Still on the NewsStand:<br><br><h2>Israel's Secret Prison</h2><br><br><h1>Secrets Of Unit 1391</h1><br><br><br><br>[color:green]"...or am I a butterfly that's dreaming she's a woman?"</font color=green>

An earlier breaking story:<br><br><h2>Facility 1391: “Israel’s” secret prison</h2><br><br>I'm starting to understand why they'd be mad at us by association.<br>It didn't take turning over too many rocks to find these stories either.<br><br>...maybe this can be Michael Moore's next movie.<br><br>[color:green]"...or am I a butterfly that's dreaming she's a woman?"</font color=green>

i can't claim i'm certain about what i say. it's just an opinion based on others opinion that i trust and sometimes my own conclusions on information that i get.<br><br>i think it's not important how correct our view, what's important that we DO talk about it, because the only way we can be responsible citizens of a democracy that cast a smart vote if we DO deal with these issues and we DO analize the situation. the smarter we get the better the democracy works. the problem with the current democracies i believe is that people vote for the most popular guy and they don't have very deep decisions. they just go with the flow, which means we don't really have democracy, people are manipulated the way the top few wants their voters to vote. you know what i mean :)<br><br>

Oh I understand competely. This election is going to be very difficult for me. There are so many issues besides the war. In some ways I like Kerry, and our union has endorsed him because of the support he gives to firefighters, but there are other issues were I strongly oppose him. The same goes for Bush. I think politics has gotten to the point where it's not so much picking the best candidate, but picking the lesser of two evils.<br><br><br>Salus populi suprema lex

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p> I think politics has gotten to the point where it's not so much picking the best candidate, but picking the lesser of two evils. <p><hr></blockquote><p> Call me a raving lunatic but I really hate this ever popular mantra said of today's politicians. It is as if politicians come from some part of Hades far from the place where us normal people come from.<br><br>But politicians are people. With as much good and bad intentions as the rest of us. Even Bush likely believed his good intention of planting Democracy in the middle east even though that intention had the chance of a snowball in said Hades. And we select these politicians. Not a perfect selection process to be sure but not all that bad either. <br><br>Sometimes in Presidential elections in can be said that there is not much difference. Clinton and Dole moved to the center so much they could have been twins. But this year we have not the lesser of two anythings. We have two diametrically opposed views on the way this country should move forward. If you are on the fence and your union decision is selecting which way you should vote then you should read up on what these two men really represent. Not today's hype but what they have done with their lives and what they intend to do with yours while leading this country.<br><br>

That's actually the point. I'm not a single issue voter. There are things I like about both candidates, and things about both that I hate. As for the Union, they are going to endorse whoever they think will be the best for firefighters. They have a very narrow point of view. All the information we get from the International is very clear about this, and they are also clear that they expect us look at all the issues and vote for who WE feel is best. <br><br><br>[color:blue]"In making the tough decisions about who to support in political election, the IAFF Executive Board focuses solely on a candidate's record of support on the fire service and employment issues. Issues of school prayer, right to life, the environment, or any other issues that are of great concer to the citizens of this country, including professional fire fighters, are not taken into consideration. Our job is to represent the needs of fire fighters and paramedics-------period."<br><br>"We trust our membership to evaluate all the issues and make your decisions on a candidate's worthiness. We respect your right to form your own opinion about who to support for President of the United States, and the issues on which you base that support."</font color=blue><br><br>General President Harold Schaitberger, International Association of Fire Fighters.<br><br><br>Salus populi suprema lex

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>I think politics has gotten to the point where it's not so much picking the best candidate, but picking the lesser of two evils.<p><hr></blockquote><p>that's exactly true. the problem is that there are better candidates for your presidency than Bush or Kerry, but they don't get the chance to even run for the presidence. there is an illegal movie called the Spin, that demonstrates this fact. you have to watch it to loose all hope of fair democracy :)<br><br><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by iraszl on 06/27/04 11:38 AM (server time).</EM></FONT></P>

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p> The problem is that there are better candidates for your presidency than Bush or Kerry. <p><hr></blockquote><p> When this is not the case I will want to be dead and long gone. Of course there are better people. Only in a perfect world would we pick the two most perfect candidates for the Presidency. Politics is just like life. It's messy, imperfect and we make choices every day which are good and bad which we have to live with.<br><br>We can all prattle on about the busted selection process or we can fix it. We can read the history books and discover how third parties do not fall out of the sky but are usually pulled out of the ashes of one of the failed in the two party system. We may well be living through a time like that right now. I would put money on the Republican party exploding into flames soon as it finds out how hard it is to keep people who make less then the top 3 percentile in wages continuing to vote for a party that supports only the wishes of the top 3 percent.<br><br><br><br><br>

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>you have to watch it to loose all hope of fair democracy :)<p><hr></blockquote><p><br>The question is, Ivan, how do you define "fair". This country has splintered into so many different special interest groups, that the idea of fair has become blurred. Many people in this country believe that fair means that they get what they want, and to hell with everyone else. Of course the politicians recoginze this, and they pander to one group or the other, depending on which way the wind is blowing that day. Or how much cash is flowing! The problem really isnt' with the politicians, they just react. The problem is when people start putting their personal special interests ahead of what is good for the country as a whole. In my opinion a fair democracy means everyone gets the chance to be heard. It doesn't mean you will get what you want.<br><br><br>Salus populi suprema lex

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