@Dar-ren19 I just cracked up because I remembered that scene where she's the group therapist. And she played one for computers in an IBM commercial.

It's true that Rey and Ben need to work on their communication skills. But this is also Star Wars where apparently children like Rey can be sold off by their alcoholic parents. Because they have laser swords and spaceships but no Child Protective Services.

@Dar-ren19 wrote:She's only now beginning to process what she's been going through with Ben. I'm looking forward to a IX that is as deep as VIII. I'm not sure we'll get what we're hoping for because I'm a longtime Trekkie and in my opinion JJ delivered a good Trek movie but it was VERY lighthearted. But I'm open to surprises Cool

I can't speak to Star Trek, but I was just watching The Force Awakens after having watched The Last Jedi twice, and you're right, there is a levity to J.J.'s work that isn't present in TLJ, and a gravitas in TLJ that isn't present in (most of) TFA. However, I find the exception to this is any scenes that involve Rey/Kylo. There's a multilayered weightiness to their scenes, both in the way they were written, but *especially* in how they are executed (I'm obviously thinking of the interrogation, and also of choice moments in their snow-fight). Hopefully that bodes well for the final film as a whole.

I was disappointed with his Star Trek movies. Even moreso when I heard how he'd openly insulted the philosophies/ethics of Trek. I've always seen him as something of a lightweight artistically. I prefer the kind of rich thematic and psychological writing Rian brought to the table. However, I agree. I rewatched TFA recently and I was impressed by the interrogation and snow fight as well. I was very impressed by how he handled Han's death.

the thing that I was waiting to see was not kylo's feelings towards Rey because we already have a clear vision in the previous film. What I was aiming for was Rey's feelings towards Kylo. Rian managed to change (maybe too soon) Rey's feelings. The hatred she feels towards him is there, but only at the beginning. The search for truth and this strange connection with him change her deeply.

So I can say that she feels hatred of him, there is the desire to know more about him, the knowledge of his past, the acceptance of his actions and the desire to go to him and save him, the confidence that she has in Ben Solo while dueling against PG and then the cold truth of his choice and tears of despair, a moment of recovery on Crait and then the disappointment towards Kylo

I believe that Rey inevitably tied up with Ben despite his choice to be a leader. she is into him as he is into her, and she has to deal with it

When Rey and Kylo saw each other through force, she did not think for a momentto shoot him. There is anger but there is something else in the air. But he has always been calm and always him goes to her.

When Rey tries to find the answer about her parents, there is a rift and we hear her talk to Kylo. For the first time is she who starts , is she who wants a contact

and another beautiful thing is ... Kylo takes off his glove because he wants touch Rey, feel her on his skin. There is no Kylo there is only Ben.

I think even if Rey showed courage facing the darkness (going to the cave, trying to lure a Dark Side user - Kylo - to the light) and the good side domains her soul, she is not a balanced character either. Her impulsive acts involving Kylo/Ben are a proof, in my opinion: hate (shooting at Kylo) - hope / almost love (after the vision) - rejection (throne scene), because of these feelings she instinctively reacts without thinking much.

@Dar-ren19 wrote:She's only now beginning to process what she's been going through with Ben. I'm looking forward to a IX that is as deep as VIII. I'm not sure we'll get what we're hoping for because I'm a longtime Trekkie and in my opinion JJ delivered a good Trek movie but it was VERY lighthearted. But I'm open to surprises Cool

I can't speak to Star Trek, but I was just watching The Force Awakens after having watched The Last Jedi twice, and you're right, there is a levity to J.J.'s work that isn't present in TLJ, and a gravitas in TLJ that isn't present in (most of) TFA. However, I find the exception to this is any scenes that involve Rey/Kylo. There's a multilayered weightiness to their scenes, both in the way they were written, but *especially* in how they are executed (I'm obviously thinking of the interrogation, and also of choice moments in their snow-fight). Hopefully that bodes well for the final film as a whole.

I was disappointed with his Star Trek movies. Even moreso when I heard how he'd openly insulted the philosophies/ethics of Trek. I've always seen him as something of a lightweight artistically. I prefer the kind of rich thematic and psychological writing Rian brought to the table. However, I agree. I rewatched TFA recently and I was impressed by the interrogation and snow fight as well. I was very impressed by how he handled Han's death.

Thank you for correlating my feelings about JJ's take on Trek. I don't want to say that I hated the 2009 Trek movie, but it didn't have the philosophical depth that we've taken for granted in Trek for so many years. However, I will say that it drew in a lot of new fans who loved the sparkly bits (figuratively speaking), and also some of the human moments (especially with the three main characters). So in that way, JJ did his job. As for the insults, well, he was always a Star Wars fan, we Trekkies got that... what else is there to say?

Anyway, I'm hoping as you are that Rian's turn in TLJ (and the fact that JJ has been with him all along from what I hear in terms of story and direction) has upped the ante in terms of what the OT can accomplish.

I will say this much: I am a new fan of the saga in that I was always a casual fan... you could say I was GA. Watching TFA twice didn't turn me into a focused fan (FF - my acronym :p), but just ONE WATCH of TLJ and -- what can I say -- I'm here. As a Lit/Film graduate, TLJ really impressed me, and as just a person who has lived life with all its ups and downs and highs and lows, it touched me at my deepest core. TBH, very few Trek (or other sci-fi/fantasy) efforts (movies/episodes, etc) have done that.

So, for all flaws -- and flaws it does have -- I place TLJ in a special category.

@twilekempire I also want to say that I've always felt that JJ understands emotional complexity well. What he's not is an auteur. There was no way he could have made TLJ as a director. The difference in them lies in that old "onion" metaphor. Every time you watch TLJ, you find something else to turn over and examine beneath what you had already found the last time. It makes for fascination on the level that JJ cannot create. When you watch TFA over and over again, you encounter the age-old themes of epic storytelling, not a richly textured narrative that opens up dimensions you hadn't noticed before. Films like this last the test of time even when not universally appreciated at the time of release.

It's the difference between -- and I can't think of a better comparison right this minute 'cos I gotta make dinner for the family! -- The Shining and the Sixth Sense. You could say JJ is the creative child of Spielberg and Ron Howard.

I think that Kylo is definitely in love with Rey. Just look at his face when he sees her in their first Force Skype session. He is so thrilled to see her that he almost smiles. Just a few days earlier* she had tried to kill him, and scarred him. Yet he's ecstatic like a little puppy when he encounters her again. His IMMEDIATE reaction is not “how is this happening”, it's “wow, it's that awesome girl! I'm so happy to see her”! However because he has never been in love before, he doesn't recognize his feelings. He doesn't know what they are, so he isn't consciously aware of them. It's all subconscious at this point.

Rey does at least have a deep crush on Kylo, or rather, Ben. But for her it's more complicated, due to the things Kylo has done. She has probably never been in love either, so she doesn't recognize those feelings. But she wouldn't have mailed herself to Kylo if she didn't have strong feelings for him. She trusted him so much that she was prepared to go straight to the enemy's headquarters to meet him, even though logic should have told her it's a suicide mission.

I think Snoke knew that Kylo was in love with Rey. He used that knowledge to toy with Kylo. Snoke bridged their minds so that love-sick Kylo would draw Rey to him, and thereby would give Snoke access to her. So Snoke was using Kylo in a very cruel way.

To me it feels like there is a Skype session “missing” between the shirtless scene, and the hand sex scene. I don't know if there was a scene that was cut, or if it was supposed to be that way from the beginning. I'm crossing my fingers it's a deleted scene.

* : I don't know how long the time jump between TFA and TLJ is, but it's short. It's just long enough for Kylo to fix his lightsaber, start healing his bowcaster wound, and for Poe to sew up the leather jacket. So less than a week? A couple of days?

@Dar-ren19 wrote:She's only now beginning to process what she's been going through with Ben. I'm looking forward to a IX that is as deep as VIII. I'm not sure we'll get what we're hoping for because I'm a longtime Trekkie and in my opinion JJ delivered a good Trek movie but it was VERY lighthearted. But I'm open to surprises Cool

I can't speak to Star Trek, but I was just watching The Force Awakens after having watched The Last Jedi twice, and you're right, there is a levity to J.J.'s work that isn't present in TLJ, and a gravitas in TLJ that isn't present in (most of) TFA. However, I find the exception to this is any scenes that involve Rey/Kylo. There's a multilayered weightiness to their scenes, both in the way they were written, but *especially* in how they are executed (I'm obviously thinking of the interrogation, and also of choice moments in their snow-fight). Hopefully that bodes well for the final film as a whole.

I was disappointed with his Star Trek movies. Even moreso when I heard how he'd openly insulted the philosophies/ethics of Trek. I've always seen him as something of a lightweight artistically. I prefer the kind of rich thematic and psychological writing Rian brought to the table. However, I agree. I rewatched TFA recently and I was impressed by the interrogation and snow fight as well. I was very impressed by how he handled Han's death.

Thank you for correlating my feelings about JJ's take on Trek. I don't want to say that I hated the 2009 Trek movie, but it didn't have the philosophical depth that we've taken for granted in Trek for so many years. However, I will say that it drew in a lot of new fans who loved the sparkly bits (figuratively speaking), and also some of the human moments (especially with the three main characters). So in that way, JJ did his job. As for the insults, well, he was always a Star Wars fan, we Trekkies got that... what else is there to say?

Anyway, I'm hoping as you are that Rian's turn in TLJ (and the fact that JJ has been with him all along from what I hear in terms of story and direction) has upped the ante in terms of what the OT can accomplish.

I will say this much: I am a new fan of the saga in that I was always a casual fan... you could say I was GA. Watching TFA twice didn't turn me into a focused fan (FF - my acronym :p), but just ONE WATCH of TLJ and -- what can I say -- I'm here. As a Lit/Film graduate, TLJ really impressed me, and as just a person who has lived life with all its ups and downs and highs and lows, it touched me at my deepest core. TBH, very few Trek (or other sci-fi/fantasy) efforts (movies/episodes, etc) have done that.

So, for all flaws -- and flaws it does have -- I place TLJ in a special category.

I like TFA a lot but I completely agree. I've only watched TLJ once, but my immediate reaction was that I wanted to watch it again as there's so much to digest and there's a rich philosophical weight to it that TFA doesn't have (I like JJ but he's definitely no auteur). The third act for me is honestly just top tier Star Wars. I think time will look upon it fondly and it might have an ESB style reevaluation, and it's generated so much discussion amongst the wider public. I'm really excited for RJ's trilogy (moreso than any of these spinoffs tbh) to see what he can do when he isn't constrained by someone else's vision and where he's (hopefully) writing and directing all three.

"In his own flawed and twisted way, Kylo understands one of the most fundamental truths about romantic love- that it flourishes most when it is established between equals who love and respect the other for being their own person, when they work together and not slavishly for the other, and when the feelings are not desperately one-sided or demanding or groveling, but warm, equal, and giving."

"In his own flawed and twisted way, Kylo understands one of the most fundamental truths about romantic love- that it flourishes most when it is established between equals who love and respect the other for being their own person, when they work together and not slavishly for the other, and when the feelings are not desperately one-sided or demanding or groveling, but warm, equal, and giving."

This is incredible. I love this so much. Ben as Gabriel Oak. It would be so easy to capitulate, because he would be with her and he loves her, but he would no longer belong to himself. He would belong to her. And it is high time that Ben stopped belonging to people other than himself. When they do come together, he will be his own man and she her own woman.

I have been aggravated with Rian as of late, but this essay has made him go up several levels in my estimation. Ben had to reject her offer, because had he not, he would never be strong, and he has to get strong.

Last edited by SoloSideCousin on Mon 29 Jan 2018, 5:24 pm; edited 1 time in total

"In his own flawed and twisted way, Kylo understands one of the most fundamental truths about romantic love- that it flourishes most when it is established between equals who love and respect the other for being their own person, when they work together and not slavishly for the other, and when the feelings are not desperately one-sided or demanding or groveling, but warm, equal, and giving."

This is incredible. I love this so much. Ben as Gabriel Oak. It would be so easy to capitulate, because he would be with her and he loves her, but he would no longer belong to himself. He would belong to her. And it is high time that Ben stopped belonging to people other than himself. When they do come together, he will be his own man and she her own woman.

I have been aggravated with Rian as of late, but this essay has made him go up several levels in my estimation. Ben had to reject her offer, because had he not, he would never be strong, and he has to get strong.

To right. And if Ben had just run off with Rey, as her little puppy dog, doing whatever she wanted and putting his wants and beliefs in a box; becoming an extension of her at his own self worth, she would eventually leave him. She wants a man who will stand up for himself, not a doormat who she can walk all over.

"In his own flawed and twisted way, Kylo understands one of the most fundamental truths about romantic love- that it flourishes most when it is established between equals who love and respect the other for being their own person, when they work together and not slavishly for the other, and when the feelings are not desperately one-sided or demanding or groveling, but warm, equal, and giving."

This is incredible. I love this so much. Ben as Gabriel Oak. It would be so easy to capitulate, because he would be with her and he loves her, but he would no longer belong to himself. He would belong to her. And it is high time that Ben stopped belonging to people other than himself. When they do come together, he will be his own man and she her own woman.

I have been aggravated with Rian as of late, but this essay has made him go up several levels in my estimation. Ben had to reject her offer, because had he not, he would never be strong, and he has to get strong.

To right. And if Ben had just run off with Rey, as her little puppy dog, doing whatever she wanted and putting his wants and beliefs in a box; becoming an extension of her at his own self worth, she would eventually leave him. She wants a man who will stand up for himself, not a doormat who she can walk all over.

I actually think it's Kylo himself who would eventually relapse and rage against the choice he's made if this situation were to have happened. I don't think it would take very long, either. That's why even before I knew Renperor was a thing, I never thought Kylo would go to the Resistance but would instead become a free agent with no clue where to go next. Had he gone with Rey back to the Resistance, it would have been obvious that it was going to blow up in all of their faces at some point in IX and that "good boy" was going to bite hard and run. He's not ready for anything like that yet, and I don't think he'll ever be rah rah Resistance.

"In his own flawed and twisted way, Kylo understands one of the most fundamental truths about romantic love- that it flourishes most when it is established between equals who love and respect the other for being their own person, when they work together and not slavishly for the other, and when the feelings are not desperately one-sided or demanding or groveling, but warm, equal, and giving."

This is incredible. I love this so much. Ben as Gabriel Oak. It would be so easy to capitulate, because he would be with her and he loves her, but he would no longer belong to himself. He would belong to her. And it is high time that Ben stopped belonging to people other than himself. When they do come together, he will be his own man and she her own woman.

I have been aggravated with Rian as of late, but this essay has made him go up several levels in my estimation. Ben had to reject her offer, because had he not, he would never be strong, and he has to get strong.

To right. And if Ben had just run off with Rey, as her little puppy dog, doing whatever she wanted and putting his wants and beliefs in a box; becoming an extension of her at his own self worth, she would eventually leave him. She wants a man who will stand up for himself, not a doormat who she can walk all over.

I actually think it's Kylo himself who would eventually relapse and rage against the choice he's made if this situation were to have happened. I don't think it would take very long, either. That's why even before I knew Renperor was a thing, I never thought Kylo would go to the Resistance but would instead become a free agent with no clue where to go next. Had he gone with Rey back to the Resistance, it would have been obvious that it was going to blow up in all of their faces at some point in IX and that "good boy" was going to bite hard and run. He's not ready for anything like that yet, and I don't think he'll ever be rah rah Resistance.

Yeah, Kylo will never be pro-Resistance and there was no way he’d help them, not even for Rey. The Resistance is too tied up to his resentment towards his family (he probably feels his mother devoted more of her time to the New Republic than him) and he seems to think the New Republic, the Resistance and its allies are part of what’s wrong with everything (murderers, traitors and thieves).

I don’t think he’s even particularly loyal to the FO’s cause or even believes in its philosophy/values. I have the TLJ Visual Dictionary and on the pages that discuss the Praetorian Guards, it says that the FO’s “aesthetic heavily favors symmetry (‘what’s past is future’).” That “what’s past is future” stuff directly contradicts Kylo’s philosophy which is to kill the past and start something completely new.

I think Kylo is going to be involved in establishing a new direction for the galaxy, along with Rey; something new and different rnt than what came before (which kept leading to the same problems).

"In his own flawed and twisted way, Kylo understands one of the most fundamental truths about romantic love- that it flourishes most when it is established between equals who love and respect the other for being their own person, when they work together and not slavishly for the other, and when the feelings are not desperately one-sided or demanding or groveling, but warm, equal, and giving."

This is incredible. I love this so much. Ben as Gabriel Oak. It would be so easy to capitulate, because he would be with her and he loves her, but he would no longer belong to himself. He would belong to her. And it is high time that Ben stopped belonging to people other than himself. When they do come together, he will be his own man and she her own woman.

I have been aggravated with Rian as of late, but this essay has made him go up several levels in my estimation. Ben had to reject her offer, because had he not, he would never be strong, and he has to get strong.

To right. And if Ben had just run off with Rey, as her little puppy dog, doing whatever she wanted and putting his wants and beliefs in a box; becoming an extension of her at his own self worth, she would eventually leave him. She wants a man who will stand up for himself, not a doormat who she can walk all over.

I actually think it's Kylo himself who would eventually relapse and rage against the choice he's made if this situation were to have happened. I don't think it would take very long, either. That's why even before I knew Renperor was a thing, I never thought Kylo would go to the Resistance but would instead become a free agent with no clue where to go next. Had he gone with Rey back to the Resistance, it would have been obvious that it was going to blow up in all of their faces at some point in IX and that "good boy" was going to bite hard and run. He's not ready for anything like that yet, and I don't think he'll ever be rah rah Resistance.

Yeah, Kylo will never be pro-Resistance and there was no way he’d help them, not even for Rey. The Resistance is too tied up to his resentment towards his family (he probably feels his mother devoted more of her time to the New Republic than him) and he seems to think the New Republic, the Resistance and its allies are part of what’s wrong with everything (murderers, traitors and thieves).

I don’t think he’s even particularly loyal to the FO’s cause or even believes in its philosophy/values. I have the TLJ Visual Dictionary and on the pages that discuss the Praetorian Guards, it says that the FO’s “aesthetic heavily favors symmetry (‘what’s past is future’).” That “what’s past is future” stuff directly contradicts Kylo’s philosophy which is to kill the past and start something completely new.

I think Kylo is going to be involved in establishing a new direction for the galaxy, along with Rey; something new and differnt than what came before (which kept leading to the same problems).

I completely agree. Whatever the source of those beliefs, (and Luke holding a lightsaber over his head certainly played a huge role in forming them), he absolutely believes that the Resistance/Rebels are an extremely destructive force. Insert whatever terrorist group you (collective) believe is or was the most destructive one IRL and that's what he thinks of the Resistance.

I truly believe that he believes his mother is dead, so as far as he is concerned those transport ships are full of a bunch of Poe Damerons, who he sees as, (once again insert the worst terrorist leader in mind), and is far as he is concerned, all those Poes will just keep blowing stuff up, keep the war going and get a ton more people killed.

IOW, if you think of him like a US Special Forces guy whose people are currently attacking a bunch of Zarqawis, no way will he stop that attack, even for the woman he loves. I mean if you think about him having his mindset, to stop the attack would mean that a bunch of people he doesn't know would die as a result of his interest in her ... which is exactly what Anakin did with Padme. Everybody had to die for Padme to live. Here, from Kylo's pov, risking other non-Resistance people and not stopping the war are not a price he will pay just because he loves her.

I'm not saying that Kylo is some saint in wolf's clothing. He is stubborn or has had his view warped, but at that moment he really does think that the Resistance is *that bad.* I don't think he believes the FO is some example of Jeffersonian democracy. His disagreements with Hux and "personal interests" have shown this over two movies. I think when he says Snoke he means the FO, because Snoke really does embody that whole thing. I think he's just over there with them because (1) They are not associated with his would-be murderer, (2) Snoke offered him protection from Luke at a very vulnerable time, and (3) Snoke's been mind-screwing him forever.

Now that Snoke is out of his head, now that he is free for the first time in his life, he actually can really be free to consider something new. Sure he wanted to burn it all, but after the events of TLJ, I think he will calm down. Also, now that Snoke and Luke are out of the picture, and with Rey having those "back to basics" books, those two can temper one another and create something new.

I agree completely with these past posts. You are all so awesome! My god. Haven’t read the link yet.... will read tonight.

Kylo’s proffered hand to Rey was much more than a personal request/proposal. It carried a proposition of truly galactic significance. He was asking her — as his equal — to remake the world(s) with him!

TPTB’s job — if this is truly where they want to go — will be to cast aside in as gentle a way as possible —all the bull crap about dark side/light side, and recast the SW zeitgeist in brand new holistic terms. And that will be hellishly difficult, on top of the current fanboy mania. But if they can do it, they can take SW into a completely different and sublime set of expectations for the next decade.

"In his own flawed and twisted way, Kylo understands one of the most fundamental truths about romantic love- that it flourishes most when it is established between equals who love and respect the other for being their own person, when they work together and not slavishly for the other, and when the feelings are not desperately one-sided or demanding or groveling, but warm, equal, and giving."

This is incredible. I love this so much. Ben as Gabriel Oak. It would be so easy to capitulate, because he would be with her and he loves her, but he would no longer belong to himself. He would belong to her. And it is high time that Ben stopped belonging to people other than himself. When they do come together, he will be his own man and she her own woman.

I have been aggravated with Rian as of late, but this essay has made him go up several levels in my estimation. Ben had to reject her offer, because had he not, he would never be strong, and he has to get strong.

To right. And if Ben had just run off with Rey, as her little puppy dog, doing whatever she wanted and putting his wants and beliefs in a box; becoming an extension of her at his own self worth, she would eventually leave him. She wants a man who will stand up for himself, not a doormat who she can walk all over.

I read that analysis on Tumblr too- and I agree... I'm not sure "most romantic moment" is the right term to describe it. But it is very important moment for their future relationship. I heard some people claim Kylo is being manipulative with his propose - I personally don't think so. If he wanted to manipulate her the most obvious choice would have been for him to say "join me and I will stop the attack on the resistance fleet and let them escape" or something similar. THAT would've been blackmail and manipulative! But he didn't! He wanted her to join him on her own free will and because she understands his vision of building something new.

From the point of view of Kylo / Ren, we immediately saw him eyeing her multiple times curiosity, interest and finally desire. As a last step, he tells her that she needs a teacher so he makes the proposal. Rey does not accept therefore our protagonist must engage more . In the last Jedi we see Kylo / Ben starting to converse with her through their bond and again there is curiosity from him and again that gaze fixed on her. In the second conversation of Force again is he who starts talking but here's interest, he wants to know if Rey knows of his past but he also does something else he approaches her, differently from the interrogation scenehowever is always him who makes the first move. In the third conversation instead we see Rey who speaks first, but here I doubt that he wanted to talk because he was in a moment of privacy , in any case it is Rey the first, there is a moment of embarrassment, her comment is something already seen in romantic movies, however she sees him for the first time as a man and this is a key element for their relationship. All we need is Kylo to see Rey half naked and the circle will be complete. Putting aside the embarrassment she makes intimate questions to Kylo, ​​raises her voice, starts crying and in the meantime we see Kylo again approaching her,again these are scenes already seen in movies and Tv- series in which the boy embraces the girl in tears. In any case, Kylo, ​​not at all troubled, says his sentence.Instead of comforting Rey , the boy gives himself a head to the wall but the guy for what we fans know, has never had a relationship so how to deal with a tearful girl, Ben Solo has a lot to learn . and in the scene of the hut? do we want to talk about it? again it is Rey who is looking for him, again , is she who takes the initiative, they exchange sentences with a sweet and comforting tone and then touch each other with their fingers. Now there is no more curiosity or interest, there is desire, especially in Kylo / Ben when remove the glove, this is a clear sign of physical intimacy that promises a sexual act. The moment is there, the weather is there, the tension is there, even the music is perfect, all the pieces are there too EVEN with the arrival of Luke, who rudders in the room where he catches our young lovers in flagrant . This is also a classic scene of romantic movie. The father who finds his daughter with a stranger. Now, Rey for the first time defends Kylo, never seen so much security in her as now. , she went to him, she left her "mission" for him, even here we find the classic romantic element that we see in the movies . The fight side by side is one of the most beautiful scenes, His gazes, her concern The sparks that fall as if it were rain, and the rain is almost always an element of sadness, or something that promises a battle. Beautiful scene where she cries and he makes a second proposal and this time our Kylo carefully uses the words, " rule together", to be equal . This is a marriage proposal ,the same proposal that Anakin did to his wife Padme only that they were already married , poetry and rhythm .

Now... even if the two are not together yet there has been a frightening development between them and can only go in one direction.

When Rey tries to find the answer about her parents, there is a rift and we hear her talk to Kylo. For the first time is she who starts , is she who wants a contact

and another beautiful thing is ... Kylo takes off his glove because he wants touch Rey, feel her on his skin. There is no Kylo there is only Ben.

I didn't read everything but I'm glad you mentionned, I've been thinking a lot of how symbolic the glove thing is. At this moment he is human, not a "monster". He's made of flesh and bone, he's not the faceless monster everyone sees. It reminds me of TFA when he takes off his mask in front of her. He is human when he's with Rey : we see his face, his hands without gloves and we even see him shirtless and we learn more about his fears (not to be as strong as Dark Vader) and his past. I noticed that when he proposes Rey to join him to rule the galaxy there is a close up on his gloved hand, in contrast with the hut scene. This time he doesn't take off his glove. Now it's not Ben talking anymore, it's the "monster" again. At least the is how Rey sees him at this moment.