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2017-18 Game Thread: Knicks @ Cavaliers

The Knicks’ 2017-18 season comes to a merciful end tonight. The chances are high that the Knicks will lose this one, since the Cavaliers still have something to play for. They are currently the #4 seed and getting to the #3 seed (and a second round match-up with the Kyrie-less Celtics) is clearly a very juicy place to be, so the Cavs will be playing to win and the Cavs are much better than the Knicks, so even if the Knicks try to win (and they will try to win, because they’re morons), the Cavs should pull this out. So that would mean a tie for the #8 seed and possibly even a three-way tie for the #7 seed if the Nets win tonight against the Celtics!

Do note that Kevin Love and Kyle Korver will rest this game and Lebron might be pulled early. The only slight problem would be if the Bucks intentionally lose to the Sixers so that the Bucks would drop to the #7 seed and play the Celtics in the first round. If the Sixers are blowing the Bucks out, the Cavs might pull Lebron, as well, and who knows? They could want to make sure the Nets don’t tie the Knicks for the #8 seed, but I doubt they would do that.

Around the league, two huge games today between the Utah Jazz and Portland Trailblazers playing for the #3 seed (it is insane how amazing Gobert is – he took a shitty team and made them good almost singlehandedly) and the Minnesota Timberwolves and Denver Nuggets playing for the #8 seed (it would be too funny to see Thibs lose out on the playoffs after burning his guys out for Year 312).

This is prooooobably the last game that Jeff Hornacek will coach for the Knicks. Scott Perry has made some poor moves to go with some good moves (signing Trey Burke certainly looks really good), but he hasn’t made any, “Oh no, how could you?” moves, unlike Steve Mills. He hasn’t done a Mega Max Melo or a Bargnani trade or a no match Lin or a signing Joakim Noah or a trading for Derrick Rose or a signing THJ or anything like that, so I will cross my fingers and hope that he somehow avoids hiring Mark Jackson to coach this team. Come on, Perry, I want to believe in you! Give me a reason to believe in you! Don’t hire Mark Jackson!

77 comments on “2017-18 Game Thread: Knicks @ Cavaliers”

it is insane how amazing Gobert is – he took a shitty team and made them good almost singlehandedly

Gobert is awesome but this is kind of a weird thing to say. The Jazz without Gobert are actually much better than most of the Western playoff teams without their headliners. Take Lillard off Portland or Jokic off Denver or Westbrook off OKC or Towns off Minnesota or LMA off the Spurs or AD off the Pelicans and none of them get the positive point differential the Jazz did in 2000 minutes without Gobert this year. Maybe you’re just implying he’s underrated.

The Jazz are 37-18 with Gobert in the lineup (possibly 38-18 after tonight, but also possibly 37-19), and 11-15 without him. I have no doubt that other teams with star players would have similar splits, so praising Gobert for the achievement isn’t a slight on any of them, who would also have similar effects.

It’s not as bad as that tho. He played 1:49 when the best the celts so it’s really 12-15. And they played a ridiculous stretch of games without him the second time he went out:

CLE
HOU
OKC
SAS
OKC
DEN
GSW
CLE
NO
DEN
MIA
WAS
CHO
IND

I mean Gobert is really good but I don’t think the Jazz are shit without him; they are better than most playoff teams without their star. They have two of the more underrated guys around him Ingles and Rubio and they have Mitchell and Favors. That’s not a playoff team but it’s a pretty good surrounding cast. The record is misleading adjusted for SOS they played to a slightly positive SRS without him.

The Jazz do have a lot of good role players + Mitchell, but Gobert is just so crucial with how he anchors everything. He might not be more talented than some of his counterparts but he’s just so impactful on defense it changes their team. The splits might also have to do with the fact that they don’t have a backup for him, it’s only Favors out of position or Ekpe Udoh.

I like a lot of Jazz players, like Mitchell, Rubio, Ingles and Exum who has returned well, O’Neale is serviceable too, but Gobert is the engine on that team. Maybe yeah, he’s not more impactful relatively to Westbrook, Lillard or AD, but to me he’s on their level.

In fairness, our young bucks are leading the charge. IIRC the one caveat on the board was that most would be happy if we were winning because of our young guys ha ha. We should be due to win a coin toss right?

Also, I think Frank Ntilikina and Trey Burke work really well as a starting back court. Tim Hardaway Jr’s contract shouldn’t get in the way of balance. Let him come off the bench as a super sub, and let’s focus on getting some combo forwards.

There were some tight sphincters down the stretch of that Minnesota/Denver game. Both teams will benefit from the experience, but the playoff experience is certainly going help the T-Wolve’s young players take a step forward next year.

I’m in the minority here, but unless we are hiring an assistant coach like Ime Udoka or David Vanterpool (because the Knicks will absolutely without a doubt be hiring a black head coach), I’d rather keep Hornacek on for another year. I don’t want us running after Rivers or Jackson. I’d even take David Fizdale, but I really just want a guy smart enough to know Burke and Ntilikina should be the starting guards next season.

I mean, after today the Dolan’s Razor is about as confirmed as the earth being round, so it surely will be him and it will be terrible. Just like with the earth being round, we’ll have to listen to months of arguments about how he’s being unfairly judged and “not given a chance” and that he will be good.

Winning last night is crushing, though at least it saves us falling back to 8 on a coin flip.

But the last few wins have come in the scheme of playing the young guys and we still have something like the second worst record in the league since KP went down and indeed since a while before. Every team wins a few so it isn’t really the last few weeks that killed us – it’s the absolutely interminable failure to pick a true path between trying to win and rebuilding. Not playing Frank more, Dot more, calling up burke sooner – these are bad errors. (Not to mention Willy).

That said, i respect Hornacek but I don’t think he’s a good coach and so I think that was the right call. This summer is huge and will tell us a lot. How we handle Noah, Lee, KOQ and Kanter, plus the coaching hire, will say a lot about the real strategy of Mills and Perry.