I was hoping to write a blog about my lovely positive experience/appointment with Dr Peatfield (after 4 years of not being well, over 2 years off work ill (confined to house) with an NHS diagnosis of CFS/ME but Im not able to today. I have been told my adrenals are in a terrible state and I have been advised to try and build them up with 4 or 5 or 6 NAX a day and possibly 4 nutri adrenals as a top up. However I am sensitive to high potency B vitamins and wondered if anyone has taken a dose of 1200mg adrenal concentrate or more using just Nutri Adrenals? I have been told by Dr Peatfields secretary people can safely take 10 a day but I’m at that level now and his office is closed for another week. Any answers or thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Yeah his office is closed until 4th Jan so I take it this means it won't open until 7th Jan.

I have tried a little NAX but it didn't agree with me so I just take nutri adrenal and have built up to 10 a day between 6am and 3pm. I need to get to 1200 to 1600mg adrenal concentrate but am unsure as to whether I can take more than 10 because of tablet fillers etc. Maybe I will try introducing NAX again and see what happens. My T3 has arrived so I could start that but with Dr P saying to get my adrenals in line first, I'm wondering if this means when my temperature has stopped falling throughout the day? (it hasn't)

Anyway thanks Si for taking the time to respond to my question and out of interest how long have you been under him?

yes i was VERY jittery on first starting Nax. I had to stop everything and start again a day or two later. I started off with 1/2 a NAX and built up from there. I stopped my Erfa for a week. I think P's correct, it's hard to raise ones thyroid meds when the adrenals aren't worrying well. I can only manage one to 2 a day.

How did you know your adrenals are that bad then Pink? I was only told to go up to 4 NAX a day. You recommendations from him sound expensive!!! lol

I have been under Dr P for 3 months. I sent off my 2nd diary just before Xmas....

Ah so you will be eagerly awaiting for the next stage of your treatment plan then once his office opens! Roll on 7th Jan! Hope you are seeing improvement and making some progress though.

Re my adrenals being terrible well I paid for the adrenal stress index test back in Sept which confirmed what I had thought and showed they weren't looking so good. I also bought a copy of Dr James Wilsons book about adrenal fatigue which I think is a must and contains some very useful advice/information. (I found Dr Michael Lamb to have some good info as well. I receive his newsletter and have bought a few chapters of his book on my kindle as can't seem to get paperback.)

By the time I saw Dr P (3wks ago) I had deteriorated even more and it was him who told me the Genova test results are not great but after examining me that my adrenals are in a bad way and worse than the ASI test results from Sept. My blood pressure crashed on standing, pulse shot up, reflex.......well not sure if I had one :-\ and balance tests and pupil reaction test not up to much either! At least I know why I sometimes look like I've been on the vino when I stand up or walk!

Hence the suggested high dose of NAX and NA with hydrocortisone as a back up plan but I'm hoping it won't come to that.

I totally agree with sorting my long suffering adrenals first but I have never taken any thyroid meds as according to NHS it's severe CFS/M.E! According to Dr P my thyroid is damaged having being left untreated for so long and I need T3 (I had paid for thyroid profile plus test). I'm keen to get started but I have taken the role of the tortoise rather than the hare in this production.......you know slow and steady wins the race!

So yeah this is all rather expensive especially when you add the EFA's, milk thistle, vit D, Vit C &magnesium, digestive enzyme, probiotic and multivitamin&mineral I was already taking as prescribed by my naturopath! Oh and he added Q 10 to the mix! But it's ok I've got one of those trees down the bottom of my garden! You know the ones which are permanently in bloom and grow money no matter what the season! Lol!

yes! Not exactly excited for my 3rd diary but hey....maybe mister P will have something new for me to try. I doubt it but hey, who knows until i receive it :0) But yes, since starting his routine i have noticed some improvements. Slowly but half surely.

You do actually sound like me and what my health course has been. I was diagnosed with M.E 13 years ago and its only since a big crash this time last year that i took another look at my health and found i am hypothyroid with adrenal issues. I personally think it's the other way around now. it's always been my adrenals that have caused all 'of this'.

I have order Dr Wilson's book. Just waiting for it to come now! Is it worth a read then? Anything new to learn?

It's good to hear you have noticed some improvements, even if slowly. Hopefully you will continue to head in the right direction with the guidance of Dr P and the support and fantastic knowledge of others on here

Yes Dr P put me on Co Q10, 50-100mg a day. He told me it was expensive but to pick up a cheap one in Holland & Barrett. Only started taking it on Sunday but stopped after a few days as wasn't feeling so good. Will try again in a week or two but for now going to concentrate on specific adrenal and thyroid meds as they have been neglected for what I believe is many many years despite what the NHS say.

Sorry you had such a big crash last year but good for you taking another look at your health and uncovering what is most likely the truth. If you think it's your adrenals that have caused your health to suffer resulting in a diagnosis of M.E, then I would say you are probably right as you know you better than anyone else does. I keep reminding myself to listen properly to my body and trust my instinct, though it does all take time. If I continue to just listen to what the docs and CFS/M.E clinic say, my health would continue to deteriorate and I would simply be told (like so many other's) it's part of M.E and what's the treatment for that?!!

Re Dr Wilson's book, well I haven't read it all as I'm not at that level yet but I have dipped in and out of it and have gained some useful info/knowledge though I guess it depends on what you already know

Hope you don't have to wait too long for the return of your diary once his office opens and hopefully he will have something new for you to try to keep you moving in the right direction to better health

well the Dr Wilson book has arrived! :0) i am half way through already!

yes, i have had a hunch for yearsssss that my adrenals were the main cause of my illness all those years ago! Funny i had that hunch but never acted on it! Like you say, they give a diagnosis of M.E and everything stops! Nothing can be done so you give up looking....in the end! It's only this crash around that i took another proper look at things. I think everyones scratching around for the right answers, doctors too!

Hi Pink, you seem to have a good bit of knowledge on the thyroid and adrenals and was hoping you might be able to advise me on this one:

Hi, hopefully someone here can advise me!

I came off my Eltroxin 7 days ago and have been on Nutri Adrenal Extra 1 tablet per day for the last 3 days. I'm feeling anxious, irritable, nervous, serious forgetfulness which is awful....so I took my usual 100mg of Eltroxin an hour ago in a panic that hopefully it's help.

Going forward not sure if I should just stop taking everything for 2 days and start back on my usual dose of 100mg Eltroxin. Any advice welcome!

Once I saw the ingredients in NAX I knew I wouldn't be able to tolerate such a high amount of BVitamins and other vitamins and minerals. I am all too aware of the toxic affect high doses can have and that more isn't always best. This is why I am taking just the nutri adrenals instead of NAX but have some concern over the amount of fillers etc. I know there is an American company who use less fillers and a higher amount of adrenal concentrate so maybe I will consider that or just wait until Dr P's office opens next week. Before seeing Dr P I had built up to 3 nutri adrenals over 3months as advised by my naturopath (she phoned nutri who said that amount was safe) but they had little affect and my temperature was still dropping within an hr of getting out of bed and plummeting by lunch time. With a steady increase of nutri adrenal I am seeing my temperature become a little more stable earlier in the day.

I thought Dr P was lovely. He listened properly, was compassionate, empathic, took the time to read and acknowledge the additional notes I had prepared and taken along with me, recognised how ill I have become and gave me the opportunity to ask questions and share additional information. Although he knew I had some knowledge and understanding of hypothyroidism and adrenal insufficiency (I am still very much learning and the brain fog and difficulties retaining and processing information doesn’t help!) he explained everything to me and like I say, he gave me time to ask questions and/or tell him anything additional I thought he should know. He was more than happy for me to record the consultation as well and alleviated any concerns I had. So overall I was more than happy with my appointment, the way I was treated and the explanations given. Let’s just hope he can help me get better and get my life back!

I think if you are needing that level of them you should probably be on hydro cortisone I know it can be daunting going on to it but for some of us with shot adrenals its the only way check out the thyroiid madness website and look at. There adrenal pages aand val taylors gruop on adrenals is great too you can start by following dr rind metabolic guidlines he has a chart were you take temp 3 times a day and plot it and if temp is jumping adrenals are not stable so you need to increase support to adrenals regards sylvia

Thanks Sylvia for the information. I have been taking my temp more than twice a day but Dr Rinds chart and guidelines are a great additional tool to have. Also thanks for the info re adrenals I will look more into this. Pink Lily

I think it might be worth you giving the CT3M a go as this has sorted out my adrenal problems and is so much cheaper too, as you are going to be taking T3 anyway. CT3M involves taking some T3 during the main cortisol production window which is usually in the last 4 hours of sleep.

Here is a link to Paul Robinson's website where you can find out more if you are interested:

I have been thinking about the CT3M as found out about it on here a few months ago, visited Paul's site and then bought his book. Unfortunately I'm not at a level where I can read it all and digest as much as I would like, but from what I have read from the book and site it makes perfect sense. Also I guess I wanted someone like Dr P to look at my Genova results and confirm my thinking, as I'm new to all this and definitely appreciate the guidance from him and this site, especially with being so ill.

You're right about it being cheaper as going to cost me a fortune especially if he wants me to take more than 10 a day! I was just a little bit concerned about when my main cortisol production window would be and having to wake myself up as I suffer with disturbed sleep/insomnia and would be worried about not going back to sleep? Also I seem more often than not to wake at 4am. Dr P briefly mentioned Paul and the CT3M but wasn't sure if that was for me and thinks that my adrenals may be past that but what have I got to lose?! I told him I often wake early (4ish) as my sleep pattern is not great so he said I could take a pill then if I wanted, but on my treatment plan he wrote that after I have built up my adrenals, I start with one 25mcg before breakfast.

I think I will gently start my T3 tomorrow as I don't really want to take more than 10 NA at moment as concerned re fillers etc as I'm quite sensitive and I've previously had elevated LFT's.

Great to hear this method had almost immediate benefits for you and also great to read your blog the other day about your new year and reflecting on previous blogs as was really inspiring so thank you

I too suffer with insomnia and early waking/not being able to get back to sleep and resisted trying the CT3M for months because of this. I have to admit I often don't go back to sleep afterwards (I take 1 grain of NDT at 5am) but Paul told me it would work so long as I stayed in bed resting afterwards. He also said that as my adrenals improve so should my sleep.

I originally started with half a grain at 5.30am but this did not really have any effect. Paul then suggested 1 grain but this gave me too much of an effect and made me feel really hyper. I then settled on 3/4 of a grain at 5am and this seemed to do the trick. My worst symptom of vertigo got better almost straight away and I had had this for nearly 18 months

I tried 1 grain again for the CT3M dose a few months later but again it made me feel a bit hyper, so I left it at 3/4 of a grain. Then in Decmber I tried again with 1 grain, as I had been feeling a bit worse - and this time I have had no problems with tolerating it I have also managed to increase my total Armour dose by 1/2 a grain too without too many side effects (I usually feel terrible when I increase) as my blood tests showed low T4 and lowish T3.

I am glad to hear that Dr P is aware of the CT3M as when I went to see him in September 2011 the method was not really known.

I had very good advice/feedback about the CT3M from the STTM T3 only group on facebook. There are some very knowledgeable people on there including Janie Alexander-Bowthorpe (author of STTM) and Paul Robinson. I can send you a link if you would like to join, if you can't find it.

If you are awake at 4am then that sounds like a fairly good time to start but I am no expert on this really. You have to consider titrating the time and dosage. I think Paul generally recommends 10mcg of T3 1.5 hours before your normal get up time as a starting point, and then you have to monitor temp, pulse and BP.

I think you would need to stop the Nutri products though, so maybe a good idea to discuss with Dr P if you are going to do this. I don't think your adrenals would be too bad for this method though as there are lots of people who were on HC who have managed to come off it altogether. However CT3M doesn't suit everyone

My sleep seems to be a bit better since introducing a small bedtime dose of NDT - it might be worth trying this with T3 too. Hope that is a bit of help. xx

Thanks so much Clarebear for that. Really helpful and informative and I will try to join the group on facebook you are talking about.

I definitely need the support but I'm often too ill to access it and unable to concentrate to read the wealth of information out there. I'm housebound and most of my day bed bound and capable of very little so typing on these forums is a big activity for me and anything I type takes forever It was a miracle I got to see Dr P but he recognised how ill I have become after being left with a diagnosis of CFS/M.E by the NHS. There have been numerous times I have wanted to ask questions etc but just not well enough. Feels like a bit of a vicious circle at times as I can see there is amazing support and knowledge out there but it's having the strength to access it. I have some speech recognition software for my laptop so hopefully this will enable be to access more support.

Anyway thanks for your reply and hopefully I will be talking to Dr P soon about CT3M as I don't think my adrenals are strong enough yet using 11nutri adrenals as I tried a very small amount (much smaller than he suggested) of t3 two mornings on the run but on both days ended up with a numb right leg and foot and strange sensation in face and jaw and generally much worse as the day progressed but not sure.