even if markets come in bear market my portfolio will outperform on downside....then i will again will be able to buy stocks cheap..especially mid caps---like i bought yes bank at 50 jk cement at 40 gitanjali at 50...i have none now...all sold...just holding the above and a few mid caps/micr caps for trading

17.1. Vivekbhauka Jul 23, 2011 3:29:05 PM IST |

my portfolio--

however indiabulls finance altough is cheap it has some management issues...therefore it is not a stock to be averaged down..but it has potential...so one has to keep his risk at stake here...similar with dcb bank .....one has to try to bring his cost negligible in them by trading in some quantity..keeping left over for long term.

Dear Vivekbhauka,Sellingput optionisvery risky & highly dangerous.Selling call option is good as you can hedge your position as well.F&O stock will maybe maxjump 20-30 percent but fall can be precipitous.I can give any numberof bluechip stocks that fell to 20-30 percent of their value.Ex:DLF,Satyam ,even Bharti halved in 3-4 sessions.Orchid chemicals,RNRL,Gitanjali,Jainirrigation,GTL etc not to mention.Scams always lurk in Indian stocks & I advice friends to never write any put option.The limited profit u make by writing puts will evaporate in one such jolt & the loss people suffer they cannot pay even with all thier assets sold.

16.2. Vivekbhauka Jul 23, 2011 10:36:53 PM IST |

money making avenues---

i know selling put options is dangerous.. but i never have said about the individual stocks....dlf at 1000 ...i will never sell put options because i know dlf is not even worth 500...jain irrigation gtl rnrl are not the stocks where put options were so active and also they never came in my radar....orchids etc stocks are not the stocks to sell options.they are not the stocks to trade in put options.first determine the stock where put options can be played.

mostly i sell options of nifty...in stocks first the stocks have to come withing my buy range...if im not a buyer of sbi at 3200 ,i will never sell put options of 2800 and above..may be i never sell put option then...i only sell option when that stock first comes withing my investment range or lower trading range...ex...sbi at 2400...i may sell put options of 2000-2100-2200...because im a small buyer at around 2000...

idea put options of 70 are not bad...because the maximum downside in idea may be 45-50...even then if im stuck..i can sell call option of 70 then...so i will always be in the range..

here are some stocks where put options could be played(provided-u feel comfortable with valuations--)its ur judgement...but u may loose selling options on ur wrong judgement...so how can u overcome that...so the best thing is nifty...only once in 3-4 years nifty may correct 20% in a day...

for me the following stocks are worth looking now for options--at current valuations...not when they may have rub up and become expensive...

sbiidea cellular ifciindia cementsany stock u feel is low priced--subjective and chances of loss are high

selling options for me is not about making profits..its aboout wanting the stock to correct so that i can buy stocks cheap...so i dont sell options to make profit..i sell options to buy stocks when they come down...so why will i sell dlf option of 800 when i dont even want to buy at 500...got it!!!!!!!

im not a buyer of nifty at 5600...thats why im selling nifty puts of below 5000...option strikes keep on shifting according to time and rates...but the logic is to be happy to see markets fall....even tough i loose on option some amount if it falls...im more happy to see broad market collapse.....

another strategy i could and would like to share with u all----hope u can benefit and make money from it....

as i still dont find value in majority of the stocks,and i wish them to fall.so the question is how would then i make money....

one way is i sell nifty put options of about 4500-5000 range of next 2-3 months...i wish markets correct...if they dont do i earn the whole premium....so i win in both the case...

either u give me stocks cheap or give me premium....

we should start discussing selling put options strategies here...

for example---i have sold idea put option of 70 strike price of august at .60 paise...if idea does not fall below 70...i will get .60 paise....have sold nifty 4800 puts sept...few qty only

there are many things u can do in small quantities...hoping for markt to correct....u win both ways....if idea corrects to 70 its good...if it rises i have my old holdings...its fine.

15.1. Sreedhar Jul 23, 2011 7:03:04 PM IST |

making money by selling options---

I have done selling Nifty out of money put options several times as Say Nifty correcting to 5200 will give me plenty of stocks to buyat cheap rates.Sell at points where Nifty has huge support.I have written 5200 puts at100-150 thrice in the last few months as I believed Nifty will not break 5200.

just look everyday the stocks which are touching 52 weeks highs....but also track and keep in mind of the stocks touching all time high lifetime...u can get from bseindia.com

all multibaggers have to first cross all time highs to reach new highs.and it continues on and on....so u always will be aware of any multibagger ...and wont be surprised to see a stock that has risen 10 times....its happening before u...

so buying a stock at the earliest when it reaches new highs is the best thing.....hold on and add positions as long as it is touching new highs....dont sell stocks reaching new highs because they will continue to do it...normally people sell stocks hitting new highs...infact its time to start buying as it moves up.....this is the best strategy for medium term to make money on investments...start observing new high stocks...u will know what i mean...but u have to develop a strategy /entry/exit...

this strategy is not about value buying....but normally i see value too...if petronet lng was hitting new high at 110...i would be buying because its worth at 110 also...with limited risk....so it works that way...u can have ur own value/momentum strategy....

just keep eyes on new high stocks and share them in this forum...keeping eye on valuations...if ur not banking on valuations....u can still buy having exit strategy...the basic idea is to make money...

i do invest in c category stocks to keep myself excited...but they are highly rewarding too....

i have been looking and invested in rama papers mills.....see the charts...i have my exit strategy ...it hardly closes in red...just study the daily moves of last 2 months....u will know how to make money here....

another co in my radar---*puneet resins...could be a multibagger*astral poly--huge potential on cpvc business(upside could be anything)its fairly priced...not cheap.but very exciting.*weizmann forex---if anyone wants to buy the business he would have to shell out 2-3 times its market cap.tracking recently

there is produck known as bank bees from benchmark asset management co..which tracks banking index....

i have been telling since last 5 years that over time banking index will always outperform nifty....look at returns of last 1-2 years of nifty and bank index....nifty is up 10%....ban bees has given 30%...

over a long term of 10-20 years....u will get 15-20% compounding returns in banking index if u buy at low valuations....today valuations are fair...not cheap...its not very high also...

bank bees best part is that u minimize the risk of buying a single stock....so u can always buy it at dips..and average in downside without hesitating...which i avoid normally in stocks.....

great stock ....now to be under rated....over a long term of 10 years...i wont be surprised to see this stock giving huge returns...it will give....surely...

book value at 160....eps at 28-30...10 is given as dividend...its earning 800 cr per year...after 10 years can u imagine how much it will be earning...may be in excess of 3000 cr....another hdfc in making....will be a 25000 cr market cap company from todays 6000 in medium term.....

enjoy the ride

11.1. Sreedhar Jul 22, 2011 9:14:29 PM IST |

indiabulls financials

Dear Vivekbhuaka,Great to see u posting regularly.I follow ur messages with lot of interest & agree with ur suggestions most of the time as they are similar to mine.Keep posting.Lot of old friends have disappeared from the board

good to see ur response....i do come here at times but its hard for me to follow day to day movements and trading strategy...i dont do much of that and im very bad in it...ha ha....

my strength is about value picking...and i can judge where we stand in valuations now on a broad and individual levels.....

i was suggesting all to buy pfc at 175 levels recently...because for me pfc could still fall to 130...but in that case nifty has to come in bear market below 4400....so it was alwas profitable to buy pfc at 175 levels for trading for 10-15% because from there downside was just 15-20% more only...but if u would have invested in any other stock and nifty comeing to 4300...u will loose more.....so i can see which stocks are cheap in today markets..in comparision...and u will outperform...same goes with ing vysya bank...it could come to 270-240...and i was buyer at around 300-320...because for 240 to come its only 20% down...but for that stock market have to just collapse.....

i want stock markets to collapse always as i can buy cheap....because i have ridden the up cycle from 2008-2010...and now its hard for me to make money on investments...thats why trade wil stocks which i know wont fall much...but still cheap...and will be much much higher /outperform on downside.....

some of the stocks are

idea cellular---with call rates leveled out...telecom is the sector to watch out for.....idea has 10 cr subscribers with market cap of 28000 cr...vodafone bought out essar at 70000-80000 cr for 5 cr subscribers then(2-3 yrs ago)....slowly call rates will be rising with few players now...even a small rate increase adds to whole of profits as costs remain same in telecos.....watch this out...

some other stocks---i have my own research an analysis for the stocks i pick

indiabulls financeing vysya bankfinancials----they form 60-80% of my portfolio holding...because they have compounding effect...i keep only those stocks in portfolio that have compounding effect...they could be financials,nbfc,utilities if i get cheap..

again this is a stocks for core portfoilo and trading with excess quantity because u never will be stuck here...as long term targets would be surely 480-680-880....

its still at 5000 cr market cap...its a better bank than indusind which is at 12000 cr market cap...if indusind can sell at 3 times book value ...ing shoul also sell at 2.5 times....in next 2-3 years book value will touch from current 300 rupee...so at 2.5 times its a 750 rupee stock...with lower range of 270-240 in a bear market if nifty goes below 3800...so u loose less by being invested here....

You have posted this message in a right time. SBICAPSEC forced me to keep 100 shares of ingvysya in my portfolio which was got in auction at the avg price of 370/-. Atleast your message gives me relief that I am holding good stock only.

However, in the right time and may be with little profit, I will exit this counter. If the market moves up, it will also go up I hope. I will try to exit at 400 level.

well good that u got ur rates back...in these type of stocks u will always get ur rate back...just a matter of time...even who has bought it at 450 will get his rate back...its not like dlf who will never get his rate back of 700-800...withing reasonable time..

i never try to sell these type of stocks...i just keep adding with no targets in mind...i buy at dips only and add up as when i have money...so i know i will keep this stock for next 10 years...so why will i try to trade..because at whatever rate u will sell it ...u are going to see a higher rate as time goes by...so no use having targets for portfolio holding.

if i buy extra quantity then i may try to trade...even then im sure i will never loose in long term...i only tarde in such stocks which i know...i have never touched dlf larsen crompton bhel tata motor for portfolio at these rates and no trading also on long side except intraday.

how can a company with earning of 400-500 cr have a market cap of 20000 cr....it will really make people loose money when they will start buying at all dips to average....i feel sorry for investors...it will be happening...when i dont know...

i know where people loose money...this is a case....tata motors/hindalco/bhels/larsen...i dont know how u can make 10% compounding returns from these levels...only when they will correct 30-40%...they might look good...not cheap even then...im not going to buy then at 30% fall....that wont make them cheap...tata motors at 40000 cr market cap after correction is still not cheap...

just am happy to see markets to become cheap to make money 4-5 times again.....