"We, the people, declare today that the most evident of truths — that all of us are created equal — is the star that guides us still; just as it guided our forebears through Seneca Falls, and Selma, and Stonewall ... Our journey is not complete until our gay brothers and sisters are treated like anyone else under the law — for if we are truly created equal, then surely the love we commit to one another must be equal as well."

Today Obama placed an original place for the battle for gay civil rights, Stonewall along side the same original battleground's for women's rights(Seneca Falls) and African-American rights(Selma).

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"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father ... And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

"If the people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." - Thomas Jefferson

It has nothing to do with opposing anything. I don't oppose gays or anything happening behind close doors, I don't think it should be of concern to the govt.
I do oppose special legislation benefiting any new groups, whatever they may be, for something that shouldn't be of the govt concern.

uhhh 40 years ago the "Blacks" were a new group wanting the same benefits as other citizens. 80 years ago women were the new group wanting the same benefits as other citizens.

Why doesn't bringing back the term Civil Unions back and giving them the same rights as being married solve it all? Gives them what they want and gives Christians their terminology.

It probably sounds a lot like "separate but equal" to them. I think it's a stupid idea because we already have marriage laws, and I don't think our government should be in the business of coddling religious bigots.

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"As I walked out the door toward the gate that would lead to my freedom, I knew if I didn't leave my bitterness and hatred behind I'd still be in prison."

It probably sounds a lot like "separate but equal" to them. I think it's a stupid idea because we already have marriage laws, and I don't think our government should be in the business of coddling religious bigots.

It's all splitting hairs and each group thinks they are more right than the other. And our Govenrment coddles enough groups now, what's one more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Why don't we just give you a term and force you to be happy with that term?

They are not 2nd class citizens just because they are gay. They deserve every single benefit than heterosexual couples and individuals are granted.

This country will look back on this period with shame. The same way we look back on denying women and blacks equal rights. The future will not understand or be forgiving on how stupid we were.

If it accomplishes the result they are after I don't see the issue. Again I don't give two shits, they can legalize it and I couldn't care less. However, marriage is deeply rooted in religion (not just Christianity) and to most religious people that religious aspect is the sticking point.

It has nothing to do with treating someone as second class citizens, it's just terminology. I understand the fight, but I think this would be a good compromise considering the circumstances. Religious freedoms are part of what this country was founded on and I don't see where forcing religious believers to accept Gay Marriage is totally right either. If you could somehow remove the religious connotation I can see your point, but religion is deeply rooted in the traditional marriage.

Ultimately it's pretty stupid to have a fight over terminology and I realize I'm over simplifying it, but that's what it amounts to to me.

It's all splitting hairs and each group thinks they are more right than the other. And our Govenrment coddles enough groups now, what's one more.

If it accomplishes the result they are after I don't see the issue. Again I don't give two shits, they can legalize it and I couldn't care less. However, marriage is deeply rooted in religion (not just Christianity) and to most religious people that religious aspect is the sticking point.

It has nothing to do with treating someone as second class citizens, it's just terminology. I understand the fight, but I think this would be a good compromise considering the circumstances. Religious freedoms are part of what this country was founded on and I don't see where forcing religious believers to accept Gay Marriage is totally right either. If you could somehow remove the religious connotation I can see your point, but religion is deeply rooted in the traditional marriage.

Ultimately it's pretty stupid to have a fight over terminology and I realize I'm over simplifying it, but that's what it amounts to to me.

See, that's the sticking point to me. If you are one of those people who don't approve of gay marriage...no one is forcing you to get gay married.

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"As I walked out the door toward the gate that would lead to my freedom, I knew if I didn't leave my bitterness and hatred behind I'd still be in prison."

I agree, but I'm just pointing out that that is how some people feel as in regards to their religious freedom.

Sure. I think a lot of religious people want the laws of the land to reflect their belief system. Unfortunately Christians in this nation really have been coddled. Led to believe that their belief system is the only one that is morally correct, pandered to by politicians, even receiving dogma as education in public schools. That's how you end up with someone like Killer Clown just flat out refusing to believe the Constitution of the United States.

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"As I walked out the door toward the gate that would lead to my freedom, I knew if I didn't leave my bitterness and hatred behind I'd still be in prison."