Imagine for a moment you enter the syndicate base/golem ship/ et all and in one way or another you engage them in battle. You're a normal station crewmember, more likely than not a miner, and you manage to beat the creature you engaged at first. You're then presented with a sheer red army tactic of unending fresh bodies, possessed by the same person that you killed before, wordlessly running up to your exact location and trying to kill you, even if they had no way of knowing why the fight started or where you are.

How does the administration deal with this issue? Is such blatant abuse of easily producible lives for vengeance allowed?

Spoiler:

[20:26:02]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Welp. It was just a prank bro isn't a very good excuse when it comes to unprovoked nonantag murder, but since this is your first time doing it and you seem to understand the problem instead of a bannu I'm just going to leave you with a warning. Please PLEASE don't do this again in the future, as funny as crackhead broken bottle memes can be. Alrighty? Do you have any input on this?[20:26:39]ADMIN: PM: [censored]->[censored admin]: Alright, no problem. I have some input. Fuck my boy pussy.[20:27:06]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Okay then. Have fun.[20:31:29]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Excuse me?

[20:26:02]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Welp. It was just a prank bro isn't a very good excuse when it comes to unprovoked nonantag murder, but since this is your first time doing it and you seem to understand the problem instead of a bannu I'm just going to leave you with a warning. Please PLEASE don't do this again in the future, as funny as crackhead broken bottle memes can be. Alrighty? Do you have any input on this?[20:26:39]ADMIN: PM: [censored]->[censored admin]: Alright, no problem. I have some input. Fuck my boy pussy.[20:27:06]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Okay then. Have fun.[20:31:29]ADMIN: PM: [censored admin]->[censored]: Excuse me?

The practical answer is admins dont care nor do players most of the time. No one will ever enforce ashliggers going to the place of their dead body to return it to the tendril or golems doing the same to retrieve lost gear. Admins would also have a hard time caring about protecting a miner player who wants to rules lawyer with metagaming rules so they can kill golems, vault podpeople at leisure while they're forced to be naive regarding the murderous miner.

Deal with it. The only time this happens for miners is if there are ashliggers, every other time it happens its because mining decided to find some conflict with roles that were friendly or neutral, or sealed off by lava.

There is metagaming and there is making players miserable while you abuse their forced ignorance. Example:Miner walks into #ghostrole base and wordlessly starts slaughtering them like he is allowed to. #Ghostrole respawns but he's not allowed to know the miner is hostile because MMUH ARRPEE and depending on the #ghostrole he is also not allowed to initiate hostilities so he peacefully approaches the miner just to be slaughtered again until all the respawns are expended or destroyed by the miner. So much fun

There is metagaming and there is making players miserable while you abuse their forced ignorance. Example:Miner walks into #ghostrole base and wordlessly starts slaughtering them like he is allowed to. #Ghostrole respawns but he's not allowed to know the miner is hostile because MMUH ARRPEE and depending on the #ghostrole he is also not allowed to initiate hostilities so he peacefully approaches the miner just to be slaughtered again until all the respawns are expended or destroyed by the miner. So much fun

I don't think you should respawn as the same ghostrole in the first place.....

There is metagaming and there is making players miserable while you abuse their forced ignorance. Example:Miner walks into #ghostrole base and wordlessly starts slaughtering them like he is allowed to. #Ghostrole respawns but he's not allowed to know the miner is hostile because MMUH ARRPEE and depending on the #ghostrole he is also not allowed to initiate hostilities so he peacefully approaches the miner just to be slaughtered again until all the respawns are expended or destroyed by the miner. So much fun

I don't think you should respawn as the same ghostrole in the first place.....

This is not enforced in the rules and in the code neither, I think we're gonna need a headmin to clarify this. Does this only work if I'm killed by another player? What if I die from other causes, am I not allowed to respawn as the same ghostrole?

Ew. Ghost roles shouldn't get a free pass on meta grudge and metagame. There is a way to enforce it. "Admin is this guy the same ckey? I think he's metagrudging me with ghost roles" "WHY YES HE IS" Bwoink Ban. Easy. I feel the same way about people metagaming the xeno ruin to spawn a alien larva. Yet the response to that is as well, if they don't get the larva metagaming it is a-ok.

TBH the rules on ghost roles should be harder. Why do they allow admins to be so lax on them? They're dead and should have the least amount of interaction with the station possible. Ghost roles exist for them to have something to do, not to be free antag validS mc shitter. Right?

ThanatosRa wrote:My biggest problem is that I can't fix any of this.

Boris wrote:shadowflame either has a brain the size of a pea or one the size of the moon and he's playing 58D chess.

BeeSting12 wrote:please write an apology to this forums, this community, the host, and the internet as a whole for the data storage space you wasted with this complaint.

Shadowflame909 wrote:Ew. Ghost roles shouldn't get a free pass on meta grudge and metagame. There is a way to enforce it. "Admin is this guy the same ckey? I think he's metagrudging me with ghost roles" "WHY YES HE IS" Bwoink Ban. Easy. I feel the same way about people metagaming the xeno ruin to spawn a alien larva. Yet the response to that is as well, if they don't get the larva metagaming it is a-ok.

TBH the rules on ghost roles should be harder. Why do they allow admins to be so lax on them? They're dead and should have the least amount of interaction with the station possible. Ghost roles exist for them to have something to do, not to be free antag validS mc shitter. Right?

You're seeing that from a player perspective. In reality ghost role bans are applied longer and harder than any other bans.

If you're going out of your way to constantly attack people with ghost-roles: that's metagruding and metagaming plain and simple. If you happen to be in their base and they throw an unrelenting fury of bodies at you to get you out of their base, I would say they should refrain from doing so since their only knowledge of you being there was gained from a previous life (a little more leeway would be given to ash-lizards than golems due to this inherent hostility.) If you believe this is happening to you: I would advise you to ahelp. It's not very actionable but if you get the suspicion more than once: feel free to ahelp and that person may get a note.

It may be a coding issue as well but we deal with what we have. A ghost-role timer would be preferable in this circumstance (but doesn't exist at the moment as far as I'm aware.)