Really? I have NEVER seen a LEO carry Kahr. In my county there is mostly Glock except for two agencies that carry ether SIG or HK. I would suggest not attacking people who want two of the biggest makers in firearms to be contributed in the list. HK is used by both civ, LE, and our government. So is Sig. Just my thought…

You should take a look at CDNN. Sigs for around $500 and HK's around $600-700
Way to expensive for civilians...just like 1911's right?

I suppose if you lived.....

Originally Posted by -gunut-

Really? I have NEVER seen a LEO carry Kahr. In my county there is mostly Glock except for two agencies that carry ether SIG or HK. I would suggest not attacking people who want two of the biggest makers in firearms to be contributed in the list. HK is used by both civ, LE, and our government. So is Sig. Just my thought…

You should take a look at CDNN. Sigs for around $500 and HK's around $600-700
Way to expensive for civilians...just like 1911's right?

....in New York City, you would have noticed the Kahr's....so far, I fail to see an attack on anyone....my perspective here in Virginia is from a former LEO and military officer perspective, and the group that I meet with on a regular basis, who happen to be a mix bag of former and active duty LEO's, Navy SEALs, etc....with very few exceptions, Sig and H&K are not on their wish lists, nor what they use on our ranges from Virginia Beach to Blackwater...the SEALs have and some still do use Sigs and H&K's, but it is not the weapon of choice, as some would have you to believe. Yes, there are a whole lot of never served in the military and law enforcement who carry YOUR favorite brands....to me, that says poser....if you take it personally, oh well.

You first post states.“There are a number of excellent polycarbonate pistols, on the market and I would like to know what the forum feels is the best of the bunch...post away amigos”

You now state that what you wanted to ask was.”....which of the listed are your faves”

So in fact you don’t want to know which of the polycarbonate pistols on the market what the forum feels is the best of the bunch.
You just want to know which of your poll choices is the better of the bunch.
I’m fine with that. It just is not what you asked for originally.

Nor do you choices of poll pistols truly reflect what you are after, you state that.“The poll is a sampling of pistols that may be used by military and law enforcement, but also are not cost prohibitive for the average”
And you further state that “the sampling of 5 pistols represents the brands MOST used by Law enforcement and the Military....foreign and domestic”

I personally don’t know of any military or law enforcement agency that currently issues the Polycarbonate offerings of Springfield, Walther, Berretta, Kahr. But I do know of many that use the metal frames models from some of these maufactures.

But I do not clam to know what the entire world is issuing for duty weapons these days. However I do have eyes & can look around just like every one else here. What I see is that the several of the manufactures you listed as “MOST used by Law enforcement and the Military”Are in fact not using the polycarbonate models of their pistols.

I also find it humorous that you state that. “H&K and Sig represent a miniscule percentage insofar as use by the aforementioned agencies”

When in fact these two companies were recently issued one of the largest small arms contracts ever to supply weapons to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security.

there is nothing preconceived here...if anything, any other responses fall outside the parameters of the poll.

....in New York City, you would have noticed the Kahr's....so far, I fail to see an attack on anyone....my perspective here in Virginia is from a former LEO and military officer perspective, and the group that I meet with on a regular basis, who happen to be a mix bag of former and active duty LEO's, Navy SEALs, etc....with very few exceptions, Sig and H&K are not on their wish lists, nor what they use on our ranges from Virginia Beach to Blackwater...the SEALs have and some still do use Sigs and H&K's, but it is not the weapon of choice, as some would have you to believe. Yes, there are a whole lot of never served in the military and law enforcement who carry YOUR favorite brands....to me, that says poser....if you take it personally, oh well.

Interresting???

I find it humorous that dilitantes without hard evidence wish to parse words, engage in a pattern of immature fault finding, and generally get their panties in a wad over the fact that their fave poser toys were not included in the poll....I'm done here....have the response I needed, and have outed the boy warriors....next time, I'll post a poll with 200 choices, and I suspect there will be another group of 4-F(s) finding fault with the poll....lovely thing my America....even the most absurdly misinformed can voice a baseless point of view.

There are a number of excellent polycarbonate pistols on the market, and I would like to know what the forum feels is the best of the bunch...post away amigos

The response.

Originally Posted by hberttmank

The question asked what I thought was the best of the bunch for plastic, and for me it is the H&K USP series. As far as a sampling of pistols that may be used by law enforcement or military since when did the Walther, Springfield XD or Kahr outsell H&K or Sig?

The reply.

Originally Posted by Dustoff '68

....the poll suggests who outsells who. In fact, I didn't ask that question. If you do a carefull search, you will find the pistols in the poll in the hands of more of the mentioned agencies than H&K and Sig...cost being one reason. No mention that Sig or H&K are inferior pistols...what is signficant is that if in fact Sig and H&K outsell all the others, then I suspect these pistols (and I see it on the ranges all the time) are in the hands of a boat load of posers, wannabees, and those who simply don't wince at the prices these guys sell for.

I find it humorous that dilitantes without hard evidence wish to parse words, engage in a pattern of immature fault finding, and generally get their panties in a wad over the fact that their fave poser toys were not included in the poll....I'm done here....have the response I needed, and have outed the boy warriors....next time, I'll post a poll with 200 choices, and I suspect there will be another group of 4-F(s) finding fault with the poll....lovely thing my America....even the most absurdly misinformed can voice a baseless point of view.

I find this responce laughable........I belive it was you who initiated the name calling and so-called attacks..........

H&K and Sig represent a miniscule percentage insofar as use by the aforementioned agencies

I dont think so........perhaps not the largest %, but certainly not a 'miniscule' %.

I find it humorous that dilitantes without hard evidence wish to parse words, engage in a pattern of immature fault finding, and generally get their panties in a wad over the fact that their fave poser toys were not included in the poll....I'm done here....have the response I needed, and have outed the boy warriors....next time, I'll post a poll with 200 choices, and I suspect there will be another group of 4-F(s) finding fault with the poll....lovely thing my America....even the most absurdly misinformed can voice a baseless point of view.

You are ridiculous...
You have yet to state any reason as to why people that own HK's and Sig's are "posers." You talk about hanging out with SEALs like you are a frickin eight year old. Are they your "base?" If you are basing your pistol choice off of what your "SEAL" friend's say then that would make you the poser.
So what kind of pistol do you use? Please enlighten me...

Everyone here knows that I love the Walther P99. But, I will admit, that there are not many agencies that use them - None in the US that I know of. Some US agencies do carry the clone - the SW99, but not many.

Actually, customer service for HK has gotten a bad wrap. They may have been terrible in the past, but they are getting better. I dealt w/ them 1x earlier this year for a bad mag. Sig, on the other hand, seems to be going to hell w/ its customer service lately. I have no direct knowledge, but I have seen some ridiculous stories people have posted on other forums about how they were treated. Sig Pros are carried w/ some police agencies in the US.

Obciously, Glock has the biggest police % in the US. They offer their guns cheap, and have buy back programs for whatever guns an agency already has. A lot of agencies report issues w/ certain models, though. And, while I love my Glock 34, I prev had a Glock 26, and received crappy customer service from Glock. Not too happy w/ that.

Beretta - everyone knows they have the US military market... And, many agencies use them as well.

S&W - the new M&P is slowly gaining ground.

SPringfield XD - WHile officers can sometimes buy their own gun and carry it, I know of no departments in the US that SUPPLY the XD to their officers at the moment. There may be some, but I don't know them.

But, if the point of this thread is to talk about what agencies carry, HK would have more guns floating out there than the XDs - HK polymer guns have been sold for much longer. Also, tons more HKs floating around in police and military hands compared to Kahrs.

Originally Posted by Dustoff '68
I find it humorous that dilitantes without hard evidence wish to parse words, engage in a pattern of immature fault finding, and generally get their panties in a wad over the fact that their fave poser toys were not included in the poll....I'm done here....have the response I needed, and have outed the boy warriors....next time, I'll post a poll with 200 choices, and I suspect there will be another group of 4-F(s) finding fault with the poll....lovely thing my America....even the most absurdly misinformed can voice a baseless point of view.

Also, I take exception to this as well. I personally think if someone likes HK guns, that is their business. I must have missed the logic in the way this thread turned... How is someone who likes an HK a "poser."?!?! People spend tons of $ on 1911s. If someone wants to spend a little bit more and buy an HK, so what.

I take no issue with anyone preferring an H&K, Sig, or what friggin' ever...what I take exception to is how a couple of dilitantes took this thread in a new direction, and parsed my words, and read into every sentence something that was not their...like I said earlier....no point in dealing with amateurs.

You sir, are the one who started out with the derogatory comments.....

I simply stated my opinion in my first post on this thread. Just because you don't agree certainly makes niether of us wrong (there's more than one way to skin a cat my friend) the reason this thread has gone the direction it has is because its started has helped drag it that more that the other posters on it IMO.

Anyone who thinks that HK and Sig are not civilian friendly companies doen't make much sense.....they produce some of the most popular and reliable arms avalible.

As far as being cost prohibitive, thats doesn't make sense either. Both HK USPs and many Sig models can be had for under $700 new. Much less if you search the used market......