I'm not that worried about toylines, at least not yet. Then again here in northern europe hasbro has done so half ass job, that anything would be better than that. I don't think that hasbro has done such a wonderful job with TF-brand anyways, so maybe this is the change many of us have hoped. I kind of doubt that disney would suddenly bury whole tf-brand and hasbro might have done just the same in the future, who knows.

My only worry is, that there would be one gigantic entertainment monopoly that can dictate all the rules. Monopolies are seldom a very good thing.

BTW; did you know that disney kind of owns companies that make porn as well.

KUMA-NIN Maximus wrote: But other than that, they will not give third parties that are trying to rip-off the Transformers fanbase a cease and desist. Because as I said before, if they are not a threat, then there is no point of going after them.

Something like Hercules and Green Giant would be attacked by a fleet of lawyers.

Honestly, I am thinking you absorbed way too much of the latter half of the Michael Eisner years. I mean, he went from getting Epcot Center off the ground to making decisions that even I, a lifelong Disney fan, want nothing to do with them. But if you noticed, he is gone and Robert Iger is trying to fix the damage that Eisner did in the end. I mean, he had Disney buy Pixar from Steve Jobs because he believed in the people that worked there. He helped buy Marvel because Disney neglected their male demographic. LucasArts was bought because both he and Lucas wanted the fans to know Star Wars will soon return to its former glory. And even though they own Marvel Toys (formerly ToyBiz), they gave all of their Marvel-based business to Hasbro.

And yet, you know what? FUNimation is worse than Disney. Their entire history consists of them doing so many cease and desist letters that their lawyers would have been clones of Fenrir. It did not matter if you purchased the domain name, your web name reflects a property they licensed, nor did it matter if they did not obtain the license yet. If they are interested in it, they will make sure that nobody can get in their way. It does not matter if they were not going to lose money. For them, if it was a molecular of a risk... It is to be eliminated. Atop of that, they disregarded the more hardcore fanbase tied to Ouran High School Host Club, Detective Conan, and Keroro Gunso (among others) by completely rewriting the scripts for the English dub. And atop of that, they are suing AD Vision and those tied to the company for a fallout on an agreement and lost of money. And quite honestly, they could find the means to gnaw on Disney's bones if Disney ripped them off in some way. Plus, many blame them for monopolizing anime, on account that they always acquire more anime each year than they can produce. Meaning more means to tell fans to surrender anything tied to their properties or be sued.

Yet, the employees there make you forget it... Much like how you forget that voice actors like Steve Blum have worked for Disney. Or how your attitude is like a 1980s church was towards Dungeons & Dragons. (FYI, I was treated this way by a neighbor because I was a former D&D player.) All because it is either excusable in your own way or you meet those that give you a reason to look past these acts.

And with Disney, you will find them donate to schools, to relief funds outside of Japan, or anything. Because unlike FUNimation, they are - to date - one of the biggest supporters of education. They have affordable college programs, and other programs that could land you work that is neither fast food nor janitorial. They donate millions, annually, to music and art projects. They are always there when donations are needed. And, much like Hasbro and every other company you excluded, they only asked that their property be respected... As you do not see them pull a Lego and steal from innocent bystanders, much like those do to them.

Yeah... Such horrible people for having a policy that says all you have to do is obtain permission to use what is owned by them. I mean, they oppose third-party Transformers (Hasbro)... Financially screwed any company that wanted to make Battlefield III (LucasArts)... Or disallowed any refunds no matter how bad their virtual products were (Sony).

Oh, and instead of going on with this valid point... I will just point out that I have a cousin who once worked for Disney. She was a producer for their gaming and CD-ROM department(s), as well as worked within their Imagineer department. She now works for Harmonix and was involved with a large number of their games. But when she did work for Disney, she So I am guessing you are going to hate her as well, huh?

Last edited by KNM2012 on Tue Nov 06, 2012 9:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

Motto:"Tell my tale to those who ask. Tell it truly; the ill deeds along with the good, and let me be judged accordingly. The rest ... is silence."

Weapon: Twin Shock-Concussion Missiles

chuckdawg1999 wrote:While I know most people are concerned about the toys, I'm more interested in how a merger could affect the media, namely the Hub. Would Disney allow Hasbro to be involved in a network that's direct competition to their networks?

If Disney bought Hasbro, the Hub would be part of that deal since Hasbro owns 50% of the Hub.

Motto:"Tell my tale to those who ask. Tell it truly; the ill deeds along with the good, and let me be judged accordingly. The rest ... is silence."

Weapon: Twin Shock-Concussion Missiles

KUMA-NIN Maximus wrote:3) Hasbro is doing fine simply because Disney gives them a lot of their business. Meaning that the only difference between being a Disney-based subsidiary and now is the fact the former gives them permanent rights to the Disney-owned toylines they already make.

Except for the fact that Mattel makes the majority of Disney retail products, including the very large Disney Princess segment which I'd love to see Hasbro get (hey maybe that could be the catalyst that brings Jem back which Hasbro is really missing out on with the whole Barbie Popstar thing that my 3.5 year old daughter loves right now).

As far as your challenge, my answer is simple. Some people just flat out dont like Disney, what they stand for, or their track record. Discussing why we dont like it could cause moral, ethical, or political debates that you really dont want here. Disney is one of those things that people either love or hate. So if I dont like what you like, that makes me childish ???

As far as your challenge, my answer is simple. Some people just flat out dont like Disney, what they stand for, or their track record. Discussing why we dont like it could cause moral, ethical, or political debates that you really dont want here. Disney is one of those things that people either love or hate. So if I dont like what you like, that makes me childish ???

You guys can discuss whatever in this topic ... just don't bait and troll people and back up your statements. This is a discussion board. Differences in opinions are more than welcome here.

Disney (Walt, himself, for starters)supported the Nazi party, before and during WWII; Walt Hated Jewish persons; and ripped off the Grimm Fairy-tales as well as ruined MANY stories and myths of folklore... (i.e. : 'Hercules', 'Aladdin', Hans Christian-Anderson's 'The Little Mermaid', 'Tarzan', 'The Muppets',now 'Star Wars', and 'Indiana Jones', ETC...) And produced all of those lame-ass musicals. THE Disney Co. refused to pay any of its animators any royalties on the characters and designs and the stories that they created on their own...(i.e. : Hanna-Barbera, who left to create their own company when Walt refused to let them retain the rights to Donald Duck, Goofy, And other characters that THEY CREATED...)Yes, Walt created Mickey Mouse, but that's it!!He took advantage of the talents of many young creators and Animators...And stole ideas and never paid for them!! THAT's just the beginning of How EVIL and tainted that company is...

Motto:"Tell my tale to those who ask. Tell it truly; the ill deeds along with the good, and let me be judged accordingly. The rest ... is silence."

Weapon: Twin Shock-Concussion Missiles

Oncoming Storm wrote:Disney (Walt, himself, for starters)supported the Nazi party, before and during WWII; Walt Hated Jewish persons; and ripped off the Grimm Fairy-tales as well as ruined MANY stories and myths of folklore... (i.e. : 'Hercules', 'Aladdin', Hans Christian-Anderson's 'The Little Mermaid', 'Tarzan', 'The Muppets',now 'Star Wars', and 'Indiana Jones', ETC...) And produced all of those lame-ass musicals. THE Disney Co. refused to pay any of its animators any royalties on the characters and designs and the stories that they created on their own...(i.e. : Hanna-Barbera, who left to create their own company when Walt refused to let them retain the rights to Donald Duck, Goofy, And other characters that THEY CREATED...)

The bit about Walt being a supporter of the Nazi party is blown way out of proportion. You can read more about this here at straightdope.com.

As for the part about royalties, we'll be on opposite sides of the fence on that one. This doesn't make Walt Disney evil ... it all just comes down to what was agreed upon at the time of hiring. I do not think that creative people should be entitled to royalties for anything they created while working for a company unless that was agreed upon when they were hired. They were hired for their creative talents and ability to come up with ideas that the company could sell. They shouldn't be entitled to royalties any more than a factory worker should be entitled to royalties for a car, toy or electronics device that they helped build in a factory.

Some companies these days don't even allow you to do paid freelance work and even go so far as to have you sign documents that say that anything you do outside of your job that is along the lines of what you do at your job is considered work done for the company. I was presented with some legal paperwork along those lines at my job about four years ago after working there for almost a year. I refused to sign the paperwork because I was concerned about the implications it would have on Seibertron.com. I was fired a week later and don't regret it for a moment.

Bottom line ... employees that are concerned about royalties should make sure they are entitled to them at the time of employment. If you don't secure your rights to royalties yet create something amazingly popular during your time at the company, then you are simply S.O.L. in my opinion.

Yes, Walt created Mickey Mouse, but that's it!!He took advantage of the talents of many young creators and Animators...And stole ideas and never paid for them!! THAT's just the beginning of How EVIL and tainted that company is...

He didn't take advantage of the many young creators and animators that WORKED for him as his employees. They were doing their job as his employees so that they could collect a paycheck to pay their bills, support their families and put food on the table ... just like all of us. That's not evil at all. That's just business. Plain and simple.

Seibertron wrote:He didn't take advantage of the many young creators and animators that WORKED for him as his employees. They were doing their job as his employees so that they could collect a paycheck to pay their bills, support their families and put food on the table ... just like all of us. That's not evil at all. That's just business. Plain and simple.

That is taking advantage of them, though. If they want to work with the skills they actually had they had to do what he told them to. What are they gonna do, risk being unable to feed their families?

Motto:"Tell my tale to those who ask. Tell it truly; the ill deeds along with the good, and let me be judged accordingly. The rest ... is silence."

Weapon: Twin Shock-Concussion Missiles

Handels-Messerschmitt wrote:

Seibertron wrote:He didn't take advantage of the many young creators and animators that WORKED for him as his employees. They were doing their job as his employees so that they could collect a paycheck to pay their bills, support their families and put food on the table ... just like all of us. That's not evil at all. That's just business. Plain and simple.

That is taking advantage of them, though. If they want to work with the skills they actually had they had to do what he told them to. What are they gonna do, risk being unable to feed their families?

As I mentioned above, I risked my job and lost my job because of Seibertron.com. I feel they should've risked it as well. It's no different than you or I. Are you part of some royalties program at your work? I'd be surprised if any of you are. Why does that make Walt Disney evil if people were doing the jobs they were hired for?

Because the circumstances in which people are hired are not equal. You agree to it in a legal sense but if you don't agree to employment anywhere you will be without income and unable to pay for a home, clothes, healthcare and food. You are under far more pressure to be hired by anyone than anyone is under to hire you, specifically. Companies know this very well and make the most of it.

Oncoming Storm wrote:Disney (Walt, himself, for starters)supported the Nazi party, before and during WWII; Walt Hated Jewish persons; and ripped off the Grimm Fairy-tales as well as ruined MANY stories and myths of folklore... (i.e. : 'Hercules', 'Aladdin', Hans Christian-Anderson's 'The Little Mermaid', 'Tarzan', 'The Muppets',now 'Star Wars', and 'Indiana Jones', ETC...) And produced all of those lame-ass musicals. THE Disney Co. refused to pay any of its animators any royalties on the characters and designs and the stories that they created on their own...(i.e. : Hanna-Barbera, who left to create their own company when Walt refused to let them retain the rights to Donald Duck, Goofy, And other characters that THEY CREATED...)

The bit about Walt being a supporter of the Nazi party is blown way out of proportion. You can read more about this here at straightdope.com.

It's a moot point anyway on supporting the Nazis anyway - America hated Jews and agreed with the Nazis rounding them up. Might as well point the finger at your grandparents and great-grandparents. If Japan hadn't bombed Pearl Harbor, the US would not have gotten involved. It wasn't until the combination of being attacked and the reveal of concentration camps that America had morals about the situation.

Anyway, look at what could go wrong based on what Disney owns and has done. Look at what could go right based upon those same ideas. Base predictions about Disney's morals off of description of past events and current holdings, not emotions.

What could go wrong? IDW's contract could run out and the license be taken back to Marvel. Not likely, but it would be cost-effective, contractually.

What could go right? Disney loves retail product and getting more product out there. This could mean more, potentially better, toys for us.

Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'

Motto:"Government didn't create the problem, government IS the problem."

Weapon: X-Ray Laser Cannon

After the deft handling that Disney has made of the Marvel properties, I would trust them with any franchise. Frankly the Transformers brand has flourished in spite of Hasbro rather than because of it for most its lifetime. Maybe now we'll get better shows and more continuity rather than rebooting every 3 years.

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits"

cor2879 wrote:Maybe now we'll get better shows and more continuity rather than rebooting every 3 years.

The G1 continuity lasted for 16 years, and (to a small extent) is still growing.

The Unicron Trilogy lasted 4 years, as did the Movie Trilogy.

The Aligned continuity debuted in 2010 and it's going to last for the next decade.

Yep. Reboot every 3 years.

Last edited by PrymeStriker on Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.

By "Kim Yura" & "Zimmo81"

Henry921 wrote:You can always be counted on to listen to reason, Pryme.

Dead Metal wrote:Have you ever, and i mean ever seen/read/heard something that is completely original and does not copy/homage/pay tribute to something else? Here's a hint: Nope. You never have and you never will.

Oncoming Storm wrote:Disney (Walt, himself, for starters)supported the Nazi party, before and during WWII; Walt Hated Jewish persons; and ripped off the Grimm Fairy-tales as well as ruined MANY stories and myths of folklore... (i.e. : 'Hercules', 'Aladdin', Hans Christian-Anderson's 'The Little Mermaid', 'Tarzan', 'The Muppets',now 'Star Wars', and 'Indiana Jones', ETC...) And produced all of those lame-ass musicals. THE Disney Co. refused to pay any of its animators any royalties on the characters and designs and the stories that they created on their own...(i.e. : Hanna-Barbera, who left to create their own company when Walt refused to let them retain the rights to Donald Duck, Goofy, And other characters that THEY CREATED...)Yes, Walt created Mickey Mouse, but that's it!!He took advantage of the talents of many young creators and Animators...And stole ideas and never paid for them!! THAT's just the beginning of How EVIL and tainted that company is...

And yet, anything done by Disney that was in regard to the Nazi Party was anti-Nazi propaganda. "Education For Death," "Der Fueher's Face," and so on. Plus, this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JStrcfHr8AY

In "Education For Death," he detailed the upbringing of a German child in Nazi Germany. How they were raised and grown to be nothing but good Nazi soldiers who will die. And this video points out that hatred is based on the fact your emotional side has greater control of your rational side. And to know the difference between truth and even stuff you said.

So yes, he was anti-Communist during the Red Scare. Yes, he took credit for his animator's works. Yes, did some stuff that was not fair. But he was not an antisemitic, and only his family supported the Nazi party before they had shown their true colors. Because if you know your history, the Nazi party claimed to represent the working people of Germany. And it was not until Hitler took over, did nobody (outside his circle) know what his plans were for Jews, Islam, homosexuals, and foreigners.

In all cases, there is no truth that Walt Disney knew that the Nazi party was going down that path before it did. And once he did, he made it clear that he did not approve. He also did not approve the way Anaheim started to look after he had built Disneyland, which is why he had built Walt Disney World. Shall we contend that doing that is a sign of hating Disney?

How about the fact that despite his beginnings, he was voted "Man of the Year" by the B'nai B'rith in Beverly Hills, a Jewish organization? Should we condone them as well? Should we also ignore all the good both he and his company have done?

How about we also boycott both Paramount and DC Comics for this cartoon? While we are at it, we have to boycott Warner Brothers because they made racist cartoons. We also must boycott Square Enix on account they made a Huck Finn game that has a racist depiction of Jim. Shueisha, Viz Media, Weekly Jump, Shonen Jump, and Toei for One Piece.

Point being is that if you look at the years when they say he was pro-Nazi, you will find that it is inconsistent with when the Nazi party was anti-Jewish. That if you look at the point, starting with Snow White and beyond, you would see that he had changed. After his death, his company evolved into many things. The most notable was the Michael Eisner era.

So yes, Walt Disney did take credit for other people's work. But so did so many other writers and creators after him. Yes, he was anti-Communist but he was not antisemitic according to those within the Jewish community. And after he became a major force prior to his death, he did a lot of good which even Roy Disney himself noted.

And besides... If you started a business, would you like it if we posted everything you said here as a means of preventing you from obtaining business? Think about that. Because I, for one, know what it is like to be called a Nazi just because my last name is German. I also know what it is like to have this kind of hatred be placed on me. And I know that people go by emotion-backed assumptions instead of intelligence-backed fact checking when they choose to hate first... Learn last.

Motto:"Government didn't create the problem, government IS the problem."

Weapon: X-Ray Laser Cannon

PrymeStriker wrote:

cor2879 wrote:Maybe now we'll get better shows and more continuity rather than rebooting every 3 years.

The G1 continuity lasted for 16 years, and (to a small extent) is still growing.

How do you get 16 years? Are you counting from the first episode in 1984 to the beginning of RID? There is no possibly way that counts considering that for most of that time the Transformers franchise was Dead (certainly here in the States it was). No, there is no way that G1 continuity lasted 16 years. We got, at best, 4 years - maybe 6 if you count Beast Wars.

PrymeStriker wrote:The Unicron Trilogy lasted 4 years, as did the Movie Trilogy.

That's exactly what I'm talking about, those things weren't very good. And really, 4 years is not much longer than 3. At best this is a technicality, at worst it is an example of how poorly the Transformers IP has been mismanaged for most of its lifetime.

PrymeStriker wrote:Yep. Reboot every 3 years.

Try to be a little less literal. Three years, four years - my point is that Transformers gets rebooted, a lot and I would much rather see a longer term focus on developing a richer, singular continuity. I suppose I'm also still a bit jaded that Beast Wars was canned just as it was getting really good, as did Transformers Animated. Everything that came in between those two shows (TV wise at least) was terrible, in my opinion.

Last edited by cor2879 on Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits"

cor2879 wrote:How do you get 16 years? Are you counting from the first episode in 1984 to the beginning of RID? There is no possibly way that counts considering that for most of that time the Transformers franchise was Dead (certainly here in the States it was). No, there is no way that G1 continuity lasted 16 years. We got, at best, 4 years - maybe 6 if you count Beast Wars.

Yes, I was counting 1984-2000. However, the original "The Transformers" franchise lasted 7 years (1984-1991). Then we got G2 from 93-95 and the Beast Era from 96-2000. 13 years of the G1 continuity family.

By "Kim Yura" & "Zimmo81"

Henry921 wrote:You can always be counted on to listen to reason, Pryme.

Dead Metal wrote:Have you ever, and i mean ever seen/read/heard something that is completely original and does not copy/homage/pay tribute to something else? Here's a hint: Nope. You never have and you never will.

Motto:"Government didn't create the problem, government IS the problem."

Weapon: X-Ray Laser Cannon

The last new episode of "The Transformers" aired in 1987. I remember it well because I was excited about the new season that would feature Fortress Maximus and the Headmasters (and Optimus Prime) only to discover that it was a mere three episodes.

I realize that in Japan there were more episodes and more shows that lasted until 1991, but for me as a kid with no means of even knowing about what was going on in Japan, Transformers ended in 1987. Hasbro's involvement with any sort of Transformers TV show certainly ended then. G2 may count as a product line and as a comic, but on TV it was just rehashed or (poorly) remastered episodes of G1, certainly that doesn't count as TV continuity.

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits"

KUMA-NIN Maximus wrote:3) Hasbro is doing fine simply because Disney gives them a lot of their business. Meaning that the only difference between being a Disney-based subsidiary and now is the fact the former gives them permanent rights to the Disney-owned toylines they already make.

Except for the fact that Mattel makes the majority of Disney retail products, including the very large Disney Princess segment which I'd love to see Hasbro get (hey maybe that could be the catalyst that brings Jem back which Hasbro is really missing out on with the whole Barbie Popstar thing that my 3.5 year old daughter loves right now).

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