Border Collie Lover

I live in Atlanta. I have three border collies. The mama dog, Miss Furgi (6 years old) and two of her puppies (born valentines day 2011), Albert (the alpha male) and Emma (the runt).
I have worked Furgi with cattle and livestock since she was a puppy and now I work with her puppies to herd cattle in south GA.

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Welcome to DTA the dog on the left with the pink bandanna is really cute, of course the others are too. Your not alone on loving Border collie's, there are other members with Border collies. I myself have a border collie mix and will hopefully get a pure bred one in college. I also live in lovely Georgia.

Welcome to DTA the dog on the left with the pink bandanna is really cute, of course the others are too. Your not alone on loving Border collie's, there are other members with Border collies. I myself have a border collie mix and will hopefully get a pure bred one in college. I also live in lovely Georgia.

Thanks for the warm welcome! The dog with the pink bandana is Emma... she is the most active one of the group! Full of personality! My mom got me my first border collie in 1990. She died in 1999 . Then she got me my second one in 2002 (I think...) and we had to put her down in 2010 ... The mama dog, Furgi (in the middle) came on Delta on christmas eve 2006 and lived with me in school, and the puppies came last year. I love the breed!!! It has been a bit challenging at times with the energy level on a constant high but I think they have grown into somewhat well-behaved adults (sometimes).

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You are definitely in the majority here I'm a minority with terriers and Dachshunds especially since several of them are deaf LOL.

My mom has two rescues, one of which I think is a Dachshund mix...? She is the cutest little squirt! I taught her how to "sit pretty" (beg) lol shes precious! You can see her in the front in the pic below!

Welcome!!!! Yes!!!! A lot of people here own Border Collies. Yours ae ADORABLE!!! Do you train tricks/ agility????? Do you use a clicker????

Thank you! I do work with them... They all know different tricks but I do not use a clicker... I use a training collar. I keep it turned down because I feel bad for shocking them In fact, the only reason I bother with it is because I take them to work cattle and livestock and I figure, a little nic with the collar is way less damaging than a kick from a cow! I use the beeps to get their attention and use hand signals and whistles to give direction. So far they are working well!

We promote positive and Clicker Training on this forum, so most of us use those styles of training. I rescued a 1 year old deaf white factor merle Border Collie last winter. He is a STUNNING dog! and I could not believe how easy he was. he was amazingly calm and sweet, wanting nothing more than a snuggle and a little play time. He was from a cattle ranch that breeds working BC's for working cattle. They used a shock collar on him too, but it didn't work, he was terrified of the collar, and would run and hide whenever it was on. He wouldn't work with it on, and without it, he would worry the horses, so the owner decided to give him up to rescue.

Here's Buck

And Buck and Oliver.

His pretty face

And Buck with one of my Double Merle Dachshunds, Boo (who was completely in love with him! LOL)

We promote positive and Clicker Training on this forum, so most of us use those styles of training. I rescued a 1 year old deaf white factor merle Border Collie last winter. He is a STUNNING dog! and I could not believe how easy he was. he was amazingly calm and sweet, wanting nothing more than a snuggle and a little play time. He was from a cattle ranch that breeds working BC's for working cattle. They used a shock collar on him too, but it didn't work, he was terrified of the collar, and would run and hide whenever it was on. He wouldn't work with it on, and without it, he would worry the horses, so the owner decided to give him up to rescue.

Here's Buck

And Buck and Oliver.

His pretty face

And Buck with one of my Double Merle Dachshunds, Boo (who was completely in love with him! LOL)

Your dogs are absolutely precious! It is a shame that someone would mistreat him because he did not fit into a template like the other dogs . I have witnessed (in person) trainers abuse the shock collar greatly and seen it cause the same kind of damage. I know exactly what you are talking about. Dogs that are skiddish of the collar have obviously had the person with the remote press the button way too much on a high level, using it as a punishment.

It is not meant to be used as a disciplinary tool, but rather to aid in getting attention.

I do not use it as a disciplinary action. I do not believe in that. I use it strictly to get their attention. It is a helpful tool by using the tones that beep, as a cue. The collars I purchased have tones and various stimulation levels that I monitor closely. The levels range from 1-8 and the tone beeps to get their attention. I keep the collar on the lowest level and only use the stimulation button when there is no response. I put it on my arm before I put it on my dogs because I wouldn't want to do something to them that I wouldn't want done to me.

I know the reaction from your dog that you referenced and it sounds to me like it was an inexperienced trainer. The way I see it is, if someone can not control a border collie in the environment in which he is expected to work, the best thing to do is give it to someone who can. Not all dogs are meant to do the same job. I have been very blessed and lucky with my dogs and have had some great advice for helping me with my training. It takes patience and time. I have worked with horses for more than 15 years and definately understand how long it takes to develop and perfect a technique that works not only for a horse, but for any animal. After working with animals for so long, I understand the difference in all of my dogs and make sure I consider that they are different and work with them according to their personality and how they respond to different things. It reminds me of children and how not every child learns the same way.

My dogs do no bother my horses with their collars on or without the collars. They listen to my voice and whistles... When I take them to south GA and work cattle, they do wear their collars as a precaution because they do get excited and sometimes they do not respond the first time I give them a command (such as calling them off a cow, ect). I would much rather them be safe and responsive than have a 1500 pound cow kick them and cause what could be a serious accident. The puppies are still learning (Furgi is an AWESOME herder... ) so until they get older and prove to me that they can respond when asked (like Furgi), they will continue to wear the collars strictly for the beeps and noises.
My favorite part of the day is how excited they are after they work and how they hop in the water trough to cool off

No, you're right, he was def. an "old School" (ie abusive) trainer. He used alot of physical punishment, it was horrible to watch. I watched him hurt his replacement puppy to the point of yelps more than a dozen times in a little over an hour, just because the pup wanted to come see me... see, he believes a working dog shouldn't get attention from any person but his master, and should actually not even want to go near other people. Even his daughter wasn't allowed to touch his dogs (and he didn't touch hers) Fortunately, Buck survived that with an extreme love of people and children He would drag me to everyone we saw, which sucked for everyone when I had my aggressive dog with us on walks! LOL

I'm not experienced with herding dogs (even pet herding dogs) Buck was my first herding dog foster. I'm used to hard headed terriers and dachshunds, who, in order to train for anything harder than sit, need positive training and rewards for working for me. They're completely different in temperament and training style.

Tons of trainers dont like working with terriers, and think they're impossible, aggressive or unwilling (Dachshunds too! LOL) most of those trainers, however, are punishment based trainers. People are often seriously shocked by what I've been able to teach my deaf (one of whom is also almost blind) terriers and dachshunds. They're not any of those things, they're just mostly unresponsive to correction based training.

No, you're right, he was def. an "old School" (ie abusive) trainer. He used alot of physical punishment, it was horrible to watch. I watched him hurt his replacement puppy to the point of yelps more than a dozen times in a little over an hour, just because the pup wanted to come see me... see, he believes a working dog shouldn't get attention from any person but his master, and should actually not even want to go near other people. Even his daughter wasn't allowed to touch his dogs (and he didn't touch hers) Fortunately, Buck survived that with an extreme love of people and children He would drag me to everyone we saw, which sucked for everyone when I had my aggressive dog with us on walks! LOL

I'm not experienced with herding dogs (even pet herding dogs) Buck was my first herding dog foster. I'm used to hard headed terriers and dachshunds, who, in order to train for anything harder than sit, need positive training and rewards for working for me. They're completely different in temperament and training style.

Tons of trainers dont like working with terriers, and think they're impossible, aggressive or unwilling (Dachshunds too! LOL) most of those trainers, however, are punishment based trainers. People are often seriously shocked by what I've been able to teach my deaf (one of whom is also almost blind) terriers and dachshunds. They're not any of those things, they're just mostly unresponsive to correction based training.

WELCOME!! BEAUTIFUL DOGS! Yes, there are some other border collie owners here, too, but DTA is chockful of probably every breed of dog! Lol, the border collies here do NOT have any monopoly on doing amazing tricks. Wait til you see them all here on DTA, just one amazing dog after another, almost all of them trained by their owners alone.(not "pro's" but there are some pros's here, too)

yes, hope you DO hang around here, and i'd bet, overtime, you may find that using shock collars are not necessary. at all. Not even to "get their att'n".
I also lose my dog's att'n at times!
never crossed my mind to zap him for that. Instead, i use several other methods,
such as re-evaluating what i am teaching him, and how i am teaching it,
making myself, or the task i want him to do, more appealing,
upping the pay-out/reward,
doing specific exercises to increase his focus on me, and to lengthen his att'n span,
shortening the lesson itself if his att'n span is short that day,
making sure i have given him plenty of chances to run full speed that day, etc etc.

If all else fails, i can post it here, what my dog is doing, and someone can tell me what to try.

There are other options than to zap the dog. Feel free to post a specific example of when you feel the need to zap the dog, and i'd bet, someone here might have an alternative suggestion worth trying out, since you do feel bad about zapping your dogs. We all help each other around here!

If my dog zones out, (and he does now and then) it's ME and my methods, or my expectations, that i have to re-evaluate or change.
we all live and learn. None of us are born knowing how to best train a dog, we all have to learn from others,
and wow, have i learned a LOT from the others here on DTA!! HOPE SO SO MUCH, that you do hang around here!!

I haven't worked with cattle and border collies but have worked with sheep and border collies and have not needed to use a shock collar. I have always worked the control with smaller, less potentally harmful animals - geese and ducks to teach the drive instinct and to control it and then move them onto sheep. They generally have a sense of distance when it comes to danger with a kick.