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I read the NRAs rag at the barber shop....and I never see anything in there about them lobbying for tighter sentancing for criminals and certainly nothing about coming up with solutions to keep hands out of the hands of those who shouldnt have them.

Im a gun owner tool..... but from what Ive seen over the years guns dont seem to be doing anything positive in the way of fighting crime..... what I see are people in 2nd amendment hats and tshirts and belt buckles trampling the old folks to get out of harms way when a crisis breaks out....that or gunning down unarmed teens coming from the store with soda or candy or listening to their jungle music way to loud for most folks taste.

Lets try something different...... Lets take everyones guns.....force them to be nice to everyone.....and direct our efforts and cash at getting our legislators to do something about criminals and crime.

Im not sure I want to be trained like the police, they shoot like crap. There marksmanship standard is pathetically low. I doubt they put more than a couple thousand rounds down range in any given year mainly due to budget constraints.
It's the fifth of January and all ready I have shot 184 rounds down range(64 Wednesday night and 120 today~~today was the annual "Money Match", I actually shot against one of the shooters from Top Shot, John Guida <sp>, he was the guy that had to retire early because of knee problem and ya, he cleaned my clock and just about everyone elses to. He's unbelievably fast) and Wednesday night I have another match.

training takes money, period. The police get paid to train, I don't. And a good weekend course probably won't make anyone a better shooter.

I read the NRAs rag at the barber shop....and I never see anything in there about them lobbying for tighter sentancing for criminals and certainly nothing about coming up with solutions to keep hands out of the hands of those who shouldnt have them.

Im a gun owner tool..... but from what Ive seen over the years guns dont seem to be doing anything positive in the way of fighting crime..... what I see are people in 2nd amendment hats and tshirts and belt buckles trampling the old folks to get out of harms way when a crisis breaks out....that or gunning down unarmed teens coming from the store with soda or candy or listening to their jungle music way to loud for most folks taste.

Lets try something different...... Lets take everyones guns.....force them to be nice to everyone.....and direct our efforts and cash at getting our legislators to do something about criminals and crime.

Which of the four NRA magazines were you reading Corny? My guess you were reading American Rifleman. Each of their magazines serves a different focus. The NRA is so involved in doing what you claim they are not that they have an entire foundation and magazine dedicated to the very thing you claim they don't do.

Your sir, are doing a great job of raising the NRA membership. Keep up your silly anti-second amendment, anti-firearm and anti-NRA rants so we can gain more pro-gun, pro-second amendment voices in Washington.

Sorry you feel that way but I also have a right to my opinion of them.

And from what I've seen I don't see any reason to change my mind.

They had their opportunity to be seen in a different light with this last massacre but their response was typical of their agenda and woefully short on any real solutions or compromise.

and exactly what was the democrat/liberal solution to "the problem". Before lunch was served on Dec 14th Liberals were calling for gun control. Talk about a group of batcrazy people, THAT is not a solution to a "problem". It's an agenda looking for a trigger

Thats selfish, agenda driven rhetoric. No real solution to a "problem" other than disarming Law abiding citizens. The crazy folks (including anti-gun democrats) will still get guns, criminals could not careless and are quit possibly laughing there Gang-banger butts off at all you liberals. When all the guns are gone, see how fast crime goes up.

Your sir, are doing a great job of raising the NRA membership. Keep up your silly anti-second amendment, anti-firearm and anti-NRA rants so we can gain more pro-gun, pro-second amendment voices in Washington.

You're certainly welcome.

Its easy for the ignorants to be confused by logic and typical for them to do the opposite of what is actually the intelligent course to take.

No disrespect intended, but maybe there's a 'magical aura' for lack of a better term, that surrounds the uniform of the police and their gun belt that makes them "appear" to have a higher standard of training and knowledge than the rest of us do.

I was waiting for this comparison with your condescending remark about cops.

Cops have far more training in real stress situations and simulated training courses. They also have radios, backup, often a partner, hand-to-hand combat training and a litany of non-lethal options on their belt that they are trained to exhaust before resorting to lethal force.

What do you have in comparison? None of the above but a lethal gun that many do not receive adequate training with. Many CCW people would respond just like the Oregon Mall guy reacted…he froze up. A cop would have laid the guy out on the spot. And he wouldn’t have aimed at his head or been carrying a .22cal.

and exactly what was the democrat/liberal solution to "the problem". Before lunch was served on Dec 14th Liberals were calling for gun control. Talk about a group of batcrazy people, THAT is not a solution to a "problem". It's an agenda looking for a trigger

Thats selfish, agenda driven rhetoric. No real solution to a "problem" other than disarming Law abiding citizens. The crazy folks (including anti-gun democrats) will still get guns, criminals could not careless and are quit possibly laughing there Gang-banger butts off at all you liberals. When all the guns are gone, see how fast crime goes up.

I was waiting for this comparison with your condescending remark about cops.

Cops have far more training in real stress situations and simulated training courses. They also have radios, backup, often a partner, hand-to-hand combat training and a litany of non-lethal options on their belt that they are trained to exhaust before resorting to lethal force.

What do you have in comparison? None of the above but a lethal gun that many do not receive adequate training with. Many CCW people would respond just like the Oregon Mall guy reacted…he froze up. A cop would have laid the guy out on the spot. And he wouldn’t have aimed at his head or been carrying a .22cal.

What disparaging remark did JP make? I agree completely, people think cops have Jedi like powers. Cops not only freeze up, they choke, they miss (see the empire state building shooting, where the "experts with Jedi like powers" shot 16 rounds, killing one and wounding 9 INNOCENT BYSTANDERS.....oops) watch any number of cop involved in shoot outs within 20 feet and see how many people are killed......

A couple other things your should realize, but your to stubborn to figure out. Cops have no legal duty to respond to your call for help, when they do, whats the first thing you see in there hands? 90% of the time, it ain't pepper spray or a Taser. It's a gun. I wonder why that is, uuuum.

A civilians first duty is to RETREAT......lets repeat that.....A civilians first duty is to RETREAT we have no legal leg to stand on if we stand and fight unless the actor is the aggressor and we are the victim. Once the aggressor is disabled or he retreats, civilians may no longer engage the aggressor, or WE become the aggressor and can be prosecuted as such.