Originally posted by Kaytagg
Yes it does. Insinuating California went bankrupt because of palm trees is much more stupid.

It is an example of frivolous spending in the millions that has gone of for decades. If your attitude is commonplace among Californians that would
explain an awful lot about the current mess CA is in and how they got there.

Is it really okay to flush a few million down the toilet because elsewhere a billion or so is being blown? You wouldnt mind toss a $5 bill out the
window each month because your electric is $80/month? I fail to understand.

Originally posted by Kaytagg
Yes it does. Insinuating California went bankrupt because of palm trees is much more stupid.

It is an example of frivolous spending in the millions that has gone of for decades. If your attitude is commonplace among Californians that would
explain an awful lot about the current mess CA is in and how they got there.

Is it really okay to flush a few million down the toilet because elsewhere a billion or so is being blown? You wouldnt mind toss a $5 bill out the
window each month because your electric is $80/month? I fail to understand.

To me, the "palm tree issue" is little like blaming the bloated government spending on "pork."

Pork barrel projects only account for 2% of the budget, so despite what John McCain says, eliminating 100% of the pork wouldn't even make a dent in
the deficit.

In other words, it's an irrelevant distraction. Although, it is a somewhat frivolous expense. Just an irrelevant one to the current problems facing
the state.

Now it all makes sense. From the palms of CA to nation building in Iraq. This is the attitude that enables it all.

Do you have a real gripe about Cali's expenses, or do you just not like Palm trees? Because all i'm hearing is "the palm trees collapsed the
state!" and "if you aren't for stopping the palm trees, what's next!?"

How bout what's going on right now? Why is California bankrupt -- the REAL reasons?

The only REAL reason is that the state spent more than it took in. Lots of states do this. Lots of cities do this. There is a pervasive myth that if
an entity be it a small town, state or nation, provides for a number of people through collected (extorted) funds from these people it will eventually
attract more people (wealth sources) to leach from and the cycle will continue in perpetuity making the town, state, nation more populous, more
profitable, with more pooled resources to spend on technological advancements all fueling the growth and advancement of its residents.

A fanciful utopia.

Like so many other utopian architectures it fails to account for human randomness. It fails to account for leeches, refusals to pay, people
consciously choosing not to move to or even move away from the utopia in progress, people not wanting to participate (which leads to
incarceration/death as a further expense not accounted for) and eventually you get an entity that borrowed or overspent expecting to be repaid and
then some forced to increase the individual burden on the remaining residents just to stay afloat which makes the area less likely to recruit new
members to its tax base which digs the hole even deeper.

What these governments are doing is essentially house-flipping. The house-flippers got theirs when the mortgage scam mess hit the pyramids top. Now
these governments are hitting the tops of their respective pyramids. The next pyramid top is the fed and if they cant manage some global unified
economy to serve as the next pyramid we're all going back to an agricultural society which is exactly what I want to see happen.

ok enough w/ the palmtrees please! i been telling most of the people i know, since last years elections. that by summer of 2009 we were gonna see
a mad max scenario across the U.S. never mentioned here on ats but
the possibilities seem to be growing ya think? this crap is getting way
past nerve racking from where i'm sitting. so just take heed i consider myself one tough hombre, i'll be damned if i'm gonna admit to being scared.
but.

Originally posted by Kaytagg
Yes it does. Insinuating California went bankrupt because of palm trees is much more stupid.

It is an example of frivolous spending in the millions that has gone of for decades. If your attitude is commonplace among Californians that would
explain an awful lot about the current mess CA is in and how they got there.

Is it really okay to flush a few million down the toilet because elsewhere a billion or so is being blown? You wouldnt mind toss a $5 bill out the
window each month because your electric is $80/month? I fail to understand.

To me, the "palm tree issue" is little like blaming the bloated government spending on "pork."

Pork barrel projects only account for 2% of the budget, so despite what John McCain says, eliminating 100% of the pork wouldn't even make a dent in
the deficit.

In other words, it's an irrelevant distraction. Although, it is a somewhat frivolous expense. Just an irrelevant one to the current problems facing
the state.

jesus if everybody in california thinks like this, I am so glad my tax dollars are not going to bailout anybody.

If you want to regulate water to save a fish nobody cares about at the cost of a dozen farms, who cares. There is still thousands more right?

Ah shucks, you got me all excited when I saw the title of this thread: California Collapsing. Darn it, I was all excited, expecting to read that it
finally has started to break off and slide into the ocean. ... and then I clicked and learned NOT. Oh well, I suppose it was too much to hope for
some good news for a change.

Say, this give me an idea .. I should send the IRS an IOU .. payable when "I" decide I can afford it too.

This is all good news you know. With so many states starting to go broke, they'll never be able to afford to implement all them commie socialist
ideas Obama is trying to shove down our throats. Excellent! This is indeed good news.

I remember talking about this with mates in the UK a couple of years ago. We had the governator on TV ads virtually begging us to come spend money in
CA. Wow, we thought, he's an actor but you'd have to imagine he's got better things to do than ads, eh? They must be in trouble...

i talked with a friend that graduated with an economics degree from UCLA, and asked him what he thought would happen to california and this
"collapse" and he honestly couldn't answer me. people are still going to go about doing their business day by day as usual.

maybe some parks will close down, etc., but what are the real effects going to be?
i could take a reduction in rent here and living expenses that's for sure.

Originally posted by zooplancton
maybe some parks will close down, etc., but what are the real effects going to be?

What can happen? Well, for starters, you know those people that believe they are entitled to a portion of everyones paycheck so they don't have to
go to work? Well, when they stop getting those entitlement checks in the mail they will be cutting out the middle man (Uncle Sham) and they will
begin coming to YOU directly to collect what they feel they are entitled too. Beware. Be ready.

Originally posted by zooplancton
maybe some parks will close down, etc., but what are the real effects going to be?

What can happen? Well, for starters, you know those people that believe they are entitled to a portion of everyones paycheck so they don't have to
go to work? Well, when they stop getting those entitlement checks in the mail they will be cutting out the middle man (Uncle Sham) and they will
begin coming to YOU directly to collect what they feel they are entitled too. Beware. Be ready.

there's already an element of poverty and crime in the mix. i think we'd have to go through a major catastrophic event to have total chaos and
looting happening. but who knows? i'm just trying to wrap my head around it all.

It is almost time. We are where we need to be. And where will you be
when this happens to your state ? Whining and disassociating from other
fellow amercans in trouble ?
Yes, we have problems. Yes, we caused most of them.
No, we're not giving up.

I like the sound of "The Republic of California".

(Quick, block all of the roads into this great republic.)

When it comes to self-sufficency, we'll have a leg up on the rest of you.

My wife handles foreclosures out of California. Her office is absolutely overwhelmed. The amount of work piled on them this last year has been
ridiculous and there is no end in site.

We lived in Southern California for five years and loved the weather but not the prices or politics. There is about to be a huge price correction for
that market. Two things are possible because the politicians there are stuck on fuzzy math and can't figure out a budget.

1. Obama is going to step in and remove state rights. He has already threatened to take control of the state parks if they don't remain open. This
option could lead to outright civil war in this nation.

2. The govinator and the corrupt congressmen may finally axe all of the stupid social programs and actually concentrate on infrastructure and
security.

People, it's time to tell the able bodied people to get off their ass and stop asking for hand outs.

It's going to take a huge collapse like California going bankrupt to open the eyes of some people.

Not a rosy picture you paint. But with the taxes Californians pay, the unemployment, the rampant cuts on what some consider basic services and
programs and with the coming civil unrest, I simply cannot fathom why anyone would want to live in that state. Time to get the hell out and find a new
place to live.

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