[quote="flightless"][quote="topknot"]CAN WE GET THIS THREAD BACK ON TOPIC PLEASE![/quote]

OK, since I feel some amount of guilt for being off topic and flirting (hi Tiahaar). And since I'm taking the day off from work and watching the snow here in New England.
Back on topic: While I do like the idea of an open play space sort of camp, I agree with many posters that some rules have to be adhered to. The sheer number of people at BM and the sheer number of tourists makes that a necessity. As a bi man with a (mostly) straight wife, I can tell you from experience that too many people _assume_ that it's ok to touch, join, whatever. I can't imagine that anything good could come from a party with no clear rules and no one to enforce them. I have had to get physical with a few people who didn't feel the need to ask, and I do not like to get physical in that sense. It really distracts from the energy and love (or lust).
So topknot, we like the idea. But we are also aware of the potential for problems.
Best of luck. We look forward to seeing you on the playa.

theCryptofishist wrote:Does anyone else think that someone who's made a habit of dating sex workers shouldn't allow himself to be freaked out by others' sexualities?

For myself, one of the first things being sex positive requires is accepting other folk's kinks. I may not be into them, they may even send an uncomfortable shiver down my spine (being 'squicked,') but as long as consenting adults are present, it's all good with me.

Ron, who know about the world of hankie codes but was keeping it simple to illustrate a point...;)

theCryptofishist wrote:Does anyone else think that someone who's made a habit of dating sex workers shouldn't allow himself to be freaked out by others' sexualities?

For myself, one of the first things being sex positive requires is accepting other folk's kinks. I may not be into them, they may even send an uncomfortable shiver down my spine (being 'squicked,') but as long as consenting adults are present, it's all good with me.

That's pretty much where I stand too. I'm sorry about the sex worker comment, because that wasn't what was particularly bothering me--except in the sence that I know he's watched at least one of them get flack for it, and he was flacking the hankycoders.

After much reflection, I've decided that I was outraged that someone who benefits greatly from the sex-positive tone of this board, could turn around and add a sex negative tone. I treasure sex-positive space, because it is scarce, and it felt like an attack on a treasure. I didn't put my objections in the most cojent or fair manner adn I'm sorry, but I'm glad I stood up and said something, rather than let it slide.

The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

theCryptofishist wrote:Does anyone else think that someone who's made a habit of dating sex workers shouldn't allow himself to be freaked out by others' sexualities?

For myself, one of the first things being sex positive requires is accepting other folk's kinks. I may not be into them, they may even send an uncomfortable shiver down my spine (being 'squicked,') but as long as consenting adults are present, it's all good with me.

That's pretty much where I stand too. I'm sorry about the sex worker comment, because that wasn't what was particularly bothering me--except in the sence that I know he's watched at least one of them get flack for it, and he was flacking the hankycoders.

After much reflection, I've decided that I was outraged that someone who benefits greatly from the sex-positive tone of this board, could turn around and add a sex negative tone. I treasure sex-positive space, because it is scarce, and it felt like an attack on a treasure. I didn't put my objections in the most cojent or fair manner adn I'm sorry, but I'm glad I stood up and said something, rather than let it slide.

I thought heli made that post just to be an asshole that has nothing positive to contribute to a thread. I like eplaya alot more when I keep him on ignore.

The horrible thing is I had him on ignore (I already know too much about his sex life, thank you very much) and I happened to look at that thread when I wasn't signed in. Like I said, he pretty much p*ssed me off by taking advantage of the boards sexual openness by having sex in the bar and then turning around and being a pig and prude about that. Rushed in where angels fear to tread, although the off board feedback that I got when I was agonizing most made me feel not alone on the issue.

The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

I had to look back to re-read the stuff Heli posted. Bahahahaha. Anyway, he does have a point. Most people that pay for sex, like Heli apearently, have to ask for what they want. Then they find out how much and go from there. Quite often he'll get what he wants but there's times when "She just don't do that".

What this guy doesn't seem to understand is that most people into kink don't pay for it. And as such, we've all developed a social network of people with similar interests. The "code" makes it easier to find others with similar interests and make them part of your network. Same thing as putting political stickers on your car. Sending a message of what you like or don't like and aware that you might meet someone because of it. Yet asking a girl in a bar after buying her a drink a question about what she's into is a little forward. "Are you into anal sex or vaginal fisting?" might not be well recieved on a first meet. Just as if you met someone that had a hankie in their pocket and assumed that they would do that with YOU.

In Heli's defence, the hankie code obviously doesn't apply to him because, as he's stated, his passion for hookers is so great that he'll never be in the situation where it would be needed. Unless he runs out of money.

However there's a different type of "code" used by sex workers. It's verbal and not always used. Most of them list their services on a web site or somthing. It goes a little further then then that in a lot of situations. There's also that little thing called negotiations.

All in all, the hankie code works and has surpassed hankies and evolved into being incorperated into clothing. For example, colored pin stripes on leather pants or shirts.

Heli doesn't pay. He has dated one Neveda liscenced prostitute and one stripper or pole dancer, both of them board members. Sorry if I gave the impression that he was a john. That's not what I was after.

I do know the whys and wherefores of the hankie codes.

The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

Topknot,
So how's your camp going? Do you have any members yet? A plan? etc. What is your camp going to have that's "participatory"? What's your green plan? What's your ratio of men to women?

We just bought the parachute needed for our Libido Lounge shelter. So we're further then we were a month ago. We still need carpet and couches. I tell ya, tryin to get burners to plan for BRC this early in the year is a pain. We have around 15 members right now and I think we're gonna limit it to 25. Our participation requirment is going to be our afternoon sexuality seminars. Our parties are going to be restricted so they won't really count. So far our green plan is non-existant except for a couple of Flex Fuel trucks and some solar trickle chargers. Our ratio of men and women is about 1.2:1. We really only accept couples and single women. Single guys must have a reference of someone in the group. Our parties will be structured in much the same way.

So let's see if Topknot can get the posts back on topic now. It is kinda funny to see SEX CAMP in the top three topics every day.

What I really need at this point is camp members. I have had some intrest already but not nearly enough. What we really need are couples and women who want to contribute, not just single men especially single male first time burners. I am sure that they have a lot to contrubute but it may not be what this camp needs to succed.

So if you are a couple, or a woman who wants to join please let me know as soon as possible.

This camp is for everyone in Black Rock City, but I need members to help me host it.

topknot wrote:What I really need at this point is camp members. I have had some intrest already but not nearly enough. What we really need are couples and women who want to contribute, not just single men especially single male first time burners. I am sure that they have a lot to contrubute but it may not be what this camp needs to succed.

So if you are a couple, or a woman who wants to join please let me know as soon as possible.

This camp is for everyone in Black Rock City, but I need members to help me host it.

Thanks, TopKnot

Hypocrite. You say everyone is welcome and in the same post say no single men. Why don't you like radical inclusion? If I find your camp I am going to run around masturbating like a zoo monkey and YOU CAN'T STOP ME! But hey.. at least I shave my balls and wear pretty leather cockrings.

Red wine, chocolate, and now this. Healthy living is getting more and more fun..

Masturbation Reduces Cancer Risk

Australian researchers lead by Dr Chris Hiley, Prostate Cancer Research were assessing prostate cancer risk and found that men could reduce their risk of developing prostate cancer through regular masturbation.

They say cancer-causing chemicals could build up in the prostate if men do not ejaculate regularly.

And they say sexual intercourse may not have the same protective effect because of the possibility of contracting a sexually transmitted infection, which could increase menâ€™s cancer risk.

The researchers questioned over 1,000 men who had developed prostate cancer and 1,250 who had not about their sexual habits.

They found those who had ejaculated the most between the ages of 20 and 50 were the least likely to develop the cancer.
The protective effect was greatest while the men were in their 20s.

Men who ejaculated more than five times a week were a third less likely to develop prostate cancer later in life.

"No one is innocent, citizen. We are merely here to determine the level of your guilt."
- Judge Dredd

A little confused exactly how do you intend on making this a "free" but "safe" camp? I mean I've been a to a few clubs like that quite frankly I had to get the bouncers to escort guys out of the place cause they wouldn't get their hands out of my pants (yes they actually stuck their hands down my pants to far past the hair line)... now that was in the middle of a club, and a dance club at that?

I'm not saying this is a bad idea I actually plan on checking it out but I would really like some reasurance that similar things are not going to happen.

I said "not just single men especially single male first time burners"
Then I went on to say that single men have a lot to contribute but perhaps not what this camp needs.
Did you stop to consiber that there are probably already single men in this camp, and that i did not say they would not be alowed but that its camp members that I am looking for, and for the sake of balance for all of those who want to visit this camp there needs to be diversity in its members.

So before you call me a hypocrite again why dont you learn to read you dumb fuck.

Look topknot.. you don't need to goto Burningman. You need to goto the bunny ranch you'll have alot more fun. You are not the first person to come around trolling for sex and you won't be the last. What folks like you don't get is that your attitude is what keeps you lonely. Your attitude is why you need to look for sex at Burningman. Honestly I could care less about sex at Burningman since I get more than enough with partners at home. I often treat sexual topics with little to no seriousness on here. I really don't understand why so many folks are so hyped up about sex at Burningman. I dig the fact that there's a poly camp and a jiffy lube camp etc etc but cmon topknot get a clue. Hire some girls from one of the ranches and you will have your "single" girls.

These codes are great way to let folks know exactly what your desires are. Size queens can save time by making sure that MUSTARD is being worn on the left. Anyone just checkin the scene out can wear ORANGE on the right and not get hassled. These are great for any sex camp and hankys can be purchased in bulk real cheap to gift to participants.

Also have you considered having a gloryhole at your sex camp? I hear gloryholes are a great way to meet new people without the hangups and good conversation.

Anyone who has to talk about why they are not looking for sex, and then turn around and say that they get plenty of it, must have some real insecurities. I do not think that I have at any point made this topic one of finding myself sex! I want to bring a sex open camp to Burning Man. Your comments have not been helpful and do not promote a sex positive atmosphere.

The last resort of someone who knows that they were wrong and did something stupid is to attack the person who showed them there fault, me. You have still not owned up to the fact that you mis-quoted me. Untill you do so I would ask you to not attack me personally. Also your attempt to turn the topic of this board away from its intent is imature. If you do not have anything helpful to say I ask you to not say anything at all. There are people who really want to seriously discuss this topic.

The problem Topknot will have is just that - getting a good staff together (Oooh - no pun intended) and not having a bunch of fratboys looking to get their rocks off rather than run the camp. I understand what he was saying. But don't blow people off because they are newbies - you could throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Also... it helps if one can be rational and calm and be able to promote and sell your idea.

You ARE going to get flack for your plans - mainly because this *is* puritanicamerica, BRC or not, and because we've seen this happen. If you are a long time burner you've seen it too. Can you overcome the flack and still be the Carlo Maltoban kind of host, not get ruffled, be pleasant and genial, or will you break? For it's You and your personality- and how you run your camp - will be what makes or breaks your camp.

And... what are your contingent plans when da fuzz shows up and wants a tour - while you're operating? They *will* want a looksie - are you ready for that? Better have your ducks inna row with your ops plans... it's no fun being busted and run outta town.

I always wonder, tho... why people either think they are starting something radically different and new with a (a) bar oriented camp, or (b) a sex oriented camp. :roll: I'm waiting for someone to start a *really* new theme camp, say... um...

I know. Call it "The Monastery"... make it like a real monastic exeprience thing. Now *that* would be unique. I wonder if anyone would have the vision - or the balls - to pull that kind of radically different idea off?

Not to get off the thread..but does anyone know of a snuggle camp? Sometimes just the intimacy of a hug is just as satisfying..almost tantric. I never done a snuggle party and I've seen pix and it looks like fun.

I just think the idea of a big group of people in one area all snuggled; bodies huggin bodies. Feeling the hearbeat of one person while listening to the breathing of another. The sense of intimacy and trust. Just seems like a very cool thing. Wow, I'm gettin a sweet visual of lots of hands wrapped around me.

so, if all these "sex camps" are eilitists and only let in couples, homosexuals and hot single chicks...then where are the single straight hetero guys supposed to go? Man, if I wanted to get denied access to a selective sex party or refused entry into a club I might as well just stay home and go to the bar! what, so you expect me to rely upon my good looks and witty personality? and just play around with one chick at a time? in my own tent? what kinda crap is that?

emotion_sickness wrote:then where are the single straight hetero guys supposed to go?;p

Its not what you have to wear but how you wear it. Attitude is everything, be cordial and don't let anyone get you down. Just move on to the next crowd of folks. With 40,000 people I'm sure you'll find some people that are nice to hang out with. For me sex has always come second to good conversation and having things in common. If all else fails just get all horned up and wear a cockring and go shirtcocking wherever the SpikeTV people are at. There is soo much to see and do at Burningman that you can have a great time without worrying about sex. When you worry about getting sex is when you have trouble getting it. If all else fails with the girls try out some of the boys, there are more boys around anyway. When you are bi you have plenty more options.

I just read through this entire thread and, wow, what a variety of opinions on a variety of subjects. I know where topknot is coming from and it's not only sex camps and/or single guys. Being an overweight, balding, middle-age man with a rubenesque wife we have been turned away, or at the least given the cold shoulder, at all kinds of camps because they only want hip, young, good lookin' people in their camp.

When I first started going to BM it was an intimate group of under 10,000 folks and, even though I was single and still overweight at the time, I never got the feeling of being not wanted somewhere. The last few years the number of places where the non-beautiful people are persona nongrata has mushroomed. I would love to find a place where an overweight, mature couple could drop their drawers and make out without a bunch of idiots either laughing and pointing or inviting you to leave. Just because you pass the age of 50 (or 60 or 70) doesn't mean your naughty-bits drop off and you head to the home.