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I didn't read the link, but in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works for
IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!

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"Tim Greer" <> wrote in message
news:7oJ1l.3946$c%...
> +mrcakey wrote:
>
>> Unpatched major security error -
>>
>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7784908.stm
>>
>> Spread the word far and wide!!!
>>
>> +mrcakey
>
> I didn't read the link, but in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works for
> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
> OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?
> --

I was meaning to spread the word to friends and family rather than to the
alt.html community!

On 16 Dec 2008, Tim Greer <> wrote:
> +mrcakey wrote:
>
>> Unpatched major security error -
>>
>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7784908.stm
>>
>> Spread the word far and wide!!!
>>
>> +mrcakey
>
> I didn't read the link, but in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works for
> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
> OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?

Many people use both. I'm not saying they're right but it's a fact. Lots
of US citizens are Republicans, too.

BootNic Tue Dec 16, 2008 11:09 am
It is well known that "problem avoidance" is an important part of
problem solving. Instead of solving the problem you go upstream and
alter the system so that the problem does not occur in the first
place.
*Edward de Bono*

+mrcakey wrote:
> "Tim Greer" <> wrote in message
> news:7oJ1l.3946$c%...
>> +mrcakey wrote:
>>
>>> Unpatched major security error -
>>>
>>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7784908.stm
>>>
>>> Spread the word far and wide!!!
>>>
>>> +mrcakey
>>
>> I didn't read the link, but in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
>> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works
>> for
>> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
>> OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?
>> --
>
> I was meaning to spread the word to friends and family rather than to
> the alt.html community!
>
> Also, I still use OE. Can't get with Thunderbird.
>
> +mrcakey

I'm not talking about people in alt.html, I am genuinely wondering why
anyone online would use IE. There's no reason for it. While all
browsers have their histories of exploits, IE is and has always been
the top of the list. I understand the need to view sites in it for
development/design reasons, but why would someone use IE in this day
and age? As for OE and Thunderbird, there are dozens of email clients.
In this day and age, no one should be using OE either, unless you enjoy
living on the edge.

I'm unsure what issues you have with Thunderbird, but consider trying
some other's out. I mean, it's none of my business what browser and
email client use, so don't get me wrong, I'm only curious of why
someone would use either IE or EO in this day and age (honestly). I
suppose I actually do care a little, considering that when people's
systems are taken over and act as zombies in an organized attack on
networks and other systems, given enough it can create a source of a
large attack on the target, which is no fun and costs people money.
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!

Neredbojias wrote:
> On 16 Dec 2008, Tim Greer <> wrote:
>
>> +mrcakey wrote:
>>
>>> Unpatched major security error -
>>>
>>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7784908.stm
>>>
>>> Spread the word far and wide!!!
>>>
>>> +mrcakey
>>
>> I didn't read the link, but in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
>> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works
>> for
>> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
>> OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?
>
> Many people use both. I'm not saying they're right but it's a fact.

I know it's a fact. I repeat, "Why in this day and age would anyone use
IE or OE for actual web surfing or checking email"? Do you think it's
just continued ignorance, hubris, uncaring, or?
>
> Lots of US citizens are Republicans, too.
>

In article <7oJ1l.3946$c%>,
Tim Greer <> wrote:
> in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works for
> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
> OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?

In article <gi7qmg$na2$>,
"+mrcakey" <> wrote:
> "Tim Greer" <> wrote in message
> news:7oJ1l.3946$c%...
> > +mrcakey wrote:
> >
> >> Unpatched major security error -
> >>
> >> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7784908.stm
> >>
> >> Spread the word far and wide!!!
> >>
> >> +mrcakey
> >
> > I didn't read the link, but in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
> > anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works for
> > IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
> > OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?
> > --
>
> I was meaning to spread the word to friends and family rather than to the
> alt.html community!

I don't think so. If that was your only aim, you would email them. No,
you have bigger aims, to help alert the whole world! Don't underestimate
yourself! <g>

dorayme wrote:
> In article <7oJ1l.3946$c%>,
> Tim Greer <> wrote:
>
>> in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
>> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works
>> for
>> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
>> OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?
>
> You left out a "subscribers to this newsgroup" after "seriousness,"
>

I actually didn't. Most users of the Internet (home users that just
surf, buy, chat, whatever), know about the history of exploits in IE
and OE. This is why I wonder why anyone (and I mean anyone) in this
day and age would use either, but (yes), especially the people that do
work on their sites and are on a newsgroup.
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!

You don't know, seriously? You can research this to find out. It has
things to do with marketing, with bundling, with human herd behaviour,
with sales momentum... c'mon... you can't not have a single clue about
this? Just a mo... if you don't, maybe you are just the sort of person
that could fall for IE... by luck you have not?

dorayme wrote:
> In article <PNS1l.25249$>,
> Tim Greer <> wrote:
>
>> I am genuinely wondering why
>> anyone online would use IE.
>
> You don't know, seriously? You can research this to find out. It has
> things to do with marketing, with bundling, with human herd behaviour,
> with sales momentum... c'mon... you can't not have a single clue about
> this? Just a mo... if you don't, maybe you are just the sort of person
> that could fall for IE... by luck you have not?
>

Don't make more out of what I said, than what I said. I know "why"
people do by default and people that are new, and obviously MS has the
marketing money and bundles it with their OS, which is the most popular
platform. Still, people that have used the Internet for very long hear
about the exploits on the news and all over.

So, *to me*, it is surprising anyone still uses it in this day and age.
That doesn't mean I don't think people do or don't know why they do.
I'll make it more clear then. In this day and age, anyone that would
be emailed or otherwise notified about the IE exploits or find out on
their own, should not just be told about the exploit, but should be
encouraged to use a more secure alternative. You'd think they'd get
the idea or know better at that point. Perhaps that's more clear?
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!

Tim Greer wrote:
> dorayme wrote:
>
>> In article <PNS1l.25249$>,
>> Tim Greer <> wrote:
>>
>>> I am genuinely wondering why
>>> anyone online would use IE.
>>
>> You don't know, seriously? You can research this to find out. It has
>> things to do with marketing, with bundling, with human herd
>> behaviour, with sales momentum... c'mon... you can't not have a
>> single clue about this? Just a mo... if you don't, maybe you are just
>> the sort of person that could fall for IE... by luck you have not?
>>
>
> Don't make more out of what I said, than what I said. I know "why"
> people do by default and people that are new, and obviously MS has the
> marketing money and bundles it with their OS, which is the most
> popular
> platform. Still, people that have used the Internet for very long
> hear about the exploits on the news and all over.
>
> So, *to me*, it is surprising anyone still uses it in this day and
> age. That doesn't mean I don't think people do or don't know why they
> do.
> I'll make it more clear then. In this day and age, anyone that would
> be emailed or otherwise notified about the IE exploits or find out on
> their own, should not just be told about the exploit, but should be
> encouraged to use a more secure alternative. You'd think they'd get
> the idea or know better at that point. Perhaps that's more clear?

To add to the above, it just seemed unusual to need to notify people in
general on a news group. People that likely know, and people that
probably (hopefully) do use a more secure alternative. So, I was
genuine about in this day and age and wondering why anyone still uses
it. Considering that, it's surprising anyone would (*not to say I
don't know why people do*).
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!

In article <z9U1l.49186$>,
Tim Greer <> wrote:
> dorayme wrote:
>
> > In article <7oJ1l.3946$c%>,
> > Tim Greer <> wrote:
> >
> >> in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
> >> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works
> >> for
> >> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
> >> OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?
> >
> > You left out a "subscribers to this newsgroup" after "seriousness,"
> >
>
> I actually didn't.

Yes, I realised that from your very next post!
> Most users of the Internet (home users that just
> surf, buy, chat, whatever), know about the history of exploits in IE
> and OE.

I don't think so. Perhaps your circle of people or sources is different
to mine?

dorayme wrote:
> In article <z9U1l.49186$>,
> Tim Greer <> wrote:
>
>> dorayme wrote:
>>
>> > In article <7oJ1l.3946$c%>,
>> > Tim Greer <> wrote:
>> >
>> >> in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
>> >> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it
>> >> works for
>> >> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same
>> >> for OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE
>> >> or OE?
>> >
>> > You left out a "subscribers to this newsgroup" after "seriousness,"
>> >
>>
>> I actually didn't.
>
> Yes, I realised that from your very next post!
>
>> Most users of the Internet (home users that just
>> surf, buy, chat, whatever), know about the history of exploits in IE
>> and OE.
>
> I don't think so. Perhaps your circle of people or sources is
> different to mine?
>

That's certainly possible (I wasn't trying to be sarcastic). From the
very new user, young or old, if I help them with anything they ask me
to (and they do, even though that's not what I "do"), I set them up
with a different browser and email client. Most people don't care or
know when they are new and I explain if they want to know. I didn't
mean that I was going by any polling/survey, just in general from what
I've seen (and I don't mean the people I have helped when asked).
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!

Tim Greer wrote:
> +mrcakey wrote:
>
>> Unpatched major security error -
>>
>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7784908.stm
>>
>> Spread the word far and wide!!!
>>
>> +mrcakey
>
> I didn't read the link, but in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works for
> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
> OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?

The average user buys a PC with Windoze already installed. He or she
does not ave a clue how to run he system. They get IE and OE because
microsquish put them in the op system in order to put netscrape out of
business. So, they have a browser which they do not even know how to
configure, and of course it direct them to msn.com to get an account.
It is patently illegal but the anti-trust court was just as ignorant as
the average user. When MS said it had to put IE in the op system to
make it run faster, no one challenged them. Obviously IE is a separate
program activated by a call, but you would have to decompile windoze to
find it.

So about 90% of the users on the net have no idea how to get Firefox and
if they did, how to configure it. They do not think they need another
browser and most of them do not even know how to configure their email
or how it works. They call their ISP who tells them how to set it up
and that is it. Companies like Best Buy, make quite a bit of money with
their Geek Squad "fixing" peoples computers, which for the most part
involves a software problem or a virus infection. For the most part,
there are few hardware problems unless you buy a low end computer.

There was a letter in this months PC World where someone wondered why
the magazine said Thunderbird was a good email program, as he could not
get it to filter spam. Chances are the user does not know how to set up
the filter in the first place. He does not seem to realize that your
email program can not stop the spam, only filter it. If he wants to
stop spam he needs to set up his own site with is own mail server and
pay a good sum to do so.

In fact as far as I can determine, the average user does not even know
about USENET, they certainly would not be reading these alerts.

DLU wrote:
> Tim Greer wrote:
>> +mrcakey wrote:
>>
>>> Unpatched major security error -
>>>
>>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7784908.stm
>>>
>>> Spread the word far and wide!!!
>>>
>>> +mrcakey
>>
>> I didn't read the link, but in all seriousness, who still uses IE for
>> anything other than viewing their sites in IE to make sure it works
>> for
>> IE and then uses a different browser when surfing the web? Same for
>> OE, who uses OE these days, and why would anyone use either IE or OE?
>
> The average user buys a PC with Windoze already installed. He or she
> does not ave a clue how to run he system. They get IE and OE because
> microsquish put them in the op system in order to put netscrape out of
> business. So, they have a browser which they do not even know how to
> configure,

Sorry, I should have been more clear. I do know the "why". I more
meant the people that would see the notice, on usenet, or any forum
about web related material regarding HTML, webmastering, or anything
more involved like sys admin, programming, etc. even more so. It would
be nice if the stores selling the systems had some policy to offer the
user's a choice (maybe some do, I've not bought a system from a store
in 15 years and just build my own, so I could be wrong).
>
> In fact as far as I can determine, the average user does not even know
> about USENET, they certainly would not be reading these alerts.

In article <_HU1l.26443$>,
Tim Greer <> wrote:
> dorayme wrote:
>
> > In article <PNS1l.25249$>,
> > Tim Greer <> wrote:
> >
> >> I am genuinely wondering why
> >> anyone online would use IE.
> >
> > You don't know, seriously?
....
> >
>
> ...it is surprising anyone still uses it in this day and age.
> That doesn't mean I don't think people do or don't know why they do.
> I'll make it more clear then. In this day and age, anyone that would
> be emailed or otherwise notified about the IE exploits or find out on
> their own, should not just be told about the exploit, but should be
> encouraged to use a more secure alternative. You'd think they'd get
> the idea or know better at that point. Perhaps that's more clear?

What is clear is that all the reasons people do use IE exist, that it is
frustrating in many ways to others for various reasons, that IE works
pretty well for most things people do (otherwise they would probably not
use it so much) and, simply, many people know no better. Don't worry, I
share your frustration that the world is not a better place!

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