Comments on: Got oil?http://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil/
Comments on MetaFilter post Got oil?Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:29:49 -0800Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:29:49 -0800en-ushttp://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss60Got oil?http://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil
Need oil? Try <a href="http://environment.newscientist.com/channel/earth/dn12141-giant-microwave-turns-plastic-back-to-oil.html">microwaving</a> your <a href="http://www.globalresourcecorp.com/Plastic%20Recycling.html">plastics</a>.post:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:10:23 -0800sunshineskyplasticoilgasolinedieselenvironmentrecyclingmicrowaveBy: furtivehttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756055
The <a href="http://www.carbonrecovery.com/Videos_GRC.asp">video</a> shows the tires before and after, but doesn't show any of the microwave process, I'd like to know how long it takes to go through all the frequencies they mention and how much energy it takes.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756055Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:29:49 -0800furtiveBy: weapons-grade pandemoniumhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756056
OK. Let's start with these <a href="http://www.pickupspecialties.com/truck_nutz.htm">Truck Nutz</a>.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756056Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:32:44 -0800weapons-grade pandemoniumBy: stbalbachhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756057
The first link says a company will be using it to recycle old cars (non-metal bits) and it generates enough fuel to power the microwave plus some other machines. So, it looks like a good method of keeping stuff out of landfills, but not a new source of energy.
I wonder what they do with the toxic gas that is produced.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756057Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:33:08 -0800stbalbachBy: scratchhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756058
So I'm all for recycling and minimizing landfill, but I wonder what kind of noxious gases this process will produce. Or are the "combustible gases" mentioned in the first link implicitly not harmful? And what about particulates? I'm a scientific idiot, so be nice to me if it's obvious to science folk that the whole process was devised to help solve the problem of particulate pollution.
Also, "autofluff" is my new favorite word.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756058Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:33:24 -0800scratchBy: scratchhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756059
[on preview] Hee! I'll bet weapons-grade panda has been just quivering with excitement for a chance to post that link into something even vaguely related.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756059Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:35:50 -0800scratchBy: weapons-grade pandemoniumhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756064
Nope. Spur of the moment. They were on MetaFilter previously.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756064Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:42:14 -0800weapons-grade pandemoniumBy: weapons-grade pandemoniumhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756068
It's the mindless consumption of so many useless oil products that feeds the culture of conquest for oil. With this "development" (I'm skeptical) we can ease our conscience into believing that it's renewable, and consume more.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756068Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:55:55 -0800weapons-grade pandemoniumBy: sunshineskyhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756071
Great input! I knew the links were pretty bare-bones, but that's exactly why MeFi is great- you always bring up pertinent questions about the posts.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756071Sun, 08 Jul 2007 09:58:50 -0800sunshineskyBy: Tubehttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756078
Not a double, but this story reminded me of an older <a href="http://www.metafilter.com/58716/Converting-Garbage-into-Energy">waste-into-something-valuable post.</a>
If this technology is for real, it would certainly help the tire disposal problem at the very least.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756078Sun, 08 Jul 2007 10:06:32 -0800TubeBy: boneheadhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756083
<em>...what kind of noxious gases this process will produce...</em>
Probably not too many, and those that it does would be fairly easy to manage.
Microwave-assisted processes (MAPs) like this have been kicking around for a while now. They work fine, but the problem is always that the end result is often cheaper by another method. They're a solution looking for a problem, in my opinion.
In this case, is it more expensive to burn the plastic in a plasma incinerator in one step rather than microwave it, then burn it? Maybe. It would be interesting to see their cost breakdowns.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756083Sun, 08 Jul 2007 10:09:20 -0800boneheadBy: boneheadhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756085
Tube, your link is to the main competitor for this kind of technology, a power-generating plasma incinerator.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756085Sun, 08 Jul 2007 10:12:46 -0800boneheadBy: stbalbachhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756094
From a global warming perspective, this technology is actually bad. At least with landfills the CO2 is being sequestered underground. Burning the oil releases the CO2 into the atmosphere - and for what? To keep landfill space down. Not a great bargain. I think making plastic releases a lot of CO2 also so its a sort of double whammy.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756094Sun, 08 Jul 2007 10:23:32 -0800stbalbachBy: maxweltonhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756096
As I said in the the other thread about the plasma machine, even if it can power itself from the process it's still hugely valuable. Landfills aren't infinite, and that's your groundwater you're throwing this stuff into.
I'm also curious about how long it takes. Can it do ten tires every ten seconds? One per minute?
This sort of machine would seem to be ideal for a high-sunlight place like the southwest. The machine could be powered by solar and produce fuel which could then be shipped elsewhere.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756096Sun, 08 Jul 2007 10:25:53 -0800maxweltonBy: FelliniBlankhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756108
<em>Also, "autofluff" is my new favorite word.</em>
What a coincidence -- my high school nickname was "autofluffer," . . . but on second thought, let's not get into that.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756108Sun, 08 Jul 2007 10:42:45 -0800FelliniBlankBy: eye of newthttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756110
Makes me wonder if the regular household microwave oven could be made to cook better if multiple frequencies were used.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756110Sun, 08 Jul 2007 10:44:45 -0800eye of newtBy: distant figureshttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756123
I wonder if the process could aid in powering this <a href="http://www.dep.state.fl.us/waste/categories/tires/pages/osbornepilot.htm">cleanup effort</a>.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756123Sun, 08 Jul 2007 11:19:30 -0800distant figuresBy: From Bklynhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756149
<i>Makes me wonder if the regular household microwave oven could be made to cook better if multiple frequencies were used.</i>
That's what I was thinking. 'Cause you know, I always wanted to own my own refinery.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756149Sun, 08 Jul 2007 11:52:39 -0800From BklynBy: Blazecock Pileonhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756170
<i> Burning the oil releases the CO2 into the atmosphere - and for what</i>
Worse yet if the waste gas is methane ("combustible gas")comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756170Sun, 08 Jul 2007 12:37:02 -0800Blazecock PileonBy: stbalbachhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756222
Plastic doesn't produce methane in landfills. It's stuff like kitchen waste that makes methane.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756222Sun, 08 Jul 2007 13:23:17 -0800stbalbachBy: Blazecock Pileonhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756240
<i> Plastic doesn't produce methane in landfills</i>
I'm referring the oil recovery process described in the link.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756240Sun, 08 Jul 2007 13:42:19 -0800Blazecock PileonBy: Mitheralhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756304
<b>eye of newt</b> <a href='http://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756110'>writes</a> <em>"Makes me wonder if the regular household microwave oven could be made to cook better if multiple frequencies were used."</em>
Unlikely. Microwaves ranges work by flexing bipolar molecules in food, which then warms everything else. Different frequencies aren't going make any difference unless a different heating action came into play.comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756304Sun, 08 Jul 2007 15:03:38 -0800MitheralBy: Shakeerhttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756661
also - an amazing superweapon !comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756661Sun, 08 Jul 2007 23:54:19 -0800ShakeerBy: Chuckleshttp://www.metafilter.com/62741/Got-oil#1756901
<em>Landfills aren't infinite, and that's your groundwater you're throwing this stuff into.</em>
Urban sprawl and other human land use, heavy metals and PCBs, and over fishing, as well as the obvious Global Warming, are the serious environmental problems. Landfill is a minor contributer to a couple of those, so it really isn't a big problem.
I'm still very much in favour of sensible application of the three R's though, as long as people remember the correct order:<blockquote><strong>REDUCE</strong> - REUSE - <small>RECYCLE</small></blockquote>comment:www.metafilter.com,2007:site.62741-1756901Mon, 09 Jul 2007 08:29:55 -0800Chuckles