Unregistered, as a new member your first 5 posts will be subject to moderation.
So if your post is submitted successfully, but does not show up immediately, please be patient, as it may take some time for a moderator to approve it.
Please don't double post.

Thanks so much for your helpful words, Kevin. Sorry for the late reply. I've been mulling things over, and we've sort of been in a period of uncertainty right now.

I really don't know how to repair things at this point. D and S have talked, and resolved that they have problems in their relationship that come down to not mutually appreciating each other. He thinks he's fixing this by initiating more quality time with her, and keeps saying it's a slow process. But really, very little seems to be changing.

Meanwhile, S reached out to me to tell me that she is bothered by the intensity of my relationship with D and wishes for me to find another partner to take some of the strain off THEIR relationship. Essentially, saying that their issues are because D and I have a strong relationship.

I respectfully replied that I'm not interested in seeing anyone else-- and that is my choice, I understand that. Since this point, she did not reply to me, has not spoken to me or communicated with me in any way (even once when we were all together, she refused to even look at me). D and I still have our regular amount of time together more or less, but everything is on edge. I feel like I can't ask for anything even close to "extra"... like a short vacation with him, an unscheduled outing with him, some extra time to spend with his daughter, or anything like that, because it would be putting pressure on a fragile situation-- D is unwilling to even bring such things up with her in fear of rocking the boat. I guess both of us are being stubborn-- I don't want to reach out and apologize when I don't see that I've done anything wrong, and I guess she thinks I'm being selfish. I have tried to reach out to her with casual conversation in an attempt to bring things back to at least civility, but she ignores me.

Not sure what anyone else can provide here, as this is all so complicated and has so many layers. I don't want to feel like I'm in competition with her, but I'm just not in a good place about it right now. Any ideas how to improve this going forward?

It takes two to tango. If she's unwilling to communicate with you, despite your efforts to reach out to her, then there's nothing you can do about that.

I don't know what she thinks of you personally, but as a "thing" -- specifically, a thing that has captured her husband's heart, she clearly sees you as a threat. Quite possibly she thinks he might leave her because he has you. At the least she blames her own relationship problems with him on you. She doesn't want to assume the responsibility for those problems herself.

It remains for D to be the one who decides what he's going to do about this. If he decides on "steady as she goes" for the rest of your lives, then that's what you're all stuck with, unless you or S decide to break up with him. You and D will continue to walk on eggshells where S is concerned, while S will continue to stress out over the great relationship she sees D having with you that she knows she doesn't have with D. And that'll be the story of your lives, til death do you all part.

There's a chance that D spending more time with S will eventually help. But it kind of sounds like S and D need some professional counseling. There's a rift between them that runs pretty deep.

You can suggest that to D if he asks your opinion. Otherwise your choices are limited to

continue to go along with whatever D decides,

put your foot down and insist D and S get counseling or divorce.

Do you want to put your foot down, or do you want to continue to keep the peace? Which of the two alternatives sucks less?

If I can think of anything else, I'll let you know. Sorry things have deteriorated (or stagnated at least).

Sincerely,
Kevin T.

__________________Love means never having to say, "Put down that meat cleaver!"

Meanwhile, S reached out to me to tell me that she is bothered by the intensity of my relationship with D and wishes for me to find another partner to take some of the strain off THEIR relationship. Essentially, saying that their issues are because D and I have a strong relationship.

On the surface that seems illogical... Her putting that they have issues at your door. If she wants a strong bond with him she could develop that with him rather than envying yours with him. Under the hood what does that mean though? How does he behave toward her?

Because even though you are not doing anything, if he goes around the house going "GF never does that, GF always does this" to his wife, I could see where wife could get sick of hearing about GF. (You) If it is the hinge's behavior that is pushing buttons like that? The wife could have trouble separating that out and "transfer" it to you rather than seeing it is the husband's behavior in his communication style that is actually the alienating irritant that prevents them from bonding better. Not you.

Could any of the people in this polyship be dealing in poly hell stuff?

And whatever happened to the bdsm partner she opened up for? Is that still on or did that fade away? Could she be upset that her husband's other relationship proved longer lasting than hers and that be the reason for envying that the bond between you guys is strong?

Could it be fears during pregnancy rearing up?

I thought you guys were moving toward coparenting and more like a "family style" polyship rather than a "separate relationships" model the last time you wrote. I do not see how it is supposed to function as "three adult polyshipping coparents" smoothly if you cannot solve problems together and do effective conflict resolution.

It is still up to you if you continue to participate in this. If you are? You could set some healthy boundaries and suggest all of you seek a counselor. I do not think both you and D "shrinking yourselves to not rock the boat" is the answer. You all could talk more efectively rather than talk less to help resolve the conflicts. Get help having those conversations with a counselor if you all cannot do it effectively on your own.

I would not add more dating partners or children to this at this time.

I do not know if any of those ideas help you any but I hope this sorts out for your sake. Hang in there.

I don't have any advice to add but just wanted to say I feel that I am in a similar situation to the OP, and this thread is exactly what I needed to read. I definitely feel a stronger more powerful love with my partner, and my husband was my first love. I don't think my husband really realizes the disconnect yet. I have no desire to leave him, and we are planning on starting a family soon. Thanks all for the advice on this topic, and I look forward to whatever else people have to add

If I'm going to be somewhat of a co-parent and adult figure to the kids to the best of my ability, I want to feel more integrated into the family.

As a mom, if someone came in and expected to CO-PARENT my kids (existing and any future), I would be livid and wouldn't want them anywhere near me or my kids EVER. My husband's best friend, over the years, has become closer than an aunt to my kids, but she is NOT a co-parent. I am the parent and my husband is the parent. For me this expectation or goal sends up all kinds of red flags (even if the expectation coming from one of the parents).

Is your begging for more time with the bf reasonable for a man with job, home, family and possible other interests that don't involve you? Twice a week commitments is actually a LOT of time away from a young family and household chores, especially if any of those are overnights. Many people with a family are lucky to get one night a week. I have a few childless friends and they have NO clue that staying out late, even just once is a BIG, HUGE, friggin deal and it adds extra stress on the parent that is staying home. Have you offered to babysit so your bf and his wife can have a night out?

You talk a lot about wanting to be seen as more an equal to your metamour, having a role in parenting their existing and future children, and feeling betrayed that their family planning (having another child) was done without including you before moving forward.

And then you say you try to maintain a friendly rapport with his spouse.

Do you contribute time and money to the care and maintenance of their kids and home? If a family emergency comes up that causes plans to change, are you upset and feeling a loss? Do you offer help in shuttling the kids to activities? As asked above, do you offer to watch the kids so they can go out and reconnect romantically? Would YOU be happy if that was something your partner would be happy to do or would you find it threatening? If you and he wanted to move on to having a kid now, how would you feel consulting her and her having an equal say in that or how to raise that child?

Like Kevin-I let my emotions motivate me to knock Maca off the pedastal AND over the years I have noticed for myself that I also do this with GG from time to time.
I have (thankfully) learned that actions need not follow emotions and I don't allow my decisions regarding who to be with change in the "heat of the moment" like that.
I love your example Kevin and the way you explain it.

Also-like others have said; I am a mother of 5. If someone else tried to come in and "take over" as a co-parent without my EXPRESS invitation-regardless of their sexual relationship with one of my partners; they would be sent flying and my partners would be welcome to join them.

I am VERY easy going about co-parenting. But the invitation HAS TO BE FROM ALL CURRENTLY INVOLVED PARENTS. PERIOD. It also has to be accepted by the children.
In our case all of the children are co-parented by a group of four adults. Three of them have additional parents outside of the household.

But you can't make that choice or decision. It's not your place. That is a decision which must be made by BOTH of them AND their children.

That's a lot of responses! I'll try to get to these as succinctly as possible.

@Kevin:
I've suggested that counseling might be a good option for us, because communication across the board has been pretty bad. I'm a scientist, and I like to lean towards if a certain method is clearly failing for a certain amount of time... it's time to try a new method. I don't know if they'll agree.

@GalaGirl:
As far as I can tell, her apparent envy of our bond seems to come from D's more subtle actions. I am sure he is not parading around announcing why our side/I am potentially better. She has just noticed that he seems excited to spend time with me, etc, and doesn't feel the same thing back. She is still with her partner, but we really don't know much about the strength of their relationship other than that it is not as intense as mine and D's. I also thought we could move toward a family-style poly and was fine with this, but I was pushed back hard by S. She specifically said in her email that she wants to include me more but my "monogamous desires" make her feel threatened and "our family always comes first." This baffles me, because I don't see why me expressing an interest in being involved with the whole family (including her!) highlights my monogamous desires. It seems to me like her fears have caused a self-fulfilling prophecy. I was asking all this time to be more involved with the group as a whole, she pushed me back because she feared I was trying to take her husband/daughter/family away and was just trying to "date [her] husband", and now things are such that I AM just dating her husband and have to "demand" more alone time with him if I'm going to see him at all.

@MsChristy:
Just my two cents, and please let me know if I'm out of line, but... if you are feeling a dynamic shift with your husband (maybe not enough to lead to a split, but still)... is it really a wise time to think about starting a family? Because of my situation, I would say absolutely make sure you talk this out with both of your partners and make sure everyone is aware where they stand FIRST.

@SNeacail and Vin:
I didn't come in expecting to co-parent, and I don't even know if that's what I'm expecting now. In the beginning I never even thought I would meet D's child. But things have evolved to the point where I have a significant role in her life, and I would like to continue being a consistent adult figure for her. No, I was never explicitly given this role by both parents, but over time D has encouraged me to where I am now, and I thought S was ok with the way things are... I thought. D and S never had a real discussion about exactly what role they wanted their other partners to play in child-rearing, and I think that's having repercussions now.

This doesn't mean I want to change rules or make significant decisions, but I do want to have some kind of a voice. YES I have offered to babysit, and have done so on a few occasions, and the offer stands, but S seems to be feeling a lot of what you're expressing here. She is currently unwilling to let me have any more than bare minimum time with her child because she seems to feel like I'm trying to take her away (which to me is so ridiculously far from the truth). If I were permitted, I would be happy to be involved more in a HELPFUL way. I would be thrilled to be able to take on more responsibilities with their child and around the house, but I can't if I'm in the position where even asking to do this makes me seem like I'm trying to take something away from them. Just recently, D was working late every single night this past week, and I offered to watch their daughter for a night or two so S could get a break. She quickly rebuffed and said she wouldn't be needing any of my help... in a rather passive-aggressive way. I have no issues with family emergencies, but I can tend to get upset if they make family plans at the last minute that can and do interfere with my plans, and I'm just expected to be fine with it-- when I can pretty much never ever make last minute plans in our current setup. This just comes down to our scheduling and communication issues.

If I were to have a child with D, in an ideal world, I wish that S and I could get along and communicate well enough that we could be co-parents. I think all hands on board is a wonderful concept for raising children. But right now this is not looking good for the future of that concept for us.

As an example of what I'm trying to point out to you concerning your feelings about their unborn child.
Right now my my husband and I have one kid. My other partner takes from this dynamic time that would otherwise go to my husband/kid. As well money I spend during the time I am with him. He contributes nothing towards the care of my home or kid. If my husband and I decided to have another kid, I'd think it was out of bounds if my other partner felt he should have been given a say in that when he isn't responsible for any part of the existing kid re time or money and wouldn't be for any other kid I might choose to have.

That it bothers you, combined with your admitting you feel gratified in your belief that you have some greater connection with your partner than he has with his wife, it takes on a competitive nature. You don't want a child right now - something that would further take time and money from his household and all who live there. Yet your are upset that they chose to have another child now for whom you also won't be responsible. Could it be the new child with only add to the amount of years you'll have to wait so his children won't be raised in a divorced home? Gosh! What an unhelpful conversation that seems!

For a future where you would create a larger deficit of time and money in that household by him having a child with you, this competitive vibe has to go. He doesn't want his kids growing up in a divorced home; would he prefer a married yet contentious home? Please examine yourself for exactly why a child for them now really bothers you when theirs won't cost you a dime, perhaps some time but one you might have with him WILL greatly cost her. It really seems you find it cute to think you outshine her in some way AND you have your eye on the other side of wife and mother.

For a future where you would create a larger deficit of time and money in that household by him having a child with you, this competitive vibe has to go. He doesn't want his kids growing up in a divorced home; would he prefer a married yet contentious home? Please examine yourself for exactly why a child for them now really bothers you when theirs won't cost you a dime, perhaps some time but one you might have with him WILL greatly cost her. It really seems you find it cute to think you outshine her in some way AND you have your eye on the other side of wife and mother.

Unfortunately, the OP did not come up with these desires and expectations on her own. D confided to her he felt a deeper connection; D brings their child around and encourages her interaction. He seems to have desires not shared by his wife. They need to get their shit figured out so the OP knows where she stands. D can feel things for the OP and wish for things all day and night, but what is he actually willing to do?

It appears he wants to keep her bound to him, but do nothing to actually act on the desires he has shared with her. Granted if his wife does not share his desires, they all have choices to make:

-continue on as they are
-the OP could decide she has had enough
-the OP could find an additional companion
-the wife could issue an ultimatum
-the husband could stand up to the wife about what he really wants
-other permutations