Isn't the opposite of materialism - death worship?

Love is what this is.
There is no you and other (to love).
Aliveness is love and this is what is going on - can you feel it?
Death?? Can it be known? Death is just a story being told in aliveness. Just as deep sleep is just a story being told in wakefulness.

You talk about good and evil and how good can exist without evil and then you talk about a cup. Can you pour a drink into a full cup? No. The
emptiness is needed.

Let's assume that it WERE possible to get rid of evil. Well why should we? Why should "good" override "evil"? Because of our personal feelings
about what WE want, so now we are GODS to reality and can choose to CONTROL REALITY? Where is the ACCEPTANCE and LOVE talked about? Or is that only
when people agree to these ideas or else you don't really love them?

" I was talking to people who DO believe that materialism is suffering... "

You will only suffer if you believe you are material, if you believe you are a thing amongst other things you will suffer.
You are not a thing. You are the seer and knower of things. You are the aware space (spirit) in which all things arise.

I don't think "this" is love. I think "this" is happening and whatever emotion is experienced at that time is what "it" will APPEAR to be (in
the coming moment).

Is there unity? Yes, I still understand this, but somehow I still do not like people who seek to control . That is one of the main things that annoy
me even though I know "this" is unity arising as one.

" I was talking to people who DO believe that materialism is suffering... "

You will only suffer if you believe you are material, if you believe you are a thing amongst other things you will suffer.
You are not a thing. You are the seer and knower of things. You are the aware space (spirit) in which all things arise.

edit on 30-9-2012 by
Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)

If the body is harmed there will still be pain whether I am just "aware" of it or not. These sensations can just be too strong.

God created man in his own image. He made a woman to keep the man company so he wouldnt ge lonely. God tried his best but he just did understand the
frail nature of the material reality.

edit on 30-9-2012 by AthlonSavage because: (no reason given)

And even after the body dies, there is still the spirit - where the spirit can long and suffer - and even if the "spirit" gains awareness where
things can "instantly" appear, for how long will it be until the spirit realize that they are a hamster running around in the endless spinning
wheel? Even the spirit is bound by desires and intentions like the body (just in a different way) only death seems to be the answer - not just of body
but of spirit - being without ANY emotion or desire...

Originally posted by NotAnAspie
Take a person who is angry and then goes and says something driven by anger. Of course it's not right but what's the solution? tell them they are not
allowed to speak while angry or find out what their problem really is and what's causing their anger.

You are saying this isn't good because this view is driven by sufferance, right?

If that is the case, then they should just be speaking from apathy since life is just happening, not any negative OR positive stimulation.. If
negative stimulation is a problem not representative of reality nature then so is positive stimulation.

The essence of our lives is the simplicity of touch. There is no greater power born in the material world than originates when a man and woman touch
hands, hold hands.

Or a man and a man or a woman and a woman that love each other.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage

Death has nothing to do with that force, it didnt create it and its not its essence. Death participates in life as an observer until the time it
reaches over and taps the person. Love is taking a loved ones hand and declaring love against death knowing that the love will go beyond material
death. Love is the heart that dared it all in front of the pain of losing it all.

Exactly, which is why I said that materialism IS NOT death. By materialism I mean anything physical so even spirits (energy/light) is physical. Loving
a person is materialism and so is love a spirit - energy force.

Love is caring for some THING or some ONE (a person - a physical thing). Love is an anchor for material things whether person, object, or spirit.

WHO?

I have eliminated yourself so I guess that is a tad of progress.

It doesn't have to be specific... just say a person you know, a group, something you read in a book. If you can't do that.... it just makes this crazy
talk since it obviously has nothing to do with you.

As for your quote... no I don't think whoever this poor unknown unnamed person who is being accused of worshipping death is speaking from apathy...
no, I don't.

I have absolutely no idea what you are saying about positive and negative stimulation. Suffering can manifest in many forms... many UNAPPARENT forms.
Why can't you understand why more details of the source of this opinion would be really considerate to both the people you are requesting opinions
from not to mention the poor theoretical person you are vaguely referring to who could be hanging themselves while you hem-haw around about the flaws
in their belief system.

They could mad with mercury poisoning, they could have a brain tumor, they could a victim of electronic experimentation or they could just be flat out
insane from organic mental disease and you are asking me whether or not I think they are speaking from apathy since life is just happening?

What are you saying? That nothing much in their life is happening to make them feel suffering? Because if that is what you are saying then this
narrows down that you are speaking of a PARTICULAR individual... and right now I couldn't be more nauseated at having to pull teeth this way when
something that could be originating from so many dangerous sources is being chalked up as their fault for worshipping death.

And they say suicide is on the rise... what a shock. I'm so surprised.

I don't think "this" is love. I think "this" is happening and whatever emotion is experienced at that time is what "it" will APPEAR to be (in the
coming moment).

Is there unity? Yes, I still understand this, but somehow I still do not like people who seek to control . That is one of the main things that annoy
me even though I know "this" is unity arising as one.

I

You don't 'think' this is love. Stop 'thinking' then. Feel the aliveness - aliveness is love.
Love is not an emotion - love is what you are - what this is when the 'thinking' stops 'thinking' this is something.
'This' is nothing (spirit) appearing as an apparent some thing (material).

And even after the body dies, there is still the spirit - where the spirit can long and suffer - and even if the "spirit" gains awareness where things
can "instantly" appear, for how long will it be until the spirit realize that they are a hamster running around in the endless spinning wheel? Even
the spirit is bound by desires and intentions like the body (just in a different way) only death seems to be the answer - not just of body but of
spirit - being without ANY emotion or desire...

Death is not the answer because its like saying im gonna sell up my house and go live in a graveyard because i can stand the neigbours noise. The
answer is too be tough, patient sweet, and cunning and when you strike make it lethal!

"If the body is harmed there will still be pain whether I am just "aware" of it or not. These sensations can just be too strong."

Pain in the moment is not 'suffering'. Sensations come and go. Human suffering is fear, dread, guilt, anticipation, unease (dis-ease). 'Suffering'
happens with the belief in time. Suffering happens with the belief in 'other'.

You talk about good and evil and how good can exist without evil and then you talk about a cup. Can you pour a drink into a full cup? No. The
emptiness is needed.

Let's assume that it WERE possible to get rid of evil. Well why should we? Why should "good" override "evil"? Because of our personal feelings about
what WE want, so now we are GODS to reality and can choose to CONTROL REALITY? Where is the ACCEPTANCE and LOVE talked about? Or is that only when
people agree to these ideas or else you don't really love them?

you don't need to fill a cup that is already filled. An empty cup isn't needed when you are thirsty unless you have something to put in it. This is
straying away from the point. I said this because people try to console those who suffer by telling them to simply accept what is not desired.

evil would be a poor choice of words because it's relevant so lets call it those who trespass upon the will of others. yes, one's own sovereignty has
much more of a right to be then those who trespass upon it... and this can be eliminated. My point is that you do not have to accept such things....
and if you look around you might find others who also refuse to accept the current crappy status quo of "life isn't fair".... well, it could be better
and the LAST thing you try to pull out of your hat to dazzle the suicidally depressed is "you gotta take the good with the bad, deal with it"....
because that is their poison and it gets them nowhere but back to square one.

That is why I made that statement.... I thought it would be clear.

This conversation is really getting on my nerves and I sure do hope that none of you people's buds decides to off themselves tonight while y'all
debate and theorize if it's incorrect for them to feel this way.

Apathy? I take it they are showing disinterest in things.... but nothing to actually complain about.... that you can see.

Yup that was the jugular alright, delayed shot, perfectly aimed and accurate, 10/10 for the OP tonight. Its a Plastic material world nothing to get
too worried about, the sun will rise again tommorow and we will be here on Ats doing our material dance togther.

It seems redundant to speculate the existence of something we can never know of as constituents of it antithesis. (we are material beings in material
reality knowing of nothing other than matter in various forms)
We do not even have a frame of reference to put it in (non-materialism), let alone try to define it.
And since our material laws state that matter-energy is neither created nor destroyed; then subsequently death falls into the above categories of
material speculation as neither the vessel or its animating energy would/can ever cease to exist - but only transfer form - and to this end we can
call the closet thing to the 'opposite' of materialism that we have available to our current understanding is perhaps matter reformed in another
existence?
Otherwise, as Abraham Maslow said: "If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.

All that can be known is this - this right here and right now is all that can be known. It can be called life and in life questions arise about
things that cannot be known, like death.
Death is just a story appearing presently in presence to presence.

It is assumed that material existence is a fact but what is material existence. If material existence is thought of as 'things', then there is no
actual 'things' - 'things' are just thoughts.
This present moment is all that is actual and this moment is not a thing. Thoughts arise presently and if the thoughts are believed they lead us to
believe that there is more than this.
The mind tells stories about things.
In reality there are no things - there is just this (whatever is happening presently).

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