Friday, November 18, 2011

Homosexual Lifestyle: "I've Been There" It's "Anything But Gay"

Ironically, most supportive comments come to us in private email message. I thank you for the recent messages of support. It means a great deal to me and all involved here at Faith and Freedom. However, most of the negative, sometimes so vile they cannot be published comments are posted on the website. Private messages are kept private.

We are grateful to our readers here in Washington State, across the country and in 35 countries, for your interest in what we write about Judeo-Christian values and the culture.

Yesterday, a post was made on our blog posted earlier this week titled, "Ed Murray's Action Items For Re-Defining Marriage". I have no idea who this person is nor where they live, however, while their comments were posted, I think their message should be read by a broader audience that may not read all the posts.

We have never done this before, but today I am sharing the comments and experiences of one of our readers who has been in the homosexual lifestyle and anonymously shared their personal view and experience. Please take a moment and read this person's comments.

You can sing your story all day long but it will not change the truth of what is going on in the 'gay' (anything but gay) community. You 'preach' your tolerance here (yet have NO tolerance for another view) but the chances of ONE homosexual person being consistently committed to another is 1 in 9000! Most people posting here haven't been close to the community to say BS to your ploys but I have seen it first hand. What a line of garbage!

The whole movement is just full of lies. I could go on but let me share just a touch of real life research and statistics. And if you want to hear more I'll tell you about my loved ones and their real life stories. To find the story of this dear daughter is 1 in a million, as the say. It just so happens that I have a cousin who probably fits that bill....but then I don't REALLY know them that well to testify to their monogamy.

Source: 2003-2004 Gay/Lesbian Consumer Online Census

· In The Sexual Organization of the City, University of Chicago sociologist Edward Laumann argues that "typical gay city inhabitants spend most of their adult lives in 'transactional' relationships, or short-term commitments of less than six months."[5]

· A study of homosexual men in the Netherlands published in the journal AIDS found that the "duration of steady partnerships" was 1.5 years.[6]

· In his study of male homosexuality in Western Sexuality: Practice and Precept in Past and Present Times, Pollak found that "few homosexual relationships last longer than two years, with many men reporting hundreds of lifetime partners."[7]

· In Male and Female Homosexuality, Saghir and Robins found that the average male homosexual live-in relationship lasts between two and three years.[8]MONOGAMY VS. PROMISCUITY: SEXUAL PARTNERS OUTSIDE OF THE RELATIONSHIP

Lest anyone suffer the illusion that any equivalency between the sexual practices of homosexual relationships and traditional marriage exists, the statistics regarding sexual fidelity within marriage are revealing:

Married couples

· A nationally representative survey of 884 men and 1,288 women published in the Journal of Sex Research found that 77 percent of married men and 88 percent of married women had remained faithful to their marriage vows.[9]

· A 1997 national survey appearing in The Social Organization of Sexuality: Sexual Practices in the United States found that 75 percent of husbands and 85 percent of wives never had sexual relations outside of marriage.[10]

Male Homosexuals

Research indicates that the average male homosexual has hundreds of sex partners in his lifetime:

· The Dutch study of partnered homosexuals, which was published in the journal AIDS, found that men with a steady partner had an average of eight sexual partners per year.[12]

· Bell and Weinberg, in their classic study of male and female homosexuality, found that 43 percent of white male homosexuals had sex with 500 or more partners, with 28 percent having one thousand or more sex partners.[13]The Handbook of Family Diversity reported a study in which "many self-described 'monogamous' couples reported an average of three to five partners in the past year. Blasband and Peplau (1985) observed a similar pattern."[17]

(Had lots more but my message was limited.)

Then, you want us to consider that homosexual behavior is normal and something the rest of us who realize - again, from experience - it is a choice, to accept as if you are helpless. Oh my word, talk about selling the bridge. You have to be kidding. Have you gone to a bar in Seattle, heck, Renton. Sure looks like lots of commitment (not). How about the sign on a Spokane bar "New meat requested" Gosh, I wonder what kind of a bar that is??? Commitment. Are you really expecting those of us who have been there and seen it to buy this garbage?________________

32 comments:

As was clear to you if you read the comments, this bit of dishonest anti-gay drivel was cut and pasted from the anti-gay hate group the Family Research Council. Nothing you presented is from the source you cite at the top!

I'd say this post is proof positive that Gary doesn't care if something is true or accurate, he can't even be bothered to make an attempt at verifying it, so long is it promotes his agenda of spreading anti-gay animus far and wide he will promote it.

An indication of Gary's complete and total indifference to the truth can be found by comparing paragraphs 3 & 4. In paragraph 3 Gary admits that he has "no idea who this person is nor where they live". Then suddenly in paragraph 4, where Gary is trying to give added weight to the anti-gay rhetoric our anonymous poster sloppily cut and pasted from the anti-gay hate site Family Research Council, Gary no claims that this poster is "one of our readers who has been in the homosexual lifestyle and anonymously shared their personal view and experience". That's right folks, we have no idea, who they are or where they live, but apparently we know they are a so-called "ex-gay" lol.

The fact that Gary feels that the sort of unthinking anti-gay animus, the rude and condescending attitude, the obviously made up "statistics", the contemptuous dismissal of everyone's experience but his own limited one is worthy of being highlighted and endorsed, should end any debate over what motivates mister Randall, clearly it is nothing but anti-gay animus!

When I owned my Christian Bookstore I had many ex-homosexual customers, and friends. They all told me the same things that were pointed out in this article and even more!

Many time we had discussed how special privileges and entitlements for sexual preferences would lead to other minority groups seeking 'equal' privileges based on who and what they "love". That would include those who love their dogs, siblings, parents, etc. who would want those kinds of marriages to be acceptable and qualify for special treatment.

Once a door is cracked open, anything can walk through and it's a lot harder to stop something once it's begun, than to not let it start in the first place.

I'm shocked and appalled at societies debaucherous views of love and marriage.

Well, all "nicely" said. However, while these "statistics" might be from a what maybe a couple thousand people, it does not ever reflect the entire community. I have had 4 partners in my life and one husband to which I have been married to for 17 years now. We do not venture outside of the relationship, becuase, we ARE "Committed" to this relationship. "for better, or worse, in sickness and in health. Until death us do part." I just don't like it when people "generalize" everything. I do not generalize, as I see and understand your view point. Even with that I will still live my life my way. May god open your eyes, just to understand, hate either way is wrong. We should just love one another, and leave the judging to God. Good day to you all and Happy Thanksgiving.....

In reading the comments here and on other daily FFN posts, I am shocked that some of you have the gall to slam Gary and his beliefs in the way you do, while at the same time he has the grace to allow you to make your points and arguments on his web site and even post your attacks. I see Gary consistently referred to as hateful because he isn't quiet about his beliefs and you disagree with them. The hate you express is much more convincing to me than the hate you accuse people of harboring and speaking. Someone above on this thread is also calling Family Research Council an "anti-gay hate site".Why do you attack everyone you disagree with? Why do you attack the person Gary quoted in this post, trying to discredit him or her because you disagree or because they quoted from FRC? I see hate, but not from those accused of it.This is a learning moment. It's hard to link the message of love and family I'm hearing from gay activists with what I actually see you saying here. This is more helpful to me in understanding, then to just have someone try to explain the hate within the gay community toward those who disagree or have a different view. Wow. Thanks.

I've known many ex-ex-gays and to a person they say that they NEVER changed, that even the leaders of their "ex-gay" ministries admitted that no one had ever changed orientation.

Many times we discussed how the entire "ex-gay" movement was all about giving cover to anti-gay groups and was at it's core nothing more than a political movement.

So, why should more weight be given to your friends than to mine?

Also, your comment about opening the door a crack, could be said verbatim by an opponent of inter-racial marriage. Please explain how that didn't open the door a crack? Remember, Gary's cohort of the time would have opposed allowing inter-racial marriages.

[b]Someone above on this thread is also calling Family Research Council an "anti-gay hate site".Why do you attack everyone you disagree with?[/b]

But that isn't the case, is it? the FRC spreads misleading screeds all the time - that's why they are an identified hate group - they aren't looking for the truth, they are are just trying to justify their own hatreds.

No honest person would look at a study that deliberately sought out a particular minority of a larger group and then say it was representative of that larger group. That is, at best, a half truth and for a Christian a half truth is the same as a lie.

Spreading lies is a sin to Christians, right? We might disagree on other things but we both agree on that, right?

If we do then what's your complaint and if we don't then what sect of Christianity are you practicing?

Truthfully thousands of gays and lesbians find long term committed and loving relationships that last for decades. Likewise some heterosexual couples live in long term committed and monogamous relationships.

On the other hand, there are straight people who do not have monogamous long term relationships. They are serial cheaters, or have open relationships. Gay people do not own the monopoly on non-monogamous relationships. Nevertheless, monogamy is not a legal requirement of marriage. Nor should it be.

Clearly more than 18,000 people in Domestic Partnerships have chosen to be committed to their loved ones. We should also give them the opportunity to marry.

Many time we had discussed how special privileges and entitlements for sexual preferencesLike the current state of only those men can license with a wife, and only women can license with a husband? I totally agree with you - marriage equality is about getting the state OUT of the sexual preference business.

Typical of these anti-Christian hate-speech advocates to post comments about thousands of gays and lesbians finding long term committed relationships. This is the usual BS. Let these folks provide THEIR OWN source of data! Come on folks! Enough with the personal anecdotes. One or two people you know personally does not negate the data provided by the hundreds of thousands and the millions.

Because some heterosexual marriages are failures doesn't provide proof of comparability. The evidence does NOT support any sort of equality of commitment between heterosexual couples or homosexual ones. And all of your belligerent, hate-filled propaganda will never change the facts.

This is so amazing. I'm the one who posted. I simply Googled 'marriage statistics in the gay community' (or something like that). The references to the studies are posted clearly. The copy and paste included credit to where it was due. I could not get it all in because it was too long. So that is that. (I picked out what would fit in the space limitations)

As another pointed out, gay's hatred of anyone who does not agree with them is obvious and these posts end up making the case all by themselves.

I testify that I was in the gay community for about eight years. My message was clear and concise that the gay community is the group spreading lies and misconceptions trying to get others to believe in these 'thousands of monogamous couples', yet here are the statistics regarding that topic and all you can say is they are lies.

Really! The studies that were quoted come from the homosexual community and from other countries. I'm sure they are terribly biased. And for crying out loud Oshtur, I've mentioned before that you are the master of circular arguments that completely ignore the 'face in the mirror'. ALL STATISTICAL STUDIES are just what the term means, statistics of a study group to the whole. Duh! Are you kidding me?

Talk about drivel.

I suppose, like another mentioned, I've been watching you guys (gays) attack those who disagree like a bunch of spoiled, whinny children and finally got fed up. Your lifestyle is like the book "The Emperors New Clothes." The homosexual community can go on and on about what they are doing doesn't hurt anybody, should be considered normal, makes marriages stronger, allows for diversity, is only fair to make things equal.....but no matter how much you can get the lemmings to buy it, there are many many who KNOW BETTER. It is a destructive community that participates in a tremendous amount of violence as well as perversion. Like another poster said, 'they all told the same things and even more'. Yep, it is true.

Stupid argument that Gary contradicts himself from paragraph 3 to 4. I swear so many people don't bother to post because answering these kinds of idiotic slams are pointless, frustrating and tiresome. Gary does not know me and he happens to be observant enough to recognize that I said I had been in the homosexual community. Can't you read?

Why are you fighting against the Homosexual life style ? Is it because you love the gays, but not not their sinand want to save them from God's wrath,or are you just trying to save your own skins from God's wrath.

You don't have to worry or fear . God loves you and his judgement for you will be fair and it will also be fair for those in the homosexual lifestyle.

Tony, you are deceiving yourself. NOT a single one of those statistics even is about 'gay marriage'! They are all directed studies about groups other than gay people in general. Please point out the single solitary deceit in the Family Research Council screed that has statistics on married gay people?

Again only a consummate liar like the FRC would represent a group selected from gay bathhouses in San Francisco in the 70's as representative of gay men in general. Same for one that was about HIV vectoring in a population of specifically selected promiscuous urban young men. No honest person in the world would reference a reference that was about another reference - again, that's the cardinal sign of someone 'lying with statistics'.

When you start comparing those kind of statistics with the ones from heterosexuals recruited from sex clubs, STD clinics and the like you might have a shred of integrity - but I won't hold my breath.

Makes me laugh - just recently a gossipy person was saying that the 'divorce' rate in the UK for civil unions was incredibly high - I went and did the research and it was lower than the divorce rate for marriages lasting the same amount of time.

Oops.

And I don't know what kind of dives you went to but if you go to the local gay bars all you find are people chatting, dancing and singing karaoke, same as you do in rest of the bars. One reason why the gay bar scene in Seattle is slowly dying - why go to a gay establishment when you can just goto any generic one and do exactly the same things?

I'm sorry if your life was horrible but then their are just people with horrible lives regardless of their sexual orientation. In my experience the ones say their gay life was horrible when they share the details reveal someone who was leading a life like something out of Dante's Inferno. They could just have easily not been promiscuous, not used drugs, not 'whatever' else you did that was wrong - they just choose the wild life and then blame the 'gay' when there is a subculture of straight people all doing the exact same things.

But blaming others for your bad choices when they never made those choices at all - that's the drivel.

The evidence does NOT support any sort of equality of commitment between heterosexual couples or homosexual ones.How could they when most homosexual couples don't even have access to the civil contract of marriage, a factor that is given great weight in promoting relationship fidelity.

Hey here's an idea, why not research the thousands of couples in Washington who are domestic partners and see what their divorce rate is compared with married couples of the same duration?

Until you do, you are just justify your own hatred and bigotry. Again, Christians don't gossip, they don't repeat lies, they don't 'presume' anyone of any group iis anything other than themselves.

Really - did none of you even read the story of the 'good Samaritan'? You do realize at the time much bad gossip and lies were told about Samaritans and they were considered, as a group, anything but good?

Give up your judgmental ways, quit searching for the worst possible ways to look at a group and then act as if every member of the group was an example of the lies.

OK, let's just assume for the sake of argument that the statistics are all correct.

So what?

One's tendency toward monogamy or vice versa has never been a consideration in allowing them to marry. Otherwise, you could make a strong argument that famous hollywood people shouldn't be able to marry.

It is sad that we have to address the same mix of studies from the 1970s and non-representative studies over and over and over again. How many times does it have to be brought out that the Dutch study cited above is NOT a study of gay relationships? It was an AIDS study. It didn't even attempt to capture a representative sample of Dutch gay men.

If you want to compare gay married couples with straight married couples, that is a perfectly valid exercise. The studies that exist show very little differences and in fact, the current divorce rate among gays in Canada and the Netherlands (where gay marriage has existed for 6 and 10 years respectively), is lower than the heterosexual divorce rate. Anyway, if you want to look at studies, look at those comparing gay marrieds and straight marrieds. Looking at studies that deal with unmarried couples, almost all young and urban, and then comparing them to married straight couples is dishonest.

And yet gay people will go on because they are just people with parents, and a normal variation.

And this idea that gays can't breed? You don't have to be attracted to a sex to have sex with that sex. We're not animals - we know how babies are made. Any one that wants to can pass on their genes regardless of their sexual orientation.