Greedy Goblin

Sunday, November 1, 2015

Weekend minipost: Dscan

First thing first, the jump beacon of the Goon capital is still in use. Use it!

Mining mission ventures are good for lot of things. For example doing mining missions. They can also be arranged in a line and Dscanned:

I can tell from my record high insult comments to delete that Goons are maaad. If you want to know the quality of the comments, here is a fine piece from reddit. The suicidegate is something they want to forget and bury, because they don't consider themselves bad people IRL and it conflicts with the fact that they are playing with a horrible person and by watching ads on his site and click his PLEX link they literally pay his bills. They want me to stop reminding them of that.

So if you want to troll them, name your ship "Since my divorce"! Anchor some cans if you are in Goon space! Remind them in local that he did not slip while drunk, he prepared powerpoint slides for the abuse! Quote his immortal words in local while AFK cloaking, camping, scouting! Make them maaad like Lucas Kell!

By the way I've found something more sickening: an official slide in the stream:

Yep, you can read the suicidal-guy-abuse in full, prepared, accepted and processed by CCP. I thought the blue slide was simply his own coming from his own laptop or something. Don't forget to link this slide in local to any Imperium member you meet! The disgusting slide can be seen on the video too.

By the way the old devblog about the issue said: "CCP requested that all panel PowerPoint presentations and discussion topics be handed in beforehand for approval. Regrettably, the offending comments were made during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentations."

26 comments:

"Regrettably, the offending comments were made during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentations."

I rate this as true. As I remember, CCP Xhagen had ended the questions and was closing up shop, but the one guy in line kept egging The Mittani on, and The Mittani proceeded to shove his foot into his mouth and deep down his throat.

So you are going to continue to use CCP's support for the Broadcast 4 Reps effort as a way to kick The Mittani out of EVE Online? Well, you're a grown man. It's your choice. If you wish to join the ranks of the M&S, that's your decision.

There is no doubt that the "Find him" part was after "closing up shop".I meant that the contents of the slide are highly offensive themselves. A clearly disturbed, likely suicidal person begged for mercy to his gankers, offered to obey their demands "never enter your space again" and The Mittani read this up for public humiliation with CCP approval.

I think that if I was that guy and my life was still shit then I wouldn't want people flying around with ships named after my quotes about being suicidal.

I mean, if The Mittani asked the Goons to name their ships with these quotes then that'd be pretty shit of him, wouldn't it? And you'd rightly call him out on it, just as you've rightly been calling out his comment at fanfest.

It's probably not going to be a problem but why not err on the side of caution/decency and pick a different way of making your point about the Mittani?

However, as NoizyGamer pointed out in your post a day or two ago, every CCP employee that was in a leadership position when that slide was approved and presented is gone.

There is a concept of justice called "Double Jeopardy", that forbids a defendant from being tried again on the same (or similar) charges following a legitimate acquittal or conviction. You are demanding that CCP do just this.

You can argue quite reasonably and successfully that TheMittani should have been punished much more severely then he was. However, he WAS punished. The people involved in approving his slide, the presentation, reviewing his behavior, and deciding the consequences have all left the building.

What do you expect to happen? What do you WANT to happen?

If CCP goes back and re-punishes TheMittani for things that he did 3 years ago, it opens a huge can of worms. CCP already penalized a player both in-game (30-day ban) and out-of-game (removal/resignation from CSM). To go back and hit that player again, 3 years later, for no additional infraction might leave CCP open to a possible lawsuit (harassment of a player).

If CCP went back and re-punished TheMittani succcessfully, without a player revolt, the precedent would mean that any account that has ever had administrative action taken against it could penalized again at any time, even if the account has not committed any additional violations. That's simply not fair.

@Banedon: The new people in CCP should prove themselves different from the old ones. After a regime change clients of the old regime are held accountable for their crimes which were not punished by the old, evil regime.

Sorry chum, but your logic is complete garbage. Even forgetting american corporations post citizens-united (that reference has no real relevance here), countries across the planet recognize companies as entities that can be held accountable. Hence why corps are sued. (as well as individuals in rare occasions.)

So to suggest double jeopardy and dumping this on ex-employees is total bullshit, and an judge will tell you so. CCP never finished the job they started years ago. The psychopath from wisconsin should be banned from the game. Now, given that he supposedly never logs into the game, going after his alliance now becomes fair game.

@Gevlon. You have made some valid points over last few days. But using the same comments from that vulnerable person to advance your point neither helps that person nor puts you on the moral high ground.

> After a regime change clients of the old regime are held accountable for their crimes which were not punished by the old, evil regime.

Ahhh a good old regime change witch hunt. Nobody has ever been caught up in these unfairly or unjustly now have they?

The Mittani was punished - perhaps not in the manner that you wanted, but punished all the same. It's like the person who is found guilty of a crime and given what some might consider a light sentence. Yes you can be mad and ask for change to the system to prevent it happen again but you cannot *retroactively* apply new penalties to somebody who was investigated, charged, found guilty and punished under the existing rules.

In other words, he's done his crime and done his time. Case closed. There is precisely zero point in going after this any further whether you agree with the punishment or not. Because he cannot be retroactively permabanned for doing it.

And you know this to be true, you have to if you are to be counted amongst the intelligent. Therefore the only possible conclusion that can be drawn is that you are attempting to bring up something which was dealt with years ago for some sort of in game political gain. It's weak and transparent.

this one was probably made by a goon crowd handling person,and since it wasn't going their way they deleted the reddit account which posted it so it cannot receive ratings and it will quickly go down the new topic list ( effectively the only way to find it is if you have it bookmarked )

if you make the post it will be able to get rated and probably end up on first page,so CCP will have a harder time ignoring it

@First Anon: what is applicable at law and in private is different. You can be fired from a job if they find an old recording of you spewing racist hate or your wife can file divorce. The CURRENT question is: do we want to share or hobby space with this person? Does a decent company want this person to be one of his emblematic community leaders?

@Last anon: I have no reddit account, and I'm hated enough on reddit that I'd be downvoted for announcing that I gave all my Eartly belongings to the Red Cross and moved to a monastery as a penitence over my horrid sins against the rules of goodposting. You on the other hand can make one about the slide post of mine. Or even better, a post with no link to me but to an imgur.com picture of the slide.

"By the way the old devblog about the issue said: "CCP requested that all panel PowerPoint presentations and discussion topics be handed in beforehand for approval. Regrettably, the offending comments were made during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentations."

Totally."

Do you have proof of your claim that CCP approved it?

"I have no reddit account, and I'm hated enough on reddit that I'd be downvoted for announcing that I gave all my Eartly belongings to the Red Cross and moved to a monastery as a penitence over my horrid sins against the rules of goodposting. You on the other hand can make one about the slide post of mine. Or even better, a post with no link to me but to an imgur.com picture of the slide."

If only you could make some sort of anonymous post on reddit....it is not as if you are compelled to use Gevlon.

"The CURRENT question is: do we want to share or hobby space with this person? Does a decent company want this person to be one of his emblematic community leaders?"

No...YOUR current question is "How can I obtain some sort of win against Goons"...Because, you know that you have the option,if a corporation does something you dont like (like Chick-Fil-A did for example), to take your custom and money elsewhere...but, that is not your aim. Your aim is to be able to crow that you defeated the ebil mittani.

I note that not once in your posts have you said "CCP, if you do not do this, me and my supporters will take our money elsewhere".

Why not? If you are that angry about CCP...why are you still patronising them?If it is not just about Mittens and your hatred of goons, what will you do if CCP ignore your megaphone?

"I meant that the contents of the slide are highly offensive themselves. A clearly disturbed, likely suicidal person begged for mercy to his gankers, offered to obey their demands "never enter your space again" and The Mittani read this up for public humiliation with CCP approval."So why are CODE not all banned? That's a daily occurrence on their blog, and they name the players every time.

Sure, but the backlash from re-visiting the punishment years after the fact would be immense. It is completely unreasonable to think that this should be done, or that it is remotely fair. You can be mad at the original punishment, you cannot call for it to be retroactively increased nor can you declare that CCP should distance itself from a media outlet because it's owner happened to once-be-banned.

Mittans is *good for CCP's bottom line*. He commands a very large in game group and runs a credible gaming journalism outlet.

> You can be fired from a job if they find an old recording of you spewing racist hate or your wife can file divorce.

Not sure what that has to do with anything. You can't be told to take a leave of absence from work as punishment, be allowed to return for 3 full years and then be sacked for the same instance of the same offence - no country on earth's labour laws would let that slide.

> The CURRENT question is: do we want to share or hobby space with this person?

Hobby space is big. You don't _actually_ share the space with Mittans. Aside from a once a year party he's never in Jita. And his friends dearly _do_ want to share space with him. So do his enemies because fighting goons is fun.

> Does a decent company want this person to be one of his emblematic community leaders?

Absolutely. He embodies the very core values of eve online. The man who became the commander of the most powerful force the game has ever seen through backroom dealing, scamming, scheming, spying and metagaming. A large number of Eve's foundational stories are curtesy of Mitten's shenanigans. CCP love his guts. Of course they want him to be seen as a community leader. He's good for business.

The point you will not admit is that you are trying to score political points by claiming the high ground through manufactured outrage. You are doing this because you want to hurt Goons. You want to hurt Goons because Condi wouldn't accept you into their ranks... and it makes you mad because you feel that you are entitled to do so. Nothing about your actions are the mark of a rational man. They are the mark of a small, petty person.

For those who think that everyone saying Gevlon is wrong is a Goon spai...consider that this is the Gevlon who believes everyone on welfare is there because they are too stupid/lazy to get work, and that if we removed it, then people would get off of their ass and start being contributing members of society.

That is the same Gevlon who is now riding into battle on behalf of people with serious mental health conditions.

"A real life welfare recipient is fully aware that he isn’t doing anything but he still feel entitled for various things from the society. If he doesn’t get “enough” he goes and steal them. The point isn’t that they are leeches, the point is that they don’t find it a problem or a source of shame."

This is the gevlon who has now appointed himself the righteous defender of mental health issues in Eve. I assume he believes all people with serious mental health issues are in full time, gainful employment.

This is why I am disgusted by his current actions, and believe (along with many others) that he is doing this purely out of a wish to score points and as another moving of the goalposts so he can claim that he has defeated Goons.

"CODE doesn't have the same power in EVE as The Mittani. Also, great many of them are already banned, the rest will follow"Of course they do. They've evidenced this time and again. Why is it though that you are so adamant Mittani should be banned, yet CODE harass people every single day and you have no agenda for that?

13:02 Anon: CCP, if you do not do this, me and my supporters will take our money elsewherethis is assuming that Gevlon pays Sub. In which case I remind you where you are and whom you write this to. from his pov eve is a f2p.

17:24 Gevlon ..They can be cured, often literally by a pill a day.And still they are the minority of the working population not worth your time and effort. Yes they might be not M&S in which case they have a brain and use it to seek help and cure their state of mental illness. To be right back at their peak workforce.

Taking a pill every day isn't a cure for mental illness, it's literally taking a pill every day to numb the effects of mental illness. As we've seen over the past couple of decades this isn't a solution and people often end up worse off both mentally and financially.

Going back a couple of posts where you mentioned how this worked for Ripard. I'm going to remind you that yes, Ripard did do this exact thing (for a current issue, not one years gone) and it did work for him, however it also had another effect: It destroyed his reputation and his credibility after it came to light that he didn't care about the victims of noted acts (he actually admitted this so feel free to look it up), he only cared about seeing someone he personally didn't like in the game being removed from the game. The end result of this is he stopped blogging and he stopped playing a couple of months later due to the backlash.

Even stupid people don't like being manipulated and given that this has happened before (albeit by someone with far more influence and reach than yourself) I sincerely doubt that you're going to be able to drum up the support required to take down a person that you admittedly have a real life agenda against. Ripard was able to create a hundred page mega thread on the forums whereas you've managed zero mentions. A couple of things appeared on reddit but those are buried deep in the cesspit of whatever reddit is supposed to even be.

I've not read all the comments so someone might've already said what I'm about to say.

Over the years of reading this blog I've gotten to know you as someone who doesn't particularly care much for strangers. Less than average Joe at least.Now if this is truly your personality is something only you know but that's the impression I and most people probably get from your posts.Of course this doesn't mean you're a bad person. I usually agree with you on your views of making isk or your posts about stuff in real life.

That said, I think you've missed the point with the posts about mittens at fanfest.I don't believe you care a lot about the person he was talking about and you probably think he should've just hardened the fuck up and learned to deal with gankers.The only reason for you bringing this up right now is because you'd like to see mittens banned, completely disregarding the fact that the person who wrote the text on that slide might still be playing the game. If I wrote something like that I'd like to think I would've moved on and would hate to see this all brought up again 3 years later.

I agree with you that what mittens said at fanfest was a horrible thing to say.And if he had thought a second before saying it he wouldn't have said it.CCP could've flat out perma banned him and that would've been fine. But they decided differently.What it comes down to now is you, in your blind hate, suggesting people link a slide with text from someone at his lowest point in his life to people who probably don't care a whole lot about it.It's like taking someone who was bullied in school and turning them into the poster-boy for an anti-bullying campaign without asking them about it.It's been 3 years, people like to move on and forget about horrible things that happened to them in the past.

If you decide not to approve this comment I hope you at least take a moment and think if you shouldn't just let this one go.You're likely not going to change anything and you're only bringing this up because mittens said it and you don't agree with the steps ccp took.