without getting into a lofty technical discussion of multiculturalism vs. Diversity vs. Melting pot vs. Cultural mosaic or all of that stuff, i'm pretty happy with how we do things in canada and think it works well. Let's stay on the path towards a more inclusive society for all people, whether they came here yesterday or their ancestors have been here for millennia.

+2

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I've always struggled with reality. And I'm pleased to say that I won.

Without getting into a lofty technical discussion of multiculturalism vs. diversity vs. melting pot vs. cultural mosaic or all of that stuff, I'm pretty happy with how we do things in Canada and think it works well. Let's stay on the path towards a more inclusive society for all people, whether they came here yesterday or their ancestors have been here for millennia.

Anyway, they also lobby for changes to Canada's gun laws to make them even less strict. Because, after all, since they've moved to Canada, not a single Army of Jesus member has been involved in a crime involving a weapon.

How would y'all react to that?

If the studies suggest that the looser gun laws will not have any significant incidence on crime in Canada, I guess there only reason for me to oppose it would be my own ideological aversion to guns. And that isn't enough to impose my insecurities on others.

If it does risk materially increasing the severity of crime as a result of this new legislation, then there is no reason for that group to impose their insecurities on society at large.

But, as with all hypotheticals, I think we should remember the words of Jean Chretien:

"If, if, if! If my mother had wheels, she would be a bus!

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I've always struggled with reality. And I'm pleased to say that I won.

If the studies suggest that the looser gun laws will not have any significant incidence on crime in Canada, I guess there only reason for me to oppose it would be my own ideological aversion to guns. And that isn't enough to impose my insecurities on others.

If it does risk materially increasing the severity of crime as a result of this new legislation, then there is no reason for that group to impose their insecurities on society at large.

But, as with all hypotheticals, I think we should remember the words of Jean Chretien:

"If, if, if! If my mother had wheels, she would be a bus!

Great quote!

I highly doubt that the views of the Guns and God crowd are in any way related to insecurity.

No one ever complains about "too much variety" at a buffet, botanical garden or art gallery. Double standard!!

That depends. Most of the "international" buffet restaurants are "jacks of all trades, masters of none". They almost never offer the true high level cuisine of the countries they claim to cover. Whereas if you go to the best Japanese, best French, best Moroccan, etc. in town, you know you're going to get something really good, unique and special.

The same can be transposed to cultures, cities, nations, etc. If you want just a pastiche of all the world's cultures, that's fine. But that's "EPCOT". Not the real deal.

If they have a choice, nobody goes to a new world city or country to sample an old world culture.

If you travel to Venice to sample "old world culture", almost all the businesses exist for tourists, and ALL of the goods are made in China. The real Italy - not the one artificially preserved in cryo stasis - is somewhere in suburban Napoli or Pescara. In Hong Kong, they're saying that the best Chinese food in the world is now in Vancouver... in other words, I wouldn't get too hung up on racial purity.

Anyway, it's a moot point since the threshold for when some place is "too (insert race)" already favors whites. Tons of people say Vancouver is "too Asian", at 30%. Some students avoid universities with that kind of ratio lol. It's scary not being the majority race. Yet no city is ever "too white" unless it's like 90% or higher.

If you travel to Venice to sample "old world culture", almost all the businesses exist for tourists, and ALL of the goods are made in China. The real Italy - not the one artificially preserved in cryo stasis - is somewhere in suburban Napoli or Pescara. In Hong Kong, they're saying that the best Chinese food in the world is now in Vancouver... in other words, I wouldn't get too hung up on racial purity.

Anyway, it's a moot point since the threshold for when some place is "too (insert race)" already favors whites. Tons of people say Vancouver is "too Asian", at 30%. Some students avoid universities with that kind of ratio lol. It's scary not being the majority race. Yet no city is ever "too white" unless it's like 90% or higher.

The only other thing I will add is: all authorities, including government departments and the police, simply need to follow the law and apply it fairly (meaning each citizen is equal). By and large both Canada and the US have pretty good laws. There are gaps and errors of various types and sizes, but if we take criminal codes, both countries would do well if the laws were simply applied as their statutes require.

Beyond that, it is reasonable to help those who are suffering (socially, economically, racially, whatever), as well as those who have suffered historically scaled injustices. It is straightforward that injury can be very difficult to overcome, especially if it has occurred over generations. This makes it reasonable to spend effort and money helping such people. It is rationally right as well as ethically.

(I can't respond to some of the misinformed ignorance of some of the posts. As for Spocket; well, its not even worth it - his/her information and opinions are just ignorant in the technical sense.)

Complaining that a place is not diverse enough and judging it for being "too white" is currently a socially-acceptable urban hipster thing to say.

Complaning that a place has too many minorities and isn't "white" enough is a socially taboo, socially-unacceptable racist neanderthal thing to say.

And yet they're two sides of the exact same coin.

the threshold for when some place is "too (insert race)" already favors whites. Tons of people say Vancouver is "too Asian", at 30%. Some students avoid universities with that kind of ratio lol. It's scary not being the majority race. Yet no city is ever "too white" unless it's like 90% or higher.

I can't stand this idea that cities should strive to be multicultural to pacify Ottawa mandarins, look good on the stats chart, or somehow are less interesting because they are not. Victoria, Quebec, London, and Kingston aren't exactly multicultural meccas but are consistently rated as having the highest quality of life and lowest crime rates. All are vibrant, beautiful, and very liveable cities yet most of their respective populations are as white as the undriven snow.

Does anyone on this forum actually care about the racial composition of their community?

In Vancouver it is a VERY big deal due to the Chinese money laundering in the real estate market. People know that if it wasn't for the Chinese dirty money and them buying houses and leaving them empty or tearing them down the city would have more housing stock and would be far more affordable so their kids can live in the city they were born in.

There is open hostility between the Hong Kong Chinese and the nouveau-riche Chinese "Mainlanders".

It's a an assumption in Vancouver that if you see a Chinese in an expensive car you automatically think they got it thru dirty money. The real estate frenzy and the money laundering has done irreparable damage to racial relations in the city.

He's not exactly being responsible with the way he's talking about it, but there's a kernel of truth in it. There is a certain tension that exists at times. I've heard generally respectable adults say some pretty shocking things. It's all very strange.

Normal people will assume 10 other more-likely scenarios. That's just you projecting

Agreed!

Misjudging the scale and influence of cultural/racial/economic phenomena to make your prejudice sound reasonable is a waste of words.

Who is it that says "cities should strive to be multicultural?" Those places that are multicultural/racial have become so for a complex of immigration factors . . . none of which include striving to be a certain way. Canada's policies about this come from the way our country has developed over its history. They are more of a reaction to our history and an acknowledgment of the reality of the country than any striving by some boogie class.

The little diatribe about the "bad" Chinese, so guilty of ruining our real estate market, and driving like asses in their luxury cars . . . . well, I know there is a small bit of truth to this (GlassCity's kernal of truth), but most Vancouverites know better than to exaggerate these things into nonsense. To claim "irreparable damage to racial relations in the city" is laughable.

Please, all of you who are not from Vancouver, do not read ssiguy's posts as meaning much: they are most often just rants, mild bigotry, and self-satisfyied justifications.

He's not exactly being responsible with the way he's talking about it, but there's a kernel of truth in it. There is a certain tension that exists at times. I've heard generally respectable adults say some pretty shocking things. It's all very strange.

Yes, a kernel of truth is an appropriate measurement.

But, it is not just a "white people speaking bad about others" situation.

Many of the worst things I have heard about the Chinese have come from Korean, South Asian, and Taiwanese people I know in Vancouver.

Just have to add this because these days there is this bizarre concept that only white people have a monopoly on racism and prejudice.

In the end though, either way, ssiguy blows it way our of proportion. The guy has an amazing ability to magnify any negative aspect in BC / Vancouver (and Toronto as times) by about 100 X.