EVENTS

Hilarity

Gosh. Paula Kirby made a funny on Twitter.

Paula Kirby‏@PaulaSKirby

Ladies and gentlemen, may I request a moment of silence in honour of CrucifixionPlus (Restored). pic.twitter.com/17wLZhof

That’s kind of startling. As I said before, when she called me a Feminazi and Femistasi and part of the Sisterhood of the Oppressed, I liked her a lot when I met her at QED. She was friendly to me, and I thought we’d had a good rapport – or to put it another way, I thought the liking was reasonably mutual. Clearly it wasn’t.

Fine; nobody has to like anybody. On the other hand, calling people totalitarians and Nazis and Stasi (when they’re not)? And circulating sneery caricatures? That’s…well it’s not very adult, for a start. And it’s nasty.

I’ve said this before too, but I’ll say this again too. I’m supposed to be such a monster, but I don’t do shit like that.

You’re looking very regal Ophelia. I know her intent is nasty but without that context it’s pretty funny and if you didn’t know the backstory you wouldn’t know it was meant to be mocking. So a bit of a failure on that front. I’d get it on a t shirt or buy the poster. Funds to Atheism Plus.

(and if she complained about using the image we could squeal about false DCMA claims and copyright enforcement as the greatest threat to freedom known ha ha)

Ophelia, I’m sorry that Kirby has escalated from insults to flat out harassment. It’s so easy to caricature people we don’t like as “monsters” who deserve the hatred thrown at them, but people–no matter how horrible we feel they act–are still real humans with real feelings. I don’t know how much her actions affect you, but I can imagine that it doesn’t feel good to be demonized.

What exactly was she even going for with this one? That you guys are somehow secretly Christian? Forget the fact that it’s not funny because it’s malicious and childish and badly done, it’s not funny because it doesn’t even make sense!

On an uplifting (but off topic note), this reminds me of a Robertson Davies’ novel in which an art forger paints The Wedding at Cana, but gives all of the people in the picture the faces of his relatives and friends. Kind of a cool book. (And Canadian, so one half of one diversity point for me.)

I have resigned myself to the fact that I will never understand the time and effort that so many people seem to pour into hating on others. It exasperates me to contemplate such wasted effort (the time! the resources! egad!) but having them continue to prove our points for us certainly lightens our load a bit. Ah, silver linings.

I like it. It made me smile. PZ’s adorable and I like how she did you, Ophelia, even is she meant it in a negative way and I’m probably not looking at it the way she means it. However she means it. For having issues between you two, she did a great job with photoshop, except with the sloppiness of Rebecca, whether she meant to or not. I think laughing, not taking insult by it, and moving on would be the best thing to do, regardless of her intent. Is it really worth getting upset about someone photoshopping in this manner? I think, personally, there’s more in this world to worry about than a silly picture, but that’s just me.

It is just so very high school, isn’t it? And clearly, Kirby has a sad because hardly anybody really gives half a shit about her, so the only way she can get anyone to pay attention to her is to associate herself with FtB. I’m going to be charitable and feel sorry for her, and it makes me feel less angry!

(and if she complained about using the image we could squeal about false DCMA claims and copyright enforcement as the greatest threat to freedom known ha ha)

Hang about she is neither a US citizen nor a US resident and the image was not published in the US so how is the DCMA relevant? Copyright is another matter, under Scottish law she would probably have to use the fair comment defence to justify publishing the image in the first place and she would hardly be in a position to object to anyone else publishing it.

I once had a soft spot for our Paula after she referred to me as her knight in shining armour. I have to admit that the glowing feeling has been fading somewhat recently.

@Mriana (#22)
One, don’t lecture people based on what you assume their emotions are (upset, worrying, insulted). Two, don’t tell people how to deal with attack-y shit. If there’s a more effective method, just present the evidence for it. Three, this is hardly a random, isolated incident. It’s a hell of a lot harder to move on when the influx of shit like this is unending and targeted at you. Four, why don’t you go tell the people who made it “there’s more in this world to worry about than a silly picture”?

This is what we have been reduced to. Answering mockeries made by what should be allies. How utterly appalling and ridiculous. I have been subjected to these for the last year but mine have been by someone I know to be mentally unstable. When I see these being disseminated by people that have been former friends and others that I admired for their work and achievements I am just flabbergasted.

This reminds me of when the nuts at Age of Autism shooped a picture of a bunch of scientists eating a baby for the crime of believing the high quality evidence that vaccines _don’t_ cause autism instead of their testimonials and anecdotes.

And in the process, you’ve made Kirby look like more of an irrational jerk than she did when you previously bullied her into calling you a “feminazi” and “femistasi” by totally taking away her ability to offer any dissent to your opinions.

And now you get to blog–again–about stuff you’ve bullied Kirby into doing–and make more people aware of how nasty and immature Kirby is.

At least it’s not prima facie horrible like the one from the TIME cover–or, in other words, this one is so fucking inept that it doesn’t even communicate anything! Of course, that doesn’t take away from the sentiments behind this ‘shop, and how they are manifesting these attitudes in many other ways, and the fact that people are stooping to this level of bullshit to discredit the values of equality.

That said, if I saw this without any context, I would assume this was made by a fan to mean something about how you’re all de-fanging religion with your brilliant mockery, and I would find it pretty hilarious (although, yes, the photoshop job on Rebecca is just plain disappointing and detracts from the work as a whole). In some kind of bizarro-world way, on that level I kind of like it…even though I know that’s not what it actually means!

It seems fairly clear this silly Photoshop didn’t originate with Paula Kirby. Why she is tweeting it? – I guess it’s just more of the reality inversion field of the #FTBullies hashtag, which has long since stopped being about how a subset of the bloggers on FTB have supposedly been unjustifiably mean and nasty to other people in the atheist movement who don’t share social justice concerns, and has instead become a conduit for the really nasty haters to peddle their bullying of the FTB bloggers and Skepchicks. Paula’s tweet wasn’t on that hashtag – but it’s of a piece with the infantile stuff that’s been going around, like the reworked cover of Time magazine featuring PZ and Rebecca.

So, this picture just reinforces that you all are atheists plus skeptics, right? I mean, Jesus is dead and you want to collect the evidence. Pretty clear to me.

We are…
Atheists plus we use critical thinking and skepticism.

The next painting is of PZ and the FTB tech team setting up a Google+ (ooh, there’s that symbol again) stream to record anyone tampering with the tomb. You gotta stop those urban legends before they get out of hand.

Ah, I like bad jokes. But there is one condition: they have to make me laugh.
Alas PK’s work fails in this respect. Not even the smallest muscle in my face tended to quiver.
So thumbs down. Point (whatever it was supposed to be) not made.

Anybody who resorts to tactics of desperation like this has to be a real loser. Dembski is a loser, and it now looks as though he KNOWS it. My guess is that he will try to take it down when he realizes how foolish it makes him look.

Wow. Just… wow. Until recently, I never had an opinion about Paula Kirby, but this is just vindictive and mean. The anti-A+’ers seem to have some incredible drive to attack, denigrate, and ridicule. On the plus side (see what I did there?), each time they do this, it just adds that much momentum, energy, and justification to the A+ movement.

Jafafa Hots says:
August 30, 2012 at 6:52 pm
…….I’m so old I can remember when trolls confined themselves to comments on others’ blogs….

Think yourself lucky. I’m so old I remember when trolls confined themselves to living under a bridge and harassing that noisy pest Billy-Goat Gruff for trip-trip-trapping over said bridge and keeping the trolls awake. They were the days when one could feel sympathy for the trolls, but boy have they changed? I blame the interweb.

Clearly, to this day I had a great flaw in my language skills. For all this time I heard that FTB were ridiculous bullies who engage in insults, ad homs and such and the other side, especially Paula Kirby engaged in reasonable, polite, honest discourse.
Now I think I fundamentally missunderstood the words:
-ridiculous
-bully
-insult
-ad hominem (and that’s not even English)
-reasonable
-polite
-honest
-discourse.
English as a foreign language sucks.

Paula Kirby is seeming more and more like one of those tedious ex-patriot types who have been all over, haven’t learned a thing anywhere, and who spend all their time drinking and whining about The Natives.

It’s like listening to my English neighbor, who informs me that Spanish speakers who pronounce a double L as a Y are simply WRONG, that’s all. I didn’t even bring up the Puerto Ricans who pronounce double L as a J. They’re obviously just BEING DIVISIVE!! 😉

The RObertson Davies book is “What’s Bred in the Bone,” which is part of The Cornish Trilogy: “The Rebel Angels”, “What’s Bred in the Bone”, and “The Lyre of Orpheus.” My favorite of his completed trilogies, actually, though I’ll read any of ’em any day of the week.

I don’t think Paula Kirby is evil, but she seems compelled to defend her side in arguments, regardless of facts, and regardless of who she makes allies with. She did it before, during the Richard Dawkins forum fiasco. I don’t think the fact that her side (i.e. Josh Timonen) succeeded in utterly destroying the forum (plus the little matter of him embezzling money from the foundation) really mattered to her. As she put it herself, “this is war”.

This seems to separate me from the more hardcore people on the Other Team, who have to think that the putative “bullies” of FTB and Skepchick (make a sign of the cross and hiss) really are “evil,” because why else would they set aside time every single day to obsess about them (us)?

I don’t think Paula Kirby is “evil” either. In many ways I think she’s swell. She does good work; she’s an excellent writer. She was nothing but friendly to me in person – actively friendly, tapping me on the shoulder to introduce herself friendly, treating me and Author and Rhys and Paul to lunch friendly.

But what can I say? Clearly she also has a little well of nastiness, and she indulges it when she gets pissed off enough. She’s also not fair-minded (when she gets pissed off enough). She doesn’t say X has some good qualities but. She skips that part.

@hyperdeath, you’re saying two things in your comment – the latter of which I strongly take issue with:

I don’t think the fact that her side (i.e. Josh Timonen) succeeded in utterly destroying the forum

You seem to be saying that the decision to close the RD forum was made by Josh. What is your source for this information that it was even his call to make? I’ve heard Elisabeth Cornwell state publicly that the decision to close the forum was made by the Foundation’s Trustees . Josh may have been tasked with executing but this is beside the point.

I’m going to be optimistic and say it is a good sign really – how can anyone claim to be against bullies when they indulge in such activities? How can anyone but a few nutters take them seriously when they are actively comparing FtBs and bloggers to the Nazis!

I thought Godwinning was something sceptics avoided as an example of ridiculous hyperbole and a lost argument. At the moment it is their favourite meme – can only lead to more reduction in credibility really. The more extreme they get the less moderate or undecided people will take any notice of them – which has got to be a good thing

I’m going to be optimistic and say it is a good sign really – how can anyone claim to be against bullies when they indulge in such activities? How can anyone but a few nutters take them seriously when they are actively comparing FtBs and bloggers to the Nazis!

How? By saying that whoever made the caricature is smaller than the dreaded gigantic all-powerful “bullies” of FTB and Skepchick (make a sign of the cross and hiss). Of course it’s pretty absurd to try to claim that Paula is smaller, given that she’s a regular on the Washington Post blog and, you know, the head of RDF UK…But no problema, because whoever made the caricature is no bigger than an ant. No really.

You seem to be saying that the decision to close the RD forum was made by Josh.

I didn’t mean to imply that. However, Timonen (assisted by Kirby) was the one who turned it into a fiasco. A normal person would have cooperated with the offers to reestablish the forum under a different name elsewhere. Timonen pursued a salted-earth campaign, where anyone who criticized the move had their profiles and entire posting histories deleted.

A normal person would have cooperated with the offers to reestablish the forum under a different name elsewhere.

Not sure that starting a forum elsewhere is something that requires permission-especially under a different name. But assuming that RDF needed to provide said permission, again it seems to me that this is something for the Trustees, given that they made the original decision to shut it down.

Dawkins’s position is that Timonen is guilty

So what you are saying now is that Dawkins himself has made such a statement on the record after the case was dismissed?

Your original comment was “(plus the little matter of him embezzling money from the foundation)” without any qualifier which seems to indicate that this was your opinion.

Even *knowing* the back-story, the pic still struck me as funny at first sight — I think because I can’t see point being made, or how it relates to the back-story. Adopting (for the sake of desperately attempting to understand the message) the POV that FTB/A+ is a nasty exclusionary cabal, then….?

I think I can see the intended point of the image. The corpse is AtheismPlus and the image as a whole represents a forlorn attempt to breathe life into the idea. –Graham

But that doesn’t fit with what comes next in the story, does it? It also doesn’t address why the “restoration” is photoshopped in there. Nah, it is most likely they were trying to insult FTB bloggers by comparing them to followers of a silly cult.

Still, I think it can work the other way if you see it as what atheists will do to a freshly crucified god: expose him as a piece of fiction, a mere painting. And they do it all with a smile. Those in the top row are all laughing at you for believing that the deity was real, some more than others. “Heehee. It was nothing more than a painting all along.” “We did try to tell you.” The bottom row are poking and prodding the deity in jest. Rebecca: “You actually thought this [she gestures] was real?” Jennifer: “Does this tickle?” Greta: “Ohh, does someone have a booboo?”

Still, I think it can work the other way if you see it as what atheists will do to a freshly crucified god: expose him as a piece of fiction, a mere painting. And they do it all with a smile. Those in the top row are all laughing at you for believing that the deity was real, some more than others. “Heehee. It was nothing more than a painting all along.” “We did try to tell you.” The bottom row are poking and prodding the deity in jest. Rebecca: “You actually thought this [she gestures] was real?” Jennifer: “Does this tickle?” Greta: “Ohh, does someone have a booboo?”

Even knowing the backstory, this was my first take on it, too; especially with the ‘fixed’ Jesus face symbolizing the many faces of Christianity?