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Spaghetti doesn't work with the iShow 3 DAC. I haven't had a chance to even see one. From my understanding based on an early prototype I saw, they are Ethernet controlled so might actually yield nice results. If someone can post a link to one I could look into it. Not promising anything, though.

beware beyond

free ... not quite
looks a kvant fiesta or mamba as entry level and then look at qiuick show as next step before moving into beyond... where your conversion will be complete.

with the FB4 a lot of the FB3 DAC are going at pretty reasonable rates

quickshow yes is ok, beyond dont go there!! we did big mistake. it offers nothing over quickshow for the average perfomance, maybe higher galvo speeds
but do you really need more than 30k for beam shows ?? it has better midi controls thats the ONLY reason we still use it!! with an APC40 . and im writing software to get round that, otherwise its a memory hog crashes regularly AND stops working as it has MANDATORY FORCED upgrades which they dont tell you about when you buy it!! . maybe you like the idea of something you have paid well over the odds for suddenly not working and you having to download a new version , I dont especially when we dont havegreat internet access or even worse when it forces an update when you are starting a show!!!! its mine i paid for it leave it alone!!!!!!!. the new versions also may require a hardware upgrade so more exspense. As i say i cannot recommend Beyond to anyone stay well away, quickshow is good if it had better midi support it would be excellent.

I must admit you are the 1st person i have heard been clearly unhappy with Pangolin and beyond. I know there were prompts to update software but was not aware it was a forced situation. I have found beyond to be super solid. only problem i had a few years ago was it doping the APC 40 but that was found to be a dicky usb port

I won't use this post to discuss the quality of our software. I think the quality speaks for itself, and there are many people here on PL who can talk about what it does, how it works, how solid it is, and whether or not it is worth what we charge. (And of course, people here on PL will also attest to our generosity, how we've given numerous updates for free to the folks here on PL, etc. )

Nevertheless, I do think that it is VERY important to correct inaccuracies in what Fiji wrote above.

First, regarding "forced updates", does anybody other than me use modern software? Has anybody other than me been "forced" to update Adobe Flash in order to use a website or YouTube? Has anybody else been "forced" to update their online banking apps? What about iPhones? And has anybody else had Microsoft sneak onto their computer in the middle of the night and convert a perfectly working Windows 7 install to Windows 10?

Most of the folks here on PL and also Laser Freak and also ILDA have seen me speak publicly on this matter. We are 10000000000% up-front in terms of what is going on and why we require people to occasionally update their software (on average once every 18 months, which is a heck of a lot less frequent than any of the others I mentioned above!!!), and why we've had to start doing this (because of piracy mostly coming out of China). Moreover, I have been 10000000000% up-front that this is something we don't like to do -- and that if everyone in the world would help us to confront piracy, we would stop this in a heart-beat.

HOWEVER (and this is what makes Pangolin different), unlike Microsoft, Apple, Adobe, Wells Fargo, iHeartRadio, and countless others, who give people virtually no notice -- and more importantly -- and no control, WE GIVE PEOPLE BOTH!

All anybody would have to do is actually read our license agreement, which, by the way you are forced to look at AT LEAST TWICE when installing and starting our software for the very first time and on each subsequent update. For anyone interested in reading it, the license agreement can be accessed at any time from the HELP/ABOUT menu in our software. It is also prominently displayed on our web site, in its entirety here:https://pangolin.com/license-agreeme...ited-warranty/

As it relates specifically to this subject, people should take special note of Paragraph 4, which reads in part: "... Software products including IMU, QuickShow and BEYOND must be updated periodically, to ensure their continued operation."

So YES, ABSOLUTELY WE DO TELL PEOPLE THAT PERIODIC UPDATES ARE REQUIRED.

BUT!!!! Here is the most important part (and where reading is especially handy). And this is where we are different from every other company that I've ever seen in the entire world. It's at the end of Paragraph 4: "If you have a fixed installation or long-term touring operation where periodic Software updates would be impractical, please contact Pangolin to obtain a file that will enable the Software to operate perpetually without updates."

It means that PEOPLE CAN REQUEST A SPECIAL LICENSE FILE SO THAT UPDATES ARE NO LONGER NEEDED!!!!

All anybody has to do is read -- either that, or attend one of the presentations that I give at PL, Laser Freak, or ILDA meetings, where we talk about the bad things that have happened to Pangolin (indeed, perhaps the world at large) because of Piracy -- what we are doing about it (these software updates, law suits and other things) -- how people can help (by reporting piracy either directly or publicly) -- AND (as it relates to this topic) how NOT to be caught in the cross-fire (by writing us an email and requesting the special license file).

Fiji also wrote above "and I'm writing software to get around that", to which my reply is -- hmmm, someone complaining about our software and writing their own? Sounds like Penis envy to me...

One of the real problems I have with forums, is that people can go by pseudonyms instead of their real name. For some people this allows people to hide behind their identity. In this case, it prohibits us from knowing if Fiji reported the problems, allowed us to investigate (and our software has indeed many tools that would allow us to investigate), whether the problem is caused by the computer, operating system, some conflicting software (such as Norton) or something else. Because of this, I can't speak to why it is that Fiji is having problems.

What I will say is that everyone here on PL has experience with Pangolin. Indeed at the last PL meeting, that's mostly what I saw being used (and actually mostly BEYOND). Everyone here can speak better than I can about the software and about our support. So I will leave it up to all of you to discuss this further.

As for Fiji and his problems, he's welcome to contact us directly and try to work through them.

All Fiji would have ever had to do is read. Either that or call us. Either that or look at our forums. Either that, or attend any of the many meetings at which we exhibit, where we publicly explain all of this.

And John, if you're going to talk about things that are "uncalled for", you should be calling out Fiji for spreading misinformation. Otherwise you're just being a partisan hack.