Initial Range Reports/low round count range reports.

This is a discussion on Initial Range Reports/low round count range reports. within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; People.
Would you pronounce your new car flawless when you haven't even had it long enough to need an oil change?
Would you get married ...

Initial Range Reports/low round count range reports.

Would you pronounce your new car flawless when you haven't even had it long enough to need an oil change?

Would you get married to someone after the first date?

No?

Well why the hell do I keep reading how flawless people guns are when they have barely shot the, let alone carried them, practiced with them or learned how to use them for their intended use?

I'll tell you why - because people have an absurd emotional investment in their new gun, and somehow need to convince...someone (themselves or others) they have picked up the greatest handgun on the planet.

Your gun is not flawless because you shot it 10, 100 or 1,000 times without a failure, problem or other assorted issue.

You gun is merely new, and for the most part, has not even reached the point at which it needs a new recoil spring, lube or cleaning.

Issues at low round counts DO mean problems...

However, no issues at low round counts only mean problems haven't had time to develop yet.

A modern pistol with 1K rounds through it is still effectively a new gun.

To determine if your weapon is actually the uber-death-blaster you really believe it is, you have to shoot it, and shoot it hard.

A modern pistol with 1K rounds through it is still effectively a new gun

Maybe a new gun that had a thousand rounds down the pipe over a few months..... But, not a new gun that had a thousand rounds run down the pipe in one or two sittings....

IMO, a weapon doesn't need to run for hours and run round after round after round to be considered trustworthy.. I mean dang man.. It's a man made object, at some point it's gonna give up the ghost just like everything else man-made. It's my contention that if you get a new auto, run three or four hundred rounds down range with it and then check it over well during cleaning and then strap it on and use it like it was meant to be used. Or, get a revolver and shoot fifty rounds to get used to the trigger and point of aim/impact and call it a day. Either way, IMO, if you can get a auto to function three or four hundred times and at a steady pace without fail, you gotta a keeper...

I guess I get the point you are trying to make...I think. But often initial range reports where the handgun functions flawlessly with say 100-200 rounds do happen rather frequently, and most people I think are just reporting what they experienced at this one initial range session, not necessarily declaring that the gun is therefore perfect and will never have any failures of any kind ever in its service life because of this one first experience. Who was it that said believe half of what you see and none of what you hear?

The OP makes a valid argument, but as gottabkiddin said, many folks simply want to show off there new gun, and there's nothing wrong with that. I've always found with my semi-auto's that they either work or they don't, and they can always simply stop working too. There is no telling when an extractor will break, or when you're gun will encounter it's first failure, but they eventually happen and it's alright. Just the other day my G19 had a FTE, it was momentarily shocking, but then instincts kicked in and I cleared it and kept on shooting for another couple hundred rounds without hiccup.

Would you pronounce your new car flawless when you haven't even had it long enough to need an oil change?

Would you get married to someone after the first date?

No?

Well why the hell do I keep reading how flawless people guns are when they have barely shot the, let alone carried them, practiced with them or learned how to use them for their intended use?

I'll tell you why - because people have an absurd emotional investment in their new gun, and somehow need to convince...someone (themselves or others) they have picked up the greatest handgun on the planet.

Your gun is not flawless because you shot it 10, 100 or 1,000 times without a failure, problem or other assorted issue.

You gun is merely new, and for the most part, has not even reached the point at which it needs a new recoil spring, lube or cleaning.

Issues at low round counts DO mean problems...

However, no issues at low round counts only mean problems haven't had time to develop yet.

A modern pistol with 1K rounds through it is still effectively a new gun.

To determine if your weapon is actually the uber-death-blaster you really believe it is, you have to shoot it, and shoot it hard.

Don't baby it, use it!

If you are willing to do the work...Then brag on your iron.

Till then...you may as well be marrying someone you don't even know.

So, at exactly how many rounds or how much time do you deem it trustworthy ? And if it is mechanical, it is going to have a problem at some point, so is there a thing as shooting a problem into your gun ? how do you determine when one is broke in, or determine when it is gettin ready to break ? I know what I do, and that works for me but i will not bash another mans gun , especially if all i can tell you about it is what I have heard.... but does the mfgr say, after 10,000 rounds this gun is broke in, just curiious, how many rounds do you have to put through one to consider it trustworthy....

So at what point or round count would you consider that a pistol is done with break-in and reliable ?? FYI I have over 4000+ problem free rounds through my Taurus PT709, could I consider it reliable and if not at what point would you recommend ?? Thanks for any info. God Bless

I see where you are coming from, however I do like hearing about "range reports" on new guns.. no matter how many rounds are through them. I want to know what people are experiencing during their break in period if I am interested in a similar model. I do agree that vetting a new gun for 100 rounds and calling it good to go, is bit premature.

My Colt will have a bobble here and there. I don't consider it a big deal. As a matter of fact, if my chosen carry round cycles thru the gun with 2 or 3 full magazines without issue, I consider it good to go.

I own both guns stated in above post, I have to say I have a sigma it broke a firing pin (square) like the Glock at a unknown round count, As I bought it used.

Sent gun in, They put new slide & barrel on and went through the whole gun. When I got it back I ran the snot out of it, got close to 7-8 K rouns through it with NO problems.

Bought a S&W M&P 9c shot it put it through the ringer & NO problems, Both are good guns, But I CC my 9c 90% of times.
The Sigma with a longer trigger pul has mad me shoot all autos better, Though I started out with a revolver help JMO ; )
H/D

"To my mind it is wholly irresponsible to go into the world incapable of preventing violence, injury, crime, and death. How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic." Ted Nugent

What exactly don't you like about them? The fact that I listed the failures by round count, or the fact that after I cleaned it up and reran the gun it ran good depending on the ammo with the TCP. Or the fact that the PF9 didn't have any malfunctions right out of the box?

Is it ok, to post failures on the initial range sessions but not runs that don't have failures.

Just what do you need to learn about a particular gun or its intended purpose? Does my XD45 Service model have a different purpose than my 24/7, SP101, or the TCP for that matter. Do we not know how to use them for their intended purpose until we have actually used it in a self defense situation? You will have to explain that portion of the post a bit more I guess.

I don't really understand the issue. When I spend time on Jeep forums, folks are looking for answers to problems they are having getting X to work right, or want to know how to put on such and such part. However, there are a lot of posts where people report what took place when they went offroading. Posts like "I installed X brand locker and wow what a difference" because the locker let them climb a hill they previously could not climb. Or they went to a new offroad park or tried a specific trail they had never tried and reported what they thought of it, or how their rig did.

For folks that are doing research on which gun to buy or what other people thought of a particular gun when they got it, these thread that you find annoying might be very helpful in their research. Maybe the mods will start a section in the forum where we can post only failures and the approximate round count of the particular gun when the particular failure occured. Would this be more to your liking? I think it would probably be a low posting thread area though. Now if I could post all of the failures of other peoples guns during my classes, that would keep at least me busy.

Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.www.ddchl.com
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