tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-48254876926276079332020-06-06T22:55:16.300-07:00City Of Angels International Christian Church (ICC) Blog<center>A former leader in Kip McKean's newest cult talks about lies, corruption, hypocrisy, and abuse in the ICC <br> "El Ministerio Latino"</center>Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger103125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-80179171055249482252015-06-26T19:42:00.002-07:002015-06-28T17:21:19.265-07:00Another Blogger Joins the Fray: The Articles of Indignation: Exposing the Corruption of Kip McKean's "Churches" (The ICC)I am glad to welcome <a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/">a new blogger</a> to the fray today, a former member of Kip McKean's International Christian Church (ICC) with quite a few things to say about his time in the cult. His conclusions about the group are strikingly similar to mine. I think it adds strength to both my statements and his that we both were able to come to such similar conclusions about the abusive nature of this group. (Well, he and I and a few thousand other people before us.)<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>"Dan" has written a series of nine articles so far, which he has just published together as a group. The articles speak in depth about the ICC's corruption, practices to extort as much money as possible from their victims, the ICC's psychological control systems, manipulative and deceitful practices, character assassination, and how Kip McKean hides corruption and silences his victims (good Lord, I have personal experience on that one).<br /><br />The blog:&nbsp;<a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/">http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/</a><br /><br />His articles (so far):<br /><br /><a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/2015/06/article-1-iccs-corrupt-policies-for.html">1. The ICC's Corrupt Policies for Money (Part 1)</a><br /><br /><a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/2015/06/article-2-iccs-corrupt-policies-for.html">2. The ICC's Corrupt Policies for Money (Part 2)</a><br /><br /><a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/2015/06/article-3-iccs-extortion-and-coercion.html">3. The ICC's Extortion and Coercion for Money</a><br /><br /><a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/2015/06/article-4-iccs-psychological-control.html">4. The ICC's Psychological Control System</a><br /><br /><a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/2015/06/article-5-iccs-psychological-control.html">5. The ICC's Psychological Control System Part 2: The Issue of Central Leadership</a><br /><br /><a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/2015/06/article-6-other-manipulative-tactics.html">6. Other Manipulative Tactics, Deceitful Arguments, and Abusive Methods</a><br /><br /><a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/2015/06/article-7-character-assassination.html">7. Character Assassination: The "Bitter Card" and the "Prideful Card"</a><br /><br /><a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/2015/06/article-8-spiritual-pornography-kip.html">8. "Spiritual Pornography": Kip McKean's Ruse for Hiding Corruption and Silencing Victims</a><br /><br /><a href="http://thearticlesofindignation.blogspot.com/2015/06/article-10-iccs-universal-excuse-we-are.html">9. The ICC's Universal Excuse: "We are Evangelizing the World"</a><br /><div><br /></div><div>Let's give this guy major props for writing such a complete manifesto with such detail about why the ICC is such a terrible organization. Seriously, what church besides the Westboro Baptist Church has so many detractors? (Hint: There Is A Reason For The Existence of Said Detractors And It Isn't Because "God's Church Is Always Persecuted"!)</div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com142tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-61779721386373074162015-06-24T21:47:00.003-07:002015-06-24T21:57:18.743-07:00MORE Ways You Know You're Part of Kip McKean's ICC / SODMThank you to my many helpers for this post! Here are some <i>more</i> ways you can tell that you are part of the so-called SODM / Sold-Out Discipling Movement, aka the ICC / International Christian Church, or whatever Kip McKean is calling his group of not-yet-former followers for the moment. (Check out the original list&nbsp;<a href="http://www.exicc.org/2015/04/you-know-youre-member-of-kip-mckeans.html">here</a>.)<br /><br />10. ...You're lame enough to claim that you attended Kip's fantasy college, the <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/03/international-college-christian-ministry-iccm.html">International College of Christian Ministry (ICCM)</a>, before he even started it! Kip created the ICCM in 2012 yet many evangelists/women's ministry leaders like Chenelle Patterson, Jared McGee and Ron Harding assert they attended the "school" several years prior to its actual inception. According to their Facebook pages, Chenelle claims she attended from 2009-2013, Jared 2007-2013 and Ron 2006-2013. Why the spin? Perhaps to give unsuspecting individuals the "impression" that they graduated from a legitimate four year university which the ICCM is NOT!<br /><a name='more'></a>9. ...You're OK with "spinning the truth" or what the rest of the world considers LYING. Coltin Rohn, the Boston ICC leader, claims he has a Marriage and Family Counseling degree from the ICCM. Really??? According to the City of Angels website the only undergrad degree the ICCM offers is a degree in ministry. Not to mention that many evangelists/women's ministry leaders were awarded degrees without having to take a single course. They just had to shell out $300 for the cost of the cape, gown and certificate and more than likely were reimbursed by their respective churches for the cost. CAN YOU SAY DIPLOMA MILL???<br /><br />(10 &amp; 9 are just a few examples (AMONG MANY) of the culture of deceit that is so prevalent in the ICC and among its leadership.")<br /><br />8. Being able to wear swimsuits is determined by your leader. For instance, the women's ministry leader of the LA AMS ministry, Sonja Chloupek, wears bathing suits albeit when she is away from the church vacationing with family. Whereas the WML in the OC Region, Kelly Bartholomew, feels it's highly inappropriate for ICC members to wear swimsuits in public, under any circumstance, and doesn't permit her disciples to do so. This also applies to "brothers" going shirtless. A big NO, NO for some leaders. Yet, a dude who owns a gym and is a up and coming leader in the LA AMS ministry often works out with no shirt and leaders don't seem to have a problem with it. Maybe because the leaders consider his guy a "valuable member" and don't want to piss him off so he doesn't walk.<br /><div><span class="comment-actions secondary-text" id="bc_0_1MN" kind="m" style="background-color: #c0a154; color: #333333; font-family: Georgia, Utopia, 'Palatino Linotype', Palatino, serif; font-size: 12.8800001144409px; line-height: 14.4256010055542px;"></span></div><div><br /></div><div>7. You can't tell the "sisters" from the porn stars at an Arts, Media, Sin (cough) Sports ministry event<br /><br />6. Terms like "Gibeonite Deception" and "Plundering the Egyptians" are used by ICC leaders/members to justify exagerrating the truth (ie. lying) in favor of the church and/or soliciting donations from non-members for special missions drives<br /><br />5. It's announced that the 20 year old kid that was baptized last Sunday, put on staff by Wednesday and appointed an evangelist on Friday is your new church leader<br /><br />4. You read Henry Kriete's letter for the first time and think, "WTF!!! Kip has done this before?!?"</div><br />3. You're a struggling single mom and your discipler tells you to get clothes at Goodwill and groceries from the food bank to pay to send others to conferences in European.<br /><br />2.&nbsp;A personal problem you shared with your discipler turns up in the LE's sermon 2 weeks later<br /><br />1. When your utilties get shut off, you're told that if you would have given more money consistently God would have honored that by giving you more than enough to pay your bills.<br /><br />0. When a married brother hits on you by "confessing" that he finds you more attractive than his wife. In fact, he says he's never been attracted to her because she's quite ugly, but he wanted a spouse in order to have sex and she was matched up with him because they were both "spiritual."<br /><br />-1. When you rebuff Married Brother's advances, he goes to your discipler and lies, saying that you told him an inappropriate joke--and your discipler believes him.<br /><div><span class="comment-actions secondary-text" id="bc_0_14MN" kind="m" style="background-color: #c0a154; color: #333333; font-family: Georgia, Utopia, 'Palatino Linotype', Palatino, serif; font-size: 12.8800001144409px; line-height: 14.4256010055542px;"></span></div><br />-2. You attend an all congregational church service to find that most of the older, wiser and spiritually mature disciples have either left or been disfellowshipped for questioning and exposing the unbiblical practices/behavior imposed by ICC leadership; leaving only "baby Christians" in their teens and early 20(s) who are often the most vulnerable and susceptible to spiritual abuse.<br /><br />-3. Your evangelist tells you that as a "leader in God's modern day movement (the ICC)" you are personally responsible for the souls/salvation of those in your bible talk and part of ensuring their salvation is making sure the members are tithing each week and meeting their special missions goal. (Kip's gotta get paid! - Ed.)<br /><br />-4. A young husband and father who has been out of work for months is told he has to quit his new job if he wants to get baptized (ie. saved) because the job requires that every employee work one weekend a month. God forbid this young man misses one Sunday in order to put bread on the table and a roof over his family's head. Yet the Olympic athlete, entertainment host and news broadcaster (just to name a few) are able to miss "meetings of the body" due to their type of work. <br /><br />-5. The evangelist's wife gets up to speak and all you can think about is the boob job she got as a disciple.<br /><div><span class="comment-actions secondary-text" id="bc_0_21MN" kind="m" style="background-color: #c0a154; color: #333333; font-family: Georgia, Utopia, 'Palatino Linotype', Palatino, serif; font-size: 12.8800001144409px; line-height: 14.4256010055542px;"></span></div><div><br /></div><div>-6. "Church" leaders have new recruits stand on street corners tagging (begging for money) to give to "MERCY" (helping the poor), then misappropriate that money to pay for things not related to MERCY or helping the poor at all. Then make fun of anyone who might dare to criticize them for doing so.</div><div><br /></div><div>-7. You are instantly labeled as "BITTER" if you ever dare to point out anything that your "church" or your leaders are doing wrong, no matter how blatant, obvious, or egregious their error. YOU are wrong and have a bad heart for daring - DARING - to question them.</div><br />-8. your dad is told he has to move the family every couple of years for the sake of "spreading the gospel" only to learn that Kip NEVER ONCE uprooted his own family for the gospel's sake. All three of his kids got to grow-up and establish roots in one of LA's most affluent communities, Pacific Palisades, and attend the same expensive private school most of their lives. #sucksbeingakingdomkid<br /><br />-9. the evangelist shares that the church had one of the most "HISTORIC Bring Your Neighbor Days EVER with more visitors than there are members..." Except he fails to mention that most of these "visitors" were made up of infants and toddlers in children's ministry. #sucksbeingakingdomkid<br /><br />-10. many of the most notoriously abusive ICOC staff leaders who are washed up, jobless with no marketable career skills, in broken marriages with kids who want nothing to do with God OR church flock to the ICC with the hopes of going back in the full time ministry and are actually rehired by Kip to start the cycle of spiritual abuse all over again. #sucksbeingakingdomkid<br /><br />-11. AAAALLLLL of the ICC sermons, regardless of who and where it's preached (whether by Joe Willis in Australia, Mike Williamson in London, Raja Rajan in India, Anthony Eckels in Texas,etc.) basically have the three same points:<br /><br />1. Multiply or Die-ICC's obsession with numbers<br />2. Show Me the Money, Honey-ICC's obsession with $$<br />3. Submit or Your Leader's Gonna Have A Fit-ICC's obsession with control<br /><div><br /></div><div>-12.&nbsp;Evangelist, Blaise Feumba, is pictured with an awkward look on his face kneeling next to a member of the Haiti ICC who is laying on a cement floor in obvious pain dying of cancer (May 3rd Good News E-Mail) and all you can think is maybe M.E.R.C.Y. should have used some of the funds collected during the numerous U.S. church "tagging" drives to buy this poor lady a bed instead of trying to get as many people paid and registered for a leadership conference held at a Hilton Resort in SoCal. (Misuse of funds is one of the basic underlying principles - or is it lack of principles? - underpinning the foundation of the ICC. - Ed.)</div><div><br /></div>-13. "High Profile" ICOC leaders who have stopped attending church regularly, cheated on their spouses, been divorced multiple times, known to "struggle" w/ porn, pain pills and pot, have children barely out of their teens posting booty pics of themselves on social media, etc. are able to "place membership" in the ICC instead of being "restored". Yet, the rank and file disciple who never misses a church event, serves tirelessly in children's ministry, shuffles people back in forth from bible talk/studies and is relied upon to cover the rent for five roommates who happen to be unpaid interns of the church is brought before the congregation because the church leader "feels" that this member is lukewarm for missing their tithe for the past 3 weeks and not regularly having visitors to church. <br /><br />-14. Your group doesn't have visitors for church or BT, so your BT leader pulls the group together to rebuke everyone in the group......yet he himself didn't have visitors either! When confronted on this by a member, he says, "I know; this rebuke is intended for *all* of us, myself included" (even though he is the one who is berating/accusing the rest of us while we sit there like obedient sheep). <br /><div><br /></div><div>-15.&nbsp;You know you're a part of Kip McKean's sold out movement when the organization is SOOO sold out that it has more than a 50% "fall away" rate, "secret sin" is rampant in the different congregations that it's even mentioned in the Good Snooze E-mail, and many of Kip's churches have not experienced net growth for several years.</div><div><br /></div><div>-16. "ICC is losing members" = "God is pruning us; that proves we are truly his movement." "ICC is growing" = "God is adding to our number; that proves we are truly his movement."</div><div><br /></div><div>-17. You serve an almighty and all-powerful "god" who can do anything.....except for, maybe, coming up with a few dollars for "missions" without his leaders begging everyone for money on their Facebook pages.<br /><br />-18. When your husband, an ICC member, tells you that he unequivocally believes that Kip's church (because it's apparently the "one true church") takes priority over your marriage and family. Members are indoctrinated to put the church FIRST before any relationship or commitment including those with a spouse and children. Here's a glimpse of what this looks like:<br /><br />-19. If you cannot plan or attend any special occasions (ie. birthday celebrations, anniversary dinners, holiday parties, etc.) that fall on a Wednesday or Friday night because the church has mandatory devotional and bible talk scheduled these nights. <br /><br />-20. Couples and/or families cannot get away for the weekend because missing church on Sunday is a big No, No. <br /><br />-21. Family vacations have to be planned around all church events (eg. GLC, Jubiliees, Winter Workshops, Campus Retreats, Women's Days, Marriage Retreats, etc.) so this basically leaves you Monday and Tuesday unless of course your husband's D-Time is scheduled on one of these days/nights then you and your kids are out of luck. </div><div><br /></div><div>-22. AND SO ON AND SO ON ....</div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com60tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-10440681981726106412015-06-18T20:46:00.002-07:002015-06-19T17:17:19.494-07:00Kip McKean: Closet Atheist?<div><b>a·the·ist</b> - "a person who lacks belief in the existence of God"</div><div><br /></div><div>Kip McKean for decades has always liked to present himself as a sort of "super Christian" and even at one time believed that he was literally a full-fledged apostle of Jesus Christ - just like Paul and Peter and the rest of the twelve or so historical apostles, who died out about two thousand years ago, never to be replaced until Kip walked the earth.&nbsp;</div><div><br /></div><div>But when we look a little closer, we can come to no conclusion other than Kip must be a closet atheist.&nbsp;</div><div><br /></div><div>Either that, or he has invented a "god" in his own mind (which makes him no different from a pagan or idolater). What other possible could explain Kip's bizarre statements and behavior?<br /><a name='more'></a></div><div>Because... if Kip McKean really believed the Bible (the Old Testament and the New), as he publicly declares, he would be living and preaching completely differently.</div><div>If Kip really believed that God was going to eternally condemn all non-believers, and in particular all "non-disciples," the mark that he so constantly uses to set his group apart from all other "false churches," then he would be spending literally every waking moment begging and pleading with people to repent/believe, everywhere he went. Note that Kip has been in control of incredibly massive amounts of money - the ICOC at it's height under his leadership was pulling in $200 MILLION dollars per year, with a total take of well over a BILLION, Kip could have easily used a tiny percentage of the money to take his message to every person in the United States, and probably the world. Wouldn't that only be fair, to at least give every person a real chance, since Kip has always taught that only his churches taught the "true" Christianity?&nbsp;</div><div><br /></div><div>If Kip really believed that Jesus was the example all Christians were called to follow - then Kip would be spending his days doing what Jesus actually did: eating with lowlife sinners, feeding the hungry, showing compassion on the sick and the weak, hanging out with the rejected dregs of society, and preaching from town to town.&nbsp;</div><div><br /></div><div>If he really believed the OT's teaching on righteousness and raising children... then he literally would have had to stone his own children when they rebelled and "fell away".&nbsp;</div><div><br /></div><div>If Kip really believed that Jesus said what he meant, then he would be quite literally terrified for his very soul - since Jesus spent a lot of time saying that false teachers and "those who say Lord Lord" but don't obey are going to Hell; since Jesus spent a lot of time slamming the Pharisees for doing/teaching the exact same things Kip does/teaches.&nbsp;</div><div><br /></div><div>And don't even get me started on the parable of the Sheep and Goats. Kip certainly would not be spending so much of his time arguing about vague, unclear doctrines relating to "authority" (teachings which ALWAYS include the requirement that money constantly flow from his followers towards him in ever-increasing amounts) ...or presiding over a fake college (which "honors" him with a fake doctorate degree and classes about the greatness of Kip McKean) ... or putting on elaborate "global leadership conferences" at fancy hotels (which his members can't afford to stay at yet are expected to anyways.)</div><div><br /></div><div>Kip, the follower of Christ and true man of God, would not be caught dead living in the lap of luxury&nbsp;in Marina del Rey's most upscale condo building, spending hundreds of thousands of donated dollars with the supposed hope of eventually converting a "sharp" resident there when there are thousands of lost souls he could be reaching at homeless shelters and clinics. (Didn't Jesus say something about when you throw a banquet to invite the poor, crippled, those who can't pay you back?)</div><div><br /></div><div>We could go on and on. Bottom line is that Kip is no more a "believer" in (much less a "disciple" of) the deity described in the Bible or the classic Christian gospel than any other random person off of the street.<br /><br /><i>(Written in part with a collaborator who wishes to remain anonymous. Please note that no derogatory meaning is intended towards those who do not believe in God or the Bible, and this post simply points out the difference between what Kip McKean publicly professes and what his actions actually show.)</i></div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com40tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-12247249318430254542015-05-16T21:40:00.000-07:002015-05-24T18:13:42.467-07:00Kip McKean to Step Down as Leader of City of Angels CultAccording to Kip McKean's "Good News Email," an electronic propaganda tool he uses to promote his cult, Kip will be stepping down as LE (lead evangelist) of the City of Angels International Christian Church cult, effective in about one year from now (summer 2016).<br /><br />This comes as welcome news to many of us who are hoping for the failure of the cult and for the protection of countless young people who are in danger of becoming involved and having their lives completely taken over by years of forced "volunteer" service, as once happened to me and to hundreds of thousands of others like me.<br /><br />The leadership of Los Angeles branch of the "Sold-Out Discipling Movement," a non-movement created by McKean in an attempt to consolidate his power and multiply his income, sorry, I mean, created by McKean in a valiant effort to fearlessly take the true, lost gospel of the first century Church to a lost modern world, saving a generation of people who would otherwise be lost in its entirety to the eternal fires of hell, will be taken over by McKean disciple, Tim Kernan. Tim is known for being Canadian and for speaking Canadian French as well as English, and for getting very red in the face when he is serious about whatever he is talking about.<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>Kip, for his part, will dedicate his time and efforts towards his "Crown of Thorns" project, which is the name that he came up with, sorry, that the Holy Spirit came up with to describe his current plans to create a clone of the International Churches of Christ (ICOC), the network of churches that he created and that in a rare, wise move, subsequently removed him from their leadership in 2001 or so.<br /><br />It does make me think back a bit to that original announcement made in the ICOC that Kip was going on a "sabbatical" for a time to work on personal and family issues. Of course, that sabbatical turned into a full dismissal from all duties and employment of Kip by the ICOC. It was just baby steps to getting rid of Kip completely. We could only hope that this will turn out to be a similar case in the ICC. However, this is not likely, as Kip has ruthlessly vetted his top leadership for loyalty to himself. Not that this is effective, as there have been multiple reports of his top leaders laughing at him behind his back. But then, they laugh at each other behind each others' backs as well, just like Jesus would do (irony.)<br /><br />So, why this change? Kip has been slipping for years. Even when I was an active member five years ago, word was going around through the leadership that Kip was starting to get too old to do the job he had once done. Forgetting what orders he gave to which cult staff, keeping things straight, mental capacity stuff like that. I can only imagine what five more years of toll may have been taken on his mind, what with the pressure of saving the whole of the lost human race resting solely on his shoulders. Or the frustration and humiliation of leading a tiny cult of 3,000 instead of the 100,000 that he once did. Or just age? Either way. There were rumors of Kip having some serious health problems a few months ago but I didn't dig far enough to get the full scoop.<br /><br />What might this change mean? Honestly, nobody will lead anything the way Kip does. Kip is unmatched in his drive, knowledge, and understanding of organizational dynamics. Kip makes churches increase in number (notice I didn't say "grow.") Kip is good at pushing people towards ever-increasing fanaticism - I mean - helping people continually increase their level of commitment to God. No-one - NO-ONE - in the ICC is as effective at doing this as Kip is, Tim included.<br /><br />Tim, as I knew him, is much less driven than Kip. Tim likes to relax and watch movies and play video games. Kip seems to have no "off" switch, except maybe when dining at fancy restaurants on the church's dime (my observation). So, I'd anticipate (hope for?) a bit of a kinder, gentler cult under Tim's hand. Ah, who am I kidding? All of Kip's franchises work on churning through fresh blood, sucking new recruits dry of as much time and money as possible, just like they did to me and so many others, no matter who is at the helm.<br /><br />This brings up an interesting comment that Tim Kernan made to me years ago about Kip McKean's ministry methodology. Tim described Kip's ministry to me as a very "dirty workshop." He explained that Kip had a very "dirty" way of getting things done. I did not know at the time to what he was referring, although I did find out later, when Kip did some of his dirty work on me. (One of his top guys had been threatening me and stole a few thousand from me, and Kip, despite a full confession, backed his leader up, and then actually made threats my myself and my family, which he even repeated later to me to make sure I understood he was serious. <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2012/11/why-im-no-longer-part-of-city-of-angels.html">Read that full story here</a>. You can read more about <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/08/why-i-left-icc-by-victor-m-gonzalez-jr.html">the dirty side of ICC methodology in this article written by a high-ranking ICC leader, Victor Gonzalez Jr</a>., who also very publicly left the cult not too long ago.)<br /><br />The interesting thing is that Tim knew even back then about the "dirty" methodologies that Kip employs, and seemed to have reservations about them, yet has continued to work and train under Kip despite that fact. I suppose this tells us something about Tim, about Kip, or maybe even about human nature. Anyway, the five years that have passed since Tim made that comment to me is a long time for Kip to have worked on Tim's "leadership abilities," molding him into a more ruthless, vicious, and "effective" version of his former self.<br /><br />Time will tell. However, it seems to me like the stars are aligning and the "growth" of Kip's ministry will continue to slow. And this is a good thing, since every person who is not baptized into the International Christian Church is one person saved from the system of abuse and lies that is the ICC.<br /><br />And here's to a hopefully less "dirty" way of doing business in the ICC.Unknownnoreply@blogger.com64tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-18045931040548052372015-04-21T21:42:00.005-07:002015-05-24T18:16:48.731-07:00You Know You're A Member of Kip McKean's Sold Out Movement When<div>Guest post by anonymous writer via the comments section of a previous post (thank you and please keep the great comments coming!):</div><div><br /></div>10. You're not permitted to wear swim suits, ride alone in a car with the opposite sex, go on solo dates and must look away during kissing scenes on tv/movie "to protect your purity". Yet, there are no shortage of sisters who show up for church in skin tight clothing, wearing hooker heels with hair/make-up all done in a way that would rival any hard working stripper. <br /><br />9. You're told that you must IMITATE, OBEY and SUBMIT to the authority of your 22 year-old church leader who barely had enough credits to graduate high school, never had a job other than his stint as a bus boy at Frosty Freeze and brags during every sermon that he has a degree from the church's unaccredited school the ICCM. Meanwhile his wife (the women's ministry leader) still reads Teen Vogue and is obsessed with taking selfies.<br /><br />8. Every Good News E-Mail is inundated with pictures of Kip, Elena and other ICC Leaders traveling the globe (in style) visiting places like London, Paris, Spain, Australia, Hawaii, Chile, etc. While you're struggling to pay the rent/bills, living off of top ramen and can barely afford the gas to shuffle your 6 roommates to and from church events because you are constantly brow beaten to "sacrifice" so as to fund these vacations, ahem, I mean "missionary" trips.<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>7. ICC leaders convince wives that it is their "COTTON PICKIN' DUTY" to financially support their husbands (and family) so hubbies can devote all of their time and energy to Kip's church slaving away as UNPAID staff members/interns.<br /><br />6. Elena McKean hasn't served a day in her life in children's ministry because "that isn't her role."<br /><br />5. ICC leaders require that everyone wear their M.E.R.C.Y. t-shirts (Maximizing Efforts for Relief Care and Youth- the "supposedly" charitable arm of the church) to collect donations. Yet the money raised is not used to help the poor and needy but instead to pay for people's GLC/Jubilee registration and/or to meet the church's Special Mission's goal. <br /><br />4. Five people are baptized on Sunday, four are struggling by Wednesday and one is barely faithful by Friday yet the evangelist enthusiastically claims that his region had a CRANKIN' week at the staff meeting. <br /><br />3. The A.M.S. Ministry stands for Arts, Media and Sin.<br /><br />2. When words like CRANKIN', EPIC and HISTORIC is used to describe E.V.E.R.Y.T.H.I.N.G that Kip does right down to making himself a bologna sandwich.<br /><br />1. When Kip's newly appointed WSL(s) can barely locate the books in the New Testament let alone where to find their assigned "world sector" on a map (ain't that right "Joanie B" and "Jee B"?).<br /><div><br /></div><div>Please add to the fun and contribute your own items to this list in the comments below!</div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com118tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-29233032552686569872014-10-22T17:44:00.001-07:002014-10-22T19:29:10.192-07:0010 Things Concerned Parents Should Know About Kip McKean and the ICC10. Two-thirds of the ICC is made up of college students between the ages of 18 and 22. Most drop out of college because they are unable to manage both school and the rigorous church schedule that each member is required to adhere to: church on Sunday, midweek service on Wednesday, bible talk on Friday, discipiling (D-times) meetings, evangelism or "sharing" several hours a day, bible studies with new recruits, "serving" paid staff leaders by house cleaning, baby sitting, running errands for them, etc. Failure to meet these demands are met with brow beating sessions where students are made to feel that they have a bad heart and are selfish by not putting the church first and as a result risk going to hell.<br /><br />9. All three of Kip McKean's kids went to private school, graduated from Ivy-League colleges, and went to graduate school. Kip's children left the organization and want nothing to do with the church. Side Note: during her college years, Kip's eldest child suffered from bouts of depression and thoughts of suicide due to the scrutiny and intense pressure to preform which are hallmarks of Kip's leadership and church culture. Since many within the ICC (including top leaders), as well as ex-members have shared that they too have experienced these emotions as a result of their affiliation with the church, Kip felt compelled to write an article on the topic of Acedia, The Forgotten Sin to deflect his responsibility in cultivating an environment where depression is common because members never feel like they are able to do enough or measure up to Kip's standard.<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>8. The organization's internal college, <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/03/international-college-christian-ministry-iccm.html">ICCM</a>, is not accredited. Several students have dropped out of legitimate universities to enroll in the ICCM.<br /><br />7. Many of the ICC's top leadership (World Sector Leaders) is comprised of men who have been married multiple times, fathered children outside of marriage, and spent time in jail for fraud. A one time WSL committed adultery twice with prostitutes. When questioned about the lack of credibility and experience of the men and women he has appointed to oversee churches and world sectors , Kip's response is "The church just doesn't have the talent..."<br /><br />6. Members are required to "tag" (stand on street corners or busy intersections begging for money) to raise funds for Special Missions and countless retreats, conferences, workshops, etc. hosted by the church. It's not unusual for college students to use their financial aid money to make their Special Missions requirement. The pressure to fund these projects are often so great that the son of a high ranking shepherding couple was arrested for stealing watches from a department store to make his special missions contribution.<br /><br />5. The church often preaches that if one is not regularly "fruitful" (personally meeting, studying the bible, and baptizing someone) they will be cut off from Jesus and thrown into hell. Yet, no one can remember the last time Kip's wife, Elena McKean, was personally fruitful nor any of her direct disciples. Apparently, John 15:5-8 doesn't apply to them. <br /><br />4. The church systematically infantilizes its members by requiring that members get permission (ie. "advice") from church leaders about everything in their lives-where to live, where to work, where to go to school, who to date, whom to marry, whether or not they can go on vacation. Students in particular are discouraged from going home during school break to visit family.<br /><br />3. Excluding college students, the remainder of the church is made up of the "working poor". Individuals and families that can barely make ends meet yet are guilted into sacrificing all they have to the church with the promise that God will take care of them. Yet, the only people God seems to be "taking care of" is those in upper leadership. <br /><br />2. The church does not baptize foreigners unless they agree to return to their country of origin with the sole purpose to expand the ICC.<br /><br />1. Kip believes that he is a "modern day apostle", "God's right hand man", and a "high priest." He often uses Deuteronomy 17:12-13 to instill fear and compliance in those that are "arrogant" enough to question his decisions and actions:<br /><br />"The person who acts arrogantly, refusing to listen either to the priest who stands there serving the Lord your God or to the judge, MUST DIE. You must purge the evil from Israel. 13 Then all the people will hear about it, be afraid, and no longer behave arrogantly."<br /><br /><i>This list was&nbsp;originally&nbsp;a series of anonymous comments on the ExICC.org post,&nbsp;<a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/05/crosswalkcom-10-signs-of-abusive-church.html">Crosswalk.com: 10 Signs of an Abusive Church</a>. The comments were so well written that it is now going to live as it's own, separate post. I found it to be overwhelmingly accurate, and even learned a few juicy tidbits that were new to me.</i>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com232tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-74067045844669708932014-08-31T16:44:00.001-07:002014-10-22T19:23:51.866-07:00Victor M. Gonzalez, Jr. - Why I Left the ICC!WHY I LEFT THE ICC!<br /><br /><i>Guest contributor: Former ICC evangelist, Victor M. Gonzalez, Jr.&nbsp;</i><br /><i><br /></i>Proverbs 18:17 "In a lawsuit the first to speak seems right, until someone comes forward and cross-examines."<br /><br />Many of you have asked very valid questions recently. Where do I start?<br /><br />I was fired on August 1, 2014 for my convictions. This was after Thomas (Kip) apologized for every single accusation that he had brought against me. Kyle Bartholomew was there; so was Joan Bartholomew, his wife, as were Elena (Kip's wife) and Aurora (my wife). You see, I don't agree with double standards: applying scriptures to some and then not to others. I don't agree with manipulation.<br /><br />Thomas (Kip) has asked and lied about asking people to write letters against me (amongst the latest confirmed are Jared McGee and Rachel McGee who lead the Mexico City ICC). When Thomas (Kip) presented these letters to me, he simply said, "These are totally unsolicited. I didn't ask for them - they just sent them to me - look at what they are saying about you." At the GLC, when asked about his letter, Jared answered, "Yes. Thomas (Kip) asked for our input and wanted us to write a letter about you guys."<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>This is manipulation at its best.<br /><br />I don't believe in the control that the leadership asserts or tries to assert on people. Opinions are opinions and advice is advice. All of you who know me, my courageous wife and sacrificial kids, you know our love for people. I have been fasting, praying and allowing God to guide me.<br /><br />I told Thomas (Kip) on August 1, the day he fired me, "The ministry is not a job - it's a calling. You didn't call me - God did, and I will be faithful to His calling." I am not interested in slandering my brothers in the ICOC or anyone; I don't want to focus on slandering people. I want to focus on loving people. I want to be known for my love. I want to surround myself with people that want to love other people into the Kingdom.<br /><br />I moved to Portland in the spring of 2004 because I saw there a new direction, no longer the overbearing focus on numbers, money, people and the manipulation thereof. Thomas (Kip) apologized for this type of behavior in the early Portland days.<br /><br />Did he lie to us? Or is he falling back to his old sinful pattern?<br /><br />Then on Tuesday, August 12, after the conference (GLC) I told Thomas (Kip) that I was grateful for the conference and that this was my last service with the group. I told him I was starting a new Church, a new Hope - a Church built on true righteousness.<br /><br />He then said, "You will be marked and disfellowshipped."<br /><br />To which I said, "Do what you need to do, my brother."<br /><br />Besides my wife, father, and one other person, I had not made this decision public to anyone as I had not wanted to cause peoples' hearts to question. My wife and I have been attempting to bring up concerns and work out issues we have seen within the leadership for many years now. Going into the GLC, we had both felt hopeful, but after witnessing various alarming situations, we prayed and decided we could no longer continue worshiping with the ICC.<br /><br />Out of respect to Thomas (Kip), I waited till the end of the conference to inform him of this. The VIOLENCE that was shown towards me was unacceptable. Thomas (Kip) grabbed my arm and tried to pull me and after he continued to do so, I asked him to please let me go.<br /><br />He was yanking my arm as he said, "You're getting outta here." I told him I had paid for the conference and I had just as much right to be there as him. Then Cory Blackwell grabbed me and I advised him to let me go because I felt threatened and attacked. He let me go and said, "I'm calling security" to which I said "I'm going to call the police, you and Kip have attacked me."<br /><br />My father then started hitting my chest and shoving me as he tauntingly said, "Call the cops! Go ahead, call them!" This kind of behavior is absolutely ridiculous and ungodly. Yet sadly, this is the "Leader of the Movement" and a "World Sector Leader" and a "Church Leader."<br /><br />I don't understand why Kip is behaving in this way towards me and my family when this is what he did twice already in his own life; it truly is hypocritical. He started the ICOC out of the mainline Churches of Christ. Then, the ICC out of the ICOC because he had a belief and conviction that things were wrong. This is exactly what I'm doing.<br /><br />I do not condemn nor look down on any disciple of Jesus no matter where they worship, but for conscience-sake can no longer personally be a part of the ICC. This marking and disfellowshippment of myself and my wife is not Biblical at all - it's POLITICAL. I have been disfellowshipped and marked for being decisive not "divisive" - Thomas (Kip) is the one dividing me from my brothers and sisters.<br /><br />This last week he tried to prohibit my mother from watching her own grandchildren. This is so sad. It is pathetic and controlling. It is not Biblical, but tactical. Do I not have the right to choose where to worship God with my family? Is this not what we did when we joined from the ICOC? Thomas (Kip) has always said that people have a right to choose where to worship; that it was not a matter of salvation, but proclamation.<br /><br />I am not teaching false doctrine; I am not drawing people away from God. I am encouraging people to draw near to God and away from man-made religion. I trust that God will provide for all my family's needs.<br /><br />It truly would have been a lot easier to stay put and get a paycheck with a lavish lifestyle. But I chose God and his truth. Even now, I'm so grateful for all who have helped us thus far on our spiritual journey.<br /><br />I know there are many unanswered questions. Please feel free to contact me for clarification on anything you desire.<br /><br />&nbsp;"But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you," Matthew 5:44<br /><br />I love everyone. I have no anger or bitterness in my heart, only a sadness for the lack of love and lack of true righteousness. I am fervently praying for us all.<br /><br /><i>Reprinted with permission.</i><br /><i><br /></i><br /><div><i>Connect with Victor M. Gonzalez, Jr. at: <a href="https://www.facebook.com/demonpunisher">https://www.facebook.com/demonpunisher</a>&nbsp;or by email at rise.ministries@gmail.com.</i><br /><br />Read about <i>my</i> run-in with Kip McKean and Victor M. Gonzalez Jr's dad here:&nbsp;<a href="http://www.exicc.org/2012/11/why-im-no-longer-part-of-city-of-angels.html">Kip McKean &amp; Friends Lie, Steal, and Threaten - Why I Left City of Angels Church</a></div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com121tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-78124971219611203472014-07-11T11:02:00.003-07:002015-03-28T16:38:31.562-07:00Kip McKean Covers Up More Teen Ministry Rapes?<b>"Today, “churches” ... cover-up the sexual abuse of children by their [leaders]."</b> (Taken from ICC propaganda email).<br /><br />This is another story that has been given to me by a friend and new ex-member of the CAICC who was made aware of the following situations at the time they occurred.<br /><br />According to this source, there were recent cases of statutory rape in the City of Angels International Christian Church teen ministry. Cases in which the rapists were protected and the victim was not. A 21-year old woman, a teen worker in the CAICC teen ministry, allegedly seduced and had sex (statutory rape) with a 15-year-old boy, a member of the CAICC teen ministry. Around the same time, <i>another</i> woman of approximately the same age as the first&nbsp;<i>also</i> committed statutory rape with the same boy. Both women were "disciples," members in good standing in the City of Angels International Christian Church.<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>The teen involved was devastated. The incidents were extremely difficult for him to deal with emotionally, and as of this writing he is still struggling to deal with the emotional wreckage caused by the abuse. Besides this, the acts were illegal and any person who commits statutory rape becomes a sex offender and suffer severe legal consequences.<br /><br />In a pattern we have observed in the past, Kip McKean's church chose NOT to notify the police of the abuse that had occurred by adults against a minor. However, the church did take action - to protect the rapists!<br /><br />The victim's mother, on the other hand, was understandably incensed, and called the police. However, the church had already aided one of the rapists to quickly relocate out-of-state. As of last notice, that rapist remains a "faithful" ICC member in another city. The consequences for the other rapist are not as clear, but she seems to still be currently an ICC member too, and has not seen legal action.<br /><br />Back to the boy. His faith was destroyed, and he left the church. His mother, who was also a member, also had her faith destroyed left the church as well.<br /><br />So once again we see how Kip McKean protects the leaders in the church, throws the rank-and-file under the proverbial bus, and through it all seeks to keep a tight lid on negative publicity.<br /><br />Imagine a parent's reaction to the situation: "Oh my God, I let my child participate in the City of Angels teen ministry, only to find out that after the songs are over, ministry leaders seduce and commits statutory rape against him/her? And then help protect the rapist, while doing nothing for my child?"<br /><br />Well, yes.<br /><br />Kip and friends probably prefer that the victim and his family are no longer part of the church, since they are certainly "bitter" and could "hurt the faith" of other ICC members.<br /><br />In short, we can observe that the ICC leadership 1. finds it preferable to protect the abusers, who remain free to abuse other minors, while 2. allowing the victimized teen to ferment in a cesspool of misery, and 3. obstruct justice for both the abusers as well as the victim.<br /><br />Funny how that is. In fact, that pattern matches<i>&nbsp;exactly</i> with&nbsp;<i>my experience</i>&nbsp;with Kip McKean and the top ICC leadership. (My story: <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2012/11/why-im-no-longer-part-of-city-of-angels.html">Why I Left the City of Angels ICC</a>)<br /><br />Is it a surprise that one of the women involved is very close to one of the key players in my story of abuse? Maybe she learned abuse from the abusive treatment by an "important" ICC leader in her own home.&nbsp;(Another source informed me that she herself has been a victim of sexual abuse within her family.)<br /><br />It seems that members of this family are able to do whatever they like, whenever they like. (As seen many times before, it pays to be close to leadership.)<br /><div><br /></div>Oh, yeah ... another point that seems clear is that the artificial front of "sexual purity" put forth by the ICC is little more than public image.<br /><div><br /></div>So, in what environment did we not only allow ONE (or more) statutory rapes to occur by one abuser, but then somehow a SECOND abuser then commits one or more ADDITIONAL rapes against the SAME VICTIM? Did the one woman tip off the other woman about an easy prey? Was the second woman emboldened to act when she saw how the first woman was able to "get away" with minimal repercussions?<br /><br />(Don't even get me started on minimal repercussions .. Why in the world are Kip McKean or Victor Gonzales Sr, among others, still working for the church? Wait .. the church EXISTS to employ guys like them.)<br /><br />So as of this writing, neither rapist has suffered any consequence for her actions. That can't bode well for the safety of other vulnerable people in the ICC, the "least of these" whom Jesus was so adamant that his disciples should protect.<br /><br />And don't think that these were totally isolated incidents, either. I was aware of several occasions in the church where adults corrupted minors, seducing them or providing them with illegal drugs. And leadership knew, and yet none of them was ever reported to the police. Years later, now that I have kids, that's pretty hard for me to wrap my head around.<br /><br />And that doesn't even include legal sex stuff, like the singles in Portland sleeping around with each other. I remember a girl with ties to leadership who was surprised to find a single guy in the church who completely abstained from sex. "Like, you NEVER have sex [as a disciple]? Not even SOMETIMES?"<br /><br />Once again, it seems that Kip McKean appears more interested in image over substance, in protecting his leaders and his group over "the least of these" who suffer in his midst.<br /><br />Of course, that was the environment into which Kip was baptized in the Gainesville Church of Christ, where his ministry leader, Chuck Lucas, was having penetrative gay sex with several male "disciples" in the campus ministry.<br /><br />Chuck Lucas, it should be mentioned, was Kip's hero, and Kip was Chuck's "star disciple." <a href="http://icoc.blogspot.com/2003/05/i-dont-know-how-i-missed-this.html">Rumors suggest that Kip was one of the guys involved in the sexual relations with Chuck</a>, and that Kip confessed this fact to the original group of WSL's in a meeting shortly before they gave him the boot from leadership of the ICOC.<br /><br />I have been reluctant to share that bit of information in case it is not true, but at the same time have not been able to find anyone to refute it. Of course, Kip wouldn't think that it was a very big deal, because 1. Kip has always said that "sin is sin" and no one sin is "worse" in God's eyes than any other sin, and because 2. Kip makes the rules anyway.<br /><br />Again, the information about the teen ministry rape victim was provided to me by a source who was aware of the situation as a member inside the CAICC. As such, my information is second-hand and I have to take this person's word for its accuracy. As a final reminder, every bit of information contained herein should be understood as "alleged." While I am posting it because I have reason to believe it is true, there remains the possibility that all or parts of this post are incorrect or infactual. If I am presented with conflicting evidence, I will be fair and appropriately amend the information posted here.Unknownnoreply@blogger.com38tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-43604610354308057952014-06-06T12:56:00.003-07:002014-06-06T12:56:46.316-07:00Why Predators and Psychopaths Are Drawn to Religious LeadershipCheck out this article about why narcissists, sociopaths (synonym for psychopath) and predators are drawn to careers in religious leadership.<br /><br />I read this thinking of Kip McKean (and Victor Gonzalez, Sr) and found them to meet basically every characteristic.<br /><br /><a href="http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/spycatcher/201404/why-predators-are-attracted-careers-in-the-clergy">Psychology Today:&nbsp;Why Predators Are Attracted to Careers in the Clergy</a>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com42tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-74584289006770894482014-05-28T17:21:00.002-07:002014-07-12T10:34:33.678-07:00Crosswalk.com: 10 Signs Of An Abusive ChurchWould you believe that Kip McKean's International Christian Churches meet ALL TEN qualifications for an abusive church?<br /><br /><a href="http://www.crosswalk.com/blogs/christian-trends/10-signs-of-an-abusive-church.html">Crosswalk: 10 Signs of an Abusive Church &gt;&gt;</a><br /><br />Every single sign applies to the ICC. However, I'd like to slightly reword "Unrealistic Promises" to make the concept more specific to the "Kipdom."<br /><br />In the ICC, only leaders are guaranteed material comfort, with the guarantees increasing with the level of leadership. All "rank-and-file" members are expected to give, and give, and give, until it hurts. And then give some more.<br /><br />Rank-and-file members are, however, promised that being "faithful to God" (which in practice is synonymous with doing whatever the ICC leadership requests or demands) means that God will bless them in unrealistic, magical ways. For example, "faithful disciples" are basically guaranteed a great spouse, "awesome" marriage, and abundant spiritual blessings from God. ICC leadership constantly preaches the message of how people's lives were terrible before finding "God" (again, saying "God" but meaning "the ICC") and how much their sad, empty, terrible lives were transformed because as a consequence of joining the church and doing whatever ICC leaders asked of them.<br /><br />What do you think? Is the ICC an abusive church?<br /><br />Someone on Facebook (a current ICC member) suggested that some of the abusive characteristics mentioned in the above-linked article are acceptable, since they are based on passages from the Bible. My response to that is 1. that's great that you are able to recognize that your church is exhibiting a majority of the abusive characteristics listed and 2. please remember that you can pretty much support anything you want with passages from the Bible, including murder and slavery, so that argument doesn't hold much water with me.<br /><br />Thoughts?Unknownnoreply@blogger.com50tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-50663172981746249822014-05-07T10:32:00.002-07:002014-05-12T12:38:36.484-07:00A Letter To Jeremy of the Phoenix ICCLetter to Jeremy Ciaramella, Lead Evangelist of the Phoenix International Christian Church.<span id="docs-internal-guid-a785a886-d7b5-070c-3baf-4b251fcca94e"></span><br /><br />Jeremy, I am disappointed. <br /><br />I was disappointed with your “help” <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2012/11/lying-stealing-and-threats-part-ii_26.html">when you and I met with Kip McKean</a> to discuss how<a href="http://www.exicc.org/2012/11/lying-stealing-and-threats-part-i.html"> Victor Gonzalez, Sr. had lied to me, abused me, stolen money from me, and threatened me</a>. <br /><br />I was disappointed because you kept your mouth shut as I was told that I was mistaken, when you had heard the full confession of my abuser. You lied to try to make me look bad and then lied to try to make others look good (ICC leaders, of course). You tricked me into meeting with you by telling me that you "loved me" (God, that sounds weirder than hell.) And then, in a final, vain and twisted attempt to try to silence my story, you used your position to separate me from my friends, all with the goal of protecting the abusers, who continue in their positions and abusing people to this day.<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>I was disappointed because you had already heard Victor’s full confession. You listened to Victor describe how he had plotted over the course of months, building layer upon layer of premeditated lies to deceive me and separate me from my money. You listened to him confess detail after detail of the lengths that he went to to trick and lie to me. And then after hearing his full confession, you took me to a meeting with Kip with the promise that it was to “fix things.” But that is not what happened.<br /><br />You silently watched me start to describe to Kip what Victor had done. You silently watched Kip interrupt me after less than a dozen words to staunchly disagree with my accusations and tell me to my face that the whole situation was merely an “innocent misunderstanding” and the Victor never had any ill intent.<br /><br />You then silently watched as Victor presented a story to Kip that completely contradicted everything that he had just confessed to you and me only two days before. You sat there, silent, as Victor claimed that he now suddenly had no recollection whatsoever of what had happened between him and me. You were silent as Victor protested his innocence and declared me the “ungrateful,” bad-hearted one who didn’t “appreciate” all of his “help.” <br /><br />You silently watched as I then complained to Kip about Victor’s habitually foul mouth. You sat silently as <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/03/kip-mckeans-650000-condo.html">Kip asked me, “What words did Victor say? Fuck? Shit? Ass?” </a><br /><br />And you sat silently as Kip told me that I was a much, much worse sinner than Victor was. <br /><br />I walked out with my head spinning and wondering how I had allowed blatant lies to be presented as fact, and how I had allowed someone who had not even been there (Kip) tell me falsehoods about what had happened to me. And then I came to realization that you, Jeremy, had been sitting there the whole time, and never opened your mouth. <br /><br />Jeremy, it was your job to open your mouth. It was your moral duty, simply as a non-evil human being, to say, “Kip, what Victor is saying now is a complete contradiction to what he so clearly confessed just two days ago. This guy here is not confused. Victor is lying.” <br /><br />With your actions, you took sides to protect the abuser. With your silence, you defended Victor’s lies and turned me into the “liar.” <br /><br />Jeremy, that was not good. <br /><br />(It wasn’t much until later that I realized that you, Kip and Victor had already discussed the situation without me present, and the outcome of our sham meeting had already been determined long before I ever walked into the room.) <br /><br />So I was disappointed, Jeremy, and rightly so. I was disappointed in Victor Gonzalez, in Kip McKean, and in Jeremy Ciaramella. <br /><br />But I still gave you the benefit of the doubt. <br /><br />Let’s fast forward just a bit. <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2012/11/that-fateful-meeting.html">Kip and Victor both make it clear that it is their intention to destroy my family</a> if I do not wish to submit to their authority. <br /><br />So my family moves away from Los Angeles, and to Phoenix, partly due to the terror that these evil men instilled in my wife and that still was living in her heart. We move to one of the few other cities on the face of the earth that had one of Kip’s churches, since obviously, Kip’s franchise of churches are the One True Church and to move anywhere else would be to leave God and destine my wife to eternity in hell. (So she still had been conditioned to believe.)<br /><br />In Phoenix, we continue attending church services at the Phoenix International Christian Church, which I had helped plant in 2006. I was hanging out with my friends there, including one who was a major church leader and someone that I helped study the Bible with and baptize. In fact, even my wife was someone that I invited off the street and baptized years before in this same Phoenix ICC - the first baptism the church saw. <br /><br />You, Jeremy, were not yet the leader of the PVICC. Someone else was. But then Kip, I’m sorry, the “Holy Spirit,” who talks exclusively to Kip, decided to move that leader away and to move you here. <br /><br />I invited you over to my house several times to share a meal. In fact, tried to invite you over so many times that my wife got mad at me and said, “Isn’t it obvious to you by now that Jeremy doesn’t want to come here? Why do you make a fool out of both of us by still inviting him?” Well, it was because I mistakenly trusted you and erroneously thought that you were my friend. <br /><br />Then I wrote about what had happened with Victor, and what happened later with Kip. Out of respect for you, I did not include your name. It was never my desire to make you look bad - in fact, although I needed to tell my story, I made sure to protect you by not naming you and also not describing your utter lack of usefulness. <br /><br />So when I posted the link on my Facebook page, it was not out of malice. Not to you or to any person. Not to hurt or destroy the church. Yes to accurately describe the abuse of Victor Gonzalez, with the hope that he might be prevented from repeat offending again. <br /><br />So I was disheartened when <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2012/12/fb-responses-to-kips-mckeans-threats-to.html">you got on my Facebook page</a> and in a very deceptive and dishonest way tried to create the impression that I was being less than fair, or even dishonest, in what I wrote. Do you realize that all of my family and life-long friends read an emotional, heart-wrenching account of everything that I was subjected to by Kip and Victor, only to then read your comments that were designed to make me look like I was lying? <br /><br />That, sir, was a VERY shitty thing for you to do. <br /><br />Besides indirectly refuting the words of my personal testimony, “I’m not saying you are lying but ….” Actually, the only reason you would write that is to insinuate, that yes, I was lying and not accurately describing the events that transpired. And then you expressed several cherry-picked details to create a very false illusion of our meeting with Victor and Kip, designed to make me look like a liar and to make Kip, Victor, and yourself look good. Naturally, your motive was to try to “protect the flock,” which meant defend your leader and the image of “The Kingdom” at any cost, even if it meant being deceptive. <br /><br />And then you tried to claim that you had never heard of the church trying to split up a marriage before. Really? Were you and I part of the same church? More likely, you think that “disciples” are justified in leaving their “non-believing” spouses, which is what Kip and Kip’s churches have practiced for decades. Kip did not stutter when he told me that he would try to get my wife to leave me. Kip repeated the threat, again without stuttering, when I went back to him a second time. And Victor, with the full support of Damon at his side, literally told my wife right in front of my face that she didn’t need me and that she should leave me. Fully supported by Kip, who defended Victor’s threat and repeated it himself to my face, twice, without stuttering. <br /><br />Just in case you really are so poorly informed, which I find very difficult to believe, here are a couple of stories of marriages that were destroyed directly by Kip’s ministries convincing a member to leave a non-member spouse over the issue of membership. <br /><br /><a href="http://reveal.org/library/stories/people/jeubanks.html">http://reveal.org/library/stories/people/jeubanks.html</a> <br /><br /><a href="http://reveal.org/library/stories/people/jodill.html">http://reveal.org/library/stories/people/jodill.html</a> <br /><br />But even then, in my foolish, trusting nature, I still tried to give you the benefit of the doubt in my mind. I thought, Jeremy doesn’t know what to do, and maybe he really sees things that way. <br /><br />So when you asked to talk to me in person, I took it, again naively, as a friendly gesture, intended to try to help resolve things. Lord knows you were a witness to the verification of all of the abuse that I received. <br /><br />And you can be the witness that I invited you, again, to my house to talk over a meal. <br /><br />However, you insisted that we meet at a McDonalds. Ever affable, I accepted, not anticipating the blows to await me. I was just a bit nervous, asking you if you were going to bring Victor Gonzalez there for a surprise conference with me (to which you replied, “No, I’d never do that!”) <br /><br />So after thereby leading me to believe that it would be a “safe” encounter, you will probably remember that you wasted not time in revealing the purpose of the meeting - to tell me what a bad person I was, and to ask me to please not set foot in the church again. <br /><br />Seriously? This church that I helped build, and where so many of my years-old friends are? This church where I never spoke to anyone to dissuade them from their faith? This church where you yourself had just arrived to lead a few short months prior? <br /><br />In the moment I was so stunned that I did not know what to say, so I said, it’s OK, I understand, don’t worry, it’s fine. <br /><br />But… This is what I get for simply telling the truth about real events that transpired? If you could even tell me one tiny thing that I exaggerated, or modified, or left out, I could maybe understand. <br /><br />You can’t. <br /><br />My account was true and it is accurate, down to the very last detail. <br /><br />Add that to the list of terrible things that you did. <br /><br />Even at this juncture, against all odds, I gave you the benefit of the doubt. My “in-the-know” church friend told me days later that you only disinvited me because that was the instruction that you received from “Los Angeles.” <br /><br />So it’s clear where your loyalties lie. Was it with our teamwork working together in ministry activities and working on the “Internet ministry” of the SODM websites? No. Was it with our 5+ years of “real” friendship that spanned 3 cities and 3 states? No. <br /><br />Was it with God? Was your loyalty to the the TRUTH and with telling the truth? <br /><br />NO. Not even. <br /><br />Your loyalty lay with doing whatever Kip McKean and your human “leaders” told you to do, right or wrong. <br /><br />Was God threatened by me describing what had happened? I doubt it. <br /><br />I still didn’t realize at the time that you were stabbing me in the back, throwing me under the bus. Even at this juncture, I foolishly and stubbornly gave you the benefit of the doubt. You know, Jeremy is just doing what he thinks is right. <br /><br />But then you unfriended me on Facebook, and I realized how stupid I was to ever think that you and I were friends in real life. You were just using me. As long as I was translating Kip’s articles into Spanish for the “Movement,” you were my friend. As long as I was giving my contribution, you were my friend. (More on your role in the cynical manipulation of my money on Kip’s behalf another time.) As long as I kept hidden what Kip wanted hidden, you were my friend. <br /><br />So I am disappointed in you, Jeremy Ciaramella. Disappointed that you choose church bureaucracy over being a decent human. Disappointed that you, whether out of fear, or lack of character, or for whatever reason, refused to speak the truth you knew to refute the lies at the appropriate moment. Disappointed that you came on to my Facebook page and used dishonest and misleading words to try to smear my reputation in front of all of my friends and loved ones and falsely portray me as a liar. Disappointed that you chose to protect the abusers and attack the abused. Disappointed that you chose to separate me from my long-time friends in an attempt to prevent people finding out the things that happened. Disappointed that you violated my trust over and over again. And disappointed in myself for making the mistake trusting you over and over again. <br /><br />Postlogue: <br /><br />But some good came out of it. First, the moment, the very moment that my wife found out that you had “uninvited” me from the Phoenix ICC, she was done with you and with Kip’s churches. She finally was able to break free from the mind control that had been placed over her by Kip’s stooges. I actually appreciate the fact that no-one from church ever called her or contacted her, to my knowledge, ever again. Even though I am sure that “before God” it was sin and hypocrisy on their part. It clearly revealed the heart and motives of the church and its leaders. <br /><br />My wife now realizes how foolish it was of her to trust the “disciples” of the ICC. And I thank you, Jeremy, for that. <br /><br />And your complete ******ness, when added to that of Kip and Victor, is what has motivated me to continue writing and warning people about the ICC. My comments on the ICC have now been seen by over 18,000 people on this site alone, which is a direct result of your actions described above. You may have prevented few dozen people from seeing my face in church service, but you have motivated me to take my message to many, many, many more people around the world. And I will continue to do so. <br /><br />You acting like such a **** helped me realize that it isn’t just Victor, it isn’t just Kip - the ICC / SODM itself is a user and abuser of people. Use a person for as much time, talent and money as humanly possible, and then as soon as they are longer “useful,” toss them to the side like so much trash, and then move on to use someone new. That is not a compliment of you or your church in any way. It is, however, an accurate description of a movement well-known for it’s incredibly high turnover rate. <br /><br />You were the straw that broke the camel’s back. So pat yourself on the back for all of the people who won’t get baptized, thanks to the efforts that you have inspired. <br /><br />In your defense, I do realize that you, as well as the other ICC leaders, are currently a victim of mind control yourself, and that this will eventually wear off. (Of course, the paycheck doesn’t hurt, either.) You would never do the things that you do if you were not being led to do so by Kip. However, Kip is a true master of the art, so I don’t expect you to snap out of it any time soon. When you do eventually break the cycle, you will become acutely aware of the folly of your previous actions, of all of your lost years, and of the trail of broken people you have left in your wake. And you will join the hundreds of thousands of former members who warn others against Kip and his unhealthy, abusive ministries. You never know, maybe you will even write your own post for this site or another one like it.<br /><br />PS I know how hard it was for you when you first came to Phoenix and how such a large part of the church was not welcoming or accepting of you, and even fought actively against you. I hope for your sake that that has improved. But even more, I hope that you will soon be able to renounce the control of Kip over your life and worship of "the Kingdom," and begin a path of healing.<br /><div><br /></div><div><i>Want to receive new posts when they go live? Sign up for email delivery over there in the right column &gt;&gt;</i></div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com47tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-78314120791973802542014-04-19T12:37:00.002-07:002014-04-19T17:52:37.940-07:00International Christian Church - Former Cult Member Speaks OutThere is <a href="http://icccult.com/">another site that has popped up</a>&nbsp;(<a href="http://www.icccult.com/">icccult.com</a>) that sheds light on the "true" experience of a member of Kip McKean's International Christian Church cult.<br /><br />The writer describes his experience (lightly edited by me):<br /><br />"...it became very obvious I had been part of a destructive, mind-control cult. I felt very depressed and traumatized that these supposedly nice people could transform into demon-like monsters so quickly...<br /><br />"Looking back, all they wanted was people to be their slaves, making more converts and giving all they could to the cult leaders, who lived in luxury...<br /><br />"The power of peer pressure in these groups should not be underestimated... It can overwhelm most people. Remember, most members don’t think it is a cult. Those sincere people lure you into what they think is a good thing, even while the leaders are taking all they can."<br /><br /><div>Is this just one more "bitter" and "ungrateful" ex-member, as Kip and co. would like you to believe? According to Kip, the only reason anyone leaves the church is because they are "in sin" or have a "bad heart." But does that make sense? Was Jesus in the business of recruiting mass followers so that he could live in luxury off of their donations?</div><div><br /></div><div><i>Want to receive new blog posts as soon as they go live? Just enter your email over where it says "Receive New Posts By Email" in the right column &gt;&gt;&nbsp;</i></div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com39tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-28911922108922945562014-04-16T12:33:00.002-07:002014-04-19T23:39:20.445-07:00Anti-ICC YouTube ChannelThere have been some new YouTube videos popping up which target the International Christian Church.<br /><br />One channel, called <a href="http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCO0_7IbIESyMX8DznkirrDA">ICC Cult Information</a>, features short anti-cult messages about the church. Here is a one-minute video from there:<br /><div style="text-align: center;"><br /></div><div style="text-align: center;"><iframe allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" src="//www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/D6LWMTuj7Zc?rel=0" width="560"></iframe></div><div style="text-align: left;"><br /><a name='more'></a>As time goes on, there will be more and more stories&nbsp;by former members&nbsp;describing abuse and&nbsp;wrongdoing by Kip's leaders, just like it was with Kip's last church, the ICOC. You have heard it before, and will hear it again: nothing has changed about Kip or his ministries. (At the least, nothing has changed for the better - it was only recently that <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/03/international-college-of-christian.html">Kip set up a sham religious school and awarded himself a fake doctorate</a>.)</div><div style="text-align: left;"><br />Update: Here is another <a href="http://www.youtube.com/user/tonymcmahon2011/videos">anti-ICC YouTube channel</a> with a bunch of videos by a former member of the London International Christian Church talking about his experiences.<br /><br />A quote from <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2o_W2YF9E5Y">a video there</a>: "You know it's kind of embarrassing, I mean, that's why most people don't say anything, because you sort of think, that was a bit of stupid thing to do, wasn't it, get involved in a cult."<br /><br />Yet, those who operate these groups are professionals at convincing people, the good-hearted people who want to do what is right - that is how they got me. They used expert emotional manipulation that I had never before encountered and was not in a position to recognize.</div><div style="text-align: left;"><br /></div><div style="text-align: left;"><i>Want to receive blog posts by email as soon as they go live? Sign up in the box over in the right column of this page &gt;&gt;</i></div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com29tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-82505928810292563822014-04-14T18:55:00.001-07:002014-04-14T18:55:11.846-07:00Kip McKean And The Sin Jesus Forgot"Move over Jesus!"<br /><br />Kip: "Jesus! Get on the ball! The lists of sins that you preached about in several places in the Bible were wholly insufficient! I'm surprised that I have to bring this to Your attention, Lord, but You seem to have completely forgotten the Most Important Sin of All!<br /><br /><b>"Autonomy for local church government is sin."</b><br /><br />Jesus: "Kip, please forgive me. You are so right! I can hardly believe that this was not included in the Bible. Actually, I am going to have to have a very stern talk with the apostles up here. Well, except for John, who didn't make it. You know, as much as he wanted to be, he wasn't really My favorite. Anyways, I gave them very strict orders to include "autonomy for local church government is strictly forbidden" in the transcripts of My speeches. Actually, John was in charge of that, and he left it out, which is one of the reasons of My displeasure with him.<br /><br /><a name='more'></a><br />"You, however, Kip, are the apple of My eye. I can hardly thank you enough for being so in step with My Spirit that you were able to receive this message from Me, and properly institute the correct teaching, while also making sure that you were the head of My One True Church on Earth and in a position to enforce it.<br /><br />"Autonomy for local church government is sin!&nbsp;Autonomy for local church government is sin!&nbsp;Autonomy for local church government is sin! What do you think we were talking about for 4o days after my resurrection? Did they remember nothing?<br /><br />"You can take it from me, the churches MUST be led by one human leader, who will have final authority on Earth to interpret My words. Such an important task should never be left in the hands of mortals. What if they should decide to no longer send their monthly percentage of tithes to the central office? What would happen if they were to fall into Traditional Church of Christ beliefs, like that disciples can be trusted to make their own decisions for themselves?<br /><br />"The results would be disastrous! The people must be told what to do! They are stubborn, and must be forced to obey! Someone must be entrusted to hold the secrets of My One True Church and SoldOut Discipleship Movement close to his chest! And most of the local evangelists are so weak-willed, they may give themselves over to abhorrent teachings like Pray Me Into Their Hearts if they aren't watched like a hawk and switched to a new city every few years to test their loyalty.<br /><br />"Clearly, this whole episode reveals why the Bible is insufficient for this. Why, those apostles completely forgot to mention that sisters must hug brothers on the side, and not front to front! And that when brothers take out single sisters on Kingdom Encouragement Dates, they must never be left alone for even a moment, lest they fall into temptation and harbor an evil thought. And the whole rest of the list of sins and instructions that were left out of the Bible by the apostles but that you have so wisely intuited.<br /><br />"And there is only one person on this planet whom I would trust for this great task. And you, of course, Kip, know who that person is. Obviously, the only one deep and spiritual enough to actually read My mind and add the teachings that My previous helpers so neglectfully forgot to include.<br /><br />"Thank you, Kip, and keep up the great work! Make the people obey Me, and submit to your authority everywhere and in every city.<br /><br />"And always remember my promise to you when I took you up on that tall mountain and showed you the splendor of my earthly Kingdom: 'One day, all this will be yours!'"<br /><br /><i>Want to receive new blog posts in your email as soon as they go live? Sign up in the box found over in the right column of this page &gt;&gt;</i>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com107tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-15553428140327767732014-04-14T14:37:00.003-07:002014-04-14T16:17:23.904-07:00Nude, Coed Baptism in the Early Church?Notice to Kip's Churches - You're Doing It Wrong!<br /><br />This may sound crazy. OK, it does sound crazy. But it looks like the early Christian church may have practiced nude baptism. Actually, NUDE, COED baptism.<br /><br />First, the evidence: respected Christian historian Hippolytus is believed to have written the following description of early church baptism in the early, pre-Catholic church:<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>"When they come to the water, the water shall be pure and flowing, that is, the water of a spring or a flowing body of water. Then they shall take off all their clothes. ...the men will be baptized. Finally, the women, after they have unbound their hair, and removed their jewelry. No one shall take any foreign object with themselves down into the water. ...the bishop passes each of them on nude to the elder who stands at the water. They shall stand in the water naked. A deacon, likewise, will go down with them into the water. …then, drying themselves, they shall dress and afterwards gather in the church."<br /><br />So here we have men, women, and children (children mentioned in an edited-out part) all getting totally butt-naked and going down to the water together.<br /><br />Pictures on the walls of the catacombs depict people being baptized nude. Baptism itself is based on a nude Jewish water purification ritual called Mikvah.<br /><br />Recipients of water immersion were nude to symbolize their state before the eyes of God, who sees everything that we try to cover up. This is ironic to me as Kip works so hard to cover up many aspects of the inner workings of the church from as many people as possible. Also ironic since the externally-focused techniques of discipling lead members and leaders alike to cover up their true feelings and opinions, and instead pantomime righteousness - the polar opposite of what Jesus wanted.<br /><br />Note that in ancient cultures, when people did not have modern clothing, nudity was not seen as much of a "big deal" as it is to Westerners like us today. And nudity was not necessarily viewed in such a sexual way as we do. Think of being naked in a locker room, or at a doctor's office. Even today in Europe evangelical preachers have been known to go, nude, to nudist beaches, and preach to naked people there, and hold naked baptisms, and without it being a weird, sexualized experience.<br /><br />Church tradition holds that Jesus was baptized naked, as was John the Baptist.<br /><br />Some churches baptize still infants naked today to carry on the teaching.<br /><br />On another note, please notice also that the baptism was to be practiced in running water, a reference to the "living water" double-meaning command of Jesus.<br /><br />To ICC-er's: Do you want to be sure that your baptism is valid? You already did it with every single part of your body immersed? If your pinkie or toe didn't go over, did you re-do it? Did you make sure you were a totally 100% committed to God and to God's One True Church before you were baptized? Did you believe all of the correct doctrines and none of the incorrect ones? Did you completely repent of every single sin? Did you confess absolutely everything? Were you baptized by a true disciple who also believed and practiced all of and only the correct teachings? Do you believe that you are going to Heaven as a result of all those things, and that everyone else who has not done the complete list will be suffering eternity in Hell because of it?<br /><br />Good. Because, well, one thing you lack. The apostolic tradition of the first few hundred years of the church, and the oral, "practical" teaching of the church was that you had to remove all of your clothing before getting into the water, and the practice continued up until about the Middle Ages. Also note that the water should be living, that is, flowing. If you had any clothes on, or if the water was not living, then MAYBE YOUR BAPTISM WASN'T VALID. Can you really be sure? Surely God won't be turning away billions of other lost souls for incorrect baptisms, and completely ignore the fact that you read this and still were not baptized correctly?<br /><br />Oh, the times have changed today, you say? It wasn't specifically mandated in the Bible, so you don't have to obey it? Let me mention here that the Bible was not even officially collected in its present form and list of books <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon#Alexandrian_Fathers">until A.D. 367</a>, and that many different parts of the church accepted and rejected books on and off that list, but they all held to the "discipling" traditions of the apostles, such as nude baptism.<br /><br />So maybe what we should really waiting to see is a huge re-baptism of everyone, this time the way Jesus intended it - completely butt naked.<br /><br />What better reason to want to come back to the church, anyway?<br /><br />Links: <a href="http://www.hopefullybiblical.com/2012/11/early-church-baptism-was-nude.html">Early Church Baptism Was Nude</a>,&nbsp;<a href="http://www.bombaxo.com/hippolytus.html">Apostolic Tradition of Hippolytus</a> (see section 21),&nbsp;<a href="http://garycummings.wordpress.com/2014/04/13/the-baptism-of-christ/">Baptism of Christ</a>, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nudity_in_religion#Christianity">Wikipedia on nude baptism</a>.Unknownnoreply@blogger.com30tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-35335667772341144762014-04-08T14:09:00.003-07:002014-04-14T14:46:18.633-07:00Kip McKean's International Christian Church: CULTCheck out the new Facebook page, "<a href="http://www.facebook.com/ICCisaCult">Kip McKean's International Christian Church: CULT</a>."<br /><br />Please "like" the page as a convenient way to be alerted of new ICC-related news stories as they develop. This also makes it even easier for you to share stories with friends or loved ones who may still be in the International Christian Church or thinking of joining.Unknownnoreply@blogger.com13tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-11755674612160677632014-04-01T12:48:00.002-07:002015-06-19T16:32:02.405-07:00Kip McKean Repents and Apologizes! (Yeah, Right)Today Kip McKean released a formal statement:<br /><br />"I would truly like to apologize for <a href="http://www.reveal.org/">every single person that I have hurt</a> over the course of my leadership. I have now come to grips with the fact that I am not like normal folk, and I should never have tried to force others to be like me.<br /><br />"Additionally, I apologize for the gross misuse of church funds, and for <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/03/kip-mckeans-salary.html">paying myself a salary in the hundreds of thousands of dollars</a>, when Jesus, who I claim to be my hero, lived so simply and humbly that he famously didn't even have a place to "lay his head."<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>"Specifically, I would like to apologize for spending over <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/03/kip-mckeans-650000-condo.html">$650,000 dollars that my followers sacrificed so hard to give me, to purchase a luxury condo in the Pacific Palisades</a>, when I could have used those dollars so much more wisely to further the Kingdom.<br /><br />"I would also like to apologize for pretending that the ICOC, and now the ICC, were the <a href="http://www.letusreason.org/cult12.htm">only One True Church</a> on the planet. I don't seriously believe that over 7,152,000,000 people on the planet today would die and go to hell. I did believe it at first, when I was a naive campus student, but I eventually grew up and realized how ridiculous it was. However, by then I was trapped in the web of lies that I had created, and a slave to my lifestyle and income, and the legions of people who would do whatever, and I mean whatever, I told them. Please understand my addiction. I need to be loved! I need to be lifted up! I need to be the star! So I had little choice.<br /><br />"I apologize for trying to control every minute aspect of the lives of so many people. My psychiatrist has helped me to see that these are just manifestations of my <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissism">narcissistic</a> and <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy">sociopathic</a> tendencies. So it's not really my fault. But forgive me anyways.<br /><br />"I apologize for <a href="https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.religion.christian.boston-church/M7caSxLuqIw">misrepresenting the truth</a> in so many ways, and so many times, and for manipulating others to do the same for me. I really just wanted you to see my point of view and do what I told you to do.<br /><br />"I'd like to apologize for slandering and trash-talking anyone - group or individual - who has stood in my way of ascent to ever-greater power and glory.<br /><br />"I am so, so deeply sorry for the many times that I used threats to try to get my way, even <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2012/11/why-im-no-longer-part-of-city-of-angels.html">threats to try to destroy people's families</a>. That was just wrong.<br /><br />"Please accept my apologies, and when you are willing and able, to extend your forgiveness to me.<br /><br />"As a token of good faith, I hereby pledge to donate every single penny I have received as compensation from the City of Angels International Christian Church, the SoldOut Discipling Movement, and all affiliated organizations, to non-church affiliated charities, and no longer accept any more money from the church.<br /><br />"I admit that I am dangerous due to my high charisma, and hereby vow to not step back into church leadership of any type. By the way, the Bible isn't really true anyway so feel free to officially turn the church into a social club. Sorry, there I go again, trying to tell you what to do. I'll stop now.<br /><br />Sincerely, Thomas Wayne "Kip" McKean,<br />April 1, 2014<br /><br />#aprilfools #wishitweretrue<br /><br />Want to receive new posts by email as soon as they go live? Sign up with the gadget in the right column of the page &gt;&gt;Unknownnoreply@blogger.com21tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-80360878366571779862014-03-24T08:58:00.005-07:002014-03-25T08:15:52.674-07:00Kip McKean's Salary: $200,000+ (And Growing)This is one of the best-kept secrets in Kip's Kingdom - Kip McKean's salary.<br /><br />The church does everything it can to conceal this information, and with good reason. Many, if not most, members might be quite a bit more reluctant to sacrifice their own money if they knew just how much of it goes to lifestyle expenses for the McKeans. <br /><br />Let's look at the year 2010, as I have the information on hand from the financial presentation that was given at the end of November, 2010. (As of this writing, the audio is still available on the official church websites if you search for it.)<br /><br />At the end of November, (according to the audio) the church had taken in $780,000 for the year. And weekly contribution was $15,000, which multiplies out to a similar annual figure. <br /><a name='more'></a>"Ryan," who is speaking, mentions that 2/3 of the money was going to pay for "people," which refers to ministry salary, ministry housing, ministry benefits, and ministry reimbursements.<br /><br />Ryan the elaborates by stating that the church is paying for 5 ministry couples, and 5 interns. Kip comments elsewhere that these interns earn $700/month.<br /><br />So 2/3 of $15,000 is $10,000 / week for ministry compensation, which comes to $520,000 per year. $161.50 of the $10,000 goes to each of the 5 interns per week, which adds up to $42,000 per year.<br /><br />Subtracting the $42,000 from the $520,000 leaves us $478,000 to divide up between the five ministry couples on payroll at that time. If that were divided evenly into five, that would be $95,600 annual compensation per couple ($7,966/month). Not a bad paycheck!<br /><br />However, Kip, who decides pay scale, does not pay all ministers the same. Kip pays leaders with more experience and responsibility more money, usually a lot more money. This is already evident in the split between the $700/month paid to the interns and the $7,966/month average compensation paid to the other ministry couples - a difference of over 10 times!<br /><br />So if we are conservative, and we say that Kip pays himself and Elena, as the very top leaders in charge of the entire ICC, only 3x what the other City of Angels ministry couples earn, that would work out to about $220,000 per year. This would still leave over $75,000 for salary and benefits for each of the other four ministry couples. ($75k x 4 + $220k = $520k). And even $75,000 is enough money to live very, very comfortably in Los Angeles.<br /><br />So there you have it. The best, good-faith estimate of what Kip McKean's salary looked like at the end of 2010, based on the limited, publicly available information: $220,000+ in 2010, and growing.<br /><br />And please remember, every penny of that compensation came from the sacrifices of ICC members such as myself, who were told, and believed, that they are giving their money to God and to further "the movement."<br /><br />Kip's total income from the church has most certainly grown since 2010, due to growth in ICC membership and income, as well as a huge (half-million dollar) new revenue stream from the <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/03/international-college-of-christian.html">International College of Christian Ministry (ICCM)</a>, which will be discussed in more detail in a later post. It should also be assumed that Kip also receives payments from MERCY worldwide in addition to these other sources of income.<br /><br />As a point of comparison, when I was living in LA in 2010 I earned an annual salary of $39,000. Money was very tight, (mainly because I had been coerced into giving a full 25% of my income to the church.) So I had to be very careful. For example, we only had about $15/month in our budget for eating out. So one trip per month to In-N-Out with the family. And in the same month, I would donate over $500 to the church in weekly contribution, plus "Special Contribution," "contribution for the poor," and other church expenses like mandatory conferences.<br /><br />However, in spite of the limitations, I was still able to use what was left of my money to pay my taxes, fully support my family of 4, and pay down school loans by thousands of dollars. And yes, even pay for an apartment that was good enough to hold Bible Talks and other church events in.<br /><br />So I find it absurd that City of Angels ministry staff, and Kip McKean in particular, are compensated at such unbiblical levels. Did Jesus pull a big salary? No. The apostles? No. <br /><br />It's especially maddening since every dollar for Kip's compensation comes out of the contributions and sacrifice of families who, on the whole, earn much, much less than he does. It's the reverse Robin Hood - take from the poor to give to the rich.<br /><br />My opinion is that if the average member of Kip's church knew how much of every dollar they donate ended up paying for Kip McKean's lifestyle expenses, they would be quite a bit less eager to keep giving. Especially when that involves personal sacrifice, which it almost always does.<br /><br />Does it make sense for you to skip eating at In-N-Out so you can give $15 more towards the salary of someone who earns 5x what you do, and who will spend the money eating at much fancier restaurants?<br /><div><br /></div><b>Literally, members of the City of Angels ICC, and the International Christian Churches, make deep financial sacrifices so that the leaders of the churches can earn very non-sacrificial salaries.</b><br /><br />Well, I for one, will never give another dollar to Kip, or to anything even remotely related to Kip or his self-enrichment scheme.<br /><br /><b>"[T]hey are conceited and understand nothing ... people of corrupt mind ... who think that godliness is a means to financial gain"&nbsp;</b>-&nbsp;1 Timothy 6:4-5, NIV<br /><br /><i>See also: <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2014/03/kip-mckeans-650000-condo.html">My Visit to Kip McKean's $650,000 Condo</a></i><br /><br />Want to receive future blog posts by email? Sign up over in the right column &gt;&gt;Unknownnoreply@blogger.com77tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-81426011395131335122014-03-12T10:16:00.001-07:002014-03-24T17:39:28.295-07:00Groggy ICC Cult Member Up At 5am To Raise Money For Minister's Salary<div style="text-align: center;"><iframe allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" src="//www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/tM-0P0yIGQg?rel=0" width="560"></iframe></div><br /><div style="text-align: left;">In this short video, this poor, sleep-deprived (and undoubtedly very good-hearted) guy, up at 5am, talks about how he is getting up to run across George Washington bridge to raise funds for missions.</div><div style="text-align: left;"><br /><a name='more'></a></div><div style="text-align: left;">He has apparently not yet realized that "missions" is church-speak for "ministers' salary" or that said <a href="http://ministeriolatino.blogspot.com/2014/02/outrageous-ministry-compensation.html">minister salaries are as super-size as possible</a>. He is probably completely unaware that he is being used,&nbsp;and that he won't get any of his time (or money, or anything else) back when he leaves the church (aka, escapes the cult).&nbsp;</div><div style="text-align: left;"><br /></div><div style="text-align: left;">And that when he does leave, most or all of the members will turn their backs on him.&nbsp;</div><div style="text-align: left;"><br /></div><div style="text-align: left;">And that he will, sooner or later, be doing a face-palm day after day, wondering how he ever allowed himself to be wrapped up in the ICC.</div><div style="text-align: left;"><br /></div><div style="text-align: left;"><i>Video courtesy of the NYC ICC YouTube channel.</i></div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com21tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-62752349235405530332014-03-08T22:33:00.003-08:002014-03-11T15:22:50.614-07:00Girl Talks About Her ICC Cult Experience<div style="text-align: center;"><iframe allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/S8Rq6FCWppU" width="420"></iframe></div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com35tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-61824808343853136942014-03-06T14:30:00.003-08:002014-04-18T09:53:45.780-07:00The International College of Christian Ministry (ICCM)Well, it seemed amazing that the International Christian Churches could set up a whole university in a couple of weeks, and even decorate founder Kip McKean with a doctorate degree almost as quickly.<br /><br />How did they do it? Easy!<br /><br />IT'S. NOT. ACCREDITED!<br /><br />That means, any "degrees" it issues are COMPLETELY IMAGINARY and not worth a 5 cents. The ICCM is NOT A REAL SCHOOL.<br /><br /><a name='more'></a>It did seem a bit suspicious that Kip could earn a Ph.D. without going through the normal years-long process of research, writing a thesis, getting it reviewed by a panel of Ph.D.'s, defending the thesis, etc.<br /><br />From an <a href="http://forums.delphiforums.com/ExIcoc_support/messages/?msg=4129.1">email</a> sent out from ICCM in response to an inquiry:<br /><br />"We have been given an <b>accreditation exemption</b> from the state of California and therefore the degrees we offer are <b>under no accrediting boards</b>, save our own. Any degree/credential given by our seminary would be accepted only within our family of churches. <b>Our Bachelor's degree would not, for example, be transferable or serve as a pre-requisite to another seminary</b>'s Master's degree program." (Bolding mine).<br /><br />I wonder how much they are charging the members for these excellent services?<br /><br />Interestingly, the above email seems to contradict the message currently on its Facebook page: "At present [the ICCM] confers the degrees of Bachelors, Masters and Doctorates in Ministry."<br /><br />Omitting the tiny detail that the "degrees" are 100% WORTHLESS everywhere except in their church of 2,000. You have a doctorate degree - because Kip McKean SAYS you have a graduate degree! And in the ICC, that's what matters most.<br /><br />But they are, like, a totally real, and awesome - AWESOME - school! They even have, like, their own web site! Well, not like a real website, but, you know, like a whole Facebook page and everything! That's, like, <i>totally </i>legit!Unknownnoreply@blogger.com65tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-8750080748568629182014-03-01T16:57:00.001-08:002014-03-31T20:50:56.250-07:00Kip McKean's $650,000 Condo(Cussing warning - but it's a quote, and in context. And you'll NEVER guess who it was.)<br /><br />I was recently reminded of the following:<br /><br /><a href="http://losangeles.blockshopper.com/property/4229020042/13700_marina_pointe_unit_1211">Kip McKean lives in a $650,000 luxury condo that he purchased in 2010.</a>&nbsp;(For the record, as seen in the link, Kip's legal name is "Thomas Wayne", not "Kip".)<br /><br />This condo has a special significance to me. This is where <a href="http://ministeriolatino.blogspot.com/2012/11/lying-stealing-and-threats-part-ii_26.html">I visited Kip in 2011 to talk about lying, theft, abuse and threats</a> by one of his top leaders. And was completely shot down.<br /><br />If I were better informed about Kip's history, I would have known in advance how the meeting would turn out. Kip would categorically defend the higher leader (Victor), and systematically attack the lower leader (me). Because leadership is from God and leaders are always right. And the most important thing is to maintain order. Leaders on top, and Kip on top of the leaders.<br /><br />So, my Kip McKean luxury condo meeting was short and ended abruptly. I started talking, and for several seconds started to tell Kip how Victor had lied to me and abused his position in the church to steal from me.<br /><br />Kip then interrupted me to insist that nothing of the sort had happened. Victor was innocent of all charges (except of possibly being "insensitive"), and that everything was&nbsp;<i>certainly</i>&nbsp;just a "misunderstanding."<br /><br />Never mind that <a href="http://www.exicc.org/2012/11/lying-stealing-and-threats-part-ii_26.html">Victor had already confessed to everything</a>&nbsp;in front of a witness.<br /><br /><a name='more'></a><br />However, while Kip's buddy was found mostly innocent, "<b>I</b>", on the other hand, was found very, very guilty.<br /><br />Why? Because I was guilty of the cardinal sin of the church - I was found to no longer believe all of the (ridiculous, wrong, damaging) things that every member of Kip's churches are supposed to believe.<br /><br />So, here I was, in Kip's luxury condo, getting shot down.<br /><br />(It wasn't until much, much later, that the obvious dawned on me - the whole meeting was a setup. Kip and Victor had obviously talked beforehand, and Kip had decided what had happened, and how the meeting would turn out, long before the meeting.)<br /><br />That was an interesting day. Kip chatted me up at first, while we waited for Victor and Jeremy to get there. Then, I sat in disbelief as lies won out over truth. Then, I listened to Kip say the words "fuck" and "shit" in the same breath. That shattered a bit of my uptight religious sensibilities of the time (even though I was basically atheist by this point.)<br /><br />(Context - one among the laundry list of concerns I levied about Victor was that he cusses .. something that I questioned as a church leader in a church that explicitly teaches teaches against it. So Kip says, "What did he say? Fuck? Shit? Ass? ...You know, some of words are relative now. 'Butt' used to be a swear word, but now is normal for people to say." Not what I would have expected, although Victor nor Jeremy flinched or blinked.)<br /><br />Then Elena came in, and I sensed some serious tension between Kip and her. About what? Who knows. But there was snapping going on about things she wanted to do.<br /><br />So we drew things to a close, Kip gave me a big creepy hug, and I walked back out, past the doors of executives and celebrities, and down towards my junky car, to ask Jeremy, why in the living H. E. double hockey-stick didn't he open his mouth and defend my word against Victor's, since he knew full well he was lying?<br /><br />... So, $650,000 ... If memory serves, I think there were about 200 members in the City of Angels church in 2010. That would mean, $3,250 per member towards the cost of the condo (ignoring the other 10% or whatever additional cost for closing fees, etc.) Spread out over a year, that would be an average of $270 per member, per month.<br /><br />Oddly, I remember at the annual financial meeting in 2010 that the entire amount of money the church received in that year was around $650,000.<br /><br />That's a lot of dollars, all donated with sacrifice by church members.<br /><br />And whether or not the condo money came out of the sacrifice and contributions of the church members in 2010, or before, or after, ... that's a lot of dollars.<br /><br />I know for me, I'm sure glad my year-over-year sacrifice of 25% of my annual income, and many personal sacrifices, were able to be put to good use - helping pay for Kip's condo, where I started to see, that the man that I had invested 15 years and two mission teams following, was not much like I had thought, hoped, or been told.<br /><br />(<a href="http://cadebryant.blogspot.com/2010/11/lifestyles-of-rich-and-thomas.html">Here</a> is some&nbsp;more info about Kip's condo.)Unknownnoreply@blogger.com102tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-86035939482111984342014-02-26T22:06:00.003-08:002014-03-12T16:36:02.446-07:00The Traumas of a "Kingdom Kid"If you are looking for a great read, and hear the perspective of a Kingdom Kid, (a child who grew up in the church), here is a great place to poke around:<br /><br /><a href="http://healthymama.net/queen-of-the-damned-recovering-from-cult-life/">Recovering from Cult Life in the ICOC (Healthy Mama)</a><br /><br />The author grew up in Kip's "old" church, the ICOC. She was very traumatized.<br /><br />One part that jumped out to me is where someone describes getting hit on and hooking up with her former ICOC teen leader, only to later find out that he was a fully "restored" member and leader in Kip's new City of Angels ICC. Yes, he was leading in the CAICC at the same time that he was tapping her @$$ and asking her for boob pics.<br /><br />No, nothing wrong with that picture, do you think?<br /><br />On a personal note, one of the motivating factors in me leaving the church was so that my kids would never have to be "kingdom kids" and suffer through church life like this girl did (and like I had) for so long.<br /><br />As I held my newborn baby daughter in my arms I thought, "There is NO WAY that I am going to allow any of THAT to be inflicted on this precious and innocent little baby!" Thank God.Unknownnoreply@blogger.com9tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-35619486831436605452014-02-25T23:00:00.001-08:002014-03-24T18:01:02.630-07:00Outrageous Ministry CompensationHow much should ministers make? A reasonable middle-class salary? Something in line with what the members of the church earn? Maybe, like Jesus and the apostles, earn nothing or next to nothing?<br /><br />Or how about, oh, say, $300,000.00 per year?<br /><br />Check out the following link:<br /><br /><a href="http://www.icocinvestigation.com/Documents/aces1212.pdf">http://www.icocinvestigation.com/Documents/aces1212.pdf</a><br /><br />It is to a copy of payment information for payments made to certain church leaders, including Steve and Lisa Johnson, in December, 1996.<br /><br />It shows the Johnsons earning a combined bi-weekly base salary of $3,692.13. Now, if you multiply that out a bit, it comes to $95,995.38 per year, just base salary. After you add in parsonage (they live rent-free in church-funded housing) and other benefits outlined in that document,&nbsp;the compensation package comes up to <b>$11,793.45 </b>every two weeks, which is <b>$25,552.48</b> per month or a<b> whopping $306,369.70 per year!</b><br /><br />This blew my mind. I suspected it was extravagant but this just seems surreal.<br /><br /><br /><a name='more'></a><br />That should give you an idea for how "the church" calculates pay packages. That was from back in the heyday when Kip McKean was still the undisputed leader of the ICOC. Now that Kip is leading the "new" church, the ICC, he has never given the slightest indication that compensation would change in the new church. Remember that when your leader is standing up front haranguing you about donating more and more money for missions and "special contribution". Missions money goes to pay "ministry costs," which mostly means minister salary. In this case, a very healthy $306,369.70 in one year!<br /><br />Hmmm... Remember those church financial books that they always told you were "completely open" and that "anyone" could look at, down to "every last penny"? Except that you never met anyone in your whole life who had ever actually seen them? Makes you think a little bit now, doesn't it?<br /><br /><i>Update (1/27/14): </i>It has been suggested that the parsonage portion of the paystub was monthly and not bi-weekly like the "gross pay" column, which would lower the total annual compensation a bit, but still an unconscionable amount to sponge out of the sacrifices of the many.<br /><br />It has also been suggested that the Johnsons also received other compensation in this period in addition to this paystub - for example, separate payments for their roles as World Sector Leaders and in HOPE worldwide. In that case, their total annual compensation would likely be well above even the $300k figure.<br /><br />In addition, they were able to receive reimbursement for many, many normal daily expenses, such as meals with disciples, meals with studies, meals with other leaders, fancy hotel rooms at conferences, driving to and from any church related activity, etc. The end result is that they earn many thousands more beyond stated salary and benefits, (and without taxes!)<br /><br />Unfortunately, due to the opaque treatment of the finances in Kip's churches, we may never know most of the details.<br /><br /><i>Update 2 (1/27/14):</i> A former WSL who is now in upper leadership in the ICC contacted me and seemed to confirm the salary figures stated above. He also told me that:<br />1. the leaders <i>DO</i> sacrifice. However,<br />2. the sacrifice of the leaders is "relative."<br /><br />The "relative" nature of the "sacrifice" probably refers to the idea that certain ICC leaders could theoretically make more money working for corporate America rather than the ICC. (This was of the arguments that was used in the old ICOC to justify ridiculous levels of evangelist compensation.)<br /><br />My conclusions:<br />1. The Johnsons, and other high leaders, did make the money described above, and<br />2. Kip has not "changed." In the future, Kip will continue using the carrot of super-high salaries for top leaders. Additionally, Kip and accomplices will continue doing everything possible to hide that very fact from the members whose contributions pay for every penny.<br /><br />and, of course,<br /><br />3. The ICC will never, ever stop asking for more and more money - no amount is ever enough.<br /><br />So there you have it.Unknownnoreply@blogger.com13tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4825487692627607933.post-8359648236377123532013-02-27T19:13:00.002-08:002014-03-11T22:06:32.932-07:00The Church of Jesus and The Apostles Today?Kip McKean and the builders of the International Christian Church claim that the ICC is the reappearance in modern times of Jesus' Church.<br /><br />God's One True Church!<br /><br />YHWH's Sovereign Movement! Of Sold-Out Disciples!<br /><br />(Aside: Ever think about the term, "Sold-Out"? And the fact that it refers to money? And materialism?)<br /><br />They claim that the Faithful, Baptized members of the ICC are (almost without exception) the Only True Christians and Saved People in the Whole Wide World.<br /><br />Let's see... These are pretty dramatic claims. Do you think they will hold up to scrutiny?<br /><div><br />One, money. In Jesus' church, there was not a constant drumbeat for the members to give more and more and more money. In fact, many leaders in the early church took no salary, and those who did received the same meager amount that was given to widows in the church to live on. That's not much!<br /><br />No <a href="http://ministeriolatino.blogspot.com/2014/03/kip-mckeans-650000-condo.html">$650,000 condos</a> or <a href="http://ministeriolatino.blogspot.com/2014/02/outrageous-ministry-compensation.html">$300,000 annual salaries</a>&nbsp;like in Kip's churches in more recent times. Here's a blog post I wrote a couple months ago talking more in depth about <a href="http://ministeriolatino.blogspot.com/2012/11/how-much-money-does-it-take.html">how Kip's church treats the topic of money differently than Jesus' church did</a>. And <a href="http://ministeriolatino.blogspot.com/2013/02/letter-to-young-disciple-money.html">here's a bit more on the topic of money in Kip's churches</a>. And there will be more still, later.<br /><br />Two, <br /><a name='more'></a>I don't see a constant pressure on members to convert new people all the time. New people were drawn into the church by the warmth and joy of the disciples, not by cold contacts and follow-up. Kip-style discipling ministries are always about pressure. I don't think that Jesus or the apostles operated that way.<br /><br />Three, there were no planned mission teams. The church grew organically. The Holy Spirit did not tell Peter or any other apostle to send leaders out to new areas as the same Holy Spirit allegedly instructs Kip today.<br /><br />Four, I don't think that the apostles bullied <a href="http://ministeriolatino.blogspot.com/2013/02/kipmckeancom-and-church-bullying.html">around members or non-members of the church the way that Kip and his agents have done on multiple occasions</a>. <br /><br />Five, I don't think that the disciples in the first-century church experienced burn-out like almost everyone in the ICC and ICOC does.<br /><br />Six, I think that Jesus and the apostles were incredibly more dedicated to their cause, and many times more willing to suffer for Jesus' teachings than even the leaders in Kip's church. You know why the American leaders in the ICOC came back from overseas missions? They didn't want their kids to be teenagers abroad. I'm talking about the World Sector Leaders of the Kip-era ICOC. The "go anywhere, do anything" schpiel is little more than that, just a schpiel. Can you imagine getting crucified upside-down like Peter? The ICOC leaders can't. In fact, they can't even imagine taking a salary in line with what average members earn!<br /><br />Seven, I think that Jesus and the apostles were much more spiritually-minded than either Kip or any of the leaders working with him.<br /><br />Eight, I think that the church of Jesus and the apostles would vomit blood at the level of materialism displayed in today's ICC, from Kip on down.<br /><br />Nine, Jesus' church was neither a formula nor a business. <a href="http://ministeriolatino.blogspot.com/2012/11/how-much-money-does-it-take.html">Kip's church is both a formula AND a business</a>. <br /><br />Ten, Jesus was inspiring because he was not worldly. His actions were on another plane. Kip, Kip's mentality, Kip's church, is worldly. "Do not handle. Do not taste. Do not touch."<br /><br />After Jesus and the apostles died, I don't think there has ever been a church like the one they set up. Will there ever be one? I don't know, but it doesn't look hopeful, not at this rate.<br /><br />Who is the closest?<br /><br />Maybe David Bercot? The Mennonites? I don't know. But certainly NOT Kip McKean or any of his super-apostles.</div>Unknownnoreply@blogger.com11