Just tell us, you have to since you've mentioned your new pad like 80 times already and of course we're all curious since it is apparently downtown. Who the fuck is going to waste their time finding you in whatever building you live in, then come up to you and say, "Hey, I'm from SSP too, thanks to your user name I know where you live now. I'm just stopping by to say hi, see ya."

I have a good friend who lost his car because he went on an internet board and posted pictures of his car with a his house behind it. Sure enough, the pictures had the street sign and someone found his car. I have only mentioned it twice that I know of.

I have a good friend who lost his car because he went on an internet board and posted pictures of his car with a his house behind it. Sure enough, the pictures had the street sign and someone found his car. I have only mentioned it twice that I know of.

How do you know it was because the picture was posted online?? Could it be his car happened to get stolen, regardless of the fact the picture was there..? or did someone log on after the fact and write THANKS FOR THE CAR. I WAS ABLE TO FIND IT BECAUSE OF THE PICTURE!

P.S. Copper Square isn't that big of an area... My high school was bigger, so we've already got you zero'd in.

I attended the Patriot's Park meeting tonight and found it to be much better then the last one, very informative.

There still seems to be a feeling from the supporters of Patriot's Square that the developers are not listening to them and to the public, while the developers are pushing that they are listening and kept repeating themselves, almost pleading that they truely are listening and don't know how to show it and make people believe them.

Personally I do think they are listening from what they have said and presented. They created a list compiled from 94 pages of comments from the public and took out the key wishes of the public and put the in a list...

Events
Entertainment
Connectivity
Shade
Destination

The list is much longer but as was mentioned at the meeting, the park is only so big and only so much can be done with it.

They did state that it will not be a park with a softball field or football field.

It does seem like they are going toward a direction of a "destination" and from the pictures they presented of other spaces around the country, it looks like it will end up as a public space but with a hardscapes, fountains, art sculptures, etc...not large grass areas with huge trees where you can lay out a blanket and have a picnic. It will probably end up looking something like the center of Desert Ridge or the center area of Kierland Commons or the new Westgate in front of the AMC.

Personally I wish we could of had a large green area with grass and trees, I envisioned a mini Central Park NYC but there clearly isn't enough space.

They mentioned that a rendering has not yet been put together as they are still in the process of listening to the public and after the Feb 8th meeting, a rendering of the park will be put together sometime after that.

There were lots of comments, most, if not all, supporting the CityScape project. There was still some opposition to it becoming "high end" and that diversity need to be maintained which to me is a bunch of crap. I agree diversity is good...but what diversity is there now that it has to be maintained? There's homeless bums there and really not much else. Claiming "diversity must be maintained" sounds like beating around the bush from saying "We don't want the bums to be relocated" If there was true diversity down there now, we would see bums with the rich there together, but I definately don't see that many of one group living and shopping in the downtown area.

Agreed ... if there was a forum for affordability, homelessness, whatever, the Patriot's Square meeting was not it. Any discussion about what CityScape is or what it will bring should only be discussed as part of "activating the edges."

Anyways, I was very happy to see a full house, and the 94 page comment book (one of which I snagged, i'll see about getting a PDF up of it tomorrow) means that my earlier fears of a disjointed process can be put to rest. Given the turnout and what I read, anything they come up with has to pass muster.

To that end, I am pleased to hear the development team getting it with regards to shade, openness, etc (what PSP is not), and Jay Thorne's promise to "meet or exceed" the guiding principles of the park's board. However, it is clear from this and previous meetings that Thorne doesn't hold the public design process in high regard.

The retail question is important--they could have all the critical features, but placement of the retail component could make or break the design. Certainly, some amount should be on there, and they will etch out whatever they can, but questions about what they intend to build shouldn't be shoo'd under the rug. As I pointed out in the meeting, it's a basic math problem--the cost of the new park has to be below the equivalent land value of whatever they want to build, otherwise they would have dropped the idea of doing anything on the block.

RED has alluded to this, but I have to believe that building some sort of iconic park/plaza will be worth it in the end, especially when they get their $100 million check.

I think as was mentioned at the meeting, a successful Patriot's Park will help the whole CityScape development so it is in their best interest that this is something that meets what the people want. If they can put together a park or square that will attract people to it...and CityScape happens to be across the street, people will certainly cross the street to it.

Another awesome thing, and I'm not sure why it didn't click until I heard it tonight...light rail will run on the west and east side of Patriot's Square as well as the south and north of CityScape. How awesome is that going to be...hanging out in the park, maybe grabbing something to eat...seeing the trains go by...

CityScape needs to get this right, both the park and the rest of the development, because thousands of people are going to pass by it everyday...and if they see something they like out the train's window, they will come back to that location and enjoy it.

HX, great point. Cityscape is surrounded by light rail tracks. It will truly be the highest visibility project in DT Phoenix. That bodes well for it's success, as long as they don't blow it. I cannot imagine they will design something that isn't transit-freindly, pedestrian-friendly and a magnet destination for residents and tourists in the region. There have been public forums, substantial press coverage and a lot of hand-holding (and financial incentive) by the city to ensure this is done right. I am stoked about seeing the final design...just a couple more months

Interesting proposed rendering for Cityscape from the DFD ConoyerHedrick site--in their version, PSP would covered with a sprawling retail mall stretching over the three blocks (yellow), with residential (green), commercial (blue), and hotel (pink) towers as shown.

Note: DFDCH is not listed as part of the current development team, per the Cityscape website.

HooverDam, I know this isn't a Cityscape-related issue but since you mentioned it...I wonder what the hold-up is for the hotel at the Collier Center. With the major expansion of the convention center and the Collier Center's great location, by the convention center and across from the arena and baseball stadium, I would think it a no-brainer to build that hotel. I think the convention center expansion will be a great success and will all but guarantee high hotel occupancy rates. Since there are not near enough hotel rooms to support the convention center within walking distance, it seems logical that a Collier Center hotel be built now. Oh yah, and its right on the Light Rail line. Any thoughts anyone???