It's not about disagreeing with me, it's about this mentality in Pittsburgh where we want to run the star players out of town during a rough stretch, but we defend the lesser players like crazy. Terry Bradshaw won 4 super bowls, and he got it worse than Ben ever has thus far. It's as if the fans here look for reason to forget all the good a star athlete has done when he does a few things wrong.

It's not about disagreeing with me, it's about this mentality in Pittsburgh where we want to run the star players out of town during a rough stretch, but we defend the lesser players like crazy. Terry Bradshaw won 4 super bowls, and he got it worse than Ben ever has thus far. It's as if the fans here look for reason to forget all the good a star athlete has done when he does a few things wrong.

Is suggesting that another goalie(Vokoun) might be better, when all the numbers support it, really "running him out of town"?

Is suggesting that another goalie(Vokoun) might be better, when all the numbers support it, really "running him out of town"?

Ah, more numbers and stats from you. But yes, from what your other Fleury bashing buddies have said, it does. How many "TRADE FLEURY!!!!111!!!1111!111!!!one!!!!!" posts have popped up on these threads?

It's not about disagreeing with me, it's about this mentality in Pittsburgh where we want to run the star players out of town during a rough stretch, but we defend the lesser players like crazy. Terry Bradshaw won 4 super bowls, and he got it worse than Ben ever has thus far. It's as if the fans here look for reason to forget all the good a star athlete has done when he does a few things wrong.

It's not a rough stretch, it's a rough four years, plus a mediocre career. I'd say that warrants a lot of criticism.

Ah, more numbers and stats from you. But yes, from what your other Fleury bashing buddies have said, it does. How many "TRADE FLEURY!!!!111!!!1111!111!!!one!!!!!" posts have popped up on these threads?

Pittsburgh just isn't a smart sports town. Passionate, but not smart.

Good thing there are the super smart fans like you to rein everyone in.

Considering they are serious about keeping Fleury fresh for the playoffs, that won't happen this year. Even if Fleury is as bad as the stat boys are saying he is, he's not going to play that many games in a row.

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It's not a rough stretch, it's a rough four years, plus a mediocre career. I'd say that warrants a lot of criticism.

Just how in the hell is one supposed to judge a goaltender anyway? All the stats are imperfect measures as they are highly influenced by factors outside of the goalie's control.

So what's left then? Does it end up being completely subjective, which is obviously prone to all sorts of subtle bias and selective memory? Sheer results? Or maybe you end up going back to the stats because though imperfect, you figure that a lot of it ends up evening out in the long haul.

Considering they are serious about keeping Fleury fresh for the playoffs, that won't happen this year. Even if Fleury is as bad as the stat boys are saying he is, he's not going to play that many games in a row.

He needs to make big saves more consistently, which was what made him unique and valuable before. He can't be blamed extensively for most games though. Some people can't accept that.

This is a town where some people actually blamed Roethlisberger when the Steelers put up over 30 points and lost to the Raiders. Just the way it is. The blame's gotta be focused on one guy and the QB and goalie are easy targets.

Because the Penguins don't need a Sharp or a Kessel right now, and Fleury isn't the problem with the team.

God, why can't the yinzer mentality just stay on the Stiller forums?

The Penguins' powerplay desperately needs the symmetry a right hand shot can provide. If you disagree then replace Kessel or Sharpe with a guy like Hjalmarsson in my prior argument.

I never said Fleury was the problem. In fact, I said I thought he's been okay. He's not better than Vokoun. He's younger, but he's also more than twice as expensive.

There's no need to dump him for cap space, but if you take Fleury off the roster the team does not get worse or better come playoff time. He's not a core player in the sense that the Penguins cup hopes don't die if he breaks his leg on the last day of the regular season. He should be on the block if it brings back a long term solution for the top 6 forward or top 4 defense groups.

Yes, he's saying the team has given up on Fleury and that's why they play poorly. I'd say that's blaming the majority of the Penguins problems on him.

Well, read into it however you like, but I don't think anyone is trying to paint the black and white picture that you're claiming. It just seems like you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder about criticism towards Fleury.

The Penguins' powerplay desperately needs the symmetry a right hand shot can provide. If you disagree then replace Kessel or Sharpe with a guy like Hjalmarsson in my prior argument.

I never said Fleury was the problem. In fact, I said I thought he's been okay. He's not better than Vokoun. He's younger, but he's also more than twice as expensive.

There's no need to dump him for cap space, but if you take Fleury off the roster the team does not get worse or better come playoff time. He's not a core player in the sense that the Penguins cup hopes don't die if he breaks his leg on the last day of the regular season. He should be on the block if it brings back a long term solution for the top 6 forward or top 4 defense groups.

So lets see, you have a goalie that has been to two finals and won a cup, and you also consider the fact the Penguins don't want to wear out any of their goalies, and you think trading Fleury is a good idea?

I don't always agree with Shero, but I'm glad he doesn't take advice from the typical fans.

People here love fleury too much. Who here actually feels that they're team has a chance to win when fleury's in net? I may be being a little too harsh but fleury sometimes shows up to games and sometimes doesnt. Like during the ottowa game he was amazing and we wouldnt have won without him, i finally start having faith in him, then he lets in a bucnh of goals against the islanders that he couldve stopped even if they were caused by thurnovers.