Iranian Naval Vessels Enter Suez Canal

It's one thing to move warships into a strategic position in a time of peace....This is not a time of peace, the leadership of Israel has literally
said they're going to attack Iran. This is self defense.

I would like to point out that I have NOT been following this thread closely!.I believe that this is the way to go because no matter what side anyone
takes...that side WILL fail because and ONLY because one side is nullified!

Either one side is victorious or it is not! The only other alternative is if everything becomes equal!

And the leadership of Iran has said they want to wipe Israel off the map, so where do we all go from here? With so much hatred being hurled from each
nation at each other, its difficult to know who has the moral high ground in this .

And the leadership of Iran has said they want to wipe Israel off the map, so where do we all go from here? With so much hatred being hurled from each
nation at each other, its difficult to know who has the moral high ground in this .

Yet, the United States and Israel have carried out joint military exercises admittedly under the pretext of a joint attack on Iran. Who is the real
aggressor here. One nation moving a couple warships into international waters, or two nations, rehearsing an attack that they have already declared
is in their plans.

And the leadership of Iran has said they want to wipe Israel off the map, so where do we all go from here? With so much hatred being hurled from each
nation at each other, its difficult to know who has the moral high ground in this .

This is not what the doom-laden-war-monger-arm-chair-fantasists want to hear.

You said a mouth full, I was thinking the same thing, certain people watch and wait with baited breath for any little move Israel makes in hope and
anticipation Israel will make a move that they can criticize.

When all around them the world is going to hell in a hand basket, Israel is their top whipping boy.

Yes, if they have a history of firing upon people there. (which they do.)

Man you ARE biased..
You say it's AOK for Israel to fly over another countries land as long as they don't fire???
Gimmie a break...Israel would shoot down an Iranian hang glider if it ventured into Israeli territory..
The attacked foreign ships in international waters for christ's sake !!

And you REFUSE to listen to anyone and stick to the "mistranslation" as your main excuse for Israel..

The mistranslation is not on my part.

I clearly said it was fine for Iran to fire on Israeli planes, because they DO have a history of violence. I would not say it was fine to fire on a
first time perpetrator wandering into foreign airspace, but if I were Iran, I would fire on everything Israeli that ever got close to my country.

The reason it seems I am taking sides, is because the OP of this thread is about an Iranian ship going through the canal and the possibility of Israel
attacking it. If the roles were reversed, my opinion would not change.

Truth be told, I wish the West would get out of the way and let this whole Tenderbox in the Middle East go up in flames. I have no emotional
attachment to any of the sides, and I feel like they are holding the whole world hostage while they teeter on the brink of war for decades. I say get
it over with. 3.....2.....1....... everyone fire and quit talking about it!

........Truth be told, I wish the West would get out of the way and let this whole Tenderbox in the Middle East go up in flames. I have no emotional
attachment to any of the sides, and I feel like they are holding the whole world hostage while they teeter on the brink of war for decades.......

Whilst I also hold little, if any, 'emotional attachment to any of the sides' in the Middle East I am very much aware of the practical implications
to the rest of the world and the human suffering that would be involved for millions of ordinary people if we, 'The West' were just to sit back, or
actively encourage them to as you seem to advocate, bomb themselves into oblivion.

Don't we have a moral obligation to try and at least minimise the risk of such confrontation and subsequent inevitable suffering from happening?

And to think that such a confrontation would have no serious repercussions for the rest of the world is, well, naive to say the least!

Unfortunately the West (U.S.) can't get out of the way, as about the only industry the Powers that Be have not transferred off shore is defense and
aero/space with the U.S. Military who employs and deploys that product in it's most sophisticated and potent form, now reduced to a mercenary force to
secure resources in order for our bankrupt treasury to obtain the international loans to keep the U.S. Government funded.

While people tend to worry about places like China even though most of the infrastructure there is European and American owned, and China is dependent
upon American and European markets to buy all the goods it is producing, China is also dependent upon oil to run it's new industrialized and
mechanized infrastructure.

The Shadow Government made up of Corporate Titans, Elitists and Oligrarchs has it's control of the planet hedged on the control of oil, which is what
the U.S. Military is in actuality doing, and in reality the only major oil producing country that does not have American boots on the ground standing
on top of it is Iran.

While many people imagine we give ungodly amounts of money to the troublesome and ungrateful and lying Israelis because they have so corrupted our
Legislative process, the truth is that the Shadow Government uses them as the pretext in many cases for war in places throughout the Middle East. So
in addition to our own propaganda we get to listen to theirs all the time too, as they try to wiggle out of crushing 19 year old Irish girls from New
Jersey with Bull Dozers who's parents really aren't under the impression that anyone other than the IDF Bulldozer driver who was filmed deliberately
running over her and crushing her to death did that, despite what the morally bankrupt psychopaths who post insulting and demeaning propaganda to the
contrary have to say.

With a hopelessly corrupted political body in Washington D.C., a manipulated International Debt to keep the military industrial complex running along,
the U.S. Military is destined to remain a mercenary force tasked with securing oil in the Middle East at any and all costs to keep the Shadow
Government enjoying the leverage that it craves.

With so many people vested in that process, between the military personnel, the military contractors, the oil companies, the oil company contractors,
the Israeli lobyists and propagandists, and the religious nutters, I would say it's safe to say, we are not going to stop taking sides to armegeddon
is upon us, and the country lies in shambles totally bankrupt, unable to feed itself, it's infrastructure smashed and all of us dependent on the
Powers that Be for a MRE and a tent.

I won't know whether to laugh or cry then, many of the people who foolishly agitated for this will be dead then and will have gotten more or less what
they wanted, a glorious death in a horrific war, or to mourn the earth itself, and the children of tomorrow who will have to inherit the legacy of the
unbridled arrogance and the unrivaled stupidity of the contemporary fools of today.

Yeah we shouldn't be involved, good luck getting uninvolved in a nation that for a few easy consumer loans and cheap foreign trinkets traded it's self
sufficiency and output away and stood by while their politicians did the bidding of the International Corporate Shadow Government.

Originally posted by Alchemst7
SOooo whats the current status with the Iranian ships? Have they made it to the mediterranian sea yet? Back on subject although some good arguments
here!!

They made it to the Med yesterday and are likely close to or have arrived at Syria by now. So far it appears that they will complete their journey
without incident, unless there is a news blackout going on. A recent Internet Search shows all parties saying nothing and no new stories since they
transversed the canal over 24 hours ago.

The U.S. as a country is less than 300 years old, while the problems in the Middle East are thousands of years old. For us to try and protect them
from themselves is kind of like my 4 year old telling me how to drive, or warning me not to get drunk. (He does both of those by the way, but of
course it isn't very effective.)

So, my answer is...yes, it is a sad situation, and as a human being I feel some responsibility to help people who are suffering, but from a logical
standpoint, I have no moral basis, or authority to insert myself or my country into a situation that I don't entirely understand, and that predates
my existence by thousands of years. Therefore, I say we get out of their way.

So, that brings us to PT's response, and he has pointed out very effectively that it is impossible to just "get out of their way." Like it or not,
we are already living in the NWO. The world politics and economy is so entangled and intertwined that every decision we make has global
implications.

Thanks PT for that intelligent post. I don't like it, but we are up to our ears now, and we have to keep treading water or let the whole thing go
down. I don't believe we can tread fast enough, and the global system is doomed to a catastrophic failure, and I don't look forward to the
suffering, but I do look forward to getting it over with and getting to the task of rebuilding.

In conclusion, we are currently taking heroic and drastic measures to save a doomed system, and while it seems honorable, I believe we should be
focusing our energies on how to recover after the crash instead of wasting so much resource and time on delaying the inevitable. Pull out, go back to
the isolationist strategy, everyone prepare and look out for themselves, and try to plan better for our next shot at living in harmony.

Being far away does`nt account for anything in todays world,has not Iran been implecated in nuclear progression,is this not ongoing,are
communications between libya and Iran the reason for the floatila,read between the info and actions show the movements as
tactical.Gaddafi---help.Iran...holy

In conclusion, we are currently taking heroic and drastic measures to save a doomed system, and while it seems honorable, I believe we should be
focusing our energies on how to recover after the crash instead of wasting so much resource and time on delaying the inevitable. Pull out, go back to
the isolationist strategy, everyone prepare and look out for themselves, and try to plan better for our next shot at living in harmony.

Well my friend, in light of the significant contributions and leadership they provided, as well as the impetus in our last revolution, and as I have
stated in a number of the Secret Society Threads, the Master Masons of the U.S. are going to have to make a hard conclusion to abandon their current
bi-laws through amendment or ignoringing them and employ their formidible skills, minds and clout to helping out once more.

Forgive me for singling you out, but as one, it's ultimately going to fall to people like you, to engage the only significant shadow structure that
is not oligarch or government controlled.

I don't see us casting off the yoke of the Shadow Government without a real alternative infrastructure to take it's place, maintain law and order
and justice during what is no doubt going to be a prolonged period of strife and hardship, as the Corporate Infrastructure dies an ugly death, leaving
us without all those things we have become dependent upon them for, while marshalling their incredible international resources and force to punish us
into submission.

While many people fear Masonry, I believe this is it's ultimate purpose, is to remain vigilant in the wings, to build, or rebuild the building blocks
of infrastructure and society from time to time.

I am hoping as this situation degrades many in your position will be deciding to put your money where your mouth is, call what ever convention needs
to take place, and get this show on the road, because no my friend, it's not going to correct itself, and we are going to need all the help we can
get right within our own borders.

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