Let's not allow this thread to drift down the path of vitriol that has become so common anytime the subject matter relates to Israel.

Even if one disagrees - Discretion is the better part of valor

Quoting: ClydeX

Anderson_G

<<<<<<<<<<<<LEARN ADAPT OVERCOME>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Always expect the unexpected and beware of nasty things pretending to be nice.Knowledge is Power, Power is A target, You are Dangerous with Knowledge therefore you are a Target.I Don't Hate A Race, I hate An Ideal, Race Is A Label Given To The Masses To Hate.

wasn't it said that the Iron dome only took out one of the rockets out of the 60 fired the other day

Quoting: Anderson_G

Iron dome fail.ET bone home.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 281165

No, it's the usual anti-Israeli moron Fail. LOL

Because Iron Dome ONLY intercepts those missiles that are on trajectory to hit the most populated centers, down-town, kindergardens.

Moreover, it's a brand new system (first tested in 2011). Unique in its kind, built with Israel's limited resources in record short period of time. By comparison, Russian S-300 system or American Patriot have been in design since 1960's!

Right now, Israel only has 5 including one used for training of crews (another problem because you got to train people to use it in very short period of time).

That means it's got a lot of kinds have yet to be worked out. In the beginning Iron Dome's interception rate was "only" 75%. Now it's over 90%.

The best part? The 5th battery of Iron Dome is 2.0 version which does something that Iron Dome designers didn't even plan on ---- it intercepts Fajr and Zelzal rockets, which is a big achievement. Because those rockets are more powerful and costly, suddenly 40,000 dollar Tamir interceptor used by Iron Dome sounds like a bargain.

Either way, LASER-based protection is the future, but the joint American-Israeli Nautilus project has not proven viable until 2015-2020 and have their own limitations such as cost of development, dangerous chemicals recquired for the laser to operate and the weather conditions that limit the laser dramatically.

So Israel just cannot wait for laser tech to mature in 2020. It needs protection now. Which is why Iron Dome is so welcome against cheaper Grad rockets & mortar.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 766206

ah fair enough thank you for the information

Anderson_G

<<<<<<<<<<<<LEARN ADAPT OVERCOME>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Always expect the unexpected and beware of nasty things pretending to be nice.Knowledge is Power, Power is A target, You are Dangerous with Knowledge therefore you are a Target.I Don't Hate A Race, I hate An Ideal, Race Is A Label Given To The Masses To Hate.

Sounds like more of the same - I don't think a Cast-Lead type operation is in the cards at the moment. Of course, that changes if the rocket fire continues from Gaza. But if Hamas quiets down, then this round may be about over.

Quoting: Newshunter

Well, yeah. A Gaza operation would be incredibly complex and risky -- all the more considering the kind of limitations IDF normally oprates under, both because of their own values and because of ridiculously biased world "commiunity" and envious banana republics & tyrants that comprise the General Assembly.

Thank to moronic, sold-out Kadima left-wingers in Israel and the pressure exerted on them by Washington DC and Brussels in 2005.... Gaza is basically world's biggest terror hub. With Philadelphi Corridor unsecured, the Iranian, Lybian, Muslim Bros Egyptian, Qatari arms just flowing there nonstop.

Israel periodically bombs an arms convoy from Sudan or weapons factory, but that's just papering over a deeper problem.

To remove literally DOZEN terror groups vying in control for Gaza, Israel would have to re-occupy Gaza if only temporarily.

That's a hellacious task for even a modern army like IDF. Normally, Gaza would have to be bombed for a month to "soften" the jihadis, but the hypocritical world will never allow Israel to do that.

So IDF would have to find a way to chop up Gaza into sectors while volleys of Kornet, Igla, Metis-M, snipers hiding behind civilians and all manner of mines & IEDs are literally everywhere.

Fallujah-style warfare is no picnic even for a juggernaut like the US. And Gaza is 10 times more complicated than Fallujah -- if only because the US can do whatever the fuck it wants because it's a superpower, while Israel simply is now allowed to. Fair's got nothing to do with it. It's reality.

* It does not matter who is morally right / wrong.* Hamas is in a very weak position.* Hamas is stupid to attack Israel, yet in order to keep political power it must do so.* The Palestinians, rightly or wrongly, have supported a movement that wants confrontation with their neighbor.* These attacks from Hamas continue despite repeated warnings and beat-downs by the Israeli's* The Palestinians hide behind U.N. and regional protection to avoid decimation, they expect to be able to restrain their neighbor's response via political power. So far, this has worked. * Obama's overt support of the M.B. and the distancing America from Israel means the Palestinian's political support has lost it's teeth. Israel already feels isolated.* A moderate response to Hamas's attacks will bring about exactly the same amount of isolation as a finishing attack. Thus a finishing attack should be executed.

Israel's only logical course of action is to utterly destroy the West Bank and kill / evict everyone in it. Only then will they have peace on that border.

There is no other real long-term solution because the Palestinians don't recognize Israel's right to exist.

I know this above solution will anger many of you. But the time is rapidly approaching when such measures will be taken not only in Palestine but all over the world.

Pax America is about to fall and woe to those on the losing side...even America.

Quoting: Fingulas

^^This^^ Well put!!

Patriotism is supporting your country always -- and your government when they deserve it. Mark Twain

Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who kept their swords. -Benjamin Franklin

wasn't it said that the Iron dome only took out one of the rockets out of the 60 fired the other day

Quoting: Anderson_G

Iron dome fail.ET bone home.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 281165

No, it's the usual anti-Israeli moron Fail. LOL

Because Iron Dome ONLY intercepts those missiles that are on trajectory to hit the most populated centers, down-town, kindergardens.

Moreover, it's a brand new system (first tested in 2011). Unique in its kind, built with Israel's limited resources in record short period of time. By comparison, Russian S-300 system or American Patriot have been in design since 1960's!

Right now, Israel only has 5 including one used for training of crews (another problem because you got to train people to use it in very short period of time).

That means it's got a lot of kinds have yet to be worked out. In the beginning Iron Dome's interception rate was "only" 75%. Now it's over 90%.

The best part? The 5th battery of Iron Dome is 2.0 version which does something that Iron Dome designers didn't even plan on ---- it intercepts Fajr and Zelzal rockets, which is a big achievement. Because those rockets are more powerful and costly, suddenly 40,000 dollar Tamir interceptor used by Iron Dome sounds like a bargain.

Either way, LASER-based protection is the future, but the joint American-Israeli Nautilus project has not proven viable until 2015-2020 and have their own limitations such as cost of development, dangerous chemicals recquired for the laser to operate and the weather conditions that limit the laser dramatically.

So Israel just cannot wait for laser tech to mature in 2020. It needs protection now. Which is why Iron Dome is so welcome against cheaper Grad rockets & mortar.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 766206

ah fair enough thank you for the information

Quoting: Anderson_G

You're welcome.

There is SO much ignorance, propaganda, clever disinformantion financed by Muslim-Marxist elites, so much lies and libel all over the world when it comes to Israel/Jews... it's breath-taking.

Iron Dome is just another small example of that. So I try to correct some of the basic ones.

Iron Dome is a unique system, it's very young, very sophisticated, but it was never designed to replace the OFFENSIVE capabilities or doctrine. It's definately a 2-edged sword for Israel because of false sense of security and political restrains associated with ID.

In fact, one of the reason Obama is helping finance it is because if it weren't for Iron Dome, there would already be several mini-Castlead operations in 2011-2012 because of never-ceasing rocket salvos by Gaza terrorists, including no less than 5 escalations from April 2011 to Fall of 2012.

Which would have risked igniting a war with Hezbollah maybe even Syria, Iran. Which would have also pissed off Obama's new friend Mohammed Morsi in Egypt.

Which in addition to forcing Obama to come to Israel's defense militarily, would have further tanked the US and world economy.

Which, in turn, would have caused Obama to LOSE re-election bid. I mean, he almost lost anyway -- and really, it took massive George Soros voting fraud for him to win swing states.

So that's why Iron Dome has been in the news so much both in US and Israeli Left (Ehud Barak is Defense Minister under Netanyahu, but he's an old Leftie at heart, trust me)

Because Iron Dome ONLY intercepts those missiles that are on trajectory to hit the most populated centers, down-town, kindergardens.

Moreover, it's a brand new system (first tested in 2011). Unique in its kind, built with Israel's limited resources in record short period of time. By comparison, Russian S-300 system or American Patriot have been in design since 1960's!

Right now, Israel only has 5 including one used for training of crews (another problem because you got to train people to use it in very short period of time).

That means it's got a lot of kinds have yet to be worked out. In the beginning Iron Dome's interception rate was "only" 75%. Now it's over 90%.

The best part? The 5th battery of Iron Dome is 2.0 version which does something that Iron Dome designers didn't even plan on ---- it intercepts Fajr and Zelzal rockets, which is a big achievement. Because those rockets are more powerful and costly, suddenly 40,000 dollar Tamir interceptor used by Iron Dome sounds like a bargain.

Either way, LASER-based protection is the future, but the joint American-Israeli Nautilus project has not proven viable until 2015-2020 and have their own limitations such as cost of development, dangerous chemicals recquired for the laser to operate and the weather conditions that limit the laser dramatically.

So Israel just cannot wait for laser tech to mature in 2020. It needs protection now. Which is why Iron Dome is so welcome against cheaper Grad rockets & mortar.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 766206

ah fair enough thank you for the information

Quoting: Anderson_G

You're welcome.

There is SO much ignorance, propaganda, clever disinformantion financed by Muslim-Marxist elites, so much lies and libel all over the world when it comes to Israel/Jews... it's breath-taking.

Iron Dome is just another small example of that. So I try to correct some of the basic ones.

Iron Dome is a unique system, it's very young, very sophisticated, but it was never designed to replace the OFFENSIVE capabilities or doctrine. It's definately a 2-edged sword for Israel because of false sense of security and political restrains associated with ID.

In fact, one of the reason Obama is helping finance it is because if it weren't for Iron Dome, there would already be several mini-Castlead operations in 2011-2012 because of never-ceasing rocket salvos by Gaza terrorists, including no less than 5 escalations from April 2011 to Fall of 2012.

Which would have risked igniting a war with Hezbollah maybe even Syria, Iran. Which would have also pissed off Obama's new friend Mohammed Morsi in Egypt.

Which in addition to forcing Obama to come to Israel's defense militarily, would have further tanked the US and world economy.

Which, in turn, would have caused Obama to LOSE re-election bid. I mean, he almost lost anyway -- and really, it took massive George Soros voting fraud for him to win swing states.

So that's why Iron Dome has been in the news so much both in US and Israeli Left (Ehud Barak is Defense Minister under Netanyahu, but he's an old Leftie at heart, trust me)

Quoting: Ashton's succulent Volvo 766206

I admire the restraint shown by Israel and the effort to bring about an alternative to force - however I feel time may be running abit to far forward for systems like the Iron dome to have a influential impact on the conflict

Anderson_G

<<<<<<<<<<<<LEARN ADAPT OVERCOME>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Always expect the unexpected and beware of nasty things pretending to be nice.Knowledge is Power, Power is A target, You are Dangerous with Knowledge therefore you are a Target.I Don't Hate A Race, I hate An Ideal, Race Is A Label Given To The Masses To Hate.

* It does not matter who is morally right / wrong.* Hamas is in a very weak position.* Hamas is stupid to attack Israel, yet in order to keep political power it must do so.* The Palestinians, rightly or wrongly, have supported a movement that wants confrontation with their neighbor.* These attacks from Hamas continue despite repeated warnings and beat-downs by the Israeli's* The Palestinians hide behind U.N. and regional protection to avoid decimation, they expect to be able to restrain their neighbor's response via political power. So far, this has worked. * Obama's overt support of the M.B. and the distancing America from Israel means the Palestinian's political support has lost it's teeth. Israel already feels isolated.* A moderate response to Hamas's attacks will bring about exactly the same amount of isolation as a finishing attack. Thus a finishing attack should be executed.

Israel's only logical course of action is to utterly destroy the West Bank and kill / evict everyone in it. Only then will they have peace on that border.

There is no other real long-term solution because the Palestinians don't recognize Israel's right to exist.

I know this above solution will anger many of you. But the time is rapidly approaching when such measures will be taken not only in Palestine but all over the world.

Pax America is about to fall and woe to those on the losing side...even America.

Quoting: Fingulas

^^This^^ Well put!!

Quoting: my 2 cents

Fingulas is correct in some points above, but he is also dead WRONG on the most important one: it IS important who's "right or wrong morally".

In this cinredible clusterfuck, Israel is the good guys . Israel are the morally RIGHT party. Make no mistakes about it.

Because whatever one's position on the disputed territories or peace process.... NOONE who has any sense of justice, truth or history of the region, sides with HAMAS, Islamic Jihad, PRC, PFLP, Fateh's armed wing al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigade -- nevermind the actual Salafist Al-Qaeda cells sprouting in Gaza in recent years.

Noone. Even the normally anti-Israeli Amnesty International has been recently forced to admit that EACH instance of Gaza terror groups firing rockets at Israeli population centers constitutes 2 instances of WAR-CRIME: because it targets Jewish civilians and also because by firing from civilian infrastructure in Gaza, jihadis invite their OWN people to be killed as collateral damage in retaliatory strikes.

Each instance. And there has been literally 10,000 of them in the last 10 years. That's not counting attempts at suicide bombing, sniping at highways, kidnapping, stabbings, and the HAMAS genocidal brainwashing & recqruitment of kids as young as 2 years old for "Holy War" which takes the whole idea of child abuse to a new standard of pathetic evil.

Because if one were to approach this Gaza issue from a phony "neutral", relatistiv perspective.... then it makes mockery of every good thing human beings are supposed to think and do. Everything.

Not to mention, it legitimizes real terror. So don't be surprised if in the ensuing years and decades, you will see such terror come to Europe and America. Because if HAMAS can do this, then so can disgruntled Native Americans who are even more "occupied" or so can Narco cartels in Mexico, whose businesses are also "opporessed" by gringos... so can growing Islamic population in Europe who are "denied Sharia" by kaffirs... And so on and so forth.

* It does not matter who is morally right / wrong.* Hamas is in a very weak position.* Hamas is stupid to attack Israel, yet in order to keep political power it must do so.* The Palestinians, rightly or wrongly, have supported a movement that wants confrontation with their neighbor.* These attacks from Hamas continue despite repeated warnings and beat-downs by the Israeli's* The Palestinians hide behind U.N. and regional protection to avoid decimation, they expect to be able to restrain their neighbor's response via political power. So far, this has worked. * Obama's overt support of the M.B. and the distancing America from Israel means the Palestinian's political support has lost it's teeth. Israel already feels isolated.* A moderate response to Hamas's attacks will bring about exactly the same amount of isolation as a finishing attack. Thus a finishing attack should be executed.

Israel's only logical course of action is to utterly destroy the West Bank and kill / evict everyone in it. Only then will they have peace on that border.

There is no other real long-term solution because the Palestinians don't recognize Israel's right to exist.

I know this above solution will anger many of you. But the time is rapidly approaching when such measures will be taken not only in Palestine but all over the world.

Pax America is about to fall and woe to those on the losing side...even America.

Quoting: Fingulas

^^This^^ Well put!!

Quoting: my 2 cents

Fingulas is correct in some points above, but he is also dead WRONG on the most important one: it IS important who's "right or wrong morally".

In this cinredible clusterfuck, Israel is the good guys . Israel are the morally RIGHT party. Make no mistakes about it.

Because whatever one's position on the disputed territories or peace process.... NOONE who has any sense of justice, truth or history of the region, sides with HAMAS, Islamic Jihad, PRC, PFLP, Fateh's armed wing al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigade -- nevermind the actual Salafist Al-Qaeda cells sprouting in Gaza in recent years.

Noone. Even the normally anti-Israeli Amnesty International has been recently forced to admit that EACH instance of Gaza terror groups firing rockets at Israeli population centers constitutes 2 instances of WAR-CRIME: because it targets Jewish civilians and also because by firing from civilian infrastructure in Gaza, jihadis invite their OWN people to be killed as collateral damage in retaliatory strikes.

Each instance. And there has been literally 10,000 of them in the last 10 years. That's not counting attempts at suicide bombing, sniping at highways, kidnapping, stabbings, and the HAMAS genocidal brainwashing & recqruitment of kids as young as 2 years old for "Holy War" which takes the whole idea of child abuse to a new standard of pathetic evil.

Because if one were to approach this Gaza issue from a phony "neutral", relatistiv perspective.... then it makes mockery of every good thing human beings are supposed to think and do. Everything.

Not to mention, it legitimizes real terror. So don't be surprised if in the ensuing years and decades, you will see such terror come to Europe and America. Because if HAMAS can do this, then so can disgruntled Native Americans who are even more "occupied" or so can Narco cartels in Mexico, whose businesses are also "opporessed" by gringos... so can growing Islamic population in Europe who are "denied Sharia" by kaffirs... And so on and so forth.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 766206

Not to mention that the IDF has been caught masquerading as Hamas and sending rockets into Israel.

So, if I were you dickhead, I would do some research before you open up your mouth!!!

I'm not in Canada. I'm in the USA, MORON!

Quoting: Steve5728

Dual cits, dual shits.

Your GLP flag shows Canada but thank G-d you and the rest of your delusional Askenazi fake clan are not here.

For the record I'm descended from real Sephardic Jews.

And just a reminder that Armageddon is a hill in Israel. You and yours will get what is coming to you. That much is promised.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 20720457

Sorry to interrupt the tantrum, but for the record;"Armageddon" is NOT a hill in Israel.

You may want to research Plains of Megiddo"Armageddon" is the name applied for a very specific event that will take place that region.

Job 12:7) But ask now the beasts, and they shall teach thee; and the fowls of the air, and they shall tell thee:8) Or speak to the earth, and it shall teach thee: and the fishes of the sea shall declare unto thee.