If you scroll through the nine or ten pages of this thread, and the 20+ pages of the other one, there are probably 10,000 words dedicated to carefully demonstrating different flaws in your proof, from the theological (an example here), the scientific (here), the historical (here) and many many other paradigms. Instead of attempting, for even a second, to modify or develop your argument, you just repeat it.

Like I said a few posts ago, that is dehumanizing.

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“Ah! How cheerfully we consign ourselves to Perdition!”
-Melville-

“If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don’t have to worry about the answers.”
-Pynchon-

If you scroll through the nine or ten pages of this thread, and the 20+ pages of the other one, there are probably 10,000 words dedicated to carefully demonstrating different flaws in your proof, from the theological (an example here), the scientific (here), the historical (here) and many many other paradigms. Instead of attempting, for even a second, to modify or develop your argument, you just repeat it.

Like I said a few posts ago, that is dehumanizing.

You see that dr. No, sounds like the man has actually paid attention to your posts. It’s a shame you refuse to give him the same courtesy.

Since you can’t find a naturalistic explanation for the origin of the disciples’ beliefs, realize Jesus is God.

Since you can’t overturn the fact nature can’t start up from nothing nor always have existed, realize atheism is a lie. Because you would have happened already, having had an eternity to do, then realize nature needs a cause outside of itself, outside of time and space, and this is whom we call the uncreated Creator.

Whynot: Excuse me, but I found this to be an interesting assertion. How does anything exist outside time and space? For anything…including a prospective god…to exist, it absolutely necessitates both a time and a place to exist. Otherwise, you are merely stepping outside the comprehensible and the logical to promote the incomprehensible…which kinda explains the content of your prophetic meandering interpretations.

And another thing…exactly why is infinite regress not possible? I missed the part where you made a reasoned case for this assertion also. And there is also a naturalistic explanation for the alleged disciples beliefs, as well. It’s called cognitive dissonance. It comes from being spoon fed hypothetical religious hoopla 24/7. Since its already been demonstrated, both experimentally and in computer modeling, how in nature, very complex structures can emerge quite naturally from very simple chemical and/or other substances via natural processes, has it ever occured to you, (of course not, else I wouldn’t be responding to this drivel), that maybe your religioun has missed the boat in explanatory accountability? I suppose, primitive man, looking around at all the complexity of nature would quite naturally assume it had to come from somewhere, and wherever it came from, had to be even more complex still…when in fact, just the opposite has shown to be the case time and time again. But it’s a reasonable assumption anyone, uneducated in the sciences, would make. It’s just not a good idea to ignore the evidence once its been dangled in your face.

Hi, I do agree with noselfwilling. the timing is right and also we should have a look at what is going on in the world today. Yes we humans do make our plans, but God YHVH still has to create everything. The fact of the matter is if you look at what the secret societies have planned for the future:

By Albert Pike—-

“The First World War must be brought about in order to permit the Illuminati to overthrow the power of the Czars in Russia and of making that country a fortress of atheistic Communism. The divergences caused by the “agentur” (agents) of the Illuminati between the British and Germanic Empires will be used to foment this war. At the end of the war, Communism will be built and used in order to destroy the other governments and in order to weaken the religions.” THIS HAPPENED

“The Second World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences between the Fascists and the political Zionists. This war must be brought about so that Nazism is destroyed and that the political Zionism be strong enough to institute a sovereign state of Israel in Palestine. During the Second World War, International Communism must become strong enough in order to balance Christendom, which would be then restrained and held in check until the time when we would need it for the final social cataclysm.” THIS HAPPENED

“The Third World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences caused by the “agentur” of the “Illuminati” between the political Zionists and the leaders of Islamic World. The war must be conducted in such a way that Islam (the Moslem Arabic World) and political Zionism (the State of Israel) mutually destroy each other. Meanwhile the other nations, once more divided on this issue will be constrained to fight to the point of complete physical, moral, spiritual and economical exhaustion…We shall unleash the Nihilists and the atheists, and we shall provoke a formidable social cataclysm which in all its horror will show clearly to the nations the effect of absolute atheism, origin of savagery and of the most bloody turmoil. Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, disillusioned with Christianity, whose deistic spirits will from that moment be without compass or direction, anxious for an ideal, but without knowing where to render its adoration, will receive the true light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer, brought finally out in the public view. This manifestation will result from the general reactionary movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and atheism, both conquered and exterminated at the same time.” SOON WILL HAPPEN

You can see how these things can unfold at any time. Just look at the things happening in the middle east right now….

But regardless of what people plan, God’s plans will always come to pass as was prophesied in the bible. He does use people to bring forth His plan he tells us in the bible. People can disagree as much as they like, but they can’t change Gods plans.

He told us very clearly that the sun, moon and stars are for signs, so we have to pay attention to these things that He has created.

About the 7 tetrads that has fallen on the Jewish holidays Tetrads, there is a clear pattern. When you look at the spacing of 48 years then 19 and then again late 19 and 48 years and the fact that there was a tetrad on 1948 is quite startling. Then the fact that when you add up 19 + 48 = 67, and again 1967 there has been a tetrad. The last gap of 457 years again ring bells as in 457BC Artexexer gave the decree to go and rebuild the temple and the walls. From 457BC + 483 years (69 weeks of Daniel) was when Jesus was anointed by God through the Holy Spirit.

Looking at this evidence as for signs by the moon and sun it is definitely something we should give our attention to.

He (GOD) wants us all to see this and it is not about doomsday, but about His Coming and for His glory. Amen

Since you can’t find a naturalistic explanation for the origin of the disciples’ beliefs, realize Jesus is God.

Since you can’t overturn the fact nature can’t start up from nothing nor always have existed, realize atheism is a lie. Because you would have happened already, having had an eternity to do, then realize nature needs a cause outside of itself, outside of time and space, and this is whom we call the uncreated Creator.

Whynot: Excuse me, but I found this to be an interesting assertion. How does anything exist outside time and space? For anything…including a prospective god…to exist, it absolutely necessitates both a time and a place to exist. Otherwise, you are merely stepping outside the comprehensible and the logical to promote the incomprehensible…which kinda explains the content of your prophetic meandering interpretations.

And another thing…exactly why is infinite regress not possible? I missed the part where you made a reasoned case for this assertion also. And there is also a naturalistic explanation for the alleged disciples beliefs, as well. It’s called cognitive dissonance. It comes from being spoon fed hypothetical religious hoopla 24/7. Since its already been demonstrated, both experimentally and in computer modeling, how in nature, very complex structures can emerge quite naturally from very simple chemical and/or other substances via natural processes, has it ever occured to you, (of course not, else I wouldn’t be responding to this drivel), that maybe your religion has missed the boat in explanatory accountability? I suppose, primitive man, looking around at all the complexity of nature would quite naturally assume it had to come from somewhere, and wherever it came from, had to be even more complex still…when in fact, just the opposite has shown to be the case time and time again. But it’s a reasonable assumption anyone, uneducated in the sciences, would make. It’s just not a good idea to ignore the evidence once its been dangled in your face.

Just read the first verse in the bible slowly and understand that when man said that everything that we know exists in time space and matter. It took man nearly 6000 years to figure it out, God stated it in the first verse of the bible: In the beginning (time) God created the heaven (space) and the earth (matter). I added the brackets for you to understand.

So if it took man that long to figure it out surely there is One bigger and Greater than us. Many doesn’t want to believe it but yet it is the truth, we can’t do anything without Him, as He is our Life and Strength…

Put yourself in the shoes of God for a moment. He chooses a nation of people from out of the world to begin revealing himself, and he chose them because they had an ear to listen, since they had suffered greatly, enslaved for 430 years. No nation has ever been enslaved for that long before. He makes a promise to them to believe in Him individually is necessary to be saved, but as a nation one day they will be the center of all nations from where God the Son will reign from in the 3rd Temple.

God wears shoes? That must mean that he isn’t an omnipotent supernatural being capable of forcing us to continue consuming oil at an exponential rate that will end in our ultimate demise at a time of YOUR choosing, as I’m guessing that you arrived at the calculation yourself; or did god actually tell you this? BTW, isn’t it interesting that the very people who created their god was promised by him that one day they would be head shed here on Earth? Ironic. And “god the son”? Why not god the father, or moreover goddess the mother? Athena was a hellova lot more interesting than burning bush guy and she only slaughtered the Amazons.

Just read the first verse in the bible slowly and understand that when man said that everything that we know exists in time space and matter. It took man nearly 6000 years to figure it out, God stated it in the first verse of the bible: In the beginning (time) God created the heaven (space) and the earth (matter). I added the brackets for you to understand.

We’ve read the Bible. Whole and in context. That’s the reason we don’t believe any of it. Nothing in it is consistent with reality.

So if it took man that long to figure it out surely there is One bigger and Greater than us. Many doesn’t want to believe it but yet it is the truth, we can’t do anything without Him, as He is our Life and Strength…

Nonsense. We’ve been doing things without the help of non-existent beings from the start. We’ve managed well without them and even better when we admit gods are a non factor.

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Question authority and think for yourself. Big Brother does not know best and never has.

Please note the dates of the posts. This was a completely dead thread for a couple of years until Aquizile (probably another name for noselfwilling) has tried to resurrect it. I think the argument is just as much a waste of time now as it it was in 2011.