Police: All Empire State shooting victims were wounded by officers.

This is a discussion on Police: All Empire State shooting victims were wounded by officers. within the In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly forums, part of the The Back Porch category; New York (CNN) -- All nine people injured in Friday's shooting in front of the Empire State Building were wounded by police gunfire, New York ...

Very interesting. Boy oh boy, didn't the media initially try to play it up almost trying to make it sound like a Batman movie rampage shooter. Three people suffered GSW's, another six from fragments, hopefully all are minor, I'd think the fragments would be.

I'm sure that some comments could be made about the officers shooting accuracy, but I wouldn't be too fast about saying that. This guy pointed a gun at them in a crowded location, I'd say they don't have time to "check beyond their target". Furthermore, if they hadn't stopped the BG so fast, it's likely his own fire would have added to more casualties behind the officers.

Bad deal, but the officers don't have time to warn all the people out of the way. I saw on the video all the people scrambling, but some of the wounded could have easily been 100 yds away.

Video released by NYC ... of when the police shot him. It doesn't appear he ever shot at the police in that video. He pointed his gun in their direction, but doesn't show him shooting at the police. I sure couldn't see any "gun battle" with the police. AS soon as he pointed the gun toward one officer, they were justifed to take this guy out, but I'm just saying.... seems like it was NOT a "gun battle" at all. Misinformation again from the media. Seems NYC citizens were in more danger of the NYC police dept in this situation. Maybe Bloomberg should break down and get them more range time.

I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. --- Will Rogers --- Chief Justice John Roberts : "I don't see how you can read Heller and not take away from it the notion that the Second Amendment...was extremely important to the framers in their view of what liberty meant."

Maybe instead of Bloomberg arguing to take guns away from law abiding citizens, he should take them away from his own police force...Okay, I jest...but training!! I saw the video...the police should have 1) Given a verbal command 2) tackled him and taken him down/or one covered the other took him down...they could have shaken his hand in two steps they were so close!(It looked to me that the bad guys weapon was never pointed "at" the officers, but towards the ground... I could be wrong but I watched the video several times)

I do not mean to pick on the officers who had to make fast decisions in a very strenuous situation, but just imagine what they would be saying if, in order to protect our own life and that of others, we , as CPL holders,had drawn, engaged and killed the bad guy, but also wounded 9 other people....and fired so many errant rounds!

There was an awful lot of luck concentrated in that 20 foot circle of sidewalk. The mere fact that we aren't discussing multiple fatalities due to stray shots is a miracle in itself. With children, people facing the opposite way, and persons seated on a bench in the direct line of fire not to mention the traffic in the street.

I guess the best we could hope for is that somehow, training is addressed on the forth rule of shooting. "Be sure of your target and what lies beyond".

If it were a CC'er you know they would be charged with all sorts of felonies. My question is can the victims get compensation from the city? Can they sue? Or is just like too bad you got shot, deal with it.

Maybe instead of Bloomberg arguing to take guns away from law abiding citizens, he should take them away from his own police force...Okay, I jest...but training!! I saw the video...the police should have 1) Given a verbal command 2) tackled him and taken him down/or one covered the other took him down...they could have shaken his hand in two steps they were so close!(It looked to me that the bad guys weapon was never pointed "at" the officers, but towards the ground... I could be wrong but I watched the video several times)

I do not mean to pick on the officers who had to make fast decisions in a very strenuous situation, but just imagine what they would be saying if, in order to protect our own life and that of others, we , as CPL holders,had drawn, engaged and killed the bad guy, but also wounded 9 other people....and fired so many errant rounds!

When someone points a gun, the time for verbal commands has come and gone!

Maybe instead of Bloomberg arguing to take guns away from law abiding citizens, he should take them away from his own police force...Okay, I jest...but training!! I saw the video...the police should have 1) Given a verbal command 2) tackled him and taken him down/or one covered the other took him down...they could have shaken his hand in two steps they were so close!(It looked to me that the bad guys weapon was never pointed "at" the officers, but towards the ground... I could be wrong but I watched the video several times)

I do not mean to pick on the officers who had to make fast decisions in a very strenuous situation, but just imagine what they would be saying if, in order to protect our own life and that of others, we , as CPL holders,had drawn, engaged and killed the bad guy, but also wounded 9 other people....and fired so many errant rounds!

If you were a Citizen and had been CC (not in NY). And even one person had minor injury you would be sitting in jail right now.
If you were a soldier in Iraq or some other places and a round stuck someone you would be charged by the current system.
This is not the first time the NY police dept has had issues with shooting. Was not to long ago they shot an unarmed man so many times they could not count the holes..
Not going to judge them but I do have a right to question.
Compensation ? NY what do you think they will get cash their bothers and sister will sue their next born will get a payment.
Heck people that saw it happen will sue.

When I was in patrol and the SWAT team was called, we left as soon as they got there. Half of the time they got involved they shot someone, half of the time they shot someone it was a cop on the scene. The lesson I learned from that, when people are shooting at each other bullets go all everywhere. I can't tell you how many robberies I worked where freeto's, coke's and walkin coolers were killed.

When I was in patrol and the SWAT team was called, we left as soon as they got there. Half of the time they got involved they shot someone, half of the time they shot someone it was a cop on the scene. The lesson I learned from that, when people are shooting at each other bullets go all everywhere. I can't tell you how many robberies I worked where freeto's, coke's and walkin coolers were killed.

If you were a Citizen and had been CC (not in NY). And even one person had minor injury you would be sitting in jail right now.
If you were a soldier in Iraq or some other places and a round stuck someone you would be charged by the current system.
This is not the first time the NY police dept has had issues with shooting. Was not to long ago they shot an unarmed man so many times they could not count the holes..
Not going to judge them but I do have a right to question.
Compensation ? NY what do you think they will get cash their bothers and sister will sue their next born will get a payment.
Heck people that saw it happen will sue.

There is a difference in a police shooting and a civilian shooting. This goes back to what I was talking about in the Aurora thread. If the CC'er is not in danger nor is he trying to protect a loved one and he goes and try's to play SWAT team and he injures someone he is at fault. I do not care what his intentions are. Most folks are not prepared to deal with those situations.

It is the same thing if a LEO gets into an accident during a high speed chase. If it is within the guide lines of his dept to be allowed to pursue and there is an accident then it is the perps fault. Not the officer. If folks favor CC'er's playing SWAT (again, not a CC'er defending themselves) then you should also be in favor of a driver chasing down drunk drivers, hit and runs and other folks. And if their is an accident who is fault is that? The driver,,,duh.

I am not a big LEO fan (sorry guys, but I do understand you have a job to do and a hard one). But I don't go around trashing folks because they were doing their job. And we all know that many LEO's do not get the training resources they need. In that case the fault lies with management and taxpayer.

I do think that LEO's need to be prosecuted or at least dismissed more often for negligent use of firearms. I d think they get a by with a lot.

And so do soldiers in a combat zone. Very few have been brought up on charges. I won;t debate the merits of each one. But the poster here makes it sound like soldiers are being marched in front of a courtsmartial everyday when that is not the truth. If I want hyperbole I can always read some newsletters from certain organizations.

I would like to point out something here ,and some of this could be speculation but I will do it anyway.
There were 16 shots by 2 officers and I think that it is fair to say (speculation on my part) that there were a FEW misses. The range seems to me like it was 20 feet + or - a few.
My point is that this was a very high stress situation and the trained officers still required 16 shots to stop the gunnman. This goes to show that because of the effects of stress and adrenaline on the body, shot placement can't always be relied on in the heat of the moment.

BTW... I carry and train with a Laser, maybe that would have helped the officers not shoot 9 other people.