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Or as Albert Einstein once said, Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Somehow, that quote has been attributed to Einstein, but there is no evidence he said it. What Einstein actually said is "insanity is reading the posts of the same totally illogical, negative Met fans over and over, and expecting them to finally make some sense."

I understood how dire the overall health of the baseball operation was when Alderson was hired. The farm wasn't that good besides a few gems. The parent club had quite a few bloated contracts that was strangling this franchise. I knew that it would take a few seasons for this franchise would be righted. Unlike yourself who thinks one signing will change the Mets 2013 fate.

Unlike many of the posters in this forum, including you. You see the Yankees spend money on Free Agents and question why aren't the Mets. And if the Mets don't spend on these Free Agents the owners are cheap. The irony of it is, the Mets have been trying to do just that prior to this front office, and they haven't won squat. The Mets needed to reinvest in the farm system not only in the draft and the IFA but with player development. And so far it looks like its working.

I understand that a vast majority of this fanbase want to sign Free Agents, But after Bay, K-Rod, Castillo, Perez, Alou etc., you would think that maybe this fanbase would want to try something else.

Or as Albert Einstein once said, Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Originally Posted by wdwyer

And I laugh when people use that as an acceptable excuse. There is a difference.

Anyone who has ever said "I've been patient for "X" amount of years...when will this team turn it around." Isn't being patient. They are complaining behind a facade of "patience".

We waited since 1986 for this team to suddenly realize a rebuild was in order. That spending every year on a lot of mediocre over paid players just to grab the backpages was a bad idea (Kind of like what the Jets have become).

Patience is accepting that once this team finally turned in their new direction, we as fans now have to understand that it will take time to show progress. To correct the damage that has been done. This is why I have been warning against instant gratification. That this market could not accept a true rebuild. We as a fan base started complaining here the first two weeks of 2011.

I don't care how long it's been, this is not patience.

This team chose to "rebuild" 2 years ago (no matter the real reason). From that stand point...being "patient" since 1986 doesn't matter anymore. We've waited since 1986 for this team to take the stick out of their butt, now we have to try and be patient since 2010.

Originally Posted by DUMETROPOLITANS
The Reds are loaded in the outfield, so I believe they would trade Drew Stubbs, who at 28 is still young enough with upside. he gives us a center fielder, power and speed. I would dangle Dickey yeah I said that, for Mr Stubbs, and sign Melky

You would dangle Dickey, but who would you substitute for him at the last minute when the Reds weren't looking? You're not really thinking of making that trade for Dickey? If we were to trade him, we could certainly do much better than that.

More and more, I am thinking we could, and should hold onto Dickey. (and keep Niese too, getting back to the subject of this thread) My plan now would be:

1. Get Arencibia from the Jays for some of our good prospects. They should be receptive, since they now have 3 major league catchers, and Arencibia seems the most logical to go.

2. Trade Gee to the Twins for Josh Willingham, giving us some power in the middle of the lineup.

3. Sign Melky to a low cost, incentive based contract, as the leadoff hitter. Then sign Juan Pierre as insurance, in case Melky's performance the last 2 years was actually due to PEDs. Pierre is a fine 4th outfielder if Melky comes through.

4. Non tender Pelfrey and resign him to a lower cost contract. Resign Hairston to a 2 year/$$4.5 million contract.

5. Sign Japanese closer Kyuji Fujikawa to bolster the bull pen and possibly to close for us. He should get 2 years/$8 million. ($3 million in 2013, $4.5 million in 2014, with a $5 million option and $500K buyout for 2015)

a young good lefty under contract cheap should be considered a building block and not trade bait

The thing the Mets need to weigh is if this year was just the start for Niese, or his high point? Remember he still hasn't pitched 200 innings in a season, and has spent time on the DL in 2 of his full 3 seasons in the Majors.

Remember at age 26 Mike Pelfrey had his best season 15-9 3.66 era.

If Niese goes back to being a .500 pitcher, who can't pitch 200 innings, with a 4.20+ era and a 1.40+ whip, he won't be such a bargain.

He's gotten better over his career, hasn't missed time for the past two years, is a lefty, is under a team friendly contract, and is only 26. He won't get a top 10 prospect, but he could get something pretty darn good.

I don't think the Mets 3rd best starter is going to get any team's top prospect, much less a top 10 hitting prospect like Myers or d'Arnaud.

Unless you believe Harvey is our 2nd best starter, Niese is our 2nd best starter. He's under contract for 6 more seasons, he's left-handed, and he's 26. He has a ton of value, and teams would deal their best prospect for him in a nice package.

Unless you believe Harvey is our 2nd best starter, Niese is our 2nd best starter. He's under contract for 6 more seasons, he's left-handed, and he's 26. He has a ton of value, and teams would deal their best prospect for him in a nice package.

Or Alex Gordon.

"You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

No way I trade niese for Alex Gordon he's very overrated. Has ha one good year.

He has had 2 solid years.

"You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

Okay I take that back but 140 strikeouts the last 2 years even though he's had good years.

I'm just not willing to part with a top end of the rotation lefty for a 29 year old outfielder. He's basically Murphy with a good glove and a bit more power. Murphy has more power then he showed this year.