My point is you'll need USD or a currency equivalent .... You don't view your self as having lost money in the last week, but in your eventual plan of being long BTC you have, the book value has halved in any real trading terms you've lost money.

The largest part (+80%) of my portfolio was bought at $350 - $600. The price of Bitcoin on this date one year ago was $1017. I bought the bulk of my XRP holdings at 0.06c

My point is you'll need USD or a currency equivalent .... You don't view your self as having lost money in the last week, but in your eventual plan of being long BTC you have, the book value has halved in any real trading terms you've lost money.

The largest part (+80%) of my portfolio was bought at $350 - $600. The price of Bitcoin on this date one year ago was $1017. I bought the bulk of my XRP holdings at 0.06c

Great, you are missing my point, if you sold all of it at $17,000 and bought them back today you'd have made a big profit. You seem to miss that traditional investments have their returns measuresd periodically against a new set price , if you don't do that performance isn't correctly measured.

As I've said to you before if you've a few million in coins sell some and buy real,world stuff with it.

My point is you'll need USD or a currency equivalent .... You don't view your self as having lost money in the last week, but in your eventual plan of being long BTC you have, the book value has halved in any real trading terms you've lost money.

The largest part (+80%) of my portfolio was bought at $350 - $600. The price of Bitcoin on this date one year ago was $1017. I bought the bulk of my XRP holdings at 0.06c

Great, you are missing my point, if you sold all of it at $17,000 and bought them back today you'd have made a big profit. You seem to miss that traditional investments have their returns measuresd periodically against a new set price , if you don't do that performance isn't correctly measured.

As I've said to you before if you've a few million in coins sell some and buy real,world stuff with it.

Roughly in agreement with you on this one insofar as that the value of a currency is only worth what you can buy with it. Of course if the USD tanked and I was able to buy less with the same amount of USD as previously, that would be similar. If I'm long-term bullish on anything, whether it's USD, Bitcoin, houses or even some random collectible, my goal would be to increase my holdings of that asset or asset class.

My point is you'll need USD or a currency equivalent .... You don't view your self as having lost money in the last week, but in your eventual plan of being long BTC you have, the book value has halved in any real trading terms you've lost money.

The largest part (+80%) of my portfolio was bought at $350 - $600. The price of Bitcoin on this date one year ago was $1017. I bought the bulk of my XRP holdings at 0.06c

Great, you are missing my point, if you sold all of it at $17,000 and bought them back today you'd have made a big profit. You seem to miss that traditional investments have their returns measuresd periodically against a new set price , if you don't do that performance isn't correctly measured.

As I've said to you before if you've a few million in coins sell some and buy real,world stuff with it.

I did that before. There isn't really much that I can buy that will make me happier.

My point is you'll need USD or a currency equivalent .... You don't view your self as having lost money in the last week, but in your eventual plan of being long BTC you have, the book value has halved in any real trading terms you've lost money.

The largest part (+80%) of my portfolio was bought at $350 - $600. The price of Bitcoin on this date one year ago was $1017. I bought the bulk of my XRP holdings at 0.06c

Great, you are missing my point, if you sold all of it at $17,000 and bought them back today you'd have made a big profit. You seem to miss that traditional investments have their returns measuresd periodically against a new set price , if you don't do that performance isn't correctly measured.

As I've said to you before if you've a few million in coins sell some and buy real,world stuff with it.

I did that before. There isn't really much that I can buy that will make me happier.

If you've got enough for your lifestyle and old age right now then why not. If you're trading though you need to sell into these dips if you can really see them coming. You will get more points.

My point is you'll need USD or a currency equivalent .... You don't view your self as having lost money in the last week, but in your eventual plan of being long BTC you have, the book value has halved in any real trading terms you've lost money.

The largest part (+80%) of my portfolio was bought at $350 - $600. The price of Bitcoin on this date one year ago was $1017. I bought the bulk of my XRP holdings at 0.06c

Great, you are missing my point, if you sold all of it at $17,000 and bought them back today you'd have made a big profit. You seem to miss that traditional investments have their returns measuresd periodically against a new set price , if you don't do that performance isn't correctly measured.

As I've said to you before if you've a few million in coins sell some and buy real,world stuff with it.

Roughly in agreement with you on this one insofar as that the value of a currency is only worth what you can buy with it. Of course if the USD tanked and I was able to buy less with the same amount of USD as previously, that would be similar. If I'm long-term bullish on anything, whether it's USD, Bitcoin, houses or even some random collectible, my goal would be to increase my holdings of that asset or asset class.

Long term bullish is great but if you're trading with any aim to profit then selling into dips and buying back is standard. Unless you just keep going longer as it falls which makes sense if you believe in an eventual $million Bitcoin.

My point is you'll need USD or a currency equivalent .... You don't view your self as having lost money in the last week, but in your eventual plan of being long BTC you have, the book value has halved in any real trading terms you've lost money.

The largest part (+80%) of my portfolio was bought at $350 - $600. The price of Bitcoin on this date one year ago was $1017. I bought the bulk of my XRP holdings at 0.06c

Great, you are missing my point, if you sold all of it at $17,000 and bought them back today you'd have made a big profit. You seem to miss that traditional investments have their returns measuresd periodically against a new set price , if you don't do that performance isn't correctly measured.

As I've said to you before if you've a few million in coins sell some and buy real,world stuff with it.

Roughly in agreement with you on this one insofar as that the value of a currency is only worth what you can buy with it. Of course if the USD tanked and I was able to buy less with the same amount of USD as previously, that would be similar. If I'm long-term bullish on anything, whether it's USD, Bitcoin, houses or even some random collectible, my goal would be to increase my holdings of that asset or asset class.

Long term bullish is great but if you're trading with any aim to profit then selling into dips and buying back is standard. Unless you just keep going longer as it falls which makes sense if you believe in an eventual $million Bitcoin.

The talk on here is very reminiscent of the chartists. They pretend real world events do not matter. Real world events like individual countries cracking down on coins / exchanges, the tax man getting real interested in breaking peoples balls, hundreds of millions being robbed online etc. No, let's look at a nice graph guys, ignore the real world, look I made that line red and that arrow I added is pointing up

The talk on here is very reminiscent of the chartists. They pretend real world events do not matter. Real world events like individual countries cracking down on coins / exchanges, the tax man getting real interested in breaking peoples balls, hundreds of millions being robbed online etc. No, let's look at a nice graph guys, ignore the real world, look I made that line red and that arrow I added is pointing up

Really? Who is claiming real world events don’t matter or effect the market? Where were these statements posted on this thread? You come to that conclusion because I posted a chart. What exactly are you trying to contribute?

The chairman of the U.S. Commodity Futures Trading Commission (CFTC) has spoken of the need for balance and a "do no harm" approach when regulating cryptocurrencies.

In a written testimony presented to the Senate Banking Committee today, J. Christopher Giancarlo said that in this "new digital era" for the financial markets, cryptocurrencies have brought "paradigm shift" in how the world views payments and financial processes, and that ignoring such innovation "will not make them go away, nor is it a responsible regulatory response."

Giancarlo continued:

"'Do no harm' was unquestionably the right approach to development of the Internet. Similarly, I believe that 'do no harm' is the right overarching approach for distributed ledger technology. ... With the proper balance of sound policy, regulatory oversight and private sector innovation, new technologies will allow American markets to evolve in responsible ways and continue to grow our economy and increase prosperity."

That's not to say the CFTC will sit back and do nothing, however. The commission chair spelled out how his agency has previously taken civil enforcement actions against several "virtual currency Ponzi schemes," including My Big Coin Pay Inc, The Entrepreneurs Headquarters Limited and Coin Drop Markets.

These actions confirm, he said, that the CFTC, in conjunction with the SEC and other financial enforcement agencies, will protect investors and "aggressively prosecute" cryptocurrency schemes that engage in fraud and manipulation.

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 amPosts: 10874Location: Best country in the world.

sewa wrote:

The talk on here is very reminiscent of the chartists. They pretend real world events do not matter. Real world events like individual countries cracking down on coins / exchanges, the tax man getting real interested in breaking peoples balls, hundreds of millions being robbed online etc. No, let's look at a nice graph guys, ignore the real world, look I made that line red and that arrow I added is pointing up

Why do you insist in commenting on areas that you are obviously clueless about. You come across rather silly. What perimeters, for example , would you think that algorithm traders might programme into their systems without looking at moving averages or support and resistance levels. Relative strength indicators and Stochastic indicators. All these signals help give a Fundamental trader an insight into projected price patterns and trends and only a fool ignores them.

Can't be sure but 6200 looks like serious support. Bear in mind that it will only go down to the level of the early adopters and hodlers buy in. A lot of us are here for the tech.

You don't have to buy Bitcoin to have access to the tech.

In order for the BTC blockchain to work, somebody has to pay for the decentralised mining.

But plenty O block chain isn't BTC .....

I presume you mean you don't have to use specifically Bitcoin Blockchain. No, you're not forced too. But you have to pay gas (ether) to run smart contracts on the Ethereum Blockchain which is awarded to the miner.

Can't be sure but 6200 looks like serious support. Bear in mind that it will only go down to the level of the early adopters and hodlers buy in. A lot of us are here for the tech.

You don't have to buy Bitcoin to have access to the tech.

In order for the BTC blockchain to work, somebody has to pay for the decentralised mining.

But plenty O block chain isn't BTC .....

I presume you mean you don't have to use specifically Bitcoin Blockchain. No, you're not forced too. But you have to pay gas (ether) to run smart contracts on the Ethereum Blockchain which is awarded to the miner.

I presume you mean you don't have to use specifically Bitcoin Blockchain. No, you're not forced too. But you have to pay gas (ether) to run smart contracts on the Ethereum Blockchain which is awarded to the miner.

How much per contract do you think it will cost ?

Other chains can run smart contracts can't they (typing "smart" made me cringe) , it's just a bloody contract.

The other issue is we are back to circular dilemma ; if the contract is uber successful then a lower coin price has to be demanded for the success to continue or the stuff will be taken to a private chain.

Correct although they seem to think it will run on the goodwill of people. i.e donations etc

No need for donations unless you consider someone running a node to be a donation. Most nodes would be expected to be run by businesses, although at the moment they are mostly run by Nano holders/enthusiasts.

I presume you mean you don't have to use specifically Bitcoin Blockchain. No, you're not forced too. But you have to pay gas (ether) to run smart contracts on the Ethereum Blockchain which is awarded to the miner.

How much per contract do you think it will cost ?

Other chains can run smart contracts can't they (typing "smart" made me cringe) , it's just a bloody contract.

The other issue is we are back to circular dilemma ; if the contract is uber successful then a lower coin price has to be demanded for the success to continue or the stuff will be taken to a private chain.

It varies depending on processing power required. They're called smart contracts because they don't need human intervention once deployed. The contract itself can do things like get weather data or teh result of a horse race etc and action on this data.

I presume you mean you don't have to use specifically Bitcoin Blockchain. No, you're not forced too. But you have to pay gas (ether) to run smart contracts on the Ethereum Blockchain which is awarded to the miner.

How much per contract do you think it will cost ?

Other chains can run smart contracts can't they (typing "smart" made me cringe) , it's just a bloody contract.

The other issue is we are back to circular dilemma ; if the contract is uber successful then a lower coin price has to be demanded for the success to continue or the stuff will be taken to a private chain.

It varies depending on processing power required. They're called smart contracts because they don't need human intervention once deployed. The contract itself can do things like get weather data or teh result of a horse race etc and action on this data.

My point is it cannot rest again in the market price of a coin. Do you sort of agree that the cost has to be commensurate to the benefit.

I understand it can take variables in an automated fashion. However it makes me cringe.

Other chains can run smart contracts can't they (typing "smart" made me cringe) , it's just a bloody contract.

The other issue is we are back to circular dilemma ; if the contract is uber successful then a lower coin price has to be demanded for the success to continue or the stuff will be taken to a private chain.

It varies depending on processing power required. They're called smart contracts because they don't need human intervention once deployed. The contract itself can do things like get weather data or teh result of a horse race etc and action on this data.

My point is it cannot rest again in the market price of a coin. Do you sort of agree that the cost has to be commensurate to the benefit.

I understand it can take variables in an automated fashion. However it makes me cringe.

There are many failings in cryptocurrencies including ETH but the potential has been identified and further iterations should iron out problems.

Yup these chartist types will be looking for support levels right until the day a company goes bankrupt. Some of them just do it do they can offload their position, some are genuinely deluded. For others it's just a part of the job