Wayne Steven wrote:You could maybe argue that 4:2:2 and 4:4:4 from a single chip bayrr was, as it is unaltered levels, but the debayering can stuff things around

Hopefully the future generation of sensors will do away with all Bayer patterns and give us full resolution instead of the 50-60% effective resolution we get after debayering.

The 4:2:2 and 4:2:0 models could not be raw as the three channels have to become inter-dependent, that's why for instance 4:2:2 cannot be represented by an RGB model but must be represented by for instance a YCrCb model which uses inter-dependent channels.

Ok, I'm not a fan of the camera design and it's not S35. But I'll admit it is one heck of a camera with so many feature with a full 4/3 sensor at such reasonable price point that I'm ready to get it, probably 2. I wonder if that screen will hold in daylight without a sunshade. Well done BMD.

And a camera that can truest be described as lowlight with up to 25,600 ISO. I think it will be a phenomenally popular camera!

It’s not going to fit in a pocket, but it fits the bill on so many fronts.

I was surprised it shoots CinemaDNG but it’s only a firmware release away from shooting ProRes raw. I thought that would be announced today, but if the team has practically killed themselves to get this out, I think they deserve our appreciation. And I still expect ProRes raw will come.

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Last edited by rick.lang on Mon Apr 09, 2018 5:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

It's likely exactly the same sensor in the GH5s and the Kinefinity terra 4K. If that's the case it's extremely good in Low Light, and dynamic range is reasonable. The dynamic range might be less than the original pocket cinema but not too bad.

The real killer though is the 60fps raw. The GH5s 10-bit 400mbps All-I codec is not bad but this is far superior.

Well, at least the target date is more realistic, and they may get it released sooner.

The Ursa Mini is still viable, as a larger sensor, Global Shutter Camera, that can be setup without rigging it, is still a good camera and while the PL version is no longer available, the EF Mount is still a good buy at $3,995. Cheers.

I'm gonna put in some overtime this summer so i can buy 2. 2 of these with the Original pocket will be my cam setup for my web series. Can't beat this at all. only time will tell on the low light performance, and any other performance hiccup like we had with the first pocket but all in all... I'm in.

Here’s hoping by September, they deliver ProRes raw as a further inducement and a feature that wasn’t promised. A great bonus if it’s there. I could use the lowlight feature for a wedding I have in late September! But I would really benefit from longer recording times by having it support ProRes raw!

As for 25,600 ISO, I’d likely just shoot with something like 6,400 ISO at a wedding so I’ll bet that will look very useable and be able to blend with the URSA Mini 4.6K shooting 800 ISO.

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Last edited by rick.lang on Mon Apr 09, 2018 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ok guys I'm usually sitting quite but I think we can say BMD nailed it this time. Basically, it is a DSLR type camera that shoots 4k 60p 2k 120p (cropped) in a form that fits small photo bag. It has fullhd screen to compose shots, with speedbooster it will be 1,3x crop from full frame. It has dual ISO 13 stops of DR. I feel like they have seen my my dreams about a perfect camera and just made it All with BMD colour science (raw and proress) and it is friction of the price of competing proposals.

illegalstudios wrote:Any ideas what I should to do with my Ursa Mini 4K now? After today announcement, nobody will buy Mini anymore, they killed own camera line

Don't think they have mate... sdi connections, vlock batteries, global shutter s35 sensor. Using the new camera will be like the old bmpcc either plugged in or modded to duck with a big brick on the top, bottom or on the back. Don't think the mics or the amps will be useful either.

I seriously cant contain myself....my poor ursa mini 4K...hmm Im seeing the posts about battery life. I guess it depends what you are shooting. The global shutter is something really nice that I think I overlook, or take for granted I should say. Tough. I will probably be pulling out the Pocket Cinema Camera every single time and my Ursa mini 4K will be collecting dust truthfully. The size of the pocket camera. and its probably good in low light compared to my *stuck at* 400 ISO ursa mini.

The only thing that concerns me about the BMPCC2 is that BM could have fallen back to their old habits of over promising and under delivering. I thought that they had leaned their lesson and would announce no product that was not shipping. If this is one of those deals where shipping in September means September of next year, I may have to swear off BM products until they finally learn their lesson.

Can I use the 3.5mm jack, mini-XLR and the internal microphones at the same time? (record LTC timecode via 3.5mm while having an external Rode Stereo-Videomic X with at least 1 channel and the internal microphones as backup)

Does it support the new prores-raw in addition to cinema-DNG? NO, IT DOES NOT

Bitrates needed for 4K raw to UHS-II (do my Sandisk Extreme Pro work?) and USB (Is there a way to use my existing Atomos Caddies with Sandisk Ultra II SSDs) => EOSHD has these

What can I do with the Bluetooth? (set camera-time to phone-GPS like with the GH5 is a great feature)

why did they choose these super-expensive batteries?

Why this super ugly 90s design?

How to mount it onto anything at all without the camera rotating around that ONE 1/4"-UNC thread in the bottom?

Some of the faked images made it look really ugly, but this looks pretty sharp to me. But really what matters is the image quality, features, and usability. If those are good, who cares what it looks like?

Great 'Cinema' camera with wonderful specs at an attractive price but without an EVF or even flip out LCD screen, it is totally unsuitable for my work. Scintillating picture quality is irrelevant if it's out of focus.

Craig Marshall wrote:Great 'Cinema' camera with wonderful specs at an attractive price but without an EVF or even flip out LCD screen, it is totally unsuitable for my work. Scintillating picture quality is irrelevant if it's out of focus.

Is an external HDMI monitor on that top 1/4" UNC thread an option for you?

Ellory Yu wrote:Grant in his announcement at NAB today mentioned that the BMPCC4K can shoot stills. Any info on the of stills?

I'd love to know what this is capable of re stills. Is this the first motion camera that you can take a proper still with the press of a shutter. Could make it even more of a game changer for the press guys where video is more important than the stills?

MarcusWolschon wrote:Is an external HDMI monitor on that top 1/4" UNC thread an option for you?

No, it would catch or snap off in a heatbeat. Sure, I could rig it with an EVF with diopter adustment, shoulder mount etc as there's no IBIS but that just defeats the purpose of this camera. I'll stick with my HD Sony S35s and wait for the URSA Pro 'Micro'. For my travel work, it's more about ergonomics than resolution.

Looks rather good. I might buy one. Then John will have to put up with me . But we'll see what else is coming.

I would prefer it with half the volume in size, to make it easier to hold and carry. It would be good if BM (this is a brainiac official request) made the sensor, controls, processing boards, and storage, seperate, so the camera could be rehoused. I.would love to make a case like my old view cam, where the sensor and controls could be in a handle that pivots with the screen, allowing either one to pivot by hand on the go. A mod maker could make a camcorder version, or something used to Canon cx15 or desperately needed extra wheels. I will.t wheels for zoom, focus, gain and adjustments for aperture, shutter, and colour, to flip round or auto set. I imagine that will be good for weddings.

Another brainiac request. Could we please have a proper HDR mode to give us 16-17 stops?

I'd prefer a second USB slot and a second cfast card.and 14 bits+ to bring out hidden dynamic range to make 15 usable stops.

I.think.there will.be.a market for add-on batteries with twin USB space. Another request, that both the USB and the cards be used as backup recording when the primary storage device fails or is full and is being swapped out. Even USB hub support to allow the device to switch drives as one filld6. So, if here is also a glitch in recording, rather than drop frames, it dumps them to other drives to be picked up latter.

aIf you are not truthfully progressive, maybe you shouldn't say anythingbTruthful side topics in-line with or related to, the discussion acceptedcOften people deceive themselves so much they do not understand, even when the truth is explained to them

I have figured out, the carbon fibre texture should work with it's looks and make it look better. It may look sleek and shiny.

aIf you are not truthfully progressive, maybe you shouldn't say anythingbTruthful side topics in-line with or related to, the discussion acceptedcOften people deceive themselves so much they do not understand, even when the truth is explained to them

aIf you are not truthfully progressive, maybe you shouldn't say anythingbTruthful side topics in-line with or related to, the discussion acceptedcOften people deceive themselves so much they do not understand, even when the truth is explained to them

I guess I still have something to dream about for the future. I'll be interested to see what the color science is like. I love the look of footage from my Pocket. I had been recently thinking about buying another as a backup. But it makes more sense now to see what people think of this one, especially those that might be pairing it with the earlier version. I'd already off-boarded my power and sound so all I really care about is the image. I do like the fact that I can get a little wider with current lenses...and like being able to grab stills. Getting full Resolve with the camera is making me rethink my currently rising Adobe fees......

Hand a chance to finally look over everything. Love almost everything. It even has a photo button! USB C port can not only charge the camera (possibly making USB C phone chargers an option), but I can duck tap a USB C SSD on my tripod handle, and record at any frame rate at the highest settings! Plus an XLR mini mic port AND a standard mic jack! And if the high ISOs work out great, then getting this camera is gonna save me money.

Only downsides I see is no flip out screen (which does suck, but I can fix that issue with a monitor), no ProRes RAW for Final Cut users (this can be fixed later though), mounts doesn’t seem to have any anti-twist holes in them (though I guess I can get a cage), and a part of me wishes it was small enough to pack in your pocket like the original. And that battery is definitely not gonna last long, lol (but again, there’s many power options). I don’t think the battery door is designed around a dummy battery. I hope the door is removable so a modded one can be added. No Global shutter kinda sucks too.

Beyond that, I’m getting a lot for the price. Competitors have weather proofing, in body stabilization, Anormophic mode, and continuious auto focus, but they’d have to drop their prices big time for me to care about the Pocket 4K lacking these. Besides, gotta leave something for Pocket 4K Pro I guess, lol.

Both weather sealing and IBIS are antithetical to the cooling required for a cinema camera. It is exactly the reason, why stills photography manufacturers are mostly stuck on 8 bit, long GOP codecs (and sometimes still overheats before their duty-circumventing 30 min).

Both weather sealing and IBIS are antithetical to the cooling required for a cinema camera. It is exactly the reason, why stills photography manufacturers are mostly stuck on 8 bit, long GOP codecs (and sometimes still overheats before their duty-circumventing 30 min).

Yeah, weather sealing would definitely cause overheating, and we know BMD cameras become super hot. Probably won’t get that till someone finds a way to cool small devices, or invent camera processors that don’t heat up as much that BMD can use. It’s why I have doubts on their in body mic’s being usable beyond a reference track, with the loud fan that’s most likely inside.

BM state clearly their position in the name 'Cinema Camera'. No serious DOP, with his crew, is going to want IBIS or autofocus. If you want those things there are plenty of other cameras to go and buy. Those crews won't be bothered about open vents because they will have rain covers. I think it is going to be an awesome camera, and yes you may need to add a viewfinder or monitor depending how you are going to shoot but make no mistake this camera is a game changer. My fear is (I have pre-ordered) that the volume of orders will shock BM and even if BM ship in September I may not see mine till this time next year or even later. This camera does change everything (particularly) if it is good in low light and the audio pre amps are spot on. Battery life at an hour is cool with me. My mission now is to find a tiny HD EVF. Any suggestions!

I haven’t been able to find the weight of the production version of this camera. The prototypes did not use the carbon fiber polymer whatchacallit that even Grant wasn’t sure about. That lightness may be another feature.

I also couldn’t find how many nits the “super bright” monitor is rated for. That should be a known but it’s not in the specs. I suspect it’s 1000 nits and that’s decent, but a higher value even better since you can’t tilt the screen and the sun can be so bright on a screen.