When Trans and Gay Culture Collide, Hilarity Ensues

May 25, 2013

Suzan Revah

Lesbians, feminists, and lesbian culture, heck women of all stripes have been under assault by anti-woman transgender activists for years in profound and violent ways. You can read a re-cap of some of that history HERE.

Gay culture, that is, gay MALE culture has basically supported trans politics, because trans politics are essentially male-centric and anti-female. Champions of women’s liberation gay men, like most men, are not. In fact, gay culture including gay lawmakers and political organizations often carry water for the anti-woman agenda of the trans movement. We see gay gentlemen like Tom Ammiano introduce transgender legislation designed to obliterate women’s rights with nary a consideration for how such initiatives impact the lives of women and girls, such lives being unworthy of consideration by gay men. We see appalling displays like gay activist/blogger Joe Jervis celebrating the “epic rant” of gay male assemblyman Daniel O’Donnell, who in THIS speech in support of removing women’s rights to sex-segregated areas away from men in public spaces where nudity is required (locker rooms, hospitals, etc), not only instructs women to just shut up about our rights, but claims he knows how women feel better than we do, ‘because several times throughout the day” he, personally, “feels like” a woman. Because males know what it “feels” like to have a body designed to (in addition to being fully human) produce ova. Apparently. Various times throughout the day. Ugh.

In short, females are of no consequence to gay culture, except perhaps our existence as coat hangers to display the outfits gays want to dress us in. Clay for the male creative expression of a male medium: femininity. Exceptions to the inconsequential female rule are the rare hetero female homophiles, formerly known as “fag hags”, who champion males who are gay and prioritize their needs and culture. An example would be San Francisco fundraiser Suzan Revah who has developed a career of sorts (writer, performer) as a self-described professional fag-hag who earned her bona-fides doing significant activism and fundraising for gay men during the darkest plague years of the AIDS epidemic. Women: No. Cheerleaders and /or caretakers with unfortunate vaginas: Yes. Go gays!

Females are of no consequence to gay culture because gay culture is male-centric and females lack the social and political power to have any impact on or relevance to male social structures which operate to protect male interests.

Gay men are not terrifically concerned about protecting themselves from an epidemic of female violence because no such epidemic exists. Gay men are not terrifically concerned with protecting themselves against an onslaught of female sexual predation because no such onslaught exists. Number of gay men concerned about female rape, forced child marriage, reproductive slavery: zero. Number of terroristic attacks against gay male gatherings by female transgenders: zero. Number of seminars hosted by Planned Parenthood for the purpose of heterosexual female strategizing to break through the “Cotton Ceiling” of gay male underwear: zero.

Gay males support the trans politic because the transgender movement is a men’s rights movement, one that they largely believe expands the rights of males to self-expression.

Trans and gay culture seldom collide, but when they do it usually occurs in a few ways:

Gay drag culture/female impersonation blurs the lines uncomfortably between the gay male theatrical performance of female subordination (femininity) for the gaze of other males -and the heterosexual trans culture’s political platform aimed at reframing and erasing female human oppression based on sex -by redefining our reproductive class as a male variant. In the trans politic females are redefined as anyone who is willing to perform (either cosmetically or via public testimonial) the subordinate role demanded of reproductively ova producing/gestating individuals.

Examples of this collision involve situations where heterosexual male transgenders take issue with a gay culture of female impersonation which is unattached to the trans politic. The gay cultural term “tranny”, invented to describe male performance of the conventions of female subordination, is a big sticking point because transgenders find the descriptor’s linguistic evolution as a gay male phrase undermines the trans platform due to it’s irreverence of their grave politic. A group of trans activists tried to hit gay icon Dan Savage in the head with a glass bottle at a speaking engagement for uttering the gay cultural term “tranny” publicly (even though he was just reading it off an audience member question card). More examples Here and here.

These complaints can veer wildly into conspiracy theories, and include the aims of some trans activists to re-frame homosexuality itself as a form of transgenderism due to the fact that gays fail to adhere to reproductively-based social roles (“gender”) by having non-reproductive sexual relationships. Shannon Minter, the “ex-lesbian” legal director of the (now anti-lesbian) National Center for Lesbian Rights theorizes that all homosexuals are in essence transgender and should be re-framed as such.

3. The childhood “correction” of gay males via the medical “Transgender Children” trend. The majority of male children referred for medical correction of noncompliance with social roles based on sex grow up to be reasonably well-adjusted (no longer seeking medical or psychiatric treatment) gay men if left untreated. When “treated” (with sterilization, lifetime drug dependence, plastic surgery) after pediatric classification as “transgender” the only option these gay men have to mature into healthy gay men is fraught with medical and social challenges. See here and here and here for examples.

The women’s and lesbian communities have been much more outspoken about the systematized medical homophobia involved in the transgender children trend, where children are being diagnosed as sex-role noncompliant as young as 18 months old. Are gay men uninformed? Or unconcerned.

As illustrated in the examples above, trans and gay culture collides only when hetero male transgenders take issue with gay culture. Gay male response to medical correction of childhood homosexuality has been slim, as has gay male response in general to collisions between the male trans politic and the male gay politic. Objectively this reflects an overall prioritization of men’s rights over homosexual rights in the gay community.

Okay… you caught me. I inserted a bunch of exposition there and none of it was funny. There is no hilarity that ensues when male sexual rights and male support of female oppression “collide”. Such a collision does not really exist. Also: not funny.

The only wrench that exists would have to be female one, right? What if that female was the biggest best champion and cheerleader of “the menz” EVER? Doesn’t matter. Fish is fish! And any woman: EVERY WOMAN is a wrench. Even when they’re sucking up. WE ARE KRYPTONITE to Male-ville by our very unfortunate (for them) inconsequential (for them) existence. This is fucking hilarious:

Even though I’ve been screaming about equal rights for LGBT people since I was a tweenage fag hag, I never imagined my fight for tolerance and acceptance would one day include waving the trans flag as my own.

I’m a grown San Fransexual woman proudly living in a gay man’s world, but I’ve routinely overcome skepticism at best and discrimination at worst. I’m still taken aback by just how long the road ahead is for true freedom of sexuality, gender, and identity.

I recently helped lead a march from City Hall to the Castro for the first-ever raising of the trans flag in San Francisco and experienced new appreciation for the struggle of those who, for whatever reason, choose “other” when faced with the binaries of gay versus straight and male versus female.

It’s human nature to try to categorize everything. It gives us comfort when we can neatly organize our chaotic world and messy political battles into more manageable labels and factions.

Still, I was surprised by how oversimplified the either/or dichotomy is when it comes to gender and by just how personal my common cause is with the T in LGBT, even though I readily “pass” as a “normal” RG (real girl).

Being “none of the above” or “all of the above” has always been a source of amusement for me, like when I travel to circuit parties outside of San Francisco’s bubble and am forced by security to use a designated “ladies’” room, instead of lining up with all my boys in restrooms that were functioning just fine as unisex by default.

Defying authority in those ridiculous circumstances raised my awareness of the absurdity of the enforced male/female divide back at home, in the gay capital of the universe, in what I’ve since determined to be the crucible of gender socialization: the locker room.

I’ve always felt excluded after working out with my boys. Why should I have to go elsewhere to shower? Especially when my separate and arguably equal elsewhere is the only elsewhere shared with individuals in transition. These brave individuals “present” as both male and female and everything in between, proving that facial hair and breasts can coexist quite peacefully.

It’s a curious conundrum, one I can’t help but question. My trans locker room buddies confide in me that they aren’t yet feeling prepared to inhabit the sexual intensity of the men’s locker room, while I’m trying to kick down the door so I can spend time seamlessly with boys I consider my closest girlfriends.

I’m confident in my ability to walk the gender tightrope with due respect, simultaneously breaking the ice and the gay glass ceiling, just as I have on several Atlantis cruises, at a couple of Black Parties, and even at International Mr. Leather. I’m merely acknowledging what now seems arbitrary, appropriately pushing the envelope of “the new normal” by advocating for a single unisex facility, just like those typically found in Holland. A modern-day interpretation of “going Dutch.”

Access to routine medical care is another area where I’ve been denied for being an “other.” Despite a lifetime of raising money and raising hell in support of HIV services, and even though I’m recognized by my community as an advocate for regular testing and treatment, I face rejection at my gayborhood free clinic when I seek the same free screenings that are readily available to my male friends. Meeting the clinic’s requirements for federal funding is apparently the issue, but seeking answers for why my female body doesn’t qualify for the benefits that are universal to males has elevated my consciousness about the issue of trans equality.

I realize that my perspective on identifying with trans is one of utter privilege. The rights I’m being denied hardly threaten my safety or my life chances, but the barriers I encounter are nevertheless real and unfair. It’s because I get away with so much as “that girl who loves her gays” that I feel compelled to voice my discontent so fiercely, and to be so unladylike in my push to break down boundaries.

For the record, I don’t intentionally try to have it all ways. Because my grievance isn’t with people so much as with the powers that be, I politely decline when chivalrous gay gentlemen invite me go ahead of them in line for the bathroom. I’m heartened that many of these gay gentlemen are equally as appalled as I am upon learning that my vagina prevents me from getting free HIV test results in 15 minutes on every corner like they can.

My comfort zone has certainly been put to the test in instances where I wasn’t sure which pronoun to use when addressing someone or couldn’t quite understand the logistics of gender presentation in certain contexts. But I’m choosing to embrace the awkwardness to help surface the struggle that is right in front of us, testing just how open and liberal “the left coast” really is.

Trans rights are without a doubt the next frontier in the gay civil rights movement, and I’m seeing that the time to rise up has already come. As a person who presents utterly female yet identifies completely as a gay male, I fight on the front lines of trans and wonder why a community represented by the rainbow isn’t yet making room for the many shades of gray.

Hahaha! WOWZA. This woman has devoted her life to the welfare of gay men. She has raised a shit-ton of money for gay men. She “identifies” as a gay man in (an un-medically “corrected”) woman’s body. Because trans activists claim jendur is a personal identification she assumed that she as a female had a right to “identify” the way she wants! Hahaha. She naively thought that trans activism was about broadening rights for all, including female individuals. LOLOLOLOL! She thought trans rights was a freedom movement! Lololol. She thought trans was about equality regardless of sex! Hahahaha! She thought “trans women” (hetero men) give a shit about hiv testing OR ANYTHING AT ALL relating to women! Hahaha omg. The poor dear. She failed to frame trans as a male rights movement! Hahaha! She used the (albeit sexist) gay male framing for females and referred to herself as a “real” (albeit juvenile) female! Lololo! THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FEMALE HON! Haven’t ya heard??? Tranny swarm! Kryptonite Alert! Female Speaking Alert! Female voice saying words alert! LMAO.

This woman could not be more male-centered, male-identified, obsequient, compliant. She wants nothing more than to kiss some trans ass. But: female reality! Oops! Wrench!

And TRANS ARE PISSED!

Men who “identify” as lesbians ARE LESBIANS according to trans. Any fucking straight dude. But a woman who “identifies” as a gay man? HATE CRIME!!! LOLOLOLOL.

Lmao the comments. First comment is from hetero dude who describes his jendur as “Faggy fag fag fag” Red Durkin. This is the guy that told lesbians and women that we should not be able to have lesbian gatherings or women’s spaces without him, because feminism is old and feminists have been going on about women’s rights, for like, forever. He tells Suzan she cannot identify as a gay man in a woman’s body.

Also featured:

Tess Yardney of the Leeway Foundation, which formerly provided artist grants for female artists but now grants them to anyone willing to embrace cultural sex-based tropes enforced upon ova producing humans. Tess took place in the targeting and assault of lesbian feminists at NY Dyke March. Tess says females who identify as gay men are not trans on the basis of personal testimony alone (need cosmetics) and mocks the AIDS activist for complaining about the difficulty of women to obtain HIV testing. Oh yes she did!

Jen Richards, straight man behind “We Happy Trans” says that females who self-identify as gay men should s.t.f.u. about showering with males and also s.t.f.u. about HIV testing! Haha!

Gemma Seymour-Amper, the violent child-support-defaulting dude that somehow found the funds to stalk Michfest Women’s Festival with a ten-foot knife/spear opines that there is no such thing as a female person and the very notion offends him. Also mocks difficulty of women to get hiv testing, offended by female desire for free hiv testing. Weirdly compares lack of female hiv testing with murder rates of transgender: “You go on with yo’ bad self, Miss Thing, complaining about how you want a free HIV test. Just don’t even get me started on the 300 or so trans people worldwide murderers put in the ground last year. Their ghosts are, I am certain, far less forgiving than I.” WHAH?! Crazy man is crazy!

Jenna Friscetti : compares Suzan to Travis Bickle (?) WOW CREEPY.

T-“Girl”- Middle-aged heterosexual male physicist with massive facial surgery and originator of the term “lady-stick” for his “lesbian” penis Savannah Garmon complains that his editor Red Durkin has been maligned by complaining that self-identification is not enough for trans if it involves gay men.

Tobi-Hill-Meyer, heterosexual male son of lesbian activist parents that used him as a pediatric media figure in the fight for gay rights, now a pornographer and “male lesbian” who markets his dick as a fleshy sperm spewing lesbian strap-on (Hahaha!) shows up expressing his delusion that women who cannot obtain hiv testing can do so if they properly “identify as” male, and that Suzan has simply failed to do so. (WTF dude?! Get help!)

Dana Lane Taylor, fetishistic sexual crossdresser for years, plagiarizer of GenderTrender posts celebrated by reformist “radfems”, who now claims to believe he is actually female, complains.

Autogynophile Dana Lane Taylor posting pic of his sexay manboob

Daryl/Sophia Banks, too emotionally labile on cross-sex hormones to maintain his photography business and who sometimes grows out his beard cause he can’t deal with the whole female thing and who tries to comment on GenderTrender impersonating Cathy Brennan, also claims that women cause trans male violence by responding to it in an unfeminine way- offers his opinion that Suzan’s Op is “horrible”.

Monica Roberts, who calls females “fish”, calls his dick “a six inch neo-clitoris”, once threatened murder of a lesbian feminist and believes that radical feminists control his internet offers his view that women in non-medically corrected female bodies who identify as gay males are “Bull feces”. Claims Suzan’s trans identification is false. Can’t make this shit up.

One commentor screen caps Suzan’s FB page which identifies her as “female” as a great trans “gotcha” that her identification as a gay man is inauthentic and not truly trans.

Katrina “Remember that Raven album?” Rose accuses the Advocate of being paid by GenderTrender. LMAO!

And on and on. Usual suspects.

One thing is for sure: Suzan will be “re-educated” and drop the whole gay thing and the whole “female humans exist” thing if she wants to be an effective trans shill. Odds: 68%

This is brilliant, Gallus Mag. Thank you so much! Putting this all together sure shows how much men hate us, whether het men pretending to be women and Lesbians or gay men. You make it absolutely clear.

We are betrayed on so many levels, from our “Lesbian” organizations, like NCLR, who put men and everyone else first, to the many Lesbians who continue doing benefits or volunteering for men with AIDS. Even after dying Lesbians were kicked out of the Shanti Project, and while gay men have SO much more money and privilege than Lesbians (especially in the SF Bay Area), and when AIDS is basically an avoidable STD, Lesbians are still focusing on helping men and ignoring dying Lesbians. A gay man who told me that gay men would never have helped Lesbians if we were dying like gay men were, also told me how gay men ask him to give them AIDS. Women devoted to trannies is part of the same male-worshipping at women’s expense.

Mainstream het culture also actively pushes lesbians into the gay male culture, lumping us all together.

Yesterday there was an event called ″Life Ball″ in ″my″ country. I have no idea if that is known to anyone outside probably Middle/Western Europe, but it is THE gay event here (right next to the CSD) and intended to raise money and awareness for AIDS prevention and victims (organised by a gay man). It is colourful, flamboyant, with a lot of cross-dressing, like cirque du solei on speed gone ballroom. Also it is famous for their international guests – Bill Clinton comes every year, but they also had Oprah and other US stars.
Yes, Bill Clinton, the unconvicted rapist. Kind of unconvincing.

Yesterday the motto of the ball was ″1001 nights″. Nobody had qualms about how this motto might be just that tiny bit inappropriate; I will not even start about the cultural implications, but I want to point out that obviously nobody bothered to realise that those are not nice stories: Sheherezade is ultimately a woman who has to talk down a serial rapist and killer.

But who cares! A lot of costume opportunities (belly dancing!), and they even shipped over the actress that played Jeannie in I dream of Jeannie. She wore her pink costume, and as the radio moderator said with this endless admiration in his voice, ″it still fits her!”
Because nothing says AIDS prevention like the pink costume of a magical house slave to an obnoxious military man.

Anyway, for years I’m asked by krethi and plethi why I’m not attending the Life Ball. I’m asked by family, friends, and passing strangers – whereas neither of them can find it in their hearts to call me a ″Lesbian″. ″Homosexual″ is the word to go by. It is half Greek, half Latin, so it probably is more posh than this old stupid label ″Lesbian″ that sounds so shady.

And because I’m a homosexual, I’m supposed to go to the Life Ball. Never mind that I am too female, too Lesbian, too ugly and too poor. Homosexuals have to attend the Life Ball. ″Because that is what people like you do, don’t you?”

(Gallus Mag: If this is too OT, please delete. I don’t mean to derail from your great work, thanks)

IceMountainFire: That’s an interesting comment. Why would Gallus want to delete it? And why do women spend so much time apologizing about stuff? That’s one thing I’ve been thinking about lately, how conditioned it is for me to apologize…especially when a man disagrees with me, even on fine points. I’m making my own point to stop apologizing unless I’ve actually done something that hurt someone. But it’s hard, women are soooo trained to automatically apologize.

The transactivist community, to the extent that they don’t constitute trolls, is trying to get gender dysphoria catalogued in the DSM as something that isn’t about being crazy, but is still in the DSM, because they want gender reassignment covered by medical insurance. Sort of like a birth defect, or a deeply hardwired developmental disorder, like autism.

And it may well be the latter. Social conditioning can run deep. It’s the idea that brains, and thus personalities, are somehow hopelessly gendered, and thus the body must be medically altered to meet the personality, that is so worrisome. I gather that transwomen run unhappy, they kill themselves a lot. Sometimes they manage medical gender reassignment procedures, they still kill themselves a lot. This doesn’t sound like a cure to me.

Meanwhile, there are all these trolls running around with pink mohawks carrying on about how they are “really” women, when they’re not threatening to rape us.

I don’t like gender essentialism. It has a lot of manifestations. I don’t like any of them, including “Men are inherently violent.”

But part of that is that I don’t like the TG rights’ gender essentialism, because that’s what it is. Cross-gender essentialism is just the acorn not falling far from the tree.

Gender role social conditioning is a terrible thing. I’m not too interested in any efforts to undermine just how vicious it is, including any backdoor efforts to reinstate gender essentialism and guilt-trip women into accepting it, into giving up all we’ve fought for, because, again, men have needs. In this case, they need to be women.

That must be difficult, when it’s real. But since they aren’t women, it’s unlikely that women are the best people to ask for help. Especially feminist women.

Hi Gallus,
Long time reader, huge fan, first time commenter, and gay male.
It’s difficult for many to form a real opinion on *any* topic because of the mass media campaign of disinformation, cognitive dissonance, and promotion of the Me-More-Bigger-Now American mentality. Add Big Gay, Inc. to the campaign of disinformation and you have a total clusterfuck of ideologies.
Many gay men might say they are onboard with T ideology (“they’re women/men if they say/feel that they’re women/men), but this is a reaction to their own experiences with discrimination and their need to be “politically correct”, which they believe means that anyone can do anything they desire and no one else can judge (WRONG!) They just want to be nice to the nice Ts. However, when it comes down to starting an intimate relationship, gay men want the peen. The REAL peen, and nothing BUT the peen. So, so much for being FULLY onboard with the Ts.
I try to do my part in educating my peers. Most are totally unfamiliar with the stories, events, and characters you expose here on your blog; you radfems are WAY ahead of everyone else in the T discussion.
That said, I heard that blogger Joe Jervis shuns away from T stories on his blog because previously every time he posted one, the T activists came out swinging, calling everyone who disagrees with them the usual slurs (bigot, “die in a fire”.) And there *were* folks who disagreed. Tellingly, when he occasionally posts a T-centered story (usually about T legislation) there is now basically the sound of crickets in the comments section (which can, for some stories, generate 100s and 100s of comments.) My point being that the Ts have actually shut down any discussion or dissension on the T topic on what is considered to be a very liberal blog.

Anyway…. I just wanted you to know I am out here, listening, agreeing, doing what I can by raising awareness. But it looks like a long road ahead.

What you brought up about Jervis staying away from T stories due to the trans shrieking and bullying – I notice it’s happening (once again), albeit in a smaller way, at Feministe right now. Veteran activist and blogger Daisy Deadhead posted something a couple of weeks ago inviting people to comment on the recent kerfuffle (to be polite) at the “Law and Disorder” conference. She had the sheer audacity to wonder why trans activists go after radical feminists so much, when it’s not radical feminists who are actually out there harming trans people. Here’s what Daisy said:

“I react pretty strongly to defacing books or otherwise rudely rousting politicos at a table because it has happened to me many times; harassed by bikers at outdoor festivals for lefty literature, jeered at by fundamentalists at Occupy, and so forth and so on….So, I asked, what IS hate speech and how should we handle it? One’s person’s hate speech is another person’s Gospel (literally!), so what should we do in a pluralistic society that values the First Amendment?

Aside: I used to warn radical feminists that their eagerness to call everything (such as porn) ‘hate speech’ would some day come back to bite them in the ass, and here we are.

Increasingly, I am puzzled by trans activists’ fixation on radical feminists (whom they call ‘radscum’). Why not focus on fundamentalist right wingers who are far more numerous and say the same things? More to the point, the radscum do not seek to deny GLBT equal rights or try to keep folks from transitioning; they just argue (endlessly, relentlessly) about the physiological and social meaning(s) of “woman” and “female”. The Christian fundamentalist Republicans think trans people should be forced to use their birth names on their drivers licenses and if they don’t, locked up in mental institutions and/or arrested for fraud. Who is worse? And who has more power to enforce their prejudices?

Why not go after the REAL scum?”

Well-hellhell. Now, I don’t agree with Daisy on several things (obviously), but I gotta give the woman credit – she’s out there marching against Monsanto when I, well, wasn’t. In an extremely conservative part of the country, she’s not afraid to use her voice to fight for progressive ideas and causes. The woman’s got guts. She does, however, accept the whole trans thingamabob at face value, like a good liberal thinks they should.

But even Daisy had to question what went down at that conference. She linked to this post of hers at Feministe’s Sunday post-links-to-your-blog, and now the usual commenters there (MtT “Donna” L, namely) are having a fit, calling the post – of course – transphobic. They are telling her she’s just another “cis” woman (gag) telling trans people how they’re “doing it wrong”, and on a so-called feminist blog, are saying that the attack on the Deep Green Resistance women was justified and correct. Of course, none of the mods at Feministe have the stones to stand up against this, because they’re complete chicken shits, even at their own damn blog. So in essence, they’re condoning the censorship of and violence to women. Damn, with “feminists” like that, who needs MRAs?

So yeah. Even the most benign questioning of the trans politic, even within the lesbian, gay, and progressive circles, tends to end in trans tantrums, screaming, threats, etc. The upside of this is that more folks are seeing the misogyny, appropriation, and pure delusion that is all part of the trans “movement.”

Thank you very much for posting the information about Daisy Deadhead. When someone as liberal as Daisy can start to see past the lock step opinions demanded of her as a born woman by men in dresses, it gives me hope.

“Aside: I used to warn radical feminists that their eagerness to call everything (such as porn) ‘hate speech’ would some day come back to bite them in the ass, and here we are.”

How disgusting and woman hating can she be? This is disturbingly similar to telling a rape victim she “asked for it.” I’ve read her blog before, and she has absolutely no concept of feminism or how it intersects with combating racism-and then when people call her out on it she pulls the whole “just a poor country girl” routine. Apparently because she lives in an apartment with *gasp* real live black people, that means she can’t possibly be racist.

I agree with all your points, AA. I think an interesting question can be-should radical feminists ally and support those women who are attacked by transactivists? I’m thinking about people like Daisy and Renee (womanistmusings), who disparage radical feminism at every turn but no matter how much proverbial dicksucking they do, a transactivist isn’t satisfied.

@ Monika – mmm. Agree. I’m in a group with a so-called ‘feminist’ leader who says that Patriarchy is, you know, nasty, but we have all had previous lives as men so we are equally responsible. I wasn’t sure whether she’d had too many drugs in the 60s or was just basically stupid.

Well, I think I finally understand now: FAB’s, WBW, “real” (by which I mean real) women, etc. are really the only group on the face of the earth that CANNOT POSSIBLY be oppressed. Ever. Under any circumstances. We’re just not oppressed. And apparently ftm’s who don’t get surgery have it better than mtf’s who don’t.

I feel like I’ve walked into opposite land. Up is down, etc.

Reading Bev Jo’s comment is heartbreaking. No one else is going to fight for us, but we will fight for everyone else. Just tragic.

As a gay male, yes trans has always been more connected to our community than the lesbian’s. Gay men historically felt pity for these men “trapped in women’s bodies”, note that these were self-hating gay males like us back then, now the majority of trans are het male fetishists.

The fact is het men cannot be lesbians and het women cannot be gay men. I had a rather odd experience online where a het women who identified as a gay man was bemoaning us “fags” and “fudge-packers” because we happen to like dick. But alas, gay men aren’t afraid to ignore these fag-hags like Suzan Revah and they don’t really cause any threat to us other than the odd complaint of vaginas in the bathhouse. I’ve never seen any real support for fag-hag “gay men” like the support for these nasty straight men masquerading as lesbians.

Drag is generally a misogynist caricature and I don’t like it, but it really isn’t much different to males calling themselves women (in fact at least drag-queens don’t call themselves women), trans activists have a knack for attacking people like Dan Savage and feminists like Germaine Greer.

And lastly I am sick of trans activists criticising us because we focus on our own issues. I don’t think trans should be discriminated in employment, service etc. but neither should they erode the rights of women.

The usual comments from the trans-jacktivists just illustrates once again how full of shit they are, complete with their double standards. Wasn’t twanz the originator of the claim that if someone SAID they were something other than they appeared then, by deity-of-choice, you WERE that identity?

Oh wait…that only holds true if you parade around as a caricature of stereotyped sex roles…

Just had a discussion today about Michigan with a couple of lesbians who had no idea the trans were threatening women with rape, breaking into the place, bringing weapons like spears on the land. So this news isn’t getting out there.
And unlike fag hags, who might be annoying in gay male bathhouses, fag hags can’t rape or beat you up with their superior muscle mass, the way a six foot tall ex-marine male to trans can.
These men threaten us with rape and death all the time. I remember one time at a lesbian bar, and this giant male to trans came thumping through and kind of shoving past the dykes, just the way gay men used to literally knock us down on the street because they weren’t seeing lesbians, and would RUN INTO US and knock us down. Until I started fighting back and carrying a big stick to make THEM move out of the way, so that I had my part of the sidewalk. The “T” have pretty much hijacked any lesbian and gay objection to the whole charade. We’ve had to deal with drag queens and their womanhating “blackface’ for decades. So offensive to women, but they do it anyway, and are so obnoxious and attention getting, that they are the opposite of real women. Women listen and are gentle, men are domineering space hoggers in my opinion.

This blog is getting out the truth, and the truth might just win out. Political correctness is horrifying to lesbians, because lesbians then don’t serve each other, and that keeps us very poor. We don’t have the resources to get drained away by trans causes or gay men still being dumb with STDs, and as Bev Jo’s friends said, gay men never would have stepped up to help the lesbian community had it been hit with AIDS back in the day. They’d have stayed home and let us die, just as they are doing today when we face rape, the trans rapist invasion, the erasure of butch lesbians, nah, they could care less.

I can assure you that significant numbers of gay males – especially those who are now pushing 50, hence are survivors of multiple holocausts – resist the imposition of transgender on the legitimately constituted gay and lesbian community. We fully support sex-segregated spaces where needed for safety or modesty, among other reasons. You don’t hear much from us, but we exist. Please understand you do have some friends among gay males.

I appreciate your saying this, and I appreciate your support of women.

I’ve heard it said that there are basically two types of gay men: The sweet and caring ones, and the misogynistic (often aggressive) ones. Misogynistic gay men literally have no use for women — not even a degrading use such as straight men might have.

I’ve known both kinds. One of my dearest and most admired friends is the sweet kind, who supports his female friends and genuinely cares about their well-being. My brother is the nasty kind. I’ve known my brother all my life, and he is a relentlessly hateful person who thinks he’s better than everyone. And while he champions equality when it comes to race, religion, or sexual orientation, he has always been a misogynist. I’ve known this since I was a toddler, and he never grew up.

I think all the gay men who think like Joe should start speaking up in real life about the trans threat to women’s and lesbian’s safety worldwide. Take them on, stick your neck out. Right now only radical feminists are doing all this heavy lifting, and if they can go for us first, you’re next.

My friends and I do what we can. You might be quite surprised at the comment sections at Xtra.ca, for example. I am pretty sure everybody in this burgh knows I am anti-transgender at this point. As I recall, there are entire blog posts about it.

I’ve always been a feminist, and also somebody who is very open to all viewpoints, so please understand I’m not challenging the writer here, I’m really just curious about your view here, and I’d like to hear more from anyone who would care to enlighten me. Anyhow, here’s my thought-the point of feminism is to undo the damage caused by living in a society divided by gender lines. I totally agree that women deserve the same status as men, that’s just common sense. The desired outcome of all of this is just for us to be able to get on with our lives without needing to worry about these things, the right to earn as much as men, and to be treated like human beings when walking late at night.

The transgender community is certainly flawed, but almost all activist communities are-femminst included. I don’t think that a trans-woman who is not able to pass for female should use the womens bathroom, but if she looks like a woman, and feels like one, then I think that it is her right to be who she wants to be. I do think that gender dysphoria is a disorder of sorts, but people who decide to transition to alleviate it really aren’t harming anyone ( except for a few, rare cases). The idea of “female” being some exclusive club is just as sexist as the world we need to contend with already, and if equality is really the feminist prerogative, then people who don’t fit in the traditional view of gender (i.e. working moms, professional women, or transgender women) deserve equality. My impression of what it really means to be feminist is to defeat the oppression of a gender binary society, and if we are all of a sudden deciding who other people get to be, then we’re not accomplishing anything. I just think people should be able to live their lives, and as long as nobody else gets hurt, it’s their right to do so. I’ve always seen gender as something flexible…anyhow, I really would like to know exactly what your rational is here, because I am actually a bit intrigued by it (you certainly seem passionate about it) and If anyone would bother, I really would like to know what exactly you believe and why you believe it…

What kind of man posts to a feminist blog using a female name and telling the women to explain feminism to him to save him the trouble of actually reading the things they say? YOUR kind Daniel.
Sir, if you’re “actually a bit intrigued” by feminism you would be reading the things feminist write and say. Not trolling. So. Either stop lying or start reading. Thanks.

What the hell are you talking about? How the hell am I am man? Maybe I’m a big scary man, trying to hunt you down on your blog.

Or, maybe my first name is Danielle, which I hate because it is simply a reduced male name, and all of my friends call me by my middle name, Lisa.

Maybe I had to change my email address a week ago because I have just escaped an abusive relationship, and I’d rather not be followed around by the bastard. Maybe I forgot that caps don’t show in an email address, and that DanieLKolodkin does not work, and I have not had time to fix it with everything else going on in my life. So I would appreciate it if you would not just snap the moment you see something that you think might bother you, because Maybe I’m just asking these questions on account of a friend of my who spent last night crying on account of your blog, and i’m just trying to make sense of it all. You want to use a different email? I’ll post it to a different email. I’d appreciate it if you would find the time to engage in a civil dialog rather than attacking me for a facet of my personal life I’d rather not publicly flaunt.

If you are just going to attack and bite me over something you don’t understand, please please please don’t bother, but if you actualy want to fill me in about why this blog is what it is so i can figure out why a close friend of mine almost killed herself last night, and decide for myself what is right, then please just listen to what i said and not to a god damn clumsy mistake I made while creating a temporary email address.

Lisa: you are putting a fair amount of time into writing comments here, for someone who doesn’t have enough time to look around and do some reading about what this blog is about. After all…here you are!

“people who decide to transition to alleviate it really aren’t harming anyone”
The key word being “decide.” All those children who are being chemically “treated” (really, physically attacked) for being too different or too gay didn’t “decide” to have this done to them.

Francois: kids consent to the treatment, and the puberty blockers supposedly are safe (famous last words) but the final cross-hormonal treatment destroys the immature gonadal material, leaving these kids sterile. I had to dig through the NPR articles about Spack some to find that. If they are doing this to kids under 18 it’s illegal, and also the medical conventions about gender reassignment say it’s all supposed to be reversible. Chemically sterilizing teenagers is not reversible, and chemically sterilizing non-gender conforming kids who likely have been terribly bullied and also confused by the media, who are likely to otherwise grow up to be homosexual adults with intact healthy bodies, is akin to genocide.

mieprowan, you seem to be somewhat confused. You both claim that it’s consensual and that it’s akin to genocide. The former cannot possibly be true: a 12 year old cannot consent to have their puberty be chemically attacked, especially after years-long pressure from their parents to do it. Get real!

Francois: they cannot legally consent to anything until they are 18. Their parents have to do it. Children who are afraid of the onset of puberty because they are being socially marginalized for being non-gender role conforming may welcome all of this. But my perspective is that they are in some way being scared into it.

mieprowan, children cannot consent to treatment. Their parents are consenting for them. In the case of young women, there are surgeons who will cut their breast tissue out at the age of 12. Hormone blockers for both sexes start at puberty which can be around 10 years of age. There is discussion about when to give the opposite sex hormones which will chemically sterilize the child and create the appearance desired by the parents. Right now, you must be age 15.6-16 years of age. If you are overseas, that age can be lower.

I know of one set of parents that is saving up to take their son to Thailand and have him surgically altered at age 16.

These children are being groomed for these processes. (One mother even claimed that she knew her son was really a girl at the age of 5 months!!) If given hormone blockers and hidden in an identity of an opposite sex for years, 100% of these kids will transition. If surrounded by a supportive family and not pushed into a gender role, only 20% of gender non-conforming children will transition. Of young males, many will grow up into gay men. Some will be straight men. But not if we cut them up in the confusion of gender roles as sex.

“a friend of my who spent last night crying on account of your blog”
Why would anyone cry on account of this blog? Trans people just hate it and strike blindly at anyone who supports it, normal people don’t care, and feminists support it. Maybe this person just read something that resonated with them personally, regardless of the actual contents.

I am just curious to know what exactly it is about this blog that is supposed to be making people cry… unless it is crying of compassion for all the children who are being physically abused by these “treatments.” But it doesn’t seem anyone ever gives a shit about children’s rights.

The line that I hear parroted by the trans community when I question their philosophy: “I suppose you believe that gender is a binary. Gender is a spectrum.”

And yet, I see precious little spectrum supported by the trans community. I see demands to rigidly conform to harmful stereotypes. I see people split into two buckets and demands to force compliance.

The stories above, two of them are individuals who are basically interested in exposing themselves to members of the opposite sex for some rather dodgy personal reasons.

The other three cases are children. Children who are being told that there is something medically wrong with them. That their outer appearance must be surgically altered. That they cannot be the sex that they were born in because they don’t adhere to gender stereotypes. That the world will not accept them if they don’t hide their real sex, take drugs to halt their maturation, and proceed to surgical alteration of their bodies to help hide them. Condemning them to spend their lives living out a lie. The very idea of this breaks my heart. To know that they are being led into this trendy movement based on some of the worst, badly constructed scientific theory ever created is a tragedy beyond words. This is our generation’s lobotomy movement.

The lead story in this article is an example of a woman who wants to extend her gender spectrum right into the men’s locker room. That is not a place for gender theater. That is a place that is segregated by sex. But I find it rather grimly amusing that the trans community refuses to accept her gender presentation. They certainly accepted Alexis Starr, who’s only possible claim to woman is that bad wig he was wearing. Perhaps Suzan Revah just needs a good flannel shirt to claim her gender identity and gain her that coveted pass into the room with the naked men.

You can change your gender presentation in a moment. Sex is not mutable. Do not conflate them. They are not the same. Your sex is not your gender. Work to eradicate harmful stereotypes of gender.

Whatever genitalia you have, whatever thought processes you have, it’s a valid combination. Full Stop. The entire IDEA of there being some “matching” arrangement between brains and bits is bizarre to me.

But that’s what all of the trans* ideology is based on. I don’t see them wanting the two rigid buckets to go away at all – they just want to be “assigned” to the other one.

The problem is that the trans* ideology absolutely REIFIES the gender binary, it doesn’t subvert it at all.

In order for the various origin stories (“I was born with a female brain in a male body, because hormones!” “I always felt like a girl, since I was four years old and preferred “Dora the Explorer” to “Cars” “I think my kid might be trans because he won’t play rough and tumble games and only makes friends with girls”) to work, that means that there must be some existing bright line between the “genders” that has nothing to do with internal identity, something ideally physical and testable, that line has to be real and enforced, so that you can find yourself “on the wrong side of it” and have that tested and officially recognized so that you can “fix things” and meanwhile never find yourself called just a gender-bender.

As a woman, that is extremely very much not okay with me. I don’t believe in the “female brain,” which means that I necessarily don’t buy the origin stories, I don’t buy that someone can wake up one day and somehow think they “think like a woman.” Once you can’t buy into that narrative, the entire thing falls like a house of cards.

When you talk about the female brain or insist that I should have some deep-seated feeling of “innate gender identity” (I don’t! Neither do plenty of the commenters here who have commented to say so, I’m not the only one!) you’re telling me, as a non-trans woman, that you have some preconceptions of how I must think, how my personality must be, who I AM, because if you didn’t have such a preconceived notion, how on earth would you “recognize it” in yourself?

That’s why the entire ideology is problematic.

Meanwhile, if someone with a penis wants to wear a dress or sincerely engage in behavior that is often stereotyped by society (read: men) as “feminine,” that’s fine. We should be free to be, you and me, all that. (And in particular, men should not be beating up other men for failing to uphold various “masculinity” standards.) But you don’t need to go around claiming to be women, is all. Because that is appropriation.

And “sincerely” is important. All the blogs about “here’s how to walk if you want to pass as a ‘woman'” are something else entirely.

Truly challenging the gender binary (as I agree that feminists want to do) means giving up this idea of innate gender identity, and saying that people should be free to behave as they want to, without needing to claim someone else’s demographic status (read: sex class) to justify it.

Being female (why the fuck are you putting it in quotes?) isn’t a club, it’s a biological reality. Female isn’t a gender, it’s a sex, you fucking imbecile. One cannot EVER change their sex (ie. XY to XX). Go back to school.

There are some mtf transsexuals who are nice people. I have no problem with them. I have no objection if anyone, whether he identifies as male or as trans, wants to wear a dress and makeup.

But, first, that doesn’t make you a woman. Dresses and makeup are not what define femininity. No amount of surgery will give you a second x chromosome or functional ovaries. Claiming to be a woman when you’re not is trying to argue with biology. If you want to play dress up and pretend, well, that’s your business, but don’t ask me to pretend with you. I believe in science.

Second, allowing the harmless mtf people into women’s spaces is a slippery slope, and we’ve already been to the bottom of it. Many Ts want to eliminate gender distinctions altogether, so that there no longer are women’s restrooms at all. Mr. Colleen Francis likened separate locker rooms to segregated drinking fountains, as if there were no difference at all. If we allow anyone who identifies as female into women’s spaces, next we decline to require that they be post-op, or that they identify EXCLUSIVELY as female (“hey, today I feel like a woman, even though yesterday I was a macho man!”), and we start having perverts donning wigs and dresses to sneak into ladies’ rooms for their own perverted gratification. This has been documented several times. The worst part is when it comes time to prosecute, they play the “trans” card and suddenly have all of political correctness on their side.

IMO it makes a lot more sense for the trans people, who are well under 1% of the population, to just suck it up and use the restroom that matches their natal anatomy, rather than inflict discomfort on the 50% of the population who are just living their lives and not trying to corrupt science. If those men in dresses are so terrified of being assaulted in the men’s room, they have the option of wearing men’s clothing and being the men that they are. Women have a harder time not getting assaulted just going through life even when we wear men’s clothes, not don’t try to earn pity points with the “but men will rape us” line. You’re telling us?!

What the hell are you talking about? The ONLY reason I bothered to try and figure this out myself was because I thought you deserved a chance to say your part before I condemned your beliefs. You can’t be reasoned with, can you? I could send you a picture, call you on the phone meet you in person and you would still say I’m a man taunting you because you cannot ever admit that you perceived something to be wrong. I thought you were just a poorly informed woman who could try and understand that what she said could be hurtful. Screw you, screw your whole blog, and screw anyone that bothers to listen to this bullshit. Some people actually feel insulted, very insulted by what you say as it makes its rounds, and I hope that you someday find out what it feels like. You are so far removed from logic, from the real world and real problems and the real truths that people face. You are a bigot, an asshole, a poor writer, and anyone who follows your creed is either a fool, a hate-monger, or both.

So next time one of your friends tries to cut her wrists, don’t bother to reason with the bastard responsible. I learned my lesson. I am so, so sorry I waisted your time. You’ve made up your entire mind about me on account of the fact that my email adress looks off. You can go fuck yourself with a gloved finger. Probably the best an asshole like you will ever get.

Transwomen do have a high rate of suicide and other forms of self-damage. The idea here seems to be that if we’d just be more supportive, this would stop. If one tries, however, to suggest that the whole idea of deciding one is a transwoman is reactionary and, well, not good for you…then it’s STFU and rape threat time.

Daniel is a very young gay man barely out of high school, possibly autistic, and definitely confused about gender in today’s society. From his posts above, you can surmise that he’s identified as effeminate for a long time, and has just recently discovered the trans movement. The trans movement has done what they always do with the young and impressionable –made it look glamorous to appropriate the opposite sex role. And downplay the very real damage that the hormones and surgeries do to your body –not just the physical but the damage to self-confidence that hiding your sex all the time does.

I don’t see threats made by him here, just the sound of a young man hitting an alternative viewpoint and trying to abide by the rules that he’s learned from another community. He’s gotten insulting, and yes, it’s because he sees his worldview being attacked.

Daniel, people can have opposing viewpoints. I think you were on the right track earlier in your life when you felt that it was ok to express yourself in the manner that makes you happy. Becoming Lisa will not make you happier because you worry too much about ‘passing’ and have already noted the trans community’s lack of a sense of humor. Crazy people don’t have a sense of humor. You don’t strike me as crazy. Be free to be Daniel and wear whatever you want to wear, for goodness sake.

The people on this blog have dealt with threats of violence from the trans community for a long time. They’re pretty trigger happy when a trans comes on the blog comments and demands that an entire viewpoint is changed because the commenter thinks they are offering the true way. Then you used a couple of four letter words to defend yourself.

I’ve got no problem with your gender spectrum. I’ve got a problem with you appropriating female because you’ve learned it’s the only way to show a different gender spectrum is to hop onto the other side. We don’t really have rules for bending gender, just rules for appropriating gender.

Brimming with white male entitlement and queer sanctimoniousness, you thought you’d give the little ladies a “chance” to speak before setting. us. straight! Telling us (many of whom are, if not old enough to be your mother, then your freaking grandmother), how “real life” really is! What the “real truths” are! You’d tell us, wouldn’t you, Daniel? Never mind the fact that so many of us have decades more worth of life experiences than you – and most posters here have lived all those years as women (’nuff said), and/or in the lesbian and gay community (with all its politics, lesbian-ignoring, and trans tantrums).

You also couldn’t be bothered to read any other posts at this site to see what we’re on about. Too much trouble, you say! Too time-consuming, whines Daniel! Instead, you want (well, basically, demand) an explanation from the women (“I really would like to know what exactly you believe and why you believe it…”). Just so that you can then use whatever is said to you to go off on some pre-conceived, patronizing, vainglorious rant to set the women straight! ‘Cuz if we only listened we’d agree with you!

Then you get angry and pouty and insulting when we react to your arrogance. You go on your blog and whine about how “you triiiiiiied to be nice!” to those mean radfems, but they just shut you down! And they “stalked” you! Oh, the humanity! (BTW, you should reconsider your use of the word “stalked.” Talk to any woman who’s been truly stalked. Grabbing a picture from your blog? Not stalking, Daniel).

What, you didn’t think we’d see that coming? What, you didn’t think we have dealt with this before? Oh, little boy, little queer boy, you have much to learn. Go now. Go learn. (After throwing yourself diagonally across your bed in a fit of pique, of course. First things first! RESPECT to the melodrama!)

P.S. If your “friend” exists, the only person responsible for him cutting his wrists is himself. Not any website. Grow the fuck up already.

P.P.S. to Gallus and the sane folks here: God, this reminds me of this.

Jesus, I just realized that the subjects of the two links I put in the above comments are probably both as foreign to Daniel as when my mother starts yammering to me about Fibber McGee and Molly, for Chrissakes. Poor kid. Next time I’ll try for something more recent. That’s a disadvantage of age: one may be getting smarter (if one is living right), but one’s repetoire of pop culture references starts to go back a little too far, depending on the audience.

I know, Moss, and thanks for the reminder. It’s just a sore spot for me when someone half my age thinks they can waltz in and tell me how life really is. When I’m dealing with someone older than myself, I make a point of it to respect their life experience. And respect them, too. Just ‘cuz. (Unless they’ve done or said something completely egregious, of course.) Anyway, thanks for lettin’ me know.

LIsa, you’re an idiot and a man, wanna go for strike three. Good god, grow up. The suicide threats are boring, trite. There are real women in real situations–real. Women calling out a man’s bullshit does not make them hate mongers. It says–we are of value. So cut the crap with the twisted tales of woe and your poor friend that “almost” killed himself—seriously do you really imagine that women are going to just fall into fawning and pity? How stupid does it sound–read something on GT and committed suicide. Is the drama of faux emotion a turn on? Does it get you hard to imagine that threats of suicide and attention seek behavior are just like real women do. Let me dissuade you of that notion. Wanna die? Fine go ahead. Who the fuck cares. Trans want to use children to play their pathological games with, to gain some kind of social legitimacy and public sympathy–well that my friend will backfire because sooner rather than later these kids will realize what has been done to them and they will turn on you boys so fast your heads will swim. Now is that hard on you get from the heals, fishnets and wig worth children’s lives? If yes then stick your head in the oven now. Oh and you asshole have a whole future of abusive relationships ahead of you because you are abusive. “Female” is not an exclusive club it is a biological reality. And why the hell should I and my daughters pander to some guy that “feels” like a women because he has a mental illness? Why? Because we are nice. Well we aren’t that nice. Because what he “feels” is more important that our reality–Dream on sir.

Motherhood: this business of transgendering teenagers has a huge potential to result in the kids suing their parents later on in life, to a great extent because it sterilizes them. The idea is that they can pass better if docs interfere with the normal process of sexual development, so the kids don’t develop secondary sexual characteristics. So they’ll be happier in bodies more like those of the gender identity the culture has somehow gotten them to think they “are.”

I spent some time reading about transgender issues over the last few weeks. Never really thought about it until the DGR hassle in Portland. The more I read about it the more appalled I am. And sad. Bad craziness everywhere. And lesbian feminists getting the worst of it right and left. This angers me a great deal.

mieprowan, I never thought about the transgender issue at all until Colleen Francis started haunting the women’s locker room with his penis exposed. And I walked into this blog and asked how we could find a compromise that wouldn’t lead to the destruction of women’s spaces and yet would protect gender identity rights. I was gently told to educate myself.

I did. I read everything I could get my hands on. I read both sides of the fence. I read the medical studies and became appalled at the poor standards that brain organization theory uses to construct a study. (There’s not even a clear definition of what masculine/feminine are! How do you propose a study when you don’t have a standard to measure?) I read feminist theory. I read anti-feminist backlash theory. I read MRA theory and positions. I read books on how to help your transgender child. Yes, I read Whipping Girl and even subjected myself to the (Vogon) poetry of Joy Ladin and Joelle Ryan.

And over a period of time, I came to understand that there is no real compromise possible. The trans community wishes to force everyone to become players in their fantasy that they are really members of the opposite sex. Gender non-conformity such as what we call butch dykes and effeminate men are not tolerated by the trans community. They are incomplete transitions because they stubbornly cling to their birth sex.

There is no compromise possible. When you try to discuss it rationally with the trans community, they hurl abuse and threats. And most mainstream people don’t realize that you no longer need full genital surgery to change your official sex on documents like your driver’s license or birth certificate. What is coming is the unisex facility. In a culture that views women through the lens of porn.

I’m a fifty-five old woman who is light years away from all of that stuff espoused by transwomen who want to be girls with hourglass waists and repressed genitalia, who appear to be working on becoming Miss America as their ultimate goal. It’s like we’re being invaded by the 1950’s.

Hi Miep, we apologize because we’re trained to apologize. I apologize for everything. Even if it isn’t my fault at all. Like blundering into someone who is coming through the same door you are at the same time. I’ll apologize. If it’s a man, I notice that they don’t bother to apologize to me. Women? We apologize to each other, usually.

That’s the socialization that we got. We’re trained to take a secondary role. And smile. I get ordered to show my teeth a lot.

It’s only a small point in her text, but:
“[…]advocating for a single unisex facility, just like those typically found in Holland. A modern-day interpretation of “going Dutch.”
I’m Dutch, and believe me: unisex facilities are not the norm at all here, except at home! In fact, I’ve never seen one in bars/restaurants/swimming pools/spas.
The Netherlands are not a genderless utopia by far.

Lisa feminism is about the liberation of women from male supremacy. It is not about equality with men, because their standards are way too low. We want liberation, we want an end to male tyranny, and we don’t want rapists or potential rapists in our bathrooms or shower rooms. What’s so hard about this?

(So far) she has not damaged her body with surgery and testosterone, and

She’s honest enough to call herself a Fag Hag, which the Kathlyn “Stephen Ira” Beattys of the world are too chickenshit to do.

She can probably find some sort of social scene in San Francisco.

Other than that, sad, sad, sad.

All the gay men I’ve ever known are all about the dick, 100%. In fact, pretty much ALL men, gay or straight, base a major part of their personal identity around their dick. This is one reason I totally cannot understand the F2T’s who are willing to accept the current state of transition surgery where they really can’t get anything resembling an actual penis, and yet they’re paying thousands of dollars for this. I bet some of those doctors are laughing all the way to the bank.

This story reminded me of the sad story of author Poppy Z. Brite. For years, Poppy (born female) has “identified” as a gay male. Many of her fictional stories contained very believable gay male characters. She wrote some fine fantasy/horror fiction as well. I had long thought of her as an original human being who thought for herself. Not anymore. Poppy (now calling herself Billy) has now jumped on the transwagon, and she seems to be pretty much devolving in a downward spiral that is sad to see: not writing any more, obsessed with her “transition,” delusional, depressed, and angry over the fact that she gets “misgendered” and is not welcomed as a male in gay male spaces.

yes, trans crowd does hate gay men as well. saw this a lot on tumblr about six months – a year ago with a user on there called “gaynotqueer” who was ex transitioner. saw him cop a lot of hate mail, but at the same time not half as bad as what any of the radical feminists on there got.

15 years ago, barely out of my teens, I was an even bigger asshole than I am now: I can’t remember what the argument was about, but I was debating some subject or another with a woman online (a perfect stranger).

She said something to the effect of “you’re only saying that because you’re a guy / male privilege exists / hence you’re a patriarch and your argument is patriarchal.”

I fired back, “oh no, I’m trans!”

She immediately fell on her knees and apologized profusely. She then retracted her previous statement as utterly inapplicable to not just me as a person but the argument I was making as well (and “cis privilege” didn’t even exist in language yet.) Even as an *asshole* I knew that the dynamic was fucked up. I knew what I was doing, what I was taking advantage of — and no, not the pain of “weal twanz,” but of women’s socialization.

What I did was indefensible. At the time, I figured, hey, I’ll be a dude when it comes to radical feminists who treat all males as dudes. But if some hipster pre-Feministing type wants to give *some* dudes the benefit of the doubt — dudes I knew for a FACT are much more sketchy than me — and include them as full members of their community, why exclude myself from that? Why not identify as trans when interacting with women who held politics that supported such a thing?

Then I grew the fuck up.

Suzan, if you ever read this, yes, there’s absolutely a double standard. It doesn’t make sense. If we fuck up “sex vs. gender” we’re redneck idiots; if they do it, it’s because everything is a fluid spectrum. Only people within the in-crowd are able to choose their identities.

You know how zombies know to never try to eat each other’s brains in the movies? It’s like that. Trans can smell crazy on each other. And by crazy, I mean totally batshit-wackadoodle insane, not needing Xanax or whatever to survive in this fucked up world. (I know there’s no way to say that and not be accused of neurotypicalism: But hey, no one in my clubhouse is scavenging dumpsters for used tampons to shove up his ass.)

Trans can also sniff out when it’s not there.

They know when a sane person starts talking about gender. It’s like a clarion call to them. And they are compelled to immediately shine a light on that sanity and call it insincerity. You can’t fool them. They’ll know. Always.

This is why they believe “cis-women” can tell the supposed difference between males with “laydee brains” and dangerous “cis-men” who might put on women’s clothes (despite having male brains and even skin cells that are somehow intelligent enough to abhor the thought of it) to more expediently violate women.

Trans absolutely *believe* themselves to be able to tell the difference and thus think women are silly and stupid for not being able to duplicate that feat.

They don’t realize that their method (their affinity for fellow insane, like-attracting-like) for spotting “imposters” is flawed and not remotely suitable for women’s purposes. Some males who hurt women are crazy. Others are normative as such violence is normative in our society. So what use is transdar (affinity for crazy) in sorting through all of that? None.

Excellent post as usual, and the business with Lisa was hilarious and well-handled (also as usual) enough to get me thinking about something.

Recently, I stumbled across a blogger– whose name I won’t drop– who was a sad example of the transupporter, which might as well be the modern fag hag..

She easily and mercilessly articulates the horrors of the misogynist aspects of society, calls on her readers to shut down rape jokes and the like; acts like a dang good feminist– until someone brings transpolitix into the mix.

Then, it’s all long, inane ramblings about how the genetic existence of two generally separate physical sexes isn’t real, and how if a guy says he’s a woman then he is and no WBW has the right to take it from him.

It just hurts to see someone who is so close to fully grasping the truth drop it in order to not exclude a bunch of creepy old men and confused angry teens playing dressup.

I actually see this a lot. I have some dumb jendaqueer friends who recognize sexism and misogyny, but there’s always this blind spot when it comes to trans shit. Once a man puts on a dress he is one of us, apparently

“The sciences are being held back by assumptions that have hardened into dogmas, maintained by powerful taboos. I believe that the sciences will be regenerated when they are set free.”

News for you is there are a lot of men on this planet. You aren’t going to get rid of them or retrain them by dancing like a man hater for your fellow bigots. You and your performance , trying to reinforce the stereotype of lesbians as man haters are wasted. And here is the bigger picture, those women out there ~? You dont speak for them. And that constantly invoked image of some man in a dress leering at women in a washroom? That’s you. It’s you who prey on women , that leer at them in the sanctity of their washrooms. Penis, no penis, it doesn’t matter, you prey on women. he penis is in your head! To have you try to invoke some sort of “We are all together unity ” when you are the real wolf in sheep’s clothing ?! Fascinating isn’t it.

I have lots of gay friends who I really love, who have nothing to do with you or your predators instinct. You and all those males hunt the same thing dont you ?! Women? You have more in common with men than I ever had. Your desire to scapegoat anyone but yourself for the way society treats women is astonishing. Your life is not my fault. Your failures are not my fault. Your being a lesbian is not my fault. I am not judging you or your life because I don’t know you but I will not be judged as a group because you sure don’t know me.

The LGBT has nothing to do with your sexuality, or my gender. It has to do with equality. That is all! So your rants are just the personal rants of a bigot who blames everyone else for their failures in life. And that is why you will fail. Oh you may hold the attention of the lazy and unhappy ranting against some vague “common enemy” . Bring up wacky trans activists you manage to wrangle into a rant but in the end , all you are is a bigot. Have a nice day.

DB

P.S. Ashly Love speaks for herself, not this community. I have just as much of a problem with trans bigots as I do with lesbian or gay bigots.

You know, as a hetero female who has been happily married for several decades, I don’t worry about the lesbians in the bathroom with me. Women don’t rape each other. Men are the rapists.

You really show that you’ve never been socialized as female at all. You don’t fear rape. There’s lip service that trans fear rape in the bathroom if forced to use the same facilities as men, but you show that you don’t really believe it.

If you think that men are going to stay out of the women’s bathroom and you can be in there with the women as your special honorary-woman self, then you’re mistaken. The men will crawl in just for the thrill of it. Sex offenders will go through two years of low dosage estrogen just to get the F on their driver’s license and stop the estrogen after. In Colorado, you can’t even get police to question skeevy pervs in the bathroom now because it might offend their gender identity.

If the trans community has it’s way, we are suddenly thrust into unisex facilities everywhere.

Really! Soooo you are saying , if women HAD a penis they wouldn’t rape, because the last time I looked it’s kind of requirement to actually rape someone. Or maybe it’s because the term has been tailored to men. Lets try “molestation”

You know what’s interesting about most women predators? If you look at the background, there’s a man back there somewhere that abused the family in unspeakable ways.

Women are capable of sexual abuse. But if you examine the cases, you’ll see that they are a tiny percentage of all the sex abuse cases. Women are not socialized to things like porn the way men are. And that social training to dehumanize the other sex is key to abuse.

That and the belief that the abuser is more important than the person abused. Women are always socialized into a secondary role in society.

I’m evidently striking a nerve because Darrell is pulling out his MRA guns to go after me.

The public bathroom debate is huge. I’ve read long outraged threads about who is messier, men or women. (I will note that I personally do NOT pee on the seat).

This appears to be overall a greater issue of concern for most than who is looking at whom, assuming they aren’t doing it from under stall walls or through door cracks.

I like public bathrooms with solid lockable doors. Barring that, it would be nice to have stall latch mechanisms kept in repair.

I used to live in Venice, CA. The Venice and Santa Monica Beaches had public bathrooms, and it was like bathroom bigotry. Up by Santa Monica, there were stalls with doors. The next set down south had stalls without doors. When one got to Venice proper, no stalls at all. Venice Beach was where people were living outdoors, or in vehicles.

I always wondered what message that was intended to send. IV drug users steal stalls so they can’t shoot up in private? Seems unlikely. More like “you street trash don’t deserve privacy or protection when you use public services.”

Usually when doors are absent, it’s because there has been some trouble in the restroom and the county is trying to avoid that by eliminating privacy. Wide stance and drug use sort of issues. That kind of thing. There’s probably also regular police patrols to pop into the restroom and make sure that no one is committing a felony in there. I’ve been pretty unimpressed with Santa Monica beaches too. The urine smell on the street in Santa Monica is pretty bad. Not as bad as San Francisco streets, but not very wholesome, either.

Europe has bathroom stalls that have completely enclosed spaces. We don’t have that in the US. We don’t even have stalls that are truly private since there are gaps all the way around the doors.

It’s done that way so that bad things can’t be done in bathroom stalls as easily.

Oh and one more thing, had a room mate who came home from work one day and told me that a transwoman started at her job that day.”How did you know it was a transwoman ?” says I . “Because she walked and talked like a man” says she. “Oh I says “Then it is a lesbian says I . “No way!” says she , “they act just like a man!”. “Lesbian” says I. Next day she comes back from work and says “You were right, how did you know?”

“Transgenders dont want to be perceived as a man so they make an effort, dykes are men who dont bother to hide it. ” says I.

You don’t know many real lesbians, do you? No wonder your type seems to think that you can break through the Cotton Ceiling.

Not all women who adopt more alpha postures at work are lesbians. Since this lesbian was gender bending, she had to be a man? No. She still isn’t a man. You just can’t seem to get that. Women are not men, no matter what social presentation. Gender is a social presentation. Sex is a biological fact.

News for you. Buck Angel is not a man. Buck Angel is a woman with body mods who is still filling a stereotyped female role by engaging in porn. Would she cause a stir in a ladies’ restroom? Probably. She’s engineered her whole presentation to shock. But she should be in the ladies’ locker room. Because she is female. And there isn’t a peen there.

If I can handle Buck Angel in the ladies’ room, you can just take your peen-bearing self off to the mens’ room. The penis is the ultimate in un-ladylike attire.

Does it make you feel more validated when you call real women “men”? That is truly sad. See, most women don’t have to prove themselves by mimicking stereotypical feminine behavior. Only someone who is compensating or insecure with their “identity” obsesses over trivial bullshit like that.

“a person who only understands woman through femininity is a man” says I

Also while we’re sharing fun little tips. you know how I can always tell a transwoman? It’s the cheap glamor shot icons. always a dead give away.😉

Ah yes. Another version of “you have what I desperately want and you don’t even CARE enough to properly use it/take care of it!! How ~unfair~!!! I deserve it so much more than you do!!” trope.

I’m reminded of some old posts over on the transabled forum where they were making comments about seeing some actual paraplegic people at the doctor’s office show up in beat up chairs with stuffing coming out of the cushion.

WTF??? Lesbians are preying on women? Lesbians ARE women, and are far more reluctant to approach women than women with men are to approach Lesbians. Lesbians supposedly being like men goes back to Fifties Lesbian-hating. “Darlie” seems to have been reading too much porn made by men for men, fetishing Lesbians or he would know that Lesbians are about as far away from being like men than any women can be. Which is not easy growing up in a world full of male propaganda.

As we said in “Dykes-Loving-Dykes,” men have made Lesbians be the scapegoats for male crimes.

But, hey, lying and projecting is what the trans cult is all about.

EqualRightsandProtection said it brilliantly: “Transwomen are actually creations of our porn culture. It’s fetishized and ritualistic in nature.”

Yes ,many lesbians prey on women just like their penis baring male counter parts. Really , I see men when I look at many of you. You sound, walk and talk just like men. Hence my friends mistaking one of you for us. Where do you think all transmen come from ? The lesbian community of course. Isn’t that funny! Laugh it up! It’s hilarious! Wasn’t Chaz a lesbo first ? Oh wait , you dont recognize him as a man either right ?
YOU ARE EXACTLY LIKE MEN! You dont wear bras ( your tits tucked in your belt, now thats a female look) you let your facial hair , armpit hair and leg hair grow just like a mans, you cut your hair short, wear pants , talk like man, masturbate to women , I mean if it walks like a duck, its a duck right ? ! You aren’t far away at all !!!!! You re exactly like them , just as arrogant and as sexist! What you think , that minor genetic difference makes you a woman ? Convince yourself.

Transwomen existed long before the porn culture , just as transmen did. Oh bullshit, lesbians love pornography, they create enough of it. It’s utterly boring listening to any o you trying to deny women have a sexuality.

You really need to stop embarrassing yourself. We get it…you’re insecure and jealous and thus take your anger out on real women. It’s obvious. We aren’t threatened by how well you perform femininity, heck you can have all that fake girly crap. lmao. We simply don’t feel the need to prove ourselves as women by adhering to socially constructed ideas of male and female behavior. I’m so sorry to let you down, I’m sure that’s liek…a mega blow to your fragile little ego.

but please born me some more with your complete lack of knowledge about lesbians. I love when men mansplain lesbians to me, makes me giggle.

though nothing will be more hilarious than men thinking cosmetic surgery and pretty dresses and make up suddenly make them experts on womanhood. You may “walk the walk” but you still talk the talk of a man. but whatever… you keep feeding that delusion if it helps you sleep at night.

“Lesbians are like men! Are TOO! They’re allowed in the ladies’ room! Why can’t I get in there too! I prey on women the same as they do!”

I don’t even think you really are hearing how you’re framing this argument, Darrell.

“minor genetic differences” ? LAWL

Sex is biology.

Your next move in the trans deck of cards is to pull out intersex biology and claim that since there are people born with ambiguous genitalia, all fetishists should be allowed in the opposite sex bathrooms and locker rooms.

Heh. I’m an actual woman through and through despite the odd beard hairs of middle age (which I’ll happily admit most of the time I can’t be arsed to bother with). I’m sure that just burns you up, doesn’t it?🙂

@Ashland- sometimes I find it challenging deciding when to draw the line between letting these guys speak for themselves and boring the shit out of everybody. “Darlie” has now started a blog called “Lesbimen” about how all gay women are actually men- transgender men, natch. I kid you not. I got the pingbacks. Not gonna link to it tho.

And as for Catholic priests molesting young boys, there are more coaches and schoolteachers than priests that have molested children over the years. Pedophiles always move to positions of authority over children. Like Dr. Spack’s fellow endocrinologist. Or Jerry Sandusky at Penn State. Or Rick Curl. Or Walter Roberts.

Notice something interesting? Most of them are men. There are women that do abuse, yes, but on the whole, statistically, it’s more likely to be men. Wonder why? Wonder, wonder….

So, have you started coaching a girl’s softball team yet, Darrell? Sounds like you might have the right stuff. You seem to be awfully interested in preying on women.

Anonymous radical feminist: people who are obsessed with their genitalia to the extent that they don’t ever stop thinking about their genitalia, aren’t likely to stop being obsessed thusly just because they arrange to have said genitalia grotesquely butchered and reassembled.

I’d really like to see more people here saying “Hey you, young man, you with the carefully styled hair dyed magenta, you in the porn photo looking totally like a girl, except for your dick…You’re just fine, dude. It’s okay. Nice dick. How about you don’t cut it off?”

And I’d even MORE like to see gay men addressing their brethren thusly.

Nothing wrong with dick. Dick is part of life. Yay Life!

As Rachel put it in the video, we’re not afraid of your penises. We’re just terrified of your socialization.

Let’s all play a game it’s called Lets All Be Adults And Learn To Accept Everyone For Who They Are. Unfortunately, this world isn’t set up like a Barney the Dinosaur movie. There are always going to be people that hate people because of their differences and gender. People are always going to go against others opinions and choices because they don’t agree and take offence. That’s life. The world needs people who respect others differences and opinions.

They can go play dress-up all they want…but I refuse to accept males trying to legislate biology out of existence and I refuse to accept males insisting on being granted access to female-only space.

If the twanzjacktivists were serious about “trying to be adults” then they would recognize that 1) it’s okay to be an effeminate male, 2) biology matters and 3) that our opinions with regard to their intrusion on our space is NOT some sort of ‘transphobia.’

But, true to form, the men try to dictate how things will be and the opinions of women are set aside since they don’t matter.

Regarding point 3, I don’t get how defending women’s spaces can be seen as transphobia, given that women defend their spaces from plain old straight men as well, and also from gay men and bi men and queer men and little boys and animals and everything except women and girls. So, either women are everything-except-women-and-girls-phobic, or they are simply rooting for women.

Is it so hard to imagine that women may want or need spaces for themselves because it’s good for them and not because they’re against someone else? Apparently so.

The thing about that is, if you state the truth that women are people born with female anatomy and two x chromosomes, then you are being hateful or phobic by denying the pretense that the trannies are actual women too.

That hurts their feelings, and they assume that it’s solely because you are bigoted/”transphobic” that you would say such a thing, and not because, you know, you believe in science and reality or anything like that.

Absolutely. But the trans community is not respecting the boundaries for actual biological women. They are the ones encroaching on our spaces. In most cases, the encroaching ones are doing so with bad intent. Kosilek. Francis. Pine. Stevens.

And the trans community certainly doesn’t respect those who gender bend without professing that they are actually the opposite sex.

Also, this whole post made me re-think my relationship with men and especially gay men. I think I have been naive and stupid. My partner, who has had relationships with men and transwomen, is far more perceptive to male BS than I am.

I saw myself as quite a strong woman, but realised I have apologised too much, acquiesced too much, tried to be fair too much with people (men) who are just baiting you on-line.

It’s all socialisation and it’s very, very strong. I’m ashamed for not being stronger and amazed at the way I’ve acted, although it didn’t take long for the realisation of : ‘Who the fuck do you think you are? And.. ‘I’m being trolled by a thick git who has also been outed on his own website as a sex offender’ to kick in.

It’s very difficult to realise it’s internalised within you, too: to be nice, to lower your head a lot, to try to make things ‘nice’. I’m not sure we can make things ‘nice’ for men politically. I think they need to sort themselves out by themselves. There are a few good ones🙂 John Stuart Mill. My Dad.

Thanks.🙂 (wry smile). Time for a ponder.
Actually, time to do some boots on the ground work and get politically involved.

“Anonymous radical feminist: people who are obsessed with their genitalia to the extent that they don’t ever stop thinking about their genitalia, aren’t likely to stop being obsessed thusly just because they arrange to have said genitalia grotesquely butchered and reassembled.”

This is something that fascinates me almost as much as “lesbian bed death” (lesbians who can’t sexually function). If one were “obsessed” why would one “butcher it” ? For example, except for dykes or christians ( fanatics all ) whining on about it without even seeing it, no one ever calls it names other than “beautiful”, Mmm go figure. My men have LOVED it , in every way possible. Every single way. Ten minute orgasms, wooo. I bet most of you haven’t even had one. That may be the missing component.

You should talk to Fallon Fox’s dyke girlfriend. “She is a woman in every sense of the word”. Aww the traitors huh ?!

You know how republicans go on and on and on about gay people till they get caught in bed with one .. . . . . . I think thou dost protest too much.

I also find it humorous that I’m the only one here using their real name yet you all use the word “real ” like you have any credibility.

Real biological women know that using their real names (though yours seems made up, no?) and photographs of themselves (especially photographs emphasizing their breasts) on message boards and blogs is an invitation for male creeps (like you!) to harass and stalk them.

Oh lordy yet another dude whining because the mean women just won’t use their real names online! And post hundreds of sexay pics of ourselves, like Darrell here! Honestly, how are the twanzjacktivists supposed to be able to stalk and harass us if we won’t help them?!

Darrell you stupid shithead. If you were a woman, you’d know why so few women use their real names online. But you’re not, so you don’t. You’ll never understand it, Darrell.

Also, re: “lesbian bed death” – this does not mean what you think it means.

Yes your little porn drenched brain is running away on you again. Hahahaha–your men. Your real name. See my vagina, not different than any other womans (not to be confused with a blind pouch fuck hole that requires chemical lubricant) is complex and nuanced. The secretions change throughout my cycle when I am ovulating (that means the ovary releases an egg that travels down the fallopian tube) and can be met by a sperm and fertilized–that would be a pregnancy if the egg attached to the uterine lining. When I am not ovulating the consistency of the secretions are varied based on all sorts of things–such as arousal. But how can that compete with your john having a 10 minute orgasm–which I btw as a life long heterosexual woman don’t believe and either does any lesbian. But hey porn rules your life–not mine. I have actual sex with an actual human who has actual genitals–and who actually exists in real life. As for credibility–you have none. These men I bet they want you and only you to be the mother of their children. You’re a sick man–get help.

I use my real name, fuckwad. I’m also a butch dyke with the guts to walk through the world dressed as I please, not caring a whit if you males don’t like the way I walk and talk and cut my hair. I’m not girly, but I’m a *woman*. And that makes everything I say and do *womanly*–something you can never be.

Many women (myself included) are capable of getting there even faster than that, but choose to postpone it because sex is supposed to be savored & enjoyed, not a frantic rush to ‘get it over with’ like a morning visit to the loo. But you wouldn’t understand this because you’re A MAN behaving like a man with a man’s sexuality. All of the lipstick & black lace nightgowns from Kmart will never change the fact that you ARE NOT, and never will be, a woman. You are simply a pathetic, salf-hating gay man. Everything you’ve said here is nothing but a bunch of crappy, reactionary, gender conformist bullshit from an episode of Leave It To Beaver.

Ten minute orgasms? Yes. Keep telling yourself that.
The actual ejaculation period for a male is a few seconds.
You can feel blissful and happy after that and most people do.Males and females can also extend the high and intensify the feeling by taking amphetamines.

Also, one of the chemicals released during orgasm is oxytocin. Woman get flooded with it during childbirth.
And endorphins get released during exercise (and the high afterwards, holy crap) and whilst you’re in love.

Frankly I’d much rather go for a run than ever have to be relegated to having sex with you, or anyone like you.

My first 5k was better than any sex I’ve ever had with a male, it was far more productive too. : )

I’m not sure I even WANT a “ten minute orgasm”. Maybe I do. That seems like a very long time. And the yard needs raking. I also don’t want to enjoy eating delicious chocolate for an hour. I guess I’m no fun.

After I read Gallus’s comment, I thought; what would it be like to sneeze for ten minutes? Then I Google searched for “longest orgasm.” I liked the part about how the researchers found their studies so tedious they could barely stay awake.

With all these distractions I forgot to address the actual topic of this post, the article at The Advocate. I don’t have much to add to Gallus’ fantastic post, except that the cognitive dissonance on display both in the article and in the comments was mind-blowing. They go on and on about appropriation this, barging into our spaces that, without anyone ever seeing the irony. Once again on this blog, with gusto: un-fuckin-believable.

I am a gay man and I hope that you will permit me to comment. Although I think that Gallus accurately identifies the areas where gay culture clashes with “trans” culture, I think she gets it wrong when she tries to describe why gay men side with trans activists against the interests of women.

IMO, it isn’t because they don’t care about women. Siding with trans activists isn’t just against women’s interests, it is against our own interest as gay men. Trans activists do indeed attack gay men all the time. They attack us physically, as happened repeatedly to Dan Savage, who had a large glass jar thrown at his head by a trans activist. They make threats against and harass gay filmmakers like Diego Luna. And they thwart and undermine gay civil rights at every turn. The trans blogger Gallus cites above, Katrina Rose, has called for the defeat of marriage equality in Maryland and refers to gay people with the kind of dehumanizing language you might see on a neo-Nazi site. Rose is not alone in this.

Most significantly, by demanding that every single gay rights measure be coupled with “gender identity” provisions, trans activists have caused all LGB people, including gay males, to lose many opportunities to win their civil rights. This occurred recently with ENDA and in a disastrous local vote in Anchorage Alaska. The Anchorage campaign, which was funded by the transjacked NGLTF, was so proud that it ran the first “transman” in a TV ad. But the result was that an expected win was converted into an 18-point loss. After a 35 year fight, LGBs are left with nothing, largely because the LGBs running the campaign were convinced that no civil rights were worth having unless they covered heterosexual crossdressers. The lopsided defeat will likely kill any chance for civil rights for LGBs in Anchorage for the next decade.

So why do gay men so obstinately and obtusely defend trans activists when those trans activists have nothing but contempt for them? 2 main reasons. First, it is because no gay man wants to be seen as someone who excludes or discriminates. Having had the falsehood of “LGBT” drummed into their heads for the last 15 years, a lot of them unthinkingly accept that they are one “people” with heterosexual crossdressers and transsexuals. Once they accept that false premise as true, they are emotionally repulsed by the idea of excluding trans people or opposing trans demands. Second, a lot of them see trans people as a kind of gay variant. A “transwoman” at some level is thought of as a really fem gay guy, and so they don’t want to be in opposition to “one of their own”.

I think that is what is going on. I disagree with Gallus’s generalizations about gay men’s respect for women, but at the end of the day, it doesn’t matter whether I am right or Gallus is right. What is driving gay men into the service of trans activists is not a broad disregard for women (if such disregard exists) but a completely misguided notion that they, gay men, have a moral obligation to serve the interests of the trans activists who despise them.

“First, it is because no gay man wants to be seen as someone who excludes or discriminates.”

I can understand that, as a woman. Many women do not want to be seen as exclusive or discriminatory. We women understand what it’s like to be oppressed, which makes us generally very sympathetic to other oppressed groups (at least compared to heterosexual white Christian men).

The transsexuals have done a great job presenting themselves to the public as a highly oppressed and downtrodden class of victims.

Jack, it sounds like Gay men are supporting men claiming to be women (and even worse, claiming to be Lesbians) for many of the same reasons that Lesbians and other women do — falsely identifying, not wanting to oppress other “queers” or oppressed people, believing the LGBTQWTF hype. The differences are that Gay men have far more money and resources and are not losing their last spaces. I live in the SF Bay Area, where Gay men own uncountable businesses, bars, restaurants, meeting places, and have a lot of political power. Lesbians have nothing left. Gay men can easily pay for private clubs. Lesbians are incredibly poor by comparison, often having trouble paying rent. The few places owned by Lesbians are expected to be for “everyone,” and our tiny, pitiful, occasional women-only events (we never had Lesbian-only) are open to and welcome the male stalkers who claim to be women.

I do think that the men who claim to be het women are self-hating gay men. The others are men who want access to Lesbians.

It would really be good if we could finally support each other because, whether Gay men intend it or not, their support of other men (again, in this case, men who claim to be women) is, directly or indirectly, or whatever the reason, male bonding against women. It just looks like a variation of the usual male supremacy to us, with women and especially Lesbians always coming last. We are being far more harmed by the trans cult. Even the influx of women pretending to be gay men has nowhere near the ability to threaten or harm gay men, as do the death and rape threats that men claiming to be women send us. We are literally being wiped out.

But the history of Gay men taking from Lesbians, while not reciprocating and being Lesbian-hating is not good. I remember how Lesbian Feminists gave up trying to work with Gay men in the Seventies because of how badly they were treated. I’ll never forget hearing about the pool party where Gay men didn’t want Lesbians because we would “dirty” the water. And then the AIDS crisis came and Lesbians and Gay men abandoned dying Lesbians and focused on helping Gay men. We were even asked to give our blood because we had the cleanest blood. Lesbians are STILL volunteering for AIDS organizations, which is basically helping men with STDs. Meanwhile, Lesbians who are ill and dying have no support, not decent care….nothing.

A gay man I know said if Lesbians had had a crisis like AIDS, Gay men would never have helped us. And again, the difference in resources and access to privilege is enormous.

Let’s also not forget how sliding-scale and low-income women’s health clinics, many of whom run largely on donations to keep going, have been impacted by trans demands.

Jack, as a lesbian, I do not wish to oppress or exclude others – but where are we allowed healthy boundaries? Boundaries that we wish to have in place for many valid reasons, which have been listed at this site innummerable times so I won’t type them out again? Also, I agree with something Versa said in the “When Trans and Gay Cultures Collide” thread – that there seems to be two kinds of gay men: the sweet and caring kind, who respect women, and the misogynistic and aggressive kind. There’s a lot of truth in that for me, borne of experience. I don’t automatically view a gay man as any kind of an ally now, until I get to know more about him. I’ve heard how too many of them talk about women, sadly.

Bev, if only every lesbian on the planet really heard your message, and focused 100% on building lesbian nation. If we had stuck with that we’d be a million years ahead compared to where we are now. We would have private clubs everywhere, that were lesbian only. No male to trans creeps would even know how to find us.

All our wealth that we wasted on every social justice movement but our own. I say, lesbians, focus on lesbians, build wealthy for each other.

More to the point–If every woman heard what Bev said. It is male bonding and male exploitation. Jack is in my humble hetero opinion wrong. There is a tacit understanding between men and trans are by and large hetero males (that if true to form I suspect loath gay men like poison) it has to do with the consolidation of power and with framing a narrative that protects that power. Gay men have money and have power, (women don’t)–money talks bullshit walks. Trans men that claim to be women merely want women to fuck–period end of story. So Jack to me it seems rather disingenuous to claim that Gay men do not want to be seen as bigoted because bottom line they are really okay with bigotry–misogyny such as supporting a bunch of cross dressers is bigoted–and not seeing it that way–more bigoted.Not recognizing that these men damage women, all women is the height or either bigotry or a delusion. Is it keeping Jack awake at night? I doubt it. I wish it would because it is running on gay male money and power–despite the women handmaidens they have just for window dressing.

Trans have as much to do with being gay as I have with being Queen Elizabeth. Gay is intrinsically social–and includes relationships with others. Trans is anti-social and is about getting it up over yourself. It is completely divorced from and finds anything pro-social abhorrent. It is a culture and movement based on the hallmarks of the sociopath.

As they are, for the most part heterosexual males, I would advise gay men to watch your backs, boys. Because these guys will turn on you as quick as you turned on women and on lesbians in particular. While it has a nice karmic ring to it, sadly in the final analysis women will suffer, as will the children that have been used in the pro Trans passion play. And that is an issue of social justice. Social justice is not easy or popular–gay men should step up already.

Gay males in general are liberal and reformist, not radical. Gay liberals have a lot in common with hetero female liberals in their politics, as well as with hetero male and lesbian liberals. Trans support is popular, more or less, among all these groups and is motivated – yes – by a genuine desire not to be bigoted. But it’s misguided and misplaced. And that’s why this site is so important. It forces liberals and others to do a re-think of the whole issue. Worked for me!

The premise is that trans women teach an unfashionable/”unfeminine” woman how to be a “real” woman because obviously women suck at “being women” until trans women tell them how to do it. It is painful, full of obvious and overt compulsory heterosexuality. I wrote a play-by-play critique of two or three episodes. Episode 8 is particularly upsetting. The woman they’re “fixing” ends up crying when the trans women insist that she has to do a “sexy” burlesque boudoir photo shoot for her boyfriend, and she ends up feeling humiliated by the costume they put her in. She tries to articulate it and they shut her down and move on with the show. I would happily give you my write-up, Gallus, if people here are interested in reading it.

Not gonna hide anything, I will not deny, I’m a heterosexual (to the extent I’m “sexual” – yeah I’m not so “sex-positive” so sue me) married woman, thankfully my male very good friend that I married is sensitive about this and doesn’t make demands, but… I have just had it up to here with the idea that because I don’t want to do this and that other thing from porn that it means I am BROKEN. I had enough of that bullshit growing up and it is ENOUGH.

I exist for myself, I am a human being, if I never wanted to have sex at all (or only via wanking) it is MY CONCERN ONLY and I have HAD IT with people trying to say that not wanting to get it on with men when available 24/7 is somehow WRONG or not progressive or I don’t even know what all.

Fuck it. But not with a penis. Because I don’t want the PIV and I never have and that is a VALID CHOICE thankyew very much.

Preach, sister. What, you don’t want to be spanked? What, you don’t want to rim somebody? What, you don’t want to have sex twice a day, every day? You prude!! What about being GGG?! You selfish bitch! How dare you!

Adrian, I was really moved by your comment here. I have lurked on GT and admired your comments for some time, and I’m glad to get to say directly that I respect you very much for how you live your life on your own terms. And sadly, though I’m lesbian, I can relate to the pressures you described. I spent years in a dysfunctional queer subculture where those cast as “femmes” were expected to be porny, better at it than straight girls (trying to prove something to the dominant culture) and were supposed to parrot some line about this stuff being our own original desire and that it had nothing to do with hetero- male-driven operant conditioning from childhood on…

Daryl/Sophia Banks, too emotionally labile on cross-sex hormones to maintain his photography business and who sometimes grows out his beard cause he can’t deal with the whole female thing and who tries to comment on GenderTrender impersonating Cathy Brennan, also claims that women cause trans male violence by responding to it in an unfeminine way- offers his opinion that Suzan’s Op is “horrible”.

I’m not sure if you want to discuss She Who Perhaps Ought Not Be Named here, but she’s been going after Banks, apparently. Her NameTheProblem Twitter has been encouraging people to leave bad reviews for Banks’ photography business on Yelp. Banks now claims that “TERFs” have made him homeless by ruining his business. Since there are only four reviews on his Yelp, all positive, he’s probably exaggerating. He’s threatening to start a GoFundMe to sue her, but since he had another fundraiser only last September, that’s probably bullshit. I have a lot of contempt for people who abuse crowdsourcing that way. I fully expect libfem suckers to shower him with $$$$.

As much of an asshole as Banks is, I think her petty stuff is pointless and makes us look bad. It would be nice, though, if idiot libfems realized that she is not the queen of the radfems or gender criticism:

A shitty economy and her coming out as trans did, shes outright said this multiple times.

She had *exactly one* bad yelp review that was removed *on the same day*.

Meanwhile she allows fake reviews that are positive (all two of them) to remain.

Shes done two fundraisers already for herself and shes gearing up for a third.

She got evicted because she didnt pay her rent, not because of TERFs.

Any time something even remotely minor happens to her she blows up like its the end of the world and throws a giant pity party, meanwhile real issues are getting ignored in favor of her grandstanding.

Oh and she spent 3 days bullying me on twitter, nearly drove me to suicide twice. And she showed absolutely no remorse for this.

Yeah, if I didn’t know better, I’d think they have a pattern of being insane con artists!

Since there’s tons of documentation of Banks and Brennan trolling each other, including Banks impersonating Brennan, there’s zero chance of a libel suit succeeding. As Voz and Bailey noted, zero trans women joined the Twitter convo in support of Banks – it was all radfem hating liberals.

Banks also conveniently announced that he got a new job today, so he won’t be homeless after all. That’s good, I wouldn’t wish that on anyone, even him.

I gotta give Voz credit for this one:

Sooo…where are the cis WoC who see me and mine as more than political points to score against their White cis frenemies?
…I'll wait.

Ha, Gallus! In the spirit of things, I tried to find a clip of the opening theme to Marge Simpson’s favorite soap opera – “Like the cleaning of a house, It Never Ends….” – but no dice. I could only find still images:http://simpsonswiki.com/wiki/It_Never_Ends
AND, while doing said search, I found out that that Simpsons bit comes from an episode called “Pygmoelian,” which is about someone getting drastic plastic surgery. You know, like the lovely folks we chat about so often here at GT. A neat little bit of synchronicity.