I'm not college educated or even a smart individual but I do have common sense. To me this thread is useless to most people, especially me. I don't know what the intentions were of AP but to people like me (with common sense) unless you have both HP & TQ, you are sitting still. You can't get one without the other. Even in a jet engine where there are no tires contacting the road to have to turn, you still have to have both HP & TQ to get thrust to move you. I think this whole thread was a way to start an argument between us Hotrodders. I'm sure some are sitting back and laughing at some of the replies and just thinking of a way to start another. I have come to all of you for advice and have gotten alot of very good advice during my build. There is one thing I did get out of reading this thread though, I now know who to take advice from and who not.

Another less nefarious reason behind the thread, is that it might have been an (ill conceived?) attempt to bring some light to a subject that is admittedly not well understood by most rodders. Maybe even to get some thoughts on the subject, thoughts that might not have been born of a wikipedia/google search.

I'm a firm believer that knowledge is to be found 'where you find it'- sometimes in some of the strangest places- like in threads that have otherwise little appeal. That's one reason that I try to read as many threads as I'm able- despite the seemingly "boring" or "off the wall" subject matter- you just NEVER know!

Another less nefarious reason behind the thread, is that it might have been an (ill conceived?) attempt to bring some light to a subject that is admittedly not well understood by most rodders. Maybe even to get some thoughts on the subject, thoughts that might not have been born of a wikipedia/google search.

I'm a firm believer that knowledge is to be found 'where you find it'- sometimes in some of the strangest places- like in threads that have otherwise little appeal. That's one reason that I try to read as many threads as I'm able- despite the seemingly "boring" or "off the wall" subject matter- you just NEVER know!

I agree totally, but, it seems that the more I read on these kinds of threads, the more confused I become. I find myself better off by just reading the replies from a few people that have helped me in the past that never steered me wrong. I have to believe that HP & TQ are fully understood by some. There are cars going 300+mph down a 1/4 mile strip. I'm sure they have it fiqured out so why try re-inventing the wheel?

Mr Watt "did" developed his HP formula to help explain his new fang dangled long "linear" stroke double acting/reciprocating steam "thrust" driven piston cylinder engine to potential customers...
(cylinder body mounted to allow pivot on one end and cylinder shaft connected direct to the wheel)

a car motor's cylinders are just a whole bunch of short stroke "thrusts" which we measure as rotational TQ...

I did compose that post so maybe AP will atleast think about it...
(he says he has a CE degree and chemists are atleast familiar with psi)
he refuses to read any in depth link or simple link (like this one below) that I do post to back up and further explain my "for the idea" brief posted info...

(that article link does also answer clearly many items raised in this thread)

other points raised in the thread:

why do online ET/MPH calculators use HP and weight to give results???
answer: they are nothing more than a "look up" table X-Y spread sheet based on many many actual drag strip runs median/average results...
"if X=600HP and Y=3000lbs strip tickets results position on the chart says you should be in the 10's at around 125mph...
there is a math formula to estimate ET/mph from HP/wt but it is based on a TQ constant value to determine the HP...
(which is how we did it before the net)

why don't we race diesels?
news flash:
many winning off shore race boats are diesel and for the last 5 plus years diesel has totally ruled production prototype road racing world wide (the Audi R8 and Peugeot)...
Audi does have a "race" small cubes turbo diesel AWD on the streets...

4jaw, they do make transom mounted added floation chambers to counter that major added motor weight on your boat...
I'd be more worried about trailering,,,that transom wasn't engineered for that much weight and hit a major pot hole...

And I learned all the physics needed for this discussion in 5th grade, the concept isn't advanced at all so I would think everyone should have been taught this some point along the way to their highschool diploma, which I presume most of this forum's members have.

Sometimes having a book doesn't mean you understand what is in it though. I know I didn't really understand diff eg until I almost graduated.

I hope you meant Diff Eq, referring to differential equations. No such thing as diff eg.
Terry

I hope you meant Diff Eq, referring to differential equations. No such thing as diff eg.
Terry

And I'm not sure about the physics in 5th grade either but things have changed since my school days. Most students today can't do simple math problems without a calculator. If I got caught with a calculator in school, it was principals office I went and you were accused of cheating.

I hope you meant Diff Eq, referring to differential equations. No such thing as diff eg.
Terry

I have to take diff eq next semester. Not excited for that.

But this thread has been very useful and lots of knowledge has been presented. Like many people have said that tq is supposed to always win against hp. But why? Well when you consider the force at the wheels and the gear ratios that multiply the torque its a different story. I think ap brought up a good theory and maybe a couple people took it a wrong way from the way he went about it. I think there is a lot more involved here than what has been discussed. Ive seen some rotary engines go stupid fast and they make sh** for torque. Anyways I am in no way any where as experienced as most of these guys but the tq to the rear wheels really makes sense.....on paper.

I have honda friends and they always talk about i don't need torque my honda this revs to 9000rpm. And i give them this example. Swap a v8 into a 4cyl car and put a 4cyl motor into a v8. The 4cyl wont make the torque to move the car at a decent acceleration. Where as the v8 will twist the car in half. This is where torque matters is getting the vehicle moving. Anyways like i said i am in no way a knowledgeable person on the subject this is just how it plays out in my head and my .02 for what its worth.

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