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Author
Topic: girl or guy (Read 8014 times)

OK, had another conversation with straight friends today about whether I'm the man or the woman in a relationship. I adore these people and I'm glad they finally feel comfortable enough to ask me specifics, but this gets tiring. They are friends with "gays" from their places of employment. They thought I'd really like to meet one of their "friends". The first thing Donny says to me is; "he's an attorney and comes from money". That doesn't impress me much. I mean come on, tell me about him and I might consider. Then Carly tells me he's a bit of a flamer who always demands his way. OK, I'm really interested.....not

Then the conversation moved to which role I play in a relationship. I partially made them see the flaws in their beliefs. I thought we progressed past that. I want an equal man, someone who compliments, not detracts. I want an equal, not someone who fits a role.

Straight people, please don't try too hard to fix me up with your lonely, successful, and rich friends. They're single and unattached for a reason.

I've caught straight mates of mine having that kind of conversation about lesbian couples as well. It's annoying, I agree. You should hear the scathing remarks my favourite bartender comes out with when someone asks him if he's the man or the woman in a relationship. I wish I could remember some of them verbatim, they're hilarious and make the point very well.

I suppose it might be worth pointing out that this sort of straight confusion is a throwback to the days when gay or lesbian couples used to use straight couple stereotypes as a means of flying under the radar. If one could pass for a man (in a lesbian couple) or a woman (in a gay couple) out in public, they could pass as a straight couple and not draw negative attention to themselves. If I recall correctly from my reading of GLBT history, lesbians were historically a bit more successful in this type of endeavour.

As for people trying to fix you up with their mates, you got it exactly right - they're single for a reason. Annoying as hell.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Thanks Ann. Kinda been thinking about this quite often today. It almost equates within our own culture. Top v's bottom kinda thingy. Maybe my friends think the pokee is always the "girl" and they are basically asking which way I like it? I'd never last with a man who always wanted it one way or the other.

Perhaps I should let this guy take me out on an expensive date, explaining that I like playing the "girl" role. And if he's butt assed ugly, a girl doesn't have to put out.

Wolfie , I used to tell co-workers that ask me that question, and I would always tell them, I'm a gay manand there is NO man or woman in my relationship, were both gay men, and then, they would just scratch their heads and walk away in confusion

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

The few times I had to hire workers for things I couldn't do, after a few days they would figure out that we were a gay couple. Eventually they all asked, "Who does the cooking?" We knew exactly what they were thinking, in their minds whomever does the cooking is the woman. You could see the wheels turn in their heads when we told them we took turns......Have fun with stupid questions.

OK, had another conversation with straight friends today about whether I'm the man or the woman in a relationship. I adore these people and I'm glad they finally feel comfortable enough to ask me specifics, but this gets tiring. They are friends with "gays" from their places of employment. They thought I'd really like to meet one of their "friends". The first thing Donny says to me is; "he's an attorney and comes from money". That doesn't impress me much. I mean come on, tell me about him and I might consider. Then Carly tells me he's a bit of a flamer who always demands his way. OK, I'm really interested.....not

Then the conversation moved to which role I play in a relationship. I partially made them see the flaws in their beliefs. I thought we progressed past that. I want an equal man, someone who compliments, not detracts. I want an equal, not someone who fits a role.

Straight people, please don't try too hard to fix me up with your lonely, successful, and rich friends. They're single and unattached for a reason.

However, consider this. Sounds like you pre-judge people as much as they do, if you look at your post in a different light. Personally I don't have many "deal breakers" but seems like you have a few!!

You were getting this information 2nd hand, about the guy, from square straight friends to boot. While being an attorney may NOT impress you, what would be the problem meeting an attorney? Same thing for a "flamer". That's what straights said about him. Maybe they say you are a flamer too. Or something equally dumb. Ok maybe he is a "flamer". Never dated a flamer? Why not? Just not your style?

"Straight people, please don't try too hard to fix me up with your lonely, successful, and rich friends. They're single and unattached for a reason. "

Im just playing devils advocate, but really, the last sentence?? Its pretty harsh on someone you don't even know. Are you single and unattached? But your "reason" is OK and the ones you assume for this guys are objectionable?

Just saying, I wouldn't mind some of my friends trying to fix me up. Yeah sometimes you just "know" its not a match, but there are plenty of surprises so it often pays to give it a go, at least when someone shows interest. I ended up with unlikely boyfriends in life, and also some unlikely friends, and lovers.

Keep an open mind, dear, the last thing we "gays" need is to continue this trend of mounting criteria and deal breakers about who can or cannot be a possible lover or partner.

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“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

I think Wolfie's point, oh (single) preachy one, is that it is a bit annoying, and presumptious, for a straight person to want to "match up" their gay friends - usually because they have one thing in common -- they are gay. Being gay isn't a reason to go out on a date with someone. Even worse -- a blind date. I suspect (and Wolfie please correct me if I'm wrong) he was more upset about THAT than the fact that he was a rich, lawyer.

Boy, you single men are a strange lot, you simply cannot come off as being desperate, you might SCARE them away, and your never gonna find a man, with that type of behavior, don't you single queers know how to play hard-to-get

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

I respect you all's opinions. That's what I love about being here. Perhaps I was wrong in some of my initial thoughts. I just don't need fixed up. I'm single by circumstances. I have the confidence again that I don't just need/want any man. I'll wait for the right one. I assume I'll know again once I see it.

Zactly,Wolfie most men like a good challenge, if you don't give them one, they will probably loose interest in you very FAST, make them work for it, if they are interested in you, they will continue to be, if they aren't there is always other fish in the fish sea......

I never had a problem finding a BF, and never remained single for very long, I was the type of guy that would say," I'll do it, when I wanna do it, NOT when you want me to " that was how I did it

« Last Edit: January 11, 2012, 10:25:39 AM by denb45 »

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

I've had a while to consider some of the comments and also evaluate my thoughts. I guess a lot of my issues stemmed from my friends' beliefs and comments regarding what I would find attractive or am looking for in a relationship. Why lead with the attorney comment. I've witnessed straight people doing this in the dating world too. I hear them talking about someone who has a great job, nice house, expensive car and etc... I read into this that they think I might be interested in external aspects rather than the person.

Why not mention positive attributes that might be beneficial and put the person in a positive light. IE...I have a charming friend that you might like to meet. He is funny, easy going and has an awesome personality.

I'll also retract the statement about him being single for a reason. That was a bit harsh and judgmental. Perhaps he is that awesome guy who is also waiting for right person instead of settling for someone who is impressed with his external assets?

And I will probably never consider dating another "flamer". I dated a guy a long, long time ago who fit this role perfectly. Perfectly masculine in private, but felt a need to scream "faggot" by his actions when out in public. Not a judgment call as much as my own personal tastes. Let them flame away, I'm just not fanning the fires with them. I don't think I have ever been considered a flamer, but have been told I have some effeminate traits. Whatever that is. I'm as comfortable with a sewing machine as I am with a floor jack. I can make you a nice pair of lined drapes or replace your transmission.

I've seen stuff like this in the work place as well. Introduce the new black guy to the black secretary... The thought process seems to be they should hit it off extremely well simply by being the same race.

Personally, I think introductions should be based soley on tit and ass size.

I've seen stuff like this in the work place as well. Introduce the new black guy to the black secretary... The thought process seems to be they should hit it off extremely well simply by being the same race.

Personally, I think introductions should be based soley on tit and ass size.

I've seen stuff like this in the work place as well. Introduce the new black guy to the black secretary... The thought process seems to be they should hit it off extremely well simply by being the same race.

Personally, I think introductions should be based soley on tit and ass size.

I always hated that when employers always did that to me, 'oh just put Dennis with all the black or Latino workers, to me that was kinda tride for them to even think that way

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

I've seen stuff like this in the work place as well. Introduce the new black guy to the black secretary... The thought process seems to be they should hit it off extremely well simply by being the same race.

Personally, I think introductions should be based soley on tit and ass size.

Yes if only my friends would include cock size in their selling points...

Logged

“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

OK, had another conversation with straight friends today about whether I'm the man or the woman in a relationship. I adore these people and I'm glad they finally feel comfortable enough to ask me specifics, but this gets tiring. They are friends with "gays" from their places of employment. They thought I'd really like to meet one of their "friends". The first thing Donny says to me is; "he's an attorney and comes from money". That doesn't impress me much. I mean come on, tell me about him and I might consider. Then Carly tells me he's a bit of a flamer who always demands his way. OK, I'm really interested.....not

Maybe they simply care enough about you and even while misguided are simply trying to help. It's not just the action, it's the intent. I think what they did was endearing. You cannot expect straight folks to understand the rules of gay dating, when even gays do not.

Oh Joe -- I don't see this as confusion on the rules of gay dating (not sure what those are exactly...). I see this as a, "your gay, he's gay -- you two should go out" no real reason to connect except the gay part. They may have meant well, but it is frustratingly demeaning to assume all one gay man needs in another is that he is gay. Now, I wasn't there, don't know the people, so I am completely open to being wrong, but that is how I read this.As I said, I was never a fan of the "set up" at any rate. Fortunately, I haven't had to date in a long time.......

...Zactly,Wolfie most men like a good challenge, if you don't give them one, they will probably loose interest in you very FAST, make them work for it, if they are interested in you, they will continue to be, if they aren't there is always other fish in the fish sea.........

If everyone took your advice about playing hard-to-get, then no one would ever get together. This never made any sense to me. How do you determine who should pursue whom? That sounds similar to the question "who is the man, and who is the woman"?

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"Life in Lubbock, Texas, taught me two things: One is that God loves you and you're going to burn in hell. The other is that sex is the most awful, filthy thing on earth and you should save it for someone you love." - Butch Hancock, Musician, The Flatlanders

If everyone took your advice about playing hard-to-get, then no one would ever get together. This never made any sense to me. How do you determine who should pursue whom? That sounds similar to the question "who is the man, and who is the woman"?

Herny, it's different for everyone, I never really had to try to pursue anyone , they always pursued me, if I wanted to get involed with them I did, if not I didn't, it was always my choice and mine to make, did I play hard to get YES almost all the time, did it always work, not always, but most of time it did, were all diferent and we all like different things about someone, if you both like a lot of things about each other it's doable, always has been that way for me, I cannot really speak for anyone else, but myself

« Last Edit: January 11, 2012, 08:49:44 PM by denb45 »

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

As I said, I was never a fan of the "set up" at any rate. Fortunately, I haven't had to date in a long time.......

Mike

gotta agree with you there mike, I haven't dated in well over 18 yrs. I probably wouldn't even know how to anymore, what worked for me back then really doesn't apply now-a-days, and I'm being honest here, all I'd probably get now would be STDs and anal-warts, not to mention the fact that I'm well into my 50s

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

beat's the hell outta me Joe, I'm 55 yrs old, have been with the same man for 18 yrs. most of the posters in here are 10 to 15 yrs younger than me, and most of them aren't even in a LTR, so they couldn't possibly understand any of this, so guess I'm not really qualified to give dating advice

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

Being set up can suck. Until it doesnt. Playing hard to get has its value. Until it doesnt.

At least the friends were thinking about your happiness, no matter how clumsily.

And you might give that successful guy a go. Maybe its only the straights who think hes a "flamer". Who knows, if he does turn out worth pursuing, than the success and the money is just a cherry on the cake.

I dont think success or money is a deal breaker per se. If the person has a heart and floats your boat, job and/or financial stability is good thing, isn't it?

I appreciate your walk back on that last point.

Hey anyway, if you are happy single and just content to see who crosses your path naturally, that's fine and dandy too!

« Last Edit: January 11, 2012, 10:14:01 PM by mecch »

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“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

...At least the friends were thinking about your happiness, no matter how clumsily. ...

Wolfie, I think this is ultimately what you need to think about: do you think your friends had your happiness in mind, or are they uncaring buffoons? Chance are it's the former, and they just a little clumsy in their approach to helping you.

One more thing to think about. A date with a rich, successful, single guy doesn't sound so bad. It just depends on how active you want to be in your search for a partner / mate. But the more people you meet, the better the likelihood of you finding a good match.

Now finish your white zin, and go to sleep!

Cheers,

Henry

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"Life in Lubbock, Texas, taught me two things: One is that God loves you and you're going to burn in hell. The other is that sex is the most awful, filthy thing on earth and you should save it for someone you love." - Butch Hancock, Musician, The Flatlanders

Thanks guys for the valid points. I do KNOW that my friends truly care for me and only are wishing the best for me. Perhaps my initial reactionary attitude needs reevaluated.

I never stated that wealth and success were a deal breaker. That would be ridiculous. I just don't think that's as important as the character of the person. Bill became very successful in his career but that wouldn't have mattered in the long term success of our relationship.

I'm neither happy or unhappy being single. I just never envisioned finding love again, especially at my age. Hopefully I stop doing that comparison thing soon. I have reached that point where I want to find another person to spend my life with. I truly enjoyed coming home to a person that I was in love with. I enjoyed all that being a couple afforded us.

I've agreed to attend their next get together instead of a date per se. He has a weekend home here at the lake and regularly has groups of friends over. The worst that can happen is that I develop some great friendships. I also think it's awesome my straight friends are so closely involved with them all.

I never went for the "flamer" or "super-butch" types of gay men , I always thought that those types were too extreme for my taste in men, however I did love men that were in-the-middle, and well rounded, it's all about attitude & personality for me, I never cared if a man was rich, poor or middle-class, never cared what he drove, or where he lived or what he wore, no bodies perfect, were flawed in one way or another, and were all different, and to me that is what makes life interesting

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

This thread is a clusterfuck of bad relationship advice. Everyone is different and everyone has a different set of rules and dealbreakers unique unto themselves. It is the very idiosyncratic nature of human beings that makes person A like person B but not person C. Whether this be financial security, good looks, great personality, or just a nature that is complimentary to your own, what could one date hurt anybody? I try not to prejudge or snap judge anyone, but after a date you can usually tell if you're interested or not. Wolfie my advice is to maybe take the date and then be honest with the guy if you're not interest, no harm no foul.

I have a guy I want to set you up with. Now, he is in the closet. I hope that doesn't bother you. He also still lives with his mother. He gets pets and they all seem to end up dead. I'm not sure what that's about and whether I should call the Humane Society. But, he has an awesome personality. Sometimes, he has more than one personality. But, it would be like being in an open relationship and you would still be monogamous.

Awful first dates are kinda funny a few days later. Unless it was with a serial killer. I have been on some where we both realised about an hour into it that its an awfully bad match and we laughed. That's often quite the relief. The worst is meeting some anal retentive type who plays games or doesn't show much of his humanity.

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“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

I have a guy I want to set you up with. Now, he is in the closet. I hope that doesn't bother you. He also still lives with his mother. He gets pets and they all seem to end up dead. I'm not sure what that's about and whether I should call the Humane Society. But, he has an awesome personality. Sometimes, he has more than one personality. But, it would be like being in an open relationship and you would still be monogamous.

I have a guy I want to set you up with. Now, he is in the closet. I hope that doesn't bother you. He also still lives with his mother. He gets pets and they all seem to end up dead. I'm not sure what that's about and whether I should call the Humane Society. But, he has an awesome personality. Sometimes, he has more than one personality. But, it would be like being in an open relationship and you would still be monogamous.

Can I give him your number?

I AM rolling on the floor laughing my ass off

That is very funny , Although I have met this man also ...............

Update: We had our "Queen of hearts" drawing last night. It always draws a large crowd. I walked in expecting to see the same people and this totally hot guy caught my eye. Maybe the gaydar was in overdrive?

I hadn't planned on working but I decided to help behind the bar so I could interact freely with the customers. I had no idea who he was but quickly figured out he was my friends' guest. If he's a flamer, then I'm a downright queen. He is incredibly charming, sweet , and if I didn't mention; totally hot.

This is the same guy your friends were trying to get you to meet, and which started this whole thread? My, you've certainly changed your tune....

Why didn't you accept his invite for a nightcap? Maybe that depends on what he meant by nightcap (I'm always terribly naive about these things). Perhaps you could have instead offered him your phone number, and suggested getting together again. Work it!

Cheers,

Henry

Logged

"Life in Lubbock, Texas, taught me two things: One is that God loves you and you're going to burn in hell. The other is that sex is the most awful, filthy thing on earth and you should save it for someone you love." - Butch Hancock, Musician, The Flatlanders

The 'who is the girl ?... who is the guy ?' question has always led to some interesting responses no doubt. I have never had that conversation with a 'straight' male but have several times with my lesbian friends. Its genuine curiosity on their part I guess.

Personally, the total 'flamers' dont do much for me. I like masculinity and intelect. If the discussion is only about tv, movies, and meaningless drivel then its not going anywhere.

No right answer Wolfie... if you dont feel like a date with someone, I am sure you will not accept one.

I never went for the "flamer" or "super-butch" types of gay men , I always thought that those types were too extreme for my taste in men, however I did love men that were in-the-middle, and well rounded, it's all about attitude & personality for me, I never cared if a man was rich, poor or middle-class, never cared what he drove, or where he lived or what he wore, no bodies perfect, were flawed in one way or another, and were all different, and to me that is what makes life interesting