IVhorseman wrote:Because of this, I think using CP to tweak things is a dangerous path. Having both UI and CP means having two economies, and I'm pretty sure that the spirit of the rules pretty clearly states "fuck that shit."

I think players are smart enough to know that when one team has explosive rounds in all their pistols, the other team should have some kind of vague advantage that at least feels like it's about the same power level. Instead of CP, something a lot looser like "well these 4 units have 2 upgrades each, so you get 8 upgrades for your team" covers it just fine.

That's actually pretty close to the plan. The new CP aren't going to be like the current CP; they're Customization rather than Construction Points, and a lot less granular. I might just end up calling them Customizations or Mods or something and lose the whole "points" thing completely. Or even Upgrades, although it's a bad idea to start both budgets with the same letter.

So "budgeting" will be something like "I have thirty inches' worth of units with five upgrades" rather than "I have a 216.5 CP army."

Natalya wrote:What's that? I can't hear you over the sound of how banned you are.

What about downgrading?What if I want a size 2 vehicle that goes slower then 10"? Do I get a handful of Customization Points change to spend on other stuff or what?

What if I want a Howitzer gun that I can hook behind my jeep to move around the battlefield.It's not a vehicle because it doesn't move unless pulled/pushed. It's not a building. It's not part of the Jeep because it's detachable and it doesn't logically draw it's power from it.Is it just free?

Just throwing stuff around here to check the flexibility of the system.

I can really get behind the idea of Inches Plus Mods, but only if there are a healthy number of mods to choose from. Functionally, I should think they'll be the equivalent of current CP options, just all fleshed out and prepackaged for players. That frontloads a lot of the work onto you, Mike, as the designer but it would create a much smoother play experience. Most of the time, when I use CP to customize now, I spend it on SN dice and on expanding Minifig capabilities (faster movement, better armor, greater skill, multiple actions). You could do some of those as packages/mods/customizations/whatever. So, for example, the tough guy mod might increase a minifig's armor by a few points or a die. A sprinter mod might boost a minifig's movement by a few inches. If you wanted to, you could go the RPG Powers route...like feats in D&D, where the powers specifically break the rules. Like an Agile mod that allows minifigs to change directions during a charge or a Two Inch Punch mod that allows minifigs to build up a MOM with only 2 inches of movement instead of 4 or a Martial Artist mod that would allow a minifig to use his bare hands as hand weapons for all close combat purposes. You could easily sink into a mire with this, though, so I'd pick the ones best themed and keep the total number of available mods to a relatively small number.

I just had some ideas. How about creating your own special abilities? This goes well for both regular construction and for customization points.

Each aspect would cost a certain amount of points, like:Damage: +1 for d4, +2 for d6, etc, then +1 for each additional die of any kindDie size increase: +1 per size (per die?)Supernatural dice: as what Stubby saidRange: +1 per inch past 2Area of effect: as above, with 2cp base costPassive abilities: +2 cp

For ex:

An area of effect explosion power at 3" would cost 11 cp2 for AOE, 1 for the extra inch, and 8 for 2d10 (4 cp each)

Or karate skills might be 3 cp. 2 for the hand to hand d6 damage, and a d8 supernatural for acrobatics.

Also, for notation, what about writing it as unit inches.customization points? So a karate master would be 1.3 u", of karate were as above. They would be counted separately, but for ease of labeling, they could be combined as one number.

*CRAZYHORSE* wrote:I feel as if all the examples you just gave could easily be solved simply with supernatural dice.

Now that I have read supernatural dice, I would agree with you. I played a game yesterday, and I was thinking of some of my friends units. He had his four horseman, and each one had a passive ability. For example, war gave all friendly units within a pistol shot(6") a +1 to all damage rolls. How would one determine the CP of this? A passive, non-dice ability?

I never used CP, but now that I'm going to start planning some 2v2 games and such, I think there are a lot of up-sides to it when you really look at it. With inches, you can have one player who's really purist buy 40 grunts and another player buy 40 broken custom units if they are fudging it too much, and so forth. I think CP is pretty good because it shows pretty precisely how equal 2 teams are, one team could have 40 grunts and another could have 25 specialized units, and it would be really even because the CP cost is the same, rather than just using inches, which are a little too easy to abuse.

samuelzz10 wrote:one team could have 40 grunts and another could have 25 specialized units, and it would be really even because the CP cost is the same, rather than just using inches, which are a little too easy to abuse.

Nah. You can't buy customized units with inches, unless the customizations are all SN dice, in which case your 25 specialized units still cost 40 inches and then the teams are matched up regardless.

But otherwise, if you want your super-customized army, then you'd buy standard units with inches, and then customize them with Customization Points. Which, hopefully, would be much more strictly limited than inches, in order to keep the game from getting more complicated than it needed to be. Say, one CP for every five inches or something along those lines.

Natalya wrote:What's that? I can't hear you over the sound of how banned you are.

stubby wrote:But otherwise, if you want your super-customized army, then you'd buy standard units with inches, and then customize them with Customization Points. Which, hopefully, would be much more strictly limited than inches, in order to keep the game from getting more complicated than it needed to be. Say, one CP for every five inches or something along those lines.

While I agree that the new system seems like it would be more simple, I am one of those who does enjoy having an ultra complex army go up against a simple one. For me, it's fun to watch a squad of 10 guys with specialties, armor, and SU dice galore, match up against 50 regular dudes, and the current system makes it wind up balanced so either side could come out victorious. If/when the new stuff goes live, could the CP system also be saved somewhere on the site for those of us who wind up preferring it?