Worth Noting: Amanda Palmer's 'Free' Album Debuted At Number 10 On The Billboard Charts

from the oh,-look-at-that dept

We've written plenty about Amanda Palmer and the various cool things she's done to connect with fans and give them a reason to buy. She's stopped by on occasion to do some guest posting as well. Obviously, a lot of the recent attention has been about her Kickstarter campaign, but there was one tidbit that seemed worth calling attention to. A week and a half ago, when the album was officially released... it debuted in the number 10 spot on the Billboard charts. This is much more impressive than it might sound. You may recall when Dan Bull tried to reach the charts with his free single. It worked in the UK, but in the US, they calculate the charts in a convoluted way that includes radio airplay as well as sales. Getting airplay is very, very difficult if you're not on a major label who pays crazy money to "promoters" in the latest attempt to do payola that doesn't run afoul of the law. So to get on the charts with a totally independent album, with no label at all, is really quite amazing.

And, to do it with an album that is available for free for those who want it is just as amazing. Yes, that's right, free. While there's been plenty of talk about the Kickstarter aspect, there's also the fact that she's offering it as a pure pay what you want model off of her site, where there's even a button to click to get the album for free... and this part where she explains why it's okay to get the album for free (though she wouldn't mind if you paid too...) in which she also encourages people to share it:

If you can't see that, it says:

DEAR DOWNLOADER of MUSIC

i firmly believe in music being as free as possible. unlocked. shared and spread.

i believe that in order for artists to survive and create, their audiences need to step up and directly support them.
honor system.
no judgment.
if you’re broke – take it. if you love it, come back and kick in later when you have the money.
if you’re rich, think about who you might be karmically covering if you really love this record.

the store below has two versions of the record. one is totally free, and one has a minimum price of $1.00 so that i can cover the cost of covering other artists’ songs.

once you have it, SHARE SHARE SHARE! COPY COPY COPY! SPREAD THE EVIL!!!
we are the media.

LOVE, afp

But, you know, it's impossible to make money when people share your stuff, right? Maybe if you actually spend time connecting with fans, you'll discover that they're more than happy to support you, as they're supporting Amanda.

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Although it's nice that she's giving her album away, her music does nothing for me. Much like all of the major label media darlings who just want attention, the hype doesn't seem warranted. It's a fad. Congrats on breaking the top 10 and all but, really, what does it matter? Who's she competing with that's any good?

I prefer to hear an independent artist who does something besides that generic rock sound and rap/hip-hop. Maybe some jazz-pop fusion or something funky like Jamiroquai or Stevie Wonder? How about some good lounge music? If it's gotta be rock-based, why not something like Alice in Chains, classic rock like Steely Dan's early albums (although I sure love their latter stuff like Aja and Gaucho) or even southern rock like Steve Morse/The Dixie Dregs? Yes, I'm old-fashioned. I love melody, harmony, smart arrangements, virtuoso performances, et al. Must all the great songwriting be relegated to decades' past?

Re: Where's the beef?

You must not be trying. I found it in a matter of about 10 seconds. At the top, under media, click music and you get a list of streaming music. Under shop you can click on the mission statement to go to where Mike linked and download the CD free.

I checked the billboard site, and it was pretty hard to find her album... why?

Well, it's a one and done deal. It peaked on all sorts of charts for a single week, and disappeared. Why? Seems a pretty simple case of all of the kickstarter "sales" which happened over a period of time, were "realized" in a single shot. So she sold to her entire fanbase in one shot, and now it's over.

It's not the $1 sales that are driving anything. The album has disappeared off the charts on that model. It's only the kickstarter "pile up" effect that did anything.

Sorry to burst your bubble - like Amanda's just did.

Oh, as a side note, the "paying musicians" story is the biggest story about facepalm on Billboard. That says it all.

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How did I know that some AC would come in here and attack Palmer and the model? Seriously, you guys would get more traction if you stopping being such hateful obnoxious little oiks. Just once, have the intellectual honesty to admit that something has worked, even if only in an imperfect, incomplete way that can be learned from in future endeavours.

Anyway, so what? There's plenty of mainstream major label albums that chart for a week or 2, then disappear. True, many of them don't get the marketing push Palmer managed to get, but then this is a system completely gamed by the major labels. Face it, Palmer made sales, enough of them to chart in a major label dominated charting system, and all using tactics you previously claimed would be failures.

All in all, it is proof that some of the old arguments you people tried to make are false (this model can't work, nobody will buy the album if it's available for free, you need a label to get noticed, etc.). Stop moving the goalposts wherever you're proven wrong and address the facts.

The Pet Shop Boys' Elysium also had big drop in chart position in the same week. In fact, it had a bigger drop. That's a major label release. Does this mean they've failed, or simply that that most of their fans bought the album in the first week? What's your take? What about all the other albums with large drops in that list, many of them major label releases?

"I guess only in your world are the facts an attack. What a sad, small mind you have."

I'm not seeing facts, I'm seeing subjective opinions which you pretend are facts, followed by a rejection of any other interpretation of the situation. It's sad that even successful projects get rejected out of hand because they don't fit your preconceived world view. But, yeah, I'm the one with a small mind.

Go on, please explain how the fact that most of the charted sales for this album were made in the first week of release makes it a failure, and explain how this differs from the major label albums in the same position, whose business model you strangely never question.

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>>> hateful obnoxious little oiks

That's what you are dealing with. If he took his head out of the sand he'd acknowledge this is a huge success for an independent artist.

Do you remember the articles about Louis CK (the comedian)? Remember how a few of those hateful obnoxious little oiks also disdained the fact that the guy made over 1 million in a week? My guess is those hateful obnoxious little oiks are paid to be hateful obnoxious little oiks. Even if an indie earns hundreds of millions they'll attribute it to luck or an exception.

How do you expect them to acknowledge something they are paid to ignore?

Sharing ain't all that bad

People seem to forget that sharing (legally or illegally) is how many artists become famous. It's a step up from walking the streets and hand passing out copies of your demo CDs that you spent money on.
Instead you simply make your track, toss it online and watch it slowly spread.

I remember one artist (can't remember exactly who) once said, "keep pirating music, we make the majority of our money from concerts and appearances. Money from album sales goes in the pockets of the suits" (paraphrased, not quoted)
But think about this, consider the number of new artists you've discovered by simply exploring LimeWire, Napster, SeekShare, etc. And now fast-forward to you at a concert of that artist. How would this have happened if you didn't explore?

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"this is a huge success for an independent artist."

yes, she made it to number 2 on the indie charts for a single week, and then dropped off the bottom line a rock. There are plenty of other indie artists having way more success than her, why point at her for it? She only scored this with a numbers trick, the sort of thing that Paul would likely call the labels out for doing.

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Yeah, I know I'm just trying to get an admission to that point, really.

I'm not entirely sure what his line or argument here is, anyway. Lots of things have excellent first week sales, then a large drop-off in the second week. The AC seems to be implying that this represents some sort of failure in Palmer's sales, and/or a failure in the business model used if so. If that's his line of thought, I just want an explanation as to why this is a failure, yet the several major label releases that followed the same pattern are not. Unless you make certain assumptions about who is writing these comments, it literally makes no sense to claim that this is a problem for the new models without admitting that the old models are equally flawed. In which case, why single out Palmer rather than congratulate her for her independent success?

Either these guys should admit they have a vested interest in attacking the new business models or they need to explain their problems with them a lot better...

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Why we point to Palmer is because she is a known name.
If we point to an unknown name (even if they did better in the charts) the trolls come flocking.
It's flawed yes, but it beats arguing with the STUPIDEST trolls.

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Personally I'm rooting for the independent artists (though as I said I'm not an AP fan). There are only a few major label artists left whose work I still like, e.g. Donald Fagen. The rest are either irrelevant or manufactured in an ivory tower, hence why chart success doesn't count much for nothing IMO. All that needs to happen is for one independent artist and/or business model to make a huge impact and the labels will go nuts trying to fight against it.

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I am not sure why I bother to answer you, as you don't read... but hey:

"The reason what happens? That Palmer has made a bunch of sales but not in the way you'd prefer it to happen?"

No, I congratulate her for her sales. Wow. Big number. ONCE.

Week 2? She dropped right back off the radar.

"The Pet Shop Boys' Elysium also had big drop in chart position in the same week. In fact, it had a bigger drop. That's a major label release. Does this mean they've failed, or simply that that most of their fans bought the album in the first week?"

No, actually they are still #7 in the eletronic Dance charts. They are doing well in their field. Palmer dropped to 33 on Indie, which is odd for someone who by your account is dominating the market.

The drop they saw (and the drop Facepalm saw) was about the same, except that Amanda dropped from much higher. PSB only peaked at 44, amanda at 10... So her first week sales were MUCH higher, and the difference in the second week much smaller.

It would also be interesting to see if Palmer is reporting free downloads as "sales", there is no indication that Billboard wouldn't consider them sales.

"I'm not seeing facts, I'm seeing subjective opinions which you pretend are facts,"

Stop reading your own posts, and stop filtering mine through your reality distortion field. Then you might get some facts.

"Go on, please explain how the fact that most of the charted sales for this album were made in the first week of release makes it a failure,"

In part because the sales didn't happen in a single day, they happened over a period on Kickstarter. It's hard to say what part of the sales came from one part or another, but a single shot burst shows a lot of hype. After that, second and third week sales are all about grabbing market that you don't already have. PSB, example, didn't do that outside of their own category. NOFX apparently has the same problem, the hype might be better than the music.

Considering all hype on the Palmer album, and the silly low $1 (or even free) price hurdle, it's shocking that she isn't #1 in the charts (at least indie). A single week, like the Dan Bull play, doesn't really indicate much other than flash in the pan of one sort or another.

" how this differs from the major label albums in the same position, whose business model you strangely never question."

Since Amanda isn't on a "label" deal, it's not what's in the discussion here. I know you want to try to turn it into that, but really - stay with the topic!

Paul, really. Stop being so angry, stop being so aggressive. You need to consider that the other side sometimes has a point. It's not about you, it's not personal. Stop trying to make it personal. You just hurt the level of discussion here, and rope a few of the sheep along with you into angry retorts that just kill all conversation.

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"yes, she made it to number 2 on the indie charts for a single week, and then dropped off the bottom line a rock."

She was #10 in the mainstream chart too. Several other albums dropped like rocks as well during the same week, some from major labels. Why are you looking at one part of the situation and ignoring the rest of it?

"There are plenty of other indie artists having way more success than her, why point at her for it?"

Such as? Do you have actual numbers rather than chart positions? Are any of those artists legally allowing people to obtain the music for free at the same time? How were they funded? What are they doing that Palmer isn't, and how does that undermine what she's doing?

Come on, if I'm wrong then prove it. Stop cherry picking one part of the argument and let's deal with reality instead of making random assumptions...

"the sort of thing that Paul would likely call the labels out for doing."

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Regardless of AP's situation, I'd say 99% of the music that's currently being released by the major labels is complete and utter garbage. Music sales are in a slump because of the lousy quality of what's being produced. The major labels are vulnerable and they know it.

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Taste doesn't enter into it. Also, if Facepalm's music was all that, it would be the hottest thing on the torrents. It's not. Hottest things on the torrents are the usual label records, the things people really want.

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"The AC seems to be implying that this represents some sort of failure in Palmer's sales, and/or a failure in the business model used if so. "

Neither. I am applauding her. If you would stop being angry for a second, you would realize that I am only pointing out that the appearance in the charts is as a result of a bit of a twist in reported sales as a result of using Kickstarter to "pre-sell" the content.

I didn't say anything about business models and the like, it's all your prattling on, where you have convinced yourself that it's what I am talking about. The failure isn't hers, the failure is yours, a failure to read!

"Either these guys should admit they have a vested interest in attacking the new business models or they need to explain their problems with them a lot better..."

I don't have a vested interest in either side. I wish you would get that through your skull. You can't seem to imagine anyone not agreeing with you completely. It's hard to keep explaining the same things over and over again to you if you are not going to accept the basics. I am NOT A SHILL. I don't work for anyone in the music or movie industries. Can you imagine that? Can you handle that?

Let me know when you can, and I will go back and start spoon feeding you the rest of it VERY slowly, because apparently I have been going way too quickly for you.

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"Such as? Do you have actual numbers rather than chart positions? Are any of those artists legally allowing people to obtain the music for free at the same time? How were they funded? What are they doing that Palmer isn't, and how does that undermine what she's doing?"

The indie chart is a great indication.

Remember, whatever Amanda Palmer did in her week at #10 maintstream, someone else was ahead of her in the Indie charts... The XX. They also stayed near the top, dropping only 1 spot, and dropping only to 15th place in the top 200.

Now, I will admit, they are on a MAJOR indie label (is that an oxymoron?), but it is showing that the big end of the business, even for their type of music, is through that sort of a system.

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"Neither. I am applauding her"

Really?

"It peaked on all sorts of charts for a single week, and disappeared."
"The album has disappeared off the charts on that model. It's only the kickstarter "pile up" effect that did anything."
"Sorry to burst your bubble - like Amanda's just did."

That's your idea of applause?

"I didn't say anything about business models and the like"

Then why mention Kickstarter and imply that Palmer's tactic was a failure? Oh, and you did mention the model, see the quote above.

"I don't work for anyone in the music or movie industries. Can you imagine that? Can you handle that?"

It's the only way your positions ever make sense. Perhaps you can hold off the impotent rage for a moment and actually explain them? Seriously, the only way half the things you type make any sense is if you have some vested interest in blocking new models.

Not that I expect you to be honest. I've explained how my opinions come from the position of being a frustrated paying customer many times, and all you idiots do is accuse me of piracy.

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So, after your pointless blather, you admit you're not comparing apples to apples and that any comparison between the two acts is shaky at best. Well done.

This is why it's important to consider all of the factors involved, and to understand the conclusions others are actually reaching rather than substitute your own half-assed assumptions.

You still haven't explained why this is a problem, or why you're singling out Palmer when so many other acts have done the same things - only depending on labels and other mechanisms rather than the new models you people said were doomed to failure.

"Amazing, isn't it?"

The knots you'll tie yourself in so that you avoid admitting that you're wrong, or that someone else here actually has a reasonable point? It is, rather.

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Except that great songwriting isn't relegated to decades past. Newer music just doesn't have the benefit of decades of filtering and word of mouth, so you have to look a little harder. For example, bands like Nightwish, Epica, and Avantasia (yes, they're all heavy rock/metal, that's what I'm into so that's what I know) have excellent writing.

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" Seriously, the only way half the things you type make any sense is if you have some vested interest in blocking new models."

It's amazing that you still miss the point:

As a consumer, it's not to my benefit to lose the old way, even if it's semi-functional, if the replacement is less likely to suit me. I don't want to trade a few good options for hundreds of questionable ones.

For me, the problem is that most of the business models put forward here wouldn't be anywhere near attractive if the existing business model wasn't being robbed blind by the very people who seek to replace it.

Even with all that, even some the biggest supports of free or name your price or so many other models end up signing label deals or label distribution.

My vested interest is like you, as a consumer. I want the choices, but I think the new business model choices should be choices IN ADDITION to what is already there. Watching the new business model types sniping and pushing the destruction of the old models through whatever means is needed makes me wonder about their true motivations.

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"For me, the problem is that most of the business models put forward here wouldn't be anywhere near attractive if the existing business model wasn't being robbed blind by the very people who seek to replace it."

So, the problem is a fiction you've invented? Great.

"Even with all that, even some the biggest supports of free or name your price or so many other models end up signing label deals or label distribution. "

Wow, you mean that different models have different benefits that don't meet every artist's needs? That labels do have their uses and some artists may choose the label model? That they should be free to do whatever's best for them and their fans?

Welcome to what I've been saying for a decade. Would you care to join me in the rest of what I've been saying, or are you still going to attack the fictional version?

"My vested interest is like you, as a consumer. I want the choices, but I think the new business model choices should be choices IN ADDITION to what is already there"

So do I. If that was offered instead of content being DRMed, region blocked and ripped off by the legacy corporations then I'd certainly be happy - and there's no real reason why they can't do so. But, they want to protect their old cash cow for as long as possible, even as new companies are trying hundreds of methods to give customers what they actually want. But yeah, it's the evil pirates that won't let them offer those things, right?

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Also, if Facepalm's music was all that, it would be the hottest thing on the torrents.

You might have a little more credibility if you referred to her by her actual name. When you call her stupid names for no apparent reason, people tend to fill in a reason why you're doing it, and those reasons aren't going to be beneficial to you or your message.

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I think the "radio play" is the kicker. Last time I checked in my area, there were 22 stations, 15 play music and 11 of those were Clear Channel. No college station, no independant stations (although several of Clear Channel stations listed "indie" or "alt" genres). Basically in the 5th largest city in the U.S. the only music that can be heard on the radio is major label "pay for play" music. The same usually goes for background music in the grocery stores, shops, resturants, etc. A tiny percentage of shop owners make and effort to play music that their customers would find interesting and I usually compliment them when I hear it.

I am so sick of label music I could scream. I don't even want to ride in a car with it on. That may sound extreme, but I swore off label music as an experiment probably 5 years ago - and wow! It was like the universe opened up. Music was way more thrilling than I ever thought. It is impossible to keep track of all the bands I enjoyed out there. That was why I knew the industry, as a whole, is much healthier than labels want people to know.

Unfortunatley there are few options to discover new music without a vehicle like radio. There's internet radio (disabled due to high fees), music blogs - most suffer from frequent DCMA take downs and YouTube (time consuming). The fact that a lot of music blogs that specialize in independant and out-of-print music seem to get the bulk of DCMA complaints and shut downs, yet the ones publishing links to current label releases can go on for years unhampered tells me the "war" is online too.

And that's the crux of the problem. It's hard to discover and keep track of independant bands unless they develop a big web prescene. Yes, there is soundclound, bandcamp, artist direct, CDbaby and even Emusic. Their offerings are uneven, limited, requires using all of them and time consuming. Both Amazon and Itunes also make it fairly simple to get independant music, but their pay stinks. I recently discovered some new bands at ... Internet Archive (whodathunkit?).

I think I have disliked 90% of what I have downloaded based on a 30-60 second clip. I've been burned enough that I won't do it anymore. I can't afford it. I want the whole song first, then I'll buy or I'll buy the next album without reservation because I like any album they put out. Amanda seems to realize that because she adds "come back later and contribute" - Yea! Free listening rights.

I really don't want to spend all day on the internet trying to find the bands I like, researching whether they are truly free of major labels or not.

It's not "free" that I'm looking for. I've got a $300 mp3 player and a $600 phone to carry music around with me in. I like new music and I don't want to waste time and money on stuff I'm not interested in. When I'm tossing 90% because I bought based on a clip - that's insane.

I love Led Zepplin, but I've listened to them for 30 years and have paid for so many variations and formats now that they are about ready to make me scream. I was very dissapointed they signed with a label again. Most of my friends are stuck on the tried and true, same old stuff because they haven't heard what else is out there. I gotta admit, one of my joys has been introducing them to alternatives.

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Ha-ha! So typical.

"Once again, absurdity proves boundless as mediafire just took down the latest Night People compilation, Bent Minds, for abstruse copyright reasons. In other words, a label’s own compilation of its own music was deleted from a free file hosting website because someone considered they already owned the combination of the words “bent” and “minds”. That’s good to know, I was actually going to upload a mix called The Burger King rules the Pizza Hut but I guess I’ll have to give it a second thought."

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Such as; Radiohead, Trent Reznor (NIN), Wilcox started that way ... I know there's been others that have charted. Radiohead's Rainbows went on to become Amazon's top selling CD that year. The physical CD wasn't put out until 6 months after it had been available online.

It's hard to sell CD's that people don't like. That's another core concept that escapes major labels. Production and marketing campaigns can't correct mediocre music or bad publicity from attacking the customer base. Whatever happened to capitalistic "the customer is always right"?

They've had over 2 decades to sort things out, including rights, distribution and royalties for the global digital age and have failed. They are on their way to loosing the third generation of customers to other entertainment. That's a business model that deserves to die, quickly. It's certainly not one I care to support with tax dollars or by becoming the world's IP police.