NEW YORK  The Dow Jones industrial average has closed above 11,000 for the first time in a year and a half on investors' rising hopes about the economy.

The Dow edged up about 9 points Monday to almost 11,006. The Standard & Poor's 500 index came within a point of hitting its own milestone of 1,200 during trading but closed just short of that mark.

A loan agreement for Greece allowed U.S. investors to focus on domestic economic and corporate news, including announcements of two big deals.

European leaders agreed over the weekend to make loans available to Greece to help the country lower its public debt burden. The 16 countries that use the euro agreed to provide $40.5 billion in loans to Greece if needed. The International Monetary Fund could contribute another $13.5 billion.

Europe is borrowing the loan money from China, who bought the money from us, and we got the money from the stimulus package, which was borrowed from our treasury, which borrowed the money from CitiBank, which was bailed out by the TARP fund, which was borrowed from Europe.

Done on light volume after FASB changes allowing "mark to fantasy" in March 2009.

Watch the credit markets instead. They're still showing that our economy is in very bad shape, with reckless federal government spending being the only thing keeping us from realizing the depth of the depression that we're mired in.

People keep talking about inflation or hyper-inflation. They should be talking about major deflation and depression instead.

(After we take the $500B out of the markets as planned, we'll put it back in gradually, inch by inch. No one will suspect a thing. Give it 18 months or so. That way no one connects the dots to our little October surprise.)

So with deflation isnt it less likely we can pay the interest on our debt and the principle on the bonds as they reach maturity?

That's EXACTLY correct!

That's what most people don't understand. The Fed and the Federal government are at polar opposites - not working hand-in-hand as most people think.

The Fed is just an organization acting as an interface between the international banks and the Federal government, but is completely controlled by the banks.

The bankers have shut off the "credit valve" to every developed nation in the world. "Credit" is the same as "money" in our M2 money supply.

Massive credit defaults are causing massive monetary destruction. The Federal government has been trying to alleviate this by creating new debt (money) as fast as it can. They can't do it fast enough by themselves, so they are trying to get the public to help them by offering "cash for clunkers", "first-time homebuyers", etc.

The Federal government is a dying patient - and will remain that way unti the bankers decide to open up the "credit valve" again. I don't expect that to happen for another 8 or 9 years at the earliest, based on history.

“European leaders agreed over the weekend to make loans available to Greece to help the country lower its public debt burden. The 16 countries that use the euro agreed to provide $40.5 billion in loans to Greece if needed. The International Monetary Fund could contribute another $13.5 billion.”

What will happen when the other parts of USPIGS start to default...hold onto your hats folks. There aint enough money in the world to bail all of us out...

Still waiting for the Dow to hit 13,000 when I sold off most of our stocks and stock funds in out 401(k) plans (transferred to other assets). Have gained a bit over 14% since, meaning the Dow needs to hit 15,000 to catch up to where we are at (assuming our current investment goes flat - not likely).

We think along similar lines. I see deflation, and I see it lasting for 5-7 years. I predict the DOW sees 7,500 before it breaks 12,000. I have been slowly taking money out of the stock market and am quite light now.

Nat gas about the only thing that looks interesting right now. I may be prejudiced there as I am collecting royalties. The ratio of oil to nat gas price looks favorable for nat gas.

Get in with what? ha. My retirement tanked on the last go around...I switched over everything to a straight money market...then today I saw the DOW and said to myself”YOU idiot! you should have left it in the index...”

then I get on freep...and now I feel better.

(I know. I know ...why would I listen to you guys when I can get such stellar financial advice as I have in the past from all the financial gurus: Diversify, index funds, blah, blah, blah!..what a joke.....rather be on here.)

If you are in this manipulated market get out now. The Fed is pumping up this market through its puppet brokers ( JP Morgan —Bear Stearn) . They are using printed money and buying selected Dow and NASDAQ components stocks and trying to stabilize the sinking ship. They go through brokers who don’t have a clue and using nominal large institutions as buyers to manipulate the market.

I went to Yahoo finance a few minutes ago. I saw the Dow was going to close negative at just before 4 pm and someone came in at almost the last second and bought. The market closed up +8.62 on the Dow.

I wish I had a bloomberg terminal to see where that last second buying came from. My guess us the PPT in the futures markets. Huge volume surge too. Have to have been almost at 3:55 pm or so.

Yep, I guessed wrong. As much as I guessed right by pulling 100% out of the market in December 2006, saving me a huge haircut on the way down, I guessed wrong in March 2009 when Obama telegraphed that the government would be manipulating the market to pump it up.

I always underestimate the ability of a corrupt government to manipulate markets in the short term.

The DOW belongs under 8000 and it is going back there in time. The fundamentals suck. As long as the government is going to manipulate things and prop up the market, anybody smart/lucky enough to ride the rally is making a killing. Congratulations on that.

I also underestimated the governments ability to force positive GDP numbers to be able to say the recession is over. Even with pathetic business growth, horrible fundamentals, unavailable credit, contining foreclosures, bank losses and closings, etc.

Note: I won’t touch unemployment as an indicator since it lags so badly behind growth, it tells you nothing about when the economy has turned.

45
posted on 04/13/2010 10:05:42 AM PDT
by Freedom_Is_Not_Free
(Bye bye Miss American Freedom. When did we vote for Communism?)

I believe it. you will see alot of evidence in low volume days where no good reason exits for positive movement. It is very easy to control if you have billions of dollars freshly printed to do this.You just say you buy higher than everyone else. No body knows. Stock goes up. then buy some more — even higher. Seller would be an idiot not to sell . It should be restricted by law but it is not. The Fed actually is buying most of t-bills that are auctioned!! China is out. The largest foreign buyer is JAPAN!!! RIGHT!!! you can’t make that up.

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