I have this little girl that will be 2 in June. She has not had a bottle or pacifier here in at least 7 months. Well I just found out that the parents have been giving her one or the other at home for naps and bedtime.

So here is the issue I am having. The girl sleeps 9:30 to 10:30 in the am and then noon to 2:30 in the pm. The mom doesn't think she is sleeping enough so she wants me to give her the pacifier so she stays asleep longer?? I'm very confused here. For an almost 2 year old I think that is plenty of nap time. also, if she hasn't had a pacifier... Why in the world would she want me to start??

Also this girl is very far behind. She does not communicate or try to communicate at all. She will say "pa" for please and up if you make her but thats it. She doesn't babble even. She is just mute most of the day. She will not help pick up or come when called. They had her hearing checked and it was fine. I did notice the parents do not make her speak or pick up at home. I am very concerned that the pacifier will stunt her growth even more. I feel that maybe the parents don't want her to grow up, which is turning out to be very unhealthy for this little girl. IMO

I too think its too much nap for a 2 yr old. Also, I would start to make her talk. I don't allow the other kids to speak for a child either I have a feeling that no one talks to her at home so she just kinda does her own thing. My dd was in speech for several years. I don't do sign language so I would make the child talk. Like instead of grunting I would tell them to use their words, and make them repeat you. If they say something, say the word correctly and have them repeat it.

I would start using sign language with her and if you have any TV time during the day and a good library, try to get the Signing Time DVDs. All kids can benefit from learning sign language and it's a big help to toddlers!

Not picking up at 2 isn't a red flag to me because I don't even TRY to get them to help pick up that young--not a popular stance, but I just don't see the need until they're old enough to really understand. I model it for them and get spontaneous help, but I in no way expect it.

Not responding to her name and the other speech issues are a HUGE red flag for me; by two she should be communicating much more than that. Sign with her but don't FORCE her to speak/sign back--encourage it, but mostly just model it for her.

That doesn't sound like too much nap for a not-quite two--one of my 2's routinely naps for 3-3.5 hours and still sleeps well during the night. I would NOT give her a paci to sleep longer, but I might start shortening the morning nap to get her to one nap a day.

Ok Thanks! Just wanted to make sure I wasn't expecting too much. I have 2 other children in care. All 3 are just 2 weeks apart. The other two will repeat after me and if they whine or grunt I stand there until the words come out. This one just stares at me. Thats it. No whining, no grunting just stares.

Ok Thanks! Just wanted to make sure I wasn't expecting too much. I have 2 other children in care. All 3 are just 2 weeks apart. The other two will repeat after me and if they whine or grunt I stand there until the words come out. This one just stares at me. Thats it. No whining, no grunting just stares.

Is she too young to worry about signs of autism

No, she's not too young. It definitely sounds like she might have a speech delay and it's possible there are other things going on as well. Have you brought your concerns up to her parents?

I would start using sign language with her and if you have any TV time during the day and a good library, try to get the Signing Time DVDs. All kids can benefit from learning sign language and it's a big help to toddlers!

Not picking up at 2 isn't a red flag to me because I don't even TRY to get them to help pick up that young--not a popular stance, but I just don't see the need until they're old enough to really understand. I model it for them and get spontaneous help, but I in no way expect it.

Not responding to her name and the other speech issues are a HUGE red flag for me; by two she should be communicating much more than that. Sign with her but don't FORCE her to speak/sign back--encourage it, but mostly just model it for her.

That doesn't sound like too much nap for a not-quite two--one of my 2's routinely naps for 3-3.5 hours and still sleeps well during the night. I would NOT give her a paci to sleep longer, but I might start shortening the morning nap to get her to one nap a day.

I would NOT use sign language! It will give her & her parents an excuse to not make her speak! She needs to learn how to talk. That is ridoulous to use sign language. Make her use words for what she wants or she cant get what she wants until she can say the word. Also, 2 yr olds are old enough to learn how to pick up toys. They need to learn at a young age to do little things like simply picking up some toys. Also, napping is individuale to the child. Maybe she needs more sleep,but would not give her a pacifer.

I would NOT use sign language! It will give her & her parents an excuse to not make her speak! She needs to learn how to talk. That is ridoulous to use sign language. Make her use words for what she wants or she cant get what she wants until she can say the word. Also, 2 yr olds are old enough to learn how to pick up toys. They need to learn at a young age to do little things like simply picking up some toys. Also, napping is individuale to the child. Maybe she needs more sleep,but would not give her a pacifer.

Oh for the love of pete!!! Using sign language does NOT interfere with their ability to learn to speak, and if she does have speech delays then it will HELP her learn to communicate. There is TONS of research supporting the use of sign language in early childhood environments with both neurotypical children and those with delays and research that I know of that suggests that it it not okay. Even children who speak and are developing normally benefit from learning sign at a young age--it gives them the tools they need to communicate before they are physically able to.

You can't FORCE a child to speak who isn't ready to, and you can do more harm than good by trying! When you teach a sign, you speak the word and make the sign at the same time and therefore are presenting both simultaneously--it in no way interferes with talking to the child or teaching them the spoken words for things. Signing is STILL communicating, and that's what's important at this stage.

No, she's not too young. It definitely sounds like she might have a speech delay and it's possible there are other things going on as well. Have you brought your concerns up to her parents?

I have tried nicely to point out milestones the other two are doing. Mom has made comments about the other two being so far ahead and needing to work on her child. Well mom made a good effort for like a wk. When the girl started saying "pa" for up and please her mom was so happy and just stopped. I would expect her to say Thank You, an actual Up and some sort of please that sounds like Please.

I also stated to mom that she doesn't seem to babble. Mom swears she babbles at home. Well we work on blocks, shapes, etc all morning and I just get stares. The other two babble with each other and laugh and this one may laugh when the others do but thats it. I don't believe she babbles. I think mom may be in denial. I also forgot to mention that the cord was wrapped around her neck at birth and it took awhile for her to cry. Another flag of why I feel these delays should be addressed.

Oh for the love of pete!!! Using sign language does NOT interfere with their ability to learn to speak, and if she does have speech delays then it will HELP her learn to communicate. There is TONS of research supporting the use of sign language in early childhood environments with both neurotypical children and those with delays and research that I know of that suggests that it it not okay. Even children who speak and are developing normally benefit from learning sign at a young age--it gives them the tools they need to communicate before they are physically able to.

You can't FORCE a child to speak who isn't ready to, and you can do more harm than good by trying! When you teach a sign, you speak the word and make the sign at the same time and therefore are presenting both simultaneously--it in no way interferes with talking to the child or teaching them the spoken words for things. Signing is STILL communicating, and that's what's important at this stage.

Sorry, I don't believe that it should be used in this case. I think the parents need to step up and help her learn to talk. There is no excuse for a 2 yr old not at least saying more words then she is saying. I know each child is different and learns at a different pace, but my gosh, help her to speak, not use sign language. If she has a development problem that is different, but it doesn't sound like she does.

I would NOT use sign language! It will give her & her parents an excuse to not make her speak! She needs to learn how to talk. That is ridoulous to use sign language. Make her use words for what she wants or she cant get what she wants until she can say the word. Also, 2 yr olds are old enough to learn how to pick up toys. They need to learn at a young age to do little things like simply picking up some toys. Also, napping is individuale to the child. Maybe she needs more sleep,but would not give her a pacifer.

You think sign language is ridoulous???? You are wrong!! Sign language is used everday probably by every provider. When we sing "when your happy and you know it" we use our fingers to our face and make a smile. When we sing "The wheels on the bus" we use our hands to this song. hummmm

And you can not MAKE her use words for what she wants. That would be cruel not to give her what she wants till she says the word.

This just really seems like a lot of sleep to me. I think an hour in the am and then two hours in the pm are fine. I don't think she needs an extra hour in the afternoon. Dad also says that when she stays home with him she will sleep 2 hours in the AM and again in the PM. I don't wake her up, she wakes up on her own. There are also days where in the AM she doesn't nap but that is just the age. My other 2 her age do not nap in the AM, only the two hours in the PM and still go to bed at a normal hour.

Sorry, I don't believe that it should be used in this case. I think the parents need to step up and help her learn to talk. There is no excuse for a 2 yr old not at least saying more words then she is saying. I know each child is different and learns at a different pace, but my gosh, help her to speak, not use sign language. If she has a development problem that is different, but it doesn't sound like she does.

Heck YES there could VERY easily be a VERY GOOD excuse for a 2-year old to not be speaking yet! Speech delay, cognitive delay, hearing issues, and ASD are just FOUR of the things that come to my mind instantly! Kids don't generally need to be TAUGHT to talk--they learn it from their environment. No one has ever sat an infant down and said, okay, it's time to learn to talk! Kids don't learn that way. Language acquisition is not like learning calculus or French as an adult. Children's brains are hard-wired to acquire speech and it begins in the womb, as soon as the baby starts to be able to hear, which occurs around...26 or 27 weeks, IIRC. If a 2-year old isn't talking or at least making SOME attempt to communicate, there is something more going on.

I am dearly, dearly hoping that you, Ms. Unregistered, are simply a lurker and a troll and [i]not[i] a registered user who's hiding. Your comments show an amazing lack of understanding of child development. You make it sound like you think the child isn't talking simply out of misbehavior or out of spite, but a child that age isn't capable of something like that.

This just really seems like a lot of sleep to me. I think an hour in the am and then two hours in the pm are fine. I don't think she needs an extra hour in the afternoon. Dad also says that when she stays home with him she will sleep 2 hours in the AM and again in the PM. I don't wake her up, she wakes up on her own. There are also days where in the AM she doesn't nap but that is just the age. My other 2 her age do not nap in the AM, only the two hours in the PM and still go to bed at a normal hour.

Wow...that's a lot of sleep for a 2 year old...now I'm wondering if there's something else medical going on. Has she always slept this much, or is it something new? A 2 year old shouldn't be napping 3 times a day. Honestly, I'm wondering if she has a severe food allergy/intolerance that's gone undetected, or if she's severely anemic, has Celiac disease, or something else (yes, more dire things are crossing my mind here...). Something's not right. She's sleeping about 16 hours a day...that's not normal.

This just really seems like a lot of sleep to me. I think an hour in the am and then two hours in the pm are fine. I don't think she needs an extra hour in the afternoon. Dad also says that when she stays home with him she will sleep 2 hours in the AM and again in the PM. I don't wake her up, she wakes up on her own. There are also days where in the AM she doesn't nap but that is just the age. My other 2 her age do not nap in the AM, only the two hours in the PM and still go to bed at a normal hour.

The parents want her to sleep MORE??? At her age she should be sleeping about 12 hours a day. That's a solid night sleep and one nap. If she gets tired very fast, I would suggest her pedi. is consulted, because there may be something going on. If they are just wanting her to sleep more or she doesn't get enough physical exercise, then it's a change of lifestyle and attitude that is needed.

Wow...that's a lot of sleep for a 2 year old...now I'm wondering if there's something else medical going on. Has she always slept this much, or is it something new? A 2 year old shouldn't be napping 3 times a day. Honestly, I'm wondering if she has a severe food allergy/intolerance that's gone undetected, or if she's severely anemic, has Celiac disease, or something else (yes, more dire things are crossing my mind here...). Something's not right. She's sleeping about 16 hours a day...that's not normal.

Come to think of it.... She was tested at the Dr's and she did come back with low iron. The Dr said it was not a big deal. The mom looked up online and it said it can cause speach delay. She has been on vitamins for about 4 months but no change. Personally I would be changing Dr's.

Come to think of it.... She was tested at the Dr's and she did come back with low iron. The Dr said it was not a big deal. The mom looked up online and it said it can cause speach delay. She has been on vitamins for about 4 months but no change. Personally I would be changing Dr's.

Hmmm...is she really pale? Low on the weight charts? Trouble with poop (esp, does she go back and forth between seeming constipated and having loose stools)? Has she ever been labeled Failure to Thrive?

They should look into WHY her iron levels are low, especially if they aren't changing. Celiac disease is one condition that often causes anemia that doesn't seem to have any other cause and isn't improved by taking supplements. Celiac disease can also cause many other issues, and I can very much see a speech delay being tied into gluten issues as well as the anemia.

You think sign language is ridoulous???? You are wrong!! Sign language is used everday probably by every provider. When we sing "when your happy and you know it" we use our fingers to our face and make a smile. When we sing "The wheels on the bus" we use our hands to this song. hummmm

And you can not MAKE her use words for what she wants. That would be cruel not to give her what she wants till she says the word.

Teach her to speak!!!!!!!!!!! If she was deaf, would be different, sounds like she just always knows she will get what she wants by not speaking.Come on people, don't coddle these kids, teach them, isn't that what we are supposed to be doing! A 2 yr OLD SHOULD BE SAYING WORDS LIKE MOMMY, DADDY, WATER,UP, DOWN ETC. I teach my kids at 2 and so does the parents to say please, thank you even.Singing is good and using fingers for that sort of thing is excellent, but she should be talking more, is all I am saying. I have a nephew who is 2 and the parents let him point to everything he wants instead of saying the words, they think it is cute, well he needs to say the words for what he wants.
I am also saying if there is a development problem with this child, the parents should be addressing it instead of ignoring it. But also not doing anything about it is not being a responsible parent, they need to find out why she isn't talking and do something about it.
But to me sign language for her is not the fix for the problem. Sorry.

Teach her to speak!!!!!!!!!!! If she was deaf, would be different, sounds like she just always knows she will get what she wants by not speaking.Come on people, don't coddle these kids, teach them, isn't that what we are supposed to be doing! A 2 yr OLD SHOULD BE SAYING WORDS LIKE MOMMY, DADDY, WATER,UP, DOWN ETC. I teach my kids at 2 and so does the parents to say please, thank you even.Singing is good and using fingers for that sort of thing is excellent, but she should be talking more, is all I am saying. I have a nephew who is 2 and the parents let him point to everything he wants instead of saying the words, they think it is cute, well he needs to say the words for what he wants.
I am also saying if there is a development problem with this child, the parents should be addressing it instead of ignoring it. But also not doing anything about it is not being a responsible parent, they need to find out why she isn't talking and do something about it.
But to me sign language for her is not the fix for the problem. Sorry.

Oi, I'm done with you. You're a troll and you are just stirring up trouble. Make an account and we can continue to discuss this. I'd be glad to continue to discuss it, in fact, so please do make an account.

Hmmm...is she really pale? Low on the weight charts? Trouble with poop (esp, does she go back and forth between seeming constipated and having loose stools)? Has she ever been labeled Failure to Thrive?

They should look into WHY her iron levels are low, especially if they aren't changing. Celiac disease is one condition that often causes anemia that doesn't seem to have any other cause and isn't improved by taking supplements. Celiac disease can also cause many other issues, and I can very much see a speech delay being tied into gluten issues as well as the anemia.

She is very pale but her family is pale as well. No failure to thrive and normal on the charts. Her stools are often like little rabbit turds (Sorry if it's TMI)

I have never heard of Celiac disease. Would it be out of line to google some info and present it to mom.

Oi, I'm done with you. You're a troll and you are just stirring up trouble. Make an account and we can continue to discuss this. I'd be glad to continue to discuss it, in fact, so please do make an account.

So Sorry, did not mean to start stirring up anything. I apolize. Just wanted to express my thoughts,meant no harm,

She is very pale but her family is pale as well. No failure to thrive and normal on the charts. Her stools are often like little rabbit turds (Sorry if it's TMI)

I have never heard of Celiac disease. Would it be out of line to google some info and present it to mom.

Celiac disease is a very under-diagnosed condition where the body can't properly process gluten, a protein found in wheat, rye, and barley. Anemia is very common in people with undiagnosed Celiac which is why it jumped to my mind. Being overly tired is common as well (and that goes with the anemia). Celiac, when undiagnosed, causes damage in the intestines that make the body unable to absorb nutrients properly (malnutrition can also cause someone to not have enough energy).

Most/many doctors aren't well-educated about Celiac and the BEST possible diagnosis is a trial off of gluten as testing is frequently inaccurate, but that requires a lot of commitment on the part of the parents! Luckily, being gluten free has gotten MUCH easier in the past 4-5 years and awareness of the problem is growing by leaps and bounds.

Whether something like Celiac/gluten intolerance is the issue, or something else, getting her iron levels fixed (which might require switching to a different and BETTER vitamin) should help a lot...but she still could have other things going on that could be causing the speech issues.

Teach her to speak!!!!!!!!!!! If she was deaf, would be different, sounds like she just always knows she will get what she wants by not speaking.Come on people, don't coddle these kids, teach them, isn't that what we are supposed to be doing! A 2 yr OLD SHOULD BE SAYING WORDS LIKE MOMMY, DADDY, WATER,UP, DOWN ETC. I teach my kids at 2 and so does the parents to say please, thank you even.Singing is good and using fingers for that sort of thing is excellent, but she should be talking more, is all I am saying. I have a nephew who is 2 and the parents let him point to everything he wants instead of saying the words, they think it is cute, well he needs to say the words for what he wants.
I am also saying if there is a development problem with this child, the parents should be addressing it instead of ignoring it. But also not doing anything about it is not being a responsible parent, they need to find out why she isn't talking and do something about it.
But to me sign language for her is not the fix for the problem. Sorry.

Again unregistered....YOU CAN'T make a child speak!! And who says WE PEOPLE coddle these kids??? Not every 2 year old can speak! My son now 33 did not say a word till he was 2.5 and he did not get any teeth till he was 16 months and yes he had NO teeth, not even one!

My son is normal and has all his teeth. There was nothing wrong with him and he spoke we he wanted to. I would of NEVER forced him or with held things from him because he would not speak.

Some and I mean SOME children are just slower, SO WHAT?? God did not make buttons to push on each child to make them walk, talk, crawl or even a button for their teeth.

Again you hit a nerve with mw saying you would not give the child what he/she wanted unless they spoke, that is PLAIN MEAN!

Two of my own children are speech delayed and on the autism spectrum. At this age that level of speech is a major delay, at least 12m behind. I have a 2yo with more sounds and his testing comes out as 12m age range. Speaking from personal, current info here. The staring and not recognizing one's name also major red flags for me. As for the sleep, why do they think she needs more? Is she lethargic and sleepy while awake? Super cranky and tantruming? That seems like a lot of sleep for a 2yo.

I know that there has been major debate in several locations about suggesting or not suggesting delays to parents and if it's right or wrong. In this case as difficult as it will be to convince Mom there's something going on I think you need to speak with her again.

As for the sleep, why do they think she needs more? Is she lethargic and sleepy while awake? Super cranky and tantruming? That seems like a lot of sleep for a 2yo.

No to all those! She is not lethargic, not cranky, no tantrums nothing lol. Thats why I was looking for advice. I just don't get it!

I am thinking... I love the parents to death and consider the mom a good friend, but I am starting to think it may be the parents not wanting to let go of thier baby. This is the last child as mom made sure of it lol. Maybe she is being cranking and having tantrums at home because they will put up with it and she gets the results she wants. I will not put up with crying for no reason unless they are tired or sick. I swear she is not tired though when she leaves. IDK

I have kids with both of those issues: the soother WAY beyond when the dcg has already been weaned off of it, and a dcb where the parents wanted him to stick with two naps when he was clearly ready to go down to one (and keeping all the other am nappers up because he wasn't tired). Both are AMAZING families who I get along great with. But in both cases, I let the families know how I do things here, and did it. They may do things differently at home, but in all honesty, the kids are here with me more waking hours than at home -- they're going to adjust more quickly to the expectations I have for them, regardless of what's going on at home.

IMO, you should just let the parents know what will work for your setting and go ahead and follow through. I would also mention (like others have said) that dcg's sleep schedule is very different from what you're familiar with, and that another visit to the doctor might be in order.

Again unregistered....YOU CAN'T make a child speak!! And who says WE PEOPLE coddle these kids??? Not every 2 year old can speak! My son now 33 did not say a word till he was 2.5 and he did not get any teeth till he was 16 months and yes he had NO teeth, not even one!

My son is normal and has all his teeth. There was nothing wrong with him and he spoke we he wanted to. I would of NEVER forced him or with held things from him because he would not speak.

Some and I mean SOME children are just slower, SO WHAT?? God did not make buttons to push on each child to make them walk, talk, crawl or even a button for their teeth.

Again you hit a nerve with mw saying you would not give the child what he/she wanted unless they spoke, that is PLAIN MEAN!

If you read above, I said I was sorry, didn't mean to start anything or stir up anything. Was just expressing my opinion. Have done daycare for over 28 yrs and have seen and dealt with many issues regarding children and parents.I'm no expert by any means,just have a hard time understanding some people thinking on parenting and teaching children these days.It seems to me today that it is the daycares that are raising the children of today instead of the parents,
So again, I apolige for upsetting anyone,not what I meant to do.

interesting - a child at 2 years of age isn't capable of doing something out of misbehavior or spite? HMM.

i think sign language is good generally speaking.

however, i agree with "unregistered" that i wouldn't start teaching a child sign language just because they didn't babble or use words especially if the child didn't seem upset/frustrated at their inability (IF that's what it is) to communicate. she never mentioned the child being frustrated at not being "able" to communicate. she may be very well capable of communicating and just isn't ready to talk - i wouldn't teach her sign language at this point to prolong that behavior.

I am new to the forum so I hope it's ok to chime in... I am currently an early childhood special education teacher (planning to open a daycare in June). From what I've read here, I think this little girl may need to be evaluated for special needs. The staring nonverbal behavior could be autism, but it is also a sign of mental retardation in some children. It definitely wouldn't hurt to have her evaluated.
That said, I would also like to say that special educators are taught that teaching sign language to a child that is nonverbal (regardless of the reason, capability or not) will encourage the use of speech while giving that child a way to communicate. The key is to speak while signing. This will help rather than hinder.

I am new to the forum so I hope it's ok to chime in... I am currently an early childhood special education teacher (planning to open a daycare in June). From what I've read here, I think this little girl may need to be evaluated for special needs. The staring nonverbal behavior could be autism, but it is also a sign of mental retardation in some children. It definitely wouldn't hurt to have her evaluated.
That said, I would also like to say that special educators are taught that teaching sign language to a child that is nonverbal (regardless of the reason, capability or not) will encourage the use of speech while giving that child a way to communicate. The key is to speak while signing. This will help rather than hinder.

of course it's alright for you to chime in. It is also great to see a special ed. teacher on the forum. I really am looking forward to your posts. Not only for the insight you can give, but also because In the fall I will be going to school for Comm. Disorders (education) and hope someday to get a job in a school.

Sign language does not replace nor hinder speech development in children. It merely gives their brain another path to make sense of HOW to communicate. Some children are more visual and signs give them a tactile way of communicating WHILE they are learning HOW to speak. You can not make a child speak. You can encourage them to express their needs/wants but you cant withhold their every need until they speak to you.

As mentioned before many many conditions can prevent a child from speaking and this issue shouldnt be taken lightly. You asked earlier if it is too early for an autism/spectrum diagnosis. NO but actually getting one will depends on your area and your community resources. Do you have early intervention, birth-three intervention, IEIC anything like that? Some drs are starting to DX earlier or refer but a parent would have to bring this issue up. Talk with this parent about it. NO speech at this age is an absolute indicator (thats the actual terminology special education calls them to show HOW IMPORTANT IT IS TO DEAL WITH). Mom may have some ideas about this too but don't avoid the issue just to keep the client. It wont turn out good for any of you if you dont get this kid services and they do need them.

Someone mentioned celiac. IF that is a concern you will have some difficulty getting tested for it unless you have anecdotal evidence to support your concern. The test is very expensive and many Drs. wont do it until they have supporting reasons/concerns and they have already ruled out other issues. For that reason I would talk to mom about it right away- it might be something that takes a few months to get a for sure answer on. Time a little one can't wait- especially if they are already this far behind.

And get rid of the paci- it obviously isnt helping the issue any. My rule is 18 months and no paci- leave it at the door.