I hear rumors DL may eliminate all B757 TATL flying in the foreseeable future. One of the reasons would be the inconsistencies in the product up front. Makes sense in a way.

With other capacity reductions in mind, the B767 could easily handle the extra burden I would guess.

Which routes could be in jeopardy due to this? You know, places where a B767 would be just a little over the top...like KEF(would it decrease chances of a return?), Scandinavia, UK...other seaonal routes...

How will this place DL competitively along with UA and AA on similar routes?

[Edited 2011-09-08 17:38:48]

Question Conventional Wisdom. While not all commonly held beliefs are wrong…all should be questioned.

I doubt DL will discontinue all 757 TATL flying. Most of it is done on the ex-TWA 757s with nose to tail AVOD. There are also some routes that are done on ex-NW 757s (5600) which would explain the consistency up front and in Y compared to the ex-TWA 757s -- Old overheads, no PTVs, older seats. Those 5600s can be pulled and used on routes to Hawaii, South America, and Tokyo as they have ETOPS and winglets.

Sounds like garbage to me. DL uses the 757 on too many important transatlantic routes, as stated above.

In recent years, the 757 has provided an advantage to some airlines by allowing them to provide multiple schedules (a la CO going 4X on 75Ls EWR-LHR) as a way of attracting more premium fliers.

If DL is having issues with "product inconsistencies" then UA/CO certainly has their work cut out for them, with 2-class BusinessFirst on the PMCO 757s and 3 class services on PMUA planes, both of which will be used out of IAD and EWR. However, judging by the fact that UA/CO has decided NOT to go forth with one standardized product, I don't believe it is too much of an issue; therefore, I cannot see why this is the case with Delta.

Furthermore, the 757 allows DL to link some of its secondary East Coast hubs such as CVG and BOS to key European cities like LHR, CDG and AMS because they are within the aircraft's range. They've also allowed some wiggle room with the AF-KL JV to serve cities like PHL and PIT. Those may not have succeeded (largely for other reasons), but at least the 757 allowed those options to materialize at some point.

I don't think so. I retired in '05 and we (DL) hadn't started flying TATL with the 757s at that time. Matter of fact, I don't think DL started TATL service with the 757 until after they emerged from BK.

[Edited 2011-09-08 22:15:48]

"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen

I think my source is reliable, however, if deemed too speculative just delete thread please...

Obviously, B757's are on their way out regardless, at some point. However, my source stated that this is an operational change before airplane retirements are due. Providing more service consistencies as well as operational efficiencies were some of the reasons given.

We'll just have to wait and see I guess...

Question Conventional Wisdom. While not all commonly held beliefs are wrong…all should be questioned.

I would believe it if someone told me they were going to cancel all TATL 75A flying (among other reasons, due to the product up front). I would not believe it if someone told me they were going to get rid of all TATL 757 flying including the 75E fleet. I think the 75E will be doing its thing for a very long time.

Quoting peanuts (Reply 11):Obviously, B757's are on their way out regardless, at some point.

The 75Es are new enough, and accumulate cycles slowly enough (as they rarely perform flights shorter than 5 hours), that they could easily fly with DL for 15 or even 20 more years.

IF the rumor is true, I think the following would lose service: JFK-KEF, JFK-SNN, JFK-MAN, JFK-AGP, JFK-VLC, JFK-ARN, JFK-CPH, PIT-CDG, and probably PHL-CDG as well. I also think the summer seasonal BOS-CDG would be dropped on DL metal and AF would just upgauge one of their flights. And now that I think about it, JFK-DKR is also a 757 route that probably doesn't warrant and upgauge.

JFK-DUB, JFK-BRU, and JFK-FRA would certainly all get upgauged to 767s.

One has to wonder if there is pressure to upgauge the most profitable TATL routes and cut the NB TATL flying largely because the ATI/JV with AC/KL generates re enue despite funneling traffic through their networks.

Pressure could be cost related, or from partners who neted higher network utilizaion.

Hard to believe the likes of JFK-AGP and JFK-VLC make money without any demand upfront and Y fares for 500-600 euros R/T in the middle of august (Spain high high high season). Know people who have flown both routes this summer and say flights averaged 90% loads in Y although plenty of empty seats in J.

Cheapiest JFK R/T from MAD or BCN during summer is normally above 800 euros, much bigger markets than malaga and valencia although much more competition (IB, CO, DL, AA, etc).

Quoting FSDan (Reply 14):JFK-DUB, JFK-BRU, and JFK-FRA would certainly all get upgauged to 767s.

Not sure about JFK-BRU being upgraded as there is a lot of competition on the route, BRU is now a Star hub, and SN is said to soon be inaugurating its own BRU-JFK sometime next year.
I think DL will focus BRU traffic via ATL and via surrounding Skyteam partners (AF and KL).

Quoting TOMMY767 (Reply 4):I doubt DL will discontinue all 757 TATL flying. Most of it is done on the ex-TWA 757s with nose to tail AVOD. There are also some routes that are done on ex-NW 757s (5600) which would explain the consistency up front and in Y compared to the ex-TWA 757s -- Old overheads, no PTVs, older seats. Those 5600s can be pulled and used on routes to Hawaii, South America, and Tokyo as they have ETOPS and winglets.

Wow. I thought these PMNW 757s had already been upgraded to the rest of the longhaul 757 fleet to maintain consistency. Is there any plan to do this?

Quoting TOMMY767 (Reply 4):I doubt DL will discontinue all 757 TATL flying. Most of it is done on the ex-TWA 757s with nose to tail AVOD.

Thus, most of the inconsistency is in the fact that most 763ER have no such thing as nose-to-tail AVOD... and neither does 744, although it does not do much t-atl curently.

I see no big deal with up-front inconsistencies as long as one given configuration (say, the less comfortable) is always used on the same destinations or flights, ie, those that get the lowest yields with little J traffic in this example.
Most airlines in fact do this, 757 or not, because 1. their existing fleet, when upgraded, is not upgraded all at once, and 2. they have specific sub-fleets with specific configurations for specific markets. As a result, most big airlines have "inconsistent" seat offers throughout their whole fleet.

That was part of the wording how it was diluted to me...
Just to reiterate: highly speculative, as there is one person between my (known to be reliable) source and ATL. So I have to take into account a certain level of dilution of information.

Basically it was stated DL is questioning the sense of B757 TATL and redeploying them transcon instead.

I do have a feeling there are some significantly intense things going on at headquarters currently. We know of staffing reductions, major new software implementation headaches and the list goes on and on. Sounds like crunch time to me, on many different levels.

Question Conventional Wisdom. While not all commonly held beliefs are wrong…all should be questioned.

Quoting TOMMY767 (Reply 16):PHL-CDG has already been dropped. PIT-CDG is arguably on it's way out as well.

We'll see about PITCDG. The flight is currently going 4x weekly until the end of October, then is going into hibernation through the winter. It is slated to return at the end of March, again at 4x weekly (and hopefully going up to 5x weekly, as it is during peak summer months) but we will see if this flight is able to make it on its own without the State and Taxpayer subsidies, which ended in June.

It is no secret that the flight had not been hitting revenue targets even with the subsidy in place, but we will have to see.