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DLottmann

Your poll is too narrow... or maybe I am supposed to choose "Bastard"?

The answer is "to an extent".

Balance, counter-balance, opposition of force, hanging from straight arm, pushing rather than pulling... all these basics can be learned in a gym environment, there is really no doubt about that...

However, technique... or that part of technique one might say is "reading the rock"... that, is in very short supply in your average gym rat, and can only be gained from mileage on real rock... it's why we see recently emerged gym rats crimp their way up 5.8 crack, or just outside the crack...

And, I'll add I think gym climbing is pretty weak for "endurance" IMO... I don't care how many 5.11 30 foot routes you can do in an evening session... that doesn't translate well to even a moderate Grade IV like Solar Slab, Johnny Vegas, or other long MP routes...

I mostly agree with DMan.Given that one cannot 'train' outdoors year-around (on rock) in the Northeast, I think a good gym is a good place to train for power and power-endurance, not so much pure endurance as DMan has pointed out. DMan - there are several good gyms in MA that have 40- and 40+ foot steep and pumpy routes in the 5.10 to 5.12 range that will, at the end of the day, lay waste to your forearms and core. Come on down this winter if there is poor ice up North (not saying it will be but just in case).

« Last Edit: October 03, 2012, 07:18:49 PM by sneoh »

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"You have to decide to do a flag, where you can broke your vertebrae or a barn door depending of your pro" - the poster formerly known as Champ

I have a basement gym, and it is a Godsend with a one year old. It has maybe 20 feet of flat roof to the overhanging wall where the stairs used to be. Maybe 11a the easiest route but harder variants. Is it the same as outdoors? Hell no, but I did five laps barefoot while Ella was napping today. Lots better than nothing, which was the alternative..

Balance, counter-balance, opposition of force, hanging from straight arm, pushing rather than pulling...

This is what I mean. I would add initiation of movement, using momentum, maybe more...

I agree that there are components of technique that cannot be trained well indoors.

I guess when I think endurance I'm thinking the mental kind... while easy and many pitches it's a long day, nothing gym climbing can prepare you for. Forearm endurance, well that's probably something the gym can help you with

If you believe climbing movement/technique can effectively be trained indoors vote yes. If you believe indoor training is only good for strength/endurance vote no.

Patrick Edlinger used to have 32 moved of 5.13 on his indoor wall (rotative wall). He is a very good climber and do them all each day. He said that it is better to used an indoor wall when you are close to a 5.10 climber. The exact raison was, I think, that the anticipation of a move and the learning process for safety most be train in real situation. Not when you know all the hold from the bottom. You can train to do a flag in all position on a wall. In rock, you have often very few second to find the good position to be able to rest...or the good technique because a flag can not be the best solution. As an indoor climber climb rock as he climb indoor, he will go for it close to a bolt, he will do the same with a cam...a nuts...nothing. As he will struggle to stay on the hole, looking at the move, finding the hole, accident, or people scare to death, is more the results of a lack of knowledge in the learning process. Indoor don't have much anticipation at lower grade even if it is a great way to improve what you already know.

All i know is that this is the first poll I haven't voted 'bastard' on in a while. For whatever reason when I first was climbing I was anti indoors. I think that this mindset and lack of climbing time negatively affected my climbing. Not that I think that indoor training is super great, but i think it generally goes along with the general acceptance that any and all types of climbing are good for climbing. Training does make you stong.

All i know is that this is the first poll I haven't voted 'bastard' on in a while. ....... the general acceptance that any and all types of climbing are good for climbing. Training does make you stong.

Same here.Indoors is more social and training for outdoors.

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"You have to decide to do a flag, where you can broke your vertebrae or a barn door depending of your pro" - the poster formerly known as Champ