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Topic Review (Newest First)

04-17-2013 11:36 PM

tech69

Ya see, always trying to be right. Yeah I do think that's good advice but I would have sat that one out.

04-17-2013 11:15 PM

MARTINSR

Henry, is the information correct or not? I feel very sad for anyone who would have their butt hurt because some added information. Again let me ask you, is the information correct or not?

Brian

04-17-2013 11:04 PM

tech69

Quote:

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

I haven't "tried" the process I am talking about have DONE the process I am talking about too many times to count, what in the heck are you talking about? As far as using epoxy like that, nope I wasn't big on epoxy when I was doing restorations but to bring the lead down before primer or filler as I explained I have done MANY times. Again Henry, what in the heck is the point of your barbs at me? A little difference in grit? HUH? Those types of things change on a regular basis, that could change next week to something else. Dude, you are over analyzing this stuff like a conspiracy nut looking at 9-11 videos.

Brian

If the guy just showed you last month that you should epoxy over lead then damn it, let the guy get the last word in cause you're trying to override his advice by adding something to it like "undercut the lead" before spraying epoxy. I think the advice was great but wasn't there a little voice inside telling you maybe you shouldn't have commented on it?

04-17-2013 10:31 PM

MARTINSR

Quote:

Originally Posted by tech69

In all honesty I love the suggestion and would do it exactly the same way, but Barry also suggested 8o grit so I'd think I'd go with that being you haven't even tried the process you suggested.As far as getting the info, it doesn't matter where it comes from, if it's a good idea it's a good idea. I'll give you that much

I haven't "tried" the process I am talking about have DONE the process I am talking about too many times to count, what in the heck are you talking about? As far as using epoxy like that, nope I wasn't big on epoxy when I was doing restorations but to bring the lead down before primer or filler as I explained I have done MANY times. Again Henry, what in the heck is the point of your barbs at me? A little difference in grit? HUH? Those types of things change on a regular basis, that could change next week to something else. Dude, you are over analyzing this stuff like a conspiracy nut looking at 9-11 videos.

Brian

04-17-2013 10:13 PM

tech69

Quote:

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

Brian

In all honesty I love the suggestion and would do it exactly the same way, but Barry also suggested 8o grit so I'd think I'd go with that being you haven't even tried the process you suggested.As far as getting the info, it doesn't matter where it comes from, if it's a good idea it's a good idea. I'll give you that much

04-17-2013 09:56 PM

MARTINSR

Quote:

Originally Posted by tech69

u r right. i can't lie...I can't and you got me on that, but I still put in the work.doubt you touched lead within the last month at a production. It's ok, it's a great suggestion. No kidding there. I do the same thing. Not above it.

Then why the heck are you on the attack? I haven't touched lead in the last month, so what? You haven't touched a carburetor on a 59 Rambler, I have, so what? How about metal finishing some dents in a fender using no filler, I did that in the last month, have you? I could care less and it means nothing but it seems to mean something to you so I thought I would ask.

Brian

04-17-2013 09:45 PM

tech69

Quote:

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

Henry, I am terribly confused here, what in the living hell are you saying? This thread is 9 years old. This advice that you have highlighted that I said is almost 9 years old! What in the hell are you talking about?

I have heard others complain about someone telling someone on a forum something they recently learned. What could be wrong with this is beyond me. If the information is correct, I don't care if a clerk at the super market knows it and passes it on, if the information is correct, what exactly is the problem? It's like when you asked about your gas door problem on the Chrysler 300. I explained to you how the position of the hinge pin was so important and explained the geometry of this location to you. In your video just a week later you are explaining it using the exact words I did sounding like it was out of your head! Now, I could care less as you were passing it on so others could learn. I am all for it, but for YOU who first off says I know nothing would use what I told you, funny stuff. But for you who has went off about that subject just as you are right now to do it, that is just too friggin funny!

You are cracking me up Henry, funny stuff. Just do your videos and help people as you are capable to do on these forums and lighten up on your bizarre personal attacks. Life is too damn easy, you are going to blow your friggin heart up like a 305 on nitrous, geeez.

Brian

u r right. i can't lie...I can't and you got me on that, but I still put in the work.doubt you touched lead within the last month at a production. It's ok, it's a great suggestion. No kidding there. I do the same thing. Not above it.

04-17-2013 09:19 PM

MARTINSR

Henry, I am terribly confused here, what in the living hell are you saying? This thread is 9 years old. This advice that you have highlighted that I said is almost 9 years old! What in the hell are you talking about?

I have heard others complain about someone telling someone on a forum something they recently learned. What could be wrong with this is beyond me. If the information is correct, I don't care if a clerk at the super market knows it and passes it on, if the information is correct, what exactly is the problem? It's like when you asked about your gas door problem on the Chrysler 300. I explained to you how the position of the hinge pin was so important and explained the geometry of this location to you. In your video just a week later you are explaining it using the exact words I did sounding like it was out of your head! Now, I could care less as you were passing it on so others could learn. I am all for it, but for YOU who first off says I know nothing would use what I told you, funny stuff. But for you who has went off about that subject just as you are right now to do it, that is just too friggin funny!

You are cracking me up Henry, funny stuff. Just do your videos and help people as you are capable to do on these forums and lighten up on your bizarre personal attacks. Life is too damn easy, you are going to blow your friggin heart up like a 305 on nitrous, geeez.

Brian

04-17-2013 08:30 PM

tech69

Quote:

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

You are making a fool of yourself Henry, back off before you have a heart attack.

Brian

That's great that in only a month you've had the opportunity to "hone" into your lead working ability(in a production shop) to the point that you'd feel the need to add onto the suggestions left by the person who told you about that process... just one month ago.

04-17-2013 06:07 PM

BarryK

Update on the original poster:

In 2005 a year after he posted this question, the car was finished and sold.
Two years later in 2007 he retired after a long career as head engineer of GE’s missile development program.

He took up snow skiing and traveled the world skiing every mountain he could for six years.
Never been to Los Angles before, so he took his skis and went looking for a hill to ski, created a mudslide and ended up in the road, sad to say he was hit by a Prius and was trapped underneath because he was wet, he was electrocuted and passed.May he rest in peace.

04-17-2013 04:10 PM

69 widetrack

Quote:

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

I think a good thing is to cut the lead a little low before the epoxy is applied. The reason for this is many times the lead is high, for some reason the factory paddled it out and then kinda left a "patch" and didn't cut it down nice and flat. So if you epoxy over that, and you plan on making the car real nice, you will have to cut the lead and end up with the same bare lead.

So, if you check it and cut it down with 120 grit if needed. Then after epoxy you can level it out nice with a skim coat of polyester if need be.

I know what you mean Brian about the lead being to high on some factory seams, remember the thread about what kind of cars you have and I mentioned that I had a 72 Demon with the rear quarters being replaced and how whoever had done the replacement of the factory quarters didn't do a very good job because the paint was starting to blister. Ever since then it's been bothering me and I felt that even if I'm not going to do the repair right now, I should at least dig into it and stop whatever rust that was forming underneath the paint now so that when I took the time to repair it properly, I wouldn't have a bigger job than it needed to be.

As it turned out, I cut the paint down and it wasn't due to a bad repair job on the rear quarters (well the repair job was still bad but that wasn't the reason for the blistering on the sail panel). I'm thinking this car spent a lot of time on the track because the factory join at the C pillar to the roof was starting to let go (flex in the body from launching) and moisture was getting into the crack from water running down the chrome trim from the rear windshield. What I thought was all blistering, there was blistering but even after the paint was removed I held a straight edge up to the panel and found an excess of factory lead on the seam. This was the same on both sides...to much lead. I've got the driver's side cleaned up now but I'm not sure yet how I'm going to repair the quarters.

The guy that replaced the rear quarters did use the full factory quarter because he used the trunk gutter but cut the quarter about an inch from the door jamb and about 4 inches below the factory seem on the C pillar...why I don't know, why do I think it was used on the track? Because the inner wheel wells look as though they where trimmed to allow for a bigger rear tire and after I dug all of the gravel guard off of the inner tub where it mates up to the quarter, I found replacement metal to make the inner wheel well. I knew I had a bit of work ahead of me to make a nicer car but, this is one of those deals where paint can cover up a multitude of sins...not just the poor quarter installation but I'm sure in 72 the seam wouldn't have looked as bad as it does today and I know I'm going to need to remove lead to make a nice seam on the C pillar.

Ray

04-17-2013 01:39 PM

MARTINSR

Quote:

Originally Posted by tech69

wasn't it a month ago when you were on the same boat as I was on whether or not to use filler over lead or epoxy first and wasn't it Barry who helped us out on that? Good thing you've been working on handling lead since then cause that process sounds great ...even though I haven't had time within the past month to try it as you had.

You are making a fool of yourself Henry, back off before you have a heart attack.

Brian

04-17-2013 01:33 PM

tech69

Quote:

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

I think a good thing is to cut the lead a little low before the epoxy is applied. The reason for this is many times the lead is high, for some reason the factory paddled it out and then kinda left a "patch" and didn't cut it down nice and flat. So if you epoxy over that, and you plan on making the car real nice, you will have to cut the lead and end up with the same bare lead.

So, if you check it and cut it down with 120 grit if needed. Then after epoxy you can level it out nice with a skim coat of polyester if need be.

wasn't it a month ago when you were on the same boat as I was on whether or not to use filler over lead or epoxy first and wasn't it Barry who helped us out on that? Good thing you've been working on handling lead since then cause that process sounds great ...even though I haven't had time within the past month to try it as you had.

04-13-2013 05:19 AM

rodgrdodger

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarryK

*************************************************
Body filler or 2K primers its not an issue.
I have changed my literature and I do know ***** is going to and one of the **** guys at the Radtec meeting said they were.
Reason is a letter was sent out by one of the epoxy resin company's about two months ago acknowledging some problems.
In short (I don't have letter here) i will try and sum up.

Metal coatings are changing such as high strength and different types of coating for rust protection from the OEM. What is happening is let say you sand with 180 the epoxy may not get into the finer scratches and adhesion is lost and corrosion protection is limited because of air trap-page that will lead to delamination.
Compounding this problem is the voc laws. The high solids resins add to the problem even more so than the finer scratches.
Also noted in the letter, it has been assumed in the past epoxy adhesion was 45-50% charge +/- as all items have a charge except things like TPO, TEO etc. Now they feel the charge rate is in the 35-45 % range.
Another problem (this is my opinion) is the so many different types of sand paper being used. The cheaper ones break down faster and if not changed enough the metal almost looks buffed with scratches.
There is no reason not to use 80, in past its been said on here that 80 is to rough but I have never (IN BARE METAL) seen an 80 scratch that was not covered with one coat of epoxy. Now in body filler or primer thats a different subject all together.

edit:
I deleted the names of the other company's as, really not my place to say, but you will see over next year different procedures being recommended.
What your using-go to 80!

I suppose you could thin out the epoxy slightly if you're worried about penetration but it should be ok using standard amount of reducer. I have had great result's with fusion just following the maker's instructions.

12-01-2004 02:28 PM

BarryK

I have never seen any type of a reaction and this is used a lot for pinholes, in glass channel's.

There is no solvent that will remove the flux, sanding and some use wire wheels to clean up.

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