So called "terrorist attacks" are warranted.

Now, I know a lot of you wont like that I said that, but we've been pillaging these people, their lands, and resources for decades. What do think
their going to do? Fact is they have no other means of resistance

Now someone will say "but their targeting innocents". So long as we stand idly by while our government uses our money, our will, and our resources
no one is innocent, not you, not me, not anyone.

Originally posted by Weisheit
Fact is they have no other means of resistance

The use of suicide-attacks for instance could be considered the ultimate in lo-tech smart-weapons, and are very difficult to counter...and when you
consider the scale and technological advantage gained by coalition forces over the insurgency in Iraq, could be considered their equal...both
suicide-martyr and GPS smart-bombs are designed to strike without detection or warning and with pin-point accuracy on the intended target.

The difference between the use of an air-dropped GPS-JDAM and a VBIED is the western-cultural-taboo aspect towards the deliberate suicide of the
weapon-operator

The theoretical question arises though of how would an enemy react to a US-suicide-bomber campaign against them???

Originally posted by Weisheit
So called "terrorist attacks" are warranted

1 - there is nothing 'so called' about it. They ARE terrorist attacks.
2 - No they are not warranted.
3 - To say they are called for is sick - IMHO.

When you push someone, eventually they will push back.

Terrorists aren't pushed. They just hate. They hate and they want to kill. Period.

You need to read this list of terrorist attacks, so far, for 2007. Then go read the
list for all the other years. According to your philosophy they all deserved to die. The children all deserved to die. So did the cleaning women
who were blown up by the terrorist bomb. So did the police men standing in line to get paid. So did the journalists. So did the head of the
children’s hospital. So did the Buddhist owned tea shop owner. So did the pregnant women. So did those praying in the mosques and temples. So
did the college students. So did the family on their way to Disney World on 9/11. So did the 82 year old elderly man. So did the UN relief agency
workers. So did the peace activists. So did the relief workers. So did the shop owners and salesmen. So did the teachers. So did the Red Cross
workers. So did those attending funerals as well as those just riding a bus. So did the doctors and nurses. And so on and so on ….

Originally posted by Weisheit
So called "terrorist attacks" are warranted

1 - there is nothing 'so called' about it. They ARE terrorist attacks.
2 - No they are not warranted.
3 - To say they are called for is sick - IMHO.

When you push someone, eventually they will push back.

Terrorists aren't pushed. They just hate. They hate and they want to kill. Period.

You need to read this list of terrorist attacks, so far, for 2007. Then go read the
listfor all the other years. According to your philosophy they all deserved to die. The children all deserved to die. So did the cleaning women who
were blown up by the terrorist bomb. So did the police men standing in line to get paid. So did the journalists. So did the head of the
children’s hospital. So did the Buddhist owned tea shop owner. So did the pregnant women. So did those praying in the mosques and temples. So
did the college students. So did the family on their way to Disney World on 9/11. So did the 82 year old elderly man. So did the UN relief agency
workers. So did the peace activists. So did the relief workers. So did the shop owners and salesmen. So did the teachers. So did the Red Cross
workers. So did those attending funerals as well as those just riding a bus. So did the doctors and nurses. And so on and so on ….

:shk:

[edit on 6/26/2007 by FlyersFan]

Really
And thats a low estimate, far more women, children, and innocents have been killed by American bombs than "terrorist attacks"

Originally posted by rdang
Isn't it nice to see the support for the killing of children and women.
I hope your vest goes off early.

what makes you different? LOL You don't mind death and destruction as long as its an islamic man, woman or child. Look at your Avatar throwing Islam
in the garbage. You could care less for them or their religion. Its just a shame that they dont have some sort of detection system to seperate you
and the rest of the crusaders from the rest of us. You have a suicide vest its just that you put it on other peoples kids to fight your war.

Originally posted by rdang
Isn't it nice to see the support for the killing of children and women.
I hope your vest goes off early.

what makes you different? LOL You don't mind death and destruction as long as its an islamic man, woman or child. Look at your Avatar throwing
Islam in the garbage. You could care less for them or their religion. Its just a shame that they dont have some sort of detection system to seperate
you and the rest of the crusaders from the rest of us. You have a suicide vest its just that you put it on other peoples kids to fight your war.

I actually mentioned this in another thread, I'm sure its quiet offensive to Islamic folk, ignorant to considering Christianities past.

Originally posted by Weisheit
Now, I know a lot of you wont like that I said that, but we've been pillaging these people, their lands, and resources for decades.

Actually it's quite a bit longer than that, the United States has been regime changing and meddling in their affairs since the 1700's (i.e. Barbary
pirates), and that doesn't call to mention the 1000 or so years that our european ancestry spent killing and claiming lands there. Zionism is
ancient, bloodthirsty, and there's damned good reasons why freemasonry is outlawed in most islamic countries.
You will find your opinion will generate alot of hostility, but I think you raise a valid point. Nobody ever seems to want to talk about WHY there is
terrorism, or what has pissed these people off to the point of resorting to it, only that they hate your way of life, hate your freedom, and are out
to get you. I'm afraid there's a little more to the story than that.

Originally posted by Weisheit
Now, I know a lot of you wont like that I said that, but we've been pillaging these people, their lands, and resources for decades.

Actually it's quite a bit longer than that, the United States has been regime changing and meddling in their affairs since the 1700's (i.e. Barbary
pirates), and that doesn't call to mention the 1000 or so years that our european ancestry spent killing and claiming lands there. Zionism is
ancient, bloodthirsty, and there's damned good reasons why freemasonry is outlawed in most islamic countries.
You will find your opinion will generate alot of hostility, but I think you raise a valid point. Nobody ever seems to want to talk about WHY there is
terrorism, or what has pissed these people off to the point of resorting to it, only that they hate your way of life, hate your freedom, and are out
to get you. I'm afraid there's a little more to the story than that.

If I remember correctly, we fought agains the Muslim Barbary Pirates because they kidnapped and ransom American sailors.

Originally posted by deltaboy
If I remember correctly, we fought agains the Muslim Barbary Pirates because they kidnapped and ransom American sailors.

What was our response to
that?

The whole truth of the matter is that 'we' (the hobnobbing masons who dictated our foriegn policy at the time) simply didn't want to pay them to
use their waterways like all the other countries were. Our response to that was to go over there and attempt to insert a deposed ruler by military
force, i.e. meddling in their political affairs and killing indiscriminately to protect our interests in their lands, emphasis on their lands. There
wasn't a single arabian ship in US territorial waters at the time, we were in their yard picking a fight, and it's been that way ever since.

The whole truth of the matter is that 'we' (the hobnobbing masons who dictated our foriegn policy at the time) simply didn't want to pay them to
use their waterways like all the other countries were. Our response to that was to go over there and attempt to insert a deposed ruler by military
force, i.e. meddling in their political affairs and killing indiscriminately to protect our interests in their lands, emphasis on their lands. There
wasn't a single arabian ship in US territorial waters at the time, we were in their yard picking a fight, and it's been that way ever since.

Pay them? If you should remember theres a reason why they are called pirates that raid on merchant ships for profit, not just its equivalent to going
to the Panama Canal.

You should remember that they didn't just prey on American ships, but also other European ships and sold for slavery.

Originally posted by deltaboy
Pay them? If you should remember theres a reason why they are called pirates that raid on merchant ships for profit, not just its equivalent to going
to the Panama Canal.

You should remember that they didn't just prey on American ships, but also other European ships and sold for slavery.

Oh well if they were just pirates, what were we doing in Lybia, which was sort of like a nation? Yes pay them, they asked/demanded payment for safe
passage through THEIR territorial waters and we refused to pay them, they took prisoners and we went to war. Not war though, we used subversion and
some other nasty little tactics your history books tend to exclude. Pirates... I guess you could call them that, but it's kind of difficult to call
someone a pirate when they operate in their own waters. Now if these pirates were sinking shipping off Boston harbor, or they were raiding costal
towns or something, sure pirates would fit the bill, but the fact is we were about 4800 some odd miles from home.

First let me say, im not a conservative. I dont support war, I dont support imperialism, and I dont support terrorism.

The slaughter of innocents, whether through terrorism, or direct military conflict, is never justified.

Yes, US imperial interests have wontonly destroied country after country, people after peoples, life after life. But that does not make it right for
a battered country to wage war on the civilian population of the attacking country, because those same civilians are usually the victims of
imperialist policy as well.

What you have done here is lump all of a citizenries interests in with their leaders, which is a grave mistake. Despite what you may believe, many in
the US and the Western world appose imperialism and its policies quite vigirously. To say that we all just sit idly by, do nothing, and therefor
deserve to die, is BS.

Edit to add: Thats not to say there arent serious grevances, and that US imperial interests arent at the heart of creating terrorism. But killing
civilians of an opposing faction only forces that faction to step up its response. Democratic action and diplomacy are the only things that will stop
a war, not suicide bombs.

Oh well if they were just pirates, what were we doing in Lybia, which was sort of like a nation? Yes pay them, they asked/demanded payment for safe
passage through THEIR territorial waters and we refused to pay them, they took prisoners and we went to war. Not war though, we used subversion and
some other nasty little tactics your history books tend to exclude. Pirates... I guess you could call them that, but it's kind of difficult to call
someone a pirate when they operate in their own waters. Now if these pirates were sinking shipping off Boston harbor, or they were raiding costal
towns or something, sure pirates would fit the bill, but the fact is we were about 4800 some odd miles from home.

Well gee where you think they are operating from in the first place if you want to go to war against an enemy?

The Barbary pirates, also sometimes called Ottoman corsairs, were pirates and privateers that operated from north Africa (the "Barbary coast").
They operated out of Tunis, Tripoli, Algiers, Salé and ports in Morocco, preying on shipping in the western Mediterranean Sea from the time of the
Crusades as well as on ships on their way to Asia around Africa until the early 19th century. Their stronghold was along the stretch of northern
Africa known as the Barbary Coast (a medieval term for the Maghreb after its Berber inhabitants), although their predation was said to extend
throughout the Mediterranean, south along West Africa's Atlantic seaboard, and into the North Atlantic, purportedly as far north as Iceland. As well
as preying on shipping, raids were often made on European coastal towns. The pirates were responsible for capturing large numbers of Christian slaves
from Europe, who were sold in slave markets in places such as Algeria and Morocco.

According to Robert Davis between 1 million and 1.25 million Europeans were captured by pirates and sold as slaves between the 16th and 17th century.
These slaves were captured mainly from seaside villages in Italy, Spain and Portugal, and from more distant places like France or England, the
Netherlands, Ireland and even Iceland and North America.

The impact of these attacks were devastating – France, England, and Spain each lost thousands of ships, and long stretches of the Spanish and
Italian coasts were almost completely abandoned by their inhabitants. Even Americans were not immune. For example, one American slave reported that
130 other American seamen had been enslaved by the Algerians in the Mediterranean and Atlantic just between 1785 and 1793. Isolated cases of piracy
have occurred on the Rif coast of Morocco even at the beginning of the 20th century, but the pirate communities which lived by plunder and could live
by no other resource, vanished with the French conquest of Algiers in 1830.[1]

Now theres a reason why they are called pirates, they are not like the equivalent to a bunch of coast guard duty ships protecting shores. They PREY
on merchant ships. So what does the U.S. do? Go to where they operate from. Hence the attacks on North African states.

I would agree that the line between acts that are "terrorism," as opposed to being "legitimate" acts of warfare is often blurred and muddied.
That is not to say that some people are engaging in acts that are truly terrorism and those acts are not to be condoned. It is one thing to target US
troops in Iraq with a roadside bomb or to fire on Israeli soldiers in the West Bank, and it is another thing to deliberately plant bombs in
marketplaces, mosques, schools, and other areas where civilians congregate in order to inflict as much carnage and fear amongst civilians as possible.
Deliberately targeting large numbers of civilians solely for the purpose of harming and terrorizing civilians is terrorism and is not to be condoned.

Your right deltaboy, the actions of a few always justify the slaughter of many, and the subversive tactics employed thereof. I'm sure we were just
defending those poor sailors that were kidnapped....
Barbary Pirates... Boston Massacre... Weapons of Mass Destruction... Remember the Alamo... Tippecanoe... Remember the Maine...
Without fail or exception, there's always some justification for it eh?

Originally posted by twitchy
Your right deltaboy, the actions of a few always justify the slaughter of many, and the subversive tactics employed thereof. I'm sure we were just
defending those poor sailors that were kidnapped....
Barbary Pirates... Boston Massacre... Weapons of Mass Destruction... Remember the Alamo... Tippecanoe... Remember the Maine...
Without fail or exception, there's always some justification for it eh?

Okay so you just pretty much change the subject and put a load of crap on something else to be critical on. You and me debate about Barbary pirates
and the justification of the U.S. intervention. I put something down hard and you whine on something else.

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