Well... unless he dies Zayne will still be there to help the Jedi rebuild after the war.

Really depends what happens to him... and Lucien's bunch for that matter. They've all chosen to keep out of the Mandalorian Wars, but would they run away from the Jedi Civil War? I'm not so sure I can see them turning a blind eye to all that.

For some reason, reading this issue, I had a vision of Zayne and Jarael ending up as a married couple who still did this sort of thing well into their old age. Shel's nice, and all, but at this point... yeah, I'm firmly throwing my weight into the Zayne/Jarael shipper camp. *Ulicus lands in the camp with a thud*

I'm regretably moving towards Zayne/Jarael since Shel never appears.

Seriously, can we have a female secondary lead who isn't the male primary lead's love interest for once?

Can't say I've ever liked Shel. But then, I guess never seeing her doesn't help. Her character is just overly generic as things stand, since she's just the stereotypical stay at home love interest, which feels off in a series as bizarre and screwy as most of KOTOR's characters are.

One thing I forgot on the last post: I'd like to agree that Deep Impact is way better than Armageddon.

Zorrixor said:

Really depends what happens to him... and Lucien's bunch for that matter. They've all chosen to keep out of the Mandalorian Wars, but would they run away from the Jedi Civil War? I'm not so sure I can see them turning a blind eye to all that.

When #35 came out, I totally saw Lucien et al sitting it out with humility. Not trying to change the galaxy, because Lucien saw the most extreme outcome of what happens when you get involved in those things. I saw his Jedi as the base for a new peaceful order - notice how they all wear the ordinary brown "peasant robes" that will be the regular outfit in the far future. I think it would be best if Lucien and his gang stayed out of the story indefinitely, only popping up in some background info mentioning how they came out of the woods after the Exile cleared everything up, or seeing how things are going, maybe even only after the dust of TOR settles.

I hope that Zayne's ressouces aren't related to Lucien. I wouldn't be disappointed or anything if they are, but I'd rather have Lucien phased out of the story. With really nobody knowing that he's still alive, and no matter how much he's influencing his Jedi group, his name not having any continuing importance. Just like Revan abandoned his name. The galaxy should continue to believe that he has died at the Covenant bombing.

Ulicus said:

For some reason, reading this issue, I had a vision of Zayne and Jarael ending up as a married couple who still did this sort of thing well into their old age.

I think everyone here should think about all professional relationships he or she had with a person from the other gender. Now imagine something like that would always turn out as a romantic relationship whatever.

Besides, #42 really shot down the romance possibility for me; neither Jarael nor Zayne seemed "hormonally charged" after the kiss. There was no question whatsoever whether any of them really felt like what they did. And in JJM's world of con people who are not what they seem, it's only natural that the two leads would be able to fake a kiss that does not only fool Malak and Gryph, but also part of the audience. I just wonder if they spoke to Gryph afterwards...

Zorrixor said:

Can't say I've ever liked Shel. But then, I guess never seeing her doesn't help. Her character is just overly generic as things stand, since she's just the stereotypical stay at home love interest, which feels off in a series as bizarre and screwy as most of KOTOR's characters are.

The whole "return to Taris" arc seems to me like it was in another lifetime... It had a certain intensity that didn't come up again on that exact wavelength, but I can't really put a finger on it. Maybe because it was so much about going back to Zayne's roots, while any other issue is "just" about exploring the galaxy and introducing new elements. And in that regard, I think that Shel had a very interesting role that somehow fell out of the story altogether. I sometimes wonder if she'll reappear at all, but then again, Jarael was also absent during Vector and Vindication, and she's still one of the big three. Shel might actually come back with a twist (and no, I'm not saying she's the Exile).

I hope that Zayne's ressouces aren't related to Lucien. I wouldn't be disappointed or anything if they are, but I'd rather have Lucien phased out of the story. With really nobody knowing that he's still alive, and no matter how much he's influencing his Jedi group, his name not having any continuing importance. Just like Revan abandoned his name. The galaxy should continue to believe that he has died at the Covenant bombing.

I've not put all that much thought to who Zayne's "contacts" are; but when you talk about how Lucien is believed to be dead... I'm now suddenly thinking that's going to be the case.

It would certainly explain why he is so reluctant to mention who it is, for want of keeping Lucien's survival secret (as for obvious reasons he'd still be wanted for his crimes). I've never been able to make sense of why Zayne would care if people knew he was working for the Jedi Council (especially after both he and Jarael have burnt their bridges with the Revanchists). But because of the need to keep Lucien secret? That actually makes a lot of sense.

Yeah... I'm all out of ideas other than the Council, Revanchists and Lucien. And we know now that it sure isn't the Revanchists. His father's money laundering is perhaps one option, but there'd be no reason not to let Gryph in on that. The guys back on Taris? Maybe... but, again, what's the big secret if he's working with the Hidden Beks?

Heck, I've always liked the idea of Zayne and Jarael, although that was partially because Shel was such a minor character who showed up briefly in Commencement a few times, then didn't show up again until Knights of Suffering. And Zayne seems to have really grown up since he was the bumbling Padawan he was back on Taris, so not sure if he and Shel would still get along. We haven't seen them spend much time together, since after Shel realized Zayne didn't kill her brother, she was mostly off on missions to help Zayne clear his name.

And I personally hope Zayne's sources have nothing to do with Lucien. Lucien has changed, so I prefer he just sit out the rest of the series, or if not that, Zayne only runs into him after a long time.

Hm, I think there are Zayne and Jarael sparks, at least on Jarael's side. She showed interest in Zayne, especially during the Dueling Ambitions arc, but Zayne was a bit distracted by all the swoops. Zayne hasn't quite reciprocated, but Zayne's kind of dense that way. And I think both are old enough not to just start blushing a lot. Anyway, Jarael's kind of slowed down by her Crucible baggage. She told Zayne about her past, but it seems like she's still holding some things back.

I think everyone here should think about all professional relationships he or she had with a person from the other gender. Now imagine something like that would always turn out as a romantic relationship whatever.

Besides, #42 really shot down the romance possibility for me; neither Jarael nor Zayne seemed "hormonally charged" after the kiss. There was no question whatsoever whether any of them really felt like what they did. And in JJM's world of con people who are not what they seem, it's only natural that the two leads would be able to fake a kiss that does not only fool Malak and Gryph, but also part of the audience. I just wonder if they spoke to Gryph afterwards...

Well, I don't think Zayne is interested in Jarael at this point. I think she might have a bit of a thing for him, though.

Shel was more prominent in the early drafts of "Vector," where we got more of a postscript to the events of "Knights of Suffering" -- but because it was a postscript, it didn't really belong. That's not Vector's problem so much as where the previous story left off. If there were ever Special Edition DVD versions of comics, "Days/Knights" would probably have more than its share of "restored and deleted scenes" -- there were a lot of plates spinning that year, and even with the Handbook and the text pages, there was a lot of ground to cover.

But while Shel may have suffered from a bit of Darklighter Syndrome in the past, stay tuned. There's always the possibility for a remarkable recovery...

Yeah... I'm all out of ideas other than the Council, Revanchists and Lucien. And we know now that it sure isn't the Revanchists. His father's money laundering is perhaps one option, but there'd be no reason not to let Gryph in on that. The guys back on Taris? Maybe... but, again, what's the big secret if he's working with the Hidden Beks?

Maybe he's secretly become a Mandalorian.

Fett does owe him one....but considering how Fett solves all his problems...

Anyway, my idea is kind of a longshot, since it hasn't really been foreshadowed or anything, but....what about Zayne's sisters? They are older than him right....and just because their parents are a banker and a gardener, that doesn't mean one of his sisters isn't a captain in the Judicial Forces or something...

Wow, talk about an old reference. Compliments to Dark Guardian for finding the ship, that was awesome! I'm reading through my TotJ omnibus now looking for it, and... apparently, the ship was at the Republic shipyard of Foerost, so it was probably a Republic design. Although considering the Crucible is operating in Republic space, not too big of a surprise that its using an old Republic ship design.

You know, if they did a Starships of the Galaxy KotOR edition, focusing on all the ships seen in TotJ and KotOR, I would so instantly buy that.

Hmm... it's not quite the usual Mando one, but there is something embellished there, albeit very faintly. Might just be the Crucible emblem, but still, nice caught, I hadn't spotted that before.

Ulicus said:

It is a silly dream of mine to one day see TotJ recoloured.

Yeah. This is why I never have thought of KOTOR as "too advanced", simply because when you get past the archaic colour scheme, TotJ isn't actually all that archaic. Rather like how Dark Empire is meant to be as advanced as anything in the New Republic era, even if most of it looks no more space worthy than TotJ.

I would have said his displays in this issue were a plot-dependant thing, but that seems unlikely given how his lack of competence used to be the plot point. That he is now approaching Jedi Master/Starkiller TK proficiency, zero-G or no, doesn't fit unless it is a plot point.

It supports his being Nihilus, his powers increasing when in conflict with powerful Sensitives ala the Trayus Assassins (which would explain how Lucien didn't gut him like a fish) but here there is no Force-powered enemy to leech off of. And anyway, such an ability should have been born after Malachor, not before.

Which means I have to put my trust in Zayne's "special relationship with the Force". This era is ripe with people possessing unique Force abilities, so I guess that could be it. Or it could be that Dazo got the script wrong, and represented what was supposed to be "one miner at a time" per the dialogue, as "twenty something people at once, Genndy Tartakovsky-style". Unfortunately, I think the latter is the case.

The way Zayne tunneled his way through the battle droids on Metellos dual-wielding saber and blaster with a wicked grin, and the way Lucien "hit another wave" of kriffing HK assassin droids aboard the Arkanian Legacy, makes me think the good Bong likes his heroes supercharged.

Actually, since they're not in a group but in a rough line, it's still pretty straightforward to read it as being one at a time. They're in a very low gravity environment - that asteroid probably barely has enough gravity to hold them on anyway - and all Zayne has to do is make sure they're going the right direction. He's not lifting them from the surface of the planet or anything like that.

His powers in general have been increasing, true. But it's worth note that his powers have increased roughly linearly since the end of Commencement; he was doing stuff even in Flashpoint that had the crowd around here saying, "Huh, he's really gotten better already." A great deal of Zayne's incompetence seems to have had more to do with Lucien not wanting to/caring to train him than with his actually being weak. Different, sure, and probably has to work at it harder than some others in the order. But he's not weak - his master just didn't care.