I mean. +1 Gives you big race. -2 Make your own tokens live and kill the other creatures. -7 with a nice +1 each turn can make you win easily…Not bad, control planeswalker.

SenasBush

If you can keep her alive, she’s quite a beast. Even better then assemble the legion. But she has to be in the right kind of deck to allow that.

Joshua McTiernan

Imagine curving Assemble The Legion into this? Sick!

Fbn Dnl Schlr

How can you seriously speak about “curving” with 5 CMC into 6 CMC? That’s so far ahead in a game of Standard it’s actually a win-more. Or are you talking about EDH? Assemble the Legion doesn’t work in EDH as far as I tried. I found it too slow and it seems to have a giant target on it’s head simply because it get’s overestimated for what it CAN do, but actually won’t.

Joshua McTiernan

Thank you for your opinion :)

Fbn Dnl Schlr

And your reply…?

Joshua McTiernan

I simply think that standard is gonna be slowing down after Innistrad leaves, but I could be wrong. I’m no expert at meta-gaming.

Fbn Dnl Schlr

That’s one thing I heard from many people now. Maybe it’s because of the 3 available dual lands 2 are coming into play tapped (Gates & Scrylands), maybe it’s simply because Thoughtseize exists now, maybe because Tusk is leaving Standard and the controlish cards of Ravnica2 have their time now to finally shine… I don’t know.

Assemble the Legion is too slow though imho. Elspeth has a strong board presence immediately. She wrathes the moment she comes in and still sits there or she squirts out three 1/1 dudes while then standing strong at 5 loyality (and therefore out of burn range). But Assemble the Legion? You wait a turn and get a 1/1, followed by two 1/1s the next turn? And your opponent does what? Nothing? Well, exactly.

But I see your point now, as Assemble the Legion followed by Elspeth is a pretty strong play. But nearly any 5 CMC card played in Standard is strong if followed by Elspeth.

Joshua McTiernan

Agreed :)

Fbn Dnl Schlr

Same for Luminarch Ascension, Doubling Season, Martyr’s Bond with Gravecrawler, etc… I’m sorry to say that all good cards/combos win the game if unanswered. ;-P

Kevan Kramer

She is better than the fake one we saw.

DeAnthony Grenesko

I think this will see standard play for sure. Just speculating here, but it seems like standard is going to be a lot slower than it is right now. In general, a 6 mana planeswalker is probably too slow for standard, but I think Theros seems like a much slower set (I know we’ve only seen 32 cards or so, but again, just speculating). Elspeth has very powerful abilities, especially +1, and if you can manage to get her emblem, her +1 is absolutely amazing. Her -3 is perfect for her, too, because even with the emblem, it won’t kill the tokens she makes.

Antares

Garruk Caller of beasts is seeing a lot of use right now, and he’s 6 mana. Sorin Markov saw use and he’s six mana. Any deck that plays control will want multiples of her, because she’s a huge threat to most decks. Decks that play mid-range will want her because she provides blockers, AND can help you outclass your opponent later in the game thanks to her emblem. The -3 synergizes perfectly with the +1 and Ultimate. Her soldiers become 3/3 flyers. So they have evasion, are the highest power available, and TICK HER UP. Her -3 then takes out anything that is stronger than your soldiers. She’s AWESOME. I’d see her at the 20$ mark easily, possibly as high as 30$, no lower than 10-12$.

DeAnthony Grenesko

Very true. She is very good. Her abilities definitely have incredible synergy to win the game just by herself. Her +1 is absolutely incredible. So are her other abilities. But +1 for 3 tokens. Wow.

Silver

mixed feelings. I reeeeeeeeeeeally wanna put her in my karador EDH. she seems amazing, can wrath the turns she enter (and only kills like 4 creatures in my deck), the +1 is brutal (is Tiriel’s -2 but adding counters!), her emblem isnt game breaking like her other emblem or venser’s but she is to mana expensive and enters with to few loyalty! The more expensive pw I use are; Liliana, Vraska, Elspeth Tiriel and the old Gideon. All of them severely impact the game (either by killing stuff or tutoring), the “weakest” one being Tiriel, but she gains life, a huge need in my deck. This elspeth accomplish the impact the board part very nicely (+1 and -3), her ultimate is decent as I tend to play weeny when my combos dont go off, but she cost 6!

(Tho I have always loved elspeth, chances are that she’s going in the deck regardless)

I’m not really too big of a fan of this one. First ability’s good, though very similar to the other Elspeths. The second one’s not so bad either, but could easily be on a 5-coster. The third ability is where the disappointment comes in. You cast this on turn 6, or 4/5 if you’re using green, and then wait three turns to finally be able to use this ability (which would require Elspeth to sacrifice herself) and then all you get is a permanent +2/+2 and flying buff. This is so underwhelming it’s crazy. This is the best they could come up with for a 6-costing Elspeth, who has been one of the best planeswalkers, who is in white, which is arguably one of the strongest colors? Granted +2/+2 and flying is not to be underestimated, but this Elspeth is just so weak as compared to the other ones.

Antares

If you play Mono-White or have enough white creatures in a deck, you can use this plus the Legendary land to cheat her out on turn 4 or 5.

Not saying that makes her awesome, but it helps.

Also, you are looking at this the wrong way. Her +1 is what Elspeth Tirel’s -2 used to be. You immediately get either 3 attackers or three chump blockers next turn. Her -3 is designed for a use in a weanie/aggro deck. It essentially becomes a one-sided wrath. Her ultimate is great in combination with her +1. Your guys now become 3/3’s with flying. So you are constantly getting 3 of the highest power creatures available, while your opponent is having all his bombs eliminated and all his weanies outclassed. She’s very synergistic.

Rockloh

Her skills are effects one would want in a weenie deck. But at 6 mana (in white) I can only see a control deck casting it, And her -3 isn’t that great in control since it will let alive all weenies your opponents may have. That being said, I’m a legacy player and I don’t have idea about what’s going on standard…

Antares

Right now, it’s shifted towards aggro very strongly (from the control dominated meta it had before Dragon’s Maze). A lot of decks are playing with swarms under 3 power. There’s also “Ramp into huge fatties”, and Control using U/W/X, thanks to Sphinx’s Revelation and Supreme Verdict/Detention Sphere.

Depending on how Theros shifts things (it looks to be going towards the “slower, longer, more interactive games”), we could see her getting used.

BEAST

THIS IS THE NEW TIBALT

Antares

What Tibalt are YOU referring to? This version of Elspeth gives you 3 blockers or 3 attackers a turn, can buff them (and everything else) to have evasion and hit hard, then wrath anything stronger than her tokens.

Yeah, she’s not BROKEN like the fake version was, but she’s very good. I would DEFINITELY expect her to be in several midrange and control decks. Just looking at the set, get her and Purphoros out at the same time. That’s 3 blockers and 6 damage every turn. Not bad, right?

bigbetz99

I didn’t catch on to what you were saying. By the “fake” one, do you mean the Fiend-Blooded or another Tibalt?

MtgMind-Welder98

He meant a “Fake” Elspeth that was show a month or 2 ago. It was really powerful, but I am pretty sure I am not the only one that wishes it was really.

BEAST

BANT IS THE NEW JUND. With all these sick G/W and U/B and just white cards (not counting the new elspeth) WATCH OUT FOR BANT

Brom

Dang. Nowhere close to as good as that fake one.

Larom888

She’s not that bad……not as good as the fake one though

Dan Vongsa

Intrepid Hero – advanced.

Angel of Shadows

From a flavor stand point, i personally love her. we go from Knight-Errant in Alara were she had lived for a long time and established herself as a mid-range knight and leader (reflected in the CMC4), the first +1 would be her calling one of her underlings, the second +1 would be her supporting her allies, and her -8 would be drawing on the power or Bant to protect the army. To Tirel in Mirrodin, where she began to lose faith in herself, and not want to be a leader because of the “loss” of Bant (CMC5), the +2 gaining life was her trying to heal Mirrodin with the power of her underlings as apposed to fighting, the -2 showed it was stressful for her to be a leader, well the -5 showed her pure rage at Phyrexia because of her past. Now we have her on Theros as Sun’s Champion (aka Hero of Heliod), the change from a sword to a lance shows that she is more commented to combat and has greater skill, the sword was more of a ceremonial weapon for a knight than a combat one and was much easier to wield in combat (CMC6). +1 shows that she is starting to regain some her confidence as a leader, -3 reveals that she sees that the monsters are overrunning the good races, so she is becoming a hero and slaying the monsters, well her -7 shows that she is not as comfortable being a leader as she was on Bant, but has gained power since than.

From a game-play stand, there no denying that she is no Knight-Errant, which outclasses all other walkers other than JTMS, but even with the high cost she is an easy pick the top ten (7th in my option), because both her +1 and -3 protect her and dramatically alter the state of the field.

Antares

I like the analysis.

Personally, I think her Bant and Mirrodin selves are good looks at the character. For Sun’s Champion, though: I’d say the +1 is her being chosen as Heliod’s champion, thus becoming (as undesired as it is) a leader of armies once again. This is reflected in her mana cost. She needs to have a strong incentive to come out, because she now commands a strong army in defense of the weak and can’t afford to be gone on frivolous pursuits. Her -3 is spot on, I’d say. We know she becomes Heliod’s champion by saving a village from a powerful Hydra. It is using her combat skills against the monsters.

Her ultimate, however, I consider to come, at least partly, from a change in her persona. She lost on Bant, and lost on Mirrodin. Her fellow soldiers all died around her, and she was the only one at the end of the day. Survivor’s guilt is eating at her. Where before she could draw on Bant to keep all her allies alive, now she has only her own power. She’s lost her rage against Phyrexia in exchange for defeatism. She could not save Bant. She could not save Mirrodin. Having lost all that she has cared for, she has chosen to use her (diminished) power to keep those around her alive.

Maybe I’m wrong, though. There’s a story on wizards about a letter she writes to Ajani, talking about her sword and how the storyline on Mirrodin ended. It’s pretty cool.

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