Sher-Clear troubles

-- 0 --

I've been using Sher-Clear from Sherwin Williams daily for 6 years. It's always proved itself to be a great WB finish. Until recently that is. For the last several months, the cans have been coming with rust in them. I ordered a case from my local store last week, and today I went over to grab it. I've learned to open the cans in the store because I've been seeing this rust issue pretty regularly for the last several months. 2 of the 4 cans had a significant amount of rust in them. The other 2 cans had some rust, but I was pretty desperate to get some finish on my signs, so I took them back to the shop. I've attached a picture of one of the cans here. Like I said, I've been spraying it for quite a while, so I'm very familiar with how it should look. This sprayed out horribly bad. Probably the worst it's been in a while, and it's been pretty bad. It almost has a dirty, oily look to it, and there are a million pinholes. I've been beating my head against the wall for months now trying to solve this thing. This is before I realized the cans were rusty. My painter would just pour it into the gun, and I guess he never noticed. Anyway, one day I was in there, and I noticed huge gobs of rust in the can. I've rejected 10 cans so far, and the ones I've accepted are pretty bad. This batch I got today was canned on May 1st of this year, so 3 months old. Anybody else seeing this? I tried a couple of other products. General Finishes 450 isn't bad, but it's really not as good as a good can of Sher Clear. It doesn't build as much, and it seems to take longer to fully set up. I have to ship these signs, and the 450 gave me troubles when I wrapped them to ship. Sher Clear has never had that problem. I have some EM9300 coming from Target Coatings, so I'm really hoping that's going to be a good replacement for Sher Clear. Anybody have any experience with the 2 for a comparison or have any other recommedations? Sorry for the long post, but I'm losing sleep over this. Oh, also notice in the picture the modeling look of the interior gold color of the can. On a good can, that gold is pristine. This must be some sort of oxidation as well. Whatever is happening inside these cans is not good.

I've never used Sher Clear, but I've used both EM-9300 and Exterior 450. 450 sprayed easier for me, but it stays soft a long time and never gets as hard as EM-9300 does right away. If the EM-9300 sprays well for you I think you'll be pleased with how it looks and performs. As a bonus, they package it in plastic pails so rust will never be an issue.

Yeah, I liked the 450, but the longer set times is a deal breaker for what I'm doing. I tried another product yesterday from Modern Masters called Masterclear, and that is showing promise. It was at least as hard as SherClear this morning, and looked great. So now, I'll do my packing paper test, and if it passes, at least I'll be moving forward with a solution. The EM9300 is coming tomorrow or Friday, so I'll keep you posted with my thoughts on that. I really hope Sherwin Williams figures the SherClear out, because when it's good, it's REALLY good... but this rust issue is messing with the chemistry I think. It's the only thing that makes sense.

More likely the chemistry is what caused the cans to rust, rather than the other way around. In any case, if it's been going on this long it doesn't sound like they are motivated to fix the problem so finding an alternative is the best option. You can always go back to it if they do fix it.

Can you buy the SW product in 5 gal plastic pails? If rust is what's causing the problem (which I doubt but I'm often wrong) that would eliminate the problem.

If it's not the rust that's causing the problem, then it has to be their chemistry. I had a bad gallon once a few years ago, but that one was clearly bad when I opened the can and looked at it. It's usually pretty white and this gallon was noticibly blueish. It was also very watery. I sprayed it anyway on a test piece just to see, and it was total garbage. I brought it back and got another gallon and it was back to normal. So it is possible for them to screw up a batch.

Sayerlack's website is almost unusable on my computer... Might just be me, but it's painful. I see the products on Sherwin's site, but from what I can gather, Hydroplus is an interior finish. But it seems like they do make an exterior finish, but I can't get to it on the Sayerlack site. I'll put a call into my local Sherwin commercial store.. I feel like I'm just thinking out loud here guys. Sorry.

The Sayerlack Data is not available unless Sherwin sets you up with a username password.... Call a Sherwin product finishes division with any questions and they can email you technical data.. a retail contractor/paint store will not be a good source of information.

I have some EM9300 coming today from Target. Thanks John for that tip. I'll let you know how I make out. This board is unreal. I wish I knew it existed 6 years ago when I was banging my head against the wall trying to figure this stuff out. The finishing world is a big mystery if you don't know much about it. If you're not a chemistry major, it's a shot in the dark of what works or not. On top of that, trying to figure out a problem with your finish... like why it's getting fish eyes, or orange peel, or solvant pop, or micro bubbles is time consuming and frustrating and expesive... This site is at the top of my favorites now! Thanks to everyone who takes the time to chime in.

I've had the EM9300 for a couple days now and it checks all the boxes. Great looking, cures fast and hard, I can ship it quickly without worrying about the finish getting messed up, sands easily between coats, sprays easily. It's really a 10 so far. It's what Sher-Clear USED to be when I first started using it. Lately here, it's turned into a pile of garbage. So, thanks to everyone here again. You have no idea how much you bailed me out.

WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.

Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.

A valid email return address must be included with each message.

Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.

Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.

"Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.

Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.

Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.

Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.

Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.

Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.

Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.

Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

Libel: Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

Improper Decorum: Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

Advertising: The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)

Forum Posting Form Guidelines

Your Name

The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).

Your Website

Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)

E-Mail Address

Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)

Subject

Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)

Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines

Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)

Thread Related File Uploads

Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .FLV .MP4 (Image Upload Tips) If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)

The editors, writers, and staff at WOODWEB try to promote safe practices.
What is safe for one woodworker under certain conditions may not be safe
for others in different circumstances. Readers should undertake the use
of materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB after considerate evaluation,
and at their own risk.