He is the Backup making his first start. There is going to be some awkwardness. I am surprised there hasn't been more. I think it is pretty surprising how well things are going considering this is the back up. The offense does not take a step back with Miller on the bench. He is clearly a more dynamic runner but the O moves on without him.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

furls wrote:He is the Backup making his first start. There is going to be some awkwardness. I am surprised there hasn't been more. I think it is pretty surprising how well things are going considering this is the back up. The offense does not take a step back with Miller on the bench. He is clearly a more dynamic runner but the O moves on without him.

Agreed, I'm actually surprised at those issues that Kenny has had, it doesn't seem like him since he has stepped in so nicely.

Is there another team in the top 20 that has this luxury, in which you don't notice the starting QB is not playing?

Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect."I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

furls wrote:He is the Backup making his first start. There is going to be some awkwardness. I am surprised there hasn't been more. I think it is pretty surprising how well things are going considering this is the back up. The offense does not take a step back with Miller on the bench. He is clearly a more dynamic runner but the O moves on without him.

Agreed, I'm actually surprised at those issues that Kenny has had, it doesn't seem like him since he has stepped in so nicely.

Is there another team in the top 20 that has this luxury, in which you don't notice the starting QB is not playing?

I don't think so. Think about how TAMU would be without Manziel. Or how Clemson would be without Tajh Boyd. Maybe Alabama wouldn't miss too much if McCarron was out, but that's mainly due to the system.

Assuming for a minute that Braxton Miller runs this offense better than Kenny G (I think you could argue that either way), what does this game look like then?

Folks didn't seem too impressed with the fact that OSU beat SDSU in a snoozer by 35 with their back up QB. Seriously, that is pretty impressive. They are going to put 55-60 on Cal with a back up. That should get some props.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

furls wrote:Assuming for a minute that Braxton Miller runs this offense better than Kenny G (I think you could argue that either way), what does this game look like then?

Folks didn't seem too impressed with the fact that OSU beat SDSU in a snoozer by 35 with their back up QB. Seriously, that is pretty impressive. They are going to put 55-60 on Cal with a back up. That should get some props.

Well does Braxton make all these throws better than Kenny? I mean I believe he can and does when Brax is on, but it's not like Brax has been doing so for game after game for a whole season. So it does allow an argument that Kenny runs this offense as good as Brax, just that Kenny isn't quite the HR threat when he keeps it, sound fair?

Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect."I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

Buckeyes could put up 700-750 yards with a backup QB against a BCS team. THat is pretty impressive. 560 through 3.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

I moved to Manchester a but more then a year ago. It's funny, there's actually a Buckeye bar and gamewatch location in London. But here in Manchester, I can't even find a place that has American football on.

I really don't get why people are freaking out about the D (universally, not just here, Buckeye World is melting)....

If you didn't realize coming into this year that this team would have lost a game if it had a real NC schedule you're nuts.

The entire hope has been and remains that over the course of the year the D grows and meshes. Now I'm not sure if it can happen with Shazier as your experienced LB (he's just not good in the coach on the field role from what I have seen, hell he's only been good at playing his responsibility well for 7 or so games). The only reason to even watch these games is to watch these kids develop, because otherwise you could just skip the entire non-conference slate.

Not his best work for sure. I am not ledging on the Bucks D right now. There are lots of things to be excited about:

1. Noah Spence's growth. Looks like he will be a real playmaker this year if teams ever actually stop with the 3 step drops.

2. Grant has played pretty well, perhaps he grows quickly with consistent time?

3. Doran Grant looks like a player at CB. I was worried, and thought he was likely a bust.

4. Middle of the DL appears capable of pushing the pocket, but they are a bit weak against the run, not bad, just not there yet.

5. Safety play generally looks better this time this year compared to last year.

What I don't like:

1. Defense does not really look coordinated. The DBs/LBs are not really supporting the DL vs. the short pass, by tending to play off too much too often. It isn't that the DBs aren't playing well, it is that the schemes don't seem to match well. If you are facing a lot of quick passes you either pressure the passer and play a little looser or you don't pressure the passer and you play it close.... in general. Am I crazy here? I don't think the Buckeyes should be playing press coverage the entire game, they should vary the coverages and the pressure, but what is the point of having B-Rad and Do-Ran if you are going to use them like those scrubs in Maize and Blue?

2. Offense is sharp to start every game which says the Gameplanning is great, but the offense bogs down after 3-4 series. Either they are slow to adjust to the D or the OC/Meyer is losing it in transitioning the game in situ. I think Meyer is working very close with Herman to script those plays and then backing off on the in game calls and I think it shows, but that is all conjecture.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

e0y2e3 wrote:I really don't get why people are freaking out about the D (universally, not just here, Buckeye World is melting)....

If you didn't realize coming into this year that this team would have lost a game if it had a real NC schedule you're nuts.

The entire hope has been and remains that over the course of the year the D grows and meshes. Now I'm not sure if it can happen with Shazier as your experienced LB (he's just not good in the coach on the field role from what I have seen, hell he's only been good at playing his responsibility well for 7 or so games). The only reason to even watch these games is to watch these kids develop, because otherwise you could just skip the entire non-conference slate.

Which is why I had a bit of fun with 'Da Bucks' stuff from yesterday. All of what ya said is true and none of it 'occurred' yesterday. It's just how it is.

Add to that that Dykes' offense is a good one, a difficult one to keep in front of you all day and that Goff can throw the ball as well as any freshman in the country and a lot of teams are going to struggle against Cal's offense.

This is the anti-2002 march to a potential title game. Yeah, a weak schedule will assist, but the formula has been completely turned upside down.

If the Buckeyes ain't putting up huge point totals they're gonna get got at some point because the D ain't dominating for another year or so.

Well Dontre Wilson looked damn good again yesterday, so far everything he was billed to be.

Jordan Hall looked good also, but I wonder what happens to his carries when Carlos comes back. I personally would prefer to have Hyde and Wilson getting most of the reps. Hall is a good hybrid back but I like having Hyde as the power back and Wilson as the outside jet sweep guy in the game most of the time.

Also, two games in a row that Decker looked good. I only saw him get beat once and that seemed like more of a mental blocking-assignment mistake then anything.

Bosa looked good again too.

Defensive backs...

Goff looked great though...very quick release, good decisions, good field vision, accurate.

1. Defense does not really look coordinated. The DBs/LBs are not really supporting the DL vs. the short pass, by tending to play off too much too often. It isn't that the DBs aren't playing well, it is that the schemes don't seem to match well. If you are facing a lot of quick passes you either pressure the passer and play a little looser or you don't pressure the passer and you play it close.... in general. Am I crazy here? I don't think the Buckeyes should be playing press coverage the entire game, they should vary the coverages and the pressure, but what is the point of having B-Rad and Do-Ran if you are going to use them like those scrubs in Maize and Blue? .

Correct me if I am wrong , but looking around College football as a whole , I am not really seeing any elite Ds out there this year, not in even in the SEC, and definitely not in the B1G.

"I don't think they're building chemical weapons in Berea. But they might be. I can't say for sure."Chuck Klosterman

Since for the past 2 recruiting seasons I've been hearing about the SooperGenious awesome D prospects arriving at C Bus by the ship load do we thing next week the Bucks can set an aggressive opponent yardage goal of 300 yards and 21 point?

I mean I know it's the might rattlers and stuff but wondering if that expectation can be warranted?

Tebow this Harvin that but AFAIC it was UFs D that made them dominant.

Other than Bosa these kids are soooooo collectively overrated when it comes to results.

e0y2e3 wrote:I really don't get why people are freaking out about the D (universally, not just here, Buckeye World is melting)....

If you didn't realize coming into this year that this team would have lost a game if it had a real NC schedule you're nuts.

The entire hope has been and remains that over the course of the year the D grows and meshes. Now I'm not sure if it can happen with Shazier as your experienced LB (he's just not good in the coach on the field role from what I have seen, hell he's only been good at playing his responsibility well for 7 or so games). The only reason to even watch these games is to watch these kids develop, because otherwise you could just skip the entire non-conference slate.

Pssst....

They blow.

That's why Cartman.

God I hope they get squeezed out of the BCS. Long term losing to Oregun or Clemson 65 - 35 would be devistating.

YahooFanChicago wrote:Well Dontre Wilson looked damn good again yesterday, so far everything he was billed to be.

Jordan Hall looked good also, but I wonder what happens to his carries when Carlos comes back. I personally would prefer to have Hyde and Wilson getting most of the reps. Hall is a good hybrid back but I like having Hyde as the power back and Wilson as the outside jet sweep guy in the game most of the time.

Also, two games in a row that Decker looked good. I only saw him get beat once and that seemed like more of a mental blocking-assignment mistake then anything.

Bosa looked good again too.

Defensive backs...

Goff looked great though...very quick release, good decisions, good field vision, accurate.

I can't agree with this. To me Hyde needs those to earn those carries away from Hall b/c Hall is flat out playing right now. He's mere inches from breaking a homerun at least 3 times a game, we aren't getting that from Hyde. Hall's head seems to be in the game more than Hydes was as well, IMO. Nice problem to have though, been a long time CBus has had that problem.

Last edited by FUDU on Sun Sep 15, 2013 10:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect."I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

Right now with Roby playing at a disappointing level I think the goal is to keep from giving up big plays. So maybe Urbs & Co aren't sweating the big yards and 25-30 pts b/c we're winning by the same margin. I don't know, but seeing those huge open pastures behind the dline every Saturday I'm waiting to see a couple hundred thousand wildebeest run by.

Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect."I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

YahooFanChicago wrote:Well Dontre Wilson looked damn good again yesterday, so far everything he was billed to be.

Jordan Hall looked good also, but I wonder what happens to his carries when Carlos comes back. I personally would prefer to have Hyde and Wilson getting most of the reps. Hall is a good hybrid back but I like having Hyde as the power back and Wilson as the outside jet sweep guy in the game most of the time.

Also, two games in a row that Decker looked good. I only saw him get beat once and that seemed like more of a mental blocking-assignment mistake then anything.

Bosa looked good again too.

Defensive backs...

Goff looked great though...very quick release, good decisions, good field vision, accurate.

I can't agree with this. To me Hyde needs those carries away from Hall b/c Hall is flat out playing right now. He's mere inches from breaking a homerun at least 3 times a game, we aren't getting that from Hyde. Hall's head seems to be in the game more than Hydes was as well, IMO. Nice problem to have though, been a long time CBus has had that problem.

Or maybe Hall will always and forever be mere inches away from that homerun. Because that's who he is and what he is.

e0y2e3 wrote:I really don't get why people are freaking out about the D (universally, not just here, Buckeye World is melting)....

If you didn't realize coming into this year that this team would have lost a game if it had a real NC schedule you're nuts.

The entire hope has been and remains that over the course of the year the D grows and meshes. Now I'm not sure if it can happen with Shazier as your experienced LB (he's just not good in the coach on the field role from what I have seen, hell he's only been good at playing his responsibility well for 7 or so games). The only reason to even watch these games is to watch these kids develop, because otherwise you could just skip the entire non-conference slate.

Pssst....

They blow.

That's why Cartman.

God I hope they get squeezed out of the BCS. Long term losing to Oregun or Clemson 65 - 35 would be devistating.

Fickle & Vrable need offed.... But how?

He never said the didn't blow. He said people shouldn't be surprised.

BTW, I'd be surprised to see Fickell here in a 18 months or so. But I'd also be surprised to not see Vrabel here. Be hard for Meyer to give up on a guy that's become a major factor in recruiting. Yeah, Meyer did well elsewhere w/o Vrabel, but Vrabel sells OSU to kids and does it well.

Seriously, that offense was 1 point from beating aTm last year and about 5 points away from a BCS bowl. It's one of if not the toughest to stop in CFB and when you're number one super stud corner gives up 14-21 himself you're going to give up points.

Rewatch the game, Roby was horrible. That is the only concerning thing.

Talking about the recruits? Seriously JB, are you six? Meyer beat OSU with a senior loaded D that was recruited by the last guy and right now he's playing with a D mostly recruited by the last guy. What team in the history of CFB has recruited kids and played them all in one/two years over experience and solid players?

Yesterday's gameplan was the perfect plan so I also don't know why anyone is mentioning Fickel. The goal (and it was the right one against a pure air raid like that) is to keep everything in front of you and confuse with varying coverages. The key to this, of course, is not having blown coverages (Roby's on the first TD) and tackling (something they 100% didn't do).

My concern with the D is not Fickel or talent based, because both are there. It is that last year it took a coach on the field type in Boren coming over before they got their shit together. I don't see a "Boren" out there to calm everyone down.

Yesterday they completely removed the Cal running game playing with 1 LB the entire game (until the fourth when they were running extremely soft coverages due to Cal's explosive potential) and Bryant/Barnett played really well on the positive side. On the negative side, they tried to run a Dime for a full game for the first time and Pitt Brown still blows and Tyvis Powell looked like a kid that had never seen anything like that before at the Star. Grant looked fine, Shazier looked good and Roby blew.

That Cal team can and will run up 21+ on every gawd damn team they play, not sure what world you live in JB.

I mean fuck, reading Buckeye Nation today is the most absurd bullshit ever. This D needs to get better as the season goes on. Thankfully in CFB this typically happens. Holy shit, I mean how did Buckeye Nation survive beating UAB by 3 last year without eating a shotgun?

Last edited by e0y2e3 on Sun Sep 15, 2013 12:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Also why does Vrable need offed? The DL was very good yesterday. I mean holy fuck, what does the DL have to do with anything? Christ he's coached Cris Carter up to the point of being a useful player, which no one thought was possible and has a true freshman playing like a junior. The only DL player that has been meh this far is Hale.

PS: Oregon has put up <30 against every none shit PAC D they've faced since forever. 2010 Buckeyes, 2011 Auburn, Always Stanford, etc, etc. You can crown them because you just discovered Chips O and stuff, but the track record for success on the field in CFB isn't there and frankly, they've been this good on O just about every single year since 2007.

Last edited by e0y2e3 on Sun Sep 15, 2013 12:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

furls wrote:B-Rad and Do-Ran if you are going to use them like those scrubs in Maize and Blue?

Rewatch the game, I did last night. The D was performing when playing off coverage better than when in press. B-Rad got his ass beat in the press for one Cal TD and was beat on the TD when the Cal WR stepped out of bounds (thankfully). I can't even tell you what they were in when Roby and Pitt Brown let Cal into the game with that first blown coverage because they just kind of starred at each other and then Roby decided to two hand tag the WR that didn't catch the ball.

Not to mention that tunnel screening the press is absurdly easy and the tunnel screen was the biggest problem yesterday.

We were saying the same shit about the coordination and support between the secondary and the DL last year and it magically disappeared when Boren came over. I honestly just don't think Shazier is a #1 LB type. He has the talent and makes the plays but he isn't the elder statesman that can get everyone in position and run a young D.

Also, speaking of rewatching the game. On Kenny G's long 4th down run Corey Linsley had one of the best reach blocks that ended up downfield and pancaking the safety I have ever seen. It was freaking fantastic.

I think Fickell is gone within 18 months because (unless he adapts quickly) he's not from the same system as Meyer would like to use defensively.Not that he can't take these athletes they recruit and be that guy, but we'll see.

And I agree Vrabel is fine. The DL is fine and the bottom line is he's become as key a member of the recruiting process as anyone in the system by most accounts.

Fickel has never played the Dime like that before, that was purely a Meyer and Withers D that was played on every snap yesterday.

That isn't to say Fickel is staying for sure, because he obviously could take a HC job and probably will at some point. Be careful what you wish for though, a lot of super DCs have looked like shit against the Air Raid. And it's really hard to be aggressive on D against 3 step drops which is pretty much all teams are willing to run against OSU this year.

e0y2e3 wrote:Fickel has never played the Dime like that before, that was purely a Meyer and Withers D that was played on every snap yesterday.

That isn't to say Fickel is staying for sure, because he obviously could take a HC job and probably will at some point. Be careful what you wish for though, a lot of super DCs have looked like shit against the Air Raid. And it's really hard to be aggressive on D against 3 step drops which is pretty much all teams are willing to run against OSU this year.

I guess that's my point: It's a Meyers and Withers D. With Withers as Co-DC/Asst HC (and also coaching DBs) I'm still not sure I understand why Fickell isn't a bit redundant.

I know he was the good soldier and that he's a very well-regarded coach, but again, seems redundant and a bit mismatched to me.

Honestly, I kind of like the dime they played yesterday. It is a little frustrating because it is a bit passive, but at the same time it is very effective. It is a defense that they are going to need against most of the elite passing spreads. On that first TD it looked like B-Rad had the underneath zone on the boundary side and it looked like Pitt Brown was supposed to pick up the WR after he cleared Roby's zone. I think Roby let him through to easily and that "tackling" effort was abysmal; he basically shoved him forward....

Again, I am not calling for press, but you have to be able to move between playing tight outside and playing soft. If every play is run soft, they will shred you with 5 yard outs. Just have to mix it up some. That is all.

As for the "uber talented recruits," they are doing well. Bosa looks great. Washington looks great (in limited action). Spence looks great. Josh Perry is starting at SAM, but really hasn't seen a lot of reps. Curtis Grant is doing fine at MLB so there is no reason to throw Mitchell in at the MIKE. The secondary is all upper classmen. I just don't see where Meyer is going to bench Barnett and Bryant to start Bell or some of the other freshman. Bell has been terrific on ST. I don't know what else you are waiting for. What you really want to see out of freshman is for them to flash talent when they are in, and we are definitely seeing that.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

e0y2e3 wrote:Fickel has never played the Dime like that before, that was purely a Meyer and Withers D that was played on every snap yesterday.

That isn't to say Fickel is staying for sure, because he obviously could take a HC job and probably will at some point. Be careful what you wish for though, a lot of super DCs have looked like shit against the Air Raid. And it's really hard to be aggressive on D against 3 step drops which is pretty much all teams are willing to run against OSU this year.

I guess that's my point: It's a Meyers and Withers D. With Withers as Co-DC/Asst HC (and also coaching DBs) I'm still not sure I understand why Fickell isn't a bit redundant.

I know he was the good soldier and that he's a very well-regarded coach, but again, seems redundant and a bit mismatched to me.

I don't love Luke Fickel and I would be OK if he left. I am hoping someone gives him a job offer at a MAC team. I would love to see a Narduzzi or Pellini type here as DC.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

Agree on Oregon, a rather meh Buckeye D put that fire out with some ease.

I think the hindsight for yesterday is simply Cal's O is legit as peeker said IIRC. I aslo thikn JB is right about Urban's Gators, they were good, but great just as much b/c of their D. Urban will get us there.

Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect."I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

e0y2e3 wrote:Fickel has never played the Dime like that before, that was purely a Meyer and Withers D that was played on every snap yesterday.

That isn't to say Fickel is staying for sure, because he obviously could take a HC job and probably will at some point. Be careful what you wish for though, a lot of super DCs have looked like shit against the Air Raid. And it's really hard to be aggressive on D against 3 step drops which is pretty much all teams are willing to run against OSU this year.

I guess that's my point: It's a Meyers and Withers D. With Withers as Co-DC/Asst HC (and also coaching DBs) I'm still not sure I understand why Fickell isn't a bit redundant.

I know he was the good soldier and that he's a very well-regarded coach, but again, seems redundant and a bit mismatched to me.

Fickel runs the base and nickel sets.

Withers will be gone as a HC very soon too.

As to Pelini Furls, no thanks. He was fine at LSU but Nebraska has been horrendous from jump with him on D.

I get the feeling Roby just thought he could suit up this year, go through the motions and walk into the 1st round. That push a long the sideline instead of tackling..... deserved to get him a seat on the bench.

CAL ran that goddamn hand off fake pass play like 17 times, and they got fooled by it just about every time.

The DL is excellent. Spence is a monster and Bosa filled in well for A-Wash. Behind them it's a cluster of fuck. But since there's no D on our schedule that can stop our O, I can live with shootouts.

The angle that the Cal CB took was excellent (and at the same time ridiculous) and was the only thing that saved a TD. If he underestimates Wilson's speed just a bit, Wilson is GONE. That play was very close.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.