Well that didn't take long...surly McConnell should have known if he pushed this through in 2 days he would have lost 4 seats on that alone

It's a calculated move. First make outlandish rules, then make concessions to make yourself look better. Not to mention, he gets to say "I've already caved this many times, what more do the democrats want?"

It's a calculated move. First make outlandish rules, then make concessions to make yourself look better. Not to mention, he gets to say "I've already caved this many times, what more do the democrats want?"

And there's the votes to adopt McConnell's rules, without a single Republican defecting. 53-47, straight party lines.

Let the Cover Up begin!

Reminds me of what a piece of shit Romney is every time. That dude talks so much about how he is "Very concerned" and "The Senate needs to get to the bottom of this", and "The House needs to send it to the Senate to try it", and the very first vote that comes up, he votes against seeing witnesses, and he is about to vote against seeing evidence as well.

I think I prefer Gym Jordan. At least he is consistent and doesn't pretend to be anything except a diehard Trumper.

"We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China. We have it under control. It’s going to be just fine." DJT- Jan 22, 2020
"And again, when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done." DJT- Feb 26, 2020
“It’s going to disappear. One day — it’s like a miracle — it will disappear.” DJT- Feb 27, 2020

It's a calculated move. First make outlandish rules, then make concessions to make yourself look better. Not to mention, he gets to say "I've already caved this many times, what more do the democrats want?"

Reminds me of what a piece of shit Romney is every time. That dude talks so much about how he is "Very concerned" and "The Senate needs to get to the bottom of this", and "The House needs to send it to the Senate to try it", and the very first vote that comes up, he votes against seeing witnesses, and he is about to vote against seeing evidence as well.

I think I prefer Gym Jordan. At least he is consistent and doesn't pretend to be anything except a diehard Trumper.

People have to understand, Romney is as spineless as they come. He's more of a political windsock than Hillary could ever be, and he has no actual principles.

Originally Posted by Knadra

Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.

This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

Not trying to argue with moderation here, but this seems very unfair. In an ideal world, where Senators voted on the preponderance of evidence, this would be a fair rule, and discussions of the political impacts would be off topic. We do not live in that fairy tale world. 90 out of 100 senators are going to vote the way they think is most likely to get them reelected or the most plush post Senate job. And that is being extremely generous to 10 senators.

In the context of reality, discussing how vulnerable a given Senator is for reelection is EXTREMELY relevant to this thread, both because of that Senator's desire for Self preservation, and McConnell's insistence on preserving his majority. Essentially, this entire impeachment hinges on "Future election odds and outcomes". The facts of the case are irrelevant. It isn't right, I am not happy about it, but it is reality, and banning us from talking about it completely kills the discussion.

Originally Posted by Machismo

People have to understand, Romney is as spineless as they come. He's more of a political windsock than Hillary could ever be, and he has no actual principles.

My exact point.

"We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China. We have it under control. It’s going to be just fine." DJT- Jan 22, 2020
"And again, when you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done." DJT- Feb 26, 2020
“It’s going to disappear. One day — it’s like a miracle — it will disappear.” DJT- Feb 27, 2020

Not trying to argue with moderation here, but this seems very unfair. In an ideal world, where Senators voted on the preponderance of evidence, this would be a fair rule, and discussions of the political impacts would be off topic. We do not live in that fairy tale world. 90 out of 100 senators are going to vote the way they think is most likely to get them reelected or the most plush post Senate job. And that is being extremely generous to 10 senators.

In the context of reality, discussing how vulnerable a given Senator is for reelection is EXTREMELY relevant to this thread, both because of that Senator's desire for Self preservation, and McConnell's insistence on preserving his majority. Essentially, this entire impeachment hinges on "Future election odds and outcomes". The facts of the case are irrelevant. It isn't right, I am not happy about it, but it is reality, and banning us from talking about it completely kills the discussion.

My exact point.

Luckily, this will be Romney's political legacy. When he dies, and people call to mourn him, I will scoff at how truly useless and ineffective he was. There are plenty of politicians I have disagreed with (basically all of them), but I can still respect their principles and ethics.

Originally Posted by Knadra

Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.

This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

Luckily, this will be Romney's political legacy. When he dies, and people call to mourn him, I will scoff at how truly useless and ineffective he was. There are plenty of politicians I have disagreed with (basically all of them), but I can still respect their principles and ethics.

When it came down to it, when the country needed him on health care, McCain voted down the repeal of ACA. There's a lot of his stuff (especially on the foreign policy side) I didn't agree with McCain, but one of his last acts in the Senate was to listen to his constituents and vote for the right thing to do...

...unfortunately it was diluted by the fact that he knew he was dying and would never run another election again, but, oh well, I guess.

When it came down to it, when the country needed him on health care, McCain voted down the repeal of ACA. There's a lot of his stuff (especially on the foreign policy side) I didn't agree with McCain, but one of his last acts in the Senate was to listen to his constituents and vote for the right thing to do...

...unfortunately it was diluted by the fact that he knew he was dying and would never run another election again, but, oh well, I guess.

I had some respect for McCain (not a lot, but some). He was also largely spineless, and went with the pack far too often, even when it went against his stated principles. Sure, he went back to being the "maverick" people claimed him to be, but that was only at the very end.

Originally Posted by Knadra

Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.

This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.

I am honestly wondering if they are going to try wholesale rigging elections to keep power at this point. They HAVE to know the consequences if they are out of power and with everything they have done so far, that really isn't a stretch for them, especially with the history of electronic voting going all the way back to the Bush years.

I fear we will get a huge deal over election fraud followed by another "Anthrax in the mail" scare or something similar just long enough to distract the media who then never looks back.

I am deeply concerned about that as well. The moment a Democrat sits in the White House a entire division will be created to investigate what Trump and his crime family have wrought on this country and the world. Given that...yeah, they must know that will happen, and I can definitely see some vote rigging going on. And because our voting system is so shitty (i.e. the deplorableness of the Electoral College) it might only take a dozen or so counties in key states to flip the vote.

If I were on the DNC's Election Security Committee, I'd be losing my shit. There is no way we might even know they did it.