Tuesday, August 21, 2007

Michael Vick to plead guilty: Let the closure begin! But only after we speculate over...

How much prison time he'll do!(Over/under: 12 months)...

When the Falcons will waive him!(Not soon enough)...

And if his NFL career is over!(Assumed jail time + NFL suspension afterward + radioactive reputation + the decline of age = all signs point to yes)...

Vick Fatigue? At this point, I think most fans are ready to put the whole thing behind us. We've all got fantasy teams to manage or real-life teams to obsess over.

But there's an interesting spin-off question, now that we're headed into the home stretch of Vick joining the Oz intramural team...

Biggest Waste of Talent Ever? Michael Vick will star in his own version of "The Longest Yard," while the rest of us consider – if we consider anything – what an epic waste of talent Vick has managed to pull off.

Depending on how you feel about Vick as a QB talent -- you can't deny what was his superstardom -- he might have finalized his status as the biggest waste of talent in modern sports history.

Commenter question: Who are the biggest wastes of talent in modern sports history. Consider an elastic definition of "waste," from "coulda-been" waste (Len Bias) to "never-was" waste (Tony Mandarich or Todd Marinovich). I contend Vick is the biggest waste of all.

Then thank the sports fates for perhaps the most classic antithesis of a waste of talent, featured in the next paragraph...

Cardinals within 3 games of NL East Central lead: That would be thanks to a win, led by yet another home run from Rick Ankiel (along with Albert Pujols... how amazing is it that Pujols takes a backseat on his own team, in terms of intriguing must-see player?) YES YES I AM A MORON FOR SAYING EAST. DAMN!

Jenks Watch: He wasn't able to break the MLB record of retiring consecutive batters (gee, thanks, Joey Gathright), but he still ties it at 41, in what could be the most remarkable "milestone" record in what feels like a season of them.

I'm late on this but...: Read this Slate column about MLB's Pitch f/x. I buy it: It's going to revolutionize statistical analysis. (The technology, not the column itself.)

NFL Camping: Trent Green was named Dolphins starting QB. Seriously, this was in doubt? Isn't this why they brought him in? (Is Cleo Lemon that good? He might be, yes. Just not yet. And by then, John Beck will be ready to step in. And Cleo gets the shaft... again.)

Bears 27, Colts 24: And that was DESPITE Rex Grossman, who provided a full game's worth of his personal brand of triple-threat (INT, fumble(s), sacks) -- in all of 26 snaps.

CFB: Jimmy Clausen cited for transporting alcohol. Actually, I didn't know either that transporting someone over 21 to get alcohol, if you're under 21, is illegal. It's not like he was boozing it up himself. No: A college freshman would NEVER drink alcohol. It's UNHEARD of.

More CFB: Sam Keller named starting QB at Nebraska. The ArizonaState transfer seems like the best fit yet for Bill Callahan's "This Ain't Your Daddy's/Momma's Huskers" Offense (a.k.a. the West-Coast offense). Keller is thrown into a brutal situation immediately: After a opening-week warm-up vs. Nevada, Nebraska plays at WakeForest, then hosts No. 1 USC, only the toughest defense in the country.

Uniform Watch: IowaState is letting fans choose its football helmet design. Here's the link. I would personally prefer the one that says "Cyclones" in script over the "I State" and "ISU" versions. But I won't vote, because it should be left to IowaState fans to decide. I'm an online populist, so I approve the tactic, but they don't need me skewing the results best left decided by real fans.

In case you missed it: Yesterday was the debut of my new weekly college football guest-post on Deadspin. I'm thrilled to be writing it, with a lofty bar already set by Deadspin weekly soccer correspondent David Hirshey, who – as one person astutely remarked to me yesterday – creates the single-best soccer column in America today.

USA Hoops: Kevin Durant was the last guy cut in order for the team to make the 12-man limit for the FIBA Americas tournament that starts tomorrow. Management has gone away from the "any-star-that-will-have-us" to not only demand a multi-year commitment from the superstars, but to fill out the roster with role players like Mike Miller and Tyson Chandler. (I still contend that the No. 1 difference-maker will be having Kobe Bryant, the unstoppable scoring threat.)

RIP, "Wild Bill" Hagy, the uber-Orioles fan who I remember so fondly from my childhood as the lunatic who stood up and led the crowd in a cheer of "O-R-I-O-L-E-S! Orioles!" by using his body to form the letters.

Name to Know: Sheila Drummond, the blind golfer who hit a hole in one. Feel-good story of the week.

You ARE smarter than me: Just a reminder to hit the links on the right and sign up for any/all of the four football prediction games that I created leagues for. Group name: Daily Quickie Readers.

85 comments:

my girl and I were talking about Ron mexico last night and we both can't wait for five years form now when he gets hit with a lawsuit for spreading the HIV around after he gets it in the pokey. Hell herpes wont stop some of those guys from wanting a little Vick ass.

Personally I think Bias should be consider a bigger waste of talent, due to the fact he did drugs and killed him self we never got to see what his talent could be where as with Vick we have seen is talent (vastly overrated) and he might still have a chance after he gets out of jail to get back into football and show what talent he has left.

The first 1/4 of the post today is about Vick, then you complain about Vick Fatigue? If you didn't write about him so much, maybe you wouldn't have it either? But, it is a tragic story that is THE story in the NFL right now. I am sure the Falcons wish they hadn't traded their QB of the future now...

But, in terms of real wasted talent, I would think Lenny Bias is the greatest. Vick played enough seasons to show us he was the most athletic quarterback ever. But, he also played enough seasons to show us he was not a top 5 QB in any year, and probably hit max potential without reaching that level of competence or success.

Biggest waste of talent? Vick is definitely up there because he did actually show flashes of it. I think Mike Tyson was the biggest waste of talent in my lifetime (26 years). Had he boxed his entire career in the manner that he started it, and had avoided trouble, there's no doubt in my mind he would have taken anyone out til his retirement in...99.

Yes, Lemon is actually a pretty good QB. The Falcons should consider a trade for him, honestly. He'd beat out Harrington.

I'm sure Clausen wasn't going to partake in all the booze being bought. /sarcasmActually, the police probably did him, and Notre Dame, a favor. He got busted for a minor offense. Had he been caught, say an hour later, drunk off his ass, he'd be missing the first football game. Now Weis can just call it "an accident".

Gratz on the Deadspin column, Dan. But geez...your gator bandwagon fandom will have much harsher critics over there.

Biggest waste of talent has to be Bo Jackson, I know he was great when he was healthy but just imagine what could have been if he didn't get hurt. It drives me crazy that we could have a whole hell of a lot more highlights from him than we do now.

Blind? That's it, I'm just going to close my eyes when I play golf. Might help...

Imagine if Canada had a really big college football landscape. Not only could you play with the 12-man lineups (more motion and an extra receiver), but the drinking age is a workable 19. What blue-chip QB wouldn't go there?

Jenks's record is very nice. The only thing that detracts against it is that as a closer, he was only facing 3 different guys a night, instead of having to get the same batters out 3 times in the same game, when not only have they seen your stuff an hour earlier, but you wear down. (And let's face it, Jenks has a body that looks like it might not last 6-7 innings on a regular basis.)

If Vick is considered a waste of talent, it's only because the wastedness was the regular old NFL coaches trying to pigeonhole him in the pocket. That wasn't Vick's talent to begin with, so he didn't exactly waste it himself.

And lastly, let's all raise a glass in toast to the Return of the Rexcrement last night!

There was no greater waste of talent than Doc Gooden. The guy was the best pitcher in baseball when he was 20. If not for his drub abuse, it is quit possible that all the accolades being heaped on Clemens would be reserved for Doc. I don't see Vick as a waste of talent, because he never proved to be that great a QB. He was certainly fun to watch and could bust a highlight reel run at any moment. But NFL quarterbacks have to be great throwers and he never really was. If there was a waste it was more on the part of his coaches who never properly developed his talent. Vick's "waste" is also not on par with what Bias and Gooden did. Guys who get hooked on coke do tremendous damage to their bodies that actually robs them of their abilities. Vick hasnt lost his talent, he just got caught doing something incredibly stupid that prevents him from using it on the field.

Gratz on the Deadspin column, Dan. But geez...your gator bandwagon fandom will have much harsher critics over there.

Am I the only ones who think the Deadspin commenters are a bunch of 7th grade boy humor fuckfaces?

The only way you're allowed to comment on stuff over there is by being a pretender, acting like a witty prick and making stupid snide comments that add little.

It's all led by that little prick Rob Iracane, who gives invites only to his personal blogger butt buddies. Heck, I had my comment 'pass' revoked/taken away because I was trying to comment on sports and not making humor of every little thing.

Not only does Conine have two rings, but the Marlins needed him as the missing piece in 2003 (well, him and Pudge). The Marlins would never have gotten to the NLCS without him that year. If you remember Pudge taking that charge against the Giants to keep the Marlins season going, Conine was the guy who made the throw from the left field wall.

As a resident ATL commenter, I couldn't be happier that Vick is gone. Of course I didn't buy season tickets.

That's why I can't count Len Bias, Van Poppel, etc. I don't think a wasted talent is one that never showcased anything or that was just hyped up. A wasted talent has to be shown in his/her element...then fritter it away or lose it by injury.

(I know Bias was expected to rule the NBA, but he never made it..so he could have busted easily and not been a waste, per se.)

As a Yankee fan, I'm obliged to say Brien Taylor was a waste of talent. But in the past 25 years, it has to be Strawberry. You never know with pitchers because anything could happen, look at Wood and Prior...so they need they're own division.

I like the mention of Dan in this too, maybe throw Simmons in the category of wasted talent among sports "writers".

Shawn Kemp has to make the list of biggest waste of talent. He was ballin in Seattle but if he had not gone to Cleveland and got fat, he would be in the talk for one of the best PF ever to play in the NBA.

Kind of hard to call someone that got hurt a waste of talent. Grant Hill, Bo Jackson, Eric Lindros etc. They were great and got hurt... it isn't like they threw their careers away through bad personal choices like Vick or Tyson.

but here's a tough call, Charles Rogers. In his first few games with the Lions, the guy looked like he was worth the second pick in the draft. Then got hurt. Following season gets hurt again only a few plays in. Next season gets busted for pot. can you be a bust and a waste of talent. Trying to make a comeback in CFL right now. Last I heard his 40 speed when he tried for the Giants was like a 4.7. My white legs ran faster than that in high school. He was clocked at 4.2 at one point.

I disagree with Kemp. He was a very, very good PF. While he did slow at the end of his career he put forth a good 5-7 years of dominance in the NBA. Could he have milked two or three more years, maybe, but he definitely isn't a bust of a player.

Strawberry, definitely. He was just an incredible talent, and for all intents and purposes his career was over when he was 29. Think about how many homers he would have hit if he had been healthy playing in the smaller stadiums of the 90s with the post-strike hopped up baseballs? And lets be honest, he's not the most scrupulous of guys, so he probably would have been juicing along with everyone else. I think 600 is a conservative guess.

Geoff, great call with Grant Hill. He's always been OK, and actually kind of comparable to Ron Mexico in terms of "flashing the talent". GHill never had a major federal arrest, but I guess multiple knee surgeries would qualify.

Gotta agree with Tyson as the greatest waste of talent, and also as the best analogy to Vick's scenario. He has to be the last athlete of Vick's calibre to go to jail in the prime of his career, right?

Vick can't be a waste of talent because he was overrated to begin with. When I was at BC, he ran for close to 200 yards (great, yes), but he was like 6/19 for 70 or so yards and a couple INTs. He was a more athletic version/less QB version of QB Eagles (Randall Cunningham).

Good call Craig. I think Grossman is awful but who cares if he was sacked once last night...what does that have to do with anything? Isn't that something that the o-line should look at, or the WR for not getting open? Focus on the real negatives of Grossman not made up ones to try and emphasize his awfulness.

Why does it matter why the talent is wasted? Injury, drugs, accident, etc. It's all a cause of wasted talent.

Here are some more:Mickey Mantle - guy could've been the best baseball player ever if he could just stay off the sauce.

Matt Clement - not biggest ever, but this guy had nasty stuff and has yet to recover from a come-backer.

Shaun Livingston - he still has a chance to be a good player, but so far he can't seem to not get severely injured.

2005-2006 UConn Huskies - this team had 5 NBA players on it and lost to f'n George Mason in the Elite 8. If Anderson doesn't get a life threatening infection, if Marcus Williams doesn't idiotically try to steal a laptop, if AJ Price doesn't help... after having a life threatening brain aneurysm, and if Rudy Gay would have learned how to dominate... anyway, waste of talent - that team should have won its third NC.

the concept behind waste of talent is personal choices that individual made, meaning controlled by the athlete. not unfortunate circumstances that happened to the individual, otherwise that list would be huge and include guys like Ted Wililams and Joe DiMaggio since they went to war and prime years would be considered "wasted".

Tino 0 the reason Clement is not back is not the comebacker it is that he had major shoulder surgery a year ago. According to the Boston Globe and Herald he might be back with the Sox in mid to late september

Am I the only one that sees another team taking Vick into the fold once his prison term/suspension are up? Seriously, these owners are all about getting the high-profile, big name players. And when Vick's out, there won't be a bigger name out there, despite the negative connotations associated with him. Someone will give him a shot, provided he's not suspended for life.

I heard this on the radio yesterday, but apparently, Clay Bucholz, Boston Red Sox stud pitching prospect was arrested in High School for stealing and selling 29 computers from his High School. Many people believe that's the main reason he dropped to the 42nd pick in the supplimental first round the year Boston Took him.

As for Lemieux besting Gretzky wouldn't have happened and this is coming from the biggest Mario and Pens fan out there. I'm not saying that Gretzky was better (I think it's pretty even) but even if Mario never got sick or hurt he wouldn't have approached the records. Mario would have spent more time in the 90's with the trap than Gretzky where scoring was down anyways and plus early in their career when Gretzky set the season records and the game was wide open he was playing with hall of fame talent. Talent Mario didn't get to play with until Jagr came along and by then he was breaking down and the game was changing

DUDE__Guest_: Theo are you worried that the Yankees are [five] games back. What are your thoughts and do you think the RedSox will win the east?Theo_Epstein: We'd rather be up 14 games of course, but we have to be somewhat satisfied with a 5-game lead given how well the Yankees have played over the last two-and-a-half months. We're well enough positioned now so that we'll get what we deserve. If we play well down the stretch, we should get into October without concern. If we don't play well when it matters... well, then we probably don't deserve to be playing into October. I am confident that these players have what it takes.Quaid007__Guest_: Hi Theo. I was wondering if you ever talk to Brian Cashman about potential trades between Sox and Yanks. Is it ever a possiblilityTheo_Epstein: We joke around about possible deals now and then but it's not really taken seriously. I suppose under the right circumstances it would be a possibility, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

And cmfost - I know about the surgery. Still think the guy has been screwed up ever since the come-backer. Not a Sox fan at all, but hope for his sake he can come back from both the injury and the incident.

I'm not saying that Lemieux would have come close to Gretzky's overall records (especially assists), but he was on pace to break Gretzky's single season goals and points records. I've argued many times that Lemieux was better than Gretzky, without the injuries/illnesses, I'd have more bullet points.

actually you'd be preaching to the choir on that regard. i hold mario in very high regard but i consider my opinion very clouded on him due to growing up around pittsburgh and having him the reason why i got into hockey (i was 7 when they won the cup the first time)

Actually, Vick may not be getting anywhere near a football field. According to an article over at AOL Fanhouse, the local Virginia prosecutor is looking to nail Vick on eight counts of animal cruelty (for the eight dogs he allegedly helped to kill). Each one of those counts has a possible FIVE year sentence. So, after the Feds are done with him, the state of Virginia just might keep him in jail for the rest of his potential career years. Adios, Ookie.

I think the biggest waste of talent would have to go to the Lions for wasting Barry Sander's talent. Look at what he did with little talent around him. If he had played on a team like the Cowboys of the 90's he might have easily broken Dickerson's single season rushing record. Anyone notice how all the Sander's highlights on NFL films involve the Bucs. I swear he averaged like 250 a game against us for a few years.

And Fantasy GMs Everywhere Rejoiced...For LJ hath returned to the fold in K.C. And Fantasy Football Drafts everywhere just shifted. My guess is LJ just moved up from the 5/6/7 range I have been seeing out of mock draft rooms like ESPN and back up to the 3/4/5 range now that he'll get 2 games under his belt before the season.

And actually, who can argue with THAT strategy? Hold out half of camp, miss the two-a-days and 2 pre-season (see: useless) games in which to get hurt, er... I mean get in practice reps and shake off the rust? And you know what? After a 400+ carry season last year, LJ deserved/needed the rest to keep him a little fresher to start this season.

The veteran players will tell you, the preseason is a joke and should be cut in half anyway. LJ (and Vinny Testaverde) just took it upon themselves to show everyone. And besides, "Maddenites" everywhere have gotten to enjoy dishing out a little LJ punishment for a whole week already since the launch of Madden '08.

So really, all we are talking about at this point is the suicide rate amongst the fantasy footbal GMs who already held their drafts and had the 3rd or 4th pick and passed on Mr. Johnson because of his contract status. (Note: those GMs do not deserve to win their league anyway if a contract dispute clouds their draft judgment and precludes them from taking a stud at RB- they deserve a year long hazing anyway).

I heard from Francona on the radio last night that Clement probably won't pitch for Boston in '07, and they were hoping he might pitch a game at the instructional league level perhaps in a few weeks.

As for tino/sparty's debate....I guess we're not considering injury a "waste" of talent, in the same way we wouldn't consider getting mugged a "waste" of the $80 bucks in your wallet. (Compared to "wasting" it on buying drinks for ugly girls all night.)

jingo that is why I am glad the league I run as well as the league I am in hold the draft late. Nothing worse then having and early draft and making your #1 pick and having that players go down for the season in the during a preseason game basically ruining your season before it starts. I think it is stupid to hold any draft before the 3rd preseason games have been played

Not only do you not watch sports...you have no idea about divisions. It would be great if the Cardinals closed in on the NL EAST lead, but too bad that would do them any good considering they are in theNL CENTRAL....maybe you should go back to reporting on diaper duty and cooking dinner for the wife...ass

Even w/o the holdout, LJ is in the 5/6/7 range; do you really trust his body and Herm's offense to hold up? TMQ also pointed out that the "Chefs" went from Willie Roaf and Will Shields to a bunch of no-names. The only way LJ gets 1,500 yards is if he gets 500 carries. Who's the QB in KC anyway; is it a first time starter or a career backup?

No, the highlights of Barry Sanders are all shown with Da Bears players flying around like they are on a friggin trapeze.

Wasted talent....well if you include wars you need to include Stan the Man, Rizzuto, et al (Side note: Not a Cardinals fan but I loved that Stan the Man wouldn't go on the same field with Cassius Clay because he dodged the war).

Kerry Wood's problems are from his HS coach and Dusty. Prior owes it to Marcus Giles, whoever drilled him with the comebacker and Dusty. Dusty also screwed Rob Nenn and I am sure plenty of other pitchers. That is why I am waiting on Big Z to breakdown in the next five years.

Cub fans always blame Dusty, but they weren't whining like little bitches when they were tossing 20 strikeout games (122 pitches). That whole hindsight thing works pretty well. There isn't a Cub fan out there that would have pulled Wood in that game because of a pitch count. Give me a break.

Tim Thomas. There is not a single reason he doesn't have a career average approaching 30 points a game.

If he gave a damn, he'd have been Kevin Durant before KD was KD, but better. We're talking about a 6'10" slasher who should still be posting up two guards and the smaller threes and destroying fours with drives and nailing threes in their faces when they give space to protect the drive. He should've grabbed 8 garbage rebounds a game as should anyone > 6'8" playing 35 minutes a game.

Match Kobe's instinct with a Tim Thomas circa year 1 of his max mcntract from Milwaukee, and you have a 35 point a game scorer. Hell, since I'm bringing up Milwaukee, put Mo Williams' or Michael Redd's aggression in TT's head and you have a 35/11/4 guy.

Re: ISU helmets. The ballot uses checkboxes instead of radio buttons, so you can vote for more than one. Which sort of goes against them asking you to vote for your favorite one. That's Iowa State for you.

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DanShanoff.com is a sports-blog spin-off of my long-time ESPN.com column, "The Daily Quickie." Anchored by an early-morning post of must-know topics, the blog is updated frequently throughout the day with new posts and user comments.