This may have well been covered in a previous thread. If so, someone please be so kind to direct me. If not, or if it warrants updated thoughts/opinions, then let's have it!

As far as I know the ORVW 15yo/107 proof is now out of production or so I have heard - but please correct me if that is wrong. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif If one comes across a few bottles of ORVW-15/107 for about $7 less than the current going price of PFR-15/107 (in my area), which do you choose? To clarify a bit more, let's take any collectibility factor out of the picture. Let's just say one has a bottle of the ORVW to satisfy the collection factor and now, is looking to buy some more for only drinking purposes. Is it better/comparable/less than the newer PFR-15/107?

Hard questions to say the least. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif I am strictly asking for opinions as to drinking and not collecting. I can get 2-3 bottles of the old right now at $7 less than the new. However, I have read somewhere (not necessarily on this Forum) that the new is preferred by many of the experts over the old. In any event, both are in short supply and it would be nice to be able to buy all I find of both....but, I do not need a divorce looming on the horizon! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/duel.gif

As normal, thanks very-very much for the assistance!!!! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/thankyousign.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/thankyousign.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/thankyousign.gif

I have always liked the ORVW 15 enough that I try to have as many on hand as I can find. I haven't yet had the Pappy 15, though I have a bottle in my collection to satisfy my need to have VW stock fairly complete(no 23yo http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/cry.gif).

One nice thing about the older bottles, if someone doesn't have one they might be willing to trade one of the newer Pappy 15 for it, so having the older stuff has an advantage there. Plus, it's definitly SW whiskey and while the current Pappy 15 is also, there's no telling if they will make a label change to reflect the time when they change to the Bernhiem and then to the BT.

I'd get the old stuff for now and later when it's now longer available and you need to replenish your supply get the Pappy.

TNbourbon

01-13-2006, 14:54

I wouldn't (and don't!) ever pass up a reasonably-priced (under $45) Old Rip 15, period. I've had the Pappy 15, though I've not bought one. I prefer the old one. But regardless of preference, the ORVW15 is a great bourbon, and it's now-or-never time with it.

RedVette

01-13-2006, 15:06

There are more than a few of us here which consider ORVW 15/107 as one of the best Bourbons ever made. There are also a few of us here who were slightly dissapointed with Pappy 15 as a replacement for the ORVW. Given the choice between the two I would take the ORVW, and I agree with Tim completely, I would buy all that I could at under $45 (or even $50). Anybody following this advice will not have to worry too much about going broke, there is very little ORVW left out there.

Virus_Of_Life

01-13-2006, 15:50

Thank you Tim and Rob, you made my decision easy, I have come across 1, probably the one and only bottle I will ever find so I am buying it. At $44 it sounds like a bargain! I come across lots of Pappy 15, but had never seen ORVW 15 (please forgive me I am still fairly new the the VA line). Now if you'll excuse me I need to make some phone calls to try and get that bottle secured!!!!.....

Virus_Of_Life

01-13-2006, 16:07

Now if you'll excuse me I need to make some phone calls to try and get that bottle secured!!!!.....

FALSE ALARM!! He says http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/27.gif it's a "glitch in the system" because he doesn't have any of that, even though the computer shows 1 bottle in stock! Now do I take his word for it, or drive a good hour+ to see for myself??? http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/banghead.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

Now if you'll excuse me I need to make some phone calls to try and get that bottle secured!!!!.....

FALSE ALARM!! He says http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/27.gif it's a "glitch in the system" because he doesn't have any of that, even though the computer shows 1 bottle in stock! Now do I take his word for it, or drive a good hour+ to see for myself??? http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/banghead.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

You are. I recognize all the symptoms. The person I see in the mirror each morning has same - if not worse. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/bigeyes.gif

I know what I would probably do....drive the hour+. Have you bought from him in the past? If you have, then you can probably trust him. Aaahhh! On second thought, I think you ought to just take his word for it and concentrate your efforts elsewhere. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/searching.gif

Virus_Of_Life

01-13-2006, 22:38

This has been a bad day, http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/smil41df29a15fb35.gif not only was my thought of getting a bottle of Old Rip 15 get shot down, but the one Bevmo that showed two bottles of VWFRR 13yo was an error also, their computers showed, the manager and I searched all over that store, but NO WHERE was it to be found! What a disappointment. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

I was slightly pleased to find a Black Maple Hill 11 year and a William Larue Weller http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif that the computer did not seem to have in the inventory also. So all was not lost, now I just need to go to a different store tomorrow and get a bottle of Sazerac 18 year (anyone know if we’ll get the younger Saz. In Cali?) before that all disappears. Boy GTS sure is plentiful right now. Oh and I got a bottle of VWSR 12yo, I think that might be on the menu for tonite! So these along with a few others put my 5% savings award to good use. Tomorrow I hunt for WT RR 101…

Now off to the gym and then over to the girlfriend’s to get an earful about spending too much money and time on whiskey http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/smiley_acbt.gif I am starting to think relationships just aren’t for me.

ProofPositive

01-14-2006, 07:17

Here's a sad, sad story. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/cry.gif Last night, I called a store outside of town where a friend of mine told me he thought he had seen some ORVW 15yo about a month ago. I asked for advice here before committing to look for any and sincerely appreciate the help. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/thankyousign.gif

Sure enough, this store has 2 bottles and I had them pulled & held for me to pick up on Tuesday of next week. The store owner told me that nobody had asked for that bourbon in years. In fact, and here's the story, he said he special ordered a case of it several years ago for a customer. After it arrived, the case became the victim of mishandling by one of his staff http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/banghead.gif.....it fell and all but 3 of the bottles were broken. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/cry.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/cry.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif The customer who had it ordered wanted the whole case. When he came in to pick it up and found out what had happened, the owner said the guy got real pissed-off http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif and stormed out without buying any of them! As far as the owner knows, the guy never came back again. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/nope.gif

Boy, what a good time to have been a house dog when that case hit the floor! If I had been present, you might have seen a grown man on all fours and crying at the same time. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/cry.gif Anyhow, as fate would have it, that guy's loss is now my gain. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/woohoo.gif

Without a doubt, there is a reason for everything.
http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif

nysquire

01-14-2006, 17:14

ORVW 15yr 107 (squat bottle) is one of the finest Bourbons made.... I bought the last 5 in this area last fall and I'm down to one unopened... I'd drive hours to aquire more of this Bourbon if I knew where there was some more....
If you have access to it and don't want it, call!!!!!!!!

OneCubeOnly

01-14-2006, 18:55

My very first Van Winkle bourbon was Pappy 20, and in hindsight I think it was really a mistake to start at the top. The Pappy seemed to program me for the taste profile I wanted. When I went looking for a younger, more lively Van Winkle and tried Pappy's younger siblings, they were good, but seemed to disappoint in a way.

Now that the Pappy 15 is around it fills the niche quite nicely.

That said, I've tasted ORVW 15 and Pappy 15 in a side-by-side and there were some times when I honestly couldn't tell them apart. From what I understand they are whiskey from the same batch, just selected for profile.

nysquire

01-14-2006, 19:10

Let me rephrase my last post... ORVW 15 is one of the finest $45 Bourbons. Pappy 20 is the FINEST Bourbon for $80....There's not enough words to describe Pappy 20....

I had the good fortune to find a couple of bottles of ORVW 15/107, but I only took one home. The next time I went looking for it, the other bottle was gone.

As for ORVW 15 vs. PVW 15, to me it's a tossup - each has lots to offer, even though they are not identical. That being said, if I ever come across another ORVW 15 sitting on a store shelf, it's going to follow me home.

ProofPositive

01-14-2006, 23:38

I feel very fortunate to have found these. The first time I ever saw ORVW was about 3 years ago when I first moved into my present neighborhood and visited the store closest to home. I went in there for a bottle of Maker's and JD. I remember seeing the price somewhere in the $35-45 range. Also, I distinctly recall telling my wife about ORVW when I got back home and remarking "people must be crazy if they think someone is going to pay that much for a fifth of bourbon....ha! ha! ha!". How ignorant, stupid, and foolish I was! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/banghead.gif - and that was just 3 years ago. I was old enough to know better! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/nope.gif If I knew then what I know now, I would have gone back that day and bought all they had. Oh well, live and learn. Besides, it makes the hunting all the more fun and finding something special a unique experience. Best of all, I make new friends on here all the time while sharing the experiences. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/icon_pidu.gif

Last Item: I've hooked up with a local store owner who thinks he knows where there is a whole case of ORVW 15yo that has been covered up & forgotten for several years in his warehouse inventory. I told him if he finds it, I'll figure out some way to buy all of them. It remains to be seen whether his hunch is correct. We'll have to wait & see if that one pans out for the good. I'll update as soon as I know more. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/searching.gif

I coulda swore that someone knowledgeable--I thought it was--Julian posted here when they made the switch that ORVW 15 and Pappy 15 were the same bourbon, just in different bottles, but now I can't find that post.

I would love to see the results of a blind tasting comparision. Never underestimate the power of expectations to affect perception; i.e., I can easily envision people "perceiving" differences between two identical products, especially with something with as many subtleties and fleeting hints of different flavors as good bourbon.

doubleblank

01-15-2006, 09:02

Julian has made several comments to me about the Pappy 15 and he's also posted here on the board. The whiskey is SW ..... therefore its the same as the ORVW 15/107 in that sense. His son, Preston, helped him in the barrel selection. That might make it different. Lastly, the first bottling of Pappy 15 was done in the summer of '04 and that Pappy 15yo was damn near a 16yo. He thinks that additional time may have resulted in a slightly different whiskey. Many of us here ran out and purchased that original Pappy 15 ..... and many posted they liked the original ORVW 15 better. The next Pappy 15's he bottled were younger and probably closer to the ORVW 15/107's we all love. I've had the newer Pappy 15 and I like it a lot. I have not done a side-by-side with ORVW 15/107, but I'd guess they'd now be hard to tell apart.

Randy

bluesbassdad

01-15-2006, 11:01

Here (http://www.straightbourbon.comhttp://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/showthreaded.php/Cat/0/Number/37480/page/) is a second-hand recounting of Julian's comment regarding the old and the new bottlings.

My flaky palate suggests to me that there are two different taste profiles involved, but I'm certainly not inclined to argue with Julian about his own bourbon. (It's been well over a years since I've partaken from my lone remaining bottle of ORVW 15/107; maybe it's my memory, not my palate, that's malfunctioning.)

I have yet to do a blind comparison. If I were to do so, perhaps I would discover that my true preference is for short bottles rather than tall ones. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

ProofPositive

01-17-2006, 00:15

I am headed out early tomorrow morning across the northern section of DeSoto county of the great state of Mississippi to pick up my ORVW 15yo. Hopefully, I'll find some other dusty corner secrets in other stores along the way. Also, picking up another Stagg 131.8 and maybe some others such as Weller Centennial and WLW. One shop down there has WTRB for $28. We can't get it for less than $34 around here. I may pick one of those up as well. Bottle prices in MS tend to be about 25-33% lower than in TN. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/woohoo.gif It always makes for a fun day....especially since we have gotten all this rain & I cannot do yard work. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/cry.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/cry.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Perhaps I should interject my standing offer of a 2002 GTS for a 1987 EWSB. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/toast.gif

Happy hunting!

One more thing, I reserve the right to decide the number of trades on this in the event that I am inundated by claimants. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/stickpoke.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/smilielol.gif

barturtle

01-17-2006, 19:42

Perhaps I should interject my standing offer of a 2002 GTS for a 1987 EWSB.

That was supposed to be a quote from Bobbyc followed by a zombie-like response(as a way to score myself another bottle of '02 Stagg).

However the answer to your question seems to be: both. Although, reading a tasting of the first several EWSB with Parker Beam, the quality seems to have improved after the '89 vintage, but it's still all good stuff. But it is beyond "rare" and at this point is "unobtainium".

ProofPositive

01-18-2006, 21:23

Is that because EWSB 1987 is so rare or so good?

Saw an old dusty bottle of EWSB 1986 today but did not buy it. Ran out of money buying some old bottles of Lawrenceburg VWSR. Maybe next week - if you guys think it would be worth some extra driving miles to retrieve it(?) http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif.