Only recognise 2 out of 4 so shall have to keep an eye out for the others, maybe I am limited in my knowledge of inspirational guitarists to 3 letters per name :lol:

The JBL's are still about yeah, sent u a mail with info before did I not? :?

They are Powered, 15&quot; JBL Eons, handle anything you throw at it and pump it out at around 300W a piece I think (saw them online listed as 400W each but think thats peak...will have to check). Have XLR inputs and link output, Mic/Line Selection, volume control, power in is standard 3 pin kettle lead but a nice feature of these is that they have a link out for power so both can be powered off the one socket if you have a long link cable...which I happen to be including. Am also throwing in a good set of speaker stands, air sprung so even if the steel locking pin fails they still wont collapse under the weight of the speakers.

Yeah that was a bad example of that song, but I couldn't find the original one. On the original album version from Blood and Chocolate the solo consists of just two oscillating, almost out of tune, notes. Sublime really, in my opinion. So much to be said by so little. Like a good artist he knows how to paint a picture. That's why he's inspirational to me. Check it out.

Pat Metheny ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvaVQZP6A_M is a pretty cool acoustic medley - shame we dont get this stuff on our tv!)
Derek Trucks
John Scofield
John mayer for his catchy grooves and feel
Jeff Buckley is also great underneath that voice.
probably lots more I cant think of, hmm.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5JkHBC5lDs
I used to play this tune by Knopfler constantly to try to study his nuances. The expression of the playing in Brothers In Arms sounds like nothing else I've heard. Just the right amount of soloing without w@nking all over the sentiments of the words.

The very fact he hasnt been mentioned goes to show that he is indeed the most underrated guitar player ever... Mr Ritchie Blackmore. Constantly reinvented himself, every time showing his vast technical ability and equally vast levels of taste.

Can't believe noone has mentioned Vernon Reid, or Alex Lifeson, or Steve Mc.Cann, or Nuno Bettencourt or Richie Kotzen, or Bucket Head or Sir Mildred Mulch or Devin Townsend or Simon Mc.Bride with the exceptions of me a whole 5 pages later, what the hell is wrong with everyone? :evil:

I enjoy the tender fingerpickings of Nick Drake and indeed Paul Simon.

Brian May's geetar sounds always had the most beautiful tone and his harmony orchestrations were a delight.

Robert Fripp of course is always a goodun' for blistering nonconsensual mayhems.

Rob-Dean-of-pop-group-Japan's contributions to the canon of svelte delicate E-bow work are often neglected, I feel.

Bravo to Johnny Ramone for discovering the werld of bar-chord overdriven minimalism, and for dying of prostate cancer (which, I heard, he liked), and also to Steve Jones for multitracking it and adding phaser pedal.

I must say I retain a fondness for the werld of angular skeleton reverberted post-punk geetar, due to the endeavours of such folk as Robin Simon (Ultravox, Magazine...) John McGeoogh (Magazine) John Levene (PiL) and maybe even Charlie Burchill of Simple MiNds (ahine though they became) and also such scraggly folk like in Sioxxie and the Bansheees and stuff.

Andy Summers is a fantastic guitar player and its between him, Mark Knopfler and John Frusciante as to who is my favourite electric guitarist. I also like Dave Gilmour, Brian May, Alex Lifeson and Steve Hackett as well as all the usual suspects; Hendrix etc.

On Acoustic I like Colin Reid, Bert Jansch and a host of others. David McCann who played at Common Grounds recently is superb and a real inspiration. Does anybody know if he has any upcoming gigs?

[quote:9eee14337f="Fernando"]Andy Summers is a fantastic guitar player and its between him, Mark Knopfler and John Frusciante as to who is my favourite electric guitarist. I also like Dave Gilmour, Brian May, Alex Lifeson and Steve Hackett as well as all the usual suspects; Hendrix etc.

On Acoustic I like Colin Reid, Bert Jansch and a host of others. David McCann who played at Common Grounds recently is superb and a real inspiration. Does anybody know if he has any upcoming gigs?[/quote:9eee14337f]

[quote:09460713dd="esotericeric93"][quote:09460713dd="Fernando"]Andy Summers is a fantastic guitar player and its between him, Mark Knopfler and John Frusciante as to who is my favourite electric guitarist. I also like Dave Gilmour, Brian May, Alex Lifeson and Steve Hackett as well as all the usual suspects; Hendrix etc.

On Acoustic I like Colin Reid, Bert Jansch and a host of others. David McCann who played at Common Grounds recently is superb and a real inspiration. Does anybody know if he has any upcoming gigs?[/quote:09460713dd]

Joey Santiago and Johnny Greenwood for getting interesting noises out of guitars and approaching the instrument in new ways. For acoustic I like Elliott Smith and Django Reinhardt. I also used to think Dave Murray was a god when I was about 16.

Brian May's geetar sounds always had the most beautiful tone and his harmony orchestrations were a delight.[/quote:4eaa3445d8]

I have to agree with you Feline, also I always loved the way some guitarists could play elaborate rhythms whilst singing along eg. Walter Schreifels, Chris Cornell, Leadbelly and Cormac Battle (amongst numerous others).

Sel Balamir from Amplifier hits the perfect line between mood and melody on their first album if you ask me.

Billy Howerdel of A Perfect Circle has a strange talent for writing guitar lines that fit brilliantly in the mix, but that you can't really always remember. Er, if you know what I mean. Mood mixed with melody.

In terms of what makes an &quot;amazing&quot; guitarist I tend to look for ability to create textures rather than widdly-widdly shite, or even hooks. The guitarists who catch my ear are the ones who can combine the two in a subtle way (i.e. hooks and textures, not widdly-widdly shite).

I really dont think Noel or Oasis's Popularity has much to do with the topic. As a huge Oasis fan myself i will stand by Noels guitaring as decent at best. Oasis's music i dont think would work with fast or irregular tuning or solo's anyway. Listning back to Be Here Now, there is way too much fiddly guitar loops and over produced keek on it. Noel writes effective cathy songs which appeal to a fair few million, but if you just learnt Oasis songs as a kid, you wouldnt be much a guitarist.

i love be here now! i thought it was one of their best, altho many will argue definitely maybe, and mornin glory were. theres some real good rockin songs on that like i hope i think i know and it's gettin better man.
cant believe it took so long for rory gallagher to be mentioned above, like the 10th post...disgrace. what a legend.. him, john mayer, josh homme and if anyone has ever heard lindsey buckinham play big love live theyll agree with me that he has to be one of the best. i know it cant be judged on one song, but no average guitarist can play that and sing it so well simultaneously (probably spelt wrong)

Gary Moore - not of 'Parisian Walkways' fame, but my Canadian cousin Gary Moore who can [i:cc50393977]nearly[/i:cc50393977] play the start of 'Enter Sandman'. Oh, and check this guy out! WATCH IT TO THE END.

its magic init.i love the way that smack head kurt stole the come as you are riff.why people not like noel on this fourm .he draged guitar music out of the gutter.say what ya like about songs beenin easy or what every but sure dats whalt its all about 3 chords .wee buns

No way man, noel is a scumbag who pals about with tony blair trying to get a sniff of his used boxers and stealing cherries knickers. Pure filth, great stuff. How did a working class boy in a rock and roll band ever get it so good?

He should be working in a Dairylee factory spunking off in the cheese and making Michael Jackson jokes.

[quote:3a6bcbfaa3="supersonicsolos"]Dont make a differance hes a fukin amazin songwriter witch is what he classes him self as[/quote:3a6bcbfaa3]

Exactly, he's a good songwriter...not a great guitar player. Noel himself stated about his own disbelief when he was named one of the greatest guitarist of all time in a famous guitar magazine (at end of 90's/2000)where he beat true guitar greats to the top of the poll.

Ok, Oasis and bands like them where probably &quot;one&quot; of the bands to bring the guitar back to the mainstream in the 1990's (in UK) and suddenly kids started becoming interested in guitars again. Noel has even stated in interviews about not knowing a single scale or what the notes are on the instrument, he is a guesswork player and whilst this approach is good for what he is doing he should not even be considered in the same breath as true virtuoso players or people who revolutionised guitar playing by introducing the world to various techniques or sounds.

Just for reference my influences and the people who I consider who revolutionised guitar playing etc are:

[i:56184cf713]...Baby One More Time (1999)[/i:56184cf713] - 35million copies sold worldwide (as of 2007) - 3.9m copies a year.

Even accounting for Nevermind's 4 year headstart it still outsells What's the story morning glory. Meanwhile, Britney is leaving them standing in her dust.

To pick up on your other point that Liam hasn't made the biggest album of the nineties and so his opinion on Noel is invalid. By the same logic it therefore follows that, as you have not made the biggest album of the nineties either, your opinion is just as invalid (as is mine).

[quote:91dfdb9cf0="exitonline"]he is a guesswork player and whilst this approach is good for what he is doing he should not even be considered in the same breath as true virtuoso players or people who revolutionised guitar playing by introducing the world to various techniques or sounds.

[quote:c8d559b5a4="supersonicsolos"]its magic init.i love the way that smack head kurt stole the come as you are riff.why people not like noel on this fourm .he draged guitar music out of the gutter.say what ya like about songs beenin easy or what every but sure dats whalt its all about 3 chords .wee buns[/quote:c8d559b5a4]

Lad, im probably a bigger Oasis fan than you, but your even making me cringe here. Noel didnt drag guitar music out of the gutter, he swung popular rock music back to Britan from 94 - 99. The whole 90's Britpop thing was my favourite music era, Noel couldnt hold a candle to some of the other bands at that time. Take Nick McCabe of the Verve, Bernard Butler from Suede or even JDB from the Manics, those guys are far better guitarists than Noel could ever wish to be. There isnt a doubt that Noels had the ability to make a really catchy song on a regular basis, but being an amazing guitarist he wasnt.

For me Morning Glory was the biggest record of the 90's, again is say this from the British point of view, down to the fact i aint American and i find a lot of grunge was negitive and never got the whole, im a little angry and depressed due to addiction bla bla whatever, but Morning Glory wasnt even Oasis's best album.

I think we are getting well of topic here... Noel's not a great guitarist. A handy songwriter yes. NEXT....

[quote:3c43a0ae2e="Mickeycolensoparade"][quote:3c43a0ae2e="exitonline"]he is a guesswork player and whilst this approach is good for what he is doing he should not even be considered in the same breath as true virtuoso players or people who revolutionised guitar playing by introducing the world to various techniques or sounds.

.[/quote:3c43a0ae2e]

It's all about feeling, man.[/quote:3c43a0ae2e]

ha ha, Yeah, fair point...im not disregarding this, playing with passion, feeling etc is part of music. Im just saying that players that combine knowledge of the instrument, technique, passion/feeling and an easily identifiable sound are a rare find and those are the type players who interest me....the bluffers guide to guitar gets old very quickly.

Tommy Emmanuel is probably the best stand alone guitarist in the world, in terms of what he can do and how amazingly he does it, ive seen him twice now and both times im totally inspired.

Stevie Ray Vaughan, is in my honest opinion the greatest electric guitarist to have ever lived, when he plays its completely natural and has this ability to play all over the guitar without ever thinking about it. He should be better known, its a crime he isn't, that guitar hero thing helped but still...

The guy from Roxette should defo not be overlooked. I also think Jim Corr deserves a mention. Does Bono play guitar? I'm not sure, but he certainly holds a guitar with purpose. Check the video for &quot;with or without you&quot;. I'd bet all my folding money kept in an elastic band, stuffed in the left hip pocket of my fancy jeans that Bono is the greatest guitarist ever. The guy is singlehandedly saving the world, six pieces of wire on a clump of wood would hardly faze him.

[quote:0499c204f3="mck_776"]Rory Gallagher is by far the best in my opinion!

He could play so many different styles, could play pretty damn fast when he wanted, and mastered the slide guitar!
[/quote:0499c204f3]
yep and his slide guitar hero was Duane Allman. Duane also heavily influenced Eric Clapton, he was involved heavily on Layla and other assorted love songs. Duane Allman is never given the recognition he deserves, his work is immense and he died at 24 which makes it ever more astounding,

most people have already named all the usual suspects but Nils Lofgren hasn't been mentioned. His acoustic solo at the end of &quot;black books&quot; is the kind of thing that makes you wonder why you bother. Also Robert Johnson for blues. Even though it was really the devil whose was doing the playing. :wink:

You cannot put into a numeric list the best *anything* in terms of music. A Subjective musical art form, and the next time someone does my blood will fucking boil over.

Right. You've all seen these Rolling Stone magazine top 100 guitarists/drummers/bassists/vocalists lists too, right?
The kind of list that puts Kurt Cobain in the top 10, because he played with Nirvana, when a guy like Jeff Beck, arguably one of the greatest guitarists of all time, and easily one of the most influential musicians in any music from of our generation gets left behind in the 50 somethings.

The kind of list that puts Jimi Hendrix in the number one spot. Every. Single. Fucking. Time. And not because anyone truly believes that he was the best, it's because that mindset has been handed down. From when? The fucking Sixties. Jimi Hendrix was a wonderful guitar player, I'm a huge fan, his rhythm was great, he was the original guitar hero, and his influence on the instrument is absolutely un-surpassed. But the fact is, the guitar has moved on, into way more complex and even more emotive places, the guitar did NOT begin and end with Jimi Hendrix. If you put Jimi Hendrix in todays musical spectrum, he wouldn't know what he was doing beside someone like Joe Satriani (who by the way, was in the 30 odds in these stupid lists), and you know what? even back in Jimi's day he wasn't the greatest around...in my opinion anyway. He had competition, there was David Gilmour, Rory Gallagher, Jeff Beck, Jimi Page, all sorts of other guys. And that's not to say they are even ultimately better players, I just simply want to show...and I'll emphasize. JIMI HENDRIX IS NOT, WAS NOT, AND NEVER WILL BE, THE BE ALL AND END ALL OF ELECTRIC GUITAR. Thanks.

These lists are pathetic, and completely based on popularity and common misconception and who is popular at the time. Rather than what it should be based upon, musical understanding or technical skill. Oh, and seriously, trying to figure out who's the 'best' in music, a subjective art form, is completely anti-productive, impossible, and moreover, really fucking stupid. Who the hell cares? You like what you like and move on.

I wish they would stop with these lists. Especially because the less well informed take them as golden shiny beacons of truth, I swear to God, the next person to tell me Jack White is a more talented guitarist than someone like Jeff Beck, or Randy Rhoads because Rolling Stone or whatever said so is going to be greeted with a good hard back handing.

So if you took the time to read this, please, don't be one of the uninformed, make your own decisions, and try not to get roped into to this bullshit &quot;music is a competition&quot; mentality. Like what you like, and screw anyone that tells you other wise.

In saying all of that though... some of my *favourite* guitar players...
David Gilmour, Randy Rhoads, Slash, Joe Satriani, Rory Gallagher, all the Thin Lizzy guys, digging alot of Slap/Tap acoustic stuff at the minute, Erik Mongrain sort of things.

Aw, Mr Coneman, why you cry?
[quote:f2730199e2]In saying all of that though... some of my *favourite* guitar players...[/quote:f2730199e2]Essentially this is all these lists are and all they can be. It's a top ten list of everyone's favourite guitar players, or the ones they think are the best. Of course it's subjective - that's not new information. If I want to make a top ten of my favourite dinners, I'll defend my right to do so.
It's just a bit of fun, fuck sake lad, chill the fuck out.
And if you don't know why Jimi ends up number one all the time, well it's cause you're just not considering all the criteria. Yours are technical proficiency and emotive ability. So what. The magazines obviously take fan reverence, influence, innovation, or other such stuff into consideration. Again, so what, who cares. It's just a list.

[quote:19822f9954="Deestroyer"]Aw, Mr Coneman, why you cry?
[quote:19822f9954]In saying all of that though... some of my *favourite* guitar players...[/quote:19822f9954]Essentially this is all these lists are and all they can be. It's a top ten list of everyone's favourite guitar players, or the ones they think are the best. Of course it's subjective - that's not new information. If I want to make a top ten of my favourite dinners[/quote:19822f9954]
I know this, and am perfectly chilled. The only thing is that these lists DO NOT ever mention the fact that it's subjective and portray themselves as substance of fact. Which then filters down to morons who take it as fact, and like to argue causes like Kurt Cobain being a better guitarist than Jeff Beck because a magazine told them so. I get it probably doesn't apply to people on a music forum who will likely know what they're talking about, but surely anyone can see why this would grind my gears?

I'd like to mention that I, by the way, fucking love Jimi Hendrix, one of my all time favourite guitar players, he's just not the greatest to have ever lived.

Who is then? Or does that question just open up a big massive contradictory can of worms?

EDIT; in case that was too subtle, I was pointing out the difficulty in claiming that all music is subjective, and that it is impossible to say whos is &quot;the greatest&quot;, and then going on to claim that &quot;X ISN'T the greatest&quot;. Isn't that also subjective too then? And, if that's the case, doesn't that mean that every pleb and his uncle is simultaneously both &quot;the greatest&quot; and &quot;not the greatest&quot;? And doesn't that, in turn, make even bothering to say &quot;X is the greatest&quot; or &quot;X is not the greatest&quot; completely pointless and contrary to the spirit of what you've just said five minutes ago? Or am I just a wanker? And, even if I am, still like...

The last best guitar list I read put together by a magazine did indeed have Jimi at the top (I don't really listen to Jimi anymore but he's definitely pivotal in to modern guitar), but a lot of the best players were in there; Django, Morello, Pass, Beck, Benson, Greenwood, Green, etc.
The last 'voted for by readers' I read had that twat from Stereophonics above Brian May while the equally twatish Noel Gallagher was in the top three or something FFS.
You like what you like because of your circumstances. Non guitar players like the last two tubes because they play mundane melodies that are stuck to songs they like. It's no surprise to me they are bored by Joscho Stefan whizzing around a guitar neck.
Experienced guitarists have more of an idea about what goes into guitar playing, and can recognise what is difficult or innovative or whatever.
I can't sing a note, but singer friends of mine revere people I'd otherwise have no time for and admonish those I thought had an appealing voice.
Lists are just lists. They are silly and a bit of fun. The opinion of anyone who takes them seriously isn't really worth worrying about.

[quote:e31d89c2f6="Chi-Lite"]Who is then? Or does that question just open up a big massive contradictory can of worms?

EDIT; in case that was too subtle, I was pointing out the difficulty in claiming that all music is subjective, and that it is impossible to say whos is &quot;the greatest&quot;, and then going on to claim that &quot;X ISN'T the greatest&quot;. Isn't that also subjective too then? And, if that's the case, doesn't that mean that every pleb and his uncle is simultaneously both &quot;the greatest&quot; and &quot;not the greatest&quot;? And doesn't that, in turn, make even bothering to say &quot;X is the greatest&quot; or &quot;X is not the greatest&quot; completely pointless and contrary to the spirit of what you've just said five minutes ago? Or am I just a wanker? And, even if I am, still like...[/quote:e31d89c2f6]
Yes and no, obviously theres different ways to argue it, but I mean, no I don't think there is a possible 'greatest'. Because people are better at different things, ask Andres Segovia to play Eruption and he can't, but does that make Eddie Van Halen better than him? Ask Eddie Van Halen to play...probably anything Andres Segovia can play and he won't...again...

You're right there is no real way to say it, buttt, there still is some level of objectivity when it comes to this, you or I, can listen to two guitarists, lets take two extremes to make it easy...a punk guitarist, and a person with a degree in classical guitar. We're both going to know who is the better musician. To me comparing Kurt Cobain to Randy Rhoads is almost the same as that, and with these lists getting it *that* wrong, it's just annoying. I was just pointing out how ridiculous the lists are. I'm not offering a definitive way to do it better, nor am I saying don't try, I'm just saying I can't stand the lists that get popularised and repeated on the internet and in magazines, taken as fact, when I'd say most people here agree with me, in that even though they technically can't be &quot;wrong&quot; because it's subjective, they're a far fucking shot from being even close to &quot;right&quot;.

[quote:e31d89c2f6="tinpot anto"]Yes he is though.[/quote:e31d89c2f6]
He's not though.

[quote:cdca05d52c="Mr.Coneman"]I don't think there is a possible 'greatest'. Because people are better at different things[/quote:cdca05d52c]

[quote:cdca05d52c="Mr.Coneman"]you or I can listen to two guitarists...We're both going to know who is the better musician.[/quote:cdca05d52c]

[quote:cdca05d52c="Mr.Coneman"]even though they technically can't be &quot;wrong&quot; because it's subjective, they're a far fucking shot from being even close to &quot;right&quot;.[/quote:cdca05d52c]

All of the above is mad contradictions. If you can't be &quot;wrong&quot; because it's so subjective, you can't be &quot;right&quot; either. Stands to reason, doesn't it.

Personally, I think you're just caught in a dilemma of knowing fine rightly that some things are shite and some things are class, but being unable to understand how people disagree with you.

It's quite simple though. Loads and loads of people just don't know what they're talking about. that may, or may not, include you. Or me. ;)

All of the above is mad contradictions. If you can't be &quot;wrong&quot; because it's so subjective, you can't be &quot;right&quot; either. Stands to reason, doesn't it.
[/quote:840680a351]
The quotations above wrong and right were supposed to portray the fact that you can't be either in a subjective err...subject. But I'm pretty sure you can be ridiculously wrong, and closer to accurate. I.E naming 10 people who can actually play the guitar rather than having Kurt Cobain anywhere near the top 100 because he was influential.

Well, at this point I think we both generally know what we're trying to say and are arguing for the sake of it

[quote:840680a351="tinpot anto"]No but he really is. I proved it by asking God, and he said &quot;Scuse me while I kiss the sky&quot;.

[quote:4d94c9a87d="Mr.Coneman"]The quotations above wrong and right were supposed to portray the fact that you can't be either in a subjective err...subject. But I'm pretty sure you can be ridiculously wrong[/quote:4d94c9a87d]

You do realise that you've just said &quot;you can't be right or wrong, but you can be wrong&quot;, don't you?

[quote:e3b0ed0a83="Chi-Lite"][quote:e3b0ed0a83="Mr.Coneman"]The quotations above wrong and right were supposed to portray the fact that you can't be either in a subjective err...subject. But I'm pretty sure you can be ridiculously wrong[/quote:e3b0ed0a83]

You do realise that you've just said &quot;you can't be right or wrong, but you can be wrong&quot;, don't you?
[/quote:e3b0ed0a83]
Yes, and you know exactly what I'm trying to say, so I'm not going to bother going further into it.

[quote:e3b0ed0a83="Chi-Lite"]
Anyway, your ma got heckled on in the old Harp Bar[/quote:e3b0ed0a83]
That's actually very likely.

Aye but see you're adamant that Hendrix is NOT the best guitarist, whilst at the same time saying such things are completely arbitrary.

I say he is the best guitarist because I thought about it recently and had a wee listen between him, Peter Green and Rory GAllagher, and though I love them all I had to admit the &quot;Woodstock Improv&quot; seals the deal.

Plus if you like Joe Satriani you clearly hate music and your own ears, so you judgement is questionable.

[quote:d668bd1f1b="tinpot anto"]Aye but see you're adamant that Hendrix is NOT the best guitarist, whilst at the same time saying such things are completely arbitrary.

I say he is the best guitarist because I thought about it recently and had a wee listen between him, Peter Green and Rory GAllagher, and though I love them all I had to admit the &quot;Woodstock Improv&quot; seals the deal.
[/quote:d668bd1f1b]
Personally I'd say Rory eats and shits Jimi, but we like what we like.

[quote:d668bd1f1b="tinpot anto"]
Plus if you like Joe Satriani you clearly hate music and your own ears, so you judgement is questionable.
[/quote:d668bd1f1b]
What a completely ignorant statement. I know if you'd actually listened to him and not gone on his stupid &quot;shredder&quot; reputation you'd never be saying that, because *most* of his stuff is actually very melodic, very musical, and not very SUPERSHRED. His number one favourite guitarist actually is Jimi Hendrix.

My judgement is questionable for enjoying this fucking beautful peice of music?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yc8xyL0Xxo

I especially can't stand Joe Satrianis attempts at emotive melodic music. It's horrible smarmy insipid music. Compare to anything by Peter green or even bb king. But then I like Blues much more than rock see?

I like Joe Bonamassa. But yeah, that's how it works. You say you like or dislike something, and everyone else says if they agree or don't agree. Then we all pointlessly argue about who's right and who isn't, citing various criteria that makes whoever we like the best. It's like top trumps, but you just make up the categories as you go along. It's great! We then argue around in circles for a few pages until someone stops or something more interesting comes up or someone says &quot;we'll have to agree to disagree&quot; or some shit like that. Easy!
I think I'm the best guitarist in the world. So there.

[quote:717ec6cb66="Mr.Coneman"]Oh I see, we're operating on the assumption that you can tell me whos better, and my judgement is flawed because we dont like the same music[/quote:717ec6cb66]

Haha, i thought we were operating on the assumption (yours) that no one can say anything about who's better and who's not. That's why we're all confused when, after telling us all that, you then proceed to tell us who [i:717ec6cb66]is[/i:717ec6cb66] better.

[quote:8547557aab="Mr.Coneman"]Christ! I said there was some level of objectivity, because there is! I'm not opening the argument again though, fuck that.[/quote:8547557aab]

You see, that's the confusing thing. You say there is some level of objectivity, then you say it's all subjective, Then you say there is some level of objectivity again, then you say there's no point arguing about it because its all subjective. And then you do argue about it, and start saying that there's some level of objectivity. And then you say that it's all subjective so there's no point arguing about it. But then you say that Jimi Hendrix isn't the best, because there's some level of objectivity. But then you say that Joe Satriani isn't shite, because it's all subjective.

That's the confusing bit.

Personally, i think it's entirely objective. The Horslips are class, The Swadoctors are class, Peter Green's class, Rory Gallagher's class. The Outhere Brothers are crap. the Vengaboys are crap. Celine Dion is crap (i realise I'm only talking mid 90s music here, but that's as far as i go). the difficulty is the bits in between. But, of course, without the two poles of objectivity, there could be no in between to debate about and everything would be just as good or crap as everything else. but that obviously isn't the case, therefore musical value is objective. QED.:lol:

[quote:a513e476a2]Roast chicken. Roasties etc (chicken or goose fat). Actually, fuck that. Roast chicken SKIN. TASTY SKIN. Possibly one of the tastiest things in the universe ever. SKIN![/quote:a513e476a2]Yep. Yep.
Think we had this out before about music quality being objective and decided that it was. However, the stuff in the middle makes for the most quarrelsome fodder, but that's were the fun lies.
Not a fan of Satriani or Vai or Malmsteem or any of their ilk (Gilbert is ok). To me they [i:a513e476a2]try[/i:a513e476a2] to make their songs 'emotional' (sometimes at least). But trying to add emotion to a song is really defeating the purpose. It's either in there or it isn't. The song is emotional or it's not.
Ever see Malmsteem try to play the blues? It's like trying to get a computer to weep at a picture of an injured deer.

Don't normally reply to these topics, but I just saw Horslips last night for the first time, and it reminded me just why Johnny Fean was one of my early guitar heroes.
The man's a legend. As are the rest of the band of course, but what a guitarist. What a gig.
Hope these two gigs aren't all they're planning.

Just thought I'd mention I thoroughly dislike Malmsteen. I don't mind Paul Gilbert, I enjoy some of Steve Vai, but I love Satch. He's really the only one of that school of guitar players that I really listen to.