Hi eDOC, just thought I'd give you an update. My wife and I have been taking 30 ml. a day like you recommended. I found a pharmaceutical grade for less than 40$ a gallon. After awhile we stopped smelling, at least no one complains about it anymore. It still makes me shudder when I swallow it because it tastes horrible! I mix in 5 grams vitamin c, 3 grams lysine, 1gram proline, and 5 grams MSM. I'm 53 and sore muscles are a thing of the past. I never need it topically anymore. And my presbyopia is still gone. I drink it first thing in the morning with no issues, whether I eat right afterwards or not. I wonder though, I brush my teeth right afterwards to remove the taste. Do you think it could be a bad idea due to the plastic bristles? Anyway, thanks for your help and advice. Hope all is well!

Hi there confused1,I'm glad to hear that both of you are doing well. No issues using DMSO with plastic bristles brush.Since you both are in good health, and been taking 30 mL for a while, I'd recommend cutting it to 15 mL.Thanks for asking, I'm doing fine, very occupied, might not be frequent visitor till end March.Have a great evening and Good luck!

eDOC!!

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EDIT:

I'd suggest taking Lysine separately, not with it.

Rookie, rusty, subaverage doc but one that gives results. But do remember no freebies. Email questions, wouldn't be answered free, I'd be charging for a consult. So think twice, before sending a mail.

Thanks eDOC. Noted, and will do. My wife still occasionally suffers from menopausal symptoms, but less frequently and very mild. Would she be helped by continuing the higher dose until they subside? She has been helped greatly by moringa, quercetin/bromelain, and pueraria mirifica. Should any of these be discontinued when symptoms are gone? Thanks again for all your input !

Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular NaturopathMy statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. Any product mentioned is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.”

eDOC wrote:Dennyk, I'm assuming you are on oral VC and measuring the glucose readings using a meter...correct.Generally, I recommend 1 hr prior or 2 hrs after a meal, but most of my patients never bother, take the required dose straight up, with none issues. Those on 30-60 mL/day to cover a flareup, take approx 3-5 liters of water per day, during that period.

Yes on the VC. I take 4 grams, 4 or 5 times/day. And I'm measuring Glucose, (blood sugar) with a finger prick and simple meter. I am certain my water intake has been lacking badly, but have really picked it up due to your comments/reminder. My thanks again. Have been back at 15 ml twice a day on DMSO, and feeling great.

Dennyk wrote:Yes on the VC. I take 4 grams, 4 or 5 times/day. And I'm measuring Glucose, (blood sugar) with a finger prick and simple meter. I am certain my water intake has been lacking badly, but have really picked it up due to your comments/reminder. My thanks again. Have been back at 15 ml twice a day on DMSO, and feeling great.

Want to wish you well, and good luck on whatever your upcoming adventure might be.

Dennyk, I'm glad your feeling better with fewer or non headaches. Hope your labs are better too.I doubt that your sugar is high, but is rather low, if checked in a lab.Thanks for your kind words, regarding my adventures, which start tonight..thought to make last few cryptic replies.Good luck again and get well.

eDOC!!

Sent using VPN.

Rookie, rusty, subaverage doc but one that gives results. But do remember no freebies. Email questions, wouldn't be answered free, I'd be charging for a consult. So think twice, before sending a mail.

eDOC wrote:Dennyk, I'm glad your feeling better with fewer or non headaches. Hope your labs are better too.I doubt that your sugar is high, but is rather low, if checked in a lab.

I see my regular Doc tomorrow morning, but was able to view my blood test results on-line this morning. It looks like my glucose meter was correct in giving slightly higher readings. My A1c went up to 6.3 from 6.0, but like I said I have not been following my low carb diet which can keep it under 6. Not sure why it didn't come down as expected from the DMSO. Does this back Owen's thoughts that VC is detected as glucose? My cholesterol levels are the best they have been in maybe 20 years. (total = 203, HDL = 35, and LDL =117). From the Vitamin C, or DMSO, or both? My CBC numbers are very close to what they were 3 months ago. I will try to put together a chart with all the numbers that I can post here, but in scanning over all the results, I noticed a change that I am hoping for some feedback on. ALT (alanine aminotransferase) went from 17 IU/L to 102, and AST ( aspartate aminotransferase) went from 16 IU/L to 42. Googling these paramenters seems to indicate a liver problem of sorts. Could this be my liver detoxing from the DMSO? Or is it developing a problem? I guess I'm hoping for a 2nd opinion, prior to hearing what my Doc has to say about it, since I have no idea how he will react to my taking DMSO, (odor is pretty strong).Here's a link to my prior and current test results.https://www.dropbox.com/s/fql4pq5l7lxdr ... t.doc?dl=0

Dennyk wrote:My A1c went up to 6.3 from 6.0, but like I said I have not been following my low carb diet which can keep it under 6. Not sure why it didn't come down as expected from the DMSO. Does this back Owen's thoughts that VC is detected as glucose?

HbA1c doesn't measure glucose directly, it measures glycated Haemoglobulin, which does of course gets glycated by the average glucose levels in the blood, but not by vitamin C at all. On the contrary, while measured blood glucose might give higher values due to vitamin C, Hb1Ac on the contrary is lowered by high enough vitamin C intake.

Journal of the New Zealand Medical Association, 23-August-2002, Vol 115 No 1160

We have observed a significant "false" lowering of GHb in animals and humans supplementing ascorbic acid (AA) at multigram levels. Mice receiving ~7.5 mg/d (equivalent to > 10 g/day in a 70 kg human) exhibited no decrease in plasma glucose, but a 23% reduction in GHb.2 In humans, supplementation of AA for several months did not lower fasting plasma glucose.3,4 We studied 139 consecutive consenting non-diabetic patients in an oncology clinic. The patients had been encouraged as part of their treatment to supplement AA. Self-reported daily intake varied from 0 to 20 g/day. The plasma AA levels ranged from 11.4 to 517 µmol/L and correlated well with the reported intake. Regression analysis of their GHb and plasma AA values showed a statistically significant inverse association (eg, each 30 µmol/L increase in plasma AA concentration resulted in a decrease of 0.1 in GHb).

A 1 g oral dose of AA can raise plasma AA to 130 µmol/L within an hour and such doses at intervals of about two hours throughout the day can maintain ~230 µmol AA/L.5 Similar levels could also be achieved by use of sustained-release AA tablets. This AA concentration would induce an approximate 0.7 depression in GHb. The GHb assay used in our study, affinity chromatography, is not affected by the presence of AA.3 Thus, unlike the case with Hb D Punjab, our results were not caused by analytical method artifact. More likely, the decreased GHb associated with AA supplementation appears related to an in vivo inhibition of glycation by the elevated plasma AA levels, and not a decrease in average plasma glucose.3 If this is true, the effect has implications not only for interpretation of GHb but also for human ageing, in which glycation of proteins plays a prominent role in age-related degenerative changes.

A misleading GHb lowering of the magnitude we observed can be clinically significant. Current recommendations for diabetics suggest that GHb be maintained at 7, a level that is associated with acceptable control and decreased risk of complications; when GHb exceeds 8, re-evaluation of treatment is necessary.6 Moreover, relatively small increases in average blood sugar (ie, GHb) can accompany adverse reproductive effects. A difference in mean maternal GHb of 0.8 was found for women giving birth to infants without or with congenital malformations.7 In either of these circumstances, an underestimation of GHb could obscure the need for more aggressive intervention.

Vitamin usage is common in New Zealand and after multivitamins, AA is the most often consumed supplement.8 Moreover, diabetics are encouraged to supplement antioxidants, including AA. Thus, it seems prudent for primary care health providers to inquire regarding the AA intake of patients, especially diabetics, when using GHb for diagnosis or treatment monitoring.

pamojja wrote:HbA1c doesn't measure glucose directly, it measures glycated Haemoglobulin, which does of course gets glycated by the average glucose levels in the blood, but not by vitamin C at all. On the contrary, while measured blood glucose might give higher values due to vitamin C, Hb1Ac on the contrary is lowered by high enough vitamin C intake.

Thank you Pamojja. While not alarmingly high at 6.3, I suppose the increase shows that my prior low carb diet was working. With the CLL diag, I tried switching to a more alkaline diet, which included a lot more carbs, so I guess the higher number makes sense.

Any insight on the jump in ALT (alanine aminotransferase), from 17 to 102 IU/L? A result of DMSO detox, or a new problem? I also noticed that while my total cholesterol, and LDL came down very nicely, my triglycerides went up from 181 to 253 mg/dl. Could this be from all the lecithin in my lipo C ? I'm trying to understand as much as I can, but It's still pretty confusing to me. So many trade offs, and so much conflicting info out there.

Dennyk wrote:I also noticed that while my total cholesterol, and LDL came down very nicely, my triglycerides went up from 181 to 253 mg/dl. Could this be from all the lecithin in my lipo C ? I'm trying to understand as much as I can, but It's still pretty confusing to me. So many trade offs, and so much conflicting info out there.

If anything, the choline from lecithin in lipo C could have made your liver to release too much fat with a rise in liver enzymes, but that usually in my case always caused higher lipid numbers. The significant rise in triglycerides is very likely caused by higher carb intake.

I guess the short answer (based on my lab results) is "a mistake". I'll almost certainly go back to the low carb diet that has worked so well for so many years in controlling my blood sugar. I guess I was trying to focus on a better diet for cancer.

Carbohydrates break down into sugars during digestion, which creates glucose that active tumors generally require for rapid cell division. This is why most advocates of a high vitamin C treatment for cancer recocmmend a ketogenic diet, i.e. a low-carb diet, to keep sugar/glucose levels to a minimum. Cancer cells will intake ascorbate via the GLUT receptors when glucose is scarce, leading to the "Trojan Horse" theory of how high dose vitamin C may work on its own.

The acididosis issue is a red herring, in my opinion. Yes, as cancer cells die, their DNA will raise acid levels in the blood, requiring a buffer. So take more magnesium.

Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular NaturopathMy statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. Any product mentioned is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.”

I'm going back on my low carb diet that has worked so well for me over the years. I had my visit with my normal Doc yesterday, and let's just say it didn't go well. I knew my cancer doc was not at all open to anything other than what the FDA suggests, but thought my regular doctor was fairly open minded, so I tried to be honest with him, (I did forget to mention the Vitamin A I was taking) and got a massive lecture about how my only problem was worrying too much about my CLL. He pretty much freaked out over taking 15 to 20g of VC a day, and considers that crazy. He is very concerned (as am I) over the sudden jump in ALT (alanine aminotransferase), and AST ( aspartate aminotransferase). My complete results listed here https://www.dropbox.com/s/fql4pq5l7lxdr ... t.doc?dl=0I spent a lot of time yesterday backtracking everything I've done in the past 6 months looking for something I was taking or doing that could possibly account for it. If my regimen caused it, it would be because of one of three things, oral DMSO at 15ml twice/day, 16 to 20 grams of VC/day with my personal lipo C mix, or the 100,000 IU /day of Vitamin A. I found nothing suggesting that DMSO could have any negative effect on the liver. The following study showed a healing effect on the liver in rabbits. https://www.dmso.org/articles/ChemicalI ... chemia.pdf

If my lipo C mix had anything to do with it, it would almost have to be because of the alcohol I use to make it, but I go through a process that evaporates/pours off any excess alcohol after the liposomes are formed, and prior to incorporating the VC, so the alcohol content by volume is probably only 1 to 3%, as opposed to about 12% in most commercial versions. I figure that the total alcohol I consume in a day, via my mix, is less than .2 oz

While I've seen and read references here in these forums stating this dosage should be helpful, and not cause a problem, I'm stopping completely the Vitamin A, to see if lab results improve. My doctor has ordered for a repeat test in 30 days. If anyone sees flaws in my logic, I would appreciate the feedback.

Dennyk wrote: I'm stopping completely the Vitamin A, to see if lab results improve. My doctor has ordered for a repeat test in 30 days. If anyone sees flaws in my logic, I would appreciate the feedback.

I agree and would do the same till liver enzymes came down. Though if you really overloaded you liver with vitamin A 30 days probably aren't enough.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_A#Side_effects

In general, acute toxicity occurs at doses of 25,000 IU/kg of body weight, with chronic toxicity occurring at 4,000 IU/kg of body weight daily for 6–15 months.[42] However, liver toxicities can occur at levels as low as 15,000 IU (4500 micrograms) per day to 1.4 million IU per day, with an average daily toxic dose of 120,000 IU, particularly with excessive consumption of alcohol.[citation needed] In people with renal failure, 4000 IU can cause substantial damage. Signs of toxicity may occur with long-term consumption of vitamin A at doses of 25,000-33,000 IU per day.[1]

Interesting read on the importance of combining vitamin A always with appropriate amounts of vitamin D and K2: