I've been searching throught the SIM online, trying to find where (if anywhere) there are wind restrictions on recurrency jumps. This, would'be been, my first recurrency jump, i got my license last fall and just took the winter off (gotta love michigan). Anyhow, after much anticipation, i showed up at the DZ on sunday, and wasn't allowed to jump!

I was told it was too windy for a recurrency jump, even though loads were going up with tandems and other fun jumpers with licenses A and up..

Anyhow, two questions:

1. Obviously there is a safty issue here, and with any such issue there is a call to make, yay or nay. What would of you done? With my experience level, was it better to pass on the jump and come back next weekend, or go ahead and do the jump?

2. Whose call was it to make? Mine, the uncurrent A license holder or the DZ? (per se, is an un-current jumper back to student status - unable to make their own decissions?)

PS. For the record, i have 39 jumps, and have been off 5 months for winter, winds were at 17mph, with gusts up to 22mph

PSS. I'm not pissing and moaning, love my DZ, respect there opinion, and realize they're looking out for my saftey... but at the same time was very disappointed on my drive home.. :(

Technically in this case you needed an instructor to do your recurrency, that ment that they are taking you back as a student and you could be subject to the same wind restrictions that students have. In reality 17 gusting to 22 is a really good clip even for an experienced jumper and I would have talked to some of my friends that recently got their A and B's about waiting until they got current again before jumpiong in those conditions.

I (and other much more experienced jumpers) chose not to jump in those winds. At least one tandem instructor refused to take up tandems after the turbulence he experienced under a small crossbraced canopy.

Have I jumped in winds like that before? Yes. Would I have probably been ok? Yes. Is it worth the risk when it's the second day of the season and you're uncurrent? To me it's not. I'd rather drive back next weekend than spend the week in the hospital.

If I'd been responsible for an uncurrent inexperienced jumper yesterday, we would have spent the afternoon on the ground reviewing emergency procedures and planning cool jumps to do later in the summer.

In Canada, those winds Gusts are above the level for A License Holders (max 18 mph) so you would have been sitting here no matter how current you were.

One of the other considerations is the fact you are a low-timer who is uncurrent. It is very important after a winter lay-off to dial it back a few notches till you do get current. There is a higher number of accidents and fatalities in the first couple of months of the season due to people trying to start off exactly were they were at the end of the previous season.

And I am also one of those who would have been on the ground in those winds this early in the season because I am not current (in fact still snow on the ground here.....)

I've been searching throught the SIM online, trying to find where (if anywhere) there are wind restrictions on recurrency jumps

Once a person recieves their license there are no wind restrictions in the US per the BSRs and the SIMS. There are also no guidelines for licensed jumpers regarding winds and recurrency jumps. Commen sense and judgement is left to the individual jumpers.

That said a DZ can set up any rules and guidelines that they want and in this case it sounds like they made a very good call since you were uncurrent and a fairly new jumper.

Talk to your instructor about personal wind limits, what his is, and what he thinks yours should be.

IMO, if you're flying student gear, I think you should be on student wind limit. You haven't filled out your profile, so I'm just guessing.

I learned the hard way why wind limits are important. A broken ankle isn't such a big deal, but they do hurt and cost money. And I would have gotten more jumps that season if I had stayed on the ground that day.

Once a person recieves their license there are no wind restrictions in the US per the BSRs and the SIMS. There are also no guidelines for licensed jumpers regarding winds and recurrency jumps. Commen sense and judgement is left to the individual jumpers.

If they're doing a student-level recurrency jump (going back to Cat D or somesuch) wouldn't the wind limits for a student-in-training come into play, though?

Once a person recieves their license there are no wind restrictions in the US per the BSRs and the SIMS. There are also no guidelines for licensed jumpers regarding winds and recurrency jumps. Commen sense and judgement is left to the individual jumpers.

If they're doing a student-level recurrency jump (going back to Cat D or somesuch) wouldn't the wind limits for a student-in-training come into play, though?

Everything in the SIM about recurrency is all recommendations, not requirements, so it's really up to the DZ how they interpret the SIM.

But, the fact also remains that DZ management can and does set wind limits for licensed jumpers all the time. DZs shut their planes down. DZs hold tandems. I've even been at one DZ that said "C license and above only" on a particular day. So even though we may technically have the right to make our own calls, we jump at the discretion of the management of the DZ every single day, and if they want to tell me one day that there's a wind limit for blondes, I'll happily sit down (if I hadn't decided to already, since I'm usually one of the first people on the ground when winds get wonky).

Beautiful day, wind ~22 mph. I am eager to jump. I get on the airplane (mistake #1 ). I jump out of the plane (mistake #2 ). Under canopy I note that I cannot make headway against the wind (canopy 210 sq ft loaded at 1.07 lb/sq ft.). I turn downwind (mistake #3 ). Everything begins to happen REALLY FAST. I let myself get too low before deciding to turn into the wind. (mistake #4 ). I realize that I am low, headed downwind with a groundspeed of ~40mph. I freak out (mistake #5 ). I decide to turn into the wind WAY TOO LOW (mistake #6 ). I make a terrified braked turn (flat turn) and have a hard but harmless landing.

Damage... Ego.

Lesson #1 ... If I had not made mistake #1 (getting on the plane) none of the other mistakes would have occured. I will be sitting out marginal winds for a long time until I am more experienced and skilled under canopy.

Lesson #2 ... occasionally a braked turn will save the life and limb of a stupid skydiver.

There is nothing that states that licensed skydivers can not still jump in whatever winds that they want even if they are doing a recurrency jump. Actually there is nothing that says a licensed skydiver MUST do a recurrency jump. The wording in the SIMS just states SHOULD do a recurrency jump. I should eat more healty and I should check my gear before each jump. The SIMS states a lot of shoulds but ultimately the USPA says jumpers are adults and can make adult decesions. Like was stated earlier, DZs can set their own rules and guidelines but it is not a BSR and it is not required by USPA.

EDIT TO ADD: I think having a DZ policy that does require uncurrent skydivers to follow student wind guidelines is a good idea.

You have posted this same post on tecumseh's forums and here. Out of the dozens of replies not ONE person has said "oh man, you totally should have jumped!"

I got exactly what i was looking for. I wanted to know the "right" (per general consensus) answer. (not to be confused with, "i wanted my answer to be right")..

Answer to OP (me) Question #1 -- With my experience level, and in those conditions, AND being uncurrent (thats just icing on the cake, the first two were enough i think). No, I shouldn't have jumped. Would I have gotton hurt? maybe/maybe not, who knows. Did i have a significantly increased risk factor? Yes. Was it worth an increased risk just because "i really wanted too"? No. Was it worth an increased risk because i'd been a long time and i really, really wanted to? Double wammy, NO.

Answer to OP (me) Question #2 -- This one is *slightly* less clear, but it's somewhere between the DZ (it's their plane, and if they don't want to let you on it, then you're got getting on it; if you force them to play that card) and a consensus of DZ, instructor, coach, and the jumper (with weight going in declining order). In this case both the DZO and instructor were against the jump, a coach was weary but willing, and i (the in-experienced newbie) was all rearing to go and trying to persaude them to let me! Plain and simply, i was out-numbered and overruled, and properly so.

What have I learned?

1. If three experienced and impartial skydivers are telling you that you probably shouldn't do something, you probably shouldn't. (And you don't need to go ask thirty more just to double check!)

2. License/no license/current/uncurrent -- Either way, I'm still not very experienced and should act like it a bit more. More listening, less talking :)

And to answer your original quesion, why did i post? Well, personally if i'm wrong about something, i'd rather find out as soon as possible (without someone contradicting me, my mind will go from "maybe i'm right" to "conspiracy theory" in about a week and a half; j/k, a bit). Rather than that, i figured it'd be a lot more effective to find out if i was wrong quickly (which i was) and instead spend the week doing/learning something about it.

So, going forward...

Thanks are in order to the three that didn't let me jump; a. because they didn't let me jump & b. because from the tone of some of the replies i've seen, i think i may have come off a bit rude/?? in my original post; which if i did, i apologize, it was not intended.

Also, I know for the few hours i was there on sunday, one person had handed me their camera and asked me to grab a snapshot of their landing.. and while waiting the 30 minutes or so minutes for them to go up & down, was about the only time that day i wasn't worried about my own jump (or lack their of). So, from here on out, I figure i'll just bring my own camera with me (no i'm not good at photography, but i do enjoy it, and it looks like this could well repeat at anytime).. And next time if i can't jump, or just decide not to... you'll just find me on the ground taking pictures of anyone that does.

Anyhow, a few more lessons learned with lots more to go. Thanks everyone for all the answers, opinions, and comments.

PS. yeah, sorry about the double post, i posted their first, then thought it might not be very active so i reposted here; which yeah, i was wrong again ;)