On December 3, 2013, John D Jones III wrote:
> I'm a hardcore Arch Linux user, and have been for ~6 years now. I prefer
the rolling release structure, it's bleeding edge
> yet stable. On the server end, FreeBSD 4 LYF!! I've been using it for 12,
up until I discovered Arch I ran fbsd on the
I hear a lot about Arch. Perhaps some day I'll throw it on a virtual
machine and play around with it. It sounds like it has a lot to recommend
itself. I've never tried any *BSD, but perhaps one day I will investigate
them too. They just kind of leave a bad taste in my mouth, not being Linux
flavors. :)
> And yes, I did try Gentoo, it's a fine distro, but I just got tired of
it's 'attitude' and I've
> seen nothing recently that suggests the 'attitude' has changed.
What attitude are you referring to, may I ask? I'm lost on this. :)
--- Dan
On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 12:28 PM, Dan Egli <ddavidegli at gmail.com> wrote:
> On December 3, 2013, Michael Torrie wrote:
>> > I used Maildir-formatted e-mail back with a Fedora Core 1 box. I never
>> > had the dependency problems you state. Also, I don't believe courier-imap
>> > ever was a Fedora standard package, so you can't blame Fedora for your
>> > dependency issues. I was probably using an early version of Dovecot, or
>> > maybe I just built courier myself..
>>>> Well, I know I didn't build courier myself. I know I used an RPM. I'm
> fairly sure I used apt-get to install it from the standard FC2 repos, but I
> could be wrong (and I know apt-get is usually debian based, I had apt for
> rpm installed because this was an older box that took for frigging EVER to
> run yum, where as apt ran just fine). Either way, I did specifically state
> that this was back in the days of FC2, so a lot could have changed between
> then and now. :)
>>>>>> > That said, none of the dependencies you mention are really a problem,
>> > nor really a waste. Despite your implication you're not really
>> > installing all those database systems. Rather you're just installing
>> > very small shared libraries for potentially accessing those database
>> > systems (IE the API is the only thing installed. And the cost of
>> > breaking all those small library dependencies out into separate packages
>> > is just too high. You don't want to have to have a full and complete
>> > but different version of courier-imap for each permutation of software
>> > combination! I know that goes against your gentoo sensibilities! :)
>>>> I'm quite familiar with the differences between say, openldap-<version>
> and openldap-libs-<version> and you're right that many were just the libs.
> But if my memory is correct (I could be wrong!) openldap wasn't just the
> -libs package required. Perhaps there wasn't a -libs package available to
> whoever designed the RPM (whether it was designed by the Fedora maintainers
> or someone else), but my memory says I had to install openldap itself (the
> full package) to get courier's RPM happy. And the point wasn't having all
> these DMBS packages installed, but the fact that this was a very small hard
> disk drive (< 4GB HDD if I recall, this WAS more than 12 years ago) so I
> had to REALLY prioritize what went on there, since it was a combo system to
> be my home e-mail server plus my print/file server, plus the samba server,
> plus the internet gateway. Those packages, just the libs and what ever else
> was required, used a large chunk of my HDD that I could have used for other
> purposes.
>>>> And I'm also familiar with building RPMs on systems like Fedora. I have
> personally designed custom RPMs for programs like exim because I wanted to
> get just the right feature set. I can't say I've ever used git, but doing
> configure/make/make install is something I've done quite a few times.
>>>> I do understand your point about trying to install things straight from
> tarballs though. Certainly doable on a few packages or only a couple
> servers. But not on a large setup. That's partially (_I_ think) why "Roll
> your own Linux" never really got too popular. :) Imagine downloading and
> compiling EVERYTHING from scratch, including glibc and gcc and init (or
> Systemd in more modern systems). Doable? Oh, absolutely. Doable on a large
> scale? Not so much.
>>>> --- Dan
>>> On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 12:26 PM, Dan Egli <ddavidegli at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On December 3, 2013, Levi Pearson wrote:
>>>> > If I was going to spend a bunch of time installing and learning a new
>>>> > distro, I'd try out NixOS (http://nixos.org/) which has my favorite
>>>> > concept of all the distributions. It treats package managment and
>>>> > configuration as part of the same system,
>>>>>>>> That sounds rather bizzare to me. But maybe I'm misunderstanding you on
>> that. I'll look over the site a bit, but perhaps you can explain better how
>> this package managment and configuration works combined?
>>>>>>>> Out of curosity, if it's a distribution of Linux, why are they calling it
>> something else (NixOS vs. Nix Linux)? Or, is it not so much Linux as a *NIX
>> O/S? That's what I'd guess from the name, but I could be wrong.
>>>>>>>> --- Dan
>>>>>> On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 5:48 AM, Michael Torrie <torriem at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 12/03/2013 11:10 AM, Lonnie Olson wrote:
>>> > * Mint
>>> > - Ugly, old, backwards UI choices
>>>>>> Sounds like a plus in my book. Although Mint may be the distro
>>> developing Cinnamon and Mate, the big distros now support them both out
>>> of the box. Fedora for sure has them both.
>>>>>> Despite the age of the core technologies, Mate+Compiz work best for me.
>>> And Mate can live alongside Gnome 3 and Cinnamon, so I'm not giving up
>>> anything. I still use some Gnome 3 apps.
>>>>>> Cinnamon is okay, but I like the customizations I have made in Compiz,
>>> and I have to have a pager that shows at least window outlines like
>>> Mate/Gnome2 does. I've tried to put in a feature request to Cinnamon
>>> for the pager thing, but they didn't seem to understand just what I was
>>> getting at. Ahh well. If anyone knows an extension that can give me
>>> this feature, I would very much like to know about it.
>>>>>> /*
>>> PLUG: http://plug.org, #utah on irc.freenode.net
>>> Unsubscribe: http://plug.org/mailman/options/plug>>> Don't fear the penguin.
>>> */
>>>>>>>>