Tape and bumpers are not the answer people. Seriously.
They need to apply a coating to the antennas. It would be clear but enough to stop the issue from happening. Unfortunately, that would involve a recall, or at the very least a trip to the Apple store and a Genius to swap out the antennas with coated ones.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GQB

Um, I've still yet to meet anyone demonstrating that this is a 'problem'.

Again...
"Doc... it hurts when I do this."
"Then don't do that".

Move your GD finger a millimeter.

The antenna design is still a vast improvement for those not trying to get in on a phony class action.

I'm afraid you are wrong,
My wife has the 16GB iPhone 4 and I have the 32GB iPhone 4, and we both have the problem,..
the signal bars are up and down like a yoyo, 3G speeds also vary,.. we both now have cases on the phones and still the signal dances up and down,.. and you say there is not a problem,..
Our previous 3GS models did not have these issues period,..

I think its time for everyone to get real!!
wake up and smell the coffee,...

I agree the software update will probably alleviate that gross perception but it will do nothing to fix the actual attenuation, which is much worse than for other phones including previous iPhones (3Gs at least).

Yet, it's reported by many that the reception is much better. It seems that the improved reception from the external antenna and the drop from holding it are pretty much a wash.

The signal loss from bridging the seam is a completely separate issue that, based on data from all reports, only occurs on some phones.

I can understand why you are having such a hard time believing this MIGHT just be true. Your iphone 4 is probably working fine for you? That is great for you. If people are to believe you that yours is working fine when you say it is, why is it such a stretch for you to believe others when they tell you theirs is not working properly? How many iPhone 4's will it take, before I can get one that does work, is my question. Mine has been returned twice and I'm on iPhone 4 number three. All three will drop a call when picked up with two fingers anywhere on the sides. I love Apple products and have 10 currently, which is why I will not give up. I believe will improve upon this problem and refuse to believe that this is all we can expect. They have always done pretty well in the past about making things right, so let's hope they stand behind these too. They announced today that they will exchange 2008 Time Capsules within the given range of affected serial numbers, and how much more important is the iPhone line to the company than the Time Capsule line.

Dude or Dudette -- Do you "get" that Apple's business has gone up 30 fold is a SHORT AMOUNT of TIME in a DOWN ECONOMY?

What company out there has had the SALES GROWTH that can MATCH or BEAT Apple?

What do you want? Perfection with Growth? Growth comes AT A COST TO ALL, including YOU AND ME. But we are talking millions upon millions of new customers every 90 days, do you get that? This kind of explosive growth is unprecedented.

BTW - My "old" 3GS just sold on ebay for $340... How many "devices" have you bought over the years can boast a 100% resale value over 12 months, USED????

You are looking for excuses. You are right. I am happy customer that is "reacting" to people like you that want Apple to somehow "come clean" that all iphone 4's are defective. They shouldn't because in my case, the iphone 4 performs as advertised, get it?

I mean you would have a leg to stand on, just one, if you "couldn't return your phone" for a refund or exchange, you can.

My 3GS was SWAPPED out two months ago because the volume buttons stopped working, should I have made HELL on forums like this and demand a recall? I simply went to an Apple store and they swapped it out NO QUESTIONS ASKED. Try doing this with your DRIOD or any other phone and see how "the competition" stands by it's products.

You have no case on Apple betraying it's customers. It isn't perfect at handling EXPLOSIVE growth, guilty as charged. And guess what, you have NOTHING to compare their growth to, nothing. It's unprecedented.

i sold my 16 GB iPhone 4 on eBay for a cool $800. let that guy deal with the death grip issue. it is real and it is a pain in the a$$.
going back to my google N1 for awhile.

I guess this proves there are enough idiots out there to keep eBay in business. Why would anyone but an idiot spend $800 when they can get one for $200. Plus, I'm curious how you did this without paying AT&T for voiding your contract?

Can you send me the buyer's email? I have some really good deals I would like to offer him/her.

I guess this proves there are enough idiots out there to keep eBay in business. Why would anyone but an idiot spend $800 when they can get one for $200. Plus, I'm curious how you did this without paying AT&T for voiding your contract?

Can you send me the buyer's email? I have some really good deals I would like to offer him/her.

They could be teiing the truth.
I saw the iPhone 4G on CL for as much as $1200 the first couple of days after it was released.

Tallest Skil:

"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse" "The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."

And this is if Consumer Reports is really like it was 20 years - A REAL NOT FOR PROFIT business.

I recently signed up to see their "product reviews" of items we all need and care about and they were LAME.

I learn way more from forums like this FOR FREE than their SUBSCRIPTION FEES for a small limited information source.

What's funny is that they FLIP FLOPPED on this issue. I call that UNRELIABLE and UNTRUSTWORTHTY by all accounts.

Well if you want details about 'how' something works, or for specific issues, yes internet is best. But in terms of 'is something a pervasive problem'; or comparing something like 'braking performance' to other vehicles etc etc etc, do you really think a couple dozen or so users blah-blah-ing on a website is more scientific? Look how long this thread is because there is not that many 'well known' scientific tests of this issue.

That said, even if this is not a 'pervasive' issue, then at a minimum Apple may have a perception issue (with a couple million sold, its hard to argue this point). Old saying- perception is reality. Perhaps Apple can wait this out, we shall see.

Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster by your side, kid.

i guess duct tape does fix everything and should i still get an iphone because i need one before schools starts

That is why the CR report is bogus. If he just wanted to be a comedian, holding up a roll of duct tape, I don't trust him as a scientist. I have tested the phone myself, and yes the bars went down, however the calls do not drop here in my test lab. I do agree, the design is foolish. How it ever made it through quality control is beyond logic.

Even if Apple is able to fix it 99.9% with whatever method they decide to implement, that will not stop the lawyers. Right now a small number of customers are having occasional problems with reception, but a large number of competitors and media companies are enjoying the the hell out of this.

I think Apple will learn a valuable lesson here about why it is always better to be honest and not such a good idea to be a snob.

Can you send me the buyer's email? I have some really good deals I would like to offer him/her.

Me too. In a few weeks, we will be able to buy unlocked iPhone 4's from Apple in Canada. If that fantasy buyer paid $800 for a locked phone, imagine how much more they'd pay for an Apple unlocked phone. Hell, even if they only pay me $800 US, I imagine I will still be turning a nice profit.

I think I will go in an buy a dozen. When my wife asks, I will explain that there are are people in the US willing to pay hundreds of dollars over ticket price. It's true. I read it in the internet,

"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro.

I guess this proves there are enough idiots out there to keep eBay in business. Why would anyone but an idiot spend $800 when they can get one for $200. Plus, I'm curious how you did this without paying AT&T for voiding your contract?

Can you send me the buyer's email? I have some really good deals I would like to offer him/her.

Um, they aren't idiots, those phones are OFF CONTRACT. I just sold my 3GS from last year on ebay for $340. What fools.

I did experience reception lost when holding it in my left hand. I wasn't even trying to duplicate results. I'm right handed, but I hold my iphone in my left hand when typing on the screen. Getting a $15 rubber case from BestBuy solved the problem. I refused to pay $30 for the bumpers Apple was selling.

Me too. In a few weeks, we will be able to buy unlocked iPhone 4's from Apple in Canada. If that fantasy buyer paid $800 for a locked phone, imagine how much more they'd pay for an Apple unlocked phone. Hell, even if they only pay me $800 US, I imagine I will still be turning a nice profit.

I think I will go in an buy a dozen. When my wife asks, I will explain that there are are people in the US willing to pay hundreds of dollars over ticket price. It's true. I read it in the internet,

The funny thing is.. That clearly there is a HIGH RESALE INTERNATIONAL MARKET for these phones, new and old. On top of being able to return them if you just bought them, clearly like in my case, I upgraded my 3GS to i4 at no cost to me at all, especially since my 3GS sold on ebay for $340 two days ago.

It's reasoning like this that more is being made about "the phone failure fears" that really exists. In other words, what's the REAL problem?

Right now nobody's loosing ANYTHING and many are wasting valuable "life time" trying with all their might to bring this company down with exaggerations.

That's the first I've heard of that happening and, at least from my perspective, it's indirect, but I'll keep an extra eye out for the direct reports.

I suspect it's (annoyingmouse) referring to solipsism who tested someone else's 4 next to his. I also suspect that solipsism deliberately neglected to tell us that one of the 4's had a case on and one didn't.

I've now had a replacement and it has dropped signal just like the old one did and just as severely.

"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.

The funny thing is.. That clearly there is a HIGH RESALE INTERNATIONAL MARKET for these phones, new and old. On top of being able to return them if you just bought them, clearly like in my case, I upgraded my 3GS to i4 at no cost to me at all, especially since my 3GS sold on ebay for $340 two days ago.

It's reasoning like this that more is being made about "the phone failure fears" that really exists. In other words, what's the REAL problem?

Right now nobody's loosing ANYTHING and many are wasting valuable "life time" trying with all their might to bring this company down with exaggerations.

Wow, paranoid much? No one is trying "to bring this company down with exaggeration". I get it, you are a new Apple fan and very enthusiastic. That is great. But, ignoring real problems is just stupid. There is a problem with the iPhone 4. Apple should admit and address this. On a different level, there is a problem with the decision making, somewhere at Apple, that first allowed the phone to ship with this defect and now to refuse to acknowledge the issue.

Does this make them a failure as a company? No. They are obviously a wild success and deservedly so. Does that mean they are perfect? No. Does it mean that anyone that is affected by the problem or is concerned about it (especially those that are not yet able to buy it) should assume there is no problem? No, again that would be stupid.

You are new to the boards. Welcome. People discuss the good and the bad about Apple here. If you don't like that, perhaps you ought to stop 'wasting valuable "life time"' screaming at anyone that has a different take on the matter than you and just move on.

"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro.

"When your finger or hand touches a spot on the phone's lower left sidean easy thing, especially for leftiesthe signal can significantly degrade enough to cause you to lose your connection altogether if you're in an area with a weak signal. Due to this problem, we can't recommend the iPhone 4."

"Lefties?" CR is guilty of either omission or worse! I am a Righty, but I hold my phones with Left Hand, so that I can use my Right Hand to Operate the phone! My guess is that the same works in reverse: Lefties hold the phone with Right Hand, and Operate it with Left Hand... So, if Consumers Report is to be taken verbatim, like Gospel, such SLOPPY wording is INEXCUSABLE, FUD designed to attract attention, clicks, eyeballs, ratings, to CR instead of the "Truth" that they supposedly Report!

Quote:

" We reached this conclusion after testing all three of our iPhone 4s (purchased at three separate retailers in the New York area) in the controlled environment of CU's radio frequency (RF) isolation chamber. In this room, which is impervious to outside radio signals, our test engineers connected the phones to our base-station emulator, a device that simulates carrier cell towers (see video: IPhone 4 Design Defect Confirmed). We also tested several other AT&T phones the same way, including the iPhone 3G S and the Palm Pre. None of those phones had the signal-loss problems of the iPhone 4"

The presumption they offer is that their "emulator, a device that simulates carrier cell" is a Word of God?! Has anyone ever challenged that device? How credible is that? That alone raises the Q for me! And just because other devices worked OK with it doesn't make that device a Word of God!

Quote:

"We did, however, find an affordable solution for suffering iPhone 4 users: Cover the antenna gap with a piece of duct tape or another thick, non-conductive material. It may not be pretty, but it works. We also expect that using a case would remedy the problem. We'll test a few cases this week and report back."

1. Why didn't CR use that "Word of God!" "emulator - simulator" during their 1st Report to give us One Definitive Answer?

2. Why is CR coming out with this 2nd Report BEFORE they test it with Cases? - "We'll test a few cases this week and report back."

It looks like CR just wanted to exploit this FUD to inject themselves into The News, cause anything iPhone Related is Big News! They are doing it in 3 Steps, perhaps deliberately, in order to Stay In The News, to get Attention! CR is fighting for their survival like all Print Media! CR itself should be put under Microscope! This is simply Sloppy, Questionable Reporting by a Desperate Publication!!!

As to Apple -- there could be several explanations there, and I will wait till their next official statement! Of course Apple is under the biggest Microscope, cause they are the biggest threat to some of their Competitors, who are too busy looking for low blows, while imitating Apple (BackBerry OS6 teaser was introduced today)!

Maybe Apple's Thinking was:

We'll max it out while reducing the size of the iPhone4, putting the antenn on the edge to get the best reception, cause most everyone will use some kind of a case! We might as well offer them something close to the Naked Look - Apple's Bumper! Hey, that's an additional sale... Also, a lot of people use Hands-Free and or BlueTooth! Thus, it's part of iPhone 4 Design!

Most people have voted with their $$$, and Apple can't make iPhone 4 fast enough to meet the demand! A small minority of users have noticed that aspect of the design and are now obsessed with it, to the point that they don't talk about the improvements in iPhone 4, but keep beating this Dead Horse!!!

Apple has EASILY called that Minority Report's bluff by offering a Complete 100% Refund! No need to sue for that which is already available!

Let's see what Apple's next move is.... During the Earnings Call they'll be asked about this, and it would be interesting to see if it's 1-5% of buyers who have returned their iPhone 4. Also, I'd like to compare that percentage to all other phones, or at least Smart Phones!!! If it's close, or lower, that would diminish this hysteria by a few!

Apple Insider, like all media, needs eyeballs and clicks! So, I can't expect them not to jump on this story! But again:

The Real Story is how many users are NOT RETURNING their iPhone 4, and the demand for it!!!

Oh, you mean $200 plus $70 per month for 2 years. That's quite a different thing.

Of course, the only difference between the $200 phone and the $800 phone, at least in the US, is that the $200 owner is contractually bound for 2 years, while the $800 is not. Assuming the $800 owner didn't buy it as an $800 paperweight, he is going to be paying the same rates for as long as he wants to use it....but he can stop paying and keep it as a very expensive iPod with a contract.

"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro.

I'm afraid you are wrong,
My wife has the 16GB iPhone 4 and I have the 32GB iPhone 4, and we both have the problem,..
the signal bars are up and down like a yoyo, 3G speeds also vary,.. we both now have cases on the phones and still the signal dances up and down,.. and you say there is not a problem,..
Our previous 3GS models did not have these issues period,..

I think its time for everyone to get real!!
wake up and smell the coffee,...

I'm smelling the coffee just fine. I love my iPhone4. I too can get the bars to dance up and down here in San Francisco.

Has it caused a loss of reception? No.
Has it caused any dropped calls? No.
Has it caused a drop in 3G data? No.

What has the antenna design caused?
It caused a huge improvement (for me) in call quality.
3G performance is a huge improvement over my previous iPhone.
It even allowed me to place a phone call 40' underground in a concrete parking structure where no other cell phone I ever had has ever been able to work. It even said "No Service" when I received the phone call. That was a shocker.

I'm sure complaints are plenty and justified. However I also believe that the majority of users have no problems with it. There is something else going on. I for one will patiently wait and see what Apple comes up with. Until then, I will continue to happily use my iPhone4. It's the best-performing phone I've had yet.

Why do you buy an iPhone without a contract? I take it people are getting around the requirement by cheating? Or is it different outside the US?

In Canada, and elsewhere, the iPhone 4 is/will be available directly from Apple without a contract. The major benefit, is that they will be factory unlocked. We have 5 carriers that support the iPhone here, so the first benefit is that we can then choose any carrier we want (that allowed 'third party' devices on their network) and so pick and choose amongst plans and add-ons. Additionally, we can bring it to any compatible carrier internationally and, assuming the support the iPhone 4 microsim, buy a card and plan and use it freely. The third benefit is being able to sell it to Americans that want to use TMobile.

Really, I don't see any reason someone would buy an AT&T iPhone without a contract. Contracts are shit, but since you have to pay AT&T to use your iPhone, what practical difference does it really make (other than being able to walk away at any time, I guess).

"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro.

An RF engineer interviewed by Leo LaPorte and referenced on latest MacBreak weekly podcast stated categorically that this business of bridging the two antennas with skin is pure nonsense. The tape solution is useless because there is no problem there. The actual problem has to do with signal blocking, and that occurs when the hand covers enough of the antenna when signal strength is already weak. This calls into question CR's results. I generally respect their intentions, but I don't think they researched this issue fully enough before announcing results. Hope Apple challenges them.

Yeah, I saw the same Podcast and this has been my feeling all along. It seems the antenna is behaving properly. All antenna's experience attenuation. Pretty much ANY antenna nowadays is located inside the phone, at the bottom.

When you put the antenna outside the phone, that phone is going to experience MORE attenuation when your hand covers it. But that doesn't mean it won't work, it simply means it will be attenuated. There are phones out there, that tell you not to touch certain parts of the antenna. This isn't new.

The upside, combined with a few other enhancements, is that the outer antenna enjoys FAR greater reception. The other side of this story (the one not getting as much airtime), is that many people are suddenly able to use the iPhone in places they previously could not. They're able to continue using phones in areas where calls are normally dropped.

I think there is a software bug, that will tell you there is no service when you can in fact make a call. This was mentioned in Walt Mossberg's review of the phone.

I think it's the combination of this very new design, the software bug, and perhaps a small amount of units (tens of thousands out of 2 million is an acceptable/normal failure rate) that are faulty.

After reading through the thread, I see two analogies that sum up the two sides of the argument:

"Doctor, it hurts when I do this." "Then don't do that"

and

"I don't have cancer, so cancer must not exist."

Really people, which one sounds stupider? If you honestly think this isn't an issue because it's not so hard to just move your hand and hold the phone in a different way, just wait until you have your hands full or something and the call is dropped because you're touching the bottom corner.

What REALLY irks me is how CR confirmed that putting duct-tape over the corner helped the issue immensely, so that confirms that Apple's putting a thin film over the antenna would help alleviate this issue.

The solution is simple: Apple should add the finish to the antenna in the production process. Once they start getting to the shelves, Apple & AT&T should allow users to replace theirs with these new fixed ones. The old ones get sent to a factory where they are sent through a disassembly process (which wouldn't even need to be that complicated) and the phone's antenna gets the new coat. The phones are then sold 25% off as refurbs online (random #, I dont know what they should cost).

I'm thinking of returning the iphone 4 while I'm in my 30 day return period, and wondered if anyone else has done so. What happens with the AT&T contract and how easy is it to get back on the same plan with my old iphone? I may wait for the software update, but it doesn't sound like that will change anything.

In Canada, and elsewhere, the iPhone 4 is/will be available directly from Apple without a contract. The major benefit, is that they will be factory unlocked. We have 5 carriers that support the iPhone here, so the first benefit is that we can then choose any carrier we want (that allowed 'third party' devices on their network) and so pick and choose amongst plans and add-ons. Additionally, we can bring it to any compatible carrier internationally and, assuming the support the iPhone 4 microsim, buy a card and plan and use it freely. The third benefit is being able to sell it to Americans that want to use TMobile.

Really, I don't see any reason someone would buy an AT&T iPhone without a contract. Contracts are shit, but since you have to pay AT&T to use your iPhone, what practical difference does it really make (other than being able to walk away at any time, I guess).

Thanks for the reply. Having a choice of carriers is nice but It sounds like the cost in Canada is much higher since the iPhone isn't subsidized. Maybe it's worth the higher cost if the coverage is better? Since I'm with Verizon I've never had reception problems. That's why I'll be patient until they get the iPhone.

Thanks for the reply. Having a choice of carriers is nice but It sounds like the cost in Canada is much higher since the iPhone isn't subsidized. Maybe it's worth the higher cost if the coverage is better? Since I'm with Verizon I've never had reception problems. That's why I'll be patient until they get the iPhone.

The cost is higher, when you buy the unlocked direct from Apple. But, IIRC, in the US you can buy contract free from Apple (and AT&T?). Apple Canada hasn't announced the pricing, but I expect it to be within $50 of the contract free pricing in the US.

I expect a lot of US users will be driving up here and buying it from Apple so they can use it on TMobile or be truly contract free (and use it internationally). Won't help you at all, since you want to stay with V.

"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro.

Thanks for the reply. Having a choice of carriers is nice but It sounds like the cost in Canada is much higher since the iPhone isn't subsidized. Maybe it's worth the higher cost if the coverage is better? Since I'm with Verizon I've never had reception problems. That's why I'll be patient until they get the iPhone.

You do understand that subsidized/unsubsidized - you still pay the same in the end, don't you? You're essentially making monthly payments on the phone when it's subsidized.

I'm with you. I have Verizon and I'm happy with the service. I tried a Motorola Droid in the store and just was appalled by the crappy quality of the phone. The touchscreen was junk, the phone felt cheap, and Android wasn't near as responsive as my iPod Touch. I'll wait and see what happens. My current contract ends in April next year, so, I have time to wait and see what happens. I hate the thought of moving to AT&T or suffering through using a Droid. I really want to Droid to succeed, but so far, it's just like the PC market: crappy hardware in a race for the bottom. No thanks!

Of course, the only difference between the $200 phone and the $800 phone, at least in the US, is that the $200 owner is contractually bound for 2 years, while the $800 is not. Assuming the $800 owner didn't buy it as an $800 paperweight, he is going to be paying the same rates for as long as he wants to use it....but he can stop paying and keep it as a very expensive iPod with a contract.

That was my entire point. The person I was responding to said it was crazy to pay $800 for a new iphone because you can buy one for $200. I was pointing out the error in his logic.

"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"Gatorguy 5/31/13