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The LBCJoined: 12 Jan 2008Posts: 35148Location: Where We Can't Have Nice Things

Posted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 6:22 pm Post subject:

gopherwrestler wrote:

Techbert wrote:

IDOG_det wrote:

Techbert wrote:

I was disappointed in his drill work. Not bad, but not up to the hype. Tighter hips than I hoped. Looked down more than he should. Above numbers are not bad for a center either, but not hype-worthy.

He may move down my board, but didn't get kicked off. I'm going to go back and look at his tape again.

This is a thing people look for at the combine?

He will never be asked to run around little orange cones ever again so you probably won't have to worry about that

Interior OL do not need peripheral vision and field awareness?

Well ya but are they going to be looking for a cone? A person is a little bigger than a cone.

Realistically, a bright orange cone stands out more in peripheral vision than a protruding leg or foot. Just saying. It's a legitimate ding. Also, you want the pulling OL's head up because you want him looking for and identifying any linebackers adjusting to the play or moving to try to get at the ball carrier. Hard to do that when you're looking down._________________

I was disappointed in his drill work. Not bad, but not up to the hype. Tighter hips than I hoped. Looked down more than he should. Above numbers are not bad for a center either, but not hype-worthy.

He may move down my board, but didn't get kicked off. I'm going to go back and look at his tape again.

This is a thing people look for at the combine?

He will never be asked to run around little orange cones ever again so you probably won't have to worry about that

Interior OL do not need peripheral vision and field awareness?

Well ya but are they going to be looking for a cone? A person is a little bigger than a cone.

Realistically, a bright orange cone stands out more in peripheral vision than a protruding leg or foot. Just saying. It's a legitimate ding. Also, you want the pulling OL's head up because you want him looking for and identifying any linebackers adjusting to the play or moving to try to get at the ball carrier. Hard to do that when you're looking down.

Well you are going to adjust to a leg or a foot, you can see where there bodies are. I think it's overblown. In a game nobody looks down to see if they are going to trip over someones foot and running out to block someone. If someone fell on the ground on a pull by you, you should be able to see them.

He had to backpedal 5 yards and he didn't want to cut it short or go too deep in drills. In a game being exactly 5 yards behind the LOS in kind of unrealistic. May cut it a half yard shorter or even a half yard longer depending on where the bodies are pushed around. They make those drills really dramatic._________________“Once you’ve wrestled, everything else in life is easy.”
-Dan Gable

If you don't think it is a good test of peripheral vision, fine. Look at it this way. If you have a position coach who told the last five athletes, "Keep you head up! Eyes up! Don't look down! Watch the eyes!" and you still stare down and still drift wide around the cones?

I was disappointed in his drill work. Not bad, but not up to the hype. Tighter hips than I hoped. Looked down more than he should. Above numbers are not bad for a center either, but not hype-worthy.

He may move down my board, but didn't get kicked off. I'm going to go back and look at his tape again.

This is a thing people look for at the combine?

He will never be asked to run around little orange cones ever again so you probably won't have to worry about that

Interior OL do not need peripheral vision and field awareness?

Well ya but are they going to be looking for a cone? A person is a little bigger than a cone.

Realistically, a bright orange cone stands out more in peripheral vision than a protruding leg or foot. Just saying. It's a legitimate ding. Also, you want the pulling OL's head up because you want him looking for and identifying any linebackers adjusting to the play or moving to try to get at the ball carrier. Hard to do that when you're looking down.

He wouldn't be looking down because the defenders wouldn't be on the ground like a little orange cone. His head and eyes would be up looking for defenders he's attempting to block. His head and eyes would not be looking down on the ground looking for little orange cones. It's a ridiculous criticism. Go watch his damn tape and you can see he's great at pulling. Or you can choose to read into him doing a drill at the combine and decide that he's not good at pulling because he was following directions. Your choice._________________
"Strength is meaningless in o-line play if there is no explosive, or speed-strength, quality to the strength."
- LeCharles Bentley

If you don't think it is a good test of peripheral vision, fine. Look at it this way. If you have a position coach who told the last five athletes, "Keep you head up! Eyes up! Don't look down! Watch the eyes!" and you still stare down and still drift wide around the cones?

That speaks to both coachability and commitment to your preparations.

You need to educate yourself buddy. If you knew the first damn thing about Pat Elflein you would never question his preparation.

And, it's not a test of peripheral vision. It's sad that you even think that._________________
"Strength is meaningless in o-line play if there is no explosive, or speed-strength, quality to the strength."
- LeCharles Bentley

This is a case where you just look back and OSU games and see if Elflein had trouble pulling. Simple as that. No sense arguing him looking down at an orange cone.

I did. I looked at Michigan and Clemson. I did not see good vision.

He had some good plays and some good pulls against Michigan, and I saw some bad ones. He did not pick up blitzers in his peripheral very well and missed several blocks in space. He gave up multiple sacks, including one where they thought it was a good idea to pull Elflein in pass pro against Taco Charlton. If Barrett did not have good escapability, he would have given up several other sacks due to substandard vision.

Clemson demolished Elflein. OSU pulled Elflein a number of times. Can't say it was effective. Maybe once. I dunno. I do know Clemson's interior beat Elflein like a bongo drum all night.

Sorry to rile up the B1G apologists, but you guys need to do a better job of reading. Yes. Elflein is obviously a hard worker, but I said he was either lacking in vision or prep, one or the other, and it looks like he has trouble with the vision. His good pulls is when he blocks someone directly in his path. His bad pulls he misses completely and keeps going.

How many sacks was he responsible for in those two games? Six? Eight? That's really sad for a center who spends most of the time in routine double teams.

Joined: 05 Jan 2009Posts: 7641Location: 8 mile by way of St. Clair E.99

Posted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 11:06 pm Post subject:

Techbert wrote:

Jlash wrote:

This is a case where you just look back and OSU games and see if Elflein had trouble pulling. Simple as that. No sense arguing him looking down at an orange cone.

I did. I looked at Michigan and Clemson. I did not see good vision.

He had some good plays and some good pulls against Michigan, and I saw some bad ones. He did not pick up blitzers in his peripheral very well and missed several blocks in space. He gave up multiple sacks, including one where they thought it was a good idea to pull Elflein in pass pro against Taco Charlton. If Barrett did not have good escapability, he would have given up several other sacks due to substandard vision.

Clemson demolished Elflein. OSU pulled Elflein a number of times. Can't say it was effective. Maybe once. I dunno. I do know Clemson's interior beat Elflein like a bongo drum all night.

Sorry to rile up the B1G apologists, but you guys need to do a better job of reading. Yes. Elflein is obviously a hard worker, but I said he was either lacking in vision or prep, one or the other, and it looks like he has trouble with the vision. His good pulls is when he blocks someone directly in his path. His bad pulls he misses completely and keeps going.

How many sacks was he responsible for in those two games? Six? Eight? That's really sad for a center who spends most of the time in routine double teams.

Did you bother to evaluate all of 2015 and 14? If you aren't aware, it should take more than 2 games to form an opinion, your post sounds like you have a personal gripe.

And even if he did have those 2 bad games, it has zero bearing on how his future shakes out._________________@CoachHam6455

This Roullier kid impressed me enough to watch him at Wyoming, and he looks really good IMO. His 40 wasn't very good, but he lead the pack in the 20yd shuttle (which tends to correlate very well to C success)._________________

MrDrew wrote:

Everything about Rivers is Awkward, reminiscent of a Giraffe with Down's Syndrome

This is a case where you just look back and OSU games and see if Elflein had trouble pulling. Simple as that. No sense arguing him looking down at an orange cone.

I did. I looked at Michigan and Clemson. I did not see good vision.

He had some good plays and some good pulls against Michigan, and I saw some bad ones. He did not pick up blitzers in his peripheral very well and missed several blocks in space. He gave up multiple sacks, including one where they thought it was a good idea to pull Elflein in pass pro against Taco Charlton. If Barrett did not have good escapability, he would have given up several other sacks due to substandard vision.

Clemson demolished Elflein. OSU pulled Elflein a number of times. Can't say it was effective. Maybe once. I dunno. I do know Clemson's interior beat Elflein like a bongo drum all night.

Sorry to rile up the B1G apologists, but you guys need to do a better job of reading. Yes. Elflein is obviously a hard worker, but I said he was either lacking in vision or prep, one or the other, and it looks like he has trouble with the vision. His good pulls is when he blocks someone directly in his path. His bad pulls he misses completely and keeps going.

How many sacks was he responsible for in those two games? Six? Eight? That's really sad for a center who spends most of the time in routine double teams.

Did you bother to evaluate all of 2015 and 14? If you aren't aware, it should take more than 2 games to form an opinion, your post sounds like you have a personal gripe.

And even if he did have those 2 bad games, it has zero bearing on how his future shakes out.

Yea but those are two games against NFL level talent. If true, I think he's right to be very concerned._________________