I watched IM3 again today as I have been meaning, and its such a weird movie, for the 1st hour or so its superb, amazing in fact, but things just seem to take a downward turn when he meets up with the kid for some reason. Which is strange because the kid is a good little actor.

The 2nd half has its moments, and the twist DOES work in the movie (its only when the movie ends that I think the twist starts to grate), but yeah, if the quality of the 1st hour was kept, it would rival the 1st movie. I still think its SLIGHTLY better than IM2, and neither are close to the 1st movie.

I do think the spirit of the character was there, but he wasnt threatening enough for me, and Stark wasnt really clever in the way he engaged him either, as others have said. I dont think what they did with the Mandarin was blasphemy like others do, but I understand their views. On 1st viewing I thought the twist worked, but its on subsequent viewings that it feels cheap and unnecessarily decieving.

I disagree. I felt like Killian was a very fair match for Stark. He was in the power position most of the movie, and in their physical confrontation, he was wiping the floor with Stark. Stark just outsmarted him toward the end, but for most of the fight, Stark was clearly losing. That shows me Killian was a threat (something I def feel Vanko lacked).

Then he got awesome, and kicked ass at Monaco, and did a Joker-like interrogation with Stark.

Then nothing.

Like i've said before, this twist isn't really that different from the first two IM movies, if you think about it. Yeah, we all knew Stane was the baddie, but Raza was set up as the foil in the beginning of IM1...and it turns out it was Stane all along. Vanko was advertised/set up to be the big baddie in IM2...and Hammer did more damage than Vanko did.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Tacit Ronin

The way SONY dominated Marc Webb was way more hardcore than anything in 50 Shades anyways.

I disagree. I felt like Killian was a very fair match for Stark. He was in the power position most of the movie, and in their physical confrontation, he was wiping the floor with Stark. Stark just outsmarted him toward the end, but for most of the fight, Stark was clearly losing. That shows me Killian was a threat (something I def feel Vanko lacked).

I just never felt Stark was truly in danger though (but this is a complaint for all MCU movies so far, something I hope they address in the next movies, as Thor 2 seems the same) their brief fight at the end didnt really see Stark in deep **** like the X-Men have seemed numerous times in their movies or Spiderman did in the Raimi movies. I think if Mandarin had beaten Tony to within an inch of life then he would have been more effective. The fact that Tony only used 2 armours to fight with him seemed to lower his threat as well, to me anyway.

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Originally Posted by A Necessary Evil

Vanko was awesome...and then he did the NYYEAAAHH.

Then he got awesome, and kicked ass at Monaco, and did a Joker-like interrogation with Stark.

Then nothing.

Like i've said before, this twist isn't really that different from the first two IM movies, if you think about it. Yeah, we all knew Stane was the baddie, but Raza was set up as the foil in the beginning of IM1...and it turns out it was Stane all along. Vanko was advertised/set up to be the big baddie in IM2...and Hammer did more damage than Vanko did.

I loved Hammer but I cant agree with this, Hammer just broke Vanko out of prison, which indeed led to Vanko doing what he did but Vanko did all the damage at the end.

The first one was great and without a doubt one of the best of its kind. It was new it was exciting and RDJ nailed the part.

In the second one they saw what worked and what the audience liked and copied the exact same recipe -from the villain to the jokes, the music and the whole feeling- without being fresh and smart as #1 and threw tons of easter eggs in the mix to promote The Avengers and the rest MCU movies. And I thought it really worked at the time but as years gone by the more I see it the less I think of it honestly. Still a good enjoyable movie though.

In the third one they at least tried something different but it got silly really quick. So many plot holes so many stupid parts and cliches. It had nothing to do with what they promoted as a more grounded approach and a slightly serious tone. Even the first part of the film suggested that direction. In the end it almost turned out as a parody. Easily the worst of the trilogy.

Iron Man 3 for me tops the list. I'm very sorry, but those who think the twist makes the movie bad really need to reevaluate their opinion. The twist works in the context of the film and, regardless of having no physical similarities to the character, is respectful to the Mandarin's deceptive nature. Seeing Tony defend himself out of the suit and seeing him actually have a conflict to deal with was great. Him invading the Mandarin's mansion, his PTSD all made for a much more interesting character than anything done with Thor in Loki: The Dark World. The action itself is prolonged and very executed, unlike the first two which had very short and distance bursts of action. The only thing about the film that bothers me is the last 10 or so minutes. Pepper killing the Mandarin was and Tony removing his arc reactor was terrible writing all together. I don't know how they got as the resolution to the story after having such a film. Either way, Iron Man 3 is my favorite, followed by the first, then, all the way down, Iron Man 2.

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Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

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iron man 1 was a great film.
iron man 2 disappointed me, it was aight but not something I'd wanna watch again. What I think would have made the film better would be
a. given hammer a british accent
b. not have recasted terrence howard, although that in itself is another issue
c. have a showdown fight between black widow and whiplash in the climax instead of whiplash showing up and being blown by iron man and war machine

as for iron man 3, i haven't seen it, but from wat i hear about the mandarin... might make it the worst of all 3 but hey, it's the second highest grossing film in the mcu and one of the highest grossing films of all time, so credit where it's due

Iron Man 3 for me tops the list. I'm very sorry, but those who think the twist makes the movie bad really need to reevaluate their opinion. The twist works in the context of the film and, regardless of having no physical similarities to the character, is respectful to the Mandarin's deceptive nature. Seeing Tony defend himself out of the suit and seeing him actually have a conflict to deal with was great. Him invading the Mandarin's mansion, his PTSD all made for a much more interesting character than anything done with Thor in Loki: The Dark World. The action itself is prolonged and very executed, unlike the first two which had very short and distance bursts of action. The only thing about the film that bothers me is the last 10 or so minutes. Pepper killing the Mandarin was and Tony removing his arc reactor was terrible writing all together. I don't know how they got as the resolution to the story after having such a film. Either way, Iron Man 3 is my favorite, followed by the first, then, all the way down, Iron Man 2.

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Originally Posted by A Necessary Evil

Why let others dictate an opinion for you?

Par for the course on the internetz. It's easiest to tell who falls into this category by whether or not their thoughts are particularly original. When I see someone regurgitating the same ill-conceived ignorance(and damn near verbatim) that the bandwagon is peddling, it's a very clear indicator of this.

I remember there was a fellow who repeatedly extolled the virtues of the comic book villain, but was caught with his pants down as having never read an Iron Man book aside from the Extremis mini. How is that sort of criticism even valuable, let alone valid? The only explanation for this sort of silliness is that these folks are simply repeating the same internet noise they've read elsewhere. How else can someone come to such a conclusion without having proper, relevant perspective? Everyone is entitled the their opinion I suppose, but when said opinion is backed by preconceived notions and confirmation bias, then that's when we've crossed into fallacy territory, which is precisely when I can't take someone seriously, no matter how loudly they yell "ITS JUST MY OPINION DOOD!"

1- Iron Man 3
I don't like how easily the suit gets disassembled, or blowing up all the armors
Everything else is fine, a great fun adventure movie, and the story is interesting9/10

2- Iron Man
Iron Man has the best superhero origin, I'm saying it, this is how I find it
After that it's not my favorite as either a Marvel comics movie or a Marvel studios movie, but it's great fun, and it's great to see Tony not making weapons to sell
Obidiah's story kind made me rub my head, people got angry over the Mandarin's twist, but not over the changes this character went through8.5/10

3- Iron Man 2
Pepper and Rhodey have annoying moments, really annoying moments, so does Tony
Is it a bad movie? No, it's a good fun movie I really enjoy, but I get why this movie disappointed after a great first
8/10

a really solid movie, up there with The Dark Knight in my book. everything worked perfectly in it, I even liked Iron Monger despite how little time they gave him in the actual Iron Monger suit. Characters and the way they interacted with each other were charming

2. Iron Man 3

I hated this one but I hate Iron Man 2 more. The good parts in IM3 are the visuals, the action was good and the jokes are well written. Still, even if you have great comedic material you can't go over board with or the movie will turn into a joke. And the Mandarin twist was a very desperate and pointless one. But at least I wasn't bored watching it like I was when I watched:

3. Iron Man 2

This movie was just boring, Ivan Vanko seemed to have potential as a villain, but they didn't do anything interesting with it in the end. Pacing was awful, it slowed down way too much in the middle, which would've been fine if the dialogue was engaging but it wasn't. Oh and in this movie Pepper is annoying as ****. They substitute the clever natural character interactions to rambling and mostly complaining, with Tony akwardly talking over Pepper's rambling

IM3 is pure unfiltered excrement tho. I considered leaving the theatre which is something I reserve for only pure turd like say Elektra or Punishers.

IM3 is barely a movie..its a pure insult to the comic fans...its a pure insult to anyone that sat thru 1 and 2. What the hell was he doing with that kid? in the middle of Tenn? also whipping up tech from crap? then using it to break into another lab? like I said this is pure unfiltered crap. Then the mandarin stuff ? really...was the writer actually taking a taco bell crap as he finished off this script? This movie was immensely insultive...its an insult even as a stand alone film much more to comic book genre.

To me it even shows how much of a diehard fan you are if you find it remotely acceptable. This movie was fun for the actors and makers...I dont go to watch a movie so that it's involved crew can get their rocks off on having fun and or having a last Hurrah on me.....it was completely intolerable....their was barely any suit action.

It absolutely demands to have its masters burned. It was a complete outrage.
I for one found no humor in their barrage of insults to Tony and to us.

IF ANYTHING ALL IN ALL I WAS ALSO FINALLY SICKENED OF Robert Downy JR. And I never want to see this guy as Tony Stark again. Ill gladly watch Sherlock holmes 3....but I think this guy feels high when he plays Tony or gets high...or maybe its just that IM3 sucked so badly and he cooperated and possibly enjoyed this soiled diaper of a film. Something Chris Bale would have never ever tolerated. It was a disrespectful film...and just like ppl were fired for John Carter and will be for Lone Ranger....I feel you and I as fans should be demanding it....the entire film roll as the evidence.

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Originally Posted by CyclopsWasRight

Iron Man 1 is the only decent Iron Man movie.

Hopefully Fox or sony can get the rights and do the character right.

Yes because Fox have done most of their other characters justice right? Mmmmmmm let's see.....

And how could we forget this. This was just priceless. Spot on representation of this character and Fox did a great job. They did the character justice

I know you dislike the MCU very much, but don't go around making absurd statements like that.

I hated this one but I hate Iron Man 2 more. The good parts in IM3 are the visuals, the action was good and the jokes are well written. Still, even if you have great comedic material you can't go over board with or the movie will turn into a joke. And the Mandarin twist was a very desperate and pointless one. But at least I wasn't bored watching it like I was when I watched:

The point was fear-mongering and misdirection; Trevor, and his subplot, was the linchpin in the villain's overarching scheme. Explain how that is in any way pointless. Desperate? With regard to what, exactly?

this is a very valid point. however, you have to admit that if a mass amount of people have the same opinion it has to come with merit. so that's when you delve into the subject yourself to see if you agree with them or not, I just have not done that yet

but I mean their opinion itself stems from a plot twist, there's not much that can dictate that. it's not like most of the hate controversy is about the entire film as a review, but just that one plot twist

this is a very valid point. however, you have to admit that if a mass amount of people have the same opinion it has to come with merit. so that's when you delve into the subject yourself to see if you agree with them or not, I just have not done that yet

but I mean their opinion itself stems from a plot twist, there's not much that can dictate that. it's not like most of the hate controversy is about the entire film as a review, but just that one plot twist

Mass amount =/= a handful of fans on an internet forum.

Just give igt a watch and see what *you* think of it.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Tacit Ronin

The way SONY dominated Marc Webb was way more hardcore than anything in 50 Shades anyways.

this is a very valid point. however, you have to admit that if a mass amount of people have the same opinion it has to come with merit. so that's when you delve into the subject yourself to see if you agree with them or not, I just have not done that yet

Not always, and the fallout from this movie is actually a perfect example of why that isn't the case. Prior to, the folks complaining about Kingsley's portrayal were in the very small minority; the majority was waiting in anticipation. At least a couple of weeks afterwards, comic book dogma reared its ugly head again. The two positions are completely contradictory. When you also consider the fact that most people can't accurately articulate what a comic book accurate Mandarin is in the first place, the whole thing becomes even more dubious. To them, the comic Mandarin is some Chinese dude with magic rings. The interesting part is that neither designation is completely accurate, yet this is what so-called fans desperately wanted...after the fact. Jonestown and the Branch Davidians were a couple examples of a "mass of people" as well...I wouldn't consider their beliefs as having much merit either.

whoever said internet fanboys were the only ones complaining? i know people from ghetto ass queens who saw im3 and were very unhappy with it. and it's quite more than a handful of fans on an internet forum. i'm sure there are some here, so there's this forum, and then ign, and facebook, and (possibly) millions of others.

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Originally Posted by Visualiza

Not always, and the fallout from this movie is actually a perfect example of why that isn't the case. Prior to, the folks complaining about Kingsley's portrayal were in the very small minority; the majority was waiting in anticipation. At least a couple of weeks afterwards, comic book dogma reared its ugly head again. The two positions are completely contradictory. When you also consider the fact that most people can't accurately articulate what a comic book accurate Mandarin is in the first place, the whole thing becomes even more dubious. To them, the comic Mandarin is some Chinese dude with magic rings. The interesting part is that neither designation is completely accurate, yet this is what so-called fans desperately wanted...after the fact. Jonestown and the Branch Davidians were a couple examples of a "mass of people" as well...I wouldn't consider their beliefs as having much merit either.

fair enough, however I'm just saying that, after what I saw on the marvel cinematics universe fanpage on facebook, why is it so wrong for people to NOT like this movie because of the twist? why do people HAVE to defend it as if the mcu can do no wrong whatsoever?

i usually agree with jeremy jahns and here's a video of him explaining the frustration of the fanboys

whoever said internet fanboys were the only ones complaining? i know people from ghetto ass queens who saw im3 and were very unhappy with it. and it's quite more than a handful of fans on an internet forum. i'm sure there are some here, so there's this forum, and then ign, and facebook, and (possibly) millions of others.

It's the internet, where anything is Bandwagon approach. Not to mention, it's a fairly mixed reaction with audiences alike anyways. Some liked it, some loved it, some hated it, others were indifferent. Movies don't make a billion dollars because people hate it. Hell, I've accepted the GA loves Transformers, although *some people on the internet may not*.

More examples of Bandwagoning :

Sam Raimi hate after SM3 came out (I acknowledge not everyone loved SM1/SM2 pre-SM3.)
A bit of distaste for Nolan after TDKR
Deadpool suddenly had this massive fanbase after WO

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Tacit Ronin

The way SONY dominated Marc Webb was way more hardcore than anything in 50 Shades anyways.

fair enough, however I'm just saying that, after what I saw on the marvel cinematics universe fanpage on facebook, why is it so wrong for people to NOT like this movie because of the twist? why do people HAVE to defend it as if the mcu can do no wrong whatsoever?

i usually agree with jeremy jahns and here's a video of him explaining the frustration of the fanboys

First of all, hating the film because they ruined a villain whilst not considering if it worked within the context of the story is just baffling to me..Secondly, I'm willing to bet that a lot of these so-called Mandarin 'fans' who suddenly emerged out of nowhere just went and googled the Mandarin and found out he has magic/alien rings without having any real knowledge of the character himself and how he has been handled through the years.

I'm willing to sit down and have a decent discussion with these 'fans' and actually talk about the character rather than argue on about how mis-represented and how Shane raped the character blah blah blah. Some of these 'fans' here treat the Mandarin like he was some A-lister, Ultron or Dr Doom type level villain. Granted, do fans have the right to be pissed off? Absolutely but they also need to realise that the movies and comics are not cannon.

It's the internet, where anything is Bandwagon approach. Not to mention, it's a fairly mixed reaction with audiences alike anyways. Some liked it, some loved it, some hated it, others were indifferent. Movies don't make a billion dollars because people hate it. Hell, I've accepted the GA loves Transformers, although *some people on the internet may not*.

More examples of Bandwagoning :

Sam Raimi hate after SM3 came out (I acknowledge not everyone loved SM1/SM2 pre-SM3.)
A bit of distaste for Nolan after TDKR
Deadpool suddenly had this massive fanbase after WO

yes that's true, there's nothing like a bandwagon on the internet (or anywhere)
I actually did not really really really like SM2, but the general appeal is that it is a great film. I thought the first SM was very good but I did not like that there were no web shooters.

And although DKR was a good film, it did not hold the candle to TDK or BB for that matter because to me it was far too similar.

And trust me, deadpool had a fanbase before WO. Just no one heard their voice until it.

I saw the first transformers and I thought it was horrible. I didn't even care to see the second and I only went to go see the third coz I was dragged and my ticket was paid for and I thought that one was horrible too.

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Originally Posted by TeeKay

First of all, hating the film because they ruined a villain whilst not considering if it worked within the context of the story is just baffling to me..Secondly, I'm willing to bet that a lot of these so-called Mandarin 'fans' who suddenly emerged out of nowhere just went and googled the Mandarin and found out he has magic/alien rings without having any real knowledge of the character himself and how he has been handled through the years.

I'm willing to sit down and have a decent discussion with these 'fans' and actually talk about the character rather than argue on about how mis-represented and how Shane raped the character blah blah blah. Some of these 'fans' here treat the Mandarin like he was some A-lister, Ultron or Dr Doom type level villain. Granted, do fans have the right to be pissed off? Absolutely but they also need to realise that the movies and comics are not cannon.

did you actually watch that video I posted? I agree that maybe SOME of these mandarin fans popped out of nowhere but you can't deny that there were some fanboys really waiting to see the showdown between iron man and his archenemy, and they deserved it.

but anyways, there's one segment in that video where it compares mandarin to the joker in TDK...whereas, how would you feel if it was the same? heath ledger's character was just a hired actor and carmine falcone was the 'joker' all along? would you have accepted that? even if it worked in the context of the film?

did you actually watch that video I posted? I agree that maybe SOME of these mandarin fans popped out of nowhere but you can't deny that there were some fanboys really waiting to see the showdown between iron man and his archenemy, and they deserved it.

And they didn't get it? Have you ever read the Iron Man comics where there's a Mandarin vs Tony showdown? Here:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

^^That is exactly what we got in Iron Man 3:

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

That's exactly how Mandarin and Tony fight in the comics. Those 'fans' who who only wanted to see "Iron Man vs. Mandarin (with Alien rings) zomg pew-pew socko-blammo" got a cold hard dose of reality poured over their heads. We were never gonna get alien tech rings, Feige and the director said that months before the film even came out. I'm guessing these so-called 'fans' wanted to see 70 year old Ben Kingsley exchanging blows with Tony and karate chopping his armours.

Quote:

but anyways, there's one segment in that video where it compares mandarin to the joker in TDK...whereas, how would you feel if it was the same? heath ledger's character was just a hired actor and carmine falcone was the 'joker' all along? would you have accepted that? even if it worked in the context of the film?

Aldrich Killian IS the Mandarin, something that many fans tend to ignore or outright deny. Accounting for the dissatisfaction from the so-called fans, they tend to use the Joker as an example, such as "what if Joker turned out to be a mascot who’s controlled by a scheming businessman and you say that that guy is the Joker?" Now, that comparison doesn’t actually work because the Joker has had one general consistent and very iconic look to his character: a guy in some purple formal wear, with white skin and green hair that looks like a clown. I can't say the same about the Mandarin. I have yet to see the Mandarin make any sort of impact in the Marvel comics universe. Cartoons, toy makes and writers have always been baffled about how to present him and usually create incarnations of their own. He's portrayed as everything from a sorcerer, to an ancient ghost, to a green-skinned alien, to a business man, to a teenage descendant of Gengis Khan in magic armour. Iron Man 3 isn't doing anything new by doing their own version.