I actually don't think Soup is worth using all that often as a witch, unless you are the last one alive, and you have no real choice.

The only time Soup becomes strong is if town does dumb things. Deceptive's claim was bad, Bbobjs and Wobber were obvious lovers by day two, and I had Dancer narrowed down to Marabu or Moo (was going to soup Marabu as Dancer if we lynched Deceptive, I think).

The main mistake I made was assuming that the priest was dead when I killed Archon. The priest check n1 was a guilty on Jwlk, but Koopa never revealed - Jwlk got lynched, but that ambiguity meant I could really play off the Deceptive or Jwlk being scum angle to appear more town.

Well, if I wasn't a decomposed corpse right now I'd probably be pretty upset. I suppose it's partially my own fault for accepting my lynch at the end instead of continuing to insist on Eidolonic, but I'm still going to blame everyone else for killing me instead of him. Well...and I didn't really *know* he was actually the last witch, but I'll conveniently leave that part out of my memoirs.

That was partially luck. I had Archon pegged as Priest, and knew I was going to kill him night two - so when he didn't reveal to get Jwlk lynched, I made sure to advocate that lynch since you'd have been able to confirm his alignment.

But uh. Archon wasn't the priest, so if Koopa had revealed his night one check, I'd have looked really bad, I think.

When I knew the priest check n1 was Jwlk, and you latched onto him, yeah. You even said something like "We can use Jwlk's flip to test Deceptive," which insinuated you already knew Jwlk's alignment, heh.

I was genuinely shocked when I found out that you weren't the priest. Although I quickly realized you were the acolyte with the reveal, which helped.

Regarding faction strength, it's really because bbobjs' gambit fed them enough information to do it. His not coming clean forced you to reveal priest as well, which really shouldn't have been necessary. Witches knew from the start that he wasn't priest, and only town was in any doubt. I think it's balanced.

As for exploding witches, that's how you control GAs. But being able to read witch chat after their death makes it a bit much. It kinda makes GAs irrelevant, as well, but it's hard making them relevant without breaking the game.

lol - you read stuff that simply wasn't there. I had no idea jwlk was scum, or checked, and patched onto him because he was "the one that was left" looking at Koopa's cleared list (I thought he'd checked Moo).

I knew he wasn't the priest. I decided he didn't fit as Acolyte unless you were the Priest, and I decided you weren't the priest.

Basically: I knew he wasn't the priest (and 100% dismissed him as the Dancer. Dancer was either Moo or Marabu), and I didn't see him making that claim unless he had the 'I'm one of the lovers' fallback. Him 'checking' you night one, and your interactions with each other pretty much confirmed it for me. I hopped on your lynch that last day to basically force him to claim lovers to guarantee I'd have a 50/50 shot that night if I could redirect it to Marabu.

Arkaal was pretty much confirmed to be EC when angels didn't protect night one, and that was my kill target. I had Ixta pegged as the Judge because I only saw 2 people as possibilities for the role, and I had an different role read on the other person.

So things were narrowed down pretty good. Aerinon I decided was either Martyr or Pope - in retrospect, I should have stuck with my initial read of Martyr, because anyone else would have saved Archon or Koopa to townfirm themselves.

Once Deceptive confirmed that Koopa was Priest, I had it slotted in as:

So I trusted that Kai/Jwlk would explode to make sure Aerinon would die and prevent any Martyr shenanigans, and took the 50% shot in the dark with the lovers.

It worked out, so yay.

Claims are bad, and lovers need to decide if the 50% odds are worth it. I don't think lovers are good roles, and have suggested they be replaced with something like Vigilante/Oracle. Because it's too much townfirm for town, and too easy to narrow things down for scum.

Here are some observer comments I made at Ehrgeix:
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What the fuck, town, Deceptive is like so obviously a witch, how the fuck do you not lynch him
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bbobjs:

"While we're waiting for Deceptive and while I still have internet, does anyone wanta take a guess at who I checked?
Actually wait Jesus I didn't realize the day phases were so short... we really don't have allot of time to dick around. I think (lynch) Eidolonic is scum. "

WTF bbobjs, whether you actually are priest or not, this looks an awful lot like you are claiming you checked Eidolonic and got a scum result. This is a really shitty post since later it seems like you are apparently claiming either not priest or that you didn't check Eidolonic.

It's a good thing wobberjacky is straightening this all out for everyone

Man, I just suck at this. It took me to day 3 to figure out Wobber-bbobjs were possible lovers, but I talked myself out of it D4 only to be reminded that they really were. I flip-flopped a lot on Deceptive-jwlk, too. I should've stuck on Eido after my intial re-read of him, but I question my finding too much sometimes.... sorry Moo and Marabu.

Martyr. I figured you weren't an important role Archon and were bluffing (but you're the Acolyte as often as CPi is the Priest, no?) so I took you off my Martyr list Night 2 which would've been better for me to sac there. I was planning on saccing at some point before the 20th just so I didn't have to deal with my out of towness. I'm glad the game ended early. Lucky shot there Eido on winning. I guess you really didn't have a choice since the lovers would've killed you otherwise.

Kai-/jwlk/and Eido. Aren't you guys all from DLP originally? What a crazy coven...

Kai-/jwlk/and Eido. Aren't you guys all from DLP originally? What a crazy coven...

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Yeah, we are. If you read our QT we were a bit surprised, to say the least. Just was bad timing for us - Jwlk had a vacation randomly pop up on him, I had zero internet on day one, so I couldn't turbo-bus the killer, and I still don't really see what was so bad about Kai's post.

I didn't like Koopa's pro-claim thing, either, but I think it's largely because he didn't understand how soup worked.

I did the only thing that gave me a chance at winning, and won the coinflip. Was just kind of frustrating to be working alone - kept repeating 'two more mislynches, two more mislynches', heh.

Were you able to tell I was priest because I kept forgetting who bbjobs checked?

I don't think things are balanced, and they are quite swingy. I guess maybe if town used martyr and didn't protect deceptive every night.

Aerinon, were you saving Martyr for Deceptive after soup?

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I think that they are quite balanced (I don't know, though) and I think the only major swing is the final soupday. Basically though, if you claim or give away your role you are dead - town had given out a lot of information and had a lot of essentially walking corpses.

BTW. I felt 72 hours for day was a tad short even for TinyHunt. I can't remember if the first one was this fast or furious, but heck I died so early on in that one that deadlines didn't matter to me then.

I think that they are quite balanced (I don't know, though) and I think the only major swing is the final soupday. Basically though, if you claim or give away your role you are dead - town had given out a lot of information and had a lot of essentially walking corpses.

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The problem is that without solid info roles, town needs that info to hunt witches, unless they hand themselves over like Kai- and jwlk did. But if we leak the info, witches get free kills on everyone. Since Soup is effectively "anyone revealed is dead", witches' info access (compared to town's nerfed roles) is just too high.

I'm pretty sure you could change detective to "you learn the role of any player that dies" and remove the "cooldown" on priest checks and it wouldn't significantly impact witches. I also think losing Vigilante's info was a big hit to town, as well. Too much of town's chance for success is wrapped up in the pope right now.

Okay...saying I messed up doesn't begin to cover what i've done, so i'll just hang my head in shame. And be grateful that Eido pulled this out of his ass. I didn't realize there was a killer this game, so... yah I deserved to die. Not to mention I forgot I was going away on vacation for 10 days, so I wasn't even here for the game.

What you call smoke screening is actually how I play, as town and scum. I'm an analyst for a living, and my posts are usually just organizing my thoughts and all of the possibilities. It can resemble stating the obvious at times, but that's not necessarily a bad thing - it helps keep people on track and focused on the most likely worlds.

What's the consensus on best number of players for forumhunts, assuming a typical "one kill per night, one lynch per day" model? This hunt seemed like it went a little too fast, but that one godawful ChocoPi hunt with 40 players among two towns was too much.

It wasn't 40 players, it was something like 33 or so. That said, aerinon's "current environment" is basically that any game above 15-ish is asking for tons of replacements, making lower numbers quite nice.

Maybe twin games (as bbobjs wanted to do) would work with a very low number of players.