Looks like the real tax (inflation/money printing) is not helping pad the government pockets any longer. No surprise, the rich get first dibs at 1% interest, throw it on the stock market and we all know how the .1% pay taxes. An angle emerges that I never considered: Since real inflation is much higher than the government approved reports will say and the fact that wages have remained stagnant, the government is really feeling the pain in loss of tax revenue purchasing power. Combine this with a rapidly growing welfare state and here we are. Cant really increase wage taxes since they are already at 50% for most western countries. There is no option left but to try bullshit like commodity taxes. This is the fiat economy and welfare state tripping over itself. Still got one of those stupid vests from my blue collar days in the trunk of my car. Never thought I might need it again.

Quote:It's important to note that the majority of protestors are middle aged, these are not college or university students, who make up the usual French protests. This is a grassroots protest. It's been reported anywhere from 50-80% of the French support the gilets jaunes. This is NOT just about taxes.

The protests began over the new taxes imposed by Macron's government on fuel. The taxes are viewed as punishing those who use cars and those who can't afford to buy newer ones. The French already pay heavy taxes on fuel, along with high tolls on highways. Every car in France is required to have 2 high visibility vests (gilets jaunes). The protestors began wearing those vests while protesting.

Along with this, the cost of living is incredibly high while salaries are painfully low, especially in larger cities like Paris. The myth of government-ordered 35 hour work weeks isn't the reality for most salaried French people. Taxes eat huge chunks of their money and the French are fed up with making the same amount in their salaries as those who don't work at all and rely on government assistance.

Parts of France are also filled with unassimilated migrants. These migrants get government assistance as well. A large part of the French are sick of paying for migrants when French people are suffering as well. There are areas that have stopped being culturally French and cities the French avoid for holidays because of the migrant problem.

In addition to this, retired people have been lodging their dissatisfaction with their retirement pensions (one woman in a video circulating around French Facebook confronts Macron about having to live off of 500€ a month) and Macron's reactions have been condescending across the board. He currently has about a 26% approval rating.

All of this started bubbling up a few weeks ago as the protests began with the gilets jaunes in November. The protests last weekend got violent. Statues at the Arc De Triomphe were broken; the Arc was defaced. In Marseille, an 80 year old woman was killed as she was closing her shutters. The police threw a tear gas canister at her window. While outside of larger cities, many police officers and firefighters are taking off their helmets and/or standing in solidarity with the gilets jaunes. There have been reports that they have also refused to shake Macron's hand and have turned their backs to government officials while serving in official capacities.

On Monday (December 2), there was a protest by the ambulances in Paris. They stood at Concorde with lights flashing and sirens sounding. Truck drivers have also showed their solidarity. They have also driven through Paris with lights flashing to show their dissatisfaction. Roads have been closed down by gilets jaunes and they are blocking access of oil in both ports and at stations. As of posting, over 650 stations are on a list of facing shortages or out of fuel. During yesterday's news cycle, many truck drivers were seen disrupting broadcasts by honking in solidarity with the gilets jaunes.

On Tuesday (December 3), the French government spoke about their plans for "appeasement" of the gilets jaunes. Their offer was to postpone the start date of 3 taxes (related to fuel). This offer has been scoffed at by the gilets jaunes, who have called it "crumbs" as the taxes haven't even been implemented yet and the offer does nothing to address the issues regarding cost of living.

Along with this, the French have begun demanding that Macron refuse to sign the UN Migration Act on December 10. This has begun appearing across the Facebook groups and events but has not been widely reported in the French media as far as I can tell.

This has culminated in everything from demands Macron step down to the creation of the 6th Republic. There are protests planned for Saturday across France. The protestors are calling the Paris protests ACT 4. They are quoting from the French National Anthem ("Aux Armes Citoyens") and planning to protest at Bastille. The medical community is also participating in the protests on Saturday.

TLDR: This is bigger than taxes. These aren't your usual French protests.

If this starts to impact trade, where Britain cant get its goods through the ports because they may shut them down, it will have an incredible and undesirable effect of fucking Britain 2 ways because we're having serious problems with Brexit and to top it off the goods flowing through anyway could be impeded.

I would like to be the fly on the wall when some high up British politician gets on the phone to the French and ask them why the hell is Britain suffering economic and social problems because they cannot keep their house in order.

We've past a rubicon moment and it caught everyone by surprise. Either the French go all in or they go further along and end up back right where they started. They cant lock up everyone!

Quote:The real story in France
It will probably not surprise anyone here to know that the globomedia is completely misrepresenting the Yellow Vest protests in Paris. This is a post by an American living in Paris about what is really going on with the gilets jaunes.

It's important to note that the majority of protestors are middle aged, these are not college or university students, who make up the usual French protests. This is a grassroots protest. It's been reported anywhere from 50-80% of the French support the gilets jaunes. This is NOT just about taxes.

The protests began over the new taxes imposed by Macron's government on fuel. The taxes are viewed as punishing those who use cars and those who can't afford to buy newer ones. The French already pay heavy taxes on fuel, along with high tolls on highways. Every car in France is required to have 2 high visibility vests (gilets jaunes). The protestors began wearing those vests while protesting.

Along with this, the cost of living is incredibly high while salaries are painfully low, especially in larger cities like Paris. The myth of government-ordered 35 hour work weeks isn't the reality for most salaried French people. Taxes eat huge chunks of their money and the French are fed up with making the same amount in their salaries as those who don't work at all and rely on government assistance.

Parts of France are also filled with unassimilated migrants. These migrants get government assistance as well. A large part of the French are sick of paying for migrants when French people are suffering as well. There are areas that have stopped being culturally French and cities the French avoid for holidays because of the migrant problem.

In addition to this, retired people have been lodging their dissatisfaction with their retirement pensions (one woman in a video circulating around French Facebook confronts Macron about having to live off of 500€ a month) and Macron's reactions have been condescending across the board. He currently has about a 26% approval rating.

All of this started bubbling up a few weeks ago as the protests began with the gilets jaunes in November. The protests last weekend got violent. Statues at the Arc De Triomphe were broken; the Arc was defaced. In Marseille, an 80 year old woman was killed as she was closing her shutters. The police threw a tear gas canister at her window. While outside of larger cities, many police officers and firefighters are taking off their helmets and/or standing in solidarity with the gilets jaunes. There have been reports that they have also refused to shake Macron's hand and have turned their backs to government officials while serving in official capacities.

On Monday (December 2), there was a protest by the ambulances in Paris. They stood at Concorde with lights flashing and sirens sounding. Truck drivers have also showed their solidarity. They have also driven through Paris with lights flashing to show their dissatisfaction. Roads have been closed down by gilets jaunes and they are blocking access of oil in both ports and at stations. As of posting, over 650 stations are on a list of facing shortages or out of fuel. During yesterday's news cycle, many truck drivers were seen disrupting broadcasts by honking in solidarity with the gilets jaunes.

On Tuesday (December 3), the French government spoke about their plans for "appeasement" of the gilets jaunes. Their offer was to postpone the start date of 3 taxes (related to fuel). This offer has been scoffed at by the gilets jaunes, who have called it "crumbs" as the taxes haven't even been implemented yet and the offer does nothing to address the issues regarding cost of living.

Along with this, the French have begun demanding that Macron refuse to sign the UN Migration Act on December 10. This has begun appearing across the Facebook groups and events but has not been widely reported in the French media as far as I can tell.

This has culminated in everything from demands Macron step down to the creation of the 6th Republic. There are protests planned for Saturday across France. The protestors are calling the Paris protests ACT 4. They are quoting from the French National Anthem ("Aux Armes Citoyens") and planning to protest at Bastille. The medical community is also participating in the protests on Saturday.

TLDR: This is bigger than taxes. These aren't your usual French protests.

I live 500 yards from Champs Elysées; I’ve told my kids not to go to school on Saturday (my son was almost hit by a tear gas canister last Saturday while going to school). We’ll close the shutters and watch Netflix all day. I have ordered a couple additional yellow vests on amazon if I need to join a march on the Elysée Palace (unlikely). I will assemble the bolts on my rifles, and get the ammo out of the safe. My wife will stockpile milk, water and some carbohydrates.

The yellow vests are not very violent but they might well decide to set fire to my car (won’t do anything) or less likely to my house (will object). More unpredictable and dangerous would be a descent of the ethnic minorities from the banlieues (suburbs) who could get very violent (they have automatic weapons and light mortars). They are natural enemies of the yellow vests and they could fight against them or with them. They are more likely to target the police.

We have talked with my wife of going to cottage but I think Paris is globally safer. The military and police forces will never leave Paris undefended, while we could get attacked or blocked any time on the way to and from cottage. Not to mention that I don’t want to be caught carrying firearms in my car on revolution day.

The first hand report of a repped RVF member is so much more credible than the reports in the news. I appreciate getting such first hand information.

Can you talk more about what some of the reports are saying, that the yellow vest protestors are the core of French society and not the usual poor? What are the French middle class really hoping to see happen? What do these protests really signify about the state of France?

(12-05-2018 05:09 PM)Montrose Wrote: I live 500 yards from Champs Elysées; I’ve told my kids not to go to school on Saturday (my son was almost hit by a tear gas canister last Saturday while going to school). We’ll close the shutters and watch Netflix all day. I have ordered a couple additional yellow vests on amazon if I need to join a march on the Elysée Palace (unlikely). I will assemble the bolts on my rifles, and get the ammo out of the safe. My wife will stockpile milk, water and some carbohydrates.

The yellow vests are not very violent but they might well decide to set fire to my car (won’t do anything) or less likely to my house (will object). More unpredictable and dangerous would be a descent of the ethnic minorities from the banlieues (suburbs) who could get very violent (they have automatic weapons and light mortars). They are natural enemies of the yellow vests and they could fight against them or with them. They are more likely to target the police.

We have talked with my wife of going to cottage but I think Paris is globally safer. The military and police forces will never leave Paris undefended, while we could get attacked or blocked any time on the way to and from cottage. Not to mention that I don’t want to be caught carrying firearms in my car on revolution day.

I’m not worried, but I’m prepared.

I'm the tower of power, too sweet to be sour. I'm funky like a monkey. Sky's the limit and space is the place!
-Randy Savage

(12-05-2018 05:09 PM)Montrose Wrote: I live 500 yards from Champs Elysées; I’ve told my kids not to go to school on Saturday (my son was almost hit by a tear gas canister last Saturday while going to school). We’ll close the shutters and watch Netflix all day. I have ordered a couple additional yellow vests on amazon if I need to join a march on the Elysée Palace (unlikely). I will assemble the bolts on my rifles, and get the ammo out of the safe. My wife will stockpile milk, water and some carbohydrates.

The yellow vests are not very violent but they might well decide to set fire to my car (won’t do anything) or less likely to my house (will object). More unpredictable and dangerous would be a descent of the ethnic minorities from the banlieues (suburbs) who could get very violent (they have automatic weapons and light mortars). They are natural enemies of the yellow vests and they could fight against them or with them. They are more likely to target the police.

We have talked with my wife of going to cottage but I think Paris is globally safer. The military and police forces will never leave Paris undefended, while we could get attacked or blocked any time on the way to and from cottage. Not to mention that I don’t want to be caught carrying firearms in my car on revolution day.

I’m not worried, but I’m prepared.

Is it really that bad or are you overly paranoid. I know there are riots but it is not a "war".

French police clubbing Yellow Vests inside a closed Burger King in Paris this last weekend. Some of the comments say the Gilets jaunes were in there to loot the restaurant, but the video description seems to suggest otherwise. Either way, it's a disturbing piece of tape:

Maybe I’m paranoid but the government seems very worried. Could be propaganda. Most likely everything will be fine and I will watch Netflix all day in the living room.

It’s difficult to know what the middle class wants. As I said earlier, Macron was elected on a well executed scam, took all powers and proceeded to push an aggressive globalist agenda. I think that most people want him gone. He is scared and trying to agitate the fears of violence. It’s difficult to know what will happen because the movement is spontaneous and leaderless. The yellow vests are split between far right and far left ideologies which is a bit difficult to analyze.

One should note that >50% of security forces vote for the far right and don’t like Macron. They are very sympathetic to the yellow vests.

Honestly the conditions are ideal for a civil war. My central scenario is that not much will happen because the government will block trains and roads (the yellow vests come to Paris by train or bus. They don’t live in Paris. Paris is very Macronist). But when shit happens it can go south very quickly.

(12-04-2018 10:14 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote: Ultimately a collapse of the welfare state is the absolute best option at this point, for every Western nation in the world.

As Simeon says, Europe has survived through world wars and communism and rebuilt each time, but if you replace enough of its citizens with Africans and Arabs then Europe is dead.

Same goes for America with Mexicans and whatever Africans and Arabs the Democrats fly, boat and truck into the nation. Same goes for Australia. 100 years from now our descendants would be glad that we endured a decade long depression along with many brutal civil wars rather than becoming a de-facto outcropping of the world's shitholes with nothing but the dilapidated 19th century ruins to remind us that things were ever any different.

Indeed generous welfare systems is what attracted the 3rd worlders in the 1st place. Once that lifeline is cut. Expect them to start self-deportation or they will have to be dealt with if they turn violent as a result.

I mean: remember how Macron offended both President Trump and the French natives, during the 1st World-War ceremony, by inviting as main guest of honor a far-Left, fiercely anti-Trump African female militant? (I even posted a thread in Politics about this)

Well, since that (sad) day of outrage, everything has turned bad for Macron:

To begin with, mysterious and powerful informants have given to the Japanese the keys to dismantle the Renault-Nissan alliance. Renault being the symbol and pride of long-standing French enterprises, it is a hard hit on France and Macron, to see the Globalists' poster-child Ghosn in jail and Renault in (relative) distress.

Secondly - anecdotally, but still: Macron had nobody waiting for him at the arrival of his presidential plane in Buenos Aires for the G20. Nobody except... a couple of Argentinian civilian employees wearing... yellow vests! The curse is following Macron all the way to South Am!

And more importantly, the Yellow Vest rebellion is hounding him at home. Much has been said about this popular revolt, which involves an unusual mix of Native and "Arab" blue-collars, endangered White middle-class workers or retirees, alt-Left profiteers, and Right-wing fighters... but in any case it does seem like a huge curse is plaguing Macron since the day he dissed President Trump.

(12-05-2018 05:09 PM)Montrose Wrote: I live 500 yards from Champs Elysées; I’ve told my kids not to go to school on Saturday (my son was almost hit by a tear gas canister last Saturday while going to school). We’ll close the shutters and watch Netflix all day. I have ordered a couple additional yellow vests on amazon if I need to join a march on the Elysée Palace (unlikely). I will assemble the bolts on my rifles, and get the ammo out of the safe. My wife will stockpile milk, water and some carbohydrates.

The yellow vests are not very violent but they might well decide to set fire to my car (won’t do anything) or less likely to my house (will object). More unpredictable and dangerous would be a descent of the ethnic minorities from the banlieues (suburbs) who could get very violent (they have automatic weapons and light mortars). They are natural enemies of the yellow vests and they could fight against them or with them. They are more likely to target the police.

We have talked with my wife of going to cottage but I think Paris is globally safer. The military and police forces will never leave Paris undefended, while we could get attacked or blocked any time on the way to and from cottage. Not to mention that I don’t want to be caught carrying firearms in my car on revolution day.

I’m not worried, but I’m prepared.

(12-05-2018 06:25 PM)Montrose Wrote: One should note that >50% of security forces vote for the far right and don’t like Macron. They are very sympathetic to the yellow vests.

Honestly the conditions are ideal for a civil war. My central scenario is that not much will happen because the government will block trains and roads (the yellow vests come to Paris by train or bus. They don’t live in Paris. Paris is very Macronist). But when shit happens it can go south very quickly.

Stay safe dude.

I would suggest having some actionable evac plans set to leave the country just in case shit really hits the fan. Don't assume because the military/police will defend Paris as a whole, that they have the manpower to assist you if you get overwhelmed with hostiles. If you live in a high rise (I know... it's Paris... but a few stories above ground level will do the job), you'll probably be OK since you're armed but if you're ground level, I would bounce to higher ground at a minimum (relatives who live in a high rise?). If things blow up, it will be hell trying to get out of town (especially with a family) and you will be vulnerable to overwhelming forces while on ground level.

That all said, this could be the USA (or elsewhere in the western world) in a few years with the way things are going.

Globalist/liberal idiot politics run amok, importation of 3rd world garbage on large scale with big welfare, the countryside economically left behind, host demographic culture getting treated like 2nd class citizens vs garbage immigrants, stupid taxes? Sound familiar? That's basically California RIGHT NOW and will be the rest of the US in short order unless drastic measures are done soon like federal voter ID laws and martial law to kick out all illegals.

Thank God we at least have Trump holding the line for now. But let this be a warning to everyone in the western world:

I read this is part of a Globalist Agenda to put $10 of tax per liter of gasoline so only upper class / bureaucrats will have cars (like in the USSR).

Thing is would make suburb lifestyle impossible for most (unless they start riding bicycles) and a lot of supermarkets would pass down the shipping costs down to the consumer (so it would be like Arctic Prices: $20 for a gallon of milk).

Funny thing is the protesters are middle aged people. The millennial of France don't seem to be as present in these protests in the clips I've seen (but I guess most of them have the bank of Mommy & Daddy paying for everything).

It's good to have an account from Montrose and I would give him credibility over myself.

However, just to add my own perspective, I live on the far south of Paris and life is going on exactly as normal. Quite a shame to admit but I've never seen a Gilet Jaune, yet No violence, no road blocks, no nothing. Maybe it helps I'm just a walk away from the barracks of the Republican Guards.

What I do see is student protesting and blocking the Sorbonne due to the newly raised tuition fees for international students (which, admittedly I support) but this is every day life in Paris.

I'm not very hopeful nor paranoid. French people love rioting and demonstrating and knowing them they will just get back to eating their baguettes and drinking coffee soon. Well, unless it gets so bad that they can no longer do that but the government will throw some bread and circus tricks, like they did during the World Cup.

Macron just said he will postpone the taxes, let's see if the masse will be appeased and the movement loses momentum.

I've seen enough riots in France (of course nowhere near what Going Strong and Montrose, but I'm a realist) and every time I was hopeful that something will change, the movement gutters out and die because the French being French will just go back about living their life during the most crucial movements.

French government is good at disruptive tactics, they know that if they can just blunt the momentum for even a little bit, movements like this dies out very fast.

Please note that Christmas is approaching and every French wants to be with their family warm full and cozy. If I was Macron I would just throw "free tickets/free gifts for everyone" and problem solved. French are like moody girls, they get angry easily but if you know the trick you can calm them just as easily.

"We demand that Macron opens the door to us. Insurrection is at the doors of France and we do not want deaths to happen this weekend."

“There are ultimately only two possible adjustments in life: one is to suit our lives to principles; the other is to suit principles to our lives. “If we do not live as we think, we soon begin to think as we live.”