I've been thinking a lot about this new spell that allows us to add power dice. I believe it's called "Power of Darkness," but whatever it is it's the spell that allows us to add D3+1 power dice. It adds a lot to our options in the magic phase. In particular, I'm wondering how to get the most out of it by casting it at the right time or just bluffing. Here's what I'm thinking about doing in my standard list, which is 2 lvl 2 casters at 6 PD:

-if I cast this spell first on 2 dice, it's a no-brainer for my opponent to dispel. Which will suck out some DD, but in the end does me little good.
-if I cast this spell first on 1 die, I've got a 50-50 chance of it going off. Which is not much use either.
-if I cast another spell first, now I'm putting my opponent in a bit of a situation, especially if it's a potent spell. If he stops it, I could use Power of Darkness to keep the magic phase rolling and really do some damage. Then he's got to stop Power of Darkness if I cast it later, but I've gotten off a powerful spell, so Power of Darkness has done it's job.
-if I cast a low casting cost spell first, I think I'll be able to get it off most of the time. I expect most opponents will let a simple magic missile- and perhaps even Chillwind- go if they know this bad boy is waiting.

So my initial inclination is to hold off on using Power of Darkness at first, using it to help me get something else off first. But I haven't played with the spell yet, or even seen the book. So I could have just wasted 7 minutes of my life typing this.

What do you all think?

Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:01 am

Tjd

Corsair

Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 9:59 amPosts: 77

I personally would do the first choice, as long as you have more than one caster, and i think it would do a great amount of benefit. Cast power of darkness, bring out dipel dice, and then cast that one casters spells, then the next PoD, and then their spells. They will likely have to let one of them through, allowing you to reclaim plus some the dice you used to cast it, and the other PoD's.

I would use it in the same way you stated in your 3rd bullet point, but using multiple sorceress' it would be a good idea to draw out dispel dice while leaving at least one power of darkness to be cast, to keep the magic phase rolling.

Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:32 am

Venkh

Malekith's Best Friend

Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2003 12:39 pmPosts: 1975Location: Returned from the East

I am definately going to take a lvl 2 sorceress with the sacrificial knife and the tome of furion.

She can cast power of darkness on one dice and if she fails she can chib one of her bodyguard and roll another. She can then reliabily cast 2 of her remaining three spells with the pool dice.

Early game I might throw 2 dice at POD and then roll another using the knife if I roll above average. This should give my opponent a dilemma. Use a scroll or risk using lots of dice. In my experience a spell cast on 12+ at the beginning of a turn is either allowed through or scrolled. definately worth it in my book.

Theory hammer at this stage but Ill be trying it out on Wednesday

Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:35 am

Alkatchoff

Corsair

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2003 5:10 pmPosts: 95Location: Ottawa

^ But if the rumors are right, both the Knife and Tome are arcane items. As such, that combination, although appealing, wouldn't work.

I've been thinking about this issue too, but along the lines of a Lvl 4 caster.
A Supreme Sorceress with the Black Staff could cause a lot of headaches in the magic phase.
Assuming she's the only caster, she could:
- Cast the Bound PoD spell, forcing the opponent to use a scroll or 2+ dice to be sure to stop it.
- Put two Power Dice to cast it again, forcing a harder dispel attempt or another scroll.
- Assuming both of these are stopped, she can still cast Chillwind and/or Doombolt on two dice fairly easily, or attempt a big spell with 3 or 4 dice.

That's assuming both PoD spells are stopped.

And that's just in the first turn, with only 6 power dice and one bound spell.
Against caddy lists, a Supreme Sorceress with a Black Staff should have free reign over the magic phase, with a ton of Power Dice.

Last edited by Alkatchoff on Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

You can't take Dagger and Tome of Furion on the same mage. They're both Arcane items. However, Dagger on a Lvl4 is an amazingly useful tool. I think this is how I'm gonna run mine.

FG

Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:56 am

Fleshcollector

Noble

Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2006 8:07 pmPosts: 451

I played the new book yesterday against a fellow DE opponent. I took the 2 lv2's and he took a level 4 with bound PoD and level 2.

I cast PoD first with one dice then used the sacrificial dagger which created an immediate problem as to dispel with 2 dice or gain an immediate edge over his 5 DD. I had no problems getting my spells cast each round.

As a side note, I also took the Rink of Hotek on a BG champ and ran my own casters outside the area of effect. His poor High Sorceress became useless against my main body and very soon I had her within the 12" range. The RoH will be the most hated item in the game to date.

-take one level2 with Darkstar Cloak-take only level2 with the Dagger.

Now, first the one with Darkstar cloak casts a medium spell (something like a magical missile) on 3 Dice to draw dispel dice. Then, the one with the Dagger casts another medium spell, using two dice and one sacrificial. This should draw enough dice from my opponent to make sure that when the first one (with the cloak) attempts power of darkness on one dice (and hopefully succeeds) my opponent will have to make a tough choice. After that, the other one with sacrificial dagger casts PoD again, if necessary drawing another dice from one of the warriors she'll be with. This strategy should (against a medium magical defence) be able to draw at least one scroll in my first turn. After that, I'll be using my noble on DS to get rid of one enemy caster and the unleash hell the next turn with my two sorceresses.

HUZZAH!

_________________When I think of something witty, I shall put it here.

Mon Jul 14, 2008 1:11 am

Bounce

Malekith's Best Friend

Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:40 amPosts: 1004

Currently I am thinking of taking a level 4 with the bound Power of Darkness and then a Level 2 as well.
Gives me 8 PD with 3 chances to get PoD off
Firstly I would just cast normal spells with 6 of the PD, which gives me 2-3 spells. If my opponent dispells these I am then free to get up to 12 more PD if I am lucky, 2 if I am very unlucky.

If they don't dispel my first spells then I will actually be able to get Black Horror or Drain Life off reliably every turn.
Either way it is a win-win situation.

_________________"I will embrace death without regret as I embrace life without fear"

Mon Jul 14, 2008 1:37 am

Elfik

Assassin

Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2007 12:24 amPosts: 531Location: Victoria, BC, on the Western shores of the New World

With level 2 sorceresses PoD should be cast first otherwise you might have to use 4 dice on one spell. With a lvl4 I will use the dagger. I'll first cast chillwind and doombolt(or bladewind/word of pain if no doombolt) both on one die(so I can cancel if I roll a 1) with help from the dagger, and guaranteed no miscasts. Then I'll cast Power of Darkness on one die with help as needed from the dagger. Then comes the danger. If possible I'll use all the PoD dice one the next spell. Then I'll use the remaining die + remaining PoD dice + possibly a pool die + dagger for the last spell.

I'll be using the focus familiar on any lvl 4 mage I field. Its just too good if it is as reported. Put her on a pegasus use terrain, friendly models to keep her away from missile fire and peek out with the familiar to cast.

Lvl 2s will get the dagger. I can stick the level 2 in with some spear elves and use them as necessary to boost spells one extra die.

The Staff is just frought with risk in my estimation. How many power dice do you need with 4 spells to cast. Its too many points, prevents me using the focus familiar and I already know the bound spell guaranteed.

_________________To strive, to persevere, to conquer.

Mon Jul 14, 2008 5:09 am

Kuren rath

Trainee Warrior

Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2008 12:43 pmPosts: 37

Power of Darkness will definately be a welcome addition to my magic phase. I usually play 2 level 2 sorceresses so i'll probably try PoD once early to draw some Dispell dice then cast it with my other sorceress about halfway through my magic phase in hopes of getting a few more good casts off or at least forcing my opponent to waste a scroll.

Mon Jul 14, 2008 5:14 am

Venkh

Malekith's Best Friend

Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2003 12:39 pmPosts: 1975Location: Returned from the East

Quote:

^ But if the rumors are right, both the Knife and Tome are arcane items. As such, that combination, although appealing, wouldn't work.

Oops! Even worse because i actually own the book! Looks like the tome is out then.

I am planning on running 3 level 2's in total with the following setup

Venkh mentioned a point which came also to my mind when reading this thread. If you put the casting of PoD too much to the end of your magic phase you could run into the problem that you have not enough spells left to cast to consume the PD. I could imagine that this could fairly easy happens to a Lv2 - if one spell would be a magic missle and you realise that no target is available.

I think PoD is similliar to the Tzeentch spell. With this one I realised that it is nice if you have a strong magicphase you put the presure up for your opponent to dispell early. Casting on 2 dice the success is nearly 100% and gives you with some chances one or two additional dices for your magic phase. If dispelled - your spell casted with
2 PD would also been dispelled. For Lv4 + Lv2 and more I would cast them early - for 2Lv2 I do not know :-)

Mon Jul 14, 2008 9:42 am

Bounce

Malekith's Best Friend

Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:40 amPosts: 1004

That could lead to an interesting situation.
Can we cast spells such as a magic missile at an enemy that is clear a long long way out of range just so we don't take the S5 hits?
Or even just cast it into thin air?

It would really depend on what other spells the level 2 gets.
If both are magic missiles than either don't cast POD or cast POD first and then use 5 or 6 Pd to get the Missiles off.
Other spells like Walking Death would be a lot asafer as at the very least she could cast it on herself.

_________________"I will embrace death without regret as I embrace life without fear"

That could lead to an interesting situation.Can we cast spells such as a magic missile at an enemy that is clear a long long way out of range just so we don't take the S5 hits?Or even just cast it into thin air?

I don't really see why you would want to do that. Casting PoD suggests that there is a reason why you did it, and the reason is, most of the time, that there is another spell you'd like to cast. And the fact that you can throw an unlimited number of dice means that, if you planned properly, there should never be any unused dice left

HUZZAH!

_________________When I think of something witty, I shall put it here.

What you have to remember is that unused PoD power dice are converted into wounds, so it is quite dangerous toward you as well as the enemy, especially on a level 2 caster.

A level 2 has 2 spells (3 with the tome i suppose maximum) as well as power of darkness spell. Now, if you cast a spell first to draw out dispel dice and then cast power of darkness succesfully you could potentially gain 4 power dice on top of those you already have left in your pool. Now, you have 1 maybe 2 spells left to cast and you need to use up all them dice, on 4 dice that is a lot of chance of a miscast happening.

On a level 4 however, following the same method of casting, you generate 2-4 power dice and still have at least 3 spells remaining, so you have plenty to do with those dice without giving a high miscast risk to your character.

If you generate your dice first on a level 2 (perhaps using a level 4 or another level 2 to draw out dispel dice first) you then have 2 power dice + 2-4 from PoD, plus an optional army 2, so potentially 6-8 power dice (maybe +1 with darkstar cloak) and you still have 2 (3 with tome) spells to use them on.

So to summarize i would use PoD first with a level 2 and use it once a spell or two has been cast with a level 4.

I agree with Mordru that the focus familiar is absolutely insane for its abilities and cost on the level 4. For big casters, the most important goal is to survive, as opponents (I know I do) are going to put pressure on the highly vulnerable and expensive mage.

Then there's the offensive ability - +6" range makes a huge difference for a lot of the "powerful but risky =<18" range" spells out there.

I really don't see any reason you wouldn't cast the extra dice spell first, to be honest. Its exactly like it was in 6th ed with lizardmen and second sign. You always cast it first, give your opponent the choice (tough choice always). On 2 dice, chances are you'll roll around a 7. If your opponent really wants to dispel it, they'll have to toss 3 dice at it (there's no sense in tossing 2 dice away for even a 60% chance of success). Even at a 1:1 ration rather than a 2:3 ratio of power dice spent to dispel dice spent by your opponent, that's still not bad when you consider how low risk casting on 2 dice is. My current army has 9 PD and 5 DD. If every army had that and was spending them in a 1:1 ratio, that would be 4 dice plus any bound items I have that will get through for offensive magic. Nothing wrong with that at all.

So, you're best off to make them eat it first since they'll almost have to in the end. The only other option is for your opponent to watch as the difference in PD increases from 9 to 11 or 12 to their 5. 12 vs. 5 compared to 4 vs 0 is hardly much of a choice.

__________________The storm is coming...Are you ready?

Mon Jul 14, 2008 4:14 pm

Decker_cky

Black Guard

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2004 7:55 amPosts: 277

You have it all wrong. PoD is a risk with a big potential upside. To get the best effect, cast your normal magic phase without it, saving a single die on each mage. With the last die, 1 at a time, cast the spell and if it's successful, use those dice immediately. Go through all your mages like that. With the DE magic rules, you have to manage your power dice.

Much like with the tzeentch spell, you use it to revitalize your magic phase halfway through.

Mordru wrote:

Casting spells yu know are going to fail comes under the same heading as intentionally declaring charges you know you cannot make IMO.

Any spell casting at least 2 dice has a chance of success, since double 6's is IF even if it's not high enough to succeed. PoD will always give you at least 2 dice.

Single die castings at spells with 7+ or higher costs is extremely bad sportsmanship though.

Isn't that rather stupid? Saving all those dies for the last spells when you have already used all of your spells?

_________________

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Mon Jul 14, 2008 5:01 pm

Evilelf

Corsair

Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2002 10:12 amPosts: 78Location: Honolulu, HI

POD used early or late in magic phase is just a beautiful thing (assuming that you've managed your spell-casting well). It's a win-win and provides tough choices for our opponents. Even if we die we win (in a sense) because we can claim the moral high ground for being fluffy and pushing our magic to its limits.

Personally, I love the idea of casting it using the dagger to ensure that it gets off when I absolutely need it and have only one power dice remaining and a nasty spell just waiting to be unleashed.

How often do you use all your spells with your basic dice. You plan to potentially have 2-4 extra dice, so likely save 1 spell that would be nice to have. The only army I've ever had that was running out of worthwhile spells to cast was my doombull of tzeentch army with only 6 spells and 12 power dice. Sometimes you just didn't have the spells for the situations.

And what's more stupid....loading up your casters with power dice so a single miscast will likely kill all your mages, or hedging a potentially slightly less effective magic phase to avoid accruing any power dice?

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