ESPN ranks franchises based on things like their performance on the field, how efficiently they spend money compared to how much they charge for tickets, and how fans feel about the team.

The Packers got particularly high scores for their “stadium experience” — ESPN says there’s no better place to see a game than Lambeau Field — and for ESPN’s estimate of how many championships fans can expect to see the team win in their lifetimes.

Out of 122 teams in four sports leagues, the bottom two were also from the NFL, with the Redskins at No. 121 and the Bengals at No. 122.

So ESPN created a stupid formula that guaranteed that some small market hellhole like Green Bay would harbor their “best franchise” tag.

The best franchise in sports is the Boston Red Sox, who sell out all 82 games instead of just 8. The team is so popular that they can charge a lot for seats and still sell out every game. Of course, according to ESPN that eliminates them from consideration.

This listing coming from ESPN, the Cadillac of the sports media world. Well, at least the 73 Caddy with the rusted out quarter panels and seized engine, that been sitting down at the end of Potter’s Road for a few years, all shot to hell by the guys getting ready for deer season.

Wow, since they won the Superbowl they automatically jump the Red Wings as the best franchise in sports? The title hands down belongs to the Detroit Red Wings. They are the only team in sports that can dominate and still be respected by every team in the league and their fan bases. Everyone admits they are the “gold standard.” I don’t think the Packers are close to that level yet.

I give little credence to ESPN’s rankings of anything … but love this choice, especially at this time.

All this talk of satisfying billionaires and bean counters by putting put more teams in big-market cities … and here’s Green Bay–the little town that’s produced the best sports franchise in North America. It’s a perfect example of what sports teams should be about: the fans. Congrats Packers.

Out of 122 teams in four sports leagues, the bottom two were also from the NFL, with the Redskins at No. 121 and the Bengals at No. 122.

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Gee I wonder why????
1. (Benglals)There franchise QB would rather retire then play another season with them (and they just made the playoffs a yr ago).
2. (Redskins) they decided to pay a guy 30mil, to play a position he never played in his career. Also they bench McNabb for Grossman!

You contributed nothing to making the Packers the top rated team on a purley hypothetical and subjective poll, and this statement just furthers the sterotype that Packer fans judge their self-worth based on how the Packers are doing.

To throw in a completely unrelated cheap shot with glee over the Vikings possibly leaving makes you scum.

You mean the only publicly owned franchise, the only franchise that opens its books, the only franchise that doesn’t have some meddlesome owner sticking his nose into something he has no clue about and who is trying to shake the fans down for every cynical dime he can steal, is the best franchise in sports? Go figure!

The category “How many championships a fan can expect to win in their lifetime” is ridiculous.

One thing can change a franchises fortunes. The 49’ers were horrible until Joe Montana and Bill Walsh arrived, and then they were arguably the greatest dynasty in NFL history from the early 80’s through the mid 90’s.

On break can create a dynasty, destroy a franchise, etc.

The fact that the Saints are as highly regarded as they currently are is testament to this, as if the poll was conducted before 2006, they would have been last, or near the bottom.

You contributed nothing to making the Packers the top rated team on a purley hypothetical and subjective poll, and this statement just furthers the sterotype that Packer fans judge their self-worth based on how the Packers are doing.

To throw in a completely unrelated cheap shot with glee over the Vikings possibly leaving makes you scum.

But hey. “you” did it!
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Probably the best post that sums it all up. Well said!

but they also took into account stadium experience and going to Fenway is like stabbing someone in the ears, to have sit there and listen to people talk about “gettin in da cahh ta go to da bahh” Red Sox and their fans are basically waterdowned Yankees.

Even as a PANTHERS fan, I am cool with the Green Bay deal….I am just surprised that the Raiders arent at the bottom, maybe they were #120.
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You’re surprised because you’re ignorant, in the true sense of the word.

“So ESPN created a stupid formula that guaranteed that some small market hellhole like Green Bay would harbor their “best franchise” tag.

The best franchise in sports is the Boston Red Sox…”

So if I’m reading this right, you’re saying ESPN is biased *against* Boston *in favor of* small market teams? Did I drive through a dimensional rift on my way back from lunch today? Or were you playing “Opposite Day?”

I don’t know how Cincinnati can be considered the worst. I believe they are actually quite profitable as an organization because of their frugal approach, and while they certainly don’t have a lot to hang their hat on, at least they’ve appeared in the Super Bowl in recent memory.

Who’s the worst team in sports? I don’t think it’s really an argument.

The best franchise in sports is the Boston Red Sox, who sell out all 82 games instead of just 8.
________________________

Do they have a 35-40 year waiting list for season tickets?
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I think that’s for people that joined the waiting list 35-40 years ago. If you signed up now I think it’s something more like 200+ years. Seriously.

anonymouslyanonymouscommentor says:
Jun 15, 2011 1:25 PM
Wow, since they won the Superbowl they automatically jump the Red Wings as the best franchise in sports? The title hands down belongs to the Detroit Red Wings. They are the only team in sports that can dominate and still be respected by every team in the league and their fan bases. Everyone admits they are the “gold standard.” I don’t think the Packers are close to that level yet
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Yeah, but they play that game with sticks and the frozen turd. Eh?

Have you ever been to Green Bay? The Packers (and their fans) are well respected by the rest of the league. Heck, the fans own the team for crying out loud. Catching a game at Lambeau is a great experience regardless of who you root for, try saying that about any venue in Detroit, even you’re airport stinks.

The Lambeau experience is unique, if you are into the NFL go to a game at Lambeau. Make sure you arrive at least 3 hours before game time and meander through the crowd. If you are a fan of the opposition you will be treated with respect and probably get to eat some awesome food and drink some great beer. Just some thoughts for fans bucket lists.

anonymouslyanonymouscommentor says:
Jun 15, 2011 1:25 PM
Wow, since they won the Superbowl they automatically jump the Red Wings as the best franchise in sports? The title hands down belongs to the Detroit Red Wings. They are the only team in sports that can dominate and still be respected by every team in the league and their fan bases. Everyone admits they are the “gold standard.” I don’t think the Packers are close to that level yet
————————————————–

Yeah, but they play that game with sticks and the frozen turd. Eh?

Have you ever been to Green Bay? The Packers (and their fans) are well respected by the rest of the league. Heck, the fans own the team for crying out loud. Catching a game at Lambeau is a great experience regardless of who you root for, try saying that about any venue in Detroit, even you’re airport stinks.

——————————-

Have the Packers made the playoffs for 20 straight seasons? Is Green Bay known as “Footballtown” like Detroit is “Hockeytown?” Do assistant coaches repeatedly get plucked from your staff for head coaching vacancies? The city of Detroit is crappy, but that doesn’t change the kind of franchise the Red Wings are.

comeonnowguys says:
So if I’m reading this right, you’re saying ESPN is biased *against* Boston *in favor of* small market teams? Did I drive through a dimensional rift on my way back from lunch today? Or were you playing “Opposite Day?”

If you read the article, you’d know the answer is yes. The formula they used effectively eliminates all teams with big payrolls and high ticket prices.

To me a great franchise is one that creates such a tremendous following that they can charge an average of $85 a seat and still sell out all 82 games, even on Tuesday nights and Thursday afternoons in an ancient stadium.

What a shocker……….the the ESPN “experts” love the Packers. But what’s not to love? They eat a lot of brats, drink a lot of beer, and waste a lot of money on a worthless piece of paper just so they can say they’re stockholders.
The only thing that rivals the Packers in Wisconsin is cow tipping.

ok and this survey was done based on what criteria and for how long???

1. If it’s over a course of a teams history then the list is flawed.

2. If it’s based on the last ten 10-20 years then it may have some credence.

Back to #1 if this was the case then no way the Skins would be 2nd from the bottom because one Super Bowl or none would not make you a storied franchise i.e. Tampa, New Orleans, Arizona/Phoenix/St. Louis, Detroit….

The votes on this list are pretty much like the HOF voting in most sports it sucks as do the sports writers doing the voting…

I completely don’t get “stadium experience” as it applies to the football or the NFL.
I’ve been to Lambeau. Great place to watch a game…and not a heckuva lot different than a slew of other football stadiums I’ve seen games at.
Bottom Line is it isn’t baseball; the field does not have it’s own unique traits, unique characteristics that differentiarte it from others. It’s a football stradium; 100 x 55, like every other.
I think Notre Dame is a terrific place to watch a game too but in the final analysis, the stadium does not make the viewing experience significantly superior to Purdue or Boston College.

Another victory for the GREEN AND GOLD! Now ranked the best in North America ans STILL WORLD CHAMPIONS for the THIRTEENTH TIME!

And the fans do have a lot to do with it. Fans buy stock in this team, buy tickets and tend to visit during the off season the Pro Shop, attend gatherings and make it all possible. The person who wrote that hit piece is just jealous.

Obviously, their probably is very little difference in any of the top ten (I haven’t seen the list it could even be the top 20) franchises. They are probably the usual suspects…

But at the heart of this is that if you do things the right way you will be successful. Other franchises that tend to take short cuts, try to manufacture controversy, give into spite and such, and franchise in it for the quick buck… Tend to see those guys in the back end of these lists.

And of course we all know who they are… You see them here with their petty comments. They don’t understand what winning is all about and never will. Just pathetic really.

and for ESPN’s estimate of how many championships fans can expect to see the team win in their lifetimes.

In my lifetime they’ve been to 5 Superbowls and won 3 how many other teams fans ahead of them can say that? And any genius who’s watched sports for more than 5-10 years will know that along with the good comes the bad yes we’ve been bad for sometime now but in the 80’s and early 90’s San Fran and Washington were at the top and in the mix and where was GB, NO, Tampa, Indy, NE yes those teams ESPN loves to love now they all stunk so don’t get to high on your horse as your turn to stink is a coming…

OMG…4SKINS RANKED 121 OUT OF 122. CONGRATS TO THE 4SKIN ORG AND DANNY BOY MUST BE AWFULLY PROUD TO HAVE RUN A ONCE PROUD ORG UNDER THE COOKE FAMILY INTO ONE OF THE WORST. SOON TO BE LAST AFTER ANOTHER 2-14 SEASAON TOO..LMAO.

I WENT TO THAT STADIUM AND IT IS A BIG CEMENT DEBACTLE WITH ABSOLUTELY NO LIFE OR CHARACTER. LOVE IT……….

Speaking on behalf of all us Packers owners, we say “thanks” to ESPN the Mag for this recognition!

Speaking on behalf of all us Packers owners, we say “tough noogies” to blowhard loudmouth dilusional Vikings fans (if you are a Vikings fan but not a blowhard, loudmouth, or dilusional, you are ok – that was not meant for you).

boysroll says:
Jun 15, 2011 2:48 PM
OMG…4SKINS RANKED 121 OUT OF 122. CONGRATS TO THE 4SKIN ORG AND DANNY BOY MUST BE AWFULLY PROUD TO HAVE RUN A ONCE PROUD ORG UNDER THE COOKE FAMILY INTO ONE OF THE WORST. SOON TO BE LAST AFTER ANOTHER 2-14 SEASAON TOO..LMAO.

I WENT TO THAT STADIUM AND IT IS A BIG CEMENT DEBACTLE WITH ABSOLUTELY NO LIFE OR CHARACTER. LOVE IT……….

btw you just described the entire city of Dallas there at the end…I once had a drill sgt tell one of my platoon mates there only two things in Dallas queers and steers and boy you ain’t got no horns…

The field of Lambeau Field doesn’t have characteristics? Sorry, but you’re wrong there. I see some of your points comparing it to baseball, as baseball fields can be radically different and football fields have to have the same measurements, but the grass at Lambeau effects the speed of the game. How it holds water and how it comes apart. Radically different than say Soldier Field or Candlestick.

“If you read the article, you’d know the answer is yes. The formula they used effectively eliminates all teams with big payrolls and high ticket prices.

To me a great franchise is one that creates such a tremendous following that they can charge an average of $85 a seat and still sell out all 82 games, even on Tuesday nights and Thursday afternoons in an ancient stadium.”

Key words being “to me.”

Yes, I read it, and (insert diety here) Forbid they consider other factors than whether or not they sell out?

Also, I don’t know where you’re getting your numbers, but I’m seeing $53.38. From ESPN: “The Boston Red Sox have the most expensive average ticket at $53.38. The New York Yankees are second at $51.83 and the Chicago Cubs third at $46.90.”

But hey, up until the last two years Cub fans were filling a worse ballpark than Fenway to watch (most years) a vastly inferior team than the Red Sox. So I’m supposed to believe that up until 2009 the Cubs were a better franchise? Please.

Packer fans that think they own the team always make me laugh. That so called “stock” was actually a donation to the team.

The “stock” entitles you to NOTHING.

The “stock” LEGALLY CAN NOT BE SOLD – therefore it is completely worthless. Of course you can give the worthless piece of paper to your friends or relatives when you die, I’m sure they will be very grateful.

The “stock” does not give you a vote on anything like real stock does.

The “stock” is nothing more than a piece of paper that morons can hang on their wall to show people how they donated $200 to a pro sports franchise.

The fact that the team even calls it a stock and the fans eat it up shows how dumb some packer fans are.

When is the last time you bought a stock that specifically stated that it can never be sold, and entitles you to no rights or vote on what the organization does?

So please explain to me why some people think the piece of paper (essentially a receipt for their donation) has anything in common with real stock.

Honestly even calling that piece of paper “stock” is borderline fraud, because it is in no way even close to being stock in the company.

“and for ESPN’s estimate of how many championships fans can expect to see the team win in their lifetimes.”

Joking aside, this is a really stupid criteria. So ESPN thinks it can predict how many championships a team will win in a lifetime? If they made this list 40 years ago the Steelers would’ve been at the bottom because they were terrible hadn’t won any yet. If this list was made in 2000 where would the Patriots rank? The Saints were historically crap until 2 years ago. They still have the same owner and same stadium…….what changed? They won a championship and now they’re a great franchise? What if a team that hasn’t won a Super Bowl wins 4 of the next 10 years? Will they become a top 5 franchise because the band wagon jumpers at ESPN will project that they’ll win 20 more in our lifetime?

Another victory for the GREEN AND GOLD! Now ranked the best in North America ans STILL WORLD CHAMPIONS for the THIRTEENTH TIME!

Too bad you had nothing to do with it nor will you ever, but, who am I to tell you not to keep the dream alive. Lol

I would think the people coming up with this poll are idiots for the sole reason that teams such as the Montreal Canadians, Detroit Red Wings, Boston Red Sox, New York Yankess are probably head and shoulders above the Cheese Curds. But, I have no problem with this empty award being granted to the Pack. Congrats….

I went to Lambeau back in ’05 wearing an opposing team’s jersey, and I was treated with a ton of good humor and respect. That was a classy, classy ballpark and is one of my fondest memories of sporting events. Even when Favre threw the prettiest TD pass I’d ever seen, no one rubbed it in my face.

For the record, Cincinnati and Tennessee also had very cool, pleasant fans when dealing with an opposition spectator.

If the players I cheer for are willing to endure open-air sub-zero temperatures and swirling winds for the benefit of my entertainment, then I want to be sitting there on aluminum benches through four full quarters enduring the same conditions with them. It’s not for people looking for comfort and convenience. I prefer it that way. It’s just one of the ways the fans connect with the team like nowhere else. Visually, no, it isn’t much different than watching another 100 yard long football field. But when all the people you see around you are talking about their great-grandfathers sitting in the same seats, and their grandfathers, and their fathers…..it is in your blood. Yeah, sure, it’s the only show in town. That’s not a bad thing. That’s what champion surfers that live in small towns near the ocean say. That’s what champion climbers that live in small towns near the mountains say. And that’s what fans in a small town near the champion Packers say. It’s unique and very accommodating to out-of-town fans and visitors. You can walk up to any tailgating environment wearing your visiting jersey and ask if they have a spare beer and three hands will extend out with one in hand. Dickheads need not apply.

bradshawlives says:
Jun 15, 2011 3:02 PM
“and for ESPN’s estimate of how many championships fans can expect to see the team win in their lifetimes.”

Joking aside, this is a really stupid criteria. So ESPN thinks it can predict how many championships a team will win in a lifetime? If they made this list 40 years ago the Steelers would’ve been at the bottom because they were terrible hadn’t won any yet. If this list was made in 2000 where would the Patriots rank? The Saints were historically crap until 2 years ago. They still have the same owner and same stadium…….what changed? They won a championship and now they’re a great franchise? What if a team that hasn’t won a Super Bowl wins 4 of the next 10 years? Will they become a top 5 franchise because the band wagon jumpers at ESPN will project that they’ll win 20 more in our lifetime?
_________________

These are excellent points. It’s preposterous to think they could predict how many championships a team will win in the next 40 years. Except for one team. As a Viking fan, I can guarantee you that the Vikings will not win a championship in my lifetime.

I agree with Lonespeed, the Lions have been pathetic. I doubt they could have survived in any other town but the fans in Detroit have been as loyal as William Clay Ford has been clueless. One lousy playoff win, no cheerleaders and a 0-16 season record on his resume for the last fifty years. Never have so few done so little for so many. I would find it ironic and irritating if WCF lives to hoist the Lombardy trophy.

adcallsfootball says:
Jun 15, 2011 2:58 PM
Packer fans that think they own the team always make me laugh. That so called “stock” was actually a donation to the team.
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No kidding Sherlock? How insightful! None of us knew that until you came along. Moron. Everybody who made a purchase knew exactly what it was….and made the purchase anyway. It’s called unparalleled support (and it is also called Marketing Genius 101.) Thirty-one other teams wish they could create a revenue stream as simple as this one. Do you know how many (other) teams could pull it off? I’ll give you a hint….NONE.

Packer fans that think they own the team always make me laugh. That so called “stock” was actually a donation to the team.

The “stock” entitles you to NOTHING.

The “stock” LEGALLY CAN NOT BE SOLD – therefore it is completely worthless. Of course you can give the worthless piece of paper to your friends or relatives when you die, I’m sure they will be very grateful.

The “stock” does not give you a vote on anything like real stock does.

The “stock” is nothing more than a piece of paper that morons can hang on their wall to show people how they donated $200 to a pro sports franchise.

The fact that the team even calls it a stock and the fans eat it up shows how dumb some packer fans are.

When is the last time you bought a stock that specifically stated that it can never be sold, and entitles you to no rights or vote on what the organization does?

So please explain to me why some people think the piece of paper (essentially a receipt for their donation) has anything in common with real stock.

Honestly even calling that piece of paper “stock” is borderline fraud, because it is in no way even close to being stock in the company.
_________________________

Why does ESPN have such a hard on for Green Bay? Personally I’ve always thought the best team in the NFL is Pittsburgh. The best team in sports history though? Gotta be Detroit Red Wings… maybe New York Yankees. I guess it is all opinionated though.

Just so you know, cheeseheads… this isn’t something that will be written down in history books. It’s just ESPN’s opinion.

Even as a PANTHERS fan, I am cool with the Green Bay deal….I am just surprised that the Raiders arent at the bottom, maybe they were #120.
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You’re surprised because you’re ignorant, in the true sense of the word.

So, are you trying to say the Raiders should be ranked higher?? This is based on things like STADIUM EXPERIENCE. Do I even need to go into scary detail about a visit to that hellhole? Who’s the ignorant one here?

My 2 club seat seasons at Lambeau are over $200 a piece….granted 8 games plus the preemies, but alot to bear….cry me a river on $85. That’s the equivalent of about $45 over here. The new user fee of $1,400 I got handed could buy quite a few Sam Adams.
__________________________________

To you donkeys that can’t divide 162 by 2…it’s 81 games….unless you guys get a bonus game to celebrate the lobster claw or the Kennedy family.
__________________________________

Amazing to me that people actually believe in and/or get all worked up about stories like this. I’m a life-long Packer fan and think it’s a great organization, but c’mon… articles like this are just meant to get attention and ignite controversy. I went through a checkout lane a few weeks ago and saw some rag was calling Jennifer Lopez the sexiest woman alive, then saw two or three sexier women (without benefit of Hollywood make-up artists) before I was out of the parking lot. The Packers are a very good organization, as are several others. That’s enough for me.

This from a guy who is obsessed with a commenter on PFT. Why don’t you mind your own business?

——-

Why don’t you make me…. Of course, I’ll make you a deal, I will mind my own business when you quit spewing your hate.
______________

What you call “hate,” other people call “good-natured ribbing.” If you’re looking for people who spew hate, you need look no further than goombar2. Meanwhile, I’ll keep entertaining PFT Planet with my humorous observations.

If you insist on a confrontation, why don’t you meet me at the Weekapaug Inn over the 4th of July weekend?

“badcallsfootball says:
Jun 15, 2011 2:58 PM
Packer fans that think they own the team always make me laugh. That so called “stock” was actually a donation to the team.

The “stock” entitles you to NOTHING.

The “stock” LEGALLY CAN NOT BE SOLD – therefore it is completely worthless. Of course you can give the worthless piece of paper to your friends or relatives when you die, I’m sure they will be very grateful.

The “stock” does not give you a vote on anything like real stock does.

The “stock” is nothing more than a piece of paper that morons can hang on their wall to show people how they donated $200 to a pro sports franchise.

The fact that the team even calls it a stock and the fans eat it up shows how dumb some packer fans are.

When is the last time you bought a stock that specifically stated that it can never be sold, and entitles you to no rights or vote on what the organization does?

So please explain to me why some people think the piece of paper (essentially a receipt for their donation) has anything in common with real stock.

Honestly even calling that piece of paper “stock” is borderline fraud, because it is in no way even close to being stock in the company.

“Actually — that stock entitles us to a team that can NEVER be moved.”

There is one way the Packers would move. If the rest of the owners decided they were sick of supporting welfare cases like GB and Buffalo and ended revenue sharing. The Packers would no longer be competitive no matter how many $200 sheets of paper they sold. Community “ownership” wouldn’t be viable and the franchise would be gone.

You contributed nothing to making the Packers the top rated team on a purley hypothetical and subjective poll, and this statement just furthers the sterotype that Packer fans judge their self-worth based on how the Packers are doing.

But hey. “you” did it!
_________________________________
1. Packer fans are far from the only fans that refer to themselves as “we” when describing their team.

Viking ‘fans’, you people are lucky as hell that the Vikings aren’t at the very bottom of that list. I mean, they have all the credentials…a crappy stadium, a crappy ‘fanbase’, a crappy owner, and the best of all a crappy team.

packerbacker12 – seriously, you won only a single division title 28 years between 1967 and 1995. Post Lombardi for 30 years you guys defined losers. Without Brett Favre, you guys would not have gotten out the cellar. In the end, all your bravado about championships is either ancient history or due to Brett Favre, a player you guys have disowned. Keep saying it….Lindy Infante, Lindy Infante, Tony Mandrich, Tony Mandrich…

Do they have a 35-40 year waiting list for season tickets?
—————————————–
I think that’s for people that joined the waiting list 35-40 years ago. If you signed up now I think it’s something more like 200+ years. Seriously.

—————————————————-

im a vikings fan, but it is more like 955 years according to the milwaukee journal sentinel as of jan 29th 2011. 86,000 people on the list, average of 90 turning over every year…you do the math.

packerbacker12 says:
Jun 15, 2011 4:39 PM
Viking ‘fans’, you people are lucky as hell that the Vikings aren’t at the very bottom of that list. I mean, they have all the credentials…a crappy stadium, a crappy ‘fanbase’, a crappy owner, and the best of all a crappy team.

It’s people like this I’ll never understand. As a Viking fan, I can’t really argue with Packers being the best franchise in sports, but a few obnoxious Packer fans on here really tarnish their image.

It’s when generalizing people because they support a certain team and thinking you’re better than someone because your football team is good when you should probably take a step back and reevaluate how serious you take sports.

You contributed nothing to making the Packers the top rated team on a purley hypothetical and subjective poll, and this statement just furthers the sterotype that Packer fans judge their self-worth based on how the Packers are doing.

But hey. “you” did it!
_________________________________
1. Packer fans are far from the only fans that refer to themselves as “we” when describing their team.

I am a Pittsburgh fan so it pains me to say this…not quite sure how the Red Wings are not higher rated. Been to the Joe and witness a great set of games and they are to be admired. I am glad to see the Steelers and Pens in the top ten, but they are model franchises so I think they should be higher. I also think the Pirates should be at or near the bottem…just my 2 cents.

There is one way the Packers would move. If the rest of the owners decided they were sick of supporting welfare cases like GB and Buffalo and ended revenue sharing. The Packers would no longer be competitive no matter how many $200 sheets of paper they sold. Community “ownership” wouldn’t be viable and the franchise would be gone.

——————————————————————

This is a lie, probably done by a fan of a different franchise pretending to be a Steelers fan. Steeler fans have for the most part been some of the most gracious, smart, and kindest fans here. Unlike ONE other franchise…

The Green Bay Packers Inc. has posted a profit every year since the merger of the leagues. GB Inc. also shares in many TV records, bringing in viewership which leads to higher revenues.

By the way, it is so enjoyable watching these familiar faces just writhing in agony and furious in their jealousy… It’s so funny, because those familiar faces that come here with their envious comments and vitriolic rhetoric… They spew out how hateful I am?

Dudes, nobody hates you guys more than you hate yourselves. Anybody wanting to call out a fight on here is an idiot. In real life, you wouldn’t dare talk to me that way and you certainly wouldn’t want to fight me. That’s not the way mature adults behave, makes you look like a child or a hot head. But nobody thinks you’re a tough guy…

We (Packer Fans) have every right to take pride in our favorite football team. As an owner, I made an investment for the sake of my child and my favorite team. I do get voting rights to whomever is making stuff up about us not getting any rights.

As a lifelong Steelers fan I don’t begrudge the Packers in the top spot. While the Steelers fans have been (IMHO) the best franchise since 1970’s, the Packers can boast a loyal fan base and winning tradition from the 1930’s. Good for them!

I do question ranking the Redskins so low; don’t confuse a dislike for the owner as a dislike for the team. When Dan Synder sells the team fan support will rise again to the Joe Gibbs era levels.

Honestly, every team has fans that get loud and support the team.
____________________________
Exactly, and many of those fans use the term “we” when describing their team. They also contribute to their team’s success/failures through their support, so in effect you’re agreeing with me.
__________________________________

The difference is you seem to think that YOU make the difference between a team being bad to good, or good to great.
__________________________________
No fan has made that claim here, I think you’re attributing a lot of meaning to the simple use of the word “we” when describing our team dude.

sakatak says:
Jun 15, 2011 2:10 PM
Make sure you arrive at least 3 hours before game time and meander through the crowd. If you are a fan of the opposition you will be treated with respect and probably get to eat some awesome food and drink some great beer. Just some thoughts for fans bucket lists.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
After the game, however, the drunks become a-holes, like all other places. We were pulling onto a road in our Packer gear and a Jeep a few houses down (yeah, parking on someone’s lawn is pretty neat) didn’t like that, even though they were pulling out a few cars behind us, threw a half filled Mountain Dew bottle at our car. If I ever saw him again, I’d take a 2X4 upside his Jeep and then upside his head.

Bitter? You bet I am. And this was after a win, making the Detroit Lions 0-16 so it’s been a few years.

Third, how many did your muppets win between 1967 and 1995? One and that was the strike season.

Fourth, without Brett Favre, you would have never seen the light of day until 2010.”

Dang that’s a lot of division championships! I’d GLADLY trade all of our (me and my co-owners) Lombardi Trophies for all of those division championship trophies. I mean we only have 4 of those Lombardi Trophies… I’d much rather have 18 piss-ant trophies… I mean…. division champion trophies.

So, are you trying to say the Raiders should be ranked higher?? This is based on things like STADIUM EXPERIENCE. Do I even need to go into scary detail about a visit to that hellhole? Who’s the ignorant one here?
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You are, all you know is what you hear from others who don’t know either.

This is a lie, probably done by a fan of a different franchise pretending to be a Steelers fan. Steeler fans have for the most part been some of the most gracious, smart, and kindest fans here. Unlike ONE other franchise…

Says the obtuse loser who does nothing but post vitriol on every thread pertaining to this OTHER franchise.

…As a Viking fan, I can’t really argue with Packers being the best franchise in sports, but a few obnoxious Packer fans on here really tarnish their image.

It’s when generalizing people because they support a certain team and thinking you’re better than someone because your football team is good when you should probably take a step back and reevaluate how serious you take sports.

Hear that Goobar! Take a step back, “dude”. You are not an owner, nor have you done anything that has directly resulted in the Packers accomplishing anything, “dude”. This is not hate, nor envy, nor vitriol, “dude”. Hope you don’t jump through the computer screen and beat me up, “dude”. Cause, well you know just how stupid that would make you sound, “dude”.

I would like to make a point though in rcunningham’s post. Depending on your age, the Packers have not always been “great”. The 70s, 80s, and part of the 90s have been some pretty lean years.

All I can say is ‘wow’! I had always believed that ESPN knew their stuff. I was terribly mistaken. One NFL team routinely has higher attendance for its home games most every other in the league. This team has ranked in the highest attendance for years.

So, when valuing a franchise, does this count at all? Based on your pitiful criteria, it would seem it should. So, ESPN, stand up and correct things!

This team, by the way, is the WASHINGTON REDSKINS. I am not saying they shoudl be top 10, but second to last?

sakatak says:
Jun 15, 2011 2:10 PM
Make sure you arrive at least 3 hours before game time and meander through the crowd. If you are a fan of the opposition you will be treated with respect and probably get to eat some awesome food and drink some great beer. Just some thoughts for fans bucket lists.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
After the game, however, the drunks become a-holes, like all other places. We were pulling onto a road in our Packer gear and a Jeep a few houses down (yeah, parking on someone’s lawn is pretty neat) didn’t like that, even though they were pulling out a few cars behind us, threw a half filled Mountain Dew bottle at our car. If I ever saw him again, I’d take a 2X4 upside his Jeep and then upside his head.

Bitter? You bet I am. And this was after a win, making the Detroit Lions 0-16 so it’s been a few years.
———————————————————-
Are you sure they were drunks, sounds to me like they were over caffeinted.

Here we go again… Viking ‘fans’ thinking it was ALL Brett Favre who saved our franchise. Sorry pal but the guy who saved our franchise didn’t go by the name of Brett Favre. He went by the name of RON WOLF. He was the one who saved Favre’s career from turmoil. He was the one who hired Mike Holmgren. And he was the one who signed players like Reggie White and Desmond Howard.

It pisses me off when Viking losers like yourself automatically assume it was all Favre but indeed it wasn’t.

“It’s people like this I’ll never understand. As a Viking fan, I can’t really argue with Packers being the best franchise in sports, but a few obnoxious Packer fans on here really tarnish their image.”

Are you seriously calling Packer fans obnoxious? Viking ‘fans’ are the ones littering this story with trash talk. All Packer fans are doing is defending our team. We aren’t gotta sweet talk you guys.

packerbacker12 says:
Jun 16, 2011 5:44 PM
“Without Brett Favre, you guys would not have gotten out the cellar.”

Here we go again… Viking ‘fans’ thinking it was ALL Brett Favre who saved our franchise. Sorry pal but the guy who saved our franchise didn’t go by the name of Brett Favre. He went by the name of RON WOLF.
———–
No…it was Brett Favre. You can try to twist the logic however you want but unless Ron Wolf was out there throwing, catching, tackling and sacking then your argument is just not a good one. Brett Favre was a piece of the puzzle with a great supporting cast but it was mainly him. Without him the Packers would not have been in the position to be in the game let alone win it. However…if Favre had retired as a Packer I am sure you would have a whole different story than what you wrote.

Here we go again… Viking ‘fans’ thinking it was ALL Brett Favre who saved our franchise. Sorry pal but the guy who saved our franchise didn’t go by the name of Brett Favre. He went by the name of RON WOLF.
———–
No…it was Brett Favre. You can try to twist the logic however you want but unless Ron Wolf was out there throwing, catching, tackling and sacking then your argument is just not a good one. Brett Favre was a piece of the puzzle with a great supporting cast but it was mainly him. Without him the Packers would not have been in the position to be in the game let alone win it. However…if Favre had retired as a Packer I am sure you would have a whole different story than what you wrote.
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Better yet…I tell you what. By your logic -YOU were the reason they won the Super Bowl. Yes, YOU! As a Packer shareholder YOU had the vote that made the different in management which hired Ron Wolf who hired so on and so on….thanks to YOU the Packers won!

Are you seriously calling Packer fans obnoxious? Viking ‘fans’ are the ones littering this story with trash talk. All Packer fans are doing is defending our team. We aren’t gotta sweet talk you guys.

Two points:

The first is the Wolf/Favre issue. Who cares is the points. The one got the other who got you guys out of the cellar. That is the point and it matters not just who it was.

The second: are you saying you do not appreciate Viking fans coming onto your threads and behaving less than cordially? Interesting because there are few here who do that on Viking threads incessantly. I’m sure you know who I mean as I have made a point about it. Also, not to split hairs, this thread wasn’t solely about the Pack, but all sports teams so we weren’t necessarily invading your thread.

Next week, the Bruins will be tied with the Mavericks as the # 1 team in sports. End of October/early November, whoever wins the World Series will be # 1. Next February, the NFL champ will be # 1. To quote the ESPN NFL guys…”C’MON, MAN!”

Sure Ron Wolf didn’t play in the game but he was the one who built the team and provided the franchise with the right players to win the Super Bowl. And I wasn’t trying to take away anything from what Brett Favre did. He played a huge role in the resurrection of the franchise but Wolf had the biggest role.

“However…if Favre had retired as a Packer I am sure you would have a whole different story than what you wrote.”

What happened between Favre and the Packers didn’t change my perspective of him one bit. Sure I hated when he wore that ugly purple but I will always honor and respect him for his role in putting the Packers back on top. Nothing will change that.

First: packerbacker, I’m not going to argue with you about the whole Wolf/Favre thing. We’ll concede he was a piece of the puzzle, and not the only reason. And the FA signings went farther than White and Howard….don’t forget Sean Jones, Santana Dotson, Don Beebe, Keith Jackson, Eugene Robinson….half the starting lineup of that SB were FA signings. But answer me this. Given what you have posted here, why do Packer fans come to Vikings threads and
a) claim that FA is for losers and the only way to build a team is through the draft, and
b) say that no matter what other players are on a team, you need a star QB to be successful
Do you really wonder why Vikings fans call some Packer fans hypocritical?

Second, when one considers the posters who claim that the Vikings aren’t Packer rivals, and the Bears are their only rivals, I see a lot of barbs at the Vikings and their fans, and none aimed at the Bears. Maybe I’m confused about the whole rivalry thing……

And third, why is it the THIRTEEN TIME WORLD CHAMPS, as some seem to think they need to proclaim in capital letters like a teenager bragging about nailing the head cheerleader, have fans that act like a little sister dancing around the table after beating her big brother in checkers? Seriously, I have seen more class in victory from Little Leaguers than what has been displayed the last few months from a handful of people on here.

I guess it’s only fitting, though…. the fanbase reflects the team. I know there are a lot of good, humble, and classy Packer fans out there, both from the occasional poster telling the others to grow up, and from my own experiences with them. But, just as Driver’s raffles and the Grant/Brewers story gets forgotten in the wake of Jolly’s drug dealing and Underwood’s hookers, the people behaving like the rude high school jock make us forget the tailgaters with a friendly word and a wish of ‘good luck to you guys’ to those sporting a Moss jersey at Lambeau. It’s sad that, when a Vikings fan thinks about the Packers fans on PFT, they think about the fan equivalent of Chmura and the babysitter first.

Congrats to the Packer organization, and my condolences on having the kind of fans that make me think of the guy who wins a World Series of Poker tournament, and then gets embarrassed by his brother-in-law dancing around and whooping in the crowd, thinking he had some part in it because the winner came to some of his poker nights in his garage.

“Second, when one considers the posters who claim that the Vikings aren’t Packer rivals, and the Bears are their only rivals, I see a lot of barbs at the Vikings and their fans, and none aimed at the Bears. Maybe I’m confused about the whole rivalry thing……
”

There’s a lot of respect among Packers and Bears fans. Both teams have been up and down over the last 80 or so years as their battles have continued.

The Vikings are the expansion team, the new kids on the block and have not earned that respect.

And don’t forget, the Packers gave up the upper mid-west, what had been part of their fan base, when the Vikes entered the league. All those folks all the way across into North Dakota and even Montana used to follow the Packers.

You contributed nothing to making the Packers the top rated team on a purley hypothetical and subjective poll, and this statement just furthers the sterotype that Packer fans judge their self-worth based on how the Packers are doing.

To throw in a completely unrelated cheap shot with glee over the Vikings possibly leaving makes you scum.

But hey. “you” did it!
—————————
By all means, just spout crap without reading the article.

“It also factors in feedback in 21 categories from more than 70,000 fans nationwide, both online at ESPN.com and in polling conducted by both independent third parties.”

And don’t forget, the Packers gave up the upper mid-west, what had been part of their fan base, when the Vikes entered the league. All those folks all the way across into North Dakota and even Montana used to follow the Packers.
———————————————

That is something I had not considered….. I imagine that the former Packer fans who took up cheering for the Vikings back in the 70’s engendered the same type of feelings in Packer fans back then that seeing Favre in purple caused now.

“Second, when one considers the posters who claim that the Vikings aren’t Packer rivals, and the Bears are their only rivals, I see a lot of barbs at the Vikings and their fans, and none aimed at the Bears. Maybe I’m confused about the whole rivalry thing……”

Oh there has been some barbs between Packer fans and Bear fans lately especially after what Brian Urlacher said. There just not on this story.

That is something I had not considered….. I imagine that the former Packer fans who took up cheering for the Vikings back in the 70′s engendered the same type of feelings in Packer fans back then that seeing Favre in purple caused now.

________________

Doubtful. I find it hard to believe that any (true) Packer fans abandoned their team for the pink, er I mean purple and gold. But, let’s assume a few casual fans switched allegiances, what’d that get you? 4 SB losses? By the way, don’t try crawling back to our bandwagon, we don’t need ya.

That is something I had not considered….. I imagine that the former Packer fans who took up cheering for the Vikings back in the 70′s engendered the same type of feelings in Packer fans back then that seeing Favre in purple caused now.

________________

Doubtful. I find it hard to believe that any (true) Packer fans abandoned their team for the pink, er I mean purple and gold. But, let’s assume a few casual fans switched allegiances, what’d that get you? 4 SB losses? By the way, don’t try crawling back to our bandwagon, we don’t need ya.
—————-
You just referred to your fanbase as bandwagon…and…yea I cant argue with you on this one.

That is something I had not considered….. I imagine that the former Packer fans who took up cheering for the Vikings back in the 70′s engendered the same type of feelings in Packer fans back then that seeing Favre in purple caused now.

________________

Doubtful. I find it hard to believe that any (true) Packer fans abandoned their team for the pink, er I mean purple and gold. But, let’s assume a few casual fans switched allegiances, what’d that get you? 4 SB losses? By the way, don’t try crawling back to our bandwagon, we don’t need ya.
—————————————-

Have no fear, Spike Lee is more likely to donate a kidney to Reggie Miller than I am to switch my allegiance. And even if I was considering that change, the mere thought of people like you being a “true” Packer fan would dissuade me. Congratulations on doing your part to ensure that the Packer fan base becomes no larger.

People are entitled to root for, enjoy, and be proud of their respective teams. No one likes obnoxious dolts that revolve their lives around said teams and the exchange above with normal packer fans is expected. A give and take of barbs and defense of ones team is normal. What is not appreciated nor expected is behavior exemplified by Loser #1 and Loser #1A. I would venture to guess these two are truly life losers if one was able to glimpse into their pathetic miserable lives. Successful, happy people do not behave in this manner. Take it to the bank.

First: packerbacker, I’m not going to argue with you about the whole Wolf/Favre thing. We’ll concede he was a piece of the puzzle, and not the only reason. And the FA signings went farther than White and Howard….don’t forget Sean Jones, Santana Dotson, Don Beebe, Keith Jackson, Eugene Robinson….half the starting lineup of that SB were FA signings. But answer me this. Given what you have posted here, why do Packer fans come to Vikings threads and
a) claim that FA is for losers and the only way to build a team is through the draft, and
b) say that no matter what other players are on a team, you need a star QB to be successful
Do you really wonder why Vikings fans call some Packer fans hypocritical?

Second, when one considers the posters who claim that the Vikings aren’t Packer rivals, and the Bears are their only rivals, I see a lot of barbs at the Vikings and their fans, and none aimed at the Bears. Maybe I’m confused about the whole rivalry thing……

And third, why is it the THIRTEEN TIME WORLD CHAMPS, as some seem to think they need to proclaim in capital letters like a teenager bragging about nailing the head cheerleader, have fans that act like a little sister dancing around the table after beating her big brother in checkers? Seriously, I have seen more class in victory from Little Leaguers than what has been displayed the last few months from a handful of people on here.

I guess it’s only fitting, though…. the fanbase reflects the team. I know there are a lot of good, humble, and classy Packer fans out there, both from the occasional poster telling the others to grow up, and from my own experiences with them. But, just as Driver’s raffles and the Grant/Brewers story gets forgotten in the wake of Jolly’s drug dealing and Underwood’s hookers, the people behaving like the rude high school jock make us forget the tailgaters with a friendly word and a wish of ‘good luck to you guys’ to those sporting a Moss jersey at Lambeau. It’s sad that, when a Vikings fan thinks about the Packers fans on PFT, they think about the fan equivalent of Chmura and the babysitter first.

Congrats to the Packer organization, and my condolences on having the kind of fans that make me think of the guy who wins a World Series of Poker tournament, and then gets embarrassed by his brother-in-law dancing around and whooping in the crowd, thinking he had some part in it because the winner came to some of his poker nights in his garage.

………………………………………………………………..
Dude….The fact that you think that a stupid blog, with a couple stupid so called packer fans saying moronic things,…… speek for all normal packer fans??? That makes you the dolt. Get real most of the people on this blog are 25 and younger.

packerbacker12 says:
Jun 17, 2011 12:18 PM
“Second, when one considers the posters who claim that the Vikings aren’t Packer rivals, and the Bears are their only rivals, I see a lot of barbs at the Vikings and their fans, and none aimed at the Bears. Maybe I’m confused about the whole rivalry thing……”

Oh there has been some barbs between Packer fans and Bear fans lately especially after what Brian Urlacher said. There just not on this story.
—————————————-

Of that I am sure!! I have noticed those on other threads. I never really thought of Urlacher as being an antagonistic person, but boy did he start a storm with that one!

Really, I just found it amusing that the same people who contend that no rivalry exists between the Packers and the Vikings are using this story to claim superiority over the Vikings and their fans and not breathing a word about their “rivals”, the Bears. I often feel the urge to point out inconsistencies in the ramblings of poorly behaved individuals.

stavreafavre says:
Jun 16, 2011 3:50 PM
bozosforall, Minnesota fans will tell you that the titles that Ruth and Gehrig won don’t count because there weren’t enough teams playing back then.
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Not entirely true…. While there were fewer teams playing then, baseball was an established and successful sport at that time, whereas football had a following similar to what MLS has now. In case you needed the reminder, the ’39 “world championship” featured the Packers and was played in Milwaukee, ,and still drew just 32,000 fans and just over $85,000 in gate receipts. Do you really want to continue with this comparison?

Ask yourself this…. Could a rival baseball league have been created and become successful enough to force a merger with MLB in the 60’s? Apples and oranges, son, apples and oranges……

While I admit the Packers are an impressive franchise and should be ranked quite highly, I just don’t see how you can rank them ahead of the Steelers (I’m an Eagles fan so I have no rooting interest between the two).

The Steelers fan base is every bit as devoted to their team and clearly have had more success int he modern era than the Packers. It does look a little like ESPN let the “quaintness” of the Packers (team in a small town, community owned, etc…) skew their thinking a bit here.

Hey the Green Bay Packers are set up like America should be run, by the city and the fans instead of by the whims of some rich family.

Its too stinkin’ bad that the Bengals can’t fire the owner (Mike Brown – flush him down) but have to instead wait for him to die to get someone else in there that might have some inkling and desire to win.

Please churches everywhere around the Cincinnati everywhere pray for the death of MB.

In case you needed the reminder, the ’39 “world championship” featured the Packers and was played in Milwaukee, ,and still drew just 32,000 fans and just over $85,000 in gate receipts.
________________________________

footballrulz says:
Jun 18, 2011 12:56 PM
In case you needed the reminder, the ’39 “world championship” featured the Packers and was played in Milwaukee, ,and still drew just 32,000 fans and just over $85,000 in gate receipts.
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$2.65 to see a pro football game. Those were the days.

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Wouldn’t that be nice…. You can’t even get into a high school game for that.

Oh yeah, and no whining from the players about who is getting paid more. That would be nice too….

How can the Bengals be named the worst franchise in sports when they’ve made the Playoffs twice in the past handful of years, winning the division just 2 years ago. How about the Nationals/Expos who havent been to the Playoffs in 29 years, or the Royals who havent been to the playoffs in 25 years?

brewdogg says:
Jun 18, 2011 2:32 PM
footballrulz says:
Jun 18, 2011 12:56 PM
In case you needed the reminder, the ’39 “world championship” featured the Packers and was played in Milwaukee, ,and still drew just 32,000 fans and just over $85,000 in gate receipts.
________________________________

$2.65 to see a pro football game. Those were the days.

——————————————–

Wouldn’t that be nice…. You can’t even get into a high school game for that.

Oh yeah, and no whining from the players about who is getting paid more. That would be nice too….

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My brother saw the Beatles live on stage back in 1965 — paid $5 for his ticket.

If you are just looking at recent years yes the Redskins are as bad if not worse than everyone including the Bengals. The Bengals have won the division with in the last 10 years, Redskins can’t say that.

Not to mention the gouging Synder does to his fan base is ridiculous. Invites them to come see practice than charges up the rear for parking.

Since Synder has taken over the team they have been run like a bunch of teenagers own the team. Going after big name free agents who almost always become busts and put the team in salary cap hell.

the article was accurate. best franchise in professional sports by far. all the money goes back into the team, the gameday experience for the fans, and scouting. not to a greedy owner like EVERY OTHER TEAM. game, set, and match, suckwads.