Forgive me for covering old ground but the Canucks crash against Chicago on Saturday night still seems to be lingering across town. The team doesn’t play again until tomorrow night in Arizona, and should they lose that one? Well, who knows as speculation runs rampant, but there seems to be a definite hangover from the collapse.

Much like the feeling when the Canucks were on their nine-game losing streak, once Chicago scored their second goal, there was a familiar ghoulish curiosity amongst some Canucks fans that appeared to be enjoying the collapse.

When the Canucks lost nine games in a row, there was a bit of a morbid curiosity for some of the fans to see the losses continue, and it felt the same during Saturday’s collapse.

I concede it may not be as much fun if you’ve paid for tickets, but certainly on social media there’s almost a revelry in seeing how bad the team can be.

It reminds me of the 1984-85 Canucks. I remember going to those games and you’d hear open laughter from the fans around you when the other team scored. There were two 9-game losing streaks that season. And only 25 wins.

We’ve done a lot of polls in the first few months of the season and many of you think this current team is the worst Canucks squad ever. Consider that 84-85 team lost 7-0 to Edmonton. Twice. They lost to the Kings 10-3 AND 12-1. They also had a 13-2 loss to Philly, 9-3 to Chicago and 11-5 to Detroit. They. Were. Awful.

In fact the best thing to happen that whole season might have been the fight between Craig Coxe and Bob Probert, interestingly look at the crowd, or lack thereof, and their reaction to the fight.

There may not be as much comic relief in the team these days as there was that season, but fans still seem to be expecting some kind of big event happening soon.

In the old days you might have seen a blockbuster trade. I don’t see one on the horizon for this club, they’re not giving up any more of their young players and with the Sedins and Ryan Miller being off the table, any personnel moves would appear to be under the “tinkering” column more than anything else.

Erik Rolfsen asked you yesterday in his Skate what you think should happen, and what you think will happen.

Interesting results. It seems you’re judging GM Jim Benning more harshly than coach Willie Desjardins. In the poll on what you think should happen, 22 per cent said Benning should go, 20 per cent said no one should go, 19 per cent said Willie and Benning and only 13 per cent said only Willie should go. That shocked me.

In what you think will happen, 57 per cent think the coach will go, 16 per cent think no one will go and 12 per cent think Willie and Benning go.

The other axiom we’ve heard in the media is that this is the time of year you can bank on the themes we’ve seen in the standings. That by U.S. Thanksgiving you can count on little movement up or down in the standings.

The Canucks have just 16 points, only two points ahead of the New York Islanders who have the NHL’s worst total and have played two games less.

However the Canucks remain only 3 points off the last wild card playoff spot.

Daniel Sedin is their leading scorer and he’s on pace for a 52-point season. Daniel and Bo Horvat lead the team in goals. They’re on pace for 24-goal seasons.

Thought that would cheer everyone up. And here’s another good one. Philip Larsen is still tied for the scoring lead among defencemen and hasn’t played in two weeks.

But … if the lack of secondary scoring, Jake Virtanen’s lack of development, or the ultra-conservative tactics don’t have you depressed, how about the realization the reason the Canucks are as bad as they are is largely down to the fact the big moves made by the GM this offseason just haven’t come close to hitting the mark.

The Canucks’ biggest disappointments have been their two biggest off-season acquisitions: Loui Eriksson and Erik Gudbranson.

In Eriksson, the belief was the Canucks were adding a 25- to 30-goal scorer who’d spark a resurgence in the twins. In Gudbranson, the belief was they were adding a legitimate top-four defenceman who has some snarl in his game and would be the perfect partner for Ben Hutton.

With Eriksson we know what the issue is, he isn’t scoring. That and he’s a 31-year-old who they signed to a six-year deal.

But Ed raises a great point on Gudbranson, who while the nouveau media suggested his analytics and advanced stats were poor, the Canucks kept talking about how bringing in a giant defenceman who had decent wheels but more importantly a mean streak, would be a foundation of their philosophy.

As for Gudbranson, he’s taken one minor penalty in 19 games this season and has one fight. No one is saying he has to be Bob Probert, but if you’re involved physically, if you’re playing with an edge, you’re getting more than one minor penalty.

Now, having said that, all last year he only had 49 minutes and just three fights, but if he was brought in because he was tough, and there are times the team needs a spark, you might have thought we’d see him drop the mitts a bit more often to lift his team.

Not sure which the Canucks need more of, I mean they certainly need more goals and Eriksson would be expected to be a huge part of that. But being rock solid in front of their own goal and having Gudbranson play more than 20 solid minutes every night was supposed to be the way forward for this team.

29. VANCOUVER CANUCKS 7-10-2
THIS WEEK: 29 LAST WEEK: 27
GF: 2.11 GA: 3.16 SA CF%: 48.1
PP%: 12.3 PK%: 83.3
The Canucks do have points in three of the past four games, though they all went to overtime, so they still have just one regulation win in the past 15 games.Key Injuries: RW Anton Rodin (knee), D Chris Tanev (lower body), RW Jannik Hansen (rib).

One thing is for sure, with Virtanen seemingly in need of a long period in the minors to get his stuff together, the bulk of the hope for the future hinges on the shoulders of Bo Horvat.

Canucks fans who read The Province have been pretty clear they’re willing to suffer through a rebuild if the young players are developing. That’s mostly going to be down to Horvat. But, what’s his ceiling? Ben Kuzma explored that on Monday.

A stronger all-round game has allowed Horvat to be comfortable in any matchup and for any player, that’s the ticket to the top line. Especially when you consider that top trios for other clubs usually aren’t as diligent defensively, it would open the door for Horvat to be even better in transition. And after a slow start, his faceoff winning percentage is up to 50.3.

Doesn’t all that make him a future first-line candidate?

“It depends how you play guys,” Desjardins said of matchups. “To me, Bo should be able to play against the other team’s top centre. He’s big and strong and he’s good on draws, but to do that, he’s got to be a little better defensively.

“That’s a role I see him playing. And a lot of times, the other team’s top lines aren’t great defensively and that’s where he can score, too. I see him able to do both.”

One last point I’d like you to clarify for me though.

It’s easy to say you’ll support a rebuild, watch the team lose while playing young players in hopes of high draft picks and development of prospects. But will you PAY for it? I mean, yeah, people will still watch on TV, but would you buy tickets knowing the team has no real shot at the playoffs for 2-3 years?

So the Blue Jackets sit two points out of second in the Metropolitan division, are 10-4-3 after losing in overtime to Colorado last night, and only New Jersey and Minnesota have given up fewer goals. So, do we owe Torts an apology? I mean, while the John Tortorella era in Vancouver was a comical disaster, the feeling when he left was he was a dinosaur who had no place left in the NHL. Getting a second-rounder as compensation of him joining Columbus was seen as a steal, and certainly his stewardship of the train wreck that was the U.S. team last summer’s World Cup of Hockey emboldened the theory he was done. But honestly, he has to get some credit for what’s happening in Columbus doesn’t he?

Tortorella took a lot of heat, along with the rest of Team USA, for the team’s lifeless performance at the World Cup of Hockey. But after losing their first two games of the regular season, the Blue Jackets have gone 10-2-2, including Sunday’s 3-2 win over the defending Presidents’ Trophy-winning Washington Capitals. That win marks four in a row for a team that leads the NHL in power-play efficiency (they scored one with the man advantage Sunday) and is second in goals scored per game. With a sterling 7-2-2 record at home, it means the accursed Columbus Civil War cannon is going off like crazy at Nationwide Arena.

Kings of the Pacific

The L.A. Kings have an elite core, but the last two seasons it has seemed like something was missing from the team and it was only a matter of time before coach Darryl Sutter got gonged.

But the Kings, in beating Anaheim on the weekend, are firmly in control of the Pacific and are playing like true contenders again. One of the main reasons is Jeff Carter is playing like an elite player again.

Carter was a one-man wrecking crew Sunday, feeding Doughty for a shot that whistled inside the far post and past John Gibson for the Kings’ first goal, finishing off a rush with linemates Tanner Pearson and Tyler Toffoli during a power play for the Kings’ second goal, and using his body to deflect Doughty’s point shot past Gibson for a 3-0 lead at 13:35 in the third period. “I didn’t have to do a lot there. It just hit me in the chest,” Carter said of that goal, but he was in the right place at the right time, and that mattered.

“We knew we were going to need everybody. We couldn’t be short-staffed in terms of effort or compete,” Kings Coach Darryl Sutter said. “I thought we were pretty good in that area. Obviously, Jeff had another big game for us.”

His excellence certainly has been obvious to his teammates. “Carts is buzzing out there. He’s using his speed,” defenseman Alec Martinez said. “All three of those guys generate a lot of plays off the rush. Carts is a really smart player and he’s always there for us in the middle. When we’re clean getting it to those guys, oftentimes that can lead to an opportunity at the other end.”

Ice Ice Baby

Interesting story out of Edmonton, where they used to boast all the time about having the best ice in the league. Well they’re in a brand new building, and fans are marvelling at the video board and the bars, but the ice? Not so much.

We’ve had had a warm fall. It hasn’t turned (cold) anywhere in the nation yet and usually by Nov. 15 there’s change and things cool down,” said Dan Craig, who worked his magic to put in the ice for the very first bitterly cold Heritage Classic 13 years ago at Commonwealth Stadium and had his son Mike looking after the ice at Investors Group Field for the Oilers and the Jets last month.

There’s an array of things at Rogers Place, concerts seemingly every second night, plus the junior Oil Kings using the ice. It’s a busy, busy building, which doesn’t help.

“It usually takes three months before the ice is good (new building). Nothing is out of alignment, you just have to get it in sync,” said Craig.

“There’s a WHL team in this building along with an NHL team. A lot of places don’t have that with hockey teams going back-to-back. The Oil Kings played on a Saturday night so we shaved the ice and then had to build it back up for the Oilers against the Rangers,” said Craig. “The morning-day NHL game skates have a snow build-up because of that. Everybody has to get used to that.”

The frigid weather in Edmonton was just one of the reasons Northlands Coliseum was always cited as having impeccable ice where the puck didn’t bounce and the players flew. It seems in the old days they had things down pat, even though the rink was treated like a community rec centre.

The ice was spectacular in the glory days of the Oilers but there was no junior team playing there. It got a major snow build-up as the years went on and the ice-plant got older, but the ice was the NHL’s best in the Gretzky-Messier days for various reasons.

“We used to have public skating at night after games, or in between games. We’d have rentals from 6 o’clock until 10 o’clock, just four hours, but they were manufacturing the ice for the next day,” said Craig.

So the current Oilers should be doing that?

“I’m not going to say that. It’s a very busy building,” laughed Craig.

“Every crew has to learn how to adjust, whether it’s New York or Boston or Philadelphia, those buildings are busy every night. I look at Madison Square Garden in New York over the last eight to 10 years. When Glen Sather went there, he knew certain things had to get done (ice) and we got them done,” said Craig.

Gambling on Vegas

Today, the NHL will announce the Desert-Silver-Golden Knights and the logo of the team that will play in Las Vegas next season. While the name is uninspired, it remains to see if the logo and the uniforms will be a hit.

The arena will be spectacular, and they may be a curiosity at first, but it’s worth wondering if this is a venture that can work. If you can see an NHL game at home, are you going to eschew all the great things that happen in Vegas to go see a game? And will the locals support it? You constantly hear stories that locals hate going to the Strip and mostly don’t venture downtown and mingle with the tourists.

The arena is awesome, and there will certainly be a good amount of curiosity in Year 1, but what about beyond that?

On Friday the Carolina Hurricanes beat Montreal in front of an announced crowd of 12,101 fans at PNC Arena in Raleigh. A game with the arena more than a quarter empty, against the hottest team in the NHL and one of its storied franchises, was actually a bright spot on the Hurricanes season. Three of Carolina’s seven home dates have had announced crowds below 9,000 and, other than the sellout home opener against the New York Rangers, the Hurricanes have played before an average audience of just over 10,000. For Sunday’s home game against the Winnipeg Jets, tickets were available on resale sites for $12.

The Hurricanes aren’t exactly a threat to relocate, as they have a lease at PNC Arena that runs for another seven years, but owner Peter Karmanos, who moved the team to Carolina from Hartford, wants to sell, and it is no surprise that he does not have a line of local buyers interested in taking the team off his hands. He doesn’t even have the beginnings of a line. It’s not unreasonable to imagine that a few more months of 8,000-plus crowds in Raleigh would increase the chances that Karmanos will sell to someone who is interested in buying out the arena lease and decamping.

Carolina’s attendance, lowest in the NHL, is only a shade higher than the average crowds of just under 12,500 that have paid for tickets to see the New York Islanders at Barclays Center. In the second season in Brooklyn, the move from Long Island appears to be a full-on disaster, with the Isles’ suburban fans not terribly interested in the trek into the city (and back) and not enough bearded Brooklyn hipsters are willing to pay for hockey tickets.

That’s not even to mention the Coyotes and, of course, the Panthers. The NHL has some very soft markets, adding another into a non-traditional market when you have Quebec City, Seattle, Portland and Surrey available as markets waiting in the wings is odd. (Ok, kidding about Surrey, but one day … ). You also have to wonder if the fabled corporate support that seems so essential to a successful franchise in any league will be there once the NFL arrives in the form of the Raiders. Still, today we’ll get a name and a logo and I’m sure bandwagon fans locally will get some gear for Christmas. You just wonder if this shell game is going to hurt the NHL in the long run.

None of this is particularly new or unexpected. For years now, the NHL has always had a handful of franchises losing piles of money, with lousy attendance, or with questions about ownership or an arena — and sometimes all of those things at once.

There are still many reasons to be skeptical of Las Vegas as an NHL site, but the biggest question remains this: with so much uncertainty around the bottom end of its 30 markets, why add another?

So, today is garbage bag day for the B.C. Lions, they’ll show up at their Surrey facility, clean out their lockers into garbage bags, and slink off into the offseason. I’ve found the coverage in the last two days a bit too much doom and gloom. This is a team that was going nowhere, had perpetually looked lost in its quest to find a head coach since Wally Buono left the sidelines and had watched its fan base drip away.

Now they have a strong vision, a coach that demands accountability and a bona fide star at quarterback. Yes they got blown out in Calgary, but they have more to build on than they’ve had in the last five seasons.

Ed Willes has some closing thoughts on the Lions, and check out theprovince.com throughout the day as Ed will be in Surrey as the team wraps up the 2016 season.

The beatdown administered by the Calgary Stampeders on Sunday didn’t expose one or two flaws in the Lions’ game. It exposed a team that isn’t ready to compete at the highest level. And, before you ask, Sunday’s 42-15 drubbing wasn’t an isolated case. This year the Lions were 3-6 against Calgary, Edmonton and Winnipeg, the only other three CFL teams to finish above .500 this season.

This fix, therefore, isn’t a matter of rebuilding the secondary or adding a pass rusher. It’s improving across the board and that’s a much bigger challenge.

This year the Lions identified their quarterback in Jonathon Jennings, laid the foundation for a solid offensive line and assembled a quality group of receivers. Defensively, they were good enough to beat average teams, but weren’t good enough against quality opponents. That should become the principal target area this off-season.

But here’s the cold, hard reality. Given what transpired Sunday, they’ll still need more. The Stamps have to finish the job in the Grey Cup game but, right now, they look like one of the best handful of teams in CFL history.

That’s where the bar is set for the Lions. And it’s awfully high.

El Raiders

The Raiders proved they’re ready for Prime Time on Monday, beating Houston in front of a gigantic crowd in Mexico City.

The Raiders completed a comeback with a stunning 39-yard catch-and-run from Amari Cooper, who caught a 10-yard pass, juked three Texans out of their jocks, and jetted to the house.

“There’s never a doubt in our minds,” Raiders quarterback Derek Carr said. “There was never a doubt last year, there is never a doubt this year. It’s just, who’s going to make the play?”

It was the eighth game-winning drive in the fourth quarter or overtime for Carr since the start of the 2015 season. Only the Detroit Lions’ Matthew Stafford has more in that time, with nine, and the New York Giants’ Eli Manning has seven.

Jagged edge

First round draft pick Jalen Ramsey is having a bit of a problem adjusting to Jacksonville. The top rookie cornerback lost four games in his whole college career. He’s already lost 8 this year with the Jaguars and was moved to tears on the sideline this weekend as he’s so sick of losing.

Jaguars fans feel your pain, Jalen. Jacksonville hasn’t made the playoffs since 2007 and hasn’t won more than five games in a season since 2010. Add a dozen or so players with Ramsey’s talent and passion, though, and maybe those droughts will come to an end.

Sawker talk

Tomorrow it will be one day shy of the Whitecaps season being over by a full month. The playoffs have dragged on they usually do, and whether or not you were aware, the all-Canadian semi-final between Toronto FC and Montreal gets started in Montreal, while there’s action down the I-5 as the Sounders host Colorado.

At least if TFC wins you’ll have some star power. But seriously, how many of you are following the playoffs?

The regular season is too long. The post-season is too long. The off-season isn’t close to long enough for playoff teams.

Consider this: The two teams that compete in the MLS Cup are rewarded with a six-week off-season — enough time to rest, recover, take a quick vacation and rediscover fitness before reporting for pre-season in mid-to-late January.

There are challenges, of course. MLS faces the unique scheduling puzzle of squeezing in domestic and international Cup games amid a year riddled with FIFA international dates. And that’s before mentioning North America’s unique weather patterns.

Still, it’s ridiculous to stretch the final three playoff rounds over 45 days. Soccer isn’t best played in December.

Just in case the Whitecaps needed to point hammered home, these playoffs have been decided by the designated players: Giovinco and Piatti, Gashi and Lodeiro.

Yes, all four conference finalists can boast about their team performances, about chemistry and unity, and all the intangibles. But, bottom line, their top players have won them games.

We know the Caps aren’t going to spend like Toronto and Seattle. But can the Caps find the right difference-makers for less? It’s a huge off-season for the club as they look to fill Octavio Rivero’s and Pedro Morales’s DP slots.

The low-budget Red Bulls and FC Dallas were great stories this season — stories that Caps’ brass loved pointing out — but what works well over 34 games doesn’t necessarily work over two legs, or one-off playoff games, where moments of magic are that much more vital.

Ad ons

Nice list by FTW on their opinion of the 35 best sports commercials. Hard to argue about some of them, but Bo Knows, Terry Tate Office Linebacker and Cut That Meat are far too low on the list for me.

And the number one choice of Be Like Mike? Far too corporate and sappy. Kind of like Jordan I guess.

Comments

We encourage all readers to share their views on our articles and blog posts. We are committed to maintaining a lively but civil forum for discussion, so we ask you to avoid personal attacks, and please keep your comments relevant and respectful. If you encounter a comment that is abusive, click the "X" in the upper right corner of the comment box to report spam or abuse. We are using Facebook commenting. Visit our FAQ page for more information.

Almost Done!

Postmedia wants to improve your reading experience as well as share the best deals and promotions from our advertisers with you. The information below will be used to optimize the content and make ads across the network more relevant to you. You can always change the information you share with us by editing your profile.

By clicking "Create Account", I hearby grant permission to Postmedia to use my account information to create my account.

I also accept and agree to be bound by Postmedia's Terms and Conditions with respect to my use of the Site and I have read and understand Postmedia's Privacy Statement. I consent to the collection, use, maintenance, and disclosure of my information in accordance with the Postmedia's Privacy Policy.

Postmedia wants to improve your reading experience as well as share the best deals and promotions from our advertisers with you. The information below will be used to optimize the content and make ads across the network more relevant to you. You can always change the information you share with us by editing your profile.

By clicking "Create Account", I hearby grant permission to Postmedia to use my account information to create my account.

I also accept and agree to be bound by Postmedia's Terms and Conditions with respect to my use of the Site and I have read and understand Postmedia's Privacy Statement. I consent to the collection, use, maintenance, and disclosure of my information in accordance with the Postmedia's Privacy Policy.