Confederate flags placed at Martin Luther King site

Southern white racists are getting desperate. They realize now, THEY are the minority in this nation. I look forward to the day when white supremacist groups are as extinct as the Dodo bird. Heads up racists… it’s coming quicker than you think!

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gringaofthebarrio

A barrio gringa with a dream of cosmic proportions: writing to satiate my insatiable curiosity, worldwide literacy beginning with our youth, and to be the first barrio gringa to explore outer space!
View all posts by gringaofthebarrio

White supremacist groups can hi-jack any symbol they want and adopt it as their own. The symbol means less than their message. Their real anger today is that they are realizing their message is irrelevant and they are social outcasts. They recognize they have been rejected by the majority and stand all alone in their marginalized minority class. They realize the majority of society only tolerates them because of their Constitutional right to freedom of expression. Although tolerated, they are not accepted and respected. They are a dying class. They know it and they refuse to go down quietly or with dignity. These are their death rattles. It’s music to my ears,

Like what groups? The white supremacist groups have become like worrisome gnats buzzing about society’s head trying to get attention for their cause. They talk big but when they have a public protest, they hide behind the protection of the police who are doing their duty. The cops are not there because they support the cause. White supremacists have no confidence in their movement any longer which is why they sneak in under cover of darkness to attack black churches, knowing they are vandalizing the property of peaceful people. If white supremacists had the courage their big mouths claim, let them try something like that at Black Panther headquarters or LULAC’s office. The white supremacist’s are old news. The rest of society has evolved and they are still living in their caves.

The men placing the flags are despicable people. The act of placing the confederate battle flags at the church was a clear attempt to garner media attention, incite fear as well as make known their racist views.

HOWEVER…

I do NOT believe the confederate battle flag is a symbol of hate. That flag is the symbol of a country. Furthermore, the Confederate States of America was not founded upon race, hate or slavery. The Confeceracy was founded upon the ideal of state’s rights. One of those rights happened to be slavery, but that was a bit down the list.

(I’m a history teacher by the way. This subject is in my wheelhouse so to speak)

I think the “lost cause” is still very much a part of the cultural landscape in the South. But people continue to fight to improve voting rights, remove hateful symbols, get better education and jobs! The STRUGGLE CONTINUES!!!

Amen! The only lost cause in the South are the ignorant hangers on to some romantic notion that what the South did so long ago was somehow noble and worthy of honoring. These “lost causers” are quickly becoming a minority. Time will eventually weed them out completely.

There were 4 Confederate flags: The first & final flag design was the “Bars & Stars” by Nicola Marschall. The “Stainless Banner” by William T. Thompson and the “Blood Stained Banner” by Arthur L Rodgers are nearly identical and one of them was the design recently removed from the South Carolina capitol.

These flags were flown to represent a group of states who banded together to secede from the union of states they were a legal part of to form a nation, the United States of America. They were angry that their wealth and way of life was threatened and that their “states’ rights” were interfered with. They did not want to give up the enslavement of other human beings as the way in which they created their wealth. They believed African slaves were not human therefore it was okay to work them to death and deny them freedom and the right to keep their family units together.

This act of secession was a treasonous act of war. 18 U.S. Code Chapter 115 Section 2381 defines treason as “Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.” This treasonous act of war was not waged by heroes, but by traitors who caused the death of over 300,000 TRUE Americans. This so-called “heritage” of the South is nothing to be proud of.

Mok72, it was ALL about slavery: The following is the heart of the Confederate States Declaration of Secession. Note that the change in U.S. government was four months away which is when the Confederacy feared the United States would wage war against them. Hence it was the Confederacy that started the war when, on April 12, 1861, Confederate shore batteries under General Pierre G.T. Beauregard opened fire on Union-held Fort Sumter in South Carolina’s Charleston Bay. The Confederate States main complaint in the Declaration of Secession: “The General Government, as the common agent, passed laws to carry into effect these stipulations of the States. For many years these laws were executed. But an increasing hostility on the part of the non-slaveholding States to the institution of slavery, has led to a disregard of their obligations, and the laws of the General Government have ceased to effect the objects of the Constitution. The States of Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, Pennsylvania, Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Wisconsin and Iowa, have enacted laws which either nullify the Acts of Congress or render useless any attempt to execute them. In many of these States the fugitive [slave] is discharged from service or labor claimed, and in none of them has the State Government complied with the stipulation made in the Constitution [to return the fugitive]. The State of New Jersey, at an early day, passed a law in conformity with her constitutional obligation; but the current of anti-slavery feeling has led her more recently to enact laws which render inoperative the remedies provided by her own law and by the laws of Congress. In the State of New York even the right of transit for a slave has been denied by her tribunals; and the States of Ohio and Iowa have refused to surrender to justice fugitives charged with murder, and with inciting servile insurrection in the State of Virginia. Thus the constituted compact has been deliberately broken and disregarded by the non-slaveholding States, and the consequence follows that South Carolina is released from her obligation… These ends it endeavored to accomplish by a Federal Government, in which each State was recognized as an equal, and had separate control over its own institutions. The right of property in slaves was recognized by giving to free persons distinct political rights, by giving them the right to represent, and burthening them with direct taxes for three-fifths of their slaves; by authorizing the importation of slaves for twenty years; and by stipulating for the rendition of fugitives from labor.

We affirm that these ends for which this Government was instituted have been defeated, and the Government itself has been made destructive of them by the action of the non-slaveholding States. Those States have assume the right of deciding upon the propriety of our domestic institutions; and have denied the rights of property established in fifteen of the States and recognized by the Constitution; they have denounced as sinful the institution of slavery; they have permitted open establishment among them of societies, whose avowed object is to disturb the peace and to eloign the property of the citizens of other States. They have encouraged and assisted thousands of our slaves to leave their homes; and those who remain, have been incited by emissaries, books and pictures to servile insurrection.

For twenty-five years this agitation has been steadily increasing, until it has now secured to its aid the power of the common Government. Observing the forms of the Constitution, a sectional party has found within that Article establishing the Executive Department, the means of subverting the Constitution itself. A geographical line has been drawn across the Union, and all the States north of that line have united in the election of a man to the high office of President of the United States, whose opinions and purposes are hostile to slavery. He is to be entrusted with the administration of the common Government, because he has declared that that “Government cannot endure permanently half slave, half free,” and that the public mind must rest in the belief that slavery is in the course of ultimate extinction.

This sectional combination for the submersion of the Constitution, has been aided in some of the States by elevating to citizenship, persons who, by the supreme law of the land, are incapable of becoming citizens; and their votes have been used to inaugurate a new policy, hostile to the South, and destructive of its beliefs and safety. On the 4th day of March next, this party will take possession of the Government. It has announced that the South shall be excluded from the common territory, that the judicial tribunals shall be made sectional, and that a war must be waged against slavery until it shall cease throughout the United States.

The guaranties of the Constitution will then no longer exist; the equal rights of the States will be lost. The slaveholding States will no longer have the power of self-government, or self-protection, and the Federal Government will have become their enemy.

Sectional interest and animosity will deepen the irritation, and all hope of remedy is rendered vain, by the fact that public opinion at the North has invested a great political error with the sanction of more erroneous religious belief.

We, therefore, the People of South Carolina, by our delegates in Convention assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, have solemnly declared that the Union heretofore existing between this State and the other States of North America, is dissolved, and that the State of South Carolina has resumed her position among the nations of the world, as a separate and independent State; with full power to levy war, conclude peace, contract alliances, establish commerce, and to do all other acts and things which independent States may of right do.

Adopted December 24, 1860″

In other words, the South wanted their states rights respected but the states of the South did not want to respect the rights of the Northern states to liberate any fugitive slave. WAR BASED ON HYPOCRISY. Again, the so-called “heritage” of the South, fighting to defend the right to own human beings they believed “incapable” of becoming citizens is NOTHING to be proud of. The Confederate states were treasonous traitors who waged war against the United States of America, killing over 300,000 REAL AMERICAN HEROES. These racists LOST. What is there to be proud of? NOTHING.

Anyone who tries to convince themselves that the history of the South is somehow romantic and noble is delusional and a racist, whether self-deceived or not. I am the grand-daughter of the South. I am the great-grand-daughter of a Mississippi Klansmen. I despise everything this so-called “heritage” stands for. I am an enlightened, educated individual. I am not a sheep of the South,

I am by no means a sheep of the South either. I am for historical accuracy.

As you rightly stated, the South wanted its state’s rights respected. I beg to differ on your analysis of their view of the north, however.

I would state the South saw the North as already having their rights respected. Whether they respected those rights or not would be a moot point; the Northern rights were in force. Southerners seeing this as Northern rights having superseded theirs. That view being supported by the near immediate secession of South Carolina upon the election of Lincoln.

While slavery was a major part of Southern state’s rights, it wasn’t the only factor. Taxation and self-governance as they saw fit being the major factors.

I agree that slavery was a big deal, but secession talks started in 1832 with the Nullification Crisis. There were MANY contributing factors, aside from slavery, that led to secession.

I agree with you on virtually everything else concerning your post.

The great thing about this forum is that we can have adult conversations without getting mad at each other. I hope that’s the case at least. I truly appreciate exchanging views on subjects such as this.

Any complaint to do with taxes or economics from the South against the North was at its core all about slavery because that was the foundation of the Southern economy. Revisionist history that has attempted to downplay the realities of the Confederates passion to continue slavery is a well known fact. That is why interpretation or relying on historians will only lead people astray. You must go back to the original documents and speeches of the people.

The documents of the Confederacy in their own words distinguish the difference between the North and the South as slave-holding states and non-slaveholding states. Every complaint is linked to the practice of slavery. The argument had been going on for 20 years. The reason being because the Northern states abolished slavery and practiced their states rights of providing safe haven for slaves that escaped and made it north. The South wanted the slaves returned. They wanted their state’s rights of ownership of other people as property to supercede the state’s rights of a northern state that considered no man to have the right to own another person. So, yes, their excuse of “state’s rights” was hypocritical at its very core when they used this term to justify treason, war and the resulting deaths of over 300,000 American citizens.

When the majority of the United States population made their wishes known the way a democratic republic does, through votes and elections, the South rebelled when they realized they were the minority. Rather than obey the law they rebelled, committed treason and started a war. Those are the facts. There is no interpretation.

And in their own words in their own Declaration of Secession it was ALL tied to the practice of slavery which fueled their economy. Southern apologists can try all they want to whitewash the truth but their “interpretations” are lies because they don’t want to trade their romantic ideas of “Gone With The Wind” for the realities of “Roots”.

Please, I was raised with these Southern apologetics and subtle racist false histories like a baby was raised on milk. I know all the coded language like “heritage” and “state’s rights”. Revisionist history, which is just a politically correct way of saying “lies”, is the main reason the southern states cannot face and move past their racism. They live in a false reality of the past which has created a false reality of the present. They are wrong. I’m from the South and when I got out of state controlled public education and educated myself I realized the truth. Unfortunately, many southerners are still trapped in this untruth.