Comments - Google quits smart meters. Anyone care? - Home Energy Pros2016-12-10T03:29:50Zhttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profiles/comment/feed?attachedTo=6069565%3ABlogPost%3A46423&xn_auth=noThe trouble with counting on…tag:homeenergypros.lbl.gov,2011-07-12:6069565:Comment:479772011-07-12T18:25:46.599ZDavid Eggletonhttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profile/DavidEggleton
<p>The trouble with counting on rising energy prices to foment energy retrofits far and wide is that those rising prices will one day, absent manipulation and/or controls (the most likely ones and their probable sequence could be lively discussions), affect nearly everyone and nearly everything. When energy is no longer cheap, solutions dependent on energy for extraction, refining, manufacturing, delivery (at each step) and installation won't be cheap, if available.</p>
<p>Our good ideas will…</p>
<p>The trouble with counting on rising energy prices to foment energy retrofits far and wide is that those rising prices will one day, absent manipulation and/or controls (the most likely ones and their probable sequence could be lively discussions), affect nearly everyone and nearly everything. When energy is no longer cheap, solutions dependent on energy for extraction, refining, manufacturing, delivery (at each step) and installation won't be cheap, if available.</p>
<p>Our good ideas will be out of reach for most. </p> The ability to track energy u…tag:homeenergypros.lbl.gov,2011-07-12:6069565:Comment:482492011-07-12T16:52:40.066ZDavid Heslamhttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profile/DavidHeslam
<p>The ability to track energy use and "see" your savings will not appeal to all, but definitely has appeal to some. I believe it will certainly hold interest for more if energy prices were to rise, as was mentioned below.</p>
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<p>Since I'm a energy geek I've tracked my usage on spreadsheets for many years, I have also signed up with many different online services to see what they have to offer. Two of them, Carbon Salon and EarthAid, have come with a novel way around the access issue.…</p>
<p>The ability to track energy use and "see" your savings will not appeal to all, but definitely has appeal to some. I believe it will certainly hold interest for more if energy prices were to rise, as was mentioned below.</p>
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<p>Since I'm a energy geek I've tracked my usage on spreadsheets for many years, I have also signed up with many different online services to see what they have to offer. Two of them, Carbon Salon and EarthAid, have come with a novel way around the access issue. These services ask you to provide your online utility account login credentials and agree to share that information with them. If you do so they offer online tools for tracking and examining your use.</p>
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<p>They also have tied it into traditional social networking and created relationships with vendors who offer discounts to folks that "earn" points by saving energy.</p>
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<p>The void left by Google is pretty large, but I think clever firms like these could do well filling the gap.</p>
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<p>The headaches involved in accessing utility bill data have commonly been underestimated</p> While I am a true believer, m…tag:homeenergypros.lbl.gov,2011-07-12:6069565:Comment:482132011-07-12T00:54:33.599ZRobert vanCreveldhttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profile/RobertvanCreveld
<p>While I am a true believer, most people couldnt care less about their energy use. The only way that people will get interested in looking at how much energy they are using is to raise the cost of energy to the point of deep pain in the wallet. Then people will be interested. </p>
<p>I am not too keen on the "smart" grid that can reach out and cut my power for whatever reasons. Check out the tv film (5 parts) on masterpiece theatre called "the last enemy"</p>
<p>While I am a true believer, most people couldnt care less about their energy use. The only way that people will get interested in looking at how much energy they are using is to raise the cost of energy to the point of deep pain in the wallet. Then people will be interested. </p>
<p>I am not too keen on the "smart" grid that can reach out and cut my power for whatever reasons. Check out the tv film (5 parts) on masterpiece theatre called "the last enemy"</p> Yes, I care. Quite a bit.
I…tag:homeenergypros.lbl.gov,2011-07-11:6069565:Comment:472872011-07-11T21:11:23.542ZLew Harrimanhttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profile/LewisHarriman
<p>Yes, I care. Quite a bit.</p>
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<p>I invested in a web-based power monitor precisely because I trusted Google to stick around for a while. The Google data display, while not perfect, is considerably more informative and far easier to scan through time than the web data display of the device I bought so I could connect to Google Power Meter (The U.K.-centric Powersave/CurrentCost meter). Plus, the ability to easily download the data is quite logical and simple with Google, and nearly…</p>
<p>Yes, I care. Quite a bit.</p>
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<p>I invested in a web-based power monitor precisely because I trusted Google to stick around for a while. The Google data display, while not perfect, is considerably more informative and far easier to scan through time than the web data display of the device I bought so I could connect to Google Power Meter (The U.K.-centric Powersave/CurrentCost meter). Plus, the ability to easily download the data is quite logical and simple with Google, and nearly impenetrable with the sites provided by the device manufacturers.</p>
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<p>I don't expect useful services to be free. I would gladly have paid money to continue the Google PowerMeter service. This decision really seems like a lost revenue opportunity for Google.</p> I think the most worrisome as…tag:homeenergypros.lbl.gov,2011-07-11:6069565:Comment:472822011-07-11T19:06:25.822ZCindy Matthewshttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profile/CindyMatthews
I think the most worrisome aspect of Google's decision is in the words, "It didn't catch on." If a company like Google with all the international attention it receives on an hourly basis can't help energy conservation measures to "catch on", then what hope is there for any other company, agency or government?
I think the most worrisome aspect of Google's decision is in the words, "It didn't catch on." If a company like Google with all the international attention it receives on an hourly basis can't help energy conservation measures to "catch on", then what hope is there for any other company, agency or government? In response to Tom's question…tag:homeenergypros.lbl.gov,2011-07-11:6069565:Comment:482082011-07-11T18:14:32.080ZDavid Eggletonhttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profile/DavidEggleton
<p>In response to Tom's question...</p>
<p>Under the influence of Chris Martenson, I don't believe it's possible. Sufficient capital won't be available for it.</p>
<p>In response to Tom's question...</p>
<p>Under the influence of Chris Martenson, I don't believe it's possible. Sufficient capital won't be available for it.</p> As impressive as Google is fo…tag:homeenergypros.lbl.gov,2011-07-11:6069565:Comment:480152011-07-11T17:08:06.248ZHugh Stearnshttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profile/HughStearns
<p>As impressive as Google is for what it is has accomplished, it is almost as impressive what it has botched. It is almost as if the company were run by a couple of impetuous ADHD kids. Oh yeah, they are.</p>
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<p>Not only is this an opportunity to help achieve considerable energy savings, but, from a business perspective, it is an opportunity to monetize beyond the monitor. Data gleaned from buildings is easily monotized. They would have been wise to provide free meters for the…</p>
<p>As impressive as Google is for what it is has accomplished, it is almost as impressive what it has botched. It is almost as if the company were run by a couple of impetuous ADHD kids. Oh yeah, they are.</p>
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<p>Not only is this an opportunity to help achieve considerable energy savings, but, from a business perspective, it is an opportunity to monetize beyond the monitor. Data gleaned from buildings is easily monotized. They would have been wise to provide free meters for the opportunity to synchronize with search. Americans are immune from being spammed, if they get something for free in the mix. Can you imagine how easy it would be to sell energy efficient appliances if you could send comparison data right to the prospective buyers' email? Unappealing in a big brother sort of way as that may seem, it would have meant significant energy savings.</p>
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<p>So, I guess I am someone who cares, because while others will move this technology forward, Google had two giant advantages. They had the money, and failed to spend it, to provide the marketing that it takes to launch a new area of technology. We were all pretty computer savvy when search started and even more so when Google hit the streets. This is not the case with harvesting consumer usable data from buildings. As much as they talk about scale-ability, they completely missed in here. And of course the other thing that only Google could have provided is the ability to feed that data into their supper processor. This is a big setback. </p> SMART GRID is a bit of a fogg…tag:homeenergypros.lbl.gov,2011-07-11:6069565:Comment:479122011-07-11T17:00:22.173Ztedkiddhttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profile/tedkidd
<p>SMART GRID is a bit of a foggy concept to me. I imagine it to mean device control to optimize power plant output and avoid brown/blackouts. Kinda a yawn to most.</p>
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<p>What appeals to me is the tracking. Hard to improve what you don't measure. Tracking burden for homeowners is clearly greater than the perceived benefit of tracking. Probably greater than the actual benefit. Think about how easy mileage tracking is for automobiles, how many people bother with that?…</p>
<p>SMART GRID is a bit of a foggy concept to me. I imagine it to mean device control to optimize power plant output and avoid brown/blackouts. Kinda a yawn to most.</p>
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<p>What appeals to me is the tracking. Hard to improve what you don't measure. Tracking burden for homeowners is clearly greater than the perceived benefit of tracking. Probably greater than the actual benefit. Think about how easy mileage tracking is for automobiles, how many people bother with that? </p>
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<p>To me the real benefit of a smart grid is it allows people to see, in a very lightweight way, their energy consumption and consumption trends. If it's easy people will start keeping track, become engaged and excited about energy efficiency improvements. The reward is not in the savings, it's in the <strong>seeing</strong> savings. </p>
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<p>Unfortunately it is incredibly difficult to access data from energy companies. I think Microsoft and Google underestimated how difficult this key component would be. </p> I've had 37 years to make sim…tag:homeenergypros.lbl.gov,2011-07-11:6069565:Comment:480122011-07-11T16:44:40.389ZTom Strumolohttp://homeenergypros.lbl.gov/profile/TomStrumolo
I've had 37 years to make similar observations, professionally, and I don't believe there is an end in sight. A smart grid is just about the only thing we don't have to worry about, on the demand side. If we can all keep repeating the mantra "smart buildings, then smart occupants, then smart grid" we'll keep focused on the work that really needs to get done. Like smart envelopes! Can we first get the missing insulation into the 10 million all-electric homes that have needed for 3 decades. …
I've had 37 years to make similar observations, professionally, and I don't believe there is an end in sight. A smart grid is just about the only thing we don't have to worry about, on the demand side. If we can all keep repeating the mantra "smart buildings, then smart occupants, then smart grid" we'll keep focused on the work that really needs to get done. Like smart envelopes! Can we first get the missing insulation into the 10 million all-electric homes that have needed for 3 decades. By the way, I'm looking for a reasonable count of American homes with plenty of leaks and missing or inadequate insulation. I'm guessing if we wanted to work our way down that list it'll take a while - like near the bottom is # 110 million. Is it possible?