i have been searching for a new sleeping bag (lost my old synthetic one).i asked and searched around on the web and came across couple of brands:FF humingbirdWM ultraliteGo lite adrenalineZpacks -7 bag - though this one has significantly less down than the others so i dont think it can actually go for 20F.

so i basically have 3 questions:1. if badget is NOT an issue which bag should i buy ?2. Is there some high quality brand that i didnt check? please only if they are of a higher quality than FF and WM.

3. 20F\-7C bag is suitable for summer+late summer early fall in europe right?

that's exactly what i'm trying to find out.because WM are so expansive i want to make sure that buy this for a long time to come and won't get that "darn i could have paid another 20 bucks and have a batter one " feeling.

so are there higher end down sleeping bags than WM and FF , assuming that budget is not an issue?

That being said, it is somewhat expensive and I'm not sure you get more for the extra money. I'd still buy another one (or FF model). I like the slimmer size, which is harder to find in mainstream bags.

I would check out Montbell UL Spirals too. You can find them on sale for prices $100-200 less than WM, FF.

You're on the right track - FF, Western Mountaineering, Nunatak, and Valandre all make great down bags. My answers to your other questions: #3 Yes, a 20F bag should work in Europe through autumn unless you sleep really cold. #1 - I'd get a Nunatak Back Country Blanket with a few custom features: wider at the shoulders, a few extra ounces of down, and some extra length. That's Nunatak's edge [and why its price premium is justified] - you can tweak the standard models to accommodate your size and preferences.

I own a Montbell, UL spiral, down, #3 bag purchased about 1 year ago. Love the weight, construction and dual direction zipper. I'm a warm sleeper so I very rarely close the zipper completely. I use the bag for 3 season hiking where temperatures have varied from 30 to 50 degrees F.

My issue with this bag is I tend to over heat and sweat even in low temperatures. It doesn't seem to breath very well, so condensation builds up inside. Montbell told me this is more or less the way the bag is - it's not Goretex!

Marquis Toson - this bag is too cold, only 11 oz. of down fill and en rating of 1C. i think it's too. i think that -7 rating is the most accurate for high altitudes in Europe. so i checked the down hugger #1 which is rated to -9C/15F , but it's really heavy . 2.5 lb/1048g. and expensive 419$. i still lean towards the WM ultalite . any ideas?

Jason Picard - sorry friend , English isn't my first language. what do you mean by that?

I have the Down Hugger UL Super Stretch (ridiculous naming convention, I know) No. 2. Have had it for three plus years and it still looks brand new. Handles everything I throw at it from camping under the stars, to tarps to tents. 20-ish to 60-ish, where I just sleep on top. Should probably get a 40 version here shortly, I've (it's) earned it.