quote: We feel UVB indoor lights are not needed if dragons are fed a proper diet; and supplemented with Vitamin D3. A calcium/D3 supplement, like RepCal can be used in place of the UVB bulb. The dragon still received its needed Vitamin D3, but instead of producing it itself, it is given dietarily.

dandennis wrote:Good post what make Basking light, uvb light, night light and Timer to control the day / night cycle of the lights should i getif u could post links anyone it would bet greatthanks dan

I personally buy most things from B&Q - the bulbs I use are 40-100W spotlights by General Electric; they come in a yellow box and are around £1.10 for two. The time is just a regular digital programmable timer, again from B&Q. You don't need a nightlight - they need darkness and cool to sleep properly.

The UV tube is a bit more specific but you still have a few to choose from. The 3 most commonly used tubes for beardies are the Arcadia D3+ 12%, the ExoTerra / Hagen ReptiGlo 10.0 and the ZooMed ReptiSun 10%. Somewhere like www.livefoods.com or www.kimbosreptileworld.co.uk should be able to provide the tubes, or you could pick one up from a local pet shop.

giggsy wrote:i found this iteresting in that page.

quote: We feel UVB indoor lights are not needed if dragons are fed a proper diet; and supplemented with Vitamin D3. A calcium/D3 supplement, like RepCal can be used in place of the UVB bulb. The dragon still received its needed Vitamin D3, but instead of producing it itself, it is given dietarily.

that kinda of went against everything ive been told

I'd 100% disagree with that. Theoretically it is sound; in practice it would be unsafe, and an absolute nightmare based on our current knowledge.

Essentially, beardies need UV to allow them to produce vitamin D3. They need D3 to allow them to absorb calcium properly in their guts. Too little D3 means not enough calcium is absorbed, leading to soft bones, muscle tremors etc. Too much D3 leads to too much calcium, which can cause ossification of organs, kidney stones, lack of muscular response etc.

The "natural" synthesis pathway (ie the one that uses UV) is what's known as "self regulating". When D3 levels are high, the D3 actually inhibits its own production. This means that D3 produced using UV can only get to a certain level before the reaction pretty much stops. This means that as long as you give a beardie fairly strong UV (strong enough to allow it to produce sufficient D3), you have no problem. It produces enough to stop hypocalcaemia, but not too much. We then add a little bit extra to the diet if they're kept under a low output UV source (e.g. a 10-12% tube). Easy enough.

Unlike D3 produced in the skin, there is no real limit on the amount of D3 that can be absorbed in the diet. This means that levels in the body can get far higher than they should be, which would cause too much calcium to be absorbed, with the problems described above.

Currently, no-one knows exactly how much D3 a beardie needs - there is very little interest in that kind of research commercially, so there isn't the funding to be able to study it. That means that to give a beardie D3 solely through diet you'd be making blind guesses. Given the miniscule amounts involved in the first place, it would be all-too easy to over / under supplement them. Given the stakes involved in getting it wrong, I would say it's highly irresponsible to advocate a UV-free lifestyle until more is known about how much dietary D3 would be needed. The way to find that out would be a proper scientific study that actually records internal D3 levels, not by subjecting beardies over many years to inadequate / excessive D3 levels that will undoubtedly result in MBD and suffering for some of the dragons involved.

i agree, but just to say they do also say in that artical that they do need a uvb light, they contridicted thereselfs i just thought that part was intresting.

also you've answerd a really important question, RICK mentioned thet there maybe a stronger uvb light avaliable now or you was working on a vapour light??

but anyway i was looking for a uv light for a 4ft deep viv its 6ft long at the moment ive lowerd the light halfway down the viv to make sure he gets the adequate amount.

but the new D3 is somthing i will be ordering staight away, maybe you should start a thread letting people know of the new uv? im preety sure not alot of people will have heard of it and all 3 reptile centers near me definatley do not stock them

Substrate - paper/tiles/reptile carpet for babies; fine, sifted playground sand can also be used for adults...... bought reptile wood chip to big to choke on

You'll be surprised how fast they grow and how easily they do get things in their mouths. Wood chip of any size really is a potential problem and best to be avoided. If you intend getting an 8 month old dragon then sand/sandstone mix is fine.

Basking light, providing a basking temperature of 105-115F just bought a new one with red bulb 60w

You would be better off (and cheaper) with a standard 60 or 100 watt spotlight from your local ASDA store. Dragons tend to bask under the brightest light source not the warmest and would probably sit under the UV source not the basking light in this case.

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