Posted by: Johnnie F.

Will he really help the British police to save those expenses for the observation of that embassy, as they cannot miss the moment he leaves it by their own court's diction? About 5.3 million pounds already according to the Huffington Post.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

STOCKHOLM (AP) — WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange asked Swedish police on Tuesday to investigate what happened to a suitcase he suspects was stolen from him by intelligence agents as he traveled from Sweden to Germany in 2010.

The suitcase contained three laptops with WikiLeaks material, including evidence of a "war crime" allegedly committed by U.S. troops in Afghanistan, according to an affidavit that Assange's lawyer filed along with a criminal complaint to police at Stockholm's Arlanda Airport.

In the affidavit, Assange suggested that the bag may have been illegally seized "as part of an intelligence operation with the purpose of gathering information about me."

He offered no proof but said all attempts to locate the bag had failed.

The move comes a day before President Barack Obama visits Sweden.

WikiLeaks spokesman Kristinn Hrafnsson said similar complaints would be filed in other countries, including Germany and Denmark, alleging potentially unlawful U.S. intelligence operations against Assange.

"It's time to confront it and fight back on all fronts," Hrafnsson told the AP.

According to the affidavit, the "medium-size soft suitcase with tan color, trolley wheels and an extendable handle" disappeared when Assange traveled from Stockholm to Berlin on Sept. 27, 2010.

"The suspected seizure or theft occurred at a time of intense attempts by the U.S. to stop WikiLeaks' publications of 2010," Assange said, and suggested that Swedish authorities "seek explanations" from members of Obama's delegation during their visit this week.

The police border control division at Arlanda Airport opened an investigation as a matter of course after receiving the complaint Tuesday, spokeswoman Jessica Fremnell said.

She declined to comment on Assange's suggestion to interrogate people in Obama's entourage, saying "we make our own decisions about what we think we need to do."

Assange's lawyer, Per Samuelson, told the AP that airport personnel in Berlin and Stockholm had not been able to locate the bag and could not explain how it got lost.

"It was checked in and we have luggage tags and everything," he said. "It's gone without a trace."

WikiLeaks has published tens of thousands of pages of secret U.S. diplomatic and military communications over the last few years, deeply angering the Obama administration. U.S. Army Pvt. Chelsea Manning, previously known as Bradley Manning, was recently sentenced to 35 years in prison for giving U.S. government secrets to WikiLeaks.

According to Assange's affidavit, the missing suitcase contained evidence of a "massacre" of civilians by U.S. military forces in Garani, Afghanistan.

A U.S. Army investigation concluded that a 2009 airstrike killed 26 civilians, at least 78 Taliban fighters and five Afghan police in the village of Garani. Local officials said the attack killed 140 villagers. It was not immediately clear that this was the event Assange was referring to.

At Manning's court-martial, prosecutors tried unsuccessfully to connect Manning to an encrypted Garani video placed in December 2009 on the computer of a Brookhaven National Laboratory worker.

Assange's affidavit also accuses U.S. military intelligence of monitoring his "journalistic activities" while he attended a conference in Berlin in December 2009 and using that surveillance to assist the prosecution of Manning.

A German newspaper, meanwhile, reported that Assange filed a criminal complaint Tuesday against a former U.S. Marine, accusing the man of spying on him in Berlin in 2009.

The Sueddeutsche Zeitung said the charges were filed at the Federal Prosecutor's office in Karlsruhe. The office did not immediately respond to an AP request for comment.

According to the newspaper, the U.S. soldier, who was based in Germany from 2006-2010, also worked in intelligence and spied on Assange while he attended a Chaos Computer Club meeting in 2009 in Berlin. The paper reported that the Marine was a witness in the trial against Manning.

Assange has been holed up for more than a year at Ecuador's Embassy in London to avoid being extradited to Sweden on sex crimes allegations.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Julian Assange might not be welcome by some in the US anymore though the US still has to come up with criminal offences they could be accusing him of. But the world is getting smaller for a lot of people. The last US-president George W. Bush for example is wanted in Switzerland for ordering torture. Will the US extradite him for prosecution in Switzerland?

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Bush's Swiss visit off after complaints on torture

GENEVA (Reuters) - Former President George W. Bush has canceled a visit to Switzerland, where he was to address a Jewish charity gala, due to the risk of legal action against him for alleged torture, rights groups said on Saturday.

Bush was to be the keynote speaker at Keren Hayesod's annual dinner on February 12 in Geneva. But pressure has been building on the Swiss government to arrest him and open a criminal investigation if he enters the Alpine country.

Human rights groups said they had intended to submit a 2,500-page case against Bush in the Swiss city on Monday for alleged mistreatment of suspected militants at Guantanamo Bay, the U.S. naval base in Cuba where captives from Afghanistan, Iraq and other fronts in the so-called War on Terror were interned.

Leftist groups had also called for a protest on the day of his visit next Saturday, leading Keren Hayesod's organizers to announce that they were cancelling Bush's participation on security grounds -- not because of the criminal complaints.

But groups including the New York-based Human Rights Watch and International Federation of Human Rights (FIDH) said the cancellation was linked to growing moves to hold Bush accountable for torture, including waterboarding. He has admitted in his memoirs and television interviews to ordering use of the interrogation technique that simulates drowning.

The action in Switzerland showed Bush had reason to fear legal complaints against him if he travelled to countries that have ratified an international treaty banning torture, he said.

Brody is an American-trained lawyer specialized in pursuing war crimes worldwide, especially those allegedly ordered by former leaders, including Chile's late dictator Augusto Pinochet and Chad's ousted president Hissene Habre. Habre has been charged by Belgium with crimes against humanity and torture, and is currently exiled in Senegal.

PROSECUTE OR EXTRADITE

"President Bush has admitted he ordered waterboarding which everyone considers to be a form of torture under international law. Under the Convention against Torture, authorities would have been obliged to open an investigation and either prosecute or extradite George Bush," Brody said.

Swiss judicial officials have said that Bush would still enjoy a certain diplomatic immunity as a former head of state.

Dominique Baettig, a member of the Swiss parliament from the right-wing People's Party, wrote to the Swiss federal government last week calling for the arrest of Bush for alleged war crimes if he came to the neutral country.

Bush, in his "Decision Points" memoirs on his 2001-2009 presidency, strongly defends the use of waterboarding as key to preventing a repeat of the September 11 attacks on the United States.

Most human rights experts consider the practice a form of torture, banned by the Convention on Torture, an international pact prohibiting torture and other cruel, inhumane or degrading treatment or punishment. Switzerland and the United States are among 147 countries to have ratified the 1987 treaty.

Reuters

Posted by: Baby Farts

Thanks for the link, JM...just made me hate this guy even more.....especially the part where he talks about "his," "whistle blowers." Who designated these f-tards as the official "whistle blowers" or the world? The one thing I enjoyed about the interview was the fear in his face. He's managed to piss off a lot of people and at the same time, compromise the integrity and security of a country which he isn't even a citizen of. He talks about our constitution, bill of rights, history of America, as if he were an American. He has to keep changing his appearance.

Posted by: Just Me

Have not watched this yet but figured as many emotions that were displayed here it might be of interest to someone here

Julian Assange: the '60 Minutes' interview 30 Jan 2011

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In a CBS interview with 60 Minutes aired on Sunday night Mr Assange, who is currently under US criminal investigation over the leaking of hundreds of thousands of secret military reports and diplomatic cables, described members of Wikileaks as "free press activists" and said the website did not have a political agenda

Having to watch a Cheech and Chong movie for research. That is awesome.

Yes, I think my student generation of the 70s was very lucky. We got a lot of individual care and the freedom of interesting research the students and teaching staff had fought for in the 60s at Frankfurt (JWGU), Berlin (FU, HU), Paris (Sorbonne), London (LSE) and Berkely (UCB). But in the 80s the number of students had risen so drastically while educational budgets had not been extended accordingly. Then lots of restrictions were re-introduced so universities could handle the masses; they became facilities of mass production.

Posted by: Baby Farts

Having to watch a Cheech and Chong movie for research. That is awesome. Tom Skerrit was in that movie too.. he played that crazy vietnam vet. Classic.. "I wasn't looking at his neck!" BAM his shoots the bird. " God Damm.it Harry I am stoned!" What was his name again? Sergeant Stadenko?

There's also an album they released called "Sleeping Beauty" or something like that.. Hilarious..You remember a TV show called S.W.A.T? They do their version of it called T.W.A.T. stands for Tactical woman's alert team. Dedicated to serving the department of the interior. LOL....Or the one with Uncle Pervy where he teaches the kids how to light farts.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Once Assange, Manning, and any of the sheep land their a.ss in prison they will know the true meaning of fear. Make an attack on one of the most powerful nations in the world, you'd better be ready to pay the consequences. Perhaps, Assange and the rest of his little sheep didn't have their parents pay them enough attention to them when they were children...Oh boy! Let's make an attack on America in the form of espionage, and when the U.S takes action, let's bitch, whine, cry, gossip, make up sh.t, like a bunch of cry babies.. Or better.. Let's cry "Violation of human rights." Let me fill you in on something..There is no such thing as human rights...

Even in the US many people are trying to protect Human Rights!

Quote

Pay close attention at 4:20mins into the video after his spiel on the Bible. You might learn something.

Sorry, not interesting enough to keep it running that long!

Posted by: Baby Farts

Ok cool. Pull up a seat and let justice be done. You can bet once Assange, and the rest of his pathetic little followers end up in prison they will be afraid...they only have the convenience of HIDING behind the internet now. Ha ha. Once Assange, Manning, and any of the sheep land their a.ss in prison they will know the true meaning of fear. Make an attack on one of the most powerful nations in the world, you'd better be ready to pay the consequences. Perhaps, Assange and the rest of his little sheep didn't have their parents pay them enough attention to them when they were children...Oh boy! Let's make an attack on America in the form of espionage, and when the U.S takes action, let's bitch, whine, cry, gossip, make up sh.t, like a bunch of cry babies.. Or better.. Let's cry "Violation of human rights." Let me fill you in on something..There is no such thing as human rights..

Here... watch this from one of the most gifted comedians of all time.. and genius.

Julian Assange and the other Wikileaks activists don't seem to fear the US. Are there citizens of the US fearing its own government? Do you blame Wikileaks now for the murders committed by Jared Lee Loughner in Tucson? He wrote on the web before his deed that he feared the US government.

Posted by: Baby Farts

This has absolutely NOTHING to do with human rights.. It has to do with FEAR. FEAR because now the U.S is going after these xxxxxxxx who compromised the human rights of everyone in America...and they are AFRAID of being caught and having to do some jail time with Tyrone. Twitter is owned and based in the U.S...if you plan on allowing xxxxxxx like Assange and its supporters to break the law then you will suffer the consequences....Don't like it? Tough shxt...go relocate to a place like North Korea or one of the countries in Africa and see just how many "Human rights" you have. When it comes to national security, yes, we do have a right to see the ip addresses and personal info.

Also, since when do you and the rest of the bleeding heart liberal xxxxxxxx have such a concern for twitter and its users? Do you own stock in the company or something? Are you one of those afraid of being caught only trying to hide behind this violation of human rights mumbo jumbo? In my opinion.. Yes.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Can it be more simplistic than calling somebody who is using his own brain and asking questions not a sympathizer only but a supporter even? Take the break and think a little for yourself!

How can the US government order the internet company Twitter to reveal personal data from foreign politicians without a clear suspicion of having violated an existing law? Bye bye Human Rights! And if Twitter would comply too easily they would loose millions of value in their stocks. Maybe they'll do now anyway due to the only possibility of not being able to protect data as long as their servers are located in the US. They should move their servers and pay their tax billions to another country more sensitive to Human Rights.

Posted by: Baby Farts

Is the U.S. government trying to prove the Wikileaks action right by dealing secretly with Wikileaks supporters?

In my opinion this just shows that Wikileaks and Assange didn't directly violate any U. S. laws. The attorneys need to dig secretly to find something that can be used...

Uh, wrong. The U.S is doing an investigation to bring the criminals to justice. Do you have a problem with that? Crimes WERE committed and supporters of Assange like you and the rest just can't seem to understand that. Frankly, I don't care how the U.S goes about doing their investigation, and it really should be no surprise to you now should it? What did you think we were going to do?

Your last sentence really sums it up. "The attorneys need to dig secretly." No..that's what wikileaks does and has been doing with every chance they get. Isn't that what this is all about?? Wikipricks DIGGING UP SECRETS?? Hello?? Anyone home upstairs? It's ok for them to do it, but it's perceived as a huge sin when the U.S does it.. Gimme a break.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A U.S. court has ordered Twitter to hand over details of the accounts of WikiLeaks and several supporters as part of a criminal investigation into the release of hundreds of thousands of confidential documents.

The December 14 subpoena obtained by the Department of Justice and published by online magazine Salon.com on Friday said the records sought from the microblogging website were "relevant to an ongoing criminal investigation."

It ordered Twitter to provide account information on WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange and Bradley Manning, the U.S. Army intelligence analyst suspected of leaking Pentagon documents made public last year by WikiLeaks.

The information sought by the government includes all connection records and session times, IP addresses used to access Twitter, email and residential addresses plus billing records and details of bank accounts and credit cards.

The subpoena included the accounts of WikiLeaks supporters Jacob Appelbaum, Rop Gonggrijp and Birgitta Jonsdottir, a former WikiLeaks volunteer and member of Iceland's parliament.

"WikiLeaks strongly condemns this harassment of individuals by the U.S. government," WikiLeaks said in a statement issued to Reuters by its London lawyer, Mark Stephens.

Iceland's Foreign Minister Ossur Skarphedinsson told Icelandic media on Saturday his government planned to lodge a protest on Monday with the U.S. ambassador in Reykjavik.

Speaking on state radio, Skarphedinsson said the U.S. authorities' behavior was unacceptable and his government would do everything in its power to protect Jonsdottir.

The U.S. government is examining whether criminal charges can be brought against Assange for helping to make public hundreds of thousands of confidential U.S. diplomatic cables that embarrassed Washington and several of its allies.

WikiLeaks said three of the four individuals targeted by the Department of Justice had never worked for WikiLeaks and were private citizens who supported its public disclosure work voluntarily as activists or politicians.

Two of them were instrumental in helping WikiLeaks make public the Pentagon video that showed a U.S. helicopter crew firing on Iraqi civilians, the statement said. WikiLeaks is instructing its U.S. lawyers to oppose the subpoena, he added.

Jonsdottir, a member of Iceland's foreign relations committee wrote on Twitter that she was seeking legal advice and had spoken to Iceland's minister of justice, who was looking into the case.

Speaking to Sky News on the telephone from Reykjavik, she said the U.S.'s actions were outrageous.

"I have not conducted any criminal activity. I find it to be troublesome because the vice president of the United States has labeled WikiLeaks as a cyber-terrorist organization," she said.

The subpoena gave Twitter Inc three days to provide the records and ordered the San Francisco-based company not to inform the users under investigation.

A federal judge unsealed the order on January 5 after Twitter requested the right to inform the people involved.

A Twitter spokesperson declined to comment on the subpoena but added: "To help users protect their rights, it is our policy to notify users about law enforcement and governmental requests for their information, unless we are prevented by law from doing so."

In its statement, WikiLeaks said the legal step taken by Twitter had made public the existence of a criminal investigation by the U.S. government into the website's work.

WikiLeaks called on Facebook and Google to unseal any similar subpoenas requesting information about its operations.

Stephens said the subpoena showed that the U.S. authorities were having difficulty putting together a case "criminalizing the actions of a journalistic source" as they try to identify the source of the leaked documents.

"What they are trying to do is hoover data up to see if anything can identify the source," the lawyer told Reuters.

Washington has accused WikiLeaks of acting without regard for the safety of those named in classified cables containing candid remarks about foreign leaders and governments.

The State Department said on Friday it has warned several hundred people worldwide it believes may be imperiled and has helped a handful relocate to safer places.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

As you have learned above I'm a descendant of a victim of the Nazi-Horror. If you don't want to believe, it can be proven. Needless to say that you got to pay for all the expenses of that. Will ya?

Many Nazis went with new identities into hiding in other countries to avoid people in Germany recognizing and delivering them to the authorities for trial. It's also a known fact that America couldn't keep all of them out. Many went there and kept breeding. So what Germans' offspring are you? ...and where did you hang that picture? Living room, bedroom, toilet or the kids' room?

Posted by: Baby Farts

Posted by: Johnnie F.

WIKILEAKS chief Julian Assange has said in an interview he signed deals for his autobiography worth more than one million pounds ($1.57 million).

Assange told Britain's Sunday Times newspaper that the money would help him defend himself against allegations of sexual assault made by two women in Sweden.

"I don't want to write this book, but I have to," he said.

"I have already spent 200,000 pounds for legal costs and I need to defend myself and to keep WikiLeaks afloat."

The Australian said he would receive the equivalent of $800,000 from Alfred A. Knopf, his American publisher, and a British deal with Canongate is worth about $500,000.

Money from other markets and serialisation is expected to raise the total to 1.1 million pounds, he said.

The latest project of Assange's whistleblower website is the gradual release of tens of thousands of US diplomatic cables.

Since the latest project began Assange, who is on bail in Britain fighting a bid by Sweden to extradite him over the sex assault claims, has faced problems financing WikiLeaks.

Credit-card companies Visa and MasterCard and the internet payment firm PayPal have blocked donations to WikiLeaks, prompting Assange to label them "instruments of US foreign policy".

The Bank of America, the largest US bank, has also halted all transactions to WikiLeaks.

Washington has been infuriated by WikiLeaks as the site slowly releases the cache of about 250,000 secret US State Department cables. The US is believed to be considering how to indict Assange over the huge leak.

Assange has been staying at a friend's country mansion in eastern England since his release from jail on December 16 on strict bail conditions that include reporting to police daily and wearing an electronic tag.

A court in London is due to hold a full hearing on the Swedish extradition request starting February 7.

news.com.au

----------------------------------

I bet Alfred A. Knopf, his American publisher, willll have sold all copies even before the ink dried. A fixed salary of $800.000 is just a little share of what he'll make of a superseller like that in America. The modest salary shows that Julian Assange isn't greedy.

And all those bitching about Wikileaks and Assange really do help speeding up the run for a copy by the publicity they're creating.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

No, I have not lost my mind! Sorry for taking the liberty to keep using it.

Quote

You quote the press and authorities constantly when it suits your needs to strengthen your weak arguments, like the post about the Lebanese guy being arrested, tortured, blah blah blah.

Ever heard of a difference between information given and opinion, or better position, expressed? Of course I could only tell the information I gained from reading a specific newspaper article or watching a news channel etc. in my own words. But somebody might ask me where I got that information from since it is unlikely that I could have gathered it myself not having been a personal witness. Isn't it better to quote that source of information at the beginning? When the so-called "authorities" deliver an in the interest of the lobby or even pressure groups carefully worked-out "opinion" of their advisors, i. e. the position of their agency or department etc., to the public they don't give information but declare positions, not even state opinions. Positions can be wrong and an opinion can or cannot be shared. Information can be fully true, partly true or not true at all.

Quote

...but it's ok for you to twist peoples' opinions and statements made by users here...like your comment about "Do I hear racism?" Have the voices returned to haunt you again JF? I mean really, if I had said half white president would you have made the same comment? I doubt it. Again, an example of how you like to twist things. There's nothing wrong with what I said so get over it and stop trying to create an alternate debate here. Oh, and thank you for reminding me and the rest of the Korat community about my ethnic background, because I CAN say I AM a native American Indian. Our people didn't torture and kill 5 million Jews, perform sick experiments on them, then put them in an oven on high to bake...or shower them with Zyklon B gas like your country did. You must be really proud of your country huh? Why not contact John Kay and ask him to write a song about that? You are in NO position to be talking about racism, JF.

Sorry, BF: that's in my eyes just another unqualified statement, only proving your own shortcomings. No need to discuss it (again)! I just wonder how you freed yourself of that German ethnicity of yours and your own "share" of the "collective guilt" of Germans you keep bringing up here.

Quote

The quote in which letter sequences had been misquoted in abusive capitalization has been corrected by admin.

..and may I ask you to play along the rules and not alter quotes of other people's posts?

Posted by: Baby Farts

I prefer to use my own brain for my opinion instead of quoting other people, so-called "authorities", even quoting them in bold letters, blindly accepting their thoughts as the truth and ignoring the fact that very often their position demands statements from them they don't believe in themselves. .

Have you lost your mind? This is EXACTLY what the majority of your board consists of, quoting everything and anything from the media. It makes up the majority of the posts on this forum! You quote the press and authorities constantly when it suits your needs to strengthen your weak arguments, like the post about the Lebanese guy being arrested, tortured, blah blah blah. This is exactly what this forum specializes in.

Quote

to support = to give aid or encouragement to a person or cause. (The Free Dictionary)

I think I stated my position answering your question many times already! I haven't sent him a check yet! But maybe you can still convince me to do so!

Why would you need me to convince you? Aren't you able to think for yourself? After all didn't you just say, you use your own brain to form opinions etc.?....Shouldn't be any different in this case now should it?

Quote

Since Julian Assange or another member of the Wikileaks group didn't consult me before their publication I wasn't in the position to give encouragement to their action, either. It happened before me getting informed about it. So what do you want to find out by asking me repeatedly? You seem to want an answer that fits your way of thinking. A simplicistic "yes" or "no". I don't see things as simple as that! I prefer clear statements that cannot be twisted against me.

Of course, but it's ok for you to twist peoples' opinions and statements made by users here...like your comment about "Do I hear racism?" Have the voices returned to haunt you again JF? I mean really, if I had said half white president would you have made the same comment? I doubt it. Again, an example of how you like to twist things. There's nothing wrong with what I said so get over it and stop trying to create an alternate debate here. Oh, and thank you for reminding me and the rest of the Korat community about my ethnic background, because I CAN say I AM a native American Indian. Our people didn't torture and kill 5 million Jews, perform sick experiments on them, then put them in an oven on high to bake...or shower them with Zyklon B gas like your country did. You must be really proud of your country huh? Why not contact John Kay and ask him to write a song about that? You are in NO position to be talking about racism, JF.

In regards to the Bold type font...it's to stress a point...Like when you use the RED font to stress your point...again another example of how it's ok for you to do it, but not me. If I write something like Assange, you quickly edit my post and put a notation to make sure everyone on the forum knows that you changed my original post. Who's censoring stuff now? Who's the control freak now? Isn't this the very thing you complain about, yet you seem to practice it on a daily basis here on your forum in a manner which is clearly intended to try and belittle people and make them look bad. I'm surprised you haven't changed my bold type font to normal yet....

Finally, I sincerely hope there's more to this debate than quoting some lyrics from a has-been hippie Canadian band. May I suggest you download or buy the TV series, "America, the story of the U.S." You just might learn something. I'll give you copy of the series if you want.

The quote in which letter sequences had been misquoted in abusive capitalization has been corrected by admin.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

BF, have you ever heard that great song "Monster" by the American band Steppenwolf, made over 40 years ago? It's as valid as ever:

Once the religious, the hunted and wearyChasing the promise of freedom and hopeCame to this country to build a new visionFar from the reaches of kingdom and popeLike good Christians, some would burn the witchesLater some got slaves to gather riches

But still from near and far to seek AmericaThey came by thousands to court the wildAnd she just patiently smiled and bore a childTo be their spirit and guiding light

And once the ties with the crown had been brokenWestward in saddle and wagon it wentAnd 'til the railroad linked ocean to oceanMany the lives which had come to an endWhile we bullied, stole and bought our a homelandWe began the slaughter of the red man

But still from near and far to seek AmericaThey came by thousands to court the wildAnd she just patiently smiled and bore a childTo be their spirit and guiding light

The blue and grey they stomped itThey kicked it just like a dogAnd when the war overThey stuffed it just like a hog

And though the past has it's share of injusticeKind was the spirit in many a wayBut it's protectors and friends have been sleepingNow it's a monster and will not obey

(Suicide)The spirit was freedom and justiceAnd it's keepers seem generous and kindIt's leaders were supposed to serve the countryBut now they won't pay it no mind'Cause the people grew fat and got lazyAnd now their vote is a meaningless jokeThey babble about law and orderBut it's all just an echo of what they've been toldYeah, there's a monster on the looseIt's got our heads into a nooseAnd it just sits there watchin'

Our cities have turned into junglesAnd corruption is stranglin' the landThe police force is watching the peopleAnd the people just can't understandWe don't know how to mind our own business'Cause the whole worlds got to be just like usNow we are fighting a war over thereNo matter who's the winnerWe can't pay the cost'Cause there's a monster on the looseIt's got our heads into a nooseAnd it just sits there watching

(America)America where are you now?Don't you care about your sons and daughters?Don't you know we need you nowWe can't fight alone against the monster

I prefer to use my own brain for my opinion instead of quoting other people, so-called "authorities", even quoting them in bold letters, blindly accepting their thoughts as the truth and ignoring the fact that very often their position demands statements from them they don't believe in themselves. .

to support = to give aid or encouragement to a person or cause. (The Free Dictionary)

I think I stated my position answering your question many times already! I haven't sent him a check yet! But maybe you can still convince me to do so!

Since Julian Assange or another member of the Wikileaks group didn't consult me before their publication I wasn't in the position to give encouragement to their action, either. It happened before me getting informed about it. So what do you want to find out by asking me repeatedly? You seem to want an answer that fits your way of thinking. A simplicistic "yes" or "no". I don't see things as simple as that! I prefer clear statements that cannot be twisted against me.

Posted by: Baby Farts

"The White House said the release of what it called “stolen cables” to several publications was a “reckless and dangerous action” and warned that some cables, if released in full, could disrupt American operations abroad and put the work and even lives of confidential sources of American diplomats at risk. The statement noted that reports often include “candid and often incomplete information” whose disclosure could “deeply impact not only U.S. foreign policy interests, but those of our allies and friends around the world.”

From the U.S Attorney general Eric Holder:

U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder says the release of thousands of classified U.S. documents and cables by the WikiLeaks organization has put Americans at risk. But Holder would not say what steps he has taken to deal with the leaks.

At a Washington news conference, Attorney General Holder said he condemned in the strongest terms the ongoing leaks of documents by WikiLeaks and said an active criminal investigation remains underway.

"The national security of the United States has been put at risk," said Holder. "The lives of people who work for the American people have been put at risk. The American people themselves have been put at risk by these actions that I believe are arrogant, misguided and ultimately not helpful in any way."

"The Obama administration has told whistleblower WikiLeaks that its expected imminent release of classified State Department cables will put "countless" lives at risk, threaten global counterterrorism operations and jeopardize U.S. relations with its allies."

America, other countries, and people at risk...plain and simple. You still haven't answered my question. Do you support Assanage? Helping America? LOL He's not even an American citizen...I guess he's doing all of this out of the goodness of his heart to help a country that he isn't even a citizen of. God Bless his kind soul.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Ok, BF, let's have a look at the contents of the revealed documents again to find out about that danger Julian Assange has brought over America;

In a September 2009 cable, U.S. Ambassador Philip Murphy described German Foreign Minister Guido Westerwelle -- also the leader of the Free Democrats (FDP), the junior party in the ruling coalition -- as "arrogant," "fixated on maintaining his 'cult of personality'" and "skeptical about the U.S. and its foreign policy objectives."

Chancellor Angela Merkel was dubbed "risk averse and rarely creative" in another dispatch sent earlier that year by John Koenig, the U.S. charge d'affaires in Berlin. (AOLnews)

No secrecy needed for those observations: they're shared by many Germans. Westerwelle's party for example fell from an all-time high of 16 % at the last elections to a mere 3% in the polls now. And Merkel isn't the most popular German politician either. She is only on place 3 now according to the last ZDF poll.

But the pressure upon the German government not to ask for the extradition of those CIA abductors is a big thing in my opinion. Unfortunately most of the press keeps fairly shut about that. Wasn't Afghanistan invaded because it is harboring terrorists? Can it be concluded now that not only the US is harboring kidnappers but even employing them as such with tax payers' money? So America might have lost a little face but definitely isn't "at risk" due to these findings. Just the international pressure coming from those revealed truths should help its government to be a little more sensitive and careful. Wikileaks didn't put America at risk but helped to get it back on the path of proper governance.

They can prove proper governance now by the way they proceed with Julian Assange and Bradley Manning.

Posted by: dirtydog

Did you not see the planes crashing into the world trade center? How do you think America is going to respond?

The planes piloted by Saudi nationals that crashed into the New York WTC? Yep I saw them on tv, it seems logical to me that if Saudi Arabia (Who has a tonne of oil) attacks American then America should retaliate by attacking, ermm, Iraq. They got weapons of mass destruction, honest Guv.

Posted by: Baby Farts

So you think Sadam Hussein was a righteous man and deserved to continue to run the country they way he saw fit? You say an invasion of Iraq disguised as a war on terror? How is that? Did you not see the planes crashing into the world trade center? How do you think America is going to respond? What did the world expect, America to take a leisure attitude, kick back and do nothing about it? At least Bush had the balls to go after these terrorist, WOMD or not Satan the second is long gone now.

Americans changed their vote? This half black president was carefully picked and put into place. Most people had no idea who he was!! Many Americans are scratching their heads now saying to themselves, "How'd this guy get into office?" Why not take a look at the recent polls. Obama's approval rating has dropped significantly and I doubt he'll get re-elected. He's done more damage to America than any other president..and NO it's not Bush's mess that he had to clean up. What a poor excuse....look here:

And yes I do mind those documents as do most Americans because they are putting America, people, AND other countries at risk, something that Assange and his band of renegade followers don't seem to understand. What part of that is it that you don't understand?..or are you a Wikileaks supporter too? Are you?

US President Barack Obama's popularity has dropped by three percentage points in the past two weeks, now standing at 39 percent, according to results of a new poll.

A Zogby Interactive poll released on Tuesday indicates that Obama's approval rating equals a low since he took office at 39 percent, while 63 percent of respondents think the US president is a weak leader compared to only 19 percent who regard him as a strong leader.

The latest poll comes after Obama agreed earlier in December to keep all of the Bush-era tax cuts for another two years in a bid to resolve differences with Republicans in Congress.

"It was a bad week for Obama's relationship with his party's base, which sees him giving in too easily to the Republicans," John Zogby said in a statement.

According to the poll, 68 percent of those surveyed also believe that America is heading in the wrong direction.

The figures come as there are widespread assumptions that a string of government failures, including the failure to rein in the economic crisis in the US, the prolonged wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and the high unemployment rate in the country have largely contributed to the slippage in Obama's popularity rate.

Against a backdrop of the worst recession since the Great Depression, which has driven many Americans out of workplace, the latest figures published recently by the US Federal Reserve show that unemployment rate will remain at around 9.5 percent this year and 8.9 percent in 2011.

Obama's healthcare reforms have also struck a snag as a federal court has ruled that a key part of the new bill is unconstitutional.

Obama's average approval rating has declined in each quarter since he took office last year, and since his Democratic party took a pounding in mid-term elections in November, he has faced an uphill struggle to press ahead with his proposed legislations in the Congress.

Michael Moore??? Sorry but he does NOT represent the majority of Americans.... Manning and Assange have put America at risk, that's a FACT.

You asked: "Do you see any Americans protesting about Assange being jailed?" That was answered correctly. Michael Moore is just one who dares to speak up. There are others as well.

And fact is: George W. Bush has put the whole world at risk with his invasion of Iraq disguised as "war on terror" and the fairy tale of the weapons of mass destruction, allegedly "representing" () the majority of Americans. That's why the majority has changed its vote drastically at the last presidential election. How do you know what the majority of Americans really thinks of Wikileaks and the behavior of their own diplomats? They might tell next time at the ballots again when their anonymity is guaranteed...

Julian Assange is capable of seeing more than just America. And the documents published by WikiLeaks don't deal with America's internal problems at all, but rather with its diplomats' relationships to the rest of the world. People from countries those documents deal with have a right to be upset about the contents of those. Why do you personally mind those documents other than the plain truth having been revealed?

Posted by: Baby Farts

Interesting..I didn't know the U.S allows these no name supporters of Manning to visit and inspect prisoners who are in solitary confinement...Since when did this policy go into effect? This twit who made the complaint...what's his name? Where did he get his info? Was he there? Did he witness any of torture or anything?

The reason Manning is in solitary confinement is for his own protection. Americans take espionage very seriously and I am certain there is a fair amount of yanks who would love to get their hands on this traitor. He is also under a suicide watch....but I'm sure he won't have to worry about that once he gets out of prison (if ever)..but that won't be before "Tyrone" tosses his salad and tears him a new one..either way this guy is marked for the rest of his natural life.

Off topic.. Michael Moore??? Sorry but he does NOT represent the majority of Americans....The same guy who actually believes 911 was all some conspiracy along with the rest of the nut cases around here...who by coincidence all happen to be Bush haters..Michael Moore is a fanatic, he has a VERY SMALL following and as I stated, does not represent the majority of Americans. Why not go and talk to some Americans and ask how they feel about this ordeal instead of quoting the very small minority groups. Manning and Assange have put America at risk, that's a FACT.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

NEW YORK -- The United Nations is probing a complaint that Bradley Manning, the detained Army private suspected of giving classified documents to WikiLeaks has been mistreated in custody. And WikiLeaks chief Julian Assange called Manning "a political prisoner" during an interview on MSNBC.

As The Huffington Post reported last week, Manning's supporters went public with their concerns about the harsh conditions of his imprisonment aboard a floating brig in Quantico, Va. -- he has no access to exercise or even a pillow and bedsheets during his 23 hours of solitary confinement a day -- after their complaints to the military over several months went unheeded.

According to the Associated Press, the U.N. office for torture issues in Geneva said it received a complaint from one of Manning's supporters alleging conditions at the brig amount to torture. A spokesman for the Marines denied mistreating Manning, telling the AP he is being kept safe, secure and ready for trial.

Assange told MSNBC that he doesn't know if Manning is the whistleblower (due to the blinders of the software used by WikiLeaks), but he's a "political prisoner" in the U.S., adding that claims he conspired with Manning are "absolute nonsense."

Recently, Manning's lawyer, David Coombs, posted a blog detailing the conditions of Manning's detention. Though he is allowed to read books and watch television for a few hours a day, the ban on exercise in his cell is strictly enforced. "If he attempts to do push-ups, sit-ups, or any other form of exercise he will be forced to stop," wrote Coombs.

The lawyer also expressed frustration with the harsh conditions, describing multiple attempts to improve them and indicating that he is prepared to file a motion under Article 13 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice, which bans illegal pretrial punishment.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

WikiLeaks founder is wanted in Sweden for questioning over allegations of rape

Britain's high court today decided to grant bail to Julian Assange, the WikiLeaks founder who is wanted in Sweden for questioning over allegations of rape.

Justice Duncan Ouseley agreed with a decision by the City of Westminister earlier in the week to release Assange on strict conditions: £200,000 cash deposit, with a further £40,000 guaranteed in two sureties of £20,000 and strict conditions on his movement.

Assange stood in a dark grey suit in the courtroom dock as Ouseley began hearing an appeal by British prosecutors acting on behalf of Sweden.

There was an early sign that the day would go in Assange's favour when Ouseley said: "The history of the way it [the case] has been dealt with by the Swedish prosecutors would give Mr Assange some basis that he might be acquitted following a trial."

The 39-year-old Australian arrived at the high court in a white prison van. Photographers swarmed around the vehicle in an attempt to get a picture. Amid intense media interest, a queue of journalists had formed as early as 6am.

Mark Stephens, one of Assange's lawyers, said before the proceedings that the bail money had been raised from Assange's supporters and "appears to be in the banking system". Stephens again complained about the conditions in which Assange had been held, describing them as Victorian.

Assange has been held in solitary confinement, released from his cell for only one hour a day, and his mail has been heavily censored, according to his supporters.

Today's hearing followed a decision by senior district judge Howard Riddle to grant Assange bail, but he remained in Wandsworth prison, where he has been held for a week, as prosecutors gave notice they would appeal.

Assange is fighting attempts to extradite him to Sweden for questioning over allegations of sexual misconduct including rape made by two female WikiLeaks volunteers, which he denies.

"It's an ongoing investigation in Sweden and the prosecutor needs to interrogate him to make a decision on the matter," said Karin Rosander, a spokeswoman for the Swedish prosecution agency.

Bail conditions set by Riddle stipulate that Assange must stay at a country house in Suffolk owned by Vaughan Smith, the founder of the Frontline club in west London, report to police daily and wear an electronic tag.

Meanwhile, it emerged that the decision to have Assange sent to a London jail and kept there was taken by the British authorities and not by prosecutors in Sweden.

It had been widely supposed that Sweden had taken the decision to oppose bail, with the Crown Prosecution Service acting merely as its representative. But the Swedish prosecutor's office told the Guardian it had "not got a view at all on bail" and that Britain had made the decision to oppose bail.

Karin Rosander, director of communications for Sweden's prosecutor's office, said: "The decision was made by the British prosecutor. I got it confirmed by the CPS this morning that the decision to appeal the granting of bail was entirely a matter for the CPS. The Swedish prosecutors are not entitled to make decisions within Britain. It is entirely up to the British authorities to handle it."

As a result, she said, Sweden would not submit any new evidence or arguments to the high court hearing. "The Swedish authorities are not involved in these proceedings. We have not got a view at all on bail."

After the Swedish statement was put to the CPS, it confirmed that all decisions concerning the opposing of bail being granted to Assange had been taken by its lawyers. "In all extradition cases, decisions on bail issues are always taken by the domestic prosecuting authority," it said. "It would not be practical for prosecutors in a foreign jurisdiction … to make such decisions."

Assange and his lawyers have expressed fears of a looming legal battle in the US, where prosecutors may be preparing to indict him for espionage over WikiLeaks' publication of the documents.

The New York Times reported that federal prosecutors were looking for evidence that Assange had conspired with a former US army intelligence analyst suspected of leaking classified documents.

Among the material prosecutors are studying is an online chat log in which Private Bradley Manning is said to claim that while he was downloading government files he was directly communicating with Assange using an encrypted internet conferencing service, according to the Times. Manning is also said to have claimed that Assange gave him access to a dedicated server for uploading some of them to WikiLeaks.

The Guardian

Posted by: sicho

Armed forces are very hi-tech and specialized today. How could for example the commander of a tank successfully operate a caterpillar on road construction? Wouldn't he refuse comparatively simple work like that with the argument being overqualified?

Up to him but many retired officers take management jobs. The squaddies have useful manual and clerical skills. Many armed forces personnel seek to learn a trade or profession that they can use after they retire so than can take useful civilian jobs at any earlier age. Some officers already think that they are politicians .......

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Armed forces are very hi-tech and specialized today. How could for example the commander of a tank successfully operate a caterpillar on road construction? Wouldn't he refuse comparatively simple work like that with the argument being overqualified?

Posted by: sicho

It's clear that you can have a recession even if the economy is stimulated by the war industry so that's no excuse for the blood sacrifice.

If there is a recession, it might help the general economy more if the troops were withdrawn and employed on capital and raw materials projects at home. Putting them to work on such things as bridge and road construction and mining would generate jobs for others and trade at no extra cost to the taxpayer. But that's not the point, is it? The possibility of job losses in Halliburton are aren't important. It's the profits for the owners that would be at risk that influences the decisions of politicians.

Back in the 1970's, the unions and Lucas Aerospace in the UK produced a business plan that would have radically changed the company's output. Concerned about the morals of making machines that had no other purpose but to kill people, the workers looked at other ways to use their skills within the company. The current buzz phrase is 'thinking outside the box'. The plan was not even considered. The reason was that the union made the mistake of considering the retention of skilled jobs rather than maximising shareholder profits. There's nothing wrong with maximising profit unless you happen to be looking at the business end of a gun that earned those profits.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Don't forget the "war -"...eh 'defense industry'. If you don't find a way to use your weapons the tax payers will object to buying more and more new ones. And millions of jobs are in danger, some rich can't get richer anymore and so on. The economy will stagnate and finally you'll have a recession.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Bad luck, BF! News are that nobody less than Michael Moore (Fahrenheit 9/11) himself offered to pay $20,000 for Julian Assange's bail and offered his internet media to keep Wikileaks running. Now don't say "Michael Moore Hates America", for sure he does love America: "There are too many good things worth saving to let the whole thing go down the drain!" (John Kay/Steppenwolf)

Michael Moore 66ème Festival de Venise (2009)

Why I'm Posting Bail Money for Julian Assange

by Michael Moore

Tue Dec 14, 2010 at 04:12:19 AM PST

Yesterday, in the Westminster Magistrates Court in London, the lawyers for WikiLeaks co-founder Julian Assange presented to the judge a document from me stating that I have put up $20,000 of my own money to help bail Mr. Assange out of jail.

Furthermore, I am publicly offering the assistance of my website, my servers, my domain names and anything else I can do to keep WikiLeaks alive and thriving as it continues its work to expose the crimes that were concocted in secret and carried out in our name and with our tax dollars.

We were taken to war in Iraq on a lie. Hundreds of thousands are now dead. Just imagine if the men who planned this war crime back in 2002 had had a WikiLeaks to deal with. They might not have been able to pull it off. The only reason they thought they could get away with it was because they had a guaranteed cloak of secrecy. That guarantee has now been ripped from them, and I hope they are never able to operate in secret again.

So why is WikiLeaks, after performing such an important public service, under such vicious attack? Because they have outed and embarrassed those who have covered up the truth. The assault on them has been over the top.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Do you know why I don't answer to your post refuting your "arguments"? Because I assume everybody can see himself that you have sufficiently proven your own shortcomings.

And I don't need to post any pictures of what was done by your country's politicians before you were born or when you were still a child, because you can look into a history book and read for yourself what some people not even related to you did before you were born and that therefore you must be guilty of. Should I feel sorry that I was born ten years after the Nazi-horror was finished already and therefore couldn't be the hero to stop it?

Quote

...you gave in so easily signing an agreement at the police station?

You talk like you knew what that agreement contained and that it would have changed this board. Guess you didn't understand at all what I said in the post where I reported about that visit.

Swear words are not allowed on any decent board. If you don't argue but only abuse this board for invectives I have to interfere.

The swear word filter only filters letter sequences. It does not block or change news reported or views expressed, what is freedom of speech. Just use your language on an American web board or in public in the US - and wait for the cops to incarcerate you!

And no, definitely I cannot give you admin or mod permissions. Because I am responsible for this board. But you can open a board of your own easily. Just google "free forum" and select.

And now take a handful of Aspirin to relieve your headache!

P.S. As history book to read I recommend "The Free and the Unfree: A Progressive History of the United States" by Peter N. Carroll and David W. Noble

Posted by: Baby Farts

JF, you crack me up...Afraid and Paranoid? You mean like the time the kid came to your house with the police and you gave in so easily signing an agreement at the police station? Then you write "Capitalization corrected by Admin." Can I have admin access so I can do the same to your posts, or are you bent on being in CONTROL and afraid? If you are all for freedom of speech then remove the filter.

You sure enjoyed working and living in my country with a beach front office didn't you?

You mention ONE frivolous incident of a Lebanese being tortured?? Can we talk about the innocent Americans captured tortured and executed? No, because you are two faced and only focused on Americans being the bad guys, like your stupid little picture you posted. You make me laugh. Guess who who perfected torture to science? I'll give you a hint. In response to the picture you posted....And to be honest with you, I'm not interested in what you say about your parents because I don't believe you...this is the internet and you can say anything you want... I do not wish to discuss this topic with you any further as you are clearly out of your element and haven't a clue about America other than what you read on the internet...sad, considering you lived and enjoyed working there...And yes, I do read those newspapers..Maybe you should learn to infer what you read. You can continue your little Nazi internet forum mind games with someone else. Maybe, you should debate with Saf about how 911 was all a conspiracy....it's as exciting as watching grass grow.....or we could talk about the picture below and what your country did to the Jews...or how about Stalin? Ever watch the History channel or NGC? You should because you might learn something about the history of YOUR country.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Well, BF, I suggest you read some US papers like the Washington Post and the New York Times to correct the picture in your mind. Ever heard of Khaled al Masri? Read The Washington Post to find out how the CIA embarrassed itself by kidnapping the wrong person. And read Wikileaks to find out how the US government tried to apply political pressure upon the German government to keep them from asking to extradite those 13 clearly identified kidnappers from the CIA. Sure that's a "military secret"!

WikiLeaks: US pressured Germany after CIA abduction mistake

US said arrest warrants would harm the bilateral relationship

Leaked documents showed that Washington put intense pressure on Berlin not to arrest CIA agents involved in the 2003 abduction of a German citizen mistakenly believed to be a terrorist.

The latest documents released by WikiLeaks show the US pressured Germany to prevent the arrest of CIA agents involved in the abduction of a German citizen who alleges he was mistaken for a terrorist and tortured by US intelligence officials.

Khaled el-Masri, a German citizen of Lebanese origin, was captured in 2003 as he traveled to Macedonia on vacation, where he was mistaken for an al Qaeda operative and turned over to the CIA.

Masri said he was held and tortured in a secret US prison in Afghanistan before US agents realized their mistake and released him five months later.

Diplomat warned of damage to bilateral relations

US diplomat John Koenig, of the American embassy in Berlin, reportedly told the German government to "weigh carefully at every step of the way the implications for relations with the US" should Berlin act on the arrest warrants for the 13 suspected agents of the Central Intelligence Agency, according to the New York Times late Wednesday.

Koenig stressed to German Deputy National Security Advisor Rolf Nikel the potential negative implications for bilateral relations between Germany and the US, in particular counter-terrorism cooperation, if steps were taken to "seek the arrest or extradition of US citizens/officials," the documents said.

Thirteen operatives, believed to be CIA, were eventually charged in indictments in Munich and Spain, as investigators concluded that the plane that transported Masri passed through Spanish territory.

(Deutsche Welle is the official German international TV and radio service, a government voice)

So what do we learn from that, BF? That the US government cannot even live up to their own Secret Service's actions committed on foreign soil, compensate victims of illegal government actions, and even protects criminals (those 13 CIA operatives) from getting prosecuted for their crimes by applying diplomatic pressure, sheltering and assisting suspects of a crime punishable with capital punishment in the US! That's why those "secrets" need to get revealed, so the American people do know what their representatives are doing and kick them back on the right path!!!

How do you feel about your above posts now, BF?

Posted by: Johnnie F.

I would say you're paranoid! I for example would never defend a guy like Hitler and his system, who sent my father's first wife and my elder (half-) brother's mother to a concentration camp. There were offenders and victims! Two completely different roles. Putting victims in one bag with the offenders and declare them all bad guys is...

It's the same in the US: there are a lot of good people and a few bad people. Why do you feel addressed when people are talking about bad people or wrong political moves there? You don't have to like everybody or even defend their actions just because they share the nationality with you!

I heard about lots of Americans not approving Visa's, Mastercard's, Paypal's etc. reaction either. But your example that nobody would openly show sympathy in the US for Julian Assange and Wikileaks could be taken as one for the US being a repressive system. "Does nobody dare?"

And may I ask you to adjust your vocabulary to a higher level? Or do I have to put more words in the swear word filter? People might get a wrong impression of this forum by the vocabulary applied in your rants.

Posted by: Baby Farts

Do you see any Americans protesting about Assange being jailed?...and last time I checked demonstrations aka riots are being scheduled by people (mostly kids) from these pis.s a.ss countries who feel they are entitled to our military secrets. Is it because America is labled as the world police? You're German right? We can talk about what your fuerer tried to accomplish if you want to....or how about what the Brits tried to do for centuries??? Trying to colonize anything and everything. Howcome no one ever talks about that?...only the Americans? Why all this protest against America? Some of you sure enjoy living and working in my country dont you? For the brits reading this.. No i do not dislike people from the UK. I'm only stating the past as reference...so please do not take what I've stated in the wrong way.

capitalization "corrected" by admin.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Wow, BF, you're even better than Wikileaks! And I always believed the USA to be a representative democracy, a form of government founded on the principle of elected individuals representing the people, as opposed to autocracy. You must've revealed a secret now; they're still telling people it were a democracy.

Posted by: Baby Farts

The military is in control and its commander is the president. The US has all this classified information and yet it's the media who controls what is released to the public?? The only control freaks people are failing to recognize is the media. You know it and I know it so lets not even going there. Take foxnews for example who relies on tmz as one of their sources. Good god. "we distort, you decide."

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Fair enough JF, but since when did these professional editors become military / security experts with the ability to determine what is published and what isn't.

Very simple: since the most important invention of the second millennium, that enabled mass production of newspapers, i. e. the beginning of printing. They have been made experts by the recipients of their publications, by the people who financially supported them buying their publications. And by the governments who had to allow their publications being in agreement with the laws. In the case of Wikileaks the companies like Mastercards, Visa, Paypal and Amazon took the laws in their own hands, attempting to be dictators by determining that Wikileaks' publications were not in agreement with the laws. They weren't even trying to find out by calling on the courts to investigate and make a judgement. Maybe because they already knew that those publications weren't violating the laws!

And now answer me a counter-question: What would become of the USA, if "the military/security experts" had free hand in running the country? A system like North Korea, Burma and too many more? A free press is necessary to keep people in governments and military from installing totalitarian systems. Who else would inform the public, so people can make up their minds about standing up or bowing down?

Posted by: Baby Farts

Fair enough JF, but since when did these professional editors become military / security experts with the ability to determine what is published and what isn't. Isn't that just another sophisticated form of the very ideal they proclaim to be opposed of?? Censorship, secrecy etc? Who all of sudden made these people the experts and gave them the authority as to what is relased to the public and what is not? Professional? Says who? Trust? I don't trust any of the people you've listed but yet people are willing to put their trust in the media and a handful of these so called professional editors?

Posted by: Johnnie F.

...the only "leaking" you would see would be coming from his trousers.

I bet that's how a lot of Americans felt (spontaneously without thought) about "Deep Throat" for talking to The Washington Post about the "fair play" (Watergate scandal) of their president (Richard Nixon) and his friends. Did America break down under that? Or did only a president resign? What is happening now is harmless compared to that!

To my information the papers Wikileaks publishes are carefully checked by professional editors from well known international newspapers to not exceed the limits of what is legitimate to publish.

Who do you trust more: the politicians and government officials or the journalists?

Posted by: Baby Farts

It's not so much about freedom of speech, information, etc., and the rest of the bleeding heart liberal as.swipes that I have a problem with....It's WHAT information he released. I am talking about ENDANGERING peoples' lives and several countries. He should have thought a little more carefully about what he decided to leak, but he chose not to. Putting peoples' lives in danger hardly makes this twit even worth supporting let alone a whistle blower. Did you notice in Denmark they've arrested one of the hacker wannabes...As I stated earlier..a sixteen year old kid.... this morning on BBC and CNN they interviewed one of the wikileaks supporters / hacker wannabes... British accent no doubt and by the sound of his voice...couldn't be over the age of nineteen (probably excited that he sprouted three new pubes)..it's all about the fun factor. Ask any 16-19 year old kid about Afghanistan or America's foreign policy and they haven't a friggen clue....yet here they are taking advantage of an opportunity to reek havoc on the most hated country in the world who they don't even realize is probably an ally of the country they are currently residing in.. but do you see attacks and leaks on them? No.

I'd like to see Julian come to America where he can practice his "Freedom of speech and Information" in front of the American people and public. You mentioned "Afraid" earlier, JF...who's really the afraid one? He can say what he wants in public in America. Bring it on down. ..no wait.. he has to hide in a cyber world with bunch of teenagers.. If he were to come to America, the only "leaking" you would see would be coming from his trousers.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Just look how Jim Morrison was served justice yesterday by the State of Florida. Only 40 years after he died they cancelled that verdict of six months jail and $500 for indecent exposure at a concert of The Doors in Miami in 1969. None of the 10.000 strong audience had taken a photograph that could prove the lizard king had shown his lizard. I do hope it doesn't take as long to rehabilitate persons currently accused.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

"We're only in it for the money" - and I thought that was by Frank Zappa; now it is by Amazon (UK)!

Amazon attempts to profit from Cablegate with Kindle book

Amazon is attempting to profit on the Wikileaks "Cablegate". It pulled its web services when Wikileaks attempted to use it for hosting - but now is offering a Kindle edition, for £7.37 including VAT, of the entire released cables.

Supporters are hitting out at the appearance of the cables, for profit, on Amazon. The top rated review by a Mr. Winkie says: "So you wilfully help to proliferate the lies for free, but you will only support the truth if there is a fast buck to be made. One nation under gold, right?"

Posted by: dirtydog

Paypal is now giving wiki some loving baby, they realised the error of their ways, they reinstated wiki accounts, says the nasty Yanks made erm take away the accounts, oh dear, corperate america forcing businesses to do business their way, wanna build a secret torture prison baby

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Of course any company does have "the right" to break a contract, they just have to pay for the damages they caused by doing that plus some "punitive award" and then also live with the reaction of other customers who might prefer another service in future. By what I heard complaints to US courts are already underway. But why did those companies not call on the courts themselves to get a clarification before they suspended accounts on the internet, which is by most people seen as something not a company owns but is more like the air people breathe, i. e. for common use? Are they so sure that US courts will always decide the way "powerful" companies think before them? I do know another picture of US courts...

Last I heard is that Paypal have been partly giving up their clearly illegal action of freezing Wikileaks' account: Wikileaks' can withdraw and use that money now, but they still don't want to pass on donations from other customers to that account. The recourse claims of people who had donated before would have cost them a pretty penny!

Posted by: Baby Farts

Why the F is everyone so infatuated with the US? There was already one person arrested for leaking information. Furthermore, this "Fan Club" consists nothing more than a bunch of pimple squirting teens and college brat hacker "wannabes" bent on doing whatever appears to be the "in" thing when they haven't f***ing clue what's going on.. kind of like that idiot Aussie and Brit who decided to participate on the riots here in Thailand just for the fun of it.

Let me set you straight on a few things that you seem to be missing here. First of all, these businesses that these cybercnunts decided to attack had every right LEGALLY to cut off doing business with wikileaks. Are you following me here?..and so they launch operation "Payback." Payback??? Try and see the logic here JF. Payback for what? These tw.ats are even close to being hackers, not to mention that they are breaking the law. A handful of ftards post some links to a program LOIC which even my two year old son could figure how to use to ping websites. Wow...I'm impressed, considering the interface is almost identical to one I wrote MYSELF over twenty years ago when I used to knock people off IRC when they pissed me off. This whole cyberwar reminds me of the riots we had here in Thailand. People want to jump in irregardless of the cause.. it's for the thrill and fun, especially when it involves the most hated country in the world, America.

At least twitter, facefukbook and others have suspended the accounts of these "hacker" wannabes.

Finally, you talk about "the system." Would this be the same system that these cry baby countries call upon whenever they get in trouble? You STILL seem to elude to the fact that this cnut has no right whatsoever to whine like the little baby he is. HE IS NOT AN AMERICAN. Besides his home country FULLY SUPPORTS America less the comment made yesterday by the PM trying to say it's all America's fault. You know, America should go into isolation like the Japs did for 400 years and tell the rest of the world F-U! You get into trouble whether it be a war, or ACT OF NATURE, and you need our help, go find some other country to lean on...Unappreciative fuks can take our red, white, and blue dildo and stick it up your as.s.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Jf, this isn't about a country fighting for its independance. It's about putting America and several other countries at risk. I would hardly call your anology to the boston tea party valid. So this guy puts several countries at risk, hes going to be charged with sex crimes, and now these wannabe hackers want revenge because certain businesses have recognized this lunatic IS a terrotist and cut him off? Think about that for a second. These pr.cks doing these denial of service attacks have NOW broken the law and have caused probably millions of dollars in damages. Doesn't say toomuch for their cause now does it? Operation "payback" they are calling it? There's one for ya. Payback? Good lord these people are raving lunatics. If any payback is to be made it should be against that as.s julian ASSange.

This guy will go down hard. Just watch.

From what I can see he doesn't seem to be afraid. The system's reaction is in my opinion just what is at the center of the whole game, what Wikileaks has been challenging. The more repressive the "establishment" reacts the more opponents it will call onto the scene. It's a new movement of people not happy with the system.

Are you afraid of somebody sitting in a British jail right now, BF? You could only accuse the jail keepers of letting him do things, if he actually would do something. You still haven't got it: it's people, DD called them the Assange Fan Club, but for you it's simply one person. It's a movement of people that has to be dealt with. And it isn't a blow aimed at the USA only! it's against a system to show it's inefficiency by the way it reacts. Your invections are just a part of that system. What'll be your reaction when you realize it isn't one person only? "Kill'em all"?

Don't forget that those documents haven't been stolen by people from the outside, they have been passed on by people from the inside; the US government "leaked". Some are angry about those who helped that leak, others applaud. In any case it shows a lack of harmony among US government employees. Some feel that the way they have to do their jobs isn't the right way. Did you mean them by that: "Good lord these people are raving lunatics." I think it's great to have government officials using their own brain!

Posted by: Baby Farts

Jf, this isn't about a country fighting for its independance. It's about putting America and several other countries at risk. I would hardly call your anology to the boston tea party valid. So this guy puts several countries at risk, hes going to be charged with sex crimes, and now these wannabe hackers want revenge because certain businesses have recognized this lunatic IS a terrotist and cut him off? Think about that for a second. These pr.cks doing these denial of service attacks have NOW broken the law and have caused probably millions of dollars in damages. Doesn't say toomuch for their cause now does it? Operation "payback" they are calling it? There's one for ya. Payback? Good lord these people are raving lunatics. If any payback is to be made it should be against that as.s julian ASSange.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

I'm watching with high interest how people react to the whole affair, don't want to call it a scandal and can't get excited about it like you. . That doesn't have anything to do with supporting or not supporting. It's a chapter in our history and cannot be undone. But how things go on from here can well be determined by well-thought of actions or no actions. It is always better to collect information first to base your opinion on. Since the whole is a conflict I need to observe both sides. I see myself still as impartial.

Where do you think the world would be now, if those at Boston, who were certainly seen as criminals by the British at that time, had not risen above the law and thrown that tea in the Boston harbor? They started something and many other people made something of it: the independent United States of America! Now what does the world make of Wikileaks' action? That is the question. Where does it go from here? Of course it might be interesting to find out how things got that far, so we can base future decisions on this knowledge. But that's all that counts: How do we go on from here?

Posted by: Baby Farts

Get real JF. The only as.swipes who THINK they are making him a martyr are those who probably aren't even Americans in the first place. You post that picture of time magazine? Wtf? You should know by now the media has the LEAST bit of credibilty these days. So do you support this terrorist because that's exactly what he is?

Posted by: Baby Farts

JF, this guy isn't even an American. He's an Aussie, not to mention that his country along with all the othet liberal as.swipes from wikileaks and the countries they come from are for the most part our allies and stand by the US. That's ok. He was arrested today. Som nom na.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

I only do see companies like Amazon (threw Wikileaks off their servers, most likely breaking a contract with Wikileaks), Paypal, Mastercard and Visa (blocked the money support to Wikileaks clearly by breaking contracts with Wikileaks and millions of other customers who wanted to use their accounts by transfering funds to Wikileaks) demising themselves. What they're doing is obviously a big blow against that American dream of "the perfect democracy". America isn't suffering from Wikileaks' actions but from their own actions in response to Wikileaks. Remember where America would be, if some people hadn't been courageous enough to spill all that tea in Boston's harbor?

It isn't that those documents were published unredacted, i. e. not made sure of the relative harmless nature of the published documents. I bet that Wikileaks is in possession of far more "dangerous" documents, actually containing military secrets, which they haven't published yet. That's why Julian Assange could easily give himself up to the British police. His friends have a very strong pledge in case authorities don't play fair.

The Wikileaks activists are "rerrorising" others as much as those people who started democracy and independence in America by refusing to pay high taxes to the British crown for tea brought to America.

Posted by: Baby Farts

More openess? You're right. We should disclose all our military secrets to the public, because they feel entitled to know things. I don't see any Americans whining, only this Ftard Assange. Maybe, he'll start posting the design and plans to some of America's fighter planes and stuff like that. WTF is this as.sholes beef with America? He's not even an American! Ckocsucker.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

...but Wikileaks under whatever name or on whichever server will live on as long as people only bitch about it instead of learning a lesson and applying what they have learned from it. It has shaken the system and needs to be integrated now. More openness instead of secrecy especially in the public sector. Public just happens to be the opposite of secret. Was it all just a misunderstanding of the ones collecting for "being in charge"?

Posted by: Johnnie F.

Julian Assange must be a really great and powerful person, if he could do all that...alone! And that's exactly the point, BF: he is one person, who might have started Wikileaks' website. But his idea found so many followers that the secret archives of the US were held wide open to let the world know.

There's no point in projecting that on one person, it's rather something in the system that wasn't taken care of properly by the people who receive a salary for calling themselves "in charge".

The people "in charge" have "taken care" of cancelling the domain wikileaks.org - that's why you can use the domain wikileaks.ch now to access the sites content. The more the "people in charge" cry foul and use "legitimate means" to suppress they more sites will pop up with that content. The "people in charge" made Paypal block Wikileaks' account to dry up their funds. Don't you think they just challenge people to find other ways to support Wikileaks and let more money flow to them than ever?

I think the only way out is to stand up to their "secrecy" while representing the people. They got caught. So what! Should just serve to do a better job in future, an open job! But their attempts to go after one person or dry up the funds of Wikleaks will just play into the hands of those who are sick of "secret services". A "service" not open isn't a service! And "public servants" operating in secrecy aren't servants at all. So what are those "in charge"?

And what is the best way to support Wikileaks? Plain bitching like you do!

Posted by: Baby Farts

Proven? Have you seen what this as.swipe has made public? Endangering our country and allies is something good? For what? To fufill his unilateral wet dream of pretending to be the savior from the American infidels when all he's done is endangered an entire country and it's factions? The ONLY people who support this freak of nature are the American haters...yet there they are standing by us in war and when their own country is in trouble come to US for help.

Posted by: Johnnie F.

What's the use of posting plain invectives like that, BF? Open the window or get an oxygen bottle, if you need to breathe better!

As far as I can see, neither the accusation "sex criminal" nor "terrorist" has been proven. All he did was giving a spark. If they go after him with the means the press reports of they just encourage others to go even further.

Ever thought of that?

Posted by: Baby Farts

I have no problem with the majority of the world hating America, but this fcuk sex crminal has pushed the limits. To fcuk with US government, it's security, and allies is not a smart thing to do. Wtf is this as.swipe trying to prove? And now he has graduated to being on the list as a terrorist. I hope this cnut enjoys his short stay there. Whistle blower? Says who? The media? He's a terrorists.