27 thoughts on “4.08: I’m tired of seeing Lexi. Lucy is an old character too, Julie.”

I think what Stefan says to Damon in the extended promo is the cruelest thing he’s ever said to him. And could ever say to him.

Damon’s about to get his face cracked wrt this sire bond thing. I don’t wish it wasn’t happening because Damon’s nasty and doesn’t know how to treat people, but dang.

How much screen time do you guys think girls night out will get? They’ll be competing with the Salvatores’ trip to New Orleans as well as the Salvatores’ flashbacks, and we know Elena is less important than the Salvatores combined.

Used to come on here often but I haven’t had time for TVD much these last few weeks, just caught up the latest episode and I came to read you guy’s thoughts.

Regarding Stefan. Putting Damon down is about the only thing that’s remained consistent about Stefan since S1. I mean like you said my heart isn’t exactly breaking for Damon because he’s awful to others, but I have to give him credit in that he never puts Stefan down like that, mostly because I think Damon actually believes these things that Stefan says to him. I think he accepts for the most part that he’s awful (well he is! LOL) but he believes that Stefan is somehow “better” and more deserving (which he isn’t).

Stefan has no self awareness it’s ridiculous. If Damon is awful and not deserving, then Stefan can conclude that he’s “good” and “deserving” but all that goes to hell once Elena is no longer interested in pretending that liking/loving Damon is bad, and Stefan sees “his” Elena openly loving on his “awful” brother as if it’s not blasphemous. Notice he says he’s not surprised that Elena has feelings for Damon, but he can’t understand why she doesn’t see how bad he is for her. So for Stefan it’s not a shock that these feelings are there, but he’s shocked that Elena isn’t denying them like she’s been known to, because they’re icky and wrong.

It’s hilarious that after Season 3 Stefan can still sit on a high horse and deem someone “bad.” I laughed out loud when he killed that convicted murderer with no remorse… Yeah because Stefan is sooo much better and has never done anything of the sort. *eye-roll* but whatever. I’m not liking him at all this season, it’s like they’ve chosen to focus on all of Stefan’s awful traits this and it drives me crazy. He’s awful!

Hi! I hope everything’s going well! The semester’s ending, so my time is disappearing. I’m behind on posting the podcasts (but not on recording them), and I haven’t even reviewed last week’s episode Scandal.

That’s true. A friend of mine even wondered why Damon is continuing to bother with Stefan. Yeah, he’s family, but you can leave family. But I think the thing is like you said: Damon believes and accepts every criticism Stefan gives him. I don’t think he’s screamed any variation of “I’m a vampire!” at Stefan since season 1. I remember I got pissed at Damon in season 2 when he was ranting at Jessica because he said “I can’t be what she wants me to be” because he omitted Stefan, who wanted him to change too. But now? I can see why he’d exclude Stefan (maybe subconsciously). Stefan brings nothing but criticism, while Elena’s criticism is pretty meek when she bothers at all. Lol.

Can you imagine Stefan ever saying, “You did it, Damon. You’ve achieved the standards I set for you. You’re finally the person I want you to be.” I can’t! Because Stefan’s standards for Damon aren’t clear. It’s like he’s set the guy up for failure. Especially since he’s so awful himself. What are these standards he has for Damon when he’s letting him get away with things like abusing Andie, with only a mild verbal slap? “She’s human, you know.” Gee, thanks, Stefan.

What makes it worse is that Stefan said last season, said to Elena’s face, that she deserves better than them both, but apparently that’s only okay so long as Elena is choosing him. As soon as she chooses or is okay with her feelings for Damon, then Stefan needs to go tell Damon how awful he is. My God, he’s so ratchet. It’s infuriating (because no one’s calling him out on it and he’s oblivious) and delicious at the same time, lol.

I can’t even tell if Caroline’s regressed. I just know that her propping Stefan up by berating Elena is very annoying, because I’m not here for Stefan like that.

This season is honestly better than season 3. I haven’t hated an episode yet.

Thanks. Hope all is well with you too! Between studying for finals, I have a little time to do fandom things! I haven’t hated an episode either, wish there was more Bonnie (but well you know how that goes). I have been enjoying her NOT being used like a magical plot device, so that’s a start, I like her scenes with Shane, but *fingers crossed* I hope she gets more as the season progresses.

You’re right there isn’t a standard. I don’t think Stefan actually has a standard for Damon at all. Like I said he lacks self awareness much less have any awareness of anyone else, so he’d never be able to see if Damon did make any strides to be better. I think even if Damon were to be less awful (which compared to S1 killing randoms he sort of is) it doesn’t register to Stefan. And mostly I don’t think Damon will bother to change more than he already has anyway, “I don’t want to have to live up to anyone’s expectations” and all that and he’ll just accept the criticism that comes with it.

But either way it’s funny because Stefan can’t judge Damon at all. Stefan is in no place to judge any vampire given his ripper status. Stefan should sit quietly in a corner and hope no one remembers the millions of people he’s murdered in the past, not to mention how awful he was to everyone last season. The fact that he feels so entitled and has the audacity to judge people after that, when no one has uttered a judgmental word to him makes me want to scream. Like are they writing him like this on purpose?

When it comes to Caroline I’m starting to see shades of her S1 self In the last episode. Bossy, immature, meddling, and insensitive. I’m also annoyed that instead of the writers having Caroline so vehemently against Damon and Elena because of Damon’s past treatment of her, they’ve turned her into a cheerleader/mouthpiece for the Stefan/Elena side of the triangle. So instead of making her voice valid concerns about Elena getting with Damon (which there are plenty), they’ve got her telling Elena Damon is awful and Stefan is her epic luv as if Stefan is not also awful. Also look at the dialogue they give her, “You and Stefan Epic” “You and Damon make me want to barf” “Damon is ugh” Nothing that can remotely be taken seriously as valid criticism. And then they have her giggling with Klaus in the same episode while he talks about hummingbirds (LOL). As if Klaus is not singlehandedly responsible for a lot of the trauma and loss in their lives in the recent past. IDK I’m just disappointed that instead of having Caroline address the abuse she suffered at Damon’s hand, they’ve completely trivialized it and instead have her acting like S1 Caroline.

Also look at the dialogue they give her, “You and Stefan Epic” “You and Damon make me want to barf” “Damon is ugh” Nothing that can remotely be taken seriously as valid criticism.

Yes! Like, there are valid criticisms to make there. She has a past with Damon. Why not use that? It’s the Stefan part of her criticizing Elena that makes me ignore her. Also, Bonnie calling Damon a homicidal vampire back in season 1 is much better than Elena (and Caroline in the next ep) calling Shane creepy for no reason at all.

They wrote Bonnie to tell Klaus that he should burn in hell in 3.22. And then these same people write Caroline giggling with him in 4.07. And then these same people have Caroline judging Shane in 4.08? What a laugh!

He previously wrote 3.21, one of the better episodes of season 3, plot-wise. Too bad it had the rest of season 3’s crap working against it, including Abby’s murder so Bonnie came off ooc. I’m interested to see what he’ll do in a season that isn’t as crap.

And witches are his favorites! And he said there are some cool “witchy moments” in this episode! I’ll be watching and judging.

If Alaric were still alive, he’d be my guest, but since he isn’t, I think it’s between Matt and Jeremy. And considering Matt’s guilt thing is over (?) and Jeremy’s the hot thing right now, I’m thinking it’ll be him.

I don´t think it is one of the boys … it wasn´t said that the person is a reg only that we know the person since season 1 so I would say if one of the parents is in the episode either Mrs. Lockwood or Sheriff Forbes. With Klaus probably figuring out what is going on with the hybrids I would say Mrs. Lockwood. Maybe he wants to take revenge and in the end it is all Tyler´s fault (or even Hayleys) because he didn´t follow the plan Stefan/Caroline come up with. Tbh I would prefer Liz Forbes to die because he character is the worst at the moment and we know that Caroline doesn´t care about her parents dying anyways. She went to a dance the day after her dad died.

I think it’s Carol Lockwood that dies because Susan Walters is definitely in this episode. Last week, someone posted pictures that were behind the scenes for O Come, All Ye Faithful that showed Carol and Tyler hugging and talking on a bench in the town square. They’re supposed to have some heavy scenes in this episode, which makes sense if they want to make the impact of her death even heavier.

I think both Carol and Hayley die in this episode because Phoebe Tonkin hasn’t been in Atlanta since the filming of this episode.

I haven’t seen any proof that Marguerite MacIntyre (Liz) is in this episode. I heard she doesn’t appear again until After School Special, which is the first episode after Christmas break.

I was going to reply to Kathrin and ask of she really thought JP was going to bring in one of the adults (and adult women at that) for a story like this, but now you have me taking it seriously.

The question is, what is the point of killing the parents? What has ever been the point? Sheila’s death was the only one that mattered. Even Mason’s death wasn’t necessary, considering how much it didn’t mean to Tyler.

Would they really leave Tyler without family? Who would run the town? Does that house? There’s no way he could keep that house.

If they give Tyler and Carol scenes where they’re actually mother and son in ep 9, then I’ll have my answer.

Thanks for the 3.10 title! Is that the only title available for the second half?

Would they really leave Tyler without family? Who would run the town? Does that house? There’s no way he could keep that house.

Maybe Klaus would become the Major and Tyler´s guardian … he acts like he is his dad already with keeping him grounded (episode 3) and stuff.

I don´t think they are more episode titles available I didn´t even think that 3×10 title was for real I thought Michael only included “After School Special” in a tweet because he finished shooting school scenes and relaxed in the gym, but maybe I missed something.

Thanks for the info, I saw those pics aswell but I didn´t know that Liz probably isn´t in episode 9. I thought she would be in it with this big town event or something.
So that makes it even more obvious that it is probably going to be Carol, especially with that heartfelt scene we are getting.

I think both Carol and Hayley die in this episode because Phoebe Tonkin hasn’t been in Atlanta since the filming of this episode.

I still can´t believe that they are going to kill off Hayley … those writers wanted Phoebe on the show so much and wanted to make her character last and then I thought they would probably reveal something about her being related to Tyler. So I´m still skeptic. But I saw that Phoebe hasn´t been in ATL since shooting for that episode, so it´s possible.
And if both of them get killed it is probably going to be Klaus who will do it. Because I remember JoMos tweet:

“You have no idea just how crazy things are gonna get this season 😉 #TVD #evilisapointofview” – that was Oct. 18th and weren´t they shooting episode 9 at that time?

After this last episode, I’m wondering if they will kill early next week. A large part of me says no. I mean she still kind of has a goal: to make sure Shane doesn’t sacrifice Tyler if something happens to one of the 12. Plus Shane told her “We are the beginning,” so I don’t know if she’s going anywhere yet.

But with Rudy and Caitlin coming after the break, they need to free up some screen time.

In the Australian promo I linked to up top, we have Caroline talking about Elena’s sire bond during girls’ night (of course), and Damon suggesting to Elena that they keep the thing between them a secret. I think it’s in character for him to suggest this, since he knows everyone (hopefully not Bonnie) will stupidly blow their tops (except for Jeremy. His reaction would be fine) once it came out.

Okay, so girls’ night in didn’t gave me a headache. They used Bonnie right in this Delena fiasco.

Bonnie brought herbs to the party!!! Lol! I love her.

Shane being in this episode was a nice surprise. He’s so crey! “We’re the beginning.” He’s totally talking about just him.

Bonnie revealing that Shane’s teaching her Expression was a good one. I was so amused, because I’m so excited!!!

Tyler! Oh Tyler! That moment, his moment, it reminded me of when Bonnie made the storm happen in season 2 after she accessed the witches’ powers. He’s finally found himself! Too bad Caroline had to watch it while chain and bruised. Ugh. And next week, she’ll be getting in his way. Ugh.

Caroline was easier to take in this ep than the last one. Probably because she mentioned Stefan’s name less.

Lexi came off manipulative and evil.

Nandi didn’t die! And she extended her life! Did you guys catch that?! She and Lucy make two witches who survived this show. For that accomplishment, the writers get a side-eye. I love that Val played Damon. She just wanted to test herself and get more power.

My opinion on Expression is the same as my opinion on Dark Magic. Why does it exist if it’s bad news? It’s still a part of Nature. An ugly part because Nature can be ugly and violent. For goodness’ sake, a witch can DIE if she over-exerts herself. That’s not ugly? So don’t Dark Magic and Expression need to be honored? You mean to tell me there isn’t a witch in history and in another culture who’s practiced Dark Magic and Expression like it wasn’t no thang. Because societies throughout history haven’t had the same ideas about what’s right and what’s wrong, especially when you’re talking about the supernatural and energies.

I also don’t get the point of Expression at this point. You kill 12 people or have someone kill 12 people for you. And then what? What happens next? Is it something you can use to solve your issues like with white and dark magic?

I feel like people are missing the point about the sire bond. I was just reading the comments from SE/DE fandoms, it always amazes me how we can all watch the same show and see completely different things. I don’t think finding out that you have to already love the person as human for the sire bond to work is a great victory the DE fandom thinks it is. It affects her actions so if she would have died with Stefan’s blood she would be sired to him right now. She would be really happy with Stefan. So I don’t know how people are saying that it hasn’t effected her or her being with Damon. If you have to ask yourself if she wouldn’t have died with Damon’s blood in her system would they be together right now? That’s a problem. I don’t even care about either of these ships. It is just so
ridiculous. They really couldn’t let DE happen without having an exit strategy.

I can’t believe this show is doing a good job with something. But the way the Shane stuff is unfolding is actually really interesting of coarse this mean they are going to completely mess it up.

Tyler needs to never be around Caroline ever. She hasn’t been good for him since the first half of season 2. They are actually writing for Tyler like they care about him. He is so much better away from Forwood that ship really limited him and you can see it now.

I think this season they have been doing okay by the secondary characters,well Jeremy,Bonnie and Tyler anyway, they seem to be trying with these three. Which is good for me because two out of those three are my favorite character.

Second witch that slowed down her aging. Maybe they keep showing us this for a reason.

it always amazes me how we can all watch the same show and see completely different things.

I experienced this amazement last night while I read people’s opinions on the episode. Especially on Tyler now being Alpha and Bonnie.

I don’t think finding out that you have to already love the person as human for the sire bond to work is a great victory the DE fandom thinks it is.

What’s even worse is that we already knew this! We already knew Elena was developing feelings for Damon. We saw it in season 3! I can’t believe I had to watch Nandi tell the Salvatores something they already know. How are those two surviving from day to day?

This season so far is pretty rewatchable. Like, I can see myself rewatching pretty much all of the episodes that have aired so far (I’d probably fast-forward Elena’s scenes in 4.06 because that hallucination plot was just basic). But yeah, I’m very interested in what’s going on with Shane (and how Bonnie will fit in). And isn’t it amazing that he doesn’t care about Elena so far?! I guess that’s why this sire bond thing is happening. The big arc really has nothing to do with her. Lol.

I agree with everything you said about Tyler. And with Caroline going against him next week For Elena, he really needs to break things off.

Yeah, they’re actually making an attempt with Jeremy and especially Tyler. With Bonnie, I’m just happy they’ve slowed down the amount of spells she’s doing for the Trio, because it means they’ve slowed down making her disappear as soon as the spell is over.

I just hope the point isn’t to have Bonnie do the spell so she can be an indentured servant to Elena and the Salvatores forever. ;_____;.

This season has been better than last season but that’s not saying much. I’m scared about the second half, when was the last time the second half of the season was better than the first half? um never. This is usually around the time the show looses all sense. I fully expect 4×09 to be the last coherent episode of the season.

Expression isn’t something you practice by accident. Like Dark Magic, there has to be intent there. And I doubt Shane’s gonna go, “Channel the energy from these 12 dead lives, Bonnie” and she’ll go “Okay!” Bonnie was fine with channeling dark magic from the EARTH, but I highly doubt she’ll channel magic from 12 dead people or that she’ll even let that happen.

So, I’m wondering if Shane isn’t preparing for two things. One is Bonnie unsealing the thing (it ain’t a cure) that the hunter’s mark leads to (his powers?), and the second is him killing the 12 people so he can practice Expression. Maybe because that’s what he practiced in the past as Silas, or he wants to try his hand at it.

Now why would he be teaching Bonnie Expression if he doesn’t want her to kill 12 people? Well, Bonnie’s afraid and the spirits are messing with her magic. He said he was going to teach her how to use what’s inside her, the potential she had, so that she wouldn’t need the spirits.

I’m just wondering. Because, one doesn’t accidentally use 12 dead people to channel magic. Val had the intent. The storyline’s still ongoing, but I don’t see Bonnie hopping on that train. That’s why I’m wondering about the levels of Shane’s plan.

I’m confused with this sire bond. If you already have to love the person as a human for it to work then why isn’t Damon sired to Katherine?
I’m definately enjoying the storyline with Shane/Bonnie. So far so good. Hopefully they won’t mess it up.

A bunch of people are confused about the side bond. They “explained” it by….giving it a regular explanation. They didn’t explain why Elena/Damon is different from Katherine/Damon and Katherine/Stefan. They were only focused on throwing a “wrench” in DE while at the same time saying it’s legit.