Town Square

Obamacare's disastrous effects, from it's biggest supporters

Original post made
by jimf01, another community,
on Sep 29, 2013

The leader of the unions who demonstrated for passage of this law have told us why this law needs major changes or outright repeal and replacement.
These same folks made this law happen, raised millions for campaigns, ran phone banks to gin up support, these same groups spell out the disastrous details of Obamacare, how it is and will negatively affect millions of Americans.
If you support Obamacare as it stands today, you should read this letter. The absolutists in this fight are the Democrats who will shut down the federal government if they do not get 100% of what they want in this debate. As Mrs Pelosi said, we had to pass the bill to find out what is in the bill. The unions who lent major support took her at her word, and the bill was passed.
Unemployed people cannot find full-time work because of this law. All types of businesses are holding off on growth and hiring because of this law. It is damaging to this economy in many ways.
The union members stood toe-to-toe against the Tea Party protestors, sometimes physically attacking (I was personally challenged to a fistfight in a protest her e in Pleasanton) those in opposition while we remained peaceful. They took Mrs Pelosi at her word, and now look at what the biggest supporters of the law say about it.
- the ACA will...destroy the foundation of the 40 hour work week that is the backbone of the American middle class.
- the law creates an incentive for employers to keep employees' work hours below 30 hours a week. Numerous employers have begun to cut workers' hours
- millions of Americans are covered by non-profit health insurance plans ... will be treated differently and not be eligible for subsidies afforded other citizens (14th amendment, anyone?)
- non-profit plans won't receive subsidies, but they'll be taxed to pay for those subsidies. Taken together, these restrictions will make non-profit plans like ours unsustainable
The American people will recall that this legislation was put together by Democrats and their lobbyists as President Obama entered office and the Democrats took a majority in the House and the Senate in 2009. Over the protest of minority Republicans, the law was passed, without a single Republican vote. Compromise was impossible then, as now.
Oh yes, people should also remember that our country was in the grips of a deep recession, the effects of which we still feel, even as we are in an alleged recovery. Obama and Pelosi expended a great amount of political capital to get red state Democrats to go along with them. This proved costly to many who lost their seats in 2010.
So now we know why the Democrats will not negotiate at this time. This cannot be a campaign issue for 2014. The progressives in Congress are also eager to build on the passage of Obamacare, they do not really want Obamacare, they want single-payer, aka socialized medicine, aka a complete federal government takeover of your medical care.

Utter nonsense, Jimbo. Same was said when Medicare was enacted in 1965.

We are self-employed and are planning to purchase Kaiser coverage from the exchange as it will be less than the amount we currently pay directly to Kaiser for similar coverage, and we will be able to keep our doctors. What could be more simple? Enough already with the sky-is-falling hyperbole.

"My biggest fight has been between those who wanted to do something incremental and those who wanted to do something comprehensive," Nancy Pelosi said in a meeting with reporters this morning (3/15/10). "We won that fight, and once we kick through this door, there'll be more legislation to follow."

Posted by A Neighbor
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 29, 2013 at 1:15 pm

As brrr mentioned above, the GOP is digging itself a deeper hole here. You cannot possibly know what the future of healthcare looks like, Jimbo, but please, if you like the holes being dug by fellow extremists like Ted Cruz, by all means, jump right in.

Posted by Another Neighbor
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 29, 2013 at 4:20 pm

Yep just as the GOP were told in 2009 that opposing Obamacare was a losing strategy for the next election, right Neighbor? Neighbor, you profess to know the future of the GOP if they oppose Obamacare, but we hear the utterances of leading Democrats in Congress, and can have NO idea what their plans are for the "future of healthcare"? Hmm, neighbor, your logic, not so solid.

Posted by So Limited
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 30, 2013 at 12:08 am

Steve, NO biggie! ! ! ! For TWO+ years the ONLY two things I've ever heard about is pre-existing and kids up to age 26. Every show, every hour, every Dem, these seem to be the ONLY two things, which could have been handled in TWO days, on TWO pages, and would have passed with BI-partisan support, unanimously, immediately, NOT earth shaking. Certainly didn't need to be the ONLY project for year and half Pelosi and her DEM congress to write the EXTRA 2000 pages of horrors teams are NOW trying to explain to the public.

Posted by Blessed
a resident of Valley Trails
on Sep 30, 2013 at 1:53 am

I just ran some numbers at the website and found that I can get a tax credit that pays nearly all of my insurance premium. I am paying $1200 per month now and will only need to pay $236 per month after Obamacare goes into effect. Thank you, Obama! He's a Saint!

Posted by right
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 30, 2013 at 8:35 am

He's a saint or satan?
Admit that this is all about money and power and you'll understand the devil in the details. The IRS (proven to be corrupt and hardly impartial) is in charge of collecting money to support the dems that pushed for this.
The govt picks winners and losers (denying coverage, delaying procedures, offering poor care, less options) and the govt bureaucracy gets fat and happy. More overhead, distribution of income from the successful to those who don't contribute, and attempting to balance the books (not) on the backs of the young.
Let's hope that the one benfit is that the left can finally get the psychiatric care they have long required.

Posted by Citizen Paine
a resident of Danville
on Sep 30, 2013 at 9:08 am

I had to watch Faux News this AM -- only treadmill available. They had a four-person frowning split screen, and one-by-one they first soberly mis-characterized the ACA as a government take-over, then lumped every other, utterly irrelevant Bad Thing about healthcare into it (high costs, doc paperwork, defensive medicine, etc.), all the while nodding their dismay.

Then they dredged-up an over-matched liberal commentator on one screen (African American, natch) all-the-while looking properly skeptical about the poor fool who been duped by his racial kinsman.

And THEN, in ironic triumph, after sowing all this derisive disinformation, they showed a poll that indicated that the public is Still Confused about ObamaCare! Now, why do you suppose that is, Faux Snooze? It would be hilarious, except that they are screwing with people's very lives here. They are really, very good at what they do, and what they do is plainly evil. Purely evil propaganda.

Posted by Can't wait
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 30, 2013 at 9:14 am

I can't wait for this health insurance to go into effect! I can pay for my coverage fully and I expect my premium to decrease by a little bit. One of my relatives will now have to pay *something* - either a fine or for coverage - after he has had surgery for a compound leg fracture and two babies delivered courtesy of the hospital because he had no coverage and not enough money to pay his bill - but enough to buy a new Apple laptop. The same year I had a $3200 ER bill for 6 stitches ( and a $2500 deductible that I had to pay!)

So I'm annoyed at the Republican shenanigans and if they shut down the government and make the economy falter, my investments will be hurt too. What are they thinking?

If the ACA is so affordable, why does Congress want me to pay their premiums?
If the ACA is so wonderful, why do the unions want to be exempted?
If the ACA is going to lower costs, why does my insurance agent tell me to brace myself for the "unbelievable" cost increases that will hit in 2014 - unless changes are delayed.
If the ACA is working so well why do it's previous supporters call it a "train wreck".
I'm sure that there will be winners and losers in the short term: many will lose jobs or hours, others will get insurance they were previously unable to get. However, the cost of this program is going to be astronomical, and even if it turns out to be good for a lot of people, it will be shown to be the Unaffordable Care Act in the long run.

Posted by jimf01
a resident of another community
on Sep 30, 2013 at 10:39 amjimf01 is a registered user.

Cmon, let us hear from some previously uninsured young people who are signing up for coverage in the exchange. Steve & Blessed will surely want to extend their gratitude, since it is your premiums which will be going to their subsidies.

Those of you young people who haven't yet signed up, you do have an option, #OptOut Web Link

Posted by Can't wait
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 30, 2013 at 10:50 am

My sons fiancé will be signing up the first day! She has a blood disorder and can't get insurance. She's 27 and unable to stay on her parents' plan. My son's employer-based coverage only offers coverage for the employee - not family members so even if they were married already, she could not get coverage with him. She's been on pins and needles and she also can't wait until January 1st when her coverage will go into effect. They can't get married before then because if she got sick/injured, her medical expenses could wipe out *both* of their savings - not just hers. Bankruptcy is always looming for middle class people who can't get health insurance and that takes a toll on the economy too.

Posted by Bill
a resident of Amberwood/Wood Meadows
on Sep 30, 2013 at 11:02 am

There is a company in North San Jose off of HWY 237, that had to inform their employees that they would need to pay $150 a month in extra medical coverage. The company stated that the coverage they offered to their employees was beyond the maximum allowed by Obamacare and if they did not reduce the coverage the company would be on the hook for millions of dollars in penalties.
Looking at the Cover California exchanges, it appears that if you are poor you can afford the premiums but not the copays. If you are middle class you can afford the copays but not the premiums. This isn't universal healthcare, its just everyone is universally screwed.

Posted by Can't wait
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 30, 2013 at 11:29 am

No... There are premiums or fines set up for the former freeloaders who didn't pay anything. We currently pay $986. monthly just for me and $674. For my husband. The new coverage will be about the same. Sorry if some people have been getting a great deal all along. Welcome to my world.

Posted by FreeLoader
a resident of Castlewood
on Sep 30, 2013 at 11:36 am

When I was working before, my premium was $354/month for a family of four. My company health plan was pretty good. $20 co-pay and $1500 max deductible. Glad I'm not working now! Part time pays less now than "unemployed"!

Posted by DontNeedItDontWantIt
a resident of Highland Oaks
on Sep 30, 2013 at 1:29 pm

Steve wrote: "I can now get coverage for pre-existing conditions (was denied before)"

Cant Wait wrote: "My sons fiancé will be signing up the first day! She has a blood disorder and can't get insurance"

Nobody has ever argued that there is a small percentage of Americans that need help getting health insurance. And nobody has ever argued that we should not help them. What we have argued is that something could've been done for these folks without a monstrosity like Obamacare, and without the government getting involved in the health insurance of ALL Americans. I don't need and I don't want government-mandated health insurance.

The ill-informed and truely uninformed in these posts are absolutely stunning. For example: "The company stated that the coverage they offered to their employees was beyond the maximum allowed by Obamacare and if they did not reduce the coverage the company would be on the hook for millions of dollars in penalties. " Did you get sucked in?? You can OVER-COVER you simply can not UNDER-COVER from the 10 essential health care benefits.

" What we have argued is that something could've been done for these folks without a monstrosity like Obamacare" okay, so will do this?? Hasn't happened through private sources and, in spite of the conservative Heritage Foundation's recommendation for a mandate, it won't happen through Republican sponsorship.

The only people exempted from using ObamaCare are our politicians and their cronies who helped push it through. Why that doesn't make everyone suspicious is beyond me. I realize many of you think this is what we need but don't you think we'd get something much better if Congress and the President were required to use it? Why do you defend these elitists and act like they have handed you some great gift out of their benevolence?

Posted by Citizen Paine
a resident of Danville
on Sep 30, 2013 at 8:06 pm

The foes of ObamaCare are all holed-up in their own private Alamo, firing-off errant rounds with all they've got. They know that once it goes into effect, it will be a non-event for 80% of Americans -- and immensely popular with we who insure ourselves.

Then folks will wonder what all the fuss was about, and remember who told them all these lies. Buh-bye, Davey Crockett.

Can't wait stated they paid $3200.00 for 6 stitches plus a $2500.00 deductable all on a plan she contibutes $986 per month on. I call BS...or you have or had no idea how to purchase insurance. Then she stated her son couldn't get married because his fiance might get sick and it would wipe out both their savings. What? That comment makes no sense at all. So if she gets sick now, her son wouldn't help his 'fiancé' out anyway? Wow, what a great guy.

Posted by Nomad
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 30, 2013 at 8:13 pm

This is the Affordable insurance via tax subsidies Act. The cost of care continues to rise. The $30 Billion medical device tax that started this year further increases costs. These funds go to pay for the ACA that helps Blessed and others. Wealth redistribution has expanded, and personal responsibility has degraded. Tell me Blessed, do you have a cell phone? Cable tv? Are you enjoying taking someone else's money to reduce your insurance costs?

Posted by Can't wait
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 30, 2013 at 8:22 pm

No, Jerry. The 6 stitches generated a hospital bill from O'Connor Hospital for $3200. + some change. Of which we had to pay our $2500. deductible. Plus pharmacy charges bc that is a separate deductible.

Is $2500 OK to pay for 6 stitches? Is that OK with YOU?

It costs that much because the hospitals are treating people in the ER who can buy cars, computers, TVs, vacations - you name it - but they refuse to save any money so they are worth nothing and the hospitals can't get any money from them - they spend everything they ever make. But now at least there will be a fine that will be up to several hundred dollars in 3 years and we will at least get a few hundred dollars from people who have contributed absolutely nothing until now, all while enjoying their new TV or laptop.

It is not BS. It really happened. And I can only wish the same benefits for you.

Posted by Freedom is not freedom if you make others unfree
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Sep 30, 2013 at 10:06 pm

Yet another move toward a more socialist society. And a long time coming. The Republicans know the American public will like Obama's Affordable Care Act, and that's why they're so rabidly opposing it. I mean, really, how transparent are their tactics. And for them to whine about principle. Gawd!

Posted by So Limited
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 1, 2013 at 12:47 am

Shouldn't each Congress member and all their staff members have to have insurance back home from the same insurance pools WE taxpayers have to use ??? WHY should they keep their super duper plan just for themselves ?? So wrong.

Posted by sounds like a problem
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 1, 2013 at 9:26 am

Here is the 1 thing that bothers me 'most':

If you don't buy the insurance, you pay some small fine. BUT, if you come down with cancer, have a heart attack, or hit by a car, etc., all you have to do is sign up THEN. No preexisting conditions can exclude you from getting health care.

So, why sign up until you need it?

So many things wrong with the process, and it sure doesn't seem unreasonable to me for it to be delayed 1 more year while issues are figured out. Allowing SOME to be exempt because they are union, big business or whoever is wrong. The 'little guy' does not get exemptions.

Posted by So Limited
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 1, 2013 at 9:46 am

ALL Repubs and many congressional Dems want CONGRESS (& ALL in Capitol) MANDATED to get common insurance like all other Americans are being required to do!!! What is wrong with our electeds & staff employees being made to live with horrors we are REQUIRED to suffer through for the rest of our lives. Write your DEM congressman, and IF that one thing happened, I think all would go smoothly.

BTW Blessed, your drop in premium is thanks to US taxpayers SUBSIDIZING you !!! So kiss my axx...as we watch our TAXES SKYROCKET FROM THIS DAY FORWARD !!! also, btw, I am not a teapartier.

Posted by Bill Carman
a resident of Country Fair
on Oct 1, 2013 at 10:28 am

One our country's biggest faults is the lack of healthcare for all. The best solution would be to tax Americans making Medicare available to all. It would change the fee for service problems with healthcare and cut medical costs by hundreds of billions of dollars. The reason we have the Affordable Care Act is because it was a right wing proposal adopted by Democrats to get something started. If we, truly, want to be competitive economically, we need to provide healthcare to our citizens. To do anything less is, simply,cruel.

Posted by 44doubletap
a resident of Oak Tree Acres
on Oct 1, 2013 at 11:57 am

What we are seeing from Republicans or any other representative entity: they are actually representing what their constituents asked them to do!! Millions of people (mostly achievers who will be paying for this Marxist mess) have signed millions of petitions over the past few years stating that they do not want Obamacare funded. And what do you know, they listened, just like a democratic society is supposed to work isn't it? The dictator says he will not negotiate about this "affordable health care act", that's not the way this society is supposed to work. And the argument that shutting down the government will hurt Republicans is laughable. Those people that choose not to work and live generation after generation off the backs of others, will never vote for a Republican anyway. If the Democrats shut it down for 3 years, they will still get the freeloader vote.

Posted by So Limited
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 1, 2013 at 2:09 pm

Just heard a Congressman saying it's not fair that some things are closed or not happening today. But over the months Obama has "exempted" certain groups FROM participated in the forced Obamacare program. How and WHY should any 'group' be EXEMPTED from this nightmare. If I have to suffer, everybody should have to suffer too. With these exemptions there will not be any 'verifications' to medical benefits. Middle-class will suffer and have to foot the bill. Since every healthy 28, 29,& 30 year old will be forced to buy a complete policy (instead of a house)to 'fund' the subsidized program, it seems CONGRESS should be "ALL-IN" too. When Pelosi & Obama team 'wrote Obamacare' that DEM PELOSI Congress didn't want her congress to LOSE their SPECIAL plan goodies. WE should demand Obama allow that REwrite.

Posted by So Limited
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 1, 2013 at 3:01 pm

The biggest winners in Obamacare are the INSURANCE COMPANIES !!! followed by those bragging about their LOW premiums....ONLY BECAUSE of the REST of US ARE PAYING FOR THEM BY SUPPLUMENTING WITH SUBSIDIES.
Insurance CO will rake it in. Rich will not suffer. Working Middle-class in HIGH INCOME areas like Bay Area will suffer greatly, paying their own premiums (employers will stop), and paying the subsidies for those deemed 'eligible' on the 'NATIONAL" income chart...very punitive to BayArea workers.
Bay Area workers will also be paying for the richest in Arkansas and Oklahoma, who fall lower on the "IRS CHART" than the hard-working Bay Area commuter who WILL appear on one-size-fit all national charts as higher income than LOW cost areas. Houses/cost of living sucks up Bay Area earnings, while house/cost of living allows the COMFORTABLE in Arkansas & Oklahoma to 'appear' as pitiful poor LOW INCOME, who must be SUBSIDIZED by that Bay Area commuter sucker working his tail off !!! BIG BROTHER should collect subsidy tax funding by ZIP codes COST OF LIVING equilance charts...NOT by income, which creates false inpressions.
Obamacare will put a drain on high-cost CA areas. BYE unions...nobody left here to pay your retirements. Just the richest(NOT Hollywood since they are all Dem talk, but have tax addresses ELSEWHERE!!). Welfare folks will still be here with you unions. BUT, the working middle-class will be outta-here!!!!
Pelosi's Dem congress & Obama were so cruel to the rest of us, to create this payback plan to his Chicago ghetto, stick it to us, and EXEMPTE Pelosi's congress !

Posted by Nomad
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 1, 2013 at 7:57 pm

Bill Carman - I like ideas that would lower the cost of X-rays, prescriptions, hospital day rates, anesthesia, stents and more.
I'm having difficulty understanding how 'taxing Americans to make Medicare available for all' would lower the cost of medical care. Can you explain?

Posted by DoWhatsRight
a resident of Del Prado
on Oct 1, 2013 at 9:17 pm

The mis-information about this healthcare change is shocking. Costs were skyrocketing and impossible to contain, THAT is why there was 100% agreement that something had to be done. That was back when congress only did something to avert a crisis, unlike now, when they can't do anything even in the event of a crisis.
FACT: the insured and taxpayers were ALREADY paying for treatment for the un-insured. In America we don't let citizens die in the street. Paying for emergency healthcare for the uninsured was costing taxpayers and insured Americans bigtime, only INDIRECTLY. Don't make me laugh by claiming strangling Obamacare has anything to do with fairness. Denying insurance to people born with a defect or uncurable condition? So THAT's fair?? Boehner defines "unfair" like my 3 year old - any situation where she doesn't think she's winning. The right-wing outrage creators have pounded the message that Affordable healthcare for all Americans is a horrible thing - it's going to cost somebody money!!!! It doesn't get more terrifying than that for Tea party extremists. The fact that the overall cost structure SAVES everyone in the country money and the people who will benefit most from this law demographically are Republicans, that seems to get overlooked.
Healthcare law needs to get inacted and refined as time goes on. Hard-right talk show blowhards who preach doom & gloom about the future with Obamacare are simply making @#$% up. They don't know what the future of healthcare looks like, they don't care. They just need to tell you an outrageously unfair anecdote, scare you, make you mad, and keep you listening. If 98% of Americans benefit, and they can tell you a horror story about one or two people, that's what they need to do. If they told you things are good, they'd have to go out and work for a living.
Healthcare has already changed and NOT because of Obamacare! - People who dream that they want their healthcare to be "the same" as it was 5-10 years ago simply know nothing about the health insurance industry or health provider costs. The earthquake has already happened, and the ground is shifting still. You cannot get "the same" healthcare as you could 10 years ago! Want to have the latest tests and procedures if you become seriously ill or injured? How do you imagine that will be available to you?? If you want to be a candidate for care, you need to wake up to the huge cost involved. The ONLY way you will be able to take advantage of the best help is with insurance. Want your young adult child or elderly family member to have help if they are hurt or seriously ill? SO DOES EVERYBODY ELSE. Don't worry, people who can afford it will still get the best care! But ANYONE can need health care, and EVERYONE should have a chance to buy it. Averting dissability and illness is actually MORE cost effective. Not to mention the moral and right thing to do.

Posted by So Limited
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 1, 2013 at 11:58 pm

DoWhatsRight, ZiegHeil !! YOU SAY "EVERYONE should have a chance to buy insurance"... BUY being the key word. IF ONLY that were the case! Many have NO medical problems, but CHOOSE to NOT work, so fall LOW on the National IRS $$ CHARTS, so appearing unable to afford, I am forced to contribute to their SUBSIDIES, to BUY FOR THEM !!!!! PLUS, PAY for my own.
Remember this is about 'insurance coverage'. IT has nothing to do with finding GOOD doctors, or quality CARE being AVAILABLE in my area. Many Doctors, CLinics, and hospitals will NOT BE IN some insurance plans !!

What I love the most about this whole fiasco is when I saw Jimmy Kimmel,I believe,interviewing people on the street.Do you like Obamacare....no......Do you like the Affordable Care Act?.....Yes.
You would think people could behave like grow ups and let the law which was passed by congress and ruled on by the Supreme Court with the president being elected for a 2nd term with it as a main issue.....take effect and see how it works in the real world.The congress could then keep all the good parts which are many,change the parts that are not working and in the end actually have something that is good for the country.Too much to ask I guess.

I forgot to mention....With the blatant disregard the far right has shown for the country in general and the intense hatred of Obama which fuels them,one would think that if the ACA was really as bad as they profess,they would welcome it and the disasters that it will cause which would destroy Obama's legacy.It is rather transparent that they are so desperate to stop it before it can implemented that the truth is they know it will be accepted and liked in the long run.I am certain it will have its problems but a congress with grow ups could fix them.

Most of us who pay for insurance will be paying more in order to subsidize those who don't pay. There are a lot of ways to look at that; maybe good, maybe not. But one thing is for certain: when the government runs the show you'd better hope you don't get sick.

Posted by Really?
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 2, 2013 at 5:25 pm

I was thinking the same thing Hoops- "if the ACA was really as bad as they profess,they would welcome it and the disasters that it will cause which would destroy Obama's legacy"

The best was when Cruz read Green Eggs and Ham during his little filibuster show- a story about not liking something, then actually trying it and finding that they really did like it!

Sen Cruz is not able to understand the moral of a Dr Seuss book he purposely used to mislead the American people about ACA, and yet so many here on these posts continue to stand behind the message the GOP is sending. As if we cant see through this little game that they are playing. I love the "they wont negotiate with us" line..... for being such strict followers of the Constitution, they certainly forget what a law is, especially one upheld by the Supreme Court.

In CA, the website was so busy they couldn't figure out how many hits they had. First they told media they had 5 million. After everyone went off and reported that, they admitted it was 645 thousand Web Link

People.....it is a law passed by congress and confirmed by the Supreme Court.Give it a chance and let's see if it is good or not.IT CAN BE AMENDED.Is your hatred of Obama so blinding that you have no common sense.Lets destroy the economy and put the world economy into chaos because of some self serving yahoos in the house who do not care about anything but their hatred of Obama and the fact that their districts are gerrymandered so they have no fear of losing their seat.

Posted by jimf01
a resident of another community
on Oct 3, 2013 at 10:36 amjimf01 is a registered user.

"Give it a chance and let's see if it is good or not"

- we have already seen how this law is and will damage the economy of the US, we are in the midst of the slowest economic recovery we have ever seen

- A survey published last month found that 15% of large employers (50 or more employees) and 20% of smaller employers had plans to adjust hours so that fewer employees qualify for full-time medical insurance under the ACA. Web Link

- other businesses are simply choosing to avoid the 2015 requirement that any company with more than 50 such employees, including full-time equivalent employees will have to offer health benefits by limiting growth of their payroll Web Link

- 2000 pages of legislation that nobody read, that has over 700 occurrences of the phrase 'the secretary shall'... so the HHS Secretary has almost complete free reign to say what is in there and what isn't as this is implemented Web Link

- the first law in the history of the US that mandates that you MUST purchase something, whether you want it or not, or pay a fine Web Link

- this mandate has an impact on people, the most popular question on the healthcare website? How to get an exemption from paying the fine for not having health insurance

- President Barack Obama famously promised, â€œIf you like your health care plan, you can keep your health care plan err, NOPE -- talk about unintended consequences, imagine this: a law intended to help more people get insured causing people to lose the insurance they already had Web Link

- medical-device manufacturers are laying employees off due to a new tax, this tax will not only cost jobs, but it will necessarily reduce innovation in this country, more manufacturing moved offshore

All this, in addition to the disastrous effects on union employees all across the US, as I explained in my OP. Not enough? Want more? How many bad effects does it take before people realize this is, plain and simple, bad legislation

Did it ever occur to you that itt makes no sense for Obama and the dems to put such a disasterous law into effect.If it s as you proclaim why would they push it forward as it is.I think you are very biased and are looking for anything that could possibly be negative and carrying out every aspect to the worst case scenario while choosing to ignore the positives.It is a law,it was passed,it was adjudicated,Obama was re-elected with it in play.If it is as you say,it will be a huge win for the repubs and it will be amended either way.

Posted by jimf01
a resident of another community
on Oct 3, 2013 at 1:39 pmjimf01 is a registered user.

It makes no sense for Obama and the dems to put such a law into effect, but they did it. It is not 'as I proclaim', it is backed up by the facts.
I have said many times, as the leaders of the GOP have said many times, there are many good reasons to have everyone insured. But this is a very bad law which had many disastrous effects on people, and the Democrats will hear none of it, what part of the law, may I ask, has been amended since it was passed almost 4 years ago? Nothing. Why would the Democrats not be amenable to fixing these problems, even the problems the greatest supporters of the law are complaining about?

Posted by Charlie
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 3, 2013 at 1:43 pm

Most of those insurance companies that opt out will come back. Those that don't will be admitting that their rates are not competitive. They'll die on the vine, because people will pursue the most competitive plans.

Just a few multi-billionaires, chafing at the idea of having their taxes raised to help subsidize a program meant to uplift the entire populace, have funneled tens of millions into causes to defeat ACA. So many in Congress and the media are doing all they can -- lie, distort, block kids from getting adequate nutrition -- to please their obscenely wealthy masters. Seeing the lemmings all trip over themselves on the way to a cliff of doom, trying to convince the public that USA can't do what every other developed country has accomplished for decades, is more than a little hilarious. They think the public is dumb. Well, as some of the above comments suggest, there are a few -- well, probably only one using multiple monikers -- who are/is willing to swallow the swill. See you guys in 2014! And remember: It's Obamacare, a law passed largely by Democrats and resisted by most Republicans. Obamacare.

Posted by Charlie
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 3, 2013 at 2:14 pm

Speaking of the lemmings, here's the multi-named Jim citing an author who maintains that Justice Roberts caved on the ACA ruling on account of public pressure. Stopped laughing yet? Next, the same author claims that Obama's 2012 election is invalid because the IRS smuggled him into office. As for his views about ACA, the author relies on an unverified tale of one applicant who went from being a law student who took advantage of an insurance plan to a free-loading, socialist welfare recipient -- and all because he got a good deal on his health insurance.

Please continue, Jim/.../.../.../..., your posts just get funnier and funnier. This is why the Repubs are going to lose big time come 2014. Like Jim/.../.../.../.../, they are a joke.

BTW, Obamacare is now the law of the land. You and the other losers can only whine and forecast doom. Have fun.

Jim,they are facts.YOUR facts.As I said before,what is pushing this obsession is fear that the law will eventually work,which it will with time and any needed changes.You see,some people actually want this country to work while others only care about destroying Obama.

Posted by Really?
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 3, 2013 at 5:51 pm

Jim states-' A survey published last month found that 15% of large employers (50 or more employees) and 20% of smaller employers had plans to adjust hours so that fewer employees qualify for full-time medical insurance under the ACA'

This is disturbing Jim and continues to point out the fleecing the private sector/big business continues to do to the middle class- find loopholes and screw the blue collar workers. I love that you chose to post that as your 'defense'. Sounds just like the attitude that sent this country into the recession- then the GOP continues to call these same workers 'takers'.

The GOP has made their platform very clear- its one of greed, self preservation, and win at all costs....its time they now face the realities of that platform and take responsibility for it.

Instead we get to witness senators standing today in front of doctors saying they want to restore NIH, because they are starting to look bad? And they were the ones that cut NIH funding to begin with, with Boehner refusing to restore that funding last January. Stunts.

And we are to believe you and your talking points Jim? Laughable, the party gets more hilarious daily.

Posted by Nomad
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 3, 2013 at 9:48 pm

Really? -
'fleecing' ?
What an incredibly myopic cherry picking claim. Until the ACA, companies freely chose (or not) to provide medical insurance and other benefits to its employees. Emphasis on 'freely chose'.
Then the ACA declares medical insurance a mandate for employers. Dictates the rules for such mandate. Forces states to provide a marketplace for individuals to acquire medical insurance including new forms of lower cost (and lower value) insurance. Taxes the wealthy, insurance companies, employers, and medical device manufacturers to provide subsidies to individuals.
With the ACA, the government has created a new mandated environment, and imposed burdensome and costly rules, regulations, taxes and penalties on companies and individuals alike.
Seems to me it is the government that is doing the bullying, fleecing and confiscation of wealth here. And has created perverse incentives for companies to change their compensation and benefit structures.

Posted by Lenny Moore
a resident of Bonde Ranch
on Oct 4, 2013 at 5:25 pm

Jim just doesn't get it, and probably never will. When rich persons and companies spend ungodly amounts to influence lawmakers who then ensure loopholes so that the rich don't have to pay their fair share but rather the public ends up paying more than it should this does indeed amount to fleecing.

Jim, on the other hand, sees the wealthy as being bullied and fleeced. The poor little wealthy things. Jim, you're a laugh a minute. Please continue with your hilarious claims.

Posted by jimf01
a resident of another community
on Oct 4, 2013 at 6:05 pmjimf01 is a registered user.

The one who doesn't get it is one who claims only the epublicans are bought and paid for.
Let's be serious. The Democratic platform is no more about 'the rich paying their fair share' than the GOP. Both parties spread 'corporate welfare' equally. The progressives thought they would get something different with Barack Obama, but nothing has changed in DC.
The wealthy, and you, and I and your gramma know the wealthy aren't being bullied, they are running the show.
And read my previous postings in this space if you think this is the first time I am saying this.

Posted by Lenny Moore
a resident of Bonde Ranch
on Oct 4, 2013 at 8:56 pm

Oh, Jim, so Obamacare indicates that nothing has changed, eh? So why have the Republicans done nothing other than try to shut it down for the past 3 years? Additional millions will have affordable health care, but you say this shows that nothing has changed? Such a feeble-minded claim doesn't even measure up to joke status.

Posted by Me Too
a resident of Another Pleasanton neighborhood
on Oct 4, 2013 at 10:29 pm

No, what Jim is saying is that if you think the elected democrats are high and mighty and not influenced by incoming dollars, than you are delusional. Obamacare shows that our current structure allows us to do nothing right. If we want public healthcare, this is not it. We have to bite the bullet and just do it. It might actually mean more financial pain for everyone including the poor, which apparently we can't have so we go about this in a half-assed manner. I don't have the exact numbers in front of me, but most Americans put themselves pretty close to the middle politically, yet the government is run mostly by people who live at the extremes of either end. So we really don't get governed by people who represent the American people as a majority.

Posted by Lenny Moore
a resident of Bonde Ranch
on Oct 5, 2013 at 2:29 am

Don't quite know what you mean, Jim. Do nothing right? And this isn't the right way to do public health care? And Obama is an extremist? And you want people who are poor to feel yet even more pain? Because the poor just don't have enough pain in their lives already, eh? Sounds to me like someone is pretty seriously unhinged, Jim.

Posted by Thomas Sowell
a resident of another community
on Oct 5, 2013 at 8:35 am

Thomas Sowell today: There is really nothing complicated about the facts. The Republican-controlled House of Representatives voted all the money required to keep all government activities going -- except for ObamaCare. This is not a matter of opinion. You can check the Congressional Record.

As for the House of Representatives' right to grant or withhold money, that is not a matter of opinion either. You can check the Constitution of the United States. All spending bills must originate in the House of Representatives, which means that Congressmen there have a right to decide whether or not they want to spend money on a particular government activity.

Whether ObamaCare is good, bad or indifferent is a matter of opinion. But it is a matter of fact that members of the House of Representatives have a right to make spending decisions based on their opinion.

ObamaCare is indeed "the law of the land," as its supporters keep saying, and the Supreme Court has upheld its Constitutionality.

But the whole point of having a division of powers within the federal government is that each branch can decide independently what it wants to do or not do, regardless of what the other branches do, when exercising the powers specifically granted to that branch by the Constitution.

The Senate chose not to vote to authorize that money to be spent, because it did not include money for ObamaCare. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid says that he wants a "clean" bill from the House of Representatives, and some in the media keep repeating the word "clean" like a mantra. But what is unclean about not giving Harry Reid everything he wants?

If Senator Reid and President Obama refuse to accept the money required to run the government, because it leaves out the money they want to run ObamaCare, that is their right. But that is also their responsibility.
When Barack Obama keeps claiming that it is some new outrage for those who control the money to try to change government policy by granting or withholding money, that is simply a bald-faced lie. You can check the history of other examples of "legislation by appropriation" as it used to be called.
Whether legislation by appropriation is a good idea or a bad idea is a matter of opinion. But whether it is both legal and not unprecedented is a matter of fact.

Posted by Lenny Moore
a resident of Bonde Ranch
on Oct 5, 2013 at 9:12 am

Fact: ACA was voted into law by BOTH houses of Congress. President Obama signed the law. The Supreme Court, despite continued remonstrations from Republicans, upheld the law's constitutionality. Republicans in the House of Representatives have done nothing for the past 4+ years accept attempt to derail the law of the land. Now they've effectively shut down government as part of their prolonged temper tantrum. Fact: Thomas Sowell is an Uncle Tom who hates his own racial identity and begrudges Obama his success.

Oh, and WHY this Republican temper tantrum? Is the law violating a people's rights? No. Is it causing people to die? No. Or is it because it has worked so well for many years in Massachusetts and they're scared to death that it will work in the larger USA and that, especially, Obama will get the credit he deserves?

If one or the other House chose to shut down government every time it didn't get its way, we'd have nothing but turmoil and chaos. Oh, but this IS the Republicans' desire, is it not? Because a country in turmoil and chaos can then be blamed on Obama. Well, we'll see what happens at the polls in 2014.

The ONLY reason they are trying to allow all of the funding in minus the ACA is to save themselves from the political suicide.It is a reaction to a disasterous plan that is making hem look like selfish idiots.If the Repubs mess with the debt ceiling there will be hell to pay and they know it.They will try to save face but in light of their extortion the damage is already done in the view of most Americans.The Dems are not saints either but at least they are not blithering idiots like the tea party fanatics that are clueless about anything except their narrow view of the world.

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