d23:EvilEgg: America would have a declining population if it wasn't for immigrants. So I don't have a problem with this.

Why do we need a growing population? Verrry confused. We already have too many people.

You guys are both correct. We already have too many people AND we do not have enough of the right skilled people. Even if we have enough for now, we are not going to have enough to meet the demand in the future.

d23:EvilEgg: America would have a declining population if it wasn't for immigrants. So I don't have a problem with this.

Why do we need a growing population? Verrry confused. We already have too many people.

In America? There is plenty of space. Either way while I agree with you long term, our current tax system is setup where a larger number of young people support a smaller number of older people. Aside from putting old people to work or letting them suffer, I don't see a way around this problem.

Kalashinator:EvilEgg: d23: EvilEgg: America would have a declining population if it wasn't for immigrants. So I don't have a problem with this.

Why do we need a growing population? Verrry confused. We already have too many people.

Most of the economy depends on it. Also America doesn't have too many people, Asia does.

Seriously. Bangladesh is the same size as Missouri and has 160,000,000 people. It's like they can't be bothered to use a condom or try anal or something.

Oh look, here is someone who is utterly clueless as to why a country's population is the way it is.

I'll give you some hints, it takes thousands of years to get to where it is now, and condoms were not available back then (also, not everyone is like your mom). Then it has a lot to do with climate, life expectancy, and education level. Of course, you will ask, why the education level was low, but then you would have to look into the colonial history of those countries. I'm guessing that would be too much to ask.

Secondly, countries like Bangladesh and India has made more progress in curving population growth than most countries in recent years.

So an American farks a lady boy in Vietnam and a Chinese woman gives birth in LA nine months later....

I have been sadly misinformed on the way that reproduction works.

I don't know why women always make a big deal about pregnancy and labour. It sounds like a cinch if you totally outsource it. Just look at my distant cousin Angelina Jolie*. She's got babies from all over the world: Asia, Africa, the low rent bits of the Americas. Never gained a pound. In fact, she may have spent thousands of them.

No wonder Conservatives have their sphincters in a knot over homosexuals having sex with each other. There's no telling where the baby will come out.

Some rich Hollywood biatch might fly to Patagonia to fetch it home to Bel Air and raise it as a Scientologist. Gay men should be more careful where they dip their wick. A lot of the world's heterosexuals can't afford to be parents, let alone gay parents.

(*I'll guess 9th cousin. She could be a little bit closer than the Duchess of Cornwall or Hillary Clinton perhaps but is probably somewhere around 9th unless I put a lot of work into filling out her family tree at the expense of neglecting my own. 9th and 10th cousins are numerous and relatively easy to document.

I linked Charles Hoy Fort to Henry Fonda recently. I went hunting for Fort, who is one of my all time favs, and managed to land him at 9th cousin. Fonda I just added for a lark. Humphrey Bogart is a Mayflower Descendant so I needed bother to go looking for his ancestors, somebody already did him, but I discovered that there are Boagarts in the family tree of the Fondas and the Forts, so I'm guessing I could get some more Nova Belgica (American Dutch) ancestors if I did.)

Times are tough so we're going in on a sex tourism share in the Berkshires. We will be able to bang her every other week from September to December and sublet her to other depraved perverts when we aren't using her. Great deal as she was off-peak and slightly damaged.

d23:EvilEgg: America would have a declining population if it wasn't for immigrants. So I don't have a problem with this.

Why do we need a growing population? Verrry confused. We already have too many people.

Taxes! who's going to pay for all the old farts? who's going to fund SS etc if you don't have a younger working class people shodering the economic burden? well in this case litrealyl too! I may be wrong but I think a 25 yr old is probably more productive than a 75 yr old buiding a house or putting shingles a roof.

Every person who enters the US is essentially classified into two categories: those who are or wish to stay permanently, and those who do not wish to stay permanently.

For those who do not intend to stay permanently - mainly most US visitors and those on limited-term work visas - there are natural and proper limitations to this system specifically designed to prevent the not-unlimited resources of the US from being overwhelmed. For example, while on a legal work visa such as B or H category, you do not have the right to unemployment benefits and certain other state and federal benefits when that visa ends due to the end of your employment. In fact, you are required to leave as soon as reasonably possible at the end of the term of your stay as outlined in your I-94 form obtained at the time of your entry.

If you intend on staying permanently after legal entry by any means whatsoever without an otherwise-legal the basis to do so (e.g. dual-intent visa categories, marriage, existing direct familial relationship with a US citizen or permanent resident) and USCIS gets wind of this, generally you should expect deportation proceedings and detainment without warning. If your basis for entry is fraudulent to being with, then you can expect similar adverse proceedings.

This story has nothing to do about our opinions of legal immigration limits, whatever amnesty may or may not be coming, de facto enforcement practices or de jure enforcement practices. The limits for immigrant visas by law are set according to numerous parameters by the government agencies involved in this process based on the likelihood of individuals entering the US of being able to sustain themselves and/or being members of specific politically-expedient classes of individuals (e.g. Cuban refugees). This story is mainly about covert immigration fraud.

As those who actually read the article in its entirety may have seen, there is a strong legal argument for fraud against the individuals involved in these covert birth mothers which should automatically negate their ability to even enter the US in the future should such a scheme be discovered. What would be helpful is for USCIS to explicitly state on the 6059B entry form that the person entering voluntarily agrees to permanently waive their right to permanent residence or citizenship via sponsorship by any person that may be born to them in the United States for the duration of that visit unless some other legal basis for such citizenship may exist that is not in conjunction with that visit.

The law does not allow anyone but the person with US citizenship and with full understanding to personally renounce that US citizenship, so it is not currently reasonable or legal to request the person entering for doing it on behalf of the child born in the US. However, the voluntary waiver for the non-citizen who enters would probably go a long way to curtailing people from such fraudulent schemes and hopefully encourage them to obtain permanent residence or citizenship using numerous other valid and legal methods.

meyerkev:Because if you like having an eldercare state, you have to have people paying taxes. And 37 Million elders vs. 8 million kids is not a recipe for an eldercare state.

30 years from now, Hispanic workers are not going to want to pay for white retirees, nor will they be forced to. Hope you like cat food and living in a mass shelter, grandma. God help you if you get sick, because nobody else will.

It's Me Bender:meyerkev: Because if you like having an eldercare state, you have to have people paying taxes. And 37 Million elders vs. 8 million kids is not a recipe for an eldercare state.

30 years from now, Hispanic workers are not going to want to pay for white retirees, nor will they be forced to. Hope you like cat food and living in a mass shelter, grandma. God help you if you get sick, because nobody else will.