I dont mind paying for people who may not be as well off as I. Your sentiment is one of self worth. You woof are no more important than the bum sleeping under the cardboard box. Do you think that your life is worth more than his.

And once more your rhetoric is all about you, dont worry about anyone else.

Here's some rhetoric about "us". We DO pay for people here in America that aren't as well off. No person can be turned away from any hospital, and there are numerous charity orgs around that lend a hand to those in need. I know. I was at a point once where I needed such help, with a small child in tow, and that help was there and in just the right form and abundance.... I got through a very tough time because of it.

Here's the issue, perception; Obama is trying to put in place a plan that reaches more people, but without focusing on whats really effecting the cost and waste of healthcare. He's just adding to our overhead, and taxing those evil rich people to pay for it. Yes, he'll reach more people (which we agree - helping others is a good thing), but at the expense of stressing an already over stretched system. In fact, he'll reduce the quality of the care most of us are currently getting, overall. That coupled with the fact that treatment decisions will be made by pundits in DC, and not left between you and your doctor, makes for "bad medicine" in my view.

We all want to improve the system we have, perception. We realize it needs fixing, and cannot be sustained the way we are going. The debate is about HOW, not IF.

The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.

So why can so many other countries afford it? And consider the cost as a % of population.

Well....I guess it all depends on what the definition of "is" is. LOL Sorry....not sure you'll understand that famous quote from former President Clinton. How can other countries "afford" it? Well....if the US would stop throwing money at other countries, maybe we could afford many other things. Let's close all our military bases around the world....let's stop sending aid to other countries....become more of an isolated country and just focus on our own people....and maybe we could afford it. I have no study to back this up, but I would be willing to bet that the US of A spends more money in other countries, both in actual dollars and percentage, than any other country. But, we do have to protect certain interests and for some reason we are looked at as the world watch dog. I wish it wasn't true....but it is....and in most cases it goes as unappreciated. So that is one big reason we can't afford it.

In addition....I think the way our country was formed many people still think of the US of A as a country where you make your own way. I don't know why, but other countries, especially in Europe, seem to be more of a "spread the wealth" type of mentality. I guess this is what separates America from the rest of the world. Many come here because of these opportunities....and I guess some go to socialist style countries if they like that. Personally, I prefer the US over any other place to live...at least for now. But maybe that's just me.

After all, we Americans know about other countries' health care systems better than the residents....and why do other countries think we're arrogant again?

How is that any more arrogant than for those same residents to lecture us on why we need to adopt their system (completely ignoring the fact that as countries go, the US is more similar to the EU than to most other countries)?

‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...

After all, we Americans know about other countries' health care systems better than the residents....and why do other countries think we're arrogant again?

Because they have to talk to you?

Welcome back Mr Reading Comprehension. Now lets look at the sentence from my post that you quoted. I used the word perhaps. That word is an indication of a "possible" condition or scenario. You could get real simple and say "guess" if you wanted to. Where in my post did I say I knew ANYTHING about Australian healthcare? I didn't. I ventured a guess that perhaps it wasn't so perfect if it needs reform. Why else would it need reform? It it ain't broke dont fix it. Perhaps you should review the meaning of reform?

I dont mind paying for people who may not be as well off as I. Your sentiment is one of self worth. You woof are no more important than the bum sleeping under the cardboard box. Do you think that your life is worth more than his.

And once more your rhetoric is all about you, dont worry about anyone else.

Emphasis mine.

Actually I am more important than anyone else. That includes my family. It just depends on who you ask. If you asked my family who was more important, me or the bum (such a dehumanizing term tsk tsk) under the box, my family will say me. Why because I provide for them. I love them. I teach them. I have fun with them. The bum does nothing for them. I'll put myself and my family before anyone else. That maybe selfish to you. Frankly I dont care. At least my family knows their interests and welfare come first and I wont be off giving away the family fortune to box dwellers.

And I do worry about others. That why I volunteer and donate both time and money to causes and individuals that I CHOOSE for myself.
The great thing is I don't care what you think of me. I give a lot to many people and teach my children to do the same. I just dont need the govt to decide for me.

I would ask why Woof isn't taking advantage of the many free services already available to people in that condition. Including health care. I would ask why Woof isn't taking advantage of the many charity services to people in that condition. Finally, I would ask why Woof is chatting in an internet forum when his family is starving under a cardboard box!

How is that any more arrogant than for those same residents to lecture us on why we need to adopt their system (completely ignoring the fact that as countries go, the US is more similar to the EU than to most other countries)?

Maybe you're right as far as measurements, but I don't care for the comparison. I'd like to think that we're still far different from the EU. You can draw correlations, sure, but foundation and principles still distinguish us. I'm hoping, at least, that we can maintain distinction.

Not just to be different, mind you. I'd be happy if they adopted more of our stuff, e.g., individual rights, right to bear arms, smaller government, states rights, right to chose a private health plan, and to determine your own fate with your doctor, etc. etc.; the core stuff.

The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.

Maybe you're right as far as measurements, but I don't care for the comparison. I'd like to think that we're still far different from the EU. [...]

I think you're missing my point. The US is made up of 50 states which, were they not part of the US, would be similar to countries elsewhere. It's a _far_ more heterogeneous environment than most countries, i.e. more comparable to a union of separate nations than a single homogeneous nation. Much as we sell the melting pot idea, a USian in Hawaii is not necessarily exactly like a USian in Alaska, California, Texas, New York, etc.

‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...

Naked nurses??? Have you guys been to the hospital lately? Most of the staff in the last two cities I have lived in are overweight out of shape chain smoking creatures that I would rather not see in clothes let alone naked.
Of course your mileage may vary

Here's some rhetoric about "us". We DO pay for people here in America that aren't as well off. No person can be turned away from any hospital, and there are numerous charity orgs around that lend a hand to those in need. ....

Then how could medical expenses be the leading cause of Bankruptcy, when...numerous charity orgs around that lend a hand to those in need.?

So if medical bills are the leading source of bankruptcy, why don't we just concentrate on catastrophic coverage rather than plans to protect every aspect of one's health bills? Seems like if you had a plan which capped your potential loss to say, $5000 (let's just say a $5000 HSA plan, where after the $5000 the plan pays at 100%), the premium would be much lower than your typical $1000 ded, 80% co-ins, physician co-pay, and prescription card plan. I find it hard to believe that anyone would be bankrupt if they had a $5,000 bill. Most hospitals would take a payment plan for that figure. But no....we have to concentrate on plans with benefits that cover day to day expenses therefore raising the premiums....so what are we trying to accomplish?

If we could get the two wealthiest leading proponents of raising taxes on folks, Warren Buffet and Bill Gates, to "contribute" more of their own money to such organizations, maybe we could fix some of this. Funny, Warren Buffet was asked in an interview why he didn't just contribute more in taxes (you can do that, volunteer to pay more in taxes) and he said he felt more comfortable having his own charitable organization determining who should get his money. Odd answer for someone who wants others to pay higher taxes. What's good for the goose evidently isn't good for the gander.

Naked nurses??? Have you guys been to the hospital lately? Most of the staff in the last two cities I have lived in are overweight out of shape chain smoking creatures that I would rather not see in clothes let alone naked.
Of course your mileage may vary

Let's just try and get Obama's new Surgeon General to lose some weight first....then we'll concentrate on the nurses. Why would you nominate a person who is over weight to be Surgeon General?....oops...sorry...."stupid" question since we are asking for common sense from Obama.