The only people who want Socialism are people who don't produce

I feel that way but I still don't want free stuff. I just want the government and business to separate so the people can have a say in legislation
again. It's never been perfect but billion dollar campaigns like Romney and Obama is just obscene

LOL I never once said China has more money than the US. I pointed out that they're the most productive country on Earth in at least 8 or 9 different
categories, that they have the 6th most amount of millionaires, and the 2nd most amount of billionaires. Those stats were to disprove the claim that
China is some poor place. They also helped show that socialism clearly allows private property & that the claim that "only non-producers want
socialism" is completely wrong. How does your post dispute anything I actually typed?

Not to mention, if you're going to show those stats to prove yourself in this imagined pissing contest, why not also show companion stats like cost of
living, healthcare costs, debt per household, inflation, retirement age, etc? If you make twice as much money as I do yet all of your expenses are 4
times more than mine, who's the real "winner" here? That's why our economy is so reliant on debt; people have to bridge the gap in income & rising
costs by borrowing. Actually, you don't have to answer this paragraph because it has nothing to do with my original point, which is that the OP is
wrong. lol

What if there was universal basic income ONLY for those who put in a mandatory 5 days of hard work for society...

An income "floor",

Accompanied by a "income ceiling"
Whereas any income earned by an individual or organization that surpasses said "ceiling", would flow into a fund, where certain councils and/or the
public, would vote on distribution of said fund...
Ie.. Crowd funding new projects that universal basic income recipients have spent their free time working on starting..

This would alleviate obscene wealth hoarding and class disparity.

And keep people who are receiving UBI, to be productive.

I wish to emerge a blend of capitalism, socialism in a meritocracy/technocracy that meets all our needs

first, I would like to point out that many of the colonies had their own programs to help the poor in the communities, funded by taxes..

when my kids were young and I was working in a printing company, after hearing the latest information about the new insurance policy that we were all
being offered, I went to my boss and asked him how much it would cost to enroll my kids in it...
he suggested I enroll them in the gov't child health program because there was no way I'd be able to afford it on what I was earning.
you don't think that he was kind of happy that this program was there for him to refer me to instead of just telling me, sorry, you are sol, and risk
having me turn around and saying well, then I guess I need to find a job that is paying me more money???
you don't think that walmart isn't happy that the food stamp program is around to not only feed their employees but also enable many of their
customers to buy their products?
you don't think that people aren't glad that medicare and social security is around when their parents become unable to work or end up needing 24/7
care?
you don't think that those who hold the rental properties in this country don't love the fact that hud pays the rent for so many?
you don't think that all these child care centers are glad that the gov't is providing funds to mothers so they can work when the alternative would be
probably charging $1.00 an hour?
you don't think that doctors aren't happy that there's medicare and medicaid, chips when the only other option would be to either accept whatever the
people could pay for their services or have alot less people to serve?

heck, the biggest benefactors of these programs is the business sector and the wizards of wall street!

Again , most of the reasons China is where they are is the major corps of the US moved all (or most) production to China. Why you may ask ? The cheap
, slave labor of your "socialist" design

You can repeat that 1,000 times & it still won't prove the claim that "only non-producers want socialism". If anything, it seems to prove that the
socialist & communist workers in China work more than the supposed capitalists in the US, since they work longer hours & for less pay.

originally posted by: jkm1864
I always noticed that the people whom would get free healthcare was always for it where as the people whom would pay for it were against it. The best
part is the first group would call the second group a bunch of racists for no wanting free healthcare when they are the ones that have to pay for
it.

Right now the middle class is carrying most of the burden for health care and paying the most for their own health care.

I'm middle class. I suppose you are right. I'm all for free health care, for everyone. Between the tax burden I'm carrying AND the health care
burden I'm carrying (literally, both of these things together are eating nearly 60% of our income), I would be grateful to shoulder just one of them
instead of both.

Everyone always wants free health care. The dirty little secret is that it will never be free. Someone will always have to pay for it.

Even in socialized health care countries, they all pay for it. They just prefer to think they don't because they don't directly fork over money to
their health care providers.

Yes, and if the wealthy would pay their share for that health care, like they do in those countries you speak of, it would be possible. But, they
never will in the US, so it's a pipe dream really, and so I guess that someone is me. I'll have to keep slogging away and hope I can afford medical
care for our collective chronic conditions.

By any metric single payer is much better at providing affordable quality health care. The US health care consumer spends double of the nearest
industrialized nation.

Private health care insurance is privatized socialism.

It's not just single payer that does it though, it's just one ingredient. The VA is single payer and it is an unmitigated disaster. There are other
social systems that need to be in place to make it work. I don't know if that is possible in the US. Such a mess, and it's burying us.

Everyone always wants free health care. The dirty little secret is that it will never be free. Someone will always have to pay for it.

Even in socialized health care countries, they all pay for it. They just prefer to think they don't because they don't directly fork over money to
their health care providers.

It goes beyond that though with pricing controls and ethics.

For instance in the US per the NEJM 50 percent of drug trials can't be reproduced. Largely due to fraud and conflict of interest. 50 percent of drug
trials and diagnosis couldn't be reproduced.

That is from for profit medical system where the share holders dictate policy and returns are forced from failed drug development.

There was a set of stories about diagnosing early childhood bipolar where the treatment and diagnosis was false. It went out in journals and
everything. The fda covers most of it up or washes their hands because of equipment and patent deficits for testing.

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