I think there is somewhat of a difference between a poll that is generally paid for by organisation or another and a survey by several organisations and agencies that are used in conjunction to come up with a set of figures. These agencies are not asking somebodies opinion but they are collecting numbers and figures which are then correlated and analysed to come up with the final figures that are published in a report. These figures are fact and not just someones opinion.

so phil are you telling me that any government survey in to home less folk is fact or any organization funded by the government is fact what they say and we must believe it because they have come up with numbers well all I can say to that is they should check the homeless folk in Birmingham the numbers they come up was wrong there was a lot more and they all do not sleep on the streets in brum town centre you can find them all over the place

18 churches each sleeping 10 or 12 in brum

Birmingham Churches Winter

Night Shelter

is a community of churches

and organisations that work together to provide overnight accommodation, an evening meal, breakfast and friendship

to men sleeping rough in Birmingham during the winter.This winter, 18 churches and

Whether it be survey, collecting numbers, statistical analysis. You can never tell the accuracy unless you know the 'Question' and the 'robustness' of the 'methodology'. Then you need to see the raw data for yourselves. If you don't see the raw data you are basing your argument on someone else's interpretation of the results. And they themselves may not have seen the raw data. To draw their own conclusions

Then if we add narrative it can on occasions make sheer implausible sound plausible....

If it wasn't for these do-gooders giving them the odd pound here and there, there wouldn't be half of them on the streets. But why stay at home when you can sit in a doorway with a dog and blanket and earn more than a decent working person. And I wouldn't be far off the truth if most of the money went on alcohol and drugs. A lot of these people are not on the old cannabis they have moved up in the world and now get their fix from heroin and cocaine, thanks to the generosity of some people. You may think your helping them by giving them money but all your doing is helping some with their addiction. If you want to help a homeless person and you haven't got time to help out in a soup kitchen then when your passing one go to a shop and buy a dink and sandwich. If they are genuine they will be more than grateful.

What I am saying is, in modern society there should be no reason for anyone to beg, the government of the day should make it a priority that no one is forced to do so and if we ever reach that point then perhaps the police will do their job and keep moving beggars on as they used to at one time. The way things are we just haven't got the infrastructure to handle the number of beggars out there.

I don't really want to bring politics into this because I think all governments up to the present are responsible for the situation we have today, but I have to say that this government has indeed made matters worse and seem determined to make things worse with their cut backs.

Well, some people disagree. Its a question of determination to change attitudes as I see it. Im thinking of the modern trend of the teenage girl who cannot fund a place of her own but wants to leave her parents care? So she deliberately, and it happens too often, gets herself in the family way? The next move is to present herself to the council as homeless and the council takes over on the public purse. Duty of care is what all these do gooders fleet and it also goes to justify THEIR jobs? Vicious circle we might think, but the answer is surely in the basis of society where the politician on the gravy train continues to patch over the leaks to keep the boat afloat long enough to make their pile.If a stronger message was sent out that girls presenting themselves with child would not get housed but that the baby would be seized in its own interests to break this cycle events. The girl would be fined and compelled to attend some kind of trade training if she has no job.This is just one example of the system being 'worked' deliberately to milk the welfare system. Ways can be found were their is the will. Someone has to pay somewhere along the line. If Socialism believes in allowing a free for all on the public purse, perhaps that is why the Labour Party is always so glad when they creep of dash out of Downing St leaving the country stony broke up to the neck in national debt?

I bought some sandwiches, bottle water, hot cross buns and 1 banana. I gave it to a homeless guy, you would think i gave him gold he was that pleased. I used to give money but stopped that. A lot of hostels are full of drug addicts and alcoholics it is not safe and they are only allowed to stay for a short time.