Following Andy's advice I'm checking Levinas out. Just reading this part about his philosophy makes me want to know more about his work:

Levinas derives the primacy of his ethics from the experience of the encounter with the Other. For Levinas, the irreducible relation, the epiphany, of the face-to-face, the encounter with another, is a privileged phenomenon in which the other person's proximity and distance are both strongly felt. "The Other precisely reveals himself in his alterity not in a shock negating the I, but as the primordial phenomenon of gentleness." At the same time, the revelation of the face makes a demand, this demand is before one can express, or know one's freedom, to affirm or deny. One instantly recognizes the transcendence and heteronomy of the Other. Even murder fails as an attempt to take hold of this otherness.

Leonard Cohen's "Who by fire"

And who by fire, who by water,who in the sunshine, who in the night time,who by high ordeal, who by common trial,who in your merry merry month of may,who by very slow decay,and who shall I say is calling?

And who in her lonely slip, who by barbiturate,who in these realms of love, who by something blunt,and who by avalanche, who by powder,who for his greed, who for his hunger,and who shall I say is calling?

And who by brave assent, who by accident,who in solitude, who in this mirror,who by his lady's command, who by his own hand,who in mortal chains, who in power,and who shall I say is calling?

I always thought this song was about the other, who you meet.

A youtuber called Elonyy says: In case you don't know, Leonard Cohen﻿ is Jewish. The lyrics' of this song are translated and were taken from the Yom-Kipur prayer. Yom-Kipur is the holiest day of the year for Jews- they fast and don't use electricity. Its said to be when god's decide who lives and who dies- and how. now read the lyrics' again

Maybe I wasn't so wrong. I think the song combines both things: in the song Cohen turns the usual or casual "encounter with another" into a "privileged phenomenon", like if God was calling.

I think I wouldn't lose sleep if I didn't have to deal with people but it is worth it. Sometimes people can be very agressive in our minds, like a threat. This especially happens when I picture them as alien to the things I know... then I claim a measurement to measure things. Later sometimes I recover sanity but never remember how.

I don't really know what doppelganger means. By other I meant other people, other person that I idendify as not being I... I think that's what Levinas meant too.

Nice example, the heart attack and cigarettes hehe (are you threating me already? )Let's speculate in the song

And who in her lonely slip, who by barbiturate,

this two are very related, I think

a slip is a mistake but it is also an accident (I'm not sure to know the connotations of this word in the context) while abusing barbiturate is usually intended, but why would someone abuse barbiture? one reason could be because he/she is lonely? At least we know this usually takes place when they're alone and loneliness makes people lonely slip and a slip I said is an accident.

asdf wrote:I don't really know what doppelganger means. By other I meant other people, other person that I idendify as not being I... I think that's what Levinas meant too.

Nice example, the heart attack and cigarettes hehe (are you threating me already? )Let's speculate in the song

And who in her lonely slip, who by barbiturate,

this two are very related, I think

a slip is a mistake but it is also an accident (I'm not sure to know the connotations of this word in the context) while abusing barbiturate is usually intended, but why would someone abuse barbiture? one reason could be because he/she is lonely? At least we know this usually takes place when they're alone and loneliness makes people lonely slip and a slip I said is an accident.

What was I trying to say with this?

...a doppelganger is like a double of yourself...I see now that's not what you mean....ciggies are on my mind because this is day 4 of giving up and my voice is whispering to me to remind me I saw a choice butt outside the back door while I was gardening today...the song speculation is very interesting. Do you know that a slip is also a petticoat (an item of underwear)? So poor woman is sitting in her lonely underwear, (it paints a picture. she's probably in a bedroom or bathroom dressed like that). She's slipped up (in this context slipping up can mean to 'backslide', or 'fall back' (into the habit of barbiturates).

What's the difference between solitude and loneliness? The Spanish word for solitude seems to be the same one as for loneliness: soledad. Is it that solitude means something regarding the mind and loneliness with the physical absence of someone else?

I think the first 3 days are the worst days of giving up so now that you're on day 4 don't spoil it with a butt.

asdf wrote:I think the first 3 days are the worst days of giving up so now that you're on day 4 don't spoil it with a butt.

...it's the next morning now...I made it through the night. It's very hard.

asdf wrote:What's the difference between solitude and loneliness? The Spanish word for solitude seems to be the same one as for loneliness: soledad. Is it that solitude means something regarding the mind and loneliness with the physical absence of someone else?

...I see solitude as a lack of contact with people, and lonliness as a lack of meaningful contact with people. Solitude seems to me to have a grander, romantic aspect because it's often a choice, as with hermits, monks etc. (unless it's being inflicted as a punishment). Lonliness doesn't seem like a choice. Solitude doesn't neccessarily lead to lonliness, and lonliness doesn't always happen in solitude.

asdf wrote:What about who in solitude, who in this mirror,

...is he talking about himself? nah I don't think so. He says: "who in this mirror". I think he's referring to the song as the mirror, so the 'who' is the hearer of this song.

Last edited by blue moon on Sun Aug 28, 2011 1:38 pm; edited 1 time in total

It's the second verse of the Yom Kippur prayer 'Unetanneh Tokef'...this part of it is relevent to the song (I've inserted the line breaks):

On Rosh Hashanah will be inscribed and on Yom Kippur will be sealed how many will pass from the earth and how many will be created; who will live and who will die; who will die at his predestined time and who before his time; who by water and who by fire, who by sword, who by beast, who by famine, who by thirst, who by storm, who by plague, who by strangulation, and who by stoning. Who will rest and who will wander, who will live in harmony and who will be harried, who will enjoy tranquility and who will suffer, who will be impoverished and who will be enriched, who will be degraded and who will be exalted.

...Cohen has given causes of death a modern twist (one of his lines makes me see an avalanche of cocain)

asdf wrote:For Levinas, the irreducible relation, the epiphany, of the face-to-face, the encounter with another, is a privileged phenomenon in which the other person's proximity and distance are both strongly felt. "The Other precisely reveals himself in his alterity not in a shock negating the I, but as the primordial phenomenon of gentleness." At the same time, the revelation of the face makes a demand, this demand is before one can express, or know one's freedom, to affirm or deny. One instantly recognizes the transcendence and heteronomy of the Other. Even murder fails as an attempt to take hold of this otherness.