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Re: NKorea warns of war if punished for ship sinking

Wait a minute here....Joint exercises as a show of strength is a "huge provocation"? What was sinking a ship killing 46? Business as normal?

My jaw is hitting the desk here....NK sinks a ship, and all we should do is what? Send a letter? Can we type it in bold type so that Il knows we are really, really serious this time?

j-mac

What would you suggest we do?

"This Administration will constantly strive to promote an ownership society in America. We want more people owning their own home. It is in our national interest that more people own their own home. After all, if you own your own home, you have a vital stake in the future of our country."" GWB

Re: NKorea warns of war if punished for ship sinking

Originally Posted by Jetboogieman

Ok diplomatic and military expert.... what should we do? Outline a complete and detailed plan of action... we have a rogue nation which may or may not have nuclear weapons, which could destroy seoul. We have a million men facing eachother on either side which will become a bloodbath.

Even your precious Ronald Reagan wouldn't have been stupid enough to start a war at this point because we won't know what we're up against. And unfortunately because of China getting tougher sanctions might not be possible (Not that it does anything except hurt the people, the elite in North Korea still get their Champagne and Rolls Royces.)

Excellent question on the board here. What do you think should be done? Where should we draw the line for what is unacceptable? If another ship or two were to catch a torpedo in the next year or so, do we take action then?

The little NK prick is a problem. China as a "guardian" of the little prick is a concern. My leaning would be that we do something just to taunt him, and then if he over-reacts we "ice the ****er...."

Re: NKorea warns of war if punished for ship sinking

Originally Posted by Jetboogieman

So now you just feed yourself Right Wing talking Point Hyperbolic, unfactual destructive crap?

Well, I acquire info from a whole spectrum of sources... and can reference decades of life experience in the private sector dealing with bureaucrats in an array of countries. You know... the real world. Where government roadblocks make it easier for those who know the ropes. (That's the dirty secret... those that know the game or can pay to learn it can make huge cash... while the masses get shut out; the barrier to entry is too high, costly and unpredictable) Your government at work for the people ROTFLMFAO.

I was out and about learning the ways of the world without FOXNEWS or talk radio or internet. One didn't exist and the other was pretty much non-existent... and was non-existent for 9 to 10 months a year when I was overseas. Your excuse for ignorance is what exactly? Kanuckistani school system? Inbred dislike of America? Love for Trudeau? Inquiring minds want to know.

Perhaps it's all the al Jazeera you watch?
After all, FOXNEWS wasn't permitted by the Kanuckistani's but al Jazeera was. Seems the Go'ment knows it audience... eh Hosehead?

I know you Kanuckistani's very, very well... such an open minded group of drones.
So open minded Ann Coulter's speech was canceled.

Re: NKorea warns of war if punished for ship sinking

Originally Posted by Polynikes

I am starting to think this situation is much closer to war than previously realized. North Korea is cutting all ties to the South, the U.S and the South just planned war games, which is a huge provocation (and rightfully so.)

What makes this a provocation? War Games are common. China conducts war games, so does Taiwan... do those signify provocations? Of course not. The provocation is the DPRK's criminal sinking of a South Korean warship.

War on the Korean peninsula is really hinging on one SAM site operator acting without permission and shooting down a stray aircraft, 1 naval skirmish etc. This could get ugly quick.

Not likely, but as you say, someone who is NOT authorized to make a decision makes one or a quick, itchy trigger finger gets involved and things could spiral out of control before the policymakers can bring it back under control.... poof, World War III...

Re: NKorea warns of war if punished for ship sinking

Wait a minute here....Joint exercises as a show of strength is a "huge provocation"? What was sinking a ship killing 46? Business as normal?

The exercises are a provocation in a situation that is already very tense. I also said that it is appropriate. Please, don't ask me rhetorical questions. Obviously the sinking of the ship was a very provocative act worthy of a military response. I think you are misconstruing my position.

My jaw is hitting the desk here....NK sinks a ship, and all we should do is what? Send a letter? Can we type it in bold type so that Il knows we are really, really serious this time?

Again, I never said we shouldn't hold these exercises. I am in favor of a bold response by South Korea and the U.S. North Korea's irratic behavior must be put in check sometime before they make the assumption that they can get away with something more than hitting a ship with a torpedo.

"I hope we shall crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial by strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country." -Jefferson

Re: NKorea warns of war if punished for ship sinking

Originally Posted by ludahai

What makes this a provocation? War Games are common. China conducts war games, so does Taiwan... do those signify provocations? Of course not. The provocation is the DPRK's criminal sinking of a South Korean warship.

Not likely, but as you say, someone who is NOT authorized to make a decision makes one or a quick, itchy trigger finger gets involved and things could spiral out of control before the policymakers can bring it back under control.... poof, World War III...

Correct, war games are common. War games that are planned immediately after an incident like this are not. IF they had been planned prior then it isn't provocative.

I think you are misunderstanding my usage of provocative. I am not saying it is a bad thing. I don't think we are intentionally provoking North Korea in engaging the U.S or South Korea, but none the less our actions are provocative and are a measured response to their much more provocative actions against the South.

Why is it unlikely that an incident such as an unauthorized engagement could lead to war? Anyways, I'm not too focused on that example, my point was that things are very tense right now and if both sides don't act rationally, things could get bad very quick.

"I hope we shall crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial by strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country." -Jefferson

Re: NKorea warns of war if punished for ship sinking

I think a military strike on the port in which the submarine originated/most likely originated out of is an acceptable response.

The North has done something very clever that prevents tit-for-tat response like this though. They have devised the image of irrationality and that any response by the south or the U.S will lead to the North engaging in total war. They have tried to do the same with sanctions, saying that if they are imposed it is equivalent to an act of war.

Game theory in these situations often rely on having a logical and rational player on the other side. North Korea has thrown off policymakers and military planners alike by making themselves out to be very irrational. It is time we call their bluff, but we must first decide if the cost/benefit ratio favors us, which it almost certainly won't.

Last edited by Polynikes; 05-26-10 at 03:33 AM.

"I hope we shall crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial by strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country." -Jefferson