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That's one possibility, although with a bold nature and shuckle's glaring water weakness, you could also go 252 HP and 252 special defense. Also, gyro ball, even with the huge speed difference between shuckle and its opponent, won't do much. Shuckle has no attack to back it up with.

I'm not positive, but I do think it is partially dependant on the user's power. Steel type attacks are somewhat rare, as they have poor coverage. Also, the boost from the EV's will only be about 20 points higher than the boost from the nature. As for a replacement to gyro ball...maybe wrap, stealth rock, or dig...

And Gyro Ball is only dependent on the speed ratio between the users and not the power. It's not a worthwhile option on Shuckle as its attack is so low even at the maximum power it won't do anything. Read what I said on your last topic please.

And Gyro Ball is only dependent on the speed ratio between the users and not the power. It's not a worthwhile option on Shuckle as its attack is so low even at the maximum power it won't do anything. Read what I said on your last topic please.

...but if Gyro Ball depends only on speed, then why would shuckle's low attack power matter?

Also, read the first line of the first post. The search thingy was broken when I tried to find it.

Ugh... I'm getting frustrated at this... I really don't know what to do... people on other forums are telling me to get rid of shuckle... Those that tell me to keep it say to give it power trick, but I don't want that... I'm so frustrated that I'm just about to give up on pokémon...

I have a shuckle that I use in regular play for nostalgia's sake. I think rest and toxic are two almost essential skills for a shuckle given his highly defensive nature, but the gyro ball and sandstorms don't really have me stoaked. While his HP may not be stellar, 244 hp if you've got maxed out hp EVs and IV, really does make for a lot of survivability with his defenses. After all, a pokemons survivability is def (or sp def) times hp.

I personally like rollout with a trickroom setup on my shuckle. If you train him with a brave nature, you can get him as low as about 40 speed. This will make him a sure shot for first attack in trick room. That paired with a possible 130 attack makes for really good rollout usage. With that setup, rollout will usuaully kill the first pokemon on the 3rd hit, and then the 4th and 5th hits oneshot many pokemon. This setup also works really well with baton passing physical attack boosts as support making you be able to get your one shot kill on the 2nd hit.

As to the survivability, maxing out your lower stat always gives you more. Im shuckle's case, it is always HP. Also remember that defensive improvements work on a percentage basis. This means that giving a shuckle with 500 defense another 50 defense from EVs will only make him live 10% longer, on the other hand, giving a shuckle with 150 hp 50 more will make him live 33% longer.

I really do think shuckle can be a viable polemon in competative play as long as you know his limitations and have peopel in your team ready to cover those. He's also pretty good against a few of the more common uber set ups I've found.

Well, Shuckle gets 1HKOed by Surf Kyogre after no calm minds, but if you focus on one type of defense, rather than both equally, he may be able to survive a few psychics from Lugia or something. Ive never tried that. Also, Rollout eventually does do major damage if its combined with Defense Curl, and it can 1HKO Articuno and Moltres on its 2nd turn, but on an average Poke, it would take too long to do anything I think.

I was really planning on him to be a mixed wall. I should've posted this before, but I was planning on having a poke with Light Screen and Reflect holding whatever item it is that prolongs those moves, use them, then switch out to Shuckle.

"While his HP may not be stellar, 244 hp if you've got maxed out hp EVs and IV, really does make for a lot of survivability with his defenses. After all, a pokemons survivability is def (or sp def) times hp."

Well, his HP IV is 30, which is just 1 below maximum, so I think it'd be fine.

I doubt I'll get rid of rest and toxic, so rollout will kind of defeat the purpose of rest. Hmm... I could put toxic on the Light Screen/Reflect poke... I don't know...

BTW, yes, I am JoltZero from GFAQs. Where'd you see me on GFAQs?

EDIT: I calculated a hypothetical sitiuation to see how much (average) damage it would give to my potential shucky.

In a situation (with Shuckle and the opponent being at lv100) where the opponent with an (SP) ATT stat of 400 used a super effective move with 100 (SP) ATT power against my shucky (who will have about 550 in DEF and SP DEF), I'll recieve about 56 points of damage, givin that Light Wall and Reflect are in effect. That's pretty bad, seeing as I can only go up to 213 in HP.

Fortunately, I'll mostly be using this againt my friends, who think EV training has something to do with getting all the evolutions of Eevee . But if I ever get into a serious match, I'll be doomed. I wanna keep my Shucky!

Well, I figure getting 400 in (sp) attack would be pretty hard, and it'd still have to be super effective to take half my HP, which would be reduced to a quarter with Light Wall / Reflect, which could be made up for with rest. *takes deep breath* Ok, I'm sticking with shuckle. Now, could anyone PLEASE tell me why Gyro Ball would be a bad idea if shuckle's att power doesn't matter?!?

EDIT:Found this on GF:

Wrap
Toxic
Sandstorm
Rest

Wrap traps them and whittles their HP a bit. Toxic whittles their HP, being able to reach it's potential since they can't switch out. Sandstorm whittles away at their HP while increasing Shuckle's godly Special Defense. Rest heals, and gives you a couple of turns where you don't need to use PP while their being worn down. Rest also gets rid of any Toxic they may have inflicted on you.

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So with gyro ball the speed determines the actual power stat ie. flamethrower = 95 fire blast = 120 this is the stat the speed determines. Your shuckle then executes an attack of that strength so shuckle still needs a decent atatck stat to do damage...eg. a hitmonchan with a low special attack will do pitiful damage with ice beam, but using ice punch which is physical he does wonderfully ^_^