im looking at getting into reloading and getting a press and have looked at a few different styles that will fit my needs based on what i have been learning, but im hearing mixed reviews about these two and would like to hear some opinions in terms of ease of use, speed and quality of reload, and reliability of machine

Nothing compares to the lifetime warranty and great customer service of Dillon.
No questions asked policy.
Been loading with a Dillon 550 since 1994. And it's one tough machine and very easy to convert calibers.

Hornandy also has a great warranty. Although it's not called "No BS Warranty," I have read countless threads were somebody needed something and Hornday always stepped up. So I wouldn't buy the Dillon based on warranty alone.

That being said, I think Dillon makes a nicer machine and I chose Dillon.

The 650 and the LNL are really more comparable. And if you're comparing the 650 and the LNL, the LNL is a little cheaper and WAY cheaper for caliber conversions.

hornady fan here. first press. my lnl is fantastic for me. ended up w/ a case feeder, and when i have the dough, gonna get their new bullet feeder. I really like cahngin out the dies to a diff caliber, w/ a 1/8 turn. I just cant see a justification to going to a different press

But if u get a blue machine get the 650. I don't like the 550 when you start comparing it to the 650 and the bang for the buck is there. But the hornady is cheaper, does just as great as a job, warrenty is the same, parts are just as easy to get and it's not blue. They really do the same job in a few different ways and the red one is cheaper.

I've used an RL550B, and it's a nice machine. But that Hornady LnL AP looks very compelling. If I needed an XL650 type machine, I'd probably get the LnL AP due to Hornady's quality and the lower cost.

BTW, I've got to ask one question. Granted that Dillon produces some nice machinery. But so do other companies (e. g. Hornady, RCBS, etc.). Despite that, I'm detecting a "Dillon only, everything else is junk" mindset among many owners of Dillon gear, when clearly not everything else is junk. What's the deal with that? Any takers?

I have only used a 550, so I'll just be another vote for the blue kool aid. This question just came up and about a month ago and Linkpimp put out one of the best unbiased comparisons I've read. I'd steal his thunder and just copy/paste it, but this forum is too small to get away with it.lol click the link and scroll down a little.

__________________
If you are not outraged you are not paying attention!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by roostersgt

You need to be a cop with lots of experience to keep children safe on a school campus. CCW holders, gardeners and yes, trainmen, do not posses the experience, training or expertise in responding to an event such as Sandy. That you can't grasp that is lost on me. Perhaps that's why you're better suited in your present employment. You don't understand what it means to provide for the publics safety. You just don't know.

I wonder how many people actually have used both brands/machines for an extended period of time?

I think a more important question in general is "Which machines have you had problems with" because when the machines are working, they are working, I don't think they "work any better". I mean, lets face it, if you sit down and at the end of an hour or so you have a bunch of rounds, that's great. The real question is ... was there anything impeding your ability to make the round?

I've HEARD that other brand progressives can be a bit "fiddly" but not these two.

When it comes to these two, I would just look at features and price. Which one has auto-case loading? Which one can do auto bullet seating? How much does that cost. In the end, either will do what you want it to, it's just a matter of money and preference.

Disclaimer (I have a 550b and a Rockchucker ... and a little Lee as well)

BTW, I've got to ask one question. Granted that Dillon produces some nice machinery. But so do other companies (e. g. Hornady, RCBS, etc.). Despite that, I'm detecting a "Dillon only, everything else is junk" mindset among many owners of Dillon gear, when clearly not everything else is junk. What's the deal with that? Any takers?

Honestly I think because Dillon costs more, people will always have the attitude that my "press" don't stick attitude if you know what I mean

When you pay more for something than everybody else, some people take that as the license to put down other products.

Your question usually ignites a firestorm of of "Blue verses Red verses etc." What you are not going to find is very many people that have actually loaded on BOTH DILLON AND HORNADY. I have loaded on the Dillon SDB, 550, 650, 1050 and the Hornady LNL. Here is my perspective:

Consider the Hornady Lock and Load Progressive. It’s cheaper than the Dillon and has several features that, IMHO are better than Dillon.

The Dillon has been on the market a long time and have great customer service, as a result, Dillon users are very dedicated to their blue presses. Dillon presses are EXCEPTIONAL and do an exceptional job in reloading. The competition to the Dillon is the Hornady Lock and Load Auto Progressive. Because most of the Dillon users are so satisfied, when you ask the question “Which is better?”, you get swamped with comments like, "The Hornady L-n-L is Junk!" If you asked if they have ever loaded on the L-n-L and 99.9% said no. When I did find someone that had experience with both presses, most liked the L-n-L and many had sold their Dillon's and bought the L-n-L. However, there have been those that sold their red presses and bought blue. You just have to decide what you like best. Some times it’s just the color, red or blue!!

IMHO the Dillon has one major shortcoming and, most Dillon owners will agree if they are honest. The Dillon powder measure is sorely lacking in ease of use and adjustability. It meters ball type powder very well but flake type powder less so. And, extruded stick type powder is VERY troublesome and not all that accurate. To be fair, extruded powder is difficult in all powder measures. But, the L-n-L powder measure handles all types of powder MUCH better than the Dillon. Also, it is a pain to swap out the Dillon powder measure to another die plate. As a result, many owners have several powder measures on separate die plates for changing calibers. This significantly drives UP the COST. I have never heard of a LNL owner that has more than one powder measure. There is no need. It is easy to adjust. Many LNL owners, myself included, own several "Powder Dies" that are pre-adjusted to load a specific case. (Note: Powder measure fits into the Powder Die.) Each LNL powder die costs about $20. A Dillon powder measure costs $75.

Also, IMHO, the Dillon de-priming system is less reliable than the LNL. With the Dillon system, spent primers drop through the bottom of the shell plate into a small cup. It is an “open” system and is easy to empty. However, the press gets dirty with carbon. Whenever carbon/dust/dirt or “primer dust” fouls the primer seating station this causes "flipped" or "skipped" primers. The DILLON de-priming system works well provided it is kept CLEAN. The Hornady L-N-L spent primers are dropped completely through the press into a plastic tube and into the trash or bottle or whatever you want to use. It is a “closed” system. You never get carbon in and around the bottom of the shell plate. The point is the dirt off the spent primers does not foul the workings of the press. I have never had a “flipped” primer. Although I have had “missed” primers that I feel were operator error (ME!) and not the fault of the primer system. (I forgot to seat the primer!) In all fairness, the LNL primer seating station will also not work properly if the primer slide is fouled with dirt or powder.

If you want a powder check system you need a press with at least five stations. The Dillon Square Deal and 550 has 4 die stations. The L-N-L has 5 stations. The Dillon 650 has 5 stations, but costs significantly more. And, the Dillon 1050 in an industrial machine and has about 7 or eight.

How the presses indexes is an issue for some people. In reading the web about "KABOOMS" (Blowing up a gun!!), many of the kabooms I have read about were directly traced back to a manually indexing press. This is not the fault of the press but, operator error. However, with a manually indexing press, If you get distracted while reloading, you can easily double charge a pistol case. (A double charge will depend on the powder you are using and the charge weight.) IMHO, a double charge is less of a problem with auto-indexing presses. The Hornady L-N-L, Dillon 650 and, Dillon Square Deal auto index. The MOST POPULAR Dillon press, the 550 is a manually indexing press. Some people prefer manual, some people prefer auto.

In addition, the LNL auto indexing is significantly smoother than the Dillon 650. The LNL indexes 1/2 step while the ram is going up and 1/2 step when the ram goes down. The 650 indexes a full step and can cause pistol cases to spill SMALL AMOUNTS or powder with the indexing "bump". IMHO, the LNL is dramatically better. Of course, the amount of powder "bumped" from a case is dependent on the powder charge, operator and speed of reloading. As I stated above, you get primer problems with a dirty press. "Bumped" powder fouls BOTH Dillon and LNL.

Next, the L-N-L uses a really slick bushing system for mounting loading dies to the press. It makes changing calibers and SNAP. After a die is adjusted for whatever you are loading you can remove the die from the press with an 1/8 turn and insert a different die. Each die has it's own bushing. The Dillon uses a die plate. The Dillon die plate costs more than L-N-L bushings. Another neat feature with the Hornady is that you can buy a bushing conversion setup and use the same bushings on your RCBS, Lyman or other single stage press and the L-N-L!

Additionally, the L-N-L seems to be built like a tank! The ram is about 2"+ in diameter and the basic press is similar in construction to the RCBS Rockchucker. I would say that a side-by-side comparison to the either the Dillon 550 OR 650, the L-N-L is at least as sturdily built. And, in some areas I think the L-N-L is better built. i.e., The massive ram, powder measure, and primer system. The head/top of the press is solid except for where the dies are inserted. The Dillon has a large cutout that is needed for their die plates. By just looking, it would seem the L-N-L would be stronger. But, of course, that may not be the case.
There is one piece that can get damaged on the L-N-L. There is a coil spring that holds the cases in the shell holder that can get crushed if you improperly change shell holders. That's the bad news. The good news is that they are only about $2-3 for three and they won't get crushed if you change shell plates correctly. The other good news is that this spring is the primary reason that while loading you can easily remove a case at any station. With the Dillon you have to remove pins in order to take a shell out of a shell plate.

Another item to think about. For NON-CASE FEEDER users; all Dillon's (Except 1050) require you to use BOTH hands to load brass and bullets.

1) Right hand inserts an empty case on the right side of the press.
2) Left hand then sets the bullet on the case mouth on the left side of the press
3) Right hand then activates the operating handle.
4) Right hand releases operating handle and inserts another case on the right side and so forth. (Right, left, right, right, left, right,right)

With the LNL you insert both an empty case AND bullet with the left hand. Your right hand never leaves the operating lever. Loading cases and bullets with the left hand is very natural to me. Others may really dislike this feature and prefer the right/left/right/right operation of Dillon. A case feeder eliminates this operation and both Dillon and LNL only load bullets on the left side of the press.

You can load anything on both the Dillon and L-N-L from .25 ACP to 500 N.E. Realistically, I would say that people with progressive loaders mostly load pistol ammo 99% of the time. After using the L-N-L for while I feel confident that my Grandkids will be using when I'm gone.

In summary, the Hornady L-N-L has all the features of the Dillon 650 but is much cheaper. However, the Dillon automatic case feeder is about $50 cheaper that the Hornady. Changing calipers on the LNL is faster and cheaper. The powder measure on the L-N-L is VASTLY SUPERIOR TO THE DILLON, at least in my opinion. I bought the L-N-L and am very satisfied. A shooting buddy of mine is a long time, dedicated Dillon user. He has three! After giving me a ration of "stuff" about my choice, he came over and used my L-N-L and sheepishly said, "That's a very nice setup!!"

I agree with you there XDRoX. One more suggestion. Don't worry about automated bullet feeders or shell feeders. Those add-ons are incremental meaning you don't really get a huge discount if you bought it all at once rather than an add-on later. You'll have enough on your hands first loading one round at a time and making sure everything goes right. While I probably would have bought a 550 if the price were the same, I got an awesome deal on a new LnL with dies, plates, accessories and components through Cabelas. I honestly think the throughput, accuracy of loads and support is so close between the two, it really doesn't matter and either choice would be top notch. Look elsewhere on Calguns for "better than list price retail" on Dillon loaders and you will find that you can save quite a bit since Dillon discounts are not the norm while Hornady are.

If you are loading rifle rounds, please also do a lot of web surfing to observe that you really don't gain much with a progressive when loading rifle rounds.

I love my LnL AP but would probably be just as happy if I had a 500B. I don't have arthritis, and moving the little index each pull would not be a deal breaker for me.

Wow, thanks for the comparisons Waldog. You submitted your excellent comparisons while I was still writing my 2 cents. I had taken for granted the little extras in the LnL you pointed out like the smoother 1/2 indexing, ease of taking a case out in the middle of the sequence with the spring shell holder, one-handed bullet and case feed not to mention the powder measure (which is ultra smooth by the way). Sometimes its better to be lucky than good.

I don't know about the 550, but both the 650 and the LNL are both fine machines and you won't regret buying either. I've tried both before buying the LNL because I liked the ergonomics of the LNL better and to boot it was less expensive and I got 1,000 free bullets (Hornady has been increasing their price lately, however). Other people prefer the ergonomics of the 650; if you can you might want to try them out to see which suits you better.

As a long-time handloader and owner of a Dillon 550B, I would offer this advice. (And I particularly appreciate Waldog's comparison.). I would not start handloading with a progressive press--too easy to make mistakes that you do not want ro make. Rather, buy a single stage press--pretty much any one will do--and learn the fundamentals; handloading with a single stage press, if you follow good practices, is fool-proof and still useful long after you've jacked thousands of rounds through the Dillon, Hornady, or whatever.

As a long-time handloader and owner of a Dillon 550B, I would offer this advice. (And I particularly appreciate Waldog's comparison.). I would not start handloading with a progressive press--too easy to make mistakes that you do not want ro make. Rather, buy a single stage press--pretty much any one will do--and learn the fundamentals; handloading with a single stage press, if you follow good practices, is fool-proof and still useful long after you've jacked thousands of rounds through the Dillon, Hornady, or whatever.

Although I don't think that one needs to start on a single stage, I did as you said. I still use my Rockchucker for small batches and development to this day.

Your question usually ignites a firestorm of of "Blue verses Red verses etc." What you are not going to find is very many people that have actually loaded on BOTH DILLON AND HORNADY. I have loaded on the Dillon SDB, 550, 650, 1050 and the Hornady LNL. Here is my perspective:

Consider the Hornady Lock and Load Progressive. It’s cheaper than the Dillon and has several features that, IMHO are better than Dillon.

The Dillon has been on the market a long time and have great customer service, as a result, Dillon users are very dedicated to their blue presses. Dillon presses are EXCEPTIONAL and do an exceptional job in reloading. The competition to the Dillon is the Hornady Lock and Load Auto Progressive. Because most of the Dillon users are so satisfied, when you ask the question “Which is better?”, you get swamped with comments like, "The Hornady L-n-L is Junk!" If you asked if they have ever loaded on the L-n-L and 99.9% said no. When I did find someone that had experience with both presses, most liked the L-n-L and many had sold their Dillon's and bought the L-n-L. However, there have been those that sold their red presses and bought blue. You just have to decide what you like best. Some times it’s just the color, red or blue!!

IMHO the Dillon has one major shortcoming and, most Dillon owners will agree if they are honest. The Dillon powder measure is sorely lacking in ease of use and adjustability. It meters ball type powder very well but flake type powder less so. And, extruded stick type powder is VERY troublesome and not all that accurate. To be fair, extruded powder is difficult in all powder measures. But, the L-n-L powder measure handles all types of powder MUCH better than the Dillon. Also, it is a pain to swap out the Dillon powder measure to another die plate. As a result, many owners have several powder measures on separate die plates for changing calibers. This significantly drives UP the COST. I have never heard of a LNL owner that has more than one powder measure. There is no need. It is easy to adjust. Many LNL owners, myself included, own several "Powder Dies" that are pre-adjusted to load a specific case. (Note: Powder measure fits into the Powder Die.) Each LNL powder die costs about $20. A Dillon powder measure costs $75.

Also, IMHO, the Dillon de-priming system is less reliable than the LNL. With the Dillon system, spent primers drop through the bottom of the shell plate into a small cup. It is an “open” system and is easy to empty. However, the press gets dirty with carbon. Whenever carbon/dust/dirt or “primer dust” fouls the primer seating station this causes "flipped" or "skipped" primers. The DILLON de-priming system works well provided it is kept CLEAN. The Hornady L-N-L spent primers are dropped completely through the press into a plastic tube and into the trash or bottle or whatever you want to use. It is a “closed” system. You never get carbon in and around the bottom of the shell plate. The point is the dirt off the spent primers does not foul the workings of the press. I have never had a “flipped” primer. Although I have had “missed” primers that I feel were operator error (ME!) and not the fault of the primer system. (I forgot to seat the primer!) In all fairness, the LNL primer seating station will also not work properly if the primer slide is fouled with dirt or powder.

If you want a powder check system you need a press with at least five stations. The Dillon Square Deal and 550 has 4 die stations. The L-N-L has 5 stations. The Dillon 650 has 5 stations, but costs significantly more. And, the Dillon 1050 in an industrial machine and has about 7 or eight.

How the presses indexes is an issue for some people. In reading the web about "KABOOMS" (Blowing up a gun!!), many of the kabooms I have read about were directly traced back to a manually indexing press. This is not the fault of the press but, operator error. However, with a manually indexing press, If you get distracted while reloading, you can easily double charge a pistol case. (A double charge will depend on the powder you are using and the charge weight.) IMHO, a double charge is less of a problem with auto-indexing presses. The Hornady L-N-L, Dillon 650 and, Dillon Square Deal auto index. The MOST POPULAR Dillon press, the 550 is a manually indexing press. Some people prefer manual, some people prefer auto.

In addition, the LNL auto indexing is significantly smoother than the Dillon 650. The LNL indexes 1/2 step while the ram is going up and 1/2 step when the ram goes down. The 650 indexes a full step and can cause pistol cases to spill SMALL AMOUNTS or powder with the indexing "bump". IMHO, the LNL is dramatically better. Of course, the amount of powder "bumped" from a case is dependent on the powder charge, operator and speed of reloading. As I stated above, you get primer problems with a dirty press. "Bumped" powder fouls BOTH Dillon and LNL.

Next, the L-N-L uses a really slick bushing system for mounting loading dies to the press. It makes changing calibers and SNAP. After a die is adjusted for whatever you are loading you can remove the die from the press with an 1/8 turn and insert a different die. Each die has it's own bushing. The Dillon uses a die plate. The Dillon die plate costs more than L-N-L bushings. Another neat feature with the Hornady is that you can buy a bushing conversion setup and use the same bushings on your RCBS, Lyman or other single stage press and the L-N-L!

Additionally, the L-N-L seems to be built like a tank! The ram is about 2"+ in diameter and the basic press is similar in construction to the RCBS Rockchucker. I would say that a side-by-side comparison to the either the Dillon 550 OR 650, the L-N-L is at least as sturdily built. And, in some areas I think the L-N-L is better built. i.e., The massive ram, powder measure, and primer system. The head/top of the press is solid except for where the dies are inserted. The Dillon has a large cutout that is needed for their die plates. By just looking, it would seem the L-N-L would be stronger. But, of course, that may not be the case.
There is one piece that can get damaged on the L-N-L. There is a coil spring that holds the cases in the shell holder that can get crushed if you improperly change shell holders. That's the bad news. The good news is that they are only about $2-3 for three and they won't get crushed if you change shell plates correctly. The other good news is that this spring is the primary reason that while loading you can easily remove a case at any station. With the Dillon you have to remove pins in order to take a shell out of a shell plate.

Another item to think about. For NON-CASE FEEDER users; all Dillon's (Except 1050) require you to use BOTH hands to load brass and bullets.

1) Right hand inserts an empty case on the right side of the press.
2) Left hand then sets the bullet on the case mouth on the left side of the press
3) Right hand then activates the operating handle.
4) Right hand releases operating handle and inserts another case on the right side and so forth. (Right, left, right, right, left, right,right)

With the LNL you insert both an empty case AND bullet with the left hand. Your right hand never leaves the operating lever. Loading cases and bullets with the left hand is very natural to me. Others may really dislike this feature and prefer the right/left/right/right operation of Dillon. A case feeder eliminates this operation and both Dillon and LNL only load bullets on the left side of the press.

You can load anything on both the Dillon and L-N-L from .25 ACP to 500 N.E. Realistically, I would say that people with progressive loaders mostly load pistol ammo 99% of the time. After using the L-N-L for while I feel confident that my Grandkids will be using when I'm gone.

In summary, the Hornady L-N-L has all the features of the Dillon 650 but is much cheaper. However, the Dillon automatic case feeder is about $50 cheaper that the Hornady. Changing calipers on the LNL is faster and cheaper. The powder measure on the L-N-L is VASTLY SUPERIOR TO THE DILLON, at least in my opinion. I bought the L-N-L and am very satisfied. A shooting buddy of mine is a long time, dedicated Dillon user. He has three! After giving me a ration of "stuff" about my choice, he came over and used my L-N-L and sheepishly said, "That's a very nice setup!!"

Old information is no information.I read the above 6 years ago.......... After reloading for close to 30 years and having used RCBS, CH, Lee, Lyman, Star and a few others
Dillon does what I want the machine to do.

One additional thought on the LNL. If you are just starting out and not ready for the progerssive press you may want ot take a look at the Hornady LNL "Classic" Kit which you can pick up for around $300 and is a complete kit including the single stage press, powder measure, scale, hand primer, other small accessories and a reloading book.

And when you do decide to move up to the progressive press later, the die/bushing setup are directly interchangeable between the Classic and the AP progressive so it's just a matter of moving them from one machine to another.

BTW, Cabela's is having a sale on LNL Classic kit for $250 and also having a free shipping promo til 11-30. Plus Hornady has a mail-in rebate for 100 bullets (up to $30).

Old information is no information.I read the above 6 years ago.......... After reloading for close to 30 years and having used RCBS, CH, Lee, Lyman, Star and a few others
Dillon does what I want the machine to do.

OK then go buy the Dillon. But my owning the Hornardy. I took advantage of the FREE Bullets Hornady will send you. I have to admit that at first I had some minor problems due to my neglegence. But a simple phone call and to my surprize the best customer I have experienced in God knows how long.

Them; "No problem sir, where do you want me to send this part?"

Me: "Uhhhhhh! How much will that cost?"

Them: "No cost sir. And by the way, let me simplify that action to you to make things easier next time"

And it did. And it works!!
Look out Dillon. Hornady is catching up

__________________
"One Useless Man is a Shame. Two are a Law firm. Three or More are a Congress".

I've been reloading for a few months now and I went with the Dillon 550. The machine works great and I have no complaints. Dilllon's customer service is excellent as well. I had a few questions when I was getting started and the customer service rep took all the time I needed to make sure all my questions were answered and that I understood what I was doing.

I got quick change assemblies for different calibers and it only takes a few minutes to change caliber setups. The hardest part is the initial investment but if you shoot a lot it will pay for itself in savings in very little time. I'm sure you can't go wrong with any reloading setup, but I definitely think the Dillon is worth purchasing.