Ok, this may be overly ambitious, but I was thinking about this while reading another thread over on rc.kn00b about hard roof cracks. Would it be possible for us to put together a list of all cracks, 5.13 and up, in North America?

Since this is already going to be a big list let's narrow it down a bit: -no offwidths, -no face trad (i.e., the routes should be splitters and/or corners, in which the crux is more or less pure jamming. Something like Survival of the Fittest at the Gunks would not cut it) -no boulder problems (i.e. Sasquatch) or super short routes that are usually tr'd (Moonbeam Crack at Jtree) -perhaps keep it limited to more cragging-type routes (1-3 pitches)? I'm not sure if we should go into, say, the Salathe Headwall or not.

I'll try to put together a list, state-by-state (and Canadian province by province). FA info, and specifications (corner, splitter, size) would be cool, too. Help me out!

I'll help narrow the list. There are several routes that you've mentioned that are not pure crack climbs. Here are the ones that I've seen/climbed that I'd remove because they are much more traditionally protected face climbing.

The Wasp Kansas City Special Pyromania (I haven't seen this one, but folks have said it's face climbing for the hard stuff)

I'd say China Doll barely qualifies. The 13+ version is entirely bolted while the 14- extension is on gear and pure jamming.

Some others to add to the list in CO:

Triple Exposure at Garden of the Gods (in the 12+/13- range) Sub-Zero in Eleven-mile Canyon (has two bolts, but the hard stuff is jamming and gear protected) Some cracks in Colorado National Monument (see the MP.com page on them)

There are also several more hard cracks at Tennessee Wall and areas around Chattanooga, but I don't know which ones specifically.

I'll help narrow the list. There are several routes that you've mentioned that are not pure crack climbs. Here are the ones that I've seen/climbed that I'd remove because they are much more traditionally protected face climbing. The Wasp Kansas City Special Pyromania (I haven't seen this one, but folks have said it's face climbing for the hard stuff) I'd say China Doll barely qualifies. The 13+ version is entirely bolted while the 14- extension is on gear and pure jamming. Some others to add to the list in CO: Triple Exposure at Garden of the Gods (in the 12+/13- range) Sub-Zero in Eleven-mile Canyon (has two bolts, but the hard stuff is jamming and gear protected) Some cracks in Colorado National Monument (see the MP.com page on them) There are also several more hard cracks at Tennessee Wall and areas around Chattanooga, but I don't know which ones specifically.

Yeah, those routes you mentioned are definitely gray area climbs. The reason I added them (and I've not been on any of them, all this knowledge is just from jerking off to videos) is because they follow crack features, and at least KC Special and Pyromania have significant amounts of crack climbing to them, even if not at the cruxes. It gets difficult to draw the line at the upper levels, since hard face, hard crack, and laybacking all get so similar once you are just on your fingertips.

There is a 30ft crack one tier above the Panty Wall in Red Rocks. I don't have the guidebook or know the area or anything. The book I borrowed that day said it had not seen an FFA. I hear tell that it has been freed though. It might be a 13. I bet a Vegas climber would have a better idea.

The Great Red Roof, 5.13, FFA Tom Moulin. Not sure what year. Basically a 30 foot roof crack; I think it is fingers-size.

There is at least one 5.13 at trout. It was a project last year, assume it got sent by now. Watts did the east face with bolts and fixed nuts, Sonnie did the first gear only redpoint. Pretty sure that Charlie at the RRG has seen a full Redpoint. Not sure where all of Pete Kamitses climbs are. Here is one: One called Oppositional Defiance Disorder (5.14a) in New York I don't think that Nick ever sent Kansas City Special... I know that Will Stanhope was working on it... Thought it was still a project. I think that Tricks are for Kids should be more in the 13b range. Didler also did an extension of this route, bumping up the grade slightly. The Salathe Headwall can be divided in up to three pitches 13a, 13a/b, 13b or 13c. Pyromania does follow cracks, but climbs more like a face route. Strong under-clinging and lay-backing ability will get you further than pure crack skills. Phantom should be added 13a in Yosemite. John Bachar FA Excellent Adventure on the Rostrum (a variation to the final pitch). If you do it as one pitch is 5.13 for sure. FA Peter Croft. The FA on Stingray is Hidetaka Suzuki, Mike did it on TR. The Stigma is 5.13c or so at the Cookie in Yosemite. FA Todd Skinner first "redpoin" Alan Watts. Good Story on the FA/ 2nd ascent

Hey Luke,

I have not heard of Charlie getting a proper send yet, though a lot of folks were talking about it this season. I'll add Excellent Adventure (see? this is what happens when I allow the Salathe headwall!), and Stigma & Phantom.