Posts like this are why I believe that a unified force of pilots has to be established to combat this griefing lifestyle, the raids on innocent miners and the pillaging of trade hubs like Jita.

I hope that in the future I can help protect or at least alleviate these kinds of actions through the Defence Force, if you would like to give EVE a second chance I would be more than willing to aid you in any way possible and give you the opportunity to join the Force.

Posted - 2012.05.03 15:28:00 -
[123] - Quote
One of my points was that the average player looking for a cheap kill would leave alone (and still do for the most part) players in corporate mining operations. That is, operations that include a full compliment of miners and haulers and defense ships.

A couple of ships chewing away at some rocks without any fleet protection is what is the target, obviously. That sort of behavior is stupid and used to be called ninja mining for a reason.

The solution is simple - get some guns to protect yourself. And some ECM to nerf that guy's lock. If they only get one volley off before their systems are shut down, the miners survive. A small ship with a fast lock that has the enemy passively targeted is a good solution. Wait for them to attack, and then the same deal. No lock or no cap means no damage. Since they have a 6-7 second volley time, that's plenty of time to mess with their fun.

Lots of things come to mind,some more dangerous than others, of course. But they all require active players playing the game.

Posted - 2012.05.03 15:59:00 -
[125] - Quote
Solo in 0.5 in a mining ship. That's the definition of ninja mining, quite literally. Choosing a mining barge or similar ship to do it in is simply poor judgement.

Trying to turn it into forum fodder for more nerfs and penalties is just poor gamesmanship.

I find it totally untolarable, that 3 1 mill Isk ships can easily gank my tanked 300mill hull. Sorry, but this makes me really sad. It put me out of business for good, that was my last money. Your cool event just cost CCP a subscriber.

Yes tears are delightful, yadda, yadda, no stuff is to be had, because it all exploded.

The Hulk is an INDUSTRIAL ship. It is not designed to be able to stand up to ships designed for combat operations (such as destroyers) especially if they are working in tandem.

Every time there is some dumb**** that can't fathom that barges and exhumers aren't designed for the capability to ward off multiple attackers, especially if they are fit properly.

Then again, you were probably one of those AFK miners that doesn't pay attention to Local, D-Scan or your Overview."War is not measured in terms of who wins or loses, who is right or wrong.-a It is measured in terms of who survives."

Yeah compare that to now with specialized gankboats (Tier3 BCs) and Tech 2 items, which didn't exist back then. Having defenders in the belt doesn't matter when 2 vollies from a Tornado will destroy you. You can't even pre-emptively fire because of CONCORD.

a) Ganking is now less cost effective than ever, due to insurance nerfs. No one uses tornados, it's blaster boats.b) You can (and always have been able to) warp out pre-emtively.c) You can mine in more cost effective shipsd) If you did want to "pre-emtively" fire, you can lock the incoming gank ships in a Scorpion with racial jammers and hit them with ECM as soon as they GCC. They won't be outputting much damage then.

You basically mis-represented the actual situation with every word you spouted.-"Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930's

I find it totally untolarable, that 3 1 mill Isk ships can easily gank my tanked 300mill hull. Sorry, but this makes me really sad. It put me out of business for good, that was my last money. Your cool event just cost CCP a subscriber.

Yes tears are delightful, yadda, yadda, no stuff is to be had, because it all exploded.

The Hulk is an INDUSTRIAL ship. It is not designed to be able to stand up to ships designed for combat operations (such as destroyers) especially if they are working in tandem.

Every time there is some dumb**** that can't fathom that barges and exhumers aren't designed for the capability to ward off multiple attackers, especially if they are fit properly.

Then again, you were probably one of those AFK miners that doesn't pay attention to Local, D-Scan or your Overview.

No I was not, it just takes ages to pick up speed and warp. aligning all the time is quite impossible due to low range of the lasers.

what you said would be true, if one really could field a defense. yet eves mechanics do not allow for something like that. even if you had two friends in rifters backing you up, they could do nothing before the agressors shot first.and since they come in kamikaze like there is nothing left to for your Escort but to watch you explode.

I find it totally untolarable, that 3 1 mill Isk ships can easily gank my tanked 300mill hull. Sorry, but this makes me really sad. It put me out of business for good, that was my last money. Your cool event just cost CCP a subscriber.

Yes tears are delightful, yadda, yadda, no stuff is to be had, because it all exploded.

The Hulk is an INDUSTRIAL ship. It is not designed to be able to stand up to ships designed for combat operations (such as destroyers) especially if they are working in tandem.

Every time there is some dumb**** that can't fathom that barges and exhumers aren't designed for the capability to ward off multiple attackers, especially if they are fit properly.

Then again, you were probably one of those AFK miners that doesn't pay attention to Local, D-Scan or your Overview.

No I was not, it just takes ages to pick up speed and warp. aligning all the time is quite impossible due to low range of the lasers.

what you said would be true, if one really could field a defense. yet eves mechanics do not allow for something like that. even if you had two friends in rifters backing you up, they could do nothing before the agressors shot first.and since they come in kamikaze like there is nothing left to for your Escort but to watch you explode.

You obviously dont know what your doing if you think like that.

How the hell do you think people in WHS/0.0 survive with thinking like that?

It's called align to a warp point and be ready to go...its called watch local...its called tank for a fight and less on cargo...its called use an orca....its called have a fleet near by.

Its called use your head and start thinking before you click that undock button.

Posted - 2012.05.03 17:01:00 -
[131] - Quote
Really, avoiding the situation you're in is not that hard. You can kick and scream all you want, but CCP isn't gonna change the game just for you, man. I've been mining off and on all through Hulkageddon, but I do it thus:

1. Find a system on the star map that hasn't had any ship deaths in the last hour, and very few in 24hrs2. Fit my miner with heavy tank, not cargohold cap(You can get away with this in some systems, but NOT a dangerous .5)3. As soon as I'm in the belt, align to station. This is the big one, and it is NOT "impossible due to the short range of the lasers", as this is how the vast majority of smart miners do it. If you are not aligned while mining, you are mining wrong. ESPECIALLY in Hulkageddon.4. Monitor every single person who comes into Local, check their sec status, age, and corp5. Switch belts semi-frequently, just in case

I'm willing to be that you didn't do any of these things. It sucks when you lose an expensive ship, truly. But quitting the game isn't the solution: It is to pick yourself up, rethink things, and take the first step toward earning back your Hulk. You can say that I'm "Telling you how to play the game" or some ridiculous bs, but the more civil folk in this thread are just trying to tell you the safest way to mine in a hulk. It's a specialist ship, and requires special attention to keep it alive.

Solo in 0.5 in a mining ship. That's the definition of ninja mining, quite literally. Choosing a mining barge or similar ship to do it in is simply poor judgement.

Trying to turn it into forum fodder for more nerfs and penalties is just poor gamesmanship, because I say so and you have to like to play the game like I do.

FTFY

I made no statements about how you have to play the game. Anyone can do whatever you want. But taking a Hulk solo into 0.5 is just plain asking for trouble to come calling. Complaining that your own stupidity is not the problem but the game is, is by definition poor gamesmanship. It's no different than playing a board game and tossing the board on the floor and stomping away saying that you don't like a certain rule.

He did something incredibly risky and paid the price. It's certainly not worth him venting his speen and calling for changes to the game.

I find it totally untolarable, that 3 1 mill Isk ships can easily gank my tanked 300mill hull. Sorry, but this makes me really sad. It put me out of business for good, that was my last money. Your cool event just cost CCP a subscriber.

Yes tears are delightful, yadda, yadda, no stuff is to be had, because it all exploded.

Yeah compare that to now with specialized gankboats (Tier3 BCs) and Tech 2 items, which didn't exist back then. Having defenders in the belt doesn't matter when 2 vollies from a Tornado will destroy you. You can't even pre-emptively fire because of CONCORD.

a) Ganking is now less cost effective than ever, due to insurance nerfs. No one uses tornados, it's blaster boats.b) You can (and always have been able to) warp out pre-emtively.c) You can mine in more cost effective shipsd) If you did want to "pre-emtively" fire, you can lock the incoming gank ships in a Scorpion with racial jammers and hit them with ECM as soon as they GCC. They won't be outputting much damage then.

You basically mis-represented the actual situation with every word you spouted.

I heard ECM is very effective against high alpha.

Translation: You're an idiot. Read my other posts to see where I've already covered everything you said, and then stop posting.

Don't forget to mention you quit because of the poor balance between cost of Hulks and cost of ganking ships when CCP inquires when you quit.

If enough ppl do it CCP will rebalance and THEN you'll have some tears on the forums.

And you wonder why we gank you, eh? It's because you cry like little whiny babies to CCP when your precious little ship gets popped. I know people like you are not all too familiar with specialized T2 ships, but did you also know that Black Ops BS's that cost billions have paper thin tanks, too? I mean, really friggen thin. But, they have a very specialized role, just like a Hulk does. You sacrifice something for that specialization.

Mining barges are not built for tanking. They are built for friggen MINING you idiot. That's what they are good at. If you want something that can tank, convert your stupid BS into a mining ship. You'll look like a fool, but you won't be sui-ganked quite as easily.

If you want to protect your Hulk there are some very easy things to do with a little bit of support, half of a brain, and understanding of game mechanics. Perhaps mining is the best thing for you to stick to though, since you barely have enough mental capacity to not drool like a head trauma victim or soil yourself.Post with your main or GTFO!If I responded to your thread, you're probably getting trolled.

Don't forget to mention you quit because of the poor balance between cost of Hulks and cost of ganking ships when CCP inquires when you quit.

If enough ppl do it CCP will rebalance and THEN you'll have some tears on the forums.

TBH, it's the industrialists own damn fault that combat ships are so cheap...

Have you even checked the prices of combat ships lately?? A feckin Hurricane was selling on average in Jita for 48mil. Twice the price it was several months ago. Prices of minerals and speculation are most to blame. Next time you feel like opening your mouth, just don't. It makes you look like a complete moron.Post with your main or GTFO!If I responded to your thread, you're probably getting trolled.

I find it totally untolarable, that 3 1 mill Isk ships can easily gank my tanked 300mill hull. Sorry, but this makes me really sad. It put me out of business for good, that was my last money. Your cool event just cost CCP a subscriber.

Yes tears are delightful, yadda, yadda, no stuff is to be had, because it all exploded.

No wonder you exploded?WHERE did you put your Damage Control II unit?WHERE did you have your medium Shield Extender rigs?WHERE the HELL did you have your better-than-crap shield extenders?And seriously.. did you sit still in the belt, or were you moving?

Don't forget to mention you quit because of the poor balance between cost of Hulks and cost of ganking ships when CCP inquires when you quit.

If enough ppl do it CCP will rebalance and THEN you'll have some tears on the forums.

TBH, it's the industrialists own damn fault that combat ships are so cheap...

Have you even checked the prices of combat ships lately?? A feckin Hurricane was selling on average in Jita for 48mil. Twice the price it was several months ago. Prices of minerals and speculation are most to blame. Next time you feel like opening your mouth, just don't. It makes you look like a complete moron.

Yup, the mineral prices are finally returning to a more "normal" price (though trit is quite high), and thus the ships are following.

As for the "market" ... meh, gets too expensive once you start to consider hauling and fuel costs. It's just easier to build stuff where I need it.

I find it totally untolarable, that 3 1 mill Isk ships can easily gank my tanked 300mill hull. Sorry, but this makes me really sad. It put me out of business for good, that was my last money. Your cool event just cost CCP a subscriber.

Yes tears are delightful, yadda, yadda, no stuff is to be had, because it all exploded.

No wonder you exploded?WHERE did you put your Damage Control II unit?WHERE did you have your medium Shield Extender rigs?WHERE the HELL did you have your better-than-crap shield extenders?And seriously.. did you sit still in the belt, or were you moving?

I find it totally untolarable, that 3 1 mill Isk ships can easily gank my tanked 300mill hull. Sorry, but this makes me really sad. It put me out of business for good, that was my last money. Your cool event just cost CCP a subscriber.

Yes tears are delightful, yadda, yadda, no stuff is to be had, because it all exploded.

No wonder you exploded?WHERE did you put your Damage Control II unit?WHERE did you have your medium Shield Extender rigs?WHERE the HELL did you have your better-than-crap shield extenders?And seriously.. did you sit still in the belt, or were you moving?

YEAH!

WHY DIDN'T YOU FIT EXPENSIVE LOOT FOR THE GANKERS TO SALVAGE?!

T2 modules, while not as cheap as T1, would've been much cheaper than the cost of losing his Hulk could've very well prevented the gank, even if just by a small margin.

But by your logic, I shouldn't even tank my combat PVP ships, because it'll just give my enemies moar to loot! lulz.Post with your main or GTFO!If I responded to your thread, you're probably getting trolled.

I find it totally untolarable, that 3 1 mill Isk ships can easily gank my tanked 300mill hull. Sorry, but this makes me really sad. It put me out of business for good, that was my last money. Your cool event just cost CCP a subscriber.

Yes tears are delightful, yadda, yadda, no stuff is to be had, because it all exploded.

No wonder you exploded?WHERE did you put your Damage Control II unit?WHERE did you have your medium Shield Extender rigs?WHERE the HELL did you have your better-than-crap shield extenders?And seriously.. did you sit still in the belt, or were you moving?

YEAH!

WHY DIDN'T YOU FIT EXPENSIVE LOOT FOR THE GANKERS TO SALVAGE?!

T2 modules, while not as cheap as T1, would've been much cheaper than the cost of losing his Hulk could've very well prevented the gank, even if just by a small margin.

But by your logic, I shouldn't even tank my combat PVP ships, because it'll just give my enemies moar to loot! lulz.

PvP =/= Hulkageddon. You're trying to troll but just making yourself look ignorant.

You tank a PvP ship to survive longer in order to deal damage.

A mining ship has no chance of destroying gankers (at least not before CONCORD arrives) so there's no point in tanking it. If they want you dead you will die. Even the most hardtanked Hulk will fall to 4 blasterboats. T2 modules will just increase the amount of ISK you lose will providing the gankers with more ISK per gank.

This is exactly why you guys are trying to encourage miners to fit tanks.

Instead, miners should fit the cheapest Covetors they can. T1 lasers, no modules except survey scanner, and just dock when gankboats appear on D-Scan.

I find it totally untolarable, that 3 1 mill Isk ships can easily gank my tanked 300mill hull. Sorry, but this makes me really sad. It put me out of business for good, that was my last money. Your cool event just cost CCP a subscriber.

Yes tears are delightful, yadda, yadda, no stuff is to be had, because it all exploded.

You aren't alone, we had 14 in our alliance cancel. They say they will come back in a month or two, but we will see. Screw CCP for allowing these ***pirates to gank and for making such a poorly designed mining ship.

I got to this thread because today i got my retriever blown up in a suicide gank and i dont understand it.

I truly wonder why someone wants to waste a destroyer class ship to concord in order to blow up my mining ship? What is the fun in that?

That ship with the strip miners and things cost me about 13 m isk. I can afford that easily. No problem. I wont lose a moment of sleep over it. In fact, i have already replaced it.I just didnt expect it., because i dont see the point why anyone wants to destroy his own ship in order to blow up mine. Just like that. Nothing more.

As there are so many childish people posting here, this seems to be the good place to ask why you are doing this.

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