If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Site Rules for MTS

Welcome to MtG: The Source (MTS), the largest non-official discussion forum devoted to the Legacy format of Magic: the Gathering. Before posting on this site, take a few moments to read and understand this site's posting rules and guidelines.

Purpose of these Rules. It is the responsibility of all contributors to this site to provide a healthy and productive environment for the free exchange of ideas to share, advance and enjoy the Legacy format of Magic: the Gathering. To provide the foundation for such an environment, we ask that all forum contributors abide by the following forum rules. While these rules apply to you, they exist for everyone else.

While we encourage you to read all that follows; for the more attention deficient amongst us, weíll boil these rules down to two simple points:

1.0 Writing Skills

Presenting your thoughts clearly and coherently encourages others to take you seriously and to listen to what you have to say. The best way to do this is to use proper grammar, punctuation, capitalization, and sentence structure. Also, spell your words correctly. Note the "Go Advanced" posting panel has a spell-checker.

Also, donít post in ALL UPPERCASE letters; itís like shouting into someoneís eyeballs. And unless youíre the reincarnated spirit of the beloved 20th century poet e.e. cummings, donít post in all lower-case letters either.

We know that no one is perfect and we wonít hold anyone to unreasonable standards. Basically just take the time to post so that others will care what you have to say. A good gauge of this and something we encourage everyone to do is to preview your post before making it public. If something looks wrong or isnít making sense, edit your post so that it does.

After youíve submitted your post for the whole world to see, read your post a final time and edit accordingly. The more obsessive amongst us go so far as to write most of their longer posts in Notepad or Word before sharing it with the world. We donít expect you to be this fanatical, but we do expect you to make an effort to write quality posts that contribute to the conversation.

2.0 Courtesy (No Flaming)

Simply, be respectful of other forum users. If you can't control the urge, go somewhere else.

In the past, MTS has taken a beating in public opinion for condoning inflammatory, offensive and ugly forum behavior. To an extent, this was true and while it looked crude to outsiders, it was more or less acceptable when the site was small, and when many of the posters knew each other and didnít take the vulgarity and flaming personally.

As Legacy has grown after the September 1, 2004 Type 1/1.5 banned list split, so has the membership of this site. Accordingly, weíre taking inflammatory posts seriously these days and far less tolerant of flaming/insulting users of this site.

The short of it is this: be respectful and decent to others -- both publicly (forum posts) and privately (PMs). If you see someone acting like a raging douche bag to you or someone else, Report the Post to the site staff. (Itís that little red triangle in the bottom left-hand panel in every post.) Engaging trolls and responding to flame-bait will get you a warning, so just ignore them and report it to us.

If youíre looking to get banned from MTS, flaming others is the quickest way to get that job done.

Last, a Note about Private Messages. While the threshold for flames and insults are lower in the public areas of MTS, if you're using the forum software to deliver insults and harassing comments via Private Message (PM), that is not acceptable either. While we ask that you attempt to resolve the conflict through less formal means at first, if you continue to receive derogatory and insulting messages via PM, forward the message(s) to a mod/admin and we'll take care of it. Harassment of other users via PM may result in warnings, up to a site ban.

3.0 Lack of Content (No Spam)

Ever since Internet bulletin boards and Usenet newsgroups sprang up in the early 90sí, weíve all had to deal with worthless posts and ideas - honestly, far too many of them. At MTS, posting without meaningful and relevant content is the easiest way to get a thread locked. Before you post, ask yourself if anyone cares what you have to say on the topic. If no one will, keep your thoughts to yourself.

Other posts falling into this category:

Posting decklists without content. Those will be locked as soon as we see it. There's no hard and fast rule about how much content you need with a new deck, but it should be it should cover the basics (e.g. why the deck is worth playing, notable card choices, what relative advantages/disadvantages it has over decks with a similar strategy, etc.)

One-liners or even one-word posts. There's a fine line between wit and spam.

Hijacking threads with off-topic posts. Stay on topic and make your posts in the appropriate thread to keep the discussion on-track and relevant.

In general, strive to add worthwhile information and perspective to the discussion at hand.

Important Note: The Decks to Beat Forum (D2B) has the harshest of all posting quality standards on this site. When that forum was first created, we discussed if only Adepts and above should be able to post there. In the end we settled on a compromise that all users can post there, but that the posting standards in the D2B are higher than the rest of this site. This means, no one-liners, poorly written posts, or other superfluous junk. Treat it like a temple and leave the garbage outside (preferably, on another site).

4.0 Intellectual Honesty (Model Posting)

The guidelines in the sections above establish the minimum standards of conduct at MTS; basically: 1) have a functional grasp of the English language, 2) be decent to others on this site, and 3) don't post garbage. However, as MTS is primarily a discussion and debate forum, we hope that all contributors to this site demonstrate and promote intellectual honesty in the presentation of their ideas.

Below are some guidelines to keep discussions on this site intellectually honest.

Note that this section is framed as "model posting." If we seeing site users burning down straw men, not fully disclosing weaknesses in their arguments, not fully researching facts, etc. we're not going to issue warnings or do anything else punitive at a formal level. Rather, these are the guidelines we hope all posters can abide and embrace.

5.0 Prohibited Topics

Most of the following should go without saying, but for the record, hereís a list of other off-limit topics and content.

5.1: Racially offensive or chauvinistic ranting: 1) will not be tolerated and 2) makes you look like an ass.

5.2: Requesting decklists. The search feature on this site is better than you realize.

5.3: Thread redundancy. If youíre about to start a new thread on a deck, do a quick search to make sure that discussion isnít already happening somewhere else.

5.4: "Bumping" of threads. If you have no relevant content to add, donít bump a thread to the top of the forum to get the discussion rolling again. The only exception to this rule is bumping of tournament announcements, but donít go crazy with that.

5.5: Double-posting. Double posting is annoying and is just like bumping. If you wrote the previous post in a particular thread, just edit that thread and put in your new content. An exception to this is if a thread has been inactive for a few days (at least three) and you have something relevant and worthwhile to add to that thread (new testing results, changes to a decklist, etc.) Otherwise, just edit your posts with new content.

5.6: Discussion Threads on Premium Articles. Linking to premium articles hosted on other sites is acceptable, provided the article is related to Legacy and the author is willing to discuss their ideas on this site. Complaints about premium content are spam and will be moderated as such.(NEW)

5.7: Whining about the moderation on this site. Weíre not infallible and if something is bugging you about the way a moderator handled something, PM that moderator, but donít rant about it publicly. Which leads us to:

5.8: Backseat moderation. Donít ďwonder how long a thread will stay open.Ē If you see spam, just report it and let the staff deal with it.

5.9: Bold Red Text and regular old red text are reserved solely for MTS Moderators and Administrators. Donít use it.

5.10: Public personal messages. If youíre writing a post for one or two other people, youíre writing a personal message and no one else cares. Send a PM (Private Message) instead.

5.12: Sales threads. Exceptions can be made by a PM to the staff in advance, otherwise donít post sales or your open eBay auctions.

5.13: Assorted things that are annoying and will be deleted. This is is not an exhaustive list, but avoid the following: a) annoying signatures (length, images, etc.); b) offensive usernames, custom titles, and avatars; and c) blatant third-party advertising. The staff reserves the right to moderate this shit with extreme prejudice.

5.14: Discussion of politics or incendiary social issues. Discussing politics, religion, and the like invariably brings out the worst in people and leads to insults, then warnings and thread lockage. Exceptions can be made in some cases by clearing it with Mod/Admin first; otherwise, donít do it.

6.0 Forum-Specific Rules

Everything before this applies to every forum on the site (with the exception of Mish-Mash, which weíll get to in a moment) with additional rules applying to specific forums on this site.

6.1: "Decks to Beat" Forum

As mentioned above, the posting standard are higher in the LMF than anywhere else on the site. If your post is empty of relevant and thoughtful content, it may be deleted and you will get a warning. The point of that forum is to advance the best decks in the format and have a place to discuss those decks, not to populate that forum with junk.

Based on the feedback of the Legacy Adepts and Mods/Admins, all new Single Card Discussion (SCD) threads must follow some basic criteria.

Previous threads were a often mess since few of these threads provided a context for discussion, so they went downhill fast, if they went anywhere at all. These guidelines are intended to create a framework to discuss the card in the general, competitive Legacy format.

All opening posts of an SCD thread must address one or more of the following. Threads that don't will be locked when we see them.

What deck or archetype can this card be used in and why?

How does this card fulfill the role of another card in an existing archetype more effectively than the card it would replace?

How has the metagame changed or what new cards exist now to make this card playable?

Brownie Points:

If the SCD card is fairly obscure, include the card text to save us time in looking it up (minimally, casting cost, card type (Sorcery, Instant, Enchantment, etc.) and Oracle text)

Ideally, include a sample deck list (even if it's rough) that incorporates the card

Remember that The Source is focused on competitive/tournament Legacy. If the SCD thread is not producing ideas which are reasonably competitive for a general Legacy tournament, the thread may be moved to the Casual Forum, even if it follows these guidelines.

6.3: Tournament Forum

In the title of a Tournament Announcements thread you should include the following: Date, Format, and Location in the title. Also start that thread title with "[Announcement]."

In the body of the first post of a Tournament Announcement thread, please include the following summary:

The Card Interactions and Rulings forum is used to ask questions concerning the actual text on MtG cards, or how a specific combination of cards interact. Before posting a card rules question, please search the forum to see if your question was already answered.

6.5: Mish-Mash

In the way that the Legacy Metagame Forum has the highest posting quality standard on this site, weíre fine with Mish-Mash being the dregs of MTS. While moderation is more lax in Mish-Mash than elsewhere on the site, there are a few rules for that forum:

6.5.0 Ė Mods can, will or won't do whatever the hell they feel like in Mish-Mash. Cope. We work hard on the rest of the site; Mish-Mash is break time.

6.5.1 Ė Don't make us come into Mish-Mash.

6.5.2 Ė If you break Rule #1, make us laugh.

6.5.3 - Don't report posts in Mish-Mash. (Except if they are political or religious posts or threads that are about something obviously illegal and vile.) See again, Rule #1.

7.0 Warnings and Bannings

If we see you violating the Site Rules listed above, you're going to get a warning. If you receive three (3) full warnings, youíll be banned from the site. Itís as simple as that. While we usually don't enjoy banning users, if a few disruptive and problematic users lose their posting privileges to increase the value of this site for everyone else, we're cool with that. Warnings are partly punitive ("knock it off"); partly a tip to other posters on where the line for acceptable forum behavior lies.

The Mods/Admins will make it clear what youíre being warned for and it will usually be a violation of a rule found above, though there may be fringe cases that we havenít considered.

The Mods/Admins may issue verbal warnings for minor infractions of the rules, but repeated violations of that rule (awful grammar, for instance) will quickly turn into a full warning. If youíre egregiously violating a rule -- especially flaming -- weíll issue a full warning from the start. When the staff feels it necessary, we may ban users who have less than three warnings. It will be for cause and it will be for the good of all.

Going back to the opening post above, if you're decent to others and make positive contributions to the public discussions on MTS, you have nothing to worry about.

Appendix B. Frequently Asked Questions for New Users

This section by Nightmare

What is Legacy?
Legacy is one of the two Eternal formats, sometimes referred to as "Type 1.5." It was initially created as an attachment to Vintage (Type 1, the other Eternal format) which used both the Type 1 banned and restricted lists as its banned list. During this time, The Source was a small community of players, mostly in the Syracuse, NY and Northern Virginia areas, who were keen to develop it into a serious format.

In September 2004, the Duelists Convocation International (DCI) separated the Type 1 Banned list from Type 1.5 (which was eventually named "Legacy" after a community vote) after years of urging from the Type 1 community. After an initial upsurge of frustration from The Source, the community settled down and developed most of the tier 1 decks you see today. Since the splitting of the lists, there has been a small but significant push from Wizards and the DCI to make Legacy a competitive format on a larger level, most easily seen through the Legacy Grand Prix tournaments in the US and Europe that occur roughly once every year and a half. These events have been largely successful, and are expected to continue as long as attendance continues to be excellent.

Why should I play Legacy?
Legacy is one of only two formats which do not rotate. In Standard or Extended, you may play one deck today, and tomorrow the deck could be unviable or even unplayable. With Legacy, you donít have the same level of concern. Along with this, cards used in staple decks in Legacy hold their value much longer and better than those made popular in Standard or Extended. Since the format doesnít rotate, there is less chance of cards falling out of favor and their price to drop considerably. Players who have been in the game for a long time frequently look to Legacy as a place where their old cards are still playable, and donít need to keep up with as much of the new sets continually released.

Wizards has designed Legacy to be a format with a relatively low entry-cost. Barring Dual Lands and a few cards such as Force of Will, the cost of playing and maintaining a Legacy collection is much less than playing the Standard format or Limited. While there may be a higher startup cost, once you have the cards, you donít need to worry about constantly getting more. Its much more economical to wait for the good cards in a new set to present themselves and settle in price, than to buy boxes to get the Standard staples of the month. On the other side of this, it is also a much cheaper format to play than Vintage, even with the rise in popularity of ten proxy tournaments.

What is The Source?The Source is an online community of members who play, debate, theorize and enjoy the Legacy format. It has the most Legacy content of any major Magic: the Gathering site, and its members are some of the most prominent and proficient Legacy players out there. It is a site for the development and refinement of Legacy decks, as well as a community of people with common interests. It is a great place to post your deck and get critique from people who have a high level of knowledge and experience in the format, post tournament reports, announce upcoming tournaments in your area, discuss format development, DCI policy, etc.

Ok, I have a deck I want to post. Where should I post it?
Chances are, your deck is fairly undeveloped. For this reason, you should post it in the New and Developmental Forum. This area is for decks which have not been tuned, and a great place to get input on new deck ideas.

I put my deck there, and everyone said its bad. What the heck?Donít be discouraged. Take some time to test out the new ideas the other members have presented, and see how they may improve the deck. If you decide your way was better, you are encouraged to come back with results and show them why they were wrong. One thing to make sure you donít do, on the other hand, is to insist that your ideas are correct without any kind of testing or results to back them up. Even if an idea seems like it's great on paper, it doesn't always pan out that way in real life.

Okay, I want to test some of these ideas. Unfortunately (my area isnít big on Legacy/I donít know anyone to test with/Iíve outgrown my other testing partners/etc.). What can I do?
A. Fear not, the wonders of the internet have fixed the problem. Go to www.magicworkstation.com and follow their guide to download and install Workstation (MWS). Once you have it installed, get familiar with the gameplay on it, and when you feel you are ready, log on and test with people. Be wary, MWS has a wide range of players, whose skill and knowledge is just as varied. Messaging members on The Source and asking for testing help is a good way to go about it as well.

what hppns if I want 2 tpye liek this?
One thing that is not tolerated on The Source is poor typing and grammar. A few members are from countries outside the U.S., and English is not their primary language. This is accepted. However, typing like you are on Instant Messenger or being lazy with grammar and spelling is not acceptable. Please be aware of the forum rules above.

Some people on this site are real jerks. Did you know that?
Yes. Unfortunately, the Mod/Adept team canít sway the entire board to be the fine, respectable citizens that they themselves are. They do try. If you have any complaints about specific users or a specific post, feel free to Private Message an Admin/Moderator or "Report the Post" (that triangle-thing in the bottom of the left-hand panel of every post), and they will handle it. On your end of things, if you make a concentrated effort to post well thought-out, intelligent, relevant posts (aside from the Mish-Mash Forum, of course), it will go a long way toward receiving the kind of feedback you are looking for.

Why are some usernames in a different color than mine?The Source uses a color-coded system to differentiate between the various user groups of members on the site.Blue: These are the regular users of the site; they have regular posting priviliges in all open forums on the site, can start new threads, etc.Teal: These are the site contributors; Users that have contributed money to support the ongoing costs for running the site. Purple: These are the moderators of the site; other than some privileges that administrators have (e.g. to ban people, create new forums, etc.), moderators and administrators do the same basic thing: try to keep the site running and enforce the rules aboveRed: These are the administrators of the site (they can ban you -- they will if you're stinking up the site)