HVAC-Talk site will be slow for the next few days. It's normal site/server maintenance. Thx -Dad

Welcome to HVAC-Talk.com, a non-DIY site and the ultimate Source for HVAC Information & Knowledge Sharing for the industry professional! Here you can join over 150,000 HVAC Professionals & enthusiasts from around the world discussing all things related to HVAC/R. You are currently viewing as a NON-REGISTERED guest which gives you limited access to view discussions

To gain full access to our forums you must register; for a free account. As a registered Guest you will be able to:

Participate in over 40 different forums and search/browse from nearly 3 million posts.

They should do with the Trane line like they did with American Standard, and drop the numbers off the model family name.

I'm curious to see what actual new AS/Trane equipment will be introduced this year. I know there are a couple of nice things currently in testing, but I'm not sure if they will be out this year or next.

Are there actually any matches where the XL61i... er I mean XL18i actually reaches 18 SEER??? It barely makes 16 SEER without oversized coils with a lot of furnace matches. Carriers Infinity 19/21 GS have the same problem. They only reach to nominal SEER ratings when matched with an oversized air handler.

Are there actually any matches where the XL61i... er I mean XL18i actually reaches 18 SEER??? It barely makes 16 SEER without oversized coils with a lot of furnace matches. Carriers Infinity 19/21 GS have the same problem. They only reach to nominal SEER ratings when matched with an oversized air handler.

What wrong with having Standard, High, Ultra, Premium effceincy for equipment model descriptions. We have sub compact, compact, midsized, full size cars. We don't describe them as 45, 40, 35, 30 mpg vehicles. That's not their primary purpose anyway.

Then the dealer can run the actual AHRI matches and tell the customer what the comparable ratings are.

Even better, they should be required to measure static pressure, show the refrigerant data (temps & pressures) and certify the unit after installation. If static pressure is high, you can recalculate the nominal effciency ratings due to increased blower power consumption or on a PSC motor the reduced capacity.

Our A-S salesman flat out said it was a game to play with Carrier. If there's 1 match with 17 SEER, they can call the XL17i that. I think it started with Lennox who called the HS29 Elite 11 because with expensive TXV coils it could get 11 in some sizes. But since most people bought a standard unit with a piston coil, calling it 11 was a joke. After that, A-S/Trane renamed their base unit Allegiance 11 and XR11 though with the common coil, it was barely a 10.

Our A-S salesman flat out said it was a game to play with Carrier. If there's 1 match with 17 SEER, they can call the XL17i that. I think it started with Lennox who called the HS29 Elite 11 because with expensive TXV coils it could get 11 in some sizes. But since most people bought a standard unit with a piston coil, calling it 11 was a joke. After that, A-S/Trane renamed their base unit Allegiance 11 and XR11 though with the common coil, it was barely a 10.

With all mfg. only one combination in the series has to meet the rating and all others will qualify.

Even better, they should be required to measure static pressure, show the refrigerant data (temps & pressures) and certify the unit after installation. If static pressure is high, you can recalculate the nominal efficiency ratings due to increased blower power consumption or on a PSC motor the reduced capacity.

Unfortunately until it is required by DOE this will not take place. The majority of all dealers do not have the competency to comply. The manufactures need to move boxes and these requirements even though I agree should be mandated will not be implemented by the manufacturer.

The only current way is to educate the consumer and have them demand it from the dealer. If the dealer can not comply with the requirements, call another. When the dealer can not sell equipment to the consumer then changes will be made.

The other desing feature I'd like to see in residential equipment with all of these newer tight HE homes, is scaled down commercial equipment. Package air handlers with integrated HRV's, comparative enthalpy economizers, multiple compressors (a couple have this now) economizers and of coruse as I've said many time, small scale residential chillers. The option of chillers is still pretty limited right now. Trane could take the 20 Ton CGAM, and scale it down with a new lower cost controller, single phase compressor(s) and offer them down to even 3 ton size. Maybe single for 3, 4, 5, 6, and 7.5 tons, then 2 stage for 8, 10, 12 and 15 ton models. Heck, for the 3, 4, 5, 6 ton units, you could probably use the existing condenser design and fit a HE in there and mount the flow center on the side. They your just running insulated PEX to and from the unit to a properly sized storage tank instead of a lineset.

BOSCH or Carrier not Trane

Originally Posted by motoguy128

The option of chillers is still pretty limited right now. Trane could take the 20 Ton CGAM, and scale it down with a new lower cost controller, single phase compressor(s) and offer them down to even 3 ton size. Maybe single for 3, 4, 5, 6, and 7.5 tons, then 2 stage for 8, 10, 12 and 15 ton models. Heck, for the 3, 4, 5, 6 ton units, you could probably use the existing condenser design and fit a HE in there and mount the flow center on the side.

Good point. They seem to be focused on the Commerical side on grabbing market share in service, and pushing established technology at price points and otherwise building a reputation and service network.