[QUOTE=Slapstick;525723]As far as LBs go, Harrison is past Joey Porter and up there with Lloyd, IMO...

I think Harrison is as good a pass rusher as either one but better against the run than both...

And, let us not forget the small matter of the longest scoring play in Super Bowl history...[/QUOTE]

Harrison is better that ALL our 3/4 OLBer BY FAR.

Actually you got Lloyd wrong. He was MUCH better versus the run than he was a pass rusher.
Harrison is better at destroying blockers when the run comes at him, Glloyd was much better in pursuit, and had a Troy like burst mode.
Both Harrison and Lloyd were rare 3/4 OLBers capable of getting 100 plus total tackles
Harrison gets WAY more sacks than Lloyd, but they get a similar number of tackles versus the run.
Lloyd was a very good but not great pass rusher.
His sacks just tended to be of the spectacular fashion, and were the stuff of highlights

Harrison has BOTH skillsets. He can bullrush an OT or dominate an elite RB with equal effectiveness.

We had a great set of OLBERs in Lloyd and Greene.

Harrison is the best of both on one package.

Healthy Harrison during his DPOY era has no peers among Steeler 3/4 LBs period.
IMHO ONLY LT was in his class, period.
Talk of Demarcus Ware being better is RIDICULOUS, as is comparisons with any other one trick pony pass rush specialist out there.

Harrisons peak, like Lloyd is going to be too short lived to recognize his historical greatness.

09-28-2012, 06:34 AM

Slapstick

[QUOTE=Captain Lemming;525740]Harrison is better that ALL our 3/4 OLBer BY FAR.

Actually you got Lloyd wrong. He was MUCH better versus the run than he was a pass rusher.
Harrison is better at destroying blockers when the run comes at him, Glloyd was much better in pursuit, and had a Troy like burst mode.
Both Harrison and Lloyd were rare 3/4 OLBers capable of getting 100 plus total tackles
Harrison gets WAY more sacks than Lloyd, but they get a similar number of tackles versus the run.
Lloyd was a very good but not great pass rusher.
His sacks just tended to be of the spectacular fashion, and were the stuff of highlights

Harrison has BOTH skillsets. He can bullrush an OT or dominate an elite RB with equal effectiveness.

We had a great set of OLBERs in Lloyd and Greene.

Harrison is the best of both on one package.

Healthy Harrison during his DPOY era has no peers among Steeler 3/4 LBs period.
IMHO ONLY LT was in his class, period.
Talk of Demarcus Ware being better is RIDICULOUS, as is comparisons with any other one trick pony pass rush specialist out there.

Harrisons peak, like Lloyd is going to be too short lived to recognize his historical greatness.[/QUOTE]

I think that Lloyd was a great pass rusher who didn't have the opportunities that Harrison did because he played in a different era...

I think that Harrison is better against the run for much the same reason...

I do agree that, especially the DPOY season, Harrison had no peer at 3-4 OLB with the exception of LT...

09-28-2012, 09:32 AM

steelz09

I do remember Lloyd getting blown up by the Cowboys in that SB. They ran those sweeps or whatever and pulled those HUGE o-lineman and Lloyd didn't have the size to hold up. That's not a knock on him... Dallas o-line was huge for that era

09-28-2012, 10:32 AM

phillyesq

[QUOTE=lloydroid;525718]If this is it for James, the question is, where does he rank in your all time favorite Steeler? If he is done, he might not have had enough seasons to displace Greg Lloyd as my all time favorite ever. But he was on his way to the top of my list. Maybe not now.[/QUOTE]

That is an interesting question. Harrison has been my favorite player for the past few seasons, with Ward and Troy right up there. I've always favored the right OLB - Lloyd, Porter and now Harrison. Harrison has probably surpassed Porter for me, but Porter's performance in the playoffs leading up to the SB, especially against Indy, gives him a special spot.

09-28-2012, 10:57 AM

SanAntonioSteelerFan

[QUOTE=phillyesq;525760]That is an interesting question. Harrison has been my favorite player for the past few seasons, with Ward and Troy right up there. I've always favored the right OLB - Lloyd, Porter and now Harrison. Harrison has probably surpassed Porter for me, but [COLOR=#00ff00][B]Porter's performance in the playoffs leading up to the SB, especially against Indy, gives him a special spot.[/B][/COLOR][/QUOTE]

Agreed. Of course Harrison has his own little claim on a post-season special spot! Haley may be the only [I]coach[/I] that ever made Kurt Warner curse, but I think Harrison caused him to utter another one at the end of the half in that SB ;-)

09-28-2012, 12:22 PM

ikestops85

I think Harrison has given his all for this team and I always loved his effort. He certainly ranks high in my list of Steeler linebackers but he is nowhere near the top. I think Jack Ham was the greatest linebacker we have ever had. I think he doesn't get the acclaim because he never had the attitude of Lambert, Lloyd, Porter or Harrison.

Ham was unbelievable against the run and tremendous against the pass. He didn't get many sack totals because it wasn't often that we blitzed in that day and age. Watching the Ratbirds game the other night they put a stat up about Ray Lewis. He is second for linebackers creating turnovers. The guy in first place, but a big margin, was Jack Ham.

Ham is the Man!!!

09-28-2012, 01:10 PM

Captain Lemming

[QUOTE=Slapstick;525743]I think that Lloyd was a great pass rusher who didn't have the opportunities that Harrison did because he played in a different era...

I think that Harrison is better against the run for much the same reason...

I do agree that, especially the DPOY season, Harrison had no peer at 3-4 OLB with the exception of LT...[/QUOTE]

Glloyd had 10 sacks ONCE in his career. Dude averaged like 7 during his prime.
Talking eras? His own teamate Kevin Greene would surpass 10 sacks routinely.
Chad Brown was moved from inside for ONE SEASON to OLBer in replacing Lloyd and bested Lloyds CAREER high number of sacks.
Same era exact same position, one season.

Lloyds sacks were just far more beautiful. Dude looked like a missile aimed at the QB, or a big cat in pursuit of the kill. Often he created turnovers.
But he needed to come off cleanly, tackles would engulf him. They needed to mix it up more with him in coverage because if you KNEW he was coming, you could stop him.

People forget the dude was a beast versus the run. Twice the run defender of most of our 3/4 OLBers.

Harrison though is better at both because he is stronger.

09-28-2012, 01:16 PM

Captain Lemming

[QUOTE=ikestops85;525767]I think Harrison has given his all for this team and I always loved his effort. He certainly ranks high in my list of Steeler linebackers but he is nowhere near the top. I think Jack Ham was the greatest linebacker we have ever had. I think he doesn't get the acclaim because he never had the attitude of Lambert, Lloyd, Porter or Harrison.

Ham was unbelievable against the run and tremendous against the pass. He didn't get many sack totals because it wasn't often that we blitzed in that day and age. Watching the Ratbirds game the other night they put a stat up about Ray Lewis. He is second for linebackers creating turnovers. The guy in first place, but a big margin, was Jack Ham.

Ham is the Man!!![/QUOTE]

I dont compare 70s guys because it was like a different position.
Ham was more like Troy (when he plays in the box) just more consistent and less spectacular.
How often did Ham have to fight through an OT to make a play. Harrison gets HELD by them every week.

A guy like Woodley plays a role more akin to LC Greenwood than LBers of that era. Harrison is a blend.

09-28-2012, 01:23 PM

Oviedo

[QUOTE=ikestops85;525767]I think Harrison has given his all for this team and I always loved his effort. He certainly ranks high in my list of Steeler linebackers but he is nowhere near the top. I think Jack Ham was the greatest linebacker we have ever had. I think he doesn't get the acclaim because he never had the attitude of Lambert, Lloyd, Porter or Harrison.

Ham was unbelievable against the run and tremendous against the pass. He didn't get many sack totals because it wasn't often that we blitzed in that day and age. Watching the Ratbirds game the other night they put a stat up about Ray Lewis. He is second for linebackers creating turnovers. The guy in first place, but a big margin, was Jack Ham.

Ham is the Man!!![/QUOTE]

Talent wise Ham was the best ever, however no player set the tone for an entire defense like Lambert. He more thsan any player not named Joe Greene personified what an entire defense was all about.

My top list:

1. Ham
2. Lambert
3. Lloyd
4. Harrison
5. Kirkland

Players who did not do it for as long I really liked: Keven Greene, Chad Brown and Loren Toews. Toews was always a favorite of mine growing up. Chad Brown would have been a star had he remained in the 'Burgh.