Because when you're holding the broken body of your dead child, the only thing that can offset that grief is knowing that the firefighter, who pulled little Timmy out of the school, was paid for with monies earmarked for poor brown people.

Nobody is going to get their earmarks cut. There are 99 other Senators and most of them will vote to pass whatever funding bill reaches them, which will almost certainly be a clean bill. This is just Coburn being a jackass trying to have his cake and eat it with regards to disaster spending when he should be trying to do something productive or supportive for his constituents.

No, I don't hate democracy. I also don't embrace the Osama bin Laden "Vote against Bush or all of America will feel my wrath" mentality where we cavalierly talk about "government you deserve" when most elections are decided by a slim majority. Apparently some people do. That's cool.

Of course Bin Laden could have been using reverse psychology knowing how Americans would react to such a threat. But I don't see it any different than Cheney's "It's absolutely essential that eight weeks from today, on Nov. 2, we make the right choice, because if we make the wrong choice then the danger is that we'll get hit again and we'll be hit in a way that will be devastating from the standpoint of the United States,"

Now if bin Laden was making a terroristic threat couldn't the same be said about Cheney?

doyner:Monkeyhouse Zendo: If OK is unwilling to bear the burden of helping other states, why should other states bear the burden of helping them?

Because playing along in that game is bad for us all in the long run.

Should have made it clearer that it was a rhetorical question but, what the hell, it's fark. Yes, playing that game makes us all worse off in the long run. There is a part of me that wants OK to get a taste of the policies they're demanding but I have no doubt that the lesson would be completely lost on most of them.

Mr. Titanium:TheMysteriousStranger: Give him some credit, most Republicans are against aid for everyone else but want money bags for their own state.

He is a nut, but an honest one.

Are you under the impression that the "offsets" he is talking about are coming out of federal money to Oklahoma? The dirtbag wants someone else in the country to take cuts to make up for the money his constituents will get.

Because that wouldn't happen if it just came as a blank check from the general fund? Do you actually read what you type or just let rhetoric have its way?

GoldSpider:Monkeyhouse Zendo: I've read you're posts for a few years now. You're better than this.

I DID limit the direction of my comments to the partisans.

And I also acknowledged upthread that I thought Coburn is being a dick about this.

You might also want to acknowledge that what these horrible partisan democrats are proposing is that we give OK precisely what they've been demanding for the last three decades. The people of OK are not children and there is no reason that we should treat them as such.

Monkeyhouse Zendo:doyner: Monkeyhouse Zendo: If OK is unwilling to bear the burden of helping other states, why should other states bear the burden of helping them?

Because playing along in that game is bad for us all in the long run.

Should have made it clearer that it was a rhetorical question but, what the hell, it's fark. Yes, playing that game makes us all worse off in the long run. There is a part of me that wants OK to get a taste of the policies they're demanding but I have no doubt that the lesson would be completely lost on most of them.

It surely would. It's far better to help them AND let them have their awful delusions, because the alternative is to hurt them and become spiteful. They wouldn't get why they're being punished, and it would probably end up causing needless suffering, so in the balance we should probably just help and then not do that offset thing.

Oklahoma gets $1.35 in Federal spending for every dollar they receive in taxes.

This is a leach state. An entire state of takers.

Yeah, we can definitely find cuts in Federal spending in this state to offset the disaster aid.

and they use that tax deficit to lure jobs from blue states.

Have you been to Oklahoma? That plan is clearly not working.

That being said, I do not approve of punishing people for the sin of voting Republican, nor do I like the idea that our already weak social contact will be further degraded to pay for this tragedy, further compounding our tragedy. It's a kind of sick perpetual sadness machine Coburn is attempting to construct in service to some numbers on a ledger.He's bad, and the people that vote for such ideas are stupid, but helping stupid people without being dicks about it is something you should really strive to do, although I understand the temptation to rub noses in poo a little. But come on, a lot of these people had their homes striped to the foundation.

did you not see the post where I said that I was being sarcastic and only teasing the republicans here on this thread? I sent off a pretty sizable donation (for me anyway) to the Salvation Army in Norman and to the Red Cross yesterday evening. And I'm one of those heartless,godless atheist libby libs. I just think that people need to own up to the real world consequences of their politics

And I also acknowledged upthread that I thought Coburn is being a dick about this.

You might also want to acknowledge that what these horrible partisan democrats are proposing is that we give OK precisely what they've been demanding for the last three decades. The people of OK are not children and there is no reason that we should treat them as such.

unfortunately a lot of them are children and they are homeless or without parents. that being said it's hard to teach people a lesson without some tough love.

Duke Phillips' Singing Bears:That being said, I do not approve of punishing people for the sin of voting Republican, nor do I like the idea that our already weak social contact will be further degraded to pay for this tragedy, further compounding our tragedy. It's a kind of sick perpetual sadness machine Coburn is attempting to construct in service to some numbers on a ledger.He's bad, and the people that vote for such ideas are stupid, but helping stupid people without being dicks about it is something you should really strive to do, although I understand the temptation to rub noses in poo a little. But come on, a lot of these people had their homes striped to the foundation.

Monkeyhouse Zendo:You might also want to acknowledge that what these horrible partisan democrats are proposing is that we give OK precisely what they've been demanding for the last three decades. The people of OK are not children and there is no reason that we should treat them as such.

On the other hand, this could be a teachable moment to the people of Oklahoma about the role and ability of the federal government in a limited crisis. But considering they already receive $1.35 of funding for every dollar they contribute, perhaps my optimism is undue.

Electriclectic:I think I actually appreciate this more than Ted Cruz saying disaster relief is pork, then turning around and asking for it after the Waco explosion. This Oklahoma guy might be an asshole, but at least he's consistent.

Consistently evil and ignorant, but consistent nonetheless.

Agree with sentiment except'''''

/Waco didn't explode, that was West// Koresh thing was in Elk/// Slashes come in threes

GoldSpider:Monkeyhouse Zendo: You might also want to acknowledge that what these horrible partisan democrats are proposing is that we give OK precisely what they've been demanding for the last three decades. The people of OK are not children and there is no reason that we should treat them as such.

On the other hand, this could be a teachable moment to the people of Oklahoma about the role and ability of the federal government in a limited crisis. But considering they already receive $1.35 of funding for every dollar they contribute, perhaps my optimism is undue.

If the people of Oklahoma could be taught, they wouldn't live in f$cking Oklahoma.

skullkrusher:Satanic_Hamster: Fine. I'm sure we can find budget cuts of Federal spending in Oklahoma to compensate.

yeah! Fark those poor and needy in OK! That'll show Coburn!

This is why you people aren't nearly as wise or compassionate as you like to tell each other you are.

I don't know who the "you people" you are referring to is here. But taking the cuts from Oklahoma is a terrible idea -- the only thing thing "good" about it is that it would be so unpopular that it likely wouldn't happen.

The whole point of making disaster aid a federal program is it spreads the cost as widely as possible, just like insurance. Other terrible ideas: offsetting the cost by budget cuts elsewhere, refusing to provide federal disaster aid, eliminating FEMA, and making states run their own disaster aid programs.

This is why you people aren't nearly as wise or compassionate as you like to tell each other you are.

I don't know who the "you people" you are referring to is here. But taking the cuts from Oklahoma is a terrible idea -- the only thing thing "good" about it is that it would be so unpopular that it likely wouldn't happen.

The whole point of making disaster aid a federal program is it spreads the cost as widely as possible, just like insurance. Other terrible ideas: offsetting the cost by budget cuts elsewhere, refusing to provide federal disaster aid, eliminating FEMA, and making states run their own disaster aid programs.

people like the poster I was responding to. Ya know, more progressive than thou, hypocritical as hell, anyone who disagrees with them must shiat GOP bunting and promise rings... Ya know, those people

GoldSpider:Monkeyhouse Zendo: You might also want to acknowledge that what these horrible partisan democrats are proposing is that we give OK precisely what they've been demanding for the last three decades. The people of OK are not children and there is no reason that we should treat them as such.

On the other hand, this could be a teachable moment to the people of Oklahoma about the role and ability of the federal government in a limited crisis. But considering they already receive $1.35 of funding for every dollar they contribute, perhaps my optimism is undue.

So true. I've always found the aftermath of natural disasters that include loss of life to be the best time to lessons on fiscal responsibility. If you wait until all of the bodies are found, you've waited too long.

skullkrusher:people like the poster I was responding to. Ya know, more progressive than thou, hypocritical as hell, anyone who disagrees with them must shiat GOP bunting and promise rings... Ya know, those people

So the ones that live in your imagination. Thanks for clearing that up, it was getting a little confusing when we thought you were talking about, you know, actual people.

Uranus Is Huge!:So true. I've always found the aftermath of natural disasters that include loss of life to be the best time to lessons on fiscal responsibility. If you wait until all of the bodies are found, you've waited too long.

I have a feeling that if the GOP stonewalls aid, the people affected (including the most staunch Republican voters) will remember. Personal tragedy has the potential to challenge the most stubborn of beliefs.

Uranus Is Huge!:So true. I've always found the aftermath of natural disasters that include loss of life to be the best time to lessons on fiscal responsibility. If you wait until all of the bodies are found, you've waited too long.

Uranus Is Huge!:So true. I've always found the aftermath of natural disasters mass shootings that include loss of life to be the best time to lessons on fiscal responsibility gun control. If you wait until all of the bodies are found, you've waited too long.

no more than voting for a party that wants to take food out of the mouths of babies.

That's it. Fark has to change its name to tuquoque.com

That is pretty much the ONLY argument type ever made these days.

so when you vote to take end school lunches, cut food stamps, deny medical care etc. and to use that money to buy tanks and jets the pentagon doesn't even want that's being fiscally responsible and bootstrappy? but when someone mentions letting your own ideology punish you and that the consequences of your party's politics have repercussions that bite you on the ass it's sociopathic? got it.

Coburn isn't saying that he wants to prevent aid from going to his state. What he is saying is, "The residents of my state want aid, damn right, and we want it toot suite, but we also demand cuts to these here slave reparations goin' to the lazy urbanites who done stole the election for history's greatest monster. Money should go to REAL MURCANS, not these here lazy urbanites."

no more than voting for a party that wants to take food out of the mouths of babies.

That's it. Fark has to change its name to tuquoque.com

That is pretty much the ONLY argument type ever made these days.

Well, what's left when logic, reason and empirical data are off the table?

put them back on?Or we can piss our pants for eternity about overblown "scandals" and the fact that a senator's spokesman may or may not have handled a question about a natural disaster in a public relations friendly manner

GoldSpider:Uranus Is Huge!: So true. I've always found the aftermath of natural disasters mass shootings that include loss of life to be the best time to lessons on fiscal responsibility gun control. If you wait until all of the bodies are found, you've waited too long.

Indeed.

The wrong time for talk about gun control: Right after a mass shootingThe wrong time for talk about gun control: When there hasn't been a mass shooting for a whileThe right time to talk about gun control: One divided by zero

The right time to talk about fiscal responsibility: Right after a natural disasterThe right time to talk about fiscal responsibility: When there hasn't been a natural disaster for a whileThe wrong time to talk about fiscal responsibility: Bill to build tanks the Pentagon doesn't want

This is why you people aren't nearly as wise or compassionate as you like to tell each other you are.

I don't know who the "you people" you are referring to is here. But taking the cuts from Oklahoma is a terrible idea -- the only thing thing "good" about it is that it would be so unpopular that it likely wouldn't happen.

The whole point of making disaster aid a federal program is it spreads the cost as widely as possible, just like insurance. Other terrible ideas: offsetting the cost by budget cuts elsewhere, refusing to provide federal disaster aid, eliminating FEMA, and making states run their own disaster aid programs.

people like the poster I was responding to. Ya know, more progressive than thou, hypocritical as hell, anyone who disagrees with them must shiat GOP bunting and promise rings... Ya know, those people

Why is disaster spending something that needs to be off set with cuts elsewhere? Why not raise taxes or have a dedicated tax for disaster relief? It just sounds like another excuse to pander to the tea party and cut funding for stuff the GOP doesn't like, just like every other time they've brought up the budget since 2009. l believe the GOP is serious about the budget when they include cuts to defense and/or tax increases on anyone but poor people

Disaster relief should be one thing that we just pay for because we need to help our citizens.

This is why you people aren't nearly as wise or compassionate as you like to tell each other you are.

I don't know who the "you people" you are referring to is here. But taking the cuts from Oklahoma is a terrible idea -- the only thing thing "good" about it is that it would be so unpopular that it likely wouldn't happen.

The whole point of making disaster aid a federal program is it spreads the cost as widely as possible, just like insurance. Other terrible ideas: offsetting the cost by budget cuts elsewhere, refusing to provide federal disaster aid, eliminating FEMA, and making states run their own disaster aid programs.

people like the poster I was responding to. Ya know, more progressive than thou, hypocritical as hell, anyone who disagrees with them must shiat GOP bunting and promise rings... Ya know, those people

I'm pretty sure Satanic_Hamster was being sarcastic though.

My first thought was they should take the offsets from the Senate's budget -- going without toilet paper for a while might make them rethink voting for offsets.

Baryogenesis:Why is disaster spending something that needs to be off set with cuts elsewhere? Why not raise taxes or have a dedicated tax for disaster relief? It just sounds like another excuse to pander to the tea party and cut funding for stuff the GOP doesn't like, just like every other time they've brought up the budget since 2009. l believe the GOP is serious about the budget when they include cuts to defense and/or tax increases on anyone but poor people

Disaster relief should be one thing that we just pay for because we need to help our citizens.

Look man, you don't just come into a thread when it's halfway over and state a logical proposition. You need to read half of it, pick a target, and respond angrily if you're going to get any traction around here.

This is why you people aren't nearly as wise or compassionate as you like to tell each other you are.

I don't know who the "you people" you are referring to is here. But taking the cuts from Oklahoma is a terrible idea -- the only thing thing "good" about it is that it would be so unpopular that it likely wouldn't happen.

The whole point of making disaster aid a federal program is it spreads the cost as widely as possible, just like insurance. Other terrible ideas: offsetting the cost by budget cuts elsewhere, refusing to provide federal disaster aid, eliminating FEMA, and making states run their own disaster aid programs.

Given that the governor of Oklahoma is willing to lose federal funding because she doesn't want to conform to Obamacare, I assume that things like federal insurance programs are just "not bootstrappy enough". It's MUCH better to wait for a disaster to happen and then get bailed out by the rest the country (who are already subsidizing your state)...and then turn around and claim that the states you are leeching off of are the real leeches.