Moving Toward A One World Government, A One World Economy And A One World Religion

By Michael Snyder, on October 18th, 2015

The global elite have never been closer to their goal of a united world. Thanks to a series of interlocking treaties and international agreements, the governance of this planet is increasingly becoming globalized and centralized, but most people don’t seem alarmed by this at all. In the past 30 days, we have seen some of the biggest steps toward a one world government, a one world economy and a one world religion that we have ever witnessed, but these events have sparked very little public discussion or debate. So please share this article with as many people as you can. We need to wake people up about this before it is too late.

From September 25th to September 27th, the United Nations launched a “new universal agenda” for humanity. Those are not my words, they actually come directly out of the core document for this new agenda. The Pope traveled to New York City to give the address that kicked off this conference, thus giving his considerable endorsement to this new plan. Virtually every nation on the entire planet willingly signed up for the 17 goals that are included in this plan, but this stunning turn of events made very few international headlines.

The United Nations is promising that if we all work together that we can turn our planet into some kind of “utopia”, but the truth is that all of this talk about “unity” masks a very insidious agenda. The following comes from a recent piece by Paul McGuire, the author of a groundbreaking new book entitled “The Babylon Code”…

The UN is not asking permission, but issuing a command that the entire planet will commit to 17 sustainable development goals and 169 sustainable development targets designed to radically transform our world by 2030. The UN 2030 plan promoted by the Pope will advance Agenda 21 on steroids. Through a controlled media the mass populations will be told that this is all about saving the environment and “ending poverty.” But that is not the true agenda of Agenda 21. The true agenda of Agenda 21 is to establish a global government, global economic system, and global religion. When UN Secretary General Ban Ki-Moon spoke of “a dream of a world of peace and dignity for all” this is no different than when the Communists promised the people a “workers paradise.”

For the general population, “the 2030 Agenda” has been rebranded as “the global goals”. On September 26th, some of the biggest names in the music world (including Beyonce) promoted these new “global goals” at the “Global Citizen Festival” that was held in Central Park. And you can watch a YouTube video where some of the most famous names on the entire planet urge all of us to get behind these new “global goals” right here.

None of this is by accident. We are being trained to think of ourselves as “global citizens” that belong to a “global community”. Decades ago, most Americans would have been up in arms over something like this. But now most people just seem to accept these changes passively. Very powerful secret societies and international organizations have been moving us in this direction for a very long time, and most Americans simply have no idea what is happening. Here is more from Paul McGuire…

The United Nations is a de facto global government and does not rule by the “consent of the governed.” The United Nations is a global government to which American politicians of both parties have surrendered our Constitutional rights. If you look at the Republican Presidential debates you see the vast majority of those running are “bought men and women.” They are there to do the bidding of their true masters, the international banking families and their interlocking secret societies. If a candidate has a different set of beliefs than the “Orwellian group think” which constitutes domestic and foreign policy, he is allowed to go only so far.

Who are these powerful elite groups and the secret societies that run them? As we extensively document in our new book, The Babylon Code, co-authored by this author and Troy Anderson, a Pulitzer Prize-nominated investigative journalist, there exists a very real network of semi-secretive and secret groups. Groups like The Council on Foreign Relations, The Trilateral Commission, Royal Institute of International Affairs, United Nations, Club of Rome, The Bilderberg Group, and others control presidents, prime ministers, media networks, politicians, CEO’s, and entire nations. You will almost never hear any substantive analysis by the media, which is controlled by these groups nor of attempts at holding them accountable by governments around the world.

Another way that our planet is being “united” is through the use of international trade agreements.

The ultimate goal is for the entire world to become a “single market” with uniform laws, rules and regulations. But as we merge our economy with the rest of the globe, the United States has been losing tens of thousands of businesses and millions of jobs as the monolithic corporations that now dominate our economy shift production to areas where labor is much cheaper. This is absolutely destroying the middle class, but very few people seem to care.

Negotiations for one of the biggest international trade treaties that the world has ever seen recently concluded. The Trans-Pacific Partnership, also known as “Obamatrade”, would represent a giant step toward a truly unified global economy. The following is an excerpt from one of my previous articles…

We have just witnessed one of the most significant steps toward a one world economic system that we have ever seen. Negotiations for the Trans-Pacific Partnership have been completed, and if approved it will create the largest trading bloc on the planet. But this is not just a trade agreement. In this treaty, Barack Obama has thrown in all sorts of things that he never would have been able to get through Congress otherwise. And once this treaty is approved, it will be exceedingly difficult to ever make changes to it. So essentially what is happening is that the Obama agenda is being permanently locked in for 40 percent of the global economy.

The United States, Canada, Japan, Mexico, Australia, Brunei, Chile, Malaysia, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore and Vietnam all intend to sign on to this insidious plan. Collectively, these nations have a total population of about 800 million people and a combined GDP of approximately 28 trillion dollars.

And do you want to know who pushed really hard to give Obama fast track negotiating authority so that these negotiations could be brought to a successful conclusion?

It was the traitorous Republican leadership in Congress. They did everything that they could to pave the way for Obamatrade.

We are also seeing some stunning moves in the direction of a one world religion.

In recent years, you may have noticed that it has become very trendy to say that all religions are just different paths to the same God. In fact, many prominent religious leaders are now openly proclaiming that the two biggest faiths on the entire planet, Christianity and Islam, worship the exact same deity.

For example, just consider what the Pope is saying publicly on this matter. The following is an extended excerpt from one of my recent articles on End of the American Dream…

*****

What Pope Francis had to say at St. Patrick’s Cathedral in Manhattan has received very little coverage by the mainstream media, but it was exceedingly significant. The following is how he began his address…

I would like to express two sentiments for my Muslim brothers and sisters: Firstly, my greetings as they celebrate the feast of sacrifice. I would have wished my greeting to be warmer. My sentiments of closeness, my sentiments of closeness in the face of tragedy. The tragedy that they suffered in Mecca.

In this moment, I give assurances of my prayers. I unite myself with you all. A prayer to almighty god, all merciful.

He did not choose those words by accident. In Islam, Allah is known as “the all-merciful one”. If you doubt this, just do a Google search.

I then greet and cordially thank you all, dear friends belonging to other religious traditions; first of all the Muslims, who worship the one God, living and merciful, and call upon Him in prayer, and all of you. I really appreciate your presence: in it I see a tangible sign of the will to grow in mutual esteem and cooperation for the common good of humanity.

The Catholic Church is aware of the importance of promoting friendship and respect between men and women of different religious traditions – I wish to repeat this: promoting friendship and respect between men and women of different religious traditions – it also attests the valuable work that the Pontifical Council for interreligious dialogue performs.

Pope Francis clearly believes that Christians and Muslims worship the exact same God. And so that helps to explain why he authorized “Islamic prayers and readings from the Quran” at the Vatican for the first time ever back in 2014.

*****

What is happening is undeniable.

We are steamrolling toward a one world government, a one world economy and a one world religion.

Of course we will not get there overnight. It is going to take some time, and there are going to be quite a few bumps along the way. In fact, I believe that our planet will experience an extreme amount of chaos before we actually get there.

But every major crisis will be used as an excuse to advance this agenda. Virtually every solution that the elite offer us will involve more globalization and more centralization. We will be told that all of our problems will be solved if humanity will just come together in unity.

For some, the goal of a “united planet” where we are all working together to eradicate things like poverty, war and disease makes all the sense in the world.

For others, a one world government, a one world economy and a one world religion would simply mean setting the stage for “one world tyranny”.

So what do you think? Please feel free to share your thoughts by posting a comment below…

There’s ANOTHER one world government, one world economy and one world religion I’m looking forward to – the one that Jesus Christ will establish when He returns to this sin-cursed world and finally sets things right once and for all!

Guest

Yes! Well said, Mondo. That is my hope.

“They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.

(Isaiah 11:9)

WSP

You people are crazy.

airedale

That must really bother you!

WSP

It does, because insane people like you control governments all over the world.

MichaelfromTheEconomicCollapse

I will definitely give you a thumbs up for that one Mondo. 🙂

Michael

fast996

Do not be deceived. All that has been described in this article,is satan’s plan for humanity. The power to enslave mankind and to seperate the wheat from the chaff was foretold in a vision to Pope Leo the XIII on October 13,1884. .Read the prayer that the Pope wrote,it will tell you all about the present and coming battle. Do you think Jesus Christ will find “true” faith on earth when he comes again?

K

Could not agree more Mondo.

SunnyFlaSnotress

You are all dreamers.

GSOB

“For some, the goal of a “united planet” where we are all working together to eradicate things like poverty, war and disease makes all the sense in the world.”

“For others, a one world government, a one world economy and a one world religion would simply mean setting the stage for “one world tyranny”.” –

ANSWER 2 COR 2:16

For we are a fragrance of Christ to God among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing; to the one an aroma from death to death, to the other an aroma from life to life.
And who is adequate for these things?
For we are not like many, peddling the word of God, but as from sincerity, but as from God, we speak in Christ in the sight of God.

I have the feeling that SunnyFlaSnotress is not a believer. Just saying.

scott

I do love his name though, and his vampire guy (the last thing a vampire likes is sunny florida..LOL). When I saw that, I started laughing! 🙂

GSOB

I am not in retirement. Thanks anyways, I may check it out Sunflasno.

SunnyFlaSnotress

Sunflasno..lol..
Well, people on disability are usually considered retired.

Nella Rogers

Make sure you use the King James Version and not one of the corrupt version of the Bible to get it right!!!

NoKJV

When God visited the world in the 16th Century to give back His word by the Reformation, and started a spiritual movement that spread to the whole world he didn’t use the KJV but German and French translations, then the KJV came later. God gave us His Word through Hebrew and Greek manuscripts, not through the KJV translation that was full of errors and had to be corrected hundreds of times. To assert that God has given His Word through the KJV is heretical.

Chris Out of Africa

The King James was translated from the Majority text manuscripts.

TeacherIntercessor

Why do you think the King James version is called that? Because it was translated according to what King James believed! Those who tried to translate more correctly had their head cut off! That’s the truth of it! For example, KJV says that men are created a little lower than angels, when every other place in Scripture, the word is translated as “God”. Changes your theology, doesn’t it, if we realize that we were created a little lower than God Himself! Although hard to believe given all the propaganda to the contrary, KJV is one of the worst translations of the Bible.

Chris Out of Africa

King James commissioned a translating committee to do the work. He protected them by law because their were forces in the land who were likely to murder the translators because the were using a more reliable source of the originals than the Alexandrian manuscripts. That is why it is called the King James – because he gave the go-ahead to do the work

TeacherIntercessor

Of course he gave the go-ahead; he was king. He wanted the translation done by the time of his son’s birth. Just because the king commissioned it does not mean that it is not a poor translation of the Bible. It also does not mean that he would allow something printed under his name that he did not personally believe. Think it through. You used a false argument.

Chris Out of Africa

So which translation do you prefer?

scott

I looked up the Hebrew translation, and you’re right. Angels is actually the word “Elohim” (God).
The same word is used every time God is mentioned in the first 5 chapters of Genesis (1st Book of Moses), and often after that.
I don’t agree that King James told William Tyndale ( he translated 2/3 of the Torah and Tanakh and all of the B’rit Hadashah, or New Testament of the KJV) how to translate much of anything.
King James knew precious little when it came to Translating the Bible from Greek, Hebrew and Aramaic. I know he did try to exert some influence concerning the “obey the authorities” verses, but Tyndale still did a pretty good job of staying true to the original manuscripts.

Gay Veteran

LOL

Jon J Thompson

I too prefer the King James Version since this it was the KJV that I memorized growing up.

Chris Out of Africa

I prefer the King James too. It is translated from the more reliable original manuscript text, not the Alexandrian manuscript. But what we should realize is that God is sovereign. People are being converted using all translations, even the Good News edition.

susan

AMEN TO THAT NELLA!

Chris Out of Africa

Yes we are to spread the fragrance instead of the judgement and end-times fear that I see everyone getting in on! Certainly reveals that heads have absorbed some of the scripture to explain theories, but hearts have not been touched and trasformed by our living Lord.

Richard O. Mann

Not dreamers. Knowers. We have the Spirit of God in us. Each of us knows what is coming. But, if you are not one of the family……

SunnyFlaSnotress

Dreamers.

Lennie Pike

Believing is seeing! You have to go first – it’s the whole point – you are not God – God is and he does not give up his sovereignty to us by going first.

You and other unbelievers (as believers) should have many a reason to go first, admit it.

It’s all about relinquishing you own sovereignty – not easy, I know, very difficult to do yes, but you are not relinquishing it to other men which you probably already have in many ways whether you realize it or not. It will be well worth it to give it to God. You think you have inherent power now – you basically have none and it is nothing compared to the power you will receive from God.

And there is only One Way to get it. You’re welcome!

.

SunnyFlaSnotress

You’re not god either.

Lennie Pike

On that one you are correct obviously but I understand why you said it and why I got under your skin.

God (with a capital G), like I tried to say, gives believers power that non-believers will never have. So on the power scale you have your non-believers at the bottom, then believers, and then God. So I can understand why to a non-believer that a believer might sound like they think they are God. Trust me I do not think I’m God (notice the apostrophe?) – I’m a sinner – big time – much much less than before though so that helps. I do though regardless of what some of my posts sound like have complete peace of mind, peace of heart, and feel extremely alive and in the game with absolutely zero fear of anything on this earth. This power frees one up to do amazing things and have amazing supernatural experiences that defy all laws of probability.

Sting was correct – we are spirits in a material world. If you have never seen any evidence of this – WAKE UP! You are not paying close enough attention.

“Seek and ye shall find, knock and the door shall be opened unto you”.

What will it hurt to give it a try?

Lennie Pike

And you should take that “what” literally.

Travis Mansfield

Let God tell you what is going to happen very soon Himself, read 2 Peter chapter 3 may God help to see the only Truth that is found in His Holy Word(the Holy Bible).

Rick

Yes and we are dreaming you are just a nightmare we’lol all wake up from.

wrg3rg3

It will happen…. in the 30th millenium!

Devil Hater

Lucifer you are A asshole.

Devil Hater

I’m going to chop the devil in half

Bob332

Just like the Dreamers” that voted this evil POS in office? No, we are realists, who at least have FAITH. That sir, is NOT a dream.

SunnyFlaSnotress

First of all, it’s Ma’am.
Secondly,your choices along with the choices of the masses led to the election of Obama..even if you voted Republican.

yumadlh

WE WILL WIN!!!

Robert Stutz

No it’s living by faith not by sight. By faith. Not dreams. If you live by faith you will please God.

jsmith

Hopefully he will bring silver bullets and stakes to be used on the termites ruling our country!

Rick

Nope, only the Great Judgement, and the second death which lasts forever. Many of these people think there is global warming now, it’s going to get a lot warmer for them in just a blink of an eye’s time.

solarflare

Ezekiels’ fire

Steeve Girard

Oh, that world caused the environmental mayhem we are in. Because of one big mistake, which was and maybe still is: “humanity owns the Earth”.

Jesus and Satan are Good Cop Bad Cop…..You see…I will guarantee…You will never see them together 🙂

When Jesus is around..Satan disappears

When Satan is around like now..Jesus is nowhere to be seen…He will make his grand entry soon according to you and i bet Satan will make a quiet exit. 🙂

They fight over humanity not among themselves.

Wake Up to the Con of religion. I will believe Jesus when he fights Satan in front of me killing him or locking him for good..Apparently, when Jesus left earth…He left Satan around “conveniently”

Rick

Again, just read the Book of Revelation. And by the way, they both do appear in the same place at the same time. Re-read the gospels where Jesus is being tempted in the desert by satan himself.

LOL

It is just a strange coïncidence that there were no other witnesses.

Rick

Of course there were witnesses there or the accounts of it happening would not have been recorded. Do you believe there are angels in this and the heavenly realm?

John Higson

Idiot. Gullible intellectual midget. Fool.

jakethepup

There you go John pretty typical of the elitist. You are so much smarter, so much better are real credit to Obamites everywhere.

Gay Veteran

LOL.

JB

What about when He was tempted? Or “get behind me, Satan!” Or what about the Book of Job? Or what about in the Garden? Or what about the Book of Revelation? – to name a few, off the top of my head…

RhooLyn

The Word is crystal clear about the working of Satan since before Creation. And Jesus is not the ‘good cop’, but the answer from the foundation of the world to the “Shining One” or Lucifer – the seed from Eve that will crush his head… which Jesus did on the cross and will thoroughly finish the job when he, along with the antichrist and false prophet are thrown into the lake of fire.

Peter tells us in 1 Peter 5:5-11 —
In the same way, younger people should be willing to be under older people. And all of you should be very humble with each other.

“God is against the proud, but he gives grace to the humble.” [Proverbs 3:34]

6 Be humble under God’s powerful hand so he will lift you up when the right time comes. 7 Give all your worries to him, because he cares about you.

8 Control yourselves and be careful! The devil, your enemy, goes around like a roaring lion looking for someone to eat. 9 Refuse to give in to him, by standing strong in your faith. You know that your Christian family all over the world is having the same kinds of suffering.

10 And after you suffer for a short time, God, who gives all grace, will make everything right. He will make you strong and support you and keep you from falling. He called you to share in his glory in Christ, a glory that will continue forever. 11 All power is his forever and ever. Amen.

Hope this helps you in your faith – Jesus WILL come in the end… Read Matthew 24 — Look up for your redemption draws near!

Macintosh

Sorry not ever going to happen. That is the stuff of fairy tales.

Rick

Bring a lot of sun screen.

Mike

It will happen, rest assured (for the believer). He will come the second time just like He came the first. The odds of the biblical prophecies about Jesus coming to fruition (i.e., Isaiah prophesying the first and second coming over 700 years before Jesus came to die on the cross for the sins of the world) by mere chance are utterly impossible. Repent mockers! Your lives are but a vapor.

Plextt Plextt

The best place to target a sheep to shear would be at any given church…

David Coker

That’d be the National Demoncrat Convention!

John Byde

Mac, I hope you change your mind on that. Christians are often the worst advert for their faith, but why not have a look at the New Testament? It’s pretty amazing. Regards

afchief

Yep, what you said.

They have to get our guns before this garbage can take place. Watch how they do it.

Rick

By treaties of course.

John Byde

Af, they can take our guns (okay, I don’t have one) but they still won’t win. Faith in God cannot be defeated.

afchief

No it can’t. But nowhere does the Bible teach Christians to surrender their means of self-defense to any civil government. I would go as far to suggest that any Christian who attends a church where the pastor urges his flock to surrender their guns IMMEDIATELY leave that church and find a church that has a Biblical pastor.

CASTIEL

I agree with you……but a major war must happen …..the only way to purifie this sin cursed world as you say is by the death of million or even bilion people that makes this world so pathetic.

WSP

You have just exemplified why religious people are EVIL.

CASTIEL

Really? the persons behind this economic crisis are religious? The persons who cause wars to get oil are religious? the puppet Obama and his masters behind him are religious? Dont confuse things…. with or whithout religion i say that there are too many people in this planet….people that are destroying everything for greed and the sheeps who follows them…..those are the evil dont forget that….at least i believe in something i can see and that is faith……that is what make us different from the animals….

WSP

Yes, yes, and yes.

“at least i believe in something i cant see and that is faith”

No, that is insanity.

“that is what make us different from the animals”

What makes us different is supposed to be intelligence and awareness, but in your case that does not seem to be true.

CASTIEL

if you were intellegent you would know to respect the beliefs of others….and most important with or without religion there always exist evil…..you understand? always……i believe in God but if i say what i said before its not because i read in the bible…..or i say that a lot of people deserves to disappear from the face of earth ist not beacuse i m christian…..its caused by what i lived and learned in my life…..and after all i made a conclusion….all of us have our faith…..but we are not muslims……we dont bomb people because God told us to……..Hitler didnt exterminate all those people by what he readed in the bible….but caused by what he lived……all the world wars happened by stupidity and greed not by religion.Staline end religion in soviet union…….but he killed is own people even so….

WSP

Religious differences throughout history have been responsible for vast amounts of bloody slaughter. And it remains true today! Almost 100% of terrorism in the world is committed by religious nuts for religious reasons.

To claim that isn’t so is simply delusional.

CASTIEL

terrorists? they are just manipulated…..they are idiots.Obama armed Isis to remove assad regime from Syria the same way that happenned in Iraq……why? for jesus? no for money…..money is the true religion of this world and for that we walk to an abism……The terrorist are just cave man idiots…they in my opinion deserves to be nuked…and dont say because i m christian i say because a man who burn childs alive who decapitates other man….are animals and they deserve to be put down

John Higson

Can’t respect religious belief, because unless you convert as an adult, religious belief is just an accident of geography. And it’s utter nonsense.

CASTIEL

OH so all christians budists and muslims are kids…but just beacuse you are a atheist you consider yourself an adult…..you are a idiot by saying that…..Grow up enough to respect the believs of others

John Higson

Read my comment again. I will test you later on your reading comprehension. I don’t expect your score on the test to be good……

CASTIEL

compreend people that didn t live enough to get a correct conclusion about the world is difficult…….why you dont concern about the elites that are going to make ww 3 for power?Syria its not about religion its power money…..Isis its just a pawn….. what religion is behind that ? tell me ?

John Higson

What religion is behind ISIS? Wahabism Islam. Islam is by far the most problematic of the monotheistic religions. Worse than Judaism.

Islam is at the root of things in Syria. Assad and his minions and henchmen are Alawite which is a branch of Shia Islam. The opposition is Sunni or it’s offshoots. Almost all war is down to religion. Religion is evil, just some are more evil than others!

CASTIEL

Isis its just a pawn….why Obama give weapons to Isis ??????for religion????no….for taking down assad and put one of their one….a puppet….. not one who is allied of russia……why russians are attacking Isis and defend the assad regime????for religion????no its all for power they all want the oil of Syria they want to control the middle east Russia and Usa….dont you understand???Isis its just a bunch of morons who lives in the middle age and they are being used by Obama which he is just a puppet of the elites….but the real deal its power…the times of cruzades are long gone….you think ww1 and ww2 were for religion?????christian killing christians……???cmon man …if the americans didnt give to Isis good quality rifles and launchers capable of taking down helis and tanks of assad regime you think they had a chance with old rpgs????you think europe would be overrun with this people????

Green tip

Dude, your trying to hard

John Higson

That’ll be ‘you’re’ and ‘too’. Instant fail……

John Higson

‘You’re’ and ‘Too’. The education system in the US is really going to pot, isn’t it?

Mike

Stalin and Hitler were atheists. Oh, by the way, Atheism is a religion too. So in one sense you’re right.
Jesus Christ is LORD!

LOL

Godwin? That´s pathetic.

David Coker

Yes, you are

WSP

Nonsense. Stalin was, but Hitler was a STAUNCH catholic. He said so himself, and he enjoyed the official support of the church.

Chris Out of Africa

Tragic he received this support from organised religion. He may have been born RC but, a horse born in a garage does not make it a BMW! In practice Hitler was dedicated to the occult. He consulted diviners and mediums. He was in practice a follower of Alistair Crowley a master Satanist. Not a disciple of Jesus Christ.

WSP

Here are a few Hitler quotes:

“I am completely convinced that I am acting as the agent of God. I am now a Catholic and will always remain so.”

“The Ten Commandments are a code of living to which there’s no refutation. These precepts correspond to irrefutable needs of the human soul.”

“Secular schools can never be tolerated because such a school has no religious instruction and a general moral instruction without a religious foundation is built on air; consequently, all character training and religion must be derived from faith… We need believing people.”

“We were convinced that the population needs and requires this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out.”

“I would like to thank Providence and the Almighty for choosing me of all people to be allowed to wage this battle for Germany.”

“The national Government, seeing in Christianity the unshakable foundation of the moral and ethical life of our people, attaches utmost importance to the cultivation and maintenance of the friendliest relations with the Holy See.”

That all sounds pretty religious to me. In fact, some of those sound eerily similar to things one can hear from religious people today.

Chris Out of Africa

Hitler was a Satanist. A disciple of Alistair Crowley, not a disciple of Jesus. Being born into any Christian denomination does not make you a follower of Christ. You don’t need to belong to a denomination to be a disciple /follower of Jesus the Prince of peace.

John Higson

And your evidence for this assertion is what , exactly? In the wikipedia article on Nazism and the Occult it had this to say about what you say-

Aleister Crowley[edit]

There are also unverifiable rumours that the occultist Aleister Crowley sought to contact Hitler during World War II. Despite several allegations and speculations to the contrary (e.g. Giorgio Galli) there is no evidence of such an encounter.[26] In 1991, John Symonds, one of Crowley’s literary executors published a book: The Medusa’s Head or Conversations between Aleister Crowley and Adolf Hitler, which has definitely been shown as literary fiction.[26] That the edition of this book was limited to 350 also contributed to the mystery surrounding the topic.[26] Mention of a contact between Crowley and Hitler—without any sources or evidence—is also made in a letter from René Guénon to Julius Evola dated October 29, 1949, which later reached a broader audience.[

John Higson

Atheism is a lack of belief in god(or dogs,or fairies).I know that because with religions get you to hand over your money and your credulity at the door, and are really not a clever or rational or sane pastime for grown-up, mentally mature human beings that it’s become fashionable, with zero justification, to claim that Atheism is a religion too, kind of like making you feel better about yourself by claiming your clearly better opponent is just the same as you, because they have a very similar system of making sense of the world. I get it. There’s just one tiny problem, it’s utter and total, shocking and unadulterated bollocks!

Explain why atheism is a religion? It does not have a set of belief without evidence, it does not require faith and there is no place where people get together to get fleeced on a regular basis by manipulative, evil charlatans.

This is your assertion. The burden of evidence lies with you. You need to justify why and how Atheism is a religion, because just bald assertion just doesn’t cut it! I look forward to your twisted and insipid reasoning!

Chris Out of Africa

These folk on here are not the real Christians. They are a minority whose heads have an ideology, but their hearts are still hardened. The real Christians are the majority who don’t make their faith an ideology like these folk have mistakenly done. The real Christians don’t seek the limelight as there is more important work to do. Like living the Gospel and making a difference in people’s lives in the worst places of suffering in the world, more than often depriving themselves to give to others. There is a difference between following Religion and having faith in one we emulate who didn’t come to condemn the world. He wasn’t religious, in fact he was at loggerheads with the religionists in favor of the downtrodden, and the sick. The religionists killed him for it Do your research and you will find them still today reveling the real Christ by their love, dedication to real care for people and their labours in difficult circumstances.

WSP

Nonsense. Not “real christians”? They say the same thing about you.

Religion is evil, a total perversion of life. Religion is anti-truth and anti-life.

CASTIEL

Real christians?????really ???sorry…..but i dont cry and pray to God to solve my own problems…..i solve them by my own….and do whats more correct……i dont need the bible to know the difference betwen god and evil……i believe in God but i have my convictions…..

John Byde

Yes, as even when trying to be a faithful Christian, I add my little drop of evil to the grand total. It’s called being human.

Chris Out of Africa

Yes Religion is. But not being a disciple of Christ. By that I don’t mean a religion

WSP

If being a disciple of anybody is not religious, what is?

Rick

And this is also in the Book of Revelation.

Chris Out of Africa

But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts, and always beready to give a defense to everyone who asks you areason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear;

Quetzol-43

Truefax.

Chris Out of Africa

For God so LOVED the world, that He sent His only begotten Son that whosover belives in Him may not perish but have everlasting life. Next verse: For God did not send His Son into the world to CONDEMN the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. This is the emphasis of the Gospel. It is GOOD NEWS. You lot who can sit and wish this to happen to people are portraying BAD news. Every person is in the Father’s image and valued by Him. (Parable of the lost coin, the prodigal, the lost sheep. etc. God goes to the ength degree to save the last by drawing them to Himself. The comments I read here wishing for people tom perish and also self-righteous judgement is NOT the Gospel of our Saviour. Re-read the New Testament, because you are clanging gongs repelling the lost and seeking. You are making the Christian message into an ideology to the shame of Christ.

CASTIEL

i read the new testament….have you read about the apocalypse and armageddon? if you believe in God you must know we all will be judged by our acts…. you think hitler and staline were saved then? the only salvation is by ourselves……we maked this corrupted world and we continue to accept it without doing nothing……..now we are going to live the consequences….you think God will be there always to our stupidity?no my friend…..we let evil people getting away without we taking actions…….do you know the expression: evil wins when good men do nothing? if a lot of people act more that will be a better solution….and remenber there are people that never change they born evil and die evil…….the sooner they die …… less pain they cause to our world

Chris Out of Africa

Yes I know about Armageddon. And I believe that we need to stand up and do something. But the first thing we need to do is not to sin in our anger. Vengeance id the Lord’s and at His discretion. God does not delight in people’s deaths. What am seeing here is the Gospel being interpreted as ideology. What I am seeing is people being consumed by Armageddon, predicting dates etc. Instead we should be consumed by the Love and Grace our Father has revealed to us! He has millions to save before Jesus returns. When we love Him fully we will want to do that. I don’t see any in the early Church speaking like people here do. Remember they lived under Roman rule, persecuted over decades by the Likes of Nero, and successive Emperors. The verse I quoted was Peter writing to the Church during Nero’s persecution. Before you focus on John’s Revelation, read his Epistles 1John to 3 John. They are more important than Revelation. Remember John was a slave on Patmos doing forced labour. Guard your heart brother for it is the wellspring of life. To want to see people dead is not the heart of God,.

Sylvia

You certainly make more sense than some of these comments–God bless you.

Ruth Allan

God bless you, Chris out of Africa – you are preaching the true Gospel. God is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance….Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord.

Rick

Amen, Amen, and Amen! Rev. 21:10 – 22:1-21

Q

When? 2 milleniums in the future…

Bob332

Amen! The gates of Hell ( the NWO) will NOT prevail. However, there WILL be a Divine chastisement that will bring the ” global citizen” to it’s collective knees.

John Byde

I hate it when people use caps, but here goes, Mondo: EXACTLY!

Mariaan Pretorius

Amen, God will rule the world and satan and his demons will burn in hell for ever and ever. There will be no Saviour in hell. The Pope is the Antichrist and will manifest soon. This ” One world Religion” would simply mean that the people will receive the mark of the beast ‘ 666. First the Antichrist will in charge but not for long, then God is coming back to save His children. The ones that confess that JESUS CHRIST IS LORD. And it is written that every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord.

Deborah Bass

Absolutely!!! The Bible says this will happen, in order for God to show His premiere control. I will continue to fight the evil of th ihis world, but look forward to Christ’s return and TRUE Utopia!

DJohn1

I think the one world government idea is old news.
But I hold different ideas as to who and what is behind it.
I believe that the devil and his servants have a lot to do with it.
The plans are long term not short term. It has been going on since at least 1945 when Israel started to become a nation again.
Look to see a Star similar to the Star of Bethlehem cross the skies.
Look to see a virgin birth and a woman pursued across the world.
Look to see miracles performed by a wild man out of the deserts of the planet. One coming before the coming of the “savior” of mankind.
Then watch as a demigod with incredible psychic and other powers comes forth to lead the planet.
Think it cannot happen? Think again because imitation is the most sincere form of flattery.
The Devil’s own hybrid son will come among us and sway many.
The Devil and these servants are immortals by our standards.
They can afford to wait for many years to pass to accomplish what goals they want.
Twenty five years ago, if someone had told me what has happened so far, I would not have believed them.
We are talking about a genius level leader with a Hitler-like charisma.
And when the whole planet is secured body and soul?
I believe that a small group across the world will disappear. Those are the ones left that still believe. The rest will leave as well as the departed souls that believe in Christ.
Then the entire planet will be destroyed.
Only a small remnant will survive the things about to come. I suggest these few will devise and live in cities far up in the clouds.
I just hope I am completely wrong.
Prophecy in Revelations will be fulfilled sometime, someday, the date to only be known by God, the father, the Alpha and Omega, the god of time.
Is it just this planet? Or is it the entire universe? I do not really know.
Because if it is the entire universe you are looking at an enormous distance of space and of time itself. All of which has physics rules.
Is the new Earth and the new Heavens a new universe?
The world is moving towards fulfilling the prophecies of the New Testament.
The Anti-Christ? Only time will tell if this is the time that the prophecies will be fulfilled.

jsmith

You are getting warm when you mention that middle eastern country. We have had nothing but trouble since then!

P Burke

I have been reading this blog for several years now. Something as a Catholic I find disturbing is the anti catholic bias amongst many contributers. Look, we are all on the same side!

Stop bashing the Pope! The media, which so many of you believe is completely saturated with Satanists and the like, are going to misrepresent what any ‘good man of God’ is going to say. So do some research first before you sprout off with unresearched comments.

Michael, you have agreat blog and I applaud that you likewise are a committed Christian. Much of the information which you have provided to us which is accurate can also be found in the writings of Catholic ‘saints and mystics’ of the early and late Church history. Everything in Revelation and the Bible has been covered in even greater depth and clarity by, St Hypolytus (3rd century), St Ephram (3rd century), St Columcille (6th century) even Brother Christianos Agreda (12th century), who even prophesised the wars in the 20th Century. Look deeper and you will see that Jesus has warned us all throughout the ‘history’ of the Church’ even up to the present day; even with the warnings of ‘Fatima’.

I suggest that for all of you who doubt the sincerety that the Church holds for the spiritual wellbeing of man to read up on this topic. I am sure that you will be pleasantly surprised and indeed agree that we are all in this together as ‘Christians’. Remember, united we survive and thrive and divided we don’t!

Now, back to these economic times that are so serious. There is little to fear about a one world government in the very near future, (at least in our life time). If the prophesies which I have aluded to are indeed true (and this is up to personal belief), then there is a long time to go before the ‘end of the world’ as opposed to the ‘end times’ which are two totally different outcomes.

We are in the ‘end times’; a period of chastisement, which will happen. The economic and social conditions are proving that as we speak. This a period where humanity will be tested and punished but it will not be the end of the world. The ‘end times’ does not have the ‘creation’ of a one world government BUT only the end of the world (as in Revelation).

No matter what is being fearmongered at the moment there are too many pieces of the unified world government that have not been put in place and it is the Satanists pride that can’t see this. For example China and Russia are ‘not succumbing’ to the grand plan that the satanic masters in the ‘developed western’ world have planned. If, as a ‘particular secret organisation’ has planned, that there will only be 500 million people left on the planet after their machinations, don’t you think that it WILL be God that decides who lives and who doesn’t? Not them, my friends!

Look up various predictions about the three days of darkness that may be visted upon the earth as a chastisement for ‘all’ our wrong-doings and you will see that many predicted things will come to pass but only in the context of God’s plan for us – not anyone elses!

It therefore comes down to a matter of faith that God and Jesus and the saints in Heaven will be in our corner and ‘NOBODY’ can beat God! Have faith and love your neighbour.

So in summary, no world government now, as other things will come to pass which is according to God’s plan for us and prepare as bad times are coming!

DJohn1

Well said!
I have known at least two Roman Catholic priests that I consider saints and fully Christian men.
When they prayed things definitely happened.
I could feel the Holy Spirit working in the elder man when he did masses.
One day it drew most of the power out of me when this man was doing a mass.
Three days later I got a letter from a young lady I was friends with wanting to know why all the power left her at the same time as it happened to me. She was in Denver, I was stationed at Niagara Falls.
The second was a man in Korea that was principal of a girl’s high school. We prayed often together and things moved.
I kept touch with him for 15 years. He is either dead or retired by now.
The first one died in the 60s.
It is real. Someday, I will die. I hope that Jesus will greet me also with open arms.
All we can do under these circumstances is to Love our Lord God with all our hearts and all our souls. And if we have needs, then get together with other Christian people and pray for what we need.

GSOB

“Is the new Earth and the new Heavens a new universe?”
Yes, in this sense,…. restored by His purifying, fiery judgment.

johnny123

If there is a one world religion Islam will probably prevail since it is intertwined with a military like philosophy that does not turn the other cheek

durango

I’d like to see these people push a Koran in my face. Jesus Christ is the only one I defer to.

jsmith

Oh yes, a one world government ruled at the top by the Rothschild Banking Cartel and its Rockefeller and JP Morgan-Goldman-Sachs allies. Add to this the puppet presidents and prime ministers of all the countries with their armed forces to keep us serfs in line. Don’t believe it, think I’m delusional? Follow the names in power, specially those names that were changed to make them more palatable to make them more acceptable to us Christians.

Ricardo

At the top will be Satan who has given his seat to the papacy who in turn has put the Rothchild’s, Rockefeller’s and JP Morgan’s in place.

Guns N Rosaries

Actually, secret societies have infiltrated the Vatican to the point where they put their man in the Chair of St. Peter. The last 6 claimants to the Papacy have all been Anti-popes who have no lawful authority. The buildings that once housed the Catholic Church represent nothing but a shell of what used to be. The Vatican is in its final stage of transmogrification into the prophesied Harlot of Babylon. As a traditional Catholic who is aware of the truth of the matter, it pains me a great deal to say this, but the truth needs to be stated regardless of the pain involved.

Rick

Nice opinion, but it’s wrong.

Guns N Rosaries

Here is a photo of Anti-pope John Paul II kissing the Koran:

Here are the words of a legitimate Pope, Callixtus III:

“I vow to… exalt the true Faith, and to extirpate the diabolical sect of the reprobate and faithless Mahomet [Islam] in the East.”

I look forward to hearing your erroneous opinion.

Rick

Spiritual warfare has always been, even before the moment satan fell from heaven. It appears there is spiritual warfare at work here as well, as your photo did not transmit. I don’t doubt there is this spiritual warfare taking place in the dimensions not yet revealed to us, yet for you to come out and cherry pick one phrase from one Pope, is rediculous. I could do the same with something any of the last 6 Popes have said as well, and it would not settle the case for you. It appears you’ve been watching too many poorly produced You Tube segments. But again, you are entitled to your opinion. I have nothing against you. All the best!

Chris Out of Africa

Really? You have this all worked out! Why not leave this to our Father to reveal and rather seek first His Kingdom. Why not rather bring good news to thousand of searching people in the world by letting Him reveal Himself by your hope and peace in your life in spite of what is going to happen. 1 Peter 3:15But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts, and always beready to give a defense to everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear.

Kent Harris

Unfortunately, what is not mention is that the result would ultimately lead to a huge decimation of the population of the world. Not just a few million we are talking billions of people would perish. Americans will continue down their path unaware that the Last Days will be marked by what Christ said that there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now—and never to be equaled again. We think the Black Plague and the Holocaust were bad that is child’s play compared to what Christians will face during that timeframe.

Antonio Ossa

LUCKILY WE ONLY DIE ONCE!

Shara Bingham Mills

Looks like everything is unfolding according to plan.

Bill

“The global elite have never been closer to their goal of a united world”
The system is crumbling and humanity is anything but united.

Bill

Not the original “Bill”. Please change.

Lennie Pike

Yea, Pope Francis is a good Pope, but better yet would have been Cardinal Secola of Italy who unbeknownst to most was in the running and nearly elected the new Pope.

Unlike other Pope’s before him he was not going to take on a name other than his own like Pope Paul or Pius, Francis etc. – he was going to simply be known as Pope Secola.

I will go out fighting to the death. “Now go sell your cloaks and buy a sword.”

Lennie Pike

And no offense, but what did Jesus say concerning his Mother who was outside and wanting to enter the over crowded room where he was teaching?

Lennie Pike

But I didn’t think two would be enough.

Bring it!!!!

Alwaystomorrow

The Economic Collapse Blog Has Issued A RED ALERT For The Last Six Months Of 2015.

Published 6/25/2015.

73 days until 12/31/2015.

Lets do a count down until the end of 2015 and see just what happens.

——————————————————————————

By Michael S, on July 31st, 2015.

“And I kind of appreciate the countdown. It reminds people of my warning, and perhaps it will give some readers a renewed sense of urgency”

Ricardo

All an Illusion. A wolf in sheep’s clothing. The anti-christ.

Guns N Rosaries

MS,

Since all the false gods of all the false religions are of the devil (Psalm 95 v 5), it would make more sense AND be much easier to just use the structure of what used to house the Catholic Church to proclaim that all religions are good and praiseworthy (which continues be to stated even today). The Vatican is, in essence, trying to lift all anathemas and nullify all heresies. Once this is done, all that remains is to worship the son of the devil when he is finally revealed to the world. The only religion that will not be tolerated will be historical, Biblical, traditional, orthodox, Apostolic & militant Catholicism.

GSOB

As long as ‘Rome’ stays out of it.

Guns N Rosaries

Rome will become the seat of the Anti-Christ, which is where the Anti-christ will sit (2 Thess 2 v 14) as the Abomination of Desolation will be found standing in the holy place, which may well be another term for the A/C, again pointing to Rome and the Vatican

DYS

It difficult to understand how any intelligent person could possible believe in God or follow any organized religion. Streets of gold, jewels in your crown, 72 virgins, Angels and free popcorn! All religions are bribing you, playing off your basic fear of death and offering you an ever lasting life. In the end it’s just a manipulation to control you from cradle to grave.

Steeve Girard

Well I am a Pagan, I do not see how Nature can bribe me? You must be talking about Abrahamic religions.

DYS

If you want to worship nature, go for it.

DYS

Worship nature if you want. Makes more sense than Christianity I suppose.

JackerRaabit

That is because you are pathetically weak.

You live in endless terror of your own subconsciousness, which you imagine can/ will hallucinate a ‘god’ to oppress you… any second now.

Poor little you. You can’t even test if there is a God, if there are devils as well. No rejecting the false, looking for the truth, for you, not ever.

Dude there is one original god worshiped by the founders the Abrahamic faiths, and it’s the thing dangling between the legs of their male prophets. They just gave it a name: God, Yaweh, Allah, Jesus, Mjolnir, Gungir, etc…

Rick

Bring lots of sunscreen to the party you’re headed for!

John Byde

Steeve, you’ve brought to life an image I don’t want to dwell on! :))

John Byde

JR, we are all pathetically weak! Give the guy a break and speak in kindness. It might have an effect! Best wishes.

True….Jesus and Satan are mere Good Cop Bad Cop to suck energy from humanity….I have a feeling they are the same guys 🙂

You will never see them at once…When Satan Comes, Jesus disappears and as they are saying…Jesus is coming soon…I bet Satan will disappear.

Bible was created by them and now they are following it…I never fight with Bible preachers as its a form of energy sucking as well..as they left Streets of gold, jewels in your crown, 72 virgins, Angels etc so that rational man will fight over them for ever and say how stupid it is…

They are Evil but not Stupid…Whoever created Bible, Jesus, Satan is a pure genius…I give him that

J.R.

Obviously you have never served your country or been in war! There are NO athiest in the foxholes! And it really doesn’t matter what you think or say out of shear stupidity and ignorance about the God that created you! You see in the end, :EVERY knee shall bend and EVERY tongue confess that Jesus is LORD!” You can bet your life and eternal destination, either heaven or hell on it! End of discussion!

Gay Veteran

“…There are NO athiest in the foxholes….”

get a clue, man fears death

DYS

only those 8 years in the marine corps, thanks.

DYS

8 years USMC.

merrileerj

God loves you DYS.

Rick

And no matter what you’ve done, or what’s happened to you, there is only one unforgivable sin. As long as you have one breath in your lungs, you can still call on Him and be saved.

John Byde

True, DYS. You’ll get some nasty replies here, but don’t let that make you throw out the baby with the bathwater. God does indeed love you!

DYS

Sure, if you mean in the metaphorical sense. Sure.

Rick

Bring lots of sun screen!

John

DYS, you are yet another Atheist who doesn’t know what he is talking about. Jesus didn’t come to start a religion. The 72 Virgins are part of Islam. The streets of gold thing is a metaphor for satisfaction.

DYS

Jesus didn’t come… Mary fooled around and got knocked up.

John

Where is your evidence?

DYS

Does the cult of Horus prove that Christianity is false?

Some parallels between Horus and Jesus Christ:

1. Horus born of a virgin. Jesus born of a virgin.

2. The foster father of Horus was Seb or Seph. Jesus was fostered by Joseph.

3. Horus was of royal descent. Jesus was of royal descent.

4. Horus birth accompanied by three solar deities [star gazers] who followed by the morning star of Sirius bearing gifts. Jesus birth accompanied by three wise men [Zoroastrian star gazers] who followed by a star “in the east” bearing gifts.

5. The birth of Horus announced by angels. The birth of Jesus announced by angels.

6. Herut tried to murder the infant Horus. Herod slaughtered every first born in an attempt to kill Jesus the forthcoming messiah.

7. Horus is baptized at age 30 by Anup the Baptiser at a river. Jesus is baptized at age 30 by John the Baptist at a river.

8. Horus resists temptation by the evil Sut [Sut was to be the precursor for the Hebrew Satan] on a high mountain. Jesus resists temptation by Satan on a high mountain.

9. Horus had 12 followers. Jesus had 12 disciples.

10. Horus performed miracles like healing the sick and walking on water. Jesus performed miracles like healing the sick and walking on water.

11. Horus raised someone from the grave [his father Osiris] Jesus raised Lazarus [notice the name similarity] from the grave. Lazarus is short for Elasarus – the “us” on the end is romanized. Elasarus was derived from “El-Asar” which was the name given to Osiris.

12. Horus was buried and resurrected in the city of Anu. The place Bethany mentioned in John was a derivative of the words “Bet” and “Anu” which translates “the house of Anu”. The ‘y’ on the end of bethany is interchangeable with the letter ‘u’.

13. Horus was killed by crucifixtion. Jesus was crucified.

14. Horus was accompanied by two thieves at the crucifixtion. Jesus was crucified with two thieves.

15. Horus was buried in a tomb at Anu. Jesus was buried in a tomb located in Bethany [Bet-Anu].

16. Horus was resurrected after 3 days. Jesus was “said” to resurrected after over a period of three days.

17. The resurrection of Horus was announced by three women. The resurrection of Jesus was announced by three women.

18. Horus was given the titel KRST which means “anointed one” Jesus was given the title Christ [Christos] meaning “anointed one”

John Byde

DYS, I can understand why a lot of people are turned off to religion but it’s a bad mistake to tar it all with the same brush. My faith in Jesus doesn’t control me; on the contrary, it sets me free. As for death, well all humans are scared of that if we are honest. I still am, despite being a Christian. The difference now is that I know that it is also the Gateway to something wonderful and eternal. I hope one day you might investigate the bible a bit more closely and learn what wonders there are in there. Best wishes to you and yours!

DYS

You might want to read more closely what’s in that bible of yours.

Steeve Girard

Have they not understood how the natural world works by now? Gods! If you try to tip the balance one way, you have to fill the other side and keep it in balance. Or else nature will put entropy on the other side to compensate and the result will be more havoc. This plan is pure stupidity and utopias do not exist.
The only thing that makes sense is to go with the “river”, not to “dam” it. Learn your environment, plan things locally, use local materials… only call upon external help in absolute necessity… and that absolute is very strictly absolute. Use the smallest amount of energy possible. Learn to “winterize”, when it’s not the best moment to do something, working things year round is not sustainable. That makes more sense to me.

The whole balance thingy is mere scalar point field generation using humanity as battery. The darkness needs so called “balance” in nature to suck energy form.

Do not fall for Balance Equation. This whole game is about Scalar Energy to move higher up in dimension.

Steeve Girard

(playing Hindu music) (taking a big puff of a joint big as a telephone pole) Oh, dude! You have some great stock! Where did Lavoisier gone?

Nick Tubber

So what happened to your market crash prediction this year Michael? Give us an update.

Steeve Girard

It happened… Wallmart stock lost 27%+ of it’s value.
Several stores (other companies) are now facing another grim Yule, and will close.

Alwaystomorrow

The stock price today is exactly where it was on May 4, 2012. Not the end of the world yet.

Jerry C

TPTB are holding the collapse until their man for the hour leaves (?!). It’s all rigged, don’t ya know?

JackerRaabit

“We need to wake people up about this before it is too late.”

Wake up… who, exactly?

To do… what, exactly?

What used to be biblical Christians got together into bed with Roman Catholicism, and from it acquired Perfect Passivity.

The Church, is DEAD. And dead things, don’t do things.

Maximus Gluteus

The world will be one as it was n the days of the Caesars and the Roman Empire. Plenty of orgies and gladiator games.Bread and circuses!! Beer and football! feed troublemakers to the lions! It was be glorious

Steeve Girard

Yea… and also full of lead pollution, resource scarcity and bullying upon their neighbours.
They got sick with Saturnism, the base of their economy went in shambles (the workers and poor), and their got conquered by Alaric.
Way to go!

rentslave

The difference is that you could bet on those gladiator games.You cannot do so in today’s USA.

max gon

If you believe that there is a God, then you would also believe that the Moon is made of cheese.

Jerry C

Really? And who’s the moron?!

Rick

Bring a lot of sunscreen. It will be real hot at your party.

Antonio Ossa

UNITED WE STAND, DIVIDED WE FALL!

Steeve Girard

oh yea, there was 900+ and there shall be one… what is the next step… because that is shrinking? Answer is Zero. Diversity and limitations are the way nature has gone.. and it should be the way we should go.

JailBanksters

Moving to a one world government, one government at a time.
But religions are blowing themselves either by explosives or corruption or by Peadophile mania, and it is governments that protect religions, it’s like self induced, self inflicted. Maybe it will get to the point of the people begging for a One World Government to save them.

GetReal4U2

What is happening is undeniable…
sadly…most don’t “get it”…or even care…

Steeve Girard

Agree!

Antonio Ossa

DON’T BELIEVE ANYTHING YOU HEAR AND ONLY HALF OF WHAT YOU SEE!

Alwaystomorrow

I like to trust nothing I read but everything I see or experience.

Macintosh

In the ultimate scheme of things none of this really matters. Nothing you or I do will stop it. We are already divided because of religion, because of government, social issues, etc.

Steeve Girard

No! The problem is basically we tried tools to unite everything and they all gone haywire. We invented money to universalized trade… now we are stuck with economic crisis… We invented nations to unite people of a same region of the world under une culture… and now we hate the similarities of our neighbours, to the point we look elsewhere for difference, annoying other nations… We have built the American model of infrastructure… and now because of it’s demands from all around the world, we face scarcity of materials (conventional oil, rare metals and earths)… we invented the internet… and more work is replaced by AI / expert softwares, which does the same job at the expense of working people and their families….
And the list goes on and on.
No! Unity is a big mistake, we should encourage difference-ness and respect of others (even if shocking at some point).

People in the USA still won’t be able to bet on sports-though they can in the rest of the world.$heldon will not permit it.

Thiagarajan TVS

Dear Michael,

The citizens of the entire planet do not know that God is going
to create the same but in a different way. God is already
implementing His agenda. Famine is looming large in many
countries. . There is a shortage of many food items in the
international market. Storms are in the queue to batter many
countries. We are witnessing flash floods and flash droughts
in USA.

Nature-unleashed catastrophes are going the cripple all economies.
We need to pay more attention to fast changing climate patterns.
Britain is expected to face weeks of storms. We seem to be
ignorant of colossal catastrophes around the world. Vulnerable 20
nations have recently appealed to wealthy nations for climate
change fund.

Constellation of ominous signs is going to converge to
make the humanity helpless and hopeless!

Thiagarajan TVS

CASTIEL

If we lived or progress to one world government….what i dont believe….there will be no major wars…. today we walk to a ww3 …..russia china iran syria north korea vs Usa Europe Israel…..thats not one world government…but two differents forces…that can escalate in a dangerous armed confilct at any moment..the globalization we live today is economic and a lot of governments that accept corruption by big companies so they can do all they want…..the world is so corrupted thats is a matter of time before we reach the limit….but one world government? to much cultures religions and hate to that happen…..One thing is true the world is ruled by money and greed and that is global

WVBORN56

Another good article Michael. Your title is right out of the book of Revelation from God’s inspired Word. We are living in the shadow of the tribulation. This is just more confirmation that the Bible is truly God breathed! It is always a good time to consider the good news of the Gospel. (Romans 10:9 and John 3:16-17) Eternity is a long time to get it wrong. I would encourage anyone interested in accepting God’s free gift of eternal life through Jesus. He is the only one who can pay our sin debt.

grumpyhillbilly

We’ve been marching to the one world thing for over the past century. Once all the kings and empires were dispensed of, and replaced by technocrats, the one world thing began in earnest. Hitler was just premature and of the wrong ethnicity.

This is where I disagree. The elite are watching their dreams be interrupted by Putin and Jinping. These two are offering an alternative which is becoming attractive to more countries.

Then there is still this pesky nationalism that still thrives, and a lot of that is due crazy radical Islam, which are CIA fostered as a tool for our elite. Plus the economic depression that seems to be epidemic on every western economy main street is exposing the elite message for the bs that it is. The only success the elite have had over us is gay marriage. Yet maybe it’s my imagination, but the gays are like the radical muslims – annoying to the point of backlash. The elite answer to all this is mass immigration, and poking the Russian nuclear bear. Neither will work out well.

The elite are what my late father would call educated idiots. Their century old vision has to destroy the very things that gave them existence and wealth. Their dream, which is almost been indoctrinated on them since birth, is slipping away. They are potentially about to become the greatest danger the world has ever seen with the nukes and killer robots. If we survive it, then we are likely have to go thru it again in several decades with a Russian Sino version.

El Pollo de Oro

History repeats itself, sometimes with nastier results than before. As Gerald Celente says, “Currency wars, trade wars, world war.” Get ready for World War III, combined with a deepening of The Greatest Depression. The way things are shaping up, WWIII will be much deadlier than World War II, and the economic storm will be a lot more brutal than the 1930s depression (my family lived through those events after they came over from Europe, so I don’t say those things lightly). There is political upheaval all over the world, combined with widespread economic suffering that will only get worse. History shows us how deadly that combination can be.

“We’re headed for a collapse that’s going to be, we believe, as bad as the Great Depression. And it’s much worse because there are combinations building on top of it. You have civil unrest, wars developing. You have a situation of social and geopolitical unrest
that the world has never seen. You have all of these declining countries, all of these countries destabilized. You have a problem that no one knows how to deal with. And it’s going to get much worse as economies decline and wars increase.”—Gerald Celente

“The United States has become Murder, Incorporated.”—Dr. Paul Craig Roberts

“When people can’t afford to buy food, the desperation will become enormous, and it will be horrific for those who failed to
prepare.”—Mac Slavo, SHTFPlan dot com

Welcome to World War III. Welcome to the Greatest Depression. Welcome to hell. And as always, please say a prayer for The Banana Republic of America because this Third World hellhole needs all the help it can get.

Zaf

‘Pope Francis clearly believes that Christians and Muslims worship the exact same God.’

Thanks for the interesting article. Michael, regarding the above comment, please note that we Muslims worship the same God that Jesus did, and Moses before him and Abraham before him and Noah & Adam before them. Ever wondered why no Muslim has ever maligned Jesus in retaliation of derogatory sketches & remarks against Muhammad, their prophet, despite a population crossing 1 billion and being labeled as extremists by all sides? (Not a single incident). Because, according to Islamic teachings, a person saying anything unholy or derogatory against any prophet or Jesus will be considered an infidel, a non muslim and will face the wrath of God. Our holy book ‘Quran’ & teachings of Muhammad are filled with praise about Jesus & we love & respect him no less than Christians. The dissimilarities lie in the practices but Islam is an extension of Christianity, as per our scholars. I can only request you to at least read what Quran says about Jesus and Mary and God then formulate your views. I am confident, you will then view Islam as it is and not according to the actions of some idiots.

Rick

Zaf, it is an impossibility that your Alla is the same as The Ancient Of Days. Christians know the God we serve is a Triune God. The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit. Three persons in one. Islam does not believe this about its god. To say that Islam is an extension of Christianity is very funny… Thanks for the levity.

Zaf

Thanks for reading my comments. You are absolutely right. However, this is a dissimilarity how both Christian & Muslims view God. We both believe in God as omnipotent and a Sustainer. Both believe that Satan is evil. Both believe in heavenly books and God’s commandments. My argument is not about differences but worshipping one God. I can only request you to read Quran once for what it says about Jesus and Mary. I am confident that this will change your point of view about Islam’s view of God, Jesus & Mary. Thanks again.

GSOB

What exactly does Islamic eschatology (the study of the end times) teach and how does it drive its adherents to commit atrocities like those carried out by ISIS?

Postmillennial Eschatology – Islam Style

The teaching that Christians must prepare the world for Christ before He comes and begins His earthly reign (called postmillennialism) is all but dead in Christianity.

But that same mindset is very well alive in Islam

Rick

Zaf, thank you for your thoughtful reply. I agree with some of these similar beliefs, yet the differences are what makes my faith unique, and likewise what makes your faith unique to you. These differences are irreconcilable. They are the big things… If we didn’t have differences, then wouldn’t all religions/faiths be the same. We believe Blessed Mary is the Mother of God, her spouse is The Holy Spirit. Now you can’t or don’t even acknowledge The Holy Spirit, so this is a deal breaker. Your god is not my God, and I wouldn’t expect you to compromise your beliefs saying my Triune God is your God.

Rick

Michael, you say: “Decades ago, most Americans would have been up in arms over something like this. But now most people just seem to accept these changes passively.”
How are we supposed to respond? With war? You say yourself these things are being done in secret. How are we supposed to know about them? The media is neutered. Who do we declare war on? We all know what a farce politicians are today, just look at the Republican Speaker of The House. It’s all rigged, and it always will be. In 10 years we will look like another India, or African country. There will be the super rich, the poor, and the dead. 3 classes of Americans. By 2030 those left here alive will be begging for government help, and the poisonous pots of GMO mush on the stove. We are well on our way to becoming “Idiocracy” in full living color.

Goldenpuff2

It isn’t that we don’t care….it’s that we have become demoralized. And how can you not when you call your Senator’s office to ask him/her to vote one way or another and the lackey answering the phone (Dem Senator, btw) Argues with you. You already know where your message is going. If they don’t listen to us, the door is shut. I’m guessing we all know that already by now. And pretty much since Obama took over, if you ask me.

Voting doesn’t matter when all politicians are bought and paid for and they represent the corporations and not We The people. If we do vote for something some judge can come along and dismiss the vote. The supreme court didn’t even have any state votes to legalize gay marriage

Religion has been the greatest partition between peoples for as long as written history can account for. All of the modern forms of organized faith have descended from corrupt, war mongering kingdoms of the past who have used it to coerce and control people. Evil, yet effective.

axinosp PAN

In the age of Aquarius the old is dying, and old is debt monetary Banking system, and unipolar world led by America !!
In the age of Aquarius the old world is washed with much, much water (flood, snow, glaciers etc)

Daystrom2012

“Moving Toward A One World Government, A One World Economy And A One World Religion”

Now if only this was preached from the pulpits. Instead of Bonhoeffer’s we have a plethora of Osteen’s and Warren’s and Rob Bell’s. The sad part is the pews are only too happy to lap up their drivel. They lack discernment to understand the times that the prophets of old longed to see but a remnant still remains.

He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red. And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times?

“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams

Psalms 23:4 Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.

ali

I think you are paranoid!!

Jazz

yeah but the stock market keeps going up, up, and up. No need for a new world order unless the people are hurting. We are still in a strong bull market!!!

Los Pollos Hermanos

This blog is serious breaking to the bad side. One conspiracy theory after another. Next up “Big Foot Sinks the Economy!”

Mark A.

Good article on these three areas of global focus for us at this time in history. The subject of making our world one by these common denominators is not new. It is as old as the Roman Empire. People really should crack open a history book to better understand our current situation. This New World Order will be far more insidious than any previous versions. The advent of invasive technologies, globally assured economic dependency and the need to bring about spiritual unity among the diverse religions of the world is reaching a fevered pitch in our lifetimes. For myself it is not a surprise as the Bible speaks of these issues in both the Old and New Testaments. I would suggest folks take a look at the Book of Daniel chapters 8 thru 12 for a quick overview. Put your trust in Christ and you need not fear these things.

2Gary2

Many
people are just too stupid to even realize that they’re stupid – and
trying to reason with people who have lost all grasp of reality is akin
to administering medicine to the dead…..but, look….the American
people have twice elected Barack Obama
– thankfully, the general populace is not Rethuglican…..we will have a
Democrat as President…I am confident in this assessment….my son is
at a major State University and all he hears day in and day out is feel
the Bern – the future belongs to these kids, they are bright and they
are having NONE of the BS that the fright-wingers spew daily like
vomiting volcanoes.

Mike

Yep, nothing like a tyrannical socialist/communist government telling us what to do with every aspect of life (Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, Mussolini, etc) to really get me excited! “You’re dumb and we’re not because we’ve been brainwashed by the state school system and the media giants”. If you guys have it your way, these “bright kids” will have no future.

2Gary2

Michael-I looked at the you tube link on this page–was that Tammy Faye Baker on the panel?

Joe Trevors

I would like to join your discussion today to focus on the visit of Pope Francis to the United States three weeks ago. Without a doubt Francis was reaching out to all of the people he spoke with from Obama to Congress to the UN to the school children in Harlem to the 9/11 Memorial to the Conference on the Family in Philadelphia. Just imagine at his age, after 3 days in Cuba, he came to the U.S. for 5 more days! I recall the words of St. Paul that refer to the mission of any disciple of Christ, including the Pope (also known as the servant of the servants of the Lord). Paul said what Pope Francis did: “To the weak I became weak, so that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all people, that I might by all means save some” ( I Corinthians, 9, 19-23). Francis loves sinners. He reached out to people in power, WITH LOVE, & they loved him! It was the Golden Rule at work he described, even though many of them are pursuing a direction opposite of the Gospel. In Philadelphia Francis went to his own flock in Church & he was more severe with them because they should know better! Did you notice that? I would love to share more about this with you but am running out of time.

chimera

Religion is just one mechanism used by the elites to control the masses.

Actually, chimera, religion – or God – controls them, except in their hubris, they don’t know it. There are many bastardised forms of Christianity, but in its truest sense it gives believers the only true freedom humans can have. That is why it has outlasted every empire and can never be subdued by political or military force.

Devil Hater

I’m scared of the big nostril poop monster.

Chris Out of Africa

Really??? You sound like Hitler!

JackerRaabit

Oh dear. You mean I must be polite to mindless jerks instead?

Um… don’t wanna.

Chris Out of Africa

These mind less guys on hear theoretical head christians who have formulated their beliefs into an ideology. The real Christians are not the ones shouting rhetoric, but go about their faith living out the Gospel as good news not bad. They are the ones serving humanity without any desire to be seen and never go for being notice by damning everyone on comment threads. These on here are thus the minority, The real believers live out the verse below and are those who give their lives to make the world a better place.

1 Peter 3:15New King James Version (NKJV)

15 But sanctify the Lord God[a] in your hearts, and always be ready to give a defense to everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear;….

Everyone is of value to our Creator and so no-one is excrement. Yes Hitler, Pol Phot, Stalin, Mao and other extermInated humans because they never valued human life. YOU ARE ALSO VALUED AND LOVED BY HIM.

JackerRaabit

Are you very new to this online thing, then?

If you are indeed brand-spanking new, then let me say: Grow Up.

If not, then do read on.

=

Do you really not KNOW what these atheists/ activists/ socialists/ hippies/ deviants ARE?

They know the Gospel: perhaps better than you do.
They know what that bible says, in detail, on a very wide array of topics. Likely better than you do.

They know, and they reject it ALL.

More than that: they are, with full knowledge of their actions, liars, manipulators, deceivers… and the list goes on and on.

Now. I know that the bible means NOTHING to a Goodness-Above-The-Bible pseudo-Christian, like yourself, but do you perhaps recall HOW the Lord address people like that? Mmmm? What DOES He say about them…?

Oh. Right. You UTTERLY do not care. Because you are ever so much MORE GOOD that God Himself. Yep, yep. You follow the Way Of Ghandi, and everyone knows that he was like even more holy than Jesus. Yep. You is down wit it all, man. You da bomb!

Now.

Scatt-off, you useless, saltless, lightless, garbage.

Chris Out of Africa

Funny you act so Christ- like! Jesus loved and came to save the”scum” as you cal them. That is what my Bible teaches me! And yes it was the Pharisaical know it all condemning like you who wanted Him dead and perhaps the Barrabas types that are among these”scum” But the Gospel of the Lord of Lords teaches me to not to owe anything but love. To love your enemy. The attitude you have reveals the fruit of a tree that needs redeeming somehow. By their fruit you shall know them. Jesus NOT Gandhi. I think you need to get saved through and through because waht you believe is NOT the scripture of the New Testament. Read it aagain end ask the Holy Spirit lead you into all truth, especially about your hateful heart. God bless and convict of sin,.

JackerRaabit

Please spare me your kiddy-edition of How To Be A Good Christian Like Ghandi.

My point remains: the Lord spoke VERY harshly to the scum of the earth: yet you refuse to do as He does… Mmmm, ashamed of Him, are you then?

Must be. Why else would you follow only PART of His example?

Chris Out of Africa

You are deceived about Jesus. Read the Gospel Luke 9:51 Now it came to pass, when the time had come for Him to be received up, that He steadfastly set His face to go to Jerusalem, 52 and sent messengers before His face. And as they went, they entered a village of the Samaritans, to prepare for Him. 53 But they did not receive Him, because His face was set for the journey to Jerusalem. 54 And when His disciples James and John saw this,they said, “Lord, do You want us to command fire to come down from heaven and consume them, just as Elijah did?”[e]

55 But He turned and rebuked them,[f] and said, “You do not know what manner of spirit you are of. 56 For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men’s lives but to save them.” And they went to another village.

I quote “You do not know what manner of spirit you are” v 55. Ego! not a disciple of Christ who will come with glory and power.

JackerRaabit

“You are deceived about Jesus.”

1. Not that this would matter to the likes of you, but the Bible is not the Gospel. I rather doubt you have the first clue what the Gospel even is, but that is neither here not there.

2. And you, still, ignore, rather blatantly, the simple point that I made.

What does the bible call someone who is intellectually dishonest like you… do you recall, by any chance?

Or is expecting you to step away from your stubborn adherence to the Satanism of Ghandi-Christianity just too much?

Oh well.

3. If you expect to come in glory and power… well, I do expect that the Lord might just impose some basic standards on that, and if so, then you will fail: you fail at being a Christian on the most basic of levels, after all.

Chris Out of Africa

I don’t think you do. If you can ignore the N.T. words of Jesus and deny the meaning of them. Sorry, but He will say in that day/… I don’t know you. Jesus is the Gospel! To all who received Him He gave the right to become the children of God. Also by their fruit you shall know them. By the comments you have made, I see the fruit of ego, self, arrogance and violence.

JackerRaabit

“By the comments you have made, I see the fruit of ego, self, arrogance and violence.”

Really. So anger at your SATANISM is now “violence”. I’ll be sure to convey your stern reprimand to the Living God: I don’t think He ‘knows’ this Great Hippie Secret Of Ghandi The Holy.

What a freekin MORON you are.

Fruit? YOU talk about fruit? YOU, who are, flat-out, choosing to be unbiblical? My God, are you SERIOUS?!

Chris Out of Africa

John 3:There was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews.2 This man came to Jesus by night and said to Him, “Rabbi, we know that You are a teacher come from God; for no one can do these signs that You do unless God is with him.”

Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” THIS is the Word of the LORD. It is quite apparent that you are on another planet. Yes you will stand before HIM and give account of these words. In the New Testament you will find people like you were called Zealots. They wanted Jesus to be an Emperor King who would kill the Roman occupiers. When they didn’t comply, they turned on him along with the “respectable pharisees” and shouted crucify him! Judas was thought to be one, that is why he betrayed Jesus. I think your comments here reveal who you are for all who are Jesus disciples to see. Sad, but you are a lost soul. Pleas examine the scriptures because you are a lost soul.

JackerRaabit

I’ve said enough.

However: “Yes you will stand before HIM and give account of these words. In the
New Testament you will find people like you were called Zealots. They
wanted Jesus to be an Emperor King who would kill the Roman occupiers.”

You are being deceitful, and manipulative. Do keep digging that hole.

Ruth Allan

Right again Chris. Have you read ‘Tortured for Christ’ by Rich Wurmbrand? You can find him speaking on You Tube. Through Christ, he was able to convert even his torturers. He wrote a small book, ‘Marx and Satan’ which explains all we need to know about the Satanic religion which is now coming on the whole world. But our Lord is in control.

Chris Out of Africa

Yes Ruth. It was instrumental in my coming to know Christ. Walked many years since then with God dealing with my ego self. It is so tragic to see that so many haven’t learned to walk with Him and allow Him to transform their lives. They will unfortunately find themselves on the wrong side of the Armageddon that they are obsessed with.

John Byde

JR, we’re all mindless jerks sometimes. Why not try and win these guys over with cogent, polite arguments? I was an atheist once too.

Rick

Or obama.

JackerRaabit

Really. So when the Lord Himself rips into sinners… He is sounding like Obama.

That’s nice: I would like to, really like to, see you try and spin-doctor that one into His face.

Tomislav

Concerning one world religion. Technically speaking Jews, Christians and Muslims do worship one true God. Fact is that they don’t belive in Him in the same way but never the less it is the same personal God. God that Abraham trusted and through centuries his belief in that God “traveled” through history down to time of Jesus. From His time both Christians and Jews still believed in that same God. And when Muhamed took beliefs from Jews and Christians he also started with this same God. I think that it’s not the almighty and merciful God that is the stepping stone between these three religions but the person of Jesus Christ. For Jews He was a deciever, for Christians He is the true Saviour and God and for the muslims He is merely one of the prophets.

Jerry Loy

Keep a close eye on Germany the dominoes start there. David Wilkerson

alan

I suspect at best you might get a one world circus. Human nature will not cooperate being in one group. You could pay the media to report that it’s one world whatever, but it really won’t be.

Seen2013

“The global elite have never been closer to their goal of a united world.”

It’s also known as New World Order and global governance. NWO isn’t widely acknowledged but global governance largely is.

“the United Nations launched a “new universal agenda” for humanity.”

It’s not really new. Sustainable development is determined by environmental accounting and land-use, and sustainable development is a major mechanism to optimum sustainable population.

It’s the same old b/s just a different era.

“Decades ago, most Americans would have been up in arms over something like this. But now most people just seem to accept these changes passively.”

First, the public relations narrative promoting these goals are infamously rosy and promotes spurring emotions that makes people simultaneously prone to instant gratification, world peace, and Utopia.
Second, people are increasingly encouraged to follow ‘past precedent’ opposed to liberties and freedoms that is why centralization is typically the desired solution even if fractionally increased.
Third, dissent is being bullied through political correctness into silence or truly evoking Godwin’s Law, which will be necessary to tackle overpopulation and man-made climate change.

How does governments typically handle such issues?
First, the centralize towards Absolute Authority of power and control.
This requires public-private partnerships or mergers also known as Kleptocracy and Plutocracy.
Second, they start utilizing crisis to increase the violence of crackdowns typically through Guilty Until Proven Innocent.
Third, they start utilizing the past precedent to nefarious ends.
IE, if Guilty Until Proven Innocent enables criminal prosecution to force you to prove your innocence, your charges are practically a done deal.
IE, if governments can force service association, it can force service purchases of goods and services.
ACA is only the first service to be mandated thus far. Next, it will be energy to keep those businesses from going bankrupt like Solyndra, which only went backrupt twice and presently operates under a different name (It’s a form of fraud. Basically, you file bankruptcy to force shareholders to take a decimal compensation and open the business under a different name aka it is a scam).
Speaking of ACA, as overpopulation and man-made climate change is compelled to force interventionism, it is going to involve population control. This is precisely why poverty, mental disability, physical disability, elderly, and genetic purity and defect are issues of the 2030 Agenda. It worked in 1907-1960 under feeble-minded, which is defined as mental illness-defect.
Now, if you did your homework, you would also know these Neo-Malthusians who desire population control are also supporters of gun control and man-made climate change.
What does man-made climate change have to do with overpopulation and population control? China boosts its 1 child policy has prevented over 300 million CO2 emitters aka overpopulation is also excess CO2 emitters.
Biomass is large; there is more CO2.

GSOB

There is something very ‘romish’ in your witnessing…

“The successor of Peter is going to need your prayers.”

Very carnal.

Hoot Gibson

Excellent article…I would suggest reading ‘The Great Controversy’ written by Ellen G White in support of the authors line of thinking. The Great Controversy was written in 1888. It is a history of the Christian dispensation, with the last 8 chapters dealing with eschatology, or the study of last day events. Ellen White draws from the prophecies of both the Books of Daniel in the Old Testament and Revelation from the New. In summary, the Catholic Church unites with the United States to create a one world government and religion. i.e. The beast of Revelation 13. The sea beast and the lamb like earth beast unite and ’cause all, small and great, to worship after the beast.’

Emilie Walling

OBAMA IS A TRAITOR TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE AND THE POPE IS A TRAITOR TO CHRISTIANITY. DOES ANYONE REMEMBER THE TOWER OF BABEL AND GOD’S RESPONSE?

Belinda Baker

The tribulation is at our doorsteps, and it is like 80 percent of America is asleep or in a hypnotic state, and the few people who have figured it out and can see what is happening are treated like they are crazy. It is sad to say that if more of the 80 percent would of spent more time reading God’s word instead of indulging in the Elites, entertainment venues then many more would have seen. What the bible warns us to keep vigilante about. Thank you for the warning and being God’s messengers.

“…And do you want to know who pushed really hard to give Obama fast track negotiating authority so that these negotiations could be brought to a successful conclusion?
It was the traitorous Republican leadership in Congress. They did everything that they could to pave the way for Obamatrade….”

ANYONE surprised at this late date doesn’t have a clue about what is going on

AirborneSoldier

I disagree. Repubs tend to be weak, but they are not ideologically to destroy the moral or economic foundations of our once great nation.

Gay Veteran

ROFLOL, republicans = democrats.
both believe in empire abroad, the national security and surveillance state at home, and shipping American jobs overseas.

neo-con and neo-liberal traitors

Gay Veteran

bilge

Gay Veteran

how Christian of you

JackerRaabit

Thank you.

durango

Go on and admit it gay veteran, the truth hurts.

Gay Veteran

I admit it, a lot of Christians are “christians” yearning to pray loudly at street corners

Jon J Thompson

Since many do not follow the political arena, many don’t care which is good for those who have most of the power in our world. I just started read the book “Babylon Code” and look forward to getting deep into the book. I am just one citizen who does not have any power over the government, but I do have the greatest power behind me in the security of Jesus Christ. I am ready for His return, are you?

JohnStefanyszyn

Who is Anti-Christ?…he who claims to be FREE to do what is RIGHT in the eyes of each man.

People talk about the coming of a “New World Order”.

BUT THIS “WORLD ORDER” ALREADY EXISTS and is worshipped by all nations and by all religions..it is known as FREEDOM of Rights, FREEDOM of Religion.

All people desire it and have willingly received its mark ( name = character / number=values) on their foreheads and hands.

The religious worship it for their religious freedom.

… the Catholics, the Christians ( & all its denominations), the Jews, all other religions, and yes, even the Muslims.

The capitalists worship it for the greed freedom.

The homosexuals worship it for the sexual freedom.

President Obama has declared the message, as a spiritual messenger(=angel) from on high, that this FREEDOM is the “Light of the world” and the righteousness of man for his peace. He has confessed in Jerusalem that there is a “common” ‘god’ among the 3 main religions of Christianity, Judaism, and Islam whose identity and gift is FREEDOM. President Obama has placed the tabernacle of his FREEDOM palace between and above the Holy Mountain of the One Creator.

AND this FREEDOM dictates that it is RIGHT, a right, to be free to worship ANY ‘god’ as per one’s self-desires and self-interests, established as per one’s definition of “good and evil’.

BUT the One Creator commanded man to worship ONLY HIM. HE said that man is not to worship any other gods….in other words HE warned man that man is NOT FREE to worship other ‘gods’ for if he were to do so the judgement and punishment for this disobedience ( for this taken freedom) would be death.

The Lord Jesus Christ, Son of the One Creator, said that we are to worship ONLY the One Lord your Creator God and HIM Alone to SERVE in obedience and love, love for HIM first and foremost and love for, to do GOOD according to the One True Way, to the fellow man.

Very soon, the Lord Jesus Christ will return, as a thief in man’s eyes, to rule the earth in obedience and power as the ONE KING according to the Will of ‘I AM’ and NOT according to man’s first love for “his freedom”, for his desire to serve and magnify oneself (XES).

…and man will weep and clench his teeth in intense anger when his freedom will be no more.

The Anointed Lord Jesus said to repent and to serve Only Him, the One True Way of Life.

WSP

You are insane. Get help.

WSP

Every religion worships the same devil.

Faith Contender

You nailed it! I have been warning people all over the landscape about this as well. The church is blind to this for the most part. They have sidestepped bible prophecy that clearly illustrates this (albeit symbolically) in Rev. 13 but it’s all there, one world government, religion, economy under antichrist. That comes first, then judgment by fire and THEN God’s kingdom. Before the big unveiling is the apostasy which is now. (2 Thess. 2). They will say revival, but it is apostasy and unity with it. They will say bridge building and relationships, but it is unity and ecumenism with the one world religion. They will say love, but their love is hate and our ‘hate’ is love by telling the truth and warning those in danger. God’s Word is truth. They will say unity but in it they divide from the truth and unite with error, in our division we unite with truth and divide from error. They will call it authentic Christianity but it is the farthest thing from it because it is doctrines of demons from false religion. They will call it sharing but it is going to be the mark of the beast economy. They call it ‘kingdom building’ but it is paving the way for the one world government and religion via dominionism heresy. One of the biggest keys to this deception was the heretical groundwork laid long ago by Scofield with things like the pretrib rapture lie.

Robin-Frans Winkel

Esperanto could solve the wars in the Middle-East.

Hank

In a one world government, or not…
Poverty will NEVER be eradicated.
Wars will NEVER be prevented.
Disease will NEVER be eradicated.
Religion will NEVER be settled.
Economies will NEVER be stable.
There will NEVER be a “utopia” on this earth as many believe.

Why…. because of sin! Because of the sin of Adam, sin entered the world. Sin has separated us from God. This is why there will never be peace on earth until Christ comes back.
Moving toward a one world government, one economy, and one religion will only worsen the worlds pain and problems.
WAKE UP!
Return to God! And ask for the free gift of salvation through Jesus Christ.

dockilldare

its not a united world, its a world with one government. there is a difference. you know the federation from star trek is a fantasy right? if there is a one world government now it will be totalitarian, be it under the guise of helping the poor blah blah blah…

it is not a united world.

John Higson

Just because YOU don’t understand it doesn’t make it wrong! Your ignorance or intellectual inability to understand is not a justification for a magical worldview. It just isn’t.

jakethepup

EVERYTHING HAS TO COME FROM SOMEWHERE GENIUS.

John Higson

I think you’ll find that YOU wouldn’t be able to understand it anyway, unless your priest/pastor/vicar etc told you it was just a ‘mystery of faith’, and then you wouldn’t even try……..

See DYS’s answer below.

jakethepup

Oh I see you’re a progressive, elitist, bitch. Anyone with faith in something other than what you believe is stupid right. Another tolerant Socialist.

John Higson

Progressive Libertarian about sums me up. To be elite is something to be aspired to, but I’m not. Elite doesn’t ACTUALLY mean what you think it means. Do you own a dictionary?

I certainly don’t have ‘faith’ in anything, that would be stupid. I demand evidence and that is simply not forthcoming from any religion, we’re just supposed to believe without evidence. No thanks, that’s what halfwits do, that’s what sheep do and they get sheared! I have rational and evidenced convictions. I think you’ll find that correlates quite well with IQ…..

jakethepup

John your arrogance is astounding. Are you familiar with the term Educated Idiot. It is a perfect description of you. Nothing is true unless some college prof told you it is true.
Lenin called you people Useful Idiots. See if you can figure out why….

John Higson

‘unless some college prof told you it is true.’

Can you read? How is that evidence? That is exactly the same as if your pastor/priest told you! I do not believe what an authority figure tells me. You obviously do. Can you work out why that makes you a flocking idiot?

jakethepup

Oh now Jonny don’t lie. Admit what you are. As a brainwashed drone you should be proud of it. As for me I don’t have a pastor or priest. See I don’t believe you need to go to a building to have faith. Religion actually has ruined faith. What I don’t understand is why people with faith in God bother people like you so much. I don’t care that you don’t have faith why do you care if I do. Ahhhh communist doctrine, everyone must live the way the you want. Mindless drones.

John Higson

Last reply, because I’m not getting anywhere with you as you lack the self awareness to see to see your mistakes, even when they are pointed out to you. I’m sure you will reply though and reveal your ignorance to the masses more fulsomely than you already have!

‘ Ahhhh communist doctrine’

I’ve already told you that I’m a progressive libertarian, in what twisted, unintelligent worldview does that equate to communism? I consider incorrect reasoning to be a handicap that needs to be corrected, or at least mitigated. I also love to argue, but the entertainment value of watching you attempt to form a cogent dialogue without constantly tripping yourself up with stereotypical, irrelevant nonsense, lapses in logic and anything in the slightest bit persuasive has lost it’s sheen.

Bye……

jakethepup

My God you are so superior Johnny. I am rather bored with you too and to be honest this was a waste of my time. Guess what genius, I wasn’t trying to persuade you of anything. As i said I don’t care what you believe. Oh and congratulations on your 2 degrees. I only have one in Emergency Management so I guess you are superior.

John Higson

Listening to your arguments I can assure you that I AM superior!

jakethepup

Where have you been? Are you out on a weekend pass? Don’t forget your meds.

John Higson

Have a look down the thread sometime…….

I’ve been pressing the case for rationality with hoards of your uneducated countrymen. I simply can’t believe there can be so many STUPID people in one country. I almost feel good about the cesspit that I come from seeing the unreconstructed quality and intelligence of the festering jobbies that emanate from yours!

David Dally

Oh good for you John. You are such a waste of time and a complete phony..

John Higson

‘waste of time’ Why?

‘a complete phony..’ Phony what? As opposed to a real what? In what context?

I can deduce from your post that you have nothing to add and lacking necessary skills to construct a logical argument and try to refute anything I’ve said. I conclude that your post was a complete, utter and total waste of time and you have nothing to add to anything. It’s easy being a critic, isn’t it?

DYS

When the personal attacks start, you know reason has left the building. Better to not try and explain things to people who already have committed to their own explanation, I think.

John Higson

Let’s foursquare face the obvious fact and shame of religious/magical thought, THERE IS NO REASON INVOLVED!

I’m quite happy to field the personal attacks, because it isn’t me who looks stupid making them. as I point out the errors of their reasoning. I could do with some back-up sometimes though……

HiHoSilver

No just a loser would better describe you

John Higson

How can you decide that from the information that you have? Imbecilic.

I would assert that Loserdom is much more likely to be where you live, going from the evidence of your post. You lack the mental discernment to construct a cogent argument to back your assertion up and resort instead to bald Ad Hom. attacks without any supporting argumentation. That is my circumstantial evidence. Odds are you are mentally challenged and put in a disadvantageous position by my point of view, because it upsets you and you lack the tools to adequately respond in a way which would challenge me and make me rethink my worldview.

Who, exactly, is the loser?

scott

Darwinian Evolution has been soundly destroyed by Scientific Truth. We don’t even need the Bible.
The Human eye alone is proof that Evolution is a fairy tale.
Evolution also violates the Laws of Thermodynamics:
1. You cannot get something from nothing. Darwin: Everything came from nothing.
2. Entropy (everything is breaking down from complex to simple). Everything is rotting, dying, decaying.
Darwin: Everything is going from simple to more complex, getting more efficient and better than before.

Only a fool puts his faith in Darwin’s religion. It’s an extremely far fetched fairy tale!

John Higson

I know how much you want to believe what you’ve written. I know how much your doubts hurt you. I feel your confusion and uncertainty. You have my sympathy. But you need to grow up.

scott

It’s plain to see by your childish replies that have no substance you can only result to ad hominem attacks.
Let’s cut to the truth here: You don’t accept God, not because you lack evidence, but because you don’t WANT to.
Like all atheists, it’s a power issue. You don’t want some supernatural being which you cannot even see with your own eyes telling you how to live and what to do. You are the captain of your ship and the lord of your life, and no one is going to dethrone you.
You have my deepest sympathy, but you need to wise up.

John Higson

‘Darwinian Evolution has been soundly destroyed by Scientific Truth’

What does this even mean? WTF is ‘Scientific Truth'(capitalised!)? If you had taken any amount of time or effort to examine the evidence that supports the biological law of evolution, I wouldn’t be needing to write this. It’s basically irrefutable. The only thing that had a chance at refuting it was ‘irreducible complexity’ which had at least a patina of scientific credibility, but ultimately was holed below the waterline in innumerable place, not least in a clear progression of the intermediate stages of the evolution of the human eye! I believe the eye has evolved many times throughout evolutionary history.

You could easily have discovered this on your own, but you are scared to. Being an iconoclast of your own views is a troubling and disturbing thing, but from it ultimately comes strength!

‘Like all atheists, it’s a power issue.’

Nonsense! It’s absolutely nothing of the sort! I have zero respect for any dogs of any description. I’ve looked at the costs, benefits and the evidence and come to the rational decision that they don’t exist, so why pretend that they do?

‘Evolution also violates the Laws of Thermodynamics’

No it doesn’t! This shows more a misconception about thermodynamics than about evolution. The second law of thermodynamics says, “No process is possible in which the sole result is the transfer of energy from a cooler to a hotter body.” [Atkins, 1984, The Second Law, pg. 25] Now you may be scratching your head wondering what this has to do with evolution. The confusion arises when the 2nd law is phrased in another equivalent way, “The entropy of a closed system cannot decrease.” Entropy is an indication of unusable energy and often (but not always!) corresponds to intuitive notions of disorder or randomness. Creationists thus misinterpret the 2nd law to say that things invariably progress from order to disorder.

However, they neglect the fact that life is not a closed system. The sun provides more than enough energy to drive things. If a mature tomato plant can have more usable energy than the seed it grew from, why should anyone expect that the next generation of tomatoes can’t have more usable energy still? Creationists sometimes try to get around this by claiming that the information carried by living things lets them create order. However, not only is life irrelevant to the 2nd law, but order from disorder is common in nonliving systems, too. Snowflakes, sand dunes, tornadoes, stalactites, graded river beds, and lightning are just a few examples of order coming from disorder in nature; none require an intelligent program to achieve that order. In any nontrivial system with lots of energy flowing through it, you are almost certain to find order arising somewhere in the system. If order from disorder is supposed to violate the 2nd law of thermodynamics, why is it ubiquitous in nature?

The thermodynamics argument against evolution displays a misconception about evolution as well as about thermodynamics, since a clear understanding of how evolution works should reveal major flaws in the argument. Evolution says that organisms reproduce with only small changes between generations (after their own kind, so to speak). For example, animals might have appendages which are longer or shorter, thicker or flatter, lighter or darker than their parents. Occasionally, a change might be on the order of having four or six fingers instead of five. Once the differences appear, the theory of evolution calls for differential reproductive success. For example, maybe the animals with longer appendages survive to have more offspring than short-appendaged ones. All of these processes can be observed today. They obviously don’t violate any physical laws.

I hope that these typing cause you to re-evaluate your nonsense. But I hold little optimism. I know your type.

zulov

Gosh, you’re so smart. I am in awe. Can you explain your consciousness?

John Higson

‘Only a fool puts his faith in Darwin’s religion’

Please,please,PLEASE explain to me why Darwin’s biological law of evolution through natural selection is in any way a religion? Define religion? I’ll bet you think that atheism is a religion too! When,in fact, it’s the exact opposite of one, rejecting belief in anything for disbelief in everything!

scott

Atheism, which is what Darwinian Evolution contains, is a religion.
The god of Atheism is man. Man is the highest form of life, wisdom, knowledge, and power in the universe and there is no higher power.
Man is deified.
The reason Darwin was motivated to flush his Christian teaching down the toilet was because when his daughter Annie got sick, and he begged God to heal her, Annie died.
Her death devastated Darwin and he quickly became bitter at God and decided he wanted nothing more to do with God, Christianity, or the Church.
This is not my opinion, this is from Darwin’s own writings and accurate biographies of his life.
BTW: His “Theory” of Evolution originally contained in the title “the preservation of favoured races.”
Darwin believed the Black race was barely above monkeys and the white race was supreme above all others.
His first cousin, Francis Galton, invented the doctrine of Eugenics in 1865. Margaret Sanger, member of the KKK, inspired by Evolution/Eugenics, started Planned Parenthood to help wipe out the Black race and “purify” the gene pool of Mankind.
Darwin’s Evolution also is the catalyst for Adolf Hitler’s “Final Solution” and Josef Stalin’s “Purges.”
Darwin is one of the wickedest men to ever walk the Earth.

John Higson

‘Atheism, which is what Darwinian Evolution contains, is a religion.’
If I had he ability I would smack you about the chops! Utter, utter nonsense of the most unbelievable I’ve ever encountered!! Where did you learn this idiocy?

Atheism IS NOT A RELIGION! It is the exact opposite. A rejection of religious beliefs.

Darwinian evolution is NOTHING to do with atheism! It is a scientific theory or, if you like, a biological law.

That the two usually go together is irrelevant in the extreme and the fact that you conflate and associate the two is an indictment of your powers of reasoning and an indication that you need to get an education!

Nothing that you have said answered my questions, just illustrated your ignorance. Why is that so many reasonably intelligent Americans demonstrate an inability to reason beyond the dogma of religious authority? I despair for your nation and people.

John Higson

‘Darwin believed the Black race was barely above monkeys’

So what? So did everybody at the time, including ALL the founding fathers of the US( that are held up as human ‘gods’ by all uneducated americans), does that give you any pause at all? I’ll bet that offends you terribly doesn’t it?

Eugenics gets a bad name because of it’s association with the Nazis, but if you actually look at the tenets of it is eminently sensible. You need to have a real look at it and not just what you think it espouses!

That ‘Social Darwinism’ may have played a part in Nazi ideology is disputed and it certainly had NOTHING to do with Stalin’s purges(show me ANY evidence at all and I’ll nail trifle to your ceiling!).

‘Darwin is one of the wickedest men to ever walk the Earth.’

Nonsense. More wicked than Genghis Khan? Pol Pot? Mao? Don’t be ridiculous.
Just because he argued for a scientific theory which invalidates your particular false ideology, doesn’t make him evil. It is uneducated, ignorant and unintelligent to argue as such. Read a book which isn’t 2000 years old once in a while. Please.

scott

John, there is no disagreement amongst people who know history that Charles Darwin and his book, which came out in 1859, are the root of Naziism, Communism, Fascism, Eugenics, and justification for the basic cruelty that governments perpetuate upon their people.
Hitler loved Darwin, Karl Marx used Evolution as a strong fuel for his fire to push Communism and to proclaim that he aimed to dethrone God and get rid of Him. Of course, such a premise is hilariously silly. A man determining that he could do in a Holy Spirit and dethrone Him. Hmmm, where have we heard that goal/desire expressed before?
Anyway, my point is that Evolution automatically demands one be an Atheist. So, now that God has been gotten out of the way, and we surmise their is no God, we can also get rid of all those pesky biblical laws and rules and the idea that people sin, and that we’ll have to answer to God for everything we’ve said & done after our life is over.
Those ancient ideas are irritating and this whole ‘Right vs. Wrong’ thing holds us back from having the true freedom to live our lives to the highest potential because we keep getting told half the things we want to do are sins.
Now there are no more moral absolutes, it’s your opinion vs. my opinion whether something is ‘right or wrong.’
This is why Hitler said he was doing Mankind a great service by getting rid of the Jews, Stalin felt he had every right to get rid of undesirable people who agitated and worried him, and on & on the list goes.
After, we all just evolved from monkeys which came from a primordial slime pool 1 Billion years ago, so it’s every man/woman for themselves, it’s dog eat dog.
That is what Darwin gave to modern society. I’m not saying that people weren’t like this before Darwin, but he definitely caused multitudes of people to forsake any faith they may have held to exchange it for his unscientific fairy tale.

John Higson

‘The god of Atheism is man.Man is the highest form of life.’

This show a massive misunderstanding of evolution(coming from you, who have only ever listened properly to slanted christian propaganda about it, this is not really a surprise) Just because man is extant now and is the most successful(some would say, plague!) species DOESN’T mean that man is ‘the highest form of life,highest power in the universe’. That is the inference of religious minds that simply can’t or actively won’t understand. Evolution doesn’t work that way, it doesn’t HAVE an end point. It is simply a way for life to adapt and survive the ecological and environmental conditions which exist at the time!

The most successful genus 70 million years ago were the Dinosaurs and had been for approx.100 million years(in comparison we’ve been around for less than 1 million in our present form, less than 30000 years since our near cousin the Neanderthals went extinct…..), then conditions changed radically and a much smaller hedgehog-like insectivore survived the cataclysm and prospered in the aftermath leading to us along with all the other mammals you see now(that we are driving to extinction). That’s how evolution works, not leading towards some hyper-potent superbeing, it’s begetting new bacteria and viruses at a much higher rate than anything else.

I told you you didn’t understand…..

John Higson

‘his daughter Annie got sick, and he begged God to heal her, Annie died.Her death devastated Darwin and he quickly became bitter at God and decided he wanted nothing more to do with God,’

I think you’ll find that he was already a long way down that road before she died. He was delaying publishing his work because he knew that it was in strict opposition to what he had been taught as a christian, it was only the fact that he heard that another biologist (Wallace) was about to publish substantially the same theories and mechanisms that finally prompted him to publish. TBH I don’t know where Annie comes on this exact timeline, but she obviously contributed.

Put yourself in his position, his daughter is dying, he has had a life of being told that Jesus saves and listens to the prayers of the faithful, granting miracles. He doesn’t really believe it’ll do any good, but at this stage it can do no harm, and so he prays, as hard as anyone has ever prayed, maybe he even believes it might help, in the extremity of his hope. And she dies anyway. Wouldn’t that be the last nail in the coffin? For Anybody? It certainly wouldn’t strengthen anybodies faith at the very least and probably was the straw that broke the reluctant naturalist’s back!

How many times have you heard the old saw ‘There are no atheists in a foxhole’? It’s so well know because it’s so common. Why wouldn’t you call on something, even if you’re pretty certain it doesn’t exist, if you were hopeless?

There, of course, is the other story, of his deathbed reconversion. Made up by a devout member of his family as propaganda, but denied by everyone else. Of course christian incessantly spout this, they like asserting things without evidence. And so what if he did? He was in that foxhole again wasn’t he?

John Higson

‘It’s plain to see by your childish replies that have no substance you can only result to ad hominem attacks.’

I think we’ve put that one to bed now, haven’t we?

John Higson

I see by your lack of new arguments that you appear to have admitted defeat. Very noble and scientific of you to change your position when presented with new evidence, well done! You have my admiration.

scott

No John, I haven’t admitted defeat, I just got very busy in Dec. and haven’t had the time to reply to much of anyone.
I think I mentioned that I still have never seen a shred of evidence for macro evolution; I’m still waiting to see a fish turn into a monkey then into a man. Or a crocodile into a bird, or whatever. It is impossible for one species to turn into a totally different species.
Also, no mutation has ever improved the genome of any creature. Mutations are always a detrimental thing, they do not propel the creature into a better state that it was before.
And another thing: why is it that we never see living creatures that are in the middle of evolving from one species into another? Darwin said there would be evidence of this in the fossil record (lots) or he was wrong.
I think Minotaur and Pegasus type creatures are only fairy tales.

Remember John: a minor adaptation within a species, in which the species stays the species it is, is not Darwin’s evolution. The microbe-fish-monkey-man kind.
It is merely a minor adaptation. Very different from evolution.

Bob332

I guess when your day’s are over on this earth ….you will the find the answer looking at you face to face! Good luck!

DYS

There are theories which involve matter / anti-matter and/or collisions of universes.

Yes it is tragic to hear people say how great it is that the faiths are coming together, knowing that only those without faith could think such a thing. And little by little everything that was important in our history being washed away by the great lie that is complacence & selfishness to become slaves to Satan. The teachers have much to be ashamed of!

jakethepup

See moron that is the difference in a nutshell. You have no concept of FAITH. You know nothing about Christianity.

John Higson

Christianity, while being mostly harmless and by far the least evil of the monotheistic religions, is still based on laughably weak evidence and should be rejected by all peoples with an IQ higher than 80. I mean, walking on water? Raising someone from the dead? Water into wine? Parlour tricks at best and outright lies at worst. If somebody did these things today you would DEMAND evidence. I know PLENTY about Xianity having been indoctrinated in it for 18 years.

I reject ‘faith’, it is a stupid or corrupt man’s excuse for believing fairy tales and nonsense.

jakethepup

See John you don’t know. You’re talking about religion. I’m talking about faith…. BIG DIFFERENCE. To tell you the truth walking on water, water into wine, worldwide floods, raising the dead… all of this means nothing to me and it has nothing to do with faith. It’s OK though many “Christian” make the same mistake.
I am reasonably sure that there are many things in your fantasy world that are supported by hard factual evidence yet you have faith that those things are true and exist.

John Higson

And the word games start……

Religion or Faith, it’s all the same, a crutch for the weak minded and spiritually spineless.

jakethepup

Now John you are not even worth taking to. Word games, really? If you don’t see the difference you are truly ignorant on the subject. I frankly don’t care what you believe I debate you because I am always amazed that people like you are bothered so much by any thought that doesn’t match yours. And why only Christianity? How many times have you said anything about other faiths? Been on a Muslim site lately?
I’m sure like Obama you believe that climate change is the number one problem facing America. I happen to disagree with that but could care less if you buy it. Don’t care.

John Higson

You’re not going to give this up are you?

You’ll keep arguing on irrelevancies because you KNOW you can’t win on the substantivenesses, if I were in your position, hopelessly outclassed, I’m pretty sure that I would just walk away. I’m pretty sure that you’re not self aware enough to see this though, you have my sympathy.

jakethepup

Geee Johnny I hope you feel better now. I’ll bet your head hurts. Yes I am giving up. There is no winner
here you won’t change and neither will I. It is always a waste of time arguing with socialists as far gone as you obviously are. I think the biggest difference between you and I is that I actually understand why you see religious faith as you do. I understand that there is no concrete proof and i don’t care how you feel. You on the other hand feel that people who do believe are just stupid. Socialists rarely have any tolerance for people that don’t follow the leader. Because of that I feel truly sorry for you.
Be happy Johnny.

Disqusid123

Glad I arrived late and didn’t get drawn into the banter with Mr. Higson. I find Mark 6:11 applicable in this situation.

Para Clete

Jesus Christ is the FUTURE, His Holy City in Jerusalem in the New Heaven
and New Earth and those who have been sanctified by His Word and by His Blood.

The rest of the beast following world will be no more, those who refused to believe in the only begotten Son of God, full of Grace and Truth.

John Higson

First of all, Evolution is not an ideology, it is a scientific theory(and a scientific theory is not what YOU think it is, it is not a conjecture with no supporting evidence).

I do not believe that this man (Veith) was ever an atheist. I also don’t believe that he believes he was either. I believe he is telling a lie in the hope that by telling it he brings some waverers to the word of God. Preachers have done this since the beginning of the human race. They think that they are doing good by trying to convince others that what they believe is the truth and anyway of convincing others is fair game.

I was a believer until I was 13-14, and then I grew up. Religion is for the weak minded and spiritually spineless and it always will be.

I can see why some people would be convinced that the origins of life and evolution through natural selections are in opposition to a creator, because they are! Evolution negates god, he is not needed. That we don’t have a solid idea how abiogenesis occurred doesn’t mean that it didn’t and at this stage of the game using a ‘god of the gaps’ argument to fill in the uncertainty is intellectually unsatisfying to almost any person of a scientific bent(me and LOTS of others) or a non-supernatural worldview.

Veith speaks well and persuasively, but I don’t buy a word of it. His whole worldview is simple. It starts with god and goes from there. If what you are saying conflicts with god, it’s wrong. HE IS WRONG, CATEGORICALLY, OBJECTIVELY AND FACTUALLY! There is scanty, insignificant, partial evidence for god, there is a mountain of basically irrefutable evidence for evolution.

Read any book by Richard Dawkins with an open mind and you will change yours, I can almost promise. Confirmation bias is a terrible thing and most of us have it bad, try to go around it. You’ll be glad you did.

scott

I believe (my own personal opinion) that by 2030 we will be in the 42 month Great Tribulation and Jesus will be coming back any day.
I also question the Pre Trib Rapture theory. I don’t find much evidence to support it. I do, however, find Biblical evidence for a Post Trib Rapture.
I pray to God with full strength and earnestness that I am wrong and missing out on the proof.

scott

Oh my glob. The staements you make are idiotic. Faith is a weakness and a fairy tale?
You exercise faith every day!
When you work to earn money, you have faith that that same cash is going to pay your bills.
When you sit in your chair, you have faith that it will not break, but support you without fail.
When you go out & about on your daily errands and necessary tasks, you have faith that you will return home safely.
There is a chance you could be killed, hit bit a car, falling tree, attacked by a dog, etc.
Without faith, you would never go out of your house. Of course, the main thing you have faith in is yourself. And your not faultless and powerful.
How is it stupid for us to trust in an Almighty being that is far greater than we are?
I am a skeptic. I do not just buy into something because a bunch of sheeple say it’s true.
But I see mountains of evidence to trust in the Lord and I have seen Him answer prayers that were so incredible that they are physically impossible to qualify as coincidences. The evidence is incontrovertible.

John Higson

Nonsense.

spirited

This will happen as the Catholic is Antichrist in format. And they failed in WW2. As they coluded with Hitler. God had other ideas. And our God will always be ahead in prophecy. Satan will be in the form of a Pope in the Tribulation period of 42 months. To wreak havoc on Earth. When the new world order arrives. Very sad, Jesus will take his Bride soon. Message Believers, away from chaos in the rapture. So this operation has been going on, some time now. For the NWO. America, the tool of the Vatican.

zulov

Perhaps if the world is fortunate enough, your enormous intellect will achieve immortality and you will be able to live on and pass your enormous knowledge to future generations of dim witted humans. With any luck, only you and your type will survive to inhabit the planet and you won’t have to deal with the masses of religious folks at all! Wouldn’t that just be glorious? Gosh, I sure wish I could live in your utopia.

Jas Hall

Darwinian evolution is NOTHING to do with atheism! It is a scientific theory or, if you like, a biological law.
Really? Please explain the biological law & evolution of the Duck-billed Platypus. My friend, you are a poor lost soul who needs to read the Word of God – and beg the Holy Spirit for understanding! Romans
1:17: For in it the righteousness of God is revealed through faith for faith;
as it is written, “He who through faith is righteous shall live.” 18.
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and
wickedness of men who by their wickedness suppress the truth. 19. For what can
be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20. Ever
since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely, his eternal power
and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things that have been made. So
they are without excuse; 21. for although they knew God they did not honor him
as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking and
their senseless minds were darkened. 22. Claiming to be wise, they became
fools, 23. and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling
mortal man or birds or animals or reptiles.

John Higson

Oh dear, another one…….

Why does everyone of a deluded religious bent always think that they have an irrefutable example of something that evolution can’t explain? And then every time I give them an explanation they just disappear, like a light mist at daybreak.

You do realise that this is the 4th example in this thread, don’t you? The human eye, refuted. The second law of thermodynamics, refuted. The evolution of consciousness, refuted. And now the Duckbilled Platypus…..you realise that even if I could give you a chapter and verse(how very biblical….) explanation it wouldn’t matter, because the overwhelming weight of the evidence is STILL on my side! But, here we go……..

(From wikipedia)The platypus and other monotremes were very poorly understood, and some of the 19th century myths that grew up around them—for example, that the monotremes were “inferior” or quasireptilian—still endure.[62] In 1947, William King Gregory theorised that placental mammals and marsupials may have diverged earlier, and a subsequent branching divided the monotremes and marsupials, but later research and fossil discoveries have suggested this is incorrect.[62][63] In fact, modern monotremes are the survivors of an early branching of the mammal tree, and a later branching is thought to have led to the marsupial and placental groups.[62][64] Molecular clock and fossil dating suggest platypuses split from echidnas around 19–48 million years ago.[65]

Platypus

Echidnas

live birth
Marsupials
true placenta Eutherians

Evolutionary relationships between the platypus and other mammals.[66]

The oldest discovered fossil of the modern platypus dates back to about 100,000 years ago, during the Quaternary period. The extinct monotremes Teinolophos and Steropodon were closely related to the modern platypus.[63] The fossilised Steropodon was discovered in New South Wales and is composed of an opalised lower jawbone with three molar teeth (whereas the adult contemporary platypus is toothless). The molar teeth were initially thought to be tribosphenic, which would have supported a variation of Gregory’s theory, but later research has suggested, while they have three cusps, they evolved under a separate process.[67]The fossil is thought to be about 110 million years old, which means the platypus-like animal was alive during the Cretaceous period, making it the oldest mammal fossil found in Australia. Monotrematum sudamericanum, another fossil relative of the platypus, has been found in Argentina, indicating monotremes were present in the supercontinent of Gondwana when the continents of South America and Australia were joined via Antarctica (up to about 167 million years ago).[67][68] A fossilized tooth of a giant platypus species, Obdurodon tharalkooschild, was dated 5–15 million years ago. Judging by the tooth, the animal measured 1.3 meters long, making it the largest platypus on record.[69]

Platypus skeleton

Because of the early divergence from the therian mammals and the low numbers of extant monotreme species, the platypus is a frequent subject of research in evolutionary biology. In 2004, researchers at the Australian National University discovered the platypus has ten sex chromosomes, compared with two (XY) in most other mammals (for instance, a male platypus is always XYXYXYXYXY),[70] although given the XY designation of mammals, the sex chromosomes of the platypus are more similar to the ZZ/ZW sex chromosomes found in birds.[71]The platypus genome also has both reptilian and mammalian genes associated with egg fertilisation.[36][72] Though the platypus lacks the mammalian sex-determining gene SRY, a study found that the mechanism of sex determination is the AMH gene on the oldest Y chromosome.[73][74] A draft version of the platypus genome sequence was published in Nature on 8 May 2008, revealing both reptilian and mammalian elements, as well as two genes found previously only in birds, amphibians, and fish. More than 80% of the platypus’ genes are common to the other mammals whose genomes have been sequenced.[36]

Is that enough for you? I expect you to now vanish……..

Jas Hall

John, the limey expert: Wikipedia? Now there’s an accurate reference. Considering that any crackpot can post assorted ramblings, driven by their personal, secular worldview. Try reading the Holy Bible, the ONLY reliable source of information on the planet, then you can draw scientific conclusions through the lens of the Truth!

John Higson

You think that the desert ramblings of goat herders in the middle east between 2 and 3 thousand years ago are more reliable than peer edited articles in the biggest encyclopedia know to the human race? Really?

Wikipedia used to be unreliable, because idiots would edit it when they were unqualified to do so. Those days are gone. People like my Dermatologist brother and actual experts in their own fields tend to correct the misinformation and maintain some form of quality control.

The bible on the other hand is a series of documents written on or before 2000 years ago by desert nomads in an as yet unknown language which have been translated innumerable time, often with mistakes, and is presented as the inerrant word of a Sumerian war god who was sequestered by the Jews and proclaimed ‘the one true dog!’. Which of these would any rational person put their trust in?

That you think that the bible is –

“Holy Bible, the ONLY reliable source of information on the planet”!!!!!

Says a lot more about your level of education and your mental health than anything anybody else could dream up about you! I’ve looked at all the religions, stood back and considered them, weighed up the pros(there aren’t any, with maybe the exception of heaven, but only idiots believe that!) and cons and decided that they are all nonsense, beneath contempt and vehicles for psychopaths/sociopaths to control and profit from the gullible. I want none of it.

Only those with a genetic dearth of imagination would read the turgid nonsense, soporific bilge that is the monotheistic scriptures and be inspired by them. Richard Dawkins’ prose is a thousand times more inspiring and factual than anything written by religious apologists. I highly recommend it, but know that you won’t go anywhere near it because it scares you and you lack the moral courage of your convictions. After all why read something that makes you think, when you can sit pat in your erroneous beliefs and think that you are saved? I wish I could be there to see you realise that you have wasted so much of your existence in believing nonsense, but of course I’ll be gone to the void as well. Embrace it, you’ll feel free of the TV camera in the sky!

Jas Hall

“….ramblings of goat herders in the middle east between 2 and 3 thousand
years ago are more reliable than peer edited articles in the biggest
encyclopedia know to the human race?”
I wouldn’t want to be in your trembling shoes when you are forced to your knees before the God of the universe on judgement day. Then, you’ll have to explain to the Almighty why you have doubted His infallible, inerrant Word and called Him a liar! And don’t forget to remind Him that He has the mental capacity of a Middle Eastern goat herder. You see, poor John, you have failed to read the scriptures I gave you earlier, where God, in His infinite wisdom, described people such as yourself, in Romans, chapter one. You never addressed the FACT that over 300 Bible prophesies have been fulfilled, just the way they were predicted hundreds of years earlier. Could a goat herder achieve this miraculous feat? Are you afraid to study the best selling book in the history of the world? Here’s another fun fact for you: Because the Bible contains scripture inspired by God Himself, you can compare It’s writings to any of man’s reference/history books and see that it falls in a reasonable sync with the annuls of every world history reference book. As I mentioned before, The Bible IS the most historically accurate of any document. And please stop it with the tired, “multi-translation, mis-translation” clap trap. You haven’t a clue about the thousands of hours of scholars’ toil in ensuring the accuracy of the Scriptures. You, John, seem to want to put your faith in Dawkins, but trust me, he’s not the smartest mind in the world if he’s an Atheist; he’s merely a fool in God’s eyes. Maybe you could call on Dawkins to represent you when you’re on trial at the Great White Throne Judgement?
So who will you put your absolute trust in – The Perfect, Holy, inerrant, infallible, Almighty Creator and Sustainer of the entire universe – or an imperfect, fallible man? Choose carefully and wisely, or you could spend eternity wishing you had studied the only reliable resource you had available during your short time on the planet!

The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can understand it?
Jeremiah 17:9.

Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?

1 Corinthians 1:20

For the wisdom of this world is folly with God. For it is written, “He catches the wise in their craftiness,”
1 Corinthians 3:19

He takes the wise in their own craftiness; And the counsel of the cunning is carried headlong.
Job 5:13

John Higson

I don’t think I’ve ever experienced so many head-slapping moments of misunderstanding and downright ignorance in one post before(and I’ve already read the other new one you’ve posted!), but I’m going to remain patient in the face of your unjustified arrogance and TRY to correct your errors. I know that you are lost to the iron age nonsense, but if I can even move you one tiny iota from the self satisfied position of certainty in your pretty idiotic delusions then my work here will have been worth the neck high excrement I’ve had to fight my way through to achieve your angstrom of retreat!

One ground rule. Don’t quote scripture at me, it just makes me angry and less likely to pay any attention to you. If you quote it again I’ll ignore you until we are both dust and gone and all that’s left of us is our genetic endowment to the next generation. I won’t be seeing you anywhere after my biological engine stops, there is nowhere.

‘although hundreds of skeletons of Basilosaurus have been found, and hundreds of whale skeletons, nothing which would qualify as intermediate between these two has been found.’

This illustrates both the dishonesty of the creationists and the impossibility for us scientists to win this argument. You say there are no intermediate fossils, we show you one, you say there are no intermediates between this intermediate and the creature which exists today, in effect we have just created another two ‘gaps’ in the fossil record, one before the intermediate and one after it!! Until we come up with a perfect succession of millions of fossils, from parent to child forever, you and your like will never accept it! Can you not see the blind ignorant unreasonableness of this? Any intellectually honest person could.

Also you make the mistake of thinking that everything is fossilized, when in fact the process of fossilization is a vanishingly rare and precious process which can only give us a imperfect picture of evolutionary processes. Nonetheless the evolution of whales from their land living ancestors is very, very well understood and quite extensively illustrated by the video I posted, the fact that you don’t even try to refute this yourself or even probably watched it and need to fall back on the plainly loony and ideologically driven ‘answers from genesis’ is illustrative in itself. Did you really read that(from 1996!) and think in your heart of hearts that it refuted ANYTHING from the video I posted? Really? REALLY? Shockingly weak, my deluded non-friend, SHOCKINGLY WEAK! Must do better.

‘biblical record of a worldwide flood’

One question. Where has all the water gone? Seriously if the whole planet was covered, including all the mountains(that’s up to, at least, 15000 feet, Mt.Ararat =just over 16000 feet) below Mt Ararat, then where is it? That’s millions, probably billions of CUBIC MILES of water! WHERE DID IT ALL GO? You need to give me an answer, and one that you are not intellectually embarrassed about!

You don’t know this, but I’m a geology graduate, so you’re in trouble if you are going to argue with me about the origins of the earth and fossils and the ages of deposition etc I know exponentially more than the bible, your preachers and any prophet there has ever been. It’s probably best if you except what I say while checking it out for yourself. After all, I wouldn’t want you appealing to authority as that is a logical fallacy, you need to satisfy yourself of the truth of my points. You’ll feel liberated when you have. And I’ll welcome you to rationality like a prodigal(oh, the irony!) son!!!

‘creatures are found in the same rock layers, many of which span entire continents’

Here we have a perfect example of a tiny seed of knowledge being a very dangerous and misleading thing. You do realise that there are literally millions of layers of different types of rock, some with fossils, most without, both continuous and discontinuous, everywhere, all over the planet, don’t you??? Now, in your ignorance and delusion, you tell me which particular one, or series of beds, or whole suite of interconnected, through time and geography and fossil sequence, structures is the one which relates to the biblical flood? PLEASE ENLIGHTEN ME!!!!!??

‘DNA points to a common designer, not a common ancestor’

Where is your evidence for this assertion? And you say you trust science(because it isn’t a belief, you don’t need to ‘believe’, you have evidence!). There is evidence for a common ancestor, there is ZERO evidence for a creator. Sad for believers, but they just need to suck it up and move on.

Your whole paragraph on DNA is so rife with logical fallacies it’s difficult to know where to start, so I’m not going to bother. Get yourself a course in genetics, or even a non-creationist, objective book. That will explain it better than I ever could. It’s all out there if only you have the moral courage to look for it and act as a real scientist, know that you know nothing and let the evidence lead you, don’t start from god and anything which contradicts him and his creation is wrong. That’s what an honest person with integrity would do. I’ll say that you take Dawkins’ quotation out of context, as he knew you would, that was his point in making it! Have you actually read a whole book by him? That should be your starting point.

Macro-evolution is BEAUTIFULLY illustrated by the video that you claim to have watched. If you can watch that and still honestly claim to deny it’s reality and factual status then you truly are lost. Another beautiful example is Archeopteryx, the transitional fossil between reptiles and birds, showing half of the features of each. The old argument against this fossil was that it was so perfectly illustrative of evolution that it must be a fraud(and in fact this was the position of the creationists) until more examples of it were found. They have been strangely silent on it ever since! How’s that for intellectual dishonesty? Does that not tell you all you need to know about your side of this argument? It certainly does me.

Abiogenesis, though there are elegant and persuasive conjectures about how it might have happened, is essentially unexplainable. It only has to have happened once! You can find lots of pretty satisfying explanations of it but little in the way of evidence. We just don’t know. Probably never will. But your go to argument of god just raises more and intractable questions. You have no better answers, just faith, and as I said that’s for halfwits and children.

And now in your dishonesty, you try to co-opt science. Unbelievable.-

‘because he has made it clear through science’

You’re are actually claiming that the very tool which goes furthest to making god irrelevant, is being used by him to disprove himself! You are beyond ridicule and lack the self awareness to see it. It’s sad, it really is, and pathetic(meaning it inspires pity). You are a completely brainwashed robot and I do pity you.

‘What is your basis for morality without God?’

ANOTHER terrible old argument which has been refuted on innumerable occasions, but like the revenant it is, it keeps coming back from the dead. DO SOME READING THAT ISN’T THE bible FFS! It’s so unbelievably easy to find answers to this nonsense that I’m embarrassed to have to tell you, use google!

You don’t read what I type do you? Please answer point by point next time, like I do to you!

I refuse to have anything to do with your god and I renounce heaven, I don’t want it! I’m happy to live my span and be finished. I embrace the nothing! I was nothing before I was conceived and I will be nothing afterward. I’m happy with that and at peace with it. You cannot say the same! Your bowels loosen at the hint that your life ends at death and you live your life frightened that you may fail the test of the great CCTV camera in the sky. I feel your fear! And thank the flying spaghetti monster I don’t feel it! I’m free, but you never will be, always looking over your shoulder. I still say that if it does come to a judgement by a perfect being, I’ll be ok, it’s almost certainly you that has a mountain of horrors to worry about!

John Higson

And I said that I want YOU to give me 10 examples of prophecies which have been fulfilled, not some website, I want YOUR examples. Only 10 of, did you say 3000, that’s 0.3%. 10 please.

John Higson

This open sewer isn’t worth replying to.

Linda

I don’t want to get involved in this back and forth with John. But in my heart I feel and know God. That is how I know He is real. He has changed my life so dramatically and shown me the path I need to take. He has put people in my life that have pulled me away from a very dark place where suicide at times seemed the best route. I am sorry John that you do not know Him. He is waiting on you. I find it fascinating that history is continually changing by religion and man. Then true thing I know is the Bible. You know history and are a very smart man. But God is smarter hun.

John Higson

I’m argumentative, Linda. I wish I could just let people believe what they want and leave it at that, but I can’t. See this thread now, this is the 4th person that I’ve ended up in a verbal duel with, and as soon as one drops away(hopefully because they are defeated by my argumentation and appeals to rationality and have been encouraged to look at their world in a different, less supernatural way), another one picks up the baton and thinks they can use the same old arguments to bring me round to their point of view.

Intellectual honesty is key, NOT wishful thinking.

‘But in my heart I feel and know God’

Yes, you ‘feel’ something, but you don’t ‘know’ what that is! So do pagans and jews and wiccans and muslims and hindus and jainists and buddhists and zoroastrians and sun worshippers. They all ‘feel’ something! If they didn’t they wouldn’t self identify with these fallacious religious persuasions. All religious people do(or they are frauds….but that’s another can of worms). If they are so sure that their feelings are correct and they can feel and know that their particular religion is correct and true and unique and singular, what makes you arrogant enough to think that you have got it right, and they are all wrong? That isn’t the humility that your saviour demands, that’s rank, shocking, arrogant superiority! How does that sit with christianity(I’m assuming you are christian, but I could be wrong!)as the (possibly non-existent)philosopher Yeshua taught it? Not very well I would surmise!

‘He has changed my life so dramatically’

Oh, FFS! Give yourself some credit! YOU changed your life! I rejoice for you! You turned it around and are still here. Why does your imaginary friend deserve any of the plaudits? Maybe the idea helped you, but it’s still just an idea, nobody actually sat with you, did they? A mind virus that was planted in your childhood made you think that something outside of yourself intervened, when in fact you found hitherto unknown resources of courage and resilience inside you! I consider that much more laudable.

Have you ever heard of the Council of Nicea? If you haven’t you should research it, I guarantee that you won’t be so confident about the veracity of the bible after you do! The bible is nothing but a political document, twisted and translated and mistranslated and twisted to fit the mores of the time, it is not worth your devotion! Some of the philosophy in the new testament is laudable but the old testament is a chamber of genocidal horrors ordered by god! How could any decent human consider worshipping that god??? It beggars belief!

You sound like a reasonable and well intentioned human being, and I thank genetics for that! Just be aware that you are good because of YOU and not some sumerian war god co-opted by the jews to justify their claims to a scraggly piece of desert two and a half millennia ago!

John Higson

So, have you got ANY answers to my points that don’t require you to quote your temporal nonsense book? No, I thought not. I claim victory by default!

Jas Hall

You really have too much time on your hands, John. Unlike you, I have a life – one that is currently centered around work, the Gospel outreach, apologetics & family during the holiday season. I promise you, my reply will be forthcoming, shortly.
In the meantime, my “temporal nonsense book”, as you call it, is the written Word of the Almighty Creator. And whether you like it or not, some day you will have to bow before Him and explain why you have called Him a liar. And BTW, you shall NEVER have “victory” over God’s Word.

John Higson

I just watched your youtube video on prophesy. Why would god give validation of prophesy to convince people of it’s authenticity when evidence denies faith? I thought faith was more important? Or is god a hypocrite? You should have answers ready for ALL these questions seeing that you are an apologeticist!

I won’t deny that actually reading your stuff, when it is so rife with biblical references and other stuff(answers from genesis etc)is hard, hard work for me, I admit to my confirmation bias, herein lies the difference between us! I try not to use links if I can help it and you should do the same. You need to give me an answer from your own mind on the whereabouts of the flood water though, that is a clincher!

John Higson

If all these prophecies were so accurate,and had been known about for so long and were being watched to see if they were to be fulfilled, why did the Jews, who wrote them, not accept Jesus as their messiah? I mean they’re jewish predictions FFS! If they were so accurate, down to the very day, then why did they reject him, if he was seen to be fulfilling them?

That would suggest that they have been altered subsequently to make them ‘fit’ the narrative that Jesus is the messiah spoken of! Any rational, vaguely objective person can see this hole in your arguments immediately, it took me all of 10 seconds!They had ample time and opportunity to make everything fit after the fact, didn’t they? It’s not like the church, churches etc hasn’t got form in this department , is it? Look at the way historical documents have been changed to mention Jesus, when he was never mentioned in the actual text!(Testimonium Flavianum).

You easily accept these things because you want to accept them. Your self-worth demands of you that you do! You suffer from exquisite and all encompassing confirmation bias of the most extreme type. You can’t and won’t see evidence that points the other way and you’ll almost certainly reject it the more conclusive that it is. As a scientist, I start from the fact that I don’t know anything and follow the evidence. You start from god and if anything throws any doubt on god then the data is wrong. I KNOW your type.

John Higson

So, YOU addressed the rock layers, did you? Nothing but twisted and partial and false and disingenuous nonsense from answers in genesis! How can you just accept stuff from one source, WHICH YOU KNOW TO BE COMPLETELY BIASED TO YOUR POINT OF VIEW??? Did you even read it or was this the stuff that someone else told you to send? I can understand why this source might APPEAR to be impressive to someone who doesn’t know, but it’s simply too riddled with half-truths and outright falsehoods and(probably deliberate)misunderstandings to be taken seriously! How do you think your false god would view the deliberately mendacious people who tell barefaced lies to convince the faithful that science poses no threat to their beliefs? They’ll be going straight to hell!! It’s an outrageous sin and a moral crime of epic dimensions!

I’m not liking your chances of salvation if this is your best efforts! You understand that by your tenants passing on demonstrably false information is a lie by omission(in that you omitted to check your sources and be certain they tell the truth) and will stop you from getting into heaven? You really, really must try harder! Or are you just a hypocrite?

You didn’t answer my question about the water in the flood. Time to put up or shut up. This is the reason I’ve never lost this argument, because nobody has an answer and it’s why you’ve lost, god on your side or not. WHERE ARE THE BILLIONS OF CUBIC MILES OF WATER ?

We go no further until you answer this question. You have one week. Realise people are watching this, your credibility is massively on the line, as is your ego.One week, as long as it took you to come up with this pile of excrement laced with bible references which I TOLD YOU not to use. One week. When you don’t answer and lose, it will be the best christmas present I’ve ever had!

One week……..

John Higson

Oh dear, if you are the best that apologetics and gospel outreach has got it’s no wonder that young americans are rejecting your brand of hocus-pocus nonsense in massively increasing and record breaking numbers! Before you know it, you and your kind will be as irrelevant in the US as your ilk are in Europe and the rest of the world!

Let’s face it you’ve been losing the fight for centuries, if we’re honest! The more educated people become the less the nonsense you peddle appeals to them, that’s just the way it is. If you want to keep expanding, and that’s what your non-existent sky-daddy is purported to want you’ll have to try somewhere else(Africa and it’s teeming millions comes to mind).

Now, we’ll have to define victory, won’t we? I’d say 50% non-religious would constitute a victory from my point of view. In my family there are 7 members, my parents and 5 children. Both my parents were believers(Dad was a protestant and Mum is still a catholic). All 5 children are atheists/agnostics despite being indoctrinated as catholics as children, I’d certainly call that victory! We all got there independently, too! 0 for 5! Just shows what happens when people get a good education! Wait…..I can see and hear you being smug and complacent and arrogant with the thought forming or formed in your mind ‘Well, that’s catholicism for you!’ Trust me, it would have been earlier if it had been any other denomination! I loved my school and all the priests, I just didn’t accept the god nonsense after about 14 at about the time my brain matured. Pity yours hasn’t yet, but there’s still time!

‘my “temporal nonsense book”, as you call it, is the written Word of the Almighty Creator’

Eeerrrrrrr, I thought it was the divinely inspired word, written by fallible and fallen men? And where is your evidence that it’s not just made up by con-men on the make? What about all the apocrypha and the other stuff which was excluded from the bible at Nicea? Is that not all divinely inspired, too? And if not, how do you decide? You do realise that none of it was written until at least 2 generation after he supposedly lived? That’s a bucketload of time for chinese whispers to mess up the message! I could go on about this for days, I’ve had these exact arguments before and never lost……

I’ve already said to you, if I have to stand in front of Him/Her/It at some judgement after my life is over, I’ll just tell him the truth, it sounds like the kind of stuff that men would make-up to control and exploit the weak minded and spiritually fearful, carefully concocted over centuries and millennia so as to be impossible to prove or disprove, with zero evidence that a rational and educated person would accept as conclusive! As Bertrand Russell said ‘No enough evidence, your honour! Not enough evidence!’. As a scientist I would tend to go along with almost every other scientist who matters in the world these day and live my life as though there is no creator, because the odds are that there isn’t. And if you lived a good life, if it’s a reasonable intelligence we’ll be ok anyway!

John Higson

‘ your first position was that the Bible is inaccurate and then when I proved it is accurate, you changed your position, claiming that they had been altered after the fact, therefore admitting their historical accuracy!’

I’m not sure if you know this, or if you even have the intellectual equipment to be able to understand it, but what you are using here is a circular argument! It goes something like this, and is very common amongst biblical literalists.-

‘What the bible says is true, because it says so in the bible. god wrote what it says in the bible because it says in the bible that god wrote it.’

This does not make for a consistent or logical argument! Also I don’t think that at any point you actually ‘proved’ anything. There is no internal logical consistency to your argument above. My position is that the bible is not a historically accurate document, I mean come on, The 4 gospels of the new testament don’t even agree on the circumstances of Yeshua’s parlour trick of fooling people into believing he came back to life do they? How many different people were supposed to have been first to see him. Different people and different stories! Wouldn’t stand up in a court of law, would it?

You are using verses from the bible to prove that the bible is accurate, eg-

‘They rejected Him because of their own self righteousness and because they were not born from above (John 3:3,19-20)’

Do you see how someone that doesn’t automatically utterly accept that everything said in the bible is factual might not consider this as good evidence? We don’t accept that the bible is true because the bible says it’s true! Your exasperated tone when assuming it is patently obvious that the Jews would reject Yeshua because of their arrogance, is nonsense! What else is it going to say, it’s christian propaganda FFS! What do Jewish writings of the time(and even now!)say about Jesus as the messiah? They certainly don’t accept it!!!!!!!!! And if he had filled all the criteria as embellished in the old testament as it stood at the time, why wouldn’t they? Why not change their minds and accept him now? You’ve got to realise this isn’t stacking up!

John Higson

I need you to think about this. Don’t just fall back on the nonsense that the creation institute or answers in genesis trot out(because these are nonsense), I NEED YOU TO REALLY,REALLY THINK ABOUT THIS!

If, during the biblical flood, the whole world was totally flooded up to 15000 feet above sea-level(because mount Ararat is 16,500 feet high and this is where the ark came to rest, I believe). Where has all that water gone? The earth’s surface area is 200 million square miles. If the whole earth was covered by an average depth of 15000 feet of water(15000 feet = ~3.5 miles) that means there was 3.5X200 million=750 million cubic miles of water EXTRA TO WHAT THERE IS NOW! Where has this water gone? It can’t have gone into space, the earth has too much gravity for water molecules to escape. It can’t have gone into the earth because geophysics doesn’t show any sub-surface oceans(and certainly not even a million CUBIC MILES OF WATER!).

SO WHERE HAS THE WATER GONE?

Also, There are millions and millions of extant species. How did they all fit into the ark? We have a good idea how big it was do we not? How did they all fit? And who mucked out all the excrement? Also, what did the carnivores eat?

One last time I say, where did all the water go? You do realise how much 750 million cubic miles is don’t you? I beg of you to think, long and hard, before you answer me. THINK.

John Higson

‘most of the water (which now covers over 70% of the Earth) was contained in subterranean chambers’

Utter BS! Where is your evidence for this nonsense assertion? Show me one such ‘chamber’ and I’ll consider giving you a break! And by chamber I don’t mean an aquifer, that dog ain’t gonna hunt. Aquifers are porous and permeable rock which contain water between the grains. They are basically solid rock with a little water between the grains, not ‘chambers’! There are no underground oceans or anything approaching being similar to such.

Once again, you cannot use the bible as evidence that the bible is factually true. It’s a circular argument!

John Higson

‘ Do you see how flawed reasoning and assumptions can lead to erroneous conclusions?’

Do YOU not see that your biases allow you to believe the most unbelievable horse excrement to guard your ego from the realisation that you have constructed a reality based on, AT BEST, highly questionable and at worst utter, utter nonsense with a weird and incredible cherry on top!

‘you are assuming they were as active on the Ark as they would be in the wild, not to mention the age and size of the animals’

You’re SERIOUSLY telling me that they were all babies and in some form of suspended animation? Seriously? When NONE of these details are even mentioned in any scripture! So you are second guessing YOUR GOD! Everything he writes is perfect, but he’s just really, really bad at including all the DETAILS! You don’t have a very high opinion of this perfect, infinite wondrous being , do you?

Look, to be absolutely serious for a moment, I have a degree in geology, I know about mountains and sedimentary beds and the timescales of such. You are talking nonsense. I COULD be wrong about Jesus and the new testament stories, it’s highly unlikely that the more fantastical elements are even close to being in the region of being true, but he could have existed and been as good a philosopher as the texts suggest, BUT, the old testament and especially the flood is complete excrement. Provably and certainly as far as the ‘worldwide’ (world at the time being the middle east and north africa, things like the American continents not being imagined or known about!) flood is concerned.

And you still haven’t told me where all the water has gone!!!!!

John Higson

‘Your argument that many supposedly inspired books were left out of the Canon of scripture is laughable.’

Have you never heard of the council of Nicea? Then explain it and why the 4 gospels that were chosen, were chosen?

‘ never considered as inspired by any legitimate Apostle’

You mean Yeshua’s Apostles? The ones who were all dead by the time even the earliest gospels were written? The consensus is that the first of the accounts of Yeshua’s life weren’t written until about AD 70, that’s about 2 generations after his supposed death and with the exception of Paul’s writings there were no written accounts until then( Paul didn’t mention any of Yeshua’s acts AT ALL!). That’s 40 years of chinese whispers and oral tradition, a long time for all the stories to be royally messed up! Your arguments are laughably weak, and objectively without firm foundations! I’d get some better ones if I were you…….

AirborneSoldier

Most churches today believe in Universalism, which is apostate. As for blame, look in the mirror. Americans have done little to preserve liberty. For too many years we have demanded the cheapest crap, and driven jobs overseas. We have allowed the Godless communist left to over-regulate our jobs out of existence. We have 9nly ourselves to blame.

scott

Ok, John, let’s get some things sorted here, shall we.
1. I am not pushing ‘religion.’ I hate religion. It’s a silly superstitious set of beliefs that mankind has to do all kinds of works and sacrifices to please some mean nasty tempered god, or else.
Christianity is NOT a religion. In fact, it’s the UNreligion (if I may borrow from 7UP). The Bible teaches the very opposite of what all religions teach.
It teaches that God loves mankind, so much so, that He died in our place so we don’t have to spend a miserable eternity separated from Him. No works required! Just joyfully recieve it, believe the Lord is who He says he is, and repent of your sins.
2. Archaeopteryx and it’s very similar friend “Xiaotingia Zhengi,” have both been reclassified as Velociraptors. The evidence that either one actually had feathers is minuscule and inconclusive.
After comparing these creatures with birds and dinosaurs, researchers concluded neither is directly related to birds.
As for Lungfish, flying fish, and flying squirrel, they have always been what they are, they were not a different creatures in the past.
Lions and tigers are different, yes, but they are both still felines.
3. What do you do with Duckbill Platypus? Did he evolve from a beaver, a duck, or some other creature?
4. The outright dishonesty of Darwinists pushing evolution is another nail in the coffin. Piltdown Man was concocted from the lower jawbone of an orangutan cobbled with the cranium of a fully developed modern human. They filed down the teeth to make it look lake a Neanderthal. Of course, evolutionists drew all kinds of lovely pictures of an ape man with a spear in his hand out hunting to feed his family as if they had photographic proof, LOL!
Nebraska Man turned out, after lavish scenarios and stories were concocted to push the lie that this was a glorious find of proof for Darwin’s fairy tale, to be only the tooth of an extinct pig. Not even a money or an ape, hahaha!
There are also other examples of outright trickery and dishonesty that Evolutionists have used. At first, they look like they’ve finally gotten some real proof, but after a few years of unbiased investigation, their ‘amazing discovery” turns out to be total bollocks.
5. Carbon 14 is a highly unreliable tool for proving the age of things older than about 1500 years. Evolutionists have used it to constantly tell us the Earth is over 4 billion years old, but they have no proof, they are only guessing. They are also assuming that the rate of decay for things long ago is precisely the same rate as it is now. That is a liberty they make not take as it is more than just a “bridge too far.” In fact, living creatures have been Carbon 14 tested and they’ve been dated at hundreds of thousands and even millions of years old. Very sad 🙁
6. I’ve personally watched interviews with 2 of the top geneticists in the world proclaim that Darwin’s evolution cannot possibly be correct as it violates so many genetic laws.
7. Mathematics disproves Darwin’s evolution. The mathematical chance of a universe so well balanced and harmonious, with trillions of heavenly bodies all in perfect synch, and an Earth that is “just right” for life to exist, is so astronomically high, the chances are literally impossible.
For such an amazing universe, and our own highly complex human bodies, to just show up and be so fine tuned and well ordered to be a product of sheer chance takes an enormous amount of faith.
I just don’t have that much faith, John.
I guess you do, so you’ve got me beat on the faith manifestation scale.

John Higson

Lions and tigers are different, yes, but they are both still felines.’

Another massive misunderstanding! Lions and Tigers are FELIDS, but they are different species of felids. Lookup Taxonomy. The family is Felidae, the subfamily is Pantherinae, the genus is Panthera, and the extant species are Panthera Leo,Panthera Tigris,Panthera Onca, Panthera Pardus and Panthera Uncia. Leo and Tigris being Lions and Tigers. They are not the same Species! Again you are wrong and I want an apology! Your god would want you to! Everything I wrote in my last post about breeding and fertile offspring and it being a result of macroevolution still stand! Time for another apology!

scott

Oh my glob, John, listen to yourself.
You know very well I meant that lions and tigers are both big cats. It’s not like I’m comparing sharks with arachnids.
You are the very embodiment of Sheldon Cooper. I’m mean your spot on. I think your motto would be: “I’m smarter than you, therefore I’m always right. If I were wrong, I would know it and I would tell you I’m wrong, but I’m not , I’m smarter than that.” You really take the biscuit.

No, I will not apologize to you, but I will pray for you. You’re ever learning, but never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. Your arrogance and puffed up pride have blinded your eyes and you’ve made atheism an important crusade in your life. If you only would come to know the Lord in a deep, close relationship, all of your guilt and insecurities would melt away and you would be a very different person. The monkey would be off your back (no pun intended).

No matter what classes or categories you put creatures in, they always reproduce after their own kind. That’s the way God set it up from the beginning, and that’s the way it has been ever since.

John Higson

Right, I’m going to explain this slowly carefully as if to an idiot child and recognising that you simply don’t have the intellectual abilities to understand this as it should be understood. It’s a shame, but we’ll probably just have to live with the fact that you’re never going to get this, probably simply because you don’t want to!

1.Speciation occurs slowly and gradually, through a process of genetic drift and rare advantageous and non-fatal mutation.

2. It is happening ALL THE TIME!
i) Goatsbeard wildflowers in the US. 1940’s speciation event around Pullman, Washington.
ii) Fruit Fly(hundreds of them!)Rhagoletis Pomonella.’Note that some of the investigators set out to prove that speciation was not happening; the evidence convinced them otherwise.’
iii) And to show you the nonsense about ‘breeding with their own KINDS’. Analysis of contact between two chromosomal races of house mice in northern Italy show that natural selection will produce alleles that bar interracial matings if the resulting offspring are unfit hybrids. This is an important exception to the general rule that intermixing races will not tend to become separate species because the constant sharing of genes minimizes the genetic diversity requisite for speciation.

etc, etc, etc If you bother to look for it it is ubiquitous!

3.AT no point between a parent and an offspring would you ever say the one is one species and the other is a different species. That’s not the way it works. AT LEAST NOT SO FAR! Maybe if you were to look at 10-100 generation you could say, that this great-great-great whatever and this great-great offspring are different species that could no longer mate and have fertile offspring(Lions and Tigers!!!!) are different species. There is none so blind as he who will not see. If we go back far enough, Dogs and Cats are related, pretty damn closely, but you would never see them interbreeding, same with us and chimps, but our last common ancestor is about 3 million years ago. There is no missing link, but we haven’t found that common ancestor yet! There is a beautiful succession of fossils going back millions of years! All you have to do is look. YOUR problem is you would have to see an ape giving birth to a proto-human, something completely different to it’s parent which is simply never gonna happen, that’s not how it works, but we have enough fossils to give us a damn good idea!

Speaking of how ‘God set it up’, so bats are birds are they? Because that’s what it says in the bible! Provably wrong and halfwitted. Therefore the bible MUST be wrong ALL THE WAY THROUGH, must it not? Just thought I’d throw that in for spice!

scott

LOL! Oh Sheldon, er, I mean, John, once again your nitpicking in the adaptation field and misconstruing what I’m saying. You’re also doing your darnedest to avoid the load of evidence I’ve given you which proves you are your Darwin crew are grasping desperately to believe a fairy tale.
With genetics, mathematics, geology, and the fossil record against you, you still insist that your fairy tale is true.
BTW: here’s another blow against the Darwin empire: Lucy, whom evolutionists glowingly pushed as solid proof of a close relative between humans and apes (even that fascist Muslim idiot Hussein Obama was crowing “yup yup”), has now turned out to be nothing more than a plain old ape who died 4,ooo or 5,ooo years ago.
Because a set of clearly human footprints were found in the area, evolutionists just tacked on human feet to Lucy (whose feet were missing) like they were playing with Mr. Potato Head. It’s a tactic they’ve used for over a century. They said Lucy was 4oo,ooo years old, but humans weren’t supposed to have evolved yet, so now they’re stuck with a pre human ape with modern human feet! LOL! Professing themselves wise, they became fools.

Even the very existence of fossils disproves Darwin’s folly. How so?
What happens when a creature dies? The vultures, ravens, insects, bacteria, etc. come quickly to clean it up (usually starting within 24 hrs). The Flood of Noah would have covered over all of the dead plants and animals within 24 hrs or less, thereby preserving them in an almost freshly killed state, which is now often found. But evolutionists say, “No, it took many years for those dead plants and animals to be covered over and fossilized.” Wrong again, simpletons.
Evolutionists go crazy when they see 3-4 Metre long tree trunks extending thru 5 or 6 different layers of rock which, to them, represent hundreds of millions of years.
And do I even need to go into the depth of cosmic dust which was proven to be less than 5 cm when Neil Armstrong walked around on the Moon. If the Moon was over 4 billion years old, the dust would have been well over 15 Metres deep. Neil would have been tunneling thru it.
Then the Coelacanth fishes came to be found alive & well and once again, Darwin’s crew had egg all over their faces.
Your knowledge of the Holy Bible is abysmal. Nowhere does it say bats are birds. In fact, the Holy Bible is not a science technical manual, it was never meant to be, that’s not it’s purpose. God gave us some basic information about the beginning of the Earth and all life upon it. He didn’t feel the need to go into great detail about species, genus, phylum, etc. For you to expect such depth out of the Holy Bible is like demanding a history textbook to tell you every one of the names of the men who built the US railways, what size tools they used, and what time they rose up in the morning and went to bed in the evening. That’s NOT their purpose. You demand too much.
Again, you refuse to address the true reason for your dogged hold upon Darwinism (like all of you lot do). You cringe at the thought of having to answer for your actions to a Supreme Being who will hold you accountable. Boiled down to it’s purest form, it’s called REBELLION.

John Higson

‘Your knowledge of the Holy Bible is abysmal. Nowhere does it say bats are birds.’

Leviticus 11:13-19 ‘And these are they which ye shall have in abomination among the fowls —–And the stork, the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat

Once again, I’m due a grovelling apology. Do you even know the bible? It appears that I know it better than you. A real apology this time, with the word ‘SORRY’ included, and ‘I WAS WRONG’, would suffice!

scott

You’re right, the bat is most certainly not a fowl/bird.
But what you fail to understand is that the Bible is NOT a science technical manual.
This law was written to people who possessed very little scientific knowledge, and so the bat was included into the “flying things” column so that the people could understand it.
If the Lord had said: “And of the flying mammals, in the classification phylum Chordata, subphylum Vertebrata, order Chiroptera, you may not eat,” the people would have had no idea what He was talking about. The Law was written on a level that they would understand.

I’m sorry the Lord didn’t write the Law according to your desire for deeper scientific classifications……….

John Higson

Stop making excuses! Either it is divinely inspired and inerrant or it isn’t.

So you were wrong and I was right,AGAIN. I still don’t see a ‘sorry’…..

John Higson

‘You’re also doing your darnedest to avoid the load of evidence I’ve given you which proves you are your Darwin crew are grasping desperately to believe a fairy tale’

The ‘evidence’ that you’ve sent me has not been peer-reviewed and has never been published in any journal that isn’t affiliated to some biased christian based publication, so DOSEN’T count as evidence and can be dismissed without prejudice. So I have!

‘With genetics, mathematics, geology, and the fossil record against you, you still insist that your fairy tale is true’

That you have the bald faced arrogance and ignorant stupidity to declare that those branches of science back you up is breathtaking and infuriating in equal degree! I have TWO SCIENCE DEGREES,IDIOT! What do you have? And what do you think gives you the right to even have an opinion that anyone should even think about respecting? The fossil record lies within the purview of Geology, genius! How ignorant can one person be?

John Higson

‘cosmic dust’

WTF are you on about? Do you mean the ‘Regolith’ or lunar ‘soil’? You are clearly not capable, qualified or intelligent enough to debate these things having no knowledge whatsoever! Have you even read anything but christian bias material? I would suspect not. How is that being intellectually honest?

Search for Regolith on wikipedia.

‘Regolith covers almost the entire lunar surface, bedrock protruding only on very steep-sided crater walls and the occasional lava channel. This regolith has formed over the last 4.6 billion years from the impact of large and small meteoroids, from the steady bombardment ofmicrometeoroids and from solar and galactic charged particles breaking down surface rocks.

The regolith is generally from 4 to 5 km thick in mare areas and from 10 to 15 km in the older highland regions.[9] Below this true regolith is a region of blocky and fractured bedrock created by larger impacts, which is often referred to as the “megaregolith”.’

Did you read that? 4-5 kms thick in mare and 10-15 km think in highland areas! Do I have to keep on refuting your nonsense?

John Higson

Define ‘Evolutionists’?

When you say this about polystrate fossils, do you mean geologists?Or scientists as a whole? You truly are a fool who resists the truth, not through rebellion, but through blind ignorance and stupidity and the desperate, panic-stricken clingy grasping at a failed and dying ideology that has, maybe, one more generation in the west before it succumbs to the inevitable oblivion of history and goes the way of Jupiter and Thor!

John Higson

‘Nowhere does it say bats are birds’

Just to rub it in, good and hard. YES IT DOES! And now you know it does, you won’t make that mistake again, will you? But unfortunately that EMBARRASSING mistake will be in the bible FOREVER! Can’t say it’s perfect and inerrant now can you? Dog, who wrote the bible(apparently) MADE A MISTAKE!!!!! So he’s not perfect, he isn’t dog and the bible was written by fallible men. You are wrong at every turn! Give it up, you can’t win…….

John Higson

‘ You cringe at the thought of having to answer for your actions to a Supreme Being who will hold you accountable.’

No, I don’t. Everything I’ve ever said to you on the matter says the absolute opposite! Why do you insist on continuing to misrepresent me? Not very christian, is it?

‘God gave us some basic information about the beginning of the Earth and all life upon it.’

Where in the bible does it say that the information that it gives is ‘basic’? Just like the laws governing food and animals and having sex with animals, the bible is a detailed account of how Jews were supposed to live their lives, nowhere does it say or intimate that the information is ‘basic’, that is your inference, and an arrogant one it is too! Who are you to second guess and infer from the divinely inspired word of your perfect imaginary friend?

John Higson

‘For you to expect such depth out of the Holy Bible is like demanding a history textbook to tell you every one of the names of the men who built the US railways’

No it isn’t! It me expecting the perfect and divinely inspired word of dog to be just that, perfect and divinely inspired, which it clearly isn’t! How can ranking bats with birds and endorsing slavery to the nth degree, with rules for beating slaves and even telling the owners to keep the children of slave as slaves because they are property, BE PERFECT?

OK, what does that usually leave? If you answered ‘bones?’, then give yourself a pat on the back! What are 99.9% of fossils? If again you answered ‘incomplete skeletons’, then another pat on the back is in order, because that’s what we get! As I said to you before, the process of fossilisation is vanishingly rare and happens in maybe 1 in a billion cases, if we’re lucky! It needs special condition, including rapid burial and not to much geophysical stress before we find it! Soft parts being preserved is even more spectacularly unlikely, but it sometimes occurs if the fossil was oxygen starved immediately upon dying(like some specimens of Archeopteryx having feathers).

I can actually almost pull apart every sentence you write, you make it too easy. A challenge would be appreciated!

I’ll even give you a hint, look up ‘irreducible complexity’ and internalize what it means, then come back. A christian author called Michael Behe came up with it and it was reasonably effective in stumping ‘evolutionists’ for about 5 minutes. It’s your best shot at intellectual credibility!

John Higson

‘Christianity is NOT a religion. In fact, it’s the UNreligion ‘ !!!!!!!

Oh fiddlesticks!! How can you in one breath claim that Evolution IS a religion and with the next claim that xianity ISN’T? Are you quite sane?

‘It teaches that God loves mankind’

LOL! Yes so much so that if you reject him you’ll spend an eternity burning in hell!! A really loving father that god of yours.

YOU need to repent of your sins Boyo! The ones that you have committed here by writing strong untruths! I can’t believe you say that christianity is different and not a religion, you need help.

I’ll be expecting those apologises soon and so will your imaginary friends, IF you REALLY believe in them……….

scott

LOL! I burst out laughing on this one! 🙂
The only imaginary friends I’ve had is when I was first learning to play the guitar. I used to imagine Led Zeppelin backing me up. LOL! But that’s how teenage boys are sometimes…….

Let me give you a proper definition of “religion:” a system of beliefs requiring works and traditions to earn the favour of a deity.”
Atheism claims to believe in no god, because no god exists. But what makes Atheism a religion is that it deifies Mankind as the highest and wisest life form in the universe, and therefore, man takes the throne of God and makes all the rules about what is right vs. what is wrong.
Now, you keep telling me to repent of all my sins, but you have no logical authority to do so. After all, if there is no God, then who determines what is morally right or morally wrong?
It’s your value system vs. my value system vs. Larry down the road, etc.
Your opinions vs. mine (and good ol’ Larry’s). You have no moral high ground or rock of absolutes to stand on! You, and all Atheists are in a real kerfuffle!

John Higson

‘Let me give you a proper definition of “religion:” a system of beliefs requiring works and traditions to earn the favour of a deity.”

I’ve looked through as many definitions of the word religion as I can find and in none of them does it mention ‘Requiring works and traditions’, not one mention of works or traditions at all. Is this YOUR definition? A very personal definition that you created in your own image and from your own mind, breathing life into the clay? Your sky-daddy won’t be happy with you……….

‘deifies Mankind’

Show me one instance, or quotation or extract of any atheist writer where mankind is deified? I’m sure some atheists do, but that is not what atheism is about, no matter how much YOU or your preacher wants it to be, it just ain’t so!

‘Mankind as the highest and wisest life form in the universe’

Atheism does not say this at all, and neither does Darwin’s biological law of evolution! You are just making this up as you go along! Seemingly because it’s what you WANT to believe! You provide no evidence and no supporting literature, just an assertion! And how would we know that we’re ‘highest in the universe’? Idiotic.

‘After all, if there is no God, then who determines what is morally right or morally wrong?’

Imbecilic Non Sequitur! I don’t accept your assertion of god, but YOU DO! Therefore by your own assertion of god you should/have to live by his rules. BUT YOU DON’T! The hypocrisy is breath-taking and troublingly worrisome, suggesting psychopathy and related pathologies.
Dog is a manmade construct, therefore morality is also manmade, always has been and always will be. It even evolves along with man(see the moral evolution over the last 2-3 centuries on slavery, which I add is ENDORSED in the bible.Dog got that one wrong didn’t he?). Dog is not needed for morality, but maybe religion is, and has played a part. That in no way acts as evidence of dog, because from your point of view atheism is a religion. D’you see how you might tie yourself up in knots over this? Dog is not needed for morality.

scott

I had intended not to answer you anymore, but you are so wrong about the Holy Bible teaching that slavery is endorsed by God (NOT Dog, you blasphemer). You know nothing about Biblical history, nor the Scriptures.
The only slavery allowed is voluntary, temporary endured servant hood. The Scriptures clearly condemn the act of taking a person and forcing him/her into slavery against their will. God hates slavery (Ex 21:16; Deut 24:7; Matt 7:12,19:18).
The blacks who were held as slaves in this country were captured by Muslims and tribal war victors and sold to evil, greedy good ol’ boys who professed, sometimes to be Christians, but were nothing but posers.
I’ll tell you who does approve of slavery: Allah. In fact, the Arabic word for “black” and “slave” are synonymous. Islam has enslaved far more people than just the African blacks of the 17th-19th century. And they continue to run a thriving slave trade today. Example: Boko Haram.
So before you go and make anymore false accusations against the Bible, God, or Christians, you’d better actually read and study what Christianity and Judaism is about.

‘n the New Testament, Jesus frequently refers to slaves in his parables, the witty stories that marked his most distinctive teaching style. He never addresses slavery as an institution, though unfortunately one of the parables assumes that beating a slave is acceptable (Luke 12:47-48). ‘

‘There’s a simple explanation for nineteenth century debates on slavery and the Bible: the Bible isn’t exactly clear on the subject. If anything, the Bible made it easier for slavery’s advocates than for its opponents. On the other hand, Robert E. Putnam and David E. Campbell suggest that while religion contributed greatly in the motivation of abolitionists, their adversaries would have promoted slavery with or without religion.’

And here is what the old and new testament says about slavery. REFUTE THIS!

‘Here are ten passages from the Bible that clearly demonstrate God’s position on slavery:

Genesis chapter 17, verse 12:

And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed. He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised.In this passage God understands that people buy other people and, quite obviously, is comfortable with the concept. God wants slaves circumcised in the same way as non-slaves.

Exodus chapter 12 verse 43:

The Lord said to Moses and Aaron, “These are the regulations for the Passover: No foreigner is to eat of it. Any slave you have bought may eat of it after you have circumcised him, but a temporary resident and a hired worker may not eat of it.God again shows that he is completely comfortable with the concept of slavery and singles out slaves for special treatment.

Exodus Chapter 21, verse 1:

Now these are the ordinances which you shall set before them. When you buy a Hebrew slave, he shall serve six years, and in the seventh he shall go out free, for nothing. If he comes in single, he shall go out single; if he comes in married, then his wife shall go out with him. If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the wife and her children shall be her master’s and he shall go out alone. But if the slave plainly says, ‘I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free,’ then his master shall bring him to God, and he shall bring him to the door or the doorpost; and his master shall bore his ear through with an awl; and he shall serve him for life.Here God describes how to become a slave for life, and shows that it is completely acceptable to separate slaves from their families. God also shows that he completely endorses the branding of slaves through mutilation.

Exodus Chapter 21, verse 20:

If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property.Not only does God condone slavery, but he is also completely comfortable with the concept of beating your slaves, as long as you don’t kill them.

Exodus Chapter 21, verse 32:

If the bull gores a male or female slave, the owner must pay thirty shekels of silver to the master of the slave, and the bull must be stoned.Not only does God condone slavery, but here God places a value on slaves — 30 shekels of silver. Note that God is not sophisticated enough to understand the concept of inflation. It is now 3,000 years later, and a gored slave is still worth 30 shekels of silver according to God’s word.

Leviticus Chapter 22, verse 10:

No one outside a priest’s family may eat the sacred offering, nor may the guest of a priest or his hired worker eat it. But if a priest buys a slave with money, or if a slave is born in his household, that slave may eat his food.Here God shows that the children of slaves are slaves themselves, and that he is completely happy with that concept.

Leviticus Chapter 25, verse 44:

Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. You can will them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.Here God states where you may purchase your slaves, and clearly specifies that slaves are property to be bought, sold and handed down.

Luke, Chapter 7, verse 2:

Now a centurion had a slave who was dear to him, who was sick and at the point of death. When he heard of Jesus, he sent to him elders of the Jews, asking him to come and heal his slave. And when they came to Jesus, they besought him earnestly, saying, “He is worthy to have you do this for him, for he loves our nation, and he built us our synagogue.” And Jesus went with them. When he was not far from the house, the centurion sent friends to him, saying to him, “Lord, do not trouble yourself, for I am not worthy to have you come under my roof; therefore I did not presume to come to you. But say the word, and let my servant be healed. For I am a man set under authority, with soldiers under me: and I say to one, ‘Go,’ and he goes; and to another, ‘Come,’ and he comes; and to my slave, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.” When Jesus heard this he marveled at him, and turned and said to the multitude that followed him, “I tell you, not even in Israel have I found such faith.” And when those who had been sent returned to the house, they found the slave well.Here Jesus shows that he is completely comfortable with the concept of slavery. Jesus heals the slave without any thought of freeing the slave or admonishing the slave’s owner.’

Colossians, chapter 3, verse 22:

Slaves, obey in everything those who are your earthly masters, not with eyeservice, as men-pleasers, but in singleness of heart, fearing the Lord. Whatever your task, work heartily…

Here God shows that he is in complete acceptance of a slave’s position, and encourages slaves to work hard. This sentiment is repeated in Titus, chapter 2 verse 9:

Bid slaves to be submissive to their masters and to give satisfaction in every respect; they are not to be refractory, nor to pilfer, but to show entire and true fidelity.Once again God shows that he is quite enamored of slavery.

God loves slavery

If the Bible is written by God, and these are the words of the Lord, then you can come to only one possible conclusion: God is an impressive advocate of slavery and is fully supportive of the concept.

As you can see, these slavery passages present us with an immense contradiction:

On the one hand, we all know that slavery is an outrage and a moral abomination. As a result, slavery is now completely illegal throughout the developed world.

On the other hand, most Christians claim that the Bible came from God. In God’s Word, the “creator of the universe” states that slavery is perfectly acceptable. Beating your slaves is fine. Enslaving children is fine. Separating slave families is fine. According to the Bible, we should all be practicing slavery today.

The intensity of this contradiction is remarkable. It shows us quite clearly that God is imaginary.

If God were to exist, and if he were playing any role whatsoever on our planet, he would eliminate this connection between himself and slavery. There is no way that a loving God would allow himself to be perceived as condoning and encouraging slavery like this.

Here is the thing that I would like to help you understand: You, as a rational human being, know that slavery is wrong. You know it. That is why every single developed nation in the world has made slavery completely illegal. Human beings make slavery illegal, in direct defiance of God’s word, because we all know with complete certainty that slavery is an abomination.

What does your common sense now tell you about a Bible that supports slavery in both the Old and the New Testaments? Given the fact that the Bible clearly condones slavery, your common sense should be telling you that God is imaginary.’

Game, set and match I think you’ll find. You lose!

scott

Whoa, there! Hold on John McEnroe, don’t count your trophies before they’re cast.
I did a wee bit of research and found that all of these verses you list are talking about bondmen/women, not people who are captured and forced against their will into bondage.
The Hebrew word used for servant/slave is “Ebed” The definition of “Ebed” is: “a bondsman, a person who stands as surety for a payment.” They could sell their labour for 7 years to pay off a debt, either their own debt or someone else’s.
In the New Testament verses, the word is the same, only it’s in Greek of course. The word is “Doulos,” and it means the same thing.
The Holy Bible is very explicitly clear that kidnapping a person is a grave crime punishable by death (Ex. 21:16; Deut. 24:7). Forced slavery, like the black slaves in early America, was strictly forbidden.
When people had worked off their debt, or after 7 years had passed (6 years for a Hebrew Ex 21:2; Deut 15:1), they were to be released as free & clear with all debts forgiven.
As for passing down a servant in your will, a man could pass down the bondsman to his children if he died before the debt was paid or the allotted time was up. The bondsman still had to work for the dead man’s kids to pay off his debt, he didn’t get out of it just because his “master” died.

As for Lev. 22:10-11, you misquoted it.
It reads: There shall no stranger eat of the holy thing; a sojourner of the priest, or an hired servant shall not eat of the holy thing. But if the priest buys any soul with his money, he shall eat of it, and he that is born in his house, they shall eat of his meat.
This verse is speaking about who is allowed to partake of the holy food of the temple. Notice the bought
servant actually gets the right to eat of the food, whereas the hired day labourer does not. No where does this verse imply that the children of bondsmen/women are automatically slaves, or that they can be held for forced bondage.
As for the Centurian’s slave, he was also a bondsman. Notice the Roman loved his “slave” very dearly, he did not treat him like the false Hollywood cruel taskmasters who go out and bullwhip the poor blacks halfway to death. That is nowhere near the historical truth.
Secondly, the Lord Jesus did not come to this Earth the first time to overturn governments and right all of the wrongs going on. He was not some Hollywood “social justice warrior” who was politically correct. Remember, a lot of the Jews in the Sanhedrin and govt offices wanted and expected Jesus to smack down the Romans, drive them out, and restore Israel to an autonomous govt and to the priests. When Jesus refused to do so, they were disappointed and very angry with Him. That was a major reason they rejected Him as Messiah.
As for servants who came to love their “master,” they gave their earlobe to be put against a doorpost and it was pierced with a small awl as a sign they wished to remain “slaves” to their “master” for the rest of their lives. It was not even as mutilating as these people who have gauges in their ears, or all of the grotesque piercings they have done to their bodies nowadays. It was very similar to a woman getting her ears pierced for the wearing of earrings.
So you see, God does NOT approve of forced bondage, nor beating of servants/slaves.
John, you seem to be so bitter and angry at God. You do not understand His nature or character, but see a twisted, distorted view of Him thru eyes that judge Him by what people do. We cannot judge God by what people do, because people are sinful, proud, and selfish. There is no limit to the people who will use God as a justification for their wicked deeds. The Lord says they are posers and they will be judged for it one day.
God does not delight in keeping anyone out of Heaven, but the people themselves choose to reject the Lord and love evil. They would be absolutely miserable in Heaven without their sins and defiled ways, of which they staunchly refuse to give up. Not to mention, they would pollute Heaven and cause trouble. That is why 1/3 of the angels were cast out with Lucifer when they rebelled and warred against the Lord.

Remember John, Jesus loves you so much He went thru living Hell to pay for your sins. How can you hate someone who loves you that much??

John Higson

Don’t hate him, just don’t believe he existed. There easy fixed it for you!

Here’s where I get to school you sonny boy! Because I HAVE studied this, and you obviously haven’t!

Years ago I just didn’t believe there was a dog, but accepted that there was a man called Yeshua/Jesus who was a good philosopher who was a wee bit misguided about supernatural things and had miracles attributed to him that didn’t actually happen in a colossal daisy chain of chinese whispers over the centuries, probably no more than any other historical figures who are romanticised after they died. I certainly didn’t believe he died and was resurrected(and neither do the muslims btw).

Then, after arguing long and hard with a christian friend(an intelligent and sincere believer, who just so happened to be one of the most evil and hypocritical people I have ever met), I looked into the actual unbiased non christian historicity of Jesus’ life and found it to be almost entirely lacking. There are some highly disputed and uncertain references in Roman records(we don’t know if it’s ‘the’ Jesus or another around at the same time, or if the records are even genuine as there is evidence they have been fabricated at a later date. Look it up. I did.) which are almost certainly additions to the original text by well meaning later christian scribes.

I don’t accept the bible as a historical document, as you know, and the blatant amendments to the text as a way to fool people into believing strikes me as a very poor and misguided way to convince people of Jesus historicity. I’m sure that you have never even thought of the whole new testament story in these terms, as a whole most people tend to believe what their parents tell them and what their parents in turn believed. If you actually look hard and skeptically, it’s about 50/50 that you come out of the experience like I did, almost certain that Jesus is in fact a construct and, in fact, didn’t ever really exist as it states in the gospels.

The gospels are not historical documents.

One more time, the gospels are not historical documents. They are contradicting and embellished stories written AT A MINIMUM of 2 generations after the events/non-events of the first half century AD. There were also many, many other gospels written in the decades and centuries after(up to about 100 I think) now known as the Apocrypha. Who is to know if there is ANY actual truth in any of them? And who gets to decide? And why? On what grounds? How can you know and judge? They did so at the council of nicea in 325 AD(this is disputed too), a minimum of 300 years after Jesus’ supposed death. That’s a long,long, lllloooooonnnnnggggggggg time for the stories to become messed up beyond all logicality in a time of absolutely minimal literacy!

I think that if you looked at the evidence with any kind of moral courage and intellectual honesty, you would, at least, have doubts as to the historical verisimilitude of the bible. I urge you to do so.

That’s why I don’t accept your ‘mountains of historical and archaeological evidence’, and your ‘eyewitness accounts’ are simply not eyewitness accounts! They are 1057th hand accounts of someone who claimed to be an eyewitness 30 or 40 years before! They wouldn’t stand up in a kindergarten, nevermind a court of law! None of it makes for good history, and certainly not good theology and absolutely certainly not good enough for me to even consider it to be ‘THE truth, THE light and THE way’. Sorry, your honour, just simply not good enough and simply not enough evidence for such outlandish and supernatural claims!

John Higson

‘God does NOT approve of forced bondage, nor beating of servants/slaves. ‘

If this was indeed the case, then why does he give directions about whether and how a slave owner should be punished or not when when a slave is beaten with a ‘rod’ as I have previously mentioned?

Your line in biblical revisionism is shocking! It does endorse slavery! And people throughout christian history have used the bible as a justification for owning and mistreating slaves! I can’t believe that you are even bothering to argue this, because you are convincing NO-ONE, except perhaps (and in a self-deluding way), yourself!

It’s probably great when you all get together at the christian club and revise and reinterpret the meaning of the bible so that it fits in just fine with the moral climate that exists today! It’s just that you are WRONG! I’m sorry to tell you but you only think this way because it’s what you want to believe. Nobody, outside of obviously biased christian circles, agrees with you! Except it, your religion is no better than anybody else’s and is more brutal and genocidal than many. You will realise this in the end, it’s only a question of time. How are your doubts mounting!

scott

Oh teah, John, I’ve revised the Bible. I wrote all of those ancient Hebrew and Greek manuscripts, as well as the many historical accounts of Jewish life in B.C. days. Yup, you caught me!

As for brutality & genocide, Christianity is strongly opposed to both. Christians do not and have not engaged in either. However, you Darwinian evolutionists have some wonderful credits to your name:
Adolf Hilter & his 3rd Reich, Joseph Stalin, the whole Soviet Union, pretty much all the fascist and communist rulers and their tyrannical govts.
How so? Because one of the chief foundational beliefs of all of these evil rulers was that there is no God, mankind evolved from a mere monkey, and therefore, survival of the fittest is the only law and it’s perfectly fine to do what’s right in our own eyes. Thanks, Charlie……………

John Higson

You’ve done it again. So many strawmen and incorrect assertions that it’s very, very difficult to know where to begin.

‘ brutality & genocide, Christianity is strongly opposed to both. Christians do not and have not engaged in either’

EEeeeerrrrrrr, Crusades, Inquisition, religious wars in Europe, witch-hunts, systemic abuse of children, genocide of the natives in the americas. Do I need to go on? In NO WAY can you claim that christianity has not been responsible for horrendous atrocities across history. It is a sin and an abomination for you to claim that christianity is not responsible for these things! It may not be responsible where you live today, but it certainly has been up until the very recent past(Northern Ireland Terrorism, The Genocides in the former Yugoslavia etc etc etc).Now you may possibly and disingenuously claim ‘ Ah yes! But these were not TRUE christians! So it doesn’t count’, and all I say is, you just keep telling yourself this, in the end ,maybe, you’ll actually believe it!

John Higson

However, you Darwinian evolutionists have some wonderful credits to your name:
Adolf Hilter & his 3rd Reich, Joseph Stalin, the whole Soviet Union, pretty much all the fascist and communist rulers and their tyrannical govts.’

(Sighs very heavily for the millionth time…..)

Hitler was a catholic and said so many times. They are christians, aren’t they? Communism killed people because of communism in it’s totalitarian and dogmatic form. Stalin didn’t kill people in the name of evolution or atheism, but because he was a c__t(I’ve already shown you that evolution had NOTHING to do with communist doctrine, something that you’ve conveniently ignored, again!). Fascism was invented by Mussolini, a catholic, and a devout one at that! It was never an atheistic ideology, you are just mistaken. How can one person be so wrong on so many occasions???

‘mankind evolved from a mere monkey’

Oh, FFS! This is not what evolution says for the thousandth time! We had an apelike common ancestor with the great apes. Please don’t keep saying this, it’s tedious and annoying and wrong. Try to be more precise. It’s what an educated person would do!

And the passages about beating slaves and the punishment for such are ok, are they? What about the bits about ‘pleasing’ the slave owner, obviously meaning ‘sleeping with’ in biblical terms? So, basically rape is ok if they a ‘voluntary, temporary’ slave, is it? See my other response for the exact quotations from the book of Exodus, it’s all there and you will be unable to deny it! Why do I know the bible better than you do?

John Higson

I had to repost this, because you had conveniently forgotten it existed and haven’t answered it! Typically for the dishonesty of your ‘kind’!

‘most of the water (which now covers over 70% of the Earth) was contained in subterranean chambers’

Utter BS! Where is your evidence for this nonsense assertion? Show me one such ‘chamber’ and I’ll consider giving you a break! And by chamber I don’t mean an aquifer, that dog ain’t gonna hunt. Aquifers are porous and permeable rock which contain water between the grains. They are basically solid rock with a little water between the grains, not ‘chambers’! There are no underground oceans or anything approaching being similar to such.

Once again, you cannot use the bible as evidence that the bible is factually true. It’s a circular argume

John Higson

‘You, and all Atheists are in a real kerfuffle!’

Why? In what context? When and how? What are you talking about?

We follow the laws of the land, which no doubt have had the input of the christian RELIGION over the centuries, which is not surprising as the christian RELIGION has had tremendous political power throughout the history of the west, but the bad bits of the bible were followed too. Like, be not only including the following, stoning adulterers, witches being burned(A LOT!), death if you blaspheme or proclaim to be a non-believer, death for gays, stoning for disobedient children, SLAVERY, I mean the list goes on and on and on and on and on and on. Yes their is some fantastic morality in that squeaky clean and inspired bible, isn’t there? It has some decent and time-tested folk wisdom along with all the horse excrement, but on the whole the horse excrement wins hands down! If you get your morality from this fairy tale, can I suggest some others? How about Little Red Riding Hood or Incy-Wincey Spider, or that good old favourite The Very Hungry Caterpillar? They’re just as relevant today as that tissue of lies and atrocities from the desert 2000 years ago!

John Higson

‘Again, so many misconceptions and outright falsehoods that I don’t know where to start! You think that you know about this stuff but you really don’t. Allow me to correct you.

First though, some ground rules. If it is 100% certain that you are wrong, I want an apology. It’s that simple. You claim to be a christian and I’m pretty sure that part of being ones is that you apologise when you make a mistake. Especially when it’s pointed out to you and you don’t accept the correction! I’m just trying to be a good shepherd….

Also, will you read the links if I send them with the evidence? Because if you won’t then I won’t send them, it would be a waste of my time and effort to search for them. A simple yes or no would do. I’m betting that your confirmation bias won’t let you because you don’t have the moral courage, but we’ll see!

I don’t accept bible quotations as evidence and thus will not read them. Nor do I accept answersingenesis, because it’s rubbish. It has to be independent of any christian source for me to accept it as evidence and be peer reviewed. That’s just the way it is!

First correction. C14 is not used for the age of the earth you are just simply wrong. Time for an apology! C14 can be used to date things up to 50,000 years ago. The problem you have here is that you have only heard of C14 dating, just like almost all your ignorant christian friend, but science has many different radiometric modalities to suit many different time ranges! eg K/Ar, U/Pb, Nb/Sr etc

scott

OK, I may be wrong about the half life of C14, but I’m not wrong about living plants & animals being tested, who were still alive, purported to be hundreds of thousands of years old.
And all of you Darwinists owe us Christians an apology for all of the outright, purposeful deceptions and lies you lot have told the world throughout the past 150 years. You lot are infamous for changing your official, scientific story almost as much as Hillary and Obama change their versions of the “truth.”
And you stoop to the greatest arrogance by telling me I’m going to Hell. I did not purposely set out to decieve you, just because I got the half life of C14 wrong. And, besides, all of my sins, past, present, and future are covered by the Blood, which means I stand before the Judge as innocent.

So, to completely wrap things up, as you absolutely refuse to listen to the truth, I tell you that I will continue to pray for you and hopefully, one day, your blind eyes and stopped up ears shall be opened. Cheers,John………………….

John Higson

‘OK, I may be wrong about the half life of C14’

The unabashed, shocking arrogance of the man! ‘MAY’ be wrong? ‘MAY’ be wrong! YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY WRONG BEYOND ANY DOUBT, TO AN UTTER CERTAINTY! Your reluctance to just say, ‘I’m sorry, my bad, I got it wrong, you have more knowledge than me where this is concerned’ shows a lack of humility that the clearly ahistorical Yeshua would admonish in the most hysterical terms! Look to your prophet as to how you should react when called out and SHOWN IRREFUTABLY to be wrong!

And then to tag on all sorts of unbelievably irrelevant and obfuscatory caveats……I have no words……..