Our Demo and rental skis are getting wrecked, far worse than normal. We are seeing a much higher incidence of core shots and pulled out edges, and outright broken skis. Customers equipment as well...

So, are skis becoming more fragile and less durable than in years past? IDK, has the ultralight trend gone too far?

Or

Are skiers attitudes and habits causing this? Is it that people just don't care if they ski in the rocks or avoid obstacles? Is it the mentality that "It's a rental, who cares?" ? What really gets to me, is that renters, will argue with you about ski damage that they are clearly responsible for. They blame the ski or the conditions, when confronted with a bill for repair.

I get that accidents happen, and sometimes rock damage is unavoidable. But, most of the time, damage can be avoided if you are paying attention. As the guy that repairs and tunes skis for a living, I very, very, rarely get any damage to my skis when I am skiing. I ski very aggressively, but I certainly pay attention to the snow conditions and where I put my skis.

Curious, what folks on this forum think.

Are skis just fragile?

Do you have experience with ski brands that are tough and resist edge blow outs and/or core shots?

This isn't about rocks....but yesterday late in the day, I apparently skied right over fencing and sort of skied over the wooden pole that lifties were rolling up as part of lift closing procedures. I say apparently because while I saw the roll on the side and the lightweight wooden pole on the ground, I didn't see anything on the ground except for the pole at the very last minute because I was looking at the bigger object ahead, the lift. The liftie was pissed off at me, and my friend agrees that I really did ski over the fence, but I don't think I did and didn't see anything because I'm 5' tall and don't have a great angle to seeing something flat on ground that is also flat. Yes, I came in too fast to change direction over the pole, and I actually thought I was going to bite it when one ski went over it, so that is my fault. But I never saw the fencing and can only assume it was on the ground?

All a long way of saying I think people don't see a lot of the obstacles underfoot or are already committed to a direction when they do see it.

I think there may be a "cool" factor in riding over some rocks. "Dude, did you see that face? I think I must have hit 6 rocks on the way down. Heheh!" "DUDE YOU KILLED IT!"
I can't speak to the rental end of it but it seems with the advent of "big mountain" skiing lots of folks are willing to sacrifice equipment for the "big" run, whether it's big mountain or that little lip that's barely covering a rock. We saw a telemarker come down a run a few weeks ago. He was under the lift and we could see the rock on the downhill side but he couldn't see it from above. He slid over the top and went straight to rock for about 3'. Ghastly noise! If he didn't pull his edge out those were tough skis!

Another story was when I was at the Moment factory. They do lifetime edges and waxing, plus base repair. A kid came in with his park skis and the Moment guy asked if he skied more on the hill or in the parking lot. The bases looked like someone took a rasp to them. Bent edges, deep gouges, just generally abused, not used.

I would say stop whining and put up a sign in your shop telling people not to ski in the parking lot, that’s the #1cause I see on rentals.

If they are rentals you could charge for excessive wear and tear, although it might backfire if you get pushback from the customer. If the damage is from customers who are willing to pay for repairs, embrace it.
Here in Big Sky we call it the price of battle and honestly it’s inevitable. Damage is going to happen sooner or later, even with 400 inches annually.

Would love to know how to avoid the rocks when they’re lurking under 12 inches freshly fallen snow and you just happened to hang one up on a iceberg.

Picking my skis up later today after a massive core shot on Friday, the damage left a flap so big it was an e-brake, had to cut it off mid run just to keep moving.
It was a super sweet run until till that happened.

Even if you're careful with your line choice you can hit a good number of rocks as your turns uncover things you didn't realize were there. Even in a very high tide year, on high-traffic trails, I still uncovered stuff hidden under the windbuff yesterday. It happens without malfeasance or abuse.

There are some manufacturers who make extra durable skis (on3p and Jskis are the only people using 1.8mm 4000-series durasurf bases) and on3p uses 2.5mm edges (most use 2.2mm or smaller). In a shop context, the durablity to cost benefit I doubt is worth the extra $$$.

I remember at Alta once we were standing looking how to get around a huge rock outcrop. Then two guys came and skied straight over the rock without pausing and kept going. I'd say we were totally schooled. We hadn't even considered there was such a school.

When I'm skiing., I am very careful to avoid the rocks. Some places ( I'm thinking of Mt Ste Anne in my youth) have a lot of rocks in the early and late season where its pretty much unavoidable
In the construction business, we have a saying, " Don't be gentle, Its a rental" Its why you always initial the damage waiver!!

If I see rocks, I try to avoid them. Still, I used almost 3 P-tex candles on one pair of skis from last season, used about 8 times, on blue and green groomers. There were a lot of thin spots last year.

If there's something I really want to ski, I'm not going to let a few rocks stop me.

The Cirque at Snowbird is a great example. The ridge above the Cirque is super windswept and regardless of how much cover the mountain has, there are always exposed rocks. If if you refused to ski over rocks to get to it, you'd never ski it, and you'd miss some of the best skiing on the mountain.

Another example was early season at Alta this year. 20" powder day but with typical early season cover underneath. The snow was super light, and it wasn't hard to hit the bottom even with that much snow, and sometimes the bottom was a rock. Also, High T was a rocky mess in parts, but navigating through it delivered the goods on the other side. I guess I could have skied on the groomers all day and avoided the couple of core shots I picked up, but I also would have missed skiing some awesome snow and great terrain - the hour it took me to repair and tune my skis when I got them home was worth it.

I do my best to avoid them sometimes shit happens. As far as the skis are concerned though, I think they are more durable than they have ever been. I'm kind of amazed at how much they can take. In the '80's it was a nightly ritual to light up a P-tex candle.

I'm more worried about my edges than the ptex; core shots are easy to fix and if repaired right do not effect the the ski performance, but edges, a rolled edge is not easily revived and performance on ice suffers.

Let's all try hard not to be offended. With 7 billion souls running around, it's easy to trample. Take the high road; smile; life's too short.

We have a little "black diamond" glade run at the small bump where I patrol. It's seldom open due to the amount of rocks and the amount of snow we get. In the past I have been so tempted by it that I have gone in and scratched my skis. Now even though it is very tempting and my favorite run on the hill, I won't ski it until there is way more snow cover, but the kids go in and scratch up their skis. They have no self control. I suspect a lot of adults are in the same boat.

When I rented demos I avoided the rocky runs. Not all folk seem to have the same respect for someone else's property.