Ta-Seti Neferet, the mother of Egyptian KingAmenhemet I‘s was of a peoples from Upper Egypt known as Ta-Seti. He built a great city state called “Amenemhat-itj-tawy” (“Amenemhat the Seizer of the Two Lands“), more simply called Itjtawy.

Amenemhat’s Ta-Seti army and conscripts came to be known Ta-Itj-tawy. In modern languages this is pronounced Bigawy, Bedjawi or Bejawi, Beja.

The Beja are found mostly in Sudan, but also in parts of Eritrea, and Egypt. They formerly were classified as belonging to the Hamiticrace (a classification now generally regarded as scientifically incorrect).

Working Theory in Progress of How Ashkenazi and Sephardic Jews, Blacks and Whites the “Caribbean”, Roma Gypsies, and

African Americans all Sprung from the Same Well !

~180,000 years ago

A woman [womb-man] walked through Olduvai Gorge

(in present day East Africa Tanzania)

with her small tribe of fellow Homo Sapiens.Her people were destined to be the only species of hominids that would survive, but right now they’re not the only “people” by far…Neanderthals and Homo Erectus still dominate most of the planet. But this lady is special because of all the women walking with her, she alone will be the direct maternal line ancestor of every person alive on the planet today. You may have read about her…“Mitochondrial Eve” and her haplogroup designation is “L”.

~75,000 years ago

In the heart of Central Africa a baby girl is born into Eve’s tribe …she is just like her mom, except that one letter in her mtDNA mutated.

She didn’t know it, but she was the beginning of a new haplogroup branch—L2—that would become the most common haplogroup in Africa. About this time a small band from another branch of “mtDNA mutants”—L3—decided to seek better weather and food by bravely crossing the Gate of Tears off the horn of Africa. They entered the Arabian peninsula—-and from there, this band of 200 or less people would go on to populate the rest of the World.

But their story is not ours…for the L2 baby girl and her descendants all stay in Africa.

~ 55,000 years ago

Among an L2 tribe living in West/Central Africa, another baby girl is born with a new mtDNA mutation…making her the start of a new haplogroup branch L2a.

Her descendant daughtersremain without much mtDNA change for over 50,000 years!

Over that time, some of her people start to migrate across Central Africa to the East area now calledEThiOpiA.

Others of her people started heading North along the nile coast, settling in North Africa and EgYpt and even reached the Levant

(now Israel, Syria, Jordan, Turkey).

~2,500 years ago (500 BCE)

Somewhere in North Africa,EgYpt or the Levant, a baby girl is born with yet another mtDNA mutation…starting the haplogroup line known as L2a1.

Some of her tribes people intermarry with the newly forming Hebrew tribes in the Levant and become Hebrews/Jews.

~ 2,200 years ago (~200 BCE)

It is among this group of African Jews that our common ancestress was born! For fun I’m going to call her Sepharda Fulanivich—a name that hints at our group’s main strains.

Sepharda had no special mutation that would create a new haplogroup,

but she was unique in the way we are all unique…and special because all our maternal lines would lead back to her.

Given how many of us have similar eye color, Sepharda may well have had green/blue eyes. This trait would have been recessive in her daughter descendants, dominated by their brown-eyed mates.…

but always ready to appear again if and when a blue-eyed spouse came along.

~1900 years ago (~100 CE)

One of Sepharda’s descendant daughters was part of a group of Jews who fled the Roman invasions of Judea and headed back into North Africa. They formed a tribe that came to be known as the Fulani.

As they migrated across North Africa, they first settled in the Morocco/Mauritania area and over the next few centuries slowly spread throughout West Africa, converting to Islam, but retaining both the appearance and some traditional memories of their Hebrew origin in the Levant. (Their DNA held the memory as well.)

At about this very same time—give or take 100 years or so!—another of Sepharda’s descendant daughters also fled Judea, heading with her family to Spain (Sepharad, in Hebrew). They may have gone up through Italy first or directly to Spain…we can’t know as yet.

But one way or another, they became Sephardic Jews.

~600 years ago (~1400 CE)

For many centuries, Spain was a place where Jews/hebrews flourished, but things started deteriorating after the Moors left and the Pope’s intolerant minions came to power. Many Jews left the country, heading for France and then Bavaria (Germany), where they mingled with the Ashkenazi Jewish populations already living there.

One of Sepharda’s descendants was among them and she is the common ancestor of all the

This was a lousy time period for almost all of Sepharda’s descendants.

First we go back to West Africa and find that some of her Fulani daughters are among the ones being captured by the British and sent to the Caribbean and the new colonies in America.

Indeed, because we know most of these enslaved daughters of Sepharda were sent to North Carolina originally, we can predict that their common ancestress lived when the trade to that area was peaking—1720 to 1760.

These daughters are the ancestors of almost all of our African-American matches.

Then, over in Spain, things had gone from bad to worse, with a complete expulsion of Jews in 1492. As noted above, some fled into Europe. Many more went farther south into the Turkish (Ottoman) Empire and North Africa. However—-drum roll—a fair number headed for the

British West Indies and by ~1650 CE there was a whole bunch of Sephardic Jews settled in Jamaica and the Bahamas. In 1691 another “auto de fe” (more “burning of Jews”) in Toledo Spain sent another wave of Spanish Jews to Jamaica.

Many of these Jews came as “singles” and ended up intermarrying with the population from the British Isles that had settled there. And among those migrating Spanish women were Sepharda’s daughters, many of whom married non-Jewish Brits and lost the memory of their Jewish past.

Their lines led to our West Indies matches.

And I believe it also explains some “not-Jewish white” folks who trace themselves back to the 17th century in Rhode Island and New Jersey

By ironic coincidence, Jamaica was also a drop for slave traders and it looks very possible that some of our Jamaican matches are from the African slave branch of our line rather than the Sephardic Jewish branch!

~250-400 years ago (1600-1750 CE)

Getting back to those Ashkenazi Jews, we can spell out their story a little more.

Some stayed in Germany …but as the centuries passed and German anti-Semitism increased, other descendant daughters started moving east into Poland and then south towards Romania (where the ancestors of some of us joined up with other Jewish Romas (gypsies)…

interestingly, a very recent study found what was to them a startling level of “L2a” haplotypes among Roma gypsies in Slovakia!

About 1700 or so, some of the Polish daughters migrated north, where some lines settled in Belarus and others went up farther into Lithuania and Latvia .

Afterword

Back in West Africa, right now, some of Sepharda’s daughters are living and don’t even realize all of us cousins elsewhere in the world are thinking of them. That is also true no doubt in Spain…and all the other places our lines have passed through. Some women moved on, but not all of them.

And imagine if Sepharda could come back to life and meet each of us and realize that without her existence….none of us would be here.

That’s the power of one.

Updated October 2008

Author’s Note: This working theory will soon be greatly enhanced by new information as nine of the descendants above (including slave descendants and Caribbeans) get their currently pending Full Genome Sequence results…

While as a General Assembly Declaration it is not a legally binding instrument under international law,

according to a UN press release, it does “represent the dynamic development of international legal norms and it reflects the commitment of the UN’s member states to move in certain directions”; the UN describes it as setting “an important standard for the treatment of indigenous peoples that will undoubtedly be a significant tool towards eliminatinghuman rights violationsagainst the planet’s 370 million indigenous people, and assisting them in combating discrimination and marginalisation.

The Declaration sets out the individual and collective rights of indigenous peoples, as well as their rights to culture, identity, language, employment, health, education and other issues.

It also “emphasizes the rights of indigenous peoples to maintain and strengthen their own institutions, cultures and traditions, and to pursue their development in keeping with their own needs and aspirations”.

It “prohibits discrimination against indigenous peoples”, and it “promotes their full and effective participation in all matters that concern them and their right to remain distinct and to pursue their own visions of economic and social development”

The Draft Declaration was then referred to the Commission on Human Rights, which established another Working Group to examine its terms. Over the following years this Working Group met on 11 occasions to examine and fine-tune the Draft Declaration and its provisions.

Progress was slow because of certain states’ concerns regarding some key provisions of the Declaration, such as

indigenous peoples’ right to self-determination and the control over natural resources existing on indigenous peoples’ traditional lands.

The final version of the Declaration was adopted on 29 June 2006 by the 47-member Human Rights Council(the successor body to the Commission on Human Rights), with 30 member states in favour, two against, 12 abstentions, and three absentees.

The Declaration was then referred to the General Assembly,

which voted on the adoption of the proposal on 13 September 2007 during its 61st regular session.

The U.S. mission also issued a floor document, “Observations of the United States with respect to

the Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples”, setting out its objections to the Declaration. Most of these are based on the same points as the other three countries’ rejections but, in addition,

theUnited States drew attention to the Declaration’s failure to provide a clear definition of exactly whom

about a displaced people within their own country. Similar to the Kurds in Iraq,

The Nubians of Egypt have had to leave their traditional villages along the Nile. Some of the displacement is caused by floods, while some is due to reservoirs that the government builds and plans to build upon.Daniel Williams of Bloomberg newstells us about the Nubian people and their efforts to preserve their own kind.

Singing songs and chatting in an ancient language, hundreds of cheerful Nubian travelers gathered at Alexandria’s railway station for a long pilgrimage to a lost homeland.

Exiles in their own country, they journeyed 18 hours to celebrate a Muslim holiday in southern Egypt’s Nile valley, a region their ancestors once dominated from a loose confederation of villages along the river banks.

In 1964, their shoreline was inundated when the Aswan High Dam created Lake Nasser, the world’s largest reservoir. Now the Egyptian government has floated plans to develop and populate land surrounding the lake — without reserving space for Nubians. Activists in the ethnic minority say no fair: They want terrain set aside for new villages so their brethren can live again on the Nile, returning from a northern Egypt diaspora and arid settlements established 44 years ago for displaced families.

“The settlements are false Nubia,” said Haggag Oddoul, an author who has become an outspoken advocate for resettlement. “To restore our character and community, we need to be rerooted. We need to return.”

They speak their own, non-Arabic language and sing their “Songs to Drum beats”….

The river was their economic lifeblood and fountain of memory, identity and lore.

Central to old beliefs, it held the spirits of angels and holy men.

Nubians, now numbering about 3 million of Egypt’s 73 million people,

have been leaving their stretch of the Nile valley for more than a century —

some because of poverty, some because of efforts to tame the river’s annual floods.

The first dam near Aswan was built in 1902; subsequent ones obliterated settlements further and further south until all of Egyptian Nubia was under water.

Khabairi Gamal, 70, unfurled a hand-drawn map of old Nubia for holiday visitors earlier this month in Aniba, one of the transplanted villages.

Young Nubians are forgetting their past, he said, turning to Islam. Fathi, 23, and asking where he was from originally…

“Well,” Fathi stammered with a smile….

“Go home and ask about your grandfather….

Ask about it!” stormed Gamal, the village leader. “And do you know Nubian ?”

“A few ” “Learn it,” Gamal ordered. “You see, we have to move back.Otherwise, there will be no Nubia and no Nubians.”

Nubians live in the Upper Nile region.

When the “Condominium Agreement” of 1899″ fixed the boundary between Egypt and Sudan,

Lower Nubians found themselves “under direct Egyptian rule” and politically “separated” from their kin to the south.

This arbitrary frontier divides the Nobiin-speaking group more or less equally between Egypt and Sudan. Close ties of culture, language and family continue to unite the people north and south of the border, and until the evacuation of 1964 that accompanied the building of the Aswan High Dam there was continual visiting back and forth between them.

Egyptian Nubia is part of the Governorate of Aswan which also includes a populous area whose inhabitants are not Nubian.

As a result, Nubians have found themselves a minority within their native province.

Although Egypt remained the stronger power for most of its dynastic period, it did not destroy its southern neighbour, Nubia;

nor did Nubia, in spite of its adoption of Egyptian gods and ideas of kingship, completely succumb to its neighbour’s ways.

The Nubian city of Meroe was sited on the banks of the Nile about 200 kilometres north of present-day Khartoum, growing rich from control of trade on the Nile until the fourth century CE. Its wealth gave rise to elite patronage of art work such as pottery and shield rings, worn on the forehead, a practice that Nubians continue today. The incorporation of Egypt into the Byzantine Empire brought Christianity to the Nile region. Coptic Christianity spread to Nubia, where a Christian kingdom existed from the sixth to the fourteenth centuries.

At the end of this period Nubia adopted Islam, 700 years later than the north of Egypt, and many of its large churches were converted into mosques.

Rural Nubians have been neglected and exploited for much of the twentieth century. From about 1910 until their final destruction in the 1960s, the villages of Egyptian Nubia were populated chiefly by women, children and older people; most able-bodied men were forced to migrate to find work. For the sake of increased agricultural production downstream, their land has been destroyed piecemeal by the building of successive dams at Aswan without any effort to gain their consent. Over a period of 70 years about 60 per cent of Egyptian Nubia territory has been destroyed or rendered unfit for habitation, and roughly half the surviving Nubian-speaking people have been obliged to find new homes.

Some attempt has been made to compensate Nubians for the loss of their farms and date groves and create new livelihoods for them, but development south of Aswan has failed to keep pace with the rest of the country. For thousands of years ‘Nubian’ and ‘slave’ were virtually synonymous in the Egyptian mind; although this prejudice has lessened in the modern era, Nubians are still largely excluded from Egyptian national life.

Nubians convened a ‘First Nubian Congress’ in October 2002, and petitioned the government for greater compensation for their lost land.

Current issues

Nubians remain bitter over the loss of their land to the dam projects without adequate compensation.

While the dams were designed to serve Egypt’s development needs ,Nubians complain that the government continues to neglect their needs…

We, the signatories on the this appeal, individuals and organizations, call upon the United Nations, its specialized agencies, governments of free nations, human rights organizations, academicians, scholars, and the international community

at large to heed to this urgent appeal and rush to the rescue of Nubia from the eminent destruction and devastation by the proposed Kajbar Dam at the Third Cataract on the River Nile which will inundate one of the most precious and invaluable archaeological sites of the world.

The international community is urged to exert all possible pressures on the government of Sudan to “Stop” building dams in the Nubian lands without the consent of the Nubians and put an end to decades of intentional marginalization, isolation, cultural and ethnic cleansing which has been practiced by the consecutive governments of Sudan in collaboration with the Egyptian government against Nubians, their culture and heritage.

The Nubians have never recovered yet from the devastation of the High Dam of Egypt to their lands and properties in early sixties of last century.

The governments of Sudan and Egypt have jointly and intentionally implemented series of destructive policies to dismantle the Nubiansociety and assimilate the indigenous people of Nubia into Arabic culture through well organized programs of cultural cleansing, acculturation and indoctrination.

It is our believe that the international community has a legal and moral obligation towards preserving and protectingthe Nubians as one of the indigenous people of the world, their heritage and culture from the excessive and intentional process of Arabization and cultural cleansing.

Governments of Sudan and Egypt have signed the Four Freedoms Agreement (the freedom to move, live, work and own.)

on April 5, 2004 and the officials of the two governments expressed their desire to bring millions of Egyptian farmers to the Nubian lands of Argeen without the knowledge and consent of Nubians.

On the other hand the government of Sudan has issued a presidential decree last year to confiscate the Nubian lands in Wadi Halfa municipality.

Governments of Sudan and Egypt “prohibi”t usage of the Nubian”language” in their educational curricula and apply disguised and discriminatory measures to denyNubians from holding sensitive and keygovernmental positions unless they master

Arabic “language” and get affiliated with the ruling elites and culturally assimilated to the dominant Arabic culture as a precondition for holding senior positions. The systematic depopulation of the Nubians from their lands and gradual replacement of Nubians by non-Nubians is intended to destroy the strongly knitted social fabric of Nubian society and disrupt the long lived harmony and demographic homogeneity of the Nubians, one of the oldest indigenous and distinctive cultural groups in Africa.

Nubians as “indigenous people” are entitled to get international protection according to the international laws protecting the indigenous people, their cultures and heritage.

Last March, the Nubians saw the Sudanese government bringing Chinese workers and equipments being brought to the site of

Kajbar Dam and the Nubian organizations and associations organized a big demonstration to protest the building of Kajbar Dam without their consent. They expressed their opposition to the dam and demand immediate removal of equipments from the site. The governor of the Northern Province promised the angry protesters but he reneged and even began to put obstacles to the committees opposing the Kajbar Dam. When the Nubians protested again, the security forces at the Kajbar Dam site used tear gas and live ammunition to disperse the peaceful demonstration injuring several people.

During the last few weeks the state authorities deployed more security forces to the site of the Dam and the governor announced that the government will conduct feasibility studies only to decide whether to proceed in building the dam or stop it. The government is trying to fool the people and continue building the dam and force the Nubians to accept the dam as a reality and a status quo matter like what they did at Meroe Dam and to the people affected by the dam.

We call upon the international community to:

• Take every necessary steps to move expediently to stop forthwith the building of Kajbar Dam and any dam in the heartland of Nubia and extend every possible help Nubians are entitled to,by the international laws to get their share

in “power and wealth” as stipulated in the Comprehensive Peace Agreement (CPA) signed in Naivasha, Kenya between the Government of Sudan and the Sudan People Liberation Army/Movement and the agreements signed in Abuja and Asmara between the government of Sudan and the Darfur rebels and the East Front rebels.

• Protect and enable the Indigenous people of Nubia to have the right and freedom to use their ancestral lands, territories and resources which they have traditionally owned, and their right to maintain, control, protect and develop their language, cultural heritage, traditional knowledge and traditional cultural expressions

• Make sure that the Nubians who suffered from forcible relocations for the purpose of building the High Dam of Aswan, the biggest man made dam in the history in their lands be compensated for their sufferings during the last four decades and that they shall not be forcibly removed again from their lands or territories and that no relocation shall take place without the free, prior and informed consent of the indigenous people of Nubia.

• Insure the right of the indigenous people of Nubia to revitalize, use, develop and transmit to future generations their histories, languages, oral traditions, philosophies, writing systems and literatures.

• Enable the right of the indigenous people of Nubia to establish and control their educational systems and institutions providing education in their own languages, in a manner appropriate to their cultural methods of teaching and learning.

• Enable the Indigenous people of Nubia who are divided by international borders between Sudan and Egypt, to maintain and develop contacts, relations and cooperation, including activities for spiritual, cultural, political, economic and social purposes, with their own members as well as other peoples across borders.

• Insure the right of the Indigenous people of Nubia to have free access to public media or establish their own media in their own languages and to have access to all forms of non-indigenous media without discrimination.

The Nubians, their organizations and association inside Sudan and around the world were asked to organize demonstrations on May 21st, 2007 inside Sudan and in front of Sudanese and

Chinese embassies and UN offices worldwide to express their unequivocal opposition to Kajbar Dam and any future plans to build dams in the Nubian lands and spread the word through the international media to expose to the world the hidden war against Nubians and the conspiracy to wipe out Nubia from the map of the world..

If you want to have a prayer of doing anything except refusing in caps, you are going to have to, point by point, refute most of the skeletal and all of the genetic evidence on which Andelimia’s very strong case rests.

Asking him what his background is has negative relevancy to what that of Pharoaonic Egyptians was. What your background is, being also irrelevant.

Try to make refutations of points WITH PHYSICAL and MEASUREABLE DATA (see I can use caps too 🙂

Your so far made 4 responses, the first of which told us what you consider yourself to be ethnically, as if that matters (obviously it doesn to you and your identity complex, to me its not so important, and has nothing to do with your accuracy).

Most importantly, none of your responses said anything about the genetic lines that exist in NE Africa, the ones there in the pharoaonic period, nor the ones most common in mummy genetic tests.

Andelimia has made copious responses including this and further physical anaysis, none of which is fallacy laden, all of which is strong on physicality, none of which you have so much as challeneged.

Now, do you need to be taught from scratch what ‘proof’ means or is your emotional attatchment to a given fiction s strong that it wouldnt even matter if I put you and I in time machine complete with DNA testing kits, Y-chrom testing kits, allowed ourselves access to every hapmap detail availible as of this day in 2009, and we both sat down and sequenced a large sample the Ancient Egyptians together? Im not sure Id enjoy your company on such a trip but thats also an irrelevant detail. You are immune to ‘proof’. What a wonderful psychopathology 😀

This intrinsic spaming, belittling, ignoring my advice to continue furthur if you wish to have a debate on this issue, ignoring my links etc, the inherent red-herrings, are just case in point.

The nature of your eristic, sophist recent behaviour, gets proven by each new comment you make.

The only thing your comment about you having been leading some conference’s, and I sincerely congratulate on that one as Im sure it must be fun and rewarding, mean is that you are very interested in the subject, you are of a certain opinion based on facts and emotive pressure, you associate and belong to one specific group of people interested in this subject opposing the other side or sides who also are interested in this subject also having conference’s.
Thus the arbitrary meaning of the comment, an appeal to authority, without knowing the legitimacy and ignoring that there’s many sides to these issues, many which dont hold your position and are more informed than both you and me, Im sure.

I, who by the way have very, very little interest in this subject to begin with.

So far the essence of your constructive argument has been that YOU and YOUR family has lived in Egypt for a long time and still are citizens to this day.

Which essentially says nothing about the ancient Egyptians which was what the Article was dealing with, as was all the evidence I put forth confirming the message.

If I moved to WestAfrica and my family-line somehow managed to remain Caucasian, my descendents could, a couple of hundred or thousends years from now, claim they’re indigeneous to West African land due to their presence there.

The problem is, they were not indigeneous and when they’d then compare dental, skeletal, dna et cetera, they’ll find that Bantus have less admixture than my descendent have. They also found that the modern day Bantus are genetically similar to the ancient Bantus, when comparing dna, unlike my descendents. The latitude skin color phenomenon when it comes to my descendents is also suspect, but not so for the Bantus.

I will not discuss this further.
If you wish to debate this, there are far more and better people than I who are both motivated, interested and willing to spend their time, debating with you on this issue.

Although I dislike the site myself.
There is a site called;

Stormfront, full of people you surely can enlighten.

If you wish to continue, this is not the place.

We try to post an article a day and simple dont have the time, debating back and forth while having a life outside of CFL, as well as trying to enlighten people on philosophy, history, science etc.

If this is your area of expertice there’s forums with much bigger “audience” like Stormfront, as mentioned.

I will not participate any further and any comment made by you after this one is unecessary and useless.

Hello again… I posted the indigenous Y-chromosome study from 2005 with the Human Genetic Society and Howard University out of washington D.C. Here is the Study one more time.. Please disprove and show my finding against yours, Please do not delete:

This is more focussed on the Egyptians around Luxor, where old Upper Egypt was located. A recent DNA study by Cruciani that focused on the Y chromosome E-M78 revealed that it was ’born’ in North East Africa , not East Africa as previously thought. This means, that an Egyptian with an M78 Y chromosome has had a male line ancestry reaching back to the Pleistocene inhabitants of Egypt; as far back as the Halfan culture about 24,000 years ago.