The North Slope of Alaska just had a rainstorm--yes, a rainstorm--during its perpetual darkness season. Yes, it was that warm!!!! As the pressure and temperature gradients wane between the equator and polar regions, the jet stream will become wavier with greater levels of amplitude as theorized by many climate physicists. This will serve to pump more warmth into the high latitudes--yet another unanticipated positive feedback. Check out the Arctic Sea Ice Blog for ongoing info. Karl

There was this guy in the 1400's who used it to scam money from the queen of Spain.

It's just obvious that the world is flat. If you live in Kansas it's obvious.

Global warming? Don't need no high falooting temperature measurements and stuff.. just lick your finger and stick it in the wind.

Whoops I mistook this for the Friday night drunk thread.

On a more serious note. When it comes to deciding what societal institutions to give credence to.

I'll stick with the one that uses evidence and serious peer review of methods and conclusions.

As always the source of your information matters.

Neither of you qualify as peers when it comes to climate science. Period. You do not have the experience required to to be sources of credible opinion. I'm sorry TheChief and Rick. In fact most of the sources you "cite" are not credible either.

I like both of you a great deal as people. I would absolutely take your advice on certain topics as both of you have exceptional expertise in certain areas. But ask yourself

Would you expect good advice from a world renowned heart doctor regarding house framing? Or naval search and rescue procedures? Even if they had "read all about it" ?

Meh.. I hate this thread.. nothing to be gained except pissing off people I genuinely like and admire. Just happen to disagree on this topic which none of us are likely to have any impact on anyway. Nor is it likely at all that any minds will be changed or that even if minds were changed it would matter one bit.