Welcome to HVAC-Talk.com, a non-DIY site and the ultimate Source for HVAC Information & Knowledge Sharing for the industry professional! Here you can join over 150,000 HVAC Professionals & enthusiasts from around the world discussing all things related to HVAC/R. You are currently viewing as a NON-REGISTERED guest which gives you limited access to view discussions

To gain full access to our forums you must register; for a free account. As a registered Guest you will be able to:

Participate in over 40 different forums and search/browse from nearly 3 million posts.

Ya can't have it both ways. Corporate CEO's fail and point fingers at the workers that made none of their stupid decisions. The conservative spokesperson Romney who so many here supported would have said "Let them go bankrupt. Now your saying NO, No it's the workers fault, don't let a mismanaged company fail.
Industries so often blame workers when they fail to peddle their products. When workers get $crewed their only recourse is often to strike. Unless the "Right To Work For Less" State has stripped them of that right and spent a fortune bad mouthing Unions.
You make it sound like the workers want to loose their jobs. That's ridiculous. Many corporate execs bleed the companies of capital then look for an excuse for their shareholders.
Papa John Pizza sold his fear tactic before the election about BO care. Then the bean counters reported BO care would raise Papa John pizza 11-14 cents. Scary huh.
We have companies going bankrupt and collecting bonuses at the same time.
Often strikes are not about money but watching mismanagement $crew you out of your job.
I hope the American worker wakes up to the fact that w/o a union, they have NO voice. Things you enjoy as a worker like a forty hour work week, minimum wage, job safety and more, all courtesy of Unions.
What the Union President said was likely the problem all along. Many corporates suffer under excutive greed.

First off you haven't seen Hostess' books. Yes the CEO's got a pay hike before filing bankruptcy. But it was only a few million among 9-10 exec's. The avg.
baker earned $5 more an hr. than the national avg. The company wasn't producing enough product during the strike.
The bankruptcy judge should have been all over the books.

As far as letting a company fail, your quoting Romney, not me. And btw, Romney never said "Let Detroit go bankrupt." That title was added by the newspapers editor.
Bankruptcy is one thing. Closing a company completely is another. There were many workers that were not part of the strike. Administration, drivers, stockers, distributors, bakers in other cities, strikers that crossed the picket lines. We are talking about people's lives here. People lost their job cause some refused to take an 8% cut that they would have gotten back over the next three years. Now instead of making $15-16/hr, they're making $0. I bet the spouses aren't happy with this.
There were strikers yelling "Shut them down!" That's just wrong.

Ain't it funny you always hear about the greedy, fat cat, corprate bosses getting rich off the backs of the workers; but you never hear about the greedy, fat cat, union bosses getting rich off the backs of the workers! Why is that?

Sadly, yes; here we go. And so it begins with shocking speed as businesses grapple with the reality of a changing culture. From a culture of free market, with its occasional boom and bust corrections; to that of certain and stifling entitlement, government intervention and redistribution of wealth. It is not a paranoid statement at all - it is here. I don't often wade into these discussions, however I make no secret of being a conservative.

And make no mistake - this is only the beginning. Having been both a contract and credit analyst at a couple of fortune 500 corporations (one being Hostess competitor Sara Lee), I can only quietly assure you it is going to get far worse.

The responses from the business world were well forecasted; the reactions of many are puzzling and extremely troublesome to me. I simply don't know where some of you get this notion of business people all being the fat cat Monopoly icon with the handle bar mustache, tux and top hat. I'm curious as to how many, if any, of you who support this new left leaning direction are also business owners with your own employees? And concerning large corporations: In all my years there I never ran into any fat cats you hear about in far left rants. The vast (and I mean almost all) majority of the denizens of that world make about as much as an experienced HVAC tech and in many cases less. Division managers, EOs, FOS, supervisors, analysts, IT etc. - all the ones I knew personally never made more than 50-150K. As for the guys at the very top...the CEOs and CFOs of multi billion dollar corporations? They have responsibilities and burdens most of us could not imagine. The laborer is worth his hire regardless of the task. The boards of these corporations agree to pay them handsomely for a reason.

Now of course there will always be the abusive, selfish and ruthless idiots out there. But they are the exception, not the rule; and it is never wise to rule by the exception. How much more foolish is it to rule by the perception of the exception? And that is what we have here: A very strong, deceptive and yet succesfull perception that all will be well and the bills will all be paid when we finally get all these fat cats to pay their share. Throw in a healthy dose of class envy and potential warfare, sprinkle liberally with race baiting (note in the attached article the nasty tweets and cries of racism directed at none other than black CEOs) and, yes - here we all go. Here we all are.

I'm sorry; and I know down deep you mean well and most of you on this site are genuinely a hard working and decent people. But those of you who voted liberal democratic have fallen for a false perception and fallen in with large numbers of people who are bleeding us all pale white. I'm feel especially bad for hard-working, highly trained Union members - how disgustingly far have we strayed from the days of Norma Rae. You guys deserve far better than your Union reps are giving you. The money ain't comin' from shirking fat cats - there aren't nearly enough of them. It's coming from you and me. Very soon.

Hunker down and mark my words: It is going to be a rough five...ten years or so. Regardless of which side you are on - plan well and be wise with your money. And I hope we all get through this without too much pain and learn something.

Sadly, yes; here we go. And so it begins with shocking speed as businesses grapple with the reality of a changing culture. From a culture of free market, with its occasional boom and bust corrections; to that of certain and stifling entitlement, government intervention and redistribution of wealth. It is not a paranoid statement at all - it is here. I don't often wade into these discussions, however I make no secret of being a conservative.

And make no mistake - this is only the beginning. Having been both a contract and credit analyst at a couple of fortune 500 corporations (one being Hostess competitor Sara Lee), I can only quietly assure you it is going to get far worse.

The responses from the business world were well forecasted; the reactions of many are puzzling and extremely troublesome to me. I simply don't know where some of you get this notion of business people all being the fat cat Monopoly icon with the handle bar mustache, tux and top hat. I'm curious as to how many, if any, of you who support this new left leaning direction are also business owners with your own employees? And concerning large corporations: In all my years there I never ran into any fat cats you hear about in far left rants. The vast (and I mean almost all) majority of the denizens of that world make about as much as an experienced HVAC tech and in many cases less. Division managers, EOs, FOS, supervisors, analysts, IT etc. - all the ones I knew personally never made more than 50-150K. As for the guys at the very top...the CEOs and CFOs of multi billion dollar corporations? They have responsibilities and burdens most of us could not imagine. The laborer is worth his hire regardless of the task. The boards of these corporations agree to pay them handsomely for a reason.

Now of course there will always be the abusive, selfish and ruthless idiots out there. But they are the exception, not the rule; and it is never wise to rule by the exception. How much more foolish is it to rule by the perception of the exception? And that is what we have here: A very strong, deceptive and yet succesfull perception that all will be well and the bills will all be paid when we finally get all these fat cats to pay their share. Throw in a healthy dose of class envy and potential warfare, sprinkle liberally with race baiting (note in the attached article the nasty tweets and cries of racism directed at none other than black CEOs) and, yes - here we all go. Here we all are.

I'm sorry; and I know down deep you mean well and most of you on this site are genuinely a hard working and decent people. But those of you who voted liberal democratic have fallen for a false perception and fallen in with large numbers of people who are bleeding us all pale white. I'm feel especially bad for hard-working, highly trained Union members - how disgustingly far have we strayed from the days of Norma Rae. You guys deserve far better than your Union reps are giving you. The money ain't comin' from shirking fat cats - there aren't nearly enough of them. It's coming from you and me. Very soon.

Hunker down and mark my words: It is going to be a rough five...ten years or so. Regardless of which side you are on - plan well and be wise with your money. And I hope we all get through this without too much pain and learn something.

Very well spoken. The 'change' is already underway and I suspect many of the supporters are not going to like it too much. But there is no going back, we all must trudge forward. I would like the chance to slap a few Obama supporters on the head along the way if I get the chance, but it really won't make any difference. We are all in this together.

"You boys are really making this thing harder than it has to be". Me

I like having infraction points, it makes me feel like 'one of the guys'.

"I am not here to rescue you, I am bringing you along for emergency rations" Quark.

Service calls submitted after 3PM will be posted the next business day.

When Hostess emerged the last time they were told to reduce their pension and health care costs that were unsustainable.
The first cuts were not enough. Meet Mr. Ding Dong. Ripplewood LLP and PE a major player.