We all know the Lions need a number of players. I'm sure most of us would love a good trade down scenario. That being said we've talked plenty about the top of the draft but if Mayhew were to pull off a good trade who do you like later in the round?

This is where I feel like the Lions could still get good help. Bulaga, Haden and Morgan could all be gone by the mid-first, but one of them might be available to the Lions and I'd be ok with that. Later on in the first it gets a little murky and depends on who falls. I'm not sold on Bulaga (or any other OT in this draft) and I'd prefer to go defense with at least the first couple picks but you gotta go with who's available. I'm really hoping for a draft without any big reaches just to fill a spot. It isn't like the Lions have any lack of spots to fill.

_________________Adopted Lion: Brandon Pettigrew-Soon to be a huge supporter of the Stickum black market

November 28th, 2009, 10:56 am

kdsberman

Team MVP

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pmPosts: 3426Location: Saginaw, MI

Though i hate UofM, my eyes will be on Brandon Graham if he falls for some reason. I want Morgan, but another solid DE would be great too. Im not sold on ANY defensive ends on this team.

I wouldn't want B Grahm until the 2nd round. Great effort player, good instincts, good speed, but I don't think he'll be that effective in a 4-3 scheme lined up on the DL.

UM. He plays in a 4 man front line right now. How would his job be any different? The Wolverines played most of the second half of the season in a 4-4-3 defense. I can't imagine how a DE's job would change dramatically in a 4-4 vs a 4-3 defense.

UM. He plays in a 4 man front line right now. How would his job be any different? The Wolverines played most of the second half of the season in a 4-4-3 defense. I can't imagine how a DE's job would change dramatically in a 4-4 vs a 4-3 defense.

Huh? What? You must be confused because Craig Roh played a hybrid DE/OLB, while Stevie Brown played a hybrid OLB/S role with the team. It was nowhere close to a 4-4-3.

Back on topic, while Brandon Graham did play DE at Michigan, he seems to be better suited to 3-4 OLB in the NFL to me. He's listed at 6'2", but I question whether he's even 6 foot. That helps him in terms of leverage, but you don't want a 6 footer on the DL in the NFL if you can help it.

There are very few college teams that run a 3-4, so the pro teams that run it have to get their players from somewhere. They typically convert undersized DTs to DEs and undersized DEs to OLBs. That's why Graham will be more attractive to the 3-4 teams.

While I like the guy as a college player, I just can't see him being successful at the next level as a 4-3 DE. Sure, he has a non-stop motor, but his lack of size and elite speed will neutralize him at that position. IMO, he would be much better utilized in a 3-4 system.

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November 28th, 2009, 4:47 pm

wjb21ndtown

BillySims wrote:

wjb21ndtown wrote:

I wouldn't want B Grahm until the 2nd round. Great effort player, good instincts, good speed, but I don't think he'll be that effective in a 4-3 scheme lined up on the DL.

UM. He plays in a 4 man front line right now. How would his job be any different? The Wolverines played most of the second half of the season in a 4-4-3 defense. I can't imagine how a DE's job would change dramatically in a 4-4 vs a 4-3 defense.

Billy, the difference is he would be playing against NFL OT's at the next level. Players are constricted by their size/ability and have to switch positions all the time to make it at the next level. I think Brandon Grahm is one of those players.

November 28th, 2009, 5:07 pm

m2karateman

RIP Killer

Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10136Location: Where ever I'm at now

I think entirely TOO much credence is given to the height factor for a DE playing in the NFL. Look at Freeney. He's probably about 6'1" in real life. Elvis Dumervil is less than six foot tall. He was playing well as a DE, and is still playing well as a rush OLB in the Denver 3-4.

Graham CAN play DE in a 43, no differently than if Lamarr Woodley had been selected by the Lions and they put in at DE in their 43. I would actually prefer the DEs to be around 6'2" to 6'4" tall, to gain leverage and allow them to take shorter steps rather than long strides that can easily be disrupted.

November 28th, 2009, 5:59 pm

Strawberries&Chocolat

National Champion

Joined: April 12th, 2005, 12:35 amPosts: 881Location: Boston, MA

M2K is exactly right. Brandon Graham is a little on the short side, but there is not a meaningful relationship between height and pass rushing ability except to the extent you have to carry enough weight to play the position. Graham is already over 270 lbs, and yeah he can't probably gain much more, but it's beside the point because he's already where he needs to be. Freeney is built the same way and before the draft slipped for the same (ultimately unfounded) concerns.

The guys who absolutely have to make the switch are more in the 240-250 range. That said, Graham might be able to play 3-4 OLB too if he performs well in coverage drills at workouts.

That said, if I could pick one of these DE's, right now I would take Derrick Morgan. But with Hardy, Dunlap, Graham, Morgan, and Hughes all entering a draft that will be rich in talent overall, it is very possible that a nice DE will fall into the Lions' lap high in the second round.

I'm not saying that a shorter DE can't succeed like Freeney or Dumervil, just that it's less likely. Besides, I prefer larger DEs that can play effectively on every down as opposed to just passing situations. Who knows? Graham may go to a 4-3 team, but I think he'll end up with someone like the Pats to play OLB. Just my opinion.

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November 29th, 2009, 11:47 am

Wayne Fontes

Color Commentator - John Madden

Joined: January 19th, 2007, 3:21 amPosts: 1919Location: A2

There are quite a few top DE's in this years draft but none will be top 10 picks. There is a very good chance the Lions could nab one in the second round and still be getting a first round talent. If they take DT in round one does that mean they can't go DE in 2? I don't think so.

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December 10th, 2009, 5:28 pm

kdsberman

Team MVP

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pmPosts: 3426Location: Saginaw, MI

Wayne Fontes wrote:

There are quite a few top DE's in this years draft but none will be top 10 picks. There is a very good chance the Lions could nab one in the second round and still be getting a first round talent. If they take DT in round one does that mean they can't go DE in 2? I don't think so.

Definetly not.

3 or 4 D-line starters needed, 2 recieved, now we have 1 or 2 left. Id say thats a pretty darn good draft.

The only reservation that I would have is that they need help in the secondary too and if they don't address that until round 3 they would be getting a nickel back at best. With the way Anthony Henry has regressed it seems tough to go into next season without addressing it makes me nervous. Here are some notable free agent corners available after this season, according to footballfuture.com.

That list of players doesn't make me feel good about our chances of upgrading in Free Agency. Unless Mayhew can hit on a third rounder like he did with DeAndre Levy this year we may be looking at another bad year.

You forgot to list Carlos Rogers, Dunta Robinson, Richard Marshall, Marlin Jackson, and Tramon Williams (RFA). That is if there is a new CBA by then. If not, there will hardly be anyone available other then players who were cut because of excessive contracts. *COUGH* Nate Clements *COUGH*.

As for the draft, the CB I really like who isn't getting a lot of hype is Brandon Ghee of Wake Forest. I'd take him before Patrick Robinson or Trevard Lindley, who are completely over-rated IMO. Unfortunately, I'm beginning to think that Ghee won't make it to the 2nd round.

Is this the year Myron Rolle will be entering the draft? I know he's been out of football for a year, but the kid is crazy smart and was a great talent before he left on his rhodes scholarship.

December 14th, 2009, 4:14 pm

conversion02

RIP Killer

Joined: January 26th, 2005, 9:34 pmPosts: 10493Location: Sycamore, IL

slybri19 wrote:

You forgot to list Carlos Rogers, Dunta Robinson, Richard Marshall, Marlin Jackson, and Tramon Williams (RFA). That is if there is a new CBA by then. If not, there will hardly be anyone available other then players who were cut because of excessive contracts. *COUGH* Nate Clements *COUGH*.

As for the draft, the CB I really like who isn't getting a lot of hype is Brandon Ghee of Wake Forest. I'd take him before Patrick Robinson or Trevard Lindley, who are completely over-rated IMO. Unfortunately, I'm beginning to think that Ghee won't make it to the 2nd round.

Tramon Williams is absolute garbage. If you want a PI on every play, sign Tramon. Dood is crap.