alkisg: you are correct, its ancient, but it continues to work acceptibly

07:57

<alkisg>

Ah it appears to be maintained in x.org nowadays

07:57

Not in sourceforge...

07:59

<maldridge>

probably for the best, I suspect sourceforge will continue its slow death

08:11

<alkisg>

stgraber: LTSP in 15.10 will be pretty unusable as it currently ships, I see in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WilyWerewolf/ReleaseSchedule it needs an FFE to be synced now?

08:12

LDM can be synced as is from debian, but LTSP cannot, it needs a newer version than the one in debian due to systemd

08:12

So my suggestion would be to sync LDM, and to either use -trunk, or request a new LTSP release from vagrantc, I know he was considering it a few days ago...

08:15

Basically the major problems in wily, that the newer versions will fix, are (1) it won't boot at all due to overlayfs, (2) it won't login to unity because of DESKTOP_SESSION, and (3) ltsp-update-image --cleanup won't work due to overlayfs

08:15

There are other significant fixes as well, but those 3 are the blockers

08:20

stgraber: can I try running syncpackage myself for ldm, without filing an FFE?

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11:17

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work_alkisg: bugfix only releases can still get in, so if ldm only contains bugfixes, then it can be synced

15:38

work_alkisg: as for LTSP, we still have a minimal delta due to Edubuntu so it needs merging (but only takes me a few minutes to do), again if we do have a more recent release in Debian (doesn't look like we do yet) and it's bugfix only, then I can merge and upload

15:47

<vagrantc>

it'll be more than bugfixes

15:49

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15:54

<vagrantc>

stgraber: what if we removed the delta with a new upload?

15:56

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vagrantc: the postinst delta probably should stay in Ubuntu until we figure out a better place for it, doesn't really make sense having a check for Edubuntu in Debian. The rest should be fine to get in Debian and is pretty minimal: http://paste.ubuntu.com/12502919/

16:06

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16:07

<stgraber>

that Edubuntu delta can very likely be moved into an installer component instead but that's not gonna happen this cycle and it's unclear whether Edubuntu will still be a thing in the future (neither highvoltage nor I have very much time for it so we may discontinue it after 16.04)

16:08

<highvoltage>

(not even sure if 16.04 would be worth it tbh)

16:11

<stgraber>

highvoltage: so I don't have any big plans for 16.04, but I believe we still need to do it so we don't just drop the whole project on the floor overnight without giving folks an opportunity to take it over. If we were not to release 16.04, that would basically kill the entire user community in the process and prevent anyone from stepping up to lead Edubuntu in our place.

16:13

<highvoltage>

stgraber: also an LTS?

16:14

stgraber: I guess that would be reasonable, and not too much work just to keep point releases going

16:14

<stgraber>

highvoltage: yeah, that'd leave a few years for whoever want to pick up the project to figure things out and if nobody does, for our users to move to something else.

16:15

<highvoltage>

stgraber: *nod*

16:15

<stgraber>

highvoltage: my plan for 16.04 is basically to make sure everything still works, reduce our delta where we have some (basically just those few lines in LTSP) and update the version string everywhere. I'm not planning anything more major on my side.

16:16

highvoltage: it may still make sense to replace the gnome-flashback option with mate if that's easy enough to do but I don't think we should be switching the main desktop environment as I don't want to deal with the upgrade story nor have to support this for 5 years. Whoever picks up the project from us can re-evaluate the default desktop environment question and pick whatever they're willing to support.

16:17

replacing flashback with mate should only be done if we feel we'll have less potential maintenance to do on it (and I think that's the case since we're the only flashback users)

16:18

<highvoltage>

stgraber: yeah that's a tricky one. at least mate is a lot better for ltsp

16:20

<stgraber>

I'll also be splitting the samba4 manager part of edubuntu-server into its own project, move that to github and drop the rest of edubuntu server (the idea is still good I think and if somebody wants to pick it up, I'm happy to give directions to rebase it on LXD which would make things significantly easier)

16:21

<highvoltage>

stgraber: cool, yes that project would be useful for so many schools and institutions

16:22

stgraber: I briefly tried LXD on an existing LXC server and learned that it doesn't work with existing containers on my machine so I haven't played with it much yet

16:23

(hmm might as well poke around with it a bit tonight)

16:23

<stgraber>

ah yeah, we really ought to write a migration tool, I guess I'll do that when I start converting some of my own servers to it :)

16:37

<vagrantc>

stgraber: i was thinking the edubuntu file could be shipped as a separate file and checked for in postinst... would be reasonable enough.

16:37

stgraber: and then that file is only installed in the Ubuntu packages...

16:38

or better yet, only include that code in the packages built on ubuntu ...

16:38

<stgraber>

vagrantc: given how easy it is to merge, I say I just keep merging that part this cycle and I'll move that logic into the edubuntu installer next cycle (should be pretty trivial and that's where that belongs anyway, not sure why I put it in ltsp to begin with)

16:39

vagrantc: that way we should finally be delta-less next cycle

16:43

<vagrantc>

there were a few things that would have just been fixed for 14.04 and 14.10 if it had been automatically merging ... so i think it would be a service to the community to get to that point sooner than later

I don't think it's worth it to separate the bug fixes from there, I think it would be easier to just sync ldm from debian

17:24

Unity won't log in without r1577, neither in thin nor in fat clients, so it's essential for wily

17:24

As for ltsp, the bug fixes are too numerous to separate from the enchancements...

17:25

If it's possible for vagrantc to tag ltsp soonish, and for you to merge before feature freeze, I think that would be the easiest

17:25

Some of the ltsp bug fixes are essential, wily clients won't boot without them

17:26

<vagrantc>

i might have some time tomorrow to sort out tagging a new ltsp...

17:27

<stgraber>

alkisg: yeah, that ldm sound fine to sync, go ahead

17:27

<alkisg>

About edubuntu, there's a small chance that I'll get a new job, if I don't, I'd be glad to take over. Being a teacher and a sysadmin and a developer gives me some clear ideas on what can are asked from the community, and what can be done from the development side

17:27

* vagrantc wonders how hard it would be to code a --quiet flag in ltsp-config

17:27

<alkisg>

s/can/things/...

17:27

<highvoltage>

alkisg: great

17:28

<vagrantc>

stgraber, alkisg: LDM was uploaded to experimental, don't know if that complicates sync'ing or requires something more explicit

17:28

<stgraber>

vagrantc: nah, the syncpackage command allows syncing from experimental, it's only syncing from incoming which is a bit trickier :)

17:28

<vagrantc>

heh

17:29

<alkisg>

I'll try syncpackage in about an hour, if I bump into any issues I'll ping :)

17:29

<vagrantc>

or i could try to re-upload to unstable tomorrow... i think the transition that i was worried about is over now

17:55

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