Well I was frustrated all day not being able to read the interviews at work, went for a few drinks for a workmates farewell, am a bit tipsy as I write this, but still have my wits about me and have to offer a few observations... sorry if this stuff is all over the boards but couldnt be bothered (in my current state) finding the relevant thread to post in...

Anyway I just listened to the interviews and I guess it really changed my viewpoint a bit, funny how listening or watchign the interviews is so much more insightful than reading the text...

1) Why the hell didnt the reporters ask Justine about the whole hand raising incident?? Serena got asked about it (more on that later) but why didnt the journo's ask Justine???? Im curious as to what her answer would have been...

2) Serena Williams will definitely win Wimbledon - not often Im as sure as any result in tennis as I am of this after listening to Serena

3) What is it with the French Crowd?? I mean I think crowds have the right to like/dislike a player but once the french have taken a 'disliking' to you they cant wait for the opportunity to just be vicious....

4) Why was Oracene not as 'outspoken' against the Fench crowd as she was about the assuie crowds?? I mean she virtually accused most people in the crowd at Oz Open of racism, yet all she can say about the French crowd are they need to learn 'tennis etiqutte'? and the aussie crowd werent half as bad??

5) I feel sorry for Serena. Id really like her to open up more about ther pressure she is under and how she truley feels about the crowds rooting against her. No doubt Richard has instructed her not to let her weakness/vulnerable side show but I think on some level what she must feel is similar to how Martina nav must have flet in her day. Martina was always very open about how the pro evert crowds really hurt her feelings and that she took it personally (one of the reasons I cheered for her). I think at least on this occasion, Serena felt similar, I think the way Serena is usually very guarded with the media serves her purposes - not getting involved in silly 'bait' etc the media consantly throws at the women, but Im glad that in this interview she let her guard down and we got to see the vulnerable Serena.

I was captivated by the match, and Justine deserved to win, I was so happy to see Serena unequivocally acknowledge Justine played better and she deservered to win because she did.Serena served awfully which was a factor but Serena did get outplayed - Ive never seen Serena get spanked so comprehsnsively as that first set....

Justine played so well defensively, and this match showed that with unforced errors and forced errors, there really is a 'grey' are area, if Justine surprises Serena by getting one of Serena's big shots back with a good deep ball and Serena makes an error, I think the fact she made her play an extra shot can make it a 'focred error, but it would probably go down in the books as an unforced error...

I pity all of Serena's opponents at Wimbledon. She is a champion and Im sure she will regroup, get the serve in order and win Wimbledon.

Congratulations to Justine, first Jennifer in 2001, now Serena, she is the grand-slam spoiler!!!!

wongqks

Jun 6th, 2003, 11:52 AM

same here, Serena will win Wimbledon for sure, and Justine can only hope that she did not draw Serena on her side of the draw ;)

I think that your observatons are spot on. I would have liked Serena to play at 4-2 without that level of crowd interference.
I do hope that Serena opens up more but being black I also know that it often just makes the situation worse. I hope Serena and Venus both get first class counselling. I did not actually get to read Oracene's comments at the AO. Serena is very strong but human. Some of this must have sank beneath her skin. May God help her.

Monica_Rules

Jun 6th, 2003, 12:39 PM

Good to see someone even if they are a bit tipsy:o speaking some sense and talking about the whole incident so sensibly!

Experimentee

Jun 6th, 2003, 12:39 PM

I agree with that. Dont know why they didnt ask Justine about it. I think they were just trying to bait Serena.
I think Serena will win Wimbledon too, but she needs to stop feeling the pressure and choking. Shes got a great chance with Venus injured and not many other players are great grasscourters.

The Crow

Jun 6th, 2003, 12:41 PM

Yep, I too wonder why they didn't ask Justine about it. :confused: I really wanna know how she has seen the incident.

Experimentee

Jun 6th, 2003, 01:02 PM

Can someone post the interviews if they have them? When i go to the RG site they just have them on video, but i dont have real player.

I just want to point out that after each loss this year, Serena has made statements that the loss will simply make her come back stronger and more determined.... and basically insinuated that her loss only means trouble for her future opponents. But, this year we haven't seen her back up those statements.

I wondered this year how the pressure of defending so very much would wear on Serena's psyche. It is a completely different matter to defend points than it is to gain them. Serena is in that unenviable place that Carroll described in Through the Looking Glass. She has to run as hard as she can to stay in the same place.

I think Serena can win back the crowds but she has to do a little soul searching. As with all of us who have been involved in situations where we think we have been victimized, it is necessary to take an honest look inward and ask "how did I contribute to this situation? Is there something I can do differently? And if I can do something differently, is it what I should do?" I think that Serena and her mother are smart enough to know that simply blaming others never gets anyone anywhere.

She's a young woman and it's all part of the growth process and growing is usually painful. It's just that these young women have to do some of their growing in public.

moby

Jun 6th, 2003, 03:28 PM

I think the fact she made her play an extra shot can make it a 'focred error, but it would probably go down in the books as an unforced error...

actually any error in RG goes down as an unforced error.

I mean there was this point where Justine hit a hard low flat backhand DTL and serena was literally flailing after it, and yep, that was an UE from serena

jmp

Jun 6th, 2003, 03:39 PM

I agree with starr's post.

I strongly disagree with the sentiment that Serena should talk more about being black and the pressure she feels defending her titles and number one ranking. The loudest statement she can make is to continue to win. Longevity and superior results will give her credibility that a 21 year old who has just suffered consecutive defeats on her worst surface doesn't have at the moment.

In all honesty, anyone who was watching her clay court play this year knows she wasn't playing the game she was last year. Serena got her first warning at Charlottesville, then Rome. Ai gave her trouble before she even got to Amelie. Then she expended an incredible amount of mental capital dealing with Amelie and the crowd on Tuesday. Finally, Justine busted her butt to get her game, head, and body ready for her best surface. Serena simply didn't handle the pressure of this particular moment well. She compounded the incident with poor sportmanship at the net and crying in the interview given over an hour after the match had ended.

As I've intimated before, Serena doesn't have the luxury of being human in her work environment. There should be one or two adults who understand this fact of life. She has a strong support system and the resilience to weather this loss the same way so many of her opponents take their whoopings at her hands. This world is harsh. She's been blessed with the ability and opportunity not to be living a life of drudgery. The next time I see her, I hope she's talking crap and backing it up.

JonBcn

Jun 6th, 2003, 04:00 PM

Heres your answer as to Justine's response:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/tennis/french_open_2003/2969514.stm

Justine Henin-Hardenne has denied suggestions by Serena Williams that she cheated in their French Open semi-final.

"[Serena] saw me and she served. It was her decision to serve - I just tried to stay focused on the second serve.

"It's very important to concentrate on the positive things from the match and try to forget this kind of incident."

The Crow

Jun 6th, 2003, 04:13 PM

If Justine really believes this, I'm okay with it. Just a different viewpoint than mine.

Wenddy

Jun 6th, 2003, 04:19 PM

I hope I never see Venus cry after a loss. Serena cried after her loss to Venus in 2000 at Wimbledom so I'm not surprised at her crying here. She hates to lose. She's always been a sore loser. Just think back to before her string of wins in the last year. She's always been ill, or she beat herself, and the handshakes at the net was very quick. I'm sorry the croud boo her, but that did not make her lode.

jenglisbe

Jun 6th, 2003, 04:24 PM

While Justine's thoughts make logical sense (in a way), I think it's a shame. She knew Serena deserved a 1st serve, yet said nothing. Had Serena done that to Justine, I've no doubt Justine would have been upset.

CC

Jun 6th, 2003, 05:32 PM

"The chair umpire is there to deal with these kind of situations - I just tried to stay focused and to forget all the other things."

This is very disappointing. I thought principles and morals counted for something.

wongqks

Jun 6th, 2003, 05:41 PM

while it is wrong for Justine to do that. Do you guys realise that those players need to be 100% focus in all professional matches, it may well be a heat of the moment. This does not make it right, but to say that it is deplorable and immoral maybe is too much

treufreund

Jun 7th, 2003, 12:18 AM

there is nothing disappointing. it is very professional to leave it up to the chair ump because that is his job. juju DOES NOT KNOW why serena served or whether serena missed because she was distracted. WHAT JUJU KNOWS IS WHAT SHE SAID: she was not ready. server determines the PACE of the match BUT SERVER IS NOT TO SERVE until THE RECEIVER IS READY! Serena broke that rule and then wanted a second look. juju does not really know what was going on so she left it up to the appropriate person. juju just knows that she was not ready and that SERENA refused to wait for her. how is that right from Serena? Nobody has explained to me even once how come that is right!

CC

Jun 7th, 2003, 12:28 AM

there is nothing disappointing. it is very professional to leave it up to the chair ump because that is his job. juju DOES NOT KNOW why serena served or whether serena missed because she was distracted. WHAT JUJU KNOWS IS WHAT SHE SAID: she was not ready. server determines the PACE of the match BUT SERVER IS NOT TO SERVE until THE RECEIVER IS READY! Serena broke that rule and then wanted a second look. juju does not really know what was going on so she left it up to the appropriate person. juju just knows that she was not ready and that SERENA refused to wait for her. how is that right from Serena? Nobody has explained to me even once how come that is right!

Because you keep saying the same thing over and over, and clearly ignoring the fact. FACT: Serena did not SEE Justine's hand and still served. Justine's hand went up AT THE SAME TIME Serena tossed her ball to serve. I'm sure you can understand that it would be difficult to stop the serve motion once it's started.

Wongqks, I don't mean to say this means Justine lacks morals, it's just that sometimes it's heated, high intensity moments like these that really tests a person. Anyway, despite all that I will give her the benefit of the doubt and say she was just caught up and wasn't thinking clearly.

I think she played extremely well and hope that she wins the final.

Tarsius

Jun 7th, 2003, 12:45 AM

Unseen by Swedish umpire Stefan Fransson, Henin-Hardenne raised her hand to indicate she was not ready to receive and Williams then served into the net.
I thought the Umpire was Jorge Diaz of Portugal?

starr

Jun 7th, 2003, 12:53 AM

Yeah. And that is not the only mistake in that article. Serena won that game. The article says she lost it.

*JR*

Jun 7th, 2003, 01:17 AM

Looking at her form, reaching semis is not a problem for her ;)
You (unintentionally) raise an interesting question not involving future Juju - Serena matches. Will Juju now be seen by the others (maybe even starting with Kimmie) not as the little overachiever, but the tainted RG (finalist as of now)? Will some of her mystique be eroded like "OK, she's the best on a size adjusted basis, but, er, size does count"! (Or else imagine what Mandy might have won with HER game). Plus the whole "a classy girl with a normal life after a trying childhood" aura may wane, and the opponents may get into her head, as several have made a habit of with Jen. ("Just" a possibility, of course).

VSFan1 aka Joshua L.

Jun 7th, 2003, 01:31 AM

there is nothing disappointing. it is very professional to leave it up to the chair ump because that is his job. juju DOES NOT KNOW why serena served or whether serena missed because she was distracted. WHAT JUJU KNOWS IS WHAT SHE SAID: she was not ready. server determines the PACE of the match BUT SERVER IS NOT TO SERVE until THE RECEIVER IS READY! Serena broke that rule and then wanted a second look. juju does not really know what was going on so she left it up to the appropriate person. juju just knows that she was not ready and that SERENA refused to wait for her. how is that right from Serena? Nobody has explained to me even once how come that is right!
LOL....everytime I see you post these days, it's as if you are on a crusade to defend people who did not appreciate the handraising from Justine.

Serena's loss hints a number of things,really. One of them is that she's not dominant anymore.

A casual tennis spectator could also derive an impression that a small petite girl like Justine can defeat a stocky, muscled Serena.

King Lindsay

Jun 7th, 2003, 03:04 AM

Serena's loss hints a number of things,really. One of them is that she's not dominant anymore.

i think you'll live to eat those words.

jenglisbe

Jun 7th, 2003, 03:34 AM

treufreund - Justine knows she motioned to stop play, and she should have copped up to that at the time. Period. That is all that matters, and no other extraneous details need to brought in. The rule is simple - the returner motioning to delay play results in the point not starting - and thus Serena should have gotten a 1st serve.

starr - No, Serena lost the game. That incident happened at 4-2 with Serena serving. Justine then won the next 3 games...