Feature
Film Process

>Published : 21st September 2003

Since
I've spent my career shooting for a TV finish I haven't dealt with the
basic process of shooting for a project that will originated on film and
then pass through the steps to eventually be printed for theatrical release.
Now I may get involved in a low budget short and I want to understand
what the normal process involves. Right now I am assuming 35mm origination,
Avid cut and at some point film finish. But since the first stop for the
project will probably be the festival circuit, I'm guessing there could
be a video finish first and then a film finish much later, if ever.

My
questions are :

Is
camera neg TK'd for video dailies and then a print struck? (or vice versa)
Or do dailies come from a print transfer to safeguard the original neg?

If
not, is a print struck at all at this stage? Are dailies reels used for
offline editing? Anything I should know at this stage that I may not have
thought of?

Typically,
here, the neg is transferred after the dailies are printed, but in low
budget work, dailies are rare. Fight to get at least something printed
regularly - a roll a week, one take from each set-up etc. You won't see
everything in video dailies that you will see in the final print.

Sometimes
if everything is printed, the print is used for transfer as you suggest.
It's essential in that case that the print exactly matches the neg (i.e.
taking out frames or shots before transfer will confuse the living daylights
out of the neg matcher at a later date).

After
neg matching, we recommend a "pos conform" whereby the neg matcher
extracts all the required takes, they are printed and cut together to
match the edl. This becomes a cut work print which is used (a) to check
the neg match, sync etc) and (b) as a guide to fine-cut the neg.

Some
producers say "just cut the neg from the edl". They
are dicing with death.

style="margin-top:0;">Geoff
doesn't like advertising on this list, so I won't mention my book "Film
Technology in Post Production - 2nd edition" from Focal Press, but
someone else might.

It
might answer many of your questions.

Dominic
Case

Atlab
Australia

>Dominic
Case wrote :

>Geoff
doesn't like advertising on this list, so I won't mention
book

>"Film
Technology in Post Production - 2nd edition" from Focal
Press.

I'll
be glad to mention it. The Pos Conform makes good sense, though in some
circles the term POS has other meanings.

style="margin-top:0;">Jeff
"always pull with long handles" Kreines

style="margin-top:0; margin-bottom: 0;">

The
most common path is to telecine from original negative camera rolls to
tape for offline editing, then generate a edit list with key code numbers
and have negative cutter conform negative to edit list. Then an answer
print is struck, first on a Haseltine timer, later ones on a comparator.
Often the first answer print is silent and the rest also have the soundtrack
on it (called a composite print.) You screen the answer print at a theatre
in the lab with the timer, who takes notes on the fly as the film plays
out in real time, using the footage counter as a guide.

He
goes off, makes the changes, shows you a new print, and you repeat the
process, reel by reel, until you run out of time or money or start getting
worried about over-printing the o-neg...Just kidding. Usually by the third
answer print, you are just reprinting an individual reel here and there
that still has a problem.

After
answer printing has determined all the printer lights needed to correct
each shot, the final answer print might be your first projection print
and you might order a few more prints made off of the original negative
("show prints"), but usually at this stage you also strike a
color-timed interpositive (I.P.), both as a protection master and as a
film element for a final telecine transfer.

Some
people might just strike a low-con print for a final telecine transfer.

The
I.P. can be used for making an internegative (I.N., aka "dupe neg")
or multiple dupe negatives even, for making lots of prints.

This
is assuming that you photographed the film in a standard 35mm
projection format (1.85 matted widescreen or 2.35 anamorphic
widescreen) so that you can do all printing steps using a
contact printer. If you shot in Super-35, 3-perf, etc. you'd
have to convert the image at one of the stages (usually between
the I.P. and I.N. stages) to a standard projection format,
so that this new internegative can be used to make contact
prints for projection. This is usually done in an optical
printer but you can also use a digital intermediate to convert
one film format to another.

Most
of the issues are really editorial - i.e. the film will be projected at
24 fps, so anything that needs to be sped up or slowed down in post has
to be done to a final dupe negative element that can be cut into the assembled
negative. You also have to decide if fades and dissolves will be done
using A-B rolls or optical printer dupes.

Just
remember that traditional color timing limits you to controlling overall
color balance and density (brightness). You can't fix one color independently
of another and you can't change gamma shot to shot, nor black level on
an individual basis, etc. Your notes to the color timing will be on the
order of "make that shot brighter...make that one a few points darker...that
looks too green...let's warm that scene up and make it more yellow-orange...etc.
Basically warmer, colder, brighter, darker, to be ridiculously simplistic
about it (it's a little more flexible than that but nothing like digital
color-correction.)

David
Mullen ASC

Cinematographer
/ L.A.

Hazeltine
timer, later ones on a

>comparator.

style="margin-top:0;">OK,
I know what a Hazeltine is, not much here has changed in the 23 years
since I worked in a lab, but what's a comparator?

Marty
Hamrick

Photojournalist/Cinematographer

WJXT
TV

Jacksonville,Fl

>OK,
I know what a Hazeltine is,

.....
it's the same as a Hazeltine

......Many
labs now use Colormasters, which do the same job but also display a moving
image.

>what's
a comparator?

.....I
think David was referring to the system of scene-testing where just a
couple of frames of each shot are printed on a special printer, and displayed
on a filmstrip projector. The timer then holds colour filters in the light
path to estimate the effect of making corrections, before making a full-length
print.

Dominic
Case

Atlab
Australia

>...I
think David was referring to the system of scene-testing where
just a >couple of frames of each shot are printed on a
special printer

No,
that's sometimes called a "proof print" at some labs. One of
the timers called the machine that he puts up the previous answer print,
with a read-out on a screen of the printer lights used, in order to input
new timing lights, a "comparator" but I guess it's not a standard
name for that sort of thing.

Anyway,
it's not a Hazeltine anymore after the first answer print.

David
Mullen

Cinematographer
/ L.A.

>
a "comparator" but I guess it's not a standard name
for that

I'd
call it a "Regrade station". (probably not standard either)

The
projector is synced up to the timing data so it tracks the RGB values
for each shot. The timer can edit the data as he/she goes.

Dominic
Case

Atlab
Australia

Dominic
Case wrote :

>I'd
call it a "Regrade station". (probably not standard
either)

Does
anyone still use the Neumade device that consists of a light box at an
angle between two rewinds, arranged top-to-bottom (not left-to-right)?
DuArt added a sprocket with shaft encoder to get footage and frame counts,
and that's how they timed both reversal originals and corrected prints.

Jeff
Kreines

David
& Dominic,

A
belated thanks (got busy for a couple days) for the information. I recently
did a film out on an HDCam project and after sitting with the timer at
Deluxe for a screening I know a little about the last stages of the process.
What could be changed by printing, what couldn't. It became obvious why
DI has become so popular. I was just not sure how things were dealt with
in between the O neg being unloaded and the IP/IN work being started.

Since
the shoot will be 5 days, if I have a budget to print anything I'll probably
do something from each location/set-up.

Will
labs print partial rolls?

Thanks
again for the help.

Randy
Miller, DP in LA

>Since
the shoot will be 5 days, if I have a budget to print anything
I'll >probably do something from each location/set-up.
Will labs print partial >rolls?

In
35mm, labs will print circled takes on the camera reports - but the trouble
with that is that they often cut out those takes from the roll and splice
them onto a "printing roll". For tests, I think it is better
just to print the whole camera roll rather than have it cut up, which
is more handling of your negative than is necessary.

David
Mullen

Cinematographer
/ L.A.

>For
tests, I think it is better just to print the whole camera
roll rather than >have it cut up, which is more handling
of your negative than is >necessary.

Or
if you can keep a "test" or "print" roll in an extra
magazine and print it when ready. You just pop the mag on and burn a few
feet or a rehearsal for each set up. Then you'll have a clean separate
roll to print and analyse.

Best
Regards,

Anders
Uhl

cinematographer

ICG,
New York

>Will
labs print partial rolls?

style="margin-top:0;">Almost
anything you ask for (and pay for)!

>Traditionally,
labs only print the "circled" or "print" takes. The
cost (on an hourly rate) of a negative breakdown operator pulling out
all the B-takes is usually less than the amount saved (per foot) by not
printing them. Therefore there's no reason why the lab can't pull out
any takes you nominate on the camera sheets, for printing.

The
only drawback is that those shots will then be on a separate negative
roll, so will be telecine'd separately, and as a result, syncing sound,
digitising, and reviewing the rushes all become a little more complicated.
If you choose to transfer first, then select some takes to print, talk
to your neg matcher first: there may be implications in the time-code/key-code
logging that will need to be taken care of if the neg is cut after transfer.

Dominic
Case

Atlab
Australia

David
Mullen wrote :

>In
35mm, labs will print circled takes on the camera reports...which
is >more handling of your negative than is necessary.

How
about David and Dominic teaming together and write the ultimate book on
post-production?

Cheers

Martin
Heffels

Filmmaker/DP/editor,

Sydney,
Australia

style="margin-top:0; margin-bottom: 0;">"Today's
mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground."

>How
about David and Dominic teaming together and write the ultimate
>book on post-production?

style="margin-top:0;">Yeah,
he could provide all the knowledge and my contribution would
be to Americanise his terminology...

David
Mullen

Cinematographer
/ L.A.

style="margin-top:0;">>David
when are YOU going to write a book?

>That's
what I said to David too. Maybe he should just compile every
word he has written to cml - he manages to encapsulate everything
that matters without any waste.

But
I don't entirely agree with David when he says :

>In
35mm, labs will print circled takes on the camera reports...which
is >more handling of your negative than is necessary.

Labs
have extracted circled takes for many many years - it's a sensible cost-saving
exercise, and well-trained, careful and skilled negative handlers have
always been able to do it without putting handling marks on the negative,
and, years ago, without the benefit of wet gate printing to mask any problems.
Where marks arise now, it is a combination of lack of skill, and too much
haste.

Traditionally,
printing only circled takes would also save the editor's time in syncing,
and also in reviewing the material to work with.