Video: MS-13 gang vandalizes Vietnam vets memorial?

posted at 2:07 pm on December 31, 2007 by Bryan

New Haven (WTNH) _ Veterans are outraged that a war memorial in New Haven has been vandalized.

The Vietnam War Memorial at Long Wharf was spray painted with the threatening words “Kill whites MS 13.”

Seeing this just crushed the veterans we spoke to. The names on that wall that are covered in paint, are the names of those who fought and died for this country in the Vietnam War. Tonight, police are investigating whether this is the work of a violent street gang, but the veterans we spoke to, say whoever they are, aren’t as tough as they might think.

Whoever did it sprayed “MS-13″ all over the place. According to law enforcement, MS 13 is a violent international gang with roots in El Salvador. Members are involved in drug trafficking, weapons trafficking and even human trafficking and their presence is growing in the U-S. Just this summer, police in the Boston area did a big round-up of MS 13 gang members.

That said, New Haven police say there hasn’t been any documented MS-13 activity so far in the city. But they are investigating this incident.

Update: Lots of folks are saying this is a hoax, and that’s obviously a possibility (hence the question mark on the title of this post). Troll through this Flickr gallery of gang graffiti or Google it and you’ll see that MS-13′s stuff tends to be more ornate than this vandalism is. I’m not sure I see the point of running a false flag vandalism (and if it’s that and it’s similar to the noose hangings we’ve seen at college campuses lately, well, then some Vietnam vet vandalized it? That strikes me as unlikely. It also strikes me as unlikely that some lefty who dislikes veterans would vandalize it in a way that draws attention to a real threat.). But this being the work of MS-13 wanna be’s makes a lot of sense to me. It’s also possible, I suppose, that someone who dislikes MS-13 would do this to make them look bad. Hopefully the police will get to the bottom of it.

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It looks fake to me. Neon orange, wrong color. The font is not very MS-13 like, gang grafitti usually has some sort of distinct font. Not that I think this is beyond MS-13 but this smells of a ginned up controversy. Like the Black guy that hung a noose to try and protect his job.

Also the spelling, it is in English and correct. Notice the space between the t and e in whites? The person that spray painted this wanted to make sure it was legible, not the hallmark of a tagger, or gang grafitti.

It looks fake to me. Neon orange, wrong color. The font is not very MS-13 like, gang grafitti usually has some sort of distinct font. Not that I think this is beyond MS-13 but this smells of a ginned up controversy.

Agreed. Why New Haven? Why a Veterans’ Memorial? And why a Veterans’ Memorial… in New Haven? And then… why English? This seems pretty suspect as an MS13 vandal, but who knows. We’ll see what evidence comes forward.

To add to that, what’s the benefit for them? Why would they take time away from human smuggling, drugs, and killing people to vandalize a war memorial in New Haven? Then mark it, in plain English, in bright orange spray paint?

Yeah, I dunno, I agree with the other people who aren’t sure on this. I can’t say I’d be surprised if MS-13 did it, but something just doesn’t seem quite right, and given the number of false hate crimes of late, I’m not quite ready to rule that out.

Theworldisnotenough, I agree. Orange is not MS-13′s style. This would be in a highly stylized font, and it would be in blue and white, were it real. Blue and white being the national colors of El Salvador.

There were even instances in which Florencia 13 leaders ordered killings of black gangsters and then, when the intended victim couldn’t be located, said “Well, shoot any black you see,” Los Angeles County Sheriff Lee Baca said.

“In certain cases some murders were just purely motivated on killing a black person,” Baca said.

Just this summer, police in the Boston area did a big round-up of MS 13 gang members.

Doesn’t mean a thing.

We are simply not prepared or able to adequately attack extremely violent and well organized gangs like MS13.

Our policing and civil rights laws do not allow the means necessary to put even a dent in this next level of third world gang activity.
We can’t subdue the gangs here already, MS13 is much worse than our homegrown variety.

Other countries use their military with shoot on sight orders against MS13.
They’re being here is like turning loose a weasel in the hen house there’s very little to restrain their very heinous activities.

I think this just magnifies the need to ‘document’ our undocumented American cohabiters. I am sure the La Raza types will cry conspiricy. With the country polarized such as it is it would not suprise me if a simular incident would incite an actual clash of civilizations.

i think the group you forgot to consider were skinheads. heck, maybe even some quasi-minutemen-ish types, such as the guy in collorado who faked a video of himself picking off border crossers.

does anyone agree?

i’m from the new haven area myself, and i can say with some confidence that it’s more likely that some anti-immigration tweaker heard ms-13 for the 90000th time from lou dobbs than it is that there’s even one actual member of ms-13 cruising around new haven.

what there are plenty of is skkinheads, or enough of. and they’re ready and prepared to do exactly this sort of thing every bit as much as the lefty gwu prof with her clearly fake noose-hanging, and for the same reasons.

if this is skkinheads attempting to radicalize white conservatives and draw them into their “white revolution”…

They are just here to vandalize things Americans aren’t willing to vandalize. Actually they should be treated as insurgents and hunted down and shot where they stand.
TheSitRep on December 31, 2007 at 2:16 PM

Is looking at their facial tatoos racial profiling?
BL@KBIRD on December 31, 2007 at 2:18 PM

“GRING-GOS OUWA IRAQ!!!!!” (Laura Ingraham listeners will recognize that sound bite.)Yep, no border enforcement problem to see here. Not at all. A disgrace doesn’t even begin to cover it.
Hawkins1701 on December 31, 2007 at 2:28 PM

He’s the Illegal Immigrant, and he’s the 2007 Dallas Morning News Texan of the Year.
Unreal.

This s-word is for frigin real, not Texas troops at war, not any of the many honorable Texans, no. It is amazing Texas even prospered, even functioned as a state, before illegal immigration.
The DMNews sucks.

New Haven has an ANSWER chapter that meets once a week or so at some local church. They coordinate with the various “anti-war” and “immigrant rights” groups for rallies. I got on Answers mailing list to keep track of them and the New Haven meetings were going strong for at least a year. Though I haven’t heard from them recently. There was a lot of outreach to the illegal community, which was also a natural draw for MS-13.

ANSWER and the communist groups have a history of trying to co-opt gangs into their movement, and the largest Black prison gang is openly marxists. MS-13 may not be marxist, but they were targeted by death squads earliy in their formative years and may have developed some contacts in the communist circles. Campus activists in the CT school system are especially tied into Communist Latin America. At Wesleyan in Middletown CT just a year ago I saw students, led by a certain teacher, openly collecting money for Noriega and FARC. There was a small MS-13 presence in that college town.

So you guys are right saying MS-13 may not have done this, it may be that they have “freinds” in the other movements that got carried away. ANSWER or some related group probably is responsible, but the higher ups in ANSWER would know not to tag MS-13 on stuff san permission, since they know these people.

The orange paint is probably an allusion to the Close Gitmo campaign where activist wear orange.

My two cents, non MS-13 commies who are enjoying the protection of the real MS-13. Some heads will rolll but MS will be happy to take credit for defacing the memorial as it makes them look untouchable.

i think you’re pointed in the correct general direction, though i still think its skinheads.

the paint i think is the same stuff dot workers use to mark pavement. it may have been chosen for availibility. often in places where most spraypaint has been banned because of grafitti, the bright orange street-marking stuff stays legal. i’m not sure if that’s exactly the case in new haven or not.

You would think growing up by the beach would preclude one from having any involvement with gangs. It doesn’t. Unfortunately, I’ve known a lot of gang members.

I think this is somebody “frontin.” MS gangsters are known for violence, not graffiti. But when they do “get up” or tag, it’s always to claim territory. I have never personally seen any hardcore gang hitting up walls in safety orange…ever. (Some Crips and Blood sets will use blue or red respectively.)

The blanket “kill whites” sounds ridiculous. It’s unlikely that the gangs shot-callers would “green light” all white people, especially in a place like New Haven.

Also, there is never just one incident involving MS. If they are in the area, cops know it and residents do too. There is no guessing with Mara Salvatrucha. When they show up, you’ll know.

One thing I read in the thread that I will dispute is that there would be a stylized “font.” These cave scrawlings are not a font. OK, I have seen gangsters using ladders and scaffolding to paint 15-foot Old-English letters in broad daylight. And I’ve seen tag-bangers literally hanging from freeway signs to get their tag up in the “heavens.” Many take great pride in their art. But most of the graffiti is just pure chicken scratch. The lack of artistry does not denote lack of conviction.

You have to remember that some of the idiots can’t even read, much less care about penmanship and typography.

Theworldisnotenough, I agree. Orange is not MS-13’s style. This would be in a highly stylized font, and it would be in blue and white, were it real. Blue and white being the national colors of El Salvador.

otcconan on December 31, 2007 at 2:33 PM

You are incorrect. MS might, I repeat, might be seen in blue and white to represent their flag. But most tagging you see is in black simply for the fact that its visible on more surfaces. Also it’s an always available color in stores.

Is looking at their facial tatoos racial profiling?
BL@KBIRD on December 31, 2007 at 2:18 PM

If you’re looking for full-bleed tatted faces, look in the prisons or back in El Salvador. You will rarely see someone walking around with fully canvassed face, even in LA.

Don’t get me wrong. There are some thugs who do, but not just MS. Mexican gangs promote face, head and neck tattoos. In fact above-the-neck tattoos are becoming popular with white gangs and musicians too.

One side note is that all gangs are increasing their ranks of “clean” gangsters. These are the types of guys who end up working regular jobs, even important ones, but maintain some twisted allegiance to the set or hood.

But this being the work of MS-13 wanna be’s makes a lot of sense to me. It’s also possible, I suppose, that someone who dislikes MS-13 would do this to make them look bad. Hopefully the police will get to the bottom of it.

I do not even think it is wanna be’s. The safety orange and spelling are a dead give away, even wanna be’s know how to fake graffiti. This in my opinion is an obvious forgery perpetrated by someone that is anti-Hispanic.

I dislike illegal immigration and the problems that come with it as much as anyone that comments here. This represents a line in the sand between bigotry and legitimate reasons for not wanting amnesty and enforcing current immigration laws.

The only other explanation that makes sense is someone from the left faked it in such an obvious fashion to smear the nativists that will go to any extent to get rid of brown people.

I do not even think it is wanna be’s. The safety orange and spelling are a dead give away, even wanna be’s know how to fake graffiti. This in my opinion is an obvious forgery perpetrated by someone that is anti-Hispanic.

I dislike illegal immigration and the problems that come with it as much as anyone that comments here. This represents a line in the sand between bigotry and legitimate reasons for not wanting amnesty and enforcing current immigration laws.

The only other explanation that makes sense is someone from the left faked it in such an obvious fashion to smear the nativists that will go to any extent to get rid of brown people.

Theworldisnotenough on December 31, 2007 at 5:28 PM

Oh puuuulllleeeeeze!!! Here in SOCAL, nobody has to do anything like this to make MS-13 look bad….believe me.

My take is a political dirty trick. The Dems have been touting how they picked up more of the Hispanic vote in 2006.

Someone just hopes this blows up for a lot of attention to drive a wedge between conservative military supporters and Hispanics by getting someone to make over the top accusations about Hispanics which seem to be getting impersonated in this case.

MS is not the major gang entity in So Cal. La eme controls all latino gang activity in So Cal. MS runs a small area near downtown LA.

From what I’ve seen, they are reported on more nationally than locally. They have a a bigger rep natonally than locally. So Cal is all about the Mexican Mafia as far as gangs go.

Until the feds started investigating racial attacks, the archetype LA Gang was 18th St. They were considered the largest and best-known.

Can you point me to some So Cal reporting on MS activity? I am interested in the coverage. Thanks.

The Race Card on December 31, 2007 at 6:39 PM

Really? I was on jury duty, 10 years ago, for a gang shooting by an MS-13 member. The trial lasted 14 days. Let me tell you, we jurors got quite an education about gang activity in SOCAL. I’ll just say you’re underestimating their activity in the L.A. area. And I know all about 18th Street, White Fence, VNE, F-Troop, La Moriya, La eme, etc…

I think it’s pretty well established in the comments that it’s a hoax. But that hoaxer better hope the cops or some veterans find him before MS13 does… When MS13 wants to make a point, they’re more liable to cut off your head then tag a memorial.

Sad, no matter who’s responsible. I lived there in the ’80s. Used to be a fun small-to-mid sized city to be in: access to arts, beachfront parks, some kulchah, a hot rock dance club near the heart of Yale, a great bacon cheeseburger ’round the corner from that, plus one could enjoy a safe walk (alone, even) across the green after clubs closed to peruse books at the Atticus Book Shop. By all accounts, it has declined terribly between gangs, corrupt politicos and lefty politics. Or maybe that was always the case and I was just not paying close enough attention. I just know I won’t be in a hurry to show my young son my former stomping grounds on our next return to my home state.

New Haven recently passed a law allowing creation of “ID”‘s for illegal immigrants http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,278552,00.html.
Perhaps this vandalism was indeed created by anti-illegal immigrant (NOT “anti-immigrant”) trouble makers to as some skeezy attempt to make it look like Hispanics are a dangerous threat to locals…