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Spent 20 minutes try to assemble some sort of coherent thought and failed.

It basically sums up as: "Go away and leave us alone, all of you. We were doing fine before you lot came and ruined it with your numbers and your 24 hour coverage and your corrections* to our method of play. Oh, and that bit where you said you didn't want to be an arsehole? You failed buddy, good and hard. But that's okay, because the brainless zergmongers who are assuming charge of this whole deliciously FUBAR situation are still rolling out the red carpet and playing the bloody national anthem whilst you and your buddies destruct everything we've struggled to build over the last two months."

...oh. I feel a bit better now. As you were.

* and yes, he had some good points. But dammit, I'm allowed to say my sister smells because she's my sister. But if you say it, I'm going to punch your teeth in. Or something like that. You get my meaning.

Generally, although I am involved in the community, I base my opinions of other people and guilds based off my own experiences. This is why I kept to the alliance with RoS when others broke it (because they supported me heavily in EB) and it also applies to our current situation with Gunnar's newest additions:

Xaoc: Provided great support last night in WSR (? - I think? Or maybe it was RoF! It's a blur!) Borderlands. Remember when we were sieging Longview, the last holdout of the enemy server and the Xaoc commander arrived from taking Cliffside? Beautifully executed. Generally they were helpful, open with me and good to have around. I can't specifically remember the last time we were up against them (was I even with Gunnar's then?) so I can't comment on the hacking of days gone by. From a commander prospective, they can keep coming.

On the flip side...

Guild Wars 2:

Main character name is Seigous Bearheart. I also play on Duke Witherheart. And Lindenheart.

Reddit: Great post by them on the community forum, linked by Sap. Although can you really judge the characteristics of a server by what happens on reset night?

Now, you must take into consideration that my server at launch was WSR and I was on there for a few months, WvWvWing for a large part of that time. However, I moved over to Gunnar's towards the end of October, meaning a lot could have changed since I was part of the WSR community. This means, whenever I express an opinion about Reddit as a guild, most of it is based on my time on that server prior to the back end of 2012.

That said, you may get the impression from their community forum post that they are a highly-organised guild that know how to play and expect the most out of their server. What they actually have is an unwarranted sense of entitlement.

We've been playing against WSR for 3 weeks straight so let me ask you this: When is the last time that you saw a group attack us with more than say... 3 players from Reddit in it? Personally, I have never found myself thinking 'oh, this is a Reddit group!' like the same way we do when we encounter TEO.

You may say that Reddit moving to a bigger, move active WvWvW community will motivate their members to play more. However, when I joined Gunnar's we were in the shitter for WvWvW. Yet did that stop us in RPS from playing together and at least taking initiative? Not at all. We stuck together, with the wider community, and worked really hard to get stabilised - despite us dropping tiers every other week.

With the numbers Reddit have, you'd think that they'd manage to have some influence over the server in WvWvW and we'd be seeing a lot more of them - seeing as their scouts seem to be pretty smart about the whole thing. You'd think that they would actively organise event nights and so on to encourage others to join in. Well I have never seen anything to suggest that they do.

If Reddit do join Gunnar's, I assure you that their presence will be little more than something to bolster the ranks of our zerg. Except the usual zerg randomers are kind, quiet folks who appreciate a commander who knows what they're doing. Redditors generally spent their time suggesting counter-productive strategies to the commanders on WSR.

Like I say, all of the above is based on my own experience and I suggest that we wait until Reddit joins the server for real (assuming that they do) before throwing down the hate. I also appreciate that RPS is a public forum and again, my opinions are my own and do not reflect RPS at all. It's just that I may seem prejudiced at times and I wanted to explain why - without starting a flame war on the server community forum.

Last edited by Krathor; 20-01-2013 at 04:58 PM.

Guild Wars 2:

Main character name is Seigous Bearheart. I also play on Duke Witherheart. And Lindenheart.

I'm not wild about the current transfer activity going, but I was in the group that Reddit guy was in and they seemed like a nice bunch and his comments were accurate. It was a loosely organised grouping of Able and Baker for reset, and while Insky is a nice chap he's not quite fascist enough when it comes to setting objectives for the groups, so there were some slack periods where he was asking for suggestions as to next targets and we did lose some momentum. It didn't help that we were up against NP who can be very organised, although in the end we worked well as a distraction force to keep them busy while other groups capped their stuff. Whether they're much cop as a WvW guild remains to be seen but there's nothing to be gained if we sneer at them checking us out.

I've posted about the Xaoc thing on the forum but from what I've seen so far they seem decent and organised. I'm not happy about the amount of forum drama it's attracted and we definitely shouldn't be trying to butter up large guilds to come and fight for us because we're not desperate to reach higher tiers by those means. We'll see how they fit in with the rest of the community soon enough. I just hope we're not in for weeks of internal or external drama over the changes.

Thanks for speaking your mind Krathor, I think all of us appreciate an honest statement, even if it doesn't reflect everyone's opinion. Personally, I have never consciously met the reddit guild (also not unconsciously, I pay attention to my drinks on a party and so should you) so I cannot really comment on your experiences with them.

However, I am pretty excited about the "new guys", both Xaoc (which means "chaos" btw) and Imp. Also, I would be happy to have the reddit folks as an addition to our community. That's the main thing about people moving over to Gunnar's Hold that many people are concerned about: Could the influx of new players impact negatively on the feeling of community we have worked for quite hard over the last months?

The quick and simple answer is - I believe - no. The people that have stuck together during the last matchups are superb company, very friendly, but most importantly used to see people come and leave. No short term fluctuation of the player base will change that.

As for the new (mostly Russian) members on the server, I've got the impression that they are very friendly, organised, and fun to play with. The official GW2 forums are full of comments from players of other servers naming and shaming Xaoc for being dishonest kittenstompers and cheaters. However, as Tichai has already pointed out in some threads, there is no evidence for that to be seen.*

So, if anyone of the new guys reads this thread, I say "Hello" and "Welcome". Looking forward fighting alongside you.

*As a general remark: The current guild leader of Xaoc, Khorne, was very relaxed and open during the Mumble interview when people started to ask questions concerning accusations of hacking/cheating as well as Xaoc's position on such behaviour, which I find really nice of him. After all, every server has some of these people and there is no way to prevent individuals to use illegal means of "winning". What we can do is to exclude them from the community. And that's exactly the view Khorne expressed as well.

We'll see how they fit in with the rest of the community soon enough. I just hope we're not in for weeks of internal or external drama over the changes.

I think this is the most important thing to take away from all of this. If both guilds join for sure, then people like me should shut up for a while and let them just get on with it. I may be wrong about both Xoac and Reddit but, if they do decide to join, there's little that anyone can do about it. Plus, they will understand the expectations Gunnar's have of them.

Guild Wars 2:

Main character name is Seigous Bearheart. I also play on Duke Witherheart. And Lindenheart.

*shrug* I'll roll with the Zerg and behave myself (most of the time) if they end up joining. Besides, as my twenty-mumblesomething-plus-one birthday approaches on the stealthy black wings of middle-agedness I feel I'm getting too old for much internet drama.

When the general chat turned towards the important subject of biscuits, specifically which ones were The Right Biscuits and which were Wrong, I noticed the Rddt guys had sound and strongly held views on the subject (chocolate digestives and rich tea respectively).

I could only feel they had passed some critical hidden test and therefore would fit into GH quite well.

I take it from the comments here (https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/foru...ed-for-WvW-use) that we could all transform into Dolyaks and then use "Golem in a Box" for attacking, giving the ruminant army options for participation which are not triggered by the "F" key. Could be pretty amusing...

I'm kind of sad that I missed the Sunday night event, but I need(ed) a break from WvW after Saturday.

I normally rather enjoy the GH Mumble but due to [redacted] guild it felt almost as bad as EB map chat when Ohdavig was there. I know a lot of the mumble guys ignore map chat: I can understand why. Map chat is often full of crap, and mumble is a lot more fluid for communication.

---

Though I would like to suggest a RPS event for Wednesdays since there isn't x-core or anything on yet, and we can just sit around on our own mumble and have a good chat (The levelling event was a blast because of this) so kind of a WvW event that is between RPS in xcore and the karma train: fun, structured, but not NO YOU MUST HAVE OFF HAND AXE WARRIOR!!!11

Whatsforlunchwhatsforlunchwhatsforlunch... Oh, I mean, count me in. Good idea, I would love to see the casual grouping fun continued, maybe put something in the "Group hug" thread.

As for the WvW centric weekend, I had a good time with joining groups/cores while having a stroll around the map to get some map completions. I think the only thing I need now is one vista on the RoF borderland, neatly placed on top of a tower... I guess we have to take that one at some point.

I didn't catch any drama on Mumble. However, I hope that GH will stick to its former tactical approach for WvW and doesn't degenerate into a big pile of zerg (not very likely to happen, but it is sometimes tempting to go for the easy solution).

Fab raised the concern about us turning all zergy on the forums- I expect it will be discussed at great length in the meeting tonight. I expect Xaoc will end up working like a more organised version of KISS used to- a large mobile (rather effective) zerg that switches maps frequently and does their own thing alongside the smaller guilds.

After the community meeting last night, when the Russians had all gone to bed, we had a glorious few hours of WvW. WSR seemed to pull big numbers out of thin air and started trying to recapture their stuff. A lengthy siege of their garrison saw us charge out many times to chase them off and Padmay single-handedly took out most of their siege. They smashed the walls down on Bay and halfway through that defense we had to waypoint across to defend our Hills from more of them before mapping straight back to finish them off at Bay again. Having waypoints in your stuff is a massive advantage, until they nerf the countdown window anyway.

A bunch of us ran with Dis and Cry Havoc for a while after that and we had some excellent fights against their superior numbers around Arah. We kept balling up, throwing down mesmer veils for buffs and then hitting them in the side and they just panicked and ran before we set up to do it all again. After 4-5 variations on that they were afraid to come round the corner to hit Bay even after we'd left the area. It was good to see WSR still bringing it while RoF seem to have given up entirely.

So there's a proposal for a big finale fight in our borderlands on Friday on the forums- at 8GMT WSR and ROF will pack out the map and try to take us down. That means a measly 2-1 numbers advantage if we get all our boys into the yard, plus we'll presumably have fully-upgraded defences, but it could be lots of fun. Shame I can't link stuff without bringing down the wrath of the auto-moderating gods but the title was GH-RoF-WsR-Goodbye-Head-a-Bashin'.

Not sure what the plan is but I think we should hold and claim a fort for Horace and hold onto it for the night. My first choice would be Cliffside so we can make The Curse work to our advantage...