I can agree that I don't like the dark, tragic heroes all the much. I doubt that the sequel will fix that or any of the other problems Bob finds because they'd rather believe that Batman will make it better.

I had moderate, but somewhat muted expectations for Man of Steel. I like Zack Snyder. I've enjoyed most of his movies (that weren't about owls). But as much as I like Nolan as a film maker, I was never excited at his involvement. I don't really think he "got" Batman, I know he didn't "get" Gotham City, and the way they kept splashing his name across the trailers I didn't think it would bode well. Not that Begins and Dark Knight weren't good mind you, they were fine. Good and great respectively. And I certainly wouldn't put the weight of MoS's bleakness solely on Nolan either. Just saying, it got me worrying early on and I adjusted my expectation.

But with Man of Steel, I didn't expect much and I got what I expected.

PS. Thanks for getting rid of the "BUY MY BOOK!" Jay Sherman gag at the end of the videos. That is a funny joke in small doses, but gets grating very quickly (which was kind of the point all along)

I will give Man of Steel one thing in how it changed the (cinematic) version of the character: it decoupled Superman from America (albeit in very blunt matter).

As I noted long ago on this site, the image of Superman as the embodiment of America's moral and strengths means that a movie in the vein of the original comic or prior movies just wouldn't work in a world where people look at the US as coming down from decades of partying and arrogance. The earnestness that Bob wants to see doesn't represent the US today, now suspicious of its own power and what it has become.

Do I think they could have done it in a better manner than having him literally chuck a drone at a general in an obviously tacked-on scene? Of course, but they at least tried.

I'm with Bob on this one. The more I thought about what happened in Man of Steel, the more blatant its problems and failures stuck out like a sore thumb. At this point, I'm at the conclusion that nobody at DC Entertainment and Warner Brothers truly understand Superman or the characters withing the DC Universe. These days, they're only interested in showcasing a product rather then telling a fantastic story of this world and all those involved. And that is not just looking at how they handle their movies. This stems from how they're handling their entire comic book company. Ask anyone who has been following the ongoing fiasco made up of editorial staff abusing their powers, a company that shows zero respect to the creators involved, its piss-poor PR, and the utter lack of sympathy for their fanbase. These are not signs of a healthy company, these are warnings that its suffering from a slow, painful death.

If you like to see a further breakdown of the movie and its shortcomings, look up Linkara's belated review of Man of Steel on his blog.

It is truly heartbreaking to hear him recap this stinker. There are moments where he's screaming his frustration at the camera (and not in a funny way like his reviews) and, to be honest, I don't blame him one bit.

DC Entertainment needs to get their shit together like yesterday. Otherwise, this company will suffer the same fate Marvel did in the 90s if not end up in a far worse situation. Which is odd since Bob Harris, the same man who ran Marvel when it went bankrupt, is now running DC. -_-

"who wants a superhero who isn't constantly morose and tormented all the time"

Obviously, every top people at DC, considering their excuse about the no marriage allowed for Batwoman.

And before we start a big gay marriage debacle, I haven't read the comic, I don't care she's a lesbian and apparently, their given reason for refusing the marriage has nothing to do with that particular issue but it points out to what I find a much a bigger creative problem nowadays : what they said was that no superhero can be happy for him/her to be engaging to the readers.

My main disappointment was with the huge potential the movie had, which was squandered.

As usually happens, they tried to do too much. The story would've been way more solid if they'd have taken a leaf from Donner's book and left Zod for the sequel. A movie about Clakr Kent / Superman growing up and dealing with his issues of alienation and search for purpose (both literal and metaphorical), with the conflict with the suspicious government thrown in, and the challenge of earning the world's trust... That would've been enough.

But that wasn't spectacular enough, so halfway through the movie you can almost hear the bell ring as the slugfest starts.

It saddens me how negative people are towards the whole Ben Affleck thing, when they should be more worried about how the people in charge can ruin both characters. They might have an idea on how to make decent Batman movies, but I doubt they have the skill to combine Batman and Superman (or any other DC character).

Now, I'll use the following quote, but this goes to all who are sharing this sentiment in the above comments:

Zachary Amaranth:the harping on the same movies over and over again is sort of making him harder and harder to watch.

Then don't.

These videos are a way for Bob to share his personal opinion, a fact he makes sure to mention often in the videos themselves.

All of you, complaining about his opinions or fixations being grating... Why are you watching his videos then?

I don't know why they tried to shove Superman into Batman's shoes to make him more interesting he is a character who can definitely stand on his own two feet. There are better Superman stories in many comic runs, elsewhere stories (see Superman Red Son), and even games (see Injustice Gods Among Us). What makes Superman a great character is his optimism and his willingness to sacrifice himself in order to protect everyone (even Red Son Superman did this despite Superman being from a vastly different background). Another example of this exists in the Justice League cartoon when the league members are asking why Superman is always taking all the hits for them he says "Every hit I take is one they don't have to." If you take that away from the character he absolutely rings hollow. Bob is totally right in his assessment of this movie and I was also disappointed in it. I did think Superman was cast correctly though despite these failings and given a different style of movie I think the actor could still make a great Superman. Why studios would ignore fantastic versions of Superman like the animated one or comic versions is beyond me. I understand that I'm not in the "industry" but when versions of the character work why mess with them instead polish them and enhance them.

I wasn't nearly as disappointed with Man of Steel as Bob seems to have become. I agree that it could have profited from a greater focus on Superman's protection of humanity, especially in later scenes, but that aspect isn't as absent has some have suggested, and I don't seem to have found the dialogue and characters as clunky as Bob did.

That said- credit where credit is due- I don't think MB's assessment is, overall, inaccurate. Shaded by his own feelings about the genre and the character, sure, but I still think it's a worthwhile take.

So hopefully this will be the last time Bob goes on about how he doesn't like Man of Steel. Seriously, I'm getting kind of annoyed by this. Hell, I love how he pointed out how he didn't want to go over again why he thought Star Trek Into Darkness sucked, yet he's been at Man of Steel's case for far more! I think I would have rather preferred him talking about Into Darkness by this point!

While I understand your disappointment and I agree with your distain for the general Nolan super hero theme of everything must be sad and dark I do hope you've finally gotten Man Of Steel out of your system.

I like your shows and it's a shame to keep hearing about one single movie over and over. I started to actively groan when you brought up Superman every other episode.

These videos are a way for Bob to share his personal opinion, a fact he makes sure to mention often in the videos themselves.

All of you, complaining about his opinions or fixations being grating... Why are you watching his videos then?

Because we are hoping that it gets better. We hope that it's worth watching, we just end up getting disappointed.

Don't get me wrong, many of the Big Pictures and movie reviews are great to watch. I follow them because for the most part, I like them. I just don't like all of them, so the ones I don't like offer me disappointment.

These videos are a way for Bob to share his personal opinion, a fact he makes sure to mention often in the videos themselves.

All of you, complaining about his opinions or fixations being grating... Why are you watching his videos then?

Perhaps because we like his videos and his insights but don't like hearing the same thing every episode? When he talks about other things he's very good, we want to hear him talk about other things and we have every right to voice our opinion that his fixation is tedious and lowering the quality of the show.

Bob just wants everything to be like The Avengers and all funny and upbeat and Robert Downey Jr. But we have The Avengers already...so what's wrong with Man of Steel going for a more serious tone? Nothing.

I didn't know what to expect from the film so I went in and thought it was amazing, 3rd favourite superhero movie EVER. Bob obviously wanted more one note villains, and Transformers-but-with-superheroes stuff like in The Avengers, because when you get down to it, Man of Steel inspired me, it felt inspiring and said some really interesting and deep things about society in general.

Food for thought: Clark is reading Plato's Republic at one point in the film, this subtley links into the "failure" of Kypton as a Platonian society in the film, exemplified by Zod. Very clever stuff. But obviously no, it needed brighter colours and more comedy so it was a failure!!

I just don't get how Bob can constantly fellate and praise The Avengers when that was a very shallow film. Man of Steel wasn't anything paritcularly deep, but it was more thought-provoking than The Avengers, why is that a bad thing?

Heh, I knew I wasn't the only one that thought of this as "Terrence Malick Presents: Superman".

I could give a Mr. Plinkett length breakdown on all the little things that make so much of this movie not make much sense, but ultimately the movie's biggest problem is that it ENDLESSLY talks a big game to pretend it's all "deep and profound" by having half the cast blandly monologue the supposed themes of the movie to us over and over, but when it's all said and done it lacks the character and the emotion and the heart to back itself up and mean anything, leading to a first hour of tedious cliches and a second hour of nihilistic Dragonball Z fights that are far more concerned with being "cool" that being about anything. Sure everything's going Kaboom, but what exactly are we supposed to be invested in? What's the big culminating arc between the two characters that's supposed to get us revved up for the ultimate showdown? Not much, it turns out.

The characters were just too half-assed for me to care, plain and simple. Say what you will about the characters of Pacific Rim, at least they were DEFINED cliches. At least I got their motivations and what their character arcs were supposed to be. MOS's were vague at best and non-existent at worst. Only Zod (thanks to Michael Shannon's overacting) brought some much needed life into this film and was closet to having a definable character. I understood his motivation, I got understood goals, I even got his BACKSTORY from all that time spent on Krypton. And ya know what, he actually DID STUFF to go about achieving said goals. As far as I'm concerned, HE'S the main character of the movie and this movie was his Shakespearean tragedy...

So yeah, this is what happens when you try to remake Batman Begins. I mean it's SO obvious that's what they were doing. Why else do you think EVERYONE on the Internet is thinking the same "iconic archnemesis comes in to smear Superman's name" storyline for the sequel? Because they clearly want to remake THE DARK KNIGHT next.

- Lex Luthor gets the people to trust him- Lex Luthor dirties Superman's name, making the people turn on him- Lex Luthor does some evil stuff under their noses, meaning Superman has to stop him/kill him- Oh no, Superman can't tell the people what Lex did because they'd be sooooo heartbroken, so he decides not to tell Metropoliis how much of a dick Lex was.- Repeat the end speech of TDK while Superman flies away to build the Fortress of Solitude- ____ years later, Brainiac or someone shows up to cause havoc and THE MAN OF STEEL RISES

Glad I wasn't the only one that noticed you were more critical in your 2nd vid then your first.

I'm surprised it took you that long to realise how bad the film was, I normally take a few days to mull over a film but I knew 10 minutes in, Man of Steel was up it's own butt-hole with supposed meaningful nonsense- Which was confirmed at the end of the film. I tried to watch it a 2nd time (for free- no way I could pay to see that again) and I had to turn it off 30 mins in.

The one thing everyone keeps talking about is Superman killing. Trying to vilify it or justify it. I'm sure there are circumstances that could make Superman even kill a human in a reboot.I honestly couldn't care less if he kills or not as long as it's explained/makes sense. Superman snapping Zod's neck (after having a fight with no tension because no1 bleeds, or acts hurt), so I didn't even know that was possible in Snyder's universe. They also flew to space, hit a satellite and in all that chaos still managed to find Metropolis on the way down again. Lois somewhere got to where they landed within 2 mins - it looked like it was 3 miles away-no idea how she made it on foot. And in the most painful cliché way possible zod is going to kill some middleclass family so superman has to kill him. What about the 100,000 humans he killed and the promise to kill more? Surely superman should of been trying to kill him all along. This was the mass effect 3 ending for a movie.

Traditionally Superman doesn't kill humans, because humans are children to him- but super powered aliens that are trying to kill humans - superman will kill/destroy them without hesitation.

The entire concept at the start was so much cringe- Krypton is destroyed by 'harvesting the core' because that's what a flawed socialist-communist utopia society would apparently do.... because they have pod babies with no freedom. So let's send kal-el to earth and hope he lands in a capitalist country.

Krypton is so advanced they have many off world colonies....but they can't sustain themselves for 24 years was it? however old Clark is. So they can't grow food and live but they have world engines lying around?

Now, I'll use the following quote, but this goes to all who are sharing this sentiment in the above comments:

Zachary Amaranth:the harping on the same movies over and over again is sort of making him harder and harder to watch.

Then don't.

These videos are a way for Bob to share his personal opinion, a fact he makes sure to mention often in the videos themselves.

All of you, complaining about his opinions or fixations being grating... Why are you watching his videos then?

Because if he has every right to harp on his fixations over and over again then we have every right to harp on this stupid redundant complaining over and over again.

Yes but if you don't like the guy discussing his opinions then why watch a show specifically for him to discusshis opinions. It's like going into a pizza place and then complaining about the lack of chinese food.

These videos are a way for Bob to share his personal opinion, a fact he makes sure to mention often in the videos themselves.

And my post was a way to voice my personal opinion, a fact that shouldn't need to be mentioned due to the stark obviousness of it.

Are you really that bothered that I dared voice my opinion about a perceived trend within videos that are played on a site for entertainment? Or does freedom of expression equal freedom from criticism?

Because if he has every right to harp on his fixations over and over again then we have every right to harp on this stupid redundant complaining over and over again.

Evidently not.

Ralen-Sharr:Because we are hoping that it gets better. We hope that it's worth watching, we just end up getting disappointed.

More annoyed in my case. Like, I don't always agree with Bob (truth be told, I usually don't), but I find his TBP vids to be informative and often introduce me to a different chain of thought than I'm used to. He usually makes it interesting, and being exposed to the opinions of others is actually a good thing. It can challenge your own notions (Bob has done this for me on occasions) or maybe even change your mind (Not really so far, but there's always a chance).

However, considering his recent response to the Batfleck thing was to show/play a baby crying, and he then turned around and made another dig at TASM, and this week is more digs at The Lone Ranger, Superman (which to be fair, most of it was solid criticism), Star Trek/Into Darkness, etc....Not only is it annoying, it strikes me as a touch ironic.

Apparently, however, we're expected to shut up if we don't like an episode. Or stop watching entirely because we don't like a trend in a few. Not even dislike the overall sentiment, but an undercurrent or recurring theme.

Which is funny, because every time I stop watching something, I get told I'm not giving it a fair shake. This actually happened with Escape to the Movies, a MovieBob program I generally don't like and normally avoid.

The thing that bugged me about MoS was that Zod & Co were stupid. They launched the terraforming attack while Superman was still alive. They could have taken the time to adapt to Earth's environment, gotten their own power levels up to a competitive level, attacked Supes en masse, killing him, and THEN, once there's no one to threaten them, launch the terraformer.

Of course, can't have the bad guys win, even when it's the logical outcome of a premise.

Weird, the more I think about the movie, the more I want to watch it again. Not because it was the best movie, but because it's one of the few movies that came out this summer that required (in my book)a second look. Maybe my opinion of the movie will change. The thing is, the more you think about anything, you're updating the memory. And the more updated the memory becomes, the more full of errors, misconceptions and concoction it actually contains. The only way to get a valid look at this movie a second time around is to actually watch it a second time around. I will always find faults with the criticism that he should have been able to save everyone or that he killed Zod. These aren't things that are wrong with the movie, these are bold steps to a character really coming into what he is. He is at the weakest he will be at any point in his adult life during the finale of this movie. He will only become much much stronger. And at no point in the DC comics is he saving everyone. So, that is not actually a valid criticism. To me, the way I remember it, it's not that he didn't want to save everyone (he saved the entire world at the end, but we can just ignore that I guess), it's that he was incapable of even knowing what he is capable of actually doing. I mean, he didn't learn to fly till halfway through the movie, or that he was even capable of flight.

Meh, I can respect criticism of something I genuinely enjoyed, well enough. But the extent of energy placed on this film and expended criticizing it at this point borders on pure insanity. I mean, no one needed a followup video because it was easy to know where he was going with it. He was going to take his original criticisms of the movie and multiply them by 10 fold. I have criticisms of the movie myself. While the flashbacks were a pretty good way to flesh out the character without showing his childhood, there was too many of them. We needed to see the bus scene and followup, and the death of Johnathan Kent... that's it. These things would mold the character just fine because these would obviously be major events in anyone's life. The movie wasn't as humorless as it was made out to be, but it could have used more. I agree that having the character Perry White in the movie was a waste because they did nothing with him. There should have been more scenes with Lois and Clark to warrant a kiss between them. He at least should have shown up in the daily planet before she is ready to jump in his lap, so to speak. All of these things detracted from the movie for me, but the main point of Superman being Superman and being developed in a way that has not previously been explored in film was great, IMO.

Oskuro:Now, I'll use the following quote, but this goes to all who are sharing this sentiment in the above comments:

Zachary Amaranth:the harping on the same movies over and over again is sort of making him harder and harder to watch.

Then don't.

These videos are a way for Bob to share his personal opinion, a fact he makes sure to mention often in the videos themselves.

All of you, complaining about his opinions or fixations being grating... Why are you watching his videos then?

Because I watch Bob and other Internet videos to confirm MY opinions, not to hear HIS! Taking down easy/obvious targets like After Earth is what makes me laugh, not taking closer looks at stuff I like and disagreeing with me!

And as we all know from the Internet Rulebook, once your opinion is given on the Internet, it is concrete and you're not allowed to bring it up ever again. If you do, then you automatically becoming a whiny harping FANNNNBOYYYY!!!

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But seriously, that is a good question. You all knew what this episode was going to be about a week ago. Why the fuck would you watch something you knew you probably weren't going to like?

Just...ya know...IGNORE it. Take a week off. Let people interested in talking about MOS more talk about it more and just go do something else with your time. You whining about how you don't want to talk about it anymore never has and never will work. So just...do something else then. The Internet's a big ol place. I also heard that thing they called "outside" was supposed to be neato too.

Spot1990:Yes but if you don't like the guy discussing his opinions then why watch a show specifically for him to discusshis opinions. It's like going into a pizza place and then complaining about the lack of chinese food.

This is more akin to going to a pizza place and complaining that the pepperoni is stale, funky, and all over your vegetarian pizza.

Bob, you are right on, but here is why I think Superman should die. Not just in the comics or the films, but just disappear forever from the culture:

Basically, Superman is a representative of Nietzsche's 'ubermench': a man-beyond-man. Which is a fine idea, I suppose, to have a character that is strong because they free themselves from the lower and base needs of human nature, thus becoming a paragon of true strength and righteousness. However, this cannot speak to the current American culture, which is endlessly -and rightly- suspicious of those that claim 'strength' and 'righteousness.' I.E. the post-9/11 culture of warfare-as-retribution for the truly horrible -but limited- terrorist acts we suffered.

After and during WWII, Superman was vital to the culture as something of a father figure. With so many children with either absent or late fathers, he served as a symbol of what young men and women could grow up to be, inspiring literally millions of children.

However, we have moved to a much more jaded and callous approach to overt strength, and this is what the film was trying to avoid: it attempted to reconnect Superman with his humanity, and discard the ubermench qualities that he previously displayed in an attempt to evade the more overt notions of endless righteousness he has been associated with in the past. This did not work, nor can it really work without changing the fundamental aspects of the character.

Rather than try to change him so much, it is best to just let him die on a cultural level.

You've pointed out times you were too kind before, but have you ever looked back on a movie you didn't like and realized you later were too negative? Like you didn't see something that puts it in a different light. Sorta like how you pointed out concepts in Sucker Punch to us.

endtherapture:Bob just wants everything to be like The Avengers and all funny and upbeat and Robert Downey Jr. But we have The Avengers already...so what's wrong with Man of Steel going for a more serious tone? Nothing.

Yes, clearly that's why one of his favorite super hero movies of all time is The Dark Knight and also why he admits that if Man of Steel was actually as good as that, it wouldn't have been a problem.

People never stop projecting on Bob just because he's disappointed in certain (comic) movies do they? Lighten up - no need to trash talk his opinion just because he's reasonably arguing why Man of Steel is flawed. He's a critic and analyst, it's his job to talk about this stuff. Additional analysis and criticism on media that can't be summed up in five minutes is good.

In the words of Yahtzee: "it's worth remembering that all reviews are subjective personal opinion and if you enjoy the [media] it really shouldn't get to you. Unless there's a despicable little niggling doubt in the back of your mind that maybe you aren't having as much fun as you've convinced yourself that you're having, which doesn't go away no matter how many times you slap it down with a flannel of wet excuses like this one."

The Dubya: Only Zod (thanks to Michael Shannon's overacting) brought some much needed life into this film and was closet to having a definable character. I understood his motivation, I got understood goals, I even got his BACKSTORY from all that time spent on Krypton. And ya know what, he actually DID STUFF to go about achieving said goals. As far as I'm concerned, HE'S the main character of the movie and this movie was his Shakespearean tragedy...

You are right.Zod was the closest character to behave like a human with motivations, emotions etc. How ironic. But even then he was only half way there.Half of what he said in the movie was downgraded to contrived techno-bable and exposition. And logic was also not on his for the other half. He finds out Superman is the only person who can stop him and he insists on deploying the world engine immediately. Why not wait? 2hours..lure out superman. Kill him and then deploy the macgiffin. He want's to convert Earth because he got a bit of a headache. Doesn't seem very warrior like. If he were to put up with it for a bit longer he could have super powers. Kryptonite doesn't seem to exist so no problem there.Why couldn't he say 'yo superman.You know those many off world colonies we have I will just go there - 100% chance of success. Just let me suck out the codex from you'. end movie.

The Gentleman:I will give Man of Steel one thing in how it changed the (cinematic) version of the character: it decoupled Superman from America (albeit in very blunt matter).

As I noted long ago on this site, the image of Superman as the embodiment of America's moral and strengths means that a movie in the vein of the original comic or prior movies just wouldn't work in a world where people look at the US as coming down from decades of partying and arrogance. The earnestness that Bob wants to see doesn't represent the US today, now suspicious of its own power and what it has become.

Do I think they could have done it in a better manner than having him literally chuck a drone at a general in an obviously tacked-on scene? Of course, but they at least tried.

That is actually a bit of a misunderstanding of the character. He was always coupled to tradition pre-WW2 value and as an American character he had that whole truth, justice and the American way thing. But the post WW2 character, or even mid WW2 character never subscribed to America's interventionist foreign policies. He never intervened in any wars. He never chose sides in a conflict between foreign nations. That was actually the biggest criticism of the character during WW2. He never fought the Nazi's (and one of the main reasons Captain America was one of the most popular comic book characters of that era). The only thing the final scene actually did was decouple him from the Military, which was always his default position. Just as always, he is distrustful of the people in power and all for the average Joe, as any would be American was during the formative years of actual Superman character. Don't fall into the hype, there were always people who didn't like American foreign policy going back to WW1, both foreign and domestic.

It's also important to remember that while the movie was made with a world audience in mind, he was raised as your typical red blooded American boy in Kansas. What Bob wants to see is actually very much part of the character, even in modern day.