How long do we wait before we can properly discuss this thing without spoiler text or dancing around what we really want to say?

SO the real question for next season seems to be; How do you take down god? On the one hand I kinda hope that Sam and Dean go after the real God and bring him back to deal with his wayward kiddos. On the hand, I'm not sure how they would do that and make God impressive enough.

I hope that dealing with Cas proves to be a bigger undertaking than some of the recent sneak peeks have seemed to be. I read an interview that made reference to new big bads, plural, and it didn't sound like Cas was included in that ....

I think they'll have Cas as more of an anti-villain than an out-and-out big bad. The possibility of him coming back down to normal (both power-wise and mental-state) seems pretty high here. But I doubt they'll get to that right away.

It will be interesting to see how the brothers function without Castiel. I mean in seasons six and seven especially they often relied on him to save their lives. But he was one of the better executed Deus ex Machina characters I've seen done.

Man I do not know how I feel about this season so far. I like that Sam is acting more like his old self but Dean's attitude is really starting to piss me off! I especially don't like how contradictory Dean acted this episode compared to the one before last... Supernatural creature killing bad people to save her son is a death sentence but two witches kill people over a lovers spat and he just lets them go? Wtf?!

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.

luketheduke86 wrote: Supernatural creature killing bad people to save her son is a death sentence but two witches kill people over a lovers spat and he just lets them go? Wtf?!

This episode was flat-out terrible, IMO. Witches, in the Supernatural-verse, don't have this sort of 'waggle your fingers' Ex Machina powers. Indeed, the episode itself constradicted itself, with the witch placing hexes on people, when she, at the end of the episode, displays the power to just point at people and choke them. Why is she casting hexes on people and hiding coins and stuff when she's Jean Grey and doesn't need any of that stuff?

And the 800 years old crap was over the top as well. This felt more like an episode of Buffy than of Supernatural (and not just because of the actors they chose). The 'lore' was completely wrong for the series, and felt like a couple of Green Lanterns just floated into my gritty urban street-defender Batman story.

Setothes wrote:This episode was flat-out terrible, IMO. Witches, in the Supernatural-verse, don't have this sort of 'waggle your fingers' Ex Machina powers. Indeed, the episode itself constradicted itself, with the witch placing hexes on people, when she, at the end of the episode, displays the power to just point at people and choke them. Why is she casting hexes on people and hiding coins and stuff when she's Jean Grey and doesn't need any of that stuff?.

Subtlety? Alibi? ("How could I have killed her? I was at home, all my neighbors saw me come 15 minutes before she died.") The coins add the Indirect & Variable Descriptor power feats to her Blasts?

luketheduke86 wrote: Supernatural creature killing bad people to save her son is a death sentence but two witches kill people over a lovers spat and he just lets them go? Wtf?!

This episode was flat-out terrible, IMO. Witches, in the Supernatural-verse, don't have this sort of 'waggle your fingers' Ex Machina powers. Indeed, the episode itself constradicted itself, with the witch placing hexes on people, when she, at the end of the episode, displays the power to just point at people and choke them. Why is she casting hexes on people and hiding coins and stuff when she's Jean Grey and doesn't need any of that stuff?

And the 800 years old crap was over the top as well. This felt more like an episode of Buffy than of Supernatural (and not just because of the actors they chose). The 'lore' was completely wrong for the series, and felt like a couple of Green Lanterns just floated into my gritty urban street-defender Batman story.

I agree this episode was just plain bad, both in terms of Sam and Dean's characterizations and the lore established in the series. Yes, I can understand the witches killing from a distance through hexes/curses rather than physically entering a victim's home, but previously even powerful witches (the ones who summoned Samhain, the gambler who played for people's years instead of money) still were mostly dependent on hexes invovling fetish items (coins, hex bags, cards), rituals, and the occasional spoken spell. They weren't the "slay with a gesture/summon stinging insects/throw lightning bolts" variety.

Admittedly, the Irish gambler who used witchcraft took steps in this direction-he basically gets off scotfree at the end of the episode, though his girlfriend reverts to old age and leaves him. Very old or experienced witches have been difficult for the hunters to deal with-they have been shown to be well prepared with defensive charms, contingency spells that protect their lairs, and so on.

(The Risen Dead have likewise been tough for Sam and Dean to deal with-some are simple zombies who can be dispatched with shots to the head/brain, others have to staked with a silver spike in their former graves, some have to be dispatched by fire or re-burial, etc. Hunters are best against monsters who have clearly defined weaknesses and lore).

But for Sam and Dean to just drop the matter and leave this two to continue their exploits was character derailment-they murdered four people and viciously assaulted another during their "spat". The boys have often retreated when necessary, but never just given up on a case. Remember, in the course of the series, they've faced off against the most powerful arch-demons, fallen gods/demigods, rogue archangels, and even Satan. The brothers most effective trait against the supernatural has always been they simply do not quit, even when way outmatched. They've backed off and even fled fights at times, but only to rearm and come back with lethal force.

I honestly don't find the Leviathans very much in the category of Big Bads so far-as Bobby said, so far they seem to be powered-up shapeshifters, except with a mouthful of lamprey teeth and hypercarnivorous appetites. Maybe I'm disappointed because they obviously have no resemblece with the "Great Beasts" of the bible (admittedly they could not, unless the guys could somehow summon the friendly versions of Godzilla and Mothra to deal with them). I almost wish the Dark Fey/Faeries from season six could have emerged as the primary enemies. Explain the near-apocalypse weakened the walls of reality, allowing beings from the Fey World once more into the earthly realm. I found the dialogue of the Leprechaun from the ep "Clap your hands if you believe" pretty chilling-he didn't respect the "human Devil" and scoffed at angels, saying he would show Sam "some real magic"; in authenic folklore (not the scrubbed Disney stuff) creatures from the faerie realm were dangerous, even those who seemed friendly or harmless-they didn't understand human behavior or basic reality and ascribed to Blue and Orange morality.