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After an absolute tosspot of a day negotiating with the galaxy’s most arrogant medical practitioners ever, I come home to find that Julia Gillard is giving the keynote address at the Australian Christian Lobby Conference in October.

I have studiously refrained from criticising the PM over the last few months. I have heeded my grandmother’s caution: “If you can’t say something pleasant don’t say anything at all.”

But now the feckin gloves are off. Any woman who can support the ACL to that extent is not my friend. Keynote speaker at the ACL National Conference?

228 Responses to “I think I’m done with you now, Ms Gillard.”

Part of this whole sorry debacle has me wishing that she has to headline Mardi Gras to compensate. Though somehow I think we both know she’ll be there in effigy if not in person.

I would on the other hand not be surprised if there are protests at the ACL conference. I hope whomever does so embarrasses Ms Gillard mightily and that in so doing they take great care not to give the media fodder for the kind of rednecked homophobic crap that I fear they’re likely to run with, because hate sells papers.

I must say that that the I didn’t immediately “get” this thread, not being immediately aware of the context of Wallace’s dark Tea party type slur against gays.
Like so much of the Australian right’s politics it is an unimaginative straight pinch from US agitprop’s dumpster full of tricks.
It’s the sort of rubbish that no Labor leader worthy of the name could remotely afford to endorse.

As Dylan said “but you who philosophise disgrace…” . Perhaps we should wait to see what she says. There is a place in the world for religious (and irreligious) freedom, as long as it is real, and not simply an excuse for mouthing anti-muslim sentiments, as it might have been for some of her predecessors. You never know. Maybe she will make this clear.

She can make this clear without being keynote at their conference. To me this ties in with her bizarre stand on same sex marriage which as an unmarried atheist makes little sense. I didn’t think there were so many votes in the ACL and their like-minded.
Do you recall how on the day after she took over from Rudd she announced that the Marriage Act wouldn’t be changed? I though that was most peculiar at the time – who cared about the Marriage Act the day after Rudd was kicked out? Was that to reassure the ACL?

If, as HG said, she showed up at the Mardi Gras,I think she would be wearing Little Johnnies bullet proof vest, no????.

And there is no point the media spruiking that ‘because we have a female PM feminism has made it’, when she toes the invisible-man line AND appeases the ACL.
Look how many women are in the government front bench.Look at how many back flips and coalition policies have been stolen. Does anyone seriously think the women will NOT end up copping this flak in history? Even if they are only partially involved,they will be totally blamed.
I know this.That’s how this country/media works.
She has in fact probably ensured that this perceived dalliance with a female leader will be seen as a failure,IMHO.

No, I don’t think so Rod.
You never tell this sort of punter that sort of thing.
More likely they will get a homily about the ALP tradition rooted in the “family values” of “Australian working families”, to try and ease losses in deep religious and housing values territory, maybe a quick mention of Conroy’s relentless crusade against pr#n on the internet to consolidate the idea of the ALP as staunch protector of Brady Bunch “family values”.
In the past Coalition politicians like Costello and Howard have also done this schmoozing and massaging of this type of ‘ressentimental’ voter group voter. If is one lot is there than the other will have to follow, by their logic.

If it wasn’t for the heavy load you carry right now,I could ask what took you so long.
Gillard is the nasal talking head of an unrecognisable party, usurping the Labor platform and principles.
For anyone who votes for principles before factions,fair go before poll driven paranoia,Gillard et al were jettisoned long ago.
I have said it before,there will be some surprises at the next election,Gillard/Labor getting anything short of a bloodbath is not one.
And even though it pains me to have to repeat it,one term of Abbott may give us the breathing space we need for a rebuild.
Gillard has no control,no vision beyond trotting out education issues every time she needs a topic change.
The latest developments are astounding.I dare say I am not alone (as a recent and loyal since 18YO Labor supporter) on my desire to see the back of the interlopers who stole Labor.
As for the backflip on big polluters AFTER we get screwed by power price rises?
They actually think it’s STILL all good.
ROFL.
Goodbye Julia/Labor/balance in politic for some foreseeable time.
The thing I will miss least is her bare faced insincerity and disregard for millions of workers and decades of hard fought Labor values.
1700 foreign workers in a down-turning economy.Joke.
Political vandalism par excellence.Her minuscule dig at Gina is the height of hypocrisy after ticking off those foreign workers.

I would ask the real Labor party to stand up,but I believe they are on all fours, and currently have their mouths full.

It took me so long because people asked me to stop bollocking Gillard as it played into Abbott’s hands to do that. I don’t really buy that but I stopped anyway, except about same sex marriage, and I’ll bollock anyone about that.

But this is atrocious. No woman in her right mind would support the ACL. They are the enemy of women, as well as gays.

Oh, I still blame John Howard, for convincing voters (through leading by example, of course) that it’s OK to have no principles and to put your own interests above others’ entitlement to push for theirs.

It upsets me to watch Julia do the things she does, but ultimately I think she’s doing a pretty good balancing act between working for what she things is important, and pushing the populist barrow for all it’s worth.

And if it makes any difference, I like to think of her coming home from engagements such as the ACL and sitting down in the cold, empty bath for a therapeutic session of wrist-cutting. Deep down I think she’s OK.

Speaking of Howards ego.
I think Gillard might also have a teensy weensy one,and so I insert this blast from the past.
Just switch a few names around.You’ll get the drift.

_______________________________
Ego- (Greg Macainsh)Skyhooks

If I did not have an ego I would not be here tonight
If I did not have an ego I might not think that I was right
If you did not have an ego you might not care the way you dressed
If you did not have an ego you’d just be like the rest

Chorus
Ego is not a dirty word
Ego is not a dirty word
Ego is not a dirty word
Don’t you believe what you’ve seen or heard

If Jesus had an ego he’d still be alive today
And if Nixon had no ego he might not be in decay
If you did not have an ego you might not care too much who won
If I did not have an ego I might just use a gun

Chorus

Some people keep their egos in a bottom drawer
A fridge full of Leonard Cohen
Have to get drunk just to walk out the door
Stay drunk to keep on goin’
So if you got an ego
You better keep it in good shape
Exercise it daily
And get it down on tape

I’ve honestly not watched this woman more than few times since the 2010 election. That particular election left me cold as this long time leftie found she couldn’t stomach the media-driven bullshit that was being delivered daily from both camps.

OK Now its getting almost zany.(A hyperbole/analogy/ideology warning for delicate readers….)
(For the purposes of this post,’you/r’ equates to those who say we ‘must’ vote for Labor Gillard because there is NO other choice.That statement is something which will be universally decided at the election.By them spooky creatures,the electorate.
I am very bewildered at how little acknowledgement is given to voting with your conscience etc.
I am well across the reality of preferences etc,but this defeatist ‘only Labor can save us’ crap is infantile.
It’s as though principles/policy/commitment/values/sustainability/humanity etc, can all sit down the back of your bus.
It’s as though you feel the need to blackmail us into submission with scary scenario speak.
For fecks sake we have a democracy,we have 2 houses etc.I think we all know that.
And EVEN if Abbott does a double dissolution,(post his possible/probable) wins it and drags us to hell via the the will of the people it just confirms that even the brain dead can (are allowed to) vote.
Either way that’s the way the cookie crumbles.
It is fact,Labor is bleeding to the Greens and will continue to do so.
Gillard is toast.It’s what the media and big business have ordained.
How many seats they win/lose will depend on how many egotistical fuckwits (advisors) Labor jettisons before it becomes a coalition green split community.

This mentality is very akin to “oh well he does beat me up,but shit I have a roof over my head and get some fortnightly money to shop with etc.”and he is better looking than the bloke next door.Better the devil you know.”

Newsflash even dyed in the wool Labor voters are wanting this macabre festival to end.It’s like forcing your pet to suffer months after it has reached a point of unbearable pain and suffering, but the phone call to the vet is too emotionally unpalatable to make.And so the unnecessary suffering goes on.

After 3 terms of suffering under the caustic Howard govt, (did we not survive despite the permanent scars?) one under Abbott will pass quicker than this stumble fest we currently endure.That Labor is so on the nose is more than just spin and media perversion.It is a fact.

Unless the MSM media does some miraculous about turn, or it starts raining money and world peace overnight, Labor under Gillard is mortally wounded.Not entirely her fault, but enough opportunities for her to maintain cred,had she wanted to.I think we still have political choice and the will power to use it wisely.

Oh well PW, Ray reckons the Greens, and I can see myself voting for most of their policies, and have in the past in the Senate, frequently, but that doesn’t really answer the question for mine.

The system we have, flawed as it is, remains dominated by the big two, and there’s just naff all we can do but Grin and bear Julia, hope they flick her in favour of anyone better, and as they say in the classics, cryin’ won’t help you, prayin’ won’t do you no good, when [Abbott gets in] mama, you got to move.

Yours is quite a common view (course of action),I too have chosen it previously, HG.
And we keep saying ‘it’ (as the Australian flock) because we keep saying ‘it’.
(‘It’ being the oh I must pick coalition ‘a’ or coalition ‘b’.)
People who are so petrified by the thought of the likes of Abbott can send a clear ambiguous message(and possibly a game changing one) at any election they choose.But they don’t,and I suspect they won’t this time.
This nation votes people out.
It happens for a few reasons.The media spins it that way.
Keating/Howard/Latham; etc.

Or their time was up.Howard,Bligh,etc?
Or they just plain deserve it for totally gutting their fan base, and quite possibly dethroning a megalomaniac they (the punters) voted for.The repercussion is Gillards fate.She can thank her backers for that.

We have been told to believe that there are only two options for so long now that it is gospel to us,the media keeps reinforcing,the big 2 do,marginal voters do.

This last hung parliament gave us a chance to shed that crap, and from day one of the handshake, we all picked our 2 different beanies and scarves back up and began barracking for our usual teams.(Plenty of media help)
But..
Apart from a mutant Labor2012 not having enough grunt to pull the skin off a rancid peach,apart from the fact that there are no grass roots tentacles left,and apart from the fact that their demise is self perpetuated,my measure of disgust is more that they will be the ones who inflict Abbott on us.
Throw in a slab of apathy, a truckload of media, a state or two of DILLIGAF,growing politic fatigue, and the great big lump of abandoned loyal servants of the Labor cause,who could ‘possibly’ have seen this coming.
Even the two indies have compromised more than Labor on most policies,pretty much sacrificing their own political futures.
Anyway, I believe you, and I, have spun this disc before.It’s probably got too many scratches in it by now,now,now,now,now,now….

I recommend you grab some Peter Tosh Bush Doctor, and play Pick Myself Up, because whatever happens after the election,that’s just what all of us will be doing.
No matter which talking head wins.

I think you tied yourself up in double negatives at the point where you have Abbott articulating “clear ambiguous” views, but that may just be prescient.

I wonder myself how long it may be before one or the other of the two Major parties effectively implodes and has to reinvent itself. If I had to put money on it I’d say that change would come from the left.

I think that there are Greens who are no longer purely environmentalists, much as there have for some time now been progressives who are no longer looking to the labour movement for inspiration. So either the ALP had better get used to coalition government or they need to reinvent themselves. And I think I actually prefer the latter. We tend to forget that the Nationals are as much an electoral necessity and political liability for the Liberals as the Greens have ever been to the ALP. Though I will say that at times the tail wags the dog for the better rather than the worse.

Yep, I tend to vote Green these days. The best we might get is the senate balance and half the time the major parties combine to subvert the usually sensible counter proposals that the Greens offer on a range of issues.

as I say, they’re the new left of centre version of the democrats. Keeping the Bastards honest in the Senate. But when it comes to the reps I figure that any shift that allows them to rival say the Nationals in relevance involves a seismic shift of sorts. Not a bad thing perhaps but nor is it one that I see being likely to overly influence the result of the next election.

So, who you gunna replace ‘em with?
As it happens, I have my own bones to pick with them just now. Many of these likely relate to our sibling relationships with Europe, North East Asia and most of all the US, probably relating to various defence, security and free trade treaties we are not allowed to know about.
There must be an underlying reason for Cubby Creek, internet surveillance, the Afghan war- right or wrong- problems with the new neolib education plan, the mega trawler off our coast when local canneries are closing down, the hard line on asylum seekers, aboriginal policy, harsher terms for single mums and probably stuff that doesn’t come immediately to mind.
Despite all the recent disasters with state elections, the message that they must govern for Australia and Australians rather than rich/ powerful outsiders and local oligarchs doesn’t seem to be sinking through with many of them, Gillard included.
But, as for addressing the ACL, it’s probable that she’d prefer to be doing something more enjoyable, like shoving her arms in a tub of boiling water, but the ACL is a substantial lobby with its hooks deeply into many (followers of MTR types?) in the crucial mortgage belt, where an election will ultimately be decided.
She can’t afford to ignore or be seen to be snubbing these people, self-absorbed asshats though they may be.
I sense you’re not feeling good, want you to know am thinking of and sympathising
with you at what is obviously a harsh time for you. Look after..

Why are medical specialists so up themselves? I have no time for such arrogance,yet can’t afford to alienate them. I keep thinking of Foucault’s Birth of the Clinic. The medical discourse, the medical gaze.

Plus they seem to have special issues with women who stand their ground. When it is safe, I will write something blazing about this experience.
Thank you PW. This connection to everybody here is quite wondrous. It anchors me, I am so thankful to have it.

We sense you are a good’ un.
I have enjoyed these movies where head surgeons are bunged up in a hospital ward at the mercy of former underlings. William Hurt was in a good example from about twenty years ago in a movie called “The Doctor”.
Very much like the “Send Them Back Where They Belong” idea or the cop in jail themes.

The answer to your question about ‘who ya gunna vote for’ is simple, really.
It’s actually a question for each and every individual who votes.I’d be very surprised if there are still 20% who answer Labor or Gillard come election time.If you think come election day, fear will kick in,I think you greatly underestimate the intelligence(or otherwise ) of a very,very disgruntled abandoned working class block,who at the most basic level will kick their arse into tomorrow.
After the states milking the electricity price rise cow,she now gives the prix raising the prices and making the problem worse, a Gold Pass.
Ha fucking ha.The p[oetic justice is she will live and die on the one issue that Abbott has steadfastl. pursued.
Lies connected to a carbon tax,

And just to remind you of an historic event which blew my mind years ago.
Remember when Howard visited Tassie and the union convinced their members to put him first to achieve the outcome they wanted?2 crucial labor seats lost to a coalition govt handing them an unheard of win.

Those Gllardophiles here and elsewhere need a better reason to protect a hollow vessel leading a lost cause, than ‘but the other mobs worse’.
Look at the trouncing in QLD.Newman maybe on the nose but he remains in power for years to come.
And if Aussies tolerate this toxic mess and tick it off at the ballot box,Labor will keep following the trend and the polls and veer even further towards shit city.
You cannot seriously say she ‘needs’ the votes aligned with the ACL,after her core supporters have signed off is almost delusional,but I think you maybe playing the comedy card,so I will cackle instead of vomit.ACL conservatives will NEVER vote for Labor,never.

An Anna Bligh disaster..god help us.
Yet they won’t learn from history, they still blithely cross their core supporters for natural enemies.
They were a given a get out of jail free card with Abbott’s failures of late, culminating in the disastrous Leigh Sales interview, but instead of re-establishing their credentials with their heartland, have pursued just the series of policies that absolutely grate most on the nerves of Labor voters.
Didn’t one of them have the cheek to blame the CFMEU for the recent industrial strife?
This from a “Labor” person?

It would be great if she’d actually stand up there, and berate them over this very issue, but I’m not holding my breath.

What I really hate about it is that she calculatingly knows that when it comes to being the religious right’s stooge Abbott is so much the worse of two evils that we the electorate have no real way of punishing her that doesn’t involve harming our own selves.

I can see how the greens are going to be very happy about this but then I don’t think they’re going to have as significant an impact in the house of reps as they do in the Senate within the short space of time that describes Ms Gillard’s likely shelf life.

In the meantime there is supposed to be a same sex marriage bill introduced sometime between now and the election. I get the feeling that if it does pass, as I hope it will, then the political reality will be that all of this will be forgotten by the time of the ballot.

And in favouring both gay marriage and progressive politics as I do, I keep saying pass that bill as soon as you can. I predict that the minute it does pass we can hope for a raft of spectacular celebrity same sex marriages plastered all over the gossip magazines to the fascination and general approval of most Australian readers. Basically I think the LGBTI community are on a winner here, firstly because the religious lobby aren’t that strong in this country, but mainly because Aussies love a party more than anything.

And Julia should take a leaf out of the book of that other redhead Kathy Griffin and Tell Jesus to Suck it!

I was referring to my imminent migration to NZ when Abbott gets in,not the small bit of Tasman between here, and the world capital of tree/fish depletion.
As to who’s leading Australia in social change,it sure isn’t Labor who are hovering up Howard’s 1956 arse.
My guess would be corners of social media but more so the MSM.And the social change is more retro,and for the worse.
I am not smitten by the same say one thing,but do the opposite of the current neo-con Labor morph.
They broke the hearts of the party faithful twenty,too many times.
Glad you aim to please.You are a good soul.

Just a friendly reminder that it was the Greens, by virtue of their coalition with Labor, demanded that Labor support the overhaul of Tasmania’s laws regarding gays. Just as it was pressure from the federal Greens that pressured the Labor party to finally change the federal party platform.

And maybe you all forget that the Labor party has always contained Christians who are morally conservative, but socially concerned about poverty and the working class.

It must be remembered that Abbott is actually an acolyte of Santamaria, who worked within the Labor movement engineering the DLP split.

Well I’m sure that the ALP wouldn’t necessarily acknowledge their policy agenda being shaped at the Greens’ prompting. But I guess there’s something to the theory if a general consensus of opinion on this can be said to have evolved in a way that the Greens were first to embrace politically. This taking nothing away from the LGBTI community for prompting all of us all to think on the issue in the first place.

And I agree we shouldn’t tar everyone with the same brush who identifies as Christian. But it does seem that the ones whose social conscience works quietly away in the background do have something of a tendency to remain hidden. Whether we blame the media or their lack of political forthrightness for that is hard to judge. The phrase let’s make a noise for moderation doesn’t often come up as a political slogan for what seem like obvious reasons. Maybe they need some prompting to get off the fence.

I’m sure Santmaria would have made a great mediaeval pope. The very thought that ideas as regressive as his were still gain currency through the instrument of his former pupil is frankly disheartening.

When you brains have the crap beaten out of them,until all they can retain is three word slogans and two letter negatives,you will take any free kick you get in the way of direction.And even more so if you were not the sharpest axe in the tool shed to start with.
Add that to the expectations(demands?) of his religious mentor,and I think you will agree,there’s not much he needs to do (is capable of) but parrot away, hoping that one day he achieves the Holy Grail of,( as wise man recently said) being able to walk upright and chew gum at the same time..
It speaks volumes of the party who he leads, and libraries about the non-existenet standards of his (coalition voters) loyal followers.

It is undoubtedly a peculiarly interesting phenomenon to watch people who bent is quite simply self centred in the extreme pretend that there’s any meaning or agenda beyond narrow self interest in Abbott’s rhetoric. Like tea-baggers in the States what they have in common with him is a determination to hang on to the vestiges of inequitable privilege in the face of the more pressing moral challenges they’re blocking their ears to.

It may be something as simple as the relief we would experience were the burden of being castigated over our much loved gas guzzling vehicles able to be lifted. A return to the innocent joy of the 1970’s. Or a life in the eternal sunshine of wilful ignorance.

What we have in Abbott is a letter penned in the false certainty or vain hope that anything so elitist and intellectual as an informed opinion could just fuck off and leave them to revel in the dying lights of their own inevitable downfall.

It’s not a consensus of opinion Hudson. It’s a matter of record. The Tasmanian Greens made gay law reform a condition of negotiations with Labor.

And socially conservative Christians have infiltrated both sides of politics.

David Marr has written an expose of Abbott that shows he was not initially concerned about the Liberal party. That his agenda is the church, the church, the church – and if had suited him and Santamaria, then he would have joined Labor.

I sense some confusion in your remarks between the consensus of option about politics and the consensus of opinion I think has come about in favour of gay marriage. The point I was trying to make was in terms of the push for same sex marriage being a grass roots movement kicked off by the gay community itself and latterly recognised and supported more broadly from within the wider electorate.

That’s not to say you don’t make a compelling point in support of the Tasmanian Greens’ strong action in negotiating for change with Labor. I just think that we should take it as read that this is an issue that they took up on behalf of the minority who originally lobbied for it and helped to bring along to the point where I think it now has wide enough support to be carried in Tasmania and most other States before too long.

As to whether Tony is more preoccupied with his religious agenda than he is with selling “everything but his arse” to win power, I think the jury’s still out on that. I think he’s very religious, but I also think he’s desperately obsessed with power in a way that is far from unique among the circles he’s mixing in.

I have seen him put on the back foot by interviewers where religious topics are raised, so while I have no doubt he’d favour them excessively where possible, I do think there are fewer limits on the kind of damage he’d do to environmental and social policy that are areas of even greater concern.

“serial killer”? sounds like hyperbole rather than hypocritophobe to me. I’ll freely admit that some of her choices have not been my choices, and I share your and Jennifer’s frustrations; but the nature of our political system requires Party solidarity and adherence to a platform : disunity is death.

We can all stand together, or rest assured we will all hang separately, to use some hyperbole of my own. :)

The third option is a rehabilitation programme for Labor via the ballot box.
They have till the next election to choose how long the program lasts.
My pen is poised.Many are.And they are not necessarily poised for Abbott.
And yes it was hyperbole.Just like the hyperbole that surrounds the notion that we should somehow start to reward mediocrity and betrayal,simply because Gillard wears an ALP T-Shirt.

Her spinners thought they could capture ACL votes.Again she followed their stupid advice.
If she cannot listen to the people.Labor people.Her people she should go.
Billions for polluters while pensioners go cold?(Please don’t blame the states,I’m talking from this point on)
This is not Labor DQ,not real Labor.

There are people who could, Helvi, but that question is irrelevant.
Those who decide these things, will pick their obedient drone.
They have.Currently Gillard.
Whenever any political issue bites their arse they scurry off and find an announcement/picture/graph/survey on education.

This is not the Labor we knew and loved.
It’s a zombie version.

We could have a whole new Australia by now,but Rudd was jettisoned, and the Gillard gamble began.It was a fatal political mistake.The decay began.
If wishing worked Helvi I would wish that your nightmare does not occur.
But..
Abbott is not bullying his way into govt any more.
Labor are escorting him to the Lodge from within their own addiction to plagiarise coalition policy/tactics.
How many ‘real’ Julias are there,anyway?

This part of our history will eventually sit in a big fat book right next to the Dismissal, for years to come.

She’d be a decent PM, except that we’ve been shafted so comprehensively in these two important areas. It’s so disappointing that a Prime Minister goes contrary to the party platform, outside reason and beyond ethics to endorse this hate group who are now just a few desperate tweets or press releases away from denouncing the gays as Satan’s spawn and calling upon God’s army to drive the heathens from the land.

Where’s our alternative Prime Minister? It’s not Wayne Swan, who was dismantled so comprehensively by none other than mikeybear only 2 days ago. Could we count on Penny Wong to keep her Christianity out of government?

You are lost in space Nick if you think the answer is in the current crop of labor impostors.
As for Wong, she has the intestinal fortitude, of cold custard and the charisma of water logged toilet paper during a dysentery outbreak.Like Gillard she is a token.
Her talent is non-existent.
What on earth has she ever done.I mean really?
Her and Garrett are identical twins.Principles on hold.

Yes, but Abbott is a Pell disciple. I will still stick with Gillard. What a choice for Australia though. Has anyone checked out apartments in Paris or at Palma at Majorca?
Still, at least Andrew Forrest and FMG are at least selling up and slinking away with tails between legs. What a shonky place to live out our retirement.

You’re right, Gerard. What choice do we have. I’ve spent the last couple of years in utter bewilderment, and it’s only Tony Abbott’s presence that irks me more than the state of politics in this country.

Labor are like having a narcissistic, kleptomaniac, junkie for a son.
You have spent your life supporting them personally,or seeking support at great cost to yourself at times.
Now,every time you turn your back they steal something and either deny it,or play the “don’t you love me any more” card.This goes on relentlessly.
Not until the house is unrecognizable, (and the son), and you have lost all your friends/faith in humanity/valuables, do you wake up.
But by then the damage is irreparable.To all.
Sometimes maybe we ‘do’ need to be cruel to be kind.
Labors self destruction is something I choose not be a part of any longer.

I should ad that I haven’t voted either Labor or Liberal in decades. I support the Greens and it is the Greens, by virtue of the accord, who effing finally got the Labor party to change irs platform on same sex unions. Seriously, don’t complain about the Labor party’s flapping about on this issue if you voted for them. Same applies to a carbon price, dental scheme and numerous other examples.

Rudd is a God-fearing man, and many are praying for his return…
If the leaders are god-less or god-fearing, is not my problem…the alternative to Julia is after all Abbott and he’s Pell’s baby…I think Australia is a very religious country…

Lutheranism is the national church of Finland, but hardly anyone goes to church, the religion is there just like some background noice for public occasions….

Helvi, don’t be perturbed at Hypocritiphobe’s sudden diversion to incomprehensible gibber in that last sentence. (S)he is speaking New Zealandish.
I will translate. (S)he is saying in response to your rightful query at to the absence of an alternative to Gillard, that (s)he feels that an Abbott victory would prove so unwelcome for the public as to ensure only a single term in government.
My response would be,”But what if we CAN’T get rid of Abbott”?
I can see, scanning this thread, that everyone is greatfully enthusiastic at the PM’s decision based solely on principle to skip the ACL bigot’s forum.
Now, a kick in the guts for the detestable internet surveillance idea and we could say both quantitatively AND qualitatively,that we have turned a corner and are on the road back to redemption and better hings in the future.
……………………………………………………………………………………………..

I think a back-flip on the internet thing is a good start,but the list is very,very long.
The non-carbon tax for example.
And as for all things internet security,they could do it under some secret act anyway,and we would be none the wiser.
Enter,Julian Assange….

” But what if we CAN’T get rid of Abbott”?
O ye of little faith.
Easy.We just sneak in Gillards current crack team of advisors.Abbott will be out in a flash.Look what they have done to Gillard.

I know what you are driving at.
Too many of them are in parliament to represent vested interests rather than their electorates or the people of Australia.
If they are not getting marching orders from the churches, it’s big business, internal factions or offshore interests.
We have honourable members for Tel Aviv, the Daily Telegraph, Washington, City of London, the Mining Lobby etc, but who represents Australians?
It’s all a bit too similar to Sir Robert Walpole’s 18th century era of “rotten boroughs”, “pocket boroughs” and general corruption and disenfranchisement that we learned about when we were kids at school.

Thank you most kindly,Paul. I almost managed the translation myself by just thinking it was my NZ friend Debbie speaking…Her husband has a very strong Scottish accent, but they seem to understand each other very well….
When our son was at the primary schoo, he came home with a new friend from school, I heard him say, my mum has got a funny accent but otherwise she’s nice…LOL

I remember being that kid, or a version thereof, when the woman in question replied that I was the one with a bit of a funny accent, and it totally floored me. I guess we can forgive little kids for being ignorant of a world beyond their experience, but when they’re adults and the ignorance is wilful…. well that’s another story.

The faithful can still have her.This does not change her depth of character or her demonstration of commitment to core Labor values.
Spin,spin,spin……
In fact Wallace handed her a freeby.So she owes him even more than before.Cannot see Marriage Equality going anywhere under this govt.

BTW I wonder if the BACWAs will do a Reverse Jenny Craig and start a petition to demand that Julia appears at the conference.

BTW2.Gillard was wrong.The comments were not heartless.They were brainless.

BTW3 Expect the ACL to do 2 things now.
Pull out themselves,and ramp up their anti-Labor pro Abbott campaign.

it’s more like a political automaton. The ACL fortuitously provided Labor with a perfect excuse to back out. I think Gillard was advised that appearing was going to cause way more harm than good, and it’s probably been in the wind for a while that this was the case.
I’m cynical enough to believe that this decision was not taken on ethical grounds, but merely as a decision as to which move would satisfy the political.re-election agenda..

If gays die even quicker than smokers as per the credo of the ACL, what about if I am gay and smoke? What about if I am gay, smoke and am denied my marriage vows to my lover, that would hasten my death even more. I thought Christianity was benevolent and caring.

There you are Jennifer – it must have been your article that did the trick.

One must wonder just how these engagements are arranged; does some dopey staffer receive an invitation, takes a look at the diary and then sends off the acceptance? Surely no sensible adviser could have vetted the invitation.

Now,if the advisor hasn’t set her Inbox to send ACL to junkmail, they should be hung drawn and quartered.
If we are being run by reactionary principles,lets just hope it’s consistent,although I think it’s a very dangerous precedent.

“When I read this I thought that Jim Wallace must have been hibernating under a rock or in a cave somewhere in the deep dark depths of the wilderness of Tasmania. He’s probably still walking on his knuckles.”

I’m thinking don’t talk down Tasmania Warren, they’re the one state that we know is on our side!

Yes I noticed that and to be honest I didn’t pick issue with it, maybe I should have. I saw the Tasmanian slur as an unkind stereotypical reference to any remote place being a cultural backwater. Doubly unfortunate in light of their stance in this very issue.

Whereas “gender challenged” I took for just meaningless ignorance on his part. It’s like Entsch forgot the letters LGBTI or was squeamish to actually use that which has in its own way become a politically correct way to refer to non-heterosexual people. I’m over it a bit too. Just looking forward to the day when marriage really means everyone as a civil and social contract conferring kinship between anyone who chooses it and we don’t have to qualify the term by saying gay marriage, straight marriage or otherwise.

Although environmentally WA is still a vandals playground,and a redneck wonderland.
They also have a QLD type record on indigenous issues.
They also worship and reward greed and selfishness and wallow in parochial narcissism.
Not twin states,but certainly from the same brother/sister progeny.

Damn you’re good. The sharks thing, has been pissing me off. I’ve swum with sharks and even shared some close calls with the crocs up north, and I’m never quite sure which of us is more wary of the other. Why people hate animals they really ought to respect is a bit of a mystery to me.

I’m sure that the ritual kissing of feet and rings still goes on quite a bit, but from what I can gather all but the most conservative Christian groups are running a mile from Wallace because with comments like those he’s a liability.

Just letting you know that not all West Aussies are shark hating, ore extracting bogans. (smile)

That’s a shame you came away with that impression, Marilyn. I tend to think I’m an Australian who happens to reside in the south-west of the continent, but I do note that some people do feel alienated when they visit interstate, for various reasons.

I think we should all move to Tasmania, it seems to be shaping up to the most progressive place in Oz, plus they have unusual Art Galleries there as well…and big apples of course, so big they have to be shared with a friend…or friends.

Agree DQ.
It’s actually quite exhausting just half a dozen comments in.
The place is trolled to death, and sadly the ABC obviously want controversy over comment.

The fanging right multi-pseudos are actually writing their own putrid political aspirant history,and no doubt in the future (after we get the new security laws, and saved content is hacked and shared by Anonymous et al, with the webboverse,) the world will know who they/you/me are etc.
I sense there aren’t very many ‘actual’ individuals,but each has the ignorance of a rather large angry mob.
Makes for interesting times.Especially if a few VIPs/pollies/advisers names pop up.

These days I might swing by (reluctantly)the Drum now and then,but it aint getting any more intellectual below the ‘waste line’.

In fact the futility is almost palpable in many articles nowadays,as the authors realise that another opportunity for some reasoned feedback is swamped my misery guts misogynist nutjobs.

Erica Betz… Nicola Roxon…Definitely a Power greater than I can imagine, sadly.
Although, wait up…
Who commanded that the Julia herself cease social intercourse with ACL and was obeyed?
A Goddess whispered in Brave Odysseus’ ear, “Why, my mistress, Dr Jennifer Wilson!”
Divine One, will you not cease the prattlings of floggers of mobile phones, IPads and foreign motor cars during my favourite Neil Oliver history doco’s?
No?
At least let not the profane mutterings of fat-soaked junk food multinationals permeate my Michael Moore “Frontline” docos? .
Crack of thunder; flash of lightning,unearthly, aethereal voice:
“No, and if I turn neo liberal I will hawk Auntie to Murdoch and you will have to put up with ads during Midsomer repeats and Saturday Football, too..”

Intro:
The sound of an emergency vehicle- ee aw ee aw ee aw – breaks through the crisp asylum garden precinct air, like a sting ray penetrating a wayward divers sternum,but alas the basic coherence of the mood of entitlement, still evaded the attentive fathomically challenged audience, in much the same way as a tadpole eyes off a violet crumble for sexual favours,and yet misses the point, in its journey to bypass evolutionary reality.
Prologue:
You get that on big jobs.Especially when you drink red wine.

Well this issue may have diffused itself somewhat, but the same sex marriage debate continues elsewhere.

Since I’ve been posting these last couple of days I’ve been confronted (elsewhere) by opposing views insisting that what basically makes homosexuality unnatural is the absence of the procreative aspect of sex. It is a commonly view that we’ve all heard before, yet for some reason I was struck by the inference that there’s more subtext to this than just an exchange of views about the nature of equality.

I suspect that one of the reasons that heterosexual people, including myself, take up the cause in support of gay marriage has to do with valuing sexuality for more than its reproductive utility. What we’re saying in effect here is that the true and essential nature of our sexuality is the emotional and physical pleasure that it, and only it, ultimately allows us to express with one another.

We’re people who have the knowledge to avoid STD’s and to control our own fertility. Especially for women, these have been among the most welcome advances of science in modern society.

To us being straight or gay isn’t the common denominator in what we would call marriage. It is two people’s intention to seal a bond of fidelity between them conferring kinship and acknowledging those things which we commonly associate in terms of sharing an exclusive sexual relationship. And I think it is encapsulated in that understanding of what it means to be allowed to choose who we love in such a relationship that means enough to all of us as to have us want to give it the equal recognition it deserves.

Quite aside from tensions between secular and religious territory in this issue, I think the real underlying issue that needs to be brought out more is that much of society values the role of sex within relationships in emotional and dare I say spiritual terms over and above its procreative utility.

Yep.
And if we had a media they would reflect just that view.
It matters not in the land of leather, laces, liniment and lush green grass though, HG.
The media has bigger fish to fry, It’s finals time!!

and the glorious picture of Gillard and her consort Emerson signing away the rights of human beings to trade them with the corrupt New Guinea government and Gillard daring to challenge Russia about Pussy Riot while she jails babies as a security risk.

I feel sorry for her mother, sister and nieces though who had to suffer the embarrassment of her as the worst PM since Billy Hughes days.

Of course I sympathise that her father died but you know what, sometimes karma is a bitch.

The sins of John Kerr were not forgiven just because he died, why should Gillards sins against humanity be forgiven because her father dies?

He seemed like a really nice man, he spent his whole life helping people with mental health issues, he brought his children to this country as boat people so that Gillard could have a better life free of bronchial problems and her response is to be more racist than Howard.

are those sins to be forgiven because a good man died while she was out there selling babies and torturing refugees?

I’m with you Marilyn, don’t take any notice of these appeasers and enablers, they’re the reason the Labor party is sunk. There is nothing like a bit of pathos and feelings of utter disgust when dealing with dills who can’t get a grip on reality.

For mine I hope they bring back Rudd, only for the fact we just may get a few more seats in opposition. I might add, this is not because Rudd is any better, it is all about perception. The electorate hates Gillard’s guts, the reasons for that will leave the true believers in the once great Labor party, baffled for years to come

The sad part is, the working class who are in the main as dumb as a bag of hammers, is going to put in a load of shysters, social mis-fits and in some cases, abject evil arse wipes into power hoping they will be Austalia’s salvation and bring Nirvana.

I nearly laughed my tits off the other day some tool in Queensland said he didn’t expect the new government that he voted for to act the way they have!!! Suck it up sweet heart I say.

If one were to believe ‘entirely’ in Karma,one would need to acknowledge that the people (refugees of war etc) Marilyn is so concerned for are surely subject to the same anomalies/(seemingly unfair attribution) of some Karmic outcomes???

I am not sure whether the Karma as per Marilyn’s outburst was allocated to Gillard or her father, but I think I might put it all down to obvious anger/frustration/anxiety, because I don’t think we need to link any particular religion and /or part thereof to the loss of ones parent.
I ‘might’ believe in Karma,but I certainly don’t believe in sins, and I just think it’s obvious there needs to be a hiatus of hate,for now.At least,a reduction of it.

Jumping to conclusions, methinks.
We have this vision of people, probably in black, modern day Burke and Hares with nothing better to do than sit in corners scheming to inflict misery on others.
“Selling Babies”, for example.
No doubt for human consumption?
Well, it’s Julia Gillard, Wicked Witch of the South, what other possible motive could there be?
I thought a little and came up with an alternative scenario. Of course this scenario bare contemplation since it doesn’t immediately show up Gillard in a completely black light, so I suppose we can dismiss it, unconsidered.
But I’ll air it, just for the whimsy..
What if PM Julia Gillard, acting on a sense of duty and concern for her fellow Australians has been trying to protect Australia and its population from the folly of big power wars in a messed up, overpopulated and ecologically depleted planet which shows no sign at the top of changing from exploitation to civilisational renewal.
What if, sadly looking at the current and probably continuing mess beyond our borders, she sought to save us from being patsied in the repair of damage rightly the responsibility of others?dismiss it of course- it attributes common sense maybe even (perish the thought) altruism as a driving impulse behind the Governments motives and actions.
Maybe Gillard feels like the skipper on a full life boat, watching others nearby drowning in the water, who’s rescue could sink the lifeboat and drown all rather than some?
A horrible decision, perhaps a cross to bear, rather than an excursion into sadism?

I didn’t say I believed it.
What I’m pointing out is that it’s risky to charge in without considering alternative readings to the one sold you.
I think that no individual is the total repository of all evil and another; all virtue.
I believe that Julia Gillard is neither the Wicked Witch of Marilyn’s imaginings, or the Angel of the opposite thesis.
I believe she is sometimes a good, sometimes a bad human being, usually somewhere in between.
Am sure, Phil, if you are like me, that you have woken up some mornings and detested the sight of yourself in a mirror. But surely you can never have patted yourself on the back for some thing well done for unselfish motives?
Forget false dichotomies, embrace complexity and never presume you are the font of all evil or all sanctity..

Hang on a mo Paul. I don’t believe our P.M. is evil, perish the thought. She is like most leaders pragmatic. I believe our P.M is a caring soul who can’t do much from opposition. Take the debate on gay marriage, she obviously believes in eqaul opportunity, but she is also cognizant of the fact that (if honest) most people are as afraid of gays as they are being ” swamped ” with refugees.

She has to play to a mixed audience. The left are open to attack her because they have a mixture of opinions, and unlike the conservatives who are mostly homophobic red necks who all sing from the same sheet. BTW I said most not all. For mine (serious) I could care less what she says or does to keep Abbott out of the lodge, that is her brief for my vote. The economy will, like it has always done, look after it self.

By the way, I want full rights for all minority groups, and when Rudd said sorry to the Aboriginal owners of this fair land it was one of the better days in my life of being involved in Labor party politics for over sixty years.We are moving towards what may well be a political disaster if Abbott becomes P.M. The ramifications of this gold plated nong running the affairs of this nation are something Alfred Hitckcock couldn’t dream up. It will be run for the benifit of the mining magnates and the working class will be screwed over as per usual.

As for Marylin attack her / him for being wrong but not the passion. It was passion with a mixture of good ol fisty cuffs that gave the working class their greatest gains. We are about to see it disa-mantled by so called lefties who think they are playing marbles on the green tennis courts of Eton. You can’t beat conservatives by becoming one of the arse holes.

The lefties are now what Labor once were.
Labor has become Liberal.They self-arseholed themselves.
No help needed.
Don’t blame the greens or anyone else for Labors morphing into an unrecongisable rabble of economic rationalist and big business appeasers.
Ferguson is as Liberal as it possible to be.
Get your head out of your arse Labor is not the same as it was when Rudd got ditched,let alone 60 years ago.
Imagination is a fine thing.?
You bet.
Desperation is another.But fantasy has no place in politics.

A spirited riposte.
I know Marilyn well enough and I know she is passionate but not always open to other viewpoints or tolerant of divergent views.
I envy her certitude.
I hate that Labor is probably f-cked, for example after watching Paul Howes the other night. I bleed for Labor in its current state, but there is still just enough about it for me to think twice before voting for Abbott.
So, you are another poor silly middle aged so and so approaching sixty, wondering what it would take to get democracy back on its feet in this country and probaby the West generally.
Put it there, brother/sister.

Indeed I am. Old notions os solidarity, mateship, compassion are all gone. You know it’s funny, I was at my daughters wok place a few weeks ago and the workers there all knew the price of everything and the value of nothing. It is becoming quite obvious the upper management of industry are brain washing the workers into total submission of their own interests. I got into some low key debate with some of them and I asked them what they knew of the industrtial revolution, Total silence. Go figure.

I lay the blame of our demise on certain Labor politicians, most of whom have since retired. We have always has agent provocatuars in the movement and other conseratives who would sell their Grannies for two bob, using the movement to ” Get On” so to speak. I don’t think Gillard is one of them. I think she let ambission get in the way of the common good.

Rudd would have eaten Abbott for breakfast, and it was dollars to donuts Labor would have been elected last time with a decent working majority.

Still hope springs eternal Abbott and his big cake hole may be yet a saviour for Labor.

Finally someone sees what I’m getting at.
Helvi, thanks for troubling to make that comment, it offers a sense of proportion ,it is what I was clumsily trying to suggest, too.
But yes, Phil I could slap them hard round the face, too.
I could have put my arms through the screen and choked Howes the other night and I’d lay quids Alberici felt the same.
Dogs they are.

Indeed they are. Paul Howes ego is only exceeded by the size of Gina Rhineharts arse. You missed my point Hypo, I’m not talking about the true lefties I’m talking about the conservatives who masquarade as lefties. The shit hit the fan in 1983 with the election of Bob Hawke. He is/was about as Labor as Tony Abbott. His greatest qoute was ” The politics of envey” You don’t need to be a Rhodes scholar to see where his true place in the political spectrum was.

I agree with Helvi bagging Gillard is playing into the hands of the toe rags. Disunity is death.

Labor is toast,unless of course some miracle happens between now and the election.
After which the only ones hanging around the Labor corpse will be necrophiliacs.
And I say this as someone who has supported Labor ALL my voting life,save the last few elections where I have incorporated green votes.
And seriously Phil, WTF? It is Labor ‘the Party’ who has shown immense disloyalty.-to it’s own values and grass roots supporters.The media and Abbott have just amplified the tragedy of it all.
It is their own disunity and abandonment of core principles which has them mortally wounded,nothing less.
Labor once stood for a fair go.They no longer do.
I still do.Quite frankly I have given Labor all the fair go’s they are entitled to,electorally.

I agree totally with your sentiments Hypo, except while there is life there is hope. There is no doubt they have lost their way (for now). The party as been hijacked by a load of shysters and spivs in suits, most of whom not being able to find their own arse holes with both hands. And don’t get me started about the policy on Iraq/Afghanistan. I would have thought after Vietnam the Labor party would have got the message?

The thought of Abbott, Hockey Bishop and Pyne strutting the world stage has me filled with dread horror. You know I have a draw full of medals at home, not mine my dear old dad’s. He was wounded WW2 fighting the ideology we are headed down the road to.

Ray rightly opines that the Greens have some of the policies I suspect many of us would have the ALP pick up and run with. And I’ve concurred but I still think that in the next election more than ever what we have to be sure of is not to be distracted from the threat of Abbott being handed the reins.

I don’t agree. Politics is about perception, Rudd was liked by the electorate and would have won the election easy. The electorate for some reason unknown to me, hates Gillard and I don’t know anyone in the Labor movement who likes her.

I agree that Abbott is a total wanker and Australia will be made to look a laughing stock with him as leader. He struts around like he is carrying a sheep under each arm and he makes me quite ill looking at him. As for his status as the personification of a he man, what a laugh, he looks like a match stick with the wood shaved off.

I don’t think those voters leaving Labor will think Fitzgibbon is doing anything but chiming their own death knell.
It’s almost like he thinks that by publicly telling us what we already know, it will somehow work in Labor’s favour.The blunt truth is that it is an act of contempt,whereby many of those shifting will now just simply tick 1 Green,outright.
It’s like a political dare.
And if Labor really want a divorce I think now is the perfect time as far as the Greens are concerned.It will hurt Labor more than the Greens.
There is as much chance of a Coalition +Green split, in the next election, as Labor green govt.
More so than a Labor govt in its own right in the foreseeable future.
It may not work,but it still could happen.And the good thing is it would likely mean the death of an Abbott govt in record time.
And I think the Nation would fall in love with the greens, for securing that scenario.
And only a fool would read a demise of the greens on the back of Sydney’s local govt result.
There are some big picture environmental concerns which will pop up come election time,and they affect a big slab of voters.
Today’s green light for the super trawler is another stuff up by Labor who said last week they could NOT stop it.It turns out after today’s senate vote,what they meant was we DON”T want to stop it.However,in any case, I doubt they will ever recover for the latest back-flip on the carbon tax.Voters/Abbott and the media will burn that into the heart of Labor’s chances going forward.
Rudd should start a break away party,just to muddy the waters,and maybe Turnbull will do the same.
Real Labor V real Liberal?

I agree in part. As the world slowly sinks into the abyss of over fishing, resource rape, over population,, water shortages and the certain damage of global warming and the financial collapse that I firmly believe is coming down the pike (And no I’m not a conspiracy theorist) Then the greens will be in with a chance of gaining power.

Abbott just may be the agent of change. He may be just working for the Green movement but just doesn’t know it yet.

Helvi:
“…all this
Gillard-bashing …is only opening the door for Abbott”.
Hypo, thanks for your morale raising comments.
Hopefully you will end up doing as much damage to yourself as others, as an Abbott government sets about its austerity work.

Nice try.(cop out)
Labor have made the bed and all of us get to lay in it.
Which part of new Labor do you equate with fair go?
Carbon tax betrayal?
1700 foreign workers?
Protecting the rich?
etc,etc
The austerity has well and truly begun under the ‘Labor 2012 morph’ aka coalition for the faceless men.
The more you poke the finger at those ex[posing Labors disgusting metamorphosis the more desperate it all sounds.
They could swallow their pride and become themselves again ‘if’ they wished,but they chose the factional existence instead.Que sera sera

In other words DON”T BLAME ME.
And for the record re-read the title of this article.

Allright, you want Abbott. Have him.
You STILL haven’t told me why I should vote Abbott.
And don’t tell me that the Greens are viable, you still have to preference.
Besides, am still sorry for asylum seekers, so I can’t vote for the people who maintained the fear and loathing and who not once in five years have taken the heat of Labor so it could come off the defensive and done something more humane about this tragic issue.

Don’t YOU talk to ME about “cop outs”..I wonder that the things you blame Labor for, you deliberately avoid pointing out as to Abetz, Abbott, Morrison and co.

Good Lord.
I can have Abbott?
No thanks.
It’s simple Paul,
Vote for the principles you believe in.
As for refugees.Fuck me,Labor is the same policy,only over multiple venues.
Every time the Libs said something the Labor party grabbed it and ran further to the right.
The suicides/depression etc will still occur.

I am well over the emotional blackmail crap they there is and will only ever be two parties to choose from.Your dichotomy not mine.
Repeat ‘Labor screwed themselves from within’.Period.

Harden up.Recognising the truth about current Labor does not mean endorsing Abbott.And if Abbot gets in it is 49/50% Labor’s own doing.The rest is media and coalition spin/amplification.
Deny it all you want.
Abetz Abbott Morrison make my skin crawl.

(I guess my period of respect is served?)
Totally disagree.
But we know that,times ten.
And arguing leadership between parties is fine by me.Criticise Milne all you want.
She has one big thing going for her.She is not one of the other two.

We may well end up with Abbott under the ridiculous ultimatum scenario being driven.
I doubt Gillard could do anything to change your mind DQ.
Sadly for you,she has done so MANY things she has changed min and many others,about 5 betrayal / back flips ago.
And if the faithful are to bring her leadership, back to life they have some serious campaigning to do.
What scares me is that you are so blind-sided, that you cannot even imagine what the next Labor govt would be like if they just scrape in.Imagine how many filthy rich and Bible thumping scum they have to pay back next time around.
They will be more like Abbott than Abbott himself.
What you are saying is any Labor is better than no Labor. Well the people who disagree with that are going to need a smidgen of convincin’ DQ.
If nothing else the post election discussion look to be interesting.If the 2 main combatants remain in place I can’t see the pre-election banter changing much.
I think also it sounds more like a greens versus Labor election if you listen to Droll Fitzgibbon, and I think that is a very telling admission.(Play theme OK Corral.)

On one interpretation I think you’re being a bi too cynical. There is a third way and has been for years.

In the Senate it has been a succession of third parties from the Democrats to the Greens that the Australian Public puts in to “keep the Bastards honest”.

And in the house of representatives there’s the Nationals. A kind of permanent appendage to the Liberals in coalition but one that became an electoral necessity for them because of the way that they appeal to a different kind of voter from the bush.

If I had to predict any kind of likely role for the Greens in the house of reps at the next election then it would clearly be as a coalition partner to the ALP. They’re being put there by people who happen to support views that are further too the left, and come from a generally more urban voter base, to temper Labor’s drift to the right.

And I think this makes the Greens far more relevant a powerful in Australian politics than other third parties have ever been, because they’ll likely retain the balance of power in the Senate at the same time. Can you imagine the electorate entrusting the Nationals with that?

Yes, the Senate. With Brown as leader they made some sense, but I suppose he got tired of herding cats.

I fully expect them to go cap in hand to him and beg him to come back, and perhaps he does too, after their vote falls to about 5% or less.

The Greens are virtually guaranteed to hold the balance of power in the Senate until 2017 or so; but whenever Labor and the Coalition can agree on a way forward they will be irrelevant. With primary vote at around 5% they will be vulnerable to threats of a double dissolution, whereas with Brown there and polls at 9% or so they could have thumbed their noses at such threats.

Interesting thoughts but it could be more complex than that. There’s some credence in my view to the idea that if Labor’s stocks are as low as some here think that they may be then we could see more Greens into the reps. And if they drift into the role of acting in more or less permanent coalition with the ALP then I think you’d agree that they’d have more clout that the Nationals currently do in coalition with the Liberals.

Anything could happen because I think a lot of people out there who don’t have anyone that they can vote for who remotely represents their views.

What a support act,Julia Gillard/Chris Bowen;”We will use Manus/Nauru/Malaysia, and take back more than we send. Even though they are not ready we cannot be seen showing a glimmer of hope, they might get the wrong idea.”

What a team. They couldn’t organise a pub chook raffle, a piss up in a brewery no less. Take out Albanese what have you got? Seven eighths of five fifths of fuck all. Although Emerson is funny, pity the bloke can’t sing. When one considers their counterparts it doesn’t say much. A load of effeminate buffoons led by a left over medieval bully boy.

I presume everyone else noticed Chris Uhlmann’s enthusiasm to ask the first question at the govt press conf about the Super Trawler, and then build another Labor loathing story around it,churning away all day, to air it on 7:30.
His modus operandi is getting a tad predictable.
I guess you need a certain amount of brownie points to avoid purgatory.
Not sure who he likes least.Labor or the Greens.It must be a hard choice given his own political history.

Time to rediscover the coalition Chris.You know? The Abbott party, who Leigh Sales almost had talking about policies.

He does have a point about policy on the run, and reactive govt,and Labor best find a better strategy, real quick.
The one thing Uhlmann did not give enough time to,was the fact the the decision was right,except that the ban should be permanent.
(I guess Uhlmann might think the animal cruelty being stopped in Indo was wrong too.He certainly slanted his story that way)
Does Chris really think that there will be more fish in the sea in 2 years time?
(Science please)
That sounds a bit like the sermon on the mount to me, and given the first version was fairy tale,I won’t buy a revised version.

Yes I watched it, a joke. Uhlmann is full of it. Uhlmann should dig up a few of the old doco’s the BBC have done recently on the state of the worlds fisheries he may have learnt something, They’re FUCKED.

From various docos I’ve seen, the wastage with these big operations is quite phenomenal. They after one or two species, everything else is pitched overboard, including quite edible stuff and of course the ecology is destroyed.
The sort of fishing that sustained communities on the west coast of Africa is ruined.On the east coast, the real reason for “piracy” is attempts by ruined locals to deter big outside fleets from doing yet more damage, or scrounge some sort of rough compensation back from the foreign operations.
With the super trawler here, Rob Oakeshitt (think I spelled that right), is voting against the legislation to control its activities.
Uhlmann?
Couldn’t stand the sight of him tonight and hit the “off” button after a few minutes.
And yes Hypo, I DO wish fed Labor would smarten up its outlook.
No use waiting for Campbell Newman and co to win it for them.

The BBC did a good one of the Canadian East Coast Fisheries, absolutely stuffed. The canning factories used previously for the fish are currently used to store furniture and other stuff. No doubt from the homes with for- closed mortgages. The ignorance of our journalists and so called leaders is absolutely breath taking.

I have to ask myself, If these ministers or any politician for that matter , have to go to go to public servants for all their information what are we paying these spivs for?

But I guess if your quaffing down champers, eating copious amounts of crayfish and nice cheese, and getting transported around half pissed up all day and having your sexual needs looked after by the long suffering tax payer, Well….. It must be hard work.

While there, they spy a red phone and ask what the phone is for. The devil tells them it is for calling back to Earth.

Putin asks to call Russia and talks for 15 minutes. When he is finished the devil informs
him that the cost is a million dollars, so Putin writes a cheque.

Obama calls the US and talks for an hour. When he is finished the devil informs him
that the cost is 4 million dollars, so he writes a cheque.

Finally John Howard gets his turn and talks for 4 hours. When he is finished the devil informs him that the cost is 20 cents. Howard just smiles.
Obama and Putin go ballistic, and ask the devil why Howard got to call Australia for only 20 cents??
The devil smiles and replies:
“Since Julia Gillard took over, the whole country has gone to hell.
So now it’s a local call.”

WTF ZG ?,
How did Obama end up in the same place?
Don’t tell me he’s having an affair with an intern!

BTW Australia is not quite a Hell yet.
(Although we have definitely taken a wrong turn/s)
We lack good (any) leadership (by a states-person) which will in turn contribute to a more cohesive society where we feel less polarised than we do now.
You know, a place where we care about others, less fortunate.
Some of you may almost recall those times.
Neither major side has anyone currently occupying that ‘states-person’ seat.

Self interest will be our downfall.It’s not a good look.
Self interest and share portfolio ownership was Howard’s only vision.
A career which it seems(is/was?) built on lies,divisive politics and personal gain by public deception.
Many of his colleagues(dregs) still pollute the front benches and/or vacillate on command for the parasitic MSM moguls.
The problem for Howard is that if he made a call from Hell he would sponge the money off someone else, and the person receiving the call,would see his name on Caller ID and NOT bother to pick up.
I think if we charged a dollar for people to dance on Howard’s grave, I reckon we could buy America in a week, and still have change for China.