Private charities for starters. Private charities with STANDARDS. Stop making it beneficial for unwed mothers to have MORE children. Make it beneficial to live in a nuclear family. Not necessarily married, or even straight.... But a mother and a father figure. I know a lot of single mothers and it is HARD. Raising my daughter I see how important the different things my wife and I bring to the table are. That also makes me realise just how tough it is for single moms. SO please do not think I am sour on single parent homes. I just hope for dual parent homes as much as possible. It matters.

I know private charities work better than anything government could ever do. I KNOW it. I see it. We (my evil, profit making company) donates our valuable time, resources and material to several awesome private charities. One of them being an abused womens shelter. But, they have STANDARDS. If they burn a drug test, they are OUT. The kids go to a pre-screened, PRIVATELY funded foster family and the parent who broke the rules is on their own.

Harsh? Perhaps. Fair? You bet.

HARD time limits on public welfare. Make public welfare recipients WORK for it. I am tired of driving by the public housing units in my town and seeing 22inch wheels on the Mercedes, being driven by people witih cigarettes and beer.

I'm not getting into this discussion, but did have a question about this one phrase.

Do you mean Nursing Home? When I think of retirement home, I think of the many retirement communities around here, full of vibrant, active people. I don't look at them as places to avoid.

Nursing homes, on the other hand, can be good or bad. My mom was in one in Rhode Island before she died, and it was a great place. But I have seen the other kind.

Correct. I have seen some AWFUL places. Plus, I promised my parents that I would take care of them. They did sacrifice a lot to help get me where I am.

I am sure there are good retirement facilities. My parents asked to not ever be placed in one and I have already secured, as best as possible these days, that they never will be. My Dad suffers from non-Hodgkins Lymphoma as a result of Agent Orange exposure in Vietnam.... And my Mom puts up with him. So, its the least I can do for them.

The retirement places around here - the residents are not placed in them - they choose to live there.

For instance, my cousin, Alan, lives in Colorado. He and his wife recently moved into a retirement community where there are varying degrees of care available. Currently, they live independently, but his wife is in the early stages of Alzheimers, and, at some point, will need more care than Alan can handle alone - he is almost 84.

Don't worry Fraulein Von Bonny, the rich will provide you with bread crusts and water, and other necessities for your old age.
Auf Wiedersehen,
Wombatz Von Adolph.

Rich? YOu think we are RICH?

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA that's funny

I suppose we are rich... just not in the way you think we are. We don't have a large home... we are currently busting out of the humble house we currently have. but it's our home and we love it (even with all the stuff that seems to be breaking lately). We don't have unlimited funds to do whatever we please. But we have love and family and laughter. We are rich in life but not in the bank. We live comfortably... and sometimes we struggle between paychecks.

To think that we are "rich snobs who don't want to help anyone" because we don't support government programs that don't actually HELP anyone get back on their feet is laughable at best.

I actually think welfare and such programs have ruined the sense of community and reaching out to them for help. there was a time where everyone knew their neighbors and if a neighbor or friend was in need people would step up and help in any way they could. Now it seems most people don't even KNOW their neighbors and if someone needs help... well isn't that what welfare is for? they are taking such a large chunk from people by force that it seems to be starting the trend of "well it's not MY problem... the government will deal with it" and that is a sad state of affairs.

The retirement places around here - the residents are not placed in them - they choose to live there.

For instance, my cousin, Alan, lives in Colorado. He and his wife recently moved into a retirement community where there are varying degrees of care available. Currently, they live independently, but his wife is in the early stages of Alzheimers, and, at some point, will need more care than Alan can handle alone - he is almost 84.

That's the kind of retirement community I'm thinking of.

If the people choose to live in one, by all means, make it so. My parents have made their choices clear. That is not to disparage (correct word useage Mom? LOL <inside joke>) people who choose to live in one.

More or less, I want my Mom and Dad around us, physically close that is, for as long as is possible, and they agree. Hannah LOVES them both. We are staying with them for the week as we visit. Mom and Dad both went to work this morning after being around for the weekend. Hannah and I came out around 7:30. Hannah RUNS out.... Only to droop her shoulders, look at me and say, "wher'd evweebody go?" I want my Mom and Dad to have as many opportunites like that as possible.

The retirement places around here - the residents are not placed in them - they choose to live there.

For instance, my cousin, Alan, lives in Colorado. He and his wife recently moved into a retirement community where there are varying degrees of care available. Currently, they live independently, but his wife is in the early stages of Alzheimers, and, at some point, will need more care than Alan can handle alone - he is almost 84.

That's the kind of retirement community I'm thinking of.

yeah I think it goes both ways. My great grandmother could not WAIT to live in the assisted living facility lol. she was in the "independant living" section. they only came to her if she needed them otherwise she was on her own and she thought that was the greatest thing ever. "If I don't want to cook... I don't have to. isn't that amazing?" LOL

then there are those who don't get to choose for themselves and are just "dumped" there by their family members. but to me that is a nursing home and not a retirement home as you stated earlier.

If the people choose to live in one, by all means, make it so. My parents have made their choices clear. That is not to disparage (correct word useage Mom? LOL <inside joke>) people who choose to live in one.

More or less, I want my Mom and Dad around us, physically close that is, for as long as is possible, and they agree. Hannah LOVES them both. We are staying with them for the week as we visit. Mom and Dad both went to work this morning after being around for the weekend. Hannah and I came out around 7:30. Hannah RUNS out.... Only to droop her shoulders, look at me and say, "wher'd evweebody go?" I want my Mom and Dad to have as many opportunites like that as possible.

Your parents could live in the same town as you do - if this is the type of place they would like, and if they would want to move North and deal with snow and ice Heck, I'm older than your parents, still living in our paid-for, no mortgage house, dealing with cold and ice and snow. My choice

Originally Posted by sparks19

yeah I think it goes both ways. My great grandmother could not WAIT to live in the assisted living facility lol. she was in the "independant living" section. they only came to her if she needed them otherwise she was on her own and she thought that was the greatest thing ever. "If I don't want to cook... I don't have to. isn't that amazing?" LOL

then there are those who don't get to choose for themselves and are just "dumped" there by their family members. but to me that is a nursing home and not a retirement home as you stated earlier.

You got it exactly right on, Tanya. Your great grandmother did what she wanted and when she wanted

Your parents could live in the same town as you do - if this is the type of place they would like, and if they would want to move North and deal with snow and ice Heck, I'm older than your parents, still living in our paid-for, no mortgage house, dealing with cold and ice and snow. My choice

That is my Moms plan. Chances are she will live longer than Dad.

But yes... YOUR CHOICE. The debate should end there.

You got it exactly right on, Tanya. Your great grandmother did what she wanted and when she wanted

Please allow me to STRESS that a retirement community is NOT a bad thing.... So long as the resident chooses to be there. Clearly, per Grace's posts, it is (or can be) a wonderful exeperience.

You got it exactly right on, Tanya. Your great grandmother did what she wanted and when she wanted

Yeah luckily my grandmother has it the same way. what she wants and when she wants... although if you even TRIED to convince her otherwise you would PAY lol.

She is almost 90 years old and just lost her husband (my grandfather at 94 years old) the other day. She is planning to still live on her own... no retirement facility and even though all her children have offered her a place to stay with them she doesn't want it. she is independant... always has been... and wants to stay that way.

it's wonderful that she has the choice. I told my parents that our home is open if they WANT it in their old age.

if it's their choice then so be it whatever the decision.

I remember visiting great grandma in her assited living facility (I was just a kid then) and thought it was great fun to go and play Crocus (LOL that's what I called it but it was actually crokinole lol) in the community room. They aren't all bad but the ones taht are bad are REALLY bad

I suppose we are rich... just not in the way you think we are. We don't have a large home... we are currently busting out of the humble house we currently have. but it's our home and we love it (even with all the stuff that seems to be breaking lately). We don't have unlimited funds to do whatever we please. But we have love and family and laughter. We are rich in life but not in the bank. We live comfortably... and sometimes we struggle between paychecks.

To think that we are "rich snobs who don't want to help anyone" because we don't support government programs that don't actually HELP anyone get back on their feet is laughable at best.

I actually think welfare and such programs have ruined the sense of community and reaching out to them for help. there was a time where everyone knew their neighbors and if a neighbor or friend was in need people would step up and help in any way they could. Now it seems most people don't even KNOW their neighbors and if someone needs help... well isn't that what welfare is for? they are taking such a large chunk from people by force that it seems to be starting the trend of "well it's not MY problem... the government will deal with it" and that is a sad state of affairs.

Private charities for starters. Private charities with STANDARDS. Stop making it beneficial for unwed mothers to have MORE children. Make it beneficial to live in a nuclear family. Not necessarily married, or even straight.... But a mother and a father figure. I know a lot of single mothers and it is HARD. Raising my daughter I see how important the different things my wife and I bring to the table are. That also makes me realise just how tough it is for single moms. SO please do not think I am sour on single parent homes. I just hope for dual parent homes as much as possible. It matters.

I know private charities work better than anything government could ever do. I KNOW it. I see it. We (my evil, profit making company) donates our valuable time, resources and material to several awesome private charities. One of them being an abused womens shelter. But, they have STANDARDS. If they burn a drug test, they are OUT. The kids go to a pre-screened, PRIVATELY funded foster family and the parent who broke the rules is on their own.

Harsh? Perhaps. Fair? You bet.

HARD time limits on public welfare. Make public welfare recipients WORK for it. I am tired of driving by the public housing units in my town and seeing 22inch wheels on the Mercedes, being driven by people witih cigarettes and beer.

I can add more, but it's time for the nightly Scrabble game. LOL

G'Night.

Charities huh ????
So you think charities are going to feed and support the unemployed ??? The sick ?? The infirm ?? The unmarried mothers ?? The multitudes that arrive daily in your country seeking political asylum and who can't speak a word of English ???
You don't think the govt should feed them ??? Try it !!! And then see how safe you and your family will be.
The BIGGEST problem is the ever widening gap between the rich and the poor. Your BIGGEST HOPE should be to support a system that looks after you and people who can't look after themselves, because if that system breaks down, your Mein Kampf book will begin to look like a book of nursery rhymes.

Hey, I don't like the system either. But I'll always support it. Because in this day and age, it's the only system that CAN work.
Forget pure capitalism, that don't work no more. Forget pure socialism, cos that don't work either. So what the remedy is, is a mixture of those two doctrines.
The system you advocate, doesn't work. It would never work. Especially in this day and age.

Charities huh ????
So you think charities are going to feed and support the unemployed ??? The sick ?? The infirm ?? The unmarried mothers ?? The multitudes that arrive daily in your country seeking political asylum and who can't speak a word of English ???
You don't think the govt should feed them ??? Try it !!! And then see how safe you and your family will be.
The BIGGEST problem is the ever widening gap between the rich and the poor. Your BIGGEST HOPE should be to support a system that looks after you and people who can't look after themselves, because if that system breaks down, your Mein Kampf book will begin to look like a book of nursery rhymes.

I do not support just shutting off the switch in one day. It took generations to create this mess, it will take at least one to turn it around. And by 'switch' I mean public welfare. There is a place for public welfare I suppose, but it needs to be a scale WAY, WAY smaller than it is now.

<Here is the part where I really piss some people off.>

Taking public support needs to be HARDER. Public support needs to suck so bad that the people will do anything to get off of it. I hear stories all the time of people being offered jobs, but refuse to take them because their unemployment compensation is 'easier'. The support system needs to be something that is rare, awful and most of all TEMPORARY. NOT a generational thing....

I know it sounds mean. Its harsh. BUT, it is the BEST thing for them. The goal of public support systems should be getting people back to self sufficency as soon as possible. That is not the way it works..... Because those people on the dole, still get to vote themselves more.

Hey, I don't like the system either. But I'll always support it. Because in this day and age, it's the only system that CAN work.
Forget pure capitalism, that don't work no more. Forget pure socialism, cos that don't work either. So what the remedy is, is a mixture of those two doctrines.
The system you advocate, doesn't work. It would never work. Especially in this day and age.

Well my friend... What you are talking about is not working either. Look at Europe. Look at the US. ( I am sure Oz is just ducky. LOL ) We are BROKE. SOMETHING has to give or we are ALL screwed.

---

What IS poverty anyway? I ask because you mentioned the gap between rich and poor. I think the West defines poverty poorly. How can you be poor AND fat? Poor and 2 cars? Poor and a fridge full of beer? Poor and have 22's on your BMW? Poor and 3 cartons of smokes? Are there truly poor people in ther West? Of course. But there are way more on the system who DON'T need it. BUT, because they get to vote for more.....

I've served in some crappy places and seen what poverty really is.

---

Whatever the answer is.... It HAS to hurt. HAS to. We lived the lie of the Credit Card for way too long. It sucks. I don't like saying this. But, I want my child(ren) to have at least the same chance as me to live the kind of life we live right now. And if my dollar is worthless.....

---

Thank you for the honest reply, BTW. This is a much better way to talk. I'm sorry for the Adolph thing... You seemed to use FEAR (a threat) as the method of getting what you wanted. That is how I made the comparision. I am sorry for that.