He isn't "missing out" on anything unless something tragic happens to Hossa in the next year.

Hossa's still going to be filthy rich. He's got many years of excellent hockey left. That means that Winter's sill going to get his percentage.

QUOTE (YoungGuns1340 @ July 6, 2008 - 10:59AM)

Just cause Hossa and his agent laughed about, doesn't mean Rich Winter didn't head straight to a shooting range after he left his meeting with Hossa. Winter lost out on a TON of money. Of course hes pissed.

Most nights, my posts are brought to you by some sort of IPA and a heaping dose of sarcasm.Success has a thousand fathers, failure is an orphan.
We not score, is hard to win. - Pavel Datsyuk #13

Just cause Hossa and his agent laughed about, doesn't mean Rich Winter didn't head straight to a shooting range after he left his meeting with Hossa. Winter lost out on a TON of money. Of course hes pissed.

yes obviously but its just funny that the article never gave off any sort of negative vibe from the agent yet that is the view that everybody took straight away.

...but yea obviously the guy is gonna be a little annoyed although im sure hes doing ok for himself.

Notice in that article it says - the "Goaltender's Club" suggested the idea. It even names the goalies..

QUOTE

A group of influential NHL players that includes New Jersey's Martin Brodeur, Dallas's Marty Turco, Detroit's Dominik Hasek and Edmonton's Dwayne Roloson want the league's - and inevitably the Leafs' - uniforms altered again. In what would be a radical overhaul that might incite hockey traditionalists but surely gratify some of the league's cash-strapped owners, several NHL goalies have asked the league and its players union to consider starting a so-called Goaltender's Club. Revenue-generating initiatives for the club could include placing a corporate logo on the jerseys of the league's 60-odd goalies.

Then it mentions that Winter and Robins are helping.

That's "scheming to get ads on goalie jerseys"? Sounds to me like he was hired to perform a job. He is a lawyer after all.

QUOTE (C-TownWing @ July 6, 2008 - 11:11AM)

Interesting you mention that. Here's what Ritch Winter was up to last time we heard from him, scheming to get ads on goalie jerseys:

I need to start taking the cynical pills that everyone around here seems to gobble down.

I read that article and I get a completely different take.

One part even mentions that Hossa and his agent were laughing at what they were proposing. That's not someone who's pissed.

Yeah, I didn't see it either.

On the one hand, Hossa and Winter are partners trying to get the biggest contract they can, as normal. But all the while, Hossa is wanting to be a Red Wing, (tired of playing with the Brat Pack Penguins already?). So his priorities change from long term big $, to wanting to fit into the Red Wings system. As you stated, they were laughing about leaving millions of dollars on the table for a chance to win with a winning organization.

Bravo to Hossa, props to Winter. They both know there is a very good chance they have just postponned the money, not lost it forever.

Personally, I suspect its more like a one year test drive: If everone's still excited this time next year, maybe things get arrainged so Marian Hossa remains a Red Wing, along with Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Lidstrom, Rafalski, and ...(?)

From everyting I've read, Holland has dealt with Rich Winter before, and seems to have enough respect for the guy

Kudos to Teeman for the Sig"You remember that chap a few years ago, climbed Everest with no oxygen, came down nearly dead...they asked him why he went up there to die. He said I didn't, I went up there to live."

From everyting I've read, Holland has dealt with Rich Winter before, and seems to have enough respect for the guy

He sure has. Just last year when we were all panicking about what would happen if Hasek didn't hurry up and sign a contract. Some people blasted Dom and his agent for stretching things out for so long. If you don't remember how it went down, here's a quote (thanks to Naranja, who uses it as her sig so I was able to find it easily).

"Dominik wanted to give the team room to have money under the salary cap. Let's face it, he's a $5 million-a-year goalie. We all know that. But I managed to talk them down to $2 million. It was a unique negotiation." Ritch Winter (Dom's agent)

Given his experience with Dom, I think he's ok with the Hossa situation.

My brother-in-law is good friends with a TOP soccer agent - good enough friends that he lent him his house in Marseille for his honeymoon He told me that most sports agents are little short of criminals in the way they control their clients.

The standard agents fee in soccer is 10% plus other perks like a couple of season tickets etc. If its the same in the NHL, Winter just lost out on a LOT of money.

"If I can be totally honest, it's not a lot of guys you get impressed by. Actually, it's no one else but him. From the bench, to see what move he makes -- you're like, 'I wish I could do that.' Sometimes you sit on the bench and just think, 'wow,' and you look over to the other bench and they sit there and shake their heads, too. He has great, great skills. I'm probably not going to play with another player who has the kind of skills he has." Mikael Samuelsson on Pavel Datsyuk

From redwings.nhl.com................A first round draft pick by the Ottawa Senators in1997, Hossa said he's harbored the opportunity to play for the Red Wings for sometime. "I've heard alot about things there from my friend" (Kopecky) "I was in contact with him during the year so we talked, and it's an exciting time and I'm looking forward to it." Who knows, maybe this isn't a one shot deal. Wonder how long he "harbored the opportunity".

From redwings.nhl.com................A first round draft pick by the Ottawa Senators in1997, Hossa said he's harbored the opportunity to play for the Red Wings for sometime. "I've heard alot about things there from my friend" (Kopecky) "I was in contact with him during the year so we talked, and it's an exciting time and I'm looking forward to it." Who knows, maybe this isn't a one shot deal. Wonder how long he "harbored the opportunity".

Also - can somebody count and tell me how many times Hossa stated that he wants to win The Cup? That says it all for me. Welcome welcome welcome aboard. I just cleaned your locker for you. Also - first game? Yer a healthy scratch - cuz we're nuts too.

Maybe but let's look at some numbers. This year the cap is about $56 Mil. Let's assume that it goes up 6-7mil like it did this year. That means we are looking at a cap of $62 mil.

For 09-10 we have a current cap hit of about $38 mil but we have to sign Hossa, Franzen, Z, Sammy, Kopetsky, Howard and Ty Conklin. I assume Cheli, McCarty and Flip fit under this year's cap as does Howard or Conklin.

Leave $2mil for Kopy and Sammy assuming that they are still here.

That leaves $60 -38 mil = 22mil.

Give Mule 5 mil because of his 40 goals. That leaves 17 mil for Z and Hossa. 8.5 each.

Maybe but let's look at some numbers. This year the cap is about $56 Mil. Let's assume that it goes up 6-7mil like it did this year. That means we are looking at a cap of $62 mil.

For 09-10 we have a current cap hit of about $38 mil but we have to sign Hossa, Franzen, Z, Sammy, Kopetsky, Howard and Ty Conklin. I assume Cheli, McCarty and Flip fit under this year's cap as does Howard or Conklin.

Leave $2mil for Kopy and Sammy assuming that they are still here.

That leaves $60 -38 mil = 22mil.

Give Mule 5 mil because of his 40 goals. That leaves 17 mil for Z and Hossa. 8.5 each.

This could work.

Am I being too optimistic?

no effin way Kopecky gets $2M unless he shows he's second comingof Johan Franzenstein. and $5M for Mule will only come true if herepeats his achievements of 2007-08. which is not so likely to me.the bar is really high for him

what relates to Hank and Hossa... if Holland keeps with "Lids is max" policythey'll get at most $7.5M which would be below their market worth. Hankmay take the discount for some 7-8 yr contract but with Hossa it dependsa lot on his feeling towards Wings at the end of the season. I could see himwanting to remain with Wings but it certainly will depend on the money.I don't think he'll accept a lower deal for the second time.

Maybe but let's look at some numbers. This year the cap is about $56 Mil. Let's assume that it goes up 6-7mil like it did this year. That means we are looking at a cap of $62 mil.

For 09-10 we have a current cap hit of about $38 mil but we have to sign Hossa, Franzen, Z, Sammy, Kopetsky, Howard and Ty Conklin. I assume Cheli, McCarty and Flip fit under this year's cap as does Howard or Conklin.

Leave $2mil for Kopy and Sammy assuming that they are still here.

That leaves $60 -38 mil = 22mil.

Give Mule 5 mil because of his 40 goals. That leaves 17 mil for Z and Hossa. 8.5 each.

This could work.

Am I being too optimistic?

Zetterberg will take less than 8.5M to stay on this team, I am certain.

And while the agent does definitely work for the player, agents want as much cash/commission as possible. You need to make your client happy in the long term, but I'd be a bit foul (though understanding of the client's motives) as well if my client rejected higher contract offers.

I'd be foul too, but that's life. Some deals are big fat whales, some are minnows and some aren't anything at all. I was in the mortgage business and missed out on all kinds of fat commissions because my customers got a loan from mother or a 2nd for $40,000 instead of refinancing a $300,000 first. It would have been nice for me if they refi'd the first, but it wasn't what they ultimately wanted. Fortunately, I had other clients.

That Hossa's agent is floored that his client chose a 1 yr run with Detroit or is bummed about snagging a whale is understandable, but I'm sure he has other clients and is not hurting financially. If he wants to understand real financial anguish, he can work in a field where his job gets outsourced to India or China or in a factory that just announced tens of thousands of layoffs.

Besides, the agent is still going to get his whale, he's just not going to get it in 2008. Boo fricking hoo.

Quote:"I want to have the best chance to win the Stanley Cup," Hossa said. "I feel like Detroit is the team, that's why the decision was made by me ... I know I could make more money somewhere else, but the thing I was looking for was the best chance to win the Stanley Cup."End Quote:

I was dancing around the room like everyone else when I heard the news of Hossa's signining with the Wings. However, I would have felt better if he had said something like "I signed with Detroit because I wanted to play hockey with these guys. They work hard every outing and that's how I approach the game. Another reason is because WE have the best opportunity to win the cup."

I know that could have been seen as a dig at Pittsburgh but Oh well.

From now on, Patrick Roy will be rolled out to and from the Avs' bench like Hannibal Lecter. - BottleOfSmoke

Quote:"I want to have the best chance to win the Stanley Cup," Hossa said. "I feel like Detroit is the team, that's why the decision was made by me ... I know I could make more money somewhere else, but the thing I was looking for was the best chance to win the Stanley Cup."End Quote:

I was dancing around the room like everyone else when I heard the news of Hossa's signining with the Wings. However, I would have felt better if he had said something like "I signed with Detroit because I wanted to play hockey with these guys. They work hard every outing and that's how I approach the game. Another reason is because WE have the best opportunity to win the cup."

I know that could have been seen as a dig at Pittsburgh but Oh well.

You need to read more articles man, he has said many many times he wants to be a Red Wing, Holland has said so, Winter has said so, Hossa has said so even in reference to before the Trade Deadline.

He does want to win the cup and the fact that Detroit, with or with out him, is a favorite helps, but he has also stated many times that he wants to be a Red Wing, that he wants to be a part of this Org.

Those of you mulling around Z and possibly Hossa's contract next year need to remember one thing:NO ONE MAKES MORE MONEY THAN THE 'C"!!!!

Holland has made it apparent to the players that if the best player in the world takes a pay cut to be on the best team, so will everyone else. Sure he threw the let me check with Nick thing out there to Hossa, but look at the respect an outsider (of the Red Wing team) had, he said "Don't worry, I'll have what he is having!"

Could it bite Holland in the ass, maybe, but it appears to be a promise he made to Nick that he will stand behind!

"The more I know about people - the better I like my dog." - Mark Twain

"A wise man once told me, ‘Don’t argue with fools. Cause people from a distance can’t tell who is who'." Jay Z, Takeover

"When I was looking for a captain, I wanted a guy with the Red Wings crest tattooed on his chest," said former Detroit coach Jacques Demers, who named Yzerman captain in 1986. "Steve Yzerman was that guy."

“Told him if he wasn't ultra-competitive he couldn't come here. If he didn't bring it every day he couldn't come here, because he was going to hate it if he didn't, dislike the coach and dislike playing here.

“It's real straightforward. If you don't do it right, you're not happy here." Babcock

I need to start taking the cynical pills that everyone around here seems to gobble down.

I read that article and I get a completely different take.

One part even mentions that Hossa and his agent were laughing at what they were proposing. That's not someone who's pissed.

That's funny, that is exactly what I was thinking when I read the article. Nowhere in the article does it say the agent is mad or that Hossa was stupid for what he did, in fact it didn't seem like the agent was mad about it at all but rather enjoyed it. I know the agent lost a lot of money but perhaps he really enjoyed have a client who cared about more than just getting as much money as possible no matter what. Maybe he was mad but I don't think you can get that from the article, it is crazy that Hossa turned down the contracts he was offered and most of (if not all of) the people here were totally floored that Hossa turned down those offers to play for one year in Detroit. It is shocking but that doesn't make Hossa's agent a jerk it just makes him surprised - like everyone else.

"Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience." - Mark Twain