I couldn't help it; it was beyond my control. I pulled into a grocery store parking lot. It was 10:00 P.M. and my son ran in. Next to me was parked a white truck with "Diebold - We Won't Rest" written on the side. There was nothing I could do. I reached into the glove box and pulled out a fattie black Magic Marker. The truck now reads "Diebold - We Steal Elections."

That simple act of vandalism like this, politically motivated wouldnt result in a chorus of condemnation. Oh yeah AK clearly put an offensive word, on a public place? no. How about a sticker? should stickers be allowed in public places? oh the crime the horrible horrible crime..

Breaking the law was the primary tactic of many great movements. Furthermore, we are talking of quite the minor law.

If someone makes such a statement and expresses such a message, that is what is important.

You can disagree with vandalism, but I would ask you to step back and look at the bigger picture, look at the actual impact this can make.

Making a stand for truth will bring good karma, while I doubt that making such a stand will incur bad karma. Also, I equally doubt anyone will gain much negative karma from sharing viewpoints on a message board.

As a side-note, karma is not something one can guess easily, but I can infer that much above (IMO, at least).

Rosebud57 posted flyers here that I have been putting up around Chicago that call for impeachment. There is nothing like the thrill I get from that. It reminds me of my highschool days and the TP we used to spread around. May I suggest some quality time with the kids. It is never to soon to start them along the right path. Kudos.

The poor guy driving the van probably has no union and this is the only job he could get in this jobless recovery. Now he has to explain this to his boss. Think people, THINK! Damnit. Let's do what makes us puff up our chests and say heh, "look at me". Real fucking bright.

But would his boss see it that way? He might ask, "How could you let this happen?" Boom, the guy's gone. There is only so much of slamming our dicks on the table, to make a point, that we end up hurting others.

Bottom line, Yeah great. You stuck it to Diebold, but you may have screwed the poor, non-union represented, minimum wage worker.

13. I think of it as un-defacing property. "Refacing" the slogan to be true

Sometimes a freedom fighter's weapon is a Sharpie. And as for admitting to a crime, I didn't see you do it. I went to a Board of Elections meeting in Hocking County, Ohio. A Repug board member admitted in the meeting to accepting items at the office for a Repug fundraiser -- grounds for censure or dismissal -- but the Chair chose to take no action, as he did not personally witness the misdeeds. When asked why the Board had dismissed the Dem member (Sherole Eaton) who reported voting machine company employee tampering with a machine and posting a "cheat sheet" before the recount -- no reason need be given, and, no, he did not witness any wrongdoing. The punishment I imagine for corrupt vote stealers would make Robespierre blush. SO they're getting off easy with a little editorial markup.

Being a vandal? Are you willing to get caught and live with the ensuing criminal record? Would it be worth it? You must learn some restraint and pick your fights a little better.

That's no better than the assholes that turfed my lawn to run over the campaign signs in my yard. Same M.O.

Also many grocery stores have digital video surveillance of their parking lots. Some systems are very unobtrusive and Diebold is just one of the firms that offer security services from internal alarms and cameras to external video; that may be why the vehicle was parked there. Your actions very well may have been recorded; at least your car could be. And yes, they can read your license plates.

" (2) (A) If the amount of defacement, damage, or destruction isless than four hundred dollars ($400), vandalism is punishable byimprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year, or by a fine ofnot more than one thousand dollars ($1,000), or by both that fineand imprisonment."

REBEL, breaking law is true rebellion. In this case she spreads the word, while defacing a van that owned by a company which has and still is screwing the people, and is actively participating in stealing their votes. Rebel, defy the illegitimate authority.

All that cruelty, all that truth scribbled on the side of a truck. Its just too much to envision.

Gosh, I sure am glad all those dead corpses decaying in the streets of Baghdad and Fajullah didn't get marked on. Nope. They just got 'shocked and awed'and napalmed and bullets through their bodies and heads.

the driver of the truck to lose his job? Let's assume for a moment that he's non-union and trying to feed a family of four in this failing economy. Let's say he has a sick child, and has to forego paying his mortgage to pay his medical bills? Would you still be so smug?

"There was nothing I could do." There most certainly was something you could have done; resisted your urge to deface property that doesn't belong to you.

In my book the four worst acts are:

MurderMolestation/RapeThieveryVandalism

I hate * for the first three, and if I had proof he was a vandal, I'd hate him for that too.

The thing that gets me is how many people here think it's OK to vandalize something that doesn't belong to you in order to make a statement.

Smugness? I thought the post had an edge of ironic bafflement: "I can't believe what I just did," more than "I'm the Leader of the Revolution!" We ought to be open to critique each other's ideas and actions here, but let's save the bile for the murdererous usurpers in the White House and their enablers in Congress and the press... and the upper levels of Diebold.

I don't think that the way to bring wingnuts back from the darkside is to show them that we'll vandalize their things if they don't believe the same way we do.

And if you think we can make the world a better place, or this country for that matter, by foresaking the wingnuts then I say you need to think again. The "us" and "them" mentality isn't helping a bit. We can't get back the power without at least a few of the wingnuts seeing the error of their ways. Ideas will win hearts and minds before vandalism will.

You are correct; your tiny gesture isn't in any way comparable to the actions of those two.

I'd say that those of us on the left are pretty much convinced already that election fraud took place. Wouldn't you? Given that, your message only catches the attention of those we're trying to persuade because it's vandalism. I don't think that kind of action makes for many converts.

As for wagging my finger at Cindy or Rosa, in Rosa's case I must admit to being a bit young to understand it all (I was born in 1961) but I wouldn't have if I were alive then. In Cindy's case NO, I did not wag my finger at her. But as far as I know, she didn't VANDALIZE anyone's property. Had she, then I'd have held fast to the same anti-vandalism opinion I'm voicing now.

Gandhi from India showed the world what non-violent protests could accomplish. He cracked the then almightyBritish Empire by leading strictly non-violent protests.He taught his followers to never throw rocks or molotovcocktails at others. If the police attacked the protesters,the protesters never fought back. They simply went to jail.

Guess what, no one got seriously hurt, no one's privateproperty was damged and vandalized. And India became thefirst nation to become independent from the British Empire.

If you want to protest against Diebold or any other outfit,by all means march peacefully and protest in front of theirplace of business. I don't believe Cindy or Rosa defacedanything. They are both true heroes. A vandal could never bea hero.

594. (a) Every person who maliciously commits any of the followingacts with respect to any real or personal property not his or herown, in cases other than those specified by state law, is guilty ofvandalism: (1) Defaces with graffiti or other inscribed material. (2) Damages. (3) Destroys.

Jesus...this is getting out of hand in a hurry. Christ,the driver won't loose his job,unless he's NOT supposed to be at that store in the first place. I don't condone using a magic marker on vehicles but I sure as hell don't condone election THEFT and FRAUD either.

It was impulsive because of 5 years of built-up rage and frustration over the fact that the Republicans have gotten away with election fraud not once, not twice, but three times (2000, 2002, and 2004).

I made a statement, albeit illegal, against a corrupt system that I, quite frankly, have little hope will change. John Q. Public MUST know what is going on. This truck is now a billboard, and the driver will not be held responsible for this (my father is an insurance agent and told me so).

I consider it a service rendered. My neck, not yours.

You're welcome.

Ps: The "it was beyond my control" was an homage to Dangerous Liasons.

159. you are lobbing grenades at me -- and for what? -- let's break it down

my word "DEFACED":* To mar or spoil the appearance or surface of; disfigure.

*****************************

your accusation "VANDALISM":* Willful or malicious destruction of public or private property.

*****************************

There is nothing about the word "defaced" alone that denotes permanence which I feel is the deal-breaker when it comes to vandalism. I did NOT destroy the property, therefore, in fact did NOT vandalize it.

The Magic Marker, although stating it is permanent on the pen itself, has long since been "cracked" by the clean sleuths out there and I proved on my own vehicle that it was, in fact, not permanent. I didn't state that fact in my OP because most folks already know that.

about a pretty innocuous post, and then accuse me of being defensive. I used precisely the words I intended in my post, words that describe what I wanted to say, and you kept reading more and more into the whole thing. I don't feel superior to anybody, I have simply responded to your incessant negativity.

I don't think you ever had a point, really. So I guess we're done. Thank god.

Ps: Perhaps we should take a poll on who has issues here. I hope whatever is making you the way you are improves in your life. Life is too short to be so anal-retentive about nothing.

get a life. Two elections were stolen, thousands are dying for a war of lies, our freedoms have been trampled on, the environment destroyed, the economy sucks, etc. and you are going to chastise her for taking a little frustration out on a truck. Geez, our priorities are a little out of whack.

My kids are teens now, but when they were younger they would try to excuse their bad behavior by outlining what their sibling had done to "make them" act badly. That didn't fly in our house. And it should not fly here either.

Ethical consistency is a big priority for me. It staves off hypocrisy. If it's not important to you, that's your problem, but it begs the question of whose priorities are actually out of whack.

But got defensive when called on your thoughtless, childish actions. Sorry to be you.

Yes, that driver could very well have lost his job. Many companies have an inspection policy when the vehicle is pre-tripped and then when it comes back into the yard. If that vandalism wasn't noticed and noted by the driver and management finds out on the next inspection report, they can take action against that driver. I've seen it done, many times.

If you obscured the company name, the DRIVER could get a ticket.If it had a DOT number or inspection sticker that you covered up or obscured with marker, the DRIVER is held responsible and ticketed.

I don't care that you think that you struck one against 'the man', it would come down on some working stiff.

That's what I thought. As the owner of a trucking company and responsible for the safe operation and reporting to the state and federal governments for it on a quarterly basis, maybe I might know a little bit about the proper identification, inspection, proper numbering and lettering, proper placement of tax stickers, and the penalties and indemnities for the improper placement thereof, missing, obscured or defaced lettering, of commercial vehicles, etc., yes, my knowledge on this matter is VASTLY SUPERIOR to yours.

I will repeat myself: any. Corporate logos included. In have one on my vehicle and it is part of my DOT lettering, city and state. If it was defaced, missing or obscured I would be cited at least, put out of service at worst. Inspection of all relevant lettering and numbering is part of a daily federal inspection report, and is taken very seriously. Try going past a DOT inspection station without displaying the current year IFTA sticker, properly placed.

My problem is not with the vehicle being defaced, it is the thoughtless action that very well could result in some poor working stiff who is just trying to earn a living to feed his family might get his ass in a sling because someone thinks that they are being witty. The OP refuses to recognize this.

The vehicle doesn't care what the OP did. But the driver is responsible for it, no matter what.

I'm not cheering on his actions, either. I'm just saying that seeing a truck with Diebold We Steal Elections on it would be quite humorous.

That being said, while this prank was definitely juvenile, it was also pretty much harmless. How is the driver going to be in trouble because somebody defaced his truck? Furthermore, he defaced it with a black marker. I'm no expert on the subject but I would imagine that it will come off with the next car wash. It's no more harmful than a bird taking a shit on his windshield.

In the United States the practice became known by the name "Australian ballot". The first President of the United States elected under the Australian ballot was president Grover Cleveland in 1892. Elections in the United States are now almost always held by secret ballot, with party nominating caucuses in some states--most significantly the leadoff Presidential nominating state of Iowa--requiring an open casting of ballots. A Pennsylvania state legislator long active in election reform issues, Rep. Mark B. Cohen of Philadelphia, said "The secret ballot guarantees that it is one's private opinion that counts. Open ballots are not truly free for those whose preferences defy the structures of power or friendship."

The UK secret ballot arrangements are sometimes criticised because it is possible to link a ballot paper to the voter that cast it. Each ballot paper is individually numbered and each elector has a number. When an elector is given a ballot paper, their number is noted down on the counterfoil of the ballot paper (which also carries the ballot paper number).

This measure is justified as a security arrangement so that if there was an allegation of fraud, false ballot papers could be identified. The process of matching ballot papers to voters is only permissible if an Elections Court requires it, and this is an extremely unlikely occurrence. The legal authority for this system is set out in the Parliamentary Elections Rules in Schedule 1 of the Representation of the People Act 1983.

the only reason vandalizing a truck owned by one of the most dangerous corporations in America is if the driver of the truck lost his job, which is highly unlikely.

Look people I don't condone vandalism either. If I saw someone walk up to a historical building and scribble graffiti on it I would be PISSED and do something about it. If someone makes a graffiti mural on some crumbeling highway underpass I would applaud the person. There is a huge difference between those two acts.

This is the same case if he just vandalized the truck for anarchy's sake there is no justification, but he didn't. If this was some start up company that was struggeling that would also be wrong. Diebold is a monster it can take a small punch in the arm every now and again. Not to mention what the company actually does.

Is there a reason some of you folks here refuse to digest that tidbit?

You really like to hear yourself expound on a soapbox regardless of whether or not the topic is moot, and it's a lot of hot air IMO.

Get a f***ing life.

On edit and FYI: I tried the marker on my own car. I used WD40 and then Mr. Clean's Magic Eraser and it came off. Also there are tons of other remedies as well. Happy? Hell no, because you aren't paying attention. You just like to go off ....

permanent damage and was undoubtedly dismayed when he or she saw the vandalism. This person is what you could call "an innocent bystander." as he/she, I am sure, is not aware of the sins of Diebold and is only an employee of the company. Why should this person be a victim?

" (b) (1) If the amount of defacement, damage, or destruction isfour hundred dollars ($400) or more, vandalism is punishable byimprisonment in the state prison or in a county jail not exceedingone year, or by a fine of not more than ten thousand dollars($10,000), or if the amount of defacement, damage, or destruction isten thousand dollars ($10,000) or more, by a fine of not more thanfifty thousand dollars ($50,000), or by both that fine andimprisonment. (2) (A) If the amount of defacement, damage, or destruction isless than four hundred dollars ($400), vandalism is punishable byimprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year, or by a fine ofnot more than one thousand dollars ($1,000), or by both that fineand imprisonment. (B) If the amount of defacement, damage, or destruction is lessthan four hundred dollars ($400), and the defendant has beenpreviously convicted of vandalism or affixing graffiti or otherinscribed material under Section 594, 594.3, 594.4, 640.5, 640.6, or640.7, vandalism is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail fornot more than one year, or by a fine of not more than five thousanddollars ($5,000), or by both that fine and imprisonment.

Clearly having addressed what my critics perceive to be their "legitimate" concerns, they aren't satisfied and continue to expound hot air on their soapboxes.

At least some of you folks understand the bigger picture and the fact that electronic voting machine fraud has been swept under the carpet. At least for a while people will either be instructed or reminded in my tiny corner of the world.

But I do understand why you did it. I guess it's a sign of the times when mothers in grocery store parking lots are so fet up with the current situation that they feel the need to express that frustration.

Really, I do. I'm not just being a contrarian. I wrote graffiti in New York City for 12 years. Lots of it, too. Trains, highways, trucks, streets, etc. One little mark on a Diebold truck makes me laugh. We used to hit whole trains one end to the other, both sides, with fill-ins. And by the way, don't sweat the so-called surveillance. Nobody looks at that shit, much less comes after you behind it. It's meant to stop you in advance, not catch you afterwards, unless you've committed a class A or B felony.

And yes, damn proud of what we did in those days. Your ridiculous morality means nothing to me with respect to that. The acts make sense only within the subculture, and anyone outside it is of absolutely no importance. I feel no need to explain or justify to you. We did it because we could, and we were damn good at it too. Never got caught. Got chased a few times (OK, a lot), but never got caught.

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