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[VS] For Training: If You Want It, Share Your Goals

We're trying to get some training together so I'd like an idea of what sort of program we should create first. If you have some interest in some tutoring, please let us know what exactly you're looking for. Examples would be basic FPS mechanics, PS2 mechanics and UI, squad/platoon play, certification suggestions, class-specific guides, ground vehicles, air vehicles, driving off of cliffs and dying in a fire with everyone in your squad screaming, Sunderer deployment/destroyment, specific base assault/defense tactics and layout, etc. We have members who excel in all of these things and are willing to help. Please post what you're looking for!

PS: Terrible 'shop, but this can be a Silly Mondays on steroids. No need to be too serious, just share experience and pointers. Especially people with experience from more structured games, like BF and tournaments, ArmA2, NS2 etc. What works and how it can be transferred into this game.

I don't consider myself good enough ant anything specific to do any sort of training, but I would like to see some sort of flight training.
I've been flying my scythe more and more since investing in the radar, and although I'm getting good enough to score some ground kills, I suck at dog fighting. If anyone could show us a few tricks I'd certainly appreciate it!

Something I'd like to see would be a platoon of liberators with zephyrs and daltons just carpet bombing, it might not be efficient but the shock and awe would be epic to watch! I know for the most part we're not a flying platoon, so maybe it'd be something for a silly Monday?

I don't consider myself good enough ant anything specific to do any sort of training, but I would like to see some sort of flight training.
I've been flying my scythe more and more since investing in the radar, and although I'm getting good enough to score some ground kills, I suck at dog fighting. If anyone could show us a few tricks I'd certainly appreciate it!

Something I'd like to see would be a platoon of liberators with zephyrs and daltons just carpet bombing, it might not be efficient but the shock and awe would be epic to watch! I know for the most part we're not a flying platoon, so maybe it'd be something for a silly Monday?

Me and a couple others have been talking about doing an ESF 101 thing for quite some time now. Haven't really had time to get down to it as of yet, but it's coming.

Don't know how long you've been on Darkweeble, but there have been a couple of training sessions. One rather improvised and two that were at least announced beforehand. These are hr ones I know of at least. It's been about squad tactics and infantry squad leadership. Our problem right now is that this did not become the regular thing it was meant to be, so thanks for pushing this. What we really need is someone to make sure that this becomes a regularly scheduled event. Not losing the training sessions themselves but finding people to do and making sure it gets done.

Would you want to be that someone? This thread is just the right kind if initiative (although I think there may be an older one, somewhere, lying dreaming beneath the waves).

The primary need right now are basic PS2 fighting. Positioning, movement, cover, working together... I have found that my skills in Q3 have not transfered...

I quite concur with Cooper here. What most of us need is to cover those basis in order get on the right foot, and not only help by being shot at instead of the actually-doing-something-useful-guy next to us.
Basically, I think that commentated squadplay would be great as training and would help a lot of the new players and has-not-played-a-fps-for-real-since-Unreal-Tournament-the-first players to get into the play style required.

I said I'd like training - so a couple of thoughts about what would be useful:

- Vehicles. My vehicle skills are literally non-existent, as I have spent less than three minutes as pilot/driver. I don't know what vehicles I would like training on; pick something that would be useful!

- Infantry. I think most people are ok with the very basics of infantry combat in terms of shooting and moving, but anything particularly unique to PS2 would of course be helpful.

Role-specific tips and hints would be welcome in terms of positioning relative to both the terrain and the team, and in terms of specific duties in assault or defence. I'm not sure how much teamwork training is possible without beginning to further define tactics and responsibilities within each squad, which I think is something we're avoiding in order to stay more welcoming and open?

I think the biggest thing for me would be a "guided tour" of some of the larger facilities on the maps, and suggestions as to the best way to assault and defend them. The couple of times I have been involved in fights in or around them I've ended up lost, confused and split up from my squad.

Thanks to those willing to invest time and energy in sorting out training!

Infantry Training

I'd be willing (with Mr Eclectic and whom ever else has been shouting about it) to do some very rapid 10 minute squad based "Fire and Manoeuvre" stuff, but that is really squad/platoon level tactics, individually again it's hard to train "Follow my leader" and "work as a group" without it being lame - SLs can say "stick together", "go in as a group", "cover the doors" until we are blue in the face but when we are on the ground fighting there is always a larger objective which we need to accomplish so any form of training gets rolled into the actual fighting 'banter/chatter' and we don't have set units to do 'drills' with.

So perhaps the best thing is just a short sharp 10 minute, talk and walk at some facility behind the lines and then get onto the ground and fight with "commentary" on going?

Further to that perhaps some "So you're an Engineer -this is what RPS expects of you" kind of sessions might be more useful than twitch?

We took a look at the "Standard Air Tower" in some depth and have never really used the drill we planned ever again. But I did think that the time going over the ground just finding the doors and windows and so on helped some people (including me with Dewi and and the boys earlier on!). So perhaps a walk round some of the larger bases isn't a crazy idea?

If everyone knows the layout, what each class ought to be doing in various general situations and a bit of squad based teamwork then it should all gel up. I'm keen to avoid the hour long debate session we had at the air tower training where everyone got a bit bored and started smoke bombing everything. Lets just do very short "train-letts" and then play!

And here is the Grible thought for the day! We have a ready made OPFOR - the Traitors in RTRS - could we perhaps meet up away from the main front and do some fighting/training? Actually I don't know how that would work. Forget it.

tl;dr - Very quick sessions, 10 mins no more, on Squad Cohesion. Class based "objective" bullet points. A look at a each facility.

I'm not sure how much teamwork training is possible without beginning to further define tactics and responsibilities within each squad, which I think is something we're avoiding in order to stay more welcoming and open?

We've got quite a wide spectrum of players in the outfit now, especially after the smashing success of the last Call to Arms. on one end we have the new people (welcome!) who need to get familiar with the basics of Planetside 2, such as its FPS mechanics, class tips, base layouts etc. On the other end of the spectrum are those of us who've been playing every week since well back in beta. We still have stuff to work on, but they are different things, stuff like squad cohesion, leadership, squad-interplay and tactics etc.

I would suggest we make sure there is training available for both groups somehow. We need to ensure that the vet don't get bored and leave, so we need to be able to step up our game, without leaving new players behind. But this is another discussion really.

So, to be concrete, I'd suggest that we make two tracks of training, and let players take part in whatever they think will give them the most or interests them the most.

One track is "skills training" or "solo training", where someone experienced with something helps those less experienced with one specific topic related to mechanics, vehicles, classes or so.
Example topics:

Being a better medic

Using the Lightning tank

Flying a Galaxy

Base layouts

Basics of Planetside 2

Using cover and choosing your fights

(All of these would be good to run, by the way!)

The other track is "group training", where we focus on the interplay between players; squad tactics (in squad), squad coordination (between squads) and strategy/PLing.
Example topics:

I'm not sure if it would be wise to run these side-by-side (might be), but maybe sequentially, 45-60 minutes of skills training followed by the same amount of group training, and then off into the wild to practice?

Edit: Grible's idea about keeping things short is probably good, so that people don't lose interest and drift off. 10-25 minutes seems like a good target.

I'd love to see some flying training. Both general handling but also for specific planes. I think we'd benefit from an air squad who can help establish air dominance, cover advances and also function as "eyes in the sky".

"Time is a companion, travelling with us on the journey of life, to remind us to cherish each moment as it will never come again. What we leave behind is not as important as how we lived."

Air squads are an excellent idea, and one which has been trialled before. We could certainly use one, and we need to combine flight practice with some kind of training on how to utilise it properly. The problem before has been a lack of ground support. Air is terribly vulnerable to infantry AA (Burster MAXes and lock-on launchers) and need ground support to focus on taking these out. Air needs friendly tanks and heavy infantry to take out enemy AA, and tanks need friendly air to take out enemy tanks and heavy infantry. Practicing this kind of coordination would be very good of us on Indar or Esamir, especially.

Hm, ok. Since this is my first FPS, but I seem to have progressed a bit from the total noob stage to not sucking so much, perhaps I can teach even some of the basics.

I agree with the previous suggestions, and I'd like to add this one:
-This is my weapon, this is my gun: Just a short session in the VR, where people shoot down the range with the patterned targets. Just so that they observe the effect of the various stances and movement speeds on the size of their reticule, and the bullet spread pattern. Understanding that is just a brief 5-15 minutes, and is essential.

The curriculum should be:

Infantry basics:

Shooting

Orientation. Spotting and calling out targets

Cover

Unit cohesion. Covering each other and sticking together. Single column and skirmish line. Avoiding obstructing each other's firing lines.

Taking ground (do it like Ridebird). Flanking. Enfilading fire

Room/small building assault and defence

Use of classes/kits.

Squad and platoon coordination

The highest DPS weapon system in the game: the Sunderer. Usage, transport, deployment. Fallback and forward spawns

Staggered approach/leapfrogging

Overwatch, bound overwatch

Scouting

Advanced squad and platoon coordination

Armour warfare. Coordination with infantry (armour cannot survive anymore without the support of infantry)

Combat Air Patrol/ Close Air Support. Securing airspace with combination of ESFs and a AA squad. Calling in CAS

Having mastered the infantry basics, I don't think that a giraffe has to follow the rest. Of course, everyone is welcome and IMHO should. But just with the basics a giraffe can still follow effectively the directions, orders and suggestions of SLs/PLs, and finally overcome the steep learning curve of the game and enjoy it. SLs and PLs though should know their stuff. Even if they have a very particular style. Having a common understanding of the game and metagame, leaders can coordinate better and appreciate a novel approach.

As I've been repeatedly stating, I am a total noob at FPS games. But I enjoy, and thus study this game a lot, even too much. I think that me coordinating with an experienced FPS gamer would be the best setup to get this thing going. Preferably someone with experience from ArmA2 and/or BF or other 64v64/32v32 tournaments. To me a lot of these things are new, so trivial things may seem fascinating, or I may have the tendency to reinvent the wheel, and end up with an odd oval-shaped thingy.

Suggested day is Sunday, starting this Sunday with the infantry basics. Perhaps another day for squad and platoon coordination classes? Infantry basics are suggested for all, squad and platoon coordination for SLs and PLs.

By the by, a lot of the proposed leadership classes could be held as discussions, as Ridebird did when we gathered and discussed leadership, and the information and lessons we get from those could disseminate throughout the outfit through actual play. SLs/PLs hold a short seminar on a particular aspect among themselves, and, when applying the lessons to a particular tactical or operational situation, give a short explanation to their squad and platoon.

- Basic weapon choice and certs. Planetside 2 is a game of specialisation, there is no overall 'best' weapon, just the best for a certain situation. This is sort of the same for vehicles but there are definitely some outright upgrades. For me, specialising is one of my favourite aspects of the game and it is definitely an important one.

- Vehicle usage. How to use them all, when to use them, when they will be effective. Stuff like, if you're riding out in a mag column, bring a skyguard or two. Also, libs are awesome and rain death from the skies.

- Squad movement. I think this is definitely something you can train. A quick tutorial one best practices followed by going somewhere specifically to fight and drill what you've learned. Having superior numbers is nothing if you all run in one at a time and don't support each other.

- Basic weapon choice and certs. Planetside 2 is a game of specialisation, there is no overall 'best' weapon, just the best for a certain situation. This is sort of the same for vehicles but there are definitely some outright upgrades. For me, specialising is one of my favourite aspects of the game and it is definitely an important one.

I considered asking for this, but felt that it might be more useful written down? It's not something that necessarily needs to be explained in game, I don't think. Also, it's such a common issue for new players it would be nice to have a resource to go to rather than waiting for a training session.

I know we have a Weapon Appreciation Society, but how about a Guide to Certing and Weapon Choice? Any volunteers?

I may be wrong - perhaps an in game discussion where people can ask questions and share opinions would be better.

I don't think it was effective at all though Eclectic. No one wanted to lead still and those that did changed very little in their leadership. Such a thing should be led by someone else that is better at it then me, and it should be done in a different way.

-snip-
Having mastered the infantry basics, I don't think that a giraffe has to follow the rest...Infantry basics are suggested for all, squad and platoon coordination for SLs and PLs.

The one point I'd make, MrEclectic, is that a basic knowledge of some of those elements that are "operational and strategic" should, I think, also be part of infantry basics. I think a general awareness of how/where we assault towers and facilities is a necessity.

I suspect, of course, that you were mindful of this, but I just wanted to raise it as a seperate point.

Unit cohesion. Covering each other and sticking together. Single column and skirmish line. Avoiding obstructing each other's firing lines.

Taking ground (do it like Ridebird). Flanking. Enfilading fire

Room/small building assault and defence

Use of classes/kits.

Originally Posted by GinSoakedBoy

I have a few ideas to add:
- Squad movement. I think this is definitely something you can train. A quick tutorial one best practices followed by going somewhere specifically to fight and drill what you've learned. Having superior numbers is nothing if you all run in one at a time and don't support each other.

Originally Posted by EsotericReverie

We still have stuff to work on, but they are different things, stuff like squad cohesion, leadership, squad-interplay and tactics etc.

One track is "skills training" or "solo training", where someone experienced with something helps those less experienced with one specific topic related to mechanics, vehicles, classes or so.

Edit: Grible's idea about keeping things short is probably good, so that people don't lose interest and drift off. 10-25 minutes seems like a good target.

Originally Posted by Grible

It's hard to "train" FPS twitch skills - without it becoming really boring.
So perhaps the best thing is just a short sharp 10 minute, talk and walk at some facility behind the lines and then get onto the ground and fight with "commentary" on going?

Further to that perhaps some "So you're an Engineer -this is what RPS expects of you" kind of sessions might be more useful than twitch?

Ok So we all loosely agree on a basic "RPS Giraffe Hoof Camp".

I suggest as follows.
15 Minutes at the very most of talking (To be conducted in a group of <=24, with only at most two "talkers") to cover:-

Orientation of your Map.

Radar

Directions

Understanding Locations.

Spotting and calling out targets.

Unit cohesion.

Covering each other and sticking together.

Single column and skirmish line.

Avoiding obstructing each other's firing lines.

Enfilading fire and Covering/Suppression fire

Use of Cover.

Taking ground

Aggression.

Flanking.

Staggered Advance/Bounding/Overwatch

Smoke/ other special tactics

15 Minutes to run some drills.(Conducted in the squad play setup with RO/SLs)

Forming up/Playing "Tag" with your leader

Bounding/Overwatch by half squads or squad.

Flanking by half squads or squad

Timing Building Entry by squad

Then Get out into the game and try it!

I am happy to lead a part or all of a session based on the above. I imagine Eso,Eclectic,Gin will be too? Shall we say next Sunday (22nd) evening? Or sooner?

The first bit in talking is more valid for new players to PS2 than the rest, which is applicable to everyone.