I've tried the PolyChoke with the muzzle brake and the Russian Cutts-compensator/ front sight combo and I'm using a Royal Arms Recoil Reducer now. It's effectiveness is less with light birdshot and better with slugs and heavy shot or buck. Shotgun muzzle brakes (or more precisely compensators) do work in reducing felt recoil if they are designed correctly and used with the right loads.

I know Cameron designs with performance in mind but no one else thinks their muzzle brake is worth a flip?

Cameron do you think the warthog is more effective than your wave brake? I like the looks of it better because according to Murphy's Law I would damage myself with the sharp warthog.

The warthog has real felt control, and anyone who has one knows this. The hog is by far better than the wave. I would easily state, their the toughest brake made for saiga 12. I have been thinking of making a version of the hog without the spikes and including some side vents angling back as well like this:

I've tried the PolyChoke with the muzzle brake and the Russian Cutts-compensator/ front sight combo and I'm using a Royal Arms Recoil Reducer now. It's effectiveness is less with light birdshot and better with slugs and heavy shot or buck. Shotgun muzzle brakes (or more precisely compensators) do work in reducing felt recoil if they are designed correctly and used with the right loads.

Cameron I like the looks of your prototype. Would the slanted side vents help more with muzzle flip or recoil? I guess my holy grail would be a brake that helps keep the barrel on target more than recoil reduction.

Wow Cameron, that looks sick! I might have to pick one of those up to complete my S12 that I'm building. I had a Phoenix brake on mine and I can't really tell if it does anything. I also don't like the looks of it and it adds almost 2.5 inches to the gun, which is abysmal. Might have to pick up a Tri-rail from y'all as well while I'm at it... don't mean to thread jack but I've been looking at the Kross offerings as well and I was wondering if you could tell me why yours is better?

I'm kinda surprised nobody has made a simple 2-3oz weight that threads to the muzzle. That would probably reduce muzzle flip as well as a brake if not better, (As I understand that brakes are marginally less effective at shotgun velocities.) I guess it just wouldn't be aggressive-looking enough for people to want it on their gun.

"Ah, the muddle-headed mysticism of the Left: Protecting yourself from attack is the same as attacking others. Jesus is Muhammad. Having no interest in race makes you a racist, so you should hate white people. Race, class, and gender are the only differences among people that matter. The Government is above the law, and once they have all the weapons then we shall have democracy. The Confederates are terrorists. Hitler wore pants- these guys wear pants. Ad Infinitum. Ad nauseum." -My best friend

I'm kinda surprised nobody has made a simple 2-3oz weight that threads to the muzzle. That would probably reduce muzzle flip as well as a brake if not better, (As I understand that brakes are marginally less effective at shotgun velocities.) I guess it just wouldn't be aggressive-looking enough for people to want it on their gun.

I actually really hate super aggressive looking muzzle devices... I think they look really cheesy. I'm not sure how much only a couple ounces would do tho compared to some heavier loads... 3 inch slugs would probably be rough... tho to be honest, there's nothing a 3 inch slug will do that a 2 3/4 inch wont...

I'm kinda surprised nobody has made a simple 2-3oz weight that threads to the muzzle. That would probably reduce muzzle flip as well as a brake if not better, (As I understand that brakes are marginally less effective at shotgun velocities.) I guess it just wouldn't be aggressive-looking enough for people to want it on their gun.

I actually really hate super aggressive looking muzzle devices... I think they look really cheesy. I'm not sure how much only a couple ounces would do tho compared to some heavier loads... 3 inch slugs would probably be rough... tho to be honest, there's nothing a 3 inch slug will do that a 2 3/4 inch wont...

3 inch will carry those extra few balls of 00 buck i like to call "insurance"

3 inch steel goose loads are probably my favorite cheap plinking ammo for the S-12. #2 might also make a good home defense load to stock up on also.

And finaly 3" rounds will give you a bruise much faster! Fun for the whole family.

I would contribute more, but Cameron pretty much told everyone what my choice would be and why...

Edited by Nailbomb, 30 November 2009 - 10:20 PM.

The Marines I have seen around the world have the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen.Eleanor Roosevelt, First Lady of the United States, 1945"I've always felt that the real horror is next door to us, that the scariest monsters are our neighbors."George A. Romero

I've tried the PolyChoke with the muzzle brake and the Russian Cutts-compensator/ front sight combo and I'm using a Royal Arms Recoil Reducer now. It's effectiveness is less with light birdshot and better with slugs and heavy shot or buck. Shotgun muzzle brakes (or more precisely compensators) do work in reducing felt recoil if they are designed correctly and used with the right loads.

I noticed a few of the rear holes are facing the wrong way to reduce recoil in the brake you posted, are they severing as some other function?

Cameron, The first row of vents do indeed face what would seem the wrong direction and I'm not sure of the logic of this arrangement. Al Zitta of ZM Arms had one of these on a highly modified SPAS-15 and he talked me into trying one on my Saiga-12 after I watched him complete a stage at a match. Al had rebored those vents to face the reverse and had good reviews of the recoil-reducer's effectiveness. The Royal Arms choke tubes are almost twice as long as normal tubes and I believe this might aid in more consistent shot patterns.

Wow Cameron, that looks sick! I might have to pick one of those up to complete my S12 that I'm building. I had a Phoenix brake on mine and I can't really tell if it does anything. I also don't like the looks of it and it adds almost 2.5 inches to the gun, which is abysmal. Might have to pick up a Tri-rail from y'all as well while I'm at it... don't mean to thread jack but I've been looking at the Kross offerings as well and I was wondering if you could tell me why yours is better?

Boy this feels like a bated question, but what the hell. I think the Kross looks nice, hell a lot of people tell me it looks a lot the Chaos Tri-rail, so on looks, its go, but after that the two part ways. The Kross tri-rail is 19 oz. because it is a casting and will always and only be a tri-rail, The Chaos tri-rail is a modular rail setup and is 10 oz. because it is extruded from 6061 aluminum alloy and are manufactured to military specs. Bottom line, they are both US made, and it really depends on what your wanting out of your rail setup. I just hope you buy a US rail for your saiga.

Cameron I like the looks of your prototype. Would the slanted side vents help more with muzzle flip or recoil? I guess my holy grail would be a brake that helps keep the barrel on target more than recoil reduction.

You should screw one of the hogs on your saiga, you'll flip at how much they push the barrel down, thats what they do!

Wow Cameron, that looks sick! I might have to pick one of those up to complete my S12 that I'm building. I had a Phoenix brake on mine and I can't really tell if it does anything. I also don't like the looks of it and it adds almost 2.5 inches to the gun, which is abysmal. Might have to pick up a Tri-rail from y'all as well while I'm at it... don't mean to thread jack but I've been looking at the Kross offerings as well and I was wondering if you could tell me why yours is better?

Boy this feels like a bated question, but what the hell. I think the Kross looks nice, hell a lot of people tell me it looks a lot the Chaos Tri-rail, so on looks, its go, but after that the two part ways. The Kross tri-rail is 19 oz. because it is a casting and will always and only be a tri-rail, The Chaos tri-rail is a modular rail setup and is 10 oz. because it is extruded from 6061 aluminum alloy and are manufactured to military specs. Bottom line, they are both US made, and it really depends on what your wanting out of your rail setup. I just hope you buy a US rail for your saiga.

Okay, I'll be going with a Chaos one then Not a baited question at all sir, I just need the lightest S12 rail that I can get, and it sounds like its about half a pound difference... that half a pound I'd rather be carrying in the form of ammo or optics or some extra kevlar or what have you.

Anyway, to the topic at hand...

I've done some reading and from the sounds of things, Cameron isn't exaggerating on how much the Hogs do help the muzzle rise... there's some good vids on youtube... just go and type in warthog and saiga into the search and you should find them.

IMHO muzzle brakes on shotguns are almost totally worthless for reducing recoil or muzzle rise, or rather they do not do anything that a simple muzzle weight of the same mass wouldn't do equally well. What you really need at the muzzle is a choke device like the PolyChoke. If you want recoil reduction, you need to exploit the gas while the shot column is still in the barrel, which means a mid-barrel comp or barrel porting - both will work well, but may cause cycling problems as they bleed off some gas (can be fixed by drilling out the gas ports).

I'm kinda surprised nobody has made a simple 2-3oz weight that threads to the muzzle. That would probably reduce muzzle flip as well as a brake if not better, (As I understand that brakes are marginally less effective at shotgun velocities.) I guess it just wouldn't be aggressive-looking enough for people to want it on their gun.

I actually really hate super aggressive looking muzzle devices... I think they look really cheesy. I'm not sure how much only a couple ounces would do tho compared to some heavier loads... 3 inch slugs would probably be rough... tho to be honest, there's nothing a 3 inch slug will do that a 2 3/4 inch wont...

I have to agree. I am not a fan of those overly aggressive muzzle brakes. I do like the prototype better than the actual. But I personally will be waiting patiently until someone has some real evidence on which comp/brake is better and why.

OK well, how about a muzzle weight that looks like a flash hider? That way you get the reduction in muzzle flip without sacrificing cosmetics? Or you could do a choke device combined with a muzzle weight if your a function over form kinda guy. Just throwing out ideas...

"Ah, the muddle-headed mysticism of the Left: Protecting yourself from attack is the same as attacking others. Jesus is Muhammad. Having no interest in race makes you a racist, so you should hate white people. Race, class, and gender are the only differences among people that matter. The Government is above the law, and once they have all the weapons then we shall have democracy. The Confederates are terrorists. Hitler wore pants- these guys wear pants. Ad Infinitum. Ad nauseum." -My best friend