The fact remains that either the Wii U is compatible with a DX11 API or similar, or that it can easily be ported to a lesser API with very similar results, so if that developer IS doing it, then what's the problem? Why others can't?

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Post 132 explains why not. Once Windows XP dies there's no reason to scale down DX11/OpenGL 4.0 just for the sake of a Wii U version if there's no PS360 version unless Nintendo speaks cash or the Wii U miraculously becomes the common lowest denominator/lead platform.

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Where are you getting this idea that they are going to stop using direct x 10 in 2014? You do realize that the millions of computers that are still running xp are not going to just magically implode. Not even sure why you keep mentioning xp as I'm pretty sure it is the video card that determines if you can use direct x 11 not the OS.

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This is something to consider. Wii U may not get any DX11 or equivalent supported game due to how much of a pain it could be to switch to a DX10 equivalent, but if the game isn't built off of DX11, the system could support it. This is a matter of how long it takes for everyone to switch to DX11 and/or equivalent. As long as DX10 is still being used, the Wii U can run it.

Post 132 explains why not. Once Windows XP dies there's no reason to scale down DX11/OpenGL 4.0 just for the sake of a Wii U version if there's no PS360 version unless Nintendo speaks cash or the Wii U miraculously becomes the common lowest denominator/lead platform.

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Where are you getting this idea that they are going to stop using direct x 10 in 2014? You do realize that the millions of computers that are still running xp are not going to just magically implode. Not even sure why you keep mentioning xp as I'm pretty sure it is the video card that determines if you can use direct x 11 not the OS.

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This is something to consider. Wii U may not get any DX11 or equivalent supported game due to how much of a pain it could be to switch to a DX10 equivalent, but if the game isn't built off of DX11, the system could support it. This is a matter of how long it takes for everyone to switch to DX11 and/or equivalent. As long as DX10 is still being used, the Wii U can run it.

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That is true, but XP doesn't even use DX10/OpenGL 3.3; it uses DX9/OpenGL 3.0 (Like the PS360). Vista supports DX11 as of Service Pack 2. This is worrisome for the time PS360 support gets dropped, as the DX9/OpenGL 3.0 level API will be fully dead.

Again, the only salvation against this scenario is if the Wii U becomes the unquestionable lead platform by then.

Either way to just assume people are going to upgrade as soon as Microsoft ends support of xp would ve very stupid. They will continue to release games that use direct x 10

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There won't be a single self-respected PC gamer not having a DX11/OpenGL 4.0 GPU by April 2014. What's on your mind? They they'll still use 2008 GPUs? Come on.

The rest? XP gamers will move on to Vista or W7 no matter how much they hate it if they don't want to compromise their beloved system's security, and from a business perspective you are late if your company is yet to begin migration as it takes months.

Remember that 3rd party reel when the Wii U was first unveiled? Got my hopes a bit too high on that one....

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So did I.

However, reports/leaks pointed out to 2011's Wii U/target plans being stronger than what we actually got. Nintendo's original console was overheating due to the lack of cooling, which is something Nintendo would not invest as it would make the console bigger.

what made xenoblade different than any other game i ever saw is not only that the environment is so varied, but also not flat. i mean, it has cliffs that drop off to nowhere, bizarre pillars of stone, caves and slopes your character can slide down. and you can just about go anywhere the eye can see, with no invisible walls. on top of the tall tree, i looked up and saw the lake in the sky my character will visit next. this reminds me of mario64.

what? It looks great, some of the characters look a bit meh but still it looks really really good.

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Yeah, it looks great! Lets hope it looks like that on the 360... And still X looks better and it's technologically more advanced, the assets have a higher poly count, the draw distance is greater, the textures are of higher resolution, the lighting is immensely better, and have better effects and even particles.

As for DirectX 10 support ending Jan 1st I'm dubious. Sure XP dies at that point and PC gaming has no reason to aim lower but what happens if the PS4 and Xbox One don't sell like everyone is hoping? Are third parties really going to give up cash cow consoles? EA isn't giving up the Wii for their Fifa 14 release. If Sony and Microsoft fail to grab up huge chunks of the market early on publishers WILL continue down porting their games to the PS3 and Xbox360. It is all about the money at the end of the day. Nothing else. Now whether that means the Wii U would also get the down ports I don't know but I'm going to wait till 2014 to freak out.

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Oh its so easy to pick on the Wii U because its the only next gen console to actually exist. Make no mistake though, the other two would be in exactly the same boat if they were real.
The simple truth behind the Wii U's development hell is that publishers are giving plenty of reason for arrested developmental support and no reason to push consumers into the next gen.
If you have 100 gazillion people in the PS360 market with so much traction, why are you going to waste resources on next gen support?
Its really as simple as that.

I think the Wii U's biggest problem was that whilst every developer knew the console was comming, they were kinda jumped by it actually being out on the market. No one was ready for it and (as proof) the massive amount of content this E3; no one had time to exploit the Wii U, with development schedules in full swing.

Regardless of DX technologies, OpenGL as a standard is increasing its development on custom API support for consoles in popular engines but it'll remain slow whilst the PS360 is still in support.

I'm at a loss as to why this sensationalistic thread exists? DX10.1/OGL 3.3 means nothing as far as consoles are concerned; and nothing at all regarding the Wii U. Its a vaguarity.

AMD state the Wii U GPU is highly customised and wholly new. Given the custom hardware driving consoles its very hard to just rush out and say "DX11 isn't supported on Wii U everybody PaNIc!!!"

OpenGL is based upon a kitty of functionality using extensions; and the great thing about being based on extensions is that you have more controlled functionality and rapid development.
Its also all you got where Nintendo and Sony are concerned DX as a standard doesn't apply.

So its not too far fetched to believe that the Wii U GPU has a whole bunch of OpenGL 4.x instruction that will only be found on its GPU. Afterall if you consider the range of controllers alone, especially the gamepad screens you'll find theres a whole range of extensions just for them. In the end, the pure truth is (as has been commented on by many devs) the Wii U OpenGL functionality has more cool and interesting ideas, not just a standard set as dictated by DX.

This thread is fear mongering and misleading and should be shutdown. @solitanze

The thread was left long enough in the main Boards to have sufficient exposure and given the nature of the source material and seeing that the majority of participants are users from the graphics thread, the thread has now been merged into the Graphics thread for now pending further developments.

As for DirectX 10 support ending Jan 1st I'm dubious. Sure XP dies at that point and PC gaming has no reason to aim lower but what happens if the PS4 and Xbox One don't sell like everyone is hoping? Are third parties really going to give up cash cow consoles? EA isn't giving up the Wii for their Fifa 14 release. If Sony and Microsoft fail to grab up huge chunks of the market early on publishers WILL continue down porting their games to the PS3 and Xbox360. It is all about the money at the end of the day. Nothing else. Now whether that means the Wii U would also get the down ports I don't know but I'm going to wait till 2014 to freak out.

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Oh its so easy to pick on the Wii U because its the only next gen console to actually exist. Make no mistake though, the other two would be in exactly the same boat if they were real.

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Since the other 2 are pretty much confirmed to definitely be in the HD 7xxx range.....
No. Plain and simple.

The WiiU not supporting the full DX 11 feature set means nothing good for the hardware, and is the final knock-out blow for your whole e6xxx assumptions, which were based on nothing right from the start anyways.
IF those sources speak the truth. Though I doubt we`ll get confirmation on that anytime soon.

Well whatever, If I get content like X that at least makes the best out of the DX10-level effects i´m content.
Never expected much from the WiiU multiplatform wise anyways....

Theres no need to discuss this crap. Its unwinnable because you're all arguing on a fallacy.

The GPU's in consoles are all heavily customised its why its so hard to compare them to thier off-the-shelf couterparts.

DX has no meaning therefore. DX is a standard set of features totally dependent on MS. OpenGL is very flexible with its features and instructions, API's are custom built and in fact AMD also provide cooperative support with development.

The custom nature of console GPU's means they could very well house extensions and instructions equal to DX11/OpenGL 4.x and any manner of shader revision. Its only important to maintain a strict standard when actually using DX which Nintendo and Sony do not do.

There are also other more unique features of console GPU's and as I said before. Features like gamepad support. Its what is meant by devs when they cite the Wii U GPU as being unique and interesting and many generations ahead of thier older counterparts.
Those are the best comments they can make to quantify the nature of the GPU.

Once API support for the Wii U increases (because popular engine development sure as hell isn't making it easy for Wii U content providers) then we'l, see more of those features displayed, above whats aready discernable in recent trailers for upcomming content.

Dat clipping... Damn, 8GB GDDR5 Ram and again like last gen, clipping. Bad draw distance, i hope they'll fixe it in the final game...
And you can see with the clipping on the top-left, the lighting and shadows are prebaked.

You can see the gpu, is at least 25cm, is longer but his leg is not allowing us to see the full lenght of it.

It is also very very fat... so I think is dual, like RADEN XX90 SERIES.

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Ok, most demos in E3 and most demos in early stages of a game run in engine, that means where the engine is running, and most engines run on Windows. So yeah, most of this presentations run in engine.

That was my point with the Shadow of Eternals game, it was an in engine demo using DX11, but it was clearly the Wii U version of the game... So it makes no point building a version using DX11 if the Wii U can't support it or it can be easily ported.

You can see the gpu, is at least 25cm, is longer but his leg is not allowing us to see the full lenght of it.

It is also very very fat... so I think is dual, like RADEN XX90 SERIES.

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Ok, most demos in E3 and most demos in early stages of a game run in engine, that means where the engine is running, and most engines run on Windows. So yeah, most of this presentations run in engine.

That was my point with the Shadow of Eternals game, it was an in engine demo using DX11, but it was clearly the Wii U version of the game... So it makes no point building a version using DX11 if the Wii U can't support it or it can be easily ported.

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its not an issue the Wiiu uses custom shaders, just like the wii did: the wii used a shading process called TEV, the wiiu uses a custom more up to date process. its arcane to think of the wiiu needing dx11, its custom and uses opengl...

Does anyone know if at E3 there were any actual PS4 and/or XB1 that the press got there hands on and played? Like were they in the same room with a unit that was running and visibly plugged into a display?