PacificaFitz:It's pretty easy to see why the government is trying so hard to stop innocent poker games from happening. Money is changing hands and they aren't getting their "rake"/taxes on it.

I know, when me and some of my friends get together for a poker game. The buy in is *gasp* typically $20, sometimes.....rarely we'll go up to *dear lord* $50 buy in. Just think of all the clerks the IRS will need to hire, not only are my poker get togethers saving the country with tax moneys, but also creating jobs. When I'm not being shot at by swat teams of coarse.

wide_eyed:As much as I support cops in general, I truly hope the ones who do this sort of thing get what they deserve. Their fellow cops need to stop covering up for them and supporting them when they f*ck up.

THIS.

I have always believed that "bad apples bring everybody down" and that "good" cops (or firefighters, or teachers, or whatever-profession) have a moral and professional obligation NOT to support the bad-among-them (and every profession has its miscreants). But by clinging to "no-snitch" mantras and defending bad cops simply because they're cops, they're doing themselves a disservice in the long run.

And we're seeing the results right here -- in the ever-growing public mistrust of what used to be unimpeachable professions.

LeroyBourne:PacificaFitz: It's pretty easy to see why the government is trying so hard to stop innocent poker games from happening. Money is changing hands and they aren't getting their "rake"/taxes on it.

I know, when me and some of my friends get together for a poker game. The buy in is *gasp* typically $20, sometimes.....rarely we'll go up to *dear lord* $50 buy in. Just think of all the clerks the IRS will need to hire, not only are my poker get togethers saving the country with tax moneys, but also creating jobs. When I'm not being shot at by swat teams of coarse.

That's about how our poker night went. And the big winner of the night had to buy the snacks on the next poker night.

LeroyBourne:PacificaFitz: It's pretty easy to see why the government is trying so hard to stop innocent poker games from happening. Money is changing hands and they aren't getting their "rake"/taxes on it.

I know, when me and some of my friends get together for a poker game. The buy in is *gasp* typically $20, sometimes.....rarely we'll go up to *dear lord* $50 buy in. Just think of all the clerks the IRS will need to hire, not only are my poker get togethers saving the country with tax moneys, but also creating jobs. When I'm not being shot at by swat teams of coarse.

You're the enemy of everything that America stands for! Not really. Unless you play those floofy pseudo-poker games with a dozen wild cards. Then I stand by my assertion!

/I doubt it, though//Few people want to play those when money is on the line

Nobody is going to care enough to take effective action until we elect a Republican president. The closest we'll get to taking action will be telling people they are risking their lives making casual bets among friends and co-workers. Any further investigation will be branded conspiracy theory, and probably racist too.

I recognize this won't be a popular viewpoint, but until cops are paid better -- which would allow cities the luxury of NOT having to employ every other malcontent bully who fills out an application form, but instead hire the better men and women out there who would be seeking that better salary -- then this trend will continue.

If you gotta have a warm body out there, some places will cut corners, and that includes hiring men and women who are only 60 percent ethical, rather than 99 percent ethical.

((The above also applies to teachers, in my opinion. If I won a 200 million dollar lottery, I'd fund a school system with $80,000-a-year elementary-school teachers just to see what happens.))

OgreMagi:LeroyBourne: PacificaFitz: It's pretty easy to see why the government is trying so hard to stop innocent poker games from happening. Money is changing hands and they aren't getting their "rake"/taxes on it.

I know, when me and some of my friends get together for a poker game. The buy in is *gasp* typically $20, sometimes.....rarely we'll go up to *dear lord* $50 buy in. Just think of all the clerks the IRS will need to hire, not only are my poker get togethers saving the country with tax moneys, but also creating jobs. When I'm not being shot at by swat teams of coarse.

That's about how our poker night went. And the big winner of the night had to buy the snacks on the next poker night.

Do you have that 'one' guy, you know the one who biatches and moans when he loses and wants his money back, then you have to calmly explain the definition of gambling to him? He's a nice guy, he just gets stupid everyonceinawhile.

Tatterdemalian:Nobody is going to care enough to take effective action until we elect a Republican president. The closest we'll get to taking action will be telling people they are risking their lives making casual bets among friends and co-workers. Any further investigation will be branded conspiracy theory, and probably racist too.

/so vote Republican//your freedom actually does depend on it

I watched Dick Cheney phone into Fox News to lend support to President Obama in the Snowden affair. It was like I got sucked into an episode of the Twilight Zone.

LeroyBourne:OgreMagi: LeroyBourne: PacificaFitz: It's pretty easy to see why the government is trying so hard to stop innocent poker games from happening. Money is changing hands and they aren't getting their "rake"/taxes on it.

I know, when me and some of my friends get together for a poker game. The buy in is *gasp* typically $20, sometimes.....rarely we'll go up to *dear lord* $50 buy in. Just think of all the clerks the IRS will need to hire, not only are my poker get togethers saving the country with tax moneys, but also creating jobs. When I'm not being shot at by swat teams of coarse.

That's about how our poker night went. And the big winner of the night had to buy the snacks on the next poker night.

Do you have that 'one' guy, you know the one who biatches and moans when he loses and wants his money back, then you have to calmly explain the definition of gambling to him? He's a nice guy, he just gets stupid everyonceinawhile.

It would have been a better novel if the main characters didn't keep getting either a) shot, or b) arrested. I'm also not that interested in poker so I just put it down about halfway through.If your local police force has nothing better to do than SWAT raid poker games you have given them too much money and personnel. Also you might want to divert some of those funds to psych evaluations for the remaining officers.

No knock raids are a simple way to setup the violence that is claimed they are trying ti prevent.

Reality is the armed and dangerous people are far more likely to give up if they know they have already lost. Statistically speaking I'm sure 90% of raids with 20 or more dudes armed tothe teeth show up to the door tell you that you lose I'm sure it's all over but the shouting.

Burst in the door unannounced and catch a violent criminal off guard what does he know it could be hommie down the way or cartel hitmen or biker enforcers comming to end him fark yeah the idiot is gonna start shooting.

I'm saying this full well knowing thats what the cops would do.... Damn I would wouldnt you?

Put people in those shoot or its your ass positions and that's what they will do.

I work early in the morning in a big building about 4 blocks away from q pretty massive police station so I see half the tactidal squad in full gear getting coffee at the same place I do and I cant help but laugh when I see them thinking damn someone is about to have a really bad day.

I always hope it's not like te other week when at 5 am they kick down some ladies door whither her 2 kids in bed pointing machine guns at her screaming in a language she barely understands while her husband is out driving cab ti support them anyway he can

They're statists whose politics are irrelevant to the problem at hand, the dismissal of these tactics by partisan lemmings like you, something the author went to great pains to highlight if you had bothered reading the whole article. Part of the problem is exactly what you're doing, ascribing a certain political ideology to these horrible abuses in order to insulate your own.

spentshells:Burst in the door unannounced and catch a violent criminal off guard what does he know it could be hommie down the way or cartel hitmen or biker enforcers comming to end him fark yeah the idiot is gonna start shooting.

now if only they were only doing this with people who were actually armed

HempHead:I watched Dick Cheney phone into Fox News to lend support to President Obama in the Snowden affair. It was like I got sucked into an episode of the Twilight Zone.

That's because you and reality have a long-distance relationship, and you haven't even texted it since weed went legal.

/Cheney would try to do the same Obama is doing//but the non-Fox media hates him, and they're the real power in the USA, so they'd pitch a big enough fit to make him behave///just like they did with Bush in Iraq, which is one of the reasons it didn't turn into the clusterfark Egypt turned into

raerae1980:nmemkha: Fiction Fan: It doesn't matter. Americans have no qualms about living in a police state so long as they can maintain the illusion they are "free".

Tragically, the illusion is wearing thin these days, but never underestimate an American's ability to be a self-delusional apologetic hypocrite.

[generatormeme.com image 600x450]

Like I said, it doesn't matter. Does anyone really think the militarization of America's police and the increase use of unwarranted naked aggression by same is going to abate by people be outraged on the internet?

So, what are you gonna do? What can we do?

Start burning and looting baby. We outnumber the cops, somebody should figure out a way to turn that into a tactical advantage.

Huck And Molly Ziegler:I recognize this won't be a popular viewpoint, but until cops are paid better -- which would allow cities the luxury of NOT having to employ every other malcontent bully who fills out an application form, but instead hire the better men and women out there who would be seeking that better salary -- then this trend will continue.

If you gotta have a warm body out there, some places will cut corners, and that includes hiring men and women who are only 60 percent ethical, rather than 99 percent ethical.

((The above also applies to teachers, in my opinion. If I won a 200 million dollar lottery, I'd fund a school system with $80,000-a-year elementary-school teachers just to see what happens.))

????????

They seem pretty well paid in my State. ( esp. compared to other "working class" people around here.)

When you have a nation driven to the point of fearing bottles of shampoo and all other nonsense they can imagine, you're going to have a terrified police force prone to overreacting.

In the cops' brains, they genuinely believe that this abuse of force is simply erring on the side of caution. To them, the next car they pull over will be the one carrying the nuke. The barking dog is the distraction the desperate dealer needs to put a bullet in their heads.

We like to think that cops are brave, but they are just as scared as every other American. Unfortunately, they have resources that most Americans don't.

Fark It:Kozmopoliskepticalopsis: I'll bet a large percentage of cops are right-wing lunatics of one sort or another.

They're statists whose politics are irrelevant to the problem at hand, the dismissal of these tactics by partisan lemmings like you, something the author went to great pains to highlight if you had bothered reading the whole article. Part of the problem is exactly what you're doing, ascribing a certain political ideology to these horrible abuses in order to insulate your own.

I did read the article and your objections to my comments are irrelevant.

Anyone who worships guns, order, compliance, power and authority is a right-wing lunatic in my book. If they wear uniforms, even more so.

Empty H:Let me see if I understand this. Some off duty cop overheard some friends betting a few bucks on a sports game. This off duty cop takes it upon himself to spend the next few months working the guy to get him to bet more and more. The cop works him up to the legal amount that can be punishable, goes to arrest him, then shoots him and blames it on not having enough sleep.

Was there seriously nothing he could have spent those months doing that would have been more productive?

What?

Like investigate crimes that have already taken place?

You watch too much TV. That would mean expecting a cop to do the job he was hired to do.

WhyteRaven74:spentshells: Burst in the door unannounced and catch a violent criminal off guard what does he know it could be hommie down the way or cartel hitmen or biker enforcers comming to end him fark yeah the idiot is gonna start shooting.

now if only they were only doing this with people who were actually armed

What's farked up is when they bust into the wrong house (As in not the one they intended) and the homeowner shoots and kills an officer repelling the home invasion. If the homeowner is not outright murdered by the police, he's still going to jail for killing a cop, when in reality he was in the right under Castle Doctrine. Police or not, they entered his home without permission, warning, or cause (Warrant's not gonna cover the wrong address, will it?)

nmemkha:Tatterdemalian: Psycoholic_Slag: Start burning and looting baby. We outnumber the cops, somebody should figure out a way to turn that into a tactical advantage.

We already know all the ways to turn that into a tactical advantage. Every single one of them would make us as bad as the cops, and probably worse, with the leaders we put into power the worst of all.

/literally by the very standards that required the revolution in the first place//that's the price you pay when you base your revolution on opinions and beliefs instead of facts and rational thought

The twist is that by the time the enough justification for said revolution arrives to get the proles off their asses, the power to execute it successfully is usually complete gone.

To paraphrase a certain princess, this is how freedom dies.

Depends on whether you mean rational or emotional justification, and whether "success" means "successfully destroying the old government" or "successfully replacing it with something that meets the revolution's moral standards, instead of making a mockery of them." Using emotional justification to successfully destroy the old government has a long history of resounding success, all throughout the 19th and 20th centuries from the French Revolution onward, and is quite possibly the only way to overthrow a government that even allows the illusion of democratic process. Rational justification, on the other hand, is quite a bit more hit-and-miss, but when it does succeed, like the American Revolution, the results are pretty goddamn amazing.

Empty H:Let me see if I understand this. Some off duty cop overheard some friends betting a few bucks on a sports game. This off duty cop takes it upon himself to spend the next few months working the guy to get him to bet more and more. The cop works him up to the legal amount that can be punishable, goes to arrest him, then shoots him and blames it on not having enough sleep.

Was there seriously nothing he could have spent those months doing that would have been more productive?

From reading the article, it would seem that we've already been living in a police state. Intentional or unintentional execution by a law enforcement officer without the benefit of a trial is a bit disturbing and entirely unacceptable. Especially when the alleged "crimes" were not even crimes!