00:47:09 palter [n=palter@c-24-128-76-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #ccl
00:47:18 -!- palter [n=palter@c-24-128-76-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit]
01:15:14 -!- Modius [n=Modius@24.174.112.56] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
02:29:59 Modius [n=Modius@24.174.112.56] has joined #ccl
05:39:26 milanj [n=milan@79.101.180.180] has joined #ccl
06:07:24 -!- milanj [n=milan@79.101.180.180] has quit ["Leaving"]
06:14:10 bfulgham_ [n=brent@adsl-69-234-124-120.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has joined #ccl
06:17:11 jauaor_ [n=araujo@190.38.49.150] has joined #ccl
08:03:07 -!- jauaor_ [n=araujo@190.38.49.150] has quit []
11:52:13 segv_ [n=mb@p4FC1B62C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ccl
11:58:26 -!- segv [n=mb@p4FC1B8DF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
12:05:18 -!- sellout [n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit []
12:35:01 -!- rme [n=rme@pool-70-105-112-40.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit []
12:38:43 jauaor [n=araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #ccl
13:06:59 sellout [n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has joined #ccl
13:18:51 -!- hypno [n=hypno@impulse2.gothiaso.com] has quit ["leaving"]
14:06:44 -!- segv_ [n=mb@p4FC1B62C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
14:06:49 segv [n=mb@p4FC1B62C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ccl
14:15:13 milanj [n=milan@79.101.180.180] has joined #ccl
14:55:25 palter [n=palter@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has joined #ccl
14:55:46 -!- palter [n=palter@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has quit [Client Quit]
14:57:11 -!- bfulgham_ [n=brent@adsl-69-234-124-120.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has quit []
14:58:52 rme [n=rme@pool-70-105-112-40.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #ccl
15:11:14 palter [n=palter@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has joined #ccl
15:25:13 -!- palter [n=palter@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has quit ["Get Colloquy for iPhone! http://mobile.colloquy.info"]
15:36:11 anRch [n=markmill@nmd.sbx09269.readima.wayport.net] has joined #ccl
16:33:47 -!- anRch [n=markmill@nmd.sbx09269.readima.wayport.net] has quit []
17:02:01 REPLeffect [n=REPLeffe@69.54.115.254] has joined #ccl
17:09:06 are there any ccl developers on the channel right now?
17:31:55 -!- segv [n=mb@p4FC1B62C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit []
17:32:12 I'm here now
17:44:01 anRch [n=markmill@nmd.sbx07279.burlima.wayport.net] has joined #ccl
18:03:35 rme: how about now -- sorry I was away :D
18:05:08 oh, well. I should have just asked the question, I guess. So I'll do so now.
18:05:27 Are there any plans to remove the SSE2 requirements from CCL?
18:06:10 I'd like to use ccl for some cross-platform development, but I suspect that the requirement for SSE2 might prevent me from doing so.
18:07:52 Absent funding, I don't think there are any plans to remove the requirement for SSE2.
18:08:16 OK
18:08:26 I'd consider trying myself, but I suspect I don't have the knowhow to make it happen.
18:08:37 What processor are you looking at targeting that doesn't have SSE2?
18:08:42 What doesn't have SSE2 these days? Netbooks?
18:09:01 I have an old Linux box with an AMD processor
18:09:18 I suspect my users would have some of those boxes still too.
18:09:33 I think it is a 1.3 Ghz
18:10:24 after checking, it's an older Atlhlon
18:10:38 actual speed is 1009.008 MHz
18:10:55 don't remember if AMD called that a "1.3" or not.
18:11:13 I believe that's the "K6" variety
18:11:45 Adding x87 support would be a fair amount of work, I would guess.
18:11:52 unfortunately, I don't think I can assume that my users won't have something that old :-(
18:12:39 yeah, that's what I was afraid of.
18:12:44 *sigh*
18:14:32 REPLeffect: But, with a few portability libs, you should still be able to use CCL, and then SBCL or something on non-SSE2 boxes.
18:15:40 sellout: I'd thought of that, but I didn't know if the Windows port of sbcl was complete enough
18:15:48 unfortunately, I still have to support Windows
18:17:16 Ah, right ... well, I think on 32 bit SBCL is fine, and 64-bit, you can use CCL.
18:17:55 and, honestly, I was hoping to simplify by using a single compiler.
18:18:48 Yeah, you might have to buy LW to meet that requirement.
18:19:01 and I was hoping to avoid that also :D
18:19:06 guess you can't have it all.
18:19:43 all of the dev would be 32 bit at this point
18:20:28 You can pay Clozure instead of LW, and then all the OSS users will thank you for getting the SSE2 restriction removed :D
18:20:29 sellout: you think the sbcl windows port is pretty stable for 32 bit stuff?
18:21:15 REPLeffect: You'd have to ask in #lisp, but I know it's supposed to work, unlike the 64 bit version.
18:21:58 sellout: my following of #lisp is probably the biggest factor in my having doubts about the port :D
18:22:16 not that it doesn't work, ...
18:22:17 REPLeffect: Well shoot!
18:22:24 but that it might not be stable enough
18:22:45 I haven't been on a Windows box in years, so I don't know what the state of things there is at all.
18:23:00 I'd love to be able to fund the Clozure folks, but I don't have the funds for that kind of thing
18:23:04 Sorry about the SSE2 requirement, but it made the 32-bit port easier, and I believed at the time that 32-bit only chips would shortly be a thing of the past. Then netbooks showed up...
18:23:22 *sellout* shakes his fist at the netbooks
18:23:23 rme: no problem -- I'd rather have the port sooner.
18:23:30 btw ...
18:23:41 thank you very much for doing that and putting it out ther.
18:23:44 there
18:23:47 -!- milanj [n=milan@79.101.180.180] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"]
18:24:00 I'm very happy to have ccl in the mix.
18:24:04 rme: No worries, though. I'm sure the Apple netbook will have SSE2.
18:24:18 Of course, they won't let us run lisp on it ...
18:25:03 Thank Clozure; they paid me to do it.
18:25:33 OK, well I meant *you* in the corporate as well as the individual sense.
18:25:52 sellout: I'd be surprised if the Apple netbook uses an x86 chip...
18:26:05 rme: what, probably an arm?
18:27:38 isn't that what the iPhone/iPods use?
18:27:46 It wouldn't surprise me to see an ARM in a device like that.
18:27:50 milanj [n=milan@79.101.180.180] has joined #ccl
18:28:44 yeah, iPhone/iPod touch uses an ARM.
18:28:46 Yeah. But I hope they let us have a REPL.
18:29:36 An ARM port of CCL would definitely be fun.
18:30:10 fun in the sarcastic, or literal meaning?
18:30:30 I think actual fun.
18:32:43 Definitely literal. I guess that's sort of an odd thing to get excited about.
18:33:04 rme: not at all. Some of us enjoy that kind of thing.
18:33:50 I wouldn't mind doing that kind of work, but I just don't have the tuits nor some prerequite knowledge to get it done.
18:34:19 prerequisite (is that right yet? ) :D
18:34:44 (yeah -- still looks wrong, though)
18:36:44 -!- anRch [n=markmill@nmd.sbx07279.burlima.wayport.net] has quit []
18:53:09 palter [n=palter@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has joined #ccl
19:08:34 -!- billstclair [n=billstcl@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]
19:47:28 -!- palter [n=palter@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has quit ["Get Colloquy for iPhone! http://mobile.colloquy.info"]
20:19:14 billstclair [n=billstcl@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #ccl
21:10:27 -!- jauaor [n=araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit []
21:12:51 -!- sellout [n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has quit []
21:28:19 -!- milanj [n=milan@79.101.180.180] has quit ["Leaving"]
21:59:09 palter [n=palter@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has joined #ccl
21:59:44 -!- palter [n=palter@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has quit [Client Quit]
22:28:50 -!- alms [n=alms@146-115-42-237.c3-0.bkl-ubr1.sbo-bkl.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit []
23:01:43 alms [n=alms@146-115-42-237.c3-0.bkl-ubr1.sbo-bkl.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #ccl
23:34:06 I think CCL is the better bet for Windows multithreaded
23:39:48 One thought that occasionally comes up (it isn't funded either) would be to emulate the subset of SSE2 that we use on machines that don't have it. That might or might not ever happen, but in some ways it's more attractive than having separate x87/SSE2 versions.