I love the lineup but with one exception, Gary Bennett. I know that it is a day game after a night game and everything, but Bills and Martin have been such a good battery ever since that Suns team. Martin is really, the only catcher that Bills has had as a pro, so i just don’t see the logic here Joe. Russ could always sit for the finale. I hope i am wrong

If anyone needs Martin catching for him it’s Billingsley. He loses focus, gets frustrated and consequently winds up walking five guys. I would think Martin would be the ideal guy to call the game and calm him down if he gets frustrated. Bennett should be relegated to Kuo/Loaiza duty.

The reason that either Andre or Kemp lose AB’s to JP is because then Colletti doesn’t have to answer the obvious question of why he’s paying $27 million to two center fielders only one of whom plays in the game.

It might behoove Colletti to keep his eye out for another job. I don’t think it should be in baseball, what with your track record of exorbitant spending and little results. I might suggest being a used car saleman, and I apologize for that reference to all of the really proffesional used car salesmen. Anybody care to suggest what kind of job might fit Colletti?

Great, now we’ve got Nomore taking time away from DeWitt… In essence we’re back to the JP debate here – average stick at best, and seriously no glove. Joe and Bobblened can’t even learn from a week ago’s history. Was DeWitt’s offense so horribly bad that they think a rapidly declining Nomore at 70% is going to provide anymore punch? I doubt he provides more punch at 100%, and Nomore’s arm is to third base what JP’s is to the outfield.

For every step the Ds take forward, they take one back. No wonder the Snakes and Rox are passing us while we’re stuck idling. The Puds seem to be in the same boat as we, but their “stat ball” approach seems to give them the edge. Only team we can look down on are the Jints, and that ain’t saying much.

I remember a Sunday game with Joe Ferguson about to come to the plate. On the old message board came the announcement that Joe’s wife had just given birth to their daughter. Through his entire at-bat, Vin was blending the game with Joe telling his daughter sometime in the future about that moment. Paraphrasing from memory:

“As I walked into the box, I was thinking about how much I love your mother and how much we have been looking forward to bringing you home as the pitcher (forgot the name) throws ball one……..”

The entire at-bat went like that. If I remember correctly, it was rather anti-climactic as he ended up walking, but it was riviting and of course, all spur-of-the-moment. I was at a driving range in El Monte and they had the game piped into the sound system there. It was a beautiful Sunday afternoon and the range was full, but during this at-bat, everyone had stopped hitting golf balls and was listening. I will never forget it.

Thanks enchanted, but it wasn’t my idea. I was just picking up the idea from the end of the last thread by mlk.

There are certainly a lot of no-brainers – “Two and two to Harvey Kuenn………..SWUNG ON AND MISSED, A PERFECR GAME!!!!!!!!!!” But there have to be so many moments like the one above that would go great on a CD.

Make that 4 out of 5 innings with the leadoff man getting on and no one has scored yet.
What happened to all that scoring earlier this week.
I think it’s got a lot to do with playing in the east.
It seems we do our worst against eastern teams.

Well, so much for good pitching, which we also don’t have. This has all the earmarks of a fourth place team, except this year there’s no doubt about it – no waiting till the end of the season.
Let’s say good bye to Colletti early. How much worse can Logan White do the rest of the way.

Well, we’re headed for another loss today. We haven’t been able to come back all season. We do good except when the opposition throws a good pitcher against. What’s up with that. No fair. We suck at this point. Doesn’t look to get any better soon.

DODGER ERIC AND DICK NELSON- ITS sarcasm, ua ,ua,uaUAUAUAUA
J UA N !
HAPPY FELLAS ?
GET A LIFE… DODGERS ARE PATHETIC THROUGH AND TRHOUGH.
YOU GUYS SLAM HIM ALL OFF SEASON AND ALL SPRING AND NOW I HAVE OFFENDED YOU BECAUSE I SPELLED HIS FIRST NAME INCORRECTLY.
YOU GUYS REALLY NEED TO GET A LIFE.
WONT SEE YOU IN OCTOBER!

I hate to say it, but this isn’t Ned’s fault. He did exactly what we wanted him to do ,and not trade the kids. The kids are now playing and not setting the world on fire. I really didn’t expect much different, remember Arizona and the Rockies finished last for a few years waiting for their young players to develop. The same will probably be true of the Dodgers. They have to get rid of Kent and Nomore and just let the young players develop. If they play everyday , who knows by the second half of the season they may turn it around, and worst case is that next year they will be further along with their development. Young players rarely start off like superstars, but instead develop into them.

Mediocre is the word I meant above.
Most Mediocre pitchers look better against the Dodgers.
When they are hitting like they have earlier this week, nobody paid attention to that.
Could it be they now have Loney’s number now. Do they know how to get him out. I hope not.
This is a young learning team.
I say, don’t get your hopes too high, but with more experience I thing this team will eventually begin to do better against these MEDIOCRE pitchers.

Agree with fliegel that we need patience with playing the kids. We could start, however, by letting DeWitt keep playing 3rd. We could also give Hu more chance at playing second, at least after Kent’s had two or three AB’s. If that were the course we’re implementing, I’d be all right with it through the growing pains. I’m fed up with Colletti, and so far with Torre, the way they’re going halfway and screwing up this season.
I’m looking forward to Colletti being GONE after the season.

Kent and Nomore are just 2 players on this team. It’s true Kent is probably done and we all know that Nomore is done, but Nomore has only played in what 3 games? I know he hasn’t done anything but the Dodgers weren’t playing good ball before he came back. Both will be gone after this season if not sooner, so just watch as the kids develop and hope their development comes sooner rather than later. Also, I’d be willing to bet that once LaRoache comes back Nomore is on the bench or out the door. I’m not a Ned lover, but I don’t know much that he could have done different this off season without trading the young players. Also, I still think that Andruw was worth the risk.

All pitchers look good against us. We headed for last place if we don’t pick up the pace and start doing some hitting. 2 years ago we came back late in a lot of games, but we can’t seem to do it anymore.

I still think this team has motivational issues. I haven’t seen a Dodger team that really wanted to win since the end of the 06 season(when we went on that great 15 out of 16 or so win streak). I swear I think the Braves wanted the W more than us tonight…

Billz started out good last year when he started in the pen. Maybe he needs to return till he gets his head on. When he started losing it today, Torre should have replaced him before he gave up 4 runs. That’s the mark of a good manager, when to know when to take a pitcher out.

I count 7 innings out of nine innings we had the lead off batter get on and not one of them came around.
The 1st, 3rd,4th, 5th, 6th, 8th & 9th.
It’s probably close to a record.
But it only comes to show you it really doesn’t mean much.
At least not with us right now.

After Ned is fired, he should start his own game show on TV called “Price is NOT Right”. The contestants would vie to match the contract terms that Ned would give designated over the hill veteran baseball players if he was still a GM. Winners could get stuff like free parking at Dodger Stadium, autographs by Pierre and Nomar, photos of Gonzo, Hendy and Bombko. On the other hand, they better come up with another list of prizes, or they’ll have a hard time getting contestants.

Do you remember last year in Cinccy when the Dodgers were like 7 for their last 81 w/RISP. I kind of get that feeling now Pierres. It just seems like nobody can come through with the big hit, and its REALLY FRUSTRATING.

Billz meltdown in the 6th was so quick and severe that I don’t think anyone could have seen it coming. Unbelievable. He was cruising. He is young and evidently loses his focus quite easily. Not getting a call just unraveled him. Nomore glove at 3rd didn’t help any.

oh, well I just sent it like 20 min ago Pierres. BTW, my name is Ryan not Scott. It’s OK though, it was just expressing my frustration with the start to the season. If you still have the email its from ryanwood@cox.net not this swood one.

Does anyone see any difference in Joe’s low key demeanor “well we’ll get ‘em next time when we start to hit”, and Grittle’s do nothingness?

The trouble I see is that Joe’s had virtually nothing but veterans in NY and when the weather started heating up, so did the vets. What I see happening is him waiting for the vets to heat it up, except that half his team here aren’t vets, and the ones he does have sure aren’t like what he had in the Bronx. So in reality, he’ll be waiting on something that’ll never come.

Nope, no difference so far, except Phew is sitting. Good start, now he needs to bench Nomore. Probably going to take him a week or two to realize Nomore has nothing left. Unfortunately, the games we lose in the interim, we can’t get back. Gonna be a long year gang.

This team will get hot eventually and win lots of games, but it doesn’t strike me as a playoff team, not even close. I’m sure Ned possess neither the saavy nor the insight to turn it around…so it’s up to Joe to eventually do what we all want–play the kids. Every last one of them. Keep the kid pitchers in the minors, though. Why torment them with this offense? Let them develop out of the limelight. The vets look REALLY old to me. Nice job Ned. They’re like bad chloresterol clogging up everything. But I would re-sign Furcal. 2nd base and 3rd base will be youth, along with Loney. Furcal is a nice compliemnt to that bunch. It’s early and I’m not panicking, just being realistic.

1. Ethier and Kemp can’t relax and just play because they’re always looking over their shoulder at JP. Ned trades JP, that goes away.

2. DeWitt isn’t setting the world on fire, but he’s part of a season out of AA and holding his own. But we stick a has been statue in his place. Obvious from watching Nomore last season he can’t play third – that should’ve been a red flag right there. Now 2Es in three games (and a third if Loney doesn’t save him) is pathetic, not to mention his lack of range. Hitting, they’re at least equals. Ned needs to cut Nomar.

3. Sweeney. I gurantee when Brazoban comes back that they don’t cut Sweeney, but option DeWitt, leaving Hu trying to cover both statues in the infield.

If Ned had the cajones to just come out and say, “OK, this just isn’t working. We’re going to totally commit to the kids and let them play out the season. We may finish last this year, but you can expect improvement in 2009, and vast improvement in 2010″, we’d all accept that, and I doubt that they lose much in ticket sales because most of the fans that attend just do so for something to do. AND once the fat contracts are off the books, any lost attendance is made up for by much lower salaries. But this bringing in worthless vets to “stay competative” is retarding the growth of the youngsters and ensuring nothing but average results year in and year out.

Ned lacks a long term plan, and like any business venture without vision, its doomed to failure.

Let’s let Logan White have a shot at running the show. No one knows the farm like he does and he appears to be a great evaluator of talent. I can’t see him signing a JP type for 1 year, let alone 5.

Extremely well put, enchanted, and probably speaks for many of us; so why can’t management understand such a really simple principle. Are they really such a blind bunch?
I see no excuse whatever for keeping Ned around after this season, and I wish they would turn it over to Logan White tomorrow.

I read somewhere that they were thinking of releasing Nomore in the spring, but then he got hurt and Andy went down. Give it some time to unfold and I think Nomore is on the bench or out the door. The other thing that bothers me is that we kept DY, and he never gets to play. He might be good, give him a start or 2. Sweeney has a great record as a pinch hitter , but since he’s come to the Ds every time I see him AB all he does is strike out. How about getting rid of Sweeney and bringing someone else up? These are minor moves , but the way things are going it couldn’t hurt.

Agree that DY is totally underused, and it is a disservice to him. Obviously management didn’t want to take the chance of losing him because he would have had to be put on waivers, but this arrangement is ridiculous. I also agree that Sweeney really serves no good purpose for our team and should be traded or released, so that we can fill his roster spot with someone that will have a future with us.

First and foremost, a good GM has to know his personnel from the big club down to rookie league. If you project a Lambo to arrive in 2011, you don’t sign a JP to 5 years today. Hence you sign a Jones or a Lofton for a couple years if you don’t have anyone you can justifiably plug in to the position from within.

Scott Boras can tell you every teams potential FAs from now until 2020. How do you think he knows when to put in opt-outs and how long to sign for? No reason a GM can’t know that as well with the help of a couple of computer nerds. And as long as they’re at it, those same nerds can keep up with the prospects of oll the other teams as well. A full-time statistician is a must. There are intangibles though, so having scouts adept at their job is 100% necessary for their input. Knowledge is power.

Prospects. Prospects. Prospects. If you’ve got ‘em you can always deal from a position of strength. Teams should be able to evaluate whether or not to keep the Kemps and Loneys when they’re ready to go FA with having a deep farm system behind them. Some you”ll negociate their arb and first FA years for, some you won’t. Those you don’t retain you deal away before their free agency for something you need for the big club or more prospects. In trades, with knowledge of your personnel, theirs, and knowing where you project to be 4-5 years from now, again you’ll be trading from a position of power.

And with L.A. in particular, you’re dealing with an even stronger hand because with the lower team salary you now have a huge money base behind you to allow you to sign your own players or FAs.

You guys have said it all, but I have to agree. It is very clear that Nomar is not a major league third baseman. He’s drifting dangerously into Hillencrap territory. Never understand how the heck they thought he could play third either. At least Joe T bats him lower in the lineup, but still, ugh. Bills looks fantastic and then just lost it… this happens to him alot. What I want to know is what is Honeycutt doing to help him? Seems like he’s another one that should have been cut loose with Grittle. You’re right enchanted, Ned, along with this whole org, has no freaking plan.

Unfortunately, management is under the delusion that we’re only a FA or vet or two away from taking that next step. Reality is we’re 2-3 years away (if the kids play full time and get somemore experience) from having a GREAT team. So what we get is a never ending revolving door of has beens and not quites that usually keep us competative, but have the exact opposite effect on taking that next step and indeed keep us from ever taking that next step by blocking the progress of the young players.

There is no shortcut to a youth movement. You either commit wholeheartedly to it, or you go the Steinbrenner deep pockets route and buy up all the premier players.

We still have to go on the pretense that this is extended Spring training and Joe is trying to get a handle on what he has to work with. It’s the only thing that makes any sense. Unfortunately, by May, we will be hopelessly behind.

1) I don’t understand how Torre is handling Russell Martin. He has had 2 days off, and both when Billingsley started. Bills has great stuff (he was DEALING through 4.1 innings), but needs help on the game call and the mental game. Martin does this for him. They have been together since Rookie Ball in Ogden in 2003, and have come up through Vero Beach, Jacksonville, Las Vegas, and LA. I’ll put money on the line that Billingsley does not implode in the fifth if Martin is out there.
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Martin should ALWAYS catch Bills and Kuroda (language issues, but they seem to be able to communicate). Obviously, he should catch most of the time, but if Martin needs a day off, Penny and Lowe can figure out how to pitch on their own.
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And what makes it worse–Martin comes in to catch the last couple of innings. What the heck kind of day off is that????
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2) Nomar was an excellent shortstop in his day. He should be able to play third base. But he has been defensively lacking. He should have turned two on that ball in the fifth–and I think DeWitt would have.
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I’ll stand by my position that you have to give Nomar a little bit of time to evaluate where he’s at. But so far, this is not good.
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According to Tony Jackson, LaRoche is going to 2 days of extended spring training, and then can do no more of 20 days on a rehab stint, so he’s due back by May 13. Probably stupid for him to do just 2 rehab days like Nomar, but at this point, I certainly hope he gets back sooner rather than later. I am hopeful that he is the answer. And if he can’t do it, we should give it back to DeWitt.
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3) Someone mentioned Loney. I think he’s slumping. Hitless in the last 2 games, and his average is down to .317. But you’ve got to like it when someone is slumping and still hitting .317. So I have no doubt that Loney will get back on track very soon. He always knows how to get his swing back, and he has Easler and Mattingly on this trip.
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4) We got the leadoff hitter on in 7 of 9 innings, but didn’t score in any of them. I don’t know how you teach timely hitting, but we need it.
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5) Arizona will come back to Earth–but we have to start winning and not let it get out of control.

What happens is people say “This is LA” we can’t rebuild and we have stay competitive, but what we have been doing is signing over the hill crap thats NOT keeping us competitive, just mediocre, just saving us from embarrassment, and as a result the young guys are “eased” into full time role. Their definitely behind the curve when it comes to Arizona, Colorado, etc. The bull of having people who “know how to win” will continue as long as ned’s reign of terror continues. I bet you ANYTHING we will start really coming together and winning when the Kent/Nomar/Loaiza/Pierre/veteran contingent is gone. If they aren’t replaced by more of the same. I agree with you leekfink, I can’t believe how Torre has handled Bills so far–from putting in the pen, to the rain delay, to pairing him with Bennet twice already. And again—where is Honeycutt to say, hey Joe, maybe you should let Martin, the catcher who’s caught him SINCE the minors, catch him. Even though Martin’s struggling, its not as if Bennett is an offensive upgrade. ugh. Joe T is Grittle 2.0 until he proves otherwise.

For Bilz and the Dodgers to be successful, Bilz will have to learn how to get out of those tough situations and stop the bleeding at one or two runs instead of four. I think that was why Torre left him in. Sure Nomar coulda/shoulda turned the double play, but he didn’t. Bilz will have to develop some toughness.

I won’t try to analyze yesterday’s game or the big picture, which a couple of you before me have done very well. If we’re to get back on an even keel, I don’t think we’ll do it by handing the third base job to Nomar, nor by replacing Loney or Martin for a day or two. I don’t know what Torre thinks that Nomar is capable of bringing to the team at this point, but he’s clearly been rushing him. Nomar will come as close to admitting that as Nomar will ever say. So what was wrong with a .250 plus average, patience at the plate that resulted in a reasonable amount of walks, and good defensive play that needed Nomar to rush back in and replace. That’s just more of the “veterans are better” presumption that this management suffers from. Now we want to talk about giving Loney a rest because he’s hitless in all of two games, and that would put another defensive dent on the field.

The problem with this management is that nobody seems to know how to trust and work with the younger players, and they will always over-react to stick the over the hill veterans in the lineup with nothing more than hope that they’ll somehow rise to the level where they were several years ago. Nothing will change until we cut loose of the Nomars, Sweeneys, and even Kents and Pierres and work through the couple of years it may take to produce a young and vibrant competitive and winning team. I submit that this will never happen with Ned at the helm and possibly not with Torre in the dugout.

Get rid of Nomore, and Pierre and Kent. That’s a start. Let Dewitt play until Andy comes back , then have a competition between them to see who wins the job. Let Kemp and Ethier know they are the starters and won’t be pulled out after a bad couple of days. Then they can relax and let their talent take over. Start DY on occasion when one of the outfielders needs a rest and see what he can do, he might surprise, and if he’s no good at least you’ll find out and then be able to trade him for something you might be able to use.

I submit that Torre is the opposite type manager that this team needs. Torre favors the vets when half the team is youth. He’s also old and can’t think outside the box, nor evidently trust his coaching staff that did see this crap going on in Florida. Just perfect though for an owner and GM who love brining in big names and aging vets – and big name managers. Yet another symptom of management just not getting it. Its part PR move, part not understanding that he’s not the type manager you need for this team.

They had it right the first time when they targeted Girardi for the job, but when he went with the Yanks, why did they do a 180 and go with the exact opposite? Honestly, of the current coaching contingent, I’d rather see Bowa manage.

The guy who should be running the Dodger show is Mike Scioscia, but that’s a train long down the tracks. Scosh has that hard-nose mentality. Bowa’s got that hard-nose mentality. God I love the story of Alston challenging his players to a fight. Laidback is not what this team needs.

I should’ve added this to my GM requirements post above, but another thing regarding the minors – you damn well better get coaches that can teach the finer points of the game. There’s absolutely no reason why when a player has gone through HS, rookie ball, A, AA and AAA that you should have to teach them at the major league level situational hitting, being patient ae the plate, and a myriad of other things that they should know before they get to the show. I about schidt the other day when Pierre bunted with two outs, runners on, and the pitcher coming up.

OK I’ll get off my soapbox now, but I just hate to see this once proud organization foundering when if it just took a step back to see the problems and fix them properly, we could have a great organization for years to come.

You look at the summaries that we plain fans have put together here, and you have to wonder whether Frank ever looks at or thinks about this team and his investment in this kind of perspective. You would think that he is an intelligent guy to have come where he is today, but it looks to me like he too is operating without any kind of plan and sense other than what he’s going to do to Dodger Stadium next. Get a clue, draw up an operating plan for the team on the field over the next five years, and then get the management team in place that knows how to implement that plan. That’s what you’re missing, and any of us vocal fans could probably tell you how to fix it. What’s more important, you probably have a few people in your own organization that could do that as well, but their names aren’t Ned and Joe.

Good line-up with the exception of no Kemp. I’m not so sure about Andruw at clean up either, but I think this might be a good spot for Loney. Also, the 5-8 spots could get something done today as well as opposed to yesterday.

Gotta count this one as JP taking ABs away again from Kemp – nothing Kemp’s done to “earn” a day off.

This is exactly what we got from Grittle. Kemp’s either your best RF or he’s not. This in and out of the line-up crap is exactly what I’m talking about. Kemp’s young and makes mistakes, but he can’t learn and grow from the bench. I don’t see how JP in the line-ups going to score you anymore runs. So what you’ve done is gone from a plus to a minus in terms of talent, and compounded the mistake because its another set of ABs from which to learn from. I’m sure Jurrjins is shakin’ in his boots knowing he’s got to face JP.

Also, why bat him 2nd? He’s proven this year and last he doesn’t belong there. If Hu’s the 2B/SS of the future, let’s see what he can do there and put JP where he belongs in 8/9. I’m just sitting here shaking my head – there’s 3-4 mistakes and the game hasn’t even started.

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