Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 10:03:15 -0700
From: "Dr. James G. Goll"
Subject: paper 7-SI on a commuter campus
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Are there any SI programs at primarily commuter campuses? Do they have
the same effectiveness that is found at UN-L? I was involved in an SI
program two years ago as a visiting professor at Mercer University and
found similar positive results.
James G. Goll
Glenville(WV)State College
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 09:54:17 -0500
From: Paul Kelter
Subject: PBK reply: paper 7-SI on a commuter campus
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Dear Dr. Coll,
Thanks for the note.
The place where the program was conceived, the University of Missouri-
Kansas City, is very much a commuter campus in an urban community.
Other examples of successful SI programs at commuter campuses (or at
least
campuses in urban areas, such as Saint Xavier University in Chicago),
can be
found in the book "Supplemental Instruction: Increasing Student
Achievement and Retention," by Deanna Martin and David Arendakle
(Editors)
Jossey-Bass Pub, San Francisco, Winter 1994 ISBN 0-7879-999-7.
However, I am not aware of any formal data base on SI location.
(That doesn't meant that there isn't one - I am just not aware of it...)
Cordially,
Paul Kelter
Associate Professor of Chemistry
University of Nebraska
Lincoln, NE 68588-0304
402-472-3512
fax = 402-472-9862
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 15:20:37 -0500
From: George Long
Subject: Paper 7, GRL: statistics and biases
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I enjoyed this paper, particularly the comments concerning the relative cost
effectiveness of the program, and think it provides a useful model of a
Supplemental instruction program.
I do have a question or two about the results shown, though. First, If the
sample is biased by the motivation factor, why do the statistics at all ??
Shouldn't we expect that students who get (seek) supplemental instruction
would do better just as we expect that students who study more do better ?
Do you have any plans to determine just what biases the students who choose
SI have (e.g. particular learning styles, difficulty with specific types of
questions, etc.).
I would think that the SI worked well for some students and not so well for
others, what were the factors that effected this ?
****************************************************************************
George R Long, Ph.D.
Department of Chemistry, Indiana University of Pennsylvania
Indiana, PA 15705
grlong@grove.iup.edu, http://www.iup.edu/~grlong/
Technology has made the world a neighborhood, now it is up to us to make it
a brotherhood - Dr. M.L. King
****************************************************************************
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 15:55:52 -0500
From: Mike Epstein
Subject: Paper 7 ME: Student leaders
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I think this is a great program. It formalizes the study group concept and
makes it available to everyone. However, I wonder about the toll it takes
on the SI leaders.
So, some questions on the SI leaders:
What is the failure rate for SI leaders (i.e., what percent of SI leaders
drop out of the program because the extra workload is hurting their
academic performance)?
What is the average amount of time that an SI leader must dedicate to his
activities (attending lectures, preparing for sessions, answering questions
out of sessions, etc.) compared to an undergraduate teaching aide? I am
curious as to how much extra burden being an SI leader puts on a student.
I would think that if the student lived on campus that it would be
difficult for them to avoid being barraged by questions prior to exams.
Is there a waiting list of students anxious to do this or do you have to
look hard for the SI leaders?
Thanks
p.s. - I love the flashing $$$$$ ... that says it all! I am reminded of
the Wizard of Id cartoon where (if I remember correctly) the question is
asked: "Why are athletes worshipped while scientists go unnoticed?" The
answer: "Would you pay to watch a scientist?"
ME
Mike Epstein
Research Chemist, Analytical Chemistry Division
National Institute of Standards and Technology
Gaithersburg, Maryland 20899 USA
[Opinions expressed are mine ... not necessarily theirs]
PHONE: (301) 975-4114 FAX: (301) 869-0413
Michael.Epstein@nist.gov
WWW Home Page: http://esther.la.asu.edu/sas/epstein/epstein.html
========================================================
"From tomorrow on, I shall be sad - from tomorrow on!
Not today; no! Today I will be glad.
And every day, no matter how bitter it be, I will say:
From tomorrow on, I shall be sad, not today!"
Motele - Theresienstadt
========================================================
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 15:20:19 -0500
From: Paul Kelter
Subject: Re: Paper 7, GRL: statistics and biases
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Dear Dr. Long,
Thanks for the kind words - most appreciated!!
Regarding your specific questions:
1. What we hope to prove with or statistical study is that the
effectiveness of the SI program goes **BEYOND** the
'bump' that students would get just by self-motivation.
As shown in Table 2, the grade difference in chem for the
top and mid group (lower group had too few to make a
meaningful comparison) is LARGER than the grade difference
in all the courses these students took. This says that
they did better in gen chem than even their general
motivation could account for. We'd like to think this
was based, at least in part, on SI.
We don't plan on looking at biases at this time - I
won't be teaching the 200 student lecture for the
first time in 8 semesters (!!) but this would be fun
for the future.
The SI program really worked pretty well for
most of the students who attended regularly, save
for one group (and this is an opinion, rather than
a statement supported with data) - I believe that
students with poor math abilities, who insist on taking
the 2nd semester course, put themselves at such great
risk that even SI can't help them beyond a certain point.
This goes to the issue of preparation for the course,
which is a bit off track. That's it for now!
Cordially,
Paul Kelter
Associate Professor of Chemistry
University of Nebraska
Lincoln, NE 68588-0304
402-472-3512
fax=402-472-9862
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 15:46:05 -0500
From: Paul Kelter
Subject: Re: Paper 7 ME: Student leaders
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Dear Dr. Epstein,
You raised some vital questions.
I just got off the phone with an SI leader (Emal, one of the
authors of the paper). We had to shorten the converstation
because a fire alarm just went off in the chem building -
I'm at home at the moment...) But we did have enough time
to agree on our responses. Here goes!:::
Mike Epstein wrote:
> So, some questions on the SI leaders:
>
> What is the failure rate for SI leaders (i.e., what percent of SI
> leaders
> drop out of the program because the extra workload is hurting their
> academic performance)?
NO SI LEADER HAS EVER LEFT THE PROGRAM IN THE MIDDLEOF A SEMESTER. TWO
OF THE 8 HAVE CHOSEN TO TEACH ONLY
ONE SEMESTER. ONE OF THE TWO WHO DID NOT CONTINUE
HAD AN EDUCATION COLLEGE PRACTICUM, AND WAS MOSTLY
OFF-CAMPUS. THE OTHER ONE WANTED TO DO MORE PRIVATE
UNDERGRAD RESEARCH WITH THE TIME.
THE WORKLOAD APPEARED TO HAVE NO AFFECT ON THE
ACADEMIC PERFORMANCE OF ANY OF OUR SI LEADERS - THEY
ALL MAINTAINED > 3.9 GPA'S.
> What is the average amount of time that an SI leader must dedicate to
> his
> activities (attending lectures, preparing for sessions, answering
> questions
> out of sessions, etc.) compared to an undergraduate teaching aide? I
> am
> curious as to how much extra burden being an SI leader puts on a
> student.
> I would think that if the student lived on campus that it would be
> difficult for them to avoid being barraged by questions prior to
> exams.
GOOD POINT. THE TIME IN PREP VARIES GREATLY - CORYDID NOT SPEND MUCH
TIME AT ALL, OTHER THAN SITTING IN
ON MY LECTURES (WHICH MIGHT WELL SEEM LIKE AN
ETERNITY...). ANOTHER STUDENT, NAMED BRADETTE, SAT IN
ON MY LECTURES AND SPENT SCADS OF EXTRA TIME
PREPARING SAMPLE EXAMS AND SUCH. 'JUST A
DIFFERENCE IN APPROACH.
EMAL WAS VERY CAREFUL **NOT** TO GIVE OUT HIS HOME PHONE
NUMBER.
FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, THE SI LEADERS WERE FAR, FAR
MORE HIGHLY PRIZED BY THE STUDENTS THAN THEIR
GRADUATE TA'S, WHO WERE OFTEN NOT NEARLY
AS KNOWLEDGEABLE OR COMMITTED TO THE TASK.
> Is there a waiting list of students anxious to do this or do you have
> to
> look hard for the SI leaders?
I GENERALLY PICK THE SI LEADERS FROM AMONG MY200 GEN CHEM STUDENTS AFTER
THE 2ND SEMESTER.
BECAUSE THE TOP STUDENTS ARE ***REALLY*** SUPER,
AS THE TOP 1% WOULD BE ANYWHERE, THEY TEND TO
WORK OUT GREAT AND ARE LESS FILLING.
> Thanks
A PLEASURE!
> p.s. - I love the flashing $$$$$ ... that says it all! I am reminded
> of
> the Wizard of Id cartoon where (if I remember correctly) the question
> is
> asked: "Why are athletes worshipped while scientists go unnoticed?"
> The
> answer: "Would you pay to watch a scientist?"
I ONCE SAW A STEPHEN JAY GOULD LECTURE AT MY OLDSTOMPING GROUNDS - THE
UNIV. OF WISCONSIN-OSHKOSH -
WE PAID HIM $15,000 FOR THE TALK (AND VISIT). I DIDN'T
UNDERSTAND MUCH OF WHAT HE SAID - SPOKE SOOOOOO
FAST!!!! I THINK OF THIS EVERY TIME A STUDENT GIVES A
QUIZZICAL LOOK IN CLASS.
CORDIALLY,
Paul Kelter
Associate Professor of Chemistry
Univeristy of Nebraska
Lincoln, NE 68588-0304
402-472-3512
fax = 402-472-9862
> ME
>
> Mike Epstein
> Research Chemist, Analytical Chemistry Division
> National Institute of Standards and Technology
> Gaithersburg, Maryland 20899 USA
> [Opinions expressed are mine ... not necessarily theirs]
> PHONE: (301) 975-4114 FAX: (301) 869-0413
> Michael.Epstein@nist.gov
> WWW Home Page: http://esther.la.asu.edu/sas/epstein/epstein.html
> ========================================================
> "From tomorrow on, I shall be sad - from tomorrow on!
> Not today; no! Today I will be glad.
> And every day, no matter how bitter it be, I will say:
> From tomorrow on, I shall be sad, not today!"
> Motele - Theresienstadt
> ========================================================
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:30:46 -0700
From: Bob Bruner
Subject: Paper 7. BB: short questions
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1. The large turnout for occasional sessions is obviously somewhat of a
problem. How about allowing the Instructor to close the session at (say) 25,
and to give priority to regular attendees. (Easy way... only regular
attendees are allowed in before 7:15, for a "7:00" session. After that, it
is open until full.) This preserves the special character and rewards the
regulars.
One step better would be to deal with the overflow, by having a supplemental
Supplemental Instructor available for the newcomers. Since the high
attendance sessions seem to be largely predictable, this might be practical.
2. Do you tell the students about the success of SI? That is, can you
"create" motivation?
3. You mention that you ask non SI students why they didn't come. What did
they say? Of course, some who did well undoubtedly just didn't "need" it.
More interesting would be the response of C and D non SI students.
Bob Bruner
Contra Costa College and
UC Berkeley Extension
bbruner@uclink4.Berkeley, edu
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 20:03:28 -0500
From: Paul Kelter
Subject: PBK Response: Paper 7. BB: short questions
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Dear Dr. Bruner,
Your first question deals with one of the very few troublesome
areas of SI - irregular participation. My response to each question
follows:
Bob Bruner wrote:
> 1. The large turnout for occasional sessions is obviously somewhat of
> a
> problem. How about allowing the Instructor to close the session at
> (say) 25,
> and to give priority to regular attendees. (Easy way... only regular
> attendees are allowed in before 7:15, for a "7:00" session. After
> that, it
> is open until full.) This preserves the special character and rewards
> the
> regulars.
Ideally, 15-30 attendees is about the right number, according to my
SIleaders. Any more gets unwieldy. After tolerating for a number
of semesters the "one-timers" who wanted to use the SI session,
before the exam as a cram session, we put our proverbial foot (feet)
down and started prohibiting folks who did not show up regularly.
For what it's worth, we noticed that the one-timers (who were invariably
fairly disruptive because they did not buy into the Socratic approach
of the sessions) were nearly always boys, and often fraternity
members (I am not a fan of fraternities on my campus..) but I
digress.....
> One step better would be to deal with the overflow, by having a
> supplemental
> Supplemental Instructor available for the newcomers. Since the high
> attendance sessions seem to be largely predictable, this might be
> practical.
>
We really want folks there from day 1.
> 2. Do you tell the students about the success of SI? That is, can you
> "create" motivation?
You bet! We do so at the opening class period, where we discuss
qualitatively theresults in our paper (ie; nearly a full point better,
etc...)
> 3. You mention that you ask non SI students why they didn't come. What
> did
> they say? Of course, some who did well undoubtedly just didn't "need"
> it.
> More interesting would be the response of C and D non SI students.
At UNL, a majority of the student body work at least part-time.
Sometimesit is tough to reconcile a work schedule with the evening or
late afternoon sessions.
Some students don't like the occassionally large sessions.
Sometimes students fall through the cracks. Interestingly, although the
grades in Chem 109 are never super high (typically averaging a 2.2 - 2.6
on a 4.0
GPA scale), most students who work at it do OK. The large number of
kids who simply give up but don't drop, thus taking an "F", has
a significant impact on the class GPA.
Thanks again for the questions.
Cordially,
Paul Kelter
Associate Professor of Chemistry
University of Nebraska
Lincoln, Nebraska 68588-0304
402-472-3512
fax=402-472-9862
> Bob Bruner
> Contra Costa College and
> UC Berkeley Extension
> bbruner@uclink4.Berkeley, edu
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 1997 00:03:14 -0500
From: Larry Rosenhein
Subject: Paper 7 - LR : SI Programs
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I am particularly interested in Paper 7 because we also have an SI
program. A few questions:
1. It sounds like your program is structured similarly to ours.
I'm guessing for instance that SIs poll the class to find out what
the most convenient times for sessions are. This inevitably will
exclude some students, however. I've heard that at one campus at
least, the session times are decided on beforehand and placed in the
class schedule so students can plan around this. Maybe they are even
supposed to sign up. Have you considered
pros and cons of that?
Incidentally, the idea of a two-hour session is excellent, and I
will certainly suggest it here; I could never see, given the desire to have
the sessions run in a highly interactive way, how very much could get
done in an hour.
2. You mention a part-time supervisor; do you mean one for chemistry
sections only, or is that all SI courses? What are the duties of the
supervisor?
3. How much collaboration between SIs and instructors is there,
generally? How is it supported/encouraged/required by the SI program
structure you have? And do you think this is an important component
of the program?
4. Assessment: It's difficult to untangle the self-selection
factors from the intrinsic differences due to the program. But I
think it's important to attempt to do this evaluation. I wasn't
fully convinced by your last table. The differences between ACT
scores within quartiles may be too low to be meaningful; and since
chemistry GPAs are always lower than overall GPAs, a larger difference
between chemistry GPAs in SI and non-SI students may just mean that
chemistry is more discriminating among students than the average
course, where grades tend to be compressed toward the high end.
[Indeed, just this morning, NPR interviewed a professor about grade
inflation, who claims that "you have to try" to get a grade as low as
a C in most courses!]
Sorry to sound picky on this subject; I do admire the authors
for tackling it at all. Certainly I agree that even a total lack of
statistics would not invalidate the program, if one feels that it is
doing good; but there is always the possibility that some other sort
of method for providing help to students might be better, and then it
is very useful to have measurements.
Since some sections were using SIs and some were not, it might
be interesting to have a comparison between the grades in the
sections, but this would probably require at least a standardized
final exam to be very meaningful. I don't suppose you do that? And
the other problem is that it appears not a large percentage of
students were using the SI anyway, so the differences would be small.
That raises the question again of why more students aren't taking
advantage of it. I think one could argue that a partial measure of
the success of the program _is_ the number of students who use it.
I am very interested in this issue because although our statistics
run along the lines of Nebraska's (first table), probably even fewer
students actually participate here.
Well, I'll stop before someone reminds me that these are
supposed to be short questions.
Larry Rosenhein
Indiana State University (Terre Haute)
chrosen@scifac.indstate.edu
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 1997 09:31:15 -0500
From: Paul Kelter
Subject: Re: Paper 7 - LR : SI Programs
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DEAR DR. ROSENHEIN,
OY! SO MANY QUESTIONS! WE HAVE GIVEN THOUGHT TO EACH ONE,
SO MAYBE IT PROVES THAT STRANGE MINDS THINK ALIKE?
RESPONSES, IN SENTENCE CASE, ARE BELOW:
Larry Rosenhein wrote:
> I am particularly interested in Paper 7 because we also have an
> SI
> program. A few questions:
> 1. It sounds like your program is structured similarly to ours.
> I'm guessing for instance that SIs poll the class to find out what
> the most convenient times for sessions are.
Yes, they do this on the frist day of class.
> This inevitably will
> exclude some students, however.
Indeed. With a class of 210, there will be NO time, short ofWednesday 3
A.M. (which was a very good Simon and Garfunkel album
of 32 years ago, BTW) which will match all the schedules. Life ain't
always fair, though we compromise as best we can.
> I've heard that at one campus at
> least, the session times are decided on beforehand and placed in the
> class schedule so students can plan around this. Maybe they are even
> supposed to sign up. Have you considered
> pros and cons of that?
For UNL, this is would not be an advantage - the students alreadytake
exams in the evening and most work. We can not legally (legal
here in the "rules of UNL"sense...) list something in the student
bulletin that is only optional. Also, we really do not want too many
students taking the thing! Interaction is the key.
> 2. You mention a part-time supervisor; do you mean one for chemistry
> sections only, or is that all SI courses? What are the duties of the
> supervisor?
There is a rather ineffective graduate student "supervisor" for the
program.The most recent one was going for her Ph.D. in English, which, a
priori,
is not a disadvantage. The disadvantage is that she wasn'r organized.
Her role is to make sure that the SI leaders are getting in their data
reports,
eval's, etc. But the SI students are really better teachers and more
organized
than the SI "supervisor."
> 3. How much collaboration between SIs and instructors is there,
> generally?
Quite a bit - the SI leaders see me and their other instructorseach
class period and then again in separate meetings. Now I
have to back off that claim just a bit - we had one SI section
last year in which the goal of the SI leader was to save the
students FROM the professor, who was less effective than
having the students stare at a blank chalkboard for an hour.
she did not see him, because he was too busy running his
own business. She saw me or the gen chem coordinator
instead.
> How is it supported/encouraged/required by the SI program
> structure you have? And do you think this is an important component
> of the program?
I hire the kiddies, and we are quite close because they have all had
me as an instructor in Chem 109/110. So we easily work together.
> 4. Assessment: It's difficult to untangle the self-selection
> factors from the intrinsic differences due to the program. But I
> think it's important to attempt to do this evaluation. I wasn't
> fully convinced by your last table. The differences between ACT
> scores within quartiles may be too low to be meaningful; and since
> chemistry GPAs are always lower than overall GPAs, a larger difference
>
> between chemistry GPAs in SI and non-SI students may just mean that
> chemistry is more discriminating among students than the average
> course, where grades tend to be compressed toward the high end.
> [Indeed, just this morning, NPR interviewed a professor about grade
> inflation, who claims that "you have to try" to get a grade as low as
> a C in most courses!]
> Sorry to sound picky on this subject; I do admire the authors
> for tackling it at all.
Thanks. I confess my undergrads did the statistical analyses for part of
theirhonors thesis work - I'm just the talking head.
> Certainly I agree that even a total lack of
> statistics would not invalidate the program, if one feels that it is
> doing good; but there is always the possibility that some other sort
> of method for providing help to students might be better, and then it
> is very useful to have measurements.
> Since some sections were using SIs and some were not, it might
> be interesting to have a comparison between the grades in the
> sections, but this would probably require at least a standardized
> final exam to be very meaningful. I don't suppose you do that?
In fact, we DO have a common final, and all common exams. so thereis
ample opportunity for comparison. The difficulty with the comparison
is really the number of variables involved - faculty, IMO, important
motivators, critical for student success. Also, lab TAs have a large
impact. Time of day MAY be important (post-prandial torpor and
all after lunch...) Common exams do help us tease out some of this
information.
> the other problem is that it appears not a large percentage of
> students were using the SI anyway, so the differences would be small.
I don't understand this point.
> That raises the question again of why more students aren't
> taking
> advantage of it. I think one could argue that a partial measure of
> the success of the program _is_ the number of students who use it.
> I am very interested in this issue because although our statistics
> run along the lines of Nebraska's (first table), probably even fewer
> students actually participate here.
Good point.
> Well, I'll stop before someone reminds me that these are
> supposed to be short questions.
Thanks for the thoughtful questions/comments.
Cordially,
Paul Kelter
Associate Professor of Chemistry
University of Nebraska
Lincoln, NE 68588-0304
402-472-3512
fax=402-472-9862
> Larry Rosenhein
> Indiana State University (Terre Haute)
> chrosen@scifac.indstate.edu
Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 10:11:52 -0500
From: cory d emal
Subject: Paper 7: CE Response to opening questions
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Good morning all!
There is a small change in plans on our end - Paul Kelter is currently
in Winnipeg, so I will be handling the bulk of the responses for this
discussion. We will remain in contact by phone, so most of what you
will see will be a collective Emal/Kelter response coming from the
student's (my) point of view.
With that said, I'll jump into responding to some questions posed by
Dr. Rosenthal. I don't have the original email handy, so I'll enter in
my own interpretation of the question - please correct me if I have
erred in doing so, Dr. Rosenthal.
>> 1. a) Can you provide more details about SI training?
SI training at UNL generally takes place the Thursday and Friday
before classes start for the semester and is required for all SI
instructors, whether they are rookies or veterans. The idea behind
this is that the experience that veterans have from being in the SI
sessions is far more valuable than what can be ascertained from the
training manual, which is valuable in its own right for background and
strategy ideas. Typically covered in the training sessions are the
fundamentals of SI and the mode of thought needed to successfully run
a session, procedures for record keeping (grades, attendence, etc.),
approaches to boosting attendence and keeping it at a desired level,
tips and tricks from the veterans, and a mock SI session where leaders
develop a discussion tool or study aid to help with the "session". We
feel this training is vital to "sell" the SI mode of thought to the
new leaders, since it is all too easy to fall back into a
"lecture-mode", particularly early in the semester when the students
themselves have not gotten used to the interactive style of learning
that we try to present.
>> 1. b) Do you have any printed material that you can send by email?
Unfortunately, no. However, a wonderful starting point for SI-related
matters is the Arendale/Martin book referenced throughout the paper.
It contains many papers specifically devoted to SI - a few are
specific to chemistry or other subjects, and others have a more
general approach to SI and its methodology. It also contains numerous
other references to SI-related material. The reference is:
Martin and Arendale, Supplemental Instruction: Increasing Student
Achievement and Retention - Josey-Bass, pub. No. 60, Winter 1994
>> 2. Have you taped any SI sessions?
No. Many students view SI as a sanctuary of sorts where they can be as
anonymous as they wish to be, yet still engage in meaningful learning
activities. We want sessions to be as free-flowing as possible,
and a tape recorder would counteract that.
Thank you for the questions!
Cory Emal
University of Nebraska-Lincoln
cemal@unlgrad1.unl.edu
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 14:50:20 -0400
From: Robert Richman
Subject: Paper 7 - RR: Tinkering with success
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The timing of this paper is ideal for me. I am dissatisfied with
my College's "peer tutoring" system. So, armed with a sign-up list of 15
volunteers from last year's class, I had planned to spend the summer
developing an alternative. Your SI program provides an ideal model.
This seems to me to be an excellent first step in designing a
program to optimize retention in General Chemistry. But not all students
fail for the same reason. I think the largest number fail for any number
of reasons related to working alone, such as hitting a roadblock, getting
frustrated, and quitting. SI is an ideal format for helping these
students.
But I think there are other students who might be better served
by, say, a "special topics" SI session, or a visit to the university's
study skills office. With my typical professor's training (i.e., a Ph.D.
in chemistry but absolutely no education courses), I still feel like an
amateur in diagnosing specific student problems, but I would start by
itemizing the following common syndromes. Others can probably add to this
list.
1. "I was never any good at math." As if, with this fatalistic
dismissal, they can get on with their lives and succeed in chemistry.
These students need to address this problem. Have you considered a
"special topics" SI session on math skills in chemistry?
2. "I read the book but didn't get anything from it." These
students are probably speed-reading. They don't know how to read a
science or math text. Have you considered a special topics SI session
that meets weekly to work through the text? (I think many humanities
courses that deal with difficult primary texts actually do this in the
lecture part of the course.)
3. "I really understood the material, but I just froze up." Test
anxiety. What do you do about these students? Study skills center?
4. "I really understood the material. I don't understand why I
did so poorly." These students probably do not know what it means to
understand the material at the college level. They may benefit from a
group format such as SI, but only if it is structured to require
individual accountability. It sounds like you've tried to do that. Do
you find that you don't get this excuse as much?
Have you considered adding "second order corrections" such as
these to the SI program in an attempt to maximize retention? Or, since
your stated goal is more modest -- "SI is meant to help students achieve a
satisfactory level of comfort in the class before facing the major
stresses of research papers and exams, while sustaining and adding to this
level as the semester progresses" -- would you be disinclined to tinker
with success?
-- Robert Richman (richman@msmary.edu)
Mount St. Mary's College
Emmitsburg, MD
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 14:21:26 -0500
From: Larry Rosenhein
Subject: Re: Paper 7 - LR : SI Programs
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Paul Kelter wrote (in response to my earlier questions):
> Also, we really do not want too many
> students taking the thing! Interaction is the key.
>
Well, I suppose it's a matter of balance, and if you had more
students wanting to use the program, you would find a way to get more
SIs to keep the interaction high.
Our problem at ISU is that not enough of the students who should
be using the SI program are doing so.
An alternate way of providing extra help to GenChem students is
to allow/require them to enroll in a preparatory course given as
a prerequisite, or a course (often < 3 cr) that runs concurrently
with GenChem. [This is currently a thread in Chemed-l.] Have you
given any thought to the compartive ad/disadvantages of the two
approaches? Do you think there are things that can distinctly be
accomplished by one approach compared to the other? (Hard questions,
I know. But I'm hoping that you or other people on the list have
more experience than we do with these matters, and can provide some
guidance.)
Larry Rosenhein
Indiana State University (Terre Haute)
chrosen@scifac.indstate.edu
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 18:04:50 -0400
From: Bert Ramsay
Subject: Re: Paper 7 - RR: Tinkering with success
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----------
> From: Robert Richman
> To: CHEMCONF@UMDD.UMD.EDU
> Subject: Paper 7 - RR: Tinkering with success
> Date: Monday, July 07, 1997 2:50 PM
>
> The timing of this paper is ideal for me. I am dissatisfied with
> my College's "peer tutoring" system.
> This seems to me to be an excellent first step in designing a
> program to optimize retention in General Chemistry. But not all students
> fail for the same reason. I think the largest number fail for any number
> of reasons related to working alone, such as hitting a roadblock, getting
> frustrated, and quitting. SI is an ideal format for helping these
> students. -----
> 1. "I was never any good at math." As if, with this fatalistic
> dismissal, they can get on with their lives and succeed in chemistry.
> These students need to address this problem. Have you considered a
> "special topics" SI session on math skills in chemistry?
---------- comment from Bert Ramsay ----
Problem is that a special SI session will not be attended by those who
need it until too late. You need the personal attention of the sort
provided by peer tutors. How can you do that?
------------------------
By the end of the summer I will have completed the first version of
"Personal Tutor" that will provide every student with a "personal tutor" to
help them develop their paper-and-pencil problem-solving skills. The tutor
will check and provide suggestions for correcting incorrect answers, as
well as "anticipated incorrect answers" (e.g. "I believe you left out a
conversion factor." or "Did you count all of the elements inside the
parentheses of the chemical formula you used to calculate its molar mass?"
[eg calcium hydroxide])
The Personal Tutor can also help the student set up the solution - but
the Learning Curve Monitor is keepting track of how much help is used, time
spent, as well as the number and type of incorrect answers.
--- In short, I believe a student working with this personal tutor will
eliminate the comments of the students coming to you: "I spent hours
studying for this exam! I can't understand why I did so poorly." With a
personal tutor available for every student, the responsibility for success
falls back on the student. They will know what they have to do to succeed.
You can get some idea of how this works at my web site:
http://www.BizServe.com/c3 ---- Since I know this message may strike some
of you as too commercial, I do not plan to say anything more about it.
Possibly a press release before the ACS meeting - if that is o.k. with the
organizers. I would welcome your comments and suggestions. And again, my
apologies if I have strayed outside of what is acceptable in this
conference.
Bert Ramsay, Emeritus Professor of Chemistry, Eastern Michigan
University - and struggling entrepreneur at c3@BizServe.com
------------------
> 3. "I really understood the material, but I just froze up." Test
> anxiety. What do you do about these students? .....
> 4. "I really understood the material. I don't understand why I
> did so poorly." These students probably do not know what it means to
> understand the material at the college level.
--- I don't think it has much to do with the level of the material. It is
more related to a critical concept that was missed early on. Or perhaps not
quite enough practice, or learning through mistakes. How many times do
students look through the "Solutions Guide" first for confirmation that
they understand how they could solve a problem (in their head), rather than
demonstrating that they could do it on their own first?
------------------------------ Bert -----------
> They may benefit from a
> group format such as SI, but only if it is structured to require
> individual accountability.
--------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 12:07:07 -0500
From: cory d emal
Subject: Re: Paper 7 - RR: Tinkering with success
MIME-Version: 1.0
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>
> The timing of this paper is ideal for me. I am dissatisfied with
> my College's "peer tutoring" system. So, armed with a sign-up list of 15
> volunteers from last year's class, I had planned to spend the summer
> developing an alternative. Your SI program provides an ideal model.
>
> This seems to me to be an excellent first step in designing a
> program to optimize retention in General Chemistry. But not all students
> fail for the same reason. I think the largest number fail for any number
> of reasons related to working alone, such as hitting a roadblock, getting
> frustrated, and quitting. SI is an ideal format for helping these
> students.
You hit the nail right on the head. It is far to easy for students in
this situation to fall between the cracks and give up, all because of
a couple of frustrating instances.
>
> But I think there are other students who might be better served
> by, say, a "special topics" SI session, or a visit to the university's
> study skills office. With my typical professor's training (i.e., a Ph.D.
> in chemistry but absolutely no education courses), I still feel like an
> amateur in diagnosing specific student problems, but I would start by
> itemizing the following common syndromes. Others can probably add to this
> list.
>
> 1. "I was never any good at math." As if, with this fatalistic
> dismissal, they can get on with their lives and succeed in chemistry.
> These students need to address this problem. Have you considered a
> "special topics" SI session on math skills in chemistry?
Based on my four semesters of leading SI sessions, I can tell you that
sessions devoted to "study skills" fly about as well as a brick. Most
students (myself included) have convinced themselves that their study
skills are just fine and any problem must lie somewhere else - time
spent overtly on study skills is wasted because we aren't looking for
the real problem! After encountering this attitude in full force my
first semester leading SI sessions, I realized that I needed to
surreptitiously include study skills in the sessions so the students
wouldn't get too defensive. For example, drawing organizational
matrices on the board and remarking, "This is a good way to
organize your notes after class." I would try to do something along
these lines at least a couple of times per session. The point is, we
generally know what types of "study aids" and "study skills" are
available to us to use, but it's tough to initiate their use out of
context. A normal SI session provides this context and catalyzes their
use.
>
> 2. "I read the book but didn't get anything from it." These
> students are probably speed-reading. They don't know how to read a
> science or math text. Have you considered a special topics SI session
> that meets weekly to work through the text? (I think many humanities
> courses that deal with difficult primary texts actually do this in the
> lecture part of the course.)
A great book that deals with all of the problems that students face
that you raise is "How to Survive and Even Excel in General Chemistry"
by Elizabeth Kean and Cathy Middlecamp, published by Mc Graw-Hill. We
make this book available to our students, both as an optional purchase
at the bookstore and for checkout in our General Chemistry Resource
Room. We have found that this helps many students each semester
realize that studying chemistry is not impossible and is not written
in a foreign language.
>
> 3. "I really understood the material, but I just froze up." Test
> anxiety. What do you do about these students? Study skills center?
Test taking skills are about the only study skills that we have spent
time on without boredom setting in on the students part. Generally I
have spent one or two sessions early in the semester going over test
taking strategies - how to identify major topics, how to anticipate
test questions (Side note:this is where having UNDERGRADUATE leaders
is very beneficial. Undergrads have been through the same courses that
they are leading and are much more familiar with the tendencies of
specific professors in testing situations than are grad students.) how
to organize a "formula card", if available, etc. I have revisted the
topic at length later in the semester if there is interest shown.
Unfortunately, sending students to the study skills center is no
longer an option here at UNL, as the powers that be decided we didn't
really need our Academic Success Center all that much, at least not
when there are "green spaces" to be put in and parking garages to be
erected.
>
> 4. "I really understood the material. I don't understand why I
> did so poorly." These students probably do not know what it means to
> understand the material at the college level. They may benefit from a
> group format such as SI, but only if it is structured to require
> individual accountability. It sounds like you've tried to do that. Do
> you find that you don't get this excuse as much?
I haven't heard this excuse a lot, but you're right, most students
I've heard it from are first or second semester students just now
facing the realities of college work.
>
> Have you considered adding "second order corrections" such as
> these to the SI program in an attempt to maximize retention? Or, since
> your stated goal is more modest -- "SI is meant to help students achieve a
> satisfactory level of comfort in the class before facing the major
> stresses of research papers and exams, while sustaining and adding to this
> level as the semester progresses" -- would you be disinclined to tinker
> with success?
At this point we are not inclined to make any real changes to our
stated goal, although we are trying to improve the program with each
semester. With increased funding we hope to first spread the SI
program to uncovered sections of gen chem, then embark on new
programs to hopefully pick up the students that SI and all of the
other support programs that we have in place are missing.
Thanks for your questions!
Cory Emal
University of Nebraska-Lincoln
cemal@unlgrad1.unl.edu
>
> -- Robert Richman (richman@msmary.edu)
> Mount St. Mary's College
> Emmitsburg, MD
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 12:21:21 -0500
From: cory d emal
Subject: Re: Paper 7 - LR : SI Programs
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text
>
> Paul Kelter wrote (in response to my earlier questions):
>
> > Also, we really do not want too many
> > students taking the thing! Interaction is the key.
> >
> Well, I suppose it's a matter of balance, and if you had more
> students wanting to use the program, you would find a way to get more
> SIs to keep the interaction high.
> Our problem at ISU is that not enough of the students who should
> be using the SI program are doing so.
> An alternate way of providing extra help to GenChem students is
> to allow/require them to enroll in a preparatory course given as
> a prerequisite, or a course (often < 3 cr) that runs concurrently
> with GenChem. [This is currently a thread in Chemed-l.] Have you
> given any thought to the compartive ad/disadvantages of the two
> approaches? Do you think there are things that can distinctly be
> accomplished by one approach compared to the other? (Hard questions,
> I know. But I'm hoping that you or other people on the list have
> more experience than we do with these matters, and can provide some
> guidance.)
>
> Larry Rosenhein
> Indiana State University (Terre Haute)
> chrosen@scifac.indstate.edu
>
Here at UNL (as, I'm sure, many other schools) we have a clear pecking
order at to which classes get funded/teachers.
1) Graduate courses
2) Honors courses (this is on the rise here)
3) Mainstream courses
4) Remedial courses
While Dr. Kelter and I agree that lower level intro or prep courses
are desireable and necessary, the financial reality is that a "Chem
099" would not get the support that it would need for it to be
effective. This underscores the importance for programs that can reach
everyone, such as SI, and for (and this is the certified high school
teacher in me speaking) better preparation for our incoming students
in ALL subjects, not just the sciences.
Thanks for the responses!
Cory Emal
University of Nebraska-Lincoln
cemal@unlgrad1.unl.edu
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 12:22:21 -0700
From: Doris Kimbrough
Subject: Re: Paper 7 - RR: Tinkering with success
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> 3. "I really understood the material, but I just froze up." Test
>> anxiety. What do you do about these students? Study skills center?
>
>Test taking skills are about the only study skills that we have spent
>time on without boredom setting in on the students part. Generally I
>have spent one or two sessions early in the semester going over test
>taking strategies - how to identify major topics, how to anticipate
>test questions (Side note:this is where having UNDERGRADUATE leaders
>is very beneficial. Undergrads have been through the same courses that
>they are leading and are much more familiar with the tendencies of
>specific professors in testing situations than are grad students.) how
>to organize a "formula card", if available, etc. I have revisted the
>topic at length later in the semester if there is interest shown.
I think these are all excellent approaches. I have also found that by
allowing a student to take the exam away from the rest of the class (in an
empty office, laboratory, etc. an hour or two or even a day early) really
helps some students. Just being in the lecture hall is stressful and
overwhelming, and having a quiet, private place can have a very calming
effect. Often after a few successful exams, they are confident enough to
rejoin the rest of the class.
Doris
Doris R. Kimbrough
Chemistry Department Box 194
University of Colorado at Denver
Denver, CO 80217-3364
dkimbrough@castle.cudenver.edu
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 16:50:57 CST
From: Anne T Sherren
Subject: Re: Iota Sigma Pi
If you send me an address, I will be happy to provide information on
Iota Sigma Pi.
Anne Sherren, ats@noctrl.edu
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Iota Sigma Pi
Author: pmabrouk@lynx.dac.neu.edu at internet
Date: 7/3/97 8:02 AM
Concerning Iota Sigma Pi, for further information contact:
The National Historian
Dr. Anne Sherren
Department of Chemistry
North Central College
P.O. Box 3063
Naperville, IL 60566-7063
(708)420-3491
fax: 708-420-4234
e-mIl: ATS@nccseq.noctrl.edu
You may also contact:
Sr. Frances Crean
Saint Xavier University
3700 West 103rd Street
Chicago, IL 60655
(312)298-3517
fax: 312-298-3517
Prof. Patricia Ann Mabrouk
Department of Chemistry
111 Hurtig Hall
Northeastern University
Boston, MA 02115
617-373-2845
fax: 617-373-8795
pmabrouk@lynx.neu.edu
--------------------------------