In my belief journey, I have been toying with the idea of becoming a vegetarian. Never vegan, as I feel milk, cheese, eggs, etc. are good for their source of protein. Your points, Zat, are all very good. I like how you stated that you will not eat anything that objects to being eaten. I have a clean vegan friend who said that she stopped eating meat because of ethics, when I asked her the reason. I asked her about free range and organic farming, and she said that it is often more kind to the animals, but even organic farms will mistreat the animals. I hate how long I have lived in such a gullible, ignorant bubble. But I think it's finally popped.
Lots to think about. I guess you could say I am am already semi-vegetarian and I only eat meat when my parents cook it. But I hate being on the fence when it comes to most things. What I hate more is cruelty - so I should start practising what I preach.
Thanks Zat!

I understood the main point why you did...your lady friend. Take her out of the equation for a one minute. Choose between a Steak or a salad. I WIN.

Hindus, just dont eat cows, because they are one of their gods........

Arguing with a Christian is a lot like playing chess with a pigeon. You can be the greatest player in the world, yet the pigeon will knock over all the pieces, shit on the board and strut away triumphantly.

Quote: Flowergurl: But I hate being on the fence when it comes to most things.

Everyone has to make their choices according to their own circumstances, and at their own pace.
If all choices are equally valid, that's not an ethical decision - that's a coin-toss. An ethical stand is one you consider so clearly superior that you can defend it against contumly, derision and hostility. You have to choose what's right on a firm basis of information and conviction - not a stranger's attire, not a gut reaction, not a fad. It's got to be right for you , regardless of whether it's right for passionate baconists, moose hunters, cavemen or people with allergies.

BTW - Any prosperous westerner who makes a choice of consuming less, local and efficient* food, is also leaving that much more of the planet's resources for other people.

(* ground+water+sunlight is the most direct food production: the most efficient nutrition possible is your own organic garden. The introduction of fertilizer adds a level of complexity; pesticide, another level; factory farming, distribution centers and transport wastes both nutrient and other energy; processing the plant nutrients through other animals reduces the product; shipping those animals to slaughter, then packing facilities, distributors cooling trucks and freezers, supermarkets....
See how many factors can be taken into consideration? Don't rush your decisions.)

(16-02-2013 09:14 AM)StorMFront Wrote: Choose between a Steak or a salad. I WIN.

...
You win the steak, I win the salad AND the argument!

I bet you have an affair on your girl, with a local steakhouse...once and awhile. Just make sure you wipe the HP sauce of the corner of your mouth before you go home.

Arguing with a Christian is a lot like playing chess with a pigeon. You can be the greatest player in the world, yet the pigeon will knock over all the pieces, shit on the board and strut away triumphantly.

Two things really get in the way of that for me. First the price of vegetarian meat replacement products are so bloody expensive. I can't really budget that in on my single alone budget. (I do occasinally splurge on some Morningstar Veggie Grillers, those things are divine) There is also a totally Vegan restraunt in Portland called Vitas that makes amazing food. Pricey however.

Secondly, I really love cheeseburgers. Silly I know but I could never give them up. Not totally.

I have no problem with people consuming meat, as you sort of made fun of before its "only natural" a part of our diet. That being said if I had to kill my own food I would quickly turn vegetarian, as I do not have the heart to kill something myself (I went fishing once, caught a ling, cried and told someone to throw it back for me....haven't fished since)

Just to confuse the issue more for me I absolutely hate hunting. Well I should clarify that....I hate hunting for sport. Hunting for nessecity I have no problem with. Killing something "cause its super fun" to me says a lot about a persons character.

A lot of my views on this is due to my upbrining. Honestly the only "religious" opinion I'm glad I held onto.

But anyway. I'm done with that ramble. Summed up. I love vegetarian food and the idea behind it, but I love cheeseburgers too much to give them up.

As for PETA, I have very little respect for them. Yes they do some good things....but they also do things like force their pets to be vegetarian...thats really horrible imo. If you're going to claim to be respectful of the rights of animals....then demonstrate it.

(16-02-2013 10:07 AM)Hobbitgirl Wrote: I really love cheeseburgers. Silly I know but I could never give them up. Not totally.

...
I bet, if they could synthesize cheeseburgers with same taste, same price, you would prefer that! It's on the way if you can believe the reports!

Quote:If I had to kill my own food I would quickly turn vegetarian, as I do not have the heart to kill something myself

That was the final reason I turned vegetarian. I wanted to be consistent in my behaviour.

Quote:Just to confuse the issue more for me I absolutely hate hunting. Well I should clarify that....I hate hunting for sport. Hunting for nessecity I have no problem with. Killing something "cause its super fun" to me says a lot about a persons character.

My exact same sentiments.

Quote:As for PETA,....but they also do things like force their pets to be vegetarian...thats really horrible imo. If you're going to claim to be respectful of the rights of animals....then demonstrate it.

I didn't know they did that! That's stupid and cruel and pointless!

I am not a PETA member -- or even fan -- I use their website for source of information.

(16-02-2013 10:07 AM)Hobbitgirl Wrote: I really love cheeseburgers. Silly I know but I could never give them up. Not totally.

...
I bet, if they could synthesize cheeseburgers with same taste, same price, you would prefer that! It's on the way if you can believe the reports!

Quote:If I had to kill my own food I would quickly turn vegetarian, as I do not have the heart to kill something myself

That was the final reason I turned vegetarian. I wanted to be consistent in my behaviour.

Quote:Just to confuse the issue more for me I absolutely hate hunting. Well I should clarify that....I hate hunting for sport. Hunting for nessecity I have no problem with. Killing something "cause its super fun" to me says a lot about a persons character.

My exact same sentiments.

Quote:As for PETA,....but they also do things like force their pets to be vegetarian...thats really horrible imo. If you're going to claim to be respectful of the rights of animals....then demonstrate it.

I didn't know they did that! That's stupid and cruel and pointless!

I am not a PETA member -- or even fan -- I use their website for source of information.

I never worry about consistancy in behavior. I wouldn't be me if I did