Oil Trading Group ***Updated Review***

Oil Trading Group…6 months later.

This past December, 2014, I posted a very positive review of The Oil Trading Group. You can read the original review by clicking here. What is the Oil Trading Group? The Oil Trading Group is a live day trading room, owned and moderated by Jason Love. Since my last review, The Oil Trading Group has grown a bit. There is now has a full time assistant named Dave Hamman. Dave’s job is to handle subscribers, answer technical questions, help subscribers set up their trading platforms correctly, take sales calls, basically Dave Hamman allows Jason Love to focus on just trading. The entire focus of The Oil Trading Group is trading crude oil futures.

The Past And The Future

How did I find Jason Love and The Oil Trading Group? Last year, while trolling through the successfully funded traders at TopStepTrader, I discovered that Jason, in addition to trading for the TopStepTrader investment fund, had also recently set up a trading room advisory. At that time, The Oil Trading Group and Jason Love were relative newcomers to the trading education scene. In my opinion, the website reflected a one man operation, it was pretty rough. Over the past 6 months, Jason has added a blog to the original website that does a better job of describing The Oil Trading Group. In addition to a new blog, he also included a membership portal with some short and handy informational videos that helps traders get set up and trading as soon as possible. Both of these additions, as well as a super accessible Dave Hamman is a massive improvement regarding customer experience. Too many trading educators that I review will spend all of their time focusing on getting your credit card number, once they have your credit card number, then you are just another piece of meat on the assembly line. Jason’s focus has shifted from being more than just a signal provider, he is pushing aggressively towards providing a better customer experience and retention of subscribers. He appears to be doing a pretty good job. And there is evidence to back up my assertion.

Lack Of Complaints

I have learned that whenever I post a positive review, I have very little to gain and everything to lose. As a professional reviewer, a positive review is pretty much a lose/lose proposition for me. If I post a review that exposes a fraud, I receive a bunch of thank you’s from random people, and a few responses from others that got scammed, and many more from folks that read my review and avoided the mess of crap that many trading educators proffer. However, when I make a highly positive review…I need to be really, really sure that my review is not flawed. That every angle is covered. That every possible fraudulent angle has been explored. People read my review and then trust that the information is valid. That what they are reading is honest and not a hyped up piece of promotional bull crap. When I wrote my original, and highly positive review of Jason and The Oil Trading Group…I literally was biting my nails in anticipation. Surely some wreckage would wash up onto my blog and make me look like an idiot.

Discovery

Over the past 6 months, I have had over 100,000 readers spend at least three minutes reading my original review. You can read it here. In addition to 100,000 readers spending at least three minutes reading this specific page, nearly 90% scrolled through the entire page, reading the review and the comments section. I thought that for sure, with 100% certainty that I would be receiving a boat load of negative comments. In truth, I received very little negative feedback. One thing I have discovered is that people will complain, and complain loudly about the tiniest indiscretion. But if a trading product is good…you wont hear a peep of positive feedback. Its as if the consumer of the trading product does not want to make too much noise about their little secret trading gem. They hoard it. But some reach out to me, in a non public manner, to let me know that they are experiencing a life changing transformation in their personal trading.

Successful Students

One of the ways that we can measure the true value of a trading room is to measure the success of the students. This is very difficult. Ultimately, how a student performs is all that really matters. We, as students and consumers of these products show up to make money. We are not there to make friends and chat. We are there to make money. Over the past 6 months, I have received several emails from student/subscribers telling me that they are happy with their results. When it comes in the form of an email, I pretty much just trash the message because vendors that get terrible reviews spam me with positive reviews of their product (The Investimonials Strategy). But when I receive positive feedback in the form of account statements or a congratulation letter from TopStepTrader, I take real notice, especially the TopStepTrader program. Let me explain…many of Jason’s students enroll in the TopStepTrader program because they do not have enough money to trade. If they pass the combine, they receive a trading stake from the TopStepTrader investment program. You cannot bullshit TopStepTrader. Period.

Since February 2014, I have now received my 5th confirmed trader that has now passed the TopTraderTrader trading combine and is trading with someone else’s money, and not risking their own money. The following is a screenshot of the actual combine tally sheet…for the most recent student of Oil Trading Group.

I would like for you to pay especially close attention to May 21, 2015 and May 12, 2015. Notice that on both of these trading days that the trader lost the maximum daily limit of $3,000. In spite of these two massive losing days, he still passed the TopStepTrader combine and received funding. Amazing.

What is crazy about all of this is that I recorded both of the losing days on Camtasia. And they were UGLY. In fact, I emailed Jason and made a comment on how he could possible offer a viable trading room when during the span of 10 trading days, he had managed to lose nearly $6,ooo dollars. Jason responded to my email by saying, “I pushed yet another newbie, know nothing trader through the merciless meat grinder of the TopStepTrader combine, how many of your other trading guru’s can say the same?”. What could I say.

The Making Of Sausage

Since December 2014 through May 2015, I have had unprecedented access to The Oil Trading Group. Jason has given me free and unfettered access to the trading room. I can enter and exit with zero notice. Sometimes I direct my assistant to drop in unannounced and begin screen recordings with no notice. I have recorded strings of up to two weeks. Jason sends me private messages how I am doing? I never respond because I am never actually watching live. I do the watching later. What do I usually see? I am not going to paint a pretty picture…sometimes Jason takes a terrible beating. I have seen multiple occasions where he starts off trading down $1,000 for the day, only to finish up for the day by $2,000. And this is really a common occurrence. It get ugly and messy and I talked about this in my original review. However, in speaking with Jason about these equity swings, he say’s…”this is what professional trading looks like”. And, “making a living at trading is lot like sausage making, you really have to have a tough stomach for what goes into the making of profits. This is a game where your only chance at success is to be both well capitalized and be extremely tough and resilient”.

Jason is tough and grisly.

I like to make fun of Jason Love. He is not very pretty. As this picture to the left accurately depicts…he is not the Wall Street type. It would fair to say that his days of youth and beauty are probably behind him. But what Jason lacks in youth and beauty, he more than makes up for in toughness and proven resiliency. Too many days to count, over too many months, I have watched this guy trade live. Under the pressure and microscope of my Camtasia screen recordings, he just keeps pushing through, putting his trades on the line for all to see. Nobody has ever contacted me and said that this guy is a fraud or a phony. In fact, the thing I hear most is about his mental toughness. I don’t hear much about the wins and the losses, its about the toughness. The grisly, ornery, meaty toughness of this guy. The will to show up every single morning and put on his game face. To start the day by taking on a broken nose and losing a tooth, but persevering through the early beating, only to gain traction and finish the day raising his arms in victory. Day after day, month after month, over and over again.

Tough Like A Turkey Drumstick

Jason and his trading room are a bit like a turkey drumstick. Have you ever eaten a turkey drumstick at your local fair? They always look so good when they are grilling and you can smell the smoke and imagine the flavor. But once you get this big thing in your hands, you quickly realize that its tough and grisly. Yes, it sort of tasty. But mostly its a big meaty thing that requires nearly superhuman effort to consume. This is sort of what its like trading with the Oil Trading Group, you are going to be handed this big meaty turkey drumstick, every single morning, and its your job to defeat this meaty thing by gnawing and gnashing. After awhile you discover that this trading thing is really a tough business. But ultimately, you discover that the drumstick is actually full of protein and quite healthy.

What We Know So Far

Over the past 6 months, the thing I have really learned regarding The Oil Trading Group and trading crude oil futures in particular, is that its a tough but lucrative game. This is not a scalpers market. This is the type of market where you really need to be well capitalized, and you need to be extraordinarily tough minded. The oil market can whip around and knock weak players out of the game quickly. If you show up to trade crude oil, and your account balance is $3k, then you are most likely just grease for the wheel. Guys like Jason are going to take your money and send you home with a sore bottom.

The Way Forward

In my humble opinion, and with much reservation, I feel that the best way to trade with Jason at The Oil Trading Group, is to trade through the TopStepTrader program. Why? Because Jason trades for a living. And since he is trading for a living, he trades multiple contracts, four contracts to be specific. And four contracts is much to much exposure for the average person reading this blog. Most of the people reading this blog are struggling to be profitable and trading with smaller accounts. Most of my readers cannot afford to lose $3k during a single trading session. And if they did, they would be so demoralized, heartbroken, gun shy, and saddled with doubt and fear that I doubt they would have the mettle to keep trading. The TopStepTrading program will allow you to trade 4 contracts of crude oil, and match the trades exactly as Jason is trading. If Jason gets on a hot streak, you could be a funded trader in short order.

For those with live trading accounts willing to trade a 4 lot, its one thing to say, hey I am OK with losing money because I know that Jason is a long term performer. But its entirely different when you experience the day to day grind of the oil market. You can make a lot quickly, and you can lose a lot even quicker.

Since I make recommendations, I feel the most responsible by recommending a system where you can replicate Jason’s trades exactly, not risk your own money, and yet still have a very good chance of quickly passing the TopStepTrader combine.

A Short Video

Below you will see a short, 15 minute video that I created from a live trading session of The Oil Trading Group. In reality, the trading session lasted 2 hours, but I edited out the dead zone where no trades were active. The remaining footage of live trades, which was 45 minutes, I edited the frame speed and condensed the play back rate. The net effect is that you get to watch an entire trading session in only 15 minutes.

How did I select the video? I actually have a massive amount of live recordings from The Oil Trading Group. I had some days where Jason took out over $5k, $4k, a bunch of $3k days. I also have a collection of $3k losing days. And so, when I decided on which recording to show, I decided to show the most “average” trading day. The video that you are about to see is really the closest representation of what an average day looks like at The Oil Trading Group. One more thing, since I had to speed up the frame rate, this made Jason’s voice sound like a chipmunk, so I removed the voice audio and replaced it with a few of my favorite songs. Hope you don’t mind my music selection.

Interesting Side Note

I wanted to make sure that I included an interesting email exchange that I received from a former student of The Oil Trading Group. I was contacted last April from one of Jason’s former students that passed the TopStepTrader combine challenge with Jason’s help. He explained to me how he began trading, mostly unsuccessfully for nearly 3 years and nearly altogether quite trading, however eventually through Jason’s tutelage he was able to finally become profitable. How he passed the combine, then promptly flunked out of the TopStepTrader program by over trading, etc. And that he went back through the combine and made it back a second time. It was a painful journey for him.

What I found interesting is the second time he went through the TopStepTrader combine…he did not do so as a member of The Oil Trading Group. He had learned the core principles behind Jason’s strategy and adapted them. He explained that he got deep into programming, backtesting, and validating what Jason had taught him. He feels like he improved upon Jason’s core knowledge and enhanced it. I do not want to make this “side note” another story altogether, however his story is interesting and I will be publishing the story in the near future.

About TopStepTrader

I want to make sure that I am not outright endorsing the TopStepTrader program. Truth be told, it is a very difficult combine to actually pass. TopStepTrader is only looking for the cream of the crop. Most of us do not fit this description. However, the TopStepTrader program combined with The Oil Trading Group is something to consider for those with less than $25k in trading capital. Also, it might be a good option for those that do not have the mental toughness (yet) to handle multiple thousand dollar losing days. Something to consider. I will definitely be writing a thorough review of TopStepTrader in the weeks ahead. Highlighting the strengths and weaknesses. But that is another day.

Wrapping Things Up

Six months ago, I wrote a glowing review of The Oil Trading Group. Considering how volatile the equity curve, I was reluctant and expecting the worst. Over these last few months, I feel like I have validated the original review. I have amassed a huge amount of recordings and witnessed both the highest highs, and the bloodiest worst days of this trading room. The information that I have provided to you today is my best opinion, and my opinion is that The Oil Trading Group is still a high quality trading product.

Using the TST trading combine is no way an indication you can be successful. I myself have passed 4, been funded 3 times, got 4 other people funded, got my 16 year old son funded, only to have everyone eventually bail on that program because the business model is flawed. Everyone quickly figured out “What the fuck am I doing paying $85 /month in fees, plus commission, to have them take 20% of my profit, when I can just trade myself and keep everything and pay nothing for exchange fees” . And its not like you need a ton of… Read more »

Hey Emmett More, just trying to reach out and get some criticism. Couldn’t find where I can private message you, but I am open to feedback from everyone. Possibly trying to start a trading chatroom service in the future, but we will see. Trying to understand the format that individuals would like to see for a video. So far I have a setup where I first talk about the Aftermarket that discuss what the strategy told me where to enter, place stop, and take profit. Then I show the trade in a fast forward. Please give me feedback where I… Read more »

You know what is funny, your videos are pretty good especially for someone that supposedly just started trading. I know I’m going to get ripped a new one for saying that. Anyway, the point is that these TR’s are all smoke and mirrors. A good trading room will be boring and make money for their customers. Unfortunately, that business model is extremely flawed. It doesn’t exist over the long term. As the room experiences draw downs a trader will lose confidence in the method and stop following the moderator. Most of the time the TR’s will start averaging down or… Read more »

If he is a shill then he deserves every negative comment, but if he’s some young guy looking to improve himself then nothing wrong with trying to get him off the hamster wheel. With some positive comments, maybe he would heed the advise of everyone here. I’m not going to bash the guy for trying. That’s just me. When someone posts here they have to be prepared for criticism. I think he has enough information now to make his own decisions.

If I was a new trader, looking to seek a good system and have a minimum wage paying job and looking to get into day trading. Say I have 5k – 10K of startup capital and want to learn a good strategy or community to get good information.

What direction or advice would you provide this person?

Some advice on a direction to get started, not give up on this dream and keep working that job @ Rob. (^-^)

“What direction or advice would you provide this person?” I would not advice them to waste their money in TST which was designed rules for you to fail while they make their money off fees. I have given advice in many long post throughout this blog. First I would tell them not to join any TR where the operator does not show actual proof they can trade profitably. And I am sure that will eliminate your TR to be. What these people teach is fantasy to scam you into a monthly churn. That dream you talk about turns into a… Read more »

Oh yeah Mike, can you please fill me in what is TS and TR. Also, just wanted to know since you seem like a trader that has been around possibly in these chatrooms, or groups, or what not. What are some content that you would like to see included in the video that you would find beneficial? Also to clear up the misconception of me being a brand new trader. I still consider myself brand new, always in a position to learn, been trading for like 5 years, but its more like learning for the first 3 years with wins… Read more »

Kel, You keep making Antidotal post and post talking about trading. It is easy to scam people talking about trading. What is not easy is to make a live trade with actual profit target and stop losses and trade profitably. Here is my suggestion. Quit talking about opening up a Trading Room (TR) and just DO IT!!!!! I will even help you out and give you instructions on how you can make a fortune with your TR: 1) Go to gotomeeting or other similar site and setup an account, 2) Actual open a futures trading account so you can trade… Read more »

Honestly, I don’t know how anyone can counter any of the points Rob has made in his last 2 posts. Sometimes it is hard to accept the reality after you were mislead for so long, but the cold hard truth about trading is dismal. Yes I’m sure there are the rare few, but I also bet they are properly funded and trade a proven set of strategies that they recycle day after day. I would never tell anyone to quit there job unless they have proven over time that they can consistently take money out of the market and weather… Read more »

You are obviously on a very long journey already. I know how that feels. If you can grow your account in that short of a time period then I don’t believe you will need Top Step. IMO your profit equity curve never seems to slope upward in a smooth manner over time, there will be days of draw downs. That’s reality not fantasy. When I realized that I didn’t have to trade everyday in order to be profitable at the end of the month, I had better months. This is what I think everyone has been trying to tell you.… Read more »

Thanks for your Input Mike, The plan that I am working towards for this new trader is to make 10K with topstep, withdraw 5k @ 0 commission and put it into a different brokerage. I then said trade the brokerage account with a different plan and it will be like your IRA Account for retirement money or emergency money. Keep the topstep account open and trade 1 contract on it and let it be your limited income account. Sure it is now considered my own money and I am also giving them 20%. Truth is the money really isn’t yours… Read more »

BTW, you have to show proof for anyone on this blog to take you seriously. That’s just the way it is. You can thank the deplorable individuals that are out to bilk the uninformed. Anything short of verified brokerage statements will not hold any validity in this day in time. It is a free for all with online trading vendors slaughtering the herd at any chance.

More BS post by Promoter Kel trying to get suckers to join his TR without showing any proof what so ever he can actually trade profitable. Instead nonsense about how he is helping other traders. Claims years of trading yet show no proof of trading profitably. Truly Mind Boggling.

WHERE THE PROOF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh I forgot that is the one thing you cannot show.

I swear I hate con artist shill like you, posting lies and looking to scam people. I really hope the regulators come down and throw people like you in jail where you belong.

Like most con artist you have shown ZERO, NADA proof of anything. All you do is talk about trading, which any TR con artist can do. If is easy to trade sim and then forgot about your losers. There is only 1 think that matter and you just keep glossing over it and that is: TO SHOW REAL LIVE BROKERAGE STATEMENTS AS PROOF. Anything else is the Kel circus act.

How dare you ask for proof? Remember that if you do this kind of thing about our TR, one of the conditions to be there is for the sucker to hire vagabonds to beat you up if you dare to say bad things about our superstar trading room? Notice how because I am setting up the room to help traders, it is no longer MY room, but instead OUR room? Be very careful. The vagabonds are waiting. We are going to make minimum $600 a day like a salary, trading /CL, starting with a 3k account. Our statements speak for… Read more »

I think one day someone is going to come back to this site with an equity curve that goes straight up with verified brokerage statements. As a result, Rob just might collapse with a smile on his face. Big foot does exist. Honestly, he will be happier for that person than that person’s family. I love the debates on this site. No bs, just honesty and great entertainment. You see, no need to pay a TR for financial entertainment. You get all here for free.

It is possible. As I have stated these TR teach people to trade white noise and you will get a Gaussian distribution. So with time less and less are profitable. I think the odds of making money playing powerball are greater than day trading the way most TR teach you, but someone wins powerball.

I looked at Kel’s videos, and having been on TOS myself for several years, it’s really nothing more than showing a journal on a detached window where it doesn’t show if it’s a sim or live dom. Past journals on the ecuadorian beachforum often had “rockstars” as RobB termed who did >occasional< and probably handpicked "live" looking videos. Sometimes these videos a handful are enough to attract a portion of the next new generation of hapless new retail aspirants. This isn't anything new. It's all been done before by many shams over and over for the past several years. MikeM,… Read more »

dtchurn, I hear you and Rob B on every single point. I have to admit the hangover from the kool aid has been slow to dissipate. If you read my posts, I now believe brokerage statements alone are necessary to verify past performance. It’s f’in crazy how many Sykes wanna be are out there looking to dupe the sheep into the monthly churn. There are so many younger dudes being shammed by the easy riches pitch. So many just don’t want to hear the reality of trading not being a daily salary, but more accurate way to gauge is by… Read more »

Thanks MikeM. It was interesting to see how your views on this site and the retail “traducation” industry gradually evolved to where now I would say you’ve completely woken up from the effects of the kool-aid like the rest of us veteran readers and commenters. I’m glad you’ve realized the absurdity of all this shilling and how these shams have gotten away with it for so long. And your comments and more open and generous tone are well appreciated on the comments as I tend to be one of those quick to get caught up more in the emotional witchhunt… Read more »

It is insane how easy it is to believe that you are the problem and not the method. Without validating your strategy with back testing or paper trading without generous fills then you will keep shooting in the dark. After failing at trading miserably on my own , I was duped twice by a trading room and and an educator, but it didn’t take me long to realize that these guys were worse than me and I was better off on my own. However, I still thought there were some rock star sites that may know what they they were… Read more »

The funny thing is I was just arguing with some less than a month ago, I think James or James II saying the same things Kel is saying. Want to start a TR and making $500 a day and so forth. Yet like you say they are all just now miraculous profitable. Where is the guy that was miraculous profitable 3 months ago so he can show proof of his claims. Somehow they do not exist. No you get Kel talking about years of trading and yet shows Sim trading results. This whole industry is beyond sickening. If Kel was… Read more »

Yesterday in the FantasyTradesRoom dot com we made $1000 in /CL using a 2 tick stop. We increased the target to 4 ticks because the action was so good. I told you that in our superstar TR, we are taking money out every day like a salary. If you do not join us, you are missing the boat. Just you wait and see. In one of the trades that went against us, we kept adding cars as we were losing, until the trade reversed and we got our winning trade. Now, remember that even though we were using a 2-tick… Read more »

Mike, One of the things I keep telling folks these scammer devils do not wear horns or carry pitch forks. If they did they would be easy to spot. Instead they come across as sincere and have stories about how they just want to help others like Kel. The TR operators that conned me had some of the best stories about how they made it as a day trader and wanted to help others by giving back. But ask them for proof and they never respond. I see the pattern repeat again and again. Same at BMT where they setup… Read more »

Man o Man, I cannot believe I missed this post. Once I would like to be wrong about a shill. But I must be a shill radar. Now I fully understand your love of TS. You want to pass a combo to use it to promote your TR just like the Oil Trader does. I clearly see the scamming picture now.

As for TopstepTrader, I love what they do, in the beginning, I felt I was spending a lot of money paying for Combines, breaking rules, and buying another combine. I said why don’t I just trade with the money I am spending. Did that, took some huge losses, because I wasn’t as disciplined as I should be and eventually understood how beneficial it can be to work through a strategy. Funny how I got my first funded account after 3 months paying for combine and going through the ftp to blow it up and broke rules when I went live.… Read more »

Interesting as I have yet to met a trader thought TS was worth a damn. There was even a thread with a survey down here. So I will just copy and post what was already written there. And I would love for you to explain what possible advantage TS offers. I have heard many traders say TS is a fee making scam and they have set up a system that virtually everyone will fail at in order to generate more fees. It seems TS is setting up rules designed to sucker in underfunded traders and just keeps dangling a carrot… Read more »

Hey Rob B. I see and understand where this is coming from. So I posted somewhere below a picture of the Funded Account and I will re-post at the bottom of this text. So the process works like this before where they were taking 35% in commissions of the profit? I think that system was adjusted like 3-4 years ago where they now take 20% overall on the withdrawal and the first 5,000 is commission free. The Fees that I paid, for the 50K is But, $165 per month that is if you don’t pass the combine in a month… Read more »

Kel, Nice detailed information. Seriously considering signing with TST are you happy with them? For $375 I pass the 150K combine they give you 150K to trade with? That’s a pretty good deal sure I could pass it on my first attempt!

Oh puleez, have you not read the review? What you have written is most certainly not what you are going to get. Gosh, is there no way to get people to see the truth. Not even after it is written out in excruciating detail. Maybe I should go over to the dark side. I should stop trying to open people’s eyes and instead start my own TR. Lord knows, after being on this blog, I now know that there is nothing I can say that is too outrageous to get the suckers (ahem, “valued customers”) to just hand over their… Read more »

OMG I had enough. I think no one listens to facts anymore. It must be the political environment we are in of alternate facts. I can’t understand why so many will defend the reprehensible con men then call anyone that is a critic just a hater. To each is own. Good luck to the traders that are after those SIM profits of triple digit monthly returns. They will have to learn the hard way. I will wait for the next review to comment.

Cyn, Man do I hear you!! I think Kel and Francis have got to be shills. I have repeatedly asked Kel to explain how this is a good deal and he refuses to answer any real questions and now Francis talking about how he will pass on his first attempt. The fact is most never pass on their first attempt or pass at all and as I explained TS only takes a little risk for 10 days. That is it. After that they risk your money not there money. It is a complete scam, but yet the shill just come… Read more »

I’m no shill just realize that for under $500 i’ll get access to THOUSANDS of dollars trading account, and swinging up to 15 contracts. I’d have to work a long time to afford an account like that, and loosing all that opportunity time between that could be making money in the market far greater than any $10/hour job.

I’m going to get that 5 THOUSAND DOLLARS and then open my own account! I’ll do both!

I won’t be on any hamster wheel way I see it only works when I can get thru to funded in less than 2 months tops. Spent less than $1000 (2 months subs @375 + 2 months data [email protected] 85)to get $4500 risk $. Spend much more and I might as well open my own account. Spend a thou to get 4500??!! Worth it as I see it. I must make 18K in 2 months ..9K Combine target and 9K FTP target. Would really have to be on my game ..trade at least 2 or 3 contracts. If I had… Read more »

Francis, This is Rob B II not that ahole loser Rob B. I just read his post and I am steaming mad. How dare that dickhead question your integrity and imply you work for TST and that you will just disappear in the wind in a month or so. He is just a loser who could not trade his way out of a paper bag. And just because that loser cannot do it he is trying to kill the dream for the rest of us. Seriously he would have you in chains working your $10/hr job the rest of your… Read more »

Rob & Rob II, there is no “10 day grace period” thats what I been trying to tell you. Once into live funded you get $4500 to play with. There is no “10 days” or anything like that the rules have changed.

I won’t be swinging 15 cars right away, I’ll work up to as the account builds up. Stay under 5 cars till my account gets over something like 10K.

Next week is when I start and will report back my progress but I won’t start slinging brokerage statements or bank account balances I have nothing to prove to you or anyone except myself and besides doubt any proof would be enough for most of you. Just keep asking for more.

You guys are traders but you doubt anyone can trade successfully? That doesn’t make sense.

TST is going to spot me thousands of dollars to get me started, and I’ll pay them 20% for that. You need to get up on the new rules.

“I won’t start slinging brokerage statements or bank account balances I have nothing to prove to you or anyone ” What a shocker!!!! “Just keep asking for more.” You haven’t showed anything for anyone to ask for more. All you done is make wild statements. How hard is it to show some brokerage statements of those millions you will be making in no time. Heck show them live to Emmett and start a TR if you want and get a 5 star Review. You will do something virtually no one else has been able to do. Personally if you are… Read more »

Francis, we understand realistic trading numbers for traders that are properly funded in order to make a true living. If you want to swing around 10 lots with proper risk management then you need at least 100g’s to weather the ups and downs of the market. 10,000 per lot traded. Now when I say 100k, one needs access to that money for when you go down 6percent after a draw down which is obviously 6000. With a 100k account, full access to that money, you can withstand the draw down and make it back, but if you are only allowed… Read more »

Mike, You are too kind. From reading this guy’s post I hope he is a shill for TST, otherwise he is a complete fool. I will recap the best I can from his post: 1) He is a $10 hour worker, 2) He has no money to open a live trading account and actually trade, 3) As best I can tell he has never taken a live trade, 4) He has just enough money to pay for TST 150K Combo, 5) He will easily make $9K in the combo the first month without breaking a sweat, 6) He will once… Read more »

I look at like this and I’m ready for the criticism. I enjoy reading dtchurn and Rob’s posts for different reasons. dtchurn seems to leave anecdotal responses that are fun and informative. Rob will give you solid financial facts along with calling people out on everything he doesn’t believe in. If everyone bashed every post without giving the writer a chance to leave their opinion then this blog would only be a few people commenting. It would be boring. Hey, I woke up from the kool aid hangover, but I still want to hear other stories. I find it fascinating… Read more »

Mike, The funny thing is I think I am nice even when I am 90% sure they are shill, but when they just post nonsense I cannot take it anymore. Gee Francis just posted he will not even be taking the combine next week as he does not have the money. At some point it just gets to be to ridiculous. You notice how everyone of these people I and others have called out months ago, never show any proof of their claims and just disappear. There are no shortage of shill out there and they are so use to… Read more »

Man, RobB you really are the shill moderator of tradingschools or next thing close to deputy sheriff, where Emmett the sheriff came to clean house of the retail trading and tradeucation industry of all the compromised review sites and even the shills’ own sites to misdirect web search traffic. This must be at least the 10th time in the past almost three years of trading schools, where some vendor shill and their tag-time pretend “newb” student-trader try to gain traction on a thread of commentary only to be exposed and countered for practically ever shilled post down the spaghetti turns… Read more »

I just hate these shills / TR operators. They are all con artist. I hate them with a passion!!!!!! Probably because I consider myself to a pretty good investor and reasonable intelligent person and pretty damn good with money if I say so myself and they scammed me in the past. I swear NOW I can see their smoke and mirror routine and smell them from a mile away. I tell you a true story. Was rehabbing this place in the shadier part of the city (back in my youthful days). Anyone stop in this restaurant and this guy comes… Read more »

Personally, I do not think TST is the answer for anyone. The rules are created to keep you paying combine fees. As far as succeeding at trading, well I would tell anyone that isn’t properly funded to run and run fast. The answer to a good life is school and a great job where you can earn and save. If you are so hell bent on trading then I would say swing trading with money you can afford to lose. People have to stop saying I won’t be part of the 90 percent which is fine. Well then you better… Read more »

Good point MikeM about having a good education and a steady job to build up with. It’s somewhat disheartening and even disgusting to see comments about people quitting their jobs to follow Ross into trading fortunes, even wishing their son to “learn” to “trade” profitably like another Sykes instead of “wasting” time and money going to college. I haven’t mentioned this much but my personal feeling on trading is that’s it’s very much steeped in the vice of gambling. I think young adults should start of their career life in something other than retail trading at least for a few… Read more »

I was just reiterating what was said on here before on a good education and a lucrative career being the path to a better life. Rob said that a few times that I read and dtchurn in his words too. A way to save as much as you can of what you make is absolutely the path to wealth. 401k with a company matching tax free is how one will not have to worry going into retirement about ever losing health care and every other aspect of life. If started early enough, you should have a very nice retirement which… Read more »

Actually I tell people try and get a job with defined benefits. Practically the only one offering that these days is Govt jobs. That pension plan is worth millions and people do not even think about it.

I admit fun to sling 10-15 cars in a sim account see those thousands add up fast lol. In a real account I would be a lot more conservative like 1-3 untill my confidence in doing the “right” thing ie taking losses quickly, and the account built up a bit. No, don’t consider myself a super trader (at this time) but i feel i have an aptitude for this 😉

The pandabera of the old beachforum reported this type of dream trading pretty much years ago. He would show his winning ticks on Crude up and down the intraday swings of the day. Better yet he would average in (not average down) cars and would never take partial profit. And of course it was all on sim, or at times it would be assumed to be ambiguous. Later on he had reported he had got to the funding stage of TST, but had failed to stay on the live funded stage due to the challenging “restrictions”. We never did find… Read more »

If folks just stopped and thought for 2 seconds and asked the most basic questions, instead of being suckered in the fantasy world. How about why if TST makes their money off profitable traders are they charging these amazing traders so much to so a sim trading combo. I mean if they are really looking for great traders and that is how they make their money then they should have no fee or very little fees. And why does a 150K combo need to pay more than a 50K combine for a sim try out? It does not cost them… Read more »

Somebody told me that “FantasyTradeRoom” is kind of telling too much truth, and asked me to get a better name. so we are changing it to “SalaryTradeRoom”, because we take out money every day from the market, just like a salary. In SalaryTradeRoom, we can have a 2-tick stop which does not get hit even if we take 1 point of heat. In our trade room, stops are never hit, until we make a profit. So we do not have drawdowns. 3% pfft. We have none. Once in a while we make a mistake and when we are adding to… Read more »

Rob, won’t be doing the combine on Monday need couple hundred more in saving. I’ll be on ninjasim again Monday @open all day. (i work 3rd shift, be tired but i’ve done it for last 5 weeks catching catnip here there where possible) I need to get thru combine make 9K target in about 20 trading days that comes out to be 450/day to avoid sub charge for another month. Like I said I’m will to pay another month which would bring me to about 200/day avg profit to reach target. 200/day is definitely doable! (dude thats only 20 oil… Read more »

“Rob, won’t be doing the combine on Monday need couple hundred more in saving. ” Seriously I think this is all anyone needs to know. All this talk about doing a combine and you do not even have enough money to take the combine. How the hell are you then going to pay for another month. Take the 50K combine if you can afford that one instead. This conversation is soooooooooo ridiculous even I cannot take it anymore. I doubt you will ever take the combine and am sure if you do you will fail based on your posts.

I want to save enough to get thru 2 months subscription if need be and 2 months data fees. I’m about there.

Tell you what until i’ll trade off ninjasim 1 contract oil & YM and report back my profit or loss from market open till close. one contract thats it no more, and should i drawdown more tha 500 bucks i quit for the day. what say about that? let me show you…what i can do?

Rob, in about another week i should have a bit over a thou with my next check this friday. untill then i’ll work the nijasim and just for hell of it post my pnl, just for shits & giggles untill i get into the combine, then i’ll post the screenshots ok?

I didn’t know as per your previous post you have been trading profitably for 5 whole weeks. Assuming you are for real, I think you are about to find sim trading and trading a TST combines and trading in the real world are completely different. I for one look forward to your TST results. But if you do not have the money for the 150K combine why wait, just take the $30K combine for only $150. You have the money for that. And you only have to make $1500 which should be like a walk in the park for you.… Read more »

If you were going to trade 15 cars with the 150K combo you would trade less cars with the 30K and work your way up. Please don’t post meaningless trade calls like James did. No matter what the market does you can say I nailed it. Unless you post time stamped calls ahead of time with stop loss and profit targets it has Zero value. Frankly, I can not follow what you plan on doing. In one post you say you are going to start your 150K combo this Monday, Next post you say you don’t have enough money and… Read more »

the trades aren’t meaningless they are live sim trades easily verified by anyone with a live feed. do you have a live feed?

if you want me to stop, i will. i won’t post my combine results either in that case they are one in the same essentially you called it useless. i’m done, nothing will make you happy apparently so why should i try?

posting “i shorted CL @ 44.51 1 car” is absolutely meaningless. What is the point!! This is the kind of BS Scam artist TR post. Cyn stated it best so I do not need to repeat, but yes if this what you plan to post go to BMT where everyone will tell you good luck and way to go Francis. But posting that is of ZERO value to anyone. Seriously what is the point?? Anyone can make random generic calls. And I think you did it just as a way to come back and say nothing you post will make… Read more »

Hey Francis, Take your time trade your plan, no need to rush. No need to swing for the fences. (Sure I might get more bs said about me.) My friend that I referred is about to pass his 150K FTP. On my live, I have a 50K Funded and I am 1K away from 5K. I just only trade 1 contact, so if you get a 150K you can definitely trade more size than me. I didn’t get to trade during the week of July 4th except on July 6, I was drained throughout the week and wasn’t waking up… Read more »

Kel, Every time I read one of your post my Spidey senses start to tingle. In one post you state your taking and passed a 150K combine then in the next post you talk about passing a 50K combine. The inconsistency is mind blowing. But forget the inconsistency, when I read this post it screams TST shill. I cannot image any trader on the planet doing what you claim to be doing. Let’s look at the facts as you state them: 1) You passed a 50K combine which was a piece of cake and now 2) You go right back… Read more »

Stated results to me is just talk. I have known traders not selling anything to embellish statistics so take them for what they are just talk until they are verified. If he wants to come here and talk about his trading to promote himself then he would need verified broker statements. Until then, we shall see. I think we belabored the point about TST not being the answer to under funded traders. Everyone has a different opinion and many will learn for themselves.

Here is the Update Francis. And no this is not my account. It is the friend’s account that I referred. If you want to go read the past post statements and verify the consistency of the documents. 50K Statement is Live Funded that I am trading on, the 150K Statement was the Combine that passed in 12 Days and the FTP which he messed up initially and dug his way out was completed in 22 Days. Good Luck and Trade Well!! ROFL Rob B. I think you are getting too old and your Spidey Senses need recalibrating. But other than… Read more »

Kel, I wish you the best. One thing I disagree with. If you truly intend on opening a room, IMO the only way to stand out is through verified performance. If you verify through Emmett just a few winning months, that would be enough to get you a 5 start review and all the traffic you could handle. It would be enough for me to accept your performance. I wouldn’t ask for more and I believe most if not all the readers would accept your numbers once verified. The only problem is that a fraction can seem to support their… Read more »

You still should comment on your experience with TST. If you feel up to being transparent then talk about the pros and cons along the way. I’m sure there are many traders contemplating on going that route. IMO the more that topic is discussed the more beneficial to you and the readers interested in TST. I think in some way Francis benefited by having the discussion on here with all the readers which started with your post.

Instead of all this Muhammed Ali-like dancing around the issue, just submit your genuine redacted broker statements to Emmett and beg him for a review. All these pictures you are posting are junk that means nothing. Yes, anyone can make up a document and take a screenshot to post. That is all that you are doing. The screenshots are barely legible anyway.

You stated at the beginning you are starting or have started a trading room. Just gather your brokerage statement of the live trades you are making in that TR and show them to Emmett and get a 5 star review. I am not sure what other proof you can show that would have any meaning.

Right there is the real problem. One can not actually believe that a 3% draw down will not occur. That’s if you are smart and only risk 1% or less on each trade. With the way crude can explode in volatility, you better be ready to consistently manage your size which most if not all of new traders do not know how to do effectively.

Yes ignore me because I am just part of the 90 percent that didn’t figure out the market. Those trading rooms are correct. You only need 3 or 4 tick stop in crude and most if not all of your trades will work out. Also, SIM trading is really a different ball game. At the very least, be prepared for the change when you go from SIM to live and you have real dollars on the line. Maybe you got stopped on your last few trades and the market went quiet. Now you are questioning your method and guess what… Read more »

Francis, go for it dude. If you can do it then come back here and prove everyone wrong. That’s up to you. Rob just doesn’t believe in trading the way most rooms try to preach. It is possible that you have something others don’t. He also has a hatred for con men which I support him on. There have been too many bs posts on here. As a result he will call out anything he feels to be made up. IMHO, it’s ok to believe, just be realistic and have a plan in case it doesn’t work out. Without a… Read more »

And I am going to start working out and get the girl in the picture as my girlfriend and then open up a kool-aid stand and become the biggest distributor of drinks in the world and then run for president. And BTW all that is more likely than any of the crap you keep on saying. Just shut up and TAKE THE COMBO (waste your money) then post everyday your results and then post those live trading results and prove us all wrong. But like every other BS artist that has come here I serious doubt we will hear a… Read more »

Rob, are you a trader or an investor? You sound a lot like one of those people that say “it can’t be done because i can’t do it”? There are very successful traders out there man, and many more undiscovered skill. No not easy but nothing worth a dman is is it? you sound a lot like a “portfolio manager” trying to squeeze a couple % SAFELY out of a retirement account so the old fool can have an extra 500 bucks a month w/o touching the principle. I’m not least bit interested in anything like that, I’m going full… Read more »

“Rob, are you a trader or an investor?” I am both. But yes I say what the Day Trading rooms teach is nonsense and there is a reason why none of them can show any actual proof and instead they all post anything and everything but showing any proof. IMHO all the Day Trading room operators are con men. I also say TST is designed to sucker in want to be day traders with rules that are almost guaranteed to make one fail. And anyone that is so broke they need TST is not likely to be a successful trader… Read more »

I will give you the best advice of your life that no TR or TST is going to tell you and I am sure you will not listen either. If you are making $10/hr, forget about the fantasy world of day trading. You will just lose what little money you have. Go get a technical skill or back to college. There are 2 year and even shorter programs with jobs that pay a good income. Then do something 90% of Americans cannot do, live below your means so you can save and invest. And then invest wisely. If you look… Read more »

Francis, the stipulations they put on passing the combine are so stringent that most can not pass or if they do they can not stay funded. Access to that money is just carrot they dangle in front of perspective traders. If you can only lose 2000 before being shut off then 3 or 4 bad days trading futures with multiple contracts will be the end of you. You really never get the luxury of a decent draw down which is very common trading futures. Sometimes a trader will be down for a couple of weeks then catch a nice trending… Read more »

” i’ll get access to THOUSANDS of dollars trading account, ” It does not matter if you have a 1M account if they only let you risk the money you made. “and swinging up to 15 contracts” You are going to swing 15 contracts when the most they allow you to lose for the first 10 day is $2000. Words can not express my thoughts. No one can be this dumb. I think you will remain a $10/hr employee. How can anyone have a conversation with someone that believes this nonsense. For $500 bucks I will get a huge account… Read more »

i can 9 thousand dollars on their sim in less than a month without even breaking a sweat. maybe you can’t do it. but when i do it and i will i’ll get access to a large account. i get 80%, they get 20%. more than fair for them spotting me… greedy guys like you say “it ain’t worth it”, ya well watch shark tank! money makes money! if, IF i can pass in less than one month billing cycle, IF (i know I can) I get many many times that much in a trading account. yea, lot fail, i’m… Read more »

Actually enjoy shark tank. Not sure what that has to do with day trading. “i get 80%, they get 20%. more than fair for them spotting me…” They are not spotting you. Lets play along with your fantasy world and you make $9K in 10 days, because 10 days is all you get. After that they only risk your money – your 9K. TST does not risk a dime and for that you pay them exchange fees and 20%. Now if reality as Tom showed it is a hamster wheel whereby they make their money from fees and not from… Read more »

Rob, I think you got TST rules all wrong, maybe Kel can step in and help. You must trade a MINIMUM of 10 days in both the Combine & FTP to prove you can trade and know & abide by their rules. You can take as long as you want in either of those sim accounts to meet the profit target of $9,000 but no less than 10 days of trading for each. Once the Combine is passed the subscription fee is turned off and you enter the FTP. Trade a minimum of 10 days, reach the profit target of… Read more »

First, I would not trust anything Kel says. I understand the TST rules. After you pass the combine and after you pass the FTD, then you get 10 days to build risk capital, which is the only time TST risk anything. But even there they are not really risking anything as they are using the money all the suckers, I mean traders, paid for the combo. But after that 10 day period TST risk nothing. Absolutely nothing!!!. The risk is the money you made during those 10 days. I have talk to lots of traders that think like you. It… Read more »

It is you who have not been reading TST properly. That is what we have been trying to tell you. Let us assume that you do make 9k in your FTP, and you go live. When you do, you have exactly the 9k that you made to trade with, NOT 150k. It is YOUR money already, and now you have to pay them 20% of whatever you make, and pay fees and vig to boot. They are putting up ZERO money once you are out of FTP. That 4.5k DD you are talking about is 4.5k DD out of money… Read more »

Cyn, I’ve been making over 9K per week trading in sim for last 5 weeks up to 10 contracts per trade. I rarely had a down day! I’ll easily reach that 9K target in 10 days! I’ll rollover to their sim do what I’m doing now w/o a stumble.

When Francis proclaims he’s ready to dump 5k into TST so he can make more than $10/hr that talk is already like what a vendor and their shill would write if Francis isn’t already a shill too, unbelievable. Even more ludicrous comments by “Kel” such as if he had 100k already he would still pay for topstep services. Guaranteed if a real dream achieving day trader (if they exist) built an account from 5k to 100k trading they would never give TopStep a thought as in the back of everyone’s mind, all know it’s just a hamster wheel churn and… Read more »

Francis, I truly wish you good luck from the bottom of my heart. If you are part of the 1 percent then more power to you. Please report back to us on how you are doing in the near future. I mean that with most sincerity.

“For $500 bucks I will get a huge account where I can swing 15 contracts and make a fortune. Man it is like they say a fool and his money are soon departed.” That is the fantasy world that the scammer depends on. If there are no suckers believing that nonsense, how can the scammers make any money? I now see that the TR that I am setting up is not promising enough. I have to up the ante a bit. Any outrageous ideas for me? How can I make the whole thing more attractive? I badly need suckers like… Read more »

How about this? You will never have a losing trade , let alone a losing day. Here is a nod to Pete, just like Al Brooks said he is striving for a year where he never has a losing day your trading room will never have a losing trade period. Moreover, you can start with $500 and by the end of the year it will grow into 1 million dollars. It will just be that easy. No one ever has to work again.

One of TST employees used to come here and defend their nonsense. Soon he realized that we were not as silly as his customers, and were taking apart his nonsense arguments and excuses, so he gave up coming in here.

After all, with so many suckers ready to do the hamster-wheel, why bother with those wise-asses at ts.org.

The shills are relentless. I keep telling people they have a financial incentive to keep spreading their non sense. Look at Kel acting like he is just some unaffiliated person. Give me a break. Talking about how you can get their July 4th 20% off deal. “I am happy with them. For 375 you take a combine which give you a calendar month to trade, and once you pass you go to FTP” What complete BS. The odds of you passing are virtually zero and you keep paying and paying to retake the stupid test again and again and for… Read more »

If the best a TR can do is help me pass a TST combine to create those SIM bucks then I hope the TR accepts monthly fees paid in all the money I made in SIM over the years. Why don’t they just create a game out of trading because these fantasy numbers they are throwing out into cyberspace are just as useless. At least with a trading arcade we can keep high scores like I use to strive for with Pac Man. I can tell you I had the high score, but it will never be used to pay… Read more »

Good point Cyn. I remember when they tried to shill for topstep with some of them pretending to be clients. They thought they could put up a shill front just like the did on the ecadorian beachpooped forum. They, like a number of others were on the xpat owner’s favored deal vendors list for years especially when they were better able to hide their stink unlike Mojo. And the xpat never bothered to test out the combines for himself nor verify there was real significant funding as a supposed prop business. Sad that’s it’s true there’s new hapless aspiring retailers… Read more »

I now believe that the so called traders that counter attack every fact we state are paid shills. If not a shill then they will learn the hard way. I feel bad because I know how dangerous it could be to drink the kool aid then wake up one day to realize one should’ve know better. All the time, money, effort, hope and not to mention opportunity lost that one will never get back. I really don’t wish that on anyone coupled with the con men getting wealthy off the back of retail. It bothers me.

Francis, I would suggest you get a 20% off promo code when they have available, I am not sure if they had a July 4th promo. You can call and ask. I am happy with them. For 375 you take a combine which give you a calendar month to trade, and once you pass you go to FTP (Funded Trader Prep) if you don’t pass your first month, you will get billed for the next month. Do understand its roughly 20 trading day, and if there are holidays in between those will count as trading days with low volatility. So… Read more »

Kel. I KNOW I can pass it in one month, I been working on sim everyday for last 5 weeks and doing well I might add. I’ll just rollover to theirs do what I have been doing just like that. Over 30 trading days in most months, 20 days to pass with 10+ day buffer…not a problem on my end.

Hey Francis, Just plan accordingly, these guys are funny, I would never want to shoot down an ambitious trader. Just because most ppl fail, it is deemed that everyone is going to fail. Go on their website and you can call them directly and ask if they have a promo, they usually send it out, or jump into their Chatroom as a guest and ask. I notice a funny comment saying you will go dark for a couple weeks, must be a swing trader, maybe a change in strategy would be a good idea. Also, their 30 day / 1… Read more »

Kel, a question for you seem to know a lot about how TST works. After I pass the combine and move into FTP (funded trader prep), the monthly fee is shut off correct? I have as much time as I need to pass the FTP w/o a monthly fee right? Just get thru the 10-day Combine within 30 days and you’ll not pay more than one months subscription? Another question about the “150K”: Once I pass both Combine & FTP my account is immediately funded with 45 HUNDREDS DOLLARS? Doesn’t matter what I make in the FTP, I get FOUR… Read more »

Hey Francis, Yes that is correct there will be no monthly fee when you get into FTP. Before they made the change for a 150k account you had 2 months to make 3k in FTP. They updated the rules to now have unlimited time in the FTP to make 9K but they employ the weekly stop limit of 3k. “Another question about the “150K”: Once I pass both Combine & FTP my account is immediately funded with 45 HUNDREDS DOLLARS? Doesn’t matter what I make in the FTP, I get FOUR THOUSAND FIVE HUNDRED DOLLARS, correct?” No, you do not… Read more »

Kel, thanks a lot for the details. I don’t think Rob is up on the latest rule changes. Regarding slinging 15 contracts never going to do that. Probably stick to up to 5 at first till I build over 10K in acoount. That first 5K @ 100% is going straight in my pocket before anything else! The way I see it I’m getting $4500 to play with for a paltry $375 + $85 data fee. Don’t get how these guys here say that’s a bad deal?? What’s the difference between having a $4500 account and having $4500 to risk with?… Read more »

You say, “Before they made the change for a 150k account you had 2 months to make 3k in FTP. They updated the rules to now have unlimited time in the FTP to make 9K but they employ the weekly stop limit of 3k.” Well, it seems that many changes have been made since one of the TST folks came on here to defend the 10-day FTP, and got told that he was talking nonsense. I stand corrected. I shall probably go and read up on the new conditions, so that I can speak with better information. Thanks for the… Read more »

First you showed a 50K combo now a 150K combo. I don’t trust anything you post, but according to your post you passed on June 8th so you have already had almost a month of Live Trading or are you still just sim trading. Should that TR be open by now with proof of live trading results?? Until you show proof of live trading results, everything else is smoke and mirrors. And BTW I am convinced you and Francis are the same person working a scam. No one can be as out of touch in reality as he is. I… Read more »

For sure, what the shills or aspiring affiliaters posting here for TST are not saying is that all the “combines” account “amounts” of $30k, $50k, $150k, whatever are >sim<. (btw, sounds like the larvae combine of alien races from Half-Life 2, lol!) It's a long way to go before they even give a lucky streak combin-er real money , even 1k to trade with and it's more than likely from the client's previous hamster wheeled fees of previous combines.

You say, ” I have as much time as I need to pass the FTP w/o a monthly fee right?” No, no, no, no, no. You have 10 days in FTP. What you make in FTP is absolutely what you get to trade when you go live. Not 4,500 regardless. You make 500 bucks in FTP, then 500 bucks is the max DD you can have when you go live. You get a bigger DD, off with your head and back to the hamster wheel. Another fee. TST wins, you lose! You say, “Another question about the “150K”: Once I… Read more »

“How can anyone say thats a bad deal?” Are you serious. I suggest you read the topstep thread link shown below. First you are painting this perfect picture. Yes I know you are a super star day trader. Lets say all goes perfect for you. After you pass your FTP, then yes TST will risk a little money (using all the money most folks spent in fees) for 10 days. You have to build your risk capital in those 10 days. And it is the money you made that is your risk capital after the 10 days not TST money.… Read more »

“I KNOW I can pass it in one month,” and “Emmett your captchas are too hard.” So the capthas are hard but passing TST combo is a piece of cake. They gave me my laugh for the day. So you are so good with money you have gone your whole life and don’t have a dime saved, except enough to pay for a 1 TST combo and you will be this financial genius Day trader? Interesting!! And if you have saved up any money why would anyone use TST? It amazes me how all the shill come out at the… Read more »

Look TST has been proven to not be a positive situation to be in. There are some posters of this site that have been on that hamster wheel for many years. It really is simple math. There is no large trading account. They do not take risk in a new trader and most if not all will fail. It sounds like you understand the importance of managing risk now. You are so much better off saving a few thousand for yourself, open up your own account and save money on fees. It all adds up. A new trader should look… Read more »

Did you read the top step Survey results? I include the link below. In that article Emmett’s survey showed 79% could not get funded after they spent on average $1,145 per person. And if you get funded the max drawdown is $2,000. So Top Step after making a fortune on all the failed traders takes an initial risk of $2000. That’s it!!!! And it gets worst as that drawdown is only good for 10 days. If you make no money in 10 days then you have to start all over. In fact once again on the survey of the few… Read more »

This is a good summary that should say it all and put the shilling to rest. Now I wonder about those “testimonials” in the past such as the girl who was trading for a “living” with topstep trading “moving averages”. I remember their site even lamely had “pit” diagrammed rooms of the CME putting up some mic chatter trying to fool the retailers into thinking they were involved in something legit. When I bet any of the topstep staff like you’ve often said, “couldn’t trade their way out of a (wet – from their spilt kool-aid) paper bag”. I recall… Read more »

Hey Rob, I apologize, I just saw the Link and read it. I just spent 30 mins writing a very long article about it, tried to attach a photo and it erased everything I wrote. So I am going to summarize. I am not trying to persuade you anyway to believe they are good or bad. I just want to be informative in a service that they offer. So that I do not criticize anyone for whatever the outcome is for them. I am going to tell you a story about a broke ambitious trader who saw the possibility of… Read more »

Kel, When you first posted I was 99% sure you were a shill, but I was still nice, but after you refused to answer any real issues regarding TS and then posted nonsense including this dissertation post I am now 100% sure you are a shill for TS. Where do I even begin. Seriously comparing BS day trading TR operators whereby not a single one can show any proof of their claims to a college education. You seriously must be kidding. You can actual find college educated people actually working at a job and making a living for what they… Read more »

Ohmigosh, RobB you are absolutely right. I thought this guy was at first just some kool-aid bystander still stuck in the TS dream in my initial estimation but now you’ve cleared it up and I can see what you’ve flushed out. A shill, or one of the owners of TS themselves. And they’ve exposed themselves with this inane retelling of anecdote about some supposed friend and showing up the TS ‘combine’ posts like this commentary thread was just another page for a TS “results” ad. I wonder how much is subconsciously related to the TS vendor themselves in their life… Read more »

I must be out of the loop, what does Shill mean? But, if you feel that way, there is really no discussion here but a one sided bias. You feel they will “sham” all their money, and my money as well. I think it just all comes down to being a better trader.I don’t work, affiliate, or endorse Topstep Trader, I only state the service that they offer that once again is a stepping stone to achieving my goals. Con Artist 101 =), Yes. I am conning you to do what exactly? I am curious, do you trade? Or are… Read more »

Kel, are you just not listening? No one here has any problems with you inquiring about TST or Jason Love, but it seems as if you are not listening to the posts. As a result, some are starting to think that you are a paid endorser of those sites because it has been known to happen before. You truly must understand that this retail trading business is loaded with the worst of the worst con men practicing their craft today. These people are wreaking havoc on the unsuspecting and the unwilling to listen. It has been proven that 99.99 percent… Read more »

Thank you Mike M for the kind words. I respect Emmett’s writing, but what would really help me understand and be beneficial for the follow up TST Post would be collecting background and data, trading experience, of the traders who failed and the traders who passed, also if they could post their Combine, FTP, Live results, I would like to see these trading patterns. For me, I like to find out what the people who failed did, so I can learn from their experience and not make the same mistakes they made. But in honesty, I would like to hear… Read more »

Oh yeah Rob regarding to if I read the survey. “In that article Emmett’s survey showed 79% could not get funded after they spent on average $1,145 per person. And if you get funded the max drawdown is $2,000. So Top Step after making a fortune on all the failed traders takes an initial risk of $2000” Yes I read it, but I don’t rank myself with the 79%. What stood out to me was this one comment where the guy said “I have spent around $700. I took $5000 as a withdrawal, and then lost the funded account.” The… Read more »

I know I can pass in 20 days if not sooner, what i’m really a bit worried they see my high win rate and try reverse engineer what I am doing? Does anyone else worry about this, that they take their best of the crop and figure out what they are doing??

They would say want I have been saying and what Tom just posted. But you have ignored the facts about TST and instead tell anecdotal stories. He said it better than I can so I will just quote him here. “What the fuck am I doing paying $85 /month in fees, plus commission, to have them take 20% of my profit, when I can just trade myself and keep everything and pay nothing for exchange fees . And its not like you need a ton of money.. You only need about 6-10k to trade 3-5 contracts of just about everything… Read more »

Requirements are: 1. Unyielding ability to fantasize about coming profits, even after losing many trades in succession. 2. Inability to do simple arithmetic, because 20 losses out of 25 trades must be believed to be a 99.9779% win rate. 3. Willingness to add multiple times to losing positions, until the account is blown up, after which you must replenish it. 4. Willingness to send in multiple checks to the broker, to cover margin calls. 5. Unwillingness to believe that any trading room is teaching fantasy. 6. You have to come to tradingschools.org daily to shill about my magical trading abilities,… Read more »

Kel, Again you just post promotional nonsense. How you will be the 1 in 1000 that makes it. But that has nothing to do with TS and its value, which is zero in my opinion. You repeatedly ignore the actual facts and instead make post such as when you pass the combo on your first attempt and so forth. You ignore all the actual facts how TS works. You post “I don’t mind spending 700 to make 5k.” As if that is the norm, which it is not. But the fact is just do it and don’t get scammed by… Read more »

Hello, recently joined the Oil Trading Group, they have lots of information and it could get overwhelming. His trades are transparent, but his documentation of results are questionable. I met them through Topsteptrader so I am aware of how Topsteptrader works on how you are able to verify trades. In the beginning, I was all about his service being excited, emotional, and winning 2 days in a row. The 3rd day made me question his technique. He over traded, kept going against the trend and eventually logged off and threw his what sounded like a pen on the table and… Read more »

Kel, I think you answered your own questions about this room. If the results are misrepresented in anyway then nothing this man says will ring truthful to me. I would love for my broker to conveniently leave out my losing days. I mean really. The trading room one pays for should be 100 percent transparent. If they show any deception with results then I would run far away as fast as possible. Think about what you are saying. “he is somewhat honest, but he is also misleading” You can not have it both ways. I think another review is warranted… Read more »

I started trading 2 years ago, i had no clues about the markets. I ve been in the OTG trading room in the past but didn’t wanted to take the full membership. I had the possibility to improve my trading habits and strategies a bit and went back to the OTG because i like the mental toughness of Jason, focused on explaining whats going on in the bad and in the good luck. Today … yeah right today he showed up his yearly table, with months red and green months… and he has absolutely no problems on doing so. Because… Read more »

Just too funny. “Honest Trader” and “Real or Fake”, did Jason pass out a script to post and offer a free month if you post it? 2 Alias posting the exact same post. I hope you are not going to make up 10 more alias and post the same thing.

I trialed Jasons room and found him to be honest and upfront about his trades. I see that he knows how to trade and he also understands how difficult trading can be, and shares that as well. Jason however does over trade terribly trying to prove he is right and the market is wrong, bad idea, very bad. He will get into up to 8 reentries at one point, usually 2 to 4, before it works or takes him out with large losses. Be careful of this fact. The problem with that is that he is changing the risk to… Read more »

I trialed Jasons room and found him to be honest and upfront about his trades. I see that he knows how to trade and he also understands how difficult trading can be, and shares that as well. Jason however does over trade terribly trying to prove he is right and the market is wrong, bad idea, very bad. He will get into up to 8 reentries at one point, usually 2 to 4, before it works or takes him out with large losses. Be careful of this fact. The problem with that is that he is changing the risk to… Read more »

TOP STEP TRADER IS MAKING MONEY OFF OF RETAIL TRADERS BY CHARGING MONTHLY FEES FOR TRYING TO GET INTO THE FUNDED TRADER PROGRAM. HOW MUCH MONEY DOES TOP STEP TRADER MAKE FROM PLATFORM, DATA AND USER FEES? HOW MUCH FROM TRADING ACCOUNTS OF FUNDED TRADERS? HOW MANY PEOPLE TRY AND FAIL COMPARED TO THE SMALL NUMBER WHO SUCCEED?

Great questions, John. I feel exactly the same way about a Job in the world out there. How much does the employer make off of me? What % is charged or deducted from each pay period? How many people make more than me? But, not to be a jerk. Regardless of the fees charged, the percentage split, the question comes down to, do you have a strategy that works within the parameters of TST in your favor. To me, it was about possibilities, but the structure had to make sense. I went from driving with Lyft and Uber to getting… Read more »

Playing this recording with music instead of listening to the trader, Jason Love, speaking and talking about the trade he is in is a scam and a fraud. You sound like a shill for Jason Love, now. in my opinion… I have watched Jason make bad trades, move his stops and get his stoploss hit after holding out for more than 30 minutes and hoping for a bigger gain. I have heard his comments when the market reverses right after hitting his stops and goes to his target price. He missed the pullback trade in my opinion… Real trading is… Read more »

Hi Emmett, after reading both your reviews and the comments, I have these observations: 1. You seem to have a double standard with OTG. With other vendors, you are adamant in getting verifiable statements. With OTG, you appear to be more sympathetic by saying “And this is the reason why Jason does not openly post results because with numbers like this, whom would subscribe? ” in one of your comments. 2. If the TopStepTrader combine can be tried multiple times, with my limited knowledge in Statistics, the success with TST becomes meaningless, unless we also know how many times Jason… Read more »

Hey Jim, Point 2 Taken, but TST uses a 3rd Party to verify the trades. They aren’t able to remove trades from Rithmic Trader. If you say that Jason has tried multiple times then post, well its a lot of work with the first-hand experience. Let me try my best to explain. With the screen shot, look at the days consistency, look for gaps, if he only wants to make it look good with consistent winners, that mean he has to have multiple combines, log in to one and not the other trade it like the other one, and it… Read more »

probably because they’re on a losing streak. The OTG review is old, at a time when Emmett was far more lenient and hopeful and could be fooled by faked “proof” and faked credentials such as fake wharton phd snapshots or slimy yet charming Primo-types. . Just that he’s busy so many other shams he hadn’t been able to update all the past reviews. If enough former OTG duped clients complain to Emmett with unfortunately savings decimated and bigger cc debt stories then an OTG update would more likely be on the short update list of tradingschools.

Hi Emmett, I have noticed Jason has ventured to a new format, by bumping up his contracts. I dont know where he is in the P&L game, but I assume it’s not going well? or low on the dough??Anyway …trading a 150k paper account is a good as me dating one of Lamar Odems’ pricey ladies. It’s not relevant. The time that Jason placed his trades in aboves pics is like a cat on a hot tin roof the trades were only seconds long. As I have been in his room his trades are sometimes an hour. BTW. I am… Read more »

“As good as you dating one of Lamar Odoms pricey ladies”…LOL! Had me laughing out loud. Great analogy. Regarding Jason, he is now trading a live $15k account and posting the actual results. Not to toot my own horn, but I got him to trade a single unit, small account in hopes of showing that a small lot trader can actually make it. Has been doing this for a few weeks and is up and down, a bit over break even. Trading a 3 unit is a heck of a lot easier than trading a 1 unit. Jason is a… Read more »

I agree with what morgan says. Also, looking at the video included in this post, it looks like Jason could not guess well the direction of the market and tried to force his way through like an amateur. He was wandering, long and short like a chicken, exposing his trading account. Overtrading and inefficiency. Does he really make money- trading like this.