Being the first movie I remember seeing in the theater and the first I owned on VHS, I'm pretty much required by law to love the '89 Batman.

That said, I'm a little confused by all of the love for Returns and the common belief it's the best of the 4, and it makes me wonder if people have seen it in awhile. I just watched it a few weeks ago and, despite my love for Walken, Pfeiffer, DeVito and Keaton and as much as it pains me to say... that movie is a fucking mess.

The Garbage Man wrote:That said, I'm a little confused by all of the love for Returns and the common belief it's the best of the 4, and it makes me wonder if people have seen it in awhile. I just watched it a few weeks ago and, despite my love for Walken, Pfeiffer, DeVito and Keaton and as much as it pains me to say... that movie is a fucking mess.

"Batman Returns" has three plot threads looking to actually birth a story. It's sometimes unintelligible. Keaton's Bruce Wayne is more lost in his own asshole than quirky as in the first movie. The sequence where the Penguin and his gang take control of the Batmobile is like something from a bad episode of "Speed Racer." The Penguin story moves from bit to bit without any connection between scenes. Hell, the entire Penguin story is superfluous; the movie should have been about the bat, the cat and the evil magnate.

But the chemistry between Keaton and Pfeiffer is so intense it digs into your brain whenever they share the screen. The chemistry between DeVito and Pfeiffer is intense in a different sort of way, but still electric. Pfeiffer was never more beautiful. The costumes were even better than "Batman," with the batsuit losing the fake muscles, Pfeiffer's catsuit unraveling along with her old life, and the wonderfully outdated suits and coats on Walken.

It's a triumph of style, man, even if Bo Welch had nothing on poor Anton Furst. I watched it recently just to see Keaton and Pfeiffer together, and I'll buy the SE DVD for the same.

"If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all." -- Noam Chomsky

Garbage. Let me preface this by saying Batman really let me down. It was one of the most disappointing movies I have ever seen. It should have been called the Joker, and for all the talk at the time that this was Batman being taken seriously vs. Adam West, I still found Batman to be campy as fuck.

Now, Batman Returns on the other hand takes everything about the first movie, and kind of turns it on its side. The action is better... the comedic moments are tight... Nicholson's abomination is gone... Pfieffer is awesome and hysterical... DeVito is disgusting and hysterical... Walken is creepy and hysterical... Why so much hysterical?

This is only a theory, but I don't think Burton wanted to do this again. And because he didn't he just kind of cut loose and had some fun with it. There are so many inspired moments in Batman Returns that I can't even list them all: HELL HERE, the Mistletoe reveal, Catwoman's first robbery, Selena and Bruce's "date", CHILDREN BEING KIDNAPPED, wacky penguins with missiles... dude its a maelstrom of wackiness and yes it is a mess, but I think it is purposeful. Like I said, I think Burton just kind took his first movie and said fuck it... lets just goof the fuck off with this one. BUT he managed to get some great performances out of Keaton, Walken, DeVito and especially Pfeiffer, who was clearly inspired by the material.

Another thing... I love Burton movies and Returns is MUCH more of a Burton movie than Batman is. His fingerprints are all over it. Somehow he became more engaged through the process. Dennis is right... the designs in the second movie blow Batman away.

In other conversations I have compared Batman Returns to Gremlins: A New Batch. The movies are KIND of about the same thing as the first, but kind of loony. And honestly, after the disappointment with Batman, it just hit me in all the right ways.

How much will these suck ass?!? I like the first one, Returns was so so (although the penguin was a little too gross looking in my opinion) and the other two are best not talked about. I'm shocked that they would invest any money in SE's for anything but hte first one.

Speaking of money, I distinctly remember reading a news story about Warner Bros. giving Joel Schumacher a couple of million to do a director's cut of Batman Forever and/or Batman and Robin. I believe the story came complete with a direct quote from good ol' Joel about what he planned to do. I talked to a friend and he remembers reading the story, too.
The Anthology details mention nothing about any cuts/extensions of any of the movies. Are we both crazy, or does anyone else remember this too?

I did hear something about a director's cut of Forever but I would guess that Warner's research showed that the only person that was interested in seeing it was Schumacher's nephew but Joel already gave him a copy so they didn't bother to press the DVDs.

Home Entertainment – Warner Bros. Home Entertainment will bring fans an array of new Batman titles throughout the year, including the highly anticipated release of the Batman ’66 TV series for the first time ever. Other new releases include animated films Son of Batman (May 6) and Assault on Arkham (summer 2014). Additionally, a 25th Anniversary Edition of Tim Burton’s Batman feature film will be released in the fall.