make me some tea:The more I read about this, the more it's apparent to me that Johar was brought into this plot at the last minute to help his big brother out. I don't believe he really was into the jihadi crap.

Doesn't make him any less responsible, but that's my gut feeling anyway.

I agree. I'm getting to the point where I almost feel bad for Johar because it seems like he was just tagging along with his brother. Doesn't mean he isn't going to spend the rest of his long life in solitary confinement, but it does explain WTF he was doing there in the first place.

miss diminutive:make me some tea: The more I read about this, the more it's apparent to me that Johar was brought into this plot at the last minute to help his big brother out. I don't believe he really was into the jihadi crap.

Doesn't make him any less responsible, but that's my gut feeling anyway.

The more I read about this, the more I suspect that these two were simply too dumb to have any political or religious motive beyond "durrr, America is bad, mkay?"

shiat. The time for action is now. Round up everyone that posts on the politics tab. It's the only way.

xanadian:Yeah, #11 on that list is really weird. Why bring a BB gun!??

Hoping people would mistake it for a real gun?

Nina_Hartley's_Ass:Looks like their "plan" was "get away with it." Then they panicked when the photos were released.

Also sounds like they were basically trying to look like bad asses - that's why they told the carjacking victim who they were. It was a Hollywood style "I'm a bad dude, don't mess with me" moment. Teenage angst, wanting to seem "legit" to your (perceived) heritage and YouTube propaganda is a dangerous mix

Clemkadidlefark:Can you spend six months without income in another nation? Not me. Probably not you.

Sure, You stay with family and friends. Which he had, and reportedly did. A ticket to Moscow can be as little as $500 bught in advance, maybe less. that's a few months without cable. Teens packpack across Europe form weeks and months on next to nothing.

I agree with much of your questions about finances, but honestly, I don't know that there is anything really conclusive there. It's not outside the realm of normalcy that he scroungedand swaved and borrowed some money and did odd jobs etc.

My family managed to take 3-5 kids to visit family in Europe every 4-5 years for decades on income just above welfare levels. (And pay for the local private school). Properly motivated, you can do an awful lot with minimal funds.

maybe because counter terrorism kept saying.. "ya gonna do it? ya gonna do it?".. just to make sure they wouldn't do it. It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

wxboy:ImpatientlyUnsympathetic: FLMountainMan: ImpatientlyUnsympathetic: These two were a real brain trust.

They found the clothes he wore day-of in his dorm. Wouldn't you get rid of all that stuff?!

Most people who are intelligent, and, most importantly, self-disciplined enough to do that are successful in society, receive benefit from society, and don't feel the need to attack the society.

Timur the Lame was not very intelligent.

I value my own intelligence pretty highly, but I get a lot of my insights into crime from TV and the first thing they do on TV is get rid of clothes and other evidence in your possession after you've committed a crime. You'd think that Joker could have picked up a thing or two from TV that told him not to keep his clothes from the day of the bombing.

Perhaps it was his lucky shirt.

I guess he is pretty lucky that he didn't blow himself up with the bombs.

biggestdog420:It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

What more do you expect to hear? Crazy mom says FBI were talking to him, the FBI released a statement saying no they hadn't. Press reported both her side and the FBI's response. What more is their to discuss?

The more I read about these two the more I agree with their Uncle, what a pair of farking losers. They got the golden ticket out of the bombed out shiathole that is Chechnya/Dagestan, came to the US, were able to earn scholarships for post-secondary educations, became citizens...

They should have been great examples of the American Dream, but instead it seems like someone was able to give them (the older one anyway) a hard-on for the old country, the old ways and a hatred of the decadent West.

Well shiat son, nobody was stopping you, why didn't you go back to the old country if you were such a proud Chechen...

biggestdog420:maybe because counter terrorism kept saying.. "ya gonna do it? ya gonna do it?".. just to make sure they wouldn't do it. It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

The media has made a pretty big deal about the fact that he was interviewed by the FBI. Are you not paying attention? It was brought up by Congress in debate of the Immigration Bill yesterday, too. They were saying that immigrants applying for citizenship would not get personal interviews, like Timur the Lame did.

dallylamma:The more I read about these two the more I agree with their Uncle, what a pair of farking losers. They got the golden ticket out of the bombed out shiathole that is Chechnya/Dagestan, came to the US, were able to earn scholarships for post-secondary educations, became citizens...

They should have been great examples of the American Dream, but instead it seems like someone was able to give them (the older one anyway) a hard-on for the old country, the old ways and a hatred of the decadent West.

Well shiat son, nobody was stopping you, why didn't you go back to the old country if you were such a proud Chechen...

I wonder what Timur the Lame's idea of the American Dream was... because he found a pretty, smart girl to marry and had a child and disappeared for 6 months to Russia while she took care of their home and when he came back, she worked 70-80 hours a week to support him. Sounds like "working hard to achieve a good life" was not his American Dream. Such a farking loser.

Ed Grubermann:netgamer7k: And yet the conspiritards will believe this was all staged.

Believe it or not, there are people dumber than terrorists.

I have one on my FB feed. Apparently, Jewfro was photographed getting out of the boat under his own power, and was subsequently beat the fark to hell and back (or...was it a body double?) after trying to shoot himself before climbing out?

THX 1138:Nina_Hartley's_Ass: Looks like their "plan" was "get away with it." Then they panicked when the photos were released.

That's kind of my take on it too. If they suddenly both dropped out of sight as soon as the bombings happened, they'd have brought more suspicion on themselves. However if they went about their regular routines, there would be less reason to think they were involved. This is all in the absence of video evidence, of course, which seems to have spooked them once it came out.

I doubt they would have brought any suspicion on themselves. Who was going to miss them? They didn't seem to have much contact with family here. The older brother didn't have a job. And a phone call to one or two friends would have put their group of friends at ease. And as for the younger brother I really don't know how much the school would have cared if he stopped attending.

So either way, if they would have dropped out of sight or went about their regular business, I doubt that they would have been caught until they said something to somebody or tried another attack, if the pictures of them didn't come out.

Clemkadidlefark:Not once does it occur to Mother Jones to ask ... Where they get the money?

Dzhokhar and Tamerlan Tsarnaev. Where'd they get their money?

Dzhokhar, the young brother, is listed as a sophomore student at UMass Dartmouth living in the Pine Dale dormitory. According to Dartmouth's Cost of Attendance data for 2013-2014 the tab starts at $10G and change. Indirect expenses can range from $500 to over $2,000. No mention of costs for cell phones, food, cars and other modern necessities.

Tamerlan was by all accounts, unemployed. His converted wife reportedly works 70/80 hours a week as an in home caregiver in order to make ends meet for their family. His unsuccessful attempt to be a boxer of note (he made one round in the Golden gloves and got croaked)? That takes real money on top of daily and usual costs of living in one of the most expensive cities in America. The Cambridge area Ranks No. 8 Costliest Cities in America. There's coaching fees, gym fees, equipment costs like gloves and headgear which can easily run past $100 each. Good hand wraps are something like $40 and you do not want to cheap out on those. A proper wrap will save you from breaking bones in your hands. Then there's the cost of a proper diet (heavy on protein) and Supplements. Pain relief costs and costs related to healthcare.

Short? It ain't cheap. In fact, it's expensive.

Available information says Tamerlane was married to Katherine Russell and they produced a child. Children are expensive. In Massachusetts average costs to deliver an infant range from $9,600 to $11,000, a normal birth without complications. According to Family Education website a one child family can expect to expense $11,500 for a newborn ... in the first year.

How'd they pay for that?

Their living space. Expensive. A one bedroom apartment in Watertown ... man, I'm not seeing much less than $1,700. More likely around $2,000. If inside the city limits of Cambridge? More.

Cost to fly to Moscow from Boston ranges from $8 ...

My best guess:

Tamerlan was moving drugs/steroids and his Wife's parents are well off as well, they were probably paying for a lot of their expenses so the grandbaby would eat/have diapers. His "best friend" and 2 other where murdered and found with a bunch of MJ. Drug deal gone wrong?

Their marriage reminds me of my Mom's friend's niece, same situation. She worked 60-80 hours a week while he stayed home "watching the kid" and playing xbox. She felt she couldn't leave him because with her work hours he would get custody of the kid. Guy is a gigantic abusive douchebag.

The sad part of my story is that the niece killed herself because she felt that she could never escape him. My Mom's Friend and her brother are fighting douchebag for custody of kiddo.

biggestdog420:maybe because counter terrorism kept saying.. "ya gonna do it? ya gonna do it?".. just to make sure they wouldn't do it. It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

When they were first identified, news outlets were saying that the older brother had been previously questioned by the FBI, so makes sense to me.

minnesotaboy:It's what if Harold and Kumar actually did try to become terrorists. Although those two would've been a little smarter.

[encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com image 240x160]

Maybe it's more like Bill and Ted...

[encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com image 263x191]

I am not sure "Be excellent to each other", and "Party on dudes" is particularly well suited an ideology to exploding bombs in crowded places.

/although as most real religions show, no matter how peace loving it might start, a couple of generations down the line and chinese whispers has turned the message for some of the followers into "kill the unbelievers"

biggestdog420:maybe because counter terrorism kept saying.. "ya gonna do it? ya gonna do it?".. just to make sure they wouldn't do it. It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

That was addressed actually. The Russian government actually alerted the FBI about the older brother in 2010 I think who investigated then cleared him before during his citizenship application. He apparently was not so hardcore at the time.

Rapmaster2000:Kill an MIT police officer. Why did the brothers shoot 26-year-old Sean Collier? The murder at 10:30 p.m. on Thursday set in motion the events that would ultimately lead to their capture.

This is what I was trying to understand after hearing about their capture. I kept thinking that they shot him in that high speed chase they were involved in. It doesn't make any sense that you would just go shoot a cop who doesn't even know you're there. What does that get you?

I heard that they shot him because they wanted to get a real gun for the younger brother. It doesn't make sense to me, but then again, these guys were obviously not all that bright. You'd think it would be better to slip away under the radar without a gun rather than bring attention to yourself for the sake of getting one. Perhaps these bombers had watched too many action thriller movies...

ImpatientlyUnsympathetic:biggestdog420: maybe because counter terrorism kept saying.. "ya gonna do it? ya gonna do it?".. just to make sure they wouldn't do it. It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

The media has made a pretty big deal about the fact that he was interviewed by the FBI. Are you not paying attention? It was brought up by Congress in debate of the Immigration Bill yesterday, too. They were saying that immigrants applying for citizenship would not get personal interviews, like Timur the Lame did.

The FBI says they interviewed him at the request of Russia, found nothing conclusive and shut the books on it. The mother says the FBI spoke with him on a regular basis. WHICH IS IT?

ongbok:THX 1138: Nina_Hartley's_Ass: Looks like their "plan" was "get away with it." Then they panicked when the photos were released.

That's kind of my take on it too. If they suddenly both dropped out of sight as soon as the bombings happened, they'd have brought more suspicion on themselves. However if they went about their regular routines, there would be less reason to think they were involved. This is all in the absence of video evidence, of course, which seems to have spooked them once it came out.

I doubt they would have brought any suspicion on themselves. Who was going to miss them? They didn't seem to have much contact with family here. The older brother didn't have a job. And a phone call to one or two friends would have put their group of friends at ease. And as for the younger brother I really don't know how much the school would have cared if he stopped attending.

So either way, if they would have dropped out of sight or went about their regular business, I doubt that they would have been caught until they said something to somebody or tried another attack, if the pictures of them didn't come out.

I agree. No one notices that you're mum on an issue when 23,985,568 other people are talking about it. They could have been out of the country if they'd planned properly, well before their pictures were released. If that draws suspicion, so what? They're gone! Instead, their cunning plan was, "not get caught" and they did whatever they do normally in their lives, which was not going to end well for them. I mean... the FBI wanted everyone's pictures, they surely weren't so oblivious at the finish line not to notice the cameras... that should have indicated to them on Tuesday/Wednesday that it was time to go. Still not identified, still not suspects... so GO! but no... Thursday, when shiat got real, then they made a bunch of stupid moves and farked up big time.

Since they had more explosives, you may conclude that they had more potential targets, but why would they wait until after they were in the news to attack again? Lazy stupid idiots. They were just too dumb to function: See - running over brother.

ImpatientlyUnsympathetic:dallylamma: The more I read about these two the more I agree with their Uncle, what a pair of farking losers. They got the golden ticket out of the bombed out shiathole that is Chechnya/Dagestan, came to the US, were able to earn scholarships for post-secondary educations, became citizens...

They should have been great examples of the American Dream, but instead it seems like someone was able to give them (the older one anyway) a hard-on for the old country, the old ways and a hatred of the decadent West.

Well shiat son, nobody was stopping you, why didn't you go back to the old country if you were such a proud Chechen...

I wonder what Timur the Lame's idea of the American Dream was... because he found a pretty, smart girl to marry and had a child and disappeared for 6 months to Russia while she took care of their home and when he came back, she worked 70-80 hours a week to support him. Sounds like "working hard to achieve a good life" was not his American Dream. Such a farking loser.

Every picture I have seen of him he looks like a complete farking retard. Maybe he got hit in the head too many times boxing?

biggestdog420:ImpatientlyUnsympathetic: biggestdog420: maybe because counter terrorism kept saying.. "ya gonna do it? ya gonna do it?".. just to make sure they wouldn't do it. It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

The media has made a pretty big deal about the fact that he was interviewed by the FBI. Are you not paying attention? It was brought up by Congress in debate of the Immigration Bill yesterday, too. They were saying that immigrants applying for citizenship would not get personal interviews, like Timur the Lame did.

The FBI says they interviewed him at the request of Russia, found nothing conclusive and shut the books on it. The mother says the FBI spoke with him on a regular basis. WHICH IS IT?

His dad thought Joker was a second year medical student and Tamerlan was a professional fighter. The older one quit boxing for religious reasons and the younger one only graduated from high school in 2011. Which is it? Their uncle thought they were losers and their father thought Joker was an angel. Which is it? Do you really think the family knows the truth? Maybe he said he talked to the FBI all the time as a service to the US, as he's such a good son and citizen, right? His mother lives in Russia, she has no facts that prove the FBI chatted with him on the regular....

palelizard:THX 1138: Prank Call of Cthulhu: 12. Use a pressure cooker (which has an incredibly low burst pressure) to build their bomb. I'd be pretty pissed if I got my legs blown off by a bomb, but I'd be even more pissed off getting them blown off by a piece of crap like this.

Piece of crap? According to the charges listed in TFA, it's now officially classed as a Weapon of Mass Destruction, and I can hardly see them doing that if it were indeed just a piece of crap!

ImpatientlyUnsympathetic:dallylamma: The more I read about these two the more I agree with their Uncle, what a pair of farking losers. They got the golden ticket out of the bombed out shiathole that is Chechnya/Dagestan, came to the US, were able to earn scholarships for post-secondary educations, became citizens...

They should have been great examples of the American Dream, but instead it seems like someone was able to give them (the older one anyway) a hard-on for the old country, the old ways and a hatred of the decadent West.

Well shiat son, nobody was stopping you, why didn't you go back to the old country if you were such a proud Chechen...

I wonder what Timur the Lame's idea of the American Dream was... because he found a pretty, smart girl to marry and had a child and disappeared for 6 months to Russia while she took care of their home and when he came back, she worked 70-80 hours a week to support him. Sounds like "working hard to achieve a good life" was not his American Dream. Such a farking loser.

Pretty much huh? "I've done nothing with my life and all the advantages given to me and this causes me to feel unfulfilled...IT MUST BE AMERICA'S FAULT!!!11!!ONE!"

Also, upon further thought, he probably didn't want to go back to Chechnya to fight for his country because it gets awful Putiny over there whenever anyone steps out of line.

Theaetetus:Tatsuma:/how about Tamerlan dropping boxing because 'Muslims don't punch people in the face' shortly before dropping bombs in a public place?

Bombs are not fists. It may be a strange statement, but it's not inconsistent. Maybe he meant that Muslims don't stoop to mere fisticuffs. Or maybe he meant that Muslims don't fight as a sport. There are lots of ways to read that.

Hyper-religious people will use any excuse to justify, well anything.

It's just like the people who burned Harry Potter and D&D books for being "satanic".

hobnail:ImpatientlyUnsympathetic: dallylamma: The more I read about these two the more I agree with their Uncle, what a pair of farking losers. They got the golden ticket out of the bombed out shiathole that is Chechnya/Dagestan, came to the US, were able to earn scholarships for post-secondary educations, became citizens...

They should have been great examples of the American Dream, but instead it seems like someone was able to give them (the older one anyway) a hard-on for the old country, the old ways and a hatred of the decadent West.

Well shiat son, nobody was stopping you, why didn't you go back to the old country if you were such a proud Chechen...

I wonder what Timur the Lame's idea of the American Dream was... because he found a pretty, smart girl to marry and had a child and disappeared for 6 months to Russia while she took care of their home and when he came back, she worked 70-80 hours a week to support him. Sounds like "working hard to achieve a good life" was not his American Dream. Such a farking loser.

Every picture I have seen of him he looks like a complete farking retard. Maybe he got hit in the head too many times boxing?

It's 1,000,000% obvious that he's totally obsessed with himself. His over-confidence is what got them caught.

ShawnDoc:biggestdog420: It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

What more do you expect to hear? Crazy mom says FBI were talking to him, the FBI released a statement saying no they hadn't. Press reported both her side and the FBI's response. What more is their to discuss?

i suppose its too much to ask for skype records? dates? they talked to him once? twice? Maybe invite the mother here to be interviewed and asked what she thinks constitutes regular contact? Did they interview him in person? did they ever talk to him on skype or the phone? It just seems really easy for them to just say, "yeah we talked to him once, but so what? we talk to a lot of people".

hobnail:ImpatientlyUnsympathetic: dallylamma: The more I read about these two the more I agree with their Uncle, what a pair of farking losers. They got the golden ticket out of the bombed out shiathole that is Chechnya/Dagestan, came to the US, were able to earn scholarships for post-secondary educations, became citizens...

They should have been great examples of the American Dream, but instead it seems like someone was able to give them (the older one anyway) a hard-on for the old country, the old ways and a hatred of the decadent West.

Well shiat son, nobody was stopping you, why didn't you go back to the old country if you were such a proud Chechen...

I wonder what Timur the Lame's idea of the American Dream was... because he found a pretty, smart girl to marry and had a child and disappeared for 6 months to Russia while she took care of their home and when he came back, she worked 70-80 hours a week to support him. Sounds like "working hard to achieve a good life" was not his American Dream. Such a farking loser.

Every picture I have seen of him he looks like a complete farking retard. Maybe he got hit in the head too many times boxing?

It has been proposed that there were head injuries... I think he might have had a severe reaction to the birth of his child that turned him into a whack job, like Scott Peterson. But instead of getting jealous about his kid taking up the wife's time and energy, he freaked out because he didn't like America as a place to raise his child. If his religious leanings tell him that America is not good enough and yet his daughter is an American citizen, he might have lost his shiat.

I know the people experience religious reawakenings when they have kids. My dad got very invested in religious teachings when my mom was pregnant, they formally joined a church and scheduled a baptism prior to my birth. My dad expressed significant remorse when the baptism of my brother was delayed due to a death in the family, he expected us to be baptized immediately. Fortunately, my dad is not a crazy type religious nut, but you kind of role the dice on that. Much later in life, I did realize that my dad really had a hardcore hatred for the Catholic Church and had made thinly veiled references to the Pope as the Antichrist. But he didn't get weird until he was otherwise messed up (mental health issues) or he could have been one of those freaks that acts on their crazy beliefs.

miss diminutive:make me some tea: The more I read about this, the more it's apparent to me that Johar was brought into this plot at the last minute to help his big brother out. I don't believe he really was into the jihadi crap.

Doesn't make him any less responsible, but that's my gut feeling anyway.

The more I read about this, the more I suspect that these two were simply too dumb to have any political or religious motive beyond "durrr, America is bad, mkay?"

They went after two groups:1) Bostonians2) People who run 26 miles for fun.

dallylamma:ImpatientlyUnsympathetic: dallylamma: The more I read about these two the more I agree with their Uncle, what a pair of farking losers. They got the golden ticket out of the bombed out shiathole that is Chechnya/Dagestan, came to the US, were able to earn scholarships for post-secondary educations, became citizens...

They should have been great examples of the American Dream, but instead it seems like someone was able to give them (the older one anyway) a hard-on for the old country, the old ways and a hatred of the decadent West.

Well shiat son, nobody was stopping you, why didn't you go back to the old country if you were such a proud Chechen...

I wonder what Timur the Lame's idea of the American Dream was... because he found a pretty, smart girl to marry and had a child and disappeared for 6 months to Russia while she took care of their home and when he came back, she worked 70-80 hours a week to support him. Sounds like "working hard to achieve a good life" was not his American Dream. Such a farking loser.

Pretty much huh? "I've done nothing with my life and all the advantages given to me and this causes me to feel unfulfilled...IT MUST BE AMERICA'S FAULT!!!11!!ONE!"

Also, upon further thought, he probably didn't want to go back to Chechnya to fight for his country because it gets awful Putiny over there whenever anyone steps out of line.

Yeah, I wouldn't expect someone as self-obsessed as he is to actually really put himself out there for his Chechen brethren. Plus, Putin is pretty much a real life Russian Superhero, right? Isn't that what the memes tell me? Him and Chuck Norris?

Bontesla:make me some tea: Bontesla: Yogimus: make me some tea: Bontesla: make me some tea: The more I read about this, the more it's apparent to me that Johar was brought into this plot at the last minute to help his big brother out. I don't believe he really was into the jihadi crap.

Doesn't make him any less responsible, but that's my gut feeling anyway.

I'm inclined to agree. Hell, some of his tweets the day of and day after the marathon almost suggest he was oblivious to his own involvement. In particular - the one in which he tells Boston to be safe either suggests he's a true and rare sociopath or he's an too much of an idiot to realize he participated in the event.

That doesn't say much because I've been wrong about nearly every damned thing related to this event...

I'm leaning toward the 'sociopath' side of things. How the hell can anyone set off a bomb, killing and maiming people, and then go to a party and be out in public, acting like nothing happened, as if he was jovial that he'd gotten away with it? No remorse, not evidence of even disturbed by what he'd done. His world only seems to have come crashing down after his brother was killed.

I've been wrong a whole lot too, this is a bizarre case. It doesn't fit the MO of most jihadi attacks.

This wasnt a jihadi attack. It was more akin to a mass shooting, but with a different weapon. Motivation wise, at least.

That pretty much summarizes my thoughts.

Same here. But I do look forward to seeing what the actual bomber has to say about it, if anything.

God... I'd LOVE to see answers to all of these questions being raised.

biggestdog420:It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

"Yeah mom, I'm doing great over here, really! Yep, the boxing career is taking off! I might even be champion before too long! I know! It's awesome! Anything else? Well, let's see... The FBI calls me every once in a while to see if I know anything, and I help them any way I can. Uh huh. Yep, they call me. Oh, and last week I went fishing, it was awesome. I caught a huge shark, like 10 feet long, no, more like 20 feet, it was crazy! No, in the ocean. Yeah, you can do that! Yep, a big, huge shark. And when we brought it in to shore they cut the stomach open and a little kid fell out, gasping for air. Yeah, I saved him! I know, so awesome! Anything else? Oh, I almost forgot, remember how I told you I was thinking about trying out golfing sometime? Uh huh. Yeah, I played Augusta National last weekend, it's like the best field in the country. Anyways, I shot a 38, which is like a record or something. Yeah! Really! They gave me a trophy and everything! Yep, first time on a course! I guess I'm just that good! OK mom, I gotta go. OK, I will. And can you send me that $500 soon, my bank is still screwy and hasn't processed my $25,000 paycheck. I know, frustrating! Thanks ma!"

Clemkadidlefark:Not once does it occur to Mother Jones to ask ... Where they get the money?

Dzhokhar and Tamerlan Tsarnaev. Where'd they get their money?

Dzhokhar, the young brother, is listed as a sophomore student at UMass Dartmouth living in the Pine Dale dormitory. According to Dartmouth's Cost of Attendance data for 2013-2014 the tab starts at $10G and change. Indirect expenses can range from $500 to over $2,000. No mention of costs for cell phones, food, cars and other modern necessities.

Tamerlan was by all accounts, unemployed. His converted wife reportedly works 70/80 hours a week as an in home caregiver in order to make ends meet for their family. His unsuccessful attempt to be a boxer of note (he made one round in the Golden gloves and got croaked)? That takes real money on top of daily and usual costs of living in one of the most expensive cities in America. The Cambridge area Ranks No. 8 Costliest Cities in America. There's coaching fees, gym fees, equipment costs like gloves and headgear which can easily run past $100 each. Good hand wraps are something like $40 and you do not want to cheap out on those. A proper wrap will save you from breaking bones in your hands. Then there's the cost of a proper diet (heavy on protein) and Supplements. Pain relief costs and costs related to healthcare.

Short? It ain't cheap. In fact, it's expensive.

Available information says Tamerlane was married to Katherine Russell and they produced a child. Children are expensive. In Massachusetts average costs to deliver an infant range from $9,600 to $11,000, a normal birth without complications. According to Family Education website a one child family can expect to expense $11,500 for a newborn ... in the first year.

How'd they pay for that?

Their living space. Expensive. A one bedroom apartment in Watertown ... man, I'm not seeing much less than $1,700. More likely around $2,000. If inside the city limits of Cambridge? More.

Clemkadidlefark:Not once does it occur to Mother Jones to ask ... Where they get the money?

Dzhokhar and Tamerlan Tsarnaev. Where'd they get their money?

Dzhokhar, the young brother, is listed as a sophomore student at UMass Dartmouth living in the Pine Dale dormitory. According to Dartmouth's Cost of Attendance data for 2013-2014 the tab starts at $10G and change. Indirect expenses can range from $500 to over $2,000. No mention of costs for cell phones, food, cars and other modern necessities.

Tamerlan was by all accounts, unemployed. His converted wife reportedly works 70/80 hours a week as an in home caregiver in order to make ends meet for their family. His unsuccessful attempt to be a boxer of note (he made one round in the Golden gloves and got croaked)? That takes real money on top of daily and usual costs of living in one of the most expensive cities in America. The Cambridge area Ranks No. 8 Costliest Cities in America. There's coaching fees, gym fees, equipment costs like gloves and headgear which can easily run past $100 each. Good hand wraps are something like $40 and you do not want to cheap out on those. A proper wrap will save you from breaking bones in your hands. Then there's the cost of a proper diet (heavy on protein) and Supplements. Pain relief costs and costs related to healthcare.

Short? It ain't cheap. In fact, it's expensive.

Available information says Tamerlane was married to Katherine Russell and they produced a child. Children are expensive. In Massachusetts average costs to deliver an infant range from $9,600 to $11,000, a normal birth without complications. According to Family Education website a one child family can expect to expense $11,500 for a newborn ... in the first year.

How'd they pay for that?

Their living space. Expensive. A one bedroom apartment in Watertown ... man, I'm not seeing much less than $1,700. More likely around $2,000. If inside the city limits of Cambridge? More.

Cost to fly to Moscow from Boston ranges from $8 ...

gonna go out on a limb and say financial aid and student loans like most people.

tommyl66:biggestdog420: It is also bizarre that the mother claims the FBI was in contact with the older brother on a regular basis, but I am not hearing anything at all about that in the media aside from her initial claims which were simply dismissed. just say'in

"Yeah mom, I'm doing great over here, really! Yep, the boxing career is taking off! I might even be champion before too long! I know! It's awesome! Anything else? Well, let's see... The FBI calls me every once in a while to see if I know anything, and I help them any way I can. Uh huh. Yep, they call me. Oh, and last week I went fishing, it was awesome. I caught a huge shark, like 10 feet long, no, more like 20 feet, it was crazy! No, in the ocean. Yeah, you can do that! Yep, a big, huge shark. And when we brought it in to shore they cut the stomach open and a little kid fell out, gasping for air. Yeah, I saved him! I know, so awesome! Anything else? Oh, I almost forgot, remember how I told you I was thinking about trying out golfing sometime? Uh huh. Yeah, I played Augusta National last weekend, it's like the best field in the country. Anyways, I shot a 38, which is like a record or something. Yeah! Really! They gave me a trophy and everything! Yep, first time on a course! I guess I'm just that good! OK mom, I gotta go. OK, I will. And can you send me that $500 soon, my bank is still screwy and hasn't processed my $25,000 paycheck. I know, frustrating! Thanks ma!"

Sounds about right. Add, "yep, the baby is going into 2nd grade, she's too smart to start in Kindergarten even at 3. Oh, yeah, Joker is studying all day and night, but still has time to come to dinner with the wife and I!"

ImpatientlyUnsympathetic:hobnail: ImpatientlyUnsympathetic: dallylamma: The more I read about these two the more I agree with their Uncle, what a pair of farking losers. They got the golden ticket out of the bombed out shiathole that is Chechnya/Dagestan, came to the US, were able to earn scholarships for post-secondary educations, became citizens...

They should have been great examples of the American Dream, but instead it seems like someone was able to give them (the older one anyway) a hard-on for the old country, the old ways and a hatred of the decadent West.

Well shiat son, nobody was stopping you, why didn't you go back to the old country if you were such a proud Chechen...

I wonder what Timur the Lame's idea of the American Dream was... because he found a pretty, smart girl to marry and had a child and disappeared for 6 months to Russia while she took care of their home and when he came back, she worked 70-80 hours a week to support him. Sounds like "working hard to achieve a good life" was not his American Dream. Such a farking loser.

Every picture I have seen of him he looks like a complete farking retard. Maybe he got hit in the head too many times boxing?

It has been proposed that there were head injuries... I think he might have had a severe reaction to the birth of his child that turned him into a whack job, like Scott Peterson. But instead of getting jealous about his kid taking up the wife's time and energy, he freaked out because he didn't like America as a place to raise his child. If his religious leanings tell him that America is not good enough and yet his daughter is an American citizen, he might have lost his shiat.

I know the people experience religious reawakenings when they have kids. My dad got very invested in religious teachings when my mom was pregnant, they formally joined a church and scheduled a baptism prior to my birth. My dad expressed significant remorse when the baptism of my brother was delayed due to a death in the family, he expected us to b ...

Tamerlan was an abusive douchbag, he was arrest for assaulting his girlfriend in 2009.

I'm not 100% sure if the abused GF is now his wife, it's not surprising he had a kid so soon after.

Abusers try and knock-up their victims so they can never leave them. Anyone who has done any work with domestic violence victims will tell you stories of thrown out BC pills, punctured condoms, and even ripping out UTIs. Why do you think she worked her ass off while HE stayed at home? "Traditional values" my ass.

Asshats like this need someone to control and abuse 24/7 to make themselves feel good about themselves.

I guess pushing around women didn't do it for him anymore, so he decided to blow people up.

make me some tea:Doesn't make him any less responsible, but that's my gut feeling anyway.

It could make the difference between life in prison or the death penalty though. Reports make it seem like he has been cooperative with investigators so far. So, that might convince the government not to seek the death penalty at all. Or, a jury who finds him guilty but truly believes that his brother was the really culpable one might not vote to give him death on that basis.*

Of course, some people (me included) would argue that spending the rest of your life in 23-hour/day isolation might actually be a fate worse than death, but that is another issue.

* both crimes also authorize a judge to impose imprisonment for "any term of years," so it is technically possible that he could be sentenced to something less than life. But I would think that there would need to be some pretty extraordinary circumstances for that. Nonetheless, a judge could sentence him to something like 70 years if they thought he deserved a chance at spending a few days as a free man before he dies. And at that point the state would just try him for murder so he would have to serve that sentence after he finishes the federal one, thus making sure he never sees freedom again.

ImpatientlyUnsympathetic:dallylamma: ImpatientlyUnsympathetic: dallylamma: The more I read about these two the more I agree with their Uncle, what a pair of farking losers. They got the golden ticket out of the bombed out shiathole that is Chechnya/Dagestan, came to the US, were able to earn scholarships for post-secondary educations, became citizens...

They should have been great examples of the American Dream, but instead it seems like someone was able to give them (the older one anyway) a hard-on for the old country, the old ways and a hatred of the decadent West.

Well shiat son, nobody was stopping you, why didn't you go back to the old country if you were such a proud Chechen...

I wonder what Timur the Lame's idea of the American Dream was... because he found a pretty, smart girl to marry and had a child and disappeared for 6 months to Russia while she took care of their home and when he came back, she worked 70-80 hours a week to support him. Sounds like "working hard to achieve a good life" was not his American Dream. Such a farking loser.

Pretty much huh? "I've done nothing with my life and all the advantages given to me and this causes me to feel unfulfilled...IT MUST BE AMERICA'S FAULT!!!11!!ONE!"

Also, upon further thought, he probably didn't want to go back to Chechnya to fight for his country because it gets awful Putiny over there whenever anyone steps out of line.

Yeah, I wouldn't expect someone as self-obsessed as he is to actually really put himself out there for his Chechen brethren. Plus, Putin is pretty much a real life Russian Superhero, right? Isn't that what the memes tell me? Him and Chuck Norris?