Pope Francis has denounced the global financial system, blasting the "cult of money" that he says is tyrannizing the poor and turning humans into expendable consumer goods.

In his first major speech on the subject, Francis demanded Thursday that financial and political leaders reform the global financial system to make it more ethical and concerned for the common good. He said: "Money has to serve, not to rule!"

"There is a need for financial reform along ethical lines that would produce in its turn an economic reform to benefit everyone," Pope Francis said, according to official Vatican Radio.

The Pope went on to say, “the majority of the men and women of our time continue to live daily in situations of insecurity, with dire consequences… People have to struggle to live and, frequently, to live in an undignified way.”

Pope Francis explained that in his opinion one cause of this situation was the relationship people have with money today.The worship of the golden calf of old, has a new image, he said according to Vatican Radio, “in the cult of money and the dictatorship of an economy which is faceless and lacking any truly humane goal.

"Human beings themselves are nowadays considered as consumer goods which can be used and thrown away,” he went on to say.

It's a message Francis delivered on many occasions when he was archbishop of Buenos Aires, and it's one that was frequently stressed by retired Pope Benedict XVI.Francis, who has made clear the poor are his priority, made the comments as he greeted his first group of new ambassadors accredited to the Holy See from Kyrgyzstan, Antigua and Barbuda, Botswana, and the Grand Duchy of Luxemberg.

Pope Francis ‏tweeted May 8th,"I have come that they may have life and have it in abundance, says Jesus. This is where true wealth is found, not in material things!"

I agree that too many people worship at the alter of the all mighty dollar. But, he is attacking capitalism. The article makes it seem as if he wants to go to a global communistic economy. Well, MR. Pope. Usually, when communism takes control, religion gets outlawed. That would put you out of a job. Be careful what you ask for.

May 20th, 2013, 11:05 am

wjb21ndtown

Re: Pope Francis Blasts "Cult Of Money"

BillySims wrote:

I agree that too many people worship at the alter of the all mighty dollar. But, he is attacking capitalism. The article makes it seem as if he wants to go to a global communistic economy. Well, MR. Pope. Usually, when communism takes control, religion gets outlawed. That would put you out of a job. Be careful what you ask for.

In no way does this "attack capitalism." He says that "money" should serve not rule," he still believes in money as both a means and an ends. If he were advocating for communism in any way, there would be no need for money. He's looking for a shift in thinking, and it's something that I happen to agree with. The only issue is that it's tough to go about doing. I'm all for making life more dignified for poor people, and not "demonizing" poor people. However, it has to be done in tasteful ways that still entices people to work, and it has to be free from luxury.

EBT cards should be limited to whole foods (raw fruits, veggies, and meats). Heck, I wouldn't even mind govt. subsidies that made things like apples free to everyone, if they could find a way to do that and not put local farmers out of business, and still force private corporations to pay for such items that they will later turn into processed foods (note: I don't think it's possible, but it is an idealistic approach that I wouldn't mind happening).

I agree that too many people worship at the alter of the all mighty dollar. But, he is attacking capitalism. The article makes it seem as if he wants to go to a global communistic economy. Well, MR. Pope. Usually, when communism takes control, religion gets outlawed. That would put you out of a job. Be careful what you ask for.

In no way does this "attack capitalism." He says that "money" should serve not rule," he still believes in money as both a means and an ends. If he were advocating for communism in any way, there would be no need for money. He's looking for a shift in thinking, and it's something that I happen to agree with. The only issue is that it's tough to go about doing. I'm all for making life more dignified for poor people, and not "demonizing" poor people. However, it has to be done in tasteful ways that still entices people to work, and it has to be free from luxury.

EBT cards should be limited to whole foods (raw fruits, veggies, and meats). Heck, I wouldn't even mind govt. subsidies that made things like apples free to everyone, if they could find a way to do that and not put local farmers out of business, and still force private corporations to pay for such items that they will later turn into processed foods (note: I don't think it's possible, but it is an idealistic approach that I wouldn't mind happening).

Quote:

Francis demanded Thursday that financial and political leaders reform the global financial system to make it more ethical and concerned for the common good.

That sounds communistic to me. The phrase for the common good always leads to communism.

May 20th, 2013, 11:46 am

wjb21ndtown

Re: Pope Francis Blasts "Cult Of Money"

BillySims wrote:

wjb21ndtown wrote:

BillySims wrote:

I agree that too many people worship at the alter of the all mighty dollar. But, he is attacking capitalism. The article makes it seem as if he wants to go to a global communistic economy. Well, MR. Pope. Usually, when communism takes control, religion gets outlawed. That would put you out of a job. Be careful what you ask for.

In no way does this "attack capitalism." He says that "money" should serve not rule," he still believes in money as both a means and an ends. If he were advocating for communism in any way, there would be no need for money. He's looking for a shift in thinking, and it's something that I happen to agree with. The only issue is that it's tough to go about doing. I'm all for making life more dignified for poor people, and not "demonizing" poor people. However, it has to be done in tasteful ways that still entices people to work, and it has to be free from luxury.

EBT cards should be limited to whole foods (raw fruits, veggies, and meats). Heck, I wouldn't even mind govt. subsidies that made things like apples free to everyone, if they could find a way to do that and not put local farmers out of business, and still force private corporations to pay for such items that they will later turn into processed foods (note: I don't think it's possible, but it is an idealistic approach that I wouldn't mind happening).

Quote:

Francis demanded Thursday that financial and political leaders reform the global financial system to make it more ethical and concerned for the common good.

That sounds communistic to me. The phrase for the common good always leads to communism.

Adding equality into the system isn't "communistic" per se.

May 20th, 2013, 11:47 am

TheRealWags

Modmin Dude

Joined: December 31st, 2004, 9:55 amPosts: 12278

Re: Pope Francis Blasts "Cult Of Money"

To me, it just sounds like he's repeating Jesus' teachings, was Jesus a Communist?

I agree that too many people worship at the alter of the all mighty dollar. But, he is attacking capitalism. The article makes it seem as if he wants to go to a global communistic economy. Well, MR. Pope. Usually, when communism takes control, religion gets outlawed. That would put you out of a job. Be careful what you ask for.

In no way does this "attack capitalism." He says that "money" should serve not rule," he still believes in money as both a means and an ends. If he were advocating for communism in any way, there would be no need for money. He's looking for a shift in thinking, and it's something that I happen to agree with. The only issue is that it's tough to go about doing. I'm all for making life more dignified for poor people, and not "demonizing" poor people. However, it has to be done in tasteful ways that still entices people to work, and it has to be free from luxury.

EBT cards should be limited to whole foods (raw fruits, veggies, and meats). Heck, I wouldn't even mind govt. subsidies that made things like apples free to everyone, if they could find a way to do that and not put local farmers out of business, and still force private corporations to pay for such items that they will later turn into processed foods (note: I don't think it's possible, but it is an idealistic approach that I wouldn't mind happening).

Quote:

Francis demanded Thursday that financial and political leaders reform the global financial system to make it more ethical and concerned for the common good.

That sounds communistic to me. The phrase for the common good always leads to communism.

Adding equality into the system isn't "communistic" per se.

No. Instead equality = no rich and no poor. Which can never happen in nature anyway. But, that don't keep the ruling elite from trying. There will always be rich people. They are the ruling elite. They will never let themselves lose their great wealth. Instead of equality, you end up with the super rich and the super poor. Wheres the equality in that. The only thing that scares the crap out of the ruling elite is the middle class. So, their equality means the elimination of the middle class. Only, the middle class won't be joining the wealthy. They will be joining the super poor.

To me, it just sounds like he's repeating Jesus' teachings, was Jesus a Communist?

Communism, as a principle, is not a bad thing. Problem is, Humans get corrupted. And once your leadership, in a Communistic society is corrupted, you won't want to be a member of that society, unless you are in the ruling elite.

To me, it just sounds like he's repeating Jesus' teachings, was Jesus a Communist?

Communism, as a principle, is not a bad thing. Problem is, Humans get corrupted. And once your leadership, in a Communistic society is corrupted, you won't want to be a member of that society, unless you are in the ruling elite.

Agreed.Just thinking out loud here, but couldn't a 'new / different' economic system be created that would harness / include the good / best parts of various ones? In other words, a Communistic - Democratic - Capitalistic Hybrid?

To me, it just sounds like he's repeating Jesus' teachings, was Jesus a Communist?

Communism, as a principle, is not a bad thing. Problem is, Humans get corrupted. And once your leadership, in a Communistic society is corrupted, you won't want to be a member of that society, unless you are in the ruling elite.

Agreed.Just thinking out loud here, but couldn't a 'new / different' economic system be created that would harness / include the good / best parts of various ones? In other words, a Communistic - Democratic - Capitalistic Hybrid?

Capitalism and Communism are 2 opposite economic systems. It would be impossible to merge them. They try to accomplish different outcomes. You would end up with an economic mess that no-one could fix. And while it might start out as a democracy, once the middle class has disappeared, the ruling elite would become corrupted. Once they become corrupted, there goes your elections. Simply put, you are either going to be a Capitalist or a Communist. You can't be both. While Capitalism isn't all that it's cracked up to be, at least it keeps the middle class in place to keep the wealthy in check. And that prevents the Wealthy from getting too corrupted.

May 20th, 2013, 1:25 pm

regularjoe12

Off. Coordinator – Joe Lombardi

Joined: March 30th, 2006, 12:48 amPosts: 3955Location: Davison Mi

Re: Pope Francis Blasts "Cult Of Money"

BillySims wrote:

TheRealWags wrote:

BillySims wrote:

TheRealWags wrote:

To me, it just sounds like he's repeating Jesus' teachings, was Jesus a Communist?

Communism, as a principle, is not a bad thing. Problem is, Humans get corrupted. And once your leadership, in a Communistic society is corrupted, you won't want to be a member of that society, unless you are in the ruling elite.

Agreed.Just thinking out loud here, but couldn't a 'new / different' economic system be created that would harness / include the good / best parts of various ones? In other words, a Communistic - Democratic - Capitalistic Hybrid?

Capitalism and Communism are 2 opposite economic systems. It would be impossible to merge them. They try to accomplish different outcomes. You would end up with an economic mess that no-one could fix. And while it might start out as a democracy, once the middle class has disappeared, the ruling elite would become corrupted. Once they become corrupted, there goes your elections. Simply put, you are either going to be a Capitalist or a Communist. You can't be both. While Capitalism isn't all that it's cracked up to be, at least it keeps the middle class in place to keep the wealthy in check. And that prevents the Wealthy from getting too corrupted.

So you'd get what you have today then????

(see bolded part)

_________________2013 Lionbacker Fantasy Football Champion

May 20th, 2013, 1:33 pm

TheRealWags

Modmin Dude

Joined: December 31st, 2004, 9:55 amPosts: 12278

Re: Pope Francis Blasts "Cult Of Money"

BillySims wrote:

TheRealWags wrote:

BillySims wrote:

TheRealWags wrote:

To me, it just sounds like he's repeating Jesus' teachings, was Jesus a Communist?

Communism, as a principle, is not a bad thing. Problem is, Humans get corrupted. And once your leadership, in a Communistic society is corrupted, you won't want to be a member of that society, unless you are in the ruling elite.

Agreed.Just thinking out loud here, but couldn't a 'new / different' economic system be created that would harness / include the good / best parts of various ones? In other words, a Communistic - Democratic - Capitalistic Hybrid?

Capitalism and Communism are 2 opposite economic systems. It would be impossible to merge them. They try to accomplish different outcomes. You would end up with an economic mess that no-one could fix. And while it might start out as a democracy, once the middle class has disappeared, the ruling elite would become corrupted. Once they become corrupted, there goes your elections. Simply put, you are either going to be a Capitalist or a Communist. You can't be both. While Capitalism isn't all that it's cracked up to be, at least it keeps the middle class in place to keep the wealthy in check. And that prevents the Wealthy from getting too corrupted.

I said "harness / include the good / best parts of various ones".

Why couldn't you take the good of Communism as you state, the principle of it, and combine it with a democratically elected Govt to oversee it? Because they would be elected, they wouldn't be anymore corrupted than what we have now. Or would that be considered Socialism?

_________________

Quote:

Clowns to the left of me, Jokers to the right....

May 20th, 2013, 1:35 pm

regularjoe12

Off. Coordinator – Joe Lombardi

Joined: March 30th, 2006, 12:48 amPosts: 3955Location: Davison Mi

Re: Pope Francis Blasts "Cult Of Money"

TheRealWags wrote:

BillySims wrote:

TheRealWags wrote:

BillySims wrote:

TheRealWags wrote:

To me, it just sounds like he's repeating Jesus' teachings, was Jesus a Communist?

Communism, as a principle, is not a bad thing. Problem is, Humans get corrupted. And once your leadership, in a Communistic society is corrupted, you won't want to be a member of that society, unless you are in the ruling elite.

Agreed.Just thinking out loud here, but couldn't a 'new / different' economic system be created that would harness / include the good / best parts of various ones? In other words, a Communistic - Democratic - Capitalistic Hybrid?

Capitalism and Communism are 2 opposite economic systems. It would be impossible to merge them. They try to accomplish different outcomes. You would end up with an economic mess that no-one could fix. And while it might start out as a democracy, once the middle class has disappeared, the ruling elite would become corrupted. Once they become corrupted, there goes your elections. Simply put, you are either going to be a Capitalist or a Communist. You can't be both. While Capitalism isn't all that it's cracked up to be, at least it keeps the middle class in place to keep the wealthy in check. And that prevents the Wealthy from getting too corrupted.

I said "harness / include the good / best parts of various ones".

Why couldn't you take the good of Communism as you state, the principle of it, and combine it with a democratically elected Govt to oversee it? Because they would be elected, they wouldn't be anymore corrupted than what we have now. Or would that be considered Socialism?

To me, it just sounds like he's repeating Jesus' teachings, was Jesus a Communist?

Communism, as a principle, is not a bad thing. Problem is, Humans get corrupted. And once your leadership, in a Communistic society is corrupted, you won't want to be a member of that society, unless you are in the ruling elite.

Agreed.Just thinking out loud here, but couldn't a 'new / different' economic system be created that would harness / include the good / best parts of various ones? In other words, a Communistic - Democratic - Capitalistic Hybrid?

Capitalism and Communism are 2 opposite economic systems. It would be impossible to merge them. They try to accomplish different outcomes. You would end up with an economic mess that no-one could fix. And while it might start out as a democracy, once the middle class has disappeared, the ruling elite would become corrupted. Once they become corrupted, there goes your elections. Simply put, you are either going to be a Capitalist or a Communist. You can't be both. While Capitalism isn't all that it's cracked up to be, at least it keeps the middle class in place to keep the wealthy in check. And that prevents the Wealthy from getting too corrupted.

So you'd get what you have today then????

(see bolded part)

Yes, we have an economic mess. And that is because a bunch of Socialists( A.K.A Communists) have been elected in this country who are well into the process of doing exactly what the Pope wants done world wide. Fortunately, our economy has proven far more resistant to their efforts than most would have predicted. Thus, we still have a middle class, even though it is shrinking faster and faster every year. And as a result of us still having a middle class, we still have elections. Though, I am of the opinion that our elections have been getting fixed since George H.W. Bush. ( I think Ronald Reagan was our last real president. Everyone since then has been a hand picked puppet for the ruling elite. For what purpose? A new world order that George H.W. Bush talked about in one of his speeches ). That New World Order has progressively been installed and is just about completely here. Virtually all that is left for it to be completely installed is a world economic collapse. Which some economists are predicting will happen before the end of 2013.