So, there've probably been a ton of those threads out there, but....Today I've beaten my first vicious dungeon, and I'm overjoyed that I did it.

So, out of Curiosity, I wondered, what was your first vicious Dungeon? How did you do it, how many tries did you need?What was the main problem?

Mine was vicious Halls of Steel. When I first saw the Indomitable I literally went WTFWTHWHATTHISTHISMADNESS before realizing his damage drops with every DP. Then I just steamrolled it with a Bear Mace Sorcerer (Yay for 3 DP/Hit), though the real problem was figuring out what I'd do with Count BlahBlah. I really hate those high-dmg-good-hp-bosses.Then I tried Berserker, and naturally, he just slaughtered the whole Dungeon. Gotta love the Bearmace btw.Took me around three tries, surprisingly enough, tho I think Vicious Halls of Steel is probably easier than other Dungeons.

Mine was Dragon Isles, although it is much harder... sorry to say but Vicious Halls of Steel is one of the easier ones Good luck with Naga City. It has even more of these "WTFWTHWHATTHISTHISMADNESS"-Moments

"WTFWTHWHATISTHISMADNESS" is pretty accurate! In fact, it's so accurate it made me remember Dragon Isles (cleared them once) and realise they are on Vicious difficulty, too

It took 3 tries. First pretty much was to just explore the place to see what is it all about. Second try, barely cleared it all and went underground to be greeted by, well, WTFWTHWHATISTHISMADNESS 3rd try, decided on an Elf Paladin, Glowing Guardian worshipper. Prep was probably dwarven gauntlets. Can't give you too many details, but the piety was used up, the potions were used up (god complaints be damned) and it was pretty much "anything goes" mode. Altars may have been defiled...

My first vicious win? I can't recall whether it was Namtar's Lair or Demonic Libraries. Either way, this predated vicious Halls of Steel, Gaan-Telet, Naga City, or Dragon Isles being introduced into the game. Mind you, back then the hard Halls of Steel was about as hard as the current vicious Halls of Steel...

Of course, difficulty back then was just off the charts. An average boss had 800+ HP and 100+ damage (though two-boss dungeons were the exception to the rule back then, rather than the norm) and some of them had absolutely crazy effects. Case in point, the original Itsssama had 90% resist both in addition to weakening...

decided on an Elf Paladin, Glowing Guardian worshipper.

Since Enlightenment gives you +5 mana, the benefit of the elf is somewhat reduced. The big problem with the Paladin is that he's a melee-specialist class with no damage-boosting class features. It makes Human, Orc, or Triling pretty dominant choices since they fill in for the class's one big shortfall. I love the Elf Paladin, as well, but I find it's only really good for Taurog Paladins (a combo I'm not a huge fan of, since I find it needs Pactmaker to really shine).

Since Enlightenment gives you +5 mana, the benefit of the elf is somewhat reduced.

I call bollocks to that on "Enlightment giving CP and elves having low conversion threshold" grounds. And paladins can reeeeeely stack those beads, which led me to many a preposterous mana spike with various glyphs.

Grats on the first VICIOUS, you are now a full member of the asyl... I mean vet brigade! Hurray!

Mine was Demonic Library I think, but I can't really remember - I did them all with Thiefs and Monks back when they were broken most likely. Yep the bosses were insaner than now, and the general difficulty was off the chart, and we had to walk 10 miles through snow butt naked to get there and back, uphill both ways. But we had broken stuff on our side so it's a moot point

I call bollocks to that on "Enlightment giving CP and elves having low conversion threshold" grounds. And paladins can reeeeeely stack those beads, which led me to many a preposterous mana spike with various glyphs.

While this is very true, you should know the sheer attrition power of the combination of high resistances and high attack damage. Increasing resistances and damage has a very similar effect to increasing mana as far as HALPMEH is concerned (one lets you tank more damage between each healing cycle, the other lets you dish more damage between each healing cycle), and on the balance you'll be a stronger character overall since those two attributes really strengthen your regen-game.

I'm not saying elf is bad. I happen to like the Elf Paladin a lot, and since the attack bonus booster prep was re-introduced they've been totally viable. However, he needs ways to get full-restores to his mana pool. Back when you could have five schadenfreude potions per dungeon and the crystal ball didn't suck your cash reserves elves were gods, but that's long history now and his spike power is much more tame. On the other end of the spectrum, I ran a purist human Paladin of Dracul not too long ago that had 60% physical resist (blood shield + body pact; sends shivers down my spine) along with about 110 damage per hit. Stacking those kinds of bonuses, the concept of "spiking" loses meaning; you're steamrolling.

Yea, sorry for tone, just wanted to say you can have quite a bit of fun with Elven GG anything, and paladins probably most of all since you can still drink potions and all that. And as for Res stacking and Drac being extraorbitant... You don't say?

(btw, been romping in Dragon Isles, got a new note or two. Tone's the ussual bullshit, content I could actually use opinions on, though, check it out if you feel like)

And, err, were hijjacking a happy vicious beater's thread, srry about that. Hope we at least gave you ideas ^^

Welp, and there I got my second Vicious - Naga city gnome BloodMage. Gotta love the crystallBall -You'd be surprised, Vet's hijacking your threads and dropping hints/secrets is kind of awesome. It's awesome to see how you guys make the most seemingly useless things into methods of mass-slaugthering. So, hijack to your hearts content *;gets a notepad* I checked the wiki btw - some of the old stuff looks really really awful.

There are lots of interesting combos, but at the end of the day there is a single truth: attack power is king. There are some good spellcasting combos, but with very few exceptions they still want a decent attack.

Resistances are powerful, but not as powerful attack. Mana is great to have for spiking, but so is attack, and attack also gives you a great attrition game. Health is also good for spiking and in most cases you need enough of it to survive at least one hit, but it's also the most common perk found in boons an items so you rarely need to plan ahead. No, the one stat to rule them all is attack; the most powerful and important attribute in Desktop Dungeons, bar none.

And before anyone mentions the Monk, yes the class is that powerful that it needs massive penalties to attack damage in order to remain balanced. Double health regeneration... nothing else remotely like it in the game.