Pointing to a "stronger than expected" response to Steam's living room-focused Big Picture user interface, Newell said that getting the Linux version of Steam out of beta would also be key to developing low-cost, living room-friendly gaming PCs. While he said Valve is developing one such hardware solution itself, Newell sees other PC manufacturers experimenting with setups targeted at the living room gamer as well. "We'll do it but we also think other people will as well," Newell told Kotaku.

Newell added the Steam-based hardware would be aimed to directly compete against next-gen consoles from Microsoft and Sony. Such a move could shake up the game console market. Steam-powered hardware would likely launch with a healthy library of downloadable games at prices often much lower than their console counterparts (especially during the service's frequent sales). It's an open question whether Valve could bring in such hardware at a price competitive with dedicated gaming consoles or with the degree of modular upgradeability that PC gamers have come to expect from their machines.

On that last point, Newell hinted that Valve's hardware would be more console-like than PC-like as far as upgrades. "If you want more flexibility, you can always buy a more general purpose PC," he said. "For people who want a more turnkey solution, that's what some people are really gonna want for their living room. The nice thing about a PC is a lot of different people can try out different solutions and customers can find the ones that work best for them."

Quick question here. I'm probably not reading ok right now, but does it mean that Valve will support home-made HTPCs as well as console-like solutions coming from them? If that's the case, I'm game as long as there's a way to put a media center there. Otherwise, I'll pass.

I'm a PC gamer through and through. About the only console I've owned is a Wii and that's because of the nintendo exclusives that provide something PCs can't (family entertainment), that and because it can be hacked to hell. An HTPC with Steam would be my dream "console" as long as it can do everything else a PC with a 10-foot interface can. I'm done with closed environments. They always miss something that makes it a deal-breaker to me.

With the direction consoles are headed, I completely support this. Companies are selling $60 games and attempting to wipe out the trade-in/second hand market. While I realize you can't trade in a PC game, most of my steam games have been bought for less than $15. Competition is never a bad thing.

So, one of the outfits keeping PC gaming alive... wants to sell consoles?

Great.

While it would share the closed nature of consoles, the difference is that from a programming perspective, it'd still be a PC, so game developers wouldn't have to port to it from PC, because it IS a PC. At most, they'd have to add controller support, which is obviously pretty trivial compared to what's involved with a real port from PC to console or vice-versa.

I'm also guessing that anyone who really wanted to would be able to jailbreak it if they really wanted to turn it into a full-fledged computer.

For the most part, I think it's great. However, releasing a new 'console' at the same time that Microsoft and Sony are releasing theirs is extremely stupid.

Yes, we here at ars knows that it's not an actual console, but the people who really know better will have likely built their own HTPC computer already if that's what they wanted. The only thing I think this would do for that crowd is to establish a standard for Linux gamepads. For the people who don't know better, they would need to know how this isn't another console - and then that it isn't going to break and get viruses like their desktops do.

It's a great idea, but they really need to release it two years after the big consoles release. That way they're not directly competing for mindshare against the established consoles. Also, they can realistically have better hardware than the consoles - I doubt valve would be willing to sell the things at a loss like the consoles can. (Even Nintendo is doing it now - eve if it's paid for after a single game is bought).

If Valve was able to create some sort of middle-ware to efficiently play the entire steam catalog on an Ubuntu "Steam Box" I would be amazed. It would be like Wine on steroids. This sounds a little too good to be true though...

A convenient way to get the steam catalog into the living room? STOP TALKING AND TAKE MY MONEY!

It's true that this does sound a bit like a console, but I'm hopeful that Valve will do a good enough job with this to provide the consistent UX of the console blended with the far superior performance of the gaming PC. This won't beat out a true homebrew gaming rig, but it is certainly a step in the right direction for the slightly more casual, mainstream gamer.

OT: I love the new "Load additional comments" buttons that have been showing up, and I just noticed a "Write/Preview" tab. FYI, the preview tab doesn't respect the current theme (shows up as black text/white background when viewing with the dark theme). Other than that, no complaints. Keep up the good work!

It would be a shame if there was awesome hardware, a slick UI, turn-key simplicity, but it was unable to play a large chunk of games that use Direct X or some other proprietary Windows-only technology.

Aren't the two big video card manufactures known to have poor Linux support?

Well, this really explains the "Big Picture" mode in steam that opens steam up full screen giving it a boxee, media streamer (like roku) or console like feel and interface. That is probably their first move toward this and will give you a decent feel what their console will be like. For anyone who hasn't noticed it, it's a big image/button in the top right of steam that says "BIG PICTURE" with arrows pointing outward, as if to expand.

Like others of said, it all depends on the implementation. If it's some custom OS that isn't based on current PC architectures, then i'll be very dissapointed. I.e. It would no longer be a 'PC'. If, on the other hand, it turns out to simply be a per-specced PC box with a Steam badge on it - then i'm all for it.

Even better would be to make sure that the Steam app itself could turn any htpc into a a similar idea (the writing on the wall was 'big picture mode'). Which would effectively mean that the Steam 'console' is already available at the click of a download button.

Everyone seems to assume it will run some Linux variation. How do we know this won't be a Windows-based box, exactly?

Because Valve hasn't exactly been heaping praise upon Windows, Microsoft would essentially become a direct competitor, because it would add $100 or so to the price of the "console," and because Valve just happens to be developing a Linux version...all at the same time.

We don't know, but if you shake the Magic Eight Ball is says that Signs Point To Yes.

Like others of said, it all depends on the implementation. If it's some custom OS that isn't based on current PC architectures, then i'll be very dissapointed. I.e. It would no longer be a 'PC'. If, on the other hand, it turns out to simply be a per-specced PC box with a Steam badge on it - then i'm all for it.

Even better would be to make sure that the Steam app itself could turn any htpc into a a similar idea. Which would effectively mean that the Steam 'console' is already available at the click of a download button.

This is already done. Only issue I can find is I haven't yet bothered to figure out how to launch Big Picture mode by default. But my HTPC already has Steam, with Big Picture Mode, which I use with an Xbox controller to play several games that its lower-powered video card can handle.

It would be a shame if there was awesome hardware, a slick UI, turn-key simplicity, but it was unable to play a large chunk of games that use Direct X or some other proprietary Windows-only technology.

Aren't the two big video card manufactures known to have poor Linux support?

Depends who you talk to and how you define "poor."

But yeah, pretty much.

Quote:

What are some AAA titles that run on something other than Windows?

Depends who you talk to and how you define "AAA."

But for the most part? Some current franchises still release for OSX (including Valve's). For Linux? Can't think of any. Maybe there are a few. Did Valve get anything ported yet?

I'll commit the mortal sin of crossposting what I posted on the forum on this topic:

New console launches cost major, major cash, you are competing with 3 juggernauts for starters and right now Steam is a PC only vehicle and the target audience for this machine would be PC gamers because those are the only ones familiar with Steam and, most likely, Valve. And there comes the trouble.

For me, (I run a 2500K with an overclocked GTX 460) to buy into this the box, it would have to be significantly faster than my PC and, given I'd give up some functionality, it would have to be cheap as well, and the games I bought on Steam (about 40 or so) would have to work on it. If they can do THAT then I might be interested. Playing Steam games on my television is already not an issue, playing with wired or wireless controllers ditto.Since the above condition are pretty hard to meet, I'd go as far as to say impossible, what would be my incentive to buy this? HL 3? One game? Yah, that's so not going to happen.

Quick question here. I'm probably not reading ok right now, but does it mean that Valve will support home-made HTPCs as well as console-like solutions coming from them? If that's the case, I'm game as long as there's a way to put a media center there. Otherwise, I'll pass.

I'm a PC gamer through and through. About the only console I've owned is a Wii and that's because of the nintendo exclusives that provide something PCs can't (family entertainment), that and because it can be hacked to hell. An HTPC with Steam would be my dream "console" as long as it can do everything else a PC with a 10-foot interface can. I'm done with closed environments. They always miss something that makes it a deal-breaker to me.

Steam does now. I have Steam installed on my HTPC as well as my desktop. It's Big Picture feature is absolutely outstanding for big-screen gaming.

Valve hardware aside, I highly recommend checking out Big Picture for an HTPC.

I see this as a good thing, but does it seem like a way for Valve to get in on the console market by using the PC gamer base as leverage to anyone else?

My main issue with consoles is that they put a limit on how far game development can progress for the duration of their life cycle. Why will this valve box be different if game makers still have to have their games able to run on a console like lower spec base line? Am I missing something?

In either case, something needs to shake up the console market; it all just seems so stale at the moment.

Either I will never, ever be using a Steam powered set top box, or I already am, having connected my Windows 7 PC to a television set and occasionally playing my Steam games on it (but with a keyboard and mouse, I'm not simple). Really with PS3s interfacing with keyboards and computers interfacing with TV HDMI ports, the line between the console mouth breathers and the glorious PC gaming master race are blurring. Playing Counterstrike GO with a keyboard and mouse will still make a person exponentially better at the game than any mouth breather contemporaries playing the set top version, thus the master race survives the coming PC genocide.

The linux based part seems pretty...interesting. I'm actually not sure what to think yet, but its a bit of a chicken and egg problem. They won't get some games on it until getting an install base (to make it cost effective), but can they get an install base with the current selection they've got? I suppose their support of indies does give them an advantage there, but then they're competing against ouya. Gonna be an interesting year!

I'm very intrigued about the OS.But for the most part? Some current franchises still release for OSX (including Valve's). For Linux? Can't think of any. Maybe there are a few. Did Valve get anything ported yet?

Supposedly runs really well and wasn't too hard to port. So all major Valve games will probably be ported. Granted I don't really want to use Ubuntu, starting Steam on it is a good way to get development and porting of games over to Linux. I will feel much better once they have their games stable on other Linux flavors about making a final switch over to Linux. Though that would be made easier if Arena Net and Blizzard would port their games to it, but I have little hope of that atm. Steam should at least be able to prove that Linux can handle traditionally window's only games and has the user base to make it worth porting to. (granted a lot of Linux users get counted as window's users, since they dual boot or have windows boxes for gaming).

Edit: Ahh, took at look at the comments on Valve's Linux blog's latest post and looks like they are working toward other distro's too:

Valve Linux team says:November 20, 2012 at 3:23 pmWhile we are focusing most of our efforts on Ubuntu 12.04 LTS we already have people in the limited beta who are running on different distributions.

I'll commit the mortal sin of crossposting what I posted on the forum on this topic:

New console launches cost major, major cash, you are competing with 3 juggernauts for starters and right now Steam is a PC only vehicle and the target audience for this machine would be PC gamers because those are the only ones familiar with Steam and, most likely, Valve. And there comes the trouble.

For me, (I run a 2500K with an overclocked GTX 460) to buy into this the box, it would have to be significantly faster than my PC and, given I'd give up some functionality, it would have to be cheap as well, and the games I bought on Steam (about 40 or so) would have to work on it. If they can do THAT then I might be interested. Playing Steam games on my television is already not an issue, playing with wired or wireless controllers ditto.Since the above condition are pretty hard to meet, I'd go as far as to say impossible, what would be my incentive to buy this? HL 3? One game? Yah, that's so not going to happen.

If you're already happy with your gaming rig, you're probably not the target audience with this. I have a feeling this is more for the 360 and the PS3 owners who look at Steam sales with envy, and for the PC gamer who doesn't want to deal with setting up an HTPC. Which means I probably won't buy one either, since I actually do have an HTPC that I'm in the process of setting up as a light-duty gaming box.

The only negative I can think of is sometimes now its real hard to get through during Steam sales. How much will this increase if everyone gets it?

I've never had a problem, not even during the last time Steam maxed out its concurrent user number. The issue is probably on the ISP level, too many concurrents on your local node. I know my packet priority slows down all other peers on my node when I start steaming, or pirating as the situation warrants. Unless you're talking about something other than bandwidth issues.

EDIT: Unrelated, but what the hell are you all talking about with the term 'HTPC'? I'm not familiar with that, I'm guessing, acronym.

Make it run XBMC too and I'm in. The old Acer laptop I'm using as an HTPC has seen better days and I'd love to have an all in one that can also run games.

I'm running an ITX sized APU build. It's not a hardcore gaming rig(64gb SSD, MiniITX MB and case, Llano APU, 4gb ram), but it cost me $350 including it's SSD and ram. It runs XBMC, all my emulators (covering up to PS2 games, which it plays at better-than-PS2 resolution), and pretty much all my Steam games at reasonable settings.

Sure, it's limited playing graphics heavy AAA titles (Skyrim, for example) though it can still handle playing them in graphics that are as good as or better than console settings.

I've no idea what sort of hardware Valve is looking at using, but you can absolutely build a decent box at console-level prices that's easily capable of running games well and serving as a full HTPC.

New console launches cost major, major cash, you are competing with 3 juggernauts for starters and right now Steam is a PC only vehicle and the target audience for this machine would be PC gamers because those are the only ones familiar with Steam and, most likely, Valve. And there comes the trouble.

..snip..Since the above condition are pretty hard to meet, I'd go as far as to say impossible, what would be my incentive to buy this? HL 3? One game? Yah, that's so not going to happen.

Launches are only expensive if you need to spend a bunch of marketing dollars to get customers, or you need to recoup a bunch of R&D dollars spent developing new hardware. Valve doesn't need to either.

The total amount of money Valve has spent both porting Steam to Linux and developing the Steam Box hardware (which is probably just a standard HTPC) has probably already been covered by their usual operating profits, and they don't have outside shareholders saying they need OMG huge profits nownownow. As such. they can go totally "long tail" on this. Maybe you won't replace your current HTPC with a Steam Box because yours is already fairly up-to-date. I actually don't have a HTPC at the moment, just an Apple TV and a Roku, so would actually probably buy one.

Even if you just install Steam and start using Big Picture mode on your existing HTPC suddenly Valve gets ~30% of all your gaming dollars spent on your couch. If they sell the Steam Boxes with a small profit marging instead of the massive loss the console manufacturers usually have they'll be quite happy to sit back and slowly take over the world.

I see this as a good thing, but does it seem like a way for Valve to get in on the console market by using the PC gamer base as leverage to anyone else?

My main issue with consoles is that they put a limit on how far game development can progress for the duration of their life cycle. Why will this valve box be different if game makers still have to have their games able to run on a console like lower spec base line? Am I missing something?

In either case, something needs to shake up the console market; it all just seems so stale at the moment.

Depends entirely on the hardware they decide to go with, but in return for the console being exclusive to Steam games, they could probably subsidize the high-end PC graphics cards and use those. (Think: hardware is the phone, steam is the data plan).

In that case this could be both good and bad. Good in the sense that it would set the bar higher for consoles, bad in that it still does fix things to a development cycle.

Also, if they make the box user-upgradable, it would basically leave things at the status quo only with a higher baseline for consoles, which wold be all-around good.

My major concern is game selection. Wine only goes so far, and there are many games that simply won't function on a non-Windows box. That and there are tons of games that simply don't support/are not designed for controllers, and Valve has no control over that.

Depends entirely on the hardware they decide to go with, but in return for the console being exclusive to Steam games, they could probably subsidize the high-end PC graphics cards and use those. (Think: hardware is the phone, steam is the data plan).

In that case this could be both good and bad. Good in the sense that it would set the bar higher for consoles, bad in that it still does fix things to a development cycle.

Also, if they make the box user-upgradable, it would basically leave things at the status quo only with a higher baseline for consoles, which wold be all-around good.

My major concern is game selection. Wine only goes so far, and there are many games that simply won't function on a non-Windows box. That and there are tons of games that simply don't support/are not designed for controllers, and Valve has no control over that.

With fixed hardware, while Wine is limited Steam could build/work with developers to build Wine installs for games individually. This bypasses one of the biggest issues with Wine-based gaming IMHO: The enormous hassle getting everything configured on a game-by-game basis.

Sure, they won't get everything, but I suspect they're looking at a pretty decent list overall as time goes by.

Not enough information on this yet. Does it have a bluray drive? Will it be a space heater running fast hardware? If it is running a form of linux will other developers port their games over to it? The biggest issue I have is will you (the user) be required to download all your games? I for one have a monthly data cap and there is no way I can download a ton of games. I welcome another competitor in the living room, but I think I'll sit back and watch what happens in this space.

I work at a university with a top 10 ranked gaming program. Faculty are not surprised by this. When thinking about porting, keep something in mind. You basically have two flavors, openGL and directx. Programming for directx gets you xbox 360 and the PC market. Programming for OpenGL gets you all the rest of the markets. IOS, PS3, Linux, Android... they all use OpenGL. That makes porting much easier. Valve needs to get out from under Microsoft as Microsoft will start consuming Valve's revenue. The Steam Box has the potential to be an all inclusive gaming/netflix/amazon prime/name your service box. Plus, you will be able to also run Steam on your current Windows or Linux box. If you have Windows, Valve could put out a live CD to run the games off the Windows drive. The win for Valve is that Linux, being free, opens up a whole slew of possibilities.

My major concern is game selection. Wine only goes so far, and there are many games that simply won't function on a non-Windows box. That and there are tons of games that simply don't support/are not designed for controllers, and Valve has no control over that.

For one, they may not worry about porting every single game from their back catalog. Two, new games are being written constantly. THree, Valve has the chance to make keyboard/mouse users a first class citizen on a console, which I think they need to do to be successful.

Kyle Orland / Kyle is the Senior Gaming Editor at Ars Technica, specializing in video game hardware and software. He has journalism and computer science degrees from University of Maryland. He is based in the Washington, DC area.