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2 big missed FT's by Pierce... I understand they'll never be 100% from the stripe, but when Deron hits all of his FT's, I expect the C's best player to match that...

1) Agreed. They are professionals and paid to rebound among other things. Should have their pay docked for the lack of performance on the boards.

2) First game action of the season. Give him the benefit of the doubt.Thought his physicality and hard foul were the start of the change in attitude that carried the C's up to the end.

3) Agreed. Have to make your foul shots and especially so with the game on the line. Pierce's misses and subsequent foul... poor execution followed by a brain fart.... from your veteran captain in crunch time are hard to overcome. But don't you have to include Terry's misses as well?

Last edited by Opalmerr; 11-16-2012 at 07:24 AM.

Chris Mannix ‏@ChrisMannixSI  14m   More
SI: Statistics suggest Joel Embiid will fully recover from foot surgery. But it could be 9-12 months before he plays http://bit.ly/1qwZuIB

they have similar games. they both have the ability so drive to the hoop, shoot the 3, good mid range jump shot, solid D. Why else do you think he was signed for 4 years? Pierce is on his way out, Green is going to be his replacement

The bolded part is likely true.

They are completely different in terms of how they achieve things. Pierce has always been more rugged / physical in his play than athletic / high flying. Green is not known for his physical play. He's an athletic player that relies on speed and quickness far more than physical play.

Chris Mannix ‏@ChrisMannixSI  14m   More
SI: Statistics suggest Joel Embiid will fully recover from foot surgery. But it could be 9-12 months before he plays http://bit.ly/1qwZuIB

If this is true, then haven't Doc and Co. failed at their job as coaches?

We can assume that the 4 returning starters know 100% of the offense.

Green and Wilcox have limited experience with Celtics so they probably don't know 100% of the offense.

Everyone else is new to the team. What % of the offense do they know?

By this logic, Doc can never put 5 players on the floor that know 100% of the offense, correct?

And offense was not the problem last night - transition defense, abysmal rebounding in the first half and missed layups / free throws late were.

Doc has had enough trouble getting all his new players involved this season. Now, take away his one constant on offense over the years and good luck. Changing lineups an integrating players has and always will be Doc's glaring weakness. A lot of coaches would be able to adjust, but not Doc.

I think this also shows that Rondo is more important to this team than KG. Take Rondo out of a playoff series and we'll have zero shot at winning. We could definitely win a playoff series without KG.

"Stats are for losers. The final score is for winners." - Bill Belichick

I do not question Rondo's importance to the team. Doc throwing out the arbitrary figure of 80% of the offense being lost ... to me it was a pre-game excuse for losing. Maybe he thought he was taking pressure off the rest of the guards by lowering the expectations for them.

And Doc & co. had these guys for a full camp. Is it reasonable to believe such a disparity in knowledge of the offense exists? Got some dumbass players or pee poor coaching if that is actually the case?

Last edited by Opalmerr; 11-16-2012 at 08:59 AM.

Chris Mannix ‏@ChrisMannixSI  14m   More
SI: Statistics suggest Joel Embiid will fully recover from foot surgery. But it could be 9-12 months before he plays http://bit.ly/1qwZuIB

1. Rebounding- Celtics do not have the players they need to battle on the boards. The players they do have do not hit the glass. Conclusion- I don't see any real change unless the Celtics make trade/ add, and/ current Celtic players focus more on hitting the glass.

2. No one but K. Garnett- When he leaves the court, Boston Celtics are awful. Other teams know they have NO ONE inside. Teams can then cheat, double down on switchs, get second/third shots. Conclusion- I don't see any real change unless Celtics make trade add/ and Darko, Wilcox step up and play better than they are capable.

3. Team chemistry- The team is still learning to play together. Guys are still figuring out their roles and options. Conclusion- This will improve greatly as the season progresses.

4. Age @ Injury- This teams key players are very old. PP, KG, JT are at the end, and it shows at times. Conclusion- Let's hope they can stay healthy, if not all bets are off.

Conclusion- Celtics will finish top four team east. Boston will not beat Heat, lakers, Thunder, Spurs, ext.... with this team.

2. No one but K. Garnett- When he leaves the court, Boston Celtics are awful. Other teams know they have NO ONE inside. Teams can then cheat, double down on switchs, get second/third shots. Conclusion- I don't see any real change unless Celtics make trade add/ and Darko, Wilcox step up and play better than they are capable.

I understand KG's importance to the team.

The starters are geting the team off to a slow start. It is the bench that has actually put the team in position to win games. Then the starters come in and struggle to finish it off. The bench is pretty damn good compared to the opponents benches they have faced.

I think one reason for the slow starts is playing KG and Pierce together. Two old war horses. Each have value and still contribute but when on the floor together the C's are sloooooow. This is one reason why I have and will continue to advocate for Green to start in Pierce's place.

Originally Posted by Bird Fan

3. Team chemistry- The team is still learning to play together. Guys are still figuring out their roles and options. Conclusion- This will improve greatly as the season progresses.

I agree with this. As stated above, I think there is still tinkering to do, but there have been positive signs. The bench has seen different players provide different types of spark in each of the recent games. This team looks to be 11 deep once Bradley returns.

That said, Sullinger's time is already decreasing and I fear Doc might be deciding he is not ready to contribute after all. That will lead to more minutes for Green at the 4 and likely move Lee to more minutes at the 3. We saw some of this a couple games ago... and it didn't look too bad.

** They built this team to go small... by default rebounding is going to be an issue, esecially so when they don't box out. The focus has to be on match ups - forcing other teams to counter what the C's do and go small themselves.

Last edited by Opalmerr; 11-16-2012 at 12:52 PM.

Chris Mannix ‏@ChrisMannixSI  14m   More
SI: Statistics suggest Joel Embiid will fully recover from foot surgery. But it could be 9-12 months before he plays http://bit.ly/1qwZuIB

The starters are geting the team off to a slow start. It is the bench that has actually put the team in position to win games. Then the starters come in and struggle to finish it off. The bench is pretty damn good compared to the opponents benches they have faced.

I think one reason for the slow starts is playing KG and Pierce together. Two old war horses. Each have value and still contribute but when on the floor together the C's are sloooooow. This is one reason why I have and will continue to advocate for Green to start in Pierce's place.

I agree with this. As stated above, I think there is still tinkering to do, but there have been positive signs. The bench has seen different players provide different types of spark in each of the recent games. This team looks to be 11 deep once Bradley returns.

That said, Sullinger's time is already decreasing and I fear Doc might be deciding he is not ready to contribute after all. That will lead to more minutes for Green at the 4 and likely move Lee to more minutes at the 3. We saw some of this a couple games ago... and it didn't look too bad.

** They built this team to go small... by default rebounding is going to be an issue, esecially so when they don't box out. The focus has to be on match ups - forcing other teams to counter what the C's do and go small themselves.

Yeah, some good points here. I think we understand the Celtics team is, " aways off. " Will they get there? Not likely, but your a little more optimistic than myself. Im ok with that.

I just have heard this song a few times before.......I know how it sounds.

I hope im off, my wife thinks im wrong a lot.....yeah....I lose a lot, a whole lot!...a lot, but I still control the remote

1) Agreed. They are professionals and paid to rebound among other things. Should have their pay docked for the lack of performance on the boards.

2) First game action of the season. Give him the benefit of the doubt.Thought his physicality and hard foul were the start of the change in attitude that carried the C's up to the end.

3) Agreed. Have to make your foul shots and especially so with the game on the line. Pierce's misses and subsequent foul... poor execution followed by a brain fart.... from your veteran captain in crunch time are hard to overcome. But don't you have to include Terry's misses as well?

I'll give the benefit of doubt for first game action to short jumpers and FT's... Not TWO uncontested lay-ups for a 7 footer... The minute he missed the second I had a bad feeling and knew those misses would coume back to bite em in the arsh...

Aside from that I, the positives I took from that game was:

- Showing in the second half how they COULD a better rebounding team...

- Barbosa continues to show how important he will be...

- Lee is starting to settle down in Doc's system...

Last edited by Forever35; 11-16-2012 at 05:51 PM.

"I've never been scared of contact. Now I get to bring it, that's what I love to do, so I'm going to bring it."