You seem to take anything less than effusive praise for S/S as a personal insult. That's not really a great way to start a discussion.

I only brought up my feelings about their program because I do think it's refreshing to see a more modern dance style explored in figure skating. We don't see it often. However, if this is the epitome of what can be achieved in terms of a modern dance/skating fusion, I think that's a shame. I just don't think S/S ever really quite "got it" and held it through an entire performance. As I said in my initial post, I'm sure having to perform the elements had something to do with that. I don't think it is a bad program (on the contrary) or that S/S performed it badly — I simply don't think it ever achieved all that it could be. I don't think it achieved that "masterpiece" status.

You, it seems, have a different opinion. Good for you. That doesn't negate my right to mine. Or the judges to theirs, for that matter. For you, this piece is perfection. For me, it was close, but no cigar.

Yes, it is quite refreshing for a pairs team to try something risky and different. I give S/S and S a great deal of credit for what they have attempted and accomplished with Pina. OTOH, it is you who refer to "perfection," not me. Altho' I think S/S Pina is a mini-masterpiece, I never mentioned the word, "perfection." I agree that it would be interesting to see the concept/ choreography for Pina further explored, but I think it might give S/S and S more freedom to explore the work in an exhibition format, rather than bring it back for competition again next season. It is always interesting to see what programs S/S and S will choose for a new season.

I dislike the way in some quarters IMO S/S are not fully appreciated and recognized for their accomplishments and impact on the sport, however I am unconcerned regarding your reference to "anything less than effusive praise for S/S." IMHO, that is more like what ubers of Patrick Chan and V/M seem to become overwrought about.

Good for you too, rain, for expressing your opinions. However, you never mentioned exactly where you think S/S Pina "was meant to go." I agree with Tigger that there is not a lot of time under CoP to explore unique movements, so I think the work S/S and S have done with Pina, while perhaps it is not a complete and full masterpiece, it is a remarkable and winning effort. I disagree with your point about "crispness," because I think the movement style S/S were inspired by in the tribute film and in the work of Pina Bausch, has little to do with "crispness" and more to do with unpredictability and unexpectedness. You may have a point about the need for more "commitment" in their movements, but I think any perceived lack of that may ironically be due to the conflicting themes inherent within the movement style of Pina Bausch that S/S are seeking to express on ice (a surface that presents an additional layer of strictures and complications).

I liked:
1) the young Chinese - they have so much energy, the girl is adorable
2) both American pairs, especially the first one, it's their first year.
3) I haven't liked Dube since she won the World bronze, she's been falling all the time, like Mukhortova thus letting down her partner. The other Canadian pair makes progress every year, good for them. But something in them is not enough to be in the top three.
4) B/L - boting, too many errors. I'd rather see Davankova/Deputat as the third couple.
5) K/S - beuatiful program as all of theirs, Moskvina knows how to touch the hearts. Isn't it time for them to retire though...I'm sad coz I think they should have not come to Worlds and let down their country. It could have been the Euro bronze medalists, at least they could have tried themselves in the Worlds.
6) VT - a terrific comeback. If only they had skated the SP without a major mistake.
7) SS - I'm a huge fan of theirs. They have a unique styke. However I find this year's LP not good enough. They used to have much better programs. No major mistakes so I can't agree with them being SO behind VT in the LP.
I'm happy with the podium though)))

I liked:
1) the young Chinese - they have so much energy, the girl is adorable
2) both American pairs, especially the first one, it's their first year.
3) I haven't liked Dube since she won the World bronze, she's been falling all the time, like Mukhortova thus letting down her partner. The other Canadian pair makes progress every year, good for them. But something in them is not enough to be in the top three.
4) B/L - boting, too many errors. I'd rather see Davankova/Deputat as the third couple.
5) K/S - beuatiful program as all of theirs, Moskvina knows how to touch the hearts. Isn't it time for them to retire though...I'm sad coz I think they should have not come to Worlds and let down their country. It could have been the Euro bronze medalists, at least they could have tried themselves in the Worlds.
6) VT - a terrific comeback. If only they had skated the SP without a major mistake.
7) SS - I'm a huge fan of theirs. They have a unique styke. However I find this year's LP not good enough. They used to have much better programs. No major mistakes so I can't agree with them being SO behind VT in the LP.
I'm happy with the podium though)))

I don't get how many say B/L boring , classical = boring ?
I think Bazarova has gorgeous lines, their lifts are amazing, if only they can fix their sbs inconsistencies
I don't think D/D will replace B/L by 2014, D/D will not even be eligible for seniors until 2013
even S/H who have a couple of seasons already as seniors are still not refined and considering Davankova will only be 15 in 2014

The crowd actually thinks they should have placed ahead of D/R or K/S?

Give me maturity and better skating skills over big tricks any day!

and you get Laura Lepisto on the podium with double jumps I have to admit I enjoy the thrill of the big tricks...but in S/H defense, what they have over most of the other teams is daring, speed and a ton of charisma. Once they clean up their overall skating, they will be difficult to beat.

My thoughts on the paris FS:
1) T/T new stars!! Whoever taught them their elegant skating should teach S/H how to skate.
2) T/T's twist!! They were able to do double only last season. This season their triple is top notch. Whoever taught them their twist should teach K/S how to twist.
3) Congrats to P/T & K/S for fighting against ageism.

and you get Laura Lepisto on the podium with double jumps I have to admit I enjoy the thrill of the big tricks...but in S/H defense, what they have over most of the other teams is daring, speed and a ton of charisma. Once they clean up their overall skating, they will be difficult to beat.

I feel the same. Someone's prejudice seems so ridiculous. Anyway, SH would rise definitely in the coming seasons to Sochi.

I liked:
5) K/S - beuatiful program as all of theirs, Moskvina knows how to touch the hearts. Isn't it time for them to retire though...I'm sad coz I think they should have not come to Worlds and let down their country. It could have been the Euro bronze medalists, at least they could have tried themselves in the Worlds.

Let down their country? You would have rather they sent Stolbova and Klimov instead of Kavaguti and Smirnov?

What place do you think S/K would have got? 10th or 11th, certainly not 7th and that was with 2 major lift issues, without those they would have had a medal.

And don't forget if it wasn't for Smirnov's unfortunate surgery 3 months ago S/K wouldn't even have a medals from Europeans.

Let down their country? You would have rather they sent Stolbova and Klimov instead of Kavaguti and Smirnov?

What place do you think S/K would have got? 10th or 11th, certainly not 7th and that was with 2 major lift issues, without those they would have had a medal.

And don't forget if it wasn't for Smirnov's unfortunate surgery 3 months ago S/K wouldn't even have a medals from Europeans.

I think he wanted Davankova/Deputat for the 3rd spot ( Age ineligibles for seniors )

if they sent the alternate, Stolbova/Klimov would have finished below Berton/Hotarek and Russia would have gotten 2 spots, so no S/K are no options
K/S had many mistakes and they have not competed since GPF and had injuries

And anyone else that had happened to, where a fall just so severely affected the flow of the program would have been nailed for that and nailed hard at that. That was not a Top 5 performance and shouldn't have happened.

they got hit hard already. just look at the PCS. That's considerable lower if you look at the margin with other teams. as happy as I am for T/T, hasn't there PCS jumped considerably? Even themselves were totally surprised. there PB increases by 10 points with one major mistakes on the 3S,down graded, and a two-foot landing on throw. that' s about the same level as what they did before, only difference is that she did not fall. but not rotating the jump is more costly. so all of a sudden 10 points more. judging is just so subjective. I really love T/T' s genuine reaction and theft are so cute and beautiful. I love them for quite a while. this is not raining on their parade. even the commentators didn't expect them winning. I guess
ISU were sending a message to P/T to compete the whole year or go home.
V/T were on fire and that was a superb LP! . aliona was cute to improvise at the end to fill the extra few seconds, an off night but congratulations for the 4th title.

they got hit hard already. just look at the PCS. That's considerable lower if you look at the margin with other teams. as happy as I am for T/T, hasn't there PCS jumped considerably? Even themselves were totally surprised. there PB increases by 10 points with one major mistakes on the 3S,down graded, and a two-foot landing on throw. that' s about the same level as what they did before, only difference is that she did not fall. but not rotating the jump is more costly. so all of a sudden 10 points more. judging is just so subjective. I really love T/T' s genuine reaction and theft are so cute and beautiful. I love them for quite a while. this is not raining on their parade. even the commentators didn't expect them winning.

You are raining on their parade.
Their PCS was 6th or 7th in the short, 5th or 6th in the long program. Both time behind B/L who were skating to god know which music because there was no interpretation of anything. If anything, they were robbed on PCS, even on their winning day.
B/L should score about 10 points lower than their actual score. Their IN, PE, CH should be in the 4 or 5s. Even junior teams interpret and skate better programs than B/L.

May I remind everyone that the guidelines are very clear on skater privacy. If it has not been reported by a reputable media source or the skaters themselves, then it's tabloid fodder and not appropriate here. If they are trying to keep it just when "no one is looking" that means they want to keep it private, and we honor skater, coach, official, and poster privacy. There are plenty of other outlets for the gossip. It doesn't need to be an announcement, but if they aren't talking about it to make it "official" then it's not your job to do it for them. Even if "everyone already knows about it."