Oh and andy2 - I didn't heaps love the painted frame at Eurobike but other than that I think they've all looked amazing! It's been great to have a little more of an 'inside look' at them on WW compared with what's been out in the e-press so far.

The Rolo frame looks spectacular. I also like the Alpha, BTW. Berk: on the saddle, it seems there would be an issue with lack of flex: center of the saddle goes straight down the seat post. Is this a problem?

I am a big fan of "tuned stiffness" and think the phenotype of the super-fat-tubed-carbon frame, while it may well win in Tour magazine, seems the wrong way to go for anything other than crazy fast accelerations which are over-rated. (in particular all my races in the past few years have been hill climbs, where these are avoided, or 200 mile double-centuries, where they are also avoided at my level).

My view: since I try to keep weight savings capped at $4.00/gram or so, the frame is not an economical place to do it compared to my 865 gram Fuji SL/1. It would likely cost me $20/gram to save much there. I could get some Schmolke bars which would cut maybe 80 grams far more cheaply, but still over my budget.

djconnel: I´ve made many saddle/post combos, I can tell you that´s a non existent problem, when you see the rails and clamping system, you feel a effect here but in fact very small difference, bigger difference can be taken from the seat tube flexing, wider tires and the frame itself and so on.

A flexible saddle shell is good but not always as you get inconsistent flex on the middle, nose and the very back.

That´s my opinion.

Yes I use full carbon saddles, mostly built from my molds, like Berk does.

artray: I´ve seen many manufacturers claim they CAN do or have did a xxx frame weight, but when coming to the real deal they have shortcuts like size 42 frame or other excuses.

Until now I have only seen a frame which was around 600 gr mark and it was a Ruegamer Zen Überlight.Then a Spin Gato too.

I agree .It was an article I saw and just thought it would be of interest to post . I was thinking the same or maybe a bike built only for climbing. 500 grms is quite a claim and most companys have failed to deliver there claimed weights . Gunter mai's spin was very light ,643grms and Donalds Rue as well. Wonder what Gunter is up to .

artray: I have no clue how much it will weigh but as their homepage said, they can tune the ride characteristic to your specs so I assume you can talk down the weight a bit, they can do a good balance between weight and relevant stiffness in certain areas for you.

There´s a lot of in production pics on their Facebook page, they do build the frame from prepreg weave cutted in custom templates for each frame specification so therefore can the characteristics be tuned to any taste from sir Chris Hoy to Paolo Bettini.

My 54 cm. Ruegamer is exactly 600 grams with front and rear derailleur hangers, built over 5 and a half years ago. It is a very stiff frame, I never notice any flex. I'm sure there will be something lighter that also has a great ride quality. Who knows what the future holds.

My hands once held a 550 gram frameset! This one was ridden and raced for about a year and belonged to Brent (now Bre) Ruegamer. It was rather small compared to typical medium frames though.

Then a few years after that during a trip to Australia, WW-member 'whodesigns' showed his 460 gram frameset. He did add that it was still in need of wrapping of the joints. I never found out if he finished the frame or what it finally weighed.

Nick Crumpton mentioned that he's able to build a really light frame, except he refuses to, since he doesn't want to be held accountable in case something goes wrong with it.

Still, so far nothing has impressed me as much as Rolo. Their Zedler stiffness testing and aero numbers simply look incredible. At first I found the front end too bulky but when I saw these bikes at Eurobike, I found them much better looking in the flesh. Photos simply don't do them justice.

There always seems to be a quest for lighter, and nobody is immune. Then again, bikes are made to be ridden. I'd personally much rather have a slightly heavier frame that rides exceptionally well than an ultralight finicky one that feels it might crack upon riding over a pebble the wrong way.

Donald, how many miles have you put on your frame so far?

_________________“I always find it amazing that a material can actually sell a product when it’s really the engineering that creates and dictates how well that material will behave or perform.” — Chuck Teixeira

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