For anyone who hasn't yet had the opportunity to look at Merchant Ivory's
website, I've just found that it includes several 'pages' on the film:
synopsis, cast, news and reviews, events. and a short interview with Madhur
Jaffrey and her daughter, Sakina, headed "Raging against the Raj". In this,
it is mentioned that the Jaffreys had 'nursed this script through development
for six years', that the film examines 'the effects of India's independence
upon its Anglo-Indian community, which inherited a legacy of placelessness
from the Raj'. Madhur Jaffrey is quoted as saying: "This was a time I
remember from my childhood, and I saw what happened to the Anglo-Indians.
...That frustration of who we are, that frustration of identity, is what
makes Cotton Mary go mad".
A number of different reviews are given,(New York papers, American magazines
and radio critiques) two of which in particular suggest a more kindly
intention for the film than has been read into it by some who have seen it.
Here are a couple, for the benefit of those who either haven't yet seen the
film, or who have been outraged by it.
1) "This riveting drama of a half-mad Anglo-Indian woman and the shattered
memsahib whose life she tries to take over is a triumph for director Ismail
Merchant. Set in India after the Raj, it's both a psychological horror story
and an unsparing portrait of the way colonialism corrupts everyone it
touches, the ruler and the ruled. The very fine Madhur Jaffrey, Greta
Scacchi and James Wilby grace the film with what may well be their best
performances ever." (Karen Durbin, Mirabella).
2) "Ismail Merchant's heart-rending portrait of Anglo-Indian snobbery and
reverse snobbery brought to luminous life by the magnificent performances of
Madur Jaffrey and Greta Scacchi as two mutually dependent victims of the
lingering curse of colonialism." (Andrew Sarris, The New York Observer).
The website also mentions that the London premiere of "Cotton Mary", on
Friday 17th December 1999, was used as a charity event to raise funds for the
Orissa Flood Appeal (which raised £50,000 on that night).
This has helped clarify my thinking, at any rate - it would seem that the
intention behind the film was to put "colonialism" in the dock: a political
system in which everone became victims in one way or another, but very
unhappily, in the case of India, where the Anglo-Indians came off worst,
being stuck in the middle. This experience can be seen repeated in almost
all other colonies and ex-colonies, not only the British-ruled ones, where
those of mixed race were the ones most made to feel excluded from society.
Pauline

Here are 3 names:
Mary Anne CAWDEARY - died 26 January, 1924
Daniel BOYD - died 7 March, 1924
William John BATHURST - died 20 March, 1924
I can copy the information if any of these names are of interest.
Pat Bostock.

Could anyone tell us any info on the Anglo American Club probably
inBombay?Whether or not it's still in existance or not? I was told
that my grandfather was a member.It would be somewhere between the
1930' and 1950's would think.I do have a photo of him standing outside
the club but don't know when it was taken.Would anyone know if it is
still there whether or not it is possible to find out a club members
list?
This is a long shot as my grandparents were separated in the 1930's
when my grandmother came to England with their children and my
grandfather continued to live in Bombay where he was a publisher of
various magazines.My grandmother and their children travelled back on
the Viceroy of India .
I would be very grateful for any poss info.
Thanks Linda and Tony Knight
-----Original Message-----
From: python(a)mail.ebbs.com.au <python(a)mail.ebbs.com.au>
To: INDIA-L(a)rootsweb.com <INDIA-L(a)rootsweb.com>
Date: 31 May 2000 05:19
Subject: Relatives
>Dear Listers,
>
>Has anyone in their researches in Calcutta, Bengal Presidency of
India encountered
>any of the following surnames between 1800-1840.............
>
>BOWMAN
>ARTHUR
>COCKELL
>
>Cheers
>
>Mel in Melbourne
>
>
>
>Melvyn D Grieveson
>
>Download NeoPlanet at http://www.neoplanet.com
>
>
>==== INDIA Mailing List ====
>For answers to basic questions about finding birth,
>death and marriage information in British India, see
>Cathy Day's website at http://www.ozemail.com.au/~clday/
>
>

Hi All!
My maternal grandmother's name was Ena. Married name Kitt. She died
around 1938. Would anyone be able to help me with her maiden name so
that I can find that part of my family? She was an Anglo-Indian.
Thank you.

Hello Listers
Am new to the list and have read some of the archives with interest. Am
researching on behalf of my father (80) who has after all these years taken
interest in his family. He was born 1920 in Ambala and was christened in the
church there. His father was Lieutenant Charles Bone MM P/54196 2nd
Battalion Royal Fusiliers . I do not know when he went to India as the file
held at Hayes does not give overseas service whilst he served as an officer.
It was obviously after World War One but he had served in the East Indies
from 3.10.1906 to 12.12.1912 and did some time on the North West Frontier.
The family lived at 84 Bank Road. This is on the back of an old photo but my
father says it could have been Dagshai where he also lived. Does anyone know
if Bank Road is Ambala or Dagshai?
I presume all the records in the church were destroyed in 1965. Where would
I find a birth certificate ? He has a baptismal certificate.
He left India in late1921. He believes it was in the SS Princess or the SS
Rawal Pindi. Does anyone have any knowledge of either of these two ships and
whether they were P & O or British Steam Navigation Company? In fact we know
that the Princess was A troop ship in Oct/Nov 1921
A final question for the time being ..Does anyone have any idea of the
significance of a diagonal black cross worn on the upper right arm of an
army uniform somewhen during World War One?
Hope somone can help.
Cheers Sue Tulloch Adelaide smtulloch(a)hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

Hi Brinds.
Cant find a "Edward St" in the area you suggest in my current A-Z of London
but there are 3 other possibles:-
Edward Mews at the rear The Albany, near Regents Park.
Edward Square just off the Caledonian Rd.
Edward Mews at the back of Wigmore St.
Its a long shot but may help...Others may have access to much older
directories though.
Cheers
Peter Rogers,
Subj: Off-subject. Ordnance Survey Map.
Is there anyone out there who has an Ordnance Survey map of the London
area - Civil township of Pancras and Parliamentary Borough of
Marylebone in particular, c. 1870 ? If so, could they please tell me
the location of Edward Street.

Subject: Re: Off-subject. Ordnance Survey Map.
Sent: 5/31/0 10:19 AM
To: Daphne, brinds(a)xtra.co.nz
Hello Daphne,
Have you come across John Snow's 1859 map of London on line? It is
excellent.
http://www.ph.ucla.edu/epi/snow/1859map/map1859.html
Having found that, you will find Edward Street in Part B, Row G-I, Column
13-15
It is north of Euston Road & west of Hampstead Road in the top left corner
of the map. It has completely disappeared from the modern OS,probably
under
widened streets. I was in that area in February, crossing the road was a
nightmare.
Hope this helps.
Pat.
I should have sent this to the list. Sorry if you received it twice.

Dear Listers,
Has anyone in their researches in Calcutta, Bengal Presidency of India encountered
any of the following surnames between 1800-1840.............
BOWMAN
ARTHUR
COCKELL
Cheers
Mel in Melbourne
Melvyn D Grieveson
Download NeoPlanet at http://www.neoplanet.com

I am seeking information on Samuel FAIRMAN please. He lived in Secunderabad, India and was a pensioner around 1850-53. Is there anyone with details of pensioners of that period who would be willing to have a look for any details recorded?
Perhaps a look in the cemetary records for Secunderabad may give us a clue as to whether he died and was buried there.
Peter Jeffrey Fairman Conquest
In beautiful rural England
Researching FAIRMAN, PEACOCK, WEIDLE and BRAMBLEBY

Dear All,
Is there anyone out there who has an Ordnance Survey map of the London
area - Civil township of Pancras and Parliamentary Borough of
Marylebone in particular, c. 1870 ? If so, could they please tell me
the location of Edward Street.
With many thanks in anticipation,
brinds

Shaun
Sorry I cannot help you on this query. The Madras Sappers & Miners were
obviously an elite lot of Engineers as there name comes up over and over
again.
I was reading the 'Indian Army and the Kings Enemies' the other day to do
with the defence of Burma after the Japanese invasion - suddenly there on
the Sittang River defence in 17th Indian Division appeared the name 'Madras
Sappers & Miners'
I have posted this reply to the full list as somebody else in India may
have access to material on this unit.
William
On Sunday, 28 May, 2000 21:22, Shaun Stanley Patrick O'Malley
[SMTP:ShaunOMalley@xtra.co.nz] wrote:
> G/day William,
>
> I read your reply to Sharon, which included a comment on the Madras
> Sappers & Miners. I have been looking for some time for the first of the
> O'Malleys to go to India. He was an engineer and worked at Dowlaishvaram
> on the Godavari river, getting married there sometime between 1847 and
> 1857, but I have not found him as yet.
>
> The records show that Dowlaishvaram was the HQ for the Madras Engineers,
> plus the Sappers and Miners. There was major irrigation work, dams and
> canals built in the area between 1847 and 1857.
>
> I wonder if you know of any books or other records that may have been
> produced on the Madras Engineers, Sappers & Miners, or on the Godavari
> river project and who the authors were.

Hello Ali,
It is so interesting to hear from you, I would be very grateful for your
families side of the story. I am far too young to have been in British
India, but in my childhood I heard so many stories from the older generation
of my family who had been there, that I became very interested. I wanted as
a young lad to go out and see India.
In 1979 I had the opportunity to travel out overland through Iran and
Afghanistan to Pakistan. I spent several months exploring the old North
West Frontier Battlefields, around Quetta, the Bolan Pass, the Tirah, in the
Kyber area and up through Malakand and Dir into Chitral. I was very
surprised at how friendly a reception I got from all who I encountered.
After all it must have been pretty terrible for the families in the valleys
after a British column had gone through blowing up the houses etc.
I found that peoples memories were still vivid, whereas once I got out into
the plains around Attock and into the Punjab, the battlefields of the Sikh
Wars were unknown to even people living right on them. I suppose it was
just to long ago.
Later while working in Dubai I had large gangs working under me who came
from Nowshera and the Malakand, as well as Dera, also Afridii's. I had many
very interesting discussions in the men over the years, which have led me to
believe that it was an awful pity that the story wasn't also being told from
the local perspective, before it passes beyond memory. Especially as both
the British and the Tribesmen seem to have come to have quite a respect for
each other.
My own families fighting involvement in India was at a much earlier date in
the 1812 to 1827 period against the Marathas, and in the 1840 to 1875
period, much further down the Indian Peninsula. Later generations took
Indian troops to France in WW1.
Regards
Nick Balmer.
----- Original Message -----
From: Comsats <salem(a)comsats.net.pk>
To: nickbalmer <nickbalmer(a)ukonline.co.uk>
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2000 8:59 AM
Subject: Re: Black Mountain Expedition of 1888 Hazara.
> Hi,
> My uncle's father was the Khan of the State of Agror, a lovely valley
> about an hourand a half from Abbotabad. They claim that the officers
were
> killed by a rival group who wanted to spoil their relations with the
> British. I have been to Agror several times andf have even climbed part
> way up the Black Mountain. My uncle's family was made Court of Ward and
> he was born in the fort at Kangra. Will beglad to get more info from
them.
> The current Khan ofAgror(Oghi)is my first cousin's son.
> Ali Akbar
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: nickbalmer <nickbalmer(a)ukonline.co.uk>
> To: <INDIA-L(a)rootsweb.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2000 11:51 AM
> Subject: Re: Black Mountain Expedition of 1888 Hazara.
>
>
> >Hello,
> >
> >I believe that Hazara falls into an are called the Black Mountain by the
> >British. In 1888 an attack was made on the 5th Ghurkhas and two British
> >Officers and four Ghurkhas were killed. This success encouraged the
tribes
> >to rise.
> >
> >A punitive expedition was raised with five British and ten Indian
> >Battalions. Three columns advanced up the eastern side of the mountain.
A
> >fourth which did all the fighting made its way up the western side.
> >
> >Attacking the crest, covered by artillery and a Gatling gun, the Royal
> Irish
> >Regiment supported by two Indian Battalions, attacked sangars. They were
> >attacked by swams of tulwar wielding tribesmen in rushes, but managed to
> >avoid being overwhelmed.
> >
> >This set back forced the tribesmen to submit. The columns stayed in the
> >valley for a month, burning villages and demolishing towers. The
tribesmen
> >fought back by sniping and small attackers. Eventually fines of 14,000
> >rupees were collected. 222 miles of roads were built at a cost of 86
> >casualties and 25 killed.
> >
> >( A précis of information in Michael Barthorp's book "The North-West
> >Frontier, British India and Afghanistan, A Pictorial History 1839-1947.)
> >
> >Colonel Caldwell in his book Small Wars says shortly afterwards: -
> >
> > "In many Indian frontier campaigns, the Black Mountain operations in
1888
> >for instance, several columns have entered the hostile territory and have
> >exercised a great moral effect upon the enemy."
> >
> >I don't suppose the Hazara tribesmen saw it like that. Are any of their
> >descendants able to give their side of the story?
> >
> >Lord Roberts was less happy about the political outcome, speaking of 1888
> he
> >says: -
> >
> > "Two minor expeditions took place this year: one against the Thibetans
> >(sic) in retaliation for their having invaded the territory of our ally,
> the
> >Raja of Sikim; the other to punish the Black Mountain tribes for the
murder
> >of two British officers. Both were a success from a military point of
view,
> >but in the Black l2ountain the determina tion of the Punjab Government
to
> >limit the sphere of action of the troops, and to hurry out of the
country,
> >prevented our reaping any political advantage. We lost a grand
opportunity
> >for gaining control over this lawless and troublesome district; no survey
> >was made, no roads opened out, the tribesmen were not made to feel our
> >power, and, Cosequently, very soon another costly expedition had to be
> >undertaken."
> >
> >The above all sounds rather familiar.
> >
> >I hope that this little helps, I cannot provide any information on the
role
> >of the Suffolks unfortunately.
> >
> >Regards
> >
> >Nick Balmer
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: De Burgh, Mary <mary.de.burgh(a)intel.com>
> >To: <INDIA-L(a)rootsweb.com>
> >Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2000 2:26 AM
> >Subject: Suffolk Regiment
> >
> >
> >> Hi all,
> >> could any one out there help with any info on the suffolk reg., and in
> >> particular the battle of HAZARA in 1888, I am researching de Burgh,
Twiss
> >> and Persse families in India in the last century, any help would be
> great.
> >> thanks
> >> mary.
> >>
> >>
> >> ==== INDIA Mailing List ====
> >> Need an India-related book? Visit Cathy's bookstore at:
> >> http://www.ozemail.com.au/~clday/bookstore.htm
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >==== INDIA Mailing List ====
> >For answers to basic questions about finding birth,
> >death and marriage information in British India, see
> >Cathy Day's website at http://www.ozemail.com.au/~clday/
> >
>
>

I am researching the WHEELER, COLLETT, KHULMEY, WARDLEY, DUNNE and DUNCAN families in India, all of which I am related to.
I am also looking for any information on BERYL CHAMPION. Brothers were BASIL and BRIAN CHAMPION. Sisters were SHEILA and ANGELA CHAMPION. Mother was nursing in Calcutta 1940.
Any information on the above families would be a great help.
Regards
Valmay Young
valmay(a)clara.co.uk

Hi All
Some weeks back I advertised the publication of research on the HEIC's
College at Addiscombe.
Because of problems that have since arisen between the original researcher
and FIBIS, FIBIS is immediately withdrawing the offer of publication. In
addition, neither FIBIS as an organisation nor I as an individual will share
any of the material on the various individuals who attended the College
contained in that particular piece of research.
However, the publication is available on the shelves at Croydon and Bromley
Libaries in South London. A good deal of the correspondence from the
original contrubutors to the current manuscript (copyright with the authors
of the letters) is also in Croydon Library and open for inspection and use
by researchers thus enabling individuals to compile their own information
about Addiscombe Cadets.
And, of course, there is good old Vibart so people can undertake their own
research and compile information for themselves, which I most certainly will
do if any Addiscombe Cadets come up in my research.
Regards
Tony Fuller

Cliff, Joy, Fred and others interested in a copy of "Raj":
I called my local PBS (Public Broadcasting Station) regarding the program.
For those of you outside the US, PBS is a non-profit broadcasting system
funded primarily through private donations with a little Federal funding
added on. That is the network that usually carries BBC productions and
other higher quality programing, with no commercials. I was told that
outside the UK Canada would get first chance at purchasing it, most likely
TV Ontario. Therefore it would be shown in Ontario Province only. Second,
it would be offered to BBC cable in America approximately six months after
showing in the UK. Unfortunately, Time Warner has the vast majority of
cable tv in the US and they view BBC cable as a competitor so will not be
too likely to want to purchase the program. Third, the CBC would get the
opportunity to purchase the program six months after showing in the UK.
Fourth, and last, BBC would offer it to PBS to purchase about 1 year after
broadcasting in the UK. A lot of wrangling for one tv program!
Fred, I thank you for your kind offer but I think I will try Cliff first as
he is literally just across Lake Ontario from me. I have some sailing
friends who may be able to stop at Brighton and pick it up. Cliff, is that
ok with you? Joy, when I get the video I will send you a copy. We can work
the details out once we know the whole thing is a go. Hopefully this will
put to rest discussion of the "Raj" and we can get back to geneaology.
Jill, thank you for your excellent synopsis. It has served to whet my
appetite to see the show!
Regards, Deirdre in Rochester, NY USA

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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Dear List members,
I subscribed on May 20 and sent the following message right afterwards
but my subscription had not registered or whatever at the time so Ian
advised me to send it over again now that my subscription is effective.
By the way, I've been reading your messages and you seem like a very
cooperative group. Glad to have joined you.
Best regards to all,
Susan Jenkins
--------------CA6DC92AF10A7C2CEE3E6825
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Message-ID: <39260CD6.3E29303F(a)ix.netcom.com>
Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 21:56:06 -0600
From: Susan Jenkins <smjesq(a)ix.netcom.com>
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I)
X-Accept-Language: en
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: INDIA-L(a)rootsweb.com
Subject: Search for an ancestor named Torpey
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear fellow genealogists,
I have just come across the Family History in India web site, which led
me to you. The clue to the site came through a Surname Helper search
under the surname "Torpey." Anecdotal family history has long claimed
that an male ancestor in our Irish Torpey line was killed while serving
in the British army, sometime in the 19th century (no firmer date than
that). The interesting (and grisly element to the family legend is that
he was allegedly killed by a crocodile or alligator and that his widow
and children used his pension money (or whatever money might be paid to
an army widow) to emigrate to the United States. The "Surname Helper"
info indicated the existence of military records, through the Family
History in India site, for someone named Torpey who received some kind
of medal during service related to the Indian Mutiny during the period
1857 - 1859. These dates correspond closely to the dates my Torpey
relatives seem to have started showing up in Philadelphia.
Does anyone have any information or suggestions?
Thanks in advance.
Susan Jenkins
--------------CA6DC92AF10A7C2CEE3E6825--

There are two errors in my synopsis of the programmme which I'd like to
correct.
1.Trevelyan rode with the Mir, not the Mayor of Hunza.
2. Iris Butler (paragraph 2) appears incorrectly as Iris Baker in
subsequent paragraphs.
Apologies for my carelessness.
Jill

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