Indiana Pettway interview

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Interview with Indiana Pettway
Date of Interview: May, 1980; Geels Bend, Alabama
Interviewer: Kathryn Tucker Windham
Transcriber: Edna O. Meek
Begin Side 1, Tape 1
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I got plenty of children.
Well, do any of them live here at the house with
you?
I got four grands stayi ng bere, the two I telling
you about from up at Camden, and I got two small
grands. One go to kindergarten and the other
go to Day Care.
Up here at Tinnie Dell's, or at the other one,
acrOBs the road?
The boy go to Camden, and the girl go to kinder­garten.
This girl here (pointing to photograph),
she getting her a house . She done got a bid on
her land . She getting one of these brick houses
what coming here. You hear talk of them? What
they gonna build .
Yes, the McCarthys have been working on them,
trying to get them built down here, I think .
Haven't they? Now, what did you tell me your
full name was?
Indiana Pettway.
Indiana Pettway. And you're named for your
Mother.
Yes , ma'am.
And you grew up right down here in Gee's Bend?
Yes, ma ' am. Right down there in front of the
store. That's where I was born; that's where I
was raised; and that's where I got grown. And
when I married, I come here.
Then you remember when they built these houses
down here then?
Dh, yes, ma'am . I was a grown woman then.
Were you married then?
No'm. I wasn't married.
Just a grown woman. Well, did you move into one
of those houses they built? The government
houses? And were you the first one to live in
this house?
No, ma'am. This man I married, he had been
married, and his wife died.
Well, he and his wife had been living in this
house, then?
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She had been living here . She was a young woman
when she died.
And what was his name, Indiana?
Spurlin Pettway .
Ob. Spurlin. Hefs the preacher.
He was thirty seven years old when we married.
I wanted to know what the houses looked like
before they built these new houses down here.
What kind of house did you grow up in?
I growed up in a plank house . It was a double­tenant.
My Mother and Father lived in one part,
and the children stayed in the other part. It
was one house when it was built, and it had one
big room and a back room. After these chillun
added, then he had another house built to that.
This house he had built to that, hold five beds.
It was a great big old place, and all us lived
in there. He and Mama lived in that, and the
other part of the chillun lived in the back
room. My Mama had a lot of chillun . She was
the mother of fifteen chillun. She had a lot of
chillun . Three of them died . She raised the
rest of them to be grown.
Twelve .
But was
houses,
Well, that's a lot to raise, isn't
there a wide hall between those two
or were they just separate houses?
it?
There was a hall between them, and you could go
to the window and talk to them through the
window. And the kitchen was on the ground.
The kitchen was built out of ply, some old ply,
and it didn't have no floor in it. Stove was
sitting on the ground . After a while , that one
got burnt up. I made a fire in the stove, and
I reckon the pipe must have been full of soot;
and it said "whoa-whoa-whoa n, and then it sot
it afire, and I come running out of there and
told them the kitchen was on fire and it got
burn up. Then, when they build it again, I
don't know whar they got that tin, but took that
tin and built the kitchen. And still had that
floor. And I think it stayed on that ground
floor till the government built us houses.
Then, when the government built us houses,
Auntie , his Sister, got disabled to work . She
worked .for Miss Liddell and then, over there
in Camden, while she was able. She got dis­abled
to work, she moved there and she stayed in
the back in the same house where us stayed
until Mr . Cammack come down here and tear it
down . And he had to tear the house down, then
she moved in one of the rooms. And stayed there
a while, and her nieces come and got her and
carried her to see them, and she stayed there
until she died.
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Raised everything us at, us raised. Raised
us hogs, chickens, corn, sweet potatoes, pea­nuts,
had a garden. Peas. Everything most
us at, us raised. Us would buy our flour,
sugar, coffee, sumpin like that, but our meat
and stuff ; our chickens coming off our yard;
our eggs coming out that hen house; and our
barn; our eggs and chickens. None of t hat
goin to the store, talking bout 11m goin to
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get groceries. We raised ••• us worked. I tell
my chillun a l l the time, I worked. Yes, ma'am.
I worked.
From the time you were a little girl.
On till I got disabled to work, I worked.
Did you work in the field?
Yes 'm.
When did you start working in the fields?
Well, I tell you. I went in there when I was
six years old, ceuse I wouldn ' t nurse . Mama
got tired of beating me bout not tending her baby .
I just wouldn ' t tend no baby. She just sont me
on in the field. I be back there p l aying in
the field till I got old enough to work. Be out
there a little while, Papa set me in the shade.
r always was his pet. She just sont me on to
him. I play back there a little while, he send
me in the shade . And I reckon r was about eight
years old before I went to work. You know, sho
nuff work, and then when I went to work, r worked
from Monday morning till Thursday night; and
then Friday I come home and get on that wash
board and wash clothes. Didn't know nothing
bout no washing machine. Hadn't never seen
narn. Just get on that rub board and wash
them clothes. Wash them out with water, put
em in a pot, soap in there; get a stick and
chug em; take em out of there; wash em out
in another water; rinse them in two waters
and hang em out, and they just as white and
pretty as they could be. They'd be heap
prettier then than they be now.
Did you have a well to ge t the water from?
Yes, ma'am. We had a well, But before my
Daddy dug the well, us used to ge t water from
t he creek. Tote water from the creek to wash
with. But it was a heap of us, and time us
made a turn, us bad a beap of water .
What creek was that, Foster Creek?
That creek right down there.
Right back of the house?
No'm. It ain't none of Foster Creek. All I
know is it a creek.
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Well, that ls a pretty good ways to tote water,
wasntt it?
Thatls whar us had to tote it from. And after
I got married, I still worked . My baby got six
weeks old , I went back to the field . My chillun
were big enough to left home, I put em in the
wagon ; put 8 ticking in there and 8 cradle for
my baby to lay on; carried their milk in the
field; and I worked. Come home , jump out that
wagon ; go in that garden ; get some green and pick
em; put em on the fire ; put on me some bread.
Then I go back in the garden while them cooking ;
get me some more ; pick em and clean em for the
next morning . I was poor and I didn't have
nothing, bad to cook what I had . And sometimes
I carry my pot in the field , when the peas, you
know , full out; carry my pot in the field; carry
my meat in the field; cook my bread at home.
Get me some brick and set that pot on; shell
me some peas ; go out there by the well and wash
em; put em in that pot; stir em . Then I have me
something to feed my chillun on . Can ' t nobody
tell me nothing bout no hard work , and no hard
way to go . I done had a good time , and I had a
rough time . Both of em .
I was s atisfied with it . It wasn ' t worrisome
to me , because I didn ' t know no better . I wasn't
used to that much , and I come up that a-way,
and I was used to it . And there so many folks ,
all the folks were just alike . See , if it had- a
been a whole lot of fo l ks had something and I
was that a - way , I WOUl d- a fe l t bad . 8¥er ybody waS
just alike, and you could make it like that .
Well , it's not much better eating anywhere than
peas and bread, or greens and bread.
No , ma ' am . That ' s the truth .
You got a garden now?
Yes , matam. I ain ' t goin miss my garden .
You got any water melons planted?
Yes, ma ' am. I 'm eatin turnip salad right now .
Well , that's wonderful. Did you ever plow any
in the field?
No , ma ' am . I didn't plow . I hoed, picked cotton,
but I never did plow. Had a l ot of brothers and
they done the pl owing. Us done the hoeing, the
girls done the hoeing . When I mar ried , my hus ­band
and boys done the plowing . I never did
plow . Don't know nothin bout no plowing, but I
sho hoed . Used to pick cotton. Could solid
pick cotton .
How much could you pick?
Pick over two hundred. Air day I got ready . Then
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I walk home and cook supper fore the night. You
know, I walked from Cobb's Landing. I was real
heavy with that girl you see right there, and I
walked from Cobb's Landing every evening and
come home and cook supper. Now I just tell these
young folk, when they get pregnant - "I ain't
able, I can't do such and Buchu - ain't nothing
like it. And my next girl I had, I had two
g irls in front of the boy, then the boy come;
the next girl behind this one, I went in the
field that evening. My water broke in that field.
I bad on my apron. I just took that apron and
backed back, and took the apron and chug it
down and poked it up under me, and kept on pick­ing
cotton. I picked cotton till knocking off
time. Knocking off time, I come out the field;
bathed my little chillunj cleaned up on kitchen.
And the next morning I said, "Spurlin, I don't
believe I go back toady. I ain't sick, but I
skeered to go back". And I didn't go back that
day. Next morning , I got up and I washed; I
mopped all the way through this housej and I got
up and I fried me something to eatj and milked
my COWSj and I churned my milk, and fixed some
bread. And that evening, me and him sittin up
here talking , wasn't a thing ail me. I went
to bed about nine o'clock that same night , and
I ca lled him and said, "Spurlin, come on and
get up and go with me". Us didn't have no bath ­room.
I said, "Come on, go with me outdoors."
I got to the door, it had rained , and I said,
"Go back and get my shoes". Ground was wet.
He brought my shoes, and when I come back, I
put one foot up on that bed, and I said, "Ub, oh.
Get up, get up and go get the Granny. I need
the Granny." He said, "I ain I t gwin nowhere.
Ain't nothing ailing you, ticklish as you is."
That thing tickled me, because it, you know,
cramped. I said, lIyou better get up from there."
And I wouldn't get in the bed then. And I go t
up and fixed my bed so I wouldn't soil it. And
he hung around. And I said, "You better get up
out of that bed. II He got up and hi tched up the
wagon to go get Granny, and that wagon hadn't
got no further than the next house you see down
there, when I done had that baby!
You could have called him to come on back home,
couldn't you?
I had done had that baby. And now, folks ••••••
Was that your first boy?
That was my second girl.
Well, who was the Granny he was going to get?
Louella.
Now they
Back in them times,
go to a hospital.
we used a Granny.
Well, you got along just fine with that Granny,
too, didn It you?
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She did. But you know, they lost a lot of women
in chil dbirth . They saving more women now , it
look like, than they was saving back in my time.
You know, sometime I be so scared I'm goin die .
I be so scared , and every time my time come
around , 8 woman'd die in childbi rth . A lady
died ten days before I got down in childbirth,
and I was so scared . Looked like I was going
to die , all I could say or do . But you know,
before I got down , all that scare went away.
And when I got to hurt ing, I forgot I was scared.
Well, did he bring the Granny back that night?
Yes, ma lam . She come in. And every time she'd
come, she'd peek around the door at me . I was
fast, and if I ever started hur ting , I was just
like that (snaps fingers), and every time she'd
come in , my baby'd be born.
One time she come, she come with the boy now, he
warn't born . She peeked around the door, and I
said, lIyou better not peep around the door, you
better come on in . " My next door neighbor, she'd
be over here with me. Me and her would be just
talking and laughing . She ' d say , IIIr I coul d
bear pain like you, I wouldn I t mind havi ng babies . II
I say , flIt hurt, but it don't hurt all the time .
When it go away, there ain ' t nothing else ail
you till another one."
What did sbe bring with her to help you bave the
baby?
Nothing . Not a thin g . She come there and put
her hand on her knee and sit up there and go to
sleep. Nothing . Not a thing . And when that
baby born, she have a little ole scissors in
there to cut its navel, and bathe it and put its
clothes on . Mash your stomach and put something
tight under your stomach. Sometimes the after
birth be hard to come. Do like that, and it'll
come. She didn ' t have nothing .
And didn ' t have anything to give you for pain?
No'm . I didn ' t never suffer with no pains after
they rolled me. But I had a sister. Lord bave
mercy, that lady, after she borned her baby, she
had them hard pains. She use aspirin. She get
her a bottle of aspirin.
That's not very strong for that kind of pain ,
is it?
Well , nothing it look like were doing her no good.
Look l ike ••••• along in then it was rough . * It
was really rough . And in time, the R. C .~ when
the R. C., folks was pl owing bulls, it was rough
then . A piece of bread, you didn't bit more have
nothing to eat with it than nothing . You had
that piece of bread, it was so good. Now, peoples
was hongry then . Us had a garden, had two gardens
* Possibly Reconstruction Finance Corp ., one of the early
relief a gencies .
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rals1ng turnips. And one night us laid down,
and a lady had some goats. Got up the next
morning , and that lady's goats had done cleaned
us garden. Et em all up. It was tough .
You didn't eat the goat, did you?
Then wasn't none of our goats.
I would have been tempted to eat tha t goat for
eating my garden .
We beet him t i ll his mouth bled. That lady got
mad about us beating her goat, and that goat
ate up all us greens. Sbe was so mad. It was
tough. It was rough.
Was that about the time when Mr . Rentz' family
broke up everybody over here?
Yes'm.
time.
That come sbortly right along in that
Broke up the folks.
Did they break up your family?
No'm, didn't break up my Daddy. He and his sister
was strong, and she still stayed strong in all
things. It didn't break him. He paid out. The
hogs and dogs were holler ing, the babies were
hollering, the chillun were hollering . You know
how chillun is, bothering they things. Somebody
getting em. Them little chillun crying , the
white folks getting them hogs. Heap of them died
before they got to the river . That lady said she
didn ' t gain nothing. She lost. She hopes she
had-a not broke up them folks, cause she lost.
She woulda got more if she had left them like
they were , let them paid out. Course , it wasn't
her doings, it was her brother. It wasn't her,
it was her brother. She had a mean brother.
Well , I had heard about how they brought t he
wagons over here and just took everything, didn't
they?
Took hogs, cows , everything from them folks .
Didn't l eft em nothing. But he didn 't take the
furniture out of the houses.
And the plows?
yes 'm. It was tough .
Yes, that was really hard times.
Yes, ma'am. It was hard. It been hard . I have
made a whole week here i n this house, boiling
peas, putting salt in them, me and my chillun
eatin em. Ain't had no bread, couldn ' t get none.
Di dn ' t have nothing to get none with. A whole
week, boiled peas with salt in em. I ain't bad
a shoe. Narn . Ain't had but one dress . Every
time that dress got nasty, pull it off , wash i t,
hang it out and let it dry , iron it and put it
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back on. My children the same way. It was
hard. But I was young.
But you made it, didn 't you?
Yes, ma'am.
then, and I
about it.
And I was strong
was satisfied and
enough to stand
I warntt worrying
Now, your children were going to school then, too,
weren't they?
Yes'm. Tbey was go in to school. I had some big
enough to go to school. But it wuz tough, and
my oldest ••������������� that girl there, when she finished
school, it was rough for her. She had some
tennises. They had done got raggedy, you know.
The teacher WQuld- talk about all the chl11un,
how they fixed up, how they shoes and things
look. Say she would stick her foots for the
teacher to see her foot. She wanted the teacher
to say something bout her foot. Teacher never
would say nothing about her foot. She said if
she say something about her foot, she gwin ask
her to get her a pair of shoes, but the teacher
wouldn't never bother with her. Bother the
other chillun, but didn't bother her. She was
real smart in school, and she knowed she wont
fit. Now, she was in the 12th grade. She
knowed she wont fit, but the teacher never would
say nothing bout her clothes and what she would
wear, but the other chillun, she just talk about
they clothes, but she never did talk about her.
And when she started, she put her foot out so
the teacher could see she had on those shoes, and
the teacher wouldn't say nothing about her. She
say she say something bout her and she'd say,
!lWell, tbat's all I got . Give me a pair of
shoes to wear to scbool, please, rna' am." She
said she would bave asked her for a pair of
shoes, but she wouldn't talk about her.
Now, this was down here at the school at Boykin1
Yes, ma'am.
And after sbe graduated, what did she do? Did
she get married then?
NaIrn. She went to Bridgeport and went to work.
Well, when you were a little girl down here,
what did y'a11 do at Christmas time?
Places to go play, to house where they have
little selling and bands, and what not. Go to
the house and play. Santa Claus come and bring
us what little he gwie bring. Chillun, you
know, wasn't like it is now. Us didn't get
plenty of things like chillun get now. Sometime
us be lucky enough to catch a doll; sometime
be an apple, or orange or candy.
Did you have anything at the church at Christmas?
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See, I was small then. Mama and them, they go
to the church for Christmas Watch Night, you
know. Go there about 9 or 10 o'clock and
stay all night till sunrise in the morning.
Didn't carry no chillun then. Left chillun home
at night. I went to Sunday School in the day,
I come back home. When church start, then they
send the kids back home. But I hated to go to
that Sunday School . That was something I didn't
want to do. I l 'eft home crying, but in all my
crying, I went to that Sunday School every Sun­day
morning.
Why did you hate to go?
I wanted to go play. I get tired settin up in
that church. No, gracious. I didn't want to
go . But i t was good. If you make your child
go to church when they young, he'll go there
when he get old . He canlt help from going
there, if you get up a certain age. Now, if
I don't go to church on Sunday, and warn't
sick and didn't go to church, I warn't going
nowhere that Sunday, long as folks was holding
meeting, till the meeting broke. I felt like
I was too guilty to go out in the road with
folks holding meeting. You couldn't get me to
go nowhere. I gain stay home till meeting broke,
and after meeting broke, then I could go free.
That guilt was on me.
Somebody down here was telling me about the
visions you used to have to have before you
could join the church.
Well, that going on now.
I know. Tinnie Dell was talking to me about it .
Yes , ma'am. You had to go in the woods and pray.
Pray hard, too.
Did you do that?
Yes, ma'am. I sbo did .
And this was before you married Rev. Spurlin,
was it?
Yes, malam.
You were, reckon, how old?
Seventeen.
Almost grown young lady, girl, weren't you?
I wasn't nothing but chillun, cause I grow slow.
You get grown according to how you grow, and
I grow slow. I was the runt of all of Mama's
chillun. I'm the smallest one and always been
the smallest one. Littlest one in the bunch,
and I always been the littlest one. Never did
half grow. I stayed chillun a long time. Yes ,
ma'am. We had to pray.
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Do you remember where you went? In the woods
near the house, somewhere?
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Sometimes I walk down in the swamp. Sometimes
I walk around and get me a praying ground out
there back of the house in the woods. Some­times
it be nighttime , I just come outdoors and
sit on the hill and pray. That's where I got
the religion that night. I walked all night l ong.
I couldn't stay in the house, and I couldn't stay
out there either. I was just restless. Every­where
I go, I warn't contented. Go in the
house, I couldn't stay, and I couldn't stay out.
Just restless.
Got up that morning, I was goin in the field.
I seed myself that night. I was laying out, out
there at Pleasant Grove. Pleasant Grove was
out there where the school house is. I was
right there, and I was right there where that
cow gap is, but that cow gap , it warn't there
then. That's whar I was standing up there, and
there was a casket there. And I was standing
up over the casket. There was an old man, old
man Joe T.; he was a preacher, Monroe and them
granddaddy. I was standing up over the casket,
I was standing up there, and Indiana was laying
in the casket. I looked in there and Bay, 1I0h,
there Indiana in the casket and here Indiana
standin up over the casket. II And when I say that,
this Indiana riz up out of the casket and she
went OD; had on a long white gown , and she went
thataway . I see myself again, I gwin around a
curve, found some big plums. And a lady say,
IIIndiana tl
• I say, ''Yes, ma'am". She said,
"If you go round there, you go ahead on around
there, but hell hounds goin get on your track.1I
And when that lady said that, it was 'bout fifteen
spotted hounds got in 'hind me, just barkin'
on my track. I seed myself again, I climbin' a
mountain. That mountain was so steep, and every­time
I get most up it, I fall back. Every-thing
I catch, it'd pull up by the roots. Catch
a weed, and it'd pull up by the roots. Catch a
bush, that bush'd pull up by the roots. And I
scuffled and I scuffled till I did get up on the
top of that mountain. It was a hard struggle.
I seed myself again, I was digging down in those
weeds. Just diggin, diggin away. Every time I
dig, I di g till I hit the rock; when I hit the
rock, that water come pouring out. I was so
happy that Thursday morning . The world looked
brand new. My hand looked brand new. I felt
brand new. I felt light; I felt good; I couldn't
never finish telling it. And I ain't finished
yet. 1'm yet tellin it.
And did you tell that to the congregation?
Yes , ma'am.
And then they l et you join the church?
Yes, ma'am.
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And changed your whole life , didn ' t it?
Yes , ma ' am , it changed it . The thing I used to
do , just like a horse , you know . You know ,
when you get ready to ride a horse , you put
a br id l e on it . And that bridle guide that
horse . You pull that b r id l e the way you want
that horse to go . And that ' s just the way I
is . I got sump in that pul l me , guide ms .
TI Indiana , that I s wr ong . Don t t you do it . II
Something talking within, telling you tha t' s
wr ong . If you go to do wrong, you could do
it , but you stepping over the r ight spir it
when you do it . The spirit goin talk on your
con science and te l l you that's wrong , don ' t
do that . Well, if you obey, you won ' t do too
many wrong things . And then , if you been con­verted
, you got love in your heart for every­body.
You could ho l d conversations with any­body.
You love everybody . You ain ' t got no
hate about you . I ain ' t got to hate you for
what you got . I don ' t hate you cause of your
color. You ' re a lady and I 'm a lady . God
made you just like He made me , and He .• • • • •
He loves you j ust like He l oves me .
That ' s the truth , He do. He loves me and you
both . I ain ' t got no cause to hate you , and
you ain ' t got no cause to hate me . God l oves
both of us . God died for you and He died for
me . Died fo r both of us. Died for a l l of us .
And He said , "Love one another . II
That ' s true. And He ' ll fix you so that people
cou.ld walk over you and you could stand it .
You can stand it . You know fol ks mistreat you,
and sometime your mouth wil l open just like
tha t , and He shut it back f or you . You just
t rust .
Well , after you were able to join the church,
then were you baptized? Where were you baptized?
Same cr eek where Lil lie Bel le and I stay over.
That same creek . Joined the Pleasant Grove
Baptist Church, under the pastor , Rev . W. M.
Cade .
Now , is he dead?
Yes , ma' am . He been dead about , to tell the
truth , twenty year s , I reckon .
Well , he was pastor down her e a long time ,
wa sn ' t he?
Yes , ma ' am , he was . He was pastor of the church
a long time . He was a home preacher ; ra i sed ,
young and all . After he quit , Rev . Gil ber t
pastor. He went to church tha t Sunday , pr eached
that day in the church , and died in the church .
He died in the church?
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He fell dead in the church .
Well , now , that was a happy way for him to die ,
wasn ' t it?
It sho wuz. He pestored a church over the river,
and his wife say when they left home, he 8ay ,
"I won 't be back . II She said, "Why you talking
bout you won't be back? What you gwin stay i l l
night?" "I just told you, I won't be back."
She said he loved the neck bones, and they went
to town and bought some neck bones that Saturday
evening . He said , "What you putting on all that
stuff for? Don ' t nobody eat it but me . Don't
cook but a little now , ' cause don ' t nobody eat
it but me. II And he went there and took some
out the pot before he went to the barn, and
said, IIJust put enough in there for me , ' cause
I ain ' t goin to est here tomorr ow evening. This
meal and in the morning , that's the last meal
I 'm gwin eat here . "
She didn ' t know . She wasn ' t thinking about he
was talking about dyi ng . He went on working .
We come from chur ch that Sunday , and I got in
my door , and I went in there, and I t urned on
my stove to fix dinner , and my next door neigh­bor
and little baby girl come over her e. All of
them call me Cousin Nar. She come her e and she
say , "Cousin Nar , Cousin Sweet PaPta dead . " I say ,
"What?" "Cousin Dear was dead . I And I went
on the door, and Mama said, "Yeah , he dead. II
I say , tlHe ain't . " She say , "Yeah , he is , too.
You better come on and let's go down ther e . "
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Told me, "I ain ' t gonna live a year. " I say ,
"Nigger , get out of my face . " She 8ay , "You
done had dinner?" And I say , "NO . " "Come on
out here and get Borne dinner." I s ay , "Man, I
can ' t eat . How you ' spect me to eat when rot.
br other just died . I can l t swallow nothin . I
"No need y ' all looking at me . I 'm gain fall
over dead."
And Patty died in May . And the next year in
Mar ch , Gilbert was dead . They told me they wuz
gain die with their shoes on, and they didn ' t
pull them off .
My Mother died l ike that . My Mother went to
chur ch that night , and she just shouted allover
that church. All around there just shakin fol ks
hands , having a good time . And she was so neat
and clean . I washed for her . Did her clothes ,
done her washin and iron in . Kept her clean,
helped her put em on . Went to church that night,
had some sort of progr am down the r e, singin
progr am , and sbe 8ay , "I got somethin to tell you . "
I want ed to kn ow what i t was so bad, and she
woul dn' t t ell me .
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I went on down there Monday morning ; they had
a funeral t hat Monday morning , my second cousin
died . He had the flu. I went down that Monday.
I got right on the step_ I didn't set in nare
chair. She said, "I been in the garden all
day and I had a bad sick spell. Done somethin
I ain't done in forty years, lay down on the
ground. Y' all gwin have plenty of greens to
Bat. 1I I say, IIWbat ail you? You goin eat em
as good ss us . Where you goin be you can't eat
em?1I She say. "I ain't goin eat none. I'm
gwin be flying a r ound in heaven. Y'all goin be
8atin these gr eens . II Just like that. I Bay,
"I'll see." ItYeah, you see. What I had to
tell you yes t erday evening, I couldn't tell you,
cause Net kept a -following me , II - that her knee
baby - !land I did·n ' t want her to hear, and you're
the strongest one of my chillun, and I wanted to
tell you I got some money right here. When I
die, you get it and gie it to Paddy, 'cause he
might be done used up t hat he got , and he would
have some money to help bury me ."
She had joined Brownlee Funeral Home . Now , she
belonged to the SOCiety of Friends , but he might
need some money. You gie it to him. I say,
"You ought to done been bought Big Bud some
flowers wit h that money." That's her oldest
son ; we joke about him all the time. Every time
Bi g Bud wants something, Mama don 't have but a
quarter, Big Bud wants some flower, she sho goin
buy 'em.
Y'all tease her about it.
I sot down there, me and her talked , and after
a while Daisy said, "Come on , let 's go to the
funeral. II Went to the funeral, and I come home
that evening , and I coul dn't do nothin . Mama
told me, "I'm gonna steal away from y' all.
I'm goin steal away. Y'all won't know nothing
about when I go . I 'm goin steal away . II
I wan't studyin about it , 'cause I knowed it
wsrn't so . It didn't worry me, but I got home
a load fell on me. I tried to cook , I couldn 't
cook. Tried to hoe my garden, couldn't hoe my
garden. I went to my next door neighbor's house .
I say , "Something botherin me , didn 't know what
it is, I just worried . I don 't know what ails
me. 1I She say, "You know this trouble ain't over .
Somebody else gwin die." I say, "You shut up
that ra cket. Mama just speak from nothing but
old", just like that. I say, "I be glad when
Spurlin come out of the field. II She say, "For
what?" I say , "So us can talk. 1I
And when he come out of the field, he sot down
right there. I couldn ' t say nothing and he
couldn 't say nothing. He said one word and I
couldn't say narn, I didn 't know what to say_
He say, "How come that rat cutting up up there?"
I didn't say nothing then . After awhile , I say,
"Let 's us go to bed, us can talk." Went on
to bed. He went to sleep. I lay up there and
couldn't go to sleep. He said, "What ails you,
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you scared of burglar? " I said, "I ain' t
scar ed . II He said, "Well, what ails you?"
I say , "I don't know, just can ' t sleep."
And I lay up there woke, cars go by and
chill un come up here, and I hear them coming
up here . They got in the gate and called,
14
"Mama I" I didn I t say nothing . Call me again
and knock on the door . I say , "Get up and open
this door , Spurlin, get up and open the door,
Mama dead or Papa one. II He say , "How come you
think somebody dead?1I I say, IIMams dead. I
know my Daddy , and be wouldn ' t disturb me for
nobody being sick . He ' d just say, 'Wait till
tomorr ow , I ' ll tell her tomorrow , I won't wake
her up , t but somebody down there dead . II He
got up and opened the door. Boy come in there
and sai d, "Auntie say come down ther e, Mama
dead . 11 I say, Ills? How ' d she die?" "Got
out the bed and fell over the s l opjar. Papa
woke us up to put her back in bed. Auntie
cleaned her up. Auntie kept a-staying there
so long, she wouldn ' t come out of the r e , and
when Auntie come out of there she said, ' I
hate to tell y ' all , I been in that room trying
to get nerve enough to tell you. I hate to
tell y ' all , but Mama ' s dead. ,II That the way
she died.
And how long ago was that?
Twenty six years ago.
And where did you bury her?
Pettway . Up there at Pettway. Way down in
Pettway Swamp . That whar the graveyard was
then . My Daddy buried in Carson.
Is that graveyard still there in the swamp?
I don ' t know.
folkses there
church .
I know they stopped buryin
and went to buryin them to the
Eot of those old graveyards were plowed over.
I think that ' s what that one is . I think that
most the reason they stopped burying there .
Somebody say they plowed them over. I ain't
been there since they buried Mama, but my
sister went down there once or twice, but I
didn't go with her. I know they buried my baby
brother up there . I got two sisters buried up
there, my baby brother buried there, my oldest
brother buried there, Mama buried there. I
know they coul dn't plow my baby br other , 'cause
be was a veter an and he was in a •• •• his vault
was steel, put that cement top on there , got
them some cement and gummed it together . I
know couldn ' t plow that up . Could plow around
it, but couldn ' t plow it, cause I stayed there
till they finished . I got two , four, think I
got five brothers up there.
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Well , the girls have lived longer than the
boys, have they?
I got three sisters dead, there are four of
us living, the rest of them dead.
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Well, who prepared your Mother's body for
burial? This aunt you were talking about, neig­bors
, or who? Do you remember?
Brownlee . She went to Brownlee Funeral Home
in Camden.
Well, do you remember before they had funeral
homes, when you used to fix the bodies at home?
Yes, ma ' am. We used to bathe the dead folks,
dried them, lay them out on a long board. Sit
up over lem all night and bury 'em the next
morning . Yes, ma ' am , I remember.
And who made the coffins for them? Where did you
get the coffins?
They had 8 Home Society.
and make the coffins out
put them in it .
They get the planks
of them . Make a box and
And it didn ' t cost anything, really, much, did
it?
No ' m. Cause, you see, just like you pay $).00
to join the society, pay a dollar a month to
stay in . Then when you died, they already had
the planks and things, and the black cloth to
line it wi~h . They make your coffin . Put you
in a wagon and carry you to the graveyard.
And somebody would dig the grave for you?
Yes, ma ' am .
Deacons just
and they dig
We had folks to dig the grave .
tell the brothers to dig the graves,
them.
And the wagon they took you in, would it be a
borrowed wagon?
No, ma ' am. Mostly folks along then had got
wagons, as I can remember . The wagon and mule
be creakin' along, folks walk in , along behind
them.
And did they sing as they went to the cemetery?
I don't remember them singing when they buried
them . Just buried them.
I remember going to one funeral where, after
they put the body down in the grave, and before
they covered it up, they handed little children
back and forth across the grave . Have you ever
seen that done?
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NaIrn. I seem them get a little dirt and drap
it in, and say, "Ashes to ashes and dust to dust,
for the generations. II or something , but I ain't
seen them hand little children across. And I
have started bathing babies myself. Lady's baby
died over there, and I bathed him by myself,
dressed him. He come here hollerin and he
hollered till he died. I bathed the baby, combed
his little hair, and he was so pretty. Dressed
him in that little white thing . Tuk him in my
arms and carried him in there for his Mama to
see. I say, Ilyou want to see your baby?1I She
say, "Yeah, bring him here and let me see him. II
Lord, I just undone. That woman hollered. I
said, "Woman, don't holler. Take it easy, you
goin make yourself sick. Cause you gwie sho
get you another baby. I know you hate your baby
dead, but you still young enough to get you
another one . Don't make yourself sick. II That
was the prettiest baby.
I wonder what was wrong with him.
I just don't know. I really don't know. He
just hollered, just had them crying spells, just
cry. And I go there every morning , go there and
change her bed; carry some water to wash herself
off; take the baby and bathe him; dress h i m.
And the morning before he died, the morning
before he died, he didn't cry that morning. He
died the next morning, first light. The morn­ing
the day before he died, I want there that
morning, bathed him. Her sister there and I
say, "Look how he looking." "Sho is. t, IILook
like he know what I doing. He not crying a bit."
Now, that baby was dying then, but I didn't kn ow
it. He just looking about. I bathed it, got
one or two draps of warm water, put it in his
mouth, carried it in there. Marie said she slept
all night, when she woke up, she say, "Ub, uh."
That all she say. Put her teat in his mouth, and·
the baby sucked her titty, and the baby, when he
turned her titty loose and his head drapped, and
when he did that, she say that baby was dead.
I thought maybe it might have smothered.
Nolm. She was woke when he died. Th at's the
onliest morning he didn't cry. All the other
mornings he cried and fretting. He couldn't
holler •••••
Sounded like a kitten, did he?
He didn't fret a bit that morning. He was a
pretty baby. Me and her was ••••• when I get down
she wait on me. Us wouldn't hardly be together,
but both of us goin be pregnant most not so far
apart. One get down, one goin wait on the other
one. She wait on me, and I wait on her. Didn't
care what she doin, she didn't get too busy to
come there fore she went to the field, clean me,
clean up my bed, clean my baby up. Feed us our
breakfast, and then go to the field.
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Now, that ' s a blessing to have a friend like
that, ian ' t it?
17
Yes, ma'am. Me and her been up here for many
years. And she n ever been mad with me, but I
ain 't been mad with her. I don't know she been
mad with me. If she been mad with me , I didn 't
know it, and I know I ain't been mad with her,
and I know I ain 't bad nare cross words with her,
and she ain 't had narn with me. Us chillun was
raised up here together, played together, at
together , stayed together when they went away
from her. Rent them a big old apartment and all
of them stayed together, sisters and brothers.
And when they was coming up, when gOing to
school, when anybody in t erfere with one, they
interfer e with all of them . That's the way
they come . No fi ght ing , no fuss, they got along
like t hat , good and peaceful .
Just one happy family, wasn't it?
Just one happy family . You never hear a bubbly
word pass their mouth. Nobody us ed no bad words.
Everybody civil- mouthed.
What games did you play when you were littl e , or
were you too busy working in the fields to play
much?
I get some rocks, throw them up on my hand, called
it play jacks. Run and play drap the handker­chief
behind one another . And run around the
ring, steal your partner, steal him back.
Now, did you sing? That was a singing game .
Do you r emember how that song went?
"Run my ring , Colleen,
Run my ring, Colleen .
Steal my partner ,
I 'll steal him back. 11
Then you get out there and steal your partner ,
then the girl come back and steal him back.
That was fun , wasn' t it?
Oh, yes , ma'am . That was good time. It was good.
I liked it. But , you know , when I come along ,
somet ime us would play and us would fight one
another, just get i n a fight, and not be fight ing
'bout nothing. Didn't have no better s en se.
Just a-fighting . Mama used to send me to my
Auntie's house, and Cousin Roman had some boys.
I was scared of them boys . And they were b i g
as sister. I be stealin on by there, and she'll
see me, and say, "Hey, yonder that big girl. II
And them boys be behind me running me ragged,
and I run. Scared of them boys . And they be
runnin at me cause I run from them. I was
s car ed of Monroe and t hem .
Scared of Monroe? He seems like such a nice man.
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Yeah. I was scared of them two boys. Just
scared of em. They knowed I was scared of em.
And they teased you about it, too, didn't they?
They did. They warn't goin do nothin to me, but
I didn't know it.
Did you ever swim any when you were little?
No, ma'am.
live close
the creek .
Never did learn how to swim . Didn l t
by no water. Nearest water was to
But you did fish, didn't you?
Yes, ma 'am. I used to go to fiabin with my Mama,
but I didn ' t want to do it, though. I didn't
want to go to fiabin, but she 'd carry me any­way.
I have a little evil in me, but I had to
keep it covered up 80 it wouldn ' t show. I
didn ' t like to go to fiahin . I went to fiahin
one time with my aunt. I didn't want to go
with her . Every time sbe axed me to go with
her to fish, I got tired . And one time, I
was grown then , I went that time. She just
went on with her fishin. We went to a fishin
hole most to the creek . Every time I thr ow my
hook in, I pullout a great big old perch. I
catch a string of fish, and she didn ' t catch
narn, not narn. Every time I throw my hook in,
the fish just git it and go, and I pullout the
fish . And I stay right there and cotch fish
till she say , "I got to go, I ain't gain catch
nothin.11 And I ain't went back no more . I
wouldn't go back no more. I cleaned them fish
and fried them and me and her et em up.
That's good eating, isn't it?
Oh , that it is. Them ' s good fish . Fresh fish
is good.
I don't expect you liked to put those squiggly
worms on the hook , did you?
No'm, cause I was scared of worms.
of worms. I can ' t stand to tech em
Shets gwin do that .
I was scared
hardly .
You let her bait the hook and you caught all the
fish?
Yes, ma'am. I's scared of worms. Always been
scared of worms. That be my trouble pickin
cotton. I be hurrying to pick as much cotton as
I could fore it get full of worms . It got full
of worms, them bad, big old worms, in September,
and us ud be done picking cotton before it
got full of worms.
Did you ever see any snakes in the fields?
Yes, ma'am. You know, Saturday fore last, I
went in my henhouse. I had a hen in there settin.
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I sot the hen on seventeen eggs, and I sot the
other one on eleven. That hen wasn't big as
the other one, and she couldn't kivver up as
many eggs as the big hen . And I went in there
last Friday, the hen I put on seventeen eggs,
there wasn't but nine under her . And I wondered
where them eggs went. And I didn't have sense
enough to think about a snake could have at em
up. I wasn ' t thinkin '.bout it could have been
a snake. went back in there that Saturday. Two
hens were on the nest together . Had at up all
the eggs from under one. And just as I walked
in the hen house, the nest was fixed like that,
and I looked up, and the nest waS just as full
of snake 8S it could hold . Full of snake. Just
curled up in there. And the nest was full.
And I said, flUb, ub, II and I backed out of there,
and I said, "Spurlin, come here and kill that
snake . " He said, IIWhere he?" "In the hen l s
nest." He say, I1IBout gone now." And I say,
IILook like he asleep . II He got his gun and
shot that snake, and the eggs were just leakin
out of that snake, he was so full of eggs. Great
big old long snake. And that snake had been
eating up them eggs. I had a hen laying on the
ground, the nest would be full of eggs, I go back
there and the eggs would be gone. I put it on
a rat . Must be an old big rat, or a pole cat.
I wondered what that was. And it was a snake.
And I ain lt been back in there. I told them
hens, liDo the best you can. I won lt be back. II
We had a neighbor that had hens setting, and a
snake like that came in and swallowed one of the
eggs, and then crawled through the handle of a
jug that was lying down on the henhouse floor,
and then swallowed another egg, and be was
caught , because he couldn lt go forward or back­ward.
Had an egg on both sides of that jug handle ,
and that snake was just lying there on the hen­house
floor, caught between two eggs in his
stomach.
He like to get in there and break em. That the
way they say they do , they squeeze through a
crack and break em, but that snake was so full
he warnlt able to get out of the nest. I reckon
after while he gonna drap out of that nest on
the gr ound . He couldn't get out of that henhouse
cause warntt no crack for him to come out. Only
way he could have got out was drop out that
nest and go through that door, like he come in.
Your Mother always had chickens, too, and eggs?
Yes , matam.
I bet she was a good fried chicken cooker,
wasntt she?
She was. She was a good cook .
Did she ever cook on an open fireplace1
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Yes , ma ' am. Oh , yes , ma'am . She raised us on
an open fireplace . I remember the first stove .
The first stove we bought , I remember it . For
a long time she had 8 pi ece of iron , go across
the chimney, you know . When they build the
chimney, they stick the iron in t he chi mney,
then they have a pot , with a little ol d hook
and the ball , hook up there over the f ire .
That the way they cook , pot hanging up over
the fire . Then they have an oven. Rake Borne
coals out , put the br ead in t he oveD , set it
on the coals , get them a l id , and get em some
coals and put em on top of the lid and bake
them some bread.
It ' s l ots better than any you can cook now,
ian ' t it?
That ' s the truth . When you cook on these wood
stove , it ' s better .
Than any electric stove , or gas?
Sho is . My chillun say that ain ' t what i t is .
I say, "Well , what it is , then? II They say ,
"You was hongry then , you a i n ' t hongr y n ow . II
But that potlikker with that bread in it ,
cooked down, oh, it was so good. And potatoes
cooked in those ashes, wrap them up and put
them in there .
You ain't never seen nobody rake back some
ashes and got ••••• and made em some bread , and
got a piece of paper bag , and pat that bread
out on a piece of paper bag , and put it in and
sot it in front of that fire till it dried off ,
and then rake them ashes over it and leave it
till it got done .
No , I haven ' t seen that.
That ' s the best br ead . Then when it get done,
you get it out there . See , that paper gain burn
off . Then you wash it , get all them gri t off
of them . You let it dry , it ain ' t gonna be
gritty . Then , wash it , get all them gr its off ,
and crumble it up and let it get cool and get
you some milk . O- h-h, that thing eat so good .
It some good stuff .
Well, you can ' t cook on your fireplace anymore .
You got gas in the r e , haven ' t you?
You can move that heater. Notice how long that
thing is? You j ust move that thing and set it
back against the wall .
Well , as much as gas is goi ng to cost , we ' re
al l going to have to have fir es this winter.
Much as it done cost us this winter .
Go ing to have to take a saw and go to the woods ,
or an axe and come back with the wood , aren ' t we?
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Ain't nothing but the truth . That ' s the truth .
My hot water heater on gas , my stove ' s gas ,
and I got two heaters on gas , and that call
for a lot of gas . And it cold, and we got to
have beat . Have to have hot water .
My chil dren can't bel ieve that when I grew up
it used to get so cold in our house that the
water would f r eeze in the room where I was
sleeping.
Well , that's the truth. Freeze right wher e we
s l eeping . And the water i n the kitchen be
nothin but ice in the morn in .
That I S right .
your face and
Have to
hands .
That ' s the truth .
break the ice to wash
And break some mor e to make coffee . But they
don ' t know anything about that.
Chillun , they donlt remember nothin like that .
Tbey might not have to go through that .
I gl ad I raised hard . Every now and then I say,
IIThank you, Jesus , for the many blessings . II
When I got marr ied, I had two chairs, and along
then lot of women come to see women a l ong then .
I be sittin in one of the chair s , and the fi r st
lady come , and t he next one find some ol d bucket
or keg or somet hing to sit on. Or just sit
r ight down on the f l oor . Li ke they come i n and
they just come bring a plate , bring t heir food .
There was so much of good love in the world then .
Fol ks j us t bring you food, f eed you.
Share whatever they had.
Yes , ma l am. And we didn l t had nothin f or them
to sit on . Some of them, they sit flat down on
the floor . And like in the spr ing of the year
when they put out the fert i lizer, the women be
glad to get them sacks . Wash them fer til izer
s acks , make sheets , pill ow case , curtains, bed­spreads
. Sew t hem things toge t her, sit down and
cut t hem all the way r ound , kinda ravel them on
the ends, and white em, and they be the prettiest
kind of bedspr eads . I have one on my bed, and
it be l ooking so good, every now and t hen I
look back at it . It looked so good on my bed .
Fer til izer sack curtains hanging up on the
window. Fert ilizer sack pillow sl ips. That
was all I had . Take them fe r tilizer s acks and
make underskirts , made the boys shir ts and my
chillun clothes , under clothes , out of them .
Glad to get them. One time a white man give my
husband some paper bags . His fer tilizer come in
paper bags. But you know what be done? He
sent the sacks and got the s ame , just as many
paper bags as he sont fertilizer in . He sont
them brand new sacks , never had no fertilizer
in them . I didn ' t have not hing to do but ravel
them and sew them up . They were alr eady clean .
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Did you work any at the Freedom Quilting Bee?
Yes , ma'am. I worked there for six years.
Do you still make quilts?
I ain't made no quilt now in about two years .
I used to make em, but my eyes got so bad I had
to stop. Dr . Callaway say my right eye most gone.
If I could see good, I 'd quilt . This one here
most gone , and that's what make me thing I
can 't see out of narn, cause the best side over
here, and the best s ide most gone . I can't see
so good . And it hard to thread a needl e and I
stopped picking up a needle. I be wanting to
pick em up , but I scared I finish putting my
eye out.
I could make pretty quilts, too .
r bet you could. What was your favo r ite pattern?
Last quilt I made, I believe it was a big star
allover the bed.
It 's got so many of those little diamond shaped
pieces .
It easy to make . You can make it so quick .
Oh , I don't believe I could ever make one.
It ain't nothing to make. That's the easiest
quilt you could make. Let me see. I started •••••
I started on a Monday night and about the last
part of the week I put that quilt together.
Don ' t take me no time to make it. But I set
down and sew with my hands. I didn 't har dly
sew with a machine, because it hard for me to
thread the needle . If I could find it her a ,
I made two.
(End Side 2 , Tape 1)

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Holding.Institution

Birmingham Public Library (Alabama)

Full Text

1
Interview with Indiana Pettway
Date of Interview: May, 1980; Geels Bend, Alabama
Interviewer: Kathryn Tucker Windham
Transcriber: Edna O. Meek
Begin Side 1, Tape 1
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I got plenty of children.
Well, do any of them live here at the house with
you?
I got four grands stayi ng bere, the two I telling
you about from up at Camden, and I got two small
grands. One go to kindergarten and the other
go to Day Care.
Up here at Tinnie Dell's, or at the other one,
acrOBs the road?
The boy go to Camden, and the girl go to kinder­garten.
This girl here (pointing to photograph),
she getting her a house . She done got a bid on
her land . She getting one of these brick houses
what coming here. You hear talk of them? What
they gonna build .
Yes, the McCarthys have been working on them,
trying to get them built down here, I think .
Haven't they? Now, what did you tell me your
full name was?
Indiana Pettway.
Indiana Pettway. And you're named for your
Mother.
Yes , ma'am.
And you grew up right down here in Gee's Bend?
Yes, ma ' am. Right down there in front of the
store. That's where I was born; that's where I
was raised; and that's where I got grown. And
when I married, I come here.
Then you remember when they built these houses
down here then?
Dh, yes, ma'am . I was a grown woman then.
Were you married then?
No'm. I wasn't married.
Just a grown woman. Well, did you move into one
of those houses they built? The government
houses? And were you the first one to live in
this house?
No, ma'am. This man I married, he had been
married, and his wife died.
Well, he and his wife had been living in this
house, then?
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She had been living here . She was a young woman
when she died.
And what was his name, Indiana?
Spurlin Pettway .
Ob. Spurlin. Hefs the preacher.
He was thirty seven years old when we married.
I wanted to know what the houses looked like
before they built these new houses down here.
What kind of house did you grow up in?
I growed up in a plank house . It was a double­tenant.
My Mother and Father lived in one part,
and the children stayed in the other part. It
was one house when it was built, and it had one
big room and a back room. After these chillun
added, then he had another house built to that.
This house he had built to that, hold five beds.
It was a great big old place, and all us lived
in there. He and Mama lived in that, and the
other part of the chillun lived in the back
room. My Mama had a lot of chillun . She was
the mother of fifteen chillun. She had a lot of
chillun . Three of them died . She raised the
rest of them to be grown.
Twelve .
But was
houses,
Well, that's a lot to raise, isn't
there a wide hall between those two
or were they just separate houses?
it?
There was a hall between them, and you could go
to the window and talk to them through the
window. And the kitchen was on the ground.
The kitchen was built out of ply, some old ply,
and it didn't have no floor in it. Stove was
sitting on the ground . After a while , that one
got burnt up. I made a fire in the stove, and
I reckon the pipe must have been full of soot;
and it said "whoa-whoa-whoa n, and then it sot
it afire, and I come running out of there and
told them the kitchen was on fire and it got
burn up. Then, when they build it again, I
don't know whar they got that tin, but took that
tin and built the kitchen. And still had that
floor. And I think it stayed on that ground
floor till the government built us houses.
Then, when the government built us houses,
Auntie , his Sister, got disabled to work . She
worked .for Miss Liddell and then, over there
in Camden, while she was able. She got dis­abled
to work, she moved there and she stayed in
the back in the same house where us stayed
until Mr . Cammack come down here and tear it
down . And he had to tear the house down, then
she moved in one of the rooms. And stayed there
a while, and her nieces come and got her and
carried her to see them, and she stayed there
until she died.
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Raised everything us at, us raised. Raised
us hogs, chickens, corn, sweet potatoes, pea­nuts,
had a garden. Peas. Everything most
us at, us raised. Us would buy our flour,
sugar, coffee, sumpin like that, but our meat
and stuff ; our chickens coming off our yard;
our eggs coming out that hen house; and our
barn; our eggs and chickens. None of t hat
goin to the store, talking bout 11m goin to
3
get groceries. We raised ••• us worked. I tell
my chillun a l l the time, I worked. Yes, ma'am.
I worked.
From the time you were a little girl.
On till I got disabled to work, I worked.
Did you work in the field?
Yes 'm.
When did you start working in the fields?
Well, I tell you. I went in there when I was
six years old, ceuse I wouldn ' t nurse . Mama
got tired of beating me bout not tending her baby .
I just wouldn ' t tend no baby. She just sont me
on in the field. I be back there p l aying in
the field till I got old enough to work. Be out
there a little while, Papa set me in the shade.
r always was his pet. She just sont me on to
him. I play back there a little while, he send
me in the shade . And I reckon r was about eight
years old before I went to work. You know, sho
nuff work, and then when I went to work, r worked
from Monday morning till Thursday night; and
then Friday I come home and get on that wash
board and wash clothes. Didn't know nothing
bout no washing machine. Hadn't never seen
narn. Just get on that rub board and wash
them clothes. Wash them out with water, put
em in a pot, soap in there; get a stick and
chug em; take em out of there; wash em out
in another water; rinse them in two waters
and hang em out, and they just as white and
pretty as they could be. They'd be heap
prettier then than they be now.
Did you have a well to ge t the water from?
Yes, ma'am. We had a well, But before my
Daddy dug the well, us used to ge t water from
t he creek. Tote water from the creek to wash
with. But it was a heap of us, and time us
made a turn, us bad a beap of water .
What creek was that, Foster Creek?
That creek right down there.
Right back of the house?
No'm. It ain't none of Foster Creek. All I
know is it a creek.
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Well, that ls a pretty good ways to tote water,
wasntt it?
Thatls whar us had to tote it from. And after
I got married, I still worked . My baby got six
weeks old , I went back to the field . My chillun
were big enough to left home, I put em in the
wagon ; put 8 ticking in there and 8 cradle for
my baby to lay on; carried their milk in the
field; and I worked. Come home , jump out that
wagon ; go in that garden ; get some green and pick
em; put em on the fire ; put on me some bread.
Then I go back in the garden while them cooking ;
get me some more ; pick em and clean em for the
next morning . I was poor and I didn't have
nothing, bad to cook what I had . And sometimes
I carry my pot in the field , when the peas, you
know , full out; carry my pot in the field; carry
my meat in the field; cook my bread at home.
Get me some brick and set that pot on; shell
me some peas ; go out there by the well and wash
em; put em in that pot; stir em . Then I have me
something to feed my chillun on . Can ' t nobody
tell me nothing bout no hard work , and no hard
way to go . I done had a good time , and I had a
rough time . Both of em .
I was s atisfied with it . It wasn ' t worrisome
to me , because I didn ' t know no better . I wasn't
used to that much , and I come up that a-way,
and I was used to it . And there so many folks ,
all the folks were just alike . See , if it had- a
been a whole lot of fo l ks had something and I
was that a - way , I WOUl d- a fe l t bad . 8¥er ybody waS
just alike, and you could make it like that .
Well , it's not much better eating anywhere than
peas and bread, or greens and bread.
No , ma ' am . That ' s the truth .
You got a garden now?
Yes , matam. I ain ' t goin miss my garden .
You got any water melons planted?
Yes, ma ' am. I 'm eatin turnip salad right now .
Well , that's wonderful. Did you ever plow any
in the field?
No , ma ' am . I didn't plow . I hoed, picked cotton,
but I never did plow. Had a l ot of brothers and
they done the pl owing. Us done the hoeing, the
girls done the hoeing . When I mar ried , my hus ­band
and boys done the plowing . I never did
plow . Don't know nothin bout no plowing, but I
sho hoed . Used to pick cotton. Could solid
pick cotton .
How much could you pick?
Pick over two hundred. Air day I got ready . Then
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I walk home and cook supper fore the night. You
know, I walked from Cobb's Landing. I was real
heavy with that girl you see right there, and I
walked from Cobb's Landing every evening and
come home and cook supper. Now I just tell these
young folk, when they get pregnant - "I ain't
able, I can't do such and Buchu - ain't nothing
like it. And my next girl I had, I had two
g irls in front of the boy, then the boy come;
the next girl behind this one, I went in the
field that evening. My water broke in that field.
I bad on my apron. I just took that apron and
backed back, and took the apron and chug it
down and poked it up under me, and kept on pick­ing
cotton. I picked cotton till knocking off
time. Knocking off time, I come out the field;
bathed my little chillunj cleaned up on kitchen.
And the next morning I said, "Spurlin, I don't
believe I go back toady. I ain't sick, but I
skeered to go back". And I didn't go back that
day. Next morning , I got up and I washed; I
mopped all the way through this housej and I got
up and I fried me something to eatj and milked
my COWSj and I churned my milk, and fixed some
bread. And that evening, me and him sittin up
here talking , wasn't a thing ail me. I went
to bed about nine o'clock that same night , and
I ca lled him and said, "Spurlin, come on and
get up and go with me". Us didn't have no bath ­room.
I said, "Come on, go with me outdoors."
I got to the door, it had rained , and I said,
"Go back and get my shoes". Ground was wet.
He brought my shoes, and when I come back, I
put one foot up on that bed, and I said, "Ub, oh.
Get up, get up and go get the Granny. I need
the Granny." He said, "I ain I t gwin nowhere.
Ain't nothing ailing you, ticklish as you is."
That thing tickled me, because it, you know,
cramped. I said, lIyou better get up from there."
And I wouldn't get in the bed then. And I go t
up and fixed my bed so I wouldn't soil it. And
he hung around. And I said, "You better get up
out of that bed. II He got up and hi tched up the
wagon to go get Granny, and that wagon hadn't
got no further than the next house you see down
there, when I done had that baby!
You could have called him to come on back home,
couldn't you?
I had done had that baby. And now, folks ••••••
Was that your first boy?
That was my second girl.
Well, who was the Granny he was going to get?
Louella.
Now they
Back in them times,
go to a hospital.
we used a Granny.
Well, you got along just fine with that Granny,
too, didn It you?
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She did. But you know, they lost a lot of women
in chil dbirth . They saving more women now , it
look like, than they was saving back in my time.
You know, sometime I be so scared I'm goin die .
I be so scared , and every time my time come
around , 8 woman'd die in childbi rth . A lady
died ten days before I got down in childbirth,
and I was so scared . Looked like I was going
to die , all I could say or do . But you know,
before I got down , all that scare went away.
And when I got to hurt ing, I forgot I was scared.
Well, did he bring the Granny back that night?
Yes, ma lam . She come in. And every time she'd
come, she'd peek around the door at me . I was
fast, and if I ever started hur ting , I was just
like that (snaps fingers), and every time she'd
come in , my baby'd be born.
One time she come, she come with the boy now, he
warn't born . She peeked around the door, and I
said, lIyou better not peep around the door, you
better come on in . " My next door neighbor, she'd
be over here with me. Me and her would be just
talking and laughing . She ' d say , IIIr I coul d
bear pain like you, I wouldn I t mind havi ng babies . II
I say , flIt hurt, but it don't hurt all the time .
When it go away, there ain ' t nothing else ail
you till another one."
What did sbe bring with her to help you bave the
baby?
Nothing . Not a thin g . She come there and put
her hand on her knee and sit up there and go to
sleep. Nothing . Not a thing . And when that
baby born, she have a little ole scissors in
there to cut its navel, and bathe it and put its
clothes on . Mash your stomach and put something
tight under your stomach. Sometimes the after
birth be hard to come. Do like that, and it'll
come. She didn ' t have nothing .
And didn ' t have anything to give you for pain?
No'm . I didn ' t never suffer with no pains after
they rolled me. But I had a sister. Lord bave
mercy, that lady, after she borned her baby, she
had them hard pains. She use aspirin. She get
her a bottle of aspirin.
That's not very strong for that kind of pain ,
is it?
Well , nothing it look like were doing her no good.
Look l ike ••••• along in then it was rough . * It
was really rough . And in time, the R. C .~ when
the R. C., folks was pl owing bulls, it was rough
then . A piece of bread, you didn't bit more have
nothing to eat with it than nothing . You had
that piece of bread, it was so good. Now, peoples
was hongry then . Us had a garden, had two gardens
* Possibly Reconstruction Finance Corp ., one of the early
relief a gencies .
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rals1ng turnips. And one night us laid down,
and a lady had some goats. Got up the next
morning , and that lady's goats had done cleaned
us garden. Et em all up. It was tough .
You didn't eat the goat, did you?
Then wasn't none of our goats.
I would have been tempted to eat tha t goat for
eating my garden .
We beet him t i ll his mouth bled. That lady got
mad about us beating her goat, and that goat
ate up all us greens. Sbe was so mad. It was
tough. It was rough.
Was that about the time when Mr . Rentz' family
broke up everybody over here?
Yes'm.
time.
That come sbortly right along in that
Broke up the folks.
Did they break up your family?
No'm, didn't break up my Daddy. He and his sister
was strong, and she still stayed strong in all
things. It didn't break him. He paid out. The
hogs and dogs were holler ing, the babies were
hollering, the chillun were hollering . You know
how chillun is, bothering they things. Somebody
getting em. Them little chillun crying , the
white folks getting them hogs. Heap of them died
before they got to the river . That lady said she
didn ' t gain nothing. She lost. She hopes she
had-a not broke up them folks, cause she lost.
She woulda got more if she had left them like
they were , let them paid out. Course , it wasn't
her doings, it was her brother. It wasn't her,
it was her brother. She had a mean brother.
Well , I had heard about how they brought t he
wagons over here and just took everything, didn't
they?
Took hogs, cows , everything from them folks .
Didn't l eft em nothing. But he didn 't take the
furniture out of the houses.
And the plows?
yes 'm. It was tough .
Yes, that was really hard times.
Yes, ma'am. It was hard. It been hard . I have
made a whole week here i n this house, boiling
peas, putting salt in them, me and my chillun
eatin em. Ain't had no bread, couldn ' t get none.
Di dn ' t have nothing to get none with. A whole
week, boiled peas with salt in em. I ain't bad
a shoe. Narn . Ain't had but one dress . Every
time that dress got nasty, pull it off , wash i t,
hang it out and let it dry , iron it and put it
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back on. My children the same way. It was
hard. But I was young.
But you made it, didn 't you?
Yes, ma'am.
then, and I
about it.
And I was strong
was satisfied and
enough to stand
I warntt worrying
Now, your children were going to school then, too,
weren't they?
Yes'm. Tbey was go in to school. I had some big
enough to go to school. But it wuz tough, and
my oldest ••������������� that girl there, when she finished
school, it was rough for her. She had some
tennises. They had done got raggedy, you know.
The teacher WQuld- talk about all the chl11un,
how they fixed up, how they shoes and things
look. Say she would stick her foots for the
teacher to see her foot. She wanted the teacher
to say something bout her foot. Teacher never
would say nothing about her foot. She said if
she say something about her foot, she gwin ask
her to get her a pair of shoes, but the teacher
wouldn't never bother with her. Bother the
other chillun, but didn't bother her. She was
real smart in school, and she knowed she wont
fit. Now, she was in the 12th grade. She
knowed she wont fit, but the teacher never would
say nothing bout her clothes and what she would
wear, but the other chillun, she just talk about
they clothes, but she never did talk about her.
And when she started, she put her foot out so
the teacher could see she had on those shoes, and
the teacher wouldn't say nothing about her. She
say she say something bout her and she'd say,
!lWell, tbat's all I got . Give me a pair of
shoes to wear to scbool, please, rna' am." She
said she would bave asked her for a pair of
shoes, but she wouldn't talk about her.
Now, this was down here at the school at Boykin1
Yes, ma'am.
And after sbe graduated, what did she do? Did
she get married then?
NaIrn. She went to Bridgeport and went to work.
Well, when you were a little girl down here,
what did y'a11 do at Christmas time?
Places to go play, to house where they have
little selling and bands, and what not. Go to
the house and play. Santa Claus come and bring
us what little he gwie bring. Chillun, you
know, wasn't like it is now. Us didn't get
plenty of things like chillun get now. Sometime
us be lucky enough to catch a doll; sometime
be an apple, or orange or candy.
Did you have anything at the church at Christmas?
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See, I was small then. Mama and them, they go
to the church for Christmas Watch Night, you
know. Go there about 9 or 10 o'clock and
stay all night till sunrise in the morning.
Didn't carry no chillun then. Left chillun home
at night. I went to Sunday School in the day,
I come back home. When church start, then they
send the kids back home. But I hated to go to
that Sunday School . That was something I didn't
want to do. I l 'eft home crying, but in all my
crying, I went to that Sunday School every Sun­day
morning.
Why did you hate to go?
I wanted to go play. I get tired settin up in
that church. No, gracious. I didn't want to
go . But i t was good. If you make your child
go to church when they young, he'll go there
when he get old . He canlt help from going
there, if you get up a certain age. Now, if
I don't go to church on Sunday, and warn't
sick and didn't go to church, I warn't going
nowhere that Sunday, long as folks was holding
meeting, till the meeting broke. I felt like
I was too guilty to go out in the road with
folks holding meeting. You couldn't get me to
go nowhere. I gain stay home till meeting broke,
and after meeting broke, then I could go free.
That guilt was on me.
Somebody down here was telling me about the
visions you used to have to have before you
could join the church.
Well, that going on now.
I know. Tinnie Dell was talking to me about it .
Yes , ma'am. You had to go in the woods and pray.
Pray hard, too.
Did you do that?
Yes, ma'am. I sbo did .
And this was before you married Rev. Spurlin,
was it?
Yes, malam.
You were, reckon, how old?
Seventeen.
Almost grown young lady, girl, weren't you?
I wasn't nothing but chillun, cause I grow slow.
You get grown according to how you grow, and
I grow slow. I was the runt of all of Mama's
chillun. I'm the smallest one and always been
the smallest one. Littlest one in the bunch,
and I always been the littlest one. Never did
half grow. I stayed chillun a long time. Yes ,
ma'am. We had to pray.
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Do you remember where you went? In the woods
near the house, somewhere?
10
Sometimes I walk down in the swamp. Sometimes
I walk around and get me a praying ground out
there back of the house in the woods. Some­times
it be nighttime , I just come outdoors and
sit on the hill and pray. That's where I got
the religion that night. I walked all night l ong.
I couldn't stay in the house, and I couldn't stay
out there either. I was just restless. Every­where
I go, I warn't contented. Go in the
house, I couldn't stay, and I couldn't stay out.
Just restless.
Got up that morning, I was goin in the field.
I seed myself that night. I was laying out, out
there at Pleasant Grove. Pleasant Grove was
out there where the school house is. I was
right there, and I was right there where that
cow gap is, but that cow gap , it warn't there
then. That's whar I was standing up there, and
there was a casket there. And I was standing
up over the casket. There was an old man, old
man Joe T.; he was a preacher, Monroe and them
granddaddy. I was standing up over the casket,
I was standing up there, and Indiana was laying
in the casket. I looked in there and Bay, 1I0h,
there Indiana in the casket and here Indiana
standin up over the casket. II And when I say that,
this Indiana riz up out of the casket and she
went OD; had on a long white gown , and she went
thataway . I see myself again, I gwin around a
curve, found some big plums. And a lady say,
IIIndiana tl
• I say, ''Yes, ma'am". She said,
"If you go round there, you go ahead on around
there, but hell hounds goin get on your track.1I
And when that lady said that, it was 'bout fifteen
spotted hounds got in 'hind me, just barkin'
on my track. I seed myself again, I climbin' a
mountain. That mountain was so steep, and every­time
I get most up it, I fall back. Every-thing
I catch, it'd pull up by the roots. Catch
a weed, and it'd pull up by the roots. Catch a
bush, that bush'd pull up by the roots. And I
scuffled and I scuffled till I did get up on the
top of that mountain. It was a hard struggle.
I seed myself again, I was digging down in those
weeds. Just diggin, diggin away. Every time I
dig, I di g till I hit the rock; when I hit the
rock, that water come pouring out. I was so
happy that Thursday morning . The world looked
brand new. My hand looked brand new. I felt
brand new. I felt light; I felt good; I couldn't
never finish telling it. And I ain't finished
yet. 1'm yet tellin it.
And did you tell that to the congregation?
Yes , ma'am.
And then they l et you join the church?
Yes, ma'am.
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And changed your whole life , didn ' t it?
Yes , ma ' am , it changed it . The thing I used to
do , just like a horse , you know . You know ,
when you get ready to ride a horse , you put
a br id l e on it . And that bridle guide that
horse . You pull that b r id l e the way you want
that horse to go . And that ' s just the way I
is . I got sump in that pul l me , guide ms .
TI Indiana , that I s wr ong . Don t t you do it . II
Something talking within, telling you tha t' s
wr ong . If you go to do wrong, you could do
it , but you stepping over the r ight spir it
when you do it . The spirit goin talk on your
con science and te l l you that's wrong , don ' t
do that . Well, if you obey, you won ' t do too
many wrong things . And then , if you been con­verted
, you got love in your heart for every­body.
You could ho l d conversations with any­body.
You love everybody . You ain ' t got no
hate about you . I ain ' t got to hate you for
what you got . I don ' t hate you cause of your
color. You ' re a lady and I 'm a lady . God
made you just like He made me , and He .• • • • •
He loves you j ust like He l oves me .
That ' s the truth , He do. He loves me and you
both . I ain ' t got no cause to hate you , and
you ain ' t got no cause to hate me . God l oves
both of us . God died for you and He died for
me . Died fo r both of us. Died for a l l of us .
And He said , "Love one another . II
That ' s true. And He ' ll fix you so that people
cou.ld walk over you and you could stand it .
You can stand it . You know fol ks mistreat you,
and sometime your mouth wil l open just like
tha t , and He shut it back f or you . You just
t rust .
Well , after you were able to join the church,
then were you baptized? Where were you baptized?
Same cr eek where Lil lie Bel le and I stay over.
That same creek . Joined the Pleasant Grove
Baptist Church, under the pastor , Rev . W. M.
Cade .
Now , is he dead?
Yes , ma' am . He been dead about , to tell the
truth , twenty year s , I reckon .
Well , he was pastor down her e a long time ,
wa sn ' t he?
Yes , ma ' am , he was . He was pastor of the church
a long time . He was a home preacher ; ra i sed ,
young and all . After he quit , Rev . Gil ber t
pastor. He went to church tha t Sunday , pr eached
that day in the church , and died in the church .
He died in the church?
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He fell dead in the church .
Well , now , that was a happy way for him to die ,
wasn ' t it?
It sho wuz. He pestored a church over the river,
and his wife say when they left home, he 8ay ,
"I won 't be back . II She said, "Why you talking
bout you won't be back? What you gwin stay i l l
night?" "I just told you, I won't be back."
She said he loved the neck bones, and they went
to town and bought some neck bones that Saturday
evening . He said , "What you putting on all that
stuff for? Don ' t nobody eat it but me . Don't
cook but a little now , ' cause don ' t nobody eat
it but me. II And he went there and took some
out the pot before he went to the barn, and
said, IIJust put enough in there for me , ' cause
I ain ' t goin to est here tomorr ow evening. This
meal and in the morning , that's the last meal
I 'm gwin eat here . "
She didn ' t know . She wasn ' t thinking about he
was talking about dyi ng . He went on working .
We come from chur ch that Sunday , and I got in
my door , and I went in there, and I t urned on
my stove to fix dinner , and my next door neigh­bor
and little baby girl come over her e. All of
them call me Cousin Nar. She come her e and she
say , "Cousin Nar , Cousin Sweet PaPta dead . " I say ,
"What?" "Cousin Dear was dead . I And I went
on the door, and Mama said, "Yeah , he dead. II
I say , tlHe ain't . " She say , "Yeah , he is , too.
You better come on and let's go down ther e . "
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. )
Told me, "I ain ' t gonna live a year. " I say ,
"Nigger , get out of my face . " She 8ay , "You
done had dinner?" And I say , "NO . " "Come on
out here and get Borne dinner." I s ay , "Man, I
can ' t eat . How you ' spect me to eat when rot.
br other just died . I can l t swallow nothin . I
"No need y ' all looking at me . I 'm gain fall
over dead."
And Patty died in May . And the next year in
Mar ch , Gilbert was dead . They told me they wuz
gain die with their shoes on, and they didn ' t
pull them off .
My Mother died l ike that . My Mother went to
chur ch that night , and she just shouted allover
that church. All around there just shakin fol ks
hands , having a good time . And she was so neat
and clean . I washed for her . Did her clothes ,
done her washin and iron in . Kept her clean,
helped her put em on . Went to church that night,
had some sort of progr am down the r e, singin
progr am , and sbe 8ay , "I got somethin to tell you . "
I want ed to kn ow what i t was so bad, and she
woul dn' t t ell me .
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I went on down there Monday morning ; they had
a funeral t hat Monday morning , my second cousin
died . He had the flu. I went down that Monday.
I got right on the step_ I didn't set in nare
chair. She said, "I been in the garden all
day and I had a bad sick spell. Done somethin
I ain't done in forty years, lay down on the
ground. Y' all gwin have plenty of greens to
Bat. 1I I say, IIWbat ail you? You goin eat em
as good ss us . Where you goin be you can't eat
em?1I She say. "I ain't goin eat none. I'm
gwin be flying a r ound in heaven. Y'all goin be
8atin these gr eens . II Just like that. I Bay,
"I'll see." ItYeah, you see. What I had to
tell you yes t erday evening, I couldn't tell you,
cause Net kept a -following me , II - that her knee
baby - !land I did·n ' t want her to hear, and you're
the strongest one of my chillun, and I wanted to
tell you I got some money right here. When I
die, you get it and gie it to Paddy, 'cause he
might be done used up t hat he got , and he would
have some money to help bury me ."
She had joined Brownlee Funeral Home . Now , she
belonged to the SOCiety of Friends , but he might
need some money. You gie it to him. I say,
"You ought to done been bought Big Bud some
flowers wit h that money." That's her oldest
son ; we joke about him all the time. Every time
Bi g Bud wants something, Mama don 't have but a
quarter, Big Bud wants some flower, she sho goin
buy 'em.
Y'all tease her about it.
I sot down there, me and her talked , and after
a while Daisy said, "Come on , let 's go to the
funeral. II Went to the funeral, and I come home
that evening , and I coul dn't do nothin . Mama
told me, "I'm gonna steal away from y' all.
I'm goin steal away. Y'all won't know nothing
about when I go . I 'm goin steal away . II
I wan't studyin about it , 'cause I knowed it
wsrn't so . It didn't worry me, but I got home
a load fell on me. I tried to cook , I couldn 't
cook. Tried to hoe my garden, couldn't hoe my
garden. I went to my next door neighbor's house .
I say , "Something botherin me , didn 't know what
it is, I just worried . I don 't know what ails
me. 1I She say, "You know this trouble ain't over .
Somebody else gwin die." I say, "You shut up
that ra cket. Mama just speak from nothing but
old", just like that. I say, "I be glad when
Spurlin come out of the field. II She say, "For
what?" I say , "So us can talk. 1I
And when he come out of the field, he sot down
right there. I couldn ' t say nothing and he
couldn 't say nothing. He said one word and I
couldn't say narn, I didn 't know what to say_
He say, "How come that rat cutting up up there?"
I didn't say nothing then . After awhile , I say,
"Let 's us go to bed, us can talk." Went on
to bed. He went to sleep. I lay up there and
couldn't go to sleep. He said, "What ails you,
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you scared of burglar? " I said, "I ain' t
scar ed . II He said, "Well, what ails you?"
I say , "I don't know, just can ' t sleep."
And I lay up there woke, cars go by and
chill un come up here, and I hear them coming
up here . They got in the gate and called,
14
"Mama I" I didn I t say nothing . Call me again
and knock on the door . I say , "Get up and open
this door , Spurlin, get up and open the door,
Mama dead or Papa one. II He say , "How come you
think somebody dead?1I I say, IIMams dead. I
know my Daddy , and be wouldn ' t disturb me for
nobody being sick . He ' d just say, 'Wait till
tomorr ow , I ' ll tell her tomorrow , I won't wake
her up , t but somebody down there dead . II He
got up and opened the door. Boy come in there
and sai d, "Auntie say come down ther e, Mama
dead . 11 I say, Ills? How ' d she die?" "Got
out the bed and fell over the s l opjar. Papa
woke us up to put her back in bed. Auntie
cleaned her up. Auntie kept a-staying there
so long, she wouldn ' t come out of the r e , and
when Auntie come out of there she said, ' I
hate to tell y ' all , I been in that room trying
to get nerve enough to tell you. I hate to
tell y ' all , but Mama ' s dead. ,II That the way
she died.
And how long ago was that?
Twenty six years ago.
And where did you bury her?
Pettway . Up there at Pettway. Way down in
Pettway Swamp . That whar the graveyard was
then . My Daddy buried in Carson.
Is that graveyard still there in the swamp?
I don ' t know.
folkses there
church .
I know they stopped buryin
and went to buryin them to the
Eot of those old graveyards were plowed over.
I think that ' s what that one is . I think that
most the reason they stopped burying there .
Somebody say they plowed them over. I ain't
been there since they buried Mama, but my
sister went down there once or twice, but I
didn't go with her. I know they buried my baby
brother up there . I got two sisters buried up
there, my baby brother buried there, my oldest
brother buried there, Mama buried there. I
know they coul dn't plow my baby br other , 'cause
be was a veter an and he was in a •• •• his vault
was steel, put that cement top on there , got
them some cement and gummed it together . I
know couldn ' t plow that up . Could plow around
it, but couldn ' t plow it, cause I stayed there
till they finished . I got two , four, think I
got five brothers up there.
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Well , the girls have lived longer than the
boys, have they?
I got three sisters dead, there are four of
us living, the rest of them dead.
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Well, who prepared your Mother's body for
burial? This aunt you were talking about, neig­bors
, or who? Do you remember?
Brownlee . She went to Brownlee Funeral Home
in Camden.
Well, do you remember before they had funeral
homes, when you used to fix the bodies at home?
Yes, ma ' am. We used to bathe the dead folks,
dried them, lay them out on a long board. Sit
up over lem all night and bury 'em the next
morning . Yes, ma ' am , I remember.
And who made the coffins for them? Where did you
get the coffins?
They had 8 Home Society.
and make the coffins out
put them in it .
They get the planks
of them . Make a box and
And it didn ' t cost anything, really, much, did
it?
No ' m. Cause, you see, just like you pay $).00
to join the society, pay a dollar a month to
stay in . Then when you died, they already had
the planks and things, and the black cloth to
line it wi~h . They make your coffin . Put you
in a wagon and carry you to the graveyard.
And somebody would dig the grave for you?
Yes, ma ' am .
Deacons just
and they dig
We had folks to dig the grave .
tell the brothers to dig the graves,
them.
And the wagon they took you in, would it be a
borrowed wagon?
No, ma ' am. Mostly folks along then had got
wagons, as I can remember . The wagon and mule
be creakin' along, folks walk in , along behind
them.
And did they sing as they went to the cemetery?
I don't remember them singing when they buried
them . Just buried them.
I remember going to one funeral where, after
they put the body down in the grave, and before
they covered it up, they handed little children
back and forth across the grave . Have you ever
seen that done?
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NaIrn. I seem them get a little dirt and drap
it in, and say, "Ashes to ashes and dust to dust,
for the generations. II or something , but I ain't
seen them hand little children across. And I
have started bathing babies myself. Lady's baby
died over there, and I bathed him by myself,
dressed him. He come here hollerin and he
hollered till he died. I bathed the baby, combed
his little hair, and he was so pretty. Dressed
him in that little white thing . Tuk him in my
arms and carried him in there for his Mama to
see. I say, Ilyou want to see your baby?1I She
say, "Yeah, bring him here and let me see him. II
Lord, I just undone. That woman hollered. I
said, "Woman, don't holler. Take it easy, you
goin make yourself sick. Cause you gwie sho
get you another baby. I know you hate your baby
dead, but you still young enough to get you
another one . Don't make yourself sick. II That
was the prettiest baby.
I wonder what was wrong with him.
I just don't know. I really don't know. He
just hollered, just had them crying spells, just
cry. And I go there every morning , go there and
change her bed; carry some water to wash herself
off; take the baby and bathe him; dress h i m.
And the morning before he died, the morning
before he died, he didn't cry that morning. He
died the next morning, first light. The morn­ing
the day before he died, I want there that
morning, bathed him. Her sister there and I
say, "Look how he looking." "Sho is. t, IILook
like he know what I doing. He not crying a bit."
Now, that baby was dying then, but I didn't kn ow
it. He just looking about. I bathed it, got
one or two draps of warm water, put it in his
mouth, carried it in there. Marie said she slept
all night, when she woke up, she say, "Ub, uh."
That all she say. Put her teat in his mouth, and·
the baby sucked her titty, and the baby, when he
turned her titty loose and his head drapped, and
when he did that, she say that baby was dead.
I thought maybe it might have smothered.
Nolm. She was woke when he died. Th at's the
onliest morning he didn't cry. All the other
mornings he cried and fretting. He couldn't
holler •••••
Sounded like a kitten, did he?
He didn't fret a bit that morning. He was a
pretty baby. Me and her was ••••• when I get down
she wait on me. Us wouldn't hardly be together,
but both of us goin be pregnant most not so far
apart. One get down, one goin wait on the other
one. She wait on me, and I wait on her. Didn't
care what she doin, she didn't get too busy to
come there fore she went to the field, clean me,
clean up my bed, clean my baby up. Feed us our
breakfast, and then go to the field.
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Now, that ' s a blessing to have a friend like
that, ian ' t it?
17
Yes, ma'am. Me and her been up here for many
years. And she n ever been mad with me, but I
ain 't been mad with her. I don't know she been
mad with me. If she been mad with me , I didn 't
know it, and I know I ain't been mad with her,
and I know I ain 't bad nare cross words with her,
and she ain 't had narn with me. Us chillun was
raised up here together, played together, at
together , stayed together when they went away
from her. Rent them a big old apartment and all
of them stayed together, sisters and brothers.
And when they was coming up, when gOing to
school, when anybody in t erfere with one, they
interfer e with all of them . That's the way
they come . No fi ght ing , no fuss, they got along
like t hat , good and peaceful .
Just one happy family, wasn't it?
Just one happy family . You never hear a bubbly
word pass their mouth. Nobody us ed no bad words.
Everybody civil- mouthed.
What games did you play when you were littl e , or
were you too busy working in the fields to play
much?
I get some rocks, throw them up on my hand, called
it play jacks. Run and play drap the handker­chief
behind one another . And run around the
ring, steal your partner, steal him back.
Now, did you sing? That was a singing game .
Do you r emember how that song went?
"Run my ring , Colleen,
Run my ring, Colleen .
Steal my partner ,
I 'll steal him back. 11
Then you get out there and steal your partner ,
then the girl come back and steal him back.
That was fun , wasn' t it?
Oh, yes , ma'am . That was good time. It was good.
I liked it. But , you know , when I come along ,
somet ime us would play and us would fight one
another, just get i n a fight, and not be fight ing
'bout nothing. Didn't have no better s en se.
Just a-fighting . Mama used to send me to my
Auntie's house, and Cousin Roman had some boys.
I was scared of them boys . And they were b i g
as sister. I be stealin on by there, and she'll
see me, and say, "Hey, yonder that big girl. II
And them boys be behind me running me ragged,
and I run. Scared of them boys . And they be
runnin at me cause I run from them. I was
s car ed of Monroe and t hem .
Scared of Monroe? He seems like such a nice man.
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Yeah. I was scared of them two boys. Just
scared of em. They knowed I was scared of em.
And they teased you about it, too, didn't they?
They did. They warn't goin do nothin to me, but
I didn't know it.
Did you ever swim any when you were little?
No, ma'am.
live close
the creek .
Never did learn how to swim . Didn l t
by no water. Nearest water was to
But you did fish, didn't you?
Yes, ma 'am. I used to go to fiabin with my Mama,
but I didn ' t want to do it, though. I didn't
want to go to fiabin, but she 'd carry me any­way.
I have a little evil in me, but I had to
keep it covered up 80 it wouldn ' t show. I
didn ' t like to go to fiahin . I went to fiahin
one time with my aunt. I didn't want to go
with her . Every time sbe axed me to go with
her to fish, I got tired . And one time, I
was grown then , I went that time. She just
went on with her fishin. We went to a fishin
hole most to the creek . Every time I thr ow my
hook in, I pullout a great big old perch. I
catch a string of fish, and she didn ' t catch
narn, not narn. Every time I throw my hook in,
the fish just git it and go, and I pullout the
fish . And I stay right there and cotch fish
till she say , "I got to go, I ain't gain catch
nothin.11 And I ain't went back no more . I
wouldn't go back no more. I cleaned them fish
and fried them and me and her et em up.
That's good eating, isn't it?
Oh , that it is. Them ' s good fish . Fresh fish
is good.
I don't expect you liked to put those squiggly
worms on the hook , did you?
No'm, cause I was scared of worms.
of worms. I can ' t stand to tech em
Shets gwin do that .
I was scared
hardly .
You let her bait the hook and you caught all the
fish?
Yes, ma'am. I's scared of worms. Always been
scared of worms. That be my trouble pickin
cotton. I be hurrying to pick as much cotton as
I could fore it get full of worms . It got full
of worms, them bad, big old worms, in September,
and us ud be done picking cotton before it
got full of worms.
Did you ever see any snakes in the fields?
Yes, ma'am. You know, Saturday fore last, I
went in my henhouse. I had a hen in there settin.
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I sot the hen on seventeen eggs, and I sot the
other one on eleven. That hen wasn't big as
the other one, and she couldn't kivver up as
many eggs as the big hen . And I went in there
last Friday, the hen I put on seventeen eggs,
there wasn't but nine under her . And I wondered
where them eggs went. And I didn't have sense
enough to think about a snake could have at em
up. I wasn ' t thinkin '.bout it could have been
a snake. went back in there that Saturday. Two
hens were on the nest together . Had at up all
the eggs from under one. And just as I walked
in the hen house, the nest was fixed like that,
and I looked up, and the nest waS just as full
of snake 8S it could hold . Full of snake. Just
curled up in there. And the nest was full.
And I said, flUb, ub, II and I backed out of there,
and I said, "Spurlin, come here and kill that
snake . " He said, IIWhere he?" "In the hen l s
nest." He say, I1IBout gone now." And I say,
IILook like he asleep . II He got his gun and
shot that snake, and the eggs were just leakin
out of that snake, he was so full of eggs. Great
big old long snake. And that snake had been
eating up them eggs. I had a hen laying on the
ground, the nest would be full of eggs, I go back
there and the eggs would be gone. I put it on
a rat . Must be an old big rat, or a pole cat.
I wondered what that was. And it was a snake.
And I ain lt been back in there. I told them
hens, liDo the best you can. I won lt be back. II
We had a neighbor that had hens setting, and a
snake like that came in and swallowed one of the
eggs, and then crawled through the handle of a
jug that was lying down on the henhouse floor,
and then swallowed another egg, and be was
caught , because he couldn lt go forward or back­ward.
Had an egg on both sides of that jug handle ,
and that snake was just lying there on the hen­house
floor, caught between two eggs in his
stomach.
He like to get in there and break em. That the
way they say they do , they squeeze through a
crack and break em, but that snake was so full
he warnlt able to get out of the nest. I reckon
after while he gonna drap out of that nest on
the gr ound . He couldn't get out of that henhouse
cause warntt no crack for him to come out. Only
way he could have got out was drop out that
nest and go through that door, like he come in.
Your Mother always had chickens, too, and eggs?
Yes , matam.
I bet she was a good fried chicken cooker,
wasntt she?
She was. She was a good cook .
Did she ever cook on an open fireplace1
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20
Yes , ma ' am. Oh , yes , ma'am . She raised us on
an open fireplace . I remember the first stove .
The first stove we bought , I remember it . For
a long time she had 8 pi ece of iron , go across
the chimney, you know . When they build the
chimney, they stick the iron in t he chi mney,
then they have a pot , with a little ol d hook
and the ball , hook up there over the f ire .
That the way they cook , pot hanging up over
the fire . Then they have an oven. Rake Borne
coals out , put the br ead in t he oveD , set it
on the coals , get them a l id , and get em some
coals and put em on top of the lid and bake
them some bread.
It ' s l ots better than any you can cook now,
ian ' t it?
That ' s the truth . When you cook on these wood
stove , it ' s better .
Than any electric stove , or gas?
Sho is . My chillun say that ain ' t what i t is .
I say, "Well , what it is , then? II They say ,
"You was hongry then , you a i n ' t hongr y n ow . II
But that potlikker with that bread in it ,
cooked down, oh, it was so good. And potatoes
cooked in those ashes, wrap them up and put
them in there .
You ain't never seen nobody rake back some
ashes and got ••••• and made em some bread , and
got a piece of paper bag , and pat that bread
out on a piece of paper bag , and put it in and
sot it in front of that fire till it dried off ,
and then rake them ashes over it and leave it
till it got done .
No , I haven ' t seen that.
That ' s the best br ead . Then when it get done,
you get it out there . See , that paper gain burn
off . Then you wash it , get all them gri t off
of them . You let it dry , it ain ' t gonna be
gritty . Then , wash it , get all them gr its off ,
and crumble it up and let it get cool and get
you some milk . O- h-h, that thing eat so good .
It some good stuff .
Well, you can ' t cook on your fireplace anymore .
You got gas in the r e , haven ' t you?
You can move that heater. Notice how long that
thing is? You j ust move that thing and set it
back against the wall .
Well , as much as gas is goi ng to cost , we ' re
al l going to have to have fir es this winter.
Much as it done cost us this winter .
Go ing to have to take a saw and go to the woods ,
or an axe and come back with the wood , aren ' t we?
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Ain't nothing but the truth . That ' s the truth .
My hot water heater on gas , my stove ' s gas ,
and I got two heaters on gas , and that call
for a lot of gas . And it cold, and we got to
have beat . Have to have hot water .
My chil dren can't bel ieve that when I grew up
it used to get so cold in our house that the
water would f r eeze in the room where I was
sleeping.
Well , that's the truth. Freeze right wher e we
s l eeping . And the water i n the kitchen be
nothin but ice in the morn in .
That I S right .
your face and
Have to
hands .
That ' s the truth .
break the ice to wash
And break some mor e to make coffee . But they
don ' t know anything about that.
Chillun , they donlt remember nothin like that .
Tbey might not have to go through that .
I gl ad I raised hard . Every now and then I say,
IIThank you, Jesus , for the many blessings . II
When I got marr ied, I had two chairs, and along
then lot of women come to see women a l ong then .
I be sittin in one of the chair s , and the fi r st
lady come , and t he next one find some ol d bucket
or keg or somet hing to sit on. Or just sit
r ight down on the f l oor . Li ke they come i n and
they just come bring a plate , bring t heir food .
There was so much of good love in the world then .
Fol ks j us t bring you food, f eed you.
Share whatever they had.
Yes , ma l am. And we didn l t had nothin f or them
to sit on . Some of them, they sit flat down on
the floor . And like in the spr ing of the year
when they put out the fert i lizer, the women be
glad to get them sacks . Wash them fer til izer
s acks , make sheets , pill ow case , curtains, bed­spreads
. Sew t hem things toge t her, sit down and
cut t hem all the way r ound , kinda ravel them on
the ends, and white em, and they be the prettiest
kind of bedspr eads . I have one on my bed, and
it be l ooking so good, every now and t hen I
look back at it . It looked so good on my bed .
Fer til izer sack curtains hanging up on the
window. Fert ilizer sack pillow sl ips. That
was all I had . Take them fe r tilizer s acks and
make underskirts , made the boys shir ts and my
chillun clothes , under clothes , out of them .
Glad to get them. One time a white man give my
husband some paper bags . His fer tilizer come in
paper bags. But you know what be done? He
sent the sacks and got the s ame , just as many
paper bags as he sont fertilizer in . He sont
them brand new sacks , never had no fertilizer
in them . I didn ' t have not hing to do but ravel
them and sew them up . They were alr eady clean .
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Did you work any at the Freedom Quilting Bee?
Yes , ma'am. I worked there for six years.
Do you still make quilts?
I ain't made no quilt now in about two years .
I used to make em, but my eyes got so bad I had
to stop. Dr . Callaway say my right eye most gone.
If I could see good, I 'd quilt . This one here
most gone , and that's what make me thing I
can 't see out of narn, cause the best side over
here, and the best s ide most gone . I can't see
so good . And it hard to thread a needl e and I
stopped picking up a needle. I be wanting to
pick em up , but I scared I finish putting my
eye out.
I could make pretty quilts, too .
r bet you could. What was your favo r ite pattern?
Last quilt I made, I believe it was a big star
allover the bed.
It 's got so many of those little diamond shaped
pieces .
It easy to make . You can make it so quick .
Oh , I don't believe I could ever make one.
It ain't nothing to make. That's the easiest
quilt you could make. Let me see. I started •••••
I started on a Monday night and about the last
part of the week I put that quilt together.
Don ' t take me no time to make it. But I set
down and sew with my hands. I didn 't har dly
sew with a machine, because it hard for me to
thread the needle . If I could find it her a ,
I made two.
(End Side 2 , Tape 1)