I've been watching the Gimelstob interview again where she talks about spending much more time working on her fitness than she spends time on the tennis court. But she also admits that she has to expand her repertoire and improve her service and her return. How she can work on that in the gym, I don't know. I'm not being cynical and I'm sure that she's a hard worker, but going by those comments it seems logical to think that she doesn't spend that much time on improving those things that she herself admits need improving.

Quite, but we don't really know if her team have the answers to the problems, some of the stuff is technical (serve, volleys etc.). What I find worrying is outside of fitness, most of the technical parts of her game have declined (the serve, backhand, forehand depth and steadiness, though arguably her offensive forehand is in better shape). I mean what is going on, obviously some of it is confidence based, you play better when confident, and I imagine Caro's confidence is shot right now, but some of it is just strange.

The thing is just being a hard worker isn't enough at the top level. Most the top players are hard workers (some exceptions, but in general), you have to be working in a clear direction, have a clear picture of what you are trying to do, maximising what you have.

With Caro, one question that hasn't been asked, and it will never be asked to Caro, but I would like to see it asked to the journalists who want to see her play this aggressive game. What is the plan to implement this vs the other big hitters? Caro can't conistently hit winners from the baseline and behind it, she likes to construct her points, eventually working her opening and a short ball to then attack. The problem is I can't see how any of this happens vs the games bigger hitters. She doesn't have (and is never likely to have) a big serve or a big return, she's often on the back foot from the start of these rallies. The core of her game imo vs these players is always going to be her defensive game.

Who knows what she truly means. Obviously if you take it at face value it's a nonsense right now. Because apparently many players outside the top 60 are continually too good for Caro. It came across as a line to sort of defend her decline, but in reality doesn't come across very well. As a whole though I did think the bits from Caro did come across as disappointing. She talked about waiting for her time to come because some players won't be around forever (obviously Serena), and she thinks eventually her time will come in grand slams, it doesn't necessarily have to be this year.

Even though the final decision came from ATP as a board. It was effectively forced by player power. Could you imagine a Masters 1000 in Madrid without Rafael Nadal (and Novak Djokovic to a lesser extent), the uproar it would cause. If Nadal says he isn't coming unless red clay is used, they're left with no choice.

As for the latter part,I'm just glad that the organizations can usually pull weight on the tourneys rather than the other way around...even though Accountability will never be important enough in the coddling WTA for it to implement my Shit List Plan

Burisleif is correct that there's a degree of arrogance in pretending to know what Caroline,or anyone we don't truly know,is thinking,but when we actually witness a televised interview,we can sometimes use behavioral psychology analytical skills to read someone's body language or voice tone.It's not an exact science yet can work effectively,at times

Whoops, wrong thread, I mistakenly thought this was the Caro fan player section...

Quote:

Originally Posted by OhNaNa

I really don't get this, everyone over analysing every detail of Caro's game, life, coaching selection etc.
There's nothing we can do about it but support Caro as her fans. It just makes you miserable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitten Kitten

my same thought

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasminefu623

my friend and i are also caro's fans.

sometimes we think maybe caro think that, her career is almost perfect, she want GS, but even if she can't get one at last, she still has an amazing career, she's year end number for 2 years.

she is rich, she had reached many ppl's goal for their whole life, travel around the world, being famous, has a good bf, has nice cars and house, provide good life for her parents, and most important, live her dream.

maybe we will never see the caro in 2009/2010/2011, since caro may not have the motivation to do that again, when she's on court now, i can only feel that she wanna left asap.

just wanna share some of my opinion.

I'm quoting these posts because I agree, and because I think we've been a bit spoiled by Caro's success and sometimes forget how much she's achieved. It's been really fun to follow her career, and she's given us so much pleasure since her junior days.

She cracked the top 20 one month after her 18th birthday - and has stayed there ever since (245 consecutive weeks now, if I'm not mistaken) - while some of her very talented contemporaries from the junior days like Cirstea, Paszek, Morita, Ula Radwanska, Rybarikova, or the slightly older Wozniak, are all still hoping to break into the top 20 one day.

I'd also like to mention Pavlyuchenkova who possibly seemed even more talented than Caro during the junior days winning three GS titles and defeating Caro in a AO final. She was a year-end No. 1 in front of Caro despite being a year younger. I quite like Pavlyuchenkova, and she's become a very good player by any WTA standard. But she's not made it into the top 10 yet (where Caro has spend almost 200 weeks), and she only has one fifth of Caro's career earnings and titles.

Caro is obviously not in the form of 2009-11 at the moment, but she still makes an IW final. Most players, bar a handful of GOATS, would give their right arm for an IW final!

I certainly acknowledge that this is a discussion forum, and every aspect can be discussed as far as I'm concerned (I might even join in with my own theories). I just think we could be a little more grateful for what we've got instead of being angry with her for what she hasn't given us yet or being angry with her for living a live with a boyfriend. I'm sure she'll be back at a level near her 2010 form when (or if?) she finds the motivation to go all in for her sport. Of course I don't really know if she lacks motivation, that's just my (and most people's) assumption.

I totally agree, we got pretty spoiled over 2010-2011 and started to take what she was showing as some kind of standard performance. But it was not standard, this was high-level,top-class. As for me I realise that she is not on that level anymore but she is still a great player. Hopefully she'll rediscover that missing ingredient which helped her to get to the top back in her heyday.

Yeah, we were spoiled by the amount of success she had, the amount of effort she put into her matches. Even thou she was #1, in a slam final, a point from a 2nd slam final, she still took criticism for not winning a major early in her career.

That always made for a lot of discussion. Now she's just not as successful as she was. Not as consistent.
Lot of critics predicted this fall, so maybe it was inevitable.

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As for the latter part,I'm just glad that the organizations can usually pull weight on the tourneys rather than the other way around...even though Accountability will never be important enough in the coddling WTA for it to implement my Shit List Plan

Burisleif is correct that there's a degree of arrogance in pretending to know what Caroline,or anyone we don't truly know,is thinking,but when we actually witness a televised interview,we can sometimes use behavioral psychology analytical skills to read someone's body language or voice tone.It's not an exact science yet can work effectively,at times

When I said "she thinks" in my post. Those words are near exact quotes from Caro (I've obviously modified them into my post).

Yeah, we were spoiled by the amount of success she had, the amount of effort she put into her matches. Even thou she was #1, in a slam final, a point from a 2nd slam final, she still took criticism for not winning a major early in her career.

That always made for a lot of discussion. Now she's just not as successful as she was. Not as consistent. Lot of critics predicted this fall, so maybe it was inevitable.

It was perhaps inevitable that there would come better players than she was in 2010-2011, but that she herself was a better player at 19 than at 22 is another matter. In other words, it was inevitable that Caroline would be no longer in the top three at this point, simply because Serena, Vika and Maria are better now than Caro was back then. But there's no reason why she now should be struggling to stay in the top 10.

I totally agree, we got pretty spoiled over 2010-2011 and started to take what she was showing as some kind of standard performance. But it was not standard, this was high-level,top-class. As for me I realise that she is not on that level anymore but she is still a great player. Hopefully she'll rediscover that missing ingredient which helped her to get to the top back in her heyday.

We were spoiled rotten in 2009-2011, that's for sure. But that's how it goes in sports. Your current form is always compared to the best you ever had to offer, and the better you are/were the more people expect.

It was perhaps inevitable that there would come better players than she was in 2010-2011, but that she herself was a better player at 19 than at 22 is another matter. In other words, it was inevitable that Caroline would be no longer in the top three at this point, simply because Serena, Vika and Maria are better now than Caro was back then. But there's no reason why she now should be struggling to stay in the top 10.

It's a shame that she doesn't have her old form at them moment, we could have witnessed a lot of exciting matches amongst her and these players. On the other hand, tennis has its eras. Caro had hers and it's someone else's now.

It was perhaps inevitable that there would come better players than she was in 2010-2011, but that she herself was a better player at 19 than at 22 is another matter. In other words, it was inevitable that Caroline would be no longer in the top three at this point, simply because Serena, Vika and Maria are better now than Caro was back then. But there's no reason why she now should be struggling to stay in the top 10.

I think if she could play like the Kerber match at IW consistently, she would be in the top 4 and would have had a good chance at this year's AO.
She had to beat Sveta, Stephens an injured Li... and Vika, who struggled with Hampton & wasnt playing well
But the last few weeks are clear that she cant play consistently at that level anymore, even IW she didnt play a QF and only Kerber among the top 10 to make the final.
What she was doing was very high level consistency, and she was #1 a long time. But thats over, and now she has established a new form and its around #10

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The most wasted of all days is one without laughter....
Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit thereEnjoy This Moment!!
HEALTH and HAPPINESS to EVERYONE

When I said "she thinks" in my post. Those words are near exact quotes from Caro (I've obviously modified them into my post).

Oh yeah,I'd already figured that that's what you did;what I was referring to was when fans extrapolate lots of deep meaning from some of Caro's simple,short presser statements...or when they assume her complete mindset based on her career arc(though it's true that,often,actions speak much louder than words).

I'd still be interested to know exactly what she meant when she said that certain others were 'too good',so maybe we'll get lucky here and get a clarification at the next all-access

I think if she could play like the Kerber match at IW consistently, she would be in the top 4 and would have had a good chance at this year's AO.
She had to beat Sveta, Stephens an injured Li... and Vika, who struggled with Hampton & wasnt playing well
But the last few weeks are clear that she cant play consistently at that level anymore, even IW she didnt play a QF and only Kerber among the top 10 to make the final.
What she was doing was very high level consistency, and she was #1 a long time. But thats over, and now she has established a new form and its around #10

^ I don't know about all that making that far at the AO If she played the way she played in Kerber match, Her consistently great and that something she need too re find again and have for all her matches but like i said early she can't just depend on her consistency and not making many errors win, don't get me wrong she need too cut the on the error becoause she have been lately making a ton and that been cause her too lose match but at the same token she need a weapon which I think she need too improve on her serve

She lost to Kuznetsova twice in Australia, Sveta didnt get past round 3 in IW or Miami, now lost badly in Portugal.
Its just the way Caroline plays now. Any noncontender in any early round can beat her. She used to be the best at fighting deep into draws. She cant do it anymore, whatever the reason is

__________________
The most wasted of all days is one without laughter....
Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit thereEnjoy This Moment!!
HEALTH and HAPPINESS to EVERYONE

Oh yeah,I'd already figured that that's what you did;what I was referring to was when fans extrapolate lots of deep meaning from some of Caro's simple,short presser statements...or when they assume her complete mindset based on her career arc(though it's true that,often,actions speak much louder than words).

I agree. We often read too much into what's being said. On the other hand, I sometimes have the feeling that Caro and her camp are not sure themselves what's going on. Piotr or Caro may say she's spending too much time with sponsors and advertising, or that she's not been "hungry" but is now motivated again, or that she has ruined her game trying to alter it too much at once. But people are not very good at analyzing themselves. And I'm not sure whether Caro/Piotr/Adidas/ or anyone else really has the best solution to her current lack of form, if we can call it that.

I also agree regarding your parenthetical remark. One very obvious example was when Caro was on her way up and was "flirting" on court with Kader. When she was struggling a bit more with her form a couple of years later she was arguing with him.

She lost to Kuznetsova twice in Australia, Sveta didnt get past round 3 in IW or Miami, now lost badly in Portugal.
Its just the way Caroline plays now. Any noncontender in any early round can beat her. She used to be the best at fighting deep into draws. She cant do it anymore, whatever the reason is