Hot Tub Forum

Many of you know (from another thread I have here) that my wife and I are in the market as first time purchasers (both of us grew up with Hot Spring and Sundance).

Iíve gathered a bunch of great info in our search process so far, mostly on other brands besides D1. Dimension One continues to be of great interest to us. We read lots interesting info in their marketing and I consistently see positive reviews when I search online. That said, most threads/reviews are years old. There are a series of videos on YouTube posted by Wild Rose Hot Tubs with nice promotional footage for D1.

So, letís talk about D1. Their Bay collection is exotic. Theyíre going for it, and theyíve piqued our interest. Itís a 1.5 hour drive for us to go see them in person and wet test, so I want to get the skinny before we commit to a trip. The Executive from the Reflections collection is also interesting to us in case we love D1 but decide we donít like Bay.

The tubs on our list from D1 are (in order of ďpaper rankĒ):ēSarena BayēAmore BayēExecutiveēLotus Bay

So, time for some questions:

ēWhat would you pay for each of the above tubs?

ēWould you buy a D1 with the dealer being 1.5 hours away?

ēTheir marketing indicates that the water effects are interchangeable. Is that accurate?

ē5 pumps is a lot - is this a good thing in that we donít have to divert power as much and have less stress on each pump? Or is it a bad thing in that we have more parts to fail?

ēWhatís the deal with Echo switches? Gimmick or nice? Do you use them?

D1 are really nice spas. The Amore Bay is one of my favorite spas out there. I'm a little fuzzy on their pricing but I would guess $15k to $17k range for it depending on a few factors.

The jets are very good. The sequencer is pretty cool. The switches to me are a bit gimmicky but certainly a neat design. The fountains are indeed interchangeable but personally, I think they are silly. Who wants water fountains shooting in the air and splashing while soaking in a hot tub? The do look pretty darn cool though.

The 5 pump thing doesn't necessarily correlate to stronger jets because only 3 are jet pumps and 2 of them are small circulation pumps. One is for filtering and the other is for the fountains. The contours to the loungers are fantastic and super comfortable. Maybe my favorite "loungers" though they are more like adirondaks than true loungers. This is a great thing for people who float in normal loungers. They are also sort of "his & hers" since one is a little longer than the other.

They do a lot of little things really well that are hard to appreciate until you have one. For instance, they have air bleeders up top to relieve an airlock. Trust me when I say this is a godsend to a homeowner who isn't very handy and gets an airlock. Honestly, even if you are handy it's still super nice to have. They have always been an engineering kind of company and constantly innovating really cool stuff. They have some ridiculous amount of hot tub patents.

All in all, D1 makes an amazing hot tub that is absolutely gorgeous and very user focused. I really want to love them and on paper they should be my favorite. Unfortunately, in my experience they are a bit overpriced and we had too many service issues. Also, it takes forever to get parts and their support in that regard could be very frustrating. I suspect this has a lot to do with being bought out by jacuzzi group and moving production to mexico.

They also use (or at least did) gecko electronics which I really don't like at all. Overly complicated and some really dumb design decisions. I don't recall the specifics but there was something that would happen occasionally requiring a "factory reset" which required the customer to remove the access panel and find a button that was not really obvious. Sorry my memory is fuzzy but I just remember it being unreasonably complicated and difficult for customers to figure out but not covered under warranty to send a tech out to do.

I haven't used the new control panel yet, so no comment. It looks damn nice though.

Their water treatment system at the top end was fine but didn't seem any better than any other companies best systems. Arguably worse than some I've seen, though they certainly talk like it's the best.

So to answer your question regarding purchasing from a dealer 1.5 hours away, I would personally be nervous due to the amount of service issues we have. I admit that my experience is sort of anecdotal in that I only sold them a year or so and I haven't heard much bad about them from other people. I've also seen quite a few pretty old D1's out in the field but again, I suspect things changed for the worse after the buyout. I say check them out because their bay series are truly incredible spas. Maybe express your concerns about service and the fact that they are so far away and see how the dealer handles it. They also may have finally settled into a rhythm with all of the changes and all of the issues that I experienced may very well have been temporary and resolved.

...The fountains are indeed interchangeable but personally, I think they are silly. Who wants water fountains shooting in the air and splashing while soaking in a hot tub? The do look pretty darn cool though. ...

First - awesome response. I almost didnít highlight this above portion because there is so much helpful info in your response that cutting it out doesnít do it justice :) Thank you for sharing such great feedback.

On the highlighted portion above, I agree. Those fountains look great in a picture. My toddler would like them. Wife and I? Hmmm.... Actually, thatís why I ask about the interchanging. Some of the other water features from D1 are actually really attractive to us. The Babbling Brook and Gieser (sorry I donít remember the exact names) seem to give some nice background noise based on videos on YouTube, and they also seem to look pretty nice - without being as intrusive as the massive fountain effects.

We will be sure to ask about service when we visit. The price is a jump, and it would for sure need to be worth it.

Your info on the recliners was exactly what I suspected and was hoping someone could confirm. That sounds exactly like what weíve been looking for in our search.

Canít really add much more then Sam. He did a great job on his post. The Sarena Bay to me is one of the most comfortable tubs I have ever sat in. Lots of power. D-1 has always made a great tub. Like Sam said they did ha e some usurps when they were first acquired by the Apollo Group. That was 5 years ago give or take so I would assume they took care of those issues. Definetely worth a visit and a talk with dealer. One of the things I would stress would be on travel charges for both in warranty and out of warranty. Another thing I remember about the Bay series is the price. Iím on the East Coast so obviously shipping charges are considerably more out here but I think that Sam probably you figures that maybe a bit low on that series. I have seen some quotes approaching 18k-19k on some of those tubs. Good luck in your search

I'm with you 100% BUT that's just us, others really care when shopping as they can be a point of sale eye-catcher, whether they care later is debatable ;).

Right, Iím with you guys. Hence, the interchangeable question. We like the ambient noise of water (not just in a hot tub, even in an indoor fountain, for instance). But we think the babbling brook, for instance, would be more practical in the tub than the massive fountains. For instance, we prefer the Sundance and Jacuzzi waterfalls over the Hot Spring design - we want the audible effects (and the visuals are nice), but not so much the actual fountain itself.

The babbling brook one is actually really cool and I should mention that I really like that one.

Thanks, Sam. Iím stil not quite 100% clear on this - if I donít like the spraying fountain things, can I swap them out for a babbling brook or another water feature of my choice?

If yes, is that something that has to be done when I place my order, or is it something I can do myself at home after taking delivery (and/or repeatedly over time, if we want to make adjustments down the road)?

There are 3 "fountain" locations. One is meant to be the babbling brook and the shell is molded to facilitate that. The other 2 are actual arcing fountains that have interchangeable heads. You can turn on just the brook and leave the fountains off independently.

There are 3 "fountain" locations. One is meant to be the babbling brook and the shell is molded to facilitate that. The other 2 are actual arcing fountains that have interchangeable heads. You can turn on just the brook and leave the fountains off independently.

Thank you. What is interchangeable with the heads? What is the result of changing heads? What options are there when changing these heads?

D1 are really nice spas. The Amore Bay is one of my favorite spas out there. I'm a little fuzzy on their pricing but I would guess $15k to $17k range for it depending on a few factors.

The jets are very good. The sequencer is pretty cool. The switches to me are a bit gimmicky but certainly a neat design. The fountains are indeed interchangeable but personally, I think they are silly. Who wants water fountains shooting in the air and splashing while soaking in a hot tub? The do look pretty darn cool though.

The 5 pump thing doesn't necessarily correlate to stronger jets because only 3 are jet pumps and 2 of them are small circulation pumps. One is for filtering and the other is for the fountains. The contours to the loungers are fantastic and super comfortable. Maybe my favorite "loungers" though they are more like adirondaks than true loungers. This is a great thing for people who float in normal loungers. They are also sort of "his & hers" since one is a little longer than the other.

They do a lot of little things really well that are hard to appreciate until you have one. For instance, they have air bleeders up top to relieve an airlock. Trust me when I say this is a godsend to a homeowner who isn't very handy and gets an airlock. Honestly, even if you are handy it's still super nice to have. They have always been an engineering kind of company and constantly innovating really cool stuff. They have some ridiculous amount of hot tub patents.

All in all, D1 makes an amazing hot tub that is absolutely gorgeous and very user focused. I really want to love them and on paper they should be my favorite. Unfortunately, in my experience they are a bit overpriced and we had too many service issues. Also, it takes forever to get parts and their support in that regard could be very frustrating. I suspect this has a lot to do with being bought out by jacuzzi group and moving production to mexico.

They also use (or at least did) gecko electronics which I really don't like at all. Overly complicated and some really dumb design decisions. I don't recall the specifics but there was something that would happen occasionally requiring a "factory reset" which required the customer to remove the access panel and find a button that was not really obvious. Sorry my memory is fuzzy but I just remember it being unreasonably complicated and difficult for customers to figure out but not covered under warranty to send a tech out to do.

I haven't used the new control panel yet, so no comment. It looks damn nice though.

Their water treatment system at the top end was fine but didn't seem any better than any other companies best systems. Arguably worse than some I've seen, though they certainly talk like it's the best.

So to answer your question regarding purchasing from a dealer 1.5 hours away, I would personally be nervous due to the amount of service issues we have. I admit that my experience is sort of anecdotal in that I only sold them a year or so and I haven't heard much bad about them from other people. I've also seen quite a few pretty old D1's out in the field but again, I suspect things changed for the worse after the buyout. I say check them out because their bay series are truly incredible spas. Maybe express your concerns about service and the fact that they are so far away and see how the dealer handles it. They also may have finally settled into a rhythm with all of the changes and all of the issues that I experienced may very well have been temporary and resolved.

Not much to add since I don't sell against nor have I ever sold D1 but I can confirm the control panel is very nice, I believe it is called the A1000 and you'll be seeing it a lot this year and next on a lot of premium brands (excluding those that use proprietary parts of course) Bullfrog will be using it on their A-Series, I got to play around with it in Vegas last month at the trade show and it was very nice!

I think you will be thrilled with D1, problems in the past are exactly that now, in the past...

I would assume this too. I hope I didn't sound like I was bashing them. They really are some of my favorite spas out there. Just trying to provide my honest opinion and experiences and there was certainly some frustration.

I just need to find a D1 dealer who will respond to me. Have emailed twice, talked to 3 different associates who ďpromisedĒ their D1 specialist would contact me, and left 3 voicemails. Itís been three weeks and I call about 3x/wk to leave a VM or talk to an associate (but never the main D1 guy who can have a meaningful convo with me). The company will not connect. The service guy is great - called me from his personal phone after hours and talked for about 30 minutes - but I canít talk to anyone in sales who knows anything about D1. Itís a 1.75 hour drive to get to the store so I want to talk before driving there.

Honestly, that would be a big enough red flag on the dealer that I would probably eliminate them from contention. If they can't return your call with the prospect of a $15k sale, what will happen when it's a service issue or operational question? I'll give people the benefit of doubt once or twice but this appears to be egregious.

This is what Iím so torn on. The sales team seems rough. The service guy, however seems great! So maybe service would be excellent after purchase? Going to give them through next week to see. Maybe things are crazy with people out around the holiday period?

We also reached out to the one other D1 dealer I can find in Ohio (really? Are there only 2 D1 dealers in all of Ohio!?).

If you have a good local service guy then can you not negotiate the best deal you can with the dealer and then not have to deal with them again?

I would try contacting D1 directly and feel them out on the warranty questions. Can your local service guy do the warranty work? Ask them about those service issues from years past. Guessing they will have a scripted answer for that, but at least you will get a feel.

I would also consider letting them know about your difficulties getting a hold of the dealer. They won't be happy to hear that their dealers are not following up on unsolicited leads!?!?

Honestly, that would be a big enough red flag on the dealer that I would probably eliminate them from contention. If they can't return your call with the prospect of a $15k sale, what will happen when it's a service issue or operational question? I'll give people the benefit of doubt once or twice but this appears to be egregious.

I would agree, slightly alarming...I'm in sales and If i get a notification on my phone about a 'lead' either calling or emailing I'll literally pull off the road if I'm driving to call them back immediately. If you submit a 'request' to our own local website (those leads are live, meaning once they hit send I get it immediately) I'm calling you if it's 8:00 pm at night, cause I know you're in front of the computer looking at spas. Are you sure you're calling the right number? lol something just doesn't add up

If you have a good local service guy then can you not negotiate the best deal you can with the dealer and then not have to deal with them again?

I would try contacting D1 directly and feel them out on the warranty questions. Can your local service guy do the warranty work? Ask them about those service issues from years past. Guessing they will have a scripted answer for that, but at least you will get a feel.

I would also consider letting them know about your difficulties getting a hold of the dealer. They won't be happy to hear that their dealers are not following up on unsolicited leads!?!?

I just sent a text to the service guy asking if he has any idea what is going on. We'll see what he comes back with. I'll be sure to let D1 know this dealer isn't trying to sell their tubs, too. Your note about only having to work with the dealer a little bit is actually the only reason I'm still considering these guys. I figure they can make some money off me on the orignal sale, that's fine - and then from then on, I'll be calling the service guy (and he may go through them, which is fine, as long as I am talking with him because he is super responsive).

Honestly, that would be a big enough red flag on the dealer that I would probably eliminate them from contention. If they can't return your call with the prospect of a $15k sale, what will happen when it's a service issue or operational question? I'll give people the benefit of doubt once or twice but this appears to be egregious.

I would agree, slightly alarming...I'm in sales and If i get a notification on my phone about a 'lead' either calling or emailing I'll literally pull off the road if I'm driving to call them back immediately. If you submit a 'request' to our own local website (those leads are live, meaning once they hit send I get it immediately) I'm calling you if it's 8:00 pm at night, cause I know you're in front of the computer looking at spas. Are you sure you're calling the right number? lol something just doesn't add up

Agree - it's so odd. Only thing I can think of is they're a member here on this forum and have decided I'm too high maintenance of a customer for them ;D

They have two locations. Their website "Call Now" button sends you to location A. Location A has always been super nice and pretty responsive. The first person I spoke to took down all of my information (name, number, email) and said he was going to line up a wet test for me in the Amore Bay and Sarena Bay - but would need to use both locations (and would drive us back and forth between the locations - wow, that's nice). Wanted to get my info so he could call me back with a date once he had everything coordinated. I send an email to location A to follow up (based on the address on their site) - and I never hear back).

Two weeks went by and I never heard back. I called back to location A and they said they would need to connect me with location B for D1 conversations. I said I'd call over there and they said don't worry - we have your info (remembered me from first conversation) and will send it to location B and have them call you.

Two days go by and I don't hear anything. I call back in to location A to make sure I wasn't mixed up. They apologize and say location B will call me before the end of the day. Nobody calls.

The next day, I call location B - and get an associate who works on fireplaces, not hot tubs, but she tries to answer some of my questions. She is super friendly - but not able to get specific with wet test opportunities and or pricing. Plays a game of telephone with the sales manager, but would not put him on the phone to talk to me directly. Finally, I give her my info, and also get an email address from her (different from location A, and I confirm it twice) and send that email address all of my details. I never hear back on that email.

That night, service guy from location B calls me on my cell phone and apologizes for missing me earlier in the day (?). I explain that I'm in the market to buy, and don't want to waste his time since I don't have any service needs (yet), but he proceeds to chat with me for about 30 minutes giving me general info, and gives me the specific name of the sales manager to ask for at location B.

I call location B again 2 days later, no answer, leave a VM.One more day, another VM.2 days pass, another VM.3 days pass, I send another email to both email addresses (location A, location B). No response.

That's been about 3 days, I believe. I texted the service guy just now and he replied in the time that it took me to write this - gives me another number and another name to ask for. Fingers crossed that this one works out.

Meanwhile, the other D1 dealership that I can find in Ohio seems great - they are really friendly and responsive. Unfortunately, they are transitioning to a new location right now - and won't be set back up until March.

D1 is making it tough to buy a tub :-) Maybe we'll end up with Hot Spring/Jacuzzi/Sundance just because they are purchasable, lol (to be fair, we also like those three other brands, we just really want to give D1 a shot before pulling the trigger).

I'm the same way as most of the dealers on hear. I get a email and I automatically respond right away unless it's a holiday or I'm on vacation. If I'm away the Emails get sent to one of the salespeople in my office and they do the same. Would definitely give me second thoughts about purchasing a tub from them. For whatever reason it seems D1 doesn't have a large dealer base (at least compared to most other high end brands). There is a dealers about a half hour from me of them but I don't think there is another anywhere close to me. For comparison there is 4 Hot Spring dealers whithin a hour and a half from me, 3 Marquis dealers, 4 Caldera Dealers, 3 Sundance dealers and a couple of Bullfrog dealers

Good news, I reached out to "Location A" of the closest D1 dealer, and they apologized again and said they're really confused. The guy promised he would personally dig in to it for me.

Got a call from "Location B" about an hour later - he thinks their call routing is messed up so that calls are not routing to their sales floor. I hope it's true and it's just an honest mistake.

He talked to me for a really long time and clearly really likes Viking. He does also have the Amore Bay on the floor wet ready to be tested.

I'm not sure if this guys is really, really honest, or if he's trying to turn a huge profit here. Do these prices seem reasonable? I looked up other prices but they are all back from the ~2005 timeframe and I'm guessing things have changed.

Those D1 prices appear to be inline with what I have heard they sell for, but I do not have direct knowledge of their pricing. The Viking price to me seems really really high. I have nothing against Viking because I think they make a fine basic hot tub, but I could not justify spending $10k on them.

Those D1 prices appear to be inline with what I have heard they sell for, but I do not have direct knowledge of their pricing. The Viking price to me seems really really high. I have nothing against Viking because I think they make a fine basic hot tub, but I could not justify spending $10k on them.

Thanks so much. Not really too serious about Viking, but he was pushing it - and this was a good way to check his honesty. Odd that he'd be in the ballpark for D1s but so far off on Viking.

It sounds like this is a major "proceed with caution" in terms of this specific dealer. At least he has the Amore Bay that we can test. Is it fair to say the Amore and Sarena are similar enough inside (in terms of sculpting of the lounger seats, jets, etc) that sitting in the Amorea lounger will be reflective of what the Sarena would be like? We just can't find *anyone* who has a Sarena that we can wet test.

Also - was just reading a D1 manual online (an old one, from 2004 was all I could find), and that sport seat idea is interesting. Is that still available? I found an old thread here from years ago that indicated it was discontinued, figured I'd ask if maybe it was back?

Seriously, bad comms with that dealer and leads must cost them a ton of business. Many people are just not that patient about that sort of perceived blow-off but I do get the idea if it's a great rated tub / company and local service is friendly, helpful and responsive when you've to yet buy anything.

Now that you've had that intial contact, I'd just tell him very directly that you do trust there was some call routing goof up's or confusion and ask for a personal # for that guy so you know it'll never happen again or if it does, his excuse is balony and at least you know NOT to trust them.

I did a recent visit to HTU and seen a favorable or hopeful comment regarding D1 as Chris W. mentioned the new leadership is the son and he is making it a priority to turn around the reputation that (I assume) must have slipped some in recent years.

$10k for a viking seems a bit crazy to me. They are perfectly fine spas on the low end but if you're willing to drop $10k there are just so many other options out there that I can't imagine picking a viking.

As for the sarena bay, I think the loungers are very similar to those in the amore but the the rest of the spa is going to be significantly different. Honestly, I don't like the way the sarena has those very enclosed seats. They feel kinda weird. I absolutely love the amore though. It may very well be my favorite overall spa out there.

$10k for a viking seems a bit crazy to me. They are perfectly fine spas on the low end but if you're willing to drop $10k there are just so many other options out there that I can't imagine picking a viking.

As for the sarena bay, I think the loungers are very similar to those in the amore but the the rest of the spa is going to be significantly different. Honestly, I don't like the way the sarena has those very enclosed seats. They feel kinda weird. I absolutely love the amore though. It may very well be my favorite overall spa out there.

They are attempting (a horrible horrible idea in my opinion) to go 'higher end' One of their reps roped me in their booth a couple months ago at the Pool & Spa show in Vegas and was trying to get me to order a truckload...multiple pumps, more lights, stereos, more jets, fancy proprietary sub-structures, etc. problem is they are still using thermo plastic or whatever it's called for their shells which for YEARS have had fading and other issues. If guys in the industry saw the current 2019 wholesale price list you wouldn't believe your eyes, you simply CANNOT compete with acrylic around that 10k price point using a plastic shell like they do, hence why I feel it's a bad idea for them..just my opinion of course.

Too me it's like Nordic trying to manufacturer and sell a spa that retails for 10k....why? you have an amazing business model already, why try to fix what's not broken?

$10k for a viking seems a bit crazy to me. They are perfectly fine spas on the low end but if you're willing to drop $10k there are just so many other options out there that I can't imagine picking a viking.

As for the sarena bay, I think the loungers are very similar to those in the amore but the the rest of the spa is going to be significantly different. Honestly, I don't like the way the sarena has those very enclosed seats. They feel kinda weird. I absolutely love the amore though. It may very well be my favorite overall spa out there.

They are attempting (a horrible horrible idea in my opinion) to go 'higher end' One of their reps roped me in their booth a couple months ago at the Pool & Spa show in Vegas and was trying to get me to order a truckload...multiple pumps, more lights, stereos, more jets, fancy proprietary sub-structures, etc. problem is they are still using thermo plastic or whatever it's called for their shells which for YEARS have had fading and other issues. If guys in the industry saw the current 2019 wholesale price list you wouldn't believe your eyes, you simply CANNOT compete with acrylic around that 10k price point using a plastic shell like they do, hence why I feel it's a bad idea for them..just my opinion of course.

Too me it's like Nordic trying to manufacturer and sell a spa that retails for 10k....why? you have an amazing business model already, why try to fix what's not broken?

Sounds like we met with the same guy in Vegas. I was shocked at some of there wholesale procing

I looked a bit but wasn't very impressed. There are just too many other options in that range for me to consider them. I didn't look at pricing though. Do they still do that stupid pro-rated warranty stuff? To me it's just dishonest to represent having an "industry leading 6 year warranty" that in reality is worse than some mid tier spa warranties. Dishonest business practices are a pet peeve of mine,

The tests went well today. Happy with both tubs. Only 3 questions coming out of it - hoping someone here might be able to help:

1. The older Sarena Bay we got to look at did not have hand/wrist jets in the two recliner seats. The Amore Bay did. Do newer Sarena Bays have them? From photos on their site, Iím thinking ďnoĒ - but if the Sarena is the flagship, it seems odd that the Amore would have these and Sarena would not.

2. Similar to the question above - no foot jets for the Sarena Bay we saw (present in the Amore Bay, though). So newer Sarenas have foot jets? The main ones we loved in the Amore were the 2 in each of the recliners and the one massive one for the bench seat (so a total of 5). Same thoughts as above re:flagship model not having as many jets/features as Amore (confused).

3. Is one recliner in the Sarena shallower than the other (his and hers), similar to how the Amore is? It was too hard to tell dry, but loved that in the Amore.

Reading this, youíd think ďjust go with the Amore!Ē And we might. But, we like the layout of the Sarena better, and also like that it has a few extra ďpremiumĒ seats. The one seat is basically a huge bowl that hugs you - I had been hoping for that in all of our searching so far.

Thanks for the insights!

Oh one other thing - I did confirm that if you donít like the fountains, you can swap them out to be the babbling brooks or whatever that one is called. It took me all of 30 seconds while in the tub :)

It's been years, but the layout, the foot jet, the wrist jets, price. It's been awhile and I don't recall the specifics. I just remember thinking that it was our favorite model and what we chose to display.

You always have to modify what the manufacturer calls out relative to how many people the spa is designed for. My hot tub was always filled with kids when mine were younger which is why I always preferred an open-seated model because kids aren't interested in just sitting a seat and relaxing, they are constantly moving. The Serena is not open much at all (are those side seats even very usable) while the Amore is at least open on that one end. If this is meant to be a family spa and there are kids going in it I think the Amore is a much better setup.

You always have to modify what the manufacturer calls out relative to how many people the spa is designed for. My hot tub was always filled with kids when mine were younger which is why I always preferred an open-seated model because kids aren't interested in just sitting a seat and relaxing, they are constantly moving. The Serena is not open much at all (are those side seats even very usable) while the Amore is at least open on that one end. If this is meant to be a family spa and there are kids going in it I think the Amore is a much better setup.

Agree - they market tubs for X people and realistically it is always X-1 or X-2 people.

I had thought the same about the seating when looking at photos, but in the dry test, we were surprised to see the bench seat in the Sarena Bay seat 3 people while we considered the Amore Bay bench to seat 4. So our thought was you gain 2 more quality adult seats in the Sarena at the expense of one kiddo bench seat.

The foot jets and hand jets though... ugh! What are they thinking with that? Why did they hold back on the Sarena?

Leaning towards the Sarena. The Amore just seems like we will be limited to exactly one seat for each of us. The bench seat was fine for kids, but not much therapy going on there/donít see myself really enjoying that seat.

The Sarena has quite a few options to sit in, while also offering the bench for kids.

Of course, as I write this, my feet are aching... may just have to get over that though :-/

Dealer is putting a clock on the order, saying prices jump by 6-8% if we do not place our order before his next order to D1 goes through. His next order goes in this Thursday. Tick tock!

He also said the two recliner seats are identical in the Sarena Bay - is that correct? I was thinking that one was deeper than the other for a "his and hers" effect (like in the Amore Bay) - are they actually both identical depths?

Dealer is putting a clock on the order, saying prices jump by 6-8% if we do not place our order before his next order to D1 goes through. His next order goes in this Thursday. Tick tock!

He also said the two recliner seats are identical in the Sarena Bay - is that correct? I was thinking that one was deeper than the other for a "his and hers" effect (like in the Amore Bay) - are they actually both identical depths?

He probably needs another tub to get his shipping rate down on his next load...NO manufacturer raises prices 8% in 1 year so unless he's raising HIS prices it's just him creating some 'urgency' (Not to mention if he's ordering the spa it is a 2019 so you're already getting the New Model Year pricing when he quoted it to you originally)

Thank you, that is helpful. Makes me wonder if I should push back/ask for more time... a week or so would be helpful as we need to get the HOA signature on the packet still.

I spoke with D1 tonight, called their customer service number. They said no changes for 2019. Regarding depths of the recliner seats, they said:Amore: 30Ē (his), 23Ē (hers)Sarena: 28Ē (his), 27Ē (hers)

Feeling pretty torn.

Sarena has more therapy seat options, and I do think I would like the extra sequencer in the ďhisĒ seat, as I start to get itchy pretty fast from jets in one place.

Amore just seems so limited in that there is ONE seat in the tub for me, and ONE seat for the wife... the others seem like standard hotel hot tub bench seats - compared to the Sarena which has two more ďtherapyĒ seats, one of this is really, really enticing.

Doing some thinking out loud here - thanks for bearing with me! Feel free to chime in and keep me honest or point out whatever I might be missing, too!

If you are not ready, tell the dealer that and tell him if that means that big of a $ increase (for no apparent reason) then it doesn't sound like its a good fit. If they come back and say its about filling the truck on an upcoming order I'd counter (/call their bluff) that I'm willing to wait for the next full truck at the current quoted price. Being held hostage like that isn't appetizing and you need to let them know they aren't the only one holding the hammer, dealers don't like to see the back side of a pending sale say "no thanks" as they walk out the door AND customers want to feel good about their post sale service and a dealer playing this game doesn't render a good feeling for how post sales service will go!

As far as what you like/don't like in a spa, its SUCH a personal thing. To be honest I think D1 is a very good brand but I don't like either of those models (look yes, set up no) because very much prefer a more open spa? What should that mean to you, absolutely nothing! Other than solid info about a model or discussions related to quality, don't put too much stock in what others prefer. Even pricing is relative unless its the same model from someone buying in the same general area.

You've done your due diligence, go with your gut at this point (assuming you get that dealer showdown fiasco in order)!

If you are not ready, tell the dealer that and tell him if that means that big of a $ increase (for no apparent reason) then it doesn't sound like its a good fit. If they come back and say its about filling the truck on an upcoming order I'd counter (/call their bluff) that I'm willing to wait for the next full truck at the current quoted price. Being held hostage like that isn't appetizing and you need to let them know they aren't the only one holding the hammer, dealers don't like to see the back side of a pending sale say "no thanks" as they walk out the door AND customers want to feel good about their post sale service and a dealer playing this game doesn't render a good feeling for how post sales service will go!

As far as what you like/don't like in a spa, its SUCH a personal thing. To be honest I think D1 is a very good brand but I don't like either of those models (look yes, set up no) because very much prefer a more open spa? What should that mean to you, absolutely nothing! Other than solid info about a model or discussions related to quality, don't put too much stock in what others prefer. Even pricing is relative unless its the same model from someone buying in the same general area.

You've done your due diligence, go with your gut at this point (assuming you get that dealer showdown fiasco in order)!

Thank you! You've given solid advice along the way to me in various topics/messages. I appreciate it.

We really liked the open feel of the Grandee and Kingston when we sat in those, BUT we noticed that the seats felt "vanilla" to us - especially me. I wanted something that really hugs me and makes me feel like the seat was sculpted just for me. That is a big draw for us with the Bays. From the reading I've done, I think we are somewhat unique in that sense, where others tend to prefer the open/high mobility options.

The beauty of the Amore and Sarena for us are that we get the sculpted seat options (especially in the Sarena), while also keeping the big open 2-4 person bench seating option - not just for efficient seating and open feel, but also for therapy purposes for our daughter (cerebral palsy).

We are thinking we will pay to add the exterior lighting, and also pay to add the speakers. The speakers are a tough one - we've read a lot about people NOT recommending these. We do have patio speakers (two smaller HEOS 1 speakers), but I really enjoy listening to audio books to relax, and I'm concerned that I will not be able to understand an audiobook coming from the patio speakers. We do listen to some slower music (Jazz, Frank Sinatra, Norah Jones type of stuff) when sitting around the firepit as well, so perhaps we'll do the same in the tub. The price on this set up seems ridiculous, but I also don't like "rigging" things together, so perhaps the premium will be worth it - and I do not want to regret not adding it later on.

The wifi seems like an added cost that will never be used - I was originally big on mobile app access, but it seems like the use cases for that are pretty minimal. Fair assumption?

We are thinking we will pay to add the exterior lighting, and also pay to add the speakers. The speakers are a tough one - we've read a lot about people NOT recommending these. We do have patio speakers (two smaller HEOS 1 speakers), but I really enjoy listening to audio books to relax, and I'm concerned that I will not be able to understand an audiobook coming from the patio speakers. We do listen to some slower music (Jazz, Frank Sinatra, Norah Jones type of stuff) when sitting around the firepit as well, so perhaps we'll do the same in the tub. The price on this set up seems ridiculous, but I also don't like "rigging" things together, so perhaps the premium will be worth it - and I do not want to regret not adding it later on.

The wifi seems like an added cost that will never be used - I was originally big on mobile app access, but it seems like the use cases for that are pretty minimal. Fair assumption?

The onboard sound system is a total waste of money. It will not be near as good sound as something that costs half as much and it will break on you. Even a little boombox that plugs in near the tub will be better. Seriously, save your cash on that one.

I bargained the wi-fi app into the dealer quote on my tub and I don't use it as much as I thought I would. But because I got it thrown in as an option rather than paying the extra ($400) I feel that it was worth while. I do like knowing remotely that the tub is up to temperature. I live in Toronto and we get some pretty cold days. When I head out of town it's comforting to be able to check on the temperature of the tub.

We are thinking we will pay to add the exterior lighting, and also pay to add the speakers. The speakers are a tough one - we've read a lot about people NOT recommending these. We do have patio speakers (two smaller HEOS 1 speakers), but I really enjoy listening to audio books to relax, and I'm concerned that I will not be able to understand an audiobook coming from the patio speakers. We do listen to some slower music (Jazz, Frank Sinatra, Norah Jones type of stuff) when sitting around the firepit as well, so perhaps we'll do the same in the tub. The price on this set up seems ridiculous, but I also don't like "rigging" things together, so perhaps the premium will be worth it - and I do not want to regret not adding it later on.

The wifi seems like an added cost that will never be used - I was originally big on mobile app access, but it seems like the use cases for that are pretty minimal. Fair assumption?

The onboard sound system is a total waste of money. It will not be near as good sound as something that costs half as much and it will break on you. Even a little boombox that plugs in near the tub will be better. Seriously, save your cash on that one.

Listen to swilly on this one. Stereos are a bad idea in any hot tub. They are way overpriced for what you get and it's not a matter of if, but when and how often it will fail. They just do not last in a hot tub environment, no matter who makes it. Then when it breaks, you are beholden to the manufacturer's ridiculous pricing and the high cost of a hot tub service technician to fix or replace. A floating bluetooth speaker for 1/5th the price will sound better, last longer, and be easier to repair or replace.

We are thinking we will pay to add the exterior lighting, and also pay to add the speakers. The speakers are a tough one - we've read a lot about people NOT recommending these. We do have patio speakers (two smaller HEOS 1 speakers), but I really enjoy listening to audio books to relax, and I'm concerned that I will not be able to understand an audiobook coming from the patio speakers. We do listen to some slower music (Jazz, Frank Sinatra, Norah Jones type of stuff) when sitting around the firepit as well, so perhaps we'll do the same in the tub. The price on this set up seems ridiculous, but I also don't like "rigging" things together, so perhaps the premium will be worth it - and I do not want to regret not adding it later on.

The wifi seems like an added cost that will never be used - I was originally big on mobile app access, but it seems like the use cases for that are pretty minimal. Fair assumption?

The onboard sound system is a total waste of money. It will not be near as good sound as something that costs half as much and it will break on you. Even a little boombox that plugs in near the tub will be better. Seriously, save your cash on that one.

Listen to swilly on this one. Stereos are a bad idea in any hot tub. They are way overpriced for what you get and it's not a matter of if, but when and how often it will fail. They just do not last in a hot tub environment, no matter who makes it. Then when it breaks, you are beholden to the manufacturer's ridiculous pricing and the high cost of a hot tub service technician to fix or replace. A floating bluetooth speaker for 1/5th the price will sound better, last longer, and be easier to repair or replace.

Another vote for no stereo. I have owned a few different tubs and always gotten them with music. My last tub was a Marquis Resort with music. Stereo stopped working in about a year and a half. I just moved and got a Caldera Geneva. I got music on it but jusfging by my last couple of tubs if it lasts a year or two I will be happy

Thank you all for the help - after reading these last few posts, we are going to take off the audio. The kicker for us was reading that they ALL fail - and then thinking about how frustrated we would be with a spa of this magnitude of cost that is not working 100% (yes, that would drive me nuts!!!).

Delivery anticipated in 4-6 weeks. Getting quotes on the concrete pad now, and figuring out the electrical.

I'm assuming I'll need to add a 220v/50a dedicated breaker and run the line from the main panel to a sub-panel with the sub-panel probably mounted on the exterior for code purposes (please correct me if I'm wrong here).

Delivery anticipated in 4-6 weeks. Getting quotes on the concrete pad now, and figuring out the electrical.

I'm assuming I'll need to add a 220v/50a dedicated breaker and run the line from the main panel to a sub-panel with the sub-panel probably mounted on the exterior for code purposes (please correct me if I'm wrong here).

Does the spa come with its own sub-panel?

White w/ Cedar sounds like a sexy color combo, I love the 'clean look' the white shell provides so I sell a lot of that color personally speaking. Typically the spa will not come with the 50 Amp GFI Panel, your electrician can provide one at a rough cost of $79-$99 give or take and yes the electrician will run a dedicated 220 volt line directly to the spa via the GFI disconnect panel.....a typical spa will require a 4-Wire service (2 Hot Wires in 6 gauge, 1 Neutral wire in 6 gauge, and 1 ground wire in 8 gauge, all wire should be 'jacketed') Good Luck!

edit: Yes, breaker panel will be installed 'near' the spa, code requires a Minimum of 5' clearance from the Hot Tub and typically a maximum of 50' and the box should be installed 'in line of sight' so that if there is ever an issue the box can be located quickly and the breaker can be shut off (ie don't hide your panel underneath a deck where nobody can find it)

Delivery anticipated in 4-6 weeks. Getting quotes on the concrete pad now, and figuring out the electrical.

I'm assuming I'll need to add a 220v/50a dedicated breaker and run the line from the main panel to a sub-panel with the sub-panel probably mounted on the exterior for code purposes (please correct me if I'm wrong here).

Does the spa come with its own sub-panel?

White w/ Cedar sounds like a sexy color combo, I love the 'clean look' the white shell provides so I sell a lot of that color personally speaking. Typically the spa will not come with the 50 Amp GFI Panel, your electrician can provide one at a rough cost of $79-$99 give or take and yes the electrician will run a dedicated 220 volt line directly to the spa via the GFI disconnect panel.....a typical spa will require a 4-Wire service (2 Hot Wires in 6 gauge, 1 Neutral wire in 6 gauge, and 1 ground wire in 8 gauge, all wire should be 'jacketed') Good Luck!

edit: Yes, breaker panel will be installed 'near' the spa, code requires a Minimum of 5' clearance from the Hot Tub and typically a maximum of 50' and the box should be installed 'in line of sight' so that if there is ever an issue the box can be located quickly and the breaker can be shut off (ie don't hide your panel underneath a deck where nobody can find it)

Very helpful info - thank you!

In terms of burying the wires - is it typical to have them in place before concrete is poured so they are in the concrete as it is formed? Or are most people just coming up from the ground right before the pad and then securing the conduit to the pad with brackets and cement screws?

Lastly - where does the conduit feed in on the Sarena Bay for the wiring? From the diagram, it looks like it is on the left side of the tub (when looking at the topside controls), where the left side meets the front?

Run the wire up through the pad for a totally stealth install. If you do it this way, you have to measure, measure again, and measure yet again. If you come out of the pad at the wrong spot you will be p***ed.

I had to tell my electrician that it was off by 7" and he made it right but it was on me to ensure that the wire came up in the right spot. We nailed it in the end, but not without some serious intervention. There are plenty of not so fun outcomes in this regard. Google it.

Run the wire up through the pad for a totally stealth install. If you do it this way, you have to measure, measure again, and measure yet again. If you come out of the pad at the wrong spot you will be p***ed.

I had to tell my electrician that it was off by 7" and he made it right but it was on me to ensure that the wire came up in the right spot. We nailed it in the end, but not without some serious intervention. There are plenty of not so fun outcomes in this regard. Google it.

Sounds like this is the ideal route, but also carries some risk (if you get it wrong).

The photos you linked returned 404 errors - any chance you can link again? Trying to determine if it will look nice enough to warrant the risk of me messing up the measurement :)

I was able to find a pretty helpful schematics diagram at the following URL (tried including a photo, too).http://www.dpspas.com/service/resources-and-manuals/sarena-bay-specifications

A couple questions - is the space between the "pedestal" (dotted lines) and the electrical inlet "open" space, or is it filled? Can the wiring come up anywhere in that open space and be OK, or does it have to come up literally exactly where the electrical inlet is?

I wouldn't stub up underneath. There is very little margin for error underneath.

Thanks, Sam. Our dealer actually just replied saying it's impossible with the Sarena Bay, and that you *have* to come up form the side? Is that right?

Other update - spa delivery delayed, pushed all the way back to the week of March 25. That's OK - buys us more time for better weather for the concrete pad (and gives us more time to get the electric taken care of).