This isn't the game I'd drop Brown to the bench for. I can just about make an argument for the three locks selection against France but I'd rather Haskell at 7 than Robshaw. I genuinely think England will lose because Scotland exposed some fundamental flaws in our game which France are more than capable of exploiting.

Just trying to establish if they're people who would actually know. You seem to want to dismiss the opinions of people who spend the most time with him but your anonymous and undefined mates seem to be all knowing.

Like the idea that he's a good bloke off the field is pretty much the default opinion so if you're going against the grain I guess you need a little bit to back it up. It doesn't bother me in the slightest, just curious as it runs directly opposite to what I've heard publicly and privately from those who know him.

I've met him 3 times, once he was an arse and the other two times quite nice. From what I've also heard he likes to play up to his grumpy persona but is actually a quiet, chilled out bloke who is a bit shy.

Just trying to establish if they're people who would actually know. You seem to want to dismiss the opinions of people who spend the most time with him but your anonymous and undefined mates seem to be all knowing.

Like the idea that he's a good bloke off the field is pretty much the default opinion so if you're going against the grain I guess you need a little bit to back it up. It doesn't bother me in the slightest, just curious as it runs directly opposite to what I've heard publicly and privately from those who know him.

I appreciate he may well have taken a selfie with you and signed something at the supporters club- that’s cool. Not everybody has the same experience, it’s ok to be different.

I remain, utterly unconvinced about Eddie. We've made zero progress in the last 18 months and there's precious few signs that he is acknowledging/tackling the real problems in the team. Another loss would be no bad thing.

This is outright madness oval.

Raggs wrote:

Wonder if Eddie has decided that the 6N is basically gone, and is now trying to move a few small things forwards.

I bloody hope not. Quitters never win (unless they're smokers of course). Need to chase the 5 pointer and try to ramp up a big scoreline.

I also had to laugh at Mako as vice captain - there's literally two club captains in that pack, as well as Lawes, Itoje and George who all have club captaincy experience and yet he goes for the least captain-y option of the lot

I also had to laugh at Mako as vice captain - there's literally two club captains in that pack, as well as Lawes, Itoje and George who all have club captaincy experience and yet he goes for the least captain-y option of the lot

Only one club captain, no? Fair point nonetheless, might just be an attempt to get more out of him.

Teo OK, not convinced but I can see the benefit. Watson OK, need someone to get time in the shirt, Daly - just hope he's match ready - he's our best back.

But Fck knows what's with Eddie and the back row - it's just madness - they were awful v the Scots and aren't going to, suddenly, become an international quality unit - even if they manage to do enough against France.

At least he's had to give George a start, so there'll be a little more pace in the pack.

I remain, utterly unconvinced about Eddie. We've made zero progress in the last 18 months and there's precious few signs that he is acknowledging/tackling the real problems in the team.

Another loss would be no bad thing.

24 wins from 26. Wow you’re a tough on to please.

Depends on the spin one wants. We've won 24/26, or we've lost 2 out of the last 4 6N games.

Don't get all this "we got turned over at the breakdown, so need a proper 7" nonsense.

A good 7 can't defend your own ball. That's about changing your pod system and playing narrower.

That's just wrong really.

Check out around 29.48 in the Scotland game. Scrum, ball goes to Ford who sees space and attacks. Barclay (who was playing openside a the time), gets off the scrum, tackles Ford, get's back to his feet, clear release and latches on, then Robshaw get's there and fails to move him. A proper 7 preferably just gets to Ford first, preventing any hands in the ruck, or at worst, actually clears Barclay out whilst he's getting back to his feet, Scotland win an easy pen. Similar from set piece at around 36.27, though not sure if that was a pen in the end. Robshaw just isn't quick enough. Put him at 6 where it's far less of an issue, and his strengths are supported far more.

A good 7 should not only be doing this for set piece, but for breaks as well, reading the play and getting into position. Hask had a good example of this for the lions, when the Lions broke, made 60m, and the opposition 7 got over the ball, but Hask basically cleared out the 7 and the tackled player in one huge hit. Hask is far from rounded, and we should be looking to move on, but he's an absolutely fabulous example of how a 7 can be influential in winning your own ball consistently at key times.

Should the rest of the pack be working well? Of course, but Lawes is not good at the breakdown, and putting him in the loose forwards just makes that even more noticeable, since it denies England of what would normally be a more accomplished breakdown worker there.

Can the system be adapted to make up for our lack of ability and poor selection? To a degree yes, but not for those set pieces or scrums!

Moving beyond your cruel observations of yesterday I actually agree with much of this, which mayn't surprise. It is odd actually that we're insisting on putting out some slower less mobile players and asking them to then play a hard game to support, though that doesn't really apply to our own bloody scrum ball.

The fear is we diminish our best winger by moving him to fullback, where he's been a bit meh at international level so far. Hope he really goes for it.

He was only our best winger while Daly was out.

As long as he handles the high ball well, and gets into position, he'll get plenty of chances to get involved in attacks - potentially it's a very dangerous back three. Probably the quickest we've had for many years.

Watson is a better winger than Daly, who is a fine player in his own right but doesn't have Watson's ability in the air and Watson has the edge for tight finishing. Happy to have them both ahead of May, though.

Watson has played fullback for England before, hence my caution. He's been a bit of a no show.

My main concern with Watson at 15 is much like Brown he doesn't actually link the play between the 13 and the wings. We'll have a lot of pace available to us if only we can work out how to actually use it. We'll get options on the counter attack perhaps more than our own attack, especially with them lacking some pace and mobility at 13, which might be a similar issue to them as our 14 taking up some interesting positions in defence (especially now he's working with a new 13)

Watson is a better winger than Daly, who is a fine player in his own right but doesn't have Watson's ability in the air and Watson has the edge for tight finishing. Happy to have them both ahead of May, though.

Watson has played fullback for England before, hence my caution. He's been a bit of a no show.

Given the choice, I'd take Daly. Just as good in attack, better defender/tackler, harder to bring down, passes better. He'd also, most likely, be a better FB than Watson. Just a better, all round, player.

Watson is a better winger than Daly, who is a fine player in his own right but doesn't have Watson's ability in the air and Watson has the edge for tight finishing. Happy to have them both ahead of May, though.

Watson has played fullback for England before, hence my caution. He's been a bit of a no show.

Given the choice, I'd take Daly. Just as good in attack, better defender/tackler, harder to bring down, passes better. He'd also, most likely, be a better FB than Watson. Just a better, all round, player.

Maybe the lack of dynamism at the breakdown can be countered by a more conservative attacking forward pattern of 1-3-3-1 with a big focus in training on clearing our those rucks more aggressively (easier to do if you the first man in a three man pod and know others can secure the ball once you have blasted through).

Watson is a better winger than Daly, who is a fine player in his own right but doesn't have Watson's ability in the air and Watson has the edge for tight finishing. Happy to have them both ahead of May, though.

Watson has played fullback for England before, hence my caution. He's been a bit of a no show.

Given the choice, I'd take Daly. Just as good in attack, better defender/tackler, harder to bring down, passes better. He'd also, most likely, be a better FB than Watson. Just a better, all round, player.

How much can we really expect from Daly in this match, he hasn't played rugby in months. Not sure who else was available but you'd think a fit, in-form player would fare better. Expected a muted game from him tbh.

Maybe the lack of dynamism at the breakdown can be countered by a more conservative attacking forward pattern of 1-3-3-1 with a big focus in training on clearing our those rucks more aggressively (easier to do if you the first man in a three man pod and know others can secure the ball once you have blasted through).

George should also be a bit quicker to the breakdown than Dylan - as well as being an extra carrying option.

How much can we really expect from Daly in this match, he hasn't played rugby in months. Not sure who else was available but you'd think a fit, in-form player would fare better. Expected a muted game from him tbh.

Tend to agree - EJ seems to think his training camps are better, than real matches, for getting players match ready. Hughes was way off the pace against the Scots.

Maybe the lack of dynamism at the breakdown can be countered by a more conservative attacking forward pattern of 1-3-3-1 with a big focus in training on clearing our those rucks more aggressively (easier to do if you the first man in a three man pod and know others can secure the ball once you have blasted through).

George should also be a bit quicker to the breakdown than Dylan - as well as being an extra carrying option.

Also the 1331 isn't inherently conservative, you can use it more in the style of Ireland than say NZ, but it allows for all sorts. We could though use a 1331 to bring in an extra resource, or we would just have the pods reduce the spacing which would make it easier for players to move across from a previous phase. We could also make more use of our pick and go game. There was also something flagged up by someone on the 1014 site of the England supporting player tending to clear out by going to ground, croc rolls in the examples given, and given we've often a one man support that exposes us and there is maybe an option to work harder and try to keep our feet over the ball though that might take getting there earlier which starts us going round this whole loop again

Maybe the lack of dynamism at the breakdown can be countered by a more conservative attacking forward pattern of 1-3-3-1 with a big focus in training on clearing our those rucks more aggressively (easier to do if you the first man in a three man pod and know others can secure the ball once you have blasted through).

George should also be a bit quicker to the breakdown than Dylan - as well as being an extra carrying option.

Also the 1331 isn't inherently conservative, you can use it more in the style of Ireland than say NZ, but it allows for all sorts. We could though use a 1331 to bring in an extra resource, or we would just have the pods reduce the spacing which would make it easier for players to move across from a previous phase. We could also make more use of our pick and go game. There was also something flagged up by someone on the 1014 site of the England supporting player tending to clear out by going to ground, croc rolls in the examples given, and given we've often a one man support that exposes us and there is maybe an option to work harder and try to keep our feet over the ball though that might take getting there earlier which starts us going round this whole loop again

Maybe the lack of dynamism at the breakdown can be countered by a more conservative attacking forward pattern of 1-3-3-1 with a big focus in training on clearing our those rucks more aggressively (easier to do if you the first man in a three man pod and know others can secure the ball once you have blasted through).

George should also be a bit quicker to the breakdown than Dylan - as well as being an extra carrying option.

Also the 1331 isn't inherently conservative, you can use it more in the style of Ireland than say NZ, but it allows for all sorts. We could though use a 1331 to bring in an extra resource, or we would just have the pods reduce the spacing which would make it easier for players to move across from a previous phase. We could also make more use of our pick and go game. There was also something flagged up by someone on the 1014 site of the England supporting player tending to clear out by going to ground, croc rolls in the examples given, and given we've often a one man support that exposes us and there is maybe an option to work harder and try to keep our feet over the ball though that might take getting there earlier which starts us going round this whole loop again

I agree - its only conservative when compared to 1-2-2-2-1.

I still look at the 12221 and think that's not a proper system. Ignoring that however I don't see why the 1331 can't be more adventurous, the spacing between the players, the roles they look to enact all bleeds into it. The system is just a starting point not an entire picture

I still look at the 12221 and think that's not a proper system. Ignoring that however I don't see why the 1331 can't be more adventurous, the spacing between the players, the roles they look to enact all bleeds into it. The system is just a starting point not an entire picture

I think it works if you have Billy making massive carries and Hask smashing the first breakdown plus contributions from the rest of the pack that seemed to be more dynamic in 2016/17.

I still look at the 12221 and think that's not a proper system. Ignoring that however I don't see why the 1331 can't be more adventurous, the spacing between the players, the roles they look to enact all bleeds into it. The system is just a starting point not an entire picture

I think it works if you have Billy making massive carries and Hask smashing the first breakdown plus contributions from the rest of the pack that seemed to be more dynamic in 2016/17.

The 242 works well on reducing the amount of running required in the tight five, whether one cares to deem that lazy or efficient probably depends on the team. What the 242 also does is expose the handling and decision making in the tight five, and whether that's a good idea or not again depends on the team.