I decided that I wanted to try making sourdough bread as my next culinary hurdle. Rather than purchase a starter from a bakery of the grocery store (where I have never seen one), I started my own. I mixed one cup of flour with 1 cup of water and left it sit loosely covered overnight.

Around 24 hours later, I noticed slight foaming of the starter (a good sign from what I have read, it was fermenting from wild yeast and bacteria). I tossed one cup of the mixture, and added 1/2 cup flour and enough water to bring it back to the original volume.

Today there was a clear liquid covering the surface, which I can only assume is what they call "hooch", and I once again tossed part and added new flour.

The question I have it whether I am doing this correctly. I read about the process in a few places and it seems to be going well.

Also, I am worried about how one tells whether the starter is good or bad. It's understandable that with the starter fermentation there would be odd smells and tastes. After all, what is fermentation if not controlled rotting?

I have no idea what a sourdough starter is suposed to smell or taste like so soon after it has started (it won't be ready until after 5 days or so). I just don't want to end up trying to make bread out of something that will end up being really disgusting and not delightfully sour.

Place starter in a separate container. Feed with fresh water and flour. If mixture at least doubles in size, you've caught some yeasties. If not, you've caught something that will not make your bread rise.

It is my understanding that hooch, the alcohol byproduct of active yeast fermentation, should not be prevalent in new starters.

Place starter in a separate container. Feed with fresh water and flour. If mixture at least doubles in size, you've caught some yeasties. If not, you've caught something that will not make your bread rise.

It is my understanding that hooch, the alcohol byproduct of active yeast fermentation, should not be prevalent in new starters.

I'll give that a try and see what happens. I'm starting to think it is a lost cause though.

I don't know whether the liquid was really "hooch" or not, it was just a thin clear liquid that separated from the rest of the mixture.

Well, after my third attempt at getting a starter going, I think that I finally have something worthwhile. The day after I made it, it had bubbled up almost out of the jar (fast huh!).

It smells good (yeasty + sour, not rotten), and the liquid color is much lighter than what I was seeing before.

I've been experimenting with it over the last 2 weeks, changing the consistency by changing the flour/water ratio when I feed it. I figure it's more than old enough now to be able to impart some great sour dough flavor, so I think I'll bake up a loaf or two this weekend (I also just got a great book on baking bread, The Bread Maker's Apprentice, and I am looking forward to baking tons).

That's a great book. If you like blue cheese, be sure to try the walnut and blue cheese sourdough. I think it's in the "notes" for the sourdough boule recipe. Reinhart says it's his favorite bread, and when you try it, you'll know why!

Functional starters include colonies of lactobacillus bacteria, as well as yeast. The bacteria cause the mixture to become acidic, creating an environment inhospitable for most bacteria, but very comfy for yeast. The acid also produces the sour flavor we so desire. This recipe uses fruit juice in the starter to create an acidic environment from the very beginning, instead of waiting for the environment to develop on its own. Potentially very cool. It also suggests use of rye or whole wheat flour, which are beleived to contain higher concentrations of yeast than other flours. Rye flour in particular is recommended by many recipes for this reason.

I've found that adding a bit of live-culture yogurt, or even better kefir, makes for a better sour dough. Don't let it get too warm -- even doing it in the fridge will work although it takes longer: the cooler temperatures seem to be favored by the better organisms.

The yogurt kind of makes sense, with the lactobacillus already on tap, but as mentioned, not on a really warm day. I've not heard of this technique before. Kefir is yet unseen in my local grocers.

I successfully implemented the grapefruit juice starter recipe previously mentioned via the thfreshloaf.com link. This was my third, and only successful starter attempt. It happened to start with whole wheat flour. The recipe also suggests that if after about 4 days, and noticible activity has not begun, sometimes the process can be prodded along by the addtion of a small bit of vinigar to make the mixture even more acidic.

My first two attempts were complete failures. I stuck by my first try (AP flour + tap water) since most of my reading told me that time and patience will ultimately heal those starters that appear inactive in the early stages. After about 7 days, an odor somewhere between rotten cheese and old jock straps developed, and Mrs. Thor forced me to keep it well covered, and hidden in the oven. I was not permitted to feed it when she was around. I loved that flat, inactive starter for 2.5 weeks before flushing it. My second attempt (bread flour + bottled spring water + ultra clean implements) hung around almost a week before the same inactive, "colorful" state began to set in. By day 8, it too was set free.

If your local tap water contains chlorine, let it evaporate for a day or so before using in your starter; if the the local tap water contains chloramine, find a bottled water without additives to use. No point in killing a perfectly good yeast before it can reproduce. B^)

One can also make a starter using regular yeast Use one and one half cups water (see note above); 2 tsp. active dry yeast; and two cups bread flour. Set in a warm place in a loosely covered ceramic bowl, stir with a very clean implement two to three times daily. You can also cover with plastic wrap that has been punctured a few times with a fork to permit oxygen flow. After seven to ten days, remove one cup of the starter, and feed the remainder with 1/2 cup water and 1 cup flour and place in the refrigerator. The removed one cup can be fed and then used after 10-12 hours at room temperature - in other words, when it is good and bubbly. A classic crock is a practical way to store starter in the refrigerator.

Refrigerated starter should be fed each week; if you aren't baking with it, simply remove one cup of starter, and stir 1/2 c water and 1 cup flour into the remainder and replace it in the refrigerator. The cup of starter removed from the refrigerated starter should be fed and left on the counter for 10-12 hours before use; or it can be discarded if you aren't baking.

Commercial starters can be found in some grocery stores; the most commonly available are the extremely sour "San Francisco" types. My personal preference is for the milder "New England" types, one of which can be purchased online from King Arthur Flour. I tried making starter here in the Bay Area; but it seems the wild yeasts I caught were all the - too me - overly sour SF starter type. Of course, friends from back home up North were begging me for samples; while I just wanted them to send me some of the kind from back in the Pacific Northwest.

The problem with the use of "wild yeasts" from products like rye is that from time to time you find yourself growing extremely nasty critters like ergot and aspergillus. (Aspergillus flavus is the reason why it is advised that one simply discard any jams, jellies, or other preserves that are growing molds. Any home canned item growing a mold should be discarded because not only is the seal broken; but the molds metabolic byproducts can lower the pH of high acid foods enough to permit the growth of botulism and the production of botulism toxins.)

Thor wrote:

The yogurt kind of makes sense, with the lactobacillus already on tap, but as mentioned, not on a really warm day. I've not heard of this technique before. Kefir is yet unseen in my local grocers.

I successfully implemented the grapefruit juice starter recipe previously mentioned via the thfreshloaf.com link. This was my third, and only successful starter attempt. It happened to start with whole wheat flour. The recipe also suggests that if after about 4 days, and noticible activity has not begun, sometimes the process can be prodded along by the addtion of a small bit of vinigar to make the mixture even more acidic.

My first two attempts were complete failures. I stuck by my first try (AP flour + tap water) since most of my reading told me that time and patience will ultimately heal those starters that appear inactive in the early stages. After about 7 days, an odor somewhere between rotten cheese and old jock straps developed, and Mrs. Thor forced me to keep it well covered, and hidden in the oven. I was not permitted to feed it when she was around. I loved that flat, inactive starter for 2.5 weeks before flushing it. My second attempt (bread flour + bottled spring water + ultra clean implements) hung around almost a week before the same inactive, "colorful" state began to set in. By day 8, it too was set free.

Bearing in mind that not only had I not prepared a Sourdough starter before, but neither had I tasted sourdough, or baked any kind of bread. This has been one whole learning experience for me, and one that I have thoroughly enjoyed.

I decided to stick to the basic instructions that I obtained from the internet.

I soon found that my starter was too thick, having the consistancy of a dough rather than a batter. So at the first feeding, I removed two ladles of my dough, replacing them with one ladle of flour, and two ladles of water. This resulted insomething that more resembled a batter, exactly what I was looking for.
I left my sourdough batter in the uncovered mixing bowl out on the Kitchen work top for five days. Feeding it each day by dividing in two, and adding a new batch of one ladle of flour, and one of water. By leaving it out in the open, it caught and cultivated the natural yeasts and bacteria floating about my apartment. It is winter here in the UK, and my heating thermostat is set at 10 degrees C, so I was quiet surprised to see that the Cultrure had taken so quickly. After five days, I needed to use my large mixing bowl to mix another batch of Scotch eggs. So my batter was transfered to a clean and sterlised Kilner Jar.

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When it was in the jar, I continued to feed it for two further days, this time with the lid securely fitted. So my batter did it's thing in a sealed envoriment. The only time that it was opened was to remove two ladles of the batter, replacing them with premixed new flour and water. For two days I watched the batter froth up and receded on almost 12 hour cycles. Rising for the first 12 hours after the feeding batter was introduced and then receding to the normal level.

Doing it's thing inside the Kilner Jar.

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On the 7th day (the creationists will love this .... .... LOL), I removed two ladles of batter placing them in my mixing bowl with two more ladles full of plain white wheat flour, and two of water, along with 2 tablespoons of Olive oil, and 3 tablespoons of granulated white suger. This I kneaded into my first ever sourdough sponge. Because the temperature in my apartment is reasonibly low (12degs C +/- 2degs C), I decided to leave my starter out overnight for at least 12 hours before baking. During this time, it almost trebled in size.

Getting the stuff together to make my sourdough sponge.

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Due to domestic chores, relaxation, and downright laziness on my part, the sourdough sponge had the opportunity to rest, rise, or whatever else you want to call it, for almost 18 hours in my mixing bowl. In the meantime I had removed all of my starter mix from the jar, replenished it back to the original mass, and allowed to sit on the work top in another bowl, while I cleaned out the jar.

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So I gave it another good kneading. Tip; coat your hands in Olive oil before kneading, it makes the whole sticky process so much easier.
Then I punched it out flat into a baking tray.

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I managed to get two baking trays worth of dough from my sponge, which I baked in a pre-heated oven at gas Mk 5 for 15 minutes.

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After clearing up, the jar of starter mix was placed in the refridgerator, ready for next week's sourdough baking escapade.

I spent the rest of the evening watching one of my favorite films: "Kingdom of Heaven" on the TV, while snacking on bite size morsles of Sourbread, dipped in home-made Blackforest fruit vinegar, with home-made Scotch Eggs, all washed down with Home-brewed Mead.

Last edited by Gareth on Tue Feb 19, 2008 2:26 am; edited 2 times in total

My sourbread had a very short shelf life, and did not last me very long; only until lunchtime today (LOL).

Here is the last piece of it.

A drizzle of fruit vinegar smoothed over the surface, a few thin slices of mature Chedder placed on top, and 5 minutes under the grill.

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On Wednesday evening, it is my turn to host the monthly Backgammon night. I have just added 3 fl/oz of Black forest fruit vinegar to the sausage meat for the scotch eggs. Which I will serve hot, covered with a Cauliflower cheese plus, in sourbread bowls, all to be washed down with the first bottling of my January's batch of home-made Mead.

I once had my own starter for sourdough and from what it sounds like you are doing ok...except don't discard the hooch...simply stir it back into the misxture and then discard about 1/4 of your mixture and replace with fresh water and flour......it will reek of beer, but that is a very good sign....after about 3 days of keeping it on your counter top, move it into your fridge....replace whatever you use with fresh water and flour and it will last forever...literally....there is a rumor of a bakery in France that has been using the same starter since Napolean was around....

Also, you are doing good making your own starter because every region has their own yeast and taste....this is why San Fransisco sourdough taste different than anywhere else...your's will as well and will have it's own unique taste and texture.

I am now removing my sourdough starter from the fridge on a Friday evening. Giving it good stir to reintegrate the hooch, and standing it on the work top until late Saturday afternoon. Then I remove 1/3rd, which I add to the flour, water and olive oil for baking, and add the replacement feed of blended flour and water, allowing my jar of starter to sit out on the work top overnight at room temperature, returning it to the fridge when I make breakfast on Sunday Morning

On Sunday afternoon, while the oven is still warm from cooking lunch, I bake my sour bread. In a week or two I will have my amounts sorted out correctly and will have enough sourbread to feed me for the whole week. Currently by Wednesday or Thursday I have to buy one wholemeal loaf to see me through the rest of the week.

Yesterday, before the onslaught upon my allotment, I prepared my latest batch of sourdough for baking.

This time had decided to deviate slightly from the original dough mix, and produce a Garlic Sourbread. used a home-made garlic oil that I prepared a few weeks ago, and had decided that it had matured enough to try for the first time.

500ml extra virgin Olive oil.

5 crushed cloves of Garlic.

Add to the oil, and stand the bottle in a bowl of hot water for a few hours. Cap and forget for a few weeks.

The Garlic Sourbread;

200ml of Sourdough starter

400ml of Plain flour

200ml of filtered, boiled, and cooled water.

1 Tablespoon of white sugar

2 tablespoons of garlic flavoured Olive oil.

dissolve the sugar in the water

add to the flour and stir well

add the Garlic oil, and stir well.

Stir in the sourdough starter.

stand at room temperature to rest for 12-18 hours.

Knead and punch the dough into a shallow baking tray.

Bake at gas Mk 5 for 15-20 minutes.

Enjoy.

I have eaten a considerable amount of this sour garlic bread today, hope that it wears off in time for my date tomorrow lunchtime.