While in the height of conflict with psychopaths or those with psychopathic features, sometimes, we scare people. I don’t mean Halloween “scary costume” scary. I don’t mean “things that go bump in the night” scary. No, I mean “take a look at yourself” scary. There are those around us who will see us go through what we do, and back away, simply because they realize that what we are experiencing or have experienced is just too strange and horrible to handle.

Maybe they don’t understand. Maybe they don’t know what to say to us, as this is a special type of trauma. Often, some of us give others a “pass” for those reasons. That is perfectly understandable. However, I believe that there are those who do know and understand, yet still choose to bury their heads.

Why are there those with such feelings of trepidation? If they become involved, even with only the minor facts of our stories, they may be forced to face the possibility that they could be in our positions at some point in time. It may be too unpleasant for them to imagine. No one is immune to these experiences and the thought of our plights becoming theirs may be overwhelming. Some may feel that is best to pretend as though this could not occur in their worlds.

How will we know?

We should not expect those around us to come out and express their fears. It is possible that they are not even consciously aware of their feelings, actions or responses. Nonetheless, if they are, in fact, afraid, it becomes clear before long, even though initially we may misinterpret that fear as something else.

What will they do?

They may pull away, be unwilling or unable to listen, or attempt to make light of our feelings on the matter. They may suggest that we are not feeling the feelings we say we are or that we need to “get over it” and move on, offering little support.

What should we do?

While moving forward is important, it is a gradual process and will come in time. If we encounter those who think this way, we should try our hardest not to internalize what they do or say, or in many cases, fail to say. This is very important because we should not take on any more unnecessary burden. It’s not healthy or helpful. We do not need to process their baggage in addition to that with which the sociopath has left us.

It may hurt at first because it is unpleasant and frustrating, but in the end, as with much of the rest of the issues that surround these experiences, their reactions may turn out to be a gift. As we grow and become whole again, we usually come to see the people who reacted in this manner very differently. We may no longer like what we see. We may come to see them as very “go along to get along,” and lose respect, because it is hard to respect those who stands for nothing. We may come to realize that these relationships were littered with conditions. The most important one being the demand for silence in our times of need.

As we recover

With recovery should also come some form of a rebirth, where we emerge better than we were before. As I have said before, we may sometimes need to leave our old methods of quantifying “better” behind. This may not materialize in the traditional sense. For example, if stripped financially, we may never be where we would have been under different circumstances. If faced to choose different career avenues, we may never achieve a level we once dreamed of. In truth, the scars the psychopaths may be very deep. However, that is not to say that once we do redefine, that we cannot find happiness and satisfaction. We can. Further, when we have little to lose, we may be willing to take some risks that go completely against our grains, but are sometimes necessary to excel. What this means is highly individual.

In the process, we may benefit greatly from purging ourselves of the negative relationships, that surprisingly are not just attached to the psychopaths or individuals with psychopathic features who are or were in our lives. We may need to take this action with those we “scare.” We can only control our actions, so we must act in ways that benefit our health and well being. With that, we will have energy for those who do matter.

In time, some may end up wishing they had handled things differently. Many won’t be phased either way. But maybe if they had, they would have learned a thing or two about their own strengths. However, they chose their safety nets of silence, demonstrating only their weaknesses.

I recently saw an inspirational quote that stated, “hard times reveal true friends.” That could not be more right on. Real friends do not scare easily, they walk with us through this time as best they can. Those who won’t, may not deserve to walk with us in our good times either. These experiences give us the opportunity to see the difference in a world where sometimes things get murky. Good luck out there!

88

Comment on this article

Linda thank you for your post. It is so true. I used to be very social. I entertained & held dinner parties had my kids friends over in groups, offered shelter to those visiting or in need. Loaned money, gave gifts on holidays or for no reason at all. Lent a helping hand to anyone who needed it or asked. The behavior of these people during the fall & the aftermath contribute to the PTSD factors especially isolation & the feelings that the incident is still occurring. It seems the repercussions continue on. The psychopath was the bomb & these people who we scare are the shrapnel.

I am constantly told that it is my fault as I picked the psychopath like one might purposely chose a rotten melon in the store instead of the fresh firm ones from the bin. There isn’t an PRG (Psychopath Recovery Group) on the planet for support. Nor a Veterans Administration center to provide services. In fact there is no reason to leave my house at all. I have very litle if any means to do so even if I had a reason. I am the woman in the commercial who has fallen & cannot get up. There isn’t a LifeAlert, Redcross, Goodwill or Salvation Army coming to my rescue. I can’t call the police or the fire department for help. I don’t know where to turn. It’s like I’ve been captured by the Joker & put in a shrinking room where the walls & ceilings are closing in & Batman & Robin are no where to be found.

I wonder constantly who I am & know for a fact I will never be the same. I am more isolated than ever. I feel damaged & marked. I wonder where these people are & often who they were. Donna wrote an open letter to the Attorneys of victims of psychopaths that was spot on. There needs to be more awareness, education & support services to deal with those of us left in the ashes without any other means of support to help us. We’re out of work (I am ), in need of housing, medical care, mental therapy, money, food, clothing, abandoned by friends & family. We are reduced to relying on welfare when prior to the psychopath we may have been 500,000 thousand miles away from ever being in such a position.

Donna is doing an amazing job but she is one person. How can we band together & begin to set this war we are waging, the traumatization we experience, the disorder it causes, the services required, the stigmatization of the situation it has put us in recognized as a crime & not a social disease that we have contracted. How can we organize community support & meetings. How can we put this in front of law enforcement & the legal system as a crime epidemic that needs to be honored not dismissed as a hysterical person who was spurned.

I want to help do this as I think it would help me help myself & others. I need these services like I need water & rain in the desert. I suspect many people do. Donna has begun the process. How do we take it to the next step. I need to know before it’s too late for me. Lillian

May 2, 2013 7:23 am

Catherine

It would be good to have help, but sometimes, for some things, there isn’t. We can work so that the next ones have that help, but if when we need it now and there is none, or few, we have to take what it is available and fight alone to get through. I think, at to some point, whenever we feel really bad, we are like a little kid who falls and cries for mummy to come. We are really hurt, why there is no one here? That is the normal reaction, we were trained to be like that. But what happens if the kid cries and mummy is not there? Well, the kid stops crying and gets up by himself. Sometimes, to know that there is no rescue, that it is really up to us to stand up and walk, does wonders. A step a day, doesn’t have to be much, but a step a day. No excuses. No waiting for a miracle, there is just the step a day solution. Take it. When you are out, and you will be, you will be stronger than ever, because you will know you are self-reliant and you would have killed many fears on the way. A step a day 🙂

You are very welcome. I am truly very sorry that you have had to endure the things that you have described. Nothing about any of it is right or acceptable. Also, you are not just dealing with one trauma, but rather, several all at one time.

You are experiencing things and feelings probably most of us do in the aftermath of these ordeals. I agree that a support group for this would be wonderful and you are not alone in wanting this. I have not been able to find a way to bring this to fruition yet, but do think about it a lot.

I know what it is like to feel the world spinning out of control around you. I found that I had to concentrate on improving only one thing at a time and take baby steps in doing so. For example, you said that you like being social. I think most of us are. That was probably part of the attraction in the first place. We are/were full of life! After we have been through the things we have, as I always say, we must redefine. So…rather than having large parties or lots of people over, how about finding one person, whose time you enjoy and is supportive and get together with him or her? You can stay in or go out. It doesn’t matter. The important thing is that you are enjoying someone socially. It’s a start. You are doing something you enjoy slowly.

You also mentioned getting out. I also found that leaving the house also sort of automatically boosted my spirits. I cannot explain it since I am a bit of a homebody, but I would find somewhere to go that was free or where I would only need to spend a very minimal amount of money. I felt like I got away from it all for a little. Maybe if you feel ready, give it a whirl. See what you think. If you don’t like it, save it for later and work on one other area you want to make better instead.

You mentioned work too. It is one tough market out there at the moment. We are pros at beating ourselves up. Give it all your effort, but if it still isn’t happening at the moment, really try not to internalize it. It may truly not be your fault at all. I tried for two years, before finally choosing a different direction. It turned out to be the best thing that happened. However, no one could have told me that as I was caught up in feeling bad about it.

As far as the blame for choosing him goes, this is where I had to train myself to stop listening to people who thought that way. This is soooooo hard, since we tend to take responsibility. However, we have to stop trying to convince. When I did, I was happier. Who, in their right mind, would choose a psychopath? Not you. Not me. They packaged themselves very differently and deceivingly. We did not choose them. We chose the persona they presented. If we feel secure in this knowledge, that is all that matters. It doesn’t change what others do and say, but it changes how we view them and the extent to which we care. People think LOTS of things that are incredibly wrong on many topics.

As far as who you are…you are probably the same person you have always been. The only difference is that you have been through a very serious and damaging battle. Hang in there. Try to be good to yourself. Do at least one nice thing for yourself every day. It could be as simple as telling yourself that you will not allow anyone’s comments to make you feel bad and then stick to it. Make one improvement every day. Trust me, it can be minor and may not look like much. However, over the course of, let’s say six months, look back and see if you at least feel better. Check into social programs in your area while you continue to look for work or get other training/education. It’s crazy challenging out there, I know. Keep posting here. The support is wonderful and you CAN get through this life altering experience.

Linda

May 2, 2013 8:41 am

Tea Light

Lillian, I have thought often how I’d benefit from a socio/psychopath survivors support group – LF in a church hall or community centre, once a week, survivors sharing, literature for borrowing and discussion. The social aspect of life is very challenging for me too post breakdown caused my sexual assaults. My anxiety levels are high though becoming manageable as nc clocks up. Linda’s suggestions are great. I agree that having one trusted easy going friend for dinner or to hang out maybe watching a film is a good reentry to sociability, just an hour or two, until confidence increases. For me one reason I’ve isolated is because I did not want people knowing what had happened. I felt ashamed. I share here and with my counselor, that’s it.

May 2, 2013 12:50 pm

Cassandrasdream

I agree that we don’t choose to be with sociopaths. We choose to be with the people they are pretending to be. If we were unable to let down our defenses and let someone in, we’d never have relationships. Not all people are exploitative vampires like sociopaths.

But once you’ve encountered one, once you’ve fallen in love, let them into your life and home, become intimate with one, then you realize the potential for disaster. The first phase of their game is so convincing and tempting: the lovebombing, the heated race to move in or marry, (for some) the “passion” demonstrated during sex, etc. You have to understand the game to get out during this euphoria phase. It’s meant to play on normal human emotions and vulnerabilities. That’s why it works on so many people.

Now that I’ve let a few of these psychos into my life, I know that lovebombing, blaming and demonizing ex-wives and ex-girlfriends, pity play, too much commitment too soon, the push to get me to make promises, etc. is a dangerous beginning that will quickly turn into devaluing, blaming, criticism, deceit, hostility, and mind games. But who knows this growing up? You have to experience it or get the information from a REALLY good teacher. Or if you have a very, very strong sense of yourself and have been through very little trauma in your life, you may be healthy and strong enough to get out at the first sign of danger. I don’t know. I personally was a target, because I was lonely and I had a traumatic childhood.

My marriage, which ended more than 2 years ago was my final lesson. The boyfriend who came (and went quickly) after was proof I’d learned my lesson. I got rid of him after about two months. He has a long history of playing women. Once he was in a serious relationship with a co-worker who didn’t know for months that he was still living with his ex-girlfriend! How did he pull that off? I have no idea. It’s amazing what these types can do. It wasn’t until he got into a car accident that the new girlfriend/co-worker found out he was still living with the old girlfriend. And guess what? The old girlfriend was a former co-worker at the same place of employment!

When he got out of his second marriage (where he was supposedly cheated on and dumped by his wife), he said he knew he could get this other woman he’d been flirting with for months. This woman was yet ANOTHER co-worker at the same job. He ended up marrying her and said she cheated on him, too and that he was a saint. I don’t believe it, because he got involved with an ex-crack addict with no job before that divorce was even filed. And the crack addict woman was still living with and married to her husband WHILE my ex-boyfriend was dating her. These sociopaths are drawn to drama and destruction. He accused one wife of selling all his family’s heirloom gold jewelry. He accused another one of stealing phone service on his Verizon account. But the crack addict woman who stole the phone service and charged up his bill is the woman he starting pursuing again behind my back after only a few weeks of dating me.

When I look back it is such a horrible mess. It old him of course he tolerates cheating and bad behavior, because that is what HE DOES himself. I really believe you have to become the person you want to be with. I mean, if you want honesty, you are honest. If you want commitment, you are committed And the list goes on. Sociopaths don’t even think about that stuff. They just want to drain people for all they can get.

May 2, 2013 3:21 pm

Catherine

I completely agree with that. You can just tolerate the things you could do yourself. And when someone has tolerated more, really check how the do really feel and react while talking about it, because they might have tolerate it because they were doing the same or worse.

May 2, 2013 4:50 pm

thejb

Cassandrasdream – reading your post kinda freaked me out because you described my ex husband to a “T”. And oddly, he too was fooling around with an ex-crack addict behind my back and ended up leaving me the first time for her. He too was married 3 times before me, but the marriage endings were always someone else’s fault and this one or that one cheated on him. I had to reply, I am stunned at the similarity. I literally JUST, less than an hour ago joined this site, and have had 3 OH WOW moments just reading these posts.

May 4, 2013 12:46 am

Cassandrasdream

Dear thejb:

Wow. I am surprised and not surprised. He is at a military training for three weeks and he is still trying to keep the game going. I am not allowing that to happen. I know he needs a “support system” while he is away. He is still talking to the ex-crack addict. I think she may be even condo sitting for him to watch his cats while he is gone. But I am not sure.

My ex sociopath boyfriend cannot stand to be alone. So he sets up people in his life, reels them in and does whatever he can to keep them in place. There is no love involved. Although, he throws that word around a lot.

I think he believes he was a victim in his past marriages and relationships. Everyone cheated on him and he did nothing wrong. Yet, when he brags about how he knew he could get one woman if he lost the other, you can tell this is a load of crap.

I know he is terribly wounded. But he needs to heal that. I can’t. And I would have destroyed my life trying.

Lillian,
It would be an ideal situation if there were more support and understanding of such frightful situations!Linda is “spot on” about people being afraid;not knowing how to deal with this kind of situation or even what will really help.She also gave excellent suggestions for healing.

There was a young woman(visiting)in my apt complex that was beaten.While residents have shown concern,I intend to “go out on a limb” to help her get started with her new life.Because I have been abused,I know what to do.Those who haven’t been abused want to get as far away as possible.It doesn’t mean they’re bad people.There’s just a difference in the way people respond.Little do they realize that sometimes they don’t need to even open their mouths and try to say the “right thing”!Sometimes a warm hug means even more!I remember people shaking their heads and telling me that “no one else would have stayed as long as you have-you are really strong!”That was nice,but the hugs always meant more!I think alot of the reason people respond with a lack of compassion or empathy for a woman or man who has been in such a situation is that we live in a society of “disposable everything” including relationships.You’re expected to be “smart enough” to walk away the MOMENT things start going wrong.It’s just not that simple.Some stay because they are living by a moral or value system.They should not be “devalued” in anyone’s eyes.Once they’re educated about sociopaths though,they understand it’s more than they can handle.So it all boils down to education.

Lillian,
The next time someone wants to say you deliberately chose that psycopath,illustrate it this way and maybe they’ll understand!It’s like getting up to the meat counter and choosing that fresh looking ground beef…oh your mouth waters as you think about the tacos you’re gonna make and eat tonight!After finishing your grocery shopping you head home and put everything away and put the ground beef on to cook….OMG!The middle is all gray,yuck!You didn’t do that on purpose!

May 2, 2013 3:51 pm

Catherine

That’s the thing, the problem here is this is all legal. But imagine one guy dressed like a policeman with a fake credential calling at your door. Even if you let him enter you can denounce him. Of course we are talking here about a private issue and it could be invasive and very complex to make a law, but THIS WAS FRAUD.

May 2, 2013 4:57 pm

Tea Light

The meat analogy made me LOL thanks Blossom, I needed that my counselor told me today the service is closing due to lack of funding. My counseling is run by the church with some funding from their own resources, some from client donations and some from government. The government has cut their support and they can’t keep going. So I lose my counselor in July. I felt very upset when he told me. I need to be grateful its lasted this long.

Tea Light,
I know how you feel.Since I was counselled at a DV shelter,I’m grateful,they were able to do it as long as they were;but the truth is they only have so many funds.Their main job is helping battered women (and children if there are any).I know they’ve had a number of emergencies come up because I had to reschedule some of my counselling appts.And then just recently,the girl visiting my apt complex was beat up by her husband,so there’s a case that I know of personally.But I keep thinking about what my counselor said,that as we focus on helping others,we build our self-esteem and continue to heal~~~that certainly applies here at Lovefraud!But I also look for other ways to help and brighten people’s days!

May 3, 2013 12:56 am

the sisterhood

Thank you for this article, Linda. I can’t tell you how demoralizing it is when my friends tell me, “You really need to let that go and get over it. You’ve got to forgive him. Everyone makes mistakes.”

They just don’t grasp the severity of what I’m going through and that really does make them confused. They, in turn, put it back on me like I am the one who is messed up. They would never let anyone interfere with their emotional well being long after the fact. They don’t understand what CPTSD is and they certainly don’t understand triggers.

It is a very lonely position to be in. I have learned to act like I’ve moved on and everything is peachy. But I still deal with the pangs of heartbreak and depression whenever a trigger happens. I’ve done really well in these past few years learning how to diminish the pain of the triggers, but they still happen and will most likely continue to happen. That is just what I have to deal with. This is the “gift” I was left with by the disordered people in my life.

It all does get better with honesty to myself and hard work, but I can’t truly count on my friends for support, That’s why I’m on LF. It has given me a safe place to express my feelings and has also given me valuable information when I need it.

the sisterhood,
I’m glad that none of my friends tell me that!Of course they have watched me try to make things work for yrs and they know after awhile “it’s just not your fault after all”!But I can remember a time when I felt like I was “doing the wrong thing” by trying to leave the situation.

Emotional abuse does scar it’s victims…it’s shadow doesn’t leave once you walk out the door!Perhaps you should allow people to see how you feel…people need to be educated about emotional abuse.It’s bad enough that many turn a deaf ear(or their backs)on physical abuse.People are afraid of getting involved & afraid of getting hurt themselves in the process.

May 3, 2013 1:08 am

the sisterhood

Blossom4th,
I think the frustration and loneliness happens for me because I have educated my friends on personality disorders and the emotional abuse they inflict. They seem to listen the first time, but if I ever bring it up again they either brush it off and change the subject, or roll their eyes and look at me like, “There she goes again thinking everyone has a personality disorder.” It really seems like they’d rather keep living with the blinders on because it’s just too difficult to look at everyone and ourselves as either being a victim or a perpetrator.

Because I truly think we are in one category or the other. Victim of the disordered or the disordered. I think we are just not aware of being the victim unless we know what we are dealing with. Especially if we are comfortable with making excuses for bad behavior or they are just merely friends that we only associate with occasionally. We can choose to distance ourselves for a while and go back when we think it just might be a fun time again. I have college friends like that. One in particular is so self-absorbed that it’s kind of funny. But all the other roommates make excuses for her behavior by saying, “Well, that’s just the way she is. They just want to keep the “girls” get- togethers going and don’t want to rock the boat. There may be occasional bitching about the roommate by the others, but in the end they always make peace with it because they want to continue to party with her and have “fun”. I’m at a point where I’m over it, but I admit that I haven’t completely given up on hanging out with her even after knowing what a NPD she is.

It’s only when in a close family or intimate relationship that we really start to evaluate what is really going on. It affects us more personally. More to the soul.

So I don’t think I’ll ever make any headway with any of my friends. I have accepted that this is really my journey and my journey only. It is lonely and miserable at times. I reach levels of frustration I never though imaginable. But I do get by, somehow. I think it’s pure determination on my part not to let the disordered people in my life win. If I get bitter, they win. If I cry victim, they win. If I take my own life because I can’t take it anymore, they win. I WON”T let them win. It’s my last stand.

Again, I thank Donna for giving me this outlet. It has been profound in my recovery and healing.

May 6, 2013 2:26 pm

lost everything

I don’t know that others are afraid of us per say. I think they can see the damage that was done to us and are afraid that they can become victims of a sociopath or perhaps they, albeit on some unconscious level, see some of the things we tell them, happening in their lives as well. It is very hard to let go of the innocence is bliss way of living. Reality is a very hard thing to face; life is, many times, easier to navigate with blinders on.

I also see that many of these people that are ‘afraid of us’ are possibly embarrassed/ashamed of themselves for not using clear specific words and examples, when they ‘saw things’ that we were too close to see, rather they spoke in broad terms or general statements.

Some of us did the same thing in the past as the ‘afraid people’ doing now. I know I discounted the sweeping statements others made. I distanced myself from people who made disparaging remarks. I didn’t see them as helpful or constructive, rather as jealousy on their part. One of the spath’s extracurricular ‘girlies’ said it best: “My girls and my friends don’t understand him the way I do”. She was blind sided by him too.

I was always interested in politics from childhood. As a teenager and young adult, I was very active in age appropriate political groups. When I started to date the spath, I would bring him to meetings, social get togethers, and other dos. Why wouldn’t I, he agreed with my views and could quote my favorite authors and politicians better than me. In the beginning, at these gatherings, the spath would sit by himself and be very quitet; after a while, he became more comfortable and found his very well-versed voice. My friends in these groups would ask me why am I bringing him and tell me that he was too polished, a little to pat. My reaction was “these people are jealous because he is so smart”. Eventually they ignored me and I gave up my involvement.

I didn’t see the spath’s goal of isolating me from people I shared an interest with.

Then there was the friend/business acquaintance of my father and uncle. When my uncle died in 1978, this man drove a long distance to come to his wake. I knew of the man, but never met him before. I introduced him to this gentleman and proceeded to tell him that the spath was going to XXX law school. The fella said that his son really wanted to go to law school as well but his grades were just not up to par and was going for his grad degree. The spath listened to my conversation and after awhile spoke to this man about this man’s business field. While I never met this man face to face again, over the next several years, when he would call asking for my father, he would be very curt when I brought the spath up. I developed a deep dislike for him. My reaction again “he is jealous because his son didn’t go to law school”.

I didn’t see that this well experienced business gentleman was uncomfortable around the spath.

My cousin with whom I grew up with as more sisters then a more distant relative, at first was very close to the spath. The three of us would always hang together, even after I married him. She would fly up to visit in law school and we would even ‘double date’, when she was going out with her future husband. Then she started to distance herself. She made no trips to visit during the last year of law school, the phone calls stopped or she always rushed to hang up if I called, etc… . One more time, I blamed jealousy, her future husband was having a difficult time passing his professional exam.

I didn’t see she wanted to be with me, not the person that I was becoming to please the spath.

We were estranged for decades due to a ‘family feud” not involving us, rather our mothers and their mother. When my mom died, I called my cousin to let her know, as she was her godmother. We reconnected for a little over a year, and during that time I was telling her about the destruction the spath did. She eventually told me that she never liked the spath and went to describe a litany of reasons. Then she told me she was not there to a sounding board I should have spoken up decades ago about the tingling feelings I had. Finally, she told me that I was no longer the cousin she enjoyed, that I allowed myself to be transformed.

I could go on and on about destroyed/lost friendships all having the spath as the centerpiece. Most of us could.

I think being rejected/shunned/kept at arms length, by these ‘afraid people’ hurts us in ways they do understand because we did it to them. It’s another slap in the face by the spath, even though he/she is no longer a part of our lives. Their ‘anger’ shows us what we did to them during the spath.

I will share with anyone, my therapist allowed me to see that ‘it’s not my fault’ and ‘I have nothing to be ashamed of’.

May 2, 2013 5:52 pm

thejb

I wish I could get to that point, but I am not there yet. I still blame myself and it didn’t help that when I left, I went to stay with family for a year and I hear all the “I knew something was wrong with him, why couldn’t YOU see it?” or “Why didn’t you get out sooner?” “You made a bad choice” (my mother still says that). I still can’t forgive myself. You see, I should have seen the warning signs – 5 years earlier I was a survivor of domestic violence ( a single isolated incident that caused me to flee for my life), so I should have seen the red flags. But, I didn’t.

May 4, 2013 12:57 am

Imarriedit

People shy away when I mention my divorce. They think I must just be bitter at my ex-husband, when there’s SO much more to it. I was overwhelmed and went outside crying at work recently, and a co-worker tried to comfort me. He meant well. “Life’s about change, Imarriedit. Nobody gets married expecting to end up divorced but changr happens. That’s life.”
I said change is when you get in an accident and wreck your car, or you get laid off, or break your leg and miss work. We were targeted for fraud. It was deliberate! Our marriage contract and vows exchanged was a fraud. When my husband joined dating sites on purpose, met people for sex on purpose, it was fraud. If we get ripped off in other ways, we have recourse. When we say someone was a conman who deceived and defrauded us to enter into a marriage contract, we get the deer in the headlights look.
We truly need support chapters so we can make new friends who get it.

May 3, 2013 12:37 am

thejb

Hi Imarriedit. I am new to this site, but simply had to comment on your post, as it is a mirror image of what I too have gone through. I don’t have the money for the divorce yet, but we have been separated for over a year (I cut off all contact and moved to another state). I’m so sorry for what you have been through and really was struck at the similarity to my situation. My soon-to-be ex (I will just call him ex, as its better for me that way) stole nearly everything, cost me 2 jobs, 3 apartments and 2 cars. He, too snuck around, put himself out there on dating sites, my shock of all shocks was that he also was seeking men and transvestites. He was leading a complete double life, with no remorse. He also surrounded himself with dangerous people and was an addict. To this day I struggle with anxiety and have a complete inability to trust people or relax and think that life will be ok. I am always waiting for the proverbial “other shoe to drop”.

Either way, I just wanted to respond and let you know you are not alone, others out there know exactly what this feels like. I wish you the best and hope you can heal.

lost everything,
You are “spot on” about the lost relationships with family and friends due to spath isolating partner!I am so ashamed of the way my husband behaved,and the way I was afraid to take a stand,not wanting to “rock the boat”.But I’m also very grateful for the friends and family that never gave up on me;although for awhile they saw it was best not to be close.

ImarriedIt,
Divorcing someone who never existed;from a marriage that wasn’t real,just isn’t like the divorces among “normal” relationships.They can look at the situation as “Well,we had some good times,made some good memories-but it’s not working with this person anymore!” They have NO IDEA what it is like to wake up one day and find out that despite YOUR BEST INTENTIONS,you have been defrauded of a mate,a home,possibly a sum of money….you have been living on Fantasy Island all this time and you were just rudely awakened by someone banging cymbals in your ears and bursting your dreams!

May 3, 2013 1:32 am

To Be Free

This is my time to vent.

I had been subpoenaed for a court hearing that was suppose to take place yesterday. The judge cancelled it yesterday morning and today found out it is rescheduled in a month. The ex-wife of my ex-spath-boyfriend is taking him to court so that their child can have supervised visits. He has a drinking problem and has driven drink many times and with his son. I have not been in the car at these times but I do know of his habitual drinking. Anyway, I had myself ready to face him but now I have to wait another month!

So, now my mind is turning over and over about the good, bad and ugly times we had together. How is it they can still affect us!!!
I want to live out the fantasy in my head again!! I’m having to remember what an evil, deceitful, etc…. person he is.

I have a wonderful family but they are extremely tired of hearing me talk about how I feel, what I think of him, what I have been through… They are past it and very thankful that I am no longer in a relationship with him. I am STILL trying to get past it!!! I broke up with him the week before Christmas. Had 4 full weeks of NC. But then broke it with an email…next came the occasional text….then the meet for a dinner….then went out a few times…. And then I found out he was “dating” someone. He said he had gone out with her but they were not serious. I happen to see a text and both were saying “I love you, baby”. I just wanted to throw up. Of course, now I know he was having a grand time conning both of us!!. I could have gotten her number and warned her but decided not to get in the middle of that.

I have not talked to him or seen him lately and was really nervous about the court hearing. I feel so foolish most of the time. And so back to the family, I think that sometime they are tired of me! (But I know that they really love me!)

My oldest son is graduating from college tomorrow and I really want to focus on him. I am so proud of how he is and what he is becoming. His dad (my wonderful husband) past away 3 years ago. My husband was the complete opposite of a spath. NOT KIDDING. He loved me with a true love and our family was so happy. This creep came shortly after he pasted and I was in a daze! You probably could write the rest of the story from here.

So needless to say, I have put my family through so much. I am just ready to slam this spath door once and for all and never reopen it again!!!

To Be Free,
I can imagine what a letdown it was not to be able to get this court hearing done and over with!I know the feeling of just wanting to “close the door” on spath,making him ‘history’,so you can get on with healing and the rest of your life!

You’re right,your family does love you,and because they just know that the spath was bad for you (and for them by extension)they really don’t want to talk about him anymore.They want to see you heal and get on with your life,as much as you do!But they feel helpless to know what to do or say….it’s just been difficult for everyone,ok?!So when with family,just be determined to have as good a time as possible!!!

May 3, 2013 3:58 pm

To Be Free

Thank you…
I am thinking about going to therapy and really think it will help.

Not only am I dealing with all this, but I found out that the spot on the back of my 84 year old mother that was removed last week is definitely melanoma. My husband died of cancer and this has really thrown me. My father died last year.

I just have had too many life changing events that are really everyday occurrences that people have to deal with. BUT, I now am trying to heal from a terrible spath relationship!!!!

May 3, 2013 4:20 pm

lost everything

Hi, To Be,

Like you, I had lots of things happening in my life. My mom fell and 3 days afterward, out of the blue, went completely blind. The ensuing medical problems and emergencies over the next 7 years, several of which reached the crisis point, 18 surgeries, all compounded by her never being able to deal with the death of my father 5 years prior to her becoming disabled, were all mine to deal with, as her sole caregiver. I also had to take care of a house, something I had never done, as I always lived with my parents, despite being married for decades. And then there was the spath.

Like you, I knew these things that ‘happen’. I built well cemented walls around myself to ensure that I could always be there for my mother and try my best to deal with the spath’s, verbal, psychological, and physical abuse. Unfortunately these walls not only kept me in, they also kept real world out.

I never would have thought of contacting a therapist on my own, it was suggested by a paralegal from the ‘good’ law firm.

I was leery given my earlier experience with trying to find a law firm that would help me. How could I find a therapist that was willing to help; research on the internet and asking for recommendations from other professionals, ie medical, legal, that had experience with these therapists. I was very fortunate to find a psychologist where mutual chemistry existed.

Please be aware, seeing a therapist is not an elixir or any other kind of quick fix. It is a long term commitment for both parties. It requires complete honesty on your part and being able to open up, not gloss over, that doesn’t happen in one or two appointments. I have been seeing my psychologist for 3 1/2 years now and the walls are just starting to breech.

Also, therapy can hurt. You are going to find out things about yourself and your life that are not always nice (spath not included). It’s part of regaining yourself.

To Be Free,
I’m sorry to hear about your mom’s biopsy results.Take some deep breaths and be resolved to enjoy as much time with your mom as possible.I lost my mom when she was only 72 yrs old.

Therapy can really help as they let you talk about your feelings and find an outlet.It’s keeping them all pent up and becoming overwhelmed that makes us sick.We’re here for you too;so let us know when you need to just talk or vent! ((( Hugs )))

May 3, 2013 8:50 pm

lifting the veil

linda,thank you for this article…..it really hit home………:(
i used to have a really good friend who i knew for nearly 20 years……but when my life fell apart she was no where to be found…..not even a text to see if i was ok,or a call to support me…..all i would have wanted was some support or just to talk and tell me everything was going to be ok…….but nothing………i made contact with her last year and we met for coffee and talked……she told me that what was happening in my life was just too dark for her…..she couldnt cope with it as she didnt want to be dragged down by it………….i was really disappointed…….and let down.but i made allowances by telling myself…..yes what had happened in my life was very dark and i could see why people would be afraid…..i dont have any contact with any of the friends i had before my relationship ended……..i felt let down by most of them…..they didnt know how to deal with me………i was in a dark place afterwards and when all the deceit was reveals people were in shock and didnt know what to say to me…….i guess i self imposed not making contact with anyone too……i felt embarrassed at what has happened to me,felt ashamed…..feel sad…………and a let down……….now i can say i dont have any friends….except people i talk to in work,work colleagues and it was some of them that were amazing and helped me through the roughest times over the past few years…….
but when i come home and lock my door….im alone…..i dont want anybody near me…i dont want to put myself out there…i get frightened easily and scared of trusting anyone and afraid to make myself vulnerable…..i tell myself i dont need any friends its better that way.i can understand why friends cant cope with or understand what has happened to us….its too much for us…..too much pain and suffering……and they will just never understand unless it happened to them…
but sometimes all you need is someone to just listen and tell you everything is going to be ok…..i keep telling myself that……..everything is going to be ok…..but each day its hard.
so i will just keep telling myself it and i hope one day i wont struggle so much.

just wondering regard the ptsd……does it ever get any better?
i get triggered by the simplest of things into emotional flashbacks……and im so down over feeling ill never get any better….:(

May 3, 2013 8:53 pm

thejb

Hi Lifting the veil, I know exactly what you mean, I too have basically isolated outside of my work contacts, save for about 3 lifelong friends that I talk to, on average, once or twice a month. I know about the PTSD as well, as I struggle with it and sometimes the oddest things end up being triggers for me – some of the triggers took time to identify as being directly related to my 18 months in hell. I hope it gets better for you and for all of us who struggle with these remnants of what is left of ourselves after such a dark life lesson. I wish there was more support out there for survivors of sociopaths, people who haven’t been through it really do not understand how deep that rabbit hole goes. For me it changed my foundational beliefs about humans, and their capacity for evil. I can never “un-know” what I know and go back to being naÃ¯ve. How I wish I could. Nor can I easily trust people anymore. Anyway, just wanted to wish you well. I am really glad I stumbled upon this site tonight. I am out of my situation a year and a few months now and cannot understand why I still don’t feel better.

May 4, 2013 12:27 am

blueskies

Hi Lifting the Veil.x

Keep telling yourself it will get better and that one day you wont struggle so much because it really is true even if it feels so impossible right now.x

I can totally relate to what you are saying here – I have felt the same.

One of the things I did was impose self isolation, from people who weren’t scared, from those who didn’t want to run away, from true friends – one of the things I felt at the time that things were so dark and so awful and so difficult to explain that I couldn’t bear to ‘lay’ it on anyone. like the poison I felt was somehow ‘infectious’.

I had also been so vulnerable after the relationship with the psychopath, that I had opened myself up again to manipulative people – I felt that I couldn’t ‘tell’ the difference between good and bad for me, and also that I had so little left I had nothing to give and who would want to be a friend of someone with nothing to give? Well I took control of that by making everyone’s decision for them!

I missed good friends weddings, births of their beautiful new babies, celebrations of new jobs – these were people I cared about – what a terrible person that made me huh? (Well no I’m not a terrible person or friend even after all that it turns out but I needed some time.)

The loneliness is so painful but it will get better.

In retrospect – I do feel that for me, I needed to do that. I needed to regroup, I didn’t have the energy to socialise – though at the time it felt like I never would again – that I had ‘lost the cog’ to do so and that I had lost everyone.

I seem to have moved through that – I kept moving – trying to be kind to myself – at first going through the motions of helping myself ( anti depressants, swimming, prioritising sleep, forcing myself kicking and screaming to write or paint or garden, make the bed.. wash!) and recently things have become brighter.

I find that the people who are my friends are still there – and that in many respects the relationships with them are better – I have come out less dependant on them for affection or attention or as remedy to loneliness – maybe that makes for much healthier friendships with them than I ever had before? The ‘medicine’ was painful and dark but necessary?:(

as for those that fell away – I see now how I had always been ‘dancing for snosages’ with them and that I would no longer do that, or be able to conduct friendships like that anyway.x

the PTSD will get better – again, there were periods where I couldn’t leave the house, noises would scare me,loud traffic… in my case I have a son ( who has a diagnosis of Autism and ADHD!) who NEEDED me to get up and do things – so I had to and somehow as time has gone on its got easier – but I had to just do it however I could at the time – so I took taxis everywhere at first-then gradually was able to walk – then started being able to say hello to people…I am still very careful of how I feel and will take ‘time out’ if I need to.x

Take care LTV. Force yourself to be kind to yourself. Don’t lose hope and you will start to notice just little things coming back all by themselves, little bits of everyday joy that will grow and grow.x

June 16, 2013 3:33 am

blueskies

P.S Something else that I found myself doing (re: loneliness)in the absence of someone else to do it, that was actually quite good although it sounds BONKERS was actively ‘self soothing’ – I actually held my own hand sometimes, and stroked my own shoulders in a self hug and cooed and talked to myself like I would talk to my own baby if he was hurt ( ‘come one darling’, it’s okay sweet heart’etc x). Hmmmm yep – I thought that would sound crazy when I started typing it – but you know – we do what we need to sometimes and it worked for me!;)x

lifting the veil,
Are you being treated for PTSD;meds and possibly therapy?!I can’t make it without my med~~~I’ll have a meltdown!I know different ways of coping,but I still need the med.Keep a journal of your triggers and try to avoid them…if that’s not always possible,also include how you’ve been able to deal with them.

Humans are social creatures.We need to interact with others.So you need to stay open to finding atleast one friend!You mentioned how hard it is to trust now.I know…I still catch myself not trusting.We’ve been through so much!It’s a struggle to get our lives back!But we have to keep working on trusting~~~so don’t give up!

May 3, 2013 10:14 pm

Cassandrasdream

I have a lot of empathy for other people, especially women, who have been devastated by a sociopath. But I do feel that at some point you have to realize what is going on and get out of the way. At some point, the evidence is stacked so high, you cannot ignore it. We can’t stand on the tracks when we see a train racing toward us.

I think our sense of reality can become twisted by a relationship with a sociopath. That’s when we need to seek help and focus on minimizing the damage, getting the heck out and away from the source.

Here is a quote from Carl Jung that I like very much: “I am not what happened to me. I am what I chose to become.”

TheJB – Welcome to Lovefraud. Yes, many friends and family find it so difficult to listen, and they certainly don’t understand, unless they’ve lived it themselves. It’s a self-protective measure so people don’t upset their own equilibrium. But everyone here at Lovefraud knows what you’ve been through and can offer moral support.

May 4, 2013 11:50 am

thejb

Hi Donna,

Thank you very much! I am awestruck at the level of parallel I am reading in the stories of others. I’ve felt so alone for a long time in the level of what I went through, and many times thought I was losing my mind.

Welcome thejb!
Lovefraud has proved to be a blessing for us as we search for understanding and needed support!So glad you found us!Keep reading and posting!

May 4, 2013 4:48 pm

thejb

Hi Blossom, thanks for your kind words! I am reading so many stories here that mirror my own story in so many ways.

May 4, 2013 6:54 pm

lifting the veil

hi thejb,
thank you so much for your comments…..i too wanted to say i feel deeply for what you have gone through……and you like you said too…you are not alone……you will find wonderful people here who truely understand…..i read what you wrote about what you went through with your ex and im so sorry….and i read how it has effected you…..i wanted to say what you are feeling is perfectly normal………..what you have experienced is a wound to you soul and a trauma like no other and this will take time to heal……..it has been 3 years since my relationship ended…my councellor once told me..if your walking through hell,just keep walking………and it seems we have walked through hell…….thejb……….i reasonate with you wishing i could unknow what i know and go back to being naive….and yes like you said i agree that this experience has also changed how i see people….just take it one day at a time and be gentle on yourself…..you have been through so much….i wish you healing and much light and blessings as you heal.

blossom4th…….you are such a wise soul…i read your posts alot and find great insight……x
im not on any meds for the ptsd……….in the first year after my relationship ended..i had a breakdown and i was put on anti-depressants and anxiety medication….the first anti-depressant didnt sit well with me,i felt very ill on it and had bad side effects…and then the next one was ok but again side effects…..and if i forgot to take them or ran out i endured the terrible sickness from withdrawal……i just didnt want to go through it anymore and asked my doctor to take me off them…..so it took 6 months to wean me off them…it was hard….and i felt ill alot of the time but i got off them…..i wanted to feel full force the depression and pain of what i was going through..i wanted to know which was real and not real….i didnt want to be numb anymore……i know i have probably not done myself any favours….and at times over the past year i probably should have been in a hospital as i completely lost my sence of reality…at times i was so irritable i would just fly off the handle and into rages of intense anger and emotion ….inside i was so angry…so hurt……….my sense of reality had been taken away from me….what i once believed as real was all lies and i couldnt come to terms with any of it…it almost destroyed me…………but i endured all the intense depression…anxiety…..panic attacks and deep inner turmoil cause its part of going through hell i guess….and im still here……i dont have as many bad days as i did………..i self imposed isolation on myself cause i knew i wasnt well emotionally….i knew i couldnt be around anyone…..i knew i need to have time alone to fathom out what had happened in my life….make sense of it……….after new year passed my ex once again kept telling me that there would never ever be any going back to a relationship for us and that she wanted us to be friends…………..well after that…….that is when i truely knew i couldnt heal if she was in my life and i had to cut contact…..cause if she was my friend she never would have deceived me and lied to me and used me for so long…..a true friend cares about your wellbeing and would never intentionally hurt you…..my ex is a pathological liar and i cant be around her….all she wanted to do was use me.and i could nt believe a single word that come out of her mouth……….omg that is so alien to me………i cant get past it………i cant understand it ever………………..im still so numb……….like you said blommom4th about a fantasy…….it was…………..i remember thinking when i met her…..she was the best friend i had waited my whole life for……….i pictured her as this beautiful rose in the centre of my garden and i would tend her care with everything in me…and i did….i nurtured her,watered her……gave her everything i had and she took it……….i used to gaze apon the beauty of this rose in my garden and think how lucky i was……..but all the while she was draining my life…..taking everything emotionally from me and damaging me beyond repair……..just like the anology of the parasite who bleeds you dry and then drops off….now i see..that rose was beautiful to the eye but beneath it was plastic……….a fake……….a false self,she represented to me someone i had dreamed of….but behind it all she was a wolf in sheeps clothing….a dark shadow that has taken my very belief in life and human kindness away…..leaving me fearful of life and especially of being hurt again….
no one will ever hurt me like that again……….i swear to protect myself at all costs.
i had a good day all day today but then got upset so easily again tonight when i spoke to someone i know when they started talking about emotional stuff….i just cant handle any stress or emotions……..i hate being like this..im sick of it……….i want to be my old self again….i hate my ex for what she did to me…….for the horrible wound she inflicted apon me………..but im determined i will fight to get better or dy trying.

also regards why some people are scared of us….i think they are scared of the unknown…….scared cause they dont know what to say,scared cause they dont want to think that things like that happen…….scared cause they think it might effect them…..scared cause its dark and evil and no one knows how to deal with that …..
now when people ask me how i am…i just smile and say im doing fine…because they just dont understand they think i should just move on or then they ask me have i met anyone else…oh yea like its that easy to ever trust another person……but inside its a constant battle to recover.

May 4, 2013 7:39 pm

thejb

Lifting the Veil, thank you so very much for your kind words. I am so very sorry for all that you have been through as well, it brought tears to my eyes, reading your above-post. I can identify with so much of the emotion you have gone through, I still am going through anxiety/ptsd/depression – a pretty deep depression actually. I don’t know how to feel happy or rather content, anymore. I, too, have isolated for the same reasons, I will never allow myself to be hurt again. Also, I too, cannot handle a lot of stress, and unfortunately in my family that is a constant. I am learning new boundaries though. For instance I have an extremely toxic younger sibling, I believe actually that he is either NPD or borderline sociopath, and I have discussed this with my mother. He has been kicking off as of late (this happens in between the usual 8 or so year stretches when he is not talking to me) with no regard to what I have been through. He even went so far as to call me a loser for the choice I made in marrying my soon-to-be ex. I have learned that the stress manifests itself miserably in me, so I have now taken measures to completely cut him off as well. It is about my sanity now, not someone else’s ego. One of the bad side effects I am struggling with is a lack of concentration. I don’t know if anyone else has gone through that, but sometimes I simply cannot focus on my job or on any one thought, and my memory is horrible as of late.

Either way, I don’t want to ramble on, thank you again for your kind words. I am really sorry for the pain you have experienced. You are absolutely correct in that this is a wound to the soul. I wish you much healing and comfort.

thejb,
I know what you’re referring to…not being able to concentrate,or handle stress well and feeling ‘out of sorts’.
This does get better as time goes by.We all need time to ourselves,but don’t make it ALL THE TIME except worktime.The things that helped me was to listen to soothing music,read and work puzzles.Do things you enjoyed doing pre-spath.If you can find atleast one understanding friend,try to socialize some by shopping,going to the movies or dining out occasionally.

lifting the veil,
I’m sorry you had reactions with all your medications.I remember feeling ‘scared stiff’ to try AD that one of my Drs prescribed.I still have the packet stuffed in a drawer from a few yrs ago,to remind me of that time.A time when I needed help but was too scared to accept it!

The med I’m now taking doesn’t affect me in any way except to make me feel calm instead of stressed out.I don’t feel like a zombie.If I did I wouldn’t take it!I do have to be careful of TOO MUCH STRESS OR PAIN.So the med is helpful.

Your analogy of a beautiful rose in a garden that you tended with love,is a good one!The parasite just happened to be curled up under one of it’s leaves,and while you were busy,you didn’t notice you were being drained of your lifeblood….actually that it what happened to ALL OF US!!!

May 6, 2013 7:54 pm

fightforwhatsright

This article is so on target. Lillian, I could really see myself in your story. I never thought I would be unable to work and here I am living under poverty level.

My nuclear family hasn’t just been afraid. A couple of them are narcissistic spaths and actually enjoy what has happened to me. When I told my mother that I had found out that my newly rediscovered friend had cheated on me the first time we were together for six years, she said, “No wonder!” What kind of mother would say that? An NPD one. When both of my husbands and a boyfriend hit me and I called my Dad, he told all three that I was too difficult to get along with (Interpretation: She is strong and independent and I could not beat it out of her during her childhood), but not to hit me. What kind of father would say that? An NPD one. How could I have possibly known what I was choosing or letting choose me when it was time for intimate relationships or friendships?

I wish so badly there was a spath-anon like Al-Anon is for the people who are involved with Alcolholics. A place to gather and know we are safe and we already know each others horrific stories because we have lived them. I can’t even find a normal PTSD group in the large city close to me. Only for Veterans and I have been through a situation at work that was pretty bad as far as national security while married to and living with and being in a family of spaths. They were sympathetic, but only Veterans could attend. The Domestic Violence groups can be very helpful because a lot of the abusive partners are spaths. I can recommend it, but I did it a long time ago. It helped me then, but I still went out and ended up with two more over the years.

I am extremely isolated. Too isolated. Where would I go? What would I say? “Hi, I have PTSD, am on disability, have to rent an apt to an ex-boyfriend who is Jekyl and Hyde, I have Major Depressive Disorder, but the medication causes TMJ because I grind my teeth because I was a whistleblower and I have nightmares and I cry all of the time, except for when I hold it in and then have panic attacks. Want to be friends?” I feel safe here for now and am extremely grateful for it. Maybe I will go back to Al-Anon one day, but I can’t take the religion in my part of the country that has taken it over. The same religion as spath number one whom I have finally ended it with tonight.

Good article. Very good article. It seems like we are all the types who take care of the people who get into situations like we have and then when it’s time for reciprocation, they are long gone or stabbing us in the back.

You’ve raised a great point about having “Spath Recovery Groups!” Fuel for thought!

At times, having a theraputic support group can significantly bolster your need for validation, particularly, because friends and family can’t always be counted on when it comes to falling prey to a predator.

In addition to all the reasons that have already been stated about the fears that may deter friends and family from being supportive, there is yet another reason for this conduct. Just as you were fooled by the predator, so might they have been as well. Depending on their own ego, they may or may not want to be disavowed of their belief.

Changing the impression of another person is a process. The first stage of that process is often anger- not at the perpetrator, but at the victim. When enlightened that someone they don’t suspect of wrongdoing might be harmful, they may react with loyalty toward that person and disbelief or dismissive behavior toward what you say.

The harmful things people say to you as you go through your journey toward recovery could reflect a lack of empathy or caring on their part. While you may have relied on their comfort and love previously, you may never have presented an issue where they needed to channel real love or compassion for you in the past.

So remember, the negative energy your hurled can be the first step toward changing their awareness. And unless or until it changes, find others who can give you the emotional support you need.

Some large hospitals have mental health clinics at low or no cost. You might contact them and see if they have a support group that would help you.

Many of us have been harmed by an action known as rape-by-fraud and/or emotional rape. Although we don’t bare the bodily scars that are usually associated with rape, we are fraught with the emotional ones. If this is the case for you, see what treatment they provide for rape victims.

Wishing you all the best on your road to recovery-
Joyce

May 5, 2013 1:44 pm

Lillian

Fight: Thanks for your response. It is helpful to have someone say out loud that they relate. I pretty much have one friend left. I don’t know where (I mean why or how he appeared as I see him as a blessing) he came from but I met him 2 years ago shortly after the spath left (1 yr). I met him during a time when I was faking my spath recovery every day. I was medicating with prescription meds, street drugs and alcohol so I looked normal. I looked good in fact. I do still take an antidepressent and thyroid but not regularly as I can’t afford it. I know when I have to because I start sleeping all the time and become sobbingly depressed. So I’ll take them for a couple days on and then a couple off to conserve them. He was and is still unaware I was doing the street crud which I don’t do anymore. He drinks some wine but has never been drunk or done an illegal drug in his life. He rarely even takes aspirin. He works very hard and appears to be as honest as I’ve seen.

I still had my house when we met which had all the trappings of a successful person. But he never new me in my successful days. Now that I’m living in a garage that I’m losing because I can’t afford even it he is still here. He knows the story and has witnessed the abandonment one by one of my remaining family and friends. Periodically I push him away with a big shove just to see if he’ll go. He hasn’t yet. I’ve even shared some of my postings on here with him and he seeks to understand but I know he doesn’t. He isn’t overwhelmed. He set’s some boundaries when I go spiraling down too far and goes quiet until I reach out but will always respond immediately.

He brings food when he comes, gets me out now and again, offers to feed me if we’re in a cafe. He takes me to the grocery and insists on buying. He has provided some money and does not consider me indebted to him in any way. He asks for nothing really but for me not to give up. To go get a job. To keep trying. I am the needy one in this relationship. I loathe the role. But I’m learning a little bit about myself and how I was always the giving one no questions asked and expecting little in return.

He get’s discouraged and tells me sometimes he hasn’t anything to say because he doesn’t want to make it worse or he thinks I don’t listen. I do listen and when I defend why I am behaving in such defeatist ways he thinks I’m disagreeing but I’m not I’m simply trying to explain. To have someone understand. He says he understands part of it but he can’t know what it’s like. I know I didn’t until I found myself here.

He’s is out of town on business (he’s in the film industry) right now but before he left I talked to him about people being scared of people like me. He told me he wasn’t scared it’s that there is only so much a person can do to help. He’s right of course but I immediately read that as he’s going to disappear too. But what he was saying was I have to get up and get going. That was something I never had a problem with before the spath but he doesn’t know that. My problem is I just can’t get going again. I’ll get out and interview and no one will hire me. I go back to bed again for about a month and then I get up again and same thing. No one can go out and get a job for me I know that but I’m so traumatized I can’t seem to face it either.

With regard to therapy (I no longer have health insurance) I went and found a pretty good therapist who had lived through the effects both personally and on her patients of 9/11. We did a lot of work a few years ago now and she said I was ready. There wasn’t anything more for her to do for me. It was up to me and that I know what to do. And I do. I was always self reliant, never wanted for a job for 25 years and took care of everyone else in my life.

I just can’t seem to do it. I am catatonic. I am frozen with anger, fear, confusion, guilt and grief. It is up to me and I just don’t seem to be up to it. Lovefraud seems to be the only place to turn for understanding and it helps. Little by little. And I’ll take anything I can get. Love Lillian

May 6, 2013 2:11 am

Lillian

Fight: On a lighter note your description of your personal introduction made me laugh. Talk about relatable. But what do we do? I have tried being straightforward and upfront like that with mixed reactions. I see it as a way to cut to the chase. I’d rather start with the end in mind. I mean that if once they find out they are going to leave anyway I would rather not waste the time. When I don’t begin like that they spot something off anyway and keep their distance.

So yes, I am looking for a friend who has PTSD, is on disability, depressed but doing what they have to in order to survive so they an teach me how to do that. I grind my teeth at night (always have) so it’s okay if they grind to. Someone who calls out the wrongs of the world even if it puts their livelihood in jeopardy, dreams anything at all as I no longer dream and knows what it’s like to be overwhelmed by a grief so profound they sob relentlessly when they are alone. Someone who wants to overcome anxiety because I took up crossword puzzles in order to cope via distraction. Want to be friends?

May 6, 2013 2:30 am

fightforwhatsright

Hi Lillian, I am just now catching up on some of these articles. I wanted to tell you that many drug companies will give you medication if you don’t have insurance. I can’t remember the organization that handles this, but you can find out the Pharmaceutical company that sells both of your medications and contact them. I know that Wal-Mart offers 30 days supplies of generic thyroid medication for very cheap. It used to be on their $4 list, but I don’t know if they’re doing that any more.

I hope your friend is a good one. I’ve found that they need to be watched for six months before I can really tell a thing. Jon Kabat-Zinn’s “Mindfulness for Depression” has helped me to a degree. Of course, as I looked through all the comments to the article, I started thinking that maybe being at home and safe all alone watching movies is a great thing! Maybe the kind of friends I find are overrated! This subject is very important. Family and friends abandon us very easily when we become ill….no matter how much we have done for them. Of course, that lack of boundaries and inability to love ourselves well is the reason the spath glommed onto us in the first place. Fight the shame. WE are here and we count.

May 14, 2013 12:09 pm

Ox Drover

Lillian, I am so sorry you are going through such a difficult time. I am here, lurking mostly. VERY Busy with my own shiat right now. Coping. Taking antidepressant medications in that manner is not helpful as they must be taken regularly to be effective. See if you can find a free clinic to provide them, or apply for medicaid. call a shelter. see if you can find some group counseling. don’t give up. contact me directly at oxdrover 1946 @ g mail dot com. Love Oxy

I know how hard it is to put one foot in front of the other when you’re in the depths of despair. I can absolutely relate to what you’re going through.

Here are a couple of things that I think might help:

Contact the Rape and Incest National Network, RAINN. Take a look at their website. It will give you advice regarding the hospitals that provide free and low-cost mental health clinics in your area.

Take your anti-depressants on a regular basis. Don’t self-medicate. There are good medications that won’t knock you out or make you feel like you’re in la-la land. They will simply help you from falling into the trough. If you qualify for a mental health clinic, you will likely qualify for their free or low-cost medication.

Do good things for yourself that you enjoy and that bolsters your spirit. If you can’t think of anything that would bring joy back into your heart, do some volunteer work for a soup kitchen or other service.

Any activity, even a brisk walk, will produce endorfins that promote a sense of wellness. The more vigorous the exercise, the greater the benefit.

You need to start treating yourself like you treat the other folks you supported in your life. You need to value yourself and talk to yourself in a positive way.

You seem to have reached a point where you think your friends are bailing on you because you haven’t gotten it together. Here’s a step I’d try….
Give yourself a time limit for the loss and grief you feel. And make it later in the day. If you are ruminating over your problems in the morning, force yourself outside for a brisk walk knowing that you’ll allow yourself to return to those feelings at a specific time in the afternoon. You need to be able to take control of your sadness and relegate it to a corner of your life. As you progress, you’ll be able to make that time-frame smaller and smaller.

Let us know how you’re coming along. We’ve been there and we care.

Joyce

May 6, 2013 11:03 pm

hope52

Escaping from an unhealthy relationship brings many other factors in your life into focus. Your family of origin, your job, your children and your friends.

Take a closer look. If you were living with “crazy” for any length of time, chances are that you had managed to also be surrounded by “crazy”.

Crazy being living in a world that when looked at closely, makes no sense whatsoever. It’s a world of make believe and more importantly, denial.

Denial is a powerful word. Denial is a survival tool for human beings. It allows us to cope with painful people and situations. It is a vital human emotion to prevent harm. Denial is not a “forever” protector however, someday you will need to pay the debt.

After my marriage broke up two years ago, I spent many months doing research and reading books about psychopathy. I know more about Cluster B personality disorders than most therapists and despite what Robert Hare says that he cannot recognize a “psychopath” – I say baloney. No, you cannot recognize them by their looks, but give me an hour with one and I can give you strong reasons to suspect this person is disordered.

My divorce changed my life, my work, and my friendships. My sister and I no longer speak to each other. Well, sometimes. Maybe once or twice a year. We were never really very close because we are polar opposites. She also married a psychopath and one of the most evil men I have ever known. Our family always knew he was “mean”, but he provided for her and their children over the years.

In the end he walked out of the 25 year old marriage just as mine did and left my sister in an emotional pile of broken dreams and promises on the curb.

I shared the family secret. Many of my friends are uncomfortable around me. They don’t want to break their cycle of denial in their own life – they want to continue to live in their dream world of baked cookies and pretty flowers.

Becoming a healthy human being in today’s world takes courage. Becoming a person that stands up for yourself AND the rights of other men and women around you takes courage.

I am proud of the woman that I have become and if this means fewer friends than so be it. Peace.

May 7, 2013 10:03 am

Delores

Hope,

You so right on. And after living with a psychopath denial can be as crazymaking as the psychopathic antics. I have lost most of my family to this denial. With co-workers and aquaintances it is easy to just let the denial go but when family turns on you for waking up the hurt is felt like total rejection.

I stood with both of my sisters through their psycopath almost destroying their lives and neither would admit that they were psychopaths. They also continued to minimize the psychopath in my life that I got away from until he used my daughter to turn my sisters against me.

A conspiracy of denial and secrecy developed where I was left out, demined and sccapegoated until I burned my bridges with them.

May 7, 2013 10:52 am

graceous

This is such an important topic! I am so glad the author has written about this, and helps to put into words my reactions to people in my life when I was involved with a sociopath aka predator.

Going back decades, to a past fiance, I think the saddest day in my life at the time was when he arranged a get together for all of my friends who we had mutual involvement with, excluding me as I had dumped him, and I walked by seeing everyone’s car parked in front of his place. I could only imagine what he was doing to spew poison about me. But, I also remember that day as an empowering day, as I took a long walk at the beach and felt a sense of inner peace. I was also reading a book celebrating solitude. So, yes, there is the potential of empowerment in situations like this. The friendships in this situation went back and forth for awhile, but did gradually fade away. So did the therapist I decided to see. I talked to her about the stalking, hang up calls, how he would walk down the hall of my apartment and whisper “sicko, sicko” loudly in front of my door (we lived in the same apartment building for awhile), and created situations where the apartment manager, who was, at the time, a mutual friend, would end up at my door about some nonsense and all his other antics. When he did a power maneuver to become manager of the apartment building, I hired movers to show up at 11:00 PM to move out. What I finally figured out with the therapist was that she never really believed that the crazy things happened, and that they were part of some delusional system in me. She even asked me if I was stoned at sessions. Sheesh! That was also a rude awakening, and another loss of trust. So, I had to end that so-called support as well. But, decades ago, there was a gift in all of this. I found my spiritual path, and started living life in a new way, with new people in my life.

In work situations, the potential and need for denial seems rampant where sociopathy exists. I still see a friend from my recent situation, and have discussed my concerns about the manager’s pathology, but the best she can admit to is that she is “wacky.” Understanding her need to survive in this situation, I simply limit conversation in this area. But, again, there is always a gift, and in this situation of being fired by her, and having difficulty finding new employment, and much soul searching, I am going into a new career direction, something this hurtful situation has almost forced me to do.

Its just so unfortunate that the sociopath has this fine-tuned ability to poison relationships, affect others’ thinking, and cause us to lose sources of support in our lives when we think we need them the most. But, some relationships need to be ended and there is always a gift. Better to be surrounded with your own truth, than to have to try to convince others the truth is truth and someone you mutually know is really a fraud and operating at a level that is unlike mine or their level. If someone does not “get” it, it is unlikely they will, no matter what additional time and effort one puts into explaining sociopaths.

Where a month ago, I was still reeling from being fired by the sociopath and thoughts of career loss, I am moving forward, applying to a college for a distance program to start a new career, and have reevaluated many people and things in my life. Yes, it is lonely at times, but I need to be true to myself and trust my perceptions.

May 7, 2013 11:59 am

Frandee

Never had I felt so alone after the realization of what happened to me…….I was isolated anyways because thats what the abuser did to me, I “chose” him over everyone else……some had an idea what was going on but they didnt know the depth, I tried to explain what happened and what I was going thru but it was so painstakingly Difficult/Frustrating I could barely grasp it myself, so I finally shut down and joined some online groups, the best choice for me, I was surrounded with like minded women that supported and loved me, I dont know where I would be without them!!! It is still difficult to talk about and I ocassionally break down in tears ……I am recovering, I hadnt talked to him in approximately a year, then he started calling, I finally talked to him to see how I would react, I know 500% I am OVER him, I see him clearly for what he always was and he actually tried to worm his way back in, he was just trying to warm up to me for another round of using me!!! Didnt happen, I ignored him….. This might not have been something others would have done but I knew in my gut I had to find out my feelings for him!!! Done Over Disgust Yuck!!! I still have NO desire to date or even really meet men, I am trying to just “get out there” around people but my radar is really keen so far……. He will NEVER get my power again!!! Thank you Lovefraud for all your help also!!!

May 7, 2013 1:27 pm

Blindsided

This is a good time to re-post my letter from 5 years ago.As you will read, many friends and neighbors did not want to hear the truth…

ORIGINAL LETTER TO LOVEFRAUD ”“ EARLY 2008
I apologize, in advance, for the length of this missive and any redundancies you may find. Before I begin, like so many others, I must say that finding this web site has been very helpful. I am not sure that this is the right “place” in the blog to post (for the first time) my feelings and experience. I have found that every area has a little piece of me and my story. I feel a sence of empathy and angst from most of the stuff I have read. It is a wonderful outlet.

“People do not get it— “Rumination is not easy to get over—”Hard learned truths—”I cannot talk to most people about this—”How do I forgive (& forget)” etc. ”“they all ring true with me.

However, I have not found one to be like mine. In fact, both of the marriage counselors that attempted the “emergency, triage, rescue” of our marriage said: “Yours is, undoubtedly, one of the very meanest and cruelest (and sad) cases we have ever dealt with.” These 2 doctors had a, combined, 60 years of marriage counseling experience between them. They were not prone to hyperbole. I realize this is not a contest ”“ I just seek opinion and empathy and fellowship ”“ just like everyone else. I have inferred that a majority of the contributors are women. I am a man. Also, what my spouse did to me and our 3 children was sudden — no, previous,years of psychotic behaviour. But wait”

What happened to me has made the papers in our city because of my ex-wife’s bizzare behaviour. I apologize for the length that I think is about to spew out of me. I will try to give the, “Cliff Notes” version to keep it as short as possible. I also ask that you accept what I say here at face value. It is so bizzare and freaky that I, literally, would have bet my right hand if someone would have predicted what my ex-wife did begininning in July, 2006. Even writing this is difficult. It is something out of a Franz Kafka novel.

I married “Sherri” in 1998. She had 2 children, a 4 year old boy & an 8 year old girl. I also had an 8 year old daughter and instant step siblings were created. It was a fantastic family and a fantastic marriage; I loved her and she loved me deeply. By every estimate and every opinion of,virtually, everyone — Ours was considered to be a strong, loving, giving marriage and we were best friends and lovers. She would have walked on glass for me and vice versa. I raised her boy and girl as mine and she was step-mother to my daughter as well. The two step-sisters were inseperable and shared the same bed and went to school together for 10 years ”“ graduating in 2007. I had brought “Sherri” into our small, affluent community. I had lived in another home here with my first spouse. I introduced her to the community and she was welcomed and became part of the community. We travelled around the world and she only had to work if she chose to. That was 25% of the time. I always earned enough to support us in a comfortable life style.

Then it all happened:
November of 2005 I had to (suddenly) begin chemo ”“ for 52 weeks. Fortunately I had a very lucrative disability policy which allowed us to live in our beautiful home and not go bankrupt.
Sherri was also working at that time and travelling (in the company car) over a 4 state sales region. She was gone 3 to 5 days a week and never had to be my caretaker while I was on my back during chemo. She was earnng $85,000 annually at this time.

June of 2006 she came home at 10:00a.m., in her company car, and found me in the bathroom ”“ vomiting from that day’s chemo treatment and announced: “I just quit my job and have met a man (28 year old tatoo artist- she’s 46) at a bar 2 days ago that I love and I tried to steal $28,000 from our bank account — but they stopped me.” Something was obviously wrong.

As part of my chemo treatment, I was seeing a Psychologist and a Psychiatrist — they routinely prescribed the, anti depressants that chemo neccessitate. They also provided counseling on a weekly basis as part of my insurer’s, “Chemo Management Plan.” They had known me very well by this point and asked that I bring Sherri in to see them — immediately. After 14 visits (several with both Doctors in the same room) over a 10 day time span, Sherri was diagnosed as having the following:

“Sudden onset bi-polar ”“ with a personality disorder, with metalogical to pathological tendencies as well as being a narcissipath” They suggested that, with proper medication and therapy she could, quite possibly, come back into the real world. It was not to be. She went into total denial, declared that there was nothing wrong and would not need any treatment of any kind. When told that they were advising me to divorce her as I could not fight cancer and her simultaneously, she replied, “I don’t give a F***!” A cub scout den mother and social committee volunteer! At this point I had lost 42 pounds from the chemo. At times my health was so fragile that it was really touch and go. I sure could have used her support then ”“ but it was not be. It was the exact opposite. The battle plans of a crazed woman were launched. What she did (in comparison to her, life long, behaviour) is so beyond normal experince I can barely describe it.

She began drinking, doing drugs and staying out all night. I would get the (3) children off to school ”“ and she would be gone for 2 days! Remember, I was on chemo at this time! When I asked her, “Did you think you were going to quit your job, live off of my disability check and have an affair with this 28 year old?” She answered, “Yes, yes I do.” A week later I filed for divorce.

After filing for divorce, I rented her a home 1 block away from ours so she could move there with her kids and they could finish the school year. The 28 year old boyfriend moved into her rental home that very same day! Imagine, my step-children had a complete stranger “replace” me on day one! I did not realize she would (in October, 2007) marry the 28 year old and buy the home. That is correct, she lives 1 block away with the (unemployed) tatoo artist in our tiny, gated, community. I am forced to see them daily.

2 weeks after moving out of my home, she snuck over and stole my 2 dogs. I let her take 99% of the furnishings; I was in a big, empty, house by myself. We had agreed upon separating that I would kep the dogs; she reneged and announced, “I have changed my mind.”

She stopped all communication between her 2 kids and myself. I have not seen nor spoken to them in 2 years. She stopped all communication with my daughter (“Sherri” was her step-mother for 10 years)! When I told her that “Rachel” missed her and was hurt and puzzled that Sherri went incommunicado, Sherri replied, “F*** Rachel!” When the psychologist suggested that the children not be used as “Pawns” — Sherri replied, “They are my pawns to use as I like.”

But it got worse — much worse.

Shortly after separating and moving one block away, it became known that Sherri had asked her boyfriend to put a “hit” on me. Yes, she was caught (via e-mails) of hiring someone to kill me. When we went to court, the judge yawned, acted annoyed and refused to do anything other than issue a restraining order which read (in part): “Sherri shall not engage in threatening conversations nor share private information with others (regarding her husband)” That is it! Nothing more. Sherri dramatically ripped the restraining order to pieces in the, courthouse, parking lot and said to me and my attorney, “F*** you.”

Then the lies, defamation, slander and character assasination began in ernest. Over the course of the next 15 months, Sherri worked earnestly at telling every neighbor, friend or aquaintance the following:
1) Ken was diagnosed with: “Sudden onset bi-polar ”“ with a personality disorder, with metalogical to pathological tendencies” (BTW, the psychologist predicted she might do this ”“ claim that I had the very same mental disorder she was diagnosed as having).
2) Ken is a, Mafia, hitman (I am in the financial sevices industry).
3) She and her children had to seek shelter at the center for battered women.
4) Ken is a (CIA like) computer hacker that traced and tracked anybody’s phone calls or e-mail messages at will.
5) Ken is not on chemo, he is away at (heroin) re-hab in Phoenix Arizona.
6) She told neighbors that if they did (financial planning) business with me, that I would steal their personal identity information and purchase homes around the U.S with their credit.

Incredibly, there were a few neighbors and friends that actually believed her story. As absurd as it sounds and contrary to everything they knew about me for 15+ years — I learned that there are “friends” in this world that prefer “dirt” to the truth. To say she cleaved our small community would be an understatement.

After 6 months of this, and many letters from my attorneys asking that she cease and desisit spreading lies — we had to haul her back into court. Once again, the judge took no real action. He issued another restraining order which said (in part): “Sherri shall stop spreading lies about Ken.” That is all. He never did seem to care and had an attitude of disdain. She also tore that restraining order to shreds in the parking lot of the courthouse and said to me and my attorney, “F*** you.”

Remember, I was still on Chemo at this point, spending what ultimately turned out to be $22,000 in attorney’s bills (just for myself). I was extremely week and had neither the will nor the strength to go out and “counter” her lies.

In January 2007, I took an 18 day trip to Costa Rica. The chemo had ended 60 days earlier (it worked ”“ I am alive and healthy). Upon returning, I had a sherriff knock on my door and hand me a document stating I had to be in court the next morning (January 19, 2007) at 8:00a.m. for an, “Emergency ex-parte stalking / abuse / restraining hearing” Sherri, in her own handwriting, went to the courthouse and swore out a complaint stating that I had come to her home on 6, different, occasions. Specifically, January 1st, 2nd, 5th, 7th, 12th and the 15th. When we went to court, my passport and airline tickets showed that I was near the equator (in Costa Rica) from December 30th (2006) to January 17th (2007). Obviously, everything that Sherri claimed was a total lie. The judge did not grant her the (stalking) order. When my attorney asked that she be held in contempt of court for blatantly lying ”“ the judge said “No.” When my attorney’s asked that my legal fees be paid by Sherri due to her, obvious, lies and the time wasted in court — the judge said, “No.” BTW, men getting shafted in court vis a vis divorce — is par for the course in my state. In the parking lot of the courthouse she, once agan, screamed “F*** you.”

Oh, have I stated that she went completely, 100%, incommunicado since the day she moved out. She has only spoken to me once. And, as I said earlier, Sherri cut off all communication between me and the children. She also forbade her kids from speaking with my daughter — their step-sibling of a decade. That is just, plain, cruel.

The divorce was finalized in, August, 2007. But the pathological lying continued, unabated. Finally, I had no choice but to file a libel / defamation & slander lawsuit against my ex-wife — and her homeowners insurance company (under the, liability, portion) Farmers Insurance. In March of this year they paid me a large amount of money($65,000) to drop the case. She also had to sign a letter allocuting to all of her lies and had to give me the two dogs back (which she had stolen 18 months earlier).

It would be so much easier if I had 10+ years of an awful marriage; this simply would have been the end of a bad thing. But, that was not the case; we had nothing but great times and true love. THAT IS WHAT MAKES THIS SO HARD. It was sudden, unexpected and so very violent in her utter silence and going incommunicado.

10 days prior to her “personality disorder” surfacing, Sheri gave me a card in which she had written the following words: “If God were sitting next to me now I would thank him for sending you to me. You have been a wonderful husband and the most perfect (step) father I could have ever wished for my kids.” This type of letter from her was quite common and I felt the same way. When we were talking to the psychologist, he asked: “Sherri, 10 days ago you wrote these words to Ken. What happened in the intervening 10 days?” She could not answer; she would just stare out of the window and say, “are we done yet?”

And all of you are correct, nobody wants to hear about this. Most people say, “”just get over it.” Or, “after 2 years, are you still talking about this shit?” Or, “I can’t believe that; there are always 3 sides to a divorce, his side, her side and the truth.”

I never got to tell ’em my side. I never got closure.

The Doctor’s called the multiple traumas I experienced, “Shakespaerean trauma.” I guess because it was so sudden and dramatic:
1) I was extremely ill and on chemo.
2) My spouse became (mentally) ill.
3) We were forced to divorce and our family destroyed.
4) When the chemo ended ”“ I was unemployed; my job had been eliminated.
5) My $400,000 home cracked in two pieces ”“ literally. The dirt shifted and my home split in two. Insurance does not cover this damage and I had to come up with $25,000 for emergency repairs.
6) During this 24 month nightmare, I had 16 (yes 16) close friends, neighbors and relatives die; I was a pallbearer at 9 of the funerals.

Six, major, traumas hit over a short period of time and I survived. Both psychologists said that there was one piece of good news. I, they said, am an “extremely strong” individual. They have had patient’s suffer nervous breakdowns and become hospitalized — who had less trauma than me.
That is my story.
January 2008

The followup letter two years later:
Lovefraud, I think this is a good time to revisit the site and update everyone about what has occurred to me recently (nearly 5 years after leaving my ex-wife). I have included my original post below (from early 2008) which will allow anyone read about the nightmare that I endured ”“ at the hands of my wife. Recently, her lies and insanity have reached out to sting me again!

Recently, I applied for life insurance. I was summarily turned down due to “private information found in your doctor’s records. “What private information I wondered?” I asked for copies and learned that, 5 to 7 years ago, my ex stole my “medical identity” ”“ and my insurance card. She let her loser boyfriend use my insurance card to get medical services for 3 years. All, naturally, without my knowledge and consent. Her boyfriend used my insurance card and coverage to go through drug counseling & alchohol counseling. Also, her boyfriend (apparently) stole the doctors prescription pad and wrote prescriptions for narcotics for himself and his friends. Several times (according to my medical records), the pharmacy was suspicious and they called the doctors office to verify the prescriptions. Of course, the Doctor’s office would deny writing me these prescriptions — and insert a note in my medical records stating that I had tried to obtain narcotics illegally. There are 25 of these “memos” in my medical records. Amazingly, the doctor never mentioned a thing during my treatments for cancer. He acted as if nothing was amiss?!? Had I known that shehad also done this to me, I would not have settled my libel, slander & defamation lawsuit 3 years ago. This has turned into a nightmare. It is extremely difficult to correct your medical records. Any attorney that I have spoken to wants a minimum of $5000 to even begin to help me with this, complex, nightmare. 5 years after she destroyed our marriage and family, and just as I have been getting on with my life, this pops up! Oh well, I have posted my original missive below:

May 7, 2013 5:13 pm

bluejay

Blindsided,

You do sound like Job, in the Bible, in one fell swoop, losing everything. Unbelievable. I recalled a saying not too long ago (and it’s true) – “life can turn on a dime.” You are a strong, resilient individual. It’s people who have been through hell and back that I have tremendous respect for. Peace.

Blindsided,
Your story leaves me speechless.I had never heard of sudden-onset bi-polar before.All of this happening at the time you were going through chemo reminds me of the account of Job in the Bible!So much tragedy;trauma.You must be a God-fearing man to have survived it all!Best wishes for things to hopefully straighten out!

May 8, 2013 1:12 am

Delta1

Hi Blindsided.

Being subject to smear campaign and having others believe the smear campaign is so frustrating. I really feel for you on this one.

Wow you’ve really been through the wringer and I think you must be an incredible person not to have ended up having a complete and total collapse.

I got badly ‘smeared’ too by two spaths – it’s really left a lot of collateral damage. I’ve set out a few thoughts, and I wonder if any other LF’ers can relate?

I felt utterly and completely humiliated in my relationsh*t with the first spath. Not only was I treated appallingly in private – but he made sure that everyone knew about it – and then also spread nasty tales about me – unfortunately some of it true (past drug history- told in confidence, for example) but also mixed in with alot of nasty lies.

The smear campaign is so effective isn’t it? In my experience, I was completely ‘devalued’ in the eyes of lots of people (of course not the ones that really mattered). I understood for the first time that many people enjoy seeing someone else being humiliated.

One lasting trait is -I never really confide in anyone anymore – expect on LF and sometimes ‘after the event’to one or two friends. I just find it hard to trust people now and have a sense that revealing any weaknesses is just too much of a risk to take. Even close friends get ‘edited highlights’ now.

The other thing is that I get really nervous about introducing friends to each other. I’ve had to completely disengage from 2 groups of friends in the past as they were ‘infected’ by the spaths in my life. In the end it was just not worth the spath(s) being able to continue to spread their barbs and poison via the means of dupes, or even worse by people who enjoyed making hurtful remarks and witnessing my upset and pain.

I think the worst is that I was always someone who was happy to really be myself and to ‘standout’ or ‘be apart from’ the crowd, not in a flash or narcissistic way – just always had a sense of my right to really just be myself – and that’s been really badly affected. I really don’t feel that good about myself anymore – though I try to hide it as much as possible in order to avoid attracting any more sharks.

Now I try to fly under the radar much more – I get nervous that if I am too confident or if I talk about any good fortune,or if I visibly enjoy myself too much – that I make myself a target.

Unfortunately I have become somewhat jaded, spiky and misanthropic since all these things happened to me. That’s the worst of it. I don’t want to be the naive and trusting girl I was 18 but neither do I wish to be a ‘bitter old woman’ at the age 40 (my current age). I often do feel bitter, depressed or angry as a result of the fallout from the spaths and their minions.

When I feel this way – I also get afraid to go out and do things – again sort of through fear. I stay at home more than I should. Or miss out on an opportunity because I haven’t the strength to ‘run the gauntlet’ and deal with the outside world.

I’ve also put on loads of weight – which is really horrible on every sort of level.

I was rarely like this in the past – in fact I’ve always been quite adventurous and bit of a fitness freak.

Anyway – any LF readers got tips to deal with chronic bitterness? I know being bitter is like drinking a cup of your own poison and then complaining because you have stomach ache. however knowing this but it doesn’t resolve the feelings.

I get bitter and I’m also depressed that I ended up 40, childless, overweight. that I find the idea of being in a relationship makes me feel empty inside, and even friendships are really tiring at times.

One of the most unpleasant hangovers from my relationsh*t with the spath(s) – is that I get bitter when my friends get married -It’s akin to, but way beyond jealousy – it’s like I literally feel sick at the thought of going to anyone’s wedding! Even very good friends. It has negatively affected more than one friendship as of course people are offended if you don’t go to their wedding (even with a good excuse!). I felt pretty guilty about not going and then kind of angry and depressed that what should be happy occassions are a major negative trigger for me.

I never wanted to be the kind of person who would feel bitter at another person’s happiness. But life with Spaths has made me a bit damaged to the point where even normal good things are painful sometimes.

A wedding makes me kind of want to throw up as it reminds me of how I once was full of youth and hopefulness that I would find a half-decent man and get married one day and maybe even have a family too.

Now I feel that I’m quite disfunctional and I don’t think that even if i met someone nice – that I could handle being married. I’m spiky, overly independant, and well I wouldn’t want to take the financial risk of being married. To me getting married means – “here feel free to cheat on me in the safety of knowing you can rip off all my money too!”.

I think marriage is still a form of social currency though – and I get really hacked of that a single woman I’m seen a ‘lesser’ in some way than the ‘smug marrieds’. I still get pissed off when the ‘smug marrieds’ boast about their lives/marriage – even if I don’t necessarily believe that they’re as happy as they’re pretending sometimes.

On the good side – I have a lovely home, a lovely cat, good job, currently financially secure, at least 2 good friends, no major health worries, I sing in a band with people who I’m really fond of..

Still there is a bitterness/unhappiness in me that I feel people can sense a little bit – my good friends are sweet and don’t comment too much.

Delta,
I used to feel the exact same way about going to weddings.I’m not sure how I would handle a wedding invitation today.But there shouldn’t be a problem with you leaving a wedding present with the family and explaining that you won’t be at the wedding but please convey your best wishes.

May 8, 2013 11:33 pm

Blindsided

Delta, I can only empathize with you and offer my condolences. As I referenced above, I have been changed forever. I will never get married again. I do not care if I ever have another relationship again. Like you, I do not share good news (or bad) with anyone anymore. Best of luck.

May 16, 2013 5:01 pm

bluejay

Delta1,

It sounds like you have a good life. In time, I’d like to have what you have. I know as single women, we can feel lesser than (but, we’re not). I respect you because you probably have a fuller, more contented life, compared to many married women. I guess, whatever our status in life, if we can live our lives the way we see fit, where we’re living a healthy, rich existence, then that’s “success” in my eyes.

Blindsided…huge kudos to you for your resilience in the face of this terrible trauma. Perhaps the woman’s insanity can offer you some comfort? I mean by that, that she does not appear in control of herself , her behaviour appears paranoid, almost psychotic. I’m terribly sorry to read about what this has done to you and the children. Peace and love to you may your remission last always. You’re a brave man.

May 8, 2013 9:04 am

Delta1

Thanks Tealight and Bluejay. I know you’re right. Your comments have reminded me of the need to keep the ol’ ‘attitude of gratitude’and that I do have a lot to be thankful about and maybe other people looking at me would think I’m really lucky.

I know I’m lucky that the spaths didn’t wipe me out financially like some of the folks on here (not that they didn’t try hard to get at my resources!) , and also that the local police (Metropolitan Police, London) acted helpfully and quickly to keep the spaths away (which is not always the case).

Blessings to you both and to Blindsided and all LFers- Delta1

And hip hip hooray to Donna for setting up such a fantastic resource.

May 8, 2013 3:51 pm

Tea Light

NDelta, glad the Met were helpful to you! I’m sorry now that I didn’t add to my post to you that it’s totally understandable, the residual anger that can become bitterness. We’re only human. It’s hard to not have a loving supportive partner and to wonder how the hell you can risk letting a new person in again. But enjoying other’s happiness won’t make us feel worse. Happiness isn’t a quantifiable resource! We can all have our share if we live well and remain open to the possibility of happiness, which for me just means peace, finding inner strength, minimising my dealings with aggressive , difficult people, having the health and enough resources to be comfortable and enjoy my interests. I think it is more than possible for life to be good without a partner , and it’s really best not to worry about not finding someone as I know divorced and widowed and long term single people who. bumped into a husband / love of their life in their 50s! It happens all the time.

May 8, 2013 7:36 pm

Tea Light

PS Delta I read a good book not long ago which is ideal if you are in an anti smug marrieds mood – Against Love by Laura Kipnis. It’s really just anti marriages of convenience and bad marriages, rather than love! Give it a go it’ll confirm all your suspicions that the grass is not necessarily greener on the married side of the lawn!Â

May 8, 2013 7:43 pm

fightforwhatsright

I needed to read this one again today. When family and friends abandon us, it is so much worse than realizing we are in a web with a spider.

May 14, 2013 12:10 pm

fightforwhatsright

I think professional therapy is the best choice. However, parts of one of my stories scared some therapists too much. I had to search quite a while to find a calm therapist who could handle the truth.

May 20, 2013 5:31 pm

FindingHealthyPaths

This is an awesome article, thank you so much for it. I don’t think I have seen anything in writing about this before. Snakes in Suits noted how folks duped react in 3-4 different ways, but I have been trying to be friends with the duped (yes, as I’m still way too close for comfort) with folks who may have caught some of it from the spath I called out. It’s directly related to what I’ve heard termed the cycle of abuse, I think.

I kind of think it’s the shame-anger that comes out at the unhealthy side of narcissism that provokes some “friends” to be scared of your voicing things. I feel sad I’m in that position also with the great majority of my friends. It really shines a light on the 1-2 who remain true, even listening, and still caring about you/me, any messenger.

Ego, in my eyes, is almost nothing to be admired, as I see it leading to the unhealthy side of narcissism. Of course the healthy side, making and keeping your own boundaries and treating others respectfully, hoping for golden rules, is definitely TO be admired, by me anyway. A 30-yr friend of mine just told me a disturbing story about her husband, who has seemed disturbing to me for years, to whom of course I can’t used charged words, she’s actually defending some pretty indefensible actions, and can’t hear it, now. She revealed her truth to me, not having anyone else in her life she can tell, but since then where I have e-communicated respecting herself and nothing more dramatic than that, and she has disappeared for now.

It seems really, really hard for folks to admit things like this, and to see it and deal with it, much less the messenger. I think it is all core to healthy upbringings, which I see few of unfortunately, where it should be relentlessly modeled, respecting yourself, and in how many ways you need to learn to do it to feel good in our life.

I’m working on it now myself, even though I personally have never had any fear in asking for respect from parents, nor now in marriage. In between I had a harder time often.

But, that’s the education that I see parents both not knowing themselves, then not passing on to their kids, and why I so applaud Donna’s school education programs for kids. Respect yourself first. Pretty easily summed up. Am trying to give that message away where I can without offending, but that part is a delicate negotiation with adults-with-ego-issues. With younger kids, it’s actually much easier to broach as a general topic, a great one.

May 21, 2013 6:20 am

fightforwhatsright

It really is wonderful to get this stuff to them as young as possible. Good post.

May 21, 2013 11:28 am

4Light2shine

Hi this is my first post. I stumbled across this site 2 or 3 weeks ago after devouring ” the Sociopath next door” I have known for a couple of years about Narcissism – NPD and immediately identified the traits and behaviors that I was being subjected to. I met my shining beacon of deception back in 07. Looking back I am baffled at just how many times she was able to convince me to stay, that it was somehow another misunderstanding, that we just have different styles of communication, that I had just been alone so long I didn’t know what being in a real life relationship was like… The problems always revolved around those of the opposite sex. Ex sexual partners, men she worked with, men we met while we were on dates, … Flirtation, reciprocation, really bad judgement, massive double standards- the exact same things she had claimed bothered her she would do, and the entitlement, don’t get me started. The last opportunity that I squandered to escape was just 2 weeks before the wedding, and by 2 weeks after we said I do, I knew I had a profoundly unethical person who was now attacking the exact positions I had very tentatively agreed to trust her word on , and even more acted like she had never heard before. The attack on my Psche, my value system, and the progressive character assassination that followed isolated me and sent me into a deep depression. My faith has always been the center of my life and so when faced with these bizarre challenges I reached out to the congregation overseers. Unfortunately the one I chose was the worst one I could have gone to. When I met with him he was spot on, very insightful, brought up some of the same articles I had referenced, and absolutely assured me I would get some needed help. After meeting alone with her his counsel and demeanor changed 180 degrees. During the meeting she brought up the fact that this overseer used to hold on to her hand for a long time when he talked to her and that she was afraid I would see and get mad. Of course the inappropriateness of this and the failure of him to inform me at the outset created a massive conflict of interest in which her behaviors were condoned and I was given strong counsel . Over the next couple of years I continued to reach out to others explaining these events and the latest inappropriate encounters and flirtations . Each time the outcome was basically the same . They always could find ways to give me strong counsel, and each time you could almost hear them saying “don’t worry girl, we’ve got your back” wink, wink. Eventually under the guise of apologizing to me this overseer when I articulated the individual offenses looked me in the eye and said “None of those things ever happened” That’s right he gaslighted me. Now I understand, the social director of the community who seems to channel joy itself, and have you tasted her cooking ? Amazing. Not to mention she always supports the ministry. Now add to her word the word of a Pillar in the community. Besides my truths are ugly and unpleasant . Their lies are much more palatable . So now what do I do ? I educate myself. I try to put things in perspective. My faith in the teachings and doctrines has never been the issue. My faith as in confidence in the appointed men is a different story. When those you would have trusted implicitly at one time prove otherwise or fail to step up – when trials betray their lack of integrity, that they are easily swayed by deceptions or politics, or simply that they are inept, you are forced to reevaluate . Difficult as it is going through it, once I had been reduced to a cautionary tale through the slanderings of the one who continues to profess her love and concern for me I have now been forced to acknowledge just how masterful she is at perpetrating her composite of evil, fully entitled, and of course never being really held accountable . So until I’m able to fully remove myself from the realm of influence of these pseudo spiritual politicians,deceptions will abound. Others, mostly decent folks who’s hearts have been stolen by by her are not likely to see the true cause but only the effects, so their comments, their opinions are likely to be off base.we need to give ourselves permission to filter their opinions and dogma. When we have done the work, and gotten to the place where we know our instincts are solid, and that if we had followed them in the first place it would have saved us a lot of trouble, then we don’t need someone who may not have a clue to tell you you’re wrong. That you should ignore your instincts. Thank you for such a well written article. It was helpful, and I think important and validating.

May 22, 2013 4:27 am

Tea Light

Welcome 4light , hopefully you will find sharing your frustrations and your clear sense of betrayal by this woman and members of your congregation therepeutic and validating. Many here, including male members of the community who do post though in fewer numbers than the ladies will relate to your experience of manipulation so do continue to post. All the very best and God bless.

welcome 4light2shine,
It’s very frustrating to have a marriage mate that “is in good standing” and “looks good” to the congregation.Especially when they’re so good at manipulating and covering over what is really happening “behind closed doors”.You begin to doubt your own sense of what is truly happening.Don’t forget though that no matter how smart these people,they cannot “out-maneuver” God when it comes to finally being exposed!Don’t lose your trust in congregation arrangements because of a man or even a few men.Keep your faith strong and do what you must to remain sane and to survive.

May 22, 2013 2:42 pm

fightforwhatsright

They trick everyone…therapists, some friends, some family members, and yes, people of faith. Some sociopaths are therapists, friends, family members and yes, people of faith. They are like robots/computers and can scan a human and know exactly how to con them. It leaves us feeling like we are the crazy ones. But, it is them…and their ability to trick just about every person in their path.

May 22, 2013 7:22 pm

4Light2shine

Thank you Tea Light, Blossom4th, and Fight for the warm welcome. I’ve read some of your posts from other articles and have enjoyed your insights. I had a bit of trepidation about posting, but reading some of your comments helped me to see the benefit of being a part of this unique community if even in a small way. So far I’m very impressed with the quality of articles here. Take care.

May 23, 2013 1:36 am

fightforwhatsright

I think it helps a lot to post…kind of like journaling. However, also feeling truly heard by others in similar situations.

May 23, 2013 6:25 pm

FindingHealthyPaths

I know it is not my job to try to re-parent, yet find my relentless self asserting to DH to respect himself to his ex-spath, who is relentless in denying and counter-attacking, knowing full well that DH was doing the same to me for too long. It’s like extreme and ugly defensiveness. I have not been stolen from financially, as his ex was doing and is with her current spouse, though time and faith have definitely been stolen, as well as many things that 4Light2Shine mentions losing. In my case I’ve outlined DH’s hypocrisy strongly enough that he is seeing and admitting it, finally, and seems to be trying to stop that, and will at least relatively quickly apologize when he’ll still lash out. I watched Good Will Hunting, and was struck by how much DH is just like Will, who when I looked up his psychological profile, online it’s noted to be PTSD which a counselor told us he’d be surprised if DH didn’t need treatment for following marriage with his ex-spath, upon hearing some of the super manipulative blaming done by email still. Likewise following his abusive upbringing. DH has looked up some treatment options and providers, and is reading about the most successful treatment option for PTSD. He asserts his devotion to improving, which yes, I’ve heard is common. Though, as noted long ago, here, he is overall a really nice guy (to me in ways he chooses, and of course to others), until he feels under psychological pressure, by my being mad or something, where acting as if a grown up is no longer absolutely impossible, and he is improving. So, while I’m at the breaking point, because DH has given this a lot of effort lately that I’ve seen and heard, I am counting slight infractions still and watching those efforts very carefully. But I am definitely tired of doing and of my own choosing to do this/stay here.

June 8, 2013 8:48 am

fightforwhatsright

newstepmom:

It sounds like you are struggling with a lot on your mind today.

I am wondering if you have seen proof that his ex is a sociopath stealing money or if your husband has just told you this? Many personality disordered people will lie about ex’s, especially to keep you from talking to the ex directly. Just something to think about.

There are so many personality disorders and mental illnesses, that it would be difficult to fully identify one from a movie character description. I can suggest that you go to medlineplus.gov or nimh.gov to read through all of the medically recognized identifying traits of different disorders and illnesses to be more solid about what he could have in your opinion from observing him during your time together.

While people with PTSD can often have dissociation and be numb to feelings, they do not normally display a lot of the traits of a sociopath or someone with borderline personality disorder. People with PTSD feel empathy, don’t have a pathology of lying, stealing, have a fake persona, etc.

Many sociopaths, people with anti-social personality disorder, borderline personality disorder, and others will often “jump to” attention when they can tell you are ready to get away from them. My spath has repeatedly stated he will seek help by reading books and attending counseling. The books are never “right” for him so he quits reading as soon as he sees himself in them. He always sabotages the counseling or he goes in and pretends to be fine and, after a few weeks, gets an A+ from a therapist who doesn’t know he/she is being tricked. My borderline ex actually does go to his counseling most of the time, he does read books, he has a great deal of empathy, and he knows when he has crossed the line. However, when defensive, angry, regressing, etc., he will display sociopath behaviors…and then feel terrible about it and I believe doesn’t understand himself at all. PTSD can bring out some borderline tendencies. However, those usually tend to be less brutal behaviors like high anxiety, hypervigilence, some fear and some paranoia, and agitation.

I am thinking of you today and hope you will continue to share what you are going through so you can sort it all out. I would definitely suggest reading as much as you can about all mental illnesses and all personality disorders. There is a very good article in the Archives here (go up to the About link and choose the Archives link) which compares Borderline Personality Disorder to Sociopaths. It was very helpful to me. It is by Becker and you may have to do a keyword search, but you may also be able to go to the right side of the page and look through recent articles because I saw it maybe about 10 days ago. I may try to see if I can bring it back up for you on the left of the home page.

Also, look at all of Donna’s videos. Check out the Red Flags of a Sociopath. Go to those other medical sites. See if you can narrow down the behaviors to one or more of the illnesses your husband may have. Trust what you are experiencing and witnessing from him. He may truly be searching for his own diagnosis, but that can often be a ploy that can drag on for years where they will act in an unacceptable way and then learn “the ropes” for how to control you by being super nice, apologetic, gifts, withdrawing from you claiming they must “think,” making you think it is you, and on and on. There are similarities, but many abusive people come up with a special combo that speaks to you specifically so you will back off and the cycle begins again with them in control of you.

I know I keep repeating this a lot here. But, read as much as you can about everything it could possibly be. Patricia Evans has some excellent books about Verbal and Emotional Abuse. One of her books even has a contract each member of the couple creates, agrees to, and signs, with expectations of how unacceptable words or actions will be handled when noticed. You probably know his patterns better than anyone. At this point, I suggest that you start researching outside of him and what he says by educating yourself about what you are witnessing and experiencing from him. Take care of yourself today.

June 8, 2013 3:00 pm

blueskies

Really great article. Thank you Linda.x I have struggled with coming to terms with friends and even family members I scared ( yeah I was pretty scarey and extremely afraid and sad – its no fun) and lost when I was having such a terrible time – there are some I most certainly didn’t though… great to read today and so helpful and thought provoking.x

June 15, 2013 11:25 am

fightforwhatsright

I feel very hurt by my family. I was constantly doing for them and their children for decades. I am also the family comic, and they got very angry for not taking care of them all during their traumas AND always being ready to put on a show! It has shocked me how hateful they have become. I am estranged from them. It was devastating to realize that I was loved for what I was doing….and for being funny….and when those things became too difficult for me, my family was very cruel.

June 17, 2013 2:21 pm

blueskies

Dear FFWR

I am so sorry that your family have been so cruel. I remember when reading others experience of trauma and depression on line when I was in such a bad place myself after the ‘relationshit’ and they’d say things like ‘I don’t know where i’d be without the support of my family’ I’d just start to cry!

I have posted somewhere else on this thread about how I believe that the devastation I experienced after ‘the discard’ ultimately left me with a healthier attitude to friendships. Which is all well and good but the process sucked:(

With my family – what happened for me was that in learning and understanding about sociopaths and Narcissists and trying to understand MY part in why I was so easily manipulated, I recognised that My mother had very strong narcissistic traits and to cut a long story short my sister , myself and her had been engaged in an unholy ‘trinity’ of behaviour with eachother in which I had been brought up as ‘the scape goat’… taught to accept the unacceptable, and almost never allowed to have personal boundaries or to expect my needs met – that I existed to meet theirs.(perfect plum picking for a sociopath)

I cut off all contact with my mother for 4 years.( I isolated myself from nearly everyone else too at the time – in my other post I have tried to say why I think that was.)

I recently started having contact with my mother again though – I feel ‘aware enough’ and strong enough now ( much reading on the subject of being a child of narcissistic parents, much thinking; from the bonkers to the rational!) but I am still very careful not to get into the old ‘dynamic’ and keep things short and sweet and make sure I have time outs from her. I think I have found a much healthier way of being with her than before. I don’t feel pain or anger towards her anymore, but I don’t forget who she is. ( caveat – I don’t suggest that everyone parents are narcissists that get stung by a sociopath or that anyone else should put up with narcissists just cuz they’re family… I’m doing what feels okay for me.x)

My sister has found it very difficult to empathise with what has happened to me.

It might be because she hasn’t had much practice due to our ‘family dynamic’.

It might be because she is the sort of person who cant stand to hear bad things because she cant ‘fix’ them.

Maybe its because she is the sort of person who’s value of others is based on how useful or amusing they are to her – I was not either anymore.

Maybe its because my depression was so dark and scary.

Her reaction was to ostracise and exclude, to exacerbate things rather than comfort. For example she never called me – but she did tell just about everyone she could that I was I was bi-polar – so helpful ( don’t have a problem with anyone who suffers from this BTW – but I am not) – and even ‘foaming at the mouth’!

She wouldn’t allow me near her child when she was born, threw family birthday parties and neglected to invite us…all this after always using me as HER emotional cheerleader… gas lighting? Punishment for no longer towing the line? her deciding I was too depressed and wouldn’t want to come to anything anyway?

Maybe one day we will rebuild our relationship – but it will be different because of my experience – I’m different – and maybe right now she doesn’t see anything ‘in that for her’ maybe she never will – but I cant be the scapegoat anymore. end of. this is a good thing. this will have to be fine.

A book I found helpful while ‘unpacking’ my family’s and my behaviours was ‘children of the self absorbed’ by Nina Brown. ( I know others haven’t found it so helpful but I did!)

Please keep trucking FFWR, and being kind to yourself, especially if no one else is. xx And I hope sharing a bit of my story ( or endless waffle!) will at the least help you feel that you are so not alone!

June 18, 2013 4:56 am

fightforwhatsright

blueskies:

Thank you so much. Our stories sound very similar except it is my father who is an off-the-charts narcissist. It is interesting you said something about other family members creating “the holy trinity.” We were taught to worship him by my mother. Everything was said and done to keep him happy. I, too, was the big scapegoat in my family. I was beaten, slapped, verbally, and emotionally abused regularly. He moved us away from a progressive part of the country to the South where his belief system fit right in. I was 16 and one sister was 14. We had been socialized differently. I think that’s why he moved us. We actually thought our gender was equal! I now say that we were “sister wives” to my mother. We were lucky he did not want to sexually abuse us. If he had, my mother would have easily looked the other way. However, two of his brothers and one of their friends sexually abused us….and THEY are the ones he move us close to!

I am very isolated because of going through a trauma at work and really have no friends that I see. I have an ex-boyfriend spath who is now a lodger on a property I own and an ex-husband who I believe is borderline personality. So, some help from two people whom are both unreliable leaving me often feeling less than supported. This website and people like you posting support for me have changed the way I deal with both of them and the way I think about my future choices.

Thank you so much, blueskies. I needed a lot of support today as Lodger spath had surgery again yesterday and won’t be able to walk normally any time soon if at all. Today, because of the support I have from Donna, the posters here, and what I have learned here, I got off the phone fast when the conversation became one of “deceitful entitlement” with him. The last three times he was in the hospital, I felt obligated to call him and then I would take abuse. Today, I quickly said, “Well, I’ve got to go now (after returning his call). Have a good lunch.” I won’t call him again. He will have to do the calling and if he doesn’t, he doesn’t have a ride home….or any home. The support here has raised my self esteem up and I am so grateful.

June 18, 2013 1:14 pm

liferaft2

There is another, darker reason why some people are uncomfortable with our revelations, sometimes even seeming to disapprove of them: they may be abusers and spaths themselves.
I suspect I’ve witnesed this many times: their reaction of discomfort when I describe my travails, and then, often much later–as if they’d spent some time ruminating on the issue–their coming out with an actual defense or “alternative” interpretation of the bad behavior I’d described.
It has always puzzled me…until very recently, with the growing realization that miscreants stick together on a basic level, to some degree at least.

July 9, 2013 10:01 am

liferaft2

I don’t want to be a downer after such a positive and inspiring article, but caution is always advisable when we are so vulnerable. I learned this the hard way during and shortly after my marriage to the spath, when I spilled my guts to new friends who seemed to care but later demonstrated that they were more focused on what they could gain financially by means of our friendship. And so while it’s certainly true that real friends stand by us when we are down and out, it’s also advisable to “Beware the friends you make in your misfortune.”
I must also state another dark truth–again I apologize for the pessimism, but this is the way I have seen it: during my darkest time–and it wasn’t when I was with the spath–certain family members who had previously basically turned up their noses at me suddenly behaved as if they were so caring and concerned. Maybe it’s simply that my previous good luck had never inspired their concern–and why would it? But it seemed it never inspired their affections either! Maybe they were jealous of my charmed life…for they were never friendly before disaster hit me.

July 9, 2013 10:27 am

4Light2shine

liferaft, sadly I have to agree with your dark observations. I have experienced this firsthand. Think about it. If I am a predator running a pretty good front, good enough that you come to me seeking help or support from another freak, would it serve me well to really assist you ? Probably not. If you are getting wise to the con and want to warn others and share your insights, ect, I don’t want you blabbing, and drawing attention. What would serve me better ( if I were an evil shapeshifter ) would be to take you down a few notches, to punch holes in your story, to gaslight you, to sabotage your credibility with others. Anything to keep you down, depressed, anxious, confused, hey a full mental breakdown would really be convenient and useful. I’m very familiar with this stuff. Because my primary spath is female there is usually complicity already with any regional cluster B types so conflict of interest is almost unavoidable. Regarding friends, I feel you there too. Learning to reevaluate to see the difference between friends and people I’ve known for a long time. That’s been a tough one for me. I truly value my real friends much more than I used to. See I found something nice to say. Let’s end with that !