First shots fired on post-Covid Scottish football

After the phony war, the first shots were fired on restructuring Scottish football post-Covid with the news that the SPFL have considered curtailing not starting Leagues One and Two until January. With one or two under-performing exceptions (Falkirk, Partick), clubs in the bottom two leagues are community clubs in the truest sense.

They exist to serve their local towns, provide physical and intellectual resources local youth clubs can use and aspire towards, allow a large the local employer put their brand on a hoarding and give grandparents somewhere to take the new generation without having to travel. They do not harbour ambitions of promotion to the Premiership, reaching that height would only skew cash flow and risk the entire venture.

These clubs are probably the most secure in British football right now. They don’t care if their players go out of contract, the vast majority of them will in June anyway. Wages are mostly below furlough levels, so they have been able to cut costs down to basic insurance and maintenance.

They could survive for a decade like this, if SPFL payments continue to trickle down, as I assume they will, they could even come out of the crisis cash positive. Opening for business behind closed doors, without pay-at-the-gate customers, reintroduces the bulk of their costs without corresponding income. It is not tenable.

The old Steinage, ‘Football is nothing without fans’ is being tested right now. Having stood at the side of fields in Wishaw, Cumbernauld, Brechin and Milton, I know it is not true; football matters to someone, whenever and wherever it is played. The more interesting questions, is can we have football clubs without fans or games?

It happened during the great 20th Century crisis. Not all survived the war, some may perish this time. The SPFL needed to overcome their recent divisions to move onto this conversation. Furlough will end before it is safe for fans to return to the game, the bottom two leagues should be parked until at least January.

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You know ….you buy something that is clearly essential to your future well-being and happiness ….and then …and then….well ten years go by and suddenly as lockdown drives you to do things like hoovering or cleaning out your drawers (the kitchen ones), you come across that key to the future that was then summarily discarded and consigned to its own decade of self-isolation.

I was going to post earlier, after reading some of the replies to BRTH, that it seems we live in times where many people are happy to be misled and lied to because of an “I’m alright Jack” attitude.

I stopped buying official Celtic merchandise some time ago because of the way Resolution 12 was being dealt with by the Board and it will remain that way until something changes. We like to laugh at the huns being gullibillies but when you are financially backing a crooked game I would suggest that the term gullibilly might also apply to those of a Tim persuasion.

…is it not the case that Rangers have a clause that indemnifies them against any of the ‘acts’ carried out by Craig Whyte? Would that be the reason why the SFA cannot adjudicate on the issue? If correct this would be limited to acts carried out before 2012 or in other words by the old club. It would be surprising and shocking if this applies to the current club as it stands. Surely if they did something illegal in an application this year, the 5 way couldn’t be used as a shield?

Well some very good points…

Firstly, my understanding is that the 5wa only idemnifies Rangers during the tenure of Craig Whyte. As the licence application irregularities had nothing to do with Mr Whyte then why is it even an issue?

Well, the SFA didn’t look at the UEFA licence application, it looked at the monitoring period which came after the licence was granted, so the whole thing wss a herring rouge from the start.

Secondly it was newco that appealed against the SFA JPDT jurisdiction in the matter – succesfully so. That organisation didn’t even exist when the licence application breach took place.

If newco Rangers can say don’t come after us to pay the debts of Rangers it has nothing to do with us

If newco Rangers can say the tax debts amassed paying footballers at Ibrox has nothing to do with them as that was Rangers

If newco Rangers can say to folk that want to sue Rangers for damages, go see the liquidators.

Then how can newco Rangers can make representation to an SFA JPDT on behalf of Rangers?

Yet newco Rangers can’t use the 5wa as a defence for their application for a current UEFA licence, but you know what? Even though they do not meet the UEFA criteria I bet they still get a licence next season…

Your points are very well made. Whatever way fholk want to spin this, the fact remains that Celtic asked for the original Res12 to be postponed inreturn for dialogue.

A dialogue you and the other ghuys were entitled to believe Celtic would approach with good faith.

Not only did they not do that but they strung this lie along for years, oblivious to the time, money and intellectual commitment expended by Celtic supporters and shareholders…

A shameful act – Callousness is the nicest way you can call their behaviour.

Totally reprehesible would be my view

It may seem odd but I’d like to congratulate you, what you exposed to the sunlight was an nasty underbelly that fholk would prefer to ignore. I likened you to Atticus Finch some time ago, in terms of the fact that you were never going to win – your success would be messured in the time the “jury” was out… well ypu had them pondering long and hard

I dont follow your last paragraph, do you think Celtic plc FC have been lied too but have just accepted that?

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Not accepted just had to make the best of it. My point is that had SFA been doing their job since 2000 Scottish football never mind Celtic would not have had to handle the commercial and emotional wreckage.

The Scottish Mainstream media involving press, radio and TV have always been in the main pro-rangers and anti-Celtic. Whether they are all Freemasons or not then the vast majority of individuals ensure this policy continues by appointing like minded successors .

Dr Joseph Venglos commented that he had never come across this bias in any european country where the local press were hostile to one of the big clubs.. He was astonished ay the poor effect on the business.

Referees

Referees and officials are also in a similar situation as media where they are also biased towards one team and adopt a self perpetuating model when they recruit young officials from they community in their own image. The Lanarkshire Referees Association are a good example of this where the young refs are anonymously marked by older refs who ensure the “right minded” youngsters get the best remarks. See Andrew Dallas. This has ensured that the quality of Scottish officials is always poor as Celtic minded boys get weeded out. The poor performances in UEFA matches bear this out.

Governing Bodies

SFA and SPFL have continually been run in favour of one Club. With rules been ignored and bent to suit the Ibrox club. The wiff of Freemasonary again shows its head and the punishments are directed to one club. Celtic being fined £100k for poaching Tommy Burns when every season this goes on with every single club guilty. Chris Sutton fined for Lying down to Rangers comments, again a common occurrence. Only Celtic have been asked to take a flag down. Neil Lennon punishments in his first spell were much worse that anyone else

Effects

Celtic supporters reactions to these biased bodies are remarkable that these factors have strengthened the support and driven the Club to its current dominate level, I suggest that the strength of the support would less were we not under the bias of the establishment. The Irish in our support have a long history of rebellion against the establishment and the fact we triumph when all this are against us, makes it all the sweeter. The fact that we are better in all areas when the obstacles are higher makes the triunphs all the better.

Damage has been done which will never be undone . Across the Celtic support, that damage is felt on a scale from intensely to barely at all . I would completely agree that ,as far as our custodians are concerned , confession would not only be good for the soul of the club ,but morally essential . We deserve honest answers and without them the club , this supposed family , has an open wound.

The basic ingredient of Shakesperian Tragedies is that the principal character has the potential to be great but has a charater flaw which prevents his achieving that greatness. As regards Res 12, Celtic FC feels like a Shakesperian Tragedy.

Firstly, my understanding is that the 5wa only idemnifies Rangers during the tenure of Craig Whyte. As the licence application irregularities had nothing to do with Mr Whyte then why is it even an issue?

Well, the SFA didn’t look at the UEFA licence application, it looked at the monitoring period which came after the licence was granted, so the whole thing wss a herring rouge from the start.

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Craig Whyte was tied up in the emails between Rangers and Stewart Regan. That was in 2011 and shortly after his takeover. Makes me wonder if the SFA carefully selected the monitoring period knowing that Whyte was tied up in that and it could not go any further. David Murray was in charge at the time of submission which i think had to be in by March 31st 2011. During the Craig Where trial it was confirmed that there were serious issues around the submission but for some reason it was omitted from the charges.

Or it may be that Rangers were given a complete indemnity, providing all football debts outstanding at the time of signing the 5 way were settled. But if that was the case, why bring charges at all.

PETEC, still here thanks, I’ve taken advantage of the social distancing to paint all the woodwork in the house. About 30 year ago I took a week’s vacation and decorated the house, 2 story, top to bottom painting and wallpapering. A year later I decided to paint the outside, all it cost me was a ladder and the paint/brushes etc, spent the whole week outside listening to the shortwave.

I’m a lot older and it’s now taken 2 weeks apart from walking the dug twice a day, the baseboards are brutal. Woke up this morning thinking “this is the day, this is the day, this is the day the paintings finished”. Garden tomorrow though.

I’ve been a bit disappointed that the festivities for our honest and truthful NIAR have been tempered by the scottish freemason association statement, also the negativity toward our club and its employees.

This site is quite temperate compared to others who want our CEO and major individual shareholder hung drawn and quartered Braveheart style, one had the audacity tae question why we have an Irishman run our club, now that’s obviously a hunterloper, but they not all are.

I was going to pen something until I read BRTH’s wonderful prose this morning; also some of the responses have been brand new.

As we all know Res 12 is about the sfa and their efforts to accommodate deidco, as I have said on here umpteen times the tenants of Park Garden’s at the time have despised us since the Scottish Football League was inaugurated on 30 April 1890 with Celtic founder member and future president John Glass, the Peter Lawwell of his day, being head hunted by all the clubs, including a non sectarian at the time deidco, to spear head this new organisation.

However, since the sfa sat on the International Football Association Board, founded in 1886, it retained responsibility for the laws of the game, as such they were allowed to continue to oversee the development of the game in the country and the administration of disciplinary matters, and although they are not involved in the day-to-day operation of the SPFL or other League competitions, they do appoint referees to officiate the games in these leagues, as well as dealing with player registrations and disciplinary issues, HUGE MISTAKE.

This is where we are today, although it should be noted the huns did not cheat us it was the tenants’ of hunden, they are the real enemy, the residents of 150 Edmiston Dr, Glasgow G51 2XD are only a vehicle for this animosity, it could have been any of a number of clubs at the time but the choice of them plus the pledge and the acquisition and amalgamation of 3 shipyards on the Clyde, with their sectarian policy, became the perfect storm.

We have no representation there anymore and that’s our choice, especially when we requested a meeting to discuss the disgraceful game of last December 29 2018 and were told to eff off, that’s what we are facing, we are truly “Ourselves Alone”.

There have been nine chief executives since 1882 and the only one who showed a wee bit of fairness toward us was the late David Taylor who after his tenure was over was appointed General Secretary of UEFA, a role that sleekit face Ogilvie coveted.

A Loon fan growing up as his da was a director he followed the Hibbees while attending Uni through in Edinburgh and then the Maryhill Magyars when he moved tae Glasgow.

He has been quoted in saying that the worse aspect of his job with UEFA was constantly apologizing for deidco/sevco.

Right now we have another fake Hibbee, trying tae emulate swan, going after us aided and abetted by a CEO with no noted academic credentials other than the alleged 3rd knuckle rub and his 5 year spell as a player with the spiders, who like the sfa have never liked us since we stole their thunder, didnae stop them taking a gift from us which they used tae put a roof over the hun end, another GIRUY ya bunch of tottie pickers.

I realize that our board were reluctant to take on the ruling bodies at SPFL, SFA and UEFA, but apart from their delay and obfuscation did they ever flagrantly lie to the petitioners?

We’re they taking a business perspective that the possible risks in losing would outweigh any advantages of winning?

*That’s the way I saw it, I have no doubt a cost benefit analysis took plane, they would have been remiss had they didn’t, and determined it would financially benefit not just us but the game itself to keep them on board, although still a few rungs down the ladder.

I realize that our board were reluctant to take on the ruling bodies at SPFL, SFA and UEFA, but apart from their delay and obfuscation did they ever flagrantly lie to the petitioners?

We’re they taking a business perspective that the possible risks in losing would outweigh any advantages of winning?

That’s the way I saw it, I have no doubt a cost benefit analysis took plane, they would have been remiss had they didn’t, and determined it would financially benefit not just us but the game itself to keep them on board, although still a few rungs down the ladder.

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I could make a cost benefit analysis do what I wanted. Sent one to Dermott Desmond re a Membership scheme and presto I get invited in to discuss.

My point is I totally understand the business imperative but how do you quantify honesty on a spreadsheet?

How much is the loss of it and integrity worth?

How long a period does it feature over?

With regards to lying. It was done at the AGM when a shareholder asked if PL had seen the 5 Way Agreement. He said no but that could only be true if he did not open the e mail attachment but in that case under the terms of the e mail, no reply by next day was acceptance of the 5 Way contents.

if he did read the 5 Way (and lets stop kidding ourselves he might have had it but never read it) he would have known of the CAS clause in it that put Res12 in a cul de sac, yet INSISTED after 2013 AGM that requisitioners handled the matter via the SFA and its processes on a matter where only UEFA could be the final authoritative judge.

(On that btw I think UEFA might have been complicit in covering up the illegitimacy of the licence award in Sept 2011. They were either told porkies in a conversation with the SFA in which case they are in the clear or told the truth but as Rangers had lost out to Malmo and Maribor by then, took the line of least resistance – see the good news imparted at https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6uWzxhblAt9cGJVMlBFZTViWUE/view )

So did PL lie to requistioners? If you take into consideration Res12 was about leverage for SFA reform and none of the information provided was used and acted upon after the Craig Whyte trial to that end then if its not a lie, it sure as hell feels like one.

Make no mistake I want them reduced to an asterisk in history. I will break my diet and over indulge in jelly and ice cream when they sink into permanent oblivion.

I just wonder if Celtic’s hands were tied as they are subject to SFA and SPFL criteria.

I asked a question on here a few weeks ago, wondering if PL and the board came out and confessed they had made an error in judgement in their treatment of Res12, would we the support acknowledge their statement and drop any remaining resentment against the board?

Would that statement enable us to give the board credit for 9 and backing for 10?

I think the time for that has passed as we have now secured 9 and SFA have managed to tarnish the award.

I would welcome a press release from Peter that acknowledged the good faith work of the resolutioners, regretted that the board didn’t pursue it with more determination and would have liked to see better governance and transparency from SFA.

I think that kind of action would help us to concentrate all our efforts on securing the record 10th title.

“I remember posters on this site telling us what a great guy Lord Nimmo Smith was.

Hmmmmm.”

Wow!- I missed that- who were the guys that thought LNS was a great guy?

IT was MACJAY. He has not been on recently as he is helping to find the £80 million missing from the queen’s treasure.That will be what is missing from her rape and pillage and slavery horde……………………………………………….

Good morning, friends and a Big Happy Friday from a breezy, grey and foreboding looking East Kilbride. Nearly the weekend and looking forward to (ahem) properly celebrating 9 in a row in the traditional manner ;-)

The bidding closes tonight at 8:30pm and the winner will be notified shortly afterwards and arrangements will be made for the winner to collect the framed top. We can also arrange for the top to be couriered to the winner, but delivery costs would need to be added.

We will of course, keep everyone informed of the highest bid as we progress during the auction.

Please note, that If you wish your bid to remain anonymous please state this when your bid

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