tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post2529533776471763335..comments2018-03-19T10:15:34.797-05:00Comments on Althouse: It's not unconstitutional to make voters show a photo ID.Ann Althousehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01630636239933008807noreply@blogger.comBlogger157125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-64203250078783314262008-04-29T16:36:00.000-05:002008-04-29T16:36:00.000-05:00require every voter to show up at the Board of Ele...<I>require every voter to show up at the Board of Election to reregister in person to get a voter registration card with photo.</I><BR/><BR/>Works for me.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-48692693088440841982008-04-29T12:55:00.000-05:002008-04-29T12:55:00.000-05:00... who then proceeded to click on "Publish Your C...... who then proceeded to click on "Publish Your Comments". Heh.Jeremyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14135112906704619414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-2141522226428732062008-04-29T12:45:00.000-05:002008-04-29T12:45:00.000-05:00Holy crap! MadisonMan was killed by an illegal vot...Holy crap! MadisonMan was killed by an illegal voter!blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05430444326700437630noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-50889481486156990902008-04-29T09:01:00.000-05:002008-04-29T09:01:00.000-05:00What's amazing to me is that Democrats are willing...<I>What's amazing to me is that Democrats are willing to believe in widespread conspiracies to rig votes, even to deliberately rig voting *machines*</I><BR/><BR/>If it makes you feel better, I don't believe such conspiracies. I think they are possible -- just like it's possible for someone to vote when they shouldn't 'cause they don't have to show no steenkin' ID -- but it's also possible that a meteorite will come through my roof just as I'm finishing writing this and strike me and kiMadisonManhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01212179466758420208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-27899181785245563662008-04-29T08:51:00.000-05:002008-04-29T08:51:00.000-05:00Considering that a drivers license is no proof of ...Considering that a drivers license is no proof of citizenship, require every voter to show up at the Board of Election to reregister in person to get a voter registration card with photo. Then the playing field would be somewhat leveled. Open the Board of election from 7 am to 7 pm the first Tuesday of every month for this purpose, as practice for voting.former law studenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15196697206046544350noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-7429351853808538492008-04-29T03:23:00.000-05:002008-04-29T03:23:00.000-05:00Well, it really makes it transparent that they're ...Well, it really makes it transparent that they're only concerned about voter fraud when it's done by the other side.<BR/><BR/>Of course, it was the outrage (OUTRAGE!) over 2000 that spurred on all the changes that the Dems claimed made it easier for Reps to rig elections.blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05430444326700437630noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-71673795471696468472008-04-29T02:58:00.000-05:002008-04-29T02:58:00.000-05:00I'm positive it's done. I'm pretty sure nobody's b...<I>I'm positive it's done. I'm pretty sure nobody's been sent to jail for it.</I><BR/><BR/>What's amazing to me is that Democrats are willing to believe in widespread conspiracies to rig votes, even to deliberately rig voting *machines* (presumably with the cooperation of the technicians who program them) in order to steal an election. But the simple act of anonymously voting under an assumed name at a poll where nobody's checking ID? That's just too far-fetched to consider, apparently!Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-30489695915489454532008-04-29T02:55:00.000-05:002008-04-29T02:55:00.000-05:00There are other ways to catch people, and the trut...<I>There are other ways to catch people, and the truth is nobody is going to be dumb enough to risk prison to cast a single vote.</I><BR/><BR/>There's no risk. You go in, give one of the phony names you registered under, and vote. Repeatedly. There's no way for you to get caught doing it, because nobody checks your ID.<BR/><BR/><I>Not when you can do 100 times more by engaging in mail-vote fraud</I><BR/><BR/>You can steal 100 times as much from a bank as from a convenience store. I guess nobody robs convenience stores.<BR/><BR/>Besides, there are two reasons not to do that. First, the FBI investigates mail fraud, while local fraud at the polls is investigated by... well, nobody, usually, but local cops otherwise. The second reason is that, as I noted above, mail-in fraud is potentially easier to detect because members of the opposite party scrutinize those ballots.<BR/><BR/><I>or even decide who wins the election by hacking into the computers.</I><BR/><BR/>Meanwhile, back here in reality, you can't.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-22147903617747197872008-04-29T02:32:00.000-05:002008-04-29T02:32:00.000-05:00There are other ways to catch people, and the trut...<I>There are other ways to catch people, and the truth is nobody is going to be dumb enough to risk prison to cast a single vote. </I><BR/><BR/>I'd say the risk is minimal. <BR/><BR/>If anyone wants to know how you do this, it's pretty simple: Get the voter rolls. It's public information.<BR/><BR/>Get the voter record for the past elections. Also public information.<BR/><BR/>Find out which registered voters haven't voted. Some people register and <I>never</I> vote, some haven't voted since Dewey beat Truman, some only vote in the general election, etc.<BR/><BR/>This is how campaigns target mailers, but you can use it for voter fraud, too!<BR/><BR/>I'm positive it's done. I'm pretty sure nobody's been sent to jail for it.blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05430444326700437630noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-2483193636285327492008-04-29T02:14:00.000-05:002008-04-29T02:14:00.000-05:00Revenant:There are other ways to catch people, and...Revenant:<BR/><BR/>There are other ways to catch people, and the truth is nobody is going to be dumb enough to risk prison to cast a single vote. Not when you can do 100 times more by engaging in mail-vote fraud, or even decide who wins the election by hacking into the computers.<BR/><BR/>For that matter, many counties use voting equipment made by Sequoia or Smart-Matyc. And who owns those companies? A company which is an arm of the government of Venezuela, that's who. So here you are worrying about whether one voter will risk a felony conviction in order to cast one vote, when Hugo Chavez has the source code to machines used in American elections and could be determining the winner ahead of time, and none of us would even have a clue if he did.Eli Blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00792743206074537073noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-17164447616968453072008-04-28T23:37:00.000-05:002008-04-28T23:37:00.000-05:00It'd be worth it. I wouldn't care if we had illega...It'd be worth it. I wouldn't care if we had illegal voters if they couldn't vote solutions to problems that weren't proven to be problems.<BR/><BR/><I>That would work in a small town, but in Los Angeles the likelihood of being "known" by a poll worker would be slim to none.</I><BR/><BR/>The odds of me even seeing anyone I know at a polling place (working, voting, driving by on the street) are, in practice, about 20-to-1.blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05430444326700437630noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-4797048656906076322008-04-28T22:49:00.000-05:002008-04-28T22:49:00.000-05:00I'd be all for it if they did.But in this case tha...<I>I'd be all for it if they did.</I><BR/><BR/>But in this case that's a catch-22. Opponents of the ID law are demanding that we prove the people voting aren't who they say they are... before they'll let us check whether or not the people are who they say they are. You obviously can't catch people voting under a phony identity if there's no system in place to check people's identity when they vote.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-50497774539215586652008-04-28T22:19:00.000-05:002008-04-28T22:19:00.000-05:00george grady:Man, if the legislature had to prove ...george grady:<BR/><BR/><I>Man, if the legislature had to prove there was a problem before they passed laws...</I><BR/><BR/>I'd be all for it if they did. Don't even get me started on laws and regulations that were written by legislators who just 'knew' there was a problem and have resulted in horrific and unforeseen consequences. I could provide you with some real doozies.<BR/><BR/>In fact I'd be for an amendment that legislators could only write new restrictions on either individuals or businesses ONLY if they had documentation that there was in fact a problem.Eli Blakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00792743206074537073noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-62555818846982461472008-04-28T21:50:00.000-05:002008-04-28T21:50:00.000-05:00In Lake County, IL (just south of Kenosha County, ...In Lake County, IL (just south of Kenosha County, WI) the county clerk sends a registration card with precinct number, US congressional district, state congressional and senatorial districts, library, school, whatever districts that one may be in are noted on the card. Also noted is one's polling place. These cards are especially handy if one's polling place is home to more than one precinct (as is mine) one has a handy reference to the correct precinct number saving the embarrassment of finding that one has gone to the wrong table...<BR/><BR/>The county clerk sends out a new card if there is a change in district boundaries or in the polling place location.<BR/><BR/>If your districts or polling place haven't changed, there's no need to send a new one. You may have received something when you first registered.kimschhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15742219426291395677noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-76693735613874559602008-04-28T20:50:00.000-05:002008-04-28T20:50:00.000-05:00I vote in Madison WI and I don't even recognize th...I vote in Madison WI and I don't even recognize these registration cards people are talking about. I show nothing. I'm asked for nothing but my name. They find my name, and then they ask <I>me</I> if I live at the address on their list.Original Mikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01714345479248980398noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-25956533003141266652008-04-28T20:20:00.000-05:002008-04-28T20:20:00.000-05:00Martin, there's also the tactic of putting entirel...Martin, there's also the tactic of putting entirely bogus people on the voting rolls, like ACORN got busted for doing during the last election.<BR/><BR/>Now there are two possibilities:<BR/><BR/>(1): They were registering fake people to vote just for the pure joy of breaking the law, or<BR/><BR/>(2): They actually planned to have people cast votes using those phony registrations.<BR/><BR/>If you've got phony names on the rolls you have to either mail in absentee ballots (which are likely to be scrutinized by members of the opposing party at some point), or vote at the polls under the fake name. Photo ID makes it much, much harder to pull off the latter kind of fraud.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-90692755577751421752008-04-28T20:01:00.000-05:002008-04-28T20:01:00.000-05:00Actually now that I think on this. If I don't have...Actually now that I think on this. If I don't have to prove to the poll worker that I am John Doe, why should I have to register at all? Why can't I simply just say I'm a US citizen with no felony convictions and be done with it? Isn't the actual act of registering a poll tax in essence? Don't I have to expend time and money to go and get registered? Didn't I have to prove I am who I claimed I was when I registered?<BR/><BR/>I find it stunning that the Democrats can mobilize the minions to get all the poor, disabled, minorities and every other segement of their voting bloc to the polls but somehow getting a photo ID is akin to achieving moon landing.Hoosier Daddyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12872965118921894534noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-3333509533285129032008-04-28T19:55:00.000-05:002008-04-28T19:55:00.000-05:00I live and vote in Indiana. I can't speak for any ...<I>I live and vote in Indiana. I can't speak for any of the other precincts in my state, but where I have voted under this law, this is how it worked.</I><BR/><BR/>Last time I voted I have my name and handed my card to the old biddy sitting at the table with the roll book. She matched my name up to my driver's license.<BR/><BR/>Evidently different strokes for different voters.<BR/><BR/>Ok I tried to rhyme it.Hoosier Daddyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12872965118921894534noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-17944396534986410302008-04-28T19:51:00.000-05:002008-04-28T19:51:00.000-05:00Michael, that event was from 2005. Was anyone eve...Michael, that event was from 2005. Was anyone ever charged? Whatever did happen to that?<BR/><BR/>It was unnerving to read the article and see John Gard (R-Peshtigo). Ack, what a skeeze right out of the Chvala-Jensen mold. And he's running again for Congress!MadisonManhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01212179466758420208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-81820314396625891572008-04-28T19:32:00.000-05:002008-04-28T19:32:00.000-05:00Then I put my ID away and walk over to the table w...<I>Then I put my ID away and walk over to the table where I give my name and they find me in the books and I sign.<BR/><BR/>Then I vote.<BR/><BR/>I am at a loss as to what fraud is being prevented by the addition of the ID check. They don't even verify that the address on the ID is in the precinct.</I><BR/><BR/>Rich, let me help you out here: suppose the local Dem precinct captain wanted to have Willy Wino cast a ballot using the registration of the recently deceased Rich Beckman. In the absence of the (admittedly perfunctory) ID check you just described, this little voter fraud could be accomplished for the price of a ham sandwich and a ride to your polling place. Thus, it would seem that a simple photo ID check removes an entire class of chicanery at minimal cost. Honestly, this is just common sense. Indeed, it's hard to understand how a trivial photo ID check of the kind nearly EVERYONE in society encounters on a daily basis (as delineated in several posts on this thread) suddenly becomes onerous solely in the context of balloting, without appealing to the possibility that some people just find a fraud friendly voting process advantageous.Martin Galehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13057633537308638250noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-50349136967327234132008-04-28T19:05:00.000-05:002008-04-28T19:05:00.000-05:00No. Only a voter registration card can do that.You...<I>No. Only a voter registration card can do that.</I><BR/><BR/>You need a voter registration too, of course. But voter registration by itself isn't enough to establish a person as qualified to vote -- you must also establish that the person showing up to vote is the same one who registered. That's where photo ID comes in.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-36639118497002883562008-04-28T18:21:00.000-05:002008-04-28T18:21:00.000-05:00"Harper v. Virginia Board of Elections"Just anothe..."Harper v. Virginia Board of Elections"<BR/><BR/>Just another BS decision by the Warren Court. In summary, we don't like the Poll tax so its unconstitutional -because we say so.rcoceanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17102201338319611538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-18558216112985607602008-04-28T18:20:00.000-05:002008-04-28T18:20:00.000-05:00Photo ID, on the other hand, has a glaringly obvio...<I>Photo ID, on the other hand, has a glaringly obvious relation to voting qualifications. It identifies you as being qualified to vote.</I><BR/><BR/>No. Only a voter registration card can do that.former law studenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15196697206046544350noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-48103670634204489922008-04-28T17:55:00.000-05:002008-04-28T17:55:00.000-05:00to repeat, wealth or fee paying has, in our view, ...<I>to repeat, wealth or fee paying has, in our view, no relation to voting qualifications</I><BR/><BR/>Photo ID, on the other hand, has a glaringly obvious relation to voting qualifications. It identifies you as being qualified to vote. :)Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-61874210754685387802008-04-28T17:45:00.000-05:002008-04-28T17:45:00.000-05:00Laws impeding voting must comply with Art. I, § 2,...Laws impeding voting must comply with Art. I, § 2, of the Constitution and the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.<BR/><BR/>From <I>Harper v. Virginia Board of Elections</I> which struck down the poll tax:<BR/><BR/><I>We have long been mindful that, where fundamental rights and liberties are asserted under the Equal Protection Clause, classifications which might invade or restrain them must be closely scrutinized and carefully confined. See, e.g., Skinner v. Oklahoma, 316 U.S. 535, 541; Reynolds v. Sims, 377 U.S. 533, 561-562; Carrington v. Rash, supra; Baxstrom v. Herold, ante p. 107; Cox v. Louisiana, 379 U.S. 536, 580-581 (BLACK, J., concurring).<BR/><BR/>Those principles apply here. For, to repeat, wealth or fee paying has, in our view, no relation to voting qualifications; the right to vote is too precious, too fundamental to be so burdened or conditioned.</I><BR/><BR/>Of course that was a vastly different Supreme Court back then.former law studenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15196697206046544350noreply@blogger.com