As it happens I don't think that there is a huge catastrophic problem from a little warming but for the goodness of generally doing things better here is my penny's worth;

Use volcanic geothermal power. Iceland is about 1500km from the UK electric grid. If we use high voltage DC power lines to bring electric all the way from there to here it would be very expensive for the cables and would probably lose half the energy in transit.

So what? The cost will be a lot less than a new nuclear power station and once set up the fuel is free.

The USA has yellow stone, the worlds biggest ever volcano. Get bussy!!

_________________"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

Basically we cannot blame industry for satisfying the needs of the customer. The solution has to be changing the needs of the customer. From an energy-use standpoint, the best way to save the planet (from all sorts of disasters including wars, financial collapse, weather changes, magnetic flux, viral pandemic) is to grow your own food. It has been estimated that around 76% of energy in America and 72% of energy in the UK is connected in some way to getting food on our tables (including dealing with the waste). The only reason the trees of the world are being cut down and not replaced is the needs of agriculture so growing your own food is as good as planting lots of trees too. The next biggest chunk of energy use (almost 45% - much of that is food-connected) is heating and cooling within buildings. Simple insulation and air-tight design can do an amazingly big chunk of that heating and cooling without using energy to do so. Good window placement, thermal mass in buildings, well-designed ventilation, and better layout of use within the building can usually eliminate the rest of the energy use. For cold climates, check out PassivHaus or the "one watt house", for moderate dry climates, look to thermal mass for the answers. Hot humid climates can find help with ground-source heat pumps and ice storage along with "green" roof systems (plants growing on the roof). Every house in the world can benefit from solar hot water heating (with variations in design based on climate). With these two things, we can chop 80% off our current energy use and at the same time IMPROVE the quality of life... except we will have to get our hands a little dirty on occasion.

Ann, Back when the Environmentsite was running one of the guys posted about a documentary called "century of self" by the BBC. You say we cannot blame industry for supplying what the customer needs and in the documentary it very clearly shows how the customer was made to think what they wanted about 100 years ago and what they talk about has become basic psychology of advertising and product release.

Also to do the things you talk about would mean the building regulations in all countries would have to be changed to allow it and that is one hell of an effort to get all countries to agree, am not saying it is wrong to think of changing in that direction but even something as simple as all new builds being given led lighting, solar panels and photovoltaics if in the right lattitude would be a good start yet these things haven't been done because the energy companies are not willing to give up centralised power generation.

The blame lies with industry a lot more. Not thinking of future consequences of what they were doing, the greed of advertising and profiteering. The rest lies in plain old ignorant, uncaring over-breeding past the long term sustainable level of humanity to the point of a massive die off ahead, followed later by the prolonged effects of pollution---thermageddon and ELE completion.

Ann's suggestions which would reduce HGHG production 80% are not good enough when 90% by 2020 is needed to have a chance at stopping the passing of the methane turnover process tipping point, when we began to be at it in 2009. Along with that, mathematically it would take an immediate moratorium of having kids for nearly a whole generation, followed by 1 child families until sustainability is reached, to prevent mass die off. Knowing human psychology, they will keep on with business as usual until die off from 2030 to 2070, then thermageddon a thousand years later for survivors to face. An extinction worse than 65 million years ago.

_________________"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

There is one element missing out of your point johhny, religion and mainly the catholic church as it went around the world dominating countries and forcing the locals to do their bidding or die, that is where the issue with high populations started and we are talking about 1000 years head start on advertising and modern technology being the cause.

There is one element missing out of your point johhny, religion and mainly the catholic church as it went around the world dominating countries and forcing the locals to do their bidding or die, that is where the issue with high populations started and we are talking about 1000 years head start on advertising and modern technology being the cause.

Now there's a conspiracy theory I've never heard before. Perhaps it has something to do with the world population growth rate not substantially changing (increasing) until the 20th century. Then of course we have the issue of where it is spiking--the developing regions. Last I checked, they're hardly predominantly catholic. I'll let you get away arguing that point with Mexico...maybe...but that's about it.

Fosgate I take it you know about sowing the seed, which is what the RC's did 1000 years ago and with the trade in slaves that were breeding themselves did rather well out of it as well as stealing their natural resources, so that is where the increase in growth came from originally. It then moved into the other areas such as Asia, by much the same means as an influence for a slave workforce in India and China (and the rest of Asia to a point) by British colonialists who had moved from religion to politics to continue the influence. It is why the RC church has the largest following around the world of any of the christian based religions.

The solutions are in the book "Storms of My Grandchildren". Time is of the essence.

And now you say you are the only one who had a solution, when it is illogical that geothermal can be used universally. Hansen's solutions were to immediately replace all coal fired power plants with Gen IV nuclear reactors that used nuclear waste and put out very little, and short lived waste. Along with increasing solar, wind, tidal, and wave generators where they would be appropriate. He also said population should be reduced by any humanitarian means possible. The time was now (2009).The 90% reduction in HGHGs had to be by 2020 for even a chance at stopping positive feedbacks from nature. Positive feedbacks being ice loss albedo change warming and methane self release geometric warming to a thermal maximum event too fast for species to adapt. If you knew all the facts and math, it is too late to prevent the human population crash by any palatable means.Preventing our own extinction along with 90% or so of all species in a thousand years or less is what is most important. I had one child in 1988, before it fell below 1 in 1998 (with implementation time). I have lived an all solar lifestyle for over 14 years with an eco footprint 1/20th the average American. If everyone did what I did, when I did it, we would not be standing at the threshold of ecocide. What have you done and when?

_________________"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

you only gave a poor solution for one type of energy for a small part of the world... I gave two solutions that are applicable world-wide. It is far more feasible for people to have a garden and a well-insulated house then a trans-Atlantic power line.

Fosgate I take it you know about sowing the seed, which is what the RC's did 1000 years ago and with the trade in slaves that were breeding themselves did rather well out of it as well as stealing their natural resources, so that is where the increase in growth came from originally.

Funny how any substantial spiking didn't occur until the 20th century, which of course coincides with post industrial revolution advances in technology.

Quote:

It then moved into the other areas such as Asia, by much the same means as an influence for a slave workforce in India and China (and the rest of Asia to a point) by British colonialists who had moved from religion to politics to continue the influence. It is why the RC church has the largest following around the world of any of the christian based religions.

That may be why it has the largest following, however it's hardly the influence for folks in these areas multiplying like rabbits today.

Fosgate I take it you know about sowing the seed, which is what the RC's did 1000 years ago and with the trade in slaves that were breeding themselves did rather well out of it as well as stealing their natural resources, so that is where the increase in growth came from originally. It then moved into the other areas such as Asia, by much the same means as an influence for a slave workforce in India and China (and the rest of Asia to a point) by British colonialists who had moved from religion to politics to continue the influence. It is why the RC church has the largest following around the world of any of the christian based religions.

You forget there are even more moslems, and their slave trading, plus TFR of double the Roman Catholics. The real geometric rise in population came with the usage of fossil fuels and industrialization. Then technology in medicine gave us less child mortality and longer lives, while wars became insufficient to stop the rise and became non or negatively selective. Religions, cultures, the wrong economic system, and general selfishness and ignorance with lack of foresight were all factors. It has gotten to the point that having any kids is helping us toward mass deaths starting in the 2030s and finishing with about 5% survivors from peak in the 2040s, around 2070. Then a level off while CAGW sets in more and more to AETM and the finish of the ELE started with the Folsom Point.People will not do enough, in time, to prevent causing their own and millions of other species' extinction. It is sickening to have known since 1967, mistakenly thought better of people, and now come to this conclusion.If you think rising gas and food prices are bad now, wait until 2015. AGW will keep making its relentless drive, too, faster and faster. Even total numbskulls will see it, but it will be too late to implement the needed changes that should have happened last century. You will see and know chaos.http://www.independent.co.uk/environmen ... 06484.htmland Ann, the moslems are much worse than the catholics who are very bad. Also evangelicals, baptists, and mormons are bad. Plus, government workers are bad. They get an automatic raise with more kids, and free medical.

_________________"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

if you want to blame the Christians, I would suggest that the biggest restriction of the growth of human populations was the combination of war and attempts to starve the enemies of such wars. Christianity brought peace to much of the world and food aid to the starving. Birth control is a very recent thing and the Catholics just don't like people hiding their fornication with these modern items like condoms and birth control pills. The Catholics are still against fornication but that does not stop drunk teens from making babies.

Oh, and Muslims stone their prostitutes... there is a solution to rampant sex drive for you.