To basically just cut in line when they feel like it. Clearly this guy is a regular and friends with the operators but i think it's BS that he basically would fall walk right back to the front of the line have the operator give a handle and off he would go. Maybe this is common since they don't have to strap in but it got quite aggravating. Oh well boat will be ready in a few days so wont have to go back there for a while.

I really dont mind it if there is a wakeskater in line behind me waiting for me to put my boots on and he jumps ahead. I usually tell them to go ahead of me. But if they just run up there without being told they can it gets a little frustrating. No offense to wake skaters, but they usually fall very quickly anyway so it all works out.

LR3 yes was there this weekend. Noticed you were there on my way out as I saw a LR3 with a Malibu sticker on it . This actually happened 2 weeks in a row (2 different operators) as my boat has been in the shop the past 2 weeks so have been hitting the cable park. Sad thing is I actually started to like riding cable this past 2 weeks as I nutted up and started hitting the kicker (man is that thing fun) and now I really have no desire to go back as it really left a sour taste in my mouth. I have really come to find that people in this area who can ride real good act like their **** don't stink and they are gods cause they are good on a wakeboard, with the exception of Justin Savich and the Link brothers.

^^really? Not calling you out, obviously entitled to your opinion, but is this a joke or are you for real? Trust me I've met some tools and agree to a certain extent. But for every tool I know 3 or 4 really good people that rip. Plus you've been a member for a year yet your profile says nothing at all? Why so secretive? Just stirring the pot or do you actually believe this?

Hilarious. I meet more and more young skaters that feel this way. I overheard this grungy little scrub walking around the boat show last year talking **** about wakeboarding, openly. He seemed offended that people were buying wakeboards instead of wakeskates. I was blown away. And he was working a booth!

Skating is cool, and very difficult, but it's not for everyone. I respect it, but I personally don't want to sit in the boat all day and watch you fall 20 times trying a surface trick. If there's no go-big, it's kind of boring.

Wakeskating is difficult and not very showy for the skills required to do the tricks. Plus the level of body building in the exercise you get is minimal compared to the tricks in wakeboarding. IMO it's an exercise in technique, and doesn't do much for me. I like to pack intense exercise in my time on the water and wakeskating doesn't give near the bang for the buck as wakeboarding. If you are a kid with plenty of time to spend on the water none of that may mean much,

Alrighty guys, I feel like I should step in here and urge y'all to cool it, because it really isn't what it looks like. At McCormick's, we don't always line up single file. Personally, when there's a big line, I like to memorize my spot in line and then go take a seat in that comfy lawn chair next to the operator's stand. You know the one. I usually don't even put my boots on until it's almost my turn. And then I stand up and jump in.

The problem with this is that some people don't notice how long I've been there and assume that I just showed up and jumped the whole line. Others don't think it's fair that I get to sit down and they don't, which is a perfectly legitimate criticism. This can lead to some ruffled feathers, so some of the operators have been telling me and other regulars to stop doing this and just stand in line. I am happy to comply.

Another thing I do to avoid hurt feelings is let people cut me when it's my turn. This has become a habit, and I usually let at least 2 or 3 guys go even if they got there after me. So, in short, consider the possibility that the regular wakeskater or wakeboarder chatting to the operator at the front of the line might have been waiting to ride for longer than you were.

I think this issue can be resolved easily if you just say something. No one ever calls me out for line jumping. NEVER. If they did, I would have the chance to politely explain to them that I was there first, and as long as they did it politely, I would almost certainly let them go ahead of me anyway. I'm a nice guy and McCormick's is my happy place! I don't want any petty drama with anyone, so if you have a problem with my queueing behavior (as the brits would say ), don't hesitate to take it up with me. As long as you aren't being a dick about it, I'd much rather give up my spot in line then argue with you. What's an extra 2 minutes? It's just not worth it.

Alrighty guys, I feel like I should step in here and urge y'all to cool it, because it really isn't what it looks like. At McCormick's, we don't always line up single file. Personally, when there's a big line, I like to memorize my spot in line and then go take a seat in that comfy lawn chair next to the operator's stand. You know the one. I usually don't even put my boots on until it's almost my turn. And then I stand up and jump in.

The problem with this is that some people don't notice how long I've been there and assume that I just showed up and jumped the whole line. Others don't think it's fair that I get to sit down and they don't, which is a perfectly legitimate criticism. This can lead to some ruffled feathers, so some of the operators have been telling me and other regulars to stop doing this and just stand in line. I am happy to comply.

Another thing I do to avoid hurt feelings is let people cut me when it's my turn. This has become a habit, and I usually let at least 2 or 3 guys go even if they got there after me. So, in short, consider the possibility that the regular wakeskater or wakeboarder chatting to the operator at the front of the line might have been waiting to ride for longer than you were.

I think this issue can be resolved easily if you just say something. No one ever calls me out for line jumping. NEVER. If they did, I would have the chance to politely explain to them that I was there first, and as long as they did it politely, I would almost certainly let them go ahead of me anyway. I'm a nice guy and McCormick's is my happy place! I don't want any petty drama with anyone, so if you have a problem with my queueing behavior (as the brits would say ), don't hesitate to take it up with me. As long as you aren't being a dick about it, I'd much rather give up my spot in line then argue with you. What's an extra 2 minutes? It's just not worth it.

Why complicate things? This isn't the 3rd world where standing in line is foreign concept. Just line up like everyone else and don't detract from other peoples experience.
McCormick's is the worst for this type of behavior and it does make it unpleasant for non "locals". If you're too tired to stand in line take a rest break.

Some of us have travelled a long way and endured a lot of BS and expense just to get to ride some cable The last thing I want to do is risk being a "dick" and have to confront you. I just want to have fun , stress free, experience when I'm there.

Plus the level of body building in the exercise you get is minimal compared to the tricks in wakeboarding. IMO it's an exercise in technique, and doesn't do much for me. I like to pack intense exercise in my time on the water and wakeskating doesn't give near the bang for the buck as wakeboarding.

First off, I am going to post this question in the wakeskating forum and put the link here. I am curious what the cable skaters say.
second if anybody tried to cut in front of me with their "memorized" spot I would push them off the dock. I see your thinking hammer, but it doesn't fly. Can I do that at an amusement park with a 3 hour wait to ride the rollercoaster? Can I do that at the bank, movies, concert ticket line? All no.
WAIT IN LINE AND WAIT YOUR TURN NO MATTER WHAT YOU RIDE.

^^^And yet we wonder why the boat guys cant stand the cable guys. Dude's MC is in the shop, so he hits up his local park and notices this stuff going on. Sounds like he had fun otherwise but then a comment like this will just push him away further. Why would he want to be a weekend warrior at the park if hes being a weekend warrior with a boat full of people on the water?

First off, I am going to post this question in the wakeskating forum and put the link here. I am curious what the cable skaters say.
second if anybody tried to cut in front of me with their "memorized" spot I would push them off the dock. I see your thinking hammer, but it doesn't fly. Can I do that at an amusement park with a 3 hour wait to ride the rollercoaster? Can I do that at the bank, movies, concert ticket line? All no.
WAIT IN LINE AND WAIT YOUR TURN NO MATTER WHAT YOU RIDE.

Easy there, killer! I see your point, but I really think it comes down to attitude. The McCormick's regulars like myself enjoy the place because of its chill atmosphere. We wanna come out and fool around with our friends. We don't want it to be run like a water park with strictly enforced rules and hordes of pushy people. We don't mind if we have to wait for one more rope. Wakeboarding is supposed to be fun. Don't stress about queueing!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luker

Kook thread Pay your dues and you get the perks... be a weekend warrior and get treated like one.

Ya, some people take that attitude. I have definitely paid my dues at McCormick's, but I really try not to act entitled because I remember what it was like to come in there as a newbie and build my reputation up from scratch. I was welcomed by veterans who took me in and made me a part of the culture there, and I try to do the same for others. I'll never be the "don't you know who I am?!" guy. I hate those people.

I really was not trying to start a wakeskater vs wakeboarder thread. Seth, this guy was not there waiting and then jumping in line when it was his turn. I would watch him fall, walk right back to the dock , get handed a handle and off he would go.

Luker - Jokes buddy. You have no idea who I am to call me a weekend warrior so get your facts straight before you run your mouth.

At the end of the day, yes, I am very impatient but have no problem waiting my turn like everyone else does but to see this was just irritating. I actually went to say something to the operator but he either heard me and completely ignored me or maybe he didn't hear me as he was not really paying attention.

^^ i advise you to re-read my comment sir. I didn't call you a weekend warrior... I simply made a statement about weekend warriors. i would however call you a kook tho... kooks are people who get online and complain about getting cut infront of at a cable park.

all of this being said... i would never cut in front of somebody and would more likely than not give up my spot to someone i've never seen at the cable before.... i'm just saying its lame to come on here and complain about it

Why complicate things? This isn't the 3rd world where standing in line is foreign concept. Just line up like everyone else and don't detract from other peoples experience.
McCormick's is the worst for this type of behavior and it does make it unpleasant for non "locals". If you're too tired to stand in line take a rest break.

Some of us have travelled a long way and endured a lot of BS and expense just to get to ride some cable The last thing I want to do is risk being a "dick" and have to confront you. I just want to have fun , stress free, experience when I'm there.

That's how all of America is, too afraid of a minor conflict "Excuse me sir, did you just cut me because I've been waiting in line forever". Conflict doesn't mean being a dick or a yelling match, you want hebrew to stand in line like everyone, he wants to talk to his buds while he waits, if you feel wronged you should say hey.

Kook thread Pay your dues and you get the perks... be a weekend warrior and get treated like one.

Its the weekend warriors who keep this industry afloat. They are the ones forking out $120k for a boat. Not your daily cable rats.
Act like a dick, and expect to get treated like one. Either online or in person. It could have been solved by a simple comment to the cable operator, but it wasnt. That doesnt make the person a kook for discussing it online on a wakeboarding site. They were just curious to see if this was a regular occurence at other parks.

Luker. What is exactly paying your dues? In my mind paying your dues is taking off work, pissing off your wife and paying for a plane ticket to go ride in another state because you aren't lucky enough to have a cable nearby.
A spoilt little bitch cutting line and doing laps on daddy's money playing the "local" card doesn't exactly cut it for me.........

Train - read the guys original post and tell me if you actually think he was posing a legitimate question or if he was venting / ranting about something that pissed him off.

Stuart - people who cut in line are turds... but it happens. locals get the benefit of the doubt in most cases... they sit and wait in long lines day after day.... so if you see one get special treatment just chalk it up to not being a local and keep riding. my point is getting worked up about localism / regulars getting their perks is just a waste of time

What part of my post made you think I was worrying? Wakeboarding is the only exercise I engage in. IMO it's a nearly optimal exercise and I can maintain great shape with only a few hours a week at the park.

Work on your reading comprehension skills and you'll understand the point I was making. Or I can a spell it out for you again... Wakeskating doesn't offer the intensity of workout in the same period of time as wakeboarding. That's important to me because I don't have a lot of free time.

I really was not trying to start a wakeskater vs wakeboarder thread. Seth, this guy was not there waiting and then jumping in line when it was his turn. I would watch him fall, walk right back to the dock , get handed a handle and off he would go.

That sounds like a problem with the park or operator. I've seen that only a few times at OWC and not recently.

Even hanging out remembering your place in line could be a problem if a lot of people started doing it at OWC because it has dual lines. If I'm not in the mood for a break I usually count the people in each before selecting which line.

Does this "being a local" logic apply to 2 tower systems? If so could one of you line cutters call placid wake park up here in Michigan for me and explain since I go there all the time that I don't have to wait my turn. Imagine if 10-15 local wakeskaters showed up at one time, all us weekend warriors would not get to ride at all
Btw, i have been to owc 3 times and have seen byerly, grassman and Gerry nunn ride and they all waited in line so you guys must be cooler than those guys.

Lets try to stay on the topic... The issue isn't with skaters, it's with people not waiting their turn. I live in California so I've only ridden cable a few times in other states/countries and haven't noticed this happening but if you don't like people cutting in front of you then say something to them.

"Locals"... really?!?! Are we going to start acting like children and fight over territory like surfers because we're "locals"

That's how all of America is, too afraid of a minor conflict "Excuse me sir, did you just cut me because I've been waiting in line forever". Conflict doesn't mean being a dick or a yelling match, you want hebrew to stand in line like everyone, he wants to talk to his buds while he waits, if you feel wronged you should say hey.

I've been to OWC and McCormick's each only once and didn't deal with line cutting, but at my home cable it's pretty customary for, if someone is new/just showing up, to get to go to the front for a pull before getting in line.

Train - read the guys original post and tell me if you actually think he was posing a legitimate question or if he was venting / ranting about something that pissed him off.

Stuart - people who cut in line are turds... but it happens. locals get the benefit of the doubt in most cases... they sit and wait in long lines day after day.... so if you see one get special treatment just chalk it up to not being a local and keep riding. my point is getting worked up about localism / regulars getting their perks is just a waste of time

It was a little bit of both but still a legitimate question! I apologize if I misspoke but your weekend warrior comment sounded like it was directed towards me. I have no problem being called a kook. Just means I am less boring then you.

DeeCee (jaybee)- I am one of the operators that was working last weekend. Im sorry that you felt as though you were treated unfairly. Operators should not be allowing anyone to cut in line but there are some times when this is going to happen. When beginner riders are waiting in line to do a sitting start, they may need additional time to get set or may need assistance on the start. If there is an open carrier approaching the dock but the beginner is not ready, the operator can quickly hand the handle to a more advanced rider or wakeskater who can quickly take off. It is more efficient to do this than to let an empty carrier pass. My best reccomendation to avoid this issue is to learn some sort of standing start so you are not caught up behind beginners in the sitting line who may take longer. If someone was just straight cutting to the front of the line, that is an issue that needs to be brought to the attention of the operator. Luker is somewhat right when he says "pay your dues and get the perks" but not in the sence that operators blatantly hook up their friends. It just means that if I dont know your ability level im not going to quickly send you off with the chance you will fall or run over another fallen rider, when I know the ability of the local riders and I know I can send them without endangering others. At McCormicks we dont really have set "rules" on how the line works but we try to keep it as fair as we can. Thank you for bringing this issue to our attention, it is something the staff will discuss further and try to make better.

As far as you saying "people in this area who can ride real good act like their **** dont stink and they are gods..." I dont know where this is coming from. If you approach any of the good riders at McCormicks and need advice or help on something they will be more than happy to take time out to help you progress. I will be happy to meet you (or anyone else) out there anytime, introduce you to the locals, and get you to a point in your riding where you can be one of the guys who can jump in line and take off right before that empty carrier passes. I hope you do not write off the park based on this experience.

take a look before the skurfer and you'll find free boarding (basically riding a surf board behind the boat without bindings). Tony Finn did not invent wakeboarding but he did commercialize it, and wakeskating didn't come directly from wakeboarding. Some of the comments on here are totally ridiculous. Wakeskating isn't luck and requires a ton of board control. Wakesurfing is for those who can't handle the commitment wakeskating requires. And i would like to know how far anyone on here actually progressed before they decided wakeskating was lame. And wakeskating is far from being about surface tricks. I don't know who you've been watching but you're not paying attention to what's really going on.

/rant, where were we with the hating on line cutters. The way this thread went, I feel like I'm on a playground...

Andrew, thanks for the post from a different perspective. Last time I was at a cable I did notice some of the standing starters getting to rush off before the ones sitting down. I did not think much of it but knowing the reasoning for it deftinately makes sense. The faster you can get the person in front of me on carrier the quicker I can move to the front of the line as well! As an operator have you been abel to help people with hitting the rails? I have attempted a few times at Hydrous here in Texas but seem to only have the nerve when the cable speed is lower. I just never feel like I have a good line at it when moving faster

DeeCee (jaybee)- I am one of the operators that was working last weekend. Im sorry that you felt as though you were treated unfairly. Operators should not be allowing anyone to cut in line but there are some times when this is going to happen. When beginner riders are waiting in line to do a sitting start, they may need additional time to get set or may need assistance on the start. If there is an open carrier approaching the dock but the beginner is not ready, the operator can quickly hand the handle to a more advanced rider or wakeskater who can quickly take off. It is more efficient to do this than to let an empty carrier pass. My best reccomendation to avoid this issue is to learn some sort of standing start so you are not caught up behind beginners in the sitting line who may take longer. If someone was just straight cutting to the front of the line, that is an issue that needs to be brought to the attention of the operator. Luker is somewhat right when he says "pay your dues and get the perks" but not in the sence that operators blatantly hook up their friends. It just means that if I dont know your ability level im not going to quickly send you off with the chance you will fall or run over another fallen rider, when I know the ability of the local riders and I know I can send them without endangering others. At McCormicks we dont really have set "rules" on how the line works but we try to keep it as fair as we can. Thank you for bringing this issue to our attention, it is something the staff will discuss further and try to make better.

As far as you saying "people in this area who can ride real good act like their **** dont stink and they are gods..." I dont know where this is coming from. If you approach any of the good riders at McCormicks and need advice or help on something they will be more than happy to take time out to help you progress. I will be happy to meet you (or anyone else) out there anytime, introduce you to the locals, and get you to a point in your riding where you can be one of the guys who can jump in line and take off right before that empty carrier passes. I hope you do not write off the park based on this experience.

Thank you for the reply. It really was a legitimate question as if all the answers were yes thats thats the way it is it would have been dropped and I would have sucked it up.

About my comment about the good wakeboarders, I was talking mostly about boat riders and I could be well off base. I was just stating my previous experiences. I have heard the same things you said about the riders at McCormiks always being wiling to help out.

In any case, boat will be out of the shop next week, so if you can get off work and want to come take a boat set next weekend just let me know.

At wakenation one weekend there were a ton of kids on kneeboards doing sliding starts off the dock and riding at least 10 laps around the middle. The very intelligent operator realized this and was letting 2 experienced standing starters go for every sliding kneeboarder. The hardcore wakeboarders are usually making 3-4 laps and falling off something. Bottom line: kneeboarders were standing in a long line for a long ride and wakeboarders had a short line for a short ride. Big props to the operator at WN in Cincinnati

I hate to say you're wrong, but you are. Wakeskating you can go just as big as wakeboarding and its more like skateboarding because you can do board flips with them. Unless you think wakeboarding and skateboarding are slow, boring, and not physical

I have been to McCormick's quite a bit, some riding and a lot just watching, and I have to say that, although I love the "family feel" of the place, and how everyone knows each other, there may be some favoritism over there. I've noticed the everyday regular's and maybe some off-duty employees (...?) who cut in line, but I've never heard anyone complain about it so I didn't think it was an issue. Also, I agree that if you get in line, you need to stay in line. If you need to take a rest, get out of line until you are ready to go again. That wouldn't fly in any other queue in the world, and you know it.

Cable costs a lot of money. No one wants to spend all that time standing in line.

take a look before the skurfer and you'll find free boarding (basically riding a surf board behind the boat without bindings). Tony Finn did not invent wakeboarding but he did commercialize it, and wakeskating didn't come directly from wakeboarding. Some of the comments on here are totally ridiculous. Wakeskating isn't luck and requires a ton of board control. Wakesurfing is for those who can't handle the commitment wakeskating requires. And i would like to know how far anyone on here actually progressed before they decided wakeskating was lame. And wakeskating is far from being about surface tricks. I don't know who you've been watching but you're not paying attention to what's really going on.

/rant, where were we with the hating on line cutters. The way this thread went, I feel like I'm on a playground...

So would wakeskating be around if wakeboarding hadn't come first? I remember first seeing wakeskating in the magazines and it was former wakeboarders like Thomas Horrell and Byerly who really commited to it and ran with it. I like wakeskating and i respect it but It just seems crazy for a skater to hate on wakeboarding.

I believe that there wouldn't be a wake industry today if it weren't for Wakeboarding...... how about that? Wakeskating alone would never carry the industry, so while I see the point of the Chefs post, I still believe that Skating exists (today) because of wakeboarding.

Jason messer was the first guy I am aware of to fully commit to wakeskating, and he did not have any wakeboarding background. He shaped his own boards and made some of the first products for wakeskating. Wakeskating would not be where it is today without thomas because he really pushed for progressive products, riding and accessibility. All of the other wake companies had some pretty ridiculous boards that were more like water toys and less like serious tools for progression.

I also have an action now magazine from the early 80s that showed surfers like matt kechele surfing behind the boat in a skate styled fashion. And by that I mean fins out re entry airs and such--not just crusing behind the boat or riding with some girl on their shoulders. There were also guys who were shaping shorter boards for this activity. My magazine featuring this free boarding article is dated October 81.

I think saying an actual activity--wakeskating--vs the wakeskating industry exist because of wakeboarding are two different things. Wakeskating follows a similar path to wakeboarding, in that the popularity of other water related activities helped it build steam. It never required wakeboarding for wakeskating to exist, but the wakeboarding or watersports industry definitely helped the wakeskating industry grow. And having that connection to wakeboarding early on helped other riders develop an interest in wakeskating. And I'm sure there will always be some connection because we all share the water, towing devices, and some people like to do both. But more wakeskaters are taking control and are trying to do things their own way, right down to starting their own tour and magazine (thewakeskatemag.com), among other things. It might be small but they're trying to grow things their way.

I don't think it's crazy for a wakeskater to dislike wakeboarding. They probably have the same lack of respect for the pursuit in much the same way that some wakeboarders don't like wakeskating. I get that surface spins aren't impressive, and everyone has room to ride the way they want. It's the same for wakeboarders--not everyone chooses to ride progressively or aggressively and it can be boring to watch also.

Here is a cool image--this is from the same issue of waterski may where tony Finn was rising his surfer. So do we all owe waterskiing or what? Looking at history and who was doing what, we all probably owe surfing the most.