taurusowner:I'm legitimately curious, does something happen in the human brain around a certain age that makes old people this way? I would imagine that this woman in question had a functioning brain when she was in her 30s for instance. I doubt she would have just given thousands of dollars to a stranger when she was young. What made her unable to rationally evaluate reality now? Similarly, why is it so much harder for older people to learn new skills? I'm not even talking about people in their 70s and 80s. Even adults in their later 40s and 50s seem to lose the ability to do new things. I'm sure I'm not the first person to try to teach an older mother or father how to use a computer. And yet simple stuff like "click the mouse here" is like trying to teach rocket surgery. I'm sure that when the first TVs or some other "new when they were young" piece of tech came out, they used to be pretty good at just learning how to use it. They learned how the 8 tracks in their cars worked. Why is learning a DVD player or how to print something now impossible? Someone who knows about brain chemistry or physiology; is there a medical reason for this kind of thing?

You have to think of the time period of these people. I'm sure in some cases there might be mild dementia involved, but not in most.

Making a phone call wasn't just serious business it was expensive. My grandfather (I was his favorite :P) loved when I'd call, but never ever failed to worry about the cost. Always offering to call me back...and I'd have to explain each time that it wasn't costing me a dime. It used to, I used to budget money to call him when long distance was expensive.

In their lifetime they're used to such emergencies being managed exactly that way. Today, those of us who deal with modernity would know that we could resolve such a matter in numerous ways. Which is why its always taking place outside the country in a region that elderly people still think of as very 3rd world.

They're strongly driven to help. Let's face it, I didn't call Grandpop when I had to move. I can't think of a time I asked him for anything after I wasn't a little kid anymore. (The demands for ice cream eventually ceased when I could buy my own). I *knew* he was on a fixed income, and while he was fortunate enough to have enough money to do all the things he wanted, I suspect the 'old people are on a fixed income' gets hammered into most family members. They're not asked for anything really. Not even advice so much any more.

And now they have an opportunity to help. They were called, they're the ones who can come to the rescue. And they have the ability to help.

So, you can chalk it up to a huge generational gap, technology gap [especially in a crisis], and a keen desire to be useful and to help their family.

My grandfather passed away a couple of years ago, but I used to seriously worry about what would happen if someone ever harmed him in any way. It's not just about what I'd want to do to someone who did something like that, but getting there faster than the rest of my irish relatives.

And such scams are especially vile to most people because it's not playing on someone's greed. This isn't some dumbass who threw away thousands in the greedy unrealistic hope that a prince's estate was going to make them wildly rich.

Nope, this is old people desperate to help a grandchild in need. It's preying on their fear and love. I think most old people are pretty saavy about get rich quick schemes, they've seen too much of life, and don't have enough of it left to fark around with such silliness. But family?

taurusowner:I'm legitimately curious, does something happen in the human brain around a certain age that makes old people this way? I would imagine that this woman in question had a functioning brain when she was in her 30s for instance. I doubt she would have just given thousands of dollars to a stranger when she was young. What made her unable to rationally evaluate reality now? Similarly, why is it so much harder for older people to learn new skills? I'm not even talking about people in their 70s and 80s. Even adults in their later 40s and 50s seem to lose the ability to do new things. I'm sure I'm not the first person to try to teach an older mother or father how to use a computer. And yet simple stuff like "click the mouse here" is like trying to teach rocket surgery. I'm sure that when the first TVs or some other "new when they were young" piece of tech came out, they used to be pretty good at just learning how to use it. They learned how the 8 tracks in their cars worked. Why is learning a DVD player or how to print something now impossible? Someone who knows about brain chemistry or physiology; is there a medical reason for this kind of thing?

It's deterioration in the ventromedial prefrontal cortex, the area of the brain that gives us skepticism.

taurusowner:I'm legitimately curious, does something happen in the human brain around a certain age that makes old people this way? I would imagine that this woman in question had a functioning brain when she was in her 30s for instance. I doubt she would have just given thousands of dollars to a stranger when she was young. What made her unable to rationally evaluate reality now? Similarly, why is it so much harder for older people to learn new skills? I'm not even talking about people in their 70s and 80s. Even adults in their later 40s and 50s seem to lose the ability to do new things. I'm sure I'm not the first person to try to teach an older mother or father how to use a computer. And yet simple stuff like "click the mouse here" is like trying to teach rocket surgery. I'm sure that when the first TVs or some other "new when they were young" piece of tech came out, they used to be pretty good at just learning how to use it. They learned how the 8 tracks in their cars worked. Why is learning a DVD player or how to print something now impossible? Someone who knows about brain chemistry or physiology; is there a medical reason for this kind of thing?

Yes, it is called getting old. I'm a specialist in senior insurance products, and one of the things that we (should) do is look out for cases of elder abuse, especially financial. Somewhere north of 70, the mind just stops thinking so critically. It's not a case where you can say that "This person is 85 and so is incompetent" (my father's aunt is in her '90s and lives independently, just got her first ever phone a few years ago) but you can say that in most people, for whatever reason, they just become easy to swindle. Many seniors just want to avoid conflict, they appreciate people who pay attention to them, and they know the world has changed a lot since when they were younger.

It's very disheartening how many houses get new roofs or driveways every year. It's even worse how many children and grandchildren actively steal from their elders.

I reported several cases to the local prosecutor's office last year, they have a special prosecutor specifically to take on senior abuse cases. But even those guys can be clueless about the financial risks involved with being a senior. You know how we are told to keep our Social Security numbers guarded, leave them at home, don't carry them with your drivers license, etc? Well, when you go on Medicare, your Medicare number is usually your Social Security number with a suffix. Every senior is advised to carry this card with them at all times. This special prosecutor had no idea this was the case. He spent a whole hour giving a presentation on safeguarding SS numbers to a group of seniors, and every one of them dipped into their wallets and brought out their cards, with their SS numbers clearly printed on them.

Because abusers can be family as well as strangers, it's real hard to figure out a good way to combat this other than increasing awareness. One of my clients was recieving a dozen copies each of ten magazines a month. The same "nice young lady" had kept coming back and she was so nice. No, I don't know why I'm getting these magazines. No, I don't know how much I'm paying for them. No, I don't read any of them. But she was such a nice young lady, you don't get polite kids like that anymore. No, I didn't know I was being charged for them, they just offered to send them to me. No, my children don't know about them.

And yet this same older woman is sharp enough to be very on guard about discussing her finances with the insurance agent she asked into her home to discuss those things. She was far more wary of me than of a random stranger knocking on her door.

And I would talk with probably a dozen seniors a year like this. Some were being ripped off for tens of thousands a year. All of them were over age 70.

I'm legitimately curious, does something happen in the human brain around a certain age that makes old people this way? I would imagine that this woman in question had a functioning brain when she was in her 30s for instance. I doubt she would have just given thousands of dollars to a stranger when she was young. What made her unable to rationally evaluate reality now? Similarly, why is it so much harder for older people to learn new skills? I'm not even talking about people in their 70s and 80s. Even adults in their later 40s and 50s seem to lose the ability to do new things. I'm sure I'm not the first person to try to teach an older mother or father how to use a computer. And yet simple stuff like "click the mouse here" is like trying to teach rocket surgery. I'm sure that when the first TVs or some other "new when they were young" piece of tech came out, they used to be pretty good at just learning how to use it. They learned how the 8 tracks in their cars worked. Why is learning a DVD player or how to print something now impossible? Someone who knows about brain chemistry or physiology; is there a medical reason for this kind of thing?

It's not my 77 year old mother who is the problem. There is NOTHING wrong with her critical thinking, and she plays with the scammers on the phone before letting them down heavily. She has 11 kids, and there is no way she can send $2K to save any of them - she has a life to live yet and we are all adults. She remarried after my dad died and she and her husband have different last names, so if they ask for Mrs. "Husbands Name" she will play with them as well, because obviously they have no idea and are cold calling.

I suppose if she got a call saying "Your son needs money in someplace" she would have to ask "Which son are you??" since there are 6 of them.

No, it's not Mom I worry about. It's my youngest brother who apparently keeps finding "girlfriends" in Africa who need just a couple of hundred dollars to get out of trouble and pay for their Visa to Canada. My Mom keeps telling him it's a scam, but he is so starved for a new girlfriend he would do almost anything. He is only 42 .....

yukichigai:SeaMonkey311: I worked at a large utilities company taking payments over the phone. Well, scam started going around where some people believed Obama was paying $1000 to everyone to pay off their utilities bill. They were all just given the same bank account numbers. They never questioned anything, wouldn't even believe me when I told them it was a scam and would default their payment agreements. The ignorance was unbelievable.

What's the other part of the scam? Did they have to pay an "opening fee" to get the bank account number or something?

Nothing. They were told by relatives and given the bank account numbers over the phone. The people initially falling for the scam handed over their SSN's and such. I had one lady insist it was her bank account. I knew the routing numbers for my state and knew it was the scam. Tried to convince her but ooooooh no it was hers, she saw the money.

You know young people do fall for stupid things. Thing of everything on Snopes. I just had someone telling me how dangerous it was to be talking on your cell phone at the gas station. I was like 'huh?' and after 20 seconds of googling I find out that is all a rumor.

These are young people who still have a prefrontal cortex, why aren't they skeptical??

I have a friend who works at a bank who CONSTANTLY has to explain scams to people. Obviously, the bank has strict rules to help protect people against scams, but some people will just argue with them like they really really WANT to fall for the scam. He is like "I can't cash this check for you. We have to see if it is a real check first. Also, this is a well known scam." and they are like "Give me my money!!"

This happened to my SO's grandma. Someone called and said it was her grandson and he was stuck in such and such city and needed some money. Couldn't even tell her which grandson it was though. She was confused because she has 6 grandsons but at least she called one of her kids and they told her it was a scam.

taurusowner:I'm legitimately curious, does something happen in the human brain around a certain age that makes old people this way? I would imagine that this woman in question had a functioning brain when she was in her 30s for instance. I doubt she would have just given thousands of dollars to a stranger when she was young. What made her unable to rationally evaluate reality now? Similarly, why is it so much harder for older people to learn new skills? I'm not even talking about people in their 70s and 80s. Even adults in their later 40s and 50s seem to lose the ability to do new things. I'm sure I'm not the first person to try to teach an older mother or father how to use a computer. And yet simple stuff like "click the mouse here" is like trying to teach rocket surgery. I'm sure that when the first TVs or some other "new when they were young" piece of tech came out, they used to be pretty good at just learning how to use it. They learned how the 8 tracks in their cars worked. Why is learning a DVD player or how to print something now impossible? Someone who knows about brain chemistry or physiology; is there a medical reason for this kind of thing?

I don't know, but I'm finding myself in that spot. I used to have a graphic design business. I thought my experience in print media--using Adobe software--would help me move on to Web development.

I couldn't keep up with the technology. My clients kept asking for more and more complex sites, and I finally had to tell them to find someone else. (Part of it was unrealistic expectations from my clients. One actually, really, no-crap, told me to go look at Donald Trump's site and make him one that looked like that, for $25 an hour.)

But mainly it was me not having the ability to keep up with changing technology. Not without taking time off to take classes, which I couldn't do and run a business and get a good night's sleep.

I visit science Web sites every day, and have a hard time keeping up with--or even feigning interest in--stuff like nanotechnology and gene therapy. Fascinating, no doubt, but not to a 48-year-old ex-stoner like me. I daily watch my own obsolescence encroaching on what would be an otherwise thrilling time to be alive.

HighlanderRPI:Guy I used to work with fell for the Russian Girlfriend scam - wired her a bunch of money for a plane ticket and such, then headed to the airport with a little sign to wait at the terminal for her. Even after multiple people at work told him it was a scam.

/she never showed//He eventually got fired

Yeah... I have an uncle that did the same thing. More than one, in fact, "white bikini model with broken English who is for inexplicable reasons in Ghana and needs $3,000 wired to 'her' to fly to New Jersey and be with him forever".

It's not all about age (my uncle was barely over 50 at the time), although he is a little fried from too many drugs in the 70s.

Good on the HyVee guy for trying to talk sense. It's a hard thing sometimes (when you have someone from the State Department explain that he's being scammed... and he still goes to the airport waiting for Miss Perfect). Unfortunately, Western Union and the other 'money transfer to the third world' companies aren't interested in slowing down the scam trade. It's big money for them.

Guy I used to work with fell for the Russian Girlfriend scam - wired her a bunch of money for a plane ticket and such, then headed to the airport with a little sign to wait at the terminal for her. Even after multiple people at work told him it was a scam.

ModernLuddite:taurusowner: I'm legitimately curious, does something happen in the human brain around a certain age that makes old people this way? I would imagine that this woman in question had a functioning brain when she was in her 30s for instance. I doubt she would have just given thousands of dollars to a stranger when she was young. What made her unable to rationally evaluate reality now? Similarly, why is it so much harder for older people to learn new skills? I'm not even talking about people in their 70s and 80s. Even adults in their later 40s and 50s seem to lose the ability to do new things. I'm sure I'm not the first person to try to teach an older mother or father how to use a computer. And yet simple stuff like "click the mouse here" is like trying to teach rocket surgery. I'm sure that when the first TVs or some other "new when they were young" piece of tech came out, they used to be pretty good at just learning how to use it. They learned how the 8 tracks in their cars worked. Why is learning a DVD player or how to print something now impossible? Someone who knows about brain chemistry or physiology; is there a medical reason for this kind of thing?

I think it's one of two things:

1) You start stupid, and stay stupid. There are young people who just can't do certain things and refuse to learn or try to do it.....it's just a complete block people have on learning things. They say things like "I don't read".

2) A lot of people believe that you get infirm as you age, and talk themselves into it. My mother works at a retirement home, and says she sees it all the time - people who are perfectly healthy, and relatively young, who are just crippled because they think they are. There are examples of people who live perfectly normal, active lives until they die. My great grandfather used to climb up on his roof and do home repairs because the grandkids were, quote, "pussies".

It could also be that as they get old and lose contact with others, they hang onto the few people they have left. It's something that phone scammers know very well. They rarely scam oldsters who have lots of friends and close family members--they get most of their money from people who live alone and are estranged from the few relatives they have left. So the scammer is the only person who calls regularly and the old person will do anything to keep that person calling back. Or in this case, it could be the old lady doesn't have many grandchildren, and panicked when she thought her only grandson was in trouble thousands of miles away.

People like my aged grandmother, who is very close to my mom and calls her all the time, don't fall victim to these scams as much. My grandmother got a call from one of these freaks, telling her she'd won a huge amount of money and needed to send them X dollars for a "processing fee" and the first thing she did was call my mom to find out who she needed to report them to.

Last year we did the same thing at my store. Older guy comes in and says he has to buy these green dot cards and send them to Jamaica because he has won the lottery and needs to buy them to pay the taxes. We didn't know thats what he was doing until he was up to nearly $2000 in cards. When we asked him if he thought it sounded a little strange, he yelled at us for "keeping an old man from his money." Surprise, it was a scam. And he was pissed. That these people had promised photographers to come take his picture and no-one ever showed up. Not the lose of money, that the farking camera crew never showed up.

Someone at a PA Costco saved my grandmother from doing this for my "cousin". The guy at the desk basically insisted that she try to call my cousin before allowing her to file the paperwork. When he answered and was like WTFRUTalkinabout she was greatly relieved.

The brazen asshole called her back asking where the money was an hour after she talked to my real cousin and she said, but we just spoke not an hour ago and you said you were fine.

So thanks random employee. My granny doesn't have much money to spare.

A few years back some woman claiming to be an old friend of my Aunt stole several hundred dollars in cash from my grandparents while she was "going to the bathroom" after being invited into my grandparents house.

taurusowner:I'm legitimately curious, does something happen in the human brain around a certain age that makes old people this way? I would imagine that this woman in question had a functioning brain when she was in her 30s for instance. I doubt she would have just given thousands of dollars to a stranger when she was young. What made her unable to rationally evaluate reality now? Similarly, why is it so much harder for older people to learn new skills? I'm not even talking about people in their 70s and 80s. Even adults in their later 40s and 50s seem to lose the ability to do new things. I'm sure I'm not the first person to try to teach an older mother or father how to use a computer. And yet simple stuff like "click the mouse here" is like trying to teach rocket surgery. I'm sure that when the first TVs or some other "new when they were young" piece of tech came out, they used to be pretty good at just learning how to use it. They learned how the 8 tracks in their cars worked. Why is learning a DVD player or how to print something now impossible? Someone who knows about brain chemistry or physiology; is there a medical reason for this kind of thing?

I think it's one of two things:

1) You start stupid, and stay stupid. There are young people who just can't do certain things and refuse to learn or try to do it.....it's just a complete block people have on learning things. They say things like "I don't read".

2) A lot of people believe that you get infirm as you age, and talk themselves into it. My mother works at a retirement home, and says she sees it all the time - people who are perfectly healthy, and relatively young, who are just crippled because they think they are. There are examples of people who live perfectly normal, active lives until they die. My great grandfather used to climb up on his roof and do home repairs because the grandkids were, quote, "pussies".

My father is mean and I can't remember ever liking him, but he did one thing I highly approve of. Many years ago, a young man went to my maternal grandmother and told her one of my sisters' was involved in some emergency. She gave him cash to take to my sister and he spent it on drugs. My father went to his domicile, kicked the door in, picked Mr.Druggie up by his throat and shook him like a rag doll. Mr. Druggie stayed the heck away from my grandmother after that.

taurusowner:I'm legitimately curious, does something happen in the human brain around a certain age that makes old people this way? I would imagine that this woman in question had a functioning brain when she was in her 30s for instance. I doubt she would have just given thousands of dollars to a stranger when she was young. What made her unable to rationally evaluate reality now? Similarly, why is it so much harder for older people to learn new skills? I'm not even talking about people in their 70s and 80s. Even adults in their later 40s and 50s seem to lose the ability to do new things. I'm sure I'm not the first person to try to teach an older mother or father how to use a computer. And yet simple stuff like "click the mouse here" is like trying to teach rocket surgery. I'm sure that when the first TVs or some other "new when they were young" piece of tech came out, they used to be pretty good at just learning how to use it. They learned how the 8 tracks in their cars worked. Why is learning a DVD player or how to print something now impossible? Someone who knows about brain chemistry or physiology; is there a medical reason for this kind of thing?

Sad how naive they are. My grandfather talks about shiat like this all the time and I shoot him down time and again. He also calls KFC a "chicken restaurant." They're living in different versions of reality.

My father-in-law fell for the grandson in Canada needing money scam a couple of years ago, they got around 5k from him before the rest of the family caught on. When my sister-in-law found out and attempted to stop him from sending money to her "son" he could not be convinced that he wasn't stuck in Canada, even though they had been to the son's house the night before.

ModernLuddite:2) A lot of people believe that you get infirm as you age, and talk themselves into it. My mother works at a retirement home, and says she sees it all the time - people who are perfectly healthy, and relatively young, who are just crippled because they think they are. There are examples of people who live perfectly normal, active lives until they die. My great grandfather used to climb up on his roof and do home repairs because the grandkids were, quote, "pussies".

I don't think that is the case. my grandfather, god love him, has a cabin in minnesota. he tries like hell to mow the lawn against the protests of his sons and myself... he just wants to do it, but when it comes to gutters, he knows his limitations. now when it comes to playing catchphrase during family game time around the holidays.... well, id rather have my six year old son on my team.

what i am saying is that he hasnt given up on life, but his faculties are escaping him. HOWEVER he was telling me a story about how some guy was trying to scam him and he knew from the start it was BS. so there ya go

I worked at a large utilities company taking payments over the phone. Well, scam started going around where some people believed Obama was paying $1000 to everyone to pay off their utilities bill. They were all just given the same bank account numbers. They never questioned anything, wouldn't even believe me when I told them it was a scam and would default their payment agreements. The ignorance was unbelievable.

Honest Bender:spidermilk: You know young people do fall for stupid things. Thing of everything on Snopes. I just had someone telling me how dangerous it was to be talking on your cell phone at the gas station. I was like 'huh?' and after 20 seconds of googling I find out that is all a rumor.

These are young people who still have a prefrontal cortex, why aren't they skeptical??

[c-storeadvisor.gilbarco.com image 400x352]

No comment about the likelihood of a cellphone causing problems at the gas pump...

Mythbusters has proven this to be 100% false. Getting in and out of the car while pumping however can cause enough static charge to light the fumes. Especially if you're wearing cotton panties and a skirt. Nice, cotton panties.....

spidermilk:You know young people do fall for stupid things. Thing of everything on Snopes. I just had someone telling me how dangerous it was to be talking on your cell phone at the gas station. I was like 'huh?' and after 20 seconds of googling I find out that is all a rumor.

These are young people who still have a prefrontal cortex, why aren't they skeptical??

No comment about the likelihood of a cellphone causing problems at the gas pump...

I'm really grateful my grandmother kept her wits the full 95 years, because she had a lot of money squirreled away. We probably would have noticed fairly quickly if she had been scammed, but she had a fair amount to lose so it could have been ugly.

/really wish she was still here/paid off most of our house with my share though...

My elderly mother once gave a guy (friend of her landscaper) named "Snoop Dogg" 5K to further his educational goals, never to see the Dogg again.Fark: I was paying her back 5K she had lent me at 5% interest.

Gyrfalcon:ModernLuddite: taurusowner: I'm legitimately curious, does something happen in the human brain around a certain age that makes old people this way? I would imagine that this woman in question had a functioning brain when she was in her 30s for instance. I doubt she would have just given thousands of dollars to a stranger when she was young. What made her unable to rationally evaluate reality now? Similarly, why is it so much harder for older people to learn new skills? I'm not even talking about people in their 70s and 80s. Even adults in their later 40s and 50s seem to lose the ability to do new things. I'm sure I'm not the first person to try to teach an older mother or father how to use a computer. And yet simple stuff like "click the mouse here" is like trying to teach rocket surgery. I'm sure that when the first TVs or some other "new when they were young" piece of tech came out, they used to be pretty good at just learning how to use it. They learned how the 8 tracks in their cars worked. Why is learning a DVD player or how to print something now impossible? Someone who knows about brain chemistry or physiology; is there a medical reason for this kind of thing?

I think it's one of two things:

1) You start stupid, and stay stupid. There are young people who just can't do certain things and refuse to learn or try to do it.....it's just a complete block people have on learning things. They say things like "I don't read".

2) A lot of people believe that you get infirm as you age, and talk themselves into it. My mother works at a retirement home, and says she sees it all the time - people who are perfectly healthy, and relatively young, who are just crippled because they think they are. There are examples of people who live perfectly normal, active lives until they die. My great grandfather used to climb up on his roof and do home repairs because the grandkids were, quote, "pussies".

It could also be that as they get old and lose contact with others, they hang onto the few people they have left. It's something that phone scammers know very well. They rarely scam oldsters who have lots of friends and close family members--they get most of their money from people who live alone and are estranged from the few relatives they have left. So the scammer is the only person who calls regularly and the old person will do anything to keep that person calling back. Or in this case, it could be the old lady doesn't have many grandchildren, and panicked when she thought her only grandson was in trouble thousands of miles away.

People like my aged grandmother, who is very close to my mom and calls her all the time, don't fall victim to these scams as much. My grandmother got a call from one of these freaks, telling her she'd won a huge amount of money and needed to send them X dollars for a "processing fee" and the first thing she did was call my mom to find out who she needed to report them to.

Yeah... it's sad.

I've done non profit fundraising where older gentlemen - the 3 off the top of my head had just lost their long term spouse - would try to give me money - to keep - just because I spent time to talk to them. If there were kids they were states away... I always refused and said it had to go to the non-profit and then lied and said we couldn't take donations over X amount.

Sigh.

/no grandparents left myself//but we saw my grandmoms at least once a week or more///f--king broke my heart when one guy who tried to give me $50 within 5 minutes of meeting me said the waitress at a diner watched out for him but his in town daughter hadn't visited in a year

liltingbanshee:I know a lady who fell for this scam. This is the same 86 year old lady who got taken by the "phone call from Microsoft" scam. She is a very intelligent and well-educated person, too, not senile as far as I can tell. I don't know why she falls for these things.

My mom got one of those "Microsoft" phone calls. She's in her 60s but she's not computer un-savvy at all so she realized the scam right away. Still, every time I've heard about someone getting that call in the area it's always someone 50+. It's simultaneously eerie and sad.

I know a lady who fell for this scam. This is the same 86 year old lady who got taken by the "phone call from Microsoft" scam. She is a very intelligent and well-educated person, too, not senile as far as I can tell. I don't know why she falls for these things.