He would be dumb to try anything but that doesn't mean anything with idiots these days. Only thing I really see is it wouldn't take much for his left hand to go back and make an attempt in grabbing the pistol. Can't make out the holster too well but I don't see any retention devices on it.

He really doesnt have hold of the fellow. I'm not a leo, but it seems to me that if you are moving someone from one spot to another while they are detained, they should be in cuffs.

I agree with the lack of retention on his pistol.

He should also be using the non-gun hand to hold the fellow. If he (or anyone else) try anything, he has to let go completely of this guy to go for his weapon. If he used his other hand, he could, in theory, go for his gun AND keep this fellow under some level of control.

He really doesnt have hold of the fellow. I'm not a leo, but it seems to me that if you are moving someone from one spot to another while they are detained, they should be in cuffs.

I agree with the lack of retention on his pistol.

He should also be using the non-gun hand to hold the fellow. If he (or anyone else) try anything, he has to let go completely of this guy to go for his weapon. If he used his other hand, he could, in theory, go for his gun AND keep this fellow under some level of control.

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Have you ever seen LE in (for example) England, or Japan detain folks? Some of them don't even carry guns.

The guy being held by the waist of his pants is very, very grateful to not have been shot on the spot, which is the usual deal there. The picture below the 2nd pic is also from that incident. The place was teeming with police and soldiers.

Tactically, almost everything he (cop) did would be wrong FOR THE USA, but he's not in the USA. The lesson here being that tactics are not universal all over the world. You use what works for you in that particular situation.

Have you ever seen LE in (for example) England, or Japan detain folks? Some of them don't even carry guns.

The guy being held by the waist of his pants is very, very grateful to not have been shot on the spot, which is the usual deal there. The picture below the 2nd pic is also from that incident. The place was teeming with police and soldiers.

Tactically, almost everything he (cop) did would be wrong FOR THE USA, but he's not in the USA. The lesson here being that tactics are not universal all over the world. You use what works for you in that particular situation.

'Drew

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Interesting take on it. But surely there are tactics that are universal, no? Such as weapon retention (using some sort of holster with some level of retention. using non-gun hand for tasks when possible)? Safe detainee handling (using cuffs to keep him from struggling as much and giving you a solid handle on the detainee)? etc?

Interesting take on it. But surely there are tactics that are universal, no? Such as weapon retention (using some sort of holster with some level of retention. using non-gun hand for tasks when possible)? Safe detainee handling (using cuffs to keep him from struggling as much and giving you a solid handle on the detainee)? etc?

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No, they are not, by any stretch. Especially if you don't have cuffs, or a weapon - hence no holster, or a gun to not use the non-gun hand.

Here's another mind blowing concept: Warning shots - they are used in lots of places all over the world by LE, and especially military, including our own military.

THREE policemen were shot and injured and two men who police say were "known gunmen" lost their lives during an alleged gunbattle in Hannah Town, West Kingston yesterday.
Following the shooting, there was prolonged gunfire in sections of West Kingston as armed men challenged the police for almost two hours.

At the nearby Kingston Public Hospital (KPH), where the gunmen were pronounced dead and the injured cops admitted for treatment, police securing the facility had to take cover as gunshots rang out outside the institution's rear entrance. The incident sent staff, patients, reporters and dozens of residents who had converged to get word on the men's condition scurrying for cover.
No other injuries were reported.
Up to late afternoon the cops -- one of whom was shot in the neck -- were listed in stable condition.
Residents identified the dead men as Marvin 'Kingsley' Kelly and a man known only as 'Fruits Man'.
Police said both were known gunmen in the area, and that a Glock pistol and a bulletproof vest were taken from a house in which they were killed.
According to the police, they went into a section of the Denham and Hannah town communities for Kelly and 'Fruits Man', but came under fire from a group of heavily armed thugs.
"We understand that three officers were shot, one in the neck and one in the left arm. I don't know where the other officer was hit," said one of several high-ranking cops who visited KPH. "Two known gunmen were shot and killed also," he added.
Yesterday, the house where the two men were killed resembled a scene from a horror movie.
Clots of blood covered the living room floor downstairs, and virtually every wall on the second floor of the two-bedroom structure had bullet holes.
Bullets also damaged a television set and pieces of furniture on which blood-stained clothes were strewn about in one of the rooms.
Kelly's mother, identified only as 'Queenie', was brought to tears after she exited the building.
"I don't even see my son. Some people said that him dead and other people tell me that him don't dead; I don't know," she said, adding that her son lived at the house with the mother of his child.
"Is one time my son ever go to jail. I don't hear him name calling in anything and nobody -- no police or anybody -- can't come tell me what my son has done to die like this all now," she added.
Yesterday, Opposition spokesman on national security Peter Bunting condemned the shooting of the cops and blamed the incident on the Government's refusal to sign an extradition request for West Kingston strongman Christopher 'Dudus' Coke.
In a release to the press, Bunting said the incident pointed to a chronic breakdown of law and order in the country.
"The continued failure of the Government to uphold the law and treaties in relation to extradition is but one manifestation of its failure to pursue a clear course on crime," Bunting said.

Also, shouldn't the officer be directing on the weak, non gun side? If the suspect were to reach for the gun from the off side, he'd have to reach across the officers body, and the officer would have better choices in reaction. And i'm surprised the suspect is being led somewhere, but not in cuffs.

Also, shouldn't the officer be directing on the weak, non gun side? If the suspect were to reach for the gun from the off side, he'd have to reach across the officers body, and the officer would have better choices in reaction. And i'm surprised the suspect is being led somewhere, but not in cuffs.

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The point of my posting the picture was to underscore that tactics we learn in the United States are not "universal". Tactics are rooted in culture. Suspects all over the world don't act and behave the same way. That person, who is being detained by the police, is completely fortunate to be alive. Normally they are shot on apprehension, stuffed in the trunk of the police car, and driven about until they leak out a bit, then sometimes shot some more, or given to the mobs to be beaten/stoned to death.

I don't think in the history of police detentions in Jamaica have there been FIVE (or even three) gun grabs as outlined above, and we are talking about hundreds of thousands of detentions, if not millions.

Is it how we do things here? No. Would I recommend it for LE here? Absolutely not.

It works for THEM. And that is what is important. Just as police in the UK and Japan use different tools and tactics that work for them.

As for tactics not being universal, well since in most other countries they don't allow gun possession by the serfs/subjects/peasants, and the police tend to have alot of automatic weapons, well they can get away with alot more than over here. And I bet if you photo them when they don't like it they get real up in your face.

It's a different world over there. More like a police state than a country.

I don't think in the history of police detentions in Jamaica have there been FIVE (or even three) gun grabs as outlined above, and we are talking about hundreds of thousands of detentions, if not millions.

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I am willing to bet their retention training consists of "They look at you gun, shoot 'em in the eye."

To reinforce what NYC Drew is saying, in the old Soviet Union, the state police (NKVD) did carry any weapons at all, except for perhaps a stick. People would sh1t themselves in fear at the mere sight of these guys. The political division of the NKVD did carry handguns, but not for self protection. The gun was for impromptu executions of political enemies.

In that environment, an arrestee would not dare make a grab for a gun, because it would ensure that his entire family would be executed.

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