Yeah he was labeled as having a game similar to a young Todd Bertuzzi. Then we actually got to see him. No hands, no physicality, no speed, no hockey smarts, no edge, nothing.

1. He played 5 games with the Penguins this season. He contributed to more goals than Boychuk so far, fwiw. 2. The vast majority of his NHL games have come on the 4th line.3. In the AHL, he's scored @ .35 goals per game. 4. He averaged as many hits per game on the 4th line last year as Adams and Cooke.5. For WBS in the playoffs last year, he upped his game and improved his regular season scoring pace.

In the spirit of Draftnik, those are facts. No hands? No physicality? No hockey smarts? The facts tell a different story. My assessment is that he has no confidence. The fault for that surely lies at his feet as much as it does at the teams', but regardless, it was obvious he wasn't going to get a chance here. So good luck to him in Winnipeg.

This argument will be revisited in about 1 year when we check in on the season Tangradi is having with them, when he's finally turned 24, which is statistically when his type of player "finds their game." Crow will be served. But to whom?

Yeah he was labeled as having a game similar to a young Todd Bertuzzi. Then we actually got to see him. No hands, no physicality, no speed, no hockey smarts, no edge, nothing.

1. He played 5 games with the Penguins this season. He contributed to more goals than Boychuk so far, fwiw. 2. The vast majority of his NHL games have come on the 4th line.3. In the AHL, he's scored @ .35 goals per game. 4. He averaged as many hits per game on the 4th line last year as Adams and Cooke.5. For WBS in the playoffs last year, he upped his game and improved his regular season scoring pace.

In the spirit of Draftnik, those are facts. No hands? No physicality? No hockey smarts? The facts tell a different story. My assessment is that he has no confidence. The fault for that surely lies at his feet as much as it does at the teams', but regardless, it was obvious he wasn't going to get a chance here. So good luck to him in Winnipeg.

This argument will be revisited in about 1 year when we check in on the season Tangradi is having with them, when he's finally turned 24, which is statistically when his type of player "finds their game." Crow will be served. But to whom?

I never mentioned Boychuk. By your "facts" then Chris Minard should have been a sure NHLer I mean that guy led the AHL in goals. Yet when put in the NHL he fail miserably. Some guys just don't have what it takes to play in the NHL. Those that do show something when given a chance. Yet Tangradi in 45 NHL games showed enough to get moved for a 7th round pick.

What does Minard have anything to do with the conversation? You said Tangradi doesn't have hands. I gave you evidence he can score. But you say he hasn't scored in his 40 games on the 4th line and 5 games on the 2nd line... So he he'll obviously never develop that aspect of his game. But hell, he's even managed a shot per game as you point out, which is better than Adams or Asham did last year on the 4th line. You said Tangradi lacks physicality. False. In 45 games he's got 73 hits. He gets traded for a 7th round pick. Great for him. It obviously wasn't working here. Now the Penguins can use his roster spot.

pcm wrote:What does Minard have anything to do with the conversation? You said Tangradi doesn't have hands. I gave you evidence he can score. But you say he hasn't scored in his 40 games on the 4th line and 5 games on the 2nd line... So he he'll obviously never develop that aspect of his game. But hell, he's even managed a shot per game as you point out, which is better than Adams or Asham did last year on the 4th line. You said Tangradi lacks physicality. False. In 45 games he's got 73 hits. He gets traded for a 7th round pick. Great for him. It obviously wasn't working here. Now the Penguins can use his roster spot.

You used AHL stats to justify your argument. I showed you an AHL player that produced great AHL stats and couldn't hack it. Heck if Tangradi had such little chance and little mins and still had a goal differential of -6 I'd hate to see what he would do with a "real chance." That whole "real chance" argument needs to stop. He had real chances, yes multiple, and didn't show enough to stick on any line from scoring to checking. He's just not very good.

Yeah he was labeled as having a game similar to a young Todd Bertuzzi. Then we actually got to see him. No hands, no physicality, no speed, no hockey smarts, no edge, nothing.

1. He played 5 games with the Penguins this season. He contributed to more goals than Boychuk so far, fwiw. 2. The vast majority of his NHL games have come on the 4th line.3. In the AHL, he's scored @ .35 goals per game. 4. He averaged as many hits per game on the 4th line last year as Adams and Cooke.5. For WBS in the playoffs last year, he upped his game and improved his regular season scoring pace.

In the spirit of Draftnik, those are facts. No hands? No physicality? No hockey smarts? The facts tell a different story. My assessment is that he has no confidence. The fault for that surely lies at his feet as much as it does at the teams', but regardless, it was obvious he wasn't going to get a chance here. So good luck to him in Winnipeg.

This argument will be revisited in about 1 year when we check in on the season Tangradi is having with them, when he's finally turned 24, which is statistically when his type of player "finds their game." Crow will be served. But to whom?

Yeah, you're right that he never earned the type of ice time he probably needs to develop what potential he has. Not only is his confidence shot, but he never seemed to quite recover from being assaulted by ----face from the Islanders. His play with the Pens has swung between inconsistent and just plain subpar. As far as eating crow goes, though, I probably wouldn't bet on even odds it will be served to either side of the too-polarized Tangradi debate. I'm far from a pro evaluator of hockey talent, but nevertheless I'd put odds at maybe 15% that he vastly exceeds his current expectations, and 30% he quickly washes out of the NHL. The remaining 55% is if he sticks around the NHL, but as a fringe player or 3rd-4th liner. Tangradi strikes me as a case of someone who doesn't have as much talent as the Penguins originally thought, but who also clearly wasn't in the situation to play to what talent level he has. The Pens just couldn't stick him with Malkin and Neal and leave him there all year no matter what. It wouldn't have been fair to the other guys in their organization, and, well, there's a Stanley Cup to go win. Maybe he'll get the minutes he needs in Winnipeg. Right now, he's an inconsistent fringe player with a decent chance of becoming a serviceable 4th liner and an outside shot of becoming a 2nd-line winger. He's shown flashes of good play, just not to the top-line winger level that was sold to us when the Pens traded for him. I don't think he'll ever become that top-line power forward. If that were likely, the Pens would have been able to get a lot more than a 7th round pick for him. But I think there's a good chance he'll eventually be as valuable as, say, Craig Adams (albeit with a very different skill set).

Bylsma's System 101. If Bylsma wins the cup, good move, stay with him long term. If Bylsma fails in the first round again, he needs to be fired. Then we lost a legit forward prospect going forward with a new staff that could have made him work.

I just don't understand Shero/Bylsma logic. Shero - Wants big body NA ala Ducks 2006 cup team. Brings in Gill, Cooke, Kunitz trade. Tough, Physical team. Next year Goligoski's and Leopold's. I just don't know where this team is going. Boychuks over Tangradis okay I'm fine with this. However this team hasn't been as good. Despres/Bortuzzo buffing up the defense is the only thing I've seen resemble what they want to do. But 4 years later?

Didn't he have a pretty serious wrist injury at the height of his output in juniors and never got back to that level? All the best to him. Hard to see a player with some potential gone for nothing, but that's life. The next Tangradi (read: prospect who doesn't live up to expectations) will here soon enough.

One negative to the Tangradi trade is that it may have helped Jersey by permitting The Jets to then move Poni back to the Devils. Not that Poni is that good, but he does know NJ's system and can slide into the line-up replacing Zubrus.

I do agree tangradi had no confidence as a top 6 winger. He looked fine last year in the bottom 6 even played well in that role. If he is going to be a top 6 player it needs to be in place that isn't a Stanley cup contender and where he is playing with one of the top center in the world.

I think they will regret this trade in a few years. Should have had more patience with Tangradi, power forwards take time to develop. If you look at Kevin Stevens stats, he didnt start producing till his 3rd of 4th season. Same thing with Glenn Murray....patience.

I don't think the Pens are really in the position to help this guy develop at the NHL level, if he ever does. He was just dead weight on the roster. Not sure Boychuk is the answer either, but I don't think the Pens should be in the business of wasting Malkin's prime years "developing" a guy like Tangradi.