From tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org Sat May 1 14:36:26 2010
From: tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org (Tweeks)
Date: Sat May 1 14:37:31 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Ubuntu 10.04 on Rackspace Mirror
In-Reply-To: <4BDA5D76.7060409@lookcee.com>
References: <201004292329.15684.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<4BDA5D76.7060409@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <201005011436.26675.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
On Thursday 29 April 2010 11:32:54 pm Herb Cee wrote:
> Tweeks wrote:
> > For those waiting... it's a fast download:
> > http://mirror.rackspace.com/ubuntu-releases/lucid/
>
> Three cheers for u & RS Tweeks
> thanks
> hh
I didn't set it up.. Thank the Racker Geeks working in our IT dept.. RTS. :)
Tweeks
From masterr at gmail.com Mon May 3 22:27:41 2010
From: masterr at gmail.com (Jonathan Hull)
Date: Mon May 3 22:28:06 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] More evidence of Steam and Valve games coming to Linux
Message-ID:
Linux Gamers Rejoice!
For those of you not following this already I will bring y'all up to
date. Steam is a gaming delivery service by Valve. They also produce a
few games themselves such as Half Life, Portal, Left 4 Dead, Team
Fortress, and others.
Since the beginning of Steam Linux users have been asking for a Linux
client, and over the past few years several pieces of evidence have
surfaced that such a Linux client is in the works. Here are the few
that I can remember (not in order):
- Job opening at Valve lists "Port Windows-based games to the Linux
platform" in the job description:
http://www.valvesoftware.com/job-SenSoftEngineer.html
- Left 4 Dead demo contains Linux binaries:
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2008/12/steam-linux-on-the-way-left-4-dead-carries-linux-binaries.ars
- Steam announced for Mac, including ports of Valve games (not Linux,
but related)
http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/08/valve-confirms-steam-for-mac-debuts-in-april/
- Upcoming Steam client for Mac contains Linux launcher code:
http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/23/steam-for-mac-beta-reveals-possible-linux-compatibility-in-the-p/
Now today a screenshot leaked showing the beginnings of a Steam client
running on Linux:
http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/03/screenshots-emerge-of-steam-linux-client-beos-wonders-if-its-n/
While there has been no announcement nor has there been any evidence
of a full client or running games, this is all still exciting in my
eyes. Valve is a master of leaking viral information that nearly
rivals Apple, and these bits of evidence are right down their alley.
As a gamer and a Linux user I am hoping!
-Jon
From bruce.dubbs at gmail.com Wed May 5 12:43:25 2010
From: bruce.dubbs at gmail.com (Bruce Dubbs)
Date: Wed May 5 12:43:29 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Google chrome speed tests
Message-ID: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
Kinda interesting.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCgQDjiotG0
-- Bruce
From the.dead.dude at gmail.com Wed May 5 12:53:00 2010
From: the.dead.dude at gmail.com (Justin)
Date: Wed May 5 12:53:26 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Google chrome speed tests
In-Reply-To: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
References: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
I was expecting some lame video where a nerdy guy goes "Ok, let's try to
render soandso.com with firefox. Ok, that was 5.43 seconds. Now lets try
it with Chrome. Wow, it was only 3 seconds, that's almost twice as fast."
But no, this video's got potato guns, sound waves, and lightning!
On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:43 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> Kinda interesting.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCgQDjiotG0
>
> -- Bruce
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From stosss at gmail.com Wed May 5 13:17:16 2010
From: stosss at gmail.com (stosss)
Date: Wed May 5 13:17:18 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Google chrome speed tests
In-Reply-To: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
References: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 1:43 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> Kinda interesting.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCgQDjiotG0
>
LOL! Some people have to much time on their hands.
--
"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue
of their money, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks
and corporations that will grow up around them, will deprive the
people of their property until their children will wake up homeless on
the continent their fathers conquered."
-Thomas Jefferson
From edeleonjr at gmail.com Wed May 5 14:59:07 2010
From: edeleonjr at gmail.com (Ernest De Leon)
Date: Wed May 5 14:59:11 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Google chrome speed tests
In-Reply-To:
References: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
Nice video. I think it captures how fast chrome is. I've been using it and
it is much faster (it seems) on windows than Mac or Linux. I'm sure this
will improve over time as the latter two of the three came out significantly
later than the windows version.
E
On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 1:17 PM, stosss wrote:
> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 1:43 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> > Kinda interesting.
> >
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCgQDjiotG0
> >
>
> LOL! Some people have to much time on their hands.
>
> --
> "If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue
> of their money, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks
> and corporations that will grow up around them, will deprive the
> people of their property until their children will wake up homeless on
> the continent their fathers conquered."
> -Thomas Jefferson
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From hc at lookcee.com Wed May 5 18:21:19 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Wed May 5 18:21:21 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Google chrome speed tests
In-Reply-To:
References: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BE1FD6F.60401@lookcee.com>
Ernest De Leon wrote:
> Nice video. I think it captures how fast chrome is. I've been using it and
> it is much faster (it seems) on windows than Mac or Linux. I'm sure this
> will improve over time as the latter two of the three came out significantly
> later than the windows version.
>
> E
>
> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 1:17 PM, stosss wrote:
>
>> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 1:43 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
>>> Kinda interesting.
>>>
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCgQDjiotG0
>>>
>> LOL! Some people have to much time on their hands.
>>
WOW I have been a fan of Rube Goldburg for at least 60yrs maybe 70+ since
dunno when he began his wonderful cartoon in the Sunday funnies that I read
from the Atlanta Journal I turn 80 this Sept.
hh
From e2eiod at gmail.com Thu May 6 00:42:39 2010
From: e2eiod at gmail.com (Robert Pearson)
Date: Thu May 6 00:42:41 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Google chrome speed tests
In-Reply-To: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
References: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:43 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> Kinda interesting.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCgQDjiotG0
>
> ?-- Bruce
> --
Am I missing something here?
The last time I looked into Chrome for Linux it was not apples to
apples. Not for Mac either.
Has this changed?
I just looked and it looks like the same code for Ubuntu.
I run Chrome, Firefox and Internet Explorer on my lone XP instance and
it seems faster and better than the other two.
At some things.
Browsers are an interesting design space. The bandwidth available is
fixed. So the creativity starts with gimmicks.
Like prefetch and cache.
If they guess right from their profile of your behavior they look
really good but very bad if they miss your intent and the wrong stuff
is prefetched to cache.
They really need a feature like "hyperdrive" in deep space. When your
browser focus has been defined the "hyperdrive kicks in.
The overall result is a faster response.
My two cents...
From dondavis at reglue.org Sun May 9 20:09:06 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Sun May 9 20:09:12 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
Message-ID: <4BE75CB2.90706@reglue.org>
It seems as if it should be straightforward to make a video from a
sequence of jpgs; however,
using stopmotion there is an I/O error
using ffmpeg stops on an opening filters error
using kdenlive - I can play the movie but when I export I only see a
black screen.
(I've tried compiling my own ffmpeg but that didn't seem to help.)
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Sun May 9 20:42:21 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Sun May 9 20:42:27 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE75CB2.90706@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <201005100142.o4A1gLJI012966@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
>
> It seems as if it should be straightforward to make a video from a
> sequence of jpgs; however,
>
> using stopmotion there is an I/O error
> using ffmpeg stops on an opening filters error
> using kdenlive - I can play the movie but when I export I only see a
> black screen.
>
> (I've tried compiling my own ffmpeg but that didn't seem to help.)
You can make an mpg format (below with 10 frames/sec) using mencoder.
mpeg2 format is what's used in DVD movies. Run this from the directory
that contains the jpg files:
mencoder mf://*.jpg -mf fps=10:type=jpg -o my-movie.mpg -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg2video:vbitrate=1800
You will need the dvd codec to play it back (any dvd playback software will do).
-borries.
From satlug at net153.net Sun May 9 20:56:33 2010
From: satlug at net153.net (Samuel Leon)
Date: Sun May 9 20:56:37 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE75CB2.90706@reglue.org>
References: <4BE75CB2.90706@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4BE767D1.3070408@net153.net>
Don Davis wrote:
> It seems as if it should be straightforward to make a video from a
> sequence of jpgs; however,
>
> using stopmotion there is an I/O error
> using ffmpeg stops on an opening filters error
> using kdenlive - I can play the movie but when I export I only see a
> black screen.
>
> (I've tried compiling my own ffmpeg but that didn't seem to help.)
>
ffmpeg should probably be able to do it. I can't give any more tips than
that though :-/
Sam
From ovalvw57 at yahoo.com Mon May 10 00:52:53 2010
From: ovalvw57 at yahoo.com (Typing on an upside-down keyboard.)
Date: Mon May 10 00:52:58 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE75CB2.90706@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <443803.84819.qm@web113515.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
--- On Sun, 5/9/10, Don Davis wrote:
It seems as if it should be straightforward to make a video from a sequence of jpgs; however,
using stopmotion there is an I/O error
using ffmpeg stops on an opening filters error
using kdenlive - I can play the movie but when I export I only see a black screen.
The GiMP with GAP should do it.
From dondavis at reglue.org Mon May 10 06:36:11 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Mon May 10 06:36:16 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <201005100142.o4A1gLJI012966@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005100142.o4A1gLJI012966@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BE7EFAB.7000700@reglue.org>
Thank you. Well, it almost worked. It made the film but the picture was
distorted very tall and narrow and mostly black and white. What do you
suggest now?
Borries Demeler wrote:
>> It seems as if it should be straightforward to make a video from a
>> sequence of jpgs; however,
>>
>> using stopmotion there is an I/O error
>> using ffmpeg stops on an opening filters error
>> using kdenlive - I can play the movie but when I export I only see a
>> black screen.
>>
>> (I've tried compiling my own ffmpeg but that didn't seem to help.)
>
> You can make an mpg format (below with 10 frames/sec) using mencoder.
> mpeg2 format is what's used in DVD movies. Run this from the directory
> that contains the jpg files:
>
> mencoder mf://*.jpg -mf fps=10:type=jpg -o my-movie.mpg -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg2video:vbitrate=1800
>
>
> You will need the dvd codec to play it back (any dvd playback software will do).
>
> -borries.
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Mon May 10 06:39:39 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Mon May 10 06:39:42 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE7EFAB.7000700@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <201005101139.o4ABddgv009883@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
>
> Thank you. Well, it almost worked. It made the film but the picture was
> distorted very tall and narrow and mostly black and white. What do you
> suggest now?
Are all the images of the same size and aspect ratio?
If not, you may need to crop them to be of identical dimension.
The b/w issue seems to suggest that there is something wrong with
your mencoder installation. If you want, I'll run the command for you,
if you can upload your images somewhere I'll give it a try.
-Borries
>
>
> Borries Demeler wrote:
> >> It seems as if it should be straightforward to make a video from a
> >> sequence of jpgs; however,
> >>
> >> using stopmotion there is an I/O error
> >> using ffmpeg stops on an opening filters error
> >> using kdenlive - I can play the movie but when I export I only see a
> >> black screen.
> >>
> >> (I've tried compiling my own ffmpeg but that didn't seem to help.)
> >
> > You can make an mpg format (below with 10 frames/sec) using mencoder.
> > mpeg2 format is what's used in DVD movies. Run this from the directory
> > that contains the jpg files:
> >
> > mencoder mf://*.jpg -mf fps=10:type=jpg -o my-movie.mpg -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg2video:vbitrate=1800
> >
> >
> > You will need the dvd codec to play it back (any dvd playback software will do).
> >
> > -borries.
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From dondavis at reglue.org Mon May 10 06:53:03 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Mon May 10 06:53:07 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <201005101139.o4ABddgv009883@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005101139.o4ABddgv009883@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BE7F39F.50900@reglue.org>
I noticed that along the way with installing my own ffmpeg I have messed
up some code installation. All dvds play wrong now. I'll have to fix
that first. I'll let you know what happens.
Thank you.
Borries Demeler wrote:
>> Thank you. Well, it almost worked. It made the film but the picture was
>> distorted very tall and narrow and mostly black and white. What do you
>> suggest now?
>
> Are all the images of the same size and aspect ratio?
> If not, you may need to crop them to be of identical dimension.
> The b/w issue seems to suggest that there is something wrong with
> your mencoder installation. If you want, I'll run the command for you,
> if you can upload your images somewhere I'll give it a try.
>
> -Borries
>
>>
>> Borries Demeler wrote:
>>>> It seems as if it should be straightforward to make a video from a
>>>> sequence of jpgs; however,
>>>>
>>>> using stopmotion there is an I/O error
>>>> using ffmpeg stops on an opening filters error
>>>> using kdenlive - I can play the movie but when I export I only see a
>>>> black screen.
>>>>
>>>> (I've tried compiling my own ffmpeg but that didn't seem to help.)
>>> You can make an mpg format (below with 10 frames/sec) using mencoder.
>>> mpeg2 format is what's used in DVD movies. Run this from the directory
>>> that contains the jpg files:
>>>
>>> mencoder mf://*.jpg -mf fps=10:type=jpg -o my-movie.mpg -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg2video:vbitrate=1800
>>>
>>>
>>> You will need the dvd codec to play it back (any dvd playback software will do).
>>>
>>> -borries.
>> --
>> _______________________________________________
>> SATLUG mailing list
>> SATLUG@satlug.org
>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>>
>
From dondavis at reglue.org Mon May 10 07:19:15 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Mon May 10 07:19:16 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE7F39F.50900@reglue.org>
References: <201005101139.o4ABddgv009883@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<4BE7F39F.50900@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4BE7F9C3.2060303@reglue.org>
Thank you.
The mencoder solution worked great. Thank you.
The gimp solution is playing one picture continuously. I'll need to
learn how to use that.
Even the one I had made in kdenlive works.
I'm really curious why ffmpeg isn't working.
Stream #0.0: Video: mjpeg, yuvj422p, 772x514 [PAR 72:72 DAR 386:257],
20 tbr, 20 tbn, 20 tbc
Error opening filters!
Don Davis wrote:
> I noticed that along the way with installing my own ffmpeg I have messed
> up some code installation. All dvds play wrong now. I'll have to fix
> that first. I'll let you know what happens.
> Thank you.
>
>
> Borries Demeler wrote:
>>> Thank you. Well, it almost worked. It made the film but the picture
>>> was distorted very tall and narrow and mostly black and white. What
>>> do you suggest now?
>>
>> Are all the images of the same size and aspect ratio?
>> If not, you may need to crop them to be of identical dimension.
>> The b/w issue seems to suggest that there is something wrong with
>> your mencoder installation. If you want, I'll run the command for you,
>> if you can upload your images somewhere I'll give it a try.
>>
>> -Borries
>>
>>>
>>> Borries Demeler wrote:
>>>>> It seems as if it should be straightforward to make a video from a
>>>>> sequence of jpgs; however,
>>>>>
>>>>> using stopmotion there is an I/O error
>>>>> using ffmpeg stops on an opening filters error
>>>>> using kdenlive - I can play the movie but when I export I only see
>>>>> a black screen.
>>>>>
>>>>> (I've tried compiling my own ffmpeg but that didn't seem to help.)
>>>> You can make an mpg format (below with 10 frames/sec) using mencoder.
>>>> mpeg2 format is what's used in DVD movies. Run this from the directory
>>>> that contains the jpg files:
>>>> mencoder mf://*.jpg -mf fps=10:type=jpg -o my-movie.mpg -ovc lavc
>>>> -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg2video:vbitrate=1800
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You will need the dvd codec to play it back (any dvd playback
>>>> software will do).
>>>>
>>>> -borries.
>>> --
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> SATLUG mailing list
>>> SATLUG@satlug.org
>>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
>>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>>>
>>
>
From toddwbucy at grandecom.net Mon May 10 07:36:16 2010
From: toddwbucy at grandecom.net (redpill)
Date: Mon May 10 07:36:19 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE7F9C3.2060303@reglue.org>
References: <201005101139.o4ABddgv009883@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<4BE7F39F.50900@reglue.org> <4BE7F9C3.2060303@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <1273494976.17801.1.camel@redpill-laptop>
Have you tried cinelerra. It has been a while but I am pretty sure it
does stop-motion pretty well
http://cinelerra.org/
Todd
On Mon, 2010-05-10 at 07:19 -0500, Don Davis wrote:
> Thank you.
> The mencoder solution worked great. Thank you.
> The gimp solution is playing one picture continuously. I'll need to
> learn how to use that.
> Even the one I had made in kdenlive works.
>
> I'm really curious why ffmpeg isn't working.
> Stream #0.0: Video: mjpeg, yuvj422p, 772x514 [PAR 72:72 DAR 386:257],
> 20 tbr, 20 tbn, 20 tbc
> Error opening filters!
>
>
> Don Davis wrote:
> > I noticed that along the way with installing my own ffmpeg I have messed
> > up some code installation. All dvds play wrong now. I'll have to fix
> > that first. I'll let you know what happens.
> > Thank you.
> >
> >
> > Borries Demeler wrote:
> >>> Thank you. Well, it almost worked. It made the film but the picture
> >>> was distorted very tall and narrow and mostly black and white. What
> >>> do you suggest now?
> >>
> >> Are all the images of the same size and aspect ratio?
> >> If not, you may need to crop them to be of identical dimension.
> >> The b/w issue seems to suggest that there is something wrong with
> >> your mencoder installation. If you want, I'll run the command for you,
> >> if you can upload your images somewhere I'll give it a try.
> >>
> >> -Borries
> >>
> >>>
> >>> Borries Demeler wrote:
> >>>>> It seems as if it should be straightforward to make a video from a
> >>>>> sequence of jpgs; however,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> using stopmotion there is an I/O error
> >>>>> using ffmpeg stops on an opening filters error
> >>>>> using kdenlive - I can play the movie but when I export I only see
> >>>>> a black screen.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> (I've tried compiling my own ffmpeg but that didn't seem to help.)
> >>>> You can make an mpg format (below with 10 frames/sec) using mencoder.
> >>>> mpeg2 format is what's used in DVD movies. Run this from the directory
> >>>> that contains the jpg files:
> >>>> mencoder mf://*.jpg -mf fps=10:type=jpg -o my-movie.mpg -ovc lavc
> >>>> -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg2video:vbitrate=1800
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> You will need the dvd codec to play it back (any dvd playback
> >>>> software will do).
> >>>>
> >>>> -borries.
> >>> --
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> SATLUG mailing list
> >>> SATLUG@satlug.org
> >>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> >>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
> >>>
> >>
> >
>
From hharadon at gmail.com Mon May 10 09:06:08 2010
From: hharadon at gmail.com (Howard Haradon)
Date: Mon May 10 09:06:11 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] May 13 - SELinux Presentation
Message-ID:
Hello, This is a reminder about our meeting
at SAC on this coming Thursday, 7:00 PM. We
will be hearing from Thomas Cameron of Red Hat.
Parking: Be sure to use the student areas and
put a sign on your dashboard "Attending SAC
event - NTC122".
Howard Haradon
From bkfuth at gmail.com Mon May 10 09:25:02 2010
From: bkfuth at gmail.com (steve kolars)
Date: Mon May 10 09:25:03 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] May 13 - SELinux Presentation
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
Parking should be rather easy since it in between semesters.
Steve
On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 9:06 AM, Howard Haradon wrote:
> Hello, This is a reminder about our meeting
> at SAC on this coming Thursday, 7:00 PM. We
> will be hearing from Thomas Cameron of Red Hat.
>
> Parking: Be sure to use the student areas and
> put a sign on your dashboard "Attending SAC
> event - NTC122".
>
> Howard Haradon
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From j at jvpappas.net Mon May 10 11:00:00 2010
From: j at jvpappas.net (John Pappas)
Date: Mon May 10 11:00:02 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] SNMP and SSH/telnet commands thru web Interface
In-Reply-To: <31995297-49D6-4F21-9F78-0F756563DBA4@gmail.com>
References:
<00i9r5tnlna3ov2lk1rg5c4kj2i4p9luql@4ax.com>
<4F0AB1EE-1CD4-4C09-84AC-1D8E8A215307@gmail.com>
<31995297-49D6-4F21-9F78-0F756563DBA4@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 15:32, twistedpickles wrote:
> I'm familiar with the built in http server on the Cisco switches
> unfortunately that won't work.
>
I am a bit late to this discussion, but I presume that you are ok with a
stand-alone system as a host for this capability, since it really cannot be
embedded into the switches themselves. MindTerm is a Java Applet that can
be included in HTTP pages, and it would seem that if you use a little elbow
grease, you could build it in yourself. A PogoPlug with HTTP server and
your embedded code would be pretty elegant.
I am not sure from your discussion whether you are looking to "automate" (ie
send programmatic commands via this solution) or just have a "Management
Panel" where the admin can click on the appropo switch and it would spawn an
SSH interface to that box without any "dedicated" software on the client.
If you are looking for a "pssh" like solution (ie send the same commands
simultaneously to multiple switches) then I am not sure the best way to do
this, or even what commercial solutions do this; but maybe Cisco
Configuration Manager or SolarWinds perhaps.
HTH,
John Pappas
From dondavis at reglue.org Mon May 10 17:10:12 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Mon May 10 17:10:18 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <201005101139.o4ABddgv009883@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005101139.o4ABddgv009883@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BE88444.7020000@reglue.org>
If you want, I'll run the command for you,
> if you can upload your images somewhere I'll give it a try.
>
Could you check if the ffmpeg commands work for you?
ffmpeg -f image2 -i image%d.jpg video.mpg
ffmpeg -r 10 -b 1800 -i %03d.jpg test1800.mp4
ffmpeg -r 10 -b 1800 -i *.JPG test1800.mp4
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Mon May 10 17:20:46 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Mon May 10 17:20:49 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE88444.7020000@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <201005102220.o4AMKksm002220@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
>
> If you want, I'll run the command for you,
> > if you can upload your images somewhere I'll give it a try.
> >
>
> Could you check if the ffmpeg commands work for you?
> ffmpeg -f image2 -i image%d.jpg video.mpg
> ffmpeg -r 10 -b 1800 -i %03d.jpg test1800.mp4
> ffmpeg -r 10 -b 1800 -i *.JPG test1800.mp4
As far as I know ffmpeg is for encoding movies, not images. What is wrong
with the mencoder command I sent you? Doesn't that work?
-b.
From dondavis at reglue.org Mon May 10 17:45:48 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Mon May 10 17:45:49 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <201005102220.o4AMKksm002220@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005102220.o4AMKksm002220@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BE88C9C.4030604@reglue.org>
Borries Demeler wrote:
>> If you want, I'll run the command for you,
>>> if you can upload your images somewhere I'll give it a try.
>>>
>> Could you check if the ffmpeg commands work for you?
>> ffmpeg -f image2 -i image%d.jpg video.mpg
>> ffmpeg -r 10 -b 1800 -i %03d.jpg test1800.mp4
>> ffmpeg -r 10 -b 1800 -i *.JPG test1800.mp4
>
> As far as I know ffmpeg is for encoding movies, not images. What is wrong
> with the mencoder command I sent you? Doesn't that work?
>
> -b.
ffmpeg is very versatile. The mencoder command you sent worked great! I
really like using ffmpeg and I was wondering if you (or possibly anyone
else) could verify that the command should work or that the command
isn't working for anyone else. (Additionally, if I did find the working
ffmpeg code I could (hypothetically) correct the code in stop motion.)
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Mon May 10 17:57:34 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Mon May 10 17:57:36 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE88C9C.4030604@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <201005102257.o4AMvYTK004862@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
>
> Borries Demeler wrote:
> >> If you want, I'll run the command for you,
> >>> if you can upload your images somewhere I'll give it a try.
> >>>
> >> Could you check if the ffmpeg commands work for you?
> >> ffmpeg -f image2 -i image%d.jpg video.mpg
> >> ffmpeg -r 10 -b 1800 -i %03d.jpg test1800.mp4
> >> ffmpeg -r 10 -b 1800 -i *.JPG test1800.mp4
> >
> > As far as I know ffmpeg is for encoding movies, not images. What is wrong
> > with the mencoder command I sent you? Doesn't that work?
> >
> > -b.
>
> ffmpeg is very versatile. The mencoder command you sent worked great! I
> really like using ffmpeg and I was wondering if you (or possibly anyone
> else) could verify that the command should work or that the command
> isn't working for anyone else. (Additionally, if I did find the working
> ffmpeg code I could (hypothetically) correct the code in stop motion.)
I see, well, I tried the snippets up above but they didn't work for me.
Not sure how to convert a bunch of jpg files with ffmpeg, maybe someone
else does.
good luck,
-b.
>
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From jeremymann at gmail.com Tue May 11 08:54:01 2010
From: jeremymann at gmail.com (Jeremy Mann)
Date: Tue May 11 08:54:04 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE88C9C.4030604@reglue.org>
References: <201005102220.o4AMKksm002220@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<4BE88C9C.4030604@reglue.org>
Message-ID:
On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 5:45 PM, Don Davis wrote:
> ffmpeg is very versatile. The mencoder command you sent worked great! I
> really like using ffmpeg and I was wondering if you (or possibly anyone
> else) could verify that the command should work or that the command isn't
> working for anyone else. (Additionally, if I did find the working ffmpeg
> code I could (hypothetically) correct the code in stop motion.)
Don, both ffmpeg and mencoder use the same libavcodec library for processing.
--
Jeremy Mann
jeremy@biochem.uthscsa.edu
University of Texas Health Science Center
Bioinformatics Core Facility
http://www.bioinformatics.uthscsa.edu
Phone: (210) 567-2672
From david.salisbury at momentumweb.com Tue May 11 11:47:59 2010
From: david.salisbury at momentumweb.com (David Salisbury)
Date: Tue May 11 11:49:46 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Blocking with iptables, even if the hostname won't resolve
Message-ID: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com>
So, we have a server attacking one of our services right now:
maria-victoria.zevsnet.netvisio.net
I'd like to use iptables to block the traffic, but unfortunately even
though that host is continually connecting, the above domain name
doesn't resolve to an IP and thus iptables can't do anything (iptables
replies with a "host/network `maria-victoria.zevsnet.netvisio.net' not
found" message). Does anyone have any ideas about blocking this
traffic, or about finding the IP it's associated with so I can? So far
my searches are fruitless, and I've not encountered a host that won't
resolve like this that is currently and actively connecting!
David
From michael at michaelrice.org Tue May 11 12:25:18 2010
From: michael at michaelrice.org (Michael Rice)
Date: Tue May 11 12:25:38 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Blocking with iptables,
even if the hostname won't resolve
In-Reply-To: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com>
References: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com>
Message-ID: <4BE992FE.3040207@michaelrice.org>
You could try using a string match if you really have nothing else to
work with
On 5/11/2010 11:47 AM, David Salisbury wrote:
> So, we have a server attacking one of our services right now:
>
> maria-victoria.zevsnet.netvisio.net
>
> I'd like to use iptables to block the traffic, but unfortunately even
> though that host is continually connecting, the above domain name
> doesn't resolve to an IP and thus iptables can't do anything (iptables
> replies with a "host/network `maria-victoria.zevsnet.netvisio.net' not
> found" message). Does anyone have any ideas about blocking this
> traffic, or about finding the IP it's associated with so I can? So
> far my searches are fruitless, and I've not encountered a host that
> won't resolve like this that is currently and actively connecting!
> David
>
From jeremymann at gmail.com Tue May 11 13:06:02 2010
From: jeremymann at gmail.com (Jeremy Mann)
Date: Tue May 11 13:06:08 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Blocking with iptables, even if the hostname won't
resolve
In-Reply-To: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com>
References: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com>
Message-ID:
On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 11:47 AM, David Salisbury
wrote:
> So, we have a server attacking one of our services right now:
>
> maria-victoria.zevsnet.netvisio.net
>
> I'd like to use iptables to block the traffic, but unfortunately even though
> that host is continually connecting, the above domain name doesn't resolve
> to an IP and thus iptables can't do anything (iptables replies with a
> "host/network `maria-victoria.zevsnet.netvisio.net' not found" message).
> ?Does anyone have any ideas about blocking this traffic, or about finding
> the IP it's associated with so I can? ?So far my searches are fruitless, and
> I've not encountered a host that won't resolve like this that is currently
> and actively connecting!
David, for now I would block the entire domain, netvisio.net:
Non-authoritative answer:
Name: netvisio.net
Address: 212.116.158.139
--
Jeremy Mann
jeremy@biochem.uthscsa.edu
University of Texas Health Science Center
Bioinformatics Core Facility
http://www.bioinformatics.uthscsa.edu
Phone: (210) 567-2672
From david.salisbury at momentumweb.com Tue May 11 14:14:35 2010
From: david.salisbury at momentumweb.com (David Salisbury)
Date: Tue May 11 14:16:20 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Blocking with iptables, even if the hostname won't
resolve
In-Reply-To:
References: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com>
Message-ID: <4BE9AC9B.7030802@momentumweb.com>
But I don't think I can block whole domains with iptables, right? Like,
if I block the site below, that will just block THAT site (that IP) and
not any "under it", isn't that correct? I so far haven't been able to
find a way to do it with iptables (block an entire domain), at least.
I'll look at that string match a little more closely, but I read some
forums that said it basically didn't match the string of the domain
name, but rather information in the headers (which potentially wouldn't
include the actual name). But I didn't check that myself so I'll dig a
little more. Thanks for the suggestions, guys!
David
On 5/11/2010 1:06 PM, Jeremy Mann wrote:
> David, for now I would block the entire domain, netvisio.net:
> Non-authoritative answer:
> Name: netvisio.net
> Address: 212.116.158.139
>
From jeremymann at gmail.com Tue May 11 14:25:11 2010
From: jeremymann at gmail.com (Jeremy Mann)
Date: Tue May 11 14:25:14 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Blocking with iptables, even if the hostname won't
resolve
In-Reply-To: <4BE9AC9B.7030802@momentumweb.com>
References: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com>
<4BE9AC9B.7030802@momentumweb.com>
Message-ID:
On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 2:14 PM, David Salisbury
wrote:
> But I don't think I can block whole domains with iptables, right? ?Like, if
> I block the site below, that will just block THAT site (that IP) and not any
> "under it", isn't that correct? ?I so far haven't been able to find a way to
> do it with iptables (block an entire domain), at least. ?I'll look at that
> string match a little more closely, but I read some forums that said it
> basically didn't match the string of the domain name, but rather information
> in the headers (which potentially wouldn't include the actual name). ?But I
> didn't check that myself so I'll dig a little more. ?Thanks for the
> suggestions, guys!
I block full domains all the time with iptables. For example:
iptables -A INPUT -i eth0 -s 200.223.203.0/24 -j DROP
--
Jeremy Mann
jeremy@biochem.uthscsa.edu
University of Texas Health Science Center
Bioinformatics Core Facility
http://www.bioinformatics.uthscsa.edu
Phone: (210) 567-2672
From david.salisbury at momentumweb.com Tue May 11 14:31:42 2010
From: david.salisbury at momentumweb.com (David Salisbury)
Date: Tue May 11 14:33:26 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Blocking with iptables, even if the hostname won't
resolve
In-Reply-To:
References: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com> <4BE9AC9B.7030802@momentumweb.com>
Message-ID: <4BE9B09E.3070706@momentumweb.com>
OK, right, I got it. Assuming they (netvisio) do have the entire class
C, indeed I could go that way. I guess I'm always wary of, if I do
that, the off chance that I'll block something else that shouldn't be
blocked if they don't have that whole block. But I guess if it
continues that will be the risk I have to take (and I admit the chances
of me blocking something legitimate coming from there are probably
indeed small)!
But it is unusual that this domain doesn't resolve anywhere, isn't it??
That seems pretty strange to me.
David
On 5/11/2010 2:25 PM, Jeremy Mann wrote:
>
> I block full domains all the time with iptables. For example:
>
> iptables -A INPUT -i eth0 -s 200.223.203.0/24 -j DROP
>
From jeremymann at gmail.com Tue May 11 14:37:16 2010
From: jeremymann at gmail.com (Jeremy Mann)
Date: Tue May 11 14:37:18 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Blocking with iptables, even if the hostname won't
resolve
In-Reply-To: <4BE9B09E.3070706@momentumweb.com>
References: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com>
<4BE9AC9B.7030802@momentumweb.com>
<4BE9B09E.3070706@momentumweb.com>
Message-ID:
On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 2:31 PM, David Salisbury
wrote:
> OK, right, I got it. ?Assuming they (netvisio) do have the entire class C,
> indeed I could go that way. ?I guess I'm always wary of, if I do that, the
> off chance that I'll block something else that shouldn't be blocked if they
> don't have that whole block. ?But I guess if it continues that will be the
> risk I have to take (and I admit the chances of me blocking something
> legitimate coming from there are probably indeed small)!
>
> But it is unusual that this domain doesn't resolve anywhere, isn't it??
Do you have clients or customers in Bulgaria? netvisio.net is coming
from Plovdiv, Bulgaria.
--
Jeremy Mann
jeremy@biochem.uthscsa.edu
University of Texas Health Science Center
Bioinformatics Core Facility
http://www.bioinformatics.uthscsa.edu
Phone: (210) 567-2672
From e2eiod at gmail.com Tue May 11 15:17:32 2010
From: e2eiod at gmail.com (Robert Pearson)
Date: Tue May 11 15:17:38 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Google chrome speed tests
In-Reply-To:
References: <4BE1AE3D.2080407@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 12:42 AM, Robert Pearson wrote:
> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:43 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
>> Kinda interesting.
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCgQDjiotG0
>>
>> ?-- Bruce
>> --
>
> Am I missing something here?
> The last time I looked into Chrome for Linux it was not apples to
> apples. Not for Mac either.
> Has this changed?
> I just looked and it looks like the same code for Ubuntu.
>
> I run Chrome, Firefox and Internet Explorer on my lone XP instance and
> it seems faster and better than the other two.
> At some things.
>
> Browsers are an interesting design space. The bandwidth available is
> fixed. So the creativity starts with gimmicks.
> Like prefetch and cache.
> If they guess right from their profile of your behavior they look
> really good but very bad if they miss your intent and the wrong stuff
> is prefetched to cache.
> They really need a feature like "hyperdrive" in deep space. When your
> browser focus has been defined the "hyperdrive kicks in.
> The overall result is a faster response.
>
> My two cents...
>
Latest "browser wars" news... some stuff, mostly fluff... notice the
shifting of "cosmetic" features to increase effective bandwidth...
also the "focus" shift to? hyperdrive?...
[Hyperdrive - Wikipedia]
[Faster Forward by Rob Pegoraro - The Washington Post {Good Overview}]
[Firefox 4 Steps Out of the Shadows by Katherine Noyes TechNewsWorld
05/11/10 11:33 AM PT]
[Mozilla sets Firefox 4 release for November -- Outlines plans, goals
by Gregg Keizer May 11, 2010 01:23 PM ET]
[Mozilla wants to make Firefox a speedster by Paul Krill, InfoWorld
May 11, 2010 02:32 PM ET]
[Browser upgrade plans include HTML5 support, performance
optimization, and greater user control]
[Mozilla Making Firefox 4 to be ''Super-Duper Fast'' by Jane
McEntegart 3:10 PM - May 11, 2010 - source: Tom's Hardware US]
[Mozilla Discusses Firefox 4 Plans by Ian Paul May 11, 2010 9:52 am - PC World]
[Mozilla Rallies Fans with Firefox 4 Plans by: Michael Muchmore
05.11.2010 - PC Magaziine]
[Wikipedia - general background reference for Firefox 3.6]
From dondavis at reglue.org Tue May 11 16:30:33 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Tue May 11 16:30:39 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To:
References: <201005102220.o4AMKksm002220@biochem.uthscsa.edu> <4BE88C9C.4030604@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4BE9CC79.80501@reglue.org>
> Don, both ffmpeg and mencoder use the same libavcodec library for processing.
Ahh. Makes sense - many things seem to rely on that. Can you confirm
that the ffmpeg command:
ffmpeg -r 20 -sameq -i *JPG -s 1024x768 render2.mp4
should or shouldn't work?
or what open filters error signifies?
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Tue May 11 16:56:03 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Tue May 11 16:56:09 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE9CC79.80501@reglue.org>
References: <201005102220.o4AMKksm002220@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<4BE88C9C.4030604@reglue.org>
<4BE9CC79.80501@reglue.org>
Message-ID:
>
>> Don, both ffmpeg and mencoder use the same libavcodec library for
>> processing.
>
> Ahh. Makes sense - many things seem to rely on that. Can you confirm
> that the ffmpeg command:
> ffmpeg -r 20 -sameq -i *JPG -s 1024x768 render2.mp4
> should or shouldn't work?
> or what open filters error signifies?
>
This command errors out on my install.
-b.
>
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
--
Borries Demeler, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
The University of Texas Health Science Center at San Antonio
Dept. of Biochemistry, 7703 Floyd Curl Drive, San Antonio, Texas 78229-3900
Voice: 210-767-3332, Fax: 210-567-4575, Email: demeler@biochem.uthscsa.edu
PLEASE NOTE NEW PHONE NUMBER!
From dondavis at reglue.org Tue May 11 19:36:16 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Tue May 11 19:36:17 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Linux Against Poverty volunteer sign up
Message-ID: <4BE9F800.9030800@reglue.org>
If anyone is planning/wanting to work with Linux Against Poverty on June
19th in Austin the sign up is available here:
http://groups.google.com/group/lap2010
From jeremymann at gmail.com Wed May 12 08:25:48 2010
From: jeremymann at gmail.com (Jeremy Mann)
Date: Wed May 12 08:25:53 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How to make video from a sequence of JPGs?
In-Reply-To: <4BE9CC79.80501@reglue.org>
References: <201005102220.o4AMKksm002220@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<4BE88C9C.4030604@reglue.org>
<4BE9CC79.80501@reglue.org>
Message-ID:
On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 4:30 PM, Don Davis wrote:
>
>> Don, both ffmpeg and mencoder use the same libavcodec library for
>> processing.
>
> Ahh. Makes sense - many things seem to rely on that. Can you confirm that
> the ffmpeg command:
> ffmpeg -r 20 -sameq -i *JPG -s 1024x768 render2.mp4
> ?should or shouldn't work?
> or what open filters error signifies?
Don, this works on my server. Which ffmpeg version do you have? Did
you compile it with all needed libraries?
FFmpeg version 0.5, Copyright (c) 2000-2009 Fabrice Bellard, et al.
configuration: --prefix=/usr --libdir=/usr/lib --shlibdir=/usr/lib
--mandir=/usr/share/man --incdir=/usr/include --enable-libamr-nb
--enable-libamr-wb --enable-libdirac --enable-libfaac --enable-libfaad
--enable-libmp3lame --enable-libtheora --enable-libx264 --enable-gpl
--enable-nonfree --enable-postproc --enable-pthreads --enable-shared
--enable-swscale --enable-x11grab
libavutil 49.15. 0 / 49.15. 0
libavcodec 52.20. 0 / 52.20. 0
libavformat 52.31. 0 / 52.31. 0
libavdevice 52. 1. 0 / 52. 1. 0
libswscale 0. 7. 1 / 0. 7. 1
libpostproc 51. 2. 0 / 51. 2. 0
built on Nov 6 2009 19:05:03, gcc: 4.1.2 20080704 (Red Hat 4.1.2-46)
--
Jeremy Mann
jeremy@biochem.uthscsa.edu
University of Texas Health Science Center
Bioinformatics Core Facility
http://www.bioinformatics.uthscsa.edu
Phone: (210) 567-2672
From mhayes59 at sbcglobal.net Wed May 12 10:50:43 2010
From: mhayes59 at sbcglobal.net (Dennis Hayes)
Date: Wed May 12 10:50:49 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Blocking with iptables,
even if the hostname won't resolve
In-Reply-To: <4BE98A3F.5010605@momentumweb.com>
Message-ID: <915651.27945.qm@web83305.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
--- On Tue, 5/11/10, David Salisbury wrote:
From: David Salisbury
Subject: [SATLUG] Blocking with iptables, even if the hostname won't resolve
To: "The San Antonio Linux User's GroupMailing List"
Date: Tuesday, May 11, 2010, 11:47 AM
So, we have a server attacking one of our services right now:
maria-victoria.zevsnet.netvisio.net
David I googled only the first part and found this:
?
80.72.72.0/23 - bgp.he.net
80.72.73.105 ? maria-victoria.zevsnet.netvisio.net ? design-mv.com ? 80.72.73.106 ? pc41.zevsnet.netvisio.net ? 80.72.73.107 ? pc42.zevsnet.
-- _______________________________________________
SATLUG mailing list
SATLUG@satlug.org
http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
From christopher.lemire at gmail.com Wed May 12 17:05:33 2010
From: christopher.lemire at gmail.com (Christopher Lemire)
Date: Wed May 12 17:05:57 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] More evidence of Steam and Valve games coming to Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 10:27 PM, Jonathan Hull wrote:
> Linux Gamers Rejoice!
>
> For those of you not following this already I will bring y'all up to
> date. Steam is a gaming delivery service by Valve. They also produce a
> few games themselves such as Half Life, Portal, Left 4 Dead, Team
> Fortress, and others.
>
> Since the beginning of Steam Linux users have been asking for a Linux
> client, and over the past few years several pieces of evidence have
> surfaced that such a Linux client is in the works. Here are the few
> that I can remember (not in order):
>
> - Job opening at Valve lists "Port Windows-based games to the Linux
> platform" in the job description:
> http://www.valvesoftware.com/job-SenSoftEngineer.html
>
> - Left 4 Dead demo contains Linux binaries:
> http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2008/12/steam-linux-on-the-way-left-4-dead-carries-linux-binaries.ars
>
> - Steam announced for Mac, including ports of Valve games (not Linux,
> but related)
> http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/08/valve-confirms-steam-for-mac-debuts-in-april/
>
> - Upcoming Steam client for Mac contains Linux launcher code:
> http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/23/steam-for-mac-beta-reveals-possible-linux-compatibility-in-the-p/
>
>
> Now today a screenshot leaked showing the beginnings of a Steam client
> running on Linux:
> http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/03/screenshots-emerge-of-steam-linux-client-beos-wonders-if-its-n/
>
>
> While there has been no announcement nor has there been any evidence
> of a full client or running games, this is all still exciting in my
> eyes. Valve is a master of leaking viral information that nearly
> rivals Apple, and these bits of evidence are right down their alley.
> As a gamer and a Linux user I am hoping!
>
> -Jon
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
I was just about to start a new email thread about this. It looks like
it's slowly happening that Linux is taking over, not all at once. Here
it is from the company themselves that are responsible for many games.
It just recently happened for OSX. It's a smart move on their part and
no more dual booting for people who use Windows for gaming.
http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Steam_under_Linux
--
Christopher Lemire
Ubuntu 64 bit Linux Raid Level 0
From christopher.lemire at gmail.com Wed May 12 17:12:56 2010
From: christopher.lemire at gmail.com (Christopher Lemire)
Date: Wed May 12 17:13:18 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] More evidence of Steam and Valve games coming to Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 5:05 PM, Christopher Lemire
wrote:
> On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 10:27 PM, Jonathan Hull wrote:
>> Linux Gamers Rejoice!
>>
>> For those of you not following this already I will bring y'all up to
>> date. Steam is a gaming delivery service by Valve. They also produce a
>> few games themselves such as Half Life, Portal, Left 4 Dead, Team
>> Fortress, and others.
>>
>> Since the beginning of Steam Linux users have been asking for a Linux
>> client, and over the past few years several pieces of evidence have
>> surfaced that such a Linux client is in the works. Here are the few
>> that I can remember (not in order):
>>
>> - Job opening at Valve lists "Port Windows-based games to the Linux
>> platform" in the job description:
>> http://www.valvesoftware.com/job-SenSoftEngineer.html
>>
>> - Left 4 Dead demo contains Linux binaries:
>> http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2008/12/steam-linux-on-the-way-left-4-dead-carries-linux-binaries.ars
>>
>> - Steam announced for Mac, including ports of Valve games (not Linux,
>> but related)
>> http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/08/valve-confirms-steam-for-mac-debuts-in-april/
>>
>> - Upcoming Steam client for Mac contains Linux launcher code:
>> http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/23/steam-for-mac-beta-reveals-possible-linux-compatibility-in-the-p/
>>
>>
>> Now today a screenshot leaked showing the beginnings of a Steam client
>> running on Linux:
>> http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/03/screenshots-emerge-of-steam-linux-client-beos-wonders-if-its-n/
>>
>>
>> While there has been no announcement nor has there been any evidence
>> of a full client or running games, this is all still exciting in my
>> eyes. Valve is a master of leaking viral information that nearly
>> rivals Apple, and these bits of evidence are right down their alley.
>> As a gamer and a Linux user I am hoping!
>>
>> -Jon
>> --
>> _______________________________________________
>> SATLUG mailing list
>> SATLUG@satlug.org
>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>>
>
> I was just about to start a new email thread about this. It looks like
> it's slowly happening that Linux is taking over, not all at once. Here
> it is from the company themselves that are responsible for many games.
> It just recently happened for OSX. It's a smart move on their part and
> no more dual booting for people who use Windows for gaming.
>
> http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Steam_under_Linux
>
> --
> Christopher Lemire
> Ubuntu 64 bit Linux Raid Level 0
>
All I could find from search string
site:store.steampowered.com linux
was this script
http://store.steampowered.com/public/client/steam_client_linux
which is enough proof. But for games running on Linux as dedicated
servers, that is nothing new.
--
Christopher Lemire
Ubuntu 64 bit Linux Raid Level 0
From masterr at gmail.com Wed May 12 22:10:13 2010
From: masterr at gmail.com (Jonathan Hull)
Date: Wed May 12 22:10:35 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] More evidence of Steam and Valve games coming to Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
There is also this bit from the Mac Steam launcher:
#determine platform
UNAME=`uname`
if [ "$UNAME" == "Darwin" ]; then
PLATFORM=osx32
# prepend our lib path to LD_LIBRARY_PATH
export DYLD_LIBRARY_PATH="${STEAMROOT}"/${PLATFORM}:$DYLD_LIBRARY_PATH
elif [ "$UNAME" == "Linux" ]; then
PLATFORM=linux32
# prepend our lib path to LD_LIBRARY_PATH
export LD_LIBRARY_PATH="${STEAMROOT}"/${PLATFORM}:$LD_LIBRARY_PATH
fi
There is also a portion that detects the sound system, and one of the
systems it tries is Jack, which as far as I know does not run on OSX.
Things are looking promising.
-Jon
On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 5:05 PM, Christopher Lemire
wrote:
> On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 10:27 PM, Jonathan Hull wrote:
>> Linux Gamers Rejoice!
>>
>> For those of you not following this already I will bring y'all up to
>> date. Steam is a gaming delivery service by Valve. They also produce a
>> few games themselves such as Half Life, Portal, Left 4 Dead, Team
>> Fortress, and others.
>>
>> Since the beginning of Steam Linux users have been asking for a Linux
>> client, and over the past few years several pieces of evidence have
>> surfaced that such a Linux client is in the works. Here are the few
>> that I can remember (not in order):
>>
>> - Job opening at Valve lists "Port Windows-based games to the Linux
>> platform" in the job description:
>> http://www.valvesoftware.com/job-SenSoftEngineer.html
>>
>> - Left 4 Dead demo contains Linux binaries:
>> http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2008/12/steam-linux-on-the-way-left-4-dead-carries-linux-binaries.ars
>>
>> - Steam announced for Mac, including ports of Valve games (not Linux,
>> but related)
>> http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/08/valve-confirms-steam-for-mac-debuts-in-april/
>>
>> - Upcoming Steam client for Mac contains Linux launcher code:
>> http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/23/steam-for-mac-beta-reveals-possible-linux-compatibility-in-the-p/
>>
>>
>> Now today a screenshot leaked showing the beginnings of a Steam client
>> running on Linux:
>> http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/03/screenshots-emerge-of-steam-linux-client-beos-wonders-if-its-n/
>>
>>
>> While there has been no announcement nor has there been any evidence
>> of a full client or running games, this is all still exciting in my
>> eyes. Valve is a master of leaking viral information that nearly
>> rivals Apple, and these bits of evidence are right down their alley.
>> As a gamer and a Linux user I am hoping!
>>
>> -Jon
>> --
>> _______________________________________________
>> SATLUG mailing list
>> SATLUG@satlug.org
>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>>
>
> I was just about to start a new email thread about this. It looks like
> it's slowly happening that Linux is taking over, not all at once. Here
> it is from the company themselves that are responsible for many games.
> It just recently happened for OSX. It's a smart move on their part and
> no more dual booting for people who use Windows for gaming.
>
> http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Steam_under_Linux
>
> --
> Christopher Lemire
> Ubuntu 64 bit Linux Raid Level 0
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From the.dead.dude at gmail.com Wed May 12 22:25:35 2010
From: the.dead.dude at gmail.com (Justin)
Date: Wed May 12 22:25:58 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] More evidence of Steam and Valve games coming to Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
Hopefully Steam on Linux will let you play all of your steam games on
linux. That would be absolutely great. But unfortunately I think
Steam-Linux will be something more like you'll only be able to play certain
games on Linux.
Either way, once it happens we'll have to do a linux-steam-lan party.
On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 10:10 PM, Jonathan Hull wrote:
> There is also this bit from the Mac Steam launcher:
>
> #determine platform
> UNAME=`uname`
> if [ "$UNAME" == "Darwin" ]; then
> PLATFORM=osx32
> # prepend our lib path to LD_LIBRARY_PATH
> export DYLD_LIBRARY_PATH="${STEAMROOT}"/${PLATFORM}:$DYLD_LIBRARY_PATH
> elif [ "$UNAME" == "Linux" ]; then
> PLATFORM=linux32
> # prepend our lib path to LD_LIBRARY_PATH
> export LD_LIBRARY_PATH="${STEAMROOT}"/${PLATFORM}:$LD_LIBRARY_PATH
> fi
>
>
> There is also a portion that detects the sound system, and one of the
> systems it tries is Jack, which as far as I know does not run on OSX.
>
> Things are looking promising.
>
> -Jon
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 5:05 PM, Christopher Lemire
> wrote:
> > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 10:27 PM, Jonathan Hull
> wrote:
> >> Linux Gamers Rejoice!
> >>
> >> For those of you not following this already I will bring y'all up to
> >> date. Steam is a gaming delivery service by Valve. They also produce a
> >> few games themselves such as Half Life, Portal, Left 4 Dead, Team
> >> Fortress, and others.
> >>
> >> Since the beginning of Steam Linux users have been asking for a Linux
> >> client, and over the past few years several pieces of evidence have
> >> surfaced that such a Linux client is in the works. Here are the few
> >> that I can remember (not in order):
> >>
> >> - Job opening at Valve lists "Port Windows-based games to the Linux
> >> platform" in the job description:
> >> http://www.valvesoftware.com/job-SenSoftEngineer.html
> >>
> >> - Left 4 Dead demo contains Linux binaries:
> >>
> http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2008/12/steam-linux-on-the-way-left-4-dead-carries-linux-binaries.ars
> >>
> >> - Steam announced for Mac, including ports of Valve games (not Linux,
> >> but related)
> >>
> http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/08/valve-confirms-steam-for-mac-debuts-in-april/
> >>
> >> - Upcoming Steam client for Mac contains Linux launcher code:
> >>
> http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/23/steam-for-mac-beta-reveals-possible-linux-compatibility-in-the-p/
> >>
> >>
> >> Now today a screenshot leaked showing the beginnings of a Steam client
> >> running on Linux:
> >>
> http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/03/screenshots-emerge-of-steam-linux-client-beos-wonders-if-its-n/
> >>
> >>
> >> While there has been no announcement nor has there been any evidence
> >> of a full client or running games, this is all still exciting in my
> >> eyes. Valve is a master of leaking viral information that nearly
> >> rivals Apple, and these bits of evidence are right down their alley.
> >> As a gamer and a Linux user I am hoping!
> >>
> >> -Jon
> >> --
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> SATLUG mailing list
> >> SATLUG@satlug.org
> >> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> >> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
> >>
> >
> > I was just about to start a new email thread about this. It looks like
> > it's slowly happening that Linux is taking over, not all at once. Here
> > it is from the company themselves that are responsible for many games.
> > It just recently happened for OSX. It's a smart move on their part and
> > no more dual booting for people who use Windows for gaming.
> >
> > http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Steam_under_Linux
> >
> > --
> > Christopher Lemire
> > Ubuntu 64 bit Linux Raid Level 0
> > --
> > _______________________________________________
> > SATLUG mailing list
> > SATLUG@satlug.org
> > http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> > Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
> >
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From daniel at rugmonster.org Wed May 12 22:37:05 2010
From: daniel at rugmonster.org (Daniel J. Givens)
Date: Wed May 12 22:37:14 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] More evidence of Steam and Valve games coming to Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <8A0E917F-F106-48C2-BC88-7882C47A08DC@rugmonster.org>
Steam is a content delivery platform. It's said that certain Source
engine games (HL2, CS:S, TF2, Portal 2, etc) will be ported. The rest
of the games that don't have Linux ports and don't use the Source
engine probably won't see a Linux port, at least at release time.
--
Daniel
On May 12, 2010, at 22:25, Justin wrote:
> Hopefully Steam on Linux will let you play all of your steam games on
> linux. That would be absolutely great. But unfortunately I think
> Steam-Linux will be something more like you'll only be able to play
> certain
> games on Linux.
>
> Either way, once it happens we'll have to do a linux-steam-lan party.
>
> On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 10:10 PM, Jonathan Hull
> wrote:
>
>> There is also this bit from the Mac Steam launcher:
>>
>> #determine platform
>> UNAME=`uname`
>> if [ "$UNAME" == "Darwin" ]; then
>> PLATFORM=osx32
>> # prepend our lib path to LD_LIBRARY_PATH
>> export DYLD_LIBRARY_PATH="${STEAMROOT}"/${PLATFORM}:
>> $DYLD_LIBRARY_PATH
>> elif [ "$UNAME" == "Linux" ]; then
>> PLATFORM=linux32
>> # prepend our lib path to LD_LIBRARY_PATH
>> export LD_LIBRARY_PATH="${STEAMROOT}"/${PLATFORM}:$LD_LIBRARY_PATH
>> fi
>>
>>
>> There is also a portion that detects the sound system, and one of the
>> systems it tries is Jack, which as far as I know does not run on OSX.
>>
>> Things are looking promising.
>>
>> -Jon
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 5:05 PM, Christopher Lemire
>> wrote:
>>> On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 10:27 PM, Jonathan Hull
>> wrote:
>>>> Linux Gamers Rejoice!
>>>>
>>>> For those of you not following this already I will bring y'all up
>>>> to
>>>> date. Steam is a gaming delivery service by Valve. They also
>>>> produce a
>>>> few games themselves such as Half Life, Portal, Left 4 Dead, Team
>>>> Fortress, and others.
>>>>
>>>> Since the beginning of Steam Linux users have been asking for a
>>>> Linux
>>>> client, and over the past few years several pieces of evidence have
>>>> surfaced that such a Linux client is in the works. Here are the few
>>>> that I can remember (not in order):
>>>>
>>>> - Job opening at Valve lists "Port Windows-based games to the Linux
>>>> platform" in the job description:
>>>> http://www.valvesoftware.com/job-SenSoftEngineer.html
>>>>
>>>> - Left 4 Dead demo contains Linux binaries:
>>>>
>> http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2008/12/steam-linux-on-the-way-left-4-dead-carries-linux-binaries.ars
>>>>
>>>> - Steam announced for Mac, including ports of Valve games (not
>>>> Linux,
>>>> but related)
>>>>
>> http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/08/valve-confirms-steam-for-mac-debuts-in-april/
>>>>
>>>> - Upcoming Steam client for Mac contains Linux launcher code:
>>>>
>> http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/23/steam-for-mac-beta-reveals-possible-linux-compatibility-in-the-p/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Now today a screenshot leaked showing the beginnings of a Steam
>>>> client
>>>> running on Linux:
>>>>
>> http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/03/screenshots-emerge-of-steam-linux-client-beos-wonders-if-its-n/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> While there has been no announcement nor has there been any
>>>> evidence
>>>> of a full client or running games, this is all still exciting in my
>>>> eyes. Valve is a master of leaking viral information that nearly
>>>> rivals Apple, and these bits of evidence are right down their
>>>> alley.
>>>> As a gamer and a Linux user I am hoping!
>>>>
>>>> -Jon
>>>> --
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> SATLUG mailing list
>>>> SATLUG@satlug.org
>>>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/
>>>> unsubscribe
>>>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>>>>
>>>
>>> I was just about to start a new email thread about this. It looks
>>> like
>>> it's slowly happening that Linux is taking over, not all at once.
>>> Here
>>> it is from the company themselves that are responsible for many
>>> games.
>>> It just recently happened for OSX. It's a smart move on their part
>>> and
>>> no more dual booting for people who use Windows for gaming.
>>>
>>> http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Steam_under_Linux
>>>
>>> --
>>> Christopher Lemire
>>> Ubuntu 64 bit Linux Raid Level 0
>>> --
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> SATLUG mailing list
>>> SATLUG@satlug.org
>>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/
>>> unsubscribe
>>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>>>
>> --
>> _______________________________________________
>> SATLUG mailing list
>> SATLUG@satlug.org
>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
From daniel at rugmonster.org Thu May 13 07:34:11 2010
From: daniel at rugmonster.org (Daniel Givens)
Date: Thu May 13 07:34:15 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] More evidence of Steam and Valve games coming to Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
On May 12, 2010, at 10:10 PM, Jonathan Hull wrote:
> Things are looking promising.
It's Official: Valve Releasing Steam, Source Engine For Linux!
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=valve_steam_announcement&num=1
I didn't send this link last night because I sent my last response from my iphone.
RMS will undoubtably say that without the source, this is not a big deal.
From masterr at gmail.com Thu May 13 13:29:21 2010
From: masterr at gmail.com (Jonathan Hull)
Date: Thu May 13 13:29:43 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] More evidence of Steam and Valve games coming to Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
Not quite official yet. Valve hasn't made an announcement. Phoronix is
saying that just based on all the collected evidence and the fact that
two other sites said it was official without any proof of an
announcement either. It does look promising but I wouldn't say
"official" yet until something is released or announced by Valve.
Regardless, I think it will happen soon.
-Jon
On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 7:34 AM, Daniel Givens wrote:
>
> On May 12, 2010, at 10:10 PM, Jonathan Hull wrote:
>
>> Things are looking promising.
>
>
> It's Official: Valve Releasing Steam, Source Engine For Linux!
>
> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=valve_steam_announcement&num=1
>
> I didn't send this link last night because I sent my last response from my iphone.
>
> RMS will undoubtably say that without the source, this is not a big deal.--
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From christopher.lemire at gmail.com Thu May 13 21:59:33 2010
From: christopher.lemire at gmail.com (Christopher Lemire)
Date: Thu May 13 21:59:55 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] More evidence of Steam and Valve games coming to Linux
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 10:25 PM, Justin wrote:
> Hopefully Steam on Linux will let you play all of your steam games on
> linux. That would be absolutely great. But unfortunately I think
> Steam-Linux will be something more like you'll only be able to play certain
> games on Linux.
>
> Either way, once it happens we'll have to do a linux-steam-lan party.
>
>
It's a great start that will lead the way to more and more games in the
future being released on the Linux as well.
Now how will this effect games that are being written with M$ proprietary
graphics library, directx? And if this results in games being written using
SDL or OpenGl instead, I imagine the development of those improve
increasingly and be under more development to better those graphics
libraries for games.
--
Christopher Lemire
Ubuntu 64 bit Linux Raid Level 0
From christopher.lemire at gmail.com Thu May 13 17:33:04 2010
From: christopher.lemire at gmail.com (Christopher Lemire)
Date: Fri May 14 11:43:29 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Strange interaction between mic/webcam and wifi + mouse
Message-ID:
Hello, I had a HD Hue webcam with built-in microphone given to me
during a Christmas long ago. In the beginning. I never had problems
with it. The microphone on it worked out of the box. I may have just
needed to set it as the default audio input. And for the camera, I got
the microdia driver source, compiled from git, stripped debugging
symbols, modprobed it, depmod -a and all that good stuff, and it
worked, and a future release of that driver vastly improved the
quality of the webcam image.
Now with current Ubuntu distros, I plug it in, and Linux goes haywire.
For many days, I was trying to understand why my wifi had seemed to
quit working on me in Ubuntu Linux. It turned out that if I left the
webcam with built-in microphone unplugged and booted, everything was
fine. Now, I can have everything working, plug it in, set the
microphone as the default audio input. Then the wireless immediately
goes out. Shortly after that, the LED on the mouse turns off, and I
can no longer use the mouse. So what I did was, I intentionally caused
this to happen again, and using keyboard shortcuts to navigate around
Gnome, I was able to get some output right after it happened, unplug
it, use system alt req keys to reboot and send this email. Here's the
output.
dmesg:
1.6.208.46 LEN=1492 TOS=0x00 PREC=0x00 TTL=64 ID=44201 DF PROTO=TCP
SPT=46365 DPT=44589 WINDOW=12564 RES=0x00 ACK URGP=0
[ 180.147852] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 9
[ 180.910023] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 10
[ 181.103185] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 181.111384] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input13
[ 181.111585] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.0009: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 186.343665] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 10
[ 187.140030] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 11
[ 187.343187] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 187.351620] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input14
[ 187.351736] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.000A: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 187.652692] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 11
[ 188.471335] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 12
[ 188.663182] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 188.672386] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input15
[ 188.673641] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.000B: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 199.305311] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 12
[ 200.050023] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 13
[ 200.110030] hub 2-0:1.0: unable to enumerate USB device on port 1
[ 200.800029] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 14
[ 200.993183] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 201.002396] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input16
[ 201.002603] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.000C: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 203.775919] usb 1-3: USB disconnect, address 9
[ 203.776078] gspca: disconnect complete
[ 205.550042] usb 1-3: new high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 17
[ 205.703381] usb 1-3: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 205.703593] gspca: probing 0c45:6282
[ 205.728767] sn9c20x: MT9M111 sensor detected
[ 205.728853] gspca: probe ok
[ 205.728928] gspca: probing 0c45:6282
[ 205.731520] 17:2:1: cannot get freq at ep 0x84
[ 205.777023] 17:2:1: cannot get freq at ep 0x84
[ 205.781776] 17:2:1: cannot get freq at ep 0x84
[ 224.921987] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 14
[ 225.681287] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 15
[ 225.873192] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 225.881409] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input17
[ 225.882222] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.000D: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 229.660066] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 15
[ 230.060045] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 16
[ 230.253191] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 230.261408] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input18
[ 230.261662] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.000E: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 235.930055] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 16
[ 236.320025] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 17
[ 236.513189] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 236.522296] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input19
[ 236.522412] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.000F: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 280.275281] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 17
[ 281.030079] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 18
[ 281.223200] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 281.231416] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input20
[ 281.231535] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.0010: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 281.925832] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 18
[ 282.690024] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 19
[ 282.883198] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 282.890438] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input21
[ 282.890642] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.0011: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 296.167758] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 19
[ 296.930020] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 20
[ 297.123201] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 297.130758] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input22
[ 297.131589] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.0012: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 297.799910] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 20
[ 298.590030] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 21
[ 298.783204] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 298.791421] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input23
[ 298.791538] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.0013: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 318.681777] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 21
[ 319.490028] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 22
[ 319.683204] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 319.691423] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input24
[ 319.692231] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.0014: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 344.580557] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 22
[ 345.340027] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 23
[ 345.533194] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 345.540505] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input25
[ 345.540716] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.0015: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 402.838921] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 23
[ 403.580034] usb 2-1: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 24
[ 403.773212] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 403.783426] input: Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse as
/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:13.0/usb2/2-1/2-1:1.0/input/input26
[ 403.784237] generic-usb 0003:046D:C00E.0016: input,hidraw0: USB HID
v1.10 Mouse [Logitech USB-PS/2 Optical Mouse] on
usb-0000:00:13.0-1/input0
[ 439.885812] usb 1-3: USB disconnect, address 17
[ 439.885977] gspca: disconnect complete
[ 442.160025] usb 1-3: new high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 28
[ 442.314327] usb 1-3: configuration #1 chosen from 1 choice
[ 442.314662] gspca: probing 0c45:6282
[ 442.340341] sn9c20x: MT9M111 sensor detected
[ 442.340424] gspca: probe ok
[ 442.340497] gspca: probing 0c45:6282
[ 442.342975] 28:2:1: cannot get freq at ep 0x84
[ 442.391599] 28:2:1: cannot get freq at ep 0x84
[ 442.396351] 28:2:1: cannot get freq at ep 0x84
[ 452.415059] 28:2:1: cannot get freq at ep 0x84
[ 452.418294] ehci_hcd 0000:00:13.5: force halt; handhake
ffffc9000034a024 00004000 00000000 -> -110
[ 452.418299] cannot submit datapipe for urb 1, error -108: device disabled
[ 453.116294] irq 19: nobody cared (try booting with the "irqpoll" option)
[ 453.116300] Pid: 0, comm: swapper Tainted: P
2.6.32-22-generic #33-Ubuntu
[ 453.116303] Call Trace:
[ 453.116305] [] __report_bad_irq+0x2b/0xa0
[ 453.116316] [] note_interrupt+0x18c/0x1d0
[ 453.116319] [] handle_fasteoi_irq+0xdd/0x100
[ 453.116323] [] handle_irq+0x22/0x30
[ 453.116327] [] do_IRQ+0x6c/0xf0
[ 453.116329] [] ret_from_intr+0x0/0x11
[ 453.116331] [] ? native_safe_halt+0xb/0x10
[ 453.116339] [] ? notifier_call_chain+0x16/0x80
[ 453.116343] [] ? default_idle+0x3d/0x90
[ 453.116347] [] ? c1e_idle+0x63/0x120
[ 453.116351] [] ? cpu_idle+0xb3/0x110
[ 453.116354] [] ? start_secondary+0xa8/0xaa
[ 453.116356] handlers:
[ 453.116357] [] (usb_hcd_irq+0x0/0x90)
[ 453.116363] Disabling IRQ #19
[ 455.011282] rtl8187: wireless radio switch turned off
[ 455.121275] wlan0: deauthenticating from 00:0a:06:ff:a7:23 by local
choice (reason=3)
[ 479.093495] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 24
[ 571.230017] timeout: still 1 active urbs..
[ 578.099070] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.099112] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.099152] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.099627] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.100111] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.100527] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.100561] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.100601] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.101071] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.101630] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.102207] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.102260] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.102356] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.102924] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.103510] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.104232] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.104287] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.104391] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.104928] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 578.105540] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.361202] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.361247] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.361290] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.361883] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.362442] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.362890] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.362926] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.362969] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.363464] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.363968] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.364504] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.364560] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.364660] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.365213] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.365773] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.366490] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.366545] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.366651] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.367219] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 688.367781] 28:2:1: usb_set_interface failed
[ 751.821223] atkbd.c: Unknown key pressed (translated set 2, code
0x88 on isa0060/serio0).
[ 751.821227] atkbd.c: Use 'setkeycodes e008 ' to make it known.
[ 751.931051] atkbd.c: Unknown key released (translated set 2, code
0x88 on isa0060/serio0).
[ 751.931055] atkbd.c: Use 'setkeycodes e008 ' to make it known.
ifconfig wlan0:
wlan0 Link encap:Ethernet HWaddr aa:bb:cc:dd:ee:ff
BROADCAST MULTICAST MTU:1500 Metric:1
RX packets:14572 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
TX packets:18455 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000
RX bytes:10007236 (10.0 MB) TX bytes:8438696 (8.4 MB)
ifconfig wlan0 up:
SIOCSIFFLAGS: Unknown error 132
lsmod:
Module Size Used by
snd_usb_audio 92747 0
snd_usb_lib 18978 1 snd_usb_audio
gspca_sn9c20x 25686 0
gspca_main 25031 1 gspca_sn9c20x
videodev 40486 1 gspca_main
v4l1_compat 15495 1 videodev
v4l2_compat_ioctl32 12020 1 videodev
binfmt_misc 7960 1
ipt_REJECT 2384 1
ipt_LOG 5370 5
xt_limit 2180 7
xt_tcpudp 2667 7
ipt_addrtype 2151 4
snd_hda_codec_realtek 278890 1
xt_state 1490 7
snd_hda_intel 25645 4
snd_hda_codec 85727 2 snd_hda_codec_realtek,snd_hda_intel
snd_hwdep 6924 2 snd_usb_audio,snd_hda_codec
snd_pcm_oss 41394 0
snd_mixer_oss 16299 1 snd_pcm_oss
snd_pcm 87850 5
snd_usb_audio,snd_hda_intel,snd_hda_codec,snd_pcm_oss
snd_seq_dummy 1782 0
snd_seq_oss 31219 0
snd_seq_midi 5829 0
snd_rawmidi 23388 2 snd_usb_lib,snd_seq_midi
snd_seq_midi_event 7267 2 snd_seq_oss,snd_seq_midi
ip6table_filter 2887 1
arc4 1473 2
snd_seq 57417 6
snd_seq_dummy,snd_seq_oss,snd_seq_midi,snd_seq_midi_event
ip6_tables 19618 1 ip6table_filter
snd_timer 23553 2 snd_pcm,snd_seq
snd_seq_device 6824 5
snd_seq_dummy,snd_seq_oss,snd_seq_midi,snd_rawmidi,snd_seq
nf_nat_irc 1577 0
nf_conntrack_irc 4429 1 nf_nat_irc
nf_nat_ftp 2513 0
hwmon_vid 3130 0
snd 70978 20
snd_usb_audio,snd_hda_codec_realtek,snd_hda_intel,snd_hda_codec,snd_hwdep,snd_pcm_oss,snd_mixer_oss,snd_pcm,snd_seq_oss,snd_rawmidi,snd_seq,snd_timer,snd_seq_device
rtl8187 53204 0
nf_nat 19501 2 nf_nat_irc,nf_nat_ftp
nf_conntrack_ipv4 12980 9 nf_nat
adt7473 18732 0
nf_defrag_ipv4 1481 1 nf_conntrack_ipv4
fbcon 39270 71
nvidia 10799466 40
nf_conntrack_ftp 7126 1 nf_nat_ftp
soundcore 8052 1 snd
mac80211 238128 1 rtl8187
lp 9336 0
led_class 3732 1 rtl8187
tileblit 2487 1 fbcon
font 8053 1 fbcon
bitblit 5811 1 fbcon
snd_page_alloc 8500 2 snd_hda_intel,snd_pcm
softcursor 1565 1 bitblit
i2c_piix4 9639 0
cfg80211 148386 2 rtl8187,mac80211
ppdev 6375 0
vga16fb 12757 1
nf_conntrack 73934 7
xt_state,nf_nat_irc,nf_conntrack_irc,nf_nat_ftp,nf_nat,nf_conntrack_ipv4,nf_conntrack_ftp
edac_core 45423 0
parport_pc 29958 1
vgastate 9857 1 vga16fb
eeprom_93cx6 1765 1 rtl8187
parport 37160 3 lp,ppdev,parport_pc
edac_mce_amd 9214 0
k8temp 3912 0
iptable_filter 2791 1
asus_atk0110 10033 0
ip_tables 18390 1 iptable_filter
x_tables 22429 8
ipt_REJECT,ipt_LOG,xt_limit,xt_tcpudp,ipt_addrtype,xt_state,ip6_tables,ip_tables
raid10 21290 0
raid456 54720 0
async_raid6_recov 5945 1 raid456
async_pq 3891 2 raid456,async_raid6_recov
raid6_pq 80147 2 async_raid6_recov,async_pq
async_xor 3111 3 raid456,async_raid6_recov,async_pq
xor 4685 1 async_xor
async_memcpy 1537 2 raid456,async_raid6_recov
async_tx 2545 5
raid456,async_raid6_recov,async_pq,async_xor,async_memcpy
raid1 22226 0
usbhid 40988 0
hid 83376 1 usbhid
raid0 6778 1
8139too 22245 0
multipath 7149 0
8139cp 19541 0
linear 4158 0
floppy 63156 0
pata_atiixp 4209 0
ahci 37646 14
r8169 39554 0
mii 5237 3 8139too,8139cp,r8169
lsusb:
Bus 006 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 005 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 004 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 003 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 001 Device 028: ID 0c45:6282 Microdia PC Camera with Microphone
(SN9C202 + MI1310)
Bus 001 Device 003: ID 0bda:8187 Realtek Semiconductor Corp. RTL8187
Wireless Adapter
Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
--
Christopher Lemire
Ubuntu 64 bit Linux Raid Level 0
From satlug at sbcglobal.net Fri May 14 21:04:45 2010
From: satlug at sbcglobal.net (Don Wright)
Date: Fri May 14 21:04:52 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] May Meeting Recap
Message-ID: <00rru593rp795025du0i9qfhrk4rkcs7eo@4ax.com>
Thanks again to Thomas Cameron of RedHat for last night's presentation
of "SELinux for Mere Mortals." The slide show from that presentation can
be found at http://people.redhat.com/tcameron/ - along with a few other
goodies.
You can learn more about the Security-Enhanced Linux kernel modules (and
you really should) with your friendly neighborhood search engine. Ignore
anything before Red Hat Enterprise Linux (RHEL) 5 or Fedora 11; things
are much better now! The preview of RHEL 6 we saw looked really easy to
manage. All the SELinux kernel and utility code is open under GPL, so it
can be found in any distro that cares enough to package it.
And just a reminder, next Saturday, May 22, is the PC Show and Sale at
Live Oak Civic Center. SATLUG will be there discussing Linux, and at
least some of us plan to save money on a few system upgrades with the
many vendors who will also be there. See www.PCShows.com for the
discount admission coupon.
See you at the show! --Don
--
Some people call 9-1-1
Some people are 9-1-1
Some people are the reason for 9-1-1
From tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org Sat May 15 11:26:53 2010
From: tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org (Tweeks)
Date: Sat May 15 11:27:12 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on the CPS
Energy Saver Thermostat?
Message-ID: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Hey..
I saw a couple of old threads on the CPS offered free digital thermostat. It
looks like it is remote controllable by CPS via two way pager control w/web
integration (on their side).. Not a huge fan of this.. would have preferred a
home broadband connection that I could control.. but whatever.
Does anyone have any info on how controllable these things are? It's designed
to allow CPS to help regulate peak load distribution so that they can do some
sort of time division smoothing of everyone's AC loads. Interesting idea..
but I would like to maintain override control if need be. Any protocol or
wired-hack info also of interest, integration with any linux home automation
systems (like Zoneminder, MisterHouse, etc). I think it's this model:
TH8000
http://www.yourhome.honeywell.com/Home/Products/Thermostats/7-Day-Programmable/VisionPRO+8000.htm
NEway.. lemme know if anyone has really dug into one of these before.
Tweeks
From tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org Sat May 15 11:31:16 2010
From: tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org (Tweeks)
Date: Sat May 15 11:31:23 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on the
CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Message-ID: <201005151131.16355.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Follow up thread I found on this the topic of security and hacker implications
of centrally controlled mass AC controls:
http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/01/hacking_thermos.html
Tweeks
On Saturday 15 May 2010 11:26:53 am Tweeks wrote:
> Hey..
>
> I saw a couple of old threads on the CPS offered free digital thermostat.
> It looks like it is remote controllable by CPS via two way pager control
> w/web integration (on their side).. Not a huge fan of this.. would have
> preferred a home broadband connection that I could control.. but whatever.
>
> Does anyone have any info on how controllable these things are? It's
> designed to allow CPS to help regulate peak load distribution so that they
> can do some sort of time division smoothing of everyone's AC loads.
> Interesting idea.. but I would like to maintain override control if need
> be. Any protocol or wired-hack info also of interest, integration with any
> linux home automation systems (like Zoneminder, MisterHouse, etc). I think
> it's this model:
>
> TH8000
> http://www.yourhome.honeywell.com/Home/Products/Thermostats/7-Day-Programma
>ble/VisionPRO+8000.htm
>
>
> NEway.. lemme know if anyone has really dug into one of these before.
>
> Tweeks
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Sat May 15 17:02:47 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Sat May 15 17:02:43 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <201005151131.16355.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<201005151131.16355.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Message-ID: <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
In general, centralizing technologies are a bad idea as it creates an
opportunity for controlling bodies to eventually "legislate" away the
individual's ability to decide for oneself. Besides, what "genius"
decided that CPS needs to control our thermostats? Isn't it *our*
responsibility to decide for ourselves how hot or cold our homes are?
Or, how well insulated and energy efficient our homes are? All economic
behavior on our parts is dependent upon our personal resources. We,
typically, don't let anyone else control our economic behavior. If, and
when, we do allow it, it's usually under coercion and force.
This is a bad idea that I suspect will be fraught with security issues.
And, there *will* be security issues once you put the power to control
your AC in the hands of centralized bureaucrats. Remember, we're
dealing with people who attempted to commit fraud over the nuclear power
debacle (in collusion with many political actors, it takes more than
"two employees" to try to pull that off).
Now, if they were to provide the technology (linux-enabled with entirely
open-source applications that utilize a highly encrypted link over ssh
2.0) that the user, alone, controls. Then, I'd probably have no problem.
pcdls
Tweeks wrote:
> Follow up thread I found on this the topic of security and hacker implications
> of centrally controlled mass AC controls:
> http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/01/hacking_thermos.html
>
> Tweeks
>
> On Saturday 15 May 2010 11:26:53 am Tweeks wrote:
>
>> Hey..
>>
>> I saw a couple of old threads on the CPS offered free digital thermostat.
>> It looks like it is remote controllable by CPS via two way pager control
>> w/web integration (on their side).. Not a huge fan of this.. would have
>> preferred a home broadband connection that I could control.. but whatever.
>>
>> Does anyone have any info on how controllable these things are? It's
>> designed to allow CPS to help regulate peak load distribution so that they
>> can do some sort of time division smoothing of everyone's AC loads.
>> Interesting idea.. but I would like to maintain override control if need
>> be. Any protocol or wired-hack info also of interest, integration with any
>> linux home automation systems (like Zoneminder, MisterHouse, etc). I think
>> it's this model:
>>
>> TH8000
>> http://www.yourhome.honeywell.com/Home/Products/Thermostats/7-Day-Programma
>> ble/VisionPRO+8000.htm
>>
>>
>> NEway.. lemme know if anyone has really dug into one of these before.
>>
>> Tweeks
>>
>
>
>
From e2eiod at gmail.com Sat May 15 18:03:54 2010
From: e2eiod at gmail.com (Robert Pearson)
Date: Sat May 15 18:03:56 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on the
CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Message-ID:
On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 11:26 AM, Tweeks wrote:
> Hey..
>
> I saw a couple of old threads on the CPS offered free digital thermostat. ?It
> looks like it is remote controllable by CPS via two way pager control w/web
> integration (on their side).. Not a huge fan of this.. would have preferred a
> home broadband connection that I could control.. but whatever.
>
> Does anyone have any info on how controllable these things are? ?It's designed
> to allow CPS to help regulate peak load distribution so that they can do some
> sort of time division smoothing of everyone's AC loads. ?Interesting idea..
> but I would like to maintain override control if need be. Any protocol or
> wired-hack info also of interest, integration with any linux home automation
> systems (like Zoneminder, MisterHouse, etc). ?I think it's this model:
>
> TH8000
> http://www.yourhome.honeywell.com/Home/Products/Thermostats/7-Day-Programmable/VisionPRO+8000.htm
>
>
> NEway.. lemme know if anyone has really dug into one of these before.
>
> Tweeks
> --
Tweeks,
Are you working on some kind of a "green" home computing environment?
In one of your previous emails you mentioned this---
"On my system.. I like to underclock the CPU and remove all fans from the
system.. making for an extremely reliable setup (no moving parts but for the
CD-ROM.. and even that could be made into a bootable flash device).
Let me know if you have any questions or anything.."
I do not have a clue how to underclock (or overclock) and how it
relates to performance and wattage reduction.
My question is, "Have you looked at EFI/UEFI CULV desktop motherboards
as a "green" solution?"
If so, "How do they look?".
Laptops and netbooks are looking like TDP's of 10W or less.
Your solution is a lot less expensive but how low a wattage does
underclocking get you?
Taking the fans off means it has to be pretty good. Assuming your
"free air" circulation is good.
Is your ultimate goal to reduce electric consumption primarily in your
computer gear or the "big picture" reduction in A/C cost?
On really hot days I am now forced to turn off all my desktops to
reduce A/C use and use my laptop in suspend/hibernate.
A/C savings approach 30% on hot summer days.
I have not been able to get suspend/hibernate working for the desktops.
Anybody doing this have any desktop suggestions?
Electricity is not going to get cheaper anytime soon.
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Sat May 15 18:38:23 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Sat May 15 18:38:28 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on the
In-Reply-To:
Message-ID: <201005152338.o4FNcNn7025799@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
> I do not have a clue how to underclock (or overclock) and how it
> relates to performance and wattage reduction.
> My question is, "Have you looked at EFI/UEFI CULV desktop motherboards
> as a "green" solution?"
> If so, "How do they look?".
> Laptops and netbooks are looking like TDP's of 10W or less.
> Your solution is a lot less expensive but how low a wattage does
> underclocking get you?
> Taking the fans off means it has to be pretty good. Assuming your
> "free air" circulation is good.
> Is your ultimate goal to reduce electric consumption primarily in your
> computer gear or the "big picture" reduction in A/C cost?
I am using one of these Acer netbooks (~ 8W) as a VOIP box and
to drive my TV. Because of the phone it is always on, like my
router, so I wanted low consumption. There may be lower consumption
devices than that available, but 8W is low enough for me.
> On really hot days I am now forced to turn off all my desktops to
> reduce A/C use and use my laptop in suspend/hibernate.
> A/C savings approach 30% on hot summer days.
> I have not been able to get suspend/hibernate working for the desktops.
> Anybody doing this have any desktop suggestions?
> Electricity is not going to get cheaper anytime soon.
Install solar panels. I did. Since hooking it up in January, I have
produced over half a megawatt more power than I am using, and feed it back
into the CPS grid for a refund check, or later use during peak usage. I
can monitor power production in realtime through my home network and
post it to the outside (check it out: http://71.40.230.200:5999/).
Besides the obvious advantages of reducing your carbon footprint and
getting free electricity, there are other benefits:
* solar panels shade your roof and reduce your energy needs for AC cooling.
* CPS gives you a rebate of $3/W installed, which is roughly 50% of your cost,
which is pretty amazing. I'd recommend to get it while this rebate is still available.
My installer took the rebate straight off the cost of the system, so I had no
out of pocket on that portion.
* The federal government gives you ANOTHER 30% tax credit on the remaining cost.
* The day you install it you are already ahead, because if you sold your house
the value of your house is increased by the cost of the system.
* The city cannot tax you on the increased value of your house, it is exempt from
assessments.
* There is no captial gains on the portion of your house that is the cost of your
solar system when you sell your house.
* San Antonio is one of the best places to get solar power due to the high amount of
sun intensity (we are very far south).
* The system even produces enough power on rainy/cloudy days to meet my needs
* it is a lot of fun to watch your meter spin backwards, and getting zero $ power bills!
* and as you say, increasing electricity rates help me recover my investment quicker,
right now I figure about 5-6 years to be completely even.
-b.
From stosss at gmail.com Sat May 15 19:08:50 2010
From: stosss at gmail.com (stosss)
Date: Sat May 15 19:08:52 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<201005151131.16355.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 6:02 PM, pcdls.ronin wrote:
> In general, centralizing technologies are a bad idea as it creates an
> opportunity for controlling bodies to eventually "legislate" away the
> individual's ability to decide for oneself. ?Besides, what "genius"
> decided that CPS needs to control our thermostats? ?Isn't it *our*
> responsibility to decide for ourselves how hot or cold our homes are?
> Or, how well insulated and energy efficient our homes are? ?All economic
> behavior on our parts is dependent upon our personal resources. ?We,
> typically, don't let anyone else control our economic behavior. ?If, and
> when, we do allow it, it's usually under coercion and force.
>
> This is a bad idea that I suspect will be fraught with security issues.
> And, there *will* be security issues once you put the power to control
> your AC in the hands of centralized bureaucrats. ?Remember, we're
> dealing with people who attempted to commit fraud over the nuclear power
> debacle (in collusion with many political actors, it takes more than
> "two employees" to try to pull that off).
>
> Now, if they were to provide the technology (linux-enabled with entirely
> open-source applications that utilize a highly encrypted link over ssh
> 2.0) that the user, alone, controls. ?Then, I'd probably have no problem.
>
http://www.americandreampreservation.com/
> pcdls
>
>
> Tweeks wrote:
>> Follow up thread I found on this the topic of security and hacker implications
>> of centrally controlled mass AC controls:
>> ? ? ? http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/01/hacking_thermos.html
>>
>> Tweeks
>>
>> On Saturday 15 May 2010 11:26:53 am Tweeks wrote:
>>
>>> Hey..
>>>
>>> I saw a couple of old threads on the CPS offered free digital thermostat.
>>> It looks like it is remote controllable by CPS via two way pager control
>>> w/web integration (on their side).. Not a huge fan of this.. would have
>>> preferred a home broadband connection that I could control.. but whatever.
>>>
>>> Does anyone have any info on how controllable these things are? ?It's
>>> designed to allow CPS to help regulate peak load distribution so that they
>>> can do some sort of time division smoothing of everyone's AC loads.
>>> Interesting idea.. but I would like to maintain override control if need
>>> be. Any protocol or wired-hack info also of interest, integration with any
>>> linux home automation systems (like Zoneminder, MisterHouse, etc). ?I think
>>> it's this model:
>>>
>>> TH8000
>>> http://www.yourhome.honeywell.com/Home/Products/Thermostats/7-Day-Programma
>>> ble/VisionPRO+8000.htm
>>>
>>>
>>> NEway.. lemme know if anyone has really dug into one of these before.
>>>
>>> Tweeks
>>>
--
"If we can but prevent the government from wasting the labours of the
people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become
happy." - Thomas Jefferson
From pixelnate at gmail.com Sat May 15 19:07:51 2010
From: pixelnate at gmail.com (Nate Turnage)
Date: Sat May 15 19:09:47 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4bef37c5.0c7c8d0a.0d72.ffffec88@mx.google.com>
On May 15, 2010 5:03 PM, pcdls.ronin <pcdls.ronin@gmail.com> wrote:
In general, centralizing technologies are a bad idea as it creates an
opportunity for controlling bodies to eventually "legislate" away the
individual's ability to decide for oneself. Besides, what "genius"
decided that CPS needs to control our thermostats? Isn't it *our*
responsibility to decide for ourselves how hot or cold our homes are?
Or, how well insulated and energy efficient our homes are? All economic
behavior on our parts is dependent upon our personal resources. We,
typically, don't let anyone else control our economic behavior. If, and
when, we do allow it, it's usually under coercion and force.
This is a bad idea that I suspect will be fraught with security issues.
And, there *will* be security issues once you put the power to control
your AC in the hands of centralized bureaucrats. Remember, we're
dealing with people who attempted to commit fraud over the nuclear power
debacle (in collusion with many political actors, it takes more than
"two employees" to try to pull that off).
Now, if they were to provide the technology (linux-enabled with entirely
open-source applications that utilize a highly encrypted link over ssh
2.0) that the user, alone, controls. Then, I'd probably have no problem.
pcdls
+1
~Nate
From e2eiod at gmail.com Sun May 16 01:34:23 2010
From: e2eiod at gmail.com (Robert Pearson)
Date: Sun May 16 01:34:27 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on the
In-Reply-To: <201005152338.o4FNcNn7025799@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References:
<201005152338.o4FNcNn7025799@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID:
On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 6:38 PM, Borries Demeler
wrote:
>> I do not have a clue how to underclock (or overclock) and how it
>> relates to performance and wattage reduction.
>> My question is, "Have you looked at EFI/UEFI CULV desktop motherboards
>> as a "green" solution?"
>> If so, "How do they look?".
>> Laptops and netbooks are looking like TDP's of 10W or less.
>> Your solution is a lot less expensive but how low a wattage does
>> underclocking get you?
>> Taking the fans off means it has to be pretty good. Assuming your
>> "free air" circulation is good.
>> Is your ultimate goal to reduce electric consumption primarily in your
>> computer gear or the "big picture" reduction in A/C cost?
>
> I am using one of these Acer netbooks (~ 8W) as a VOIP box and
> to drive my TV. Because of the phone it is always on, like my
> router, so I wanted low consumption. There may be lower consumption
> devices than that available, but 8W is low enough for me.
>
>> On really hot days I am now forced to turn off all my desktops to
>> reduce A/C use and use my laptop in suspend/hibernate.
>> A/C savings approach 30% on hot summer days.
>> I have not been able to get suspend/hibernate working for the desktops.
>> Anybody doing this have any desktop suggestions?
>> Electricity is not going to get cheaper anytime soon.
>
> Install solar panels. I did. Since hooking it up in January, I have
> produced over half a megawatt more power than I am using, and feed it back
> into the CPS grid for a refund check, or later use during peak usage. I
> can monitor power production in realtime through my home network and
> post it to the outside (check it out: http://71.40.230.200:5999/).
> Besides the obvious advantages of reducing your carbon footprint and
> getting free electricity, there are other benefits:
>
> * solar panels shade your roof and reduce your energy needs for AC cooling.
> * CPS gives you a rebate of $3/W installed, which is roughly 50% of your cost,
> which is pretty amazing. I'd recommend to get it while this rebate is still available.
> My installer took the rebate straight off the cost of the system, so I had no
> out of pocket on that portion.
> * The federal government gives you ANOTHER 30% tax credit on the remaining cost.
> * The day you install it you are already ahead, because if you sold your house
> the value of your house is increased by the cost of the system.
> * The city cannot tax you on the increased value of your house, it is exempt from
> assessments.
> * There is no captial gains on the portion of your house that is the cost of your
> solar system when you sell your house.
> * San Antonio is one of the best places to get solar power due to the high amount of
> sun intensity (we are very far south).
> * The system even produces enough power on rainy/cloudy days to meet my needs
> * it is a lot of fun to watch your meter spin backwards, and getting zero $ power bills!
> * and as you say, increasing electricity rates help me recover my investment quicker,
> right now I figure about 5-6 years to be completely even.
>
> -b.
> --
Thanks, Borries. This is really good information. Exactly what I would
like to do.
With regard to your Acer netbook use, I read the following and it
peaked my interest in low TDP computers---
"recently setup a virtual network using VirtualBox OSE on an Ubuntu
Lucid (10.04) host. The guests were all running Ubuntu Server (10.04)
with 64 MB RAM and 2GB virtual disk space. That was enough to try out
running several services (DHCP, DNS, NAT, ssh, etc.) to a network of
machines.
Just an option if someone wants to explore networking and doesn't have
enough physical hardware to experiment."
[More Info]
"This was a new install of Ubuntu Netbook Remix Lucid 10.04 on a
netbook: Asus EeePC 1005HAB. Have been running Lucid for a little
over a month now."
[My Question Is]
Would VirtualBox OSE allow you to run more than VoIP and your TV on
the Acer if you wanted to?
For what I do a netbook would cover more than 80%.
How would all the VirtualBox OSE instances work with suspend/hibernate?
Probably silly to use suspend/hibernate with TDP of 8W or less.
The possibilities look interesting...
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Sun May 16 05:55:40 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Sun May 16 05:56:05 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on the
In-Reply-To:
Message-ID: <201005161055.o4GAtefc007841@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
> [My Question Is]
> Would VirtualBox OSE allow you to run more than VoIP and your TV on
> the Acer if you wanted to?
> For what I do a netbook would cover more than 80%.
> How would all the VirtualBox OSE instances work with suspend/hibernate?
> Probably silly to use suspend/hibernate with TDP of 8W or less.
> The possibilities look interesting...
A couple of points:
Since I have not run VirtualBox OSE on this netbook I cannot comment on
the ability to run that on the netbook, but the network services certainly
would not be an issue. Since my VOIP application is incompatible with
Linux, I am forced to run Windows, and of course, suspend/hibernate is
not an issue there. I know there are linux distros out there that have
successfully implemented suspend/hibernate.
I have considered running my VOIP under vmware, but the netbook was not
powerful enough (the processor was too slow). There is enough memory on
it but the low speed just makes it too unreliable.
Also the graphics on this (Intel Mobil 945) are really slow, watching
full-screen internet-based movies on it is not really satisfactory
since flash is a CPU hog and it tends to get choppy. DVD, avi, mp4,
wmv, mpg format work fine. My netbook has a 1.6 GHZ Atom N270.
-b.
From henry.pugsley at gmail.com Sun May 16 15:09:54 2010
From: henry.pugsley at gmail.com (Henry Pugsley)
Date: Sun May 16 15:09:57 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<201005151131.16355.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
I think you're missing the point .. it's not about who is deciding how
hot or cold your house is. From what I've read about this, CPS will
cycle your A/C during peak load times to smooth the load cycles. I've
seen this happen both in Florida and Texas: the first hot day of
summer causes brownouts and blackouts because everyone sets their
thermostat for 72 degrees and they all kick on at the same time.
Great, now you have no A/C at all and it's 100F outside.
The deal doesn't sound all that bad:
1) You get a free programmable thermostat (this alone saves you money)
2) The cycling only happens during peak times (3pm-7pm) of peak months.
3) Cycling doesn't happen more often, it just happens at better times.
4) You can remove yourself from the project temporarily or permanently.
What I get from #3 is they want to setup a sequence across the grid so
that as one house cycles on, another one cycles off .. to keep all the
houses from cycling on at the same time and causing brownouts. You
control the temperature, they control when the A/C runs to maintain
that temperature.
The bigger issue here is that the power grid is overloaded and it's
getting worse as people put more power hungry electronics in their
homes (honestly, who needs 6 computers, 3 gaming systems, and 2 plasma
TVs? ;)). I suppose the alternative to centralized power cycling
would be to increase electric rates to the point that no one can
afford to run their A/C. Or maybe do tiered billing like the cell
phone companies and charge 2x more for power during peak times than
off-peak times.
I guess from the security perspective, the only big risk is that
someone could access the system and force everyone's A/C to cycle on
at the same time, thus causing a brownout or blackout. Of course that
can happen now, it's just not as likely. It's a voluntary program of
course, but in the end it could help avoid situations like I described
above.
-Henry
On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 5:02 PM, pcdls.ronin wrote:
> In general, centralizing technologies are a bad idea as it creates an
> opportunity for controlling bodies to eventually "legislate" away the
> individual's ability to decide for oneself. ?Besides, what "genius"
> decided that CPS needs to control our thermostats? ?Isn't it *our*
> responsibility to decide for ourselves how hot or cold our homes are?
> Or, how well insulated and energy efficient our homes are? ?All economic
> behavior on our parts is dependent upon our personal resources. ?We,
> typically, don't let anyone else control our economic behavior. ?If, and
> when, we do allow it, it's usually under coercion and force.
>
> This is a bad idea that I suspect will be fraught with security issues.
> And, there *will* be security issues once you put the power to control
> your AC in the hands of centralized bureaucrats. ?Remember, we're
> dealing with people who attempted to commit fraud over the nuclear power
> debacle (in collusion with many political actors, it takes more than
> "two employees" to try to pull that off).
>
> Now, if they were to provide the technology (linux-enabled with entirely
> open-source applications that utilize a highly encrypted link over ssh
> 2.0) that the user, alone, controls. ?Then, I'd probably have no problem.
>
> pcdls
>
>
> Tweeks wrote:
>> Follow up thread I found on this the topic of security and hacker implications
>> of centrally controlled mass AC controls:
>> ? ? ? http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/01/hacking_thermos.html
>>
>> Tweeks
>>
>> On Saturday 15 May 2010 11:26:53 am Tweeks wrote:
>>
>>> Hey..
>>>
>>> I saw a couple of old threads on the CPS offered free digital thermostat.
>>> It looks like it is remote controllable by CPS via two way pager control
>>> w/web integration (on their side).. Not a huge fan of this.. would have
>>> preferred a home broadband connection that I could control.. but whatever.
>>>
>>> Does anyone have any info on how controllable these things are? ?It's
>>> designed to allow CPS to help regulate peak load distribution so that they
>>> can do some sort of time division smoothing of everyone's AC loads.
>>> Interesting idea.. but I would like to maintain override control if need
>>> be. Any protocol or wired-hack info also of interest, integration with any
>>> linux home automation systems (like Zoneminder, MisterHouse, etc). ?I think
>>> it's this model:
>>>
>>> TH8000
>>> http://www.yourhome.honeywell.com/Home/Products/Thermostats/7-Day-Programma
>>> ble/VisionPRO+8000.htm
>>>
>>>
>>> NEway.. lemme know if anyone has really dug into one of these before.
>>>
>>> Tweeks
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
--
"The best way to predict the future is to invent it" - Alan Kay
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Sun May 16 16:26:10 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Sun May 16 16:26:12 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
In-Reply-To:
Message-ID: <201005162126.o4GLQA2X009130@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
>
> I think you're missing the point .. it's not about who is deciding how
> hot or cold your house is. From what I've read about this, CPS will
> cycle your A/C during peak load times to smooth the load cycles. I've
> seen this happen both in Florida and Texas: the first hot day of
> summer causes brownouts and blackouts because everyone sets their
> thermostat for 72 degrees and they all kick on at the same time.
> Great, now you have no A/C at all and it's 100F outside.
>
> The deal doesn't sound all that bad:
> 1) You get a free programmable thermostat (this alone saves you money)
> 2) The cycling only happens during peak times (3pm-7pm) of peak months.
> 3) Cycling doesn't happen more often, it just happens at better times.
> 4) You can remove yourself from the project temporarily or permanently.
>
> What I get from #3 is they want to setup a sequence across the grid so
> that as one house cycles on, another one cycles off .. to keep all the
> houses from cycling on at the same time and causing brownouts. You
> control the temperature, they control when the A/C runs to maintain
> that temperature.
>
> The bigger issue here is that the power grid is overloaded and it's
> getting worse as people put more power hungry electronics in their
> homes (honestly, who needs 6 computers, 3 gaming systems, and 2 plasma
> TVs? ;)). I suppose the alternative to centralized power cycling
> would be to increase electric rates to the point that no one can
> afford to run their A/C. Or maybe do tiered billing like the cell
> phone companies and charge 2x more for power during peak times than
> off-peak times.
>
> I guess from the security perspective, the only big risk is that
> someone could access the system and force everyone's A/C to cycle on
> at the same time, thus causing a brownout or blackout. Of course that
> can happen now, it's just not as likely. It's a voluntary program of
> course, but in the end it could help avoid situations like I described
> above.
>
> -Henry
I have been signed up for this program for several years now and
besides a plastic component on the digital thermostat breaking off
I have not noticed any ill effects of this program. I cannot tell
when it kicks in during peak hours, this program is definitely low
if not no impact.
-b.
From fhuddles at gmail.com Mon May 17 00:14:19 2010
From: fhuddles at gmail.com (Frank Huddleston)
Date: Mon May 17 00:14:20 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <20100516063438.A99E3A0A954@satlug.org>
References: <20100516063438.A99E3A0A954@satlug.org>
Message-ID: <4BF0D0AB.2090107@gmail.com>
On 5/16/10 1:34 AM, satlug-request@satlug.org wrote:
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 15 May 2010 18:03:54 -0500
> From: Robert Pearson
> Subject: Re: [SATLUG] Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info
> on the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
> To: "The San Antonio Linux User's Group Mailing List"
>
>
> On really hot days I am now forced to turn off all my desktops to
> reduce A/C use and use my laptop in suspend/hibernate.
> A/C savings approach 30% on hot summer days.
> I have not been able to get suspend/hibernate working for the desktops.
> Anybody doing this have any desktop suggestions?
> Electricity is not going to get cheaper anytime soon.
>
>
On my Ubuntu desktop I use the "pm-hibernate" command, and it works. On
the other hand, "pm-suspend" does nothing. I think it previous versions of
Ubuntu it did, but it still didn't work well. It probably needs some
tweaking, which I haven't done. I just use pm-hibernate.
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Mon May 17 03:06:05 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Mon May 17 03:06:00 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To:
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <201005151131.16355.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BF0F8ED.9010009@gmail.com>
I'm well aware of it's intended operation and use. Historically, things
like this (coming from a central authority) always start out voluntary,
then, they find out some way of coming at you sideways. I believe we
can all cooperate to achieve great things but it must remain voluntary
and decentralized. Linux is a perfect example of this.
In reference to the OP's question, if you have a 24 Volt Thermostat, a
24VAC thermostat can be overridden if you have access to the control
signals of the split-system AC. Signal identifiers may differ with make
and model of your split-system but their general control functions are
typically the same. These signals are what the thermostat uses to
actuate the relays that control your air handler and condenser
assemblies. If you cannot override the electronics of this thermostat
directly, you could access the control signals and gang a second
thermostat that you control along with the thermostat that you wanted to
hack, this would require some application of relay logic to facilitate
and will look kludge-y as hell. I wouldn't recommend this unless you
have intimate knowledge of how your split-system AC works. Plus,
touching 24VAC can still hurt quite a bit.
The typical split-system AC, mine in this case, consists of a
air-handler/evaporator coil assembly on the inside of the home and a
condenser assembly on the outside of the home. Normal cycling occurs
when a temperature threshold is reached on the thermostat (a bi-metal
relay variety or a digitally monitored and controlled variety), and a
signal to the exterior assembly's control board triggers the condenser
to cycle on by closing 120VAC relay to the compressor. If the air
handler's blower is not permanently configured in the 'on' position,
then this signal will also trigger the blower to turn on as well via a
timer relay that introduces some turn-on and turn-off delay to the power
cycling of the air handler's blower assembly. As the condenser's
compressor operates, refrigerant is compressed from the low-pressure
line of the system to the high-pressure line of the system. In the high
pressure line, condenser coils cool the compressed refrigerant
liquid/gas. The high pressure line connects up to the evaporator coil
via a thermostatic expansion valve (think of it as a fancy atomizer
nozzle but with extra mechanical controls) that will atomize the
'cooled' high pressure refrigerant liquid/gas to an even cooler low
pressure gas (work and heat in thermodynamic processes). The liquid to
gas conversion causes the evaporator coils to cool down significantly,
allowing the air passing through the evaporator coils to cool and
thereby cool down the home as the air handler's blower distributes the
air to the vents.
I've always wanted to incorporate a secured, web-enabled control board
that could monitor the entire AC system: high line and low line
pressures, coil temperatures, refrigerant flow, thermostatic expansion
valve displacement, blower speeds, relay actuations. Now that would be
awesome.
pcdls
Henry Pugsley wrote:
> I think you're missing the point .. it's not about who is deciding how
> hot or cold your house is. From what I've read about this, CPS will
> cycle your A/C during peak load times to smooth the load cycles. I've
> seen this happen both in Florida and Texas: the first hot day of
> summer causes brownouts and blackouts because everyone sets their
> thermostat for 72 degrees and they all kick on at the same time.
> Great, now you have no A/C at all and it's 100F outside.
>
> The deal doesn't sound all that bad:
> 1) You get a free programmable thermostat (this alone saves you money)
> 2) The cycling only happens during peak times (3pm-7pm) of peak months.
> 3) Cycling doesn't happen more often, it just happens at better times.
> 4) You can remove yourself from the project temporarily or permanently.
>
> What I get from #3 is they want to setup a sequence across the grid so
> that as one house cycles on, another one cycles off .. to keep all the
> houses from cycling on at the same time and causing brownouts. You
> control the temperature, they control when the A/C runs to maintain
> that temperature.
>
> The bigger issue here is that the power grid is overloaded and it's
> getting worse as people put more power hungry electronics in their
> homes (honestly, who needs 6 computers, 3 gaming systems, and 2 plasma
> TVs? ;)). I suppose the alternative to centralized power cycling
> would be to increase electric rates to the point that no one can
> afford to run their A/C. Or maybe do tiered billing like the cell
> phone companies and charge 2x more for power during peak times than
> off-peak times.
>
> I guess from the security perspective, the only big risk is that
> someone could access the system and force everyone's A/C to cycle on
> at the same time, thus causing a brownout or blackout. Of course that
> can happen now, it's just not as likely. It's a voluntary program of
> course, but in the end it could help avoid situations like I described
> above.
>
> -Henry
>
> On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 5:02 PM, pcdls.ronin wrote:
>
>> In general, centralizing technologies are a bad idea as it creates an
>> opportunity for controlling bodies to eventually "legislate" away the
>> individual's ability to decide for oneself. Besides, what "genius"
>> decided that CPS needs to control our thermostats? Isn't it *our*
>> responsibility to decide for ourselves how hot or cold our homes are?
>> Or, how well insulated and energy efficient our homes are? All economic
>> behavior on our parts is dependent upon our personal resources. We,
>> typically, don't let anyone else control our economic behavior. If, and
>> when, we do allow it, it's usually under coercion and force.
>>
>> This is a bad idea that I suspect will be fraught with security issues.
>> And, there *will* be security issues once you put the power to control
>> your AC in the hands of centralized bureaucrats. Remember, we're
>> dealing with people who attempted to commit fraud over the nuclear power
>> debacle (in collusion with many political actors, it takes more than
>> "two employees" to try to pull that off).
>>
>> Now, if they were to provide the technology (linux-enabled with entirely
>> open-source applications that utilize a highly encrypted link over ssh
>> 2.0) that the user, alone, controls. Then, I'd probably have no problem.
>>
>> pcdls
>>
>>
>> Tweeks wrote:
>>
>>> Follow up thread I found on this the topic of security and hacker implications
>>> of centrally controlled mass AC controls:
>>> http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/01/hacking_thermos.html
>>>
>>> Tweeks
>>>
>>> On Saturday 15 May 2010 11:26:53 am Tweeks wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hey..
>>>>
>>>> I saw a couple of old threads on the CPS offered free digital thermostat.
>>>> It looks like it is remote controllable by CPS via two way pager control
>>>> w/web integration (on their side).. Not a huge fan of this.. would have
>>>> preferred a home broadband connection that I could control.. but whatever.
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone have any info on how controllable these things are? It's
>>>> designed to allow CPS to help regulate peak load distribution so that they
>>>> can do some sort of time division smoothing of everyone's AC loads.
>>>> Interesting idea.. but I would like to maintain override control if need
>>>> be. Any protocol or wired-hack info also of interest, integration with any
>>>> linux home automation systems (like Zoneminder, MisterHouse, etc). I think
>>>> it's this model:
>>>>
>>>> TH8000
>>>> http://www.yourhome.honeywell.com/Home/Products/Thermostats/7-Day-Programma
>>>> ble/VisionPRO+8000.htm
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> NEway.. lemme know if anyone has really dug into one of these before.
>>>>
>>>> Tweeks
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>> --
>> _______________________________________________
>> SATLUG mailing list
>> SATLUG@satlug.org
>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
From chrishudson at gmail.com Mon May 17 13:19:54 2010
From: chrishudson at gmail.com (Chris Hudson)
Date: Mon May 17 13:20:01 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
Message-ID:
>
> The bigger issue here is that the power grid is overloaded and it's
> getting worse as people put more power hungry electronics in their
> homes (honestly, who needs 6 computers, 3 gaming systems, and 2 plasma
> TVs? ;)).
I was about to say "Yeah!!!" but then I realized I'm one of those people.
:-)
-- Chris
From jeremymann at gmail.com Mon May 17 14:41:25 2010
From: jeremymann at gmail.com (Jeremy Mann)
Date: Mon May 17 14:41:31 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] What am I doing wrong to connect to an Active Directory?
Message-ID:
I've got a Samba server I need to connect to the campus AD. I set up
Kerberos first, /etc/krb5.conf contains:
[libdefaults]
dns_lookup_realm = false
default_realm = UTHSCSA.EDU
[realms]
UTHSCSA.EDU = {
kdc = ***.***.uthscsa.edu
default_domain = uthscsa.edu
}
[domain_realms]
.kerberos.server = UTHSCSA.EDU
My AD account is an Administrator and able to connect Windoz machines
to the AD, but when I try to kinit this server, I get:
kinit(v5): Cannot resolve network address for KDC in realm UTHSCSA.EDU
while getting initial credentials
So I google that error and it tells me something is wrong with the DNS
not resolving that name. The problem is, DNS can resolved that name.
What else should I look for?
--
Jeremy Mann
jeremy@biochem.uthscsa.edu
University of Texas Health Science Center
Bioinformatics Core Facility
http://www.bioinformatics.uthscsa.edu
Phone: (210) 567-2672
From edeleonjr at gmail.com Mon May 17 14:43:45 2010
From: edeleonjr at gmail.com (Ernest De Leon)
Date: Mon May 17 14:43:47 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] What am I doing wrong to connect to an Active Directory?
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
what do you get from an nslookup of that name from the box giving you the
error?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 2:41 PM, Jeremy Mann wrote:
> I've got a Samba server I need to connect to the campus AD. I set up
> Kerberos first, /etc/krb5.conf contains:
>
> [libdefaults]
> dns_lookup_realm = false
> default_realm = UTHSCSA.EDU
>
> [realms]
> UTHSCSA.EDU = {
> kdc = ***.***.uthscsa.edu
> default_domain = uthscsa.edu
> }
>
> [domain_realms]
> .kerberos.server = UTHSCSA.EDU
>
> My AD account is an Administrator and able to connect Windoz machines
> to the AD, but when I try to kinit this server, I get:
>
> kinit(v5): Cannot resolve network address for KDC in realm UTHSCSA.EDU
> while getting initial credentials
>
> So I google that error and it tells me something is wrong with the DNS
> not resolving that name. The problem is, DNS can resolved that name.
>
> What else should I look for?
>
> --
> Jeremy Mann
> jeremy@biochem.uthscsa.edu
>
> University of Texas Health Science Center
> Bioinformatics Core Facility
> http://www.bioinformatics.uthscsa.edu
> Phone: (210) 567-2672
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From jeremymann at gmail.com Mon May 17 14:50:24 2010
From: jeremymann at gmail.com (Jeremy Mann)
Date: Mon May 17 14:50:27 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] What am I doing wrong to connect to an Active Directory?
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 2:43 PM, Ernest De Leon wrote:
> what do you get from an nslookup of that name from the box giving you the
> error?
I get the correct response back. I called the Windoz admin guy to
verify he gave me the right domain controller name. There are 5 domain
controllers on campus so I'm going to try each one.
On another note maybe I'm trying to do something advanced when the
solution could be simplier. The problem I have is a user that logs in
to the campus domain, can not get our network share. It keeps
prompting them for a login like:
UTHSCSA\
If they use a local account, our network share works.
The only solution I came up with is to bind this server to the campus domain.
Is there a different solution I should be considering?
--
Jeremy Mann
jeremy@biochem.uthscsa.edu
University of Texas Health Science Center
Bioinformatics Core Facility
http://www.bioinformatics.uthscsa.edu
Phone: (210) 567-2672
From stosss at gmail.com Mon May 17 15:38:51 2010
From: stosss at gmail.com (stosss)
Date: Mon May 17 15:38:54 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To:
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<201005151131.16355.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 4:09 PM, Henry Pugsley wrote:
> I think you're missing the point .. it's not about who is deciding how
> hot or cold your house is.
No, that is the point. It is about who is in control.
Any time you agree to centralization that you have no control of you
enslave yourself to the ones that do have the control no matter what
potential benefit might come from it.
Frogs love cold water and don't like hot water. If they are put into
water that is already hot they will jump out or try to jump out. But
if you put them in cold water they will stay there and won't even
notice as the temperature goes up, they will stay in the water and
boil to death without making any attempt to get out.
>
> The deal doesn't sound all that bad:
> 1) You get a free programmable thermostat (this alone saves you money)
> 2) The cycling only happens during peak times (3pm-7pm) of peak months.
> 3) Cycling doesn't happen more often, it just happens at better times.
> 4) You can remove yourself from the project temporarily or permanently.
>
> What I get from #3 is they want to setup a sequence across the grid so
> that as one house cycles on, another one cycles off .. to keep all the
> houses from cycling on at the same time and causing brownouts. ?You
> control the temperature, they control when the A/C runs to maintain
> that temperature.
>
It always starts out looking like a great idea for everyone. They,
"Say it will save you money"
People are so conditioned to having their money taken away from them
that they jump at the chance to save or cut expenses and do not always
evaluate the long term effects or the possible changes that could come
from it later that they might not agree with and would not have agreed
with they had known about them at the beginning. Their plan will
always look beneficial for you in the beginning but it will always
work against you in the long run.
Those planning the centralization of resources that effect everyone
have their plan all laid out long before they launch. Their objective
is to save their own money and if you save money in the beginning they
don't care.
> The bigger issue here is that the power grid is overloaded and it's
> getting worse as people put more power hungry electronics in their
> homes (honestly, who needs 6 computers, 3 gaming systems, and 2 plasma
> TVs? ;)).
If a family is big enough and rich enough to have all of those devices
they have a right to buy and use them and no has a right to say can't
have them or don't need them.
The biggest consumption of electrical power is the AC/heat, water
heater, stove and dryer not all those electronic devices you listed.
--
"If we can but prevent the government from wasting the labours of the
people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become
happy." - Thomas Jefferson
From bruce.dubbs at gmail.com Tue May 18 16:06:19 2010
From: bruce.dubbs at gmail.com (Bruce Dubbs)
Date: Tue May 18 16:06:23 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
Message-ID: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com>
http://panopticlick.eff.org/
At least for me:
"Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 937,511 tested
so far."
But what would you expect from an LFS system?
-- Bruce
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Tue May 18 16:29:25 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Tue May 18 16:29:13 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Are there Open Source Manufacturing Efforts in San Antonio?
Message-ID: <4BF306B5.3080909@gmail.com>
Greetings,
Does anybody know of any Open Source Manufacturing Efforts going on here
in San Antonio? If not, is anybody aware of where such efforts are
taking place to achieve a post-scarcity, open source manufacturing and
manufacturing education effort? I'm looking for the hands-on approach
in addition to the OSS approach. Google doesn't appear to turn up much
useful information.
pcdls
From lgj at usenix.org Tue May 18 17:52:19 2010
From: lgj at usenix.org (Lionel Garth Jones)
Date: Tue May 18 17:52:21 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] 2010 USENIX Annual Technical Conference Registration Now
Open
Message-ID:
We're pleased to invite you to attend the 2010 USENIX Annual Technical
Conference (USENIX ATC '10). This year, USENIX ATC '10 is part of the
USENIX Federated Conferences Week. Not only do you get a 3-day
conference program filled with the latest systems research, but
you'll also have increased opportunities to network with peers across
multiple disciplines.
The technical program begins on Wednesday, June 23, and includes
refereed papers, invited talks, WiPs, and a poster session.
The impressive slate of invited speakers include:
-- Keynote Address: Bobby Johnson, Director of Engineering, Facebook,
Inc.
-- Keynote Address: Ivan Sutherland, Portland State University, on
"Some Thoughts About Concurrency"
-- Ben Fry, Author and Consultant, on "Visualizing Data"
-- Jon Orwant, Google, on "Google Books: Making All the World's Books
Universally Accessible and Useful"
-- Maximilian Schich, Northeastern University, on "Reconstructing
Ancient Rome: 700 Years of IT and Knowledge Management"
-- Matt Welsh, Harvard University, on "RoboBees: An Autonomous Colony of
Robotic Pollinators"
The USENIX ATC '10 Refereed Papers present the latest in
ground-breaking systems research. Be among the first to check out the
latest innovative work in the systems field.
A joint Poster Session and Happy Hour between USENIX ATC '10 and WebApps
'10 will be held on the evening of Wednesday, June 23.
Work-in-Progress Reports will take place on Thursday, June 24.
Finally, don't miss the opportunity to mingle with colleagues and
leading experts in the combined Birds-of-a-Feather sessions and at the
various evening social events, including the joint poster session,
vendor BoFs, and receptions.
The full progarm is available at http://www.usenix.org/atc10/proga
USENIX ATC '10 promises to be an exciting showcase for the latest in
innovative research and cutting-edge practices in technology. We look
forward to seeing you in Boston
On behalf of the USENIX ATC '10 organizers,
Paul Barham, Microsoft Research Cambridge
Timothy Roscoe, ETH Zurich
USENIX ATC '10 Program Co-Chairs
atc10chairs@usenix.org
P.S. Connect with other attendees and help spread the word!
-- Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/USENIX-Annual-Technical-Conference/
27016525676?ref=ts
--Twitter: http://twitter.com/AnnualTech
----------------------------------------------
2010 USENIX Annual Technical Conference
June 22-25, 2010, Boston, MA
http://www.usenix.org/atc10/proga
Early Bird Registration Deadline: June 7, 2010
Part of USENIX Federated Conferences Week
http://www.usenix.org/confweek10
-----------------------------------------------
From dondavis at reglue.org Tue May 18 18:08:31 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Tue May 18 18:08:38 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org>
Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 944,802 tested
so far.
Currently, we estimate that your browser has a fingerprint that conveys
at least 19.85 bits of identifying information.
I got that with Iceweasel too. Possibly the fonts?
Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> http://panopticlick.eff.org/
>
> At least for me:
>
> "Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 937,511 tested
> so far."
>
> But what would you expect from an LFS system?
>
> -- Bruce
From toddwbucy at grandecom.net Tue May 18 18:27:16 2010
From: toddwbucy at grandecom.net (redpill)
Date: Tue May 18 18:27:24 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop>
I got the same thing using chrome on Ubuntu 10.04
Todd
On Tue, 2010-05-18 at 18:08 -0500, Don Davis wrote:
> Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 944,802 tested
> so far.
>
> Currently, we estimate that your browser has a fingerprint that conveys
> at least 19.85 bits of identifying information.
>
> I got that with Iceweasel too. Possibly the fonts?
>
>
>
> Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> > http://panopticlick.eff.org/
> >
> > At least for me:
> >
> > "Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 937,511 tested
> > so far."
> >
> > But what would you expect from an LFS system?
> >
> > -- Bruce
>
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Tue May 18 18:40:02 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Tue May 18 18:39:49 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org>
<1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop>
Message-ID: <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com>
Ditto,
pcdls
redpill wrote:
> I got the same thing using chrome on Ubuntu 10.04
> Todd
>
> On Tue, 2010-05-18 at 18:08 -0500, Don Davis wrote:
>
>> Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 944,802 tested
>> so far.
>>
>> Currently, we estimate that your browser has a fingerprint that conveys
>> at least 19.85 bits of identifying information.
>>
>> I got that with Iceweasel too. Possibly the fonts?
>>
>>
>>
>> Bruce Dubbs wrote:
>>
>>> http://panopticlick.eff.org/
>>>
>>> At least for me:
>>>
>>> "Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 937,511 tested
>>> so far."
>>>
>>> But what would you expect from an LFS system?
>>>
>>> -- Bruce
>>>
>
>
>
From dondavis at reglue.org Tue May 18 18:45:30 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Tue May 18 18:45:32 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com>
<4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop>
<4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org>
So, we are trackable on our browser fingerprint alone.
pcdls.ronin wrote:
> Ditto,
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Tue May 18 19:10:23 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Tue May 18 19:10:15 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com>
<4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com>
So, uh, what do we do about it?
Don Davis wrote:
> So, we are trackable on our browser fingerprint alone.
>
> pcdls.ronin wrote:
>> Ditto,
From hc at lookcee.com Tue May 18 19:10:24 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Tue May 18 19:10:26 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com>
<4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4BF32C70.8060600@lookcee.com>
Don Davis wrote:
> So, we are trackable on our browser fingerprint alone.
>
> pcdls.ronin wrote:
>> Ditto,
Yep, pay attention to the moves being made by the leaders in the Browser
war, sur google is so far your frin ... but ... What happened in China?
hh
From hc at lookcee.com Tue May 18 19:48:38 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Tue May 18 19:48:41 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com> <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org>
<4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BF33566.9000204@lookcee.com>
pcdls.ronin wrote:
> So, uh, what do we do about it?
>
> Don Davis wrote:
>> So, we are trackable on our browser fingerprint alone.
>>
>> pcdls.ronin wrote:
>>> Ditto,
>
I dunno but consider this ... I find this anecdotal experience very
interesting. About 8yrs ago i bought a 250' roll of 10/2 Romex elect-hookup
wire it cost me $32+7% tax and a yr ago I wanted to buy another of same
product but the price was $280 at same store + 7.75 tx.. local tiny town
feed & hwd. lowest price i found via google was still over $200 ... so i
just could not afford it but i also had noticed that Southwire had
virtually cornered the market anywhere I looked via Google ..
FF to just 2wks ago I noticed that copper was dumping big time, mines
closing cause price had gone below production cost. (this pure speculation
but I figured the shooting war is no longer consuming copper, just mostly
big boomer's) I first went to ebay and found a price of $80-90 so with $30
shipping i thought ok I need this so lets do it and I clicked on an ad
within the Ebay auction search pg that was a mail-order hwd co (Audubon hwd
co) and yet when i got to the add that was for $78 I found yep buy it now
.. low ship but in the description it was not 10/2 but was 14/2 so 1/2 the
copper, won't carry the load that 10/2 will.
So I then went ahead and bought from ebay dealer it is now in transit but
now since that day 10days ago almost all urls I visit like weather channel
plus any google search on anything i am getting not only the (A-hwd store)
but other stores displayed saying 10/2 but when i have clicked on all these
they are misleading, just to cost these cheats money I c on every new pg I
get, it still really offers the 14/2 product this is on weather channel
plus several other news type channels i reg visit... plus the same ad
displays however often i click the url.
Do you dudes connect the same dots as I?
I am mildly irritated, but only that goog is being a whore for a gyp-ass
seller and I find that offensive. I would have praised Goog if they had led
me to a bargin instead of a cheat that must be picking up sales and once u
buy it's yours. I would not have known till i received a worthless product.
hh
From bruce.dubbs at gmail.com Tue May 18 19:51:06 2010
From: bruce.dubbs at gmail.com (Bruce Dubbs)
Date: Tue May 18 19:51:11 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com> <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org>
<4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BF335FA.1050301@gmail.com>
pcdls.ronin wrote:
> So, uh, what do we do about it?
Change the fonts or plugins and the fingerprint changes. Note that they
don't mention IP address which is known to the server too.
Also, you can always go to the library to post something.
-- Bruce
From hc at lookcee.com Tue May 18 20:05:43 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Tue May 18 20:05:45 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF335FA.1050301@gmail.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com> <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org> <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com>
<4BF335FA.1050301@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BF33967.5020900@lookcee.com>
Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> pcdls.ronin wrote:
>> So, uh, what do we do about it?
>
> Change the fonts or plugins and the fingerprint changes. Note that they
> don't mention IP address which is known to the server too.
>
> Also, you can always go to the library to post something.
>
> -- Bruce
Thanks Bruce I will make the changes but since i no longer am mobile i
cannot go somewhere else I am stuck wi using my rural BB phone'co IP. what
can we do about this just live wi it, be damn careful what I post? I feel
that with this kind of ID being captured whatever u post can also be
connected, rite?
hh
From bruce.dubbs at gmail.com Tue May 18 20:28:51 2010
From: bruce.dubbs at gmail.com (Bruce Dubbs)
Date: Tue May 18 20:28:55 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF33967.5020900@lookcee.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com> <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org> <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com> <4BF335FA.1050301@gmail.com>
<4BF33967.5020900@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <4BF33ED3.70704@gmail.com>
Herb Cee wrote:
> what can we do about this just live wi it, be damn careful what I post?
> I feel that with this kind of ID being captured whatever u post can also
> be connected, rite?
When you talk on the phone, the telco can listen. Do you trust them not
to do that? All data (text, audio, video) can be reduced to a bit
stream and that can be recorded. Is it? Probably not, but it could be.
When you send something via USPS or FedEx or UPS, does someone open it
and look at what is sent? Probably not, but it could be.
Privacy is relative. The most likely component to see what a browser
sends is the server. Only if servers are broadly communicating does
this become an issue. And then, only if you care.
And remember, even if you can uniquely identify a browser/computer
system, it doesn't guarantee who is operating the keyboard.
-- Bruce
From hc at lookcee.com Tue May 18 20:36:00 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Tue May 18 20:36:02 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF33ED3.70704@gmail.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com> <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org> <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com> <4BF335FA.1050301@gmail.com> <4BF33967.5020900@lookcee.com>
<4BF33ED3.70704@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BF34080.2000806@lookcee.com>
Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> Herb Cee wrote:
>
>> what can we do about this just live wi it, be damn careful what I
>> post? I feel that with this kind of ID being captured whatever u post
>> can also be connected, rite?
>
> When you talk on the phone, the telco can listen. Do you trust them not
> to do that? All data (text, audio, video) can be reduced to a bit
> stream and that can be recorded. Is it? Probably not, but it could be.
>
> When you send something via USPS or FedEx or UPS, does someone open it
> and look at what is sent? Probably not, but it could be.
>
> Privacy is relative. The most likely component to see what a browser
> sends is the server. Only if servers are broadly communicating does
> this become an issue. And then, only if you care.
>
> And remember, even if you can uniquely identify a browser/computer
> system, it doesn't guarantee who is operating the keyboard.
>
> -- Bruce
Got it Bruce big thanks.
hh
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Tue May 18 22:31:28 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Tue May 18 22:31:17 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF34080.2000806@lookcee.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com> <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org> <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com> <4BF335FA.1050301@gmail.com> <4BF33967.5020900@lookcee.com> <4BF33ED3.70704@gmail.com>
<4BF34080.2000806@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <4BF35B90.7020706@gmail.com>
Personally, I take a devil-may-care attitude in these cases. If they
come for me, I'll kill them with my swords. Beyond this life, I'll take
what comes.
Herb Cee wrote:
> Bruce Dubbs wrote:
>> Herb Cee wrote:
>>
>>> what can we do about this just live wi it, be damn careful what I
>>> post? I feel that with this kind of ID being captured whatever u
>>> post can also be connected, rite?
>>
>> When you talk on the phone, the telco can listen. Do you trust them
>> not to do that? All data (text, audio, video) can be reduced to a
>> bit stream and that can be recorded. Is it? Probably not, but it
>> could be.
>>
>> When you send something via USPS or FedEx or UPS, does someone open
>> it and look at what is sent? Probably not, but it could be.
>>
>> Privacy is relative. The most likely component to see what a browser
>> sends is the server. Only if servers are broadly communicating does
>> this become an issue. And then, only if you care.
>>
>> And remember, even if you can uniquely identify a browser/computer
>> system, it doesn't guarantee who is operating the keyboard.
>>
>> -- Bruce
>
>
> Got it Bruce big thanks.
> hh
From tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org Tue May 18 23:15:27 2010
From: tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org (Tweeks)
Date: Tue May 18 23:15:35 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on the
CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To:
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Message-ID: <201005182315.27410.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
On Saturday 15 May 2010 06:03:54 pm Robert Pearson wrote:
[...]
> I do not have a clue how to underclock (or overclock) and how it
> relates to performance and wattage reduction.
> My question is, "Have you looked at EFI/UEFI CULV desktop motherboards
> as a "green" solution?"
> If so, "How do they look?".
Please.. don't mistake my cheap/high availability computer hacking for being
on the "green" bandwagon. It's one thing for business to market to
this concept.. but when honorable geeks start buying PC components based on
green and energy-star ratings.. it really makes me ill. The energy star
compliance program is a joke. And most of those "green hardware" out there
is marketing fluff (except maybe for PFC and RoHS). Marketing mean to make
companies look good.. and make more money for people willing to may 30% more
to feel good.
> Is your ultimate goal to reduce electric consumption primarily in your
> computer gear or the "big picture" reduction in A/C cost?
On my high availability firewall -- By underclocking and pulling off the fan,
I just make a very low cost, more reliable system with no moving parts.
That's the main goal there. Not "going green"... heh..
> On really hot days I am now forced to turn off all my desktops to
> reduce A/C use and use my laptop in suspend/hibernate.
I just turn the AC to 69. ;)
> A/C savings approach 30% on hot summer days.
I'm a Yankee. I can't take the heat..
> I have not been able to get suspend/hibernate working for the desktops.
> Anybody doing this have any desktop suggestions?
> Electricity is not going to get cheaper anytime soon.
Electricity is the cheapest in the nation right here in San Antonio at around
6.5cents/KWh (unless it's recently changed). This is why solar power has
never really taken off in Central Texas. Perfect climate... terrible RoI.
Tweeks
From tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org Tue May 18 23:20:54 2010
From: tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org (Tweeks)
Date: Tue May 18 23:21:00 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To:
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
On Sunday 16 May 2010 03:09:54 pm Henry Pugsley wrote:
> I think you're missing the point .. it's not about who is deciding how
> hot or cold your house is. From what I've read about this, CPS will
> cycle your A/C during peak load times to smooth the load cycles.
Yeah man.. That's why I'm thinking about getting one and then "voiding that
warrany". ;)
> The bigger issue here is that the power grid is overloaded and it's
> getting worse as people put more power hungry electronics in their
Just wait until americans start plugging in those E-cars.. that will change
the shape of the whole grid usage.
> I guess from the security perspective, the only big risk is that
> someone could access the system and force everyone's A/C to cycle on
> at the same time, thus causing a brownout or blackout.
That's my concern with such a system. Actually creating an attack vector for
our power grid.
Tweeks
From tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org Tue May 18 23:24:46 2010
From: tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org (Tweeks)
Date: Tue May 18 23:24:53 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <4BF0F8ED.9010009@gmail.com>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<4BF0F8ED.9010009@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201005182324.46211.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
On Monday 17 May 2010 03:06:05 am pcdls.ronin wrote:
[...]
If you cannot override the electronics of this thermostat
> directly, you could access the control signals and gang a second
> thermostat that you control along with the thermostat that you wanted to
> hack, this would require some application of relay logic to facilitate
> and will look kludge-y as hell.
Not at all.. The manual says that the unit will continue to run your fan, but
not the compressor. You simple wire in a bypass switch that uses the FAN
signal to close relays for BOTH the fan and the compressor. Big brother is
bypassed. :)
> I wouldn't recommend this unless you
> have intimate knowledge of how your split-system AC works. Plus,
> touching 24VAC can still hurt quite a bit.
Not that bad.
(if you're not sweaty.. ;)
Tweeks
From cold2na at gmail.com Tue May 18 23:42:21 2010
From: cold2na at gmail.com (Dylan Nelson)
Date: Tue May 18 23:42:38 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bizarro Install
Message-ID:
Ok. I burnt a BackTrack 4 DVD install from Remote Exploit. Checked the md5
like always. It checked out as usual. Installed this afternoon on a PC with
Ubuntu 10.04 I have been using all semester. I wiped the drive clean and
completed the install of BT4. After the installation was complete, I
rebooted the pc. Everything as usual, right? When the PC boots back up it
gives me the options of Ubuntu 8.04 and WINDOWS. Windows Vista longhorn
bootloader!! Shocked, I run and go wake my wife up to show her. Get
witnesses I'm thinking because this is insane. She's not as amazed as I am
to say the least. Amazed is not exactly how I would describe your mood at
all. : (
So, Windows is there somehow. And I say why not, let's pick it. I pick the
partition with Windows on it. And it is a Windows 7 installer. How bizarre
is that? I haven't gone back and checked the Ubuntu partition. But wow,
right?
Keep in mind, Windows has never been on that PC since I picked it up from
GoodWill two years ago and it was XP. Bizarro , yes?
Dylan
From ftm at satx.rr.com Tue May 18 23:57:43 2010
From: ftm at satx.rr.com (Doug)
Date: Tue May 18 23:57:50 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info
on the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
<201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Message-ID: <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com>
I spoke to CPS about one of those, and their advice was that if there is usually someone home all day then DO NOT have one installed. But if you do get one and have ANY electronics in use, they should be protected by surge protectors and battery back ups or UPS with back up. That or kiss them goodbye.
I opted to pass on the opportunity/
-----Original Message-----
From: satlug-bounces@satlug.org [mailto:satlug-bounces@satlug.org] On Behalf Of Tweeks
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2010 11:21 PM
To: satlug@satlug.org
Subject: Re: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
On Sunday 16 May 2010 03:09:54 pm Henry Pugsley wrote:
> I think you're missing the point .. it's not about who is deciding how
> hot or cold your house is. From what I've read about this, CPS will
> cycle your A/C during peak load times to smooth the load cycles.
Yeah man.. That's why I'm thinking about getting one and then "voiding that
warrany". ;)
> The bigger issue here is that the power grid is overloaded and it's
> getting worse as people put more power hungry electronics in their
Just wait until americans start plugging in those E-cars.. that will change
the shape of the whole grid usage.
> I guess from the security perspective, the only big risk is that
> someone could access the system and force everyone's A/C to cycle on
> at the same time, thus causing a brownout or blackout.
That's my concern with such a system. Actually creating an attack vector for
our power grid.
Tweeks
From mayfield_mark at att.net Wed May 19 00:49:38 2010
From: mayfield_mark at att.net (mark)
Date: Wed May 19 00:49:43 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bizarro Install
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <1274248178.7146.24.camel@grim-desktop>
My experience with grub detecting existing linux installs has not been
good. I am assuming that BackTrack is using grub. I don't think that
grub would wipe out the MBR, so if it had windows on it and the MBR
wasn't wiped grub may leave the bootloader there even though the system
is gone. I know on some systems that have recovery partitions as the
first partition grub will grab it and put it in the menu in which case
you just have to change the partition number (otherwise it boots the
recovery utility). I always back up the bootloader configuration and
never rely on the bootloader to get it right. Expecially with multiple
hard drives the auto detection is horrible. I've got several systems
with three or more systems in a multi boot configuration (windoze,
linux, solaris or bsd). The only way to get it right is manually. If I
had to guess I might think that because BackTrack is meant to be a live
system and to be used in stealth they didn't think you would want it in
the boot loader that everyone can see. What might be nice would be to
put its entry on a floppy, cd, dvd or flash drive and boot from that
when using backtrack (I don't know how big the backtrack kernel is and
if it would fit on a floppy).
I've done alot of editing boot loader configurations manually. In this
case I would probably boot the live disk and copy the boot loader
configuration from it. Then just change the location of the kernel,
initial ramdisk and root filesystem to match what is on the hard drive.
Very bizarre but not surprising. The part about the Vista boot loader
when Vista was never on it is. Perhaps the hard drive had made its way
around different machines and did have Vista on it at one point? My
machine, which has three hard drives has grub 2. Every time the kernel
gets updated and grub-update is run it resets the boot loader
configuration. It gets all the systems that are not on the primary boot
drive wrong. I put the right settings in the grub 2 custom directory so
that they get picked up but it puts both sets in, the wrong ones that
are auto detected and the right ones from the custom directory. I just
go in and remove the autodetected entries manually after each kernel
update.
There may be way to disable the auto detect feature but I haven't gotten
around to looking for it.
On Tue, 2010-05-18 at 23:42 -0500, Dylan Nelson wrote:
> Ok. I burnt a BackTrack 4 DVD install from Remote Exploit. Checked the md5
> like always. It checked out as usual. Installed this afternoon on a PC with
> Ubuntu 10.04 I have been using all semester. I wiped the drive clean and
> completed the install of BT4. After the installation was complete, I
> rebooted the pc. Everything as usual, right? When the PC boots back up it
> gives me the options of Ubuntu 8.04 and WINDOWS. Windows Vista longhorn
> bootloader!! Shocked, I run and go wake my wife up to show her. Get
> witnesses I'm thinking because this is insane. She's not as amazed as I am
> to say the least. Amazed is not exactly how I would describe your mood at
> all. : (
>
> So, Windows is there somehow. And I say why not, let's pick it. I pick the
> partition with Windows on it. And it is a Windows 7 installer. How bizarre
> is that? I haven't gone back and checked the Ubuntu partition. But wow,
> right?
> Keep in mind, Windows has never been on that PC since I picked it up from
> GoodWill two years ago and it was XP. Bizarro , yes?
>
> Dylan
From dondavis at reglue.org Wed May 19 06:34:40 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Wed May 19 06:34:47 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF33566.9000204@lookcee.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com> <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org> <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com>
<4BF33566.9000204@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <4BF3CCD0.2020905@reglue.org>
Herb Cee wrote:
> pcdls.ronin wrote:
>> So, uh, what do we do about it?
>>
>> Don Davis wrote:
>>> So, we are trackable on our browser fingerprint alone.
>>>
>>> pcdls.ronin wrote:
>>>> Ditto,
>>
>
>
> I dunno but consider this ... I find this anecdotal experience very
> interesting. About 8yrs ago i bought a 250' roll of 10/2 Romex
> elect-hookup wire it cost me $32+7% tax and a yr ago I wanted to buy
> another of same product but the price was $280 at same store + 7.75 tx..
> local tiny town feed & hwd. lowest price i found via google was still
> over $200 ... so i just could not afford it but i also had noticed that
> Southwire had virtually cornered the market anywhere I looked via Google ..
I remember working in construction 15 years ago. I was _very_ surprised
to see a box of Romex for close to $300.
You don't think it's cookies tracking.
From dondavis at reglue.org Wed May 19 06:41:37 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Wed May 19 06:41:39 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF35B90.7020706@gmail.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com> <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org> <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com> <4BF335FA.1050301@gmail.com> <4BF33967.5020900@lookcee.com> <4BF33ED3.70704@gmail.com> <4BF34080.2000806@lookcee.com>
<4BF35B90.7020706@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BF3CE71.3030201@reglue.org>
You can use an onion router. FF has Tor plugins. You can also tunnel
over ssh. Taking due diligence to clear cookies and flash 'cookies' is
mostly good enough. Also take a look at the 'request policy', 'default
user agent', and 'better privacy' plugins for FF.
Basically everything that you send unencrypted is 'public.' There are
plenty of chances for MITM snooping / packet capture.
>>>> what can we do about this just live wi it, be damn careful what I
>>>> post? I feel that with this kind of ID being captured whatever u
>>>> post can also be connected, rite?
>>> When you talk on the phone, the telco can listen. Do you trust them
>>> not to do that? All data (text, audio, video) can be reduced to a
>>> bit stream and that can be recorded. Is it? Probably not, but it
>>> could be.
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Wed May 19 07:45:27 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Wed May 19 07:45:16 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF3CE71.3030201@reglue.org>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF31DEF.6000803@reglue.org> <1274225236.29876.0.camel@redpill-laptop> <4BF32552.5030008@gmail.com> <4BF3269A.9080005@reglue.org> <4BF32C6F.4020703@gmail.com> <4BF335FA.1050301@gmail.com> <4BF33967.5020900@lookcee.com> <4BF33ED3.70704@gmail.com> <4BF34080.2000806@lookcee.com> <4BF35B90.7020706@gmail.com>
<4BF3CE71.3030201@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4BF3DD67.3010605@gmail.com>
It's interesting to note that, in light of everyone's interest in
'privacy', that all of the SATLUG correspondence are being posted here:
http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.org.user-groups.linux.satlug/www.satlug.org
pcdls
Don Davis wrote:
> You can use an onion router. FF has Tor plugins. You can also tunnel
> over ssh. Taking due diligence to clear cookies and flash 'cookies' is
> mostly good enough. Also take a look at the 'request policy', 'default
> user agent', and 'better privacy' plugins for FF.
>
> Basically everything that you send unencrypted is 'public.' There are
> plenty of chances for MITM snooping / packet capture.
>
>>>>> what can we do about this just live wi it, be damn careful what I
>>>>> post? I feel that with this kind of ID being captured whatever u
>>>>> post can also be connected, rite?
>>>> When you talk on the phone, the telco can listen. Do you trust them
>>>> not to do that? All data (text, audio, video) can be reduced to a
>>>> bit stream and that can be recorded. Is it? Probably not, but it
>>>> could be.
From dkowis at shlrm.org Wed May 19 08:04:53 2010
From: dkowis at shlrm.org (David Kowis)
Date: Wed May 19 08:06:00 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BF3E1F5.2080307@shlrm.org>
On 5/18/2010 4:06 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> http://panopticlick.eff.org/
>
> At least for me:
>
> "Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 937,511 tested
> so far."
Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 977,650 tested
so far.
This is in firefox on windows. I'm wondering if perhaps this isn't
really as dramatic as it used to be. It includes things like Screen Size
and color Depth, the plugins I've got, and what fonts are installed.
It's entirely possible that most everyone will be unique, unless you're
a windows internet exploder user, and you never changed your resolution
from the default when you bought your laptop from Worst Buy.
David
From satlug at sbcglobal.net Wed May 19 09:35:35 2010
From: satlug at sbcglobal.net (Don Wright)
Date: Wed May 19 09:35:41 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info
on the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
<201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com>
Message-ID: <86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com>
Doug wrote:
>I spoke to CPS about one of those, and their advice was that if there is usually someone home all day then DO NOT have one installed. But if you do get one and have ANY electronics in use, they should be protected by surge protectors and battery back ups or UPS with back up. That or kiss them goodbye.
You got a cite from competent authority for that? There's nothing
electrical that differs in this unit from a standard thermostat. The
unit just pretends the temperature is a little different than it is. The
A/C turns on and off EXACTLY THE SAME as with a standard t-stat, so
where is this magic electronics-destroying monster?
--
Be well - or at least have interesting symptoms!
From satlug at sbcglobal.net Wed May 19 10:18:35 2010
From: satlug at sbcglobal.net (Don Wright)
Date: Wed May 19 10:18:40 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bizarro Install
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
Dylan Nelson wrote:
>So, Windows is there somehow. And I say why not, let's pick it. I pick the
>partition with Windows on it. And it is a Windows 7 installer. How bizarre
>is that? I haven't gone back and checked the Ubuntu partition. But wow,
>right?
> Keep in mind, Windows has never been on that PC since I picked it up from
>GoodWill two years ago and it was XP. Bizarro , yes?
You sure that was 7 and not (spit) Vista? Most consumer machines have a
reinstall partition with the original factory OS. Some are harder to
kill than others.[1]
Use Darik's Boot And Nuke (DBAN - see below) to really wipe the drive.
It's also found as an alternate boot in some 'rescue' distros.
[1] http://www.dban.org/node/35
--
Be well - or at least have interesting symptoms!
From ve3cda at gmail.com Wed May 19 10:59:34 2010
From: ve3cda at gmail.com (Ben Price)
Date: Wed May 19 10:59:42 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] OT: job opening - Systems Administrator (Windows/Linux)
Message-ID:
Mr. Jay Lucas of TrueNorth has asked that the following information be
made available to the SATLUG members. You may contact Mr. Lucas via
email at: jlucas@truenorth-us.com
Systems Administrator (Windows/Linux) $50,000 - $60,000
Leading edge biotechnology consulting firm is leading the front on
technology developments in the bio-technology and bio-informatics
fields. If being on the leading edge of a nationally recognized
project while working for an entrepreneurial and rapidly growing
consulting firm is attractive to you, then please send us your resume
for consideration.
To view the opportunity, go to www.truenorth-us.com, then select
careers, then select search job openings, use 1051 as the job number.
Regards,
Ben Price AD5YY / VE3CDA
From cold2na at gmail.com Wed May 19 11:11:18 2010
From: cold2na at gmail.com (Dylan Nelson)
Date: Wed May 19 11:11:21 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bizarro Install
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
No. It was Windows 7. On top of that, Vista or 7 were never on the machine.
It is an old Dell Optiplex 270 I picked from Goodwill a while back. Wiped
it clean, and installed Linux on it. Just all kinds of odd. And yep, it was
7. I would have kept it but it both needed an activation key and the
display settings could not be optimized for the PC.
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 10:18 AM, Don Wright wrote:
> Dylan Nelson wrote:
>
> >So, Windows is there somehow. And I say why not, let's pick it. I pick the
> >partition with Windows on it. And it is a Windows 7 installer. How bizarre
> >is that? I haven't gone back and checked the Ubuntu partition. But wow,
> >right?
> > Keep in mind, Windows has never been on that PC since I picked it up from
> >GoodWill two years ago and it was XP. Bizarro , yes?
>
> You sure that was 7 and not (spit) Vista? Most consumer machines have a
> reinstall partition with the original factory OS. Some are harder to
> kill than others.[1]
>
> Use Darik's Boot And Nuke (DBAN - see below) to really wipe the drive.
> It's also found as an alternate boot in some 'rescue' distros.
>
>
> [1] http://www.dban.org/node/35
>
> --
> Be well - or at least have interesting symptoms!
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From toddwbucy at grandecom.net Wed May 19 16:27:32 2010
From: toddwbucy at grandecom.net (redpill)
Date: Wed May 19 16:27:39 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bizarro Install
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <1274304452.10898.1.camel@redpill-laptop>
Just curious when you say that you wiped the drive did you use DBAN or
some other such utility?
Also generally BT4 is not installed on a hard drive but used from the CD
or USB stick. It is not really intended as a desktop distro.
Todd
On Tue, 2010-05-18 at 23:42 -0500, Dylan Nelson wrote:
> Ok. I burnt a BackTrack 4 DVD install from Remote Exploit. Checked the md5
> like always. It checked out as usual. Installed this afternoon on a PC with
> Ubuntu 10.04 I have been using all semester. I wiped the drive clean and
> completed the install of BT4. After the installation was complete, I
> rebooted the pc. Everything as usual, right? When the PC boots back up it
> gives me the options of Ubuntu 8.04 and WINDOWS. Windows Vista longhorn
> bootloader!! Shocked, I run and go wake my wife up to show her. Get
> witnesses I'm thinking because this is insane. She's not as amazed as I am
> to say the least. Amazed is not exactly how I would describe your mood at
> all. : (
>
> So, Windows is there somehow. And I say why not, let's pick it. I pick the
> partition with Windows on it. And it is a Windows 7 installer. How bizarre
> is that? I haven't gone back and checked the Ubuntu partition. But wow,
> right?
> Keep in mind, Windows has never been on that PC since I picked it up from
> GoodWill two years ago and it was XP. Bizarro , yes?
>
> Dylan
From cold2na at gmail.com Wed May 19 21:37:56 2010
From: cold2na at gmail.com (Dylan Nelson)
Date: Wed May 19 21:38:38 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bizarro Install
In-Reply-To: <1274304452.10898.1.camel@redpill-laptop>
References:
<1274304452.10898.1.camel@redpill-laptop>
Message-ID:
No utility per say. Just when their installer asks how you would like to
install the system, I choose use the entire drive option. I installed BT4
because I got tired of the small little delays when running from live CD.
Dylan
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 4:27 PM, redpill wrote:
> Just curious when you say that you wiped the drive did you use DBAN or
> some other such utility?
> Also generally BT4 is not installed on a hard drive but used from the CD
> or USB stick. It is not really intended as a desktop distro.
>
> Todd
>
> On Tue, 2010-05-18 at 23:42 -0500, Dylan Nelson wrote:
> > Ok. I burnt a BackTrack 4 DVD install from Remote Exploit. Checked the
> md5
> > like always. It checked out as usual. Installed this afternoon on a PC
> with
> > Ubuntu 10.04 I have been using all semester. I wiped the drive clean and
> > completed the install of BT4. After the installation was complete, I
> > rebooted the pc. Everything as usual, right? When the PC boots back up it
> > gives me the options of Ubuntu 8.04 and WINDOWS. Windows Vista longhorn
> > bootloader!! Shocked, I run and go wake my wife up to show her. Get
> > witnesses I'm thinking because this is insane. She's not as amazed as I
> am
> > to say the least. Amazed is not exactly how I would describe your mood at
> > all. : (
> >
> > So, Windows is there somehow. And I say why not, let's pick it. I pick
> the
> > partition with Windows on it. And it is a Windows 7 installer. How
> bizarre
> > is that? I haven't gone back and checked the Ubuntu partition. But wow,
> > right?
> > Keep in mind, Windows has never been on that PC since I picked it up
> from
> > GoodWill two years ago and it was XP. Bizarro , yes?
> >
> > Dylan
>
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
From tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org Wed May 19 23:17:15 2010
From: tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org (Tweeks)
Date: Wed May 19 23:17:23 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] High Paying Linux(RHEL)/Solaris/BSD Sendmail System
Engineer Position in Silicon Valley
Message-ID: <201005192317.15968.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
A recruiter contacted me for a Silicon Valley Linux/UNIX Senior Engineer
position at a "well known Internet company" for very good pay (even for SV).
It's a temp to hire position, but sounds like it's worth it for anyone who
doesn't mind living in Southern CA and risking a temp-to hire position. I can
not disclose the hiring company on list.
Below are the requirements. If interested, contact me with a PDF resume for
more info (serious, qualified inquiries only please):
---------------------------------------------------------------
Environment:
FreeBSD
RedHat
Solaris
RSA
RHEL
Sendmail (strong - here are the Sendmail questions they're asking in the
interview)
1. Describe your largest sendmail deployment including how
redundancy, load balancing, and DoS mitigation was implemented.
2. Describe any milters that you have worked with or written.
3. Describe any custom sendmail binaries that you have created
and include details about what was custom.
Here's the job description:
Senior Unix Systems Engineer
MUST HAVES:
Strong SendMail Experience
FreeBSD
RSA
RedHat and Solaris
This position has been split into two positions - Perl and Sympa experience
are no longer required!
DESCRIPTION
This position requires an individual who is well versed in UNIX/LINUX. The
ideal candidate must enjoy working in a dynamic setting, with a unique
ability to effectively juggle multiple high priority challenges. The Senior
Unix Systems Engineer is responsible for the creation and maintenance of UNIX
servers and desktops that support all the Business efforts of the Company.
This position will also be responsible for interfacing with various levels of
the business; he/she will be required to assist other team members with
projects as necessary.
Engineering & Administration
* Develop and present proposals and technical solutions to management
* Technically oversees and administers UNIX/LINUX Systems environment and
interoperability with Windows
* Monitors multiple operating systems [UNIX/ Linux]
* Monitors UNIX based Incident(s) and problem queues daily
* Responsible for resolving complex challenges in a timely manner
* Support all development efforts by various development groups
* Develop and produce daily, weekly, monthly and annual system reporting for
all UNIX servers
Qualifications/Skills
* Ability to solve highly complex problems spanning multiple technologies and
disciplines
* Require in-depth knowledge of high availability technologies
* Capacity to learn and gain a high level understanding of multiple
technologies
* Out of hours and weekend working will be necessary
* UNIX Scripting (Shell Scripting and PERL Programming Skills)
Business Partnership
Create business solutions/partnership by working with internal and external
staff to ensure company success
Experience
- Expertise with Solaris, RHEL, FreeBSD System Administration (7-10 yrs)
- Expertise with SendMail (MUST HAVE)
- Expertise with SUN/Oracle hardware architecture, troubleshooting and
diagnostics
- Sympa experience
- Solid understanding of RAID and fiber channel storage
- UNIX/LINUX Security Experience is a MUST
- Preferred * Business Continuity & Disaster Recovery Skills
- Preferred * UNIX Performance Tuning
Certifications: Solaris, Red Hat UNIX/LINUX, etc. not necessary but a plus.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Heh.. and NO.. this is not Rackspace.. ;)
Tweeks
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Thu May 20 02:14:02 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Thu May 20 02:13:48 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Switch Mode Power Supply Design Software
Message-ID: <4BF4E13A.40307@gmail.com>
Anybody have any knowledge of an open source, switch-mode power supply
design tool? I was sitting down one day, crunching the numbers on a
buck converter design's power transformer and thought it might be nice,
given the iterative nature of power supply design and the relative
standardization of switch mode design principles, to have a design tool
that took the desired power supply parameters and crunched all the
numbers for you. Perhaps, even afterwards, generating scripts for
simulating in gnucap or ngspice and analyzing in sage/octave for
verification purposes.
If there isn't, I'm thinking about generating my own. But, I wanted to
check with you guys before re-inventing any wheels. Plus, I don't
believe that this will be a trivial exercise given the broad choices of
design conditions.
pcdls
From nathan at gvtc.com Thu May 20 08:11:35 2010
From: nathan at gvtc.com (Nathan Oxhandler)
Date: Thu May 20 08:11:40 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Computer Show
In-Reply-To:
Message-ID: <1280832465.515663.1274361095487.JavaMail.root@md02.emerald.synacor.com>
Reminder that the Computer show is Saturday the 22nd at Live Oak Civic Center. We should have at least two tables. We need to be operational by 9AM.
Before I forget, who has the two green table clothes?
If you have a system that has virtualization software on it, that is what we would like to show off.
Even if you are not able to help out at the booth, stop by and spend some money with some of the vendors at the show. Remember they make our FREE booth possible.
If any one is good with Debian, I need help getting the proper drivers for my WIFI card found and installed. Once that is done I have a 32 Gig partition on my laptop that we can use for a second install of Debian and add Virtual Box to it.
Nathan
From mayfield_mark at att.net Thu May 20 14:25:29 2010
From: mayfield_mark at att.net (mark)
Date: Thu May 20 14:25:31 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Computer Show
In-Reply-To: <1280832465.515663.1274361095487.JavaMail.root@md02.emerald.synacor.com>
References: <1280832465.515663.1274361095487.JavaMail.root@md02.emerald.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <1274383529.5199.0.camel@grim-desktop>
whats the make, model and version of the wireless card?
On Thu, 2010-05-20 at 09:11 -0400, Nathan Oxhandler wrote:
> Reminder that the Computer show is Saturday the 22nd at Live Oak Civic Center. We should have at least two tables. We need to be operational by 9AM.
>
> Before I forget, who has the two green table clothes?
>
> If you have a system that has virtualization software on it, that is what we would like to show off.
>
> Even if you are not able to help out at the booth, stop by and spend some money with some of the vendors at the show. Remember they make our FREE booth possible.
>
> If any one is good with Debian, I need help getting the proper drivers for my WIFI card found and installed. Once that is done I have a 32 Gig partition on my laptop that we can use for a second install of Debian and add Virtual Box to it.
>
> Nathan
From nathan at gvtc.com Thu May 20 16:05:27 2010
From: nathan at gvtc.com (Nathan Oxhandler)
Date: Thu May 20 16:05:28 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Was Computer Show, Now Wireless Card
In-Reply-To: <1274383529.5199.0.camel@grim-desktop>
Message-ID: <1678593576.528734.1274389527386.JavaMail.root@md02.emerald.synacor.com>
The wireless cards is a Broadcom 43xx series in an HP zv6100 Pavilion. There is an 'error' message in the start up, but I have not looked at the detailed information it gives. I know I do not know enough to do anything on my own about it.
Nathan
From mayfield_mark at att.net Thu May 20 18:14:58 2010
From: mayfield_mark at att.net (mark)
Date: Thu May 20 18:15:00 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Was Computer Show, Now Wireless Card
In-Reply-To: <1678593576.528734.1274389527386.JavaMail.root@md02.emerald.synacor.com>
References: <1678593576.528734.1274389527386.JavaMail.root@md02.emerald.synacor.com>
Message-ID: <1274397298.2245.2.camel@grim-desktop>
You most likely need to get the firmware for it. It probably tells you
if you look in the messages, sudo less /var/log/messages | grep
firmware.
take a look at this link, it tells you what to do
http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/b43
On Thu, 2010-05-20 at 17:05 -0400, Nathan Oxhandler wrote:
> The wireless cards is a Broadcom 43xx series in an HP zv6100 Pavilion. There is an 'error' message in the start up, but I have not looked at the detailed information it gives. I know I do not know enough to do anything on my own about it.
>
> Nathan
From satlug at sbcglobal.net Thu May 20 19:49:28 2010
From: satlug at sbcglobal.net (Don Wright)
Date: Thu May 20 19:49:33 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Was Computer Show, Now Wireless Card
In-Reply-To: <1274397298.2245.2.camel@grim-desktop>
References: <1678593576.528734.1274389527386.JavaMail.root@md02.emerald.synacor.com>
<1274397298.2245.2.camel@grim-desktop>
Message-ID:
And the Debian-specific instructions are here:
http://wiki.debian.org/bcm43xx
mark wrote:
>You most likely need to get the firmware for it. It probably tells you
>if you look in the messages, sudo less /var/log/messages | grep
>firmware.
>
>take a look at this link, it tells you what to do
>http://wireless.kernel.org/en/users/Drivers/b43
>
>On Thu, 2010-05-20 at 17:05 -0400, Nathan Oxhandler wrote:
>> The wireless cards is a Broadcom 43xx series in an HP zv6100 Pavilion. There is an 'error' message in the start up, but I have not looked at the detailed information it gives. I know I do not know enough to do anything on my own about it.
>>
>> Nathan
--
Be well - or at least have interesting symptoms!
From nathan at gvtc.com Thu May 20 20:16:11 2010
From: nathan at gvtc.com (Nathan Oxhandler)
Date: Thu May 20 20:16:12 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Was Computer Show, Now Wireless Card
In-Reply-To: <1274397298.2245.2.camel@grim-desktop>
Message-ID: <58459676.534510.1274404571289.JavaMail.root@md02.emerald.synacor.com>
/var/log/messages
Showed the system requesting the 43 driver, but did not show the error message that shows during booting. Will look at the problem at the show with someone that can do better them me.
Nathan
From hc at lookcee.com Thu May 20 21:30:06 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Thu May 20 21:30:09 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF3E1F5.2080307@shlrm.org>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF3E1F5.2080307@shlrm.org>
Message-ID: <4BF5F02E.2030306@lookcee.com>
David Kowis wrote:
> On 5/18/2010 4:06 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
>> http://panopticlick.eff.org/
>>
>> At least for me:
>>
>> "Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 937,511 tested
>> so far."
>
> Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 977,650 tested
> so far.
>
> This is in firefox on windows. I'm wondering if perhaps this isn't
> really as dramatic as it used to be. It includes things like Screen Size
> and color Depth, the plugins I've got, and what fonts are installed.
> It's entirely possible that most everyone will be unique, unless you're
> a windows internet exploder user, and you never changed your resolution
> from the default when you bought your laptop from Worst Buy.
>
> David
David this over my head ... sooo I pose a simple question to this list...
Does Goog have the potential to become a tyrants right hand or not? U
plainly see that since they place false ads with no discrimination they can
be dangerous to our already embattled civil rights?
Main ? Could Goog move into a pawn position of the damn thieves that are
currently wrecking our lives? What moves can be made to stop them if they
become evil.
I see this as a puzzle and I cannot yet solve it cause there is no clear
picture, please enlighten.
hh
From mayfield_mark at att.net Thu May 20 21:39:06 2010
From: mayfield_mark at att.net (mark)
Date: Thu May 20 21:39:17 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF5F02E.2030306@lookcee.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF3E1F5.2080307@shlrm.org>
<4BF5F02E.2030306@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <1274409547.2825.6.camel@fedora-laptop>
As far as tracking through browsers I don't think its that big of a
deal. After all you can change your browser and your operating system. I
find trusted computing and the trusted platform modules a much more
troublesome proposition. It's got a history, the Paladium chip was an
early version and when Intel tried to get identification numbers
embedded into their CPU's. The idea is that it is a hardware based
identification method that "cannot be altered", even by the owner of the
hardware. As well as tracking computers, they can also be used to
control what software is allowed to run on a machine and whether or not
you are granted access into a network, or the Internet.
On Thu, 2010-05-20 at 21:30 -0500, Herb Cee wrote:
> David Kowis wrote:
> > On 5/18/2010 4:06 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> >> http://panopticlick.eff.org/
> >>
> >> At least for me:
> >>
> >> "Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 937,511 tested
> >> so far."
> >
> > Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 977,650 tested
> > so far.
> >
> > This is in firefox on windows. I'm wondering if perhaps this isn't
> > really as dramatic as it used to be. It includes things like Screen Size
> > and color Depth, the plugins I've got, and what fonts are installed.
> > It's entirely possible that most everyone will be unique, unless you're
> > a windows internet exploder user, and you never changed your resolution
> > from the default when you bought your laptop from Worst Buy.
> >
> > David
>
> David this over my head ... sooo I pose a simple question to this list...
>
> Does Goog have the potential to become a tyrants right hand or not? U
> plainly see that since they place false ads with no discrimination they can
> be dangerous to our already embattled civil rights?
>
> Main ? Could Goog move into a pawn position of the damn thieves that are
> currently wrecking our lives? What moves can be made to stop them if they
> become evil.
>
> I see this as a puzzle and I cannot yet solve it cause there is no clear
> picture, please enlighten.
> hh
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
From hc at lookcee.com Thu May 20 21:42:53 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Thu May 20 21:42:56 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] How trackable is your browser?
In-Reply-To: <4BF5F02E.2030306@lookcee.com>
References: <4BF3014B.3080500@gmail.com> <4BF3E1F5.2080307@shlrm.org>
<4BF5F02E.2030306@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <4BF5F32D.2020407@lookcee.com>
Herb Cee wrote:
> David Kowis wrote:
>> On 5/18/2010 4:06 PM, Bruce Dubbs wrote:
>>> http://panopticlick.eff.org/
>>>
>>> At least for me:
>>>
>>> "Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 937,511 tested
>>> so far."
>>
>> Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 977,650 tested
>> so far.
>>
>> This is in firefox on windows. I'm wondering if perhaps this isn't
>> really as dramatic as it used to be. It includes things like Screen Size
>> and color Depth, the plugins I've got, and what fonts are installed.
>> It's entirely possible that most everyone will be unique, unless you're
>> a windows internet exploder user, and you never changed your resolution
>> from the default when you bought your laptop from Worst Buy.
>>
>> David
>
> David this over my head ... sooo I pose a simple question to this list...
>
> Does Goog have the potential to become a tyrants right hand or not? U
> plainly see that since they place false ads with no discrimination they
> can be dangerous to our already embattled civil rights?
>
> Main ? Could Goog move into a pawn position of the damn thieves that are
> currently wrecking our lives? What moves can be made to stop them if
> they become evil.
>
> I see this as a puzzle and I cannot yet solve it cause there is no clear
> picture, please enlighten.
> hh
Sorry to post to my own post but I followed Bruce suggestions and Goog
still had me targeted for 10/2 AWG roll of wire same danm misleading ads so
no it is not cookies. This is important data.
LOL what is important?
hh
From afcasta at satx.rr.com Fri May 21 06:59:48 2010
From: afcasta at satx.rr.com (Al Castanoli)
Date: Fri May 21 06:59:44 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on the
CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <201005182315.27410.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<201005182315.27410.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Message-ID: <1274443188.14621.5.camel@phrodo>
On Tue, 2010-05-18 at 23:15 -0500, Tweeks wrote:
> I just turn the AC to 69. ;)
>
> I'm a Yankee. I can't take the heat..
Consider yourself fortunate. Most of my co-workers are Canadians. One
of them called the A/C man for repairs the other day because the
temperature in the building had soared to 74 degrees (F).
Al Castanoli
From e2eiod at gmail.com Fri May 21 14:35:46 2010
From: e2eiod at gmail.com (Robert Pearson)
Date: Fri May 21 14:35:49 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] External Drive Shared by Mounting with sshfs - Which Drive
Format - FAT32 or ???
Message-ID:
I am recycling my external disks. They are currently formatted FAT32.
I have never liked FAT32.
Since I no longer do any Production work with Windows, 98% of the
access is from Linux. Primarily Ubuntu 10.04 and PCLinuxOS 2010. Both
of these run the JFS file system.
I plan to use the sshfs procedure for mounting and syncing the drives.
Probably rsync will actually do the sync.
Should I just format these drives with JFS?
Is there something like FAT32 only better to use now?
If I was still using Windows for Production I would probably use NTFS
because Linux has ntfs-3g built in.
Suggestions?
From daniel at rugmonster.org Fri May 21 15:47:42 2010
From: daniel at rugmonster.org (Daniel Givens)
Date: Fri May 21 15:47:48 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] External Drive Shared by Mounting with sshfs - Which
Drive Format - FAT32 or ???
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <23426A7E-C494-4B72-BAA7-91E9F68421B9@rugmonster.org>
On May 21, 2010, at 2:35 PM, Robert Pearson wrote:
> I plan to use the sshfs procedure for mounting and syncing the drives.
> Probably rsync will actually do the sync.
> Should I just format these drives with JFS?
> Is there something like FAT32 only better to use now?
The only reason to use FAT or NTFS is if you want cross platform (Windows, Mac, Linux) support. If you're just doing Linux, then use whatever you're comfortable with. I've been happy with ext4, personally, but whatever floats your boat.
As for sshfs+rsync, there's no need. You can do rsync over ssh like this:
rsync -[various flags] -e ssh /orig/path/ user@host:/dst/path/
In my experience that is faster because it's not doing the additional FUSE stuff on top of the already intensive SSH encryption/decryption. Further, if you're not actually syncing the data and plan on moving it once, just use scp:
scp -R /orig/path/ user@host:/dst/path/
Daniel
From satlug at sbcglobal.net Fri May 21 17:48:43 2010
From: satlug at sbcglobal.net (Don Wright)
Date: Fri May 21 17:48:48 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] External Drive Shared by Mounting with sshfs - Which
Drive Format - FAT32 or ???
In-Reply-To: <23426A7E-C494-4B72-BAA7-91E9F68421B9@rugmonster.org>
References:
<23426A7E-C494-4B72-BAA7-91E9F68421B9@rugmonster.org>
Message-ID:
Daniel Givens wrote:
>The only reason to use FAT or NTFS is if you want cross platform (Windows, Mac, Linux) support.
"Cross platform" in this case means dual-boot or direct attachment of
the drive (as in USB) to the non-Linux system. If you're only sharing it
across the network (with Samba, for example) it doesn't matter much what
the underlying filesystem is. The file sharing system translates as
needed.
See us at the computer show tomorrow. (www.pcshows.com) SATLUG should
have a demo of network file sharing like that. --Don
--
Be well - or at least have interesting symptoms!
From crynosys at grandecom.net Mon May 24 00:26:45 2010
From: crynosys at grandecom.net (Chris)
Date: Mon May 24 00:26:56 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com> <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com>
<86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com>
Message-ID: <4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net>
Don Wright wrote:
> Doug wrote:
>
>> I spoke to CPS about one of those, and their advice was that if there is usually someone
>>home all day then DO NOT have one installed. But if you do get one
and have ANY electronics
>> in use, they should be protected by surge protectors and battery
back ups or UPS with back up.
>> That or kiss them goodbye.
>
> You got a cite from competent authority for that? There's nothing
> electrical that differs in this unit from a standard thermostat. The
> unit just pretends the temperature is a little different than it is. The
> A/C turns on and off EXACTLY THE SAME as with a standard t-stat, so
> where is this magic electronics-destroying monster?
Unless CPS has changed policy, they DO install something out at your
compressor that prevents it from cycling on for 10 to 15 minuets out
of the hour, during high demand periods.
If you actually want to lower your electric bill and increase your homes
comfort level make sure you have at Least 15 inches of insulation
in your attic.
Chris (Solar PV panels are for suckers) Lee
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Sun May 23 20:30:47 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Mon May 24 01:30:53 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation-Hacking/Override info on
the CPS Energy Saver Thermostat?
In-Reply-To: <4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com> <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com> <86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com>
<4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net>
Message-ID: <4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com>
Excellent advice.
pcdls
P.S. love your PV comment in your sign-off. Do PV actually pay off in
the long term, given initial cost, degradation, service and the like?
Doubt it. At least my calculations have indicated it to be
cost-prohibitive in the long term model. Now if I lived in a windy
area, at least I could CNC some replacement parts to a wind turbine as
part of a long term maintenance and repair effort using basic human
ability. I can't exactly develop and maintain a silicon fab lab (or
readily find people to support it) to easily support poly-amorphous
silicon production efforts and switch mode supplies for solar cells
until we pull our heads out of our butts and actually learn to share
this sort of manufacturing information. This is why internal combustion
engines won't go away any time soon. Like Linux, it's established
technology , readily shared and relatively easy to duplicate from a
manufacturing/production standpoint.
Chris wrote:
> Don Wright wrote:
>> Doug wrote:
>>
>>> I spoke to CPS about one of those, and their advice was that if
>>> there is usually someone
> >>home all day then DO NOT have one installed. But if you do get one
> and have ANY electronics
> >> in use, they should be protected by surge protectors and battery
> back ups or UPS with back up.
> >> That or kiss them goodbye.
>>
>> You got a cite from competent authority for that? There's nothing
>> electrical that differs in this unit from a standard thermostat. The
>> unit just pretends the temperature is a little different than it is. The
>> A/C turns on and off EXACTLY THE SAME as with a standard t-stat, so
>> where is this magic electronics-destroying monster?
>
> Unless CPS has changed policy, they DO install something out at your
> compressor that prevents it from cycling on for 10 to 15 minuets out
> of the hour, during high demand periods.
>
> If you actually want to lower your electric bill and increase your
> homes comfort level make sure you have at Least 15 inches of insulation
> in your attic.
>
> Chris (Solar PV panels are for suckers) Lee
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Mon May 24 09:01:48 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Mon May 24 09:01:54 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com>
<201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com>
<86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com>
<4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net> <4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <57701e9f8cf35ecab06474ca58c30e50.squirrel@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
> Excellent advice.
>
> pcdls
>
> P.S. love your PV comment in your sign-off. Do PV actually pay off in
> the long term, given initial cost, degradation, service and the like?
> Doubt it. At least my calculations have indicated it to be
> cost-prohibitive in the long term model. Now if I lived in a windy
> area, at least I could CNC some replacement parts to a wind turbine as
> part of a long term maintenance and repair effort using basic human
> ability. I can't exactly develop and maintain a silicon fab lab (or
> readily find people to support it) to easily support poly-amorphous
> silicon production efforts and switch mode supplies for solar cells
> until we pull our heads out of our butts and actually learn to share
> this sort of manufacturing information. This is why internal combustion
> engines won't go away any time soon. Like Linux, it's established
> technology , readily shared and relatively easy to duplicate from a
> manufacturing/production standpoint.
PV systems require up-front investment, but with the rebates and tax
credits available right now, they are VERY reasonable (my recovery is 6
years to break even, shorter if rates go up, after that its $ in my
pocket).
CPS has its own reasons for subsidizing PV, because they want to avoid
having to build new power plants and very expensive new distribution
infrastructure by reducing the load, so for them it actually pays to give
out rebates.
All of you naysayers are completely ignoring the environmental cost of
burning oil, coal and gas for power production. If you take that into
consideration (as you should!) PVs are a giveaway. But I guess the
prevailing attitude is to come up with excuses why you don't need to give
a shit about global climate crisis and keep denying all scientific
evidence to the contrary. Keep on cranking down the thermostat until you
feel comfortable, keep on driving in your gas-guzzling SUV, and above all,
drill, baby, drill! I never wanted to eat gulf shrimp anyway, and as long
as the environmental impact isn't happening in my back yard I don't see
it.
But heck, it's a free country, so you are entitled to your ways. I just
hope we get a carbon tax soon so you can feel the real cost of this
irresponsibility.
-b.
>
> Chris wrote:
>> Don Wright wrote:
>>> Doug wrote:
>>>
>>>> I spoke to CPS about one of those, and their advice was that if
>>>> there is usually someone
>> >>home all day then DO NOT have one installed. But if you do get one
>> and have ANY electronics
>> >> in use, they should be protected by surge protectors and battery
>> back ups or UPS with back up.
>> >> That or kiss them goodbye.
>>>
>>> You got a cite from competent authority for that? There's nothing
>>> electrical that differs in this unit from a standard thermostat. The
>>> unit just pretends the temperature is a little different than it is.
>>> The
>>> A/C turns on and off EXACTLY THE SAME as with a standard t-stat, so
>>> where is this magic electronics-destroying monster?
>>
>> Unless CPS has changed policy, they DO install something out at your
>> compressor that prevents it from cycling on for 10 to 15 minuets out
>> of the hour, during high demand periods.
>>
>> If you actually want to lower your electric bill and increase your
>> homes comfort level make sure you have at Least 15 inches of insulation
>> in your attic.
>>
>> Chris (Solar PV panels are for suckers) Lee
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
--
Borries Demeler, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
The University of Texas Health Science Center at San Antonio
Dept. of Biochemistry, 7703 Floyd Curl Drive, San Antonio, Texas 78229-3900
Voice: 210-767-3332, Fax: 210-567-4575, Email: demeler@biochem.uthscsa.edu
PLEASE NOTE NEW PHONE NUMBER!
From pjcrux at gmail.com Mon May 24 10:44:29 2010
From: pjcrux at gmail.com (pjcrux@gmail.com)
Date: Mon May 24 10:43:32 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <57701e9f8cf35ecab06474ca58c30e50.squirrel@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org><4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com><201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org><001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com><86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com><4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net>
<4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com><57701e9f8cf35ecab06474ca58c30e50.squirrel@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <1633543987-1274715799-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1228932558-@bda352.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>
Borries,
Agreed! However, one of the things I do not like about the way cps sets up the pv arrays is that you are not allowed to setup a battery cell bank to store excess it all has to go back to the grid. I may be wrong but that's how I interpreted/read the literature.
Cheers!
Peter
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
-----Original Message-----
From: "Borries Demeler"
Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 09:01:48
To: The San Antonio Linux User's Group Mailing List
Subject: Re: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
> Excellent advice.
>
> pcdls
>
> P.S. love your PV comment in your sign-off. Do PV actually pay off in
> the long term, given initial cost, degradation, service and the like?
> Doubt it. At least my calculations have indicated it to be
> cost-prohibitive in the long term model. Now if I lived in a windy
> area, at least I could CNC some replacement parts to a wind turbine as
> part of a long term maintenance and repair effort using basic human
> ability. I can't exactly develop and maintain a silicon fab lab (or
> readily find people to support it) to easily support poly-amorphous
> silicon production efforts and switch mode supplies for solar cells
> until we pull our heads out of our butts and actually learn to share
> this sort of manufacturing information. This is why internal combustion
> engines won't go away any time soon. Like Linux, it's established
> technology , readily shared and relatively easy to duplicate from a
> manufacturing/production standpoint.
PV systems require up-front investment, but with the rebates and tax
credits available right now, they are VERY reasonable (my recovery is 6
years to break even, shorter if rates go up, after that its $ in my
pocket).
CPS has its own reasons for subsidizing PV, because they want to avoid
having to build new power plants and very expensive new distribution
infrastructure by reducing the load, so for them it actually pays to give
out rebates.
All of you naysayers are completely ignoring the environmental cost of
burning oil, coal and gas for power production. If you take that into
consideration (as you should!) PVs are a giveaway. But I guess the
prevailing attitude is to come up with excuses why you don't need to give
a shit about global climate crisis and keep denying all scientific
evidence to the contrary. Keep on cranking down the thermostat until you
feel comfortable, keep on driving in your gas-guzzling SUV, and above all,
drill, baby, drill! I never wanted to eat gulf shrimp anyway, and as long
as the environmental impact isn't happening in my back yard I don't see
it.
But heck, it's a free country, so you are entitled to your ways. I just
hope we get a carbon tax soon so you can feel the real cost of this
irresponsibility.
-b.
>
> Chris wrote:
>> Don Wright wrote:
>>> Doug wrote:
>>>
>>>> I spoke to CPS about one of those, and their advice was that if
>>>> there is usually someone
>> >>home all day then DO NOT have one installed. But if you do get one
>> and have ANY electronics
>> >> in use, they should be protected by surge protectors and battery
>> back ups or UPS with back up.
>> >> That or kiss them goodbye.
>>>
>>> You got a cite from competent authority for that? There's nothing
>>> electrical that differs in this unit from a standard thermostat. The
>>> unit just pretends the temperature is a little different than it is.
>>> The
>>> A/C turns on and off EXACTLY THE SAME as with a standard t-stat, so
>>> where is this magic electronics-destroying monster?
>>
>> Unless CPS has changed policy, they DO install something out at your
>> compressor that prevents it from cycling on for 10 to 15 minuets out
>> of the hour, during high demand periods.
>>
>> If you actually want to lower your electric bill and increase your
>> homes comfort level make sure you have at Least 15 inches of insulation
>> in your attic.
>>
>> Chris (Solar PV panels are for suckers) Lee
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>
--
Borries Demeler, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
The University of Texas Health Science Center at San Antonio
Dept. of Biochemistry, 7703 Floyd Curl Drive, San Antonio, Texas 78229-3900
Voice: 210-767-3332, Fax: 210-567-4575, Email: demeler@biochem.uthscsa.edu
PLEASE NOTE NEW PHONE NUMBER!
--
_______________________________________________
SATLUG mailing list
SATLUG@satlug.org
http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Mon May 24 10:49:56 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Mon May 24 10:49:59 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <1633543987-1274715799-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1228932558-@bda352.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>
Message-ID: <201005241549.o4OFnugK000680@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
> Borries,
> Agreed! However, one of the things I do not like about the way cps sets up the pv
> arrays is that you are not allowed to setup a battery cell bank to store excess it
> all has to go back to the grid. I may be wrong but that's how I interpreted/read the
> literature.
>
> Cheers!
>
> Peter
> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
>
>
Actually, I didn't have CPS install the grid, they don't do that. You get an installer
that is approved by CPS. There is a wide range of contractors to choose from. My installer
offered to install a battery backup unit, so I know it it definitely an option. In fact,
I know several people did that in case of power outages so they can continue to run. And
yes, you can use it to store excess power, but it is more costly to do that than
to simply feed it back into the grid, since then you don't have to pay for the storage
of it, but the meter essentially turns backwards, and every kwh you feed back into the
system you can get back for free later (say at night when there is no solar power, or
in the winter, when there is less light). So I think you misread the rules, or they
are not stated clearly. It is definitely allowed to connect a battery backup.
-b.
From bruce.dubbs at gmail.com Mon May 24 11:17:30 2010
From: bruce.dubbs at gmail.com (Bruce Dubbs)
Date: Mon May 24 11:17:36 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <201005241549.o4OFnugK000680@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005241549.o4OFnugK000680@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BFAA69A.1010309@gmail.com>
Borries Demeler wrote:
> Actually, I didn't have CPS install the grid, they don't do that. You get an installer
> that is approved by CPS. There is a wide range of contractors to choose from. My installer
> offered to install a battery backup unit, so I know it it definitely an option. In fact,
> I know several people did that in case of power outages so they can continue to run. And
> yes, you can use it to store excess power, but it is more costly to do that than
> to simply feed it back into the grid, since then you don't have to pay for the storage
> of it, but the meter essentially turns backwards, and every kwh you feed back into the
> system you can get back for free later (say at night when there is no solar power, or
> in the winter, when there is less light). So I think you misread the rules, or they
> are not stated clearly. It is definitely allowed to connect a battery backup.
I'd have a couple of concerns. I wonder what the failure rate for the
panels would be. Is there maintenance required? Are there homeowners
association rules that would limit installation? What are the effects
on the appearance of the house? How do trees that shade the house
affect the economics of the effort?
That said, I do wonder about the issue of global warming in general. I
don't doubt that it is happening, but historical investigation has shown
that the world has been warmer than it is now and 10000 years ago it was
certainly a lot colder. Someone from 10K years ago would think that
we've already had a lot of global warming since then.
http://longrangeweather.com/images/GTEMPS.gif
I don't know about the accuracy of the above graph, but I suspect that
volcanic eruptions and solar output have a lot more influence on global
temperature than carbon emissions.
-- Bruce
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Mon May 24 11:54:55 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Mon May 24 11:54:58 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <4BFAA69A.1010309@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201005241654.o4OGstkn009509@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
>
> Borries Demeler wrote:
>
> > Actually, I didn't have CPS install the grid, they don't do that. You get an installer
> > that is approved by CPS. There is a wide range of contractors to choose from. My installer
> > offered to install a battery backup unit, so I know it it definitely an option. In fact,
> > I know several people did that in case of power outages so they can continue to run. And
> > yes, you can use it to store excess power, but it is more costly to do that than
> > to simply feed it back into the grid, since then you don't have to pay for the storage
> > of it, but the meter essentially turns backwards, and every kwh you feed back into the
> > system you can get back for free later (say at night when there is no solar power, or
> > in the winter, when there is less light). So I think you misread the rules, or they
> > are not stated clearly. It is definitely allowed to connect a battery backup.
>
> I'd have a couple of concerns. I wonder what the failure rate for the
> panels would be.
Mine came with 25 year warranty parts and labor, way beyond the
amortization period.
> Is there maintenance required?
Yes, when you have a bunch of oak pollen in the air you need to spray them off
periodically if you want to have peak performance.
> Are there homeowners
> association rules that would limit installation?
Yes, there are actually HOAs that would deny homeowners to install PV
systems (hard to believe, but true). Check with your HOA, and push them
to adopt an environmentally progressive attitude. I sent mine a letter
with the plans asking for permission to install them and it was granted
without objections. In my neigborhood I would have to do the same if
I wanted to install a backyard deck. The way I proposed to build them
(on the roof) there was no limitation in my HOA.
> What are the effects
> on the appearance of the house?
>From the street it is hard to see, if you install flat on the roof it looks like
a skywindow, except bluish-black.
> How do trees that shade the house
> affect the economics of the effort?
CPS won't approve a rebate for a system that is north-facing or shaded
by trees by a certain percentage. There has to be a minimum exposure
(I think 6 hours unobstructed on Dec. 21st). It is easy to get that by
installing panels tilted to the south or horizontally.
> That said, I do wonder about the issue of global warming in general. I
> don't doubt that it is happening, but historical investigation has shown
> that the world has been warmer than it is now and 10000 years ago it was
> certainly a lot colder. Someone from 10K years ago would think that
> we've already had a lot of global warming since then.
>
> http://longrangeweather.com/images/GTEMPS.gif
>
> I don't know about the accuracy of the above graph, but I suspect that
> volcanic eruptions and solar output have a lot more influence on global
> temperature than carbon emissions.
Global warming is a misnomer. Climate crisis is much more accurate. Some
changes in climate actually cause large scale global shifts that produce
climate in certain regions and locally to actually become colder. Some
effects are drastic, for example, forest kills in the northwest by pine
bark beetles that survive because it doesn't get cold enough anymore
and have already killed huge swaths of forests in the northwest, which
are now dangerously prone to wildfire with all the dead trees. As you
can imagine, these effects amplify the subtle climate effects from CO2
emission to a crisis level in these areas. Also, slight rises in ocean
levels from ice melts (overwhelming evidence that this is man-made)
can wipe out entire low lying shoreline and islands.
Extended drought conditions, increasing intensity of hurricanes, warming
and acidification of oceans due to CO2 and the ecotope and microclimate
changes caused by this, etc., there is an abundance of evidence. I could
go on forever...
It's definitely man made, and it is definitely serious. To keep denying
it is to ignore scientific evidence.
-b.
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Mon May 24 14:25:45 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Mon May 24 14:30:52 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <57701e9f8cf35ecab06474ca58c30e50.squirrel@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com> <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com> <86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com> <4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net>
<4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com>
<57701e9f8cf35ecab06474ca58c30e50.squirrel@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BFAD2B9.7010803@gmail.com>
Borries,
Anybody ever consider the environmental costs of semiconductor
production? The entire process is wrought with chemicals and poisons
that also occasionally escape into the environment. Cursing us with
the pain of a potential tax is no way to endear oneself to those of us
sitting on the fence. As for this carbon tax, do you really trust the
people who want to administer it?
Besides, my point was not to nay-say, but to point out the importance of
disseminating the information needed to support this form of technology
with a broad spectrum of providers. Until this information gets into
the hands of the rest of us mundanes, then we are at the mercy of those
who say they want to "save" us. Tax manipulations, rebates and
emotion-fueled rhetoric will not convince me of this technology's
legitimacy as a "primary" source of power. But, I do believe that it
has a place as an "alternative" source of power to supplement what we
currently have.
I want to see a peaceful, technologically advanced and technologically
enhanced society with a clean environment as much as the next guy; but,
the throw-the-baby-out-with-the-bathwater politics of environmentalists
tends to be counter-productive. If environmentalists want a sympathetic
ear, they need to promote economic balance and a more open,
information-based society to stimulate well-informed and productive
dialog. To be fair, we should all be promoting "open" information for
it is not the responsibility of any one group but the responsibility of
our entire human race (if we expect to get anywhere). Our current
political climate doesn't exactly make this easy.
pcdls
Borries Demeler wrote:
>> Excellent advice.
>>
>> pcdls
>>
>> P.S. love your PV comment in your sign-off. Do PV actually pay off in
>> the long term, given initial cost, degradation, service and the like?
>> Doubt it. At least my calculations have indicated it to be
>> cost-prohibitive in the long term model. Now if I lived in a windy
>> area, at least I could CNC some replacement parts to a wind turbine as
>> part of a long term maintenance and repair effort using basic human
>> ability. I can't exactly develop and maintain a silicon fab lab (or
>> readily find people to support it) to easily support poly-amorphous
>> silicon production efforts and switch mode supplies for solar cells
>> until we pull our heads out of our butts and actually learn to share
>> this sort of manufacturing information. This is why internal combustion
>> engines won't go away any time soon. Like Linux, it's established
>> technology , readily shared and relatively easy to duplicate from a
>> manufacturing/production standpoint.
>>
>
> PV systems require up-front investment, but with the rebates and tax
> credits available right now, they are VERY reasonable (my recovery is 6
> years to break even, shorter if rates go up, after that its $ in my
> pocket).
>
> CPS has its own reasons for subsidizing PV, because they want to avoid
> having to build new power plants and very expensive new distribution
> infrastructure by reducing the load, so for them it actually pays to give
> out rebates.
>
> All of you naysayers are completely ignoring the environmental cost of
> burning oil, coal and gas for power production. If you take that into
> consideration (as you should!) PVs are a giveaway. But I guess the
> prevailing attitude is to come up with excuses why you don't need to give
> a shit about global climate crisis and keep denying all scientific
> evidence to the contrary. Keep on cranking down the thermostat until you
> feel comfortable, keep on driving in your gas-guzzling SUV, and above all,
> drill, baby, drill! I never wanted to eat gulf shrimp anyway, and as long
> as the environmental impact isn't happening in my back yard I don't see
> it.
> But heck, it's a free country, so you are entitled to your ways. I just
> hope we get a carbon tax soon so you can feel the real cost of this
> irresponsibility.
> -b.
>
>> Chris wrote:
>>
>>> Don Wright wrote:
>>>
>>>> Doug wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I spoke to CPS about one of those, and their advice was that if
>>>>> there is usually someone
>>>>> home all day then DO NOT have one installed. But if you do get one
>>>>>
>>> and have ANY electronics
>>>
>>>>> in use, they should be protected by surge protectors and battery
>>>>>
>>> back ups or UPS with back up.
>>>
>>>>> That or kiss them goodbye.
>>>>>
>>>> You got a cite from competent authority for that? There's nothing
>>>> electrical that differs in this unit from a standard thermostat. The
>>>> unit just pretends the temperature is a little different than it is.
>>>> The
>>>> A/C turns on and off EXACTLY THE SAME as with a standard t-stat, so
>>>> where is this magic electronics-destroying monster?
>>>>
>>> Unless CPS has changed policy, they DO install something out at your
>>> compressor that prevents it from cycling on for 10 to 15 minuets out
>>> of the hour, during high demand periods.
>>>
>>> If you actually want to lower your electric bill and increase your
>>> homes comfort level make sure you have at Least 15 inches of insulation
>>> in your attic.
>>>
>>> Chris (Solar PV panels are for suckers) Lee
>>>
>> --
>> _______________________________________________
>> SATLUG mailing list
>> SATLUG@satlug.org
>> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
>> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
>>
>>
>
>
>
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Mon May 24 14:51:42 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Mon May 24 14:51:44 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <4BFAD2B9.7010803@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
>
> Borries,
>
> Anybody ever consider the environmental costs of semiconductor
> production?
Your point is well taken, but it is no worse than other forms of
manufacturing and need to be dealt with appropriately. There are
regulations in place to handle this, although they are not always
enforced. There are no regulations to control CO2 emissions, and
that's a problem.
> The entire process is wrought with chemicals and poisons
> that also occasionally escape into the environment. Cursing us with
> the pain of a potential tax is no way to endear oneself to those of us
> sitting on the fence. As for this carbon tax, do you really trust the
> people who want to administer it?
The equilibrium needs to be shifted. If you charge a gasoline tax, you
need to benefit the payers of the tax, i.e., by researching better battery
technology and more efficient vehicles. If you charge a tax on home
heating oil, the funds should be given to homeowners to renovate their
houses and make them more efficient. This must be done transparently.
If you have a better system, I'd like to hear about it.
> Besides, my point was not to nay-say, but to point out the importance of
> disseminating the information needed to support this form of technology
> with a broad spectrum of providers.
Sorry, I misunderstood you, but I agree with you on this.
> Until this information gets into
> the hands of the rest of us mundanes, then we are at the mercy of those
> who say they want to "save" us. Tax manipulations, rebates and
> emotion-fueled rhetoric will not convince me of this technology's
> legitimacy as a "primary" source of power. But, I do believe that it
> has a place as an "alternative" source of power to supplement what we
> currently have.
Ok, maybe I have a bit more pioneer spirit and I must say I also have
done the research proactively to find out about this technology. So I
took the dive and must say I am VERY pleased with the results. I invite
anyone who wants to see it to come to my house, I'd be happy to show you
everything, including my powerbills.
> I want to see a peaceful, technologically advanced and technologically
> enhanced society with a clean environment as much as the next guy; but,
> the throw-the-baby-out-with-the-bathwater politics of environmentalists
> tends to be counter-productive. If environmentalists want a sympathetic
> ear, they need to promote economic balance and a more open,
> information-based society to stimulate well-informed and productive
> dialog.
There is nothing wrong with demanding "economic balance and a more open,
information-based society to stimulate well-informed and productive
dialog." I am not sure how advocating clean energy is somehow counter
to that concept.
> To be fair, we should all be promoting "open" information for
> it is not the responsibility of any one group but the responsibility of
> our entire human race (if we expect to get anywhere). Our current
> political climate doesn't exactly make this easy.
Again, I agree wholeheartedly. The information is out there, while there
may be outlets that hype this or that technology, based on my research
solar technology here in South Texas makes a lot of sense, I certainly
don't regret for a minute I installed that system on my house. I mean, it
is hard to argue with $0 powerbills (actually, $7, since there is a
meter rental charge).
Let me know if you have any specific questions, I'd be happy to answer
what I can.
-b.
From ftm at satx.rr.com Tue May 25 09:09:22 2010
From: ftm at satx.rr.com (Doug)
Date: Tue May 25 09:09:34 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
If one has been keeping up with the news, even Al Gore has now reversed
himself on the effects of CO2 emissions and is now agreeing that current
levels are having no effect on climate change or global warming, and that
natural disasters worldwide, especially the production of volcanic activity
is the major cause, and that the Sun's cycles and the wobbly orbit of our
planet is the cause of the wide cycles in the earth's weather patterns.
Keep watch on the effects over time from the ash production of the Icelandic
volcano. There will be a cooling.
That now being revealed hopefully many of the environmentalists can now
return to their day jobs.
Doug.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Borries Demeler"
To:
Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 2:51 PM
Subject: Re: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Tue May 25 09:18:11 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Tue May 25 09:18:16 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
Message-ID: <201005251418.o4PEIBu7011347@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
>
> If one has been keeping up with the news, even Al Gore has now reversed
> himself on the effects of CO2 emissions and is now agreeing that current
> levels are having no effect on climate change or global warming, and that
> natural disasters worldwide, especially the production of volcanic activity
> is the major cause, and that the Sun's cycles and the wobbly orbit of our
> planet is the cause of the wide cycles in the earth's weather patterns.
> Keep watch on the effects over time from the ash production of the Icelandic
> volcano. There will be a cooling.
If you think this is anything but misinformation, at least provide references
for your claims. Where does Al Gore say any of this? One look on his website
shows you that he says exactly the opposite, the upshot of which is:
Man made CO2 emissions cause global warming.
Nothing else, period.
-b.
From j at jvpappas.net Tue May 25 10:00:34 2010
From: j at jvpappas.net (John Pappas)
Date: Tue May 25 10:00:37 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <201005251418.o4PEIBu7011347@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
<201005251418.o4PEIBu7011347@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID:
On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 10:18, Borries Demeler
wrote:
> >
> > If one has been keeping up with the news, even Al Gore has now reversed
> > himself on the effects of CO2 emissions and is now agreeing that current
> > levels are having no effect on climate change or global warming, and that
> > natural disasters worldwide, especially the production of volcanic
> activity
> > is the major cause, and that the Sun's cycles and the wobbly orbit of our
> > planet is the cause of the wide cycles in the earth's weather patterns.
> > Keep watch on the effects over time from the ash production of the
> Icelandic
> > volcano. There will be a cooling.
>
> If you think this is anything but misinformation, at least provide
> references
> for your claims. Where does Al Gore say any of this? One look on his
> website
> shows you that he says exactly the opposite, the upshot of which is:
>
> Man made CO2 emissions cause global warming.
>
I usually don't get involved in these discussions as I do not have enough
authoritative info to be useful; but I will put forward some thoughts, and
see what feedback I get:
1. How many barrels of oil/tons of coal/CF NG a day are consumed per day
world wide?
2. Of those, what percentage is used for electrical/motive power (burned,
not part of a different chemical process like making plastic)?
3. How many BTU's does all of that burning produce per day?
4. Where does the heat of combustion go, nevermind the CO2 (Law of
conservation of energy)?
I cannot fathom how even a massive volcano, wildfires, and other natural
processes can match the day-after-day fire that is burning all that fuel.
How can we say that a fire of that magnitude would have no effect on our
planet?
Thanks,
John
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Tue May 25 10:15:40 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Tue May 25 10:15:44 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To:
Message-ID: <201005251515.o4PFFeiw016172@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
> I usually don't get involved in these discussions as I do not have enough
> authoritative info to be useful; but I will put forward some thoughts, and
> see what feedback I get:
>
> 1. How many barrels of oil/tons of coal/CF NG a day are consumed per day
> world wide?
> 2. Of those, what percentage is used for electrical/motive power (burned,
> not part of a different chemical process like making plastic)?
> 3. How many BTU's does all of that burning produce per day?
> 4. Where does the heat of combustion go, nevermind the CO2 (Law of
> conservation of energy)?
>
> I cannot fathom how even a massive volcano, wildfires, and other natural
> processes can match the day-after-day fire that is burning all that fuel.
> How can we say that a fire of that magnitude would have no effect on our
> planet?
Finally some rational thought. Here is a statistic from wikipedia that
comes close to what you want to know:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:World_Energy_consumption.png
(This graphs shows world-wide energy usage in terawatts (10^12 watts).
1 terawatt = 3.41 teraBTU
BTW, volcanos do not get their power from burning fossil fuels. Their
biggest environmental impact is the particulate they spew into the air.
(See recent airspace closures in Europe).
-b.
From bruce.dubbs at gmail.com Tue May 25 10:36:03 2010
From: bruce.dubbs at gmail.com (Bruce Dubbs)
Date: Tue May 25 10:36:09 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
Message-ID: <4BFBEE63.4010700@gmail.com>
Doug wrote:
> If one has been keeping up with the news, even Al Gore has now reversed
> himself
Now there's a technical source.
-- Bruce
From lgj at usenix.org Tue May 25 12:19:52 2010
From: lgj at usenix.org (Lionel Garth Jones)
Date: Tue May 25 12:19:54 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] USENIX WebApps '10 Registration Now Open
Message-ID: <9E446198-D3D7-4761-9061-20DE10F3EDF1@usenix.org>
You're invited to join us in Boston, June 23-24, 2010, for the first
USENIX Conference on Web Application Development. WebApps '10 is a new
technical conference designed to bring together experts in all aspects
of developing and deploying Web applications.
Web-based applications are revolutionizing both the features that can be
delivered and the technologies for developing and deploying
applications. They also involve a diverse collection of issues and
technologies. Take advantage of this new opportunity for interaction and
synergy across these areas.
The program includes:
* Invited talks by industry leaders including Adam de Boor, Google, on
"Gmail: Past, Present, and Future"
* Refereed papers on a variety of topics such as new approaches to
Web frameworks, techniques for giving users control over their Web
data, better ways of managing Ajax and Javascript, and a variety
of security issues ranging from better CAPTCHAs to information flow
tracking.
* A Poster Session and Happy Hour held jointly with USENIX ATC '10.
The poster session provides a great way to let other people know about
your work and to get useful feedback from the community. Submissions are
due on June 13, 2010.
* Work-in-Progress Reports. If you have work you would like to share, a
controversial opinion, or a cool idea that's not quite ready for
publication, submit a WiP by June 13, 2010.
Find out more about the posters and WiPs at:
http://www.usenix.org/events/webapps10/posters_wips.html
WebApps '10 is part of the USENIX Federated Conferences Week. Not only
do you get a 2-day conference program filled with the latest research,
but you'll also have additional opportunities to mingle with colleagues
and leading experts in the combined Birds-of-a-Feather sessions (BoFs)
and at the various evening social events, vendor BoFs, and receptions.
Your WebApps '10 registration gets you into all the ConfWeek events
happening those days: tutorials, talks, workshops--you name it. Plus,
registration packages offer expanded discounts. The more days you
attend, the more you save!
http://www.usenix.org/confweek10
The full WebApps '10 program is available at
http://www.usenix.org/webapps10/proga
Register by June 7, 2010, for the greatest savings.
* Additional registration discounts are available!
Discount types include hardship, government, and non-profit:
http://www.usenix.org/events/confweek10/discounts.html
* Help spread the word!
http://www.usenix.org/events/webapps10/promote.html
I look forward to seeing you in Boston!
Sincerely,
John Ousterhout, Stanford University
WebApps '10 Program Chair
webapps10chair@usenix.org
------------------------------------------------------------------------
USENIX Conference on Web Application Development (WebApps '10)
June 23-24, 2010, Boston, MA
http://www.usenix.org/webapps10/proga
http://www.usenix.org/confweek10
Poster and WiPs Submissions Deadline: May 27, 2010
Early Bird Registration Deadline: June 7, 2010
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From mayfield_mark at att.net Tue May 25 14:07:25 2010
From: mayfield_mark at att.net (mark)
Date: Tue May 25 14:07:27 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
Message-ID: <1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop>
Are you kidding? I don't know why everyone is acting like global warming
is the only problem with pollution. In a family of 5 dogs that we had 3
of them got cancer. We used to let our dogs drink unfiltered tap water.
Since we started filtering our tap water none of our dogs have ever
gotten cancer. I won't let any living creature drink unfiltered tap
water for an extended period of time. Besides cancer there are asthma
and autism which may be at least in part attributed to different kinds
of commercial pollution. People have to be careful how much fish they
eat because of mercury content. Species becoming endangered on a regular
basis some of which can be attributed to commercial under regulation
(pollution and deforestation, sea otters endangered partially because of
oil spills). Anyone that acts like pollution is no big deal and
companies should just be allowed to do whatever they want with the
byproducts of their activities, well I won't event make that comment,
it's obvious.
People that endanger other individuals, especially children can face
criminal charges but companies that endanger entire populations are
protected and respected. Sometimes I am ashamed of myself and my peers.
I'm in awe of the power that money has over people and it's ability to
make people believe things that are completely illogical and sometimes
downright insane.
On Tue, 2010-05-25 at 09:09 -0500, Doug wrote:
> If one has been keeping up with the news, even Al Gore has now reversed
> himself on the effects of CO2 emissions and is now agreeing that current
> levels are having no effect on climate change or global warming, and that
> natural disasters worldwide, especially the production of volcanic activity
> is the major cause, and that the Sun's cycles and the wobbly orbit of our
> planet is the cause of the wide cycles in the earth's weather patterns.
> Keep watch on the effects over time from the ash production of the Icelandic
> volcano. There will be a cooling.
>
> That now being revealed hopefully many of the environmentalists can now
> return to their day jobs.
>
> Doug.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Borries Demeler"
> To:
> Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 2:51 PM
> Subject: Re: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
>
>
From hc at lookcee.com Tue May 25 17:21:31 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Tue May 25 17:21:34 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu> <9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
<1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop>
Message-ID: <4BFC4D6B.1040804@lookcee.com>
mark wrote:
> Are you kidding? I don't know why everyone is acting like global warming
> is the only problem with pollution. In a family of 5 dogs that we had 3
> of them got cancer. We used to let our dogs drink unfiltered tap water.
> Since we started filtering our tap water none of our dogs have ever
> gotten cancer. I won't let any living creature drink unfiltered tap
> water for an extended period of time. Besides cancer there are asthma
> and autism which may be at least in part attributed to different kinds
> of commercial pollution. People have to be careful how much fish they
> eat because of mercury content. Species becoming endangered on a regular
> basis some of which can be attributed to commercial under regulation
> (pollution and deforestation, sea otters endangered partially because of
> oil spills). Anyone that acts like pollution is no big deal and
> companies should just be allowed to do whatever they want with the
> byproducts of their activities, well I won't event make that comment,
> it's obvious.
>
> People that endanger other individuals, especially children can face
> criminal charges but companies that endanger entire populations are
> protected and respected. Sometimes I am ashamed of myself and my peers.
> I'm in awe of the power that money has over people and it's ability to
> make people believe things that are completely illogical and sometimes
> downright insane.
>
> On Tue, 2010-05-25 at 09:09 -0500, Doug wrote:
>> If one has been keeping up with the news, even Al Gore has now reversed
>> himself on the effects of CO2 emissions and is now agreeing that current
>> levels are having no effect on climate change or global warming, and that
>> natural disasters worldwide, especially the production of volcanic activity
>> is the major cause, and that the Sun's cycles and the wobbly orbit of our
>> planet is the cause of the wide cycles in the earth's weather patterns.
>> Keep watch on the effects over time from the ash production of the Icelandic
>> volcano. There will be a cooling.
>>
>> That now being revealed hopefully many of the environmentalists can now
>> return to their day jobs.
>>
>> Doug.
>>
Come on guys knock this off u pushing my buttons big time. However i got my
hands full learning Linux. My 11 acres is clean I will have my own elect
generating unit by next yr i hope... but all I can do is control my own
fences and u will have to do the same.
hh
From mayfield_mark at att.net Tue May 25 19:55:37 2010
From: mayfield_mark at att.net (mark)
Date: Tue May 25 19:55:40 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <4BFC4D6B.1040804@lookcee.com>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
<1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop> <4BFC4D6B.1040804@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <1274835337.14373.17.camel@grim-desktop>
I don't have a problem with what individuals are doing. We just buy
products that are available. I don't agree with the way companies are
allowed to operate in regards to environmental waste that is produced by
their businesses. Comments stating that the environment is not really
important and can't be affected by what we do (humans) is just crazy
talk.
On Tue, 2010-05-25 at 17:21 -0500, Herb Cee wrote:
> mark wrote:
> > Are you kidding? I don't know why everyone is acting like global warming
> > is the only problem with pollution. In a family of 5 dogs that we had 3
> > of them got cancer. We used to let our dogs drink unfiltered tap water.
> > Since we started filtering our tap water none of our dogs have ever
> > gotten cancer. I won't let any living creature drink unfiltered tap
> > water for an extended period of time. Besides cancer there are asthma
> > and autism which may be at least in part attributed to different kinds
> > of commercial pollution. People have to be careful how much fish they
> > eat because of mercury content. Species becoming endangered on a regular
> > basis some of which can be attributed to commercial under regulation
> > (pollution and deforestation, sea otters endangered partially because of
> > oil spills). Anyone that acts like pollution is no big deal and
> > companies should just be allowed to do whatever they want with the
> > byproducts of their activities, well I won't event make that comment,
> > it's obvious.
> >
> > People that endanger other individuals, especially children can face
> > criminal charges but companies that endanger entire populations are
> > protected and respected. Sometimes I am ashamed of myself and my peers.
> > I'm in awe of the power that money has over people and it's ability to
> > make people believe things that are completely illogical and sometimes
> > downright insane.
> >
> > On Tue, 2010-05-25 at 09:09 -0500, Doug wrote:
> >> If one has been keeping up with the news, even Al Gore has now reversed
> >> himself on the effects of CO2 emissions and is now agreeing that current
> >> levels are having no effect on climate change or global warming, and that
> >> natural disasters worldwide, especially the production of volcanic activity
> >> is the major cause, and that the Sun's cycles and the wobbly orbit of our
> >> planet is the cause of the wide cycles in the earth's weather patterns.
> >> Keep watch on the effects over time from the ash production of the Icelandic
> >> volcano. There will be a cooling.
> >>
> >> That now being revealed hopefully many of the environmentalists can now
> >> return to their day jobs.
> >>
> >> Doug.
> >>
>
> Come on guys knock this off u pushing my buttons big time. However i got my
> hands full learning Linux. My 11 acres is clean I will have my own elect
> generating unit by next yr i hope... but all I can do is control my own
> fences and u will have to do the same.
> hh
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> SATLUG mailing list
> SATLUG@satlug.org
> http://alamo.satlug.org/mailman/listinfo/satlug to manage/unsubscribe
> Powered by Rackspace (www.rackspace.com)
From crynosys at grandecom.net Tue May 25 23:44:33 2010
From: crynosys at grandecom.net (Chris)
Date: Tue May 25 23:44:40 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com> <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com> <86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com> <4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net>
<4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4BFCA731.5090700@grandecom.net>
> Do PV actually pay off in
> the long term, given initial cost, degradation, service and the like?
> Doubt it. At least my calculations have indicated it to be
> cost-prohibitive in the long term model.
Current residential PV setups range from 6 to 15 grand. In that price
range you can offset 5 to 20 percent of your CPS bill.
For 3 grand you can upgrade your homes insulation envelope well enough
to cut your total energy bill in half.
So unless your aiming for a net zero energy home the Solar PV panels
are just so much $Eco-Bling$.
Now Solar Thermal for hot water and space heating is a no brain-er.
Depending on how DIY and resourceful you are a Reliable set-up
can be had in the 1 grand range.
The current mission is to keep my mechanical room from resembling
the console of the TARDIS.
Chris (if you just have to blow 10 grand to ease your conscience,
buy a ground source heat-pump.) Lee
From crynosys at grandecom.net Wed May 26 00:31:54 2010
From: crynosys at grandecom.net (Chris)
Date: Wed May 26 00:31:56 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic - now PV
In-Reply-To: <201005251418.o4PEIBu7011347@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005251418.o4PEIBu7011347@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BFCB24A.3080403@grandecom.net>
Borries Demeler wrote:
> Man made CO2 emissions cause global warming.
> Nothing else, period.
Your usually the man in my book but....
The fallout from climate-gate is that IPCC scientists have been proven
to Falsify their data sets, Falsify their results/models and Still
refuse to offer up their data/findings to open peer review.
Oh and lets not forget that NASA oops.
Current climate modeling can't even reliably predict weather 48 hours
into the future.
The folks on the cutting edge of geo-engineering research predict it
will be 30 years before we even have the computing power necessary to
calculate a model that can for-see the effects of global warming.
As for CO2, if you really want to make a difference drop the beef from
your diet. Cow farts are 14 times more potent a Greenhouse gas than CO2.
Chris (I can mitigate the worst effects of global warming for 2 mill a
year and stop a Cat 5 hurricane with a 100 grand.) Lee
From wg5o at sbcglobal.net Wed May 26 10:26:07 2010
From: wg5o at sbcglobal.net (Andrew Pickens)
Date: Wed May 26 10:26:13 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFCA731.5090700@grandecom.net>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com> <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com> <86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com> <4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net> <4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com>
<4BFCA731.5090700@grandecom.net>
Message-ID: <4BFD3D8F.9070907@sbcglobal.net>
Chris wrote:
>> Do PV actually pay off in the long term, given initial cost,
>> degradation, service and the like? Doubt it. At least my
>> calculations have indicated it to be cost-prohibitive in the long
>> term model.
>
> Current residential PV setups range from 6 to 15 grand. In that price
> range you can offset 5 to 20 percent of your CPS bill.
> For 3 grand you can upgrade your homes insulation envelope well enough
> to cut your total energy bill in half.
>
> So unless your aiming for a net zero energy home the Solar PV panels
> are just so much $Eco-Bling$.
>
> Now Solar Thermal for hot water and space heating is a no brain-er.
> Depending on how DIY and resourceful you are a Reliable set-up
> can be had in the 1 grand range.
>
> The current mission is to keep my mechanical room from resembling
> the console of the TARDIS.
>
> Chris (if you just have to blow 10 grand to ease your conscience,
> buy a ground source heat-pump.) Lee
Our 4.86 kW PV system was placed in service a week ago, on 2010/5/19.
So far, it has made about $8 worth of juice, and I can hardly wait for a
sunny day. There is no question that, at full price, PV is not
practical. But, the powers that be have decided to spend our money on
the things, and I figured I might as well get my share. The rational:
With CPS paying about half of the cost, and with the Feds kicking in a
30% TAX CREDIT, at a time when interest rates are unreasonably low, it
became a reasonable investment. It pays in tax free dollars (those
saved), and the return, i.e. the cost of power, is almost guaranteed to
go up.
Andy
>
>
>
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Wed May 26 13:12:53 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Wed May 26 13:12:58 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFCA731.5090700@grandecom.net>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com> <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com> <86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com> <4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net> <4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com>
<4BFCA731.5090700@grandecom.net>
Message-ID: <4BFD64A5.9040900@gmail.com>
> The current mission is to keep my mechanical room from resembling
> the console of the TARDIS.
(/random thought processor activated/)
Hey, as long as it doesn't look like the interior of a Dalek or the
Nestene consciousness, I'd take a TARDIS console any day.
(/random thought processor de-activated/)
From hc at lookcee.com Wed May 26 13:35:59 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Wed May 26 13:36:03 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic - now PV
In-Reply-To: <4BFCB24A.3080403@grandecom.net>
References: <201005251418.o4PEIBu7011347@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<4BFCB24A.3080403@grandecom.net>
Message-ID: <4BFD6A0F.4050904@lookcee.com>
Chris wrote:
>
> Chris (I can mitigate the worst effects of global warming for 2 mill a
> year and stop a Cat 5 hurricane with a 100 grand.) Lee
Could u elaborate this statement?
hh
From crynosys at grandecom.net Wed May 26 19:15:03 2010
From: crynosys at grandecom.net (Chris)
Date: Wed May 26 19:15:05 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic - now geo-engineering
In-Reply-To: <4BFD6A0F.4050904@lookcee.com>
References: <201005251418.o4PEIBu7011347@biochem.uthscsa.edu> <4BFCB24A.3080403@grandecom.net>
<4BFD6A0F.4050904@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <4BFDB987.20404@grandecom.net>
Herb Cee wrote:
> Chris wrote:
>> Chris (I can mitigate the worst effects of global warming for 2 mill a
>> year and stop a Cat 5 hurricane with a 100 grand.) Lee
>
> Could u elaborate this statement?
> hh
Just things learned while watching "planet green" and "Discovery
Science". But the best explanations can be found in the book:
"Super Freakanomics".
Chris (1986 called, They can fix that climate change thing) Lee
From dkowis at shlrm.org Thu May 27 07:47:25 2010
From: dkowis at shlrm.org (David Kowis)
Date: Thu May 27 07:48:58 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFD3D8F.9070907@sbcglobal.net>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com> <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com> <86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com> <4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net> <4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com> <4BFCA731.5090700@grandecom.net>
<4BFD3D8F.9070907@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <4BFE69DD.3040307@shlrm.org>
On 5/26/2010 10:26 AM, Andrew Pickens wrote:
> Our 4.86 kW PV system was placed in service a week ago, on 2010/5/19.
> So far, it has made about $8 worth of juice, and I can hardly wait for a
> sunny day. There is no question that, at full price, PV is not
> practical. But, the powers that be have decided to spend our money on
> the things, and I figured I might as well get my share. The rational:
>
> With CPS paying about half of the cost, and with the Feds kicking in a
> 30% TAX CREDIT, at a time when interest rates are unreasonably low, it
> became a reasonable investment. It pays in tax free dollars (those
> saved), and the return, i.e. the cost of power, is almost guaranteed to
> go up.
Where does CPS get it's money? Where do the Feds get their money?
You'll end up paying for the subsidized items eventually. Rather, all of
us will end up paying for your PV system, whether we want to or not...
David
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Thu May 27 08:06:36 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Thu May 27 08:06:41 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFE69DD.3040307@shlrm.org>
Message-ID: <201005271306.o4RD6aHc020613@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
> Where does CPS get it's money? Where do the Feds get their money?
>
> You'll end up paying for the subsidized items eventually. Rather, all of
> us will end up paying for your PV system, whether we want to or not...
I'd much rather pay for solar panels than for oil-spill cleanups and damage from
climate crisis, and the damage caused by mercury toxification from coal-burning
power plants, not to speak of consequences of CO2 enrichment of the atmosphere.
-b.
From dkowis at shlrm.org Thu May 27 08:45:23 2010
From: dkowis at shlrm.org (David Kowis)
Date: Thu May 27 08:46:56 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <201005271306.o4RD6aHc020613@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005271306.o4RD6aHc020613@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BFE7773.5080702@shlrm.org>
On 5/27/2010 8:06 AM, Borries Demeler wrote:
>> Where does CPS get it's money? Where do the Feds get their money?
>>
>> You'll end up paying for the subsidized items eventually. Rather, all of
>> us will end up paying for your PV system, whether we want to or not...
>
> I'd much rather pay for solar panels than for oil-spill cleanups and damage from
> climate crisis, and the damage caused by mercury toxification from coal-burning
> power plants, not to speak of consequences of CO2 enrichment of the atmosphere.
>
I don't have any right to tell you what you have to do with your money,
and neither should the government. At least when it comes to things not
specifically enumerated as federal powers. (State governments are
governed by their constitutions, and as such people living there will be
subject to different rules.)
I don't think we should have to pay for oil-spill cleanups through
taxes. If the companies were fully responsible for their actions,
perhaps they'd have more incentive not to screw up. Under current
Federal Law, they are only on the hook for $75,000,000. Taxes on barrels
of oil imported to the country are supposed to keep a $1,000,000,000
fund available to have the federal government foot the rest of the bill.
Recently, the democrats tried to pass legislation that would raise the
$75,000,000 to $10,000,000,000 but the republicans blocked it. Now,
legislation has been proposed to quadruple the tax on the oil to raise
the federal government's responsibility to $5,000,000,000. Socialized
risk, privatized reward, and paying off legislators.
As for the supposed consequences of CO2 'enrichment' of the atmosphere:
I cannot accept any climate science that has been published by
scientists that admit to forging the data and basically lying about
their research. Making any laws or legislation fixing a supposed problem
we don't completely understand is only being used as an excuse to get
government to support companies that lobby it by making changes to the
market in their favor.
A few reads:
http://maxedoutmama.blogspot.com/2010/03/under-life-sucks-so-suck-it-up-and-deal.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1250872/Climategate-U-turn-Astonishment-scientist-centre-global-warming-email-row-admits-data-organised.html?ITO=1490
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/-234092--.html
http://blogs.the-american-interest.com/wrm/2010/02/01/the-death-of-global-warming/
http://scragged.com/articles/lies-damned-lies-and-embarrassed-globe-warming-liberals.aspx
http://science.slashdot.org/story/09/12/16/2336239/Russians-Claim-More-Climate-Data-Was-Manipulated
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2009/12/leading-global-warming-crusader-cap-and.html
http://www.lewrockwell.com/rockwell/lost-left-climate-morass136.html
All this being said, I think the best way to protect our environment is
to make individuals responsible for what they do. I can't barf out tons
of nasty black smoke into my back yard because I share the air around my
property with my neighbors. I can't dump gallons of $TOXIC_WASTE into my
back yard because it'll leech into the water supply, which we all share.
If I could ensure that all this would be contained on my property, then
I could do whatever I want.
Making people take responsibility for their actions is the best way to
ensure that they don't ruin things we all share, and they've got
incentive not to ruin things they own, because, well, they own them and
ruining it reduces it's value and usefulness. Unless, of course, they're
building a waste disposal facility with the express purpose of
handling/processing/storing these waste products.
If BP had been on the hook for the entirety of the damages they caused,
might they have done something different? Might there have been better
security/safety at the plant to prevent the explosion in the first place?
Someone mentioned Freakonomics and here's someone else talking about it
too, an interesting read at least: http://mises.org/daily/3825
David
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Thu May 27 14:02:34 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Thu May 27 14:02:36 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFE7773.5080702@shlrm.org>
Message-ID: <201005271902.o4RJ2YqG015997@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
> I don't think we should have to pay for oil-spill cleanups through
> taxes. If the companies were fully responsible for their actions,
> perhaps they'd have more incentive not to screw up. Under current
> Federal Law, they are only on the hook for $75,000,000. Taxes on barrels
> of oil imported to the country are supposed to keep a $1,000,000,000
...and even that is peanuts compared with the environmental and economical
damage caused by the spill. Some birds are threatened by extinction and
will be irretrievably lost. Entire ecosystems will be destroyed by this.
A billion dollars is not going to replace this loss.
> fund available to have the federal government foot the rest of the bill.
> Recently, the democrats tried to pass legislation that would raise the
> $75,000,000 to $10,000,000,000 but the republicans blocked it. Now,
> legislation has been proposed to quadruple the tax on the oil to raise
> the federal government's responsibility to $5,000,000,000. Socialized
> risk, privatized reward, and paying off legislators.
Yes, unfortunately, that's how it goes. Sad, isn't it? But guess what,
individualized greed beats individualized responsibility EVERY TIME!
So if you are counting on the industry to self-police itself (it doesn't
matter if it is the banking or oil and gas or coal industry) dream on.
it's not going to happen. Whether it is the MMS or Lehman Brothers,
or Goldman-Sachs. Lack of government regulation and failure to have
strict enforcement screws us up every time, and the public is left
holding the short end of the stick.
> As for the supposed consequences of CO2 'enrichment' of the atmosphere:
> I cannot accept any climate science that has been published by
> scientists that admit to forging the data and basically lying about
> their research.
Neither can I. Those individuals (to be clear, a small group of climate
scientists) who violated scientific methods and ethics have caused a huge
amount of damage to the field, and with the help of biased media, cast doubt on
the overwhelming majority who conduct sound science investigations.
Exactly what you are doing is now happening repeatedly. The bad apples keep
getting pointed to as to why the entire science must be flawed. Of course,
the vast majority of scientists did not falsify their science, but somehow
the deniers of climate crisis manage over and over to bundle all others
with this sorry bunch who misrepresented their work. Nothing could be
further from the truth, but if you just mention it often enough
(the media does the same, very much to the disservice of the public)
it just must true. I wished people would make a bit of effort to look
beyond this manipulation and figure out what really is going on. The
evidence for man-made climate crisis is overwhelming and undeniable.
> Making any laws or legislation fixing a supposed problem
> we don't completely understand is only being used as an excuse to get
> government to support companies that lobby it by making changes to the
> market in their favor.
On the surface, that of course sounds reasonable. The problem is only that
this is not at all what is going on. The evidence is rock solid, but the
oil coal and gas lobby has congress wrapped around its little finger and
as you say, the legislature is being paid off, the public is dumbed down,
and necessary regulation is prevented, and the oil and gas lobby comes
out ahead again.
Interesting conversation, though I feel we pushed it a bit too far away from
Linux :-)
-b.
From jehaywood at gmail.com Thu May 27 14:35:18 2010
From: jehaywood at gmail.com (Jennie Haywood)
Date: Thu May 27 14:35:24 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] OT: C++ Consulting and Full-Time Openings in NYC
Message-ID:
if anyone is interested I'll forward the email I just got for this
position.
--
Jennie Haywood
----
Everyone is crazy. It's just a matter of degree.
--
The oak tree in your backyard is just a nut that held its ground.
From hc at lookcee.com Thu May 27 15:58:02 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Thu May 27 15:58:05 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <201005271902.o4RJ2YqG015997@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005271902.o4RJ2YqG015997@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BFEDCDA.3060607@lookcee.com>
Borries Demeler wrote:
>> I don't think we should have to pay for oil-spill cleanups through
>> taxes. If the companies were fully responsible for their actions,
>> perhaps they'd have more incentive not to screw up. Under current
>> Federal Law, they are only on the hook for $75,000,000. Taxes on barrels
>> of oil imported to the country are supposed to keep a $1,000,000,000
>
> ...and even that is peanuts compared with the environmental and economical
> damage caused by the spill. Some birds are threatened by extinction and
> will be irretrievably lost. Entire ecosystems will be destroyed by this.
> A billion dollars is not going to replace this loss.
>
>> fund available to have the federal government foot the rest of the bill.
>> Recently, the democrats tried to pass legislation that would raise the
>> $75,000,000 to $10,000,000,000 but the republicans blocked it. Now,
>> legislation has been proposed to quadruple the tax on the oil to raise
>> the federal government's responsibility to $5,000,000,000. Socialized
>> risk, privatized reward, and paying off legislators.
>
> Yes, unfortunately, that's how it goes. Sad, isn't it? But guess what,
> individualized greed beats individualized responsibility EVERY TIME!
> So if you are counting on the industry to self-police itself (it doesn't
> matter if it is the banking or oil and gas or coal industry) dream on.
> it's not going to happen. Whether it is the MMS or Lehman Brothers,
> or Goldman-Sachs. Lack of government regulation and failure to have
> strict enforcement screws us up every time, and the public is left
> holding the short end of the stick.
>
>> As for the supposed consequences of CO2 'enrichment' of the atmosphere:
>> I cannot accept any climate science that has been published by
>> scientists that admit to forging the data and basically lying about
>> their research.
>
> Neither can I. Those individuals (to be clear, a small group of climate
> scientists) who violated scientific methods and ethics have caused a huge
> amount of damage to the field, and with the help of biased media, cast doubt on
> the overwhelming majority who conduct sound science investigations.
> Exactly what you are doing is now happening repeatedly. The bad apples keep
> getting pointed to as to why the entire science must be flawed. Of course,
> the vast majority of scientists did not falsify their science, but somehow
> the deniers of climate crisis manage over and over to bundle all others
> with this sorry bunch who misrepresented their work. Nothing could be
> further from the truth, but if you just mention it often enough
> (the media does the same, very much to the disservice of the public)
> it just must true. I wished people would make a bit of effort to look
> beyond this manipulation and figure out what really is going on. The
> evidence for man-made climate crisis is overwhelming and undeniable.
>
>> Making any laws or legislation fixing a supposed problem
>> we don't completely understand is only being used as an excuse to get
>> government to support companies that lobby it by making changes to the
>> market in their favor.
>
> On the surface, that of course sounds reasonable. The problem is only that
> this is not at all what is going on. The evidence is rock solid, but the
> oil coal and gas lobby has congress wrapped around its little finger and
> as you say, the legislature is being paid off, the public is dumbed down,
> and necessary regulation is prevented, and the oil and gas lobby comes
> out ahead again.
>
> Interesting conversation, though I feel we pushed it a bit too far away from
> Linux :-)
>
> -b.
Indeed we have strayed and once again just as in the mass media there was
no mention of the constant spraying in our skis all over the globe by whom?
What is in that mist that has virtually changed the color of the sky.
How can any discussion of climate change be legitimate when this huge mega
tons per day of man induced pollution is not even mentioned?
hh
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Thu May 27 18:01:40 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Thu May 27 18:01:42 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFEDCDA.3060607@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <201005272301.o4RN1epl030758@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
> Indeed we have strayed and once again just as in the mass media there was
> no mention of the constant spraying in our skis all over the globe by whom?
> What is in that mist that has virtually changed the color of the sky.
Not sure what you are referring to -
> How can any discussion of climate change be legitimate when this huge mega
> tons per day of man induced pollution is not even mentioned?
You have to be more specific. Who is spraying our sky?
-b.
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Thu May 27 13:55:54 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Thu May 27 18:55:55 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFEDCDA.3060607@lookcee.com>
References: <201005271902.o4RJ2YqG015997@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<4BFEDCDA.3060607@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <4BFEC03A.7000200@gmail.com>
Herb Cee wrote:
> Borries Demeler wrote:
>>> I don't think we should have to pay for oil-spill cleanups through
>>> taxes. If the companies were fully responsible for their actions,
>>> perhaps they'd have more incentive not to screw up. Under current
>>> Federal Law, they are only on the hook for $75,000,000. Taxes on
>>> barrels
>>> of oil imported to the country are supposed to keep a $1,000,000,000
>>
>> ...and even that is peanuts compared with the environmental and
>> economical
>> damage caused by the spill. Some birds are threatened by extinction
>> and will be irretrievably lost. Entire ecosystems will be destroyed
>> by this.
>> A billion dollars is not going to replace this loss.
>>
>>> fund available to have the federal government foot the rest of the
>>> bill.
>>> Recently, the democrats tried to pass legislation that would raise the
>>> $75,000,000 to $10,000,000,000 but the republicans blocked it. Now,
>>> legislation has been proposed to quadruple the tax on the oil to raise
>>> the federal government's responsibility to $5,000,000,000. Socialized
>>> risk, privatized reward, and paying off legislators.
>>
>> Yes, unfortunately, that's how it goes. Sad, isn't it? But guess what,
>> individualized greed beats individualized responsibility EVERY TIME!
>> So if you are counting on the industry to self-police itself (it doesn't
>> matter if it is the banking or oil and gas or coal industry) dream on.
>> it's not going to happen. Whether it is the MMS or Lehman Brothers,
>> or Goldman-Sachs. Lack of government regulation and failure to have
>> strict enforcement screws us up every time, and the public is left
>> holding the short end of the stick.
>>
>>> As for the supposed consequences of CO2 'enrichment' of the atmosphere:
>>> I cannot accept any climate science that has been published by
>>> scientists that admit to forging the data and basically lying about
>>> their research.
>>
>> Neither can I. Those individuals (to be clear, a small group of climate
>> scientists) who violated scientific methods and ethics have caused a
>> huge
>> amount of damage to the field, and with the help of biased media,
>> cast doubt on
>> the overwhelming majority who conduct sound science investigations.
>> Exactly what you are doing is now happening repeatedly. The bad
>> apples keep
>> getting pointed to as to why the entire science must be flawed. Of
>> course,
>> the vast majority of scientists did not falsify their science, but
>> somehow
>> the deniers of climate crisis manage over and over to bundle all others
>> with this sorry bunch who misrepresented their work. Nothing could be
>> further from the truth, but if you just mention it often enough
>> (the media does the same, very much to the disservice of the public)
>> it just must true. I wished people would make a bit of effort to look
>> beyond this manipulation and figure out what really is going on. The
>> evidence for man-made climate crisis is overwhelming and undeniable.
>>
>>> Making any laws or legislation fixing a supposed problem
>>> we don't completely understand is only being used as an excuse to get
>>> government to support companies that lobby it by making changes to the
>>> market in their favor.
>>
>> On the surface, that of course sounds reasonable. The problem is only
>> that
>> this is not at all what is going on. The evidence is rock solid, but
>> the oil coal and gas lobby has congress wrapped around its little
>> finger and as you say, the legislature is being paid off, the public
>> is dumbed down,
>> and necessary regulation is prevented, and the oil and gas lobby comes
>> out ahead again.
>>
>> Interesting conversation, though I feel we pushed it a bit too far
>> away from
>> Linux :-)
>> -b.
>
>
> Indeed we have strayed and once again just as in the mass media there
> was no mention of the constant spraying in our skis all over the globe
> by whom? What is in that mist that has virtually changed the color of
> the sky.
>
> How can any discussion of climate change be legitimate when this huge
> mega tons per day of man induced pollution is not even mentioned?
> hh
Indeed, there would seem to be some actions on the part of governments
and private citizens to deliberately pollute. That, I think would be
more a more provocative discussion.
But, I don't think I'll bite. This is supposed to be a Linux mailing
list after all. If this were on IRC, someone would have brought the
banhammer down on us a long time ago for going off-topic. It was fun
watching the banter, though.
pcdls
"The truly civilized man is always skeptical and tolerant, in this field
as in all others. His culture is based on 'I am not too sure'." ~ H.L.
Mencken
From hc at lookcee.com Thu May 27 20:13:26 2010
From: hc at lookcee.com (Herb Cee)
Date: Thu May 27 20:13:30 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <201005272301.o4RN1epl030758@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005272301.o4RN1epl030758@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BFF18B6.6080405@lookcee.com>
Borries Demeler wrote:
>> Indeed we have strayed and once again just as in the mass media there was
>> no mention of the constant spraying in our skis all over the globe by whom?
>> What is in that mist that has virtually changed the color of the sky.
>
> Not sure what you are referring to -
>
>> How can any discussion of climate change be legitimate when this huge mega
>> tons per day of man induced pollution is not even mentioned?
>
> You have to be more specific. Who is spraying our sky?
>
> -b.
I do not know the responsible party nor do I know the composition of the
particulate.
I am referring to the relatively new phenomena of persistent con-trails
that over just 15yrs have completely altered the sky from deep blue to a
silvery blue and some days white.
Perhaps you would like to start here
http://www.google.com/search?aq=2&oq=chemtrails&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=chemtrails+discovery+channel
hh
From demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu Thu May 27 20:28:33 2010
From: demeler at biochem.uthscsa.edu (Borries Demeler)
Date: Thu May 27 20:28:42 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFF18B6.6080405@lookcee.com>
Message-ID: <201005280128.o4S1SXRa002901@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
> I do not know the responsible party nor do I know the composition of the
> particulate.
>
> I am referring to the relatively new phenomena of persistent con-trails
> that over just 15yrs have completely altered the sky from deep blue to a
> silvery blue and some days white.
>
> Perhaps you would like to start here
> http://www.google.com/search?aq=2&oq=chemtrails&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=chemtrails+discovery+channel
>
Ahh, this quickly led me to:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemtrail_conspiracy_theory
The haze you see is the smog from coal burning power plants and diesel
emission particulate. Yep, that has gone up significantly over the past
15 years. Bye...
-b.
From pixelnate at gmail.com Thu May 27 20:59:46 2010
From: pixelnate at gmail.com (Nate)
Date: Thu May 27 20:59:53 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <201005272301.o4RN1epl030758@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005272301.o4RN1epl030758@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BFF2392.3060301@gmail.com>
On 5/27/10 6:01 PM, Borries Demeler wrote:
>> Indeed we have strayed and once again just as in the mass media there was
>> no mention of the constant spraying in our skis all over the globe by whom?
>> What is in that mist that has virtually changed the color of the sky.
>>
> Not sure what you are referring to -
>
>
>> How can any discussion of climate change be legitimate when this huge mega
>> tons per day of man induced pollution is not even mentioned?
>>
> You have to be more specific. Who is spraying our sky?
>
That is the question. Who is spraying the skies? It's either NASA or the
Air Force or some multi-letter government agency. Look up every once in
a while. Most of the contrails you see in the sky any more really aren't
contrails. Take a look at tinyurl.com/chemtrails . I can't vouch for the
writing, but the pictures couldn't be a plainer description of what is
going on.
Sorry. Had to chime in on this one.
~N
From alesmerises at satx.rr.com Fri May 28 00:08:57 2010
From: alesmerises at satx.rr.com (Alan Lesmerises)
Date: Fri May 28 00:08:53 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFE69DD.3040307@shlrm.org>
References: <201005151126.54103.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4BEF1A07.9000803@gmail.com> <201005182320.54550.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <001001caf70f$d1491c00$73db5400$@rr.com> <86t7v5553h7tlboiheuvql294d6u9ohgqo@4ax.com> <4BFA0E15.9040902@grandecom.net> <4BF9D6C7.1000100@gmail.com> <4BFCA731.5090700@grandecom.net> <4BFD3D8F.9070907@sbcglobal.net>
<4BFE69DD.3040307@shlrm.org>
Message-ID: <4BFF4FE9.7080707@satx.rr.com>
David Kowis wrote:
> On 5/26/2010 10:26 AM, Andrew Pickens wrote:
>
> Where does CPS get it's money? Where do the Feds get their money?
>
> You'll end up paying for the subsidized items eventually. Rather, all of
> us will end up paying for your PV system, whether we want to or not...
>
> David
>
Actually, the idea is that it's cheaper to subsidize the PV's and other
alternative energy generation rather than build new power plants. If
they don't get enough people to conserve and install PV's, etc., then we
WILL be paying a lot more for the energy we do use.
Al Lesmerises
From crynosys at grandecom.net Fri May 28 01:10:27 2010
From: crynosys at grandecom.net (Chris)
Date: Fri May 28 01:10:32 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <201005271902.o4RJ2YqG015997@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
References: <201005271902.o4RJ2YqG015997@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
Message-ID: <4BFF5E53.7020303@grandecom.net>
Borries Demeler wrote:
> Those individuals (to be clear, a small group of climate
> scientists) who violated scientific methods and ethics have caused a huge
> amount of damage to the field, and with the help of biased media, cast doubt on
> the overwhelming majority who conduct sound science investigations.
> Exactly what you are doing is now happening repeatedly. The bad apples keep
> getting pointed to as to why the entire science must be flawed. Of course,
> the vast majority of scientists did not falsify their science,
snip
> I wished people would make a bit of effort to look
> beyond this manipulation and figure out what really is going on. The
> evidence for man-made climate crisis is overwhelming and undeniable.
IF all the small group was guilty of was practicing bad science.
IF the IPCC wasn't still using their finding to scare
the world into Global redistribution of wealth schemes.
IF the Church of Climate Change didn't reject rational economically
viable short term and long term solutions to the "crisis" out of hand.
IF I didn't have to wade through pages of personal attacks to find
out that some Church Official couldn't dispute the facts they just
hated the way a statement was worded.
I might agree with you.
Fortunately when you discount "the bad apples" work you knock off the
worst of the effects of global warming. Then your left with a
consensus of a possible rise in sea level of 1 to 5 feet between now
and 2100.
The fact that man is generating a huge amount of green house gases
IS undeniable. The Fact that even greater concentrations have
repeatedly occurred before man reached the industrial age is also
on record.
The Fact that there is a 95 percent chance that NONE of the catastrophic
predictions will come true is also on record.
The fact that the earth's climate will eventually change with
or without human intervention is undeniable.
The rate of that change not the severity is what threatens us puny
humans.
> Interesting conversation, though I feel we pushed it a bit too far away from
> Linux :-)
> -b.
True, but you started it... :-)
I wanted a discussion about how best to utilize linux to monitor 8
sensors and interpret those to operate about 4 different modes on my
homes HVAC setup.
Seen any sub $200 dollar thermostats with USB ports?
Chris (1986 still had the answer to 1000 years of clean energy) Lee
From dkowis at shlrm.org Fri May 28 08:12:09 2010
From: dkowis at shlrm.org (David Kowis)
Date: Fri May 28 08:13:45 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Trying to do some Fibre Channel Expirementation
Message-ID: <4BFFC129.7020104@shlrm.org>
First some background:
I've got a single computer at home that I use to experiment with running
xen. It's a pretty beefy server, and runs about 10 VMs right now. The
storage on it is currently a mdadm raid5 array of 3x 1tb drives. The
performance of which isn't doing so well, since the workload is ill
suited to raid5. And then there's the write hole for when the power goes
out. A hardware raid5 card will mostly solve the problem but is like
$400. What I want to do is use a opensolaris based server to serve up
storage over a FC connection. Then I get the benefits of ZFS, which
brings so much more to the table than a hardware raid5 card does and for
only a little bit more money.
The plan is to use osol to run a zfs based storage machine, with the
block level deduplication (which will save me plenty of space with
virtual machines) running raidz and connected to my xen server over
fibre channel. I can use COMSTAR in osol to export the zvols over the FC
connection, and then pick them up in the Xen box as drives and just use
them. I'll have my storage separated from my hypervisor, which I've been
told is 'good karma' since first I tried to use osol as my domain0.
Unfortunately, since Oracle's acquisition of Sun, the osol
implementation of Xen has not been developed or anything. I opted to
avoid that, and stick with the linux xen, so getting a separate server
for storage is the only way to go. Using ZFS gets me several benefits
that I don't have:
* much faster disks, since raidz is much smarter than raid5
* Automatic bitrot detection
* block-level deduplication
Resilvering, block-level deduplication, and raidz are worth the extra
money. Especially since I'm a hobbyist, and I can't afford advanced
storage arrays with magical software to check the data consistency, and
raidz is free and will work with commodity disks (so long as the
hardware is new enough to be supported (SATA is)).
However, OpenSolaris' hardware support is crap, so I'm having trouble
testing my setup. I have an oldish dell 2400 (I think that's the number)
that has 64-bit PCI slots. Unfortunately, osol doesn't support the scsi
controller in there, so I can't actually install osol onto it, so I
cannot test anything. I have tried to put the 64-bit pci cards into a
32-bit slot, and that doesn't work. The system locked up when it tried
to initialize the card.
What I'm wondering is if anyone has a computer that has 64-bit pci slots
that I could borrow for a while to see if I could get this working. I
have other hardware that I'd be willing to trade for it, or if you're
willing to just let me borrow it, that'd be awesome too :)
I'd rather not spend $500 to buy the components to build this storage
server, and then find out that it's not possible, hardware wise. I guess
I could just spend more money and purchase FC cards that I know work,
but I'm trying to operate on a budget.
Thanks for your time,
David
From mayfield_mark at att.net Fri May 28 10:50:34 2010
From: mayfield_mark at att.net (mark)
Date: Fri May 28 10:50:37 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] off-topic Solar-PV discussion
In-Reply-To: <4BFF5E53.7020303@grandecom.net>
References: <201005271902.o4RJ2YqG015997@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<4BFF5E53.7020303@grandecom.net>
Message-ID: <1275061834.2500.8.camel@grim-desktop>
On Fri, 2010-05-28 at 01:10 -0500, Chris wrote:
> IF all the small group was guilty of was practicing bad science.
> IF the IPCC wasn't still using their finding to scare
> the world into Global redistribution of wealth schemes.
> IF the Church of Climate Change didn't reject rational economically
> viable short term and long term solutions to the "crisis" out of hand.
> IF I didn't have to wade through pages of personal attacks to find
> out that some Church Official couldn't dispute the facts they just
> hated the way a statement was worded.
> I might agree with you.
>
> Fortunately when you discount "the bad apples" work you knock off the
> worst of the effects of global warming. Then your left with a
> consensus of a possible rise in sea level of 1 to 5 feet between now
> and 2100.
>
> The fact that man is generating a huge amount of green house gases
> IS undeniable. The Fact that even greater concentrations have
> repeatedly occurred before man reached the industrial age is also
> on record.
> The Fact that there is a 95 percent chance that NONE of the catastrophic
> predictions will come true is also on record.
>
> The fact that the earth's climate will eventually change with
> or without human intervention is undeniable.
> The rate of that change not the severity is what threatens us puny
> humans.
Besides all the these statements you made that we are just supposed to
blindly take as fact. Climate change is not the only problem with
pollution.
In a family of 5 dogs that we had 3 of them got cancer. We used to let
our dogs drink unfiltered tap water. Since we started filtering our tap
water none of our dogs have ever gotten cancer. I won't let any living
creature drink unfiltered tap water for an extended period of time.
Besides cancer there are asthma and autism which may be at least in part
attributed to different kinds of commercial pollution. People have to be
careful how much fish they eat because of mercury content. Species
becoming endangered on a regular basis some of which can be attributed
to commercial under regulation (pollution and deforestation, sea otters
endangered partially because of oil spills).
People that endanger other individuals, especially children can face
criminal charges but companies that endanger entire populations are
protected and respected. I'm in awe of the power that money has over
people and it's ability to make people believe things that are
completely illogical and sometimes downright insane.
From thomas.cameron at camerontech.com Fri May 28 11:00:28 2010
From: thomas.cameron at camerontech.com (Thomas Cameron)
Date: Fri May 28 15:51:22 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Red Hat Hiring Virtualization Solution Architect
Message-ID: <4BFFE89C.9030606@camerontech.com>
If you're interested/qualified, please fill out an application at
https://redhat.ats.hrsmart.com/cgi-bin/a/highlightjob.cgi?jobid=5063.
Please put choose "Employee referral" in the "How did you hear about
us?" drop-down and my work e-mail address (thomas@redhat.com) in the
field below. Please let me know if you apply so I can herd the cats to
look at your resume! Note that Austin is not a hard requirement for a
qualified candidate.
I absolutely love working for Red Hat. It's incredibly exciting to be a
part of this company, and it gets better year after year.
Job description below:
**************************************
Position Summary:
The Role:
The primary role of an Virtualization Solution Architect is to partner
with regional Key Account Executives to achieve sales and revenue goals,
evaluate technical requirements of new sales opportunities and develop
technical solutions that can successfully meet the needs of prospects.
Primary Responsibilities:
? Ensure revenue quota, deployment, and service objectives are met
while maintaining a high level of prospect/customer satisfaction.
? Act as technical point of contact for prospects, customers and the
sales team.
? Develop and implement the technical Virtualization sales strategies
to help ensure Red Hat's objectives are met.
? Position and present Red Hat solutions and technical proposals to
prospects, customers.
? Lead the gathering of architecture, design, and presentation of
solutions to meet the prospect's needs.
? Research and write the responses to technical sections of RFI/RFPs.
? Drive and support pre-sales pilots, demonstrations, PoCs,evaluation
and benchmarks.
Required Skills & Experience:
? Comfortable with solution selling process in enterprise software market.
? Strong interpersonal and organizational skills.
? Excellent written and oral communication with proficiency in
presentation. Solid client facing skills up to C level executives.
? Advanced knowledge of Enterprise Virtualization, VDI, Linux, and
Microsoft technologies.
? Knowledge of networking and complex software integration.
? Ability to work in the field in remote offices, and be self-managed
with excellent prioritization skills.
? 5 + years experience as a Sales Engineer or equivalent supporting
Enterprise accounts.
? 5+ years experience with Linux and Windows in the areas of system
administration, integration or development.
? 5+ years experience working with Virtualization technologies and/or
with a VMWare Certified Professional certification.
? RHCE or MCSE Certifications a plus.
? 50% travel expected
Requirements
As stated above.
**************************************
From tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org Fri May 28 23:49:01 2010
From: tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org (Tweeks)
Date: Fri May 28 23:49:05 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
<1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop>
Message-ID: <201005282349.01737.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
On Tuesday 25 May 2010 02:07:25 pm mark wrote:
> Are you kidding? I don't know why everyone is acting like global warming
> is the only problem with pollution. In a family of 5 dogs that we had 3
> of them got cancer. We used to let our dogs drink unfiltered tap water.
> Since we started filtering our tap water none of our dogs have ever
> gotten cancer.
I don't know about tap water causing cancer directly.. but indirectly I could
believe. Let me explain My dog was scratching and chewing himself raw. We
tried everything in the way of baths, hair conditioners, tea tree oil, oat
meal scrub, etc. All crap. After I switched him to home filtered water.. it
all cleared up. Just to make sure.. I switched him back to SA tap water for
a month.. within a week.. he was scratching and chewing raw spots again. Back
to filtered.. problems all gone. So knowing that cancer can be caused by
irritated and inflamed tissue -- sure.. I can believe that SA tap causes
cancer in some dogs.
So.. of COURSE that's all my kids drink.
Now.. if we could just them to shut off the damn fluoridation.
My oldest daughter (6) already suffers from dental fluorosis:
http://www.fluoridealert.org/dental-fluorosis.htm
Damn fluoridation..
Tweeks
From bruce.dubbs at gmail.com Sat May 29 00:20:40 2010
From: bruce.dubbs at gmail.com (Bruce Dubbs)
Date: Sat May 29 00:20:46 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <201005282349.01737.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu> <9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control> <1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop>
<201005282349.01737.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Message-ID: <4C00A428.6060806@gmail.com>
Tweeks wrote:
> Now.. if we could just them to shut off the damn fluoridation.
> My oldest daughter (6) already suffers from dental fluorosis:
> http://www.fluoridealert.org/dental-fluorosis.htm
>
> Damn fluoridation..
As opposed to http://www.fluoridedebate.com/question21.html
"Fluoride in the much lower concentrations (0.7 to 1.2 ppm) used in
water fluoridation is not harmful or toxic."
http://www.saws.org/our_water/fluoride.shtml
"Fluoride already occurs naturally in San Antonio?s water at 0.3 parts
per million. SAWS adds enough fluoride to bring the fluoride level up to
0.8 parts per million"
There are many scientific studies that contradict each other -- global
warming, fluoridated water, radiation from nuclear power plants, cancer
from cell phone use, Obama was born in Kenya...
The advantage and disadvantage of the internet is that you can find many
opinions that agree (or disagree) with what you think.
Choose wisely.
-- Bruce
From tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org Sat May 29 01:26:33 2010
From: tweeksjunk2 at theweeks.org (Tweeks)
Date: Sat May 29 01:26:37 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Qs about BT787 video capture cards
Message-ID: <201005290126.33570.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Hey Jeremy.. others..
Anyone much experience with BT7xx video capture cards?
Is it true that with a 4 camera-input card, that if you want motion detection
on all four cameras that you need to get the more expensive four chip capture
card? (please excuse typos.. this late.. I just can't type)
It would seem that on a single capture chip card that the middleware (ivtv,
v4l2, etc) could do the motion detection at the kernel level.. and then
just "Switch" to that camera to record.. and if there was more than one
camera, simply time division switch between the the cams with motion in them
(changing the frame rate of each as needed). No?
(although I can see problems with this if all cameras are not sync'd to a
common clock or SPG)
Anyway.. I DO want motion detection on all four cameras, but I don't want to
have to buy a four chip card unless I have to.. So anyway, experience in this
area is wanted.
Thanx..
Tweeks
p.s. for those not familiar with the create Linux support of this stuff.. see
here:
http://store.bluecherry.net/category_s/63.htm
and this great demo video of their pro-grade video surveillance system here:
http://videos.bluecherrydvr.com/demos/
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Fri May 28 21:46:50 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Sat May 29 02:46:46 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Re: Any Technical/Automation - now PV
In-Reply-To: <4C00A428.6060806@gmail.com>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu> <9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control> <1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop> <201005282349.01737.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<4C00A428.6060806@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4C00801A.6080409@gmail.com>
Bruce Dubbs wrote:
> Tweeks wrote:
>
>> Now.. if we could just them to shut off the damn fluoridation.
>> My oldest daughter (6) already suffers from dental fluorosis:
>> http://www.fluoridealert.org/dental-fluorosis.htm
>>
>> Damn fluoridation..
>
> As opposed to http://www.fluoridedebate.com/question21.html
>
> "Fluoride in the much lower concentrations (0.7 to 1.2 ppm) used in
> water fluoridation is not harmful or toxic."
>
> http://www.saws.org/our_water/fluoride.shtml
>
> "Fluoride already occurs naturally in San Antonio?s water at 0.3 parts
> per million. SAWS adds enough fluoride to bring the fluoride level up
> to 0.8 parts per million"
>
> There are many scientific studies that contradict each other -- global
> warming, fluoridated water, radiation from nuclear power plants,
> cancer from cell phone use, Obama was born in Kenya...
>
> The advantage and disadvantage of the internet is that you can find
> many opinions that agree (or disagree) with what you think.
>
> Choose wisely.
>
> -- Bruce
>
The internet is, indeed, a cesspool. That's why I remain a skeptic on
all things that I cannot prove myself mathematically, scientifically
and/or logically. I don't claim to be good at reasoning but, what
reasoning that I am capable of is enough for me. My perception and
personal comprehension of the world are my world. This leads me to the
desire to extinguish my anger at the differences in this world and to,
quite simply, accept that we will never achieve any of the utopian
fantasies of all of the world's socialists, capitalists, libertarians,
republicans, democrats, NWO creeps, conservatives, liberals, communists,
anarchists, cannibals, reptile people, what-have-you. Maybe, if we were
all skeptics, there might be peace ( not likely ). The best that I can
do is deal with that which I can control and limit the number of
meddlers in my sphere ( there are always meddlers!! ). Kill this thread
already!!!
pcdls
From dondavis at reglue.org Sat May 29 08:30:53 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Sat May 29 08:31:00 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Qs about BT787 video capture cards
In-Reply-To: <201005290126.33570.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
References: <201005290126.33570.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
Message-ID: <4C01170D.9070300@reglue.org>
I've used a BT787 from Linux Labs with Zoneminder. I haven't run the
system for a little while. I'll try to remember without giving
misinformation.
What you're doing depends on whether you want half duplex or full
duplex. Depending on whether your card supports full duplex at all.
How many fps do you want?
Motion detection on all four should work fine. I don't know about the
built-in chip used for motion detection. My setup relied on the
algorithms in Zoneminder comparing the stream of images.
BTW, I have the Linux Labs card (it's a few years old now but a very
solid piece of technology - solid heavy metal ), a nicer cctv camera,
and a cheap $100 camera that I'm not using. The card expands from 4 full
duplex ports to 8 half duplex ports. (I never used the expansion though.)
From dondavis at reglue.org Sat May 29 08:49:08 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Sat May 29 08:49:11 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Qs about BT787 video capture cards
In-Reply-To: <4C01170D.9070300@reglue.org>
References: <201005290126.33570.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org>
<4C01170D.9070300@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4C011B54.6070107@reglue.org>
This is the card I have:
http://www.linuxmedialabs.com/product_details.php?prodid=310
lmlbt44
It uses the bt787 drivers which have been included in the kernel for a
while.
Don Davis wrote:
> I've used a BT787 chipset from Linux Labs with Zoneminder. I haven't run the
> system for a little while. I'll try to remember without giving
> misinformation.
>
> What you're doing depends on whether you want half duplex or full
> duplex. Depending on whether your card supports full duplex at all.
>
> How many fps do you want?
>
> Motion detection on all four should work fine. I don't know about the
> built-in chip used for motion detection. My setup relied on the
> algorithms in Zoneminder comparing the stream of images.
>
> BTW, I have the Linux Labs card (it's a few years old now but a very
> solid piece of technology - solid heavy metal ), a nicer cctv camera,
> and a cheap $100 camera that I'm not using. The card expands from 4 full
> duplex ports to 8 half duplex ports. (I never used the expansion though.)
>
From alesmerises at satx.rr.com Sat May 29 10:58:04 2010
From: alesmerises at satx.rr.com (Alan Lesmerises)
Date: Sat May 29 10:58:05 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Timestamps on e-mails [was: Any Technical/Automation - now
PV]
In-Reply-To: <4C00801A.6080409@gmail.com>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu> <9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control> <1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop> <201005282349.01737.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4C00A428.6060806@gmail.com>
<4C00801A.6080409@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4C01398C.2020105@satx.rr.com>
The previous thread reminded me of something that's puzzled me for a while.
Three e-mails, in sequence, from Tweeks, Bruce, & pcdls are shown
below. It's clear which came first based on who's responding to whom.
But the time stamps (and the sequence they show up in my in-box, since I
sort them by time), are pcdls - 5/28/2010, 9:46pm (this was actually the
last e-mail); Tweeks - 5/28/2010, 11:49pm (this was the first e-mail);
and Bruce - 5/29/2010, 12:20am.
How the $#^% does that happen? Shouldn't the timestamps be UTC time or
something?
Al Lesmerises
pcdls.ronin wrote:
> Bruce Dubbs wrote:
>> Tweeks wrote:
>>
>>> Now.. if we could just them to shut off the damn fluoridation.
>>> My oldest daughter (6) already suffers from dental fluorosis:
>>> http://www.fluoridealert.org/dental-fluorosis.htm
>>>
>>> Damn fluoridation..
>>
>> As opposed to http://www.fluoridedebate.com/question21.html
>>
>> "Fluoride in the much lower concentrations (0.7 to 1.2 ppm) used in
>> water fluoridation is not harmful or toxic."
>>
>> http://www.saws.org/our_water/fluoride.shtml
>>
>> "Fluoride already occurs naturally in San Antonio?s water at 0.3
>> parts per million. SAWS adds enough fluoride to bring the fluoride
>> level up to 0.8 parts per million"
>>
>> There are many scientific studies that contradict each other --
>> global warming, fluoridated water, radiation from nuclear power
>> plants, cancer from cell phone use, Obama was born in Kenya...
>>
>> The advantage and disadvantage of the internet is that you can find
>> many opinions that agree (or disagree) with what you think.
>>
>> Choose wisely.
>>
>> -- Bruce
>>
> The internet is, indeed, a cesspool. That's why I remain a skeptic on
> all things that I cannot prove myself mathematically, scientifically
> and/or logically. I don't claim to be good at reasoning but, what
> reasoning that I am capable of is enough for me. My perception and
> personal comprehension of the world are my world. This leads me to
> the desire to extinguish my anger at the differences in this world and
> to, quite simply, accept that we will never achieve any of the utopian
> fantasies of all of the world's socialists, capitalists, libertarians,
> republicans, democrats, NWO creeps, conservatives, liberals,
> communists, anarchists, cannibals, reptile people, what-have-you.
> Maybe, if we were all skeptics, there might be peace ( not likely ).
> The best that I can do is deal with that which I can control and
> limit the number of meddlers in my sphere ( there are always
> meddlers!! ). Kill this thread already!!!
> pcdls
From mayfield_mark at att.net Sat May 29 11:56:22 2010
From: mayfield_mark at att.net (mark)
Date: Sat May 29 11:56:25 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Timestamps on e-mails [was: Any Technical/Automation
- now PV]
In-Reply-To: <4C01398C.2020105@satx.rr.com>
References: <201005241951.o4OJpgLT024183@biochem.uthscsa.edu>
<9A0A8BA1073841CB8D9EDA4ABBE7231C@Control>
<1274814445.7258.15.camel@grim-desktop>
<201005282349.01737.tweeksjunk2@theweeks.org> <4C00A428.6060806@gmail.com>
<4C00801A.6080409@gmail.com> <4C01398C.2020105@satx.rr.com>
Message-ID: <1275152182.3946.2.camel@grim-desktop>
On Sat, 2010-05-29 at 10:58 -0500, Alan Lesmerises wrote:
> The previous thread reminded me of something that's puzzled me for a while.
>
> Three e-mails, in sequence, from Tweeks, Bruce, & pcdls are shown
> below. It's clear which came first based on who's responding to whom.
> But the time stamps (and the sequence they show up in my in-box, since I
> sort them by time), are pcdls - 5/28/2010, 9:46pm (this was actually the
> last e-mail); Tweeks - 5/28/2010, 11:49pm (this was the first e-mail);
> and Bruce - 5/29/2010, 12:20am.
>
> How the $#^% does that happen? Shouldn't the timestamps be UTC time or
> something?
>
Possibly a difference in the processing time on different email servers
and the way they do the times stamps?
From dondavis at reglue.org Sat May 29 12:11:25 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Sat May 29 12:11:33 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] how to use tr to remove newlines after '--'
Message-ID: <4C014ABD.3070700@reglue.org>
I have a file and I'm trying to remove newline characters after lines
that end with '--'
using:
tr '\-\-\n' '\-\- '
removes _ALL_ new lines not only the ones after '--'
and sed -e 's/--$/foo/g' |tr 'foo\n' ' '
does as well.
Suggestions?
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Sat May 29 08:06:13 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Sat May 29 13:06:09 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] how to use tr to remove newlines after '--'
In-Reply-To: <4C014ABD.3070700@reglue.org>
References: <4C014ABD.3070700@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4C011145.3010707@gmail.com>
Don Davis wrote:
> I have a file and I'm trying to remove newline characters after lines
> that end with '--'
>
> using:
> tr '\-\-\n' '\-\- '
> removes _ALL_ new lines not only the ones after '--'
> and sed -e 's/--$/foo/g' |tr 'foo\n' ' '
> does as well.
>
> Suggestions?
Tried the following as a command that is supposed to take a string and
replace it with another string. I used your string --\n (the string
that you want to replace) and replaced it with just the --. I used the
echo functions to see that it removed the \n and essentially
concatenated some of the strings together in an expected fashion.
(echo --; echo -z; echo -x; echo --; echo -*) | sed '/--$/ {
N
s:--\n:--:
}'
For a file, I guess you could do the following:
sed '/--$/ {
N
s:--\n:--:g
}' foobar.txt > test.txt
With output going to test.txt. It isn't tested. Let us know how it
works out.
pcdls
From dondavis at reglue.org Sat May 29 13:25:24 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Sat May 29 13:25:32 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] how to use tr to remove newlines after '--'
In-Reply-To: <4C011145.3010707@gmail.com>
References: <4C014ABD.3070700@reglue.org> <4C011145.3010707@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4C015C14.6080805@reglue.org>
Thank you, I tried it out with no luck.
Depending on how well the new lines copy - this is the text in file with :
1 --$
--$
--$
NOT $
SCORED --$
--$
NO $
$
1 --
--
--
NOT
SCORED --
--
NO
pcdls.ronin wrote:
> Don Davis wrote:
>> I have a file and I'm trying to remove newline characters after lines
>> that end with '--'
>>
>> using:
>> tr '\-\-\n' '\-\- '
>> removes _ALL_ new lines not only the ones after '--'
>> and sed -e 's/--$/foo/g' |tr 'foo\n' ' '
>> does as well.
>>
>> Suggestions?
> Tried the following as a command that is supposed to take a string and
> replace it with another string. I used your string --\n (the string
> that you want to replace) and replaced it with just the --. I used the
> echo functions to see that it removed the \n and essentially
> concatenated some of the strings together in an expected fashion.
>
> (echo --; echo -z; echo -x; echo --; echo -*) | sed '/--$/ {
> N
> s:--\n:--:
> }'
>
> For a file, I guess you could do the following:
>
> sed '/--$/ {
> N
> s:--\n:--:g
> }' foobar.txt > test.txt
>
> With output going to test.txt. It isn't tested. Let us know how it
> works out.
>
> pcdls
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Sat May 29 10:29:48 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Sat May 29 15:29:41 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] how to use tr to remove newlines after '--'
In-Reply-To: <4C015C14.6080805@reglue.org>
References: <4C014ABD.3070700@reglue.org> <4C011145.3010707@gmail.com>
<4C015C14.6080805@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4C0132EC.7020603@gmail.com>
Don Davis wrote:
> Thank you, I tried it out with no luck.
> Depending on how well the new lines copy - this is the text in file
> with :
> 1 --$
> --$
> --$
> NOT $
> SCORED --$
> --$
> NO $
> $
>
> 1 --
> --
> --
> NOT
> SCORED --
> --
> NO
>
>
>
>
> pcdls.ronin wrote:
>> Don Davis wrote:
>>> I have a file and I'm trying to remove newline characters after
>>> lines that end with '--'
>>>
>>> using:
>>> tr '\-\-\n' '\-\- '
>>> removes _ALL_ new lines not only the ones after '--'
>>> and sed -e 's/--$/foo/g' |tr 'foo\n' ' '
>>> does as well.
>>>
>>> Suggestions?
>> Tried the following as a command that is supposed to take a string
>> and replace it with another string. I used your string --\n (the
>> string that you want to replace) and replaced it with just the --. I
>> used the echo functions to see that it removed the \n and essentially
>> concatenated some of the strings together in an expected fashion.
>>
>> (echo --; echo -z; echo -x; echo --; echo -*) | sed '/--$/ {
>> N
>> s:--\n:--:
>> }'
>>
>> For a file, I guess you could do the following:
>>
>> sed '/--$/ {
>> N
>> s:--\n:--:g
>> }' foobar.txt > test.txt
>>
>> With output going to test.txt. It isn't tested. Let us know how it
>> works out.
>>
>> pcdls
>
Your input text file looks like this?
1 --
--
--
NOT
SCORED --
--
NO
If so, I can play with it later tonight.
pcdls
From dondavis at reglue.org Sat May 29 15:59:58 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Sat May 29 16:00:04 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] how to use tr to remove newlines after '--'
In-Reply-To: <4C0132EC.7020603@gmail.com>
References: <4C014ABD.3070700@reglue.org>
<4C011145.3010707@gmail.com> <4C015C14.6080805@reglue.org>
<4C0132EC.7020603@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4C01804E.2040104@reglue.org>
>>> pcdls
>>
> Your input text file looks like this?
>
> 1 --
Yes. Thank you.
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Sat May 29 11:58:31 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Sat May 29 16:58:31 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] how to use tr to remove newlines after '--'
In-Reply-To: <4C01804E.2040104@reglue.org>
References: <4C014ABD.3070700@reglue.org> <4C011145.3010707@gmail.com> <4C015C14.6080805@reglue.org> <4C0132EC.7020603@gmail.com>
<4C01804E.2040104@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4C0147B7.7040007@gmail.com>
Don Davis wrote:
>
>>>> pcdls
>>>
>> Your input text file looks like this?
>>
>> 1 --
>
> Yes. Thank you.
>
Okay,
## With an input like this pasted into foobar.txt ##
## Beginning of foobar.txt - Comments shown here are not in the file. ##
1 --
--
--
NOT
SCORED --
--
NO
## End of foobar.txt ##
## Assumes \n (hex: 0A) and no other endline symbols ##
I tried this command, as follows, to remove the \n from the end of each
line that ends in '--':
In otherwords, "--" which can be represented as ASCII <2D><2D><2A>,
if there is any other character string between the -- and the '\n', then
you may need to evaluate your input file for whether you might have a
space following your '--' or another non-visible symbol that separates
your '--' from '/n'. In that case, the command should be updated to
reflect this criteria.
Anyway, the command I used was as follows:
sed -n '1h;2,$H;${g;s/--\n/--/g;p}' foobar.txt > test.txt
After execution, opened up test.txt and found the following (comments
shown were not in the file):
## Beginning of test.txt ##
1 ------NOT
SCORED ----NO
## End of test.txt ##
If you don't get this, then evaluate your input text file. Under the
criteria that I defined for this email, it appears this particular
command may help you out.
pcdls
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Sat May 29 12:01:06 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Sat May 29 17:01:01 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] how to use tr to remove newlines after '--'
In-Reply-To: <4C0147B7.7040007@gmail.com>
References: <4C014ABD.3070700@reglue.org> <4C011145.3010707@gmail.com> <4C015C14.6080805@reglue.org> <4C0132EC.7020603@gmail.com>
<4C01804E.2040104@reglue.org> <4C0147B7.7040007@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4C014852.3000907@gmail.com>
Don Davis wrote:
>
>>>> pcdls
>>>
>> Your input text file looks like this?
>>
>> 1 --
>
> Yes. Thank you.
>
Okay,
## With an input like this pasted into foobar.txt ##
## Beginning of foobar.txt - Comments shown here are not in the file. ##
1 --
--
--
NOT
SCORED --
--
NO
## End of foobar.txt ##
## Assumes \n (hex: 0A) and no other endline symbols ##
I tried this command, as follows, to remove the \n from the end of each
line that ends in '--': In otherwords, "--" which can be represented
as ASCII <2D><2D><2A>, if there is any other character string between
the -- and the '\n', then you may need to evaluate your input file for
whether you might have a space following your '--' or another
non-visible symbol that separates your '--' from '/n'. In that case,
the command should be updated to reflect this criteria.
Anyway, the command I used was as follows:
sed -n '1h;2,$H;${g;s/--\n/--/g;p}' foobar.txt > test.txt
After execution, opened up test.txt and found the following (comments
shown were not in the file):
## Beginning of test.txt ##
1 ------NOT
SCORED ----NO
## End of test.txt ##
If you don't get this, then evaluate your input text file. Under the
criteria that I defined for this email, it appears this particular
command may help you out.
pcdls
From pcdls.ronin at gmail.com Sat May 29 12:05:37 2010
From: pcdls.ronin at gmail.com (pcdls.ronin)
Date: Sat May 29 17:05:28 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] how to use tr to remove newlines after '--'
Message-ID: <4C014961.6070306@gmail.com>
Don Davis wrote:
>
>>>> pcdls
>>>
>> Your input text file looks like this?
>>
>> 1 --
>
> Yes. Thank you.
>
Okay,
## With an input like this pasted into foobar.txt ##
## Beginning of foobar.txt - Comments shown here are not in the file. ##
>1 --
>--
>--
>NOT
>SCORED --
>--
>NO
## End of foobar.txt ##
## Assumes \n (hex: 0A) and no other endline symbols ##
I tried this command, as follows, to remove the \n from the end of each
line that ends in '--': In otherwords, "--" which can be represented
as ASCII <2D><2D><2A>, if there is any other character string between
the -- and the '\n', then you may need to evaluate your input file for
whether you might have a space following your '--' or another
non-visible symbol that separates your '--' from '/n'. In that case,
the command should be updated to reflect this criteria.
Anyway, the command I used was as follows:
sed -n '1h;2,$H;${g;s/--\n/--/g;p}' foobar.txt > test.txt
After execution, opened up test.txt and found the following (comments
shown were not in the file):
## Beginning of test.txt ##
1 ------NOT
SCORED ----NO
## End of test.txt ##
If you don't get this, then evaluate your input text file. Under the
criteria that I defined for this email, it appears this particular
command may help you out.
pcdls
From dondavis at reglue.org Sat May 29 18:00:02 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Sat May 29 18:00:04 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] how to use tr to remove newlines after '--'
In-Reply-To: <4C014961.6070306@gmail.com>
References: <4C014961.6070306@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4C019C72.9060305@reglue.org>
It seems to work. Thank you.
From pixelnate at gmail.com Sun May 30 00:10:59 2010
From: pixelnate at gmail.com (Nate Turnage)
Date: Sun May 30 00:11:01 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bash scripting noob could use some help with a Bash script
Message-ID:
I am trying to automate a process of encoding many videos into six different
formats. That's not the part that I need help with, yet. I am starting out
trying to batch process the image still preview images for each of the
videos. All of the videos are quicktime '.mov' files. The ffmpeg commands I
am working from can be found here:
http://rodrigopolo.com/wp-content/uploads/video/BigBuckBunny/encoding-commands.txt
What I would like to do is iterate over all the '.mov' files in a directory
and save out a preview of them using ffmpeg. Each of these preview files
should be named 'filename_preview.jpg'. The script is trying to do what I am
asking, but I don't know how to get it to save the file out properly. The
files aren't being saved and the images are being 'written' on the terminal.
Can somebody take a look at the script and offer some pointers?
Script:
#!/bin/bash
FILES="*.mov"
for f in $FILES
do
echo "Processing $f file..."
ffmpeg -i $f -ss 78.5 -s 640x352 -vframes 1 -an -f image2 ${f}_preview.jpg
cat $f
done
Thanks in advance,
Nate
From dondavis at reglue.org Sun May 30 08:13:00 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Sun May 30 08:13:08 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bash scripting noob could use some help with a Bash
script
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <4C02645C.6050100@reglue.org>
Nate Turnage wrote:
> I am trying to automate a process of encoding many videos into six different
> formats. That's not the part that I need help with, yet. I am starting out
> trying to batch process the image still preview images for each of the
> videos. All of the videos are quicktime '.mov' files. The ffmpeg commands I
> am working from can be found here:
> {
>
> What I would like to do is iterate over all the '.mov' files in a directory
> and save out a preview of them using ffmpeg. Each of these preview files
> should be named 'filename_preview.jpg'. The script is trying to do what I am
> asking, but I don't know how to get it to save the file out properly.
The
> files aren't being saved and the images are being 'written' on the terminal.
You are catting an image file. If you want to see the picture use
'display.' (You may need to install Image Magick first.)
Using the basic version of your script:
for i in *wmv; do ffmpeg -i $i -ss 78.5 -s 640x352 -vframes 1 -an -f
image2 ${i}_preview.jpg; done
worked fine for me. I did, however, have problems using .mov files - I
don't know if the problem was with the .mov files or some lack of codec
on my part.
> Can somebody take a look at the script and offer some pointers?
>
> Script:
>
> #!/bin/bash
> FILES="*.mov"
> for f in $FILES
> do
> echo "Processing $f file..."
> ffmpeg -i $f -ss 78.5 -s 640x352 -vframes 1 -an -f image2 ${f}_preview.jpg
> cat $f
> done
>
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Nate
From pixelnate at gmail.com Sun May 30 08:52:43 2010
From: pixelnate at gmail.com (Nate Turnage)
Date: Sun May 30 08:52:45 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bash scripting noob could use some help with a Bash
script
In-Reply-To: <4C02645C.6050100@reglue.org>
References:
<4C02645C.6050100@reglue.org>
Message-ID:
On Sun, May 30, 2010 at 8:13 AM, Don Davis wrote:
>
> Using the basic version of your script:
> for i in *wmv; do ffmpeg -i $i -ss 78.5 -s 640x352 -vframes 1 -an -f image2
> ${i}_preview.jpg; done
>
> worked fine for me. I did, however, have problems using .mov files - I
> don't know if the problem was with the .mov files or some lack of codec on
> my part.
You're right, Don. And it was the 'cat $f' that was drawing the binary in
the terminal.
One more question. With the script the way it is, the resulting JPEG file is
named 'filename.mov_preview.jpg' and I would like it to be just
'filename_preview.jpg'. How do I get that to work? How do I remove the file
extension from $f?
Here is the revised script:
#!/bin/bash
FILES="*.mov"
for f in $FILES
do
ffmpeg -i $f -ss 78.5 -s 640x352 -vframes 1 -an -f image2 ${f}_preview.jpg
done
Thanks again,
Nate
From dondavis at reglue.org Sun May 30 09:54:34 2010
From: dondavis at reglue.org (Don Davis)
Date: Sun May 30 09:54:41 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bash scripting noob could use some help with a Bash
script
In-Reply-To:
References: <4C02645C.6050100@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <4C027C2A.2020703@reglue.org>
How do I get that to work? How do I remove the file
> extension from $f?
>
Have a look at sed, regular expressions, grep, and awk.
They are the duct tape and flat head screwdrivers of scripting.
for i in *wmv; do ffmpeg -i $i -ss 78.5 -s 640x352 -vframes 1 -an -f
image2 `echo $i | sed 's/\(.*\)\.[A-Za-z]\{3\}/\1/'`_preview.jpg; done
Here -> sed 's/\(.*\)\.[A-Za-z]\{3\}/\1/'`_preview.jpg; done
\. signifies escaping the dot so it's a dot and not 'any character'
[A-Za-z]{3} signifies any combination of 3 upper or lowercase letters;
you could replace it with \.mov
back ticks contain the subroutine and returns the data. $(echo $i | sed
's/\(.*\)\.[A-Za-z]\{3\}/\1/')_preview.jpg; done
$() works as well. The preferred usage is now $(). However, I don't
remember enough to explain why...
From jdchoate at gmail.com Sun May 30 14:45:02 2010
From: jdchoate at gmail.com (John D Choate)
Date: Sun May 30 14:45:14 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bash scripting noob could use some help with a Bash
script
In-Reply-To:
References:
<4C02645C.6050100@reglue.org>
Message-ID: <201005301445.03488.jdchoate@gmail.com>
On Sunday, May 30, 2010 08:52:43 Nate Turnage wrote:
> On Sun, May 30, 2010 at 8:13 AM, Don Davis wrote:
>
> >
> > Using the basic version of your script:
> > for i in *wmv; do ffmpeg -i $i -ss 78.5 -s 640x352 -vframes 1 -an -f image2
> > ${i}_preview.jpg; done
> >
> > worked fine for me. I did, however, have problems using .mov files - I
> > don't know if the problem was with the .mov files or some lack of codec on
> > my part.
>
>
> You're right, Don. And it was the 'cat $f' that was drawing the binary in
> the terminal.
>
> One more question. With the script the way it is, the resulting JPEG file is
> named 'filename.mov_preview.jpg' and I would like it to be just
> 'filename_preview.jpg'. How do I get that to work? How do I remove the file
> extension from $f?
>
> Here is the revised script:
>
> #!/bin/bash
> FILES="*.mov"
> for f in $FILES
> do
> ffmpeg -i $f -ss 78.5 -s 640x352 -vframes 1 -an -f image2 ${f}_preview.jpg
> done
>
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Nate
>
Also, if you used 'cat > $f' then the image would get written to the $f filename and not be displayed.
From pixelnate at gmail.com Sun May 30 15:27:08 2010
From: pixelnate at gmail.com (Nate Turnage)
Date: Sun May 30 15:27:10 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bash scripting noob could use some help with a Bash
script
In-Reply-To: <4C027C2A.2020703@reglue.org>
References:
<4C02645C.6050100@reglue.org>
<4C027C2A.2020703@reglue.org>
Message-ID:
On Sun, May 30, 2010 at 9:54 AM, Don Davis wrote:
> How do I get that to work? How do I remove the file
>
>> extension from $f?
>>
>>
> Have a look at sed, regular expressions, grep, and awk.
> They are the duct tape and flat head screwdrivers of scripting.
>
> for i in *wmv; do ffmpeg -i $i -ss 78.5 -s 640x352 -vframes 1 -an -f image2
> `echo $i | sed 's/\(.*\)\.[A-Za-z]\{3\}/\1/'`_preview.jpg; done
>
> Here -> sed 's/\(.*\)\.[A-Za-z]\{3\}/\1/'`_preview.jpg; done
>
> \. signifies escaping the dot so it's a dot and not 'any character'
>
> [A-Za-z]{3} signifies any combination of 3 upper or lowercase letters; you
> could replace it with \.mov
>
> back ticks contain the subroutine and returns the data. $(echo $i | sed
> 's/\(.*\)\.[A-Za-z]\{3\}/\1/')_preview.jpg; done
>
> $() works as well. The preferred usage is now $(). However, I don't
> remember enough to explain why...
>
>
>
Brilliant! That worked perfectly. I'll definitely look into regex more, but
I didn't know anything about sed or awk.
Thanks,
Nate
From bruce.dubbs at gmail.com Sun May 30 16:06:17 2010
From: bruce.dubbs at gmail.com (Bruce Dubbs)
Date: Sun May 30 16:06:22 2010
Subject: [SATLUG] Bash scripting noob could use some help with a Bash
script
In-Reply-To:
References: <4C02645C.6050100@reglue.org>