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Re: Poll: GOP to blame if "fiscal cliff" talks fail

Well, rather than get into details right away, let's try to establish a broad framework. What, in theory, do you think the ratio of spending cuts to revenue increases should be?

Let Bush tax cuts expire on incomes over $250K, cap deductions and credits at $50K, figure out income from there and cut budget to match. Not necessarily important to pay down debt but must halt it. Whatever ratio that works out at is the correct one. Start budget cuts by slashing unnecessary programs and cutting everything else by 20-30%, including military, and Medicare.

Re: Poll: GOP to blame if "fiscal cliff" talks fail

I like it! It's Draconian and would cut government by about a third. That's about $1 TRILLION just cut right off the top! That's about 4x the cuts from Paul Ryan's plan!

On the other hand, everyone would look back to the current fiscal cliff crisis as the good ol' days!

I don't think you realize how big the deficit is or how little revenue those proposed tax increases would net.

Actually, I know all too well how big the deficit is and how little the tax increases would affect it. Spending would have to be decreased by about 40%to actually balance the budget. You can't make that up in tax increases without completely destroying the economy. That is the reality of how completely screwed up our current budget or lack thereof truly is.

You want to assign different levels of blame. You want to ignore how the dems obstructed when Bush was in office. You ignore that while they were contentious opponents, Clinton and Gingrich and Reagan and O'neil could at least work together. There is no such thing as a little pregnant. On Maury, out of all the guys on stage, only one can be the baby daddy. BOTH sides own this debacle. Get it through your thick skull. It doesn't matter who's "more" to blame in your opinion. They are ALL leading you down the primrose path.
One more time....get off the knob and THINK. You worry about whose to blame, meanwhile, the the lemmings are approaching the fiscal cliff, and if one goes over, they ALL go over....and drag us and our countrys economy down with them. If that happens, all the blame in the world doesn't mean a damn thing. We ALL will suffer with a real recession, inflation and unemployment.

Then you can argue about who is MORE miserable

More hilarity from MoFinz.

How is it that Bush can be brought up when talking about Democrat "obstructionism" 6-10 years ago, but if Bush is brought up in any scenario its declared "Bush bashing" and people should move on because Obama has been in office? What Democrats did and did not do when Bush was in office is utterly irrelevant. We have a crisis now. Lets deal with it instead of making excuses and justifying lack of compromises because "that other dude did something years before". No matter how many straw man arguments and buzzwords you want to throw around, it still doesnt change the fact that Republicans are refusing to solve this crisis.

And of course we can assign blame at different levels. This thread was about a poll. People voted and found the GOP is more to blame. Again, Pelosi leaving a debate isnt as damaging as the majority of the Republican party destroying the economy. Im not sure how to spell it out for you more clearly than i have: not all wounds and damages are the same. A papercut is much easier to recover from than a spinal injury. That your not grasping this concept makes me extremely thankful your not in politics or medicine.

How is it that Bush can be brought up when talking about Democrat "obstructionism" 6-10 years ago, but if Bush is brought up in any scenario its declared "Bush bashing" and people should move on because Obama has been in office? What Democrats did and did not do when Bush was in office is utterly irrelevant. We have a crisis now. Lets deal with it instead of making excuses and justifying lack of compromises because "that other dude did something years before". No matter how many straw man arguments and buzzwords you want to throw around, it still doesnt change the fact that Republicans are refusing to solve this crisis.

And of course we can assign blame at different levels. This thread was about a poll. People voted and found the GOP is more to blame. Again, Pelosi leaving a debate isnt as damaging as the majority of the Republican party destroying the economy. Im not sure how to spell it out for you more clearly than i have: not all wounds and damages are the same. A papercut is much easier to recover from than a spinal injury. That your not grasping this concept makes me extremely thankful your not in politics or medicine.

I KNOW you're not really this slow. You CAN'T be. The whole point i'm making is BOTH sides obstruct, and who is "more" to blame is irrelevant, because both sides are equally culpable. You have spent this entire thread saying the GOP is MORE to blame, agreeing with a poll that was posted. What i've been trying to get through to you is that IT DOESN'T MATTER who is more to blame, there is way more than enough to go around. And Clinton and Gingrich got it done. To tell the truth, the shut down was not a bad thing at all, and we actually saved a few bucks during the down time.

You keep trying to paint me as some far right conservative GOP water carrier. That only illustrates how little you know. I support gay marriage and pot legalization. I support a strong military to defend our interests and out allies. I do not support our action in the middle east, but i don't see it as a war for oil, but rather a war of convenience. I supported lock boxing social security, but it's way too late for that now. I support welfare with conditions and limited time for benefits. I'd rather see publicly funded college than publicly funded healthcare. I don't think Charles Manson is more guilty than his "Family" i think they're all insane. I support modernizing our energy grid, i do not support subsidizing crops or ethanol. I think the Dept. of Education is a waste and that their funding should go back to the states. I dont think government workers should be unionized, because they work for us, and government can not serve us and the workers union at the same time. I believe that we have a President who promised to go through the budgets line by line and cut wasteful spending, but he has yet to do so. I believe gun control means using both hands and do not shott unless you shoot to kill. I believe that people who blindly root for one party of the other either have not researched their parties record against their promises or are just intellectual jello heads parroting back whatever talking points they hear that appeal to their sensitivities. I believe pols should treat the national budget like we treat our househild budgets, because when you get down to it, they're both OUR fiscal houses.

Now....any other questions? Get the Knack? Comprende? Spoken de deutch?

I KNOW you're not really this slow. You CAN'T be. The whole point i'm making is BOTH sides obstruct, and who is "more" to blame is irrelevant, because both sides are equally culpable. You have spent this entire thread saying the GOP is MORE to blame, agreeing with a poll that was posted. What i've been trying to get through to you is that IT DOESN'T MATTER who is more to blame, there is way more than enough to go around. And Clinton and Gingrich got it done. To tell the truth, the shut down was not a bad thing at all, and we actually saved a few bucks during the down time.

You keep trying to paint me as some far right conservative GOP water carrier. That only illustrates how little you know. I support gay marriage and pot legalization. I support a strong military to defend our interests and out allies. I do not support our action in the middle east, but i don't see it as a war for oil, but rather a war of convenience. I supported lock boxing social security, but it's way too late for that now. I support welfare with conditions and limited time for benefits. I'd rather see publicly funded college than publicly funded healthcare. I don't think Charles Manson is more guilty than his "Family" i think they're all insane. I support modernizing our energy grid, i do not support subsidizing crops or ethanol. I think the Dept. of Education is a waste and that their funding should go back to the states. I dont think government workers should be unionized, because they work for us, and government can not serve us and the workers union at the same time. I believe that we have a President who promised to go through the budgets line by line and cut wasteful spending, but he has yet to do so. I believe gun control means using both hands and do not shott unless you shoot to kill. I believe that people who blindly root for one party of the other either have not researched their parties record against their promises or are just intellectual jello heads parroting back whatever talking points they hear that appeal to their sensitivities. I believe pols should treat the national budget like we treat our househild budgets, because when you get down to it, they're both OUR fiscal houses.

Now....any other questions? Get the Knack? Comprende? Spoken de deutch?

Yes, yes, yes. Who cares exactly who is causing the problem, lets just blame the everyone and the government. All things are equal and when a Democrat leaves a debate to use the rest room that is exactly the same as Republicans trying to sabotage the economy. Duly noted.

And yes, i have spent this thread blaming the people who refuse to negotiate in good faith. I have blamed them over those who might have done stuff in the past. I really dont care what excuses are used or "who did what" previously, i just want them to fix this problem. Previous grudges are irrelevant to me. And if Republicans are the ones to blow this thing up, im going to blame them. Mind boggling. I dont have to be "fair and balanced" when assigning fault.

Did burst out laughing when you suggested Clinton and Gingrich got it done. The entire shut down of the government is clearly cooperation.

Dont care about your views that are outside the fiscal cliff, granted its been difficult to keep track of them in between all the Benghazi and Fast and Furious stuff. Kodos to you for your beliefs, perhaps we will address them in other threads during other subjects.