September 25, 2009

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Sen. John Ensign (R-Nev.) received a handwritten note Thursday from Joint Committee on Taxation Chief of Staff Tom Barthold confirming the penalty for failing to pay the up to $1,900 fee for not buying health insurance.

Violators could be charged with a misdemeanor and could face up to a year in jail or a $25,000 penalty, Barthold wrote on JCT letterhead. He signed it "Sincerely, Thomas A. Barthold."

So let me get this straight--If someone cannot afford health insurance they will be fined or could be sent to jail. Back to the 18th Century debtors prisons I guess--since we have been letting real criminals go for lack of jail space this just makes lots of sense!
Obamathink!

You are truely clueless Maritza. Why is it on there in the first place. I pay 210 dollars a week for my health-care. I DONT need ANYTHING from the government. They have their hands in our pockets enough as it is.

This admin is out of control. To FORCE ME to buy health insurance in their program, when I don't want it, and if I refuse, they will put me in JAIL?!?!?! What country is this, Iran? Russia? China? What happened to freedom of choice, I thought that was the liberal battle cry!

Spoken like a "True Marxist"..YOU WILL BE FINED OR JAILED. AH, THE NEW OBAMA ADM., RULING LIKE A GOOD REGIME(HIS BUDDY CHAVEZ COMES TO MIND) IN CONTROLLING IT'S CITIZENS.
WHAT'S NEXT? WE STAND IN LINE FOR FOOD? THIS MARXIST NEEDS TO BE IMPEACHED....PERIOD.

We don't have room in the jails now for "true" criminals. What a joke this legislation is. Just tweak the existing system with GOP suggestions and let's see what happens. This DemCare plan is going to really tank our economy. Make sure your mutual funds don't include health care companies because when 2013 comes around watch out.

What about the illegals- they win again- no health insurance- they get to go to the hospitals for free, no insurance-- they are illegal so they can not be fined or go to jail-- the politicians do not care- because they and their families do not pay for their benefits so they do not care about us-- they get theirs for free-- America wanted change- they got it- moral of the story--You are only protected if you are illegal or a politician

Why are we even sitting at the table with these leftists--get up and walk away. They are the ones who cried wolf (healthcare crisis) and we ASSUMED it was true. Are we going to let them do to the country what they have done to Medicare beneficiaries?

these penalties only apply if the fee one fails to pay is a TAX. Obama says it is not a tax. Either the Senate needs to get in line with the President or POTUS needs to admit that he intends to tax individuals down to the $66,000 level.

Regardless of what Obama calls it, the "mandate" payment is assessed under the Internal Revenue Code, which provides for possible jail time for unpaid taxes. I'm sure the Dems and Obama would like the assessment and collection of the "mandate" payment to occure outside of the Internal Revenue Code, but they would have legislate an entire new IRS to do so.

You know, Obama has this figured out. He knows how to give us the business. I mean, a great mind like his can't be put into a box. His his brain is producing all these wonderful ideas about everything. Shame on you if you doubt him, in all his splendor.

I think I'll let them put me in jail, that way they have to feed me, clothe me, give me healthcare, furnish all my medical needs.
How much will it cost to do this to 18 million "OUT OF WORK" taxpayers?? Somebody in Congress is thinking with their head up their ASS ! ! ! !

you will all blame obama for this despite the fact that the only reason anything like this is in the bill is to garner some sort of repub support because you are all afraid of the socialist nazi fascist public option.

yea right they could empty all jails and still wouldnt have room for those who cant afford insurance get real they cant fine you crap they would drive by a dead hooker and meth lab just to make the arrest

We need a Revolution in this country / world... These puppet politicians have 1 agenda via the UN / NWO... Wake up America before its too late... look at the G20 for a police state preview
WE THE PEOPLE
DON'T TREAD ON ME

These yahoo's have no idea of who they are dealing with. The American people that I know will not allow anyone to tell them that they must do something.
Or Constitution is built on what the government CAN DO. And our bill of rights is exactly that.
If this kenyan tells me that I MUST

Now stop and think abou this folks. The jails are already over crowded so do we turn the real crimminals loose to make room or do we get taxed to build another prison. And wait here is another if as I continually here the prisons are way to full of minorities who the hell do you think the majority of those that can not afford to buy insurance. This is the stupidest thing.

BY ACCEPTING THE OFFICE AND TITE OF PRESIDENT OF UN SECURITY COUNCIL WITHOUT PRIOR CONGRESSIONAL PUBLIC APROVAL!!!
WHAT IS OBAMA DOING?? WHILE HOLDING THE OFFICE OF PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, HE HAS ACCEPTED A TITLE AND OFFICE FROM A FOREIGN ENTITY (IE GROUP OF STATES)?? UNLESS HE AS ALREADY GOTTEN APPROVAL FROM CONGRESS IN SECRET, WHICH WOULD ALSO BE ILLEGAL, HE HAS JUST COMMITTED A HIGH CRIME IN FULL PUBLIC VIEW!! THE VIDEO OF HIS ACTIVITIES IN THAT POSITION WILL BE ENOUGH EVIDENCE TO PROVE HIS GUILT!! SINCE HE IS A CONSTITUTIONAL LAWYER, HE SHOULD KNOW BETTER THAN TO GO AROUND DOING ILLEGAL THINGS IN PUBLIC!! ONE WOULD THINK!! I MEAN, NO PRESIDENT HAS EER DONE THIS BECAUSE IT IS A DIRECT VIOLATION OF ARTICLE I SECTION 9!!....

I'm going to have Health Insurance for my family.... BUT
BUT
obozo and his cronies can kiss my asci code. The loons have invaded DC and the chief loon, not qualified to tend bar is at it.
I wonder if we could jail them for violating our constitutional rights if the pass that kind of BS?

That this is even considered in the USA is frightening! Think again, folks, about health care being provided in jail--you won't be sent to jail; you'll be sent to a gulag or a camp where you'll be left to die.

The numbers of people protesting this "plan" keeps rising every day yet more and more absurdities are being added to it. We mean nothing to these people. They do not care about healthcare. They just want control over the money so they can use it for other absurd programs while trashing us and our great country.

BTW FOLKS: Things like this leaking out on Obama/Hitler/Care,
is WHY THEY WANT TO RUSH THIS THRU,
SO NO ONE CAN SEE THE OTHER GOODIES
IN IT. NO WONDER THEY WON'T GIVE TIME TO READ IT-IT'S A RUSH, RUSH DEAL, TO CREATE CHAOS, THEN THEY WILL SPRING ALL THE "RULES" ON US AT A LATER TIME. FORGET THIS MARXIST- HE IS NOT GOING TO RULE MY LIFE OR MY FAMILY'S. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. HE THINKS HE'S KING-THE
LEMMINGS THAT VOTED THIS FRAUD IN,
SHOULD BE HAPPY NOW-"THEY ARE GOING
TO HAVE THEIR FREEDOMS ERODED AS WELL AS THE REST OF US WHO KNEW THIS RADICAL WAS NO GOOD FOR AMERICA, ALONG W/HIS RADICAL, COMMIE, SOCIALIST, TERRORIST BUDS.

Man what kind of Country are the Demarcates trying to turn our country into? This is now a police state! Hail Obama and the Demarcates. What a disgrace! Middle Class peoples get ready for more taxes and Jail time!
Rick Clay
rclay36@aol.com

All I can say is.. Hurry up 2010! Hopefully, ACORN won't have the power the Democrats were planning on giving them to "fix" the upcoming elections in their favor. Hopefully, Al Franken's election will have been one of the Dems last fixed elections. It's goodbye DEMS in 2010. That is, if we're still allowed to vote by then. By the way Obama, how's that "dictator wanna be" you supported in Honduras? Ya know, the guy who tried to ignore the fact that his term was up and that YOU support him for that? Obama is a Marxist, supports Marxists and they support him too (Chavez, Gidafi, etc.)

If you are going to force insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions then you have to force everyone (which would include the young and healthy) to buy health insurance. This just makes sense. This way, the young and healthy are paying to provide health care for those sick people under 65 who otherwise cant get coverage due to pre existing conditions. It's the moral thing to do.... and I can't imagine why those aged 18-35 who voted for Obama in such great numbers would object to this.

I truly suggest that everyone prepare for the worst. This is not going to get any better. Life as we have known it is ending. Freedoms are being taken away one by one. Our only hope is that the military stands by the people.

This fits the PLAN perfectly! In the nex few weeks there will be too many Wacky items added to count, and give everyone something to scream about. Then in the end, they'll take out all of this ridiculous stuff, and make all of these idiots think there was 'compromise' and 'bi-partisanship' to get the bill through. Americans have become complete lemmings and will be sooooooo happy we've been saved by this wonderful piece of legislation. WAKE-UP AMERICA!!!!!!

Lets get this straight. The new plan isn't going to cost us any money to add 30 million people but if you don't want it you have to pay $1900.
This is the biggest load of crap in the history of crap. My apologies to Al Gore for taking back the trophy.

"They could change all of this in the end."
The fact that the government is 'even thinking' of a punishment for a section of the economy in which it may 'regulate,(ensure free flow and regularity)' but not force or coerce is very Nationalist Socialist Party-ish ... 'nothing' in the Constitution allows for this ... ergo it is unconstitutional.
Yes, in the end this 'could' change, but do you even want to go there?

Why are we surprised. You forget, we work for Obama, not him for us. Are you people stupid? That's why we elected him, to tell us, please tell us where we've been wrong for 200 years... please Mr. President!

Bruce on the loose -
Think about this... There will be another ?Cheney? in the Whitehouse one day. How long do you want them to be in control of your healthcare? If you continue to promote government control of healthcare, that will be the situation.
Open your mind and THINK!

Many of us who did not vote for this commie knew what he was about before hand; just by being informed about his voting record in the senate & the company he kept. Shame on you for those of you who put him in office!

Does this or does this not prove that the left wing cooks are fascists? Does this or does this not PROVE that our government is NOT working for us anymore? 'WE THE PEOPLE' hereby state that 'WE THE PEOPLE' declare Independence from this Marxist regime of Nobama!

As it stands now I can't even afford basic H insurance coverage and our plan at work refused to cover me. I could only buy state sponsored insurance and it would cost as much as my rent a month which I cant afford. The last I heard the insurance payments would be the same for the Federal plan. If I cant afford the state insurance then I cant afford the Fed insurance. If I cant afford 500 to 600 a month for those plan then how can I afford to pay the $1900 fine. I have a clean record and worked since I was 15 and younger if you count yards and paper delivery. If this goes through though then I am a criminal simply because my job doesn't pay me enough to get H insurance. Since when has lower class = criminal?? I work and I refuse to go to the hospital or Dr. regardless how I feel because I can't pay for it. Now you will throw me in jail to??

Does that TAX OR JAIL deal include people who do not file taxes? like for instance unregistered/illegal aliens??
How do we go about billing the latin american governments $1,900 X 12 million for health care penalties??

BTW, if this passes and Obama signs it, this will mean Obama broke his promise not to raise middle class taxes....The fine is legally called an EXISE TAX in the bill...read and see! All of Barack Obama's campaign promises come with a VERY short expiration date. But don't get all wee weed up about it now!

FreedomRang: "If you drive, you must carry auto insurance. If you breathe, you must carry health insurance. I don't see the problem?"
Me neither. After all....
If you DON'T drive, you don't have to carry auto insurance. If you DON'T breathe, you don't have to carry health insurance.
The logic is air-tight ---if you're an Obamanoid,

Enemies of the Constitution have hijacked over most of our legislative and governement functions. They are a clear and present danger to our wealth and very health.
This uses brute force to prop up a failed system of medicine and lack of health.

This is a very dangerous period because Nationalization will still occur even without an overt government run insurance plan like this "public option" provision everyone keeps fixating on - everything else contained in the plan is just as dangerous and is not being discussed in any kind of a targeted manner.
Here are the core elements what will be contained in the ?health care reform compromise? after the so-called ?public option? is in all likelihood dropped; both the Bacus and Wyden-Bennett bill contain all of these items:
(a) Federal Regulation aka HEALTH CZAR/DEATH PANELS/RATIONING
(b) Employer/Individual Mandates aka NATIONAL HEALTH INSURANCE
(c) Government Subsidies aka MIDDLE CLASS MEDICAL WELFARE
With the Federal Government setting the rules, forcing everyone to participate, and is paying the bills for most of the middle class through subsidies how is this anything other than Nationalization?
And it?s clearly a government take-over of health care ? only the names are changed to make us feel better about the arrangement. Since the government will be controlling the market and setting the terms, health insurance companies will essentially quasi-governmental agencies that get to administer the plan. They will be controlled in the same manner as GM or CITIGROUP and will be private in name only.
The common thread in all of the so-called "compromise" or bi-partisan plans is the Individual Mandate to force people to buy government dictated health insurance. This needs to be the focus for conservatives now!

Justice Wm O Douglas would roll over in his grave. There is such a thing as freedom --- or at least there used to be. 2012 is the target --- a revolution to bring back the individual back to power. It is time to remember ... we do not violently dispose of anyone, but we do dispose .. and it begins in 2010 with midterms and finishes in 2012 .... this is bad, but the indoctrination in schools is worse. Shame used to be a societal tool for good, but now it is absent from the landscape. Be patient .... sanity can return.

Here are the core elements what will be contained in the ?health care reform compromise? after the so-called ?public option? is in all likelihood dropped; both the Bacus and Wyden-Bennett bill contain all of these items:
(a) Federal Regulation aka HEALTH CZAR/DEATH PANELS/RATIONING
(b) Employer/Individual Mandates aka NATIONAL HEALTH INSURANCE
(c) Government Subsidies aka MIDDLE CLASS MEDICAL WELFARE
With the Federal Government setting the rules, forcing everyone to participate, and is paying the bills for most of the middle class through subsidies how is this anything other than Nationalization?

It's things like this that let you know that Government is out of control.
It's ashame that any American would support these things. They also want to hide from seniors that 400- 800 billion dollars will be cut from Medicare. This is very Sad.
Obama doesn't walk on water liberals.

You better bring your union thug army with you Obama because we'll fight over this you disgusting Communist Piece of ****. I'm willing to die to protect my freedom. Are your thugs willing to die trying to take it?

Now Obama will gladly imprison those who don't comply with the King and Czar. This is just one good reason among TRILLIONS ($$,$$$,$$$,$$$,$$$ - money and expenses which the government has already proven they cannot be trusted with nor can they run a "trust fund" Social Security nor can they operate a "Cash for Clunkers" program and be accurate and timely and cost effective for the citizens of America). We must vote these failures and losers into retirement ASAP. Say NO to Obama-care since it is obvious that he doesn't really care about us and only wants more power and czars. We must not say hail to the Czar. We must stop these democrats and their evil plans.

We barely make it from paycheck to paycheck now and the feds want us to spend money we don't have to cover health care we won't need because we're going to starve to death trying to stay out of jail??? The gov't can go f itself.

you figure 40% of democrats will vote for whoever gets the nod. all they had to do was fool 11% of the rest. I am glad to say I was not fooled. I think the fools have come around and the toher 40% of dems will always be fools and can not think for themselves.

Life on the outside= work to pay for housing, food, medical and to pay for same for a bunch of people who dont want to work OR refuse to pay, get sent to jail and get all above for free without working.
coverage and to

Are all of the people on welfare going to go to jail? They certainly don't have $1900 to pay for a penalty.
Aren't our prisons already over-crowded? What if the 85% of Americans who're happy with their healthcare DON'T buy health insurance? What jails will hold 85% of our population?
We're have the majority, folks, so when are we going to take a stand against the politicians (our employees) who're trying to shove this down our throats?

"Live free or die"
I am really missing free market.
I have a feeling this government is pushing most of to the brink?
These people in our government created the collapse of our economy with the housing issue. And now they actually think that they know what the solution is by giving us more of the same.
God help us. Please.

Just whose fault is all this anyway? Look in the mirror people. It is "we the people" who have continued to send the same ones back to DC year after year after year. All the while they have been keeping us fat, dumb, and happy, while at the same time nailing us to the wall with endless streams of legislation that no one has taken the time to question.
Now, we are nearing the point of an awakening. We are now beginning to see the true extent of the train wreck that "more government" has gotten us into. 11 Trillion dollars of National Debt, not considering the 50 Trillion or so in unfunded obligations. We are really in a pickle, so to speak.
If the American electorate does not wake up and vote all these idiots out of office, well then, nothing will change.
It is up to us.

For all you "all are required to have car insurance" people out there. You are only required to carry auto-insurance to protect the other guy! And that is only if you own a car and want to drive on the public highways. Only those who have a lien on their car MUST purchase full-coverage. GET OVER IT! This is not comparing apples to apples!

How is this good for the American people? All we have here is another tax increase scheme that will destroy our existing health care system in the process of destroying our economy ever worse then he has. Obama and his schemes are not anything new. He is duplicating here what has failed in the rest of the world. I thought democrats where progressives Ha! Regressive is more the description. What Change did he mean in all his rhetoric?

Of course they won't put yuou in jail! It's the Chicago way- THREATEN you with Jail in order to extort your hard-earned money... It's called a protection racket- you know, the kind Obama taught to all those 'Community Organizers' he trained for ACORN and SEIU back in Chicago!
It's also called a 'Thugocracy', 'Kleptocracy' and a 'Plutochracy'... Look 'em up... I believe Websters has Obama's picture next to definition #1.

Knowing what people like Tim Giethner and Charlie Rangel and the seemingly endless list of cheats tried to get away with not paying, how could any of them even consider this? The law makers in this country truely believe they are above the law and have a different set of rules when compared to the commoners. We need to remove each and every one of them from office and elect individuals that are not millionares and know the plight of the common man. I invite any of the cheats to come to my door when I don't pay! We will have a lot to talk about.

Lolz. The only one's going to jail will be the bureaucrats and civil servants when US.gov goes out of business. Perhaps labor camps will be more suitable for them and their children. To hell with the State and their elites.

If it is in the final bill, the penalty is for those who can afford health insurance but choose not to get it. Those who can't afford insurance will be provided assistance. If there were no penalty, we end up with what we have now- us all paying for their bad choices. The only way we can get rid of rescission and denial for 'pre-existing conditions' is to make sure everyone is insured so that the risk is fully distributed.

Of course some of the people commenting here are about as deep as a dinner plate. Do you really think it is that cut and dry? If people can not afford to buy health insurance they would receive a waiver. Do you realize that a HUGE factor of rising health care costs are from uninsured people screwing everyone else over by going to county hospital ERs and ditching the bill? Of course an individual mandate would be terrible with the current system, but with a cheaper public option this is totally feasible and I am ok with it if we get the PO. I would much rather have a single payer system, but that will come soon enough.

Well comrades, it should be crystal clear by now, as if it wasn't before, the types of change Obama has in store for Amerika. Go ahead.. someone please reply with a comment about how he ISN'T a socialist. I could use a good laugh after this report.

It is funny how so many people are saying they won't let the government do this. Yes you will. You will go without a wimper. Just like the Medicare tax (amoung other things) they take out of your paycheck now (for which you receive no services), this will just be another payroll deduction that you can't do anything about. While you sit in your easy chair and click your remote cntrol all night, your freedoms and rights are being stolen from you and there is nothing you can do about it.

Thanks Obama. By not sign up Obama healthcare I get even more freebies. Free lunch, free housing, free cable TV and free healthcare. I'll be the first one to sign up to jail. In jail I am not driving I can save the earth from global warming. What a great country.

It is plausible considering the track record of the current administration, but I'm not 100% convinced this is true. I'm going to need to see this handwritten note first before I affirm this to be fact. Any chance of scanning and posting the note for us Politico?

This is similar to fines one must pay when encountering a police officer waiting to ticket you at the exit of violating an HOV highway. We pay taxes for these roads, yet we cannot use them unless we have 2 or more people in our car. This is a violation of my freedom to drive where I want, when I want, with whomever I want, even if that means only myself. People don't see that our freedoms have been being stripped from us since the moment we obtained them

But nobody complains about being forced to pay top dollar for half assed car insurance. As a lower middle class male i would be happy to pay for Medicare. I would rather pay government workers their rightful pay than a multi billion dollar insurance monopoly. The Medicare system exists and works. Don't be brainwashed by the media folks, do your homework!!

Just to make sure we're clear on this, everyone here is for the current practice of allowing people with pre-existing conditions to be denied insurance, yes? Fine if you are, but if not the only way that works is for insurance to be mandatory (otherwise of course people will wait til they get sick then sign up for insurance on the way to the hospital)
And to be consistent you also have to be against telling hospitals they have to treat people who show up at the ER without ability to pay.(because that's currently one of the things breaking the system)

I suggest that congress should read all legislation, then be they should be forced to take an examination and must pass with at least a C or they forfeit their seat. If they fail read the bill or to take the test they should pay a fine go to jail and forfeit their seat. My preference is both be applied.

We fine folks that don't have auto insurance....why not for health insurance? Do we care more about our cars or the collective health of our society?
Q: What is the penalty for not having auto insurance?
A: Failing to show proof of financial responsibility, meaning insurance coverage, is a violation of California Vehicle Code Section 16029. Violating this code could result in fines up to $500 plus penalties, impoundment of the vehicle and suspension of the driver's license. If the vehicle is impounded the owner will have to pay for all storage and tow charges as well.
The consequences can be far more serious if you are involved in an accident and do not have insurance. You may have to comply with the financial responsibility laws (SR22, SR22s, SR16) including having to pay for any injuries or damages from the accident out of your own pocket.
It is up to a judge to determine if imprisonment is an option. We hope not!
Being caught driving without car insurance is likely to cost you twice as much as what you would have spent for one year of auto insurance.

Its the thought that counts. Buy health insurance for some outragous price (there is no price control in the bill) Pay a fine and go to jail if you don't where health care is free.
Stupid stupid stupid. we elected these stupid clowns. They would be better off with lobotomys.

Now all of us REAL CITIZENS who have obeyed the law and aren't on welfare and actually WORK for a living will go to jail because we are not buying health insurance for the illegals and misfits? 1776 all over again!

Lock me up then, jackasses. I dare you. I work for a company that provides great healthcare and covers 100% of the cost; I opted out to help them save money.
I'll be damned if I let some dictator tell me that I have to have it.

Whether or not they could change this and taking it with a grain of salt is not the point, they actually have it in their mind to do it. You deluded American on the right the left have allowed the government to force you to wear seat belts or put children into "child safety seats" and use unleaded gas and keep a catalytic converter on your car. The government meddling in your choices, see the point. Pretty soon, if the speech is not conducive to a health lifestyle or the food, or the religion, or the associations. See where this is going. The only way we will get government out of our lives now is by pure brutal naked force.

Red, yellow, black or white, we are ALL precious in His sight. He loves us and only wants the best for us. We must submit ourselves to our dear leader's wishes so we can all hug trees and sing Kumbaya. Ummmmm, Ummmmm

I'm trying to figure out if the health care debate is a smokescreen for the attempt to eliminate Isreal, you know, "we were dealing with domestic issues and forgot about the middle east getting nukes".

No one is going to go to jail. The IRS will simply take it like they take all back taxes. Garnishments, levies on your house, tax sales, seizing your bank acounts, etc. Happens all the time.
The think is, those "taxpayers" who operate cash businesses are going to make out like bandits. The people who do side work for cash don't declare all their income. If they make $50,000 landscaping, they declare say $20,000. They are eligible for subsidies to pay this fine, AND get the free health insurance. These "working poor" know the system very well. They pass it down from father to son, mother to daughter. Heck, half of the most small towns in say Kentucky are on "disability". Like the guy who does my tree trimming. I pay him for a big job with a $1000 check. An hour later, my bank calls me to get my OK to cash the check for his wife, who is in the lobby. LOL You think he is reporting that $1000 on his tax return? HE gets free health care... and no fine.

Of course the penalty is jail. The penalty is a tax. The continued refusal to pay a tax is a crime punishable by a stint prison.
The power of government is coercion. That is why the constitution placed limits on government. Even a "benevolent" unlimited government is oppressive.
Welcome to the Obamanation.

So lemme get this straight... Since they cannot deny insurance based on pre-existing conditions. I can pay the fine up front, wait until I get actually sick, then get insurance in the warehouse and cancel it when I'm better. Hmmm.. compared to what I pay now this would end up being a discount! Liberials are so smart!

Under Stalin.. 75% of the inmates in the Soviet Gulags believed that if Uncle Joe just knew what was happening to the Russian people he would set things right.. keep dreaming Obama supporters.. the Dear One will set this right too, course you may spend half your life breaking rocks on a government road gang.

Great, so we can't afford health insurance and we get charged with a crime. We need to be very careful right now, our government is doing exactly what the Founding Fathers warned against -- getting out of control. What's next? Work camps?

"they could change all this"... All they (socialist democrats)have done is continualy present a moving target. They have mover versions of the bill floating around then Bill Clinton has mistresses. The solution to healthcare costs is simple: Tort reform, the ability to buy health insurance across state lines and the ability to manage your own ple and not be forced to pay for services you do not want and/or need.

To Obamamite-
Whether I can afford or not afford health insurance is not the point. It is not in the Fed Govts authority to order me to buy health insurance. Obama is a f5cking communist b5stard and he can go to f5cking h e l l. He is one sorry piece of ****.

There is a very simple method to their madness ... they want to disarm Americans, but they can't do it as easily as they'd like. So they try to criminalize everything possible. Criminal record=no firearms.

This must be what all those internment camps they are building in the US are for. No Health Care Criminals. Good news is that most prisoners have better healthcare than the typical employee benefits healthcare package. For example dental, most company plans have horrible or no dental plan. Prisoners have great dental care.
This is an OBAMINATION!
Scream out loud that this is socialisim worse than the Nazi's or Stallin every dreamed up.
Fairly clear to me that Obummer and the rest of the democrats are actually communists at heart.
Just remember, this health care is only for us lowly comrades. Congress and the Prez all get gold plated healthcare from the governement for free for life. These plans won't impact them at all.

It is unamusing how history constantly repeats itself. Our country is being re-made by a drug addict without portfolio proffered by bra-burning, abortion dropping hairy armpited femin-nazis and limp wristed fudge-packers that look forward to bending over facing the east so they can have their rectums aired by Islamists that make repubs look like choir-boy's!

Attn. Bureaucrats:
Please quit meddling in the lives of private citizens. Fix healthcare problems with YOUR MONEY, and keep your hands out of our pockets!
If you would like to contribute YOUR MONEY to help someone without insurance, then by all means, go ahead and do so. But, don't use the FORCE OF LAW to "extort" money out of the free citizens of this country.
The things you are foisting on America are REVOLUTIONARY.

Let those dirty **********s try to fine me! BRING IT ON!! I dont have insurance, I dont need Insurance, I dont want Insurance, and guess what ......IM NOT GONNA PAY FOR YOUR INSURANCE!! IF you come for me you better come HEAVY; STACK EM DEEP.

why on earth did Congress and the President have such an urgency to get this plan done - it is not supposed to go in effect until 2013 - the rush was so all these unacceptable "minor" additions to the bill would slip through the cracks - the more Congress talks the more "we the people" learn. After all this plan is not supposed to kick in until 2013 after Obama has gotten his amnesty bill passed - and then - EVERYONE WHO IS ILLEGAL RIGHT NOW WILL BE LEGAL AND WILL GET HEALTH CARE INSURANCE. In the meantime the fines, fees, whatever could be figured into the magically computed cost of health care - numbers do not lie - unless they are prepared by the Dems and Congress.
Obama voters - "we the people" hope you are the first ones to get fined and put in jail.

I hope all you real smart college kids and Acorn voters who voted Obama in are happy that you are putting your parents and your families in the hands of a communist.....do you feel proud yet of the "change" you voted for?
Will you praise Obama while your families go broke, your parents lose their jobs and homes, and even better yet...go to jail because they can't afford Fuhrer Obama's health care?
Happy now?

FreedomRang you are not very bright. Your logic, though simple, is severly flawed. I am not responsible to you (fellow citizen) if I break my arm, and vice versa. Carrying liability insurance on your vehicle and having life insurance on yourself are two completely different agendas! Go educate yourself...if not, then fall in line. You will be one of Obama's favorite followers. Dumb, blind, and in line!

If young healthy people gamble by not getting health insureance and then get a pre-existing condition they should have to pay for their health care themselves. IF the government would get out of the health insurenace market then insureance companies could offer health insureance policies that meet the needs of the healthy (ie high deductibles and only catastrophic coerage), which would be cheaper. Let the market handle this. Health care is a service, not a right.

Hmmm... this would seem to violate the 1st amendment, e.g., freedom of religion. There are some religious sects out there which regard insurance as a lack of faith. So if your religious views prohibit you from purchasing insurance, then, the government fines you for it... there could be a big constitutional problem there.

I feel the same way most of you feel. The worst part about this whole thing is there is a shortage of ammo in the country. So these !@#holes are ramming this thing through precisely when the public is not armed to the teeth. If they would wait a year, they would be scared to do this because then the citizens would be armed. Owning guns won't be illegal, but owning ammo will be. At least the police can't shoot staight. I've seen the target practice they've done, ****ty!!!

Wow. The sheer brute arrogance of these creatures inhabiting our government astounds me. They claim radio talk show hosts are fmomenting violence in people? It's this government ITSELF that is stoking violent sensibilities in its people with these draconian laws they are passing. They are pushing the envelope and people are right on the verge of pushing back.

This is corporate welfare for the insurance industry written by their lobbyists. Catastrophic health insurance, such as the $2 million excess major medical policy offered by the American Bar Endowment to ABA members, would not qualify because of the high deductibles of $10,000 to $50,000. I pay my own doctor bills and carry the ABE insurance with a $15,000 deductible for unexpected, catastrophic conditions, at a cost of only about $600 per person per year. Under Obamacare, I would not be allowed to self-insure up to $15,000, although I do so on my home and auto insurance. I would have to pay a fine or buy an expensive, low deductible policy that probably would not even cover my anticipated doctor bills.
Like many Republicans disgusted with McCain, Bush and their open borders policy, I sat out the last election, but I will gladly work for the crooks, hacks and RINOs the Republicans run in all elections until the tyrannical Obama regime is ousted. A taste of Afro-Indonesian communism makes Republican corruption seem trivial.

They won't send you to jail, they'll just attach your tax returns or wages and property to get the money. Since you will have a criminal record, employers will be "incentivised" not to hire you. In the end you will either live like a hobo or capitulate...

That will stimulate the economy. Let see, first they will need more jails, that will boost the construction industry, then they will need more security people, amd cooks and adminestrative people to man the jails, and more trucks to bring the prisioners in and the best part all us inmates will recieve free health care. Is this a great country or what?

Folks this is just too much. Allow state to state selling for insurance and start there.
If Barry and company feel so confident they can save so much by finding corruption in Medicare/Medicaid then prove to us you can do it before we hand over our private health care.

Bleah, bleah, bleah "That's all folk's!!!" No doubt "Oduma" (and you thought Carter was an idiot ???) will look the other way while Israel has no choice, but to defend it's self. After words to condem Israel for it's audacity to not let it's people get blown off the map! Next, because of his (Obama's) inability or unwillingness to stand up for what's right ! The American people, will suffer extremly high (and you thought, 4.85 A GALLON WAS BAD!!!) gas prices. So as to further his administrations efforts to kill this country's economy. If the worst thing that comes out of this "one term wonder" (yeah, that's right one term, shades of Carter here! Bet a lotta of you are "wondering" why you voted for this twit by now !!!) Is an extra $ 2k outta pocket , we should count are selves lucky !!! But, how many of you have felt "lucky" lately ???

5000 years ago God said to Moses"gather thy picks and shovels, mount thy camels and asses we are going to the promise land. 5000 years later Obama is smoking Camels,importing our picks and shovels,kicking our asses and stealing the homeland.

We have lost our country. Bush set the stage for this whack job so called President. It is obvious that he hates our country.He is doing everything possible to destroy us. I think he will get his wish. Bye-bye USA.

Hey libs, Merry Christmas! This includes you! Finally you can be useful to society. Your new careers as Bubba's b*tches, brought to you by your Messiah!!!! A career that is oh so deserved! Now be good little libs, grab your ankles and smile!

Marcy Harris - So let me get this straight--If someone cannot afford health insurance they will be fined or could be sent to jail.
---------
Marcy,
No, No, No. If you can't afford health insurance you can 'choose' the government plan.
if you opt to go without insurance THEN you will be fined. If you cannot (or will not) pay the fine, THEEENNNNNN you could face jail time.
See ... it's not as bad as you think.
/sarcasm off

Posted By: bow down before the Teleprompter-in-Chief | September 25, 2009 at 03:54 PM

If you drive, you must carry auto insurance. If you breathe, you must carry health insurance. I don't see the problem?
Posted By: FreedomRang | September 25, 2009 at 03:03 PM ---------------I live in New Hampshire,THE LIVE FREE OR DIE state, where we have a CHOICE to have auto insurance or NOT, so I guess I would have a BIG problem with it

"you will all blame obama for this despite the fact that the only reason anything like this is in the bill is to garner some sort of repub support because you are all afraid of the socialist nazi fascist public option."
wow... this shows just how out of touch the left is. Who is going to pay for the public option? This is in the bill because they have to pay for it. If you provide incentive like fines or jail time people will pay for the same reason they pay all of the other taxes Uncle Sam has heeped on us. And for my second point... why does Obama need Republican support? He owns both houses if this so called public option is the best for us all why not just pass it and really show the Republicans up by taking all the credit when it succeeds like Social Security or Medicare. (no one will notice that we are bankrupt just like with social security and medicare)

I think the people here like to get riled up because they have nothing else going on in their lives. I really do. (And I'm sure they thought the same thing about me when I was going to protests over the war.)
There's a lot of confusion people are just feeding into:
1) Illegal immigrants aren't going to be given health care under the plan (although, the 'hero', Joe Wilson previously voted for it http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/11/joe-wilson-voted-to-provi_n_284034.html)
2) You won't be required to dump your coverage for the Public Option (if there even is one)
3) Those without insurance because they don't have the money will be given assistance.
4) Those who don't get insurance, though they can afford it, cost all of us money because of their bad choice.
5) THE ONLY WAY TO MAKE PRE-EXISTING CONDITIONS A THING OF THE PAST IS TO MAKE SURE EVERYONE IS COVERED.
For anyone thinking that this equals fascism or nazism, they need to read up on history (as well as Godwin's Law). Every other rich developed country has some form of universal healthcare except for us.

You really want things to change? Then quit paying your taxes all together, everyone, right now! Money is what pits us working folks against each other. Money that is not even issued by our own government!!

You really want things to change? Then quit paying your taxes all together, everyone, right now! Money is what pits us working folks against each other. Money that is not even issued by our own government!!

To people assuming there will be waivers how do you know? Who will decide what qualifies for waivers? There are not waivers for car insurance. When will the price come down for basic plans? What will the income cut off be. These are all things that should be decided before this bill goes through. You dont ask and answer the questions after you approve the bill. You figure them out first. I am sorry but I am not just going to assume us lower class will have waivers instead of jail time.