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Problem with Knights
page 4

> *Originally posted by **[GiovanniV](/forums/228/topics/324706?page=3#posts-6928821):***
>
> I’m sick of people saying that Knights are underpowered. Classes are meant to be different for a reason, now lets talk more about knights. Knights have Insane Defence / AoE / Shield / Block + Heal / Stun (Since you lose a turn if you get your rage sucked out) / Double Attack (same as Multi for Archers) and one last important detail… HP!
>
> I’m an Archer with over 14k PATK and I still get out-damaged by Knights with 12.5k patk. How is this possible? The answer is easy: The famous mage/knight astral Will Destroyer. Couple of friends of mine who are over 17k PATK Archers also see this pattern for top level knights. Archers are meant for damage / Knights are meant for defence / Mages are meant for support.
>
> Instead of saying that Knights are underpowered, watch the top players on each server and you will notice that a Knight is probably on top. In my honest opinion Knights are the most Over-Powered class in the game, a knight should either be a tank or attacker, shouldn’t be both. I normally do 6k – 10k with my crits and Knights do the same damage without crit.
> The only downfall of being a knight is the fact that you will probably not be in the top 10 for WB, but as I mentioned ealier knights are meant for defence. If you want to be in the top 10 go make an archer xD.
Oh, really? In my server there’s only one knight in top ten and the only reason is because he spent a lot on mount training (average 500 point for each stat).

So knights with similar level and br as archers do more damage than archers? Then wb would be filled with knights not archers, since most knights use wd.
Knights aren’t op, and it has been proven with fine sheets of text here. IMHO, I only want block to be counted in wb, since it’s lower daru and gold amounts that bother me most as knight. With more gold and daru, I’d have better astrals and troops. And I’d see knights in top 10 in wb.
1 top knight who cashes insanely isn’t proof that knights are op. He’d be top with that amount of cash as mage or archer as well.
I sincerely doubt devs will change anything. They didn’t knights on Chinese servers, won’t change anything here.

Now all knights who complain about fighting mages forget one thing: the br they get from skills. Mages get 15% attack and 20% mdef, knights get 15% attack, 20% pdef AND 20% HP. So if you get beaten by a mage with 1k br less but you get 2k from skills it’s just logical.

I think the main reason knights aren’t on the wb top 10 is because of their astralz also. Most of them get things like pdef/mdef/hp which has nothing to do with wb while archers get like patck/crit/crit dmg+. Also like someone said earlier, archers are meant to do damage.
Also, i want to point out that br isn’t a good way to value strength of a player. Yes, it is a good average but it is not a true means of valuing someone’s strength. A difference of 5k br doesn’t mean that the one with the +5k br is stronger. Example: The weaker br might be a knight with a minute amount of matck and have a lot of astrals that don’t contribute to br while the higher br might be a mage with 2k patck from wings and astrals that brings br up but don’t necessarily work (like crit) So maybe the higher br got so unlucky that she/he didn’t crit. Well…does that higher br mean anything now? It is quite hard to calculate the strength of each class and i recommend not doing so. Just enjoy the game

> *Originally posted by **[LordWotan](/forums/228/topics/324706?page=4#posts-7288504):***
>
> Well, knights can’t beat mages who has the same br, but archers can. I think Mages are OP for me.
Did I not point out that knights get a ‘’br bonus’’? If you and the mage would do a skill reset the mage would have much more br.

no one here mentioned that knights have a tough time in wb for the fact our doubles broke. the same time they nerfed illusion after that one update. i used to be able to double almost every round except for when i used delphic. immediately after that update knights lost the ability to double. and at the same time crit rates for wb went up so everyone started making crit builds even if they werent archers. so knights got f’d up and archers got a boost. fix the crit rate back to normal and give knights the previous cast speeds back and the problem is solved. damn i hate this game…

i wouldnt say they cant DH (double hit), its just kinda difficult for ulti slasher and basically impossible for thrasher… now if ur on a lagbox and u were able to dh before and cant now.. thats a bit different but 50% (read: slasher) still works completely fine… also, if u have the same consistent lag/delay between input and output.. u should work on trying to find the correct timing for that
i would say willy is the closest to a decent argument over why archers do so much better… they have a single set of astrals they use (no crit/det sitting on the sidelines) which means any time they improve one of their atks it goes for pve/wb and pvp (and helps rage gain) as opposed to the rest that have to split income between normal atk gear and wb gear

no i wasnt on a lag box. and yes ulti could double all the time. im not the only one who noticed the change after the update, pretty much every knight in my guild did. are you even a knight? getting tired of archers thinking they get what its like playing a knight.,
btw. Jaymz s1, been playing since day 1. i understand timing thanks…

> *Originally posted by **[markboy11](/forums/228/topics/324706?page=4#posts-7295854):***
> > *Originally posted by **[Anamnesis613](/forums/228/topics/324706?page=4#posts-7291460):***
> >
> > too bad that br bonus gets nulled by the inherent br bonus of matk…
>
> nulled? LOL mages get 5% more br from matk, knights 20% from hp.
too bad a 20% increase in hp only is equivalent to a 5% increase in br… and seeing as matk is weighted at like .2 higher br than patk… mages have it better overall

I can give a bit and say a critic knight is a beast, but a knight has no active skills that can give hp on demand. A mage can cure like mad, and the archer has that absorb hp attack. Knights do not, except if they use one of their precious rune slots for the hp cure. However, a knight with high block can cure like mad, even to the point of rendering an enemy’s attack worse than useless, making block a knights most critical stat.

> *Originally posted by **[Anamnesis613](/forums/228/topics/324706?page=4#posts-7302561):***
> > *Originally posted by **[markboy11](/forums/228/topics/324706?page=4#posts-7296959):***
> > > *Originally posted by **[Anamnesis613](/forums/228/topics/324706?page=4#posts-7296675):***
> > > > *Originally posted by **[markboy11](/forums/228/topics/324706?page=4#posts-7295854):***
> > > > > *Originally posted by **[Anamnesis613](/forums/228/topics/324706?page=4#posts-7291460):***
> > > > >
> > > > > too bad that br bonus gets nulled by the inherent br bonus of matk…
> > > >
> > > > nulled? LOL mages get 5% more br from matk, knights 20% from hp.
> > >
> > > too bad a 20% increase in hp only is equivalent to a 5% increase in br… and seeing as matk is weighted at like .2 higher br than patk… mages have it better overall
> >
> > where did your logic go? mages get 1.05 br per matk, knights 1 per patk. so hp is a 5% overall increase but matk only 1.5%
>
> an atkbr % bonus is leaps and bounds better than a hp buff. ‘oh look at me i got a hp buff, im gonna go outlive the boss now and lots of money’ said no knight ever.
So… you think that if you get more br from 1 matk point than 1patk points, you do more damage with matk? So if a mage with 10k matk would do a skill with the same damage as knight with 10k patk (like HS) he would do more damage? Well I don’t think it works like that.

you could say that shield is like a heal, albeit one based on your hp and not on atk, and it can be cast at full hp 10k shield is kind of the same thing as a 10k heal unless u dont actually have ur shield broken by dmg