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Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

VS

Well just in case some of you have yet to watch Death Note, Code Geass, or both (wow...you really believe Naruto is the one all be all manga eh?) well then I'll keep my analysis in spoilers. In any case, I highly suggest that you watch both. You'll be joyful that you did.

Now, without any further adieu, I present to you my analysis.

I use to naively believe that Lelouch was simply better man of the two because when it was all said and done Lelouch eliminated and neutralized all of his major threats, and with the Zero Requiem made himself the enemy of the entire world so that once he is killed by "Zero", the corrupted world will be ultimately peaceful; however, recently I've been having second thoughts.

Was it fair?

Light had a damn good run as "God of the New World." If you look at it, Light had to do it all really by himself because his so called allies (Mikami and Misa) didn't think things through cautiously as he did. Furthermore, the Shinigami who gave Light the Death Note, Ryuk, was not on his side at all...only a spectator, and he only assisted Light for his personal amusement or for his own benefits.

Lelouch on the other hand had a true accomplice that he could rely on, C.C. (or C2). She was not only intelligent, but a comrade Lelouch could rely on. She saved his arse on way more than one occasion everything from pretending to be Zero so that Lelouch could escape to fighting some of his battles in the Knightmare machine. Without her assistance, even with the Black Knights, Lelouch would probably not have gotten very far in his future endeavors.

Speaking of good runs, lets see who lasted longer. Light or Lelouch?

Light Yagami: He got the Death Note in 2003 and he died in 2010 so his reign as "Kira" lasted roughly 7 years. Unfortunately, he made a couple of costly miscalculations which lead to him being defeated by...grumbles...Mello and Near. Yuck!

Lelouch vi Britannia's conquest only lasted a single year. Still, Lelouch could of been a tyrant ruler for 10X longer than that if he wanted to, for there was no one else to challenge him. In the end though he only got rid of wicked or innocent people (sometimes on an accident...poor Euphemia) for the greater good.

Anyways, that's all I have for now. *yawn* The last thing I want is a wall of text that will deter people from reading. What's your take on this denizens of NarutoBase. Discuss.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

In terms of intelligence these two are about equal. To be fair though, Light did eventually gain allies over time (Misa Misa for example). C.C. saved Lelouch more times than Misa saved Light though from my memory on DN.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Originally Posted by Itssupereffective

There are different sub forums that allow talk about other anime like this.

OT: Since I only know about Light I'll go with him, I mean he was able to

have L killed

But in Code Geass, Lelouch killed off an Immortal with greater power than him...his father, and he beat his brother Schneizel who is a better tactician (Lelouch's brother is the only man alive to ever beat him in Chess).

If you love Death Note, then you'll also think that Code Geass is a great hit as well!

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Obviously I'm biased here, but I'd have to say Lelouch by far is better. Both Light and Lelouch received great character development throughout their stories, but in terms of overall awesomeness? I'd side with Lelouch without a doubt.

The thing about Light is that he was intelligent and had good intentions......for about like 5 episodes. Sure, you could say it was his form of "justice" but I'd say that after he killed Raye Penber he completely lost sight of his original goal. A "just" world where good citizens are to reside? More like a world where anyone who pisses you off or doesn't agree with your views 100% dies. Light was the kind of character who started off good, but went crazy with power and it distorted him as a human being. Lelouch took pretty drastic measures himself, but unlike Light he retained his humanity throughout the whole series. I'd say the two are inverses. Light is the guy who acts like he cares about people but doesn't, while Lelouch is the one who pretends he does not care about anybody in spite actually having a heart.

A big problem with Light? His pride. It always, always gets in his way and is responsible for every single flaw he makes. This is seen really early on in how he takes L's bait with Lind L. Tailor. I initially assumed that it was an idiotic move, but it wasn't really "idiocy" but rather that Light is childish and arrogant. He's the type who dares any opponents to come at him so he can prove his worth and crush them. Unfortunately, this bratty attitude causes him a lot of trouble and, eventually, his whole battle. Lelouch's blunders? Usually come through unforeseeable circumstances (the permanent Geass deal in particular, which was probably the one major plot-induced thing about Geass that bothered me). Lelouch's blunders come from such unfair situations and from his moral turmoil over whether or not he is making the right choice because of how he affects those around him. Light never, ever considers this beyond the first 3 episodes.

And of course, the conclusion. Don't wanna ruin the story for people who haven't seen both so I'll put a spoiler tag here:

Light died pretty pathetically and particularly through the failure of one he trusted. He made a lot of change and caused trouble for the police, but in the end, did he REALLY revolutionize the world? Hardly. He took his chance, made his changes, to the world and himself, and ultimately failed in his goal.

Lelouch? His plans had just as much danger and chance of failure, but he ultimately succeeded. The very last episode in particular is why I respect Lelouch more than any other. He put all of the hatred of the world onto himself and sacrificed his own life for the sake of creating world peace and uniting all of the world against a common enemy to end the destruction in the world. It was truly a sight to see and this death was probably the most meaningful character death I have ever seen. The fact that the means he took to bring this about were incredibly difficult, yet he STILL pulled it off masterfully earns my respect more than Light ever did.

And this is why I cannot say that Light is superior to Lelouch. Part of it is that I find Light to be a particularly unlikable (though very, very well developed) character by the end of the series, but regardless, Lelouch's development as a character is more impressive and, in my eyes, the achievements he made also were much more fascinating.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Originally Posted by Miles vi Britannia

Obviously I'm biased here, but I'd have to say Lelouch by far is better. Both Light and Lelouch received great character development throughout their stories, but in terms of overall awesomeness? I'd side with Lelouch without a doubt.

The thing about Light is that he was intelligent and had good intentions......for about like 5 episodes. Sure, you could say it was his form of "justice" but I'd say that after he killed Raye Penber he completely lost sight of his original goal. A "just" world where good citizens are to reside? More like a world where anyone who pisses you off or doesn't agree with your views 100% dies. Light was the kind of character who started off good, but went crazy with power and it distorted him as a human being. Lelouch took pretty drastic measures himself, but unlike Light he retained his humanity throughout the whole series. I'd say the two are inverses. Light is the guy who acts like he cares about people but doesn't, while Lelouch is the one who pretends he does not care about anybody in spite actually having a heart.

A big problem with Light? His pride. It always, always gets in his way and is responsible for every single flaw he makes. This is seen really early on in how he takes L's bait with Lind L. Tailor. I initially assumed that it was an idiotic move, but it wasn't really "idiocy" but rather that Light is childish and arrogant. He's the type who dares any opponents to come at him so he can prove his worth and crush them. Unfortunately, this bratty attitude causes him a lot of trouble and, eventually, his whole battle. Lelouch's blunders? Usually come through unforeseeable circumstances (the permanent Geass deal in particular, which was probably the one major plot-induced thing about Geass that bothered me). Lelouch's blunders come from such unfair situations and from his moral turmoil over whether or not he is making the right choice because of how he affects those around him. Light never, ever considers this beyond the first 3 episodes.

And of course, the conclusion. Don't wanna ruin the story for people who haven't seen both so I'll put a spoiler tag here:

Light died pretty pathetically and particularly through the failure of one he trusted. He made a lot of change and caused trouble for the police, but in the end, did he REALLY revolutionize the world? Hardly. He took his chance, made his changes, to the world and himself, and ultimately failed in his goal.

Lelouch? His plans had just as much danger and chance of failure, but he ultimately succeeded. The very last episode in particular is why I respect Lelouch more than any other. He put all of the hatred of the world onto himself and sacrificed his own life for the sake of creating world peace and uniting all of the world against a common enemy to end the destruction in the world. It was truly a sight to see and this death was probably the most meaningful character death I have ever seen. The fact that the means he took to bring this about were incredibly difficult, yet he STILL pulled it off masterfully earns my respect more than Light ever did.

And this is why I cannot say that Light is superior to Lelouch. Part of it is that I find Light to be a particularly unlikable (though very, very well developed) character by the end of the series, but regardless, Lelouch's development as a character is more impressive and, in my eyes, the achievements he made also were much more fascinating.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Originally Posted by Miles vi Britannia

Obviously I'm biased here, but I'd have to say Lelouch by far is better. Both Light and Lelouch received great character development throughout their stories, but in terms of overall awesomeness? I'd side with Lelouch without a doubt.

The thing about Light is that he was intelligent and had good intentions......for about like 5 episodes. Sure, you could say it was his form of "justice" but I'd say that after he killed Raye Penber he completely lost sight of his original goal. A "just" world where good citizens are to reside? More like a world where anyone who pisses you off or doesn't agree with your views 100% dies. Light was the kind of character who started off good, but went crazy with power and it distorted him as a human being. Lelouch took pretty drastic measures himself, but unlike Light he retained his humanity throughout the whole series. I'd say the two are inverses. Light is the guy who acts like he cares about people but doesn't, while Lelouch is the one who pretends he does not care about anybody in spite actually having a heart.

A big problem with Light? His pride. It always, always gets in his way and is responsible for every single flaw he makes. This is seen really early on in how he takes L's bait with Lind L. Tailor. I initially assumed that it was an idiotic move, but it wasn't really "idiocy" but rather that Light is childish and arrogant. He's the type who dares any opponents to come at him so he can prove his worth and crush them. Unfortunately, this bratty attitude causes him a lot of trouble and, eventually, his whole battle. Lelouch's blunders? Usually come through unforeseeable circumstances (the permanent Geass deal in particular, which was probably the one major plot-induced thing about Geass that bothered me). Lelouch's blunders come from such unfair situations and from his moral turmoil over whether or not he is making the right choice because of how he affects those around him. Light never, ever considers this beyond the first 3 episodes.

And of course, the conclusion. Don't wanna ruin the story for people who haven't seen both so I'll put a spoiler tag here:

Light died pretty pathetically and particularly through the failure of one he trusted. He made a lot of change and caused trouble for the police, but in the end, did he REALLY revolutionize the world? Hardly. He took his chance, made his changes, to the world and himself, and ultimately failed in his goal.

Lelouch? His plans had just as much danger and chance of failure, but he ultimately succeeded. The very last episode in particular is why I respect Lelouch more than any other. He put all of the hatred of the world onto himself and sacrificed his own life for the sake of creating world peace and uniting all of the world against a common enemy to end the destruction in the world. It was truly a sight to see and this death was probably the most meaningful character death I have ever seen. The fact that the means he took to bring this about were incredibly difficult, yet he STILL pulled it off masterfully earns my respect more than Light ever did.

And this is why I cannot say that Light is superior to Lelouch. Part of it is that I find Light to be a particularly unlikable (though very, very well developed) character by the end of the series, but regardless, Lelouch's development as a character is more impressive and, in my eyes, the achievements he made also were much more fascinating.

But, Light's animation > Lelouch's animation. And yeah, alot of that was biased.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

I am a lover of both anime and I would have to say that Lelouch > Light. Light did have a lot of help from Ryuk if you remember, if it weren't for Ryuk Light would not have known about all of the cameras placed in his room and exactly where they were, if we remember correctly Ryuk did a number of things even stealing an extra deathnote for Light, albeit he did it all for his amusement, but so did Light. Lelouch was a true master mind who did not succumb to the temptation of power. Light became power drunk and became detached from his original path of making a greater world to instead making a world he wanted to reign over, Lelouch defeated all of his opponents and was able to deceive everyone about his true intentions all the way to the end. Lelouch > Light because he ultimately succeded in his goal as Light did not.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Originally Posted by Yusuke Urameshi

But, Light's animation > Lelouch's animation. And yeah, alot of that was biased.

I'd say that's debatable. And regardless of bias my point still stands, I see practically no way in which Light is superior to Lelouch. Put Lelouch in Light's situation, L wouldn't have even tracked him down. Put Light into Lelouch's situation.......I doubt he would've gotten past episode 2. At best he would've gotten to Cornelia and then trashed.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

In terms of intelligence these two are about equal. To be fair though, Light did eventually gain allies over time (Misa Misa for example). C.C. saved Lelouch more times than Misa saved Light though from my memory on DN.

It's true, Misa helped Light a whole entire bunch due to the fact that she had "Shinigami Eyes." You know...she'll be able to see the person's real name by just looking at them. However, she was not bright at all, and there were times she nearly caused Light to fail prematurely.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Originally Posted by Miles vi Britannia

I'd say that's debatable. And regardless of bias my point still stands, I see practically no way in which Light is superior to Lelouch. Put Lelouch in Light's situation, L wouldn't have even tracked him down. Put Light into Lelouch's situation.......I doubt he would've gotten past episode 2. At best he would've gotten to Cornelia and then trashed.

Creepy stick figure (and the only one in the series at that) vs. a more human, lifelike person. Riiiiight. And that's totally hypothetical and shouldn't even be considered, just Saiyan.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

>.> I hadn't finished with either, but I must say that DN didn't drag my attention as much as Code Geass and the Liar game.
I like Lelouch and Akiyama because these two have the "ability" to make miracles become true...and so far I hand't seen that on Light.
I like the psychological aspects involved in the illusion of hope and such...Light is more like a boring child >.>
And no, this is not a rant about who's more likeable. The ability to drag ppl to your cause it's an important part to rule(Tho Akiyama lacks a bit in charisma).

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Creepy stick figure (and the only one in the series at that) vs. a more human, lifelike person. Riiiiight. And that's totally hypothetical and shouldn't even be considered, just Saiyan.

And that basically comes down to a matter of opinion. That's not even animation, that's just the Clamp art style and regardless I think it works pretty well for the series. And if we're going to talk about human, I can't even say Light is really "human" after his descent into madness. It's a real stretch to consider someone who kills anybody who gets the slightest bit in his way or disagrees with him "human" either way.

Hypothetical maybe but I don't see anything proving contrary. The fact is that Light's pride has torn him apart in many instances, Lelouch doesn't have such a big character flaw.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Originally Posted by Miles vi Britannia

I'd say that's debatable. And regardless of bias my point still stands, I see practically no way in which Light is superior to Lelouch. Put Lelouch in Light's situation, L wouldn't have even tracked him down. Put Light into Lelouch's situation.......I doubt he would've gotten past episode 2. At best he would've gotten to Cornelia and then trashed.

I do prefer Lelouch over Light. Lelouch is far more charismatic. Still, to be fair if they traded places Light would have C.C. on his side which would make some of his blundered plans successful. She is quite the ally. Even so I do see your point. I would imagine that C.C. would see right through Light's goody toe shoes routine, and end him right then and there just like she killed Mao because of Light's dark side.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Originally Posted by Strata Spartan

I do prefer Lelouch over Light. Lelouch is far more charismatic. Still, to be fair if they traded places Light would have C.C. on his side which would make some of his blundered plans successful. She is quite the ally. Even so I do see your point. I would imagine that C.C. would see right through Light's goody toe shoes routine, and end him right then and there just like she killed Mao because of Light's dark side.

That's a valid point, C.C. is certainly a more reliable ally than Misa was and could do pretty well to get him out of trouble. When it comes to the strategic warfare though I'm sure Light would become pretty overconfident and this would ruin him since even C.C. couldn't save him there. Light is the type who would utterly hate to retreat if it meant a "loss" and I'm sure this would be his downfall.

Re: Who reigns supreme: Light/Kira or Lelouch/Zero (Analysis)

Lelouch is a master of military strategy, and politics. He also kept a secret identity, but in being active in actual combat....eventually it wasn't game over if he was caught.

Light was a master of hiding his identity and at the same time listing names for his book. He had to think cautiously as being caught meant game over for him.

Lelouch conquered the world through plans in about 2 years taking in the time skip.

Don't know much about Light, but apparantly he could hide for 7 years.

Both are seemingly impossible tasks.

Also, Light was, initially I guess, killing off criminals...eliminating the jails I'm a fast time from the few episodes I've seen
Lelouch painted himself a Target and manipulated world order, stability, and peace. And in my opinion, managed to achieve Code Geass and hence didn't actually die (some people disagree....I respect that).