shafnutz05 wrote:And just think...all of this horrific violence and destruction. Over a **** rinky-dink film that most people would have never, ever heard of if it wasn't for this idiotic overreaction.

I really think this was all planned and they're using the film as a "reason" to do this crap. It's really starting to get scary.

count2infinity wrote:I really think this was all planned and they're using the film as a "reason" to do this crap. It's really starting to get scary.

That is certainly the case with the murder of the ambassador, but all of these other riots/protests are just good old-fashioned extremist nonsense, IMO. I'm sure the mullahs and whatnot are doing their part to roil them up though.

The UT Austin threat was phoned in by someone saying he was al-Qaeda, which to me is proof alone that it is bogus. They don't warn, they kill.

I think the attitude that we can make fun of just about every single creed, belief, race, religion, etc in the world except for Islam, while grounded in reality, is pretty sad. It is truly the only group of people on the PLANET that people are extremely remiss to crack any jokes about. If I was one of the many, many moderate believers, I would find that to be an utterly embarrassing fact.

I don't think anyone is denying that. But there is a difference between terrorist attacks (like the assassination of the ambassador and 9/11), and your garden variety, property-destroying chanting riots. All of these riots in London, etc, are 95% people just throwing an absolute **** fit because someone insulted what they believe in.

count2infinity wrote:I really think this was all planned and they're using the film as a "reason" to do this crap. It's really starting to get scary.

As with the riots and bloodshed following the publications of the Danish Mohammad cartoons, I’m sure this outrage had been carefully fanned and cultivated by persons who want to use it to their political advantage. How better for Islamist movements to cement their recent electoral gains than whipping up some good-old indignant religious fury? After all, don’t people tend to vote more conservative during wartime? How better to get more votes for religious-based parties than to convince the citizenry that their religion is under attack (whether real or imagined)? And it also serves as easy cover to attack unwanted groups of people—not just Westerners, but also local unwanteds like the Christian Copts in Egypt.

For a better insight into what is going on, I suggest reading Silenced: How Apostasy and Blasphemy Codes are Choking Freedom Worldwide . What is going on is no less than an international effort on the part of Muslim-majority nations to change how the Western world defines and enforces its defamation laws. Our laws prohibit the defamation of people, not abstract concepts like religions. We have a right to be aggrieved if someone defames us personally, but not if someone merely attacks or mocks a concept we support, whether that concept is religion or otherwise. Demands to prohibit “religious insults” or anything that “defames religion” are no less than demands to completely change our legal concepts and traditions.

Godric wrote:What's amazing to me is there never seems to be any internal conflict in those radical Islam terror organizations.... They never blow each other up.

It may not be reported so much here, but the primary victims of Muslim terrorists are other Muslims, and Muslims rampantly discriminate against Muslims of other sects. The Silenced book catalogs numerous cases where Shia-majority countries use their blasphemy laws to suppress Sunnis, Sunni-majority countries use their blasphemy laws to suppress Shias, and both of them use their blasphemy laws to suppress Sufis and Ahmadis. The constitution of Pakistan, for example, has a provision that specifically singles out Ahmadiyya followers and declares them to be non-Muslims. If they claim they are, they’re apostates who can be put to death.

Godric wrote:What's amazing to me is there never seems to be any internal conflict in those radical Islam terror organizations.... They never blow each other up.

It may not be reported so much here, but the primary victims of Muslim terrorists are other Muslims, and Muslims rampantly discriminate against Muslims of other sects. The Silenced book catalogs numerous cases where Shia-majority countries use their blasphemy laws to suppress Sunnis, Sunni-majority countries use their blasphemy laws to suppress Shias, and both of them use their blasphemy laws to suppress Sufis and Ahmadis. The constitution of Pakistan, for example, has a provision that specifically singles out Ahmadiyya followers and declares them to be non-Muslims. If they claim they are, they’re apostates who can be put to death.

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I've done a lot of reading about it too, as well as the my first hand experiances.

shafnutz05 wrote:I don't think anyone is denying that. But there is a difference between terrorist attacks (like the assassination of the ambassador and 9/11), and your garden variety, property-destroying chanting riots. All of these riots in London, etc, are 95% people just throwing an absolute **** fit because someone insulted what they believe in.

The absurdity of the "insults" is the total intolerance that exists in these countries for other people's religions(or other's atheism).I disagree about the reason for these riots being insults. These types look for the slightest provocation to go ballistic. What I'd like to see in this countries is picketing and demonstrations at buildings housing CAIR and related apologist groups that lobby and play our news media like a fiddle. It'd be a good idea if Americans would demonstrate on every 9/11 at mosques in our country to protest Muslim violence world wide. I mean peaceful demonstrations, not harassment. Any truly moderate muslims should join such protests.

Geezer wrote:It'd be a good idea if Americans would demonstrate on every 9/11 at mosques in our country to protest Muslim violence world wide. I mean peaceful demonstrations, not harassment. Any truly moderate muslims should join such protests.

You're assuming that the 9/11 attackers were actually representative of the religion?

Geezer wrote:It'd be a good idea if Americans would demonstrate on every 9/11 at mosques in our country to protest Muslim violence world wide. I mean peaceful demonstrations, not harassment. Any truly moderate muslims should join such protests.

You're assuming that the 9/11 attackers were actually representative of the religion?

They were indicative of the extremist behavior done in the name of their religion. If the vast majority of Muslims opposed jihadis they could stop those people tomorrow. It does appear by polls done by non-Fox media(don't want them blamed) that about 3/4 of the Egyptian populace dislikes America. The attitude in most of these countries that some movie a nut made is a more evil act than the murder of 4 Americans. The 9/11 attackers were representative of enough of the Muslim populace that their violent behavior is a major worldwide problem.

To me the key is to focus on opposing the Islamic fundamentalism that is the root cause. I think there's 1.5 billion Muslims.If 10% of them are fundamentalists you're dealing with 150 million people. Of the Islamists who are non-violent and moderate Muslims many have twisted views of events.A survey in Pakistan of educated younger people showed the majority didn't believe 9/11 was an attack by radical Muslims. The clown running Egypt has stated in speeches that 9/11 was an American inside job. I wish that we as a country would challenge that belief system.Sorry to ramble. I believe that the attackers were representative of a high enough percentage of that religion that it needs to be focused on;whether it's 5% or 10%.

Godric wrote:What's amazing to me is there never seems to be any internal conflict in those radical Islam terror organizations.... They never blow each other up.

It may not be reported so much here, but the primary victims of Muslim terrorists are other Muslims, and Muslims rampantly discriminate against Muslims of other sects. The Silenced book catalogs numerous cases where Shia-majority countries use their blasphemy laws to suppress Sunnis, Sunni-majority countries use their blasphemy laws to suppress Shias, and both of them use their blasphemy laws to suppress Sufis and Ahmadis. The constitution of Pakistan, for example, has a provision that specifically singles out Ahmadiyya followers and declares them to be non-Muslims. If they claim they are, they’re apostates who can be put to death.

Thanks. My brother told me about how the Kurds hated all the Muslims in Iraq... He said Kurdish Militias working with US Military would have "accidents" and engage in firefights with other sects and their US militias

What I meant was internal struggles in this organizations like Al Qaeda, Hamas, Hezbollah, TMB, etc

Good point. A lot of them seem to operate in separate countries, like Hezbollah is pretty much in Lebanon and Syria, the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and North Africa, and Hamas in the Palestinian territories. They may not cross paths too often.

It was the case, however, that when Hamas won Palestinian elections in 2006 (interestingly, no elections have been held since then), Hamas members pretty much went around Gaza and liquidated members of Fatah and other rival factions, killing something like 120 people and wounding hundreds. Does that one count?

Good point. A lot of them seem to operate in separate countries, like Hezbollah is pretty much in Lebanon and Syria, the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and North Africa, and Hamas in the Palestinian territories. They may not cross paths too often.

It was the case, however, that when Hamas won Palestinian elections in 2006 (interestingly, no elections have been held since then), Hamas members pretty much went around Gaza and liquidated members of Fatah and other rival factions, killing something like 120 people and wounding hundreds. Does that one count?

Yes, that's sorta what I'm talking about but I suspect Hamas and Fatah are operated by different sects

YouTube refuses to remove anti-Islamic film clipYouTube will not remove a film clip mocking the Islamic Prophet Mohammad that has been blamed for anti-US protests in Egypt and Libya, but it has blocked access to it in those countries. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/g ... -clip.html

columbia wrote:YouTube refuses to remove anti-Islamic film clipYouTube will not remove a film clip mocking the Islamic Prophet Mohammad that has been blamed for anti-US protests in Egypt and Libya, but it has blocked access to it in those countries. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/g ... -clip.html

columbia wrote:YouTube refuses to remove anti-Islamic film clipYouTube will not remove a film clip mocking the Islamic Prophet Mohammad that has been blamed for anti-US protests in Egypt and Libya, but it has blocked access to it in those countries. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/g ... -clip.html

Keep something up causing death and violence, take down anything disney, pro wrestling, music not from the source, cartoons, etc. Well done YouTube.