Anyone with a solid knowledge of Iberian Peninsula history and culture is well cognizant that Portugal (particularly the northern regions of Minho, Douro and Tras-os-Montes and, to a lesser extent, areas of Central Portugal), Galiza (Galicia) and Asturies (Asturias) are very closely related in numerous ways. The three culturally (and ethnically, for the most part) can be seen as forming one nation, distinct from the rest of the Peninsula.

My question is: Should Portugal, Galiza and Asturies not be united as one country? The divisions between the three, in my opinion, are essentially geopolitical. Is there any serious political movement to unite Portugal, Galiza and Asturies in some way? What are your thoughts, irma~os / hermanos?

Anyone with a solid knowledge of Iberian Peninsula history and culture is well cognizant that Portugal (particularly the northern regions of Minho, Douro and Tras-os-Montes and, to a lesser extent, areas of Central Portugal), Galiza (Galicia) and Asturies (Asturias) are very closely related in numerous ways. The three culturally (and ethnically, for the most part) can be seen as forming one nation, distinct from the rest of the Peninsula.

My question is: Should Portugal, Galiza and Asturies not be united as one country? The divisions between the three, in my opinion, are essentially geopolitical. Is there any serious political movement to unite Portugal, Galiza and Asturies in some way? What are your thoughts, irma~os / hermanos?

This is a huge can of worms. I'll state my opinion beforehand: no, I don't think that hey should be united under a single country.

Today there are numerous different movements, each with a different DIY map of what the countries should look like to reflect so-called "ethnic borders". These generally make that last millennium disappear as if nations were exclusively defined using allele counts.

More to the point, there are movements that:

1) See Galiza as being "part" of Portugal, and want to "free" Galiza from "castillian" imperialism.

2) See Northern Portugal and Galiza as a country, and want the simultaneous secession of both Galiza from Spain and Northern Portugal from, well, Portugal.

3) The same as 2) but including Asturias.

Point 1) disregards the fact that most Galicians I have met are pretty happy with being Spanish, whatever their position regarding Forals and larger autonomic freedom. It seems to stem from a linguistic perspective (Galician-portuguese) and also a somewhat dated view on the situation in Spain - especially from the Portuguese.

Point 2) uses proto-history as the boundary, allied with some racial substract taken from XIX nationalism that portraits Galiza as a beacon of purity amidst a see of moors. In addition to the objections in 1) it makes moot of the extremely relevant happenings since 1143 as if they are somehow a completely irrelevant thing.

Point 3) also irritates Asturians - not unlike the Catalunya/Valencian thing. It is assumed by people defending them that others in the "claimed" regions must feel the same kind of "national identity", where mostly it is seen as some sort of territorial claim based on things that most give little value to.

This is not to say that those regions don't share a lot. They do. If one augments the criteria a bit the whole Iberia shares a lot. Whether this is an argument in favour of an Iberian Union is another matter.

Mostly I think that all of this takes a rather simplistic approach to the issue and assumes that haplogroup percentage and whatever classic authors said about proto-historic Iberia should be a defining criteria in nation-building. Which is something that I disagree with.

If Galicians and other Spaniard brothers are reading this topic I'm sure many of them will quite clearly say that no, they do not want that to happen. Some will position themselves according to the three positions above, but most will not.

I am, btw, also part Galician, and overall part Spanish from Castille. The "Galiza is Portugal" thing is overblown and mostly said in a way that solemnly irritates Galicians, with good reason.

This is a huge can of worms. I'll state my opinion beforehand: no, I don't think that hey should be united under a single country.

Today there are numerous different movements, each with a different DIY map of what the countries should look like to reflect so-called "ethnic borders". These generally make that last millennium disappear as if nations were exclusively defined using allele counts.

More to the point, there are movements that:

1) See Galiza as being "part" of Portugal, and want to "free" Galiza from "castillian" imperialism.

2) See Northern Portugal and Galiza as a country, and want the simultaneous secession of both Galiza from Spain and Northern Portugal from, well, Portugal.

3) The same as 2) but including Asturias.

Point 1) disregards the fact that most Galicians I have met are pretty happy with being Spanish, whatever their position regarding Forals and larger autonomic freedom. It seems to stem from a linguistic perspective (Galician-portuguese) and also a somewhat dated view on the situation in Spain - especially from the Portuguese.

Point 2) uses proto-history as the boundary, allied with some racial substract taken from XIX nationalism that portraits Galiza as a beacon of purity amidst a see of moors. In addition to the objections in 1) it makes moot of the extremely relevant happenings since 1143 as if they are somehow a completely irrelevant thing.

Point 3) also irritates Asturians - not unlike the Catalunya/Valencian thing. It is assumed by people defending them that others in the "claimed" regions must feel the same kind of "national identity", where mostly it is seen as some sort of territorial claim based on things that most give little value to.

This is not to say that those regions don't share a lot. They do. If one augments the criteria a bit the whole Iberia shares a lot. Whether this is an argument in favour of an Iberian Union is another matter.

Mostly I think that all of this takes a rather simplistic approach to the issue and assumes that haplogroup percentage and whatever classic authors said about proto-historic Iberia should be a defining criteria in nation-building. Which is something that I disagree with.

If Galicians and other Spaniard brothers are reading this topic I'm sure many of them will quite clearly say that no, they do not want that to happen. Some will position themselves according to the three positions above, but most will not.

I am, btw, also part Galician, and overall part Spanish from Castille. The "Galiza is Portugal" thing is overblown and mostly said in a way that solemnly irritates Galicians, with good reason.

I'll wait for other comments.

Excellent analysis. My family comes from both sides of the Galiza / Minho border and the roots are extremely deep; Minhoto and Galeo. Ethnically, I consider myself Gallaecian Celt. - my families hailing from Galician and Gascon tribes. Geopolitically I am, of course, Portuguese (since I was born there) and Luso-American. From my point of view, the best one can expect is some sort of cultural union between Galiza, Asturies and Northern Portugal (Minho, Douro and Tras-os-Montes). I personally refer to the latter as Bracara, the 8th Celtic country.

I have been called an extremist, a reactionary, a revisionist, an elitist, a supremacist, a racist, a homophobe, an anti-Semite, a right-winger, a theocrat, a godless cynic, a fascist and, of course, a must for every German, a Nazi.

So, it should be expected that I have a foible for politically "incorrect" sites that every "modern," "decent," "civilized," "tolerant," and "enlightened" man is supposed to ignore and avoid.

Yes I can. My grammar can be a bit off when I write. I'm fluent; been speaking the language since birth.

Right, sorry for asking, meant no disrespect, but as you are probably aware *sometimes* the 2nd generation of Portuguese is not exactly fluent. I see that happening in France, at least, partially due to a desire to approach the socio-economic status.

Right, sorry for asking, meant no disrespect, but as you are probably aware *sometimes* the 2nd generation of Portuguese is not exactly fluent. I see that happening in France, at least, partially due to a desire to approach the socio-economic status.