Polly's parents are tested yearly by a cardiologist for heart issues, they are both 7 years old and are clear any any murmurs or heart problems (which is of course great news :thmbsup:) but I was curious if this is actually quite common for cavalier's of their age or if it's especially good? I have her pedigree going back several generations, I will have to check on her grandparents history as well (curious) Thanks!

MadPip

7th March 2011, 02:09 PM

I'm sure there'll be some knowledgeable people along soon who can answer whether this is common or not. I can only speak for my two - Maddie's parents are both clear aged 9, and Pippin's both clear aged 7. I'd like to think that we're not unique. However, every year that passes with a clear test is to be celebrated I think.

Let us know about the grandparents though, that would be very interesting. :thmbsup:

Karlin

7th March 2011, 02:51 PM

It wouldn't be that uncommon if breeders are selecting dogs from lines with good hearts and parents had good hearts and if they follow the MVD protocol (actually I'd be pretty alarmed if a breeder didn't have most breeding stock remain clear until this age at least... and if they didn't discontinue that line if they found it was producing murmurs by age 7, which is still very early for dogs generally if sadly not in this breed). Half of all cavaliers have a murmur by 5-6, but that still leaves half of them who do not, so the chance is slightly under 50% for any 7 year old cavalier to be heart clear (I have had three clear at that age, with one too young still and one diagnosed at 6, of my 5). Almost all the remaining 50% will develop a murmur by 10 though.

As a general point: I would not rely on any report of a clear heart unless it is from a board certified cardiologist -- most vets miss early grade murmurs (one of my vets made a guess of grade 2 on Leo and I know it is at least a grade 3 from a cardiologist -- so they also tend to be off the right grade slightly too, which is not a criticism as they are not heart specialists! But it underlines that any report from a vet alone is likely to be inaccurate and potentially entirely miss a murmur).

I also would not take anyone's word on what their dogs are graded: if people haven't seen the certs they have no idea if what a breeder is saying is correct or how old the auscultation is.

Karlin

7th March 2011, 04:02 PM

Meant to add that it is great your breeder is cardio testing older dogs as too many seem to stop at age 5 and never reveal results on their older dogs (which of course are at least as important as what the dog was graded at when young!!! Clear at older ages is good to hear).

renate

7th March 2011, 07:09 PM

in DK it would be rather unusual to have two 7 year old dogs tested heart clear (with clolour flow ultrasound).
i had to look abroad to find beansy, whose parents were 7 and 8, both heart clear with ultrasound.

Erin2854

7th March 2011, 08:07 PM

Thanks for the info, good to know! Her parents are both heart cleared by a board certified cardiologist, they actually both go to the same cardio doctor that Polly does (polly had an ECG and Echocardio done a few months back, everything looked great) and they have both recently been to the cardio doctor for a checkup. I'm lucky enough to have a good relationship with the breeder I purchased Polly from, we keep eachother updated with frequent emails and chats at AKC shows when she shows. It was encouraging to hear that on the sires side, one of the breeders original cavaliers lived tlll he was 17!

Madpip- How wonderful that they are still heart cleared at 9. Every year that goes by with a clean bill of health must be such a relief :)

Pat

7th March 2011, 09:49 PM

in DK it would be rather unusual to have two 7 year old dogs tested heart clear (with clolour flow ultrasound).
i had to look abroad to find beansy, whose parents were 7 and 8, both heart clear with ultrasound.

In the US, when we say "heart clear" by cardio, this means they are clear by auscultation only. Neither breeders nor pet owners generally clear their Cavaliers via color doppler echocardiogram (ultrasound of the heart). At the 1998 Heart Symposium, the cardiologists said that if we require heart clear by doppler ultrasound, way too many dogs would be removed from the breeding program since valvular disease is seen on ultrasound long before a heart murmur is heard. (Also, ultrasounds here are in the $350 and up price range.) In 20 some years I've only known perhaps two breeders that screened with ultrasound.

Pat

Karlin

7th March 2011, 10:06 PM

In Ireland it is almost impossible to find breeders who even use a cardiologist! Very interesting on the ultrasound.

I had an echocardiogram done on me about two and a half years ago and it was really fascinating to watch the blood flow and see the valves working on the echo. I think the technician was a bit surprised that I was asking lots of questions about the valves and regurgitation… It's funny the weird areas of knowledge you end up with, from owning cavaliers.