His heart was visible, and the dismal sack that maketh excrement of what is eaten.

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Mar 2006

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Originally Posted by It is Fake

Yes, EVERYONE was on the CIA payroll. I am a CIA plant to find subversives like you. See, we allow you to talk because the illogical conclusion you draw help to hide the real truth behind our actions.

Thank you,
CIA Operative Iif.

lol. This is so true. Rampant conspiracy theorists are the worst enemies of truth.

I go over to AboveTopSecret once in a while for a chuckle. The funny part is that I look into that deep, deep pile of **** and I know damn well something there is true. Somebody is on to something. But we'll never know because it's a needle in a crazy stack.

Obama raising Black army to kill whites

Originally Posted by patfromlogan

Resonance10, I'll look at those links later, I got to clean up our vacation rental and look at real estate in Hilo today.

Mike, I would like it if you could temper your statements. I don't like "crap." It's not crap at all, after all, what do Osama, Saddam, and H W Bush have in common? All were on the CIA payroll. Historically the issue is more complex, but I'm not inclined to respond to accusations of crap.

And look a little closer at the "shores of Tripoli." You want to call something crap, then here's your big chance. To my knowledge it was the first time and set the precedence of ignoring the professional military (or in Rummy's case, firing dozens of Generals) and making expedient choices that lead to disaster.

The US forces, a lot of Navy, a handful of Marines and hundreds of mercenaries, fought to end piracy AND to restore the pasha, Hamet Caramelli, a liberal "good guy" in their eyes, and get rid of his asshole brother. In typical short sighted foolery, the US betrayed Hamet and went with the dictator, just like the US has done ALL the time, all over the world. The Marines and their commanders were furious, but just like what the fools did in Vietnam and Iraq, DC decides policy and over rode the soldiers.

Fair enough, I apologize. You deserve that level of respect. Going forward, this might be offensive but that is not my intent: your statements seem to follow a nationalistic theme. Everything is the fault of the US. In turn this treats non-Americans as substandard people who don't count in world affairs. For that matter, they don't account in their own domestic affairs. Soviet Union, does not account. Previous history of appeasement by European powers had nothing to do with Barbary piracy. Sultans supporting piracy, all the fault of future US response. Ottoman Empire, does not count. Former allies, even if unsavory, turning in us all had to do with Americans not choices by foreign people. In all affairs, foreigners don't count except as helpless victims or American tools.

But to the point, I have attempted to temper my own paranoia. That said, what is conspiratorial in this thread? While Obama isn't raising a Black Army (or IS he???) in Guatemala, Iran, Indonesia, and Vietnam the role of covert operations, assassinations, The School of the Americas (+1500 Guatemalan military trained), and/or simple deceit is petty clear and frankly, where is the conspiracy?

Many years ago I read that in order to understand a nation's morality one should study their secret police; all else is bullshit and propaganda - the bottom line is the actions of the secret police.

I have been shaped by my own life's history. My mother's friend married Mcnamara, I went to school in Saigon with Carl Colby, son of the CIA chief (and late Director and if you or anyone wants to get into a juicy conspiracy, read the accounts of the local fishermen about where the body and canoe were found and currents) William Colby, Carl later himself an agent who infiltrated and befriended Bob Marley), my parents were drinking buddies with the Colbys and my own father was fired by Mcnamara from his job of Chief Navy MAAG Saigon for telling Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Max Taylor that our policies were losing the Vietnam war.

I knew it was bullshit fifty years ago, and I think the bullshit has continued.

Last edited by patfromlogan; 3/01/2013 1:38pm at .

"Preparing mentally, the most important thing is, if you aren't doing it for the love of it, then don't do it." - Benny Urquidez

Ok. But there is dispute over how much of a connection there is with those incidents and 'modern terrorism'. A lot of dispute. It could be argued that there was inspiration for the Taliban in the actions of the revolutionaries, but that it is thin at best.

Again I am not saying there is no blame to be laid at the West's feet just that were not up to our neck in it.

Back on topic: Is it true Obama is secretly Muslim, this Army of Blacks could be a mix of the Black Panthers and the Muslim Brotherhood?

The first link is to a review of 'All the Shah's Men: An American Coup and the Roots of Middle East Terror,' By Stephen Kinzer

The review thinks Kinzer goes to far with this:

"With their devotion to radical Islam and their eagerness to embrace even the most horrific kinds of violence, Iran's revolutionary leaders became heroes to fanatics in many countries. Among those who were inspired by their example were Afghans who founded the Taliban, led it to power in Kabul, and gave Osama bin-Laden the base from which he launched devastating terror attacks. It is not far-fetched to draw a line from Operation Ajax through the Shah's repressive regime and the Islamic Revolution to the fireballs that engulfed the World Trade Center in New York."

Robarge, the reviewer, thinks that... overlooks conflicts between the Shia theocracy in Tehran and Sunni extremists in Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, and elsewhere... Hmmm, I agree with Kinzer, but will check out what he's saying. I don't agree with Robarge that US president's efforts to make the Shah reform were in anyway effective. Was there less torture?

Frankly, this will require more study and thinking to analyze. My first thought is taken with what the consequences of the Iraq war; enormous increase in influence for Iran/Shia which is being fought out now more of less with US and Saudi Arabia countering this in Pakistan and Afghanistan.

"Preparing mentally, the most important thing is, if you aren't doing it for the love of it, then don't do it." - Benny Urquidez

Resonance10, I'll look at those links later, I got to clean up our vacation rental and look at real estate in Hilo today.

Mike, I would like it if you could temper your statements. I don't like "crap." It's not crap at all, after all, what do Osama, Saddam, and H W Bush have in common? All were on the CIA payroll. Historically the issue is more complex, but I'm not inclined to respond to accusations of crap.

And look a little closer at the "shores of Tripoli." You want to call something crap, then here's your big chance. To my knowledge it was the first time and set the precedence of ignoring the professional military (or in Rummy's case, firing dozens of Generals) and making expedient choices that lead to disaster.

The US forces, a lot of Navy, a handful of Marines and hundreds of mercenaries, fought to end piracy AND to restore the pasha, Hamet Caramelli, a liberal "good guy" in their eyes, and get rid of his asshole brother. In typical short sighted foolery, the US betrayed Hamet and went with the dictator, just like the US has done ALL the time, all over the world. The Marines and their commanders were furious, but just like what the fools did in Vietnam and Iraq, DC decides policy and over rode the soldiers.

I've got rep recently for this post so I re-read it. And now I'm annoyed at the flippant responses by IiF, Devil and d, the point is that they WERE all on the CIA payroll. And "we" against the plans and hopes of the US Marines, fucked up in 1803. It's not weirdo conspiracy theory. The US fucked up then and has kept fucking up. If you want to say Zbigniew Brzezinski funded Osama through some other covert agency then that may be true, but so what. The point is that all three were funded covertly by the United States. HW specially - his declared worth was 100 mil and he gave 90 to Yale some time ago. No one said, **** he's given 90% of his wealth; those in the know know all about his obscene profits from coke. He's probably a billionaire. If anyone wants to know what's up there are books about the Bush and Walker family histories. Basically generations of asshole criminals, war profiteers, people always on the edge or over the edge of criminal activity, bankers for Hitler etc etc. They make rum runner Kennedy look like a upstart.

This reminds me of when The Wastrel got pissed off when I posted that Chiang Kai Shek was a heroin dealing criminal, a veteran of the Green Gang, the thugs who wiped the commies in '27 and set up the Golden Triangle with fellow Green Gang members and used the CIA's Air American to fly raw opium to the factories in Taiwan. It's just history. Sorry if it doesn't fit the bullshit version people have swallowed. It's like bs TKD history to me, once you understand the truth, you can't stand the crapola. Some think that the Opium wars are ancient history and have no bearing on modern international relations. I understand that the Opium Wars didn't just end and everything then became rosy and peaceful. The French and British gained enormous funds from opium in my lifetime and it goes on with different players now. Similarly the establishment of the Shah and the SAVAK, Iran/Contra/Cocaine, Gulf War l and Gulf War ll are part of a pattern. IMHO a pattern of idiotic blundering by the US.

I did, by the way, read Brzezinzski's statements that were in response to recent criticisms of his scheme that funded (and some would argue, created) the mujahideen. He said **** off, what's a piddly little war in Afghanistan compared with bringing down the USSR. I, on the other hand, see it as part of the US's continued screw-ups that will bite us on the ass.

You don't know how US-Mexico relations work if you think that's a real thing that can actually happen.

"The only important elements in any society
are the artistic and the criminal,
because they alone, by questioning the society's values,
can force it to change."-Samuel R. Delany

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It seems that the only people who support anarchy are faggots, who want their pathetic immoral lifestyle accepted by the mainstream society. It wont be so they try to create their own.-Oldman34, friend to all children