(02-05-2013 08:59 PM)bbeljefe Wrote: Ah yes. some kid in Texas prints some 3-D gun parts and references crypto-anarchy and all of a sudden, it's chaos.

All you good, moral people vote for more gun control vis-à-vis more guns in the hands of the rulers and be sure and beat your kids into submission so we can avoid this atrocious voluntarism that so threatens our cult...ure.

I'm thinking you're on the wrong board with that kind of reply.

I wish I were.

The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their right names. - Chinese Proverb

When I get a house and room for tools, I'll be cranking out some 80's lowers with my drill press.

It is completly legal to make your own firearm for personal use. At what point dose a hunk of T-7075 become a firearm and not just a paper weight? 81% complete. So you buy a 80% lower and the jig with plates,and use your drill press to do a couple holes and machine out the trigger housing area.

3D printing and guns is a sensationalized topics. You can't print a gun barrel or chamber, not if you want to shoot anything bigger than .22LR. I think one guy made an AR-15 lower and part of an upper on a 3D printer, with a commercial bolt and barrel. But it fell apart after five shots.

3D printers don't do anything, with regards to guns, that couldn't already be done with a lathe and some hand tools other than make a plastic frame.

The person who made this documentary has no idea what they're talking about... One guy prints an AR-15 lower, then puts on a commercial upper, installs a commercial trigger package, puts on a commercial collapsible stock, and all the sudden OMG PEOPLE CAN PRINT GUNS. Or, not. All he's got is an AR-15 with no serial number, which you could get anyway by filing off the serial number on a real AR-15... Nothing really new has happened.

(03-05-2013 09:46 PM)Phaedrus Wrote: 3D printing and guns is a sensationalized topics. You can't print a gun barrel or chamber, not if you want to shoot anything bigger than .22LR. I think one guy made an AR-15 lower and part of an upper on a 3D printer, with a commercial bolt and barrel. But it fell apart after five shots.

3D printers don't do anything, with regards to guns, that couldn't already be done with a lathe and some hand tools other than make a plastic frame.

3d printers that print metal already exist. They use metal powder and lasers to fuse the metal one layer at a time.

It's still no good for cheap things like guns but is currently used to make titanium surgical implants tailored for people.

Thing is, like with everything IT related... The cost will come down. The technology will improve.

This might not be controversial to you since guns are so accessible in your location. In places like Australia all of a sudden people can print heavy assault rifles with high capacity magazines when it used to be unavailable.

Also making them out of plastic, even if they only last a few shots. It gets them past a metal detector and gives them a chance at killing someone. Welcome to the future.

You claim nothing new has happened... Maybe not much changes in your country, but it does change things. It makes a mockery of any attempt at gun control. Whether that is a good or bad thing is up for debate.

Edit: I was also aware that most of the gun in the documentary wasn't printed. The point still stands though. With some design modifications I'm sure all the parts could be printed. If using materials with decent strength and thermal properties most of the gun wouldn't need design modification.

“Forget Jesus, the stars died so you could be born.” - Lawrence M. Krauss

The thing is, they can't. You can't make a gun out of entirely plastic... The barrel must be metal. The boltface must be metal. The firing pin or hammer must be metal. That's pretty much a requirement for anything that will fire without blowing up, or if you're lucky fire more than one shot. So no, you can't get it through a metal detector.

And the metal parts cannot be 3D printed, even if technology improves. You might 3D print a barrel for a .22LR, ten years from now and with an expensive setup. But try and print an AR-15 barrel? Or bolt? Not going to happen. The fusion process used in 3D metal printers is not a tenth as strong as forged, or even cast steel, and lacks heat treating. A gun barrel has to be made as a solid piece, then bored, then rifled. No one will be able to do that at home, not without tens of thousands of dollars of investment, not in the foreseeable future.

And, for countries where guns are already banned, most of them have restricted access to ammunition anyway. What, are they going to print brass cartridges? Even cast brass isn't suitable for most firearms, it has to be drawn... And you can't print gunpowder.

What I'm saying is this.

Where 3D printing was 10 years ago......Where it is now.............................................................................​................................................................................​............................Where it needs to be to do anything like what you think it does

I understand the tech. Probably better than you do. And I understand guns. And I can say with authority that the majority of the claims made in that "documentary" are pretty much bullshit, with regards to making weapons. 3D printing will do a lot of things, but it won't make it possible to print a whole firearm, not in the next 20-30 years.

(03-05-2013 10:23 PM)Phaedrus Wrote: The thing is, they can't. You can't make a gun out of entirely plastic... The barrel must be metal. The boltface must be metal. The firing pin or hammer must be metal. That's pretty much a requirement for anything that will fire without blowing up, or if you're lucky fire more than one shot. So no, you can't get it through a metal detector.

And the metal parts cannot be 3D printed, even if technology improves. You might 3D print a barrel for a .22LR, ten years from now and with an expensive setup. But try and print an AR-15 barrel? Or bolt? Not going to happen. The fusion process used in 3D metal printers is not a tenth as strong as forged, or even cast steel, and lacks heat treating. A gun barrel has to be made as a solid piece, then bored, then rifled. No one will be able to do that at home, not without tens of thousands of dollars of investment, not in the foreseeable future.

And, for countries where guns are already banned, most of them have restricted access to ammunition anyway. What, are they going to print brass cartridges? Even cast brass isn't suitable for most firearms, it has to be drawn... And you can't print gunpowder.

What I'm saying is this.

Where 3D printing was 10 years ago......Where it is now.............................................................................​................................................................................​............................Where it needs to be to do anything like what you think it does

I understand the tech. Probably better than you do. And I understand guns. And I can say with authority that the majority of the claims made in that "documentary" are pretty much bullshit, with regards to making weapons. 3D printing will do a lot of things, but it won't make it possible to print a whole firearm, not in the next 20-30 years.

What DeepThought said. You can 3-D print in metal now and the technology will be available to the public in a widespread fashion in about 10 years from now. So, yes, an entire gun, barrel and all could be printed from a CAD file in the not too distant future.

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