For people who are/were comet throwers and have had a decent amount of time with the Fugitive, how comparable are the two? I understand the fugitive is a bit faster, but in terms of glide and stability could both be described as fairly neutral? It's probably going to be another month until I can play, and wouldn't mind trying some new stuff since I've had time to forget a lot of habits/dependencies since having knee surgery.

Ability is what you're capable of doing. Motivation determines what you do. Attitude determines how well you do it. -Lou Holtz -

First run Suspect 176 orange is basically a very slightly tackier flat top Z Buzz. If there is a flight difference this disc might fade a little harder. Nice one but derivative.

The real star of this test of new discs is Classic soft Judge 176 peach colored putter. It has cosmetic damage from the first round in the snow so longevity may be a blemish on the shine this disc put on today. I didn't play that much last year having surgery just before the short Finnish summer and this winter rehabbing but i think i made as many circle putts and farther today than i got in the last 10 months after the surgery.

I was impressed by a few things but i realize that i had an ace up my sleeve that may skew the results and improve all putts with all putters. I used rubber cement on a thin almost seamless fabric/kangaroo leather golf glove for the best winter grip i've ever had. The tackiness worked in drives with C-Line plastic so the tacky like rubber Judge needed the least grip power ever the not slip away. No wonder the looser arm moved better at higher power levels needed to make the longer putts. I gotta do boxing practice more to get more putting gains if added power adds this much accuracy and hit rate at long ranges!!! I mean hooray! Putts are straight and can take fairly stiff winds but rear winds smack these out of the air so they are not the glidiest of putting putters. I could not power fully with the snow so i only got it to about 220'. At that power it tracked in the hardest winds and was straight for the most of the flight in moderate winds. The fade is pretty mild. Pureish. With a thin profile i had no problems with the bead. Gripping is easy and so are clean releases.

The HSS is not that great OAT'd with the wind hitting the bottom of the disc. I was throwing flat shots thanks to the wind most of the time so hyzers and annies are to be tested. The wind was probably too hard for this disc to expose the bottom or the top to it so i have no idea how well it does in more normal weather. When tilted it seemed to move sideways pretty quickly but i cannot say for sure how much of it was because of the wind.

In new state it seems like a good driving putter but maybe too tightly turning for finessing in mildly turning tight fairways. Since the grip and clean releases are fine the low profile is not making the grip any worse practically than with a Pure but this seemed like a hair more HSS and similarly straight finishing disc. So this is probably quite a dependable disc when new and as straight or straighter and certainly more forgiving than anything i've found. With an easy to grip material it should not slip out easily even in 20F+- some that i faced. It means that i will throw it more and do a shoot out because it might be the best winter putter at least that i've tried for 25' putting. Outside of that glidier discs are nice to have powering wise. I gotta do a shootout with Soft X Banger, Sole and MVP putters with the rubber cemented gloves but actually this could be the best putting putter in all conditions. Depending on preferences of course.

As a straight line driving putter it is top of the pack material too with caveat for possibly tight turns. Which means that minor sideways placement differences might be zero error margin shots. The jury is out on that.

A VERY interesting putter that will be put to the acid test of shoot outs between the best competitors on other courses as well.

If i have worries it is how well it maintains the Anode like ease of straight driving at higher power levels. At that distance Opto Pure with the slicker material is straight too. I might be the culprit for Opto Pures flipping at times at high power. Or it could be the disc. If the soft Judge holds up to driving (not holding breath seeing the first day damage) and won't flip occasionally at full power -yummy and takeover. As it is i will at least temporarily bag it and see what it does in warmer weather. I might get a harder plastic one later if durability seems to be a problem and seeing how the soft Judge breaks in. I see a poor weather role in the bag for this disc because i've not seen anything better for cold and wet. That alone insures at least occasional appearances in the bag. I can see being a permanent disc in my bag with it. It seems to be that good. But this was initial first day test in poor weather so i need to push it to see what's what. So far so good. Fingers crossed that no deal breakers arise.

Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.

I finally threw my Bio Escape and really really liked it. I actually came home and ordered a second one. I wasn't that hip on the Lucid ones, but these have much more HSS and fly like I thought the Lucids would.

I've found my two Lucid Escapes fly about the same as my BioFuzion Escape. The Bio might be just a hair more stable, but not much. I like the Escape a lot, but I doubt it will make my bag since it really is trying to take the place of my PD's. And my PD's are still a little longer and more consistent for me.

I could not get reliable data yesterday on how the Judge flies because i was cycling looking for traction. I was dressed for cycling in the wind and was constricted by clothing like the Michelin man. With that caveat and relatively little power generation the Judge flew the farthest for me out of the discs i had in rear wind. This is the first time ever for me to be able to outthrow mids and FWs with a putter. Interestingly Roc3 and Mace outflew Rival and C FD too. Also a first for me. Since most of the field was under ice and snow i don't have exact distances but the best Judge throws were around 280-300'. In headwinds the soft Judge turned too much to be reliable. Around 10 degrees. The grip was fine even when the disc was wet. Which is huge for my slick skin.

Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.

Got a good condition to field to throw at and the FR Suspect is between a flat top concave wing Z Buzz and the more overstable kind of Glo Z Buzz. Fairly close to halfway. Being over dressed and in just above freezing conditions i got it to 300' at best. The soft Judge turns a few degrees at full power going to 280' at best today. So it would seem that there are more reliable driving putters out there or mine broke in super quickly. If harder plastic version is more OS it could be a very nice disc because the soft one fades mildly and late gliding a lot on tall slow lines.

Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.

keltik wrote:I generally applaud our European forum members for their excellent use of diction, syntax and spelling in English.

Probably due to us actually having had to actively learn it, instead of just growing up with it. I definitely have a better technical grasp of English than Finnish, because at some point I've had to actively think about learning English, whereas Finnish just happened naturally.

Parks wrote:If the posts on this forum are any indication, the PD is like a Teebird with sunshine coming out of its butthole so hard that it flies faster.

I'm disappointed in the Renegade. I wanted it to be a disc that was a slightly less stable Flow. I had heard it was more understable than that. I haven't had a chance to throw it in calm conditions yet. In a headwind, it was super flippy, which made sense if its a little understable to begin with. So I figured when I threw it with a tailwind, that it might fly kind of straight. It actually flew a little overstable with the tailwind. It's like the wind affects this disc, regardless of direction, more than other discs. Also, it seemed to have less glide than I anticipated. My form isn't that good, so it could well be operator error. I'll probably try it some more, but I don't see the Renegdae making my bag.

I tried the Renegade again yesterday, and started throwing it side by side with my purple/grey swirl GL Flow. This time it seemed the Renegade flew very similar to my Flow, but with a little less glide. This time the winds were a little slower, though still present.

the lucid escape has been a furstraition for me thrown flat it will turn then fade out about half and slowly fade out but give it any hyzer and it turns into a pig and just fade out right away. very nose angle sensative for a stable/over stable disc as well.