Theresa May vows ‘no compromise’ on her Brexit plan

Theresa May pledged she would not be “pushed into accepting compromises” on the Brexit plan agreed by her Cabinet in July that are not in the U.K.’s national interest.

In a bullish op-ed for the Sunday Telegraph ahead of the full return of the U.K. parliament she repeated her commitment to leaving the EU on March 29 next year and to fend off calls for a second referendum on the eventual deal.

But she hinted that the government’s proposal for future immigration arrangements with the EU would give the bloc’s citizens special access to the U.K. in return for better trade terms — something that would infuriate many Brexiteers in her party.

“Provisions for limited mobility arrangements are commonplace in other trade agreements. In the same way our proposed ‘framework for mobility’ is simply a way of supporting a trading relationship,” she said. But the prime minister added that “unfettered access to the UK” and the country’s benefits system would end.

May said that a no-deal scenario would be difficult for both sides and it was the government’s duty to prepare for it. “For some sectors there would be real challenges for both the UK and the EU. But we would get through it and go on to thrive. So we will be ready for a no deal if we need to be,” she said.

Also writing in the Sunday Telegraph, the former minister and Tory backbencher Nick Boles came out against the Chequers plan and what he predicted would be the “humiliation of a deal dictated by Brussels.”

Boles, who described himself as an “instinctive loyalist” who had never voted against the government, backed Remain in the referendum. He has previously supported the prime minister’s approach to Brexit.

But he said voters in his constituency reacted with “dismay” to the Chequers plan and “I have concluded that I must put my country first.”

He has put forward his own Brexit plan which would involve the U.K. leaving the EU next year without a transition period but remaining within the European Economic Area for a time while it negotiated a long-term deal with Brussels.

EUROPE Peace and Love

contango one

excellent news coming out of britain today

not only pressure to topple may is intensifying n put in place a very anti brussels anti 3rd world immigrant admin but the labour is also getting ready to split n get rid of that disastrous for the west marxist dinosaur

steadfast brits:

borris for pm
corbyn in jail

Posted on 9/2/18 | 9:17 AM CET

Paul N

Mrs May sticks to her lines, whether it is about the deal with the EU or another referendum. With regard to the latter, it is again presumed to have the same choice as before, Leave or Remain. Probability of a referendum is increasing, but the old choice is unacceptable for her. A choice between Canada or Norway model might be, when she is forced to admit that the deal that she is close to clenching does not include frictionless trade.

EU doublestandards

Always funny watching politicians do an about-face when they finally understand the reality of their own personal opinions amounts to political suicide. Now that you’re finally awake Theresa, stop messing about and get on with it.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 11:42 AM CET

blue bell

“Boles said voters in his constituency reacted with “dismay” to the Chequers plan and “I have concluded that I must put my country first.”

Well, it’s a start – one down just another six hundred and forty nine to go.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 12:16 PM CET

G Scot

The UK political temperature is going to continue to rise throughout the next month. Boles has written his article after having representations made to him by his local party & electorate. His constituency was a 61% Leave with Conservative voters representing an even higher percentage. I am sure a number of other MPs will have had a similar message delivered over the Summer break by constituents. Nothing motivates a politician more than his majority disappearing!

May has lost a large amount of credibility & support from her parties grassroots as well as an increasing number of MPs. The Conservative Party conference is going to be very interesting even although May’s apparatchiks will try to stage manage it.

We have an interesting time ahead in the UK & our European friends need to be aware that to many of us in the UK the story has moved on from just a Leave/Remain argument to an even more fundamental democratic point – does my individual vote actually mean anything if an elite minority can overturn the single largest democratic vote ever held within the UK?

I would still see the outcome as leaving on WTO or a Canada +++ deal – if the Commission had any sense it would begin to negotiate in the good faith that was outlined in Article 50.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 12:19 PM CET

Henry Jones

No Deal Hard Brexit is the Will of the People. May needs to represent the 52% who voted LEAVE. Britain will survive as long as Project Fear is ignored.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 12:27 PM CET

Rick Garness

A long winter ahead but there will be plenty of foder to keep the Remainiacs happy.
There’ll be no pressy from Santa though !

Posted on 9/2/18 | 12:29 PM CET

blue bell

@G Scot

Hear, hear!

Posted on 9/2/18 | 12:30 PM CET

Alex T

@ Paul N

YouGov polls are well known for being biased toward Remain, and are thus irrelevant.
Indeed most polls have over the last few years shown themselves to be completely unreliable.

Isn’t it time that you woke up to the fact there WILL BE NO SECOND REFERENDUM, and accepted the result with good grace? Well with a much grace as you can muster, at least.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 2:17 PM CET

Saintixe 56

Theresa May pledged she would not be “pushed into accepting compromises” on the Brexit plan agreed by her Cabinet in July that are not in the U.K.’s national interest.

Lets put the words in the right order: Theresa May can be “pushed into accepting compromises” which “are in the U.K.’s national interest”.

The prime minister added that “unfettered access to the UK” and the country’s benefits system would end. Knowing this fettered access could be enacted since a very long time (by Labour and Tory governments), I do not feel exactly reassured by the cough, cough not exactly pristine record of a former Home Secretary now turned PM.

Germany, France, etc have been doing it for years. Why not Britain?
Blaming the EU may have been flavour of the month for decades by Brexiters but out of the EU, they are going to be obliged to find a different scapegoat. Which is why I favour a No Deal Brexit.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 2:29 PM CET

Peter Monta

I must say it is fascinating to watch the squirming of various British politicians offering ridiculous alternatives to the Chequers plan even though that has almost entirely been rejected by the EU. Chequers is bad they say but I know something much more generous that the EU will accept! No they won’t. You Titanic. They iceberg.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 2:42 PM CET

Alex T

@ P Monta

“You Titanic. They iceberg.”

Another profoundly unintelligent comment from our Fake Canadian from Munich troll.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 2:50 PM CET

Dr Orthogonal

Excellent news!! Theresa May will not diverge from her white paper plan. It’s either that deal or No Deal. And even remainers, such as Nick Boles, do not believe she will compromise any further. He fears that the EU will say no to the white paper plan and because there will be no further UK compromises there will be no deal. He knows that Theresa May is not bluffing.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 2:51 PM CET

Dr Orthogonal

@Peter Monta

It is either the white paper plan or no deal.

If the EU reject that, they are also rejecting 40 billion Euros, cooperation on defense and security, a surplus in free trade to and from the UK, a solution to the Irish border issue, EU citizens rights in the UK, etc etc In other words they would be throwing away everything that they thought they had already gained from the negotiations. The thing is, it is always much harder to lose something you already thought you had. EU voters won’t take kindly to this …

Posted on 9/2/18 | 3:00 PM CET

Steuersklav Erei

@ Paul N

Even if the UK were to hold another referendum (and it wouldn’t), there could not be a choice between Norway and Canada on the ballot paper. Neither the Norway nor the Canadian option is on offer from the EU. Quite why you keep peddling your nonsense is a mystery.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 3:14 PM CET

Saintixe 56

As PM May sort of says to Barnier: my plan or the highway, let remind our audience of where we are.

Barnier has already replied No Way to Chequers since a few weeks. Whatever Raab and our plucky Continental alpinist are negotiating is NOT Chequers.
It is like being all sitting in a restaurant we were saying we are discussing the same menu. Yes, we are but not the same orders.
So:
– EU says no Chequers.
– May says Chequers, while sending to Brussels Raab who, either is loonier than Davis (no mean feat) , either has gone rogue negotiating on his own outside of Downing Street remit (who believes this) or is following May orders like Barnier is following the EU Council orders. Thus May Chequers must be a … different Chequers.

– D Davis says No to Chequers. But No to which one?

It would seem this Chequers has been bounced back finding itself check mate. (signng quite proud of my puns) (it is Sunday, guys)

Alex T

Steuersklav Erei

@ Saintixe 56

‘Germany, France, etc have been doing it for years. Why not Britain?’

Because Germany and especially France have fortified labour markets, meaning that is harder for foreign workers to progress than in the UK. They also have much more insurance-based social security in contrast to the taxpayer-funded universal UK model. Companies in Germany and especially France are thus much less likely to hire foreign workers than their equivalents in the UK.

Irene Duym

Can she just put the tories together in view of a common position for a change?

Posted on 9/2/18 | 5:58 PM CET

Peter Monta

Oh I am pretty sure Dr O that the EU can figure out how to collect a lot more than forty billion one fee and one tariff at a time. On the plus side for them they escape all liabilities they might have had for British nationals. Win win for them. You, not so much.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 7:03 PM CET

Stan

Paul N

Interesting speech by the Prime minister of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland published on the BBC.

No second referendum.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 7:20 PM CET

Stan

“Win win for them. You, not so much.”

Classic Monta.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 7:21 PM CET

Paul N

Interesting way in which mrs May describes her position on another referendum:
“Neither will I give in to those who want to re-open the whole question with a second referendum. To ask the question all over again would be a gross betrayal of our democracy – and a betrayal of that trust.”

With this formulation, she left the door open for a referendum that would not be a repetition of the last one, so not on Leaving or Remaining. It would allow her to organize a referendum between the deal that she is now negotiating and no deal, but both are in her view bad options. So she could also decide to organize a referendum on the deal that is now being negotiated and permission to start negotiating a Norway kind of deal.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 7:22 PM CET

Stan

Paul N
“With this formulation, she left the door open for a referendum”

Paul, unfortunately she doesn’t make speeches just for you. If she did I’m sure she would say it in a way that makes it absolutely clear in every possible way you could willingly misunderstand it.

There must be a poll somewhere you could get comfort from instead of these convoluted reasons why T May has just said there might be another referendum after all.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 8:07 PM CET

Jo Docus

Hmm, I’m afraid that’s it then. No compromise allowed, UK insists on demanding the EU breaks its internal market to suit the UK.

Just Once

@Dr Orthogonal

I tend to disagree with your points;
1. 40 billion Euros – UK will pay the money or the borrowing will be expensive. Future EU regulations will definitely will not be supportive of UK’s financial services. Either way it is a 7 year budget issue. Brexit is forever.
2. Cooperation on defence and security – EU’s own new defence is coming. UK contribute 38% to security it means UK will loose 62% of the data.
3. Surplus in free trade to and from the UK – it is an issue for EU but it is much bigger issue for the UK with 44% of the trade affected
4. Solution to the Irish border issue – it is UK’s issue as it changes its status
5. EU citizens rights in the UK – UK confirm the EU citizens can keep the right to leave and work in UK

As mentioned million times, there will be no winners but UK is bound to loose a lot more. EU voters have accepted that.
Besides, you seem to see EU as trading block only. In fact, we see it just like the union of UK. What you see as advantage of having 4 countries in a close union, it is also applicable to a union of 27.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 8:50 PM CET

Ver San

The Chequer’s plan was more like an attempt to convince the EU it’s a deal they should take because Brexiteers are against it. You may be able to fool the people but you may not fool one’s principle.

Brexit leave campaign has been based on lies and deceit. You can’t build a relationship on lies and deceit.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 9:05 PM CET

Ian Beaumont

Just Once ,
1. 40 billion Euros – UK will pay the money or the borrowing will be expensive. Future EU regulations will definitely will not be supportive of UK’s financial services. Either way it is a 7 year budget issue. Brexit is forever.

You don’t seem to realise that the EU members depend on UK financial Services .
The failure of the EU to secure the 40bn euro’s will have a massive effect .
Just look at how EU Commissioner Oettinger reacted to Italy’s threat to withhold its contribution , that Oettinger claimed amounted to only 2-3bn euro’s .

2. Cooperation on defence and security – EU’s own new defence is coming. UK contribute 38% to security it means UK will loose 62% of the data.

When will the new defense be in place .
The UK has a permanent seat on the UN security council , is a member of The 5 eyes, is one of only 2 European nuclear powers , with a rapid response armed forces
That is what the EU loses .

3. Surplus in free trade to and from the UK – it is an issue for EU but it is much bigger issue for the UK with 44% of the trade affected .
The UK export market to the EU is shrinking , and the UK export market is growing outside of the EU . Being able to negotiate our own trade deals, and tariffs should further increase our exports outside of the EU .
The UK is the 2nd largest customer (after America ) of European made goods .
How will EU members increase their trade deals with Non EU countries without member vetoes ?, and a market that has reduced by 1/8th after the UK leaves.

4. Solution to the Irish border issue – it is UK’s issue as it changes its status .
I disagree , its to protect the integrity of the EU single market , not the UK market .

5. EU citizens rights in the UK – UK confirm the EU citizens can keep the right to leave and work in UK
Those living in the UK before March 2019 , will be given the right to live and work in the UK , and their rights protected under UK law .

Those wanting to migrate to the UK after Brexit may have to qualify .

As mentioned million times, there will be no winners but UK is bound to loose a lot more. EU voters have accepted that.
Besides, you seem to see EU as trading block only. In fact, we see it just like the union of UK. What you see as advantage of having 4 countries in a close union, it is also applicable to a union of 27.

We’ll have to wait and see who loses more .

Maintaining the union , close cooperation, and agreements of 4 countries without leaping from crisis to crisis , is easier than maintaining a union of 27 countries , with differing opinions , requirements , demands , arguments and vetoes, whilst jumping from one crisis to another ( basic logic )

Posted on 9/2/18 | 10:04 PM CET

Ian Beaumont

Ver San,
The Chequers deal is the softest deal that could be offered , which is why most in the UK do not like it .

It has supposedly been rejected by Barnier .

If so , It will be a Hard Brexit that suits nearly all Brexiters

Posted on 9/2/18 | 10:09 PM CET

Gupta 

Posted on 9/2/18 | 10:10 PM CET

Tony brown

Pauln

I looked at the polls. First of all it was a very small sample. Bearing in mind nearly three quarters said the negotiations had gone badly, it is remarkable that so many still wanted to leave.

However the key point is that leave still has a commanding lead amongst those most likely to vote, the over 45’s. Factor in the bias towards Scotland whereby a proportionately higher number wanted to remain and the poll is remarkably similar to the one held just before the actual referendum.

At this stage of proceedings, as with governments, I would have expected remain to be doing much better.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 10:21 PM CET

Peter Monta

The race is on! Judging by Barnier’s most recent comments about the Chequers plan it is going to be a very close thing whether or not members of May’s own party or Barnier himself will drive the stake through it’s heart. My money is on the Brits.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 10:23 PM CET

Tony brown

Just once

You see the eu as just like the union of the UK. In other words, politically, financially and with a single market, and presumably willing to make fiscal transfers from the rich to the poor regions?

Are you sure your fellow citizens in the EU are on board with such a completely integrated union and more to the point, is mrs merkel?

Posted on 9/2/18 | 10:30 PM CET

Gupta 

On the one hand, a nation is seeking to regain its freedom and its right to self determination, and on the other hand, the entire future and likely downfall of a dictartorial regime ship’s future hangs in the balance. Of course they are desperate.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 10:39 PM CET

Gupta 

As Juncker said, “Brexit is the fault of the EU and one can only blame the EU for it’s own downfall”. And he is right, and those like Barnier are suppossed to be responsible , not irresponsible. He should grab the snake by the head and sack him.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 10:46 PM CET

Tony brown

Ian

With regards to point one of your reply to ‘just once’

Whilst the rest of the financial world is expressing concern about Contract continuity of derivatives post brexit, it is apparently falling on deaf ears in Brussels. Up to 100 trillion of derivatives needs to be sorted out by the EU if there is not to be financial mayhem. Yes, trillion.

I do not think the EU has any idea of the size and nature of the threat which needs to be dealt with at government level.

The uk has made its arrangements but the eu has made none

Posted on 9/2/18 | 10:47 PM CET

Steuersklav Erei

@ Just Once

It’s very strange that you think that the Irish border is the ‘UK’s issue’. It is the EU, not the UK, which by Treaty law requires hard external customs and regulatory borders against non-EU countries.

The worst-case scenario (for some the best-case scenario) would be for the open Irish border to be declared by WTO plaintiffs to mean a unilateral free trade border. This would mean that the UK must unilaterally declare 0% tariffs on its imports from the rest of the world. There are some influential voices in the UK in favour of this.

I wonder, however, who in the EU would like the 440-million strong EU market to be declared unilaterally free trade for the rest of the world?

Posted on 9/2/18 | 11:14 PM CET

Ian Beaumont

Tony brown,
“I do not think the EU has any idea of the size and nature of the threat which needs to be dealt with at government level.

The uk has made its arrangements but the eu has made none”

Oh , I think they know ,they have a number of ex Goldman Sachs experts in nearly all the member countries governments , but I think there is no way for them to deal with it .

They are probably trying to down play the situation , or they would have to admit to a weak negotiating position .

After all “When it becomes serious , you have to lie ” JC Juncker

Posted on 9/2/18 | 11:29 PM CET

Just Once

@Ian Beaumont

Cut out a bit but here;
1. I do realise EU depend on the UK financial services at the moment indeed but the money is not UK’s and it is liquid, easy to migrate. But most of all their owners would not allow the their money to stay not invested as that means profit loss or even worse loss of already invested money. Solutions will be found very quickly.
2. Who exactly will attack EU and what is NATO for? Not having an army yet is a temp problem, you don’t expect EU to hide behind the UK, do you?
3. It doesn’t make sense to have FTA with any country that can beat you in cost of goods. And I’m afraid that is not difficult as you have to maintain NHS and high social standards (it is a compliment to UK, that’s the way it should be). But UK is competitive only to countries with EU standard. UK will have to be protectionist.
4. You don’t seems to know much about the Irish border. Trade is the smaller issue, read up on the Good Friday Agreement.
5. I don’t disagree on this point

And just to be clear, we do respect your choice to leave, but judging by the posts here, many do not respect what we believe in and stand for. Leave with some dignity, no deal is fine, just invite me for a pint for the good old times.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 11:32 PM CET

Paul N

@Tony B
If you refer to the YouGov poll, you mean the people over 50 years old. Your argument that a higher percentage of this group actually vote is in my view not so important at this moment. But anyway, the EU tracker shows that first (in august 2016) “it was right to leave” led by a margin of about 3. It lags “it was wrong to leave” already since October 2017. Current margin is about +4 for wrong. It is not a huge shift, but enough to be taken seriously.

Posted on 9/2/18 | 11:58 PM CET

blue bell

@Gupta
“On the one hand, a nation is seeking to regain its freedom and its right to self determination, and on the other hand, the entire future and likely downfall of a dictartorial regime ship’s future hangs in the balance. Of course they are desperate.”

Sums it all up really doesn’t it.

Is that dictatorial regime ship tied to anything and if so did they use a Double Matthew Walker? and is that a hitch or a knot?

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:06 AM CET

Ian Beaumont

Just Once,
1. I do realise EU depend on the UK financial services at the moment indeed but the money is not UK’s and it is liquid, easy to migrate. But most of all their owners would not allow the their money to stay not invested as that means profit loss or even worse loss of already invested money. Solutions will be found very quickly.

I acknowledge that the money does not belong to the UK , but the investors are customers of the UK financial Institutions , and they can transfer it , and reinvest elsewhere ( In other words , it can be withdrawn from the EU member states)

2. Who exactly will attack EU and what is NATO for? Not having an army yet is a temp problem, you don’t expect EU to hide behind the UK, do you?

Nobody will attack the EU in a conventional war situation , but probably terrorists killing small amounts of people (10-50) ,with the loss of only 1 terrorist at a time . Cooperation with the UK , and UK cooperation with the EU, benefits both

As far as NATO , The EU members state they can no longer rely on America , and refuse to meet their signed commitment of funding , thus weakening NATO .
So my question is valid , When will the EU army be ready ?

3. It doesn’t make sense to have FTA with any country that can beat you in cost of goods. And I’m afraid that is not difficult as you have to maintain NHS and high social standards (it is a compliment to UK, that’s the way it should be). But UK is competitive only to countries with EU standard. UK will have to be protectionist.

I disagree , UK exports outside of the EU ( the fastest growing economies) is increasing , whilst UK exports to EU members is decreasing .
Who wouldn’t want to trade with a country of buyers with money ?
Those countries wanting to sell to the UK will also be negotiated to buy from the UK
( before you ask what the UK has to sell , check our exports to the EU)

4. You don’t seems to know much about the Irish border. Trade is the smaller issue, read up on the Good Friday Agreement.
Actually , I am quite well read on the Irish border, GFA , and The Northern Ireland Act of 1998 .
What do you want to know?

And just to be clear, we do respect your choice to leave, but judging by the posts here, many do not respect what we believe in and stand for. Leave with some dignity, no deal is fine, just invite me for a pint for the good old times.

Personally , I respect your belief in EU membership , and actually think the UK is in a unique position , in not being dependent on its membership , as some other countries are .
As far as going for a drink for old times sake , not a problem

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:22 AM CET

Gupta 

@Eleena Adal

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:26 AM CET

Gupta 

Dutch people unable to control themselves, stab Americans in train station simply because they are Americans !

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:35 AM CET

Gupta 

Yet another terroríst hive in Amsterdam. Dutch ask for UK for cooperation and intellegence.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:36 AM CET

blue bell

@Gupta
Where did you see that?

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:40 AM CET

Gupta 

ALL over the internet.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:42 AM CET

Gupta 

Yesterday, more of Mutti’s ‘guests’ carrying knifes kill 2 Americans.
Carried out by a 19 year old German citizen fromAfghanistan.

BACKDROP: As more riots take place in Germany protesting against Muttis immigration policy (that she is now desperatly trying dissown, by trying to offload it onto the EU so that she can remain in power)….

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:48 AM CET

Gupta 

Sorry, tried to murder, the two Americans are, happily, alive.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:53 AM CET

blue bell

@Gupta
I still cannot see it here

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:59 AM CET

Gupta 

‘It is VOLATILE’ German mayor issues ‘STATE OF EMERGENCY’ as Chemnitz violence escalates”…

THOUSANDS of people have joined both the anti-migrant protests and counter-protests in Chemnitz, amid escalating tension in the east Germany city – with eleven people hospitalised so far.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 1:02 AM CET

blue bell

@Gupta
Goodnight

Posted on 9/3/18 | 1:05 AM CET

Gupta 

& days of rioyts and protests in Chemnitz, mayor declares state of emegency.

Amsterdam: https : // www . bbc . com / news / world-europe-45382557

And 100’s of others sources, do you live in state controlled and state censored Germany?

Posted on 9/3/18 | 1:05 AM CET

blue bell

@Gupta
There is nothing on Reuters and they are usually a feed to the news channels. Very strange.

Gupta 

AMSTERDAM (Reuters) – Dutch police said a man who stabbed and seriously injured two people at Amsterdam’s main train station on Friday was a 19-year-old Afghan with a German residence permit.

Police said the man seemed to have randomly picked his two victims in the busy hall of Amsterdam central station at around midday. He was shot and taken to a hospital by police where he was being interrogated, police and the Amsterdam city council said in a joint statement.

“The investigation into the incident is ongoing”, the authorities said. “All scenarios are taken into consideration, including a terrorist motive.”

Wilders on Thursday cancelled the contest citing security risks, as thousands of people in Pakistan marched in protest of his plan, while the Taliban in Afghanistan called for attacks on Dutch troops serving in the country.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 1:14 AM CET

Gupta 

Posted on 9/3/18 | 1:19 AM CET

Gupta 

And in Switzerland:

Posted on 9/3/18 | 1:21 AM CET

blue bell

Why the accusative tone? Why would I not want to see it? It is not logical and you are clearly perturbed by events should I leave you to yourself or would you like company for a while?

Posted on 9/3/18 | 1:26 AM CET

Gupta 

Down the road from me…

Posted on 9/3/18 | 1:27 AM CET

Tom Cullem

No compromise? Of course not, it’s no longer necessary, as her Chequers Plan has already done all the compromising.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 3:42 AM CET

Hrvoje Horvat

@EUROPE Peace and Love Your request that Britain do not respect result of referendum shows main EU problem: NO DEMOCRACY. When EU citizens vote something what rulling parites od not like then they, like you , want to null this vote.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 5:31 AM CET

blue bell

Boris Johnson writing in The Telegraph today “Victory for Brussels is certain. In adopting Chequers, we have gone into battle waving the white flag” According to SkyNews he has the support of around 20 mps including the likes of IDS and Pritti Patel.
The ERG group currently enjoy the support of around 60.

David Davis meanwhile has said that although he does not agree with the Chequers Court deal and will vote against it he was critical of those who seek to conflate the Chequers deal with a leadership contest.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 8:48 AM CET

Ver San

@Ian Beaumont
“Ver San,
The Chequers deal is the softest deal that could be offered , which is why most in the UK do not like it.

It has supposedly been rejected by Barnier .

If so , It will be a Hard Brexit that suits nearly all Brexiters”

That’s my point. The conservatives have no real intention of a deal from the very start. The no-deal brexit mantra will become their self-fulfilling prophecy. They either want a no-deal or cake-deal.

Maurizio Bertini

@Dr Orthogonal
Sorry to hurt your British pride, but next time we EU citizens will vote for the EU and our national Parliaments, the results of the Brexit negotiations will influence the voting decisions of about 0.001% of us.
Even when thinking only of international affairs, our opinions about how the EU and our national governments should interact with Trump, Putin and China will influence our vote much more than about the EU interaction with the UK.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 10:27 AM CET

Ian Beaumont

Ver San ,

If that is so , then Barnier is lying to its member states citizens , in claiming that it is close to a deal .

And

Theresa May is lying to the Pro EU supporters in the UK .

Personally , I disagree with your claim

Posted on 9/3/18 | 10:49 AM CET

Ian Beaumont

Maurizio Bertini ,
“Sorry to hurt your British pride, but next time we EU citizens will vote for the EU and our national Parliaments, the results of the Brexit negotiations will influence the voting decisions of about 0.001% of us.
Even when thinking only of international affairs, our opinions about how the EU and our national governments should interact with Trump, Putin and China will influence our vote much more than about the EU interaction with the UK”

Why do you think it is about British pride ?

Your claims of a percentage of voting decisions affected by Brexit is not quantifiable .

Who knows how voting decisions will be affected in those member countries that significantly suffer from the failure of a no deal exit , or the various European events such as terrorist attacks , migrant protests , countries refusing refugee rescue ships etc .

Like everybody , we’ll all have to wait and see

Posted on 9/3/18 | 11:04 AM CET

Ver San

@Ian Beaumont
“If that is so , then Barnier is lying to its member states citizens , in claiming that it is close to a deal .
And
Theresa May is lying to the Pro EU supporters in the UK .”

I’ve never said Barnier is lying to EU-memberstates and I can’t relate to how he does that when I simply analyse the Tory’s intentions. Secondly I do agree that May is lying to Pro EU supporters. When I look at her actions. She succeeded in maintaining as much business as possible with those lies.

I simply look at the universal law. There is absolutely no rational logic in Brexit and there is absolutely no chance that rationality will prevail. Therefore I say that this subconsciousness that we’re surrounded with is resulting in a no-deal scenario. My sensors say 100% no-deal. Despite 80% being agreed. For the most simple reason, the Leave Campaign promises. You can sell lies and deceit to a country but not to someone’s principles.

Lastly 80% being agreed is not 100% being agreed. When 80% is agreed doesn’t mean that it will result in 100% being agreed to. When there is 20% which has heavy collusion with the Brexit Leave Campaign promises, it simply cannot be done. Barnier is correct though because in my opinion a “no-deal” is a deal that can be agreed to as well. I think your perspective is too black and white. I still stick with what my guts is telling me, no-deal or cake.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:03 PM CET

Maurizio Bertini

@Jan Beaumont
Well, Dr Orthogonal wrote: “EU voters won’t take kindly to this …” (rejection of the UK cherry-picking attempts) Sorry, but we UE voters hardly care at all. We have many other problems to deal with. The UK decided to leave the EU and we have to define our future relationships, as neither the UK nor the EU will disappear on day 1 after Brexit. The EU wants the best possible deal in its interest and the UK wants the best possible deal in its interest, but neither side will have it 100% its way. Like in any bargaining, either we meet somewhere in the middle or there’s no deal and the fallback line is WTO. We accept this fact. I am still wondering if you accept it too or are still under the delusion that you can force us to agree on your terms.
And as you correctly say, many other items will influence our vote much more than the result of the Brexit negotations. Number one for the EU parliament: how far do we want to move towards a federal Europe in order to resist Putin and Trump, or do we want to move in the opposite direction and let them divide and conquer us one by one?
At the national level, the list of our main worries is just too long and different for each country. To name only one, I can easily foresee that unemployment will influence the next Italian general election much more than the next German general election.

Posted on 9/3/18 | 12:19 PM CET

Ian Beaumont

Maurizio Bertini,
“Well, Dr Orthogonal wrote: “EU voters won’t take kindly to this …” (rejection of the UK cherry-picking attempts) Sorry, but we UE voters hardly care at all. We have many other problems to deal with”

So why create more problems for yourselves ?

“The UK decided to leave the EU and we have to define our future relationships, as neither the UK nor the EU will disappear on day 1 after Brexit. The EU wants the best possible deal in its interest and the UK wants the best possible deal in its interest, but neither side will have it 100% its way. Like in any bargaining, either we meet somewhere in the middle or there’s no deal and the fallback line is WTO. We accept this fact. I am still wondering if you accept it too or are still under the delusion that you can force us to agree on your terms”

The UK followed EU law under The Treaty of Lisbon and Article 50 , and will be leaving the EU , as is its legal right .

The EU chose the order of the negotiations , to try to get concessions , without agreeing to any concessions by itself .
This has defined the negotiations , in which the UK has had the EU make demands on the UK , whilst refusing to discuss any future trade deal .
Clearly not a sensible way to conduct negotiations

Actually , I would be happy with a no deal exit , with absolutely no delusions

“And as you correctly say, many other items will influence our vote much more than the result of the Brexit negotations. Number one for the EU parliament: how far do we want to move towards a federal Europe in order to resist Putin and Trump, or do we want to move in the opposite direction and let them divide and conquer us one by one?
At the national level, the list of our main worries is just too long and different for each country. To name only one, I can easily foresee that unemployment will influence the next Italian general election much more than the next German general election.”

Why do you think that moving further towards a Federal Europe is needed to counter Putin or Trump ?

After all , the EU claims European Unity exists already , or are they lying .

If the EU unity exists , why do you think it could be divided by anyone ?

Unemployment , forced acceptance of migrants etc will all have negative results in the EU elections

Posted on 9/3/18 | 3:02 PM CET

Ian Beaumont

Ver San,
Your statements are not any form of rational logic , just a one sided personal opinion , where the EU is truthful , and the UK are liars .

Rational logic would determine the probability that both are liars

Do I have to remind you of Junckers own claim from his book

“When it becomes serious , you have to lie”

Posted on 9/3/18 | 3:09 PM CET

Ian Beaumont

Ver San,
You fail to see the self perpetuating reason of EU bureaucrats

Bureaucrats increase bureaucracy thus increasing the need of more bureaucrats to create even more bureaucracy infinitum .

All at the ever increasing costs to the citizens that have to pay for the Bureaucrats