1) Relief that Kyle was fine after the crash. Honestly, working as an Emergency and Trauma Physician, I was expecting a much worse outcome. Kyle, sorry I hugged you after you got out of the car!2) Appreciation to the Motorsport Team, Medical Team and track support. I was very surprised to be able to get back on the track the same day.3) Thanks to the two M4 drivers in front of me who ran immediately to Kyle's aid with extinguishers in hand.

1) Relief that Kyle was fine after the crash. Honestly, working as an Emergency and Trauma Physician, I was expecting a much worse outcome. Kyle, sorry I hugged you after you got out of the car!2) Appreciation to the Motorsport Team, Medical Team and track support. I was very surprised to be able to get back on the track the same day.3) Thanks to the two M4 drivers in front of me who ran immediately to Kyle's aid with extinguishers in hand.

Rohan

Hear hear Rohan, very well said indeed

PS. I'm tipping Kyle couldn't have given a stuff about being hugged by another grown man at that point in time!

Cheers boys. Yes I was very lucky indeed (and enjoyed the hug ). The guys that ran over to get me out of the car I cant thank enough!

If I had my time again I would go a 6 point cage from the start. However, I will say it was my half cage, 6 point harness, Velo fixed back seat & Hans and helmet that saved me from time in hospital Or worse

I'd actually like to take this opportunity to make something very clear..... My accident was some type of mechanical failure with my brakes (of which I doubt I'll ever find out 100% what it was). I went to press the brake pedal at the end of the straight and the car basically locked me out, brake pedal was rock hard and I proceeded to go straight into the gravel at over 200kmshr. I was not over driving my car, I did not do anything I haven't done at Sandown for the entire time I've been racing.....

I say this for no other reason than wanting to make it VERY clear that this can happen to ANYONE!! Please if you are reading this and you participate in our track days WITHOUT a HANS device (and compatible helmet), a good 4/6 point harness & if possible a roll cage please make it/them your next investment/mod! I left the track at around the 206kmshr mark, rolled at least twice, bounced over the tyre barriers and hit the outside retaining wall which has completely killed my car. However because of the safety device decisions/investments I'd made very early on was home to kiss my 2 boys good night by 6:30pm. The stuff works go and make an investment in yourself, for you and your family.

Now having said all of that the hunt is on for the next car! I'll be back.

"I say this for no other reason than wanting to make it VERY clear that this can happen to ANYONE!! Please if you are reading this and you participate in our track days WITHOUT a HANS device (and compatible helmet), a good 4/6 point harness & if possible a roll cage please make it/them your next investment/mod! "

Buy your HANS Device now, CAMS did have a special.Now the compulsory use of HANS devices is coming down the levels of motorsport.It is only a matter of time, before they are at Club Level. It will be soon, apart from personal experience stories like this, the data is irrefutable. The only thing slowing that down is CAMS are mindfull of not increasing the cost of people starting at grassroots motosport.

I've been in contact with CAMS since my little bingle back in June and have been trying to understand why they aren't forcing safety onto the track owners as they do for us car owners. We can put all the safety gear into our cars and we can drive sensibly and so on but that's not going stop the stacks from happening, it's racing and they will happen and I think we're at a point where local tracks need to account for worst case scenarios (brake fail on main straight) and provide 1st and 2nd line of safety. Unfortunately Australian tracks (except PI and prolly Sydney MSP) are so far behind in terms of safety it's not funny and someone sooner than later won't be as lucky as Kyle or myself.

The funny thing is that several tracks seem to have a higher level of safety that in the Track Safety manual.http://docs.cams.com.au/Public%20Docume ... 130612.pdfIn theory the kitty litter at Turn 1 Sandown should have stopped the car, it might have packed down a bit and needs a stir up. Though it did flip him when he turned.

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Last edited by Pleiades on Wed Nov 09, 2016 12:38 pm, edited 2 times in total.

There are alot of should haves and could haves and I absolutely did not do everything correctly but if the car is not touching the ground enough to make an impression on the gravel I dare say it is not slowing you down...... Where I went off the track the ground looked as though it slightly dipped down then started to rise into the gravel. This appears to have unweighted the car and it travelled a good 20 (possibly more) meters into the gravel with out wiping any speed off. Infact Id say, due to the car being unweighted and therefore basically having no rolling risistance I may well have speed up....

Now why did that post twice, Can someone delete oneAny how, nice to see you are alright.I had a look at that trap on Tuesday after your adventure and over last weekend, it does seem to have compacted a bit!I wonder if stirring it up needs to be added to track safety rules.

I remember seeing the slightest of marks in the gravel. However when Ive been watching the vid I'm sideways very early in the gravel and I dont recall seeing marks that looked like that... So possibly the rear wasnt touching. Anyways, Id prefer to know what happened back at the 120m mark when my pedal wasnt moving.... Unfortunately I doubt I ever will.

Pleiades wrote:The funny thing is that several tracks seem to have a higher level of safety that in the manual.http://docs.cams.com.au/Public%20Docume ... 130612.pdfIn theory the kitty litter at Turn 1 Sandown should have stopped the car, it might have packed down a bit and needs a stir up. Though it did flip him when he turned.

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If CAMs know that gravel traps don't stop a car then they need 5-10 meters of layered tyres or another solution that protects drivers, it's 2016 so I'm sure a engineer can figure something out that works.

The fact is this has happened before in QLD only 3 years ago. The wall was around 79m from the track yet CAMs know that failed to stop the car and a death occurred. At Sandown the wall is around 72 meters from the track.

PI main straight on the other hand has a 55 meter of run off asphalt, 85 meters of gravel and then another 30 meters of asphalt and then 25 meters to a tyre wall - that's 200 meters of run off to sort your car out. FACT is at PI we hit 250+ kph in the main straight, at Sandown we hit 240+ kph... so why is the safety so chalk and cheese? It's simply not acceptable and needs to change before someone loses their life. What happened to Kyle and I could happen to any car and if that car happens to be one with a std seat belt and no cage.....

I ordered a 6 point cage with door bars after the PI round, $1720 is cheap insurance plus it'll look cool..lol. There was a seven week wait so it should be here soon.Now I need a seat and HANS device.Glad to see no one was hurt in the incident and the safety gear did what it was meant to do.

Pleiades wrote:The funny thing is that several tracks seem to have a higher level of safety that in the manual.http://docs.cams.com.au/Public%20Docume ... 130612.pdfIn theory the kitty litter at Turn 1 Sandown should have stopped the car, it might have packed down a bit and needs a stir up. Though it did flip him when he turned.

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If CAMs know that gravel traps don't stop a car then they need 5-10 meters of layered tyres or another solution that protects drivers, it's 2016 so I'm sure a engineer can figure something out that works.

The fact is this has happened before in QLD only 3 years ago. The wall was around 79m from the track yet CAMs know that failed to stop the car and a death occurred. At Sandown the wall is around 72 meters from the track.

PI main straight on the other hand has a 55 meter of run off asphalt, 85 meters of gravel and then another 30 meters of asphalt and then 25 meters to a tyre wall - that's 200 meters of run off to sort your car out. FACT is at PI we hit 250+ kph in the main straight, at Sandown we hit 240+ kph... so why is the safety so chalk and cheese? It's simply not acceptable and needs to change before someone loses their life. What happened to Kyle and I could happen to any car and if that car happens to be one with a std seat belt and no cage.....

I don't think that some people at CAMS know that Gravel traps need stirring up [FLUSHED FACE].

I wonder if the ecu can be interrogated to see if it knows what happened.

PI is interesting, in that they made changes to turn one after a car went straight across and ended up at turn 3 just missing a car. Well known driver as well, he came to WRX Club soon after for a chat. He retired to running a Tyre business for a while.So they put in a barrier.Bike GP objected as tyres would kill bike rider.They took them out.So a bike rider went straight across and died.

The thing is also PI you might max out at 250, but others go above 300.The problem is not hitting wall, its hitting other vehicle.

Also cages are not cages, you need to make sure that it isnt made from gas pipe [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]

I've had a 6pt bolt in cage sitting in the shed since middle of the year, wasn't sure whether to sell or install as my car is basically standard compared to some others out there. After reading this I think I'll get it put in. Gets very minimal daily use so I can put up with it I think. For those asking where to get them, mine is from AGI in Sydney. Comes with CAMS paperwork just need to take photos of it installed and send it in apparently.

neptune11 wrote:May I ask Kurt & Mr Corduroy where you ordered your half cages through?. Will they also installed?

Yes please Kurt & Andrew, I would appreciate this information too!!

Very interesting discussion going on here....and being one of our Club members who does get around the track with standard seatbelt & no cage (albeit in Street class with a pretty standard MY00 GC8), it has me re-thinking safety for 2017

I can understand that installing a half/full cage or even harness bars for those with daily drivers could present a real dilemma - do I give up going on track or potentially stuff up the interior of my road car installing safety gear?!?

With my GC8 not doing daily duties anymore but still very much registered for the road as I love driving it on the road & doing our Club social cruises etc, my decision is more straightforward.

magoo wrote:I ordered a 6 point cage with door bars after the PI round, $1720 is cheap insurance plus it'll look cool..lol. There was a seven week wait so it should be here soon.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Do you mind telling us where you sourced your cage from? And is it bolt-in or weld-in?