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Maybe the aborted timelines are horrible places where Elizabeth Bathory was just a normal serial killer, Nero was a male emperor that wasn't particularly noteworthy apart from persecuting a religious minority and people like Sakata Kintoki probably never existed!

What a dark and horrifying timeline. We must never let it come to pass.

Maybe the aborted timelines are horrible places where Elizabeth Bathory was just a normal serial killer, Nero was a male emperor that wasn't particularly noteworthy apart from persecuting a religious minority and people like Sakata Kintoki probably never existed!

Maybe the aborted timelines are horrible places where Elizabeth Bathory was just a normal serial killer, Nero was a male emperor that wasn't particularly noteworthy apart from persecuting a religious minority and people like Sakata Kintoki probably never existed!

Hold in. If what I'm reading is correct then these servants from alternative timelines shouldn't have a reason to fight us. Even if their world was prune, they are part of the Throne of Heroes which exist outside of Time, right?

So, between this two Anastasias, who you people bet/think/want its gonna be the one we saw?Anastasia Romanovna (first lostbelt happens around the time her husband lead the massacre of Novgorod)Grand Duchess Anastasia (knew Rasputin who we know is coming thanks to the mats)

Also datamine spoiler

Spoiler:

Ivan the terrible, the first Anastasia`s husband, was datamine when the game was released

Hold in. If what I'm reading is correct then these servants from alternative timelines shouldn't have a reason to fight us. Even if their world was prune, they are part of the Throne of Heroes which exist outside of Time, right?

He's just putting the bone of his sword into other people until it explodes and lets out parts of him inside them.

Originally Posted by AvengerEmiya

Genderswaps are terrible, but I think I and other people would hate them less if Fate didn't keep ignoring actual heroines throughout history and folklore. Like, why bother turning Francis Drake into a woman when Ching Shih and Grace O'Malley exist?

Originally Posted by Magikewl

so she’s ugly boring and bad truly a triple threat your fav could never

Well, I kind of give the last two a pass because one is a legendary monster and the other is a famed occultist. All I know about Anastasia is that people claimed to be her and then DNA evidence showed that no, she died a long time ago.

That being said, no, it doesn't really matter that much to me. Either I'll like her and will roll or I won't and won't. Though I can say right now I don't really like her design that much.

Guda recalls that Nobu found some weird golden "stuff" that she ended up drinking -- and the next thing she knew, she was in Edo with Suzuka-Gozen. However, did the incident with the golden drink actually happen? After all, we know exactly what Guda was doing as of New Year's Eve. The "fact" of Nobu's golden drink may be itself a fabrication.

Incidentally, the "plot" of the dream doesn't really matter. It's just a dream.

Prologue:

Hokusai is called unto the waters of the Deep by an unknown voice. There, a certain Gentleman manifests, warning him not to go any further.

"You're hearing voices, then? That isn't a good sign. The one that's calling to you is a demon of the Deep."

"A demon is it? I've always wanted to see a real demon."

The metaplot of the dream:

On the evening of his "painting match" with a rival school -- an event that's taking place on the mandate of the Edo Shogunate -- Hokusai, the famed artist of the Floating World, has vanished. Guda and Suzuka try to help Hokusai's daughter O-Ei find him -- but every named character they encounter in Edo seems to possibly be a figment of Guda's memories of Chaldea?

In the final stages of the dream, O-Ei takes her father's place in the painting match, as her father is nowhere to be found. After defeating Utagawa Hiroshige in the first round of the match, the representatives of the Shogunate allow O-Ei to proceed to a second match, but only on the condition that she forfeits her life if she loses. In the second round, her opponent is Utagawa Toyokuni -- but when Guda objects to the rule about committing harakiri, Toyokuni breaks the "settings" of the dream, and reveals his identity as a representative of either "the soul of Hokusai," or a being from outside of the Universe; or some other party assuming either identity (maybe Raum).

Toyokuni gives that Hokusai sought to continue the pursuit of art beyond the boundary of death, to such an extent that he fundamentally rejected passing on unto the Throne of Heroes. He notes that of the sketches of Hokusai that survived unto modern day, there exist images of Kaima (海魔, kaima, "ocean demons") -- the monsters summoned forth by Gilles in Fate / Zero. The clarity and realism of these images are of such height that it's as if Superstition (迷信, meishin) had grasped ahold of his vision.

Toyokuni gives that Hokusai, who was known to gather vast quantities of reference materials for his work, might have obtained a copy of a certain book from a collection that originated of the Nation of Tang -- a certain thaumaturgical grimoire that documented the existence of the Sunken Spiral City. This, Toyokuni suggests, is the reason that Hokusai's art of the youkai of Edo always had an air of falsehood, that prevented him from competing in the subject matter against other artists of the period; it was because he knew of the existence of true monsters.

Toyokuni asserts that the Evil God of the Abyss (深淵の邪神, shinen no jashin) desires to descend unto the Servants of Chaldea along the pathway that is Guda's dream. The course that the dream has thus far taken was merely the process of its surfacing -- or rather, its "floating upward" (浮上, fujou). The Yorishiro that is Hokusai is nearly complete; and all that remains is to eliminate the final obstacle to the "floating up" of the God of the Deep -- Hokusai's daughter, O-Ei. She, Toyokuni states, is the only thing holding Hokusai back from reaching his desires.

The allegation pains O-Ei, and as the dream is consumed by the taint of the God of the Deep, her ego begins to fade unto the certainty that her father has once again cast her aside; but Suzuka calls her back -- saying that an empty "superstition" is nothing compared to the reality of her thoughts and feelings. Guda joins in calling O-Ei to return -- and in that moment, Katsushika Hokusai is called to awaken, taking ahold of his daughter's flesh.

Hokusai gives that the God of the Deep tried to make him a yorishiro -- but as an artist, Hokusai prides himself in reflecting the world about him within his art. The God of the Deep, by comparison, forces the world about it to conform to its art -- and is therefore no true artist. Hokusai declares thus that they are inherently incompatible. Alongside Guda and Suzuka, he assists in defeating Toyokuni -- driving the God of the Deep from Guda's dream.

In the aftermath, it was revealed that Hokusai's mind was confined to Tako-suke the Tako (the floating octopus mascot) -- but that Hokusai and O-Ei are in their present state one and the same existence, somehow (even if they occupy two distinct physical vessels). (Historically speaking, both of them did indeed operate under the pseudonym of Hokusai ...)

Epilogue:

On the boundary of the Abyss, the Gentleman that Traverses Time & Space congratulates and thanks Hokusai for resisting the influence of the God of the Deep -- though it surprises him that a man who was neither a magus nor a Saint could bring to heel even a portion of the power of an Evil God.

He gives that a certain Demon Pillar has repeatedly attempted to summon forth an existence of Superstition. Despite his failure, to those Existences of Emptiness (虚空の存在, kokuu no sonzai), even a momentary opportunity is sufficient to obtain a foothold -- and as such, a pathway into Hokusai's soul has been opened.

The Gentleman states that Hokusai was intended by the Demon Pillar as something like a prototype / forerunner to his plans.

Hokusai observes that the Gentleman himself is quite distant from humanity, what with the terminology he's throwing around. On being told that he did well to assert control over the power of the God of the Deep, Hokusai asks if the Gentleman hasn't perhaps mistaken himself for a human. Hokusai believes the Gentleman to be a manifestation of the mechanisms of the World (世界の絡繰り, sekai no karakuri) itself; or of the Laws of Nature (自然の理, shizen no kotowari). When the Gentleman is uncomprehending of his words, Hokusai quits the line of conversation.

Instead he asks if there's a chance that he might somehow accompany Guda to witness strange sights and the defeat of monsters -- because that sounds like good material for his art. Ergo, he asks if he might be able to become a Servant -- as his daughter desires this as well. To this, the Gentleman replies that he can't precisely welcome such a circumstance, but he doesn't know the future. Perhaps a miracle might allow for it?

BB and Gilgamesh's explanation of "Foreigner":

Gilgamesh gives that "a certain Demon Pillar" opened a pathway unto the Abyss -- and from the Abyss, there came existences that sought hosts through which to manifest. Hokusai was one such individual. So as gods and Buddhas on occasion momentarily come to inhabit the flesh of holy men, a crystallization of evil came to know of a potential yorishiro. Gilgamesh describes the existence responsible as the very Evil God of the Abyss -- comparable to BB in its capacity to "dye the World in its colors."

To this, Suzuka exclaims that it's pointless for a Divinity to attempt to inhabit a mortal in the way that Gilgamesh describes. The act of taking the mortal as a host would be equivalent to putting a branch of a tree against the sun; rather than being able to function as a host, the mortal would be annihilated.

BB believes otherwise; as the wick of a candle can persist in its brilliance even as it's consumed by a flame. She gives that the qualifications for the class of "Foreigner" are those unto which "existences of superstition" descend -- but specifically, they are either those who can maintain the integrity of their being as of consumption unto madness; or those who on consumption unto madness instead consume the madness.

However, come the time that such a thing occurs, the host would hardly qualify as a human anymore ...

So, what was going on in this quest, anyhow?

Cthulhu tried to get at Chaldea through Guda's dreams by taking over Hokusai. It isn't clear as to why Hokusai was even necessary for this purpose, or why Cthulhu wanted to attack Chaldea (because of Raum?) -- but in meta-time, Hokusai's encounter with Cthulhu was prepared by Raum prior to Salem. The takeover of Hokusai was apparently held back by the existence of Hokusai's daughter O-Ei (or, perhaps, his remaining emotions for his daughter). Thus, O-Ei was brought forth into Guda's dream to be sacrificed.

Assuming that the Gentleman was telling the truth, Hokusai wasn't in the "proper" history of Man selected as a potential avatar by Cthulhu. Merely, Raum's actions resulted in either the living Hokusai or a Servant fabricated in his likeness to be adapted for use as Cthulhu's avatar. O-Ei becoming her father's vessel is purely a consequence of Hokusai awakening into control of a fragment of Cthulhu's powers.

That is to say, the Foreigner version of Hokusai isn't a proper Heroic Spirit recorded to the Throne -- at least, as of the epilogue of the quest. Also, by the time of the quest, Guda is canonically asleep onboard an armored transport, outside of time and space.

So, who were all those Servant look-alikes?

Either Guda's recollections of various Servants -- or the actual Servants themselves, "invited" into a stage within Guda's unconscious mind, and made to take the roles of various figures from Edo Japan. Gilgamesh, BB, and Tomoe-Gozen seem quite intent on killing Hokusai before he awakens as a Cthulhu avatar -- and so, there's a chance that they legitimately infiltrated the dream to save Guda.

However, given that all Servants other than da Vinci, Holmes, and Mashu are at present time demanifested, it's hard to say?

Guda's Resistance:

Suzuka-Gozen gives that even though Guda is apparently resistant to all sorts of bizarre things, she may actually have a weakness against Mental Contamination.

With this I think I can understand a little why Michelangelo isn't in the throne, and from I know of him the motivation would fit. Of course that's whether this Deep God is telling the truth.