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It would be interesting to have reliable information (rather than rumour and hearsay) about what far-eastern factories make what bikes/brands. For example, I know that my Scott Foil was made by Ten-Tech Composites in Guangdong, China. Why is it so difficult to find a definitive list? Everyone knows that nearly all carbon frames these are made in the far-east, and there must be plenty of people in the industry who know where all of the big brands are made. Do us a favour and post a complete list!

From my perspective I'm just curious whether there are similarities between different frames marketed by different brands when they are made in the same factories. Sometimes you see certain tube profiles that look vaguely familiar..

It's just occurred to me - a good way for the manufacturers to prevent such a definitive list being compiled would be to spread multiple and contradictory rumours. Easier to hide the truth that way than to keep it secret, sort of like "I'm Sparticus" .... Not accusing anyone here of being involved in that of course!

Giant manufacture for Scott (that's where both my Plasmas were built). I'm actually fairly certain that both my Foils (HMF fames) had made in Taiwan stickers, although I do know that Scott also use TTC.

It really doesn't matter that much, nor is it interesting. The factory that any given bike is made in is of negligible consequence. Design is what makes the difference between a shitty chinese end-run frame and a satisfying bike.

It really doesn't matter that much, nor is it interesting. The factory that any given bike is made in is of negligible consequence. Design is what makes the difference between a shitty chinese end-run frame and a satisfying bike.

I can see your point, but how is design shared between a brand and a factory? When a big brand plans a new frame, is it designed completely in-house and the plans then delivered to the factory (which could be any factory), or do the designers work with specialists at the factory to plan the layup, material choice etc? I always had the impression that was the case (might be wrong). Also, I got the impression that in many cases, the design is effectively undertaken by one of the large far-eastern companies/factories and then sold/contracted to a brand.

Chinese bashing nice given the Chinese make most carbon frames, including the big brand ones.

Some well known names use open mold designs and have them branded. The brand therefore did not design the frame.

A bike made in England for example may only be painted and assembled in England. The parts come from all over the world. So where it is "assembled" is irrelevant where each bit is made is interesting to know.

Just to be clear, I'm certainly not bashing the Chinese or Taiwanese, I'd rather have my frame build there (where the expertise is) than in the U.S. or Europe! It's just interesting to know more about what specific far eastern companies are involved in the design and manufacture of particular frames, and what stages take place where. In some ways it is the big brands that are "bashing" the Chinese because they are not giving them full credit for the role they play. I think it's good that Scott allow ten-tech to put their logo on some of the Foil frames.

In an area where they build airplanes [Seattle WA], my understanding is the factories build them and the engineers design them. Going to a factory that makes a great product, may not be the best place to start. Going to the design team/engineer, might be better.

Obviously a good design and factory team would result in a good product. The reason for China is cheaper labor and less regulation. China is not known for their good designs, unless a design that was most likely copied from someone else.

Someday, they will be known for their designs, but right now, I do not think so.

Krull, I think you might be mixing up the products design (superficial appearance) with production design (the design of the construction). There are obviously huge differences between high and low end here. You don't get an X-Ray scan of every separate layer of carbon cloth like with the MacLaren edition Venge, when you buy a Hong-Fu...

I'm not arguing that it matters, I'm just giving you the facts so you can make your own informed choice.

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