Norwegian Squirrel:The wiki article about her explains some of the issues she has, including having sex with two prison guards. It's hard not to have sympathy for such a damaged individual..

She didn't have an easy life. That's sad. It might even explain how she could do what she did. But if she is so damaged that she doesn't know the difference between right and wrong; if she can in any way justify killing two kids to be with a lover who dumped her, then she needs to be locked up for life to protect society from her. Feeling compassion for a criminal doesn't mean abrogating the responsibility of protecting society.

I was pretty young when she drowned her boys but I remember watching the press conference live and screaming liar! It was that obvious. You wouldn't believe the police sketch of the "black man" she claimed car jacked her and took off. It was an exaggerated Sambo caricature which I'm pretty sure nobody believed for one second. Even worse was watching her performance on Good morning America the next morning making the same fake crying plea. Talk about national outrage...

As near as I can remember, she DID have a reasonably easy life in 1994; responsible husband, (outwardly) stable home life, sex with the wealthy guy across town. Lots and lots of mothers have it worse and they don't kill their kids (and she looks better at 40 than the last photo any of us saw of Casey Anthony so there's that).

Norwegian Squirrel:The wiki article about her explains some of the issues she has, including having sex with two prison guards. It's hard not to have sympathy for such a damaged individual..

She cold-bloodedly murdered her young children, falsely claimed that she had been carjacked by a black man (this in the Deep South), went on TV begging for the return of her children when she knew full well they were dead.

I had zero sympathy for this f*cking biatch then, I have less than zero sympathy for her now. She deliberately let her car roll into the lake, with her two children still strapped into their car seats. Imagine the terror & panic they felt when they couldn't breathe, then tell me you still have any sort of sympathy for this piece of inhuman excrement.

Confabulat:cynicalbastard: Sounds like what happened to Karla Homolka. She got off practically scot-free because she was the first one to rat out the other, and it turned out she did most of the actual killing.

No, this is about nothing at all like that mess. Twisted sure. But not even close to each other in motive or reasoning or pretty much anything. What are you talking about?

It sounds as if both of them got country-club treatment compared to male inmates. Both, lesbian lovers, both have a guy waiting for them on the outside and no worries.

As near as I can remember, she DID have a reasonably easy life in 1994; responsible husband, (outwardly) stable home life, sex with the wealthy guy across town. Lots and lots of mothers have it worse and they don't kill their kids (and she looks better at 40 than the last photo any of us saw of Casey Anthony so there's that).

IIRC, she lost her Dad at a fairly young age and was abused by (one of??) her stepdads. That will leave a mark, even if it looks like you've grown up and now have the good life. Still no excuse for killing two kids.

Bathia_Mapes:Norwegian Squirrel: The wiki article about her explains some of the issues she has, including having sex with two prison guards. It's hard not to have sympathy for such a damaged individual..

She cold-bloodedly murdered her young children, falsely claimed that she had been carjacked by a black man (this in the Deep South), went on TV begging for the return of her children when she knew full well they were dead.

I had zero sympathy for this f*cking biatch then, I have less than zero sympathy for her now. She deliberately let her car roll into the lake, with her two children still strapped into their car seats. Imagine the terror & panic they felt when they couldn't breathe, then tell me you still have any sort of sympathy for this piece of inhuman excrement.

Oh yes, what she did was horrible and thinking about what those kids went through, doesn't give me much sympathy for her. But reading about her upbringing where she was sexually abused by her stepfather and her own father committing suicide, it can be thought that she's a victim (of some sorts) of the environment she grew up in.

Then again, I live in Norway where we sentence mass-murdering nutbags to 21 years (with a good chance of extending that sentence), so I can understand that people disagree and that some people should be kept locked away (and away from guards).

Maybe sympathy is the wrong word, it's just that I always feel the need to find a reason, to find a trigger that pushed people into the situation. I want to understand, even though I sometimes know there isn't much to understand, just humans being humans.

Mr. Right:But if she is so damaged that she doesn't know the difference between right and wrong; if she can in any way justify killing two kids to be with a lover who dumped her, then she needs to be locked up for life to protect society from her. Feeling compassion for a criminal doesn't mean abrogating the responsibility of protecting society.

Society is in no danger from her, given that she never menaced anyone else's children or car. Depending on how crazy, if at all, she really is, it may be better for society that she off her children rather than raise them.

"Not knowing the difference between right and wrong" is an extreme thing, if you think about it. People assume this too easily. A man who truly doesn't know that his acts are considered "wrong" and certain to provoke attacks wouldn't bother to hide them. By constructing an elaborate deception to throw off suspicion Smith demonstrated that she knew full well that what she was doing was a grave crime. Jack Ruby seems to me a fine example of not knowing right from wrong -- he expected to be lauded for murdering Oswald, so he shot him right in front of the cops.

Norwegian Squirrel:The wiki article about her explains some of the issues she has, including having sex with two prison guards. It's hard not to have sympathy for such a damaged individual..

Nope. Not hard at all.

She killed her two kids because they got in the way of her social life (instead of, oh, I don't know, letting the father who loves them have custody of them), then blamed the whole thing on a fictional black man. I don't have any sympathy to waste on this scum.

/geez, just realized those kids would have been around 20 years old now...

ShannonKW: Depending on how crazy, if at all, she really is, it may be better for society that she off her children rather than raise them.

The emotional sticking point I have here is that the boys had a loving, involved dad with a solid extended family who would have taken full custody in a heartbeat and let her wash her hands and walk away.

ShannonKW:Mr. Right: But if she is so damaged that she doesn't know the difference between right and wrong; if she can in any way justify killing two kids to be with a lover who dumped her, then she needs to be locked up for life to protect society from her. Feeling compassion for a criminal doesn't mean abrogating the responsibility of protecting society.

Society is in no danger from her, given that she never menaced anyone else's children or car. Depending on how crazy, if at all, she really is, it may be better for society that she off her children rather than raise them.

"Not knowing the difference between right and wrong" is an extreme thing, if you think about it. People assume this too easily. A man who truly doesn't know that his acts are considered "wrong" and certain to provoke attacks wouldn't bother to hide them. By constructing an elaborate deception to throw off suspicion Smith demonstrated that she knew full well that what she was doing was a grave crime. Jack Ruby seems to me a fine example of not knowing right from wrong -- he expected to be lauded for murdering Oswald, so he shot him right in front of the cops.

If someone doesn't know the difference between right and wrong and commits this kind of murder, she should be locked up because she isn't in control of her behavior. The fact that Smith only murdered her own children (this time) makes her no less a threat to society next time she can't control her impulses.

Since, as you point out, she constructed a lie to throw off suspicion, then it appears she does indeed know the difference between right and wrong and chose the extreme wrong of murdering her children. That makes her maliciously evil. She should be locked up for life.

Since when do they allow lipstick, eyeliner, and tanning beds in maximum-security prison?

That's not her natural skin-tone, just compare it to the pre-arrest photos where she's puffy and pale.

My guess is that mugshot was taken before she was going to a court appearance of some kind. They'll often take new mugshots when that happened and lawyers have long argued successfully that people can appear to look presentable in court, which means they can shower, get a haircut, and use makeup. But I have no idea of the specifics. Not like I heard about her getting killing any more kids since then.

cynicalbastard:Confabulat: cynicalbastard: Sounds like what happened to Karla Homolka. She got off practically scot-free because she was the first one to rat out the other, and it turned out she did most of the actual killing.

No, this is about nothing at all like that mess. Twisted sure. But not even close to each other in motive or reasoning or pretty much anything. What are you talking about?

It sounds as if both of them got country-club treatment compared to male inmates. Both, lesbian lovers, both have a guy waiting for them on the outside and no worries.

I'm not convinced there is a wealthy man waiting for her on the outside. It's not like she has a history of lying or anything...

namegoeshere:ShannonKW: Depending on how crazy, if at all, she really is, it may be better for society that she off her children rather than raise them.

The emotional sticking point I have here is that the boys had a loving, involved dad with a solid extended family who would have taken full custody in a heartbeat and let her wash her hands and walk away.

Good point, that. Still, even if you are growing up in an otherwise loving, proper family, it only takes one evil mother who would drown for the privilege of banging a rich guy to fark you up.

Huh. My girlfriend and I were playing a game a few days ago called "Guess the pen-pal inmate's crime" where you go on one of those "write an inmate" websites and guess what they did.

Susan Smith was on there and my girlfriend recognized her immediately (she watched IDHD all the time and they've had a few Susan Smith pieces on there). Apparently she stopped doing the pen-pal thing because her notoriety increased exponentially after the ID-HD shows.

I have a terrible memory, but vividly remembered a lot of this story. What I had forgotten was that her on-again/off-again wealthy boyfriend had said, "Maybe we'd have a future, if you didn't have kids" ...so she drowned them. What a world.

JackieRabbit:This woman is very sick. I can find compassion for her, without excusing her crime.

so she is. And I've known people equally as sick. I have some compassion for them--I also stay as far away from them as I can. No good comes from any interaction with them.

I guess some people don't remember her crime, but it was about as cold-blooded and ruthless as you can get. I felt so bad for her husband, standing by her, but you could tell by the look on his face that he knew something wasn't right with her story.

cryinoutloud:JackieRabbit: This woman is very sick. I can find compassion for her, without excusing her crime.

so she is. And I've known people equally as sick. I have some compassion for them--I also stay as far away from them as I can. No good comes from any interaction with them.

I guess some people don't remember her crime, but it was about as cold-blooded and ruthless as you can get. I felt so bad for her husband, standing by her, but you could tell by the look on his face that he knew something wasn't right with her story.

Exactly. I couldn't agree more. Stay away from crazy. I don't doubt that her husband knew something was wrong. He was estranged from her for a reason. A sane spouse will recognize insanity in his/her mate before anyone else does. The tragedy was that her insanity was not acknowledged before she so horrifically killed her children.

JackieRabbit:cryinoutloud: JackieRabbit: This woman is very sick. I can find compassion for her, without excusing her crime.

so she is. And I've known people equally as sick. I have some compassion for them--I also stay as far away from them as I can. No good comes from any interaction with them.

I guess some people don't remember her crime, but it was about as cold-blooded and ruthless as you can get. I felt so bad for her husband, standing by her, but you could tell by the look on his face that he knew something wasn't right with her story.

Exactly. I couldn't agree more. Stay away from crazy. I don't doubt that her husband knew something was wrong. He was estranged from her for a reason. A sane spouse will recognize insanity in his/her mate before anyone else does. The tragedy was that her insanity was not acknowledged before she so horrifically killed her children.

Not every woman who kills her children is insane.

Andrea Yates - insane. Farking nuts. Frootloops. Train off the tracks. Nobody home. She killed her children to save them from a fate worse than death. She loved them dearly so she sacrificed them to save their immortal souls. I have nothing but sympathy for her, and wish her a gentle life of complete amnesia in a world with no children. That poor, poor woman.

Susan Smith - damaged, yes. Extremely narcissistic.The Queen of Issues. But very sane. She killed her kids because they became inconvenient for her. She attempted suicide (no she didn't) to gain sympathy and media attention. (Look, it worked.) She knew exactly what she was doing when she sent those kids into the lake. She intended for them to die slowly, very slowly. Not for their own good, but for hers. She wanted a penis with dollar signs, and to be free of children without the stigma of being a deadbeat mom. She had a plan and a purpose that was completely heartless and evil but very reasoned and sane.

BolshyGreatYarblocks:But of course a man late with the child support payments after he leaves his shrieking harpy wife is just a creep.

Good thing that you're even easier to deal with. You can go right away.

namegoeshere:Andrea Yates - insane. Farking nuts. Frootloops. Train off the tracks. Nobody home. She killed her children to save them from a fate worse than death. She loved them dearly so she sacrificed them to save their immortal souls. I have nothing but sympathy for her, and wish her a gentle life of complete amnesia in a world with no children. That poor, poor woman.

Thank you. A lot of people missed that, and it makes me mad when people put Andrea Yates in the same category as other baby-killers. That poor woman was in hell.

I remember when they had the choice between death and what she eventually got, as much as I wanted her deep fried by re-routing all the power generated by the Savannah River nuclear plant into the chair, I think the jury knew that's what she wanted, so instead they gave her a fate far worse than death. And the parole board should see to it that she doesn't get out until she is 90, and should ensure that she lives to see 90.

I would love to have that woman, upon her release, wake up one morning in a car slowly filling up with water and a SAW-type voice coming out of the radio- "Susan, you have been manacled into place here. One hand has been left free. By it, you will find a scalpel and a roll of duct tape. The tape, should you choose, will make an effective tourniquet. LIVE OR DIE, YOUR CHOICE."

She's the reason I've advocated that people who are convicted of significant, violent crimes at least should be sterilized. Regardless about incarceration, they've proven that they shouldn't be parents.