This begs the question: Why didn't Vol'jin challenge Garrosh to Mak'gora instead of costing the lives of thousands of soldiers in a rebellion that crippled the Horde?

Because he wouldn't have won; Garrosh probably wouldn't have taken the chance. Garrosh had already tried to assassinate him by the point Vol'jin puts the rebellion together, and the last guy who tried to dethrone Garrosh in a Mak'gora died under mysterious circumstances himself.

I think everyone knew that Garrosh was through playing fair at that point in the story. Vol'jin was of the opinion that Thrall would be killed on sight in Orgrimmar, and the same goes for himself tenfold.

Don't think he'll be coming through with us and seeing as we're supposed to be trapped on Draenor (possibly for the majority of the expansion), I don't think we'll be seeing too much of him. He'll probably feature briefly at the beginning when he sends us off to Draenor and as I'm predicting Siege of Stormwind as the final raid I expect he'll take a fairly big role in that.

I hope Vol'jin handles rebuilding the Horde, and only goes to Draenor for diplomacy reasons... I hope he'll be advised and accompanied by Rokhan and Rexxar...
If he stands his ground, he can be a real badass, I'd love to see him make the Frostwolves respect him, and in general... seeing how the Orcs of Draenor learn about the new races that now form the Horde.

I was in Northrend sonny, the only reason the Horde Offensive got any further than Borean Tundra was because Saurfang went around cleaning up after Garrosh and wiping the drool off his chin. But of course, Garrosh got all the credit...

That's just how the story goes and it cant be undone now. It's normal that after all he's done, all he went trough... he totally deserves that post. Also, while he's busy with serious buisnes, thrall and the rest might be perfect to become part of the war front and lead us trough all this.... I think all's fine

Wait, WHAT!!??? Looks very satisfying to me that Vol'jin kill Garrosh, with an arrow through his black heart. While he is frozen by Jaina.

I think the implication was that it would be more satisfying in the sense that it would make him slightly more sympathetic and three-dimensional. Not the cardboard cutout villain he was in MOP. They've said they don't want to redeem him per say, but I fully expect him to become slightly less villainous in WoD.

ITT: Idiots who never played Warcraft 3 and dont realize how much Vol'jin contributed to the horde.

You must be thinking of Rokhan, only troll that did something in Warcraft 3. Although I forgive your ignorance, Blizzard is slowly retconing Rokhan out of existance and having Vol'jin take credit for all he did.

"To the ordinary, we are unknowable. Fallen, corrupted; rightly feared. You cannot understand our origins, our motives. The dawning realization, that we are not fallen... we are ascended!"

I thought Vol'Jin was gonna overthrow Garrosh sooner or later the minute i saw the scene during the first levels of my Troll Druid in early Cataclysm where they were arguing between each other.
I like Garrosh, new Orgrimmar looks real badass with the Korkrom Guard and 'fight for the horde or die' attitude. I liked Thrall's way of 'we fight to survive, we want a place to live' idea as well. But thrall quit. And THAT i didn't like. He didnt quit when the 2.0, and 3.0 events happened. He delegated, and things went fine.
I think the books during and in between expansions dictate too much nowadays. And things are getting way to dense and complicated.

Anyway, i thought it would be lame for him to go back to lead the Horde after quitting. That leaves us with the remaining faction leaders. None of them are liked by the rest. I don't see Goblins following Sylvannas much less viceversa. Same thing could be said with Belfs and Taurens. Council idea is best IMO. And Vol'Jin is is my second choice for leading the Horde among the rest of faction leaders. In terms of respect by the rest of the HORDE races. I guess. At least he had the balls to step up gainst Garrosh when things went.. crazy. So obviously this Horde does not like to go on the offensive, like Garrosh did.
This horde needs something that would keep them united no matter what. Either the Draenor Horde or the Alliance or Kil'Jaeden need start doing some serious invading on multiple Horde settlements or something like that, THREAT them like Arthas did to get them togheter, like... REALLY togheter and fight like one true multiracial horde.

I think it has really great story potential. I want to see Vol'jin stand up and say "Screw your old Horde and it's warmongering ways." It's a great way for the Horde of today to finally break all ties with it's dark past and start anew. Who cares if the old Horde leaders don't like it? Their Horde failed.

Actually, if he doesn't do this then still he is the warchief.
All heroes of the horde will move as he sees fit; the horde will fight this fight as he sees fit.... the thing is: he is leading us whatever people say.
Whatever happens, it is happening under his control.

Wether he will go to draenor or not, it is his fight. If we win this fight, it is his victory.

Having said that:
I hope Thrall will deal with all of his demons and that he will be back on his throne after wod.

Probably because Vol'jin knows he's no match for Garrosh in a straight up one on one fight. Cairne was, and probably would have won had it not been for Magatha.

It's not much about that. Baine thought about it in Tides of War, he was pretty sure to have good chances of defeating Malkorok or even Garrosh in a fair duel, but he had strong doubts that, at this point, a fair duel could have taken place at all.

The big problem is...you cannot slightly consider good old "traditions" when you deal with a dictator. A fair duel for decide who will lead the Horde? Not at all, the dictator's loyalists will do anything for ensure their leader's supremacy, with tacit approval of the leader itself, or even without his approval at all. Garrosh, the more time he stayed in power, the more arrogant and egocentric has become, with his loyalists (Malkorok in particular) creating a true "personality's worship" towards him.

The Mak'gora would have been an option if all these orcs were truly loyal to the Horde. But they weren't. They were, and only, loyal to Garrosh.
It doesn't matter who wins a duel, Garrosh is the only leader that his loyalists can recognize, because he embodies the ideals in which they belive (unlike Vol'jin).

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Originally Posted by Firen

As an Alliance player I like Vol'jin, but my first thought was: "I don't think he'll be able to have Sylvanas under control.". Garrosh just seemed more intimidating I think.

Garrosh is the typical guy who shouts a lot, make the tough-hard-boiled man, but in the end no one takes him seriously. Sylvanas doesn't look intimidated, and in fact she does all her shit with the New Plague giving a fuck about Garrosh.

Last edited by Zulkhan; 2014-02-23 at 08:23 PM.

Originally Posted by Keyblader

It's a general rule though that if you play horde you are a bad person irl. It's just a scientific fact

Proof:

Originally Posted by ravenmoon

no matter what I said, you would find one way or another to undermine it or ridicule it. It wasn't in the interest of fair game with you, it was vindictive and cruel, just like the description of the race you adore so much