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I tested positive February 2012 and had two negative tests in the past 12-18 months (one in June 2011 and one in December of 2010.)

While my boyfriend and I did have group sex occasionally, we ALWAYS used condoms. If someone even pushed at not using a condom, we would refrain from doing anything with that person. No condoms ever broke. We've always been adventurous with our sex life, but always made sure we were safe about it when inviting other people over and got tested regularly. Even though we were not monogamous, we always used protection outside of our relationship and thus thought our relationship was isolated, so we did have bareback sex between the two of us.

So roll around to February when I test positive. My numbers were not good - my CD4 was at 48 and my viral load was 750k. I'm starting to wonder if my boyfriend is one of the rare types of "silent carriers". While he has tested negative with oraquick tests, there's also evidence to say he has the virus but just isn't responding to it. He's said he had numerous unprotected encounters with people who he knew were HIV+ (this had been years prior, 3-5 years ago). His ex boyfriend also became positive shortly after they started dating, but he just thought there was cheating involved there. When I heard this, it seemed a little questionable, but after getting tested together repeatedly my worries dissolved. I thought he was completely safe to be sexual with.

It would also explain how my viral load would have become so high at such a fast rate if we repeatedly had unprotected sex and he just repeatedly infected me with more virus, right? My doctor said that it would seem I had been infected for a long time to have my bloodwork come back with such troublesome results.

I'm just trying to make sense of how I was infected. If my boyfriend is a Silent Carrier, are there tests to find this out?

I tested positive February 2012 and had two negative tests in the past 12-18 months (one in June 2011 and one in December of 2010.)

While my boyfriend and I did have group sex occasionally, we ALWAYS used condoms. If someone even pushed at not using a condom, we would refrain from doing anything with that person. No condoms ever broke. We've always been adventurous with our sex life, but always made sure we were safe about it when inviting other people over and got tested regularly. Even though we were not monogamous, we always used protection outside of our relationship and thus thought our relationship was isolated, so we did have bareback sex between the two of us.

So roll around to February when I test positive. My numbers were not good - my CD4 was at 48 and my viral load was 750k. I'm starting to wonder if my boyfriend is one of the rare types of "silent carriers". While he has tested negative with oraquick tests, there's also evidence to say he has the virus but just isn't responding to it. He's said he had numerous unprotected encounters with people who he knew were HIV+ (this had been years prior, 3-5 years ago). His ex boyfriend also became positive shortly after they started dating, but he just thought there was cheating involved there. When I heard this, it seemed a little questionable, but after getting tested together repeatedly my worries dissolved. I thought he was completely safe to be sexual with.

It would also explain how my viral load would have become so high at such a fast rate if we repeatedly had unprotected sex and he just repeatedly infected me with more virus, right? My doctor said that it would seem I had been infected for a long time to have my bloodwork come back with such troublesome results.

I'm just trying to make sense of how I was infected. If my boyfriend is a Silent Carrier, are there tests to find this out?

Lots of things not adding up, so I can see your confusion!

First of all and most important, welcome to the forum and sorry you had to get HIV!

Secondly, so where are you now for numbers and/or treatment. You reported numbers from February, its mid April, now.

Third, what kind of tests did you have the last two negative tests? If they were a reliable testing method, then obviously you have not had a long infection, your doctor's hunch notwithstanding. And did your bf test at the same times, and by the same methods, and did you see his results, were you there with him? And, was he tested in February, same time as your unfortunate positive test, and by what method, and was he negative. And is he tested again now, negative?Oral quicktests may not be reliable. If that is all he has ever had, get him into your ID doc for a real tests. They can even test for HIV directly when there is no antibody.

Fourth, your theory about constant reinfection producing your poor numbers isn't very good. You can have horrible numbers in primary/acute infection. Also, you can just not be a very good fighter, genetically. It is possible to have hideous numbers rather quickly, though its not the norm.

Fifth - "silent HIV infection" was something talked about in the 90's. Does it even exist? What did your ID specialist say about this theory? Has your HIV specialist overseen a very reliable testing of your BF's status? Perhaps that is in order. If he gets one, and he is declared HIV- by your doctor, that solves the mystery, doesn't it? There was some unknown risk but it wouldn't be with your BF. There are very occassionally HIV infections that can never be identified as to how and from whom and when. The important thing is to go forward from here.

How its the relationship holding up with this new development...?

And how are you doing generally?

« Last Edit: April 22, 2012, 05:38:49 PM by mecch »

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“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

I tested positive February 2012 and had two negative tests in the past 12-18 months (one in June 2011 and one in December of 2010.)

While my boyfriend and I did have group sex occasionally, we ALWAYS used condoms. If someone even pushed at not using a condom, we would refrain from doing anything with that person. No condoms ever broke. We've always been adventurous with our sex life, but always made sure we were safe about it when inviting other people over and got tested regularly. Even though we were not monogamous, we always used protection outside of our relationship and thus thought our relationship was isolated, so we did have bareback sex between the two of us.

So roll around to February when I test positive. My numbers were not good - my CD4 was at 48 and my viral load was 750k. I'm starting to wonder if my boyfriend is one of the rare types of "silent carriers". While he has tested negative with oraquick tests, there's also evidence to say he has the virus but just isn't responding to it. He's said he had numerous unprotected encounters with people who he knew were HIV+ (this had been years prior, 3-5 years ago). His ex boyfriend also became positive shortly after they started dating, but he just thought there was cheating involved there. When I heard this, it seemed a little questionable, but after getting tested together repeatedly my worries dissolved. I thought he was completely safe to be sexual with.

It would also explain how my viral load would have become so high at such a fast rate if we repeatedly had unprotected sex and he just repeatedly infected me with more virus, right? My doctor said that it would seem I had been infected for a long time to have my bloodwork come back with such troublesome results.

I'm just trying to make sense of how I was infected. If my boyfriend is a Silent Carrier, are there tests to find this out?

Hi moto,

Sorry you tested poz, but welcome to the forums.

Testing poz is an intense experience and it’s normal to be caught in a whirlwind of thoughts and fears in the first few months, particularly by questions haunting you on how you became infected if the answer isn’t evident.

I can’t comment on the reliability of this Oraquick test as I have no knowledge about it, but if your bf has tested negative then we must assume that he has dodged infection despite his close shaves. If he tested HIV- 3 months (or are 12 weeks adequate?) after his last bareback experience then he is reliably HIV-.

When I was diagnosed, I too was in an open relationship, and my bf tested negative. We both used condoms consistently when we played outside the relationship and I had a tough time putting a finger on how and when I acquired my infection- since his test came negative (in spite of us barebacking several times). It finally dawned on me that I had had some drunken encounters many years ago (as far back as 2005-06) and slipped up there, most likely. Truth is, I still don’t know, and will perhaps never know, how I contracted HIV with a finer precision of certainty than ‘I probably slipped up or something went badly wrong in my encounters 5/6 years ago’. I have now come to peace with that.

I understand how hard it can be to shake the desire of pinning down the specifics of your infection; however, having been down that road I can tell you that it can tend to mess up your mind a little bit.

The important thing is to look forward and not backward. You can’t change your past, but you can change the way you look at your future.

First of all and most important, welcome to the forum and sorry you had to get HIV!

Secondly, so where are you now for numbers and/or treatment. You reported numbers from February, its mid April, now.

Third, what kind of tests did you have the last two negative tests? If they were a reliable testing method, then obviously you have not had a long infection, your doctor's hunch notwithstanding. And did your bf test at the same times, and by the same methods, and did you see his results, were you there with him? And, was he tested in February, same time as your unfortunate positive test, and by what method, and was he negative. And is he tested again now, negative?Oral quicktests may not be reliable. If that is all he has ever had, get him into your ID doc for a real tests. They can even test for HIV directly when there is no antibody.

Fourth, your theory about constant reinfection producing your poor numbers isn't very good. You can have horrible numbers in primary/acute infection. Also, you can just not be a very good fighter, genetically. It is possible to have hideous numbers rather quickly, though its not the norm.

Fifth - "silent HIV infection" was something talked about in the 90's. Does it even exist? What did your ID specialist say about this theory? Has your HIV specialist overseen a very reliable testing of your BF's status? Perhaps that is in order. If he gets one, and he is declared HIV- by your doctor, that solves the mystery, doesn't it? There was some unknown risk but it wouldn't be with your BF. There are very occassionally HIV infections that can never be identified as to how and from whom and when. The important thing is to go forward from here.

How its the relationship holding up with this new development...?

And how are you doing generally?

Thanks for the response everyone. It all really helps.

I actually just got back from the doctor's office for my second ever cd4/viral load count. This one will be my first after I started my prezista/norvir/truvada regimen. I'm hoping for the best.

Secondly, my boyfriend and I always went to get our oraquick tests together. While I never saw his results, I trusted him when he said they were negative. Though after talking to my doctor today, he said the best route from here would for him to do an RNA Blood test to look for the actual virus rather than the antibody (in the case that he hasn't produced any yet).

Hopefully he is okay. I know he has expressed fear of even being tested in the case that he is positive - though I told him that not knowing his status is by far the worst scenario. I very much wish I had known my positive status sooner so I could have started a less aggressive treatment regimen.

Though after talking to my doctor today, he said the best route from here would for him to do an RNA Blood test to look for the actual virus rather than the antibody (in the case that he hasn't produced any yet).

I very much wish I had known my positive status sooner so I could have started a less aggressive treatment regimen.

If you tested negative less than a year ago, it does not make sense to believe you have had HIV a long time. IN fact, pat yourself on the back because discovering you are HIV+ just a couple of months after infection is quite fast, considering many people go far far too long never knowing!

Furthermore, you are on a standard common combo -- why do you think it is especially "aggressive" ?

Aggressive may not be a constructive way to think about HAART. Your doc surely prescribed the one he thought best for you and one would hope that he did a genotype back in February. All HAART is "effective" when properly chosen and taken faithfully. Please don't think of it as poison, for to do so is just loading another stress on your back.

« Last Edit: April 23, 2012, 01:03:00 PM by mecch »

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“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Yeah - its just frustrating because I hear about other positive people who catch it in time as well that don't even need to start taking medication right away. And then others who just take one pill. And then me who has to take 3 different meds and possibly deal with more side effects. While I haven't had any of the side effects with this combo like diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting, I'm worried about more long term side effects like lypodystrophy and blindness.

I guess its just frustrating to think I might have to deal with other things even on top of my hiv diagnosis. It's a lot to mentally handle.

There are 3 drugs in the 1 pill. Its all at least 3 drugs, HAART. Your combo is just as "nice" as Atripla. Everyone reacts to his/her combo in his individual way. Its common to worry about all these "possibles", but remember, live for the now. You don't have the side effects and its possible you won't for a long time if ever. Your combo isn't going to make you blind and highly unlikely to give you lipo.

Logged

“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Yeah - its just frustrating because I hear about other positive people who catch it in time as well that don't even need to start taking medication right away. And then others who just take one pill. And then me who has to take 3 different meds and possibly deal with more side effects.

I'm worried about more long term side effects like lypodystrophy and blindness.

One third of the people who find out they are positive find out in a hospital because they already have AIDS and are quite sick and dying. So finding out when you did really isn't all that remarkable. Be thankful you're not very sick or in the hospital.

Plus there are many kinds of illnesses today where people have to take daily medication. HIV isn't all that special in that respect either. Not to mention that according to the information you can read about any medication (through the package insert material) the percentages of people who have side effects (past the initial few weeks as your body sheds HIV and you get accustomed to the meds you have been prescribed) are very small percentages. Worrying about side effects personally means that you're relying on old information (like from 1994 LOL) and you need to do some research about HIV and the medications in 2010+. That includes worrying about things like lipo or blindness ( what?! never heard that one before).

I've been on medications on one sort or another for 20+ yrs and trust me, the meds today are pretty awesome. And the amount of pills means nothing. What matters is taking a three medication regimen to wipe out HIV. (Atripla is 3 meds in one pill) I'm on a three pill/drug a day regimen (reyataz/norvir/truvada) which causes me NO side effects at all for almost 7 yrs. I'm actually tickled pink to not be taking the one pill-a-day Atripla too. The Sustiva component in it was the absolute worst med I've ever taken, even worse than AZT - but that's my experience with Sustiva.

Too be honest everyone is different so results vary and side effects (short and long term) vary, but with over 20 meds to pick and choose from, worrying about the side effects of meds is the last thing you ought to be wasting time, energy, and emotion on. Nowadays people get on a good regimen, have little to no side effects, continue working and living, while planning for their retirement

One third of the people who find out they are positive find out in a hospital because they already have AIDS and are quite sick and dying. So finding out when you did really isn't all that remarkable. Be thankful you're not very sick or in the hospital.

Plus there are many kinds of illnesses today where people have to take daily medication. HIV isn't all that special in that respect either. Not to mention that according to the information you can read about any medication (through the package insert material) the percentages of people who have side effects (past the initial few weeks as your body sheds HIV and you get accustomed to the meds you have been prescribed) are very small percentages. Worrying about side effects personally means that you're relying on old information (like from 1994 LOL) and you need to do some research about HIV and the medications in 2010+. That includes worrying about things like lipo or blindness ( what?! never heard that one before).

I've been on medications on one sort or another for 20+ yrs and trust me, the meds today are pretty awesome. And the amount of pills means nothing. What matters is taking a three medication regimen to wipe out HIV. (Atripla is 3 meds in one pill) I'm on a three pill/drug a day regimen (reyataz/norvir/truvada) which causes me NO side effects at all for almost 7 yrs. I'm actually tickled pink to not be taking the one pill-a-day Atripla too. The Sustiva component in it was the absolute worst med I've ever taken, even worse than AZT - but that's my experience with Sustiva.

Too be honest everyone is different so results vary and side effects (short and long term) vary, but with over 20 meds to pick and choose from, worrying about the side effects of meds is the last thing you ought to be wasting time, energy, and emotion on. Nowadays people get on a good regimen, have little to no side effects, continue working and living, while planning for their retirement

I am reallllly thankful that I caught my HIV before it could do any more damage. Believe me. I was getting sick all the time and nothing seemed to be healing properly. Since being on meds I've noticed that most of it is ebbing away pretty nicely. Though from talking to different people and researching around on the internet, I'm faced with a lot of articles talking about some of the dangerous and extreme side effects of these drugs.

I'm reading on WebMD that "Since the widespread use of antiretroviral therapy began, the numbers of HIV-positive people with lipodystrophy has increased. Today, lipodystrophy occurs in 30% to 50% of people who are infected with HIV (human immunodeficiency virus)." I've also done research on my medication and Norvir in specific has been known to cause it.

Of course, these articles might not be so correct (I'm hoping). I just figured I'd post to see what other positive people are experiencing. I really appreciate all the time you guys are giving to discuss with me.

I've been on just about every med that there is. I purposefully avoided the earlier ones that caused lipodystrophy and lipoatrophy. I am currently on Truvada, Prezista, Isentress and Norvir. No issues whatsoever, aside from the same diarrhea that I have with or without meds - which I treat semi-successfully with diet.

There's really no real reason to worry about those extreme issues from the meds you are on. This site has a terrific and detailed examination of all your meds here:

While it's true that Truvada is in the category of NRTI medications, not all NRTI medications are equally implicated in lipo issues. Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but Truvada does not appear to be even close to other meds in that category insofar as serious body-changing side effects are concerned.

There is an issue with some people and lactic acidosis, and your doctor will no doubt monitor you for that. Also, some liver and kidney issues can arise, but these are quite often due to pre-existing conditions with those organs. Again, these are things your doctor can monitor through your bloodwork.

Your article on blindness mentioned CMV as a possible culprit, combined with the advent of HAART therapy with extremely low cd4 counts. I can't help but wonder if that is simply a manifestation of an existing infection that the patient's body lacked enough of an immune system to fight. My PCP flared up HUGE after I initiated HAART with a cd4 count of 12 and a viral load of over two million. The illness had BEEN there all along, but when my immune system started working again, the immune reaction was severe.

Had I not initiated HAART, I would have been dead, of course.

I honestly think it's possible to scare the shit out of yourself, searching for rare and unlikely events and finding obscure and outdated information. ONe think I really like about this site is that Tim Horn pays excellent attention to detail when it comes to updating treatment information.

I honestly think you are going to be just fine.

Logged

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

I've been on just about every med that there is. I purposefully avoided the earlier ones that caused lipodystrophy and lipoatrophy. I am currently on Truvada, Prezista, Isentress and Norvir. No issues whatsoever, aside from the same diarrhea that I have with or without meds - which I treat semi-successfully with diet.

There's really no real reason to worry about those extreme issues from the meds you are on. This site has a terrific and detailed examination of all your meds here:

While it's true that Truvada is in the category of NRTI medications, not all NRTI medications are equally implicated in lipo issues. Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but Truvada does not appear to be even close to other meds in that category insofar as serious body-changing side effects are concerned.

There is an issue with some people and lactic acidosis, and your doctor will no doubt monitor you for that. Also, some liver and kidney issues can arise, but these are quite often due to pre-existing conditions with those organs. Again, these are things your doctor can monitor through your bloodwork.

Your article on blindness mentioned CMV as a possible culprit, combined with the advent of HAART therapy with extremely low cd4 counts. I can't help but wonder if that is simply a manifestation of an existing infection that the patient's body lacked enough of an immune system to fight. My PCP flared up HUGE after I initiated HAART with a cd4 count of 12 and a viral load of over two million. The illness had BEEN there all along, but when my immune system started working again, the immune reaction was severe.

Had I not initiated HAART, I would have been dead, of course.

I honestly think it's possible to scare the shit out of yourself, searching for rare and unlikely events and finding obscure and outdated information. ONe think I really like about this site is that Tim Horn pays excellent attention to detail when it comes to updating treatment information.

I honestly think you are going to be just fine.

This was a really helpful post. OVER TWO MILLION? Yeesh! I keep thinking my condition was the worst it could get but you got me beat. Thanks for sharing your advice - its really valuable for someone at my stage of this disease. Once I'm undetectable and had a few more years under my belt with this, I hope to spread my experience like you have. Thanks again.

I was diagnosed in serocoversion and before I had antibodies. After a few months of viral loads in the millions I started HAART and all went well. No, you are not the worst case scenario as for viral loads. It may not be obvious to you to curb the online research about side effects but it may be helpful for the moment to stop that, and live your life for the moment week by week, month by month, while your mind and anxiety adjusts to the new reality.

Logged

“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

but I feel this is is another set of bad news. I feel like I'm breaking apart and its hard to stay hopeful anymore.

try not to be too down about this. obviously that just wasn't the right combo for you (every body is different).

Luckily its not 1995, and there are a bunch of other regimens that might work better. A lot of people go through several combos before getting just the right one that doesn't have side effects and works well (getting you to undetectable).

I was on meds for 12 yrs before I finally got to UD, while it took 15 yrs to find meds that didn't make me puke all the time. You may ask how I managed to hang in there - well its quite easy when you remember that NOT treating HIV ends in death. I was in the hospital 3 times nearly dying, so that made it easy to think that throwing up 4 days a week wasn't "all that bad" LOL. By the time there were choices (more than only a half a dozen meds on the market) I went through about 4 combos till I got one that didn't make me puke everyday and got me to UD. I've been on that combo for 6 or 7 yrs now and couldn't be happier.

Try to hang in there, while your doctor helps you get the right combo for you during this initial treatment period.

I've been on just about every med that there is. I purposefully avoided the earlier ones that caused lipodystrophy and lipoatrophy. I am currently on Truvada, Prezista, Isentress and Norvir. No issues whatsoever, aside from the same diarrhea that I have with or without meds - which I treat semi-successfully with diet.

There's really no real reason to worry about those extreme issues from the meds you are on. This site has a terrific and detailed examination of all your meds here:

While it's true that Truvada is in the category of NRTI medications, not all NRTI medications are equally implicated in lipo issues. Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but Truvada does not appear to be even close to other meds in that category insofar as serious body-changing side effects are concerned.

There is an issue with some people and lactic acidosis, and your doctor will no doubt monitor you for that. Also, some liver and kidney issues can arise, but these are quite often due to pre-existing conditions with those organs. Again, these are things your doctor can monitor through your bloodwork.

Your article on blindness mentioned CMV as a possible culprit, combined with the advent of HAART therapy with extremely low cd4 counts. I can't help but wonder if that is simply a manifestation of an existing infection that the patient's body lacked enough of an immune system to fight. My PCP flared up HUGE after I initiated HAART with a cd4 count of 12 and a viral load of over two million. The illness had BEEN there all along, but when my immune system started working again, the immune reaction was severe.

Had I not initiated HAART, I would have been dead, of course.

I honestly think it's possible to scare the shit out of yourself, searching for rare and unlikely events and finding obscure and outdated information. ONe think I really like about this site is that Tim Horn pays excellent attention to detail when it comes to updating treatment information.

I honestly think you are going to be just fine.

I think that the Immune response is something that far to people are aware of when starting meds.... Doctors should point this out more to people it kicked my ass for a few weeks.

I think that the Immune response is something that far to people are aware of when starting meds.... Doctors should point this out more to people it kicked my ass for a few weeks.

IRIS (immune reconstitution inflammation syndrome) is what happens when HIV has nearly destroyed a person's immune system; then a person begins medication which kicks HIV's ass and allows their immune system to begin to recover; the immune system finally starts paying attention and doing something about all the underlying issues that it has not been handling when it was hampered by the HIV.

actually though most people don't have issues with IRIS. since only about 1/3 of all positive people are diagnosed with advanced HIV, most of the time when HIV is diagnosed, IRIS is never going to be an issue. I think doctors don't discuss it much because it's not even guaranteed to happen to that unlucky 1/3. Doctors at that point with patients are mainly focused on the patient getting well ie getting to undetectable HIV so the immune system can recover.

it's actually quite weird in a way because dealing with IRIS actually means that a patient is getting better.