How can anything hurt him? He's a firmly entrenched dictator and one of the richest people on earth, with one of the biggest militaries to command. Nothing can even touch him, and he can play his power games as he sees fit.

How can anything hurt him? He's a firmly entrenched dictator and one of the richest people on earth, with one of the biggest militaries to command. Nothing can even touch him, and he can play his power games as he sees fit.

Dude, it's obvious he is a sole ruler without opposition. It's obvious to anybody with an ounce of brain matter and we don't need the USki's to tell us that.

As for his riches, he has a whole country of 140 million people to siphon off from, with a wealthy oil industry. Are you so dumb to believe his story were he only has $200,000 and one appartment? People estimate his worth at $40 to $200 billion, and no, that's not just the BBC.

Quit being such a mindless fanboy.

Dude, it's obvious he is a sole ruler without opposition. It's obvious to anybody with an ounce of brain matter and we don't need the USki's to tell us that.

As for his riches, he has a whole country of 140 million people to siphon off from, with a wealthy oil industry. Are you so dumb to believe his story were he only has $200,000 and one appartment? People estimate his worth at $40 to $200 billion, and no, that's not just the BBC.

Stalin was worth an entire country. He owned everything in it, including the people.

Wow, you're getting pretty riled up here Mr Fanboy. Those people are all dumb, but YOU know the truth, exclusively, because you just LUUUUVV Putin SOOOOO MUCH!

Personally I think Putin is incredibly smart and capable. That's how he rose to power and he uses his capacities for his own good. That's how he collects lots of money, and not really in a legal way, but by coercion, that's just how it works in Russia. It's good to be king.

And not spending his money? Owning 20 palaces is not spending? 'mkay.

Stalin was worth an entire country. He owned everything in it, including the people.

Wow, you're getting pretty riled up here Mr Fanboy. Those people are all dumb, but YOU know the truth, exclusively, because you just LUUUUVV Putin SOOOOO MUCH!

Personally I think Putin is incredibly smart and capable. That's how he rose to power and he uses his capacities for his own good. That's how he collects lots of money, and not really in a legal way, but by coercion, that's just how it works in Russia. It's good to be king.

[quote user=Immac1]Stalin was worth an entire country. He owned everything in it, including the people.[/quote]

Yes, but how rich was he ? How much did he siphon from the people ?

You have said:"As for his riches, he has a whole country of 140 million people to siphon off from, with a wealthy oil industry. Are you so dumb to believe his story were he only has $200,000 and one appartment? People estimate his worth at $40 to $200 billion, and no, that's not just the BBC."

I interpreted this as STEALING. You know, stealing funds, hiding them in the swiss bank account, stuff like that.

And it made no fucking sense to me. It sounds fucking DUMB to me. So I am trying to understand you and explain my point, until we come to mutual conclusion.

To illustrate the point - how much did Stalin siphon from the people ?

Immac1 wrote:

Stalin was worth an entire country. He owned everything in it, including the people.

Yes, but how rich was he ? How much did he siphon from the people ?

You have said:"As for his riches, he has a whole country of 140 million people to siphon off from, with a wealthy oil industry. Are you so dumb to believe his story were he only has $200,000 and one appartment? People estimate his worth at $40 to $200 billion, and no, that's not just the BBC."

I interpreted this as STEALING. You know, stealing funds, hiding them in the swiss bank account, stuff like that.

And it made no fucking sense to me. It sounds fucking DUMB to me. So I am trying to understand you and explain my point, until we come to mutual conclusion.

To illustrate the point - how much did Stalin siphon from the people ?

When you interpreted it as STEALING, you interpreted it correctly. That's how it works, that's how it always worked. It's good to be king.

Medieval kings or Roman emperors just took what they want. If you had a problem with it, you got your head chopped off. Russia is a country where it still works like that too. Even modern politicians in democracies with lots of check and balances still do it, a bit of declarating here, a bit of moving funds around there, etc, etc. Only a minority get caught and they get -maybe- a slap on the wrist.

In a country like Russia where there are no checks and balances at all the leaders can do what they want. You can rest assured that Putin has a couple of Swiss bank accounts, and in the Caymans, and whatever tax haven you can think of next. Enough to live comfortably if he has to pack up and leave in some way. Not that that's likely, but you never know, clever to be prepared and as I said, I think Putin is very clever.

But while you're in power, there's no need to built a huge pile of gold, as long as you can get it when you need it. How much do guys like Stalin or Putin take? It's not like they're going to build an Uncle Scrooge warehouse full of money to swim in. Just get the thing you want when you want it, and declare it somewhere as "needed" for the job. Want a plane? Fine. Russian airforce provides. Putin can use it as if it was his own. Want a yacht? Fine, somebody will provide it. Want a billion dollar palace? Fine, some billionaire buddies of Putin provide it. What does it matter who really owns it on paper as Putin can live in it as if he owned it anyway?

So how much did Stalin take? No idea, but of course enough to live as he liked. He had no opposition, nobody to tell him he ought not to do it. You didn't say no to a man who send tens of millions to the gulag.

And Putin? He's been very well investigated actually, by lots of people and companies. And they've found many things and "possessions". It's not per se what he "owns", but more what he "controls". He's very secretive about his wealth, but they found he has high stakes in a couple of Russian oil industry giants worth at least $40 billion and maybe as high as $200 billion, though that last number is highly debated. He uses many of his buddies and employees as proxies, so he might have stakes in a lot more companies people can't directly uncover.So much that many people suspect he's in fact the richest individual on earth.

When you interpreted it as STEALING, you interpreted it correctly. That's how it works, that's how it always worked. It's good to be king.

Medieval kings or Roman emperors just took what they want. If you had a problem with it, you got your head chopped off. Russia is a country where it still works like that too. Even modern politicians in democracies with lots of check and balances still do it, a bit of declarating here, a bit of moving funds around there, etc, etc. Only a minority get caught and they get -maybe- a slap on the wrist.

In a country like Russia where there are no checks and balances at all the leaders can do what they want. You can rest assured that Putin has a couple of Swiss bank accounts, and in the Caymans, and whatever tax haven you can think of next. Enough to live comfortably if he has to pack up and leave in some way. Not that that's likely, but you never know, clever to be prepared and as I said, I think Putin is very clever.

But while you're in power, there's no need to built a huge pile of gold, as long as you can get it when you need it. How much do guys like Stalin or Putin take? It's not like they're going to build an Uncle Scrooge warehouse full of money to swim in. Just get the thing you want when you want it, and declare it somewhere as "needed" for the job. Want a plane? Fine. Russian airforce provides. Putin can use it as if it was his own. Want a yacht? Fine, somebody will provide it. Want a billion dollar palace? Fine, some billionaire buddies of Putin provide it. What does it matter who really owns it on paper as Putin can live in it as if he owned it anyway?

So how much did Stalin take? No idea, but of course enough to live as he liked. He had no opposition, nobody to tell him he ought not to do it. You didn't say no to a man who send tens of millions to the gulag.

And Putin? He's been very well investigated actually, by lots of people and companies. And they've found many things and "possessions". It's not per se what he "owns", but more what he "controls". He's very secretive about his wealth, but they found he has high stakes in a couple of Russian oil industry giants worth at least $40 billion and maybe as high as $200 billion, though that last number is highly debated. He uses many of his buddies and employees as proxies, so he might have stakes in a lot more companies people can't directly uncover.So much that many people suspect he's in fact the richest individual on earth.

Question 1:Now would you say that what you describe is POWER not MONEY ?

As in - absolute power and being interpereted by the same people who smear Putin as absolute power till he dies.

And next...

Question 2:Would you say the one who has absolute power until death has no need for money? And no need to siphon money ? (Unless he wants a platinum coffin, but let's be realistic)

Because money is just means to buy things and means to buy POWER over other people, is it not ?

Effectively what you are saying is that Putin is stealing from his left pocket and putting it in his right pocket, and both pockets belong to him anyway. And I have trouble understanding the whole idea.

Ok we are getting somewhere.

Slowly, but I have hopes for you.

Question 1:Now would you say that what you describe is POWER not MONEY ?

As in - absolute power and being interpereted by the same people who smear Putin as absolute power till he dies.

And next...

Question 2:Would you say the one who has absolute power until death has no need for money? And no need to siphon money ? (Unless he wants a platinum coffin, but let's be realistic)

Because money is just means to buy things and means to buy POWER over other people, is it not ?

Effectively what you are saying is that Putin is stealing from his left pocket and putting it in his right pocket, and both pockets belong to him anyway. And I have trouble understanding the whole idea.

You know they call it net WORTH, right? That includes all his assets. Do you think Bill Gates has a pile of 65 billion dollars laying around?

Would you say the one who has absolute power until death has no need for money?

I would not say that. People still need to get paid you know. Putin's minions still need to do their shopping at the grocery.

Effectively what you are saying is that Putin is stealing from his left pocket and putting it in his right pocket, and both pockets belong to him anyway.

Sure, keep making up your own stuff. That's not what I said for a second. All the wealth Putin accumulated first belonged to someone else. Some of them dead as a doornail, killed on Putin's orders. Or rotting in jail.

Ok we are getting somewhere.

You're not seriously hoping your delusional fanboyism is teaching ME something? Get real. Putin's a good thing for Russia, a good leader who gives Russians what they need. Doesn't mean he's still one mean bastard. He's a damn KGB spy, and those are mean bastards. But that's also what a leader needs to be in a country where the law of the jungle rules.

Why the fuck do you even need to see him as a saint? Are you that weak of a character you need a fucking hero in your life? Grow up. Be your own hero.

Now would you say that what you describe is POWER not MONEY ?

You know they call it net WORTH, right? That includes all his assets. Do you think Bill Gates has a pile of 65 billion dollars laying around?

Would you say the one who has absolute power until death has no need for money?

I would not say that. People still need to get paid you know. Putin's minions still need to do their shopping at the grocery.

Effectively what you are saying is that Putin is stealing from his left pocket and putting it in his right pocket, and both pockets belong to him anyway.

Sure, keep making up your own stuff. That's not what I said for a second. All the wealth Putin accumulated first belonged to someone else. Some of them dead as a doornail, killed on Putin's orders. Or rotting in jail.

Ok we are getting somewhere.

You're not seriously hoping your delusional fanboyism is teaching ME something? Get real. Putin's a good thing for Russia, a good leader who gives Russians what they need. Doesn't mean he's still one mean bastard. He's a damn KGB spy, and those are mean bastards. But that's also what a leader needs to be in a country where the law of the jungle rules.

Why the fuck do you even need to see him as a saint? Are you that weak of a character you need a fucking hero in your life? Grow up. Be your own hero.

"Machiavellianism" is widely used as a negative term to characterize unscrupulous politicians of the sort Machiavelli described most famously in The Prince. Machiavelli described immoral behavior, such as dishonesty and the killing of innocents, as being normal and effective in politics. He even seemed to encourage it in some situations. The book gained notoriety due to claims that it teaches "evil recommendations to tyrants to help them maintain their power".

Stealing was like kindergarten stuff to Machiavelli. He was fine with killing whole cities of innocent people, as long as it served a purpose for the ruler. You think he had a problem with stealing?

"Machiavellianism" is widely used as a negative term to characterize unscrupulous politicians of the sort Machiavelli described most famously in The Prince. Machiavelli described immoral behavior, such as dishonesty and the killing of innocents, as being normal and effective in politics. He even seemed to encourage it in some situations. The book gained notoriety due to claims that it teaches "evil recommendations to tyrants to help them maintain their power".

Stealing was like kindergarten stuff to Machiavelli. He was fine with killing whole cities of innocent people, as long as it served a purpose for the ruler. You think he had a problem with stealing?