I don't think you should make talents that only cater to one spec or that negates the reason for choosing a talent. Might as well have a level 100 ability.

That said I like this ability. What might make it interesting is to have a short cooldown like 30s or so and have it channeled consuming rage fast. Something like consuming 25 rage a second until rage is depleted. What do you think about 30% reduced damage while channeling and 20% reduced damage to those behind the warrior?

I don't know, if all 3 talents were group-oriented (like my Hellscream) then it would be the choice of how you want to best benefit your mates/yourself. A DPS warrior could easily take a talent that lets him shield wall the whole raid for a few seconds, or your arena mate(s). The only problem would be coming up with a way to make the other talents also interesting and useful without being DPS gains or every fury and arms warrior would feel pigeonholed into picking the DPS boosting ones.

That said, I wouldn't mind seeing it as an ability, even if protection-only, either. I would love an ability like this, it would make you feel more responsible for the protection of your group.

With Hellscream's Fury it would be probably a 45-1min CD. I am not sure if it would be a CD on the stacks AND the charged attack or if it would be only the charged attack on CD, which would allow you to continue to build stacks. I think it would need a minimum time to build each stack, because as I mentioned before, within the first 20 seconds of a boss encounter you would be at full stacks - so maybe 3-5 secs between building stacks. I feel like this way it provides a sustained DPS improvement for arms/fury, and the prot version would have stacks that provide maybe decreased dmg, health received increase, or lifesteal, that way while you build it up you are sort of experiencing a passive bonus. Taking the time to build up the stacks would create an interesting dynamic for dps/tanks, do I keep up the stacks for the bonus or do I let loose with this hard-hitter? I feel like the attack would need to be fairly powerful to warrant getting rid of X amount of stacks that provide a constant bonus.

My issue with it, from a mostly pvp biased standpoint, is to make a solid increase in sustained damage the attack would have to be a large hit which only contributes to burst issues in pvp. In pve its a good design since it would make you time cds and CS more efficiently, but in PVP I am seeing wait till the stacks are about to cap them reck/bloodbath/banner/bladestorm on someone with the stacks popping off. Maybe a smaller amount of stacks and a smaller hit but more often would be good.

Gladiator's Dominance

I am not entirely sold on the massive shield idea, although it would definitely be a nice ability to have when you are getting focused in PvP/arenas...it is definitely very interesting. I feel like 10 seconds might be too long, I bet we could get away with 6-8 seconds, mind you I would love 10 seconds of that ability.

I am digging the fury idea with the chain, so how would this work? Would you throw a weapon and then spin or does each attack like throw out your weapon?

I don't entirely understand the prot idea too, do you attach a weapon to your shield or are you just using a 2H with a shield? Elaborate a bit more please!

Definitely like where you are going with the gladiator theme though, I feel like that could definitely become a permanent fourth stance with its own unique abilities and a different play style - maybe one that even prioritizes use of polearms.

Honestly I was looking at more of heart of the wild sort of design, where you can essentially thrive as a different role temporarily (hence the gladiator name implying mastery of multiple kinds of combat).

Basically arms gets a sort of defensive / protection type role, good in a pvp spot which is where arms is played 99% of the time (if nothing else that "shield smash" ability could do more damage to things immune to stuns to make it better for pve). Fury turns into a ranged dps for 15 seconds. I dont know how the animations would work but basically think Kratos from god of war hurling weapons with chains around. Cleave part is good for fury too I would think. I have never played prot so I didn't really know what to put there, but bucklering a shield means basically hanging it on your forearm so you can hold other stuff. The point was to make the warrior more like a dps for a short time so extra rage from damage dealt and a 2 handed strike for high damage.

Originally Posted by Gandrake

I like how when people complain about getting killed by kill shot which can have a 43 yard range, no resource cost, and can be used again if it doesn't kill and everyone says WELL, HEY, YOU KNOW, IT IS CALLED KILL SHOT
but when a warrior does it, clearly the ability's name is "useless wet noodle piece of shit strike with an exorbitant rage cost that should do the same damage as MS"

Well about Ancient Spear. It's exacly what Garrosh do before impale Taran-Zhu on Gorehowl. Aside from talents i think we should get some new animations that will show warriors fights way more "brutal" than paladins for example.

I'm adjusting my "Gladiator's Dominance" to a passive because it seems more badass as a passive.

Gladiator's Dominance

Arms: Hold the line
Whenever a shield is equipped, damage taken is reduced by 10% for the warrior and all allies within 15 yards. Additionally, you reflect 20% of all damage taken back to the attacker. Passive.

Fury: The Chains of War
Your weapons are now attached by a chain allowing you to throw them and attack at range. All of the warrior's attacks now have a 10 yard range and cleave 10% of their damage to all enemies within 3 yards of the target. Passive.

Protection: Commanding Presence
Your presence inspires courage in your allies. Reduces the cooldown of all banners by 20% and causes your rallying cry increases damage and healing done by all raid member by 10% for its duration in addition to its current effects. Passive.

Like I said I don't play prot so I couldn't be very creative with it. I really like the fury one but the arms one could probably use work too.

Originally Posted by Gandrake

I like how when people complain about getting killed by kill shot which can have a 43 yard range, no resource cost, and can be used again if it doesn't kill and everyone says WELL, HEY, YOU KNOW, IT IS CALLED KILL SHOT
but when a warrior does it, clearly the ability's name is "useless wet noodle piece of shit strike with an exorbitant rage cost that should do the same damage as MS"

I'm adjusting my "Gladiator's Dominance" to a passive because it seems more badass as a passive.

Gladiator's Dominance

Arms: Hold the line
Whenever a shield is equipped, damage taken is reduced by 10% for the warrior and all allies within 15 yards. Additionally, you reflect 20% of all damage taken back to the attacker. Passive.

Fury: The Chains of War
Your weapons are now attached by a chain allowing you to throw them and attack at range. All of the warrior's attacks now have a 10 yard range and cleave 10% of their damage to all enemies within 3 yards of the target. Passive.

Protection: Commanding Presence
Your presence inspires courage in your allies. Reduces the cooldown of all banners by 20% and causes your rallying cry increases damage and healing done by all raid member by 10% for its duration in addition to its current effects. Passive.

Like I said I don't play prot so I couldn't be very creative with it. I really like the fury one but the arms one could probably use work too.

They just got rid of equipping shields. They won´t bring it back.
Fury version is supernice, but I´d cut the Cleave thingy.
Prot version is my favorite. More utility. MORE UTILITY.

Originally Posted by magnuzze

considering that TG warriors was here since Vanilla, and DK's got into the World of warcraft in WoTLK... you can say that they have been stealing 2-handed from us.

Originally Posted by Mojo Risin

But I think it's a serious problem that a lot of people keep farming Mounts without any result for years. It could probably invoke some bad kind of anxiety and in some cases even depression, to be honest.

My issue with it, from a mostly pvp biased standpoint, is to make a solid increase in sustained damage the attack would have to be a large hit which only contributes to burst issues in pvp. In pve its a good design since it would make you time cds and CS more efficiently, but in PVP I am seeing wait till the stacks are about to cap them reck/bloodbath/banner/bladestorm on someone with the stacks popping off. Maybe a smaller amount of stacks and a smaller hit but more often would be good.

Very good observation, it is viable for PvP, but it is not necessarily the most optional choice for PvPers. I think I may have thought of a solution, that satisfies everyone, although my worry is that it would be OP, so just take this as a concept and tweak as needed. For Hellscream's Fury enrage can now be stacked up to 3 times for X% dmg increase (maybe 5 and less increase per stack), upon reaching 3 stacks you may consume the enrage stacks and use an ability despite it being on CD or not, wait for 5 stacks and you get a charged ability. Passive: Arms gains either armor pen or cleave for attacks, Fury: gains attack speed/lifesteal per attack, prot: gains lifesteal/increase healing received/decreased damage.

Once again, don't know if that is too much for one talent, but I feel like that would give old mechanics a bit of a tweak and provide a different sort of play style for encounters. The option of consuming it prior to max stacks, is the PvP route, which would allow you to get off another charge or whatever while it is on CD. I feel like being able to continue to build enrage stacks is a must, but there definitely should be a CD of 30 secs-1min on the free ability. Let me know what you think.

Originally Posted by thisnamesucks

I'm adjusting my "Gladiator's Dominance" to a passive because it seems more badass as a passive.

Gladiator's Dominance

Arms: Hold the line
Whenever a shield is equipped, damage taken is reduced by 10% for the warrior and all allies within 15 yards. Additionally, you reflect 20% of all damage taken back to the attacker. Passive.

Fury: The Chains of War
Your weapons are now attached by a chain allowing you to throw them and attack at range. All of the warrior's attacks now have a 10 yard range and cleave 10% of their damage to all enemies within 3 yards of the target. Passive.

Protection: Commanding Presence
Your presence inspires courage in your allies. Reduces the cooldown of all banners by 20% and causes your rallying cry increases damage and healing done by all raid member by 10% for its duration in addition to its current effects. Passive.

Like I said I don't play prot so I couldn't be very creative with it. I really like the fury one but the arms one could probably use work too.

I am liking where you are going with that, seems like a solid passive for every talent.

I am especially liking the fury talent, would make fury viable for PvP, because you can actually chase people down with the extended range...so frustrating to be so close to wiping someone out only to get kited until they drop you. Would be viable for PvP, because it would allow you to get out of AoE dmg while being able to keep up dps on the boss, I like the cleave, but yeah might be too much since that is already a pretty big change. Giving prot more utility as a support/leader type of role is awesome, I feel like trying to keep up buffs on allies while tanking will make it more interesting then just sitting there and getting beat on during boss fights, and there is obviously a huge bonus in PvP when you pop rallying cry. Great ideas!

I am not really sure about this one, reminds me a lot of heroic throw, but it does more damage, costs rage, and has no CD. Basically just the inverse of heroic throw with extra damage. Mind you I think this could be useful, just not really sure if it would be worth speccing into as a lvl 100 talent.

I am not really sure about this one, reminds me a lot of heroic throw, but it does more damage, costs rage, and has no CD. Basically just the inverse of heroic throw with extra damage. Mind you I think this could be useful, just not really sure if it would be worth speccing into as a lvl 100 talent.

Not sure either, but i think the general idea about some range attack could be discussed.

Not sure either, but i think the general idea about some range attack could be discussed.

Check out this idea by thisnamesucks, looks pretty sick and would satisfy what you are looking for.

Originally Posted by thisnamesucks

I'm adjusting my "Gladiator's Dominance" to a passive because it seems more badass as a passive.

Gladiator's Dominance

Arms: Hold the line
Whenever a shield is equipped, damage taken is reduced by 10% for the warrior and all allies within 15 yards. Additionally, you reflect 20% of all damage taken back to the attacker. Passive.

Fury: The Chains of War
Your weapons are now attached by a chain allowing you to throw them and attack at range. All of the warrior's attacks now have a 10 yard range and cleave 10% of their damage to all enemies within 3 yards of the target. Passive.

Protection: Commanding Presence
Your presence inspires courage in your allies. Reduces the cooldown of all banners by 20% and causes your rallying cry increases damage and healing done by all raid member by 10% for its duration in addition to its current effects. Passive.

Like I said I don't play prot so I couldn't be very creative with it. I really like the fury one but the arms one could probably use work too.

I feel like that is totally reasonable, its 10 yards so casters/ranged would still maintain superiority in the realm of ranged attacks - but it would give warriors some midranged utility.

I feel like that is totally reasonable, its 10 yards so casters/ranged would still maintain superiority in the realm of ranged attacks - but it would give warriors some midranged utility.

And all that lack of cool looking animations/abilities that the other thread in here is talking about could be satisfied if they make some unique animations involving throwing the weapons with chains all over. Would make warriors 10 kinds of badass to look at imo.

Edit/Update (Editate?):

The fury passive needs to keep the cleave or some kind of dps increase it; it would be a cool but unviable talent if it didn't provide some actual damage increase.

Im changing the arms one in my head, still liking the shield aspect.

Arms: Unmatched Discipline
While in combat and out of range of your target, the warrior automatically equips (visually) a sword and shield which reduces damage taken by the warrior and all allies within 15 yards by 10%. Additionally, the warrior throws the weight of his shield into his charges before he equips his main weapon which causes your charge to deal X damage (a fairly low amount) in addition to its current effects.

Last edited by Hand Banana; 2013-11-20 at 11:57 PM.

Originally Posted by Gandrake

I like how when people complain about getting killed by kill shot which can have a 43 yard range, no resource cost, and can be used again if it doesn't kill and everyone says WELL, HEY, YOU KNOW, IT IS CALLED KILL SHOT
but when a warrior does it, clearly the ability's name is "useless wet noodle piece of shit strike with an exorbitant rage cost that should do the same damage as MS"

And all that lack of cool looking animations/abilities that the other thread in here is talking about could be satisfied if they make some unique animations involving throwing the weapons with chains all over. Would make warriors 10 kinds of badass to look at imo.

Edit/Update (Editate?):

The fury passive needs to keep the cleave or some kind of dps increase it; it would be a cool but unviable talent if it didn't provide some actual damage increase.

Im changing the arms one in my head, still liking the shield aspect.

Arms: Unmatched Discipline
While in combat and out of range of your target, the warrior automatically equips (visually) a sword and shield which reduces damage taken by the warrior and all allies within 15 yards by 10%. Additionally, the warrior throws the weight of his shield into his charges before he equips his main weapon which causes your charge to deal X damage (a fairly low amount) in addition to its current effects.

The arms change is definitely a great idea, but I see it being a little less viable for PvE, I mean yeah it can be used for some parts of boss fights/killing adds, but if you are arms in a raid then you need to be pumping out dps. I think your original idea would be good for both PvE and PvP, because you are getting the damage reduction, plus the extra damage to targets permanently immune to stuns.

I love coming up with talent designs so here is my take on the last tier for warriors at 100:

Deathwish:

Arms and Fury: Increases your damage of Mortal Strike and Bloodthirst by X and allows Overpower and Wildstrike criticals to reduce the cooldown of Recklessness by X

Protection: Your Critical Blocks add 1 stack of Furiousness which increases all your damage by X% while under the effects of Beserker Rage. Stacks up to X times

Honor thy Blade:

Allows an additional weapon enchant to be placed on your weapons and shields at 50% effect

or something else with the same kinda idea

If your weapon is unenchanted gain the following

Arms and Fury: Each hit has a chance to grant you X% strength and X% movement speedProtection: your Devastates have a chance to give you X% Vitality and X% critical hit damage

Mastering Morale:

Increases the potency and lowers the cooldown of your Skull, Demoralizing and Mocking Banners and grants an additional benefit:

Skull Banner:Increases Lifesteal by X%(The new stat) for the durationDemoralizing Banner: Slows enemies within 20 yards by X% for the durationMocking Banner: Deals X damage every second within 10 yards of the banner

Here are my ideas, I'd like to increase Warrior group utility with the tier 100 talents by modifying existing abilities.

Master Bannerman

Your banners now have the additional affect for all party and raid members:

Skull Banner-Increases your highest tertiary stat by X.

Demoralizing Banner-Reduces enemy attack speed by X.

Mocking Banner-Damage dealt to anyone within X yards of banner that is not the Warrior reduced by Y.

Combat Presence

Your stances now have the additional affect to all nearby party and raid members:

Battle Stance-Chance on your hits to grant nearby party and raid members(basically only those in melee range)Battle Presence, increasing their critical strike chance by X.

Berserker Stance-Chance on your hits to grant nearby party and raid members Berserker Presence, increasing their attack speed by X.

Defensive Stance-Everytime you take damage, you have a chance to grant nearby party and raid members Defensive Presence, increasing armor and spell resistance by X.

Warlord's Depravity

Your primary abilities now grant the following:

Bloodthirst-Increases life drain of nearby party and raid members(those in melee range basically).

Mortal Strike-Increases the cleave of nearby party and raid members.

Shield Slam-Increases the avoidance(remember avoidance will be a new tertiary stat reducing AOE damage taken) of nearby party and raid members.

The idea being that Master Bannerman would end up helping the entire raid, but would provide the lowest buff. Combat Presence and Warlord's Depravity would only be for melee, with CP providing the best single target DPS and WD would be for fights where you need extra survivability or cleave damage(heavy AOE fights) Numbers would need to be tweaked of course, but ideally you'd swap based on what your raid needs.

Lifesteal is no true new stat. A stat is something, that is obligatory on a certain item. Strength is a stat. Haste is a stat. Lifesteal isn´t. They said, that it would rarely and randomly appear on certain slots and won´t be anywhere near needed to clear certain content. It´s is nice to have, whereas a real stat is crucial to have.

Also, regarding the cleave of the chained weapons: I don´t think it needs this addition to be a viable choice. The thing I like about the "new" talent system is, that you get to respecc and re-glyph frequently. Everytime I feel like talent x would be more suiting for a certain boss fight I think it´s good gamedesign. A talent, that would allow you to melee on distance should certainly not be the go-to talent all the time - but comes handy everytime the boss charges away or whenever it is neceassairy to get away from the boss yourself. It has its niche, just like Massspellreflect has its niche for me as a prot on Sha and Dark Shamans.

Originally Posted by magnuzze

considering that TG warriors was here since Vanilla, and DK's got into the World of warcraft in WoTLK... you can say that they have been stealing 2-handed from us.

Originally Posted by Mojo Risin

But I think it's a serious problem that a lot of people keep farming Mounts without any result for years. It could probably invoke some bad kind of anxiety and in some cases even depression, to be honest.

I love coming up with talent designs so here is my take on the last tier for warriors at 100:

Deathwish:

Arms and Fury: Increases your damage of Mortal Strike and Bloodthirst by X and allows Overpower and Wildstrike criticals to reduce the cooldown of Recklessness by X

Protection: Your Critical Blocks add 1 stack of Furiousness which increases all your damage by X% while under the effects of Beserker Rage. Stacks up to X times

Honor thy Blade:

Allows an additional weapon enchant to be placed on your weapons and shields at 50% effect

or something else with the same kinda idea

If your weapon is unenchanted gain the following

Arms and Fury: Each hit has a chance to grant you X% strength and X% movement speedProtection: your Devastates have a chance to give you X% Vitality and X% critical hit damage

Mastering Morale:

Increases the potency and lowers the cooldown of your Skull, Demoralizing and Mocking Banners and grants an additional benefit:

Skull Banner:Increases Lifesteal by X%(The new stat) for the durationDemoralizing Banner: Slows enemies within 20 yards by X% for the durationMocking Banner: Deals X damage every second within 10 yards of the banner

Interesting idea with Death Wish, it makes practical sense, although it doesn't come across as too exciting - definitely useful, but I feel like it doesn't really complement the spec or allow a differing play style.

How exactly would the prot version work though? Berserker rage only lasts 10 secs, so how would you build stacks? Would they persist through berserker rage fading or would this talent allow a longer berserker rage period, good idea though.

Honor thy blade looks very very interesting, I feel like this could be taken in very cool direction - although we need to be sure not to get close to a runeblade sort of addition that mirrors DKs. I feel like this just makes sense, I mean warriors value their weapons more than most classes, and let me be careful in saying this...We are fairly useless without some sort of weapon (or shield). We are heavily reliant on our weapons, so why not have a talent that reflects this and allows us to improve them? I know it bears resemblance to runeforging, but there definitely needs to be some way for us to get a bonus. Maybe the enchant bonus you mentioned or attaching something to our weapons to allow additional damage, like spikes that cause every swing to throw spikes or something...not sure where to go with this, I'll have to think about this some more!

Mastering Morale seems practical, but at the same time doesn't really provide a fun or unique new play style. Adds utility, but I feel like something else could be done to not only provide the utility for warriors, but also make it more interesting for them as well. Maybe people in your party gain a bonus dmg multiplier equivalent to health missing by your lowest raid member or by the boss or you gain those above mentioned buffs and it allows a proc/free ability every X seconds (for the warrior only). Just a few thoughts - good ideas though!

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by FobManX

Here are my ideas, I'd like to increase Warrior group utility with the tier 100 talents by modifying existing abilities.

Master Bannerman

Your banners now have the additional affect for all party and raid members:

Skull Banner-Increases your highest tertiary stat by X.

Demoralizing Banner-Reduces enemy attack speed by X.

Mocking Banner-Damage dealt to anyone within X yards of banner that is not the Warrior reduced by Y.

Combat Presence

Your stances now have the additional affect to all nearby party and raid members:

Battle Stance-Chance on your hits to grant nearby party and raid members(basically only those in melee range)Battle Presence, increasing their critical strike chance by X.

Berserker Stance-Chance on your hits to grant nearby party and raid members Berserker Presence, increasing their attack speed by X.

Defensive Stance-Everytime you take damage, you have a chance to grant nearby party and raid members Defensive Presence, increasing armor and spell resistance by X.

Warlord's Depravity

Your primary abilities now grant the following:

Bloodthirst-Increases life drain of nearby party and raid members(those in melee range basically).

Mortal Strike-Increases the cleave of nearby party and raid members.

Shield Slam-Increases the avoidance(remember avoidance will be a new tertiary stat reducing AOE damage taken) of nearby party and raid members.

The idea being that Master Bannerman would end up helping the entire raid, but would provide the lowest buff. Combat Presence and Warlord's Depravity would only be for melee, with CP providing the best single target DPS and WD would be for fights where you need extra survivability or cleave damage(heavy AOE fights) Numbers would need to be tweaked of course, but ideally you'd swap based on what your raid needs.

I like where you are going with each ability, essentially each talent would be adding a utility to either stance or an ability. I feel like giving 3 passives either for 3 abilities or 3 stances would work well, there just needs to be one overarching increase along with that. Actually, not even sure, I mean the passive idea does work really well and knits into the abilities we already have, but it would be interesting if there was some aspect of the talent that would alter how you play. Whether it is a change in your rotation or something, just to make it feel fresh, if you hit 100 and are just like ok, well I get passives and thats about it, then you will take them obviously, but it doesn't really make it that much more exciting. Basically good idea, but it would be nice if there was something to complement the talent that would make the talent feel both viable/necessary AND fun - which is a tough balance to find.

I won't just sit back and offer empty advice though, here's a thought:

Master Bannerman

Your banners now have the additional affect for all party and raid members:

Skull Banner-Increases your highest tertiary stat by X.

Demoralizing Banner-Reduces enemy attack speed by X.

Mocking Banner-Damage dealt to anyone within X yards of banner that is not the Warrior reduced by Y.

Add a limitation to the range you can receive the effects of the banner, the more people affected by the banner you(only the warrior) gain X% dmg increase, sort of making you the focal point while your banners are out. It kind of would give the effect (don't even know if I am using affect/effect correctly - always get them mixed up..) of leading the charge into combat, people flock to the banners and you are inspired by their presence.

Combat Presence

Your stances now have the additional affect to all nearby party and raid members:

Battle Stance-Chance on your hits to grant nearby party and raid members(basically only those in melee range)Battle Presence, increasing their critical strike chance by X.

Berserker Stance-Chance on your hits to grant nearby party and raid members Berserker Presence, increasing their attack speed by X.

Defensive Stance-Everytime you take damage, you have a chance to grant nearby party and raid members Defensive Presence, increasing armor and spell resistance by X.

Brothers in Arms Whenever your allies are affected/effected (lol), by one of the above chance on hits your abilities cost 20% less rage for X amount of seconds, this effect can only occur once every X amount of seconds.

Warlord's Depravity

Your primary abilities now grant the following:

Bloodthirst-Increases life drain of nearby party and raid members(those in melee range basically).

Mortal Strike-Increases the cleave of nearby party and raid members.

Shield Slam-Increases the avoidance(remember avoidance will be a new tertiary stat reducing AOE damage taken) of nearby party and raid members.

Question for this one, so when you hit the target would it receive a debuff that allowed for life drain/cleave/avoidance? Or would you constantly have an aura when you use this? Interesting concept, but I don't follow how it would be implemented. I am loving the utility, just to provide something for the warrior themselves - maybe using these abilities will increase your attack speed or something for a certain period of time, or its got a 10-30% chance to proc a buff of some sort only for the warrior. Great ideas, loving the utility you are adding.

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by Valech

Lifesteal is no true new stat. A stat is something, that is obligatory on a certain item. Strength is a stat. Haste is a stat. Lifesteal isn´t. They said, that it would rarely and randomly appear on certain slots and won´t be anywhere near needed to clear certain content. It´s is nice to have, whereas a real stat is crucial to have.

Also, regarding the cleave of the chained weapons: I don´t think it needs this addition to be a viable choice. The thing I like about the "new" talent system is, that you get to respecc and re-glyph frequently. Everytime I feel like talent x would be more suiting for a certain boss fight I think it´s good gamedesign. A talent, that would allow you to melee on distance should certainly not be the go-to talent all the time - but comes handy everytime the boss charges away or whenever it is neceassairy to get away from the boss yourself. It has its niche, just like Massspellreflect has its niche for me as a prot on Sha and Dark Shamans.

Definitely agree with this, the chained weapon idea would be awesome. Although, personally I am still in favor of the cleave concept, it makes sense really - if you are swinging around weapons on chains you are bound to hit some of the other people nearby. Not for full damage of course, but 20-30% would be fine.