I'm going to be the jerk who says, "I don't understand how people can not understand veganism." I get that (some) people think veganism is silly, misguided, frivolous, or unhealthy. I think they're wrong, of course, but I'm taking about the people (and I've encountered them too) who just can't understand what vegans do and don't eat. The "rules" are pretty simple. If it comes from an animal, it's a no. So, just one rule, really.

All this confusion is like asking someone who you know won't eat red food, "What about tomatoes? Oh, I'm sorry—I didn't realize you didn't eat strawberries!"

You don't have to want to follow the same rules, but how is it this hard to understand?

It has seemed to me just that people want to understand the reasons and when they invent their own reasons, the idea of abstaining from all animal foods doesn't make sense. If they think it's about health, then it's just like any other diet - people go off the diets for special foods or special occasions. The other possibility people seem to think up is that it's an aesthetic discomfort with meat. So meat broth should be fine, because then you don't have to look at the meat or be grossed out by chewing it or whatever (hence people being perplexed about why vegans would eat replacement meats). Then there are some people who really don't seem to understand what foods come from animals - fish and honey seem really perplexing across the board, many are also confused about where eggs and milk come from, and then others include foods that aren't animal-based (peanut butter, anything with yeast).

It's a lot easier if they perceive it as a spiritual decision rather than the "normal" reasons people choose different diets. People seem to get that kosher Jews don't eat pigs, ever, or that observant Muslims don't drink alcohol, ever, or that observant Mormons don't drink caffeinated coffee, ever - this is really parallel to that kind of decision and not parallel to other kinds of dietary decisions.

Yesterday I bought a latte and drank it. Six hours later I was in the grocery store and passing by the milk aisle, and that's when the coin dropped - lattes have milk in them. That milk comes from cows. And I don't eat animal products! What the fork? Was my brain on vacation?

_________________I tend to hook up with people who give me chocolate, but I fail to see how this is a bad thing./tofulish

It's a lot easier if they perceive it as a spiritual decision rather than the "normal" reasons people choose different diets. People seem to get that kosher Jews don't eat pigs, ever, or that observant Muslims don't drink alcohol, ever, or that observant Mormons don't drink caffeinated coffee, ever - this is really parallel to that kind of decision and not parallel to other kinds of dietary decisions.

This is something that really drives me crazy. Most of all my family and friends are Christian. In Christianity, if you don't drink or smoke, it is considered good and holy. But when people find out we're vegan for moral and ethical convictions, they just don't understand it.

You see, when dietary constrictions come from a religion, people respect you and think you're holy OR they feel sorry for you and are understanding about your situation.

But when people hear I'm vegan and gave up meat as a CHOICE, it's like they can't even grasp the idea.

It's a lot easier if they perceive it as a spiritual decision rather than the "normal" reasons people choose different diets. People seem to get that kosher Jews don't eat pigs, ever, or that observant Muslims don't drink alcohol, ever, or that observant Mormons don't drink caffeinated coffee, ever - this is really parallel to that kind of decision and not parallel to other kinds of dietary decisions.

You see, when dietary constrictions come from a religion, people respect you and think you're holy OR they feel sorry for you and are understanding about your situation.

But when people hear I'm vegan and gave up meat as a CHOICE, it's like they can't even grasp the idea.

ooh, isn't it true? When i first came to brazil as a vegan and people didn't grasp it, and my language skills were shaky, I just told everyone i had given everything up for lent, and the response was always the same- a knowing nod, the impressed "wow". Never disbelief. Same place, same people, and 6 years later i am the Space Oddity. I mean, honestly, i don't really care, but I think people tend to put you in whatever box that fits their understanding.

To get back to the original comment, about some people being better prepared to provide a vegan meal, i think it really does depend more on the individual than the culture. Some people are open enough, kind enough, confident enough, or whatever enough to just roll with it, graciously. Some aren't. I've seen good and bad in this sort of situation all over the world, from head-of-lettuce to amazing dinners, and it seems to really depend on the person.

Yesterday I bought a latte and drank it. Six hours later I was in the grocery store and passing by the milk aisle, and that's when the coin dropped - lattes have milk in them. That milk comes from cows. And I don't eat animal products! What the fork? Was my brain on vacation?

Totally off topic, but did you have any side-effects? Several months ago, I suddenly broke out in hives one day and I am convinced I ate something that had hidden dairy.

A vegan friend of mine was in hospital a couple of months ago and I when I went to visit I expected to have to do a food run for her. But, she had no problems with getting vegan hospital food. I found that a big surprise considering we live in the heart of Canadian cattle country.

I think a big part of it is that most people have no idea what they hell is in their food. I have had people (smugly, urgently, questioningly) tell me that I can't eat bread. When I ask why they say "ummmm eggs? Milk?"

I've had the same experience, even to the point that the person argued with me that all bread contains eggs. I just ended up telling the person to read the labels if they didn't believe me. I agree, most people seem to have no idea of what is in their food.

I think a big part of it is that most people have no idea what they hell is in their food. I have had people (smugly, urgently, questioningly) tell me that I can't eat bread. When I ask why they say "ummmm eggs? Milk?"

I've had the same experience, even to the point that the person argued with me that all bread contains eggs. I just ended up telling the person to read the labels if they didn't believe me. I agree, most people seem to have no idea of what is in their food.

Yeah! I'm always bewildered by how much people don't know what's in their food but then I realize I was exactly the same way pre-veg. Obviously I knew major ingredients but never knew anything about the little ones. I find it so empowering to know exactly what I'm consuming.

Not the hospital I was at this summer. I had just delivered my baby - it was still lunchtime so the full kitchen was open. I had told EVERYONE I preferred a vegan diet. When they took my lunch order they reiterated it. What did I get? A turkey sandwhich, broccoli salad with bacon, sweet tea (when I had requested water) and some poached pears in a suspiciously milky looking broth. I was sure they had delivered me the wrong tray. 40 minutes later (and mind you I hadn't eaten in forever and just delivered a baby so I was starving) they brought me a grilled cheese sandwhich and some limp lettuce/tomato that they called a salad (and more of that awful tea).

I think alot of confusion about what Vegans eat come from people who mislabel themselves and say things like "I am vegan, except I sometimes eat fish and ice cream." At one point long ago I was actually one of those people calling myself a vegetarian who sometimes ate fish (because nobody knows what a pescitarian is).

I think a big part of it is that most people have no idea what they hell is in their food. I have had people (smugly, urgently, questioningly) tell me that I can't eat bread. When I ask why they say "ummmm eggs? Milk?"

I've had the same experience, even to the point that the person argued with me that all bread contains eggs. I just ended up telling the person to read the labels if they didn't believe me. I agree, most people seem to have no idea of what is in their food.

I've had two people in the last month tell me that I can't have bread, because yeast.

um...no?

_________________But if one were to tickle Pluto, I suspect that it might very quietly laugh. - pandacookie

55k usd is like 4 cad or whatever equivalent in beavers you use on the island - joshua

I think a big part of it is that most people have no idea what they hell is in their food. I have had people (smugly, urgently, questioningly) tell me that I can't eat bread. When I ask why they say "ummmm eggs? Milk?"

I've had the same experience, even to the point that the person argued with me that all bread contains eggs. I just ended up telling the person to read the labels if they didn't believe me. I agree, most people seem to have no idea of what is in their food.

This woman I was talking to ust would. Not. Believe. That I read the labels on the food that I eat, the clothes that I wear, and the cosmetics that I use. Like all of it. And that I cook a lot of my food from scratch. She started trying to trip me up: "Now what about your shoes, huh? What about bread? You said you had burritos last night, did you check the tortillas?"Then she told me that it's been proven--proven!--that grass has feelings, so don't I realize I'm just as bad as everyone else?It was a fun evening.

I belong to a few playgroups with really nice, intelligent women, and everyone agrees that animals are terribly treated and you should buy organic, eat local, avoid dairy etc. Which is great, except that everyone also thinks that soy causes hormonal imbalances.

You know, I get that soy has phytoestrogens and you're concerned about the effect that those might have on your body (and especially your baby boy), but you know what has even more estrogens that are pretty much the same as ours? Dairy!

And you all avoid giving your kids antibiotics because you want their bodies to process infections and get stronger? Well, don't feed them meat then!

But no, its all, Oh I can't be vegan, because SOY!

_________________My oven is bigger on the inside, and it produces lots of wibbly wobbly, cake wakey... stuff. - The PoopieB.

THROW A forking YAM IN THE OVEN ITS forking CHRISTMAS - LisaPunk

Last edited by Tofulish on Fri Jan 04, 2013 10:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

I belong to a few playgroups with really nice, intelligent women, and everyone agrees that animals are terribly treated and you should buy organic, eat local, avoid dairy etc. Which is great, except that everyone also thinks that soy causes hormonal imbalances.

You know, I get that soy has phytoestrogens and you're concerned about the effect that those might have on your body (and especially your baby boy), but you know what has even more estrogens that are pretty much the same as ours? Dairy!

And you all avoid giving your kids antibiotics because you want their bodies to process infections and get stronger? Well, don't feed them meat then!

But no, its all, Oh I can't be vegan, because SOY!

I get the "OMG SOY!" regularly from people who almost exclusively shop in the center of the grocery store, buying products that probably average 30% GMO Soy filler among all sorts of other crepe.

I encountered some people recently that are on a diet based on a book. The book cites that soy is evil because it is GMO and it is everything and it is the cause of obesity. So you tell people that most soy for human consumption, outside of the soy additives are GMO free. They don't believe it because 'the book' says differently. Where do you think most of that soy goes? It along with corn (which is also a bad thing to them because of GMO corn) goes into animal feed.

_________________You are all a disgrace to vegans. Go f*ck yourselves, especially linanil.

Then she told me that it's been proven--proven!--that grass has feelings, so don't I realize I'm just as bad as everyone else?It was a fun evening.

I wish I had a better stock response to this statement, because most of the time the stupidity of it just leaves me flatfooted and I fail to respond with anything decent.

Me too, I once had a friend try and convince me that cabbage had feelings and water had memories and hence, my being vegan was pointless. This was all based on "scientific fact".

On the topic of people not knowing where their food comes from, we were invited to my brother in-laws for dinner one night and he was asking my husband about what to make. He then proceeded to ask if I ate mushrooms…my husband just laughed and asked him which animal he though mushrooms came from.

Then she told me that it's been proven--proven!--that grass has feelings, so don't I realize I'm just as bad as everyone else?It was a fun evening.

I wish I had a better stock response to this statement, because most of the time the stupidity of it just leaves me flatfooted and I fail to respond with anything decent.

Me too, I once had a friend try and convince me that cabbage had feelings and water had memories...

IT'S TRUE! Just this morning, the water in my kettle was so enraged by the recollection of some past experience that it was literally boiling. When my suggestions that it calm down, take a few deep breaths, and listen to reason were continually ignored, I saw no choice but to make tea in self defense. (Which raises the question: am I still vegan??)

I was mortified when my Bosnian (a pretty meat-heavy cuisine) friend called up his mom as we were driving home and asked if he could bring me over for dinner, and I didn't eat any meat or dairy etc., and insisted he not ask her to go to any trouble, but she made me some of the most delicious grilled veggies and roasted potatoes I've had. I mean it was simple, yeah, but it was delicious and how many American families can pull a vegan meal out of thin air in half an hour?

No pet peeves at this moment (sure they will come soon) but that potato pie looks AWESOME. I pinned it on one of my pinterest boards. It looks super easy, and great for leftovers or picnics. Perfect for when I go wine tasting (we always bring a picnic lunch - something heavy on the carbs)