koffee wrote:I like the bag so far. I also would not be afraid to bring in a meat hook of some type. They just can be so useful to get around obstacles

CHEERS - Koffee

Agreed. Except I would go with something that is truly stable and not so dependent on speed stability (i.e. Predator, Firebird, XXX, etc.). The ones you listed as possible very overstable discs ARE stable, and especially throwing lower power will behave much the same as the ones I recommended, but they do depend on a certain amount of speed stability.

Hmmm... that is a tricky suggestion because I believe the Banshee and Flick are very overstable discs. I guess I could be wrong but if you wouldn't mind explaining what you mean by "not so dependent speed stability" I'd love to know.

I have used the Champ Banshee as my meathook with great results. So I dont know if you like it keep it. I however do not have a big arm average is around 300 feet. Do you have a big arm? Thats what makes the differance on whats a good overstable driver for some people.

I've been going through a rebuilding process. Discing down for a period to learn from the ground up and doing the sekrit technique stuffs. I've been throwing my Ridge about 290-300. and I can put a Buzzz and Ascent farther but I haven't gone to a field to really measure yet.

Right now I'm testing out the XLink Summit, Firm Summit, XLink Ridge, and Firm Ridge for putting and driver putting. I'm pretty set to the Ridge and probably using both Firm and XLink. Last time I check I was able to put my TL and Stalker about 350-375.

I am not sure at what power and distance the Banshee becomes less of a meathook and more of a fairway driver. Mainly becouse I cant get it out that far. I still think you should keep what you are comfortable with.

cfair wrote:Hmmm... that is a tricky suggestion because I believe the Banshee and Flick are very overstable discs. I guess I could be wrong but if you wouldn't mind explaining what you mean by "not so dependent speed stability" I'd love to know.

It has to do with the shape of the disc. Overstable discs tend to have similar shapes. Blunt noses, and concave wings. I'll talk about the xcal since I'm much more familiar with it than the others you mentioned.

It is a stable disc by design, but not necessarily overstable. It takes 400+ power to get the type of flight it was intended to have, which is straight with a solid fade. When you are throwing with this power, the disc can still handle some wind (I use it for upwards of 10-15 mph headwinds), but if I throw it into much more wind than that, it will turn, much in the same way a teebird will for somebody throwing lower power into a headwind.

When I throw a predator, firebird, xxx, etc. into that same wind with that same amount of power, the disc is every bit as predictable. I KNOW that disc is going straight and fading.

For people throwing lower power, the speed stable discs behave very similar to structurally stable discs. The harder you throw those discs, the more they move away from that very overstable flight towards their intended flight.

mattw wrote:I am not sure at what power and distance the Banshee becomes less of a meathook and more of a fairway driver. Mainly becouse I cant get it out that far. I still think you should keep what you are comfortable with.

For me the banshee flies like an eagle x at high speeds (350+ pwr) if you were throwing the eagle at like 275 ft power. At high power and speed the banshee is no longer a meathook, and it can flip, but its still decent in the wind. For lower power throwers the banshee is what a Fb is for bigger armed players to some extent IMO.

I think what he is saying Cfair is that you may benefit from something that is very overstable at any speed, all of his examples were good ones. But if you can get similar results to what he is describing with the banshee then there isnt a reason to make a change until you find one.

So its been a long time since I've been in here (doing a lot of lurking and a little getting to know the locals) but I figured its time to get back into it...

Putters:175g Firm Ridge - I'm enjoying it, but I know so little about putting it will probably change this summer175g XLink Ridge - I love it for a lot of things and it will be hard to get it out of my bag...

I want to get a hold of some TP or ESP comets but... alas... Also I have a hard time deciding on DX or KC rocs. Once the weather gets nice I'm going to have a once and for all decision. Finally, for tournament play should I just consider having 3-4 rocs in various stages of wear? Or keep the comet...?

Very Overstable DriverI don't have them yet but I'm going to run two Z Preds one new and one beat for the moderately overstable slot.

Stable Control DriverEither the ESP Cyclone or S/Q Polaris LS... this is what I want to know about most. I'm looking for discs that will help me transition from mids to drivers... good choices?

I have used the ESP Cyclone in the past and currently have the Polaris in the bag. ESP Cyclone is a great disc its easy to work multiple lines with and the plastic holds up great. The ESP Cyclone also has great distance potential. The Q Polaris is more Teebird like in flight with a straight flight pattern with a little fade at the end. It can also do a nice S curve. The Q can also handle a decent headwind. The S Polaris is a little less stable than the Q but is faster.

Apothecary wrote:kick that vibram garbage the hell out of your bag and watch your short game blossom.

Actually I've watched my short game get better because of it. In practice I throw my summits next to my comets because they react so similarly You know I was thinking of dyeing a a few discs with that vibram logo in the middle and sending them your way

cfair wrote:So its been a long time since I've been in here (doing a lot of lurking and a little getting to know the locals) but I figured its time to get back into it...

Putters:175g Firm Ridge - I'm enjoying it, but I know so little about putting it will probably change this summer175g XLink Ridge - I love it for a lot of things and it will be hard to get it out of my bag...

I want to get a hold of some TP or ESP comets but... alas... Also I have a hard time deciding on DX or KC rocs. Once the weather gets nice I'm going to have a once and for all decision. Finally, for tournament play should I just consider having 3-4 rocs in various stages of wear? Or keep the comet...?

Very Overstable DriverI don't have them yet but I'm going to run two Z Preds one new and one beat for the moderately overstable slot.

Stable Control DriverEither the ESP Cyclone or S/Q Polaris LS... this is what I want to know about most. I'm looking for discs that will help me transition from mids to drivers... good choices?

I really like the Cyclone myself, but I ended up picking the Gazelle. The only issue I really have with the Gazelle is that it produced mainly in DX. I know there is some Champ FRs and some Glows, but those are far and few between and I don't like white discs. I was thinking of throwing the Cyclones in the bag again when the snow melts and I can play a course where I'd use them (I've only been throwing putters and mids as of late).

Have you any updates on Cyclone/Polaris comparison? I ask because I'm curious to hear about your progression and I haven't thrown a PLS and was thinking of trying it.

the last 3 days here have been -3, -5, and today -12 degrees and 2 feet of snow... no throwing yet. But I have happily amassed some sweet discs that I'm happy about (TP and ESP Comets).

I think once the nice enough weather hits I'm going to work out the Summit, Ridge, Wizard, and Jokeri. Comets and Rocs are in the bag for good. After that I'll be tryin out the ESP Cyclone, Sirius Polaris LS, and a Glow Stalker. Once the weather is nice enough I'll let you know.

For overstable I'll probably be going with Preds but I may test it next to firebirds and XXX...