Wednesday, July 20, 2005

An Open Letter To Mordecai Tendler

I have no idea whether you are guilty or innocent of the many charges against you.

I do assume innocence,although the latest developments with the RCA causes me to pause.

I do not have a horse in this race.I do not have a kugel in this oven.I do not have a black hat on this head.

So for starters you need to know I hope you are innocent.

I did not say I hope you are" found "innocent,because the only thing you can be" found" is guilty.You know what the score is.Either you are guilty or innocent,there is no gray area.I do know what this fight with the RCA represents,and that makes me a nogaih b'dovor,because whatever the outcome of this matter, all streams of Orthodox Jewry will be affected.

Trying to avoid the well known cliche,I have come up with my own.

WHERE THERE IS CHOLENT,THERE IS HEARTBURN!

The above is a general rule that I learned throughout my own trials and tribulations that life offers. I sense that there is something here that does not quite meet the proverbial eye.You have waited way too long to come out swinging.These rumors have been swirling around for years.

Why pick a fight with an adversary that you can not beat? You can NOT beat them!They will destroy whatever is left of your reputation.I am not saying you should not be defending yourself,but this Israeli bais din gimmick sounds and feels like camouflage and subterfuge.

I know Rabbi Shmuel Fried extremely well.He is the toain or attorney for the RCA.A few things you must know about this guy.HE IS THE SMARTEST AND SHREWDEST TOAIN ALIVE TODAY.We speak often on business issues,especially when it comes to real estate.He is unbeatable when his client is right,and never takes a case unless he is sure they are.

HE WOULD NOT HAVE TAKEN ON THIS INTERCONTINENTAL BATTLE UNLESS HE IS ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN THAT HE CAN WIN!

I know of your Toain Mittleman,he is out of his league.

Mordecai Tendler,

You are getting very bad advice.Your ego will destroy you and your family.

This is my advice to you.

Give it up!

Have your respective representatives meet in private.

Let both sides come up with a pareve statement that is ambiguous.Fried is a big mentsch,he will encourage a respectable settlement.

Mordecai,You are in way over your head.Your father and all your uncles will not be able to help you.Fried will absolutely crush you!

SETTLE,SETTLE,SETTLE!

You are still the rabbi of your shul,if you proceed with this nonsense you will lose your job.You will join Moshe Londinski in no man's land.

I hope you don't one day have to look at this blog,wishing that you should have listened to this anonymous blogger.

The problem is people do not listen to free advice,so send a check in my name to your local Tomchei Shabbos.

GIVE IT UP!

SAVE YOUR FAMILY FROM MORE GRIEF!SETTLE BEFORE YOUR LIFE WILL BECOME UNBEARABLE.

37 Comments:

In the same breath that you say you have no negius, you brag that SF consults with you no less than on a "regular basis" and that SF is "unbeatable".

Bemechilas kevodchem, that is a paradox in itself. As a preliminary matter, how good could SF be if he consults with a shana Upiraish on a regular basis.

Secondly, those of us who are Orthodox Jews and Gedolai Hador, know that one of the fundamentals to any Din Torah, is the issue of nemanus, believabilty.

Just because the RCA chose to disseminate slanderous information by means of the orthodox hating rag, the jewish week, does not mean that the information contained in that organ has any credibilty or reliability whatsoever.

I hope that the advice you give your clients or SF is of better quailty. Hanogaya Linyanainu, "ASYA BMAGAN MAGAN SHAVYA"

GH,aka one naive Jew,SF does not get his info from the Jewish Week.Calling names is just a sure sign that you do not have a clue how a man of the stature as SF gathers his info.The Jewish Week is NOT the issue and neither is how Fried gets his info.The issue is clearly, that fighting Fried is like just asking for a whupping,which he is sure to get.Mark my words,MT better settle this issue before Fried takes off his gloves.You heard it hear first.

This isn't the real Godol Hador. You can tell because when you click on the name, instead of bringing you to GH's profile, it brings you directly to GH's website. We have been banning this guy and deleting his comments. He just keeps finding new blogs to comment on.

Tendler, has a solid name here in Monsey. I believe that few people ( who have any sense), want to start up with Tendler. Perhaps he should have been a little more careful when sitting with these women. Maybe leave the door a little bit open so no one can have any ridiculous isead. Who is testifying against him? A black cleaning lady? Some women with emotional problems? And as I understand it, the whole issue with Yeshiva University is that he went against the ruling of the Rav. His sin was possibly that he was trying to help some women who are Agunot. The whole law of Agunot smeels to high heaven about the unequality of the sexes. As soon as one rabbi finds a way out of a situation that will make it easier for an Agunoh ten other idiot rabbis will jump on the bandwagon yelling , NO, looking for Chumros. Meanwhile the man runs off to marry his paramour. Nice religion the idiot rabbis have made. And God looks down at this and probably laughs.

9 women came forward to the RCA and others with related testimony. There are others still that were too afraid to come forward. There is one married woman who was paid by RMT about $100,000 who can't speak to the RCA (or anyone) due to a confidentiality agreement. There were taped messages/phone conversations that rabbonim in the area (among others) heard (which was the reason for the payoff).

>And as I understand it, the >whole issue with Yeshiva >University is that he went >against the ruling of the Rav. >His sin was possibly that he was >trying to help some women who >are Agunot.

You understand wrong. RMT threw these agunot as cannon fodder against his enemies, using them as a basis for what was happening to him. Not the RCA nor the Awareness Center made any public issue of RMT's agunot. Everyone tried to deal with that issue quietly in order to protect these agunot. It was RMT and his supporters who made the agunot issue public, basically destroying their lives.

>The whole law of >Agunot smeels to high heaven >about the unequality of the >sexes. As soon as one rabbi >finds a way out of a situation >that will make it easier for an >Agunoh ten other idiot rabbis >will jump on the bandwagon >yelling , NO, looking for >Chumros.

Is it chesed to tell an agunah she is free and years later for her to discover that rabbonim consider her still married to her previous husband? That she may have to leave her current husband? That her children may be mamzerim? That the person who "helped" her now uses her situation publicly for his own protection, drawing the attention of some of the top poskim in the world who now publicly have said what she most fears?

>Meanwhile the man runs off to>marry his paramour. Nice >religion the idiot rabbis have >made. And God looks down at>this and probably laughs.

No one is laughing. All of this has come about because we do not protect our daughters and sisters like we should. That allows predators like RMT and others to prey on them.

JWB,The best we can do is urge him to do what is right for him and his family.I am utterly surprised that his father is not meeting with Fried right now.It is NOT a sign of weakness to settle this issue without further damage.The possibility exists that MT is no longer rational,that is why his family should step in.

>Un-Orthodox Jew said... >JWB,>The best we can do is urge him >to do what is right for him and >his family.

What do you think was going on all of 2004?

>I am utterly surprised that his >father is not meeting with Fried >right now.

Why?

>It is NOT a sign of weakness to >settle this issue without >further damage.>The possibility exists that MT >is no longer rational,that is >why his family should step in.

Who in his family? His brother Aron in California?

I don't think you grasp the totallity of the situation.

Both Mordechai and his brother Aron in Hollwood have demonstrated they are not fit to be rabbinical leaders or community leaders. They have preyed on the vulnerable far too long.

We are susposed to protect the victims of sexual predators not the sexual predators and their prominant families. Too many Rabbonim, community leaders and members of the Jewish press have forgotten that simple truth.

I don't get you. You give many good reasons for thinking he is not innocent and then say maybe he is. There are two points-first-let him waive his rights from the confidentiality statement (I think JW suggested this). If someone spread lies about me, I would do my utmost to discredit them. But instead he settled. I also did not know black people can't be trusted (apparently they may be intimidated and then trusted though). Second-if he were a priest, all his defenders would be making fun of him and the Church.

Both Mordechai and his brother Aron in Hollwood have demonstrated they are not fit to be rabbinical leaders or community leaders. They have preyed on the vulnerable far too long.

What is it with this guy whistleblower. Is he normal. Where does he come off dragging MT's brother Aron into this. Now he is asserting that there is something wrong with Aron also? I know Aron quite well. What kind of jealous schmuck is this whistleblower. Next he is gonna say there is something wrong with me also. Godamn moron.

Rabbi Aron Tendler is under a joint RCC/RCA investigation regarding serious allegations involving former students. This was posted about months ago:

Protocols:Tuesday, November 16, 2004 The RCA (Rabbinical Council of America) and the RCC (Rabbinical Council of California) are investigating allegations that Aron Tendler (rabbi of Sharay Tsedek in North Holywood, California, and a teacher at the Yeshiva of Los Angeles High School) sexually molested teenage girls. Some of the women coming forward to press these allegations are now in their 30s. This Aron Tendler is the brother of rabbi Mordecai Tendler. He is not the rabbi Aaron Tendler of Baltimore.

JWB,You do make some interesting points.NO RABBI SHOULD BE IN A POSITION THAT WOULD ENABLE HIM TO HARM PEOPLE.He has kids, a wife,respected father,respected uncles and cousins etc.They too must be going through hell.

He must be held accountable for his behavior,I firmly believe that.

My advice to him is to settle this matter in private and without protracted litigation.

He must deal with the people that he may have hurt.(I am neutral,I only state as facts the issues I have first hand information on.)

My bigger point is he should get this behind him and move on without causing any MORE damage to himself and his family.

From what I am reading ( The Jewish Voice) I am getting the impression that this Rabbi Freid is not so brilliant and that Rabbi Mittelman, is more then up to the challange. Of course I could be wrong. Reading articles in a magazine is hardly the best way to get all the facts

As to Susan Rosenbluth and her Jewish Voice and Opinion. View some correspondence.

http://lukeford.net/archives/updates/050708.htm

JWB responds:

He claims there is a seperation but without the identies of the editorial board, how do we know that?

I would note when the Jewish Press "editorial" board ran an editorial against a series by Stephanie Saul in Newsday on sexual abuse in the Jewish community, one of the rabbis featured in that series ran several ads for his real estate brokerage company in the same issue.

I informed Maoz and Rosenbluth of Yeedle's background over a week ago. I gave them Israeli newsarticles and names of the reporters involved. Yet these "news" people make no inquiries? Nice.

What other "journalistic" publication is told that their publication is promoting an alleged child molester and refuses to look into the allegations?

The Jewish Voice and Opinion and The Jewish Press are in a league of their own.

Susan replied:

As I told "jewish whistleblower," I do not correspond with anonymous blogs.

I also know nothing about anyone named "Yeedle Werdyger." "jewish whistleblower" made all sorts of allegations and backed them up with a news report that did not offer any names. When I pointed that out to the anonymous blog, the blogger said something about the fact that, in Israel, authorities had forbidden the names to be released. In other words, I should just take the word of an anonymous blog. Forget about it.

"Alleged" means nothing to me. "Convicted" does.

As for the other pieces you have included, I do not keep up with Ukrainian politics and I know nothing about Dr. Michael A. Rosin.

Jewish Whistleblower writes:

An arrest record of this sort would disallow Yeedle from many professions (law enforcement, anything in government involving a security clearance and teaching in the public system for example) where it does "mean something". But then Rosenbluth has the same attitude that got the Catholic Church where it is today.

I would note that in addition to the consistent false information concerning the role of Rabbi Blau in the RCA investigation that appears in Jewish Press and Jewish Voice and Opinion articles/editorials, there has been a consistent lack of factual balance. Both claim the same "facts": that the RCA process was not halachically or legally valid.

And on what basis is this claim?

Nothing, they've pulled this fact out of the air.

I've actually done the research that they haven't and determined that the RCA followed the clear halachic and legal precedent set by the chief rabbanut in England.

But then when has this stopped Rosenbluth or the shadowy Jewish Press from making halachic determinations and factual claims in areas where it is painfully clear they have no expertise.

My "communications" with Susan Rosenbluth reveal her to be totally ignorant as to the issue of sexual abuse. She has done zero research into other survivors organizations and has no idea how other religions deal with their sexual predators. Instead of taking an open view to the issue, she relies on her "halachic advisors" such as Rabbi Moshe Tendler. She makes bold statements that this is halachic/this isn't halachic as if she and her advisors have a monopoly on Jewish Law. She believes that unless you have a criminal conviction you should not be prevented from holding positions of trust or working with the vulnerable. Her crazy ideas found wide acceptence in the past in such organizations as the Catholic Church. Which is the reason for the current scandal. Her attitude towards the propblem of sexual abuse and exploitation is the same dangerous attitude that has protected errant clergy in the past.

I pointed her to http://www.bishop-accountability.org/ as an example of how religious survivor abuse groups deal with their sexual predators. I noted that of the thousands of priests listed, only a few dozen have been convicted. I also noted that a good portion of the priests listed are dead. It went right over her head.

She simply does not hear what she doesn't want to.

Remember, Susan L. Rosenbluth of the Jewish Voice and Opinion, killed her story on Rabbi Baruch Lanner's abuses in 1989. Her direct silence allowed more children to be victimized. She has proven that her integrity can be bought for the price of a few mere ads. She too was and is a part of the problem.

>Remember, Susan L. Rosenbluth of >the Jewish Voice and Opinion, >killed her story on Rabbi Baruch >Lanner's abuses in 1989. Her >direct silence allowed more >children to be victimized. She >has proven that her integrity >can be bought for the price of a >few mere ads. She too was and is >a part of the problem.

The price of a child's dignity and safety to Rosenbluth? Her advertising money.

After interviewing a half-dozen teenage boys in 1989 who said they had been physically abused by a local rabbi, weekly newspaper editor Susan Rosenbluth said she contacted members of the Rabbinical Council of Bergen County, expecting that the Orthodox organization would intervene.

But instead of showing concern about the alleged misdeeds of Rabbi Baruch Lanner, Rosenbluth claimed, three of the council members tried to protect him.

"One called me and said, 'If this gets into print, we will see to it that no stores under the Rabbinical Council of Bergen County can advertise in your newspaper,' " Rosenbluth charged in an interview.

"It was made clear to me by the rabbis who spoke to me that this was an RCBC decision," she said, declining to name the rabbis. "I said, 'You're kidding me. Is this real?' "

A spokesman for the Rabbinical Council of Bergen County vehemently rejected Rosenbluth's charges Tuesday. "We categorically deny that the Rabbinical Council of Bergen County made such threats to Ms. Rosenbluth. We simply do not operate in this fashion," said Rabbi Shmuel Goldin, a council member and rabbi of the Congregation Ahavath Torah in Englewood.

Over the last month, some of Lanner's former students have accused leaders of the 1,000-synagogue Orthodox Union, the largest Orthodox organization in the nation, of ignoring allegations that he had fondled and kissed a number of teenage girls and had kneed boys in the groin in the 1970s and 1980s. The Orthodox Union, where Lanner was an officer of its educational youth arm, has empaneled a tribunal to investigate the charges.

Rosenbluth's claims, however, represent the first accusations that local religious leaders engaged in an active cover-up.

Goldin declined to comment Tuesday on whether council members had spoken directly with Rosenbluth about Lanner. Rosenbluth ultimately did not publish any article about the accusations against Lanner in 1989.

"There were discussions at the time with various people concerning one specific allegation, and the matter was referred in responsible fashion to the Bet Din," Goldin said, referring to a Yeshiva University investigative tribunal that heard a dispute involving Lanner in 1989.

Meanwhile, Jewish leaders from throughout the state met behind closed doors in Springfield on Tuesday night to express their concern.

More than 10 people have accused Lanner in published reports of inappropriate behavior, including alleged incidents of fondling, making sexual remarks to teenage girls, and kneeing some boys. Most of the allegations involve Lanner's tenure as an officer of the National Council of Synagogue Youth, a respected Orthodox Union educational group.

In addition, prosecutors in Monmouth County are investigating a new complaint that Lanner behaved inappropriately with a female student when he was principal at the Hillel School in Ocean Township. Prosecutors in Bergen County have said they will review the allegations against Lanner with an eye toward a possible criminal investigation. Lanner also taught at The Frisch School in Paramus, and one former student there has told The Record that the rabbi improperly rubbed up against her on several occasions.

Lanner, who is currently living in Fair Lawn but is not working as a rabbi, has denied mistreating the teenagers, although he said he may have made inappropriate jokes when he was much younger.

"I've made plenty of errors and poor judgment in my early years, when I was in my 20s," Lanner, who is now 50, said in an interview last week. "In my younger years, I must have permitted some errors of judgment, and I must have somehow hurt people. But I never hurt anybody intentionally. And I did not fondle anyone, even before I was a rabbi."

Rosenbluth began writing and publishing The Jewish Voice and Opinion, a small weekly newspaper, in 1986 in the Englewood home she shares with her husband, Richard, who is the chief of oncology at Hackensack University Medical Center. She called herself a watchdog who occasionally clashed on issues with some members of the Bergen County Rabbinical Council.

But in 1989, she said, the issue went beyond ideological differences.

"Kids were being hurt," said Rosenbluth, 53. "There was inappropriate stuff going on, and it should have been stopped by the rabbis in charge."

"It was clear that they were not going to allow this story to come out. I think they shortchanged their congregations, and I think they shortchanged our children."

In addition to offering educational programs, the Rabbinical Council -- on which all of the county's Orthodox pulpit rabbis sit -- is responsible for certifying products in Bergen County as kosher.

Because Rosenbluth's 15,000-circulation newspaper receives roughly 90 percent of its operating revenue from advertising by Bergen County firms selling kosher products, Rosenbluth said she took the alleged threat seriously.

Rosenbluth said she believed the council could have killed her paper by cutting off its principal source of revenue. So she opted not to write the article she was preparing, which she said had been based on interviews with six teenage boys who told her they had been kneed in the groin.

She said she feels guilty about that.

"If there have been children hurt in the past 11 years, you can bring them to my doorstep, because I didn't print what I should have," Rosenbluth said.

Rosenbluth said she was also threatened with a loss of business by two high-ranking officers of the Orthodox Union. She declined to identify the two rabbis.

Mandell I. Ganchrow, president of the Orthodox Union, declined Tuesday to comment on Rosenbluth's accusations.

"All matters and allegations that are being brought to our attention will be referred to the NCSY special commission for full review," he said. "I urge all those who have information that has bearing on these issues to contact the commission as soon as possible."

Rabbi Jerome Epstein, executive vice president of the United Synagogue of Conservative Judaism, a New York-based international association of 850 synagogues in North America, has written that a society that silently tolerated Lanner's alleged misconduct is responsible for the current crisis. His comments were published in The New York Jewish Week, which first reported the allegations last month.

But if religious leaders actually engaged in a cover-up, as Rosenbluth claims, it would be "unconscionable," he said in an interview.

"Society cannot permit this type of behavior to go unchecked. And that doesn't mean every allegation is true. But it certainly deserves careful checking," he said.

Rabbi Bernhard Rosenberg, an Orthodox rabbi from Edison and a former officer of the National Council of Synagogue Youth, said he has recently received more than 30 calls from young people with some type of complaint against Lanner.

Rosenberg said he is concerned that there may have been a concerted effort by religious leaders to paper over the Lanner problem.

"It seems as if there was knowledge of his actions -- and that's what I'm concerned [about] -- he should have been stopped and should not have worked with teenagers."

Goldin, who served on the Rabbinical Council in 1989, insisted the Lanner issue was of great concern to the Orthodox community.

"It goes without saying that we are deeply saddened and pained by the whole series of events surrounding the allegations raised against Rabbi Lanner," Goldin said. "In retrospect, it seems clear that national and local Jewish leadership must learn to be more vigilant and responsive. We can all certainly learn from our mistakes."

anyone in trouble should contact fried,not mittelman.fried has connections in law enforcement,the FBI,the D.A. etc...he is not a guy to mess around with.how do i know?I went up against him,did 2 years in jail(he got me out after 6 months.he killed me then he helped me.you don't want to cross this guy.he's an animal.

If Tendler & Mittelman take on Fried,they are crazy.I used Fried on various big and small issues,he's a killer.Tendler should crawl on his hands to fried and get out of this.Fried will chew him up and spit him out if he molested women.He is one wild and crazy guy.Watch out Tendler,you aint seen nothing yet.If I were you I would be kissing Frieds ass in Macys window to get out of this.

Un-Orthodox -- you're letting a cancer take over your website. Personally I don't appreciate your self-righteous style, but you're just another yenta. When you allow the Jewish whistle guy into your website you are a yenta with a snake in the house.

Look, for example, how he turns the discussion from Tendler to Lanner, with a nice three card Monte deal, and all off a sudden he makes a connection between a proven case of child abuse and a totally unproven case of she said he said. That's his method. Get into bed with him and you won't believe the fleas yo'll find on yourself in the morning.

Remember, he is best friends with a crazy woman who claimed on national television that her father raped her five times and made her eat the five babies. She told Oprah, on camera, that half the Jews of Chicago are Satan worshippers. Now wtch a connection -- every single thing this blower puts on, she puts on, in her couple of websites and her email list.

You say you don't have a horse in this race? Maybe. But you sure got a lot of horseshit.

1) There's only one Usajewish journalist that I know that constantly uses references to horse/monkey feces in everything he writes.

2)>Look, for example, how he turns >the discussion from Tendler to >Lanner, with a nice three card >Monte deal, and all off a sudden >he makes a connection between a >proven case of child abuse and a >totally unproven case of she >said he said.

A few years ago, Lanner's case was "unproven".

3)>Remember, he is best friends with a crazy woman ...

>the discussion from Tendler to >Lanner, with a nice three card >Monte deal, and all off a sudden >he makes a connection between a >proven case of child abuse and a >totally unproven case of she >said he said.

The unnamed journalist appears to use the tactic he claims I use.

I have never met or spoken to Vicki.

Before I had any dealings with her, I did a background check. I'm aware of her background, history and more. Simply:a. any allegations she is crazy are false.b. the Oprah allegations are being misrepresented and taken completely out of context.c. although I could get into specifics of the smear campaign against her and those involved, it is not yet the time. I'm not going to allow the people involved to take the real focus off Rabbi Mordechai Tendler, Rabbi Marc/Mordechai Gafni/Winiarz/Winyarz. and Rabbi Hershy Worchd. She has been a very useful resource for victims and has acted very professionally.e. Contrary to anonymous post by the above journalist AKA Yossel AKA Shalom Salem AKA Tehillimzuger and his friend Olga, Vicki has not been charged or investigated for any fraud. All such allegations she is a thief are without merit.

http://lukeford.net/archives/updates/050708.htm

in particular:_____________________________Shalom Salem @ 5:20PM | 2004-10-15| >>Who and what money prey tell? Both Luke and Vicki are predators of the weak and unsuspecting, asking for a handout here, a gift there. Vicki is in court now for credit card fraud. Ford is facing a suit following the publication of his book (not all those interviews actually took place). There's nothing more dangerous than the professionally self-righteous, and these two are a match made in hell. He accuses, she follows up, he confirms, she emails -- one hand confirms the other. But the fate of scoundrels is usually to end up in jail -- and these two are just not big enough to beat back their pursuers. ____________________________

I would also note, that before I launched my internet campaigns to get out the word concerning the sexual predators in our community, I spent several years working within the system to try to deal with these predators. Our leadership had the opportunity to deal with these things quietly, they chose not to. Our system unfortunately is broke.

WANT TO KNOW WHY THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF UNQUALIFIED GUYS WASTING THEIR TIME IN YESHIVA, RAPING THEIR PARENTS AND IN-LAWS? WHO IS THAT STILL BLASTS COLLEGE - EVEN PATHETIC TOURO "COLLEGE"?

"In public life here in Brooklyn, there is false testimony. We have merited, through blood and sweat and with the Almighty's help, to establish large Yeshivos for the boys and Bais Yaakova for the girls. And these schools produced students of whom all can be proud. But then someone comes and says that they are still incomplete. When the boys go out of the Yeshiva, they are still not finished -- they still need more studies: they still have to go to "Touro College" to be well rounded. That is the biggest false testimony against the Torah. The boys do not need such "completeness". One is not allowed to be friends with them! One is not allowed to be partners with them! What will be with our children? From where will our great Torah leaders come? From Touro College they will not come! And mothers of Gedolei Torah will also not come from Touro College, because the Gemorah says that to merit children who will become Gedolei Yisroel, one has to have modesty. And modesty cannot be acquired in Touro College!" –R’ ELYA SVEI

If he has such issues, he has no business being a rabbi. JWB Blows-Any man who ever is alleged to have slept with a prostitute could get away with it-because if the prostitute says he slept with her-she has no credibility.

Sorry, but to say that SF only takes cases when he knows they are right is, well, wrong. I can't convince you of how wrong he is, but I know he took the wrong side of a case (because they had money and Chashivus on their side as well) and his approach in court was dishonest, perverse (not sexually, but in the worse way - intellectually), and distorted. Just the fact that he is representing someone is, to me, enough to question the side he is taking.

JWG,I certainly do not know every single case Fried takes,nor can I possibly know what he feels is the right side of a case when there is conflicting evidence.

In this case,which is of international importance for batei din in general,and an entire rabbinical organization vs. an important rabbinical family,knowing Fried the way I do,he NEVER would have taken this case unless he was absolutely certain he would prevail.

SF may be very shrewd, sharp, and aggressive, but a) you said "He is unbeatable when his client is right, and never takes a case unless he is sure they are" which I is what I took up with you in the first place.

And b) as you are “impartial” when it comes to R. Tendler, I am “impartial” when it comes to SF, and I only know about one case (and his practices and approach there specifically) and what I read in the papers of his quotes and practices when it comes to being the Toain for the RCA. I should preface this with the idea that in Beis Din, there really is no concept of a Toain. A Toain is basically someone who is familiar with how Batei Dinim are supposed to operate – specifically the Chazakas, umdinos, and other tools that the Dayanim use to determine the facts of the case. The problem with having a Toain is that these tools are to be used by the Dayanim to determine the facts – not used by the people bringing the case before the Dayanim (or their helpers/advisors the Toainim). Once the Toain uses these tools they loose all efficacy, they become mere technicalities to be twisted into perversions of justice. If we were talking about a purely Halachic ruling, such as with Kashrus where it is purely a Halachic phenomenon, then technicalities are warranted. But when it comes to finding Justice, or getting to the truth of the situation, then technicalities become impediments and are destructive.

For example, there is a rule that if a witness implicates himself partially we can believe the rest of his testimony. When a witness comes and does so, the Dayanim will take this principle into account and give credence to the testimony. This principle comes about from Chazal’s understanding of Human nature, psychology and experience from the Batei Dinim in their times (which would apply to all times). Comes along a Toain who knows about this principle, so he advises his client to throw in something incriminating into his testimony so the Dayanim will believe him. This has nothing to do with Human nature, psychology or the witnesses veracity – it has only to do with a Toain using a principle (out of context and undermining the entire process of Chakira V’Drisha the Dayanim are supposed to use).

From my impartial reading of the reports, the case I know in particular, and the idea of a Toain in general, I can say that SF is not after the truth, not involved with pursuing Justice for his clients, and merely involved in his own pursuit of his career – successful as it may be.

And I apologize if I seem to be coming out against SF in particular so strongly - my umbrage is mostly due to my understanding of the Toain in todays Bais Din. Though my reading of how he operates does not help in dissuading me . . .

JWG,The bais din system evolved more into a secular advocate system over the years.

Due to many differences of the nature of the dayan itself.The dayan of yesterday,being a dayan or rosh bais din was his only job.

That is almost non existent today.Dayanim are rosh yeshivas,kashrus administrators..etc.

The reason that makes a difference in our conversation is because the dayanim are NOT well equipped to scrutinize various details and information processing that they should.They rely on the Toain to provide this to them.

I never said Fried was a tzaddik.He is an advocate,and he feels his job is to advocate his client's position within the confines of halacha.He also hates to lose.

Combining all the human elements involved when dealing with money,power,reputation etc.,there of course is going to be stretching of the truth to say the least.I do not vouch for anyone,what I am saying is the Bais Din structure is and was imperfect,and that includes all the human beings involved as well.

this fried dude is the biggest piece of drek that ever laid eyes on Choshen Mishpet. I sat against him once, and I mopped the floor with him. he is nothing more that a pile of hot air, and the littlest prick puts him in his place. You just need to deal with him with the same manner as he does.Having said all this, I still feel that how appropo that the son of the so called rabbi whose opinion on mettzizah pepah is so well known... has TWO children that are prominent rabbis and caught with the pants down... getting metzizah.....