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Conditions and restrictions
- Both Nagato and Itachi as well as Orochimaru are in their best state.
-Neither Nagato or Tobi can use GM.
-Sarutobi is in the same state as he was against Orochimaru.
-Nagato is fighting with his real body and full mobility but can't use the six paths of Pain.
-Neither Orochimaru or kabuto can use ET.
-Both Naruto and Sasuke can use everything they have shown.
-Shisui eye is not allowed.
-Considering Tobi never showed the abilities of the Rinnegan, it's not allowed to assume he can use them. Everything else he showed is fine.
-Dead demon consuming seal is not allowed by either Minato or Sarutobi.
-The last member standing wins for his team.
-No one has any info on the other.
-Jiraya can not use frog song.
-No one is in edo state.
-Madara can't use Rinnegan abilities, eveything else is allowed.

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

You must be quite mistaken. Didn't Itachi fight equally for a while against Naruto ? And don't you think you have underestimated Kabuto a lot ?
But since you believe it's not balanced i will do something about it.

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

First welcome to the forums mate!

Second Madara would anihilate the other team... Put him in a team with Tobi and he COMPLETLY STOMPS. This 2 put togeder vs ALL the other people combined from both teams would stomp them all. Tobi just needs to turn Madara intangible and have Madara pop Meteors like candy...

But to answer the OP team hate completly stomp and i mean COMPLETLY. Team WOF have 0 chanse of even putting up a fight.

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

Originally Posted by xXan

First welcome to the forums mate!

Second Madara would anihilate the other team... Put him in a team with Tobi and he COMPLETLY STOMPS. This 2 put togeder vs ALL the other people combined from both teams would stomp them all. Tobi just needs to turn Madara intangible and have Madara pop Meteors like candy...

But to answer the OP team hate completly stomp and i mean COMPLETLY. Team WOF have 0 chanse of even putting up a fight.

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

Well now this is harder but still team Hate take the win.

JMan and Minato should go down to a combo of genjutsu or Amaterasu from Itachi/Sasuke,.

Madara would have no problem holding Naruto as he can summon the dragon Hashirama used to deal with the Kyuubi.
EDIT HERE: just noticed that Madara no longer has the Rinnegan so he is dead meat vs Naruto.

Sarutobi is irrelevant as compared to the people here... He has horible feats as he is from part 1 when Kishi was not going DBZ with his manga.

The only real fighters here are Nagato and Naruto but they can't win in the end. Put up a fight sure but that is about it. Eventualy as Minato, JMan Sarutobi drop like flies Naruto and Nagato are going to get surounded by to many people.

Jiraiya himself is not even a factor here. You need to at least put him in Sage Mode to be of ANY use here. No SM and he is fodder droping from the first Amaterasu... Ah w8 now that i think about it not even in SM and he does not have any abilitiy or speed to dodge an Amaterasu. So this would probably not even help. Heh not even MS genjutsu from Itachi and JMan can't do anything.
If he starts in normal mode he defenetly is not going to have time to get to SM and even if he starts in SM he does not have counters to Amaterasu and Itachi's genjutsu.

EDIT: Ignore the above. Madara with no chakra shield and his team is going down hard.

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

Firstly, can Madara use all the Mokuton he has shown thus far? I am guessing so, as otherwise he is stuck with around 4 moves that he has shown (strong moves, but still, only 4)
Those being, Perfect susanoo (Insanely powerful), an eye genjutsu (powerful to take out the Raikage - who boasted resistance if I remember?), that fan reflection move (powerful enough to fully [and effortlessly] reflect Naruto's mini biju bomb) and a katon move (that covered an entire battlefield and needed to be countered by a whole load of water ninjas).
Naruto and Nagato are the only two I see in this lineup that have a chance against these moves. It was suggested that Sarutobi could match the first, but in his only fight nothing was shown that could do this (though that was almost a different manga), and also suggested Minato could. However the only way I see Minato doing so would be if he can somehow get close to Madara + Somehow get through his perfect susanoo...
So not only are the will of fire team outnumbered (6 to 5), but they also have to compete with Madara?!?

Before you introduced Madara, the will of fire team won easily. Following introduction, they lost. Following removal of his rinnengan, I am still unsure if they can compete, as they would need to have either Naruto or Nagato constantly trying to deal with Madara, thus leaving them outnumbered against the rest of team Hatred.
Although Nagato is OP - requiring Bee, Naruto and Itachi to take him on. Madara is also equally, (if not moreso) OP.

If you are going to add Madara, then at least add another member to team will of fire. I would suggest Hashirama (as he is kind of a good counter to Madara), but not enough has been shown (outside of what Madara has shown)... SO how about Gaara?

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

xXan, of course Jman can use sage mode. Only things that are restricted can't be used, everything else is fine.

zimbardo, don't overestimate madara too much, allow me to remind you that a combination of sage mode naruto and gaara almost killed madara and he said
"Thats a little too much" then was forced to use rinnegan.
But in this case, then i will add another member to team will of fire.

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

Originally Posted by KingOfNight

xXan, of course Jman can use sage mode. Only things that are restricted can't be used, everything else is fine.

zimbardo, don't overestimate madara too much, allow me to remind you that a combination of sage mode naruto and gaara almost killed madara and he said
"Thats a little too much" then was forced to use rinnegan.
But in this case, then i will add another member to team will of fire.

But then let me remind you that Gaara isn't in this fight, and also that was still 2 v Madara (the same Madara who could beat 5 Kage effortlessly - maybe he used Rinnengan techniques, but maybe he did not). If Naruto/Nagato teamed up with another member against Madara - that would still leave 3 from team Will of Fire against Sasuke, Itachi, Tobi, Orochimaru and Kabuto.That is 3 against 5 (none of who are particularly walk overs).

Although I see Tsunade as a poor choice against any of these.
The first thing that the team Will of Fire need to do is remove Madara.
The only people who have shown any ability that could hold Madara in place, like Gaara's sand did (following ripping him out of Susanoo [which no one can do, except perhaps Minato if he can tag Madara - and also perhaps teleport people who are tagged...]), so that Naruto could Fuuton Rasenshuriken him would be Nagato and Jiraiya. As Nagato would be sorely needed to deal with the others, let's say that Jiraiya can cast a swamp of the underworld to hold Madara in place. What is to stop Madara just summoning his perfect Susanoo to protect himself? Now, I could see swamp of the underworld perhaps being large enough to hold a regular susanoo – but perfect susanoo?!? No chance, that thing is FAR too massive!
So, the only way to ensure a hit, is to have either Naruto rush there with his kyuubi mode on (in which case he probably also suffers the rasen shuriken), or have Minato speed in and tag Madara.
If Minato does this, then Madara may well die. However, that still takes 3 members to do so - and still requires them to do so before Madara summons his perfect Susanoo. With Madara down, team Will of Fire may win - if he gets perfect Susanoo up, the only people who can damage him are (perhaps) Naruto, Nagato - and (really not likely, but perhaps) Tsunade (As long as she can get close enough without being killed beforehand... [<- not likely])

Luckily team Will of Fire have Nagato. He, like Madara, will also require a few people to take him on, as I do not think Sasuke, Itachi, Tobi, Orochimaru or Kabuto could do this themselves.
I am not sure what Sarutobi will be able to do in this fight, unfortunately, as he has not shown any moves recently (and recently shown moves > [and that is a really, REALLY big “>”] first half moves).
Tsunade can damage a Susanoo, but is not that useful against anyone else outside of that. I guess she can heal the rest, as long as the other team do not take her out first...
So it is still Naruto, Jiraiya, Nagato and Minato against the rest in my opinion. Even though Minato is a beast, especially in team battles, as he can pressure anyone and everyone, he has not shown any large scale damaging moves.

At least those 4 won't be 1 shot Amaterasued/genjutsued in my opinion (even if other people here may disagree).

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

The teams are way too large for this fight to even be plausible, cause it would most likely be broken down into separate fights.

Naruto solo's with his gargantuan Bijudama that counter balanced a combined bijudama from the bijuu's? Other than there's no way, Kabuto and Madara are dying side by side on the same day. Sasuke and Itachi can get solo'd by a minibijudama or rasenshuriken to their Susano'o, Madara can reflect them with his fan so he wouldn't die the same away. Orochimaru, he get's knocked out by Itachi's tsukuyomi lol? Obito can be taken out by; Naruto, Minato, or Nagato with shinra tensei.

Naruto's sealing-cloak is ugly, he needs to finish his chakra agreement with kyuubi already!

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

Originally Posted by Archea

Orochimaru, he get's knocked out by Itachi's tsukuyomi lol?

One sec. Why would Itachi try and KO his own team mate?
(Although, why is Itachi on a team called Team Hatred? If anything, he was one of the few ninjas who actually fought actively for peace his whole life... Unless you are going to argue that he hated war [and loved peace] )

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

heh, my bad... Though, I guess you have to remove character personalities with these kinds of fights (as I have no idea why Orochimaru or Kabuto would get drawn into this kind of fight - or why Itachi would side with Madara and Tobi against the village he tried to protect).

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

If removing Madara is the case then here are my thoughts.

Nagato's bansho tenin can do the exact same thing as Gaara's sand and even better, simply draw him out of the susanoo and have Naruto in his KM strike him with a Rasenshuriken which is stronger than the SM's version. And considering it's bansho tenin then Madara will be completely helpless as the technique will strip him from his freedom. Also treating Madara as his Edo version is wrong as he have infinite chakara and immortal body so he can't keep doing all the feats he showed so far. Also unlike Itachi's susanoo, Madara's version is completely and purely chakara which the preta path will render completely useless no matter the size. Actually if you think about it, Nagato alone should be very well capable of defeating Madara without his Rinnegan (now keep reading before saying anything). So far and without his Rinnegan, Madara hasn't shown anything that the Rinnegan can't counter, like this:
Kenjutsu = Asura path will take care of this with no problem.
Ninjutsu (fire style, amaterasu, susanoo)= all is fruitless with preta path and shinra tensei.
Taijutsu= if he is desperate enough to get close his soul will be ripped right in front of his eyes.

Thats how haxx the Rinnegan is. The only thing that may give him a chance is the wood release, but i doubt the shinra tensei or the asura path mass destruction laser from the head, can't deal with it. Now if Nagato alone can rival Madara or even defeat him then adding Naruto would be i'm afraid a stomp. As if he was too much'ed by sage mode Naruto and Gaara then the same can happen with KM Naruto and Nagato. With him down the other can go at each other, waiting to see your opinion.

Re: Team will of fire VS Team hatred

Originally Posted by KingOfNight

xXan, of course Jman can use sage mode. Only things that are restricted can't be used, everything else is fine.

zimbardo, don't overestimate madara too much, allow me to remind you that a combination of sage mode naruto and gaara almost killed madara and he said
"Thats a little too much" then was forced to use rinnegan.
But in this case, then i will add another member to team will of fire.

That is not what i was refering to. I am aware JMan can use Sage Mode problem is he will never get to enter Sage Mode before he is DEAD. He does not have time to sit in a corner and enter Sage Mode.

Quote:

Nagato's bansho tenin can do the exact same thing as Gaara's sand and even better, simply draw him out of the susanoo

That is not how it works. Gaara had to hold Susano in place and then drag Madara out of it when holding him direcly by the hand. If Nagato ends up using BT on Madara he is going to try and pull the entire Susano. His BT ability does NOT go trough a shield.
When Nagato used BT on RM Naruto his shield was not left behind.

Quote:

and have Naruto in his KM strike him with a Rasenshuriken which is stronger than the SM's version

Where was this showed? I don't remember any feat that would put RM (or KM as you put it) RS above SM RS.

Of course this would imply that the rest are alowing Nagato to help Madara. Why would the rest hold back? Its more then enough people on both sides for all the people to be fighting at least 1 man.

Quote:

And considering it's bansho tenin then Madara will be completely helpless as the technique will strip him from his freedom.

Even Kakashi countered it with a bloody chain at least for some time... He even had time to change places with a clone.. Madara having 25 wood clones of himself running about... Yeah GL getting the original... And if he DOES get pulled in he can use a forest to defened himself... POP SUSANO AGAIN. It can be done faster then a lighting bolt hits the ground.

Quote:

Also treating Madara as his Edo version is wrong as he have infinite chakara and immortal body so he can't keep doing all the feats he showed so far.

We are not but considering he has a TON of chakra even with no ET mode... Its not that relevant. Madara has Senju DNA.

Quote:

Also unlike Itachi's susanoo, Madara's version is completely and purely chakara which the preta path will render completely useless no matter the size.

You actualy belive Madara is going to use it and then alow Nagato to get close? The entire place is going to be hell with wood element crep everywhere. Polen and other factors.
Also Nagato can't instant absorb chakra. If Madara swings his Susano blade and hits Nagato then Nagato is DEAD. Bee was more then able to first HIT Nagato and then lose his chakra (chakra mode).
Of course we have even a TON of genjutsu going about. Nets that need Amaterasu to get trough and other things, even the ability to blind Nagato (Kabuto).

Only if the enemy is SO stupid to shoot Amaterasu at Nagato. Why would they do that? Target the rest, kill the other and then team up on him.

Quote:

Taijutsu= if he is desperate enough to get close his soul will be ripped right in front of his eyes.

Its not that easy. Nagato had a LONG "fight" with Naruto as he was tring to remove his soul. Thing is Nagato can defened himself but not the others. When his time comes... And it will come.

Thing is you removed the rinnegan from Madara. You know what that means? No chakra shield to absorb jutsus from Madara. You know what that means? Naruto solos this fight.
1 Flashdama and Madara's team is going to lose so many members is not even funny.
Madara with his shield was the only counter to Naruto. As it is now his ENTIRE TEAM can grab a beer and alow Naruto to solo the rest. He just pops 13 RM clones and split them going for the enemy. Not a chanse in hell for them to win.