CONSERVATIVE? KIDS OUT OF SCHOOL AT 14? SOUNDS LIKE THEY BELIEVE THEY ARE A PRIVILEGED FEW! FIRST THEY PROVIDE SERVICE WORK IN COMMUNITIES WITH A 16% BID ADVANTAGE IN LIGHT OF THE FACT THEY PAY NO MEDICARE NOR SOCIAL SECURITY TAXES. SECOND, WHAT IS WRONG WITH A GOOD EDUCATION FOR ALL IN OUR COUNTRY. THIRD, ARE THEY EXEMPT FROM CONSIDERATE TREATMENT OF THOSE WHO ARE GAY AND LESBIAN IN THEIR FOLD? YES THEY ARE CONSERVATIVE SOCIALLY AND FINANCIALLY BUT THEY HAVE APPEALED FOR AND BEEN GIVEN QUITE LIBERAL TREATMENT BY THE REST OF AMERICAN SOCIETY.

Amish have a better education by 14 years than in most public schools by 18.
Amish do not pay medicare or social security because they provide these services for themselves.
Amish are considerate to everyone, which is more than can be said for some. . .

I accept all that you have said.
I am also quite considerate to others.
But why do I, as an individual, need to be Amish to keep my own money and therefore provide for myself just as the Amish are able to do.

I loved reading this article, incredibly fascinating and mesmerizing. Too often we focus on the large voting groups and completely forget about these smaller ones. Yes, the Amish vote may be inconsequential in terms of the overall electorate, but it's important to hear their perspectives on current events that the rest of us simply gloss over as straightforward public policy. I wish this immersion approach was taken by more reporters in regards to interviewing minority voter groups.

You shouldn't casually dismiss voter fraud, Lexington. And when you do, you display your sympathies on the issue, which are patently irrational. In a country where nearly every activity of consequence requires a photo ID for security reasons, why is it morally preferable to subject the ballot box to insecurity?

I found this article to be fascinating.
Regarding the Amish and the Mennonites: while the Amish are in general a more homogeneous group, the Mennonites range from those who drive horse and buggies to those who drive Mercedes Benz automobiles and everywhere in between. So it is perhaps more difficult to make blanket statements about the Mennonites as a whole.
Pennsylfaanisch Deitsch (Pennsylvania Dutch or better, German) has not died out, particularly among the Amish and the more conservative Mennonites. Many of the "Church" Dutch (Lutherans and Reformed, et al) no longer speak it as the younger generation had no reason to speak it (i.e. no peer group with whom to speak it).

Lots of misguided and ridiculous notions of the Amish and Mennonites. As someone who grew up around Mennonites on the border of Berks & Lancaster County:

1. Amish and Mennonites are not the same.
2. There are notable difference from different communities on what types of technology are acceptable and uses of it are. It varies considerably.
3. Some still speak the old Pennsylvania Deutsch language (including non-Amish) but it has largely died out.
4. Amish and Mennonites aren't only farmers or produce agricultural products. Tons of them are carpenters who do woodwork and also work in several other lines of business including retail food production (e.g., pretzels).
5. Amish and Mennonites largely don't vote and generally remain apolitical even though they have what would be regarded as very traditional/conservative family values and beliefs. Even those involved in politics generally stick generally stick to issues that really directly affect their communities.
6. Amish and Mennonites don't seek active conversion of outsiders which is a HUGE difference between other fundamentalist faiths and their faith.

I really like and enjoyed living among the Amish. Respect a lot of their values even if I personally disagree with them and respect how they run & lives their lives. Unlike other conservative faiths, they don't seek conversion of non-believers nor do they try to actively impose their will/viewpoints on the larger community. Also generally run and own businesses that only agree with their system of beliefs too which almost is true of any other faith or religion. Not a lifestyle that I would choose to live but I have a lot of deep-seated respect for their sense of community, family, and the way they live their lives & conduct business (hard bargain-drivers but my family or I never had an issue with a business transaction with them).

I grew up with the Amish as neighbors and have done plenty of business with them in PA. Your comment is grossly ignorant for this simple fact - the Amish simply wish to maintain their lifestyle and community and do not seek active conversion of anyone else outside the community nor do they own generally own businesses which are against the testaments of their religion unlike Mormons.

From my experience in Idaho, Mormons will gladly own casinos or businesses that sell alcohol/tobacco/caffeine just as long as they don't partake themselves. Also rabid about converting both the living and the dead to the Mormon faith which is why I have such mixed feelings the Mormon faith.

There is a huge difference between muslim fundamentalists and fundamentalists of almost all other religions: The fundaments.
In Islam, the Story started with war and make war is part of the message.
Il almost all other religions, le Story started with peace and a spiritual research.

Therefore fundamentalists of almost any other religions are pacifists and Salafists (Muslim fundamentalists) cut hands, feet and heads, lapidate women, torture anybody they call sinner etc

Open your eyes: Salafist International brigades which are destroying Malians and Syriens (each and every syrien: Government and rebels) are not sympathic old fashion anabaptists.

The Amish in PA are actively excommunicating members who stand for biblical truth, in recent years hundreds have been put out. One minister i quote as saying "I would rather see my son with a beer in his hand than a bible"
They may not sell cigarettes per say, but they sure do plant tobacco from which the cancer sticks come from. The main reason why they don't try to convert outsiders is because they haven't been converted themselves & the best they can do is maintain a wishful hope concerning spiritual matters.
What outsiders usually see and appreciate about them is their culture, and rightfully so, as they have much that outsiders can learn from.
However all of that is built upon fear of man and pleasing the bishop. If another group arose today with the same practices that the Amish maintain the outsiders would cry out against them calling them a cult.

Because of the separation from the outside world those on the inside live with fear and abuse that is consistently covered up and ignored.

As a result several ministries such as Charity Christian Fellowship, MAP which stands for Mission to Amish People, & Plain New Life - Ministry to Amish People are actively engaged in working with, assisting, equipping and educating Amish & none Amish, concerning all of the above mentioned issues that are prevailing among the Amish people

The Amish Country sounds amazing and interesting, the beauty of variations in beliefs and religion is something which humanity is all about. I would love to visit one day the Amish community (if they allow visitors) and spend a week or two to know them better. Who they vote for is not important but they must vote because they make up what is America today and if their votes are sought then it means they have a say and because they have say, they must say and express their 'says' through their votes.

Amish areas often become tourist destinations and Lancaster County PA is the mother of all Amish tourist traps. Drive along Rt 896 and especially Rt 30 and you will have the options of visiting an authentic Amish Barn or taking any number of Buggy Rides throughout Amish farmland. Tour buses and traffic can be heavy. Buses sometimes traverse some pretty small roads through farmland to give riders a closer look at Amish life

One particular place I found offensive was the Weavertown 1 Room Schoolhouse replete with wax figures of Amish Children. It has thankfully closed. Gift shops selling Amish goods, particularly furniture abound as do resturants offering Amish food. In the middle of things is an Amusement Park called "Dutch Wonderland" which includes many life sized Amish attractions.

This area is an international destination. I like to sit and read in a touristy corner located in Intercourse PA and hear a wide variety of foreign tongues. Sometimes 7-8 tour buses sit in the lot.

The Amish drive their horse drawn buggys through all of this, often causing traffic backups until disgruntled drivers have a chance to speedily pass. For a group that would seemingly favor privacy, the Amish has adapted well. They have many busineses catering to the tourist trade and almost every farm has a sign offering Produce or Home Made Root Beer sales with one limitation - "No Sunday Sales."

The important thing for the Amish community to consider, is the impact of past 'conservative' policies (the past 100 years considered) on their quality of life. Instead of judging candidates based on their words (which anyone with a reasonable amount of intelligence can assess as lies, or atleast lip service for election purposes), they should consider what has acually been achieved due to the 'application' of each party's/candidate's stated policy roster during the same 100 year period. A discussion/debate on this topic is useless unless one allows herself or himself to objectively judge the cumulative effect of 'conservative' policies over the same 100 year period. Only then, when one assumes such a viewpoint, can she/he make an informed decision on the true candidature of Mr. Obama vs. Mr. Romney. Candidates say whatever they need to say to get elected, however, only when one analyzes how many promises have been kept, do they get to understand who possesses integrity. Society in general needs to move away from words that don't hold water.

I live about 25 miles from Lancaster County PA and travel to the area on an almost weekly basis.

I was surprised to learn that any Amish vote but upon further reflection it is not so shocking. There are several different types of Mennonites and even great variation in how strictly "Old Order" Amish follow what otherwise appears to be rigid rules. As the article implies, it often has to do with how strict one's Bishop is. There are lots of bishops tending over relatively small flocks and it is fair to say their education and training is minimal

As the article mentions, Amish will not keep a phone in their house but for many it is acceptable to maintain one in a small enclosure nearby. Go to the many farmer's markets where some work, and you will see some chatting on cell phones. While they will not drive a car or use a tractor to work their fields, it is very common to see them using gasoline powered farm equipment pulled by a team of horses or mules. They absolutely love gas powered weed whackers because they are always using them along the roadside. Some have very modern looking homes. Others live in old multi-generational farmhouses.

Some of the more "liberal" Mennonite groups permit car ownership. At least one conditions it upon painting the bumpers black.

I have always thought it odd that they think 17th century clothes styles define some type of purity. If they are Christians, why not go back to robes and sandals ? Otherwise, they are very decent and hard working people.

I saw a documentary recently concerning Amish who left the sect. They are a minority. One man could not get past his bishop's insistance that the world is flat because the Bible talks about the 4 corners of the earth. This is the kind of nonsense that often results from fundamentalism and why I don't much care what the Amish think about gay marriage and other social issues.

Strange & irrational are the workings of the human mind! Guess we still have a long ways to go, down the evolutionary path, as we continue being prisoners of our immediate environments. The 'herd mentality syndrome' still holds sway over us & our faculties, to this day..

Your comments made a lot of sense almost all the way to the end, then i realized that they lacked substance.

That ONE mans bishop's insistence that the world is flat because the Bible talks about the 4 corners of the earth - stems from his lack of knowledge of the bible not from his I quote "fundamentalism"

I do agree that his lack of biblical knowledge causes him to make statements that can be classified as nonsense. I would go even further and commend you for your statement: "I don't much care what the Amish think about gay marriage"
Personally I think that all men need to go way further than being worried about what mere men think about us and our modern views and be more concerned about what God the Creator thinks about these issues - and then choose God's way.

Maybe you think that this makes me a "fundamentalist", well i also have the view that if men are against God's way for their lives then they should stop spending money that reflects trust in him.

Can a person really judge a book by its cover? Can a person really tell the contents of a box by looking at the box alone?

This is what you have done in speaking about the Amish. You have looked at and examined the nice box, and then classified it's contents based upon your assumption of what you think is inside. In so doing you are just like that ONE man's bishop "emphasis on the ONE" who speaks with a lack of knowledge.

In your view what is a fundamentalist? Is being one a good or bad thing? Why do you think so?

- French "laïcité" (Laïcité "à la française") is an extreme form of "laïcité": No religion is discriminated AND the state officialy ignores the existence of religons: For the french state, religion is invisible. This explains why the french state is not prepared to deal with invisible entities, like the dangerous Salafists. Like other traditionalists, the Salafists have a beard but they have no moustache.

If you want: One does not exclude the other. It is not the same point of the History.
By the way: The language they speak is "Alemanic" and not "German".
If you want to precise the dialect of that tongue, you should write "Bern-Alemanic" (for instance).

"This explains why the french state is not prepared to deal with invisible entities, like the dangerous Salafists"

Nonsense. We treat them like any other dangerous underground organization - keeping tabs on them and taking action when needed (hopefully). And we never were addicted, like the US, to helping pious biblical-looking figures who feared God with one hand and greased their Kalashnikovs with the other one, so to speak.

An interesting article. I have no idea how accurate the portrayal of the Amish is in the film "Witness" - but when my late father (who was a carpenter) saw it he couldn't understand why Harrison Ford at the end wanted to go back to "normal" life.

How quaint. All these years, I had this image of the Amish as benign sorts, strangely dressed, trotting along rural roads in hand built carriages, selling homemade strawberry pies and quilts along the side of the road. It is a bit of a shock to learn that they have strong political opinions, and that some members of the Amish community will actually vote in the next presidential election. While I don't agree with their conservative social views, I still do like their homemade pies.

BTW, although many so called liberals of today have nothing in common with real liberals.

A real liberal would be tolerant and broadminded about "differences".

The wannabe liberals of today exhibit a most intolerant mindset infected by delusions of grandeur and want everybody to think like them, have the same opinions as them.

That is impose their beliefs on others. And those who don't toe the party lie are immediately dubbed "uneducated, right-wing, fascist" you name it.

The real liberals are of course the Amish who never impose their beliefs on others. Which shows you don't need a formal education to be truly educated. A mark of a truly educated person is the ability to be tolerant of "difference".

The Amish and Mormons both have systems in place that work to keep their young from straying. Amish allow a young man a year to go out in the world to see things for himself. What he sees (typically) is that he isn't prepared for the modern world. He has never changed a tire and can't reset a tripped circuit breaker. He also knows that if he is successful a stays in the outer world, his family will disown him. The Mormons allow young men into the world but not alone. There is always someone there to report any straying. Interestingly, women aren't trusted. The Amish know that women don't need modern skills to get along. And the Mormons..well, they have their own reasons not to trust women on their own.

Whipsaw,
Just a correction:
I grew up Mennonite, in Lancaster County and have spent my life living among the Amish. Most young people decide to join the church after Rumspringa because of the strong community that they grew up with. Not because they cannot function in the "outside world". Amish young people actually tend to do well at mixing into general society during Rumspringa. Also, shunning in the Amish community only occurs if one decides to leave the community after they had already joined the church, not before.

You seem a bit confused. Your comments about Mormons are a bit off. First off, Mormons don't keep youth from the world in the first place. So, the idea that they "allow young men into the world" is silly.

Yes, Mormons do have a large missionary program, and Mormon missionaries go in pairs, but that is nothing remotely similar to the Amish practice of allowing their young men into the world. I have no idea where you're getting the idea that women aren't trusted as Mormon women also serve as missionaries.

Okay, I apologize for the Mormon women comment. But what is the percentage of female missionaries? And I said Amish, not Mormons, 'allow young...' And I still have to wonder why there is no Amish female Rumspringa. I still say they know that women don't need modern skills but men do. Am I wrong?

OBAMA can defend himself easily but Romney has to eat iron balls to win heart and souls of the voters; because his proposals on tax cuts to all including the richest cannot be digested even by rich 2% voters. His proposal of medicare and healthcare voucher system is very close to throw all sick and poor over the cliff to the deep canyon. His proposal of gunboat diplomacy and creating macho image with others will slide back the USA in to isolation and surely invite another more bloodier and disastrous wars, which may ultimately cripple our economy. His hard core conservative proposals to restrict choices for women and platform against Latinos will put him in to very pitiable spot during the debate. Romney may speak some one liners like President Reagan and for a moment make his supporters to laugh but he is not a comedy actor like Ronald Reagan and Obama is very soft hearted, cool and honest President like Carter. If Romney will try some punches like that, he will be sure to receive hard kicks from the well known Chicago breed.