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As an aside, I stopped hearing how great ethanol is. I wonder why? Gas is $3.15 a gallon and the media isn't making a big deal about the greedy oil companies and their insane profits. I wonder why? Is it because their man (a democrat) is in the WH now and they don't need to make waves in order to get a republican out?

Although it looks like they are getting a bit more sneaky with it! Stopped at a COSTCO to refuel a week ago and noticed that their pumps were sporting a brand new little label stating that their gas was now 10% etoh!! No other signage or warning anywhere else. Talking to the station manager, he said the ptb want them to up the content to 15% by the end of summer.

It was useful feature to people who tow regularly or people that needed to manuver in tight spaces. It let you turn your vehicle in much tighter spaces than you could with a regular steering system. The problem was it was expensive when it was introduced (about $5,600), so it didnít catch on enough to make it profitable for GM. The funny thing is everyone I talked to that had one, loved it. Many railroads liked it because it let them manuver full-size trucks in tight rail yards. Nothing has come to replace it yet, but that doesnít mean it wasnít a good idea.

Originally Posted by sandyg

Two more GM "reversals" were their trend toward digital IP displays in the mid-80s that went the way of the dinosaur and the "heads up" display that projected onto the windshield (never take your eyes off the road again!).

I am not sure what the digital IP displays are you are talking about, but a lot of technology has come and gone since the 80s. Heads Up Display is still available some GM models. In fact, GM is working on a more sophisticated system to be introduced in the future.

Originally Posted by sandyg

The IC engine isn't going away anytime soon. The refueling infrastructure is in place and it's still a dirt cheap energy source. Electric vehicles have "hidden" pollution and toxin and net energy use issues (the energy cost to make the batteries and motors). It's not the panacea many greenies wish it to be.

No one is saying the IC motor is doomed anytime soon, but it is going to be used less going forward. As I previously stated, electric vehicles are not meant to be an ultimate solution.

In case you hadnít noticed, every car with an IC engine has a battery too, so we are already producing those ďhiddenĒ pollutions and toxins, and we seem to be dealing with them. And, IC engines are not made in a vacuum. There are energy costs to make those motors as well.

Originally Posted by sandyg

As an aside, I stopped hearing how great ethanol is. I wonder why? Gas is $3.15 a gallon and the media isn't making a big deal about the greedy oil companies and their insane profits. I wonder why? Is it because their man (a democrat) is in the WH now and they don't need to make waves in order to get a republican out?

Large oil companies and their supporters waged a pretty successful negative propaganda campaign against E85, so many of those that supported it have gone quiet. However, E85 is still around. I just fill up with a tank of it Friday. But that is a prime example of how fickle the American consumer is. They say they want to reduce dependency on foreign oil, yet they wonít use a product that reduces oil consumption by almost 85% because it doesnít burn as efficiently as gas, and they are afraid they might end up spending a little more money.

how long is the batteries waranty for and how much do they cost to replace?

The battery and its electrical powertrain components of the Volt are warranted for 8 years/100,000 miles. I have not heard how much the batteries cost to replace, but I'm sure they are pretty expensive. They will probably get cheaper as more are built, and be considerably cheaper by the time you have to replace one.

If the last cold snap wasn't enough to make anyone buying an electric car wary, especially if they lived anywhere north of the equator, then I say...HAVE AT IT, YOU IMBECILES.

What has yet to be even 'thought about' by the greenies is along the lines of the drop in smokers and the lost tax revenue. For some time now, the tobacco nazis have been putting a stop to all forms of tobacco use, and the states no longer reap all that $$$$ from the 'filthy' smokers.

Just think of the taxes various states will lose when there are no more 'gas' stations to gouge the drivers driving those unclean filthy gasaholic mosheens. Has anyone considered the ramifications of the gazillions of dollars raised with each gallon pumped by those nasty guzzlers?

I can hear the lefties now...whining and moaning about how unfair big oil was, as they took their product and ran, and didn't consider how badly it would affect all the environmental whackos and their ilk.

WAKE UP AMERICA. THE LOSERS ARE IN THE PROCESS OF KILLING A ONCE GREAT NATION, AND YOU LINGUINI-SPINED SOCIALISTS ARE NOTHING BUT A BATCH OF SHEEP, ALLOWING IT ALL TO HAPPEN.

UB

When the one you love becomes a memory, that memory becomes a treasure.

I recently sold a vw Jetta 5 speed diesel. 50mpg every tank. $20,000 car. I bought it when I had to do a 60 mile commute every day. I no longer do that. I'll tell you though, for the price, low maintenance and dependability, it was tough to beat.

I'm not sure what year your VW was. I had heard you could get 50 mpg, but they don't get that kind of mileage on their new models. Even the Golf diesel is only rated at 42 mpg hwy. Perhaps the reduction in mileage is caused by emissions equipment and requirements.

If the last cold snap wasn't enough to make anyone buying an electric car wary, especially if they lived anywhere north of the equator, then I say...HAVE AT IT, YOU IMBECILES.

What has yet to be even 'thought about' by the greenies is along the lines of the drop in smokers and the lost tax revenue. For some time now, the tobacco nazis have been putting a stop to all forms of tobacco use, and the states no longer reap all that $$$$ from the 'filthy' smokers.

Just think of the taxes various states will lose when there are no more 'gas' stations to gouge the drivers driving those unclean filthy gasaholic mosheens. Has anyone considered the ramifications of the gazillions of dollars raised with each gallon pumped by those nasty guzzlers?

I can hear the lefties now...whining and moaning about how unfair big oil was, as they took their product and ran, and didn't consider how badly it would affect all the environmental whackos and their ilk.

WAKE UP AMERICA. THE LOSERS ARE IN THE PROCESS OF KILLING A ONCE GREAT NATION, AND YOU LINGUINI-SPINED SOCIALISTS ARE NOTHING BUT A BATCH OF SHEEP, ALLOWING IT ALL TO HAPPEN.

UB

I drove the Volt in 10 degree weather in Chicago, and the cold wasn't a problem. I drove about 60 miles all total, and burned less than a gallon of gas. Maybe it's not as imbecilic as you think.

I thought you were against taxation and big government. Now you are defending taxation and worried about not collecting enough taxes?

Blackstone, please don't talk down to me ("In case you hadnít noticed, every car with an IC engine has a battery too").
I started my career with Pontiac Motors in 1982 and I've been in the automotive field ever since. I have a masters in mechanical engineering and I'm a professional engineer so I know a little bit about which I speak.
You say you work for GM so of course you love the Volt! I haven't met a GM employee yet who doesn't. The hype in Detroit was incredible over the Volt. All I can say is that if the public was clamoring for it (other than those who have to have it first for bragging rights) the government wouldn't have to use my tax dollars to subsidize it.
I have a Chevy Impala that can use E85 and I will never put it in my car. I have a real problem with an industry that uses two gallons of fuel to get one gallon of corn oil to the pump. Corn is for eating and making bourbon, NOT burning up in an IC engine when there's perfectly good crude to be refined.

I drove the Volt in 10 degree weather in Chicago, and the cold wasn't a problem. I drove about 60 miles all total, and burned less than a gallon of gas. Maybe it's not as imbecilic as you think.

I thought you were against taxation and big government. Now you are defending taxation and worried about not collecting enough taxes?

I can hardly wait for the "imbecile" in a volt to become stranded like the family that spent 3 days in their gas burning vehicle. They survived because they judiciously ran the heater in spurts, starting and stopping the engine.

How long would you last in your "VOLT" Mr Blackstone?

Face it, your 'pride and joy' is just a motor vehicle tinker toy, designed primarily for the nearby worker to jog back and forth in. It's another version of the pregnant rollar skate we've seen for years, only this time it's dangerous because the GREENIES are making it happen at the expense of what this nation really needs.

As to your last "imbecillic" comment, you have again missed the point...that being you environmental jerks push for all this feel good crap, assuring your fellow airheads that what you are accomplishing is all good and necessary. But when they find out, as that Obama teen mama did, when Obama didn't pay for her gasoline, or her baby's clothing, and she was heart broken.

My concern about the loss of taxation revenue should you environmentalists take over the country, is you don't even think about it. You are too damned ignorant to face reality and recognize the fallout and disasters that occur because of your do-gooder policies. And when the crap hits the fan, do you expect to pick up the mess? Hell no, you are off promoting the next environmental joke to prop up your egos.

Every time your crowd dreams up some new era save-the-nation-idea, we taxpayers can expect to drop our drawers and bend over. When the gas taxes fall below what states can live with, do they look to the environmental whackos to compensate for the difference? Nope. It's time to pass another hike in real estate taxes, or sales taxes, so we make sure those union pension funds are paid, and those pie-in-the-sky promises are kept.

When you see the federal unionists marching because many of their pensions and jobs are being cut, think they are going after the legislatures that put a kybosh on smoking in their state, causing that revenue source to drop by several millions. Hellsbells, many of those marchers are smoking. Do they lobby their representative to stop with the new laws? Nope, they just go across state lines and buy cartons by the case because that state hasn't raised their taxes $2 bucks a pack ...yet.

As I've stated many times, it always depends on who's ox is being gored.

When the gas tax revenues are way down, will the Volt drivers pony up extra, so the roads can be cleared of snow???...or repaired by the underpaid union fed worker, who's now so overworked because all his buddies have been layed off due to budget constraints?

Actions have consequences, Mr. Blackstone. The environmental movement has pretty much wiped out the timber industry in this nation. It's working hard on the auto industry and mining industry, and oil industry.

Your sacrificial lamb of an electric car is a joke, and we all know it. It ranks right up there with windmill electricity, and solar panels. If it was all so importantly wonderful, why doesn't it become the way of life the liberals are craving? And please don't annoy me with that teacher's union tripe of needing more money. Doesn't matter how much is thrown down that empty hole, it will never be enough.

In fact it's time to see how much less this socialistic experiment can do without. After all, the other nations attempting this experiment are having to go through it also, and they are finding out the PC crowd has led them down the path to ruin. Time for a huge change. Hope you didn't buy into the last one.

UB

When the one you love becomes a memory, that memory becomes a treasure.

Blackstone, please don't talk down to me ("In case you hadnít noticed, every car with an IC engine has a battery too").
I started my career with Pontiac Motors in 1982 and I've been in the automotive field ever since. I have a masters in mechanical engineering and I'm a professional engineer so I know a little bit about which I speak.
You say you work for GM so of course you love the Volt! I haven't met a GM employee yet who doesn't. The hype in Detroit was incredible over the Volt. All I can say is that if the public was clamoring for it (other than those who have to have it first for bragging rights) the government wouldn't have to use my tax dollars to subsidize it.
I have a Chevy Impala that can use E85 and I will never put it in my car. I have a real problem with an industry that uses two gallons of fuel to get one gallon of corn oil to the pump. Corn is for eating and making bourbon, NOT burning up in an IC engine when there's perfectly good crude to be refined.

I apologize if you took my tone to be condescending. I just found it ironic that you continued to harp on the hidden costs, pollutants and toxin created by the production of electric engines and batteries, but failed to acknowledge that the production of IC engines and cars produce their own hidden costs, pollutants and toxins. I donít know if electric vehicles produce more, but if you want to compare apples to apples, you have to compare both vehicles equally.

I never said I loved the Volt. I think it is a very interesting vehicle, and a first step in the right direction to reducing dependence on oil (forgien and domestic). However, I do not plan to buy one. It doesnít fit my lifestyle. But, like I said, if they can build similar technology into a full-size SUV or full-size pickup, Iíll be in line to get one.

Is the government subsidizing electric vehicles with your tax dollars, or giving buyers a tax credit? There is a difference.

I'm not sure what year your VW was. I had heard you could get 50 mpg, but they don't get that kind of mileage on their new models. Even the Golf diesel is only rated at 42 mpg hwy. Perhaps the reduction in mileage is caused by emissions equipment and requirements.