Riding as a Passenger and the Driver Pulls Over to Stop a Fight

This is a discussion on Riding as a Passenger and the Driver Pulls Over to Stop a Fight within the Carry & Defensive Scenarios forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; This is based somewhat on an actual event I was involved in some time ago.
Say you're on vacation to visit family. You, your wife, ...

Riding as a Passenger and the Driver Pulls Over to Stop a Fight

This is based somewhat on an actual event I was involved in some time ago.

Say you're on vacation to visit family. You, your wife, and your child are riding in the back of a vehicle and your two relatives are riding up front.

One of your relatives spots two vehicles (lets say a blue truck and a white truck) in a vacant lot. You see the driver of the white truck assaulting the driver of the blue truck, who is still seated in the truck with the window down.

Now the driver of your vehicle without saying anything runs up on the situation, stops, and starts yelling that they are going to call the police while your other relative jumps out of the car and get himself involved in the situation.

What would you do?

Alternate situation.

Lets say you feel the need to get out of the vehicle as well for whatever reason. For example your relative that got out was elderly or disabled or just very unlikely to win a fight.

You are armed and When you get out you notice the person doing the assaulting running back to their vehicle, and is almost at the door, that is within a relatively close proximity with a seriously pissed off look on their face.

Do you draw on the man in case he is going back to his truck for a gun or weapon? or do you just let him go while trying to get your relatives back in your own vehicle and get out of there?

This is based somewhat on an actual event I was involved in some time ago.

Say you're on vacation to visit family. You, your wife, and your child are riding in the back of a vehicle and your two relatives are riding up front.

One of your relatives spots two vehicles (lets say a blue truck and a white truck) in a vacant lot. You see the driver of the white truck assaulting the driver of the blue truck, who is still seated in the truck with the window down.

Now the driver of your vehicle without saying anything runs up on the situation, stops, and starts yelling that they are going to call the police while your other relative jumps out of the car and get himself involved in the situation.

What would you do?

Alternate situation.

Lets say you feel the need to get out of the vehicle as well for whatever reason. For example your relative that got out was elderly or disabled or just very unlikely to win a fight.

You are armed and When you get out you notice the person doing the assaulting running back to their vehicle, and is almost at the door, that is within a relatively close proximity with a seriously pissed off look on their face.

Do you draw on the man in case he is going back to his truck for a gun or weapon? or do you just let him go while trying to get your relatives back in your own vehicle and get out of there?

Keep in mind this all happens in the span of about a minute.

You seriously need to talk to a gun lawyer if you don't know whether or not you should draw down in this situation.

This is based somewhat on an actual event I was involved in some time ago.

Say you're on vacation to visit family. You, your wife, and your child are riding in the back of a vehicle and your two relatives are riding up front.

One of your relatives spots two vehicles (lets say a blue truck and a white truck) in a vacant lot. You see the driver of the white truck assaulting the driver of the blue truck, who is still seated in the truck with the window down.

Now the driver of your vehicle without saying anything runs up on the situation, stops, and starts yelling that they are going to call the police while your other relative jumps out of the car and get himself involved in the situation.

What would you do?

Alternate situation.

Lets say you feel the need to get out of the vehicle as well for whatever reason. For example your relative that got out was elderly or disabled or just very unlikely to win a fight.

You are armed and When you get out you notice the person doing the assaulting running back to their vehicle, and is almost at the door, that is within a relatively close proximity with a seriously pissed off look on their face.

Do you draw on the man in case he is going back to his truck for a gun or weapon? or do you just let him go while trying to get your relatives back in your own vehicle and get out of there?

Keep in mind this all happens in the span of about a minute.

I am a control freak, I always drive so, I can't imagine the scenario.

Maybe the relatives knew the person being attacked. I can't imagine making a full approach to a situation where there are two men without knowing one of them and being concerned with his well being.

I might yell from a distance to alert the perp he is being watched.

In this circumstance, you protect first your family in anyway necessary.

When this actually happened I was with my parents and they didn't know either one. I was less than thrilled about them running up on the situation because I didn't know them either. My father is the one that jumped out. I got out when he did and by the time I turned this pissed off little aggressor was about to open his truck door. This is one of those little towns where just about everyone keeps a gun in their truck, especially around hunting season. I had about a second to react so I pulled. Got my dad back in the car and we got out of there.

In hind sight pulling might not have been the best option but when running on an adrenaline dump and you've got less than a second to make a decision you are just moving in instinct.

I almost considered not carrying anymore after this because until you've pointed a gun at someone because they scare the hell out of you there is no way you could understand the feeling.

IMO, based on what happened, I think you did the right thing. If you felt threatened and feared for your life, you were justified in drawing your weapon. The fact that you did so before the other person had a chance to produce a gun possibly kept the situation from escalating further.

That being said, I would have a serious sit down with my parents the next day to try and help them understand why what they did was incredibly dangerous and dumb.

Did this meet the IDOL standard? It did not. Did it meet AOJ? It did not. If it doesn't meet IDOL or AOJ, you can't make a valid claim of self defense if you have to shoot someone. Simple assault is not a reason to use deadly force on someone, so without some disparity of force (and after your parents involved THEMSELVES in the incident, I think you'd be in big trouble if you had fired your gun. Gicven that, mine stays in the holster unless/until I feel the need to use it, keeping in mind that furtive movements constitute a danger. IE, he makes a sudden move for his belt as if drawing a gun (a furtive movement) he's likely to see mine. I might even draw the gun from the holster, fold my arms, and keep it hidden behind my bicep if things looked like they were going south, but no pointing and no brandishing until that point.

I'm going to do my level best to get mom and dad out of there before we hit that point. I may appeal to his (dads) base nature and say "Dad, I'm armed. I don't want to have to shoot this guy for attacking you. Let's get back in the car, watch, and call the police. I have his license number. Since we don't know anything about whats going on here, let's step back and do the smart thing, eh?" My dad would listen (he's smart that way).

Did this meet the IDOL standard? It did not. Did it meet AOJ? It did not. If it doesn't meet IDOL or AOJ, you can't make a valid claim of self defense if you have to shoot someone. Simple assault is not a reason to use deadly force on someone, so without some disparity of force (and after your parents involved THEMSELVES in the incident, I think you'd be in big trouble if you had fired your gun. Gicven that, mine stays in the holster unless/until I feel the need to use it, keeping in mind that furtive movements constitute a danger. IE, he makes a sudden move for his belt as if drawing a gun (a furtive movement) he's likely to see mine. I might even draw the gun from the holster, fold my arms, and keep it hidden behind my bicep if things looked like they were going south, but no pointing and no brandishing until that point.

I'm going to do my level best to get mom and dad out of there before we hit that point. I may appeal to his (dads) base nature and say "Dad, I'm armed. I don't want to have to shoot this guy for attacking you. Let's get back in the car, watch, and call the police. I have his license number. Since we don't know anything about whats going on here, let's step back and do the smart thing, eh?" My dad would listen (he's smart that way).

I totally agree. My parents knew I was armed. Not real sure why they stopped at all. There were too many unknowns. My finger never touched the trigger though. I just wanted us out of there before anything else.

My parents and I had a long argument after this and it has bugged me to the point I've picked at it second by second.

Dad probably thought he was doing a good deed and didn't consider the totality of the situation or the danger he put himself and everyone into. Give him some credit; he may have saved a life or severe injury.

Doing something unwise or unsafe isn't necessarily morally wrong.

Was he trying to show off to you and your family or is this the way he is?

If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
Andrew Jackson

When this actually happened I was with my parents and they didn't know either one. I was less than thrilled about them running up on the situation because I didn't know them either. My father is the one that jumped out. I got out when he did and by the time I turned this pissed off little aggressor was about to open his truck door. This is one of those little towns where just about everyone keeps a gun in their truck, especially around hunting season. I had about a second to react so I pulled. Got my dad back in the car and we got out of there.

IMO, you did fine. The result was that everyone survived. Maybe the guy was going to leave, maybe he was getting a gun. It is entirely possible that the aggressor felt out numbered. Your action was a defense act under a stressful situation.

IMO, most of your stress is due to not knowing if you are in the right. Remeber this: I would rather deal with a jury of twelve, than be carried by six. My guess is that if you were to eliminate the possible after affect legal issues from this scenario, you would not question yourself so harshly.

I almost considered not carrying anymore after this because until you've pointed a gun at someone because they scare the hell out of you there is no way you could understand the feeling.

True, but you have also seen how easily situations could occur. The bad situations in the world do not go away when you give up your gun. You are lucky that you have endured a stressful situation and everyone walked away. Don't beat yourself up.