But, I know you can do breathing exercises to strengthen your lungs and use techniques to improve oxygen intake.

But for increasing performance on the bike. It will not help... Your lungs are NOT the weakest part of the chain. And the chain will only be stronger when the weakest spot(s) are becoming stronger.

Your blood is after it passed the lungs saturated with 100% of oxygen. And you can't improve it to 101%

The only performance increase with better breathing. Is that you have the same ventilation but you use less energy for breathing. But that is a very small different. Exept when you are breathing very wrong....

Your blood is after it passed the lungs saturated with 100% of oxygen. And you can't improve it to 101%

EPO can improve it, cant it? Joking of course.

All I'm saying is there are breathing techniques and exercises you can do to strenghthen your lungs and improve performance .. I've got a book somewhere about how some pro's use them, I can dig it up. Something about the rythem and depth of breathing, especially when climbing. I don't think anyone can expand their lung capacity .. if that's what you're talking about, I agree.

Your blood is after it passed the lungs saturated with 100% of oxygen. And you can't improve it to 101%

EPO can improve it, cant it? Joking of course.

All I'm saying is there are breathing techniques and exercises you can do to strenghthen your lungs and improve performance .. I've got a book somewhere about how some pro's use them, I can dig it up. Something about the rythem and depth of breathing, especially when climbing. I don't think anyone can expand their lung capacity .. if that's what you're talking about, I agree.

No, that was not what I tried to explain. I tried to explain that bigger, better lungs do not increase your cycling performance. But I did not explain it very good. I will do it again:

Increasing cycling performace is increasing your aerobic system. The bottle neck of the aerobic system are not your lungs. It is the uptake of oxygen in the muscles. So increasing your lungs does not increase your cycling performance. Normal lungs (healthy lungs of an healthy person) give oxygen to your blood. They give it till your blood has 100% of oxygen.

When you are cycling very fast. For example at your vo2max intensity. Your muscles have reached their maximum oxygen uptake. They can't consume any more of o2 (oxygen). When you go faster you are still using the same amount of oxygen. It's your vo2max. Maximum Oxygen Uptake.

But at that level your lungs can still give your blood 100% saturation with oxygen. Your muscle still get enough oxygen deliverd by blood only they can't consume it...

That's a fact. Just like eating pancakes. When we only get 1 pancake /hour we can consume them all. My maximum eating speed is for example 5 pancakes / hour. When I get 5 pancakes / hour. I eat 5 pancakes / hour. But when I get 10 pancakes / hour. I still only eat 5 pancakes / hour.
Then my eating speed is the bottle neck, not the kitchen.

For the lungs it's a little bit different because they just try to keep the blood o2 saturation at 100%. It comes in your muscles with 100%. Your muscles consume some o2 and the oxygen drops to 50%. When it comes back in the lungs it's saturated with 100% again.

It's difficult for me to explain it in english. But I hope everybody can understand what I am saying.

That's a fact. Just like eating pancakes. When we only get 1 pancake /hour we can consume them all. My maximum eating speed is for example 5 pancakes / hour. When I get 5 pancakes / hour. I eat 5 pancakes / hour. But when I get 10 pancakes / hour. I still only eat 5 pancakes / hour.Then my eating speed is the bottle neck, not the kitchen.

I'll find the book and quote it to let you know better what I read..

Anyrate, I like your pancake analogy. So, let's suppose someone has bad fork holding technique in this example. If they learn to hold their fork better, can't they increase from 5 to 6 pancakes an hour? I think that's the point, some riders can learn better breathing technique to maximize oxygen delivery efficiently. They may not yet be at "100%" without better technique.

BTW, I love pancakes the morning of a long ride. Great pre-ride food I think.

That's a fact. Just like eating pancakes. When we only get 1 pancake /hour we can consume them all. My maximum eating speed is for example 5 pancakes / hour. When I get 5 pancakes / hour. I eat 5 pancakes / hour. But when I get 10 pancakes / hour. I still only eat 5 pancakes / hour.Then my eating speed is the bottle neck, not the kitchen.

I'll find the book and quote it to let you know better what I read..

Anyrate, I like your pancake analogy. So, let's suppose someone has bad fork holding technique in this example. If they learn to hold their fork better, can't they increase from 5 to 6 pancakes an hour? I think that's the point, some riders can learn better breathing technique to maximize oxygen delivery efficiently. They may not yet be at "100%" without better technique.

BTW, I love pancakes the morning of a long ride. Great pre-ride food I think.

No, everybody (every healthy person) can have an 100% saturation. The lungs are very good in that. When your lungs can not get the 100% saturation due an lung disease or cardiac disease you will turn blue. It's not due an sportactivity that you can turn blue.

With better fork holding technique you will not increase from 5 to 6 pancakes an hour. But it takes less energy for you to eat 5 pancakes. So you have more energy for talking or other things...

I think that the (small) increase of better breathing is that it takes less energy with correct breathing techniques. So that saved energy can go to an other activity.

Don't you guys have hard races after which you can taste your lungs? For me it's the measure of a good/hard race.

Studies have show that this is from blood sucked through the Avoli (sp?) at times of maximal output. Repeating this day after day does not allow for it to heal properly and may lead to the scaring of the lung surface.

Remember to not have to many max effort days back to back.

_________________Success is how far you you bounce back up after being knocked down

breathe in breathe out :: tied to a wheel fingers got to feel :: i spin on a whim i slide to the right :: i felt you like an electric light :: for our love :: for our fear :: for our rise against the years and years and years

got a machinehead better than the rest :: green to the red machinehead :: and i walk from my machine :: i walk from my machine :: deaf dumb and thirty

starting to deserve this :: leaning on my conscience wall :: blood is like wine :: unconscious all the time :: if i had it all again :: i'd change it all

Anyway, that's pretty much my strategy when it comes to breathing technique!

That being said .. I still think that breathing techniques can improve performance, but only because pros use them (I don't, but maybe I should). But maybe that's the big part of it .. if you THINK any technique improves performance, then it probably helps (even if it's negligible) because I think so much of performance is mental anyway.

Some of the most interesting equiptment studies are the ones that also measure the placebo effect of the "All New SUPA MEGA Widget". Those that do show an inprovement far in excess of what the part will give if the rider thinks it will.

_________________Success is how far you you bounce back up after being knocked down

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests

You cannot post new topics in this forumYou cannot reply to topics in this forumYou cannot edit your posts in this forumYou cannot delete your posts in this forumYou cannot post attachments in this forum