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Elliot Coleman I would say is the one person most responsible for the market gardening movement in the U.S. This was the only book I had when I started growing Actually this is 30th anniversary edition this new edition just came out this year it's got a lot of. Color photographs and some updating I still say this is the place to start to learn about market gardening. You know others have come along and kind of stood on his shoulders and maybe gone further but he gives a lot of good information on basic techniques you know how to hold your colinear when how to use the wheel hoe and some of these tools and just a very good introduction to market gardening so I highly recommend the new organic grower. The market gardener so some years ago I think maybe 2008 Johm or Tom for T.H.C. or for those of us who don't speak French we just say J M 40 A from Quebec came out with this book we are blessed in that my son Jonathan who's hiding in the corner back there. Has developed some tools that have really revolutionized market gardening we believe the Lord bless and give him the credit but we were able to go see Jay M's farm before this book came out and I was blown away by his farm and. He gave me a 1st came out in French he gave me a copy of it in French and man I was really motivated to learn French at that point I was figuring out OK well what does that mean. Anyway fortunately it came out in English a year or 2 later but this so I say Elliot Coleman started the market gardening movement J.M. $48.00 turned from a movement into a revolution I would say in this book has encouraged thousands of young people to leave careers in the city and move to the country and start market gardening it's it's a really well it's a very very complete manual of how to run a market garden. And the thing that I think really. Really got people excited was that he's making 150000 on an acre and a half and he document how he does that and you know you look at the prices he's getting he's up in Quebec and we get those kind of prices at our farmers market so it's like Wow Well if he's doing it up there then we should be able to do it in Tennessee or in Oregon or wherever so anyway this is just another highly recommended book. The winter harvest handbook also by Elliot Coleman Elliott is the authority on winter growing this is an excellent book it's the only book that I'm aware of that really goes into winter growing. Eliot Coleman is in Maine zone 5 he's on the coast of Maine. Again if he can do it in Maine you can do it in Oregon he's growing an unheated hoop houses so we're talking low tech The one thing I love about Elliot Coleman is he's trying to he's very minimalistic if we can get rid of it you know if we don't need the bells and whistles let's get rid of them let's come down to what is actually essential and so this is highly recommended. The urban farmer Curtis Stone how many of you have heard of Curtis Stone I know a lot of people have heard of Curtis Stone because he's on You Tube He's got hundreds of videos on You Tube He's in Colona British Columbia that's north of here and he actually he's not doing market gardening anymore. He is I'm not sure what he's doing except making videos and videoing other people doing market gardening but he's got a young family and for I don't know all his reasons but he's no longer actively market gardening but he wrote the urban farmer book Growing food for profit and least in broad land. Got some excellent tips in there and for those of you who don't have a farm yet or land you know again he he used neighbor's yards back yards he was when when he quit he was making. Over $100000.00 on a 3rd of an acre and I just want to. Stop and emphasize something here I'm going to be throwing around these numbers and I want to make it clear that you're not going to make that when you start out. Dhoni So don't say oh wow I can I can make a $100000.00 in my backyard you know these are people who have have sharpened their skills and who really know what they're doing and I also want to say most of them are not Christian and so they have a different outlook on life and again you know I hope that our number one goal is not making money I hope that our goal is outreach and service and so on and so. I throw the numbers out just because I'm trying to get rid of the myth that you can't earn a living in a market garden you know there's still this idea and it seems to be especially strong in ads and does and well yeah that's nice but you know I got to pay the bills well these people are are doing it now and again we're talking about roasts We'll talk about that more later on but. You know it's fair to say net is usually around 50 percent of gross in market gardening so that's important to keep in mind too OK we got to keep going because there's a lot of resources here lean farm this book came out a few years ago in this was really revolutionary in that BEN HARTMAN took lean manufacturing techniques that Toyota popularized. You know becoming the most profitable auto maker in the world I think he's taken these techniques and principles and applied them to the market garden and as I say in the resource thing this is not going to tell you how to be a market gardener how to grow plants but it will tell you how to be a smarter market gardener gives a lot of principles and and methods for. Being more efficient you know just a simple example the spaghetti diagram you know you you you map out your movement on the farm for harvesting OK so I go over here in the tool shed and get my knife and then I go down over here and harvest and then I come back here and wash it and then I've got to bring it here and so you just map your route and it usually ends up looking a lot like a pile of spaghetti so you're trying to you're trying to straighten those lines out what if I keep my knives at the hoop house where I harvest so I can go straight there then I come straight back and I wash dry put it in the cooler and then it goes into the van to go to market you know you just straightened out all those lines so anyway all kinds of good information about increasing efficiency and then a couple of years later he came out with a lean farm Guide to Growing vegetables because people were saying well this is a great theory but how do you make it work in your garden so this is kind of he's showing you how he uses it on his farm. Again he's he's farming under an acre. Doing it largely by himself and making a comfortable living BEN HARTMAN the lean farm Guide to Growing vegetables sustainable market farming this is one that I consider more reference work I've never read through beginning to end but has a lot of good information and has it broken down by different crops so if you're if you're wanting to learn more about bras because that you're trying to you're trying to improve your Brusca production you can look at it and just a good reference manual for the small farm. Sustainable market farming market farming success I don't actually have here. But I think we've all these books we have downstairs at the at Agra table we want to encourage you to to buy them here in support at Agra rather than Amazon. Anyway market farming success is just a good introduction to market farming friends family friendly farming if you have a family and you're wanting to figure out how to make it work for your family and hopefully encouraging them to someday take over the farm excellent book I can say that. It changed the course of our farm when we read it. We realized that our children were not. Picturing a future for themselves on the farm. And so we made some pretty big changes on our farm you know we're not trying to make them all into market gardeners but we just want them to know that the farm is there for them if they want to if they feel called to that and so it's just an excellent book on on family farming managing cover crops profitably there's a number of different issues here and you Mefford the editor is kind enough to send these 2 S. Obviously he would like you to become a subscriber I would encourage it you know it's like $33.00 Well I'm one that loves to read and learn from others and so growing for market is the main magazine for. Market gardeners so I highly recommend it councils on agriculture I don't even have that up here that's a compilation I did some years ago from Mrs White tried to come up with everything she had to say about agriculture I highly recommend it just because I think it's really important for us to stay grounded you know why are we doing this. And so just reading her councils on an agriculture you know did you know she was a market farmer I mean she had a farm in elms haven a commercial farm she she was an incredible gardener you read stories of her going out. By moonlight to plant because the rain was coming and c One had to beat the rain it's really amazing to read read her love for market gardening now we come to internet resources which keeps getting longer and longer as I said beginning I'm having a hard time keeping this up to date because you know when I started out the problem was there wasn't enough information now we almost have the other problem that there's so much information you don't know what to believe and what to digest. The big thing in the last year or 2 is all these farmers who've kind of made a name for themselves have come up with these online courses. But they I highly recommend them you know I say the best way to learn market gardening is to go work with somebody who's doing it but if you can't do that the next best thing is to get one of these courses where you're going to see a lot of videos of what they're doing and how they're doing it successfully the one that I actually shelled the money out to purchase was the never sink farms course the 1st one on the list there Conor Crick more as far as I know he's the highest grossing market farmer in the country he said the last 3 years it's average between 360 and 390000 dollars on less than an acre and a half. And that's where the out a tractor. That's without a walking tractor that's with hand tools only so now he's in New York he he's got good markets so that explains some of it but he's super efficient super you know he's the one that doesn't leave beds empty for more than a few hours. So that's what you those are what is being done. But again you know he's got ideal markets he's going year round Well he does take 2 days off a week so that's 5 days a week 8 hour days they quit at $430.00 every day so again to me what that says is you know I don't need to make that kind of money. But I could I could make a lot less and have a lot more time for ministry for at Agra for whatever and so I'm not trying to learn I'm not trying to follow his philosophy on life but I do want to learn from his efficiencies and plug it into our understanding of the world's And and why we're here kind of thing does that make sense. So Connor has a course Curtis Stone has a chorus J.M. has a course I've seen samples of all of them and I think they're all good one thing I will say about Conor Crick more though is that he's the only one that I'm aware of that uses the Albrecht system of soil balancing. And that's what you're going to hear from Whitmore McConnell I think that what you're going to hear from Michael trivia from BOB GREGORY they believe William Albrecht was a true soil scientist and came up with true science on how to balance the soil and again Connor Crick more is the only one that I know of using that BEN HARTMAN has a course now if if you know lettuce is one of the most profitable crops on a small farm because it's so fast and everybody eats it. Ray Tyler friend of ours from Tennessee has become quite well known and being able to grow lettuce year round he's got a course now on growing lettuce you know it's a lot easier to grow lettuce up here in the northwest through the summer but it's a challenge for us in the southeast to grow lettuce in the heat of the summer. And he's doing it so anyway a lot of good online courses there's podcasts. You know great way while you're out working in the garden to listen to interviews with farmers and you know you just glean all these little temps I've learned so much between growing for market and podcasts. I've learned an amazing amount just little things you know that can make a big difference in the long run videos you know You Tube has become huge and Curtis Stone has literally hundreds of hours of videos on every aspect of market gardening Conor Crick Mort has more and more on you too you know these guys are businessmen you know they know how to to make money on these things and they will lure you in. Richard Perkins is is in Sweden and if you look at a map and see the latitude of Sweden it's Whaley up there and he's has a profitable bark garden and Sweden. Business in record keeping a lot of good tools there if you're doing a C.S.A. it can be very overwhelming all the record keeping of a C.S.A. you know so and so's calling up saying I'm not going to be here next week could you save my box and bring it to market the week after and if you don't have an efficient way to deal with all that it can be get very overwhelming very quickly so there's record keeping I think my wife will talk about something we're not real familiar with yet but we're going to try this year Harvey it's called it's from small farm Central which is on your list there tools and supplies we've got to go to talk about farmers friend L.L.C. He wants to be your friend that's my son's business. Tools and supplies farmers friend that their main tool that they came out with was the Greens Harvester the quick greens Harvester but they actually sell the most of Caterpillar tunnels it's a low cost greenhouse kind of thing that if you buy 2 of them they'll ship free to Oregon lot of good lot of good resources here. Seed catalogs you know there's hundreds of seed companies. The one thing I would recommend is making sure that the seed company you support has signed the safe seed pledge that they don't knowingly use genetically modified seeds you know that's a whole different discussion but there's a lot of companies that have signed the safe seed pledge including all these I clued some year Northwest Maine one that I'm aware of is territorial seeds but I put a couple others specifically for you Northwesterners here adaptive seeds and while garden seeds are any of you familiar with those OK they while garden seeds Frank Morton is is a very talented plant breeder and he's come up with. All kinds of wild and crazy lettuces and calles and. So anyway those are good good resources for you I I did a little searching online for local Amendment supply houses Robert you probably where do you get your stuff from. That's the name of the company concentrate OK So write that down if your local hair concentrate for all your constant traits concentrates OK yeah so some of these would be a long ways of here from this part of the country and on the last thing I would just say on soil fertility huge subject deep subject we're not even going to try to talk about it here but I give some resources here and then I just recommend you know unless you really know what you're doing work with somebody that does and Whitmarsh McConnell who is here I think he's going to have a booth he does soil consulting you know you can get a task and have him interpret it for you and give you the recommendations and then learn all you can as you go along but. Recognize that it's a subject that even when Maher will say he's got so much still to learn it's. The kind of thing you'll spend the rest of your life trying to understand but if you're trying to get up and going and get profitable earn a living from it I think your best thing is just to have somebody else tell you somebody that you trust to tell you what to do with your soil this because you can mess things up really quick and really bad if you're not careful by using the wrong things even compost Joshua come up and talk to us about high value crops. OK So we are going to just quickly look. Look through at. Crops choices and just how we rate our crops as far as the the yield the value that we get from them so for starting off we're going to look at Curtis stone's. Crop value rating and he has 55. Method that he uses so 1st one short days to maturity so if it's a crop that's mature in 60 days or less it would be one point. High yield per linear foot so a half a pound yield per hour per linear foot and that's on the 30 inch bed so that would be a. 2 and a half square foot section. A high price per pound minimum of $4.00 a pound long harvest period. Minimum of 4 months so that would be either a crop that you continually harvest for up to 4 months like tomatoes. Or cucumbers peppers those kind of things or a crop that has a season up to 4 months so it might be a relive that you're replanting every week but you have at least 4 months worth of season that you can be harvesting and the last one popularity. High demand crops you don't want to be growing things that people aren't aren't wanting so we have a slide here was just a. A few of the crops so the crop value rating on a regular is a 5 out of 5 so that means all of those we have beats are 4 out of 5 carrots 4 out of 5 kale 4 out of 5 lettuce 5. My careens or 4 radishes baby kalo salad mix turnips spinach and tomatoes if you look at the 5 out of 5 they're almost all baby greens which are definitely your highest your highest yielding so that gives just an idea of of that rating so we're going to go through and look at these crops and just some growing tips on these highest value crops OK so we're going to start with baby greens. Key with baby greens is not having weeds in your bed because you don't want to have to be sorting your whole harvest so you want to make sure you have a smooth and weed free feed bad seed with a high intensity Cedar. We use a the Johnnies 6 row cedar for most of our things we also use in the jing see you're more now. You need a good more stir for germination but if you get too much water after things start Germany you'll start dealing with molds in your you know dense bed and then harvesting with a quick harvest or you can harvest I don't even know what they say as far as pounds per hour but it's a huge amount I mean we're not harvesting hundreds of pounds of baby lettuce but are any of the baby cross but we don't take more than probably. 5 minutes to harvest any specific crop like a $25.00 foot of a regular. You know take just a couple minutes so huge. Efficiency on that so that was baby greens in general you know regular baby kale different stuff like this this is specifically on baby lettuce so we we have started in the last few years growing salad Nova and I don't know if you all are familiar with salad Nova but it grows in a head and then you cut the head you cut. The Leafs above the growing the growing tip in the head and it regrows you know we it depends in the summer you won't get as you'll get maybe 2 cuts but in the winter sometimes we'll get 4 or 5 cuts from the one plant. No of us so we use pelleted seeds Yeah yeah well that's the way that the sound of is bred it doesn't give like a regular head lettuce it doesn't have. Full leaves it just has a lot there just come up little leaves. So it grows it grows differently than a then a regular head lettuce and we just find it much easier because if you do have weed that come up in your bed well for one you can cultivate because your plants are you know 6 is a part so you can cultivate through even after it's growing whereas if you have it in a sea in a bed you can't do any call to vacation and then also if you have. If you have weeds and you go to harvest you're just grabbing your head and cutting it you don't have a you don't have stuff growing in your head it's all around and so you kind of sorting. You're sorting your lettuce and harvesting all at once and we just find it a much easier way to grow the baby lettuce so we. We transplant it so we use pelleted seeds for for our blocks because it just makes it much easier to. To see that it's a quick and easy harvest and it's a sturdy year lettuce so the the baby lettuce mix is that you'll direct seed into a bed or just a very limp I guess you'd say and so this is just. A sturdier lettuce so then we're going to go to spinach. Where there's 2 ways that we grow spinach one would be seeding it direct seeding into bed intensely. 7 rows per bed probably. And then harvesting it with the with the Greens harvester and you may get a couple cuttings but you know your 1st cutting is going to be is going to be your best in the winter we seed it in soil walk so do for seeds per block and then we just harvest the big leaves and it keeps growing. Much better than if you cut the whole plan so we'll harvest we'll have a bed that will go through the whole winter with just continually be harvesting from that. So with this spin it you have to be more cognizant of the fact that it is a have your feeder and so it needs more fertility put on it than just your other greens and when you're harvesting. When you're harvesting just the leaves are going to make sure you're not giving you're not harvesting with a long stem because that. People don't like to do like just the leaves. So then we go to turnips and radishes. For for this high. The the crop by rating that what we're talking about are Gore may radishes and turnips is not your field you know purple top turnips or your big radishes these are little so the turn up so we grow our hack right turn ups they're a small they get up you know maybe a golf ball size. And then radishes Also we do like French breakfast radishes and small pink beauty radishes They're just much more. And you get much better price for those people people like them a lot more. So that's the seeding that we do radish and the 5 rows per bed and turnips you for as per bed. And I'm sure in the. When we talk about. The tools talk about Cedars we used to doing cedar for we've started using the jeans here more for most of the seating so they'll talk about that when they do that. With the radishes and turn ups especially in the summer and fall we deal lot more with flea beetles eating the believes and so will cover with an insect netting You can also use a real lightweight ro cover and it will keep your your leaves your greens really nice we also do that with a regular. In the kale anything that you have issue with with. Insects so for pretty much anything selling it bunched with the Greens on it you're going to get a much higher price than if you cut if you cut your greens and you're selling a book but. If you know if we have a crop of red cars radishes don't won't last especially the small gourmet radishes they don't last in the ground and definitely they'll grow too big and then they'll get like soft they'll get hollow on the inside so if you're not able to sell them all when they need to be sold you can pull them cut the tops and they'll store for you know a few weeks and you can you can move them that way but on a whole we try to sell all of our stuff bunch because you get a much you know you can have maybe 10 or 10 radishes in a bunch and it looks like a pretty good amount you get to $53.00 for your bunch but if you cut the tops off those nobody's going to pay $3.00 for 10 little radishes All right we're going to beat. We transplant all of our beats and if you know the seeds they kind of are a little clump you generally have 2 plants per seed and so we do 2 seeds in the block and we get a little bunch of beets coming up. And so yeah we transplant them just because the germination can be hard to get in the field and so when you transplant them if they don't germinate you don't have an empty spot in your field you just take it you know when you when you're sitting at the blocks you don't use the. Empty one so we also do the beets bunched. We try and get you know a tennis ball a little a little smaller maybe size be it will sell 3 so 3 per bunch and we get $3.00 a bunch for them. And then in the winter the Greens aren't as good and also I sell them much more bulk in the winter like a much bigger amount of beets in the winter and sell them. You know by the pound without the greens but you're not getting a dollar be like you would be when you're selling them by the bunch carrots are a big crop for us they're also somewhat challenging but 1st of all you have to make sure you've got a good loose soil so we broadsword all of our beds before to get you know 12 inches deep loosen up the soil and then the biggest thing with carrots is your weeds and so we still haven't gotten this down perfectly but I would like to have my beds perfect prepared about a month before I seed the beets and then you do. The carrots sorry you do the stale seed beds so you'll prepare your beds get them all smoothed. Water them and then leave them for maybe 5 days a week and you'll have. All your weeds will come up and there's a couple ways you can do it easiest one is with the flame weed or you'll run it over your bed and it'll just torch all those weeds and they'll die and then you can water it again and. Do that sure there are times and then when you go to plant all your germinating seeds in the top inch of your bed have already tried to germinate and been killed and your care to come up and you will have the weeds coming up one thing that I have struggled with that is that you'll end up getting kind of a crust it depends on how you know if you've got real if it's really stunned the kind of dries out you've got a crust on your on the top your bed and then you can it can be difficult seating into it so what I've found the is the best way to do it we use. Silence tarps for for killing weeds when we when we don't have crops in the ground will discover our plot with a silos Tarpon to keep keep the weeds from coming up and then when you uncover you've got a nice place to plant so I'll do the flame weed or a couple weeks and then the last time instead of flame weeding it when the weeds come up pull a silos tarp over. And it doesn't kill the weeds you know immediately it's got to be on there for a few days if it's sunny it'll get faster. But having it covered with the plastic will moisturize the bed and it will break down that cross them you pull the tarp off you've got a much softer bed to seed into you so that's what I've what I've found is the easiest way to to get that still seed bed and then yeah you you don't have nearly the issue as weeds. For the direct seeding we used to use pelletised seed but the germination is just not as good and then a lot of times it's harder with the cedar so use an pelletised seed CD where from 3 to 12 rows per bed I would did all my roses or all my beds 7 rows per bed and that's has worked well for for me well it's 7 rows per bed they're like. $34.00 inches of what 4 and a half year for 4 and a half inches apart I've done I did 12 rows per bed. Maybe 2 years ago and I had amazing stand of carrots and they sized up but it can be a little bit harder because. Sometimes they'll just get too thick and they just won't get a good size so I do 7 to 9. Rows per bed. And take advantage of the cold weather. I grow I do the winter season on our farm and so carrots are a really big crop that we do in the winter it's the one crop that we do a lot of outside of C.S.A. and winter carrots are just amazingly sweet. And they're I mean they sell themselves they're so easy to sell I did last last winter I did. I'd about a quarter acre of carrots and I mean there's no no problem selling them so the winter the winter carrots are very sweet you know I'm not getting not bunching them. In the winter they're the tops are as good so I'm selling them by the pound but still it's a very very profitable crop so tomatoes to get our early tomatoes will feed them. I will be seeding them as soon as we get home usually see them like middle of January in little half inch blocks keep them inside and then we increase to a 2 inch block. At that point we'll move them to the greenhouse and then we will put them in a 6 inch pot and plant them out in. The middle of March and they'll be like you know 18 inches 2 feet tall we have I don't think we grafted OK The question was do we graft. We have we didn't graft last year Dad might have a little bit more. Reasons on the grafting but I think we just found that you know you have to obviously you have to plant twice as much because you're taking the top from one in the bottom from the other one so then you know you've got a top and bottom the you're throwing away and I think we just found that the. Yield wasn't and then we also it was you know it's hard to to get a good graph and we would have a pretty big percentage of them that wouldn't make it after you graph them they would die and so we just kind of came to the conclusion that with all the work put into it and the extra cost put into it just wasn't the yield wasn't really that much better it wasn't really worth it. So different different markets are going to be looking for different things. You know if you're growing for a farmer's market or a C.S.A. It's nice to just have a good variety of of colors and sizes and if you're growing for a store or restaurant they might be looking for just a big red slicing tomato and so you going to want to know what your market is and what you're looking for in order to to be able to provide that we grow pretty much all of our tomatoes in a hoop house. And we do greenhouse varieties which just keeps the. The disease is much less and the yields are much higher and then we try as all of ours to a 2 liter system and so when the when the plant grows you know you've got your suckers that come out. On every you know right above every leaf there's bilby a new sucker that will go out. And so will take will take the main plant and one of those suckers and we will Charles those on string and then every other every other sucker will be cut off and so you don't end up with a huge Bush you've got to. Trellised leaders and you know you have a nice neat row otherwise you just have a huge tomato bush and it's hard to get in there and see what you're trying to pick and what's ripe and all that OK So those were the the highest rated. Crops but depending on your market you can't just stick to those crops. With a C.S.A. you know that was I don't know that was 8 or 10 days different crops. If you have a C.S.A. you can't just grow those crops and expect people that you know they're going to appreciate getting the same thing for your whole season so we do a lot outside of that and it depends on your your marketing method and. The size you're if you're growing on a very small crop plot of land you might want to just be focusing on those crops and not doing a C.S.A. and your yield is going to be much greater for your small. But on our farm we're doing C.S.A. we grow quite a bit more outside of those crops. Yes So for C.S.A. or also just also just farmers market. You know you could you could just have those things a farmer's market and you'll probably do fine sell them but having more variety brings people to your to your stand they like to be able to get what they want your stance that having to go all over and only getting a few things that you're at your stand so a few other ones Cumbers sweet peppers garlic cherry tomatoes kale and chard herbs. All the herbs. Small fruits we grow. Strawberries and blueberries mostly we're got quite a few must get on and we are probably will be getting more into the blackberries and raspberries also it's just people love fruits and if you have fruit in your stand it will be a huge draw for people in the spring when we have shrubberies and blueberries Well blueberries or later in the summer but. They're you know that's when we have the biggest. Farmer's Market sales so yeah there's the the small fruits that we have grown so we have crops not to grow now the thing is that when we look through pretty much all these crops our crops that we have or still grow sometimes but when we say crops not to grow these are crops that you're not really going to be making much money on we grow them for our C.S.A.. But we don't we we keep it as minimal as possible so sweet corn broccoli and cauliflower. Squash and melons potatoes so Laurie and celeriac. Parsnips artichokes and zucchini all of if you look at all of these crops their crops that take up a lot of space and their crops that you for the most part they're in the ground for a long time they take up a lot of space and you harvest them once and you're done. But like I say we have we have grown all of these things at one point or another. We if we don't grow them we will we will get them once or twice in the season from. Nearby farms to have an R C S A because people if people go through a whole summer C.S.A. and they never get corn they're kind of disappointed like Korn's like your staple in the summer you know it's a crop everybody wants so you have to you have to weigh that in on your own your choices OK so the yeah the question was on the tomatoes the. The pot changing the size how we do that so it was we start with a half inch block so Johnny's has the cedar it's it's like the block of the block or it's like that big and it's got 2020 blocks so we started in there we start the inside the house or in a a germinating chamber so you know on one of our big trees we've got. Like 600 plants. So you can just have a lot in your germinating chamber and then once they're well really once they're about an inch tall they've got their full their 1st Cod lead in leaves then will transplant them or change the block to a 2 inch so Johnny's got the blocker it's got a half inch inset So it's got the same size block you know make the hole in the center so a movement to there they get you know 3 inches 4 inches tall and then we'll put them in a 6 inch pot and then at that point they'll stay in the pot for a month maybe OK So the question is on the books the most important I think I think Dad's. The way he presented them was kind of his most important so the 1st one was Elliot Coleman's new organic grower which is just a very it covers your whole seasons and you know it's just the most the most broad The 2nd one J.M. says the market gardener and then the winter harvest would that be your 3rd one especially especially if you're if you're looking at growing in the winter that's going to be that might even be higher on the list if you're growing just in the winter this media was brought to you by audio 1st a website dedicated to spreading God's word through free sermon audio and much more if you would like to know more about audio verse if you would like to listen to more sermons leave a Visit W W W audio verse or.