The Collaire Report

The Collaire Report - 04/30/0804:19 AM

Yeah, I cleverly changed her name.

In case you were unaware, I'm currently in pursuit of an unavailable girl, and it's not even Regina Spektor! She's sweet, she's funny, beautiful (I'll admit it), and she likes to hang out with me. Now of course that may be just because I seem like a non-threat, but my huge ego would like to believe it's because there's a connection that could turn into something more substantial.

Then there's the guy she's dating. It's a little worrying that she started dating him to begin with. He's 27 or so, lives at home, doesn't have a car (neither do I, but out of choice, not because I totaled it), and he just had a child with an ex in February--a child he has yet to meet. None of these things can tell the whole story, of course. However, after meeting him, I'm at a loss for what's causing the attraction. He's not attractive, and apparently he's even told her that he's glad he has her, as now he doesn't have to try to be attractive anymore. A true romantic. Not only that, but he was completely cold to me the one time we met, even though I went out of my way to be nice.

I know this girl through a coworker. They're best friends, and my coworker has ColLAIRE come in and join us for dinner usually at least a couple of times a week. It used to be that we had her bring food in for us--that was the excuse--but now we just have her come in to hang out with us. Anyway, my coworker is dating this guy, let's call him WoWboy, and it's his best friend that ColLAIRE is dating, so it's two best friends dating two best friends. Insurmountable? Maybe. I mostly hear complaints about the guy. My coworker says that he's always hanging out at her apartment (which she shares with her boyfriend), and he helps himself to her food, never offering to reimburse or replace. Not only does she buy extra groceries just because she knows he's going to eat it, but he leaves messes around the apartment, too. This is my competition?

I guess that's the worst thing. He gets to date the coolest girl in the world, and he doesn't even have to put forth any effort. How do I compete with that?

I've simply been trying to enjoy my time with her and see if anything develops, despite the circumstances. Besides her coming in for dinner, we've gone to comedy night twice, they've come over for a movie twice, and we went for a walk once. The only time her boyfriend was along was for pho.

I'm scared that I'm getting further and further into the "friend zone," but I'm still torn between what to do. On one hand, it would be nice to put up a fight for once. On the other hand, this is a decision she's made, and I feel like I should respect it. If she likes me enough, she should break it off with him on her own. But then, saying nothing is just going to lead to regret. This is the spin cycle I'm in right now. I suppose the only way I'll respect myself is to talk to her about it and see what happens. I'm taking my time weighing how important self-respect is.

I really like her!

Now that you're up to speed on the basics, I'll tell you about her birthday, which was the 28th. She likes to read, so I looked through my collection of books trying to find something she might also like. It became painfully apparent that all of my favorite reading is geared towards adolescent males. She has said she reads anything that's around, and when she came over for a movie the first time, she pointed out Ender's Game, saying she liked it, and Ranma 1/2, saying nothing about it, but I get the sense she at least had an interest in it. I decided to give her a copy of I Was a Teen-Age Dwarf by Max Shulman, which is a book based around the character, Dobie Gillis. It's a light, fun read, and I figured its goofiness might fit her well. Also, giving her something I already owned wouldn't be too awkward of a gift (I actually bought her the copy I gave her, as I wanted one in a little better condition, but don't tell her that).

I needed a way to wrap the gift, so I took advantage of the Shout Box here, and Sean came to my rescue, suggesting aluminum foil. I almost always enjoy what I find in aluminum foil, so I had to take his suggestion and run with it. However, it was still obviously a book, so I decided to put it in a Ziploc bag covered with duct tape. Scary? Maybe. I didn't have any duct tape, so I had to borrow something from my dad. Thankfully, he had aluminum foil tape, which went along well with the aluminum foil, and I thought it looked better than duct tape would have, too. At first I was going to pretend that NASA had planned on launching it into deep space to let an alien culture enjoy our literature, but the mission was scrapped, and I was able to buy it at their annual yard sale. After getting to work with it and seeing the refrigerator, though, I decided to throw it in the freezer. I thought it would be funny to give it to her nice and cold and explain that it had been sent hurtling forward through time, Back to the Future style, and that's why it was iced over. I didn't have the opportunity to give it to her myself, but my coworker took it home and put it in her own freezer, and she gave it to Collaire the next morning.

Apparently she thought it was funny, and was fascinated with the Ziploc bag. My coworker said she went so far as to say I'm awesome. I'm looking forward to seeing her again, as I don't know if she knew what was up with the pressed "flower" that I put in the card.

Back on Valentine's Day, when she came in to join us for dinner, she made me a flower out of a paper napkin, which turned out really horribly. She said she wouldn't be offended if I threw it out. Naturally, I held onto it. I figured it would be funny to give back to her at some point, and this was the perfect opportunity. I simply said in the card that someone gave me this beautiful flower (aka abused napkin) once, and I thought it was appropriate to pass it on to her.

I don't know what's going to happen with all of this, but it's nice to know I can still like someone so much. If it was up to me, I'd see her every day. Here's hoping she's not already just thinking of me as a brother.

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0808:29 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0810:54 AM

Charles,

It is inexplicable why women choose guys such as the loser Claire has chosen. If your feelings about her are as strong as I've interpreted them, you owe it to yourself to not give up on her.

The dreaded "friend" status is a death knell--stay away from this at all costs. As much as you want to tell Claire your true feelings for her, causing her to choose between you and her current boyfriend, let's first work on uping your stock. To put it simply, make her want to choose you.

I have no idea how your personal interactions with her go, but if I've read your description right, you're slipping into that safe "friend" zone where you like each other well enough, but there is no tension (at least on her part). You need to work on creating some sparks between the two of you to let her know that you are desireable.

It's a bit of a project, but you can do it. You don't want to spill your feelings for her only to be rejected because she is suddenly overwhelmed. Work on building up the right kind of relationship (more romance, less friend) and then break the news to her and put yourself in a better position.

And, Charles, I'm not saying you have to do this stuff, and by no means am I a relationship guru, but I've been sucked into that friend trap before. There is nothing worse than being friends with a girl you really like only to have her confide in you all her relationship details with another guy. Especially when you want to be that guy.

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0811:41 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0811:43 AM

Charles,

If my wife read this she would probably get all teary eyed.

One thing I've learned in the 50 odd years I've been around (and yes we do know more with age) is that you need to live your life with as few regrets as possible, especially when it comes to affairs of the heart.

I'll agree with Sean that you don't want to overwhelm her, but it seems to me that she has to have more than a minor interest if she's spending that much time with you. I say strike while the iron is hot and before she develops to much of a relationship with the other guy. Just my 2 cents.

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0802:21 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0802:30 PM

Originally Posted By: HomeDad

I'll agree with Sean that you don't want to overwhelm her, but it seems to me that she has to have more than a minor interest if she's spending that much time with you. I say strike while the iron is hot and before she develops to much of a relationship with the other guy. Just my 2 cents.

I make a third vote.

myrison, moving subs around is only physical not the mental and emotional stress that goes along with the dating game, I'll take the subs anyday, although these 150+lbs boxes are starting to push the limits.

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0804:35 PM

Tell her how you feel! Ask her out on a real "date"! But I agree with the others, don't drop bombs on her too fast. Sounds like you've been doing fine so far. Hopefully she will get a clue and know of the attraction that you have for her. Then, if she has good judgment, she'll dump loser guy.

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0809:02 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0810:15 PM

Charles,

I know this will sound a little "high schoolish", but why not ask her to a dance? Nothing turns on a person more than dancing, as you can get intimate with each other without feeling awkward. Just be clear it's only going to be the two of you.

Although, I could be completely off base on this, as I met my wife back in high school. "Rusty" doesn't even begin to cover it........

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0810:29 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 04/30/0811:46 PM

Thanks for the feedback, guys. It's nice to talk about it a little before vaulting myself over the point of no return.

She came in to dinner break again, and she brought Baskin-Robbins ice cream for us, since they had their 31 cent scoop special tonight. I was going to get some more after work, but the line was outside the Baskin-Robbins quite a ways.

But yeah, every time I see her it reminds me I wasn't being sarcastic... I really do like her. She thanked me directly for the birthday present. She said it was very unique, and the smile on her face seemed genuine enough that I didn't accuse her of hating the gift. I don't know how someone can glow like she does. She must be absorbing the energy from my brain.

Anyway, I think she's going to go for me when I tell her I like her. I just have that feeling. I'll have to start advertising the power of aluminum foil at that point.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0803:34 AM

When I found out I was really bad at the whole rigamorol of how to effectively feint, and bob, and duck, and weave through the beginnings of a relationship - the courting ritual - I countered with the absolute most backward tactic... complete honesty.

Sonuvabee... if that hasn't worked for me ever since.

Then again, I'm as charismatic as David Hasselhoff and cute as a baby lamb, your mileage may vary.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0803:39 AM

I'm thinking complete honesty is the way I'll have to go, torpedoes be damned. It's a straight line to what I want to find out, and then I can stop taking up message board space with my near-love life.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0803:46 AM

Let me just specify that complete honesty is "you know... I'm really liking spending time with you, I'd like a chance to do it more", not "I collect your hair that falls out and tape it to my pillow and spoon it all night"...

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0802:07 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0802:14 PM

Seriously CV, just make sure you don't go too fast or come on too strong. You don't want to potentially ruin two couples that are best friends, as well as what at least for now is a good friendship with her. The best of all possibilities would be for her to choose you, albeit with a little nudging from you.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0802:14 PM

You know, I was trying to avoid using her name so it would be just SLIGHTLY harder to do a simple Google search and find this thread. Ha ha. Oh, well. I'm sure she won't be searching for me online, anyway, since she already has the flesh-and-blood version.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0802:17 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0802:18 PM

Originally Posted By: Spoiler

Seriously CV, just make sure you don't go too fast or come on too strong. You don't want to potentially ruin two couples that are best friends, as well as what at least for now is a good friendship with her. The best of all possibilities would be for her to choose you, albeit with a little nudging from you.

Oh, it'll be fine. I won't come on too strong, but I don't want to leave any doubt about my interest, either. It'll work out, even if I don't get to date her. The world is full of fish I'll never catch, but maybe that's for the better. I should just enjoy it as an aquarium, as in look, but don't touch. Just kidding. Now where's my net?

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0802:21 PM

Hmm, the thought of her reading these things is interesting. She would see you have a charitable spirit with your gifts of CDs/DVDs/Blu-rays/games etc, and she would see you in your element with your homies, i.e. as a funny, personable guy.

I'm not sure what her reaction would be!

Hopefully a nice and understanding one, although my wife thinks I'm a dork for all this board activity. Must be a guy thing. Other than Amie and Sonicfox, there's zip for estrogen here (unless you count my man-boobs).

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/01/0802:42 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/02/0812:19 AM

Hey, her boyfriend is actually good for something! I was hating him in my mind today, and I came up with "out of shape with puked features," so I used it as the start of my new story:

Originally Posted By: Man-boobs The Butt-Frencher

Out of shape with puked features, Dryton Bonewright had no chance whatsoever with Fessa Conjay, the beauty of the neighborhood. Luckily for Dryton, she wasn't the kind of girl to take a chance. Their first date took place in his imagination, but their second date actually happened, and he had to keep slapping and pinching himself to make sure he wasn't dreaming. He wasn't, much to the chagrin of his body.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/03/0803:00 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/07/0812:50 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/07/0812:55 PM

Ha, women do like a good soap opera, huh?!

Men too! Count me in.

CV shouted a few days ago that Collaire's boyfriend, sadly, appeared to be stepping up his game, tuning in a little more. CV was undaunted and enjoying ongoing, frequent, and casual contacts with Collaire anyway.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/07/0801:04 PM

Oh man - I'll have to go check the 'roll' for the shoutbox update. I knew I should have it summarized and emailed to me!

I've been trying not to interfere, but Ian won me away from a rival with a big gesture and I can't help but think that's the route to go. The other guy seems like a nester, we need to take action before he nests with our Collaire! "Faint heart never won fair lady", after all!

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/07/0801:15 PM

LOL! No, but it did involve making my own custom model loudspeakers completed with personalized silk-screened labels. That's pretty manly, to put it all on the line with your silk-screener and your woodcutter and your speaker finisher. <opinion> Don't you think CV could employ this same tactic with an illustrated novel? </opinion>

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/07/0802:05 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/07/0802:10 PM

Maybe it should be a children's book. That sounds less daunting than an illustrated novel.

Yeah, nothing new to report at the moment. I probably won't see her again until next week. She and my coworker are heading out of town tomorrow, and I'm not sure she'll be in for dinner tonight. I would of course inform you all if something major went down.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/08/0803:39 AM

So I went to see Iron Man with my coworker and her boyfriend tonight, and Collaire and her boyfriend ended up coming, too. Collaire (I'm going to get tired of using that dumb name--ha ha) said hi right away and said she finished reading the book I gave her for her birthday. I know it's a light, quick read, but I honestly didn't know if she'd read it at all. I asked her if she liked it. "I was entertained," she said. She was smiling pretty big, but she always does that, so it's hard to take it seriously. Still, I'll take acting over no reaction, and who's to say it wasn't genuine?

I liked the movie well enough. I definitely want a suit, as does my coworker. She was mentioning it on the way home, and I told her that she would need two of the arc reactors, one for each breast. She agreed.

All of the stuff they play before the previews even start was getting on my coworker's boyfriend's nerves. "I'm going to go to the bathroom and kill myself," he said. "Don't forget to flush," I reminded him. I know, I'm hilarious. I guess it's not just him who kills himself.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/12/0810:50 AM

Friday night I watched a movie with my wife whose name (the movies name, smart-guy!!) I have already blocked out of my mind in self defense of my manhood, but hey, she was a sport and saw Iron Man with me so it was only fair.

Actually, it wasn't all that bad. It had some sharp humor in between the depressing, then uplifting, then back to depressing roller coaster of a plot that women seem to enjoy so much. Including one line that I think that applies nicely to your predicament.

The main female character answers the question to one of life's oldest and great mysteries when questioned on "What do women want from men?"

I can't remember her exact words but the gist of it was, "Truthfully, the secret is.....we don't know!"

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/13/0802:34 AM

I think in my case they want friendship. Buckets and buckets of friendship. Ha ha.

Today she said she genuinely liked the book I gave her, that she managed to read it even though she was busy with other stuff, and that it was funny. So I'm glad. Claire and Tiana (my coworker, and yes, I'm using real names now) were talking about going to see The Chronicles of Narnia: Prince Caspian. Claire turned to me and said, "Do you want to go?" Cool, right? No, she was just inviting me to go along with the group, which includes her boyfriend.

Not that I'm giving up. I still need to speak up for myself and see where that takes me.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/13/0809:16 AM

While at the movie, lean over to the boyfriend and say, "I need to go to the bathroom. Let's go." After he gets to the bathroom with you (don't worry, he'll accompany you. All guys like group bathroom trips) tell him you dropped your wallet in the toilet. When he leans in for a closer look, push him in, and give the toilet a good couple of flushes. Bye bye boyfriend.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/13/0810:52 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/13/0811:58 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/20/0812:27 AM

DEAD THREAD.

Not really, but I couldn't seem to find the nerve to impose on an existing relationship, and after I found myself resenting her slightly for sticking with a goober, I decided to let it go.

I still enjoy her company, but I think I've effectively wrestled my heart into submission. Tiana complained to me once again about how much Claire's boyfriend sucks, and I didn't really feel much at all. I just agreed that his behavior was BS (he was mad at Claire for making them slightly late to Prince Caspian--I don't see how he has any right to have an attitude when she's the one driving him around everywhere... and seriously, mad over Prince Caspian?), and that was it.

If the relationship unravels, maybe my feelings will kick back in, but for now I think I'm fine just being her friend.

I'm excited about the Zzang candy bars that zhimbo recommended in the candy bar thread. I ordered 10 of them so I could share the experience with friends. They should get here Wednesday, so I'll take them in to work on Thursday, and in addition to some of my coworkers, Claire's coming in to try one. Don't worry. I'll make her eat the whole thing in front of me so I know that none of it goes to her boyfriend. Ha ha.

The soap opera is losing its suds. Is that the fat lady singing in the shower?

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/20/0807:00 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/20/0807:39 PM

Quote:

Not really, but I couldn't seem to find the nerve to impose on an existing relationship,

Thats really a shame given how you really feel. In the end, if you go for it and she turns you down, you are no further behind than you are right now. If she feels anything for you, and she does, she will, at least be tempted, and there is the very real possibility that she will take a chance on you.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/20/0807:57 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/20/0811:51 PM

I appreciate the feedback. I still don't know exactly where I'm going to land. I seem to change my mind from one day to the next, and it seems like it depend on whether it's a day I've seen her or not. It's a lot easier to decide to let her go when she's not right there in front of me turning my heart to hearty soup.

It still feels like Tiana is trying to feel me out regarding Claire, and I'm still giving nothing back. I have this feeling that I actually would have a chance if I'd give enough of a signal that I'm interested in Claire beyond friendship. But if that's what it takes, I'm not sure I'm game. I always come back to, "Well, if she likes me enough, she'll make herself available." I'm afraid of trying to force something to happen, as that kind of relationship might want to unravel quicker.

Of course, all of this is academic for me, as I've never been in a real romantic relationship, and at the rate I'm going, I may end up marrying my pride.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0807:21 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0808:44 AM

I remember that the first girl I was brave enough to ask out when I got to high school laughed in my face. A few years later in college after building up quiet a bit playing rugby and martial arts, I met her again in a club. She didn't remember me and asked me to dance.

I know revenge is wrong but the look on her face when I told her why I would NEVER dance with her was golden!!!

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0810:23 AM

Man, back in junior high a girl asked me if I wanted to go out. I laughed at her and said no. I wasn't trying to be mean. At that point in my life, I simply didn't have idea how to react, as I hadn't even considered dating anyone.

She kind of blew up at me in a class in high school. I didn't realize it was the same girl until I was thinking about it later. But yeah, I was acting like a dork with a friend in that class. I don't remember the details, but I was pretending like I thought I was cool, which I knew I wasn't, but she took my attitude seriously and really jumped down my throat. Once again I didn't know how to react. I said something about how I was all too aware of how uncool I was, and I nearly broke into tears. She felt bad at that point. We even ended up hugging at graduation, which was nice, since she had turned into a very attractive girl.

Ooh, my Zzang candy bars are Out For Delivery. I'm glad they're on time so I can take them in to work tomorrow. Yum (I'm pretty sure)!

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0802:50 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0803:07 PM

Originally Posted By: St_PatGuy

Plus, my tops are very low-cut.

Funny thing is, so were hers. Of of my patients complained (not a male patient, of course).

She didn't really use Liquid Paper on the monitor (a classic blonde joke), but she was 19 and not the sharpest tool in the shed, shall we say. She quit to take a job in the federal government. Insert joke here.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0804:02 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0804:11 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0804:23 PM

I'm seriously thinking about getting a MacBook (or MBP) for my next computer purchase. Having had PCs/Windows only since 1995, the last time I used Macs was in college circa 1986-1990. How much has changed in the last 20 years?

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0810:29 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0810:33 PM

Originally Posted By: St_PatGuy

That may be, Chess, but we are professional nutters.

Not anyone can do this.

Well yes i guess that is quite true. medic8r is certainly a professional in nutters.So does that lifetime of exposure create a conditioning effect in which in the sane becomes the insane?I'm witnessing some strong evidence here.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0810:33 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/21/0810:35 PM

Originally Posted By: chesseroo

Originally Posted By: St_PatGuy

That may be, Chess, but we are professional nutters.

Not anyone can do this.

Well yes i guess that is quite true. medic8r is certainly a professional in nutters.So does that lifetime of exposure create a conditioning effect in which in the sane becomes the insane?I'm witnessing some strong evidence here.

I think JP managed to escape from someplace and only poses as a doctor to throw people off.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0802:00 AM

Originally Posted By: fredk

Now which would be less painful?

You know, I'm really not sure. I seem to be running into a lot of internal resistance. Once again, I got to go to comedy night with her, alone with her on the way there and on the way back, and... nothing. She even wanted me to get up and dance after the comedians did their routines, but I chose to be a sitting statue. I mean, I've never danced in public before, so it's going to be a big step for me to start, but really, what does it take to dance in a club?

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0803:57 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0808:24 AM

Sounds to me like your already dating, just neither of you have actually said the word out loud.

And my God man, you just missed the best opening ever. No, you don't have to learn to dance like a pro, all you had to do was wait for a slow song and then tell her you that you are not comfortable dancing but could probably pull off a slow dance.

You even have the added advantage of being sincere instead of it being a 'line'.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0810:13 AM

Charles, I'm horrible at dancing, but I've found that no matter how bad your moves are, if you time them to the beat of the music you'll be fine. Believe me. Back in my college days I shared a balcony with the girls from next door. They always had friends over on the weekend and they inevitably wanted to go clubbing and dragged me along with them.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0812:33 PM

I like to dance around in the privacy of my own home, of course, but the music I play at home is a far cry from the music they play out in the wild. I also have dancing I do at work, and lately I've been doing a "pants dance," which Tiana told Claire about, so Claire was hoping I'd bust that out. Losing the little bit of weight from DDR makes the pants just loose enough to make it fun to adjust them while moving around. I do it to freak my coworkers out, especially Mike, since he has been "trying" to lose weight for a long time now. But yeah, both Tiana and Claire were hoping I'd unleash it on the public, but I wasn't quite there.

Yeah, yeah, I'll get new pants, but at this point I'll have to shop in the juniors section. I especially need new work pants, but I was already wearing the smallest size (in both length and waist) of the kind that I like. What a pain! I'm not even that small of a guy. 5' 8", 150 lb. I feel fairly average.

I think I'm going to have to tell Tiana and get her input. I'm pretty sure she'd be on my side.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0812:41 PM

Yaaaa soooooo. As I said, start with slow dances and avoid talking about your pants for 2, 3 minutes at a time maybe......LOL Kidding!

and while I'm being inexcusably mean.....St.Pat's Guy! How dare you start a story with "Back in my college days I shared a balcony with the girls from next door." and end it with nothing but 'got drug to a club'!!!

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0812:45 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0812:48 PM

Originally Posted By: Murph

and while I'm being inexcusably mean.....St.Pat's Guy! How dare you start a story with "Back in my college days I shared a balcony with the girls from next door." and end it with nothing but 'got drug to a club'!!!

Would you believe we managed to snag the same apartment for two consecutive years? Ah, those were the days. . .

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0802:21 PM

You may already know that I whiled away my university summers working at a summer resort. Ahhh, young love. In my vast experience (every Wednesday night was dance night) boys don't actually even have to dance to really impress the girls. They just need to stand on the dance floor, swaying slightly (on beat if possible but not crucial) and make lots of eye contact. I'd say in 98% of the cases girls were so impressed by this act of courage that they would dance around said boy, making it seem as though he were dancing, and then he'd be made in the shade. With your DDR training I'd say you're already light years ahead of the rest. Start small and you'll see how easy it is!

BTW - strategic alliance with Tiana is a brilliant idea. As is chocolate.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0803:50 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0804:19 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0804:20 PM

Originally Posted By: Amie

boys don't actually even have to dance to really impress the girls

Let me just tighten that up. "Boys" should not attempt to dance unless they can. The "white boy hip sway" should be the extent of it... anything more and you're in over your head and look like the drunk uncle (druncle) at the wedding.

But that's just me... I prefer to be the guy standing at the table in the leather jacket resting my beer on my belt buckle and remaining an enigma who can be wrestled into a slow dance with the right amount of fluttering eyelashes. I get to keep my cred that way.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0804:22 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/23/0804:22 PM

Just to add my 2 cents...boyfriends like the one described on the very first post (I am just joining the party) are merely a speed bump. My wife, when I first met her, also had a boyfriend what was a "speed bump" in my mind. I treated him as such, paid no attention to him, and basically stole my wife's heart away.

We are now happily married, and I am really glad I had the balls to do what was needed to get her by my side.

The moral of the story is: Boyfriends are speed bumps. Girls like ColLAIRE are begging for a real man to step up and act like a future husband should act like. You think she likes her relationship? She is just there because he is expressing lots of interest, no other reason. If you start asking her out on dates, getting to know her better, that boyfriend will be a thing of the past, and soon you'll be the boyfriend. If you treat her right, you won't be a speed bump for another guy either

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/24/0807:23 AM

Charles, if I were a betting man I would have to bet that everyone involved, including the girls and the bf, know how you feel about Claire. The present you gave her was the dead giveaway. K is right, you gotta make a choice and live with it.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/25/0809:54 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/25/0811:22 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/26/0808:40 AM

Back to flowers.Back in the day, We convinced a shy buddy of ours to by a rose from the 'Rose Girl' who sold them at local night clubs and walk up to this girls he had been obsessed with all night and tell her that she deserves a rose.

Well he did, but when she asked "why?", he lost it and retreated when he couldn't figure out what to say.

Moral of the story, she thought his flustered retreat was so sweet, she hunted him down and they have been a happy couple ever since.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/27/0808:21 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/27/0811:42 PM

I'm pretty sure my chance has already come and gone. I appreciate all of the feedback, and I'm sorry it didn't go anywhere. It's just that it seems fairly straightforward. If she liked me a fraction as much as I like her, she would have made herself more available. Since she's coming in way less and spending more time with her boyfriend, it seems she's made her choice.

On the plus side, now I don't have to learn how to be in a relationship.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/28/0808:42 AM

or she just got tired of waiting for you to make a move. But you knew somebody was going to say that, right.

I normally swear never to give advice on such matters. Damn internet, makes it too easy to shout your opinions to the world. I'll stop now but I'll finish with, "If you don't ask her out now, you will never know for sure and that will be way worse for wayyy longer, as opposed to the quickly passing feeling of rejection."

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/29/0808:29 AM

You know, that's a very good point, Murph. I hadn't put two and two together like that, but I guess Bren is more complicated than I thought. Hmmm, "Dear Diary, today I rethought my analysis of Bren ..."

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/29/0806:16 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/29/0806:35 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/30/0812:19 AM

Originally Posted By: fredk

OK, I just can't seem to let this one go.

Be at ease.

You're right that telling her how I feel would leave me with the fewest regrets. I'd know exactly where I stood, and I would be proud of myself for speaking up. Where I'm having trouble is that IF she likes me, continuing to date someone she's not as interested in doesn't speak a lot for her character, though I think it's more likely that she sees me as just a friend. In the end, I think I'm too proud to beg for reciprocation. I'd rather it happened more naturally.

It will hurt for a while, but probably mostly in the ego, considering who's being preferred over me. But it's fine. Life has its disappointments, and then it has its real tragedies. Thankfully, so far I've only been disappointed.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/30/0809:02 AM

CV, I like your last post a lot. It shows that you're happy and level-headed. Your certificate of sanity is in the mail.

After some reflection, I have realized how easy it is for those of us thousands of miles away to throw all kinds of advice at you, whereas you are the one, of course, that will have the actual dealings with her and make your own reality. Or have your reality made for you by others, hmmm ...

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/30/0812:15 PM

Once again, I'd like to thank everyone for listening and being very encouraging. It's nice to know that people have my back. You're all a positive influence on me. There are a lot of people around here with good heads, and it makes me want to be a better person.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/30/0802:44 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/30/0802:45 PM

OK Charles, I can’t stand it anymore and have to say something…. Have you ever watched a monkey swinging around in a tree? If not, do so. A monkey will not let go of one branch before it commits to the next branch. It has to have a firm grasp on that next branch before it lets go of the first branch. Think of women and relationships with this in mind and you’ll start to understand what’s going on with this girl you’re infatuated with. She’s made it pretty clear that she’s not all that interested in the branch she’s clinging to now, but she needs the comfort of finding that next branch before she can let go of the one she’s holding onto. She’s trying to grab it (you), but you won’t let her.

Suck it up and figure out how to let her know you are interested in her. I’d work with her girlfriend if I were you. Your last post is nothing more than you trying to find comfort in the bad decision you’ve made that will force her to look for someone else to help her get away from the twit she’s with now.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/30/0805:10 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/30/0811:48 PM

Originally Posted By: mdrew

OK Charles, I can’t stand it anymore and have to say something…. Have you ever watched a monkey swinging around in a tree? If not, do so. A monkey will not let go of one branch before it commits to the next branch. It has to have a firm grasp on that next branch before it lets go of the first branch. Think of women and relationships with this in mind and you’ll start to understand what’s going on with this girl you’re infatuated with. She’s made it pretty clear that she’s not all that interested in the branch she’s clinging to now, but she needs the comfort of finding that next branch before she can let go of the one she’s holding onto. She’s trying to grab it (you), but you won’t let her.

I know this isn't where you got it, but I always associate that monkey/branch comparison with M:I-2.

Yes, a lot of my decision is cowardice with spin. However, I really don't know how I'd feel about dating a swinger who's just looking for the next handhold. I kind of hate to think about her being freshly off fartknocker's branch.

Don't worry. Now I'm just joking. You called me on the fact that I'm justifying my lack of action, but debating is fun.

I mean, you're right, the only way to feel good about myself is to just do it. I don't have feelings of this depth often enough that I can just flush it away and be okay.

As it happens, I'll be hanging out with Tiana and the tree dweller tomorrow. I doubt I'll have a good opportunity for spilling any beans, but I'll make an effort to leave a decent impression on her, and I'll talk to Tiana on Monday. Between you and fredk, I may yet be browbeaten into a surge of spinal growth.

Re: The Collaire Report - 05/31/0812:08 AM

You know, I think the point here is that you felt deeply enough for her to start a thread in hopes of making a connection.

For the love of (your deity here), I've had SO many missed opportunities in my life... I would give up alot to go back and make my feelings known to the few women in my life I should have had the *alls to speak up to. (Yes, I'm divorced for quite a few years)... DO IT. As others have said, regrets last much longer than simply diving in and at least KNOWING.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/06/0812:53 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/06/0812:59 PM

From the Shout Box on July 6, 2008:

[CV] Oh, I took the smallest step forward possible. I sent Tiana a message about the Claire situation. I actually sent it on Wednesday, but she didn't log into MySpace until last night, right after I went out to a movie with all of them

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/06/0801:08 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/06/0801:09 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/07/0811:51 AM

CV, I just the read the first page and the last couple, so forgive me if I missed something crucial. I won my wife from a sort of similar situation. Two rules. Be honest about how you feel to her even though it will seem counterproductive sometimes. Don't fear the friend zone. In fact, make sure that you are her best friend. It takes time...painful time, but you are giving her a very real and solid alternative to the status quo and success is inevitable. At least it was for me. She knew I wanted to marry her and eventually she said yes. No dating ever. We just skipped straight to the good part. I have been the happiest guy in the world for 14 years now.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/07/0801:03 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/07/0801:04 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/22/0812:16 AM

So Tiana asked me today if I wanted to talk about the message I sent her about Claire. It was right at the end of my shift, so we didn't talk long. I said I didn't really know what I could do at this point, and she said "not really anything." She admitted that doing nothing also didn't seem like the way to go. She actually seemed pretty cool with me liking Claire. I guess I'll talk to her more on Wednesday. "So I guess you don't want me to tell Claire about your message, do you?" I said no, since I want to talk to her a little more. "I imagine she must at least have a hint of me liking her," I said. "I don't know. She can be pretty oblivious. Anyway, it's not that obvious. I didn't know you liked her until someone else said something." So I guess I somehow had them fooled.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/22/0804:08 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/22/0806:38 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/28/0811:49 PM

All right, so here's the deal.

After thinking about it a bit, I decided to let Tiana go ahead and tell Claire about the message I had sent her, because let's face it, I would have dragged my feet into eternity, and I was tired of having this constant pressure inside me. I also figured that using Tiana as a buffer would take away the awkwardness. Claire wouldn't have to respond, and I wouldn't freeze in the middle of spilling the beans. At least she would know for sure, and I wouldn't have to keep carrying this weight around.

Tiana waited until no one was around, said to me, "Yeah, it was out of left field."

"What was?" I asked.

"Claire had no idea you liked her."

So she was taken aback a little, and apparently she said that it didn't change anything. Which is fine. On to the next humiliation. I just need to learn to make my humiliations shorter.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/29/0812:48 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/29/0812:53 AM

I have yet to see the new movie. I should soon because one of my coworkers saw it over the weekend and didn't stop talking about it all day at work. This is the same guy who constantly forgets I haven't watched any episodes from the 4th season of "The Office" but will talk to me about them every other day. . . (sigh)

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/29/0801:37 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/29/0801:39 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/29/0801:57 AM

I think you did the right thing Charles. I doubt if it will end the saga, now you've planted the seed and perhaps it will grow. And if it doesn't at least you won't spend the rest of your days wondering if.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/29/0808:27 AM

Charles, no matter the outcome, you should feel proud of yourself for taking the chance. That's what will instill more self-confidence the next time, and women find confidence attractive....as long as you don't get so confident you become arrogant!

But, in the interim, it may not be over. It's just possible that Claire "never saw you in that way before", but might start now....

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/29/0810:26 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/29/0812:03 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/29/0812:26 PM

By the way, thanks for the comments, guys, but let's give it up for the real star of the show: Tiana. For being such a good friend, I'm volunteering along with her for Habitat for Humanity this coming Saturday.

Re: The Collaire Report - 01/06/0903:56 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 01/06/0907:49 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 06/09/0901:39 AM

I just had to mention that the girl at work who's too young for me and is in love with her boyfriend is way too cute. Not only that, but she has insane reaction times. As soon as she turns into the same hallway, she starts waving at me. She can be way down at the other end of the hall, and right as I happen to see her, she's already raising her hand to wave. She thinks I should go to the employee picnic on Saturday, but I always feel uncomfortable even when I'm going with people I'm close to. We'll see.

Re: The Collaire Report - 06/09/0911:21 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 06/09/0911:38 PM

Originally Posted By: LT61

Too bad your Medusa's head tote-bag isn't ready........I'm sure that would be quite an "icebreaker".

Hey, the first one could possibly be here this week. It was supposedly shipped yesterday. I'm crossing my fingers that it will arrive, not because of the picnic, but just because I want to show it off to my coworkers.

Re: The Collaire Report - 06/10/0912:09 AM

If she stares at you blankly, just say, "Don't worry, I brought the whipped cream!"

Anyways, the key is to play it like you don't care, because you shouldn't. Because if you don't care, then when the girl tells you that she "just wants to be friends" you can actually process that and move on rather than returning to her like a dog to its own...

The AAR occurs within a cycle of establishing the leader's intent, planning, preparation, action and review. An AAR is distinct from a de-brief in that it begins with a clear comparison of intended vs. actual results achieved. An AAR is distinct from a post-mortem in its tight focus on participant's own action - learning from the review is taken forward by the participants

Seriously it wouldn’t hurt to review what happened and how you might do things differently...before, as someone said above, you do a 360.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/05/0901:29 AM

Yeah, I think I'm going to have to go for a totally different approach, but it may take a while to get there mentally.

No better time like now to start preparing so I’ll toss out (reiterate what others have already said) some ideas.

Women (people in general) are drawn to confidence. As you’ve seen they often confuse cockiness/arrogance with confidence but will usually take that over timid-ness any day…especially a branch in the hand (the monkey analogy). So as we said in the Corps “Exude Supreme Confidence” (also intimidates the crap out of the enemy).

How does that apply to your situation? Don’t wait to ask a girl you like out. Do it soon after you meet her as is prudent and do it yourself not indirectly. Waiting shows indecisiveness and lack of confidence and the longer you wait and get to know her as “friends” the more awkward your asking may be. Besides, with rare exception women know if you have the “right stuff” as soon as they meet you so the longer you wait the less your chances.

Stuff it if she has a boyfriend, ask anyway…what could be more confident. Plus now she knows your interested. Also, if the girl is that great you’re not likely to be the only one pining after her, but you may have been the only one with the guts to approach her. The boyfriend can also be your advantage if you’re worried about getting turned down because it gives both you and her a face saving way to back down while still getting your message across.

Originally Posted By: CV

I need JP to put me under hypnosis.

Do what it takes to boost your self image. Working out is great.

Erase that one hobby in your profile and stop doing it. Self deprecation can be charming if you’re exuding underlying confidence otherwise it shows weakness.

Nothing breeds confidence like success. Set small goals and then exceed them. Again, exercise is great for this.

Do a self assessment of what you like to do and are good at. See if there is a way to mix those things with meeting people. You’re more likely to feel confident when doing things your comfortable with.

If you’re not good at it start getting out with groups and mingling/talking. The “gift of gab” will get you more dates than the best looks in the world. I’ve had two friends, one looked like the “Crypt Keeper” the other like “Alfred E. Neuman” but both had the gift of gab and had girls falling all over them. Get better at conversing by doing more of it.

Quote:

Too bad he only prescribes medications!

Self medicate. Short intense workouts build testosterone which in turn acts like an aphrodisiac by boosting confidence and aggressiveness/assertiveness. Meditation is also a powerful tool for some people to fine tune their minds. I meditate daily usually many times especially while running.

Short of an epiphany you aren’t going to fundamentally change who you are Charles, but by building on your strengths while improving and or mitigating your weaknesses you can surely improve your batting average. I mostly rehashed what others already said but thought I’d restate some highlights and how you might use them to change direction 350 degrees this time.

Once your swing improves you can start looking at how to get more at bats.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/05/0902:04 AM

Those are all great ideas. I'm not so sure about swinging bats at women, but I see what you're saying. At this point, though, I don't really feel like working on myself on the off-chance someone else might appreciate it. It seems a little ridiculous to want to win over a woman who is dazzled by the confidence of morons. If that's what they respond to, then there are plenty of dudes out there to accommodate them. Maybe this will result in an eternally isolated existence. That's fine. I'd like to emphasize that I do appreciate your thoughtful suggestions. I have no doubt they'd lead to companionship and a happier me. I simply don't want to pretend I'm going to follow them when I'm really not wanting to throw myself back into the game.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/05/0902:47 AM

You’re right that you shouldn’t work on yourself for others but rather for you, and if it’s not what you what right now I respect that. I’m purposely not looking to date right now because I like being single and unattached and plan to stay that way at least until I retire. There’s just not enough time in the day for me to work, do all the things I want to do, and have a relationship. Ah, but when I retire it’s back to university for me. My experience is that many young women do like older men (probability and upper limit to that but I’m willing to push the envelope). Should you choose to enter the fray again good luck and good hunting.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/14/0909:03 AM

Speaking of "confidence" verses "over-zealousness," every time I hear the word "fray" I can't help but think of this guy charging in to a battle only to 'accidentally' kill everyone on both sides. Upon seeing any skirmish, his battle cry was "A Fray!!!"One of many comic collections I wish I still had.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/15/0911:02 PM

Originally Posted By: Murph

Speaking of "confidence" verses "over-zealousness," every time I hear the word "fray" I can't help but think of this guy charging in to a battle only to 'accidentally' kill everyone on both sides. Upon seeing any skirmish, his battle cry was "A Fray!!!"One of many comic collections I wish I still had.

I liked Groo too!

Didn't Sergio Aragones do little drawings in the margins of Mad magazine?

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/17/0907:07 AM

Finally Bren, you bring back a memory from my early teens that doesn't involve ruining my occasional habit of listening to a classic metal bands by posting pictures of how ridiculous they actually looked. Thanks for the chuckle!

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/19/0904:48 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/09/1001:08 AM

I just thought you all should know I'm going for a walk in the park with an actual woman tomorrow evening after work. While I don't think anything will happen beyond friendship, she's been really fun to talk to, and it will be nice to try hanging out with someone different. I may meet another person I've been talking to online, too.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/09/1002:15 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/09/1002:16 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/09/1002:43 AM

Hey, thanks. My room definitely isn't as nice as some of the other ones, but at least the gear is pretty decent thanks to my very skewed priorities. I'm going to be moving my system into the basement when it's done, so I'm going to be putting my energy into making that room as good as possible.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/09/1010:10 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/09/1010:12 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/09/1011:20 AM

Wow I just found this thread. I read the first post and knew it was not going anywhere. I will recommend to you a book which has changed many lives. It is called the system and will help you understand yourself, as well as how to change your behavious so that it positively affects your dating life. I read it about 10 years ago and it turned my dating life 180 degrees. It's called "The System" and it works like a charm. The three big things it stresses as has been said before are "Confidence,Challenge,Control(Of yourself)"

I strongly recommend reading the book and following what it preaches. It really makes it easy to understand where you stand with a woman very quickly and helps you spot the wrong ones and the right ones. Good luck to you.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/09/1010:18 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/10/1001:32 AM

The walk along the river went well. She brought coffee, just like she said. She recognized me by my walk because I told her I walk fast. The sparks didn't set the river ablaze or anything, but she's fun to be around. She's certainly more outgoing and living life to the fullest. I think my limited sampling of life's experiences and reserved nature in person would bore her pretty quickly, but she didn't run away.

We had talked before about going to the Kings of Leon concert at the Gorge next weekend, and that might still happen. We'll see. If nothing else, it was nice to meet someone new. There's one other person I need to meet, and then I also need to talk more to a couple of women at work. Look at me go.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/10/1011:11 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/10/1011:51 AM

Nice to hear everything went well! Good luck on your next date. I remember one funny date I had, this girl wouldn't stop asking me questions, I thought I was in a interrogatory. LOL I think one thing you should never ask someone on a first date is, how much you make a year, what car do you have. LOL That's just what she asked me. No need to say the date ended right away.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/12/1007:48 AM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/12/1012:58 PM

Too late. I'm pretty sure the woman I met isn't interested in doing anything again. The other one I was going to meet, who I've been talking to for a while, is no longer wanting to meet anyone as of last night, after a guy she liked led her on, started avoiding her, then finally posted to his Facebook that he was in a relationship. Now I'm down to the stripper at work.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/12/1001:17 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/12/1001:41 PM

That "other girl" sounds like she would be really appreciative of a nice surprise gesture at the moment. She might be angry at the world but then again, it might also be the perfect time to stand out from the crowd by being the nice guy that you are. 'Worst case Ontario,' you don't have anything to lose.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/12/1002:13 PM

Originally Posted By: MarkSJohnson

Man, the benefits packages some people have at work are really something!

Ha ha. The stripper thing is just a rumor. I have no idea if there's any basis for it. I don't really care, either. She's always been nice to me. Two of my female coworkers seem to dislike her, though.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/12/1002:30 PM

Flowers would probably be the obvious choice. Something in a 'cheery, hope things get better for you' kind of bouquet as opposed to going for the romantic bunch just yet. The card should also strictly be about cheering her up. Show you care about her feelings as opposed to feeling her.... Oops, sorry I slipped for a moment there.

Shortly thereafter, the old spontaneous carefully timed "Hey, you looked like you needed a coffee." when you notice she is having a particularly bad day.

This opens the perfect opportunity to test the waters with, "I hope today is much better for you than yesterday. Here are some chocolates to help get it started..." Again, the small sampler sized boxes with a little card. A full box might be trying too hard still at this point.

If she stops smiling when she thanks you, then it's time to pull out, but again nothing to lose.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/12/1002:43 PM

Oh, I may not have explained well, but I only know her online. One of my coworkers has a son who went to school with her, but that's the only way I know she's real. I wouldn't have a way to enact these physical transactions.

But yeah, while I like talking to her a lot, I don't see real potential beyond friendship, so I'm not going to pressure her into an actual meeting. In the meantime, I'll do what I can to get her focused on better things.

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/12/1002:49 PM

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/12/1004:22 PM

I like strippers and have dated several. They have nothing to hide..... They also tend to prefer 'nice' guys as most of the men they deal with when working are A-holes. I'm not a jealous person though. If you are, don't even think about it....

Re: The Collaire Report - 07/13/1006:39 AM

The profession is not what it used to be. Exotic dancing seems to be becoming the profession of choice for upscale young students who are trying to get through University on their own. At least according to several panicking Dads I have talked to.