Gee folks, I never meant that I didn't want to be told that an event or sighting took place, with or without 'proof'. I place as much faith in one sighting as the next, and do not discount anyones word of an event. And the more information that comes in and is shared, the better for all.

I think what some of us find annoying is the type of dialog where the poster not only tells you of his/her experience, but then orders you to "understand" it the same way that they did. I am vexed when someone adds personal ideology to information.

If you were a police officer investigating a car crash and I were the witness, you would find it most helpful to reconstructing the accident if I kept my statements based on what I saw or noticed during the incident. You would most likely be irritated if I went on to tell you how an angel had told me to stand on that corner so I would be there to inform the police that the reason for all these accidents was rampant Satanism in America.

"An individual who intentionally lies (especially about themselves) usually does so since there is a actual feeling of grandure that one feels when acting out the lie. It's actually a high for many individuals. It's like their drug. These are the "I've done that", "I've been this", "I know this person", "I know that person", "I'm all this and I'm all that", etc., and the Internet is full of them. It's simply narcissism and here are the symptoms.

1. has a grandiose sense of self-importance2. is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love3. believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by other special people4. requires excessive admiration strong sense of entitlement5. takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends6. lacks empathy7. is often envious or believes others are envious of him or her8. arrogant affect

The sad thing here is that they are the way they are (usually always) because of the actions of others. In most cases you'll find a tremendous lack of self-esteem and self-worth that was instilled by a set of parents who shouldn't have been parents. Many times it's created by siblings and teachers and even through molestation and the like. It's very repairable and requires maybe one visit to a psychiatrist who simply shows the individual how they got that way and shows them that it wasn't their fault and to catch themselves when they begin to fabricate a new lie and eventually it will all go away. Essentially, the psychiatrist is diagnosing their problem and describing it to them in a fashion that they can now understand. The part that remains unrepairable is the low self-esteem and low self-worth. That takes certainly more then one visit to repair, if ever.

Unfortunately, too many lies are being told in respect to UFO's, aliens and the government for all those reasons. When we have too many lies flying around the Internet, it hurts our trek because more then anything it's simply a lack of knowledge and ends up as a conspiracy theory. Once it's a conspiracy theory and one entrenches themself in it, it grows rapidly through forums and websites. When something gets big, it gets a lot of attention. Then the cycle continues and the size of the circle within that cycle is greater.

It appears, according to your information that the above quoted would apply to me. As sad as it is- I agree with you on several levels- and disagree with you many more levels greater (narcissistic grandiosity- yet again).

I am not running around lying and killing people and animals. I am not judging people and incarcerating them. I am not trying to rule the world by force and deception.

I would rather be this screwed up mental defective narcissistic jagoff then someone educated- like you.

Please refrain from feeling sorry for the likes of me- I feel fine.

My screwed up childhood has not changed the fact of how bad things are or how bad they are going to get. In fact, everything thing going on in the world has nothing to do with me. My perception is no different than a healthy nurtured person's.

The entire world is in trouble and it is not my (seemingly) mentally challenged perception! IT'S FACT.

I just found this thread, from months ago. I just wanted to say that I certainly appreciate the posts from GFORCE (and many others). I'm a bit new here , but IMO you have some exceptionally nice and intelligent members.

Slow down guys, this is a heavy post that is extremely clinical, put down the scalpels please. If I had read a post such as this one when I first started my search over a year ago I would have run for the hills lol, you have to remember that there are people like me who had no interest in ufo ect until something turned their world upside down that set them on a quest to obtain answers to what they had witnessed or had done to them. Yes you get a large percentage of B/S on the web that can be frustrating at times but sometimes out of the B/S rises the phoenix , for instance I was reading a story today that led me to a web page about car tires where I learnt about tire dates and the recommended shelf life of a tire and it scared me to think that what I thought was a good tire was really an instrument of death, the point is that if I had not trolled the B/S then I would still be ignorant to the facts I learned about tires that may someday save myself or my children’s lives. Disbelief or belief its all down to the readers choice at the time of reading so please do not dissect before it is written.

people get confused with facts and theory. There are a lot of theories. All UFO info is just theories until we have one to study. Until then ALL is theory.....

This is only partially true. Those with abduction experiences alone hold solid facts. Now the fact is that these facts are not fact for anyone but the abductee and only if the abductee is indeed telling the truth. Some of these experiences have evidence (such as radiation poisoning and scorched earth etc.) which strongly support the claims. This evidence helps solidify the fact that these experiences are plausible. But remember theory is always theory until it is proven through experience and experiment. Confused?

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PC the E.T.Blogging about all things alien at http://ufobservers.blogspot.com: The Underground Forum for Observers, a personal blog of exploration into the unknown.

people get confused with facts and theory. There are a lot of theories. All UFO info is just theories until we have one to study. Until then ALL is theory.....

Let us not forget that the very word theory (and its definition) are human constructs. The scientific method says you must prove a theory in order for it to stand as truth. Science is another human construct. It doesn't necessarily have any bearing on reality or truth.

I'm new here and its good to see people with insightful posts. I usually expect the mixture of moonbeams, crystals and religion. On the issue of facts or theories, I will throw out something. There are tens of thousands of photos and videos of UFOs and new ones every day. Do UFOs exist? I would say this is a fact since only one of these has to be real (a high certainty) for this to be a fact.

Are they alien? Less certainty but highly probable. The reason is that they have exhibited behavior that is orders of magnitude greater than technology we would expect humans to have (both past and present). Even our military can't jump in technology like that. We can't have jet fighters that go 1500mph then jump to 15,000 mph the next year or even ten years. Rockets are different.

I consider something a fact when there is high probability that the theory fits and high certainty based on evidence. As an example, lets say that 1000 people have used Windows with no problems (mostly at Microsoft, I suppose) then the 1001st person clicks it the right way and the computer locks up. Would you say it is is theory only that there is a bug in Windows (possibly on the first report)? If is true that the correct clicks can lock up the computer and this can happen on different computers (video and still cameras for UFOs) then I would take it as fact. Absolute proof can come later.

For UFOs we need to have only one real bit of evidence to be right and they can't all be fake.Well, just MO.

Welcome to the forum babble. I hope you will enjoy reading and contributing to the discussions.

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"We are not human beings on a spiritual journey, we are spiritual beings on a human journey." Stephen Covey

eedisonikkGuest

Re: FACT OR THEORY?« Reply #27 on: Feb 6th, 2009, 8:34pm »

Let's see?, instead of running around confused and undecided , let's just accept the Alien Question as True Facts being covered up in a colossal way because it is being covered up from the people for Sinister purposes.I can't blame true skeptics , but debunkers are a different story , they know Aliens are real they are just getting paid to lie to the citizens so that nobody out there is really in the loop. You see if the Aliens want to eliminate you all they cannot disclose this information.

Life is full of millions of souls drifting on an endless ocean in the Quest for God

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Re: FACT OR THEORY?« Reply #28 on: Feb 23rd, 2009, 11:18am »

Since ATO has explained Fact vs Theory vs Fiction and done a great job at not only explaining it but confusing me as well. I will only add that the reason I'm here is to search for not only the truth, but to have greater understanding on the topics at hand. To meet like minded people and learn from their experiences. Nothing more, nothing less. I don't want nor need groupies who think I'm an intellictual God and know everything here. Well.... maybe....naw. I have 4 dogs who think I'm god and a wonderful lady at home who pretends I am. I think I've just perfected chee. Uh oh I hope I spelled chee right. The Watcher is watching!I appreciate d facts more than the theories. Gives less guessing.

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Life is full of millions of souls drifting on an endless ocean in the Quest for God

My son started secondary school this year, and his history teacher's first topic was Roswell. Shocked? Yeah, so was I. As a long standing UFO-nut I was delighted that his class would be looking into UFOs, aliens and crashed debris on the desert plains of New Mexico (although, thankfully, I didn't have to pay out the plane fare for a field trip! )

Of course, the topic was being presented to show the class the difference between historically determined 'fact', and events that were less easy to establish as 'fact'. I think this is the same point as is raised on this thread. At the end of the day, despite what may be written in history books, what is considered as 'fact' is only a consensus of opinion based upon evidence. Given the amazing secrecy cultures beloved of our governments, how can we ever be sure what is real, despite what they might tell us is the correct version of history? After all, none of us are in possession of all the facts, and never will be.