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I like the one from post #44. The stocks that I use are all dogleg stocks. They aren't the best cosmetically but they perform the best. They allow quick target acquisition as well as giving head clearance. The stock in #44 appears to give relatively the same amount of clearance or atleast enough for my big noggin to get in there. I like the idea of mounting the Q-loader there. One it frees up your barrel, two it appears it would be easier to change clips, three it keeps everything in tight.

You know, those doglegs kinda make the best of both worlds. They keep the stock high, and still give enough room. The are also pretty easy to manufacture, as they are just bent metal. I am leaning a little more towards that way now. I have never used one, but on paper they seem the best.

This makes me want to go warp again. SUCH low profile. SO tight. Ugh. This hopper does not use up any room, as it is the space between the body and the front arm holding the hopper. No Qloader placement issues at all. Hmm. But the noise and batteries? Ugh. Just look at that feild of view tho! SO nice.

And I kinda like this grip. Its a little gawdy here, but the placement is interesting to me.

In the bottom mounted Qloader design (post #44 i think?) This could also hold a warp if the owner wanted. That means we could kill two birds with one stone! Either mount the warp there, or the Qloader under, depending on preference. Hmmm, I am going to design a drawing for this. This could be good.

I only forsee one problem with placing the q-loader there. The q is approx 12in long (I could be wrong but that's a number i somehow remember associated with the q). That would really prohibit laying down. That's my only concern.

Prolly not the best idea, as the grip is tilted a little too far back, and may be uncomfortable to hold. This marker would also suck in closer quarters. That is not even counting the fact that the carbon fiber grip has to be cut and replaces with that huge shroud.

I think I like the one you posted with the Black Cell the most. It would be dificult to machine the housing for the q but I'm sure there is a way. I feel the one where the q is at an angle would lend itself to being broken to easily. Atleast with it inline with the rest of the body it won't receive as much stress.

Jet, am I safe to assume that your rig is: A powerfeed left frame with the powerfeed turned downwards pointing to the right and a lapco warp feed adapter (or a qloader adapter) going into the Qloader? Sorry, but I am kinda new to the automag setup. That is one short length of Qloader tubing! Excellent and very tight setup. Thanks for the pic. It looks like, with the sight riser, that you could get a very unobstructed field of view over the marker.

This is interesting, because if it is a powerfeed just turned the one could just turn it back up and play with a hooper if they wanted, or if anything went wrong with the Qloader. Could be handy perhaps?

Yep, it is a power feed left, however I cut about 1 inch off so I could use a spyder feed cap on it, the curve of the AGD cap doesn't block the feed tube enough to froce the qloaded balls into the gun. it is a warp feed adaptr again with a spyder cap. Based on those last few picks, if you can find either a plastic mold or a machine shop the folks at qloader may be intrested in your design.

I like the qloader designs, but for quickly replacing the pods that might get a bit akward. Also, not exactly bullpup design per se, but still cool. I'm trying to think of where i'd put it (oh, and normal woodland camo would look better, not that digital crap, no offense, i just don't like the look)

Digi camo is better for breaking up the shape of the gun. "Normal" camo still uses geometric shapes which the eye has an easy time picking up. The Marines and The Army are switching to digi camo. My best friend already has his new digi uniform.

Digi camo is better for breaking up the shape of the gun. "Normal" camo still uses geometric shapes which the eye has an easy time picking up. The Marines and The Army are switching to digi camo. My best friend already has his new digi uniform.

I know this, i've heard this, and i don't buy this. I have seen people hiding in it, and they're easier to spot than those in traditional camo.

That is actually an interesting facet in itself: what kind of camo to use.

My only contribution is to make it slightly darker than usual. That makes it a little more in keeping with the stealth theme of the marker. Whether it is digital or regular does not make much difference to me. It would be nice if we could all agree, or close to agree on one type tho. There is still tiger stripe, realistic, etc. We should experiment with a bunch. I just picked digital cuz its hot with SpecOps and the US military right now.

I will chop a few more pics, and try a variety of camo. So, the underbarrel Qloader is the best thing we got going so far? If so, I will continue down this path a while.

EDIT: Also, yeah, I figured that might be a little nuts to machine. Pretty tight and complex shapes. I will try to break it down into a more buildable style, tho I am not exactly sure what can be build/machined from metal, aluminium or plastic.

I am not even sure if we could go the plastic route, as I am sure manufacturing that is expensive as you have to make expensive molds. What would be good tho is we could all get a bunch of plastic shrouds for fairly cheap after the molds are paid for.

I still figure lightweight metals and alloys is the way to go, if it can be machined well. We could always get a computer person to make a CAD file of the final shroud, and then any C and C shop can mill it out. I am also not sure how much that costs either. Hmm.

They are easier to spot because they are using the wrong design. Just like you can't use woodland to hide in the arctic, most of what is available is not recommended for the woods. When was the last time we fought a battle in a woodland terrain. That's why I'm currently developing a digi camo that is intended for woods and that design will be incorporated onto the marker.

I love the image with the integrated Qloader socket. That reduces the overall length by 1-2 inches and gives the marker nice flow.

I'm telling you, that marker, with a classic valve, would sell like hot cakes.

I would still like the option to mount the bottle directly on the markers. Keeping the stock separate would give users that option.

Having the option to mount the bottle and not using the stock is an excellent idea, seeing as the Q housing is really the feature of that one drawing. Tho I do not have a stock interface in mind, I am sure a machinist could figure something liek that out really easily. Ill incorporate this idea into the next batch. Thanks for the heads up.

for comparison purposes. Stock looks a little low still, but due to its placement it should technically feel better than the Black Cell stock placement. No knowing until one is made out of cardboard or wood for demo purposes.

I feel that the bottomline Qloader is not going to have appeal, due to the worry that the pod will get damaged there. I personally dont think it would as much placed here as anywhere else, but I am worried this will still be a major concern.

Besides, people just like that Qloader under the barrel. It has mass appeal. If the Qloader were under the grip, the weight would be more balanced tho. Hmm, Ill doodle one up anyways. We may be suprised.

This is also an example of a warp right frame (pretty rare) being Q fed. I suppose this configuration could work with powerfeeds, as well as perhaps a vert with a super low rise adapter. In that case, the handle on the top would have to be designed more like the black cells riser.

I just noticed there are two different stock lengths from SpecOps. The air thru on the Longbow is short, and the others are regular.

I figure, if we went the easy road, we could just slap on a Qloader, adn mill this little adapter to mount any Spec Ops stock, essentially creating the Black Cell automag. Note: This can only be done by drilling into the rear of the classic rail, where people sometimes drill to mount their asa from the rear.

Easy, and really creatable. Then it would be just like the SpecOps buying madness, and mixing and matching. Ugh. That stuff is far too expensive, but at least we would save money in labor. With just the top shroud and adapter to create, milling is greatly reduced.

Not as romantic as milling a whole stocked shroud, but its a start. The good news is that I like the Black Cell automag much better than its Ion counterpart.