The desktop icon set already is a menu, present without any action taken - and it already uses functional labels such as "browser."

Switching between profuse and sparse icon sets is already set up: menu/desktop/desktop templates. And the sets can be edited, simply by dragging icons to the trashcan.

So - there's something to be said, on simplicity grounds, for making the most of what is already there, rather than adding something new.
-----------------------------
Edit: well, actually, when tested (in 5.2.8 & 5.3.1) the feature doesn't seem to work. That is: starting from a customized state, if I select Traditional or Minimal setups, nothing happens: the icons stay as I've put them.
If this supposed function really is non-working debris, fixing it would be a good step - nothing confuses and annoys new users more than non-working debris.Last edited by bpm on Wed 18 Jan 2012, 23:02; edited 1 time in total

bpm makes a good point. Some simplification is available but it is hidden away. I must admit only having used it once. I tend to prefer all the icons. Saluki has a simplified menu. We are already seeing a much simpler menu (that is end user ease - just works) with Saluki (currently at Alpha 007) Efforts spent with Saluki would be most productive.

The Alpha2 of Slacko uses a simpler 3 step menu. I am not sure if menu items can be made bold in JWM (or half bold) as Nancy Reagan suggests and Volhout would like. The dropping of geek program names has been talked of before and not adopted. I would suggest it is common sense.

First Step should figure out, if it is possible to create a user menu that shows only the wanted entries.

Improved and worked out successfully!

------

Step 2 should figure out, if it is possible to edit comfortably and save the user menu.

Improved and worked out successfully!

As you can see in the attached images, there is user mode for KIDS enabled. Related menu entry shows "on" if set on.
In example KIDS mode are only two programs enabled: Aqualung (to play music) and mtpaint (to paint pics, doesn't all kids do stuff like that?).
Changing user mode is possible at all user modes, but if not running in ADVANCED mode, a password is required.
If running as ADVANCED a password is also required, but the checkbox allows to set off password check - only ADVANCED.
Password check is a simple text file based password - i think it will be save enough to KIDS, BEGINNER and INTERMEDIARY users and easy to change by admin (you).

It is surely possible to make a "cutdown" of the menu structure instead of leaving empty menu entries, but it is not as easy to modify by the average user (admin, you).

As you can see in the codes, there are some sections in the scripts that builds the menus, that can only be changed by manual editing of the script.
This is unacceptable for the average user, that's why i have decide to let menu entries stay - but empty. It is the easiest way to configure user menus without the need of having a big bag of puppy knowledge.

These sections are also responsible to the impossibility to get the complete menu in other languages than English. The whole SHUTDOWN section can only set to other languages by using GETTEXT - which doesn't work in my puppy. and so in lucid and surely many other puppies as well.

All codes are showing menu editions of LazY Puppy 5.2.8-4. It is always the SHUTDOWN and HELP section, that needs to be translated by GETTEXT - or, the other possibility - remove these sections and replace it with likely one of the lines using xxx.menu files.

Therefor some .directory and .desktop files must be created. I think, this is the way i would use, because it would be fine to get the complete menu in foreign languages!!!

The rest of the story is surely told by having a look at the attached images.

Check this out, post your suggestions - but do not make me confused - please.

Posted: Sun 22 Jan 2012, 01:19 Post subject:
Standard/Advanced MenusSubject description: making the most of what is already there

bpm wrote:

So - there's something to be said, on simplicity grounds, for making the most of what is already there, rather than adding something new.

The intention of this all here is: making the most of what is already there.

And maybe just a little bit easier and/or more effective.

The everage user is surely not able to make a "cutdown" of the menu entries without a big risk of loosing some of these files.

I have found a way to switch the menu, the desktop and the wbar configuration between four (4) modes, just by ONE SINGLE MOUSE CLICK (after these configurations are set).

It is stable and it has the feature to get all menu entries in foreign languages - even the "help" and "shutdown" section of the menu. It works for fbpanel, openbox, fluxbox and jwm.

And best of all: it has actually a uncompressed size of 161 Kb, .pet size 119 Kb. This is surely not much for an option to "free" the desktop, "remove" wbar and let only one single program in the menu - just by one click.

Actually i am working on this feature to use it to "remove" even the drives from dektop._________________LazY PuppyRSH's DNASARA B.

Of course, you could expand the menu_profile script to run Xdialog etc let users choose a profile...
In fact, this looks easy enough that I might apply what I just wrote to my own install and test it!_________________Akita Linux, VLC-GTK, Pup Search, Pup File Search

Posted: Mon 23 Jan 2012, 04:51 Post subject:
Standard/Advanced MenusSubject description: There is a much easier way to achieve much the same thing?

Hi scOttman.

Thank you for your suggestions. Actually i did some of my work on this one project the way like you suggested.

scOttman wrote:

There is a much easier way to achieve much the same thing:

Yes, there is mostly an easier way to achieve much the same thing.

- for an individual solution
- for personal use
- surely no other languages supported than english
- if experienced in puppy's filesystem structure
- if experienced in bash scripting
- by moving files around manually

All this is not given to a new linux user - especially a new puppy user.

When i do develop my work, every user will be able to get from a full featured desktop and menu to a "free" desktop (no icons except one for pmount) and a menu with only on program in it (if wanted so) - by only one single mouse click.

Also the wallpaper changes.

It will have language support for English and German and is able to add support for other languages by installing NLS packages.

The menus will also be available with FULL language support.

Actually there is no puppy with a (f.e.) german menu that says "herunterfahren" instead of "shutdown" etc.pp. If so, than you will have the "herunterfahren" by using English menu as well... (EDIT: i just didn't see one)

Posted: Mon 23 Jan 2012, 12:06 Post subject:
Re: Standard/Advanced MenusSubject description: There is a much easier way to achieve much the same thing?

RSH, my way does support full localisation - as long as the .desktop files contain translations already - if they don't then extra steps/scripts are required, no matter what you do!

And actually, any puppy using Shinobars "Puppy-Desktop-NLS", or techno "jwm_tools" will already have "herunterfahren" (etc) in their menu, along with many other translations - and that is without any extra language files installed/added... Pups like this include Slacko, Akita, QuicksetWary, LupuQ and others...

I just tested 'my way' on mine, works fine, localised too, ...took me 4 mins to setup..
Seems to work in openbox, jwm, xfce, lxpanel, fbpanel..

I might package it up as a pet, simply to prove it works

(Not trying to be nasty or horrible in any way, its just that a lot of this is already available in Puppy - toggle-rox-desktop, desksetup.sh and others all do some of what you want... you may find them useful... Just trying to help..)_________________Akita Linux, VLC-GTK, Pup Search, Pup File Search

@scottman - that would be a hell of a lot simpler and faster if you just changed symlinks to directories - would it not?_________________Check out my github repositories. I may eventually get around to updating my blogspot.

i do think everything and all that we use today in a matter of course has been started out as a few users project. Even Puppy Linux did start as a few users project. Another Word for few users project would be minority support (care) and we german guys do have this already in the Grundgesetz as you already should know.

I do think, the value of a company and/or commmunity, should be measured at how they do act about minorities (care, support etc,)

However, i did make some progress:

All User Modes working fine and i do use this feature actually in one of my private LazY Puppy isos. I did refine the menu and closed all sub-cagegories (except every last one) All changes on the menu, desktop, wallpaper, wbar and fbpanel are automatically saved if changing the user mode. So if changing back to the last user mode all settings will be available.

The Work goes on, more to come...

RSH

Note: i do not post images this time, because it takes too much time to work them out and put them in here.

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