Post by warehamgas on Jul 25, 2019 8:28:53 GMT

Some of the batsmen today will feel like they’re playing for their positions in the team for the Ashes. If so they could bat long all day today and tomorrow and make a 350/400+ score and give themselves a chance on Saturday. If they don’t some will have very short Test careers I would have thought. The likes of Roy, Burns, Denly especially will be under pressure.

Post by irishrover on Jul 25, 2019 14:12:38 GMT

Well we should win it anyway now. Great that Ireland had their moment though.

I genuinely text my Dad at 10.30 this morning saying that it was perfectly set-up to be one of those weird days where the nightwatchmen scored the only 100 of his test match career. Perfect batting weather, pretty innocuous attack etc, plenty of bloody minded motivation to reverse yesterday's debacle. So very rare I actually call one right!

Murtagh's success raises an interesting point. I've always wondered if we're overly obsessed with pace in the modern game. It seems to me that someone who moves it consistently off a length at a moderate pace can be just as lethal but this is an unfashionable way of thinking. England seems to have a particular issue in this area if you look at the similar damage Pandya did at Trent Bridge against us last year. Vernon Philander would be the A1 example of someone who clearly had to wait far too long for a chance to prove the obvious - ie. that he was a high class international bowler. Test Cricket history is actually full of highly successful bowlers like that but the modern game turns their noses at them on the whole. I understand that the quickies are likely to be more effective across multiple services but still seems to me that we are under valuing the guy who gets players reaching for it. Any thoughts? Makes me wonder if we should be taking the claim of someone like Porter more seriously.

Post by jackthegas on Jul 26, 2019 16:14:41 GMT

I thought Root's post match comments were delusional. The pitch was not substandard nor was it impossible to post a score in excess of 300 (if not 400) in those conditions. If it was an aberration then you could put it down to a World Cup hangover, but it's not. If the captain is delivering the same message behind closed doors then I am worried.

Bayliss was more accurate with his surmisation. He's right that Roy showed promise but you need an opener who has made 70 to go on and make 170. He also said that the players seem to have an issue motivating themselves for games against sides that aren't Australia or India. That is also a fair point, but also a damning indictment of the coaching team who's remit must include motivation.

I thought the selectors got it wrong this test as well. There is very little chance that the top 3 are going to make it through the Ashes. We didn't need 6 bowlers this test match. They should have picked Sibley or Zak Crawley or whoever they think is next in line and batted them at 5. Making your debut in a relatively low pressure match against a weaker attack must be preferable to being thrown into the 4th Ashes test.

Post by irishrover on Jul 26, 2019 19:39:18 GMT

I don't really understand why Bairstow played either.Should have been rested after World Cup.He must be close to burnout.

I agree Root's comments lack credibility.Made it sound like they were on a snakepit as opposed to a slow track with a bit of grass on it which any English batsmen should be able to recognise and adjust to.This is hardly some aberration either-the lack of resilience of our batting when facing adversity has been a worrying feature of his whole tenure thus far.So yes you do hope that more honest conversations are taking place in the dressing room.Also if I was Jimmy Anderson I'd brain Root because that's exactly the kind of wicket we should be wanting to play the Aussies on.Better than the dead flat snorefest wickets Lords has been preparing for the last 10 years!

Not sure what we learn re;Ashes.I think Burns may have played himself out of a starting spot although he will benefit from it being T20 season so no obvious in form replacement.Roy's obviously in now but I think he was anyway.Its clear we've dropped the Bairstow at 3 experiment so the whole top 3 is up in the air which is hardly ideal.Given lack of obvious candidates I'd be tempted to gamble with Stokes at 3.He's matured into a player who could do that role I think.Then you pick Roy and AN Other.I'd drop Moen who looked woefully out of form in both departments.But on the whole it's the same as ever.Bowling options look excellent, batting looks fragile.I like Australia's side more than ours I'm afraid but home advantage might still give us the edge I hope.Please!

Post by Captain Jayho on Jul 27, 2019 8:31:48 GMT

On a slightly different note, great to see we've played Bancroft back into form in local conditions for the Aussies. Maybe we could give him a lift to and from the ground and pack his lunch for him too.

Post by warehamgas on Jul 27, 2019 16:55:45 GMT

Bancroft was badly treated compared to Smith and Warner. What I like about Bancroft was he put himself back into contention by choosing to play for one of our worst current counties, he had the added pressure of being captain and he played in April, May and June when he had more to lose than he had to gain. I’m glad in a way that he’s fought his way back into the squad. He’s also there because he’s Western Australian and Justin Langer has always been his mentor and supporter. He doesn’t seem to come with Smith’s or Warner’s sense of entitlement. I hope he does well, just not too well!Bairstow is a bit of a problem. I think he’s built himself up and has developed a touch of arrogance whereas before he was resilient and gritty. Why was he in the team? He needed a rest but with Foakes injured both him and Buttler needed not to play but in the end he had to keep wicket. Some great catches but he’s not in the best place at the moment. It almost seems that he’s making the team decisions more than Root regarding himself. I know they are both Yorkshiremen but I’m not sure that the decisions made were for the team or for Bairstow. I’ll wait for his next spat with Michael Vaughan. I hope he won’t sound quite as ridiculous as he did before.What the selectors need to do is decide for the conditions what is the best team. Rory Burns though not a unanimous choice needs to be given a run of matches. And yes jack I agree with you Root needs to stop moaning about the wicket, get your head down, don’t chase outside the off stump and you could have got to 300+ as we did second time round.And that is going to be a great pub quiz question in years to come: Which England cricketer scored the highest innings of 92, was made MOM, was the reason England won a match and yet was then dropped from the next match? (With little likelihood of getting another test this summer!) And, despite being a Somerset member, I agree with the decision at Edgbaston. Unlikely to help the spinners so Moeen can use up some overs to rest the quicks but Archer needs to play.

Post by jackthegas on Jul 27, 2019 19:05:48 GMT

I want England to win but I also want to see a contest and so with that in mind I'm all for the Australians playing county cricket.

I think Irish is a bit harsh on Moeen. He is out of form with the bat but his bowling has been very good since he came back into the side. He had a quiet world cup but so did almost every spinner.

I like Bairstow but this is a big series for him. I think he's developed a tenancy to stay leg side of the ball which has helped his one day game but means he's getting bowled a lot in test cricket. Foakes has already shown what he's capable of.

Given that England have clearly prioritised the world cup and that Australia's preparation looks good and the uncertainty around England's top 3 (the selectors have asked root to bat at 3 again) I think Australia have their best chance of an away ashes win in a generation.

Post by irishrover on Jul 29, 2019 17:08:49 GMT

I want England to win but I also want to see a contest and so with that in mind I'm all for the Australians playing county cricket.

I think Irish is a bit harsh on Moeen. He is out of form with the bat but his bowling has been very good since he came back into the side. He had a quiet world cup but so did almost every spinner.

I like Bairstow but this is a big series for him. I think he's developed a tenancy to stay leg side of the ball which has helped his one day game but means he's getting bowled a lot in test cricket. Foakes has already shown what he's capable of.

Given that England have clearly prioritised the world cup and that Australia's preparation looks good and the uncertainty around England's top 3 (the selectors have asked root to bat at 3 again) I think Australia have their best chance of an away ashes win in a generation.

My feeling is that Bairstow has always been more vulnerable to being bowled than most international quality batsmen. I mean traditionally that was the measure of whether someone was truly up to the standard right? A top international batsmen simply shouldn't be bowled out very often. In the modern game with more tolerance for unorthodoxy that's probably less of a marker. But I agree he's an odd one. It was definitely a mistake to put him up to 3 - I think that messed with him as well.

Moeen is exasperating. I sometimes don't think he's been challenged enough with bat and ball to deliver fully on his talent but then he's also been messed around an awful lot as well. He actually seems to respond best when jolted out of his comfort zone. But my basic point is that I think Leach is a better bowler and will eventually usurp him as the number 1 spinner. It's definitely a big series for him in that regard - if he fails to deliver again v Australia I think he will cease to be seen as a frontline Test player. Don't get me wrong I absolutely love Moeen- he is my favourite English player. I just fear for his future a bit. I hope I'm wrong.

A test team is normally built on the stability provided by the top order and if you struggle in that area you're normally in trouble. So that's a massive hole for us. I think those who are saying it will be a bowler's series may have a point though. Both teams look stronger with the ball than the bat. Weather is looking dicey for the first 2 weeks as well which should benefit us marginally. On paper I do give the Aussies the edge but a lot will depend on whether Smith and Warner come to the party as without them the batting has struggled mightily. I also think they must now have a psychological block when facing Anderson-Broad in England with their tails up as they've been done over so often - a lesser version of when England used to crumble to Warne and Mcgrath in Australia as soon as they got out of their cars on the morning of the match! So that might even things up a bit and home advantage pushes it slightly our way. Our test team remains too hard to predict though - a team that gets knocked over by Ireland and struggles against the Windies is hardly one you can confidently back to win an Ashes series but Aussies have been pretty wobbly too.

My team in batting order would be; 1. Roy, 2. Burns (only cos there's not really anyone else), 3. Stokes (I honestly think 2019 Ben Stokes could step up to this and become the story of this Ashes series), 4. Root, 5.Buttler, 6.Bairstow, 7.Woakes (I'd want him in the team and I think he's a better option than many of the extra bats that might be considered like Vince, Malan etc), 8.Moeen (Like I say I'd go with Leach but they won't so there's no point), 9. Archer (but I'd have gone with Wood just ahead of him if fit), 10. Broad, 11. Anderson. If Anderson not fit then pick the extra batsmen I think. Just realised I agree with Chewie!

Post by warehamgas on Jul 29, 2019 21:34:26 GMT

BurnsRoyRootStokesButtlerBairstowMoeenWoakesBroadArcherAndersonNot too different from all the rest. Australia will be happy if we are 50-3 but if we can survive the opening session to be about 100-2 or better then they will be worried what our mid order batsmen could achieve. I see the mind games are going strong with Glenn McGrath saying he’d like to bowl to our top order. Mind you he could be right!

Post by jackthegas on Jul 30, 2019 10:01:33 GMT

It sounds like a top 4 of Roy, Burns, Root and Denley which I think is bizarre. Picking Denley to bat at 3 given that we have a shortage of top order batsmen is understandable but surely we have better options for the middle order? I would be more supportive of Roy and Denley opening with Root at 3 and Roy at 4. I do think Ed Smith's Kent connections are the primary reason that Denley has been around the England side.

I think the Australian's have some big decisions to make too. I think they will pick Bancroft, but I think Burns is a better batsman. I would also pick Pattinson, Cummins, Siddle and Lyon as their 4 bowlers. I suspect they will go with Starc over Siddle, but the latter is a fabulous bowler in English conditions and is a bit of a point of difference. He could offer the captain some control and I think he finds a fuller length more naturally than Hazelwood.

Post by chewbacca on Jul 30, 2019 11:08:20 GMT

It sounds like a top 4 of Roy, Burns, Root and Denley which I think is bizarre. Picking Denley to bat at 3 given that we have a shortage of top order batsmen is understandable but surely we have better options for the middle order? I would be more supportive of Roy and Denley opening with Root at 3 and Roy at 4. I do think Ed Smith's Kent connections are the primary reason that Denley has been around the England side.

I think the Australian's have some big decisions to make too. I think they will pick Bancroft, but I think Burns is a better batsman. I would also pick Pattinson, Cummins, Siddle and Lyon as their 4 bowlers. I suspect they will go with Starc over Siddle, but the latter is a fabulous bowler in English conditions and is a bit of a point of difference. He could offer the captain some control and I think he finds a fuller length more naturally than Hazelwood.

Not having Siddle essentially captain the bowlers is utterly insane, he's potent in English conditions and so experienced. I look forward to this time on Thursday when it'll be 22/4, I'm just no sure which side...

Post by jackthegas on Aug 1, 2019 12:07:41 GMT

Well we have well and truly given up the initiative there. Either Anderson has picked up a niggle, or he wasn't fit enough for selection, or Root has had a terrible morning and has completely failed to see that the game was up for grabs with Australia 35/3 and Smith under all kinds of pressure.

It's not unsalvageable but who knows what was possible if Jimmy had bowled 7 overs in that session.

Post by jackthegas on Aug 1, 2019 12:19:26 GMT

Well we have well and truly given up the initiative there. Either Anderson has picked up a niggle, or he wasn't fit enough for selection, or Root has had a terrible morning and has completely failed to see that the game was up for grabs with Australia 35/3 and Smith under all kinds of pressure.

It's not unsalvageable but who knows what was possible if Jimmy had bowled 7 overs in that session.

He's injured. Bugger. Rotten luck but given Anderson, Broad, Stokes and Woakes have all had niggles over the last 12 months we could have mitigated that risk by picking an extra bowler.