Mr. SHARMAN & Mr. ELSEWORTH moved to fill the blank left in the 4th. Resolution
for the periods of electing the members of the first branch with the words, "every
year." Mr. SHARMAN observing that he
did it in order to bring on some question.

Mr. RUTLIDGE proposed "every two
years."

Mr. JENNIFER propd. "every three
years," observing that the too great frequency of elections rendered the
people indifferent to them, and made the best men unwilling to engage in so
precarious a service.

Mr. MADISON seconded the motion for
three years. Instability is one of the great vices of our republics, to be
remedied. Three years will be necessary, in a Government so extensive, for
members to form any knowledge of the various interests of the States to which
they do not belong, and of which they can know but little from the situation and
affairs of their own. One year will be almost consumed in preparing for and
travelling to & from the seat of national business.

Mr. GERRY. The people of New England
will never give up the point of annual elections, they know of the transition
made in England from triennial to septennial elections, and will consider such
an innovation here as the prelude to a like usurpation. He considered annual
elections as the only defence of the people agst. tyranny. He was as much agst.
a triennial House as agst. a hereditary Executive.

Mr. MADISON, observed that if the
opinions of the people were to be our guide, it wd. be difficult to say what
course we ought to take. No member of the Convention could say what the opinions
of his Constituents were at this time; much less could he say what they would
think if possessed of the information & lights possessed by the members
here; & still less what would be their way of thinking 6 or 12 months hence.
We ought to consider what was right & necessary in itself for the attainment
of a proper Governmt. A plan adjusted to this idea will recommend itself —
The respectability of this convention will give weight to their recommendation
of it. Experience will be constantly urging the adoption of it, and all the most
enlightened & respectable citizens will be its advocates. Should we fall
short of the necessary & proper point, this influential class of Citizens
will be turned against the plan, and little support in opposition to them can be
gained to it from the unreflecting multitude.

Mr. GERRY repeated his opinion that it
was necessary to consider what the people would approve. This had been the
policy of all Legislators. If the reasoning of Mr. Madison were just, and we
supposed a limited Monarchy the best form in itself, we ought to recommend it,
tho' the genius of the people was decidedly adverse to it, and having no
hereditary distinctions among us, we were destitute of the essential materials
for such an innovation.

The words requiring members of ye. 1st. branch to be of the age of years
were struck out Maryland alone, no. The words "liberal compensation for
members" being considd. Mr. MADISON
moves to insert the words, "& fixt." He observed that it
would be improper to leave the members of the Natl. legislature to be provided
for by the State Legisls. because it would create an improper dependence; and to
leave them to regulate their own wages, was an indecent thing, and might in time
prove a dangerous one. He thought wheat or some other article of which the
average price throughout a reasonable period preceding might be settled in some
convenient mode, would form a proper standard.

Col. MASON seconded the motion; adding that it would
be improper for other reasons to leave the wages to be regulated by the States.
1.
9 the different States would make
different provision for their representatives, and an inequality would be felt
among them, whereas he thought they ought to be in all respects equal. 2.
9 the parsimony of the States might reduce
the provision so low that as had already happened in choosing delegates to
Congress, the question would be not who were most fit to be chosen, but who were
most willing to serve.

DOCtr. FRANKLYN
said he approved of the amendment just made for rendering the salaries as fixed
as possible; but disliked the word "liberal." he would prefer
the word moderate if it was necessary to substitute any other. He remarked the
tendency of abuses in every case, to grow of themselves when once begun, and
related very pleasantly the progression in ecclesiastical benefices, from the
first departure from the gratuitous provision for the Apostles, to the
establishment of the papal system. The word "liberal" was struck out
nem. con.

On the motion of Mr. PIERCE, that the
wages should be paid out of the National Treasury,

Mr. SPAIGHT moved to fill the blank for
the duration of the appointmts. to the 2d. branch of the National Legislature
with the words "7 years.

Mr. SHERMAN, thought 7 years too long.
He grounded his opposition he said on the principle that if they did their duty
well, they would be reelected. And if they acted amiss, an earlier opportunity
should be allowed for getting rid of them. He preferred 5 years which wd. be
between the terms of
22 1st. branch & of the executive

Mr. PIERCE proposed 3 years. 7 years
would raise an alarm. Great mischiefs had 23
arisen in England from their septennial act which was reprobated by most of
their patriotic Statesmen.

Mr. RANDOLPH was for the term of 7
years. The democratic licentiousness of the State Legislatures proved the
necessity of a firm Senate. The object of this 2d. branch is to controul the
democratic branch of the Natl. Legislature. If it be not a firm body, the other
branch being more numerous, and coming immediately from the people, will
overwhelm it. The Senate of Maryland constituted on like principles had been
scarcely able to stem the popular torrent. No mischief can be apprehended, as
the concurrence of the other branch, and in some measure, of the Executive, will
in all cases be necessary. A firmness & independence may be the more
necessary also in this branch, as it ought to guard the Constitution agst.
encroachments of the Executive who will be apt to form combinations with the
demagogues of the popular branch.

Mr. MADISON, considered 7 years as a
term by no means too long. What we wished was to give to the Govt. that
stability which was every where called for, and which the Enemies of the
Republican form alledged to be inconsistent with its nature. He was not afraid
of giving too much stability by the term of Seven years. His fear was that the
popular branch would still be too great an overmatch for it. It was to be much
lamented that we had so little direct experience to guide us. The Constitution
of Maryland was the only one that bore any analogy to this part of the plan. In
no instance had the Senate of Maryd. created just suspicions of danger from it.
In some instances perhaps it may have erred by yielding to the H. of Delegates.
In every instance of their opposition to the measures of the H. of D. they had
had with them the suffrages of the most enlightened and impartial people of the
other States as well as of their own. In the States where the Senates were
chosen in the same manner as the other branches, of the Legislature, and held
their seats for 4 years, the institution was found to be no check whatever agst.
the instabilities of the other branches. He conceived it to be of great
importance that a stable & firm Govt. organized in the republican form
should be held out to the people. If this be not done, and the people be left to
judge of this species of Govt. by ye. operations of the defective systems under
which they now live, it is much to be feared the time is not distant when, in
universal disgust, they will renounce the blessing which they have purchased at
so dear a rate, and be ready for any change that may be proposed to them.