Classic Rotary Phones Forum

I got into a bidding war and paid a little more on this than I wanted. When I got it, it was beautiful, all original and matching all the way. I emailed him about if there were and cracks, he said no. I got the phone, it wasn't packed the greatest, and it has about a 3/4 inch crack on the left front foot.

He's been real cool about it and will even refund the entire amount including original cost, shipping, and return shipping. He has a buyer ready to buy it crack and all.

I'm thinking of using Dennis' repair advice on the troubleshooting topic, but is this worth it based on the price and value of this phone? Thanks guys, I love the phone, but don't know how badly the crack diminishes the value

By the way, in the picture the line from the 8 to the nine under the dial is a pretty significant scratch, but may buff out ok. Thanks

Dan, what a shame. Another example of a vintage phone damaged because of poor packing. You paid a lot for that phone to be cracked. How much it will diminish the value is anyone's guess. But if I were shopping for one and then you said it has a crack in it...I wouldn't pay $100 for it. If you can keep it and get a 50% return then I'd consider that. I know it's tough to part with them when they're nice. But if you like it and think you can repair the crack and live with it then keep it. There, that was a lot of help wasn't it?

Thanks. I am going to send it back. It's really a shame.It was basically packed in an insulated with styrofoam four sided box with a little bubble wrap around the handset. I'm sure it really jostled around a lot in the box.

I agree with Dennis on this. Crappy packing, don't even get me started!!! >:(

Have you been a victim of crappy packaging? My best packed phone was a light blue 500 for $4 , 7.95 shipping and double wrapped , double boxed, newspaper, foam peanuts wonderful!Then I get this beauty with a broken corner....

How many have arrived broken? Let me count the ways......Here are just a couple.

The first sign that it isn't going to be good is when the box has a sticker on it that says the Post Office Re-packed it. This 1950's red Kellogg 554 was broken as a result. Thin newspaper packing.

Another bad sign is when plastic pieces the same color of the phone fall out during the unpacking process. The green 500 is also a Kellogg.

Then the beige 500 that I thought was going to be soft plastic. It wasn't but apparently the plastic wasn't hard enough. And the pink 500 that someone had broken the part inside the case where the screw tightens down the cover. They glued it and didn't say anything on eBay about it. When I tried to remove the cover it fell to pieces (Just like Patsy Cline).....

Dennis, Looking at your photos is painful. I hope that, at least, the sellers made right on all of those, although it doesn't change the fact that a bunch of great telephones were needlessly destroyed.

Ben, most of the sellers offer something. Either a full refund if the phone is returned or a partial refund. But I always hate to send the phone back and in fact never have. I figure they'll probably just throw it away. In the case of the green Kellogg I have managed to part it out to people looking for that color of green to finish one of their projects. There have been some that I don't even bother contacting them. I just try and remember who they are for next time. And then there are those that say I should have purchased insurance---but that doesn't bring back the damaged phone.

Looking back at the first photo of the cardboard box repaired by the Post Office; it reminds me how often people will reuse a box to the point there is no structural support. They're like paper they've been used so much. The Post Office will give you a Priority box if you ask for one---free, as long as one uses Priority mail to ship it.

If I had a nickel for everything I had shipped to me and broken, I could buy a few more things! I've had so many things just fall to pieces, figured I'd quote Patsy Cline (as I thought of the song before I even got to where you had referenced it haha)

Also, on an unrelated note. I'm a newbie to the phone thing and was at the local antique store today, there was a Kellogg Wall-Mount phone for 150 bucks. The classic country kitchen phone with the side crank and the double bell, I'll try to get back over there next week and get a picture of it.

Also , on another unrelated note, there was a $50 Kellogg black rotary phone, 50s or prior with the metal rotary dial, the phone-to wall wiring was gone, and it had a white button built in to the top left of the dial. I'll try to get a pic of this one too.

And no matter how flawlessly you can repair it, it will never be the same.D/P

That's the thing. I really want to keep this, I think I can make the crack vanish, but it is still there....I'm changing my mind each day on this one. Dennis, your pictures make me angry and sad @ the same time!

After receiving several broken phones myself, I now give specific instructions on how I would like the phone packed. Bubble wrap with the handset not on the phone, with enough packing so that it doesn't move around inside the box. I tell them if there's extra cost involved to ship it this way, I'm willing to pay. This saves a lot of heartache, and I've had good results.

Dan, I'd send it back. Red soft plastic 500s seem to be plentiful lately, and you should be able to find another one very soon....and you might get it even cheaper! Especially since the seller is willing to refund the price and shipping.

Wow, it is a beautiful phone. What a shame. For me, I would have to send it back. You will always be explaining the crack otherwise. Good luck and I can understand why that might be too difficult.

Thanks for the kind words. I am depressed about this, but at least red oldies are common. I packed her up today like the hope diamond. (box in a box, bubble wrap, etc) Hopefully he'll see how to pack the phone for his buyer who wants it, crack and all.

Everything on the phone--handset, caps, elements, case, internal components--all date to either October or November 1958. It arrived in wrapped in thin sheet foam, with paper packed tightly on all sides. When I shook the box, I couldn't hear anything move, which is always a sign of good packing, but... the handset was left on the cradle, and I forgot to tell the seller that's a bad idea.

Despite the somewhat yellowed case, and whitened cords, I would have been thrilled, because it would have been just my third 500. All matching and all soft plastic, too.

Not only is it my first broken phone, but it's actually the very first broken item of any kind that I've received from an ebay seller.

I guess the lesson learned is that you should never forget to tell the seller to NOT pack a phone with the handset in place on the cradle. Everybody always says that, and I usually tell sellers about it. Unfortunately for me, I just forgot this time. After a half century of survival, it's a shame it had to end like this.

Bingster, I feel your pain. That IS an awful way to end the life of that phone. What a shame. I feel bad telling people how to package, especially experienced eBay sellers, but if you don't they'll ship it with the handset on and then they even still do it if asked not to. I've held my breath a few times unwrapping them.

I've seen many amazing repairs over the years. Some so good, it's hard to tell without a nice long close look. But, for me, a repaired phone. Especially one with this kind of damage. Will never be the same.

I sold my 302 a few days ago and I've tried contacting the buyer several times to see how it arrived and if they are happy with it. No response why are people like that?I'm on pins and needles here hoping I packed it wellD/P

When I complain to those around me that a buyer hasn't responded to their purchase...because I too wonder if it arrived OK--Is it damaged---Are they happy, etc., I am told that not everyone logs on a thousand times a day to send e-mail like I do. I can't understand why they don't. Those are for off-ebay sales. I don't generally e-mail sellers from eBay unless it was something spectacular or some exceptionally quick shipping and extra good packing. I let them know via my feedback like Bingster. But Dan, I know what you mean about pins and needles.

Sometimes people get busy, or sick or have other issues (like their computer crashed), be patient grasshopper.

Well one positive thing, they had 3 days to let me know of intent to return...If this weren't my first venture into this sort of thing I'd probably say Oh so what, but I want to know if I should continue or hang it up.

I really wouldn't worry about it, D/P. You've gone way beyond the call of duty as it is. Not only do some folks not answer their emails for whatever reason, but I myself have been guilty of not leaving feedback until after a long delay. In fact, I just found some items that I had neglected to leave feedback on from two months ago. My profile said that I needed to leave feedback on two items, but after digging around, I found that I actually had twelve items to leave feedback on, but it wasn't obvious to me and I had to dig for the info. I finally took care of it tonight.

If you have sent five emails and they haven't answered, I would assume everything is okay. I assume you need their feedback to build up your positive feedback "bank" as it were, but I've just found that some folks (including myself) simply don't always leave feedback. They are happy with the item and they simply move on. Just my .02 of course.

I won this phone http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200419527268 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200419527268) last week. I was really excited since it appeared to be in excellent condition. It arrived today with major damage. It had been wrapped in one thin layer of bubblewrap and placed inside of an old Kellogg K500 box, and that box was placed on its side inside a shallow corrugated cardboard box. There was essentially nothing to prevent pressure from being exerted on the the phone's sides, so it was apparently crushed sideways. Here are a couple of pictures:

I sent a message to the seller, but I have not yet asked for anything. I do not know if I should demand a full refund and return the phone or ask for a partial refund and keep it. What should I do?

It's just awful when a nice old phone like that is wrecked because of someone's carelessnenss. I would ask for a partial refund, there's plenty of good parts on that phone and you could always wait for a new case.

Larryinmichigan, Man that hurts!!!!!!!!!! I had several, from Calf. , that couldn't get over the mountians 2 times looked liked the usps played football with my boxes!!!!!!!!! I know you hate to keep it and hate to refund!! Mine was so tore up refund was all that was left. I started giving special instructions on all my phones now!!!! I don't always get it like I want but it cuts down on damage!!!!!!!! Hope you have better luck next time!!!! stub

I did give instructions. I asked that the phone be packed so that it will not move within the box and that handset be kept from coming in contact with the base during shipment. I think that I included a warning about bakelite being brittle. I forget to specify that the phone should not be placed on its side in a shallow box so that the weight of other boxes on top of the box would not crush it.

I sent a message to the seller telling them about the damage caused by improper packing and including links to the two images I posted here. I am awaiting a reply.

Larry, You would think, from the sellers feedback, that they would know how to pack stuff by now. Anyway good luck getting this issue resolved!!!!! Hope the rest of your phones come in without any damage!!!!!!!!!!! stub

Thanks. I have two more bakelite phones on the way, including a Redbar (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150397880716 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150397880716)). I know how fragile those are.

Larry

(Again, I added the eBay photo. So that when the listing disappears we will still see it here)~Dennis

Sorry about that, Larry. I know the heartbreak of a crushed phone (as most of us do). Unless you have another similar Leich that needs parts, I'd ask for a full refund. Many times, a seller won't even ask for the broken one back, because they know they can't resell it, and shipping it back would be a waste of money.

I think proper packing is even more important now, during the winter. At least in my neck of the woods it's pretty cold out there. The box sits in the back of the mail truck for X-amount of time until the postal carrier drops it your porch. Things are very brittle on a good day. I always open my boxes and let the phone get to room temperature before I mess with it much. Dials are slow and the plastic is brittle.

I know in the cargo holds of jets it's probably cold but they're just sitting by that time. Those boxes take a lot of abuse from point A to point B.

A friend sent me two model 500's this week. Both in one Large Flat Rate box. He packed them on their sides. Both had damage to the front of the phone. Very thin cracks, but damaged nonetheless. One from October of 1955 and the other from June of 1952. Bummer.

I guess that I need to add a "Do not lay the phone on its side in the box" clause to my packing instructions. If and when this seller responds to my message, I will ask for a refund and offer to ship back the broken phone for the cost of a flat rate box. If I end up having to keep it, at least the handset is still in good shape, and it does seem to work, but I did not test the ringer. The F1 transmitter is dated '47, and the base '48. It is a real tragedy that a 62 year old phone which was in nearly perfect condition has been broken.

Larry....nothing is more frustrating than buying a phone and waiting,waiting for it to be delivered. Finally opening the box and finding damage from neglect of the seller. I instruct anyone I buy a phone from, if you don't have bubble, just cram newspaper into the box so it doesn't move. Separate the handset from the cradle of the phone. There is no better box than the Priority Boxes from the Post office. You can stand on them. I have purchased a lot lately from craig's list and people have no idea how to pack. Newspaper, plenty of newpaper. If you shake the box and can feel it move, MORE NEWSPAPER. ...Doug

I just received a green AE80 which I bought a week ago on ebay for $6 plus $11 shipping. The phone was nothing special, but I like green, and it was fairly cheap. I asked the seller to pack it carefully so that it would not move around during shipment. It arrived, wrapped in two sheets of newspaper in a small, flimsy cardboard box which was crushed in spots. The shell was broken on the bottom in a few places. I emailed the seller, and he offered to refund my costs. Here is a picture of part of the damage. (Warning! graphic content may not be suitable for all viewers!)

Larry;Here is a tip I use on all of my purchases, whether Ebay or private.After the win, or purchase, I contact the seller, and get His/Her guarantee that they will pack according to my specifications. I even offer to pay extra for proper packing....BEFORE I PAY FOR THE ITEM............ I do not pay until they respond.I had one guy initiate a non pay complaint, which I won, because I showed Ebay he did not respond to my requests.D/P

This has happened to me in the past as well and makes me afraid to spend "big money" on EBAY. Normally, as soon as I win an auction I send an e-mail asking, no begging the seller to pack carefully and also ensure that the handset is not hung up but rather wrapped separate; I also offer extra cash to ensure a good pack. Most times they comply but sometimes they just ignore my request. It[s not bad enough that my money is wasted but the fact that these old phones lived for 50 years in pristine condition only to be destroyed by a cheap or lazy seller breaks my heart. Case in point, I once bought a 10 button 1554 and "begged" the seller to wrap carefully. Well it came wrapped in a paper bag and newspaper. Needless to say it arrived in 1000 pieces :'( (literally). I was so angry I took photos and sent them to the seller. He was like..... I wrapped very well must have been the post office >:( NO YOU DID NOT you idiot. Well at least I have the guts. That reminds me...anyone have the plastics for a 1554 10 button ? I'll take it ;D

Too bad, Larry. I hate when that happens. Like it's been said, it is not the money it's the fact that a phone that lived this long had to be damaged because of ignorance.

I make a comment to the seller like, "forgive me for offering packing tips as I know you're a professional" BUT and then I give my packing tips. I end it by saying that when the box is shaken, there should be NO movement inside. If something is moving, then it's not good enough.

I told that to a woman that sent me her phone to be "tuned up". I gave her specific info and the box (large flat rate) arrived with the phone loosely packed inside and rattling around. At least she wrapped the handset. No protection on the body of the (model 500) at all...some newspaper laying on top (not balled up but just laying there) and yet the phone arrived undamaged. Sometimes people get lucky.

The seller gave me a full refund, and I plan to glue back the pieces that I can after cleaning the shell. I always include instructions with my payment to pack the phone carefully so that it will not move around and the handset will not come into contact with the base during shipment. I also explain, that bumping or crushing will likely result in damage. Most sellers have followed my instructions, a couple of them to the extreme, but some pay little or no attention. At least this phone was not especially rare or valuable in the first place, so it is not a great loss to mankind. It is a 1970s vintage AE80. Had it been an SC 1211 or something like that, I would probably have cried. I bought it mostly because I really like this color.

Probably with a lot of patience, you can glue it with crazy glue, sand the back panel and polish it to a point where it will be difficult to tell it was broken. I hope you can find all the plastic that broke away.

Just bought a nice '59 princess last night ( a bargain!!!) and I sent this e-mail....hope it works ;) They replied "will do"...hopefully they "will do"

Hi. I bought and have paid for the phone and also added insurance. Please do me a favor and when packing do not send the phone hung up on the base as these phones are very delicate and it will most likely crack. Instead please wrap the base and the handset separately as this will help to minimize damage. The extra effort will be most appreciated. Not disrespecting your packing ability as you have excellent feedback but if you are not a phone collector you wouldn't realize how fragile these older phones are and I have had a few break in transit. Thanks in advance :) Joel

Just so everyone knows. the seller is responsible for insurance in the shipping quote they give you. eBay made the seller responsible at the beginning of the year. So buyers, you do not have to add extra money for insurance.....Doug (seller Jflowres)

It is important that the phone be packed so that it will not move within the box and so that it will not be crushed by the weight of other boxes. A while back, I posted about a 1949 Leich convertible bakelite phone that arrived crushed because it was packed on it side in a flimsy box which was only slightly deeper that the width of the phone. The shell of the phone bore most of the weight of the boxes on top of it. The seller refunded my money for that phone also.

Once this shell is clean, I plan to try to glue back the pieces which are salvageable. Some parts of the shell were crushed into tiny bits, and I think that other pieces may have fallen out of the box, because there are a few parts unaccounted for.

Just so everyone knows. the seller is responsible for insurance in the shipping quote they give you. eBay made the seller responsible at the beginning of the year. So buyers, you do not have to add extra money for insurance.....Doug (seller Jflowres)

Hmmmmmm then I paid double insurance >:( Maybe they will reimburse me? Yeah right maybe they will have Santa hand deliver the reimbursement. Oh well...live and learn. Thanks Doug.

Just so everyone knows. the seller is responsible for insurance in the shipping quote they give you. eBay made the seller responsible at the beginning of the year. So buyers, you do not have to add extra money for insurance.....Doug (seller Jflowres)

Hmmmmmm then I paid double insurance >:( Maybe they will reimburse me? Yeah right maybe they will have Santa hand deliver the reimbursement. Oh well...live and learn. Thanks Doug.

Go to eBay on it, shipping includes insurance on all items sold on eBay.....Doug

Dan....it is up to the seller to guarantee it to your door. If it is damaged, seller has to refund your money and shipping. Most sellers, myself included, add extra to the shipping to cover insurance. I say in my ads, shipping and insurance are $xx.xx Its better than the old days as a seller, when something was damaged in the mail and the buyer went back to eBay/Paypal and got all their money back. Even when I had emails stating the the buyer DID NOT want insurance. eBay is heavily loaded against the seller. We have never had eBay/Paypal rule in our favor. Not once, buyer is always right, no matter what....Doug

We all continue to shake our heads in collective disbelief at the crass and careless way some sellers pack phones for shipment, even after we have made agonizing efforts to explain to them how to do it properly. Here's my latest sad story: Last year, I bought a really rare W.E. 602C Data Phone, and implored the seller to use plenty of bubble-wrap and a good large carton. He was miffed that I would question his ability to correctly pack a box, as he was "a professional". Well, the pictures below show what I received. The box he used was only about an inch larger than the contents, and his "packing material" consisted of a few wadded up pieces of paper. As this Data Phone is really heavy, and the front plastic cover is thin and fragile, it didn't take a lot of cafefully-orchestrated gymnastics by our friends at the USPS to trash it. Now, I can add a replacement front cover to my list of "Unobtainable Things To Search For".

Yeah, a refund, which might help reduce the pain, still can't compensate for the ruin of something that has survived unharmed for decades. I've tried all the previously-suggested methods to convey the seriousness to sellers, but in the end it's still a crapshoot.

<snip> Now, I can add a replacement front cover to my list of "Unobtainable Things To Search For".

Try calling or emailing Phoneco. When I was there a few years ago they had a pile (literally) of data sets. A quick look left me with the impression that at least some of them must be parts sets. ::) ::)

Looking at the photo reminded me that the Data Sets were from a large purchase from Alberta. There were a number of different variations, so hopefully they'll have the configuration you need. You obviously need to be careful about getting severely sun-tanned parts! Good luck!

Several of us stopped at Phoneco "on the way home" from a phone show in Bloomington. (OK, we took the REAL scenic route.) It was an experience. I encourage all collectors to make the visit while we still have the opportunity.

I was pretty excited when I won the bid on this phone last week: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270663060080 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270663060080) which i mentioned in another thread on this forum. The seller waited almost a week to ship the phone, and ignored my packing instructions. When lifted the box on my doorstep, I immediately heard the horrifying sounds of shaking and bells ringing. When i opened the box, I found that the handset had been left sitting in the cradle with nothing between it and the phone body. The handset was largely destroyed, and the side of the shell was bashed in. I just sent a message to the seller with links to these pictures.

I would assume a full refund including shipping is coming your way. It was probably packed up b4 you sent your packing instructions and they were too lazy to do a repack. Some of these sellers don't even do their own packing and so the instructions are not passed on.

I purchased a 317 wood wallphone once and the cathedral top did not fit the box so they just put some extra tape on the part sticking out . The receiver bounced around inside and broke the shelf and itself. Whats wrong with these people. Most of the time they are new to Ebay but your seller is a seasoned veteran. Good thing it wasn't a super rare phone. Better luck next time.

That's really a shame. A few years back when I dabbled in some basic restoration and selling of the phones on eBay the very first thing I learned, and always adhered to, was how to carefully package the phone for shipment.

You guessed it, the first rule of packing was never to remove the handset from the receiver if at all possible, or heavily pad it if not possible to remove it. It's so simple and so effective.

The box was not sealed before my instructions because it included an invoice indicating that I had already paid, which I did within a few minutes after the auction ended. What is really annoying is that the seller charged my $15 for shipping but used a medium flat-rate Priority Mail box with no insurance, which costs $10.70.

Anyway, I am waiting for a reply. I did not ask for any specific compensation yet, but I certainly want a complete refund because I cannot use not display a phone with a demolished handset. It is really a shame because the bakelite is in otherwise very good condition.

For what it is worth, here is the text of the instructions which I included with the payment:

Quote

Please pack the phone very carefully with plenty of padding so that is will not move around, no weight will rest on it, and the handset will not bump or come into contact with the base during shipment. The handset should be wrapped separately. These bakelite phones are quite brittle and crack and chip very easily.

Larry, I'm sorry to hear about yet another poor packing job. Sometimes I think many of those sellers with thousands of feedback are really less caring and more of a "production-line" seller. Taking a look at his/her feedback score, 17 Negatives in the past 6 months. I know that for the amount of sales, that may be a normal number. I figure every 257.5 people leave a negative comment. That's too much. Good luck getting satisfaction from the seller. You may be better off dealing with eBay/PayPal. The bottom line is a nice old phone is now damaged, which is the shame.

Yes, what a shame. I'm sorry, welcome to the club (of those of us who have received broken phones in shipment from eBay).

I am a bit more emphatic in my packing instructions. I send this to every seller when I win an auction:

IMPORTANT! PLEASE READ! When you box up this phone for shipment, please DO NOT pack the phone up with its receiver sitting on the phone's cradle. The receiver will knock into the body of the phone during shipment and it is GUARANTEED that the phone will be received broken into several pieces. PLEASE wrap the receiver of the phone separately.

I am very polite in my instructions too, but I make sure they respond to me before they ship. As in ---In case you didn't get my instructions the first time, I wish to............... I sometimes have to send this two times, but I have only had one cracked so far.

The seller replied to my message an offered a refund if I ship the phone back to them. I am a bit nervous about putting another $11 or so into this in the hope of getting a refund, so I am thinking of asking for a partial refund of $20 or so. I can probably glue the pieces back together and have a usable phone which looks acceptably good when viewed from the right sides. Do you think that this would be a good idea, or will it likely make the seller suspicious or less willing to cooperate?

I think that requiring you to ship the phone back, at your considerable expense, is ridiculous. The seller can see the photos. All they are doing is throwing road blocks in front of you to thwart your efforts to hold them accountable.

I'd just keep the phone and toss whatever appropriate negative feedback you can give them their way. What goes around comes around, as they say.

I wouldn't send it back either. I've had sellers give me a partial or total refund and tell me to keep it. Since they cannot retaliate with negative feedback any longer, you can always do that if he refuses to compensate you in some way. I'm thinking he probably doesn't care if he gets another red mark.

Larry Just think of the skill set you will acquire if you keep the phone and fix it up brilliantly. Got to be worth the outlay - what do you think? If life sends you a bag of lemons make some lemonade, add yeast and sugar and hey presto - booze!! ;D

Larry I had a 711 blanked model turn up with the case in pieces, I got a partial refund, kept the bits used it as a donor, I know its not bakelite like yours, but you get my drift.

From what I can see you could buy a replacement handset, but the body doesn't look too clever, I'm sure with a lot of work you could get it straightened out though, on ebay UK tonight there is a No. 164 handset starting at 12 quid, no caps though.

I see a complete GPO handset on ebay UK now, currently at £1.45, but I would expect that even if I would win with a bid like that, shipping to the USA would be £50, or something outrageous like that.

The bashed in side of the shell might not be completely terrible as long as the handset remains in the cradle since the worst damage was done where the spitcup hit it, so it would be mostly hidden.. The spitcup itself, amazingly remained in nearly perfect condition. The ugliest wound would be the top of the handset which has chunks broken out of it.

I am awaiting a reply from the seller.

This seller sells mostly old coins. I should have bought a phone from someone who sells mostly crystal glassware :)

I'm so sorry to see your sad pictures, and to learn that you have joined those of us who have found ourselves in this same infuriating position.

For what it's worth (and sometimes it's not worth much), here is what I send (with appropriate variations as the situation requires) to all my sellers:

Hi ____ . Before I pay you for this nice ____ , I want to say something important about packing: The housing of this old phone is really very fragile, and it can easily be broken if not packed well. I have had similar nice phones ruined in the past when the sellers didn't pack them well. PLEASE use MULTIPLE LAYERS of bubble wrap (NOT crumbled up paper), and wrap the handset separately so it can't rattle around and bang into the rest of the phone. Also, please use a box that is large enough to absorb the abuse it will get from the P.O. without hurting the contents, and fill any void spaces with additional packing material to keep things from rattling around. I will wait to hear back from you before paying so that I know you have received this important message. This is a really nice phone and I will be happy to add it to my collection. Thank you for the auction. Dave F.

This is my contribution to the effort of educating Bozo sellers and thereby possibly reducing shipping damage. You are welcome to use any part or all of it when dealing with your sellers. If it helps to keep even one nice old item from being destroyed, this effort will have been worthwhile. Any recommended changes or additions to the text are welcome.

Thank you for the advice. This is actually at least the fourth of fifth phone that has been damaged or destroyed on the way to me, all of them poorly packed. On one of them, the seller immediately refunded my money and let me keep the phone. On another, the sellre asked me to ship back the phone, which I did, and refunded my money plus the return shipping. This time, I really don't feel like standing in a line at a post office to correct someone else's careless mistake, and the phone is still worth something, at least for some of the parts.

I will hopefully have a response by tomorrow and will let everyone know what happened. At least, the total amount of money in question here is only $24.50. If this had been a $1000 colored AE34 or something like that, I would be in shock now.

So the seller wanted you to spring for the return shipping? If so were they going to refund the phone purchase price, phone price plus originall shipping charge or phone price plus both shipping charges? If they were going to refund your return shipping cost, be sure that they know that it is $15, not $10.70 as that is what it cost them to ship the $10.70 flat rate box to you.

I think that they were planning to pay me for the return shipping, but once I ship it, I will be out the purchase price plus two shipping charges until they refund me. I think that the safest thing is to keep the phone and get a partial refund.

The seller just offered to refund just the original $15 shipping charge. I just sent them another message stating that, since they ignored my packing instructions and packed the phone improperly, and the phone was badly damaged, I did not actually receive the item that I purchased and should therefore not incur any expense. I expect that this is going to turn out to be a hassle with an ebay complaint. Don't expect a perfect feedback score from me on this.

eBay now requires all sellers to provide insurance on their packages. If you file a complaint, you will ultimately win, but you will most likely have to mail back the broken item. Before filing your claim, decide which is better for you, the full refund or the spare phone parts.

The seller replied to my message an offered a refund if I ship the phone back to them. I am a bit nervous about putting another $11 or so into this in the hope of getting a refund, so I am thinking of asking for a partial refund of $20 or so. I can probably glue the pieces back together and have a usable phone which looks acceptably good when viewed from the right sides. Do you think that this would be a good idea, or will it likely make the seller suspicious or less willing to cooperate?

I've only bought a few phones so far, but I've experienced the best and the worst regarding packaging. My 554 was put in a box (with the handset on the hook) and only a few sheets of newspaper between it and the cold cruel world. But the '54 500 set was wrapped as if it was making a trip over niagra falls.

I have had the same experience lately. I bought a plastic 302 that came with handset on hook with one sheet of newspaper under it and one on top. Suprisingly it was unharmed! I also purchased a 354 from the same person and made it clear to him we were very lucky with the first one and he had better make sure this one was better packed, giving him explicit instructions on how to pack it. When it arrived it took me hours to unwrap it ;D

I will give you the good seller side of this thread, as you know I was lucky enough to win a beautiful green North Galion. This is the email I sent the seller:

"Hi...I was lucky enough to win your auction, it is a wonderful phone. Bakelite is very fragile. Would you please separate the handset from the phone and wrap both in bubble wrap. Please secure the phone firmly in the middle of the box with newspaper so the phone and the separated handset can not move and bang each other. I do appreciate you packing it this way. I have received damaged phones in the past and do not mean to be telling you how to run your business. I am thrilled with this phone. Please let me know when you send it and furnish me the tracking number...many thanks....Doug"

Well, separate the handset was taken literally, she unscrewed the cap and disconnected the handset cord. REALLY! This phone and handset had enough bubble around it that I started to get frustrated trying to find my prize. This was a buyers dream, seller listened and I received a beautiful phone, INTACT!!...Doug

Well, separate the handset was taken literally, she unscrewed the cap and disconnected the handset cord

You're lucky, she didn't just cut the handset cord.

BTW, the GPO phone (the original subject of this post) was just reassembled a few minutes ago. I did my best to patch the cracks in the shell. The handset looks bad, but one of our members generously offered to sell me one of his spare NOS handsets. I hope to post some pictures once everything is settled. The sound quality from the transmitter is lousy. I don't know if this is just the way that the old GPO transmitters work, or if this one is just bad. I have tapped and shaken it and cleaned the contacts on the back, but it still sounds only marginally better than an old candlestick type transmitter. Also, I am looking for some GPO dial center cards.

Larry....when I first opened the box, I was betting on that the cord was cut. As it turns out, it wouldn't have been an issue as the insulation in flaking off and their is static. Its seen its last day. At least I could connect it real quickly to test functionality....Doug

There's also original cards turn up (usually in bulk) from time to time.

For the RX, try an old trick, carefully slide the diaphragm off , check the inside for any metal swarf, clean if it has, do the two sides of the diaphragm with WD-40, when wiped dry flip the side over and gently slide back on the magnets.

WOW :oMy condolences Dave.That is a shame. There were a couple of those at the Maitland show. I will try to recall who had them. I do recall they were priced fairly low but are not my cup of tea so I passed.

My condolences. Those Leich beehives are about the most fragile phones around. I would have gone through extreme lengths to pack it. I always wonder how those things were shipped from the factory so that they didn't arrive damaged.

Here is the text of the message I sent to the seller, and which was promptly ignored by same:

The Bakelite housing of this old Leich phone is brittle and EXTREMELY fragile, and it can easily be broken if not packed well. Trust me on this -- I have had similar Bakelite phones ruined in the past when the sellers didn't pack them securely. PLEASE use MULTIPLE LAYERS of bubble wrap (NOT crumbled or shredded paper), and wrap the handset separately so it can't rattle around and bang into the phone. Also, please use a box that is large enough to absorb the abuse it will get from the P.O. without hurting the contents, and fill any void spaces with additional packing material to keep things from rattling around.

I'm really sorry and I know how you must feel right now. I restore, sell and buy antique electric fans and they have got to be the hardest to pack. They weight up to 30lbs by themselves sometimes and with a brass cage and blade your talking about complete destruction when that weight starts moving. I've literally have gotten boxes with a ball of iron and brass in them. But I know how to pack them safely for their treacherous trip. But, I'll NEVER understand why someone can not pack a little ole phone in the proper size box with the proper packing material to get it to it's destination without harm. I think eBay should not let ANYONE sell something if they cant get it to you in the same condition it was when the customer bought it. If someone gets more then 2 damaged in shipping claims against him in a year, your out, over, kaput, outta here and never to return.Now, where's that bottle of Valium I had.

That sure is painful to look at. I have a few that look just like it. The crank should have been removed before packing but here it looks like the handset did it in. The handsets always seem to win that fight. I had one seller pack four Leich's in the same box that was only large enough to safely pack one phone in. It was a waste of four nice phones that lived a long time only to be destroyed by stupidity. The Leich phones are so fragile that I have heard of properly packed ones destroyed because the magneto broke away from the mount. I don't know how to prevent that one unless you disassemble the phone before packing it. I would help you out if I could but I'm actually looking for a few housings myself. Sometimes you will find just the ringer box on eBay.

I send a similar message about packing a phone before I pay. I also add a line "I will be happy to add $5.00 to cover additional shipping materials and will wait for revised invoice in case larger box is a little more to ship."I have thought about adding a threat of sorts, "If these instructions are not followed and I receive a damaged phone you will not be getting good feedback" but my wife has convinced me not to so far.

I send a similar message about packing a phone before I pay. I also add a line "I will be happy to add $5.00 to cover additional shipping materials and will wait for revised invoice in case larger box is a little more to ship."I have thought about adding a threat of sorts, "If these instructions are not followed and I receive a damaged phone you will not be getting good feedback" but my wife has convinced me not to so far.

Harry, I agree with your wife on that. Sometimes words can be taken wrong and some will do just the opposite to show you, if you know what I mean.

My sympathies Dave on the broken telephone. It's always a bummer when that happens. Like DougPav said in one of his posts...they (the phone) made it all these years and then in one act of poor packing, it's destroyed.

Not always. With my GPO phone several weeks ago, both parties lost, but the handset suffered the most.

Why does it seem so difficult for people to understand the simple concept that allowing a heavy object (handset) knocking into a fragile object (phone shell) is bad? It's a good thing that I don't collect light bulbs.

"Hi. I bought and have paid for the phone. Please do me a favor and when packing do not send the phone hung up as these phones are very delicate and it will most likely crack. Instead please wrap the base and the handset separately as this will help to minimize damage. The extra effort will be most appreciated. Not disrespecting your packing ability as you have excellent feedback but if you are not a phone collector you wouldn't realize how fragile these older phones are. If you would like more money to offset the extra bubble wrap just let me know. These phones have been around for many years and I am sure neither one of us want to be the one to damage them. Thanks in advance :) Joel "

Some people respond with don't worry I will be extra careful and they are and then some choose to ignore it and the phone arrives damaged. Some STILL send the phone hung up and it makes me so angry. Angry to the point that I rarely buy any more phones on EBAY unless they are at a really good price and I will gamble that the seller is conscientious in their packing.

I think eBay should not let ANYONE sell something if they cant get it to you in the same condition it was when the customer bought it. If someone gets more then 2 damaged in shipping claims against him in a year, your out, over, kaput, outta here and never to return.

I agree. Maybe if enough people who have received destroyed phones griped about it to eBay, they'd do something to tag the category warning sellers that they'll eat the damage and face loss of their selling account. I've lost count of the horror stories just in this group in the last few months.

I think eBay should not let ANYONE sell something if they cant get it to you in the same condition it was when the customer bought it. If someone gets more then 2 damaged in shipping claims against him in a year, your out, over, kaput, outta here and never to return.

I agree. Maybe if enough people who have received destroyed phones griped about it to eBay, they'd do something to tag the category warning sellers that they'll eat the damage and face loss of their selling account. I've lost count of the horror stories just in this group in the last few months.

Guys....I sell on eBay. This "rule" would put all your sellers out of business. Yes...ALL sellers. You are mixing poor packing with damaged phones by Carrier into one lump issue. USPS Priority Flat Box I have NEVER had a phone damaged. NEVER! FedEx and UPS are a crapshoot, but sometimes necessary because of weight or box size. Don't punish the good guys because there are a few sellers who don't take the time to pack correctly. Most sellers on eBay aim to please. All I can say is, "walk a mile in my (our) shoes.".....Doug

Kidphone, I see your aspect and respect it and I too sell on eBay. But the ones I'm talking about are the ones that just throw the item in a box with the front page of the daily news and send it on it's way. I think we can all tell the difference between ones that where packed well and didn't survive because of a post office football game and the ones the sellers just didn't care and, that's the ones that should be chastised. Usually, the post office wont even honor the insurance if it wasn't packed properly.There's a lot of good sellers on eBay that know how to pack and there's the ones who don't and there's gotta be something done about it. Even if the seller refunds me, they seldom refund shipping. And I buy heavy vintage and antique fan sometimes that weigh 30-40 lbs packed, that's a lot of money to be loosing just to find out that your seller didn't care enough to pack it well.

This is not intended to be argumentative, it's only MY opinion, and we all know what there like.

No argument at all, but sometimes the buyer needs an education. I am on both sides of this discussion. Fans are the toughest item by far to package. If the cage and blade are not removed and sent separately the fan WILL be ruined. Where there is uneven weight distribution this should not be taken on by anyone but a professional. Hopefully the buyer of the fan will let the seller know before the auction ends, just what is expected for a safe travel of the fan. 95% of eBay sellers would not be capable of this even if they had the knowledge before hand. Everyone wants their item shipped the cheapest way possible and do NOT want to hear the expense of sending it safely. MOST sellers are not professional packers and do need your guidance. Some will not listen no matter what you tell them.

Buyers....Just don't lump every seller in the same pile. We try very hard to have the item we send arrive in the pictured condition.

Remember....there are some buyers who are not happy no matter what you do of how you do it. .Doug...

The worst packing I ever received was 2 500 sets in a box (no packing at all). Amazingly the only damage was to a hollow fingerwheel.Jim

Same here, Jim, and it was a standard flat rate box and I wasn't as lucky as you. One of the phone housings cracked. I have the pictures to prove it. It makes me wince every time I see it, like an accident scene. I just packed the blue phone away to avoid the anger and one day I may get back to it. Luckily the phones were cheap. They were valuable, though. Both were soft plastic 591s, which are a little rarer than the average 500 set. This was August, 2007.

I posted the box picture before, but it bears repeating. You can't be too careful in sending packing instructions. I did send them to this seller and they were ignored. I had no idea two 500s could be crammed into a flat rate box like that. I have trouble packing one in properly.

Not trying to take away from the subject here but, eBay sellers that sell fans don't always have the ability to remove the blades of a fan. This is because most Emerson fan blades screw onto the rotor and you need to wedge or stop the rotor from turning in a way that it doesn't damage the motor to take the blade off.

I asked a seller the last time if he'd do this and even called him to give him instructions. But before I could even finish he stated that he was a mechanic and could do it without problems. Well, to make a long story short, he gouge the stator so bad that it ruined it and would no longer run. hence fourth, I never ask them to remove the blades on Emerson's.

Sorry to hear of your loss. I used to collect vintage Singer sewing machines and Ebay sellers seemed to think that anything cast iron could be packed as haphazardly as an anvil. I lost 2 due to poor packing even after I offered to pay extra for quality packing. My theory is if you can't throw it on a concrete floor from a 10 foot step ladder without damage, it isn't packed well, because that is exactly the care the post office or UPS will give it. It's a d*mn shame to see a collectible survive the best part of a century, only to be destroyed by careless packing.

I sell on Ebay from time to time. Last year I sold a portable Singer sewing machine to a guy in Texas (Iím from Quebec). I Packaged the machine before the auction started and thought it was very well packaged. After the auction ended the buyer sent instructions on how to package it properly. He mentioned that a certain arm and a few other things had to be secured and wrapped securely. I had to unpackage the whole machine and repack it properly. I was glad to do it right and even happier when he received it and said it was the best packaging he had seen. I like it when collectors send info on how to package a certain item.... as they usually know what they are talking about. Sellers who don't follow instructions even when your money is refunded should be let with a big fat NEGATIVE. Jiggerman

<snip>....It's a d*mn shame to see a collectible survive the best part of a century, only to be destroyed by careless packing.

This, of course, is the saddest part. We have all lamented endlessly about this very thing. The money, while certainly important, is secondary. The unnecessary loss of a beautiful artifact which had survived for ages is a tragedy.

An update on the Leich Beehive phone:

I sent the seller a message in which I just barely contained my rage and outrage. I guess the tone of my message got through. He refunded my money, including the shipping, but did not reply in any other way. Since he didn't ask for the phone back (probably because I told him that HE would have to pay the return postage), I assume that I am free to do with it what I will. I recovered all but the tiniest of Bakelite fragments from the box, and I may try some repair later. This makes 5 or 6 items I have which were ruined by crappy packing. Maybe I'll line them all up in one place and post a picture -- sort of a Rogue's Gallery of careless incompetence.

That is such a shame about the Leich phone--I can empathize completely. I recently received a BEAUTIFUL, blue, early 702B Princess phone--along with three other phones, all in one lot. It was a good deal so I won it on eBay. When I received the four phones (all in one box), guess what was used as packing? Crumbled newspapers and an old bath towel! I would have laughed, but during the jumble, a crack--not a MAJOR one, but annoying, nonetheless--was noticeable on the back casing of my phone. All of that could have been avoided if she had packed it properly. I ended up receiving a $10 refund, and she was very apologetic, but I really do hope that she learns a lesson on packing in general on things that could crack, break, or scratch in transit.

The near-tragedy of all time was the time I won a 10-digit Trimline (very elusive--I have a very knowledgeable friend on all things Western Electric who wasn't even initially aware that they even made this variety of Trimline) for a mere $66! Not too shabby--however, when it arrived, it was in a box, with only newspaper (bad enough and not much of it) and the handset and base were placed TOGETHER!!! I couldn't believe it! Sadly, a hairline crack appeared on the side of the handset opposite the keypad. Fortunately though, there were no additional cracks or chips. I ended up getting half of my money back, but I would have rather paid the full price and had the phone in the advertised condition.

I do like you do now--I always include a ridiculously specific message (which sounds like I'm telling a total moron how to pack a phone) with my order. It's a shame it only works for some sellers. Good luck, man.

For the member who first posted this thread, I have found another "beehive" bakelite crank wall phone on eBay.It's ebay item #170595305522The auction ends February 1st at about 10:10 pm EST and it's currently at $8.95 w/no bids.It's in excellent condition.Just thought I would pass this along on this thread-Thanks

After reading the tales of woe that some of us have experienced this past month due to bad packing and rough shipping, it occurred to me that, in nearly two years since I started buying phones off the internet again, I have been extremely fortunate to not have a sad shipping story to share. That all changed last Saturday as I opened the box that this light biege Kellogg 554 was packed in. As has been discussed elsewhere, this model of wallphone is rather delicate at the corners and will not ship well if badly packed. This item was placed directly on the bottom of the box, handset right next to it, with about six crumpled pages from a newspaper sales circular stuffed around & on top of the phone. Even the handset didn't survive the trip. The final insult, of course, was in the very bottom of the box-- three pieces of rodent droppings!

What a shame. I remember seeing that auction. That was a great price for that phone too. Sorry to hear about Murphy catching up to you Stephen. Let's hope this all the dues you have to pay. Which is enough.

It was not only a great price, but uncommon enough I considered nominating it for "Find of the Month" before I opened the box.

Harry, the one year time frame for the Kellogg/ITT name is probably a reference to how long they made soft plastics with that badge. They continued using that name for a few years after that, but the plastics had changed to ABS by then. I have a Kellogg/ITT wallphone from 1962 that is nearly identical to this one-- badging and all.

Stephen, I'm sorry to see the damage. You sure did get a good deal on the price, but the seller needs to be informed about the damage. I have a pink ITT-Kellogg 554 like this that was packed similarly and the housing had large chunks out of it by the time it arrived. It was also very faded, so I just used it for parts. I've had other wall phones damaged in shipping too, but I've never seen a handset broken in two like that. It must have gotten an incredible hit to break in two.

ITT-Kelloggs were made for much longer than a year. From about 1957 to 1965, I think, and the plastics did change sometime in the 60s, but I don't know exactly when. They aren't as full of dates as WE phones, and aren't as plentiful, so I haven't seen enough to know for sure. I think they made them in soft plastic longer than WE, and for at least three or four years before making them in ABS. Their handsets are different than WE, with curved edges at the top and bottom.

Stephen, is this 554 soft or hard plastic? Are there any dates on it? I guess if it can't be a showpiece, at least it can help define the history of ITT-Kellogg 554s.

I did inform the seller of the damage & explained to him where he went wrong in packing this phone. I won this one late in the evening & he sent me shipping notice early the next morning, so I did not get any instruction to him before it was in the mail--big mistake! You would think that a seller with a 2000+ feedback rating-- the majority as a seller-- would know how to pack an item. He did send me a message to tell me he would pack future items of this kind much more carefully & he did refund my $6.50-- but not the shipping. You're right, Sargeguy-- it didn't help.

Jonathan,

I haven't checked every part, but the base & C4A ringer are dated 6/59. The plastics are soft. I may not be successful, especially with the handset, but I am going to attempt to repair the damage. If anyone learns of a replacement handset handle, I'm looking for one-- just in case.

It's really hard to look at -- I'm so sorry. Having been through this so many times, you would think I would be numb to it by now. But no, it still hurts to see what these incompetent doofuses (doofi?) manage to do to us.

Welcome to the (unhappy) club, Tom. It seems we all have had this happen at one time or another.

At this point, because so many of our acquisitions change hands via the mail, I think we must simply accept that a certain small percentage of telephone history will be permanently lost to attrition due to mailing damage. We can try to minimize it as much as possible, but that fact will never be changed, it's just a reality.

Sometimes a well-packed package gets smashed by the post office or parcel carrier. This is more likely during the winter holidays and other times when employees are being overworked to death, and they take shortcuts such as overloading hand-trucks and carts, or they slip on wet/icy ground and packages go flying.

That's not the seller's fault. Usually it's not even the postal or carrier worker's fault, but the result of speed-ups and overwork and under-staffing. Any item of value should be insured for its real value, not the "price paid," if such a thing is possible. Then when something gets smashed, file the insurance claim. If enough people do that, the post offices and carrier services might just hire enough workers to handle the load properly.

Then there are the ones that are packed crappily, pardon my language but the appropriate adjective begins with a considerably stronger common cussword that probably isn't welcome on this board.

Ebay is now closing in on 15 years old if not older. There is exactly no excuse at this point for poor packing, and I don't care if the seller just got started, they should be obligated to understand what secure packing means. Ebay needs to have it in their terms of service, that if sellers are not familiar with proper packaging methods, they are obligated to have items professionally packed for shipping, and further, that inadequate packing is legitimate cause for negative feedback on a transaction.

When this happens to you: Write to the seller and politely inform them that the item arrived smashed to bits due to their poor packing, and you expect a 100% refund with no further hassles or you are going to leave scathingly negative feedback. They will probably reply "oh I didn't know!" and the correct response to that is, "you're selling in a public forum, you're OBLIGATED to know, or have it professionally packed."

After you get the refund, leave "neutral" feedback, rating the seller high on all counts except whatever the one is that has to do with shipping. Rate that one zero, and in the little box for obligatory verbiage, write in something like this: "Item inadequately packed, arrived smashed to bits."

That's called "teaching them a lesson" and over time if enough of us to it, sellers will learn.

This happened to me twice, both instances being from Australia, which, being halfway around the world from the US, does not make for a gentle ride but is all the more reason to require proper packing.

One was a 232 with integral bellset, where the bellset was smashed along the right bottom edge. Fortunately all the bits of bakelite were rattling around in the box, so it could all be fixed via the "acrylic repair method" (below), and you truly can't tell it was ever damaged unless you look closely at the specific area.

The other was an HES 2+10, of the 332 era, that arrived with the left side completely smashed out. Once again all the pieces were in the packing. However, this was the *gray* version, rare as can be, and light enough in color that the acrylic repair still shows a hairline if one looks carefully.

Your red 706 can be repaired and the repair probably will be barely visible or entirely invisible. Thusly:

The acrylic repair method:

Take the housing off the phone, and remove the dial number ring and its circular metal retaining clip on the inside of the housing Clean the housing by wiping *away from* the break in each direction, using Windex or similar ammonia-based window/glass cleaner on a clean soft rag. Do this on the inside of the housing as well as on the outside. You want to be careful to avoid getting the Windex inside the crack itself because it will bring just a tiny bit of dirt along with it, that will get into the irregularities of the crack, and make the crack more visible. Then rinse under clean water, over the entire surface, and it's not a problem if this water gets into the crack. Let the housing dry completely, overnight. (Not in a heated area: at room temperature.)

Next, get a bunch of tubes of Krazy Glue, the original version that is a very thin liquid with low viscosity.

Lay out a few thicknesses of newspaper over your work area, and then two thicknesses of clean white un-lined office paper in the area where the housing will be set down during repair. Do the rest of this under bright light. I have a lamp with a circular fluorescent lamp around a magnifying glass, and I use that for this purpose. However bright light alone should be sufficient to let most people see what they're doing.

Next, practice fit the cracked material together, taking care to see that all the little weird variable areas along the crack mesh together properly.

Now open one of the tubes of Krazy Glue by piercing the top of the tube with the little tack or pin that's provided. The glue is an acrylic plastic material (don't get too close when working with it, it has a sharp smell and may make your eyes burn a little) that is rapid setting. It flows nicely into cracks and it sets extremely quickly, so you'll have to work fast.

Use gentle hand pressure to spread the crack open a little bit. Working from the inside of the housing, apply the Krazy Glue liberally. If the crack doesn't go all the way through such as to be an open break, gently but quickly wiggle the plastic to ensure the glue flows all the way into the far reaches of the crack. In any case, once the crack has been liberally coated with Krazy Glue along its mating surfaces, quickly bring the two halves of the crack together, and *press* them together firmly and steadily. In your case you are seeking to press in a front-to-back direction, not putting pressure on the sides of the housing. Hold that position for 1 - 2 minutes to let the stuff harden. Then put the housing down on the white paper and leave it sit overnight.

The next day: Take a tube of Krazy Glue and apply a layer on the interior side of the housing over the cracked area, to fill in any areas that may be chipped on the inside. Do the same on the outside of the housing, and here it's OK if the bead of Krazy Glue ends up higher than the rest of the plastic. When done, lay the housing down such that the bead of Krazy Glue on the outside is facing up but tilted slightly toward the bottom. It will be necessary to find small random objects to prop up the housing in a stable manner in that position: do this in advance as a "dry run" before doing it with the housing freshly treated with acrylic.

Then go away overnight again to give the stuff more than enough time to harden and dry.

Then repeat the surface treatment the following day, and the day after, until what you have is a bead of Krazy Glue that's consistently just a tiny bit higher than the plastic itself.

Once that's completely hard and dry, it's time to file it down to flush with the plastic.

Use a *metal* file that has a fine filing surface. Look very carefully and you will see how to hold the file such that it can shave off the hardened Krazy Glue on the outside of the housing, without biting into the original plastic. When filing, start with the area furthest from any edge of the plastic, and work back toward the edges (in your case, the dial hole and the bottom left edge respectively.

Using the file gently and carefully, you'll end up filing off all of the excess bead of acrylic until you have a completely flush surface.

After that, take the housing to the kitchen and clean the rest of the housing, using Windex on a clean rag, or using a dedicated toothbrush and dish detergent & water.

You may want to try sanding the area around the crack using the finest sandpaper you can find (e.g. 600 grit). Just sand lightly to ensure that the surface is flush.

Follow that up by buffing the entire housing using a buffing wheel on slow to medium speed, with coarse buffing compound; and then repeat using fine buffing compound (the stuff I have is black and white respectively). The goal here is to get the whole thing to a high shine. The buffing process will make the whole thing totally flush and seamless around the area of the crack. The high shine will also reflect light in a manner that makes the repair even less visible.

If done right, this will make most types of cracks utterly invisible and as good as new. It works best on black housings, and dark colors generally better than light colors. Red is kinda' in the middle, so it should be satisfactory (I've done it with green as well). Deep scratches can also be brought up to level with the acrylic method, and those should look completely new when done (I have a white AE 80 with a small area that has a moderately deep scratch, we'll see how that comes out).

One of these days I'll post some pictures. I have a blueish-greenish Tesla with a bottom edge that got a minor chunk missing during shipping (unavoidable, box was well packed, Tesla housings are thin), so we'll see what happens with that one.

If you try this, let us know how it comes out. 706s are made of a good, tough, thick plastic, so this is likely to succeed. And of course take appropriate care when reassembling the set, including removing the dial fingerwheel first. (I presume you know the method for using a small thin screwdriver through the slot under the fingerwheel, to eject the center plastic disc; otherwise a suction cup applied from the front will do it, thereby providing access to the screw in the center of the fingerwheel.)

Thanks for the comprehensive guide, GG. I'm negotiating with the seller (who has offered a full refund, including return postage) to see if we can't work a fair price out and I keep the phone, and get to work on the repair.

Ebay is now closing in on 15 years old if not older. There is exactly no excuse at this point for poor packing, and I don't care if the seller just got started, they should be obligated to understand what secure packing means. Ebay needs to have it in their terms of service, that if sellers are not familiar with proper packaging methods, they are obligated to have items professionally packed for shipping, and further, that inadequate packing is legitimate cause for negative feedback on a transaction.

When this happens to you: Write to the seller and politely inform them that the item arrived smashed to bits due to their poor packing, and you expect a 100% refund with no further hassles or you are going to leave scathingly negative feedback. They will probably reply "oh I didn't know!" and the correct response to that is, "you're selling in a public forum, you're OBLIGATED to know, or have it professionally packed."

After you get the refund, leave "neutral" feedback, rating the seller high on all counts except whatever the one is that has to do with shipping. Rate that one zero, and in the little box for obligatory verbiage, write in something like this: "Item inadequately packed, arrived smashed to bits."

That's called "teaching them a lesson" and over time if enough of us to it, sellers will learn.

Hi GG,I don't fully agree with this approach. I was with you until the mention of threatening to leave "scathingly negative feedback" if the situation is not resolved with no further hassles. This is the initial contact to the seller, and IMHO, threatening the seller at this point with negative FB if this is not resolved to your satisfaction is not going to help matters. Doing so may cause you more grief in the process than it is worth. Coming on as strong as you suggest will likely put the seller on the defensive, or perhaps more correctly, on the offensive.

In my experience, (I have received one smashed ebay phone and one damaged phone related item so far - both had packing issues) I have found that it is better to first give the seller a chance to make it right, without my making threats. If the seller is an honest person, let them prove that before making threats.

I had a seller send me a check for a complete refund for a damaged calculagraph, and she told me to keep the calculagraph. I had only advised the seller of the damage as I felt she could benefit from the FB so she would perhaps pack items better in the future. I said that I believed I could repair it, and I never requested, or suggested that a refund was due. One of the levers broke off in shipping because it was in contact with the box and the screw sheared when the box was hit in transit. I managed to get the broken stub out, and obtained a replacement screw from a local specialty fastener shop. I voided her check and mailed it back with a note thanking her, and explaining that I could not accept the refund in good conscience. I felt that it was the right thing to do.

The smashed phone was resolved by the seller with no problem. I offered to return the broken phone, but he advised me to keep it. Both sellers were truly "class acts" and I respect them very much for that.

I left both sellers positive FB. Why diss them when they did what was the right thing to do?

The phone is a darker red than the pics might suggest. I have no intention to leave the seller any negative FB. She seems honest enough, and while the packing was lacking I don't think she meant any harm. I would think she has learned from this.And, as Dave so truly said, we have to expect some breakages. The only irony for me is that I've received phones from the other side of the Atlantic with not a bit of damage. This 706 came from less than 30 miles away :-\

I also agree on giving the seller a chance to make it right. Soertimes breakage happens even with well packed items. My wife and I have been selling on Ebay for a few years now. We have a 100% positive feedback rating and solid 5 stars in our Detailed Seller Ratings. It has taken a lot of time and effort to get there. I have packed and shipped many fragile items, such as Lladro porcelain, crystal and even Dresden lace all over the world. My feedback is full of praise on great packing. I recently shipped a Ron Lee clown figurine that arrived broken. I packed it with bubble wrap and air pillows and I still do not understand how it could have broken. I gave the buyer a complete refund including return shipping. Should this buyer give me neutral feeback and a zero star? That would ruin our perfect ratings. The DSR's and feedback are more than just numbers, they determine how much we pay on Ebay and also how high our items go on searches so they are invaluable to sellers. I asked the buyer if he could not leave positive feedback and 5 stars to not leave any feedback. So far he has complied. I have received broken items also and the sellers were honest and made things right, I left them positive feedback.

Harry.....I totally agree. Being a seller and well as a buyer on eBay; I can view it from both sides. We strive to be honest and fair. Great Packing is always part of the feedback we receive (Janet is the Queen of packing), BUT things still do get broken in shipment. We always offer a full refund plus shipping. Part of doing business and eBay is a business.

Remember, the seller is just as upset its broken as you are. All the work to find, list, sell, invoice, box, ship is now a total loss and we are out money. Yes, there are sellers that do not take the time to pack properly. The majority are like Harry and his wife and me and my wife, trying run run a small business as a second job. It ain't easy my friends...Doug

Tom...you got the sh*t end of the stick on this transaction! You are always a true gentleman. I hope you get it repaired to look as new. This was very unfortunate for you, but you reacted with class.....Doug

But look at this combination of factors on EBay: sellers who are feigning IQs below room temperature with beyond-credible bad spelling ("dile"), sellers blatantly disguising flawed goods via "clever" photography disguised as amateurish photography, and then also some truly crappy packaging that doesn't even prevent objects sliding around and rattling audibly in the box. At some point there needs to be at least a minimum standard for "doing business."

Ebay isn't a social forum: it's a marketplace first, and occasionally you meet cool people. Places like this are social forums: Social first and a bit of trading on the sidelines (Erik I haven't forgotten your AE speakerphone).

Sure, I cut people plenty of slack when they appear to be operating in good faith. I might have mentioned a blueish-greenish Tesla phone recently: it arrived with damage to the front right corner of the housing. But it was reasonably well packed, maybe not quite as ferociously well packed as it might have been, but within reason anyway. I don't have a problem with that kind of accident, and I'm not going to hold that against the seller. In fact I did business with them again.

On the other hand, a few wads of crumpled-up newspaper in a weak cardboard box, that's a different matter. The limit is smashed goods due to truly beyond belief negligently bad packing. Negligence is not excusable any more than when someone causes a fender bender: there is a standard for safe driving, and it's enforced by insurance rates as much as by the police. There needs to be an enforced standard for safe business practices in vast many-to-many markets.

FYI, the way I run my moral/ethical system in general, goes like this: There's "good," there's a large gray zone, and there's "bad," and then there's "truly evil." The gray zone goes sufficiently over the line from "good," that there's wide latitude to forgive, right up to the point where something is truly egregious. If something is questionable, or excusable, or there's a plausible explanation, or someone made a reasonable effort, I'm more likely to urge forgiveness. But when something is way way over the line, past any reasonable question, excuse, explanation, or reasonableness, then I tend to favor the harsh treatment as a deterrent to others. (And when something is in the "truly evil" category, such as remorseless murder for hire, organized child abuse, or wrecking the economy for speculative gain, then as far as I'm concerned that's where life in prison without parole comes in: lock them up and throw away the key.)

So as that applies to online selling, if something is in the broad gray zone of reasonable or excusable, it gets excused. If it's way over the line to the point of willful negligence, it deserves a penalty.

Just received a GPO 713, came in a slender box with a layer of foam padding sandwiched over it, naturally the seller left the handset on the hook, and there was a 1.5cm x 1cm chunk chipped out, I searched the box but it wasn't there, then got angry the seller hadn't told me it was damaged.

Of it wasn't damaged when he "packed" it, and the bit is inside the case, thankfully in one piece, and has a perfect match to the hole, so superglue ahoy, its such a tidy fit you can't see the join much.

Superglue repairs can be made effectively invisible after a repair like that, by this method: Trace around the edge of the replaced chunk with a line of superglue so it's just a little bit high around the break line, let it harden overnight. Then use a fine file (not sandpaper) to file down the line so it's flush with the original plastic. Then buff to high gloss. The normal reflections of light off the buffed housing will render the repaired crack difficult to impossible to see.

I recently received a Philips type 43 Monophone (Canadian AE) with GPO slipping-cam dial, that was packed so loosely it slid around in the box. Fortunately no damage. Gave the seller high marks all'round but noted in comment that packing needed to be better. IMHO that's a legit way to deal with feedback in those cases.

Just received a GPO 776 off-white, double-boxed and packed so well that it would have survived a drop out of an airplane. I'll be giving that seller major praise in comments for doing it right.

The thing about bad packing that's so maddening is that it's a "stupid" mistake, one that can be remedied by just *thinking* and putting a *little more effort* into it. Damage caused by stupidity is more frustrating than damage caused by "natural causes" such as "got run over by the Parcels truck."

Doug: I don't have pictures of in-process repairs yet, but once I get my workbench cleaned off enough (this weekend) that I can take pictures without being embarrassed by the pile, I'll start doing so. I have a bunch of these to take pictures of. More to be said about that in a dedicated topic I'll start for that purpose, rather than digressing this topic further.

Here's my latest experience with bad packing. I bought what appeared to be a great Century Telephone Construction Co. wood wall phone that I was going to restore. No apparent damage when I purchased it - of course I asked the seller to package properly, etc.... Arrived in a cheap, flimsy cardboard box, which wasn't too bad. he pushed the transmitter arm all the way up so it rested on the front wood panel between the bells, no padding. He removed the screw holding the generator in place, and left it unpadded in it's compartment. All the other loose parts, receiver, mouthpiece, bolts, etc. he placed in the top compartment, unpadded. The front door now has a 1/8" deep gouge about 3" long under the bells, the inside of the door has deep gouging from the generator bouncing around, the inside of the generator compartment is damaged, with one wire pulled out. The coil that was in the top compartment was knocked completely off its mount, removing all 4 wires, plus more scratching. I was heartbroken when I saw the damage. What do you do in a case like this. Not worth the postage to send it back. A wonderful turn of the century phone that survived over a 100 years, now damaged.

You have my sympathies. It never ceases to amaze me how stupidly some people pack items, and this case is one of the worst. If this was an ebay purchase, I would send a message to the seller explaining (politely) that the packing instructions were not properly followed, describing the resultant damage, and asking for a partial refund. If the seller has any sense, he/she will realize that it would be in their best interest to refund some of most of your money. If they refuse, you can hint about bringing the issue to ebay for resolution. I did this when my smashed GPO 300 arrived, and I got back most of my money.

Not able to work anything out with the seller. I thought EBay only offered full refunds if you ship the item back - how did you negotiate a partial refund? He brags in his ad about being a member of ATCA & TCI. You would think that anyone who has been around these old phones would know how to pack one for shipping.

I have had various experiences, but I always started by politely informing the seller that the item arrived damaged because the handset was left in the cradle, the phone was crushed because there was insufficient padding, etc. and waited to see what the seller would offer. In some cases, they immediately offered a complete of partial refund. In other cases, I hinted that I might have to contact ebay for a resolution. In the case of the smashed GPO phone, they wanted me to ship the phone back, apparently at their expense, but I replied that repacking and shipping the phone would be alot of trouble for me, and I asked for a refund of a bit less than the amount which they would be out anyway. The person corresponding with me said that her employer does not do that, but she would ask the boss the next morning, and later that day I suddenly had a partial refund from paypal. Ebay sellers do not usually want to risk building a bad reputation if they plan to continue selling.

I find it astounding that a member of ATCA and TCI would pack a phone that way. Perhaps he had and assistant, like his son or daughter, pack it for him, and they did a sloppy job. I bought a phone once on ebay from a nearby seller, and I emailed him repeatedly for almost a week asking when I could pick it up, receiving only one brief reply telling me to pay for it first. Several days after I paid for it, I received a phone call from the seller who apologized that his son was supposed to have handled giving me the phone but was ignoring his messages. He told me that he yelled at his son and told me that I could come and get the phone whenever I wished.

Even though I PACK ITEMS with the utmost CARE I can not be RESPONSIBLE for what happens after the ITEM LEAVES my BUSINESS.

Technically, yes, he can be and he is. It's in the eBay seller regulations. It's the seller's responsibility to make sure the item reaches the buyer as described, whether or not shipping insurance is purchased. eBay made that perfectly clear when they revised their selling options to no longer make shipping insurance an option for the buyer; it is now at the option of the seller, but they're responsible either way.

The seller on eBay is REQUIRED to insure your package to your door. It IS the sellers responsibility. All my actions include insurance in the shipping quote, NO EXCEPTIONS!This way I am covered after my package falls into the hands of the carrier.

There is no insurance against woeful packing. This seller sells phones on eBay every week. What was his reasoning for unscrewing the magneto?

I notice the sellers with the least experience have extremely bad packing habits. This seller has had 100 transactions. I instructed the seller twice on how to pack heavy items such as magnetos with a fragile ost reciever. They did not follow the advice and so the reciever hook was splayed thru the cardboard and the winder was bent out of shape. Somehow the receiver was undamaged. Item was $88 and shipping $30, the actual post office charge was $22, so they could have spent $8 dollars on a bigger box and large bubble bubble wrap. So beware of newer Ebayers.

I recieved a deluxe chrome edition AE40 in the mail today and even though it was packed with care it still arrived with the entire front end smashed in! It's unfortunate because this phone WAS in great shape, now its parts. On another note, the dial makes a ratchet sound when it dials. Didn't the AE34's do this as well?

The ratcheting sound indicates you have one of the early editions Type 24 dials. Rumor has it that complaints from customers caused AE to redesign the dial to eliminate that sound. I prefer the sounds: it seems to indicate the phone is doing "some work" when dialing. ;D ;D ;D

Two in a row for me . Whats wrong with these Ebay sellers ... this one has had 500 sales . When i saw the box i knew it was too small ... when i picked it up the phone moved within the box ... not a good sign. On opening there was one layer of small bubble pack on the reciever and housing. I am sure everyone knows where it broke and how.

My heartfelt sympathies to you, NorthernMan. I haven't bought as much off eBay this year, but I've noticed that alot of sellers seem to be packing their items out of the recycle bin. Most of the items sent to me since January have been in reused boxes with crumpled newspapers sporadically placed around & over the item, and they never use enough or place any under the item --they just set the item right on the bottom of the box. I almost never see bubble wrap anymore, and I've noticed that some boxes aren't taped very well. I know times are tough, but, seriously, packing an item well makes more sense to me than buying insurance. It actually is a kind of insurance.

Since we're discussing this, I should mention that there are sellers who routinely sell phones & intimately know how to pack them. I recently received a phone from Doug Rose, & it was not only well packed, but the shipping was cheaper than some of the badly packed items that were sent to me.

I've posted this here before, but if it helps someone, here it is again. I send this text to every eBay auction that I win when I pay for the item:

-------------------

IMPORTANT! PLEASE READ! When you box up this phone for shipment, please DO NOT pack the phone up with its receiver sitting on the phone's cradle. The receiver will knock into the body of the phone during shipment and it is GUARANTEED that the phone will be received broken into several pieces. PLEASE wrap the receiver of the phone separately. Thank you.

-------------------

Perhaps I've been lucky, but since I've been sending these simple instructions, I haven't received a broken phone.

Since we're discussing this, I should mention that there are sellers who routinely sell phones & intimately know how to pack them. I recently received a phone from Doug Rose, & it was not only well packed, but the shipping was cheaper than some of the badly packed items that were sent to me

.

Thanks for the kind words Stephen, but I can take 0% credit on packing. The lovely Janet does the thankless job of packing. She thinks any idiot can do it, but I tell her it is just the opposite. She does a first class job! I can't wait to see the pictures...Doug

I bought a Galion recently of eBay (photos in "Collector's Corner" thread) that was shipped with and interesting idea of packing. It was placed in a box then the box was half-filled with packing peanuts. That's it. Nothing else. When I paid for the item I put a note that said "please pack so that the handset cannot bang into the base of the phone". Obviously that didn't help.

The bigger problem (though the above exacerbated the damage) was that the ringer was not screwed to the base, so it was loose inside! These photos show the result. Really annoying, as the ringer was a straight-line ringer. Something as simple as stuffing some paper towels inside woul have prevented this -- better still install two, even one, screw to hold down the ringer! But the ringer and the coil are useless now (unless maybe somehow I can rewind the ringer bobbin -- doubtful). Miraculously though, the Bakelite is intact. There is some damage to the handset caps, but it looks to be old damage. I don't think it happened in shipping. The missing pieces weren't in the box.

The seller and I went back & forth and eventually reached an agreement whereby I get enough of a partial refund to keep the phone (I didn't pay much to begin with). I've got an inductor on order with Adele (which the seller's refund to me covered).

Is the only damage in the back? If this is a good displayable phone, maybe you might reconsider and keep it. Want to post the auction so we can look at the phone. When displayed, it is the back. Lets see what it looks like. Is it cost effective to keep it over giving away $35...Doug

This may be a silly question, but why should the buyer have to pay for shipping when the seller was at fault for improper packing? If the seller was explicitly instructed to keep the handset off of the shell, and he/she disregarded the instructions, in my opinion, they have shipped an item other than what was purchased, so the buyer should not be liable. It should not be much different than the seller having shipped a different phone (or something else entirely) than what was purchased.

I have made references to such an argument on an occasion or two when I received a damaged phone which was packed contrary to the way I requested.

When buying, I send a note saying "Extra good feedback given for proper packing" and describing the basics: bubble wrap handset & base separately, use a strong cardboard box with lots of stuffing.

Then for phones received well-packed, giving extra credit in the feedback notes, and for those received poorly-packed, saying as much even if leaving positive feedback.

Worst-packed recently: Red RWT Elektrim desk set from Poland, that looks almost identical to a German type 611 set, and interestingly had a USA alphanumeric dial that was produced in Poland. Missing its line cord (no big deal). Packed in a box with a few handfuls of newspaper and that's all, and was rattling around when I got it. Miraculously it didn't suffer any damage. However, seller still got the "poorly packed" note in their feedback comments.

If enough of us start doing this as standard practice, sellers will get up to speed on packing.

paul-f , I called and told the shipper what happened and I told him that it wasn't a total loss. I said that I could still use the parts and would just fix it . I said that half the price would make me happy . Just checked and they gave me a full refund. :o Very NICE people!!!! ;D It was packed very well, turns out to be weak spring inside phone housing letting the handset move every time it was thrown!! stub

If the seller simply put the handset inside that yellow metal holder and expected it to survive the trip, then it's bad packing. That handset should have been wrapped separately and packed outside the enclosure, if it was too large to fit inside with bubble wrap around it. The door can also be propped open a little, so the cord isn't severed. A phone should always be packed to survive being thrown around, although a bumpy ride in a mail truck could have done that.

You're lucky it only broke in one place, and that you have a decent seller who admits their blame.

Ouchie! Fortunately those handsets are fairly common so it shouldn't be terribly hard to replace.

They are hard to find for a reasonable price as long as I've been looking for one.

You need to look in less obvious places. I just got this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290617564589 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290617564589) today (for $22.50 with shipping). The Kellogg phone shell is in bad shape (and made worse by bad packing), but the AE handset is pretty good.

Well after about 20 successful transactions on ebay finally got my first broken phone due to packing mistakes. Seller simply sat phone in box and stuffed newspaper around it. Handset was on phone and post office obviously dropped it on its side a bit hard and this is what happened. Good thing it was only a 59 Ivory. Hopefully seller will refund but I doubt it. Think we should start a category for biggest packing blunders? LOL

It took less time for me to get a damaged phone. My very first phone arrived damaged. This was about 1999 or 2000, when eBay was more like a community of people and the seller was very understanding and refunded half my cost. I glued it back together and gave it to my niece and she still has it.

It's happened more times than I can count since then and you just chalk it up to the risk of doing business with someone you don't know. I also send packing instructions most of the time. I try to keep it short and say "please wrap the handset separately from the base of the phone" and "please make sure there is plenty of packing in the box, so the phone doesn't move when you shake the box."

I also got a light gray 500 WY motel phone packed poorly and cracked in exactly the same place as your phone. See this link for a picture.

Well the lady was very nice and she did refund half the cost and I kept the phone so maybe I can repair it if not it is a '59 through and through so maybe I can find a matching cover for it. If that had been a gray I would have been a little more upset. Thanks for the advice I will be sure to mention packing instructions to the sellers from now on.

After getting about 100 phones undamaged (quite a run of good luck) the seller of this phone tightly wrapped the base with bubble pack. That forced the cradle down to the support. When wrapped in bubble pack, the bundle was 6 inches high. The box they used to ship the phone was 6 inches high. The result, half the cradle broke off. However, it didn't take much to break it because the cradle had already been broken and glued back together with a weak glue, which the seller did not disclose in the eBay listing. Seller refunded shipping costs. Why didn't they use a 10 inch high box? Who knows. The yellow item laying on top of the box extending over the phone in the picture is a yardstick showing the box height they used and the phone without bubble wrap in the cradle up, off hook, position. And, yes, I did ask the seller to carefully pack the phone.

Ouchie! Though, it appears that was originally a white phone that got a "sun tan," and I'd guess that white components are reasonably easy to find.

What I tell sellers: "These are more fragile than they appear; I give extra-good feedback for good packing & shipping. Please wrap receiver and base unit each separately in bubble-wrap and use a strong corrugated cardboard box stuffed with enough packing that nothing moves when you shake it. Thanks (signed)."

Then in feedback I'll say something like "A+ for proper packing..." etc., so other folks here can find it if they check feedback.

So far this seems to have worked. For example a GPO 722 Trimphone that came packed as if it was a 332, which is almost humorous, but certainly better to open the box and laugh rather than cry.

The big shipping disaster in my life was the PMG Australia HES-2 (same as GPO HES-2, 2 line + 10 station) in GRAY bakelite that was packed loosely with newspaper and arrived with one side of the housing smashed out. My repair on that is "pretty good" but still visible in places, so, "boo hoo (cussword!) hoo" for that one, and God Knows when another of those will ever come along.

TelePlay, IMHO you were the victim of a misleading listing, and if I were you I'd demand a full refund, and even after you get it, note the misleading listing in your feedback. For example, "listing failed to disclose obvious damage & shoddy repair, item poorly packed, arrived smashed, price refunded." (or ...."seller refused to refund.") People should *not* be allowed to get away with those kinds of shoddy practices, particularly if they use all kinds of flowery language in their listings.

Received a 302 in a Styrofoam box with hardly any material protecting the phone inside the box.

Fortunately, the Bakelite handset was on the opposite side of the hole in the box and fortunately, again, the missing corner was at the front right corner of the metal shelled 302. Could poke my finger through the hole and touch the phone, and move it around.

Fortunately, no damage to either the handset or the phone. Had it been thermoplastic, that front right corner may have been damaged.

Sent the seller a message telling him of this issue and suggested a better way to pack phones for shipment. And, yes, I did ask the seller to wrap the handset and phone separately, not ship the handset on top of the phone and to make sure the phone and handset could not move around in the box in the payment message area.

Last summer I received a Perfect North Galion wrapped in what appeared to be.......... Saran Wrap. No Sh*t.....Saran Wrap. Looked like seller wound a whole roll of it around the phone with the handset firmly wrapped in the cradle. Just as I asked them not to do.

Yes....I had emailed the seller in advance how I would appreciate the phone wrapped. I questioned them on it and the response was , no sh*t, " I thought this was better."

Well, he was right. It came perfect with no damage. I couldn't wait for Janet to come home, as I has to unwrap it to see if it was alright. I could not unwrap it, so I had to cut it with a knife and scissors. I showed her the shell of the Saran Wrap, I still don't think she believes me.....Doug

I have received at least a few phones wrapped that way after I explicitly asked that the handset be kept away from the phone. It is at least better that leaving the handset to move freely and smash into the phone. About a week ago, I received a D1/F1 and 684 subset with tenite cover with the phone base on top of the subset, with one thin layer of bubble wrap between them, and the handset in the cradle, with the whole set held together with bubble wrap and tape. I held my breath until everything was separated. I did not notice any damage, but I will never know how much paint or bakelite was scraped during shipment.

I bought a Galion off eBay and I also left a note asking that the handset be wrapped to prevent it banging into the phone body. When it arrived, I saw the seller had placed the handset on the phone, set the phone in a box half-full of foam peanuts, and taped the box shut. That there was no external* damage to the phone still amazes me. I wrote the seller and the reply was, "Oh, sorry. Didn't notice your note."

*Unfortunately there was internal damage because the straightline(!) ringer was not attached to the baseplate and both the ringer and coil were destroyed.

Doug, that was no box. That was a sarcophagus. As in mummy wrapping. You should've taken a picture of that one. Sounds like a phone cocoon.

To those who send instructions with their payment, I find that sellers usually ignore anything that comes with the payment. What works for me is an email through eBay sent BEFORE the payment and after the auction ends. The best sellers respond that they will pack it like I ask. And then there are some who think they always know better than we do, like Mr. Handi Wrap.

I just reread my post, just to be clear THERE WAS NO BOX, just Saran Wrap and a shipping label...Doug

Unfreakingbelievable! :o

After countless bad shipping experiences I no longer bother to e-mail sellers and tell them how to pack, no one seemed to listen. I just get what I get it seems, and usually they are okay and sometimes not. Never seen anyone do totally moronic stuff like wrap it Saran Wrap and label it and mail it, or even this styrofoam cooler of death shipping box. Geesh. What are people thinking, that these phones are made from solid steel and are unbreakable?

Just when you thought you heard it all........Can we have an EBAY seller moron of the year award? Here is my latest EBAY shipping story: I always send an email after payment explaining that I paid for my purchase and that the phone although sturdy is quite delicate. The obligatory please do not hang up the phone and ship that way but to wrap the receiver separate from the body was added. The seller responded "no problem and thanks for the heads up". I got a request from seller through paypal a day or so later stating that the seller wanted an additional $12.00 for additional packing. I never received this before and I was confused so I just chose to ignore it until the phone arrived. Guess what? Two boxed arrived >:(. The seller took my note to heart and cut the receiver off the phone with scissors and mailed the receiver in a different box. Anyone have a red 500 receiver cord they are not needing?

260924083398 An ITI (Indian Telephone Industries) wall phone, one of the more interesting shapes of wall phones I've ever seen (vaguely reminiscent of Australia PMG 800-series) and in a nice bright yellow that goes well with retro kitchen colors.

Seller says "Packaging - Phone will be wrapped in a generous amount of bubble wrap and then packed in a thick corrugated box, the corrugated box will be given a layer of thick thermocol on all sides for additional protection and then buffered with peanuts, hay or grass to secure the movement of the phone during transit."

While I've never heard of hay or grass being used as packing material, it's probably perfectly OK if enough of it is used.

I bought a dark red ITI desk phone from that seller (not the ITI version of the 706, but an indigenous ITI design that has no approximately similar version anywhere else) and sent them my usual message requesting proper shipment and saying I give extra good feedback for same. Phone arrived properly packed and in great shape, which I happily noted in feedback.

IMHO the key to getting sellers to take notice and do this right, is to let them know you give extra positive feedback for proper packing. Worked for me 9 times out of 10.

This even worked for a phone shipped from Russia, a somewhat-rare RWT Elektrim early 1960s model in ivory. (RWT Elektrim is Polish, consistently high quality and very interesting designs.) In the past every phone I've gotten from Russia had suffered damage one way or another, but this one came through intact and was in incredibly good condition. Is presently on the workbench getting the usual going-over (it was in such good shape to begin with, that it jumped to the head of my queue).

While I've never heard of hay or grass being used as packing material, it's probably perfectly OK if enough of it is used.

I'm sure it would protect the contents, but I'd advise anyone receiving such a package to burn the all hay or grass. Packing material is one way invasive weeds get spread. In my area we're fighting microstegium (Japanese stilt grass) that was accidentally introduced ca. 1919 via packing material.

Yes it was, and stuck in the battery compartment. The guy wrapped the phone in several layers of foam padding, and even taped a piece of plastic over the diagram to protect it. He removed the hook, which I hadn't requested, and left the magneto handle on, which got bent. I suppose he tried. I will have to chalk it up to doing business with a guy who knows absolutely nothing about phones. If he had, I'm sure he would have mentioned the OST and transmitter in his post, and I would have had more competition. As it is, the "Antique Wall Phone" auction had no other bidders when it ended at 9am EST on a Monday morning. It had been listed at $175, and I had meant to bid on it, but forgot to. That auction ended with no bidders and was relisted at the lower price. I made certain I bid the second time around.

I was wondering where the hook was. Even with the broken receiver, you obviously got quite a deal.

What makes people think that a couple of layers of newspaper protects anything fragile? I should start being more specific in my packing instructions about what constitutes padding and what does not. I have received phones with the handsets or receivers wrapped in a couple of layers of paper when I asked that they be wrapped and padded.

When packing Vintage phones-that's like the 1st and foremost do's and don't you learn right out of "diaper training" lol I even get the padded envelopes from the USPS store online and I put my phone in one of the padded envelopes and the receiver in the other padded envelopes-I seal both of them up-then I put one of the padded envelopes on the bottom & use bubble wrap in all 4 corners of the box and something strong down the middle to keep them separated and then pack it down with newspaper for the travel. I have excellent reviews on my packaging technique so far no complaints & cross my fingers-no broken phones. I am new at this, so any suggestions-please I'm open for any. :0) That was just ridiculous, so sorry Sargeguy about your mishap. :( But you could get a refund thru eBay so you don't have to pack everything back up if I'm not wrong. So sorry that really bites. UGH :0)

I think you should at least minimum ask the guy for a few dollars back. For the simple reason to make sure he pays attention better next time. The best way to get an ebay sellers attention is through their wallet. You sound like a more than fair guy but do the next 100 buyers a favor and teach the guy a $20 lesson. I'm a full time ebay seller and would not be able to improve if I didnt get feedback from my buyers. Yes I have had a mishap or two but made them right and paid a lot closer attention the next time. Good luck.

I have the same type of experience with ebay items broken. Most of it is poor packing. Like not securing heavy items that can move and bash against other stuff. I received a ring type cabon mic thathe ring is in several pieces because of the heavy element moving around on its springs. I think the whole thing shifted to one side of the box. Also be aware that the cold weather causes old metals and hard bakelites to become extra brittle.

I got a wall phone recently in a box.... with NO PACKING MATERIALS. Nothing. Just banging around against the receiver the whole way here. I was so mad.

You mean like this? By some miracle this 554, which was hard plastic, wasn't damaged. Amazing, both for the stupidity of the seller and that it arrived without damage. I've posted it before, but the new guys haven't seen it.

Funny you should say that. I bought a 3' round telephone sign, I think it might have gone to a phone booth. One of the opaque signs that's back lit. The seller wrapped it a couple times with clear shrink wrap and put a UPS label on it and shipped it. Can't believe it arrived in one piece.

You mean like this? By some miracle this 554, which was hard plastic, wasn't damaged. Amazing, both for the stupidity of the seller and that it arrived without damage. I've posted it before, but the new guys haven't seen it.

Almost. The box for mine was much wider. Lots of extra room! Im fairly certain it would have safer if she really HAD just stuck some postage on the phone.

And on the flip-side, I just sent a wall phone, wrapped in inches of bubble wrap to canada, where it showed up cracked, with the whole plastic facing popped off, and the plug shredded and destroyed. Im talking, large bubble wrap, paper filler...etc... That thing should have been able to sustain a drop kick.

Here's a fresh Ebay purchase that arrived today. A '55 Moss Green 500 for $10.50 plus shipping. Its all date-code original except for the '67 handset cord. When I saw it on the porch, I immediately thought oh no, that box is just too small for a phone. :o Sure enough, it was an interference fit and you can see also the indentations on the box top from the cradle ears. What you see is what I saw when I opened the box - not even a single piece of newspaper! I'm not sure who I should thank more, Western Electric or the USPS, but the phone was undamaged by the trip across the country. It should clean up nicely. Fortunately, a good story with a happy ending. :)

Wow! What a great deal on a soft plastic phone! And what a lousy packing job! Reminds me of the yellow 554 I've posted several times, that came in a thin, oblong Priority box with the metal switchhook pierced through the side of the box, holding the phone so it somehow didn't come in contact with the handset at the bottom of the box. Mine arrived safely too, and with no packing material.

I've had plenty of phones packed better than this one that didn't arrive safely, so you are very, very lucky. There's still time for you to post this in the May find of the month too. You even got the rare dark gray mounting cord. That was a great find. The cord alone costs more than that, so even if you got a box of broken plastic, you still would have gotten a deal.

Great buy, Paul! As Jonathan said, that gray cord alone is worth much more than $10. That will be a nice phone for your collection. You did get lucky with that wonderful packing job. What are people thinking when they ship something like that?

Great buy, Paul! As Jonathan said, that gray cord alone is worth much more than $10. That will be a nice phone for your collection. You did get lucky with that wonderful packing job. What are people thinking when they ship something like that?

Not only did you get an amazing deal, but the fact that the phone arrived without damage makes it even more amazing. It's a good thing that the box was not any wider, or the seller would have packed it with the handset in the cradle.

I'm working on it now, and I'll post a pic upon completion. I'm very happy about that gray line cord, and this is the first one I have with the two-piece cord restraint in the handset. My other Moss Green is a '57, and I do really like the color. Reminds me of TV shows like "I Dream of Jeannie" when I was a kid.

I watched a bunch of "That Girl" Episodes a few months back. In the early episodes EVERY phone was a moss green 500. Ann's phone (Marlo Thomas), her neighbours phone, phones in offices, all the same with big long matching set cords. And it wasn't that they only had ONE phone on the set. Her neighbour across the hall came over with her phone (thus the long cords I guess) and of course left with Ann's phone by mistake so they were getting each others calls!

In episodes from later years some other colors came along and Princess phones showed up.

I don't think the first season was a 1500 but now that you mention it I think her phone did turn into a green 1500 and then soon after she had a Princess phone in the bedroom and on and on it went. Poor strugling working girl living in New York City just after leaving home but she had the $$ for colored phones in every room of her apartment!

Ok, here a pic of the phone about finished. Bad light in the garage so the color doesn't look true. I also scored one of early 283B plugs without the "ears" on the line cord. Of course, the bad part is the "hen's teeth" status of the missing gray handset cord. I'm considering trying to make a straight one for it. My issue is finding the right thickness and flex in a dark gray cord. So far light gray is all I can find. I'm toying with the idea of trying some dye approaches to darken the cordage...

Jorge - Yes, I could connect it "F style" with 3 wires, but I think you're right about the thickness. With 4 wires, a handset cord would be a tad thicker. Question for you: the phone shell does have brown staining in some places (the flash picks one area up the pic below the letter "S" on the dial plate. Any thoughts on this? I'm guessing I can sand it out, but in normal light it looks fine. Tobacco? There aren't any bad smells, but Novus doesn't seem to remove them. Thanks!

Ok, here a pic of the phone about finished. Bad light in the garage so the color doesn't look true. I also scored one of early 283B plugs without the "ears" on the line cord. Of course, the bad part is the "hen's teeth" status of the missing gray handset cord. I'm considering trying to make a straight one for it. My issue is finding the right thickness and flex in a dark gray cord. So far light gray is all I can find. I'm toying with the idea of trying some dye approaches to darken the cordage...

Well at least the handset was placed on the side.I got a 2500 Yellow WE with handset on hook wrapped in bubble wrap with a crack on the right side where the receiver was, made apparently after the box was dropped by the Post Office. I did get my money back and got to keep the phone.

That is typical of what can happen when a phone is shipped with its handset in the cradle. As far a I am aware, the best way to fix it is to push the parts back into position from the inside of the shell as well as possible and then to apply super glue to the inside of the crack. Some sanding and polishing of the outside will probably be helpful.

You have my sympathies. Was the handset properly wrapped in bubble wrap or just left sitting in the phone hook? I tell people all of the time to wrap handsets and keep them away from the phones, and to many or most, the idea had never occurred.

Maybe packing the handset "on hook" is all that's left of years of programming to hang up the phone when not in use, listen for dial tone before dialing, and answer promptly even in the middle of supper.

The handset was wrapped in bubble wrap, as requested, and left on hook . The base was wrapped in one layer of bubble wrap and put in a 18" sg. box with 1 lb. of shredded newspaper ::). Anyway ,I had a extra handset so I'm back in business. stub

I always bubble wrap both the phone and the handset. The I individual wrap the in 2 cardboard. Then I separate both pieces with yet another piece of cardboard. And the ship that in a doulbe cardboard box hat I cut and tape to size. I'm equally stuburn with all I ship. Never had a problem so far. I fact most my feed back has a comment on how well the item was packed.

It's a pain to pack but at the end of the day it's worth it. With 3 supermarkets, 2 drugstore and a hardware store in the area I get packing supplies by the ton for free.

HowardPgh , The ring was bent and I fixed it, and the spitcut was good. People don't have a clue as to what happens when a package is shipped!!! stub

This is too true. I sold a comic book @ $500 and handed to my mail lady at the back of her truck. She scanned it in and frisbee tossed it into the back of the truck floor. I watch them drop packages in the yard and throw many of them into the truck. I'm surprised more items dont get damaged when packing them.

My Beehive phone arrived today. They stuffed the phone, crank side down, in a small box barely big enough to accommodate it, with no padding underneath it, only on one side, then put that box in another box, still crank side down, with wadded paper for padding. Sure, they wrapped the handset separately, but didn't follow my instructions to remove the crank. I had an awful feeling when I lifted up the inner box and tilted it and heard something rattling. Once I get done being upset, I'll be filing a claim with the shipper. I would call and scream at them, but it's the weekend.

Would be great if someone did a step by step way to correctly pack and ship every known phone in the world, including pictures or even a YouTube video, so a shipping link could be given to the seller in the comments section. But, that will never happen and even if it did, I know there are sellers out there who either wouldn't or don't care or still think they know better and do it their way.

It could be a project phone but will never be as strong as originally cast once repaired.

In this case, I talked to the shipper on the phone right after I won it, and sent instructions on removing the crank and wrapping the handset. It probably would have arrived intact had they not put it in the box crank side down.

I am awfully sorry to hear that. When I spoke with the woman at the auction house, she told me that she had spoken with you, and I mentioned to her and a woman at the shipping company that the phone you had bought was extremely fragile. I hope that you get a refund.

BTW, my AE 3, from the same auction, also arrived today. It looks like it survived even though it wasn't packed so well. The handset has two cracks, but they may have already been there.

That is a shame that it's been ruined, and it got more packaging material than my GPO 706 did (a light sprinkling of packing peanuts, and arrived with a scratch that wasn't in the pictures)... :-\

I think there should be a course people can go on to learn how to properly pack things for sale on ebay, it'd save them a bundle on refunds I'm sure, cos some people just do not know the meaning of the word "packaging".... :o

Today, I received the dark brown Ericofon which I bought more than couple of weeks ago: ebay link (http://www.ebay.com/itm/271020391620). The seller originally wanted $20 for shipping. before paying, I sent the seller a message explaining that Priority Mail would cost him only about $7, so I shouldn't have to pay $20. After three days, he responded, and I managed to negotiate the shipping charge down to $9. When I saw the box which finally arrived today, almost two weeks after I paid, my heart stopped. The phone, which is about 4" wide, was stuffed into a 2 1/2" high Priority Mail box :o. When I picked up the box, I heard loose things moving around inside it. I carefully opened the box, holding my breath and expecting the worst, but the phone emerged somehow undamaged. The loose plug and cord were making the sounds that I heard. I was able to start breathing again. I don't know if I should send a message to the seller or forget about it, but I just cannot begin to imagine what he was thinking.

That's another amazing one, Larry. It's nice to hear the ones that turn out well. It does make me nervous when I feel I've found a good deal. If I didn't pay a lot, the seller may not place the value on the the phone that I do. Reminds me of my M. Brown 500 I found BIN on Ebay a couple years back. The phone arrived with the handset on the cradle inside a white plastic grocery bag and then in a box with only a modest amount of packing. Fortunately the white bag was tied tightly so the handset couldn't move - it made it just fine. Glad yours did too!

Ebay does certainly have a "wild west" element to it, no matter how many rules they have in place!

If they had placed it on it's back instead of it's side, it may have survived the trip. I haven't examined the crank, but I have two Leich desk phones with presumably the same crank, and it would seem to me that it would take more than just the weight of the phone to actually bend the crank as much as it did.

Which reminds me, I need to give the auctioneer a call, haven't heard anything yet and they said they would contact me end of last week about a refund.

Would be great if someone did a step by step way to correctly pack and ship every known phone in the world, including pictures or even a YouTube video, so a shipping link could be given to the seller in the comments section. But, that will never happen and even if it did, I know there are sellers out there who either wouldn't or don't care or still think they know better and do it their way.

It could be a project phone but will never be as strong as originally cast once repaired.

That was really, really too bad. >:(

John;On the Antique Radio forum I belong to, we did exactly that, collectively wrote up a procedure to pack various types of radios and televisions. We emailed a copy to anyone that wanted it, and every time a purchase was made, we sent the email along with the payment.Didn't do much good but it was an idea.D/P

To finish the story on this '55 Moss Green 500: I just found a ho-hum black 500 on Ebay but look at the cord..... After a little clean-up, my Moss Green is back to factory trim, and I have yet another black 500 (mostly '54) that needs some work.

I got a 2500 Yellow WE with handset on hook wrapped in bubble wrap with a crack on the right side where the receiver was, made apparently after the box was dropped by the Post Office.

Could this be fixed?

(http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm302/johnnybaby15/Phone.jpg)

JohnnyJT 8)South Philly

There is a lot of information about a lot of plastic refinishing techniques including filling and sanding cracked shells at this thread. Some have used the dissolved plastic technique to restore removed mouse holes.

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=5059.0

cihensley did a lot of experimentation on phone refinishing including dissolving plastic cut off of ribs inside of the shell in a solvent and using that to fill a crack. It's like welding a crack with the same plastic that is cracked. It's a more complicated fix than glue but a more accurate fix.

I read in another post that he has found a 10 to 1 solvent to plastic solution eliminated that air bubble problem, just requires more applications of the dissolved plastic.

Two AE Bakelite intercoms, from the look of the handsets I salvaged and the shine of the bakelite, these look as if they were never used. I asked the seller to ZPLEASE wrap the handsets and the phones in bubble and PLEASE use plenty of newspaper so they do not move in the box. A rattling box is never ever good. I couldn't unpack it, I had Janet do it. Cellophane a a few Styrofoam boars. Everything was banging around inside. "it does n't look too bad.........ooooh sh*t". Oh sh*t was right, Totally destroyed. Handsets and cloth cords look like they are NOS. What a darn shame!....Doug

Thanks for the warning doug. Funny thing was that I still felt compelled to look even after reading your warning.

Those bakelite covers on those early spacesavers are so fragile. I only have one and its cover has a crack. I saw that auction but didn't realise it was two phones. Hopefully you can piece them back togther somewhat.

I think I knw why you were recently looking for a couple of Monophone Hookswitch cover plates now Doug! Odd that they were missing, maybe somone used them as spare parts on another phone.

Terry

Terry....You are correct. I found a perfect one in my parts bin after posting the want for the plates. What amazes me as the handsets are perfect, cloth handset cords have the AE label. The shine on what's left of the bopdies is superb. Anyone need any parts from these. I know the bakelite reciever mount breaks of of these. Otherwise, I put them on ebay as parts only.....Doug

Okay, here it is, The CRPF "Bad Packing" awards thread. I've merged a whole bunch of "Bad Packing" threads together where they were mainly concerned with the bad packing and the damage caused by it. Everyone get themselves a double Rum and Coke before reading this one from the top......

AE 90 from ebay. Didnt realize it was coming from Canada and I have no idea how he shipped it for 17.00. Ive never shipped a phone internationally for less than 32. But this is how it got here--

He set the receiver on the bottom of the package and the body of the phone on top of it. Crunch.

I emailed him that it was cracked and ruined and he's been pretty unsympathetic. Says I need to ship it back for him to file a claim (I paid 30 for it plus 17 shipping, it would cost me at least 30 to ship back, so I wouldnt actually GET anything back). I told him it would cost me the same for shipping back as he would refund me. I offered to send pics instead. He doesnt want pics. Finally after pushing the issue and breaking down the numbers he says Canada Post needs my phone number. So I provide it and never hear from him again.

At this point Ive given up. Havent rated him because he hasnt rated me. Overall...very disappointed. First time on ebay someone has basically unapologetically screwed me over.

Now how about a good packing award. See my earlier post about the Intercom I purchased, I finally got the seller to pack it correctly after a few emails. It arrived today in one piece. It was packed exactly as I asked. Some pictures below.

Now how about a good packing award. See my earlier post about the Intercom I purchased, I finally got the seller to pack it correctly after a few emails. It arrived today in one piece. It was packed exactly as I asked. Some pictures below.

During a brief episode of temporary insanity, I bought this SC 1197 and 1156 subset: [url-http://www.ebay.com/itm/110968404448]ebay link[/url] a few days ago. I added a not to the seller during the checkout explaining that these phones are extremely brittle and that they need to be packed well with plenty of padding and the handset kept away from the base. I then sent a message to the seller reminding him to read the note. His reply indicated that he understood.

The phone and subset arrived this afternoon. The box seemed a bit small to accommodate everything, so I was a bit nervous. After opening the box, I couldn't believe what I saw. The subset was sitting an a couple of layers of newspaper at the bottom of the box. Right next to it, wedged between it and the side of the box, sat the phone with the handset in the cradle! The handset was tied down to the cradle with the cords. There were a couple of pieces of newspaper beneath and on the sides of the phone and bit of bubble wrap and crumbled paper on top of the phone. Amazingly, the phone suffered no apparent damage. The last time that I received a bakelite SC phone, it arrived badly damaged, and that one was packed better than this.

The phone and handset are actually in pretty good condition. The handset has some scuffs, but these handsets sand very well. The subset unfortunately has a frequency ringer. I don't know if I really got a good deal on this. The handset is worth at least $20, but I already have a spare. I mostly wanted the subset to use with a SC candlestick.

Well, last Wednesday, I received in the mail a white WE 760A speaker phone speaker. It was packed with one layer of bubble wrap, and that was placed inside of a padded envelope. By some act of God, it was not smashed into a thousand pieces. I do not know how this made it through the Postal system intact. On top of that, the PS wanted four cents postage due. ::)

I really should send the seller a polite note suggesting better packing methods, but I won't bother as I know that either one of two things will happen... either the seller will not even read it or will get ticked off that I dare suggest that his packing methods were lacking. Thus, I will save my keystrokes.

The good thing is that now I have a white 760A. That makes white, black, moss green, and beige. Now comes the hard colors... red, yellow, blue and etc. Those usually go for hundreds of dollars.

I just wanted to thank everyone for the advice on this thread; as a very general vintage seller on ebay I had no idea that the 500 series phones were so fragile or that it was a bad idea to mail them with the handset secured on the cradle. I guess I've just been lucky with the dozen or so I've sold over the years.

One problem I've had from a seller's point of view, not with phones in particular, but in general, is that buyers refuse to pay what it costs to ship an item properly. I've had many buyers demand I ship items cheaper because "it shouldn't cost that much" and refuse to accept the explanation that extra packing material adds size and weight to items... It makes it very difficult to balance packing methods. I have to say though, I love it when the buyer tells me how to pack the item properly, I certainly don't want to see any amazing pieces of history damaged in transit!

I recently won a soft plastic yellow 500 on eBay. Package was securely packaged and shipped to my address. I received a delivery confirmation from FedEx stating packaged was delivered. I arrived home that evening and package was nowhere to be found. I filed a complaint with FedEx and I followed up with them this morning. They were able to contact the driver and from the description (knowing another package in the screen door) it was indeed delivered. To sum it up, the package was stolen from my steps! I can't believe it. FedEx is taking the responsibility but, the fact is this isn't easily replaceable and I may never see one for a reasonable price in decent condition again! I've had numerous packages delivered and this has never happened before. I cannot trust any of my neighbors at this point. I am not even sure what to do? Do I file a police report? Will it do me any good? I will be checking the dumpsters and surrounding woods when I get home as I will assume the thief will not find any value in this...

I recently won a soft plastic yellow 500 on eBay. Package was securely packaged and shipped to my address. I received a delivery confirmation from FedEx stating packaged was delivered. I arrived home that evening and package was nowhere to be found. I filed a complaint with FedEx and I followed up with them this morning. They were able to contact the driver and from the description (knowing another package in the screen door) it was indeed delivered. To sum it up, the package was stolen from my steps! I can't believe it. FedEx is taking the responsibility but, the fact is this isn't easily replaceable and I may never see one for a reasonable price in decent condition again! I've had numerous packages delivered and this has never happened before. I cannot trust any of my neighbors at this point. I am not even sure what to do? Do I file a police report? Will it do me any good? I will be checking the dumpsters and surrounding woods when I get home as I will assume the thief will not find any value in this...

I am very sorry to hear about this. Being that I live in a rather high crime area (the city likes to call it "diversity"), I worry alot about such things happening. In the past when I worked away from home, I used to have packages delivered to the homes of friends in the neighborhood or to the office where I worked. If I were you, I would file a police report, as much as it may annoy the police, because it is useful for the authorities and public to be aware of crimes being committed, and perhaps, by some unlikely circumstance, the police might recover the phone without the address on the box and not know whose it is.

I sure hope that you get your phone back. In the mean time, I will keep an eye open for another one. They do appear occasionally. I have a beautiful soft plastic yellow which I got for cheap a couple of years ago.

That's terrible, I'm so sorry to hear it happened! I agree with Larry though, definitely file a police report. My guess is this wouldn't be the thief's first or last time doing this. They might have other reports within the same area that will help them catch who is doing it. So, don't file a report with the hopes of finding the phone, but rather documenting the happenings with the hopes of finding the culprit.

About 10 years ago I had a piston and connecting rod out of an old locomotive. I had just gotten it, and it was absolutely filthy, so I had it sitting on some cinder blocks right outside the back door of our shop/museum until I got the chance to clean it up. We are literally 3 buildings away from the police department. I show up the next morning and the thing is gone with a bunch of scrape marks on the concrete leading off our property and into the alley. I filed a police report, they figured someone was stealing scrap. A week or so later I got a call that they found it. It was sitting in someone's garage about 6 blocks away. A pair of kids tied it to their bikes and drug it home. They took it because they thought it was neat because it was so big. They offered to give it back, but they put some really nice flat spots on it dragging it home so I didn't bother. Point being, maybe you'll get lucky :)

I contacted my superintendent and there has been instances where people are following FedEx trucks around in our area and taking the packages they drop off. Larry, your sympathies are much appreciated! I will have to just learn to let go. I almost wish I didn't win this item as it would have probably survived in the hands of another bidder. Very unfortunate situation. My luck will hopefully turn around soon.

I've probably said this before, but over here, all couriers are required to either deliver the item to the recipient, or with a neighbour, and if they couldn't find someone to hand it to, they HAVE to take it back to the depot and leave a "Sorry, you were out" card. Some couriers are a bit lazy though in that they'll just fake a signature and leave the item near your door (hopefully out of sight though), or they'll not even bother to try and deliver and just drop a card through the door...

The US & Canadian courier services need to adopt the "deliver to a person or return it to the depot" policy, cos the truck tails are going to keep following them and making loads of money from stolen post...

I went ahead and filed a complaint with the police department. They were actually very nice and an officer came to my door. When he asked what it was I had told him the story and then it turned into more questions on old rotary phones and what's that one worth.... :) I also searched all of our dumpsters and the nearby backwoods. No such luck:-( I will have to let this go and move on. Now, a soft plastic yellow 500 is at the top of my list of wanted phones. RIP little buddy....

Sorry to hear of the pilfered phone. Drop by your local thrift shops or re-sale shops....keep an eye on the local Craigslist and if you see one on eBay from a seller in your neck of the woods it may be worth contacting eBay. It just might turn up somewhere. If you find it locally, contact the police where you filed the report and refer to the report number. Let them do the follow-up. You never know...........

Thanks everyone! I am definitely bummed by the situation. This should hopefully be the last of my string of bad luck with phones over the past few months. There's a silver lining somewhere. Hopefully, this phone doesn't end up in the trash somewhere. Bad packing/damage was always my worst fear with phones but, now I can add theft to that list.

***Every now and then I'll open my door and peer outside in hopes it magically appears***

Now this happens to me too, first time but very annoying. Bought three WE 1C1 phones from same seller, $75 each. That's cheap I think. Every Phone was packed separate in one box, total shipping to Germany was $628,80 , wow, that's quite a number for me. When they arrived today I was rather disappointed, the boxes looked damaged from outside, one even had to be re-taped by USPS. The seller only put some of those flakes into the boxes, no bubblewrap or anything else protective. And as a payphone is quite heavy it literally grinded all flakes to something like dust. So during shipping the phones got dings and dents from loose handsets, and one is totally without function now as smashed from inside, when opened it there were lots of chips from the networks plastic. So I did my very best to change chromed front covers and handsets etc. to get at least two phones look acceptable, what to do with the last one, damaged from inside..I don't know. Spare parts have to wait now, I can't spend more money and shipping costs this month. Same with the missing instruction cards. Maybe someone here has one from Cincinnati bell, really like the one with the Cincinnati Bell handset, took me some time to polish all scratches out but now looks fine again.All sellers before did outstanding packing jobs but it was only a matter of time until one doesn't.

You may want to ask for a refund for at least one of them since the seller did not pack the phones properly. Unfortunately, you would still probably have to pay the shipping charges for the broken phone, unless the seller feels generous.

If seller is uncooperative, you can file a case; Ebay usually sides with the buyer. Ebay then requires that the seller refund the purchase price + shipping. However, the buyer has to send the item back at his own expense. In that case, it's usually better for both buyer and seller just to negotiate a partial refund.)

I wrote the seller a mail but as he has a feedback less than 10 I don't report at ebay. I'm kind and everyone has the chance to learn. As you mentioned, sending the item back is no option, as expensive, refund or partial refund on $75 in contrast to the shipping costs will only help very little. It's annoying and make me feel sad for the phones but I guess that's part of life. It can't be always like it should be. Luckily, for doing ebay for more than 10 years, it is very rare that this happens, in this case with the shipping costs being that high on a not so high priced item it's bad luck. But always, could be worse, I don't like to think what might have happened if this wasn't a WE C1C but a 1930's two piece pay station. Even if every phone has his historical and personal worth of course, no matter how old or rare.

I just wanted to thank everyone for the advice on this thread; as a very general vintage seller on ebay I had no idea that the 500 series phones were so fragile or that it was a bad idea to mail them with the handset secured on the cradle. I guess I've just been lucky with the dozen or so I've sold over the years.

One problem I've had from a seller's point of view, not with phones in particular, but in general, is that buyers refuse to pay what it costs to ship an item properly. I've had many buyers demand I ship items cheaper because "it shouldn't cost that much" and refuse to accept the explanation that extra packing material adds size and weight to items... It makes it very difficult to balance packing methods. I have to say though, I love it when the buyer tells me how to pack the item properly, I certainly don't want to see any amazing pieces of history damaged in transit!

It could have been delivered to the wrong house in the same street. FedEx did that to me. A week later a neighbor delivered the goods to my house.

AE40FAN - I have had very bad experiences with FedEx to the point I will offer to pay extra to have something delivered by another method. The most recent was I got a confirmation email that I had a package delivered at 2:49pm when I arrived home there was no package from FedEX, but I had 2 packages from USPS (which come around 9am or 1pm. I called FedEX and they said it was delivered and there was nothing they could do since it wasn't insured... Now myself forgetting I have cameras at both doors that record 24/7, I went and checked the DVR, I searched for 1/2hr before and after the said delivery time, and there had been no FedEx guy at my house or even a FedEx truck on my street. I called FedEX back and immediately asked for a supervisor, and then asked for his supervisor. I explained the situation and with in minutes I had a cal back from the Pittsburgh regional manager (and it was well after 5pm) from his home. I gave him all the information again. The following morning, the seller contacted me (who I had made aware of the issue) to say he had a check for the price of the item and shipping delivered to him by FedEx before there truck are normally even on the road. Aside from this I have had FedEx destroy 2 other packages and lose 3 more. They are the worst in the business as far as I am concerned.

I don't know much about FedEx, but here in the UK I specify the seller I will not accept TNT courier service, had a 10 day delay with phantom deliveries, utterly incompetent and downright rude staff, being passed from pillar to post.

Now that our Gov has privatised the Royal Mail, it has been mooted TNT may buy it over - please God no!

Now that our Gov has privatised the Royal Mail, it has been mooted TNT may buy it over - please God no!

Could be worse, could be Hermes, they put packages in the safest of safe places, in the bin, like the power supply for fixing our plasma TV, couldn't leave it with a neighbour or under the table outside where it was sheltered and hidden from view, but rather in the recycling bin by the road, thank goodness it was bin day the previous day or that would have been £40 down the pan and into the nearest landfill!!! :o

As for TNT taking over the RM, well, that wouldn't be much of a surprise, a lot of regular post is sent via them but delivered by RM posties, all they really need to do is just rebrand everything to TNT, and like its explosives namesake, blow the nation's postal service to kingdom come... :o

Sad thing is, a lot of sellers are trying to save as much money on postage as possible, so when it comes to sending them instructions, it's a case of leading a horse to water, you can do it, but you can't make it drink... :-\

It's not even a question of cost. The postage is the same for upto 10 kg. Holland is not that big.

Problem is, most sellers are looking at the cost of the packaging itself, using what they have rather than buying something more suitable with some decent wrapping material, so whatever money they save on that they can take from the actual postage cost... :-\

I'm guilty of doing the same, but not on packing techniques, if I can't use what I've got though I will go buy the right stuff... :)

Problem is, most sellers are looking at the cost of the packaging itself, using what they have rather than buying something more suitable with some decent wrapping material, so whatever money they save on that they can take from the actual postage cost...

[/quote]

Holy generalization Twocvbloke. This is a statement I take umbrage with. MOST SELLERS. Really??

We use Medium Priority Flat boxes for most phones with bubble (that we pay for, not the buyer). We do not use second hand boxes and our quotes include insurance in the auction. You know what you are paying before the auction ends. No Surprises. Shipping quotes are in every auction!! We quote all overseas transactions before auction ends.

We DO NOT make money on shipping. We want you to get the phone pictured in one piece. I am a collector first and a seller second.

Where do your facts come from?

Have you ever sold one thing on eBay?

It's really cool to spout out these alleged facts, but you couldn't be more wrong. Don't make one bad seller experience a one size fits all.

Yes, MOST sellers, not most sellers selling specifically telephones, it's the few that do the job by the book that usually are the exception, so there's no need for such an outburst like that... ::)

The facts come from buying many items on ebay since I joined that site in 2003, most if not all of the items I've received have arrived in re-used packaging, occasionally badly packed, sent by postage that was a lot less than was stated on the auction (when the sellers forgot to hide the actual shipping cost), so, yeah, I'm pretty sure I can say that those are facts... :)

And I have indeed sold one thing on ebay, over 50 things actually, so I have experience of selling and packing with new or decent re-used boxes & padding, and only charging for the shipping, so to claim I'M generalising, yeah, you might want take a look at what you just posted in detail, cos you've just done what you're accusing me of there... ;)

Yes, MOST sellers, not most sellers selling specifically telephones, it's the few that do the job by the book that usually are the exception, so there's no need for such an outburst like that... ::)

The facts come from buying many items on ebay since I joined that site in 2003, most if not all of the items I've received have arrived in re-used packaging, occasionally badly packed, sent by postage that was a lot less than was stated on the auction (when the sellers forgot to hide the actual shipping cost), so, yeah, I'm pretty sure I can say that those are facts... :)

And I have indeed sold one thing on ebay, over 50 things actually, so I have experience of selling and packing with new or decent re-used boxes & padding, and only charging for the shipping, so to claim I'M generalising, yeah, you might want take a look at what you just posted in detail, cos you've just done what you're accusing me of there... ;)

Most sellers are trying to make a profit on shipping by using inferior boxes ??? That is what you are saying :'(Not using proper packing :-\ I got it now ::)......sorry for the outburst :-X ???

I'm sure you are both saying the same thing, accept using different words.

Anyway, as national deliveries do not travel great distances here in my experience the parcels do not suffer very much. If only packed with a little soft material in a not too small box is usually enough here. Double layers of bubble wrap and 2 boxes is overdoing it. For national shipments I only use one box (but I do double bubble wrap).

I've sent out over 100 telephones over the years and never had one damaged in transit. Of course I use more packaging when shipping internationally.

Agreed. I have purchased a couple of phones from eBay ::) I always give detailed instructions to the seller and tell them I will not make payment until they acknowledge said instructions. Most will comply, some agree and then simply throw it in a box with no packing anyway! Somewhere here I posted about an intercom I purchased, it took the seller 3 tries to get it packed correctly, but he kept trying until I was happy! Positive feedback for that seller! As a seller I have shipped fragile porcelain and crystal items all over the world, besides phones, and have never had a broken item. I reuse bubble wrap, I get most of my boxes from work(car parts) or use the flat rate boxes. Most of the time the eBay shipping calaulator is too high which I mention in my auction, in that case I refund the difference. I make money on the item, not the shipping. I maintain a 100% feedback score and if you take a peek at it you will see almost every one mentions the packing.http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=d_and_h_cool_stuff&ftab=AllFeedback

Well I do not know about USPS, but here Postnl has a automatic sorting and handling system with conveyer belts. And packages just drop a couple of inches from on to the other in that system. Can't blame them really.

You know, I forgot to add my GPO 706's packing when I got it, it wasn't pretty at all, and the handset wasn't really wrapped at all, just a bit of paper and then laid over the phone (receiver over the dial, transmitter between the hook), that was lucky to have survived aswell, had the phone's shell been Diakon (it's ABS, and the handset Diakon), it too would have been smashed... :o

The eBay seller wrapped this phone I won only in newspaper and used a flimsy cardboard box (the kind the stuff from China comes in at the dollar store) and sent it by USPS parcel select (parcel post). The seller gave me a full refund and I didn't have to send it back.

The eBay seller wrapped this phone I won only in newspaper and used a flimsy cardboard box (the kind the stuff from China comes in at the dollar store) and sent it by USPS parcel select (parcel post). The seller gave me a full refund and I didn't have to send it back.

Wow! Well, let's see what's left. From here I can see a fingerwheel, dial, base, I'm going to assume the handset and cord.

I recently took a chance on a soft plastic Light Beige 500. The price was right, Buy It Now with free shipping. It left California via USPS Parcel Post.

I arrived at home today to see what looked like a pillow on my front porch. I wasn't expecting anything other than the phone. Sure enough, the seller wrapped the phone in some bubble wrap and put it in a bag. It shipped all the way across the country in one of those thin postal service bags. Remarkably there was NO damage. None. I couldn't believe, first of all that someone would ship a plastic telephone in a bag and secondly that it wasn't broken. I could feel the plastic through the bag. It was wrapped with MAYBE 3 layers of bubble wrap. A soft bag for a soft plastic phone.

It's an unfortunate occurrence to place a phone here but the recent eBay purchase by HarrySmith of what was once a fine beige 554, posted here on the forum, (http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=12745.0) has made it to this topic.

I too also have the unfortunate pleasure of posting to this topic. After sending the seller a standard shipping instructions and receiving an "OK, Will do", the phones came in a bursting flimsy box with paper packing. RIP ivory 302 and soft plastic red 500.

After seeing this sad event, one that has happened over and over again, I am starting to wonder if it isn't caused by a seller having wrapped the phone for shipment, to get the shipping cost to put into the listing, before starting the auction on eBay. That way, when the auction ends, all the seller has to do is pay the postage and put the label on the box. As such, any packing instructions sent by the buyer will go unheeded, with a seller dismissal reply of "OK" or "will do" because the seller has no intention of honoring the buyer's request. The seller will not take the time to open up the box and repack the phone, and possibly incur additional shipping costs for the extra weight of good packing, to prevent damage,

Just a thought but it may be a good idea to send the seller this link in the buyer's good packing message

to show what happens to a poorly packed phone in hopes that the buyer will then open up a poorly packed phone and repack it right to prevent shipping damage. That along with a statement that the buyer will not pay for a phone damaged during shipment but will pay for any marginal increase in shipping costs for good packing.

Just a thought, and if anyone tries this, a reply posted here stating if the link can be sent in eBay along with any seller response to this suggestion would be helpful.

------------------

Example packing instructions (http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=717.msg51082#msg51082) written by Dave F: "Hi ____ . Before I pay you for this nice ____ , I want to say something important about packing: The housing of this old phone is really very fragile, and it can easily be broken if not packed well. I have had similar nice phones ruined in the past when the sellers didn't pack them well. PLEASE use MULTIPLE LAYERS of bubble wrap (NOT crumbled up paper), and wrap the handset separately so it can't rattle around and bang into the rest of the phone. Also, please use a box that is large enough to absorb the abuse it will get from the P.O. without hurting the contents, and fill any void spaces with additional packing material to keep things from rattling around. I will wait to hear back from you before paying so that I know you have received this important message. This is a really nice phone and I will be happy to add it to my collection. Thank you for the auction. Dave F."

These would have to be edited down to make room for the TinyURL link and to make the instructions your own and specific to the item purchased. Others have suggested similar shipping instructions, this is the first set I have run across in going through the Bad Packing topic.

----------------------------

I just bought a phone and found that this paragraph is the maximum amount of characters allowed in the message to the seller at the time of purchase (actually, 4 characters short of the maximum). I've used this for many purchases and have received undamaged phones almost all of the time. There was no room for the link to the PhotoBucket collection.

"Please wrap the phone and the handset separately. Do not wrap the phone with the handset on the cradle. Please use sufficient packing to keep the handset from impacting the base during shipment and to prevent any outside impact to the box from damaging the phone. These are fragile and the USPS has a history of handling them rough and cracking the plastics. You may already do this when shipping phones and if so, excuse this tutorial. Thank you for good packing methods to insure safe delivery.

Aw, Jim, that is one beat up 2500. I feel your pain and have felt it many times. The first phone I won on eBay arrived broken and that was about 15 years ago. I've learned over the years to send a packing request before I pay for the item, unless it's a seller I know. It's saved many a phone. They seem to think that these phones are indestructible. As anyone can plainly see--they're not.

I usually try to put it gently because some can bristle at being told what to do. I usually say I hope they don't mind a packing request and if they could do these two things it would make sure the phone arrived unbroken. First, be sure the handset is wrapped separately from the base. (I can see that wasn't done on your phone because it got divots in the sides, which is what happens when the handset is on hook and goes crashing into the housing.) Second I ask them to make sure there is plenty of packing in the box so that the phone doesn't move when they shake the box. You may want to add something about the box being large enough and a standard shipping box. I've seen shoe boxes used before. One thing with some sellers--don't get too detailed or demanding with your request or they will ignore you.

I've had sellers actually thank me for my suggestions and who knows how many phones I saved because of them. I've also had a seller recently (not a phone seller) who wouldn't even respond when three out of four bowls arrived smashed to bits because of her bad packing. I had to use the eBay/PayPal money back guarantee and only got part of the money back. I hope that doesn't happen to you. Good luck with your refund and be sure to make the email to the seller calm and not too long. Calmer heads prevail in situations like this.

I'm glad it was a normal 2500 desk phone - if it had been a blue thermoplastic 302, I'd be beside myself...

I'm catching in with the folks who deal with phones and those who don't. On the same day, I received a a Trimline, double-wrapped in bubble wrap, inside a grocery bag, with added packing, inside a wine box, inside additional packaging material (brown paper bag - crunched up into balls, it actually seems to offer some added cushioning)' inside a new box. Plenty of packing for a run-of-the-mill Trimline...

We'll see what happens, but the seller offers the eBay money-back guarantee (plus I used PayPal...)

I just received my turquoise Princess inside a bubble wrapped envelope. Thank goodness nothing was broken, but my heart sank when I saw the heavy envelope in the mail. I sent the seller. The following note (after thanking them for the auction and explaining the difference between turquoise and aqua blue):

I do have one request, if you sell any phones in the future: please pack them in a box, with proper padding, and separate the handset from the base. The U.S. Postal Service throws these packages around and even though the phones seem indestructible, the older plastic can easily break or chip. They can get easily damaged if not inside of a solidly built box (if you're shipping Priority Mail, you can get boxes for free from your post office or online at USPS.com delivered directly to you).

Green AE-80 - a little less easy to find than the yellow 2500... Was packaged with a rose beige AE-80 that had no issues. Both phones were packaged in a large flat rate box with bubble wrap, but was a tight fit (don't have the wrapped pics, as I didn't notice until all was unwrapped...). Got a refund, but it's the phone I really wanted that was damaged...

Here's what I got in the mail today...what was an all-dates-matching 1965 WE 565 in beige! :'(

The seller shipped it without any packing whatsoever on the broken side!

Fortunately, the plastic was very brittle to begin with for some reason; it already has an area that was broken and then taped back on! Also, the phone was only $9.99, and the seller refunded all of the costs, so I got it for free!

Anybody have a WE 565-564 non-modular housing in beige they would be willing to sell? :-\

I just updated the "broken phone" library to include the latest disappointments. This collection can be used, in total or by one image, to show a seller what happens when a phone is not packed well for shipping. These links are also posted in the very first post of this topic so they can be found easily as this post gets lost in the middle over time.

CAUTION -- do not click either of these two links if already in a bad mood . . .

Doug posted this, at that link, about the broken receiver: "I found two sticks on CL in RI on 3/17 for $200. They sat for a few weeks and I asked seller his best price and he said $125, WE agreed on $100 and $20 to mail them. Got them today and they we rolling around in the box. The prefect marked 143 was totally crushed. "

Try calling or emailing Phoneco. When I was there a few years ago they had a pile (literally) of data sets. A quick look left me with the impression that at least some of them must be parts sets. ::) ::)

Ironically Paul-F gave this advise to Dave F back in 2010 when his Data Set arrived smashed. MIPS took his advice and ordered a smashed parts phone from their supply!

Try calling or emailing Phoneco. When I was there a few years ago they had a pile (literally) of data sets. A quick look left me with the impression that at least some of them must be parts sets. ::) ::)

Ironically Paul -F gave this advise to Dave F back in 2010 when his Data Set arrived smashed. MIPS took his advice and ordered a smashed parts phone from their supply!

Terry

I did in fact take Paul's advice and call Phoneco but, at least back then, they did not have any spare housings available.

This isn't a phone, but it is such a tragedy that I needed to post it. I bought a Silvertone model 8005 radio on ebay last week for a very good price. These 1948 model radios are bakelite painted a blue-green metallic color which was very popular at the time. Most of the ones I have seen online have substantial paint loss, but the paint on this one was much better. Unfortunately, the seller stuffed the radio, lying on its back side, into a flimsy box which was only just big enough to fit the radio and a single layer of thin bubble wrap. The cabinet was damaged far beyond repair in transit. The seller gave me a refund, but I would really like a radio. If you have a spare cabinet for this radio, please contact me.

"Hi I ordered this early Starlite type phone and as you can see it got smashed in our marvelous postal service ( Hermes ) or another carrier as this went through many carriers. What are the Chance's that another case could be found as I would really like this to be repaired for my Museum. The case is NOT the same as the normal Starlite and would not fit. I would be willing to pay for any replacement and of postage."

Not a phone but a rather rare Olympic AM/SW radio with what was, before shipping, a very nice, undamaged burled walnut Bakelite case. I asked the seller to please pack it well to avoid damage. She did not put much packing on the bottom so this heavy radio was very close to the flimsy cardboard box that she used to ship the radio. It was wrapped in only two layers of the small bubble size wrap and the paper and chunks of Styrofoam and cardboard placed inside to protect it did not help when this box was dropped hard somewhere along the way.

Big disappointment with this. Haven't contacted the seller yet, it just came today. Any suggestions on how much I should get back for this?

Center photo is the damage, left photo cracks outlined in yellow and the right photo is the eBay listing.

Contacted the seller by eBay message on Friday morning - have not yet heard back from her. I sent two more messages today to get 7 additional damage pictures to her. If she does not respond by Tuesday, I will go the official, formal eBay complaint route.

What seemed to be a packing only issue turned out to be a sad story of stupidity on the seller's part. Not only was the packing on the bottom only crushed brown paper but the power cord was not secured inside the cabinet. As I opened up the radio, I was finding several small black plastic pieces that did not seem to be part of the radio but had no idea of where they came from. After taking the additional cabinet photos, I looked at the pieces and it hit me. They looked like the power plug and, yes, the plug was also damaged. The damaged power plug, a piece of junk before being damaged, is seen in the photo showing the top side of the chassis. Also seen in that photo are the 2 dial lamps out of their mounting sockets. The drop was so hard, both of the two lamps (shows with a red dot on them) came out of their mounts (circled in red).

Takes a lot to break one of those power plugs but the drop did. So, the round power plug caused the cabinet damage just as putting a golf ball under the cabinet and dropping it would also do. What a sad shame that a stupid packing error, or two errors being a wandering plug and insufficient packing, destroyed a perfectly in good, near NOS burled brown Bakelite cabinet that lasted for 75 years, but is no longer. What a stupid waste!

That's a real shame. Some people just don't think. I guess they think the box will go from hand to hand with no dropping, force or any other thing that will harm the contents. She ought to send you a full refund. If she wants it back she should pay shipping too.

Sorry you were on the short end of this deal for sure....not to mention a good radio (beautiful color in your pictures) is damaged close to being beyond repair.

Bought this 302 for $32 total on eBay last week. The dial and hand set cord caught my eye. And the metal shell would be a keeper.

It came today in a box and packed that was, well, less that appropriate for shipment.

The box was obviously crunched down when being taped. Whatever was inside was moving around and I could hear an internal noise when turning the box over and over.

Upon cracking the main seal, I discovered the phone was double boxed, if you can call the Crunchmaster (an appropriate name for a box in which you want to have something destroyed, I would say) Cracker Box a shipping box.

Opening the box top, I found the phone encased in a bubble wrap cocoon with the front end of the phone facing up. Hmmm, not got so far.

I took the phone out of the box and set it on my bench to cut the wrap off. Didn't have to open it much to notice THE SELLER SHIPPED IT WITH THE HANDSET ACROSS THE CRADLE!. Opening up all of the bubble wrap showed the transmitter end of the handset resting very close to the plastic finger wheel. That made me nervous.

But, Lady Luck was on my side today and there was no damage to the handset or the finger wheel.

Oh, yes, I did send a message to the seller with the payment asking him to wrap the handset in bubble wrap and lay it next to the phone in the shipping box. That was on the 17th. I got this eBay message from the seller yesterday, the 22nd:

I never see the "Buyer's Note" til too late. I hope it makes it safe, if not let me know, John.

Those notes to the seller in Paypal payments go unread 99% of the time. You have to first, before you pay, write the instructions and send them in an eBay email and ask them to please let you know they've read them. I try to pour on the charm so it doesn't sound like I'm barking orders. Sometimes I wait a few hours to pay and other times I just pay right after sending instructions, if it's not a BIN auction. I never assume they know how to pack unless it's a long-time phone buyer or seller.

I've gotten phones shipped in all kinds of boxes and some of them were laughable, like Pampers boxes and shoe boxes. I've also seen disposable diapers (unusued ones, thankfully) used as packing material.

There is something habitual about sellers packing phones on-hook, so we just have to fight that urge. I'm glad you were lucky this time.

Whatever was inside was moving around and I could hear an internal noise when turning the box over and over.

What I was hearing was the ringer mount moving around. The grommets had dried out a long time ago and pieces of them were floating around inside the phone. So, will need to put in some new grommets to make it sound better when ringing . . .

Not a phone but I hope you don't mind. Bought on eBay as I like this style of white bakelite radio. The seller only used tissue paper to wrap the radio. Smashed in the dial and broke a piece of bakelite off. I did receive a full refund and the seller said to keep the radio.

Had 2 phones from eBay show up yesterday. One eligible for this award, the other one for the ultimate protection award (styrofoam inside the box, peanuts for filling, then bubble wrap, then shrink wrap - took me 10 minutes to get the phone out ;-) ).

Anyway, here we go - yes, it's a basic late 70s modular 500, but I had plans to use it at work for a hotline phone (at least it wasn't a soft plastic model...).

Had 2 phones from eBay show up yesterday. One eligible for this award, the other one for the ultimate protection award (styrofoam inside the box, peanuts for filling, then bubble wrap, then shrink wrap - took me 10 minutes to get the phone out ;-) ).

Anyway, here we go - yes, it's a basic late 70s modular 500, but I had plans to use it at work for a hotline phone (at least it wasn't a soft plastic model...).

Quite the shame.

Seller should refund and let you keep the phone. If so, you have either a parts phone or one in need of a new housing (relatively cheap on eBay in black, red is a bit harder to find). If so, try the forum "Wanted" route.

Yeah, I can see that happening (and that even looks like one of the boxes I received recently) if the weight distribution of the box, the incline and the belt speed was just right but if I were the Postmaster at that station I'd fire the employee on the spot for not only not stopping the destructive action but also deciding to take a video of it for YouTube.

Some days I open up a delivered telephone box, shake my head and promise never to ever by anything else on eBay forever, or longer.

Fabius posted this topic (in humor, maybe)

http://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=17885.0

and I was intrigued by the image, a black number plate and a felt bottom. AE_Collector thought it might be a Navy ship phone with a dial that glowed in the dark and felt on the bottom to keep it quiet. Don't know, it was his theory.

So, I bought phone for less than $28 total and the second picture below is what was sent. A very nice metal housing SC 1243 with a bit of chrome and nice original cloth cords, not the interesting AE 40 shown in the listing.

Contacted the seller and after a few back and forth messages, convinced him he did not sent the phone pictured, what I thought I was buying (knowing the description and listing title were not for that phone) but instead sent the SC (sent him a photo).

I asked if he still had the phone pictured and he did and he said he would ship it to me right away and he would pay for return shipping for the SC. I said I would wait until I got the phone pictured before sending the first phone back.

Fast forward 10 days. The phone arrived, 3rd image below.

A beat up $13 flat rate USPS box arrived today (used once before and again to me) and upon opening saw the AE 40 and black number plate. I was getting excited until I tried to take the phone out of the flimsy packing material (grocery store shopping bags) and cut my finger. With one of the 47 cards in his deck, he packed it so poorly that a corner drop of the box busted out a front corner and left a crack in the housing.

Sent a message to the seller explaining the situation including it wasn't worth shipping back to him because he could not sell it on eBay like that. Told him I was will to keep the first phone and pay him $30 plus shipping for this phone but not have to buy a new housing (I just don't need another project so a replacement housing for $45 total - from Doug Rose through eBay - is worth the time saved to get this phone back into original condition).

So, another piece of history having survived 65 years or so destroyed with a 3 minutes poor packing job, by the seller. I'm waiting to what he wants to do. I'm hoping he says let's call it even and I get the SC and the damaged AE 40 for $28 total.

This purchase was double frustrating with a double surprise and today, a high level of frustration. The bear bit both of us on this deal. Sure which he wouldn't have lot those 5 cards.

OUCH!.....This will be a perfect replacement.....goes out in the morning thanks and sorry....Doug

Thanks, Doug. I'm sure yours will arrive undamaged.

Been working with the seller. I offered to pay half the cost of shipping the busted phone and calling it even, I keep the busted phone. He came back and said keep the busted phone, no need to pay half the shipping and I keep the SC 1243 I paid a total of $28 for to start this journey. So, for $28, I got two phones, one needing a housing. Seller was very reasonable. If he would have invested in $5 of bubble pack, it would have turned out so much better for him.

Unfortunate and frustrating, but a somewhat happy ending for me, sort of, I guess.

I'm glad you got SOME satisfaction, John. But as you said, it's too bad that something that survived this long became damaged from poor packing when it could have been avoided. Unfortunately this thread will continue to grow in the future............

This is definitely not a winner of bad packing, more a recepie of good packing. The box containing one Bakelite LB telephone filled half of the trunk in my car. The telephone witch I took a chance on is a tabletop magneto telephone designed in 1938 for military use, it has r parts, the phone, the battery and connection box and the handset. Pretty ugly, but war, and post war history from Norway.

Not my best buy, it was not complete. But the seller did probably not know, but he packed it well.

The handset was destroyed - someone loaded the phone in the box and put some flat styrofoam pieces around it... Right now, plugging the attached cable in yields nothing, but that may be a function of the damaged handset.

The phone is an AT&T 1D2C4-03 Custom Manufactured in Taiwan-R.O.C. for AT&T, 5-96, so it's not a "classic", per se - not even the WE touch pad... I got it for cheap, so will probably use it for swapping out various boards (and possibly my own controller - Ethernet Payphone???).

The last picture is from the eBay auction - it shipped taped exactly as shown...

I feel in general when we score a good deal on a phone from somewhere, its mainly because the selling party is not a phone person. Reasonable to assume they would know less about phone shipping if they don't care that much for the phone.

I bought a fairly early White AE multiline on eBay recently. I sent my usual packing instructions to the seller--making sure to tell them to pack the handset and base in separate bubble wrap layers--and, in a very condescending way, told me that he was a professional, and wrapping telephones are "mere child's play" to him.

Well, let's see what he did wrong. First off, let's see what Automatic Electric did right...they built their phones like ammo cans. This guy pretty much disregarded my shipping instructions. He put the phone in a big box and had it wrapped enough that it didn't move around inside, but put the handset on top of the base with the receiver cap resting on the edge of the fingerwheel! >:( The handset and base were wrapped in the same bubble wrap cocoon, which could have easily shattered that very hard to find fingerwheel.

Fortunately, no damage...not even a crack. I took pictures of how I received it directly out of the bubble wrap. He even crammed the handset and line cord together in the back. ::)

I bought a fairly early White AE multiline on eBay recently. I sent my usual packing instructions to the seller--making sure to tell them to pack the handset and base in separate bubble wrap layers--and, in a very condescending way, told me that he was a professional, and wrapping telephones are "mere child's play" to him.

Well, let's see what he did wrong. First off, let's see what Automatic Electric did right...they built their phones like ammo cans. This guy pretty much disregarded my shipping instructions. He put the phone in a big box and had it wrapped enough that it didn't move around inside, but put the handset on top of the base with the receiver cap resting on the edge of the fingerwheel! >:( The handset and base were wrapped in the same bubble wrap cocoon, which could have easily shattered that very hard to find fingerwheel.

Fortunately, no damage...not even a crack. I took pictures of how I received it directly out of the bubble wrap. He even crammed the handset and line cord together in the back. ::)

It is a good looking phone. Lucky for you no breakage.

I am interested to in what you all the hard to find fingerwheel. Is there a pic of one of these somewhere?

All that clean living paid off with good Karma, Christian. Nice phone. I noticed it has one chrome plunger and one black one...

Benny

Yep, the black bakelite plunger lifts the handset up when one of the three "hold" buttons is pressed. It's pretty comical to watch the handset spring off the cradle when you press a button. I laughed the first time it happened! ;D

Yep, the black bakelite plunger lifts the handset up when one of the three "hold" buttons is pressed. It's pretty comical to watch the handset spring off the cradle when you press a button. I laughed the first time it happened! ;D

The interconnect is you CANíT hang the handset up without it mechanically knocking any held lines off of hold. This is because there is no key equipment to run the AE87ís, they have three line buttons and three hold buttons. A resistor is placed across the line in the phone to hold a call and you canít have that left across the line inadvertently.

So, you can have two or even three calls all held at the same time, just donít put the handset back in the cradle. Then if making a call while other lines are held and you need to hang up to get a new dial tone, use the plunger button that ISN'T linked to the hold mechanism. Thatís why they are either a chrome one and a Bakelite one OR newer 87ís had a clear and a red plastic plunger.

Nice score Christian, we all know how hard it is to find a decent white phone!

As for this fingerwheel, not extremely rare but the most difficult of the three clear plastic AE wheels to find. This type was used briefly in the first coloured plastic AEís and can quickly be identified by the chrome metal ring around the number card. This metal ring is only slightly different (but it IS different) than the black or chrome ring used on earlier AE dials such as on the 40 and 50.

Four pictures of AE Dial fingerwheel & Numbercard rings from old to new:

Black - Old metal type going back to type 24 Dial from 1924.Ivory - First clear fingerwheel for coloured plastic phonesGray - Type with pin hole to remove it and the card is inside beneath the fingerwheel.Green - Newest type with centre screw that used the stick on number card.

A) Phone was posted in a taped up black bin liner.Some Bubble wrap was around phone - amazingly it survived.

B) Phone in box. Bubble wrap all around but none underneath.This one was not so fortunate. Crack to bottom edge.

My best packing experience was this week too - seller put a nice thick padded cushion underneath the phone which was so thick and cosy the phone sat inside like in a nest. Plus lots of bubble wrap and handset bubble wrapped separately too. And then she double boxed. Five star packing! :)

Another bad pack. I explained the packing process twice over to the seller but to no avail.

This is a Bakelite GPO phone which arrived literally wrapped in a thin plastic supermarket shopping bag with two/three layers of bubble wrap for shipping. Many of the bubbles had popped and the phone could be felt through the plastic. Handset wrapped in one layer, placed at the front bottom edge of phone. No box.

Amazingly, no damage. :o

ETA - if you look carefully at the first photo packaging you can actually see the handset at the front, and the pointed outline of the cradle to top.

Hereís one I got very cheap on EBay. Seller had 100% positive feedback but only charged about $7 shipping. I knew there was packing risk at that price, but I gave the seller my standard ďplease pack so handset does not contact phone bodyĒ message and left it at that..... Just a USPS bubble bag with no other protection except for ďfragile pleaseĒ written on the bag.. To his credit, my instruction was followed..... 😎. Amazingly, the phone survived undamaged (an NE Ď73 500Y hotel phone in nice shape). Iíll add another post with before and after resto pics soon....

Around 1992, all residential customers who wanted to stop paying quarterly charges for their AT&T leased phones were given Tyvek (bullet proof?) mailing envelopes to return them to the lone remaining AT&T service center (in Atlanta) for residential phones. The soft plastic 500s often arrived in a million pieces. Not that it mattered, since AT&T was selling them for 11 cents a pound to Applied Components Inc. (ACI shipped most of them to China, but we bought some for $1.50 each.)

Interesting story, poplar1 - Thanks for sharing that. The economics didnít support any better treatment of the phones, since the goal was to simply to remove them from service since they werenít going to be leased anymore. I hope you found a nice one or two during that time. Iíve often wondered about the stories behind the thousands (millions?) of these bell phones that survived.....

I bought it off a guy on Kijiji for $10.00 CDN and he agreed to mail for postage and packaging.He said postage was $15.00 and that's about right.Then it was $10.00 for the packaging. Ok I thought fair enough he has to buy the packing stuff, pack it and take it to the post office.

Wow $35.00 CDN / $25.62 USD Super deal for a 1967 NE 1554BQ1A or so I thought.The packaging material he got was just the box and the tape.

The phone needs a good cleaning and the handset cradle is a little bent from the shipping.Could have been worst, I got lucky on this packaging job with not a lot of damage.

Paul, you got lucky.Doug, I wonder if he could have maybe found a slightly larger box, depth wise. Boy the things people do and say, yea it will be fine.I do have to admit I'm guilty too, but for the most part, I do try to pack things well.

Looking closer at the photos. it appears that switchhook kept the phone centered and prevented it from getting housing damage. I would contact the seller, explain the issue and ask for a refund of the $10.00 packing price. You should be able to find a 554 parts phone with a nice switch hook for $10 or less.JMO,Jim S.If he doesn't want to, maybe follow up with the link for this thread regarding the phone.

You're lucky the handset didn't beat up the housing, with not a single shred of packing material. First and foremost, you should have sent packing instructions, and for $10 you were due more than this pathetic packing job. You need to tell the seller to wrap the base of the phone separate from the handset with bubble wrap and to be sure there is plenty of packing material in the box, so the parts don't move or hit each other.

You can't assume any seller, except maybe a long-time phone collector, will know how to pack a phone. They're very unusual--heavy yet delicate--and most people don't realize they can self-destruct inside the box.

I wonder if most postal employees in the US would even accept this box, with the phone poking out of it like that? That tape over the part that stuck out is kind of amusing. As if that would protect it from a heavy box being laid on top of it.

What you received is a damaged phone and the seller owes you at least half the cost back and the $10 packing charge back. I don't know what the rules are for Kijiji, but this seller needs negative feedback if at all possible and you need to file an "item not as described" if that's possible and initiate a refund or whatever you can get. You didn't buy a damaged phone and that's what you got, and it's the seller's fault. Don't let the fact that it was a relative bargain stop you from getting a refund. Other people need to be warned about this seller's packing or lack of it.

There is no feedback for Kijiji, It is buyer beware. You are buying at your own risk when asking them to ship. Kijiji is meant to be pick up at the sellers.

I have 2 more phones coming this week. Both off Kijiji. Each of the sellers assured me that they are well packed.One is a Centurion Rotary Payphone and the seller said he took it to UPS store to have packed and shipped.The other is a 1938 Ivory Diakon GPO 332 phone. The senders father had this phone for over 50 years and she said that it has been in the family home all her life. So she made sure it was well packed.

My wife was trained by UPS how to pack fragile items when she worked in shipping, so they should have done a good job packing that centurion. But the white phone looks sharp, hope she does in fact pack it well. It'd be a shame if something happened to that one.

I had hoped I would never have to make an entry in this thread. But, I guess it was inevitable. It's kinda sad it had to happen to a phone that was a gift from my dear old mom. This was a disaster from the word go anyway, in part because the post office really hates me. They have refused to ship packages to my home address for years now, and also refuse to give package notifications. I have complained so many times in person that I am banned from the branch office. I have written the postmaster general and my congressperson. Never gotten more than an automated response and no improvement. However, this one is all on the seller. My mom forgot that I have packages sent to my office address, and sent it to my home. So it got returned to New Mexico, all the way across the country. Then it got reposted and sent to my work address. The seller used the smallest possible box and just two chunks of styrofoam. Naturally I got a box of plastic bits. However, because it's a quality Western Electric product built with pride at a time when quality meant something it still works fine. Behold my sadness:

Sorry for your loss Butch. :'(It just amazes me that anyone thinks that packing something loose in a box is a good plan. I have had no end of things from eBay sellers that are just rattling about with no padding whatsoever. Miraculously the majority manage to survive, but quite a few have not.I always assume that any package is likely to be dropped or thrown at some point in its journey, so ensure that anything I pack is well padded and has good clearance from the sides of the box. I then always give the box a bit of a shake and if anything moves I will add extra padding.

Well, looks like it's time for my first submission to the "Bad Packing" awards. My fiance decided to get me a Snoopy Animated Telephone for my birthday. I'm not very into the novelty phones, but it was a cute one. The eBay seller shipped it in a very large box and wrapped the phone only in postal paper! The box itself was broken when it arrived. Shockingly, the only visible physical damage was to Snoopy's sunglasses (one of the arms broke off). Needless to say, the animation did not work at all.

Ugh. Sad day for me. I got a Blue/Gold Celebrity on eBay. i've wanted this combination for a while, but haven't seen one. And sadly, it arrived shattered.

The seller took efforts to protect it. The phone was wrapped in bubble wrap and surrounded by crumpled newspaper. However, IMHO, the box was too big and allowed for too much movement. The base appeared to be almost completely upside down when I removed it in pieces.

I recently got the idea in my head that I need a green WE 500. I figured it would look nice on my desk at work and they seem to be the cheapest ones on eBay. So I ordered one and when it finally arrived it was cracked in several places. It was packed in a medium flat rate box w/ shredded paper and cardboard.

So then I figure iíll get another one and use the first for parts. So I bought another on eBay, and sure enough it was crushed worst than the first! Same medium flat rate box, but this time in bubble wrap.

Neither packages looked crushed or in bad shape.

I actually have another one on the way. Iím not hopeful at this point. I told them to pack it carefully. Iím in the market for green 500 shells, by the way! Iím also open to other ideas for what to do with the phone bases (I was thinking about making subsets, but donít know where to start or what I build them in).