Why some North Country union members won’t vote for Wilson

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Lewis County is a solidly Republican part of the state. Yet some people in Lowville have no interest in voting for him. Current and former employees of FiberMark, a company that Wilson’s investment firm bought, reformed, and sold, don’t want to see him in charge of the state’s finances. The Buffalo News talked to people in Lowville and to Wilson himself.

Wilson, they contend, presided over a low point in company history after his Silver Point investment firm acquired FiberMark debt during bankruptcy. Silver Point’s control resulted in a frozen pension, wage reductions, elimination of retiree health insurance, an imposed labor contract, and charges against the company filed by the National Labor Relations Board.

“I know that nobody who works for FiberMark will be voting for Harry Wilson,” said Turck, president of Local 1988, United Steelworkers. “And this is a Republican county.”

Wilson counters that the CEO was replaced after the NLRB found that FiberMark had been negotiating in bad faith with union members, and corporate turnarounds require difficult decisions for the good of the company (or, presumably, the state.)

Wilson said he has “agonized” over some of the human costs of corporate turnarounds, but says such action can save the jobs of many more. He is bringing the same posture to his campaign for state comptroller, contending that Albany’s “cost structure is suffocating upstate.”

Why any union member in the US would vote for a Republican is a mystery to me. Harry Wilson’s plan for labor – “frozen pension, wage reductions, elimination of retiree health insurance” is being sponsored in the US by the Republican party and the US Chamber of Commerce.

I don’t recall getting a 4% raise under Pataki. I do remember him offering a bunch of zeros though.

Bottom line – Democrats are pandering to the hoopleheads in the voting public right now due to the economy. Most of them blindly (and incorrectly) think we cost the taxpayers an arm, a leg, and their first born, and if a Democrat was to be truthful and tell the public that wasn’t the case, they’d lose the swing voters needed to get elected.

Let’s put things in perspective. Due to public misconceptions, if state employee raises were ever set up to be approved only by a direct public vote, we’d never get raises. Voters generally have huge misconceptions, bad information, and are generally ignorant about most issues, unless they actually take time out of their lives to research it for themselves, so they listen to the talking heads instead. In many cases, voters will vote against things that are in their best interests because of that.

1. Republicans are still being the party of “No” every chance they get.

2. Democrats, in response to perceived voter anger, are moving away from their usual message and sliding a bit to the right – hence why even Democrats are attacking the state workforce.

In order to get the job done, the Dems need complete control with a supermajority in both houses and control of the executive branch to take the party of “No” out of the picture, and they need to move back to to the left.

Additionally, it wouldn’t hurt to ditch idiots like Sheldon Silver, who could give a crap less about upstate and only legislate based on the needs downstate. Until we get enough people in there that realize New York state doesn’t end at the northern borders of New York City (or sometimes Westchester county depending on the politician), we’re still in for a rough ride. While I dislike Joe Bruno, and dislike Republican policies in general, at least while he was running the show in the Senate upstate wasn’t completely forgotten about.

Maverick wrote: “I don’t recall getting a 4% raise under Pataki. I do remember him offering a bunch of zeros though.”

Do you remember having your pay lagged, or threats of furloughs under Pataki? How about having your longevity bonus taken away or your raises canceled?
Which party held the governor’s office when those things happened?

“Do you remember having your pay lagged, or threats of furloughs under Pataki? How about having your longevity bonus taken away or your raises canceled?
Which party held the governor’s office when those things happened?”

No, but at the same time, I never considered Mario to be much of a Democrat either, regardless of what his voter registration card said.

No raises under Pataki? Did state workers not get their usual 1.5% yearly raises when Pataki was in office? Those are raises (oh, I forgot, the state workforce calls those “steps” or “cost of living increases” so they can avoid using the word “raise”. I don’t think private industry people get those.

Maverick, go look up the state contracts AND the dates people held office. The ONLY year workers got a 4% contract year was the contract signed by Pataki. The ONLY contract to get less than ZERO (lag in same year as 0% was….Cuomo. followed by a SECOND year of 0%. Yep, you keep drinking Democrats are better, you will get AT LEAST 3 years of 0% as soon as Cuomo does not sign a contract until he gets 2 oe 3 years of 0% and health and retirement givebacks. Your union will support himanyways.

“The ONLY year workers got a 4% contract year was the contract signed by Pataki.”

Wrong answer.

Our last contract, which contained the 4% we got this year, was negotiated with Spitzer.

Pataki was never anywhere near that generous. In fact, his negotiating strategy with the unions seemed to be to start negotiations by offering zeros across the board. Apparently you seem to forget unions marching or picketing heavily during almost every contract negotiation with Pataki due to this. Let’s also not forget Patakis threats to move government jobs downstate as a negotiating tactic. You also clearly haven’t looked at a table showing the raises by year, because we did in fact receive more than one zero from Pataki.

Note I did not defend Mario Cuomo above, so why attack me based on what he did. In fact, you might note that I didn’t consider Mario Cuomo much of a Democrat regardless of what his voter registration card said. Cuomo is responsible for pay lags, etc, and I recall this. However, Cuomo generally did not start off negotiations in bad faith by offering nothing but zeros as Pataki did.

Note I also said I do not support Andrew Cuomo, so save your attacks on that too. I will be voting for Howie Hawkins, the only true progressive on the ballot.

But add up all of the above and the bottom line is – it’s easier to negotiate with Dems. Republicans will cry poverty at the beginning of every single year. Pataki was a perfect example of this – he offered contracts with all zeros during the tech boom of the late 90′s when the state was flush with revenues coming in, which I believe makes my point.

“No raises under Pataki? Did state workers not get their usual 1.5% yearly raises when Pataki was in office? Those are raises (oh, I forgot, the state workforce calls those “steps” or “cost of living increases” so they can avoid using the word “raise”. I don’t think private industry people get those.”

People in the private sector also don’t start off their jobs as a “trainee” at a “trainee” either for the most part.

That is where many of you who whine about steps fail. You always seem to forget that a state employee is hired at a “hiring rate” that is far less than what the job should be paying, and those steps are how they move to that job rate. They are not raises – a raise is what is negotiated in the contracts by the unions. As far as those steps, and moving from the hiring rate to the job rate, lets not forget that during the Pataki administration, one of the concessions made was to lengthen the amount of time it takes to get to the job rate from 3 or 4 years to 7 years.

The really funny thing is many people like you seem to think EVERY state worker gets a step EVERY year, and this is far from the case. Only employees with salaries below the job rate get them, and only if their performance is good enough.

As far as the “usual” 1.5% a year, that’s a fallacy, but at least you estimate the “guaranteed annual raises” myth commonly spewed by the right at a lower amount than most, who seem to think it’s 3%, and even at that mythical level of “guaranteed annual raises”, that’s still less than the raises generally garnered by private sector employees:

Life notes an average annual raise last year of 2.5% and calls it “measly”. It notes a projected average raise in 2011 of 2.8% and also refers to it as measly, and notes both of them are far below the usual average. Given that, how do you recify that we are always getting a better deal than the private sector at your mythical annual raise amount of 1.5%, or even the more common mythical amount of 3%? Seems like the private sector considers 2.8% to be measly based on that article, so even 3% is still measly based on those terms.

Oh I get it – it’s only “measly” when you are getting it. If we get it, it’s “more than generous” or “highway robbery of the taxpayers”, right? Here’s a clue smart guy – the average annual raise of the state workforce over the past 2 decades or so works out to 2.52% a year, and includes quite a few years where the annual raise was 0%.

Yeah, private sector DOES get cost of living increases. Ask my spouse. 3% cost of living increase every year (and a raise AND bonus). Is there a reason why you didn’t? After all, since private sector is supposedly all about how hard you work, what does that say?

Not that I actually believe that drivel, as we all know private sector only cares about their bottom line, and not their employees, but since that’s the crap you choose to believe, then you must realize your not getting an increase must be a reflection on you.

I’m actually leaning towards voting for Wilson over DiNapoli. Let it not be said that I’m a party line voter. I vote for the person, not the party. I just happen to think one party is better *most of the time* than the other.

FiberMark was in bankruptcy. Wilson’s company purchased Fibermark probably under a Trustee’s sale. His company could’ve purchased the company and then sold off the equipment, buildings and land separately and dissolved Fibermark, but he didn’t. So now they aren’t voting for him, because they still have jobs? Wow. I am so impressed with their union leadership. If Wilson’s company had done what many other companies do, they would’ve purchased and dismantled FiberMark and then everyoen would have been out of work. Gee whiz…count your blessings instead.

We wonder why our nation has so many troubles when union members only view candidates for what they can do for them as employees. To hell with everyone else. Democrats are paid off by the unions and beholding to them. I’m quite sure the union presidents are promising members Cuomo won’t lay them off. Right.

How does that address what I said? It’s typical “smoke and mirrors” and “change the subject” stuff.

Cassini has it right – it takes all of them.

But I’ll tell you what: There is more than enough information out there on the internet for you to figure out what the average taxpayer pays in taxes and how much of that figure goes towards employee costs. When you choose to come back here with the answer, you can start running your mouth again.

Regardless, changing the subject when it is noted that an average raise of 2.52% is considered “measly” by most in the private sector is a total fail. If you had half a brain, you’d look for a way to attack the information presented and not instead attack by changing the subject. Then again, if you had half a brain, you’d realize the hypocrisy of the private sector pointed out by the discussion on raises in the Life article and you would have just kept your mouth shut.