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I'm saying the guy has a lower ceiling than the elite. He can show at times that maybe he can reach it, but he just can't. He doesn't have the ability to. The reason he was so efficient is because he wouldn't force shots, especially with Durant and Westbrook, he's forcing shots right now and its showing he's also a streaky shooter/player

Didn't want to get dragged into this

We all know his efficiency is going to dip. We know that playing with OKC and coming off the bench will help with that. No one is disputing that. Those 66.0% TS% days are gone, for sure. He's at 56.6% (I think he'll finish the year a little better than that), but that's not bad. Even if his TS% drops 1/10th of a point, it's at 56%, which tops Kobe Bryant's career high for reference's sake.

We will see in due time. Sample size remains way too tiny. It's his first year starting/being the first option. There's nothing at all that we can reasonably deduce after 8 games on a new team in a new role with a weaker cast.

I just think he has the tools. Amazing off the dribble. A solid shooter. A great finisher at the rim. Absolutely elite at getting to the line. Solid defender. Great rebounder for his position. There might be some streakiness, but he's got the tools. I'm not sure where the Rudy Gay comparison is coming from. Rudy's efficiency in terms of scoring is Harden's cellar IMO. Rudy isn't nearly as good off the dribble, he can't get to the line nearly as much as Harden, and he's not the play-maker Harden can be. Harden can basically function as a PG if needed, Rudy is not good at all at setting people up.

I'm not saying he's a star, nor am I saying that he'll be a decent #1 option...I just think he has the tools and am more than willing to give him a lot of time to figure it out. This is virgin territory to him.

Again, we'll see. My last comment on the matter! We got the Mighty Magic to talk about, and I'm content with letting him prove it on the court rather than us trying to prove it before it happens.

I think you guys would like this. Video about the Magic's rookies. Funny thing about how Kyle and DeQuan went to Target to pick up some stuff for Jameer and Baby, around the 8min mark. Give it a watch.

We all know his efficiency is going to dip. We know that playing with OKC and coming off the bench will help with that. No one is disputing that. Those 66.0% TS% days are gone, for sure. He's at 56.6% (I think he'll finish the year a little better than that), but that's not bad. Even if his TS% drops 1/10th of a point, it's at 56%, which tops Kobe Bryant's career high for reference's sake.

We will see in due time. Sample size remains way too tiny. It's his first year starting/being the first option. There's nothing at all that we can reasonably deduce after 8 games on a new team in a new role with a weaker cast.

I just think he has the tools. Amazing off the dribble. A solid shooter. A great finisher at the rim. Absolutely elite at getting to the line. Solid defender. Great rebounder for his position. There might be some streakiness, but he's got the tools. I'm not sure where the Rudy Gay comparison is coming from. Rudy's efficiency in terms of scoring is Harden's cellar IMO. Rudy isn't nearly as good off the dribble, he can't get to the line nearly as much as Harden, and he's not the play-maker Harden can be. Harden can basically function as a PG if needed, Rudy is not good at all at setting people up.

I'm not saying he's a star, nor am I saying that he'll be a decent #1 option...I just think he has the tools and am more than willing to give him a lot of time to figure it out. This is virgin territory to him.

Again, we'll see. My last comment on the matter! We got the Mighty Magic to talk about, and I'm content with letting him prove it on the court rather than us trying to prove it before it happens.

I'm not saying Harden and Gay have the same game, I'm saying they are the same "Number 1" guy. They aren't elite, and I don't see Harden becoming elite. He has a good set of tools, and gets to the line like Wade did (by the refs calling every ticky tack foul, bs btw). People were saying he's so great because of his efficiency, well his efficiency is dipping, not in just shooting, but taking care of the ball as well.

It is his first year of all this, I understand that. He will get better, but he won't lead the team any where. That was the whole point in the first place with me and Macc talking about Harden. How he said we should have gotten him, and I said it would have been pointless. Harden is a good ball player, but he is not elite and if he is the number 1 option, the Rockets will not go anywhere

Originally Posted by heimdog8

I didn't want to throw this information out here. I was a 3 year varsity starter at QB in high school. I played quarterback in junior college as well. I was considering playing division 1 football as well but chose to pursue my career in business instead. However, currently I am helping train with Derek Carr from Fresno State get ready for his pro day and the draft. I am also working with Cody Kessler, the USC quarterback.

I didn't want to throw this information out here. I was a 3 year varsity starter at QB in high school. I played quarterback in junior college as well. I was considering playing division 1 football as well but chose to pursue my career in business instead. However, currently I am helping train with Derek Carr from Fresno State get ready for his pro day and the draft. I am also working with Cody Kessler, the USC quarterback.

We're at Detroit tonight. Probably the second worst team in the NBA right now. If we can't beat them, well....that's bad.

Nelson is close to returning. He wanted to play on Tuesday. I think he'll make a decent difference...if for no other reason than bumping Ish Smith out of the rotation. And he's certainly better than Moore too.

I hope Nelson returns soon. Our offense staggards when Redick isn't in the game and Moore is bringing the ball up. He's making open shots but that's about it. We are lacking a play maker. Good to see Harkless making strides though. Not just in points but blocks and rebounds as well.

I hope Nelson returns soon. Our offense staggards when Redick isn't in the game and Moore is bringing the ball up. He's making open shots but that's about it. We are lacking a play maker. Good to see Harkless making strides though. Not just in points but blocks and rebounds as well.

Harks defense is actually surprising me a bit. Great surprise!

Originally Posted by heimdog8

I didn't want to throw this information out here. I was a 3 year varsity starter at QB in high school. I played quarterback in junior college as well. I was considering playing division 1 football as well but chose to pursue my career in business instead. However, currently I am helping train with Derek Carr from Fresno State get ready for his pro day and the draft. I am also working with Cody Kessler, the USC quarterback.

I hope Nelson returns soon. Our offense staggards when Redick isn't in the game and Moore is bringing the ball up. He's making open shots but that's about it. We are lacking a play maker. Good to see Harkless making strides though. Not just in points but blocks and rebounds as well.

Nelson is listed a game time decision, but he went through a full practice today so the chances of him playing are looking pretty good.