Cretony38:jrodr018: Cretony38: jrodr018: Cretony38: Look it up in the dictionary and then say you want more fluoride in your body. And "Remineralization" isn't in the dictionary.

I am just glad that the Dictionary people are not "in" this vast worldwide conspiracy. Thanks for the truth, man. Thanks, valiant savior!

What conspiracy? I merely asked you protectionists to simply look it up. And I get attacked for asking you to be better informed. But you guys are satisfied with the pat answer "it's been studied for decades" without a one of you citing a single study?!? I guess you all just swallowed it whole.

See? these are the type of answers that gives me the peace of mind that there are soldiers of the truth out there! Do not get me wrong, it is not as if I actually do biomedical research or some nonsense and I would NEVER know how to use PubMed. Perhaps you, soldier of truth, can link to some peer-reviewed studies showing the damaging effects of flouride at the concentrations we currently use. That would bring the truth out in the open!

So put your vitriol & politics aside. The fact remains Fluoride is a toxic compound, an industrial by product that is to toxic to be dumped into a landfill. And was used in pest control. So are these facts incorrect?

Sunlight at its current levels sustains the planet. If we moved the planet closer and got a higher dose it would burn us all to death and turn the earth into a rotating ash sphere.Concentration is relevant. Do you deny this?

born_yesterday:OK, then you can clear this up for me. I worked at a treatment plant years ago (*treatment plant fistbump*). You know the open air tanks, pretty early in the process, that have oxygen pumped into them? I swear the safety guy told me that if you fell in, you would sink in the poop-water, because the aeration would prevent buoyancy.

Probably mostly screwing with you. However, some of that depedning upon the type of aeration they were using (course bubble to help with mixing or fine bubble to pump as much oxygen into the water as possible). Course bubble aeration will create currents and eddies within the tank to keep things stirred up and this may impact how easily you could swim. Just think of it as a big hot tub the night after a big party that you are trying to swim in with the bubbles on.

spickus:Esc7: Absolutely pure H20 with no dissolved anything in it not only tastes a little flat

Yes it does.

but is also not as good for you as other water.

Citation please.

The expert meeting concluded that only a few minerals in natural waters had sufficient concentrations and distribution to expect that their consumption in drinking water might sometimes be a significant supplement to dietary intake in some populations.

AverageAmericanGuy:I just don't like the idea of my beer being adulterated with fluoride. Many Portland breweries use the city's (delicious) tap water as the basis for their beers. Adding fluoride introduces a change that is neither wanted nor desired.

Keep fluoride out of the water. If not for the childrens' sakes, at least for the beer's.

Krieghund:AverageAmericanGuy: I just don't like the idea of my beer being adulterated with fluoride. Many Portland breweries use the city's (delicious) tap water as the basis for their beers. Adding fluoride introduces a change that is neither wanted nor desired.

Keep fluoride out of the water. If not for the childrens' sakes, at least for the beer's.

In a letter to the Oregonian, the owner and head brewer at Upright Brewing stated, "I can tell you that at standard levels (up to 0.7 ppm), fluoride in water is tasteless, odorless and doesn't affect the brewing process in any way. It is harmless to yeast and doesn't change the taste of beer one bit."

CPennypacker:Sunlight at its current levels sustains the planet. If we moved the planet closer and got a higher dose it would burn us all to death and turn the earth into a rotating ash sphere.Concentration is relevant. Do you deny this?

Exactly right. Those that point to the risks of substances without any context of dosage should be forced to sit throught the next EPA seminar on the Clean Water Act.

TwistedFark:badhatharry: The amount of flouride in a tube of toothpaste could kill a small child. If you ingests more than the amount used to brush, call poison control.

Enjoy your flouride water!

That's a lie.

Toothpaste only has about 1000 ppm fluoride in it, or about 20-30 times LESS than a lethal dose. At the very most, it might give you a tummy ache - as you would expect from being stupid enough to eat a tube of toothpaste.

Practically everything can be lethal if you ingest too much of (think; water toxicity). I take asprin when I have a headache. I don't take 30 of them because I'm not a moron.

Tyrone Slothrop:TwistedFark: badhatharry: The amount of flouride in a tube of toothpaste could kill a small child. If you ingests more than the amount used to brush, call poison control.

Enjoy your flouride water!

That's a lie.

Toothpaste only has about 1000 ppm fluoride in it, or about 20-30 times LESS than a lethal dose. At the very most, it might give you a tummy ache - as you would expect from being stupid enough to eat a tube of toothpaste.

Practically everything can be lethal if you ingest too much of (think; water toxicity). I take asprin when I have a headache. I don't take 30 of them because I'm not a moron.

Cretony38:jrodr018: Cretony38: Look it up in the dictionary and then say you want more fluoride in your body. And "Remineralization" isn't in the dictionary.

I am just glad that the Dictionary people are not "in" this vast worldwide conspiracy. Thanks for the truth, man. Thanks, valiant savior!

What conspiracy? I merely asked you protectionists to simply look it up. And I get attacked for asking you to be better informed. But you guys are satisfied with the pat answer "it's been studied for decades" without a one of you citing a single study?!? I guess you all just swallowed it whole.

From your post "In this chapter, demineralised water is defined as water almost or completely free of dissolved minerals as a result of distillation, deionization, membrane filtration (reverse osmosis or nanofiltration), electrodialysis or other technology."

Your municipal water supply will never be "almost or completely free of dissolved minerals". Only one of the methods that you bolded is even filtration (which is my whole point). Membrane filtration can demineralize water as you have described. But because of EPA regulations due to one your other concerns: "higher leaching of metals from materials in contact with water resulting in an increased metal content in drinking water " you don't have to be concerned with this in the US because we are required to provide a non-corrosive water. The cheapest and most effective way to do this is to add alkalies such as lime, caustic or soda ash. If it is determined during annual testing that a municipalities water supply is corrosive, that supplier will be required to correct the problem most quickly. Either by better pH control and/or corrosion inhibitors.

And here's why: (paraphrasing you) "Among eight outbreaks of chemical poisoning from drinking water reported in the USA in 1993-1994 **, there were three cases of lead poisoning in infants who had blood-lead levels of 15 μg/dL, 37μg/dL, and 42μg/dL. The level of concern is 10 μg/dL. For all three cases,lead had leached from brass fittings (<--bullshiat*) and lead-soldered seams (<---culprit) in drinking water storage tanks. "

This however is not due to "overly filtered water". It is due to improper pH and corrosion control.

*Brass fitting have always had very little lead and the industry has been going lead free for many years.** The lead copper rule became law in '91 and I guess it was a little too slow for those infants.

Wayne 985:My problem with flouride in the water isn't that I think it's dangerous; it's that it's totally unnecessary.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the World Health Organization, the American Dental Association, the American Medical Association, the American Academy of Pediatrics, the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs, the Environmental Protection Agency, the American Public Health Association all would seem to disagree with you.

Why would all of these agencies recommend fluoride if it was totally unncessary?

From your post "In this chapter, demineralised water is defined as water almost or completely free of dissolved minerals as a result of distillation, deionization, membrane filtration (reverse osmosis or nanofiltration), electrodialysis or other technology."

Your municipal water supply will never be "almost or completely free of dissolved minerals". Only one of the methods that you bolded is even filtration (which is my whole point). Membrane filtration can demineralize water as you have described. But because of EPA regulations due to one your other concerns: "higher leaching of metals from materials in contact with water resulting in an increased metal content in drinking water " you don't have to be concerned with this in the US because we are required to provide a non-corrosive water. The cheapest and most effective way to do this is to add alkalies such as lime, caustic or soda ash. If it is determined during annual testing that a municipalities water supply is corrosive, that supplier will be required to correct the problem most quickly. Either by better pH control and/or corrosion inhibitors.

And here's why: (paraphrasing you) "Among eight outbreaks of chemical poisoning from drinking water reported in the USA in 1993-1994 **, there were three cases of lead poisoning in infants who had blood-lead levels of 15 μg/dL, 37μg/dL, and 42μg/dL. The level of concern is 10 μg/dL. For all three cases,lead had leached from brass fittings (<--bullshiat*) and lead-soldered seams (<---culprit) in drinking water storage tanks. "

This however is not due to "overly filtered water". It is due to improper pH and corrosion control.

*Brass fitting have always had very little lead and the industry has been going lead fr ...

None of which negates my point that highly filtered water (for example, through reverse osmosis filtration, which, incidentally, someone suggested in this thread is good for one's health) is bad for you. This whole "water must be pure!" movement is complete bullshiat.

spickus:For all three cases,lead had leached from brass fittings (<--bullshiat*) and lead-soldered seams (<---culprit) in drinking water storage tanks. "

Don't forget that many municipalites still have lead water pipes as well. Most are doing what they can to get them replaced, but many still have them. For these towns, it is imperative that they closely watch the pH and oxidation potential of the water.

Cretony38:jrodr018: Cretony38: jrodr018: Cretony38: Look it up in the dictionary and then say you want more fluoride in your body. And "Remineralization" isn't in the dictionary.

So put your vitriol & politics aside. The fact remains Fluoride is a toxic compound, an industrial by product that is to toxic to be dumped into a landfill. And was used in pest control. So are these facts incorrect?

Yeah in the same sense that a toddler would fight Mohammad Ali. Dude, I provided a 30 year old easy to read review paper showing no negative effects of fluoride (at the concentrations currently used), another (newer) paper was listed above that one. Of course ANY chemical can have deleterious effects if used in the appropriate concentrations. And this is not politics, it is science. I will change my mind when you show me peer reviewed, repeatable studies that show a negative effect of fluoride at the concentrations currently used. There, you have the floor.

Fluoride is unnecessary. There's plenty of countries that don't use fluoridated water, and their dental health has been improving with the rest of the world. Fluoride isn't the only factor involved in dental health, and it's obviously not responsible for the improvement. Frankly, the biggest cheerleaders for fluoride don't know what the hell they're talking about.

RexTalionis:None of which negates my point that highly filtered water (for example, through reverse osmosis filtration, which, incidentally, someone suggested in this thread is good for one's health) is bad for you. This whole "water must be pure!" movement is complete bullshiat.

You're right. If you treat your own drinking water in a way that is not done due to health concerns, some bad things might happen.

Cretony38:jrodr018: Cretony38: jrodr018: Cretony38: Look it up in the dictionary and then say you want more fluoride in your body. And "Remineralization" isn't in the dictionary.

I am just glad that the Dictionary people are not "in" this vast worldwide conspiracy. Thanks for the truth, man. Thanks, valiant savior!

What conspiracy? I merely asked you protectionists to simply look it up. And I get attacked for asking you to be better informed. But you guys are satisfied with the pat answer "it's been studied for decades" without a one of you citing a single study?!? I guess you all just swallowed it whole.

See? these are the type of answers that gives me the peace of mind that there are soldiers of the truth out there! Do not get me wrong, it is not as if I actually do biomedical research or some nonsense and I would NEVER know how to use PubMed. Perhaps you, soldier of truth, can link to some peer-reviewed studies showing the damaging effects of flouride at the concentrations we currently use. That would bring the truth out in the open!

So put your vitriol & politics aside. The fact remains Fluoride is a toxic compound, an industrial by product that is to toxic to be dumped into a landfill. And was used in pest control. So are these facts incorrect?

The fact also remains that Fluoride is prevalent in well water at concentrations much higher than what is proposed, that many compounds we need to consume wouldn't be allowed in concentration at a landfill, and that the fluoride containing compound used in pest control (sulfuryl fluoride - SO2F2) is not the compound that is being used to treat municipal water supplies. Any of those incorrect either?

HeadLever:Wayne 985: My problem with flouride in the water isn't that I think it's dangerous; it's that it's totally unnecessary.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the World Health Organization, the American Dental Association, the American Medical Association, the American Academy of Pediatrics, the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs, the Environmental Protection Agency, the American Public Health Association all would seem to disagree with you.

Why would all of these agencies recommend fluoride if it was totally unncessary?

Something can be good for you and still unnecessary. Like Vitamin C. Let's start putting that in the water supply. I hear there's a Vitamin D deficiency as well. Maybe pump that into the water.

For the record, groups like the AMA also recommend making professional boxing a crime, so... there's that kind of mindset to contend with. They advocate for a lot of stuff that is physically good for you, but still intrusive.

BraveNewCheneyWorld:Fluoride is unnecessary. There's plenty of countries that don't use fluoridated water, and their dental health has been improving with the rest of the world. Fluoride isn't the only factor involved in dental health, and it's obviously not responsible for the improvement. Frankly, the biggest cheerleaders for fluoride don't know what the hell they're talking about.

As the official Fark representative of not knowing what the hell you're talking about, I respect your opinion

Wayne 985:Like Vitamin C. Let's start putting that in the water supply. I hear there's a Vitamin D deficiency as well. Maybe pump that into the water.

These don't do well in chlorinated drinking water and is a non-starter. Besides, vitamins come from food and need to be digested in order to be effective. Flouride is a topical treatment that is not typically found in foods.

Why would you want to add more chemicals to your water and body? It is amazing how many people want fluoride in their water, I have not drinking fluorinated water for over ten years and have not had any tooth decay or health issues from a lack of fluoride. It is amazing how many people enjoy and support poisoning of their water, food and bodies.

pmdgrwr:Why would you want to add more chemicals to your water and body? It is amazing how many people want fluoride in their water, I have not drinking fluorinated water for over ten years and have not had any tooth decay or health issues from a lack of fluoride. It is amazing how many people enjoy and support poisoning of their water, food and bodies.

You mean apart from all the other chemicals that compose your body? and food? and water? and air? Sorry, I will keep my chemicals.

HeadLever:BraveNewCheneyWorld: There's plenty of countries that don't use fluoridated water, and their dental health has been improving with the rest of the world.

Probably because most of them are finding out what a toothbrush is.

They're developed countries in Europe. Maybe you should read about it before spouting off.

CPennypacker:BraveNewCheneyWorld: Fluoride is unnecessary. There's plenty of countries that don't use fluoridated water, and their dental health has been improving with the rest of the world. Fluoride isn't the only factor involved in dental health, and it's obviously not responsible for the improvement. Frankly, the biggest cheerleaders for fluoride don't know what the hell they're talking about.

As the official Fark representative of not knowing what the hell you're talking about, I respect your opinion

When did Fark nominate you as the "official representative of not knowing what the hell you're talking about"? You certainly would have gotten my vote, but I assume you won in a landslide anyway.

HeadLever:Wayne 985: Like Vitamin C. Let's start putting that in the water supply. I hear there's a Vitamin D deficiency as well. Maybe pump that into the water.

These don't do well in chlorinated drinking water and is a non-starter. Besides, vitamins come from food and need to be digested in order to be effective. Flouride is a topical treatment that is not typically found in foods.

Fair enough. What else can we add to water to make Americans healthier then? There have to be other interest groups who stand to make profits.

BraveNewCheneyWorld:HeadLever: BraveNewCheneyWorld: There's plenty of countries that don't use fluoridated water, and their dental health has been improving with the rest of the world.

Probably because most of them are finding out what a toothbrush is.

They're developed countries in Europe. Maybe you should read about it before spouting off.

CPennypacker: BraveNewCheneyWorld: Fluoride is unnecessary. There's plenty of countries that don't use fluoridated water, and their dental health has been improving with the rest of the world. Fluoride isn't the only factor involved in dental health, and it's obviously not responsible for the improvement. Frankly, the biggest cheerleaders for fluoride don't know what the hell they're talking about.

As the official Fark representative of not knowing what the hell you're talking about, I respect your opinion

When did Fark nominate you as the "official representative of not knowing what the hell you're talking about"? You certainly would have gotten my vote, but I assume you won in a landslide anyway.

Wayne 985:HeadLever: Wayne 985: Like Vitamin C. Let's start putting that in the water supply. I hear there's a Vitamin D deficiency as well. Maybe pump that into the water.

These don't do well in chlorinated drinking water and is a non-starter. Besides, vitamins come from food and need to be digested in order to be effective. Flouride is a topical treatment that is not typically found in foods.

Fair enough. What else can we add to water to make Americans healthier then? There have to be other interest groups who stand to make profits.

Wayne 985:HeadLever: Wayne 985: Like Vitamin C. Let's start putting that in the water supply. I hear there's a Vitamin D deficiency as well. Maybe pump that into the water.

These don't do well in chlorinated drinking water and is a non-starter. Besides, vitamins come from food and need to be digested in order to be effective. Flouride is a topical treatment that is not typically found in foods.

Fair enough. What else can we add to water to make Americans healthier then? There have to be other interest groups who stand to make profits.

CPennypacker:Wayne 985: HeadLever: Wayne 985: Like Vitamin C. Let's start putting that in the water supply. I hear there's a Vitamin D deficiency as well. Maybe pump that into the water.

These don't do well in chlorinated drinking water and is a non-starter. Besides, vitamins come from food and need to be digested in order to be effective. Flouride is a topical treatment that is not typically found in foods.

Fair enough. What else can we add to water to make Americans healthier then? There have to be other interest groups who stand to make profits.

Are you saying we're all in the pocket of big fluoride?

Don't you know that scientists are in either the pockets of "big fluoride", "big climate", "big pharmaceuticals" and several other "bigs"? Have you ever seen a poor scientist? they are all "in" these vast conspiracies!

CPennypacker:Nobody knows what the hell you're talking about, I just represent us.

Of course you don't know what the hell I'm talking about. The only thing you ever do is take the opposing position of anyone with anything resembling a conspiracy theory regardless of the facts. You never bother to research, if you did, you wouldn't have your ass handed to you in every thread.

BraveNewCheneyWorld:CPennypacker: Nobody knows what the hell you're talking about, I just represent us.

Of course you don't know what the hell I'm talking about. The only thing you ever do is take the opposing position of anyone with anything resembling a conspiracy theory regardless of the facts. You never bother to research, if you did, you wouldn't have your ass handed to you in every thread.

Quick g-search came up with this.. Plenty of citations included from reputable agencies.http://georgewashington2.blogspot.com/2011/01/overwhelming-number-of -s cientific.html

And here's a chart from the World Health Organization.[sdsdw.org image 596x433]

But it must be the fluoride!!! derp!!!

What, exactly, do you think your chart proves, of anything?

Why are you wrong in every thread? I can predict your position on any issue by imagining the stupidest possible interpretation of what is being discussed.