Well after hearing some news yesterday i feel this needs to be said out in the open.

in the short time i was back in there what could you really say was getting accomplished by the cla. Absolutly nothing when ever a thread was started the all that ever came about was a major bitch fest people brining personal issues to it. i used another member to bring up something i had said before in there which got slagged down. But when this other member brought it up it got looked at. all cla is at present is a waste of clans time. then we come to a issue that is being kept alive even though there have been several cases where abuse has happened.

The signing of sitters to clan wars.

1)sitters must not sign up to any games apart from tournements.ok so sitters can sign up to tournements. but what was the reason why this was allowed. It was to prevent the delay of players joining games delaying the tourney. so the problem i see.

is that admin see clan wars the same as tourneys, this is incorect. If a player is absent from site sitters should not sign up due to the fact that 1 player will not cause any form of delay to the war. as the clan has other players able to use for the running of the war. also signing up a player who is absent with another member of a clan does actually affect the player limits on wars that several clans use. it also affects medals because a player must play a set amount of games to get a medal.

i am not trying to flame the cla 4 U 2 NV i am just stating that is there actually any point having it. sorry but for the short time i was back in there i seen 3 clans leave because they seen it as pointless. all that ever happened was a point would be made and it would turn into a bitch fest. i can only ask you prove me wrong last 5 months show me 1 valid thing to come from the cla

eddie2 wrote:i am not trying to flame the cla 4 U 2 NV i am just stating that is there actually any point having it. sorry but for the short time i was back in there i seen 3 clans leave because they seen it as pointless. all that ever happened was a point would be made and it would turn into a bitch fest. i can only ask you prove me wrong last 5 months show me 1 valid thing to come from the cla

you are free to leave CLA (I mean AKA representative, not exactly you) if you think that CLA is not doing anything useful.

eddie2 wrote:i am not trying to flame the cla 4 U 2 NV i am just stating that is there actually any point having it. sorry but for the short time i was back in there i seen 3 clans leave because they seen it as pointless. all that ever happened was a point would be made and it would turn into a bitch fest. i can only ask you prove me wrong last 5 months show me 1 valid thing to come from the cla

i question your reasoning behind your original post. i can't see in your original post you asking if there was a point to it. all i see are negative comments about how they were organized and handle business.

while i respect your opinion about your thoughts on the CLA, it's your method on how you present it that bugs me. I hope that you first stated this in the actual CLA forum because any possibility of finding strong support to your opinion would start there as guys in there have the most knowledge of what goes on in there. if you want change, it starts from in there, not out here.

eddie2 wrote:i am not trying to flame the cla 4 U 2 NV i am just stating that is there actually any point having it. sorry but for the short time i was back in there i seen 3 clans leave because they seen it as pointless. all that ever happened was a point would be made and it would turn into a bitch fest. i can only ask you prove me wrong last 5 months show me 1 valid thing to come from the cla

i question your reasoning behind your original post. i can't see in your original post you asking if there was a point to it. all i see are negative comments about how they were organized and handle business.

while i respect your opinion about your thoughts on the CLA, it's your method on how you present it that bugs me. I hope that you first stated this in the actual CLA forum because any possibility of finding strong support to your opinion would start there as guys in there have the most knowledge of what goes on in there. if you want change, it starts from in there, not out here.

lol when i left they were argueing about the structure. they opened a new private group arguements about it because 2 members were from same clan (all they new group was doing was taking info and putting it together for the vote.)

then you had arguements about clan mods being in there (masli head clan mod) when he wasnt 1 of 2 members of a clan.

then you had complaints that the 2 members should not be able to vote should only be 1 from each clan.

ow yes and this all followed 3 months of only thing being posted was arguements about certain clans not being allowed to join.

you cannot really bring up go to cla and discuss because things dont really get discussed all that happens is it turns into a arguement and goes totally off track. because a member takes offense to what has been said. my thoughts are instead of cla bring it to public forums for discussions. then let the clan mods decide the outcome.

shaneback wrote:Eddie, what is the point of this thread? Are you just trying to complain about the CLA, or are you trying to get the sitter rules changed?

point of this thread is there are close to 1000 members in clan world most of who have been hit with people abusing sitters in clan wars. this should not of been something the cla has the right to decide it should be a public discussion. also since it is a real cheating event (account sharing) this should be in the hands of c and a moderators and clan mods to decide if they are going to allow this to continue or not. but taking this to cla and cla dealing with it is like asking a murderer if he should be found guilty or not. (due to the fact some members of cla are members who are guilty of this type of abuse.)

shaneback wrote:Eddie, what is the point of this thread? Are you just trying to complain about the CLA, or are you trying to get the sitter rules changed?

point of this thread is there are close to 1000 members in clan world most of who have been hit with people abusing sitters in clan wars. this should not of been something the cla has the right to decide it should be a public discussion. also since it is a real cheating event (account sharing) this should be in the hands of c and a moderators and clan mods to decide if they are going to allow this to continue or not. but taking this to cla and cla dealing with it is like asking a murderer if he should be found guilty or not. (due to the fact some members of cla are members who are guilty of this type of abuse.)

that sort of makes sense. you're missing the whole picture though. The CLA can help to govern the standards of the clan world. They are responsible for determining if change is necessary. Someone has to make the law. I wouldn't ask someone in the US to make a law for someone in canada if it doesn't apply to them.

In the real world, laws are made by a committee such as the senate in the US, but that senate is also held to that law. They live in a place where the same laws made apply to them. The clan community through countless efforts has been left at the back of the line and i'm paraphrasing the efforts made by those who have had closer experience.

The question is when is it time for the clan community to hold itself to a higher standard than those already made? all major events are governed through the CLA. They make the rules for their events. why would they run something if they weren't given that power to do so? i know i wouldn't make the effort if there was always red tape around. if you do not like the rules that the CLA will come up with, you have the right not to participate.

shaneback wrote:Eddie, what is the point of this thread? Are you just trying to complain about the CLA, or are you trying to get the sitter rules changed?

point of this thread is there are close to 1000 members in clan world most of who have been hit with people abusing sitters in clan wars. this should not of been something the cla has the right to decide it should be a public discussion. also since it is a real cheating event (account sharing) this should be in the hands of c and a moderators and clan mods to decide if they are going to allow this to continue or not. but taking this to cla and cla dealing with it is like asking a murderer if he should be found guilty or not. (due to the fact some members of cla are members who are guilty of this type of abuse.)

Ok, first eddie, bashing the CLA is just cementing my decision to not let you back in after you abruptly resigned your position there as a representative of your clan. Secondly, while yes there may be close to a 1000 members in the clan world, stating that "most" have been hit with abusing sitters in clan wars is an absurdly ridiculous accusation that has no merit or truth to it at all. While yes there have been a couple of high profile cases of it, and a few not so high profile cases of it, saying that "most" have been hit by this is irresponsible and just foolish. The fact of the matter is, once again you don't know what your talking about. There is a discussion going on in the CLA about sitting abuse, that discussion is being discussed because it was brought to us by C&A for our opinion as there are 33 active clans in the CLA. They can get an honest opinion of what the majority of the clan world thinks of the current rule and if it should be changed. Just because we are discussing it and voting with our opinion's does not mean that the current rule will change or not, it is there to give C&A an accurate account of what the majority of the clans think about it. You had your chance to belong to the CLA, and to be part of that process, you blew it, so stop trying to bash it with meaningless untruthful posts that you have no real knowledge of.

As most of you know my clan has been one of the most outspoken about the functionality of the CLA. We even went so far as to withdraw. However, in recent months, it has taken some very good strides to be a governing body.

I do feel that this conversation is best left in private messages or in the CLA forum. I fear that this is going to devolve into a flame thread any minute now. So unless someone has something extremely important to add, I am going to lock this and move it to archives. Any final words?

Eddie is clearly passionate about this. However the approach is all wrong. Eddie, if you are willing to do the work and show some sort of legitimate stats and or patterns of sitting, then you can talk to King Achilles about the issues.

Hey, I have an idea. Why don't you talk with your clan's CLA rep about your issues and have them bring it up in the appropriate forum.

And just so you know, your clan voted to allow sitters to sign up for clan games while the clans that have had abuse accusations (which you ridiculously called out as a conflict of interest) voted to not allow it.

So... it seems as though your problem is with how your clan views abuse.

jpcloet wrote:Eddie is clearly passionate about this. However the approach is all wrong. Eddie, if you are willing to do the work and show some sort of legitimate stats and or patterns of sitting, then you can talk to King Achilles about the issues.

thanks jp i will do (but all king a needs to do is look at one of our reicent challenges). and bones i was on a forum ban if you remember just came off it so i am having a discussion with our cla rep about his vote. at present i can only think there was a misunderstanding of what was actually being asked. but i do remember our discussion evolving around sitters cheating (in the cla last december) where every clans persona was sitting abuse is a job for c and a mods and clan directors. so cla should not be deciding if this is cheating or not.

eddie2 wrote:sitting abuse is a job for c and a mods and clan directors. so cla should not be deciding if this is cheating or not.

You're missing the point. The C&A team has brought this to the CLA for our opinion on an exception that the C&A team has made that allows this to happen. To me, it makes perfect sense for the clan community to get a C&A rule changed that only affects the clan community, if we so wish.

Remember, it was the C&A team who asked for our opinions. They don't need our input at all to make a change, but I appreciate them wanting to get our insight before doing anything.