bidness:natmar_76: gshepnyc: No other two species on the planet have the relationship - including shared history and interdependence - that humans and dogs have. We relied on one another to get to the stage we find ourselves in today. That is more than enough reason not to eat a dog.

What an overstatement, and not remotely true.

If anything, the most valuable animal to humanity is cattle. While dogs were sniffing each other's butts in the jungle, humans had domesticated cattle and were using them to plow farms, using them for milk and sustenance, eating them when they grew old, and using their skins for clothing. Entire nations have been fed on cattle meat while dogs sat around doing not much of anything.

Other animals such as horses have been just as important, if not much more important, as travel and war companions. When was the last time you heard about a famed dog cavalry breaking the lines of an enemy army? Yeah, you didn't, because it was horses that threw themselves onto pikes because of the relations that they formed with their human masters.

Cats have been just as important. Who have people turned to consistently for pest control, to kill rats on farms? That's right, cats, because dogs are too dumb to catch mice.

You can like dogs all you want, but claiming they've helped humanity evolve is patently ridiculous.

I don't have time on my lunch break to explain in detail just how wrong you are point by point. Just suffice it for now to say, go look up when dogs were domesticated vs. when cows were domesticated.

I'm giving up on him. Now he is tossing out buzzwords like "magic." For someone who tells people to be logical, he is not terribly willing to look at the facts.

natmar_76:Entire nations have been fed on cattle meat while dogs sat around doing not much of anything.

I don't think you're going back far enough.

Before we were a world of nations, we were a world of tribes; and before that, mere pack animals. Without dogs to stand guard at our camps, help us track and catch game, provide warmth and companionship, and, yes, even meat when necessary, some of the advancements which led us to form tribes and nations may have taken considerably longer, if they happened at all.

Surely, our history would have unfolded in an altogether different way without dogs. I believe that is the point the poster in question was trying to make.

natmar_76:If anything, the most valuable animal to humanity is cattle. While dogs were sniffing each other's butts in the jungle

Dogs were domesticated thousands of years before any other animal. In fact, it's probably due to the assistance of dogs - through herding (a modified hunting instinct) - that we managed to domesticate any of our livestock.

Zmog:Sarcastica75: Zmog: The Internet, where everyone is presumed male until proven otherwise.

actually, i kind of prefer it that way. i would most prefer to be perceived genderless, but i'll take male over the usual nonsense chicks who aren't here to announce how big their boob sizes are in comparison with a celebrity and otherwise fishing for compliments and e-cock have to put up with. which is why tfd bores me to no end.

/except the jorie threads. that's worth the $5 for the wtflolbbq factor.

All right, you win. I will not send e-cock.

I refuse to make such a comment as PIE may be needed to get BIE. It's part of the rules of BIE you know.

I have said this same thing before myself. I always thought it was kind of weird that some people argue how it's ok to eat some animals because they're "farm" animals but it's definitely not ok to eat dogs and cats because they're "companion" animals. It's like some kind of animal caste system. I would bet that pigs and cows are just as intelligent and capable of feeling pain as dogs and cats.

Another animal comparison I have often thought about is dogs vs coyotes. Dogs and coyotes are so similar that they can breed and produce viable offspring. But despite that, people will treat their dogs like their children, yet they will shoot at, trap, and skin coyotes like it's nothing. What's up with that?

//just to note: I'm not a vegetarian.//I'm more than happy to eat whatever tastes good and is relatively convenient to farm.

gshepnyc:5,000 years is meaningless given 10,000-25,000 year window? Really?

And calling what amounts to a mutual domestication between humans and dogs "magic" or not logical just because you have strong opinions but no education on the subject doesn't make your statement any stronger.

1. Strawman: Magic is in reference to your implication that a special relationship exists (magically) between humans and dogs because of a mere difference of a few thousand years between domestication of dogs and cattle

3. Circular fallacy/Correlation: human-dog relations (lol) are somehow special because human-dog domestication occured before human-cattle domestication because human-dog relations are special

4. Argument of Ignorance/Ad Nauseum: 5000 years is a long time! That must be special! (no, it's not; we domesticate because we can, from dogs to cattle to dolphins)

5. Cherry Picking: ignoring any and all cogent arguments that do not accept the mystical poetic assertion that human-dog relations are special and magical above and beyond any other domestication, despite many other domesticated species being more intelligent and useful than dogs.

Animals are just animals. Meat is just meat. We eat people, when we need to, from the Chilean plane crash to the Oregon Trail to remote tribes that practice ritual consumption. We eat every kind of a

natmar_76:gshepnyc: No other two species on the planet have the relationship - including shared history and interdependence - that humans and dogs have. We relied on one another to get to the stage we find ourselves in today. That is more than enough reason not to eat a dog.

What an overstatement, and not remotely true.

If anything, the most valuable animal to humanity is cattle. While dogs were sniffing each other's butts in the jungle, humans had domesticated cattle and were using them to plow farms, using them for milk and sustenance, eating them when they grew old, and using their skins for clothing. Entire nations have been fed on cattle meat while dogs sat around doing not much of anything.

Other animals such as horses have been just as important, if not much more important, as travel and war companions. When was the last time you heard about a famed dog cavalry breaking the lines of an enemy army? Yeah, you didn't, because it was horses that threw themselves onto pikes because of the relations that they formed with their human masters.

Cats have been just as important. Who have people turned to consistently for pest control, to kill rats on farms? That's right, cats, because dogs are too dumb to catch mice.

You can like dogs all you want, but claiming they've helped humanity evolve is patently ridiculous.

I love all the counter-arguments, which boil down basically to "nu uh, dogs rule, dogs were first". Cows or dogs first, the point is the same.

Dogs being first means shiat. Dogs didn't descend out of heaven and choose humans to live with because it was a holy ordained special magic event. We domesticated every domesticated species because we could, because we are smarter, because we are better than animals.

Dogs smell like shiat. They aren't that smart. Love them all you want (yuck), but they deserve no special ranking above cows, dolphins, cats, pigs, or any other animal.

Muscle is meat. There is nothing wrong with eating it (assuming you believe eating some types of meat is not wrong). Until you can provide a logical, reasonable proof that there is a significant moral difference (ex. humans, normally) between dog meat and the meat of dolphins or pigs, then you are wrong and not worth listening to.

i had dog meat years ago in Mexico city ...I like to know that my meat probably had a name ... I just hope it was organic. Horse meat it tough ... snake is ok ... alligator tail was good ... I could not eat rat when i was in Peru ... that was to far ...I think eating at many fast food places is disgusting ...

natmar_76:I love all the counter-arguments, which boil down basically to "nu uh, dogs rule, dogs were first". Cows or dogs first, the point is the same.

Dogs being first means shiat. Dogs didn't descend out of heaven and choose humans to live with because it was a holy ordained special magic event. We domesticated every domesticated species because we could, because we are smarter, because we are better than animals.

Dogs smell like shiat. They aren't that smart. Love them all you want (yuck), but they deserve no special ranking above cows, dolphins, cats, pigs, or any other animal.

Muscle is meat. There is nothing wrong with eating it (assuming you believe eating some types of meat is not wrong). Until you can provide a logical, reasonable proof that there is a significant moral difference (ex. humans, normally) between dog meat and the meat of dolphins or pigs, then you are wrong and not worth listening to.

Cry about it, dog lovers.

I agree with you on the meat is meat.

What I have a problem with is you seem to ignore what the dog has done throughout its 15,000 year relationship with man. And to say dogs are not smart just helps demonstration your ignorance.

thismomentinblackhistory:Can a pig sense that you are sick and cuddle with you when you are bedridden? Does a pig freak out when you come home? Does a pig whimper when you're angry? Does a pig plop his head on your leg when you are crying? If your pig died would you take off work?

R.A.Danny:Cythraul: R.A.Danny: Cythraul: R.A.Danny: Logically this planet would be better off with 75% fewer humans. Why must we be such hypocrites?

Are you suggesting we start to eat other people?

No, I'm the emotional guy that thinks puppies should be cuddled.

Humans need cuddling too.

I agree 100%.

This is why I cuddle with my puppy. It makes us both happy. Plus my puppy is so cute.He are a big sweetie, yes him are. With him big puppy eyes and cute puppy nosey and pink tongue to give kisses. And with many feet and many paws so he can play more than anybody else! He is just the sweetiest little sugar butt!

natmar_76:I love all the counter-arguments, which boil down basically to "nu uh, dogs rule, dogs were first". Cows or dogs first, the point is the same.

Dogs being first means shiat. Dogs didn't descend out of heaven and choose humans to live with because it was a holy ordained special magic event. We domesticated every domesticated species because we could, because we are smarter, because we are better than animals.

Dogs smell like shiat. They aren't that smart. Love them all you want (yuck), but they deserve no special ranking above cows, dolphins, cats, pigs, or any other animal.

Muscle is meat. There is nothing wrong with eating it (assuming you believe eating some types of meat is not wrong). Until you can provide a logical, reasonable proof that there is a significant moral difference (ex. humans, normally) between dog meat and the meat of dolphins or pigs, then you are wrong and not worth listening to.

elev8meL8r:Irving Maimway: Spent 6 years in Korea. Not all dogs are considered edible. There's a certain breed that's been cultivated for tastiness. Much like Black Angus.

However, in a pinch, any dog will do. But remember, black dogs taste bad, yellow dogs taste best.

Would it be the opposite in Africa, I wonder?

CSB: Taking a driving tour of a game preserve in South Africa (all of us white Americans), we pull up to view, from a safe distance, a pride of lions chilling in the sun. Our guide (African, not an Afrikaaner) says "Oh by the way, if the lions charge, I'm going to be the only one who's safe. They don't like dark meat."