This thread needs to be moved or restarted in MABS, and we need to verify Mr. Popkin's identity (no disrespect intended--standard procedure). If Doug lied about that training, then hoooooo boy we have blood in the water.

I PM'ed Ignatzami about this. I'm thinking it should be moved to MABS when we confirm Howard_Popkin's identity.

With one of Sensei Doug's credentials shown to be a single-day of training, then it always makes you wonder about the other ones.

As for the sparring aspect--let's not get too carried away. If he does light sparring he does light sparring. If he claims that he's deadly and advertises as Ultimate Badass #1, then the fact that his sparring sucks or doesn't exist would be valid fodder. But a lack of good sparring isn't the real meat of the matter here.

The topic was furthered by zen_mind:

Originally Posted by zen_mind

The class is for real and so is the sparring.

This piqued my interest in the sparring aspect. If a student believes that the sparring is 'for real,' then I believe that looking a little further into it is worthwhile, especially for the OP's benefit since he/she is interested in the school and wanted opinions.

I didn't mean to start a war here, I just wanted some info. I am going to check it out myself. I will let you know. How anyone here that hasn't been to this guys class can comment or speculate is beyond me. I take only Zen Minds comments right now until I see it myself. As to the lineage issue, what lineage do the so called Mixed Martial Arts have. A mix of BJJ( not great for fighting more than one person),boxing or whatnot. I think MMA is great to watch and the fighters may train hard and be tough guys, but I am looking for a more complete ART. I will report back. Sten

I didn't mean to start a war here, I just wanted some info. I am going to check it out myself. I will let you know. How anyone here that hasn't been to this guys class can comment or speculate is beyond me. I take only Zen Minds comments right now until I see it myself.

You didn't start a war at all. Coming on to ask questions and gather information is what should be done.

I think the issue that has come up now is that Sensei Doug might be using Howard Popkin's name and lineage to bolster his background. This is important and why we will try to confirm Howard_Popkin's identity and then invite Sensei Doug on here as well.

Originally Posted by sten

As to the lineage issue, what lineage do the so called Mixed Martial Arts have. A mix of BJJ( not great for fighting more than one person),boxing or whatnot. I think MMA is great to watch and the fighters may train hard and be tough guys, but I am looking for a more complete ART. I will report back. Sten

Each of the arts in MMA has lineage. BJJ has a very well publicized lineage; Muay Thai, boxing, wrestling, etc... also have lineages that can be traced. The lineage proves legitimacy in that particular art and helps to reassure the practitioner that they really art training in that art.

Lineage and legitimacy are inherently important in all martial arts. Without it, how do you know if you really are training _________ (BJJ, Muay Thai, Kung Fu, etc...)?

Originally Posted by sten

Just to clarify. Sensei Doug didn't say his JiuJitsu teacher was Howard Popkin, he mentioned him as a point of reference to his style, to the similarities to Aiki Jiu Jitsu.

Originally you had said:

Originally Posted by sten

Melch, I emailed and asked who he trained Sanda with. John Yuan, a 5 time World Wushu Gold medal winner in Brooklyn.Sensei Darel Chase,Sensei John Craig , Sensei Howard Popkin for Jiujitsu and Master P. Lan for Ninjitsu. Sensei R. Bryhan, Weapons. Any of these look familiar?

which, unless I'm reading it wrong, implies that he trained under Howard Popkin. That is even further implied with the inclusion of "Sensei R. Bryhan," whom Sensie Doug lists on his web site as being his Weapons Master:

I just got off the phone with Howard Popkin and confirmed his identity under the account named "Howard Popkin"

He and I had a nice talk and briefly went over what has been mentioned so far.

Mr Popkin mentioned that Doug DeRenzo had come into a class and trained a single time. Doug mentioned that he had trained under another person and was trying to determine the lineage of that system. After the class, Doug said to Mr Popkin that their arts were very similar.

I am the first to say that I am not the most qualified person to make a judgment on the comparison of the two arts but Mr DeRenzo's videos do not appear to be similar at all to what Mr Popkin teaches.

I'll let Mr Popkin go over details so that I don't put word into his mouth.