Making a complaint shouldn’t come at a premium

Have you ever had to call a premium rate 0845 or 0870 number just to make a complaint about a recent purchase? New government proposals could soon see premium rate charges scrapped for company helplines.

Being a loyal customer can be expensive. If you want to call your energy company’s customer service line, a pricey 0845 number may be waiting for you. And yet, what number is a prospective customer given? A free-phone 0800 number.

Well, this uncomfortable inconsistency could soon become a thing of the past. The government has said that calling a company’s complaints or customer service line should not cost any more than calling a geographic landline or, if calling from a mobile, no more than the standard mobile rate.

The new legislation is set out in the government’s response (PDF) to the European Consumer Rights Directive, and should come into force in June next year.

The end of rip-off call charges?

So, could this be the beginning of the end for rip-off call charges? Yes and no. Companies will still be able to charge higher rates when you’re purchasing goods or services, but not when you call up to complain about that purchase.

It’s also worth noting that financial services aren’t included in the government’s proposals, as they are covered by separate regulations. This is disappointing considering that last year we found that most banks and insurers use 0800 numbers for new customers and 0845/0844 numbers for their existing loyal customers.

Government departments will also not be covered by the new rules, and the inclusion of transport companies is currently up for consultation.

What about calling from a mobile?

Of course, if you don’t have a landline, calling from a mobile could still be a bit pricey, just as calling an 0800 number can be at the moment. However, at least you’ll be content in the fact that it won’t cost more than calling another mobile.

I’m one of the landline-less among us, but I am lucky that my mobile provider doesn’t charge for 0800 numbers. So, how do I call my bank or energy company? I track down their 0800 sales number for new customers and ask them to put me through to the right department!

Confusing 084 and 087 call costs

And it’s not just the cost of non-geographic 084 and 087 numbers that are frustrating – working out how much it will actually cost can also be very confusing. This is because the rates differ depending on the company you’re calling and also the phone provider you’re with. The cost of calling an 0845 number from a BT line can be dramatically different to calling from a Virgin line, for example.

To this end, the communications regulator Ofcom is also working to simplify non-geographic charges. Ultimately, call charges for calling helplines need to be clear and transparent so that you know exactly what you’re going to pay before making a call.

It’s encouraging to see that the government is tackling this issue – it’s been a long time coming. Do you resent having to call premium rate numbers to make a complaint?

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285 comments

I can see a reason for using premium rate phone lines to provide personal technical support, but no-one making a complaint should be expected to use them.

The cost of phone calls to 0845 and 0870 numbers was one of the reasons that I switched to a tariff that includes them. That saves looking for alternative numbers, but I still have to do this for 084… numbers.

When it was first introduced, the Say no to 0870 website was not much help, but it is now very useful.

It’s not just for complaints though – I find it very odd that even some ‘sales’ lines are 0844 or 0843 or 0871. It’s plain and simple money grabbing, as far as I am concerned, so I simply won’t bother with them at all.

Yes and No. Yes, just because nearly all companies have a model where all parts of the organisation should be bringing in revenue, doesn’t mean I should have to pay to contact them, If they did whatever well enough in the 1st place I wouldn’t need to. And No, as I have a call plan which includes them.

I rang Thames Water this morning at 01:30 yes that right. Why? Because two men in high vis jacket were doing something with the water meters and they woke me up with the noise at 01:05. I had to use an 0845 number, grr. Turns out they had crews out doing active water tests, but if they hadn’t they wouldn’t have woken me up and I wouldn’t have needed to ring them.

From July 2014, Article 21 of the Consumer Rights Directive will ban businesses from using 084 and 087 prefixes for after-sales telephone lines. For some unknown reason, some industries (e.g. airlines and banks) are exempt from complying, but the UK government can remove these exemptions in the UK if it wishes. Let’s hope that it applies a blanket ban across all industries.

Why has this not been done without the need for input from the EU? We are very good at recognising what needs to be done but seem powerless to take action.

On the basis of Ofcom’s performance with other issues, it seems very unlikely that they will simplify charges for calling non-geographic numbers to the extent that the average person can remember the cost. My suggestion is to have a technical solution so that we can enter part of a number followed by a hash to check the cost per minute before calling: for example 0844# The price could be both displayed for those with Caller Display and also announced audibly by an automated system.

Certain numbers are designed for revenue sharing. The caller pays for the service through the Service Charge, a form of micro-payment. These numbers should exist, but there should be strict rules as to who can use them and when.

As Which? already knows, I have a 0871 as my home number. I have this so I make money when PPI/cold callers phone me.

But, I hate them numbers. I hate 0845, 0844, 0843, 0870, 0871 the list goes on and I refuse to call them.

When I need to speak to a company the first thing I will do is search for a 0800 freephone number and if i can’t find one, take to Twitter and get the company to phone me (on my 0871 number) or speak via DM instead….and it works as companies like to show they help people on social networks.

My 0871 numbers sits on top of my normal Leeds 0113 number. 2 people have my 0113 number and that is my mother and my best friend. There is no need to give anyone else the number as I speak to other people via txt or on skype for free.

When I am opening a new bank account or moving my energy etc and they ask for my “home number” I give the 0871 and sometimes they ask why. I am honest and say it’s so I make 10p per min when companies call me. If you want a number for me that will have to use it.

It sounds like a good idea, but do you really get PPI and other cold calls to your 0871 number? I thought most of these PPI callers just dial random numbers until they find one that exists. Then they will get your 0113 number. They are unlikely to ring random 0871 numbers as most of these belong to companies rather than individuals.

“but do you really get PPI and other cold calls to your 0871 number? I thought most of these PPI callers just dial random numbers until they find one that exists.”

I look for ways to get companies to call me tbh. Like 3 days ago I had a problem with my Ocado shop. I tweeted them and they asked me to call a 0845 number. I refused and asked them to call my 0871 *** **** number. I posted this in a open tweet so if cold callers pick up on that number it will help me make a few more quid if they phone me.

“I admire your spirit of enterprise and your cheek. How long did you have the number before earning the cost of it?”

When I first got the number i was making around £7 a month from it. So it paid for itself in less than 2 months. But my cold calls have slowen down loads this year.

“Lee, do you make enough to cover the cost to you? ”

Yes, I paid a one-off £10 plus VAT and i do not pay monthly or yearly. The company who I have bought it off makes money on every call just like me. So they do not need to charge anything else apart from the £10+VAT.

This month, August, I have had 16 calls so far & my “Rebate” is £2.867. I would post a screen shot. But you can’t on Which.

Thats amazing. I often supply a fake telephone number when I have no option but to supply a number and when I don’t think the organisation needs to have my telephone number. This, I think could be a solution. Perhaps if I start having nuisance calls I may follow your example.

“Only an individual can decide whether the small rebate is worth these drawbacks. ”

I work from home so I am always at my desk when the phone goes anyway so i just listen to them blab on while i carry on with my work

I pay £19.99 (including VAT) a month for my normal line rental & unlimited broadband with Plusnet I do not have any extra calling plans so i pay for each and every call i make. I normally spend around £2.00 – £2.50 a month on calls that I make. So if my rebate covers that then i am very happy indeed & that is no goal.

Last year I was making much more. But this year has been little slack.

But even if you get on with your work while they are talking on the phone, it will still cause at least one minute’s delay to your work due to disrupting your train of thought. Considering most calls are hardly more than a minute, at 10p a minute that’s £6 an hour – roughly minimum wage. If I were you, I would outsource your telephone answering to Bangalore. You can get someone there to be your personal agent for £2 an hour, then you pocket the remaining £4 an hour without having to do anything!

I don’t know how much these 084 and 087 calls cost a minute, and Ofcom’s call cost guide, although interesting, is not much help:
- for landlines
- 0843 and 0844 “typically 1p to 13p per minute
- 0845 “typically..1p to 10.5p per min…often include a call set-up fee”
-0870 “2p to 10p per min and may include a call set-up fee”
-0871/2/3 “5p to 12.5p per min plus a call set up fee”
- 118### £s!
So you neither know what a call will cost, nor how long your call will last (navigate through endless “press 1 for..”) and then how long will you be kept waiting.
03 numbers are there to avoid the 08 uncertainties – they must be included in inclusive minutes. We should abolish 08.
Where I can,I use email or the website contact mail – with the bonus of a written reply – unless I’m in a hurry. Then use SAYNOTO0870.COM

I did just illustrate landlines, but the same Ofcom guide lists from 10p up to 41p per min for mobiles for these numbers. You can soon rack up a large bill. I have a PAYG mobile that I use only when necessary, so spend little on it.

Every telephone network publishes their prices on their website, though it’s not always in plain sight.

Landline price guides are difficult to use and confusing because you have to look up which tariff code (such as g6 or g10) applies to the number you are calling. Once you have that code, looking up the call price is fairly easy. Don’t forget there’s usually a connection fee of around 15p and this makes a large number of short calls very expensive.

Finding the price that applies to a call from a mobile phone is much easier. Mobile networks generally charge the same for all 0844 numbers rather than basing the price on the first 6 digits of the telephone number you are calling. The price for 0845 may be the same as for 0844 or it may be a different amount, but that amount will apply to all 0845 numbers. Similar principles apply to 0870 and to 0871. The disadvantage of calling from a mobile is that the caller pays from double to ten times the rate of calling from a landline. There is some price variation between the various mobile networks, though most seem to charge around the 35p/min mark.

More important than the actual price is gaining a sense of which calls are inclusive in call plans and packages.

03 – inclusive from all landlines with a call package (check whether “anytime” or “evenings and weekends” applies) and from all mobiles with a call package (contract phones or pay-as-you-talk bolt-on deals) else charged at “standard geographic rate”.

0843/0844 – always chargable from landlines and from mobiles. The Service Charge stops these calls being inclusive. BT are regulated to charge no more than the Service Charge for these calls. Other providers may charge more. Mobile operators always charge a lot more. The business you are calling makes money from the revenue share of whatever is left after the call-handling costs (queueing, IVR, etc) have been met from the Service Charge monies.

0845 – always chargeable from mobiles. Although there is a Service Charge around 2p to 3p/min, some landline companies (especially BT) subsidise this charge and allow 0845 numbers as inclusive calls in some packages. This is an exceptional case and must not be seen to be the normal arrangement. The Service Charge barely covers the call-handling costs incurred by the called party and therefore isn’t usually large enough for them to receive a revenue share out-payment. However, the company is still benefitting from the Service Charge; it is paying for the non-geographic call-handling facilities and this relieves the called company from having to pay for them.

0870 – always chargeable from mobiles. Ofcom banned revenue sharing in 2009. It’s optional whether these calls are inclusive – some landline operators allow this, mobile operators generally do not. When those new Ofcom rules came into force in 2009, the vast majority of businesses moved to an 0844 or 0871 number so they could continue to charge the caller a Service Charge and benefit from the revenue-sharing of that charge. 0870 numbers are therefore no longer widely used.

0871/0872 – always chargable from landlines and from mobiles. The Service Charge stops these calls being inclusive. BT are regulated to charge no more than the Service Charge for these calls. Other providers may charge more. Mobile operators always charge a lot more. The business you are calling makes money from the revenue share of whatever is left after the call-handling costs (queueing, IVR, etc) have been met from the Service Charge monies. These numbers are also covered by some of the Premium Rate Services (PRS) rules.

084, 087 and 09 numbers are usually sold to busineses with “no running costs when diverted to a UK landline” listed as an advantage. The reason there are no running costs imposed on the called business is that the caller is paying a higher rate for the call, part of which is the Service Charge. The money collected through the Service Charge pays for the call-handling facilities. If there is anything left over after that, the called business may also receive a revenue share payment.

The new BIS draft regulations (published last week) inform businesses they must stop using 084 and 087 numbers for customer services by June 2014 and adopt a standard 01 or 02 number, a non-geographic 03 number or an 080 (“free”) number.

Ofcom will also make a number of changes in 2014 (though some will be deferred until 2015):
- revenue sharing (through a re-introduced Service Charge) will return to 0870 numbers and they will work the same way as 0871 numbers.
- BT’s 08 and 09 prices will no longer be regulated (BT 01 and 02 calls were deregulated in 2004). BT will be allowed to charge 08 and 09 numbers the same way as all other providers.
- The Service Charge imposed on all calls to 084 (including 0845), 087 (including re-introduced on 0870) and 09 numbers will be confirmed and users of these numbers will be required to declare the Service Charge every time their number is advertised.
- 080 numbers will become free from mobile phones.
- The “connection fee” will be abolished on calls to 08 and 09 numbers from landlines, replaced by a per-minute Access Charge.
- Variable levels of markup, depending on the number called, will be abolished. Each network will publish a single replacement Access Charge and it will apply to all calls made to 084, 087 and 09 numbers. There will be a single Access Charge per tariff.

This point is important. Although the call price from landlines will continue to vary depending on the number called, this will wholly be down to the variation in Service Charge set by the telephone number you called. Mobile networks will no longer charge a highly-inflated single fixed rate. At present you might use a mobile phone to call several numbers with equivalent Service Charges ranging from 1p to 10p/min and be charged 41p/min for every one of those calls. Clearly, the mobile network has added an extortionate and variable amount, somewhere between 31p and 40p/min, on top of the Service Charge. In future, phone networks will declare a single fixed Access Charge that applies equally to all 084, 087 and 09 numbers. The call price (will be the sum of the Access Charge and Service Charge and) will therefore vary in step with the variation in Service Charge. Declaration of the Access Charge by mobile operators should also result in a price reduction for at least some of these calls; mobile networks will not be able to justify an Access Charge of 30p or 40p/min. The call price “per-minute” rate from landline operators may be seen to rise by a small amount. They will replace the approx. 15p connection fee with a small Access Charge charged at a per-minute rate. The overall call price is unlikely to change much unless the call is either very short or very long. Other than the effect caused by a steady rise in the connection fee, the call price for many 084 and 087 numbers as called from a landline has remain largely unchanged since 2000 – caller’s bills have risen mainly because a large number of companies have changed to using higher priced numbers (especially the mass flight from 0870 to 0844 several years ago).

The Service Charge will be 1p to 7p/min on 084 numbers, 1p to 13p/min on 087 numbers and 7p to £3/min on 09 numbers and will, as already happens now, be set by the first six digits of the phone number called. Additional PRS regulation will apply to most 087 and all 09 numbers but not to 084 numbers.

The call price will be the Access Charge charged by your network plus the Service Charge charged by whoever you are calling. It will be clear how much the called party is making. It will be easy to find the network with the lowest Access Charge.

Above all that, many businesses will no longer be able to justify imposing a Service Charge on callers and will change their number to one without this charge. Many others will be compelled to do so by June 2014 under the provisions of “The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Payments) Regulations 2013″ published last week.

The present system is very complicated. The changeover will be very complicated. The end result will be a much simpler system as much of the present complication will have been removed. All 084, 087 and 09 numbers will be seen to work in the exact same way as each other, merely differing in the level of Service Charge imposed. Each user will declare the Service Charge that applies to their phone number. Each phone network will have one simple Access Charge per tariff and it will apply equally to all 084, 087 and 09 numbers.

I’d be interested to know how this legislation will impact on so-called “Helpdesk” phone services.

I’m adept technically, so if I do phone for support it is usually because I can’t make the damned product work according to the instructions. So my call to a Helpdesk number is only one step away from becoming a complaint.

Why deal with part of the problem of companies making life awkward for customers? Should there not be a universal code and Which? deals with the whole matter. This was in a June conversation and posted by NFH

“Ryanair makes it particularly difficult to claim reimbursement because it corresponds only via postal letter to a non-UK address or a premium rate telephone number. It has to provide an e-mail address by law but it fails to do so.

Regulation 6(1)(c) of the Electronic Commerce (EC Directive) Regulations 2002 mandates that where a company sells its goods or services via a web site, it must provide an e-mail address for communication “in a direct and effective manner”. This is the UK’s enactment of Article 5(1)(c) of Directive 2000/31/EC “Directive on electronic commerce”, which is likewise enacted in Ireland (Ryanair’s country of incorporation) under Regulation 7(1)(c) of the European Communities (Directive 2000/31/EC) Regulations 2003.

What bugs me is that if you call an airline in the UK you have to use a premium rate phone number but phone that same airline in the USA or Canada and it is a freephone number. That applies to all of the major airlines.

Companies who publicise premium numbers sometimes also publish a UK number for those who wish to call from outside the UK. Those are not always easily accesible but a bit of research on their website reveals them. I always use those and never had a problem.
Ronnie Danon

Let’s get one thing straight. 0845 and 0870 are NOT premium-rate numbers. Since August 2009 0870 is charged the same as a UK national landline call and some operators include it their calling plans so if calling 01/02/03 is free at any time then so is calling 0870. Calling 0845 from a landline generally costs about the same as a UK national number (10p – 12p/min) and with some operators is much cheaper or even free if they include it in their calling plans, e.g. BT. The problem is that different telephone companies charge different rates for calling the same number, some are good and some having a laugh. It’s not the code that’s the problem, but telephone companies exploiting the complicated and confusing tariff system we have.

I agree with John that clearer pricing is needed from phone companies. My BT residential package includes free calls to 0845 and 0870 numbers, so it costs me nothing to call them. Mobile phone companies are the main culprits – why can’t they include 0845 numbers in their free bundles?

RE: “Let’s get one thing straight. 0845 and 0870 are NOT premium-rate numbers.”

Let’s be very clear that 0845 certainly is a premium number and that 0870 will shortly be so once again.

Calls to 0845 numbers incur a Service Charge around 2p or 3p/min. BT and some other landline providers choose to cross-subsidise that charge and allow the call as “inclusive”. This is unlikely to continue once BT’s “NTS Condition” is removed next year and once all phone networks have to specify a single Access Charge per tariff covering all 084, 087 and 09 numbers.

0870 numbers currently do not have a Service Charge and revenue share is not permitted. It is voluntary whether phone networks make these calls inclusive. Some landline operators have chosen to do so, but mobile networks have not.

There is now intense customer confusion because 0870 and 0871 numbers are charged at vastly differing rates from landlines, but are charged much the same as each other when called from mobiles. Likewise with 0844 and 0845.

All that happened when Ofcom removed revenue sharing from 0870 in 2009 was a mass exodus of businesses from 0870 to 0844. This increased the phone bill for many landline callers. Call charges remained high, and perhaps increased by a small amount, for mobile callers.

This time, things are going to be different.

Ofcom’s simplification is to confirm all 084 and 087 numbers as being revenue-share numbers that impose a Service Charge on callers, as well as introducing new call cost declaration rules for these numbers. BT call prices will also change to become more like the other landline networks.

Although 0870 is going to return to being a revenue share number and 0845 will continue as such, the new BIS regulations will force very many businesses away from using 084 and 087 numbers and on to 03 or 080 numbers.

Taken out of context, some of the new rules look like a backwards step when examined in isolation. It is only when you look at the complete picture that various things fall into place.

RE: “Mobile phone companies are the main culprits – why can’t they include 0845 numbers in their free bundles?”

Calls to 0845 numbers include a 2p or 3p/min Service Charge. Mobile phone companies ask the caller to pay for this (plus they add a whole load more on top). BT chooses to cross-subsidise those calls and several other landline operators decided to copy them. This is a highly unusual arrangement and one that is not likely to continue (but it won’t matter once many existing customer service lines have migrated from 0845 to 0345 under the provisions of the new BIS regulation).

Another tip I was told was if you can’t find an 0800 or a landline number , try phoning the number they give you to phone if you calling from abroad. I haven’t tried it but I was told it connects to a normal landline number.
Tax credit are 0845 as well got my daughter into a lot of money trouble at a time she couldn’t afford it.

Smartphone users should check out an app called 0870. I use it whenever faced with one of these premium numbers. You simply enter the premium number and invariably the app will come up with a “Normal” phone number.

I’ve just finished complaining to Boots about a delivery and the number was an 0845. I wasn’t on long fortunately and my query was dealt with politely and quickly, but I have phoned some of our high street shops and been on for 30 minutes or more. It also annoys me when I ring that number I am listening to a spiel and given dozens of button options while paying the premium price. It can take minutes before you reach the section you are after.

The main problem is the high charges from mobile phones. I work in the telecoms industry and know that calls to 0845 only cost the mobile operators a little more than a landline call, but they charge their mobile users much more than cost. So Which? should focus on mobile operators pricing practices.

Ofcom’s “unbundled tariffs” will shortly require phone companies to set and declare a single Access Charge covering all 084, 087 and 09 numbers. At present, the equivalent of this charge is around 25p to 35p/min, varies depending on the number called, and is hidden away within the overall call price.

The mere act of having to declare this charge should see a hefty reduction in its level. With the forced revelation of this charge and enhanced clarity for consumers, competition effects will also come into play.

If the charge is still seen as excessive there is always the possibility of further Ofcom intervention leading to the Access Charge being subject to a price cap.

GPs were banned from using 084 numbers in April 2010 through a variation to their contacts with the NHS. This ban was re-confirmed in the April 2013 version of the contract. The same wording still applies.

GP surgeries should have moved to a number beginning 01, 02 or 03. This arrangement means the caller no longer pays a Service Charge within the call price. The surgery will have to pay for the special call features found on a non-geographic number. The caller will no longer be funding the system.

However, “Which” promote these numbers in every issue of Which? magazine.
They should tell firms that following a product review, only geographical numbers will be printed for customer follow up. I wrote to Which? about this once. Never got a reply.

It would take very little effort for ‘Which?’ to “suggest” that advertisers offer a geographic number (01 or 02) or a geographic-rated number (03) when they advertise with ‘Which?’.

Let’s see which one ‘Which?’ considers more important: consumers, or the advertising dollar.

Note: 0845 and 0870 are NOT geographic-rated numbers. Some providers choose to offer these numbers at reduced cost, but mobile operators do not. Only 03 numbers are confirmed as “geographic rated” from all mobiles and all landlines.

It would be a great help if Which? would publish the equivalent geographical or free numbers in the magazine, rather than listing the expensive numbers when publishing manufacturers’ contact details. That would be a useful service for members.

Thanks for your comment Mike. You’re right that we do list some 087 and 084 numbers for manufacturers on our ‘Test Lab contact’s page in Which? magazine. However, we try our very best to find free and low-cost numbers – it is only when these are not available that we have to print 087 or 084 numbers. We don’t think you should have to call premium-rate numbers for complaints or customer service, and will continue our policy not to print expensive numbers when cheaper ones are available.

Looking at the July 2013 issue of Which?, which was to hand, the number for Amazon is given as 0843 4799792, which seems to be their general Customer Services number. Looking up Amazon on the Say No to 0870 gives 020 7084 7911 and 0800 4961081. I have not called either of these numbers, so cannot be sure that they work, but in the past I have found geographical and free numbers for other companies when expensive numbers have been published in the magazine.

I recently had a minor RTA and had to phone my insurance company. The only number I have is an 0800 number which should be free but when i dialled it from my mobile phone I got a message that the call would cost 14p per minute (Vodaphone). I later discovered that the ins co only has an 0800 number for claims. So why should I have to pay so much for what should be a free call?

Presumably you had to use your mobile if you phoned while you were at the scene. This is the problem with mobiles and their providers – these “freephone” numbers may be charged for, apparently up to 31p/min. To be fair to the company, they make the call free to landline users.

I’m not sure why these calls should be free. There is a good deal of convenience in having a mobile phone that has to be paid for whatever type of call it makes. Presumably if you have a contarct with bundled minutes these call charges do not apply – or use the landline number if you have it.

Not everyone has or normally needs contract phones and if you’ve had a vehicle accident or have broken down, you may be nowhere near a landline phone. Why add unnecessarily to someone’s distress by making them pay a fortune for the call (plus, you may not have enough credit on the PAYG phone).

Mobile services cost money – it should not “cost a fortune” (up to 31p a minute) and it is your responsibility to keep your phone credit adequate – you can top up by credit card while you are out if necessary.

0870 numbers have not imposed a Service Charge since 2009, and revenue sharing has also not been allowed since then. Let’s be very clear that 0845 certainly is a premium number and that 0870 will shortly be so once again.

Calls to 0845 numbers incur a Service Charge around 2p or 3p/min. BT and some other landline providers choose to cross-subsidise that charge and allow the call as “inclusive”. This is unlikely to continue once BT’s “NTS Condition” is removed next year and once all phone networks have to specify a single Access Charge per tariff covering all 084, 087 and 09 numbers.

0870 numbers currently do not have a Service Charge and revenue share is not permitted. It is voluntary whether phone networks make these calls inclusive. Some landline operators have chosen to do so, but mobile networks have not.

There is now intense customer confusion because 0870 and 0871 numbers are charged at vastly differing rates from landlines, but are charged much the same as each other when called from mobiles. Likewise with 0844 and 0845.

All that happened when Ofcom removed revenue sharing from 0870 in 2009 was a mass exodus of businesses from 0870 to 0844. This increased the phone bill for many landline callers. Call charges remained high, and perhaps increased by a small amount, for mobile callers. Additionally, many businesses using 0845 numbers were tempted by the possibility of earning several pence per minute from incoming calls, and moved from 0845 to 0844.

Other than calls to 0870, all calls to 084, 087 and 09 numbers result in the caller paying a Service Charge within the call price. The Service Charge pays for the non-geographic call-handling features. If there is anything left over, the called party may receive a revenue share out-payment. Since the call-handling features consume only around 2p or 3p/min, only 0845 and the lowest level 0843 and 0844 numbers fail to pay out.

Ofcom’s recent consultations should result in draft legislation before the end of the year. Their “simplification” of non-geographic numbers is likely to confirm all 084 and 087 numbers as being revenue-share numbers that impose a Service Charge on callers, as well as introducing new call cost declaration rules for these numbers. BT call prices will also change to become more like the other landline networks.

Although 0870 is going to return to being a revenue share number and 0845 will continue as such, the new BIS regulations will force very many businesses away from using 084 and 087 numbers and on to 03 or 080 numbers.

0845 and 0870 will be seen by all as being revenue share numbers, in the same way as 0844 and 0871 already are. However, most businesses with any sense will have moved to the equivalent 03 number and will be keen to convey to their customers that “calls to 03 numbers cost the same as calling an 01 or 02 number and will be inclusive in landline and mobile call packages whenever 01 and 02 numbers are inclusive”.

Ofcom will eventually also confirm that only 01, 02 and 03 are geographic-rate numbers and only (0500 and) 080 are free. Other numbers, those beginning 084, 087 and 09, will be clearly noted as imposing a Service Charge on all callers (subsidising the recipient’s call-handling costs) and therefore potentially paying money to the called party through a revenue-share scheme if the Service Charge is greater than 2p or 3p/min.

Oh so cynical. This increased our phone bill by at least £5 per month and we now use their old local number which is free. Initially roundly told off by the Receptionist, but now accepted with good grace.

I exchanged a number of emails with my practice manager, but he maintained that
a) They cost no more than a land line call – WRONG, my calling package has free geographic numbers.
b) The practice made no profit from the calls – WRONG, either he was too stupid to claim his cut from the provider or he was an outright liar.

GPs were banned from using 084 numbers in April 2010 through a variation to their contacts with the NHS. This ban was re-confirmed in the April 2013 version of the contract. The same wording still applies.

GP surgeries should have moved to a number beginning 01, 02 or 03. This arrangement means the caller no longer pays a Service Charge within the call price. The surgery will have to pay for the special call features found on a non-geographic number. The caller will no longer be funding the system.

With that suggested rule, a company that uses a 50p/min phone line for sales, would be allowed to use the same phone line for customer service.

BIS has the right idea; their draft legislation requires that traders will have to use an 01, 02, 03, (0500 or) 080 or mobile number for customer service.

The cost of calling mobile numbers from a landline should soon be similar to the price of calling other geographc numbers. It’s not going to be long before landline providers offer free calls to mobile phones on any mobile network within inclusive call packages. Some landline operators already offer free calls to mobile numbers that are on a mobile network that is owned by the landline operator.

That said, HMRC have almost completed their move from 0845 and 0870 numbers to new 0300 and 0345 numbers.

The July 18th National Audit Office report is highly critical of government use of 084 and 087 numbers. With the new BIS business legislation becoming law by the end of the year and applying from June 2014, central government can’t afford to hang around and risk being seen to let the same rip-off continue to be effected by themselves.

As for banks and transport, both currently proposed to be exempt, consumers should make their feelings be known to the relevant parties while they continue to ask for opinion and input. This is draft legislation and can be beefed up either now or later. Now is better.

I am profoundly deaf and with an impaired speech, and do not have a ‘voicing / hearing’ telephone at home. I get a lot of annoying that many well-known companies do not including the ‘text messages’ mobile Phone number and email addresses on their website, especially ‘contact us’. I think it is high time they should including the name of person who is in charge, clearly head-office addresses and so on, rather than their ‘self answering’ to the computerised questions on the website.

They come under the heading “chargeable 08 business rate numbers” and, from a landline, cost between 1p and 10.5p a minute plus possibly a call set-up fee. However these call may be free if included in a package that allows calls free of charge at certain times of the day, just like 01, 02 and 03 numbers. Premium rate numbers are 09 where “goods and services” are charged to your phone account on top of the call cost.

Calls to 0845 numbers incur a 2p or 3p/min Service Charge. This money is used by the called party to pay for the non-geographic call-handling. Other numbers, such as 0844 and 0871 can have a larger Service Charge. In those cases, the called party may also receive a revenue-share out-payment.

0845 numbers ceased to be local rate in 2004. This happened when 01 and 02 numbers became “inclusive” calls in call packages. If you have a deal where there are no inclusive calls (rare!) the price paid for a “local” 01 or 02 call is the same as the price paid for a “non-local” 01 or 02 call. “Local rate”, as such, no longer exists.

The only non-geographic number range confirmed as ALWAYS costing the same as a call to an 01 or 02 number, is the 03 range. This applies to calls made from all mobiles and landines.

Many organisations including those who are in existence to provide help for people in trouble use outrageously expensive numbers.

Citizens Advice Service use 0844 numbers for their helplines which is a deterrent for many.

Also I have never understood how the police are allowed to use 101 for their non emergency contact number. It costs 20p per minute from landline or mobile which is iniquitous. No wonder many people still dial 999. Its impossible nowadays to find out a number for your local police station.

I’ve just looked up the number for my local police station. Finding it was not problematic at all; it took me less than half a minute. But instead of a geographical number, it is listed as 0845 and 0345.

I’ve never been happy that phone calls that put me in a queue are not free.
We should follow the American model and make all calls to companies’ call centres free of charge.
In the US they believe that a customer call is an opportunity to do business and so the company pays via an 800 number.

We’re going to follow the European model. Draft legislation was published last week. It must be in place before the end of the year. It will apply from June 2014.

Calls should cost no more than calling a geographic number or be free. Businesses must use phone numbers that are inclusive in call packages whenever geographic or mobile numbers are inclusive. The legislation is clear.

In: 01, 02, 03, 080, mobile numbers.

Out: 084, 087, 09, other numbers such as 070 etc.

Ofcom have several other changes in the works that will bring even more clarity.

Ofcom is getting more feeble as the years go by. The plan was to fix the cost of a call in the UK from its prefix, eg 0800… is free, but Ofcom allowed mobile phone companies to cheat and it led to the present chaos, extortionate ‘connection’ charges and weird short code numbers.

Vodafone charges 66p per minute for calls to “personal numbers/calling cards (starting 07 but not UK mobile networks)” but we don’t know that before we call. It looks like a mobile number.

Phone calls are basically free, it’s the infrastructure that costs money. Ofcom needs to be strong again: 0800 must be free to the caller, 01/02/03 and 0845/0870 should be the standard landline charge, 07 should be the standard mobile charge and no exceptions. Premium numbers should all move to the 09 range and be disallowed by default.

The number that costs is 070…, not 07 which are normal mobile numbers. 070 numbers can be used for “follow me”services where calls are diverted to another number and make calls easy to manage by some traders and small businesses. They can also be bought on a one-off basis where you want to, say,sell a used car but don’t want to advertise your own mobile or landline number. But they are expensive – 5p to 50p a minute from a landline plus maybe a set-up fee, and £1 or more a minute from a mobile. They need to be distinguished from ordinary mobile numbers when thinking of ringing them if you don’t want to pay the costs.
It is a very murky area – not knowing the cost of the number, how much your provider charges, whether there is a set-up cost, how long your call will last…. so it appears as a money-making racket. Needs to be “made transparent” is, I think, the current catch phrase (better than “lessons will be learned” though!)

As I read O2′s tariffs:
070 numbers are charged at 51p/min, for monthly contacts, 66p for PAYG.
The other 07 numbers quoted are at more usual mobile rates, or included in the monthly package – same as 0844, 0845. So technically although many of these are “follow me” numbers they do not get charged at the high 070 rate.

Only 01, 02 and 03 will be confirmed as standard “geographic rate” calls.

0845 numbers currently impose a hidden Service Charge of around 2p or 3p/min on all callers. This charge pays for the non-geographic call-handling features that would normally be paid by the call recipient on other ranges, such as on an 03 number. Ofcom propose this Service Charge be revealed and declared by all users of 084 and 087 numbers.

Although BT and one or two other landline providers allow 0845 numbers as inclusive calls, this is not the “normal” situation. Mobile operators do not allow these as inclusive calls. BT has chosen to cross-subsidise these calls; and several other landline providers have copied BT. BT may be unable or unwilling to continue with this subsidy once the “NTS Condition” has been lifted.

All phone providers will shortly have to set and declare a single Access Charge per tariff covering all 084, 087 and 09 numbers. The Access Charge will replace the current (large) “connection fee” and modest per-minute markup (if any) found on calls made from landines. It will also replace the huge, often extortionate, per-minute markup currently found on calls made from mobiles. In this situation, 0845 and 0870 numbers are unlikely to remain as inclusive calls.

This, however, is not a huge problem. Some six months to a year before the Ofcom changes come into force, many businesses will have to comply with the recently published BIS regulations. Very many businesses will have to stop using 084 and 087 numbers and move to geographic (01 or 02), non-geographic (03), or free (080) numbers. In certain circumstances, a standard mobile number is also acceptable.

The fact that 0845 will continue as a premium number with a Service Charge and 0870 will return to revenue sharing with a Service Charge won’t matter all that much when the vast majority of calls will instead be to the replacement 0345 and 0370 numbers.

Likewise, many 0844 users will be compelled to move to 0344, and many 0871 users will be compelled to move to 0371 numbers. In all of those cases only a single digit is changed in the phone number: the “8″ becomes “3″. Alternatively, those businesses can elect to take a brand new 01, 02, 030, 033 or 080 number.

RE: “‘Premium’ as used normally means calls that include the cost of a service. As far as I am aware these are all 09 numbers and easy to avoid.”

All 084, 087 (except 0870) and 09 numbers impose a Service Charge on the caller. The only diference between the various number ranges is the level of that charge. Those with the highest charges are also covered by additional Premium Rate Services (PRS) rules.

At present, the Service Charge is hidden within the call price. Ofcom will shortly publish draft legislation compelling every user of 084, 087 and 09 numbers to declare the Service Charge.

I use a website called SAYNOTO0870 which is enables users who find out alternative landline and Freephone numbers to these dreaded numbers to add them to the database.

The only trouble is it would appear that the IT/communication management teams for these organisations cotton on to this and start pulling the plug on the alternative numbers as soon as they realise that they have been rumbled.

One such organisation is the HMRC which deals with our income tax!

Some doctors surgeries also use these awful numbers too which really ought to be banned.

RE: “One such organisation is the HMRC which deals with our income tax!”

HMRC have already moved the bulk of their 0845 and 0870 numbers to new 0300 and 0345 numbers. Check their website for the new numbers. This huge operation should be completed within the next few months.

The recent NAO report (July 18th) is highly critical of the usage of 084 and 087 numbers within government. With BIS currently about to impose stringent conditions on business, government departments would be wise to also change their phone numbers in the same way. HMRC is proof that it can be done both in an orderly manner and in a relatively short timeframe.

Not before time, and typical of rip off UK that we wait till EU legislation forces us to take action. Side note to anti EU brigade in government and media, its not all bad. These charges have angered me for years. Lets see the history of this………… well nigh impossible to get help face to face as companies retreat to call centres. Then they charge you for calling them, whether you have a phone package or not. On top of all that you can wait for ages in their phone Q’s while the meter runs. Then how often does it turn out you are in wrong part of organization and get passed into another Q. Its like being charged to talk to staff in a store if you go back with a problem. No doubt they don’t just cover the cost of their operation by charging us rather than building these overhead costs into their new product/service prices (and losing business to higher quality lower cost competitors), they also make a profit. Its treating us with contempt. As several have commented, they don’t get away with this in the US, from where the UK could still learn a lot about customer service.

RE: “No doubt they don’t just cover the cost of their operation by charging us rather than building these overhead costs into their new product/service prices (and losing business to higher quality lower cost competitors), they also make a profit.”

In all cases (084, including 0845; and 087, not including 0870), the caller pays a fee which is passed on to the “terminating telecoms provider”. This can be up to at least 5p/min on 084 numbers and up to at least 10p/min on 087 numbers. On 0845 numbers it is around 2p or 3p/min. Ofcom will shortly set these rates as “up to 7p/min” on 084 numbers and “up to 13p/min” on 087 numbers. The fee currently varies according to the number called and will continue to do so in the same way.

The “originating call provider” currently adds their own markup on top of that fee, and they usually retain that markup. BT is currently regulated to retain almost nothing, but that condition will be lifted next year. Mobiles add a huge per-minute markup. Landlines add a modest per-minute markup (if any) but then add a large connection fee of around 15p per call. In some cases (e.g. 0845 numbers called from BT lines), the call provider chooses to subsidise the fee from the monthly call package price and designate the calls as “inclusive”. This latter case is a rare exception.

The fee collected by the “originating telecoms provider” is passed on to the “terminating telecoms provider”. Apart from the lowest-rate calls (under 2p/min), this “termination fee” adequately covers the cost of the non-geographic call-handling features (call queueing, IVR, etc) which usually cost a couple of pence per minute.

Anything left over may be paid out as revenue share to the company that uses the non-geographic telephone number. Companies using non-geographic numbers typically make about 2p/min from calls to 0844 numbers, and perhaps as much as 8p/min from calls to 0871 numbers. On 0845 numbers they make nothing; the 2p/min fee paid by the caller just about pays for the call-handling features.

The “termination fee”, ultimately handled by the “terminating telecoms provider” (part of which may be paid out as “revenue share”), will shortly be designated the “Service Charge”. Ofcom will shortly require all businesses using 084, 087 and 09 numbers to declare this Service Charge every time they advertise their telephone number.

Revenue share is currently banned on 0870 numbers. Users of 0870 numbers therefore have to pay for the non-geographic call-handling features. 0870 numbers remain expensive to call from mobiles and offer the worst possible outcome for all parties: both callers and users are paying fees.

All users of 0870 numbers may as well move to an 03 number right now. The business will pay no more for the call-handling on an 03 number than whatever they currently pay for call-handling on an 0870 number. However, the caller gets to pay the same rate for 03 numbers as whatever they pay for calling 01 and 02 numbers, even when calling from a mobile. Additionally, the 03 call will be “inclusive” if the caller has a call package on their mobile or landline. This makes little diffrence to users calling from a landline but makes a huge difference to mobile users who may pay about 30p/min less for “inclusive” 03 numbers than for “chargeable” 0870 numbers.

Ofcom will shortly confirm the Service Charge details for 084 and 087 numbers, including the continuation of this scheme on 0845 numbers, and the return of 0870 numbers to this scheme. Revenue share will return to 0870 numbers.

The “connection fee” (often around 15p per call) imposed on calls from landlines will be scrapped. Networks will no longer be able to add a variable markup to the call price. Instead each network (landlines and mobiles) will each set and declare a single Access Charge covering all 084, 087 and 09 numbers. There will be one Access Charge per tariff. In these circumstances, it is very posssible that 0845 and 0870 numbers will no longer be inclusive calls from landlines. However, that’s not the disaster it might at first seem.

Many businesses fled from 0870 to 0844 as soon as revenue sharing was removed from 0870 in 2009, so there’s not all that many 0870 numbers still in use. More importantly, any business currently using an 084 or 087 number for customer service will need to move to an 01, 02, 03 or 080 number before June 2014. When the new pricing arrangements for 084 and 087 numbers come into force in 2015, most people will not be affected by them as, by then, most of their dealings with business will be made by calling an 03 number.

What really infuriates me, having dialed 0845 or 0870, I then go through a computer menu, only to be told “all our operators are busy. Your call is important to us. Please hold” You bet the call is important to them – it’s earning them money!

There is one major reason that companies use these premium rate numbers, and that is purely to make, not earn money at the public’s expense. Asking a conservative government to correct this quickly is a no go. They will gently nibble at the edges and pretend that they are doing something about it.

Compared to what the caller pays (especially when the call originates from a mobile), the amount made by the called company is tiny.

Nevertheless, these charges will shortly be outlawed on customer service lines. Businesses will be banned from using numbers beginning 084, 087 and 09 for customer service.

Public opinion will pay a big part in convincing other businesses, including those not directly covered by the legislation, to also adopt the same measures. Which business wants to be exposed as using a Service Charge number when their competitors mostly use 03 and free numbers?

It’s not just commercial companies that are at fault; in fact in almost every single case SAYNOTO0845 comes up with a decent alternative. However our doctor’s surgery, in common with many NHS health centres, use premium rate lines and there is no alternative, despite directives from the Health Authorities to the contrary. In the last six months calls to my doctor are the ONLY calls that accrue a charge on my bill. In one case three calls added £5.00 to my bill. Free health service? Perhaps not.

Government departments aren’t “exempt”. They are simply not covered by “business legislation”.

The recent (July 18th) National Audit Office report is highly critical of government usage of these higher rate numbers.

HMRC are already replacing their 0845 and 0870 numbers with 0300 and 0345. They started doing this in the spring and it will all be completed within the next few months.

It has now become more difficult for other departments to avoid making the same move. HMRC has shown how easy it is to change the phone numbers over. Clear direction from (presumably) the Cabinet Office is now required to set things in motion.

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Comment of the Week

Legacymjr

“I think that with fewer players there may be an opportunity for Ofcom to address the real problem with mobile and that is the truly appalling patchy coverage on all networks. I am talking about in major built up areas - lord knows what it is like in rural areas...”