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Joe how very 1968 of you. I like the peaceful fuck you that would send. Inconvenience those who take their healthcare for granted like those without it are inconvenienced every day.

This may be something to SERIOUSLY consider! Our very own little sleeper cells in major cities.

« Last Edit: February 07, 2007, 08:49:44 PM by ACinKC »

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LIFE is not a race to the grave with the intention of arriving safelyin a pretty and well-preserved body, but, rather to skid in broadside,thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming--WOW! WHAT ARIDE!!!

I had this idea from watching "The Day The Earth Stood Still". The movie is rather hokey but caries a very powerful message. In essence, space man comes to earth and his superior technology is misunderstood and he goes into hiding as he seeks the greatest minds on the planet. After finding an Einstein type he announces to the world that we must change our ways and that we are free to decimate ourselves, but don't even think of doing that to another planet. Everybody laughs him off so he schedules a warning demonstration down to the minute. The next day, precisely at noon, all electricity in the world ceases to work, with the exception of hospitals and other places that provided for the health of humans. No cars, trains, buses, nothing. This lasted for five minutes and then everything returned to normal.

There is more to the movie, but it started me thinking of something "big" that average people could do and I thought given our sheer numbers and if we partner with other chronic illnesses we could present a unified message that pleads for all Americans to have access to health care, that many prevention programs work (especially when you base them on the truth) and that many of us with chronic illnesses need help in providing for own own care.

I believe the founding documents of this country include the right of all Americans to adequate health care. The insurance, drug and other companies will bitch, but this can be done as long as there is a will. I have mentioned before that we could establish something like the Federal Reserve for health care. The Federal Reserve is a separate government entity pretty well immune to the folly of politics, so do the same for health care.

All those companies and such can then become subcontractors to the health care system and if they cannot deliver, then they lose their contract. But none of the details really matter, because these are the same screams that were heard when they broke up the railroads or AT&T and surprisingly the world did not end.

We need to develop a solid mission statement and given the times, "soundbites". We can take a page from the old activist playbook and use shock to give America one collective "slap upside the head".

I believe we can create our own day when America stopped and there is no way we will miss any new coverage if we can "blockade" at least 2 cities per state, say the capital and largest city. We recycled the die ins in the form of cigarette protests where they delivered "body bags" to the tobacco companies. However, while their message is effective, I do not believe it is the direction that we should follow.

I believe we should be convincing America, by appealing to most Americans based on the issue of fairness and need. Almost everyone knows someone who does not have insurance and that can be our common bond. Rather than telling the government what they are not doing, we will tell them what we need and illustrate the reality of many of our lives.

And the more I think about it, I am not so sure we should fully avoid DC. Imagine the power of 50 or 100,000 on the mall walking toward the capital, bringing our message to our nations leaders? I also believe that we should label ourselves as "promoters" or something that has a positive tone. This is our baby, so we get to set the rules.

Think outside of the box indeed. The way I look at it, either go big or stay home.

And the more I think about it, I am not so sure we should fully avoid DC. Imagine the power of 50 or 100,000 on the mall walking toward the capital, bringing our message to our nations leaders?

Nation's leaders look out windows and see 50-100,000 and respond, "Oh another march on Washington....send in the next corporate lobbyist." The simple fact is a march on Washington, in and of itself, for any cause will do very little to bring change. Unfortunatly, most elected officials listen to dollars not voices. I am not saying don't have a march, but it must be paired with things that reach the true decision makers, those with the big bucks. Maybe I am too jaded, but I don't think so.

Woods

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"Let us give pubicity to HV/AIDS and not hide it..." "One of the things destroying people with AIDS is the stigma we attach to it." Nelson Mandela

I think this is exactly what Joe is saying woodsie! To not have Washington DC be the ONLY place to do this but dont IGNORE it either.

The Day America Stands Still!!!!

Now THAT is a great little slogan not too mention a great title if we sell the movie rights!!!

If we do the "sleeper cell" idea as I am calling it, we would need to keep the locations off the national radar. Dont want some gentlemen in uniform there to greet us ahead of time! I good way to do that is a viral txt message of the exact locations just prior to the event. You could narrow it down to city and state but you wouldn't want it any more specific until minutes prior to the event. no more than an hour or so.

« Last Edit: February 08, 2007, 12:38:11 PM by ACinKC »

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LIFE is not a race to the grave with the intention of arriving safelyin a pretty and well-preserved body, but, rather to skid in broadside,thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming--WOW! WHAT ARIDE!!!

All very good points! Why couldn't we do both? Do Washington, AND do individual cities, all on the same day. The truth is, we know inherently that there are many who would love to go to Washington, but are unable for a plethora of reasons. Too sick, too broke, too isolated......etc.If I were only reading this, and it happened to have been someone elses idea, I would opt for Washington because I know absolutely NO one in my city with HIV/AIDS. I don't do support groups, so I have no idea how many of us there are in my town. Aside from taking out an ad in the newspaper, there is no other means by which I could appeal to others in my area.AIDSMEDS has been my support group for three years, and I have come to know so many of you on a personal basis as well. For those able to get to Washington all the better, for those who cannot, they may be able to do a regional thing. Really good thinking gang! Let's keep ourselves open to ideas, and once we get some momentum, we can vote.

Addendum: Each state could hold a similar march in the capitol of each respective state, right in front of the State Cap. buildings.

Go!

« Last Edit: February 08, 2007, 01:41:52 PM by Lisa »

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No Fear No Shame No StigmaHappiness is not getting what you want, but wanting what you have.

my 2cents: keep the message on track and do not try to be all things to all people, which is to say diluting a message advocating more funding of AIDS/HIV related sciences with a broader stance of universal health care can only detract the media and government officals, for example, from staying On Point

blocking bridges or intersections nationwide might get a lot of people thrown in jail. This represents entirely new logictics in planning if one must also plan to get thrown into local jails for a few days...

also as the guy hosting the millionaidsmarch site, I don;t want to advocate anything illegal

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Who was it wrote; Give any one species too much rope and they'll fuck it up?-Roger Waters

While we may continue the discourse of the elements of our stance, I must wholly agree that we do not wish to embark into illegal activities. Marching on bridges, or closing highways is to our greater detriment. We wish to affect change through peaceful means.I understand the mindset of inconveniencing John Q Public at large, in order to make our point, but I think a positive message is of more importance. I'm not sure that pissing somebody off at rush-hour will make a positive statement.

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No Fear No Shame No StigmaHappiness is not getting what you want, but wanting what you have.

Civilized points and counterpoints. Why cant more threads be like this?!?!?!?

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LIFE is not a race to the grave with the intention of arriving safelyin a pretty and well-preserved body, but, rather to skid in broadside,thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming--WOW! WHAT ARIDE!!!

I'll go you one further.Which would you be more responsive to.........

"Tonite, many of our viewing audience is in their cars, still trying to make it home.It appears as though there are people standing across the span of the bridge with signs. ..... Hang-on...we're going closer!........

O.K. ..This appears to be a protest of some genre, .... we are ascertaining the message of this gathering........

"...It appears to be a me'launjge' of people saying AIDS IS STILL AN ISSUE OF NATIONAL IMPORTANCE! "

"DO we know when these protesters will give over use of this bridge?"

"No, we have not been able to establish an idea of that yet!"

"Have any demands been made?"

"We are putting someone on the ground to establish a connection."

" So this is a protest?" ... Who is it? , and what do they want?"

" Looks like they are trying to convey the need for more aids money/funding."

"Well dang!...We KNEW all that!"

"So, have they made any progress to forward this shit before this?"

"Yeah, there's some background, but they've been pretty passive(read:=pansies) so far."

Just my take.

It is still time!

« Last Edit: February 08, 2007, 05:16:10 PM by Lisa »

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No Fear No Shame No StigmaHappiness is not getting what you want, but wanting what you have.

People I REALLY REALLY like what I am seeing here. This is a great dialogue of options. Keep throwing them out and we can pick the best one or two or even three to get our message across.

I really cant emphasize enough how excited I am to see all those participating and not condemning each others ideas!!!

On a side note...the wife is paranoid about me getting arrested for protesting!!! It's SOOOO cute! I love her to death!

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LIFE is not a race to the grave with the intention of arriving safelyin a pretty and well-preserved body, but, rather to skid in broadside,thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming--WOW! WHAT ARIDE!!!

I have a website which is already built, has generated search engine visibility and had 60,000 + or - unique visitors between December 1, 2005 and December 1, 2006. The website www.Commission-on-aids.org is at your disposal. Have the best dayMichael

I've been talking with Lisa and Tim (Moffie) and Lisa has asked me to encapsulate some ideas and lay some of the foundation for this event. I am still working on it, but it will be up over the weekend. And Twofires, thank you for that suggestion, I think you may have provided another way for us to really reach America in a very constructive way and be assured that anything we decide on doing will only involve CIVIL disobedience and nothing criminal.

Whew... I couldn't finish reading every post because my head already has too many ideas/questions about what I did read...

Lisa, when we spoke I stressed some of these points, but maybe in a different order:

1) Incorporation as a (eventually 501c3) non-profit. (Make the corporation legally responsible for the website, too, so Patrick has no liability) (calling all non-profit corporate lawyers!)

2) Ask for technical assistance from individuals at AIDSmeds and other organizations that have pulled off large marches on the Capitol/elsewhere. I have a feeling we'll need to cough up $$$ (which will be covered by the hundreds of thousands of people, corporations, and other organizations that donate $$$) to pull off an event of this size in D.C.

3) Obtain piggy-back rights to use another 501c3 organization's tax number (until our own 501c3 is granted, which could be in 2008 the way things go...).

8.) Hire me as PR Director with a nominal salary of at least $100K annually and finance a marketing/advertising budget of at least $1,000,000 .

9) Some other things but I forgot them already and it's time for my afternoon nap.

I've been asleep at the wheel for a week or so since I forget to check for threads in in Activism and did only today. I'll be on a committee but I'm a flake so you might not want me. I can try to work on any of the 8 actions listed above (number 8 stands out in my mind as extremely important so maybe we can approach Bill and Melinda for a few million right off the bat).

May these efforts mark the resurgence of peaceful social protest against so many other inequitable situations in the great old USA and our poor, pitiful world.

And I am Marie of Roumania...

Boo Parker

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String up every aristocrat!Out with the priests and let them live on their fat!

I think you can actually get the feds to review a 501(c)3 for $300 instead of $500. Also, you may want to take notice of a great website called couchsurfing.com This website does have a travel forum. However, I don't think it gets as much attention as Craigslist.

For whatever it is worth, Ryan White is not the only issue we are dealing with. President Bush has ordered ACTU shut down. Both Galveston, Dallas, and USC have been ordered completely shut down. In addition, many of the sites that haven't been shut down have received funding cuts exceeding 80%.

IN addition, Bush has taken away most of the money from the public hospital system and has indicated he won't allow them to receive more than what private hospitals receive after a standard reimbursement rate.

This all comes at a time when public administrators are paid more than ever. In Seattle, they recently raised the head of the University of WAshington from $440,000 to $718,000 and the guy who is getting the money says he wants more.

We are told that congress doesn't have much control over these issues, but I question that. In past years congress could veto a budget and now is the time for congress to do something provocative.

I like the recent changes that have occurred with the House of Representative and I think for the first time we have some real voices there. However, the Senate I am not to wild about.

Tomorrow I will be spending $300 for a review fee for filing a non-profit organization. The organization will be setup to help replace funds that were lost when Bush ordered the ACTU neutered. Originally the organization was going to include only regenerative medicine and gene therapy techniques, but recent changes and funding cuts by Bush seem to indicate that additional research support is warranted.

We have two more years of this bum in the White House and I strongly suspect that his next move will be to take away extra help for people on Medicare Part D. I see it coming.

This is a good time to reinvigorate Aids Activism. I am going to try and move to Palo Alto so that I can continue getting medical care at Stanford. I have been battling with resistant virus for over a decade and some of the California research sites have tools that are not available in the northwest.

Glad to see there are other activists out and about. I am wondering how many people know about Bush's cuts at ACTU?

One of the standard practices of ACT UP in the past was to always have a bunch of sound bytes which any ACT UP member could trot out for any media person hungry for same.

The media is rarely interested interested in a real discussion about the issues. What they love is something quick, preferrably tear jerky or witty, that will fly on the am or dinner news. So we would pass out sheets to members that would make it possible for anyone to be an informed spokesperson.

For instance this one fits most government plans including Bush's healthcare proposal and for that matter just about anything he proposes:

"It's a lie, it's a sham and it won't work!"

As we get closer to the March 20th action I will either post fact sheet info here or direct you to the ACT UP website for same.

I just had to come here, and tell you guys this! As I watched the local morning news today, there was a segment done about the upcoming citywide cleanup. They are inducting groups of teens to be at the ready to quickly cleanup any new appearances of graffiti, which is a good thing, but in addition to this, they are also forming groups of teens to go around town removing all signs, and bills that are not legal.I was daydreaming the other day about Patrick's idea of highway blogging, and actually had several bridges in my city in mind for this kind of project.Piffle! Guess I'll have to target bridges out of the city proper.

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No Fear No Shame No StigmaHappiness is not getting what you want, but wanting what you have.

I would love to do a march on Washington D.c. to show the bureaucrats that behind the number of deaths we are poeple just like them. If we do the march I would love to have the AIDS Quilt brought to show the names of friends lost not just numbers. My e-mail address is orionrca@yahoo.com.

being a frequenter for some activist liberal blogs, here are a couple others things that a large group of people can do short of risking arrest by doing freelance freeway blogging:

coordinated contact with elected official-this includes things like everyone phoning the Reps/Senators DC office one day and leave a scripted comment. These numbers are tracked within our elected officials' offices! A mass influx of phone calls is something that gets notice!

changing up the mix a little bit, this technique is more of a positive reward for a positive action: when one of our elected officials actually takes a stand for (your plank here) a co-ordinated effort to send a nice bouquet of flowers with a Thank You note to the Reps/Sen's office is really effective as has been found by the crowd that follows Americablog.com

And I very much support this Positive Reward for Positive Positioning, rather than confrontational stance squared of against congressional/administration inaction

Positive Positioning may be described as any policy position that promotes the well being of the electorate over war-time industrialization and tax breaks for the upper 2%. But thats just my 2cents worth.

When a Congressperson or a Senator speaks out for something we support, a mass of people all call in an order for a nice bouquet to be delivered to that officials' DC office.

I'm telling you: this is definatley a very cool, highly appreciated reward system that lets our elected know we stand behind social policy rather than special interests. All for maybe $20.00 a pop. It really brightens their day, so in a sense we are Bringers of Light into their dreary hell each day must be. Sparks jump in the deepest recesses of their minds and they remember better days, halcyon days when loftier goals called them to public service before the special interests got their jaws wrapped round their souls.

If 100 people across the country send in a $20 bouquet to 1 office in one day, that sends a powerful, positive message: Thank You for Supporting the Will of the People, the Health of the People.

This is one of those Viral things, against which nothing can stand, not even the most vociferous of right wing nut jobs. Unconditional Positive Reinforcement, aka Love.

What is then required is a website whose format is to monitor who in DC is supporting what. I'm sure its out there somewhere and as with the wheel, does not need to be re-invented. Just googled...

perhaps this is will become one of the foci of MillionAIDSMarch.org. Not so much a Real Date on the Mall rather a virtual skinner box for rewarding positive responses with a lovely cheap vase of flowers and a NOTE (don't forget to say which bill/amendment you are thanking them for) so the Rat you voted into office gets an ego stroke now and then.

Hows that for underhanded and devious?

« Last Edit: February 24, 2007, 12:35:29 PM by twofires »

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Who was it wrote; Give any one species too much rope and they'll fuck it up?-Roger Waters

I've had much going on with family, dying friends and personal ill health here lately...so I haven't been around on the boards much. Just posting this as a way of virtually waving my arms in the air and saying, "Hey! Still here and stuff!"

say we made a site and had a set date when the march was going to happen. we could get three million people to march and raise money for roundtrip tickets for you and two people that its affecting to washington dc on the 40th aniversey of hiv. sine its est. one million people have it in the us if we could bring a friend or two that would be even more. if we had a site with a countdown and a forum and maybe this site could do it? and a fund raiser for people that cant afford to go it this would happen i can see it too!

I'm not sure if you are going to do an AIDS march or one for Universal Health Care, so why not do both? Surely there is someone who could design a new logo that includes the AIDS Red Ribbon with some symbol to represent health care for all. If you do it that way, very few can stand against you, because then you can play the sympathy card for babies or whatever we need to get our message heard. After 12 years of Republican pablum we know that we need to slap America in the face and what better way to do that than by introducing an inclusive movement to better the health of all Americans.

As for DC, I say skip the whole thing there. Instead, why not use the Internet to organize armies of supporters, who will wear our new symbol and then at a prearranged time, say noon, we work to bring any and all parts of this country to a standstill, if for nothing more, than to hear our message. You could still have someone in DC who could be our spokesperson(s) to clarify our message to the country. But if you want to really affect change, then you need to bring this issue to each and every American and since they do not live in DC, we need to take it where they live.

Imagine closing all the bridges in almost every American city for one-half hour. With enough of us, the authorities would be fairly powerless to do anything as the "protest" would be there and gone before they even knew what hit them and even if there are arrests, even better to get our voices heard and to show the rest of America how grave the situation really is. This is a fight we need to win and I believe that all options should remain on the table, with the exception of violence. We are Americans and we know what moves this country, so let us tap that potential by bringing all the players to the table.

American health care, preventive programs and managing chronic illnesses. That pretty well covers almost every American alive.

I like this Idea and think it could work better except the getting arrested part. I actually have been involved with the million man/family marches and know for a fact that for them to be successful the basic cost is over 2 MILLION bucks unless you just plan to go to the mall and stand around.Considering everyone I know that is HIV positive is in a financial bind a local protest would be better.