Thursday, January 06, 2005

First, they ignore you.

Then, you're proven right. But it doesn't make any difference, because they control the spin, and by now they're lying about something else, anyway.

A whole lot of sensible knickers are getting twisted over some folks questioning the provenance of the earthquake and tsunami. Look, for instance, at this story: "Conspiracy theorists see dark forces behind tsunami disaster":

In bars and Internet chatrooms around the world questions are being asked, with knowing nods and winks, about who caused the submarine earthquake off Sumatra on December 26, and why governments were so slow to act in the minutes and hours before tsunamis slammed into their shores, killing almost 150,000.

"There's a lot more to this. Why is the US sending a warship? Why is a senior commander who was in Iraq going there?" whispered designer Mark Tyler, drinking a pint of beer at a bar in Hong Kong's Wan Chai district.

"This happened exactly a year after Bam," said Tyler, referring to the earthquake in Iran which killed 30,000 on December 26 last year. "Is that a coincidence? And there was no previous seismic activity recorded in Sumatra before the quake, which is very strange," he said, nodding somberly.

...

Among the more common suggestions is that eco-weapons which can trigger earthquakes and volcanoes remotely through the use of electromagnetic waves were being tested.

You gotta love that Lone Gunmen colour. I wonder how many "knowing nods and winks" the author really saw, or if the conspiracist truly "whispered." Democratic Underground was singled out this week by The New York Times and FoxNews for posts which asked whether there might be more than nature at play. That the US mainstream - and it doesn't get more mainstream than those two - would pick over an anonymous message board for "extreme" examples of free speech was silly enough. (Unbalanced, too: when has either singled out examples of the grotesque ignorance and bloodlusting hate on sites such as "Free Republic"?) Compounding the silliness with a dispiriting concession to those who are forever permitted to frame the debate, DU's administrators have now banned "Kooky Tsunami Conspiracy Theories," though every relevent post merely questioned whether a human agency was possible, and tried to raise awareness of the military's interest in weaponizing the forces of nature. This, despite the fact not a single death can be attributed to "Kooky Tsunami" theories; unlike, say, the Kooky WMD Theories popularized and unretracted by the Times and FoxNews. (And, as was to be expected, the call has already gone out from DU's perpetually embarrassed handwringing moderates to further constrict the freespeech zone: "Can we extend this to 'Kooky 9/11 Conspiracy Theories' too?")

If it's a kooky theory, and it involves killing people, you can be sure the Pentagon is there. In 1997, then-Secretary of Defense William Cohen admitted to taking seriously the threat of seismic weapons in the hands of terrorists. Even the hypothetical possibility of triggering "earthquakes, volcanoes remotely through the use of electromagnetic waves" was cause for the Pentagon's concern. What does that suggest regarding the Pentagon's level of interest towards the research and development of its own seismic weapon system?

And not just the Pentagon. In his autobiography Through the Eyes of the Enemy, Lt Col Stanislav Lunev - the highest ranking defector from Soviet military intelligence - acknowledges that the USSR was developing and testing seismic weapons in the mid-1980s. (The Amazon editorial review notes that the book "could be dismissed as fantastic paranoid ravings were the source not so credible and the ramifications not so severe.") Also Akif Gasanov, a former KGB intelligence officer, claims to have seen evidence of Soviet tectonic weaponry 20 years ago:

GASANOV: I became aware of this subject quite by accident in 1985. I was working in the Second Department (counterintelligence) in the linear branch of Western espionage. I needed some new assistants to "set up" foreign diplomats. We would usually select these people from among intellectuals who were of interest to the Western special services. ...The information I received seemed fantastic. Certain scientists at the Academy of Sciences were working on problems associated with earthquakes. There was a certain Ikram Kerimov and a group of his associates, the most notable of whom was Dzhafar Dzhafarov, son of Khady Dzhafarov, the well-known [Azerbaijani Petrochemical Institute] professor.

Ikram Kerimov asserted that they could control and initiate earthquakes. Moreover, he said they had theoretical justification for their assertions and were attempting to obtain minimal financing in the academic sphere. In their opinion, there were grounds to believe that a number of earthquakes that had occurred recently may well have been initiated through a remote control device or accidentally triggered directional influence on the Earth's core. We collected materials that might prove factually relevant, then drew up and submitted our report to the center.... It would usually take a month or more to process information. On this occasion, however, we received a conclusion very quickly. The assessment was fairly high for internal USSR information. It was treated as intelligence information. There was an immediate request to prepare the most extensive possible analytical reference package on the material and send it to the VPK (military-industrial complex). As a result of VPK study, a very high assessment was given. Scientists were then brought to Moscow to elaborate the subject matter. According to main information, an outstanding environment was created for them. They were afforded almost unlimited financing and the ability to conduct experiments.

...In the late 1980s, a series of earthquakes took place encompassing a vast territory -- from India to Central Asia. Accusations of the use of tectonic weapons and directed towards the Soviet Union appeared in the Western press at that time. Our scientists who had participated in the development of tectonic weapons declined to give a response to all questions dealing with the nature of these earthquakes.

Then there's Dennis Kucinich's Space Preservation Act. As tabled before Congress on October 2, 2001, it defined "exotic weapons" as those "designed to damage space or natural ecosystems (such as the ionosphere and upper atmosphere) or climate, weather, and tectonic systems with the purpose of inducing damage or destruction upon a target population or region on earth or in space." But be careful to whom you mention it. No evidence is enough for some who need to deny the hidden High Weirdness of our world.

The same goes for weather modification, mind control, remote viewing - heck, even attempting to kill with a stare and walk through walls. The deep black world of military-intelligence R&D is all real, all crazy, all the time. And that's just the part we know about. There is no greater conspiracy theorist than the US defence establishment, and its kooky theorizing has the benefit of God knows how many trillions of unaudited dollars to see its theories become practice. What has it left us to not question?

Here's a tsunami conspiracy story even the Times and Fox wouldn't ridicule, because they would likely commend it:

The massive US-led relief operation in tsunami-hit Asia is expected to give the American military greater clout in the region and bolster counterterrorism efforts, analysts say. Backed by an array of US warships, planes and helicopters, more than13,000 US military personnel have been dispatched to help Indonesia, Thailand and Sri Lanka, the countries most affected by the December 26 disaster.Conducting its largest operation in Asia since the Vietnam War, the US military could remain in the region for up to six months, analysts said here Tuesday.... US forces are also using Thailand's Vietnam war-era air base of Utapao as an airlift hub for the humanitarian mission in the region, strengthening potential US military logistical support throughout southeast Asia.

The emergency relief operations appear to provide a windfall opportunity for beefing up the American military presence in Southeast Asia, part of the expanding Pentagon strategy of "forward positioning,"establishing sites, so-called "air cargo hubs, "where American forces can stash equipment and enter and leave as desired."

Myself, I think it's most likely the earthquake and tsunami occurred naturally, but I can't say with certainty. And certainty about the natural world is something I miss.

By the way, all those who wonder whether there's something fishy about David Corn, and all those who don't, really ought to read Andres Kargar's "A Mole in the Progressive Movement"? Corn does more damage to the left than a hundred thousand "Bush caused the tsunami!" threads.

1287 Comments:

Anonymous said...

The reaction of the DU admins is sad and inappropriate. With this kind of action (banning threads containing "cooky conspiracy theory") they stifle free speech. Conspiracies do exist, and some of them sound cooky at first. A site like DU is a place for ad hoc discussions, not for scientific discussions where every statement must meet high standards. Many posts on DU are well-researched. DU should be able and strong enough to tolerate even cooky conspiracy theories, given the wealth of interesting and thoughtful material that is posted there as well -- that is, up to now.The decision to ban certain tsunami-threads indeed sets a dangerous precedent for censorship.

How's this for a "kooky" conspiracy theory? At least 19 guys hijack 4 airliners and destroy the World Trade Center & part of the Pentagon. That is why I no longer dismiss most conspiracy theories out of hand. Unless it's Robertson or Dobson telling me about them...

On page 550 of Mike Rupperts book,Crossing The Rubicon,the map of Indochinese oil shipping routes are a carbon copy of the area of the tsunami's wrath......Oh speaking of odd......WesternGeco is jointly owned with Baker-Hughes...Yeah,THAT Baker.....I believe WesternGeco is the most advanced seismic concerns among the world?

The thing that really gives me pause in this tsunami thing is how the US military has moved in so quickly to give "relief". Even assuming that the tsunami was caused naturally, it is disturbing to see the US continue to expand its military presence.

And given that there was clearly research on tectonic weapons, and that it is entirely conceivable that nuclear weapons detonated in the right place could upset tectonics, that there are oil shipping routes in that region, AND that psychopaths that have taken over the US government we have to be open to the most sinister possibilities .

"We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you're studying that reality -- judiciously, as you will -- we'll act again, creating other new realities..." WH aide.

we are seeing the "other" new realities being created, right before our eyes, but most will refuse to accept it. Maybe i am too far gone on the darkside but that tsunami of 20004/12/26 (remember GG and his 26/27?) has all the hallmarks of a pre-meditated event.

I am playing a little game/experiment with myself: based on my hypothesis, i make predictions (for tomorrow, next week, next month) and check them against the actual unfolding reality. This is a rare oppurtunity for us (darksiders) since we are mostly looking backward with the data in already inhand. One word to the cognizant: Australia.

"(And, as was to be expected, the call has already gone out from DU's perpetually embarrassed handwringing moderates to further constrict the freespeech zone: "Can we extend this to 'Kooky 9/11 Conspiracy Theories' too?")"

I see that comment was made by the putative Air Traffic Controller MercutioATC-- the guy who seems to hang around 9/11 threads a lot mostly to debunk them. I actually exchanged some messages with him, and found he completely buys the official hijacking story. I tried to push him a little him on the logic and he got more and more uptight. Anyway, I am not surprised he's the one who made that comment!

cross-posted from http://www.vivelecanada.ca/article.php/20050104132511460

I don't think it was HAARP or a nuke. We would have seen a mushroom could if it was a nuke. Scalar weapon, possibly.

Likely, this was the price paid for tens of years of nuclear testing by the US in the South Pacific, which likely altered long-term plate tectonics.

Possibly, though, it has to do with vocanic eruptions and the Transit of Venus, which occured in 2004. When the Krakatoa volcano went in indonesia in 1882 it was preceeded by a Transit of Venus. I mean, look at all the volcanoes in Indonesia volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/volc_images/southea .

I'm not saying that the Transit of venus CAUSES seismic activity, only that the two are associated. Perhaps the interaction of planetary magnetic fields changes the Earth's gravity.

What we really need to be concerned about is the possibility of an aftershock - the contaigion effect.

Note that the BBC yesterday announced that it was pulling its huge-budget docu-drama "SUPERVOLCANO" out of "respect for the victims of the Tsunami".

feeds.bignewsnetwork.com/?sid=dddbd06f60458a63

Maybe it was out of concern for the financial markets. If they caught wind of the true epicenter of this earthquake and how close it was to the Toba Caldera, there would certainly be a contaigion effect in the financial markets.

We don't want people learning about things like the 1997 UN Treaty on Weather Modificationwww.fas.org/nuke/control/enmod/text/environ2.htm

Nor do we want people learning about Ecological Warfare

www.ecologynews.com/cuenewsdesk.html

People are paranoid enough as it is.

Although, it would make sense to ask "Who Benefits?". The oil in Aceh is of geostrategic importance and the US is going to capitalize no matter what.

Ever wonder, though, if ecological warfare is a "Safe" alternative to nuclear warfare? As long as South Asia's most populous Muslim Nation believes it was a natural disaster, then Iran won't be pushing its nuke button any time soon.

ya, i think i'm gonna take DU off my link list...i thought it was a joke at first when i reading the story....what do they think, that they are big time cause they were mentioned in the nyt? do they think they are gonna get a gold star from the heathers? most likely kicked harder after they smell weakness...how sad, hopefully they come to there senses soon.

concerning earthquakes:There was an expedition of scientists who went to the place everybody had thought was the origin of an earleir sea-earthquake. They expected to find major rifts in the seabottom, they could not find anything and were very surprised. Those scientists explained it to themselves in the way, that they probably went down in the wrong place and they had miscalculated the place of origin of the earthquake. I´m sorry that I can´t remember the details and I can´t find the article any more either. But it was posted only a few days before the Dec 26 Tsunami-earthquake.

concerning counterproductive leftwingers like David Corn:I just read the last fearmongering article from Ruppert of FTW.

He kind of says nuclear war and devastation is inevitable. He reiterates his mantra of peak-oil, peak-oil and now combines it with the inevitable dollar-crash. And he suggests: stock a little food, get gold instead of dollars and be nice to your next-door neighbours.And he calls the whole thing emergency warning.

Alright I will give Ruppert the benifit of doubt, maybe he was duped himself by agents who undermined his project.However I have real difficulties to see integrity in somebody who propagates population-reduction as a remedy for the world´s ills.There is so much profit-span between production costs of oil and selling prize, that even the deep-soil Russian oil gives good profits. And even if oil was deminishing, gas and alternative energies could take over in a few years.The crisis of peak-oil is an artifical not a natural one.So what Ruppert and other peak-oilers are propagating is:America and most ordinary Americans will go down in hunger and extreme poverty unless America is taking over the alledged last an best reserves of energy in th world. He also alledges that there are too many people on earth and there should be done something to reduce(genocide) them.However, if you think logically you already know, that the problem for the environment is not people per se, but the wasteful economy of the consumer-societies of the West. By changing the aspects of waste and the way we produce energy we could reduce environmental damage to a minimum without loosing real life-quality.Some European countries are starting the process, however under the pressure of the economic powers they haven´t gone as far as they could have by now.One other thing population density in most third world countries is far below population density in Europe.And inspite of this is Europe able to feed itself and even over-produce. Europe had a big population growth in 19. and beginning 20. century and it has stopped and is reversing since 1960.Economic security would stop population growth in third world countries as it has stopped it in Europe. Clean and alternativ methods of production which are already available in Europe could help third world countries to economic security without a lot of environmental hazards.To propagate war and chaos as unavoidable for natural reasons is playing into the hands of the greedy sociopaths who are in power of most of the world right now. There are problems ahead but we could solve them without violence, but war always gives far more profit and it always helps to concentrate wealth in the hands of the sociopathic warprofeteers. Right now they are planning a global police-state with a reduced and subdued population where everything from entertainment to food and water is controled by corporations.

Erlenda:This is not exactly what you were refering to re earthquakes but ...it is from Joe Vialls, 5 Jan (i think)

"To make any sense at all of the irregularities, we must start at the very beginning, and then follow the course of events as they unfold, especially events in the immediate vicinity of the real tsunami epicenter, because the latter is quite different from the location being remorselessly peddled by the New York Times and CNN.

At midday local Australian time I faithfully recorded the magnitude and position plotted by the Jakarta Geophysical Office in Indonesia. An earthquake measuring 6.4 on the Richter scale had hit the north of the Indonesian island of Sumatra. The Jakarta Geophysical Office meticulously noted that the epicenter of the event was located 155 miles south-southwest of Aceh Province.

This location is approximately 250 miles south of the position later selected by the American NOAA, which plotted the epicenter to the north-west of Aceh, and initially claimed a Richter reading of 8.0. Alas, even that was not enough to cover the damage caused by this extraordinary event, so NOAA progressively upgraded the reading to 8.5, then to 8.9, and finally to 9.0 - at least for the present."

No sooner has DU adopted a policy to self-censor any speculation around the Tsunami, the Jerusalem Post goes and publishes an article repeating what an Egyptian newspaper is alleging: that the Quake was caused by a joint Israeli-Indian nuclear experiment with American scientists involved.

"Since 1992, the magazine argued, leading geological centers in Britain, Turkey and other countries, warned of the need "not to hold nuclear experiments in the region of the Indian Ocean known as 'the Fire Belt,' in which the epicenter of the earthquake lies.

Geologists labeled that region 'The Fire Belt' for being "a dangerous terrain that can move at anytime, without human intervention," Al-Osboa' wrote.

Despite warnings not to carry out nuclear experiments in and around the 'Fire Belt', "Israel and India continue to conduct nuclear tests in the Indian Ocean, and the United States has recently decided to carry out similar tests in the Australian deserts, which is included in the 'Fire Belt', the Egyptian weekly magazine wrote.

"Last year only, Arab and Islamic states have asked the United States to stop its nuclear activities in that region, and to urge Israel and India to follow suite," Al-Osboa' reported. "

Again, I suppose that it's no coincidence that the BBC pulled its Supervolcano movie.

"... as mentioned in Part IX of this series, a Senate sub-committee hearing, chaired by Senator Claiborne Pell, stated that: "We need a treaty now...before the military leaders of the world start directing storms, manipulating climates and inducing earthquakes against their enemies." Senator Pell would not have spoken these words in 1975 about inducing earthquakes unless he had some knowledge that such technology existed.

"Also, reported in Part IX of this series, on December 10, 1976, the General Assembly of the United Nations approved the 'Convention of the Prohibition of Military or any Other Hostile Use of Environmental Modification Techniques,' and issued a report. Again, such a report would not have been issued if there were not technology in place capable of environmental modification, including the ability to induce earthquakes."