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Re: 2nd Round Pick

package our first and second round picks this year plus next years first rounder along with austin croshere to atlanta for their number 1 next year.....that should serve as punishment to austin for airing locker room business in the new york times...

Re: 2nd Round Pick

package our first and second round picks this year plus next years first rounder along with austin croshere to atlanta for their number 1 next year.....that should serve as punishment to austin for airing locker room business in the new york times...

Re: 2nd Round Pick

He is referring to Austin's comments about Artest Austin basically said that Artest is good now, everything is fine and dandy at the moment but who knows what will happen when Artest is instigated or is placed in a 11/19 kind of situation

William C. Rhoden | Sports of The Times
Pacers Lose Artest but Find Themselves

Published: May 14, 2005
Indianapolis

A WEEK ago, I was convinced that the Pacers could not get past the second round of the playoffs without Ron Artest. But now, after two straight victories - one in Detroit and another last night at home - I'm not so sure.

Two months ago, Indiana was not even a sure bet to make the playoffs. Now they have the defending N.B.A. champions on the ropes, and the Pistons are beginning to yelp.

Last night, Indiana continued its unlikely trip through the playoffs, defeating Detroit, 79-74, to take a two-games-to-one lead in their best-of-seven Eastern Conference semifinal series. Once again, Reggie Miller was the center of controversy, setting off yet another round of the game-within-the-game known as Lobby the Officials.

Miller hit a clutch shot with 10.7 seconds left that gave Indiana its 79-74 lead. After the game, Pistons Coach Larry Brown was fuming.

Asked to praise Miller's legendary ability to hit clutch shots, Brown said: "You look at that on the film and you tell me what he did. He made a great shot, an unbelievable shot, I've seen him do it again and again. But watch it on the film and write it down and tell me how he got that shot. Yeah, he made an unbelievable shot, but tell me how the space was cleared to get that shot."

Brown also wondered how the Pacers scored points without making field goals in the fourth quarter and implied that the N.B.A., in its zeal to increase scoring, has empowered the officials rather than the players.

Pacers Coach Rick Carlisle was indignant over Brown's comments. The Pistons shot more free throws than the Pacers, and Indiana's best player, Jermaine O'Neal, fouled out with 2 minutes 30 seconds left.

"I don't want to hear it," Carlisle said. "I don't want to hear it, not with the season we had. Not with what we've had to fight through. Forget it. Forget it. There's two teams playing hard, the officials are doing the best they can. That's what I see."

What we also see are two Indiana Pacers teams.

There are the prebrawl Pacers, whose symbol was Artest: tough, physical, bruising. This was a team for which toughness meant tracking down perpetrators and handing out instant justice.

Then there are the postbrawl Pacers with multiple identities, a team for which toughness has meant perseverance and overcoming adversity, taking its punishment and making the best of a difficult situation.

I like these Pacers a lot better, and I'm not alone.

Who could have guessed on Nov. 19, after the horrific brawl at the Palace of Auburn Hills, that Indiana would evolve into an admirable underdog?

Several Pacers, led by Artest, charged into the stands to beat up Pistons fans they suspected of throwing objects at them. It was frontier justice; the Pacers became do-it-themselves judges, juries and executioners. The altercation sparked a near riot and resulted in several suspensions, including Artest's for the rest of the season.

While Indiana battles Detroit, Artest is on a Band-Aid tour to repair his image. He is going on talk shows and giving magazine interviews, putting his spin on his behavior and his suspension. But he's missing the point.

"His heart is in the right place," said his teammate Austin Croshere. But Artest's heart isn't the issue. His emotions are. This is a matter that is deeply rooted and cannot be addressed with merely an "I'm sorry" on ESPN.

Croshere said he watched part of Artest's interview. "I just turned it off because it's kind of at the point now where I think everybody on the team is like, 'Well, I'll believe it when I see it,' " Croshere said.

"Ron is a good guy," he said. "I see him in practice, I go up and talk to him. We talk about our kids all the time. But what's going to happen in a game where his guy gets 25 or 30 points or he misses a shot at the end of a game; he doesn't get the ball at the end of a game; high-stress situation. How does he handle that?"
In any event, the fallout from the brawl has had an upside for Indiana. A number of players who craved playing time - Fred Jones, James Jones and Croshere - had the opportunity to play, and have played well. The starters and the stars, except for Artest, are back from injuries and suspensions. Those who were playing larger minutes are back to being role players, but the increased playing time has benefited everyone on the team.

The fallout from the brawl has this downside: the basketball intensity of this series will suffer because the physical nature of each team will, out of necessity, give way to a certain restraint.

The Pistons and the Pacers are walking on eggshells. The series will not be as uncompromisingly physical as it would have been had there never been a brawl. Nobody wants to be thrown out of a playoff series, and no one wants to be ejected from a game in this series.

I'm not convinced the Pacers would have made this great run had Artest been in the lineup. Now they have created an identity without him.

The question is not what would happen if Artest were playing. The reality for Artest to consider is that if he were here, the Pacers may not be.

Re: 2nd Round Pick

package our first and second round picks this year plus next years first rounder along with austin croshere to atlanta for their number 1 next year.....that should serve as punishment to austin for airing locker room business in the new york times...

This is such a bizarre comment that I don't even know where to begin.

You want to punish Austin for airing lockerroom business while at the same time challenge all of us that believe that what Austin said is "just the tip of the iceberg" as just reading things in whatever way is convenient to our positions.

I've got a hard enough time following your logic, now this?

Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
And life itself, rushing over me
Life itself, the wind in black elms,
Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

Re: 2nd Round Pick

that should serve as punishment to austin for airing locker room business in the new york times...

[Bball in a foretaz mode]
But how do you know Austin really said that? All we have is some random writer in a newspaper claiming to have some inside line with Austin and telling us what Austin said.... Maybe the writer spoke with Austin and maybe he didn't.... Did you see Austin say any of that? I refuse to believe anything like that at all or even consider it worthy of my time. Anybody can make anything up, print it, and some people will believe it. I don't even know that it was ever 'printed'. I just see it on the internet. For all I know, that is as far as it goes.... Just some internet noise pretending to be news. I prefer to stick to facts and not be sucked into some discussion based on random speculation or blatant lying...especially based on some guy on the internet claiming some kind of inside info...

Austin doesn't air dirty laundry in public. Until I see otherwise.... and I don't expect I ever will... then I refuse to believe some random guy on the internet no matter who or what he claims to know. He has zero credibility with me. I'm not going to waste my time with it. I'm not even going to consider it in part or in whole.... I prefer to deal in facts.
[/Bball in a foretaz mode]

Please note: Sarcasm was used in this posting.

Bball

Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

------

"A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

Re: 2nd Round Pick

[Bball in a foretaz mode]
But how do you know Austin really said that? All we have is some random writer in a newspaper claiming to have some inside line with Austin and telling us what Austin said.... Maybe the writer spoke with Austin and maybe he didn't.... Did you see Austin say any of that? I refuse to believe anything like that at all or even consider it worthy of my time. Anybody can make anything up, print it, and some people will believe it. I don't even know that it was ever 'printed'. I just see it on the internet. For all I know, that is as far as it goes.... Just some internet noise pretending to be news. I prefer to stick to facts and not be sucked into some discussion based on random speculation or blatant lying...especially based on some guy on the internet claiming some kind of inside info...

Austin doesn't air dirty laundry in public. Until I see otherwise.... and I don't expect I ever will... then I refuse to believe some random guy on the internet no matter who or what he claims to know. He has zero credibility with me. I'm not going to waste my time with it. I'm not even going to consider it in part or in whole.... I prefer to deal in facts.
[/Bball in a foretaz mode]

Please note: Sarcasm was used in this posting.

Bball

imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.....

sarcasm duly noted....

comparing bill rhoden, one of the most respected journalists of our time, to one of the most disrespected anonymous internet posters of our time.....well....

Re: 2nd Round Pick

2nd round pick, Chris Thomas Notre Dame PG with a great shot. I think he will be in the league for awhile and is better then Eddie Gill.

"He wanted to get to that money time. Time when the hardware was on the table. That's when Roger was going to show up. So all we needed to do was stay close"Darnell Hillman (Speaking of former teammate Roger Brown)

Re: 2nd Round Pick

I agree Sun Ming Ming would fill seats just because he's huge, I had the opportunity to see Manute Bol up close at the Ceasars riverboat a couple years ago just before he was in the accident. It was unbelievable how tall he was and a stringbean at that. Sun Ming Ming is not a stringbean by any means. I think he weighs something like 360 right now.

"He wanted to get to that money time. Time when the hardware was on the table. That's when Roger was going to show up. So all we needed to do was stay close"Darnell Hillman (Speaking of former teammate Roger Brown)

Re: 2nd Round Pick

No way. Hes a 7'8" freakshow, nothing else. Sun Ming Ming is incredibley slow, he cant score anywhere unless he's right next to the basket. Don't confuse him with Yao, hes not nearly as agile and he will be too tired to play another second after 10 minutes of play.

I'd much rather get a real player like Gilcrest in the second round.

But if Julius Hodge is still around when we pick, he is going to be a stud in the NBA. He could be a serious sleeper I think. I'm a big J-Hodge fan and I would love to see him in a Pacer uni

Re: 2nd Round Pick

Chris Thomas will be gone way before we pick. Francisco Garcia will most definitely be gone way way way before we pick. Hopefully we'll use the pick on some foreign guy who might pan out down the road, cause sure as hell nobody would make our team this year.