The bludgeoning home of the Elves vs Dwarves conflict? Two brief scenes constitutes "bludgeoning"?

No "right" or "wrong" here, just opinions. These are mine, and others have agreed with me. Clearly you don't. That's ok.

I don't think it was necessary to make up the bit about the Elves declining help, although I'll admit Thranduil's elk was spectacular. It was heavy-handed and overdone.

Tolkien was able to set up the conflict quite easily: Dwarves don't get on well with [Elves]. Even decent enough dwarves like Thorin and his friends think them foolish (which is a very foolish thing to think), or get annoyed with them. For some elves tease them and laugh at them,and most of all at their beards. Gandalf could have explained that to Bilbo easily just before they entered Rivendell.

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Dreary means lifeless and depressing. None of the action sequences fit this description. I on the other hand, saw scenes that stressed the evil of the Orcs, the teamwork of the Dwarves and the danger of the quest. Nothing depressing or lifeless. Sorry, nope.

Ineffectual Orcs? You have to show danger but the principals obviously can't die, so why nitpick this? Azog was hardly ineffectual when he decapitated the Dwarf King.

It's not at all obvious, at least to many audience members, that none of the dwarves will be picked off. More importantly, it's absurd to show hundreds of orcs attacking 13 dwarves and a hobbit and they fight their way out with what seems like trivial ease; to show more hundreds being effortlessly swept off impractical catwalks, etc. Since most of the shots were from a high, distant vantage point, you couldn't even see the teamwork (as, for instance, you could with the Fellowship in Moria). It may sound strange to speak of credibility in a fantasy movie about dwarves and orcs, but there is such a thing. These sequences of repetitive, cartoon violence didn't contain any credible threats or interesting situations, they were just loud and boring, which is dreary in my book.

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Drawn out White Council segment? This was necessary exposition, restating the threat of Smaug beyond a simple revenge quest, the reasoning for concern for Dol Guldur, and the seeds of Sauron's reemergence.

You don't think that contributed? What part of the following doesn't contribute?

1. Re-stressing the threat of Smaug. 2. Laying the foundation for the reemergence of Sauron 3. Hinting at the later turn of Saruman through his lack of support of Gandalf, and general arrogance. 4. Foreshadowing Galadriel's role in the fall of Guldur. 5. Setting the stage for the shadow of Sauron's rise in Rings by mentioning the watchful peace, and visually portraying those that fought against him in the early days (Elrond)

Well, I'm in the camp that thinks playing out this whole Dol Guldur subplot is unnecessary. Smaug's threat was made quite clear in the Prolog. It's not necessary to tie the Necromancer to Sauron at this point, he can be sufficiently sinister on his own. And we have no idea what Galadriel's role is going to be. In any case, it has nothing to do with this movie, and weakens it. They could reveal all this stuff later, when it's more relevant.

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Patently phony? For you to say that and be right, you would have to know for sure that PJ and crew were motivated by ill designs when they wrote that scene and purposely wrote it to anger fans and arbitrarily invent something that has no meaning in order to be false artistically just to anger some fans.

I don't accuse PJ and crew of any of those things, only of allowing this to become a routine fantasy blockbuster instead of a unique story.

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This scene is EXACTLY true to the spirit of not only the book, but the characters because the KEY CONCEPT here is Bilbo proving himself to a reluctant Thorin, and gaining the respect of the Dwarves which is EXACTLY what happens in the book thematically.

Eventually, yes, but not so soon. This was a fake scene that looks thrown in to gain some closure for this movie -- probably at the last minute, since AUJ was apparently planned to end with the barrels in the river. IMO it would have been a stronger ending if they had just gone with the eagles' rescue of the company from the wargs and fire, which is what happens in the book actually. Leave the tension between Thorin and Bilbo to simmer a while longer.

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You don't speak for Peter Jackson. You speak for yourself.

Of course. That's all any of us can do. ...

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When I see the Hobbit, I see an army of talented people working and dedicating years of their lives to try and bring a classic book to life, and the end result is a film that not only captures the SPIRIT and ESSENCE of the book and its themes, but the essence of the characters as well.

I don't demean their talents or their intent in the slightest. The result is open to the judgement of the viewers. Obviously some disagree with you, or the subject of this thread wouldn't be what it is.

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