"So your brain tells you to go right in order not to hit that person or the oncoming traffic."<br><br>Do I have to listen to my brain all the time? <br><br>If so, then I have no free will. Because by your definition of the brain being just a processor that makes logical decisions on physical input (ie chemical and neurons) that's cause and effect. If event 'A' will always cause 'B' which in turn causes 'C' then by the physical nature of cause and effect everything that has happened to date, including the point where you made your last post and the little brain cells in your head were doing it's cause and effect thing, can be traced back to the first cause - which could either be the big bang or God creating the universe.<br><br>That first cause triggered an effect, with trigger another effect, and so on until we get to where we are today.<br><br>If we believe in minor randomness (ie. quantum physics) creates slightly different effects for the same causes then we still have no free will because outcomes can not be determine by oneself. Outcomes are only rolls of dice.<br><br>If I don't have to listen to my brain all time, then I have free will. But then who exactly am I? What part of the body can you point to that is not governed by physical laws of cause and effect. This part is the soul and that part that gives us free will.<br><br>Another point to ponder. If brains are just computers and we have no soul, then we can not have the concept of morality. Because brains are just responding to stimulus then how can we say a person is responsible for murder? The actions that caused the murder where simple cause and effect brain neurons making calculations that controlled the body to do the act. So how do you justify locking up a person that committed a crime they have no responsibility for? You can't, it would be like locking up the gun because it shot the bullet.<br><br><br><br><br><br>

Your brain has different parts in it, that's what makes it so unique. One side does not have to listen to the other although it usually does. <br><br>People commit suicide. When they decide to jump off a bridge and they are "sane" they have to override the part of the brain that tries to protect them and tells them to step back. They have to concentrate to cancell out the fear and take the jump although they feel it is not the right thing to do. <br><br>You can call that side of the brain that makes decisions a "soul" but it is just a physical piece, tangible. Here is a lil article out of thousands http://physorg.com/news4234.html<br><br>So when someone hits their head and gets brain injury, they can loose memory, they can loose the decision making process, they can loose movement, they can have random feelings..... so in they have brain injury, do they have soul injury?<br><br>Even when you don't listen to your brain, you are thinking with the other part of the brain. One part of the brain is just not listening to the other part, that's all. The brain is not a single processor, it is a group of independant processors.<br><br>As for morality, it is just a logical concept. We are meant to exist and harm= bad. If harm=bad than anything associated with harm=bad. Everything in our brain and body tries to push us to survival up to the last second of it. Therefore we try to exist which means that killing someone is bad. <br><br>Also, what you may think is right, someone else might think is wrong, so morality is basically a tought memory. We live by what we have learned since time of birth. What we have been tought right we think is right, what we have been thought is wrong we think is wrong. We make our judgements on memory. <br><br>Now if we go into quantum physics, well, they talk about multiple dimmensions within each other. Quantum physics say that there are unlimited possibilities. But then again, all they have proven is that there are multiple dimmensions and not that each dimmension is a different possibility. Just that time itself exists all in one and each dimmension could be a part within this time which is why time could be brought foward and reversed. But then, free will would not exist. Quantum physics are interesting, but theories tend to hit each other sometimes.<br><br>What we know up to now is that humans are physical "robots" living in a non-physical world made out of waves of energy. Something similar to a character that I would create in a game. I can give it physical characteristics and the character itself would think he is made out of mollecules, but me on this side of the computer, I would know that the character is just an electrical bit of information.<br><br>You should go rent the movie "What the bleep do we know" if you haven't seen it already. I am not saying I agree with everything they say in the movie because I did my reads on some of the cultist type characters, but it definitely has some great ideas in it.<br><br>_________________________________________<br>Just a different kinda geek...

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_________________________________________"The United States is by far the largest exporter of weapons in the world, selling more weapons than the next 14 countries combined."

Most of your posts goes on the complexity of the brain. But the fact doesn't change - it's still physical and controlled by the laws of cause and effect no matter how many parts there are to it. The end result is just the sum of all parts.<br><br><br>"So when someone hits their head and gets brain injury, they can loose memory, they can loose the decision making process, they can loose movement, they can have random feelings..... so in they have brain injury, do they have soul injury?"<br><br>Don't know, never had a brain injury <br><br>"Also, what you may think is right, someone else might think is wrong, so morality is basically a tought memory. We live by what we have learned since time of birth. What we have been tought right we think is right, what we have been thought is wrong we think is wrong. We make our judgements on memory."<br><br>So who did the teachers that taught us morality make their judgements on?<br><br>"What we know up to now is that humans are physical "robots" living in a non-physical world made out of waves of energy. Something similar to a character that I would create in a game. I can give it physical characteristics and the character itself would think he is made out of mollecules, but me on this side of the computer, I would know that the character is just an electrical bit of information."<br><br>Why do the people have to be physical while the world doesn't? <br><br>"You should go rent the movie "What the bleep do we know" if you haven't seen it already. I am not saying I agree with everything they say in the movie because I did my reads on some of the cultist type characters, but it definitely has some great ideas in it."<br><br>I get my great ideas from the great philosophers, just like the movie writers. So I'll pass on the invite.<br><br>

I don't totally agree or disagree.<br><br>I do believe we have a soul, as far as the God creations someone told me a good quote about religion.<br><br> Religion is the biggest obstacle to reaching God. <br>I wish some of these pseudo-Christains would realize that.<br><br>David (OFI)<br>

I do... I just shun religion if it's to restrictive or structured... <br><br>and no one can turn me off faster than to say theirs is the only way, or if I don't do "X" I'm going to H !!<br><br>That's mideavil BS !!<br><br>David (OFI)<br>

I think merely having the stem cell debate is doing a disservice. The two opposing views are not equal. But I digress and found this discussion using the search feature here. I searched for stem cells. Best response to Matt-----<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>But I think I know what you are getting at. Yes, I don't treat a lot of things that you post as the funny ha ha type post because you belittle serious issues with your narrow minded approach to such things as Iraq, war casualties, and on and on. My pointing out some things to you makes me a jackass. Your constant braying of "Bush did not ban stem cell research" is a case in point. <p><hr></blockquote><p>That person rocks! Read that discussion. He knows his stuff. <br><br>http://www.macminute.com/cgi-bin/wwwthreads/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=politics&Number=202743<br><br>

The belief of a soul. I love this one and always did. How can you tell a person that she/he is just a computer? I am here, I am writing this and therefore I exist and I believe that I have control, therefore I can not be a computer. Should be interesting to see how AI will change the views on the soul. Will computers have a soul? Gotta love the self awarness evoqued by evolution. The belief itself into a soul or "GOD" as THE supreme being shows the stage we are at in our own part of this evolution process. The interesting part is that evolution itself is a multi dimmension process while most people only see 1 dimmension of it.<br><br>_________________________________________<br>Just a different kinda geek...

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_________________________________________"The United States is by far the largest exporter of weapons in the world, selling more weapons than the next 14 countries combined."

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