I really hate to heat things up here but discussions about functionality easily become "academic" in a way that they are theoretical. If functionality would be the main reason why people are choosing stuff we would've used Betamax, not VHS, Ambisonics, not Dolby Surround, SACDs instead of CDs or MiniDisc instead of crappy MP3s (at least in the early 00's). So why didn't they succeed? At the beginning it was bad marketing and then it became a compatibility problem. "Just bought this awesome Blur album, wanna listen? Poor lad, don't have a MiniDisc recorder here to hand it over"

In our case a lot of people (designers and developers) are using Bootstrap because it is so well known, not because it is far superior. It's not about functionality but popularity and therefore more people are likely to know how to tweak it to fit their needs. There are people claiming that ColdFusion needs far less code than PHP to do the same things. That might be true but it wouldn't be a valid argument for us against PHP would it?

I also have my issues with Bootstrap using "obstrusive Javascript" here and then but there are ways around that.

What about only bundling the most vital Bootstrap components with Yii? It doesn't have to be the whole thing.

I don't care much what the Yii team chooses.
I have a feeling that they will go for Bootstrap, unfortunately (IMO) - I can live with that.

Would have been refreshing if they didn't, but this seems to be a fight you can't win.

I would grab the best bits from Foundation, Bootstrap,HTML Kickstart, Gumpy and Responsive.gs.
Everyone is familar with css, html and javascript.
It doesn't really matter, since it's the same technology.

What happened to 'Dare to be different' ?

Take for instance Kickstart from http://www.99lime.com/ - I would throw in a responsive grid, and then it already beats Bootstrap squarely in the knackers.

I just find it really ironic that they'll choose Bootstrap over Foundation or another option as it's the least flexible and most intrusive solution.

This topic is very opinionated - and I better leave the topic before people start calling me names, and worse.

Thank you all for this enlightening discussion. My current vague idea is that we will enhance the webapp command so that it allows you to choose from one of several premade skeleton applications and generate the starting code for you. Among these premade applications, we will choose to use one CSS framework (likely to be bootstrap). The design of the webapp command will also allow people to plug in skeleton apps made by 3rd party.

For the core code, we will try to be independent of any specific css framework. Instead, we may release individual packages for popular css frameworks.

@qiang: That's what we need! But I've one more thing ... please consider a feature for using multiple themes within a single application, see this post this post for details. Then it will be perfect and not so ugly like my current hack to switch theme with a theme

@qiang: That's what we need! But I've one more thing ... please consider a feature for using multiple themes within a single application, see this post this post for details. Then it will be perfect and not so ugly like my current hack to switch theme with a theme

After spending time with Bootstrap and Foundation... The buttons and tabs are excellent junk the rest. I spent more time trying to think of ways to work around the limitations and I was adding double to triple the amount of markup