Finally got around to seeing the episode. I, for one, liked it! Yes, the resolution was obvious... for us teenagers and adults who have likely experienced bullies in school. I think it's good how it addressed her being bullied in Manehattan because it gives the message that sometimes bullying leads to victims becoming bullies, but that's not okay. The importance of not passing on hate is a theme and it's one I support. I'll agree with the criticism of recycling animation in the song, though.

I laughed pretty hard at the speech at the end, I have to say.

Kyderra Wrote:

Today, I got a little PM for a old Forum member, perhaps you remember him, his name was Zander He now goes by the name of DILeak.

Just watched the episode. I think it had some really good messages. Avoiding bullies never works. They still control you through fear. But, then again, in my experience anyway, going to authority figures doesn't really work either. Over all I think it was a good episode.

Being bullied is no excuse for committing that behavior yourself. Anger is a good way to hide fear, but that is no excuse to sell out family. I was actually hoping that Babs crashed the float. Maybe she would learn a lesson in loyalty.

I wish the Gilda story had a similar ending. Maybe the source of Gilda's rage could be the result of being possibly the only griffon at a camp for ponies.

After reading the description of next week's episode, I can't wait! Finally. One of the biggest conflicts of season one is going to be settled!

_________________"I have known hardship and learned to aid the wretched."-Virgil

I guess I was so down on the episode not because of it's message but by the writing in general because I've seen very similar story structures in other cartoons. I know it's difficult to be original. We're not living in the time of geniuses like Tom Ruegger or Bruce Timm but too many current cartoons seem to have some sort of agreement that it's okay to use the same story structure over and over again as long as it's with different characters.

I guess I think My Little Pony could be better than that. I think it could fit in nicely with the other challengers of the agreement like Gumball, Thundercats, Adventure Time, Flapjack and Chowder, odd shows that play off their oddness. If not for the terrible dialogue Ben 10 could have been one of my favorite shows.

_________________Spike - "Seriously, a talking Dog is the weird thing about all this"

Me - "Not at all, the fact that you're a dog and not a lizard is much weirder"

Sun Nov 25, 2012 8:09 pm

Penwrite

Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:03 amPosts: 3407Location: Canterlot

Re: My Little Pony

I feel stupid. Earlier I thought Michelle Creber was the voice of Sweetie Belle and the singing voice of Sweetie Belle and Apple Bloom. I got it backwards, she's the voice of Apple Bloom and the singing voice of Apple Bloom and Sweetie Belle.

This has been your daily dose of herp a derp, brought to you by Penwrite.

I feel stupid. Earlier I thought Michelle Creber was the voice of Sweetie Belle and the singing voice of Sweetie Belle and Apple Bloom. I got it backwards, she's the voice of Apple Bloom and the singing voice of Apple Bloom and Sweetie Belle.

This has been your daily dose of herp a derp, brought to you by Penwrite.

yeah, I noticed that. but your post sort of makes sense anyway. Applebloom has the accent that Michelle doesn't have, so Sweetie's singing voice is closer to Michelle's than Applebloom's is.

_________________I'm a shape-shifter. I'm currently in whatever form I feel likeParadigm Shift by meI do not actually believe any of what I'm saying.RP character sheets

Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:29 pm

Radio Blue Heart

Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2012 10:27 pmPosts: 2642Location: North Carolina

Re: My Little Pony

JohnWillow Wrote:

Yea, why is Gilda the only Griffon?

I guess I was so down on the episode not because of it's message but by the writing in general because I've seen very similar story structures in other cartoons. I know it's difficult to be original. We're not living in the time of geniuses like Tom Ruegger or Bruce Timm but too many current cartoons seem to have some sort of agreement that it's okay to use the same story structure over and over again as long as it's with different characters.

I guess I think My Little Pony could be better than that. I think it could fit in nicely with the other challengers of the agreement like Gumball, Thundercats, Adventure Time, Flapjack and Chowder, odd shows that play off their oddness. If not for the terrible dialogue Ben 10 could have been one of my favorite shows.

There does seem to be a very small griffon population in Equestria. I would love for them to revisit this character.

I don't think really the story, but rather the lesson. Some lessons are universal and always of value.

_________________"I have known hardship and learned to aid the wretched."-Virgil

I know I'm slow to the conversation, but I feel I must say a few things.

angelusbr Wrote:

my thought on the episode: horrible.First, as it was said by many people already, the music was weak (this day aria still my number 1)

I personally disagree. I think the music was great, what with it's refreshing visit to the seventies-eighties era. But then again, it's music. There are people who hate all of one kind of music, and can't stop listening to anything that's from one certain genre. That said, I think music is too heavily relied on for image.

angelushbr Wrote:

As for the plot, it had potential. It could have been a decent anti-bullying episode, but it was utterly ruined with the whole "awwww. Let's feel sorry for Babs because she was bullied too.", that's complete *******. I must say there IS a temptation of joining the bully side when you are beng bullied for so long (I'm a bully victim as well to the point of dreading go to middle school. Thankfully I changed schools before starting high school and, thankfully, I managed to make friends there and I wasn't bullied anymore). But guess what? It's still not an excuse to act like a complete jerk. I didn't feel sorry for that filly. I was ****** *** at her because she was a bully victim as well and she chose the path to inflict pain to others when it's something she hated when others had done to her.I know it's hard and even when you tell your parents or teacher the bully doesn't back down and even fighting back can backfire (I thought back when I got tired of being pushed around and I didn't get out unscrathed, obviously, but it felt good to not let people trample over me anymore). But these options are MUCH better than simple say "I was a victim and now I choose to hurt others. Now feel sorry for me!"

JeffCvt Wrote:

Don't hate the episode for the character. I was also bullied majorly in middle school, and I could actually see where she was coming from. She was too shy to really hit it off with the CMC at first, it was much easier to just go with DT and SS. What I actually hate is seeing how she didn't really seem to feel bad about teasing them. Having been in their position before, she should have known how they felt and should have shown something. I think that was the weak point of the episode for me.

... You don't want to play the game of "From my experience."I will win...

Psychologically speaking, it makes sense that Babs would end up lashing out at others. People live what they know. Ponies bully her in Manehatten, so what's to say she's always been bullied or not? Heck, we only know Babs is from Manehatten and that she's been bullied. What's not to say her parents ignore that she's being bullied, thinking she needs the "Character building."

I know, that's dark, but all we have for Babs is a whole bunch of questions on "What if?"

Besides, it's in the characters to feel bad for doing something mean to someone who's trying to get away from people being mean to them.

Sweetie Belle is a sweetheart. She's the one who suggested finding their teacher a "Super Special Somepony," simply because she didn't want Cheerilee to feel alone on Hearts and Hooves day. She wouldn't let herself live it down if she was the one to completely destroy somepony.

Applebloom is a bit more rough around the edges, but she seems to be the type who won't let an issue she caused go unresolved. This also leads to not wanting to completely destroy anypony. It's hard work to try and build someone back up from being an emotional wreck.

Scootaloo... Well, I don't have a very good argument for her, but look at the ponies she hangs out with. They're bound to rub off on her.

JeffCvt Wrote:

But my biggest problem was that I have never heard an accent like that one before.To me it sounds like the voice actor didn't know she was a girl AND didn't know how to properly do the accent.

This is the only thing that makes sense to me on why the episode would be disliked.

@Leafolawl: because being bullied stripes you of your free will, right?I love when people like to dodge blame from their own bad deeds"oh, it was the society thast made me do this""it was violent cartoons/games""my parents didn't love me so I must spread my miserabillyness to others"

Yeah, I've seen people with disfunctional homes and they turned out fine. How? Because they worked hard and refused to let that ruin their lives and they also never bullied others just because they were unhappy.

Learn something: It's NEVER an excuse to do bad things. Your parents don't love you? Deal with it.You don't have friends? deal with it.You are bullied? Deal with it.

@Leafolawl: because being bullied stripes you of your free will, right?I love when people like to dodge blame from their own bad deeds"oh, it was the society thast made me do this""it was violent cartoons/games""my parents didn't love me so I must spread my miserabillyness to others"

Learn something: It's NEVER an excuse to do bad things. Your parents don't love you? Deal with it.You don't have friends? deal with it.You are bullied? Deal with it.

Someone only becomes evil if they allow themselves to.

I'll admit, it doesn't strip you of your free will, but after so long of hurting, you want it to stop. Figuring out that hurting others isn't going to stop the pain is the part that can take awhile.

I don't say I approve of her being mean to the Cutiemark Crusaders, I'm just saying I don't blame her for trying to avoid something that was making her upset.

angelusbr Wrote:

Yeah, I've seen people with disfunctional homes and they turned out fine. How? Because they worked hard and refused to let that ruin their lives and they also never bullied others just because they were unhappy.

Like I said, don't play the personal experience game with me.I don't care what you've seen, or what you have been through. It's different for everyone, so keep in mind even with your experience with it, it's not the same as another person's.

@Leaf: You didn't sound mean. You sounded like you are fleeing from an issue. When i mentioned disfunction homes, I wasn't talking about myself, but from some people I've talked to in high school, some of my sister's and my parent's friends. i've also read a lot of statements in internet and even books. People are able to deal with their issues. It's not an "oh, it's just you so don't generalize."I'm a firm believer EVERY SINGLE person is able to withstand anything that's thrown at them. People who turn evil is because they CHOOSE to be so. If by hurting others is the only way some people can feel better, then these people are the pathetic ones. It's not just me who says that. or person A or person B. Only those with SEVERE mental issues are excused from their actions and these people should be on medicine or maybe in sanatories if needed.

I hate people who go "awww. poor guy he went through so much. let's give him a slack and let him do **** with other's life."

A piece of advice: grow up.And this isn't supposed to sound mean either. It's a legit piece of advice.

A person can never know exactly what another person is going through, can never know how they've suffered or not. Everyone thinks their brand of suffering is the worst, and nobody else's can compare. This is incredibly false. It was not right for Babs to take out her own frustration on the CMC, but that doesn't mean it's not understandable. And what should the CMC done instead of forgiving her after learning her background, eh? Condemned her anyway? Punish her anyway? What would that have solved?

Babs sought forgiveness for what she'd done afterwards, realizing she was wrong. Apple Bloom and the others forgiving her before that just goes to show how good and moral they are. Why is understanding and forgiveness such a bad thing to teach children? Haven't we gone through something similar to this already with Luna?

I'm serious, this is one of the world's major problems. People refuse to understand other people. "Oh, you've had a rough life and you're trying to escape it any way you can? Too bad, you're a terrible person!"

That seems the complete anti-thesis of what this show is supposed to be about. Can we please get some love and friendship in here?

@Leaf: You didn't sound mean. You sounded like you are fleeing from an issue.

I have no idea what issue I could be fleeing from, if you'd like to talk about that one.

angelusbr Wrote:

When i mentioned disfunction homes, I wasn't talking about myself, but from some people I've talked to in high school, some of my sister's and my parent's friends. i've also read a lot of statements in internet and even books. People are able to deal with their issues. It's not an "oh, it's just you so don't generalize."

I said your personal experience. You've had experience talking to people from places that are horrible, and you've learned for it. This is something I qualify as personal experience.

angelusbr Wrote:

I'm a firm believer EVERY SINGLE person is able to withstand anything that's thrown at them. People who turn evil is because they CHOOSE to be so. If by hurting others is the only way some people can feel better, then these people are the pathetic ones. It's not just me who says that. or person A or person B.

I can agree with this, but a few bad choices instantly makes someone evil? I don't see things from that perspective at all.

angelusbr Wrote:

Only those with SEVERE mental issues are excused from their actions and these people should be on medicine or maybe in sanatories if needed.

... This isn't even an excuse.

angelusbr Wrote:

A piece of advice: grow up.And this isn't supposed to sound mean either. It's a legit piece of advice.

This is exactly what Babs did. She grew up.

Sometimes, all it takes to make someone grow up is to be shown an act of genuine kindness. I'm not saying you're wrong in your opinion, but I'm just not able to see why it is Babs should be treated as if she's a horrible person. She's young, so to assume she's already learned this doesn't make sense.

Penwrite Wrote:

A person can never know exactly what another person is going through, can never know how they've suffered or not. Everyone thinks their brand of suffering is the worst, and nobody else's can compare. This is incredibly false. It was not right for Babs to take out her own frustration on the CMC, but that doesn't mean it's not understandable. And what should the CMC done instead of forgiving her after learning her background, eh? Condemned her anyway? Punish her anyway? What would that have solved?

Babs sought forgiveness for what she'd done afterwards, realizing she was wrong. Apple Bloom and the others forgiving her before that just goes to show how good and moral they are. Why is understanding and forgiveness such a bad thing to teach children? Haven't we gone through something similar to this already with Luna?

I'm serious, this is one of the world's major problems. People refuse to understand other people. "Oh, you've had a rough life and you're trying to escape it any way you can? Too bad, you're a terrible person!"

That seems the complete anti-thesis of what this show is supposed to be about. Can we please get some love and friendship in here?

I don't mean to sound as if I don't want to learn why it is Angelus thinks the episode isn't any good, but I can't think of any reasons that make sense to me as to why he's so against Babs. I understand he doesn't like bullies, and I understand that Babs should have been better behaved. I do support friendship, but I believe one of the key points to friendship is understanding.

This is why I'd like to understand why Angelus doesn't like Babs. I don't want to sit there trying to figure it out when I could just talk to Angelus and get the answer.

Learn something: It's NEVER an excuse to do bad things.Your parents don't love you? Deal with it.You don't have friends? deal with it.You are bullied? Deal with it.

I really wanted to avoid getting into this argument, but since it seems others have already brought it up, I may as well drop my 2 bits as well.

The main thing I want to bring up is that the stance you're taking on this is incredibly idealistic. Dangerously so. Saying that the situation is as simple as "Deal with it." regardless of the severity of each individual case betrays a complete lack of understanding on the psychological trauma that can and does come with many cases of bullying.

As Penwrite mentioned, everyone is different; everyone has a different breaking point. And as Leaf brought up, your personal experience means very little in a problem as wide-spread as "bullying" in general. Just because you've seen people who have been able to get past their problem (I'm very happy for those people, by the way.) does not, under any circumstances, automatically mean that anyone will be physically and mentally able to do the same.

Bottom line: you're taking a very complex and dangerous issue and trying to simplify it to ridiculous levels. If life were as simple as you're trying to make it out to be, the world would be a very different place right now. That's not an excuse. That's not a justification. That's a fact.

I don't think the show ever intended people to think that because she was bullied, what Babs did was okay. The message was that you shouldn't let being bullied turn into being a bully, which is what the CMC started to do.

I don't think the show ever intended people to think that because she was bullied, what Babs did was okay. The message was that you shouldn't let being bullied turn into being a bully, which is what the CMC started to do.

I've already said it myself that I don't think Babs was right in bullying the CMC, but I don't exactly blame her for what she did. I actually have a great deal of respect for her, where she owned up to her mistakes, and admitted she was wrong in bullying them on her own accord, instead of having to be told what she was doing was wrong by someone else.

I don't think the show ever intended people to think that because she was bullied, what Babs did was okay. The message was that you shouldn't let being bullied turn into being a bully, which is what the CMC started to do.

So, now standing up to yourself is now considered bullying? Right...@penwrite: Yeah. Understanding is part of the process of building friendship. But BOTH sides must be able to understand one another. I'll use marriage as an example. If just one part concedes to the other and just one side puts the happyness of the partner above his/her own, the relationship is condemend to fail. Miserabily.Also, in an example: suppose a person out of nowhere invades your home, while holding a gun, to kill you and steal everything you have there (the person says he's going to do so). And you are also holding a gun. What do you do? Put down the gun and start saying "dude, don't do that. you must be poor or having some kind of debt. let's put that behind us. I'll go prepare something for us to eat and we can talk about this." What do you think it'll be the most likely outcome? Him start crying saying he was sorry or him shooting you in the head using the chance you gave him since now you're defenseless.I'm sorry, but I would never put my life or those I care about (if there are any nearby) in danger for the slightest chance the guy is just bluffing with their threat. It reminds me of the case shown in Brazil some months ago. two brothers fled from home and went to the police saying that their prantes were going to kill them. The social service analized the kids for just a few days and dismissed thems aying" they were lying" then coerced them into going back to their homesBig surprise. A few days later the parents did kill the two kids. People love taking threats too lightelly. Soemtimes people are bluffing. sometimes people aren't. but we can't read minds and people often forget that EVERYONE can commit murder (one big defense some murders hgave is first building up a good image in society just so people can say but person X would never do that...). Anyone is capable doing the most of beutful acts the same way they can do the most cruel acts.

What makes a person evil? Their choices and the intent behind them. Want to do good things because you genuinelly care for others = good personWant to do bad things because you like to make others suffer = bad personwant to do good things seeking praise and glory = bad personWant to do bad things in name of greater good = bad person. For those who don't believe in me in this one, just remember 2 things: the famous saying "the hell is full of good intentions" and that MANY of the worst people in the world did their horrible things thinking of what they claimed to be good. Hitler thought that arian race was the supreme it it was rightful for them to rule over others and that the Jew were the root of evil. Stalin thought that capitalism was the root of evil along with any form of religion and those who were capitalist and/or religious should be killed (he killed several million of his own population under this pretext).

As for mental illness, I said it was excuse because they are not responsbile for their own actions since their free will is near null or completly null.

As for growing up. I agree with you. Sometimes a genuine act of kindness is enough to change a person to become good. It would be wonderful if that worked 100% of the time. But just read what i said to Penwrite above. babs did learned the lesson. But it was plot forced and that kind of talk would HARDLY work on real life.If what you say concerning personal experience is true than if 2 people read the same happening that happened to a third person in a newspaper then the 2 had the same personal experience? Sorry, but we disagree on this. Experience is something that is built with years and are passed on to others through life lessons, books, talks, etc. You don't have to experience something first hand to know the consequences of it. That's one common dellusuion of people. You don't have to try drugs to know their consequences. You don't have to be a bully to know that not only you'll induce phisical, but also psicological pain to others.

Okay, now what I'm about to say is 100% PERSONAL experience, since it happened to me and I know that not everyoone is that cruel. One day, three of the bullies that liked to torment me came to me after the PE class and talked to me for a while. They said they were very sorry for all the things they said and done to me and that they would like to be my friends. I believed them. I was very happy with this and I immediately forgave the, I truly did. But that had been just a ruse to delay me from getting to class just so they could prepare a prank to me. Once the prank was done when I got to class they ALL laughed at me and told they were lying and explained all their plan to me. I cried that day. Not because of the prank, which was quite stupid, but because I had trusted them.

I KNOW that not all bullies are as nasty as the ones that tomented me were. The same way i know there are WORSE bullies out there. I chose to be higly suspicious of the people I called friends ever since. I know there are good people out there and I even met two people by accident 7 years ago and we are VERY close friedns up to this date and theya re famioly to me. I was distant at first, but I was slowly opening myself to them and I don't regret giving them the chance.

Do you want to know how I would have handled the episode? Let the CMC finish their plan and after that they would come to babs and say "Look, we wanted to be your friend. We really did. And we would still like to. But if you are going to torment us, then we'll fight back from now on. If you don't want to be our frieend. Fine. Just don't try do anything bad to us and we won't do anything bad to you."Then you could fill in the whole "I was bullied" thing and THEN they could make ammends and become friends.

Given the necklace she is wearing, the color of her magic and the red color her eyes flashed, maybe Trixie has fallen under the influence of King Sombra! He may not be able to return to corporeal form, but maybe he is exerting his influence in other ways!

It will be interesting to find out who gave her that necklace.

_________________"I have known hardship and learned to aid the wretched."-Virgil

Note: I'm not trying to spark a debate here. I'm not saying "This is stupid. How could they have not know each other when they very clearly were hiding together here." I simply find it interesting that they were together in the very first episode when they didn't "officially" meet until the middle of the season.

_________________Jeff "Clavy" Civit

Mon Nov 26, 2012 5:36 pm

IceKitsune

Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2010 1:35 pmPosts: 4530Location: Ohio

Re: My Little Pony

To give a good in story explanation its likely they didn't talk to each other and didn't know each other formally until later since they were so scared at the time. The actual explanation is its likely that Sweetie Bell and Scootaloo's models were used because they wanted Applebloom to be hiding with fillies her own age and they just picked the most complete models they had at the time.

What I think is that they had a lot of the episodes planed out when that part was actually written, so having the CMC together was something that whoever wrote that episode thought as normal, despite them not having actually met in the show at that point.

_________________Jeff "Clavy" Civit

Mon Nov 26, 2012 6:13 pm

angelusbr

Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2010 11:26 amPosts: 1754

Re: My Little Pony

Foxstar Wrote:

Alright guys, let's settle down, focus on the cartoon and remember it's just that. A cartoon.

Dear Foxstar. Try harder next time you try to troll. The discussion was about bullying in real life and had just a little to do with the cartoon.Read before posting. Okay?

Note: I'm not trying to spark a debate here. I'm not saying "This is stupid. How could they have not know each other when they very clearly were hiding together here." I simply find it interesting that they were together in the very first episode when they didn't "officially" meet until the middle of the season.

Maybe they all dove for cover by coincidence. They just didn't remember each other because they were so terrified of Nightmare Moon. Or they knew each other informally, since they are in the same class together. They probably never bothered to get to know each other until episode 12.

_________________"I have known hardship and learned to aid the wretched."-Virgil

I actually seem to remember that at one point he was still active here while doing pony stuff, and commented that he had made one of the animations when he posted it.it was this one if I recall correctly.

_________________I'm a shape-shifter. I'm currently in whatever form I feel likeParadigm Shift by meI do not actually believe any of what I'm saying.RP character sheets

Mon Nov 26, 2012 7:30 pm

Sleet

Bringing Foxy Back

Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:32 amPosts: 16609Location: Nephelokokkygia

Re: My Little Pony

The new episode looks promising! It seems like it'll be written for the older fans!

angelusbr Wrote:

Foxstar Wrote:

Alright guys, let's settle down, focus on the cartoon and remember it's just that. A cartoon.

Dear Foxstar. Try harder next time you try to troll. The discussion was about bullying in real life and had just a little to do with the cartoon.Read before posting. Okay?

I'm going to have to ask you to never talk to a fellow forum member like that again, let alone a moderator. Capisce?

The new episode looks promising! It seems like it'll be written for the older fans!

angelusbr Wrote:

Foxstar Wrote:

Alright guys, let's settle down, focus on the cartoon and remember it's just that. A cartoon.

Dear Foxstar. Try harder next time you try to troll. The discussion was about bullying in real life and had just a little to do with the cartoon.Read before posting. Okay?

I'm going to have to ask you to never talk to a fellow forum member like that again, let alone a moderator. Capisce?

If I'm wrong, please show me where?

Foxstar Wrote:

Alright guys, let's settle down, focus on the cartoon and remember it's just that. A cartoon.

Foxstar Wrote:

I dunno, given that this is again, My Little Pony, it was right in line with what I expected from a childrens cartoon.

And that is just his RECENT posts.I stopped with the discussion about bullying in this topic since it derailed almost completly from the cartoon to real life.Also, I'll reply to mr. "I'm too mature for this, but I'll repeteadly post in this thread about my matureness anyway"as I said to RandomGeekNamedBrent, ban me if you must. also before you join him in the chorus of "it's a kid's cartoon". The discussion begun if it was wether or not a good moral and how it could be handled in real life. And as I just said, it derailed almost completely to real life. Tell us to quit because this isn't a topic for that is fine and understandable. Tell us to stop because it begun as a discussion about the episode of a cartton? Now that's stupid.

I'm going to have to ask you to never talk to a fellow forum member like that again, let alone a moderator. Capisce?

If I'm wrong, please show me where?

Foxstar Wrote:

Alright guys, let's settle down, focus on the cartoon and remember it's just that. A cartoon.

Foxstar Wrote:

I dunno, given that this is again, My Little Pony, it was right in line with what I expected from a childrens cartoon.

And that is just his RECENT posts.I stopped with the discussion about bullying in this topic since it derailed almost completly from the cartoon to real life.Also, I'll reply to mr. "I'm too mature for this, but I'll repeteadly post in this thread about my matureness anyway"as I said to RandomGeekNamedBrent, ban me if you must. also before you join him in the chorus of "it's a kid's cartoon". The discussion begun if it was wether or not a good moral and how it could be handled in real life. And as I just said, it derailed almost completely to real life. Tell us to quit because this isn't a topic for that is fine and understandable. Tell us to stop because it begun as a discussion about the episode of a cartton? Now that's stupid.

There are more mature ways to deal with things than to belittle moderators for their actions and accuse them of trolling. I recommend a polite PM explaining why you believe it was unnecessary. You have been warned. If I'm not mistaken that's your second. Thin ice.

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