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you probably won't get your hot war with Russia. you'll get the bill for part of it anyway, though. the next president will probably give you all of the war that you can stand. pretty much every frontrunner at this point is a hawk with something to prove.

Re: US, NATO Troops Parade Near Russian Border in Estonia

Originally Posted by Jack Hays

It is a falsehood to claim that Russia sees (or ever saw) Ukraine as a buffer state. Ukraine has always been an economic prize.

1. Napoleon ignored Ukraine when he invaded Russia.
2. In WW1 the Germans never fought for Ukraine. Ukraine was on the front of Germany's Austro-Hungarian allies, and they retreated more than they advanced. At the time of the treaty of Brest-Litovsk (March 1918) Ukraine was already in full rebellion against the Soviet government in Moscow, so the Bolsheviks simply ceded all Ukraine to the Germans.
3. In WW2 General Guderian considered it a terrible mistake for the German army to temporarily turn away from Moscow in the summer of 1941 in order to assault Kiev. His warning was prophetic. Ukraine was not a buffer but rather a diversion; it is not on the road to Moscow.

As memory serves, believe Czar Alexander used what is now Ukraine as a diversion when at war with Sweden over that area

""You know, when we sell to other countries, even if they're allies -- you never know about an ally. An ally can turn."

Re: US, NATO Troops Parade Near Russian Border in Estonia

Originally Posted by Threegoofs

Right. And Ukraine should not be a member of the EU, or NATO. Recognition as a buffer state by the West would satisfy both the West's and Russia's interests. It might not sit well with Ukraine, but its either that, or they become a proxy battlefield for Russia.

This would be a direct violation of the 1975 Helsinki treaty (to which Russia is a signatory) which states

"every country has the right to belong or not to belong to international organizations, to be or not to be a party to bilateral or multilateral treaties including the right to be or not to be a party to treaties of alliance."

Moreover, when Russia signed the Founding Act, it pledged to uphold "respect for sovereignty, independence and territorial integrity of all states and their inherent right to choose the means to ensure their own security".

Re: US, NATO Troops Parade Near Russian Border in Estonia

Originally Posted by flogger

This would be a direct violation of the 1975 Helsinki treaty (to which Russia is a signatory) which states

"every country has the right to belong or not to belong to international organizations, to be or not to be a party to bilateral or multilateral treaties including the right to be or not to be a party to treaties of alliance."

Moreover, when Russia signed the Founding Act, it pledged to uphold "respect for sovereignty, independence and territorial integrity of all states and their inherent right to choose the means to ensure their own security".

Ukraine has the right to want to be in NATO. And NATO has the right to never seriously consider that as a possibility.

Many Trump supporters have lots of problems, and those deplorables are bringing those problems to us. They’re racists. They’re misogynists. They’re islamophobic. They're xenophobes and homophobes. And some, I assume, are good people.

Re: US, NATO Troops Parade Near Russian Border in Estonia

you probably won't get your hot war with Russia. you'll get the bill for part of it anyway, though. the next president will probably give you all of the war that you can stand. pretty much every frontrunner at this point is a hawk with something to prove.

The US needs a larger defense budget. Decisions whether there will be war are not ours alone to make.

"It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan