I am using DW CS.5 to create a website for a client and they want a CMS package that is computer illiterate user friendly to update the weekly events of their business (restaurant/bar).

I am very new to the game and feel in over my head.

It looks like there are two options:

Using an online CMS like Drupl, Joomla or WP

Using an DW extension such as contribute or TDE Website editior.

I am looking for the cheapest and easist alternative. Any advice. and please use normal every day human language as I can write Html code from memory but I don't actually understand fully what I am doing.

I've never used it but feel sure i will. I tend to use Wordpress but that has a pretty big learning curve for developer and user especially if you want it to fit what you're dining rather than the other way around.

You can be sure that Drupal, Wordpress and Joomla will be able to help you achieve what you want and then some. But your comment in the original post about feeling that you are in over your head, makes me think that it is a lot to take on. Yes, they're free and open source and they are great fun to learn but it is a lot of learning despite their huge following and established communities. If you are good at learning and have a reasonable grasp of PHP, HTML and CSS then it would be much easier.

It looks like they all have apps for event pages, gig calenders and gallerys. which is what i need.

It's just that i already created most of the website in DW already and now they have told me they want this, and I'm not getting paid much, unfortunately it's one of those situation I can't get out of so I want to find the easiest and most time effective way to use what I've got and provide what the client needs. i just need to decide which one is best to use. Joomla, drupl and wordpress are free but you have to pay for add ons and I'm wondering if by the time I add a gig calender etc it will be cheaper to go with perch.

Basically I just want to incorporate a CMS into my current DW stylesheet so I don't have to remake the website or learn a new progam. The CMS needs to allow for online login, and editing an events page, gigcalendar and photo gallery.

Ok, so I have narrowed it down to two options but I still have questions.

If I use joomla the I can create a gigcalendar exactly like the one in the example website, which is what the client wants. But can I use the template I have already created in dreamweaver instead of the joomla templates and just use joomla for the sections that i want to be editable to the client?

Or I can use perch, which looks reallt easy to use and seems like I don't need to remake my site but use what i have already created in DW. However I can't see any visual examples of the galleries or calendars and I'm worried they will be ugly and not what the client wants.

Having declared already that I've never used Perch it's difficult to comment although, it won't stop me now! You might do well to ask some questions on their forum. If I had to add CMS to a static site I would definitely go with Perch.

If you're worried about it not looking good then I imagine that will be down to your ability with HTML/CSS. I would expect Perch to be customisable based on the fact that you can plug it in to an existing site. Again, it might be best to have a look at their setup port stuff.

Why don't you also think about showing your client what Perch can bring to the party and see if they will stump up a bit more for the work? Their introductory video was quite good and it might help you with the decision.

I can tell you this, I'm currently teaching a customer how to work with Wordpress and it is a) agony and b) time consuming!

Perch is a great little cms. I don't know much about the events application add-on but if you ask around in the forum youre sure to get a response.

I hate to say this BUT if the client isn't paying you much to do this then they can only expect what you can provide them with. If it isnt exactly the same as the example then tough.

Myself I would probably just do away with the fancy calander and just have links to the months, then list the events in that month. Might not look as pretty but on a budget it does a more than adequate job.

If it is only one or two pages that you want your client to be able to change, you might like to try what I used to do many moons ago.

The idea is to create a text file (I call it a text file because it does not contain the normal document structure) to be included into your document. In a secured backend, the text file is loaded into an HTML editor, http://ckeditor.com/. Within the editor the client can change the contents and save it. Very much like using word.

Am I right in thinking that in order to edit the page my client will also need DW and Konductor on their system?

This seems like a more expensive alternative if this is the case. I am after something that my client can edit online so they can access it from work or home or whereever they are without having to purchase softoware they don't understand.

No. Konductor is 2 things, 1) a free Dreamweaver extension for Designers and 2) an Application that allows Clients to edit content defined by the designer. Similar to Contribute but 100 times better for Designers and 10000 times easier for clients.

Don't know if anyone has suggested this, but someone here suggested to me that I use CushyCMS, which I have used very successfully with several clients. It is easy and free to set up. You can find them at cushycms.com: http://www.cushycms.com/en

Editing happens in client's browser through their link to their cushycms admin page. Each editable element or area is defined as an edit field with edit tools like those at the top of the forum edit panels.

If the changes that they are trying to make involves ONLY a calendar, I have also successfully embedded a Google calendar, which requires no messing with the website at all, as the calendar owner edits totally off the site.

well you had me sold on the perch thing but it turns out my system is not compatible as I don't have PHP. I have been looking at all the numerous possibilities everyone has suggested and they all seem like they might be hard to sell to the client due to the cost. Another option that was suggested by a friend was to skin WP, but I haven't got a clue how to do that. Do you have any other thoughts on how I can keep all the design work I have done in DW but integrate a cheap CMS package that offers gallery and gigcalendar options?

I have been looking into Konductor and you don't edit online. You edit through the Konductor editing application which you upload. I feel that this process is going to be difficult to explain to my clients. They would also have to download the application to all of the computers they use, where as they want to be able to access and edit their site no matter where they are. It seems like it is not the easiest approach for a client.

Do you know anything about skinning WP and using it as a CMS within DW?

Why is WP so hard to teach? If I can work out how to skin a wp site it seems like it will be the cheapest option. Perch obviously would be better but my system is just not compatible.

Ren

If you can run WP then you can run Perch. Why do you say it is not compatible? All CMS packages use: MySQL, PHP, and Apache server. All three are free to download and configure on any Windows, Mac, OS X and Linux systems.

I found Wordpress really challenging but when I started out I was still only just learning. Since then Wordpress has got better but if anything, it is more complex. If you want to get a site going quickly and are content to use someone else's theme you can get publishing content within a half hour. For that matter, so could your client.

I have just finished a Wordpress site. It was me that talked the client in to having it over a static site. I'm now on about day 5 of showing this person how to use it. Yes, with a combination of evenings, weekends, txt &amp; email, 5 full days!

If you want to run Wordpress you need to firstly, understand the template hierarchy, work out how to make different content pages say, by using categories and learn about how to make it as secure as you can. You might be well advised to have a look at child themes too.

I reckon all of that is about as much as I've worked out for myself. The amount of online support available is astonishing. However, depending on what you want to do and your level of knowledge it still isn't all easy to grasp.

For my next project, my client wants the ability to edit now and again. I'm going to go with Concrete5 I think.

Martin

PS all of the CMSs I've looked at run on PHP. There are other options but I thought PHP was everywhere? It might not be on your own system but as someone has already indicated, you can install it easy enough. Your client should not need to install anything.

thanks I fixed it. I downloaded PHP, created a new database on my server and the test came back positive this time. I like perch because the video tutorials have made so much more sense than any of the other CMS packages I have looked at and it seems so much cheaper as well.

Perch 2 has just been released and the pages UI is a massive step forward from v1. For ease of use and pricing it's the best in its category on the market. You can be editing pages in a matter of minutes using the friendly <perch tags> which you just replace your content with. You can build 'custom' templates if you require to do so which automates the process a bit more. Adding/Deleting pages is a breeze. If the client can't use Perch then they won't be able to use any CMS.

1. You will labor intensively to implement the CMS and train the client how to use it (this regardless of which CMS you choose)

I agree. It's a question of better the devil you know when it comes to CMS's. I'd rather not integrate any CMS into a website if I'm honest. Depending on the degree to which the client wants to update the site depends on its success or failure. What bugs me is in my time as a DTP operator no client ever said 'hey I have a fresh copy of Quark Express, toss over your well planned and finished design and let me make the final edits'......... can you imagine the mess they would likely make. Websites are no different.....why let an untrained monkey loose with something which 1) They don't know how to use and 2) can't be bothered to spend time learning how to use it.

I guess the way to go would be to give the client something, restricted access to limited sections of the site like 'news updates' etc. Once they want full access to every page, image uploads, etc etc its likey to be more trouble than its worth.

I built a search/image library for a client at the begining of the year where they could upload the images and input the details about the image for their clients to search for and download in hi-res. I jumped through hoops getting this thing working and they haven't used it because they claim uploading a few images were too time consuming and difficult.

The upside is that it's incrementally easier to make most changes using the CMS (and you *can* do this in an internet cafe, for example), than it is to find the page, open it, make the change, save it and upload the changes. Note that I said "incrementally" easier. In other words, I wouldn't do this for that reason alone.