Canoe, this is a very nice setup! But I am worried about a possible structural weakness in your trailer frame.

(Years ago my brother and I discussed careers, and he said I ought to be a quality control inspector because I so readily find fault with things. )

I’m talking about the spot where the triangular tongue attaches to the rectangular box. There is a lot of bouncing-force here, and over the years I have seen many trailers sitting along the road, broken in exactly this spot.For one thing, the steel looks to be installed horizontally, which gives it less resistance against up-and-down flexing than if it were vertical. And for the other this spot appears to be welded together, which invariably represents a weakness compared with undisturbed metal. Commercially manufactured trailers generally have uninterrupted vertical steel in this area – and they still sometimes fail.

So I’m thinking you might want to take this thing to a competent welding shop and ask his opinion about reinforcing it.

I “enjoy” spotting weaknesses like this because I believe it is the best way to avoid disasters down the road.

If I have not explained my concern clearly enough, I can look for photos of such cases to illustrate the point.

Elliot wrote:... I am worried about a possible structural weakness in your trailer frame. ...I’m talking about the spot where the triangular tongue attaches to the rectangular box. ...

Hmmm.Good point.

This trailer started as a boat trailer, which is why the tongue is so long. The tongue is rather similar to figjam's image, only the tongue sides don't extend all the way to the side of the trailer, but shortly after going under the front of the box, they turn to the back with a weld to a longitudinal member, which runs along inside of the wheels.

I don't remember the exact details, but I had the same concerns, so I did examine it, and had someone jump on it while I watched to see what flexed where. If I remember some correctly, then:

the outer sides of the triangle tongue are two "C" pieces of steel sandwiched together to make a "tube", which makes me think someone has already added to the original design

the centre tongue member is a through-and-through, and rather robust, again two "C"s sandwiched, but looks original (I was able to feed doubled extension cord through it to serve as new robust wiring for the lights - what else use for an extension someone's gone over with a lawn mower)

the front of the box sits against a small piece of angle iron, welded across the three member tongue, as does the rear of the box

I though I had photos, but I can't find them right now.As a utility trailer, this has had ridiculous loads in it, loaded up past the side supports (like we see in its last use when full of bikes, with bins of steel parts stacked at the front), with with much heaver loads of hardwood and scrap steel (previous owners, semi-rural setting, helped feed their kids by heading out every Sunday night to fill the trailer with scrap metal left out for the garbage trucks). We tried to break it once, but couldn't. Oddly, its taken the abuse. When I adapted it for "living" use, for reinforcement on the inside I added 2x2 to near every seam with 1x2 up the sides. Under the box I added a near full-length piece of angle-iron to each side, bolted to the longitudinal steel member running inside of each wheel. I also discovered that the box was just sitting there, not bolted on, small screws rusted away... It's now bolted to the new angle-iron.

I'll have to take a much closer look at what goes where, once it's warm enough to do so.

Note: with the top section of 1/2" plywood being so heavy, and the triangle sides putting more weight to the rear, it's biased the whole balance to the rear. With the trailer empty, there isn't enough tonque weight, even with the spare tire. It has to have a load.

Jar Jar Sith Lord.Odd. No bears in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries..... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

Note the way you get "towed" when you're already towing a trailer...Never had that happen before.

Jar Jar Sith Lord.Odd. No bears in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries..... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

Guilty there.Relied on the previous owner, good friend, saying he did it.Will redo myself this year.

Jar Jar Sith Lord.Odd. No bears in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries..... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

Elliot wrote:... I am worried about a possible structural weakness in your trailer frame. ...I’m talking about the spot where the triangular tongue attaches to the rectangular box. There is a lot of bouncing-force here...

Good catch!

I found (in the second photo I posted) that my memory was wrong. The tongue side members attach by weld to the longitudinal members right at the front of the box. I'll take a good look at that in the spring, perhaps adding a plate or a short member to lessen that joint being a stress riser.

Jar Jar Sith Lord.Odd. No bears in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries..... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

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Jar Jar Sith Lord.Odd. No bears in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries..... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

Can I derail a bit here? I'm going to be pulling a 5x8' open trailer with about 800+/- pounds on it, with a Ford Expedition. The truck currently does not have a receiver hitch on it, but has a bumper ball. The bumper say's it has a 400# tongue weight and 4,000# towing max.I've googled around and the reviews about using a bumper ball are mixed. What do you guys think about that? It should be fine, right??

The numbers look good. But as you have read indications of, bumpers have little room for error, and errors are rather common for regular folks who only occasionally pull a trailer. For example, it is awful "easy" to jack-knife a small trailer when backing up, and then the forces on the ball and bumper can skyrocket far beyond the specs. I had to wrestle somebody's bumper back into usable shape right in BRC once.

There is a second aspect to this: the height of the ball above the ground. Bumpers vary greatly in height, and trailers likewise. A major discrepancy could spell trouble. But with a receiver hitch, you have almost unlimited options for ball height, since the bar that connects the ball to the receiver comes in so many heights ("drop" or "rise"), and these bars are available in most auto parts stores. You can even get them adjustable.

I'd agree with Elliot, Bounce.Knowing that engineering is at least x2 on anything stamped for public reading.And height is an issue, it making sure you have enough tongue weight. Enough weight on the ball, can't be over stated. If it were multiple axle, height would be even more important, IMHO.Just make sure it's front loaded.

you don't mention brakes, and I'd guess the trailer has none? if so, again, tongue weight is critical, and, remembering you're going to have that trialer trying to push you past stop signs and such, so allow lotso of extra room.

One indicator on not enough tongue weight, is "fishtailing". also underinflated tires.

Your right yggy, no brakes on the trailer. I feel better now though, as I was having some sticker shock at the price of having a receiver hitch installed, I was thinking $200, but the local hitch guy is talking over $500. The weight shouldn't be an issue as the load will be very adjustable. Thanks guys!

Bounce530 wrote:Your right yggy, no brakes on the trailer. I feel better now though, as I was having some sticker shock at the price of having a receiver hitch installed, I was thinking $200, but the local hitch guy is talking over $500. The weight shouldn't be an issue as the load will be very adjustable. Thanks guys!

Bounce530 wrote:Your right yggy, no brakes on the trailer. I feel better now though, as I was having some sticker shock at the price of having a receiver hitch installed, I was thinking $200, but the local hitch guy is talking over $500. The weight shouldn't be an issue as the load will be very adjustable. Thanks guys!

if you can get the hitch, I'm happy to help install it here.

Installing hitches is a fairly approachable task even for a novice mechanic. Instructions always come with the hitch and wiring harnesses that plug in to the wiring harness at the back of the vehicle are available at any major parts store or that really large on line retailer. Real person advice on installing or repairing nearly anything is available on numerous vehicle chat sites and many times on youtube. Warning! Having a heavy duty hitch is super handy but can lead to budget busting purchases for new hitch facilitated must haves and new hobbies.

Black Rock City Welding and Repair. The Night Time Warming Station.

Card Carrying Member BRCCP.

When you pass the 4th "bridge out!" sign; the flaming death is all yours.-Knowmad-

Bounce530 wrote:Your right yggy, no brakes on the trailer. I feel better now though, as I was having some sticker shock at the price of having a receiver hitch installed, I was thinking $200, but the local hitch guy is talking over $500. The weight shouldn't be an issue as the load will be very adjustable. Thanks guys!

if you can get the hitch, I'm happy to help install it here.

Installing hitches is a fairly approachable task even for a novice mechanic. Instructions always come with the hitch and wiring harnesses that plug in to the wiring harness at the back of the vehicle are available at any major parts store or that really large on line retailer.

^^^This. Most off the shelf aftermarket hitches are kits assembled on site. All the holes are already there it's just a matter of bolting the hitch together then putting (usually) six bolts through existing frame holes and making sure everything is torqued down. Until you start talking upper end of class III and class IV welding is optional.

Bumper balls are fine as long as the planes of both the vehicle and trailer are parallel to ground when hitched.

And then comes learning how to parallel park with a trailer.

I have discovered the ultimate question to life the universe and everything. "Does it burn?"

Thinking about buying used truck to pull my trailer with this year. I like Toyota Tundra's because of Toyota reliability. But it may be cheaper to buy a domestic and just pay for the repairs when they are needed. Figjam, what do you pull your trailer with?

I dunno FJ. a good heavy truck, is safe, and more controllable. a lighter truck under a large load, probably gets near the same fuel economy.for the difference, I'd take you truck, hands down, pulling a trailer of any substantial size or weight.

Re bumper hitches, the ranger bumper is pretty bulletproof.A friend has pulled huge weight with his.However, pulling the boat trailers home with the ruined tires on one side, the bumping, even at very slow speed, bent the bumper where the ball is, just a bit.

Look for mail order retail hitches, or used will save you more money.I found a new old stock for the Ranger, so heavy I am delaying putting it on.Big advantage is being able to unhook with the tailgate down.Can't do that now.

I found a receiver for my friend's ford van on a chevy van. Same bolt points.And receivers can be modified from other types or made from scratch.Used northern tools tube to build one for a car for the burn, bike carrier insert.

$25-50 is typical for a used one.Found the nos receiver in a hitch shop.Bought it uninstalled for $60.They wanted $100.Paid $10 or $20 for the truck receivers in an auto parts yard, my removal.