If he's tight, then you can fold the turn as he won't be betting with worse there.
If he's laggro / prone to overplaying his hand, then that board runout means you're only behind AK and AA. TT and 88 have been counterfeited by this river.

#3

27th June 2016, 3:49 PM

roygor [41]

Poker at: fulltilt

Game: ALL

I would have call, I Think you were better.

hope you won

#4

27th June 2016, 6:46 PM

John A [4,093]

As Tim said, it totally depends on your opponent. He 3-bet your UTG raise from Mp, so that's as strong as it can get in terms of a 3-bet range (w/o history). I think JJ would have to slow down at some point, so you can probably find a turn or river fold, but only if he's a reasonable opponent.

#5

28th June 2016, 1:49 PM

rhombus [2,379]

Game: NL/PLO/PLO8

re: Poker & $10 NLHE 6-max: Can you fold at any point?

Sorry forgot to post the stats
he was 23/23 3B23.1 AG40% after 31 hands

#6

29th June 2016, 12:25 AM

John A [4,093]

That's a high 3-bet even though it's a small sample. He could just be a pre-flop donk and can have a lot of SC's now in his range even though he should be more selective against an UTG opener. It basically polarizes him to bluff or AA/AK though. I don't think JJ is shoving often on there. And you block some of his AQ 3-bet hands. So it's close enough where call/fold doesn't matter too much.

#7

29th June 2016, 2:43 AM

Nutcracker69 [693]

Unless your gut tells you otherwise, you find a fold on the flop. On the flop, you only hold the 5th best option, if we are generous and lump in KK along with "any king". As the coaches have pointed out, the runout makes it unique since you now know he definitely didn't have KK and if had two of the other flops that crushed you 88 and TT you just rivered him.

The only time I'd find myself in an all in river showdown would be 1 of 2 reasons. Like I said, I'm going with gut/instinct over gameplay since he is indicating that he has you beat and only does that when he DOES have you beat or when he is bluffing like he does. Plenty of other spots to not have to have such a tough decision against such a polarized range. The 2nd reason is a SERIOUS leak in my current game since I've returned to online poker in the last year. I will sometimes call it all the way down for information. I used to do this back in the day all the time and it was very profitable in the long run because even when you're opponent tried to use the information he just provided to alter his tactics it was pretty obvious. Nowadays, though, I'd find myself calling for information. No matter the outcome, whether he did win with AA AK or I won with anything else, I wrongly assume that I have learned something about this player. Next thing I know he's shoving all in with the nuts and getting a call and with air, getting a fold and showing to piss me off. It's as though the information I just paid for ended up working in HIS favor instead of my own.

#8

29th June 2016, 8:35 AM

nkat [138]

I pretty much never fold flop. <1%.

Difficult to fold turn given draws.. but such a bad card to barrel.. most know this.

Once you call the turn you may be able to find a fold on the river given small amount of reads. You have it 25% of the time? Against a standard tag.. i dont think so. Against a lag.. maybe

#9

29th June 2016, 6:37 PM

rhombus [2,379]

Game: NL/PLO/PLO8

Quote:

Originally Posted by John A

That's a high 3-bet even though it's a small sample. He could just be a pre-flop donk and can have a lot of SC's now in his range even though he should be more selective against an UTG opener. It basically polarizes him to bluff or AA/AK though. I don't think JJ is shoving often on there. And you block some of his AQ 3-bet hands. So it's close enough where call/fold doesn't matter too much.

guess it was just one of those times when the aggro player actually had it. I called and he flipped over AK for quads

#10

29th June 2016, 11:30 PM

John A [4,093]

re: Poker & $10 NLHE 6-max: Can you fold at any point?

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhombus

guess it was just one of those times when the aggro player actually had it. I called and he flipped over AK for quads

For sure. It was the perfect setup for him. I don't think it was a horrible call for the price if that helps.

#11

1st July 2016, 9:01 AM

BPEPFPDP [141]

i think the main info goes from preflop action, with these raise, again situation which strong depends what kind of player vs you, so terrible cards comes on postflop, you decide call, 'cause stats give info he is agressive, and saw AK, yeah it happens/, so the question was 'can you fold at any point?' i'd say no and just call, like you did, i think it's not bad call.

#12

1st July 2016, 10:46 AM

jwlaw35 [67]

Online Poker at: ACR

Game: Holdem and 7

The flop here would have had me fold in 'most' moods lol another reason you have to watch your roll.. AK is so overplayed.

#13

1st July 2016, 12:16 PM

MinhANguyen [695]

Think turn is a fold... I doubt opponents would really barrel for value with worse here. Underpairs check back, AA checks back a high frequency, and if he had air he's most likely giving up because the K on the turn is a bad card to barrel at. From your point of view, it's less likely he has one since another appeared. That is very true. But when he barrels the turn, his range is heavily skewed toward Kx. His range OTT is very different from his turn betting range. I think this is an important concept that people miss a lot. Also, not calling with QQ here because we block QJs/AQ (the most likely bluffing hands) that would double barrel.