Hey Dennis, don't you think it is interesting the DC is making the gritty and dark movies while Marvel is making the lighter movies? Kind of a reversal from the comics.

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It isn't really. DC has embraced "gritty and dark" as its main ethos for decades now. After Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns came out to such acclaim, they've been trying to copy those successes ever since. The comics coming out these days are just as dark and violent as the movies, if not more so.

Last year, I was at a local comics-convention sort of thing, and there were copies being handed out of a Free Comic Book Day release sampling Future's End, this big crossover DC was doing set in an alternate future. I couldn't even get past more than a few pages of it, since there was so much gore and death and violence -- there were these killer robots that were killing heroes and incorporating their victims' body parts into their own structure or something, and the last straw for me was an image of Black Canary's severed head stuck on one of the robots' bodies. (No, wait, I looked it up, and it turns out it was actually a Brother Eye-controlled Frankenstein's Monster who'd sewn her head into his chest, which makes it even more troubling.) Think about it -- the purpose of Free Comic Book Day is to attract new readers, including young readers, by giving them free samples to whet their interest, and DC's idea of how to do that is with this kind of relentlessly grim, disgusting violence porn. Dawn of Justice looks positively upbeat next to that.

By contrast, the recent Marvel comics that I've either read or read about have much more of a sense of fun. After all, DC is trapped by its self-consciousness, its desire to prove itself mature and sophisticated, which is largely a result of its enduring need to imitate Marvel. Whereas Marvel, well, already is Marvel, and thus doesn't have the same insecurity or uptightness.

Hey Dennis, don't you think it is interesting the DC is making the gritty and dark movies while Marvel is making the lighter movies? Kind of a reversal from the comics.

Click to expand...

It isn't really. DC has embraced "gritty and dark" as its main ethos for decades now. After Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns came out to such acclaim, they've been trying to copy those successes ever since. The comics coming out these days are just as dark and violent as the movies, if not more so.

Last year, I was at a local comics-convention sort of thing, and there were copies being handed out of a Free Comic Book Day release sampling Future's End, this big crossover DC was doing set in an alternate future. I couldn't even get past more than a few pages of it, since there was so much gore and death and violence -- there were these killer robots that were killing heroes and incorporating their victims' body parts into their own structure or something, and the last straw for me was an image of Black Canary's severed head stuck on one of the robots' bodies. (No, wait, I looked it up, and it turns out it was actually a Brother Eye-controlled Frankenstein's Monster who'd sewn her head into his chest, which makes it even more troubling.) Think about it -- the purpose of Free Comic Book Day is to attract new readers, including young readers, by giving them free samples to whet their interest, and DC's idea of how to do that is with this kind of relentlessly grim, disgusting violence porn. Dawn of Justice looks positively upbeat next to that.

By contrast, the recent Marvel comics that I've either read or read about have much more of a sense of fun. After all, DC is trapped by its self-consciousness, its desire to prove itself mature and sophisticated, which is largely a result of its enduring need to imitate Marvel. Whereas Marvel, well, already is Marvel, and thus doesn't have the same insecurity or uptightness.

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This is not universally true by any means. About ten years ago, with Infinite Crisis DC became really dark but since then it has really depended on the title.

Hey Dennis, don't you think it is interesting the DC is making the gritty and dark movies while Marvel is making the lighter movies? Kind of a reversal from the comics.

Click to expand...

It isn't really. DC has embraced "gritty and dark" as its main ethos for decades now. After Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns came out to such acclaim, they've been trying to copy those successes ever since. The comics coming out these days are just as dark and violent as the movies, if not more so.

Last year, I was at a local comics-convention sort of thing, and there were copies being handed out of a Free Comic Book Day release sampling Future's End, this big crossover DC was doing set in an alternate future. I couldn't even get past more than a few pages of it, since there was so much gore and death and violence -- there were these killer robots that were killing heroes and incorporating their victims' body parts into their own structure or something, and the last straw for me was an image of Black Canary's severed head stuck on one of the robots' bodies. (No, wait, I looked it up, and it turns out it was actually a Brother Eye-controlled Frankenstein's Monster who'd sewn her head into his chest, which makes it even more troubling.) Think about it -- the purpose of Free Comic Book Day is to attract new readers, including young readers, by giving them free samples to whet their interest, and DC's idea of how to do that is with this kind of relentlessly grim, disgusting violence porn. Dawn of Justice looks positively upbeat next to that.

By contrast, the recent Marvel comics that I've either read or read about have much more of a sense of fun. After all, DC is trapped by its self-consciousness, its desire to prove itself mature and sophisticated, which is largely a result of its enduring need to imitate Marvel. Whereas Marvel, well, already is Marvel, and thus doesn't have the same insecurity or uptightness.

Click to expand...

This is not universally true by any means. About ten years ago, with Infinite Crisis DC became really dark but since then it has really depended on the title.

Click to expand...

And its not like Marvel's been all sunshine either I mean between Superior Spider-Man, the Multiverse crisis, Ironman's current issues, and the death count in Spider-verse they went to some bleak places.

It isn't really. DC has embraced "gritty and dark" as its main ethos for decades now. After Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns came out to such acclaim, they've been trying to copy those successes ever since. The comics coming out these days are just as dark and violent as the movies, if not more so.

Last year, I was at a local comics-convention sort of thing, and there were copies being handed out of a Free Comic Book Day release sampling Future's End, this big crossover DC was doing set in an alternate future. I couldn't even get past more than a few pages of it, since there was so much gore and death and violence -- there were these killer robots that were killing heroes and incorporating their victims' body parts into their own structure or something, and the last straw for me was an image of Black Canary's severed head stuck on one of the robots' bodies. (No, wait, I looked it up, and it turns out it was actually a Brother Eye-controlled Frankenstein's Monster who'd sewn her head into his chest, which makes it even more troubling.) Think about it -- the purpose of Free Comic Book Day is to attract new readers, including young readers, by giving them free samples to whet their interest, and DC's idea of how to do that is with this kind of relentlessly grim, disgusting violence porn. Dawn of Justice looks positively upbeat next to that.

By contrast, the recent Marvel comics that I've either read or read about have much more of a sense of fun. After all, DC is trapped by its self-consciousness, its desire to prove itself mature and sophisticated, which is largely a result of its enduring need to imitate Marvel. Whereas Marvel, well, already is Marvel, and thus doesn't have the same insecurity or uptightness.

Click to expand...

This is not universally true by any means. About ten years ago, with Infinite Crisis DC became really dark but since then it has really depended on the title.

Click to expand...

And its not like Marvel's been all sunshine either I mean between Superior Spider-Man, the Multiverse crisis, Ironman's current issues, and the death count in Spider-verse they went to some bleak places.

Click to expand...

Marvel has it's share of dark events too.

The finale of New X-Men with Mageto/Xorn throwing humans in to furnaces, using his magnetism to give Jean Grey a heart attack, and Logan cutting off his head.

House of M which culled the heard of X-Men

Civil War: Infamous by now

Infinity: With billions dying out in space. A war with Shi'ar, Skrull, Avengers, Kree and Inhumans on one side and The Mad Titan Thanos' side on the other.

AXIS: Marvel's version of Forever Evil. Where the Red Skull gains Xavier's telepathy and becomes a new Onslaught. Xavier having previously died in Avengers vs X-Men.

Avengers vs X-Men: Where the Avengers are portrayed as noble heroes fighting against those bad, bad muties. Honestly neither side looks good after this event but it's obvious Marvel wanted to sling mud at the X-Men. Cyclops is a psychopath and murders Charles in this book for Chrissakes.

Incursion: Where the Illuminati (Black Panther, Tony Stark, Reed Richards, Hank McCoy, Dr Strange, Black Bolt) conspire to save their universe by destroying parallel ones. Basically a riff on Crisis on Infinite Earths but with the heroes doing the destroying.

That's just a few. The idea that Marvel is doing something that DC isn't, is ludicrous. The events for each respective company dial it up to 11 in terms of violence and content but that's not completely reflective of the solo books.

I read Marvel for a few years from the "end" of the Avengers/Ragnarok era to the Skrull Invasion, Planet Hulk, and Secret Avengers and Spider-Man selling his soul to Mephisto for the life of Aunt May.

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^ Oh god! I forgot about those. Does anyone remember Spider-Man Sins Past and Ultimates? Jesus Christ what were they thinking?

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On the DC side I remember being genuinely shocked and repulsed by Identity Crisis. I then bought some of the books around Infinite Crisis and though Earth II Superman was right about the state of the DC Universe. Of course the story of Infinite Crisis was to multiply the brutality thousand fold with Superboy Prime punching people clear through the head and such. DC of that era had some of the most graphic scenes of any mainstream comics. Uggghhh. I remember buying the Justice League OYL in the hopes of seeing some classic super-hero stuff only to have Solomon Grundy rip Red Tornadoes arm off.

The new 52 has been much more kid friendly (and me friendly) in terms of graphic content.

I read Marvel for a few years from the "end" of the Avengers/Ragnarok era to the Skrull Invasion, Planet Hulk, and Secret Avengers and Spider-Man selling his soul to Mephisto for the life of Aunt May.

Click to expand...

^ Oh god! I forgot about those. Does anyone remember Spider-Man Sins Past and Ultimates? Jesus Christ what were they thinking?

Click to expand...

On the DC side I remember being genuinely shocked and repulsed by Identity Crisis. I then bought some of the books around Infinite Crisis and though Earth II Superman was right about the state of the DC Universe. Of course the story of Infinite Crisis was to multiply the brutality thousand fold with Superboy Prime punching people clear through the head and such. DC of that era had some of the most graphic scenes of any mainstream comics. Uggghhh. I remember buying the Justice League OYL in the hopes of seeing some classic super-hero stuff only to have Solomon Grundy rip Red Tornadoes arm off.

The new 52 has been much more kid friendly (and me friendly) in terms of graphic content.

Click to expand...

Oh I'm right there with you. I hate Identity Crisis. It's a needlessly dark retcon of the late 70's Justice League. To satisfy the writer's (Meltzer) fanboy jimmies of putting his own twist on comics he grew up with. A era of comics that (thanks to Crisis on Infinite Earths) was no longer in continuity, but they referenced it anyway.

I like Infinite Crisis though. The size and scale of it all makes it a pretty epic tale. SBP is a parody of a whiny fanboy, makes his temper tantrums funny IMO.

OYL Justice League (Tornado's Path) also written by Meltzer, was a huge disappointment. No one cares about Red Tornado or Solomon Grundy. Thankfully Geoff Johns took over JLA afterwards to give us the Lightning Saga and Dwayne McDuffie after Johns gave us some good tales. Before his untimely death .