Yes, I had read the English translation of the speech, of course Mary must have been delighted at Frederik's words,
I was just speculating that, if Frederik's is a case of fear of public speaking, maybe she had shared his axiety in the previous days or his uncertainties about what to say etc, and weeing that in that partciular occasion everyhing turned out perfectly well maybe it was an extra factor which prompted her to go and kiss him

Yes, I had read the English translation of the speech, of course Mary must have been delighted at Frederik's words,
I was just speculating that, if Frederik's is a case of fear of public speaking, maybe she had shared his axiety in the previous days or his uncertainties about what to say etc, and weeing that in that partciular occasion everyhing turned out perfectly well maybe it was an extra factor which prompted her to go and kiss him

I was getting the impression that all was lost, until I read a couple of posts that made me think that perhaps Frederik might survive.

I think Frederik has many qualties that imo means he will be a good and respected King, his connection with the people be they young or not so young, he cares and is not afraid to show it. He also has a warm heart according to his mother, and is a wonderful family man by what we can see.
We have just been through a major flood and are still dealing with the crisis in many different and difficult ways, it was noted by all and I can say without a shadow of a doubt, it was not the best dressed or the best speaker that helped us deal with this at the major point of the crisis, it was the person that showed caring and connected with the people and was not afraid to show a bit of emotion that helped give people the courage to go on. This IMO is where Frederik holds his own and would do a far better job than most.

I was getting the impression that all was lost, until I read a couple of posts that made me think that perhaps Frederik might survive.

I think Frederik has many qualties that imo means he will be a good and respected King, his connection with the people be they young or not so young, he cares and is not afraid to show it. He also has a warm heart according to his mother, and is a wonderful family man by what we can see.
We have just been through a major flood and are still dealing with the crisis in many different and difficult ways, it was noted by all and I can say without a shadow of a doubt, it was not the best dressed or the best speaker that helped us deal with this at the major point of the crisis, it was the person that showed caring and connected with the people and was not afraid to show a bit of emotion that helped give people the courage to go on. This IMO is where Frederik holds his own and would do a far better job than most.

That is the truth

And in Denmark we are watching the flood every night in the news. All danes feel for you I'm sure.

About Frederik's speaking abilities, well, yes Muhler you are definitely more pessimistic than I am. While I do recognize that Frederik is not likely to bring home the annual oratorial award (still, that speech for mom's 70th was pretty darn good ) it is, IMHO, not a major obstacle for his becoming a great king; and I believe that he will one day. His people communcation skills are far superior to eg. his mother's and I find that hugely important. To be considered a relevant king to the Danes he has to have these connecting abililties which I believe that he has. His younger brother does not have that connection among the Danes, IMO, in spite of his greater public speaking ease. They are two very different persons but the dynamics will work for them, and I think that Joachim is very loyal to his brother and will be able to complement him in many positive ways. I'm not a 'fan' of Joachim, but I do recognize his abilities and respect them.

I agree that Frederik's IOC speech was not the highlight of his oratorial career, however, he was at that point officially sailing the politically shark infested waters and I think that all newcomers to that organization are grilled about the history of the IOC by a host of extremely critical parties which may understandably leave the newcomer momentarily speechless!

It's been interesting catching up on this thread (marfre, I loved your post)

__________________Some people say that cats are sneaky, evil, and cruel. True, and they have many other fine qualities as well.

His younger brother does not have that connection among the Danes, IMO, in spite of his greater public speaking ease. )

I'll second that , if it makes any difference to anyone! I remember when many Danes (the late 80s early 90s) wished that Joachim were the heir apparent! Now I'm grateful that he isn't! He's probably a nice person privately, but what my antennae pick up in particular is the occasional contempt of hoi polloi (the ´people´) occasionally shown by his mother, when she's caught off guard.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UserDane

I agree that Frederik's IOC speech was not the highlight of his oratorial career, however, he was at that point officially sailing the politically shark infested waters and I think that all newcomers to that organization are grilled about the history of the IOC by a host of extremely critical parties which may understandably leave the newcomer momentarily speechless!

Speech problems aside, is the IOC- membership a problem for the Danish heir only? What about the other royals in IOC? Have they met similar criticism in their countries??

I'll second that , if it makes any difference to anyone! I remember when many Danes (the late 80s early 90s) wished that Joachim were the heir apparent! Now I'm grateful that he isn't! He's probably a nice person privately, but what my antennae pick up in particular is the occasional contempt of hoi polloi (the ´people´) occasionally shown by his mother, when she's caught off guard.

I think he makes a good heir apparant. The comment about public speakingn was made more than a few years ago and he has improved greatly and is more than confident. I believe he initially stumbled in a small way to step forward into a group of royals and aristocrats among some politicians though was quite to contribute. Someone was asked of their opinion and merely pointed out he was unused to public speaking. He did a fine job and is much suited to the role.

The truth may be that others decided not to speak publicily and he should be applauded for doing so.

Quote:

Speech problems aside, is the IOC- membership a problem for the Danish heir only? What about the other royals in IOC? Have they met similar criticism in their countries??

Viv

I think his mother is jocular in herself about the public not haughty and is quite proud of herself for the work she does for the public though they may not see all. She is a very nice woman and the public respond well to her as she is quite happy to be around people.

About Frederik's speaking abilities, well, yes Muhler you are definitely more pessimistic than I am. While I do recognize that Frederik is not likely to bring home the annual oratorial award (still, that speech for mom's 70th was pretty darn good ) it is, IMHO, not a major obstacle for his becoming a great king; and I believe that he will one day. His people communcation skills are far superior to eg. his mother's and I find that hugely important. To be considered a relevant king to the Danes he has to have these connecting abililties which I believe that he has. His younger brother does not have that connection among the Danes, IMO, in spite of his greater public speaking ease. They are two very different persons but the dynamics will work for them, and I think that Joachim is very loyal to his brother and will be able to complement him in many positive ways. I'm not a 'fan' of Joachim, but I do recognize his abilities and respect them.

I agree that Frederik's IOC speech was not the highlight of his oratorial career, however, he was at that point officially sailing the politically shark infested waters and I think that all newcomers to that organization are grilled about the history of the IOC by a host of extremely critical parties which may understandably leave the newcomer momentarily speechless!

I sincerely hope you are right, UserDane. Nevertheless, if you are right and Frederik does not have an impediment of some sort, but it can all be contributed to nervousness and insecurity, I still hope and believe he should work on it, and work hard, harder than now.
Because he will get some heat for this in the future.

Well, I've been wrong before. I were among those who was very much against Frederik joining the IOC. I was certain he would end up in trouble for that.
So far, I've been proven wrong. May I continue being wrong...

For me the public speaking issue is only one relatively small piece of the puzzle when it comes to the question of Frederik's suitability. I think it's something he should work on and try to improve but I don't think it's something that in and of itself will make or break Frederik as king.

For me, the best indication of Frederik being an overall suitable King is that he's been an overall suitable Crown Prince. Becoming the monarch will be a big symbolic change, and possibly a big psychological change for Frederik himself, but I think the day to day activities will build on what he's been increasingly doing over the past couple years. Frederik is the second most experienced person in Denmark when it comes to the dealings of the monarch. I think sometimes the more mundane aspects of being the King, (or Queen), take a backseat in discussions like this to issues of personality, but I think on a practical level being a monarch is much like any other job in that there are a lot of skills that need to be mastered - public meetings and speaking, yes, but also issues of protocol, how a meeting with the government is conducted, how the royal household and staff is organized and how they liaise with the government and other segments of society, how to deal with paperwork, (is there any job that doesn't have paperwork? :) ), etc. These are the sorts of things we don't hear about as long as they run well, but I bet if you asked Queen Margrethe what she spends most of her working day doing she'd mention things like the above.

I have always thought that a country needs a king worthy, strong and responsible. Prince Frederick seems so fragile. Certain pictures of him show a whiny "little boy" who seems completely lost, but it's only my opinion

Please note that this thread has been cleaned out again. The discussion about translations has been off-topic
and can be resolved via PMs instead, for discussions about fashion please use the various threads in the Royal
House of Fashion subforum, in this particular case the "Fashion and Style of Royal Men"-thread.

I've had a further thought about the suitability of Frederik as a king and what I want to add is that his suitability (and the suitability of other heirs to thrones) is dependent upon how the people of his country see him. Obviously there are technical quailties required of a monarch including the actual ability reign and carry out the various duties required of a monarch, but for me it is important to recognise the more personal and character qualities. Frederik seems a friendly, jolly sort of person, likeable, kind and caring to his family and friends, fun loving and serious when it is required of him. He has been brought up to respect the history and institutions of his country and works to building good relations between himself and the people of Denmark (as far as I can see anyway). He doesn't appear to look down upon anyone and doesn't seem to take advantage of his position. I know of no major scandals about him and he doesn't appear to have done anything detrimental to his country. So as far as I can see he's good for the job! Of-course all these atributes I have mentioned can easily apply to his brother Joachim, but of course, Joachim is not the crown prince!

I have always thought that a country needs a king worthy, strong and responsible. Prince Frederick seems so fragile. Certain pictures of him show a whiny "little boy" who seems completely lost, but it's only my opinion

Well IMO CP Frederik has proven his worth. He has achieved a master degree and on top of that the most difficult military education.

The danish love him because he is down to earth. The danes don't like arrogant people.

Perhaps that is a special trademark for Denmark. Arrogance is the worst of sins.

Well IMO CP Frederik has proven his worth. He has achieved a master degree and on top of that the most difficult military education.

The danish love him because he is down to earth. The danes don't like arrogant people.

Perhaps that is a special trademark for Denmark. Arrogance is the worst of sins.

I'm not saying that Fred is bad, I find him fragile, and I can't imagine he has the stature to be a king, but I hope I am wrong

A king can be proud of what he represents, be aware of his value, without despising others, he may have a great ability, a certain class without being dismissive. And since you always talk of arrogance, being dignified and responsible has nothing to do with arrogance. People who are very well-educated can give a sense of pride and coldness, but I rather think they have great respect for others, and they know they can't get away with anything. Don't confuse dignity with insolence. Dignity is the prerogative of kings, insolence is for fools

I'm not saying that Fred is bad, I find him fragile, and I can't imagine he has the stature to be a king, but I hope I am wrong

A king can be proud of what he represents, be aware of his value, without despising others, he may have a great ability, a certain class without being dismissive. And since you always talk of arrogance, being dignified and responsible has nothing to do with arrogance. People who are very well-educated can give a sense of pride and coldness, but I rather think they have great respect for others, and they know they can't get away with anything. Don't confuse dignity with insolence. Dignity is the prerogative of kings, insolence is for fools

Well You are very frank about the danish crown prince.

He is well educated but doesn't appear cold because he is a real warmhearted person and that what the danes likes

You are welcome to Mitterand or that other president you have at the moment

Danes don't like arrogant people. Perhaps you like dignified people - but I don't think the danes are big lovers of dignity

Is there currently, or has there ever been any question, within Denmark, as to Frederik's suitability for the kingship?

I know of reports that he's struggled with his own self-doubt in the past, but has there ever been a time when people have not respected him?

I ask simply because I struggle to see the relevance of this thread. Frederik is the Crown Prince, through the sheer accident of birth he is next in line to the throne. It is not a job where one can simply apply and be interviewed for the position. You are simply born to it. Therefore, logically, he is eminently suitable to be King whether he has certain qualities or not.

I'd like to pose a question for all the Danes out there:
Is there currently, or has there ever been any question, within Denmark, as to Frederik's suitability for the kingship?.

On an official level, like in a hearing? No.
Behind the scenes? Possibly yes. I would find it very strange if it wasn't a case for concern at the royal court at a time!
Then there's the media and the voxpops: His suitability has often been discussed in the media, not always in a fair and objective manner, especially by the tabloids. IMO no one really questions his suitability after his marriage, but his public speaking skills - or the lack hereof - is still being commented upon. And somehow - whether it's fair or not, these two issues get intertwined.

Quote:

Originally Posted by inglebug

I know of reports that he's struggled with his own self-doubt in the past, but has there ever been a time when people have not respected him?.

It's down to semantics, IMO and depends on what you mean by 'respect in this context! Many Danes have been duly worried about his suitablity and some still are. Is it lack of respect or is it a genuine concern?

Quote:

Originally Posted by inglebug

I ask simply because I struggle to see the relevance of this thread. Frederik is the Crown Prince, through the sheer accident of birth he is next in line to the throne. It is not a job where one can simply apply and be interviewed for the position. You are simply born to it. Therefore, logically, he is eminently suitable to be King whether he has certain qualities or not.

Well, CP Frederik was born to the job! Some day he will inherit the throne, period! And yet it't not that simple, especially when the heir made it clear that he didn't like the future laid out for him and especially by showing that he didn't like what came with it, duties, press conferences and etc. That triggers a discussion about suitablity, not at least in this time and age, where the authority of old institutions isn't taken for granted!
For future reference the popularity and the relevance of a Royal Family will rest on the abilities of the individual members.

BTW This discussion has also popped up regularly in the UK (Prince of Wales).