ampleforth posted:

Hi there!
So, you're ready to get out there and share your awesome self with the ladies of the world. Great! Dating is and should be fun. I like to think of it as the ultimate massively multiplayer game. Let's get cracking!

first you dweebs gotta learn our language

ampleforth posted:

8. Be fearless! Approach her! Do not stand around by yourself or chode crystallize* with your guy friends.

*Chode Crystal = group of dudes standing around out somewhere not approaching. Smash the crystal! Credit Jeffy.

this summer reading should help you get some snizzzzzz

ampleforth posted:

Reading list
These books will help you better understand yourself and human sexuality as a whole. Read them. Seriously, do it.
1. The Game, Neil Strauss
This book is the Led Zeppelin IV of pickup books. It's a story that contains many examples of pickup artists in the field, and also illustrates how pickup can go wrong. Check it out.
2. The Venusian Arts handbook. Mystery
The first bible of meeting women. Mystery coined many of the phrases in use in the community, as well as many of the techniques.
3. David DeAngelo, assorted works.
David D is great. Almost all of his stuff blends together, but his main point is that you must get your inner game under control in order to successfully attract women. Read any David D
4. How to be a pickup artist, Juggler (Wayne Elise)
Juggler's another great writer on the subject. His conversational style appeals to many people for whom Mystery is too aggressive and David D is too wordy.
5. Sperm Wars, Robin Baker
An incredible text on the subject of human sexuality.
6. RSD, Tyler Durden, Jeffy et. al.
Look them up.
7. The definitive Body Language Book, Barbara Pease and Allan Pease
Super important. A great place to start with understanding human communication.

lemme give a little backstory on myself

ampleforth posted:

Actually. I do. I was once an anxiety-ridden pack a day smoking chodester who was 100lbs overweight and hopelessly in love. If it seems like I occasionally have the right answer, you can believe it's because I hosed everything up a million times.

as you can see neil strauss changed my life

let's start with some life changing advice!

Jhonas posted:

You're taking life too seriously, cowboy. You're making banter, a fun, teasing comment. You're not denouncing her existence and taking a poo poo on her family crest or anything. Lighten up a little.

holy poo poo internet guy you're right

jet_dee posted:

Best quote I've ever heard about me! I totally agree, I am WAY too serious about everything and trying to lighten up more.

woah uh no thanks can we get some more capable candidates for change please

Plectrum posted:

I'm the kind of SADFAG who falls in love with any girl who shows the slightest bit of affection, and to top that off I'm inclined to do the whole white knight thing with those girls - I can't help myself. Needless to say, I've never had a girlfriend. I'll be 21 in less than four weeks.

I'm also pretty not right in the head. I was treated for depression from 2003-2006 - I've been better for about 13-14 months now but I wouldn't say I'm 100% out of the woods. I'm obese, but working on it (just under 50lbs down since June, but I could stand to lose at least that much again), and my fashion sense has only just started showing signs of evolving past T-shirts with whacky messages on and manky trainers.

My degree will be finished in May and with it I'll have wasted three years of university in which I should probably have been meeting girls and having relationships that would set me up for a well-adjusted future with all the necessary social skills and experience. Soon after May I'm expecting to be going into full time employment at a computer game developer where I'll be shut away with a bunch of (almost exclusively male) fellow nerds - have I missed the boat on the whole women thing?

Am I fixable or is this pretty much a slow motion train wreck now? Have any of the Meeting Women Thread regulars got any stories of people like me turning it around and sorting their lives out? I could use the pick-me-up.

hey little guy i know interaction is tough but we'll get you through it

MZ posted:

Bit of a cross-post from my NYE situation in the other thread, but I have a question:

Say I found a girl on facebook (that I have already met of course) via her being tagged in the same photo as me.

1.Do I add her as a friend?

2.What do I say to her?

I'm not really into the whole internet flirting thing, I don't want to come across as a creepy stalker, but as I couldn't get her number or anything because of her older brother wanting to leave, is this a viable way?

i got you dawg here's a handy script

stupid puma posted:

1. No, message her first.

2. "I had a great time at ______, I'm going/doing/seeing ______ on _______, you need to come with me because it'll be awesome." And perhaps a comment about her profile or something such as; "Wow, you really like Grey's Anatomy? On second thought, I'm not sure if we can hang out together anymore." Don't use this verbatim, but you get the idea.

If you didn't get her number while you were hanging out then you're a little behind the ball, but there's not reason to not contact her.

oh no oh no oh no

MZ posted:

Great except her profile is hidden so I can't make such comments until she adds me.

six years ago a girl liked me what now you ask

Curt posted:

Alright, so hopefully you guys can help me out here.
When I was in high school (about 6 years ago), there was this girl that I knew liked me, but I was too afraid to act on it. I saw her about a year ago. She came into the store I worked at, we talked/flirted a little, haven't seen her since.

I see her all the time online (AIM), but I can't remember the last time I talked with her there.
What would be a non-creepy way to get a date out of this? Should I just, out of the blue, IM her? what should I say?

well of course i give information despite my retardation (leave this to me, a professional pua)

Curt posted:

Not sure how to help on the first girl, but the second girl I can do. She is obviously into you, and wants you. Her failed attempts to get you those past nights didn't work, so she tried to make you jealous this night. She continued to do this until she found out that you couldn't care less, then became extremely jealous that you picked up 3 other women that night.

Does that help explain things at all?

here is a wall of text about basic interaction hope it helps

Booyah posted:

I'd like to say a lot of advice in this thread is great, but not necessarily going to work for everyone. The first post is somewhat of a "guide lines", but by no means should be considered a bible.

A few misconceptions in this thread that need to be cleared up :

1.) The difference between a tease and a hurtful remark. The big difference here is the inflection when you say it, and the time at which it's said. If you say something in an angry tone and have an angry look on your face then chances are a girl is gonna be pissed. If you're not sure as to how you can make something a joke versus a hurtful remark, then don't. They're very powerful tools, but they can also backfire tremendously. A good tactic is turn to her, cock your head a bit, act like she just said something ridiculous(raise an eyebrow even if you want to be corny), and say, "Aren't you demanding". Following up with a smirk or a chuckle or even a wink will ensure that it was a joke. She'll love it (hopefully). This will have a TREMENDOUSLY effect than looking lame in the face and saying that.
In situation one she thinks its funny the other situation she thinks you're telling her to gently caress off. One of those will get her to like you, but I'm gonna let you figure that one out yourself.

2.) You can't hook up with friends. That's just not true, though there's a good chance that you could potentially lose that friend either to awkwardness or to a nasty breakup or to thousands of other complications that arise from relationships (let alone sex). If you're responsible about it, you can hook up with a good friend and act as though nothing happened and go right back to that friend state. Though this is rare and unlikely.

Now that we've cleared that up, we'll go on to something else.

I'm only going to go over my strengths which are NOT looks and style. I consider myself only to be average looking and have only a decent sense of style. Nothing to set the world on fire with. However, I'm terribly good (it should be a crime) at getting people to laugh and I like to think my personality is pretty good.

Humor, how can I use that? I like to consider my sense of humor my forte. Even with average looks, and a decent sense of style but a good personality and a killer sense of humor you can get any girl to be completely enamored with you all night. Remember it's all in the delivery.
What's funny to women?
1.) Slightly funny jokes. If it sounds cliche chances are they'll love it. Some say it's not true but the fact is most women eat up even slightly funny jokes.
2.) Stories. I can't tell you how many times you can get a good chuckle out of a story where you or a friend (change it to a friend if it's bad, change it to you if it's good ) did something stupid or funny.
3.) Other things that don't revolve around the internet. If you have a good sense of humor for real world things use it. This is a real powerhouse.

What's NOT funny to women?
1.) Anything that's funny in FYAD.
2.) Anything that's funny in BYOB.
3.) Probably anything that's funny in GBS.
4.) 4chan (in general).
5.) Death, poverty, disease, disasters, anything funny on the internet, etc.
6.) You should be careful with sex jokes. They can get either great responses or terrible ones. They also make you look like a sex fiend potentially (which is bad most of the time).

So what makes a good personality? For starters this is completely in the eye of the beholder (meaning the girl you want to pursue, and chances are her friends). I'd say intelligence will only get you so far, but being charming and charismatic are big pluses. Sweetness and sensitivity to some extent, but not to the point of oversensitivity/sappiness. Chances are the girl is going to want you to "protect her" so to speak and the last thing she wants is for her to picture you crying in a corner when she needs you most. You also don't want to look like a emotionless prick, so pretend not to be if you are one.

Ok, now on to some more general tips :

Never become more intoxicated than she is. 2 reasons for this:
1.)No matter how good you think you are when you're drunk, you aren't that good. I hate to say it, I feel the same way too, but it's not true. I like to think of myself as "smoother" when I'm drunk but it's just not true.
2.)She'll be throwing you signs based on how drunk she is. So, if you're too drunk to pick them up you'll be missing clues that she'll be giving you. DON'T be too drunk to pick up on them, they can mean the difference between a fun night and a lame night.

If you need to get a drink in you to "take the edge off" fine, but keep it cool and slow. This is more of a problem during the age of 14-25 in which irresponsible drinking is a bit more rampant. Knowing your limits can mean the difference between going to bed with her or going to bed with the trash can. I suggest against getting very drunk (or even drunk for that matter) before you attempt to hit on a girl. If you're buzzed when you start (and you continue to drink) you're better off, but NEVER EVER get too drunk to where you want to puke.

Also, don't be afraid to stop a girl from drinking or saying no to sex. If she's wasted chances are she may do something that could hinder you guys having a relationship. If she pukes chances are she'll be embarrassed, especially if you're the one holding her hair back while she yacks into the toilet. Been there, done that, ruined the T-shirt. They may say their fine, but I've seen girls who are "5 shots away from drunk" pass out or start puking. The younger they are the less they know about their limit.

Pick up on clues/signs she gives you. Discerning clues can be hard, and they're different for every girl, but the most notable is physical contact.
Breaking the physical contact barrier is a GREAT clue to know if you're "in" (not her pants at least not necessarily; rather that you're in her thoughts). A simple brush up against each other doesn't count. WHAT DOES count is when she puts her hands/arm/whatever on you, and not just in an accidental way. A perfect example is if while sitting down you say something funny sand she puts her hand on you and says something like "oh that's funny" or something. Try not to force the physical contact, but once you're sure that barrier is broken you can do it (so long as you do it responsibly -- no boob/butt grabbing you horn dog!) yourself, but make sure you know it's broken. A good thing is to put an arm around her shoulder (so cliche, yet so effective). A hand at the small of her back while you dance (or even walking to "lead her" so to speak -- but this is dangerous don't try it without a firm knowledge that she is in to you.) shows your both your manliness and your control. Don't put it on her rear end, she wont like that. The small of the back is JUST sensual enough that she'll get the idea though.

Physical contact is 90% of the way to getting to the relationship level. Sealing it with a kiss is the last 10%. If she feels comfortable touching you physically all you've got to do is wait for a perfectly timed kiss and you're in. Don't go for a kiss right away, it will seem awkward and don't go for a kiss after one or two touches. You could have interpreted them wrong. Nothing kills a budding relationship more than an awkward attempted kiss gone bad.

***DISCLAIMER***
With this next section of advise these are very effective, but very dangerous gambles. They can work EXTREMELY well but you have to walk a fine line between too much and too little otherwise the delivery of it will turn her off, or even worse, make you look like an rear end. So be careful when using these.
***DISCLAIMER OVER***

My favorite tactic that I can't preach enough is make it seem like THEY are fortunate to spend time with you, ONLY AFTER you have them alone and have talked with them enough. If you do it at the start you'll come off as cocky (which is a turn off to most women) or if you do it around her friends they'll think less of you. So, once you have her alone (especially if you two are really hitting it off), do something that would allow for you to have a way out, but also let it be an invitation to her. This way she thinks that SHE is losing you. If she's even REMOTELY interested she's gonna want to pursue you if even just to figure what she did wrong. It's the male version of playing hard to get, and it's unbelievably easy to do. I realize how weird that sounds, but I'll give some examples:

1.) If you're at a party or a club say something like you wanna get up and go dance or something. Dancing is a GREAT way to break the physical contact barrier and stir up any sexual chemistry you have. If you can't dance well I don't suggest using this, but trust me girls don't care too much how you dance. It's a common misconception that "if you can't dance well you don't gently caress well". It's not true, but there are some women who think that. If she says she doesn't want to dance (because she's exhausted or for whatever reason) sit back down and ask her why, but make sure to make it look like that was a ploy. You're simply trying to get her to show interested in you rather than you show interest in her.

2.) Moving to somewhere "less crowded". Cliches work best in this game. I know it sounds like any girl can read it from a mile away, but if they can, they sure don't give a poo poo. Make sure you stress that you want to do it to get to know her better. Don't even MENTION anything about kissing/etc (even if you're saying lets go over there to talk, not make out). Make your intentions pure as can be and try not to taint them. The kiss will come very easily when you are alone if it's meant to. If she says "You just want to get me alone to have your way with me" jokingly say something like "you would like that wouldn't you" or "you would only be so lucky". If she responds positively to this, you know you're good to go, and if she responds negatively (something with a neutral answer like "oh I just thought that you were another one of those horny guys who is only into me cause I am hot") then you're kinda hosed. Remember these tactics are gambles that will work 95% of the time. When they work, they work well. When they backfire they can very quickly destroy a good bit of time spent trying to "court" the lady.

those are some good general examples but feel free to make up your own. Just remember : make it clear that she has the invitation to do this with you, make sure it's something she's interested in(example of what not to do : "Hey wanna go browse an internet forum called somethingawful with me?) and lastly if she even slightly thinks that you're trying to get her away so you can kiss her, turn it around on her and make it seem like she would only be so lucky.

Ok, so every thing's going well right now and you two love birds are alone. Aside from the fact that being alone is very romantic in itself, you shouldn't let her know that you're going for a kiss right now. Obviously if she responded positively to something like "you would be so lucky to get me alone" she's pretty much ready for you to make her move, but it's always fun to make her wait, but don't make her wait too long! It can turn her off. Remember, girls do it ALL the drat time, and if you take that power away from them you're the one holding all the cards now.

Just don't force the kiss (but make sure to go for it some time, or you could lose her)!

If you manage to be really good and somehow get to sleep with her on the first night, you should know/realize a few things. I've never had a good meaningful long relationship after having sex the first night (note : not the first date though) though it's not to say you can't, a guy I know and his girlfriend slept together after a party and have been dating for something like 1.5 years, but the chances are dramatically less. If she's willing to give it up after a few hours of knowing you chances are she just wanted some action and nothing more. You can have one of those fun few month relationships where you have sex all the time, but don't expect to find someone you truly love. But what's wrong with a little play? The answer: nothing.

Now, here's some tips for when she finally does want to have sex with you, REMEMBER she wants to have sex with you. It's back to the "you would be so lucky" (but please, don't use that. Rephrase/reword it somehow she'll catch on eventually...) to do this with me kind of thing.

*quick note at any point, she may speed things up by uttering these 5 words "Do you have a condom?" That means she wants to have sex. It's pretty apparent. Just remember she's lucky that you're willing to sleep with her, NOT the other way around*

The perfect example is say you're in bed together, and you're probably making out. Never pressure the tongue. That's a bad thing to force it. Once she accepts it (it wont take long, and she may even pressure the tongue on you) then you're clear for your next target : The neck/ear. There is something very sexy about kissing a womans neck, and there's something even hotter about a little nibble on the ear (treat it like you'd treat your thumb. Just brush your teeth against it, DON'T BITE)! If you want, whisper into her ear that shes awfully lucky that she seduced you into doing this. If she likes that you're definitely looking more likely to have a happy ending to this endeavor. The last and final bastion of defense is the shirt and more notably the bra. This is tricky, because frankly it all hinges on you looking like either an horny guy, or a guy she is gonna give it up to. We want the second choice. So you're gonna have to go slow with this. If she doesn't pressure it, it's still ok to try until she says "No" or "Stop" or if she pulls away/whatever. She WILL let you know what is too much, but she MAY not tell you what is not enough. If you get the bra off chances are you're good to go. Remember though, don't pressure her more. A good (again cliche) technique is to begin by kissing her, then move down her neck to her torso and move south. Now, when you get to the pants is when things get a bit crazy. You want to be slow (so that she has plenty of time to react) and if you get her pants off you're definitely good.

Just remember if you're confident and make her think she's the lucky one she'll believe it, and you'll have won.

pua church edition

Sulecrist posted:

Yeah, I have a question.

I started reading these three full threads ago or so. They helped quite a bit. I cleaned up my approach a lot and went to Watch and Weight for better appearance advice, too--I ditched the K-mart shoes for some Puma Romas, started shaving as soon as I saw growth, started exercising every day, and bought more appropriate clothes. I've changed significantly in the last eight months, and I'm at the point where if I see any girl that I don't know, anywhere, I feel comfortable going up and chatting to her. I could do it more often, but that's not a major issue right now. However, I'm turning into a pretty devout Protestant and I don't want to date anyone who isn't. At least half of my relationships have fallen apart because of basic moral disagreement (she wants to sleep with me and I can't and won't, or whatever) and I really don't want to deal with it anymore. It's not really fair to either of us.

So I want to hear advice for meeting people on similar levels of ridiculous religious zealotry. I think ordinarily the church itself would be a good place to start, but out of 550 regular attenders the closest-aged single women are either seven years older than me or three years younger. I'm 20. And I have leadership responsibilities every Sunday, so I can't go trawling at other churches. I have a really extensive circle of friends, but the people who live nearby are all either kids or self-defined losers, so my odds of being set up are dismal. Anyway, I've never dated a Christian before. I don't even know if it works the same way (though I don't see why it wouldn't.)

Any thoughts?

"how do i live a life"

Killmaster posted:

This is going to sound horribly, horribly pathetic, but where do you get the confidence to have your own social life? I managed to make it all the way through college with just a handful of friends (who were also roommates) and a bunch of acquaintances that I never bothered to hang out with much.

E/N warning:

Looking back at my 22 years of existence, I've come to realize that I never learned how to have friends on my own. All the friends I had in grade school were from "play dates" set up by my mom. I kept with these groups all the way until 5th grade, when I switched schools and never saw them again. I'm ashamed to say it, but 5th grade all the way through 8th grade was a horrible void. I think I had maybe one person I could call a friend for that entire period of my life. It wasn't until high school that some people took interest in me, and I'm still close friends with them today.

Reading that, I guess it could be a lot worse. I mean, this is SA and all. I'm not ugly and I have decent social skills (my college friends really helped me break out of my shell). I workout regularly and dress decently. I just have a very limited social life and it sucks.

For my entire life, I've relied on other people to get out and I don't want to do that any more. I need to forge my own path; my future demands it. I need to pick up some hobbies, but it's really difficult without friends to do them with. I have a loner mindset which makes it even harder. I also have a lot of self-esteem issues that still linger in the back of my head, that somehow prevent me from making new friends.

Any suggestions? Specifics are always good; I need to kick these lovely habits and live my own life but I know unless I can make a VERY specific action plan I'm going to falter and fall back

well that's the first two pages, read the next twelve for handy tips on how to be a human being and neg the poo poo outta some hbs!

I never set out to be weird. It was always other people who called me weird.

I've never really read W&W because everything I hear makes it sound like it's supposed to give goon shut-ins common sense advice that normal people figure out on their own (for example, girls don't like shirts with WACKY sayings on them), as opposed to, I dunno, being a forum about exercise and diet tips. Is there anything in W&W that might provide contrary evidence?

spittinglettuce posted:

BTW..My mantra for women used to be..."what would Clint Eastwood do?"
it will never steer you wrong

look it always works also here is advice on licking a butthole

spittinglettuce posted:

The old salad toss. I've only done it with my wife and we both love it. Its definitely a once in a while thing (we do it about once every two weeks, and its usually before anal sex to help get everything stimulated). Its sexy because of how kinky and dirty it seems. I would do it everyday if I could. I doesn't really taste like anything but skin. We typically do it after the shower or bath but I don't really care when (its more about her wanting to feel clean). I also think its hot because I am showing her that I am so into her and her sex that I will lick with my tongue what some people consider the dirtiest part of the body.

She says it feels amazing and is comparable to cunnilingus, but a very different feeling.

Basic technique would be eating her pussy, getting her wet so everything flows down into the rear end area. If its not common practice or is going to be the first time ASK ("can i lick a little lower"). Lick the rear end in a top hat in circular motions very lightly for a little while, then get a finger in her pussy and play with the g-spot. I go from one to the other with my tongue. Its not uncommon for her to come at this point.

edit: Usually the rear end in a top hat is shaved, that cuts down on the "dirty" factor.

let me tell you more

spittinglettuce posted:

I'm 26 and I pre-cum like crazy when I make out with my wife.

but what is your new years resolution

spittinglettuce posted:

Quit smoking and hit the next level in rockclimbing. Also receive more blowjobs.

as somebody who fails miserably in real world dating situations, let me advise you

tiananman posted:

I also hate the idea of being a persona and entering a set.

So I date women exclusively on the internet. It's way easier to meet people on the internet, because they're usually already in your frame of influence: they're also looking to meet someone on the interet. Right away, you've already cut through 90% of the horseshit of the approach.

There's also plenty of normal women who use the internet - it's not all trolls and whores.

And for me, a terrible date is always better than a completely awkward opening.

I'm lucky, because I'm a copywriter by trade, so I have a lot of tools for being convincing in print, but here's a few things about writing either a craiglist ad, or a dating website profile:

More words always outsell less words.

Be specific in who you are looking for, and who you are.

Be urgent - give your ad a time constraint.

Be unique - say something crazy about yourself.

Be playful - say something funny.

lol

Jhonas posted:

Honestly, I went to bristollair.com lair list and found that there was a PUA community in Denver. I joined and now most of my free time is spent hanging out with these dudes and going and meeting girls. I've heard most lairs kind of suck and there's a lot of keyboard jockeys but mine is pretty solid.

Maybe that's not an option for you or you aren't sold on the idea, so I'd have to suggest joining some kind of community. I'll help explain what I mean with an SAT analogy:

SA Forums:Goon meets::Some other community:Not a bunch of smelly nerds

Sulecrist posted:

I chatted with three new girls today. I've been installing nurse call systems in a hospital during my winter break. I flirted with a nurse during the day and pulled her number at the end of the afternoon. Also, when I went out to lunch, I met two girls at the Hardees down the street--it wasn't a great place, and they turned out to be a little boring, but it was good practice.

By flirting he means she said hello to him and by pulled her number he means he looked it up in the directory so he could agonize about not calling it for the next 6 weeks.

quote:

I've been working on my Wood Elves (Warhammer Fantasy, for those of you not completely familiar with offline nerdiness) and I now have tiny cuts all over the tips of my fingers. Why? Because I'm apparently a retard who can't cut the bitz out of the sprues without injuring myself. But seriously, my dryads are a pain in the arse to clean up because they're all branches and twigs and crap that's fragile. So now it looks like my fingertips are emo.

On the bright side, my dryads just need arms, my glade guard need heads (and cloaks and daggers, but that's not as big a deal), and my glade riders need assembled (which I'll hopefully get done today) before Alex will deem me worthy of being allowed to start painting. I'm excited about painting, and I probably would've started long ago on the first model I assembled if it wasn't for the fact that he won't let me. I think the theory is if I get everything assembled and based I can start playing and getting my army down, and the painting will come along as it gets done. On the other hand, I still don't have 500 points until I get my hawk riders, which I really can't afford right now, so it's a moot point. But I'm almost done assembling anyway, and I gotta admit I'm pretty proud to my own army coming together. MY VERY OWN ARMY!! WHEE!!

Vehementi posted:

So I was out dancing in a club with a girl I was dating, but she was seeing some other guy too. I wasn't very happy about that, but the only choice was to just ignore it and be awesome and interesting until she was dating me exclusively (and in the mean time I'd date other people, etc.). Doing anything else would just reek of low quality.

It happens that the other guy was at the club, and while I had stepped away he ran up and grabbed her to sit with him. What would James Bond do? Instead of getting huffy and being pissed off and jealous, I started dancing with a few girl-friends of mine. A few minutes later the girl was back with me dancing again!

i woke up today and said i am going to be awesome and interesting and just really really cool i guess

Moniker posted:

Do you know what's wrong with talking first? The words you are only 7% of the communication formula. Do you know what takes up the rest of that large chunk? Body language, speech patterns (AKA How you say what you're saying), and things like that. That is 93% not what you say but how you look, act, and sound while saying it. What falls into this? Touching. It's part of body language.

Dave Mustard posted:

I love this thread except for the whole outpour of people that are ruining this thread by acting like being a nice guy and not doing anything to better yourself will land you a girl you actually care for.

I was wondering if it was okay to post a specific situation in this thread.

As a foreword, i'm in highschool. Basically, there is a girl that I really like, she has the same hobby as me (drawing), the same sense of humor I would guess by the movies she likes, good taste in music and she is also really pretty and a christian.
(which is important to me because I know she has morals and doesn't drink or smoke pot like most of the girls my age)

Anyways, I like her but i'm not sure if she likes me back. I'm thinking she must like me because she has done the following

- At the beginning of the year she I said "I like your hair" when I walked up to do something on the board.

- Sometimes I would look around for her to see if I saw her alone so I could approach her, and as I would look at her she'd be looking back at me and we'd stare at eachother for a couple of seconds before I reacted and looked around as if looking at her was just an accident. This happened about 3 times.

-When I cut my hair, (it was really long, like metal long because I am metal and i was in a band and I got kind of an emo hair cut after) I think she waited til the teacher was near my desk to ask to go to the bathroom just so she could say something to me. I think this because after she left the room, she came back way too quick to have gone to the bathroom. So, I think she might have maybe waited outside of the class for a while just to make it seem like she went. Anyways, when she did walk up to ask the teacher to go to the bathroom she stopped by my desk and looked right at me and said "you cut your beautiful hair" and I was just like "Yeah. I know."

-I'm fairly sure she was checking me out or trying to look at me inconspiculously. This was the day after I had cut my hair. She walked up to get a calculator and was looking away from my direction at nothing as she walked by, as if she was trying hard to not look over in my direction and make it obvious. I get this feeling because i'm a loser and use the same kind of techniques to look at her and not seem obvious. Then when she was walking back to her desk, I stared blankly at the person in front of me's back so I could look at what she was doing out of the corner of my eye and she did this kind of pause and lean over like she was looking for something and then she kind of tilter her head in my direction so she could look at me.

Yes, I realize i'm over analyzing this and sound like a psycho but it's because I really like this girl. And like the rest of you since I started liking her I began lifting weights and taking care of myself and dressing better and all that.

Oh, and I have talked to her.

its THAT GUY

edit- follow up

Dave Mustard posted:

Yeah. I wish I had read the pick up artist stuff before I went on break. I was planning on asking her to the movies.

There is a dilemma though. She has a boyfriend. The thing is it's a long distance relationship. I think they see eachother once every 2 or 3 weeks, and to top it off the guy she is dating has nothing in common with her. So I don't see their relationship going anywhere but I also don't want to cause any drama or anything.

I think I might ask her anyways. If she knew I was interested I think she would get it over with and break it off with him.

Dave Mustard posted:

Well thanks. I need all the motivation I can get. I've been doing this cool loner thing for too long and my only strategy for getting girls to like me was ignore them and act like I didn't care about them until they were throwing themselves at me and all it got me were girls I actually didn't care for.

And I was completely frozen if the girl I liked didn't decide to make a pass at me at all.

Cheers to manning up.

And goddamn, after I talked to her the adrenaline I got had me rocking in my chair even after I was home. So I've gotta desensitize myself to her.

i did the "cool loner" thing but now i'm ready to be normal

Dave Mustard posted:

Yeah. You should definitely read the books. I don't know if I can post this but there is a website that lets you watch all the episodes of the Pick Up artist. I think the Vh1 site even hosts them so maybe it'll be okay, i'll wait for an okay before I do it though. You should watch those first because they show you the concepts visually and you can see them actually working and it's pretty amazing.

Before I took a look at it myself I would have just assumed it was just like any other get rich quick scheme except with women but it actually makes sense when you read it and they even get you some sort of explaination as to why it works.

And yeah, I understand getting stuck on the being introduced thing. I knew a friend of a friend of the girl I liked and tried to have her introduce me to her and she wouldn't because she knew she had a boyfriend. So I just kept hitting a rut and didn't know what to do besides just go and talk to her so I did that.

Dave Mustard posted:

is hugging a good sign of somebody being stuck in friend zone?

Besides this girl's long distance boyfriend, there is one other guy that I see hanging out with her little group that looks like he has a chance with her. They hug but she also hugs a lot of her lovable loser guyfriends daily.

Also, I kind of messed up because I didn't go to school on monday, and then when I went today she wasn't in class. This means I probably won't be getting around to the date thing this week.

But the good news is we got to pick new seats in Spanish class and this girl i've thought was pretty cute for a while now sat in front of me. She seems really shy and quiet even though she is very attractive and doesn't look like she would be. I think she may have low self esteem and be slow to trust people because i've never seen her with more than one close friend at a time and I doubt that she has a boyfriend. She fits the base requirements though, in that she's shorter than me, attractive, and I'm fairly sure she isn't the party type.

I guess i'll practice on her but she actually seems like a nice girl. On top of that, since I haven't built up some image in my head of her being the perfect girl, I can actually talk to her normally.

Dave Mustard posted:

I love girls. hahaha.

Alright, bad news and good news.

The girl I like ended up transferring out of my math class I guess. I think she dropped her last 2 classes so she could go home earlier since she has a job. Which sucks because now I can't talk to her in class and basically have no way of talking to her longer than a couple minutes since I don't have the same break or lunch periods as her.

The good news is that when I walk to my 5th period class, I end up crossing paths with her. Better than that, I was walking to 5th with my friends and I was just laughing at whatever we were talking about and I was smiling and I looked up and I saw her right there and she looked at me and smiled.

Except I didn't expect it so I didn't say hi or ask her if she transferred out or whatever so I hosed that up and my friends were like "what the gently caress, dude she was looking right at you she wanted you to say hi, jeez!" But I think i'm going to see her again on the way to 5th tomorrow. When I do see her i'm just going to be like hey did you transfer out, oh, now how am I gonna talk to you? and then she'll hopefully give me her number or something else.

Also, In general i'm being a more social person and it's working out great. I just started talking to everybody and actually getting involved in conversations and basically had everybody interested without even trying hard. I even got this hot preppy chick to start turning around in her seat to pay attention to me (I didn't even initiate any sort of conversation with her so I managed to actually interest her) and she started talking to me and asking me questions about stuff I didn't think she'd even remember me saying.

also what the gently caress is this

Vehementi posted:

Chat up lots of other girls with no aim then.

To reiterate what he said, there are numerous possibilities. One of them is that she says yes, and you live happily ever after. One of them is that she says no. Every decision ever has uncertain outcomes, and you weigh the options and what you believe the chances are.

Let's suppose it's unlikely that she likes you/will end up with you/etc. (let's say 5%), and likely that she will say no (say 95%).

What happens if she says yes? The payout is huge, say the "happiness equivalent" of $10,000. (Obviously I'm talking about the concept of utility here, but let's keep it simple.)

What happens if she says no? Nothing. This is important: the value is zero, not negative.

So if you were to perform this experiment a lot of times, you would expect (5% * $10,000) + (95% * $0) = $500 on average. It makes no sense to not take advantage of this opportunity.

Let's change the situation. Suppose she were dating a huge jealous rear end in a top hat, and if she said, "No," to you, she would also tell her boyfriend and he would kick your rear end and break your leg, for a "happiness equivalent" of $-10,000 (i.e. you would basically rather pay $10,000 for this outcome to not happen).

Now we have 5% * $10,000 + 95% * $-10,000 = $-9,000. If you kept doing this, on average you'd lose the "happiness equivalent" of $9,000, so doing this would be retarded.

But is some guy going to come and break your legs and ruin your life? No. If she says, "No," nothing happens to you.

Binowru posted:

I've never really read W&W because everything I hear makes it sound like it's supposed to give goon shut-ins common sense advice that normal people figure out on their own (for example, girls don't like shirts with WACKY sayings on them), as opposed to, I dunno, being a forum about exercise and diet tips. Is there anything in W&W that might provide contrary evidence?

W&W basically has two halves that never post in each other's threads. One of these deals with weightlifting and diet and poo poo, which is great if you want that, and pretty unremarkable otherwise.

The other half is full of creepy shut-ins with bad hair and skinny jeans. That's the half that can usually be directly cross-posted to helldump.

Dave Mustard posted:

Some guy said that he got a vasectomy and he beat off (this being his first sexual action after the surgery) and when he came he said there was some dry bloody pulpy stuff that came out with it and it was gross. So uhh, I wouldn't want to put that in my woman.

Dave Mustard posted:

Highs
-Fell in love with a girl that wasn't just extremely pretty but also has the same hobbies as me and good taste in music and has morals. And I finally talked to her.
-Cut my hair that was past my shoulders (i'm a guy, I was in a band so that's why.) and for the first time in my life I liked my hair cut and got tons of compliments on it and girls started checking me out and blushing when I looked at them and I was like B)
-Found a lot of good music and bands after being in a slump where I listened to the same stuff over and over and was just sick of it all.
-I started working out and taking better care of myself (brushing my teeth 3 times a day and using mouthwash twice a day and daily showering)
-I got a lot better at bass and I started drawing regularly and improved significantly. One of my drawings is going to be in the yearbook.

Lows
-My sister moved out for college.
-I found out that the girl I'm in love with has a boyfriend and I probably could have got her if I had just talked to her that day she complimented me instead of being the loser that I am and waiting for her. I got pretty depressed when I thought about her all the time and couldn't think about anything else.
-I feel like i'm growing distant from some of my friends.
-Found out a lot of my old friends had become potheads and their whole lives revolve around going to parties now.
-My dad shaved his mustache and I've never seen him without a mustache because he's had one since before I was born. Plus his mustache was so thick that I couldn't even imagine what he looked like without one. Needless to say it was disturbing to see him and I didn't recognize him at all.

Dave Mustard posted:

I like my women to be smaller and weaker than me because I could never love somebody that could surprise sex me or beat me.

Dave Mustard posted:

God, this thread made me cry like a bitch last night. I miss my sister. I don't think i've cried in years.

Binowru posted:

I've never really read W&W because everything I hear makes it sound like it's supposed to give goon shut-ins common sense advice that normal people figure out on their own (for example, girls don't like shirts with WACKY sayings on them), as opposed to, I dunno, being a forum about exercise and diet tips. Is there anything in W&W that might provide contrary evidence?

Warszawa posted:

one time i read the mystery method front to back in one night and then i went out for coffee and a dude came up and said "nice hair color... is it real?" and lowered his shades at me.

so i said "are you for loving real man" and got up and walked away and the motherfucker followed me through a room through a door down a hallway through another door outside and 40 feet to my car askin me if we went to a movie tonight would i want to see knocked up or superbad.

Dave Mustard posted:

Lows

-My dad shaved his mustache and I've never seen him without a mustache because he's had one since before I was born. Plus his mustache was so thick that I couldn't even imagine what he looked like without one. Needless to say it was disturbing to see him and I didn't recognize him at all.

Dave Mustard posted:

The one girl i've fell in love with in 4 years has a boyfriend who is in college, and I can't find a situation or way to start talking to her and I don't know if I should or if I should just wait until they break up. I can't see her cheating on her boyfriend and I don't want to become a guyfriend... but she graduates this year and I don't want to never have had the chance. I have no idea what to do and just not having her is making me depressed.

I’m just trying to change my life because I’m not above killing any drug dealer for money.

Let's suppose it's unlikely that she likes you/will end up with you/etc. (let's say 5%), and likely that she will say no (say 95%).

What happens if she says yes? The payout is huge, say the "happiness equivalent" of $10,000. (Obviously I'm talking about the concept of utility here, but let's keep it simple.)

What happens if she says no? Nothing. This is important: the value is zero, not negative.

So if you were to perform this experiment a lot of times, you would expect (5% * $10,000) + (95% * $0) = $500 on average. It makes no sense to not take advantage of this opportunity.

Let's change the situation. Suppose she were dating a huge jealous rear end in a top hat, and if she said, "No," to you, she would also tell her boyfriend and he would kick your rear end and break your leg, for a "happiness equivalent" of $-10,000 (i.e. you would basically rather pay $10,000 for this outcome to not happen).

Now we have 5% * $10,000 + 95% * $-10,000 = $-9,000. If you kept doing this, on average you'd lose the "happiness equivalent" of $9,000, so doing this would be retarded.

wow it takes a math nerd to compare dating to telemarketing theory might as well wait until they make dating robots poindexter so you can find someone with your unique world view

cant wait until this guy prints out blowjob_frequency_2.xls and it gets back to his ex-girlfriend

Shryke posted:

After reading this thread, I read a fair amount of the literature recommended in the OP, and now I'm really looking forward to getting out again, when everyone gets back to uni.

What I took from the stuff I read, is that there's no point in being the nice guy. I'm a decent looking bloke, but I've always been crap with girls. I never broke through the 'how are you? my name's x, the weather's nice today etc" barrier, and I think that's my big problem. Now that I think back to how boring I am when I go out, I realise that no-one's interested in just another 'average' person - they're everywhere after all. I've got the charisma, heck, I'm a singer in a band that's played some good sized shows. I always just stuck to the most boring conversation topics with girls, instead of trying to sell myself as the interesting, charismatic individual I can be.

That's all I have to say on the subject, I suppose. I don't think the 'pick up artists' are doing anything to take advantage of women, to any extent at all. It's more about showing men how stupid, and boring they can look, and suggesting ideas to improve upon the problem.

maybe wear pants that fit

maybe tell better stories

Shryke posted:

My friend Jim's Dad died. Jim lives in a loft. At the wake, one of my other friends got a pair of Jim's boxers, put them out of the window onto the roof, pissed on them, and then put them back in Jim's drawer. Luckily, we're all good friends and everyone just found it hilarious. It was a bit of a wtf moment though.

maybe stop being so depressing

Shryke posted:

I'm depressed right now. I think I'm actually suffering from depression, but I don't want to see a doctor about it.

Basically, I'm incredibly picky about what girls I like. I can't help it, I just find hardly anyone attractive (in looks and personality.) I'm a 19 year old university student, so you'd think I would easily find someone out of tons of people, but I haven't. Well, I say I haven't, I met one girl and I really fell for her. Because it's so rare that I find someone who I like, I naturally fall for them pretty quickly. We became good friends, and sometimes she'd become reasonably close to me etc. She recently told me that we'll never be anything but friends. I told her yesterday that I can't see her again until I get over her, because everytime I see her, it makes me fall for her more. She's really upset over this, because she really likes seeing me - I just wish she wasn't so very sure that we'd never be more than friends, so at least I'd be able to try to change things.

So what do I do now goons? I don't like going out and meeting people in places like the student union, because the music is terrible, and loud, and I find that 99% of the people there are people who enjoy that kind of atmosphere. Those generally aren't people who I find myself compatible with. Whenever I meet someone, it seems to be through some random encounter somewhere, so now I just kind of feel like I have to wake up every day and hope that something works out, and there's nothing I can do to help myself.

Oh, and I ran out of bacon and it's breakfast time

maybe get better hobbies

Shryke posted:

I love posting in this thread!

I'm a level 21 alliance human paladin, but I'm getting kind of bored of my surroundings. The furthest afield I've been is around Ironforge (Loch Modan etc.) Can anyone recommend anywhere that I should visit, and tell me roughly how to get there?

maybe don't defend the zelda wedding

Shryke posted:

I don't see why so many people are getting so worked up about someone else's choice of wedding. They did what they wanted to do, and it was their decision, what has it got to do with you? Seriously, piss off.

Edit: And while you're at it, stop trying to tell her how to live her life, why should she listen to what you think?

maybe make better music

Shryke posted:

We were pretty poo poo, as our drummer and our guitarist weren't very good. I split up the band and started a new one, with much better musicians, but a similar style. I was wondering what kind of interest there is from record labels for bands that don't really fit into something that's popular with a lot of people.