Why I debunk the chemtrail myth

Interesting the experiment in England dont you think, that no one knew about it at the time but do now?

Dont you think it could be the same case with this subject?

I don't think it can be, no. Firstly, the world was very different then, and British secrecy was always very, very tight with the aviation press and
the "aviation correspondents" of the nationals under very strict control compared to the way information can be spread nowadays, with the Internet and
mobile phones and texting etc for communication instantly, as well as globally.

Secondly, you would be comparing a small scale, localised military operation with the daily routine of every commercial operator in the developed
world, if the photos snd claims are anything to go by. I don't think there is any similarity at all.

Thank you, but not really everything. I agree that you need the humidity and temperature to be right, surely there is a region in between widespread
cirrus coverage and clear blue sky where the conditions are very close but something needs to kick it off, like a passing jet?

What do you make of WW2 pilots accounts where they described leaving a contrail In a clear air that thickens out and spreads to cover the sky?

If a Spitfire can do that is it not likely that the effect from such as a 737 or larger will be even more pronounced?.

My main reason not to believe chemtrails is simply that there are far more efficient ways to poison people: water supply, food supply, etc. Chemicals
dispersed in the air get diluted real fast. Whether or not there is a conspiracy to poison people I don't know, but if there was, I would think it
would be fairly efficient and covert.

That link is from Australia, but many other developed nations also have this problem. They blame it on obesity, so it may not be the chemtrails doing
it. But to say that life expectancy is proof that chemtrails don't exist is absurd.

I have seen Ted Gunderson been slandered on ATS. What proof do you have that he is nuts? All I ever came across was that he seemed to be a very
credible person.

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
All you folks coming in here to help me over my failure to believe the chemtrial myth - if you are going to present some evidence, please try to check
& see if it's something new.

Because, honestly, I've seen an awful lot of it, and none of it has been convincing to date.

I've seen What in the world are they spraying, I've seen hundreds of contrails on YT that someone says are chemtrails & can't prove why. I've
seen Ted Gunderson, I've seen tanker enemy, I've seen Arizona and California Skywatch, I've seen high barium levels in Mohave residents, Clare
Sweeny, Rense, Carnicon, AirCrap (never a better name for a site!!).

And every single bit of all of it I discount as hearsay, speculation, bad science, outright mistakes and sometimes probably lies.

And if all you're going to do is say "you are wrong because I say so" or "it's been proved that chemtrails exist" or whatever other
unsubstantiated assertion, then I hope that makes you feel better for getting it off your chest - because that's all the effect it will have.

I'm not really expecting any better ...but that's something I wanted to get off MY chest

You talk about bad science but you are the one who constantly tries to present it. You do not pay attention to detail and do not understand the
science. You also lie. When me and Phage were debating this subject, you got yourself involved and it was obvious that you could not follow what was
going on. In the end, Phage had to admit that the science was not so clear and to making some mistakes. You tried to say that you had comparable
data and pictures from LA during WW2. I asked you for it and you then tried to state I was being unfair to you. I then asked you for pictures and
data from even the 80's and you could not present it. I think you then ran off after you were handled and started another thread on chemtrails. I
am still waiting.

edit on 4-11-2011 by BillfromCovina because: clarity

I'm only on page 2 but I hope this gets addressed before the end of the thread.

I am interested in reading that thread you mentioned, would you mind linking me?

Originally posted by CaDreamer
to all you believers... if chemtrails are making us sick...why is life expectancy worldwide increasing 50% of children born today will live to 100.

oh and BTW that FBI guy is nuts...

You can't just make up nonsense that like that without posting a source. It looks ridiculous. Oh, and BTW, you should probably source something
supporting your opinion about the "FBI guy" as well. I'm interested in reading about both.

Again, Who said the spraying is for nefarious reasons? IF they spray,and don't admit it? Then WOULD they tell you about long term side effects?
Would they even know or care?

I've said it before, I have NO CLUE whats going on when they spray or why. It's NOT cloud seeding. Different airline does that here in Tahoe.

Is it to protect us from harmful ultraviolet rays? dunno
Block ground movement from satellites? dunno (We have a TON of military stuff within 200 miles of here)
Sedate us to slow us down? Why?
Is fluorination in the water a real conspiracy or a joke? When were we included in on the joke?

To dismiss chemtrails or geoengineering as a hallucination that can be explained away,some of you obviously haven't seen when they COAT the sky.
It's a COATING like a primer of paint on the skyline.

Once you see it,you KNOW the difference. It's not the same as a "flight route verses flight pattern" DUH.

Its an intentional COATING. And No, I have no clue who, or why, or what.

Ever been through Vegas Airport? Go look at the skyline there. Somedays they spray,some days they don't.
Once I pointed it out to a friend of mine who lives there,he GET'S it. He calls to tell me when they're spraing asking ME wtf is it?

I clearly said that it was an Australian link. And I still stand correct when I say that for you to claim chemtrails are fake because of world wide
life expectancy may rise is ridiculous. Nice deflection though, good troll tactic

Originally posted by CaDreamer
to all you believers... if chemtrails are making us sick...why is life expectancy worldwide increasing 50% of children born today will live to 100.

oh and BTW that FBI guy is nuts...

You can't just make up nonsense that like that without posting a source. It looks ridiculous. Oh, and BTW, you should probably source something
supporting your opinion about the "FBI guy" as well. I'm interested in reading about both.
Cheers,
Strype

I have posted numerous times about that guy. He has made claims like children are kidnapped and flown to the Area 51 for organ harvesting, that USAF
aircraft are used to fly children to Congressional orgies.

He chemtrail claims are also impossible, but in true chemtrailer style, none of them ever try to verify what Teddy claimed, or to even follow up on
it. They just take it as gospel.

Ted claims that Ft Sill, has a fleet of chemtrail planes. However, there is not even a runway long enough there to support large aircraft like that.
He also claims there are secret aircraft flown by the Nebraska Air National Guard in Lincoln. the Nebraska ANG flies out of a PUBLIC airport, with
8 KC-135 tankers that are out in full view for anyone to see out there.

Chemtrailers should do a better job verifying claims made from their own side, rather than just take something as truth just because someone who used
to work ine the government said it.

In addition to longer life expectancy, air quality is continually getting better too..

Are you freaking kidding me? Air quality is getting better you say? LMAO

You must work for Battelle .... Better for who and in comparison to what? That statement can only be true on a small scale localized level. Where some
large industrial polluter was shut down and put out of business.

The rate at which the air quality of the planet is getting worse may be slowing down but that is a far cry from it getting better.

edit on
6-11-2011 by MathiasAndrew because: edit text

Yes, it is getting better. You can find that online rather easy, particulate matter is less, there are far more pollution controls on power plants,
cars have better emission controls and engines run cleaner.

Places like Los Angeles, had far worse air quality in the 1960s. Face it, we can find data and scientific studies that show that air quality is
getting better in developed countries. Places like China have it worse, but in the US and Europe, its definitely better

This is an interesting read. Something I am leaning towards as to the reason we see so much coating of the skies....

More effective scatterers can be realized by employing that subset of materials which exhibit high
electrical conductivity. In this special case, electrons may be separated from their original locations
by any distance, and it is the magnitude of the optical-frequency current carried by these electrons
that characterize the effectiveness of such scattering materials – which are generally metals.
Employed near-optimally, tens of thousands of tons of high-conductivity metal – roughly 1% of the
required mass of dielectric materials – are required to scatter 1% of the Earth's total insolation; the
corresponding costs are $0.07-0.14 billion/year

So it is my contention that if there was "something going on" then I would know about it.

That is an abusrd assumption. How many people knew of the SR71 during its years of development? How many people knew anything about any of the stealth
projects during development? I and others are supposed to believe someone in the civilian aviation industry would somehow know something is going on
when cleary the vast majority in the militarry had no idea?

I know you like to cling to the assumption that all believers in the possiblity of chemtrails think they come from civilian aircraft and look like
contrails but we both know thats not true for all "chemmies" as you like to call us. Many of us believe the military and their R&D might be playing
around in the sky based on past projects.

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
You need to learn more before you falsely condem millions of people in the aviation industry.

So some yahoo claims pilots are poisioning us and you take it to heart and think the whole industry is being condemed.

I didn't think you took the opinion of yahoo's and the people who support them that seriously but I guess I was wrong.

So it is my contention that if there was "something going on" then I would know about it.

That is an abusrd assumption. How many people knew of the SR71 during its years of development? How many people knew anything about any of the stealth
projects during development? I and others are supposed to believe someone in the civilian aviation industry would somehow know something is going on
when cleary the vast majority in the militarry had no idea?

I know you like to cling to the assumption that all believers in the possiblity of chemtrails think they come from civilian aircraft and look like
contrails but we both know thats not true for all "chemmies" as you like to call us. Many of us believe the military and their R&D might be playing
around in the sky based on past projects.

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
You need to learn more before you falsely condem millions of people in the aviation industry.

So some yahoo claims pilots are poisioning us and you take it to heart and think the whole industry is being condemed.

I didn't think you took the opinion of yahoo's and the people who support them that seriously but I guess I was wrong.

You can not compare the F-117, which were developed in secret and then test flown out of an isolated USAF facililty out in Groom Lake Nevada, only at
night and in that immediate area. The SR-71 was publicly announced, and it flew for its first flight out of Palmdale California, and that was not
secret at all.

So we are going on 12+ years of fear mongers going on about chemtrails, with no evidence, no photographs of spray planes, no insiders, and just bad
science and faked photos?

Remember, these are aircraft supposedly numerous all around the daytime skies, over major cities and flying into all the airports and around in public
airspace. How exactly does that make a great comparison to the F-117?

You can not compare the F-117, which were developed in secret and then test flown out of an isolated USAF facililty out in Groom Lake Nevada, only at
night and in that immediate area. The SR-71 was publicly announced, and it flew for its first flight out of Palmdale California, and that was not
secret at all.

The SR-71 was a secret during its development, it was not annouced to the world that the USA is now making a super stealth to spy on its
enemies.

I think arguing over the capabilites of the US military to keep secrets is pointless becuase I could post examples of things that were kept secret all
day long.

Originally posted by firepilot
Remember, these are aircraft supposedly numerous all around the daytime skies, over major cities and flying into all the airports and around in public
airspace.

I don't believe that for a second as I have said time and time again. If, and I do mean if, there is anything happening I believe it would be based
out of a military base and happen at night. It has already been mentioned that with todays technology anything can end up on YT in a minute so I
don't believe any secret projects would be up in the sky during daylight hours and over heavily populated areas.

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