the real problem with the FLDS ranch

You know the reason everyone is really so rabid about the polygamists? It’s not just the matter of teenage mothers (who, after all, are a common enough phenomenon in this society; here, at least, they’re respected as legitimate, and the fathers are involved with their children).

No, it’s the women’s clothes. Modern Americans take one look at their appearance – which I would describe as graceful, elegant, sweeping, modest dresses and beautiful swept-up hair – and react viscerally, I believe because they’re convicted by this total contravention of modern society’s flagrant embrace of everything vulgar and obscene. It’s almost as though men think they have a right to see barely-clothed women, and are affronted by these women denying them that privilege; as though women think that they earn respect by flaunting their beauty in the eyes of all, and are defied by these women’s refusal to do that.

That, and the large families. In a society where a single child is pondered before years before being accepted, and where two children are an imposition, three unheard of (in the professional circles I seem to be in these days), the idea of having many children is shocking – the 400 kidnapped children (since I don’t see where the government gets the right to take all of them without specific evidence against everyone’s fathers) are described as a crowd of toddlers and 4-5 year olds running around under foot.

Plus, their rejection of the modern world. My friends talk as though it’s evil not to have TV and internet and cell phones. Who am I to talk, of course; but I think I can at least recognize the beauty and possible desirability of such a lifestyle (the Amish, for instance), while still choosing to use some of modern technology myself. So far, I’ve refrained from pointing out to my colleagues that I was raised without TV (although they may have figured that out from my profound pop culture illiteracy), and regard my cell phone as a necessary evil.

(I have previously described Mormonism as a heresy. But I respect the FLDS people for being consistent and true to the original spirit of Mormonism in spite of intense persecution.)

I am stunned at this post. You stated that you “respect the FLDS people for being consistent and true to the original spirit of Mormonism in spite of intense persecution.” What part of the “original spirit of Mormonism” do you respect? Multiple marriages and all the potential for domestic abuse (even violence) that come with that? Or maybe you respect the loss of the individual to make free choice or practice critical thinking? Perhaps you admire the “sincerity” of the FLDS people for holding tenaciously to their beliefs. (Does it matter to you that the beliefs are dead wrong and lead to bondage rather than freedom?) You claim to be a “Christian”—do you admire that this group embraces a form of self-righteous legalism that leads AWAY from a relationship to Christ?

Please, Dr. Alice, tell me I completely misunderstood your post. Did I understand that you admire the FLDS? You think the problem is with the women’s clothes and hairstyles. Do you wish more people would emulate their form of dress and hairstyle? You think 400+ children are “respected as legitimate, and the fathers are involved with their children.” Have you heard former FLDS members (raised in the cult) say their fathers never even knew their names and did not interact with them? Do you wish more people would engage in multiple marriages where many children are produced, where young girls are raised to be married to much older (already married) men when they are teenagers? Maybe you respect and admire legalistic “obedience” to the patriarch of the cult as the only form of acceptable behavior?

This is a very disappointing post. I do not think any of us fully understand the ramifications of being raised in a culture like the FLDS…but my moral compass tells me something is fundamentally wrong with their lifestyle and belief system.

I loved the post. I think you are right, not in a literal sense about the problem being with the dress of these people. Does the government have proof of the abuses that took place. I have several friends who were raised in polygamist families that are very happy. However their mothers were not 14 when they gave birth, more like 18-20. Polygamy does not equal abuse or mistreatment.

While you do have a point that many in our society has little frame of reference and finds the sect’s dress and lifestyle confusing and quaint, I don’t think that this is the “real problem.”

The real problem with this group is that women and children are being abused and brainwashed. It’s one thing to value family and have many children, or to dress differently and hold strong religious beliefs when you are free to choose that life. It’s another thing to coerce women and girls to have children, without giving them a say in the matter.

These women are not given the opportunity for education and self-determination. They are told what to do, when to do it, and how far to spread their legs. They are being exploited by men, who keep them economically vulnerable.

If an educated, self-assured woman choses to dress against the norm, have a large family, or reject modern society, good for her! But for an uneducated, powerless woman to do the same, it speaks to her lack of choices, rather than her ability to determine her fate.

Not to mention the young boys from this community who are discarded (driven from the compound and left to fend for themselves) when they are old enough to compete with the older men for the women. This “community” is twisted and sick, and I am confident in that assesment, despite my possible lack of understanding of their wardrobe choices.

I found your post disturbing. That you, someone who has strong beliefs (and the freedom to hold them), sees this struggle as simply a clash of cultures and not the flagrant abuse that it is makes me wonder what sort of abuse you would be willing to tolerate in the name of your faith.

My question is at what level does it become “sinful” to take advantage of modern technology? I’ve seen Amish people that will use a tractor in their fields and won’t drive or own a vehicle, but they’ll accept a ride in one. Or they’ll have electricity and not a telephone or they’ll have a telephone, but not a cell phone… at what point does it become sinful to use currently available technology? When is it too much? This is the problem that I have with religions like the Amish and such that act like they’re so much better than everyone else because they don’t want to use certain technologies.

As far as the government having proof of abuse taking place at that particular ranch, the whole reason they went in was because of a phone call from an anonymous person they can’t seem to be able to locate. They should’ve located this person by now. I don’t believe there was a phone call… the purpose was to try and set up a precedent where someone can anonymously call and state that all kinds of abuse are going on at someone’s residence (or alternative community) and give them a reason to go and take the children or take this or that without a warrant, probable cause, or a verifiable witness. That’s all that was about. Setting up precedent for what is to come.