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I apologize if i caused you so much distress to have you rant about my beer question.
That was certainly not my intent. It was a simple question from a member. I was not aware that this subject is so touchy and gets beaten to death every year.

I get it and personally approve the decision to keep those who might overindulge on site and out of harms way, you can't fix stupid after all.

I also think it is good policy to have a profit center for the club to help with expenses, if that means selling a few beers then by all means do it.

As far as i am concerned , I enjoy what the MOA offers to me as a member. I am not a long distance rider, so unless the rally is held within a days distance or at the most two days away I will not be going anyway. Heck I don't even like driving in the car that far anymore, but that's just me.

As to the lack of member involvement in the BOD, that's a reality all organizations face. The folks who do get involved in group leadership or politics, either like what they get from it or don't last long.
Doug

Remember the last BMWMOA Election, 2 (TWO) positions were not filled becauce no one ran for them.

This is what I mean. Then the MOA BOD will look at only a select group individual and then make them BOD members. I have voiced my concerns about that issue in the past. I am sure BOD does not want me to bring this issue up again and again. This is why it is so important to have a true election and not rubber stamp election. So we are all at fault for this rally site, the days in which the MOA holds the rally. etc. Because as members we did not have enough Candidates to hold a true elections for the MOA BOD Trust me I have no fans on the MOA BOD, but if you want change make sure they have enough Candidates to have election to make change

Before the "forum voices" condemn the BOD and the MOA,
I think we need to take a breath here, show some mutual respect and get the personal vendettas out of the way.

If not we could easily end up the way the AMA has gone , total loss of respect for the members, the BOD and loss of members by the boat load.

Most of us, at least i think so , belong to the MOA for friendship , help with maintenance, advice on gear , and for many other reasons .
But mostly because we like BMW motorcycles
( well the chicks who ride them are pretty hot too)

Lets all remember we do this" hobby" for fun, very few are lucky enough to get paid for riding , sharing their adventures and telling us arm chair riders about them.

I doubt the BOD get enough reimbursement for their time and trouble to account for the tough decisions they need to make so stuff gets done , that many of us reap the benefits from.

Before the "forum voices" condemn the BOD and the MOA,
I think we need to take a breath here, show some mutual respect and get the personal vendettas out of the way.

If not we could easily end up the way the AMA has gone , total loss of respect for the members, the BOD and loss of members by the boat load.

Most of us, at least i think so , belong to the MOA for friendship , help with maintenance, advice on gear , and for many other reasons .
But mostly because we like BMW motorcycles
( well the chicks who ride them are pretty hot too)

Lets all remember we do this" hobby" for fun, very few are lucky enough to get paid for riding , sharing their adventures and telling us arm chair riders about them.

I doubt the BOD get enough reimbursement for their time and trouble to account for the tough decisions they need to make so stuff gets done , that many of us reap the benefits from.

Some may think I am attacking the MOA BOD. I am not and I just stating a fact if you want changes to where and when you want the rally or other items within the MOA. You need to have individuals who have your interest in the organization. I will be the first person to look myself in the mirror and say I am at fault because I did not do this or that for the organization. But I can say this in the past I did try to make improvements to the MOA, somewhere declined and other issues were implemented. If the weather was cooler at this rally this thread would not have been an issue. At the time of the rally I had well over 30 plus days of riding in the heat, rain, 20-60 mph wind gust, and dust storms. I enjoyed it all because I was doing what I love to do. This time I looked myself in mirror and said to myself. I do not want to go this rally because of the heat, not because of the rally location or other issues. The MOA BOD cannot control the weather nor can I. We just need to make smarter decisions and have individuals who have your interest if you want changes in this organization.

I didn't go because I was on our boat in the North Channel of Lake Huron at a sailing rally. I'm sorry that I had to sleep under a blanket every night because of the cool weather while some of my MOA friends found it too hot to attend. (Well, not that sorry. )

The members of the sailing organization sat around bemoaning the declining membership and the lack of younger members. Sound familiar?????

The BOD has spent a lot of time and effort trying to figure out a strategy that will ensure that MOA will be here 20 years from now. I applaud their efforts and hope they will succeed. If we have a few missteps along the way, we will make a course correction and try something different.

Younger people are not "joining" like our parents did or like we do. It is true of the Lions, Elks, Moose, Masons, most churches and other membership organizations. It is a reflection of a culture change where social media has replace or superseded the traditional forms of "joining".

Some Chartered Clubs have figured out a way to get riders engaged on a regular basis and they have active, growing membership. The often have non-motorcycle events to ensure that spouses, children and SO's can be involved as well. They don't burn out their Leadership by having in place a program so you have a term end date, rather than being President (or other leadership position) for life. If there is a training program in place and a defined term with a replacement ready to step up, more people will say "yes" when asked.

What does this have to do with the Rally? Good question. If those who have strong opinions about how the BOD is not adequately providing leadership to the MOA then they have to do more than complain, if they want different results. Remember the definition about doing the same thing time over and over yet expecting different results?

If the BOD has to fill vacancies because of lack of candidates, no on should complain about their choice. They are doing what they believe to be the right thing. The give countless hours so that the rest of us can enjoy the benefits.

I became a Lifetime Member after attending several Board meetings and seeing the high quality of individuals involved in MOA leadership positions. I believe this to still be the situation today.

The majority of our members seem to be satisfied with the ON as the primary benefit of membership. Several other thousands seem to also want to have a Rally experience. Hundreds of others work very hard to make all of this happen.

I had the privilege to be Chartered Club Liaison for a couple of years. The many individuals that I had contact with from Chartered Clubs convinced me that w/o Chartered Clubs, MOA would quickly die. Why? Because if you look at the BOD, the Rally Chairs, the hundreds of volunteers that make a Rally possible and the volunteers who make the Regional Events possible, the majority have a background of serving at the Chartered Club level. Chartered Clubs are the training grounds for service at the National Level. Check out the current ON for a list of Chartered Clubs near you.

As an example, my replacement, Paul Mulhern, was very involved in his Chartered Club in TX and was willing to serve at a higher level. He has done a great job during a difficult time when BMW set new requirements for the use of their intellectual property. All of that time, effort and frustration was w/o compensation. If you get a chance, drop him an e-mail and say thanks.

To wrap it all up, if you desire change, it starts with you. Express your opinion here, send an e-mail to the BOD, write to the ON, get involved with a Chartered Club. Volunteer. Run for the BOD. Just think, if you had been a candidate last election, you would have won a seat with only one vote (you would vote for yourself, right?)

Doug 40427

Doug, no offense taken and I'm truely sorry if that's how I came off. It's some of the responses to your inquiry and imaginary facts that I responded to, not your question. We've addressed this question several time before which I'm sure you were unaware of. Sadly, in my mind, we have a few negative posters who are quick to post but that seems to be the extent of their contribution. It's easy to get truely involved. Even up to the BoD level. Anyone can look up the requirements and run for office. There is no secret cult running things at the MOA. The MOA is lead by people who are willing to get involved and do things instead of talking about what others are doing wrong. It does, at times, get frustrating to give a lot of time to any organization to constantly have pot shots taken at you. Especially when many of the shooters are repeat attackers who never do more than bit*@ ... "voice their displeasure" but never step up and take on a job at any level to improve things.

I think some people want the attention and it's simpler to get negative recognition by punching buttons on a keyboard than it is to get involved and try to improve things you feel need improving.

At this point I'm done with this thread. I assure you most BoD members and other Key Volunteers follow the forums regularly. Seldom do we respond as it almost always brings the folks looking for an arguement out of the woods. We are obviously all blessed to have the freedom to take away from this discussion what we choose. I have other things to do. I'm sorry I didn't respond sooner but I took a 300 mile ride today and tried on a new riding suit or two.

In my previous business career I always asked my people to look for the" second right thing" . We were there for Consultation not Confrontation.

It's always easy to find fault with the other party, the true leader finds the good and right thing, superior leaders find the 2nd right thing.

If Vetbmwrider is so unhappy with the way things are being done, he needs to step up and state his positions clearly and positively, get his name on the ballot and make the changes he wants. ( no slam on him if for what ever reason he cannot do this) but an older wiser persons once told me " you are either part of the solution, or part of the problem" your choice.

If the weather suits my old bones tomorrow I'll get my old AirHead out and go for a ride , knowing my club has my best interest at heart.

I went to the rally. It was refreshing compared to Bloomsburg. I did my seminars. The air conditioning was wonderful. Folks didn't flee because it was too hot, and I didn't have to outshout cooling fans in a sheep barn. I don't always agree with the Board. I didn't always agree with the Board when I was on it. I didn't always agree with the Board when I was President. That is the way of majority rule with an elected Board.

I personally liked the "hotel rally" (we camped) when the Board got crucified for trying something different. I wish they would do it again. I liked the June midweek rally in Texas, and it wasn't near as hot as Lima, Spokane, Bloomsburg, or York. But they got yelled at then too because it wasn't in July and wasn't Thursday-Sunday.

That said, I am odd man out because every valid random sample survey done in the last 20 years divulged that a majority of members like the July weekend format. I agree that cool is better than hot, but guessing the weather a couple of years in advance is iffy at best. I can recall at least 3 rallies where the temperatures were 15 degrees above normal.

But I think the solution is to go back to Canada, midweek, in June.

Paul Glaves - "Big Bend", Texas U.S.A
"The greatest challenge to any thinker is stating the problem in a way that will allow a solution." - Bertrand Russellhttp://web.bigbend.net/~glaves/

Geez. There are many posting here who somehow think that the MOA can control the weather. As we all know the only person who can do that was President Bush with the Cheney/Halliburton weather machine

The temps in Bloomsburg the rally week this year??? Hot early in the week. Thursday to Sunday? 86, 71, 78, 82. Overcast with showers. The average? Mid-80's. Just what sort of algorithm should the MOA have used in 2009 when the were likely looking for eastern sites that could accommodate us??? NYTrashman, do you think they have a crystal ball?

Take a look at the weather map. There aren't too many areas that the MOA could have selected for this year's rally that would have been hospitable. I have to imagine that the MOA is using every single bit of information it gathers from EVERY rally to make it's selection process better.

4000+ members on the MOA Face book page with zero mention of moving the rally date, 5000 + at the rally, 30,000 plus members and this poll at this time has 77 responses. I think that pretty well sums it up for me.