The reason there is no evidence is because the evidence cannot be tested. there pictures of steel that was melted, debunkers claim it is aluminium or
something else, but it cannot be proven or disproven eigher way, because no one can test it. Common sense tells me that if you have a steel beam and
something melted at the end of it, its that steel beam, can I prove it...nope. can you prove it is something else...nope.

common sense can tell you alot of things about why 9/11 is an inside job, but cannot be tested or proven. but the OS is even more sketchy and also
cannot be tested or proven. So this is why the conspiracy will never be debunked and the OS will never be proven. TPTB did their job well.

I can prove NIST is wrong about why building 7 went down... i posted this in another thread.

Originally posted by ohhwataloser

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
C)A ccording to NIST, the fires caused column 79 to overheat and expand, and becuase the steel was vertical and couldn't expand up or down, it
expanded sideways, pushing the horizontal girder between columns 79 and 44 and causing floor 13 to collapse. The NIST report go into all of that so
I'm not going to waste my time repeating it here to satisfy this weird little game playing of yours.

so thats what caused wtc 7 to come down? hmmm.... now my first question is why wouldn't the steel expand inward, instead of outward against the
girders which would obviously have more resistance but we can ignore that

also how much did the steel expand?

lets assume worst case, I couldn't find any info on how thick the steel was for wtc 7, but wtc 1 and 2 used 5 inch thick steal for their columns at
the base, which would be way over kill for wtc 7 at floor 13, but lets just use 5 inches.

how much did the steel get heated? I have no idea but, lets assume the steel is normally at zero degrees why not? and it got heated to 2500 degrees
which would melt it, but lets just use some numbers

0.00000645in*in*deg F - forumla for steel expansion

0.00000645in*5*2500F = 0.080625 n. which obviously it would of been alot less.

so .08in was enough to cause a grider to fail?

or are we going to assume that the entire column expanded in the direction of column 44 and in no other direction? biggest column I could find is
again from wtc1 and 2 so would be way oversized for wtc 7, is 52inx22in. so ill assume the same thing as above and that all 52 inches expanded in the
direction of column 44.

0.00000645in*52*2500F = 0.8385 so even at an impossible amount of expansion, you think less than an inch caused a grider to fail? and mind you the
amont of expansion would obviously be alot less.

So NIST is wrong and I submited this to them. I will never get a response back and nothing will ever come of this. we stay at this standstill. other
people can prove other parts of the OS wrong with science and math, but we still stay at this standstill. this is why the conspiracy exists, forever
and ever.

OP tactics as follows: Distract, ridicule, raise tensions, talk rubbish, play the big ego, side with the OS, garner support from disinfo agents and
naive people, slap bang wallop, a few points for the OS and disinfo guys. SHOUT IN CAPITALS to make a point. (scary)

Ignore evidence of manipulated media cover. Ignore the mass attacks against those who question the OP in the media. Ignore evidence of government
inaction/ complicity. Ignore evidence that the 'Dancing Israelis' knew before time that this would happen. Ignore evidence that no plane crashed
at the Pentagon. Ignore the blatant evidence PLANT wherein the passport of a 'hijacker' survived the crash but none of the three black boxes did.

Ignore algorithm-generated CGI vicsims? That one's controversial, but scary when you look into it.

well said ....i would ask you something...would you give this a read through and see if it is completely of base...as i would like to solve this as a
crime rather than fighting over the results...your remarks are well presented on the OP's tactics....thanks for that.

If the US hadn't instantly become involved in not one, but two wars, against an adversary residing in countries very wealthy in Natural Resources,
with nary a standing army or single plane or Ship in which to fight against I personally would feel totally different about 9/11.

If people can be paid to kill one another, How difficult would it be to pay some crazies to fly into buildings anyway ?
Especially if by using brainwashing ala MK ULTRA they would do it for FREE ?

Im sorry you feel this way. But you are doing what someone does when they deflect. The passport that survived is completely reasonable. Quite oftne
when a car bomb explodes pieces of paper from that car are scattered everywhere. But the passenger seat is completely destroyed and non existent.

HArdware is often destroyed as it is "nailed down and there for is exposed to the central point of a balst far more than lose flappy pieces of paper
or passports, a collection of flappy papers. The lighter and less secure an item the more likely it will survive the tremendous blast of a bomb. I'm
sure that other pieces of hand luggage were found that day but where not as significant as a passport of a terrorist.

Remember, the government did have something to hide. Incompetence of letting something like this happen. Again your theories are just that. Everyone
has come up with what would happen if a airliner hit the twin towers but nothing in science can fully explain all occurrences. Nothing is purely text
book when it comes to science. The slightest additional bit if wind, a change in direction, a beam that was more dense than the rest can all have an
effect that could not be accounted for. Whatever happens is pure chance to some degree. So the passport surviving is rather shallow proof of anything.

Does this guy know anything about 1,200 plus architects and engineers saying is was an inside job?

I'ts 1,300 plus now, and growing.

The scores of anomolies aside, the Official Conspiracy Theory doesn't even make sense...

What terrorist in his right mind would plan an operation that contained as a crucial element the malfunction of the multi-trillion dollar US Air
Defense System?
If the Air Defence System was functioning normally on 9/11 the 'terrorist operation' would have failed.

How could bin Laden possibly know that Air Defence would fail that day, which is something that *had to happen for his plan to succeed?

Well I'll give you an A for effort, but all that stuff that was posted there has already been answered many times in the past. And I'm sorry but
none of what they say, (And I saw this exact same stuff years ago back when I for a short time was a "truther" ) kicks starts my imagination into
the "inside job" aspect. In fact, it just shows me how far they are stuck in a completely ignorant mindset where they WANT to believe that nonsense
they posted, even if it means suspending reality and ignoring actual facts. I'd love to go through with you every one of those points, but to be
honest, its been done countless times here on ATS by myself and many others who are just as tired as seeing these TM "facts" cropping up and though
they are true, when in reality, they are all based on A) innuendo, B) lies, C) misunderstanding of reality, D) connect the dots in any way you see fit
style, E) ignorance of actual facts and truths, E) twisting and taking out of context quotes/comments/eyewitness accounts, and G) very little to zero
understanding of complex engineering/fire/physical/etc etc etc matters.

I still cannot believe they still believe that Silverstein actually said to "pull" down WTC7, when in the quote they use themselevs, he says no such
thing! I mean come on! READING COMPREHENSION people! When a group of people who are claming they are looking for the truth and trying to expose the
lies, I'd expect for them to be able to at least have decent reading comprehenion skills and some critical thinking skills. I'm sorry, but if that
is how they try to sucker you in, I do not believe for a second they have actual intrest in the truth in mind.

If the US hadn't instantly become involved in not one, but two wars, against an adversary residing in countries very wealthy in Natural Resources,
with nary a standing army or single plane or Ship in which to fight against I personally would feel totally different about 9/11.

If people can be paid to kill one another, How difficult would it be to pay some crazies to fly into buildings anyway ?
Especially if by using brainwashing ala MK ULTRA they would do it for FREE ?

Think outside of the box and look at the bigger picture my friend.

The Truth Shall Set You Free.

Again possible. But again you have ZERO proof just mindful fantasy. Suggestion is not proof. Its merely guess work and speculation. What is up with
this type of thinking. Why do truthers always say think outside the box. You can't just go round making stuff up cause it is possible and using it as
the story. I could say little mice planned and carried out this attack. Its a story and possible in the realm of make believe. But i cant prove it so
it becomes just more theory. Theories are that until ACTUAL evidence gives them proof positive.

An actual reason why? schizophrenia seems to be spreading like wildfire, and not in the cool "pretty picture" way. As you might already be fully
aware, alot of people tend to make things up in thier head, or hear voices in thier head (how they get thier "intel")

The world is full of gulible idiots and schizophrenics, lucky there is a third party "logic" not too many people fall under logic, some pretend to
have such a feature in thier mind, while others think the voices in thier head is "logic"

Logic comes from intellgent and in my opinion intellgence comes from a large gene pool (open opinion/debate)
It is also well known that many people have (sadly) a small gene pool, which comes from genetic malformations, and imbreding.

So it doesn't really suprise me that many people are not willing to listen to logic, because to them logic is the scary side of the world they never
want to see, because it involes them leaving thier delusional fantasy land, built entirely within thier mind. Like a movie a place of nonstop
entertainment, i suppose. So when a dose of the real world comes into play, they don't want it simply because it does not appeal to them, does not
entertain them, merely boring in thier eyes.

So when will the 9/11 truthers stop? perhaps a few generations from now, or maybe untill we are dead, merely replaced by our desendants whom hopfully
have logic in thier daily lives.

I'm rather sick of the shaky evidence myself. While I do believe there was some level of interior involvement I'm tired of the same anecdotal
evidence being rehashed. Maybe when some new evidence comes out I'll change my tune, but in the mean time I'm sick of the same record playing on
repeat.

Can you point to me in the NORAD mission objective where the Air Defence Network is specifically inclined to track and target civilian airliners
within its own airspace? That is a common misconception of the reality of how an Air Defence system works.

This was not the Cold War USA of 1956 where we had bombers and fighter interceptors on round the clock ground alert readiness, with engines running on
the tarmac on five minute alert where they can be wheels up in five minutes of recieving the "go-code" to intercept Soviet bombers coming over the
North Pole or off the coasts of Atlantic and Pacific. The Air Defence mission is to track and intercept aircraft from OUTSIDE our airspace. Not inside
our airspace.

Ah and what exactly is the offical story? Have you truthers ever made a consensus on that yet? As far as I know the only offical story is that
radical Islam terrorists hijacked 4 airliners, smashing three into buildings and a fourth going down into a field. Two buildings collapsed from the
resulting damage and fires together, while a third collapsed as collateral from damage and fires which were unchallenged for hours after the
collapses.

Yeah, as far as you know. Other than the fact that your "hijackers" weren't on any initial passenger manifests (no, the manifests aren't
"victims lists"), MSM organizations like the BBC reported that several of the "hijackers" were still alive (now reportedly 7), FBI claims
"problems with identification" but never revises list, the WTC towers were designed and constructed to withstand impact from a similar size, weight
and speed 707 (INCLUDING any resulting fires), the WTC towers were the first and last steel-frame high-rise buildings to collapse due to fire), there
was NO identifiable 757 wreckage at the Pentagon, NO identifiable Shanksville wreckage at crash site (spread out over 8 miles), NO photos or videos of
a plane impacting the Pentagon, NO black boxes recovered from the WTC wreckage (another aviation first), NO significant damage or fires at WTC 7,
known laws of physics-defying free-fall speeds for all three towers and numerous "secondary explosions" heard by dozens if not hundreds of people.
The crazy anomalies, inconsistencies and cover-ups go on and on.

Yeah, so much for your "official story" which is not only impossible but laughable.

And it's so hilarious how the 'skeptics' (not true skeptics at all) claim that anyone who believes (knows) the facts about 9/11 have been covered
up, manipulated, white washed...is "craaaaaazy". We're all "schizophrenic". Yep

I guess it's easy to just debate something by saying :

"Hey, that guy's crazy, don't listen to him because I'm logical...Did you hear me...I'm LOGICAL!!! I'm a "skeptic" it says so on my name tag.
I'm the expert of all things LOGICAL...you're a denier because you're on the opposite fence as me and I'm the LOGICAL one so you must be
crazy...."

It hasn't worked for years guys. You're playing a ROLE. So stay in character guys, it means nothing in the end.

Oh boy, are you STILL reading the same manuscript word for word from the truther sites? The same one that has been addressed and debunked hundreds of
times over?

Ok, well to start, the hijackers WERE on the flight's passenger list, they were NOT on the victim's list. They WERE identified through process of
elimination. You can find that info here on ATS in no time.

The hijackers are alive nonsense has also been addressed and debunked. Apparently, the truthers didnt know that many of the hijacker's names are also
very popular and common. Just go look in a telephone book and see how many John Smiths there are. Or Michael Jordan. Anyways, here is the BBC on
that: www.bbc.co.uk...

Everything else there that you posted is nothing more than the same old rehash of garbage that has been debunked ad nasuem. Just because you repost
the same dead horse and clame its alive, doesnt make it so. The debris, it was all there. Black boxes, recovered. No free fall of the towers, (hint,
it was the debris goldenfleece. I thought at least THAT would have been obvious).

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