QB - Even
Weeden's played as well or better then Tannehill this season and he's had much more inexperience around him. RT has had solid vet skill guys with him all season. RT is clearly more talented with a better arm, accuracy, mobility but Weeden has been a little better in clutch situations. BW has shown a knack to pull a pass out his ass when he needs to, where Tannehill, even with those vets receivers hasn't been as clutch. 2 yrs time, I think it's still even. 4-5 yrs time is when it swings to RT.

WR/RB/TE - Browns
Dolphins guys are better right now but just between Gordon & Richardson, they might be better then anyone Dolphins have 2 yrs out.

DL/LB - Dolphins
Again right now it's Dolphins. If they resign Starks they look strong upfront. DE Vernon flashed something also. Browns depth upfront is strong as rookies Hughes and Winn have looked better then Taylor and Rubin most of the time. 2yrs out it's closer but it depends on what pieces the Browns add at DE and LB.

DBs - Browns
I like Reshad Jones but the Phins need to resign Sean Smith and find a 3rd CB. Ward and Haden have been very solid. Sheldon Brown might still be with the team at FS in 2yrs. He's been the best CB on the team this year.

Overall - Browns.
They're starting more rookies then any other team this year and they've all played pretty well. Projecting the skill position guys forward, you would think they're guys will be better then the Dolphins guys in 2 years, even if Tannehill is the more talented QB by a slight margin.

__________________..yes, this sig is a little embarrassing right now...but it's like my penance

It won't just be Weeden. Anyone who was a leader on the previous team (Joe Thomas?) will be candidates to leave. It really depends on their contract situations and whatnot. Dqwell Jackson is a prime example of player who could be sent packing. Josh Cribbs? I don't know Cleveland's roster that well. I just am saying that it's typical to see new regimes want to get rid of the old regime's players and invest into their own.

Just go back and look at what happened with the Jets after Mangini was fired. Or Denver after Shanahan. Or any of the other major regime changes.

edit: or Oakland after Al Davis died.

I could understand Jackson being let go.... But if you're trying to tell me a new head coach would cut or trade Joe Thomas ( by far the best LT in the game ) that is just funny to me.

I agree with descendency. Thomas and Mack will likely be traded to the Bears for a couple mid-rounders.

Honestly, I think the answer to this question depends entirely on the next couple drafts. I think I trust Miami more in that respect, but as of now the talent level is similar, factoring in the big difference in QBs. Will Ireland still be around? Will Cleveland stick with Heckert? Is Lombardi/Saban an option? Plenty of wild cards.

It won't just be Weeden. Anyone who was a leader on the previous team (Joe Thomas?) will be candidates to leave. It really depends on their contract situations and whatnot. Dqwell Jackson is a prime example of player who could be sent packing. Josh Cribbs? I don't know Cleveland's roster that well. I just am saying that it's typical to see new regimes want to get rid of the old regime's players and invest into their own.

Just go back and look at what happened with the Jets after Mangini was fired. Or Denver after Shanahan. Or any of the other major regime changes.

edit: or Oakland after Al Davis died.

What in gods name are you rambling on about?

Yeah someone new is going to come in here and completely blow up all the talent that Heckert drafted just because they weren't his guys. Doesn't seem likely at all and you are going under the assumption that we are going to fire everyone.

Yeah someone new is going to come in here and completely blow up all the talent that Heckert drafted just because they weren't his guys. Doesn't seem likely at all and you are going under the assumption that we are going to fire everyone.

I would actually agree with him if it was a different team. The Browns have been working to hard for to long to let any of their young talent go next season though. Even if a new coach drafted a QB in the first, Weeden would have an outside chance of keeping his job (there would be a competition I mean, even if it was biased towards the new QB).

If I was the Browns though, I would stay the course. Instead of firing everyone, try to let some roots grow there. As an owner, you're sending a strong message to any coach you hire if the last guy got fired the year after drafting his QB and RB.

Sorry, but I just haven't been impressed with Weeden. I think people are overrating him just because he hasn't been as bad as they thought he would be. He's still be arguably a bottom five starting quarterback in the NFL. I'd only take him over whoever is starting for Arizona, New York (Jets), Kansas City, and maybe Buffalo. I wouldn't feel comfortable with him as the future of my franchise.

Sorry, but I just haven't been impressed with Weeden. I think people are overrating him just because he hasn't been as bad as they thought he would be. He's still be arguably a bottom five starting quarterback in the NFL. I'd only take him over whoever is starting for Arizona, New York (Jets), Kansas City, and maybe Buffalo. I wouldn't feel comfortable with him as the future of my franchise.

I couldn't agree with you more. Weeden not being Gabbert-bad and redefining the standard for awfulness has gotten him massively over-rated here. He's still been a worse QB than any of the other rookie starters this year.

Only part I disagree with is Fitzpatrick, he's not very good, but he's still better than Weeden, Kolb, Sanchez and Cassel. And he's only a year or two older than Weeden.

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BK

Quote:

Originally Posted by AcheTen

JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham

Quote:

Originally Posted by abaddon41_80

Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.

Sorry, but I just haven't been impressed with Weeden. I think people are overrating him just because he hasn't been as bad as they thought he would be. He's still be arguably a bottom five starting quarterback in the NFL. I'd only take him over whoever is starting for Arizona, New York (Jets), Kansas City, and maybe Buffalo. I wouldn't feel comfortable with him as the future of my franchise.

Tannehill hasn't exactly set the world on fire either. Whenever I watch him he just looks alright, there hasn't been anything in his play yet that would suggest he's on his way to being an elite QB. I've actually been a little more impressed with Weeden in the games I've seen. If given the choice between the 2 rosters minus QB at the moment I'd take Cleveland's in a heartbeat, and I haven't seen anything from Tannehill that would be enough to swing it the other way. I think there are plenty of Tannehill caliber players who are going to be within range for the Browns to select even if Weeden doesn't work out. Franchise QB's are difficult to find, but it's only one guy to find, but building an overall quality roster takes years to do.

My choice for picking the Browns here has very little to do with Weeden. I'm not exactly sold on Tannehill, either. So QB is pretty much a wash at this point.

RT's at least done enough to think he could become a legit franchise guy, and I believe in him, the arm talent and athletic ability is excellent and he's shown great understanding for how little experience he has. That to me takes away Cleveland's superior young defensive talent.

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BK

Quote:

Originally Posted by AcheTen

JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham

Quote:

Originally Posted by abaddon41_80

Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.

RT's at least done enough to think he could become a legit franchise guy, and I believe in him, the arm talent and athletic ability is excellent and he's shown great understanding for how little experience he has. That to me takes away Cleveland's superior young defensive talent.

Fair enough. I can't fault people for picking the Dolphins here. I like their young talent, too. I hope that both teams are still headed in the right direction two years from now. The more quality football teams the better.

Tannehill hasn't exactly set the world on fire either. Whenever I watch him he just looks alright, there hasn't been anything in his play yet that would suggest he's on his way to being an elite QB. I've actually been a little more impressed with Weeden in the games I've seen. If given the choice between the 2 rosters minus QB at the moment I'd take Cleveland's in a heartbeat, and I haven't seen anything from Tannehill that would be enough to swing it the other way. I think there are plenty of Tannehill caliber players who are going to be within range for the Browns to select even if Weeden doesn't work out. Franchise QB's are difficult to find, but it's only one guy to find, but building an overall quality roster takes years to do.

Consider Tannehill has looked good at all in the first places says all you need to know. He doesn't have to be Andrew Luck good, give him some credit instead of knocking him because when knowing the circumstances he's certainly been impressive. We already know he's a former WR, but he's a guy who probably should have sat like Locker, and got to take it slow, but he was thrown out there from the get go and has actually won some games for them in the process. They also lost a few games that didn't have anything to do with him.

Considering how bad some rookie QB's have looked, that have played QB all their life(Gabbert, Ponder most recently) and how good of a ball Tannehill throws I think it's safe to say he's been very impressive. Your trying to gauge who is a Tannehill level talent for a guy in his rookie season after barely being a QB. You do realize that it's a pretty good bet he's going to get a lot better right? He's not someone I would think is even close to being as good as he'll get.

Roster wise I love the Browns a lot more. Gordon is a soon to be stud and he might make Little settle in nicely in an Anquan Boldin role underneath and not the #1 WR. There are key pieces on that team in key positions. Weeden is surprisingly accurate whenever I see him and if he had better WR's(like Fitzgerald) he'd look a lot better. Little has dropped so many long bombs this year that were dropped in a perfect spot, even Gordon lost one in the lights. He may not get that much better, but he's a starter in this league IMO even if it's just a solid one.

Still, Tannehill I think will be much better long term and if Miami can get a WR and a TE there he'll be even more impressive. It's just funny to even hear people try to knock him when he's led the team to 5 wins, as a rookie, with who he has to throw to.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Wright

I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

Richardson hasn't really been himself this whole year, and while we have guards that are serviceable, if we could get some better run blocking guards or a full back that wasn't complete dog **** we would be a lot better in that department as well.

Weeden has been very up and down this year, a lot of his passes have had a chance of being picked (literally hitting defenders right in the hands) and been dropped.

As far as Little dropping passes, I don't think hes dropped one since the second Ravens game which has been close to 8 weeks I think.

This team is a defense back or two, pass rusher, and tight end away from being a legit contender. Also, call me insane... But I would love to see Mike Vick behind our offensive line.

Consider Tannehill has looked good at all in the first places says all you need to know. He doesn't have to be Andrew Luck good, give him some credit instead of knocking him because when knowing the circumstances he's certainly been impressive. We already know he's a former WR, but he's a guy who probably should have sat like Locker, and got to take it slow, but he was thrown out there from the get go and has actually won some games for them in the process. They also lost a few games that didn't have anything to do with him.

Considering how bad some rookie QB's have looked, that have played QB all their life(Gabbert, Ponder most recently) and how good of a ball Tannehill throws I think it's safe to say he's been very impressive. Your trying to gauge who is a Tannehill level talent for a guy in his rookie season after barely being a QB. You do realize that it's a pretty good bet he's going to get a lot better right? He's not someone I would think is even close to being as good as he'll get.

Roster wise I love the Browns a lot more. Gordon is a soon to be stud and he might make Little settle in nicely in an Anquan Boldin role underneath and not the #1 WR. There are key pieces on that team in key positions. Weeden is surprisingly accurate whenever I see him and if he had better WR's(like Fitzgerald) he'd look a lot better. Little has dropped so many long bombs this year that were dropped in a perfect spot, even Gordon lost one in the lights. He may not get that much better, but he's a starter in this league IMO even if it's just a solid one.

Still, Tannehill I think will be much better long term and if Miami can get a WR and a TE there he'll be even more impressive. It's just funny to even hear people try to knock him when he's led the team to 5 wins, as a rookie, with who he has to throw to.

Fine with everything except that last part. Hartline and Bess are very solid and easily capable of 1000yd seasons. They might both reach it this year. Fasano's a solid TE and Bush is definitely one of the better receiving RBs.

__________________..yes, this sig is a little embarrassing right now...but it's like my penance

Fine with everything except that last part. Hartline and Bess are very solid and easily capable of 1000yd seasons. They might both reach it this year. Fasano's a solid TE and Bush is definitely one of the better receiving RBs.

Eh, I'd say Bess is solid and Bush is a good receiving back coming into this year. Hartline and Fasano? Not so much. What about Weeden's supporting cast coming into this year? Sure we expected Richardson to help a lot, but Little has disappointed and Gordon has surprised. Not really too much of a difference there, I'd say.

Weeden has lead this Browns squad to 5 wins this year as well, including the last 3 in a row. When's the last time the Browns won 3 straight games? Neither of these QBs have set the world on fire in those wins, it's more about not turning the ball over and playing good defense at this point.

I'd say people give Weeden more crap overall than people are knocking Tannehill at this point.

I actually appluad the Browns decision to draft Weeden & think he's going to be ok mid - long term. So if you consider both teams to have their current QB's in 2 years time I lean towards Tannerhill & the phins. To me he just seems to have the 'it' factor you want in a QB. His numbers wont reflect it this year but I think he has a chance to be something