The concept is that Carbon tends to be too stiff and while the rebound is GREAT, it resists flex and can actually create a weak point just inside the CF. The "microfibers" are most likely nylon or polyester. Dennis turned me on to sheetrock mud support webbing. It has a glue on one side so that I can stick it to the board, while laminating it to the board.

That's the stuff I'm using, but the material I found is plastic not fiberglass. I think technically a microfiber just needs to be synthetic and measure less than one denier. Doesn't need to be hollow or have any specific purpose.

I did see that Tangent, I was theorizing that the black was CF and was hiding something like a blank of balsa. The location is odd though, the tail has nothing and it looks to stiffen the middle of the board, so I'm not following that conceptually. Do you have any theory about the location of that black strip?

so basicaly its vacu bag 2lbs stringerless EPS, with more glass than regular board and some unwoven fabric between glass layers (therefore more white look), but it looks like the top layer seems to be hand laminated with polyester resin. !?!?

I saw that post when it hit and it makes sense. If you read between the lines, the guy talks about the "mat in the core" and it sure LOOKS like coremat. Although, there appears to be an almost woven orientation which I though was maybe an imprint of the inner and outer glass, but it could be that mat is a really loosely woven FG.

I don't doubt that the exterior is PE resin, epoxy doesn't polish worth anything. I've tested PE over Epoxy and it seems to adhere well and polishes nicely.

That tangent is interesting and creating a blank with straight stringers would sure make the blank build process easier.

Jeff, does that yellow Channel Islands board just have fiber wrapped rails? or is it throughout and just exposed on the rails? Hard to really see them on my phone. That Tangent looks interesting. Do either of you know the reasoning or theory behind the straight stringers? Is that center piece carbon or something else?

Hey Bac, if you read the marketing propaganda, they describe the process as: cutting the rails off the shaped board, wrapping the rails in the microfiber and then reattaching it to the center or core of the board. So internally, it's foam (they say a special polyu blend) but the rails include a vertical section where they reattach to the core.

The tangent is a odd looking duck. In looking at the black stripe in that first URL Petr gave us, the outline looks just a little wavy like it's fabric. My guess is it's CF, but without seeing it upclose and personal I'm strictly guessing.

I read somewhere that the straight stringers are supposed to rebound more directly than a curved perimeter stringer. The curve, when the board flexes, isn't in line with a turn but is more "twisted" and so when it rebounds, it loses some engery in untwisting. I have no idea if that's accurate.

I have the first layer of deck lamination down and I put the webbing down first. In my testing, the webbing didn't stick well to epoxied fiberglass, nor an unsealed blank - raw foam, but a sealed blank worked well. I think it has to do with the surface contact - the more the merrier, so to speak.

This is the first side with the webbing stuck down. You'll see relief cuts around corners and where it wanted to bunch on the rails.

If I ever do this again, I'll vacuum bag it, some of the webbing wanted to undo, so I had to really work the fiberglass down HARD. One bright spot was that the webbing sort of snagged the fiberglass and held it in place, even in the wind.

What the webbing does is move more resin out to the rails. The voids between the web fill with resin and also provide a bit of structure to this extra resin so that it doesn't chip so easily. The extra resin still retains the shape of the rail without associated fabric changing the overall matrix. Pretty interesting concept. My guess is that when cured, the rails will be stiffer than just plain 'glassed eps, but nowhere near as stiff as epoxied carbon.

Something that just occured to me on the Coil. They aren't lapping the rails. They build that board in a bag and the tuck UNDER on the lap is miserable inside the bag. It wants to bridge or bunch unless you have an intensifier or a pleat every 2.5 inches. If you look at the rail of a P5, the foam is rounded and the deck laminate is tucked under, but the rail from the apex down is built up of PE resin and then shaped out. The bottom skin is afixed and then I'd bet routed off in one operation. The Coil boys I'm willing to bet do something similar, but stop the lap at the apex of the rail so there isn't any tuck, then cover the whole thing up with the webbing and some extra resin. That's a great work-around.

@ dtw - LOL, isn't woofie funny? He's always got EPS on his butt. When I am shaping, he comes out and joins me - mostly because I scratch him, but he also likes laying down in the eps dust. It must be soft or something.

Yes, lighter colors too. Mix your resin and catalyst. Divide clear epoxy. Add color to divided epoxy. Maybe keep some clear epoxy. Poor colors in to the same container and give a half to two stirs. Poor on the board. Possibly fill open spots with clear. Squeegee to laps. Wipe the squeegee clean before each pull. Pull each area once and only once.

Thanks guys. Finished the deck tonight. I'm rather in awe of the difficulty of doing the art work. I have no affinity for this sort of thing, which doesn't help, but choosing coordinating colors, developing a pattern that is pleasing to the eye and effects that don't look muddied are a challenge. I gained a deeper appreciation for the quality art we see on custom boards.

Solid board. Rode very well. The stringerless EPS behaved nicely and the webbing with the extra resin on the rails adds a bit of snap that you can feel. I think it's a great alternative to stringers, not sure that results in any net weight savings. I'd like to try it with a bagged lamination.

@ Hawaj - It just opens so many more doors, I find myself asking a bazillion more questions with each minor success.

@ Brewkettle - yeah, I've done stringerless, but was intrigued by that Coil. I mostly wanted to see if the webbing added anything to the board. You could feel it snap back - Bre indicated it had the same pop as James' parabolic wood stringered board. It also spun really easily. James did several reverses and I personally did a few threes - if I can hit one, it's a good day. I can't even begin to imagine how the webbing could affect surface rotation, but I'm at a loss to point to anything else...the shape and fin placement is all the same.

I noticed that the webbing comes in a bunch of different colors - I think each signified a different function or "speciality".