At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

Yes he did. he remains on earth, behind the veil of the flesh, within the inner most sanctuary of every descendant of Noah.

After his death, he was reborn as the baby Noah, from which body he preached the Good News also to all those who were disobedient in the days that the ark was being built.

Interpolations in brackets are mine

From the "Book of Enoch the Prophet" CVI: 1-6, "Methuselah took a wife for his son Lamech, and she became pregnant by him and bore a son And his body was as white as snow and as red as the blooming of a rose, and the hair on his head and his long locks were white as wool, and his eyes beautiful. And when he opened his eyes, he lighted up the whole house like the sun, and the whole house was very bright. And thereupon he (Jesus) arose in the hands of the midwife, opened his mouth, and conversed with the Lord of righteousness (Enoch). And his father Lamech was afraid of him, (Just as Eve was terrified when she first saw "Cain the shinning one" and thought to kill him) and Lamech fled and ran to his father Methuselah. And he said to him: "I have begotten a strange son, diverse from and unlike man, and resembling the sons of the God of heaven; and his nature is different, and he is not like us, and his eyes are as the rays of the sun, and his countenance is glorious. And it seems that he is not sprung from me, but from the angels. And I fear that in his days, a wonder may be wrought on the earth.

At 1/20/2016 12:15:41 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.

Obviously you don't understand the question in the OP.

[------------------------------------Sophisto: Clearly, you do not understand the implications of your own OP.Jesus would not be playing espionage, lurking behind the shadows for 2000 years while doing nothing to influence humanity. As for current events, he would not resist trying to help humanity in its multiple crises either. So, no Jesus is not himself in the flesh when the whole point of the Christianity is to build a factory of defective copies of Jesus for mass distribution so that any wannabe fails to compare either way. Not only do you fail to understand me, you fail to comprehend the silliness and ignorance of your own wonderment.

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

Yes he did. he remains on earth, behind the veil of the flesh, within the inner most sanctuary of every descendant of Noah.

After his death, he was reborn as the baby Noah, from which body he preached the Good News also to all those who were disobedient in the days that the ark was being built.

Interpolations in brackets are mine

From the "Book of Enoch the Prophet" CVI: 1-6, "Methuselah took a wife for his son Lamech, and she became pregnant by him and bore a son And his body was as white as snow and as red as the blooming of a rose, and the hair on his head and his long locks were white as wool, and his eyes beautiful. And when he opened his eyes, he lighted up the whole house like the sun, and the whole house was very bright. And thereupon he (Jesus) arose in the hands of the midwife, opened his mouth, and conversed with the Lord of righteousness (Enoch). And his father Lamech was afraid of him, (Just as Eve was terrified when she first saw "Cain the shinning one" and thought to kill him) and Lamech fled and ran to his father Methuselah. And he said to him: "I have begotten a strange son, diverse from and unlike man, and resembling the sons of the God of heaven; and his nature is different, and he is not like us, and his eyes are as the rays of the sun, and his countenance is glorious. And it seems that he is not sprung from me, but from the angels. And I fear that in his days, a wonder may be wrought on the earth.

At 1/20/2016 12:15:41 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.

Obviously you don't understand the question in the OP.

[------------------------------------Sophisto: Clearly, you do not understand the implications of your own OP.

I understand its implications perfectly well. Obviously you have no idea what I understand. You can only speak for your own lack of understanding.

Jesus would not be playing espionage, lurking behind the shadows for 2000 years while doing nothing to influence humanity. As for current events, he would not resist trying to help humanity in its multiple crises either. So, no Jesus is not himself in the flesh when the whole point of the Christianity is to build a factory of defective copies of Jesus for mass distribution so that any wannabe fails to compare either way. Not only do you fail to understand me, you fail to comprehend the silliness and ignorance of your own wonderment.

So you are saying Jesus is not on Earth in the flesh today?

1John 4:2-3Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

"IS COME" is present tense not future or past tense.

I gather from your words that you don't believe or confess Jesus Christ IS COME in the flesh? What does that make you according to 1 John 4:3 ?ANTICHRIST ?

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

Eucharist.

So you ate him ?

God unites himself with his people. Giving them that which truly feed the soul, himself. Under the Jewish system you had to eat the sacrifice - God didn't set that up for no reason.

Jesus clearly stated that unless you eat his flesh and drink his blood, you have no life in you.

[------------------------------------Sophisto: Clearly, you do not understand the implications of your own OP.

I understand its implications perfectly well. Obviously you have no idea what I understand. You can only speak for your own lack of understanding.

Jesus would not be playing espionage, lurking behind the shadows for 2000 years while doing nothing to influence humanity. As for current events, he would not resist trying to help humanity in its multiple crises either. So, no Jesus is not himself in the flesh when the whole point of the Christianity is to build a factory of defective copies of Jesus for mass distribution so that any wannabe fails to compare either way. Not only do you fail to understand me, you fail to comprehend the silliness and ignorance of your own wonderment.

So you are saying Jesus is not on Earth in the flesh today?

1John 4:2-3Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

"IS COME" is present tense not future or past tense.

I gather from your words that you don't believe or confess Jesus Christ IS COME in the flesh? What does that make you according to 1 John 4:3 ?ANTICHRIST ?

----------------------------------Sophisto: You have confirmed my assertion that decent Christians are manifestations of Jesus in the flesh. Sure, Jesus is the messiah.

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

Eucharist.

So you ate him ?

God unites himself with his people. Giving them that which truly feed the soul, himself. Under the Jewish system you had to eat the sacrifice - God didn't set that up for no reason.

[------------------------------------Sophisto: Clearly, you do not understand the implications of your own OP.

I understand its implications perfectly well. Obviously you have no idea what I understand. You can only speak for your own lack of understanding.

Jesus would not be playing espionage, lurking behind the shadows for 2000 years while doing nothing to influence humanity. As for current events, he would not resist trying to help humanity in its multiple crises either. So, no Jesus is not himself in the flesh when the whole point of the Christianity is to build a factory of defective copies of Jesus for mass distribution so that any wannabe fails to compare either way. Not only do you fail to understand me, you fail to comprehend the silliness and ignorance of your own wonderment.

So you are saying Jesus is not on Earth in the flesh today?

1John 4:2-3Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

"IS COME" is present tense not future or past tense.

I gather from your words that you don't believe or confess Jesus Christ IS COME in the flesh? What does that make you according to 1 John 4:3 ?ANTICHRIST ?

----------------------------------Sophisto: You have confirmed my assertion that decent Christians are manifestations of Jesus in the flesh. Sure, Jesus is the messiah.

If Christians are the manifestation of Jesus in the flesh, that would make Christians the messiah.

Neh 9:27 Therefore thou deliveredst them into the hand of their enemies, who vexed them: and in the time of their trouble, when they cried unto thee, thou heardest them from heaven; and according to thy manifold mercies thou gavest them saviours, who saved them out of the hand of their enemies.

Oba 1:21 And saviours shall come up on mount Zion to judge the mount of Esau; and the kingdom shall be the LORD'S.

Notice the plural word saviours

Phil 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

If people cannot save themselves from their self deceptions, no God or Jesus or anyone else will save them either.

Truth is the messiah. The messiah is not a man.Only Truth can make people free.

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

As long as you reject Truth you will continue to believe lies because that is the consequence of rejecting Truth.

[------------------------------------Sophisto: Clearly, you do not understand the implications of your own OP.

I understand its implications perfectly well. Obviously you have no idea what I understand. You can only speak for your own lack of understanding.

Jesus would not be playing espionage, lurking behind the shadows for 2000 years while doing nothing to influence humanity. As for current events, he would not resist trying to help humanity in its multiple crises either. So, no Jesus is not himself in the flesh when the whole point of the Christianity is to build a factory of defective copies of Jesus for mass distribution so that any wannabe fails to compare either way. Not only do you fail to understand me, you fail to comprehend the silliness and ignorance of your own wonderment.

So you are saying Jesus is not on Earth in the flesh today?

1John 4:2-3Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

"IS COME" is present tense not future or past tense.

I gather from your words that you don't believe or confess Jesus Christ IS COME in the flesh? What does that make you according to 1 John 4:3 ?ANTICHRIST ?

----------------------------------Sophisto: You have confirmed my assertion that decent Christians are manifestations of Jesus in the flesh. Sure, Jesus is the messiah.

If Christians are the manifestation of Jesus in the flesh, that would make Christians the messiah.

Neh 9:27 Therefore thou deliveredst them into the hand of their enemies, who vexed them: and in the time of their trouble, when they cried unto thee, thou heardest them from heaven; and according to thy manifold mercies thou gavest them saviours, who saved them out of the hand of their enemies.

Oba 1:21 And saviours shall come up on mount Zion to judge the mount of Esau; and the kingdom shall be the LORD'S.

Notice the plural word saviours

Phil 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

If people cannot save themselves from their self deceptions, no God or Jesus or anyone else will save them either.

Truth is the messiah. The messiah is not a man.Only Truth can make people free.

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

As long as you reject Truth you will continue to believe lies because that is the consequence of rejecting Truth.

Another example of someone who has NO biblical understanding whatsoever.

I'm going to say it again Skyangel, (AKA dingdong) You don't know what the bible says, you don't know what any of it means, you continuously slander God's word, and you think God doesn't see it? Oh my.....

Christians do not claim to be Christ, (unless they are nuts like you.)

Someone said that you are on a slippery slope, and that person was telling the truth.

How many times do others have to tell you the truth? I just doesn't seem to sink into that thick skull of yours.

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

Eucharist.

So you ate him ?

God unites himself with his people. Giving them that which truly feed the soul, himself. Under the Jewish system you had to eat the sacrifice - God didn't set that up for no reason.

Jesus clearly stated that unless you eat his flesh and drink his blood, you have no life in you.

All living people have life in them.

But not divine life. It is by God that we are spiritually animated.

This is why the Romans thought Christians were cannibals.

Apparently many of the Jews in the story misunderstood Jesus too.John 6:66

Precisely. I always find it ironic that the verse is 666. Jesus let them walk away. He didn't try to correct them or explain a deeper allegorical meaning to what he was saying. He let those who did not believe in him walk away. If I'm mistaken this is the only time in the bible that his followers walk away in disbelief.

To eat the flesh and drink the blood of the mythical character is merely metaphoric of partaking of his life and following his example of living a WAY of LIFE in TRUTH.

This is your interpretation, which holds absolutely no historical or theological weight.

Take a look at 1 Corinthians 11:17-34.

Paul chastises people for being drunk or coming and eating big meals while there are others present who have nothing to eat. They were showing off their wealth in front of other Christians. Paul told them to go and eat their earthly food in their own houses before coming to worship.

Paul then starts off explaining the difference in the eucharist saying that he is passing on what he received. He then proceeds to talk about the literal bread and wine at the last supper. He then explains that you have to examine yourself so that you do not eat and drink in an unworthy manner. If you are unworthy and eat and drink then you are guilty of the body and blood of Jesus. That is quite the damning statement (literally!) and not something that can be applied to a symbol.

Sophisto: You have confirmed my assertion that decent Christians are manifestations of Jesus in the flesh. Sure, Jesus is the messiah.

If Christians are the manifestation of Jesus in the flesh, that would make Christians the messiah.

Neh 9:27 Therefore thou deliveredst them into the hand of their enemies, who vexed them: and in the time of their trouble, when they cried unto thee, thou heardest them from heaven; and according to thy manifold mercies thou gavest them saviours, who saved them out of the hand of their enemies.

Oba 1:21 And saviours shall come up on mount Zion to judge the mount of Esau; and the kingdom shall be the LORD'S.

Notice the plural word saviours

Phil 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

If people cannot save themselves from their self deceptions, no God or Jesus or anyone else will save them either.

Truth is the messiah. The messiah is not a man.Only Truth can make people free.

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

As long as you reject Truth you will continue to believe lies because that is the consequence of rejecting Truth.

Another example of someone who has NO biblical understanding whatsoever.

I'm going to say it again Skyangel, (AKA dingdong) You don't know what the bible says, you don't know what any of it means, you continuously slander God's word, and you think God doesn't see it? Oh my.....

You are clueless as to what I know. I am a mirror and you see your own cluelessness in me.Your own preconceived ideas and biases are fooling you into a believing your own lies.

Christians do not claim to be Christ, (unless they are nuts like you.)

Most Christians still claim to be sinners, therefore they are not even saved like they claim to be. Christians make many false claims, preach many false doctrines and pretend to be something they are not.

If you believe your own bible, the way you judge me is the way you judge God. (Matt 25:31-46)I am "the least of these" in your eyes and you are the cursed unprofitable servant in my eyes.

Someone said that you are on a slippery slope, and that person was telling the truth.

The people who see me on any slippery slope are merely seeing a reflection of themselves in me. I am on perfectly solid ground and cannot be shaken. My feet are firmly grounded in reality not in childish superstitions which include belief in a mythical god.

How many times do others have to tell you the truth? I just doesn't seem to sink into that thick skull of yours.

Take your own words and apply them to yourself. Your own words judge you.Matt 12:37 ............ by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

The truth is God is a mythical character who merely personifies LIFE and TRUTH.Jesus is a mythical character who personifies a WAY of LIFE in TRUTH.

Sophisto: You have confirmed my assertion that decent Christians are manifestations of Jesus in the flesh. Sure, Jesus is the messiah.

If Christians are the manifestation of Jesus in the flesh, that would make Christians the messiah.

Neh 9:27 Therefore thou deliveredst them into the hand of their enemies, who vexed them: and in the time of their trouble, when they cried unto thee, thou heardest them from heaven; and according to thy manifold mercies thou gavest them saviours, who saved them out of the hand of their enemies.

Oba 1:21 And saviours shall come up on mount Zion to judge the mount of Esau; and the kingdom shall be the LORD'S.

Notice the plural word saviours

Phil 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

If people cannot save themselves from their self deceptions, no God or Jesus or anyone else will save them either.

Truth is the messiah. The messiah is not a man.Only Truth can make people free.

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

As long as you reject Truth you will continue to believe lies because that is the consequence of rejecting Truth.

Another example of someone who has NO biblical understanding whatsoever.

I'm going to say it again Skyangel, (AKA dingdong) You don't know what the bible says, you don't know what any of it means, you continuously slander God's word, and you think God doesn't see it? Oh my.....

You are clueless as to what I know. I am a mirror and you see your own cluelessness in me.Your own preconceived ideas and biases are fooling you into a believing your own lies.

Christians do not claim to be Christ, (unless they are nuts like you.)

Most Christians still claim to be sinners, therefore they are not even saved like they claim to be. Christians make many false claims, preach many false doctrines and pretend to be something they are not.

If you believe your own bible, the way you judge me is the way you judge God. (Matt 25:31-46)I am "the least of these" in your eyes and you are the cursed unprofitable servant in my eyes.

Someone said that you are on a slippery slope, and that person was telling the truth.

The people who see me on any slippery slope are merely seeing a reflection of themselves in me. I am on perfectly solid ground and cannot be shaken. My feet are firmly grounded in reality not in childish superstitions which include belief in a mythical god.

How many times do others have to tell you the truth? I just doesn't seem to sink into that thick skull of yours.

Take your own words and apply them to yourself. Your own words judge you.Matt 12:37 ............ by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

The truth is God is a mythical character who merely personifies LIFE and TRUTH.Jesus is a mythical character who personifies a WAY of LIFE in TRUTH.

Try to get that fact into that thick skull of yours.

The truth is, this isn't some little fairy-tale that you can make up as you go along.

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

In the verse Jesus tells his disciples he will be with them always until the end of the world. So where his disciples are so will Jesus be with them also. His disciples are dead and in heaven....so too is Jesus with them in heaven and will be there even if the world should end.

Jesus clearly stated that unless you eat his flesh and drink his blood, you have no life in you.

All living people have life in them.

But not divine life. It is by God that we are spiritually animated.

What according to you, is the difference between divine life and ordinary life.

This is why the Romans thought Christians were cannibals.

Apparently many of the Jews in the story misunderstood Jesus too.John 6:66

Precisely. I always find it ironic that the verse is 666. Jesus let them walk away. He didn't try to correct them or explain a deeper allegorical meaning to what he was saying. He let those who did not believe in him walk away. If I'm mistaken this is the only time in the bible that his followers walk away in disbelief.

Many still walk away from truth in disbelief today.They are too busy worshiping their idols to believe the truth about those idols.

To eat the flesh and drink the blood of the mythical character is merely metaphoric of partaking of his life and following his example of living a WAY of LIFE in TRUTH.

This is your interpretation, which holds absolutely no historical or theological weight.

Theological weight is an illusion designed to fool the gullible into believing lies. Theologians are people who teach false doctrines after all.

Take a look at 1 Corinthians 11:17-34.

Paul chastises people for being drunk or coming and eating big meals while there are others present who have nothing to eat. They were showing off their wealth in front of other Christians. Paul told them to go and eat their earthly food in their own houses before coming to worship.

Paul then starts off explaining the difference in the eucharist saying that he is passing on what he received. He then proceeds to talk about the literal bread and wine at the last supper. He then explains that you have to examine yourself so that you do not eat and drink in an unworthy manner. If you are unworthy and eat and drink then you are guilty of the body and blood of Jesus. That is quite the damning statement (literally!) and not something that can be applied to a symbol.

Sure it can be applied to a symbol. Consider the bread of life is the TRUTH. Those who turn the Truth into a lie are unworthy of the Truth. They partake of Truth in an unworthy manner. Professing themselves to be wise, they become fools. They worship the creature ( the man Jesus ) more than the creator which is not a man.

Sophisto: You have confirmed my assertion that decent Christians are manifestations of Jesus in the flesh. Sure, Jesus is the messiah.

If Christians are the manifestation of Jesus in the flesh, that would make Christians the messiah.

Neh 9:27 Therefore thou deliveredst them into the hand of their enemies, who vexed them: and in the time of their trouble, when they cried unto thee, thou heardest them from heaven; and according to thy manifold mercies thou gavest them saviours, who saved them out of the hand of their enemies.

Oba 1:21 And saviours shall come up on mount Zion to judge the mount of Esau; and the kingdom shall be the LORD'S.

Notice the plural word saviours

Phil 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

If people cannot save themselves from their self deceptions, no God or Jesus or anyone else will save them either.

Truth is the messiah. The messiah is not a man.Only Truth can make people free.

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

As long as you reject Truth you will continue to believe lies because that is the consequence of rejecting Truth.

Another example of someone who has NO biblical understanding whatsoever.

I'm going to say it again Skyangel, (AKA dingdong) You don't know what the bible says, you don't know what any of it means, you continuously slander God's word, and you think God doesn't see it? Oh my.....

You are clueless as to what I know. I am a mirror and you see your own cluelessness in me.Your own preconceived ideas and biases are fooling you into a believing your own lies.

Christians do not claim to be Christ, (unless they are nuts like you.)

Most Christians still claim to be sinners, therefore they are not even saved like they claim to be. Christians make many false claims, preach many false doctrines and pretend to be something they are not.

If you believe your own bible, the way you judge me is the way you judge God. (Matt 25:31-46)I am "the least of these" in your eyes and you are the cursed unprofitable servant in my eyes.

Someone said that you are on a slippery slope, and that person was telling the truth.

The people who see me on any slippery slope are merely seeing a reflection of themselves in me. I am on perfectly solid ground and cannot be shaken. My feet are firmly grounded in reality not in childish superstitions which include belief in a mythical god.

How many times do others have to tell you the truth? I just doesn't seem to sink into that thick skull of yours.

Take your own words and apply them to yourself. Your own words judge you.Matt 12:37 ............ by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

The truth is God is a mythical character who merely personifies LIFE and TRUTH.Jesus is a mythical character who personifies a WAY of LIFE in TRUTH.

Try to get that fact into that thick skull of yours.

The truth is, this isn't some little fairy-tale that you can make up as you go along.

God is real and His word is the truth.

Sure, God is as real as Mother Nature and her word is also the Truth. She speaks through creation the same as God does. She tells you when it will be a fine day or a rainy day, winter or summer by signs all around you. You simply need to know how to read the signs.Both are a personification of natural forces. Nothing more and nothing less.

God is LIFE which you can clearly see all around you unless you are blind.

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

In the verse Jesus tells his disciples he will be with them always until the end of the world. So where his disciples are so will Jesus be with them also. His disciples are dead and in heaven....so too is Jesus with them in heaven and will be there even if the world should end.

Apparently you don't believe he gained more disciples or stayed on Earth till the end of the world.

John 8:32 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

Are todays believers not disciples of Jesus ? Do they not continue in his word?Is Jesus not with them in the flesh ?

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

In the verse Jesus tells his disciples he will be with them always until the end of the world. So where his disciples are so will Jesus be with them also. His disciples are dead and in heaven....so too is Jesus with them in heaven and will be there even if the world should end.

Apparently you don't believe he gained more disciples or stayed on Earth till the end of the world.

In. Matt 28:20 Jesus is talking to his 11 disciples and commissioning them after his resurrection. Try and read the verse in its proper context.

John 8:32 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

But those Jews were not with him when he spoke to the 11 remaining disciples in Matthew 28:20. You are taking both Matthew and John out of context. Any wonder why you failed as a Christian.

Are todays believers not disciples of Jesus ? Do they not continue in his word?Is Jesus not with them in the flesh ?

Jesus said the Holy Spirit would come to them after his departure.John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

Sophisto: You have confirmed my assertion that decent Christians are manifestations of Jesus in the flesh. Sure, Jesus is the messiah.

If Christians are the manifestation of Jesus in the flesh, that would make Christians the messiah.

Neh 9:27 Therefore thou deliveredst them into the hand of their enemies, who vexed them: and in the time of their trouble, when they cried unto thee, thou heardest them from heaven; and according to thy manifold mercies thou gavest them saviours, who saved them out of the hand of their enemies.

Oba 1:21 And saviours shall come up on mount Zion to judge the mount of Esau; and the kingdom shall be the LORD'S.

Notice the plural word saviours

Phil 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

If people cannot save themselves from their self deceptions, no God or Jesus or anyone else will save them either.

Truth is the messiah. The messiah is not a man.Only Truth can make people free.

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

As long as you reject Truth you will continue to believe lies because that is the consequence of rejecting Truth.

Another example of someone who has NO biblical understanding whatsoever.

I'm going to say it again Skyangel, (AKA dingdong) You don't know what the bible says, you don't know what any of it means, you continuously slander God's word, and you think God doesn't see it? Oh my.....

You are clueless as to what I know. I am a mirror and you see your own cluelessness in me.Your own preconceived ideas and biases are fooling you into a believing your own lies.

Christians do not claim to be Christ, (unless they are nuts like you.)

Most Christians still claim to be sinners, therefore they are not even saved like they claim to be. Christians make many false claims, preach many false doctrines and pretend to be something they are not.

If you believe your own bible, the way you judge me is the way you judge God. (Matt 25:31-46)I am "the least of these" in your eyes and you are the cursed unprofitable servant in my eyes.

Someone said that you are on a slippery slope, and that person was telling the truth.

The people who see me on any slippery slope are merely seeing a reflection of themselves in me. I am on perfectly solid ground and cannot be shaken. My feet are firmly grounded in reality not in childish superstitions which include belief in a mythical god.

How many times do others have to tell you the truth? I just doesn't seem to sink into that thick skull of yours.

Take your own words and apply them to yourself. Your own words judge you.Matt 12:37 ............ by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

The truth is God is a mythical character who merely personifies LIFE and TRUTH.Jesus is a mythical character who personifies a WAY of LIFE in TRUTH.

Try to get that fact into that thick skull of yours.

The truth is, this isn't some little fairy-tale that you can make up as you go along.

God is real and His word is the truth.

Sure, God is as real as Mother Nature and her word is also the Truth. She speaks through creation the same as God does. She tells you when it will be a fine day or a rainy day, winter or summer by signs all around you. You simply need to know how to read the signs.Both are a personification of natural forces. Nothing more and nothing less.

God is LIFE which you can clearly see all around you unless you are blind.

Creation is your god....instead of the creator. Yep, even certain reprobates in the bible worshiped creation. Everything that you say is old news! This has all been done SkyAngel. It's not even interesting!

Here's what it says about you Skyangel. Since you want to keep quoting the bible and all...,

Jeremiah 2:27 Saying to a stock, Thou art my father; and to a stone, Thou hast brought me forth: for they have turned their back unto me, and not their face: but in the time of their trouble they will say, Arise, and save us.Jeremiah 2:28 But where are thy gods that thou hast made thee? let them arise, if they can save thee in the time of thy trouble: for according to the number of thy cities are thy gods, O Judah.

Do you see how they were worshiping created things? When you are at a point of trouble, why do you test it and see how much help a rock is, or a tree....Good luck with that.

Ezekiel 8:16 And he brought me into the inner court of the LORD's house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the LORD, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the LORD, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east.

Do you see how the people even did this way back then? They were worshiping the sun.Ezekiel 8:17 Then he said unto me, Hast thou seen this, O son of man? Is it a light thing to the house of Judah that they commit the abominations which they commit here? for they have filled the land with violence, and have returned to provoke me to anger: and, lo, they put the branch to their nose.

How shameful...

Now this really speaks of you SkyAngel:

ROMANS 1:25They traded the truth about God for a lie. So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen.

When people continuously reject the true and living God, they are handed over to a reprobate mind.

ROMANS 1:28:Since they thought it foolish to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their foolish thinking and let them do things that should never be done.

This is why you won't see the truth, because of your own stubbornness.Matthew 13:15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

I bet you don't even read those verses, and if you happen to read them with your very dim vision, you'll reject them and twist them like you do every time you speak of God's word.

But keep slandering God's word and you'll understand this passage.

Hebrews 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.Hebrews 10:31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

"If you believe your own bible, the way you judge me is the way you judge God. (Matt 25:31-46)I am "the least of these" in your eyes and you are the cursed unprofitable servant in my eyes."

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Oh goodness...Let's read this together, shall we?

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:Matthew 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:

This is all true, and every eye will see him, and I guarantee, every knee will bow.

Matthew 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

Who do you think the goats are Skyagnel?

Matthew 25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:Matthew 25:35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:Matthew 25:36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.Matthew 25:37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?Matthew 25:38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?Matthew 25:39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?Matthew 25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these <strong>my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

Now do you see who He is calling the "least of these," HIS brethren! You slander and deny Him constantly. You are NOT his brethren.

By slandering HIM, and his followers, YOU are the one doing wrong! You are the goat!

Matthew 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

And Yes, I can judge this! Stop using that infantile excuse against Christians. We are to judge what it true and what it a lie. And you do nothing but lie!

It's not too late for you.

My last advice is HIS advice:

Revelation 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:Revelation 3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

At 1/20/2016 12:16:34 AM, Sophisto wrote:Why would he want to die again? What purpose is there in that?Don't expect a plausible scenario.Jesus doesn't need to come back until he's given a better reason than you can imagine...

Jesus claimed he would remain on Earth till the end of the world.

Matt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

So answer the question if you can... Did he remain on Earth in the flesh or did he leave the Earth and broke his promise to stay till the end of the world?

In the verse Jesus tells his disciples he will be with them always until the end of the world. So where his disciples are so will Jesus be with them also. His disciples are dead and in heaven....so too is Jesus with them in heaven and will be there even if the world should end.

Apparently you don't believe he gained more disciples or stayed on Earth till the end of the world.

In. Matt 28:20 Jesus is talking to his 11 disciples and commissioning them after his resurrection. Try and read the verse in its proper context.

The words of Jesus apply to all his disciples not just to 11 people. He had a lot more than just 11 disciples. The 11 were simply a small sample of the followers he had.John 4:1 ............................Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John,Acts 1: 15 And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,)

Acts 6:1... And in those days, when the number of the disciples was multiplied,Acts 6:2.. Then the twelve called the multitude of the disciplesActs 6:7 the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly

You are greatly mistaken if you believe that every mention of the word disciples in the bible is only referring to 11 or 12 people.Many disciples left Jesus in John 6:66. From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.

That shows there were a lot more than just 12 disciples at the time.You need to get out of the box you are stuck in.

John 8:32 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

But those Jews were not with him when he spoke to the 11 remaining disciples in Matthew 28:20. You are taking both Matthew and John out of context. Any wonder why you failed as a Christian.

The words of Jesus apply to all disciples of the past present and future whether you want to accept that fact or not.If you want to believe the words of Jesus apply only to the characters in the stories, you are basically implying that none of the bible is relevant to anyone living on this planet today.Is that what you are saying?If so, there is no such thing as a failed Christian since Christianity would be irrelevant today since it would only apply to the people in the bible and not to anyone else at any time. Failed Christians in that case would be those who claim to be disciples of Jesus today. I make no such claim. I graduated from the false doctrines of Christianity when I realized the truth that they were false.

Are todays believers not disciples of Jesus ? Do they not continue in his word?Is Jesus not with them in the flesh ?

Jesus said the Holy Spirit would come to them after his departure.John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

John 14:16-18 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

The character who represented the TRUTH ( Spirit of Truth ) was basically saying that he, the TRUTH, would dwell in the fleshly bodies of the disciples in the same way he dwelt in the fleshly body of the Jesus character. The return of Christ in the flesh is about Truth manifesting itself in the flesh of all disciples. It is not about a single person named Jesus returning to Earth.Christ is on Earth in the flesh of all who live a WAY of LIFE in TRUTH and do not idolize a person as God.

Truth is not a person. Truth is reality. Reality is constantly judged by people as good or bad.

Christ in the flesh is simply a personification of physical reality. Physical reality is always on this planet and so are many ways of personifying it in literature.

Sure, God is as real as Mother Nature and her word is also the Truth. She speaks through creation the same as God does. She tells you when it will be a fine day or a rainy day, winter or summer by signs all around you. You simply need to know how to read the signs.Both are a personification of natural forces. Nothing more and nothing less.

God is LIFE which you can clearly see all around you unless you are blind.

Creation is your god....instead of the creator. Yep, even certain reprobates in the bible worshiped creation. Everything that you say is old news! This has all been done SkyAngel. It's not even interesting!

Creation is not God or my god any more than Nature is Mother Nature or any other god. God is a personification of creation. I do not worship creation or nature as if it was some god. I perform no religious rituals to any gods at all. I don't talk to trees or think there are some kind of tree spirits in them or anything like that.I don't pray to the universe. I simply live an ordinary life accepting reality as the wonderful process it is.The old news is that your speculations about me are totally false. You have no clue who I am or what I believe. Everything I s write is filtered through the preconceived ideas and biases of readers who end up with false conclusions due to lacking objectivity regarding their own biases.

Here's what it says about you Skyangel. Since you want to keep quoting the bible and all...,

Jeremiah 2:27 Saying to a stock, Thou art my father; and to a stone, Thou hast brought me forth: for they have turned their back unto me, and not their face: but in the time of their trouble they will say, Arise, and save us.Jeremiah 2:28 But where are thy gods that thou hast made thee? let them arise, if they can save thee in the time of thy trouble: for according to the number of thy cities are thy gods, O Judah.

Do you see how they were worshiping created things? When you are at a point of trouble, why do you test it and see how much help a rock is, or a tree....Good luck with that.

That's why I don't bother praying to anything at all. Those who worship Jesus are also worshiping a created being, a man as God. Those people have turned their back on the very thing God represents and worship the character instead of living in the principle which is taught. That principle is about living a WAY of LIFE in TRUTH which is all about repenting from idolatry and not worshiping any gods as characters at all. It is about understanding God is a SPIRIT of TRUTH not a character of any kind. If you ever get that revelation you will put aside childish beliefs in mythical gods and stop performing religious rituals to please them.

Ezekiel 8:16 And he brought me into the inner court of the LORD's house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the LORD, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the LORD, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east.

Do you see how the people even did this way back then? They were worshiping the sun.

Worshiping the Son is just as bad since God is not a man.

Ezekiel 8:17 Then he said unto me, Hast thou seen this, O son of man? Is it a light thing to the house of Judah that they commit the abominations which they commit here? for they have filled the land with violence, and have returned to provoke me to anger: and, lo, they put the branch to their nose.

How shameful...

Believers in mythical gods ought to be thoroughly ashamed of themselves.

Now this really speaks of you SkyAngel:

ROMANS 1:25They traded the truth about God for a lie. So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen.

The Truth set me free from those who traded the truth for a lie. Those traders are the believers who trade the Truth that all gods are mythical characters for the lie that one God is a character in the form of a man and continue to worship that mythical character.

When people continuously reject the true and living God, they are handed over to a reprobate mind.

ROMANS 1:28:Since they thought it foolish to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their foolish thinking and let them do things that should never be done.

This is why you won't see the truth, because of your own stubbornness.

The fact that I saw the Light is what makes me stubborn and not want to go back to idolatry. You on the other hand are still stuck in your idolatry because you reject the truth that wants to set you free from it.I acknowledge God as a personification of all reality and I can see God as clearly as I see reality. The character is a myth but the thing he represents is very real.

Matthew 13:15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

I bet you don't even read those verses, and if you happen to read them with your very dim vision, you'll reject them and twist them like you do every time you speak of God's word.

The words apply to all readers. I know I am blind and that is why I also see better than most who claim that they can see.Isaiah 42:19 Who is blind, but my servant? or deaf, as my messenger that I sent? who is blind as he that is perfect, and blind as the LORD'S servant?

But keep slandering God's word and you'll understand this passage.Hebrews 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.Hebrews 10:31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

I understand it better than you will ever know.I am in the hands of the living God at all times. I am in him and he is in me. We are one LIFE and one TRUTH.It is no longer I that lives but TRUTH which lives in me.