The sealed version is smaller but gives up output in the midbass (60-120hz). With subwoofers and a 80hz crossover the differences are hardly noticeable however if you need a lower crossover point than you definitely need the vented versions. Quoted from JP

The Triple 12HT-lp is a sealed version of the Triple 12HT that is smaller in all dimensions. The Triple 12HT-lp is voiced to work well near boundaries (walls) or in baffles. Quoted from JP

The above is Jeff's comment on the differences. There is NO performance gain with the LP over the HT. It does not have less distortion or is not any more seamless at the XO point.

Thanks, I actually did see that post. I was a bit confused as to where it give up some output at 60-120hz, would that be at max output or at any volume level. I will register and post at the link you posted.

Not that I am aware of. A couple of the Cinci guys from AVS have had small GTG but nothing formal like what you see on these forums. Last year a couple guys came to my house and I went to theirs. I will say they are bass heads and for the first time had my system to reference... my HT is in the basement...daughter came down to tell me the front door was shaking from the subs. Once I get the new Noesis up and running we had talked about getting together at my house here in Cinci... probably in the Spring. If something materializes, you are certainly welcome over as well.

I would be very interested in coming up for a HT meet...

Can't seem to find enough guys down in East Tennessee that are in the forum. Just Dgage and myself.

Hey @carp, did you catch my post about a week ago about ARC? What do you reckon?

No I missed that.

Wow! That is exactly what I would want, because I like what Audyssey does down low but hate what it does up high. I would probably have ARC just EQ up to about 250 to 300hz and that's it, and that would be perfect.

There's room for a second S2 but not a third. The corner bass traps cut in to the width too much. The braces are modular so can be easily moved to add that second S2. But there's room for two S1 in the current structure.

Thanks, I actually did see that post. I was a bit confused as to where it give up some output at 60-120hz, would that be at max output or at any volume level. In will register and post at the link you posted.

The Triple 12HT-lp is +/-3db down to 65hz so the 212 would be the same.

The LP gives up a couple dbs of output in the 60-120hz range.

Base your decision off your HT room and personal preference (looks). Do not worry about performance lose or gain. If a car can do only 180mph vs 185mph I would not let that factor into my choice.

If there is no limitations then the HT would be my choice but I would not think twice if I had to go with the lp or would I consider it in anyway as settling for less or gaining more.
2 cents from
Chris

The Triple 12HT-lp is +/-3db down to 65hz so the 212 would be the same.

The LP gives up a couple dbs of output in the 60-120hz range.

Base your decision off your HT room and personal preference (looks). Do not worry about performance lose or gain. If a car can do only 180mph vs 185mph I would not let that factor into my choice.

If there is no limitations then the HT would be my choice but I would not think twice if I had to with the lp or would I consider it in anyway as settling for less or gaining more.
2 cents from
Chris

Thanks

My main decision right now is if I want the 228 or step up to the 212. I watch 90% movies, but may start listening to more music if they are as great as everyone says.

I am sorely lacking in the 80-200hz region with my current Emptek E55ti towers and E56ci center. I am sure either the 228 or 212 would be worlds better than either. I have to raise the XO setting to my sub to 150 to get any impact in this range. I want this to be my last purchase of LCR's for this system. The 228's will fit as is and I can afford them now. The 212LP's may fit. I would have to go with an AT screen setup to make the regular 212's fit. If I went with the 212's I would have to wait a few months.

When it is said that the 212Lp's give up a couple of db's to the 212's in the 60-120 range, is that just at max output?

My main concern over the 228 vs 212 is the 80-200 range and if I would lose impact with the 228's

My main decision right now is if I want the 228 or step up to the 212. I watch 90% movies, but may start listening to more music if they are as great as everyone says.

My main concern over the 228 vs 212 is the 80-200 range and if I would lose impact with the 228's

Thanks
Ray

There will be an impact difference between 2x8" woofers vs 2x12" woofers in the 80-200hz range. The 212 woofers are XO to the coaxial CD at 400hz while the 228 is XO at 1000hz.

Going from another brand to JTR can be a Night/Day difference but going from one JTR speaker to the other will not be nearly as noticeable. You can expect a performance gain with every $$$ more

spent on a different model/series of JTR speakers but will that be noticeable, needed, wanted, or even worth it?

That is decision we all have to make as there is no definitive choice when value is concerned. IMO a couple of months of waiting is not a lot to ask when speaking about lifetime or the last speaker choice.

This is a guess:
I think the couple dbs from 60-120hz would be at all volumes up to Max but it could be max output only. This can be negated with a higher XO.

My main decision right now is if I want the 228 or step up to the 212. I watch 90% movies, but may start listening to more music if they are as great as everyone says.

I am sorely lacking in the 80-200hz region with my current Emptek E55ti towers and E56ci center. I am sure either the 228 or 212 would be worlds better than either. I have to raise the XO setting to my sub to 150 to get any impact in this range. I want this to be my last purchase of LCR's for this system. The 228's will fit as is and I can afford them now. The 212LP's may fit. I would have to go with an AT screen setup to make the regular 212's fit. If I went with the 212's I would have to wait a few months.

When it is said that the 212Lp's give up a couple of db's to the 212's in the 60-120 range, is that just at max output?

My main concern over the 228 vs 212 is the 80-200 range and if I would lose impact with the 228's

Anyone in the Pittsburgh area have either if these speakers?

Thanks
Ray

The KC guys (Archaea and Carp) have done numerous comparisons between the 228 and 212 and posted their opinions. Based upon their takes, and Jeffs comments, there is a difference but it is a subtle one. A bit more resolution (detail) and less distortion with the 212. The 212 can play louder/cleaner but do you need that and, can you hear the differences? Good question ...

The KC guys (Archaea and Carp) have done numerous comparisons between the 228 and 212 and posted their opinions. Based upon their takes, and Jeffs comments, there is a difference but it is a subtle one. A bit more resolution (detail) and less distortion with the 212. The 212 can play louder/cleaner but do you need that and, can you hear the differences? Good question ...

What sub(s) are you using?

Thanks.

I am using triple PSA Triax's.

I did read those and they are helpful. I think I need to read through the whole thread, at least starting where the 212 starts to show up.

The "lp" version and "placement flexibility" still seems a little misleading around here at times. Nothing against your post Rob, as you are correct, they do offer more "flexibility" but only when you only have the option of really backing the speaker deep into a corner, or really have lack of space issues like under a screen for a center channel. In just about every other case, I would argue the regular 212 is better, and that the additional extension helps.

No knocks here like I said, it is just when you are placing mains optimally in dedicated spaces, the standard version will almost always be a better option in the long run. Even backing my old T12's into the corners, I never perceived much if any boomy behaviour from them, but YMMV. Keeping speakers at a good foot off from boundaries, the loading of the ported version will be minimal, at 2 feet or more, almost non-existent.

Based on what the KC guys said and talking to Jeff about the differences between the 228 and 212 I think I am going to go with the 228's as LCR's.

The price shipped to me with a 5% discount and offering the $1199 price still makes it about $500 less than I was thinking I would spend. I honestly didn't ever even expect to pay this much for LCR's - gotta hope the wife doesn't fine out.....

I think the 228's are going to be so much better than what I currently have that I will not miss the small differences noted on movies, especially if I go with a 100-120hz cross over like suggested several times here. If it ever comes time that I go with an AT screen, I could always move the 228's to the back and grab the 212's for the front. I never listen above -15 to -10 on currently so I probably wouldn't get the most out of the 212's. I probably don't listen that loud though because my current speakers don't sound very good past that.

I plan on calling and placing the order later today, man the month wait is going to kill me!!!

Thanks for everyone's help and sorry to be a pain with all of the questions.

Feeling the pressure...lol. I'd venture to say that Carp's most recent transducer purchase would be more tactical/fun than what my nearfield has to offer, but I'm looking forward to their feedback as well.

I'm sure this is subjective but I seem to much prefer the brute force strength of even 2 of my LMS 5400s compared to the transducers in the seat. It doesn't happen often but when the entire coach shakes, that is damn impressive. Of course, some that are on concrete slabs probably can't make that happen so in that case I'd probably go for transducers too.

Based on what the KC guys said and talking to Jeff about the differences between the 228 and 212 I think I am going to go with the 228's as LCR's.

The price shipped to me with a 5% discount and offering the $1199 price still makes it about $500 less than I was thinking I would spend. I honestly didn't ever even expect to pay this much for LCR's - gotta hope the wife doesn't fine out.....

I think the 228's are going to be so much better than what I currently have that I will not miss the small differences noted on movies, especially if I go with a 100-120hz cross over like suggested several times here. If it ever comes time that I go with an AT screen, I could always move the 228's to the back and grab the 212's for the front. I never listen above -15 to -10 on currently so I probably wouldn't get the most out of the 212's. I probably don't listen that loud though because my current speakers don't sound very good past that.

I plan on calling and placing the order later today, man the month wait is going to kill me!!!

Thanks for everyone's help and sorry to be a pain with all of the questions.

Ray

Good choice (even if you didn't go with my recommendation ) .

Don't be surprised if you find yourself listening louder at times. With these speakers, the louder they play the better they sound. But if you have more self control that many here, you will be very happy at your -10 to -15. Thats about where most of us are for day to day.

What differences would be expected? I know one is sealed, but with a 80hz cross over would there be a difference? The smaller size of the LP could possibly fit in my space, the regular 212 would not unless I went with an AT screen which I am not ready for at this time.

Jeff is a hard guy to get in touch with! I have sent several emails, a few phone calls and a few messages. What is the best way to get a hold of him?

I have 212HT-LPs and Coach has the 212HTs. We haven't put the two speakers side by side but I was able to go over and hear Coach's very nice system. In a double blind I doubt anyone could tell a difference between the two if properly setup. Meaning I think you could reach the same performance in a room with either speaker assuming the surrounding gear is up to similar standards. And of course with those speakers, based on reading, treatments would matter much more than which of those two speakers were in the room.

Based on what the KC guys said and talking to Jeff about the differences between the 228 and 212 I think I am going to go with the 228's as LCR's.

The price shipped to me with a 5% discount and offering the $1199 price still makes it about $500 less than I was thinking I would spend. I honestly didn't ever even expect to pay this much for LCR's - gotta hope the wife doesn't fine out.....

I think the 228's are going to be so much better than what I currently have that I will not miss the small differences noted on movies, especially if I go with a 100-120hz cross over like suggested several times here. If it ever comes time that I go with an AT screen, I could always move the 228's to the back and grab the 212's for the front. I never listen above -15 to -10 on currently so I probably wouldn't get the most out of the 212's. I probably don't listen that loud though because my current speakers don't sound very good past that.

I plan on calling and placing the order later today, man the month wait is going to kill me!!!

Thanks for everyone's help and sorry to be a pain with all of the questions.

Ray

I haven't heard the 228 but from everything I've read, the smile on your face after listening to your 228s will make you forget JTR even has a better speaker. It's like the Porsche 911 GT4 vs Porsche 911 Turbo (I've driven neither), there is a great price difference but not such a performance difference. Don't worry about it, just enjoy what you have, which will be awesome damn speakers to go with your awesome damn sub system!

The OS with it's 14 ft folded horn is "Another Animal" with few if any equals above 20hz. Multiple sealed subs may equal the SPL output but it would not have the Presence of the OS commands.
The OS creates a Unique experience.

Chris

I believe it...

I have a couple of sealed 15s from HSU and they each have a 1000 watts amp. I think it'll take 8 of those to equate the output of the OS...

Wait.....you guys x over your 228s at 100 to 120hz? And here I've been doing 60 and 80hz.

As stated already, 80HZ is the norm ...probably because THX stated that many years ago. I always used 80HZ until recently and bumped it up to 100HZ. I always felt (not sure why), that it wasn't "manly" to cross your sub that high but it works great. The question becomes what can cover the 80 to 100/120HZ better, your mains or your subs.