Friday, November 23, 2012

Back in 2006, I think it was, I wrote about how the combination of feminism, immigration, and post-Christianity would lead inevitably towards reducing women's choices to the brothel or the burqah. That point is rapidly arriving in both Holland and the UK:

Anything-goes Amsterdam has long been hailed as a sex mecca. The red-light district attracts thousands of customers, many of them tourists, who walk through alleys where half-naked prostitutes prance in the windows of some 300 brothels illuminated with scarlet bulbs.

A century ago, the brothels were banned to stop the exploitation of women by criminal gangs of Dutch men. But gradually the sex establishments crept back, with the authorities turning a blind eye.

In 2000, after pressure from prostitutes (demanding recognition as sex workers with employment rights) and Holland’s liberal intelligentsia (championing the choice of women to do what they wished with their bodies), the brothels were legalised. The working girls got permits, medical care, and now there are 5,000 in the red-light district.

But things went badly wrong. Holland’s newly legal sex industry was quickly infiltrated by street-grooming gangs with one target: the under-age girl virgin who can be sold for sex.

The men in the gangs are dubbed — incongruously — ‘lover boys’, because of their distinct modus operandi of making girls fall in love with them before forcing them into prostitution at private flats or houses all over Holland, and in the window brothels. The lover boy phenomenon has appalled Dutch society, not least because of the sheer numbers of girls involved.

Holland hopes the rot will be halted. Last year, 242 lover boy crimes were investigated by police, half of them involving the forced prostitution of girls under 18. Campaigner Anita de Wit says this is a fraction — ‘one per cent’ — of the true number. ‘There are thousands of girls being preyed on by male gangs in Holland,’ she says. Anita visits schools to warn girls exactly what a lover boy looks like, and makes no bones of the fact that most of the gangs are operated by Dutch-born Moroccan and Turkish men.

‘I am not politically correct. I am not afraid of being called a racist, which would be untrue. I tell the girls that lover boys are young, dark-skinned and very good looking. They will have lots of money and bling as well as a big car. They will give out cigarettes and vodka. They will tell a girl that she is beautiful.

‘The gangs know who to pick out: the girl with the confidence problems, with the glasses, or who looks overweight. They flatter her and seem like the “knight in shining armour”. She is drawn to her new boyfriend like a magnet.’

There has never been a society that survived the loss of its religion and its children. The end game for secularism, equalitarianism, and multiculturalism is not the shiny, sexy, It's A Small World scientopia of post-religious dreams, it is what is already being witnessed in present-day Amsterdam. This is not progress, this is a return to the pagan world that was defeated with the passing of Julian the Apostate and Diocletian.

The problem isn't that the feminist revolution "backfired', the problem is that it was a revolution of 180 degrees that marked a return to ancient societal patterns.

104 Comments:

It's just a return to normal. When you let your daughters act like whores, sooner or later men start treating them all like whores. The sex gangs just figured a way to make money and get laid at the same time with the west's whorish girls.

It's a total loss of identity. Men were summarily executed within living memory for crimes that didn't even begin to approach this but the most the Dutch can manage is an anemic, apologetic "awareness" campaign and a comparative slap on the wrist for anyone caught red-handed. This stuff reads like a parody of Antique slanders against barbarians, except it's actually real and nobody cares.

The Dutch don't identify these girls as "theirs" (just look at how many PC ideologies that statement runs afoul of), and even their families have been systematically eviscerated. Unfortunately, this means that no one actually cares about these liberated girls' well-being. Now, intellectually I don't really give much of a damn what happens to the Dutch, but if they do nothing about this, I know when my/our time comes, no one else will help me or my children either.

Concerning our heathen past, knowledge of the Classics (or practically anything written down before 1970 that wasn't radically Leftist) has gone from the hallmark of liberal education to the specialized knowledge of irrelevant antiquarians. Nobody has any idea what the world looked like before Christianity. They don't even know what it is they're undoing at this point.

Isn't it amazing how feminism ruins the lives of women at every stage? It kills them in the womb, deprives them of parents, tells them to open their legs to every man who wants a piece in their adolescence and young adulthood, and then deprives them of family, fellowship, and lifelong significance by telling them to pursue a nebulous, ephemeral "dream" of self-centered nonsense ensuring that they face the stark reality of middle age and retirement all alone.

And what will be the solution (not the one mentioned by Ms. De Wit, but of the libbie intelligentsia)?

Here is an example:

"We need to educate the immigrants on sex, to stop the disproportionally high immigrant rapes" (no, not the immigrants being raped; and this also does not mean educating the spanish or the italians, or the irish, or ze germans...)

"We need to educate the immigrants on sex, to stop the disproportionally high immigrant rapes..."

Brilliant! While we're at it lets educate the immigrants on why murder and stealing is bad, too - I'm sure that will put and end to those crimes as well! See guys, all violent sexual predators and criminals need is a place to talk about their feelings and a few (consensual) hugs.

"I am not afraid of being called a racist, which would be untrue." I'd like to see some progress made to where people will say things along the lines of 'Yes, I'm a racist'. Mother Nature herself is racist. Once people break through the constraints placed upon their thinking then they'll be able to see things much more clearly.

This is not the pagan world. Please Vox. Don't slime the "Pagan" world. Pagans had morals. Look at Sparta, was anything happening in Holland going anywhere on in Sparta? Yet, Sparta was pagan.

This was not happening in Rome either! I'm well read in the classics and what you describe never happened in Classical Antiquity. European pagans had Morality!

How just because the genociding Jews showed up---then Morality began! The pagans had morals. Maybe not complete morals but they had morals!

Every body dumps on the Spartans--but they never committed genocide--but your beloved Jews were the greatest Genociders of all of Classical Antiquity. It would be a race to see who was first the Romans or the Jews.

Do NOT slime the pagans with that garbage. Morality did not come about with the Jews or with Christianity.

I can't believe the behavior of that girl Angelique, the daughter of the woman who founded the safehouse in the article. She acted extraordinarily stupidly. Falling for another "lover boy" for the THIRD time after having been exploited as a prostitute for six weeks? That's just ridiculous.

What? I always heard that pederasty was an accepted thing in ancient Greece, and that it was part of the young Spartans' training that they had to be protege/lovers with older soldiers. Are you telling me the Spartans did not approve of it? What's your source?

As for the ancient Jews, how are they any less "pagan" than the ancient Greeks or Romans?

Last year every rape reported in Norway was perpetrated by a non-Norwegian immigrant. Hmmm.

In Sweden the women are so feminist that they will march into the Men's room if the lines are too long at the Women's room... and they are trying to rid the country of urinals. They are sexist afterall. And their men? I doubt many are of the old Alpha Male Viking stock.

Who will defend liberal feminists against the immigrant onslaught? Their feminized men? Not bloody likely.

In the UK, if you use too much violence to defend yourself, you will go to jail. I believe an armed guard was prosecuted for shooting an armed robber because the state though that the robber wasn't really that much of a threat. You must surrender and not provoke that bad man.

European feminazery leads to the destruction of the masculinity of their own men, allowing the masculine immigrant men to run roughshod over the entire system. In this sense, second ammendment rights, self defense rights, and men behaving like men are shown to be an imperative to the survival of a civilization.

Feminists and liberals are trying to destroy their own men, import immigrants and seem ignorant of who is going to win this contest of cultures.

"What? I always heard that pederasty was an accepted thing in ancient Greece, and that it was part of the young Spartans' training that they had to be protege/lovers with older soldiers. Are you telling me the Spartans did not approve of it? What's your source?"

Spartans were a separate group from the other ancient Greeks. They didn't enagage in pederasty were as the other did.

"Yes, of course they did. The Mayans, Aztecs, Celtic Druids, etc all had morals but I don't particularly like their definition of right and wrong...."

European paganism is different to non-white paganism. Paganism is a term that is applied to all tribal religions which can misleading. It isn't correct to take about paganism in the collective sense. There was obvious problems with European pagan morality especially in relation to infanticide. But there was a lot of understanding of good within there morality as well.

Dutch "window girl" prostitution looked like a workable idea 40 years ago, I'm sure. A few excess young women, usually from the countryside, turning tricks in a safe, warm, controlled environment with police protection readily available and full spectrum medical care just down the street. A customer base consisting of older men, single for whatever reason, men whose have become too beta for their wives, and young men looking for sex without strings. Xavaria Hollander's world, in short. Everyone relaxed about sex, it's no big deal, and any diseases easily and quickly cured with antibiotics that always work. Girls who work for a while and then move on to a different job, johns who are always polite...

Often institutions look stable for a "long time", in the young man sense - say, 10 to 20 years - that turn out to be quite unstable in the real longer run, in the sense of generations. Immigration from the third world where women are regarded in very different ways from the decadent west, declining birth rate that means there are no "excess" girls anymore, constantly mutating bacteria such as gonorrhea, all add up to the classic liberal / left conclusion: This was Not what we intended!

Feminism is based on falsehoods. One by one, those falsehoods are being demolished by reality. As this continues, feminists will more and more live in unreality.

When you present Christ, things change. Seated among a group of friends in a fast-food place after ministering at the New Mexico Youth Challenge chapel, I recounted to a sixteen-year-old Celina the speech I give to every young man who ever wanted to date my daughters. She had never heard such a thing. When finished, I stood and offered her my arm, then walked her around the restaurant, "This is how you escort a lady." Later as we exited I told her, "This is what the men-folk are for, if any crummy guy comes around trying to take advantage of you or anyone else in the church, we are there to put a stop to it." In the past Celina had people take dreadful advantage of her, but now that she is in the church, she had a glimpse of a far better future.

My source is Xenophon an Athenian Aristocrat that served in the Anabasis under a Spartan General. Xenophon later went on to serve under a Spartan King and then went to live in Laconia. His two sons went thru the Spartan agoge.

Xenophon said himself that there was no pederasty in Sparta. In Crete, yes and other places, not in Sparta.

Prostitution is a necessity in a society, and prostitutes will always exist, because where there is demand for a product or service, there will always be people willing to provide it. I think a ban herror, all we can do is to state what has been done so far, create laws to protect both prostitutes and customers.Regards,Jenny | Recetas Faciles

That problem that Vox pointed out in Holland---I WOULD SAY comes out of the extremism of Christianity. What that shows is Christian! It is Christianity that exactly and solidly produced that situation in Holland!

It is Christianity, and not paganism.

The overpreaching of Love in all of the Christian communities and churches have effeminized people so much that they lack judgement. They have NO judgement whatsoever. They have NO backbone due to the overemphasis of Love, Tolerance and Diversity all backed up by the Bible---by the Gospel!!!

This has NOTHING to do with Paganism whatsoever---but with the bastardizations of Christianity and the extremizing of the Gospel; Love and "Do not judge". The people of Holland have lost all sense of propriety, judgement, wisdom and prudence. They are fools.

The only thing is the Mirror. Why don't you Christians look themselves in the Mirror of what they have become, spineless, non-judgemental, everything is Love, peace and tolerance. That is what produced the culture of Holland. And that is what has led to girls being victimized. And the cowardice and the lack of manliness within the Dutch!

How disgusting. This has nothing to do with paganism but everything to do with what is wrong with Christianity today!!!!

Why should the Dutch care? If there is no God, no good or evil, it's all about what feels good as long as it doesn't "hurt someone else", and these girls appear to be having a great time. Besides, it's their choice what they do with their bodies and the Dutch are all about the right to choose. And, if things go south for them in the business they're in, they can always get doctor-assisted suicide; after all, it's their right to choose.

WLW:That problem that Vox pointed out in Holland---I WOULD SAY comes out of the extremism of Christianity. What that shows is Christian! It is Christianity that exactly and solidly produced that situation in Holland!

It is Christianity, and not paganism.

The overpreaching of Love in all of the Christian communities and churches have effeminized people so much that they lack judgement. They have NO judgement whatsoever. They have NO backbone due to the overemphasis of Love, Tolerance and Diversity all backed up by the Bible---by the Gospel!!!

This has NOTHING to do with Paganism whatsoever---but with the bastardizations of Christianity and the extremizing of the Gospel; Love and "Do not judge". The people of Holland have lost all sense of propriety, judgement, wisdom and prudence. They are fools.

The only thing is the Mirror. Why don't you Christians look themselves in the Mirror of what they have become, spineless, non-judgemental, everything is Love, peace and tolerance. That is what produced the culture of Holland. And that is what has led to girls being victimized. And the cowardice and the lack of manliness within the Dutch!

How disgusting. This has nothing to do with paganism but everything to do with what is wrong with Christianity today!!!!

As it is presently constituted in the west, Chrsitianity is the enemy. It's just another branch of what Moldbug terms "the Cathedral of Cthulhu" This even goes for "conservative" churches like the Southern Baptists and Dobson's FOF organization. The new gospel of Galatians 3:28 - equality über alles, with its thinly-veiled genocidal sister doctrine of "anti-racism" - elevated high above all else, even God himself. So the "extremism of Christianity" you describe is really a heresy writ large which has infected the entire church, both Catholic and Protestant. A single line of scripture from one of Paul's letters has been elevated to the central core of the entire religion and is employed as a massive battering ram to destroy everything in its path.

Holland, like all of the EUSSR, is profoundly post-Christian. There is no 'there' there. The numerous old churches and cathedrals which dot the landscape there are nothing but temples of the new social gospel described above. Perhaps they should complete the process under way by opening brothels in the places - temple prostitutes for Cultural Marxism. The EUSSR central bankstas and Lloyd "Doin' God's Work' Blankfein would be happy to lend them the cash from trash to upgrade the facilities to the latest and greatest.

Just as an aside, I expect few of the "lover boys" are native Dutch. My bet is that the vast majority are from the precious vibrancy of the other, which naturally renders them immune from what masquerades as "law" in the EUSSR prison of nations. In the UK-okrug, the local police and magistrates were actively covering up a child-prostitution ring which snapped up young English girls because it was a Moose-limb enterprise. They'll use the full resources of the "justice" system there to attempt to put Geert Wilders behind bars for crimethink, but allow outrages like this to go along until embarrassed by their extent. No one there resists. Instead, the natives just keep on digging their own graves by paying taxes and obeying laws - upholding a system whose purpose is to exterminate them.

Why don't you Christians look themselves in the Mirror of what they have become, spineless, non-judgemental, everything is Love, peace and tolerance. That is what produced the culture of Holland. And that is what has led to girls being victimized. And the cowardice and the lack of manliness within the Dutch!

"They lead my people astray, saying, "Peace," when there is no peace, and because, when a flimsy wall is built, they cover it with whitewash. Therefore tell those who cover it with whitewash that it is going to fall. Rain will come in torrents, and I will send hailstones hurtling down, and violent winds will burst forth." (Ezekiel 13:11)

@WLW:Over at Paul Kersey's site, there is a very revealing article about the destruction of Rochester, NY at the hands of Satan's spawn Saul Alinsky, mentor of the John Doe known as Barack Hussein Obama. It's not the activities of Alinsky which are a surpise, nor are the activities of the groids, both of which are entirely predictable. The interesting back story in Kersey's article is about how Alinsky ended up being invited in the first place. Old Saul didn't show up to do his "community origanzing" schtick unless he was well paid and able to bring his staff along. It wasn't the Joos who issued the invite and shelled out the 30 pieces of silver - It was white Christians.

Krul, I think Xenophon's comment is either in the Memorablia or in his Oeconomicus. I don't have my library with me; my library is in Michigan and I'm in Mexifornia at the moment!

Gen Kong is exactly right.

Socialism and communism came out of, originated from, influenced by Christianity.

The point is Anon, that Jesus Christ said, "Man lives BY EVERY WORD that proceedeth out of the mouth of God". It is explained here Christ the Logos the Font of Greek Philosophy. The Gospel must be cojoined with the real, original natural law which Jesus also promulgated! As Jesus is of two natures, his Logos is of two natures. The Natural Law is Harmony, the combination of the high and the low. The High is the Gospel and the Low is the Natural Law but they have to be combined. The error of Protestant Christianity is its rejection of Greek philosophy that is full of the Natural Law!

The proof of what I say is here:

"Even Good, done to the wrong proportion, does evil".

The Gospel done without proportion, without harmonizing, without being the Golden mean does Evil! This is the error throughout the church.

As you can see Death in Holland. That picture of Holland is Death. It was brought about by the extremizing of the Gospel which effeminizes and clouds men's minds. God said, "EVERY WORD". The Natural Law proceeded out of God! out of Jesus Christ. You can NOT ignore the real original natural law!

Anewt, how wrong you are. Protestants accuse the traditional pre-Vatican II Church of Paganism. And then you call modern Christianity and liberal Protestantism "the pagainization of Christianity".

Can you get your story straight?

Yes, Traditional Roman Catholicism is Pagan, read "European" for Christianity is supposed to be a European Religion. When Europe was Catholic---it suppressed the Jews, fought the Muslims, kept Europe free, and had a tough moral code. That was Under Pagan Christianity.

I'm a traditional orthodox Roman Catholic who lives that "pagan Christianity". Anewt, you don't have a clue.

Christianity is to be clothed in NEW Wine Skins and that means pagan Europe. It is your Judaized form of Christianity that produced that mess in Holland---NOT Catholicism. (But now modern Catholicism seems to be apeing Protestantism. Protestantism is Judaized Christianity.)

And thanks Gen Kong for that link that was a tremendous article! Outstanding. Along with Saul Alinsky is the Frankfurt School.

WLW,Read The Two Babylons by Alexander Hislop or Babylon Mystery Religion by Ralph Woodrow. I should warn you though, that you might not like what those gentlemen have to say.By the way, those "new wine skins" have nothing to do with Europe.

Christianity is NOT based on "sola scriptura" nor is it based on "sola gospel" either.

Christianity is based on two things Holy Tradition (this includes both scripture and the tradition of the Church) and the Natural Law embedded in Greek Philosophy of Socrates, Plato and Aristotle. You've got to have both.

those are actually three; and including greek philosophy in christianity is the very definition of pagan syncretism.

but i say this with genuine concern for your soul, Mr. Wheeler, if you don't repent of your syncretistic version of christianiy, and trust in Jesus Christ's finished work alone, you have no hope of eternal life only eternal judgment.

I will steer clear of your precise location on the last day . . . lightning bolts are not my favorite item in creation . . .

Just as an aside, if Scripture is the source of Holy Tradition, which I most certainly hold to, and can amply demonstrate . . . the "tradition" is beholden to Scriptrue, and not the oppposite, as advanced by the RCC and EOC.

As far as Socrates, Plato and Aristotle - only insofar as their views happen to agree with Holy Scripture are they worth considering theologically.

FYI - it would be helpful, for future arguments, if you would get the "Sola's" correct . . . "sola Gospel" sound like something form Rick Warren or Joel Osteen's joints.

The Reformed (not Protestant) Cahtolic Understanding:

Sola FideSola GratiaSola ScripturaSolus Christus

It is not fides caritate formata . . . but -

Caritas fide formata. Love for God or neighbor cannot exist prior to faith, which receives the essence and blessings of God that permit us to love Him and our neighbor.

Yes, I'm a Church of one. I live that in my heart, my soul and in my mind. When I go, it will all be over. That is not an idle jest but very sincere. I am really the last real Christian. Not only am I a Believer, but am obedient to the Church, faithful to the canons of the Church and obedient to the Natural Law. Nobody knows the natural law like I do.

As Christ is of two natures, his Logos is of Two Natures. There is no "sola scriptura". It is not "sola christus" either. We have a Trinity. Three Gods in One God. A Multiplicity in a Unity. I am obedient to the two Logoi of Christ, therefore I am thoroughly and completely a Christian.

Yes, and the Protestants need to look at the Eastern Orthodox Churches and even the Coptic Church. See, truth is in the Consistency of what one teaches. All sorts of Prots pull out the whore of Babylon to describe Roman Catholicism but the existence and teachings of the Eastern Orthodox Church and the Coptic Church kinda puts that out to pasture.

Yes the RC and the EOC kinda of both stand together. It is Protestantism that is outside the Faith.

You really ought to understand those you claim to oppose before you make false accusations and bear false witness, which I know, as a former ROman Catholic, is also against Church Canon.

There is no "Sola Scriptura"? Perhaps you ought to re-read the first Pope - Peter - who wasn't aware he was the "Pope" - and see his view on Scripture.

And, to the contrary, you are not a "traditional orthodox Roman Catholic." There has not been such a person in the RCC since before the Fourth Lateran Council. Trent was merely digging a deeper hole, and Vat I proved Luther right on the Papacy, and Vat II admitted Luther was probably right.

You seem unable to keep your concepts of the nature of Christ distinct from your emotions about being Catholic:

"As Christ is of two natures, his Logos is of Two Natures. There is no "sola scriptura". It is not "sola christus" either. We have a Trinity. Three Gods in One God. A Multiplicity in a Unity. "

What in the flying flip are you talking about with such language? I am a Confessional Lutheran, and reading your words I feel like Barbara Billingsley having to go through some weird translation!

Since we Lutherans are not "Protestants" we take no offense at the term - we know better. But to imply Luther was a "judaized Christian" is absolutely the best one-liner I have heard in years -especially since it was he who brought the Gospel forth from the rank legalism of Rome. Hilarious!

But I repeat actual history, which you would do well to learn before pretending you know it.

In a truely free society people must be free to harm themselves providing they harm no one else in the process. The problem is once you give up all self-restraint, especially in the form of religion, freedom doens't last long.

On another note I have to gasp at the total lack of suspicion on the part of the mother allowing her 15 yr old daughter to go off with 3 strange men in their 20's (white or not)in the first place, let alone without direct adult supervision. Even if it was supposed to be at her mother's house with other siblings present, do these native Dutch not understand how incredibly vulnerable teenage girls are? Clearly not.

From Vox to Nostril-damn-us. Vox has a record of exacting predictions and not quatrains. It is funny to me, Vox does not say there will be a great dragon cross the world with great sparks, he just says, want to be whore keep the feminism and egalitarian going.

I was trying to explain the difference to someone over the phone tonight. Sin and guilt are bedfellows but are not the same. I pointed out that Adam had no Idea what sin was but knew he was told not to do it, and then we are told how he felt naked and covered himself, that is guilt.

You may think that the liberals and whores don't feel guilt, you would be wrong. It manifests itself in many different ways, and the assholes who perpetuate the lie also feel guilty and many are damn rich in nothing numbers, you just don't see it.

"I can't believe the behavior of that girl Angelique, the daughter of the woman who founded the safehouse in the article. She acted extraordinarily stupidly. Falling for another "lover boy" for the THIRD time after having been exploited as a prostitute for six weeks? That's just ridiculous."

Notice there is no mention of a father or father figure in angelique's home. people, especially little girls, seek out the disfunction they are comfortable with. whatever her home life was like she probably had no example of how a good, protective man behaved toward women. Think of this as the little seed of emotional damage that blossomed into full wilfull participation in her own degradation.

Martin Luther was a casualty of his times. As the Jews concentrate only on their writings, so did he. Europe was already Christian. They were all baptized and receiving the Eucharist. So what was Luther's point? Yes, selling indulgences were mistake but was it necessary to change the Faith? No.

As you can see the Modern Age thoroughly and righteously proves the Catholic Church's stand that the Laity really have no business reading the scriptures. Look at the mess. Over 2500 different Protestant sects and all sorts of branched off cults. Protestantism broke apart Christendom and was an integral part of the conspiracy. Look at the mess of the Modern World. Look at Holland, a thoroughly Protestant Country, Look at England, thoroughly Protestant country.

Even though Martin Luther escoriated the Jews when they didn't automatically convert, he was influenced by the Jewish inroads into Christianity at the time. There were many precursors to Martin Luther who were directly influenced by Jews.

Yes, I'm a Church of one. I live that in my heart, my soul and in my mind. When I go, it will all be over. That is not an idle jest but very sincere. I am really the last real Christian. Not only am I a Believer, but am obedient to the Church, faithful to the canons of the Church and obedient to the Natural Law. Nobody knows the natural law like I do.

"Martin Luther was a casualty of his times. As the Jews concentrate only on their writings, so did he. Europe was already Christian. They were all baptized and receiving the Eucharist. So what was Luther's point? Yes, selling indulgences were mistake but was it necessary to change the Faith? No.

Oh, my . . . where to begin? Your below-elementary view of Luther, which is not even taught in Catholicism anymore?; your complete lack of, and appreciation for, if even an opponent, of the countless words and books and tracts Luther wrote?; your simplistic reasoning that indulgences were the issue in the end? My friend, as I said before, you need a serious history lesson (or thirty)!

"As you can see the Modern Age thoroughly and righteously proves the Catholic Church's stand that the Laity really have no business reading the scriptures. Look at the mess. Over 2500 different Protestant sects and all sorts of branched off cults. Protestantism broke apart Christendom and was an integral part of the conspiracy. Look at the mess of the Modern World. Look at Holland, a thoroughly Protestant Country, Look at England, thoroughly Protestant country.

Nothing of the above paragraph proves anything except that maybe purple is a shade of greenish-tinged pink and elephant shaped walnuts - which is to say - you said nothing and proved nothing. Again, you really need to study the history of the matter, as C. S. Lewis would say (although to you he was one of those "English" protestants). Know what it is you are talking about before you go wandering off accusing others of being wrong, when your own words prove you are not "right" to begin with!!!

"Even though Martin Luther escoriated the Jews when they didn't automatically convert, he was influenced by the Jewish inroads into Christianity at the time. There were many precursors to Martin Luther who were directly influenced by Jews."

Luther "excoriated" the Jews for their failures to accept Jesus as the Messiah. Precursors were not an issue.

My friend - from which pre-Vatican II book/tract are you lifting your quotes? You really should burn it - and go learn some history AND some theology. In both you are woefully lacking.

As an aside, I could show how Catholicism actually gave birth to Calvinism, with its non-Gospel emphasis being a parallel to Rome, and how Luther steered the true Catholic Church through the bog and brought it out on the other side - smaller perhaps, but that was prophesied by Jesus anyway.

If you are serious about a serious discussion - post me at koivwvia@hotmail.com I am discussing the same misconceptions you have with several others at the moment. I can take on one more.

(1) How do you feel about the fact that Church tradition has failed to prevent the contamination of scripture? I am talking about verses like 1 John 5:7-8, or the infamous parable of the adulteress?

(2) How do you feel about the fact that the church venerates Mary, even though Jesus specifically said that Mary is no different than any believer? (Mark 3:35)

(3) You write, Yes, I'm a Church of one. I live that in my heart, my soul and in my mind. When I go, it will all be over. That is not an idle jest but very sincere. I am really the last real Christian.

Isn't this similar to what Eliyah said to Yahweh?

Eliyah replied, "I have been very zealous for the LORD God Almighty. The Israelites have rejected your covenant, broken down your altars, and put your prophets to death with the sword. I am the only one left, and now they are trying to kill me too." The LORD said to him... "Yet I reserve seven thousand in Israel --all whose knees have not bowed down to Baal and all whose mouths have not kissed him." (1 Kings 19)

(4) You write, Nobody knows the natural law like I do.

(4)(a) Starting from SO(N) current algebra, construct two lowest primary higher spin-4 Casimir operators which are quartic in spin-1 fields. (Hey, you said natural law!)

(4)(b) Did you know that if you have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if you have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, you are nothing? (1 Corinthians 13:2)

[i]There has never been a society that survived the loss of its religion and its children. [/i]

Can you give examples of societies which failed because they lost their religion and/or children? This isn't an attempt at a "gotcha" question; I'm sufficiently ignorant of world history that I honestly don't know whether or not such examples exist.

It's interesting - Vox has been making this statement about the end of feminism for years now. There is hardly a branch of leftism's great tree of death which has been more thoroughly discredited than feminism. When feminist high-priestess Gloria Steinem responded to the exposure of Bill Clinton's rapine behavior - the very textbook definition of sexual harassment - with the remark "everyone is entitled to one grope", the movement lost any semblance of actual credibility. It should have died in a chorus of scornful laughter then and there. It seemed to make no difference though. It continues on - taught day in and day out in every public skool, broadcast 24 x 7 x 365 by the Ministry of Truth, the Hollywood jujubox, etc. Like a zombie, it just stumbles along and keeps infecting new victims. What is the key to this almost supernatural power?

Is it so bad though if feminism ends there?I mean, YOU ARE GOING TO PAY for pussy ANYWAY YOU LOOK AT IT, why not a one-time gift rather than a permanent drain with all its inherent drama, whining & bullshit?

Of course if you're REALLY smart, you know how to get the free samples & bail.

Gen. Kong, from what I can find or stand to read from liberal points of view, if somebody like a Clinton is achieving the agenda being pushed, then its a matter of 'end justifies the means' kind of thinking.

They truly don't care who gets hurt, or what happens to innocent people, as long as the end goal is achieved.

I mean, YOU ARE GOING TO PAY for pussy ANYWAY YOU LOOK AT IT, why not a one-time gift rather than a permanent drain with all its inherent drama, whining & bullshit?

Even better, compulsory laryngectomies for all females--or the entire species, frankly. The universe needs less of your whinging and complaining, and there is no hope that any of you will stop of his own accord.

Actually, Wizard, the custom did not come from the Greeks, but from the Romans. And precisely what do you do with I Cor. 11:15 - which explains the "covering" . . .

And then verse 16 especially - which examines a concept that seems completely foreign to you, that of Christian freedom.

I am not quite sure why you feel the need to style yourself as the "last Christian." I would suggest that you appear to have inserted yourself into the role of "Judge" - which belongs to Christ alone, and that you are in danger of rejecting the entire Gospel despite its witness, which is the sin against the Holy Spirit.

You have, in your own mind, turned the Faith into a repristinated version of Phariseeism - with yourself as the Chief Priest. Your words and attitude speak nothing to the Gospel of Jesus Christ; there is none of the "compassion" Christ desires rather than sacrifice; nothing whatsoever of the Gospel.

You are as transparent as a pane of glass to those of the Faith, but understand, for those who do not fully know all matters of the Faith, you are risking both their souls and your own preaching the legalistic nonsense you are.

Again, I repeat, you really need to study both history and theology. Your lack in both fileds is readily apparent.

Let's look at Holland, 51% Non Religious, 25% Catholic, 15% Protestant, 9% other. Sounds thoroughly Protestant to you? They are among the most post modern, post-Christian countries in Europe. Sure Protestantism spread there, but then they went all Nazi in the war and liberal thereafter (before the war it seemed they were very tolerant of Jews for quite some time, but then something snapped and they liquidated an estimated 75% of 'em). Very sad state of affairs.

And perhaps due to their harsh language they have the highest rate of throat cancer. (Useless trivia)

Yes, let's look at Holland. You are quoting modern statistics. What about Holland 200 years ago?

All Protestant. Protestantism because it has no authority, no center, dissapaites. Protestantism is a degeneration of Catholicism. Out of that it continues. Those 51% non-religious--what was their forefathers? Protestants. Just as Politics has a kyklos, religion does as well. Sooner or later Protestantism with its many contradictions and infighting, soon causes disbelief.

The damage, Rantor, has already been done. Holland was one of the centers of the "Enlightenment" the damage occured 200 years ago. Holland was the home of Spinoza, one of the major architects of the "Enlightenment". The fruitition of that damage is just being seen now. Some of the impetus of the English Civil Wars came from Jewish instigation from Holland. It was they who taught that monarchy was idolatry and so Cromwell the Protestant beheaded the English King and all future kings are beholden to the House of Commons in England. The damage has already been done. The American Revolution was a carry-over of the English Civil Wars and then the American Revolution was the paradigm for the French Revolution.

That mess in Holland is precisely the cause of the "Enlightenment" which had its home in Holland and fueled by the American and French Revolutions.

Because of the teachings of the "Enlightenment" all of Europe is dying.

For the very true beginning of her is the desire of discipline; and the care of discipline is love Wisdom 6.17

How many people here have read this in Scripture? How many people have heard a sermon on this?

So I am a dumbshit am I. Well, Christ said, "If you Love me, you will obey me".

What is Love? The care of discipline. The Spartans anyone? Who had a disciplined society? The Spartans. Who had Love? The Spartans. The book of Wisdom is Greek not Jewish.

The pre-Vatican II Church was known for its discipline.

The requirement for women in the Church to veil while in Church was across the board, Coptic, Orthodox and Catholic. Only the Copts still to this day still have it church-wide.

I mentioned the veil because It is ONE example amongst many! That is NOT the only one. See, what you don't understand is that some do this, and some do that---Which one does it all? Who has read the WHOLE Bible? Like you people know that verse quoted in the beginning of this post. You don't know what is in the Bible and the Bible of the Church, of the Early Church was the SEPTUAGINT! That and that only is the Bible for the Church. No protestant has that! There is NO such thing as "deutrocanonical" or "apocrypha". The LXX is Scripture. (except 3, 4 Macc.) That was the Bible at the beginning! "The Virgin is with child" is ONLY in the Septuagint. No Septuagint---no Virgin prophecy.

What about the consistent teaching of the Church that Judaizing is anathemitized the Jews are suppressed. I am the ONLY one to adhere to the ancient and traditional teachings of the Church.

I obey ALL. I follow Tradition. I read only from the LXX. I have read the all the canons of the Seven Ecumenical Councils. I have supplemented the Faith with Arete as St. Peter has said. That verse in II Peter 1.5 has never, never been carried out in the Church either Catholic or Orthodox! Once it was written---it was overlooked and not paid attention to.

Jesus Christ said, "Man does not live by bread alone, BUT BY EVERY WORD THAT PROCEEDETH out of the mouth of God". Not only Scripture, Not only from the Horses mouth, but the Natural Law proceeded out of the mouth of God. How many here are even cognizant of the real, original natural law--that which came from the Mouth of God?

I am the Last Spartaite and also the Last Christian. I obey ALL things. I OBEY ALL the Words that proceedeth out of the Mouth of God.

How many here know that kneeling is proscribed on Sunday? That the proper position of Christian is to Stand throughout. What Christian stands throughout? Maybe some Ultra-Orthodox Old Calenderists of the Russian and Greek Orthodox Church but then these retards throw out Plato and spit on Aristotle. The Natural Law is nowhere on the radar of the Copts or any Orthodox!

The whole church is INCOMPETENT.

I'm a Spartaite. We do things right. We have the fear of God and we Obey---because we are trained to Obey. I'm the first and last of the Mochicans. I have the total package; that is why I can make that claim. No other Christian anywhere can make that claim. Do you have the total package?

Furthermore, Christ prayed that "We all should be one". Am I the only one that practices that Christian Unity? And where does that Christian Unity exist? In the Consistent Teaching of the Church and in Obedience to all that Christ and the Holy Spirit dictate. Is that so hard?

Obviously it is.

It is just the realization I had, that I must be the only guy out there that has the total package. Does anybody out there have the total package?

Yes, Truth is way out there for the masses. It is like I'm on the far side of the moon. That was said of Jesus, "he is of beelzebub". That was also said of the Spartans, "their peculiar culture" so very very strange.

"In the first place, therefore, it is necessary that both preachers and hearers take heed to doctrine and have clear, unmistakable evidence that what they embrace is really the true Word of God revealed from heaven; the doctrine given to the holy and primitive fathers, prophets and apostles; the doctrine Christ himself confirmed and commanded to be taught. We are not permitted to employ the teaching dictated by any man's pleasure or fancy. We may not adapt the Word to mere human knowledge and reason. We are not to trifle with the Scriptures, to juggle the Word of God, as if it would admit of being explained to suit the people; of being twisted, distended and patched to effect peace and agreement among men. Otherwise, there would be no sure, permanent foundation whereon the conscience might rely. — Blessed Dr. Martin Luther, Church Postil VII, p. 325."

"Sola Scriptura" is not the basis of the Faith. No. Martin Luther is wrong.

The Church is Spirit and is guided by the Holy Spirit. The Church was first spread by Word of Mouth--thus the Oral Tradition preceded that of the New Testament. The Faith first was ORAL. Not written! St. Pauls says, "Maintain the traditions that I have handed onto you by word of mouth or by written letter". Both.

Notice the word "primitive" in Martin Luther's speech? "Primitive" is a Kabala teaching that stated what was "primitive" is true and best. The whole Protestant movement is about this supposedly capturing the "primitive" state of Christianity.

There is NO such thing! The Natural Law is Incrementalism. God follows the Natural Law for He is that. There is NO primitivism in the Christian Church. The Church grows because it is a living thing. Just as all living things grow by incrementalism, just as the earth was formed by little steps (Incrementalism), the Church and its understanding has grown incrementally. The Church is vine, didn't you know that.

All of Protestantism was instigated by the Jews and the Church has condemned any one who is to Judaize the Faith.

In college they told us, in Weinmar Germany, before the unreal inflation hit, some prostitutes would walk the streets naked. At least during the summer. Couldn't even bother to get dressed between johns. We know what happened after that.

And keeping in mind, sometimes it's the little things that count, or littler things, I read recently, Hugh Hefner lets his dogs pee inside his mansion. And crap on the rug. That's right. His dogs pee inside, and crap on the rug. Can't even be bothered to have the dogs walked around the grounds. It.smells.like.pee.in.there. And the decor is cheap, and tasteless. Though that stuff may be due to approaching dementia, and not related to America re-electing a fascist/socialist/ communist/progressive/traitor/ for its president.

And you know why I came here? I've interrupted watching "Sid And Nancy" for the first time. I wanted to take a break from reliving my youth in a whole different light.

IIRC, Holland is like Germany in that if you are a member of a religion then your dues are withheld from your paycheck. If you don't want to pay, you have to quit the church. That provides a pretty strong incentive to be non-religious.

You have offered proof of nothing -save for your own, and very skewed, opinion.

Luther's use of "primitive" has nothing to do with the context in which you define it . . . your "opinion" is simply absured. If you are incapable of understanding he was referring to the Ancient Creeds, which open the Formula of Concord, then you have chosen to be willingly ignorant.

If Sola Scriptura is not the basis of what the Una Sancta teaches and from which the Church draws its tradition, then, pray thee, what is? You opinion?

Oy vey!

Trying to tie in Kabala and "Incrementalism" as you define it, is likewise absurd - you are not even dealing with theology proper now, but your own deluded opinions.

"All of Protestantism was instigated by the Jews and the Church has condemned any one who is to Judaize the Faith. "

Peradventure Wheeler could enlighten the doubting part of his audience - which would be all of it - with the details of Luther's/Huss's/any Reformation leader's conversion to Judaism prior to leading their pro-Bible stand against The Whore.This fascinating (and fabricated) bit of church history is outside our scope of fact-based research, please proceed!

"Holland’s newly legal sex industry was quickly infiltrated by street-grooming gangs with one target: the under-age girl virgin who can be sold for sex. The men in the gangs are dubbed — incongruously — ‘lover boys’, because of their distinct modus operandi of making girls fall in love with them before forcing them into prostitution"

This sounds patently ludicrous. Any proof whatsoever? It's feminist daydreaming about some irresistably handsome evil men forcing virgins to do their bidding... Come on.Also I very much doubt that there's a great demand in the Netherlands for the raping of unwilling underage virgins. It's standard feminist demonization of men, trying to imply that there are millions of (probably paedophile) perverts out there always on the lookout for a chance to inflict something evil upon innocent young girls.