It sure would be childish if it were true, but there never was such a debate. You misread things. I thought I reacted against the notion that one desiring to use "pinches" and the like in regards to just sauce additions were somewhat misguided or insufficient or useless or what-not.

Simply put, Ron posted a handful of spices to throw into a can of 6 in 1's. He qualified his post in these ways.

...They take a taste and because of experience know how it will translate into the final dish. That technique, however, is not the way to convey information to others who may not be as experienced, keen in the palate or aware of the intended results...

Some how the bar got raised to include moms and grandmothers in throwing pinches and 'a touch' of ingredients into meals. Then the bar was raised again to include professional pizza makers ruining entire buckets of sauce. Finally it stretched into celebrity cooks adding "pinches, dashes, dabs and bits" of additives to their food concoctions.

I thought we were strictly speaking of pizza sauce made with 6 in 1's.

I know nothing about pizza except what I have learned here. Just a few months ago Ragu spaghetti sauce was pretty dang good on my pizzas. (Assuming that I could actually get a pizza off of my baking sheet peel with cornmeal on it.) I appreciate Rons attempt to provide something that anyone can reproduce, irregardless if they like it or how fresh their spices are.

BTB I appreciate your knowledge and contributions to the forum. Everything that I know comes from post from experienced people such as yourself. I believe that Rons post stands on its own merit, as do all of yours.

Moving forward, I don't know if its been mentioned lately, but here's a couple of suggestions to try and flavor the sauce with if you haven't all ready. One is to take a small amount of fennel seeds, crush them on a surface with a spoon and add to sauce. Crushing the seeds releases some very powerful Italian flavoring in the spice, so one should be cautious to avoid overpowering the sauce with too much fennel flavoring. One of my Penzey spices is India Ground Fennel Seed, but I kind of prefer just crushing some seeds from a bag.

Similarly, anise seeds is another very popular Italian spice totally different from fennel, but predominates in certain regions of Italy and a number of old fashion pizzerias in the U.S. use it either in their sauce and/or their home made sausage. Suggest to also crush a small amount and add it to some sauce and see if you like it. But I don't recommend putting both fennel and anise in the same sauce. Try one or the other. And I only do this once in a while for sauce in thin crust versions and not deep dish styles.

--BTB

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buceriasdon

BTB, This is quite the concidence as one of the returning guests to the hotel where I work and live brought me down two bags of fennel today! Can't get it here and I was running low. Bless her heart for remembering I use fennel in my sauce. Don

Moving forward, I don't know if its been mentioned lately, but here's a couple of suggestions to try and flavor the sauce with if you haven't all ready. One is to take a small amount of fennel seeds, crush them on a surface with a spoon and add to sauce. Crushing the seeds releases some very powerful Italian flavoring in the spice, so one should be cautious to avoid overpowering the sauce with too much fennel flavoring. One of my Penzey spices is India Ground Fennel Seed, but I kind of prefer just crushing some seeds from a bag.

Similarly, anise seeds is another very popular Italian spice totally different from fennel, but predominates in certain regions of Italy and a number of old fashion pizzerias in the U.S. use it either in their sauce and/or their home made sausage. Suggest to also crush a small amount and add it to some sauce and see if you like it. But I don't recommend putting both fennel and anise in the same sauce. Try one or the other. And I only do this once in a while for sauce in thin crust versions and not deep dish styles.

If you're having truoble getting herbs and spices (I'm not sure if they ship out side of the USA) - for US pizza makers / cooks this is a real good spice source and they have both ground fennel and ground anise. I have some that I use both in cookie making and Itallian pizza sausage topping making:

This is quite the concidence as one of the returning guests to the hotel where I work and live brought me down two bags of fennel today! Can't get it here and I was running low. Bless her heart for remembering I use fennel in my sauce.

Don, in my youth, the great independent mom and pop pizzerias in the midwest most commonly had some degree of fennel in their pizza sauces. For some reason, it seems to be gone to a large degree, unfortunately, from the pizzeria sauce recipes of today. It's good that you like using it. I bet it would be good in that bar room thin and crispy pizza that you recently reported on in the Cracker Style section, which looked really good. --BTB

my family comes from the Italian area that puts fennel in their sausage...not in the sauce. How much fennel would you suppose would give the sauce a hint but not overwhelm. I'd love some sausage flavor in my non sausage pizzas. My wife gets tired of living on oregano. I put fennel at a rate of 3 teaspoons in 10 lbs of sausasage and since I like the flavor, I crack the seeds in a mill until they are broken into 1/3ds to 1/2s. My guess would be to start at about a half teaspoon in a 1lb 12 oz can of 6 in 1. 1/2 teaspoonful is 1.2 gms by my measure so it would work out to about 0.15% by weight. That's about 1 and 1/2 times the amount of the oregano as I throw and fennel is as potent as oregano once cracked but more compact.

The amount of fennel in my sausage is 3 teaspoonsful in 10 pounds, this works out to be 0.15% based on the pork weight. Some how that math worked out the same but the fennel expression in my sausage is too pronounced for a sauce. so I guess about half of the 1/2 teaspoon would be more subdued, I'd add 1/4 teaspoon or about 0.08% to the sauce and crack it in my spice grinder. Since fennel is a hard seed that takes time to exert its flavor, it would be difficult to taste it and tell if it was right immediately. I'd need to wait a day or so to see how it permeates and adjust more if needed, I want to be on the low end initially.

Id love to hear from anybody who puts fennel in their sauce and as to what extent.

anyway it was by far the best NY style sauce I ever made and the crew also commented how tasty it was I ended up with close to 4 qts. so even after 10 pies I have about 5 nice size containers left for the freezer YUMMY!John

As a newbie myself, I'm glad this thread started and I hope it will get some more attention and postings. I am just getting ready to start mixing my own sauces so I really appreciate the comments here. Thanks to Bill also for leading me to this thread. Keep em comin!

Regina

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Regina

"Everybody needs beauty as well as bread, places to play in and pray in, where nature may heal and give strength to body and soul." John Muir

Growing up in SW mich. in the 60's,pizza to me was Pizza Hut and the few independent pizza's around weren't very good.Then Mama Mortarano's opened in Watervliet and introduced me to the wonderful world of quality pizza.She moved to St. Joseph,Mi. and made the same wonderful pizza till she closed about 10 yrs ago(?).She used some kind of pepperoni that was in thicker rectangular "slabs" on the pie and her sauce had a sweet ingredient that I've been trying to find for yrs without success.I've used fennel in Swedish bread and tomato sauces,it's close but not it.I don't think I've tried anise,I'll have too try that soon,thanks. Are there some tomato types that could be that much sweeter in flavor than normal Romas? I'll have to try 6 in 1's when I finish my Redpack sauce.

Don,You will probably never go back to the red packs after you try the 6 in 1's.Its amazing whats out there,that we may not have tried yet.The 6 in 1's are a base to start off with,and it has a very strong tomato smell and flavor.Its really nice to make into a sauce.

Don,You will probably never go back to the red packs after you try the 6 in 1's.Its amazing whats out there,that we may not have tried yet.The 6 in 1's are a base to start off with,and it has a very strong tomato smell and flavor.Its really nice to make into a sauce.

The 6 in 1's are great. I loved them, but I've found a new love in the Stanislaus 7/11's

Don,You will probably never go back to the red packs after you try the 6 in 1's.Its amazing whats out there,that we may not have tried yet.The 6 in 1's are a base to start off with,and it has a very strong tomato smell and flavor.Its really nice to make into a sauce.

The 6 in 1's are great. I loved them, but I've found a new love in the Stanislaus 7/11's

Thanks for the recommendationsWe've got a GFS and a StanzFS in the area,I'll bet I find one or both of these brands,I'll definitely be looking for them next time.The Redpack was fine for a base to add "stuff" to and for $4.99 @over 6lbs,a great price. But I think I liked the GFS PrimoGusto slightly better and was going to try something new next time anyway.It's great to get help and advise from others experience on this forum.My pizza's are so much better as a direct result,can't wait to try one of these!!Thanks again!!!

Growing up in SW mich. in the 60's,pizza to me was Pizza Hut and the few independent pizza's around weren't very good.Then Mama Mortarano's opened in Watervliet and introduced me to the wonderful world of quality pizza.She moved to St. Joseph,Mi. and made the same wonderful pizza till she closed about 10 yrs ago(?).She used some kind of pepperoni that was in thicker rectangular "slabs" on the pie and her sauce had a sweet ingredient that I've been trying to find for yrs without success.

DonC, you bring to mind some fond, old memories for me of some great pizzas in SW Michigan that are no longer around. I, too, use to love Mama Mortorano's in Watervliet and watched her many times cutting the pizzas with those long special pizza sissors. After she left town, we occasionally went to her ex-husband' place in Coloma, Papa Mortorano's, but it was never as good as his wife's pizza. Mama Cupani's was good for many years, too, until she closed. She made her own great pepperoni that was put on pizzas in clumps much like normal Italian sausage was. To me her's was the best pepperoni in the world.

Now that area has no decent pizza. And the PH there is terrible. But with the new Indian Casino opening this summer between Watervliet and Hartford, there are many new food places and restaurants being started to get some of the passing business there. Hopefully, a decent pizza place will be among them.

GFS in Benton Harbor has 6 in 1's, but in the larger cans, unfortunately.

Since I only make one pizza a week, I would like to freeze in 3 containers the remaining sauce. My question is if one can will sauce four approximately 14" pizzas (does that sound right?), should I add the spices and freeze, or just freeze the sauce and add the spices upon thawing?

Regina

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Regina

"Everybody needs beauty as well as bread, places to play in and pray in, where nature may heal and give strength to body and soul." John Muir

DonC, you bring to mind some fond, old memories for me of some great pizzas in SW Michigan that are no longer around. I, too, use to love Mama Mortorano's in Watervliet and watched her many times cutting the pizzas with those long special pizza sissors. After she left town, we occasionally went to her ex-husband' place in Coloma, Papa Mortorano's, but it was never as good as his wife's pizza. Mama Cupani's was good for many years, too, until she closed. She made her own great pepperoni that was put on pizzas in clumps much like normal Italian sausage was. To me her's was the best pepperoni in the world.

Now that area has no decent pizza. And the PH there is terrible. But with the new Indian Casino opening this summer between Watervliet and Hartford, there are many new food places and restaurants being started to get some of the passing business there. Hopefully, a decent pizza place will be among them.

GFS in Benton Harbor has 6 in 1's, but in the larger cans, unfortunately.Wow,I'm thrilled that someone here knew bout Mama Mortorano"s!!! She actually opened in St.Joe after Watervliet and it was the same wonderful pizza,I've never found any other pizza as good to me.I tried the Mortorano's in Coloma(where I grew up) also,I agree only the name was the same!Do you remember her sauce as having a very distinctive sweet type ingredient?If so,any guess"s? I've been trying to find that wonderful flavor for yrs and just can't find the key!! I'll try some anise next and my next can of sauce I'll try 6in 1's,maybe she used them.Do you know if they have a distinctively different sweeter flavor over a regular pizza sauce? We go to the GFS in Benton Harbor or South Bend,also the Stanz foods by the South Bend airport just off the bypass.I thought I'd seen 6in1's at one or more of them. What a small world!! --BTB

Since I only make one pizza a week, I would like to freeze in 3 containers the remaining sauce. My question is if one can will sauce four approximately 14" pizzas (does that sound right?), should I add the spices and freeze, or just freeze the sauce and add the spices upon thawing?

Regina

Regina,I suggest you to try doing it both ways for yourself.Freeze one mixed up with your spices already,and one plain.See what your palate tells you after its thawed.

I have heard of mixed ideas on what to do or not,and found its easier to try it myself.I have found freezing a sauce with my spices mixed in,to thaw out and taste just fine.

One good idea,is to mix up a sauce,and place into the fridge overnight to let the spices/flavor come together.The next day,take it out,mix up some more and put into the freezer until needed.

We went to the Benton Harbor this afternoon and they had 6in1's.I bought a 6lb9oz can for $5.29 and a 2lb block of red star ADY for $5.49.I can't wait to open the 6in1's but I've got a couple jars of redpack in the freezer to use up first.

DonC, the 6 in 1's are among the best for pizzas in my experience. I often add a little sugar (either white or brown) to the 6 in 1's, maybe as much as 1 tsp. for an amount that would go on one pizza. I refrain a lot now from adding too many things to the tomato sauce apart from that. But I do sprinkle "pinches" of oregano and/or dried basil to the top of the pizza right before going into the oven as shown on this cooked pizza.

Did you get a chance to go to Silver Beach Pizza while in the Benton Harbor/St. Joseph area? Best pizza in that area.

DonC, the 6 in 1's are among the best for pizzas in my experience. I often add a little sugar (either white or brown) to the 6 in 1's, maybe as much as 1 tsp. for an amount that would go on one pizza. I refrain a lot now from adding too many things to the tomato sauce apart from that. But I do sprinkle "pinches" of oregano and/or dried basil to the top of the pizza right before going into the oven as shown on this cooked pizza.

Did you get a chance to go to Silver Beach Pizza while in the Benton Harbor/St. Joseph area? Best pizza in that area.

--BTB

Thanks for the sauce tips,I like to add a little sugar to cut the tomato acidity,garlic,and a little italian seasoning.I'll have to try the herbs on top like that.I haven't tried S.B.pizza yet we're on a very tite budget and don't eat out other than special occasions but St.Joe's only a few miles up the road from us(Berrien Springs) That whole Silver Beach area below the bluff is unrecognizable to me from just a few yrs ago with all the development.To be honest,I usually avoid St Joe(other than when Mama Mortarano was there) because of the tourist traps there for Chicago people but I'll make a point to try their pizza soon.Thanks!!

Well I've used the 6 in 1 on several pizza's now and it is a very high quality product.My wife really loves it,especially in a pasta meat sauce I used it in.To be perfectly honest the pieces of skin aren't something I'm crazy about and altho I could happily use it permanently without any complaints,I think I prefer the Gordon foods "Primo Gusto"brand.They both have an excellent flavor(to me),I just personally like less skin and seeds in my sauce,others will prefer it. I was also hoping that not having citric acid in the 6 in 1's would give them a much better,noticably sweeter flavor.It does have a good flavor,but I didn't notice it as being sweeter than the other quality sauces.I probably don't have a very refined palate tho,especially compared to the experts here!!!LOL

I have the same problem with the 6 in1's and the skins,but the folks here told me they have other versions of 6 in 1's that don't have the skins.

Maybe see if your local GFS can order that one.The ones they tend to stock are unpeeled ground tomatoes,hence the heavy skins.

I sometimes will take 28 oz of 6 in 1's it from the can and put into a bowl.With a hand mixer,I will pulse blend a little at a time to reduce the amounts of peels in it.It does help a little bit.Ya wont get it all,but it reduces it some.

What Primo can of tomatoes/sauce did you buy?I have tried most of the Primo sauces in the cans and they were not ideal me.These days,If a can says its made with "Paste and water" on the label,I walk away.Its never what Im looking for.Yet if you tried something I havent,I will pick some up next time for a test.

I would think that if you ran the 6-in-1's through a food mill, you would easily lose the skins and the seeds. I have an Oxo food mill, and I may try that on the 6 in 1's, because my teenage daughter does not like any peeling or chunks in her sauce. I have used the mill for whole tomatoes, and they come out beautiful, with no skins or seeds. Mark

I would think that if you ran the 6-in-1's through a food mill, you would easily lose the skins and the seeds. I have an Oxo food mill, and I may try that on the 6 in 1's, because my teenage daughter does not like any peeling or chunks in her sauce. I have used the mill for whole tomatoes, and they come out beautiful, with no skins or seeds. Mark

Thanks for the tip.I do not have one of those,so for now,I the hand mixer is ok.I do plan to buy a food mill of some type soon,sounds like it can go a very long ways.