I only watched the highlights on ESPN but it was cool seeing dudes blow their teammates up. some Chief (i think) crushed his own RB and there was another hit, i forget who, but some frinedly fire. that was cool.

rickythepenguin:I only watched the highlights on ESPN but it was cool seeing dudes blow their teammates up. some Chief (i think) crushed his own RB and there was another hit, i forget who, but some frinedly fire. that was cool.

dude on the Chiefs blew up* Jamal Charles

dude on the Browns blew up* Josh Gordon

*Harder than you would expect in a pro-bowl, not as hard as you will see in pre-season.

foo monkey:The MLB All-star game is usually a great game, because it determines home-field advantage in the World Series. The players actually play. The Pro Bowl is stupid. It $erve$ no purpose.

yeah the MLB event is the best of the big 3 plus hockey, but interleague has taken a lot of the fun out of it. it used to be a big deal to see Marquee NL Pitcher face off versus, you know, McGwire back in the day (i know he was roiding, just saying). interleague -- which i don't like -- has just kinda renderd that aspect of the ASG irrelevant.

NBAs can be fun with the unfettered athleticism and crazy dunks and shiat. the NFLs, i just never cared for it. all the tweaks I guess made it from what i'vre read, more compelling but i didn't give a shiat about. just the highlights.

A few years back I was staying at the Hilton in Waikiki.... that's where all the lesser-known NFL guys stay. You could see the guys that had Wife 1.0 and the guy that was on his 5th or 6th version. Most of them hobbled around, signing autographs, just trying to make a few bucks and meet up with old friends.

I think the selection to the game should be purely stat based and there should be enough incentive to go and to win that people don't beg off in droves every year. Require each team to pay $100k Pro Bowl appearance and $250k Pro Bowl victory bonuses and things would be more interesting.

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo:I think the selection to the game should be purely stat based and there should be enough incentive to go and to win that people don't beg off in droves every year. Require each team to pay $100k Pro Bowl appearance and $250k Pro Bowl victory bonuses and things would be more interesting.

Does the game really need to be played though? Why not make it like All-America selections in college - you get recognition and a check, but you don't have to suit up.

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo:I think the selection to the game should be purely stat based and there should be enough incentive to go and to win that people don't beg off in droves every year. Require each team to pay $100k Pro Bowl appearance and $250k Pro Bowl victory bonuses and things would be more interesting.

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo:I think the selection to the game should be purely stat based and there should be enough incentive to go and to win that people don't beg off in droves every year. Require each team to pay $100k Pro Bowl appearance and $250k Pro Bowl victory bonuses and things would be more interesting.

rjakobi:Yet Tom Brady and the Niners are still twits for opting out of the Pro Bowl this year.

Dude, FREE TRIP TO HAWAII!

I partly blame Simeon Rice for changing the Pro Bowl from after the Super Bowl to the week before, although I think it was a pretty fantastic/dickish move on his part. When Tampa Bay won the Super Bowl after the 2002 season, Simeon went to the Pro Bowl and after the first series sat on the bench and wouldn't go back in the game. It got to the point where the position coach couldn't get him to go so they sent Andy Reid over to get him off the bench. He spat out something about beating Reid's Eagles in the NFCCG and then winning the Super Bowl, taunting Reid for his failure to get it done, and then thanked Reid for the vacation.

I can't imagine that the NFL wanted that to become a habit for players in Rice's situation, so I'm sure there's something involved where the players actually have to play and not just take the vacation.

/just saying that the "does it need to exist?" is a really bad question when we're talking about entertainment. None of it needs to exist.

Are we about to get into the sociological reasons sport exists as a major focus in American (Western, really) society?

Insofar as the NFL does and should exist, the Pro Bowl still doesn't need to be played. The season (whether it's 16 games in 17 weeks; or 300 games in 2 weeks) does. That goes for every all-star game, not just the NFL's (except MTV's Rock'n'Jock. That shiat was necessary). As has been pointed out, the NFL's all-star game is by far the weakest spectacle of the Big 4.

So with all of that taken - does it really need to be played? If the players just cashed their checks (I guess there wouldn't be "winners" and "losers" checks, so that's something) for the privilege of getting (s)elected, what have we, the fans, really lost? The worst-watched game of the football "season"?

AdmirableSnackbar:I'm sure he wouldn't be alone among NFL players for thinking it but to actually say it out loud take a special kind of ignorance and douchiness.

simeon also had one of the great ".....uhhh.......what?" quotes with this gem, which pops up on NFL Network from tiem to time: "It is what it is, but sometimes it is what is isn't. But we are who we are, and know what we want to be."

rickythepenguin:rickythepenguin: forget how simeon rice slammed Pat Tillman AFTER HIS DEATH, but it was either calling him an "idiot" fro leaving the NFL or just calling him overrated.

In fact, former Cardinals teammate Simeon Rice, now a member of the Super Bowl champion-Tampa Bay Buccaneers, disparaged Tillman in an interview on Jim Rome's radio show last month.

"He really wasn't that good, not really," Rice said. "He was good enough to play in Arizona, [but] that's just like the XFL."

After several more promptings from Rome, Rice allowed, "I think it's very admirable, actually. You've got to give kudos to a guy like that because he did it for his own reasons. Maybe it's the Rambo movies, maybe it's Sylvester Stallone, Rocky, whatever compels him."

only because i like to source things when possible.

you could say Rice was right. Tillman was a serviceable NFL player, but not an All-Pro. but the man had just died. what kind of idiot disparages a man days after his death wtih "he wasnt that good"?

simeon rice, ladies and gentlemen.

I wouldn't say Rice was right. After all, the Rams wanted Tillman and were willing to shell out nearly $2M/year for him - pretty good money for a safety - in 2000, so had Tillman accepted it he would have been a starter for two Super Bowls. And he was only in the league for four years, he was well on his way to being one of the best in the game as long as he stayed healthy and not joined the military.

rickythepenguin:AdmirableSnackbar: I'm sure he wouldn't be alone among NFL players for thinking it but to actually say it out loud take a special kind of ignorance and douchiness.

simeon also had one of the great ".....uhhh.......what?" quotes with this gem, which pops up on NFL Network from tiem to time: "It is what it is, but sometimes it is what is isn't. But we are who we are, and know what we want to be."

AdmirableSnackbar:After all, the Rams wanted Tillman and were willing to shell out nearly $2M/year for him - pretty good money for a safety - in 2000, so had Tillman accepted it he would have been a starter for two Super Bowls. And he was only in the league for four years, he was well on his way to being one of the best in the game as long as he stayed healthy and not joined the military.

as someone that saw pat play several times*, i'm certainly not saying Rice was in fact right. it would be fair to say Pat was not an elite player, but yeah, the rams wanted him and he stayed with the Cardinals out of loyalty. I'm just saying simeon should have kept his mouth shut, period.

it was always different when Tillman made a play in Sun Devil. always. whenever he made a tackle or a pass brekaup, the crowd cheered a little bit extra. no exaggeration. that was our fella.

*my cousins are 20+ year season ticket holders, and frequently went to training camp. for the first time, over Christmas I saw a picture my cousin has of her with Pat, guessing around 2000. She has some autographed stuff of his as well. when i saw the picture i was like, "hoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooollllllleeeeeeeeeeeee shiat!!!!!"

Dr Dreidel:Insofar as the NFL does and should exist, the Pro Bowl still doesn't need to be played.

Neither do any of the other games. Yet, people enjoy them. So why should it not be played? Because a bunch of self-important twats who talk about games that "matter" have decided that it's fun to say the Pro Bowl sucks and they totally don't watch it?

/not necessarily saying you're saying this, but "the Pro Bowl sucks and no one likes it" has been an argument made on the internet over and over//yet it still pulls better ratings than any other sport's championships///and it's fun to watch because the players actually have fun instead of being suffocated by the "must not try anything out of the ordinary, lest it go wrong and I be excoriated for the entire season" mind-numbingness of the standard NFL game

IAmRight:and it's fun to watch because the players actually have fun instead of being suffocated by the "must not try anything out of the ordinary, lest it go wrong and I be excoriated for the entire season" mind-numbingness of the standard NFL game

I don't see it that way. I see the Pro-Bowl as a more mind-numbing game than any of the others in a given season. Of all the Pro Bowls I've ever watched, the only thing I really remember is on every FG/PAT, the only people who move faster than stalactite formation are the snapper, holder and kicker. Everyone else just kind of stands up at the snap (at least during the regular season, they make a TOKEN effort; maybe even shoved an opposing lineman).

I think if they made the Pro Bowl count in some way, like the MLB All-Star game does, it might make it more competitive and more people would be willing to watch.

Something along these lines was the best I could personally come up with...

Go back to the NFC vs AFC format, winning conference's Superbowl representative automatically wins the coin toss. I know it's not necessarily as important to the Superbowl as home field advantage is in the World Series, but it can add some sort of motivation to perform. Especially in Superbowls that are played in outdoor stadiums, the wind could be a factor, so winning the toss, electing to defer, and picking which end of the field you want could factor into the game...

puny:I think if they made the Pro Bowl count in some way, like the MLB All-Star game does, it might make it more competitive and more people would be willing to watch.

Something along these lines was the best I could personally come up with...

Go back to the NFC vs AFC format, winning conference's Superbowl representative automatically wins the coin toss. I know it's not necessarily as important to the Superbowl as home field advantage is in the World Series, but it can add some sort of motivation to perform. Especially in Superbowls that are played in outdoor stadiums, the wind could be a factor, so winning the toss, electing to defer, and picking which end of the field you want could factor into the game...

/my two cents//which probably aren't worth much

You'd need to also move the Pro Bowl to the midpoint of the season for that to have any effect.

puny:I think if they made the Pro Bowl count in some way, like the MLB All-Star game does, it might make it more competitive and more people would be willing to watch.

"I didn't watch the Pro Bowl, but let me tell you what's wrong with it and why. After all, who would know better than someone who knows nothing about it?"

puny:so winning the toss, electing to defer, and picking which end of the field you want could factor into the game...

You can either choose end of the field or when you're going to have possession. And you should always defer kickoff to the second half - it gives you the opportunity to force a turnover via clock management.

Dr Dreidel:Of all the Pro Bowls I've ever watched, the only thing I really remember is on every FG/PAT, the only people who move faster than stalactite formation are the snapper, holder and kicker. Everyone else just kind of stands up at the snap (at least during the regular season, they make a TOKEN effort; maybe even shoved an opposing lineman).

And the NFL is considering removing the PAT from the equation of regular games because no one misses 'em anyway. That's like being upset no one's blowing each other up on kickoffs that sail through the end zone.

/and the last time that the Pro Bowl was actually as bad as people make it out to be was two years ago - then Goodell threatened to eliminate it and people actually started trying again

IAmRight:puny: I think if they made the Pro Bowl count in some way, like the MLB All-Star game does, it might make it more competitive and more people would be willing to watch.

"I didn't watch the Pro Bowl, but let me tell you what's wrong with it and why. After all, who would know better than someone who knows nothing about it?"

puny: so winning the toss, electing to defer, and picking which end of the field you want could factor into the game...

You can either choose end of the field or when you're going to have possession. And you should always defer kickoff to the second half - it gives you the opportunity to force a turnover via clock management.

First point: I did watch most of the game, though mostly only half-assed. I'm not trying to say I'm the one to fix things, just making a suggestion.

IAmRight:And the NFL is considering removing the PAT from the equation of regular games because no one misses 'em anyway. That's like being upset no one's blowing each other up on kickoffs that sail through the end zone.

More like "being upset that players who do the barest minimum during the season during this forgone-conclusion of a play do even less during what is purportedly a showcase of the best talent in the league."

And that doesn't explain why no one tries to block FGs either. I know in the past there was some Pro-Bowl-only rule about leaping or something, but if you have to change the rules of the game for the all-star version, something is amiss. They don't give you 4 strikes in baseball's Midsummer Classic, and the Infield Fly Rule doesn't stop applying.

But I think it's clear that you want the game to keep happening, and I would not miss it.

Yeah, in baseball, both leagues play by a different set of rules. (BTW, as a general rule, "this is how baseball does it" is going to be an argument against whatever you're saying.)

Using the Pro Bowl as a way to test out new rules seems like a pretty good way to get people used to it and see how it'd work in a game.

/I just don't like how so many people's arguments about sports they don't like are "I don't care about this, therefore let me either change it to something I still wouldn't really care about" or "let's just get rid of all the stuff that I don't care about."