450. Secretary of State and Minister, in welcoming
you here today I ask if you will allow me to conduct a little
domestic business in public first. First of all, on behalf of
the Committee I would like to give a birthday card and wish many
happy returns to Llin Golding. Secondly, we know no more in this
Committee than anybody else outside 10 Downing Street as to whether
there is going to be an election fairly soon, but if there is
to be an election then this is likely to be the last public meeting
of this Committee of this Parliament. That being so, I want to
take this opportunity of paying tribute to four colleagues who
are retiring from Parliament whenever the General Election comes,
and to say how much we shall miss them: David Faber, who, among
his many other talents, brought an extremely acute focus to bear
on sporting matters; Ronald Fearn, who has his local government
experience and has great knowledge of tourism coming from representing
a seaside resort and has seen during this Parliament, perhaps
partly because of our efforts, a Lottery grant for Southport Pier;
Llin Golding, who is extremely knowledgeable on many matters,
including sporting matters, and if angling ever gets properly
recognised it will be pretty well a single-handed achievement,
as well as a reform of the gaming laws to which she has devoted
herself. I would like to pay particular tribute to John Maxton,
who has served with me not only on this Committee but on the National
Heritage Committee during the last Parliament too and has brought
huge knowledge of sporting matters and also of matters relating
to communications technology and content and so, on behalf of
the Committee, I would like to thank those colleagues and wish
them well for the future. Could I also thank the other members
of the Committee for the work that we have co-operated on during
this Parliament and the Clerks and their staff too who have given
us extraordinary support. We have had our ups and downs on this
Committee and if it were analysed I suppose that we have had more
recommendations rejected or ignored than have been accepted, but
on the other hand we can look back on a number of things in which
we can take pride, including work we did on the Royal Opera House,
work we did which is resulting in legislation on the looting of
works of art and antiquities, the work we have done on funding
of film and other matters and, although it may well be that John
will raise an eyebrow here, our single most famous achievement,
namely the saving of HMS Cavalier from the scrap yard. Having
delivered that commercial, Secretary of State, I think that you
want to say a word before we launch into questioning. (Mr
Smith) Chairman, if I may can I join with you in paying tribute
to the Committee over the course of the last four years, its members
and its staff, and particularly to those colleagues who are standing
down, perhaps at an election shortly to be called. Can I also
say that I trust that our record of accepting and implementing
Committee recommendations is getting better as the years go by.

Chairman: Thank you, Secretary of State.
I should of course mention that relevant to this very inquiry
we were gratified by the response of the Prime Minister in appointing
Mr McCartney, from whom we had evidence yesterday, to co-ordinate
the work on the Commonwealth Games. After that smug aura of self-congratulation
we have all been involved in we will now return to business

Mr Fearn

451. Good morning. We were in Manchester yesterday
and of course we got a lot of questions fielded at us as well
as we fielding questions ourselves, one of which leads me to my
first question. The Government has not given any funding guarantee
to the organisers of the 2005 World Championship Athletics. The
Mayor of London will not sign the staging agreement. Sport England
and UK Sport cannot sign it. Why then have you given Mr David
Moorcroft an assurance that the event will be underwritten by
a third party? (Mr Smith) We believe it is very important
that we hold a truly successful 2005 World Athletics Championships
in this country. It is an objective that I think everyone has
endorsed, Sport England, UK Sport, the Government, UK Athletics,
in seeking to have the Games here in 2005. We are working very
closely together with Sport England and with UK Athletics in ensuring
that we can have a very good stadium in order to host the Games,
a smooth process of running the Games and that everything will
be put in place between now and 2005 to ensure that that happens.
I am confident that that will happen because all the fundamentals
are right. The location has been identified, the feasibility work
on the design is well advanced and hopefully tomorrow we will
hear from the architects with the public unveiling of the design
and the costs. Already substantial areas of funding are earmarked.
Of course there is some further work to be done. That would be
unusual if at this stage that was not the case, but I am absolutely
confident that we are properly on track.

452. The City of Manchester have put £20
million in so far but that £20 million has expanded to £40.75
million already. On top of that, of the sponsorship that has come
along, out of the 50 they were hoping for at this time only 30
has been received. Is the Government underwriting it? Mr McCartney
could not answer the final question but certainly Manchester City
did confirm that the figures had jumped from 20 to 40. (Mr
Smith) And indeed it was the case at the outset of the bid
for the Commonwealth Games, which of course took place under a
previous administration, that at the time of that bid the City
of Manchester did accept that if there were funding difficulties
they as the City would be prepared to underwrite it. One of the
issues in relation to London of course is that the Greater London
Authority does not have the resource base that a city authority
like Manchester has and that is why I completely understand the
view which the Mayor of London has taken that it would be very
difficult for him to act in the same way as guarantor. In the
light of that, which is an entirely understandable decision on
his part, we are looking, together with a range of other bodies,
at what alternative steps can be taken.

453. It is going to be one of the major events
worldwide, I would think, and certainly the biggest Commonwealth
one that we have had. At the moment there seems that uncertainty
within the finance which follows from here on and that is why
I was trying to find reassurance for the North of England, for
instance, in that London does not seem to bother too much about
these Games but it is the Commonwealth Games for the whole of
the Commonwealth and we are very proud from what we saw yesterday;
it was superb. Can you tell me who will sign the staging agreement
then? (Mr Smith) For the Commonwealth Games?

454. Yes. (Mr Smith) The City of
Manchester have, right from the outset, accepted that they sign
the agreements. It is their Games to host. The Government of course
is already doing what it can to assist. There is £131 million
worth of investment in the sporting infrastructure for the Games,
there is the £10.5 million of Government expenditure on the
opening and closing ceremonies which is in the budget and guaranteed.
There is also some £30 million of private sector contributions
already secured as well as Manchester City's own contribution,
so the funding is very well advanced. There are of course some
further steps to be taken and I think, as Ian McCartney will have
explained to the Committee yesterday, the Government is working
together with a number of different departments who are involved
to see whether there is further help that can be given.

455. So it will be Manchester City who are the
signatories in the final agreement? (Mr Smith) They
always have been from the outset as far as I understand it in
relation to the Commonwealth Games.

456. Are you confident that those will be signed
very soon? (Kate Hoey) At the moment we have had no
approaches from Manchester City Council to ask us to look at ways
of meeting any financial deficit and I think that was probably
made clear yesterday by Richard Leese.

457. Has not Mr McCartney briefed you on that?
No? (Kate Hoey) I am aware that at the moment the sponsorship
has not reached what they would like it to but we are still some
500 days, over a year, away and I think you will know that right
up to the last minute in Sydney there were all sorts of scares
and rumours and problems. I am perfectly confident that we will
have a wonderful Commonwealth Games which will be terrific for
Manchester, for the North West and for the whole country and that
the country will join in and really want to celebrate, particularly
as it is in the Jubilee Year which gives us an extra dimension
to being a really fantastic Games. The facilities are superb;
you have seen them yourselves. Clearly, in any major project like
a stadium, there are always problems that may lead to slide over
costs but there is nothing at this stage that we should feel we
cannot among us all, including the City Council, work through.

458. It was probably because of this Committee
and especially the Chairman that Mr McCartney was appointed to
that position and he certainly seems to have cracked the whip
as it were and things are popping very nicely. Do you have hands-on
on the whole situation? Does he report to you frequently? How
many times have you been to Manchester? (Kate Hoey)
I have been about five times to Manchester in the last year, either
to events or to see round and look at all the different facilities.
I attended the World Championships in the Velodrome so I saw it
in use as well, having seen it not in use. I talk to Mr McCartney
the way one talks to anyone who would be in a position where he
is trying in a very good way I think to pull together the various
strands. First and foremost of course it is a sporting event but
it is not a sporting event in terms of how we run it because you
cannot run a successful Commonwealth Games without practically
every department in government being involved and it would not
be possible for someone who does not have the clout to be able
to go through and around and deal with all the departments to
pull it together and that is what he has managed to do. (Mr
Smith) I have just had a note passed to me from my officials
saying that we think Manchester have signed all the agreements
but I will of course check and write to the Committee if by any
chance that is not the case.

459. Who will sign the 2005 World Championship
Athletics? (Mr Smith) That, as I indicated, is a matter
still for discussion about who the most appropriate body would
be. There is no immediate urgency about this. It has to be done
within a relatively short period. I will be meeting with the President
of the IAAF early next week and will discuss this matter further
with him then. (Kate Hoey) And I am having dinner with
him so I am sure we can sort out something.