Like for example a Panasonic GT series (50 or 55"), which is a really good plasma, or the admitted pricier 55" VT30. Or a Samsung 51" D7000 or D8000. There are serious bargain on that list.

Just looked at some reviews on Amazon. Alot of discussion about fluctuating brightness on GT's built prior to Aug 2011. Was this a real problem? Has it been solved? Also several comments about premature fading of blacks. Is this a legitimate complaint re GT's and VT's? Thanks.

To really appreciate it you need to be in a relaxed environment with some good source material. It is also important to have the set somewhat calibrated.

Nobody can convince you of something you do not want to believe, the difference is huge and worth every dollar.

The chain stores put material on that is difficult to appreciate a good set from a bad one.

If you do not want to spend the cash I suggest a Plasma, great blacks and lower prices.

The best full-array sets today are matching the Pioneer Elite of 3 years ago.

Watch golf or baseball on a Samsung D8000 with the settings on movie and you will see the grass in the edges of the screen washed out or brighter than the center.

Agree that "Nobody can convince you of something you do not want to believe" and reading up on edge lit vs full array, hence this follow up question to a posting from a while back...have you seen this year's Samsung, the ES8000? Seems many of the reviewers think it much improved over the D8000. If you have seen it do you think that while perhaps not perfect or as good as the better full arrays, the picture uniformity concerns have been in large part reduced/eliminated such that this is a TV worthy of strong consideration?

p.s. I'm a real big fan of the design so paranoid that going for this one may be analogous to being the sucker who goes for the "pretty girl" vs the complete package...

Generally, a Full Array LED back light should provide better and more uniform lighting than edge lit. Both can exhibit flash lighting, however, which is usually because of uneven pressure from the way the screen is mounted, manufacturing process screws ups, shipping , handling, and storage of the TV before it is sold, and possibly other factors such as having a thin and flimsy bezel around the screen. Also, it often seems that larger LCD/LED panels of 50" or more often have more issues because of sheer size and weight.

I just purchased an ES8000 last night and it is going back today. Horrible flash lighting, uniformity, and bright spots. Just my two cents.

Yeah, it seems Samsung's edge-lit LED-LCD models often have such issues, especially for those who watch TV at night with minimal to no lighting. While issues like flashlighting, clouding, and bright spots can occur on all LCD displays, it seems the edge-lit design is most prone to these kind of issues. I wish Samsung would make their higher end TVs full array and their cheaper ones edge-lit, not the other way around.

Yeah, it seems Samsung's edge-lit LED-LCD models often have such issues, especially for those who watch TV at night with minimal to no lighting. While issues like flashlighting, clouding, and bright spots can occur on all LCD displays, it seems the edge-lit design is most prone to these kind of issues. I wish Samsung would make their higher end TVs full array and their cheaper ones edge-lit, not the other way around.

However they prize the ultra-slim panel look in the high-end models, thats only possible with the edge-lit LED backlighting.

However they prize the ultra-slim panel look in the high-end models, thats only possible with the edge-lit LED backlighting.

That is always a trade off it seems. A thin bezel is attractive but often not substantial enough to evenly support a large LCD panel.

And flash lighting does seem to be more prone to edge lit and large panel designs, but also used to show up even in small 19" to 32" LCD TVs with CCFL back lighting. Some owners have found that loosening the screw a bit around the edge of the back of the bezel often reduces flash lighting also. Then, sometimes later they can be tightened back up after the panel relaxes a bit. But to me, why take a chance and just return the TV.

I just purchased an ES8000 last night and it is going back today. Horrible flash lighting, uniformity, and bright spots. Just my two cents.

I also just returned a 65es8000, they even exchanged it for me once at best buy. Mine had horrible vertical banding. I assume since the same issue happened for me on 2 TV's that they all have it when they get to that size. Since I prefer LED over Plasma because I like the brighter picture and my tv sits next to 2 very large , very bright windows I am now trying to decide which full array LED to buy. I honestly did not even do a ton of research before I purchased, I was so happy with all my previous Samsungs I just went out and bought the latest and greatest model.. total crap

The Samsung had a great picture for 95% of viewing, the problem is once you notice the vertical bands you cannot "unsee" them, and your eyes are drawn to them every time the camera pans. (especially noticeable when watching football)