Actually I think Apollo came out from left field with his 'statement' that no GM would come here with a team that got blown up. I don't think there is a single person in the universe who thinks it should (or could) be done before a GM is hired.

I didn't say "no GM" is said no high profile GM. The Raptors are the kiss of death, just look at that track record. The emphasis needs to be on turning the ship right now. Ripping it down is a controversial approach anyway. For every success story you have half a dozen horror stories; Raptors included multiple times.

I didn't say "no GM" is said no high profile GM. The Raptors are the kiss of death, just look at that track record. The emphasis needs to be on turning the ship right now. Ripping it down is a controversial approach anyway. For every success story you have half a dozen horror stories; Raptors included multiple times.

Actually the Raptors are a model of why teams *should* rip it down. Look at the last 5 years. If Colangelo had been willing to rebuild and not retool back then, we wouldn't be in the mess we're in today.

Stop writing "Raptors mediocrity" your Xmas wishlist:

You don't know that. The Raptors have torn it down multiple times and Colangelo had two separate cracks at it with lots of cap space and couldn't get it done. You don't need to rip it down, you need somebody in there that can make the right decisions.

Gutting and nose diving isn't a proven method to victory.

At some point the Raptors need to build a level of consistency in making the playoffs before high profile FA's are ever going to want to consider coming here without there being extra money involved. Gutting is only going to further destroy the reputation of the team and at a time when they're just about ready to make a playoff push. Chances are they're not going to hit a Durant and Westbrook combo in the draft. They should rebuild credibility now when eyebrows are raised at the executive shuffle. They should strike now at the playoff while keeping the long term in mind; it is very possible to do this.

You don't know that. The Raptors have torn it down multiple times and Colangelo had two separate cracks at it with lots of cap space and couldn't get it done. You don't need to rip it down, you need somebody in there that can make the right decisions.

In fairness the only 2 times we tore it down completely we ended up with a team that eventually went to Game 7 of the 2nd round and a team that won the Atlantic division.

You don't know that. The Raptors have torn it down multiple times and Colangelo had two separate cracks at it with lots of cap space and couldn't get it done. You don't need to rip it down, you need somebody in there that can make the right decisions.

Gutting and nose diving isn't a proven method to victory.

Things are so up to chance it's ridiculous...For every OKC or Portland there's a Charlotte or Sacramento. And even OKC needed some very very real luck. Even bad luck. If, as Seattle, they had won the draft lottery in the Oden/Durant year instead of Portland (both teams were longshots to even land where they did), things could have been much different for both teams. Heck, if they had kept their expected positions (5th SEA, 7th POR), it could've been a pretty terrible draft for both.

In fairness the only 2 times we tore it down completely we ended up with a team that eventually went to Game 7 of the 2nd round and a team that won the Atlantic division.

What? This wasn't a rebuild. It's not a rebuild when you have no assets. The team had 3 horrible seasons. They draft Carter, and their fortunes changed. I don't know if trading Camby for Oakley is really blowing it up. And despite the special place he has in Raptors fans hearts, Stoudemire was a thorougly average PG. It was not like the team traded away a real franchise player.

I somewhat agree that the team tried to do a real rebuild going into the Bosh era. But they also failed to do it properly. In the end, the team that won the Atlantic division was not built patiently by stocking assets. It was built by on the fly by just plugging holes. And that has been Colangelo's strategy since.

The last 2-3 seasons is when they should have committed to a proper rebuild, and basically "tank". But they didn't. Basically, BC should have been firm with Bosh in the season and told him "if you can't give me a commitment now I'm trading you before the deadline". Who knows what the does for things? I think the team would've given up on the season, so probably a fair amount of extra losses. It wasn't the best draft, but even better chances at John Wall (Wiz at the 5th worst record, so they moved up) would have been nice. Not to mention Paul George was taken at 10, and he was the guy I wanted so badly in that draft...just 3 spots ahead of Toronto.

Basically, I'm not sure this team has ever really blown it up and done a good job. Again, I can't count the first years as blowing anything up. The success in the Bosh years was not really a result of the "rebuilding" done by Babcock (that's why it wasn't sustainable, because it was just a constant patch-job). And the most recent opportunity was basically wasted.

All that is besides the point, at 2 points in our franchise we became a bottom 3 team in consecutive years* and following those years we ended up going as far as we have as a franchise thanks in large part to the players we got in those drafts.

*3 but I'm not including inaugural years as the deck was pretty stacked against us at that point (no #1 picks for 3 years)

Objection your honor...

Letter N wrote:

In fairness the only 2 times we tore it down completely we ended up with a team that eventually went to Game 7 of the 2nd round and a team that won the Atlantic division.

Right, they ended with game seven in the second round only to go on one of the most pathetically awful stretches in league history and to say they built that team due to a deconstruction is inaccurate. They loaded up with a lot of tough vets via trades and FA after (unintentionally)wallowing in the lotto since their existence. You could argue that they took a similar means back then to what I'm saying now except I want there to be a focus on the future and not on trying to make a one hit wonder, cap be damned.

And come on, who are we kidding here. Why don't you state their record the year they won the Atlantic? While you're at it tell us how the rest of the division did that year? Nice try though...

All that is besides the point, at 2 points in our franchise we became a bottom 3 team in consecutive years* and following those years we ended up going as far as we have as a franchise thanks in large part to the players we got in those drafts.

*3 but I'm not including inaugural years as the deck was pretty stacked against us at that point (no #1 picks for 3 years)

Umm...this is not actually true at all. The Raptors have never been a bottom 3 team for consecutive years.

I think the point is that any "blowing it up" should wait for the new GM to be hired, so that they have the assets to work with, in order to tear down / rebuild the team the way they say fit. I don't think a GM would want a team to be blown up right before they're hired, since they'd have a lot less options available with all the most tradeable assets gone.

Yes, of course; The newly hired GM would be the one "tearing it down". Who else would do it?

Everyone gets that. We're just not all on board with slashing the cap to nothing, praying for a high pick, praying that the high pick turns out to be a really good player and then praying that really good player decides to stay in Toronto. We've been there, we've seen this. It hasn't worked and I personally don't want to sit through three to five more seasons of losing to have a couple chances at the roulette wheel and to see them overpay for free agents.