Episode 209 – Mysterious Universe

We’ve got quite a treat in store for you this week in the form of a huge two hour Halloween Special.

In the first hour Aaron and I take our chances against an ancient Jewish Curse as Jason Haxton returns to tell his adventures as keeper of this strange artifact. Be warned that strange things can happen to those who are simply around to hear this story.

In our second half we are joined by MU favorite Jason Offutt to discuss his latest book and research on the illusive Shadow People and Old Hag Syndrome. Offutt shares some incredible tales from Darkness Walks and some exclusive, never heard before encounters, for MU listeners.

Read on for book links, recommendations, and Music.

UPDATE:If you were quick to download this episode you may notice a very high frequency (and very annoying) buzz during the interviews. I have since updated the file with a fixed version but there was a period of around 1 hour when early downloaders got the bad version. So if you notice the buzzing sound while listening you may want to re-download the episode. For iTunes users, delete the old episode, then unsubscribe from the podcast, then re-subscribe to trigger the download of the fixed file. Damn Dibbuk Box!

Final Track

Related Articles

We open with a discussion on the latest in EEG advancements, adorable mini-humans, and the all new smell-o-phone before eventually venturing into LSD induced re-birthing experiences and genetic memory. The episode closes with…

Historian Thomas Hatsis joins us this week to reveal the secret history of psychedelic magic with his new book ‘The Witches’ Ointment’. Exploring the untold history of the witches’ ointment and medieval…

Thanks again for another awesome episode! This was perfect for Halloween. I really enjoyed Film Noir Worlds track “Lunatics Desire.” top notch. I posted the link to the label website, you should check out more from Film Noir World! I found two albums online. Thx again MU!!!

Jay

Hello, long time listener first time commenter. I just thought I would share a quick testimonial on the effect of the artifact on those who listen (I’ll keep it short). That night was Halloween and rather than going out as i usually do, I decided to stay in to help my family who were having friends over with the intention of visiting my girlfriend later that night.

About right after sundown we began to notice what seemed like a fog fill our neighborhood which increased over time to what looked like a mist. This was accompanied by a putrid stench of something burning. Many officials (police officers, fire fighter) were occasionally seen circling our neighborhood to no avail and everyone who happened upon our neighborhood would stay and chat, inquiring of the scent and smoke. I stayed out until the putrid fog began to burn my eyes and my throat, my mother was affected to an extent where it almost overwhelmed her gag reflex. We had to go back in around 9. Later that night, tempting fate, I left to go to my girlfriends where the scent did not follow. When I got there, she said she was jealous, when I asked why she inquired if i was barbequing earlier that night, she hadn’t eaten yet. I said no, why? She replied that I smelled like I had been sitting next to a smoking pit all night.

As I got home later that night, needless to say I was looking over my shoulder, but although nothing else did come about, the scent still remained off until the morning hours. I woke up around 5:30, which is peculiar for me, but the strange thing is that when I got to the living room, my father was sitting awake, he didn’t see me yet so I used the bathroom and went back to my room. Soon I hear my mom join him and I could hear her ask why he was up so early. He replied, “Strange f**kin’ dream… I’m awake now, we’ll just leave it at that.”

perihelion

Great show, guys… you are my favorite podcast! Nice work.

About the “box”. Interesting story, interesting guest. Very fun stuff. I hate to get skeptical, but here it is anyway, just for discussion. Some basic questions I'm left with:

1) Has anyone ever taken the 2 hair bundles and the 2 coins out to see what happens? Why would any new owner leave those items in there?

2) Everyone agrees how scary and 'possessed' this box is, everyone wants to give it away… but nobody has tried to dump kerosene on it and permanently dispose of the problem that way?

3) The James Randi Foundation will pay $1 million if this thing does what everyone says it does. Does the guest not want $1 million for it? (Assuming it indeed has measurable effects, which nobody seems to dispute).

Just wondering.

gage_rode

Hello. My name is Gage, I live in Canada and I am a relatively new listener to your podcast. I just love the content and the presentation, it is absolutely enticing and sparks my interest on almost every story. I thought to myself I would never really have any type of experience to contribute that was noteworthy or anything. That is, until I listened to this podcast episode.

What first caught my attention was the Shadow people who wore the fedora. This happened about 6 years ago when I was 12, I remember thinking I saw this fedora wearing shadow person on the tops of houses. When I would sleep at night, I had a clear view of my neighbors roof. I would see this figure or so I thought on many occasions. I ended up going to a friends birthday party and I ended up mentioning this shadow figure. To my surprise, I was not the only one who had seen this particular being. We continued on doing other things afterward. After the birthday party, I had never seen this shadow person again. I occasionally thought back on this and eventually convinced myself that it had been my young imaginative brain that had crafted this being at that my friends said they had seen it as well to try and convince one another that it actually existed. That certainly is not the case now, I am sure I actually saw something.

The next things that sent a shiver down my back was the dreams about an owl sitting outside a window staring. Yesterday, my friends and I were going to a bush party to celebrate Halloween, we had to get ready and we went over to one of my friends houses. As he was making something to eat, myself and a couple others waited outside as his sister didn't want us in the house. I got of on the topic of Mysterious Universe because I knew my one friend would be interested by many of your stories. We somehow got sidetracked on the topic of aliens and about a movie called 'The Fourth Kind'. He was telling me how he was afraid to see it as when he was younger, he had had night terrors about aliens where he would wake up screaming and these dreams about this owl sitting out of his window with these huge black eyes. This creeped me out a bit, but I didn't think too much of it. But, when I heard it mentioned on the podcast today (being November 1st), it sent shivers down my spine. It makes me wonder if he was abducted or had some run in with these beings.

Every episode I listen to, it feels like more and more is ringing true, or at least to me they are.

My thoughts were that these are effects are the result of confirmation bias. For example, you hear a story about something that is creepy, you expect that something will happen (you think about it a lot etc etc), then you dream about it and BANG something “weird” happened.

Secondly, we don't hear about all the people who have heard about the box, opened it etc etc and not had anything weird happen. Which is fairly obvious. People who have nothing occur do not speak up, where as people who had something “weird” happen do speak up.

Mick Psyphon

Hi Ben & Aaron,

Great show! I've been waiting for more episodes before piping up with some constructive feedback. You're starting to get your groove. Keep it up… love it!!! Go, go, go! Coming out of the gates you were at full stride; and over a few episodes it was evident that you were both suffering (for wont of a better word) speed wobbles, but the hordes of the MU Army are with you all the way.

As for this particular episode: The Dibbuk box is the perfect topic for Hallowe'en! Fantastic… great choice.

Btw, if either of you ever want to experience a Canadian Hallowe'en, you're welcome with open arms. Who knows what you'll find here in the Greater Toronto Area that might end up on your podcast. On the other hand, I've got to wonder how Australia, or New Zealand might respond to a good ole North American style Hallowe'en festival. Hmmmmm…

Honestly, I can't critique your efforts. It seems to me that you've both found a path that leads to the same goal; and the end result is a treasure!

Two more things:(1) MU #20 is still my favourite episode, because of the Sasquatch research audio clips. I hope you can dig something up in that area soon. I've been avidly pursuing the Bigfoot/Sasquatch phenomenon since the 70's.(2) As a long-time MU listener (since at least MU #09), I really am narked about missing out on the opportunity to get the MU Lts Edition DVD set. Any chance of making it available at a later date?

Keep up the good work, guys! Honestly. I may not have been elected by anyone to say this, but the MU Army is definitely pleased with your efforts.

Hey guys love the show, been listening since episode 40 of the original series. I've been thinking about the Dibbuk Box, and its effects. During the show you mentioned that there is a strange mold substance which grows inside the box. Is it possible that this can be resonsible for the medical effects, eg: blured vision and “burns” aswell as the odd smells. This obviously doesn't explain the dreams or entities, but could these just be hysteria or coincidence. I am not saying that this is true its just a thought, its always good to look at things from diffrent angles. Let me know what you think about my idea.

azzwright

Excellent comment Kroum!

rizangler

Great show but I will not listen to the Dibbuk Box episode. Last time I did on MU my main tower computer crashed and then my laptop crashed the next day. I NEVER had a crash and they both go after hearing the story. I am very sceptical but this was too strange to be a coinsidence,

Otherwise keep up the great work. You are my favorite podcast now. Dave from South Florida

euroyeti

Great Episode Ben and Aaron.

I listened to the story of the box again, and yes, I got the chills and checked over my shoulder a lot (again).

The music is also sick as usual. KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!

oldstersview

I'd just like to add to this excellent comment that certain fungi cause hallucinations, magic mushrooms for example and the ergot now believed responsible for the visions and hallucinations that triggered the Salem witch trials. Many of these also produce strange and foul odors.

Great program as usual, guys.

DougL

Hey Ben! Great show as always!

Question: Any chance at getting the old forums up and running like the good old days? Was always lots of fun having discussions and getting to know everyone in the MU community.

Doug

DougL

Hey Ben! Great show as always!

Question: Any chance at getting the old forums up and running like the good old days? Was always lots of fun having discussions and getting to know everyone in the MU community.

Doug

mikewar1

Thanks Ben for another great show.

Just wanted to say that I listened to this on my ipod in my car. When I was about half way past the box interview, my car suddenly broke down. About 15 minutes later it was fine. However, I did find a twenty on the sidewalk afterwords so maybe the bad luck was counteracted to good?

About a week ago at around 2:30 in the afternoon i was sitting in my kitchen when all of a sudden i got the very strong feeling that there was some one in my house. I turned to look to the right of me into my living room and saw a dark figure walking from left to right. I didn't get a good look but that was the most scared i have ever been in my life. My heart was pounding even though it was in the middle of the day. I called out for my wife cause she often times uses the computer that the figure was moving toward, but i knew that she was at work. I was listening to your Halloween episode and for the first time i heard about the Shadow people. I am now convinced that it was a shadow person. Further more, I am almost positive that there is a ghost in my hallway. Often times i go to the bathroom at night and almost every time there is a silvery-blue flash of light. the bathroom is the room adjacent to my bedroom, i open the door and take an immediate left into the bathroom. There is a window through the bedroom in front of me but the light comes even if the door to that bedroom is closed. I am a very skeptical person in nature and don't really believe in ghosts and the like but i must conclude that there is something unexplainable happening there. If i wait for some time there is a green flash of light that is explainable because of the fire alarm flashes a bright green every two minutes or so. but there is no silvery-blue light at anytime. It is almost like i am startling an entity and it is disappearing quickly. My wife also complains to me about a feeling that there is something in this house. It is my sister's house that we are lucky enough to be living while her and her family are in Alaska for 2 years. There are no cars driving by or any other explainable phenomenon. I want to see the Shadow Person again just to know that it wasn't just my imagination. also when i listened to the show there was a techno song that played on my iPod when i clicked the show. I thought it was just a musical intro and it was a good song so i didn't really mind. I have listened enough to know that you guys play some good music, but then it just stopped. I pushed play again and it was a more normal intro and the file played from time 0:00. I don't have any techno on my iPod since i usually listen to podcasts exclusively and only have 2 artists on my iPod Tegan and Sara and Our Lady Peace. I since have played every file on my iPod to find that song but it is no where to be found, just thinking about it sends shivers up and down my spine. I love the show despite being skeptical and listen every week. i am excited for the USB with the backlogs. keep up the good work.

matchTlevel

Another great show! Keep them coming! Absolutely nothing happened during the dibbuk box interview. Would love to have a conversation with Jason Offutt about my own “shadow people” experiences.

matchTlevel

Another great show! Keep them coming! Absolutely nothing happened during the dibbuk box interview. Would love to have a conversation with Jason Offutt about my own “shadow people” experiences.

Bermuda

Fantastic show! It was the perfect combination of spooky and fascinating for Halloween. Keep up the great work!

DONT mock the dibbuk box!! it can hear you guys and it didnt like this episode. shhhh

About sleep paralysis I never heard about the part where the brain kicks in on purpose before. I always thought this was caused by your brain dreaming too soon due to exhaustion and you dream before your brain gets a chance to shut everything else down first. This happens to me alot and my cats always suffer for it. They dont trust to the bed much until after I am well asleep and unlikely to kick around. I notice that when it does happen it doesnt make sense in a dream. Its always sudden and not part of a sequence like im in a car and it crashes. Its more like im dreaming about sitting and watching tv with friends and pigs coming flying through the window, just complete nonsense out of context to the rest of the dream.

Argo Navis

Sorry, the whole Dibbuk Box things sounds fishy to me. Playing on superstition for publicity. I LOVE the Mysterious Universe Podcast and listen to them all, but just not a fan of this topic.

never had any troubles when this first box first came to MU in season one so i didnt really think anything of it. so, i listened to the episode at 2 am last night, or tried to… at 11min and 17 seconds, as soon as it starts to really get into the story, bam, i-pod crash. i tried one more time thinking it was some joke that ben had played in the episode somehow. nope, crash at 11min and 17 sec. needless to say i turned it off and went to bed…scared. i will try again tonight.

Nicole

Heya Doug, you could always head to the Mysterious Universe page on Facebook

Nicole

Nicole

Mick, Season 1 will be available for purchase in mid-November. It's on a USB stick instead of DVD.

Nicole

Black-eyed children … now that freaked me out more than the Dibbuk Box.

luinbariel

I've heard a lot about these BEK's or Black-Eyed Kids recently.

Nicole

This is the first I've heard of them … kinda wish I hadn't 🙂

luinbariel

There have been a few stories floating around on various message and image boards for awhile; I was actually really surprised to see them jump from these communities into what I consider a respected podcast. I'm even more interested now!

Don't let 'em in and you'll be fine, nothing to fear!

xeno611

So, anyways, I just listened to this episode yesterday and my car got backed up into. no burning eyes or anything else like that. though i did feel very tired, but that may have to do with lack of sleep. I am not sure that this dibbuk box has anything to do with it and i honestly think it doesnt. all i'm saying is that it happened.

luinbariel

Your talk at the end of the show about dreaming of falling and startling yourself awake had me interested. This used to happen to me a lot, it brought back memories. For me, I always would imagine I was shovelling snow (I'm in Canada) and that I would slip with the shovel in my hands; just as I was about to hit the ground I'd wake up in a jolt. Kind of funny, kind of not, heh.

Thanks for sharing and for another cool show! So many topics that I've heard so much about lately on various boards, it's neat to see them leaking into the show. Thanks again!

Hello Aaron,Due to the bad connection duirng the interview, white noise, (dibbuk box interference) – I never could tell whether it was you or Ben speaking and I completely missed your telling of your Dreadlock Old Hag attack. When I finally listened to the show I was surprised and wondered when that was told. Good luck and I hope the Hag doesn't return to your dreams.

Tikki_wikki

I stumbled onto this podcast while I was looking for something to listen to at work today. Not being a podcast listener, I jumped in with the expectation that it would be at most, mildly entertaining.I was wrong. Within the first 5 minutes I was attached to my headset, wide eyed, and concerned for my well being…regardless of the warnings, I just HAD to listen. And boy, am I impressed. Firstly, within 20 minutes I had to let people know about your podcast! It’s great! I thoroughly look forward to listening to the previous and future editions, as well as checking out the MU community!Next, Skelliot- thank you so much for this response. I didn’t want to write this, and I almost regret agreeing with it due to the “wrath of the box”, but as an academic, I feel there may be several psychological explanations for these happenings. Knowing that you may be susceptible to something happening, will most likely heighten your experience or awareness. The mere suggestion of bad luck, can often spew a series of events that are seen in a negative light- when, in the exact same situation, on any given day, they could appear to simply be a misfortune. Or the subtle effects of someone talking about an itch, and then the listener feeling itchy (I’m itchy right now…could it be the box!?) … I’m quite interested in the dreams though. Some could say that the suggestion of a certain event could influence a listener’s dream, and their subsequent interpretation/recall of it. However, the details that was mentioned about several individuals having the exact same dream, without discussing it – well, that gives me shivers!I haven’t decided if I’ll be visiting the website- well, I’ll rephrase that…I haven’t gathered enough nerve to check it out! I would however, be interested if some scientific research was done on it. I know in the podcast it was asked if there were EMF readings taken from it, has that been done? Also, the mention of taking articles out and seeing the consequence is something that intrigues me, but is something that- well, I don’t know if I would actually ask someone to do that, purely based on the possible ramifications!I have SO much to say about this single podcast. It was interesting, intriguing, and have relit a paranormal fire in me!Thank you!!

Hello Tikki,As the caretaker of the box I want to respond to a few of you thoughts and questions. But first, you are right that there can be a definite addicton to Ben's voice, his ease in talking to an otherwise invisiible audience. And, you feel like it is very personal – just to you, hence the attraction along with the vast/eclectic collection of topics he covers. Aaron is like a fun college chum and seems as much a participant in learning as a co-host. A very nice team approach. Back to your question.

Only once did I attempt, and I mean really considered and attempted to remove part of the artifacts for Steve Maas of the LIPRG who wanted to review a part of the box's tokens in the summer of 2004. I agreed, but then an unsettling weather condition came over our home immediately and my city, it thundered continuously (24 – 7) for five full days with torrential rain, and then on the sixth day it didn't rain, but lightening crawled the skies and would suddenly bolt at the ground. I visited the Amish who helped with the box who claimed it was like nothing they had ever witnessed and it was a bad omen. You could feel the oppression in everyone. I told Steve that I would not break up the material. He pleaded for months of and on despite 5 hurricane that all came through his area next finally flooding him and his city out in the Carolinas. I think he too found it too odd to ignore. It is the same series of hrricans that felled the 60-year old Acacia tree in Florida which became the Ark of the Dibbuk Box. i received the tree two years after the storm and the Amish made the sealing Ark. Regardless, I felt it was best not to mess with the items and to keep them together after all of this damage.

Ben can attest that the Dibbuk Box likes to make big storms when its fate is being discussed or considered. Now, it could be all coincidence or like string-theory… just thinking it, believing it can cause it to happen too. As long as I am caring for it the peices stay within,

Lia Ramses requested EVP's be taken, so without telling her when I did this, and 1/2 way around the world as I cleansed the area around the box with burning sage and having a Jewish prayer recited on tape… her home simultaneously filled with sage as if on fire. You can read her family's full affects by being involved on the research area at Haunted Australia.

Best!Jason

BoyNaco11

Haha.. I finally got enough courage to press play on my ipod to listen this episode.. Really good stuff.. Did anyone else catch Ben's final comment right before the end of the show? HAHA I almost never listen to it all the way through, I usually stop it when it fades to the music, but man oh man I was rolling when I heard that. Great episode!

Ed

When the guy mentioned the shadow person in the Fedora hat I went cold! My immediate association with a Fedora hat is FREDDY KRUEGER! Surely a modern architype for all that is sinister in sleep, dreams and the dark hours!

Criss

I laugh at the box , and nothing . No sore eyes , no smashs or broken teeth , black eyes , numb thumbs or even computer crashing , Xbox destroying , car expolding , ear ringing days . Nothing , so i laugh at the box and all who respect or fear the box , because to me its just that a box with a story spun around it .

Twaz a good yarn tho

Nathanael Smith

After listening to this episode… Flash Player crashed!

LU

I know this is a bit late but I need to tell my story. so i just began listening to your podcast again and i have listened to this episode when it first came out a few years ago. So i decided to relisten to the older episodes. the first time i listened to this episode i did not get any bad luck. But on monday 2.6.12 i relistened to this podcast….well some of it. lol. heres my story. so i drive 45 min to and from work. i was heading home when i started listening to this episode. as u were giving the warning i was sorta laughing at u guys saying it could cause bad luck. well as u started the story i told myself yep i remeber this story hearing it a few years ago. and i kept saying how can a box hold such dramatic outcome to so many lives. theres no way. so as i was listening to the story all of a sudden a creepy feeling came over me. its hard to explain. but i didnt even make it thru to even half of ur story before i just felt this huge urge to shut it off. so i did. i thought it was kinda odd but o well. i was almost home anyhow. so the next day i listened to ur next episode 210 and u kept talking about the box. i was like haha so many peeps have had bad luck. that night my window in my car came off its tracks and fell making a huge pow noise. scaring the heck outta me and a friend in the car. it took us almost 20 minutes to get it back on the track and able to stay up. the next day i listened to ur episode 211 and u still talking about the box! i laughed again. except my luck this day was much worse. me and my bf havnt fought for 3 years and we had the worst fight about our dog, a doberman, whom we never have had issues with until this day. i guess maybe it had been coming but it just seemed wierd it was on this day. i got to work and the nitemare only continued. my eyes were extremely itchy and blurry all night. and after lunch i was working on a fixture sitting in a chair a little close to the edge of it and when i went to pick up the fixture, the chair literally swept right out from underneath me. i went flying to the floor and scrapped my knee, arm, banged head, and sore back. Also that night i forgot to shut the door to my car….never in my life have i forgotten to shut the door. I of course woke up this morning and the battery dead! so anyhow my long winded message, i just want to say this morning i said to myself I believe! I BELIEVE! and today was sooo much better! I believe in this box! I better believe cause i in no way want to upset the box or whomever controls it.
from LU in NY,USA

Jason Haxton

Hey LU —
As the owner of the real Dibbuk Box – all I can say is Yep – sounds like you got a dose of it!! I have received thousands of emails from listners to my interviews with MU – to be honest, you got off kinda easy!

Wait until the SYFY docu-drama comes out on TV in late August and the Hollywood movie too.

I am just curious — are you planning to see either or both?
Best regards – Jason