Why is it that Weiss gets demoted to the 3rd line and it's all "WTF has Weiss done to deserve this" from kipwinger, but if Smith is demoted to the 3rd pairing, it's "well he just isn't a top 4 defenseman"...

I appreciate your Smith crusade, but this happens because Weiss puts up points despite his position in the line-up and his minutes played.

If Detroit does manage to land Franson, I would definitely be hesitant to break up DeQuincey. First instinct would be to put DeKeyser with Franson, but then we'd have a Smith-Quincey pairing, and we all know how that worked out... Big Rig's been better lately (at least offensively), but I think that's where I'd slot in Franson. I agree that Smith-Franson would likely be a disaster. These would be two different looks I'd explore if the team adds Franson.

Kronwall-Ericsson
Quincey-Franson
DeKeyser-Smith

Kronwall-Franson
DeKeyser-Quincey
Smith-Ericsson

Obviously, these aren't the only options, but I'm trying to avoid pairings that haven't worked out in the past. I'm not as sold on that first group. As solid as Quincey has looked this year, I'm not sure I trust him to hold down that pair defensively.

That is steep for a potential rental, however, I believe that Franson could be the type of guy that would want to re-sign with us in the offseason (if we land him). If we finish in the top of the standings and go on a decent run, I think he would be foolish not to re-sign (assuming Holland offers him a fair contract). Our blue line would look significantly better with him back there, and I'd consider going as high as a 2nd and Ouellet in a trade, and then do everything we can to lock him up after this season.

And this is probably the reality of what he's going to command. If Toronto really is starting at a 1st + prospect, and teams are (likely) offering a 2nd rounder, they're likely to meet halfway. If that means a 1st or a 2nd + good prospect, then Detroit's going to have to toss out a 2nd + Ouellet/Pulkkinen/Athanasiou to compete with some of other offers out there.

I don't think all of those guys have the exact same value, but I think they're in the same ballpark. Not our highest end guys, and not players most fans would be comfortable giving up. I'm not sure I pull the trigger on that - meh. The trade deadline has my love and hate.

Edit: If moving Smith for Franson was possible, I would rather go that route. I'm not sure how much interest Toronto would have in Smith, though (if they're looking for picks and prospects). Guess we'll have to see.

Honestly, I think he's staying. Some of his quotes lately (in the NHL.com article) have reflected a sense of optimism regarding the current roster, and the future of some of the younger guys. More than anything, I think Babcock wants to win. If he believes he can win with this team (which seems more likely now than ever), he's not going anywhere.

I also thought his quote about the Stadium Series was a bit telling:

"I know I was really excited for myself, for my franchise, when we got the opportunity because to me it keeps your logo front and center," Babcock said. "Outdoor games are a great, great experience. We've been fortunate enough to be involved in (two) and enjoyed it very much. I think it's another way to break up the season and it's going to be in a beautiful city. It's going to be a lot of fun."

Yes and no. He doesn't ever fight, but he's not a pest. You don't see him trying to get under people's skins the way a traditional pest (Maltby, Glendening) would. But that's because that isn't his role on his team. He's a first line power forward in GR and plays that game. He's most comparable to Abdelkader on our current team. He's a physically tough, strong, and in your face type of player. He hustles. He competes. He's aggressive. He's "heavy". And at the NHL level he'll probably be an agitator. But in GR he's a top line guy. So he doesn't act too "pesty", despite his style of play.

I figured something close to this. He's basically the net front presence down there from what I've seen, but I've only been checking out games more recently.

I'm wondering if he could tweak his game to suit our 4th line, as I know it would be a change from what he's doing down there. I know Detroit's got a lot of depth at forward right now, but I'd love to see a 4th line of Miller-Glendening-Callahan. At the very least, I still think he's an upgrade over Andersson.

Have there been any reports linking Zidlicky to Detroit... or anywhere, for that matter? It seems like New Jersey has been quiet, despite them being a sure-fire seller at the deadline. Their prospect cupboard is U.G.L.Y.

There was a time when I felt bad for Leafs fans. A couple of Toronto-fan friends of mine some of the more knowledgeable and passionate fans I know. Then Detroit lost that back-to-back in the middle of December and I got texts, FB messages and tweets from people I hadn't heard from in legitimately over a year, going on about how great Toronto is now/how they knew Detroit was on the decline.

I'm thoroughly enjoying this. I hope they split the rest of the season between wins and losses, and end up with somewhere around the 8th-10th pick.

I agree with this, but I also think, "who cares"? I mean, I don't really give a s*** if other teams and other fans thought Tatar or Nyquist were 2nd tier prospects. The fact that other people don't rate our prospects very high doesn't mean those prospects aren't really good, or better than other people think. You'd think years and years and years of churning out NHL players would get people hip to the fact that our prospects are almost always better than theirs, but if they aren't, oh well. Sure it makes trading a little harder, but we rarely trade anyway, so no harm done.

This is why I've been trying to stay away from a certain hockey forum (unsuccessfully lately, but it's the trading season). I generally keep it to myself, but it gets frustrating at times to see Red Wings prospects dismissed over and over again. Realistically, if people can't be bothered to look at Detroit's track record and see the value of some of these guys, then it's on them. It's still annoying, though.

You'd be wrong. At most they would have "little" value, if they had more than "no value." What your statement implies is that they could have more than just a little value and actually become a material component of a trade. There is simply no way that 30 NHL teams are going to pass on a guy with serious potential only to re-evaluate the situation a few months later and suddenly ascribe material value to the player.

If you propose a second round pick + a bunch of players that cleared waivers a few months ago, that is in reality just an offer for a 2nd round pick...and that simply is not going to get a player of Franson's caliber.

So, Jacob Markstrom has no value? I'd be willing to wager that he has some value on the market. At the very least, it's to a point where the Canucks have said they're not willing to deal him.

I stated in my post that I don't think those two pieces would be enough for Toronto to bite on. Going after Franson with Ferraro/Callahan and a 2nd isn't what I'm getting at. It's more going against the idea that a guy waived in October is going to be worth nothing in February. I'm not saying a guy like that is going to tip the scale a significant amount, but they can certainly improve upon their own value and be worth more than they were earlier in the season.

Considering the kind of bidding war that may occur for Franson, I don't think that a 2nd + Callahan/Ferraro will be enough.

I do, however, disagree that players who pass through waivers have little to no value. At the point in the season that those two passed through, teams were moving forward with their own prospects and trying to see what they might have to offer. There's a much higher chance that someone puts in a waiver claim during the season than at the beginning of it. Not to mention, if a guy has a solid year, passing through waivers has little to no impact on his value later in the season.

“I think what you always do (have to remember) is it’s called trade,” Babcock said. “It’s not Christmas, it’s trade, so you’ve got to give something to get something. What my job is and what Blash’s (AHL Grand Rapids coach Jeff Blashill) job is, is to develop players so we create as many assets as we can. Sometimes you end up with too many guys for one spot and you can make a move to make your team better. The general manager’s job is to weigh the current cost vs. the current gain vs. the future damage. That’s the decision time for every team in the league, not just for (GM) Ken (Holland) and myself.”

Not the whole window closing thing, but you know... the mentality of wanting to make a move.