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Pokémon clearly have a concept of morality, and aren't some dumb mutt. I find it hard to believe that out of 649 species, not a single one thought to themselves "hey, maybe I can use my powers of nightmares to rule the world!". Also, there have been real life cases of animals performing crimes like kidnapping. Also, Spiritomb sez hai. He's 108 evil spirits bound to a stone 'cause they did bad things.

Um, what? Do you or have you EVER owned a pet? You should know how smart they can be. There's a whole freaking meme built around cats for gosh sakes!

Pokémon clearly have a concept of morality, and aren't some dumb mutt. I find it hard to believe that out of 649 species, not a single one thought to themselves "hey, maybe I can use my powers of nightmares to rule the world!". Also, there have been real life cases of animals performing crimes like kidnapping. Also, Spiritomb sez hai. He's 108 evil spirits bound to a stone 'cause they did bad things.

Wow, just wow. >.> Believe me, my dogs/cat know if they did something right or wrong. They aren't as dumb as you think.

Animals kidnapping? Pfft the only thing I can think of is some ants with some smaller ants. While it's kidnapping, I'm sure there's some adaptation for why they do it.

As for Pokemon the notable thing is they have their own language and can speak English/Japanese through Telepathy. They are obviously advanced creatures but I think that's more to make them easier to understand for the little kids watching Pokemon.

As I said elsewhere (on this topic, maybe?), Pokémon are definetely as smart as or even smarter as humans. And while Ekans' "no bad Pokés" quote should be taken with a pinch of salt, it shows that Pokémon have a clear sense of morality. So logically, there should be at least one who realises it's far more powerful than humans, and decides to use their power to become a terrorist/god/destroyer of worlds/what have you.

Shokotan: "And then, in Extremespeed Genesect: The Awakening of Mewtwo, we meet another Mewtwo!"
Yuyama: "Yes, I thought it'd be better if it was a different Mewtwo."

Good for you Yuyama. Too bad you've singlehandedly torpedoed any lingering respect I and anyone else had for you.

Anything that has free will can become evil. I don't buy the whole 'Pokemon can't be evil' argument. Because whenever it's brought up, I simply say, 'Says who?'.

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Says Jessie's Ekans... and unless that Ekans was told by Arceus Itself that Pokémon cannot be evil, I don't buy it.

Originally Posted by matt0044

While there can be morally gray Pokemon, that tropes been done to death so I agree that there needs be more vareity in terms of Pokemon characters.

Exactly. The whole "Evil-looking guy isn't really evil" thing may have been cute once, but when you see it for the 50th time, the gimmick wears itself out. I still don't see why Pokés can't be the devil, but humans can do it fine. It makes me think of a story that says there is no such thing as pure evil... yet has villains who are not portrayed in any positive way.

Make an evil looking Poké that's actually evil for once pls.

Last edited by Spin Attaxx; 28th November 2012 at 8:46 PM.

Shokotan: "And then, in Extremespeed Genesect: The Awakening of Mewtwo, we meet another Mewtwo!"
Yuyama: "Yes, I thought it'd be better if it was a different Mewtwo."

Good for you Yuyama. Too bad you've singlehandedly torpedoed any lingering respect I and anyone else had for you.

As I said elsewhere (on this topic, maybe?), Pokémon are definetely as smart as or even smarter as humans. And while Ekans' "no bad Pokés" quote should be taken with a pinch of salt, it shows that Pokémon have a clear sense of morality. So logically, there should be at least one who realises it's far more powerful than humans, and decides to use their power to become a terrorist/god/destroyer of worlds/what have you.

Mewtwo did. He very clearly wanted to go against the norm of "all Pokemon must be nice to humans" (which is apparently so ingrained into every Pokemon's mind that it's practically genetic), but instead wussed out and conformed to it in the end.

Meowth's about the only Pokemon in existence who truly chose (and continues) to be wicked and malevolent towards man, and not just as a mischievous tormentor (like Spiritomb, for one).

Mewtwo did. He very clearly wanted to go against the norm of "all Pokemon must be nice to humans" (which is apparently so ingrained into every Pokemon's mind that it's practically genetic), but instead wussed out and conformed to it in the end.

... Or, rather, events happened that opened his eyes to the fact that being an ******* to humans is actually seriously a bad thing.

98% of the teenage population has died smoking pot. If you're one of the 2% who hasn't, copy & paste this in your signature.
Good old natural selection...

Ah yes - the Arceus ex Machina. Seriously, those blasts should've nuked Ash. And, as the Nostalgia Critic said, crying to raise the dead isn't very smart writing. And the whole "Poké tears are filled with Ressurectium" thing was dub only, so it is completely out of nowhere.

And sadly, even Mewtwo, the original evil Poké, wasn't inherently evil. His friend died, and that made him evil. I never liked that whole "my loved one is dead, I'MMA KILL THE UNIVERSE" motivation, I'd prefer if he were evil from birth. Kinda makes more sense to me.

Last edited by Spin Attaxx; 29th November 2012 at 6:52 PM.

Shokotan: "And then, in Extremespeed Genesect: The Awakening of Mewtwo, we meet another Mewtwo!"
Yuyama: "Yes, I thought it'd be better if it was a different Mewtwo."

Good for you Yuyama. Too bad you've singlehandedly torpedoed any lingering respect I and anyone else had for you.

And sadly, even Mewtwo, the original evil Poké, wasn't inherently evil. His friend died, and that made him evil. I never liked that whole "my loved one is dead, I'MMA KILL THE UNIVERSE" motivation, I'd prefer if he were evil from birth. Kinda makes more sense to me.

Isn't it hard for something to be born evil? Things all start out the same--as in not knowing enough about the world to despise it (unless with some mental illness or whatever) :/

Well, Mewtwo wasn't technically born - he was created, and his violent nature is said to be due to the scientist failing to give Mewtwo a warm heart. In other words, Mewtwo was - albeit unintentionally - made evil.

Shokotan: "And then, in Extremespeed Genesect: The Awakening of Mewtwo, we meet another Mewtwo!"
Yuyama: "Yes, I thought it'd be better if it was a different Mewtwo."

Good for you Yuyama. Too bad you've singlehandedly torpedoed any lingering respect I and anyone else had for you.

Shadow pokemon haven't featured in the anime or at least i haven't seen them, so i don't really know. On the subject of mewtwo, i think he was 'evil' because they wanted to create the ultimate pokemon. So really, it's another case of tragic backstory. Personally, i want to see a true evil pokemon, it would make it more exciting. But sadly that probably won't happen.

Well, Genesect is the next candidate for "evil Pokémon", and they made a Pokémon - Kyurem - the antagonist of the last movie (last that happened was, what, 12 years ago?), so if all goes well, he'll be the Pokémon equivalent of the Daleks. If not, he'll be made a goody goody to make the human villan look more evil. Guess which is more likely to happen... *sigh*

Shokotan: "And then, in Extremespeed Genesect: The Awakening of Mewtwo, we meet another Mewtwo!"
Yuyama: "Yes, I thought it'd be better if it was a different Mewtwo."

Good for you Yuyama. Too bad you've singlehandedly torpedoed any lingering respect I and anyone else had for you.

Shadow pokemon haven't featured in the anime or at least i haven't seen them, so i don't really know.

In my view, Shadow Pokemon are what happens when humans suck all the morality and self-restraint out of a Pokemon's heart and leave mindless hate in its place. They're about akin to rabid animals that lash out at anything that moves.

Well, Mewtwo wasn't technically born - he was created, and his violent nature is said to be due to the scientist failing to give Mewtwo a warm heart. In other words, Mewtwo was - albeit unintentionally - made evil.

Is that seriously the plot angle they went with in the Japanese version?

Either way, Pokemon have free will. They can think and make their own decisions, as we've seen countless times in the Anime and games. Therefore, that must mean, they are just as capable of evil as humans.

Last edited by SBaby; 4th December 2012 at 8:52 AM.

Rules of fansites:
1 - You can either be right, or you can be happy.
3 - If you think someone is lying about being an expert, they are.
5 - If you think someone is lying about knowing people who work in the industry, they are.
14 - All sources are one-sided.
27 - There's no such thing as an honest politician.