Gowdy objects to IRS official 'taking the fifth'

Trey Gowdy

House Oversight and Government Reform Committee member Rep. Trey Trey Gowdy, R-S.C., gestures as he speaks Wednesday on Capitol Hill in Washington during the committee's hearing to investigate the extra scrutiny IRS gave to Tea Party and other conservative groups that applied for tax-exempt status.

Published: Wednesday, May 22, 2013 at 5:42 p.m.

Last Modified: Wednesday, May 22, 2013 at 5:42 p.m.

An Internal Revenue Service official tried to evoke her Fifth Amendment rights in a House Oversight Committee hearing Wednesday, but she could now be forced to face committee members after U.S. Rep. Trey Gowdy questioned her tactics.

Lois Lerner, who leads the IRS department that oversees exempt status, appeared before House Oversight committee, of which Gowdy is a member, and read a statement before declining to answer any questions. Chairman Darrell Issa (R-Calif) excused Lerner before Gowdy called for a point of order.

“You don't get to tell your side of the story and then not be subjected to cross-examination,” Gowdy said. “That's not the way it works. She waived her right to Fifth Amendment (against self-incrimination) privilege by issuing an opening statement. She ought to stand here and answer our questions.”

Gowdy's point of order drew applause from the audience.

Issa then asked Lerner to reconsider her position before she left with her attorneys.

Wednesday afternoon, Issa said he would bring Lerner back in for questioning.

“The precedents are clear that this is not something you can turn on and turn off,” Issa told POLITICO. “She made testimony after she was sworn in, asserted her innocence in a number of areas, even answered questions asserting that a document was true … So she gave partial testimony and then tried to revoke that.”

During the hearing Wednesday afternoon, Gowdy mercilessly grilled former Internal Revenue Service chief Doug Shulman during the U.S. House Oversight Committee hearing on the IRS scandal.

The House Oversight Committee is investigating the agency's targeting of conservative political groups by flagging terms such as “Tea Party,” and “Patriots,” for additional scrutiny during the tax-exempt application process.

Shulman led the IRS until last November and evaded most of Gowdy's questions, but the former prosecutor didn't let up and used every second of his allotted time to drive home his points.

Gowdy asked Shulman whether he stepped in to stop the targeting of political groups after learning of the practice. Shulman referred to the on-going Inspector General report and said he was confident targeting had stopped.

“If there's someone wielding a knife in the parking lot, are you going to call the Inspector General,” Gowdy asked. “Are you going to wait until his or her investigation is over to stop it?”

After further questioning, Shulman said he was confident the practice had stopped and Gowdy asked what he had done to verify that.

Shulman said he was satisfied that the Inspector General was investigating the targeting of conservative groups and that he had followed practices used by his predecessor.

“Did you investigate the facts, Mr. Shulman, did you lift a finger to identify the facts,” Gowdy asked, to which Shulman referred to the IG's report.

“Let the record reflect that's a ‘no,'” Gowdy replied before his time expired.

<p>An Internal Revenue Service official tried to evoke her Fifth Amendment rights in a House Oversight Committee hearing Wednesday, but she could now be forced to face committee members after U.S. Rep. Trey Gowdy questioned her tactics.</p><p>Lois Lerner, who leads the IRS department that oversees exempt status, appeared before House Oversight committee, of which Gowdy is a member, and read a statement before declining to answer any questions. Chairman Darrell Issa (R-Calif) excused Lerner before Gowdy called for a point of order.</p><p>“You don't get to tell your side of the story and then not be subjected to cross-examination,” Gowdy said. “That's not the way it works. She waived her right to Fifth Amendment (against self-incrimination) privilege by issuing an opening statement. She ought to stand here and answer our questions.”</p><p>Gowdy's point of order drew applause from the audience.</p><p>Issa then asked Lerner to reconsider her position before she left with her attorneys.</p><p>Wednesday afternoon, Issa said he would bring Lerner back in for questioning.</p><p>“The precedents are clear that this is not something you can turn on and turn off,” Issa told POLITICO. “She made testimony after she was sworn in, asserted her innocence in a number of areas, even answered questions asserting that a document was true … So she gave partial testimony and then tried to revoke that.”</p><p>During the hearing Wednesday afternoon, Gowdy mercilessly grilled former Internal Revenue Service chief Doug Shulman during the U.S. House Oversight Committee hearing on the IRS scandal.</p><p>The House Oversight Committee is investigating the agency's targeting of conservative political groups by flagging terms such as “Tea Party,” and “Patriots,” for additional scrutiny during the tax-exempt application process.</p><p>Shulman led the IRS until last November and evaded most of Gowdy's questions, but the former prosecutor didn't let up and used every second of his allotted time to drive home his points.</p><p>Gowdy asked Shulman whether he stepped in to stop the targeting of political groups after learning of the practice. Shulman referred to the on-going Inspector General report and said he was confident targeting had stopped.</p><p>“If there's someone wielding a knife in the parking lot, are you going to call the Inspector General,” Gowdy asked. “Are you going to wait until his or her investigation is over to stop it?”</p><p>After further questioning, Shulman said he was confident the practice had stopped and Gowdy asked what he had done to verify that.</p><p>Shulman said he was satisfied that the Inspector General was investigating the targeting of conservative groups and that he had followed practices used by his predecessor.</p><p>“Did you investigate the facts, Mr. Shulman, did you lift a finger to identify the facts,” Gowdy asked, to which Shulman referred to the IG's report.</p><p>“Let the record reflect that's a 'no,'” Gowdy replied before his time expired.</p>