BeeAre wrote:Hmmm, I would this is a good rule of thumb, yes. How far does that line go? HOW CAN YOU KILL THAT WHICH HAS NO LIFE? No but seriously, what counts as killing?

I think this is a case of "the devil's in the details". There's defiantly a difference between killing, and homicide. There's killing another creature, (like an animal) and then there's killing another human. If you recall, the Powerpuff Girls killed countless giant monsters in the show. But I guess it all comes down to a matter of individual perspective. What's considered "okay" as far as killing goes, is more of a persons point of view. Hell, that's why there are vegans/vegetarians in this world.

Mad-Mutt wrote:As I said before, killing %$# you up inside. And not even purposeful killing either, even killing someone by mistake or indirectly can really mess a person up.

That's very true. Especially at a young age. If Buttercup DID kill Samantha, and came to regret it, it would hit her hard. She'd probably flip shit over it, right at that very moment. Honestly, I would love to see this happen. Buttercup having regrets would be, as Blord put it "pure character development gold".

Anyways, moving on. So how do you think the Samantha death scene will play out? Do you think we'll all rejoice at the sight of her demise (well, most of us at least)? Or upon her death, will we all learn her back story, and find out that she was just "misunderstood" this whole time, and her passing will be a great tragedy?

Also I know I already said this but I would like to bring it back up.Now we know Sam will die, this means Buttercup will regain possession of Jack's sword. Most likely she'll go and help Blossom, and when she does, she'll have the sword in hand. My question is, would she use the sword on Bell and/or Gir? I mean, she probably wouldn't kill Bell with it. I can see her maybe cutting off a limb with it, or even using the blunt side of the sword. But I highly doubt she'd intentionally kill Bell with it.

Mad-Mutt wrote:Doesn't always mean we have to agree with it, but what really is left of Sam if she's sold her soul for a new shiny body. Or does she have something left inside. Hate is a human emotion. An emotion we all know too well.

Sam also seems to feel pain. She did say "Ow" when she finally landed at the bottom. I'll admit that I am not exactly familiar with robots, cyborgs, and the like, but can mechanical beings also be programmed to feel pain? Or does this mean that she has some of her nervous system still intact?

Edit: This is somewhat Off-topic, but that video at the bottom of this page is nice. I like the song.

"A reader lives a thousand lives, the man who never reads lives only one." - George R.R. MartinTumblr

BeeAre wrote:Hmmm, I would this is a good rule of thumb, yes. How far does that line go? HOW CAN YOU KILL THAT WHICH HAS NO LIFE? No but seriously, what counts as killing?

I think this is a case of "the devil's in the details". There's defiantly a difference between killing, and homicide. There's killing another creature, (like an animal) and then there's killing another human. If you recall, the Powerpuff Girls killed countless giant monsters in the show. But I guess it all comes down to a matter of individual perspective. What's considered "okay" as far as killing goes, is more of a persons point of view. Hell, that's why there are vegans/vegetarians in this world.

I do recall that! Plus, the PowerPuff Girls never learned a lesson that killing is wrong, but the question is: What are they gonna do with the monsters or what will the monsters do since the PowerPuff Girls let them live? So, I guess killing was an option.

To be honest, that was one of my problems with the show. Is that they never learned anything about that killing is wrong and they go to school. They were never scolded or anything like that. I dunno... About them being superheroes, I'm not sure about that because all they do is little punch and kicks and those monsters are defeated. They hardly broke a sweat! Not that I'm bashing on them or anything, but in my terms when it comes to a superhero, that person has to be pushed to the very limit by the supervillain. The superhero/superheroine, if he/she teamed up with another superhero/superheroine, they would use forms of creative tag team style with powers and/or without against their opponents besides little punch and kicks. I think there was an episode where the PowerPuff Girls talked to a monster then all of a sudden beat it up (probably both PPG and PPGZ).

The PowerPuff Girls has it way too easy. The thing in PowerPuff Girls Doujinshi is that I like the fact that they ARE pushed to their limit. Perfect ex: What's currently happening.

And with Boomer... He performed a public act of service by preventing that kid from getting cavities and whatever it is that leads to the cons of eating too much candy. I still crack up when I hear the kid says out loud that he spent all his allowance on all that candy . Sorry, I keep going back to the RRBs. They are my favs. Anyways, Boomer got beat up by three girls... NOT FAIR and SO NOT RIGHT!!! But that's my way of putting it with that of the episode Bubble Boy.

But really, the RowdyRuff Boys are one of those 'villains' that gives the PowerPuff Girls a run for their money. They are way too strong for them, but equal in power. Heh, funny how Craig McCracken wanted to make them the most hated by making them like Zod, Ursa, and None. Who hates Zod, Ursa, and None? I know I don't! The only way for the PowerPuff Girls to defeat them is by feminine wiles and kinda outsmarting them, but I believe that one day the RowdyRuff's will get back at them and their win and lose streak will be tied.

Mojo Jojo and HIM I like as villains. They are ones who gives the PowerPuff Girls a run for their money as well, but Mojo is a little easy compared to HIM, IMO.

Vegan? I thought the perspective of being a vegan was of 1. Religion and 2. Health. My parents are Vegans. My brother and I are half-vegans

"I think this is a case of "the devil's in the details". There's defiantly a difference between killing, and homicide. There's killing another creature, (like an animal) and then there's killing another human."- Nicely worded and so true! It just feels like people/animals like them have their lives mentally challenged.

bluebluetopaz wrote:

Mad-Mutt wrote:Doesn't always mean we have to agree with it, but what really is left of Sam if she's sold her soul for a new shiny body. Or does she have something left inside. Hate is a human emotion. An emotion we all know too well.

Sam also seems to feel pain. She did say "Ow" when she finally landed at the bottom. I'll admit that I am not exactly familiar with robots, cyborgs, and the like, but can mechanical beings also be programmed to feel pain? Or does this mean that she has some of her nervous system still intact?

Edit: This is somewhat Off-topic, but that video at the bottom of this page is nice. I like the song.

IMO, when it comes to an advanced humanoid or cyborg, anything is possible to be programmed in order to feel pain and stuff. Gunslinger Girl would be an example or even Appleseed and Ghost In The Shell. These are good examples to watch anime and figure it out http://www.fantasy-magazine.com/reviews ... alchemist/ They kinda react to certain types pain. So, yeah... As far as we know it, they'll be spitting out Interjections

No the main problem with Thunderbolts is that the writing is fucking horrible. You'd think a book featuring these characters would be awesome but noooooo we have to give it to Daniel Way where he turns the thing into his terrible Expendable fanfics. How bad? Is it let me count the ways.

-Rulk has reverted back to a Gary Stu where basically no one can beat him & he has the answer to everything.

-Venom is entirely pointless on this team.

-Punisher once a well fleshed out example of a anti-hero has now been reduced to a guy who smirks, spits out one liners & macks on Elektra after kill some guys.

Technically Buttercup isn't a vigilante. Vigilante's fight crime without proper authority, Buttercup and her sisters were sanctioned by the mayor to be public crime fighters.

As for not feeling bad about it there was one episode of PPG (Makes Zen to Me) where Buttercup went too far and beat Fuzzy into a broken mess. At first when she did it she wasn't bothered by it seeing him as just a villain who needed a good ass kicking, but when someone wheeled Fuzzy's busted ass over to her she got pretty freaked out by how far she had gone, she was still in a bit of denial, but she flew all the way to a mountain, so it got to her one way or the other. In that same episode she meet her master (who has been mentioned before in this thread) who taught her to calm her rage.

Buttercup has also shown regret for other things in the past, while also being a bit of a brute. She apologizes like fifty times when she accidently knocked Bubbles' tooth out, but then she goes out and beats the crap out of villains for tooth fairy money.

Considering Sam is being demonized by this point into looking like a soulless machine whose not even anything near human, Buttercup may be under the assumption that Sam is just a robot. But if Buttercup knew that Sam was once human, then I disagree that she wouldn't feel anything.

Meh. We all have our arguments about the whole classification thing. We all have our POVs. To each his own! Cheers!

It all depends what we see what Buttercup might do."You either die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain." I think this quote justifies the whole point depending what you do. In this case, Buttercup and Blossom.

I HOPE to GOD that Blossom doesn't wear glasses for the remainder of this webcomic. She looks stupid with them on when she don't really need it... Not her character and please don't tell me about Bubbles wearing glasses in one of the episodes. She only wore it for the time being because somehow, someway she had bad eyesight... Temporarily.

Admittedly those do make for good stories when done right. Injustice did something like that in the comics prequel and the game's story mode. Even though I do very much dislike Tyrant Superman (as I call him) from Injustice, his fall from hero-hood (is that a real term?) was interesting to see. I did know at the time that this was taking place in an alternate dimension in the comic prequel.

Despite liking epic Darth Vader moments, we all think that Buttercup is gonna turn bad because she's gonna kill a full body cyborg that is only programed to hate organic life. That's basically what the Daleks are, full body cyborgs programed to hate organic life. Really once you think about it, how is Buttercup, who may not be the most innocent Powerpuff Girl, going to be guilty about killing a Dalek? Can anyone tell me if there is any way that Buttercup would be guilty about killing a cyborg with only one emotion: hate?

Do you think Samantha will ever get a "backstory"? Something explaining why she's here in the first place. Or will Buttercup simply turn her in to a pile of bloody scrap metal, and that'll be the end of it?I'm half expecting Dr.X to make so sort of remark about her, after she dies.

Blood Lord wrote:I love it when a hero falls and becomes a villain.

Mad-Mutt wrote:Admittedly those do make for good stories when done right.

It does make good story. Especially if said hero has friends, family, or other heroes, who do follow them to the darkside. Anakin Skywalker is the first one to come to my mind.

TheMadDoctor wrote:Really once you think about it, how is Buttercup, who may not be the most innocent Powerpuff Girl, going to be guilty about killing a Dalek? Can anyone tell me if there is any way that Buttercup would be guilty about killing a cyborg with only one emotion: hate?

Maybe there's more to Samantha, than meets the eye. However, when you put it that way, it does make since. My initial thoughts were; if Buttercup didn't know Sam was part human, and she slaughtered her in a blood frenzy, saw that part of her was still human, than she'd start to feel really bad. However Samantha's setting there, on the grown, with a ton of blood around her, but Buttercup doesn't seem to give a shit. I would love to see Buttercup walking away from this fight, riddled with guilt, but that's starting to look very unlikely at this point.

Mad-Mutt wrote:Considering Sam is being demonized by this point into looking like a soulless machine whose not even anything near human, Buttercup may be under the assumption that Sam is just a robot. But if Buttercup knew that Sam was once human, then I disagree that she wouldn't feel anything.

I completely agree with that. But how would Buttercup even know she was human to begin with? Unless someone who knew Sam, told her.

Havoc751 wrote:Do you think Samantha will ever get a "backstory"? Something explaining why she's here in the first place. Or will Buttercup simply turn her in to a pile of bloody scrap metal, and that'll be the end of it?I'm half expecting Dr.X to make so sort of remark about her, after she dies.

Blood Lord wrote:I love it when a hero falls and becomes a villain.

Mad-Mutt wrote:Admittedly those do make for good stories when done right.

It does make good story. Especially if said hero has friends, family, or other heroes, who do follow them to the darkside. Anakin Skywalker is the first one to come to my mind.

TheMadDoctor wrote:Really once you think about it, how is Buttercup, who may not be the most innocent Powerpuff Girl, going to be guilty about killing a Dalek? Can anyone tell me if there is any way that Buttercup would be guilty about killing a cyborg with only one emotion: hate?

Maybe there's more to Samantha, than meets the eye. However, when you put it that way, it does make since. My initial thoughts were; if Buttercup didn't know Sam was part human, and she slaughtered her in a blood frenzy, saw that part of her was still human, than she'd start to feel really bad. However Samantha's setting there, on the grown, with a ton of blood around her, but Buttercup doesn't seem to give a shit. I would love to see Buttercup walking away from this fight, riddled with guilt, but that's starting to look very unlikely at this point.

Dr.X: Sam's death was a necessary loss.Like that sort of remark? I expect a something like that.

Havoc751 wrote:Do you think Samantha will ever get a "backstory"? Something explaining why she's here in the first place. Or will Buttercup simply turn her in to a pile of bloody scrap metal, and that'll be the end of it?

I'm trying to guess at how much time we have left before the bomb goes off. I don't think it is enough of a time for Samantha to explain all of her back story, but it might be brought up if Buttercup asks whats wrong with her and how she joined the Cluster. She really isn't the asking type.

Havoc751 wrote:I'm half expecting Dr.X to make so sort of remark about her, after she dies.

This I see as being much more possible.

TheMadDoctor wrote:she's gonna kill a full body cyborg that is only programed to hate organic life. That's basically what the Daleks are,

Weren't you corrected on the idea of comparing Samantha to Daleks from BR? Cybermen are still your best comparison here for Sam. Especially when you can argue the point that Daleks are controlled by little mutant things that can live outside of the Daleks without any help.

We aren't looking at personality structure here, but physical comparison. The personality stance of "destroy all humans" can be shared by nearly every single classification of robot/cyborg and most alien species.

Havoc751 wrote:I completely agree with that. But how would Buttercup even know she was human to begin with? Unless someone who knew Sam, told her.

She did fight with her a bit before hand. she could have gotten the impression that she was a human then. Even from the current conversation she could infer that Samantha was at some point in time a human.

Havoc751 wrote:It does make good story. Especially if said hero has friends, family, or other heroes, who do follow them to the darkside. Anakin Skywalker is the first one to come to my mind.

One of my favorite examples. I was giddy when the mask snapped on and he started breathing. I like the drama that such a change can create. the effect of it in Star Wars can be debated, but I also like to think of Arthas from Warcraft.

CTCFirebird wrote:Dr.X: Sam's death was a necessary loss.Like that sort of remark? I expect a something like that.

Maybe. I was thinking of some a little more "philosophical" (as per his style). Like:"Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."Or"By abandoning her humanity, she sought to achieve perfection..."And then the rest of that might relate to exactly how she dies.

Blood Lord wrote:I'm trying to guess at how much time we have left before the bomb goes off. I don't think it is enough of a time for Samantha to explain all of her back story, but it might be brought up if Buttercup asks whats wrong with her and how she joined the Cluster. She really isn't the asking type.

Buttercup is more "punch now, ask later". I could see her possibly stopping to explain things, maybe a brief summary as to why she is, where she is. It could also cut to a flashback near the end of their fight, shortly before Sam is killed. Or Dr.X could give us the 411 on her.

Havoc751 wrote:Do you think Samantha will ever get a "backstory"? Something explaining why she's here in the first place. Or will Buttercup simply turn her in to a pile of bloody scrap metal, and that'll be the end of it?

I'm trying to guess at how much time we have left before the bomb goes off. I don't think it is enough of a time for Samantha to explain all of her back story, but it might be brought up if Buttercup asks whats wrong with her and how she joined the Cluster. She really isn't the asking type.

Havoc751 wrote:

CTCFirebird wrote:Dr.X: Sam's death was a necessary loss.Like that sort of remark? I expect a something like that.

Maybe. I was thinking of some a little more "philosophical" (as per his style). Like:"Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."Or"By abandoning her humanity, she sought to achieve perfection..."And then the rest of that might relate to exactly how she dies.

I was thinking of maybe if Samantha dies, that could perhaps trigger the bomb and that could tie in from what Dr.X would say as what Havoc751 had in mind. As if, Samantha was suppose to be the saboteur. That's possible, IMO!

Blood Lord wrote:

Havoc751 wrote:I'm half expecting Dr.X to make so sort of remark about her, after she dies.

This I see as being much more possible.

Yup!

Blood Lord wrote:

TheMadDoctor wrote:she's gonna kill a full body cyborg that is only programed to hate organic life. That's basically what the Daleks are,

Weren't you corrected on the idea of comparing Samantha to Daleks from BR? Cybermen are still your best comparison here for Sam. Especially when you can argue the point that Daleks are controlled by little mutant things that can live outside of the Daleks without any help.

We aren't looking at personality structure here, but physical comparison. The personality stance of "destroy all humans" can be shared by nearly every single classification of robot/cyborg and most alien species.

Was wondering why he brought that whole crap again. <sighs> A quote from Batman in terms of this situation: "He knows. He just doesn't care."

Blood Lord wrote:

Havoc751 wrote:It does make good story. Especially if said hero has friends, family, or other heroes, who do follow them to the darkside. Anakin Skywalker is the first one to come to my mind.

One of my favorite examples. I was giddy when the mask snapped on and he started breathing. I like the drama that such a change can create. the effect of it in Star Wars can be debated, but I also like to think of Arthas from Warcraft.

Heh. I was, too. That was my favorite scene. I keep calling that part "The Face of Evil." Not much of a Warcraft fan, though. Just like the artwork

CTCFirebird wrote:I was thinking of maybe if Samantha dies, that could perhaps trigger the bomb and that could tie in from what Dr.X would say as what Havoc751 had in mind. As if, Samantha was suppose to be the saboteur. That's possible, IMO!

I was just thinking about this possibility. It would make sense if, somehow, Sam's energy source were used to power up the bomb. For instance (and this is just a wild guess on my part), what if Sam were to somehow land between the two big wires that Blossom disconnected? If the wires are still live, she could be the connector between them and in turn activate the bomb.

As I was skimming the previous pages (looking for a hint as to where we are time wise) , I noticed that Bubbles used her sonic boom voice sometime after the power outage, and I wondered if it would be so loud that it could be heard in the area that Blossom and the others are currently located. Though, I suppose they could either be too far away or that Bubbles simply wasn't loud enough.

Edit: I would also like to mention that if we presume that the visuals from Dexter's glasses are showing their exact positions both times, then it would seem as if Buttercup and Sam are fighting in an area directly above Blossom and Bell. It is also noteworthy that Sam's position in the first energy reading seems to overlap with the bomb's position in the second energy reading. Since Bell is basically right in front of the bomb now, I think that it wouldn't be that unreasonable for Sam to fall from her area now and land in between the two wires. This would then lead to Blossom, Bell and Buttercup either being tossed back by the explosion or fleeing from it. I'm leaning toward fleeing since Bell is so far from her original location (though the knockback could send her flying). Interestingly enough, if this were true, it's possible that Gir could still be destroyed by the explosion from Sam landing between the wires.

Of course, I could just be over analyzing this whole scenario. I'll admit it feels like a bit of a stretch.

Edit2: I also noticed that there are double rings around Blossom and Bell's energy signals in the first page, but only a double ring around Bell's energy signal in the second. I wonder if that means that they are the furthest from the Dexter's scanner? Could this mean that, for some reason or another, Bell was left down there while Blossom and Buttercup attempted to escape (with Buttercup possibly forcing Blossom to leave her)?

"A reader lives a thousand lives, the man who never reads lives only one." - George R.R. MartinTumblr

CTCFirebird wrote:I was thinking of maybe if Samantha dies, that could perhaps trigger the bomb and that could tie in from what Dr.X would say as what Havoc751 had in mind. As if, Samantha was suppose to be the saboteur. That's possible, IMO!

I was just thinking about this possibility. It would make sense if, somehow, Sam's energy source were used to power up the bomb. For instance (and this is just a wild guess on my part), what if Sam were to somehow land between the two big wires that Blossom disconnected? If the wires are still live, she could be the connector between them and in turn activate the bomb.

As I was skimming the previous pages (looking for a hint as to where we are time wise) , I noticed that Bubbles used her sonic boom voice sometime after the power outage, and I wondered if it would be so loud that it could be heard in the area that Blossom and the others are currently located. Though, I suppose they could either be too far away or that Bubbles simply wasn't loud enough.

Edit: I would also like to mention that if we presume that the visuals from Dexter's glasses are showing their exact positions both times, then it would seem as if Buttercup and Sam are fighting in an area directly above Blossom and Bell. It is also noteworthy that Sam's position in the first energy reading seems to overlap with the bomb's position in the second energy reading. Since Bell is basically right in front of the bomb now, I think that it wouldn't be that unreasonable for Sam to fall from her area now and land in between the two wires. This would then lead to Blossom, Bell and Buttercup either being tossed back by the explosion or fleeing from it. I'm leaning toward fleeing since Bell is so far from her original location (though the knockback could send her flying). Interestingly enough, if this were true, it's possible that Gir could still be destroyed by the explosion from Sam landing between the wires.

Of course, I could just be over analyzing this whole scenario. I'll admit it feels like a bit of a stretch.

Edit2: I also noticed that there are double rings around Blossom and Bell's energy signals in the first page, but only a double ring around Bell's energy signal in the second. I wonder if that means that they are the furthest from the Dexter's scanner? Could this mean that, for some reason or another, Bell was left down there while Blossom and Buttercup attempted to escape (with Buttercup possibly forcing Blossom to leave her)?

Well, the wires are not dead. They're just separated. Plus, not only that, there is a generating source in that facility that conducts electricity with all that ionic stuff and metallic items there. Heh, kinda like an old science project with hooking up a light bulb and a battery with the wires. But yeah, I could see that happening, too, as a possibility. With Samantha having to fall between them. It could possibly be Buttercup's fault or not depending on the situation. Gir has the opportunity to put the bomb in since Bell is NOW keeping Blossom busy. I don't think that Blossom could pull off that little Sherlock Homles style again when Bell is on the verge of wanting to murder Blossom by the sense of letting her hair fall all over her face and stuff. The wires may be fried, but can easily be replaced with new one and/or you can cut wire around where its fried, because from where it was fried, due to wiring, the fried wire would reach a few inches of the inside of that covering, but as for Samantha, being a cyborg and NOT A DALEK like R2-D2, she also generates electricity. So, yeah, Samantha could burst out to help generate the electricity traveling from one to the next. Uh, Superman might be a perfect example. Like in the movie how the train track was missing and Superman used himself as to help... Bridge it (I think that's the right wording for it) so the Train could go through without having to crash. Or like in Mighty Morphin Power Rangers The Movie where Ivan Ooze destroyed the monorail track and the White Ranger used his Falcon Zord to help that situation. So, yeah, she could clear that gap right there with her own body either being destroyed by Buttercup like that or having Samantha using whatever energy she has left to connect both those wirings. Superman: Quest For Peace comes to mind in that. Like how Superman defeated his evil clone, Nuclear Man by throwing him in a factory after blocking the source of his power, the Sun, which also gave radiation. The entire place lit up like a Christmas Tree and in this case, the whole place would light up like magnesium light or even LED light... Blinding light.

Could Samantha be a Zord? I wonder...

As for your skimming through pages, I believe that a small portion of her voice would boom through, but with a little more of a quake from where Bubbles and both her sisters currently are. I just don't remember the lights going out where Bubbles is. The whole electricity would have to go out and I don't think that there was any mention of it based on the timeline of this story from when it happened to where we are now.

Just wondering when the colorist is gonna put some teepees in his coloring style. Anime does that alot!

Your edit1: I don't really think that Samantha would land on the wires from falling from that space above Blossom and Bell. Considering the fact where Blossom and Bell landed. My guess is that its a few inches away. Unless, Buttercup and Samantha smashes the crap out of each other creating new holes like a crater. Then Samantha would have to get pummeled down by a powerful double axe handle smash and crashing through the ceiling and onto the wires. Still, don't think that hole would cover the entire room. Yes, Gir could still be destroyed or Bell grabbed Gir just in time before he would get destroyed.

Your edit 2: Its possible. And from that point on, I guess we see Blossom sees Dexter and Olga locking lip... I'm thinking with a little tongue action ... Sorry.

Still wondering what the hell was I.M. Weasel doing with them in the firsts place. Is he a respectable member of scientists?