Comment

HABERMAN Genealogy
The vast majority of Argentine Jews are descended from immigrants who arrived from Europe. These ashkenazic Jews migrated from small towns or shtetels of Poland, Lithuania, Russia, Germany, Romania or Ukraine, leaving behind most of their Jewish relatives. After two or three generations, those Jewish families lost track of their relatives, having been saved from the war, emigrated to other countries like USA, England or Australia.

Franklin, you are gonna have to take that up with the author of the book, who has a Jewish last name. Although he is probably not with us anymore, if so he is quite old. LOL

Shadowcat, I love your style. That point is nothing short of BRILLIANT. I am sure Haberman was aware of his Jewish roots, it probably was what inspired him to trace that Jewish heritage of his throughout history.

I have a copy of the book, and I'm curious if he was a covert to Christianity or not. I haven't read it in quite some time, but it is a remarkable book, it explains the origin of many names we may have thought not connected to Judaism.

I see nothing racist in his study of history, when he refers to the white race as "superior" I take it to mean in relationship to both Biblical and secular history. Historical facts speak for themselves.

If Franklin wants to claim missionaries of another race developed, maintained, and taught advances in science, technology, literacy, and the Christian and Jewish religions all over the ancient and Medieval worlds, so much so that Franklin had to dig up George Washington Carver in response to what he surely knows is true himself, then he should feel challenged to do so.

But labeling history as we know it racist and antisemitic is nothing but the kind of spin we'd expect to see from BLACK supremicists, such as the Israel Church of God in Jesus Christ, who claims all white Jews are "fakes" and only they are the true Church of Christ on earth.

Comment

http://americanfraud.com/possecomitatus.aspxWilliam Potter Gale: A self-described "reverend," considered by some to be the founder of the Jew-hating Posse Comitatus that raged through the Midwest in the 1970s and 1980s, Gale warned the world that a satanic Jewish conspiracy disguised as communism was corrupting public officials and the courts, undermining the United States and wrecking its divinely inspired Constitution. Jews, Gale taught, were offspring of the devil, while non-whites were "mud people" and whites were the real Hebrews of the Bible. By the time of his death in 1988, Bill Gale had spent more than half a lifetime energetically promoting his particularly bloodthirsty brand of anti-Semitism across America.

"Arise and fight!" Gale preached in one infamous sermon broadcast to Kansas farmers in 1982. "If a Jew comes near you, run a sword through him."

But William Potter Gale had a secret. It turns out that Gale was descended on his father's side from a long line of devout Jews. In interviews with author Daniel Levitas,

Gale's daughters revealed with some bemusement the Jewish roots of their grandfather and his forebears. Ironically, Bill Gale's father Charles was fleeing Russian anti-Semitism and seeking economic opportunity when he arrived in the United States in 1894, changing his name from Grabifker in the process.

William Gale claimed to have chosen the term "Christian Identity" in 1965, when it was adopted as the name of a newsletter. In Gale's mind, the Identity movement was the glue to hold together racist ideology in the United States. Though he died almost unnoticed in 1987, Gale is the central figure and inspiration for America's present white supremacist movement and Identity doctrine is his legacy to that movement.

Comment

hhhmmm a Jewish man that probably came from a family that converted to Christianity, like many Jews in Germany and other parts of Europe did. Examples: Karl Marx, Wesley Swift's teacher William Potter Gale, who started Posse Comitatus and is known as the grandfather of the modern Christian identity movement, John Kerry's grandparents who escaped the holocaust and last name was Kohn and changed it to Kerry by dropping a pencil onto a map of Ireland, and countless others -

writes a book claiming that the Bible only deals with white Adamic people and you're freaking out calling him a racist. Well franlkin, the problem is he has Jewish roots. So what now?

I guess Franklin will have to include all those families of "completed Jews" (the term evangelicals use to describe converted Jews) in his daily rants against his own self created darkened world of those he believes are antisemitic racists, heretics, atheists, cult members and defenders, from his lofty perch of indisputable truth, of which only he is worthy of occupying.

Comment

You are filling your plate with a whole lot of projects, that is, if you really are trying to build a case.

You have to rebut Shadowcat's and my own replies to your posts, you have to find out why ADL and SPLC don't list Murry among CI ministers, you have to find out why they don't mention him at all other than that silly article by Casey Sanchez, who is hardly an expert on theology, and just a hired attack dog of the SPLC. In other words they give Sanchez someone to smear, and he goes to work, it's what he's paid to do.

Anyway, since you claim to be so knowledgeable, I'm sure you can whip up your own package to give the ADL and SPLC. We'll be waiting.

Comment

"Denounce racism, anti-Semitism and all ethnic or religious intolerance as evils. The ideals of our country leave no room for intolerance, anti-Semitism or bigotry of any kind, none. We must more fervently attack ugly intolerance. We have no place for haters in America."

Nice spin job, Cult defense damage control, but very lame, full of holes and totally transparent! Whether the author was ethnically Jewish or not does not matter. Jews can be racist also. What I quoted had nothing to do with antisemitism, just racism. And purely racist, white supremacist it is. There is no justification for what he wrote and no whitewash, no excuse of Arnold Murray recommending "Tracing Our Ancestors" by Frederick Haberman to his Cult members except that Arnold Murray is a racist himself. That is the core beliefs of Arnold Murray. Whitey is superior, the German Gaelics are superior to the non German Gaelics Caucasians and the Jews are the literal descendants of the devil! Except for the last part, the serpent seed, Murray's racist antisemitic beliefs are identical to Adolph Hitler's! Blacks and Orientals are excellent farmers, in many ways more innovative than Caucasians could ever be. Spin on Cult Defenders, damage control technicians, but you are wasting your time constantly repairing the thin tissue of lies you are trying to cover up, deceive us that Arnold Murray is not a racist, antisemite. Give up your foolishness! God is not a racist, but Arnold Murray IS!

Comment

Nice spin job, Cult defense damage control, but very lame, full of holes and totally transparent! Whether the author was ethnically Jewish or not does not matter. Jews can be racist also. What I quoted had nothing to do with antisemitism, just racism. And purely racist, white supremacist it is. There is no justification for what he wrote and no whitewash, no excuse of Arnold Murray recommending "Tracing Our Ancestors" by Frederick Haberman to his Cult members except that Arnold Murray is a racist himself. That is the core beliefs of Arnold Murray. Whitey is superior, the German Gaelics are superior to the non German Gaelics Caucasians and the Jews are the literal descendants of the devil! Except for the last part, the serpent seed, Murray's racist antisemitic beliefs are identical to Adolph Hitler's! Blacks and Orientals are excellent farmers, in many ways more innovative than Caucasians could ever be. Spin on Cult Defenders, damage control technicians, but you are wasting your time constantly repairing the thin tissue of lies you are trying to cover up, deceive us that Arnold Murray is not a racist, antisemite. Give up your foolishness! God is not a racist, but Arnold Murray IS!

Don't you have anything more to offer than your own opinion Frankie? I can assure you, the ADL and SPLC will demand more than an opinion if they are going to list Murray as CI and antisemitic and racist. Look at what you wrote, it's all opinion, and that is very weak.

You don't rebut facts with spin, it never works. Now we gave you some facts, and you are ignoring them. I addressed your facts, gave some of my own. It wasn't any spin job.

Comment

Well there is no doubt that the OT Bible deals with one people and one people only, and that would be the Hebrews or Israelites. The book doesn't focus at all on any African blacks, nor Egyptians. And if Egyptians are mentioned, with the exception of a few cases, it is mostly in a bad way.

The God of the Egyptians was Ra, they had their own religious documents. Same goes for the Sumerians, Babylonians, who were Abraham's kin folk. As did the Greeks and Romans. The Bible focus is on Israel and it addresses Israel.

You know it's funny that in the NT the people use that terminology quite a bit, "we have Abraham as our father", well Abraham wasn't a Jew, nor was he a hebrew, nor was he an Israelite. He was Babylonian plain and simple. So enthnically Abraham and his kin are Babylonians from Iraq.

In history the Babylonians are thought to be Mongolian. So would that mean Abraham was a Mongolian?

Comment

Frederick Haberman was one of the pioneers of the more racialised sect of British Israelism, now known as Christian Identity (CI). However one thing to note about Haberman is that unlike other Christian Identity pioneers, he was not particularly anti-Semitic and in fact one of his works was the focus of anti-Nazism in regards to Biblical prophecy (Hitler's Approaching Doom, 1941). Paradoxically later CI proponents embraced neo-Nazism and strong anti-semitism. Haberman in contrast, although a racialist was not antisemitic or a Nazi. He was writing during WW2 and was not sympathetic to the Nazis and as noted one of his own works espoused an anti-Nazi focus. Modern Christian Identity has been corrupted by uneducated neo-Nazis, Haberman however was an intelligent author with an academic background in history. His work Tracing Our Ancestors, although written from a Christian fundamentalist perspective is a very useful book with its research on Aryanism, or the appearance of the Aryan which Haberman links to Adam in Genesis.

Comment

Well there is no doubt that the OT Bible deals with one people and one people only, and that would be the Hebrews or Israelites. The book doesn't focus at all on any African blacks, nor Egyptians. And if Egyptians are mentioned, with the exception of a few cases, it is mostly in a bad way.

The God of the Egyptians was Ra, they had their own religious documents. Same goes for the Sumerians, Babylonians, who were Abraham's kin folk. As did the Greeks and Romans. The Bible focus is on Israel and it addresses Israel.

You know it's funny that in the NT the people use that terminology quite a bit, "we have Abraham as our father", well Abraham wasn't a Jew, nor was he a hebrew, nor was he an Israelite. He was Babylonian plain and simple. So enthnically Abraham and his kin are Babylonians from Iraq.

In history the Babylonians are thought to be Mongolian. So would that mean Abraham was a Mongolian?

Catholic theology teaches that Abraham was a spiritual father, I suppose you an use the term Rabbi:

When in her liturgy the Churchsolemnlyprays that the angels may carry the soul of one of her departed children to "Abraham's Bosom", she employs the expression to designate Heaven and its endless bliss in company with the faithful of both Testaments, and in particular with Abraham, the father of them all. This passage of the expression "the Bosom of Abraham" from an imperfect and limited sense to one higher and fuller is a most natural one, and is in full harmony with the general character of the New Testamentdispensation as a complement and fulfilment of the Old Testamentrevelation.

Comment

From the article "Hate and Hypocrisy" from the SPLC which is about William Potter Gale who was Jewish, was Wesley Swift's teacher, and is known as the grandfather of the Christian Identity movement and even coined the term "Christian Identity" it states at the very end:

"But the story of hypocritical hate did not begin with Bill Gale, and it surely will not end with Gollub or Hawke. For an entire millennium — from the 8th to the 18th century — Jewish converts to Christianity were among the leading advocates of forcibly converting their former brethren and of burning the Talmud, the text of rabbinical commentaries on Jewish law. In the early 20th century, there were numerous converted Jews who also made careers out of attacking their former co-religionists.As long as there is religious and ethnic hatred in this world, there will be members of oppressed groups who turn on themselves."

Comment

Cat, Looks like Frankie went to do some homework, at least we can hope he does.

Have you ever read about the Hyksos? Some researchers think they were Israelites who influenced Egyptian religion in such a way that it went from being Polytheistic to Theistic, at least to my fuzzy recollection.

Comment

From the article "Hate and Hypocrisy" from the SPLC which is about William Potter Gale who was Jewish, was Wesley Swift's teacher, and is known as the grandfather of the Christian Identity movement and even coined the term "Christian Identity" it states at the very end:

"But the story of hypocritical hate did not begin with Bill Gale, and it surely will not end with Gollub or Hawke. For an entire millennium — from the 8th to the 18th century — Jewish converts to Christianity were among the leading advocates of forcibly converting their former brethren and of burning the Talmud, the text of rabbinical commentaries on Jewish law. In the early 20th century, there were numerous converted Jews who also made careers out of attacking their former co-religionists.As long as there is religious and ethnic hatred in this world, there will be members of oppressed groups who turn on themselves."

I think we're beginning to see why the SPLC and ADL doesn't list Murray as antisemitic. Franklin and Stage Director should thank you for doing their homework for them. Great catch! I can't imagine Murray calling William Potter Gale or accusing him of being a Kenite.