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Topic: Conversational responsibility... (Read 13771 times)

I was waiting for a group meeting to start, milling about with the other attendees. We all kind of sort of know each other and engage in chit chat before the meeting.

I mentioned that I bought something at Small Pricey Grocery Store. One of my acquaintances looked at me a bit sideways and said, “I never go there… I wouldn’t know. It’s so expensive.”

My husband and I are frequently questioned about our reasons to shop there and I responded truthfully, but lightly, “We shop there because there are never any kids at this store. No meltdowns in the candy aisle. Haha, tantrums are the worst, amiright?”

All of the other women in the room were parents (I’m not), so I was really hoping that I didn’t rub anyone the wrong way, but I immediately regretted answering the way I did. Even though my initial feeling was that no one enjoys a temper tantrum, so it was a safe thing to mention.

My acquaintance launched into a description of a meltdown she saw the other day in Large Discount Grocery Store and what her internal reaction was. She wanted to tell the parents to take the kid out of the store. Her story telling tone was harsh and judgemental. Her kids are adolescent and I got the feeling that she had been waiting for a chance to pontificate On Parents Today.

Another woman piped up, “I would have been furious with you if you had said that to me.”

Acquaintance says, “The parents weren’t addressing the situation properly and they had to do something.”

Tension levels went WAY up and I felt pretty gross for starting the subject. Conversations do have a life of their own, but parenting discussions are such a minefield, I feel like I made a tactical error that lead to the entire group being uncomfortable. I probably should have just said something bland like, “Oh, we like it. It’s a nice little store.”

Given the passionate viewpoints people have on parenting and discipline, I’m wondering if these are topics that shouldn’t be brought up in social situations, much like religion and politics?

Yeah, I don't have kids either, but I can see myself saying something along those lines, and then thinking, carp, i should have said something else. I don't think you were rude though. Not everyone is going to agree with everyone else. And you couldn't help that someone else started in on the same subject....

I think you had an error in tactics there. I wouldn't have said that in a roomful of parents. You weren't rude, per se, but it's the sort of thing parents could take offense to, or that childfree people could take and run with - which happened. I'd just have said something like, "Well, they have a particular Thing I like, so we indulge occasionally."

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William wondered why he always disliked people who said "no offense meant." Maybe it was because they found it easier to say "no offense meant" than actually to refrain from giving offense.

However, you aren't responsible for the rudeness and ill judgment the OTHER woman displayed, so don't take too much responsibility onto yourself.

And I want to encourage you to *never* feel that you must justify why you go to small pricey grocery store. When people say "I wouldn't know, I never go there, it's too expensive," just say, "Oh!" brightly.

And stop. Bite your tongue, literally (like, with your teeth, but gently) if you have to. Don't say another word. Then after about two beats, continue on with the ORIGINAL topic, which was the thing that you bought, so say, "it's really delicious," or "we enjoyed it with lentils."

(also, you might think about why you do mention that grocery store, given that you get quizzed about it--are you trying to make a statement? You *can* just leave it out of your original statement: "I bought something at Small Pricey Grocery Store."

However, you aren't responsible for the rudeness and ill judgment the OTHER woman displayed, so don't take too much responsibility onto yourself.

And I want to encourage you to *never* feel that you must justify why you go to small pricey grocery store. When people say "I wouldn't know, I never go there, it's too expensive," just say, "Oh!" brightly.

And stop. Bite your tongue, literally (like, with your teeth, but gently) if you have to. Don't say another word. Then after about two beats, continue on with the ORIGINAL topic, which was the thing that you bought, so say, "it's really delicious," or "we enjoyed it with lentils."

(also, you might think about why you do mention that grocery store, given that you get quizzed about it--are you trying to make a statement? You *can* just leave it out of your original statement: "I bought something at Small Pricey Grocery Store."

This is what I was thinking. The first woman's comment about where you shop sounded judgmental to me, so if there was an instigator here it was her! One should never feel as though they have to defend where they chose to grocery shop. Yeesh! I like Toot's suggestions for responses should it happen again.

As for your comment, eh, I can see where it could open up a can of worms, but I still think you had good intentions.

The remark about how expensive that store was comes off as putting the OP on the spot. That was the first issue.

But I would gently discourage the OP from making remarks about avoiding places where children may be, especially in large groups. (Different if it's a small group, where you are confident no one is a parent). As a parent, my hackles would go up the moment I heard that. It's quite likely to lead to child-bashing.

As for kids in grocery stores: Sadly families need to eat, they need to buy groceries, and grocery stores can be very difficult in particular. Little kids see so many tempting things around them, and even the best of parents on top of their parenting game can have a kid lose it and go into loud crying at a grocery store. When mine were toddlers, I found grocery shopping to be practically the most difficult part of our lives, and I did my best to go at off-hours when it wasn't crowded so we could get in and out faster. A little understanding goes a long way. Not everyone can go shopping without their kids (who can afford to hire babysitters for running all the errands?).

Anyhow, the OP was not the rudest person by far at that meeting, but I do think a remark about going somewhere for the reason of avoiding families with small children is highly likely to lead to rudeness and upset people.

I think a better response might have been, "Yes, it's a little higher but we like it. Bean dip?"

I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting to avoid places that are likely to have lots of children.. I'm a parent and even I like to go to adult places sometimes. But actually saying that you don't want to be around kids is definitely likely to cause some friction among a group of parents.

I agree that the "that store is too expensive" remark is what caught my attention and I thought that was going to be what this post was about. I think she was pretty rude to say that. If she doesn't want to shop there, that's her perogative. But I don't get the point she was trying to make by making that remark. Was she trying to make you feel bad?

I get Toots's advice about leaving out the store name in the conversation, but I could also see it being relevant to what you were saying. Was it?

As far as the parenting comment & following conversation, well, you can't control how other people react to those kinds of conversations. It probably wasn't the best thing to say but on the spur of the moment, it probably just slipped out. I'm a parent (my kids are grown up now) but I don't take every parenting comment people make personally. I wonder if the woman who took offense at what your acquaintance said has out of control kids and knows it. And that's why she took the comment to heart instead of just letting it go.

First off: not your fault. The tension and anger were due to a series of unfortunate comments.

I think it would have been more tactful to phrase your comment on why you enjoy going there on occasion in a more positive way: not saying that there aren't any tantrumy kids, but that it's usually quieter and calmer. "Yes, it is a bit pricer, but we like that it's quieter and less crowded than other stores."

I am sympathetic to both the woman who mentioned wanting to kick the meltdown child and his parents out of the store and the mom who has probably dealt with her own meltdown child in a public place. It would have been more tactful for your acquaintance to just say, in general terms, that tantrums are a big pain to witness. It would have been more tactful for the other woman to just agree that meltdowns are annoying rather than escalate it into an argument.

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You have just begun reading the sentence you have just finished reading.

The remark about how expensive that store was comes off as putting the OP on the spot. That was the first issue.

But I would gently discourage the OP from making remarks about avoiding places where children may be, especially in large groups. (Different if it's a small group, where you are confident no one is a parent). As a parent, my hackles would go up the moment I heard that. It's quite likely to lead to child-bashing.

This.

Sometimes (though not always) a remark about shopping at an expensive store can come off as "Gee, lucky you. Must be nice to be able to afford to shop there".

I never explain/justify my store preferences - whether I get something at a more expensive store or the dollar store.

Where you choose to shop is your business.

However, remarks about preferring a place because there are no kids running around can get parents' hackles up. I don't think OP was rude, but it's something to keep in mind.

However, you aren't responsible for the rudeness and ill judgment the OTHER woman displayed, so don't take too much responsibility onto yourself.

And I want to encourage you to *never* feel that you must justify why you go to small pricey grocery store. When people say "I wouldn't know, I never go there, it's too expensive," just say, "Oh!" brightly.

And stop. Bite your tongue, literally (like, with your teeth, but gently) if you have to. Don't say another word. Then after about two beats, continue on with the ORIGINAL topic, which was the thing that you bought, so say, "it's really delicious," or "we enjoyed it with lentils."

(also, you might think about why you do mention that grocery store, given that you get quizzed about it--are you trying to make a statement? You *can* just leave it out of your original statement: "I bought something at Small Pricey Grocery Store."

POD to this. It was the same woman who made the remark about the store being expensive, AND told the story about witnessing a tantrum, right? Her remark about the store was unnecessary and judgmental. Then, the OP's remarks about avoiding tantrums were awkward and probably a poor choice, but not necessarily rude I think.

Then the first woman decided to run with that and told the tantrum story, apparently with a little too much glee and venom for the other parents--the story itself wouldn't have to be rude, I could see the conversation just being awkward and seizing on the first thing my keyword search brought up, which was a tantrum I'd witnessed the other day, but if you get too carried away judging people in your story, you may find that some of the people around you identify with them more than with you. For example, she probably could have told the same story but been like, "Yeah, it was awful, poor little guy, he just didn't know how else to express himself I guess," and probably no one would have been offended.

I think a better response might have been, "Yes, it's a little higher but we like it. Bean dip?"

I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting to avoid places that are likely to have lots of children.. I'm a parent and even I like to go to adult places sometimes. But actually saying that you don't want to be around kids is definitely likely to cause some friction among a group of parents.

Actually, saying that you want to avoid ANY group of people is likely to cause friction.

"We like going there because there aren't as many hipsters.""...aren't as many seniors.""...aren't as many poor people.""...aren't as many yuppies / DINKs."

It's just best to leave that sort of negative out of the conversation. What possible good does it serve?