I confirmed just now with Geshe Sonam, the qualification for consort practice in our tradition is that one must be an Arya Bodhisattva.

He also mentioned many hold LTK was already enlightened from a previous lifetime, but manifested the aspect of delaying enlightenment until the bardo in order yo emphasize monastic ethics as an essential assisting factor on the path.

Adi sorry as this was during a tantric teaching of HHDL it is not widely available on line. Here in India I also don't have my usual resources, but I will try to come back later to this when I am near those resources again.

JKhedrup wrote:Adi sorry as this was during a tantric teaching of HHDL it is not widely available on line. Here in India I also don't have my usual resources, but I will try to come back later to this when I am near those resources again.

Thank you for telling me. I appreciate it very much as this is a subject that has come up occasionally with some of my sangha friends and I am interested to hear what HHDL has to say. And of course if it involves a non-public teaching I certainly understand that and wouldn't ask further. I look forward to anything you might have available and kindly feel free to PM me if that is better.

I have been practicing Kriya Yoga for years as part of my Dharma practice, and find it to be totally compatible. The point is to use breath and intention to move the prana into the central channel. Similar practices, called Tsa-Lung, are found in the part Vajrayana Buddhism known as Anu Yoga. My Lama, a Nyingmapa Master, is well aware of and supports my Kriya practice!!

Completion stage practices are only superficially similar to what is usualy referred to as "yoga".

Unless you have sufficient experience in generation stage you can't practice them successfully anyway and if you are qualified you need direct transmission of these teachings from your master.

The yoga you are doing now may be healthy for the energy body in general if done correctly, but they will not have the effect of completion stage meditation and they are certainly not interchangeable.

JKhedrup wrote:I confirmed just now with Geshe Sonam, the qualification for consort practice in our tradition is that one must be an Arya Bodhisattva.

He also mentioned many hold LTK was already enlightened from a previous lifetime, but manifested the aspect of delaying enlightenment until the bardo in order yo emphasize monastic ethics as an essential assisting factor on the path.

A little background to this for this for those that are unfamiliar:

The same opportunity for final realization is present with consort practice and also at the moment of death. LTK had reached the point where it would have been appropriate for him to do consort practice and therefore achieve final realization while alive, but declined to do, not because it would have been un-dharmic, but because unaware people would have misinterpreted it as him having sex. Consort practice is not "sex" per se, but it is impossible for samsaric beings to imagine that action to be anything other than what they normally think of as sex.

As I am overly fond of quoting ChNN: "A human being has his limits. And thus in every conceivable way, with every possible means, he tries to make the teaching enter into his own limits." LTK knew this and did the bodhisattva thing of delaying his final realization in order to set an example for monastic discipline.

My posts are for entertainment purposes only. Please don't take anything I say seriously unless you verify it with a real teacher first.

JKhedrup wrote:LTK had reached the point where it would have been appropriate for him to do consort practice and therefore achieve final realization while alive, but declined to do, not because it would have been un-dharmic, but because unaware people would have misinterpreted it as him having sex.

For those individuals who do engage in consort practice, are you saying that those individuals simply don't care if people misinterpret what they're doing, or that they see the benefits resulting from consort practice outweighing the potential drawbacks?

JKhedrup wrote:LTK had reached the point where it would have been appropriate for him to do consort practice and therefore achieve final realization while alive, but declined to do, not because it would have been un-dharmic, but because unaware people would have misinterpreted it as him having sex.

For those individuals who do engage in consort practice, are you saying that those individuals simply don't care if people misinterpret what they're doing, or that they see the benefits resulting from consort practice outweighing the potential drawbacks?

LTK was a reformer who saw tantric practices being misused, and tried to re-establish moral discipline in Dharma practice. He was setting an example.

As has been quoted earlier in the thread:

...the qualification for consort practice in our tradition is that one must be an Arya Bodhisattva.

And

I have heard that in the course of his 60 year teaching carreer HHDL said he encountered 2 or 3 yogis attained enough to really benefit from consort practice.

If you're an Aryan Bodhisattva, of which HHDL has evidently met 2-3, then you're a candidate. Basically almost nobody is evolved enough to do actual consort practice, but there are multitudes that want to try, just like in LTK's time.

My posts are for entertainment purposes only. Please don't take anything I say seriously unless you verify it with a real teacher first.

"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

All but one of the 17 Karmapas were monks for life. As well as the Situ Rinpoches, Shabkar, Longchenpa, Dza Patrul Rinpoche, Luding Khen Rinpoche, Karma Kuchen Rinpoche, Sharmapa, Chobgye Trichen Rinpoche- the list goes on and on. Look up Penor Rinpoche's views on the subject.

Your description makes it sound like the Hindu Varnashrama stage of Brahmacarya. Some hihh lamas do marry later, but I think to say most is a great exaggeration

Last edited by JKhedrup on Fri Apr 18, 2014 4:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

JKhedrup wrote:All but one of the 17 Karmapas were monks for life. As well as the Situ Rinpoches, Shabkar, Longchenpa, Dza Patrul Rinpoche, Luding Khen Rinpoche, Karma Kuchen Rinpoche, Sharmapa, Chobgye Trichen Rinpoche- the list goes on and on.

Was Longchenpa a lifelong celibate?

The whole purpose of Buddhism is to have fun, isn't it? - Dzongsar Jamyang Khyentse Rinpoche