Smart teams don't draft a scat back in the 1st round, eh? That's all fine and dandy, but he's not a scat back.

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Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:00 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Isn't Spiller considered to be this years Chris Johnson???

I wouldn't mind having a "scat back" if he runs the ball 350 times for 2000 yards & 14 tds and catches 50 balls for 500 yards & 2 tds.

Spiller all the way!

Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:14 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Isn't Spiller considered to be this years Chris Johnson???

I wouldn't mind having a "scat back" if he runs the ball 350 times for 2000 yards & 14 tds and catches 50 balls for 500 yards & 2 tds.

Spiller all the way!

Some would consider him that, yes.

To me, he is not as good an inside runner nor is he tough enough to be anything near Chris Johnson though.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:22 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Some would consider him that, yes.

To me, he is not as good an inside runner nor is he tough enough to be anything near Chris Johnson though.

To me, he is JUST as good an inside runner, maybe even better, and i think not only is he tough enough to be "near" Chris Johnson, but depending on what team drafts him, has the potential to be better than Chris Johnson.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 4:37 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

Some would consider him that, yes.

To me, he is not as good an inside runner nor is he tough enough to be anything near Chris Johnson though.

To me, he is JUST as good an inside runner, maybe even better, and i think not only is he tough enough to be "near" Chris Johnson, but depending on what team drafts him, has the potential to be better than Chris Johnson.

What makes him better than Darren McFadden? How about Reggie Bush?

I don't see it from his inside running. If there is a big hole, he is usually gone. But he rarely, if ever, creates anything of his own and gets stuffed at the line too much for my liking.

Also, he's not tough. In fact, even Jon Gruden called him out on it the other day on those segments with the top prospects that he is doing. It's always something with him.

Im not going to go into detail with you. No matter what I say, you'll have something to retaliate with.

All I have to say is that you were the one who guaranteed Hakeem Nicks to be a top 10 pick, even calling him a top 5 pick at times....he almost fell out of the first round.

So wish I could find that thread.

Well, he was better than either of the WR's that did go in the top 10. I don't remember ever saying top 5 though.

But regardless. To me, he is no different than any of the other finesse type RB's to come out the last few years. In fact, there is a reason he is not as hyped as Bush and D-Mac.

In any case, I think it is a moot point because he just does not fit the definition of a Bill Parcells player.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:04 pm

Iowafin

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Well, he was better than either of the WR's that did go in the top 10. .

Heyward-Bey, yes. Michael Crabtree, no.

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Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:18 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Well, he was better than either of the WR's that did go in the top 10. I don't remember ever saying top 5 though.

But regardless. To me, he is no different than any of the other finesse type RB's to come out the last few years. In fact, there is a reason he is not as hyped as Bush and D-Mac.

In any case, I think it is a moot point because he just does not fit the definition of a Bill Parcells player.

And what is that reason? He is the top RB in this years draft. Heads and shoulders above the next RB. I think the reason he isn't as "hyped" is because there are 2 QB's, 2 DT's and about 3 OT's that are graded above him, something the drafts of Bush and McFadden didn't really have. The talent in the 2006 draft was almost pathetic, and I have no reason why you bring up McFadden....he had a lot of negatives to him heading into the draft and was picked by the Raiders, self explanatory.

No different than any of the other finesse type RB's to come out the last few years (Chris Johnson? Felix Jones? I would be more than happy with either of them) The reason he is "mocked" out of the top 10 this year is because a lot of teams have needs or want to sell tickets so they will take a QB, otherwise he is top 10 pick.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:19 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Iowafin wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

Well, he was better than either of the WR's that did go in the top 10. .

Heyward-Bey, yes. Michael Crabtree, no.

I would say that Kenny Britt and Percy Harvin are better as well.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:21 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Iowafin wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

Well, he was better than either of the WR's that did go in the top 10. .

Heyward-Bey, yes. Michael Crabtree, no.

I would say that Kenny Britt and Percy Harvin are better as well.

That's debateable. We'll see in 2 more years.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:26 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

Well, he was better than either of the WR's that did go in the top 10. I don't remember ever saying top 5 though.

But regardless. To me, he is no different than any of the other finesse type RB's to come out the last few years. In fact, there is a reason he is not as hyped as Bush and D-Mac.

In any case, I think it is a moot point because he just does not fit the definition of a Bill Parcells player.

And what is that reason? He is the top RB in this years draft. Heads and shoulders above the next RB. I think the reason he isn't as "hyped" is because there are 2 QB's, 2 DT's and about 3 OT's that are graded above him, something the drafts of Bush and McFadden didn't really have. The talent in the 2006 draft was almost pathetic, and I have no reason why you bring up McFadden....he had a lot of negatives to him heading into the draft and was picked by the Raiders, self explanatory.

No different than any of the other finesse type RB's to come out the last few years (Chris Johnson? Felix Jones? I would be more than happy with either of them) The reason he is "mocked" out of the top 10 this year is because a lot of teams have needs or want to sell tickets so they will take a QB, otherwise he is top 10 pick.

Teams have needs in the top 10 in every draft. So I don't know why you use that as a reason why CJ will not be a top 10 pick.

We're in disagreement about him being the best RB bar none. I'd rank him 3rd or 4th.

Bush was the 2nd overall pick and was touted as the best RB to ever come out by some. McFadden was seen as a top 5 pick regardless of who took him. Both have been average players in the NFL, who, yes, have homerun ability, but were not worth top 5 picks, or even top half of the first round picks. CJ falls under that same category, and he's not even touted as highy as those two guys were.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:30 pm

Rich

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Bush was the 2nd overall pick and was touted as the best RB to ever come out by some. McFadden was seen as a top 5 pick regardless of who took him. Both have been average players in the NFL, who, yes, have homerun ability, but were not worth top 5 picks, or even top half of the first round picks. CJ falls under that same category, and he's not even touted as highy as those two guys were.

Why do the projections of McFadden and Bush matter?

If the scouts and draftniks were wrong on them being "generational backs" or guys with incredible talent that would change the game is played, why couldn't they be wrong on the way they tout Spiller?

Do these scouts and draftniks have some level of competence where they are bad enough to overrate guys like McFadden and Bush but good enough to underrate Spiller?

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Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:43 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Teams have needs in the top 10 in every draft. So I don't know why you use that as a reason why CJ will not be a top 10 pick.

We're in disagreement about him being the best RB bar none. I'd rank him 3rd or 4th.

Bush was the 2nd overall pick and was touted as the best RB to ever come out by some. McFadden was seen as a top 5 pick regardless of who took him. Both have been average players in the NFL, who, yes, have homerun ability, but were not worth top 5 picks, or even top half of the first round picks. CJ falls under that same category, and he's not even touted as highy as those two guys were.

Because no team in the top ten really has a need at the RB position, or have even greater needs than a RB or want fans to buy PSL's so they will go with a QB. Spiller is ranked as in the top ten prospects.

You will rank him 3rd or 4th, yet almost EVERYONE has him rated as the #1. Remember, you were the one who had Nicks as the best WR to come out last year....LOL! And if Bush wasn't worth a pick at the a top half of the first round, what is Ronnie Brown really worth? Reggie Bush just helped his team get to a Super Bowl.

If Spiller isn't your #1 RB of this years draft prospects and you have 2-3 ranked above them, I am REALLY curious to see who you consider better than him. PLEASE SHARE!!!

Wed Apr 21, 2010 6:48 pm

Iowafin

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

Teams have needs in the top 10 in every draft. So I don't know why you use that as a reason why CJ will not be a top 10 pick.

We're in disagreement about him being the best RB bar none. I'd rank him 3rd or 4th.

Bush was the 2nd overall pick and was touted as the best RB to ever come out by some. McFadden was seen as a top 5 pick regardless of who took him. Both have been average players in the NFL, who, yes, have homerun ability, but were not worth top 5 picks, or even top half of the first round picks. CJ falls under that same category, and he's not even touted as highy as those two guys were.

Because no team in the top ten really has a need at the RB position, or have even greater needs than a RB or want fans to buy PSL's so they will go with a QB. Spiller is ranked as in the top ten prospects.

You will rank him 3rd or 4th, yet almost EVERYONE has him rated as the #1. Remember, you were the one who had Nicks as the best WR to come out last year....LOL! And if Bush wasn't worth a pick at the a top half of the first round, what is Ronnie Brown really worth? Reggie Bush just helped his team get to a Super Bowl.

If Spiller isn't your #1 RB of this years draft prospects and you have 2-3 ranked above them, I am REALLY curious to see who you consider better than him. PLEASE SHARE!!!

I'll bet I can guess..Dexter McCluster, Ryan Matthews and Ben Tate.

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Wed Apr 21, 2010 6:52 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Ryan Mathews, Ben Tate, and Jahvid Best.

I wouldn't necassarily consider Best a better RB than Spiller, but I think he can bring just as much to the table to this team, and for a lot cheaper of a selection.

And BTW, Hakeem Nicks lead all rookies in receiving yards, (tied with Percy Harvin). I don't see what was so "LOL" about him possibly being the best WR to come out last year. And BTW, I did not think he was better than Crabtree last year. I thought he would have a better rookie year, (which he did), but that down the road Crabtree would be the best of the class.

And also, so if teams are not drafting Spiller, despite his godliness, in the top 10 because they have needs, why did the Saints draft Bush? Why did Oakland draft D-Mac?

Wed Apr 21, 2010 6:59 pm

phinsfansc

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins, you realize one of Bill Parcells favorite players was Dave Meggett, a smallish type back that could do it all. Return game, line up at RB and be part of the passing game.

I don't know that Spiller will be a Chris Johnson type back, but he does not have to be with Miami. He can share the load with Ricky & Ronnie or just Ricky if by some chance Ronnie get's traded.

CJ Spiller is a WEAPON.

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Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:03 pm

Iowafin

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

and for a lot cheaper of a selection.

Forget when you can draft them, who's the best back.

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Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:07 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

And also, so if teams are not drafting Spiller, despite his godliness, in the top 10 because they have needs, why did the Saints draft Bush? Why did Oakland draft D-Mac?

Have you been reading anything, or just the beginning of what I post. Sometimes Owners and GM's are forced to select certain players for a "wow" factor cause they need to sell tickets and jerseys.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:10 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

And also, so if teams are not drafting Spiller, despite his godliness, in the top 10 because they have needs, why did the Saints draft Bush? Why did Oakland draft D-Mac?

Have you been reading anything, or just the beginning of what I post. Sometimes Owners and GM's are forced to select certain players for a "wow" factor cause they need to sell tickets and jerseys.

So you would agree that CJ Spiller does not have that same "wow" factor that Bush and McFadden had?

Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:17 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Iowafin wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

and for a lot cheaper of a selection.

Forget when you can draft them, who's the best back.

I have a problem with his running style, but Mathews is probably right up there with Ben Tate. I'd go 1a 1b between those two.

Best and McCluster are pretty exciting guys, who I think could give Miami everything CJ could, considering the situation and role we would put them in.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:18 pm

Iowafin

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

And also, so if teams are not drafting Spiller, despite his godliness, in the top 10 because they have needs, why did the Saints draft Bush? Why did Oakland draft D-Mac?

Have you been reading anything, or just the beginning of what I post. Sometimes Owners and GM's are forced to select certain players for a "wow" factor cause they need to sell tickets and jerseys.

So you would agree that CJ Spiller does not have that same "wow" factor that Bush and McFadden had?

I'm not sure what all the hate is towards Spiller. All I know is that youtube video that was posted on Spiller was insane. He definitely broke about 9 tackles and was running backwards during a KO and still out ran the entire team. He also breaks tackles. He might only be 195lbs but he is alot stronger and better put together than mcfadden and bush combined. Now, on the flip side I as well like Ryan Matthews. He fits the mold of an everydown prototypical back. He also packs some speed and power. But don't sell Spiller sort. The kid is fast, strong, elusive. He is a good one.

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Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:25 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

And also, so if teams are not drafting Spiller, despite his godliness, in the top 10 because they have needs, why did the Saints draft Bush? Why did Oakland draft D-Mac?

Have you been reading anything, or just the beginning of what I post. Sometimes Owners and GM's are forced to select certain players for a "wow" factor cause they need to sell tickets and jerseys.

So you would agree that CJ Spiller does not have that same "wow" factor that Bush and McFadden had?

What are you talking about? I never said that, nor does what I posted suggest that.

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Have you been reading anything, or just the beginning of what I post. Sometimes Owners and GM's are forced to select certain players for a "wow" factor cause they need to sell tickets and jerseys.

The teams that have needs, will take who they need, or will draft a QB (or BPA).

Saints had Drew Brees the year they drafted Reggie, so they didn't need to draft a QB. And Oakland already made a huge investment in Russell, so same reasoning, plus its the Raiders.

I might go out on a limb here and say that Seattle might take Spiller 6th overall because of his wow factor, and Seattle is a team that doesn't have to worry about selling tickets.

Last edited by Project86JLL13 on Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:33 pm

Iowafin

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Iowafin wrote:

What?

Exactly what I said.

No, you made an extreme leap in logic, and I don't know how you got there.

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Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:34 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Project said that Bush and McFadden were drafted because those organizations were looking to draft guys to sell tickets, not draft needs. But he also says that Spiller will not be drafted because he does not fit needs of those top 10 teams, basically saying that Spiller does not have the same wow factor that Bush and McFadden had to lead teams to believe they should draft him to sell tickets.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:45 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Project said that Bush and McFadden were drafted because those organizations were looking to draft guys to sell tickets, not draft needs. But he also says that Spiller will not be drafted because he does not fit needs of those top 10 teams, basically saying that Spiller does not have the same wow factor that Bush and McFadden had to lead teams to believe they should draft him to sell tickets.

So now you put words in peoples mouths?

Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:48 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

Project said that Bush and McFadden were drafted because those organizations were looking to draft guys to sell tickets, not draft needs. But he also says that Spiller will not be drafted because he does not fit needs of those top 10 teams, basically saying that Spiller does not have the same wow factor that Bush and McFadden had to lead teams to believe they should draft him to sell tickets.

So now you put words in peoples mouths?

What else am I supposed to infer?

Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:51 pm

MdDolfan

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

AQNOR wrote:

Quote:

Why C.J. Spiller should be the Dolphins first round pick…..

1. C.J. Spiller is the type of player who is a threat to score every time he touches the ball ...

2. Ronnie Brown, who hasn’t signed his tender offer, will likely become a free agent in 2011, ...

3. Spiller can immediately impact two phases of the game ... returner void ...

Our defensive needs are far too great for us to use a 1st round pick on Spiller. The only way I see it happening is if we make a big move/trade.....maybe sending Ronnie Brown to a team for picks....or if we trade back in the 1st round and get picks.

I think we will be looking DT and OLB early....and take a shot at a safety later. I wouldn't be surprised to see us take some late round shots at a running back. This class at RB is pretty deep and some guys might slip....how about Gerhardt? How far down do you think he goes?

_________________Philbin's countenance exudes confidence!1984 was so long ago...Will there ever be another rainbow?

Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:07 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

Project said that Bush and McFadden were drafted because those organizations were looking to draft guys to sell tickets, not draft needs. But he also says that Spiller will not be drafted because he does not fit needs of those top 10 teams, basically saying that Spiller does not have the same wow factor that Bush and McFadden had to lead teams to believe they should draft him to sell tickets.

So now you put words in peoples mouths?

What else am I supposed to infer?

You really have me lost.......

I think Spiller brings just as much wow factor as both those backs, but I think Spiller will be better than both. But what I have said in my posts in this topic doesn't suggest that I am "saying that Spiller does not have the same wow factor that Bush and McFadden had to lead teams to believe they should draft him to sell tickets". I never said what you accuse me of.This is what I said:

Project86JLL13 wrote:

Because no team in the top ten really has a need at the RB position, or have even greater needs than a RB or want fans to buy PSL's so they will go with a QB. Spiller is ranked as in the top ten prospects.

Seattle has a need at running back, and has TWO picks in the 1st round. I could see them selecting Spiller with #6 and drafting a offensive tackle with the #14, rendering him a TOP 10 pick.

Reggie Bush was undoubtably a top 5 back, but New Orleans needed that one guy that would help Drew Brees, as well as sell tickets and jerseys.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:09 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

FrustratedFinFan wrote:

Our defensive needs are far too great for us to use a 1st round pick on Spiller. The only way I see it happening is if we make a big move/trade.....maybe sending Ronnie Brown to a team for picks....or if we trade back in the 1st round and get picks.

I think we will be looking DT and OLB early....and take a shot at a safety later. I wouldn't be surprised to see us take some late round shots at a running back. This class at RB is pretty deep and some guys might slip....how about Gerhardt? How far down do you think he goes?

Our defense was ranked ahead of New Orleans, the team that won the Super Bowl. The game has evolved. New Orleans had three running backs that were all used in effective ways.

First round DT's BUST more than First round QB's.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:13 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Project86JLL13 wrote:

FrustratedFinFan wrote:

Our defensive needs are far too great for us to use a 1st round pick on Spiller. The only way I see it happening is if we make a big move/trade.....maybe sending Ronnie Brown to a team for picks....or if we trade back in the 1st round and get picks.

I think we will be looking DT and OLB early....and take a shot at a safety later. I wouldn't be surprised to see us take some late round shots at a running back. This class at RB is pretty deep and some guys might slip....how about Gerhardt? How far down do you think he goes?

Our defense was ranked ahead of New Orleans, the team that won the Super Bowl. The game has evolved. New Orleans had three running backs that were all used in effective ways.

First round DT's BUST more than First round QB's.

Miami allowed 24.4 PPG, while NO allowed 21.3...

Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:16 pm

phinsfansc

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

I will use the same argument I used when I thought Dez Bryant would possibly be the pick. Miami has 9 other picks that can be used to address defensive needs if they took Spiller. Most of us feel that the majority of the picks will be used to address the defense.

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Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:23 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

Phins Rock wrote:

Miami allowed 24.4 PPG, while NO allowed 21.3...

Fact of the matter is that the game has evolved to benefit offensive teams. Teams can allow 30 points as long as they score 31.

I'd rather have our young offense continue to get young early in this years draft and have them start to "gel", and focus on our aging/old defense later in the draft and in the coming years.

Last edited by Project86JLL13 on Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:25 pm

Project86JLL13

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Re: Why, Why Not….Miami Dolphins draft C.J. Spiller

phinsfansc wrote:

I will use the same argument I used when I thought Dez Bryant would possibly be the pick. Miami has 9 other picks that can be used to address defensive needs if they took Spiller. Most of us feel that the majority of the picks will be used to address the defense.

Thank you, I have been trying to say this, but couldn't put it into words that others would understand.