I was cleaning up my hard drive and came across this pic. Many of you have probably seen it before.

Dan Martin

09-08-2003, 07:50 PM

I'm still amazed that he died in that accident. Aside from the wheel, the inside looks pretty good.

bluer1

09-08-2003, 08:36 PM

I'm still amazed that he died in that accident. Aside from the wheel, the inside looks pretty good.

I'm not - but then I always wear a full face helmet at the track.

in_d_haus

09-08-2003, 08:56 PM

We had a club member that specializes in racing safety devices come speak to us and he went in depth about that wreck. While it looked fairly mild the loads were subatantial on his neck

bluer1

09-08-2003, 09:10 PM

We had a club member that specializes in racing safety devices come speak to us and he went in depth about that wreck. While it looked fairly mild the loads were subatantial on his neck

The loads from which impact? The car hitting the wall or his face contacting the wheel?
:rolleyes:

My disdain for Nascar aside, I still fall into the "full-faced helmet and tight harness" camp.
:eeps:

Artslinger

09-09-2003, 07:17 AM

The loads from which impact? The car hitting the wall or his face contacting the wheel?
:rolleyes:

My disdain for Nascar aside, I still fall into the "full-faced helmet and tight harness" camp.
:eeps:

I believe he was wearing a full face. And his accident and death helped push many series to require the HANS Device for drivers. Tight harness... I have know idea what you are saying with this comment... have you seen the harness that NASCAR requires.

bluer1

09-09-2003, 07:31 AM

I believe he was wearing a full face. And his accident and death helped push many series to require the HANS Device for drivers. Tight harness... I have know idea what you are saying with this comment... have you seen the harness that NASCAR requires.

He wasn't wearing a full faced helmet and in fact used a non-standard harness, (standard harness, but non-standard installation and was reported to regularly wear it quite loosely).

The HANS device is nothing more than a whip prevention mechanism. It won't prevent posterior mandible/maxilla displacement.

At the end of the day, he was primarily responsible for his own safety.

Guest84

09-09-2003, 07:47 AM

His son switched to full face the next time he got into a race car.

Learning from others mistakes is a good thing!

Artslinger

09-09-2003, 09:15 AM

He wasn't wearing a full faced helmet and in fact used a non-standard harness, (standard harness, but non-standard installation and was reported to regularly wear it quite loosely).

The HANS device is nothing more than a whip prevention mechanism. It won't prevent posterior mandible/maxilla displacement.

At the end of the day, he was primarily responsible for his own safety.

Not necessarily NASCAR has known for a long time the problem with the very rigid cage and a hard wall... Neil Bonnett, Adam Petty, Kenny Irwin. Not to mention you're just speculating on how tight his belts were at the race, and I can find no mention of him not wearing a full face, and the helmet was never mention as a contributing factor to his death.

A high-speed-to-basically-zero-stop a "G spike" or acceleration-deceleration injuries have been the cause for the most of the recent deaths in NASCAR. I personally believe that the HANs device has saved more then a few Winston Cup drivers from serious injuries.

"The investigation also essentially confirms the findings of the court-appointed independent expert who determined Earnhardt died of a sudden head-whip when his car hit the wall Feb. 18 on the final lap of the Daytona 500, sources close to the investigation told Sentinel auto racing writer Ed Hinton on the condition of anonymity."

That's probably because anyone who followed NASCAR even a little while he was racing knows that he always wore an open face helmet. So no stories bother to mention it. It would be like mentioning that the sky is blue. I don't have any links, but I remember some debate about open vs. full face helmets after the wreck and some one saying that he was wearing an open face helmet that day.

in_d_haus

09-09-2003, 10:36 AM

Not necessarily NASCAR has known for a long time the problem with the very rigid cage and a hard wall... Neil Bonnett, Adam Petty, Kenny Irwin. Not to mention you're just speculating on how tight his belts were at the race, and I can find no mention of him not wearing a full face, and the helmet was never mention as a contributing factor to his death.

A high-speed-to-basically-zero-stop a "G spike" or acceleration-deceleration injuries have been the cause for the most of the recent deaths in NASCAR. I personally believe that the HANs device has saved more then a few Winston Cup drivers from serious injuries.

"The investigation also essentially confirms the findings of the court-appointed independent expert who determined Earnhardt died of a sudden head-whip when his car hit the wall Feb. 18 on the final lap of the Daytona 500, sources close to the investigation told Sentinel auto racing writer Ed Hinton on the condition of anonymity."

Yup, I haven't seen anything concluding that an open face helmet was the cause of his death...it was attributed to head whip which broke his neck at the base of the skull.

Artslinger

09-09-2003, 11:53 AM

That's probably because anyone who followed NASCAR even a little while he was racing knows that he always wore an open face helmet. So no stories bother to mention it. It would be like mentioning that the sky is blue. I don't have any links, but I remember some debate about open vs. full face helmets after the wreck and some one saying that he was wearing an open face helmet that day.

Not true, later in his career he wore an open face only at certain times on short tracks. He could have been wearing an open face but I do not recall that being the case.

Correction, he was not wearing full face helmet, this was not the cause of death though:

"Helmet effects and restraint effects

It has been suggested that a full face helmet might have been an important aid in preventing the injuries in this crash. This is incorrect. If Mr. Earnhardt had worn a full face helmet, he would still have experienced the same tragic outcome. There are several reasons for this. Addition of a full face helmet does not (affect) the inertial (whip) mechanism. In the chin impact mechanism, the impact was submental and as such directed forces posterosuperiorly (upward and backward). Addition of the full face helmet would not significantly alter how that force was transmitted through the maxilla and mandibular condyles (face and jaw). Moreover, it would not have significantly changed the ride-down distance and therefore the deceleration of the head during the phase in which the steering wheel impact and deformation occurred. In contrast, a full face shield provides benefit in protecting the jaw and face from direct trauma. It also can work in conjunction with other systems to control the head. Thus, while not ameliorating Mr. Earnhardt's injury, a full face shield is of potential benefit to other drivers."