peeker643 wrote:I must be a fool. I thought the faster, smarter, more experienced, more athletic, better-in-every way thing did that.

And Weeden hasn't wronged me, he was just wrong from jump. Holding onto him because you were okay initially is ignorant and flat-out dumb.

Prove to me he's the guy. Very simple.....go.

Lord god...

I don't need to prove shit b/c I don't give a shit about Weeden. You're the only one talking about Weeden, numb nuts.

The conversation was TRYING to be about Alex Smith, not He Who Shall Not Be Named. As far as I'm concerned, they have NOTHING to do with each other because I'm pretty sure they're going to replace Weeden with SOMEONE, so he's very likely not going to be part of the equation anyway.

"Alex Smith is better than Weeden" doesn't mean anything to me. Neither does "Alex Smith is WAY better than Weeden". Because neither of them makes me noticeably more excited to get Alex Smith than [insert a whole buncha names here] because I feel that Alex Smith is Mediocre, and it took him a long fucking time just to get that far.

If you want me to get excited about Alex Fucking Smith, you'd have to compare him favorably to GOOD QB's.

Otherwise, he's still King of Meh.

EDIT - And I still acknowledge that he's probably the best option that will be available (at least for the short term). Just that if the Browns fail to get him, I'm not gonna lose a ton of sleep over it.

Lord God-

I'm talking about Weeden because he's the fucking quarterback and because he blows. Replace him with JB and I'd be happy. Replace him with Alex Smith and I'm happier because Smith is better than JB (if not more entertaining) Just fucking replace him and move to the next option so people like you and everyone else that fails to see what's so obvious can laugh about their support of the guy and move on and complain about Smith. The QB of the Browns blows goats. Get another fucking QB of the Browns. No one is losing sleep over it. But a few people are clinging to way too much pride.

Just get a guy that can play fer fucksake. I don't care who it is anymore than you do but I do KNOW WHO IT AIN'T EVER GONNA BE.

Now, lets talk guards. Is there one out there that upgrades this OL the day he signs?

peeker643 wrote:I'm talking about Weeden because he's the fucking quarterback and because he blows. Replace him with JB and I'd be happy. Replace him with Alex Smith and I'm happier because Smith is better than JB (if not more entertaining) Just fucking replace him and move to the next option so people like you and everyone else that fails to see what's so obvious can laugh about their support of the guy and move on and complain about Smith. The QB of the Browns blows goats. Get another fucking QB of the Browns. No one is losing sleep over it. But a few people are clinging to way too much pride.

Just get a guy that can play fer fucksake. I don't care who it is anymore than you do but I do KNOW WHO IT AIN'T EVER GONNA BE.

Who are you having this argument with? If you think it's me, you dumber than I thought.

peeker643 wrote:I'm talking about Weeden because he's the fucking quarterback and because he blows. Replace him with JB and I'd be happy. Replace him with Alex Smith and I'm happier because Smith is better than JB (if not more entertaining) Just fucking replace him and move to the next option so people like you and everyone else that fails to see what's so obvious can laugh about their support of the guy and move on and complain about Smith. The QB of the Browns blows goats. Get another fucking QB of the Browns. No one is losing sleep over it. But a few people are clinging to way too much pride.

Just get a guy that can play fer fucksake. I don't care who it is anymore than you do but I do KNOW WHO IT AIN'T EVER GONNA BE.

Who are you having this argument with? If you think it's me, you dumber than I thought.

peeker643 wrote:I'm talking about Weeden because he's the fucking quarterback and because he blows. Replace him with JB and I'd be happy. Replace him with Alex Smith and I'm happier because Smith is better than JB (if not more entertaining) Just fucking replace him and move to the next option so people like you and everyone else that fails to see what's so obvious can laugh about their support of the guy and move on and complain about Smith. The QB of the Browns blows goats. Get another fucking QB of the Browns. No one is losing sleep over it. But a few people are clinging to way too much pride.

Just get a guy that can play fer fucksake. I don't care who it is anymore than you do but I do KNOW WHO IT AIN'T EVER GONNA BE.

Who are you having this argument with? If you think it's me, you dumber than I thought.

peeker643 wrote:I'm talking about Weeden because he's the fucking quarterback and because he blows. Replace him with JB and I'd be happy. Replace him with Alex Smith and I'm happier because Smith is better than JB (if not more entertaining) Just fucking replace him and move to the next option so people like you and everyone else that fails to see what's so obvious can laugh about their support of the guy and move on and complain about Smith. The QB of the Browns blows goats. Get another fucking QB of the Browns. No one is losing sleep over it. But a few people are clinging to way too much pride.

Just get a guy that can play fer fucksake. I don't care who it is anymore than you do but I do KNOW WHO IT AIN'T EVER GONNA BE.

Who are you having this argument with? If you think it's me, you dumber than I thought.

Apes do read philosophy, they just don't understand it.

They neither read it nor understand.

It's a lot like the NFL QB position in that way.

Yes. It is.

No time for ultra-clever signature games once I left my teen years behind. No inclination to ever head back there. You go crazy though. Many say the last six months indicate you're almost there. Godspeed.

peeker643 wrote:No time for ultra-clever signature games once I left my teen years behind. No inclination to ever head back there. You go crazy though. Many say the last six months indicate you're almost there. Godspeed.

Many, huh?

Do these "many" also have the inability to process and understand the hieroglyphics "many" call words?

peeker643 wrote:No time for ultra-clever signature games once I left my teen years behind. No inclination to ever head back there. You go crazy though. Many say the last six months indicate you're almost there. Godspeed.

Many, huh?

Do these "many" also have the inability to process and understand the hieroglyphics "many" call words?

But I'll gladly revisit my teen years if I can take my body with me.

They must struggle with it. Clearly, if they're not in whatever camp you're in on a given day. Or they've been rendered dizzy watching you spin.

Say what you will, I just revisited the draft thread. That was funny. Zero difficulty knowing where I stood before, during or after. I think I was standing next to you for much of it. My thoughts definitely made known. No waffling or wavering.

And I was 5'2", 110lbs as junior in high school. I don't want that back at all

I think a lot of what you call "spin" is manufactured/misinterpretation by you, but it doesn't really matter. I can definitely say that I've ridden many a roller coaster of opinion on many a Cleveland QB. Opinions have a habit of changing as more data is collected. Naturally, I came to disdain each and every one of them eventually, but I'm pretty sure I didn't have such a poor opinion of all of them when they started.

The conclusion I've come to is that I know nothing - just like everybody else. A bunch of guys that get paid lots of money to pick players included.

I thought Weeden would be better than he was. With a year's worth of data, I see I was probably wrong. BFD. Everyone here has been wrong numerous times. No one's writing "Right About Weeden" on their gravestone (at least I hope not).

Hell, I think I wrote something glowing about Colt after either the Pats or Jets game in 2010. Yet I'd already given up on him by the end of the season. Data has a way of fucking up your notions. I don't have anything invested in these guys - I can change my opinions on them whenever I damn well please.

(Kind of like the way you'll turn on Alex Smith after he gets booed off the field halfway through the 2014 season).

Fuck, it sucks that I'm still working. So tired... the baby can sense when I'm about to fall asleep, I think, and has decided that it's never too early to start torturing me.

For NFL players who attempted more than 13 passes this year, Smith is ranked 3rd in QB rating behind two stiffs named Rodgers and Manning. With yards per attempt being virtually identical as the aforementioned stiffs.

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"The nose of the bulldog has been slanted backwards so that he can breathe without letting go." -- Winston Churchill

Hikohadon wrote:I think a lot of what you call "spin" is manufactured/misinterpretation by you, but it doesn't really matter. I can definitely say that I've ridden many a roller coaster of opinion on many a Cleveland QB. Opinions have a habit of changing as more data is collected. Naturally, I came to disdain each and every one of them eventually, but I'm pretty sure I didn't have such a poor opinion of all of them when they started.

The conclusion I've come to is that I know nothing - just like everybody else. A bunch of guys that get paid lots of money to pick players included.

I thought Weeden would be better than he was. With a year's worth of data, I see I was probably wrong. BFD. Everyone here has been wrong numerous times. No one's writing "Right About Weeden" on their gravestone (at least I hope not).

Hell, I think I wrote something glowing about Colt after either the Pats or Jets game in 2010. Yet I'd already given up on him by the end of the season. Data has a way of fucking up your notions. I don't have anything invested in these guys - I can change my opinions on them whenever I damn well please.

(Kind of like the way you'll turn on Alex Smith after he gets booed off the field halfway through the 2014 season).

Fuck, it sucks that I'm still working. So tired... the baby can sense when I'm about to fall asleep, I think, and has decided that it's never too early to start torturing me.

Yes- plenty wrong plenty of times. But there is value in looking at these guys objectively and in some depth before they get drafted. It eliminates the brown and orange colored view of a guy or minimizes it anyway. And we all get that, myself more than included.

You can't ever know, like you said. "Experts" eff up picks, like you said. A lot of it is based on projection, like you said. But there are objective points of data as well. Those were not good.

Not an expert. Neither is Jason. But I'll tell ya, you look at some of the stuff on T.Y. Hilton and Mohamed Sanu and it was close. There was time spent on watching that stuff and watching some of those players. You watch these guys and their games as much as you can and you can at least start to cut through some of the subjectivity that them being chosen here immediately brings forth.

That's all. And if you watched the guy and saw the issues you have to shake your head at the end result. I have really strong feelings now because I had really strong feelings before, and professionals making the selection despite all the objective reasons not to pissed me off because they did it in their own self interest and set all of us fans back 3 years to try and grasp at something that might save their ass.

It's done. I want to move on and not complain about it. Someone else here playing the position is the only way that happens for me. Otherwise I'm waking up every day with an annoying ex-wife who I hate, standing in my kitchen fucking up my shit and constantly reminding me how much I loathe her.

And I honestly think Smith is a solid QB. How much more effective he can be here than the other guys, who knows. I'm willing to find out because I think it will be significantly better and I'm willing to take a chance even if he blows goats.

Enjoy the baby, dude. You know how it works. Before long you'll miss the late night nuisances. Well, maybe not. But enjoy every minute anyway.

peeker643 wrote:You can't ever know, like you said. "Experts" eff up picks, like you said. A lot of it is based on projection, like you said. But there are objective points of data as well. Those were not good.

Yes, but 2 people can objectively look at the same data points and come to different conclusions. Such as people did with Blaine Gabbert.

And if this were 2011 and you looked at the data points supplied by Alex Smith so far in his career, most people would objectively vomit.

We shall see what they do at QB. Like I said, I don't really care, none of the options are overly appealing. Alex Smith would likely be the best of a number of mediocre options. But I'm probably predicting 6-10 with whomever they roll out at QB.

OldDawg wrote:For NFL players who attempted more than 13 passes this year, Smith is ranked 3rd in QB rating behind two stiffs named Rodgers and Manning. With yards per attempt being virtually identical as the aforementioned stiffs.

All of them dwarfed by the incomparable Derek Anderson.

(Actually, I think that the QB we already have here is very comparable, but que sera sera...)

"I think Norv and Chud have been very open that they like a lot of what Brandon (Weeden) does, but we're going to have competition at that position, and I think competition makes us all better and we'll see where that competition comes from,'' JH3

Translation: Don't get to attached to the mistakes of the past regime.

"I don't think they're building chemical weapons in Berea. But they might be. I can't say for sure."Chuck Klosterman

"I think Norv and Chud have been very open that they like a lot of what Brandon (Weeden) does, but we're going to have competition at that position, and I think competition makes us all better and we'll see where that competition comes from,'' JH3

Translation: Don't get to attached to the mistakes of the past regime.

Naturally. This regime will want to make mistakes that are all their own.

LeBron is a lot of things, but attention whore isn't one of them. He's never needed to look for the spotlight, it's always been on him. Redneck is constantly trying to keep himself in the news by saying stupid shit.

e0y2e3 wrote:LeBron is a lot of things, but attention whore isn't one of them. He's never needed to look for the spotlight, it's always been on him. Redneck is constantly trying to keep himself in the news by saying stupid shit.

Yeah, but truckers love the guy. Hot showers and food courts, baby!

I don't need to be patient, they're going to be shit forever. - CDT, discussing my favorite NFL team

On a serious note, am I the only person in the world that thought Randy Jammies was the best kind of owner? I mean if any one of the five NFL hand picked Browns runners worked out he would have happily just sat in the background, wrote checks and not fucked with anything.

I don't think that Haslam is some sort of savior. I do think he's better than Randy, but, outside of that? Whatever.

Until results on the field change, it's still the same thing. You're still the worst team in the AFC North, with an unproven QB (likely average if we're lucky), and an unproven Head Coach with some decent coordinators.

Do we have that Coach/Quarterback that Mr. Rooney kept telling Modell about back in the day? No? Then we're still back where we started.

I'm not against bringing in Alex Smith, I just don't think he's that elite quarterback that will be able to get you to where you want the franchise to be. I can't see the guy hoisting a Lombardi or hell, even just leading us to the playoffs. I could be very much wrong on that, but it doesn't matter.

The elite quarterback that we all are clamoring for is either going to be some random prospect in this years draft or Bridgewater/Manziel in 2014.

I do think it's smart to have a competition though. And, no, I'm not talking about bringing in Thadeus Lewis. I'm talking about taking a shot on a few guys, whether it's in the draft (late, mind you), stealing some guy from the CFL or going after a Alex Smith and seeing if you can either find a long term or a short team solution via said competition.

Whatever, all I'm asking for is to make the sucking stop, and make it stop now. No 5 year plans, no "rebuilding years", put a team on the field that can at the very least compete for a wildcard spot. Don't sell us the damn lies anymore.

Swerb wrote:Go start a blog if you want to tell the world your incomprehendible ramblings.

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I have a big arm and can throw the ball pretty damn far...... maybe even over those moutains. The Browns should sign me, i'll let you all in locker room to drink beer. Then we can all go out the parking lot to watch me do motorcycle stunts.

I've been hearing these rumors and finally broke down and decided to visit and see if there was anything more solid here (there wasn't).

That said, I agree that if the Browns can get Smith without giving up much it's an improvement over Weeden and what the heck, an improvement is an improvement. I just can't bring myself to hope for 4-12 to improve the draft position.

If EJ Manuel isn't there in 3rd Round, There should be a more then a few to choose from next year...I hope Browns don't reach for someone this year in the first 3 rounds. Another year of Weeds, McCoy, or scrapheap qb play won't kill us for next year as much as adding another name to the mix to compete for playing time.

"Cocaine is a hell of a drug" - Originated from a famous skit in Dave Chappelle's "Chappelle's Show". The skit would portray Rick James, usually high on cocaine, preforming doing crazy and stupid things, such as smacking Charlie Murphy in the face. Rick James would frequently explain away his actions by saying "Cocaine is a hell of a drug".

I don't want a 2013 QB for this reason. 2014 QB class is really stacked. McCarron is really a prototypical pro-style QB (yes, his O-Line is awesome and RBs have been amazing, but still, one doesn't complete 67% of your passes with a 30 TD/3 INT ratio by being a game manager), and Teddy Bridgewater has the next level that just isn't present in these guys this year.

fairvis wrote:I don't want a 2013 QB for this reason. 2014 QB class is really stacked. McCarron is really a prototypical pro-style QB (yes, his O-Line is awesome and RBs have been amazing, but still, one doesn't complete 67% of your passes with a 30 TD/3 INT ratio by being a game manager), and Teddy Bridgewater has the next level that just isn't present in these guys this year.

Amazing to see KC at 5-0. Say what you will about the competition, etc, but if Alex Smith an Brian Hoyer show us anything, it's that merely competent play from your QB is good enough to win with against teams that don't get that.

Smith and Hoyer ranked 18th and 20th respectively in Passer Rating but their teams had absolutely woeful play from the position before that.

Reid's a good coach too, and it wasn't like Kansas City was devoid of talent IMO.

Swerb wrote:Go start a blog if you want to tell the world your incomprehendible ramblings.

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I have a big arm and can throw the ball pretty damn far...... maybe even over those moutains. The Browns should sign me, i'll let you all in locker room to drink beer. Then we can all go out the parking lot to watch me do motorcycle stunts.

Triple-S wrote:Reid's a good coach too, and it wasn't like Kansas City was devoid of talent IMO.

Even more clear that competency is key.

You watch with Weeden back how OL, RBs and TE all seem to suck at a higher level than they did with Hoyer acting quickly and getting the ball away.

This is going to be ugly and entire team (defense included) and coaching staff will wear it.

Right.

I'm really frustrated right now because I believe that with the type of QB you're talking about? The Browns make the playoffs. ESPECIALLY with how godawful the AFC North is this year.

Weeds ain't lasting the Detroit game, that much is clear.

Swerb wrote:Go start a blog if you want to tell the world your incomprehendible ramblings.

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I have a big arm and can throw the ball pretty damn far...... maybe even over those moutains. The Browns should sign me, i'll let you all in locker room to drink beer. Then we can all go out the parking lot to watch me do motorcycle stunts.