Amnesty For Nocioni?

Anyway, to sum up my thoughts. The amnesty clause could be a very powerful tool a team could use, the Sixers are especially in a position to make a big splash next summer (assuming it can be held over). They don't have to use it and unless there's a serious, meaningful plan behind it, they shouldn't use it on Nocioni just because they can. And no, I don't consider adding Kwame Brown as a serious, meaningful plan.

Where'd you come up with 20 million for four years? You just think that's the going rate for a Kwame Brown? For what it's worth, I'd much rather have him than Hawes. Especially when Vucevic is our other center. Of course, I'd be okay with a gaping hole at center for now too.

I'm not sure about Thad's (and Hawes) cap hold but i am pretty sure that if they amnesty Nocioni they will be under the cap so they don't really need to use the MLE. Also there is a new exception of 2.5 million for teams slightly under the cap.

Also if they do get under the cap maybe they have a chance to get some of the amnestied players at a discount. Just dreaming here, the Sixers getting a player at a discount?!?!?

All that being said, cutting Nocioni is completely worthless at this point. I would much rather target teams that have multiple bad contracts as trade targets and try to squeeze something out of them so we can eat up the bad contract. Hello Orlando :)

I think a buyout makes the most sense with a possible million savings on the cap, if Nocioni is told he is not in this teams plans and he can go home and recoup that million over a contract overseas.

If this team wants to win and build off of this year than K. Brown makes sense in a lot of ways. He is the anti Hawes as far as what he gives a team and is young enough to stick around for a little bit. He should bring some physicality to the 5 spot and I would hope he can set some solid screens with that 270 lbs. of his.

A name not being mentioned is L.Will. for amnesty. If Young is given a fairly big deal and kept in his current role, and Meeks is moved to the bench by Turner than a pass first defensive p.g. off the bench makes more sense than Lou, and in my opinion that could improve the team greatly.

Anyone who submitted an entry to newsixersowner.com before 11/19 will be getting a free ticket. Not sure if it's because less than 1776 people did it, or I'd they're actually being generous.. But good to hear.

"After attending the last failed bargaining session to possibly end the NBA lockout in New York on Monday, Kobe Bryant was in a psychology classroom this week at the University of California-Santa Barbara answering questions from students and a professor about his stellar 15-year career. At one point, Bryant was asked about his lone most valuable player award in 2008 and used it as an opportunity to share a story about his former teammate and forever Wizard Kwame Brown...."

"...Brown has had a serviceable yet undistinguished career that fell well short of expectations. But Bryant’s hilariously-delivered tale of Brown’s final game with the Lakers perhaps offered a glimpse into how confidence — or a lack thereof — contributed to his early career struggles in Washington and Los Angeles...."

"... “I got to say, it was tough doing it that year. I was playing with guys, God bless them — God bless them — but Kwame Brown. Smush Parker. We had one game right before…by the way, what I say here, I say directly to them, see what I’m saying, I don’t talk behind people’s back. Things that I say to you, I’m comfortable saying this to them and I’ve said this to them...But like, the game before we traded for Pau, were playing Detroit and I had like 40 points towards the end of the game. This is back when Detroit had Rasheed [Wallace], Chauncey [Billups] and those guys, so we had no business being in the game. So down the stretch of the game, they put in a box and one. So I’m surrounded by these players, Detroit players, and Kwame is under the basket, all by himself. Literally, like all by himself. So I pass him the ball, he bobbled it and it goes out of bounds.

“So we go back to the timeout and I’m [upset], right? He goes, ‘I was wide open.’ ‘Yeah, I know.’ This is how I’m talking to him, like, during the game. I said, ‘You’re going to be open again, Kwame, because Rasheed is just totally ignoring you.’ He said, ‘Well, if I’m open don’t throw it to me.’ I was like, ‘Huh?’ He said, ‘Don’t throw it to me.’ I said, ‘Why not?’ He said, well, ‘I’m nervous. If I catch it and they foul me, I won’t make the free throws.’ I said, ‘Hell no!’

“I go to Phil [Jackson], I say, ‘Hey Phil, take him out of the game.’ He’s like, ‘Nah, let him figure it out.’ So, we lose the game, I go the locker room, I’m steaming. Steaming. I’m furious. Then, finally I get a call, they said, ‘You know what, we got something that’s happening with Pau.’ I was like, ‘Alright. Cool.’…That’s what I had to deal with the whole year.”

They can use it at any point during the duration of the new CBA. They can only use it on existing contracts though, signed before July 1st 2011. And they can use it only once.

Honestly, i seriously doubt there will be that many amnestied players. The new minimum salary restriction is going to prevent a lot of the under-performing teams to amnesty their own bad contracts. We will only see amnestied players if they solve any salary cap or tax related issues important for the team (financially or roster wise).

The way it originally read to me in the 'rejected' proposal was that it could be used more than once, only on contracts in place. Derek's article seems to indicate it's only once, maybe I read it wrong or maybe it changed.

I don't think the new CBA does as much that the NBA wanted to allow 'competitiveness' but I don't think that was ever a realistic goal based on how they thought about it. You can't even a playing field when there is a chasm of 'intellectual ability' between some teams. The Knicks, the Yankees, the Eagles, they've demonstrated you can't 'buy' a title without a plan some times.

Luck of course will still play an issue and I'm waiting to see if that 'b list' includes the 20 year old age limit

"The MLE is now four years and will start at $5 million. Teams near or over the luxury tax line will be limited in the amount they can spend, being restricted to only adding a MLE deal up to $74 million in total salary (in the first year). A team with $69.5 million in commitments, for example, is limited to $4.5 million for the MLE. Teams over that amount can offer a mini MLE of three years starting at $3 million. The Bi-Annual Exception remains. A new exception worth $2.5 million is available to teams who use all their cap space to sign free agents."

Does this mean that all MLE contracts will be worth 5 million for the first year, unless the team is less than 5 million dollars under the luxury tax threshold? A team can't use the MLE to sign a player for over 5 million in the first year, right?

Extension-and-trades permitted, except maximum length of any such extended contract is 3 years (e.g., 2 new years if player during last year of his old contract) and max annual increases are 4.5 percent. If a player signs a contract extension for a longer period or higher amount than would have been permitted for an extension-and-trade, then the team is prohibited from trading the player for a period of six months following the date of the extension. If a team acquires a player in a trade, then, for a period of six months following the date of the trade, the team is prohibited from signing the player to a contract extension for a longer period or higher amount than would have been permitted for an extension-and-trade.

This is just a weird paragraph to me. Expect it will lead to more 'handshake' agreements (that aren't public)

"The luxury tax will be raised for each $5 million over the defined luxury tax level starting in 2013-14. The first $5 million will be taxed at $1.50 per dollar, the next $5 million at $1.75 per dollar, the next $5 million at $2.25 per dollar, and starting at $15 million over each dollar is taxed at $3 per."

"For the next two seasons the tax will remain the same, one dollar for each dollar spent over."

L.A got lucky, if this had started this year and if they didn't use the amnesty clause, they would have had to pay 40 million in luxury tax instead of 17 million.

I wonder who they'll cut. Bryant, Gasol, and Bynum should be out of the equation. It will come down to Odom, Artest, or Walton

Chicago could use cut Boozer next year. Doing that will bring their committed salary to 35 million. They could use the remaining cap space to resign Rose and sign Dwight. They could probably trade Joakim, Deng, Brewer or Korver for an expiring contract to get more aggressive in next year's FA.

That's an interesting scenario indeed. I wonder if Noah becomes available in order to make that happen.

Actually come to think of it i have no idea why noone mentions Chicago as a possible destination for Howard. I'm sure that if Howard tells Orlando he is leaving noone will be able to match a Noah + Deng(Boozer) + filler for Howard + Arenas. They can amnesty Arenas then and proceed with a core of Rose/Howard/Boozer(Deng) with key role players such as Asik Gibson and Korver also under contract.

I think Love might become available actually. His situation in Minny has been tricky throughout his career and i wouldn't be surprised if they decided Derrick Williams is their future PF and dealt Love for a wing or a center. would you trade Iguodala for Love? I most certainly would i'd even add a pick (or anyone else outside of Jrue and Turner) to do it.

To tell you the truth, I don't really care about winning a championship. We would need a lot of luck in order for that to happen. Right now I would be satisfied with a 6th seed or higher and a series win in the first round of the playoffs.

I know signing Thad won't get you that far, but resigning him and adding a few pieces here and there along with Turner's development can get you to that level.

Without rescinding Nocioni, they have about $14m to sign both Hawes and Thad before hitting the luxury tax, which would leave them at 12 players. To realistically sign 2 minimum contract guys, they'll need Thad + Hawes this year to be ~$12m.

I'm not saying you use it on Brand this year. That only makes sense to me if you're planning on using the money to sign someone this season and/or tanking. But you can use it on Brand next summer to clear a ton of cap space.

Nocioni and Speights come off the books next summer, and I think there's probably a 90% chance Lou doesn't exercise his team option, which would put the Sixers at about $43.9M plus whatever Thad's salary is for next year, plus Hawes if he's re-signed for multiple years. So say Thad's number is $10M next year, then they're at $53.9M. If you amnesty Brand next year, you've got room for a max contract, plus another maybe $7M, maybe more.

Of course, if you sign Kwame Brown this year, then that eats into it. And if you amnesty Nocioni this year, then you aren't a player next year in any meaningful way unless you can find a sign and trade for Brand's expiring contract.

Each team permitted to waive 1 player prior to any season of the CBA (only for contracts in place at the inception of the CBA) and have 100% of the player’s salary removed from team salary for Cap and Tax purposes.

Is it just inferred that you can only use this amnesty once? To me it says the sixers (could) waive Nocioni this year, brand next year if they wanted?

The stretch exception + the higher minimum team salary will even the field in money spent IMO quite a bit but the impact on competitiveness will be limited. The only way competitiveness will be maximized (it will still be far from perfect) is by having a true hard cap. Even then we won't have a competitive field fighting for a championship of 20 teams but having 10-12 teams more or less even wouldn't surprise me. And now with the current modifications the number will only increase from 3-4 to 4-6 competitive teams.

I doubt there will be significant impact in the first two season as well. A lot of the important modifications kick in after that anyway.

It all depends on where Howard and D.Williams want to go. It's not the same situation as Anthony because Anthony could've signed with the Knicks in the summer anyway (or as it turned out in December). Howard and Williams and Paul don't have the same leverage because there probably won't be a team they would strongly like to go to sufficiently under the cap (max deal or close to it). Aside from the Knicks who i'm not sure will even be able to afford another max deal at all, is there another potential target for these guys? Lakers, bulls, Mavs and the like are teams these guys would like to go to, but they have no real leverage to persuade the Magic, Nets and Hornets to trade them to.

"The Sixers have always been irrationally averse to trading Iguodala. It's known throughout the league that, while the team will occasionally reach out to teams to test the waters, they very often pull back and slam shut the door. I believe that now that general manager Ed Stefanski, who signed Iguodala to his long-term deal, is no longer in the front office, the possibility increases that the Sixers truly and really loosen their hold on Iguodala. Because he's the best player on the team, and a very valuable player overall, the Sixers will need to receive a key piece in return: a top-10 shooting guard, or someone very close to that status."

I think she's saying what she says to keep her job, it's what appeals to the majority of the 'fans' who read and comment on philly.com. She's feeding the beast that keeps her employed. I don't respect it, but I can understand it, she's employed in a dying medium and needs to figure out how to get those eyeballs, beating the 'anti iguodala' drum will do that.

Writers like her would just find someone else to blame - for instance - with a massive roster shake up like that - collins obviously wouldn't be the right coach he's too old schools or some nonsense.

I had no problem with DeSean until this year. He has been dropping passes and has been letting CBs get interceptions on the deep balls. His taunting penatly was inexcusable. But that last straw for me was when teamed up with Lou to make a rap single. I say we draft Justin Blackmon and let DeSean walk. He's not worth the 10 million he is demanding.

I really don't think his punt return was showboating. I honestly think that he was cocky enough to believe that the whole punt return took less than 5 seconds. Other than that he hasn't been a major problem. He used to go after the ball, but now it seems that he doesn't catch the ball anymore unless it hits him in stride. I can think of 4 times this season that a deep ball thrown for him has been intercepted.

Vick's contract isn't a major issue, I still think he's a good QB. I just can't believe that Andy went into this season with Juan as his DC and Casey Matthews as his MIKE.

I think teams weren't as ready for Vick last year as they were this year, they remembered how to shut him down and he reverted.

Much like the 'tebow' phenomenon - it's tough to switch mid stream - but if the broncos start him next year - they'll have their running game stuffed a lot more - and tebow will have to throw - which he just sucks at

I disagree. He's not a top 5 QB, but I don't think the team's struggles have to do with him. The losses against ATL, BUF, and SF were not his fault IMO. He could have played better vs. CHI, and he should have taken himself out of the game vs. NYG and ARI.

He's not a top 5 qb
but he's worth 100 million dollar contract?
Admittedly I haven't seen all the games this year because I don't have directv and live in california but from what I did see - he's back to being inaccurate, he's running too quickly and teams are sacking him more easily (not totally his fault) and thus he's injured again.

Hypocrisy? Like deriding posters last year for saying Turner was a bust (relative to his draft position) after a forgettable summer league and a quarter of a season, only to now call Vucevic a bust before he even plays one game?

I love how ET can't crack the starting lineup but she is willing to pencil him in as the starting SF.I don't understand her logic, if it doesn't help the team and it doesn help the cap situation, why make the move?

I wonder how the new management feels about Hawes. I know he sucks but he is better than Speights and Vucevic. I wonder if there are any centers out there that would sign for less than 2 million and can play 35+ minutes a game without being a liability.

When you use Arenas as an example of course it would be illogical and by you're logic why would a team use the amnesty clause at all because regardless of whether a team trades for the player that the amnesty clause is used on the team will need to pay that salary. But that isn't how it works as far as I know because the silent auction that takes place for the waived player will take off some the money owed off the books of the team that waived that player.

A scenario I was thinking of would be a team giving up a high salary player for a low salary player that they want to keep and a high salary player that they plan to waive.

Again, I still don't see the benefit to the team receiving the higher salary player they're just going to waive. Unless the low salary player is bad, where's the incentive to take on a bad contract (whatever it is) and waive it immediately while you give up talent?

It's money. That's it. Instead of including $3M in a deal, or maybe on top of that, you're taking back a shit contract that you're willing to amnesty in order to get something you really want. So you take, say, Mo Williams along with Eric Gordon and you're essentially paying $17M for the privilege of getting Eric Gordon because you're going to amnesty Williams immediately. Sterling does the deal because you're essentially giving him $17M.

Except that Sterling would have to take money back mostly likely in the deal and then waive that player - which was the scenario traded - and in most scenarios - the team giving up the low salary player takes back the higher waiveable contract, so what's the incentive?

If it's a team with cap room maybe - but in general - i don't see the waiver being used like that too often.

Except new trade rules allow 150% if the team in not a tax team. Not sure it works with Orlando (Orlando is a tax team the Sixers are not), but it definitely works with the Clippers.

All this was my understanding of a good use of the amnesty as well. Try to squeeze a valuable asset (a player, a draft pick...) from another team with multiple terrible contracts (can't amnesty both). Teams that come to my mind include: Orlando, Charlotte, Detroit, Lakers...

Yes, I'm aware, but it's not 'free' - so unless they're giving those guys away to a team with cap room - it's not 'free money' for tserling - he has to take a player back a team didn't want and pay him whether he waives him or not

For an example lets say the sixers really want the twolves 1st rnd pick in 2012 that the clippers have the rights to. In order to get that pick the clips want the sixers to take on mo williams salary and to give them iggy. In the past the sixers may not have wanted to be saddled with mo's salary for the next 2 or 3 years because of the cap hit, but with the amnesty clause they would be able to waive him and recoup whatever amount of money the silent auction allows them to recoup. This could be nothing but that's not the point of the trade. The point of it would be to get a piece you really want without having to take on the salary cap hit for years to come of the incoming player you don't really want. The sixers would more than likely lose a lot of money in the deal but you're in a much better place cap wise and have a probable top 5 pick in the next draft.

I realize doing something like this could be very expensive but if its good for the franchise and could be a move that could turn it around, why not take the financial loss in the short term in hopes that it will payoff in the long term.

The Timberwolves' pick has to be worth a bit more than Iguodala/salary dump. Minnesota won just 17 games last year, but went 7-45 in the West. And now we're switching to a schedule where 73%, rather than the traditional 63%, of games will be played in your own conference. Which will tend to improve Cleveland and Washington's records (Cleveland and Washington both went about .300 in the East but anywhere from .133 to .233 in the West), while hurting Minnesota. It ought to be a fight between them and Sacramento for worst record in the league, and the chances of their falling below top 3 in a strong draft are really slim.

Why on earth would they do that. Bosh may not be a top 10 player but he still has quite a bit of trade value. For example you can trade him for DeAndre Jordan and Mo Williams in a nanosecond. The clippers might even through in the Timberwolves pick for that trade.

She said that right after saying she hasn't talked to anyone about this since new ownership took over. She's still going off the master plan she was supposedly clued into back in like May and none of which actually happened.

Yeah, I thought she was Ms. "Iguodala Rediscovered His Game Last Season." I guess she thinks he's mercurial and may undiscover his game. There are times, it's true, when he does nothing on the offensive end. He almost always plays great defense.

No, there are also a great many possessions or even games where he stands somewhere outside the arc most of the time and doesn't create for anyone. It's not like he's a dynamic point-forward every game.

I'm sure you're right, his ability to score, rebound and assist (as a whole) being near the top of the league year in and year out probably wouldn't take a hit if some nights he just stands in the corner scratching his balls

I definitely have problems when he doesn't attack a blatant mismatch. I don't think his playmaker is every really in question beyond saying things like he's not great every game. LeBron isn't the best player in the world every game. Dwight Howard isn't a dominant force in the paint every game.

Agree with you on this one. Last year there were times where he drifted and didn't involve himself in the game as much as he should. Then again that's true of a lot of guys, but Andre Iguodala is best when he's energized and active on offense. For other players, it's that way on defense.

I really don't get Fagan of late. Honestly, right now i would rather have Hawes than Dampier or Kwame. None of them accomplishes what this team needs and Hawes at least is younger and presumably tradeable, whereas Dampier and Kwame would instantly become overpayed bigs who shouldn't be more than backups.

I like brians idea of re-upping on thad for 10, doing everything you can too convince lou not too sign. The only question i have with that brian is how do you get an extra 7+ million after howard. Howard coming here as we all know will be on the development of et and jrue. We our a top 5 media market and one of our new owners is none other that the fresh prince which is one of the most powerfull people in hollywood which Howard has expressed he would like too do after and during his career.

Brian i asked about the extra 7 million because if we would have that much extra why not resign lou

I don't think New Jersey is going to offer him that much money, new jersey is going to wave outlaw and try and find the cap room properly to sign Dwight Howard, they aren't going to occupy it with Thaddeus Young. Avery Brooks would hate Thad.

Predictions

Chandler will stay in Dallas
Gasol will stay in Memphis
Afflalo will stay in Denver,someone will regret over paying david west (let it be the pacers)
Nene might move - but Denver has the leverage and he's a valuable commodity

With the Cap and tax staying fixed for the next 2 years I think we will see 2 years of crippling deals followed by 3 years of mediocre teams that have dug themselves into a financial hole (sort of resembling the last few Sixers teams.)

Given the Lakers, Celtics and Spurs are all old, a smart GM would position their team to take advantage of the "surprise" market conditions that will begin after the next 2 years.

I would hope the current ownership has that type of patience and time horizon (it basically measn build towards flexibility when Jrue and Turner are finishing their rookie deals and Brand and Iguodala are coming off the books- which is the right thing to do anyways.)

Gasol is a stiff. Incredibly slow, his hard work disguises lack of talent in the box score, but not when one actually watches him play (he looks pathetic at all times). Nene will be a huge overpayment by whoever gets stuck with him for 4-5 years. He's kind of a whiner. Much better off with Brand for 2 years only.

Slow up and down the floor and really immobile. He's definitely a skilled big man, and he can score on the inside, but to me he's limited by his size/athleticism. They need a finisher in the worst way.

Well I never claimed Hawes was a bastion of athleticism or supreme talent. I just like the dude's physical game and attitude. Hawes is also much, much cheaper than Gasol will be.

And Hawes at least looks more athletic than Gasol. I remember being utterly shocked at how slow and pathetic-looking Gasol was the first time I saw him run the floor (I had previously been told how great he was, and thus when I saw him for the first time I was flabbergasted).

Utah has made Jefersson and Milsap available again. How about Nocioni+Speights+Brackins for Jefersson. The Jazz get cap relief and young talent and get rid of the overpayed big Al and Jefersson while not the perfect solution (how he fits is very questionable) is certainly an improvement over Hawes. And it's not like he is going to cost the team anything outside of extra few bucks. His contract ends same as Brand.