Gun control works! Just think of the horrible things this family would have been able to do to an attacker if they had been armed. One more life has been saved!
[url=http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/07/14/family.stabbed.ap/index.html]CNN Story[/url]
WHITTIER, California (AP) -- Four family members, including an 8-year-old girl and a 70-year-old woman, were found stabbed to death in a home outside the city Saturday, authorities said.
No arrests were made. A relative found the bodies and called police at about 11 a.m., but police said they probably died on Thursday.
There were no signs of forced entry at the home but it appeared as if there was a struggle, said sheriff's Deputy Ray Peavey.
The home was ransacked with items "strewn about," Peavy said.
"A great deal of blood, a great deal of violence, a great deal of disarray in the home," Peavy said. "It's quite a devastating crime scene."
Peavey said preliminary information indicates "it's just a quiet family, nothing to make you think anything out of the ordinary. It's just baffling."
The victims were identified as Miguel Ruiz, 37, and Maritza Trejo, 41; their daughter Jasimin Ruiz, 8, and relative Anna Martinez, 70.
Whittier is 24 miles southeast of downtown Los Angeles.

Originally Posted By DScott:
Or they could have gone to a gunshow in Georgia and got shot in the head... [:(!]
The world is a dangerous place, I guess. [:(]

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Yeah, but do try to think of the number of accidents & homicides at gun shows relative to the number of guns there. Now compare that to the number of gun related deaths in Kalifornia. Despite the fact that 1 waste of DNA killed someone at 1 gun show, I'd still feel safer there than wandering around at night unarmed in the PRK.

How sad. Here is the latest news. The 8-year girl was raped.
===========================================================
[url]http://www.kfwb.com/news_local.asp?displayOption=&contentGUID={CDC246DA-0A26-469C-BED3-99A985075BB2}&groupName=KFWB Front Page Local Headlines&siteGUID={3B62BF55-4A93-48E6-A45D-6A495DC423AD}[/url]
Family Killed in Whittier Home; 8-Year-Old Sexually Brutalized First
WHITTIER (KFWB) 7.14.02, Updated 3:25p - - Investigators believe more than one person was involved in the violence that left four members of one family dead, their house ransacked and blood-pattered.
One of the dead was an eight-year-old girl. She was stabbed to death after being very brutally sexually assaulted.
Sheriff's Deputy Ray Peavy told KFWB's Jim Asendio they were releasing that disturbing information in hopes it would prompt soemone with knowledge of the crime to tip off authorities.
Four family members, including an 8-year-old girl, were found stabbed to death in a home outside the city Saturday, authorities said.
No arrests were immediately made. A relative found the bodies and called police at about 11 a.m. But the four probably died on Thursday, Los Angeles County Sheriff's Deputy Richard Pena said.
There were no signs of forced entry at the home but "it appears a struggle ensued, or whoever did it wanted to give the appearance that a struggle ensued," Deputy Peavy said.
The home was ransacked with items "strewn about," Peavy said.
"A great deal of blood, a great deal of violence, a great deal of disarray in the home," Peavy said. "It's quite a devastating crime scene."
The victims were identified as Miguel Ruiz, 37, and his wife, Maritza Trejo, 41; their daughter, Jasimin Ruiz, 8, and the girl's grandmother, Anna Martinez, 70.
Mr. Ruiz worked at an electronics store and computer repair shop.
"The preliminary information that we have it's just a quiet family, nothing to make you thing anything out of the ordinary," Peavy said. "It's just baffling."
"We just don't have a clue as to what have occurred at this point. It's a very brutal murder."
News of the deaths shocked neighbors.
"Why her?" Marie Cervantes told KNBC-TV. "Why the little girl? She was like one of my own. I don't know who could have done that."
Yvonne Ybarra told KTLA-TV that her daughter, Candice, was a friend of the 8-year-old and often slept over.
-- continued --

"Thursday night, she had asked me if she can spend the night," said Ybarra. She refused.
"The first thing on my mind was, what if my daughter had been there that night?"
"This guy is the nicest guy, if you needed help he'd come over here and help you," Leo Ramirez said of Ruiz. "Why would anybody do something like this to him or to his family?"
The quadruple homicide was the second family killing in Whittier this year. In March, five children died of asphyxiation after their father, Adair Javier Garcia, allegedly lit a charcoal grill inside the family's home.

Originally Posted By DScott:
Or they could have gone to a gunshow in Georgia and got shot in the head... [:(!]
The world is a dangerous place, I guess. [:(]

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Yeah, but do try to think of the number of accidents & homicides at gun shows relative to the number of guns there. Now compare that to the number of gun related deaths in Kalifornia. Despite the fact that 1 waste of DNA killed someone at 1 gun show, I'd still feel safer there than wandering around at night unarmed in the PRK.

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I think it all depends on the neighborhood you live not so much the state. I would feel much safer my home town than I would in Cleveland. If you look at the latest crime figures from the FBI, the south leads violent crimes with an index of 580.0 compared to the west which is next with 520.9. All that being said I would still feel safer if I could get a CCW permit.

fizassist, I understand your point, and I saw reports on this tragic incident in the news, but I'm not sure what gun control has to do with it. This could have happened anywhere. Not to mention the fact that they were murdered in their home, and you don't need a CCW to keep a loaded gun in your house... not even in California. [rolleyes]

Our people look for a cause to believe in. Is it a third party we need, or is it a new and revitalized second party, raising a banner of no pale pastels, but bold colors which make it unmistakably clear where we stand...? ~ Ronald Reagan

Originally Posted By Big_Bear:
fizassist, I understand your point, and I saw reports on this tragic incident in the news, but I'm not sure what gun control has to do with it. This could have happened anywhere. Not to mention the fact that they were murdered in their home, and you don't need a CCW to keep a loaded gun in your house... not even in California. [rolleyes]

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Well, the family was undoubtably subjected to lots of anti-gun propaganda. Maybe they wanted one, but it was too much hassle to buy one. Maybe the perp(s) figured the there were good odds that the family was unarmed, due to Kali gun laws. Maybe they didn't have enough money to buy other than an affordable handgun, banned under SB15. Maybe they bought one because of some threat from local gang members, but couldn't bring it home for ten days. Maybe they were bad shots, and needed a mag with more than ten rounds.
Whether it was gun laws or the people's ignorance, this could have easily been prevented with a gun in house, and the anti-gun folks bear some responsibility in crimes like these.

To generalize anything about a state as large and diverse as California doesn't cut it. For instance, the last home burglary in my neighborhood was in 1980. That's 22 years! Go 5 blocks north, and there have been perhaps 3 burglaries in that same time period. In the last 20 years, maybe 3-4 murders (domestic violence mostly), a couple of rapes on the northern side of town where the bars are, and that's about it. As long as I've lived here, for 22 years, I've taken my evening walk between 9 and 11 PM and never once had a problem other than some smart ass teens throwing water balloons at me one summer in 1995 or 1996.
The key to the low crime rate where I live is very simple. First, sorry, I cannot be PC but the area is something like 99% Whitey. Also, I live 6 miles from a freeway. There is no easy way into and out of where I live. I live on a dead-end street on a hill, inside a much larger development of upper-middle class homes. You can drive for 8 miles in any direction and you will not come into contact with any kind of scum bags. The scum bags cannot afford to live anywhere near where I live (and I am not rich at all), so that means if they want to cause crap over here, they have to drive through miles of suburbs, where every home is basically the same. No one neighborhood really stands out.
On the other hand, 8-9 miles south-east is a kind of crappy area with lots of Mexicans and a much higher crime rate. 20 or so miles south-west is Oakland.
Anyway, for the most part, the kind of areas most of us would want to live in are very safe.

"Okay, but I'm not good at details, or the big picture. I also show up late, and drunk. I've got a good feeling about this."- Homer Simpson

Originally Posted By mattja:
To generalize anything about a state as large and diverse as California doesn't cut it. For instance, the last home burglary in my neighborhood was in 1980. That's 22 years! Go 5 blocks north, and there have been perhaps 3 burglaries in that same time period. In the last 20 years, maybe 3-4 murders (domestic violence mostly), a couple of rapes on the northern side of town where the bars are, and that's about it. As long as I've lived here, for 22 years, I've taken my evening walk between 9 and 11 PM and never once had a problem other than some smart ass teens throwing water balloons at me one summer in 1995 or 1996.
The key to the low crime rate where I live is very simple. First, sorry, I cannot be PC but the area is something like 99% Whitey. Also, I live 6 miles from a freeway. There is no easy way into and out of where I live. I live on a dead-end street on a hill, inside a much larger development of upper-middle class homes. You can drive for 8 miles in any direction and you will not come into contact with any kind of scum bags. The scum bags cannot afford to live anywhere near where I live (and I am not rich at all), so that means if they want to cause crap over here, they have to drive through miles of suburbs, where every home is basically the same. No one neighborhood really stands out.
On the other hand, 8-9 miles south-east is a kind of crappy area with lots of Mexicans and a much higher crime rate. 20 or so miles south-west is Oakland.
Anyway, for the most part, the kind of areas most of us would want to live in are very safe.

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That's the difference between where you live up North and Whittier in Southern California. Southern California has taken in millions of third world killing machines in the last decade or two, far more than the Northern part of the state. It's no surprise that crime statistics now reflect the new demographics.
Still, driving in any direction for 8 miles without seeing any scumbags is nothing to brag about. Having fled the South Bay two years ago because I no longer felt safe for my wife when she left the house, I now need at least a 20-25 mile buffer zone (which I have in Northeast Dallas). When I left, cities in the South Bay as close as five miles from the ocean didn't look that different from the full-on hoods and barrios further inland. It reminded me of a a couple I knew who lived on the ritzy Sunset strip at Martel in the early 90's. They weren't far enough away either, and they didn't feel too hip and trendy when the L.A. riots ended up in their front yards.

Originally Posted By mattja:
To generalize anything about a state as large and diverse as California doesn't cut it. For instance, the last home burglary in my neighborhood was in 1980. That's 22 years! Go 5 blocks north, and there have been perhaps 3 burglaries in that same time period. In the last 20 years, maybe 3-4 murders (domestic violence mostly), a couple of rapes on the northern side of town where the bars are, and that's about it. As long as I've lived here, for 22 years, I've taken my evening walk between 9 and 11 PM and never once had a problem other than some smart ass teens throwing water balloons at me one summer in 1995 or 1996.
The key to the low crime rate where I live is very simple. First, sorry, I cannot be PC but the area is something like 99% Whitey. Also, I live 6 miles from a freeway. There is no easy way into and out of where I live. I live on a dead-end street on a hill, inside a much larger development of upper-middle class homes. You can drive for 8 miles in any direction and you will not come into contact with any kind of scum bags. The scum bags cannot afford to live anywhere near where I live (and I am not rich at all), so that means if they want to cause crap over here, they have to drive through miles of suburbs, where every home is basically the same. No one neighborhood really stands out.
On the other hand, 8-9 miles south-east is a kind of crappy area with lots of Mexicans and a much higher crime rate. 20 or so miles south-west is Oakland.
Anyway, for the most part, the kind of areas most of us would want to live in are very safe.

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That's the difference between where you live up North and Whittier in Southern California. Southern California has taken in millions of third world killing machines in the last decade or two, far more than the Northern part of the state. It's no surprise that crime statistics now reflect the new demographics.
Still, driving in any direction for 8 miles without seeing any scumbags is nothing to brag about. Having fled the South Bay two years ago because I no longer felt safe for my wife when she left the house, I now need at least a 20-25 mile buffer zone (which I have in Northeast Dallas). Cities in the South Bay as close as five miles from the ocean are now not too different from the the full-on hoods and barrios further inland. Heck, I knew some people who lived on ritzy Sunset at Martel in the early 90's, and they didn't feel too hip and trendy when the L.A. riots ended up in their front yards.

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Are you talking about San Jose? My wife is from Mountain View, and for the most part that area is very nice (and safe).
We used to have a 10-12 mile buffer zone, but the area that was once mostly blue collar Whites is now poor Mexicans. The thing that saves us is there are few rental units nearby and the price of homes is way more than the Mexicans can afford. But they are coming up here, no doubt about that.

"Okay, but I'm not good at details, or the big picture. I also show up late, and drunk. I've got a good feeling about this."- Homer Simpson

No, the South Bay, not the Bay area. The beach city suburbs of Los Angeles. There is literally one big Third World cancer pushing the beach city dwellers into the ocean from Santa Monica (south of the 10 freeway) all the way down to Long Beach. North Orange County is looking really bad now too (which is where Whittier is located). One magnificant region of crime. Whenever I get homesick, I just go to www.apbnews.com and listen live to the police radio in Los Angeles. It sobers me up real quick.
High-priced rental units and housing won't save any neighborhoods when you have 50 Third World'ers living in one dwelling and collectively paying the rent/mortgage. That is what is happening in Southern California. Then all it takes is for one bullet to whiz by and everyone moves out. Suddenly the price just got cheaper.

Oh yeah, I remember growing up in LA the South Bay is that area you mentioned. Up here, it's the San Jose area we call the South Bay. My cousin lives in Manhattan Beach. I guess that's not the area you're talking about. Or is it?
I know what you're saying. That area has been on the way down since I moved up here in 1980. My uncle ownes an indistrial construction company in Long Beach and I remember that area was always cheesy, even when I was a kid in the 60's. I suppose the civilized world is being pushed south into Orange County?
Do they still have that Whittier Blvd. cruize night? That used to be the place to cruize in the 70's. Stinking fog, I also got killed twice driving home from that place.

"Okay, but I'm not good at details, or the big picture. I also show up late, and drunk. I've got a good feeling about this."- Homer Simpson

Originally Posted By mattja:
Oh yeah, I remember growing up in LA the South Bay is that area you mentioned. Up here, it's the San Jose area we call the South Bay. My cousin lives in Manhattan Beach. I guess that's not the area you're talking about. Or is it?
I know what you're saying. That area has been on the way down since I moved up here in 1980. My uncle ownes an indistrial construction company in Long Beach and I remember that area was always cheesy, even when I was a kid in the 60's. I suppose the civilized world is being pushed south into Orange County?
Do they still have that Whittier Blvd. cruize night? That used to be the place to cruize in the 70's. Stinking fog, I also got killed twice driving home from that place.

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Yeah, I lived in Redondo Beach, which is about 10 minutes south of Manhattan. The civili8ed world has no place left to move, except out of state. Even Orange County is starting to experience the joys of it. Just drive through Santa Ana or Costa Mesa. The only cruizin' I heard about (on TV) was the high speed residential racing in that was driving the cops wild. Nothing defines Southern California like shaved-headed gang-bangers strapped with gats and sporting cheaply clad women in riced-out Hondas.

Originally Posted By mattja:
We have them too, but up here, a lot of Asians fit that description.
Ya'll just have to get out of LA. Everyone's moving north up by Magic Mountain and beyond.

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Some have moved up north, and that's why it's just as crowded now and the cost of living went through the roof. Besides, the weather isn't as good up north. The weather in Southern California is the only thing that keeps people around at any cost; I am utterly amazed at the suffering people will endure just to be a part of Southern California living. Better to leave the state for better opportunities and freedoms. I've come to love my evil weapons that would get me a prison sentence in California.

Los Angeles Times: Neighbor Is Arrested in Slayings of 4
[url]http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-whittier15jul15.story?coll=la%2Dheadlines%2Dcalifornia[/url]
Neighbor Is Arrested in Slayings of 4
Crime: Man is described as acquaintance of Whittier family. Investigators
release grisly details of attack.
By LAURA LOH and RICHARD MAROSI
TIMES STAFF WRITERS
July 15 2002
A 23-year-old neighbor was arrested late Sunday in the slayings of a South
Whittier family of four, and investigators said they expect to make additional
arrests.
Alfonso Ignacio Morales, whom investigators described as an acquaintance of the
Ruiz family, was arrested after detectives received information from neighbors
and collected unspecified evidence from the home in the 10200 block of Gunn
Avenue, according to a sheriff's spokesman.
"It's too early to talk about a motive," said Deputy Rick Varela, a spokesman
for the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department. "We are narrowing the field of
additional suspects and hopefully in that process they will be able to detail a
motive." Morales was being held at the Norwalk sheriff's station without bail.
The arrest came about six hours after Lt. Ray Peavy released additional details
about the nature of the attack, hoping that anyone with information would come
forward. Peavy said the four family members underwent extreme suffering before
they were stabbed to death.
Authorities said that 8-year-old Jasmin Ruiz, a bright child who neighbors said
had many playmates, was "brutally, sexually assaulted" before her death. Her
body, along with those of her mother, father and great-grandmother, had been
dragged from room to room, smearing blood on the floor and across walls.
A friend of the family said late Sunday that he had seen Morales several times
at the home and that Morales had sold the family a dog. Morales lives in the
immediate neighborhood and his family raises dogs, according to the friend.
On Saturday, victim Miguel Ruiz's sister, Olga, was seen taking away a large
boxer named Moisha and a small brown mutt named Taylor.
Ruiz, 38, worked out of his home part-time doing computer repairs. Investigators
found a computer in a neighbor's backyard Saturday, and family members told
authorities that computer equipment was missing from the home.
Peavy said the crime appeared too cruel to have been part of a robbery, but
suggested that the house might have been ransacked to conceal a different
motive. "A mass murder did occur and a robbery may have occurred," he said.
-- continued --

The other victims were identified as Maritza Trejo, 41, and Miguel Ruiz's
grandmother, Ana Luisa Martinez, in her 70s. The Los Angeles County coroner's
office will perform autopsies, Lt. Fred Corral said.
Investigators said they believed that more than one person had killed the
victims because of the amount of damage inside the home and the nature of the
slayings. Sheriff's officials also said they now believe the killings occurred
between 8:30 a.m. and 5 p.m. Friday.
The home was a hub for neighborhood kids, said Gail Baxter, principal at Howard
J. McKibben Elementary School, where Jasmin had been named student of the month
at least three times.
"Jasmin was a very sweet, beautiful little girl," Baxter said. "She was very
smart--had a lot of friends at school. She was a top student. The whole
community--neighborhood--is in shock and in mourning over this."
*
'Involved' Parents
Baxter said Jasmin's parents had been "super involved" with her education.
"Mom dropped her off every morning. Dad was waiting for her to get out of school
at 2 p.m. every afternoon," Baxter said. "They were really a model family, as
far as the school was concerned."
Miguel Ruiz, known as Mike in the neighborhood, was from Puerto Rico and was
remembered by neighbors as generous and helpful. He had often bought hamburgers
for local children and picked them up after school. He also worked as a car
stereo technician for his wife's brother.
Sometimes he fixed his neighbors' computers without charge, and he was known to
dish out advice to younger people.
"He would always give me guidance," said Hector Alvarez, a next-door neighbor.
Maritza Trejo was a good cook who liked to make pupusas from her native El
Salvador. Each morning, without fail, said neighbor Jose Jesus Hernandez, she
set her husband's coffee down next to him at his work station.
"She was a beautiful woman," Hernandez said.
Trejo worked hard, Hernandez said, sometimes six days a week, selling electronic
equipment from her brother's store at a local swap meet.
The family had rented the modest four-bedroom house for about five years,
according to neighbors.
Outside the home, leafy citrus trees cast a shadow on the overgrown front lawn
where Martinez, who was described as a pious woman, often sat for hours watching
neighborhood children at play.
Alvarez said he and his family had heard no unusual noises on Friday. The bodies
were found Saturday morning by Trejo's 21-year-old daughter, whom authorities
declined to identify.
Alvarez said he had last seen family members Thursday evening, when they were
sitting on their front porch and talking. Jasmin was absorbed in reading a
children's story, he remembered.
"She came out with her book," Alvarez said. "She was so eager to finish it."
Across the street, Arlene Hernandez, 8, said she and Jasmin had played together
nearly every day. One of Jasmin's favorite pastimes was handball, which the
children played against their garage doors. Arlene said she had often gone to
the Ruiz home to play computer games.
Anyone with information about the crime was asked to call homicide detectives at
(323) 890-5572.
*
Times staff writers Charles Ornstein and Richard Winton contributed to this
report.
If you want other stories on this topic, search the Archives at
latimes.com/archives. For information about reprinting this article, go to
www.lats.com/rights.

I didn't mean to bash the PRK by saying it was a horribly unsafe place to live. What I am saying is that
1) The bad guys didn't need firearms to murder a family of 4 & rape a little girl. People kill people.
2) In a more firearms tolerant environment, the family might have been armed and had a better chance. Even if all they could afford was some crappy "Saturday Night Special".

Whittier?!!
That place is a warzone, I'm surprised this made it to the press, it happens all the time. The family could have gone out to the street corner and bought some AKs if they would've had the time.

I've a friend that lives in Whittier, and it is not as bad as you folks make it out to be. It is an average working class neighborhood, not extraordinary one way or the the other. These murders could've occurred in anybody's neigbhorhood.
OT: Whittier is also the birthplace of former President Richard M. Nixon.

Whittier has always seemed ok to me. Kind of weird the preceptions that you have. I have no trouble driving around Boyle Heights on the east side of Los Angeles which is infected with Latino gangs but am very nervous whenever I have to go anywhere near the Comptom-Inglewood-LAX area.

That's the problem. Many neighborhoods in southern California have been gradually going to hell for so long, you can't even recognize how dangerous they are anymore. You have to move away to an area of the country where people are still law-abiding, God-fearing, and heavily armed to see the difference. I was pretty conditioned to accept my surroundings when I lived in So. Cal. too; now I see how lucky I am to still be alive. Everytime I go back to visit Hell.A., the hair on the back of my neck stands straight up the minute I drive away from LAX.
Sure, those murders could have occured in Malibu or Newport Beach, but if I had to bet my money on the probability it occuring there vs. other cities like Whittier, well...

My dad bought his first house in Whittier, in the early 50's using his GI Bill loan. Paid $5,000. It was a good, blue collar area back then. In the 70's, Whittier was known for Saturday night cruizing up and down Whittier Blvd. It was safe. We never had a problem.
Last time I was in LA was 1995 or 1996 to visit a client located very near to Florence and Normandie (not the best area, but they made me go anyway). I was just amazed how much it changed since I left in late 1980. The Black areas are getting smaller and smaller, as they are forced out by Mexicans moving in.
I guess Simi Valley is the place to be these days.

"Okay, but I'm not good at details, or the big picture. I also show up late, and drunk. I've got a good feeling about this."- Homer Simpson