Let's use a bit of imagination for this one. Suppose you are in a building with a small child, and you become ill. You have close relatives in the next building. You would like them to assist with childcare.

Clue - both parties have a phone of some sort. You could ring next door, say "please can you assist with childcare", and they would come round and assist/ Don't you think that could work?

Um......yes, I guess that’s what I was alluding to......meaning CONTACT! They, theoretically, transferred the virus North. Though it’s debatable if anyone was actually infected, as this is most probably just misinformation in any case........difficult to interpret double, double bluffing buffoons!

Absolutely distraught.....who would believe it? Woke up with the sniffles.......we’re setting off to my family in Greece. Please keep me informed of any news in Blighty......need some chit chat with my Ouzo

Who knows, the Prime Minister may even deem us worthy enough to show his face.

Getting toxic this, the longer it goes on for. The sight of leading cabinet ministers willing to undermine weeks of public health advice in order to defend an unelected adviser was one of the most unedifying sights I’ve seen in politics for a very long time.

Very sad that you can’t express an opposing opinion without being subjected to insults.

It wasn't an insult. I said you are/were defending the indefensible and it makes you look like a Tory Party apparatchik. I don't believe for one single minute that you were offended by my comment. I really can't do with people who twist the posts of others. I think it's best if we both ignored each other from now on.

Oh you and Jack were just joshing! Well silly me. Doh!
But does it really add to the debate, or is just meant to be a comment to rile the Conservative voters on here?

I don’t speak for jackhiggins and I have no idea whether he was ‘joshing’ or not. But maybe you should stop taking things quite literally. Frankie Boyle once likened UKIP to the Nazis but without the style. That’s amusing.

I can't see Cummings hanging on for much longer. Tory MPs are now sticking their heads above the parapet and calling for him to be sacked. Also, Grant Shapps slippery performance on the TV isn't doing Number 10 any favours. One Tory MP sums up the whole mess: "There cannot be one law for the Prime Minister’s staff and another for everyone else. He has sent out completely the wrong message and his position is no longer tenable".

To be fair to Grant Shapps he is being completely hung out to dry. He seems a pretty ok guy to me and one of the better of a horrendous bunch.
Would have been nice to see the likes of BJ, Gove, Raab or Wankcock try and squirm their way out of this but they are all cowards and decide to send out the fall guy.

Shapps has done a decent job at fronting it. I agree it's poor that he's been left to do it - in particular Johnson and Hancock should be leading the response. I can't see how Cummings can survive this and nor should he. Suspect more will come out which makes his position increasingly untenable - the trip to the castle could be an interesting one.

Last edited by taio on Sun May 24, 2020 11:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

I don’t speak for jackhiggins and I have no idea whether he was ‘joshing’ or not. But maybe you should stop taking things quite literally. Frankie Boyle once likened UKIP to the Nazis but without the style. That’s amusing.

You know as well as I do that accusing someone of being a nazi in today's society is toxic. Like I said, it offers nothing to the debate.

Well at least we all know what the government and all the senior Tory MPs were doing whilst they should have been sorting out PPE and setting up test, track and trace - they were clearly debating and worrying about how to minimise that damage from the public finding out about Cummings and his holiday jaunts. Priorities and all that...

“What do you mean we need to sort out PPE and testing, don’t you know that we’ve got bigger things to worry about - Dom’s been seen in Durham FFS...”

You know as well as I do that accusing someone of being a nazi in today's society is toxic. Like I said, it offers nothing to the debate.

Don’t think I did?? Just find it amusing that people, like you , wear their political persuasion like a tattoo and will defend anything that die party says or does, no matter how wrong it is - verstehen?

Sunday Times have covered a big piece of work that has reviewed Johnsons failure in March to get on top of the virus.

This is a massive read and dont expect it to make any ripples on here whilst the Cummings saga rolls on but once it dies sown im sure we'll be seeing this report broken down into more manageable chunks and getting the attention it deserves

Has he been furloughed?the Churchill comparisons are becoming more hollow by the day,could you imagine Winnie hiding away in a time of crisis,no exactly time for BJ to front up and address this mess head on,either come out and defend and explain Cummings actions,or give him the boot,this story is becoming tedious now,and it's detracting from the business of government.

Dominic Cummings has broken the number 1 rule,never let yourself become the story.

Reading this thread, it isn’t hard to imagine the true blue sycophants endorsing policies akin to the Germans in the 30’s. Very disturbing.

“One of the greatest advantages of the totalitarian elites of the twenties and thirties was to turn any statement of fact into a question of motive.”
Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism.

This is what I see when I cabinet ministers jump (at command) to the defense of Cummings and point the finger at us for 'political point scoring'.
For highlighting the UK having the worst death record in Europe.
For NHS staff who once wore a Labour badge saying there isn't enough PPE where they work in TV interviews.

Don’t think I did?? Just find it amusing that people, like you , wear their political persuasion like a tattoo and will defend anything that die party says or does, no matter how wrong it is - verstehen?

You know as well as I do that accusing someone of being a nazi in today's society is toxic. Like I said, it offers nothing to the debate.

No ones accused anyone of being a Nazi. It is just that you have completely misunderstood the point and are now getting upset over something that wasn't there

The point being made is the danger posed to a society when large swathes of the population become so devoted to a political ideology/party/side that they will defend everything they do no matter how wrong it is

We have seen the impacts in our political system of how politicians and the media that supports them now dont even try to hide their lies because people now care more about their side winning the argument than the truth

The most extreme example of this kind of political sycophantic behaviour leading to terrible events is how the Nazi party rose to power (under the support of right wing papers like the Mail) and so this is the example used to drive the point home

I would go one step further and say that the kind of people who put ideology other truth and morality are exactly the kind of people who had they lived in Germany in the 1930's would have been supporting and aiding the rise of the nazi party

This isn't calling them Nazis or likening Johnsons govt to the Nazi party but highlighting the damage to our society this kind of behaviour can result in and why people challenge and attack it so vehemently on forums like this

Now you can completely disagree with the points made but at least understand them and dont get upset about something that was neither stated or implied

Sunday Times have covered a big piece of work that has reviewed Johnsons failure in March to get on top of the virus.

This is a massive read and dont expect it to make any ripples on here whilst the Cummings saga rolls on but once it dies sown im sure we'll be seeing this report broken down into more manageable chunks and getting the attention it deserves

I'll read the ST article later but a comment on another forum summed it up.

Boris and Cummings will tough it out. And all the while the media are going bananas over a single person, no one will be holding the Government to account on the 20,000 extra British people dead in care homes due to woeful policy errors. Good priorities guys. This is classic Trump playbook...

I'll read the ST article later but a comment on another forum summed it up.

Boris and Cummings will tough it out. And all the while the media are going bananas over a single person, no one will be holding the Government to account on the 20,000 extra British people dead in care homes due to woeful policy errors. Good priorities guys. This is classic Trump playbook...

I think people are too ready too see dead cats when there are none, Cummings was meant to be the man who threw them, he was never supposed to be the cat. They didn't want us to know this, which is why it was hidden and then why it was denied.
Government's defense of him has done a great deal to shine a light on how they operate and the rank hypocrisy, the changing of fact and truth etc to some who haven't' thus far seen it.
I think it will be a more powerful wake up than some stats and figures for some people as it's a slap in the face to everyone who obeyed the rules and made huge sacrifices. Sacrifices it seems some in power didn't feel applied to them and while the full force of the state was mobilized to tell us what the rules where, now that same power is now turned to defend one man who broke them because he's in the club.

No ones accused anyone of being a Nazi. It is just that you have completely misunderstood the point and are now getting upset over something that wasn't there

The point being made is the danger posed to a society when large swathes of the population become so devoted to a political ideology/party/side that they will defend everything they do no matter how wrong it is

We have seen the impacts in our political system of how politicians and the media that supports them now dont even try to hide their lies because people now care more about their side winning the argument than the truth

The most extreme example of this kind of political sycophantic behaviour leading to terrible events is how the Nazi party rose to power (under the support of right wing papers like the Mail) and so this is the example used to drive the point home

I would go one step further and say that the kind of people who put ideology other truth and morality are exactly the kind of people who had they lived in Germany in the 1930's would have been supporting and aiding the rise of the nazi party

This isn't calling them Nazis or likening Johnsons govt to the Nazi party but highlighting the damage to our society this kind of behaviour can result in and why people challenge and attack it so vehemently on forums like this

Now you can completely disagree with the points made but at least understand them and dont get upset about something that was neither stated or implied

DA,I suggest you read JM's post at 7:17am if you believe I have misunderstood.
As for your belief, I'm 'Getting upset over the comments,' that's made my day! Just about the most amusing thing I've read on here for weeks!
The point I was trying to make,(obviously poorly) was that using the German government policies of the 1930's and comparing them to the Johnson government now is frankly a sh!t analogy and hardly constructive to 'sensible' debate. Hope that helps.