**** that. Toby > Ingram forever. Gerhart was better that year, but Ingram was on a higher profile team. I think east coast bias is eh, but I believe it actually happened. Toby dominated games and the pace of play. 4 yard runs in the 1st quarter ground into 12 yard runs in the 4th. I wish more of Gerhart and Luck overlapped. I'm fully Ger-hard right now.

Coming up 2nd 3 years in a row sucked man. Cam clearly deserved his, but I would argue for Luck and Gerhart in the others.

Yeah, dude, I'm spamming because I think Stephon Tuitt is the better ND defensive player and that Jarvis Jones is a better linebacker. I'm not sure how I don't think a linebacker with two tackles for loss isn't the best in the country. So sorry about that.

Yeah, dude, I'm spamming because I think Stephon Tuitt is the better ND defensive player and that Jarvis Jones is a better linebacker. I'm not sure how I don't think a linebacker with two tackles for loss isn't the best in the country. So sorry about that.

Agreed. For a LB to win the Heisman he'd have to be 5x better than the next LB in college. There are plenty of guys on the same level as him and better.

Yeah, but Clowney doesn't play for the undefeated media darling, either.

Defensive players who have been more dominant than Manti Te'o off the top of my head in no order: Jadeveon Clowney, Stephon Tuitt, Jarvis Jones, Jordan Poyer, Will Sutton, Dee Milliner, Kawann Short. Again, that's off the top of my head.

Yeah, dude, I'm spamming because I think Stephon Tuitt is the better ND defensive player and that Jarvis Jones is a better linebacker. I'm not sure how I don't think a linebacker with two tackles for loss isn't the best in the country. So sorry about that.

So with Klein's 7 TD performance over Geno Smith(who had 2 INTs on the day), does Klein become the new frontrunner?

Well it's obvious at this point Geno is just another system QB, so he has no business being in the discussion at all. If these were games that were lost like 49-45 or 55-42. it would be one thing, but each time he's played a real defense he's been embarrassed. Now I really wish WV had cancelled the game earlier this season.

I don't think Smith is a just a 'system' QB, he happens to play in an offensive system at WVU that's been figured out. It was like TT and K-State knew all the routes being run by WVU WRs and never bit on the option runs.
BTW
K-State is a really good football team, possibly one of the top 4 teams in the BCS.

That said, the Heisman IMO is Klein's to lose. If K-State finishes the regular season undefeated I think he wins it in a walk.

I don't think Smith is a just a 'system' QB, he happens to play in an offensive system at WVU that's been figured out. It was like TT and K-State knew all the routes being run by WVU WRs and never bit on the option runs.
BTW
K-State is a really good football team, possibly one of the top 4 teams in the BCS.

That said, the Heisman IMO is Klein's to lose. If K-State finishes the regular season undefeated I think he wins it in a walk.

TT and KSU kept everything in front of them and tackled WVU receivers once they got they ball. Other teams did not have the talent or the coaching to have their defenders tackle in space. ESPN CFB Final put a stat up that Smith in the last two losses is 2-23 on passes of 15 yds +. WVU has a few challenges left and could potentially lose the next 4 games.

I think Smith is very much a system QB - when things were going good within the system and things were going WVU's way it was easy to heap praise upon Smith yet he has not seemed to handle the adversity particularly well - throwing chairs and not keeping his composure on the sideline. Just think Cam Netwon's non-composure on the sidelines this season - it will have an effect on the draft process. The victory at Texas is becoming less impressive as the weeks go on seeing that their defense is absolute garbage - Smith has not got it done against good defenses.

It was great to see a very well coached and well balanced team on both sides of the ball completely dominate one of the hyped up offenses of college football.

That said Klein leapfrogged Smith as the Heisman frontrunner and did it in remarkable fashion in a head to head matchup.

Klein has 24 total touchdowns and quarterbacks the nation's #4 team. I don't think there's a player in the nation more important to an undefeated/1-loss team (because that has become a requirement barring some unreal stats)

Klein has 24 total touchdowns and quarterbacks the nation's #4 team. I don't think there's a player in the nation more important to an undefeated/1-loss team (because that has become a requirement barring some unreal stats)

It is hard to argue against Klein but a case could be made for Braxton Miller using that criteria.

I'm playing devil's advocate here as I have a strong rooting interest in Klein to win it, but why not McCarron? He's got 0 interceptions and is the best offensive player on the best team in the country.