Always going to worry about the man's concussion issues but hes an awesome back.

March 24th, 2012, 5:18 pm

calvin81mixes

Water Boy

Joined: March 25th, 2012, 9:46 amPosts: 4

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

He's a good RB. I'm happy to have him back.

March 25th, 2012, 10:07 am

m2karateman

RIP Killer

Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10398Location: Where ever I'm at now

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

lionsflow wrote:

Always going to worry about the man's concussion issues but hes an awesome back.

Awesome isn't the adjective I'd use. He has skills, but is not a complete back by any means. I think the Lions need to use him sparingly to maintain his longevity. Put him in the backfield and split him out on occasion. 15 touches a game, both running and passing, should suffice.

_________________I will not put on blinders when it comes to our QBs performances.

March 25th, 2012, 3:14 pm

kdsberman

League MVP

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pmPosts: 3485Location: Saginaw, MI

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

m2karateman wrote:

lionsflow wrote:

Always going to worry about the man's concussion issues but hes an awesome back.

Awesome isn't the adjective I'd use. He has skills, but is not a complete back by any means. I think the Lions need to use him sparingly to maintain his longevity. Put him in the backfield and split him out on occasion. 15 touches a game, both running and passing, should suffice.

Give him a Sproles type role.

March 25th, 2012, 5:49 pm

Blueskies

QB Coach

Joined: September 13th, 2007, 12:43 pmPosts: 3084

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

kdsberman wrote:

m2karateman wrote:

lionsflow wrote:

Always going to worry about the man's concussion issues but hes an awesome back.

Awesome isn't the adjective I'd use. He has skills, but is not a complete back by any means. I think the Lions need to use him sparingly to maintain his longevity. Put him in the backfield and split him out on occasion. 15 touches a game, both running and passing, should suffice.

Give him a Sproles type role.

Pretty sure that's why they drafted leshoure.

March 25th, 2012, 10:04 pm

Pablo

RIP Killer

Joined: August 6th, 2004, 9:21 amPosts: 9898Location: Dallas

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

This is a little off subject but interesting...

Freep wrote:

DETROIT — Lions great Lem Barney wasn’t diagnosed with his first concussion until years after his Hall of Fame career ended, when an ophthalmologist looked into his eyes and saw spots on his brain.

"(He) told me that he saw where I had at least seven or eight concussions," Barney said. "One (spot) was as large as a silver dollar, and he said, ’You were out for a long time.’ And there was about 30 minutes that I was out — down at Tiger Stadium playing against the Bengals. It was just amazing.

"And then the other ones that he saw — I can remember them. The ones I remember fondly was big Rufus Mayes from Ohio State, 6-9, 290, and he put his right knee right in the right temple when I came up to cut him down on a sweep. Next thing I know, it’s like la-la land. Was out for a long time."

Barney is one of 106 retired players who filed suit against the NFL in Philadelphia federal court in January accusing the league of negligence when it came to treating and diagnosing head injuries. Similar lawsuits have been filed in Florida, Georgia and New York, some of which have been consolidated into one complaint.

The NFL is contesting the allegations, and commissioner Roger Goodell said at the Super Bowl last month the league is pioneering research "to make sure we understand all there is about brain injuries and brain disease."

Despite his legal claim, Barney, 66, considers himself lucky.

He hasn’t suffered any of the debilitating mental diseases that have disabled many of his peers. He still works full-time in patient relations at Sinai Grace Hospital. And he’s able to deal with the health problems he has — he said he has been diagnosed with nerve conditions that cause tingling in his fingers, hands and forearms and limits him to 3-4 hours of sleep a night — without the help of medicine.

"I call it blessed," Barney said. "It’s that type of game. It’s a lethal game. Again, as I tell people, ’Do you miss the game, Lem?’ And sincerely, I don’t miss the game."

In fact, Barney goes a step further.

"If I look at the game now and I look back on it retrospectively, if I had another choice I’d never played the game, at all, in my life," he said. "Never. Never. From all-city, all-state, all-conference, all-American, seven times All-Pro, I’m in eight Hall of Fames, it wouldn’t be. It would be golf or tennis. I’m serious. Very serious."

A standout cornerback in 1967-77 with the Lions, Barney said the term concussion wasn’t used during his playing days.

"I related concussions to boxers," he said. "I didn’t put one and two together. You get KO’d on the football (field) like getting KO’d in the damn ring, it’s a concussion. I didn’t put that together because, again, no doctors from middle school through high school through college through the league called them concussions. They all called them dingers and stingers."

Now that he has seen firsthand how dangerous concussions can be, Barney, who testified at a Congressional hearing about the subject two years ago, said he worries about players like Lions running back Jahvid Best.

Best suffered two concussions last year, finished the season on injured reserve and has not been cleared by team doctors to return to football.

Lions general manager Martin Mayhew said Monday at a town hall meeting for season-ticket holders that he has "big plans" for Best this year and is "very optimistic" about his health.

Barney said if he were advising Best, he’d tell him to consider giving up the game.

"If he wants to play again, God bless him, but if he can come back and still be comprehensible and still be able to understand things and still live a real good life," Barney said. "I would tell him, if he’s going to play, they’ve got to get some kind of special helmet for him because it’s not going to take much longer if he keeps getting those dinger, stinger and bell-ringers as the boxers used to call them, or even the concussions, that he’s going to be around here.

"I would tell him to maybe look at doing something else rather than coming back again after having those back-to-(back) concussions. It’s a dangerous game. Like I said, I don’t have anything against it, I just don’t have anything for it now."

If anything, I think he needs to be used more as a Tedd Ginn type role, without the KR/PR duties, of which I understand is a VERY limited role. I wouldn't even go so far as to give him 15 touches per game. I would put him out there for 15-20offensive plays, most of which are pass plays. Maybe give him a reverse or two, 2-3 typical runs, a handful of passes out of the backfield, and perhaps line him up in the slot occasionally, but that's about it.

What is the salary cap hit if he retires?

March 26th, 2012, 2:51 pm

regularjoe12

Off. Coordinator – Joe Lombardi

Joined: March 30th, 2006, 12:48 amPosts: 4180Location: Davison Mi

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

nothing if he retires...at least the way i understand it.

Im sorry I can't help but think this kid has a wish to drink his food through a straw for the rest of his life. He's going to talk Like Ali..but at the age of 25. i really dont think we can depend on him....

_________________2013 Lionbacker Fantasy Football Champion

March 26th, 2012, 5:54 pm

kdsberman

League MVP

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pmPosts: 3485Location: Saginaw, MI

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

regularjoe12 wrote:

nothing if he retires...at least the way i understand it.

Im sorry I can't help but think this kid has a wish to drink his food through a straw for the rest of his life. He's going to talk Like Ali..but at the age of 25. i really dont think we can depend on him....

If he has bonuses, those will count against the cap wont they?

March 26th, 2012, 6:37 pm

wjb21ndtown

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

regularjoe12 wrote:

nothing if he retires...at least the way i understand it.

Im sorry I can't help but think this kid has a wish to drink his food through a straw for the rest of his life. He's going to talk Like Ali..but at the age of 25. i really dont think we can depend on him....

When Ricky Williams retired (and I think Charles Rogers too) I thought the team suffered the same cap hit as if they cut that player, UNTIL the player returned the pro-rated bonus money that they received. I could be wrong, but that's what I remember (which is why I asked) ).

Im sorry I can't help but think this kid has a wish to drink his food through a straw for the rest of his life. He's going to talk Like Ali..but at the age of 25. i really dont think we can depend on him....

When Ricky Williams retired (and I think Charles Rogers too) I thought the team suffered the same cap hit as if they cut that player, UNTIL the player returned the pro-rated bonus money that they received. I could be wrong, but that's what I remember (which is why I asked) ).

I think that's right. Retiring is no different from cutting a player--the remaining portion of the pro-rated signing bonus would accelerate and count against this year's cap. I think the hit for Best would be about $3M this year. And yes, I remember that cap relief only occurs if the player returns all/part of the signing bonus (which no player would ever do unless they were being sued by the team, as Charles Rogers was). I assume all of this stuff applies to the new CBA but I honestly don't know for sure.

_________________Proud member of the Contract Extension for Schwartz Fan Club.

March 26th, 2012, 7:47 pm

wjb21ndtown

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

mwill2 wrote:

wjb21ndtown wrote:

regularjoe12 wrote:

nothing if he retires...at least the way i understand it.

Im sorry I can't help but think this kid has a wish to drink his food through a straw for the rest of his life. He's going to talk Like Ali..but at the age of 25. i really dont think we can depend on him....

When Ricky Williams retired (and I think Charles Rogers too) I thought the team suffered the same cap hit as if they cut that player, UNTIL the player returned the pro-rated bonus money that they received. I could be wrong, but that's what I remember (which is why I asked) ).

I think that's right. Retiring is no different from cutting a player--the remaining portion of the pro-rated signing bonus would accelerate and count against this year's cap. I think the hit for Best would be about $3M this year. And yes, I remember that cap relief only occurs if the player returns all/part of the signing bonus (which no player would ever do unless they were being sued by the team, as Charles Rogers was). I assume all of this stuff applies to the new CBA but I honestly don't know for sure.

I think they're honestly obligated to return the money (Ricky Williams was going to get sued too, but he came back instead) if they retire. The signing bonus is a bonus for signing a contract of X amount of years. Retiring is more or less a breach of contract. It's like telling the team that you're not going to honor the deal, so X amount of the SB (the pro-rated portion) should be returned.

That said, the league has already said that they're not going to give a team cap relief until the money has been returned, and the chances of that all happening this year are slim to none. Best would have to voluntarily retire, AND honor his contract by returning the money AND get the money returned, all within the next couple of months.

March 27th, 2012, 3:57 pm

regularjoe12

Off. Coordinator – Joe Lombardi

Joined: March 30th, 2006, 12:48 amPosts: 4180Location: Davison Mi

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

That would make what he's doing make more sense. If he quits he gotta give back. If he can ride out his contract he gets to keep it. I know it's a decent chunk of change but it's a huge gamble IMO

_________________2013 Lionbacker Fantasy Football Champion

March 27th, 2012, 4:02 pm

wjb21ndtown

Re: Jahvid Best gets OK to work out

regularjoe12 wrote:

That would make what he's doing make more sense. If he quits he gotta give back. If he can ride out his contract he gets to keep it. I know it's a decent chunk of change but it's a huge gamble IMO

Sort of... It's a long-term gamble, short term reward. People are always willing to risk getting alzheimers later or parkinsons later for multiple millions today. If you presented this situation to the rest of the world 95% would take the money.

Want me to prove it to you? Go and ask how many people would let Mike Tyson punch them for one million dollars. They're almost certain to get a concussion, but most would say yes, and this is LESS risky, IMO, and more than double the reward.

Im sorry I can't help but think this kid has a wish to drink his food through a straw for the rest of his life. He's going to talk Like Ali..but at the age of 25. i really dont think we can depend on him....

When Ricky Williams retired (and I think Charles Rogers too) I thought the team suffered the same cap hit as if they cut that player, UNTIL the player returned the pro-rated bonus money that they received. I could be wrong, but that's what I remember (which is why I asked) ).

I think that's right. Retiring is no different from cutting a player--the remaining portion of the pro-rated signing bonus would accelerate and count against this year's cap. I think the hit for Best would be about $3M this year. And yes, I remember that cap relief only occurs if the player returns all/part of the signing bonus (which no player would ever do unless they were being sued by the team, as Charles Rogers was). I assume all of this stuff applies to the new CBA but I honestly don't know for sure.

I think they're honestly obligated to return the money (Ricky Williams was going to get sued too, but he came back instead) if they retire. The signing bonus is a bonus for signing a contract of X amount of years. Retiring is more or less a breach of contract. It's like telling the team that you're not going to honor the deal, so X amount of the SB (the pro-rated portion) should be returned.

That said, the league has already said that they're not going to give a team cap relief until the money has been returned, and the chances of that all happening this year are slim to none. Best would have to voluntarily retire, AND honor his contract by returning the money AND get the money returned, all within the next couple of months.

If Best needs to retire for injury reasons, I wonder if the Lions could get him to return part of his bonus (to earn cap relief) and then give Best an injury settlement (which lets the other players know that the team won't try to screw over the injured player). That might be seen as manipulating the system so I have no idea if that is allowed. I know injury settlements are common when players are cut...I don't know about retirements.

_________________Proud member of the Contract Extension for Schwartz Fan Club.