As it stands, TO is really quite stable but unfinished.
There are a few voxels around the outskirts which need tidying up or making/remaking, and some remaining buildings (But tbh, Donut has a lot fewer buildings still to work through than there are buildings already done).

As for BuildConst, atm there is no alternative but to revert to both sides having the same starting unit. This presents a problem with design, but hopefully a good neutral visual can be developed.

I have a question for the team. Actually, this is a questioning.
Why is it that you have rendered the Scrin into a generic mining race, having no biological relationship to Tiberium even, which was obviously created for multiple purposes, the main one being their survival by adapting other planets ecosystems to support their kind. In light of this, and the huge potential provided in the existing fictional lore aswell as the quote I am providing from Adam Isgreen, your design decision is just goddamn criminal!

Quote:

They weren't buggish.

They were very angular, menacing, and closer to the key item they created and manipulated for survival (hint, hint)

Last edited by Pepzi on Mon Jun 21, 2010 4:20 pm; edited 2 times in totalQUICK_EDIT

What? I didn't even think we have information on the Scrin released, not even like they are a large / overly important part of TO. Anyway, we don't follow 100% WW and we aren't complete fanboys either or agree with all their decisions. There is more to the Scrin than just a simple mining race, but we don't want them having a large biological relationship with Tiberium, why?

Are humnas biologically similar or have a biological relationship to coal, natural gas or oil? No, or at least I don't anyway, if anything I find the Scrin being somewhat biologically linked to Tiberium a bit boring or "could have seen that coming".

CCHyper wrote:

Its the truth, nothing else needs to be expanded on that. As for BulidConst, its staying in HyperPatch, i'm not rewriting it to work on a non-expanded executable.

We will either wait untill HyperPatch is ready for use before a TO release, or ignore HyperPatch and continue our work focusing on not needing it and sticking to usual TS. Being honest TO waits on enough staff members for it's neccessary material and I can't imagine the added time delay we will have waiting on HP also as well as everything else on TO's plate. The current plans are to continue working as if we are just sticking to normal TS._________________QUICK_EDIT

Are humnas biologically similar or have a biological relationship to coal, natural gas or oil? No, or at least I don't anyway, if anything I find the Scrin being somewhat biologically linked to Tiberium a bit boring or "could have seen that coming".

This argument is fallacious, as Tiberium is not a "mineral", but a thing the Scrin created to ensure their survival. The natural resources it has sucked and processed is just one aspect of it. You don't seem to grasp the Sci/fi concept that the fiction is playing with, namely that there is an alien race that is both biologically and ecologically different from humans, thus "alien".QUICK_EDIT

Is this stated in one of the games, or something an ex-westwood member said on petroglyph or something?

Well I quoted an ex-developer above, more info on tiberium can be found in the quotes thread I made in the games discussion forum. The paragraph I wrote about "playing with the concept/ídea" was just my conclusion based on the information released and how they all relate. One needs to take into account for what is said in the games themselves, because WW didn't ignore past fiction unlike what was done in TW etc.QUICK_EDIT

What? Tiberium was created as something to kill of any resistance on the planet before the invasion would begin. Tiberium is to Scrin like weed (not the hallucinating substance) is to humans, except that it likely doesn't irritate them as much as weed does humans. They don't need it to survive, it is a biological weapon they themselves are immune to (or may benefit from)._________________QUICK_EDIT

We don't take any information on TW, infact CnC 3 onwards is ignored, as I guess in a way TO tries to be a CnC 3 of it's own. When it comes to the Scrin, I think all you will really see of them in the TO universe is maybe some detailed text documents on our theories, and most likely no units in the game itself.

When it comes to living organisms and their relationship to Tibeirum, well, many of our concepts regarding mutants and Tiberium life forms definately use the idea of Tiberium becoming a large part of life and the ecosystem. The reason we tended to sift away from the Scrin having this characteristic is because we had written it so the Mutants / Forgotten are more interwined with Tiberium in ther lives. The benefits and advanced abilities Tiberium gives to Mutants is the best way we use Tibeirum being heavily incorporated into a living being, and it is this that was meant to be a large factor to play against the Scrin. The substance which was meant to doom the planet and kill us all, the Mutants / Forgotten is meant to be the actual salvation from the Scrin. We think this makes Kane's actions make much more sense and seem much more fitting, helping to define why the Brotherhood is so pro-Tiberium and what they really mean or stand for._________________QUICK_EDIT

Pepzi, I don't quite understand your point.. Is it that our Scrin designs aren't scrin enough (funny.. I didn't even know that we had publicised any Scrin designs), or that the Scrin are not integrated into the TO story in the way you'd imagined?

You must understand that the Scin cannot just be "Nod, but Aliens". And our story makes the whole Brotherhood's (Kane's) objectives make sense.QUICK_EDIT

And I didn't think it was. To be honest, I ztyping hate all this "ZOMG EX WW SAID THIS" mentality that lurks in TS fans and gives me an instant dislike towards all TS projects._________________QUICK_EDIT

If we kept 100% true to Westwoods future ideas and concepts, we'd have no freedom or fun in what we can make, and it'd be unimaginative. But of course, we draw from particular ideas we like or think will fit._________________QUICK_EDIT

We will either wait untill HyperPatch is ready for use before a TO release, or ignore HyperPatch and continue our work focusing on not needing it and sticking to usual TS. Being honest TO waits on enough staff members for it's neccessary material and I can't imagine the added time delay we will have waiting on HP also as well as everything else on TO's plate. The current plans are to continue working as if we are just sticking to normal TS.

Aye, i always said work as HyperPatch is optional, but never definite.QUICK_EDIT

Most of the stuff discussed here has some semi-hidden campaign/story/text document content linked to it or at least is supposed to.

Writing fan-fiction is always a fun thing to do, but gradually we've changed the course of the story from loosely fitting the seam from where TS/FS left off to just writing our own standalone canon that in no way is 'obliged' to link up with canonical events before Firestorm, rather it may overwrite it. TO has its own canon that is, by definition, separate from everything else. What this means in practice is that it's an unofficial 'sequel' to TS/FS of sorts, but you may find some of the TO canon not to match up with some of that which has been established in the previous games, or spouted by WW and WW's ex-employees at Petroglyph.

As Morpher said, the concept of mutation is applied not just as a body horror element, but as a crucial plot point. Would you want to be mutated if it meant the survival of your race? GDI disagrees, whereas Nod embraces the philosophy of divination, actively, aggressively pursuing it so as to prepare themselves for things to come... In TO this conflict is a neat drape for the inherent conflict in mankind. Nod and GDI are supposed to be presented with equally determined yet fuzzy points with good arguments for them. Although Nod doesn't particularly care much for the laws of war or ethics in general, it has its reasons. Although GDI shuns the Forgotten and places mutant refugees in special camps, it has its reasons.

The Scrin are not mentioned a lot in TO for the simple fact that it's no fun having everything revolve around them. C&C3, along with dozens of other stories has plenty of room for the Scrin. In TO we shove them back a little, no big fat spotlight for them just yet. Maybe somewhere in the campaign, but nothing big. The Scrin are a very stereotypical enemy the way they tend to be presented and we don't want another Zerg or Tyranid clone if we can help it.QUICK_EDIT

I like. Personally I think relegating the scrin to the backburners and focusing more on the war and its effects on humans (Blunt or Shiner aside) will be better by far. It keeps TO from going down the 'Hey guys guess who's coming to earth?" plot and brings the Tiberi-verse into a bit more realistic feel. I'm not going to argue realism or not, but... its much easier for players and writers to relate to a story and world where discrimination and clashing ideologies thrive (yet both have the same goal of making the earth a better place.), then another pew pew pew alien war.

You can't really have as good of an impact on your audience if you shell out the same garbage as EA did with C&C3 -and- RA3 of this 'mysterious third army' coming and kicking ass until there is a truce to defeat them. No._________________Victory!QUICK_EDIT

Hospital: Infantry sent to Hospital will heal
Armoury: Infantry sent to Armoury will be promoted
Cabal Core: Gives player access to Cabal units and buildings (Units have threads)
Cabal PP: Cabal building, provides power
Cabal Adv. PP: Cabal building, provides even more power
Pyramid of Nod: Gives player access to Black Hand units (Units should get threads)
Forgotten HQ: Gives player access to Mutant units (Most units have threads, though the graphics may be slightly out of date...)
Sensor Array: Provides radar and around array provides sensors to player

Once these buildings have graphics, threads will be posted. By me if necessary.
...Actually, the Cabal Powerplant and Advanced Powerplant both have graphics, so I might draft up a topic in the near future - the others, however, you may have to wait for.

EDIT: TO is standalone, requiring nothing except a blank folder in which to put the mod.QUICK_EDIT

It'd be great to release, right now we're at staff beta (unofficial release) 2.1.

ATM, we're waiting on the high-tier Nod buildings, the completion of the GDI command centre, the Naval Yards, some terrain and a few units.
Oh, and a bunch of maps, for both single player and skirmish.

It'd be great to set a date, but there are only so many active staff and I have a feeling we'd not stick to a set date.
I can only speak for myself, though.
Anyone who wants to help ease the workload by helping me with some of the 2D work and tmp conversions, that'd move some things a lot faster. However, I'm only taking a hand in the 3D in a peripheral way, so it's mostly up to the 3Ders when the building sets are done for the factions.
All I can tell you is that I'm doing what I can, and the other staffers I've talked to recently have been putting in their own work too.

Looking at the number of roles I'm busy filling, it actually amazes me that I haven't gone mad or got badly sick yet.QUICK_EDIT

Hey I just have a few questions about the campaign. Will there be more missions like the riot mission in Firestorm. In a world that is rapidly becoming unstable, I imagine anxiety will be common. I think more passive aggressive mission featuring GDI performing police actions would be neat._________________Beta Tester for Mental Omega 3.0

We have some good guildelines on the direction of the campaign, but we're not 100% solid. By all means feel free to post in the suggestions thread a mission concept if you've got any particular ideas or want to see something specific? There will be some riot / out of control civilian - Mutant situations similar to what you have mentioned though, but they may not be the focus of missions._________________QUICK_EDIT

No doubt we'll have some missions which will have Tiberium based lifeforms play a large part. We've got a few missions concepts cooking which involes this.

Nod has two different types of subfactions, the early campaign Splinter Factions and then the different divisions of the fully functional Nod which are the Black Hand and the Crown of Eclipse. GDI does have a special ops faction which is the Phoenix Division which is really just a campaign only faction, it's mainly comprised of highly skilled infantry and the GDI's most hightech / secret weaponry._________________QUICK_EDIT

Where the hell are your sources of inspiration coming from? The new designs for things like the Hydra and Piranha were totally out of the ballpark for anything I'd expect. Frankly, they were fuckin' cool to be blunt, but totally unexpected looks for Nod's naval units. Keep it up._________________Victory!QUICK_EDIT

Google Images for spaceships for the Hydra, which eventually got me a pic of a low poly model of something or other for a mod for Homeworld or something, which I bent about a bit and ended up with the thing you see today. Also some discussion with Ryan who was, as he has noted, slightly lost for much of it.

The Piranha was my quest to make it look less like a giant jetski and more like a multi-manned boat. This was an entirely practical design, where the shape was informed by the role. The most basic goal was to make it not look quite as much like an attack bike but for water (which mostly worked. Size and scheme aren't much help for differentiating units which are very similar).

I could go on for ages on how I designed these things, but since it makes me feel a bit silly, I won't.

Next thing to do in this vein is the Nod middle tier boat, which will be a submarine. At the moment the exact weapon is a bit in the discussion/brainstorming phase between me an Morpher, but since he's apparently got torpedos working properly they'll hopefully make an appearance there. To keep it different from the CABAL sub, I'd kinda rather avoid vertically launched cruise missiles....

merging my previous post with this one:

Morpher wrote:

GDI does have a special ops faction which is the Phoenix Division which is really just a campaign only faction, it's mainly comprised of highly skilled infantry and the GDI's most hightech / secret weaponry.

Also GDI has the federal troops, which are the arm of GDI which does the policing in GDI cities (putting down food riots, preventing mutants from overrunning civilized areas, etc), and has a role in the construction and running of GDI positions (cities, major bases such as Hammerfest, Munich, etc). They're basically the forces which GDI deploys to areas whuch aren't military hotspots but still require some GDI manpower in the area.QUICK_EDIT

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