Started my job at MDW today and got the scoop on some things going on at the airport.

1. Odyssey Aviation closed their doors on May 31st. Their operation was pretty small and the building was falling apart. Rumor has it that the city will demolish the building. This leaves Signature and Atlantic as the only two FBOs on the airfield now.

2. The National Guard will be vacating their building sometime this year supposedly. The city will probably be demolishing this building as well. I find it hard to believe because I think the NG hangar is one of the first buildings at MDW. It looks pretty historical. I wouldn't be surprised if someone put up a fight.

3. The city has until I believe the end of July to find funding to privatize the airport. No idea if they have any investors or not. The city will most likely not make any big airfield changes until that date.

4. There are rumors that, after tearing down the old NG and Odyssey buildings, the city will build a new international terminal in their place. Honestly, this wouldn't surprise me as right now, the only two international gates are A2 and A3, and they are utilized much of the day by Volaris and Porter. It would be tough to add a third international carrier into the mix with more than 1 or 2 flights a day. Again, just a rumor.

5. Not sure if this is confirmed or still just a rumor, but apparently DL will be moving back to the C Concourse and vacating A5, A7, and A10. WN would take the gates back giving them basically all of the A Concourse in addition to all of the B concourse.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Thread starter):There are rumors that, after tearing down the old NG and Odyssey buildings, the city will build a new international terminal in their place. Honestly, this wouldn't surprise me as right now, the only two international gates are A2 and A3, and they are utilized much of the day by Volaris and Porter. It would be tough to add a third international carrier into the mix with more than 1 or 2 flights a day. Again, just a rumor.

MDW hasn't had issues accommodating everyone in the past and probably won't in the future. Given the short runways, the only possibilities for international service are Canada (and in most cases, those flights can use pre-clearance), Mexico, the Caribbean (several pre-clearance airports there), and perhaps Central America.

Canada - Canada essentially only has three major scheduled transborder operators. AC and now WS serve ORD in conjunction with partners and as such have no reason to serve MDW. PD can utilize domestic MDW gates if YTZ succeeds in getting U.S. pre-clearance facilities. WN/FL, like other U.S. LCCs, probably won't be serving Canada anytime soon. Even if they did, most or all flights would likely be able to use the airline's existing domestic gates thanks to pre-clearance at all of Canada's largest airports.

Mexico - Not much WN/FL can do beyond their existing CUN flight, with authorities between Chicago and the likes of MEX, PVR, and SJD all accounted for by other U.S. airlines under relatively restrictive U.S.-Mexico bilateral agreement. Given the recent failure of Viva Aerobus at MDW, I doubt we'll see additional Mexican carriers add service to the airport. It's possible that Y4 will add more MDW-Mexico flights, but with major markets like MEX and GDL already covered I can't see them adding more than a few low frequency additions to existing or new markets.

Caribbean - All of the Caribbean flag carriers that serve Chicago have opted for ORD. Not surprising, as ORD tends to be much closer to the wealthiest suburban families that can easily afford those expensive trips to the Caribbean. Even so, ORD does not have all that much Caribbean service, and I would not expect to see WN/FL do much in the way of MDW-Caribbean nonstops. Stuff like MDW-SJU/NAS/AUA can use domestic gates, and anything beyond that - PUJ, MBJ, etc. probably wouldn't be more than a few weekly flights. I would expect WN to serve the Caribbean primarily through ATL, Florida, and the East Coast.

Central America - Barely seems to work from ORD, with the exception of seasonal weekly LIR. I would imagine any nonstop service from MDW, a Chicago airport with significantly less feed, would fare even worse.

So, there you have it. I simply don't see a need for a new international terminal. They have had no problems squeezing three airlines into the existing facility, and I'm sure they could always convert an existing domestic gate or two into an international-capable one if there is a need to do so. Much less expensive proposition than a new terminal.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Thread starter):Not sure if this is confirmed or still just a rumor, but apparently DL will be moving back to the C Concourse and vacating A5, A7, and A10. WN would take the gates back giving them basically all of the A Concourse in addition to all of the B concourse.

I have heard that before on here. Might as well give WN some room to grow (I would imagine they'll be adding new service to DCA, CLT, MEM, DAY, RIC, ROC, ICT, SJU, and perhaps even PWM, PNS, FNT, and GRR) and put the C gates back into use!

Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!

I definitely see your point on the international terminal. I guess I was thinking more along the lines of Volaris adding more frequencies onto its routes. If that were to happen, the gate space might become an issue. However, they seem to have a more G4 type model of low frequency routes. As for Canadian airlines, WS chose ORD for whatever reason (connections?) vs. the cheaper MDW. CanJet tried and failed at MDW. I've heard conflicting reports on how full PD flights are.

The only other reason for a new international terminal is to attract new carriers. Carriers looking to start flights to Chicago might see that the MDW international gates don't leave much room for expansion and choose ORD over MDW. Again though, we seem to have most foreign carriers capable of flying into MDW accounted for. I guess we'll just have to wait and see!

As for the DL gate swap, I've been hearing it for a couple months now, too. I'm not sure how true it is, but I hope it is. I never understood why DL chose the NW gates over having the entire Concourse C to itself.

I've heard that, too. Not sure how much more they can expand, though. They could only extend the terminal a little further north, maybe getting 1-3 more gates in there. I guess it's a possibility, but would it be worth it?

Quoting 93Sierra (Reply 3):great lakes had 2 beech 1900s there over the last month dunno

I wonder if GL is looking into doing some IL EAS routes in the future.

At what point does someone suggest that hey we need to scoop up some additional property that surrounds the airport to give ourselves some breathing room. I state this fully realizing the costs would be significant however if additional room for safety and additional concourses is deemed necessary maybe the push might come.

Ah! Of course, why have one when you can have two.
Makes sense it would be DD over Starbucks -- Starbucks generally requires more room and space and I doubt they (airport management) would want to put a kiosk right in the middle area coming off of security.

if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport

Well before ANYTHING happens at MDW, there is one problem that has to be addressed and fixed. My last two departures from there were awful. I'm referring to Security and the mess around it. Last Thurs. I got there about 2 hours before departure and the lines were backed up into the main terminal. It was 45 mins to get through. This is redictulas. There must have been 400-500 people in line.If I were going to somewhere like CLE I would just get on a Mega bus, sit back and relax, read, do work etc and no hassel. To get to the airport so early, and the rest of it....No way. MDW needs to address this problem if they even want to think of adding new flights. My 2 cents

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 6):How many unused gates, but which could be used, exist at MDW? Cheers!

As of today, all of Concourse C is unused (minus an arrival from DTW at night and an early morning departure back to DTW the following morning. C consists of C1, C2, and C3.

WN has the entire B Concourse B1-B3, B5, B7-B12, B14-B26.

For Concourse A, F9 uses A1 and A2. Y4 uses A2 and PD uses A3. DL (including CP, OH, and 9E) use A5, A7, and A10. FL uses A12, A14, and A16. WN uses A4A, A4B, A9, A11, A13, A15, and A17. That leaves A18 and A19 unused. However, WN may have snatched these gates up when they got A4A and A4B. I believe FL only uses A16 on rare occasions and for RON. A6 isn't really a gate. It's an elevator that leads downstairs that could be used for busing passengers. No one uses it right now, either.

Quoting KarlB737 (Reply 7):At what point does someone suggest that hey we need to scoop up some additional property that surrounds the airport to give ourselves some breathing room. I state this fully realizing the costs would be significant however if additional room for safety and additional concourses is deemed necessary maybe the push might come.

I'm not sure how this would even be possible. MDW is constrained by 4 busy streets in all directions. Not only would they have to demolish lots of houses and businesses, they would have to relocate the busy roadways as well. This would be a disaster in an already poor traffic flow area. They definitely couldn't shift east on Cicero as the terminal is there. Shifting north would be difficult with all the WN hangars in the way. Expanding west would probably be the best option of a bad scenario. Signature needs more space right now (they are constrained to BBJs or smaller). The railroad tracks would be a big issue in addition to demolishing all those houses. In other words, is it a possibility, yes. Would it be worth the billions of dollars, definitely not. I think this is another reason they are really pushing the third airport in Peotone.

There's a "sort of Starbucks" in Potbellys. It's more than a "we serve Starbucks coffee here" place, but much less than the real deal. I think they can make lattes and stuff with some syrups, but they don't have even half the menu of a real Starbucks. I've always wondered myself why there isn't a legit Starbucks at MDW. I'm sure it would rake in quite the profit (as does basically every Starbucks). I think the area next to A4 would be a great spot for a Starbucks.

Quoting syncmaster (Reply 10):
How would the number of gates that DL might get in C compare to what they have now?

If DL got all the gates at Concourse C, they would have the same amount of gates as they do now at Concourse A (3). I think the only issue with 3 gates is they RON 4 aircraft at MDW, so they would need to find somewhere to park that 4th aircraft. They currently use C1 for the last DTW arrival and early DTW departure.

You should have seen the mess before they added on 2 more lanes. Really the part that makes it bad is the ID checking area. They have the kiosks set too close to the entrance area. When it's really busy, the line snakes back to the escalators, but there's plenty of room between the ID stations and the metal detectors. They added on the new lanes a while back, but I've only seen them used a few times. Honestly, I think the bottlenecks only happen on occasion. I've flown in and out of MDW quite a few times and only seen it bad once or twice. Anyone else have bad experiences with lines? The biggest issue I have with MDW is the TSA officers. They are some of the worst, rudest, most surly TSOs I've seen at any airport. They really affirm the acronym for TSA "Thousands Standing Around."

I went through MDW about a week after it opened and when I saw that they had put security on the bridge over Cicero Av I immediately thought "who in the he11 would put security THERE?" Look, there has been airport security since the mid 70's, couldn't they have designed a better place to put it in the newly designed terminal?

There were long lines (almost back to the ticket counters). Does MDW still have those baggage scanners on the passenger side of the ticket counter where you have to walk your bag back and forth to it before you can check it?

Quoting type-rated (Reply 16):Does MDW still have those baggage scanners on the passenger side of the ticket counter where you have to walk your bag back and forth to it before you can check it?

No, luckily those scanners have been moved behind the scenes.

On the subject of ticket counters, I would really like to know why Continental and American ticket counters are still up. Obviously no one has had to use those counters, but you'd think the respective airlines would want to take their insignia down after shutting down a station.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Reply 15):If DL got all the gates at Concourse C, they would have the same amount of gates as they do now at Concourse A (3). I think the only issue with 3 gates is they RON 4 aircraft at MDW, so they would need to find somewhere to park that 4th aircraft. They currently use C1 for the last DTW arrival and early DTW departure.

Thanks! I went through there quite a bit back in the TZ days but only have used it a few times recently (I live near SBN) and wasn't sure what had changed since the DL/NW merger.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Reply 15):There's a "sort of Starbucks" in Potbellys. It's more than a "we serve Starbucks coffee here" place, but much less than the real deal. I think they can make lattes and stuff with some syrups, but they don't have even half the menu of a real Starbucks. I've always wondered myself why there isn't a legit Starbucks at MDW. I'm sure it would rake in quite the profit (as does basically every Starbucks). I think the area next to A4 would be a great spot for a Starbucks.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Reply 17):
On the subject of ticket counters, I would really like to know why Continental and American ticket counters are still up. Obviously no one has had to use those counters, but you'd think the respective airlines would want to take their insignia down after shutting down a station.

I didn't see AA last time I was there, although maybe they still have the grey backdrop without the signage so I didn't notice. The CO counter on the other hand is a case of someone at 77 West Wacker (or is it I-Will-Never-Call-It-The-W-Word Tower now? I haven't paid much attention to when that was actually happening) completely dropping the ball, which isn't that surprising these days.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Reply 15):Honestly, I think the bottlenecks only happen on occasion. I've flown in and out of MDW quite a few times and only seen it bad once or twice. Anyone else have bad experiences with lines?

The lines usually aren't too bad, and the lines tend to come in the early mornings, especially on Mondays, Fridays and weekends. The Business Select line, which merges with the crew line, can be horrendous, though. It's not a situation like Terminal 1 at LAX where the line always seems to be nasty.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Reply 15):I think the only issue with 3 gates is they RON 4 aircraft at MDW, so they would need to find somewhere to park that 4th aircraft. They currently use C1 for the last DTW arrival and early DTW departure.

They have used a city gate on A for an RON in the not-so-distant past. There might also be space for a fourth aircraft between C and the runway.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Thread starter):4. There are rumors that, after tearing down the old NG and Odyssey buildings, the city will build a new international terminal in their place. Honestly, this wouldn't surprise me as right now, the only two international gates are A2 and A3, and they are utilized much of the day by Volaris and Porter. It would be tough to add a third international carrier into the mix with more than 1 or 2 flights a day. Again, just a rumor.

I dont think having a new international terminal built is a good idea. WN/FL wont be happy to have to bus passengers from one terminal to the other. Such a terminal wouldn't handle that many flights a day and I'm sure the city will want to make some money in forms of concessions. But if gate space is needed for WN's future expansion CDA will have to do something or lose those flights to another airport.

Either expand Concourse C north adding 2 more gates to it, or some how move Cicero Avenue east where a new concourse can be built where A4A and A4B are at.

The city should just convert two more gates to connect to the FIS, A1 and A5.

Quoting type-rated (Reply 4):
Wasn't concourse C designed to be expanded at some time in the future when the need arises? It's really nothing more than a stubby hallway. Only three gates down there.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Reply 5):I've heard that, too. Not sure how much more they can expand, though. They could only extend the terminal a little further north, maybe getting 1-3 more gates in there. I guess it's a possibility, but would it be worth it?

IIRC concourse C is not meant to be expanded in the original plans. But it does look like you can expand it a little bit north making the concourse at least 5 gates at most squeezing 6th gate. If such a thing happens, DL, F9 and any other future airlines can be all be placed there.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Reply 15):WN uses A4A, A4B, A9, A11, A13, A15, and A17. That leaves A18 and A19 unused. However, WN may have snatched these gates up when they got A4A and A4B.

When WN made the loan to ATA they got the 6 gates on A which are A9, A11, A15, A17, A18 and A19.

Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Reply 15): A6 isn't really a gate. It's an elevator that leads downstairs that could be used for busing passengers. No one uses it right now, either.

I see WN/FL closely doing what ATA had for international operations minus PVR. For PVR and SJD, WN should try to get Volaris to do the flights for them.

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 20):The lines usually aren't too bad, and the lines tend to come in the early mornings, especially on Mondays, Fridays and weekends. The Business Select line, which merges with the crew line, can be horrendous, though. It's not a situation like Terminal 1 at LAX where the line always seems to be nasty.

Last time I experienced those long lines was the Friday of the NATO summit. But they do try to get everyone out of there quickly.

Quoting syncmaster (Reply 18):Quoting fghtngsiouxatc (Reply 15):
There's a "sort of Starbucks" in Potbellys. It's more than a "we serve Starbucks coffee here" place, but much less than the real deal. I think they can make lattes and stuff with some syrups, but they don't have even half the menu of a real Starbucks. I've always wondered myself why there isn't a legit Starbucks at MDW. I'm sure it would rake in quite the profit (as does basically every Starbucks). I think the area next to A4 would be a great spot for a Starbucks.

Absolutely.

I went back and asked again and the answer is just as I suspected .... "space issues." Starbucks' store design is apparently too big for the space available at Midway.

if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport