Epy, did King give you permission to post this here? If not, quote or not, then it's plagiarism and he could sue WN (not that he'd bother to do that.)

10-25-2007, 05:37 AM

Epy Stolean

Re: We should be reminded

Barbara - You have a point, however I think some writers tend to lean on the thesaurus as a crutch rather than allowing their creative minds to create a story. In other words, when having a normal conversation, one would not come to a thought, stop, open a thesaurus and attempt to figure out which word to use. I believe, his point was your writing and voice should be natural and flow, just like conversation. As a writer, I would think one has a vast vocabulary thus rendering the thesaurus a rarely used tool.

Wonky - The first line of the post gives credit to King. Secondly, your rebuttal makes no sense whatsoever; "quote or not, then it's plagiarism"? Are you serious? What law school did you attend?

For the rest. If you would like to logically discuss the post, I don't mind. If you would like to attack, please take your words elsewhere. I posted this reprint of King's ten minutes to help new writers; not to create a ****storm.

10-25-2007, 06:39 AM

Beautiful Loser

Re: We should be reminded

Epy, great advice. And I agree with your comment to Wonky about copyrights.

Here's an article/link which might shed some light re "fair use" and other copyright infringement claims.

Geesh, everybody wants to be a lawyer.

<http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html>

10-25-2007, 06:46 AM

Jeanne Gassman

Re: We should be reminded

Not only do I agree with Barbara about the thesaurus, but I think it's better to use a hard copy dictionary AND thesaurus. Why?

Well, writers believe too much in the "zone," as though it's some sort of magical talisman. Creativity also comes from exploration and research--things better done with a hard copy of the thesaurus.

Think about this for a moment. When you look up a word in a book (versus online), what do you do? You read how to spell the word, or you find the definition you're looking for--AND you read the other definitions AND your eye skims down the page to see the word just above it, which is similar but has a slightly different meaning AND you pause to read that funny-looking word that refers to horse whips in the 17th century, something you've never seen before. In just a few seconds, you have not only answered your original question, but you've also expanded your vocabulary. (At least, this is how I use a dictionary!) A similar thing happens when I use a hard-copy thesaurus. I find myself looking up more than one synonym just to see the relationship among the various choices.

As for being in the "zone"--that comes back easily enough (for me), with the added benefit of more tools in my toolbox.

Oh, Epy, in our house we sometimes grab the dictionary and/or thesaurus during normal conversation!

Just my thoughts...

Jeanne

10-25-2007, 07:05 AM

Beautiful Loser

Re: We should be reminded

How funny, Jeanne. We do the very same thing in my household. There are several hard-copy versions of dictionaries and thesaurus. And, you are absolutely correct about the added benefits. When our eyes wander about looking for that "perfect word" quite a few more enter our minds.

10-25-2007, 07:50 AM

nom de plume

Re: We should be reminded

Do not post material under copyright unless you have specific permission to do so! I understand to post a short paragraph for educational purposes is permissible, beyond that you need permission.

Whoever posted this showed himself to be an @$$

10-25-2007, 07:52 AM

Epy Stolean

Re: We should be reminded

I think the difference is between story telling, general conversation and a discussion of a topic. I can imagine one telling a story to a group, stopping at some point and looking above in thought, then opening a thesaurus to find just the right word, and then continuing the story . . . . ainít gonna happen.

On the other hand, you are sitting around the fireplace with your friends in a discussion of whatever; perhaps you are discussing a political candidateís demeanor . . . Hmmm, let me see; blockhead, bonehead, cretin, dimwit, dolt, dummy, dunce, dunderhead, fool, goose, halfwit, idiot, ignoramus, imbecile, lunkhead, muttonhead, numskull, simpleton. Not exactly what I am looking for. These just donít fit. Sometimes there is just the right word to describe the deportment, but it just doesnít come to mind. You grab your thesaurus and dig. Oh wait. . . . .addle-pate! Or perhaps a purveyor galimatias colloquy.

I can see that happening.

Since the topic however is writing (or storytelling) one should not be stopping to look up a word during the creation phase. During editing? Of course.

On the other hand, perhaps I am different. I sit and read the dictionary and thesaurus as a pass time.

10-25-2007, 07:55 AM

Epy Stolean

Re: We should be reminded

"Whoever posted this showed himself to be an @$$"

First you can see who posted this, and second you assume it was a man. Interesting.

As mentioned earlier, what law school did you attend?

10-25-2007, 08:20 AM

nom de plume

Re: We should be reminded

ES wrote:
""Whoever posted this showed himself to be an @$$"

First you can see who posted this, and second you assume it was a man. Interesting.

As mentioned earlier, what law school did you attend?"

I really don't care to know the gender of the show-off kid who posted a significant chunk of material under copyright without having obtained the author's permission. S/He should have apologized instead of trying to ridicule posters who point out the error. It served as another illustration of immaturity.

BTW, the initial post wasn't a revelation but old news because most of us read the book.

10-25-2007, 08:29 AM

Epy Stolean

Re: We should be reminded

As posted previously;

If you would like to logically discuss the post, I don't mind. If you would like to attack, please take your words elsewhere. I posted this reprint of King's ten minutes to help new writers; not to create a ****storm.