PETA Gets to Your Kids
Friday, May 13, 2005
By Steven Milloy
Radical animal-rights activists may be the last people you'd think would be planning school lessons for your children. Well, think again.

Through its innocuous-sounding "educational" programming arm known as TeachKind, People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals has found a way to reach school children starting as young as kindergarten with its extremist agenda. The opportunity for PETA (search) to gets its message into the classroom has been paved, at least in part, by various laws on the books in at least 12 states mandating humane education in public schools — thus creating a demand for curricula centered on teaching children about the humane treatment of animals.

"Kids who hurt animals may be on a dangerous path that will only get worse if it is not corrected. Psychiatrists, FBI profilers and law enforcement officials have repeatedly documented that kids who abuse animals rarely stop there," TeachKind warns.

Its fact sheet, entitled "Animal Abuse and Human Abuse: Partners in Crime," points out that "violent acts toward animals have long been recognized as indicators of a dangerous psychopathy that does not confine itself to animals," and goes on to detail how many notorious school shooters, including Columbine's Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold, were known to mutilate animals prior to their attacks on humans.

Indeed, according to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (search) (DSM-IV) published by the American Psychiatric Association, participation in animal torture is one of the early warning signs of a severe emotional disturbance in a child, ranking alongside fire-setting as a strong indicator of future criminal behavior as well as the likelihood of psychopathy in adulthood.

While there's no question that the small number of children who torture animals are quite disturbed and that all children should be taught how wrong such behavior is, it's quite another matter for PETA to capitalize on this issue as an opportunity to indoctrinate children with PETA's own radical, catch-all definition of what constitutes "animal cruelty." And that's precisely what PETA is doing through TeachKind.

As its Web site prominently touts the animal cruelty-psychopathy connection with quotes from FBI criminalists and others, a closer inspection reveals that the bulk of TeachKind's educational efforts are actually crafted so as to make children believe that everyday behaviors, such as eating a diet that contains meat or animal products, are unmistakably, unequivocally acts of animal cruelty.

PETA's frightening of young children by equating, or even associating, truly disturbed behavior such as mutilation of a family pet with common everyday practices such as eating hamburgers amounts to nothing less than ideological child abuse.

PETA even accuses schools across America of being major perpetrators of animal cruelty. They oppose basic learning methods widely practiced throughout our educational system such as insect collection, field trips to zoos or aquariums, and dissection in the classroom.

"Hearing a lot about violence in schools? You can do something to help. Cut out dissection!" announces their Web-based anti-dissection campaign, which even mentions how a young Jeffrey Dahmer "became fascinated with blood and guts" as a result of participating in a biology assignment involving dissection. With this assertion, PETA is inviting impressionable young minds to believe that all it takes is one experience with a dissection assignment to walk away a psychopathic serial killer.

In addition to encouraging kids to refuse to participate in dissection assignments, the campaign even coaches kids on the exact wording to use in their formal written objections so as to "provide the basis for a possible legal case."

A significant portion of TeachKind's curriculum is devoted to persuading children to adopt a vegetarian diet as a way to avoid participating in "animal cruelty." PETA's Web-based materials provide the warped logic that if farmers treated a cat or a dog the way they treat livestock, they would "be prosecuted for animal cruelty and locked up" — once again stressing the theme of hypothetical criminality for those who eat meat.

PETA even tries to scare kids away from drinking milk, a food so controversial that it occupies its very own wedge on the latest FDA food pyramid for optimal nutrition. A series of trading cards called "Don't Be a Milk Sucker" available from its Web site, features cartoon characters suffering a host of illnesses PETA attributes to milk consumption such as ear infections, obesity, acne, and even diabetes!

Nor does milk consumption escape PETA's definition as a distinctly cruel act against animals. We meet "Milk-Stealing Ming," who is depicted with his mouth directly attached to an unhappy cow's udder, alongside a "wanted poster" describing his crimes and exclaiming, "cows make milk for their babies, not for maniacs like Ming." :rolleyes:

If we are to take at face value PETA's irresponsible suggestion that "animal cruelty" — as defined by their radical, catch-all parameters — is a reliable indicator of psychopathic tendencies, I suppose it's just a matter of time before we all read about Milk-Stealing Ming's future adult crime sprees in the headlines.

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 05:25 PM

milk from cows is terrible for people, anyway.

kids are getting so fat nowadays, that cutting out animal products might just help them out.

SelesFan70

May 13th, 2005, 05:30 PM

milk from cows is terrible for people, anyway.

kids are getting so fat nowadays, that cutting out animal products might just help them out.

I love milk, especially ice cold chocolate milk! :drool:

Infiniti2001

May 13th, 2005, 05:36 PM

PETA can kiss my ass-- and that's from a vegetarian. Their stupid tactics cause more harm than good if you asked me. :fiery:
decemberlove, I personally do not drink real milk (ie from the cow's tits) :lol: , but I don't think it is the cause of the obesity in kids. I blame all the sugar and other junk foods they consume :shrug:

Wigglytuff

May 13th, 2005, 05:47 PM

i dont think peta has an inch's justification it what its trying to do. (in fact by any educational standard what they are doing is wrong, as you are not supposed to feed student any propaganda). you are, as an educator, supposed to provide content as well as the tools and the resources so that they can learn how to make good choices for themselves.

and now for two of my famous off topic rants!!:

:topic:

cows milk doesn't even have that much calcium, and has too much fat. people like cows milk, that's cool, but i do wish they would stop with lies about how good for you it is. its all hype and very little action.

now if you want high calcium, low fat milk.... go for camel's milk.

although people (peta and fat vegans not included) see nothing wrong with fatty cows milk, i don't think camels milk will ever catch on. call hypocrisy, call it nasty, call it whatever you like, its true. :p

so my point is, making kids drink cows milk "because its good for them" is a lie. people drink cows milk because thats what they are used to and thats what they like, (and there is nothing wrong with that) but its nutritional value compared with the milk of other non endangered mammals is dubious at best, and non existent at worse.

anyway 75% of the worlds people are lactose intolerant. and shouldnt touch the stuff

:topic:
personally, i think of peta (and vegans and vegetarians) as a kettle and meat eaters as a pot.

On the one hand,

PETA's frightening of young children by equating, or even associating, truly disturbed behavior such as mutilation of a family pet with common everyday practices such as eating hamburgers amounts to nothing less than ideological child abuse.

this part in bold comes from a place of profound ignorance. some people around the world do keep cows as pets and have for ages. so to them the eating of beef is no less repulsive than the eating of dog meat is to Americans, and of course dog meat is banned in most places in America. pot.

i think people should eat whatever they want but they should not kid themselves into thinking that they are morally justified in banning the eating of one pet while eating another. they should be honest with themselves. they eat animals other people keep for pets and get mad when other people eat animals they keep for pets. :sad:

on the other,

America has tons of non profit organizations to help abused animals, including peta, but few and far non profit organizations between to help physical, and sexually abused children in the same way. (in fact there were animal protection agencies before their were child protection agencies in america :sad: ) i would bet 100$ that peta members have never once staged a protest nike/gap ect. offices where they would go naked rather than wear clothes made by child labor in china for 4 cents a day. kettle.

personally, i think of peta (and vegans and vegetarians) as kettles and meat eaters as pots.

neither side has any moral high ground on anyone else as far as i'm concerned.

OUT!

May 13th, 2005, 05:49 PM

PETA can kiss my ass-- and that's from a vegetarian. Their stupid tactics cause more harm than good if you asked me. :fiery:
decemberlove, I personally do not drink real milk (ie from the cow's tits) :lol: , but I don't think it is the cause of the obesity in kids. I blame all the sugar and other junk foods they consume :shrug:
Acan't really comment on PETA here, but some snimal rights activists (i.e. those not belonging to PETA) can use shocking tactics in the UK. For example, it is shocking when anti-vivisection activists petrol bomb scientists homes and descerate their relatives graves. It just alientates people who would have been otherwise been sympathetic to their cause.

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 06:07 PM

PETA can kiss my ass-- and that's from a vegetarian. Their stupid tactics cause more harm than good if you asked me. :fiery:
decemberlove, I personally do not drink real milk (ie from the cow's tits) :lol: , but I don't think it is the cause of the obesity in kids. I blame all the sugar and other junk foods they consume :shrug:

no, it's not tha cause, but it definitely contributes.

all the chemicals and steriods they give animals + the terrible way they are treated = not good for humans.

it's a lie that it's good for you. soy/rice milk is much better. the FDA food pyramid is complete bullshit. they just pulled it out of their ass.

Infiniti2001

May 13th, 2005, 06:11 PM

no, it's not tha cause, but it definitely contributes.

all the chemicals and steriods they give animals + the terrible way they are treated = not good for humans.

it's a lie that it's good for you. soy/rice milk is much better. the FDA food pyramid is complete bullshit. they just pulled it out of their ass.

I so remember drinking fresh milk straight from the cow's tits on my grandpa's farm when I was a lil girl. People from the rural areas in my birth country are so lucky. They don't deal with all the steroids and chemicals that are so prevelant in the big cities.

Da Bizzness

May 13th, 2005, 06:21 PM

PETA can suck my big fat hard cock. :)

those ppl need to get a life and realize their are more important things in this world to worry about...

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 06:23 PM

America has tons of non profit organizations to help abused animals, including peta, but few and far non profit organizations between to help physical, and sexually abused children in the same way. (in fact there were animal protection agencies before their were child protection agencies in america :sad: ) i would bet 100$ that peta members have never once staged a protest nike/gap ect. offices where they would go naked rather than wear clothes made by child labor in china for 4 cents a day. kettle.

personally, i think of peta (and vegans and vegetarians) as kettles and meat eaters as pots.

neither side has any moral high ground on anyone else as far as i'm concerned.

peta members are a bit off the wall, but just cos they don't protest for children's rights in china doesn't make them any less moral. there are a million things to protest against. you can go on and on with that way of thinking "well if they aren't fighting for animals rights and children's rights in china and general human rights in cuba and women's rights in tribes who use FGM, then they aren't any better than the hypocrites who won't eat dog meat but will eat cow meat"... this is what is important to them, and i don't think we should try to lessen their efforts just cos they don't protest for children's rights in china. [did that make sense? just woke up not too long ago :) ]

also, you should be careful to call veggies & vegans kettle cos not every vegetarian/vegan is one cos of moral issues. all the vegans i know do it for health reasons. don't generalize :p

bill maher is a member of peta. i don't think it's necessarily for the way people "treat" animals, but more for the nutritional value of not eating any animals products.

OUT!

May 13th, 2005, 06:23 PM

PETA can suck my big fat hard cock. :)
Can I join the queue? :D :sad:

Martian Willow

May 13th, 2005, 06:36 PM

PETA is one of the reason I eat meat with such an ecstatic passion. :tape: I'm afraid those people just don't have a grasp of reality.

When your house is infected with rats, do you let the rats live in the excuse rats will suffer if you kill them? When you go outside, do you avoid walking on ants? No wait, you don't. Why? Because humans want a certain quality of life. And a certain quality of life include good food, that animals can provide us.

We have to kill some animals, for many reasons, and thinking otherwise is pure stupidity.

I do think animals should be treated better in general. But those insane extremists don't offer the solution, they just disgust the general public with their extreme, unrealistic point of view.

The only thing I agree is that cows make milk for their babies. :o I have no idea why humans drink cows milk, it's gross.

No, but there are more or less humane ways to deal with the problem, and most civilised countries have laws dealing with such issues.

People shouldn't assume PETA are in any way representative of all animal welfare organisations. It's just that America's attitude to animal welfare is so fucked up they're the only ones able to thrive.

That is all. :)

gentenaire

May 13th, 2005, 06:40 PM

no, it's not tha cause, but it definitely contributes.

all the chemicals and steriods they give animals + the terrible way they are treated = not good for humans.

it's a lie that it's good for you. soy/rice milk is much better. the FDA food pyramid is complete bullshit. they just pulled it out of their ass.

I recently watched a documentary on milk, about how it apparently increases the cancer risk (but really, what doesn't?). There's more growth hormone in cow's milk (because it's intended for a cow, a much bigger animal than humans) and that isn't healthy, they say. It also explains why the Dutch are the tallest in the world. I don't think there are other people out there drinking more milk than the Dutch.
The Dutch don't have an obesity problem like the Americans though, so I wouldn't blame obesity on milk. I drink a lot of milk, I need my glass of ice cold milk every morning or my morning isn't complete. I'm far from overweight.

Which makes me think...maybe the steroids have an effect on weight. They're not allowed in Europe (not that our cows are healthier, they're pumped full of all sorts of chemicals as well), they are in the US...

Martian Willow

May 13th, 2005, 06:48 PM

I recently watched a documentary on milk, about how it apparently increases the cancer risk (but really, what doesn't?). There's more growth hormone in cow's milk (because it's intended for a cow, a much bigger animal than humans) and that isn't healthy, they say. It also explains why the Dutch are the tallest in the world. I don't think there are other people out there drinking more milk than the Dutch.
The Dutch don't have an obesity problem like the Americans though, so I wouldn't blame obesity on milk. I drink a lot of milk, I need my glass of ice cold milk every morning or my morning isn't complete. I'm far from overweight.

Which makes me think...maybe the steroids have an effect on weight. They're not allowed in Europe (not that our cows are healthier, they're pumped full of all sorts of chemicals as well), they are in the US...

American buy milk by the gallon. And they put sugar in their bread. :cuckoo:

I drink organic milk. :)

gentenaire

May 13th, 2005, 07:26 PM

American buy milk by the gallon. And they put sugar in their bread. :cuckoo:

I drink organic milk. :)

Do nearly all people in canteens at uni drink milk with their lunch? Do you get a choice of all kinds of milk at the canteen, while the soft drinks are standing somewhere on the side? (and only the foreigners drink the soft drinks)

That was my experience at a Dutch uni. The Dutch though it was odd I was drinking coke, as I was the only one.

I generally get funny looks when asking for milk at a hotel. They usually give me some lukewarm milk, taken from the can that stood next to the cereal for several hours. Yuck.

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 07:34 PM

I recently watched a documentary on milk, about how it apparently increases the cancer risk (but really, what doesn't?). There's more growth hormone in cow's milk (because it's intended for a cow, a much bigger animal than humans) and that isn't healthy, they say. It also explains why the Dutch are the tallest in the world. I don't think there are other people out there drinking more milk than the Dutch.
The Dutch don't have an obesity problem like the Americans though, so I wouldn't blame obesity on milk. I drink a lot of milk, I need my glass of ice cold milk every morning or my morning isn't complete. I'm far from overweight.

Which makes me think...maybe the steroids have an effect on weight. They're not allowed in Europe (not that our cows are healthier, they're pumped full of all sorts of chemicals as well), they are in the US...

yes, i think steroids and such are definitely a major problem. i believe that homegrown, organic milk from cows is much better than the shit they sell at food markets.

you and i are similar in that we can pretty much eat whatever we want and not gain weight, right? i know i eat a lot of cheese and bread and pasta and don't gain weight. but there are a lot of americans that aren't as lucky as i am, and they still stuff their face with whatever they want. the FDA is misleading with their food pyramid, which they shove down the throats of children in 1st grade. i remember being 7 and having to make my own food pyramid. i thought for years it was the only way to eat, until i got older and did a lil research on my own.

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 07:36 PM

[left][font=Times New Roman][size=3]Well, I'm one of those people who don't think that milk is really any good for you ...but I really can't stand Peta . I think people should be informed on all accounts and make their own choices. I drink soy milk or almond milk.

i've never had almond milk thou. how does it compare to soy milk?

Wigglytuff

May 13th, 2005, 07:42 PM

god you missed the point. the point was not that peta members are immoral (and its good that thats not the point because i didnt say that) its that peta members are in NO place to make any moral jugdements about other peoples choices...because frankly someone who wont eat meat because of animal suffering but wears clothes made by 6 years who are abused in more ways than seem possible is not someone who has any merit in preaching on what is moral or just . THAT was the point. they can do whatever they want, but they are on no moral high ground to tell anyone else what is right for themselves either.

i dont know if you read my first post in this topic but i was talking about, in addition the lack of interest in childrens well being abroad, but also in america

i do know lots of fat vegans who say they are vegan or freegan for health reasons sure. and they all fully acknowlegde that there is no moral high ground in being a freegan or vegan, so whats you point?

i should care about bill maher because........?

peta members are a bit off the wall, but just cos they don't protest for children's rights in china doesn't make them any less moral. there are a million things to protest against. you can go on and on with that way of thinking "well if they aren't fighting for animals rights and children's rights in china and general human rights in cuba and women's rights in tribes who use FGM, then they aren't any better than the hypocrites who won't eat dog meat but will eat cow meat"... this is what is important to them, and i don't think we should try to lessen their efforts just cos they don't protest for children's rights in china. [did that make sense? just woke up not too long ago :) ]

also, you should be careful to call veggies & vegans kettle cos not every vegetarian/vegan is one cos of moral issues. all the vegans i know do it for health reasons. don't generalize :p

bill maher is a member of peta. i don't think it's necessarily for the way people "treat" animals, but more for the nutritional value of not eating any animals products.

Da Bizzness

May 13th, 2005, 07:43 PM

did you guys know that PETA kills thousands of animals a year? or should i say, they "humanly" put them down. ;)

if they cared so much about animals, why are they killing them?

AjdeNate!

May 13th, 2005, 07:49 PM

milk is nasty, kids shouldn't have to drink it. ;)
what other animal drinks another animal's "juice" for sustenance?

Wigglytuff

May 13th, 2005, 07:49 PM

American buy milk by the gallon. And they put sugar in their bread. :cuckoo:

I drink organic milk. :)
:rolleyes:
i gave you good rep points earlier, i wish i could take it back now :(
:bigcry: :bigcry: :bigcry: :bigcry:

Da Bizzness

May 13th, 2005, 07:52 PM

:rolleyes:
i gave you good rep points earlier, i wish i could take it back now :(
:bigcry: :bigcry: :bigcry: :bigcry:
It's a ok jiggly, just give her a mean face. :)

*wonders why the name jigglypuff makes him think of nice boobies*

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 08:00 PM

i got your point, i just don't agree with it. your post did too much assuming and generaizing for me to agree with it.

my point was, if you were targeting such a specific group "the vegans who won't eat meat cos of animal suffering, but will wear clothes made by blah...blah" then you should've specified. instead, you said vegans and vegetarians are kettles and meat-eaters are pots. THAT was my point.

not EVERY peta member wears clothes made by lil children in foreign countries. so why throw them all in the same group? you are making peta members seem like they only care about animals and don't give a shit about children's suffering. there are plenty of vegans out there who won't wear clothes made by huge corporations.

and i don't know why you brought up anything about "fat vegans" not eating animal products for health reasons, as if they are only vegans cos they are trying to lose weight? what's with the hostility?

i wasn't attacking you, so chill the fuck out, girlie. :kiss:

god you missed the point. the point was not that peta members are immoral (and its good that thats not the point because i didnt say that) its that peta members are in NO place to make any moral jugdements about other peoples choices...because frankly someone who wont eat meat because of animal suffering but wears clothes made by 6 years who are abused in more ways than seem possible is not someone who has any merit in preaching on what is moral or just . THAT was the point. they can do whatever they want, but they are on no moral high ground to tell anyone else what is right for themselves either.

i dont know if you read my first post in this topic but i was talking about, in addition the lack of interest in childrens well being abroad, but also in america

i do know lots of fat vegans who say they are vegan or freegan for health reasons sure. and they all fully acknowlegde that there is no moral high ground in being a freegan or vegan, so whats you point?

don't know what the bad rep was for just cos i disagreed with you... seems immature to me, but whatever.
i'll volunteer to give her a good pussy licking. :D

what about you, d-love? you need one too?

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 08:04 PM

eww, that's disgusting.

Da Bizzness

May 13th, 2005, 08:07 PM

eww, that's disgusting.
girl, you don't know what you're missing. i got the best of both worlds! i got cock and tits!

lol

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 08:07 PM

girl, you don't know what you're missing. i got the best of both worlds! i got cock and tits!

lol

i think i will pass, i like mine separate :)

Da Bizzness

May 13th, 2005, 08:09 PM

i think i will pass, i like mine separate :)
ju kidding me mang?

i even got hairy nipples, what girl can resist that???

Wigglytuff

May 13th, 2005, 08:11 PM

im not hostile i am being real all the vegans i know are fat. most vegetrians are as well....too much pasta.

if you are going to tell me i'm wrong than you better prove you are right.

if you can show me solid proof that any one peta member does not in away finance child labor (that is that does not use any project, that is not financed, funded, or support by any child labor in any nation, this includes, clothes, toys, electronics, services and so on. thats $10.00 paypal to you! there thats putting my money where my mouth is. when you have your information, you can pm me.

until such time my statement stands unchanged.

i got your point, i just don't agree with it. your post did too much assuming and generaizing for me to agree with it.

my point was, if you were targeting such a specific group "the vegans who won't eat meat cos of animal suffering, but will wear clothes made by blah...blah" then you should've specified. instead, you said vegans and vegetarians are kettles and meat-eaters are pots. THAT was my point.

not EVERY peta member wears clothes made by lil children in foreign countries. so why throw them all in the same group? you are making peta members seem like they only care about animals and don't give a shit about children's suffering. there are plenty of vegans out there who won't wear clothes made by huge corporations.

and i don't know why you brought up anything about "fat vegans" not eating animal products for health reasons, as if they are only vegans cos they are trying to lose weight? what's with the hostility?

i wasn't attacking you, so chill the fuck out, girlie. :kiss:

Da Bizzness

May 13th, 2005, 08:14 PM

you guys should stop fighting. you should just make love to eachother and be happy.

Wigglytuff

May 13th, 2005, 08:19 PM

jiggly, you need a nap or a good pussy licking or something.

don't know what the bad rep was for just cos i disagreed with you... seems immature to me, but whatever.
that wasnt for disagreeing with me, that was for putting words in my mouth(namly that i said that peta member were "immoral", what i said was that they have no moral high ground. there is a difference.). i always bad rep people for putting words in my mouth. i mean i talk soooo much and there are so many words to choose from, why go around making up shit up.. i mean REALLY. its not like people cant scroll up and see what was actually written.
dont put words in my mouth, i dont like it, :)

as for your personal attack, it lacks both wit and creativity.

Wigglytuff

May 13th, 2005, 08:22 PM

this fucking bowser has a bug that makes it take forever to type. so i hate going back to edit shit

Da Bizzness

May 13th, 2005, 08:24 PM

jiggly, can i play with your jigglies?

Wigglytuff

May 13th, 2005, 08:30 PM

jiggly, can i play with your jigglies?

no i am still waiting for a response. someone said i was wrong, i offered them $10 to prove it. and i m still waiting. :) anyway, i am off the doctor....umm ambien..... and i will be back later.

plus i am seeing some one and she would NOT like it. although we have drama now. god why is it that lesbians cant seem to date without drama (that was me generalizing :p )

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 08:47 PM

i don't agree with you. get over it.

and drop the veggies/vegans are fat.

all i eat is pasta and i am still thin as hell. my boyfriend's entire family are vegans and they are all in great shape and great health. maybe the veggies you know are that way as a last resort, after trying many other diets. life-long veggies are rarely fat thou maybe unhealthy if they do not take the proper vitamins and eat the proper foods.

my aunt is a peta member, and she does what she can to keep things all natural. she wears those raggedy hemp clothes and shit. but electronics... finding a corporation who has completely clean hands is pretty fucking hard. that doesn't mean she should be called a hypocrite cos she uses a refrigerator. :rolleyes:

it's annoying when people make assumptions about vegans and vegetarians. what's worse is people who complain about the injustices in the world, get up on their soap box and yell, but do nothing about it.

you are still using electronics and supporting the use of psychotropics [some of the worst corporations in the world!] so [by your logic] who the fuck are you to speak on anything?

and i don't need $10... i have a boyfriend for that. :)

edit: also, i never said the word "immoral", so please don't put words into my mouth. thanks.

decemberlove

May 13th, 2005, 08:50 PM

no i am still waiting for a response. someone said i was wrong, i offered them $10 to prove it. and i m still waiting. :) anyway, i am off the doctor....umm ambien..... and i will be back later.

plus i am seeing some one and she would NOT like it. although we have drama now. god why is it that lesbians cant seem to date without drama (that was me generalizing :p )

my boyfriend was using the puter to scan oil paintings for their website. oil paintings made in china by lil children :p

griffin

May 13th, 2005, 08:53 PM

America has tons of non profit organizations to help abused animals, including peta, but few and far non profit organizations between to help physical, and sexually abused children in the same way. (in fact there were animal protection agencies before their were child protection agencies in america :sad: ) i would bet 100$ that peta members have never once staged a protest nike/gap ect. offices where they would go naked rather than wear clothes made by child labor in china for 4 cents a day. kettle.

personally, i think of peta (and vegans and vegetarians) as kettles and meat eaters as pots.

neither side has any moral high ground on anyone else as far as i'm concerned.

Kind of off-topic, but

First of all, the idea that the US has more groups to help animals than children is completely bogus. America has LOTS of child welfare agencies - aside from extensive GOVERNMENT agencies devotedto protecting children at the federal level and in every single state (which is not to sya they're all effective, just to say that they exist), many churches/religious organizations and community organizations have programs dealing with child welfare even where they group itself isn't child-specific. The amount of foundation funding available for child welfare dwarfs that available for animal welfare, as does government funding. While it's true that there were animal-welfare-specific groups in the US before there were child-welfare-specfic groups, there were many groups/organizations already doing child-welfare work.

As for PETA not protesting child abuse and exploitation, no they probably haven't staged such protests, but then I wouldn't expect Catholic Charities to teach Hebrew School, either. That doesn't mean that some PETA supporters aren't also supporters of decent working conditions for all laborers and adequate child-labor laws.

They don't have moral high ground? By your definition though no one does because can't all protest/work on everything. Which begs the question, so what? I'm not going to ignore or dismiss people working to help those poor little kids in China just becuase they're not also protesting animal cruelty. Why would I dismiss people working against animal cruelty just because they don't protest Nike, etc?

That said, I do think PETA are extemists who often do their own cause more harm than good; that American's are fat not because we drink milk but because we eat too much (and too much of the worng things) and don't excercise enough; and that "dinner out" would be a fine, fine thing for most of us ;)

Kart

May 13th, 2005, 09:39 PM

Nor does milk consumption escape PETA's definition as a distinctly cruel act against animals. We meet "Milk-Stealing Ming," who is depicted with his mouth directly attached to an unhappy cow's udder, alongside a "wanted poster" describing his crimes and exclaiming, "cows make milk for their babies, not for maniacs like Ming." :rolleyes:

:lol:

I know PETA wind a lot of people up - myself included - but they do provide some great comedy value.

flyingmachine

May 13th, 2005, 11:23 PM

i dont know but i love big boobies!!!! hmmmm boobies!!! :lick: :lick: :lick: :lick:
:haha: You just love boobies. I have large boobies and has impressed a few men in the past. :hehehe:
Anyway, I think organisation like PETA is truely :rolleyes: . They just like one of these exterme religous groups who likes they are above everyone else. There are a lot of these people in U.K. too. A few months ago a elderly women's grave had destroy by these animal activist because her family own a farm which sells small animals for medical research.

exoneuk

May 13th, 2005, 11:25 PM

Hmmm... milking cows is such a violent act against them. God forbid...

CC

May 14th, 2005, 12:46 AM

I could think of it as ideological "adult" abuse too.

Wigglytuff

May 14th, 2005, 01:20 AM

you never had a point, you were defensive because you or someone you know is vegan.

thats the point of this post. there never was anything. to disagree about. you are just defensive. :bounce:

See i went to a school where most people are fat vegans so i am very familiar with the "don't challenge the intellectual laziness of my or my friends moral veganism" school of thought.

:lol: truth is, like i said before, vegans make the choice to not finance animal suffering while they continue to finance oppression of the poor and of third world people, particularly children. thats great. one of my best friends is such a person, but see he owns his issues, hes not afraid of the truth and understands the implications of his choices.

everyone can make the choices that help them sleep at night.

they should learn not to act all defensive when someone calls them on it, is all.

i don't agree with you. get over it.

and drop the veggies/vegans are fat.

all i eat is pasta and i am still thin as hell. my boyfriend's entire family are vegans and they are all in great shape and great health. maybe the veggies you know are that way as a last resort, after trying many other diets. life-long veggies are rarely fat thou maybe unhealthy if they do not take the proper vitamins (yeah dont get me started on the classist nature of most vegan and veggie diets) and eat the proper foods.

my aunt is a peta member, and she does what she can to keep things all natural. she wears those raggedy hemp clothes and shit. but electronics... finding a corporation who has completely clean hands is pretty fucking hard (but not impossible, you know what would get companies to do the right thing, is people organizing. if they can do it got peta i am sure they could do for the children :p ). that doesn't mean she should be called a hypocrite (didn't say she was, your own guilty mind did. ) cos she uses a refrigerator. :rolleyes: (what i find real funny is that one of the few peoples on this earth who manage to not contribute to the factory farming system and the explotation of third world peoples particularly children are the Amish. and they eat meat. in fact most peoples around the world who manage to not support either system things eat meat :bounce: .)

it's annoying when people make assumptions about vegans and vegetarians. what's worse is people who complain about the injustices in the world, get up on their soap box and yell, but do nothing about it. (i hate that too, its a good fucking thing i am not one of those people. )

you are still using electronics and supporting the use of psychotropics [some of the worst corporations in the world!] so who the fuck are you to speak on anything? [b] (lol, you are so defensive that you are still missing the point. i dont know if being a vegan makes your skull thick or what, but here it is again: neither side has any moral high ground on anyone else as far as i'm concerned. you have viciously defending this claim to moral high ground, this claim that there is nothing at all questionable or problematic about being vegan. and if there is, i am some how anti vegan for pointing it out. NEVERMIND THAT YOU HAVE SAID NOT ONE WORD ABOUT WHAT I SAID ABOUT MEAT EATERS. i wonder if what what are you trying to say that is ok to criticize people who you eat meat but not those who dont because you dont? classy.)

and i don't need $10... i have a boyfriend for that. :)

edit: also, i never said the word "immoral", so please don't put words into my mouth. thanks.

question... does your boyfriend think for you as well? because you dont seem to be doing a good job of doing it for yourself. you said i was generalizing, but refuse to defend the merit of that statement.

edit:
doesn't make them any less moral.
you didnt... but yeah you did..

Wigglytuff

May 14th, 2005, 01:25 AM

sorry i meant non gov. non profit. i think talking about government organizations is important, but peta, and other aminal welfare organizations are not goverment organizations.

dealing with childhood, such as sunday school, and serving the particular needs of children who have been abused is vastly different. abused children have particular needs that these other services can not meet.

Kind of off-topic, but

First of all, the idea that the US has more groups to help animals than children is completely bogus. America has LOTS of child welfare agencies - aside from extensive GOVERNMENT agencies devotedto protecting children at the federal level and in every single state (which is not to sya they're all effective, just to say that they exist), many churches/religious organizations and community organizations have programs dealing with child welfare even where they group itself isn't child-specific. The amount of foundation funding available for child welfare dwarfs that available for animal welfare, as does government funding. While it's true that there were animal-welfare-specific groups in the US before there were child-welfare-specfic groups, there were many groups/organizations already doing child-welfare work.

As for PETA not protesting child abuse and exploitation, no they probably haven't staged such protests, but then I wouldn't expect Catholic Charities to teach Hebrew School, either. That doesn't mean that some PETA supporters aren't also supporters of decent working conditions for all laborers and adequate child-labor laws.

They don't have moral high ground? By your definition though no one does because can't all protest/work on everything.

(only if preaching and protesting are the same thing, peta does little protesting and a shit load of preaching. i dont remeber saying that people could not call for change. i do think people who are morally bankrupt should not be preaching. how that means that there should be no fight for equity i dont know you tell me)

Which begs the question, so what? I'm not going to ignore or dismiss people working to help those poor little kids in China just becuase they're not also protesting animal cruelty. Why would I dismiss people working against animal cruelty just because they don't protest Nike, etc?

That said, I do think PETA are extemists who often do their own cause more harm than good; that American's are fat not because we drink milk but because we eat too much (and too much of the worng things) and don't excercise enough; and that "dinner out" would be a fine, fine thing for most of us ;)

Wigglytuff

May 14th, 2005, 01:33 AM

:haha: You just love boobies. I have large boobies and has impressed a few men in the past. :hehehe:
Anyway, I think organisation like PETA is truely :rolleyes: . They just like one of these exterme religous groups who likes they are above everyone else. There are a lot of these people in U.K. too. A few months ago a elderly women's grave had destroy by these animal activist because her family own a farm which sells small animals for medical research.
:worship: :worship: :worship: :worship: :worship:
thank you, thats what i have been trying to say.

RVD

May 14th, 2005, 02:28 AM

:lol:

I know PETA wind a lot of people up - myself included - but they do provide some great comedy value.Agreed! You have to hand it to those PETA members though. They do get the debates going. I mean, just look at this thread.

As far as drinking milk, I'm lactose intolerant and milk tastes nasty to me anyway. YUCK! We usually drink SOY milk, but that shit is hella fattening.
I do like my ice cream and cheese though. So homie ain't giving those up.
On another note, I applaud the PETA folks for getting actresses to pose naked on huge billboards, and also getting close enough to throw red paint on celebrities wearing fur (watch out P.Diddy & Jennifer Lopez ;) ) and then getting away with it. Talk about an effective hit-n-run campaign.
If I absolutely have to have milk, nothing beats a cold glass of wifie's. It's on tap and always ready. YUM! :cool:

mboyle

May 14th, 2005, 04:35 AM

I find it really funny that the people who think we shouldn't drink milk often think that women should be able to slaughter their 8 1/2 month old babies...

Wigglytuff

May 14th, 2005, 07:18 AM

Can someone please explain me the link between drinking milk or not and abortion. Thanks.
ditto

also if someone can show me a person who supports abortions at 8.5 months.

gentenaire

May 14th, 2005, 08:51 AM

ditto

also if someone can show me a person who supports abortions at 8.5 months.

ditto, I don't know anyone who supports that :eek:

~ The Leopard ~

May 14th, 2005, 08:56 AM

^ I imagine that this was a simplified and much-distorted account of the views of Peter Singer. :scratch: :shrug:

RVD

May 14th, 2005, 09:10 AM

I find it really funny that the people who think we shouldn't drink milk often think that women should be able to slaughter their 8 1/2 month old babies...http://deephousepage.com/smilies/jawdrop.gif Sorry, I don't get the connection either. :scratch: But I am willing to listen. ;)

decemberlove

May 14th, 2005, 03:29 PM

you never had a point, you were defensive because you or someone you know is vegan.

thats the point of this post. there never was anything. to disagree about. you are just defensive. :bounce:

See i went to a school where most people are fat vegans so i am very familiar with the "don't challenge the intellectual laziness of my or my friends moral veganism" school of thought.

:lol: truth is, like i said before, vegans make the choice to not finance animal suffering while they continue to finance oppression of the poor and of third world people, particularly children. thats great. one of my best friends is such a person, but see he owns his issues, hes not afraid of the truth and understands the implications of his choices.

everyone can make the choices that help them sleep at night.

they should learn not to act all defensive when someone calls them on it, is all.

honey, i'm not the one who goes on rants on a message board. i'm not that passionate. i don't bad rep people just for disagreeing with me. i'm not that sensitive. yet i'm the defensive one cos i thought your pot/kettle preaching was fucking stupid. it sucks when people don't swallow every word you say, but that's life. you don't have to act like a child because of it. :lol:

we obviously have different experiences, but i don't generalize vegans cos my very limited exposure to them at school taught me that they were all fat. just like all the lesbians i've ever known have had serious mental issues, but i know they aren't all complete psychos.

question... does your boyfriend think for you as well? because you dont seem to be doing a good job of doing it for yourself. you said i was generalizing, but refuse to defend the merit of that statement.

yes, he tells me exactly what to do and say and i listen like the good lil girl that i am. :devil:

anyway, i'm done.

Crazy Canuck

May 14th, 2005, 03:41 PM

ditto, I don't know anyone who supports that :eek:
Indeed. Extremists will be absurd to make a point which is why they rarely make any sense when trying to do so ;)

Wigglytuff

May 14th, 2005, 03:48 PM

:yawn:

people swear they have a point, and they when you ask them to prove it. its all like "i dont like this game. you are a big meanie, asking me to back up the merits of my statements. you big generalizer, you. not all points have merit you know. some just are! "

honey, i'm not the one who goes on rants on a message board. i'm not that passionate. i don't bad rep people just for disagreeing with me. i'm not that sensitive. yet i'm the defensive one cos i thought your pot/kettle preaching was fucking stupid. it sucks when people don't swallow every word you say, but that's life. you don't have to act like a child because of it. :lol:

we obviously have different experiences, but i don't generalize vegans cos my very limited exposure to them at school taught me that they were all fat. just like all the lesbians i've ever known have had serious mental issues, but i know they aren't all complete psychos.

yes, he tells me exactly what to do and say and i listen like the good lil girl that i am. :devil:

anyway, i'm done.

switz

May 15th, 2005, 11:07 AM

i'm very much against the abuse of animals but peta seriously needs to get a sense of reality. they try and get heaps of media attention by being controversial and using celebrities but they are far too left wing to ever get any kind of mainstream appeal - which is really unfortunate becuase i think most decent would support animal rights in a more active way if they didn't feel they would associated with people like PETA.

isn't the president of PETA going to have her body donated to PETA when she dies and then have different part bbq and sent to political leaders they accuse of condoning animal rights abuse eg sending her liver to france in protest of what they do to geese. too weird.