Why am I so cynical? Probably because of what I've seen over and over again. I posted this before:

Seeker wrote:my point is that these women are NOT ATTRACTED to the older yet financially stable men they settle for. They're settling with someone who they hope will provide stability over the long term, but it's not love in the romantic sense. Over the last few years living around Asia I've met a few of these younger women who made the choice to shack up with a much older man for some reason. Sometimes I've had the temerity to ask "Do you love him?", and all but one of them answered "NO", the only one that didn't tried to get into my pants that very same night.

But let the guys continue to indulge their fantasies.

Most guys agree with this but they continue to think that THEY'RE THE EXCEPTION!

Seeker wrote:Why am I so cynical? Probably because of what I've seen over and over again. I posted this before:

Seeker wrote:my point is that these women are NOT ATTRACTED to the older yet financially stable men they settle for. They're settling with someone who they hope will provide stability over the long term, but it's not love in the romantic sense. Over the last few years living around Asia I've met a few of these younger women who made the choice to shack up with a much older man for some reason. Sometimes I've had the temerity to ask "Do you love him?", and all but one of them answered "NO", the only one that didn't tried to get into my pants that very same night.

But let the guys continue to indulge their fantasies.

Most guys agree with this but they continue to think that THEY'RE THE EXCEPTION!

Even if you are correct as a general principle, stating that a guy's wife to whom he has been happily married for years is "obviously not attracted to him" seems a little classless. At the very least you might congratulate him for having a relationship that is the exception to your rule. The fact in this very thread that multiple guys who live in PI said that such relationships often happen and happen successfully, at least raises doubts about the absoluteness of your assertion.

For me what attraction is, is a fascinating subject and not only changes based on culture, age and generation, but more importantly on the nature of the relationship. What attraction is for a one night stand isnt the same thing as what it is for a casual gf, serious gf, or lifetime partner. For a one night stand sexual attraction might be the prime or only consideration. But in marriage it is one of a number of considerations. And yes those considerations might include "can he provide for me," "could she be a good mother," "will he cheat on me," "will she take care of me as I get older" and probably a dozen others.

As to whether the girls you talked with "loved" their husbands; anyone who has been married for a period of time knows that the concept of love is very fluid; one day I loved my wives, the next I loathed them. if a girl is chatting wth you and hitting on you, she aint gonna say "I love my husband". She's gonna rationalize by saying "I really dont love him." The real question is, did they go home to the older husband that night - and screw his brains out!

"Keius", I would love to meet you for a beer/coffee some time if you are in the Philippines to prove that your negativity is completely unjustified. I don't believe I would ever change your mind with words on a computer screen.

I don't blame you for your views; most people have never met anyone like my wife. Her comments were written from the heart - there was no ulterior motive!

How do I know? We have known each other for nearly 7 years and, because of our work, spend 24 hours a day together.

For those of you that doubt a happy, beautiful relationship can exist - YOU ARE VERY WRONG.

For those of you that want to explore my relationship further, I would ask you to put up full details of yours, so I can be critical also.

Hello there-

I will be in touch one of these days- I do not get up to Cebu very often, but I do sometimes. We have friends on
Mactan- not too far from the Doctors Hospital and Basak Rd. You are right- most, who will go not ever go anywhere
or do anything, since they are so devoid of actual action, will spend time at home in the US nit-picking on others while
they do nothing except spank the monkey.

davewe wrote:Even if you are correct as a general principle, stating that a guy's wife to whom he has been happily married for years is "obviously not attracted to him" seems a little classless. At the very least you might congratulate him for having a relationship that is the exception to your rule. The fact in this very thread that multiple guys who live in PI said that such relationships often happen and happen successfully, at least raises doubts about the absoluteness of your assertion.

For me what attraction is, is a fascinating subject and not only changes based on culture, age and generation, but more importantly on the nature of the relationship. What attraction is for a one night stand isnt the same thing as what it is for a casual gf, serious gf, or lifetime partner. For a one night stand sexual attraction might be the prime or only consideration. But in marriage it is one of a number of considerations. And yes those considerations might include "can he provide for me," "could she be a good mother," "will he cheat on me," "will she take care of me as I get older" and probably a dozen others.

As to whether the girls you talked with "loved" their husbands; anyone who has been married for a period of time knows that the concept of love is very fluid; one day I loved my wives, the next I loathed them. if a girl is chatting wth you and hitting on you, she aint gonna say "I love my husband". She's gonna rationalize by saying "I really dont love him." The real question is, did they go home to the older husband that night - and screw his brains out!

What other guys tell me about their relationships means very little to me, all that matters is what the woman has to say in private. I'm not the only one to talk about this, even Winston's "partner" Dianne talks about how other women she knows say the most horrible things about their foreign partners behind their backs. Another example, a female acquaintance of mine with a partner 20 years her senior, and fat even by Western standards OPENLY talked to me about her other (younger) boyfriend while we sat in her partner's condo. This shows that she didn't even respect the guy, let alone love him, despite all the money he gave her. Yet in pictures on facebook they look like a smiling happy couple!

The one that tried to f**k me that night was quite funny. She started going on about how she loved her boyfriend and showed me his picture, a very typical old, fat Englishman. Yet later she said that they never had sex because in her culture women didn't do that before marriage (not that she was a virgin). Then she started hitting on me in a very blatant way saying, "If my boyfriend would see this then he would cry!".

I could go on but you get the idea. It's not 90% of the one's I've known but 100%. While exceptions may exist I've yet to know of one.

It's always about money, isn't it seeker? Or it about western "attractiveness?" Or is it about "status?" So what is your definition of "love in the romantic sense?"

Guys like you REALLY need to understand that your experiences are really only that, YOUR experiences. Your perceptions are really just that, perceptions. I mean really, EVERYONE KNOWS that woman only want money and nothing else, right? And men just want SEX from any many woman as possible, right?

I notice you don't ever say ANYTHING about fat bald old Asian men with young wives? It seems that it's always the "white" guy you and others seem to like to give opinions on?

Why is that?

Welcome dekesinger.......hope you stick around a little while. I'm happy that you and your wife found each other.

Mr. Peabody? "Don't bring a flower into a sewer? I concur completely!

"What we are seeing in this headless misandry is a grand display of the Tyranny of the Underdog: "I am a wretchedly longstanding victim;therefore I own no burden of adult accountability, nor need to honor any restraint against my words and actions. In fact, all efforts to restrain me are only further proof of my oppressed condition."

"It is the most perfect trump-card against accountable living ever devised."

Truthville wrote:It's always about money, isn't it seeker? Or it about western "attractiveness?" Or is it about "status?" So what is your definition of "love in the romantic sense?"

Guys like you REALLY need to understand that your experiences are really only that, YOUR experiences. Your perceptions are really just that, perceptions. I mean really, EVERYONE KNOWS that woman only want money and nothing else, right?

I notice you don't ever say ANYTHING about fat bald old Asian men with young wives? It seems that it's always the "white" guy you and others seem to like to give opinions on?

It's funny you should say this because I was about to mention this young woman I know who recently married a Korean guy. He isn't even that old he's just 37 and she's 25, but it's exactly the same situation as the others I discussed. While he's in Korea she says "what happens here stays here" meaning she sees other guys. She admits she's just using him to get to Korea and that she'll leave him when she gets there, just as me and a friend of mine predicted. She's very open about it and not ashamed at all. Oh I almost forgot to mention that she didn't even have sex with him yet, on their wedding night she claimed it was her period.

I never said women only want money, I've argued against that in the past even on here. If a woman likes you for real she'll spend on YOU if she can afford it. I said that money/security is the main interest they have in these much older, unattractive guys. That's like, common knowledge.

And isn't it common knowledge that the only thing that an older man (or any man for that matter) sees in a younger woman, is sex? That's too simplistic a view. I agree with Davewe that there are many types of attraction that occur between men and women, one of which could be money/security. But from my own experiences, finding love is a lot, lot more complicated than that. I've had several relationships with Filipinas and most of them have been negative. Why? Because eventually I realized that I was just a walking ATM to them. But have I given up on Filipinas or women in general? NO!

If the search for love is a fantasy then I am guilty, as charged. What's the point of living if you don't have love in your life? At the end of my life, I might have all the money I might ever need but if I'm alone and unloved, well that's a pretty shitty way to end, don't you think?

I'm still looking for love and whenever I find a woman interested in me, the first thing that pops into my head is why? Is she another gold digger? But I always wait and see what develops. If you think that all women are gold diggers and you don't give a woman a chance, you'll never find true love. But if you don't care about that and all you want is hookups and sex, there are many, many ways to get that and you don't have to think about love.

To me, the search for love is like playing golf. Many people ask me why I waste so much time and money playing golf around the world. I always tell them that it's because I want to hit that perfect shot and know what that feels like again. If you're a golfer, you know exactly what I mean. The one shot in the round where you hit that little golf ball high in the air, exactly where you were aiming. And you watch it spin and land softly on the green a few feet away from the hole. It's one of the greatest feelings that a man can experience!

But if I gave up after hitting hundreds of different golf balls, then I might never experience that feeling again. And so I keep trying, learning from my past experiences, hoping to hit that perfect shot. Remember, "Life is like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're gonna get."

dekesinger wrote:
"Keius", I would love to meet you for a beer/coffee some time if you are in the Philippines to prove that your negativity is completely unjustified. I don't believe I would ever change your mind with words on a computer screen.

Believe it or not, I would love to meet you in person. Unfortunately, that wouldn't be for awhile. I'm planning a trip to SE Asia sometime in the next 2 years. I have an obligatory trip to China sometime before that.
While I do believe that my cynicism is justified, based on the things i've seen and my own life experiences, there are exceptions to every rule. Love is overrated and ephemeral, assuming it ever really happened.
All that flowery prose just rings BS to me.
Trust is what matters. If you do have a deep level of trust in your relationship, then you're a lucky man. Still... considering your situation, I'd still protect myself as much as possible and never take her back to your home country.

Cynic? U betcha. I don't need someone to pick over my own marriage/relationship. I'm a realist, especially when it comes to being self aware. The cynic again

If you guys have time to waste on gossiping about someone else's wedding photos, perhaps you should find more productive use for your time.

As far as I can see, this man offers valuable relocation services and such. I'd add that you might want to look into offering property management services to your real estate offerings. Usually when you buy a pre-build condo in PH it comes bare, and before you can live in it or rent it out, you need to furnish it. This isn't a big issue if the owner is on site, but difficult when the owner is overseas. Filipino contractors are flaky and have difficulty completing projects on time. If you can offer management service to supervise interior jobs, that might be worth something to absentee landlords. There's also residual income possibility if you can have the landlord pay you to maintain/manage their property or vacation home.

"Keius", I would love to meet you for a beer/coffee some time if you are in the Philippines to prove that your negativity is completely unjustified. I don't believe I would ever change your mind with words on a computer screen.

I don't blame you for your views; most people have never met anyone like my wife. Her comments were written from the heart - there was no ulterior motive!

How do I know? We have known each other for nearly 7 years and, because of our work, spend 24 hours a day together.

For those of you that doubt a happy, beautiful relationship can exist - YOU ARE VERY WRONG.

For those of you that want to explore my relationship further, I would ask you to put up full details of yours, so I can be critical also.

Welcome to this forum. I read the thread last year and am happy to see its subject get to weigh it. It's stunning to me that guys who have never met you or your wife know more about what your relationship is based on than you do - lol! I hope you'll stick around and provide your perspective on life and love in PI.

I have to agree with you... Lots of internet wannabe's that think they know it all...

So what if the girl is a gold digger? The old guy is most likely having the time of his life and living out his golden years with a young hottie... Something many can aspire to, IF you have the where with all...

As far as her photos, there is nothing there to indicate she is a gold digger, nothing... Even if she was, what gives any of you the right to speculate and slander someone you know nothing about? No, just more sad little people that feel they have to knock someone else down in order to feel better about their pittiful existence...

Seeker wrote:Why am I so cynical? Probably because of what I've seen over and over again. I posted this before:

Seeker wrote:my point is that these women are NOT ATTRACTED to the older yet financially stable men they settle for. They're settling with someone who they hope will provide stability over the long term, but it's not love in the romantic sense. Over the last few years living around Asia I've met a few of these younger women who made the choice to shack up with a much older man for some reason. Sometimes I've had the temerity to ask "Do you love him?", and all but one of them answered "NO", the only one that didn't tried to get into my pants that very same night.

But let the guys continue to indulge their fantasies.

Most guys agree with this but they continue to think that THEY'RE THE EXCEPTION!

Yes..many of these girls might be gold diggers...oops..well actually many girls who marry one their own age are also gold diggers, but let us assume
that it is so much of the time. It's absolute? Because you talk to girls in private and YOU KNOW?
You must be naive, if you think that "talking to girls in private" yields some kind of absolute truth. Perhaps one in ten women even knows her own mind, much less can articulate it. THE VAST majority of women of ANY AGE, marry because it is convenient. They bullshit themselves, and especially their friends,
but I would guess that 95% of women marry for convenience. I KNOW..i have talked to millions of them personally in private!

So much of the posting on these topics is just BS generation...as if somehow establishing some meaningful statistic were even possible.
Who cares? If you are in the DOING MODE, statistics mean squat! If I depended on statistics, my ass would be rotting somewhere in South America, or some other shit hole somewhere.

Generate a statistic of ONE...and with women, its what they DO that counts, because even more than with men, what they might say is 99% bullshit...they
act what they feel...and say what is convenient.

I might add, that buying love sucks...like paying someone to like you or act out that they love you...that is terrible, BUT it's a hell of a lot better than
paying for some horrid bitch (Yes, one exactly your age..properly American mated..) to poop on you and treat you like shit, which is exactly what
you will get if you end up married in the USA...

The whole dynamic on this forum seems typically American pathological overall. Rather than some sense of community and decency, it is a freaking bitch-fest.

INCREASINGLY, IF A DECENT "FOREIGN " GIRL WAS WATCHING THIS FORUM, SHE WOULD FIND PLENTY OF EVIDENCE THAT MARRYING AN AMERICAN MAN WAS IDIOTIC. THIS FORUM HAS BECOME "EXHIBIT A" FOR SUCH A CONCLUSION. With such a poorly moderated forum, increasingly, the only hope
for intelligent conversation will be through PM. If one does some searches, there are some genuine expat forums that tend to be country specific. Many times they are inhabited by sane people.

OutWest wrote: The whole dynamic on this forum seems typically American pathological overall. Rather than some sense of community and decency, it is a freaking bitch-fest.

INCREASINGLY, IF A DECENT "FOREIGN " GIRL WAS WATCHING THIS FORUM, SHE WOULD FIND PLENTY OF EVIDENCE THAT MARRYING AN AMERICAN MAN WAS IDIOTIC. THIS FORUM HAS BECOME "EXHIBIT A" FOR SUCH A CONCLUSION. With such a poorly moderated forum, increasingly, the only hope
for intelligent conversation will be through PM. If one does some searches, there are some genuine expat forums that tend to be country specific. Many times they are inhabited by sane people.

Outwest

I agree completely. I used to not comment about the lack of common sense moderation, but the troll infestation and general bitching and tearing down of good posters has gotten out of control -- except to one person, who is the owner of the site and who remains merrily oblivious to it. Maybe when most or all of the good posters have left, he'll notice. . . maybe.

Seeker wrote:Why am I so cynical? Probably because of what I've seen over and over again. I posted this before:

Seeker wrote:my point is that these women are NOT ATTRACTED to the older yet financially stable men they settle for. They're settling with someone who they hope will provide stability over the long term, but it's not love in the romantic sense. Over the last few years living around Asia I've met a few of these younger women who made the choice to shack up with a much older man for some reason. Sometimes I've had the temerity to ask "Do you love him?", and all but one of them answered "NO", the only one that didn't tried to get into my pants that very same night.

But let the guys continue to indulge their fantasies.

Most guys agree with this but they continue to think that THEY'RE THE EXCEPTION!

Yes..many of these girls might be gold diggers...oops..well actually many girls who marry one their own age are also gold diggers, but let us assume
that it is so much of the time. It's absolute? Because you talk to girls in private and YOU KNOW?
You must be naive, if you think that "talking to girls in private" yields some kind of absolute truth. Perhaps one in ten women even knows her own mind, much less can articulate it. THE VAST majority of women of ANY AGE, marry because it is convenient. They bullshit themselves, and especially their friends,
but I would guess that 95% of women marry for convenience. I KNOW..i have talked to millions of them personally in private!

So much of the posting on these topics is just BS generation...as if somehow establishing some meaningful statistic were even possible.
Who cares? If you are in the DOING MODE, statistics mean squat! If I depended on statistics, my ass would be rotting somewhere in South America, or some other shit hole somewhere.

Generate a statistic of ONE...and with women, its what they DO that counts, because even more than with men, what they might say is 99% bullshit...they
act what they feel...and say what is convenient.

I might add, that buying love sucks...like paying someone to like you or act out that they love you...that is terrible, BUT it's a hell of a lot better than
paying for some horrid bitch (Yes, one exactly your age..properly American mated..) to poop on you and treat you like shit, which is exactly what
you will get if you end up married in the USA...

The whole dynamic on this forum seems typically American pathological overall. Rather than some sense of community and decency, it is a freaking bitch-fest.

INCREASINGLY, IF A DECENT "FOREIGN " GIRL WAS WATCHING THIS FORUM, SHE WOULD FIND PLENTY OF EVIDENCE THAT MARRYING AN AMERICAN MAN WAS IDIOTIC. THIS FORUM HAS BECOME "EXHIBIT A" FOR SUCH A CONCLUSION. With such a poorly moderated forum, increasingly, the only hope
for intelligent conversation will be through PM. If one does some searches, there are some genuine expat forums that tend to be country specific. Many times they are inhabited by sane people.

Outwest

+1 on all points. Asking women how they feel is irrelevant. Even if you ask a large sampling, most women are unaware of their true feelings and motivations. Viewing their actions is a much more effective indicator, but even that ain't perfect.

But as Outwest says, even if the young woman in question is motivated by the older man's money, that can still be a much better situation for the man than he would get living in the US with his 50+ wife, who bitches at him, gives him no sexy or lousy sex, and BTW - still wants money!! If you think that gold digging Asian girls who wants you to give them an allowance of a few hundred a month is bad, try marrying a Western woman, for whom a few hundred is considered chump change.

I too made the mistake of telling a woman about this forum, having her google it, read various postings, and tell me that some of my fellow Americans were idiots and slime balls. How could I disagree?

Seeker wrote:Why am I so cynical? Probably because of what I've seen over and over again. I posted this before:

Seeker wrote:my point is that these women are NOT ATTRACTED to the older yet financially stable men they settle for. They're settling with someone who they hope will provide stability over the long term, but it's not love in the romantic sense. Over the last few years living around Asia I've met a few of these younger women who made the choice to shack up with a much older man for some reason. Sometimes I've had the temerity to ask "Do you love him?", and all but one of them answered "NO", the only one that didn't tried to get into my pants that very same night.

But let the guys continue to indulge their fantasies.

Most guys agree with this but they continue to think that THEY'RE THE EXCEPTION!

Yes..many of these girls might be gold diggers...oops..well actually many girls who marry one their own age are also gold diggers, but let us assume
that it is so much of the time. It's absolute? Because you talk to girls in private and YOU KNOW?
You must be naive, if you think that "talking to girls in private" yields some kind of absolute truth. Perhaps one in ten women even knows her own mind, much less can articulate it. THE VAST majority of women of ANY AGE, marry because it is convenient. They bullshit themselves, and especially their friends,
but I would guess that 95% of women marry for convenience. I KNOW..i have talked to millions of them personally in private!

So much of the posting on these topics is just BS generation...as if somehow establishing some meaningful statistic were even possible.
Who cares? If you are in the DOING MODE, statistics mean squat! If I depended on statistics, my ass would be rotting somewhere in South America, or some other shit hole somewhere.

Generate a statistic of ONE...and with women, its what they DO that counts, because even more than with men, what they might say is 99% bullshit...they
act what they feel...and say what is convenient.

I might add, that buying love sucks...like paying someone to like you or act out that they love you...that is terrible, BUT it's a hell of a lot better than
paying for some horrid bitch (Yes, one exactly your age..properly American mated..) to poop on you and treat you like shit, which is exactly what
you will get if you end up married in the USA...

The whole dynamic on this forum seems typically American pathological overall. Rather than some sense of community and decency, it is a freaking bitch-fest.

INCREASINGLY, IF A DECENT "FOREIGN " GIRL WAS WATCHING THIS FORUM, SHE WOULD FIND PLENTY OF EVIDENCE THAT MARRYING AN AMERICAN MAN WAS IDIOTIC. THIS FORUM HAS BECOME "EXHIBIT A" FOR SUCH A CONCLUSION. With such a poorly moderated forum, increasingly, the only hope
for intelligent conversation will be through PM. If one does some searches, there are some genuine expat forums that tend to be country specific. Many times they are inhabited by sane people.

Outwest

+1 on all points. Asking women how they feel is irrelevant. Even if you ask a large sampling, most women are unaware of their true feelings and motivations. Viewing their actions is a much more effective indicator, but even that ain't perfect.

But as Outwest says, even if the young woman in question is motivated by the older man's money, that can still be a much better situation for the man than he would get living in the US with his 50+ wife, who bitches at him, gives him no sexy or lousy sex, and BTW - still wants money!! If you think that gold digging Asian girls who wants you to give them an allowance of a few hundred a month is bad, try marrying a Western woman, for whom a few hundred is considered chump change.

I too made the mistake of telling a woman about this forum, having her google it, read various postings, and tell me that some of my fellow Americans were idiots and slime balls. How could I disagree?

In addtion, if your relationship with your Asian girlfriend doesn't workout you can find a new one easily if your living in Asia.

In defence of American men, men have always been idiots and slimeballs, society can still function ok with them around. However, society can't function when the women are idiots and slimeballs, thats the difference. American women, don't exactly bring out the best in people or inspire them.