HeartBurnKid:I'm betting he doesn't. I don't either. But if their CEO went on the news and said how proud they are to support Westboro's traditional family values, you bet your ass I'd stop eating there.

Ignorant is one thing. Willfully ignorant is another.

I think we're all fairly aware the manufacturing conditions overseas are not good. I think people are being willfully ignorant if they pretend that Nike, Reebok, Adidas, Old Navy, Gap, or any other manufacturer who bases their production in a third world country are ok to buy while Chick-Fil-A is not. The fact of the matter is that once you start looking at all these companies, if you're going to be up on a moral high horse boycotting them for whatever you are against, it becomes difficult to buy any good that you like. In my opinion, the world is not black and white and there is a balance to every decision. Does a company produce more good than bad?

Let's do some math here. Chick-Fil-A does $2.3 billion in sales each year. Say the Cathy's give $2 million per year to anti-gay groups (as they did in 09 and 10). That means that 0.009% of every sale ends up in the hands of an anti-gay group. They have also given $18 million to help fund foster homes and camps in 2010 alone and have given out $23 million in scholarships to employees over the past 35 years.

If the logic for the boycott is that you don't want to finance anti-gay groups, then by that same logic you also do not want to fund scholarships to Chick-Fil-A employees, you don't want to fund foster homes and camps, and you certainly don't want to fund anyone involved in the other 99.991% of their sales, which includes good people just earning a living.

You know what would make more sense than a boycott? Donating a dollar to a gay-rights group every time you ate at Chik-Fil-A. If the average sale is $10 (picking a round number), then that would equal 1,100 times what the Cathy's donate to anti-gay groups.

roncofooddehydrator:HeartBurnKid: I'm betting he doesn't. I don't either. But if their CEO went on the news and said how proud they are to support Westboro's traditional family values, you bet your ass I'd stop eating there.

Ignorant is one thing. Willfully ignorant is another.

I think we're all fairly aware the manufacturing conditions overseas are not good. I think people are being willfully ignorant if they pretend that Nike, Reebok, Adidas, Old Navy, Gap, or any other manufacturer who bases their production in a third world country are ok to buy while Chick-Fil-A is not. The fact of the matter is that once you start looking at all these companies, if you're going to be up on a moral high horse boycotting them for whatever you are against, it becomes difficult to buy any good that you like. In my opinion, the world is not black and white and there is a balance to every decision. Does a company produce more good than bad?

Let's do some math here. Chick-Fil-A does $2.3 billion in sales each year. Say the Cathy's give $2 million per year to anti-gay groups (as they did in 09 and 10). That means that 0.009% of every sale ends up in the hands of an anti-gay group. They have also given $18 million to help fund foster homes and camps in 2010 alone and have given out $23 million in scholarships to employees over the past 35 years.

If the logic for the boycott is that you don't want to finance anti-gay groups, then by that same logic you also do not want to fund scholarships to Chick-Fil-A employees, you don't want to fund foster homes and camps, and you certainly don't want to fund anyone involved in the other 99.991% of their sales, which includes good people just earning a living.

You know what would make more sense than a boycott? Donating a dollar to a gay-rights group every time you ate at Chik-Fil-A. If the average sale is $10 (picking a round number), then that would equal 1,100 times what the Cathy's donate to anti-gay groups. John 3:16

roncofooddehydrator:You know what would make more sense than a boycott? Donating a dollar to a gay-rights group every time you ate at Chik-Fil-A. If the average sale is $10 (picking a round number), then that would equal 1,100 times what the Cathy's donate to anti-gay groups.

Or you could NOT eat there and donate a dollar.

Are you that weak-willed you have to pay a gay-tax just to justify eating mediocre chicken?

roncofooddehydrator:If the logic for the boycott is that you don't want to finance anti-gay groups, then by that same logic you also do not want to fund scholarships to Chick-Fil-A employees, you don't want to fund foster homes and camps, and you certainly don't want to fund anyone involved in the other 99.991% of their sales, which includes good people just earning a living.

If only there were some way to support those good causes without at the same time supporting the bigotry.

Oh wait, there is: give your own money to good causes. Eat at places that don't proudly use the profits to fund bigotry. Problem solved.

MikeyistheDevil:rohar: chewielouie: Sorry, but freedom of speech, freedom of religion and freedom to eat tasty chicken sandwiches and waffle fries trump exaggerated outrage expressed by those who chose a lifestyle that not everyone is willing to accept or embrace as natural, and who also oppose it on moral and religious grounds.

Yes, there is intolerance and bigotry, but it's coming from the left.

shotglasss: Who gives a fark. I'm still going to Chick Fil A every time I want a chicken sammich. It's the best one out there. Although Panera's got a great turkey sammich that works for me too.

Oh you poor bastards in the south, no access to tasty fast food. You do what you will, but it doesn't compare to Zip's.

/oh, and for you smug Seattlites, Dick's isn't Zips.//Zip's has an awesome chicken sandwich, and the fries are to die for///and deep fried mushrooms, without the whole child abuse funding

You must not have ever been to the South.

/Had Chick-Fil-A today, will probably have some again next week//u mad?

Nah. It's your right to be a bigot and support businesses that act as a front for hate groups. I just ain't sharing any of my beer with you, or letting you ride any of my awesome motorcycles.

Kuroshin:MikeyistheDevil: rohar: chewielouie: Sorry, but freedom of speech, freedom of religion and freedom to eat tasty chicken sandwiches and waffle fries trump exaggerated outrage expressed by those who chose a lifestyle that not everyone is willing to accept or embrace as natural, and who also oppose it on moral and religious grounds.

Yes, there is intolerance and bigotry, but it's coming from the left.

shotglasss: Who gives a fark. I'm still going to Chick Fil A every time I want a chicken sammich. It's the best one out there. Although Panera's got a great turkey sammich that works for me too.

Oh you poor bastards in the south, no access to tasty fast food. You do what you will, but it doesn't compare to Zip's.

/oh, and for you smug Seattlites, Dick's isn't Zips.//Zip's has an awesome chicken sandwich, and the fries are to die for///and deep fried mushrooms, without the whole child abuse funding

You must not have ever been to the South.

/Had Chick-Fil-A today, will probably have some again next week//u mad?

Nah. It's your right to be a bigot and support businesses that act as a front for hate groups. I just ain't sharing any of my beer with you, or letting you ride any of my awesome motorcycles.

scottydoesntknow:Are you that weak-willed you have to pay a gay-tax just to justify eating mediocre chicken?

Are you that much of a hypocrite that you can pretend that Chick-Fil-A = bad while ignoring everything other companies do? Your computer was made using rare metals mined in China. Guess how nice of a life Chinese miners have...

You mean like the consequences of companies shipping their manufacturing to third world countries where workers toil in poor conditions and are paid a pittance, all so they can maximize profits? I bet you never even consider what you're supporting by just owning a computer.

MikeyistheDevil:rohar: chewielouie: Sorry, but freedom of speech, freedom of religion and freedom to eat tasty chicken sandwiches and waffle fries trump exaggerated outrage expressed by those who chose a lifestyle that not everyone is willing to accept or embrace as natural, and who also oppose it on moral and religious grounds.

Yes, there is intolerance and bigotry, but it's coming from the left.

shotglasss: Who gives a fark. I'm still going to Chick Fil A every time I want a chicken sammich. It's the best one out there. Although Panera's got a great turkey sammich that works for me too.

Oh you poor bastards in the south, no access to tasty fast food. You do what you will, but it doesn't compare to Zip's.

/oh, and for you smug Seattlites, Dick's isn't Zips.//Zip's has an awesome chicken sandwich, and the fries are to die for///and deep fried mushrooms, without the whole child abuse funding

You must not have ever been to the South.

/Had Chick-Fil-A today, will probably have some again next week//u mad?

Hell no - it's your body, and if you want to shiat in it, it's your business. After all, the more of that garbage you eat, the shorter the time the rest of us will have to tolerate having you around.

You mean like the consequences of companies shipping their manufacturing to third world countries where workers toil in poor conditions and are paid a pittance, all so they can maximize profits? I bet you never even consider what you're supporting by just owning a computer.

The world isn't black and white.

The plight of miners in the third world does not excuse Chick-fil-A's bigotry. And while the world isn't black and white, bigotry is. Bigotry serves no useful purpose.

You mean like the consequences of companies shipping their manufacturing to third world countries where workers toil in poor conditions and are paid a pittance, all so they can maximize profits? I bet you never even consider what you're supporting by just owning a computer.

The world isn't black and white.

You're right, to a point. But I don't think I'd buy a computer that had a sticker on it that said "We abuse our workers, and we're damn proud of it!" It's inpossible to avoid complicity with all evil in a complicated world - but I don't have to give my money to people who treat their assholishness as a prideful selling point. It is, I would remind you, my money - and I can spend it where I want.

You mean like the consequences of companies shipping their manufacturing to third world countries where workers toil in poor conditions and are paid a pittance, all so they can maximize profits? I bet you never even consider what you're supporting by just owning a computer.

The world isn't black and white.

The plight of miners in the third world does not excuse Chick-fil-A's bigotry. And while the world isn't black and white, bigotry is. Bigotry serves no useful purpose.

Refusing to buy Chick-Fil-A under the guise that "doing so supports bigotry and I don't support bigotry" means that a person should also refuse to own a computer because "doing so supports human rights violations in China and I don't support human rights violations in China".

People who are using this line of reasoning need to admit that they're jumping on this because it's easy to do and it makes them feel better. If the claim is a moral high ground, like so many have been doing, they're hypocrites (as evidenced by the fact they own electronics).

MikeyistheDevil:rohar: chewielouie: Sorry, but freedom of speech, freedom of religion and freedom to eat tasty chicken sandwiches and waffle fries trump exaggerated outrage expressed by those who chose a lifestyle that not everyone is willing to accept or embrace as natural, and who also oppose it on moral and religious grounds.

Yes, there is intolerance and bigotry, but it's coming from the left.

shotglasss: Who gives a fark. I'm still going to Chick Fil A every time I want a chicken sammich. It's the best one out there. Although Panera's got a great turkey sammich that works for me too.

Oh you poor bastards in the south, no access to tasty fast food. You do what you will, but it doesn't compare to Zip's.

/oh, and for you smug Seattlites, Dick's isn't Zips.//Zip's has an awesome chicken sandwich, and the fries are to die for///and deep fried mushrooms, without the whole child abuse funding

You must not have ever been to the South.

/Had Chick-Fil-A today, will probably have some again next week//u mad?

Oh, I've had more than my time in the south. I swear the osmosis effect made me permanently dumber for the experience. Neither here nor there.

Come up north, we'll gladly invite you to try our food. You'll be spoiled within 6 months and never want to go home. There's a secret to our meals though. You sitting down?

Care to share why? You group Amazon along with other business I mostly avoid, so I'm curious why you skip Amazon.

I used to be a HUGE Amazon customer until I found out that they treat their shipping/packing people like shiat. Actually, they aren't even their shipping/packing people, they hire an outsourcer. The people are paid minimum wage with no benefits and are herded (literally) around to fulfillment sites to pack and ship in bad and unsafe conditions. My hubby is a shipper and I don't want to support the outsourcing of that kind of job to horrible companies that treat their workers like shiat and I don't want to support the companies that use the outsourcers.

liverpoolumd:Kuroshin: MikeyistheDevil: rohar: chewielouie: Sorry, but freedom of speech, freedom of religion and freedom to eat tasty chicken sandwiches and waffle fries trump exaggerated outrage expressed by those who chose a lifestyle that not everyone is willing to accept or embrace as natural, and who also oppose it on moral and religious grounds.

Yes, there is intolerance and bigotry, but it's coming from the left.

shotglasss: Who gives a fark. I'm still going to Chick Fil A every time I want a chicken sammich. It's the best one out there. Although Panera's got a great turkey sammich that works for me too.

Oh you poor bastards in the south, no access to tasty fast food. You do what you will, but it doesn't compare to Zip's.

/oh, and for you smug Seattlites, Dick's isn't Zips.//Zip's has an awesome chicken sandwich, and the fries are to die for///and deep fried mushrooms, without the whole child abuse funding

You must not have ever been to the South.

/Had Chick-Fil-A today, will probably have some again next week//u mad?

Nah. It's your right to be a bigot and support businesses that act as a front for hate groups. I just ain't sharing any of my beer with you, or letting you ride any of my awesome motorcycles.

jso2897:You're right, to a point. But I don't think I'd buy a computer that had a sticker on it that said "We abuse our workers, and we're damn proud of it!" It's inpossible to avoid complicity with all evil in a complicated world - but I don't have to give my money to people who treat their assholishness as a prideful selling point. It is, I would remind you, my money - and I can spend it where I want.

I have no problem with you spending your money as you see fit. I just wish people admitted they were involved in this boycott because it made them feel better, not because they're acting under some sort of moral imperative.

I wish I actually liked Chikfila (I'm not typing all those farking dashes for these farks) so that I could deny them my business with my head held high. Unfortunately, I've always hated chikfila for their terribly shiatty, identical tasting sandwiches. Instead, I'll just continue poisoning my office against them during lunch.

/Didn't you see in the paper? They found a used condom in a chikfila sandwich last week.//I know, right? What kind of sick farking assholes are they hiring? Everyone knows God frowns upon contraception.

roncofooddehydrator:jso2897: You're right, to a point. But I don't think I'd buy a computer that had a sticker on it that said "We abuse our workers, and we're damn proud of it!" It's inpossible to avoid complicity with all evil in a complicated world - but I don't have to give my money to people who treat their assholishness as a prideful selling point. It is, I would remind you, my money - and I can spend it where I want.

I have no problem with you spending your money as you see fit. I just wish people admitted they were involved in this boycott because it made them feel better, not because they're acting under some sort of moral imperative.

Funny thing, acting within the imperatives of my morals make me feel better. Now if Chick Fil A could just admit the same...

You mean like the consequences of companies shipping their manufacturing to third world countries where workers toil in poor conditions and are paid a pittance, all so they can maximize profits? I bet you never even consider what you're supporting by just owning a computer.

The world isn't black and white.

The plight of miners in the third world does not excuse Chick-fil-A's bigotry. And while the world isn't black and white, bigotry is. Bigotry serves no useful purpose.

Refusing to buy Chick-Fil-A under the guise that "doing so supports bigotry and I don't support bigotry" means that a person should also refuse to own a computer because "doing so supports human rights violations in China and I don't support human rights violations in China".

People who are using this line of reasoning need to admit that they're jumping on this because it's easy to do and it makes them feel better. If the claim is a moral high ground, like so many have been doing, they're hypocrites (as evidenced by the fact they own electronics).

The difference is companies who abuse third-world workers are doing it because they want to provide cheaper prices, and while reprehensible, it is a necessary evil in this day and age.

Chick-Fil-A just hates gays because Jesus. Which would be fine if everyone believes in Jesus and thinks homosexuality is a sin and evil, but obviously many, many people don't.

roncofooddehydrator:jso2897: You're right, to a point. But I don't think I'd buy a computer that had a sticker on it that said "We abuse our workers, and we're damn proud of it!" It's inpossible to avoid complicity with all evil in a complicated world - but I don't have to give my money to people who treat their assholishness as a prideful selling point. It is, I would remind you, my money - and I can spend it where I want.

I have no problem with you spending your money as you see fit. I just wish people admitted they were involved in this boycott because it made them feel better, not because they're acting under some sort of moral imperative.

Funny thing about that, is that if given a choice on whether to buy a Chinese-made piece of electronics from a slave factory, or buy one from a decent assembly plant where workers are treated well, those of us who stand against Chik-Fil-A would also choose to purchase from the latter factory. Sometimes the choice isn't ours to make.

And yes, electronics are a requirement for the vast majority of us. My job alone has be toting around two cell phones, a tablet, and my own private workstation back at the office.

So what should I do? Buy a chicken sandwich knowing full well that part of my money will go to the persecution and oppression of several very good friends? Is that your suggestion? Or is it your suggestion that that choice I have to make isn't a question of morals? That deciding my friends' lives are valuable and more important than junk food isn't somehow grounded in morals?

roncofooddehydrator:jso2897: You're right, to a point. But I don't think I'd buy a computer that had a sticker on it that said "We abuse our workers, and we're damn proud of it!" It's inpossible to avoid complicity with all evil in a complicated world - but I don't have to give my money to people who treat their assholishness as a prideful selling point. It is, I would remind you, my money - and I can spend it where I want.

I have no problem with you spending your money as you see fit. I just wish people admitted they were involved in this boycott because it made them feel better, not because they're acting under some sort of moral imperative.

You should re-read what you just responded to, and then take a step back from your original argument and see where the problem lies. You're trying to shame us into accepting Chickfila's shiatty stance on gay rights just because none of us are going to drop completely off the grid and live in a field, eating berries to avoid unknowingly supporting ALL of the evil in the world. So let me repost it for you, with a bit of emphasis:

I don't think I'd buy a computer that had a sticker on it that said "We abuse our workers, and we're damn proud of it!" It's inpossible to avoid complicity with all evil in a complicated world - but I don't have to give my money to people who treat their assholishness as a prideful selling point.

Do you see it? Do you see the part where your "You're all just hypocrites because you have an alarm clock" argument stops applying? Because I can make it bolder and biggerer for you. And I agree with him. You are right. To an extent. We ARE being hypocrites. But everyone is, aren't they? Name me one person in the history of man (a real person, not a fake person like Jesus or Superman) that wasn't a hypocrite. HOWEVER. What we CAN do is stick to what our soul tells us is wrong, and refuse to support that which we believe IS wrong. Chickfila played their hand. Unfortunately, they believe in bigotry. I don't.

Cymbal:The difference is companies who abuse third-world workers are doing it because they want to provide cheaper prices, and while reprehensible, it is a necessary evil in this day and age.

On this point, I would disagree. It's not necessary. It isn't our decision to make, but it isn't necessary. What you're describing is a race to the bottom, and it's never the right way of going about things. It's corporate profit-chasing run amok. Sometimes it's better in the grand scale of things to simply let prices be high, and accept a smaller volume of trade. Business used to understand this.

malaktaus:FloydA: "What harm would it do, if a man told a good strong lie for the sake of the good and for the Christian church ... a lie out of necessity, a useful lie, a helpful lie, such lies would not be against God, he would accept them." ~Martin Luther.

"Did I not tell you earlier that a Jew is such a noble, precious jewel that God and all the angels dance when he farts?"- Martin Luther

Kuroshin:Cymbal: The difference is companies who abuse third-world workers are doing it because they want to provide cheaper prices, and while reprehensible, it is a necessary evil in this day and age.

On this point, I would disagree. It's not necessary. It isn't our decision to make, but it isn't necessary. What you're describing is a race to the bottom, and it's never the right way of going about things. It's corporate profit-chasing run amok. Sometimes it's better in the grand scale of things to simply let prices be high, and accept a smaller volume of trade. Business used to understand this.

Unfortunately, the people that run these giant, faceless corporations are completely and utterly morally bankrupt. The only thing that matters is having more than everyone else. More sales, more employees, more stores, more distribution centers, more everything. Nothing is, or ever will be, enough. It's a depressing thought, but that's the world we live in. It's a shock we've lasted this long as a species. As a race, we can't be trusted. As a species, we deserve to be extinct. But as a person, I want a farking Xbox and a kickass TV.

There seems to be some chronic disease that hits companies when they get above a certain unknown (and perhaps unpredictable) size: they just start to get douchy for some reason. Not all of them, but enough to make one wonder about it.

alowishus:roncofooddehydrator: So you ask every business person who you do business with where they spend your money to make sure it conforms with your views?

If the CEO of Chick-fil-a announced that the restaurant's official policy was that black people should no be allowed to vote, would you still have such a nonchalant view?

It's not just the CEO's personal opinion, he's made it the official policy of the company.

It's not even that it's their policy. It's that they actively prosecute it materially, by donating real money to real groups that are really working against gay rights in this country, for example by really lobbying real congresscritters about real legislation that affects real gay citizens. I don't give a rat's ass what they believe. It's what they DO that irks me.

I read the entire thread and I'm still curious. How does chikfila think they can win in a PR battle against one of America's most beloved institutions, the Muppets?

Since the late 60's, those furry farkers have taught us all about love, acceptance, and understanding. Even bigots raised on the puppets are stopped in their tracks when reminded of the words of the Sesame Street characters.

Is this corporation seriously so stupid to think that they can win this? The generation that watched the golden age of PBS will always side with their childhood friends.

Hell, I'm an atheistic alcoholic that lost all hope in humanity long ago and I keep a Mr. Rogers quote calendar on my desk.

/still don't understand the logic//I know! We'll make Americans hate the Muppets! Then we'll stilll be able to hate the f***ots and still sell shiat loadds of chickin!///I think I just wrote the plot to the new Muppets movie