Actually I do have several to report from Winni, one of which happened before ice out! But you'll have to be patient. Our next installment will be from the ocean. And as our readers are seeing, even though you attribute all (what 213?) accidents to Winni not all of them happened there. Your data may be big on generalizations but as far as specifics go "it has very small hands".

BTW do you have any facts on how many of these 213 accidents happened on Winni?

Actually perhaps you're being too easy on me. Lets look at yours and my data in a different light:

Here's your data from your first post where you try to dupe your readers into believing these numbers pertained to Winnipesaukee exclusively and in which you say show a "smooth steady increase" in accidents.

2011...36 accidents2012...40 accidents2013...40 accidents2014...44 accidents2015...53 accidents...for a total of 213 accidents on all of NH's lakes, ponds, and the ocean.

Now lets include the 2 years prior that you "inadvertantly" omitted:

2009...60 accidents2010...46 accidents2011...36 accidents2012...40 accidents2013...40 accidents2014...44 accidents2015...53 accidents ........for a total of 319 accidents on all of NH's lakes, ponds, and the ocean. So perhaps we now have more accidents to account for but that "slow steady increase" is a bit more suspect.

So how many of these 319 accidents happened on Winnipesaukee? I'd like to know and presumably so would the readers of this thread.

Dear Uncle Salty, I have been in touch with some of our friends and relatives regarding accidents on N.H. bodies of water. There is a guy who is purposely misleading the public into thinking that accidents happening on you (see below), the ocean, can be lumped into the data for me, Winni. And he even talked about you having few if any marinas (hence a negligible contribution to boat traffic) but I googled “marinas” in the towns in which you live and found quite a few. You and I know thousands of recreational boats are found in your waters. And when asked to provide accident data specific for me, Lake Winnipesaukee, he refuses. Saying that accidents are up all over on all of NH’s waters and then stating that as “proof” that I am less safe is down right dishonest. And he deliberately misled the public by leaving out accident data for 2009 and 2010 which showed a subsequent decrease in NH accidents. And of course, as has been pointed out, deaths involving the GFBL boats have ceased now that we have the SL. And speaking of dishonesty and misrepresentation, this guy has all these fantasies about the ethical behavior from the people who helped me get my SL. In reality he needs to hold up the mirror. His group had a ploy to get people from all over the country and world via the speed boating web sites to sign his petetion against speed limits, after all "your lake may be next” they said. They even recruited on some speed associated automobile sites. Amazing. Yet SL proponents collecting signatures in Nashua in favor of a SL were criticized because "what do Nashua people know about Winnipesaukee?". Then when the majority of Lake's Region legislators indicated they would support a SL his folks come up with the op ed about how the lake belongs to everyone in NH and it's opening a Pandora's box by letting Lake's Region people have a bigger voice in the management of the lake. What a joke! There was even a threatening quote on one of the boating sites when the SL was being initially proposed: “ If this SL happens I may be on the front pages of newspapers”. Some of the people involved in initiating the SL legislation at one point even had to call the police. It is no wonder the anti SL crowd had so little credibility in Concord, hence the landslide vote in favor of the SL. And yet one more disreputable event from the anti SL crowd. One of my favorite ploys was when speaker William O'Brien replaced those on the Transportation Committee who did not make it to the vote with his hand picked "replacements" who voted as he directed against the SL. But it didn't do any good when it came to a full legislative vote. You can bully and badger a small committee but not the whole legislature.

So in any case, for my sake, do what you can to keep those accidents in check so they won’t be blamed on me. Gotta go now as I need to write to my sister Winnisquam. She has had her share of accidents as well and I also need to reach out to her. She has been envious of me because I got a SL and she didn’t and I want to do my part to maintain good family relations.

HAMPTON, N.H. — A 25-year-old Plaistow, N.H. man has died and a man from South Hampton, N.H. is being treated for hypothermia following a fishing boat accident that took place just 50 yards off Atlantic Avenue at Hampton Beach yesterday.

Barry Arnold of Plaistow was a passenger in the 14-foot Sea Nymph when it was hit by a huge wave about 7 p.m., washing both him and the operator of the vessel, 46-year-old Christian Frey of South Hampton, into the rough sea, according to the New Hampshire Marine Patrol Bureau.

Arnold was found by one of the dozens of onlookers who watched the situation from the beach. But he could not be revived and was pronounced dead at Exeter Hospital, succumbing to hypothermia and cardiac arrest, according to a report from the Patrol Bureau, which is investigating the accident. He was in the water an estimated 90 minutes, police said.

Frey, meanwhile, was pulled from the sea by a nearby boat and revived by rescue personnel after about 45 minutes in the water. He was also taken to Exeter Hospital where he is listed in stable condition, the Marine Patrol Bureau said in a press release this morning.

At the time of the original call, the Hampton Fire Department launched a boat and the Coast Guard launched four boats from the Portsmouth Harbor and Merrimack Station in Newburyport.

Hampton firefighters also put a rescue boat in the water. Searchers concentrated on the area a couple hundred yards north and south of Concord Street, crisscrossing back and forth, recovering clothing and debris, while other searchers paced the beach.

At 8:08 p.m., a searcher on the beach was seen dashing into the waves, as a woman screamed, "They found him!"

Arnold was pulled from waves about 100 yards south of Concord Street, and about 10 yards offshore. He was quickly loaded onto a stretcher and placed on the back of a Gator — a vehicle similar to a golf cart used for beach rescues — and taken to a waiting ambulance.

Firefighters could be seen trying to resuscitate him as the Gator drove along the beach. A Coast Guard rescue helicopter arrived just a couple minutes after Arnold's body had been found.

The wind had been blowing strongly off the frigid water all day, causing white-caps earlier. By the time of the accident, the wind was still blowing fairly briskly, but the white caps were gone and waves were about 2 feet.

Last edited by Amy B on Thu Jun 02, 2016 1:29 pm; edited 1 time in total

There has been an increase in the number of accidents annually since speed limits took effect, none of them involving speed and you declare speed limits are working? You have a very odd sense of success. BTW the family from Chelmsford would debate you on the no fatalities statement.

See you next year.

_________________America is one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Not just for people who look or worship a certain way.

Actually there have been a decrease in accidents once you take account of the 2009 - 2010 data which you intentionally omitted. But where is the data specific to Winnipesaukee? We're still waiting. As mentioned earlier, for someone who harps on the importance of facts you seem to be providing precious few of them.

P.S. The family from Chelmsford can debate me all they want about a person alone in a small boat who falls overboard unwitnessed. This is tangential to the discussion at hand.

To My Dear Little Sister Winnisquam, I have meant to be in touch with you earlier. First of all, I am sorry about your accident (see below). Try not to take it too badly as these accidents occur on all our NH water bodies. Besides, you may get off lightly…as you know there is this guy who attributes what he calls an increase in accidents on all bodies of water in NH exclusively to me LOL :-) In any case there were a few things I wanted to talk about and hopefully clear up. I know you always thought mom loved me more because she gave me more islands and frontage. But she loved you just as much. And besides, you have a beautiful shore and an incredible sandbar. Life is too short for family differences to go unsettled. And there is another thing I needed to discuss. I had heard you are upset because my people gave me a speed limit and you don’t have one. But that is out of my control. And besides, I understand that more and more of the beautiful lakes in New York are getting their own SL as time goes on. You could have your own some day.

And speaking of New York, I plan to be in touch with Cousin George in eastern NY to see how his speed limit and its enforcement is doing. I’ll let you know what I find out.

"It was probably around midnight," said Bobbi Thomas, visiting the area for Labor Day weekend. "We had just gone to sleep and we heard a big crash."

The boat operator, 51-year-old David Degregory of Tyngsborough, Massachusetts, was traveling at about 20 mph when he collided with a tree, Marine Patrol said.

"They were pretty lucky," said Sgt. Joshua Dirth of the New Hampshire State Police Marine Patrol. "There was no indication that there was any slowdown or evasive movement before contact with the shoreline."

Degregory was charged with boating while intoxicated, Marine Patrol said.

Amy B wrote:To My Dear Little Sister Winnisquam, I have meant to be in touch with you earlier. First of all, I am sorry about your accident (see below). Try not to take it too badly as these accidents occur on all our NH water bodies. Besides, you may get off lightly…as you know there is this guy who attributes what he calls an increase in accidents on all bodies of water in NH exclusively to me LOL :-) In any case there were a few things I wanted to talk about and hopefully clear up. I know you always thought mom loved me more because she gave me more islands and frontage. But she loved you just as much. And besides, you have a beautiful shore and an incredible sandbar. Life is too short for family differences to go unsettled. And there is another thing I needed to discuss. I had heard you are upset because my people gave me a speed limit and you don’t have one. But that is out of my control. And besides, I understand that more and more of the beautiful lakes in New York are getting their own SL as time goes on. You could have your own some day.

And speaking of New York, I plan to be in touch with Cousin George in eastern NY to see how his speed limit and its enforcement is doing. I’ll let you know what I find out.

"It was probably around midnight," said Bobbi Thomas, visiting the area for Labor Day weekend. "We had just gone to sleep and we heard a big crash."

The boat operator, 51-year-old David Degregory of Tyngsborough, Massachusetts, was traveling at about 20 mph when he collided with a tree, Marine Patrol said.

"They were pretty lucky," said Sgt. Joshua Dirth of the New Hampshire State Police Marine Patrol. "There was no indication that there was any slowdown or evasive movement before contact with the shoreline."

Degregory was charged with boating while intoxicated, Marine Patrol said.

WHLIf I were you I'd find new friends and acquaintances.AmyB does not accept the tragic accident that left a fisherman dead as "counting" and says he'd debate his family over his death because of the way he died and It's-Not-News Hawk...he's crossed the line too many times to count.

They are both dead to me and I recommend you drop them least you become guilty by association.

Quite frankly, they killed this forum.

_________________America is one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Not just for people who look or worship a certain way.

WHL wrote:I just love how all you speed limit opponents say speed causes accidents. Yet, every accident you talk about was not due to speed. Like this last one: " traveling at about 20 mph when he collided"

The state of Florida has a trailered device called "The Convincer". You're belted-in using standard automobile seatbelts, and subjected to a short downward [wheeled] ride on rails—coming to an abrupt stop at the end. You don't exceed 10-MPH!

You're NOT ejected into a body of water to see if you can survive drowning at the end.

obervantone wrote:AmyB does not accept the tragic accident that left a fisherman dead as "counting".

Again the straw man argument. I said nor implied nothing of the kind. It doesn't "count" in terms of supporting your outlandish assertions that accidents on all NH bodies of water "prove" that a SL has made Winni less safe.

Last edited by Amy B on Mon Jun 06, 2016 9:59 pm; edited 4 times in total

Dear Winni, I received your letter from New Hampshire yesterday and I wanted to update you on how things are going here in New York. I would say things are great. Business is booming and our family friendly atmosphere is becoming known far and wide. I would say people are for the most part ecstatic with the results. Of course there are always people who will complain and I will attach some of the complaints below for you to see what we were up against. The complaints remind me of what my 7th grade teacher always said: Empty barrels make a lot of noise. Try not to be too offended by the bad grammar, spelling, and especially the profanity. It may give you a sense of why we don’t take these complaints too seriously.

Give my regards to your younger sister Winnisquam. Is she still as beautiful as ever?

-16-2008, 12:19 PMOh Davey you "imprudent" bastud..........You need to get a nice 90 hp bowrider to stay out of trouble.

I hate speed limits anywhere period. The cops should bag the moron's doing stupid zhit and so long as your not too close to anyone or anything they should leave you alone and go eat doughnuts. We all like are fast toys:iagree: One ticket,and many more to come, Schroon lake next week anyone,rossi07-16-2008, 03:38 PMBe careful at Schroon Dave, theres a 45mph speed limit from Horicon launch to Adirondack and the Sheriffs will more than likely be there on the weekends and people are trying to push for a speed limit on the whole lake. Schroon is a very touchy subject with the other hotboaters who are tying to keep the limit from not happening. We have to do our part to keep the ball in our court.SpeedDee07-16-2008, 08:51 PMThat is some crap!!! Bring the boat to California at least to the northern part no radar and lots of delta waterways and lakes no speed limit. Have a bay strait area that my boat works great in and there is another boater with the same kind of Jet boat and he screams past the Ferry dock that takes people to San Francisco from here in Vallejo.We also have Arneson Racing who races his Jet Helicoopter motr Boat in the San Francisco bay and up to Napa, CA with it from the Bay Area and he reaches speeds with this boat of over 200 mph. They have not cuaght up with him YET!!! Good friend Arneson comes to our Power Sqadron Function.Watch out if you have a CDL license that can really be a bummer!!!SpeedDeebaja200merk07-17-2008, 05:56 AMthat sucks... his judgment :rolleyes:1BadAction07-17-2008, 06:20 AMthat sucks... his judgment :rolleyes:

take heed. us young guys are going to need to deal with bullchit like this more and more. just ask bushwacker what to do when you get pulled over by a LEO, he has the best idea yet. :reddevil:hotdaddy2707-17-2008, 06:50 AMNone the less all this sucks for you Guys up in NY. Hell you all pay taxes to. That State, Couny etc needs to provide safe harbor for fast boats to do their thing. All others stay out or you will be ticked for doing less than 60 mph.

I agree.

We have the same stupid laws on most of the lakes and rivers in CT.

The bad part is that they rarely post the limits (used to be a sign at the ramps, now they are gone) and the cops tend to sit outside of bars/restaraunts with radar waiting for the first guy that had more than one beer per hour.

Kinda sad that our major cities in this area are some of the most crime ridden in the nation, yet our "boys in blue" are hunting the American Worker for letting off a little steam (via an internal combustion engine and some fiberglass) on his day off.Fasttoys07-17-2008, 07:08 AMThe "Boys in Blue" should spend a little more time chasing real criminals like thieves, sex offenders, and thugs in general...........but they don't because it's a lot more dangerous and it's easy money for the system to just annoy the general working class and hand out tickets..........and the more money you put into the system, the more annoying cops are out there annoying the working class.:reddevil: It's a viscous cycle......and I hate it.:reddevil::reddevil::reddevil::reddevil:

#6epeek epeek is offlineRegisteredepeek's AvatarMy Boats: 35 Fountain ExecutionerJoin DateApr 2003LocationLake George N.Y.Posts1,52590 dba at idle,3ft off transom. It's very hard to get legal.My Fountain Ex 496's with gibsons just make it. Theyare very strict. If you pull into the village,Bolton,the bay'sYou will be tested & ticketed. If they see you again afteryou get a ticket,they boot you off the lake!The speed limit is 45 mph,and now they use radar!. I got stopped last yeardoing 60 in a rain storm. He did let me go with a warning.I just use my pontoon boat most of the time, No hassles.ShareReply With QuoteReply With Quote_i04-03-2011, 08:38 AM#7Apexwarrior Apexwarrior is offlineRegisteredMy Boats: 353 FastechJoin DateJan 2007LocationDiamond Point, NYPosts200They are looking for loud and fast boats. However, I agree with CarGuy08, absolutely beautiful and worth the potential aggravation.

Where did you get stopped for 60mph?ShareReply With QuoteReply With Quote_i04-03-2011, 09:35 AM#84195 4195 is online nowCan You Hear Me Now??gold_member_star.gif Gold Member4195's AvatarMy Boats: 2001 42 Cigarette Tiger LipShipJoin DateMay 2005LocationOld Saybrook CTPosts2,658I don't mean to offend anyone I love Lake George and the area but I just dont see this as great performance boat destination. I read on here there is a guy building new beautiful boat that will do 130mph and he is going to use it frequently on Lake George. It is a 39ft boat, just my opinion but that is overkill. I lived on the Saratoga area a couple years back and still did my boating in long island sound. Open water no noise restrictions no speed limits and plenty of offshore destinations. I am always looking for the least amount of aggravation out there.ShareWhat did you say can't hear anythingReply With QuoteReply With Quote_i04-03-2011, 07:58 PM#9Got Cigs Got Cigs is online nowRegisteredMy Boats: 2000 Cigarette Mystique- Sold Shopping for 35 T/S CigJoin DateSep 2010LocationNorthern JerseyPosts316Original PosterThank you all for the input. Thats a shame theyre so strict, ive made several trips up there with my harley and the scenary is great. Maybe find other places to boat, dont need the aggravation.ShareReply With QuoteReply With Quote_i04-03-2011, 08:01 PM#10Carguy08 Carguy08 is offlineRegisteredMy Boats: 2011 Spectre 36 CC, 2014 formula 37 PCJoin DateJan 2008LocationLake George NYPosts420

You do have to have thick skin and be willing to kiss some a**. Ive been busted but I was in the wrong. 80 on fourth of July weekend. Yes I was ticketed. I know most of the cops on the lake, but again i do know where to play and where not to and i was in the wrong. (I had some relatives up and was showing off a little). My boat is also relatively quite. If your looking to open the boat up and do some prop testing and things of that nature Champlain is an awesome lake with tons to do and a great bunch of guys up there to boat with. Have your boat tested and see what dbs your at. I do tow mine elsewhere of lake George when I feel like playing.

Last edited by Amy B on Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:34 pm; edited 1 time in total

The prevailing attitude among Ocean Racers is NOT "Reasonable and Prudent". They'd ignore the 150-foot rule, and race side-by-side. (Or, sometimes, just "race"). They'd idle their engines outside of lakeside restaurants, making enemies with their over-rich exhaust smells and sounds. Today, lots of diners can taste their food and have actual conversations without the hydrocarbon-rich exhaust wafting in.

"Quiet" would have helped their cause, but their prevailing attitude was for more noise.

News Hawk wrote:The prevailing attitude among Ocean Racers is NOT "Reasonable and Prudent". They'd ignore the 150-foot rule, and race side-by-side. (Or, sometimes, just "race"). They'd idle their engines outside of lakeside restaurants, making enemies with their over-rich exhaust smells and sounds. Today, lots of diners can taste their food and have actual conversations without the hydrocarbon-rich exhaust wafting in.

"Quiet" would have helped their cause, but their prevailing attitude was for more noise.

Too bad about NHRBA, and that other one.

.

Lakeside communities all over the country are dealing with what NH speaks of:

Speed limits on the Chain O' Lakes? If you think it can't happen, look 30 miles to the northeast.

It's a law Wisconsin officials are convinced reduces accidents and noise, and helps foster one of the area's most attractive boating lakes.

George Hennerley, executive vice-president of the Geneva Lake Area Chamber of Commerce, said the speed limit has not adversely affected business, tourism or boating. It has caused larger speed boats to go elsewhere.

"Those racing boats that have three engines and are shooting out 500 horsepower each, they left Lake Geneva and things got quieter," Hennerley said. "They may have had fun racing from one end of the lake to the other, but I think they would have more fun doing that on Lake Michigan."

Looking to make the area a bit quieter is one reason Fox Waterway Agency officials say they're kicking around the speed limit idea for the Chain and Fox River, said Ingrid Ruttendjie, FWA executive director.

It's only one option being discussed, Ruttendjie said. Others include further restricted boating zones, limiting speeds on a trial basis, adding more no wake areas, installing quiet signs in residential zones and limiting or banning exhaust systems that run above the water.

The agency hosts a brainstorming meeting on the issue Thursday at 7:30 p.m. at the McHenry Municipal Center, 333 S. Green St.

Current noise ordinances on the Chain state a boat cannot be louder than 90 decibels while standing still on the water, and 75 decibels when moving 20-feet from shore. According to freehearingtest.com, 90 decibels equals the sound of a running lawn mower; 75 decibels is about the sound of a running kitchen appliance.

Ruttendjie said less than five noise ordinance tickets were issued by the McHenry and Lake county marine unit patrols in 2007.

Creation of a speed limit has been suggested several times in meetings by angry residents and boaters. They say they are concerned about the noise and reckless boat driving and claim speed limits would help address those problems.

Speed law opponents say such problems are caused by only a few boaters. Instead, current laws designed to quiet boats and stop recklessness should be enforced, they argue.

No one knows exactly when speed limits were put in place on Lake Geneva. When citing the law, officials use legislation updated in 2006.

Today, speed limits are in effect from May 15 through Sept. 30 -- the primary boating season. Also, boats are not allowed to travel faster than 15 mph at night.

Geneva Lake Law Enforcement Chief Tom Hausner, head of boat patrols on Lake Geneva, said speed limits are an "absolute necessary" for any body of water with a high boat population.

"I believe there is a huge safety risk if there isn't a speed limit on our lake, considering the density of the boats we have," Hausner said. "Boats are not like cars where if you push a pedal, you stop. There are no brakes to avoid hitting someone."

He said 20,000 boats are registered to operate Lake Geneva, which is nine miles wide and has 5,200 acres of water. As many as 2,000 to 3,000 boats are in motion at once on busy weekends, he said. Fifteen accidents were reported in 2007.

The Fox Waterway Agency sold more than 28,000 boat stickers in 2007. Those boats are spread across 45 miles and 7,100 acres of water on the Chain and Fox River. There were 20 accidents on the Chain last year.

The biggest problem on Lake Geneva, Hausner said, are the choppy waves caused by heavy traffic and speeding boats. A similar problem exists on the Chain.

"If the boat population there is as big as it is here, then speed limits are something that should be explored," he said. "The number of boats make it choppy and dangerous, and it's easy to slip out of control when it's traveling at more than 55 miles an hour."