However, take a can of this, add a jar of that, and top it with a can of these is not really cooking despite warming it up.

No it's not cooking. And not the way I would do it. What I don't understand is why it bothers you (and others here) so much when other people do it.

Case in point: My host, where we spent Thanksgiving, made a couple of casseroles as sides; one hash browns, the other broccoli. In both cases, pre-shredded cheese and cans of undiluted cream of X soup were among the ingredients. Both the broccoli and hash browns were frozen bags. Basically, the sort of thing you're talking about. Is that cooking? Not hardly. At best it's assembling to order.

But.....not only did it not bother me, I enjoyed portions of both.

I could also make the point that your friend is at least making an effort to produce something. I belong to a club that periodically has pot-luck dinners. One couple can be depended on to bring a bucket of KFC as their contribution. Personally, I'd rather have your girlfriend's dip. But not my business either way.

Aren't we talking about pet peeves?

I reckon so. And one of mine is people sneering at other people's food preparation methods.

They have taken the oath of the brother in blood, in leavened bread and salt. Rudyard Kipling

I live in small town USA and here we have a lot of church related festivities through out the year. The ladies always donate sweets and food items to be sold for fund raising or give away as door prizes. I am amazed at the variety of items prepared, some loving made from scratch and some not so much. Canned apple pie filling and pre-made pie crust is not unusual, but there is s technique involved to make it.

Pumpkin pie cake, lemon bars, cakes of many different kinds each with their own "spin."

No it's not cooking. And not the way I would do it. What I don't understand is why it bothers you (and others here) so much when other people do it.

....

Aren't we talking about pet peeves?

I reckon so. And one of mine is people sneering at other people's food preparation methods.

You know I don't sneer. Some prepared food is better than home made probably. I enjoy KFC more than my home made fried chicken, especially when I screw up.

It does bother me as you say, but not as much as you're accusing me of. There's nothing wrong with combining prep foods and calling it dinner, but it's not really cooking. Just a few days ago I made chicken pot pie. Bought a whole roasted chicken from the grocery store, already cooked, and shredded it. Had a bag of frozen veggies (carrots, peas, corn, green beans), laid them on a cookie sheet along with some freshly chopped onion and roasted in the oven for 15 minutes. Made a roux, added some stock and a little half n half and combined it with the shredded chicken and roasted veggies. Covered it with a sheet of puff pastry and voila, chicken pot pie. Apparently the best chicken pot pie hubby ever ate he said. The only part of it that was homemade was the chicken stock which I keep in the freezer and the roux... big deal. I didn't cook the chicken, or the chop the veggies, or make the puff pastry. In my mind if someone compliments me for the chicken pot pie I can't take credit because it's basically prepared food thrown together while others would make believe that they were a chef to make it lol! So if I don't give myself credit and calling that cooking then I sure as heck won't give you credit for opening a couple of jars. Am I a snob? Probably.

Here's the question: How many of your not-really-cooking friends would have even thought to use those ingredients that way? I think that's the real difference. Unless one of the convenience-product companies posted it on one of their packages (in which case, it would likely call for cream of chicken soup rather than the sauce you made), it wouldn't occur to them. Good cooking consists of using good techniques to manipulate good

The crux of the matter, I believe, is where you talk about taking credit or not taking credit. Which brings us back to what I said: That we cook from scratch, using fresh ingredients, to please ourselves. There's a lot of ego in good cooking; a lot of pride.

The difference between us, I think, is that I want to be the best I can be for its own sake. I challenge myself to do a better job each time. But I don't really care if the people I serve (other than Friend Wife) notice the difference or not. At base, the only one I have to satisfy is myself.

If you had made all the components of that pie from scratch, would the finished product have looked or tasted any different? I don't see how it would have been. So the only difference is the way you percieve the process. It doesn't satisfy you as a cook because you didn't put all your heart and soul into it.

But you know what? Heart, and soul, and love, despite how much the TV cooking shows bombard us, are not real ingredients. They don't show up until somebody tastes the product. In this case, the taster declared it to be superb. Shouldn't that be all that matters?

Another question: Do you have any idea how many pre-made and convenience products are used in good restaurants? How many things come prepped by suppliers? How many canned, and frozen, and prepared ingredients? Yet, you wouldn't say the folks in those kitchens aren't cooking. So why are you harder on yourself than you'd be on a professional?

They have taken the oath of the brother in blood, in leavened bread and salt. Rudyard Kipling

OMG, Koukouvagia. No oregano! Of course its not homemade. Oh no you didn't just say oregano!

(Sorry folks. Private joke)

...

The crux of the matter, I believe, is where you talk about taking credit or not taking credit. Which brings us back to what I said: That we cook from scratch, using fresh ingredients, to please ourselves. There's a lot of ego in good cooking; a lot of pride. You're darn right, my ego is huge.

The difference between us, I think, is that I want to be the best I can be for its own sake. I challenge myself to do a better job each time. But I don't really care if the people I serve (other than Friend Wife) notice the difference or not. At base, the only one I have to satisfy is myself. Here's where we differ, few people can appreciate how much work goes into home cooking. I get annoyed by people who couldn't care less if the stock I use is Emeril's brand or my own home made brand. Last year a friend who came over for dinner couldn't understand why I'd bother whipping my own cream when Rediwhip is soooo much easier and comes out prettier. Cooking for people like that is a waste of time.

If you had made all the components of that pie from scratch, would the finished product have looked or tasted any different? I don't see how it would have been. So the only difference is the way you percieve the process. It doesn't satisfy you as a cook because you didn't put all your heart and soul into it. Aside from the puff pastry which I would never even attempt, yes I'm pretty sure it would have tasted better had I roasted my own chicken, and chopped some of my own veggies although probably only I could tell the difference.

But you know what? Heart, and soul, and love, despite how much the TV cooking shows bombard us, are not real ingredients. They don't show up until somebody tastes the product. In this case, the taster declared it to be superb. Shouldn't that be all that matters? Shrug. They're not real ingredients as you say.

Another question: Do you have any idea how many pre-made and convenience products are used in good restaurants? How many things come prepped by suppliers? How many canned, and frozen, and prepared ingredients? Yet, you wouldn't say the folks in those kitchens aren't cooking. So why are you harder on yourself than you'd be on a professional? Because I'm better than some professionals.

Sometimes that works, Chris. F'rinstance, we have restaurants, particular in the south, where they serve "a meat and two" or "a meat and three." The word meat is used generically, because it could be beef, or pork, or chicken.

But, in general, do you include poultry and fish in the term "meat,"? I don't. Nor, would I'd guess, do most people. I usually differentiate between wild game and domestic meat as well.

Don't get me wrong. I certainly agree that the word "protein" is overused, particularly by TV cooks, and especially by judges on cooking shows. When somebody is talking about a specific dish, and refers to the animal product in it as protein instead of as beef, or veal, or chicken, or whatever, that's just an affectation. But when talking about animal food products as a whole, I don't mind the word "protein" at all.

I think "protein" is a misleading word - it takes for granted that all protein comes from animals. What would you call pasta e ceci, or lentils and bread, or beans and rice? They're all strong protein dishes.

maybe "animal protein" would be better, or just "meat or fish"

"Siduri said, 'Gilgamesh, where are you roaming? You will never find the eternal life that you seek...Savour your food, make each of your days a delight, ... let music and dancing fill your house, love the child who holds you by the hand and give your wife pleasure in your embrace.'"

"Siduri said, 'Gilgamesh, where are you roaming? You will never find the eternal life that you seek...Savour your food, make each of your days a delight, ... let music and dancing fill your house, love the child who holds you by the hand and give your wife pleasure in your embrace.'"

I think "protein" is a misleading word - it takes for granted that all protein comes from animals.

My take is that just the opposite is true. When designating a "protein" as a part of a nutritionally balanced meal (the other parts possibly being carbs and vegetables) it could be anything from meat or fish to tofu, beans, seitan or some other vegetable based protein source.

In many an editorial meeting about menu development the word "meat" is used as a general term to refer to animal-based proteins, no matter which animal it might be.

"I think "protein" is a misleading word - it takes for granted that all protein comes from animals. What would you call pasta e ceci, or lentils and bread, or beans and rice?

They're all strong protein dishes. maybe "animal protein" would be better, or just "meat or fish"."

Siduri...when we talk about proteins in this way, we are referring to the animal protein.

The items you speak of would be referred to as starch.

In our world the plate is broken down into protein, starch, veg.

That's why the term is used as is

I guess we both are correct.......

Yeah, i understand the point, though if you're having pasta e ceci or lentils on bread, you would dispense with the animal protein, because you'd have plenty of protein. Also would a cooked cheese dish, like case gebacken (did i spell that right) or an omelette or some other non-meat animal protein be called a protein?

I guess the terms used in the sense of a balanced meal would be different from the terms used for a restaurant presentation.

My point was that there are plenty of proteins that wouldn't be animal in origin

"Siduri said, 'Gilgamesh, where are you roaming? You will never find the eternal life that you seek...Savour your food, make each of your days a delight, ... let music and dancing fill your house, love the child who holds you by the hand and give your wife pleasure in your embrace.'"

"Siduri said, 'Gilgamesh, where are you roaming? You will never find the eternal life that you seek...Savour your food, make each of your days a delight, ... let music and dancing fill your house, love the child who holds you by the hand and give your wife pleasure in your embrace.'"

" Cooking is a mirror of one´s being and if you feel in harmony with yourself and are driven by passion, you are positive and uplifting and thus, accomplish amazing tasks and your dishes shall shine with love and enjoyment ... "

2ndly, the most unfortunate action on the face of this earth, whether it is in a kitchen or any other place as far as I am concerned, the place is irrelevant, are the hateful crimes against humanity.

I like Marcella Hazan's general philosophy in her cookbooks, to use the best you can find or make and afford. Then, she goes on to show alternatives you can use, considering her books were first written in the 80s, for Americans to make Italian; what people could buy was limited in many areas. One example is her pasta e fagiole, she would like you to use homemade meat broth and fresh cranberry beans, but gives intructions for diluting canned broth and cooking times for dried or canned beans, as well. All come out good, but of course you taste the difference if you lucked out on fresh beans and made your own broth.

I don't know, it's give or take 5-or-6 to 1-am. I've just gotten home from working a shift at a Zagat rated Michelin * starred restaurant, on the salad station. It was interesting. << edited because I have a big fat stupid ego and I need to learn better "shut up" skills >> I am so very sorry, once again, that I never learned Spanish. I really hope I last here longer than March.

People who cook much too much food, like fear of running out of potato salad in parties.

Cold food thats meant to be eaten hot and vice-versa.

This is what makes us each our own. My pet peeve is going to someone's house for dinner and they barely made enough to feed 4 for a party of 8. When you politely take a small portion to allow for everyone to have some and secretly suffer from hunger pains for the rest of the evening and hope no one hears your stomach rumbling. I like to make twice as much as I think I'll need and as long as nothing goes to waste, I don't see a problem with it.

Having grown up on TV dinners, I hear you there. I don't think I would eat one today if you paid me.

OK. So I'm like ... 50 and all. I guess half my family is Italian, I grew up w/ Italian people, spent lots of time in Italian neighborhoods, and I make damned good, albeit Bohemianized, Italian food. That, in one example, being that I much prefer serving Kluski noodles as a side than any other style. Anyway ... I can't remember anyone using the word "gravy" for the word "sauce" ever. TV show people and wannabees at the grocery store are the only place. Oh yeah, Pauly Walnuts too.

Originally Posted by Koukouvagia...Carl Sagen perhaps said it best: "If you want to make an apple pie from scratch, first create the universe." However I choose to say "To make scrambled eggs from scratch, first lay an egg." Some things are just impossible to do.

I only just read this, months after you posted it and I hope that the boss here is not opposed to reviving old discussions.

So, what does "from scratch" mean? Is it not understood that no one is expected to create a universe or lay an egg herself (himself?!). I mean, really.

I happen to have chickens, who eat scraps from our kitchen, and whose eggs I use in recipes. But I am not fooling myself that only I am somehow baking an item "from scratch" whereas the cook who buys eggs from the supermarket, even though the rest of our labours is exactly the same, is not. Buying eggs from the store is the norm in this part of the world and raising your own chickens is not. Same with opening a can of tomato paste or sauce. I am not cooking from scratch merely because I took the trouble to grow tomatoes and then can or freeze them. You are still a "from scratch" cook even if you buy canned tomatoes from the store. Same with fishing, etc. Where is the dividing line?

Carl Sagan is just a blowhard in any case. Imagine a godless atheist yapping about creating (I think he really said "invent[ing]") the universe.

OK. So I'm like ... 50 and all. I guess half my family is Italian, I grew up w/ Italian people, spent lots of time in Italian neighborhoods, and I make damned good, albeit Bohemianized, Italian food. That, in one example, being that I much prefer serving Kluski noodles as a side than any other style. Anyway ... I can't remember anyone using the word "gravy" for the word "sauce" ever.TV show people and wannabees at the grocery store are the only place. Oh yeah, Pauly Walnuts too.

My claimed "nationality", by the way is "CHICAGO AMERICAN".

So ... I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'.

Ah, you've never been to NY or NJ that's why. And they don't call it sauce, they call it Sooooauce. Other newyork-ized italian words include mozzarel, prozzute, supersot, cannelone, raviole, it's too depressing to remember any more.

This is what makes us each our own. My pet peeve is going to someone's house for dinner and they barely made enough to feed 4 for a party of 8. When you politely take a small portion to allow for everyone to have some and secretly suffer from hunger pains for the rest of the evening and hope no one hears your stomach rumbling. I like to make twice as much as I think I'll need and as long as nothing goes to waste, I don't see a problem with it.

Having grown up on TV dinners, I hear you there. I don't think I would eat one today if you paid me.

I hear you and I would probably be pissed too if potato salad would be all they're serving up but realistically nobody plans a party serving only one food staple. I find that I rather enjoy whipping something last minute for an unexpected surge in the guest list rather than filling the fridge with trays of leftovers that would last me until mid-March!...Ham! How much ham can one person eat in one day?! And seriously, how many things can you do with leftover lasagna!?