While truth can shine a light, it usually takes lies to generate heat.

Take the immigration debate, which is about to get underway again. President Obama has said that he intends to pursue comprehensive immigration reform. And recently, New York Senator Chuck Schumer said that he planned to have a bill written by Labor Day. We can expect six to eight months of spirited debate before Spring 2010, at which point Congress will either have passed the bill or defeated it.

Whenever we talk about immigration, much of the heat that is generated comes from myths and assumptions masquerading as facts. These are things that people know in their bones to be true, even though they aren’t really true at all. An example is when people say immigrant birthrates in the United States are going up, but all the available research points to the fact that newcomers are having smaller families — mostly for economic reasons.

Or when they say immigrants aren’t learning English when, actually, they pick it up by the second generation and have trouble retaining their native language by the third generation. Or when we say illegal immigrants don’t pay taxes when, actually, they pay their share of sales, property, and even income taxes with the help of something called an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number.

Or when they say that recent waves of immigrants — especially those from Mexico and elsewhere in Latin America — aren’t following in the footsteps of earlier immigrant waves because supposedly the newcomers aren’t assimilating to the point where their children wind up a permanent underclass because they lack wealth, skills, and education.

According to the study, the poverty gap between immigrants and natives decreased from 1994 to 2004 and the poverty level for immigrants fell over the entire decade; immigrants who arrive in the United States as children and attend U.S. schools tend to achieve parity with natives at the same socioeconomic status; and, over the generations, children of immigrants and immigrant children do as well as the children of U.S. natives unless they encounter external obstacles such as poverty or discrimination.

In fact, in a finding that some consider counterintuitive, the researchers discovered that adults born in the United States to immigrant parents were more likely to have a college degree than adults who are already in the third generation.

What’s that about? Simple. While the conventional wisdom is that the longer an immigrant family stays in the United States, the better off it will be, that’s not always the case. On the one hand, no matter what some nativists believe, assimilation happens. And when it does, immigrants are usually better off. But sometimes, what we consider progress can come at a steep price. For every new opportunity, something is lost. There are bad habits that people can pick up living in the United States for a few generations, such as a weaker work ethic, a thirst for immediate gratification, an entitlement mentality, and the tendency to take for granted the value of a college education.

So overall, immigrants are still assimilating on schedule. Some Americans think that because they see a Spanish-language billboard on the way to work, or because an ATM asks them is they’d like to proceed in Spanish, that somehow this must mean that immigrants aren’t assimilating.

No, it just means that corporations are trying to sell stuff. Hungry for a slice of an $800 billion a year market of Latino consumers, companies will use Spanish –- or French, Russian, or Martian — to help close the deal. But the important point is that these bilingual marketing efforts notwithstanding, English always finds a way to come out on top. Just as immigrants always wind up assimilating -– whether they want to or not.

That’s why studies like this are important, even if many Americans aren’t ready to accept their conclusions because the findings run contrary to what they think they know. The immigration debate already has plenty of fear, division, racism, suspicion, and animosity. What it could use more of are facts.

Ruben Navarrette Jr. is a member of the editorial board of the San Diego Union Tribune, a nationally syndicated columnist, a frequent lecturer, and a regular contributor to CNN.com.

Click here to view the 63 legacy comments

Click here to hide legacy comments

63 Comments, 63 Threads

1.
Delia

Uhhhhh. What part of ‘illegal’ don’t you understand???????????

I don’t care if an illegal immigrant can rub his head in a circle while patting his belly whilst reciting the consitution and whistling Dixie out his/her hoo-ha…if he/she is ILLEGAL it matters NOT.

This assimilationist trend sounds almost traditional. Sure, there are a lot of Spanish-language media these days, but 50-60 years ago it was Yiddish newspapers & Italian radio stations that constituted immigrant media, & these didn’t seem to permanently keep the immigrants of those days in the ghetto. It’s also a hopeful sign that all the PC attempts to keep the Hispanics distinct aren’t successful, either.

….And they are all too inclined towards assimilating as, and exacerbating a pre-existing criminal persuasion which the nation already has enough problems and limited resources in trying to control while still maintaining it’s standards.

The article is too harsh on those “living in the United States for a few generations,” accusing them of having weaker work ethics, among other things. But it is nice to hear someone defending the immigrant for a change.

Who is an immigrant?

An immigrant is a person with ambition, someone willing to leave behind all they know in their native land, to seek out a better future for themselves and their family. Be it for economic, political, or religious reasons, people have been coming to America for centuries because they want a better life -and usually are willing to work hard to get it.

Today’s immigrants (e.g. Hispanics, Koreans) may start out poor, but slowly make their way up the economic ladder, as did the immigrants of yesterday (e.g. Italians, Irish).

I do not condone illegal immigration (nobody should be allowed to flaunt the law), but do become disheartened when hearing so many people disparaging immigrants today. Unless of Native American blood, we are all children of immigrant ancestors. Today’s America would not exist if not for immigration. It’s what made us who we are.

Hey Ruben….you might want to take a look at California’s books before you start spouting off about how beneficial immigrants are, legal and illegal. I know, I know Arnold says that immigrants have no part in California’s budget woes. Give me a break! LA alone spends 350 million a year on services for alien immigrants..thats just one city.

I certainly hope your right, according to the numbers crunchers, this will be a latino/hispnaic country in a relatively short period of time. As to your assertion that bilingual messaging is simply a matter of profit margins, why are schools and public entities doing it as well?

first of all, let’s differentiate between an immigrant and an illegal alien.

an immigrant is someones who entered the country LEGALLY and therefore granted what is called “Immigrant Status.”

an Illegal Alien is someone who entered the country without permission and therefore does not have Immigrant Status.

the word immigrant has been bastartdizd and has given all immigrants a bad reputation.

I am an immigrant. I entered the country LEGALLY. I pay taxes (I’d say more than your average American born citizen), I served in the military, and I love this country and had almost paied the ultimate price during the first gulf war.

having said that, I don’t condone AMNESTY for illigal aliens! law breakers should not be rewarded. those who break the law to enter this country need to be caught and deported. there are rules and standards to be followed when applying for entry into this country and those who can not respect and follow those rules should not be given a “free pass” and granted immigrant status; doing so only condones their illegal act and entices more people to break the law.

before the ILLEGAL ALIEN problem can be solved, the rule of law should be enforced. it’s been said by many that we are a country of laws to turn our backs on that is detrimental to the future of this country.

again, differentiate between IMMIGRANTS and ILLEGAL ALIENS, then enforce the law and deport those who choose not to follow the law. the rules of obtaining LEGAL entry and immigrant staus for the USA is strict and ensures only immigrants that are respectful of the constitution and laws of this country is given entry so that they can contribute to the country’s advancement instead of contributing to the country’s budget strain.

many who argue for amnesty simply blur the lines between legal and illegal. they try to paint a gray situation when it is all black and white. follow the rules and the law and enter legally or not at all.

Sorry Ruben – the ‘study’ you sight (wonder who paid for it and what their agenda is) doesn’t line up with what I see around me. I live in the suburbs outside New York City and see waves of Latino immigrants working in cash under the table jobs (so no need to pay income taxes on that), living in rental apartments usually illegal units (so no property taxes) whose kids get a full public education and then some because they usually need some form of special education services and who use the emergency room or free clinics for all their healthcare from giving birth to heart surgery all on the taxpayers dime. My frustration is not Latinos coming to this country to work and become good citizens which most are. It is all the social services that are provided when they really do not pay income or property taxes. There are many millions of illegal immigrants getting all these services for several generations and they just keep coming. Taxes and healthcare costs keep going up at a rapid pace with no sign of leveling off. There have just been too many immigrants flooding over the border for the past 20 years with all these associated costs. It’s overwhelming and given the state of the economy, we need a break.

“This assimilationist trend sounds almost traditional. Sure, there are a lot of Spanish-language media these days, but 50-60 years ago it was Yiddish newspapers & Italian radio stations that constituted immigrant media, & these didn’t seem to permanently keep the immigrants of those days in the ghetto. It’s also a hopeful sign that all the PC attempts to keep the Hispanics distinct aren’t successful, either.”

But neither did any of those groups have La Rasa equivalents arguing for regional secession or refuing to recognize the authority of State or Federal Governments. Nor did Italian, Irish or Polish governments actively and publicly pursue a policy of “cultural reconquista,” exhorting their former citizens to refuse assimilation and subvert the laws and systems of the US.

A Ruben-esque “fact:” Navarette’s writings are filled with clicheed-Leftist bigotry and victimology.

” These are things that people know in their bones to be true, even though they aren’t really true at all. An example is when … they say immigrants aren’t learning English when, actually, they pick it up by the second generation and have trouble retaining their native language by the third generation.”

Please tell that – necessarily in Spanish – to the massive number of latinos in the metropolitan Washington, D.C. suburbs who – after 3 or more generations – still cannot or will not speak English.

My state, Georgia, tried to take away the driver’s license of any illegal pulled over for a traffic infraction. I have to wonder whether we would purposely create a permanent underclass due to our resentment of their cost to society. Well, we already bear the cost of a permanent underclass, so to speak, from the failed welfare program destroying the character of poor people.

So, I’m very conflicted on the issue of Mexicans and feel we are lucky it is them and not Middle Eastern people like in the EU has to deal with.

I propose we revamp Ted Kennedy’s immigration system that smiles upon letting in uneducated barbarians while limiting polished, educated people; even people who graduated in the U.S!

While I’m generally positive on Ruben’s stories, I do feel Billingual Education is a tricky way for instuctors and students to avoid working with black kids. Take the same kids, parents, and instructors to some “sundown town” away from the inner city, they will actual embrace being with the white kids, but only if they dont have the educators and other ilk convincing them that bilingual is for their betterment. I expect that one day, someone will walk in on a “bilingual” class in the Rust Belt or in Oakland CA and be surprised that English is being spoken wholly.

Thats because the nations of Ireland, Italy, and Poland were “concepts” not actual countries in the 1800s at the height of emigration (Italy, like Germany became a unified nation c. 1870 or so, but these new nations were largely the extensions of the respective Sardinian and Prussian states).

Who is to say that a Irish premier circa 1870 would’nt have wanted to twist John Bull’s tail by “taking over” the Englishman’s crown jewel of the USA?

The German government (Bismarck, the Kaisers) that grew out of the Prussian juggernaut actually cultivated a lot of German-cultural superiority movements in the U.S. via German-language newspapers, bunds, support of Lutheran churches, put downs of Slavs and other competing immigrant groups, particularly in the midwest. It took one guy named Zimmerman to slip up (ask Mexico to join the Central Powers in WW I) and force assimilation (Beckers to Bakers, Schmidts to Smiths etc) on some of the most recalcitrant elements of the German-American community.

What #10 (”Chicago”) wrote. There is a difference between ILLEGAL aliens and LEGAL immigrants.

Ruben: Do the studies you reference make a distinction between illegal aliens and legal immigrants or do these studies lump both groups into one category?

Jul 29, 2009 – 6:44 am
===================================

I’d bet that the study does not differentiate between immigrants and illegal aliens.

people who migrate to the US legally are sponsord by relatives or employers or they have an economic advantage by having a certain sum of money that they can invest into the economy. illegal aliens on the other hand do not.

when a person files a “petition” to sponsor a relative for entry into the USA, that person is required to file an affidavit stating that the relative he/she is sponsoring will be supported by him/her financially. this is a guarantee that the person to emigrate into the US does not become a burden to society.

as I’ve said, the rules are strict and simply need to be enforced.

in addition, people who follow imigration rules wait years and sometimes decades for the processing to complete. this includes background checks, medical checks, financial checks to ensure that undesireables are weeded out during the application process. illegal aliens bypass this process and places a burden on the immigration system. those who are deserving entry into the US are then forced to wait longer. that is an opportunity missed since many of the people in line have higher education, essential skills, and the means to becomes investors in the US economy. illegal aliens in turn take their place and places an economic burden by participating in the labor black market instead of immigrants who pay payroll taxes and other fees.

those who say that illegal aliens contribute to the economy are full of bs. immigrants (again, those who entered legally) contribute to society and add knowledge, skills, and economic means; illegal aliens simply drains the economy and does not payback into the nations coffers by elluding payroll taxes, along with medicare/medicaid taxes which many of them partake in through welfare/WIC and other state programs.

pay into the system then you can start drawing from it. illegal aliens do not pay into it so why allow them to draw from it.

while I symphatize with those foreigners who are in need of help, I’d rather see my tax dollars go to those who followed the rules and entered legally and contribute by paying their fair share of taxes.

to say that illegal aliens are contributing to the nation’s economy is ludicrous. stop painting the lines gray. illegal aliens are a problem, LEGAL immigrants are not. This author should never ever lump in both into the same argument since the difference is night and day!

I agree with #10. For most of my adult life (30 +) years I lived within 80 miles of the USA border. I always returned to Canada after being admitted to the US as a tourist. Now that an I-551 (Permanent Resident or so-called green card) is in my pocket, I feel foolish knowing that I could have crossed that border in the late 1970′s, been recognized in the 1986 amnesty and had a very different life. But I was under the impression that the US is a nation built on law, so I immigrated in accordance with the law.

Maybe I should have bought a one way ticket to Mexico and walked across years ago. The Niagara River flows very quickly, is very cold and very deep. And there is the little matter of those falls and the whirlpool…..

Navarette is obviously making a blatant attempt to obfuscate the difference between legal and illegal by saying that some illegals pay taxes. So what!!!! They should not be in the U.S.A. in the first place because they are breaking the law. He is claiming that they pay their “share” of taxes and his proof is that there is such a thing as a taxpayer ID number. Tell us Mr. Navarette, do you support all illegal immigration or only Hispanic illegals?

Your mix of a study based on all nationalities of immigrants, (not exclusively illegal immigrants or Mexican illegals)distorts the truth which seems to be your genre’.

If you were to separate the figures and base the findings you mention on a more clear distinction between Mexican illegal immigration,compared to legal Asian, European, Middle Eastern, African and so forth your figures would not hold true.

You struggle constantly in each and every article to justify what is not justifiable. And that is that illegal Mexicans and some other Latin American illegal immigrants have not and are not assimilating in the so called “conventional way”.

They have in fact chosen not to become part of the American dream. Instead they have arrived on our “tierra” and decided to take everything that they can get, any way that they can get it.

They have decided to alter the concept of immigration and what it stands for.They see much clearer than you where they stand.

The Mexican and Latin American illegal gene- rationally are replacing the African American as the number one prison inmate population especially in the western United States.

Here your statement about a thirst for immediate gratification, bad habits, and an entitlement mentality seems to play true.

This by the way stems from low educational achievement due to lack of family supervision and involvement mostly due to two working parents, large families, low wages, and sub-standard living conditions. All symptoms and results of illegal immigration.

Mr. Navarrette you consistently try to paint a picture of a somewhat healthy assimilation of Hispanic (mostly Mexican) immigrants but you are in denial.

The Mexican population in this country is mostly illegal. This is how it is for a reason, and that reason is cheap labor.

The Mexican and Latin American illegal is being exploited generation after generation and by your denial of this reality you are contributing to the problem.

Without even wasting my time looking at the study:
1. “Immigrants” and their children might be doing fine and dandy (let’s pretend), but as even the study notes the following generations aren’t doing so good. Google Heather MacDonald for more on that.
2. The study was based on information that’s years or decades out of date. For instance, using current second or third generation children of “immigrants” isn’t exactly a good predictor of what’s going to happen decades from now because the original “immigrants” came here in an entirely different time.
3. Navarrette will say just about anything to support massive Latin American immigration. (OK, to be fair he did go after the NCLR a little bit once and he’s not as bad as others, but still.)

A very misleading, biased study, being used by Mr. Navarette to make a propaganda statement. The assimilation, education and income data are skewed by the legal immigrant population. A large number of these immigrants come from cultures where education and personal responsibility are core values.

I suspect the numbers would be very much lower if the data base contained only illegal immigrants.

We’re lucky in this respect. Unlike the Islamic immigrants that are flooding Europe, Latin Americans do assimilate in to our society. While they do represent a problem in terms of lowering wages, they are not nearly as dangerous to our way of life as the Europeans. At least here, they are not trying to create a separate Sharia subculture and they are not trying to mainline misogyny and blatant racism. However, we must improve our enforcement of our immigration laws (document checks for employment and heavy penalties for non-compliant businesses) to preserve American jobs at decent wages.

Did you read the book? Based on the first chapter (I didn’t buy it), the authors say that Hispanic immigrants have not done well and will not do well in America, and the book is to punting on the question of immigration policy concerning levels and skills of immigrants. Ruben, you are perpetuating myths, not shattering them.

Here are the quotes:

“…Hispanics are losing ground relative to whites because of the weak economic position of the many low-skilled immigrants, large numbers of who are undocumented, which lowers population averages on numerous socioeconomic measures”

Translation: As a group, Hispanics are staying poor.

“…The US economy has changed and may not provide the upward economic escalator that assisted previous waves of immigrants and their descendants”.

Translation: As a group, Hispanics and their children will stay poor.

“‘There is little chance they will reach economic parity with native workers during their lifetimes’ (1999, 38 – quote from George Borjas’ “Heaven’s Door”)… His analysis leads him to recommend that the stream of immigrants should be smaller and higher-skilled. We will take up some of the same policy questions, though our overlap will be more focused on the aspect of the adjustment of immigrants themselves.”

Translation: Immigration policy is out of whack and we are punting on the issue. We are going to write a puff piece that shows that immigrants seem to benefit from immigratation.

A broad stroke that is true for a select group of southern and rural midwestern states (for better or worse, IL, WI, IN, MI had rail towns since the 1910s-20s). Hell, I was born and raised in Chicago and so were a godly chunk of my friends.

Invert the ratio between Latin American and Asian immigrants admitted and I guarantee you will see “Desi” and other Asian youth gangs fluorish. Just look at California where the sheer size of the hispanic gang scene obscures the growth of Korean, Filipino, Indian and other gang activity.

All this sounds wonderful. I love the idea of immigrants assimilating to America – provided they are LEGAL immigrants. I will not, repeat NOT, support amnesty for illegal immigrants. For while you appear unwilling or unable to make that distinction, I and millions of my fellow citizens can an will do so.

Remember, legalized abortion created a hole in the whole aggregate demand picture. Not saying blind-eye immigration is “right”, but a lot of industries (e.g. housing, consumer goods, retail) were facing cliffs once the baby bust generation (or the Generation X of 1965 to 1982) matured. Not to mention those old Prison-, Education-, and Social Services- complexes.

Your basing your comments in this article on WHAT PAST GENERATIONS of immigrants, largely LEGAL immigrants, have done. There’s no way to know for sure what the current crop of heavily illegal and uneducated illegal aliens will do. We haven’t even had a generation of them and there sure hasn’t been much research on them of any merit (illegal aliens aren’t particularly cooperative survey respondents) so your responses to these “myths” have no more validity–and probably a great deal less–than the “myths” themselves.

My state, Georgia, tried to take away the driver’s license of any illegal pulled over for a traffic infraction. I have to wonder whether we would purposely create a permanent underclass due to our resentment of their cost to society. Well, we already bear the cost of a permanent underclass, so to speak, from the failed welfare program destroying the character of poor people.
——–The welfare to work programs of the 1990s were working just fine. However, illegal aliens took the entry level jobs that most welfare recipients need to get a leg up. We have adult illegal aliens doing jobs that kids, especially disadvantaged kids, should be doing to earn spending money and build a work history.

So, I’m very conflicted on the issue of Mexicans and feel we are lucky it is them and not Middle Eastern people like in the EU has to deal with.
—I’m Arab-American, and I promise you, at the same time my grandparents came to the U.S., other Arabs were heading to Canada and Latin America. In fact, the richest man in Mexico, Carlos Slim Helu, is the son of Arab immigrants, while other so-called “Hispanics” such as Salma Hayek and Shakira are also of Arab ancestry.

I propose we revamp Ted Kennedy’s immigration system that smiles upon letting in uneducated barbarians while limiting polished, educated people; even people who graduated in the U.S!
——-Agree, at least partially, on this one. I prefer we go back to a system of requiring that companies prove that they can’t find a qualified U.S. citizen and sponsoring workers for green cards BEFORE they enter the U.S.

As in the case mentioned by Chicago in post #10 above, my wife is a legal immigrant. So are my stepsons, my daugher-in-law, and a lot of my friends. They complied with the law, immigrated legally, and most became citizens. Both of my stepsons served in the US military (one still serves as a Navy officer).

What does complying with the law, paying taxes, and becoming a citizen make people like my wife? Chumps! They could’ve entered the country illegally, demanded special treatment like ballots and government services in their native languate, and drove up the cost of social services and healthcare like the illegals do. What were they thinking? Comply with the law, enter legally, pay taxes, and become productive citizens? Or sneak across the border and get free stuff?

Having so many legal immigrants in my family and knowing so many as friends, I see the vitality and energy they bring to America. I’m a strong supporter of legal immigration. But I have no tolerance for illegals.

Certainly there were papers in this country that were foreign language papers, however to use that as a point to today is to deliberately obscure reality.
The German side of my family immigrated here in the 1880′s. My great grandmother and great grandfather were the first American born in their families, having immigrated at close to the same times. They both spoke German with each other, especially when they didn’t want the kids to know what they were saying. However, unlike so many of today’s immigrants my family came here legally, AND they didn’t speak German in public because they were both in their 30′s during WWI when someone of German ancestry could legally be arrested for speaking German. There surely weren’t any nice signs in German on the outside of a businesses door thanking them for shopping there like you’ll find on the mall doors today in Spanish. So we have gone from the hard racism of the Progressives led at the time by Woodrow Wilson to today’s soft racism of the Progressives while they blame the past racism on—-right wing conservatives, of course. That difficulty in reality based thinking is maybe because it was white people discriminating against white people and it obviously doesn’t fit the narrative.
Then there’s the Scots-Irish side of the family that intermarried with Native Americans, not to mention that one guy named Frankie Zulu ——-, I’m thinking he wasn’t probably all white. That intermarriage wasn’t uncommon, yet those “rednecks” are the ones who were and are still called racists by those lily white New Englanders whose ancestors weren’t willing to go out into the frontier and fight for their little piece of ground.
The Catholic Irish got here and that white on white “racism” reared it’s head so they found signs that said “No Irish need apply” so they took the jobs that they were considered good enough for, police officers for one since their lives weren’t worth much anyway, especially in Boston or New York.
Each one of these groups worked hard, got over the crap way they were treated by the New England power structure who today act holier than thou in lecturing the rest of us on “racism” and they got on with their lives and became Americans and gave the love of this country to their children and grandchildren because no matter what they went through it was still better than what opportunities they had in the old country.
It is not racist or wrong to expect that we differentiate between legal and illegal. And it is disingenuous to act as if the past for immigrants was some sort of happy, joy joy, because that would not be the case, yet amazing enough they succeeded where millions with more “understanding” are failing. Soft racism just lets them pretend their helping.

Here’s a compromise. Post a $100,000 bond (about the average do-gooder’s home equity before the bubble popped) for any alien immigrant, guest worker, child or other relative of same, what have you. The bond is instantly forfeit should the now-legal resident alien commit a crime, consume public services, or be deported.

Employers could put up the bond money and we wouldn’t need to fuss anymore over H1-B visas. Ponying up the bond (especially the interest payments on it) would be a sincere indication that there really is a shortage of such-and-such kinds of skilled workers. Churches could even put up the bonds to finance as large a legal “sanctuary community” of Honduran/Salvadoran/Nicaraguan/chic-commie-war-of-the-moment refugees as their congregation wishes to afford.

Or when they say immigrants aren’t learning English when, actually, they pick it up by the second generation and have trouble retaining their native language by the third generation.
———
Mr. Navarette, in this three generation family you’re discussing, only the grandparents are immigrants. The question is, does the first generation learn to speak English?

The children [second generation] are native-born American citizens, as are the grandchildren. Of course these generations speak English; they ‘picked it up’ at birth.

Well if it is true that California is going to forcibly borrow from local and county governments, then the illegals are only forcibly borrowing our jobs, goods, services, etc. We should welcome them with open arms so they can forcibly borrow more.

BTW. In Guatemala, there are natives who have not assimilated to the dominant Spanish language/culture in 500 years. They seem great prospects for assimilation to English language/American culture. And they’re coming here now!

Americans, most Americans, believe in law and order. For immigrants, the first test of true assimilation should be their belief in law and order, too. It’s not a good start to come here illegally. It’s understandable, considering the total legal cipher that is Mexico, and points south, but it’s still not a good start.

Look, it’s just like the health care flap, if the government wants the opportunity to run all of the health care system, they ought to be able to show that they can run those portions of it they’re already responsible for – like Medicare, Medicaid, and the V.A., just to name three. You want to come here and become a proper, respected American in good standing? Get in line behind all the people already trying to get here legally. Them first, then you.

This posting at the excellent Coyote Blog should be food for thought. California is tops in illegal immigration, and as the graph shows, this correlates strongly with California’s enormous, disproportionate share of US welfare recipients.

Immigration is supposed to benefit the US: we must stop trying to educate, feed and medicate another country’s citizens. The Brits tried to do this world wide and it bankrupted them. enough of this “we must carry the burden” bs.

Bring in as many trained and educated canadians, australians, brits, italians and germans as we can, along with foreign supermodels, technicians, doctors, nurses and mexicans willing to learn english and become citizens. All of those have been great in the past and are perfectly compatible with us.

Exclude anyone with a religion incompatible with mini-skirts, alcohol or that has to pray at work, and revoke visas of anyone that goes on welfare in the first 5 years. No more Amish that won’t fight in the wars and clog roads with buggies. No more people who are simply obnoxious in their home countries and claim “persecution” so they can get a visa here.

Ban by law those “for english press 1″ recordings within 3 years.

Any illegal that wins a lottery pays an immediate 50% tax to the feds and a 20% tax to the state they live in.

Impose a 20% tax on non-citizens remitting funds out of the US.

Personal liability on officers, directors and managing agents of employers that hire illegals at $5,000 per hire for the first offense, non-dischargeable in bankruptcy. Those employers are artificially suppressing wages and are cheating against honest companies thta hire legals.

Stop resettling people from somolia here. If we have to resettle anyone, resettle people from Mexico or South America who are don’t come here seething with anger against us for acting as we want in our own country.

We should just have a limited amnesty for people currently working and willing to pay an eternal fine via a triple- or quadruple- social security/FICA withholding. This bargain would not include voting rights. The Social Security system is crashing earlier then expected because of all the laid off 62-64 year olds who have concluded that employers simply dont want anything to do with them. I think your remittance tax should also apply to citizens. I dont owe a thing to the commonwealth or northern European countries – tell them the same thing you tell a Mexican – save your own damn country.

-when we say illegal immigrants don’t pay taxes when, actually, they pay their share of sales, property, and even income taxe That´s a pretty strong statement on the basis of just one little study, which is one of Ruben´s little predilections. On a flight from LA to
Panama last week, I sat with an illegal alien/business
owner. He told me that he is making a fortune in LA with
his car repair garage. Even with the recession? I asked.
In LA, he responded, illegal aliens prefer cash deals for
most transactions of this sort. Ruben, does your study
account for that? There are whole slices of city economies
that never reach the long arm of the tax system. Many are in your precious California. You don´t need a study, Ruben. Walk through E. LA and see the real illegal economy. Only an ideologue or a fool could reach the conclusion that it pays its own way.

Why not enforce all our immigration LAWS LIKE MEXICO does…then prior to deporting all illegal guests in this country send them to a STATEHOOD SEMINAR so they go home and agitate in their native country for joining the great American union.

Hey Ruben, No mention of the cost of illegal immigrant Anchor Baby breeding in your propaganda. How can unwed teen parenting for welfare benefits and the right to remain in American be good for our society?? The result is called the Latino Paradox. First generation Americans (Latinos) end up in violent gangs and prison in higher numbers than would be predicted. Just hope no one you love is victimized by the horde of angry unparented offspring of illegal immigrant teens.

WE’RE ALL MISSING THE POINT… AS LONG AS DROPPING A BABY ON AMERICAN SOIL ENTITLES THE BIRTHER TO RECIEVE FREEBIES AND STAY ON LEGITIMATELY THE PROBLEM GETS WORSE!

“Indian” gangs in california? This is news to me. Do they break into hoomes, shake their heads vigorously from side-to-side, and ask for curry? threaten to fix peoples computers against their will… what? do you have any links?

Hmmm. The Bosnians who have now been in our region of the country for going on 10 years are still stealing vegetables from the old timers’ gardens and doing open-pit bbq’s of pigs (after butchering them in their yard)….

Glad to know that they’re “on schedule” or who knows how long this could go on.

“In Guatemala, there are natives who have not assimilated to the dominant Spanish language/culture in 500 years. They seem great prospects for assimilation to English language/American culture. And they’re coming here now!”

This is true. Many Guatemalan Indians retain their culture and that’s what makes Guatemala an extremely attractive place for tourists. But I don’t think that the pure Indians are coming to the USA, it’s probably the ones who have assimilated to the Spanish culture, which is very close to the American culture.