Ask the Readers: Is traditional advice killing your job search?

“Vince” was halfway through his MBA program and struggling to find an internship. So, he took his career counselor’s advice and blasted his resume and cover letter to 30 companies.”I just tried to shoot out as many resumes as possible,” says Vince.

Nine companies called him back, but the interviews didn’t go well. He only got one offer, and it wasn’t for a particularly great internship.

If Vince followed his career counselor’s advice, why was his search so unsuccessful?

Traditional job-search advice doesn’t work

Vince was following the traditional job-search advice, which is to send out as many resumes as possible. But the traditional advice is bad advice, says Ramit Sethi, who wrote the New York Times bestseller “I Will Teach You To Be Rich” and teaches a course on how to find your dream job.

First, “you’re fighting for scraps with millions of other people,” says Ramit. Vince realized that was the case even before he sent out 30 resumes. “I knew that since career counselors gave the same advice to everyone, there was no differentiation,” he says.

Second, if you apply to as many companies as possible, you won’t ace the interviews, says Ramit. Vince used to prepare for interviews by reading blog posts, company websites, and news articles, but “it didn’t help,” he says. “I still didn’t understand their real business challenges.”

Vince suspected that these methods weren’t working, so why did he try them anyway?

Two reasons job-seekers follow bad advice

Ramit says there are a couple of reasons job-seekers continue to send resume blasts, even though they know it’s not effective.

For one thing, “it’s what they’ve been told to do by parents, career counselors, and teachers,” says Ramit. That’s why Vince gave it a shot, even though he didn’t think it was a great approach.

Also, “resume blasts are easy and low-risk,” says Ramit. Vince admits that it didn’t take much effort. “I was very scatter shot,” he says. “I had a form resume and cover letter. Clicking on ‘submit’ 30 times isn’t that hard.”

Vince tried the traditional method and only got one crummy internship offer. But once he graduated and was looking for a real job, he knew he needed to take a different approach.

Network the right way

This time, Vince started by selecting 10 companies to target.

Then he networked within his alumni association, interviewing people who worked for his target companies or their competitors. “I asked what their pain points were,” he says. “What keeps the managers up at night? Once I had that focus, I could figure out how to address those needs.”

After networking with current employees, he wrote very targeted resumes and cover letters for each company on his list. Seven out of 10 companies called him for an interview. Compared with his internship search, he increased his interview rate from 30 percent to 70 percent.

So how did the interviews go this time?

“My first interview was with an online tech company,” he says. “From my conversations with alumni, I knew their biggest challenge at the moment was cloud-computing pricing. Sure enough, that question came up early in the interview. I said, ‘You know, I’ve thought about that issue and have a document that should address that.'”

The interviewer was impressed. “He said it was the most in-depth discussion about company issues he’d had with an interviewee,” says Vince.

And his interviews with the other companies went just as well, resulting in six job offers. That means 86 percent of his interviews resulted in a job offer, compared with 11 percent during his internship search.

The key to Vince’s success was that he networked, says Ramit. He says there are three reasons why networking gives job seekers an advantage:

When you network, you’re more likely to hear about dream jobs. “Most jobs, and nearly all of the best jobs, are filled before they’re ever advertised,” says Ramit. “By growing your network, you’re more likely to hear about dream jobs when they become available, and get referred.” That makes your job search a lot less stressful. You’re also less likely to job hop if you can land a dream job.

Networking helps you stay in touch with the state of the industry. “If you’re networking, you know how your job, salary, and skills compare to the industry standard,” says Ramit. “That allows you to negotiate for higher wages, responsibilities, and more flexibility. It also helps you focus on in-demand skills, instead of stagnating by running in the same hamster wheel for years while the industry moves on.”

Networking forces you to get real. “People are notoriously bad at figuring things out themselves,” says Ramit. “But going out, talking to people doing jobs you’re interested in, and seeing what it’s really like and how they really got their job forces you to get specific, realistic and tactical. And that gets you closer to actually achieving your goals.”

But what if you don’t have a huge network? How does a networkless job seeker get started?

Three steps to start building a network today

“Start by asking people out to coffee for an informational interview,” says Ramit. “Then ask them for referrals for other people to talk to.”

First, brainstorm a list of 10 people you want to meet. Include people who have job titles that interest you or who work at companies that you’re considering. “The best place to get names is from your alumni association,” says Ramit. “People who went to the same college have a bond with each other, even decades later.”

Then, email each person using the following script from Ramit’s Dream Job course:

To: Jane

From: Samantha

Subject: Michigan State grad — would love to chat about your work at Deloitte

Hi Jane,

My name is Samantha Kerritt. I’m a ’04 grad from Michigan State (I know you were a few years before me), and I came across your name on our alumni site. [TELL THEM HOW YOU CAME ACROSS THEIR NAME SO YOU DON’T SEEM LIKE A CREEP.]

I’d love to get your career advice for 15-20 minutes. I’m currently working at Acme Tech Company, but many of my friends work in consulting, and each time they tell me how much they love their job, I get more interested. [THE FIRST SENTENCE SAYS WHAT YOU WANT. MOST PEOPLE ARE FLATTERED THAT PEOPLE VALUE THEIR ADVICE.]

Most of them have told me that if I’m interested in consulting, I have to talk to someone at Deloitte. Do you think I could pick your brain on your job and what motivated you to choose Deloitte? I’d especially love to know how you made your choices after graduating from Michigan State. [THE PHRASE “PICK YOUR BRAIN” IS ONE OF THE BEST WAYS TO ASK FOR ADVICE AND FLATTER, AND “MICHIGAN STATE” REINFORCES THE SHARED BOND.]

I can meet you for coffee or at your office, or wherever it’s convenient. I can work around you! [THE BUSY PERSON IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN YOU. TREAT THEM ACCORDINGLY.]

Would it be possible for us to meet? [A BUSY PERSON CAN SIMPLY REPLY TO THIS WITH A “YES” — PERFECT. NOTE THAT YOU DON’T ASK FOR THE TIME OR LOCATION, AS THAT’S TOO MUCH INFORMATION IN THE FIRST EMAIL.]

Thanks,

Samantha

After you’ve made some contacts, you can ask for referrals using Ramit’s follow-up script:

Hello, John,

Hope all is well.

If you recall, we spoke a few months ago when I was exploring new career opportunities in information security. Thanks again for meeting with me! [REMIND THE BUSY PERSON HOW YOU KNOW EACH OTHER.]

I was browsing the the Acme career site the other day and the research scientist role caught my eye. I think it’d be perfect for me, considering my work on insider threat-related projects at Current Company. [NOTE THAT THE FOCUS OF THIS EMAIL IS ASKING FOR RECOMMENDATIONS, NOT DIRECTLY ASKING FOR A JOB. JOHN UNDERSTANDS YOU’RE LOOKING FOR WORK AND DOESN’T WANT TO BE PUT ON THE SPOT. IF HE WANTS TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT THE POSITION, HE WILL.]

From what I remember, it sounds pretty similar to the work you do at Acme. By any chance, do you know of anyone there that you think I should chat with? I’d love to learn more about the role so I can see if it’s the right fit for me.

If not, no problem, just wanted to keep you in the loop. Thanks again for all your help!

Take care,

Roger

Shunning resume blasts in favor of scheduling informational interviews might seem weird, especially to well-meaning parents and career counselors. But Ramit says that what’s really weird is using tired tactics that don’t work.

“Informational interviews are one of the most powerful techniques in your arsenal, yet because they seem weird, people don’t do them,” he says.

“It’s OK to be unorthodox,” adds Vince. “In an economy where where everyone looks the same, being a little unorthodox is a plus. You have to hustle. That’s how I got an excellent job instead of a mediocre one.”

What job-hunting strategies have you used that have been successful? How did you land a job you love?

GRS is committed to helping our readers save and achieve their financial goals. Savings interest rates may be low, but that is all the more reason to shop for the best rate. Find the highest savings interest rates and CD rates from Synchrony Bank, Ally Bank, and more.

Don't miss out - Subscribe to our newsletter for more articles on personal finance.

You are right about that. You can send 100 resumes to as many companies as you can and get no results. Experience has taught me that aside from quality content one aslo has to make his/her resume eye-catching and riveting. I mean, HMs don’t spend more than 6 seconds scanning your resume. So make it stand out! That’s how you can make sure that you are noticed as a candidate. What I do is I make graphical CVs, and yes, they are effective!

loading....

Jon

Love Ramit…

My last time searching for a job, I got lucky. I used the shotgun approach, and it basically went nowhere. 20 resumes later, I got two interviews and no job. Fortunately, I got a job through networking – referred by a family member – so it wasn’t even networking of my own doing. But that has landed me a great job! Still, I love reading this type of thing because I am sure I will be back in the job market someday, and this type of advice seems MUCH more likely to help find a job…

loading....

Stacy

I”m currently job-searching and I”ve been using the spray and pray method even though I know I should be doing something else. I’ve tapped my network and gotten nowhere with that. I’ve spent the past 6 years working for a nonprofit and I’m looking to sidestep into something related but different.
My issue is that when I see an online posting for a job I’m interested in, the ONLY option I can find is to submit an online application/cover letter/resume. I can’t find a person to contact, a physical address to go and chat with someone, etc, even though I would gladly do things. Assuming that the company is getting tons of responses to their online posting it is far too easy to get overlooked when I know if I could talk to someone in person I would have a much better chance.

loading....

CincyCat

I’m going to be somewhat of a nay-sayer, and say that “networking” in the stereotypical sense is somewhat over-rated when it comes to job searching. The key is knowing whether or not the skills and experience that you have (and actually want to use) will meet the company’s immediate need. You need to develop the art of reading between the lines of the job posting. Ironically, there may be jobs available and appealing within the company you’re already working for if you employ this approach.

As for myself, I didn’t know a soul in any of the companies that I applied to. In a way, I guess I just wanted a clean break.

Anyway, here’s my story…

Trigger: Current job = dead end. No opportunity for new projects, or advancement. I loved (most of) the people, but the work just wasn’t challenging anymore. I had worked off & on in the same basic line of work for over 10 years, and I was ready for a change.

The Search: I looked at career websites for nearly 6 months, and only bothered clicking on jobs that actually interested me. I sent resumes and highly tailored cover letters to exactly 5 companies. (Not a typo… five (5) companies.)

The Result: Got form-email reply “thanks, but no thanks” from 3 companies (incidentally, these were the same three that forced me to fill out a career-site web application form to “apply” for the job). My guess is the computer screening resumes didn’t find enough of the right key words. In hindsight, I really don’t know if I truly wanted to work at a company where computers do work that is really best done by a human…

Finale: I got interviews at the other two, including one where I filled out a paper application in the lobby, chit-chatted with the receptionist before I took a personality test. I had two interviews, and eventually got the job at one.

Aftermath: I have been at my new job a few months, and I absolutely love it. The people could not be nicer, the work is challenging – but in a way I really like, they have a strong commitment to work-life balance (a “must” for me, which I saw in the job posting, and confirmed in the interview), and I have been able to immediately put to use the skills that I love using.

Sometimes, it isn’t “who” you know; but rather, how well you know yourself.

If folks would take the time to critically examine the job posting itself – whether or not their 3rd cousin, twice removed can get the application expedited – they would probably find themselves landing interviews much faster, and for jobs they actually want.

That’s my $0.02.

loading....

Judy

I really liked this post. Everyone has always told me to network, to work my network and other advice along those lines. But no one tells you exactly how. I’m not the most social or outgoing type of person, so advice and an example of how to cold contact an alumnus is great!

If I were contacted with something like the letter in the post, I’d probably consider helping out the person.

Just for background info, while there was no networking involved in my getting hired at my current company (I was a college new hire), I did ping my previous manager and recruiter to get a different position at my company when I got a bit bored. So, technically, I did use my network to get my current “job”.

However, I know I have a much larger network, I’m just not quite sure how to exercise it if I wanted to since I don’t keep in contact with those folks and I’d feel awkward contacting them. So, I appreciate the example/advice in the post.

loading....

Stacie

Along with networking, I think the biggest thing is to excel while you are working. I got my first internship on my resume strength alone, but every job after that has been a direct result of doing a great job: My internship hired me full time in a different role. When there were cutbacks and I was laid off, my coworker referred me to a related but not perfect job, and then another coworker basically opened a job for me at a new company she was at because she knew I work hard and do a good job.

Before reaching out to more nebulous contacts (college alumni, those at orgs you want to work for) I’d check with previous coworkers first. LinkedIn is a great tool for that, as well.

loading....

Honey Smith

There was ZERO networking involved in my current job – I applied to an online posting and got hired. However, my SEO work was through a friend, and just the other day I was chatting with another friend who may have similar work (and hooray! Since this would be my direct client I could bill a higher rate than I’m getting from Shawn. He’s even giving me advice on how to price myself). The thing about networking is that once you start doing it, it becomes automatic, and the results can be exponential after awhile – instead of you approaching people, they think of YOU and come to you with offers.

loading....

Joan

As a career advisor at a university business school, I would never give out the advice to blast generic resumes to my students. The author is right — networking is far more effective. However, we have found that LinkedIn, not email, is a much better way to request those informational interviews. With LinkedIn, you can access your alumni database, find personal connections at your targeted companies and join professional groups to provide you a common access point to those people with whom you want to connect. Too much email gets directed to spam or simply gets ignored, espcially if you do not already have some connection to the person you are trying to reach.

loading....

LeRainDrop

I have not personally had any job offer connections generate directly from LinkedIn, but I will give you a good story that combines the benefits of that website with personal e-mailing: An old friend from college and law school is considering moving out of legal work but into a related field. He saw my profile on LinkedIn, connected to my brother, who works at one of the top firms in this new field my friend is considering. So, he sent me a very nice personal e-mail to catch up and ask if I might be willing to introduce him to my brother so that he could find out more about what the work/firm is like. They’re going to grab coffee this weekend. 🙂

loading....

Elizabeth

I was surprised this article didn’t talk about LinkedIn (or any social media, for that matter). I have had HR people contact me through LinkedIn about jobs.

I’ve noticed recently that some companies in my province hold their own recruiting events or online job fairs. If you follow the company through social media, you can find out about these events.

loading....

Kingston

Question about LinkedIn: Is no one concerned about having one’s resume/work history posted so publicly? Who is LinkedIn, how do they use the info people post, how do they make money from their service? I realize it’s widely used, but I’d like to know more about LinkedIn and GRS readers’ thoughts on the privacy issues.

loading....

Triple E

My job searches have always involved networking, but ultimately, more often than not, my physical network often pays off more for references than actual jobs.

That said, I’ve beefed up my LinkedIn profile, and jobs often roll into me whether I want them or not. Seriously, the amount of passiveness I’ve had in looking for work has been astonishing, since recruiters seek me out.

Note that I’m in software engineering, and have about 12 years experience. Even if I don’t think my experience is fantastic, it’s enough to put me in a sweet spot in an active industry.

loading....

Chris Gammell

This is exactly the advice I give people when job searching. However, I think it is important to state that NO job search can be formulaic. If everyone starts doing this kind of job search (they won’t, as April said, because it’s so “different”), then the efficacy of this method will go down as well. Imagine if everyone starts getting 10 informational interview requests per day…those will start to get ignored, just like resume submissions do now. However, having a human connection inside a company will always be more powerful than trying to go through HR or a computerized system. That’s just a waste of time.

Moving forward, I think it’s worthwhile to state that people should have an online presence in some form. While this won’t get you jobs directly (or at least jobs you likely don’t want), it will give you a platform from which you can inform others that you’re available in the job market; your online material can also show your capabilities. My favorite example in my field (electronics) are people showing off their passion on YouTube by showing off their hobby projects. It follows the “don’t say, do” mantra and I’ve seen it work wonders.

loading....

Jacko

Traditional job search doesn’t work because there aren’t JOBS available like there used to be “traditionally”.

The new corporate model is a skeleton crew where in the past there used to floors stocked full of workers stuffed into cubicles.

Those days have passed and I don’t think they are returning any time soon.

Add to that the fact that companies actually prefer recent college grads with no experience and you should know why your job search isn’t going as well as you would expect.

With that said, it’s still a good excuse to start your own business.

loading....

Wyoming Gal

My experience in Human Resource leadership with a Fortune 100 company, a mid sized regional company and a sizeable non-profit in a 15 year period does not agree with the statement, “most jobs are filled before they are advertised.” It is certainly true that networking is a successful tactic and many of the best jobs are filled by a qualified internal candidate, particularly in organizations that focus on career development. However, most jobs are advertised in all the environments I have worked in. The successful candidate will do effective research and networking to make their application stand out. Many applicants don’t have a prayer of being considered because they write the wrong cover letter, send a photo (NO!NO!), send a resume that is not targeted to the job they are applying for, act in annoying and agressive ways when following up on an opening, or simply disregard the needed education and experience for a particular job.

loading....

Brenton

I was about to say something similar. Any large company will force you through their HR screening process before an interview.

For smaller companies, including start-ups, then the approach in the article will work, but for Fortune 500 companies, it wont work at all. If they hire without advertising, they can get into legal trouble, and the whole point of the HR dept is to avoid legal trouble regarding their hiring practices.

Ive worked for both a small tech start-up and a multi-national corporation. The interview and hiring processes were completely alien to each other. I dont think there is any one good way to find a job. Its industry and company specific.

Of course, the most important thing is having in-demand skills. I switched jobs in 2008 as well, and had no problem getting hired because of my technical skills.

loading....

Another Kate

While I do agree that networking can, in some environments, be far more effective than the “spray and pray” resume send, I work for a university, and all jobs are advertised. My husband works for a Fortune 500 company, and they, too, have very formal channels for filling jobs. When he was last jobless, he had a former coworker at a large bank who knew of an opening and recommended him to his supervisor. Although the supervisor was willing to look at my husband’s resume thanks to his former coworker’s recommendation, in the end, despite this coworker arguing that my husband could do the job and do it well, the bank was more interested in someone who fit their advertised requirements, not someone with a recommendation from another employee. I have no doubt that networking does work well for more flexible organizations, but there are tons of organizations, many where people really want to work, for which the only route is to send in that resume in response to a job posting. I’d say a good approach to a traditional job is probably a mix of the old advice and the “new” (networking) advice (hasn’t networking been around for a couple of decades now, at least?). Readers may also want to consider the newer-than-networking advice: go entrepreneurial and work for yourself.

loading....

AMW

I work for a college and my husband works for a fortune 100 company. They do advertise all their posititions. However, in a large majority of cases this is just a procedure and legal antics. In my case, the college I worked for automatically kicked me out of their on line screening because I did not meet some criteria, however, another employee gave the dean my name and contact info and I got the interview. When they decided to hire me, they wrote a job description specifically for me me so that the system wouldn’t kick me out. In my husbands company, job postings are mostly for show- especially for hiring from within. The company already knows who they are putting in that position, they are just avoiding being sued. Even coming in as a new hire, it’s 80% who you know.

loading....

Paul

When I found my current job I was already employed, but didn’t really like my job. I was passively looking for something new. I signed up for some job sites and sifted through e-mails. I applied for dozens of jobs, but I either didn’t have exactly the right experience they were looking for or I was overqualified.

The job advertisement for my current job really piqued my interest. As I read through it, I thought they were looking for me or somebody very similar to me. So I applied and was contacted by someone from HR. In the meantime, I remembered that an old colleague worked for this company, so I contacted him and asked for advice on the interview process. His advice really helped and I got the job.

So I sort of used networking, but in a roundabout way. The company is great and even though we had to move, we like the new area. Everything is much more reasonably priced, especially the real estate. And even though the cost of living is much lower in our new location, I did get a small raise by taking the new job. Monetarily the raise was small, but the increased buying power was like getting a 20% raise over my previous job!

loading....

nicoleandmaggie

I thought the traditional advice was to network. The majority of jobs are found via networking, not through want-ads or other job listings. That has always been the case at least since labor economists started keeping track.

Make sure that when you do network that you leave a professional trail. That is, when you’re out of work, don’t email my sister that you’re desperate– even if she’s your friend. She cannot forward that email and she’s less likely to be able to put her reputation on the line if you’re not professional every step of the way. Same thing with typos in those emails. Present yourself at all points as you would want a recruiter to see you.

loading....

Michael

When you’re still in college it’s difficult to network, because all of your contacts are undergrads who also have no experience.

The solution that worked for me, in IT, was to join several local User Groups in subjects I was interested in (Linux, PHP, etc.). At the time the contacts I made there were far more valuable than my classmates.

Now 6 years after graduation, my former classmates and I are still in contact and networking with each other is actually useful. Most of us have jobs in different industries and our diverse work experience is useful when we’re job hunting, trying to fill a position or looking for an outside opinion on something.

loading....

Mrs PoP @ Planting Our Pennies

I quit my job in August of 2008 – so the timing on my job search was exactly when the recession was starting to really make an impact. But I searched for very specific firms whose interests and company philosophies matched with my backgrounds and needs. I sent out 4 emails to local CEOs that were short and to the point, but each one was individually tailored to why I thought I would be an excellent fit with their company. I got 4 responses, 3 interviews, and 3 job offers – two of which would have been creating a position for me that did not exist before. All while the stock market was crashing.

I don’t know if the method would work for all companies, but for the type of company I wanted to work at, the super tailored strategy was incredibly effective.

You didn’t know a single person who worked their (via your “network” or not) and you still landed those interviews.

This is the point I try to make to friends (or random acquaintances) who try to see if I can “forward their resume” somewhere. If I don’t know you, or don’t know what you are good at, I am not going to waste everyone’s time forwarding resumes.

You have to know *yourself* first, know what you want to do, and *then* find companies who need you.

Plain & simple.

loading....

Elizabeth

I think this is a really useful post, and not just for job seekers because it encourages everyone to put effort into networking.

I agree with the comment above to try and give as good as you get. Sometimes there isn’t much you can do to help mentors and more senior people in your network (beyond a big thank you, that is) but I’ve always been happy to “pay it forward”.

loading....

Short arms long pockets

Networking is definitely the key, and as you progress in your career your network should expand to include people from all of the places you have worked. It pays to keep in touch. I learned of my current job from someone that I worked with 3 companies ago who told my current boss that, although I hadn’t held the job title that he was looking for, I had the skills and was the right person for the position.
Networking also means reciprocity. You need to be willing to provide assistance to the folks in your network and not just be on the “taking” side all of the time.
I’m a huge fan of Liz Ryan and her approach to job seeking, networking, and human resources in general. http://www.humanworkplace.com/
She is well worth reading on this issue, even if you don’t agree with everything she says.

Advertiser Disclosure:
Many of the savings offers appearing on this site are from advertisers from which this website receives compensation for being listed here.
This compensation may impact how and where products appear on this site (including, for example, the order in which they appear). These offers do not represent all deposit accounts available.
Editorial Disclosure: This content is not provided or commissioned by the bank advertiser.
Opinions expressed here are author’s alone, not those of the bank advertiser, and have not been reviewed, approved or otherwise endorsed by the bank advertiser. This site may be compensated through the bank advertiser Affiliate Program.
UGC Disclosure: These responses are not provided or commissioned by the bank advertiser.
Responses have not been reviewed, approved or otherwise endorsed by the bank advertiser. It is not the bank advertiser's responsibility to ensure all posts and/or questions are answered.

Disclaimer: Rates / APY terms above are current as of the date indicated. These quotes are
from banks, credit unions and thrifts, some of which have paid for a link to
their website. Bank, thrift and credit union deposits are insured by the FDIC
or NCUA. Contact the bank for the terms and conditions that may apply to you.
Rates are subject to change without notice and may not be the same at all
branches.

Disclaimer:All information provided on this site is for informational purposes only. GetRichSlowly.org makes no representations as to the accuracy, completeness, suitability or validity of any information on this site and will not be liable for any errors or omissions in this information or any damages arising from its display or use.