Sun worship or Son worship?

Tradition credits Saint Boniface with the invention of the Christmas tree. The Oak of Thor at Geismar was chopped down by Boniface in a stage-managed
confrontation with the old gods and local heathen tribes. A fir tree growing in the roots of the Oak was claimed by Boniface as a new symbol. "This
humble tree's wood is used to build your homes: let Christ be at the centre of your households. Its leaves remain evergreen in the darkest days: let
Christ be your constant light. Its boughs reach out to embrace and its top points to heaven: let Christ be your Comfort and Guide."

Here we have the roman catholics christians get an idol too... like the 10 commandments never mentioned idols. Even worse, it's made of wood, just
like the commandments said we were not to do specifically.

Nice dude, I also like the hebrew screen name you use, sweet cane eh >? hehe

What you're talking about is very interesting, but I think it's more of an alikening rather than sun worship. Afterall, the bible mentions how the
bridgegroom comes out of his home and runs a circuit etc etc - It's basically all about the sun and how it moves through the constellations one by
one. Like you mentioned about the Age of Aquarius.

It's also interesting because the age of great outpouring is the Age of Aquarius, Jesus was a Pisces and he was in the year of Pisces. Aquarius is
seen as a man pouring water from an urn on his shoulder, the water flows down into the fish(pisces) mouth.

I agree with every thing you say!!!
But you might as well just give up telling the religous zealots!!! They are not going to listen, they'd rather beleive in "fairy tales".
Why do all you religous people think christianity(I'm not spelling a religion based on lies with a capitol letter) persecuted the Pagans in countries
like England in the dark ages??? Because the Pagans laughed at christians and bassicly said WTF are you worshipping, it's wrong. At the end of the
day theere are like 3-4 modern religions that think we were created by god an almighty powerful being. When the fact is it's BS...

There is much contention in the history of religions and such,things have been lost,obscured and changed,done to hide things or to initiate
control,have power and such things as these,much of this we are aware of,

Putting aside these histories and such,i would like to tell you a short story of why i am a Christian as this was not always so.

When i was born my Father was a practitioner of Voodoo,
My Mother was a witch, member of a coven,I have grown up all my life knowing the otherworld,
from the time i was 15 to the time i became a Christian i was
a drug addicted,death loving,occult practicing Satanist,

Then i met the living God.

He changed my life,healed me of my addictions instantly
turned my whole life around in the blink of an eye,i am not that which i once was,what i am is living proof of the power of God and his love.

No,i am not religious,hold no adherence to a particular church or its doctrine,
only the bible.
Am not weak and need to feel loved and accepted by a particular group or fit into a mold,
I am me and i am unique.

There is no true correlation between the man Yeshua who was born and walked the Earth and died (was murdered), who had abilities granted unto him
through God's holy spirit, and all of this old Pagan and Egyptian Underworld Religion Sun God "Ra" crap.

Straight up man, I challenge any of you to a debate on the existence of Yeshua, he lived.. and died. There are so many historical accounts from non
biblical references that you'd be quite surprised as I busted them out during the debate, my secret weapons of truth.

If the Son of God was the "Sun" of God, and not a man, and never existed, we sure do have a hella lot of liars out there! I mean damn, write an
ENTIRE BOOK through like .. 20+ different authors, all writing about the same man, his life, the events in it, and so forth. Corroborating each
other by describing the same events! Yeshua, Jesus, was a man, not a star 60 million miles away from the planet Earth.

The Sun had a name when it was worshipped as a God in Egypt, which was Ra, Ra the Sun God. Some say Moses was in a cult of Ra during his early life as
Pharaoh's step son. Sun worship has some similarities to Monotheism, I mean, they worship one Sun, but its merely an object of creation, God created
that Sun, for us to live, and his creations on Earth. It does not have a conscious, it cannot think or communicate. It is not alive like we are; it
has no flesh and no blood. Surely this is no God of mine, but merely an idol.

Yeshua was born, lived, and was killed before he was 35. It's all documented, disbelieve if you'd like, but you will not convince anyone except the
weak minded and the skeptics that he never even existed to begin with, and that all of the texts and historical accounts are bold faced lies. That is
retarded, even I do not say Muhammad "made up" the Koran. Sure, I may question whether Gabriel truly visited him with it, but do I sit there and
say, "the Koran is all lies, and Muhammad made all that crap up". No!! It is utterly disrespectful, and besides, I don't know that to be truth, and
to say it outloud would stir up trouble with Muslims. So in essence, these threads have the same purpose alone: to stir up trouble with ATS Resident
Christians.

Please get over the Zeitgeist, its loose change like Loose Change was, and these kids care more about internet-fame with making these far fetched
videos than any true sense of trying to find the ultimate truth of reality. Charlatans ..

Originally posted by tacocheesey
If Jesus is a creation or incarnation of God, then in fact, isn't Christianity worshiping the creation and not the creator? He only incarnated once.
Once is not never, though. I seriously cannot understand this. I worship the Creator, I just don't know who or what that is.

For one, Jesus' birth in His human form was not believed to be His creation. He is described as being eternal and infinite. Only His human form was
finite. Many scriptures mention this, Jesus Himself stated this, and there are even Old Testament allusions to this.

Just face it, Ashley. You worship a burning ball of helium & hydrogen.

It is NO coincidence that this is the age of pisces and Jesus is depicted by the fish. It is NO coincidence that Sun remains at the lowest point of
the sky for 3 days between December 22nd-25th, only to "rise again." It is of no coincidence that Mithra was crucifed, and is depicted slaying the
Bull because Mithra was worshipped during the age of Taurus. Then Moses came around and was angered to find his people worshipping a golden bull
statue. Thus began the age of Aries, depicted by the ram. Ever wonder why Jews blow into a rams horn on Roshashana? Yeah. Think about it. After the
age of Aries and the old Testament came the age of Pisces and the new Testament, depicted by the two fish. How many fish did Jesus use to feed the
hungry mob? Yeah. Think about it. In 2012, we enter the age of Aquarius, the water bearer. In fact, the Bible states something to the effect of "at
the end of this age a man with water will greet you. Follow him into his home." The different signs of the Zodiac are called "houses." Hence,
follow him into his home.

All of it, in the end, revolves around the Sun. Quite literally. 12 signs of the Zodiac, plus the Sun. Jesus and his 12 disciples. Mithra and his 12
followers. Hercules and his 12 workers. And so on and so on.

Also note that each sun-God always had a headpiece of some sort that represented the sun's coronoa's. In Jesus' case, it was the crown of thorns.

Originally posted by ModernDystopia
It is NO coincidence that Sun remains at the lowest point of the sky for 3 days between December 22nd-25th, only to "rise again."

Again, December 25th was not a part of original Christianity. That date was chosen centuries later under Constantine. But let's assume for
argument's sake just this once that it was. Again, His death and crucifixion happened in the springtime, not in December where the sun
would be at its "lowest point" and "rising again after three days."

It is of no coincidence that Mithra was crucifed

Such a thing was never believed by Mithras followers. Mithras was believed by his followers to be born out of solid rock as a full grown adult before
humans were even created. He was also never believed by his cult to have died (nevertheless by crucifixion).

and is depicted slaying the Bull because Mithra was worshipped during the age of Taurus. Then Moses came around and was angered to find his
people worshipping a golden bull statue.

Two problems. Mithras (the diety claimed to be an inspiration of Christ) originated in first century A.D. and maybe even the century before. Way after
Moses. The Mithra of Persia has nothing to do with slaughtering a bull.

In 2012, we enter the age of Aquarius, the water bearer.

I thought that was supposed to begin in the 2060's?

In fact, the Bible states something to the effect of "at the end of this age a man with water will greet you. Follow him into his home." The
different signs of the Zodiac are called "houses." Hence, follow him into his home.

It does not. This has already been answered twice on this thread. It had nothing to do with the end of this age or the end times. Myself and another
poster already refuted this.

12 signs of the Zodiac, plus the Sun. Jesus and his 12 disciples. Mithra and his 12 followers. Hercules and his 12 workers. And so on and so
on.

Mithra's "12 followers" were nothing more than the signs of the Zodiac. It was the same with Horus. Jesus technically had 13 apostles if you count
in the addition of Barnabas to replace Judas. But the clincher is, many of the apostles' writings still exist to our time and their authorship is
verified by early eye witnesses. Many propagators of the Christ Myth use the argument that Jesus did not exist because He never wrote anything down.
Well, the apostles did so using that logic we can assume they are real people.

The only thing you can do is claim the writings were falsely attributed to them after the fact but that argument would be based on presupposition and
bias and not recorded history. Like I said above, I also buy my eggs by the dozen. Do they represent the zodiac, too? All I see is a "12 and a 12."
Or a thirteen if you want to get technical and then Christ Mythers can claim the hidden sign of the zodiac must represent Barnabas. Ugh.

Also note that each sun-God always had a headpiece of some sort that represented the sun's coronoa's. In Jesus' case, it was the crown of
thorns.

That is quite a stretch. We are told it was to mock Jesus as the "Jewish King." Nothing to do with the sun.

Jesus technically had 13 disiples and technically there are 13 zodiac house, did you know that too? the 13th is the sign reisdes in the dark
rift, or center of the galaxy.

Zeitgiest was put together AFTER Pharmacratic 2007 I believe, and has SOME of the same scenes,... so no I am not repeating just that movie but many
many different facts that they shoved into that movie and many others,.... but yes I see (now that I watch zeitgiest) why some think I "just"
watched it and am excited with my new found ideas? wrong... just finally wanted some public opinion. It has become clear who is blinded and who is
truly searching

They say we are blinded, we say they are,... aren't we all be blinded by lies?

Oh my belief, this twisted view of GOD was done to us intentionally by the powers that be, just like 9-11 was intentionally done by the powers to
be...

Fear of hell, fear of terror, always control through fear...

Get saved to avoid hell, Pay taxes to avoid hell, don't research or think to find truth because it would cause hell to your beliefs, we'll tell you
what's truth, Fairy Tails are always better than reality.

Oh side note, Zeitgiest keeps getting mentioned... I am not a Alex Jones fan, I agree with some of his political views, but I believe he is being used
like many christians are.

sorry for the double post.

Thanks to those that help me explain the info we have been exposed to, and thank you Christians for regurgitating all the info I had heard for 38
years, going to private school for 12 years, church every sunday for years, I almost forgot all that "stuff" and when I mean "stuff" I mean door
knobs.

Originally posted by KanehBosmJesus technically had 13 disiples and technically there are 13 zodiac house, did you know that too? the 13th is the sign reisdes in the dark
rift, or center of the galaxy.

Yes, which is why I said in my above comment:

"Or a thirteen if you want to get technical and then Christ Mythers can claim the hidden sign of the zodiac must represent Barnabas. Ugh." We can't
win. Christ Mythers will find correlations at all costs even if there were never 13 apostles at one time. Like you mentioned in the original post when
you compared Jesus walking on the water with the sun "walking" on the water at sunrise and sunset. How do you refute such vagueness? You can't.

I offered an analogy in THIS comment on ATS to show just how easy it is
show a correlation between anything, as silly as the coincidences may seem, and to point out the level of scholarship of such examples.

First off, i would like to take this time to humble myself and say I really do know nothing. From what i have read here i really do like most of
ashley's arguments. Ash seems eager to provide sources so that the babblings have a foundation. I also have not heard the "because god said so"
argument. I am just saying that if this was a debate AshleyD would be winning. Though i will say the only reason i kept reading this post is because
there is a pretty even volley of ideas bouncing around.
ModernDystopia, you are dangerously confident in your findings. It may or may not be a coincidence. If it was proven fact nobody would be
debating anything. Though you have very good points in your post the linksite was a little sketchy.
To me, it sounds possible that a few different cultures could have viewed the stars and looked upon them with adoration. then these cultures
could have personofied the stars to make the astronomy of that day more interesting.(i live in Michigan and there is a story for the "Sleeping Bear
Dunes" when really its just a natural land formation) Or there is a supreme being and he sent his only begotten son to die for our sins.

Or Apollo is pretty upset because he gets up very early in the morning and hauls the sun all the way across the sky and then he has to see all of
these people not giving credit where credit is due.

I will add that humans are fallable, we write based on research and then people use our writings for their research and so on. All of these well
researched writings just seem like compounded opinions.

No one can prove the existence or inexistence of a God ,Jesus or where they came from if we all knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that there was a man
in the sky telling us how to live our lives and if we do what he says we can come live in the sky with him than i imagine people wouldnt like him very
much. they would probably post about how god is an elitist. so leaving the gaps in the religious texts is what makes them so good.

If you read this, I thank you.

I am sorry for any dead horses i beat if things have been posted during the 45 minute time period it tooke me to write this. lol(At Work)

Also I did not intend to offend as all of you seem very well educated and would utterly smoke me in a debate. Thanks again.

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