ADDED: Gabrielle Giffords was the member of Congress who had the honor of reading the First Amendment when the Constitution was read on the House floor January 6th. Video.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

And judging from the comments to this post, people are already trying to score political points. Well, they kind of telegraphed this strategy, didn’t they? Remember Bloomberg making a fool of himself by blaming the Times Square bombing on the Tea Party? How about waiting until we actually know something, this time? That’s likely to be soon enough.

(Not saying *I* know the shooter was a Palin disciple, just saying that that will be said, and then there will be those against that, and then accusations of this and that, and counter-accusations of that and this...)

Hey, chuck b! Way to be classy! Now, kindly fuck off and leave the political ghoulishness out this. This goes for everybody commenting here on this. Partisanship has no place in this tragedy. There will be time aplenty to sort this out in the coming days. Remember, chuckie, these things can come back and bite your ass big time.

In the meantime, a number of people have been killed, and their families and communities have been plunged into a nightmare that few of us can imagine.

Fulbright Scholar, Scripps and Cornell graduate, wife of a space shuttle and Navy pilot, businesswoman, serious politician with thoughtful positions on immigration, border security, guns, economic issues, energy. She seems to have been several cuts above the average politician.

For the sake of argument what if it was a white male and he shouted out "For the Republicans!", does this condemn all Republicans and conservatives? Really I want to know why my political speech would suddenly be subjected to being censored because of a lone madman.

"For the sake of argument what if it was a white male and he shouted out "For the Republicans!", does this condemn all Republicans and conservatives? Really I want to know why my political speech would suddenly be subjected to being censored because of a lone madman."

Unfortunately, the left is using this tragedy to score political points. Rep. Giffords was on Gov. Palin’s target list for defeat this past November. The left claims Gov. Palin has blood on her hands. So does the tea party movement.

Yup, the left has no shame. They are no actively attempting to stifle and foment violence against conservatives.

This is the dark heart of the Western Taliban. Beautiful and horrible in its simplicity: Derive power from selling fear and hate. Whip that product into a corrosive froth. Sit back and count the bodies.

And yeah... the pre-triangulation, the need not to let a crisis go to waste, it all smells a whole lot of party-time don't it? Whoo-hoo! We can make political hay! Lets go! Alpha! You got your script baby, get your points in there early, before any details come out. We all know how to spin this, too bad of the sacrifice, but it will come out in our favor, huh?

Everyone knows that the violent rhetoric of the left is as vile and outright aggressive as any on the right, but a death, a real *death*, that will obscure that truth and political points can be made. The opportunity can not be wasted. The only thing that could happen that would be better is the *left-wing* assassination fantasies about Obama came true.

Dancing on graves is a liberal specialty. Can you imagine the sorrow if Congresswoman Giffords doesn't die and the political rally at her funeral has to be canceled?

"I hope that's not where we're going, but you know, if this Congress keeps going the way it is, people are really looking toward those Second Amendment remedies. They're saying: My goodness, what can we do to turn this country around?" Sharron Angle

I lied: I am back for my last comment to Althouse: Ms A--if you had a shred of human decency would spike this thread--you wont of course because it drives up your hit count which is what this is all about.

I don't see why Althouse should close this thread. It's important to defend our rights to free speech in the wake up lefties using this assassination as a beachhead to silence us. Remember they WILL silence us if you just shut up.

Alex: Congresswoman Giffords is a friend of mine, in fact I just talked to her at our last state party meeting in December. She has always tried to do the right thing to benefit the people down there in Tucson as well as the United States of America. Your trying to spin this into attempts by liberals to 'foment violence against conservatives' would be twisted and bizarre if it were not so sickening right now.

Rep. Giffords' office was shot during the campaign (as well as Rep. Grijalva's.) A lot of the rest of those who voted for the health care law received death threats.

Incidentally, I was present when an unruly crowd in the Holbrook Safeway on Aug. 7, 2009 caused then rep. Ann Kirkpatrick to leave (which was shamelessly exploited during the campaign by the Gosar campaign as saying she had 'walked out' on her constituents.

I'm angry. I'm willing to wait until we know more about the suspect and why he did this horrible murder before I say more specifically about this.

This is a VERY dangerous time. The liberals are going to use this assassination to shred the Constitution, just you wait and see. They needed a smoking gun, here it is. I expect calls to ban the 2nd amendment very shortly.

The liberals are going to use this assassination to shred the Constitution

No. First, they've already been using the attempted assissination of President Reagan and the resulting paralysis of Jim Brady. Second, neither that attempt nor the very successful attempts prior to then have been used successfully to shred the Constitution.

@Eli, thank you for your forbearance. Yes, let's find out what happened first.

I was a teenager when Kennedy was shot. I have vivid memories of people rushing to claim that the assassination was a Texas plot to put LBJ into the presidency, or that the shooter was a member of some right wing militia. In the end, of course, Lee Harvey Oswald was a dedicated member of the far left lunatic fringe, who had gone to live in Russia and attempt to renounce his citizenship.

So let's find out. As of the latest data I've seen, Congresswoman Giffords was officially listed as "wounded." So let's all hope.

This is a horrible crime. I won't assume what the motives are until I hear some reports from the police on this. But this is an evil act, regardless of what the motives were.

However, I will say that people like Florida, and anyone who cheers him/her/it on, are complete trash and worthy of scorn and contempt, whether he/she/it believes what he/she/it is saying or is just being a troll.

Sarah Searchlight and her psychotic followers, including Nugent the narc, should be held accountable for this. This will backfire on the teabuggers as well (assuming the perp is another pro-NRA, slack-jawed racist yokel, as appears to be the case).

Political motivation is the most likely explanation. Someone of the right motivated by the people in our body politic running around with guns at political events and urging people to take "Second Amendment remedies" and reload are most likely.

Of course it could be something else that motivated the gunman. It is not likely.

Will conservatives finally stop flirting with violence? We've had a series of killings now. Cut it out. Speak against the violence-invoking language. Stop making excuses.

I've read she and her staff had just set up a table outside the grocery store to talk to people as they came in and out. Just like the girl and boy scouts do around here, selling cookies and whatnot. Seems like she didn't have any security at all. What I read says the guy came out of the store and walked up and blasted her first then everyone around the table.

That could happen any time around here, we have people with tables set up outside the grocer all the time. What a shame. I'll pray for her when I go to reconciliation this afternoon.

Wake me up when "conservatives" make an assassination movie about the president (like a liberal did about GW) or openly wish for the Vice President's death (like thousands of leftist did as noted on the DU & Kos Web sites).

The people who are trying to score their points do the blog, and the Congresswoman, and whatever cause they might espouse, no good.

Nobody wins in this sort of thing and, if it's correct that about a dozen were shot, it would appear the Congresswoman alone was not the object of the shooter's ire. Until we know about motivations, any speculation may come back to bite several people here - and none of us should forget who - on any side - only cared about making political hay.

Considering a lot of the people shot may not have had anything to do with the Congresswoman, a little restraint out of respect for them seems in order.

Reports are very sketchy and you can be sure the story will change about fifty times before we find out what it was all all about. Or if we ever find out what it is about.

It takes a seriously deranged person to do something like this whether at a politial event, post office, beer distributorship or high school. Idiots of both sides will scramble for some fleeting political advantage instead of having the decency to restrain the rethoric for even a few minutes.

Somefeller said: I will say that people like Florida, and anyone who cheers him/her/it on, are complete trash and worthy of scorn and contempt, whether he/she/it believes what he/she/it is saying or is just being a troll.

Agreed, absolutely. I'll add that I've long thought that Florida was not a serious commenter. Moby-ism is bad enough for the dishonesty, but to use it in a circumstance like this is tremendously beyond the pale.

Prayers for Congresswoman Giffords. Her politics doesn't matter; she does.

Those who are busy finger pointing and blaming this that and the other, usually Left wingers, ought to just sit down and shut up until the full events are sorted out. By spouting off, all you all are doing is whipping up frenzy on the Left that will result in the death of some innocent. May God forgive you all for this.

we're taking notes on the AA regz, is what some of us are doing. Evidence, as they call it up at Althouse's, er, soon-to-be former place of employment ( :] ). And maybe, like just maybe the Feds will be coming to get yr unregistered gats, you sad pedazos de mierda. Best to flush yr HDs as well, and the Nugent posters

"I weep for people who wait for all the facts to come in before rushing to judgment."

Never let a good crisis go to waste. Isn't that the Democrat Party motto?

Wasn't AlphaLiberal (a Democrat Party employee) right out of the gate blaming Sarah Palin for this shooting?

AlphaLiberal: "She was one of the House Democrats in Sarah Palin's 'target' ad, with the crosshairs placed on a map."

Democrats will use this event to paint Sarah Palin as a dangerous kook. It's already begun. Andrew Sullivan has already suggested Palin is responsible for this shooting. The talking points are already being distributed.

Those who are busy finger pointing and blaming this that and the other, usually Left wingers, ought to just sit down and shut up until the full events are sorted out. By spouting off, all you all are doing is whipping up frenzy on the Left that will result in the death of some innocent. May God forgive you all for this.

It's totally normal to speculate on the motives of a killer. After the Oklahoma CIty bombing, it was immediately assumed to be an act of an Islamic Terrorist.

I'm sure that if it was a Republican Congresswoman, like say Bachmann, who was shot at a public appearance, all these people here would still be saying "We can't speculate that it was a lefty......no way will we do that." Yeah...right.

Alpha is going overboard as usual with his bullshit, but it is not "mere speculation" to say that it was most likely a right-winger in this case. It is simply the most-likely scenario. Certainly, it is more than possible that there is no political motivation, or that it was a lefty. But at this point, it is obvious that the right-wing shooter is the most likely culprit. Just as when we hear about a bomb attempt on an airplane, countless commentators on this site will start saying things like "Oh, I'm sure he was a Christian....Can't be a Muslim, right?" "I'm guessing his name is....Mohammed" before we have any details. Is it guaranteed that the bomber was a Muslim terrorist? No, but it is the most likely scenario.

And no, that does not mean all right-wingers are to blame. But we all know that there are way too many nutjobs out there, and continuing to use the violent rhetoric that we've heard from the right over the past few years - ("People are really looking toward those Second Amendment remedies and saying my goodness what can we do to turn this country around? I'll tell you the first thing we need to do is take Harry Reid out." Quoting Jefferson's "Tree of Liberty," "Don't retreat, reload!", the Left are all "traitors," Palin's crosshairs on the map, and countless others)

- is just foolish and irresponsible.

You can say that you think the Left's ideas are horrible and damaging to this country without all the violent bullshit. The only thing the violent bullshit will accomplish is riling up the mentally unstable, whether on the Left or Right.

Wishing and hoping that she, and all the other wounded people still fighting, can somehow make it through all of this alright.

"After the Oklahoma CIty bombing, it was immediately assumed to be an act of an Islamic Terrorist."

Really, woof? I don't remember anything of the sort. But since there really wasn't much of a world wide web at that time, and certainly no blogosphere, we can't go back to verify that. From what I remember, it was a possibility, but most news stories I saw on the news speculated anti-government people, since they chose a federal building which contained a local office the IRS.

In fact, I can't think of any attack on US soil of any kind at any time that was widely assumed to be an act of islamic terrorism. In fact, most "news" agencies bend over backwards to try and deny the possibility until it becomes clear they cannot ignore it any longer (Times Sq, Richard Reid, WTC 1, WTC 2, ILAL counter at LAX, etc)

"Yes, I weep for people who wait for all the facts to come in before rushing to judgment."

It could be someone associated w/ an anti-Jew group.

Lots of those folks (including Muslim terrorists) have done a lot more than Palin's crosshair targeting and reload rhetoric. And, how could Palin's jabber motivate a non-nut? I'd assume that this murderer had a lot more going on than some politician's quips.

Even so, it'd probably be best for politicians to avoid the Palin-type imagery because it's in poor taste, even though it's impossible to imagine that these quips could influence anybody.

No, I take my post, above, back. Upon further reflection I believe the article heading had a picture of a rat (implying conservative talkers were vermin) with a cross-hair over it, (the rat) not the talkers as such themselves.

@J: J, are you like a hipster? Like a fixie riding hipster? Because you appear to be one irony slinging pabst blue ribbon drinking smoking typing ball of cool. do you like live in a big city where people look at you and go...cool? Would you like to move to one if you had the jack?

"And what good, really, is a "most-likely scenario"? How does it get you any closer to the truth? A healthy skepticism keeps one from rushing to embrace a most-likely scenario until the facts are in."

My point is that many of the same people here who are preaching patience and care before we speculate in any way, are the same people who will jump on the speculation bandwagon whenever it's a crime where a Lefty or a Muslim terrorist scumbag is the most likely culprit.

Waiting instead of speculating is usually a good thing. But only doing so when it's your side that potentially is the culprit, while readily speculating away when it's the other side, is a joke. And the same people who do this are now acting superior to those on the Left who are doing the exact same thing the commentators here have done many times in the past concerning crimes that look to be the result of Leftist idiots or Muslim terrorist shits.

The truth is this: Alpha and some others here are being insensitive assholes and are jumping the gun on the speculation. The majority of the people here who are crying about them being insensitive assholes are just as big assholes who have done the exact same things on many comment threads in the past when it wasn't the Right who were the target of the speculation.

If that is indeed the shooter's youtube channel then it is looking like the crazy theory is the most likely.

A list of his favorite books from the site:

Animal Farm, Brave New World, The Wizard Of OZ, Aesop Fables, The Odyssey, Alice Adventures Into Wonderland, Fahrenheit 451, Peter Pan, To Kill A Mockingbird, We The Living, Phantom Toll Booth, One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest, Pulp,Through The Looking Glass, The Communist Manifesto, Siddhartha, The Old Man And The Sea, Gulliver's Travels, Mein Kampf, The Republic, and Meno.

He also had a few manifesto type videos and one of him burning the flag.

I know that some people hate speculating, but I can't help it, I find it facinating, and I'm not trying to score any political points, so here it goes:

Rep. Giffords is a blue dog and called for border control. However, the YouTube channel reports indicate complaints about people who can't speak English (implying, of course, that he was anti-illegals).

Interesting, very interesting.

......

Hmmm, OK, Shep Smith is reading some more of his statements, and they don't sound like they are related to English at all; they are more about literacy and people being "illiterate." Hmmm.

I was thinking vet seemed most likely, based on age, but I would expect they would have found record of it by now. But if he was just crazy, then did he just get lucky with that many shots?

Related question: If you were planning a terror attack, what would stop you from planting a number of crazy things on the net pointing in any and all sorts of directions that you might want people to think? It would be a brilliant way to confuse and distract your targets, and to cause in-fighting and blame.

....

OK, Shep Smith just read some more, about the government controling our minds with grammar. ??? Wow. He also described himself as a "military recruit", but Mr. Smith said that they couldn't get any confirmation of military ties.

Its Loughtner with an 'o'. Some have turned up some of his writings and let me tell you, he ain't no tea-partier, quite the opposite. Called america a "Teroorist Nation". Look for this story to quickly lose media intrest now.

Prayers for Rep Giffords and the other victims.

I think some of you on this board need to apologise so you can re-join the human race.

James said: The majority of the people here who are crying about them being insensitive assholes are just as big assholes who have done the exact same things on many comment threads in the past when it wasn't the Right who were the target of the speculation.

Oh, please, do name specific incidents and names. Otherwise, you're just a liar.