I've finally decided that I am just not crazy out the vocalist you are working with. Don't let that get you down though! She is talented, but there is something about her tonal quality that just doesn't click with me.

As for the production, you have definitely listened to the advice we've given. The drums are crisp in the mix. I can hear the bass without it making the mix muddy. The guitars are somewhat to the front of the mix which is great for metal. The vocals are at a level where the music comes through just fine but you can understand what she is saying. Also, you've put enough reverb on her voice to make it sound bigger without making her sound like she is in a hole or just has too many effects going. You've found your sound, man! I applaud you for that!

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I might have decided, or maybe not, that I should or shouldn't, depending on the issue or non-issue, to possibly share or not share, any thoughts, opinions, or facts (that might not be deemed factual by some), due to possible fear of any misinterpretation or retribution.

In a couple of days y'all are gonna get some money from me. Can't wait to hear the complete final product! I like that you guys have put out some samples and solicited feedback from other musicians and enthusiasts. I think one of the biggest problems that plague artists is that they get locked in to what they want their music to sound like and that sometimes keeps them from hearing what it really sounds like.

JLE3

Number of posts : 166Localisation : USARegistration date : 2016-11-16

Subject: Re: Alone I Lie - Evans and Stokes Tue Mar 21, 2017 2:33 pm

Messiaen77 - Thank you!!! You're right in that we wanted to solicit feedback first. You can still be true to your style and what you envision but get critical feedback along the way in order to fine tune what you work so hard on. Need to have thick skin sometimes, but in the long run hopefully it's worth it.

alldat - Thank you too! It's funny because I told Jenny that when we started this journey I would have never thought that the hardest part would be the production/mixing. Writing the song is the easy part! The feedback we have received here and on other forums has been very valuable and I truly appreciate your candor when giving it. Since we still have several other songs to complete before this album is done I do have a question for you. If you wouldn't mind listening to this song one more time there are a few parts I'd like your opinion on regarding the vocals as there are 4 distinct vocals at play here.

First, the intro. This is a straight forward vocal with a bit of reverb and runs from .35 to 1.04and thefirst verse from 1.12 to 1.40 and is pretty much the same.

The first chorus begins at 1.41 and has a bit of panning to it.

The second and third verses are where we did something different (2.12 to 2.24 and 3.27 to 3.40). In these we doubled up the vocals with a secondary vocal track sung a little lower.

Then the second and third choruses have a more extreme secondary harmony track.

My question is...even though this particular vocal style may not click with you, is there a particular version (as listed above) that clicks better than the other? I ask because I really like the way we doubled the vocals in the second and third verse, and am wondering if it makes sense to try that in some of the remaining songs we are working on.

Going back and really listening to Jenny, it is the extra reverb that makes her voice rub me the wrong way. She needs to be more clean throughout. Instead of reverb, you may want to experiment with some other effects like perhaps a chorus.

I'd like to hear this mixed with Jenny's voice having a tad more low and highs brought out. I don't care if it is a 30 second version. Try it and see. I think the extra reverb and the mid range are messing with my ears.

The harmony vocals are well done, haunting, and pretty although dark sounding. With what you are doing, that works and should be held on to tightly. That lower vocal adds mystery and power. I'd do it in all the choruses--not just the 2nd and 3rd. If you ever listen to my blues stuff, you will hear me doing two and three part harmony for my choruses just to make them sound huge. It helps drive home a song if you have a big hook.

I hope that helps. You guys are SO close to having a perfect mix!

_________________

I might have decided, or maybe not, that I should or shouldn't, depending on the issue or non-issue, to possibly share or not share, any thoughts, opinions, or facts (that might not be deemed factual by some), due to possible fear of any misinterpretation or retribution.

I agree with alldat. She's talented vocally but I think the reverb is up a bit high. You want some reverb (unless you can record in a room that provides some) but it does seem a bit high. It makes her sound like she isn't enunciating clearly but I believe she is.

I agree with alldat. She's talented vocally but I think the reverb is up a bit high. You want some reverb (unless you can record in a room that provides some) but it does seem a bit high. It makes her sound like she isn't enunciating clearly but I believe she is.

Reverb is great if it is needed. Not everyone does. It can add space to a vocal track. It can also make it sound fake. I have heard of a few singers who preferred a bit of a chorus effect or no reverb at all to get a more natural feel. Too much reverb, especially on a female voice, can make the voice seem too sharp and cause ear fatigue. Ear fatigue for the listener is bad because people won't listen to your work over and over and won't be able really to tell you why. They just know that something is wrong when they hear it.

_________________

I might have decided, or maybe not, that I should or shouldn't, depending on the issue or non-issue, to possibly share or not share, any thoughts, opinions, or facts (that might not be deemed factual by some), due to possible fear of any misinterpretation or retribution.

JLE3

Number of posts : 166Localisation : USARegistration date : 2016-11-16

Subject: Re: Alone I Lie - Evans and Stokes Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:38 pm

OK good advice coming through here. I have some thinking to do. Thank you everyone!

Something else that can work. I know that Scott Wenzel of Whitecross used to do TWO vocal tracks (not counting harmonies) per song. One he would record and they would do no effects on. The 2nd they would add reverb but pull to the background some. It made him sound fuller and gave him a little 'verb on his voice without making his vocal sound too sharp to the ears or over processed. I have never tried this on myself though. I have done two tracks doing the same thing for a doubling effect like Glenn Kaiser and that's pretty cool.

_________________

I might have decided, or maybe not, that I should or shouldn't, depending on the issue or non-issue, to possibly share or not share, any thoughts, opinions, or facts (that might not be deemed factual by some), due to possible fear of any misinterpretation or retribution.

Something else that can work. I know that Scott Wenzel of Whitecross used to do TWO vocal tracks (not counting harmonies) per song. One he would record and they would do no effects on. The 2nd they would add reverb but pull to the background some. It made him sound fuller and gave him a little 'verb on his voice without making his vocal sound too sharp to the ears or over processed. I have never tried this on myself though. I have done two tracks doing the same thing for a doubling effect like Glenn Kaiser and that's pretty cool.

This is how I do reverb. Leave one track au naturale and back off the level of the reverb track until it sounds right.

JLE3

Number of posts : 166Localisation : USARegistration date : 2016-11-16

Subject: Re: Alone I Lie - Evans and Stokes Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:59 am

Well thank you everyone for the feedback. This one is available now along with I Cry No More. We've actually taken some of this advice into account on some other tunes we are working on and one's I've posted here that we are re-working a little like Defy The Demons. Only a couple more to go and this album will be done! Thanks for the critiques and support!!