Norther and Western Europe also absorbed a lot of these things across Europe without the necessary presence of actual Muslims.

Also the denial of cultural influences of the Ottomans in the Balkans is just Nationalistic wishful thinking. Turkish influences are everywhere, in the cuisine, language, arts, clothing, music, dances, literature.

What I was trying to say is that while differences exist and sometimes are very deep, the exchange of population and culture and customs always existed within Europe and into Europe. Europe can't afford to isolate itself as much as some wish. We have an aging population and a dependance on imported goods and a dependance of exports. If we want goods, knowledge and information to flow, we need to accept the people that come with it.

What we really need is to figure out how to adapt to these new times and how to control and absorb immigrant populations while maintaining the defineing charactersitics of our European culture.

Originally Posted by Orlong

It doesnt destroy the land to bury styrofoam 25 feet below the ground

Today Obama once again kneeled at the altar of environmental naziism and hurt this once great country. He has now banned all drilling in the Atlantic Ocean

They are having relatively significant social problems owing to poorly assimilated groups of immigrants. The US' immigration problem is actually quite tame by comparison, for the simple reason that those hispanics that do come here often are very keen on being Americanized; they want to wear blue jeans, have the white picket fence, and eat Big Macs.

guess we are stuck with this until all the european country take the example of France and go beat some respect into those fanatics, until then we are stuck with those insane idiot spreading their bs around the world.

Originally Posted by caervek

Obviously this issue doesn't affect me however unlike some raiders I don't see the point in taking satisfaction in this injustice, it's wrong, just because it doesn't hurt me doesn't stop it being wrong, the player base should stand together when Blizzard do stupid shit like this not laugh at the ones being victimised.

What we really need is to figure out how to adapt to these new times and how to control and absorb immigrant populations while maintaining the defineing charactersitics of our European culture.

Indeed. Europeans should start one big ass editing process to quran and the bible. Getting rid of anything that can easily lead to misinterpret or abuse of the original text in any kind of negative effect for womens rights, social inequality and generally human rights. That being a serious joke anyway for people who wants to take old rules from time of wars between religions and cults and from some delusional chauvinists and hypocrite apostles and so on. Bunch of fucking sheeps lets old letters and books manipulate their feelings and give themselves some different rights over others.

Why the fuck are they teaching this kind of crap anyway in the 21st century? How is it even necessary? Because the teach them it is that's why so lets teach them to think again for themselves for instance. Let only educated and reasonable people study the old texts since they are usually wise enough to be sceptical and objective. Take that shit away from kids and humans might one day have less disagreements. Afterall these three abrahamic religions seems to give only bad reasons to be insulted. Getting insulted easily is dangerous and this is not what we want to teach to our future generations.

What I'm saying that this book is DANGEROUS and it most deffinetly should NOT be spread. Not more than Mein Kampf or some other facist ideologies from Stalin to Mao and such cases. Those things should be burried to history with the education how things can go wrong with these kind of writings. All the way to first testament. Take the morally bad parts out of it and leave the good parts and lets fucking evolve! Let gay people do what they want it's not the business of believing christians or muslims. Let women dress how they want it's not business of chrtians or muslims. Let people drink and have sex with as many people they fucking wants to. All this denilaism or should I say banning is manipulated trough generations within religions and they rarely keeps it within their own circles. First of all keep religions out of politics. No self thinking rational human wants to be a fucking sheep like believers admits and even are proud of being. LOL big time.

Sahih Bukhari (83:37) - "Allah's Apostle never killed anyone except in one of the following three situations: (1) A person who killed somebody unjustly, was killed (in Qisas,) (2) a married person who committed illegal sexual intercourse and (3) a man who fought against Allah and His Apostle and deserted Islam and became an apostate."

Sahih Bukhari (89:271) - A man who embraces Islam, then reverts to Judaism is to be killed according to "the verdict of Allah and his apostle."

This kind of misinterpretable text is really all over the old letters and books and not forgetting all the immoral sensless crap that I've had to read from the bible. Not really smart now is it. Just fucking edit it to 21st century and the kids will forget those old dogmas and stupid shit. Afterall the old dogmas of the past are inadequate in the present.

I'm from sweden and i can say that some immigrants are awsome. We need them for some jobs, doctors for example, but...
Certain groups of immigrants are very very difficult to integrate. For example: Studies show that 80-90% of the somali immigrants are illiterates.
In some cultures only the men work while the women stay home and take care of the home and the kids. If all women in a country did that. well, you get the point..
It takes a loooong time for immigrants to get jobs in sweden. if 10 ppl come to sweden, 5 of them will have had a job in 7 years.

I don't dislike immigrants. I dislike the amount of immigrants we take in.
If you look at how many immigrants we got and get every year and how many kids swedish ppl and immigrants get on avarage, sweden will have 3 million "swedes" (2 swedish parents) and 14 million "immigrants" in 60 years.
We need to chill the fuck out, we don't have the jobs or the economy for it and we don't have anywhere to put them. It is not fair to the swedish people or the immigrants.

There is only one party in sweden you can vote for if you want the madness to stop, but you get called a rasist if you do!

In China, I meet a lot of people readying to leave for Australia/Canada/the USA, and honestly most of them are assholes. They spit, litter, and are generally poor human beings. They are rich, so it's only a matter of time until they are accepted though. Very few can even speak passable English/French.

A while back a boatload of Tamil's came to Canada, that really pissed me off. They can't even speak English, and there were terrorists on board. Fucking Canada and it's huamnistic nature. Leeches love to refugee here. Next time turn the boat around or sink it. Now those 500 people are living a free life in Canada doing shit all. Pisses me off.

What we really need is to figure out how to adapt to these new times and how to control and absorb immigrant populations while maintaining the defineing charactersitics of our European culture.

Everyone's solution seems to be to get rid of the immigrant's cultures. You can't just take away their culture and their way of living. We can't take a too authoritarian stance on cultures. Banning the Quran because the loud minority makes it look bad is stupid, though I can certainly agree that there should be alterations to it to make sure that texts where it literally says something that is against the law should be removed. There's no reason for those texts to be there.

Still, I'd rather have countries strengthen their identities instead of taking away identities. A 1974 reform here in Sweden made it so that the king can no longer knight people, special titles like "Count" cannot be given out and stuff like that that added flavor to our monarchistic society. In schools, all countries should focus on the nation's history rather than focusing so much on other countries' histories. I mean, sure, knowing the basics of the American revolution and civil war should be okay, but I can't see why there need to be so much focus on every other country's history if they didn't do anything to shape the world around them, instead of learning about the time when the country you live in was at it's most powerful peak.

In my opinion (Belgium) many immigrants behave like criminals and are really annoying. The majority of Antwerp is now Arab. I don't have anything against Arab adults, but the teens are annoying as hell. They randomly assault you, steal, trashtalk, etc. The majority of the Belgian teen population in Belgium hates Arabs ( I dont "hate" them but i'd be happy to get rid of them and I see every person as an individual because there are also very nice and awesome Arab teens ). In belgium only Morocco and Turkish people are hated

^ younglings are easily manipulated. It's again the older ones there who gets their facist ideology trough their heads. Don't share this ideology? You're not a true muslim they say. How is this even possible? No neo nazis, no racism. No sharia-muslims, no facism and insults against human rights. Antwerp is one sad case.

In my opinion (Belgium) many immigrants behave like criminals and are really annoying. The majority of Antwerp is now Arab. I don't have anything against Arab adults, but the teens are annoying as hell. They randomly assault you, steal, trashtalk, etc. The majority of the Belgian teen population in Belgium hates Arabs ( I dont "hate" them but i'd be happy to get rid of them and I see every person as an individual because there are also very nice and awesome Arab teens ). In belgium only Morocco and Turkish people are hated

Funny enough what you just described has to do in part with the fact that they are in Belgium. When their families arrived to Europe these kids found themselves in a pothole somewhere betwen their traditional culture and western culture. Western music, movies, dress code, forms of entertainment but without the cultural background that would make the consumption of these products less destructive. Simply the social structures of their parents aren't adapted to this cultural shift yet.

Other interesting thing is stuff like Chavs in England or Canis/chonis in Spain. They are in essence local European "white trash" that act and behave as the above described immigrant youth. The parallel is in the lack of education or suporting social structures that would allow these people to behave in a more civilized manner.

It is self evident considering the parallels that the issue is not racial, but rather socio-economic.

I mean don't missunderstand me. I'm not a bleeding heart social-liberal. But I don't believe in such simple answers to problems as...uh it's the race, or uh it's the religion. I prefer to put things into context and look at issues from all sides. It tends to give better long term results, then beliefs based on ignorance or denial.

Last edited by Mihalik; 2013-01-29 at 06:09 PM.

Originally Posted by Orlong

It doesnt destroy the land to bury styrofoam 25 feet below the ground

Today Obama once again kneeled at the altar of environmental naziism and hurt this once great country. He has now banned all drilling in the Atlantic Ocean

Hey look yet another one. (Innocent man gets kicked from behind, passes out on the floor, they keep kicking him in the head and he gets a concussion and several fractions (broken) on his head / face area.

As a Norwegian, I tend to see people coming here exploiting our "goodwill" culture. We're apparently supposed to protect everyone who asks for it. Even terrorists. Meh. I do have something against immigrants who only come here and exploit pretty much everything. Those who do come here and do put some effort into being integrated and getting a job (which is NOT hard), I'm all for it. Those who come here only to collect different types of benefits and ship it to their families (and in the end bringing them over) ... well, I'm against those immigrants.

If you do pull your weight, then come on in. We're glad to have you here. If you're here to just spit in our face and wandering aimlessly in the cities begging for coins, then please don't come. There's more than enough possibilities for them to both learn Norwegian and getting an education for free.