that is a fair point...but may i also point out that many Enterprises create apps for their mobile devices (as well as pc's) and having a closed platform like iOS is limiting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

Who cares. For all that volume, they make, sadly, an annual profit of of ~US$350 million across the whole company.

I'll venture a guess that the iPad alone makes a much larger profit than that (If we assume, say, 5 million iPads will be sold this year, at an average price of $600, with a profit margin of 20% - Apple's average - that's $600 million in net income).

Yup it is not about market share it is about profit.... Hmmm does Acre have a war chest of billions in the bank... My point. People buy things that work not things they have to figure out. Just walk int ANY apple store and you will notice that it is FULL of people. That is what they want PERIOD.

that is a fair point...but may i also point out that many Enterprises create apps for their mobile devices (as well as pc's) and having a closed platform like iOS is limiting.

You do know that Apple allows companies to set up their own enterprise app distribution separate from Apple's iTunes app store, right? There are 3 ways to distribute apps: ad-hoc (usually used for beta-testing, etc), iTunes App Store (used by most consumers), and Enterprise (used by large companies to distribute in-house apps to employees).

Couldn't agree more about iOS4. I just said basically the same thing on the other thread.

Instead of doing what you want on your device like flash or porn, you do what the CEO of some company wants you to do. But because this CEO is a celebrity you all follow his whims like he was a rapper hawking the latest Reebok hi tops. Ohhh, Ahhh, I want a pair of hundred dollar sneakers made in a sweatshop! I'm an American and I want it! NOW!!

Before you say I'm a troll, remember the story where Jobs walks out of a restaurant cause he can't get a table? It was the lead story at AI and the photos were picked apart to see if they were fakes. Comparing shadows on objects and such stuff.

No. I'm absolutely right about iOS4 and it's master. And all of you would be the first to give me a "totally agree" or a "spot on" if you were not bloated on Apple pie.

steve our master gave us at least 5 miracle products
with one fantastic lean mean SW os to tie them all together.

My buddy had to buy his wife and kids computers for school << grades 10th thru 2 yr college >>

5 in total /

He bought 5 MB white plastic base models.
got 5 free touches base models no upgrades.
and then 2 ipads for the college kids and 3 160g classic ipod for wife and the younger ones .

Some one at apple sent an extra box for his family filled with goodies like t shirts stickers and stuff. All 5 MB were pre installed with free SW.

Suck in the bottom of the case was a handwritten card stating
>>THANK YOU FROM APPLE <<.

Apple understands that taking great care of its clients is good for APPLE.

why you hate apple so much and need to throw oil and sand in our eyes daily is beyond me.

Open doesn't really mean "open". It just means they can't license it...

Consumers pick the iPad versus what else is available. Consumers pick the iPhone versus what other phones are available. And manufacturers pick what else IS available. They pick Android, not because it's open, not even because it's free, but because they can get it. They can't get iOS.

Of course Apple won't have 100% of the pad market. They don't even cater to a large portion of the market (e.g. people that want cheap stuff). There's plenty of room for devices that are just different. They won't run iOS, because Apple doesn't want them to.

So iOS (and OSX) market share is low, because Apple doesn't want to license it. Apple device market share is usually low because they only target specific segments.

But assuming that device market share is low because it's "closed" is just smack talk by a company that failed to push their own closed system.

Instead of doing what you want on your device like flash or porn, you do what the CEO of some company wants you to do. But because this CEO is a celebrity you all follow his whims like he was a rapper hawking the latest Reebok hi tops. Ohhh, Ahhh, I want a pair of hundred dollar sneakers made in a sweatshop! I'm an American and I want it! NOW!!

You should learn the first rule of posting. It's much better to keep quiet and be thought a fool .... than to post and be proven to be a fool.

Apple, bigger than Google, √ ..... bigger than Microsoft, √ The universe is unfolding as it should. Thanks, Apple.

Couldn't agree more about iOS4. I just said basically the same thing on the other thread.

Instead of doing what you want on your device like flash or porn, you do what the CEO of some company wants you to do. But because this CEO is a celebrity you all follow his whims like he was a rapper hawking the latest Reebok hi tops. Ohhh, Ahhh, I want a pair of hundred dollar sneakers made in a sweatshop! I'm an American and I want it! NOW!!

Before you say I'm a troll, remember the story where Jobs walks out of a restaurant cause he can't get a table? It was the lead story at AI and the photos were picked apart to see if they were fakes. Comparing shadows on objects and such stuff.

No. I'm absolutely right about iOS4 and it's master. And all of you would be the first to give me a "totally agree" or a "spot on" if you were not bloated on Apple pie.

i doubt if anyone is doing what steve jobs wants them to do except for his employees. and if the board goes along with steve's ideas regarding what should or shouldn't be allowed on their product then so what? like you don't have an option? you do, get an android device.

Couldn't agree more about iOS4. I just said basically the same thing on the other thread.
Instead of doing what you want on your device like flash or porn, you do what the CEO of some company wants you to do. But because this CEO is a celebrity you all follow his whims like he was a rapper hawking the latest Reebok hi tops. Ohhh, Ahhh, I want a pair of hundred dollar sneakers made in a sweatshop! I'm an American and I want it! NOW!!
Before you say I'm a troll, remember the story where Jobs walks out of a restaurant cause he can't get a table? It was the lead story at AI and the photos were picked apart to see if they were fakes. Comparing shadows on objects and such stuff.
No. I'm absolutely right about iOS4 and it's master. And all of you would be the first to give me a "totally agree" or a "spot on" if you were not bloated on Apple pie.

So now what is the trend? despise the one that had success?
You are not talking about a regular CEO, this one has made or been part of computer history and with each single product they release he/they (Apple) they just get better. You have to go way back in history to find some products that made such impact in culture such model T, radio, first cell phone. Any big company dream is to have an Steve Jobs as CEO, including Microsoft, Dell, Acer,etc. Just take a look on how bad Ballmer has done on Microsoft, How bad Michael Dell failed predicting Apple's future. In oder words, I totally not agree and you are not on the spot.

Open doesn't really mean "open". It just means they can't license it...

Consumers pick the iPad versus what else is available. Consumers pick the iPhone versus what other phones are available. And manufacturers pick what else IS available. They pick Android, not because it's open, not even because it's free, but because they can get it. They can't get iOS.

Of course Apple won't have 100% of the pad market. They don't even cater to a large portion of the market (e.g. people that want cheap stuff). There's plenty of room for devices that are just different. They won't run iOS, because Apple doesn't want them to.

So iOS (and OSX) market share is low, because Apple doesn't want to license it. Apple device market share is usually low because they only target specific segments.

But assuming that device market share is low because it's "closed" is just smack talk by a company that failed to push their own closed system.

Or more to the point, their own complete systems. Acer isn't going to start developing an OS for their tablets any more than they are going to do so for their PCs. Trying to convince us that their generic hardware plus someone else's OS is somehow automatically more appealing than a completely designed product from somebody else is silly and at least a little desperate. I mean, in what other industry would someone advertise their product as being superior because they only design part of it? Talk about counterintuitive.

70,000 Apps and the highest piracy rate of any mobile platform to date.

You know developers just love switching over to platforms that require thousands (if not tens of thousands) of dollars in development only to have 70% of their earning raped by online pirates.

To say nothing of the fact that it requires maintaining 2 separate code-bases and likely 2 separate teams of developers.

Tack on Market Fragmentation amongst 50+ different form factors (and the technology they support inside) and I'd say you have the perfect formula for pissing off every developer in sight, right from the get go... But really, Wang knows best.

Hmmm, 20% market share, but 80% share of the total profit in the category, 99% mind share, and no need to deal with low quality customers who dredge the bottom of the price barrel and then expect better than bottom of the barrel performance. As usual, Apple is in the better place when evaluated by anything beyond simplistic metrics.

Good luck in that race to the bottom Acer. Such a crouded elevator down.

while i agree with Kyle76 and antkm1, there will be developers who begin to eschew iOS simply because it is closed. i don't think apple hit the tipping point with iOS that it did with the iPod.

as for storneo's quote "same for iPod?", NOTHING came close to the quality and simplicity of the iPod as an MP3 player, but Android and [ugh] winMo7 seem to have fairly elegant interfaces and both companies can toss billions of dollars behind their software.

while i certainly prefer iOS to Android, i have no doubt that Android will NOT fail, and that's good for iOS users. companies need competition. when are we going to get live widgets for app icons? [why does my weather app icon always have to say it's sunny and 73 degrees?] it wouldn't happen nearly as fast if someone out there hadn't already thought of it first.

i will defend Apple as a leading tech innovator in any argument, but i'm not foolish enough to think they don't have to [or do] start their copy machines from time to time.

May be I need to emphasize, after seeing various Android based tablets, I can conclude that "If it is not Apple, it will fail eventually. Archos, eeePad, WePad, Dell Streak (is it tablet, or jumbo phone?), JooJoo, Libretto, Black Pad, etc. There are also many $100 china tablet with "'unauthorized version of Android Market (thought Android is open?)". Are they selling (or predicted, not wished selling) well?

Fun and relaxing way to prepare Japanese Language Proficiency Test (JLPT) test with Juku Apps

So he's ceding 20-30 percent of the market? I think Apple would be OK with that, even if they stumble so much. Because of the iPad's untapped versatility and ability to overcome its declared consumer purpose, its sales will be stranger than Mr. Wang expects, but that also offers a chance for more "business-friendly" companies to get their feet in the door. My guess (and it is only that) is that the iPad will stabilize at around half the tablet market.

Quote:

Originally Posted by antkm1

[M]any Enterprises create apps for their mobile devices (as well as PCs) and having a closed platform like iOS is limiting.

Actually, I think that Apple's release of APIs for the relatively walled-off iOS would make it more attractive to big businesses, which will be gun-shy of the many ways into a system as open as Android. They'll be able to write the programs they need, and without much of the detritus.

Couldn't agree more about iOS4. I just said basically the same thing on the other thread.

Instead of doing what you want on your device like flash or porn, you do what the CEO of some company wants you to do. But because this CEO is a celebrity you all follow his whims like he was a rapper hawking the latest Reebok hi tops. Ohhh, Ahhh, I want a pair of hundred dollar sneakers made in a sweatshop! I'm an American and I want it! NOW!!

Before you say I'm a troll, remember the story where Jobs walks out of a restaurant cause he can't get a table? It was the lead story at AI and the photos were picked apart to see if they were fakes. Comparing shadows on objects and such stuff.

No. I'm absolutely right about iOS4 and it's master. And all of you would be the first to give me a "totally agree" or a "spot on" if you were not bloated on Apple pie.

While your criticisms of Americans are more or less spot on, the other conclusions you draw don't hold much water. Don't really care what Steve wants, I just want the best product. And if I couldn't get a table at a restaurant, I'm sure not hanging around and admiring the decor, I'm going to go get something to eat. (That being said, I'm not really familiar with the story, and don't care to be.)

Attitudes like yours baffle me... So you don't care for iPad or iPhone or iOS, fine. Have your android and your porn and viruses and flash. Why are you angry that other people like it quite a lot? That other people are willing to pay a premium for a refined user experience and sleek design? That other people don't want flash or porn? Just baffled.

Wang should be looking at what the iPod did to SONY rather than the Macintosh model when trying to predict the marketshare of the iPad. The iPad should drop to 70% if the competition ever gets off the ground.

that is a fair point...but may i also point out that many Enterprises create apps for their mobile devices (as well as pc's) and having a closed platform like iOS is limiting.

Why is it limiting? Enterprise has the iOS SDK. Enterprise does not [need] to distribute their apps through the App Store / iTunes. There is no Apple curation or involvement necessary for Enterprise iOS apps.

.

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -

While there are some pretty bold claims here, he could end up being right. But for Apple to end up with 20% market share, the tablet market is going to have to expand tremendously. I'd expect iPad sales to continue to rise, but it's possible that the combined sales of all other tablets would outpace iPad sales. That wouldn't really be a bad thing though, more competetion means better tablets and a 20% share for Apple would still bring in a lot of proffit.

We'll see what happens, but if this claim comes true, Apple will have reshaped yet another market. A market that prior to the iPad, many people said didn't exist.

Take it easy on Acer. They fulfill a need in the market place. Not everyone can afford the Apple Tax.

I agree with your initial statement, but not your conclusion. The trollish and disparaging term "Apple Tax" is meant to infer that there is no value added to Apple products, that you're just paying for the name. Would you say people drive Kias because they can't afford the BMW tax? I would say they can't afford the BMW.

Low quality hardware? What world are you living in? The Evo, Incredible, Droid X and Droid 2 can match the iPhone and in many cases beat it hardware wise. My Evo running 2.2 is far faster then the iPhone and that can not be debated.

Two things: You replied to a post that specifically named Acer " (Android = open because it can run on low quality hardware like Acer)" ..... but you replied and specifically left out the Acer brand .... what's up with that .... info manipulation for the purposes of posting ..... nah, can't be.

Number two .... you, of all people, should know that, anything and everything can be debated on the internet ...... where everyone is on the "honor system" (and seems to have an agenda) .... yeah, that's really reliable, huh?

Apple, bigger than Google, √ ..... bigger than Microsoft, √ The universe is unfolding as it should. Thanks, Apple.

Open platform - depends on your defination of open. According to every manufacturer (other than Apple of course) MS and Google are open because they run on their hardware. So by that defination Apple is closed. THANK GOD for that.

But speaking of Google's openness. One should read TechRepublic's article on this. Google may be "open" but Google has put the consumer movement behind by years.

When Apple iphone was first available on AT&T, Apple convinced AT&T not to put their brand name on the phone and not to install their crapware on the phone. That set the direction for the US handset market to move to the open markets of Europe where the model is very successful.

After the failure of Nexus by HTC Google basically gave up and allowed Verizon to install all kinds of junk on the Android phone. It also allowed Verizon to nickle and dime the consumers to death.

So in reality Apple is far more open than Google and thanks to Google we will have a few more years of CRAPWARE to deal with.

Take it easy on Acer. They fulfill a need in the market place. Not everyone can afford the Apple Tax.

What you see as an Apple Tax I see as the reason to we get the lower ownership cost of a Mac product. But, of course, if one can't see any further than the tip of their nose ..... than that would explain your opinion.

Apple, bigger than Google, √ ..... bigger than Microsoft, √ The universe is unfolding as it should. Thanks, Apple.

While there are some pretty bold claims here, he could end up being right. But for Apple to end up with 20% market share, the tablet market is going to have to expand tremendously. I'd expect iPad sales to continue to rise, but it's possible that the combined sales of all other tablets would outpace iPad sales. That wouldn't really be a bad thing though, more competetion means better tablets and a 20% share for Apple would still bring in a lot of proffit.

We'll see what happens, but if this claim comes true, Apple will have reshaped yet another market. A market that prior to the iPad, many people said didn't exist.

I have the same feeling. When you give away your OS to all comers (Android), the market will be flooded with wannbe iPads. Some just junk, some worthy imitations. Witness the PC and Android phone market: there are a lot of people out there for whom dirt cheap is good enough. Apple will just continue to be Apple, innovating and making great products for the discriminating buyer. If all Steve wanted to do was conquer the world, he would give away his OSes like Google.

May be I need to emphasize, after seeing various Android based tablets, I can conclude that "If it is not Apple, it will fail eventually. Archos, eeePad, WePad, Dell Streak (is it tablet, or jumbo phone?), JooJoo, Libretto, Black Pad, etc. There are also many $100 china tablet with "'unauthorized version of Android Market (thought Android is open?)". Are they selling (or predicted, not wished selling) well?

while i have no interest in buying this stuff, you've left off some decent tablets:
Exo PC, Slate, ink adam, ICD Ultra...
while the tech specs may say they're better than the iPad and the prices are lower, i'm NOT saying they're better, i'm saying that i don't think they will fail.

These generic hardware makers will be beating up on each other much more than they beat up on Apple. How will they differentiate their wares from each other's when they all have the same but fragmented OS? It will end up just being like the commoditized low-margin PC market but it will be even more cutthroat as Acer will not only have to deal with the likes of Dell and Lenovo but with consumer electronics giants like Samsung, LG, and Sony as well as a slew of other smaller manufacturers who will only try to sell their stuff with better pricing and in turn drive down the margins down to bare bones.

The whole scenario is exactly what Apple wants: let the generic clone makers clobber each other and Apple can grab the lion's share of the profits on the high-end - just like with the smartphone. As I linked on another thread, Apple's market share of the global cellphone market is only 3% but Apple makes 48% of the profit share. What's the point of selling gazillions of anything if you're not making a good profit?

If all Steve wanted to do was conquer the world, he would give away his OSes like Google.

You mean like they give away iPods?

Here's my rant on Apple iPod give-aways. When they give you a "free" iPod with your computer, they make you buy the iPod and apply for a "rebate." That way they can say they "sold" x-number of iPods, including the ones they give away. They shouldn't to that. It makes them seem slimy.

Even if he's right about the 20%, Android tablets are definitely not going to take the other 80%. In it's current state, Android is not suited for tablets at all. It doesn't support typical tablet resolutions yet, the UI library is does not have any widgets that suit the larger screen area well, the multitude of different hw specs will make it hard to target 'the Android tablet', and just seeing how the Android market works, it seems most Android users primarily want free software to go with their cheap devices. All this combined will give Android for tablets a really hard time getting any traction among developers. Writing tablet applications takes more time and money than phone apps, so you'd have to have a lot of confidence in your application to target either a subset of Android devices or write for the lowest common denominator Android tablet, hoping that you'll sell enough copies at a $5 price point and not getting screwed over by the many cheapskates who pirate your app to run on their cheap, 'open' devices.

If there's going to be any serious competition for the ipad in the short term, it would be from the WebOS tablet from HP. Now that they bought Palm, they are currently the only company that has all the ingredients to create an interesting software/hardware platform for tablets. Microsoft could be another competitor with wp7, but right now it seems they have their hands full getting it out the door for phones first.

What you see as an Apple Tax I see as the reason to we get the lower ownership cost of a Mac product. But, of course, if one can't see any further than the tip of their nose ..... than that would explain your opinion.

And that is why I say your belly is full of Apple pie. You pay too much and you LIKE it.

Customization is for the 5% geeky fringe. Most consumers could care less about reading the instructions, much less customizing their device. Ease of use and dependability are what 95% of consumers seek.

Exactly. Today my 4 year old daughter grabbed my wife's iPad and opened a movie on it. Granted we had let her play with it a while for a few months so she knew her way around. She knows that if she does not like the screen after she taps and icon, to hit the Home button and then start again. She found the Movies icon, clicked and saw her movies there. She then proceeded to click on them and found the volume and scrubber function. 4 years old. No way this would happen on a WinX or Android machine. Apple makes it simple.