A new look at the ENPI theory

I have been greatly blessed by a discussion between Eschologizer and myself. Many of you will remember him from our discussions on FP. He was so kind as to gave me permission to share the following paper with you for your interest and discussion. Please feel free to share your views.

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European Neighborhood Theory

A New Look

By: Eschologizer

Herb L. Peters came up with the most viable prophecy theory in history. It relied on fulfilled prophecy, as opposed to speculation. Also, the statistical likelihood of everything pulling together like that is incredible.

But when the abomination of desolation didn’t happen in summer 2010, many of us became disillusioned and abandoned his theory. Indeed, I was incredibly discouraged by it and didn’t do prophecy stuff for two whole years.

Here is a general timeline that Herb would have agreed with:

1948 – Rebirth of Israel (Isaiah 66; Ezekiel 38:7-9)

1950 – Rebirth of the Roman Empire at the Treaty of Rome. (Fourth kingdom of Daniel 7 = Roman Empire destroyed by Messiah at Second Coming)

1967 – Jews retake East Jerusalem, and live in both parts of the city. (Zechariah 14)

1995 – WEU military organization, separate from the EU, reaches ten member states. (10 kings come from end times Roman Empire)

1999 – Javier Solana becomes secretary-general of those 10 after their initial arrival (Daniel 7:24 = after the 10, another king arises among the 10, different from the previous 10)

1999 – Solana also given powerful positions in the EU. (In 1998 Document 666 created his EU job and WEU Recommendation 666 suggests giving him more power over 10 nations).

c. 2003-2007 – Solana competes with the so called “EU 3″ (also part of original 10 WEU nations) for influence, and succeeds (Daniel 7:24 = new king subdues 3 of original 10 kings)

2007 – Solana foreign policy chief while European Neighborhood and Partnership Instrument is initiated. It confirms a 7-year financial relationship to Israel and many other nations (Daniel 9:27 = end time ruler makes deal of unspecified terms with many people for 7 years).

Mid 2010 – If the 7-year deal was spoken of in Daniel 9:27, the abomination of desolation, the final sign of Christ’s return. Should have occurred. Unfortunately for us, it didn’t. And made quite a ton of discouragement for me and a lot of other people, leading us to abandon the theory.

Analysis of Herb’s Theory

Contrary to my previous beliefs of the past two years, I now hold that Herb was broadly and approximately correct.

It is very statistically improbable that both the 10-nation alliance and the 7 year deal would correspond with one another at the same time in history.

However, perhaps it doesn’t prove what I originally thought it did. It does indeed prove that at least one of them has to be prophetic. If it didn’t, that means that both of them were a complete fluke. Which is highly improbable.

Perhaps God really did give us wisdom when we prayed for it, but not in the way we expected.

My Own Theory

In light of this, I would like to present my own list of prophetic events which I deem significant. Then, I would like to propose my own theory based on them, and an analysis of current events in light of them.

1948 – Rebirth of Israel (Isaiah 66; Ezekiel 38:7-9)

1950 – Rebirth of the Roman Empire at the Treaty of Rome. (Fourth kingdom of Daniel 7 = Roman Empire destroyed by Messiah at Second Coming)

1967 – Jews retake East Jerusalem, and live in both parts of the city. (Zechariah 14)

1995 – WEU military organization, separate from the EU, reaches ten member states. (10 kings come from end times Roman Empire)

1999 – Javier Solana becomes secretary-general of those 10 after their initial arrival. Solana starts building a political position which may be very important in the end times.

1999 – Solana also given powerful positions in the EU, further enhancing his power. (In 1998 Document 666 created his EU job and WEU Recommendation 666 suggests giving him more power over 10 nations). This paved the way to creating the HR position in the Lisbon treaty, which is very powerful.

c. 2003-2007 – Solana competes with the so called “EU 3″ (also part of original 10 WEU nations) for influence, and succeeds. He was instrumental in getting Europe together for a common foreign policy, paving the way to the new position in the Lisbon treaty.

2007 – Commission and EU foreign policy chief Javier Solana initiate European Neighborhood and Partnership Instrument. It confirms a 7-year financial relationship to Israel and many other nations. This starts the custom of making 7 year deals with countries in the European Neighborhood, which is expected to continue.

2009 – Lisbon Treaty goes into effect, a very great leap in imperializing Europe. It also merges all of Javier Solana’s original posts into one very powerful foreign policy post.

2010 – Ten nation WEU accomplishes its purpose and hands its power over to the EU beast because of the Lisbon treaty.

2010-2012 – European sovereign debt crisis becomes a serious issue. Just like the Bible says, the EU struggles with unity and cannot hold itself together.

2014 – European Neighborhood Instrument (ENI) set to go in effect for 7 years. It encompasses many nations and Israel, except it is more streamlined and has more funding (16 Billion EUR). This could be the real “covenant with many,” but I’m not sure.

If I want to rely on some elements of Herb’s theory, I have some explaining to do.

What is my reasoning?

Israel became a nation back in 1948 and regained the whole city in 1967. These are clear fulfillments of prophetic expectation in the Bible. It would make sense that we should see a revival of the Roman Empire concurrent with this as well. There are many reasons to believe the EU as a unit is the revived Roman Empire:

● The EU is the only game in town since the rebirth of Israel.
● The EU steadily increases its grip over time through various treaties.
● The EU has a single currency, just like an empire.
● The EU has difficulty being united and holding itself together, just like the Bible says.
● The EU makes laws for its member states.
● The EU regulates immigration.
● The EU has the ability to represent its member states when making treaties.
● The EU previously cooperated with a group of ten nations who were their own treaty system. However, this group of ten nations dissolved, in favor of the powerful EU-beast.
● The EU now makes deals with neighboring countries, including Israel, on 7 year cycles.

If the EU isn’t the revived Roman Empire, then I’m a poached egg. So it only makes sense for the above bullets to be prophetically significant, and there is no reason to wait for another empire, or another ten nation alliance, or another 7 year treaty mechanism. It’s all in place.

Who is Javier Solana?

Short answer: I don’t know. Long answer: He built the position which may have incredible power in the future.

Who is the Western European Union?

The dissolution of the Western European Union in favor of the stronger and larger EU is consistent with prophecy, because the ten kings eventually give their power and authority over to the beast.

What is the relevance of the European Neighborhood and Partnership Instrument?

The ENPI was the first 7-year deal the EU made with neighboring countries. We thought it was prophetically significant. But perhaps its significance is that the Antichrist now has a mechanism by which to make a 7-year deal in the future.

No one really wants #1 because it would cause a recession. No one is going to tolerate #2, because Germany, lenders, and investors will get really impatient. Leading economists are saying the EU has a very short time to get its act together.

#3 is a real possibility. It’s not just prophecy buffs who are worried about it. The UK’s EU parliament representative, Nigel Farage, fears dictatorship as well.

My Theory in A Nutshell

1. Israel is back in the land, and we have our EU-beast. There is no good reason to look for another beast.
2. Ten nations already dissolved their organization in favor of the EU-beast. There is no good reason to look for another ten-nation alliance.
3. The EU already has a mechanism by which it makes cyclical 7-year deals with Israel and other nations. There is no good reason to look for another mechanism.

In 2014, we will have had a ten nation alliance that gave up its power in favor of the EU beast. In 2014, we will have a very powerful position that Javier Solana created already in place. In 2014, we will have yet another 7-year deal with Israel.

Europe is having a debt crisis and can’t hold together. What a great time for a strong person to come and take the reigns, subdue three nations, and make a seven year deal with Israel.

I really am unsure but it is possible that this one could be it.

I think this general “European Neighborhood Theory” is a great way to get the word out about the generalities of this prophecy theory, but while being diverse in specific interpretations of events. Whether it be ENPI, ENI, or something else, we all feel the EU is it, the WEU is it, the high rep is it, and that the budgetary cycle of 7 years is significant.

Disclaimer:

I have been away from prophecy stuff for nearly two years. Perhaps many of these ideas people have already proposed. I know that others have been wondering about the next 7 year deal. But my apologies if I have stolen ideas without crediting.

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67 Comments

Justasheep

June 19, 2012 – 4:29 pm

A great post by Eschologizer, thank you for sharing it with us Vic. I would hope Eschologizer would join us to discuss things here as well, I think he’s highlighted a number of things we need to be aware of as possibly already fulfilled and watching for further fulfillment. We need to find him a shorter name though, because that one is hard to type.

I agree with just about everything he’s written above – but I wouldn’t write off the the ENP just yet since we are still in the “midst” of it. It is interesting that the ENI will further reinforce the agreements for another 7 years. What we will have in 2014 we also have in 2012 and 2103, so lets be watching carefully in case the pace of things suddenly pick up.

Juan Carrillo

June 19, 2012 – 5:10 pm

I’m sorry to say but your theory is headed down the same direction as you said it did in 2010. The best interpretation which I have encountered so far in my quest evolves around my spiritual experience which is at my website and Hebrews 9:11-15 in nature. You will be barking up the wrong tree every time and your theories will yield no fruit, while the whole time you will be under the influence of ignoring, mocking and blaming that which was right the whole time. From which thereafter and hopefully not too late, will you long to cleanse your consciences. Receive and embrace life and the promised eternal inheritance. There is only one small choice possible through which a camel will be able to walk through before many men.
The Blood of Christ
11 But when Christ came as high priest of the good things that are now already here,[a] he went through the greater and more perfect tabernacle that is not made with human hands, that is to say, is not a part of this creation. 12 He did not enter by means of the blood of goats and calves; but he entered the Most Holy Place once for all by his own blood, thus obtaining[b] eternal redemption. 13 The blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who are ceremonially unclean sanctify them so that they are outwardly clean. 14 How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death,[c] so that we may serve the living God! 15 For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance —now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

I am not interested in buying any book to read your prophetic interpretation. If you have something to share don’t enrich yourself with it and share it for free. In any case, your book is rubbish. Your dream or vision was not from God. There is no way that God will give a prophetic dream to an idol worshiper and expect us to believe it.

Yes Mr Carrillo, I called you an idol worshiper. Anyone who worships a heavenly queen called mother mary is an idol worshiper. I only pray to one God, God the Father of our savior and Lord Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit who guides us and lives in us. Any person dead or alive worshiped equal to God is an idol and abomination. That includes Mary, the Pope and all the Catholic saints.

Thank you.

agie95

June 19, 2012 – 7:42 pm

Mathieu, The Bible does not state how many 7-year covenants there are between Israel and many. There is a specific one that the Word mentions, but that does not mean there cannot be more than one covenant.

Dave

June 19, 2012 – 7:50 pm

I do not care if you are right or wrong. If the lord wanted you to know the day and the hour he would have told you. That will not happen. The only thing that matters is you keep us posted. I know things are very very close to the end and I am getting ready to fly. I dont care about anything on this stinkin planet except Jesus Christ. Keep up the good work.

Good point Agie. I don’t think the Lord will make it deliberately confusing with more than one covenant, but it is interesting that after 2013 there will still be another 7 year period between the EU and Israel.

Eschologizer

June 19, 2012 – 10:44 pm

Thank you all for taking a look at my thoughts. It was very kind of Wickus to post this paper to his website.

I kind of see it like concentric circles.

The evidence we have that the EU is the Revived Roman Empire includes all of this information: the Lisbon treaty, the common currency, the WEU, the 7 year deal cycles, the rebirth of Israel confirming the correct time frame, “iron and clay” debt crisis…..all of it. So all of that fits within the big circle that is the “EU is the Roman Empire” circle. All of it acts as evidence for that assumption. So at least one of the things that we deem to be prophetically significant in that list above could be incorrect. But the chances of them ALL being incorrect is highly improbable. Even people with some skepticism of ENPI stuff accept the EU as Roman Empire theory, including my old pastor who doesn’t take a ton of interest in prophecy. So we have a high degree of certainty about that part.

The “WEU is the ten nations” circle is a smaller circle inside the “EU is the Roman Empire” circle. But it too has evidence encased within it. For one, the ten are giving up their sovereignty as we speak as the union tightens. The ten specifically chose to dissolve in favor of the EU-beast. After being ten for 15 years, and specifically renouncing their own treaty, I don’t see them going back to it. This could have important prophetic significance, as Holly on FP noted, since they gave their power and authority to the beast so to speak. Furthermore, the treaty of Lisbon shows signs of further political unification, as opposed to political fragmentation. Furthermore, the fact that the EU now likes to regularly make 7 year deals with Israel acts as an authentication of the a general prophetic progress. That is what we would expect to happen if the ten nations were “it.” After the most viable group of ten decided to renounce itself, I don’t see us needing to look for another group of ten kings…..

The “European Neighborhood Policy is the mechanism for the 7 year covenant” is the orb at the center and a smaller concentric circle. It too has evidence. Since the EU is very very probably “it” and it already has a habit of making seven year deals with Israel, we should look no further, because there is no need to. The chances of a specific one of these seven year covenants being correct or incorrect is uncertain. However, the next one is 2014, and if further circumstantial evidence provides, more evidence of the ENI theory could be forthcoming, but we never know for sure.

The new plan that the Eurocrats are gonna make on June 27-28 seems to involve the loss of at least some national sovereignty, according to political commentators. Under pressure, they promised the G20 a closer banking union. And we already know they lost national sovereignty in the treaty of Lisbon. One article I read said that a the eurozone will definitely fail unless it literally becomes one country. This adds to circumstantial evidence of Europe’s increasing political choke hold on all of its member states.

Good one Eschologizer, that’s about where I am too. Take a look at FP8 information on the net now, it’s being called Horizon 2020 – that is if we make it that far down the line – 2014 is looking very far away given the current global situation.

I would like to ask some questions and I’m no trying to change minds or start any conflict.

Why do you all say Israel is back when the nation consist of 12 tribes all over the bible the Lord says he will gather the nation

Please read the entire chapter yourself
I will get right to the verse

Luke 21:23-25 (KJV)
But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. [24] And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled. [25] And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;

Israel is suppose to be in captivity untIl the Gentiles times is up and until Jesus return

I have more verse upon request

Next how could Javier Solana be considered the beast when he has not been put in power by the EU to run all branches or government and the EU nations. Actually Herman Van Rumpouy is the closes thing to the EU president.

The eighth as he is called has to be someone like Mussolini, Napoleon, Justinian, Charlemane, Otto the great Charlse V, these 6 men tried to revive the Holy Roman Empire an unite all of Europe. The next head of Europe plus the religious leader is what we wait for. To speculate that is is Herman romppuy or Javier Solana is speculation. Both are qualified but we don’t know yet.

Pleas read the entire chapter

Revelation 17:10-12 (KJV)
And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. [11] And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition. [12] And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

ozell

June 20, 2012 – 12:50 am

As far as a 7 year tribulation or a 7 year covenant this to has to be looked at very closely.

There is no agreement because of this verse

Daniel 11:31-32 (KJV)
And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice , and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate. [32] And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits .
The AOD is in Jerusalem and in the temple using force (armies)

So much for a covenant.

ozell

June 20, 2012 – 1:05 am

One other thing I would like to mention, I do remember posting it somewhere on FP and discussing it with Mr Peters. The 3 that was plucked up by the roots. This to is past it is not future as we can see now with the announcement of the 10(Weu) the 3 plucked up were the Vandals, Heruli and the Ostrogoths these 3 Germanic tribes were part of the Horns.
We have no people alive that can trace there lineage back to these.

Daniel 7:8 (KJV)
I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

Plucked up by rhe roots means they don’t exist anymore but we have evidence of their existence like te gothic buildings and the word vandalize from the vandals.

I just want to inject some more things in our understanding. I recommend this excellent bible companion called the
FOUR WINDS OF HEAVEN
From the Israel of God BIble study class
Check it out, I Guarantee you that you will not put it down and it will give you a different outlook using Gods word on end time prophecy

Comment by Vic:

Pure rubbish! We do not need a different outlook. We need the truth. I guarantee that the Sunday Christian will find it interesting, but the real, Born Again child of the Loving God will find it pure and utter junk.

ozell

June 20, 2012 – 1:23 am

Last

I love the time line, I love the research, I love you guys for seeking, most sites don’t do this.
BUT

God left us this sign

Matthew 24:15,21 (KJV)
When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) [21] For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

We look for a temple
We look for animal sacrifice
We look for the AOD
We look for the 10
We look for the temporal or military leader of the 10

Who said w are to look for a 7 year covenant?
Who said we are to look for a Agreement between the Vatican and the Jews.

Let’s focus on what the Lord Jesus say focus on.

If Javier is not the one what then?
What if a 7 year agreement is not signed what then?

I was with FP back in 2004 and a lot of the prophecy she told is not.

unsealed prophecy lets not make the same mistake. God has you here for a reason

Vic told me in a post to keep it simple it made me feel good because he knew I knew a little something.

Unsealed prophecy you know mucho te than a lot of othe forum a lot more

You know about the 10
You know the 10 is looking for a super president
You know about the temple
You know that they have all the material to build
They have a blueprint
They have a model Altar
They have red cows

This is what we look for this is what is written

Peace on Jesus

Nkosazana

June 20, 2012 – 4:10 am

Ozell sir frankly you weary us. I remember years ago when the Pentecostals were rather evangelistically trying to get in to several denominations that didn’t buy tongues. I recall saying to one individual. “We don’t want to fight, or dialogue for ever about this. We know what we believe and you know what you believe, so why don’t you just go your way and win the lost and let us do the same here. Why are we spending all this energy trying to convince the other of something we aren’t going to be convinced of? God help us both to get on with the kingdom work.

Ozell we have watched Javier for a long time. In more ways than we can elaborate repetitiously here, he fits the bill. We don’t know for sure. But we find it impossible to not watch a person who meets all qualifications except for being again in power. But considering the EU’s plan to consolidate further around a more powerful and forthright leader, it seems very possible if not probable that that man will again be Solana. Everything else “works”. Everything else has not yet congealed,..but it works. If you can’t understand where we are coming from,…sir go on your way. Lord bless you, but hinder us not here as we do our research. The time is too short for this foolish distracting interaction. Nkosazana

ozell

June 20, 2012 – 4:56 am

I don’t know how I weary You and I won’t spend anytime wondering. You said a lot but it is all in vain. The words you spake about him not being in power says it all. Don’t misunderstand what I was saying. It was the Lord who put FP and Mr Herb Peters on my life to focus on Javier and the WEU. 8 year later my understanding has increased and so should yours, Javier is a likely candidate but so is Herman rompouy who is also a Jesuit. I don’t know why you have a problem with me putting the word of God but that is between you and God

Peace in Jesus

Dave

June 20, 2012 – 5:15 am

AMEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEN Brother

Dave

June 20, 2012 – 5:16 am

Nkosazana
You need your head examined.

ozell

June 20, 2012 – 5:30 am

And every time we open the bible you will not find the ENPI or 7 years tribulation or 7 year covenant

We won’t know who the beast or leader of the EU until the time appointed.

Dave, personal insults are not tolerated. Discus the topic, not a persons head. An apology to Nkosazana will be the right thing to do.

Ozell, you are trying to weary us. You claim full understanding of this theory and discussions with Herb Peters, but you start your discussions with questions that you claim to not understand.

Ozell, you are clearly not from an evangelical Christian background but from a heretic false sect. Your reason to ask all these questions is so that you can have the change to spill your lies on this site and poison the readers mind. Not long and you will start your teaching that Jews are black people and that the people in Israel are imposters. You will start to call us who argue against it racists and heretics. Sir, your lies on this site stop here, today!

Friends, some of you may think I have lost my mind. Ozell gave him away by referring to some Bible aid book. Now first of all, anybody who NEEDS a Bible aid is in error. If you can not read the Bible for yourself and trust the Holy Spirit to teach you, you have a serious problem. Some Bible aids are good, but we must keep in mind that they are written by people and can be wrong. Only the Bible is faultless.

By delving into the site he referred to, I realized that they are Sabbath keepers and they believe black people are the real Israel. Here is a link to the false teaching. I must say, it would have been funny if it was not proclaimed as truth by these people.

Oh, I see that we who argue with Ozell are salad-bar Christians. He gets taught that only his sect has the truth. Friends, I can not stress how important it is to know your Bible. It is better for a man to have only a Bible and never go to a church or read a book but to get taught by the Spirit. Even satan used the Word (and still does) to accomplish his deception. I am a witness of that. My dad gets buried today and his whole life he knew the Bible better than most Christians. He could show a modern pastor were what is written. But you know, he was a Jehovah’s Witness bound for hell. Beware friends, satan is out to deceive if possible even the elect. Test the spirits.

I also see that he believes the Fathers name is Jesus. In that he denies God the Father. So he believes Jesus is schizophrenic as He prayed to Himself. This is so sick.

Here is a snippet of what Ozell believes about us:

“Salad-Bar Christianity”
In mainstream Christianity, when we try and correct someone with the bible and show them what the word of God says, some are quick to go on the defensive especially when what you say goes against what they are being taught and what they believe. That’s when the “Who are you to judge me?” comes out. Even my own mother told me that we serve the same God but in different ways. We were taught to be “opened-minded” and to tolerate other people’s beliefs and ideas. In a democratic and “multicultural” society, this approach has its merits, for people do not want someone else’s religion or other ideas forced down their throats. But there is a grave danger in this approach. Although it is good to be kind and to be “tolerant” of others’ ideas and religions, this approach can very easily degenerate into religious confusion—into a situation where millions of people begin to assume that there are no absolute truths, and that God will put up with anything and anybody.

hisown1

June 20, 2012 – 8:24 am

Ozel you lost me @ – ” From the Israel of God ”:(

Justasheep

June 20, 2012 – 1:09 pm

Agreed – Ozell putting heretical materials that put a man-made ideology/philosophy alongside the Bible on an equal plane is just wrong and a quick way to end up believing in something other than who Jesus has revealed himself to be in the Bible. Don’t take this too lightly, as believing in one of these false man-made christs is a seductive and certain path to hell, just as certain as if you stood on your rooftop and cursed God. Put that stuff away, flee from those that would require you to use their book to understand scripture. Run from those that claim you can’t understand God’s word for yourself. Find a solid fellowship of believers who preach the word and nothing else – you can still know who Jesus really is, if you’ll turn from man-centered man-pleasing doctrine.

We are not interested in your teachings. As Rob said, flee from them. They will lead you to hell.

Goodbye Ozell.

ozell

June 20, 2012 – 4:10 pm

Comment by Vic: My answers in Bold.
Vic, who do you think black people in America who are descends of slaves are? the Falashans of Ethiopian are black and they are from the tribe dan do you beleive they are not Israel? you speak about things you have no clue about.Your church must stick to the Gospel. These types of teachings are common and there is even “proof” that white Europeans are Israel. These teachings promotes hate toward real Israel and is not tolerated by this site.

a bible aid or a time line or articles from newspapers from all over the world. whats the difference? it is still be used to aid in understanding of God’s word.If you are drawn to Jesus by the Father and are born again by the Spirit of God, He will teach you all things and you will not need aids. No book will ever contradict the pure written words of God. It is for babes, not clever men. The Lord taught millions before your church wrote their aid. so throw away your aid.
What lies have I told Vic? what Lies have the website the church I attend told Vic? Read my previous comments.

Show me evangelical chrisitan in the bible? you can’t. Show me black Moses. You can’t.
I will go in Peace because of who I am. I go in peace because of who He is. I am disappointed that you all are not open minded and open to what is written in God’s word.I am open minded to the Word of God, but close my mind for rubbish interpretation. I know I don’t beleive in evenagelical teaching and there is a reason for it. what I do beleive in is this that we are to grow in grace and
knoweldge of God. Hmmm, there is our problem. You work to earn God’s mercy. You have a work based faith. We can do nothing to impress God or get closer to Him. Our best deeds are filthy rags. But He saved us from ourselves. Wile you try to grow in grace, we are baptized in grace.

2 Peter 3:18
But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
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so Israel cant be black? The Falashas in Israel are black and they have proven that they are from the tribe of Dan. do your research? and quit being closed minded. you have not even researched this yet you are quick to judge Israel returned to their country in 1948. There are black Jews in between, but the majority are Asian/European/White. Any picture on the internet can proof it. Open your eyes. You are deceived.
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The ENPI theory
yet you say you beleive in the truth
the guy said this is his theory and you beleive this. He even said he was not sure but you beleive this. the best we are suppose to do is look into it. not agree to a theory.
yet you want me to leave because I know I am a Israelite who happens to be black? The ENP is a theory. What is the problem? Nobody ever said on this site that it is a fact. We are discussing the possibilities. We are in agreement to “the guy” that it can be wrong. I know I am a white man destined for the new Jerusalem. Has that got anything to do with any discussion on this site?
you have not read the four winds of heaven and you call it rubbish. Yes, it is rubbish. Why pay for a book when I have a Bible?
yet you read a theory and you are all in

what is sad is my christian evagelical brothers and Sisters attack me my church without even reading all of it. yes I am a chrisitan who read the bible and follows what is said. I do not deny the Father nor the Son

Jesus said he come in his Fahter name

John 5:43
I am come in my Father’s name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

i ask what is the Father’s name? it must be Jesus, thats not hard to understand
I have a Father who is God
I have a son who is God

why do you lie and say I deny them? See my previous comment with the link to your church. Stop stirring.

those who attack me do you believe this?

Exodus 20:16
Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.

as far as a salad bar christian

you all know we have diffferent denominations and different doctrine that say they are chrisitians BUT are not christ like.

peace in Jesus
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i would like to thank all of you for letting me post on your site. The church I attend is a great church for learning regardless of what little you have read and think. I wish you all would have commented on the verses I put to justify why I beleive what I beleive. as far as the bible companion it was a guide and nothing more everyone here has some sort of prophecy guide on there shelf or have looked on the internet for some sort of guidance. we are to read the bible but we are need of a pasrtor to guide us this to is written

Romans 10
13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

yes you need a pastor according to the word of God, a Pastor after Jesus own heart

Jeremiah 3:15
And I will give you pastors according to mine heart, which shall feed you with knowledge and understanding.

before I go keep in mind that I did not post anything outside of Prophecy. Iknow we would not agree on anything concernign salvation but we do agree on many things concernign prophecy.

peace in JESUS to all of YOU!!!!!!!!!!

good byeGood bye Sir. Hope to see you back soon when the Lord opens your eyes. I will pray for you. Time is to short to argue. Do not be deceived my friend.

Mr Baldy

June 20, 2012 – 4:23 pm

Wow…..

Man a lot has been going on since I last posted.

To Eschologizer: (By the way, welcome back)

I just have a couple of questions:

1) As I have read your theory – which is somewhat very similar to my own, then you must believe that the 1st Beast of Revelation is the EU; and not a man? (Meaning that we may have only one End Time player.)

2) You have mentioned an additional 7 year time frame that runs from 2014 – 2020. I find this interesting; in that you also have provided the links. Now, Scripture states that the coming Antichrist will confirm a Covenant with Many for a week (or 7 years). In your theory, is it possible that the “original” confirmation of the Covenant with Many would be sufficient to have fulfilled this prophecy – regardless of any subsequent 7 year time periods – in that we have this same foundation, and any additional 7 year increments would only be an extension of what has already been established? Or should we look for another “he” each time a 7 year time frame is mentioned with Many?

I will await your answer, and respond back at a later time. Thank you for taking the time to respond in advance.

Baldy

Juan Carrillo

June 20, 2012 – 4:33 pm

Dear Ozell
You seem to be the only rational one in here and one that would make a proper interpretation and choice, many here will stay working at the “mill” still conjuring up worldly solutions and living, drawing a check while marked not by the lamb but by he who governs them. You men search among men for an AC but he is already among you as an intoxication of worldly matters this energy will come to manifestation but the energy was already in you. The beast is negative energy founded by men void of God but yet they may proclaim God but in reality they proclaim a god and who might that be? The hates and desecration and ignorance clouds judgement, yes a camel will pass through the eye of the needle (the Church handed down by Christ Himself under divine orders which they now rebuttal with a passion and hate, doesnt make sense, but even then men who heard these words departed from Christ at the time as they do now).

They will be attempting to resolve prophecy and contemplate such matters even in the midst of the plagues befalling upon them, even from the caves that they will take cover within, “saying Jesus what have I done to deserve this, I have read and searched and searched for your goodness BUT NEVER FOUND IT.” and Christ will say onto you, “What you have done to the least of my people, that you have done unto Me.” Away with this wicked cycle of ignorance that has plagued mankind since then until now for now is merely for Judgement not for seeking passages for your own accord but to prepare your body and soul lest you be found a servant to him whom will gladly thank you and mark you. Still you persist and fail to see.

Yes a system of order will be established in order to resolve matters of dire importance to survival but not yet, in the meantime the soul needs to be prepared and to be able to see the one and ONLY path. The timing in your heads is how men think some of these men do not read whole segments they rely on one or two sentences as telling enough. They denounce clear and strict orders by Christ Himself yet they say the only one I know to trust is Christ Himself. Has He already said clearly unto you what He expects. “Upon this rock (petrus in Latin) I shall build MY CHURCH”. Not multiple churches , JUST ONE AS HE IS ONE WITH GOD. You MUST be worthy.

The expressions above are idols of hate not loving devotions of meditation, they do not know the difference between worship and loving devotions and the asking for prayers by worthy Saints to pray on their behalf, THEY THINK THEY ARE ALREADY WORTHY they are pagan, Agnostic, Nicholatian in nature, of such which Christ despised. Don’t you in times of need ask a dear friend to pray for you because you feel they are more worthy than you? You ask a Saint to Pray for you in the NAME OF GOD. Read up on the Iconic Revolution and proper devotions as Saint John of Damascus would put any modern writer to shame. God before Christ was unseen but when Christ came He took human form. You men have missed the ship and are still looking? Certainly Satan has deceived you and is laughing at protestantism an “ISM” not a faith. The proclamations of the witnesses is your last resort to know the path. Not Good state to be in. These times are desperate times for the Faith and mercy is no longer a loophole or scape route for the wicked to continue to thrive amongst us, they will be separated by the proper choice, then ONE path or the MILL or the world of here and now.

Mr Baldy

June 20, 2012 – 4:43 pm

Vic Wickus……..all I can say is you know that your Ministry for Christ will be tested right?

Stay focused Brother!

Justasheep

June 20, 2012 – 4:53 pm

Glad to see you back Baldy! Vic and I were worried something had happened to you since we hadn’t seen you here and we were having trouble getting e-mail to you.

Justasheep

June 20, 2012 – 5:01 pm

Juan – shame on you for denying the sufficiency of God’s grace, for denying the finished work of Christ on the cross, and for seeking any other mediator between God and man other than the Lord Jesus himself. Your works will NOT make you worthy, and without accepting the Lord has paid your debt in full and as the prophet Isaiah saw all his good deeds as dirty rags you will not know the true Christ. Neither The church in rome, the woman you pray to, nor any other human can assure your salvation. It is given to you freely by the Lord alone, confess your sins, repent and abandon this apostasy of pride, disobedience, and idolatry.

Amen Justasheep. The apostasy is great and it will get worse. There is no one so blind as he who don’t want to see. One deny the trinity and the other pray to a woman. How sad. But lets move on with this discussion.

Mr B, were have you been? Like we will say in Afrikaans “Goeie genade, ek was bekommerd.” But it is good to have you back. Yes, this ministry (and me personally) are tested. But the Lord is faithful and He will get us through. Much thanks to Rob as well for being there for me and this site.

Now why do I miss Andre’?

hisown1

June 20, 2012 – 10:00 pm

(((( MR B )))))) whooo It’s great to see you…as Vic says where in heaven’s name have you been …LOL :)

Can’t want to dig in when time permits, but needed to quickly say how blessed I am that Curt is posting more often as well and yes I miss Andre so much as well ( hugs to you )

Ps – Vic when I saw the idolatry pic of ” jesus” I almost fainted…..then I read on…WHEW Boet you had me there for sec…LOL :)

andre' leibee

June 20, 2012 – 11:01 pm

hi all! checking in today and have been very sporatic of late to get to see the posts. much company and vacation bible school and remodeling work in our house….whew!!!

good good good all of it! and bless your hearts i have missed all of you too! this is like family over here at unsealed prophecy and yall continue to be a blessing. (hugs to you all) glad to see mr. baldy’s posts too! i’ll have to take some time-whenever that is-as part of the next week in pretty covered up too. i’ll do some backtrack to catch up later but glad to poke my head in the door-so to speak-and find the faithful still at it. oh yes—i’m missing all of you folks as well…………………later my dear friends……………

My apologies for not seeing your comments earlier. Thanks a lot for taking a look at the paper.

1) I do think that the beast is an interchangeable word, which can refer to the man or the empire, depending on the context. In Revelation 13 and Daniel 7, we can definitely see it representing a government of some kind. However, in both passages, we see indications that the “beast” is also a man. Daniel 7 talks about the beast being given over to be burned in fire, which is what we know happens when the Antichrist goes to hell. Also, Revelation 13 talks of a beast with ten horns (ten kings) with seven heads. However, one of the heads is made into an image to be worshiped, and everyone worships him. He is said to have the number of a man. He also utters proud words and blasphemies, as a human would.

So basically, I think there are a lot of indications to say its interchangeable, depending on context of the passage. Because we have strong evidence the word is used for either. This is logical because the empire is the “beast” but the man who is dictator of the government basically is the government while he is in charge.

2) I think we should look for a “he” every time a covenant with many is made, in my opinion. A person from Europe could theoretically make a deal with Israel for seven years and it be purely political. However, the Bible does mention one. So we should always “heads up” when one is happening. For example, as we saw with the original European community, there were ten nations. However, the real ten nations (the WEU) which lasted for 15 years dissolved in favor of the greater EU alliance. Though there were two groups of ten nations in the reviving roman empire, one was a “fluke” so to speak. There is even a third group of ten foreign ministers meeting, who were responsible for trying to make an EU super president and advocate an EU army. The WEU seems to have the most evidence, because of how long it lasted and why it dissolved. However, since there were ten nation alliances that were “fluke,” as unfortunate as it is, I think we have to be open to the possibility of “fluke” seven year covenants, since the Bible only mentions one.

As far as relative certainty, the idea that the EU is the Revived Roman Empire has somewhat of a status as a “fact” in my mind, as in something that is objectively true, especially since Israel is back in the land. I have relative certainty on the WEU. I also have relative certainty on the 7-year European Neighborhood deals. One of these is going to end in the Antichrist. Which one it will be is up for grabs. 2014-2020 or 2021-2027, or even as late as 2027-2033, we can’t know for sure. One thing is for certain is that since we have our EU-beast empire for sure, looking for other seven year covenants in other places other than the Neighborhood deals seems to be unwarranted.

We might be wrong about the WEU, we might be wrong about the Neighborhood deals, but wrong about everything at once is highly unlikely.

Mr Baldy

June 21, 2012 – 4:40 pm

Hello All……

Yes I have been away. I have had to take care of a few personal matters, dealing with my mothers estate, and other personal issues – so I have been away from the computer for awhile. Thanks to you all for inquiring about me, and your very kind comments.

Eschologizer…..let me first say that you have by far the “coolest” icon. Vic Wickus should have one so cool! (really man it is cool) I loved BerryBlueBerry’s icon, but yours has certainly surpassed his. (Lol) As you can tell, I’m really into these icons. I know that they are randomly provided, but man appearance is everything! Being a former body builder I guess I’m somewhat vain. (Please pray that I let that particular sin go)

Okay, I’m off my soapbox……….

I want to thank you for doing your homework. Many see ideas and/or thoughts posted by those who appear to be well informed, and they take for granted that they know what they are talking about – therefore they won’t challenge what is written, and they live vicariously through someone else’s thoughts, believing it to be true. While others who are somewhat skeptical won’t say a thing, perhaps even knowing that that person may be wrong – yet they won’t challenge the ideas posted, for fear that they may hurt the persons feelings.

As I have read through your comments, I have to be very candid and ask the question – what has brought you back? In your own admission you have taken two years off, and had jettisoned the whole ENP(I) theory because what you had expected to happen at the so-called “midpoint” didn’t happen the way that you had expected. Please forgive me Eschologizer, if I am coming off a bit strong – but this is certainly not my intention. But as a child of God, and one who has communicated with you in the past, I have to question your sudden appearance on the scene to once again enlighten those of us who are very interested in Bible Prophecy, and the Return of Christ. I feel that this is a very fair question, in that you definitely bring something to the table with your thoughts and insight. So, therefore I believe that it is reasonable to ask the questions that I have.

Now that I have gotten that out of the way, I must say that I agree with you that the Beast Empire and a man are interchangeable. However, (and I know that my view is not very popular) – but I think that the 1st Beast mentioned in Revelation 13 is clearly an Empire alone. I support this theory by reading what John – who is the author of the Book of Revelation has given us a warning in his previous self titled Book; in that he warns of of the coming “Antichrist”. He never warns us of a “False Prophet” – nor does he warn us of two End Time players. I believe that this is an important fact to take note of; in that the Book of Revelation is symbolic.

In view of the aforementioned, and what you have also provided, I have to echo what you have stated: “wrong about everything at once is highly unlikely”. There are those of us who have not budged on the whole ENP(I) theory. This is not to boast or brag…but something just doesn’t add up with it not being what we have been told to look for. So in mentioning that…….. I really believe that it is highly unlikely that someone else who were to come along an “confirm” any additional 7 year “Covenant with Many” would be the “he” – in that the precedence has already been established. (just a thought)

In closing, I sincerely hope that I have not come across too strong – it’s just my nature to question what I have in my heart. I just deeply desire that the Body of Christ be edified.

I would love to read any additional thoughts that you may have.

Baldy

Mr Baldy

June 21, 2012 – 5:57 pm

I just came from FP, and noticed that James 1:12 posted this:

“166. The European Neighbourhood Policy (ENP) provides the political
framework for our cooperation with the “near abroad”, i.e. our Mediterranean
partners and the countries further to the East and Southeast. Our self-interest
in upgrading policies in these countries is self-evident – they are at the
doorstep of the European Union. The ENP builds upon existing agreements
between the European Union and the partner in question (Partnership and
Cooperation Agreements or Association Agreements). The bilateral ENP
Action Plans cover ambitious chapters on justice, freedom and security policy,
thus giving the relationship a closeness which differs from cooperation with
other third countries. The implementation of JHA reforms by ENP partners will
also be vital for ensuring the success of the whole policy, which aims at
enhancing the security of the European Union by exporting stability to their
neighbours.
167. The European Union’s proximity policy towards the Mediterranean region is
governed by the comprehensive Euro-Mediterranean Partnership. The
Mediterranean has a strategic importance for the European Union’s stability
and security.”

The aforementioned article is a bit more than James 1:12 posted – however, I believe that the information therein is very crucial into understanding “perhaps” the “he” who originally confirmed the ENP has included “upgrading policies” – meaning that any further 7 year agreements can be referred back to “he” who confirmed it in the first place. Please take note that the words “stability and security” are used.

Great points by Eschologizer – also remember that our enemy is the master of deception. Although he doesn’t have access to the meaning of the texts via the holy spirit – he does have access to the text of the bible and has had a very long time to know every word that God has said. I suspect that as things heat up he will throw out counterfeits that could match the text in some ways, but not perfectly to throw us off (I think that’s been going on a very long time). We know from Daniel 7:25 the enemy’s man will “wear out the saints of the most high” I think the enemy has been working to do that for millenia now. So when we look at 7 year agreements with many – its funny how for a very long time there were none that included Israel and many nations – now we seem to see them popping up again and again, the same with 10 nations. Remember our enemy is going to do everything he can to get as many as possible to dismiss the truth of what God has said using every means at his disposal. I don’t think its necessarily just a fluke when many things at the same time match prophecy – I think its just as likely that it’s the enemy trying to obfuscate the truth of events that fulfill prophecy among many false, but plausible possibilities. So we watch – because we know that when things are happening as God has said they will match perfectly in every detail.

I especially agree with this point, “We might be wrong about the WEU, we might be wrong about the Neighborhood deals, but wrong about everything at once is highly unlikely.”

Eschologizer

June 21, 2012 – 10:55 pm

Mr Baldy,

Hmm I was pondering this and I actually thought your icon was cooler, perhaps because of the color of it though. ;)

Thanks for your honest thoughts and inquiry into my sudden return and perhaps the motives behind it. I do not mean to exude any hubris in my return. Indeed, my return would not have happened at all unless my own change of mind preceded it. I just wanted to share some thoughts and see what other people thought too. So thats why I emailed Wickus with my paper and asking him what he thought.

There are a number of personal, political and theological factors that play a role in my personal behaviors with respect to researching prophecy again. I am not sure how detailed I should be, but here are some thoughts. I will be candid about my own emotions and beliefs, since transparency would be best and I’m sure you will agree, if you don’t mind. (I also do not intend to come off as too strong).

I was fully committed to the ENPI theory, especially in 2009-2010. (Though I knew about it and advocated it even back in summer 2007). My friend and I up at my college became very passionate about it, and try to share it with as many people as will listen. I wore prophecy on my sleeve and me and my friend sent one of my youtube videos to over 1000 facebook friends right to their inbox, in late 2009. My immediate friends group knew how passionate I am. I felt that the chances of the theory being wrong were somewhat low.

Mid 2010 came at a time in my life where I felt God wasn’t answering any of my other prayers. So to tell all of your family and friends, my inner and outer social circle, 1000 people, and 25,000 people on youtube that the Antichrist will come in 2010 and he doesn’t, is especially very rough, especially when one thinks God isn’t answering your prayers about other things in your life, even for years. It compounds the sense of abandonment and humiliation.

Also, since something with as good as evidence as the ENPI failed at the midpoint, a rival theory is going to need more evidence, which enhances my cautiousness about prophetic developments as a whole (even today). I knew about framework program 8 and the ten nations dissolving, but I felt that any new theory is gonna be weaker than the old one, so the prophecy evidence I would need would have to surpass the ENPI theory. When the midpoint past, I told my other ENPI friend that I would purposely avoid it until I saw the final sign of Christ’s return, and the Antichrist walked into the temple.

So basically why I came back all of a sudden:

1) started reading stuff about the debt crisis and eurozone collapse, knowing that someone has to pull it together
2) remembered that framework program 8 was coming up in a year and a half.
3) remembered that the WEU dissolving may have had significance.
4) Latent apocalyptic feelings, if I may say it that way. Standing out in the open field, staring into the open sky filled with thousands of stars….knowing that some day God is going to come back and all the stars will fall, is probably one of the most intoxicating feelings I’ve ever felt.

I had previously tried to reconcile how the WEU dissolving would fit in the picture past the ENPI midpoint, but anything I came up with seemed ad hoc to me, so I stayed away from it, especially since I remembered how much pain it could cause to be wrong. I also didn’t want to waste my efforts with something that could be wrong.

Then it happened. I was swept up in it again. Literally 4 days ago. Somewhat out of nowhere.

If I may be completely honest, I personally can’t justify the idea that the ENPI theory is it anymore on theological grounds. However, my goal isn’t necessarily to talk people out of it (we will know in a year and a half anyhow). I think we can achieve a sort of unity in diversity on agreeing that:

1) the EU is significant
2) the WEU is significant
3) The Neighborhood Deals are significant
4) The high rep might be significant

So while we all may disagree as to which neighborhood deal it is, we agree on a lot too.

Eschologizer

June 21, 2012 – 10:57 pm

Also Mr. Baldy,

I realize that blog comments I can’t change the tone of voice to clearly enunciate my intentions. So if anything sounds too strong, if you would be so kind, please don’t take it that way, since I mean no hard feelings in any way :). Glad to hear from you and thanks for asking those questions I appreciate it.

James1:12

June 22, 2012 – 2:23 pm

Eschologizer and Mr B, I have a question for you both.

But before I ask I have a preliminary question, are either of you familiar with the Isaiah 9:10 parallels with the events of 9/11 and the financial crisis?

I continue to be troubled by all the attention being focused on the Harbinger book. Big red flags go up in my mind when Pat Robertson endorses a prophecy. I haven’t read the book (yet) but I have read that the author claims it was a hard message to share, one he thinks is counter-cultural and unpopular, it strikes me as odd that a message claiming to be so hard to hear would be on the New York Times Best Seller list, and one of the top selling books on Amazon. I don’t deny the striking similarities between some scriptures and events, I’m just advocating for a healthy dose of caution when considering the yet future predictions of this kind of literature, and whether they should have any more weight than predictions about the future from any of the rest of us who study world events and prophecy here.

Yes, I agree with you to be cautious about future predictions. Any modern prophecies are probably not from the Lord. The problem is that I have never seen this book as a prediction, but rather as a warning. The similarities between the Israel and the US are astonishing and I think we can all agree that judgment is coming. Now if it does please the Lord to give a final warning that ends up on a best seller list, how much more guilt will a nation have if they do not repent? Sadly we know there will be no repentance.

This is one of the most difficult messages for me to analyze. I hear the concerns from people like Cole and Rob, but I can get rid of the feeling that this is a final warning. Eish, I hope I am wrong.

Justasheep

June 22, 2012 – 5:17 pm

I think the popularity of this novel is based around people’s uneasiness given all the indicators that we are headed for trouble. Even though many have become futile in their thinking, deep down they realize there are many frightening trends in the world, and many of the things the worldly are counting on could evaporate in an instant. If it causes people to stop, turn around and seek the Lord then it is a blessing.

Mr Baldy

June 22, 2012 – 5:37 pm

Hi Eschologizer,

I detected absolutely no strong language in your reply. I want to also say for the record that it is absolutely okay to disagree with some one’s opinion – respectfully, and I hope that you have received me this way as well.

Now, let me say that your testimony about what you have gone through, and the embarrassment that you may have faced really touched my heart. Ironically, just as I was on my way home this morning I was listening to Chuck Swindoll. He was doing a teaching on 2 Thessalonians – and how it related to the believers of that day; and the Return of Christ. Chuck was speaking of how a well informed believer should have “Balance” as it relates to Return of Christ – and not get caught up in extremes as it relates to His Return.

Now one might say that the belief in the ENP(I) theory is an “extreme”. Perhaps it is, in some believer’s view – but let me add that those of us who have continued to follow this theory have never lost “Balance” in that we have always qualified our continuous watching with “it may be wrong”. Nevertheless there was always something there that wouldn’t allow us to just let it go, and throw us off course. (I don’t want to speak for all here – but I believe that some will agree) The evidence was, and just continues to still be THERE.

The whole World Wide financial crisis is no fluke. Let me say that I’m no economist; I have no economic major, or degree in how the whole financial system works – but I do have common sense. And this whole system of money makes absolutely no sense at all to me. Let me please explain…… I mean how does a man take something tangible such as paper money and put a value to it? It’s an IDEA…and an idea only – thing is, you have to get others to buy into this idea in order for it to work. This is a system. A system which has been allowed by God to bring about His ultimate plan, but carried out by Satan himself – the prince and ruler of this World.

I don’t want to get too deep, or too far from making my point, but if the “idea” of making something such as paper money have value, and men world wide have bought into this idea, then it is something greater than a group of men controlling this thought process. A system has been designed by forces greater than ourselves (Spiritual World) that controls the minds of men to collectively get men to agree on something like paper money can actually have value. So this whole World Wide Economic mess is straight from the pits of Hell. When asked about money; and the paying of taxes thereof Jesus Himself even said : “Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s.” That alone says a lot about the state of that man is in financially.

I want to say for the record that the ENP(I) theory has never lost credence for me. I know that there are those who wholeheartedly disagree – and that’s fine. Perhaps I am wrong, and those who have continued to not let this theory go.

Now, if I may attempt to validate my point for not ruling it out.

First, and far most – Christ Himself said that no man knows the day or hour of His Return. Christ further gives warnings; He gives parables, such as the 10 virgins; He states that men will be behaving such as they were in the days of Noah – they had no clue. So, in reading all of this – how can we look at a particular theory; pinpoint some of the details, but rule it out totally when things don’t happen to come out the way that we “think” that they will – and that based on our own interpretation?

No dear Brother Eschologizer, I will not rule the ENP(I) theory out – not yet. Not until it has completely run it’s course. Hindsight is 100% accuracy in most cases. This has been the only theory out there that has continuous “road signs” that has not led one off course. So, I’ll just hang in there just a tad bit longer.

To James 1:12 – Sir, I am not familiar with the Isaiah 9:10 parallels with the events of 9/11 and the financial crisis. But I must say that your homework on the ENP(I) Beast System has been exceptional.

Thank you all for your hard work towards edifiying the Body of Christ in these Last Days.

Mr Baldy

June 22, 2012 – 5:48 pm

By the way…here is the link to Chuck Swindoll’s teaching on the 2nd Coming of Christ:

have just a minute to be here today but i have to say that i never took the harbinger book to be anything but a sincere warning for america (and beyond). it seems to me that because we know God is all powerful then He can turn things around on a dime should He choose to. the author of the book acknowledges this but in the light of the way israel responded to God’s warnings during their time and the way that modern america-in the very uncanny parallels-is responding to God’s Word we do know that Judgment has to come. this is all i have taken away from that book which is believe is it’s intent. so—-i’m with you vic—-would love to be wrong about all that but seeing the times we are in and the matchup of spiritual with spiritual (acted out in the natural) from antiquity to now i say God has (of course) stayed True to His Word and in a short time many many more things will come to pass according to all the prophecies as they line up for fulfillment just as God has faithfully warned from His Merciful Heart for us all to get in right relationship with Him. Repentant Turning to the Lord is what that book is about—how much of that are we seeing right now? i think it is on the best seller list because of the prophectic topic alone. the question i pose is how many will let it’s warning to repent hit home? (and even pat robertson can get something right sometime if he believes repentance is necessary for the church–to kill the message because you do not care for the messenger is just not how we need to approach this in my opinion—i prayed first and asked for the Holy Spirit to enlighten before judging at the outset-it seems to me to be how we should be approach all prophetic topics anyhow). i know a few believers who have read it and are sensing the same thing—i believe we have heard from the Lord in very telling & graphic ways from within the Scriptures that our own everyday newspapers can attest to but where is our collective heart? cahn does not predict anything—the dire warning is enough—-and the point. i took that point to heart as i pray others do too. just my 2 cents……………………..

hisown1

June 22, 2012 – 6:47 pm

Guys I too only have a few sec’s to share my heart.

I’m not denying the MESSAGE of the Harbinger and the parrales of such. My concern is the ” NAR” smell to it. Sorry it reeks of it and that stinks.

We have discussed this in detail here and if Rob and I are in error I pray that the Lord show us. I am so open to that.

Andre sis if you look at my very first post on FP(6 yrs ago ) it was this very same concern for the coming judgement on USA so I am not refuting the warning.

Okay James don’t keep us waiting :)

hisown1

June 22, 2012 – 7:04 pm

Guys we are in some pretty beguiling days of seductive spirits and apostasy and there is a revival coming but it ain’t holy :(

Okay so no stoning Coll allowed :)

Justasheep

June 22, 2012 – 8:35 pm

Ha! Baldy – I listened to that same broadcast on my way home from work last night. I was thinking the same thing. I think the wisdom in balance is that we are admitting that we don’t know and we continue to search the scriptures daily for the things we wants to tell us about himself, drawing nearer to him, and his will for how we are to live while we await his return.

hisown1

June 23, 2012 – 2:12 am

Not stirring the hornets nest here but has Swindoll not gone ” contemplative” ?

hisown1

June 23, 2012 – 2:16 am

Ps….

Beware of those that endorse the ” Celebration of Discipline” by Richard Foster….he gives me the hibbiegibbies :( the book that is !

James1:12

June 23, 2012 – 8:04 am

Hi Hisown, I do understand your concern in life I generally steer clear of what is popular out of not wanting to follow the crowd or be deceived. One of the reasons I like to post in places like this is so I can also receive guidance and listen to other viewpoints that may catch something I have missed – so I’m open to your input!

Mr Baldy and (Eschologizer if you havent already), can I suggest you take a look at the following links on the Harbinger message.

This first one is a link to the sermons as taught by Rabbi Jonathan Cahn, they conatin all the information the other 2 are the discussions on FP that give some quicker answers as the sermons are about 40 mins each, if you have time for them I highly recommend watching them all:

Thanks Wickus , I just had a good read through. I’ll pose my question soon! just want those 2 guys to be up on the details if they wish to dip into this a bit first. I’ve been mulling this over since August last year. It had a great impact on me as I had decided not to look into the 9/11 material on the web as a lot of it was crazy conspiracy stuff and quite disrespectful to the victims, I was in the states at the time of the attack and being that close had a deep effect on me. Anyway with discovering Herbs book in early 2004 I had plenty to keep me busy!

James1:12

June 23, 2012 – 2:14 pm

Hoping I haven’t hyped the question too much, reminds me if this comedy scene:
Holly: [her IQ has been increased to 12,000] Strike a light! I’m a genius again! I know everything! Metaphysics, philosophy, the purpose of being-everything! Ask me a question, any question, and I’ll answer it.
Talkie Toaster: Any question?
Holly: Yes.
Talkie Toaster: How to break the speed of light? How to marry quantum mechanics and classical physics? Any question at all, truly anything and you will answer?
Holly: Yes.
Talkie Toaster: OK, here’s my question: Would you like some toast?
Holly: No, thank you. Now ask me another.
Talkie Toaster: Do you know anything about the use of chaos theory in predicting weather cycles?
Holly: I know everything there is to know about chaos theory and predicting weather cycles.
Talkie Toaster: Oh, very well. Here’s my second question: Would you like a crumpet?
Holly: I’m a computer with an I.Q. of 12,000. You don’t seem to understand; I know the meaning of the universe.
Talkie Toaster: That’s not answering my question.
Holly: [irritated] No, I would not like a crumpet! Now ask me a sensible question, preferably one that isn’t bread related.
Talkie Toaster: Very well. I have a third question. A sensible question. A question that will tax your new I.Q. to its very limits and stretch the sinews of you knowledge to bursting point.
Holly: This is going to be about waffles, isn’t it?
Talkie Toaster: Certainly not. And I resent the implication that I’m a one-dimensional, bread-obsessed electrical appliance.
Holly: I apologise, toaster. What’s the question?
Talkie Toaster: The question is this: Given that God is infinite, and that the universe is also infinite… would you like a toasted teacake?
Holly: That’s another bready question.
Talkie Toaster: It’s not just bready. It’s quite curranty, too.

Now to continue watching the match on TV. England leading with 3. That will change soon. Kom Bokke.

hisown1

June 23, 2012 – 6:05 pm

James …British humour ? LOL

Ahh that’s not fair Vic…..come on like seriously don’t tell me you guys are having a braaivlies too then I will have to smack you!!! like no fair already…LOL.

Enjoy!!

Eish!!

Coll heads out to the closest wannabe SA store for a ” quick fix” :)

Eschologizer

June 24, 2012 – 10:30 am

Mr. Baldy,

Thanks for taking the time to read my response. I realize I give somewhat lengthy messages at times.

Your message about Chuck Swindoll is I think very wise. I lacked balance in those years 2009-2010. I look back and say that even if we were right about 2010, the amount of intensity by which I pursued advocacy of the idea throughout the internet and in my campus ministry was perhaps too simply because things of this nature need to be defined by more caution since we cannot personally see the future and interpretations vary. I think that balance with respect to the return of Christ is something that I personally always need to pursue.

I do agree that ENP stuff is more on the “edge” as far as the world’s eyes for sure, and within the world of prophecy even. I just think this is because of the nature of what we are claiming. We aren’t claiming anything new really. We are claiming something is about to happen/in progress which is rather groundbreaking. For example, all the Jews thought the Messiah would come one day. However, it was rather subversive to say that he already did. Same with us. Most eschatological futurists think the Antichrist will make a 7 year deal with Israel. As we know, it’s common knowledge in the study of prophecy. However, we think the ENP(I) or ENI might be in progress/scheduled to start soon. That’s a pretty subversive, controversial and earth-shattering message. Which isn’t a bad thing I don’t think, as long as we are cautious in our presentation.

You are very right. The economic issues are either gonna unravel Europe and cause a recession, or they are going to forcefully pull together in a “political union.” The fact that Wall Street Journal has opinion pieces that basically recommend the formation of a US of E just shows how remarkable the situation really is. This economic crisis seems to be the impetus for the creation of further economic unity, which will end in the Antichrist and the mark.

Prophecy issues are hard to understand and theologians dedicated to Christ differ on the details. So I think it is absolutely ok for brothers to respectfully disagree on matters such as these. However, I find it rather striking that, even among the differences of our views, that our common message to the world is that the 70th week is probably associated with a very specific policy in the EU, the European Neighborhood Policy. Despite our respectful disagreements, the fact that we have so much in common for something as controversial as end time prophecy in current events, is eye-opening.

JustAsheep,

I think that you have a very valid analysis that Satan wants us to be confused in these times. I agree, that we should be observant and discerning when factoring in what is a true fulfillment of prophecy and what is not. You are right that we should become especially observant, especially when certain prophetic fulfillment type stuff that hasn’t happened for 2000 years, starts happening again and again. I especially agree with you that such a development (i.e. 10 nations and regular 7 year covenants) is quite peculiar given the last 2000 years.

James 1:12

Sorry I took so long to get back to you. I have started listening to some of those episodes. I will read your posts on the matter and get back to you as soon as I can. It looks like very interesting stuff. Again, my apologies for the delayed response.

Eschologizer

June 24, 2012 – 10:32 am

I started listening to one of them but I was going to go ahead and finish them all first. Again sorry I took so long.

James1:12

June 24, 2012 – 4:17 pm

Don’t apologise Eschologizer, it’s a lot of material to take in, thanks for your dedication! I agree totally with your post above. This ENI is looking set to be really interesting if the current ENPI doesn’t make it Just been seeing some amazing statements by Tony Blair on the Eurozone crisis and the middle east, keeping in mind the UK is not one of this new 10 grouping…. I noticed though that this Future Group is keeping alive the ENP and a lot of the outome from Solana’s career in the High Rep/Sec Gen WEU post.

Looking4acity

June 24, 2012 – 6:19 pm

Just chiming in with some amazing news. Brother Brian (http://www.pastorbrianroberts.com/) found where “10 EU foreign ministers” “have prepared what the front-page headline in Die Presse describes as a ‘Plan for transformation into a European State’.

It also states:

“The ‘study group for the future’ initiated by Germany’s Guido Westerwelle, which does not currently include an official French representative, proposes to put an end to the dominance of national government leaders and give greater authority to the European Commission – in particular the European Commission president, who will be elected by universal suffrage and granted the right to form a ‘governmental team;, making him or her the most powerful politician in Europe.”

Another 10 is about to give their power away! The 10 are: Germany, Belgium, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Poland, Portugal and Spain.

As Herb would say: Stay tuned!

James1:12

June 24, 2012 – 11:42 pm

OK so I thought I would propose my question/theory now…

I’m going to move off the assumption that the Isaiah 9:10 message is a genuine warning from God to the US. So just to stake out the relevant facts:

The warning is to alert the church of America’s spiritual decline.

The timing of the stock market crashes are meant to draw attention to the 7th year of Israel’s economic cycle and specifically its day of debt forgiveness or shmita.

The word shmita was meant to be understood by the term “release” because the stock market drop in September 2008 was an event of divine intervention, God Himself put His identifying number 777 points fall, 7% of the market value wiped off the NYSE and I think this happened at the 7th hour of trading (this is one fact I have yet to verify), blowing a $700 billion whole in America’s banking system – not too subtle!

This action though was in response to the decline of America’s spiritual health a financial mirroring of the decline of the US.

The US having had its foundations in God and scripture upon which it wealth and global success rested particularly since the end of the Second World War as the leading nation, is now seeing position eroded. The foundation of this whole world system because it relied on the US is in peril.

We see the Eurozone crisis spring up because of this issue. It has pressed the EU into moving closer to either destruction or full union like a single nation/empire.

So finally we get to the point!

There is a connection now between the spiritual decline or falling away of the United States and the possible rise of Europe’s beast system on the world stage, teeth and all.

Is it possible then that this Isaiah 9:10 moment, this releasing, dropping or falling away of the economy is a key signpost in showing us that the last days apostacy is actually occurring?

“Apostasy in Christianity refers to the rejection of Christianity by someone who formerly was a Christian. The term apostasy comes from the Greek word apostasia (“ἀποστασία”) meaning defection, departure, revolt or rebellion. It has been described as “a willful falling away from, or rebellion against, Christian truth. Apostasy is the rejection of Christ by one who has been a Christian….”[2] “Apostasy is a theological category describing those who have voluntarily and consciously abandoned their faith in the God of the covenant, who manifests himself most completely in Jesus Christ.”[3] “Apostasy is the antonym of conversion; it is deconversion.”[1]”

It is perhaps one of those time will tell things, but given the shaking of the Med through the Islamic uprising and more the stability enjoyed under the US at its peak seems very much to be fading fast.