Author
Topic: Relatives who just don't get it (Read 1163307 times)

One of my coworkers is going to Disney in November with her family (herself, husband, 2 adult children with their families). They're planning to be there for a week, staying at one of the on-site hotels. They do this every year. They just bought a new car (a Cadillac of some flavor) for the drive (last year, they bought a Lexus for the drive). Of course, everyone must have new clothes for the vacation and all four grandchildren must have new Ipads so they can take pictures.

She told me this week that they'd cashed out her husband's 401K because they needed the money to pay off their credit cards so they'd be available for use on the Disney trip.

God damn, who buys a new car for a drive? Twice in a row?

Can I brag for a second? My 17-year-old buick, which I bought when it was 11 years old, has been to forty-nine states, driven by me within a two year span. Six Canadian provinces, some twenty-odd national parks. It was bought, maintained, and repaired on the budget of a college kid doing coop for half the year. Driven cross-country five times on that same budget, plus several other 1000+ and 2000+ road trips, all within that timeframe. (Since then, it's been driven a hell of a lot more, obviously.)

Sure, there were some mild issues - put 40k miles of road trip on a car and an issue can happen. But come on, a new car to drive to fucking disney? I'd drive across the country with two days warning on either one of my cars, no sweat; 150k and 90k miles on the clocks of each respectively.

Grandparents keep asking me when I'm going to go back to college. I dropped out 11 or so years ago, and am happily home schooling my 3 kids. I also make and sell paintings and illustrations, and teach fun paint classes. But apparently I'm not achieving enough to satisfy them.

"Toffee, aren't you ever going to get a degree?""What would I do with a degree?""Anything you want!""Don't worry, I'm already doing anything I want."

Love this. I get this about holidays sometimes - no, I'm not desperate for a holiday because my daily life isn't so awful that I need to get away from it every few months!

*snip*Can I brag for a second? My 17-year-old buick, which I bought when it was 11 years old, has been to forty-nine states, driven by me within a two year span. Six Canadian provinces, some twenty-odd national parks.*snip*

Oh please tell me that the non-contiguous state was not Alaska. :) But seriously, that is really impressive.

Can I brag for a second? My 17-year-old buick, which I bought when it was 11 years old, has been to forty-nine states, driven by me within a two year span. Six Canadian provinces, some twenty-odd national parks. It was bought, maintained, and repaired on the budget of a college kid doing coop for half the year. Driven cross-country five times on that same budget, plus several other 1000+ and 2000+ road trips, all within that timeframe. (Since then, it's been driven a hell of a lot more, obviously.)

Sure, there were some mild issues - put 40k miles of road trip on a car and an issue can happen. But come on, a new car to drive to fucking disney? I'd drive across the country with two days warning on either one of my cars, no sweat; 150k and 90k miles on the clocks of each respectively.

Playing with FIRE UK: Only that you'll be buying them presents for a good long while, so it'll even up over the years. And that they won't notice/care! Either that or to get them all a similar thing: e.g. All of my present receivers this year got a book, which has a naturally small variation in cost.

Thanks shelivesthedream and zolotiyeruki. I'm sure this is entirely in my head. I'm a bit more sensitive to it than a well-adjusted person because there are a couple of relatives the generation above on one side who would make a big deal of buying bigger presents for their favourites (including one shining star who would buy a birthday present for one TWIN and 'forget' the other). Probably the bigger gift is constraining the neurotic behaviour to this generation.

Father buys new house , that he can't afford, to impress.Then redoes the interior to fit a vacuuming system in the walls, that he can't afford, to impress.To top it off, he installs a totally unnecessary massive automatic gate, that he can't afford, you've guessed it, to impress...

Now notices that he has boxed himself in a corner, but he finds a sulotion!Frugality? Selling stuff? Putting a stop to renovations until solvent? No, no, no...He "forgets" to pay alimony to my mum...

And he does stuff like this all the time... just makes me scared that I'll have to pay for his upkeep in old age because he blew his high income "to impress".

Father buys new house , that he can't afford, to impress.Then redoes the interior to fit a vacuuming system in the walls, that he can't afford, to impress.To top it off, he installs a totally unnecessary massive automatic gate, that he can't afford, you've guessed it, to impress...

Now notices that he has boxed himself in a corner, but he finds a sulotion!Frugality? Selling stuff? Putting a stop to renovations until solvent? No, no, no...He "forgets" to pay alimony to my mum...

And he does stuff like this all the time... just makes me scared that I'll have to pay for his upkeep in old age because he blew his high income "to impress".

And he does stuff like this all the time... just makes me scared that I'll have to pay for his upkeep in old age because he blew his high income "to impress".

If my father had done that, I would disown him until he mended his ways. Non-negotiable.

My brother and I no longer live in France, so I'm "safe". My sister is not rich and had to fight and scratch what she has, I hope he will not make her life hell.I have not seen my dad in 6 years, and he has yet to met his 4 year old gran daughter.Appart from the personal "I had enough", I was studying to be an unlimited marine officer, and wanted to keep his "money weirdness" far because companies in my sector can and will check your next of kin.As an example, I can't have him send money to my daughter's saving account, because that money could have been awarded by a judge to my mum and come from a unclear source. This could drag me into their mess and into radar of my company... Etc.

To make thing worse, my family has a habit of keeping "secrets" of things that should be in the open, so logical is not and illogical has a strong foundation of smoke+shadows.

He kept a five figure credit card debt hidden from his wife, until they went to refinance their house to pull equity for a kitchen remodel. So, they went ahead with the refi and took the equity to pay that off.

Then he went and bought a new to him Mercedes, since his company car had to be returned. Of course, there is a loan for that.

Then since he refi'd his condo (in addition to the house) and won't have to make a mortgage payment for January, and he gets an 'extra' paycheck in December he and his wife are flying to Iceland for 5 days because... they 'like the idea of being the type of who can just go to Iceland for the weekend.'

...and those are just what has happened this month. Don't get me started on his rare book buying and selling 'business' and his Mont-whatever pen habit.

UGH! Thank goodness DH agrees with me that these are ridiculous, so we have a good chuckle when we get over the fact that someone you love keeps shooting themselves in the foot.

Husband kind of counts as a relative, and I'm not starting a new thread, so... :)

The electric bill came. For 2 months. 70$ higher than expected. As always, for the first bill of winter. In that I spend the first 2 months harping on about things we can do (and I am doing, but we're 2 adults and the thermostat only stays down if the second adult doesn't keep raising it...) to save $ on electricity, but it's only after the first bill comes and he has a shock at the amount that he starts bloody listening insread of rolling his eyes and ignoring. *ahem* every year. Every damned year it's the same thing, and it gets on my last NERVE.

For the record: we talked it out, we figured it out, he's apologetic, it may improve, etc... but man, it's gonna take my patience a few days to calm the hell down.

One of my coworkers is going to Disney in November with her family (herself, husband, 2 adult children with their families). They're planning to be there for a week, staying at one of the on-site hotels. They do this every year. They just bought a new car (a Cadillac of some flavor) for the drive (last year, they bought a Lexus for the drive). Of course, everyone must have new clothes for the vacation and all four grandchildren must have new Ipads so they can take pictures.

She told me this week that they'd cashed out her husband's 401K because they needed the money to pay off their credit cards so they'd be available for use on the Disney trip.

God damn, who buys a new car for a drive? Twice in a row?

Can I brag for a second? My 17-year-old buick, which I bought when it was 11 years old, has been to forty-nine states, driven by me within a two year span. Six Canadian provinces, some twenty-odd national parks. It was bought, maintained, and repaired on the budget of a college kid doing coop for half the year. Driven cross-country five times on that same budget, plus several other 1000+ and 2000+ road trips, all within that timeframe. (Since then, it's been driven a hell of a lot more, obviously.)

Sure, there were some mild issues - put 40k miles of road trip on a car and an issue can happen. But come on, a new car to drive to fucking disney? I'd drive across the country with two days warning on either one of my cars, no sweat; 150k and 90k miles on the clocks of each respectively.

Oddly enough this reminded me of my BIL. He wasn't sure if his car (brand new 2016 Toyota Corolla) could make the drive from Tulsa, OK to Branson, MO. That's a grand total of 221 miles one-way, so him and his buddies paid to rent a car for the trip.

This conversation happened in my Prius with 120k miles that I've driven cross country in just this year. He had me confused...

One of my coworkers is going to Disney in November with her family (herself, husband, 2 adult children with their families). They're planning to be there for a week, staying at one of the on-site hotels. They do this every year. They just bought a new car (a Cadillac of some flavor) for the drive (last year, they bought a Lexus for the drive). Of course, everyone must have new clothes for the vacation and all four grandchildren must have new Ipads so they can take pictures.

She told me this week that they'd cashed out her husband's 401K because they needed the money to pay off their credit cards so they'd be available for use on the Disney trip.

God damn, who buys a new car for a drive? Twice in a row?

Can I brag for a second? My 17-year-old buick, which I bought when it was 11 years old, has been to forty-nine states, driven by me within a two year span. Six Canadian provinces, some twenty-odd national parks. It was bought, maintained, and repaired on the budget of a college kid doing coop for half the year. Driven cross-country five times on that same budget, plus several other 1000+ and 2000+ road trips, all within that timeframe. (Since then, it's been driven a hell of a lot more, obviously.)

Sure, there were some mild issues - put 40k miles of road trip on a car and an issue can happen. But come on, a new car to drive to fucking disney? I'd drive across the country with two days warning on either one of my cars, no sweat; 150k and 90k miles on the clocks of each respectively.

Oddly enough this reminded me of my BIL. He wasn't sure if his car (brand new 2016 Toyota Corolla) could make the drive from Tulsa, OK to Branson, MO. That's a grand total of 221 miles one-way, so him and his buddies paid to rent a car for the trip.

This conversation happened in my Prius with 120k miles that I've driven cross country in just this year. He had me confused...

Maybe he thought the car was too inexperienced? Like runners, start at 5k and slowly add distance...

He kept a five figure credit card debt hidden from his wife, until they went to refinance their house to pull equity for a kitchen remodel. So, they went ahead with the refi and took the equity to pay that off.

I'm a pretty chill person but this alone would be a break up offense if he were my partner. Not the slow creep of credit card debt, but the hiding. My boyfriend is bad with money, we regularly have to sit down and talk about how he can cut back and what his goals are. But if I found out he was hiding debt so that he didn't have to deal with it I would probably flip my shit.

He kept a five figure credit card debt hidden from his wife, until they went to refinance their house to pull equity for a kitchen remodel. So, they went ahead with the refi and took the equity to pay that off.

I'm a pretty chill person but this alone would be a break up offense if he were my partner. Not the slow creep of credit card debt, but the hiding. My boyfriend is bad with money, we regularly have to sit down and talk about how he can cut back and what his goals are. But if I found out he was hiding debt so that he didn't have to deal with it I would probably flip my shit.

Word. WORD.

I have very few "this is over right now" offenses. Dishonesty on something that impacts me is 100% one of them. (Aka: financial dishonesty, hiding infidelity, that sort of nonsense.)

"Oh, you hid major debt from me and now it impacts us both, lemme just co-sign a larger loan with you" = SO FAR from anyogical réaction I can even begin to contemplate that I don't u derstand how someone can go there.

Oddly enough this reminded me of my BIL. He wasn't sure if his car (brand new 2016 Toyota Corolla) could make the drive from Tulsa, OK to Branson, MO. That's a grand total of 221 miles one-way, so him and his buddies paid to rent a car for the trip.

This conversation happened in my Prius with 120k miles that I've driven cross country in just this year. He had me confused...

... 221 miles? Oh lawd, you might die of dysentery on the way. Or you'll be there in three hours... your BIL might be overcautious, but come the fuck on!

*snip*Can I brag for a second? My 17-year-old buick, which I bought when it was 11 years old, has been to forty-nine states, driven by me within a two year span. Six Canadian provinces, some twenty-odd national parks.*snip*

Oh please tell me that the non-contiguous state was not Alaska. :) But seriously, that is really impressive.

The only state missing from that list is Hawaii. Alaska is on it. Not only is Alaska on it, but this car has been beneath the aurora just north of Fairbanks ... with photographic evidence.

There's something wrong with it right now, it's hard starting / half-starting, about 50% of the time. Given that it's half-starting, which is incredibly strange, I'm guessing that (unless there's a fuel/fueling issue) one of my engine sensors is dying - perhaps cam position sensor. So with a seventeen year old buick with a possibly failing camshaft position sensor, am I going to get rid of it? Fuck no. It's getting fixed. Just like every other time something's ever gone wrong.

If I had cash to throw, I'd buy a Chevy SS in manual, but though I could easily afford one, the buick is ship-of-theseus-ing over time.

Oddly enough this reminded me of my BIL. He wasn't sure if his car (brand new 2016 Toyota Corolla) could make the drive from Tulsa, OK to Branson, MO. That's a grand total of 221 miles one-way, so him and his buddies paid to rent a car for the trip.

This conversation happened in my Prius with 120k miles that I've driven cross country in just this year. He had me confused...

Always clean sensor and test before replacing...Sounds like the throttle body to me, the grease in there might have dried up.Take out, clean, degrease and grease. That kind of thing can usually be negotiated in beer with the neighbourhood petrol head (it's a small job).

... 221 miles? Oh lawd, you might die of dysentery on the way. Or you'll be there in three hours... your BIL might be overcautious, but come the fuck on!

*snip*Can I brag for a second? My 17-year-old buick, which I bought when it was 11 years old, has been to forty-nine states, driven by me within a two year span. Six Canadian provinces, some twenty-odd national parks.*snip*

Oh please tell me that the non-contiguous state was not Alaska. :) But seriously, that is really impressive.

The only state missing from that list is Hawaii. Alaska is on it. Not only is Alaska on it, but this car has been beneath the aurora just north of Fairbanks ... with photographic evidence.

There's something wrong with it right now, it's hard starting / half-starting, about 50% of the time. Given that it's half-starting, which is incredibly strange, I'm guessing that (unless there's a fuel/fueling issue) one of my engine sensors is dying - perhaps cam position sensor. So with a seventeen year old buick with a possibly failing camshaft position sensor, am I going to get rid of it? Fuck no. It's getting fixed. Just like every other time something's ever gone wrong.

If I had cash to throw, I'd buy a Chevy SS in manual, but though I could easily afford one, the buick is ship-of-theseus-ing over time.

Husband kind of counts as a relative, and I'm not starting a new thread, so... :)

The electric bill came. For 2 months. 70$ higher than expected. As always, for the first bill of winter. In that I spend the first 2 months harping on about things we can do (and I am doing, but we're 2 adults and the thermostat only stays down if the second adult doesn't keep raising it...) to save $ on electricity, but it's only after the first bill comes and he has a shock at the amount that he starts bloody listening insread of rolling his eyes and ignoring. *ahem* every year. Every damned year it's the same thing, and it gets on my last NERVE.

For the record: we talked it out, we figured it out, he's apologetic, it may improve, etc... but man, it's gonna take my patience a few days to calm the hell down.

My old place had a thermostat with an offset, I could set it to show 19ºC when the actual temperature is 17ºC. It was excellent.

My SO also had a total disconnect between fuel bills and behaviour. I'd come home in winter to find him sitting in underwear with the heating on full AND a secondary heater on full. Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

Husband kind of counts as a relative, and I'm not starting a new thread, so... :)

The electric bill came. For 2 months. 70$ higher than expected. As always, for the first bill of winter. In that I spend the first 2 months harping on about things we can do (and I am doing, but we're 2 adults and the thermostat only stays down if the second adult doesn't keep raising it...) to save $ on electricity, but it's only after the first bill comes and he has a shock at the amount that he starts bloody listening insread of rolling his eyes and ignoring. *ahem* every year. Every damned year it's the same thing, and it gets on my last NERVE.

For the record: we talked it out, we figured it out, he's apologetic, it may improve, etc... but man, it's gonna take my patience a few days to calm the hell down.

My old place had a thermostat with an offset, I could set it to show 19ºC when the actual temperature is 17ºC. It was excellent.

My SO also had a total disconnect between fuel bills and behaviour. I'd come home in winter to find him sitting in underwear with the heating on full AND a secondary heater on full. Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

Oh. My. God. The disconnect between behaviour and reality...

Yeah, with my husband it's more that he sees a logical need and an easy solution (I am cold, I will turn up the heat) and completely ignores the impact of that behaviour on the bill that comes in 2 months later. Like they're not even connected naturally in his brain or something... until he gets the first bill, freaks at the amount, and that seems to solder a connection. Except that that's the case every year. Like, love, TRY to retain that learning for more than 6 months at a time, hmmmm?

Also honestly part of the problem is that I'm in charge of the household finances and better with money (erm... when we got together, his credit was so shitty he couldn't get a CELL PHONE... granted he was 24 and I wouldn't marry him until he pulled it together, but.) and so if we need 70$ somewhere I'm the one juggling meal plans to make it come out of the grocery money, or juggling personal spending or clothing needs or putting off another purchase or whatever. He doesn't feel the pain of arranging it, so he doesn't remember. So... our discussion involved "this is what we have, this is where it's going, figure out where it's coming from this time". And we're in a financial position right now where we can't put gobs into savings (we have enough to make ends meet, but I'm 8 months pregnant and going on maternity leave and he's getting laid off in 2 weeks, so both of us will be at 55% salary for a while) so the solution isn't "put less in savings to address the lack", it's "what are you going to sacrifice to pull the $ where it needs to be". And I think having to figure it out, and seeing what he's going to have to alter to make it work, is having an impact.

Like, good lord, basic solution, how hard is it to do laundry on different days? (Actual difference: 20-30$/month) I'm not even hassling him to hang it up, just don't run the dryer 3 times in the same day!! (Hydro more than doubles the cost of power after you reach a certain amount per day... works out to the first load of laundry costing less than 1$ but further loads being $$$) and also if you don't let the laundry pile up we all have clean clothes... how wonderful, to not run out of underwear... *ahem*

Husband kind of counts as a relative, and I'm not starting a new thread, so... :)

The electric bill came. For 2 months. 70$ higher than expected. As always, for the first bill of winter. In that I spend the first 2 months harping on about things we can do (and I am doing, but we're 2 adults and the thermostat only stays down if the second adult doesn't keep raising it...) to save $ on electricity, but it's only after the first bill comes and he has a shock at the amount that he starts bloody listening insread of rolling his eyes and ignoring. *ahem* every year. Every damned year it's the same thing, and it gets on my last NERVE.

For the record: we talked it out, we figured it out, he's apologetic, it may improve, etc... but man, it's gonna take my patience a few days to calm the hell down.

My old place had a thermostat with an offset, I could set it to show 19ºC when the actual temperature is 17ºC. It was excellent.

My SO also had a total disconnect between fuel bills and behaviour. I'd come home in winter to find him sitting in underwear with the heating on full AND a secondary heater on full. Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

Oh. My. God. The disconnect between behaviour and reality...

Yeah, with my husband it's more that he sees a logical need and an easy solution (I am cold, I will turn up the heat) and completely ignores the impact of that behaviour on the bill that comes in 2 months later. Like they're not even connected naturally in his brain or something... until he gets the first bill, freaks at the amount, and that seems to solder a connection. Except that that's the case every year. Like, love, TRY to retain that learning for more than 6 months at a time, hmmmm?

Also honestly part of the problem is that I'm in charge of the household finances and better with money (erm... when we got together, his credit was so shitty he couldn't get a CELL PHONE... granted he was 24 and I wouldn't marry him until he pulled it together, but.) and so if we need 70$ somewhere I'm the one juggling meal plans to make it come out of the grocery money, or juggling personal spending or clothing needs or putting off another purchase or whatever. He doesn't feel the pain of arranging it, so he doesn't remember. So... our discussion involved "this is what we have, this is where it's going, figure out where it's coming from this time". And we're in a financial position right now where we can't put gobs into savings (we have enough to make ends meet, but I'm 8 months pregnant and going on maternity leave and he's getting laid off in 2 weeks, so both of us will be at 55% salary for a while) so the solution isn't "put less in savings to address the lack", it's "what are you going to sacrifice to pull the $ where it needs to be". And I think having to figure it out, and seeing what he's going to have to alter to make it work, is having an impact.

Like, good lord, basic solution, how hard is it to do laundry on different days? (Actual difference: 20-30$/month) I'm not even hassling him to hang it up, just don't run the dryer 3 times in the same day!! (Hydro more than doubles the cost of power after you reach a certain amount per day... works out to the first load of laundry costing less than 1$ but further loads being $$$) and also if you don't let the laundry pile up we all have clean clothes... how wonderful, to not run out of underwear... *ahem*

*frustration*

Mr.T was the same way. He wanted to do right by us, but he just didn't get it. It didn't click with him until I sat him down and made him do the budget for once. Now, whenever I start to see the disconnect happening once or twice a year, I make sure to have him sit with me and figure out where all the money goes. I also never let him hold on to cash, because that seems to trigger the "spend" reflex.

Husband kind of counts as a relative, and I'm not starting a new thread, so... :)

The electric bill came. For 2 months. 70$ higher than expected. As always, for the first bill of winter. In that I spend the first 2 months harping on about things we can do (and I am doing, but we're 2 adults and the thermostat only stays down if the second adult doesn't keep raising it...) to save $ on electricity, but it's only after the first bill comes and he has a shock at the amount that he starts bloody listening insread of rolling his eyes and ignoring. *ahem* every year. Every damned year it's the same thing, and it gets on my last NERVE.

For the record: we talked it out, we figured it out, he's apologetic, it may improve, etc... but man, it's gonna take my patience a few days to calm the hell down.

My old place had a thermostat with an offset, I could set it to show 19ºC when the actual temperature is 17ºC. It was excellent.

My SO also had a total disconnect between fuel bills and behaviour. I'd come home in winter to find him sitting in underwear with the heating on full AND a secondary heater on full. Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

My boyfriend does this all the time, it blows my mind. Sitting in his underwear says the house is too cold. PUT ON SOME PANTS!

Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

Husband kind of counts as a relative, and I'm not starting a new thread, so... :)

The electric bill came. For 2 months. 70$ higher than expected. As always, for the first bill of winter. In that I spend the first 2 months harping on about things we can do (and I am doing, but we're 2 adults and the thermostat only stays down if the second adult doesn't keep raising it...) to save $ on electricity, but it's only after the first bill comes and he has a shock at the amount that he starts bloody listening insread of rolling his eyes and ignoring. *ahem* every year. Every damned year it's the same thing, and it gets on my last NERVE.

For the record: we talked it out, we figured it out, he's apologetic, it may improve, etc... but man, it's gonna take my patience a few days to calm the hell down.

My old place had a thermostat with an offset, I could set it to show 19ºC when the actual temperature is 17ºC. It was excellent.

My SO also had a total disconnect between fuel bills and behaviour. I'd come home in winter to find him sitting in underwear with the heating on full AND a secondary heater on full. Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

Oh. My. God. The disconnect between behaviour and reality...

Yeah, with my husband it's more that he sees a logical need and an easy solution (I am cold, I will turn up the heat) and completely ignores the impact of that behaviour on the bill that comes in 2 months later. Like they're not even connected naturally in his brain or something... until he gets the first bill, freaks at the amount, and that seems to solder a connection. Except that that's the case every year. Like, love, TRY to retain that learning for more than 6 months at a time, hmmmm?

Also honestly part of the problem is that I'm in charge of the household finances and better with money (erm... when we got together, his credit was so shitty he couldn't get a CELL PHONE... granted he was 24 and I wouldn't marry him until he pulled it together, but.) and so if we need 70$ somewhere I'm the one juggling meal plans to make it come out of the grocery money, or juggling personal spending or clothing needs or putting off another purchase or whatever. He doesn't feel the pain of arranging it, so he doesn't remember. So... our discussion involved "this is what we have, this is where it's going, figure out where it's coming from this time". And we're in a financial position right now where we can't put gobs into savings (we have enough to make ends meet, but I'm 8 months pregnant and going on maternity leave and he's getting laid off in 2 weeks, so both of us will be at 55% salary for a while) so the solution isn't "put less in savings to address the lack", it's "what are you going to sacrifice to pull the $ where it needs to be". And I think having to figure it out, and seeing what he's going to have to alter to make it work, is having an impact.

Like, good lord, basic solution, how hard is it to do laundry on different days? (Actual difference: 20-30$/month) I'm not even hassling him to hang it up, just don't run the dryer 3 times in the same day!! (Hydro more than doubles the cost of power after you reach a certain amount per day... works out to the first load of laundry costing less than 1$ but further loads being $$$) and also if you don't let the laundry pile up we all have clean clothes... how wonderful, to not run out of underwear... *ahem*

*frustration*

Was going to suggest a Nest thermostat as you can lock the wall unit so that only your phone or internet login can change the set temperature but it seems you have more immediate concerns.

I am not sure how locking an SO out of the thermostat should be taken. On the one hand it is sort of like setting a budget and the SO getting x$/mon as fun money to help control impulse spending but it also sort of sounds really shitty and controlling (no pun intended). I think there would also be a gender difference if a husband locked his wife out that would be seen differently than a wife locking her husband out. I think a husband who did that would be seen as a tightwad unconcerned about family comfort where if a wife did it she would be seen as taking responsibility for the budget and looking after a helpless husband. But I have never been hitched so maybe I am 100% full of it.

Husband kind of counts as a relative, and I'm not starting a new thread, so... :)

The electric bill came. For 2 months. 70$ higher than expected. As always, for the first bill of winter. In that I spend the first 2 months harping on about things we can do (and I am doing, but we're 2 adults and the thermostat only stays down if the second adult doesn't keep raising it...) to save $ on electricity, but it's only after the first bill comes and he has a shock at the amount that he starts bloody listening insread of rolling his eyes and ignoring. *ahem* every year. Every damned year it's the same thing, and it gets on my last NERVE.

For the record: we talked it out, we figured it out, he's apologetic, it may improve, etc... but man, it's gonna take my patience a few days to calm the hell down.

My old place had a thermostat with an offset, I could set it to show 19ºC when the actual temperature is 17ºC. It was excellent.

My SO also had a total disconnect between fuel bills and behaviour. I'd come home in winter to find him sitting in underwear with the heating on full AND a secondary heater on full. Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

Oh. My. God. The disconnect between behaviour and reality...

Yeah, with my husband it's more that he sees a logical need and an easy solution (I am cold, I will turn up the heat) and completely ignores the impact of that behaviour on the bill that comes in 2 months later. Like they're not even connected naturally in his brain or something... until he gets the first bill, freaks at the amount, and that seems to solder a connection. Except that that's the case every year. Like, love, TRY to retain that learning for more than 6 months at a time, hmmmm?

Also honestly part of the problem is that I'm in charge of the household finances and better with money (erm... when we got together, his credit was so shitty he couldn't get a CELL PHONE... granted he was 24 and I wouldn't marry him until he pulled it together, but.) and so if we need 70$ somewhere I'm the one juggling meal plans to make it come out of the grocery money, or juggling personal spending or clothing needs or putting off another purchase or whatever. He doesn't feel the pain of arranging it, so he doesn't remember. So... our discussion involved "this is what we have, this is where it's going, figure out where it's coming from this time". And we're in a financial position right now where we can't put gobs into savings (we have enough to make ends meet, but I'm 8 months pregnant and going on maternity leave and he's getting laid off in 2 weeks, so both of us will be at 55% salary for a while) so the solution isn't "put less in savings to address the lack", it's "what are you going to sacrifice to pull the $ where it needs to be". And I think having to figure it out, and seeing what he's going to have to alter to make it work, is having an impact.

Like, good lord, basic solution, how hard is it to do laundry on different days? (Actual difference: 20-30$/month) I'm not even hassling him to hang it up, just don't run the dryer 3 times in the same day!! (Hydro more than doubles the cost of power after you reach a certain amount per day... works out to the first load of laundry costing less than 1$ but further loads being $$$) and also if you don't let the laundry pile up we all have clean clothes... how wonderful, to not run out of underwear... *ahem*

*frustration*

Was going to suggest a Nest thermostat as you can lock the wall unit so that only your phone or internet login can change the set temperature but it seems you have more immediate concerns.

I am not sure how locking an SO out of the thermostat should be taken. On the one hand it is sort of like setting a budget and the SO getting x$/mon as fun money to help control impulse spending but it also sort of sounds really shitty and controlling (no pun intended). I think there would also be a gender difference if a husband locked his wife out that would be seen differently than a wife locking her husband out. I think a husband who did that would be seen as a tightwad unconcerned about family comfort where if a wife did it she would be seen as taking responsibility for the budget and looking after a helpless husband. But I have never been hitched so maybe I am 100% full of it.

Yeah, I'd feel super uncomfortable locking him out of the thermostat... that just seems controlling in a borderline abusive way? The gender dynamics you mention are a thing, totally, but I still wouldn't be ok with it.

And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. So what other habits are you going to change to come up with that cash? I'm not gonna say his convenience isn't worth the money if HE finds the cash to fund it that ISNT from savings... But I, personally, am not hugely keen on his convenience always being balanced by my sacrifices, and it never swinging the other way. Balance, yknow? Partnership. Etc. (To be fair: that's not the usual pattern, and when I pointed out that it was starting to turn into a financial pattern he immediately agreed that it was uncool and made plans to change the actual issues and has since been living up to i. He's not actively an asshole, more... floating around in the faith that things will work out. Which they tend to, since I make them work. Once he recognized that consciously, it helped a lot.)

And also, it's 20C In the house. Put another log on the wood stove (free heat!!) and put on a sweater, wtf, cmon.

Was going to suggest a Nest thermostat as you can lock the wall unit so that only your phone or internet login can change the set temperature but it seems you have more immediate concerns.

I am not sure how locking an SO out of the thermostat should be taken. On the one hand it is sort of like setting a budget and the SO getting x$/mon as fun money to help control impulse spending but it also sort of sounds really shitty and controlling (no pun intended). I think there would also be a gender difference if a husband locked his wife out that would be seen differently than a wife locking her husband out. I think a husband who did that would be seen as a tightwad unconcerned about family comfort where if a wife did it she would be seen as taking responsibility for the budget and looking after a helpless husband. But I have never been hitched so maybe I am 100% full of it.

I would think that locking the thermostat would be handled much like budgeting; if both partners agree there is a problem, and that this is the solution to the problem, it's fine. If one partner is saying "You're spending too much; you now get $X to spend every month." without considering the other person, then it's not a healthy dynamic.

So yeah, the action is controlling, totally; but if all parties agree to one being controlled by the other, I don't see a problem.

Logged

Give me one fine day of plain sailing weather and I can mess up anything.

*snip*And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. *snip*

You shouldn't have to do this, but for you or anyone else in a similar situation, what about writing the average bill above each temperature on the thermostat? So, 65° has "$40" above it, but 75° has "$100" above it. And maybe a chart above the dryer or on the door of it with1st load today = $22nd load today = $6 MORE3rd load today = $10 MORE

*snip*And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. *snip*

You shouldn't have to do this, but for you or anyone else in a similar situation, what about writing the average bill above each temperature on the thermostat? So, 65° has "$40" above it, but 75° has "$100" above it. And maybe a chart above the dryer or on the door of it with1st load today = $22nd load today = $6 MORE3rd load today = $10 MORE

That's actually a hilarious idea for the laundry room, given that I just 'decorated' it (aka: put up shelves and a countertop, with the realization that if it wasn't done before I gave birth it wouldn't happen after... that's my definition of nesting pre-giving-birth: finishing up ALL THE THINGS. Don't ask me what the baby's room looks like, tho - I can't see the floor yet).

That chart could go right next to the 'here is how you read laundry labels' chart I printed from Pinterest.

Husband kind of counts as a relative, and I'm not starting a new thread, so... :)

The electric bill came. For 2 months. 70$ higher than expected. As always, for the first bill of winter. In that I spend the first 2 months harping on about things we can do (and I am doing, but we're 2 adults and the thermostat only stays down if the second adult doesn't keep raising it...) to save $ on electricity, but it's only after the first bill comes and he has a shock at the amount that he starts bloody listening insread of rolling his eyes and ignoring. *ahem* every year. Every damned year it's the same thing, and it gets on my last NERVE.

For the record: we talked it out, we figured it out, he's apologetic, it may improve, etc... but man, it's gonna take my patience a few days to calm the hell down.

My old place had a thermostat with an offset, I could set it to show 19ºC when the actual temperature is 17ºC. It was excellent.

My SO also had a total disconnect between fuel bills and behaviour. I'd come home in winter to find him sitting in underwear with the heating on full AND a secondary heater on full. Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

My boyfriend does this all the time, it blows my mind. Sitting in his underwear says the house is too cold. PUT ON SOME PANTS!

The kids started talking about what they would do if they had en endless amount of money. One kid would fill a house with kittens, I want to spend a few millions on vaccines. After a bit of nudging, Dh finally offered his opinion: "I would turn on the heaters and waste vast amounts of energy."

*snip*And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. *snip*

You shouldn't have to do this, but for you or anyone else in a similar situation, what about writing the average bill above each temperature on the thermostat? So, 65° has "$40" above it, but 75° has "$100" above it. And maybe a chart above the dryer or on the door of it with1st load today = $22nd load today = $6 MORE3rd load today = $10 MORE

That's actually a hilarious idea for the laundry room, given that I just 'decorated' it (aka: put up shelves and a countertop, with the realization that if it wasn't done before I gave birth it wouldn't happen after... that's my definition of nesting pre-giving-birth: finishing up ALL THE THINGS. Don't ask me what the baby's room looks like, tho - I can't see the floor yet).

That chart could go right next to the 'here is how you read laundry labels' chart I printed from Pinterest.

A chart for laundry labels? Don't you just read the text? I have to admit I ignore them... I don't buy dry-clean-needed clothes, nothing fitted or with stretch goes in the dryer, and everything gets washed on warm in light or dark loads.

A chart for laundry labels? Don't you just read the text? I have to admit I ignore them... I don't buy dry-clean-needed clothes, nothing fitted or with stretch goes in the dryer, and everything gets washed on warm in light or dark loads.

*snip*And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. *snip*

You shouldn't have to do this, but for you or anyone else in a similar situation, what about writing the average bill above each temperature on the thermostat? So, 65° has "$40" above it, but 75° has "$100" above it. And maybe a chart above the dryer or on the door of it with1st load today = $22nd load today = $6 MORE3rd load today = $10 MORE

So I'm dumb enough to ask - why does washing three loads today cost more than washing 1 load each day for three days?

Logged

Give me one fine day of plain sailing weather and I can mess up anything.

*snip*And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. *snip*

You shouldn't have to do this, but for you or anyone else in a similar situation, what about writing the average bill above each temperature on the thermostat? So, 65° has "$40" above it, but 75° has "$100" above it. And maybe a chart above the dryer or on the door of it with1st load today = $22nd load today = $6 MORE3rd load today = $10 MORE

So I'm dumb enough to ask - why does washing three loads today cost more than washing 1 load each day for three days?

Something about a lower per-unit rate for energy consumption under a specific threshold, but a substantially higher per-unit rate if it exceeds that threshold. Kind of like brackets in a graduated income tax system, but for energy consumption. There might be more than two tiers or thresholds.

*snip*And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. *snip*

You shouldn't have to do this, but for you or anyone else in a similar situation, what about writing the average bill above each temperature on the thermostat? So, 65° has "$40" above it, but 75° has "$100" above it. And maybe a chart above the dryer or on the door of it with1st load today = $22nd load today = $6 MORE3rd load today = $10 MORE

So I'm dumb enough to ask - why does washing three loads today cost more than washing 1 load each day for three days?

Something about a lower per-unit rate for energy consumption under a specific threshold, but a substantially higher per-unit rate if it exceeds that threshold. Kind of like brackets in a graduated income tax system, but for energy consumption. There might be more than two tiers or thresholds.

Thank you. I'm was not aware of this - perhaps my coop doesn't use it in my area. I may have to look closer at my bill.

Logged

Give me one fine day of plain sailing weather and I can mess up anything.

*snip*And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. *snip*

You shouldn't have to do this, but for you or anyone else in a similar situation, what about writing the average bill above each temperature on the thermostat? So, 65° has "$40" above it, but 75° has "$100" above it. And maybe a chart above the dryer or on the door of it with1st load today = $22nd load today = $6 MORE3rd load today = $10 MORE

*snip*And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. *snip*

You shouldn't have to do this, but for you or anyone else in a similar situation, what about writing the average bill above each temperature on the thermostat? So, 65° has "$40" above it, but 75° has "$100" above it. And maybe a chart above the dryer or on the door of it with1st load today = $22nd load today = $6 MORE3rd load today = $10 MORE

Is this normal in the US? I mean having subsequent loads cost more?

I believe Kitsune lives in Quebec. We used to have something similar in Ontario - use up to a certain limit of electricity, and you got a cheap rate. Go over the minimum amount, and boom, your rate went up considerably.

Logged

When life closes a door, open it again. It's a door. That's how they work.

He kept a five figure credit card debt hidden from his wife, until they went to refinance their house to pull equity for a kitchen remodel. So, they went ahead with the refi and took the equity to pay that off.

I'm a pretty chill person but this alone would be a break up offense if he were my partner. Not the slow creep of credit card debt, but the hiding. My boyfriend is bad with money, we regularly have to sit down and talk about how he can cut back and what his goals are. But if I found out he was hiding debt so that he didn't have to deal with it I would probably flip my shit.

Father buys new house , that he can't afford, to impress.Then redoes the interior to fit a vacuuming system in the walls, that he can't afford, to impress.To top it off, he installs a totally unnecessary massive automatic gate, that he can't afford, you've guessed it, to impress...

Now notices that he has boxed himself in a corner, but he finds a sulotion!Frugality? Selling stuff? Putting a stop to renovations until solvent? No, no, no...He "forgets" to pay alimony to my mum...

And he does stuff like this all the time... just makes me scared that I'll have to pay for his upkeep in old age because he blew his high income "to impress".

You and I may have the same father. I have no relationship with him anymore but this is exactly the stuff he did.

1. Buys boat because we moved to Florida and that is what people do in Florida. Had no clue how to operate it, sold it after only taking it out 3-4 times in the two years he had it.2. Moved to Iowa and had in-ground pool. No clue how to operate, buried it after dumping $5k in it.3. Fast forward a couple years, with a new wife. Buys cars every year, literally rotated them.4. Bankrupt.5. Called me out of the blue and had a great deal for me, buy his Harley motorcycle and we can ride together! (we live 800 miles apart). No.6. New wife and apparently "sweet" new house! Come visit, all brick, 3 car garage, move down here and buy one also! No.

All to "impress" people.

I can go on for hours, I have learned more on how to not manage my money by his actions than any other person. Sad thing is his parents would make any mustachian proud, not sure what happened.

A chart for laundry labels? Don't you just read the text? I have to admit I ignore them... I don't buy dry-clean-needed clothes, nothing fitted or with stretch goes in the dryer, and everything gets washed on warm in light or dark loads.

Sometimes it is just the symbols or the text is too small.

Oh! Thank you. I didn't realize until today that the symbols were for consumers, not just manufacturers.

*snip*Like, good lord, basic solution, how hard is it to do laundry on different days? (Actual difference: 20-30$/month) I'm not even hassling him to hang it up, just don't run the dryer 3 times in the same day!! (Hydro more than doubles the cost of power after you reach a certain amount per day... works out to the first load of laundry costing less than 1$ but further loads being $$$) and also if you don't let the laundry pile up we all have clean clothes... how wonderful, to not run out of underwear... *ahem*

*frustration*

Yes, for all who asked, Kitsune is saying that higher usage of electricity ("hydro") increases the cost per unit. I haven't run into this in the US, though I know some electric companies in the US have electric prices that vary based on the time of day, another interesting system.

*snip*Like, good lord, basic solution, how hard is it to do laundry on different days? (Actual difference: 20-30$/month) I'm not even hassling him to hang it up, just don't run the dryer 3 times in the same day!! (Hydro more than doubles the cost of power after you reach a certain amount per day... works out to the first load of laundry costing less than 1$ but further loads being $$$) and also if you don't let the laundry pile up we all have clean clothes... how wonderful, to not run out of underwear... *ahem*

*frustration*

Yes, for all who asked, Kitsune is saying that higher usage of electricity ("hydro") increases the cost per unit. I haven't run into this in the US, though I know some electric companies in the US have electric prices that vary based on the time of day, another interesting system.

Yes! Exactly! To clarify further: hydro Quebec is our power company, and is provincially owned and run with usually cheap electric rates... until you go above a daily threshold and then the rates mpcan more than double. And if you're doing that in winter and some of your heat is electric and you're already raising the heat, any power-using decision pushes your bill that much closer to double-billing territory. Usually 2+ loads of laundry in the dryer in one day will do it. And then ANY extra power used is at higher rates (oven, heating, water heater, etc...) so there's definite incentive to use less overall. Its not a direct cost-per-use calculation

I know some electric companies try to bill based on time of day so as to incentivize not using lots of power when the power grid is already taxed - like, people get home and turn on the heat from 5-8pm, and make dinner and turn on TVs and generally use power, so you may as well incentivize laudpndru after 10pm, when the power grid isn't already taxed. It makes a certain amount of sense.

Yes, for all who asked, Kitsune is saying that higher usage of electricity ("hydro") increases the cost per unit. I haven't run into this in the US, though I know some electric companies in the US have electric prices that vary based on the time of day, another interesting system.

My water utility is like this. Relatively cheap rate, then usage over a certain amount is higher, then water over the next higher amount is a LOT higher.

Yeah, I'd feel super uncomfortable locking him out of the thermostat... that just seems controlling in a borderline abusive way? The gender dynamics you mention are a thing, totally, but I still wouldn't be ok with it.

And, frankly: if he's cold, and he needs to, SURE, put the heat up by 3 degrees! You pay for this too, I'm not your mom, etc. But I'd also like that accompanied with a basic awareness that doing that costs money and what will you sacrifice to pay for it. Or, say, if he RRALLY wants to do laundry all in one day every week and run the dryer 4 times that day (babies puke a lot, ok, there's laundry). Like, go, do it that way. But that's a 20-30$ difference in the month for your convenience. So what other habits are you going to change to come up with that cash? I'm not gonna say his convenience isn't worth the money if HE finds the cash to fund it that ISNT from savings... But I, personally, am not hugely keen on his convenience always being balanced by my sacrifices, and it never swinging the other way. Balance, yknow? Partnership. Etc. (To be fair: that's not the usual pattern, and when I pointed out that it was starting to turn into a financial pattern he immediately agreed that it was uncool and made plans to change the actual issues and has since been living up to i. He's not actively an asshole, more... floating around in the faith that things will work out. Which they tend to, since I make them work. Once he recognized that consciously, it helped a lot.)

And also, it's 20C In the house. Put another log on the wood stove (free heat!!) and put on a sweater, wtf, cmon.

You have just summed up my heating related life. I don't want you to be cold, but I want you to know that there is more than one option for not being cold. If you turn up the heating this has a financial impact, i'm not willing to bear the financial impact alone.

I would never lock my partner out of the thermostat (but have no problem setting up a thermostat that misreads). That is my line. There are times when it could be reasonable to turn the heat up higher, your pants being upstairs is not one of these times.

Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

Then I visited the in-laws in one of the hottest summers we had for years; two radiators on and windows open, complaining of the heat, talking about getting an AC unit. Wouldn't let me turn the heating off in case it wouldn't come on again. So that's where that behaviour started.

But ... they ... what???

And MPGH sums up my entire relationship with my in-laws!

Further snappy life-defining insights welcomed!

my inlaws - in Sussex.she smokes. in the house. opens the window for the fresh air.gets cold so instead of closing the window tuns the heat up.heaters on - windows open......

FIL - spends all his time going over the bills and complaining that they don;t have enough money and can't go anywhere.

me - to mil - stop smoking and opening windows..me to FIL - sell the 4 bed house that you can't live in, move to a 2 bed flat and you'll have masses of money.