Tom Cable thought he had the O-Line he needed…LOL
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Scary thing is Cable also thought “all Kwame needs is some good coaching”…12 games later, after leading the league in penalties and sacks allowed..it finally suck in.

jhill

and Barnes was terrible in Jacksonville….

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No he wasn’t. We covered that last offseaon. He gave up sacks to Freeney and Mario Williams in multiple games. A few other big name sack artists too.

And what about the Jags top rated running game?

Terrible? Nah!

Regardless of it, he was brought here to compete for the LT spot with the loser going to RT. I think most of you said you don’t draft a RT with the #7 pick in the draft.

jhill Says:
February 28th, 2010 at 4:28 pm
So McClain only put up 24 reps and Micah Johnson put up 31.

Sean Weatherspoon put up 34.

If we draft Johnson or Weatherspoon instead of McClain, are we HWS guys?

Or do I need to wait on the 40?
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Linebacker is definitely an “athletic” position. Last year the Raiders drafted two linebackers. Slade Norris and Stryker Sulak. Both were known for speed and athleticism.

Thomas Howard was the last legit linebacker drafted. He happens to be the fastest linebacker in the NFL.

Kirk Morrison? His strength is more in being mobile and less in being physical.

I think you answered your own question. Davis has a lot of faults..but he is true to what he believes….regardless of the consequences.

RaiderLen

Rack o

Yes DHB is one of the least feared for now.

Take my remarks in context. I think you will find the DHB was the last in line, but if all other pistons are firing, he could be a back breaker.

Do not delude yourself, NFL teams have to account for DMAC.

SnB offense defense specialteams

Jhill,

With all due respect…why was Barnes, A LEFT TACKLE, available for a song?

Hue Jackson is the most important person in the building right now. Its up to him to salvage a lot of careers and get this doggone team going to exploit the raw talent on the offensive roster.

I just hope that the Raiders recognize the desperate needs on the O-Line. We go in with Cooper Carlisle, Cornell Green, Samson Satele…forget about it!

jhill

you do realize the least feared WR in the NFL is DHB, right?

And McFumble instills zero fear in defenses.

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Disagree with that.

I think those 2 are clearly on the mind of opposing DCs. I think we just make it easy on them by running DMAC between the tackles and not trying to get him matched up one on one with a LB or S. And by having DHB clear out areas for other receivers.

Not sure why so many believe Bey is going to rise above the knocks he’s had all along?

Yeah, he’s a hard worker, nice guy, wants to contribute..but it’s also a fact that his claim to fame is he’s a track star..someone who’s fast.

It’s not unusual for someone converted to football because of other skills to flinch, and hear footsteps, who tightens up expecting a hit..who’s not grown up, playing football at different levels, getting used to hits.

You add in the fact it’s the NFL where everyone lays a solid teeth jarring hit, tells me it’s harder than many of you might believe on just “getting better catching the ball”.

Bey has NEVER had solid success catching the ball…and was known for bobbling balls, and dropping balls all through college.

Just don’t know why so many of you believe he’s going to be better or should be automatically given the chance to be better than others on the roster who are obviously past Bey as far as development goes.

jhill

SnB,

Do we really have to rehash the Khalif Barnes thing? The point is he was brought here to compete with Henderson for the LT spot with the loser going to RT. Right, wrong, or indifferent that is the direction the coaches chose to go in WAY before the draft. Once that happened, OT was off the board. Same as this year. If we tender Barnes or pick up a FA OT, we are not drafting an OT at 8.

I think those 2 are clearly on the mind of opposing DCs. I think we just make it easy on them by running DMAC between the tackles and not trying to get him matched up one on one with a LB or S. And by having DHB clear out areas for other receivers.

I’d argue that better play calling makes them both more of a threat.
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At the beginning of the season, you saw teams respecting Bey’s speed, but that didn’t last long.
And McF might only be effective out of the backfield, or outside the tackles, because he’s also guilty of the same knocks he had in college, which is going down too easily, and never breaking tackles.

Of course better play calling would help everyone, because that might have just been one of the worst seasons any team has had calling plays.

RaiderLen

Satelle, Carlisle and Green on the right side is totaly unacceptable.

If L Walker can hold down the RG position as Jhill suggests, cool.

That still leaves a center and right tackle. Plus… Mario did struggle after Gallery left the line up.

And we are not sure at this point if Gallery will be healthy when the regular season starts.

To Many question marks on the o line.

Earth… to AL/Cable…need O linemen

jhill

Rich,

I don’t think 3-4 balls a game is expecting too much. And I don’t mean 3-4 of the same opportunities he had last year. I would like to see him get 1 reverse, and a couple of WR screens each game. Also a couple of short 3-5 yd slants and crossing routes. Have him line up in the slot from time to time. Send him in motion. He may drop 3 or 4 balls a game on top of what I’m saying, but he should be able to catch 3 or 4 of those too.

JT52

Picks we could had that we woulda been way better off with!!!!

Aaron Rodgers

Calvin Johnson (however with Rodgers we prob wouldnt be picking 1st)

Adrian Peterson ( sam as above)

Patrick Willis (Same as Above)

Joe Thomas

CockMcGEE unnamed probowler

RaiderLen

Richochet Says:
February 28th, 2010 at 4:44 pm
Not sure why so many believe Bey is going to rise above the knocks he’s had all along?

Yeah, he’s a hard worker, nice guy, wants to contribute..but it’s also a fact that his claim to fame is he’s a track star..someone who’s fast.

It’s not unusual for someone converted to football because of other skills to flinch, and hear footsteps, who tightens up expecting a hit..who’s not grown up, playing football at different levels, getting used to hits.

You add in the fact it’s the NFL where everyone lays a solid teeth jarring hit, tells me it’s harder than many of you might believe on just “getting better catching the ball”.

Bey has NEVER had solid success catching the ball…and was known for bobbling balls, and dropping balls all through college.

Just don’t know why so many of you believe he’s going to be better or should be automatically given the chance to be better than others on the roster who are obviously past Bey as far as development
======================================================
Rack O

GREAT POST.

We don’t know. Your points are valid.

I would however offer up Cliff Branch and Bob Hayes as an example of a track stars that made the transition.

I’m willing to give DHB the time to develope.

It’s tough to witness, but He may be able to make it happen.

jhill

At the beginning of the season, you saw teams respecting Bey’s speed, but that didn’t last long.
And McF might only be effective out of the backfield, or outside the tackles, because he’s also guilty of the same knocks he had in college, which is going down too easily, and never breaking tackles.

——————————————————

I agree with that. I think teams stopped respecting the passing game in general because they knew the pass rush would be there before the long patterns could develop. Not to mention the QB issues.

We need to accept that DMAC is best outside the tackles and out of the backfield and move forward instead of forcing him between the tackles and hoping for something different.

Key is play calling.
Yeah, need O line, a solid go to receiver, D line, but regardless, plays should play to the strengths, and not just stick to a game plan that’s not working.
to hell with the deep ball. Get teams respecting the short pass, the 6 yard toss to the RB..grinding out first downs..instead of the all or nothing plays that Cable calls.

But…what if we had a Center and Guards that could beat their man at the LOS with a fullback that was a competent lead blocker.

Then what?
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Having a center and guards that beat their man at the LOS? Solid lead blocker?

Regardless of the team..you’re in the playoffs with even an average RB…hell, make a hole big enough..and I can get a first down.

No…really 🙂

RaiderLen

Raider O, Bench Press is a crappy way to measure a Football player’s ability.

It’s a “sexy number” but has not much to do with real football performance.

jhill

Exactly Rich, agree 100%.

If DHB was dropping screens, and slants, and short routes, I’d be right there with you on the bust thing. But with hands being an acknowledged issue with him, why put him in a position to catch 15-20 yd fastballs from Russell?

We have to get Houston and Spikes, and Austen Lane is a must have luxury.

RaiderLen

Rack O,

And there it is.

A dominant O line would enable even you to be a star.

Start Jogging, and get the cell number of the old man. 🙂

SnB offense defense specialteams

Jhill,

Not here to argue about Barnes specifically. Just the concept that fixing the line through free agent castoffs as a strategy vs. building with top tier draft picks.

We would never approach building the secondary that way. It has always been “preceived top tier free agents” or high round draft picks. This is my problem with Al Davis. It appears that he spends WAAYYY to much effort and resources in certain positions, while thinking the rest get by with castoffs.

Seymour was only brought in when it was PAINFULLY obvious in the last week of training camp that the D-Line was woefully uncompetitive.

I would like to see the Raiders go for a top tier O-Lineman or D-Lineman IN MULTIPLE YEARS!…..Lord knows we’ve done that for other positions

You shouldn’t look for Talent at the combine, but its a good way to compare talent.

If all these drills like the bench and 40 are “crappy way to measure” then why do GMs, scouts, and coaches pat attention to it?!?

SteveAlford21

RE: Anyone who says to take Dez or ANY players other than an OT in the 1st round…

Emmitt Smith. Troy Aikman.

Smith is far from the greatest RB in NFL history. His stats are due to the Line behind which he played. Aikman didn’t “get old” and start getting concussions: his linemen started getting old and retiring/being traded/becoming FAs… letting Aikman get hit a lot more. Behind an average line, Aikman is an average QB and Smith is a pedestrian back. We don’t need “playmakers” as some of you keep saying… we need dominant players on the line who will make the rest of our offense look like superstars (some might already be, if given enough time for a play to develop).

Using our 1st pick on anything other than OT doesn’t leave us with several more picks to use on the line… not the way you guys think. What we do with that 1st pick affects every pick thereafter. I’d rather have top OL prospects and miss out on Dez than get Dez and have lower-tier line prospects. We don’t have the luxury of taking a “playmaker” when we have a horrid line… not when there are four top-15 OTs… and then a huge talent dropoff after that, meaning that we won’t get an elite lineman if we pick anything else… we’ll be taking second-shelf whiskey and trying to make it Middletons. If you disagree, you don’t understand football. Games are won and lost in the trenches.

raidertalk

With the 39th Pick in the 2010 draft..the Raiders take
MUARKICE POUNCEY, C, FLORIDA

Before DHB was picked, Al’s 40 time guy was a guy like Carlos Francis in rd 4.
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Because Russell threw the ball 80 yards on his knees and had the cannon arm. Hence no Calvin Johnson
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C’mon SnB. There was a hell of a lot more that went into the drafting of Russell. It cracks me up that people still say goofy stuff like this. Did you watch NFL Network? Did you see the little mock interview with Tony Pike? JR went through tons of that. In fact Kiffin was quoted as saying that JR was very impressive on the grease board. And what about his intangibles? Always cool under fire and extremely competitive? He showed all those things in engineering eight 4th qtr comebacks. After he was hurt in the SEC Championship his sophomore year and Matt Flynn starred in their bowl win, he had to reclaim his job the following season against Flynn and Ryan Perriloux, an extremely heralded recruit. He rose to the occasion and had an outstanding season. And in the Sugar Bowl which was billed as a fight for status as the No. 1 pick in the draft, he rose to the occasion again. Don’t you think the Raiders noticed any of this stuff along with his physical attributes? I know you’re just trying to make points about our drafting in the 1st round the last few years, but let’s not re-write history.

RaiderDebo

SteveAlford21 Says:
February 28th, 2010 at 5:35 pm
RE: Anyone who says to take Dez or ANY players other than an OT in the 1st round…

Emmitt Smith. Troy Aikman.

Smith is far from the greatest RB in NFL history. His stats are due to the Line behind which he played. Aikman didn’t “get old” and start getting concussions: his linemen started getting old and retiring/being traded/becoming FAs… letting Aikman get hit a lot more. Behind an average line, Aikman is an average QB and Smith is a pedestrian back. We don’t need “playmakers” as some of you keep saying… we need dominant players on the line who will make the rest of our offense look like superstars (some might already be, if given enough time for a play to develop).

Using our 1st pick on anything other than OT doesn’t leave us with several more picks to use on the line… not the way you guys think. What we do with that 1st pick affects every pick thereafter. I’d rather have top OL prospects and miss out on Dez than get Dez and have lower-tier line prospects. We don’t have the luxury of taking a “playmaker” when we have a horrid line… not when there are four top-15 OTs… and then a huge talent dropoff after that, meaning that we won’t get an elite lineman if we pick anything else… we’ll be taking second-shelf whiskey and trying to make it Middletons. If you disagree, you don’t understand football. Games are won and lost in the trenches.
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Almost got away with it Steve. Forgot to mention The Playmaker though. Ever heard of a guy named Michael Irvin? Who is the Michael Irvin on our roster? Dez could be the guy.