I just pick up a vario-w + Large Espro. while is is not replace my K-30 Vario. I have never used a a french press style before. (I am a drip coffee and espresso person) and after 4-5 wasted try. I find.

I start with con. (Unless I am a idiot)

- espro waste alot of water. at the end of pour. there is still (at least) 1/2 to 3/4 cup left. so you waste more grinds because you have to fill with more water.

- on the vario-w. while setting to the coarse-est. the grind still get though the filter.

- in order to make a clean cup. you would have to overfill your amount. for ex. if you use 20gram grind = 300gram water ur pour will be about 200gram (or less) in cup. so in order fill your 300gram cup. you would need to use 27gram grind and fill with 400gram with water. Now you will get a fill cup.

Now with the pro's

- vario-w is great. I love the size. as my vario k30 over shadow the vario-w.

- not was fast as k30 (4x $$$ less) of course.

- the weight measurement is great. I love it. no need to use a scale to measure before loading in.

- espro is lovely on the counter. finish is great. someways I think it is easier to clean than Bodum.

- WOW it hold the heats. after 1 hour it was still good to drink

The Taste.

- after all the pre-trails to get it right. I have to say it taste good. compare to single drip. I now think drip coffee is too clean. you lose the oil. with Espro. you get the coffee oil. and very very little grounds passing thought.

re your comment that Espro wastes a lot of water...there is an easy method to retrieve the extra coffee, as described first by Randy Glass (aka frcn) in his Espro press review, on his website, www.espressomyespresso.com I use it every time and it works like a charm.

After pouring out the coffee, with the press still in pouring position, hold the lid down towards the bottom of the press with your pouring hand, then with your other hand pull the plunger out a few inches (about the entire length of the filter unit), then press it back in and watch the additional fantastic coffee flow into your cup. Randy cautions one to use something to insulate your fingers from the top of the press during this process, as it gets very hot.

If you're only making a 300ml cup, you might want to use the small press. It's perfect for this volume.

.Always remember the most important thing is what ends up in your cup!

My vote is for the better grinder. I recently bought a refurbished Virtuoso 586, the one with the upgraded Preciso burr set, from the Baratza website. All I can say is that the difference between the Virtuoso and my Hario Mini hand grinder is huge. I tested out the coarse grind with my Bodum Chambord over the weekend, and the results were truly stunning. You hear it all the time that a consistent grind really makes the difference, and it's blatantly obvious when you have the ability to compare side-by-side.

That said, I have not used an Encore before. I'm sure it's a great grinder, but for me, the Virtuoso refurbished was in my budget and all the anecdotal as well as test data indicated the Virtuoso had a more consistent grind with less fines at the coarse end. Given that my main brew methods are french press and drip, the Virtuoso 586's characteristics and price point sealed the deal.

Also, as one other poster noted, check Baratza's site on Thursday mornings for updated refurbs. I bought the Virtuoso 586 for $175 but had to wait a few weeks to snag one.

I just bought a Virtuoso from William Sonoma...they sent out a 20% off coupon so got it for $183 with free shipping. I went on the Baratza website and tried to find out about the Virtuoso 586. What is that? Do all the new ones have the upgraded burr set?Rob

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