Must win, no win situation for Tony

Of course the Saints won, just like the Packers win, the Patriots win, etc. The point I'm making is Brees made the throws like he did all game. He threw for over 400 yards that game so if you think Brees had nothing to do with the win you can at yourself for that idiocy.

You and this 'team' thing man you are trying way too hard to make a point and it's not working.

1. I never said Brees had nothing to do with the win. Go ahead, look for a single post where I said Brees had nothing to do with the win.

2. The 'team' thing? I take that as you still don't get it.

3. The only reason it's not working is cuz you don't have the ability to comprehend.

4. Brees did his part. So did the WR's, TE's, RB's, OL, etc.... And why is that? Cuz it's a TEAM game. Does Brees throw for over 400 yards if the WR's don't catch the ball? If they don't run the right routes? If the OL doesn't block the pass rushers? etc...

I just asked this question in another thread and maybe someone can answer it:

Has a QB (and team) EVER in NFL history passed for 400+ yards, had 4 TD passes, and zero turnovers and LOST an NFL game?
That happened to Romo and the Cowboys last week.

The only other time was, again, Romo, last year against the giants (well it was almost 400 yards). It's really a testiment to how awful the team is because it really is unheard of outside of this team for a QB to produce at Romo's level and not win. Like Jaws said the other week on ESPN, this team might not win a game without Romo.

You are right. They led the league in forced turnovers. I hadn't considered that point. Good catch.

Still -- that Packer defense was historically putrid.

While they gave up a lot of yards, the Packers were 2nd in the league in fewest points allowed that year. In the playoffs, they got defensive TD's against both the Falcons and the Bears and they picked off Vick in the end zone to seal the game against the Eagles.

Rodgers is a great QB, but he was not carrying Clay Matthews, AJ Hawk, BJ Raji, Tramon Williams and the rest of the Packers Defense on his back.

While they gave up a lot of yards, the Packers were 2nd in the league in fewest points allowed that year. In the playoffs, they got defensive TD's against both the Falcons and the Bears and they picked off Vick in the end zone to seal the game against the Eagles.

Rodgers is a great QB, but he was not carrying Clay Matthews, AJ Hawk, BJ Raji, Tramon Williams and the rest of the Packers Defense on his back.

Those are not stats of a putrid defesne at all.

Plus they led the league in turnovers.

I thought that D was somewhat similar to the opportunistic Saints defense that won a Super Bowl.

It <is> possible for a team with a quarterback playing flawlessly even if the rest of the team sucks -- witness Aaron Rodgers last who managed 15 wins despite no running game and the 2nd worst defense in the entire history of the NFL. Of course, in the two games where Rodgers had average days, they lost.

My point is, you cannot say Romo didn't have some part to play in the 8-7 record the Cowboys now are dealing with. He did. He played fall less than flawlessly in the 1st half of the season.

Hard for him to play any better than he has in the last quarter of recent seasons. Maybe Aron Rodgers isn't a reasonable standard for QB play. Or maybe their situations are just different. But you can't put this team's recent inability to play well when it matters most at Romo's feet.

The problems are elsewhere, notably, with our ability to stop the other guys from passing effectively.

You guys are mixing up the Packers 2010 Superbowl Defense which was very good with the 2011 Defense which was historically bad in terms of yards allowed HOWEVER lead the league in forced turn-overs.

You are right about the mix up in years. However, I must still be missing your point. In 2011 despite the 15-1 record during the regular season the Packers collapsed in their first playoff game when the line couldn't protect Rodgers against the Giants pass rush and they had 3 fumbles.

I don't disagree, however, Romo can play better. Romo is part of the reason why this team is only 8-7 and fighting for a playoff spot. He was off early in the season. He's been lights out the past 5-6 weeks.

A QB playing flawlessly can wipe out <ALMOST> all flaws in a team.

This week and the following weeks in the playoffs is Tony's chance to perform lights out.

This.

If Romo plays consistant football all season long, the rest will take care of itself. Then he'd be regarded as a top tier QB, instead of just a good one who shows flashes and then shows flushes.

If Romo plays consistant football all season long, the rest will take care of itself. Then he'd be regarded as a top tier QB, instead of just a good one who shows flashes and then shows flushes.

How so? How will Romo's play make the pass rush "take care of itself"?

How will Romo's play make the coverage "take care of itself"?

How will Romo's play make the run D "Take care of itself"?

The answer: It doesn't.

There isn't a magical force coming from QB's that make other aspects of the team "take care of itself". Romo has to do his job and the rest of the team have to do their job. They are separate entities, not intertwined.

If Romo plays consistant football all season long, the rest will take care of itself. Then he'd be regarded as a top tier QB, instead of just a good one who shows flashes and then shows flushes.

This has already been demonstrated to not be true. You'd be hard-pressed to find a more consistent player than Tony over the term of his career, as evidenced by his high QB rating. And his December numbers have been discussed to death already. Go look at his end-of-half splits or his rating in games decided by 7 points or less if you need further evidence.

Tony's reputation is the result of bad pr in general, and of his bobble in SEA and the team falling short against the NYFG in 2007 in particular. And of ignorance, otherwise. That's it. There's really not anything more to it, because, when you watch the guy play, he's usually money.

Qb is the most scrutinized position in sports, like it or not. Romo has talent around him, does he have the perfect team around him, no, but others have won with less.

saying like it or not does not make it right. Because someone says something stupid does not make it smart. Romo does have guys with talent around him and they too have jobs to do. Does not matter if the QB throws a strike if the WR does not hang on and in terms of defense the QB has no control at all over what they do. QB becomes a fan on the sideline hoping like the rest of us.

saying like it or not does not make it right. Because someone says something stupid does not make it smart. Romo does have guys with talent around him and they too have jobs to do. Does not matter if the QB throws a strike if the WR does not hang on and in terms of defense the QB has no control at all over what they do. QB becomes a fan on the sideline hoping like the rest of us.

It doesn't make it right, but its reality, qb has become the most important position in sports. Is it all tony's fault, no, but lets not give him a complete pass. Last year in a winner take all situation his offense put up 14 points.

Qb is the most scrutinized position in sports, like it or not. Romo has talent around him, does he have the perfect team around him, no, but others have won with less.

Not this year, if you include both sides of the ball and special teams.

But I do think they could have done some damage in 2007. They lost tothe SB champs that season and that Giants team had a preposterously good pass rush come playoff time. Still should have beaten them. That was 5 years ago....still hurts.

It doesn't make it right, but its reality, qb has become the most important position in sports. Is it all tony's fault, no, but lets not give him a complete pass. Last year in a winner take all situation his offense put up 14 points.

It is reality that the media will protray it that way. Now given dumb comments made by the media over the years why would I put stock into what they say? and because some fans parrot them again is foolish. No doubt many will say it, I think I'm smart enough to know better.

Until this game is played as a one on one with just 2 QB playing vs each other then this game is still about which team goes out and produces.

I do think poor QB play will get you beat faster than any other position

It doesn't make it right, but its reality, qb has become the most important position in sports. Is it all tony's fault, no, but lets not give him a complete pass. Last year in a winner take all situation his offense put up 14 points.