If we had a dominent front line and a winning record. Everybody would love Rush, and would call for somebody's head if he were traded. Just my opinion.

02-21-2010, 08:59 PM

Noodle

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erik

What does FTW mean? If it means what I think it does, then I've seen it where it doesn't make sense also.

For the win or **** the world. Mostly, for the win.

02-21-2010, 09:40 PM

Putnam

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by speakout4

Sins of omission, sins of commission. As McGee fan pointed out when someone needs to step up at crunch time he's still deferring to someone else.

He seemed to.

But I remember the fact going around the Derrick McKey actually lead the league in last-second, game-winning scores one season. (I'll try to find a link.)

It might have been the last season he was with Seattle -- not even when he was with the Pacers -- but he did prove that he could be clutch if the team needed him to be.

02-21-2010, 09:44 PM

Naptown_Seth

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Putnam

Hee hee.

Now we know that the cuss blocker won't allow S H / T

.

And yet it just did. ;)

Happened to me recently too.

02-21-2010, 09:48 PM

Naptown_Seth

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by EmCeE

If we had a dominent front line and a winning record. Everybody would love Rush, and would call for somebody's head if he were traded. Just my opinion.

To me it would be about how I felt when they traded Jax for Rose. I was really excited about how Rose looked in Denver and understood how getting him helped...but I hated losing my favorite player.

In the end it all worked out, and when you think about Brown (who ironically created that trade) it could work that way this time too. We get Henderson, then 6 months later Rush is buried on the bench because Larry hates him, we pick him back up on the cheap. :D

Personally I'd prefer to get Henderson without losing Rush, Roy or Price.

02-21-2010, 09:58 PM

Naptown_Seth

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by speakout4

Sins of omission, sins of commission. As McGee fan pointed out when someone needs to step up at crunch time he's still deferring to someone else. Brandon plays alot like Dun offensively but Dun will step up when needed.

Has this happened with Brandon though? I don't really recall him choking, and frankly TJ and Danny have dominated the late game attempts the last 2 seasons.

Rush and Danny were the tandem that poured it on during the meaningless final game last year to pull ahead and win the game. Unfortunately with a bad team you don't get many "win the game" moments to find out who's up to the challenge.

My defense of him is more based on who he's been willing to go at. I think we've seen him try to take it right at some of the biggest stars, including guys like Kobe. He won't do it 15 times, but he'll do it 2-3.

It will be very interesting to see him with a different coach and an altered roster, be it here or elsewhere. I hope it's here of course.

Part of being a big time Rush fan before he was even drafted, just as a prospect (no interest in KS at all), is that I do care about his game and do see the flaws because of that. I like his game overall so I enjoy evaluating where it's at. All criticism stems from that. Ditto on Roy.

There's "willing to trade" and "happy to trade" and they aren't the same.

02-21-2010, 11:09 PM

NapTonius Monk

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squirrelz

That's what I thought at first, but it was used in a few sentences that just didn't make sense.

I used to think it meant The Pacers Top Brass. I was wide right on that one.

02-21-2010, 11:21 PM

Dr. Awesome

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobbyMac

I think you overrate Brandon....he may end up as a good player, but he's not right now.

He is a great defensive player, that alone makes him a good player.

I find it sad that players who aren't great scorers are now viewed as bad players. I remember when fans took pride in a players defense.

02-21-2010, 11:40 PM

NapTonius Monk

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Brandon was trade sweetner. I doubt they're looking to move him just to move him. I also wonder if targeting DJ means they aren't quite sold on AJ yet.

02-22-2010, 02:05 AM

Justin Tyme

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by PacerDude

Alex Gilbert ??

I was thinking along the lines of Staley or something like that. Although Gilbert kinda sounds familiar. That's been eons ago, and I just can't remember.

02-22-2010, 02:39 AM

Justin Tyme

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

[QUOTE=PacerDude;963645]

Alex Gilbert ?? QUOTE]

It was Brad Miley. Staley was on the team.

Alex Gilbert was the other forward and not Harry Walker. Harry Walker was a baseball player. Bird played ball at ISU with a Harry Morgan. I remember it being referred to as the Harry and Larry show thus I said Harry Walker. LOL!

02-22-2010, 02:41 AM

Justin Tyme

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by PacerDude

He's still bad as a GM though. :)

Welcome to my world of belief!

02-22-2010, 10:36 AM

Leroy Staley

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

[QUOTE=Justin Tyme;963767]

Quote:

Originally Posted by PacerDude

Alex Gilbert ?? QUOTE]

It was Brad Miley. Staley was on the team.

Alex Gilbert was the other forward and not Harry Walker. Harry Walker was a baseball player. Bird played ball at ISU with a Harry Morgan. I remember it being referred to as the Harry and Larry show thus I said Harry Walker. LOL!

Starting lineup was Bird, Miley, Gilbert, Reed, and Nicks. Heaton and Staley off the bench. Gilbert was the low post threat. He had a nicer vertical and a good turnaround jumper. Miley was a poor man's Jeff Foster. Harry Morgan wasn't there during the '79 run, but played the preceding year.

02-22-2010, 09:54 PM

cordobes

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

That bit about TJ Ford dancing is hilarious.

I think Rush has the talent+mentality (as Naptown notes) to be a very good role-player and he'll be one - 14pgg scored efficiently, good to very good defence at both wing positions, especially on the ball, excellent to very good rebounding contributions for his position, mistaken free play, solid but unspectacular passer. He's already a good role-player, as others guys said players like him are better appreciated when playing for good teams. I like Henderson and Augustin and I believe then can become elite role-players as well, but Rush is closer.

That said, Brown and Rush would be a match made in heaven. Larry Brown would bring the best out of Rush very quickly, especially as a shooter. Plus: Felton+Rush+Jackson+Wallace+Thomas+Diaw+Chandler = best defensive team in the league.

02-23-2010, 11:53 AM

sportfireman

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

I have a question..may have been asked already. Concerning Bird's future core guys Danny, Tyler, Roy, AJ..... I thought Rush was mentioned. But I saw a post the other day with Rush absent from that list. My question is if Rush isn't part of the future and he's so expendable then why is he getting so much time on the floor? I guess he has pics on Flim like Murph OR OR he was and still is being showcased.......

02-23-2010, 11:57 AM

Speed

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Good questions, I've heard him listed, not listed, "oh ya" listed. It depends. He's mainly playing because he's the only good defender who has NBA caliber athleticism on the team (slightly greenishly typed).

02-23-2010, 11:59 AM

Speed

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

I know this will sound crazy, but I wish they'd put him at the point in summer league. Or at least make him take some of the ball handling responsibilities, so he can get comfortable with the ball.

02-23-2010, 12:02 PM

sportfireman

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speed

Good questions, I've heard him listed, not listed, "oh ya" listed. It depends. He's mainly playing because he's the only good defender who has NBA caliber athleticism on the team (slightly greenishly typed).

So then he should be part of our future and not tradebait:confused:........ and yes he needs time with the ball to work on his ball handling.

02-23-2010, 12:17 PM

BobbyMac

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Awesome

He is a great defensive player, that alone makes him a good player.

I find it sad that players who aren't great scorers are now viewed as bad players. I remember when fans took pride in a players defense.

I just don't see that great defense people talk about on this board. He's not bad but he has lapses where he just seems lost both on offense and defense.

02-23-2010, 01:14 PM

Naptown_Seth

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speed

I know this will sound crazy, but I wish they'd put him at the point in summer league. Or at least make him take some of the ball handling responsibilities, so he can get comfortable with the ball.

Unfortunately he got hurt at the start of the last summer league. I think it does help to go out and play as the best guy on the court in order to learn a different mentality and see your role from the outside. Meaning as the top guy Rush can see what he needs from the 2nd and 3rd guy.

Plus I think you do bring out a sense of confidence and power in players when they are put into that role.

Isn't that the very essence behind NCAA teams playing creampuff teams to start a season?

I wonder if Rush will go to summer league this year? Seems doubtful. Price, Tyler (hope), McRoberts...not sure Rush or Roy will.

Personally I think if you'd been showing them a consistant role and an actual offensive strategy since JAN 09, Rush, Roy and Josh would be playing a pretty sound game right now.

For example, perhaps the two best offensive plays last night were the same called play for Rush. Rush cuts over both high post screens, then darts down the lane after passing the weakside high post and takes the pass from the ball side high post (ie, Roy). They got easy baskets both times they did it that I saw.

It stood in stark contrast to whatever you call TJ, Earl, and Luther coming down and jacking up a long jumper with 17-18 on the shot clock. Or the times they "used" the shot clock, ie TJ dribbles the clock away till driving hopelessly deep into the paint and prays for a foul bail out.

In fact after Rush passed up a 1 on 1 transition chance (poor choice) he seemed to flip to the other side and began forcing his lane action into traffic ala TJ which was much, much worse, thus his poor overall shooting.

Rush tends to avoid BAD SHOTS, that's part of his thing. He'll take them when pushed, as we saw last night after that play. But a big "problem" with his game is that his instincts from Kansas (and reality) say that shooting without any offensive action or movement is not a good way to efficiently score.

02-23-2010, 01:27 PM

Mr. Sobchak

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobbyMac

I just don't see that great defense people talk about on this board. He's not bad but he has lapses where he just seems lost both on offense and defense.

Rush tends to avoid BAD SHOTS, that's part of his thing. He'll take them when pushed, as we saw last night after that play. But a big "problem" with his game is that his instincts from Kansas (and reality) say that shooting without any offensive action or movement is not a good way to efficiently score.

And that is why we need to keep Rush.......... he plays SMART. I don't know what the FO is looking at:confused:

02-23-2010, 02:14 PM

Ozwalt72

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by sportfireman

So then he should be part of our future and not tradebait:confused:

He can be both. Just like Roy, Price, and Tyler can be.

02-23-2010, 02:24 PM

Speed

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth

Rush tends to avoid BAD SHOTS, that's part of his thing. He'll take them when pushed, as we saw last night after that play. But a big "problem" with his game is that his instincts from Kansas (and reality) say that shooting without any offensive action or movement is not a good way to efficiently score.

That's interesting, I really think of it the other way, that he lacks aggressiveness, but I think you are right. The other side of that coin is avoiding bad shots.

A microcosm play of a bad possession is what you eluded to is the one play when Luther Head brought the ball up, dribbled completely through the lane, out the other side, then passed it to TJ, who did exactly the same thing, maddening. Inconsequently, TJ hit a fall away bad shot at the end of the shot clock. A made basket by no means made it a good possession.

Back to the point, BRush wants to do the things he's comfortable doing and it would be helpful to put him those positions more often vs. trying to make him force the issue doing things outside his wheelhouse. It's a very good point.

Analogy. It wouldn't have been very sucessful to have a young Reggie Miller go one on one, instead they built an offense that let him come off picks and hit the J. Maybe BRush needs some more "good" opportunites presented to him instead of trying to force him into bad ones.

02-23-2010, 04:29 PM

BPump33

Re: Well's> Ford, Rush taken aback by Pacers' trade talk

T.J. is on Kravitz and Eddie right now and he laughed when they asked about the player option. He said that the option wasn't going anywhere and he picked it up four years ago.

So, like most of us already knew unless he's traded T.J. is not going anywhere.