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I haven't read a single book about Jacen Solo so I can't speak to that but just as Jedi turning to the dark side has already been shown so too have Sith Lords. Their both essential themes of the Star Wars saga and I really don't see how one is more overdone than the other. I'm just keen on the idea of history repeating itself and while the Sith are destroyed and balance has been brought to the Force the dark side still threatens Luke's fledgling Jedi Order. I like the idea that these fallen jedi are being led by someone Luke cares for and their confrontation would ultimately lead to his death which would then cause the hero to seek revenge thereby coming dangerously close to the dark side as well. As to the identity of the main antagonist my idea is the Evil Mother (aka Luke's wife) and I know that is probably not a popular idea but it is just my opinion and I'm sticking to it. Really one of my reasons for liking the idea so much is because it gives a prominent role for the hero's mother so she's not just some background character. Since we never met Luke's wife in the OT I don't like the idea that she either just shows up or is already dead. So the main themes of my supposed ST would be learning from past mistakes, rebuilding, and passing on what you have learned. I like that.

What I like about this is that it fits with the overall evolution, if you will, of the relevance of Star Wars villains throughout the saga.

Darth Maul - Complete stranger to the heroes/Jedi, they never even really talk to him but they know he's a Sith and enemy of the Jedi.

Count Dooku - A Jedi fallen to the dark side, hitting a little closer to home since he's one of their own. Later reveal: he's the Master-once-removed of Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Palpatine/Darth Sidious - Friend to the heroes/Jedi and leader of the Republic for two movies, and he's Anakin's mentor-confidante.

Anakin/Darth Vader - Main protagonist for three movies, student of Obi-Wan Kenobi, and father of two of the main heroes in the OT.

For the next villain to be someone foreign to the heroes, who they have no real emotional ties to, is a little counter to the trend set in the six movies of the saga to date. Darth Plagueis is like, what... Luke's father's-master's-master-thought dead? It's like Lone Star to Dark Helmet. Having the new villain be someone emotionallyclose to the heroes, such as a direct relative like a spouse, child, or sibling perhaps if the torch-bearing heroes are Solos or Skywalkers (or Calrissians?), would create an intrinsic relevance to the struggle that the movie audience could all immediately relate to. I like it anyway.

Ok. But in order of appearance, it's really 1) Vader 2) Sidious 3) Maul 4 ) Dooku. They haven't really been making the antagonists progressively closer to the heroes like you insinuated. Anyway, how can you make the villain in the ST someone the main characters are all emotionally attached to? Leia turns to the dark side? Either way the new villain will be new to the audience. Besides, Plageuis could play the Master while his apprentice is someone that 'hits closer to home'. You can get the best of both worlds.

To answer your question, if Vader had a secret apprentice, of course Luke would feel emotional attachment. He never had ample opportunity to know his father. The secret apprentice would probably know more about the person Luke dreamed about since he was a little child than anyone else.

And a sibling of Sidious could in a way be a dark twin to Jaina. One "evil" from the start, one "good" from the start. Jaina would have to ask herself if her being a Jedi was really a choice of preprogrammed from the beginning. And how to deal with a villain who might as well have turned out good if he were raised by a different person?

For the love of all things holy, no more resurrections! Don't plague us with Plageuis....

Give me an example of a "new" villain that does not completely disconnect the ST from the existing saga.

If you can, you get a cookie.

If not, you get Plageuis.

But seriously.... As all of us are speculating, one thing that lacks in every argument against a villian that we already know, whether its Plageuis or not, is that a brand new villian can't connect to the rest of the story. This is a continuation, not a new Star Wars story. Thats what the VII means.

If we look to the films (I'm not an EU guy, and don't believe it will be honored) and the films only to try to figure out the direction of the story, there are not many choices that make sense. That being said, Plageuis is the only element in the existing movies that can smoothly connect the existing story to the ST. Lots of folks are worried about ruining the existing story by making everything that happened in the PT and OT useless if the Sith are just going to return after. The trick is going to be HOW they return. Everything in the existing saga had to happen, regardless of what comes next.

Look at it like this:

Plageuis knew Anakin was destine burn the house down, destroy the Sith, and die in the fire. So he knew not to be home when it happened.

Thats my theory. I may not know for sure that I'm right, but you don't know for sure that I'm wrong......

2015 here we come!!

It is easy enough to connect a new villain to the saga. A secret apprentice of Vader or Sidious could work. Or, as I've already said, a sibling of Sidious.
Both options could be quite interesting because it opens the door for the villain to be motivated by more than hunger for power.

Tonight I'm believing that a female villain makes a lot of sense. 1) Female action heroes and villains are popular now. 2) We haven't seen a female big bad in the PT and OT yet.

I'm also beginning to hope more and more that there will be some pulpy serial roots at play with the ST. I'm going to start researching, starting with Flash Gordon, old serials for titles and possible plot influences.

I say an easy compromise between Plagueis and new would be something like this: Plagueis serves as an "Emperor" type role. In the background and the shadows while his apprentice *a new villain* does most of the villain-work. There we can get Plagueis *to make you guys happy* and a new villain *to make me happy*. Everybody's happy in the end

I would be ok with Plagueis and a kick ass apprentice, but I want them to come up with something new that perfectly fits with the 6 other movies, and doesn't seem to be tacked on coz Disney want more dosh..

These creatives are pretty much the best money can buy, they goddamn better be able to come up with something better than all of us on a forum.

I want to be blown away by the new villain!

I have always liked this Maul concept art, it could be used for a female villain.

I would be ok with Plagueis and a kick ass apprentice, but I want them to come up with something new that perfectly fits with the 6 other movies, and doesn't seem to be tacked on coz Disney want more dosh..

These creatives are pretty much the best money can buy, they goddamn better be able to come up with something better than all of us on a forum.

I want to be blown away by the new villain!

I have always liked this Maul concept art, it could be used for a female villain.

I would be ok with Plagueis and a kick ass apprentice, but I want them to come up with something new that perfectly fits with the 6 other movies, and doesn't seem to be tacked on coz Disney want more dosh..

These creatives are pretty much the best money can buy, they goddamn better be able to come up with something better than all of us on a forum.

I want to be blown away by the new villain!

I have always liked this Maul concept art, it could be used for a female villain.

I say an easy compromise between Plagueis and new would be something like this: Plagueis serves as an "Emperor" type role. In the background and the shadows while his apprentice *a new villain* does most of the villain-work. There we can get Plagueis *to make you guys happy* and a new villain *to make me happy*. Everybody's happy in the end

This is what I was hoping for, I wouldn't mind if Plagueis had a small group of 3-5 new Sith though, instead of just one apprentice.

I'm personally pulling for Darth Plagueis, but here's another option I've been joking around with.

IG-88 growing rapidly smarter by the second decrees that droids are superior to biological creatures in every way.

For the past 30-40 years he has colonized an abandoned planet in the unknown regions of the galaxy and has set up factories manufacturing a new droid army. His new army is completely different and far more threatening than the droid armies of The Clone Wars.

With their numbers strong he declares war on all life and even starts a droid revolution throughout the galaxy. Many protocol, astromech, medical, mechanical, labor, and security droids now see him as their liberator.

They could have IG-88 wield a lightsaber with out being force sensitive, similar to Grievous, so there could still be lightsaber duels.

IG-88 could be like the Ultron of Star Wars, imagine something similar to Ultron from Marvel Comics with an army of T-800 Terminators.

1. Whoever the villain is in the ST, he/she has to connect to the rest of the story. If not, this would be a roboot and not Ep VII.

2. If Plageuis does wind up the villain, he probably won;t be revealed as such until VIII or IX. I would expect to see an apprentice in Ep VII doing the dirty work. This would be natural Star Wars villainy.

I had time to read through the novel again recently, and I have to admit, my mind might be shifting a bit towards this being a strong possibility. Knowing that Lucas was heavily involved in the novel itself adds a little to the pile of possibility, plus this character has some depth to him, not to mention that it is essentially laid out for you that he is the one who created Anakin in the first place...I guess that makes him Luke's grandpa?

And you can't really argue around the idea that Moth brought up...there has to be connection...and yes, if it did happen, I would prefer it remain in the background, so to speak, until 8 and 9.

However unlikely that Plagueis will be the main villain in the ST, I do think he has the strongest bid of all the characters we know of.
The fact that he was explicitly mentioned in the movie gives him a considerable advantage over other EU characters that only fans have heard of, for the most part.

I would like to see him in some movie or series sometimes, and wouldn't even mind him being the villain in the ST - but I think that is highly unlikely.

However unlikely that Plagueis will be the main villain in the ST, I do think he has the strongest bid of all the characters we know of.
The fact that he was explicitly mentioned in the movie gives him a considerable advantage over other EU characters that only fans have heard of, for the most part.

I would like to see him in some movie or series sometimes, and wouldn't even mind him being the villain in the ST - but I think that is highly unlikely.

I think it's highly likely we are going to see something completely new.

I don't think they even mention any of that. I think they will steer plenty clear of Plagueis, the prophecy, balance of the force, midiclorians, chosen ones and divine births, all of it.

As well they should, because none of those things actually mattered much to the story.

While the new villain needs to thematically relate with those that came before, there's no real reason to use Plagueius other than his name has been floated once before. Someone stumbling on Palpatine's work/influence and modeling themselves after him would be just as effective. There are plenty of things to tie the PT and ST together (Naboo, Coruscant, looking back at the old Jedi Order, etc.) without needing to delve into bad fan fiction.

Remember: the vast majority of the movie going audience doesn't care about Plagueius. It's a name like Nar Shadda, or Bothans, or anything else mentioned in passing. The scene where he's mentioned also mentions the irony of his death. That's an important plot point. No matter one's power, they cannot cheat death. While it makes sense for a Sith in their inherent selfishness to try, everything we know about life and death in that universe (that's canon) is that death cannot be cheated, and death is yet another transition to another stage of being. Luminous beings and all that. It's a cornerstone of the setting and the basis for much of its spirituality. I don't think that it should be shattered because of a name we heard once in the films.

I'd much rather have a new villain that we can see grow and change. We've already had two villains that were, at first, powerful, mysterious strangers who slowly become familiar and intimate with the protagonists. I'd like to see the opposite - someone close to the protagonists distancing themselves and becoming unknowable in their downward spiral.

I love your point about the irony of his death, I wish I could like that 1000 times! Why people want to screw that scene up is lost on me.

It simply just doesn't screw it up for everybody. I think the mistake we often make in speculation (because both sides of this discussion are purely speculation) is that we assume everyone else feels the same way we do. For instance, I think plagueis is currently the best choice, but I also get it is a difficult concept for others to wrap their heads around for whatever reason.

For me personally Plagueis being alive does not ruin that scene for me. It still tells me Palpatine relished in his belief of killing his master, but it would now also show me his arrogance in his pride in believing he actually succeeded. I think some people can't handle the thought if a villain upstaging Palpatine. The reason people can "ruin" that scene with this idea is because they simply view it differently.