THE CRANE POOL FORUM thecranepool.net (.com)

Both punched their Hall tickets YEARS ago so the numbers are just "resume boosters" at this point

Okay, Mets PR question. Say Piazza hits 2 or less HRs from here on out, do you take a flyer for a year just for a milestone that should be cleared by mid-April?

You know, the more I think about it, can't do much worse on the market, if Mike's okay in spending his last days as a player in a platoonequse kind of role.

Other than that, its off to the AL.

Figure, Mets improve exponentially to 85-90, do you want to pencil in 15-17 out of Glavine next year? 15 will bring him to 290, ten away. You kind of got the feeling the Mets signed him with an eye towards 300 as a Met. Hmmm...

Course we could fanaguel a trade back to Atlanta for a Francoeur or a LaRoche! =;)

Unfortunatly the way the Mets have treated Mike all year, and with the video tribute it doesn't appear the Mets are willing to do so.

At least he's getting a better "send off" than Carter/Hernandez did at the end of 1989

Steve

metirish Sep 29 2005 11:28 PM

Steve are you saying that the Mets treated Piazza in a bad way all year?..IMO the Mets and Pizza have played this just right, Piazza has been nothing but class about the situation, who knows what the winter will bring, maybe Pizza does come back but if not then we move on and wish Mike the best.

Frayed Knot Sep 29 2005 11:30 PM

The question about whether you sign Piazza to another year or Glavine for another year beyond next one should be made on their merits and have nothing to do with hitting round numbers while wearing NYM uniforms.

smg58 Sep 29 2005 11:40 PM

I wouldn't dismiss bringing Mike back out of hand, but I'd lean toward youth at that position. And hope he gets three HR this weekend.

As for Glavine, let's see how next year goes. I wouldn't re-sign him if that blocks Petit in 07.

Ultimately, I'm more concerned about what's best for the Mets than where certain players reach their milestones.

Edgy DC Sep 30 2005 09:21 AM

There's an argument for Piazza.

He's just worth a lot more to a team that can give him 500+ AB whle we would be more likely to get him 350. I'd like him, but reality says that's who the Mets would be competing with.

metirish Sep 30 2005 09:30 AM

Fred Wilpon speaks..........

]Wilpon puts Piazza in past

Hopes his career 'goes on'

BY ADAM RUBINDAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

Mike Piazza has bat and fate in hands, as pending free agent is unlikely to return.

The Mets will show a video tribute to Mike Piazza on Sunday. Principal owner Fred Wilpon offered his own toast yesterday."He, in my opinion, is going to be the second Met Hall of Famer," Wilpon said at the introductory news conference for the team's new network, SportsNet New York. "... I think he loved being here and was certainly the star of the team. No matter who we had here, I think Mike was always the centerpoint. But things change, which I think is good. I hope Mike goes on and plays out as long as he wants to play out."

The Mets and Piazza officially haven't ruled out a return, though it's seemingly a longshot at best - unless both sides exhaust their other options. The catcher will search for AL jobs where he also can serve as DH. And the Mets will search for an alternative so Ramon Castro can remain the backup, with San Diego's Ramon Hernandez and Anaheim's Bengie Molina the most attractive pending free agents.

"I like Mike a lot as a person," Wilpon said in rare public comments. "He was a great player here. There's no question. We certainly hope Mike goes on and keeps playing. It remains to be seen where that's going to be. I don't know whether that can be here."

Wilpon had kept a low profile this season, declining nearly all interview requests.

"One of our players just said to me, 'Where have you been, Freddy?'" Wilpon said. "I've been at every game. I just don't go down to the clubhouse and I'm not on the field. Frankly I like it that way better. We have very good baseball people and it's their job."

He didn't want to use the phrase, but yes, Wilpon is happy the Mets played meaningful games in September.

"I think it's progress," Wilpon said. "I'm not sure it's success unless you are in the playoffs, and we're not in the playoffs. So that part is a disappointment. I think we made a lot of progress in the entire organization this year.

"I think the guys have responded very well. We had times where we were in similar positions in years past and you didn't see the same vibrancy on the field I think you do now."

Wilpon committed $172 million to Pedro Martinez and Carlos Beltran last winter.

"He's been a great citizen," Wilpon said about Martinez. "He's been a great pitcher. With a little break here and there, he might have won 20 games this year. Everything we've asked him to do, he has done 120%. He's a man of his word. He's a man of character."

Regarding Beltran, Wilpon offered: "I certainly have been satisfied with his effort - 110%. He's not satisfied with his performance and he knows he can do better. He knows he will do better. He's a real pro. I mean, he was banged up pretty badly and there was no way he wasn't going to play. I didn't think he was going to play last night because he's got a little tweak in his arm or bicep. ... He's a gamer. It takes time to get adjusted in New York."

Wilpon heaped praise on GM Omar Minaya and Willie Randolph.

"I think what Omar has done and what Willie has done is they've made it attractive for players to want to play here in New York," he said. "And that was not necessarily always the case. Players are now coming up to Willie and coming up to Omar and they want to be here. And that's exciting."

Edgy DC Sep 30 2005 09:43 AM

]Wilpon had kept a low profile this season, declining nearly all interview requests.

"One of our players just said to me, 'Where have you been, Freddy?'" Wilpon said. "I've been at every game. I just don't go down to the clubhouse and I'm not on the field. Frankly I like it that way better. We have very good baseball people and it's their job."

Well, it's good that Wilpon shuts up and stays out of the clubhouse, but it's kind of sad that when he did speak he kind of put a damper on the lovefest.

The lovefest, Freddy!

Rotblatt Sep 30 2005 09:48 AM

I'd take a flyer on him, but Edgy's right: Piazza will get a much better contract from an AL team.

Now, Piazza might be willing to take a home town discount (ala Radke last year), especially if he doesn't want to DH, but it's hard to say. Piazza's been pretty quiet about what he wants to do next year.

Will we offer him arbitration or would the arbitration number be ridiculously high? There's a minimum to what kind of a pay cut he can take in arbitration, right?

If he's going to sign somewhere else, it'd be nice to get a draft pick out of it . . .

Frayed Knot Sep 30 2005 10:00 AM

Except that to get a draft pick you'd need to offer him arbitration and to do that into lock yourself into a higher salary than he's going to be worth. You can only cut your own players 20% from one year to the next.With Mike it's either going to be a re-sign at some agreed upon reduced rate & role or a clean break. I can't see an arbitration/waiting process playing out.

Minaya was on the radio last night talking about Piazza (among other things):'We'll talk to him and his agent after the season in order to find out where everyone stands' (or something along those lines).I still think he could return and that under the correct circumstances I think it would be a good move. Mostly it's going to depend on what Mike himself thinks of his own abilities and how the market views him. I'm not sure anyone knows the answers to those questions just yet.

Other Minaya stuff:

- on Willie: Still learning on the job - but overall good focus, good communication, good w/media- Looper: will also talk to him and agent but will also look to the market for closing candidates- Matsui: "right now" he's still in their '06 plans (and really, what else can he say?)- Jacobs: Has impressed and worked his way into the discussion for a 1st base job but doesn't want to base too much on September alone. Likes his "swagger" and the fact that he's a homegrown guy they know.- Seo: Could be in rotation but makes no guarantees- Cameron/Diaz - Sure Mike can come back from injuries, thinks Diaz will benefit from the experience- Scouting Changes: Were done with the long-term in mind. Cited the Braves example of sustained excellence.- Peterson: Won't comment on rumors [of backstabbing, etc] but says there are always disagreements but disagreement aren't the same as "conflict"

Rotblatt Sep 30 2005 10:06 AM

]Except that to get a draft pick you'd need to offer him arbitration and to do that into lock yourself into a higher salary than he's going to be worth. You can only cut your own players 20% from one year to the next. With Mike it's either going to be a re-sign at some agreed upon reduced rate & role or a clean break. I can't see an arbitration/waiting process playing out.

Eek. Yup, there's no way we're going to pay him $12M or whatever as a part-time catcher.

I suspect someone will give him an incentive-laden contract, ala Nomar.

I understand not wanting too base to much on September alone, but there are those two Sterling Awards in Mike Jacobs' locker as well.

soupcan Sep 30 2005 11:24 AM

You big on Jacobs Edgy?

Edgy DC Sep 30 2005 11:51 AM

Big enough.

Edgy DC Sep 30 2005 12:02 PM

Returning to Piazza, though. There's also the possibility of a handshake commitment from Piazza to be offered arbitration and decline it, as a parting gifrt to the Mets, a la Bobby Jones.

I think a player, even Piazza, should find himself under no obligation to do that for a team.

metirish Sep 30 2005 12:05 PM

Mike will work first round playoff games for ESPN, teaming up with the awful Chris Berman and the even more awful Rick Sutcliffe, it's impossible to watch a game Berman is doing.

Frayed Knot Sep 30 2005 12:47 PM

Edgy DC wrote:Returning to Piazza, though. There's also the possibility of a handshake commitment from Piazza to be offered arbitration and decline it, as a parting gifrt to the Mets, a la Bobby Jones.

That's possible, although it wasn't just a "Gift" from Jones to the team. Since a team NOT offering arb to a player loses the rights to him at an earlier date the prearranged offer/decline scenario kept a Mets/Jones re-marriage possible for a longer period which was something Jones himself wanted as an option.

In this case Mike may want to keep the Mets as a safety valve kind of thing if he finds the market isn't going to offer him the full-time C/DH job he wants (assuming that's what he wants). The only problem from his end would be that the FA-compensation that the offer/decline thing would trigger will, in effect, make him more expensive for other teams looking to sign him. I'm assuming he'll be a 'Type A' FA which means a 1st round pick to sign him (plus the supplemental). Jones, IIRC, was more like a 'B' or 'C' which meant only the supplemental pick to the Mets. Great for us since it that pick became David Wright but it was no skin off the signing team's nose.

IOW, I doubt that'll happen.

Edgy DC Sep 30 2005 12:50 PM

Like I said, a player should feel no obligation to play that game, as it clearly hurts his leverage.

mlbaseballtalk Sep 30 2005 08:53 PM

metirish wrote:Steve are you saying that the Mets treated Piazza in a bad way all year?..IMO the Mets and Pizza have played this just right, Piazza has been nothing but class about the situation, who knows what the winter will bring, maybe Pizza does come back but if not then we move on and wish Mike the best.

Oh no, of course its been handled well, I meant that there is a definte sense of finality with Mike and the Mets this season

Clearly its all been nothing but "Thanks for the memories Mikey, best of luck, see you Upstate 5 years after you retire, and feel free to stop by every now and then to say hello."