Ernie: NITRD works with 16 - 19 agencies of the US Govt to collab/coord IT among the agencies.

13:20:32 [sandro]

... if we see a serious problem with technology, we'll put together information about what we want the govt (congress, ostp, ...) to do. communication from the agencies, to make sure innovation happens.

13:20:36 [BernadetteHyland]

Ernie Lucier from US NITRD speaking on outreach & education to communicate with US Agencies on what needs to be done to ensure innovation happens ... or explains why it is not.

13:20:58 [sandro]

... we also put together the budget summaries of the agencies. nitrd.gov annual report, R&D supplement to federal budget.

John Sheridan: Linked Data adds value via reconcilation (linking to other data). The big selling point to gov't executives (#10 Downing St) was visualisations and being able to embed on their own website.

13:56:29 [BernadetteHyland]

John Sheridan: have really focused on making publishing easy, focused on education & outreach & took a Chop-o-matic approach (see Gladwell quote). Plus a bit of promotion to keep momentum.

13:56:43 [bkaempgen]

+q

13:56:47 [sandro]

q+

13:57:17 [sandro]

ack bkaempgen

13:57:24 [boris]

boris is here btw

13:57:41 [George]

@JLS - AMAZING INSPIRING WORK!

13:59:40 [BernadetteHyland]

queue +

13:59:52 [sandro]

q+

13:59:55 [George]

q+

14:00:02 [BernadetteHyland]

q+

14:01:23 [chrism]

chrism has joined #gld

14:01:30 [sandro]

sandro: why excel vs webapp?

14:02:08 [sandro]

johnlsheridan: policy rules were changing in real time -- eg disclose total pay, phone number, etc it was easier and cheaper and quicker

John and Sandro: also, most public bodies have multiple disparate teams publishing data on different topics.

14:37:34 [Zakim]

+Jeanne

14:38:15 [BernadetteHyland]

Anne Washington: Be sure to recognize government timescale, it is slower than industry and therefore solution need to accommodate the pace.

14:39:12 [johnlsheridan]

+1 to Anne re sustainability. Especially important re URIs. One answer is to write contract requirements for maintaining a URI Set, and publish the contract. so, for legislation, maintaining the URI Set is a requirement on the contractor for next 5 years. Better still would be statutory requirements, but we are a ways off with that for URIs

14:39:13 [BernadetteHyland]

Anne: On Legacy Data, everyone wants things in RDF, but it would better considered a "search problem" first & foremost. We don't need perfect data out of the gates.

14:39:46 [sandro]

okay, thanks, HadleyBeeman, johnlsheridan :)

14:40:23 [BernadetteHyland]

Anne: Best practice on Stability - there are different appoaches (e.g., handles, PURLs) which is OK. Library of Congress used handles, US GPO used PURLs.

14:41:04 [BernadetteHyland]

Anne: Look at areas of innovation, but keep stability at front of the queue. That is what matters in gov't.

14:41:31 [johnlsheridan]

Btw, we are looking to support URN:Lex too (as some others use that) off the back of our Linked Data RDF store. Preferring HTTP URIs doesn't mean you can't play nicely with other approaches. Very similar issue wrt other URNs. We should link from http URIs to URN based schemes, where they have traction

Anne: It needs to come from official source, the people who created it. "We want to make sure it is the government on the Web and not a dog behind it." Must have a gov't URL behind it & ensure Gov't keeps it current.

14:49:34 [BernadetteHyland]

Anne: Consider having a PURL behind the link for continuity. Australians and UK are way ahead of us on this.

14:51:00 [Zakim]

-HadleyBeeman

14:51:02 [Zakim]

+??P12

14:51:08 [BernadetteHyland]

Katherine G (from L3 Communications): Asked a question about Federal Register still being printed in this day and age. (Note: Federal Register is available digitally).

14:51:20 [Zakim]

+ +1.440.389.aaff

14:51:23 [tobo]

Tope Omitola in .

14:51:35 [HadleyBeeman]

zakim, +1.440.389.aaff is me

14:51:35 [Zakim]

+HadleyBeeman; got it

14:51:36 [annew]

and johnsheridan didn't pay me to say what a great job they are doing.

14:51:57 [tobo]

No problem.

14:52:11 [johnlsheridan]

waves to annew - thank you - agreed with a lot of your talk

14:53:20 [tobo]

Could somebody mute their mike.

14:55:19 [BernadetteHyland]

Anne: Asked Hadley question about how her work is funded. Hadley said funding comes from UK Government Technology STrategy Board and they are exploring a "freemium" model too.

I'm going to have to go. Really sorry I couldn't be there or stay for longer (as I'm at OKCon) - really enjoyed the presentations I heard - looking forward to contributing to the WG. There is lots for us all to do!

What makes the US Gov't a bit different is special treatment of individual's data in sectors - specifically, children (COPPA), Health info (HIPAA), banking & financial service info (Sarbanes/Oxley), and global presense of US collectors.

Michael: Highly granular control of PII is commensurate with US & UK ... US corporations have a weak burden of duty for PII they collect from citizens.

15:29:02 [DruidSmith]

DruidSmith has joined #gld

15:31:04 [sandro]

dan: (question missed)

15:31:07 [Zakim]

-??P35

15:31:14 [Zakim]

+??P31

15:31:18 [sandro]

kath: nstic connections?

15:31:27 [BartVanLeeuwen]

Zakim, ??P31 is me

15:31:27 [Zakim]

+BartVanLeeuwen; got it

15:31:48 [sandro]

mikea: my colleage, Weitzl, ... we might have a MITRE or ABA comment.

15:32:09 [Zakim]

-HadleyBeeman

15:32:41 [Zakim]

+??P5

15:34:14 [BernadetteHyland]

Speaking now is Cory Casanave on Solving the pervasive Data Problem

15:36:36 [BernadetteHyland]

Please see the updated agenda on http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/wiki/F2F1 if you are speaking, please check. Appreciate your understanding as the schedule has changed to accommodate the many good talks people having been giving ... and the Q&A that followed.

15:37:49 [BernadetteHyland]

@danbri are you planning to speak on FOAF?

15:39:00 [BernadetteHyland]

Cory: Updated everyone on the Federal Data Architecture Subcommittee - Open Government Vocabularies Wokring Group (OGV).

15:39:01 [danbri]

hello Bernadette, everyone. I'm afraid I only saw Sandro's mail earlier today, and have some other commitments, ... so I was planning only to try to observe quietly from IRC

15:39:27 [HadleyBeeman]

I need to be going… best of luck with the rest of the session. Thanks again for inviting me, BernadetteHyland, George and Sandro!

15:39:38 [BernadetteHyland]

Cory: Caveat - this group can make recommendations, there is a White Paper on this available to this group (not yet public), however, this group has no official authority to mandate anything.

15:39:44 [danbri]

But I would like to say, that if there are changes around FOAF that will make it more useful or appropriate for this audience, I would love to start that conversation

15:40:05 [danbri]

(re long-term maintainance; or downplaying some of the older frivolous terms, etc... or re adding terms)

15:40:27 [sandro]

Thanks for coming, HadleyBeeman !

15:40:45 [HadleyBeeman]

Bye, Sandro!

15:40:49 [annew]

Bye HadleyBeeman. loved what you are doing

15:41:07 [BernadetteHyland]

@danbri are you able to speak at 13:45 US ET today? or is that too late for you?

15:41:15 [HadleyBeeman]

Thanks, Annew. Hope we'll get to talk more about it— we need loads of help. :)

15:41:20 [HadleyBeeman]

Bye, all!

15:43:16 [danbri]

I'm afraid I'll be heading off shortly; would it be possible to start a discussion by email [somewhere?] though?

15:43:56 [sandro]

danbri, how about joiing the WG and discussing it on public-gld-wg ?

15:43:59 [BernadetteHyland]

@danbri - yes, I would suggest that your talk be scheduled for one of our upcoming weekly GLD calls. Would that work for you? Sandro is working on survey results to confirm best time for everyone.

15:44:13 [BernadetteHyland]

@danbri, did you complete survey re: timeslot?

15:45:26 [BernadetteHyland]

Cory: I hope that we can band together on a "common theme, common message to solve data problems."

15:45:35 [bkaempgen]

+q

15:45:44 [danbri]

I didn't complete survey, maybe I can squeeze one more WG into my life... will take a look at the poll and find a way to follow up

15:46:58 [BernadetteHyland]

@danbri ... right, there is word for that ... YAWG (remember YAK and LEX ;-)

15:47:07 [danbri]

:)

15:47:20 [BartVanLeeuwen]

:)

15:47:36 [Ansgar_Scherp]

so, how many WG do you do at the same time?

15:47:36 [BernadetteHyland]

@danbri, even if you don't join formally, having your expertise on reviewing some of the vocab recommendations would be very welcome. You can dabble in our WG ;-)

Tope Omitola from University of Southampton on Provenance Models for Linking Data

15:53:06 [sandro]

topic: Tope Omitola from University of Southampton on Provenance Models for Linking Data

15:53:54 [madalynn]

madalynn has joined #gld

15:55:37 [BernadetteHyland]

@annew there is your dog behind the wheel ... that is a classic cartoon :-)

15:56:05 [SimonWall]

sandro, those times are pretty good for me - midnight in Canberra is not as bad as it could be

15:59:30 [BartVanLeeuwen]

sandro: who is that again on your right side ? ( /me is notoriously bad with names :( )

15:59:51 [annew]

@bernadette glad to have a visual reference for my quote from the New yorker... July 5, 1993

16:00:15 [sandro]

BartVanLeeuwen, that's George Thomas, co-chair. I figure'd I'd let the camera show only Bern for long enough. :-)

16:00:26 [BartVanLeeuwen]

:D

16:00:51 [sandro]

maybe I should slowly move the camera around the room, but it tends to make people dizzy.

16:01:38 [BartVanLeeuwen]

are there minuts from yesterday afternoon somewhere ?

16:02:39 [sandro]

BartVanLeeuwen, there's a raw IRC log, but I'm having some trouble with the proper formatting. (some server bug I can't concentrate on right now.) http://www.w3.org/2011/06/29-gld-irc

16:03:44 [BartVanLeeuwen]

k

16:04:36 [BartVanLeeuwen]

dinner time here I'll try to back at 14:00 for the charter discussion

16:06:01 [Zakim]

-BartVanLeeuwen

16:06:16 [BernadetteHyland]

@BartVanLeeuwen - what is your evening schedule? Are you able to participate in discussion of charter items at 14:00 US ET or is that too late for you?

16:07:21 [BernadetteHyland]

@topo - 1 minute warning to wrap up please

16:07:43 [BartVanLeeuwen]

@BernadetteHyland , that is my plan, that will be 20:00 here, I just hope you meet that schedule ;)

16:08:00 [BartVanLeeuwen]

I will at least pop back in here then

16:08:33 [BartVanLeeuwen]

later

16:08:35 [BartVanLeeuwen]

BartVanLeeuwen has left #gld

16:10:25 [BernadetteHyland]

@BartVanLeeuwen - I believe we can make that time. We have a lunch break and only one presentation, by Irene from TopQuadrant before the 14:00 charter discussion ... so I appreciate your hanging around for that.

16:12:11 [BernadetteHyland]

Yigal Arens, Deputy Director, ISS (Information Sciences Institute from USC) on The effect of government support for e-government research

16:13:19 [sandro]

Yigal: dg.o is the major north america egov conf, ...

16:14:15 [BernadetteHyland]

BernadetteHyland has joined #gld

16:15:04 [sandro]

yigal: govt agencies had to be involved in proposal, but then switched to "cluster"

16:16:59 [sandro]

yigal: Digitial gov, like every app, requires additional work from the researcher; unless funded to do so, they are not likely to do it.

16:18:34 [BernadetteHyland]

Yigal: "There is a real loss if there is less research being done for digital government. Decisions made by private sector are very different than those of gov't agencies."

16:19:07 [sandro]

Yigal: Due to lack of govt funding, we see people fleeing the area for the past 10 years.

16:19:29 [BernadetteHyland]

Yigal: "We see researchers fleeing way from digital government due to less grant funding being available in the last 10 years" and that is a real loss.

16:20:00 [annew]

+1 that we need a sustainable business model for doing research that impacts govt technology

16:26:57 [Zakim]

-DruidSmith

16:26:58 [BernadetteHyland]

Michael: "R&D investment in the USA at established mainstream companies has gone from approximately 18% to below 5% in the last decade. For startups, it is higher typically, but in mainstream companies it has gone down drastically."

16:28:28 [sandro]

mikea: Without the Office of Technology Assessment, there is much less expertise to make these budget decisions.

16:28:35 [BernadetteHyland]

Michael: There isn't sophisticated capabilities to make these arguments in Congress ... in the 1980s-1990s we had university, corporate research & gov't funding to support innovation research.

16:29:01 [annew]

Duly noted that the Congressional Research Service still provides technical nonpartisan advice to Congress.

16:29:07 [sandro]

yigal: The US spends 6% of GDP on research, EU 3%

16:29:21 [tobo]

Folks, I have to go . Good set of speeches. I hope to join again in the afternoon.

16:29:53 [annew]

good work on provenance tobo!

16:30:17 [tobo]

Thanks, annew. Further work still to do on there.

16:30:50 [SimonWall]

Can't hear Irene at all

16:30:57 [SimonWall]

Better

16:31:42 [sandro]

irene: we have linkmodels.org

16:32:33 [tobo]

tobo has left #gld

16:32:38 [Zakim]

-??P5

16:33:11 [BernadetteHyland]

Topic: Irene Polikoff (TopQuadrant) on Linked Data Models

16:33:34 [sandro]

irene: It's a bit frustrating when a lot of work goes into developing a model and it sits unused.

16:34:29 [BernadetteHyland]

See http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/wiki/F2F1 for updated agenda. We are lookingt to start at 13:40 US ET on Charter Items discussion for the benefit of our faithful participants in EU and AU.

William Bradford from Revelytix reviewing some early notes on Community Directory Discussion (corresponds to Deliverable 2.1)

18:12:30 [sandro]

subtopic: Community Directory

18:12:57 [sandro]

mikea: "publicity" sounds a bit mendacious, let's go with "outreach"

18:13:12 [sandro]

sandro: let's split pre-wg outreach and post-wg outreach

18:14:36 [sandro]

rick: Structure directory so we know Technology Policy Leaders

18:15:27 [BernadetteHyland]

Rick M: Discussed the Community Directory potentially having a bio and some basic info for the "technology policy leadership"

18:16:05 [BernadetteHyland]

Michael: Suggested doing this by role and not person's name. Maybe an institutional/affiliation contact.

18:16:44 [BernadetteHyland]

Rick M: Open Gov't was a really strong component of incoming US Administration's policy ... when money becomes tight, civil society takes up the "slack" when budgets are reduced.

18:17:10 [BernadetteHyland]

Rick M: e.g., Sunlight Foundation, codeforamerica.org, others who are taking up the slack.

18:17:54 [BernadetteHyland]

Rick M: We need a plan for engagement with civil society to make it relevant for them, e.g., a listing for Sunlight Foundation, pothole.com, etc who are fulfilling the social initiatives.

18:18:54 [BernadetteHyland]

Cory: Asked whether "Open Government" initiative still has staying power as a brand.

18:19:24 [BernadetteHyland]

Rick M: Open Government still has "brand" internationally.

18:20:04 [BernadetteHyland]

Michael: "Rule of Law democracy has worked for 100 years" (Jackson)

18:24:18 [BernadetteHyland]

Action Item: Rick - List of policy leaders per country so we know who to engage throughout the world. The second list is a list of organizations in civil society who we think are important to engage with.

18:24:18 [trackbot]

Sorry, couldn't find user - Item

18:25:00 [BartVanLeeuwen]

I know some dutch organisations for list 2

18:28:07 [BartVanLeeuwen]

are there multiple mics ?? some people are easy to understand, some are waaay in the backgroun

18:30:50 [Ernie]

Ernie has joined #GLD

18:32:26 [Zakim]

-BartVanLeeuwen

18:32:46 [SimpsonTP_]

SimpsonTP_ has joined #gld

18:33:07 [SimonWall]

sound was ok for presentations, almost unintelligible now discussion has started

18:33:19 [Zakim]

-SimonWall

18:33:35 [Zakim]

+??P3

18:33:42 [sandro]

sorry, SimonWall, I'm in the room and can barely hear anything.

18:33:58 [sandro]

some sort of after-lunch quietness

18:34:02 [SimpsonTP_]

Zakim, ??P3 is me

18:34:02 [Zakim]

+SimpsonTP_; got it

18:34:22 [Zakim]

+??P4

18:35:03 [sandro]

can you hear William, speaking right now?

18:35:12 [SimonWall]

yes william ok

18:35:16 [BartVanLeeuwen_]

yup

18:35:41 [martin]

yes, better. Thanks

18:36:49 [BartVanLeeuwen]

some people are stil waaay in the back

18:40:36 [Yigal]

Yigal has joined #gld

18:40:51 [SimonWall]

gone altogether for about 10s then

18:44:05 [BartVanLeeuwen]

please let there be on, one of the confusing things about the semweb is that there is no single entrypoint for e.g. vocabularies

18:44:41 [sandro]

discussion about technology for hosting the directory

18:44:58 [BartVanLeeuwen]

so if we intend to be a starting point, maybe we should just have only 1 entry point ?

18:45:00 [sandro]

we'll solicit offers. fallback to mediawiki

18:45:33 [sandro]

irene: what about having it decentralized?

18:47:42 [sandro]

sandro: Yes, we'll host the central triples, and let other people host their own triples if they want.

18:49:57 [BartVanLeeuwen]

hmm its basicly impossible to follow the discussion over SIP, is it just my having that problem ?

18:51:59 [sandro]

BartVanLeeuwen, we're trying to get people to speak louder, but it's hard....

18:52:04 [SimonWall]

Not able to follow most of the discussion now, I'm done for tonight. Thanks

18:52:14 [Zakim]

-SimonWall

18:52:36 [sandro]

goodnight, SimonWall !

18:52:42 [BernadetteHyland]

@SimonWall - good nite mate!

18:53:16 [SimonWall]

No probs

18:53:36 [martin]

BartVanLeeuwen, I have the same problem

18:55:47 [Zakim]

+??P1

18:58:59 [BartVanLeeuwen]

okay I give up as well, its not possible to follow the discussion like this :(

18:59:30 [annew]

it's not a very coherent discussion even for those of us in the room. sorry

18:59:58 [BartVanLeeuwen]

well at least you probably don't mis every 2nd word ;)

19:01:00 [Zakim]

-SimpsonTP_

19:01:20 [BartVanLeeuwen]

okay goodnight all

19:02:26 [sandro]

zakim, who is on the call?

19:02:26 [Zakim]

On the phone I see +49.261.287.aagg, martin (muted), +1.703.292.aahh, ??P1

19:02:35 [martin]

I have problems to follow the discussion as well. I'll read the minutes.

19:02:40 [martin]

Bye

19:02:53 [Zakim]

-martin

19:03:09 [martin]

martin has left #gld

19:03:17 [annew]

hey we can hear someone speaking german on the phone

19:03:20 [sandro]

zakim, mute aagg

19:03:20 [Zakim]

+49.261.287.aagg should now be muted

19:03:31 [sandro]

zakim, unmute aagg

19:03:31 [Zakim]

+49.261.287.aagg should no longer be muted

19:03:42 [sandro]

zakim, who is talking?

19:03:55 [Zakim]

sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: +1.703.292.aahh (66%)

* Action Item: Support for 2.1.6 Community Directory - Outreach & advocacy - List of policy leaders per country so we know who to engage throughout the world. The second list is a list of organizations in civil society who we think are important to engage with. Volunteer: Rick Murphy

20:04:57 [sandro]

Katherine: I'm an acquisitions geek. I do this stuff day in and day out. :-)