45 comments:

1] Hall's theory is methodologically, and logically unsound, for this reason:

Even if, purely for the sake of argument, we assumed that Hall's conclusion that the flight paths of 20 odd videos of Fl. 175 did in fact match was correct, that "fact" alone could, IN NO WAY logically prove that this means they were all genuine "real time" videos, as Hall erroneously concludes .

Such a conclusion is a GROSS misapplication of logic - for if the flight paths in the videos all match , then that fact, by itself cannot and does not disprove that they were not all simply manufactured/mass produced via the same original "seed" video composition, maybe even on the same computer, using the same software; the only essential difference between them all being the pre-selection of a brand new perspective/viewing angle before final publication of each new version in video format.

2] Like I said at [1] above, IF we assume for the sake of argument that flight paths did match .

However, the the simple, plain-as-day fact of the matter is that the 20-odd flight paths Hall analyzed do _not_ match at all, as I show in my analysis of Hall's thesis linked to below.

The Gall Of Hall:

i] He actually has the gall to entirely misrepresent the actual flight path shown in the CBS "divebomber" sequence , drawing a line to indicate a path the plane does not even take.

ii] He appears to entirely avoid the upward flight path shown in the BBC version of the alleged event.

iii] According To Hall's Own Radar Data, The Ghost Plane Completely Stops/Disappears Due South of The WTC:

Fetzer claims in this broadcast that Hall's other flight path data that he had mysteriously found on the internet [somehow :-)], shows the invisible "ghost" plane [i.e the one supposedly projecting the holographic plane image] as flying directly past the Twin Towers.[ie. travelling North]

THAT SIMPLY IS NOT TRUE! As I show in my analysis of the Hall theory, according to the actual data Hall uses, in actual fact the flight path of the mysterious , invisible "ghost plane" stops completely _before_ it ever even reaches the Twin tower area, and simply disappears! [i.e. there is/was no more radar data after that point, directly due South of the WTC. ]

What's more, in my interview on Mr Fetzer's show, I pointed out the fact that the alleged ghost plane's path completely disappears before it ever even gets to the Twin Towers.

I see that point of mine is now to be conveniently ignored, [along with the rest of them :-)].

I have found this man to be a complete waste of time. He does not represent Richard Hall's theory accurately and ignores that there are only three alternative explanations: CGI, video compositing, or the use of holograms. Since there are witnesses who report having seen "the plane" approach the South Tower, which can't be true of CGI or video compositing, it must have been done using holograms. I am sorry, but he is just wrong.

Tessan, the investigation found zero evidence of a missile, and I believe it was a sincere investigation. I also believe there were no real victims in the TWA 800 incident. So that part the government was forced to cover up, but the rest was basically a genuine investigation.

Anders, have you even followed the official investigation? Kallstrom made a complete 180 after he had been called to a meeting with white house representatives. He was investigating the missile(s) himself. The official investigation is silly, it was sabotaged by some agents from the FBI and then derailed completely. Do a search for what Chris Emery, Jack Cashill and Tom Stalcup have to say on the matter. James has a 2 hour interview with Chris Emery on the subject here on the blog, search for Emery, you will find it. It is so blatantly covered up that all investigators into the matter say that had the internet been more widely spread back then, they would never even have tried to cover it up, because it was so blatant.

Yes I have investigated it a bit. The idea with the false missile witnesses was to make the FBI be brought into the investigation for some reason. So the FBI got tricked, and that's the reason for the 180. The real cause of the staged accident was a shaped charge placed under the center fuel tank.

Could you elaborate on that or link to some more information? I have not heard anything about it before, and seen no proof of it. It disregards the radar plots, all the boats, the look of the wreckage, residue of missiles, etc. And most importantly, why would they put a charge under the plane and none see it? The pilot does an on-ground inspection of the plane before it starts. Please provide more information for your viewpoint.

It was a missile, the investigaton showed that clearly but the FBI got involved and covered it up. The witnesses weren't planted, many of them were intimidated by the FBI into keeping quiet or changing their story.

The witnesses definitely could of been planted, does anyone even know who these witnesses are. It has a memorial just like Shanksville to convince people this happened. It also has a very well publicised documentary, produced and distributed by major companies, which like loose change disputes the official story but avoids the real story that no planes crashed.

The DNA mix-up is probably just that, the cover-up for a mix up. Either they have a flawed system for analysing DNA, or they cocked it up. Explosions don't fuse DNA. But that does not make the whole mass of evidence for missiles invalid.From what I have gathered, this was something that happened or a small rouge faction did it, and the government did all they could to cover it up. The Atlanta Olympics was just weeks away. If they would have said that planes were being attacked by missiles there would have been no Olympics. The Clinton administration did not want any scandal, be it domestic or foreign. Non that they didn't orchestrate themselves, that is ;-)

I've not long spoken to a first hand witness to the 2nd plane impact of the South Tower, and I asked him the $64.000 question. Was what he witnessed with his own eyes accurately represented in the all the videos, both TV Media and Amateur, and he confirmed to me that all the videos he had seen all reflect accurately and tie-in with his observations on the day.

Aren't holograms difficult to project even under normal circumstances and require many cameras? I have been unable to find how they are done in Google searches.Is there a website you can recommend?

Don't you think projecting holograms is way too much effort just to convince some witnesses that a real plane hit WTC2 especially timed as it was in the very last minute of the operation?

Do you believe the images of planes as seen in the archived footage were also made by holograms? If CGI, that would have been a lot of work for artists and videographers just moments before the demolishment of the towers.

Also, this all had to be synchronized with the cutting out by thermite charges of the plane outline on the south facade, WTC2.

It seems unlikely the people who were so careless with other details of 9/11 would suddenly put such effort into last minute details when easier methods were available.

The Central Intelligence Agency has been making US policy since WWII. They are a rogue agency with their own black budget and accountable to no one. As long as this group and its allies continue to do as they please, the world will see no relief from their authoritarian ways. William Blum, unfortunately a Left gatekeeper on CIA domestic operations, is a great writer on what has been going on these past decades:

Killing Hope page U.S. Military and CIA Interventions since World War II William Blum

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Blum/KillingHope_page.html

"[American leaders] are perhaps not so much immoral as they are amoral. It's not that they take pleasure in causing so much death and suffering. It's that they just don't care ... the same that could be said about a sociopath. As long as the death and suffering advance the agenda of the empire, as long as the right people and the right corporations gain wealth and power and privilege and prestige, as long as the death and suffering aren't happening to them or people close to them ... then they just don't care about it happening to other people, including the American soldiers whom they throw into wars and who come home-the ones who make it back alive-with Agent Orange or Gulf War Syndrome eating away at their bodies. American leaders would not be in the positions they hold if they were bothered by such things."William Blum. Killing HopeAngola 1975-1980sBrazil 1961-1964Cambodia 1955-1973Chile 1964-1973Congo 1960-1964Cuba 1959-1980sDominican Republic 1960-1966East Timor 1975El Salvador 1980-1994Greece 1964-1974Grenada 1979-1984Guatemala 1953-1954Guatemala 1962-1980sHaiti 1986-1994Indonesia 1957-1958Indonesia 1965Iran 1953Laos 1957-1973Nicaragua 1981-1990Uruguay 1964-1970Zaire 1975-1978

As we have seen with 9/11, Sandy Hook, Boston, the mass shootings, etc. of the past thirteen years, the government doesn't have to actually blow up planes, shoot children or adults, THEY ONLY HAVE TO SAY THEY DID, thanks to the new media and scattered attention of the public. We now get our news from the Internet or not at all. We cannot concentrate long enough to see the phoniness.

They don't have to drop nuclear weapons on us, THEY ONLY HAVE TO SAY THEY DID to get people to obey.

"My dear, and recently departed, Washington friend, John Judge, liked to say that if you want to call him a “conspiracy theorist” you have to call others “coincidence theorists”.

Thus it was by the most remarkable of coincidences that Arseniy Yatsenuk did indeed become the new prime minister. He could very soon be found in private meetings and public press conferences with the president of the United States and the Secretary-General of NATO, as well as meeting with the soon-to-be new owners of Ukraine, the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund, preparing to impose their standard financial shock therapy. The current protestors in Ukraine don’t need PHDs in economics to know what this portends.

They know about the impoverishment of Greece, Spain, et al. They also despise the new regime for its overthrow of their democratically-elected government, whatever its shortcomings. But the American media obscures these motivations by almost always referring to them simply as “pro-Russian”..........

Au contraire, mon frere, I have instead clearly shown that, in order to make his theory appear to "work", that _he_ [Hall] has, at the bare minimum, err, "misrepresented" [to put it mildly], both the flight path of Fl.175 according to the CBS footage, and the path of the alleged invisible plane, which he has falsely extended due North, directly to the face of the WTC2 from its last actual data point, which is in the middle of the river, almost directly South of the WTC, opposite Ellis Isle and the Statue of Liberty.

To be blunt, Hall has lied , both about the real path of Fl.175 according to the CBS footage, and about where that mysterious other radar data he used actually disappears into thin air [ it disappears South of the WTC , and never carries on in a Northerly direction _past_ the WTC complex, as Fetzer contends in this broadcast].

Furthermore, I have pointed out here and in my analysis that:

given the realities of modern computer software capabilities [ even in 2001], it is in fact a gross error in logic to blithely assume that just because[ in theory] all flight paths match, that that means they are all beyond doubt genuine, when the truth is they could all still have been just as easily manufactured on just one computer, from just one basic "seed" composition.

But I see that neither logic, and knowledge of modern computer software capabilities, are neither Mr Halls, nor Mr Fetzers, strong suites.

Joan Edwards said : "The Central Intelligence Agency has been making US policy since WWII. They are a rogue agency with their own black budget and accountable to no one. As long as this group and its allies continue to do as they please, the world will see no relief from their authoritarian ways. "

Joan, it would make no difference if the CIA were abolished- some other government agency would simply be created to replace it - in fact that other agency might even already exist, unbeknown to us.

The simple fact of the matter is that all governments are 100% criminal entities, [ "a criminal gang writ large" as Rothbard said]; they cannot be contained [by laws, or pieces of paper like the Bill of rights , for example] or voting for "the right" guy, or "the right" laws etc.; once created, they [and their violence] cannot be controlled.

If you have a government in the first place, the criminal acts of the CIA and the rest of the government cannot be avoided, since the nature of all governments is simply violence, extortion, theft and counterfeiting [to name just a few of their inherent, wholly unavoidable, characteristics].

"Joan, it would make no difference if the CIA were abolished- some other government agency would simply be created to replace it - in fact that other agency might even already exist, unbeknown to us." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~This was an answer to Jim's interview above in which he states the solution to the corrupt government is abolishing electronic voting machines and taking away the PAC money, etc, He ignores the fact the US, along with NATO, the military and other groups, has been empire building on behalf of corporations even before WWII. The NSA Act in 1947 created the CIA which has made it possible to circumvent international law by operating covertly. The history of the CIA and NSA is unknown to most.

Unless you know this history of assassinations, destabilizations, false flag attacks, etc., you will not understand anything that is currently going on. It is naive to think election reform will change anything when the military intelligence mafia is in charge and will be eternally.

It's clearly too late for the public to wake up to the truth about the secret government or even do anything about it. And, it's world wide. How do we know all the powers, including Russia and China, aren't just playing mind games?

Jim, if I remember an alternative is a choice between just two theories, one meant to cancel the other. Not that loose latin makes one a slacker but I don't think that a hologram,even if the theory was correct, would have to canel cgi fakery. Hence "alternative" may be here a bit radical. For that you would need one hell lot of holograms of planes men women holographic window sizes etc. And it wouldn't help you since you would need credible witnesses. It's enough to look at the motley of weeping sapheads roleplaying kins of vicsims lost on the planes to see that credible witnesses for 911 are as hard to come by as leprechons and suitcase nukes and for that matter they have to be dismissed out of hand.

There may have been real aspects in this soap, why not, why not the hologram and the witnesses who saw it. Truth is a hard coin. It usually pays for itself eventually but when paired with fairy tales all it can do is to reshuffle fairy tales, when smartly planted. The hologram would be a dumb overkill.

They needed to get the planes into the buildings before the exploded to have a semi-plausible explanation for their "collapse". But it was not physically possible to do that with real planes.

There are three ways to fake it: CGI, video compositing and holograms. But CGI and video compositing would create no images in real time for witnesses to see. If any witnesses saw (what they took to be) planes approaching the building (which is the case), then it can't be either CGIs or video compositing.

John Lear, our nation's most distinguished pilot, Steffan Grossman, who has done a study of the absence of collision effects, Richard B. Hall and others, including Morgan Reynolds and Judy Wood, also support holograms.

They could fly in a plane if they removed levels and undone fixinngs at the point of impact. It would be unnecesery and way too risky and still the big picture wouldn't comply with crash physics.

The hoax was sold on tv by the media. The witnesseses had very little to do with it. The only solid part the witnesses had was in the imagination of the viewers. This turned out to be a bluff as the plane or hologram if you will came from the coast and struck the side of the towers nobody was looking at. Only 15 minutes after the first impact. Not enough time to allow too many witnesses to gather to see it from a distance and enough time to sweep stray cats hanging around the south tower under the excuse of emergency, if it hadn't been done already. Timing, surprize, confusion, this was the ticket.

If they had the technology to do it and wanted to play witth witnesses they would make sure the hologram did come from the side where as many as possible could see it. And they still would have had to figure out how to give it sound jet enrgines make, let alone of a hologram doing 500 mph

The witnesses have plenty to do with it in Jims theory. He has ruled out 2 of the 3 ways to fake it based on these witnesses. If he has ruled out the other possibilities because of these witnesses, he must believe them to be credible. Is their any witnesses, who say they seen planes you could point out which you believe are genuine?

Tessan said: "The DNA mix-up is probably just that, the cover-up for a mix up. Either they have a flawed system for analysing DNA, or they cocked it up. Explosions don't fuse DNA. "

FBI DNA analysis is a farce, a scam.

Although the TWA Fl. 800 case is not specifically examined, the book "Tainting Evidence" is a glorious, in depth analysis/expose of the FBI's fraudulent, incompetent DNA analysis methodologies as used in various high profile cases from the 1990's.

Read it and your perception of the FBI and its "marvelous" , "irrefutable" DNA "evidence",as used at trial, will be drastically revised, to say the least :-) .

Amanda Price said: "The witnesses definitely could of been planted, does anyone even know who these witnesses are. "

No, no no! Say it isn't so!

Surely the "witnesses" must be telling the truth? - no need to do background checks etc. - just believe them- "everybody knows" its just standard [codified?] 9/11 investigative procedure, after all. :-)

J. Fetzer said :" John Lear, our nation's most distinguished pilot, Steffan Grossman, who has done a study of the absence of collision effects, Richard B. Hall and others, including Morgan Reynolds and Judy Wood, also support holograms."

Then none of these people can possibly be aware of the simple fact that it is physically impossible to successfully track a plane [or holographic image of a plane] , moving across the camera-persons field of vision at 500 mph with a camera, no matter how skilled they might claim to be.

In fact it is impossible for such a person to be able to successfully track [ie keep in frame] an object [real or holographic] moving across their field at even _half_ the alleged speed [i.e 250mph.]

Ask just any experienced Formula 1 race car sports photographer.

In the latter part of the Hezarkhani sequence, not only does the alleged photographer manage to successfully track an object supposedly moving at 500+mph in real time [according to Hall's calculations] from left to right across his filed of vision, he also _simultaneously_ manages to keep the tail-section of the Fl. 175 object exactly centered in the frame, as I show in my brief analysis of the Hezarkhani video here:

Furthermore, as pro. film maker AC Weisbecker has previously demonstrated , an object filmed moving at around 500mph through the sky, in real life would exhibit approximately 13 ft. of motion blur per frame at standard video frame recording speed - in other words it would be impossible for a real object filmed traveling at that speed to be seen clearly in any one frame, the image blurring per frame would be significant .

And yet, in the Hezarkhani sequence [and others] there is _no_ image blur per frame, the image always remains clear, frame to frame:

This is something that Jim has covered extensively, not only in the show with Allan Weisbacker, but also in a follow-up show featuring me where I talked in depth about motion blur and why the Hezarkhani footage and other videos must be fake because they lack motion blur.

So if OBF is trying to attack Jim about the motion blur then he's making an untenable point, Jim has covered the motion blur issue in depth.

Dr Fetzer's reliance on eyewitness reports to formulate his fanciful 9/11 hologram theory is telling. It is also most interesting to me that the old TWA 800 charade is being brought up here. As I see it, the TWA 800 event (non-event?) - what with its reported "700 eyewitnesses" - was instrumental to seed the notion, in the public's consciousness, of the utter redundancy and insignificance (to the US legal system) of private eyewitness reports.

go figure. jim kallstrom was a classmate of the chairman-of-the-board of the jfk library foundation and master charlatan, ken feinberg, at umass-amherst. http://www.bostonglobe.com/magazine/specials/2013/04/19/three-who-shined-after/04JMTGsWvFlhM7swRxP96H/story.html

legend also has it that jim took down gotti.

here's ken giving gabby giffords her profile in courage award. this was just after the boston hoax and the suspicious fire at the kennedy library. fortunately they didn't have to cancel the show. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaN2L-RbEKw

don't forget that the interwebs were new and another kennedy protege had an opportunity to participate in one more scam. pierre salinger's performance during the drama gave us the term "pierre salinger syndrome"

not that i remember any of this first-hand; i just read it on the internet.

Again, some very interesting info, seu bobo - thank you. Kallstrom and Feinberg are evidently major players in the 9/11 hoax, but I wasn't aware they were both quite so close (to each other - and to the Kennedy clan). We can only hope that former Marine Corps officer Jim Fetzer will soon invite former Marine platoon commander Jim Kallstrom for a friendly chat on the "Real Deal" show (the two may even be old buddies?). If Fetzer does a good job of it (deflecting / alleviating any suspicions folks may have of Kallstrom's 9/11 complicity) - he may even qualify for a prestigious "Jim Kallstrom Marine Corps Law Enforcement Award" :

Kennedy story goes back hundreds years to Scottish and Irish septs, no less colourful than the history itself.The Scottish-English wars, Waterloo you name it Kennedies were there pulling the strings. Now as they come to be sniped out from political life in somewhat flamboyant fashion that may be worth a show or even a book from Jim. Just don't think you gonna like it, and neither do I.

i really don't know what to make of the so-called kennedy clan. i tend to think of the acting troupe and the their sfo, the park agency inc., as a boutique disney- that specializes in political drama and real estate.

His reliance is also very handy. It removes the labor intensive necessity of deep background checks for individuals [career, life history, financial records, family, education etc.], and allows for the "cherry-picking" of certain individuals "testimony" that handily fits certain theories [eg Halls hologram theory].

Such a sloppy process, typical of nearly all 9/11 "investigators", [ Fetzer, Hall, Wood, Reynolds, Baker, Kalezov, Johnson], goes hand in hand with an investigative procedure that deliberately bypasses any necessity for the far too laborious [and labor intensive] process [ :-) ] of having to closely scrutinize any/all photos/videos _before_ ever using them as "conclusive proof" of anything, so that it is sufficient for the 9/11 "investigator" to declare from on high that all of the imagery "hangs together" on initial, perfunctory examination, and must therefor be genuine, and "besides", that imagery is "backed up" by the "testimony" of certain, entirely unverified "eyewitnesses".

So much for "check the evidence" .

Question: how does something that has never even been thoroughly examined first [e.g. photos, videos, "eyewitness testimony"], ever get elevated to the level of genuine, unassailable "evidence" in the first place? Beats me :-) [But then again, I'm not a big name 9/11 investigator steeped in the scientific and legal methodologies.]

Regards obf.

p.s. Great info on the TWA 800 affair Simon. It would be interesting to research some of the alleged victims, I believe.

From the vantage point of a psyop machinator a witness is an obstacle. They fabricate .liars to throttle any possible real witnesses who otherwise could get their voices through and develop unwanted angles. That is after they minimize likelihood of such witnesses to be present as was the case with the path of the second no plane coming from the coast and further apparent coincidences. They did a good job here. No one can get a handle on these witnesses. Another thing they succeeded with is they have kept it from courts. Not that they would loose the battle but in the process they would discredit the whole legal system behind recognition while an internet or tv liar is no witness. Jim has to shed his precious haze of apparent goofiness sooner or later if he wants make headway or he will keep playing for donats.