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I saw the pics, it was good, but with Squirtle using Ice Beam, wtf? I liked it, just froim the pictures, so it must be one of the better ones, but they should let someone besides May win...8.5/10 Good Pics!

And if Harley had won, it would've only stretched out the Battle Frontier saga more, resulting in more fillers that most people don't like, and causing more complaining.

Not really, that would have just meant we'd have more contests and less fillers.

This saga is going to end at the time the new games come out anyway, so they can't go further than the year deadline that they have. It's going to end at the same time regardless of how many fillers they make. If they run out of time they'll rush the last couple of Brains and Contests.

Tsk tsk, everyone's so busy throwing a tantrum about Squirtle that there's barely been any commentary on Jessie! Was that not the best appeal in living memory? And the puppet-show? With Harley dancing along? (ROFL) Jessie and Harley could so be the Karen and Jack of the Pokemon world.

I know that the writers are trying to make us really like Squirtle, but they are doing it the wrong way. Harley should've won this contest. If Harley loses every single time he goes up against May, the viewers at home aren't really going to see him as much of a threat anymore. Harley is one of May's rivals, so it's only common sense that he should beat her once in a while.

Originally Posted by Geodude

-I'm really liking Lillian. She's really good at getting the audience going, she's enthusiastic and emotional, and I liked her bits of Engrish. ("It's showtime!"..."Are you ready?"..."Let's go!") She's a vast improvement over Vivian.

Gawd, I love Lillian. She's more energetic, more exciting, and she's also pretty hot. Vivian didn't really have all that much going for her, but Lillian and her skin tight, two piece outfit make me excited about the next contest episodes.

...And I don't want Jessie to keep that haircut. Don't get me wrong, I like change, but that hair just doesn't look like Jessie.

Pokemon Fan, with all due respect, that's a load of bull. Zenigame pulled an ice beam out of it's ass the episode before the actual contest, and with no battling experience aside from being destroyed by Shuu's Flygon, is able to beat a tough, intimidating, and fully evolved foe.

But what evidence is there that this Ariados was tough? Like I said it seemed to be skilled only with webbing and was pretty pathetic otherwise.

Please note I agree it was a bad battle, I just think as much blame rests on Ariados and that it should be noted the writers did not make the mistake again of having May's inexperienced Pokemon somehow beat a very skilled one that devestated opponents and seemed unstoppable (i.e Dusclops).

Interesting to hear that May used Squirtle's inexperience to her advantage. It seems it had about as much trouble with Ice Beam as Snorunt did, which surely makes it learning the move a bit easier to take doesn't it? Not that it makes the battle any less revolting...

I simply find the episode more poor than unbelievable. They gave May a pathetic opponent in a one-trick Ariados (and I adore Ariados in general) so that her weakest Pokemon could star in a contest. I really rather they had simply had it do a nice appeal and left the battle to someone else.

<><><>

I apologize for the use of the ^_^ but on this board I find it easier than searching through hundreds of smilies. If necessary I'll stop but what exactly is wrong with the smile face? Has it come to mean something else?

Quote:Gawd, I love Lillian. She's more energetic, more exciting, and she's also pretty hot. Vivian didn't really have all that much going for her, but Lillian and her skin tight, two piece outfit make me excited about the next contest episodes.

I agree with ya,if only there is a contest by the beach, then we can hopefully see her in a bikini.Anyway the ep could have been better,but I like ariados{except the fact it was a one trick pony}

I kinda liked the appeals and the battles, but i can agree with many of the opinions expressed in this thread. It's just that, when Harley pulls something underhanded like he did, the main character always has to give Harley whats coming to him. Now, maybe if May learned her lesson and wont fall for his tricks anymore, he might win, but that doesn't mean his character has to change he could just be a little meaner and use intimidation as a strategy since his tricks wont work on may anymore. Although it is funny when she falls for it, and i think thats what they were going for.

But what evidence is there that this Ariados was tough? Like I said it seemed to be skilled only with webbing and was pretty pathetic otherwise.

Exactly. Ariados did not use a single damaging attack for the entire episode. So it really isn't that far out there to believe that May found a way to win. If Harley would actually concentrate more on improving his battle tactics as opposed to finding ways to trick people, he might actually beat May. I really don't understand why all the hate is directed at May instead of the incredibly annoying Harley.

Originally Posted by SuperSonic

I kinda liked the appeals and the battles, but i can agree with many of the opinions expressed in this thread. It's just that, when Harley pulls something underhanded like he did, the main character always has to give Harley whats coming to him. Now, maybe if May learned her lesson and wont fall for his tricks anymore, he might win

I like that theory. It goes with what I said above.

Interesting to hear that May used Squirtle's inexperience to her advantage. It seems it had about as much trouble with Ice Beam as Snorunt did, which surely makes it learning the move a bit easier to take doesn't it?

Certainly does. Why haven't people figured that out yet?

And what happened with that was: Ariados had Squirtle trapped in a Spider Web and was quickly "moving in for the kill". Squirtle was struggling but seemed completely immobilized. May thought fast, then remembered how earlier, when it had tried to use Ice Beam against Ariados (while on the ground), the force of it had knocked Squirtle off its feet. So she called for Ice Beam, and sure enough, Squirtle's inability to control Ice Beam's power and plant itself down before using the move gave it sufficient force to break free of the net, and it froze Ariados to boot.

Exactly. Ariados did not use a single damaging attack for the entire episode. So it really isn't that far out there to believe that May found a way to win. If Harley would actually concentrate more on improving his battle tactics as opposed to finding ways to trick people, he might actually beat May. I really don't understand why all the hate is directed at May instead of the incredibly annoying Harley.

Heyyyyy! No-one as fabulous as Harley can ever be truly annoying. But I do think you've hit the nail on the head - Harley's problem is that he spends too much time trying to win underhandedly and thus lacks the skills to win fairly. Wasn't there an exchange between him and Drew in the Grand Festival where Drew says as much? I think his previous two appearances made it clear that May is a better battler than him, which obviously gives her an advantage.

[walks into the thread with a large, one-sided grin, head tilted sideways, and a random twitch every few seconds] I would like to thank Heracross. I stayed away from spoilers for yet another week until I saw the ep, which I finally did after Heracross sent me it when the bit torrent was giving me trouble.

Originally Posted by The Big Al

I'm waiting for Yamato-san to come here and go on Grade A b*tchfest. He's hated that terapin from the start and this will only serve to piss him off further.

[head snaps to an upright position with a sickly crick sound] You read me like a book. [one eye blinks slowly] Everyone's covered most of the points, but I'll mention what I can. And yeah, I am p*ssed.... extremely p*ssed..... Harley not only lost again, further preventing him from being token as a serious, regular villian (which is something this show needs so god damned badly), but he lost against..... THAT! And that thing scored a victory in the process...... god, if I were in the anime, and that Zenigame were in front of me right now, I'd be cracking my knuckles, say something to the effect of "kisamaaaaaa....!" or "kono gaki meeeeee....!" before dashing forward with a shouted "YURUSENE!!!" and beating it worse than what you'd expect from a gorey, X-rated remake of Musashi vs. Habunake.

Originally Posted by The Big Al

Plug that stupid turtle's pie hole with String Shot duh. Then it couldn't use Water Gun, Bubble or Ice Beam.

Exactly. These writers purposely made Harley lose his cool, as well as make his Ariados seem like a one-trick pony, just to make Zenigame win a contest, which as stated, really shouldn't be doing at this early point in time. There were so many solutions to the problem, like the one The Big Al mention, or maybe pelt Zenigame with a Poison Sting, not only knocking it back, but lose footing on the web, causing it to fall. Hell, when the Ariados was falling, it could've used String Shot to snag Zenigame by the foot, and while I imagine the frozen web would shatter afterwards, it would help break Ariados's fall just a little and give it a chance to swing the damned cryptodira and slam it onto the ground.

Originally Posted by Geodude

And if Harley had won, it would've only stretched out the Battle Frontier saga more, resulting in more fillers that most people don't like, and causing more complaining.

Bulls***! As Cybercubed pointed out, new sagas of the anime start the same week the new generation of games are released in Japan. The Diamond/Pearl games aren't expected to come out until Summer of next year, and there's the possibility of it being pushed back further, so Harley winning would be completely irrelevent. And I too would rather have more contests than crap fillers, much like what we've been having lately. On top of that, Haruka's likely to lose at least one contest in each region anyway, just as much as Satoshi will likely have to rematch at least one gym each region (excluding Satoshi in the Orange Islands; we can only hope the anime hasn't sunk so low with having cheap, unrealistic characters with zero forms of character development), so why couldn't it be this one? You know, her first contest in the region, when her party's extremely unexperienced and most vulnerable?

Originally Posted by Geodude

-Everyone was complaining in the last episode about how May supposedly always gets Pokemon that instantly know moves, but we now see that Squirtle hasn't fully mastered Ice Beam yet. It has no problems actually using the move, but can't quite control its power yet. The force knocks it off its feet.

-Good job by May, using that control problem to her advantage to get out of the net and turn the tables on Ariados. She was at such a disadvantage points-wise before then, I thought she might lose. Most other young coordinators don't have the advantage May does of spending all their travelling time with two very experienced trainers. She's clearly learned a lot from them.

Um, yeah, it's appreciative that Zenigame could be given a problem with its Ice Beam, however, it's still kinda stupid in that the problem wasn't evident when the Zenigame first pulled this move out of its a** in the previous episode. It seems to me that, only in the next episode, do the writers give Zenigame a problem just so Haruka can use it to her advantage. If they were a bit more consistent with having the problem apparent in the previous episode (maybe have Zenigame embed itself into the sandy ground due to the recoil), I'd be a little more happy about this tidbit, but since it wasn't apparent back then, it just seems like another last-minute excuse by the writers.

Originally Posted by jolteonjak

I love the pic of it flexing at the end. Its so cute. Can we make that an avatar please?

If I had hit list, you, sir, would be at the very top. If that horrid scene really does get avatared, I'll see to it that you go through hell. And I'm aware that I'm on a forum. That's why I'm gonna track ya down, do whatever possible to encounter you in real life. You better hope that it doesn't get made into an avatar, specially not a commonly-used one, and if it does, you better watch your a**.

Anyway, I can't argue with Sushi, the rest of this episode was very great, just that the ending outcome leaves an extremely bitter taste in my mouth. All the appeals were friggin outstanding, and I was laughing my head off during the Harley vs. Musashi match, both the stalling parts and Sounansu helplessly being turned into a puppet. Gotta love Harley dancing in the background like he was controlling a puppet (there's a scene worth avataring) XD. I was rather surprised when Musashi sent out Sounansu, too, and considering the preview clearly showed that this contest had Grand Festival rules, I'm amazed I didn't consider the possibility of her using a second Pokemon besides Sabonea.

Harley's battle against Haruka itself was also good..... until Haruka won -_-. Like Alfonso, I was really expecting he'd get this one. Sure, I saw the picture on the main page of Zenigame using Ice Beam to repel itself away from the web, and with that, I knew Haruka was gonna use that repelling to her advantage when it became apparent. However, after I saw the scene with that picture on the main page, I was thinking Harley would still get a last-minute win. After all, his appeal was pretty much flawless until that point, and Haruka's appeal gauge was about halfway empty. When Zenigame was sliding down the frozen web, Haruka commanding it to use Bubble, I was really expecting Ariados would clog its mouth with String Shot. But it didn't happen.... instead, Ariados gets hit, it falls, and my hopes come shattering to pieces once I saw Ariados land, fainted, and then..... that god damned turtle.... mounting atop it victoriously (leaving me to flip off the computer screen). It's bad enough to make Harley lose, but does he have to be outright KOed by that Pokemon, of all things? I mean, take away his appeal points or something, but to be KOed by the ****ing Zenigame? Do the writers really need to go out of their way to make all villians end up looking that bad? My god, this is almost like Rocket Dan being beaten by Satoshi's Gomazou in the same episode that it hatched. Really, Harley's a character with great potential under his belt, but it seems they're letting all of it go to waste by turning him into Haruka's punching bag. This guy needs to friggin cream Haruka and soon, dammit. For Christ's sake, let it happen soon. Preferably, let him beat Haruka's Zenigame (or even more preferably, let him kill it..... damn, why does this have to be such a kid-friendly show? If there was a bit more of a mature theme, at least to the level of the Pocket Monsters movies, just a few character deaths happening in the main series could actually be feasible).

[cough] Anyway, just so everyone knows, I still like Haruka a lot, and I found that it was a great move adding her as a co-star (a second quest means less fillers overall, and with all these sweet-looking appeals, who can argue against adapting the game's contests). Her Zenigame's the only thing I hate, though, that and the whole lucky streak (which would really be the fault of lazy writing). But Haruka herself is still a good, likeable character who brings a lot to the show, and I doubt that my opinion of her will change, putting me on the other side of all these Haruka vs. Kasumi debates.

Last edited by Yamato-san; 25th September 2005 at 1:24 PM.

Yup, classes again. I'm gonna be at this for a while.

I translate for #Pocketmonsters (just because I know Japanese does not make me Japanese, stop PMing me).

Yamto-San was even more piss*d than I thought he would be. A great episode ruined by an ending that has become all too common in the Pokemon anime. It's episodes lik this that makes me thing they should ripped the anime out by the roots and start from scratch.

Some people don't think it's funny that Exit 69 gets off on Big Beaver.

[walks into the thread with a large, one-sided grin, head tilted sideways, and a random twitch every few seconds] I would like to thank Heracross. I stayed away from spoilers for yet another week until I saw the ep, which I finally did after Heracross sent me it when the bit torrent was giving me trouble.

[head snaps to an upright position with a sickly crick sound] You read me like a book. [one eye blinks slowly] Everyone's covered most of the points, but I'll mention what I can. And yeah, I am p*ssed.... extremely p*ssed..... Harley not only lost again, further preventing him from being token as a serious, regular villian (which is something this show needs so god damned badly), but he lost against..... THAT! And that thing scored a victory in the process...... god, if I were in the anime, and that Zenigame were in front of me right now, I'd be cracking my knuckles, say something to the effect of "kisamaaaaaa....!" or "kono gaki meeeeee....!" before dashing forward with a shouted "YURUSENE!!!" and beating it worse than what you'd expect from a gorey, X-rated remake of Musashi vs. Habunake.

Exactly. These writers purposely made Harley lose his cool, as well as make his Ariados seem like a one-trick pony, just to make Zenigame win a contest, which as stated, really shouldn't be doing at this early point in time. There were so many solutions to the problem, like the one The Big Al mention, or maybe pelt Zenigame with a Poison Sting, not only knocking it back, but lose footing on the web, causing it to fall. Hell, when the Ariados was falling, it could've used String Shot to snag Zenigame by the foot, and while I imagine the frozen web would shatter afterwards, it would help break Ariados's fall just a little and give it a chance to swing the damned cryptodira and slam it onto the ground.

Bulls***! As Cybercubed pointed out, new sagas of the anime start the same week the new generation of games are released in Japan. The Diamond/Pearl games aren't expected to come out until Summer of next year, and there's the possibility of it being pushed back further, so Harley winning would be completely irrelevent. And I too would rather have more contests than crap fillers, much like what we've been having lately. On top of that, Haruka's likely to lose at least one contest in each region anyway, just as much as Satoshi will likely have to rematch at least one gym each region (excluding Satoshi in the Orange Islands; we can only hope the anime hasn't sunk so low with having cheap, unrealistic characters with zero forms of character development), so why couldn't it be this one? You know, her first contest in the region, when her party's extremely unexperienced and most vulnerable?

Um, yeah, it's appreciative that Zenigame could be given a problem with its Ice Beam, however, it's still kinda stupid in that the problem wasn't evident when the Zenigame first pulled this move out of its a** in the previous episode. It seems to me that, only in the next episode, do the writers give Zenigame a problem just so Haruka can use it to her advantage. If they were a bit more consistent with having the problem apparent in the previous episode (maybe have Zenigame embed itself into the sandy ground due to the recoil), I'd be a little more happy about this tidbit, but since it wasn't apparent back then, it just seems like another last-minute excuse by the writers.

If I had hit list, you, sir, would be at the very top. If that horrid scene really does get avatared, I'll see to it that you go through hell. And I'm aware that I'm on a forum. That's why I'm gonna track ya down, do whatever possible to encounter you in real life. You better hope that it doesn't get made into an avatar, specially not a commonly-used one, and if it does, you better watch your a**.

Anyway, I can't argue with Sushi, the rest of this episode was very great, just that the ending outcome leaves an extremely bitter taste in my mouth. All the appeals were friggin outstanding, and I was laughing my head off during the Harley vs. Musashi match, both the stalling parts and Sounansu helplessly being turned into a puppet. Gotta love Harley dancing in the background like he was controlling a puppet (there's a scene worth avataring) XD. I was rather surprised when Musashi sent out Sounansu, too, and considering the preview clearly showed that this contest had Grand Festival rules, I'm amazed I didn't consider the possibility of her using a second Pokemon besides Sabonea.

Harley's battle against Haruka itself was also good..... until Haruka won -_-. Like Alfonso, I was really expecting he'd get this one. Sure, I saw the picture on the main page of Zenigame using Ice Beam to repel itself away from the web, and with that, I knew Haruka was gonna use that repelling to her advantage when it became apparent. However, after I saw the scene with that picture on the main page, I was thinking Harley would still get a last-minute win. After all, his appeal was pretty much flawless until that point, and Haruka's appeal gauge was about halfway empty. When Zenigame was sliding down the frozen web, Haruka commanding it to use Bubble, I was really expecting Ariados would clog its mouth with String Shot. But it didn't happen.... instead, Ariados gets hit, it falls, and my hopes come shattering to pieces once I saw Ariados land, fainted, and then..... that god damned turtle.... mounting atop it victoriously (leaving me to flip off the computer screen). It's bad enough to make Harley lose, but does he have to be outright KOed by that Pokemon, of all things? I mean, take away his appeal points or something, but to be KOed by the ****ing Zenigame? Do the writers really need to go out of their way to make all villians end up looking that bad? My god, this is almost like Rocket Dan being beaten by Satoshi's Gomazou in the same episode that it hatched. Really, Harley's a character with great potential under his belt, but it seems they're letting all of it go to waste by turning him into Haruka's punching bag. This guy needs to friggin cream Haruka and soon, dammit. For Christ's sake, let it happen soon. Preferably, let him beat Haruka's Zenigame (or even more preferably, let him kill it..... damn, why does this have to be such a kid-friendly show? If there was a bit more of a mature theme, at least to the level of the Pocket Monsters movies, just a few character deaths happening in the main series could actually be feasible).

[cough] Anyway, just so everyone knows, I still like Haruka a lot, and I found that it was a great move adding her as a co-star (a second quest means less fillers overall, and with all these sweet-looking appeals, who can argue against adapting the game's contests). Her Zenigame's the only thing I hate, though, that and the whole lucky streak (which would really be the fault of lazy writing). But Haruka herself is still a good, likeable character who brings a lot to the show, and I doubt that my opinion of her will change, putting me on the other side of all these Haruka vs. Kasumi debates.

I agree completely because I also hate May's squirtle{its voice irritates the life out of me}it makes me want to kick it right through a window.
Just imagine...
May:oh you won yipee!!
squirtle:Zennnnniiiiii!!
Harley{burning up in frustation}:Hahh take this
squirtle:ZENNNNIIII{smash}

If I had hit list, you, sir, would be at the very top. If that horrid scene really does get avatared, I'll see to it that you go through hell. And I'm aware that I'm on a forum. That's why I'm gonna track ya down, do whatever possible to encounter you in real life. You better hope that it doesn't get made into an avatar, specially not a commonly-used one, and if it does, you better watch your a**.

Dude, relax...its a freakin TV show. I'd like to see you try finding me. I'll just pretend that you're some pre-pubescent kid with ADHD, and you haven't had your ritalin yet. I'm sorry you feel so much hatred for May's Squirtle, or I'm sorry you feel so much love towards Harley. Think about it (do you really do that?), if Harley is such the villian you want him to be, then he will never win a contest that May is in. Look at Jessie. She's a villian, and she never wins even though a lot of us want her to (myself included).

Yes it sucks that Harley lost. Ariados could have shown much potential. I would have preferred to see Banette instead.

Um, yeah, it's appreciative that Zenigame could be given a problem with its Ice Beam, however, it's still kinda stupid in that the problem wasn't evident when the Zenigame first pulled this move out of its a** in the previous episode. It seems to me that, only in the next episode, do the writers give Zenigame a problem just so Haruka can use it to her advantage. If they were a bit more consistent with having the problem apparent in the previous episode (maybe have Zenigame embed itself into the sandy ground due to the recoil), I'd be a little more happy about this tidbit, but since it wasn't apparent back then, it just seems like another last-minute excuse by the writers.

Ever think that May and the others didn't notice the problem then because 1) Ice Beam was only used once and 2) Squirtle was in mid-air anyway when it did it?