I not a Chevy Fan, but why would you pay all that money for a Corvette when you can get this at $55K and it spanks the ass of every car around it

2011 Chevrolet Camaro SLP ZL1 0-60 mph 3.1 Quarter Mile 11.0 oh let not forget for our Euro Friends who think road course are the all important measure of a cars performance 7.41.27 lap time at the Nurburgring, I think that beats all the BMW on home territory

I love it. I own a C6 now and while I love it, the new car is revolutionary for the first time since '84 in every way. The entire design is performance driven, and while it shares a lot of styling cues from other vehicles, that often has to do with function rather than perceived form.

What I didn't like initially was the taillights. It seemed like they took a giant and unnecessary leap away from a traditional Corvette identifier needlessly. When the C6 was introduced with fixed headlights, it angered a lot of people and many C5 owners didn't move forward with the new car. I can see a lot of traditional Corvette owners also not making the leap forward because this car has a lot more departures from traditionalism than any of the previous cars did. All that said, the design has grown on me considerably in just the few short days I've been able to see it. I'll probably buy a 2nd year, depending on how the new performance models look.

It is NOT a sports car (the americans still havent grasped that concept) it's just a muscle car. Loads of power in a flimsy chassis. Almost tractor like. Yes the LS series small blocks are great powerplants and 450hp is a solid output.. but I dont care for the sound.. the all new ford coyote motor spanks it for sound and engineering, too bad IT is saddled into that brutal truck.. called a mustang.

hopefully some day the american auto manufacturers will pull their heads out of their respective asses and build proper drivers cars..

It is not that flimsy of a chassis. Here's a quote from the CNN Money article that is linked on the first page:

"The car's new aluminum structure is 99 pounds lighter than the steel frame underlying today's Corvette while it's also 57% stiffer. The body is made from composite materials, including carbon fiber in the hood and roof panels."

While most American cars do not fit into the "driver's car" category, I would have to say the C6 Corvette Z06 and Mustang Boss 302 are pretty damn close considering their performance.

My god I was hoping this time would be different. I was hoping the USA would present a car to our Euopean friends that we could be proud of.

Nope. We have to wait another freaken 7 years in hopes we'll get it right then. Because we're certainly not getting it right now. It looks like it's trying too hard. Too many creases, edges and the letter V. Looks like the guys from Cadillac designed it, thinking they were designing the next Lamborghini. Thinking is the key word.

No. Supplemental AWD that isn't full time is really nothing like fwd. My point is simply that some things that have 60+ years of heritage, don't really need a paradigm shift just to conform to the wants of a few.

I'd imagine a mid engined Corvette would alienate more buyers than it would attract. However, hopefully this go around the special edition cars like the Z06 and ZR1 are given a little more unique styling than the C5 or C6 cars received.

Is that still a push rod engine?
Really?
Still?
In this day and age?
WHY!
I mean I get it old guys don't like change...hell they don't like loud kids either and still think AMC is the best thign out there.
But you know the world has changed?

I think it is a bit ott with the scoops and vents, and think that the back looks hideous. Don't like the steering wheel either.

I'm not a fan of the vents all that much either, but that car done up right in black will take care of it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malibu1

I am not sure about the tail lights. It needs more power though. 450 is lame.

Lame? Compared to what? 450 is plenty as a starting point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeyO

I was watching an old episode of Top Gear yesterday, and they were reviewing the current C6. Hammond liked it but Clarkson walked right up to it and pointed out something surprising. With his hands he pushed the rear plastic bumper inwards and it deflected a good 2 inches. It was pathetic. It was just symbolic how cheaply the fit and finish is all over the car. Just like the interior plastic. They trashed that as well. Oh and the leaf spring suspension also. Clarkson said Kurt Douglas used a similar suspension setup while running his chariot around the track in Sparticus.

Watching TGUK and taking their auto commentary as gospel is kinda like watching MSNBC or Fox News and expecting to actually get the news.

Quote:

Originally Posted by veloziROTHTOR

well it's 50k, you gotta lose out somewhere. can't expect the build quality of a 911tt

Seems like a very simple concept lost on a lot of people here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Year's_End

The interior just has to be passable. It's a fucking Corvette; you don't buy it so you can gawk at some trim bezels and diamond quilted leather.

Yeah first thing I thought when I saw the new interior was that I hope they didn't divert too many resources and add too much to the bottom line with it the way it was, because you'll now get hit either on the sticker or by resources having been diverted from performance oriented development to interior materials and design. It's a Vette, not a Roller.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cuiter23

It is an improvement, but too supercar looking for what it actually is...

What is it actually then? What defines "supercar"? Performance? What cars are in the performance category of the C7 and its variants? I'll agree it lacks the exclusivity aspect, but it doesn't fall short in the performance category (C6), and I fully expect the C7 to exceed the bar set by its predecessor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rowdy

It is NOT a sports car (the americans still havent grasped that concept) it's just a muscle car. Loads of power in a flimsy chassis. Almost tractor like. Yes the LS series small blocks are great powerplants and 450hp is a solid output.. but I dont care for the sound.. the all new ford coyote motor spanks it for sound and engineering, too bad IT is saddled into that brutal truck.. called a mustang.

hopefully some day the american auto manufacturers will pull their heads out of their respective asses and build proper drivers cars..

The Corvette, not a driver's car...? Are you mad...? And like Jason mentioned, what about the BOSS? Have you had any serious seat time in either the Z06 or the BOSS?

Quote:

Originally Posted by MediaArtist

Are people really criticizing the turn signal stalk?

You know a car has done pretty good when someone has to go to that length.

Yes of course we are. What else would you be staring at, considering since you are on a BMW forum, you must already be able to handle the whole of the drivetrain and chassis, while stroking the dash with your face and licking your beautiful turn signal stalks, all the while turning 6 minute laps at the Ring using only your johnson to steer?

The comments about it being ugly or sounding like shit, etc... those are all normal and expected.... But the comments about it not being able to handle or questionable materials being used in a 50k car which runs with MUCH more expensive competition.... Not to mention that 450HP is seemingly "not enough" for the BASE version.... How many BMWs are there with even the power:weight of that base version....?

Looks great, specs are great, they've improved upon areas where it was highly maligned in the past.... Nothing to see here, just the evolution of an icon in the industry.... But OH THE STALKS, NOT THE STALKS!!!!!!!!

As a c6 z06 owner there are certain things I like and dont like about the new c7. I'm not a fan of the back end although its growing on me. The styling lines of the c7 are quite aggressive but then again it was never intended to be a conservative looking car. It should be cool to see them on the road.

No one is debating this car is a track beast. OP's title is car is "UGLY" hence we are talking looks only.

That's kind of dumb because looks are subjective. Have you heard of the expression : "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."?
That's why the op likes the F30 and I think it's ugly. And if someone had a thread saying, my lord the F30 is ugly, all the BMW fanbois will call him a troll.

I'm being honest, i like the Corvette's interior better than the F30's. The current auto gear selector on non M cars looks hideous.

You know a car has done pretty good when someone has to go to that length.

I've see two pictures of the Corvette. (The two pictures in this thread) I could make a decent list of issues from those two interior shots. The turn signal stalk was an example of their thought and/or execution process. It hasn't changed in decades.

Kind of like Porsche's thinking when it comes to ignition placement, hasn't changed and was designed that way for a purpose. Sometimes, change is good....there are no more Le Mans starts! However, what they have done is update the buttons, switches, levers, etc... from the first beetle.

I can't imagine you would be thrilled about spending all that money on the RS to find it still has a 1985 Beetle turn signal stalk and interior buttons.

Again, the gripe isn't about the stalk itself. It's about them being ok with cutting corners like that. Because of this, speaking of interiors, they won't be on par with companies like Audi until they change that way of thinking. And don't talk to me about cost savings.... they have used the same suspension design for decades as well. And as someone else mentioned, a push rod motor. They're not throwing a ton of cash at R&D.

In short, for those lacking in reading comprehension, my post is about the manufacturer rather than what was manufactured.

Don't get me wrong, i can find gripes about all car interiors. The Audi A6 is horrible for the most part but they have a few glimmers of genius. The A3 i had my driving experience in was superb as well as the new TT. The 2012 911GTS is horrible for the most part. The gauge layout is among the best though. Mini Countryman is ok but some of the decisions they made are laughable. The interior in my 97JK Wrangler is actually very nicely laid out. Funny that it has the same turn signal stalk as the new corvette. But then it's a jeep, with removable top.... and doors.... The large buttons actually make sense in a off road vehicle.

One of the best interior layouts has got to be a SCREW F150. Albeit the fit and finish and material selection leave something to be desired but the layout is fantastic. I like the E92 interior pretty well but what has to be the best auto interior for everyday use with regards to fit and finish, layout, ergonomics etc... is the E46 M3. Simple and elegant without any shouting.

Edit: For the ignorant asses who make assumptions, i figured that i should add that i'm actually a Corvette fan. I really like them, they way the look, the way they sound and the general concept of the car. However, my back ground is in Industrial Design and these details tend to jump out at me.

__________________

-Joe

"Government is the great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else." — Frédéric Bastiat

That's kind of dumb because looks are subjective. Have you heard of the expression : "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."?
That's why the op likes the F30 and I think it's ugly. And if someone had a thread saying, my lord the F30 is ugly, all the BMW fanbois will call him a troll.

I'm being honest, i like the Corvette's interior better than the F30's. The current auto gear selector on non M cars looks hideous.

What is dumb? that people have different opinions on what looks good..well duuh thanks Captain obvious.

Ofcourse its subjective...doesnt mean it cant be debated and in the OT almost anything goes

Is that still a push rod engine?
Really?
Still?
In this day and age?
WHY!
I mean I get it old guys don't like change...hell they don't like loud kids either and still think AMC is the best thign out there.
But you know the world has changed?

Why>? Putting the cam in the block and actuating the valves with pushrods (through rockers) works really well. The main advantage is that, especially in a V engine, there's only one camshaft. Also, the camshaft drive is a lot shorter which gives better accuracy in timing. Chevrolet stuck with the pushrod engine because they also tend to be smaller. There's no camshaft up above and no cam sprocket. On a V engine, that makes it both lower, narrower and lighter.

Technology is NOT always an improvement..DOHC and SOHC have their advantages..but tried and true muscle cars still use pushrods for a reason.