Btw ..if anyone wants to contribute to this history or answer a few questions I would be grateful, I always want the chance to flesh some things out.

In return you get to talk about the old days, and feel cool when you get interview. Well, the last is a stretch perhaps.I am at drlloyd@gmail.com and that is for gTalk as well. Usually I get back to some one with in about half an hour depending ontime zone and all that..

I have an update tomorrow morning, and a second one on Tuesday. But until then I wanted to show off a tool I made. I have built an inverted index of all the posts (except for the insidetheweb ones) ever on the kitten.This lets me do some amusing things,

So for example on this date in 2002.

There were 184 posts in 33 threads by 88 different users. The top poster was Tommo(Ruth) with 16 total.If people like this (and permission of the mods) I could make it fully searchable by date, keywords, topic, or poster.Yeah, I'm a nerd

As much as this is fascinating (and it is truly), it's also a littlebit heart-breaking.Sure there are rumours of Tara's death, along with others. but everyone is discounting them for various well thought out reasons.It just doesn't make any sense.And it doesn't..

Thanks!I don't want to all be that way. This was and is something awesome that I am proud to be part of. I have more happy memories coming up.

Last edited by drlloyd11 on Mon Jul 16, 2012 8:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

There were a lot of spoilers around even then, but their quality was just dreadful.

Quote:

Where The Wild Things Are -A party is held at the Holt house (where Riley stays), its old and so is the caretaker, Mrs. Genevive Holt. She would punish her kids for the "sins" she thought they had resulting in their deaths. The house is haunted and things start to go wrong when the spirits of the dead kids start haunting the partygoers. - At one point Xander kisses a girl named Jana at a party and she runs away screaming. All while Anya is in the other room. - At one point Willow is attacked and Buffy hears her scream yet, she is too in a moment of "passion" with Riley to care. - All of the Initiatives men are unreachable when the house makes them horny. -This episode deals with those two controversial subjects: magic and sexual desire. -This episode features the possible return of the estranged Oz (Seth Green in a reoccurring guest-starring role). He might make an appearance at the end of the episode. -Willow and Tara will kiss in the episode "Where The Wild Things Are".

and the more stupid sounding the spoiler the more people were ready to believe it.

and even correct reports, often missed the sub-text. One of the great things about the early W/T was the subtext and how most reports just missed it.

Quote:

Willow's wicca group turns out to be a bust, as most of them are justwannabes, and one even thinks Willow is weird. One girl, Tara is actuallytrying to be a real witch, and she teams up with Willow.

I wish I could convey how exciting that was, how piece by piece and bit by bit it grew. Howwe were genuinely amazed how far it was going.

Quote:

I remember what a relief it was that Tara was back. After she wasn't in Doomed, I had begun to wonder if she would be back. I wasn't into spoilers then so I didn't know anything until the episode aired. Though I think that was the last episode I remained unspoiled for.-Xita

We would hope for small signs and tiny bits of proof, and we were rewarded. It was a tremendously exciting time, and made a lot of people who were meerly fans of the fanatics..I have interviewed over 20 people for this project to date and every *single* that was aKitte says it a one time experience for them. They never felt that way before or since.

but there were still so many doubters

Quote:

--I don't think Willow will go gay and neither do I think Tara is gay. I justthink that they finally found someone who understands about the magic andtheir powers. At the Wicca group it sounded like Tara got picked on WHOLElot!! So she is grateful to have someone to share with who will notridicule her. Also she sort of talked about her mother in the past tense somaybe she is trying to connect with another witch to fill her loss. Just myopinion.

--Willow's 'sleep-over': Not every 'sleep-over' with women results in lesbianism. You know that and so do I. (And no one is ever neatly dressed after any sleep-over, so it's not sex.) --

and

Quote:

--What if that will spell.had made Tara? -- For those of y'all who have seen the little demo Willow and Tara did just to heighten the now-senseless and asinining rumor about their possible homosexuality, let me deflate your Happy Balloons in the name of sanity. THEY'RE NOT HAVING THE 'OTHER' RELIGIOUS EXPERIENCE!The core of Wicca's beliefs is to be tuned to the universe and nature. To experience the rapture of creation and work with it, not against it--

Quote:

Willow and Oz had and possibly still does a click to one another. You just can't seem to separate one from the other since they seem to be destined to run into each other, if not to spend the rest of the lives together. I honestly don't feel that with Willow and Tara. As friends, they have something.but it's like what Willow and Buffy have. They are sisters, they are friends, and they are comrades, but sex will never be part of the equation.

and my favorite titled

Quote:

Just so we're clear on this, Willow and Tara are not gay!But make no mistake! They're not doing the Bed Bounce and they're not gonna do it! Tara and Willow are just more sensitive to the moods and whims of the universe than normal folks or even Giles and Buffy. Get it straight! Unless they start kissing and lay under the covers with no nightshirt to call their own, it's still only a working relationship and a deep friendship.

.. that you should make sure you have plenty of your favorite condimenton-hand .... because you're going to have to eat all theseobviously well-thought-out words.--BBovenGuy

[url]goo.gl/NNQAF[/url]

Often people would create deliberately fake spoilers just to antagonize various ships. A typical one of this time was that Oz was going to "rescue" Willow from Tara, or that Tara would be a plotter with Adam, or had cursed Willow to fall in love with her. When the episode title "The Yoko Factor" appeared online *everyone* every one claimed that the "Yoko" was Tara. The more stupid sounding the spoiler, the more people would get furious about it and complain online. There was also the by now annual "big scooby death" rumour. [url]goo.gl/I9IIb[/url]

I think that this of the first signs of a shipper is when you begin to practically count air time for your couple, and begin to resent air time "wasted" on plot or action sequences. I remember having mixed feelings about the Faith two parter, thinking it would be Tara-lite. I couldn't imagine that a big faith arc would have much time for our girls, and I wondered why I cared so much for a short term player in a long arc. I found that I would be waiting for any appearance of Tara, and every little bit was like a treasure. It occurs to me now how almost every single line between Tara and Willow is like poetry.like Tara: I am, you know. Willow: What? Tara: Yours. Every interaction between them stayed with me. Tara: You said "recon." You're, like, Cool Monster Fighter. I doubt I can remember verbatim five setences from that episode that did nothave a W/T in..but I can quote every one that did.

Based on this criteria I assumed "this years girl" and "who are you" would be very light in this department, but it was actually fantastic .Tara: You said "recon." You're, like, Cool Monster Fighter. When Faith spotted the attraction between the two it was treated as the first "scientific proof" that we were not imaging it.

" Welcome to the first (and only, at the moment) Willow/Tara relationship site."

and I remember this post

Quote:

>My Willow Tara site is up...>>http://go.to/WillowTara

I love it!!!! The title is great. Reminds me of a post I read a while backthat challenged that wewould never see Willow & Tara forever sites, as opposed to Willow & Ozforever sites. YEAH! Great work so far. The little cartoon link at thebottom is the most adorable thing I have ever seen.-Xita

After this there followed the longest mid season episode drought the show ever would have, where we were left hanging and waiting for the rumoured episode where Oz would return. I remember that time as agonizing, because so much was waiting to be resolved. I never had butterflys in my stomach over a TV show before or since, but I was on pins and needles.The writers began to speak a out a bit ..This was an interview in Universe of Doug Pertie

Quote:

Willow and Tara are going to have a good, happy, satisfyingrelationship," Petrie says. "That's something that we're more acutelyaware of and we definitely don't want to touch on 'being a lesbian isbad.' We've all seen shows where if you have any kind of gay tendencies,you must be killed or made to suffer for no other reason other thanyou're gay. We're hyper aware of that, so we're more predisposed to havethings work out for Willow and Tara. In fact, if Tara were a guy, Iwould predict a near 100 per cent chance of a breakup for Willow. Thefact that Tara is not a guy may make things work out better, because wecan avoid what we feel is this old cliché."

and the famous Joss quote

Quote:

Joss Whedon at the BronzeJanuary 29, 2000Well, we meant it to be SUBTEXT, but you guys have obviously worked it out. Yes, Willow is becoming a Monkey-owner. I just hope we don't get a lot of protest from Christian Right Groups over this.

Marginally more seriously, Willow and Tara's relationship is definitely romantic. ..... I just know there's a sweet story there, that would become very complicated if Oz were to show up again. Which he will.

the first mention of this promised new episode was in march[url]http://goo.gl/rp7tR[/ur]

Quote:

WHERE THE HEART IS -Episode 19 -Airs in May -Written by Marti Noxon -Riley's moment of truth comes when Oz is captured by the Intiative and is given an ultimatum: torture Oz or be court-marshalled. -Willow and Tara finally kiss in this episode. (XG Note: I'm not entirely sure how the network will censor it. I know in the past there have been f/f kisses in "Ally Mcbeal" and "Party of Five". Joss says he doesn't want to do it that way, so it may be just sweet and innocent, instead of hot and passionate.) -This episode will answer all of the questions concerning the Willow/Tara relationship. -Oz is in this episode, in which he must come to terms with Willow, her new life, and the broken remains of their relationship. --------------------------------------------------------------------------

'Buffy' Character Follows Her BlissBUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER. Tonight at 8, WB.Something really significant happens at the end of tonight's "Buffy theVampire Slayer" on the WB at 8. We don't see it, because the sceneplunges into darkness and ends at that precise moment - but thedialogue leading up to that moment makes the episode alandmark "Buffy."

It's a landmark in TV history, period.

What happens is the shift from subtext to text of a very long-running,compelling and credible character development involving AlysonHannigan's Willow.

I have placed below a link to the rough drafts of each section I am working on for the history.--these are just the drafts.I am still posting them to the Kitten, but I have placed them here to I can have the proof read orallow people approve their own chats. If you want to take part in one of those PM me and I will add you to the list.https://sites.google.com/site/pxw1history/I have locked most of the pages that are not already on the board, but I will release them on request or when I post themThere will NEVER be material open to the public on this site that is not already on the Kitten.This is for WIP , my need to organize and to let people get an idea of upcoming content going only.

The old yahoo group willtara that this group split off from has been over run with spam and porn for almost 8 years since the last mod vanished.Today I convinced Yahoo to make me to mod, so I can clean it up.I just hated seeing the old place covered with graffiti.

As I continue to pull this huge ass history together, some times I amuse myself with statistics like this.This is number of posts per day on the board over the lifetime I am able to rebuild, minus "anonymous" and blank topic posts.

Wow, this is fricking AWESOME!...I'm one of those later in life kittens. I did'nt watch my first episode of Buffy until several years after it last aired (2008). The first one I saw was Touched, which featured "she who shall remain nameless" and only watched it because I thought Faith was hot!!

I was hooked instantly and decided to buy season 7. After watching the final season, I became curious as to how it all began. So, I bought the whole series. By the time I got to the I in team, I was madly in love with Amber/Tara.

I wish I would have discovered this wonderful Love story (and brutal heartbreak) while it was happening. But, this is a wonderful way to experience the emotions after the fact.

Thank you.

_________________The kitten formerly known as SMGOVAN ~Official Head of Security for the Finey_McFine fan club. Ass whippings will be handed out liberally!

I'm not quite as 'old' as some of the old timers. But I think I landed at the kitten sometimes around 2001. I think I was just going by 'Ginner' then, but then there was that great big crash and I lost my original username (and my posts damn it! I was a Big Pineapple!).

I can't quite put into words how much fun this was to read through; how truly commendable the effort that has been put into the gathering of the history is. For that, drlloyd, I thank you. It's been a long time since I've frequented The Kitten, even longer since I've been a regular poster, but the importance of this place is not something that will ever fade with time. The Kitten was my refuge. I started watching Buffy in it's fifth season, my very first episode was "Buffy vs Dracula", and I immediately fell in love with Willow and Tara, of course. Largely because of what I was dealing with in my own life at the time (newly realised teen lesbian, woo! ) . And when I found this place, it was like hitting the freaking jackpot. There were so many kind people here, no one was ever mean or pointlessly nasty (actually, I did encounter someone antagonizing me once, but Xita promptly banned them from the board).

I remember talking to people over at the yahoo group chat, well into the early hours - something I probably never would have done had Xita herself not messaged me and told me to get my butt in there (though I'm sure she worded it far more eloquently). I was painfully shy, still am to a certain extent, but The Kitten was a place I grew to feel comfortable - and I don't think I could ever explain just what that meant to me. Still means to me, really.

It was the reason I wrote my first fanfic, and while I'd happily set flames to them all now just to ensure they never see the light of day again , it set me on a path that has given me so much joy... as I've said, there aren't words. I still write fic, albeit for different fandoms now, but had it not been for The Kitten, I don't know that the idea to do that would have ever entered my head.

I remember a silly 'war' that was waged between Wiccie and I to see who could stalk DrG the most efficiently.

I remember that morning that Amber was on Channel 4's Big Breakfast - I remember it because I'd been awake all night talking to my girlfriend (who I met through the yahoo group) and had ended up in the yahoo chat room to talk to anyone else who was awake while it was on. I remember Amber making a joke about a painting that had been done of her and brought onto the show, about how big her chest looked in it!

I remember when those awful, awful spoilers were leaked. And I spent weeks (at least it felt like weeks) wishing that they weren't true. I think I pretty much cried for two weeks solid, emotionally vulnerable teenager that I was. I too was one of those people that uttered the phrase "It feels like a real, flesh and blood person that I KNEW has died". I remembered when the episode aired, and I spent the last 60 seconds holding my breath and thinking "It hasn't happened yet! Maybe they cut the scene! Maybe it was a fake spoiler!". But it wasn't. I remember the bitter cold that followed.

But The Kitten still stands! A place of warmth and friendliness. I don't think I could be happier about that.

I couldn't tell you dates of when any of this stuff took place, but the memories that were made here are imprinted onto my brain. The Kitten will always be a place of fond memories to me. I mean, I still have my Kitten logo t-shirt. That kind of love never dies.

I'm not quite as 'old' as some of the old timers. But I think I landed at the kitten sometimes around 2001. I think I was just going by 'Ginner' then, but then there was that great big crash and I lost my original username (and my posts damn it! I was a Big Pineapple!). --~Jen (whose long and rambly post is over now.)

Thank you so much, it means the world to me. I want to publish the rest of it after I finish the board cleanup. I just want her to look like new.

Last edited by drlloyd11 on Sun Jul 15, 2012 7:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Wow. What a trip down memory lane. I rarely stop by, but I'm sure glad I did! It's nice to see the old guard, even though it makes me feel very old. With out the ole kitten I never would have met my wife, fell into my career or have great memories of drinking chats.

Xita: not everything that happens in Vegas stays in Vegas. Up for another trip??

Buffy fans have wondered whether Whedon is cursed for an especially egregious act of cruelty against one of the show’s characters in its sixth season. Tara Maclay, Willow’s gentle Wiccan love interest played by Amber Benson, had recurred for three seasons before Whedon added Benson to the show’s main cast credits. And at the end of that very same episode she was suddenly and unexpectedly shot and killed. No character, main cast or not, was safe in the “Whedonverse,” as the world of his creations has come to be known. “I realised, just the other day, that I have this terrible reputation for killing people not just because I killed Tara, but because I was such a dick about it,” he laughs. “[Adding her to the credits] was just mean. Tara may be dead, but she haunts me still, because now all anybody ever talks about is the fact I kill characters off, and I think, ‘I do other things as well!’”

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