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Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

Originally Posted by Hardy

Wait, Ken, you're not getting it.

It's not as simple as ¨K, he's a first stringer, he's better¨ (Kenya isn't better than Shiraishi, Kirihara, Hirakoba, Kaidoh, etc...) . WoK lost to a synchro pair, do you know what that means? Perfect coordination, it's not that easy to beat them.

Now, as Airgrimes said, you could easily attack the weakest of the two (of course, Kenya) and avoid BJK, a synchro pair would be good enough to do that... and WoK would be as good too (come on, Tachibana and Chitose against Kenya, wtf is he gonna do?). The same goes for the Taira/Hara pair.

Attacking the weak one? That's a tactic that can be use anytime. What about Momoshiro and Kenya attacking Chitose? One hit from BJK and he's out. And Airgrimes already stated that syncho can only be use for last couples of point where WoK is about to lose. It's not going to help much. And it look like you say a syncho pair is good enough to do that...?

Here's some fact.

1. As of the current timeline without any assumption about their future match, WoK lost to 3rd court Doubles 1.
2. 3rd Court Doubles 1 should be weaker than 2nd court doubles, 1st court doubles, and especially 1st stringer doubles. It's the way shuffle court is meant to work.

If you think 3rd court doubles 1 can beat Taira/Hara, then I don't really want to debate that with you. I don't think they are as strong as Taira/Hara, even if they do have Syncho. And espeically not the pair that just beat Taira/Hara, even if they just win due to the virtue of one move. A win is a win.

Originally Posted by Hardy

Real life =/= PoT... you don't really know. But, as I said before, you don't need to return BJK to win against that pair.

Eh, so assuming that a ball to a racquet will deal less damage to your hand than a ball to racquet string is reasonable? BJK doesn't deal damage because it hit the string. It deals damage because it's a ball with high impact. Hitting with racquet or hitting with string does not change the impact of the ball, but it will make it have more impact on your hand.

Last edited by -Ken-; January 27, 2013 at 07:40 PM.

Most of the thing I post is probably assumption if it's not a fact that I support using some evidence from the manga.

If you knows you're on my ignore list and you quote my post, there's high chance I would ignore you. Or answer you and not look at your response.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

In the game 3rd court battle that Krauser played it's said that he's overreliant on one hit KO moves. But honestly if you have a move that can one hit KO an opponent does it really matter if you suck everywhere else? In a doubles match if you KO one of the opponents there's no way the other team can win since whoever got KOed cannot hold his serve, and can never return a serve either unless you're already ahead 4-1 or better with the guy who didn't get knocked out about to serve (and assuming this guy can win his serve single handedly).

Now the easiest way to deal with moves like BJK is just get out of the way because it's just one point and it doesn't seem like it's a move you can use on every point, but characters in POT are too stupid to figure this out and they always try to return the crazy shots that can possibly kill you. Looking at their place in story I don't see Momoshiro/Kenya being all that strong, but as long as their opponent is dumb enough to try to return BJK and possibly breaking their hand over it, they're definitely a very strong team.

Well, Saiki's an all or nothing technique, so of course it's not going to work on the higher level players. CE breaks it, In breaks it, and GUYU breaks it. Yamato's not a top U-17 player, at least not G20-level, and he can break Saiki.

Explain to me why doubling your speed and minimizing fatigue is a bad idea. Even if Echizen couldn't double shots back with it against G10 players, it's still going to work in terms of the speed boost.

Nanjirou won the world with TnK, that's all I'm going to say on that front.

Even if you're correct, none of that explains why he hasn't tried using them at all. Against Kazuya, we don't see him activate any of the doors and we haven't since either.

What a lot of us assumed is that Echizen magically lost the use of the abilities because it works like that. Some people, such as Kaoz, claim that Echizen may have been unconsciously playing against Yuki and therefore doesn't remember/recall activating/using them.

There's a massive power inflation after the Kantou tournament and then again in NPOT. When Ryoma played Akutsu it's said that Ryoma reminded people of the Samurai Nanjirou when he was young. That was Ryoma without muga or anything else. If that is supposed to remind people of Samurai Nanjirou then he must be a very pathetic player back then, because Ryoma's power level while playing Akutsu would have a hard time winning a game and possibly even a single point against any top tier character that showed up by the Nationals let alone NPOT. Nanjirou, given the powers he displayed in POT, would be barely better than a cannon fodder character in NPOT. There's roughly 3 eras in POT: Kantou tournament, national tournament, and NPOT. Techniques that dominate an earlier era is pretty much useless in the next era. Muga was supposed to be the end all be all ability at the Kantou tournament and it's pretty much a completely irrelevent technique by the nationals when you've the two guys who mastered it (Sanada and Yukimura) never using it, and Kirihara was clearly talked out of learning more about Muga in favor of Devil Form. Likewise stuff like Hyakuren or even TnK is uber in the national era but by the time NPOT comes around even TnK isn't that noteworthy by the fact that none of the top characters even bothered commented on Tezuka obtaining TnK.

You can't say 'but this technique says it's awesome'. Hyakuren and Saiki would lose to World of Ice on its own because you can't double return a shot that you cannot hit, and Saiki will just tell you that Atobe is about to hit a shot that you cannot return, and even World of Ice isn't really noteworthy in NPOT which is why we have the Atobe Kingdom upgrade.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

@Ken

Taira/Hara > Washio/Suzuki because Taira has Bakyuun. I agree of course.
But look at it this way. Had Taira/Hara known that Momoshiro had BJK don't you think the match would have played out differently?
They were hitting it it to Momo allowing him to hit his Jack Knife just so they could shit on the move for fun. Taira/Hara were just having fun.

I'll be honest here, since Hara/Taira nearly shat themselves when they noticed Momoshiro could use BJK, I think its clear they would have just not aimed for Momo early on and I think thats in their capabilities personally since if you remember, without BJK, Kenya and Momoshiro were getting dominated completely they looked a joke.
Yes, as a pair they have BJK but... Once that is gone they are back to be an awful pair again.
There are tons of MS pairs that would beat Nationals!Momo/Kenya. In fact, they can't actually take many points from Hirakoba/Chinen.
Nationals!Momo/Kenya is that useless.

As for BJK, basic Biology here, hitting a powerful shot on the racket part directly beside your wrist will put far less pressure than hitting the shot on the racket strings far away from your wrist.
Think about it. Hitting it with the racket throat that is nearby your hand will be a lot less painful on the wrist than having to gather the strength in your arms to hit it back with your racket strings whilst the BJK spins violently on your strings as you take a difficult swing to hit it back.
By hitting it on the throat of the racket like Abare Dama does, there would be no possibility for the ball to spin violently on your racket and rape your wrists.
It will likely just knock the racket straight out of your hand but it shouldn't hurt your wrist.

Sure it will probably knock the racket out of Tachibana's hand constantly but its not impossible that he returns it.
Didn't Momoshiro receive several BJK's before giving up? I think Tachibana personally can survive some too.
Taira/Hara like a lot of these HSers are not physically strong.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

Originally Posted by Airgrimes

Sure it will probably knock the racket out of Tachibana's hand constantly but its not impossible that he returns it.
Didn't Momoshiro receive several BJK's before giving up? I think Tachibana personally can survive some too.
Taira/Hara like a lot of these HSers are not physically strong.

I think it is ironic that you used Tachibana as an example, because like Sanada, he is one of the few characters known for his strength without being a power player. In fact, Tachibana and Sanada are the only ones I can think of. I don't think BJK would knock the racquet out of either of their hands, because both are very strong (physically).

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

It's not biology. It's Physics. And it's the opposite. Further away it is, the less force it will be required to take the ball back to the opponents. I got 5 in AP Physics AB, whatever that's worth.

And I only saw you stated "If they play smart, they can win". The only single time that I saw people plays smart in PoT is when Sanada stops using Rai against Tezuka because Rai will make him lose. Niou doesn't change back to Tezuka to not hit cord ball when he's fighting Fuji.

PoT characters like to face each other head on and wins. They might plays smart, but that's really high assumption because it happen such a few times in the manga.

Most of the thing I post is probably assumption if it's not a fact that I support using some evidence from the manga.

If you knows you're on my ignore list and you quote my post, there's high chance I would ignore you. Or answer you and not look at your response.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

Its both. Its regarding muscle tissues here. In case you didn't know, Muscle tissues are a part of Human Biology.

Originally Posted by -Ken-

It's not biology. It's Physics. And it's the opposite. Further away it is, the less force it will be required to take the ball back to the opponents. I got 5 in AP Physics AB, whatever that's worth.

That's the issue. It damages the muscles in the opponents wrists as far as we're concerned.
So its all about pressure and not about breaking bones. Since if Momo's hand was broken, he wouldn't be back in action so freaking soon.

A broken hand requires a long time to get back into tennis.
So that confirms that all BJK does is damage the muscles in your wrists.
This proves the theory that the damage is done due to the violent spin on the ball when it touches the opponent's racket.

And Ken, two things, if the ball with violent spin hits against your racket strings, the pressure to return it will be all on your wrist.
If the the ball with violent spin hits your racket throat, there isn't any room for the ball to generate the violent spin, secondly, Abare Dama is a Drive Volley so Tachibana is sprinting towards the BJK and because the ball is so close to his own hand he's almost punching it away.

Considering Momoshiro can survive numerous BJK's, Why is it impossible to suggest that Tachibana + Mojuu no Aura + Abare Dama won't return Momoshiro's BJK which is more than likely weaker than Oni's since Oni and Momoshiro simply cannot have the same stats.

Going back to what I've said, its all about the pressure on the wrist muscle considering Momo's two wrists couldn't have been broken and healed so neatly so fast.
Only a few weeks have gone.
And that Abare Dama involves no real tension on wrists since the ball is going to simply fly straight off the metal as oppose to being absorbed by the racket strings.

And I only saw you stated "If they play smart, they can win". The only single time that I saw people plays smart in PoT is when Sanada stops using Rai against Tezuka because Rai will make him lose. Niou doesn't change back to Tezuka to not hit cord ball when he's fighting Fuji.

PoT characters like to face each other head on and wins. They might plays smart, but that's really high assumption because it happen such a few times in the manga.

Here this, its not "if they play smart" in my theory. Pay attention.
Tachibana + Mojuu no Aura + Abare Dama should surely be able to hit back BJK. Its not like BJK is godly anyway. It got shat on by Nationals!Tooyama.
And Momoshiro survived several of Oni's.

You're assuming that Tachibana is phsically weak right now. Just because Taira and Hara lost to Momoshiro's BJK does NOT mean that Tachibana, a man who wrecked Fuji's racket before he got Mojuu no Aura will be finished by a BJK from Momo.
More importantly, Tachibana is known as a physically strong player like Momo is.

Once he enters Mojuu no Aura and uses Abare Dama and Abare Jishi all at once, I can't see Momoshiro's BJK being enough to KO him.

And remember, Momoshiro's BJK is relying on KO'ing Tachibana in order to win. Just like Hara dodges shots, I'm certain Chitose will do the same and let Tachibana hit his Abare Dama they are a canon pair after all.
Also, its been kinda shown that Momoshiro can't even Jack Knife on demand and that he has to set it up. This means he has to set up a BJK.
So he has limited chances of even hitting his BJK, which shouldn't really damage the wrist of Tachibana.

I guess you could counter me by saying Tachibana is physically weak, (Not true)
Or... That despite Momoshiro being able to survive several of Oni's BJK's, Tachibana will be KO'd in one shot by Momoshiro's even weaker BJK.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

About the science stuff, go back and learn AP physics then you can debate it with me. Physics wise, hitting with racquet will deals more impact to your hand in comparison to hitting it with racquet string. Seriously. There's nothing to debate there. It's pure life physics.

Eh, all I saw is just theory of how Tachibana stand a chance against Momoshiro. Like I say before, shows me a proof from a manga that Tachibana is 1st string material. I only found proof that he's 3rd court. Overwrite that proof with actual manga material and you win.

You say Chitose "could" dodge and let Tachibana handle it. I don't think Tachibana can win against what 2 1st stringer couldn't win. As he, by himself, is just a 3rd court level. That's where Konomi placed him. National! Shiraishi had trouble against 3rd court until he takes off his gauntlet. It's nothing to be ashamed of. But Momoshiro is 1st court material. And Tachibana just aren't going to win against someone who is 1st stringer when he can't win against someone who is 3rd court. Beast Aura+Abare Dame puts him equal to 3rd court before syncho. It's not going to do anything to Momoshiro who is 1st stringer.

Chitose is pretty much fodder here. As soon as he hit a ball by Momoshiro, he's out.

Theory crafting is fine, but really, SPoT is a different manga than PoT. Characters are in different tiers now. Momoshiro is in 1st stringer tier. WoK is just 3rd court. I don't see what's so hard to understand. If you can't show me a proof from manga that they aren't 1st stringer material, then don't bother posting anymore.

The matter is just "tier". It doesn't matter how the techniques are. I remember seeing people putting Yagyuu higher than Kaidoh before SPoT starts and he get his curved laser simply because of "tier". Momoshiro is higher tier than Tachibana. It's really that simple. Look at the page where Momoshiro beat 1st stringer and page where Tachibana lost to 3rd court. That sets their current tier.

3rd court is not a weak tier. I just want to make that clear. They lost to 1st stringer tier, but so will any other characters that doesn't get upgrade in SPoT. Shiraishi, who was regards one of the stronger high tier, would have get crush by players in Doubles 2 without taking off his gauntlet. Krauser also got shat on. But it's just not as high as 1st stringer, that is all.

Most of the thing I post is probably assumption if it's not a fact that I support using some evidence from the manga.

If you knows you're on my ignore list and you quote my post, there's high chance I would ignore you. Or answer you and not look at your response.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

Originally Posted by -Ken-

About the science stuff, go back and learn AP physics then you can debate it with me. Physics wise, hitting with racquet will deals more impact to your hand in comparison to hitting it with racquet string. Seriously. There's nothing to debate there. It's pure life physics.

Eh, all I saw is just theory of how Tachibana stand a chance against Momoshiro. Like I say before, shows me a proof from a manga that Tachibana is 1st string material. I only found proof that he's 3rd court. Overwrite that proof with actual manga material and you win.

You say Chitose "could" dodge and let Tachibana handle it. I don't think Tachibana can win against what 2 1st stringer couldn't win. As he, by himself, is just a 3rd court level. That's where Konomi placed him. National! Shiraishi had trouble against 3rd court until he takes off his gauntlet. It's nothing to be ashamed of. But Momoshiro is 1st court material. And Tachibana just aren't going to win against someone who is 1st stringer when he can't win against someone who is 3rd court. Beast Aura+Abare Dame puts him equal to 3rd court before syncho. It's not going to do anything to Momoshiro who is 1st stringer.

Chitose is pretty much fodder here. As soon as he hit a ball by Momoshiro, he's out.

Theory crafting is fine, but really, SPoT is a different manga than PoT. Characters are in different tiers now. Momoshiro is in 1st stringer tier. WoK is just 3rd court. I don't see what's so hard to understand. If you can't show me a proof from manga that they aren't 1st stringer material, then don't bother posting anymore.

The matter is just "tier". It doesn't matter how the techniques are. I remember seeing people putting Yagyuu higher than Kaidoh before SPoT starts and he get his curved laser simply because of "tier". Momoshiro is higher tier than Tachibana. It's really that simple. Look at the page where Momoshiro beat 1st stringer and page where Tachibana lost to 3rd court. That sets their current tier.

3rd court is not a weak tier. I just want to make that clear. They lost to 1st stringer tier, but so will any other characters that doesn't get upgrade in SPoT. Shiraishi, who was regards one of the stronger high tier, would have get crush by players in Doubles 2 without taking off his gauntlet. Krauser also got shat on. But it's just not as high as 1st stringer, that is all.

The problem with this mentality is you will never account for future tier jumps, just present ones. For example, going by your mentality to judge the Kantou arc, you would have said the following:

At this point in the series, you would have said Fuji is better than both Kirihara and Tachibana because of the above premises. I would have disagreed with you, and been proven right when Tachibana makes Fuji look like an idiot before the Nationals. You only take the "what" into account. The "what" is Tachibana lost to Kirihara directly, and Fuji indirectly. However, that theory is incomplete because you do not take the "why" into account. The reason "why" Tachibana lost to Kirihara, is because he was not using his typical aggressive attack style that he is known for, which creates a handicap. Sure, we didn't know this at the time, but the author's hints are what make me prepare the mental fields for rain. I was not surprised when Tachibana unofficially wrecked Fuji, because I knew his true abilities were not yet shown.

All this to say everything you say will only apply until Konomi writes his inevitable tier jumping. I think it is both safe and necessary to take that into account.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

You can't just stick with the character's past ranking forever. In POT the WoK are the 'national tier', i.e. supposed to be able to put up a fight against Tezuka, while Momoshiro is just an average guy in a school that never made it very far in the nationals. But you can't say just because WoK were national tier and Momoshiro was fodder tier in the past this means it can never change. If Kaidoh inexplicably defeated Byodouin you don't say 'this means the truckloads of people who could've defeated Kaidoh are all clearly better than Byodouin too". All this would mean is that Kaidoh is now inexplicably in the god tier and all the guys who used to beat him easily is clearly no match for him now. Momoshiro won his doubles in a rather dominating fashion (Niou used an anti-synchro gimmick, while Kawamura actually lost the game but were handed badges for saving their opponents) so this puts them very high on the doubles hierarchy. When and if Konomi remembers that there's supposed to be this Beast Synchro or whatever I'm sure the WoK will improve too but until that actually happens, the WoK is really nobody special at this point and there's a more than good chance Konomi may never have them play again.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

Originally Posted by -Ken-

About the science stuff, go back and learn AP physics then you can debate it with me. Physics wise, hitting with racquet will deals more impact to your hand in comparison to hitting it with racquet string. Seriously. There's nothing to debate there. It's pure life physics.

In terms of wrist pressure, if the ball hits the frame of the racket and basically rebounds off of it, which is what Abare Dama is, there is less pressure on the wrist.
This no longer about Physics so your physics knowledge lacks relevance here.
Human Muscle pressure is about human biology. Which I do know.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

Originally Posted by Fayte

The problem with this mentality is you will never account for future tier jumps, just present ones.

That's not a problem. It's tier list as of a current time in the manga. How the future match affects the tier list will be taken into accounts when that match takes match in the manga. The problem with your mentality is that "Well, we knows Echizen will tops it all in the end. Why not just put him on top of the tier list."

Originally Posted by Fayte

For example, going by your mentality to judge the Kantou arc, you would have said the following:

At this point in the series, you would have said Fuji is better than both Kirihara and Tachibana because of the above premises. I would have disagreed with you, and been proven right when Tachibana makes Fuji look like an idiot before the Nationals. You only take the "what" into account. The "what" is Tachibana lost to Kirihara directly, and Fuji indirectly. However, that theory is incomplete because you do not take the "why" into account. The reason "why" Tachibana lost to Kirihara, is because he was not using his typical aggressive attack style that he is known for, which creates a handicap. Sure, we didn't know this at the time, but the author's hints are what make me prepare the mental fields for rain. I was not surprised when Tachibana unofficially wrecked Fuji, because I knew his true abilities were not yet shown.

Correction: When Fuji did beat Kirihara, Tachibana was not yet shown to have beast aura yet. So at that chapter, Fuji indeed > Kirihara AND Tachibana. However, as you say, as soon as the chapter that show Tachibana beast aura arrive, he move up the tier list again, and move above Fuji at that time. It's the same case here, WoK might move up above 3rd court tier list. But until then, they ARE 3rd court.

Originally Posted by Fayte

All this to say everything you say will only apply until Konomi writes his inevitable tier jumping. I think it is both safe and necessary to take that into account.

But it will apply until Konomi write his tier jumping. I think it's unfair for the characters that gain improvement if other is just given benefits of doubt to be above them.

I don't think it's necessary to take that into account. Unless you want to make a tier list of where the characters will be at the end of SPoT, then yes, by all means, takes that into accounts. I'm only interested in constructing an accurate current tier list as of the current chapter, though.

Most of the thing I post is probably assumption if it's not a fact that I support using some evidence from the manga.

If you knows you're on my ignore list and you quote my post, there's high chance I would ignore you. Or answer you and not look at your response.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

You say Chitose "could" dodge and let Tachibana handle it. I don't think Tachibana can win against what 2 1st stringer couldn't win. As he, by himself, is just a 3rd court level. That's where Konomi placed him.

In Doubles.
Why have you confused his Singles ability with his Doubles Ability?
Would Tachibana really have lost to Nakagauchi? I doubt it.
Would Tachibana have really lost to Yamato, something we can discuss. (Irie is Top10 level as we know lol).

Tachibana as a Singles player is not 3rd Court level.
Why would you judge him like that? Nothing shows his Singles ability so far in SPoT so I don't know why you are saying he is 3rd Court level as an individual.
That's wrong.
You are now implying Kenya > Tachibana individually with your logic.
Which is so wrong its disgusting.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

Originally Posted by Airgrimes

In Doubles.
Why have you confused his Singles ability with his Doubles Ability?
Would Tachibana really have lost to Nakagauchi? I doubt it.
Would Tachibana have really lost to Yamato, something we can discuss. (Irie is Top10 level as we know lol).

Tachibana as a Singles player is not 3rd Court level.
Why would you judge him like that? Nothing shows his Singles ability so far in SPoT so I don't know why you are saying he is 3rd Court level as an individual.
That's wrong.
You are now implying Kenya > Tachibana individually with your logic.
Which is so wrong its disgusting.

Eh, do you place him above 3rd court level? Where, then? Proof? Please? From what we've seen, I think Nakagauchi would lose against Tachibana, but not by a huge margin. I don't think Tachibana > Shiraishi in National, and National! Shiraishi was put into a hard time by 3rd court.

If you don't have proof, it's assumption. Simple. Show me a proof in SPoT that place him above 3rd court.

Most of the thing I post is probably assumption if it's not a fact that I support using some evidence from the manga.

If you knows you're on my ignore list and you quote my post, there's high chance I would ignore you. Or answer you and not look at your response.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

Originally Posted by -Ken-

Eh, all I saw is just theory of how Tachibana stand a chance against Momoshiro. Like I say before, shows me a proof from a manga that Tachibana is 1st string material. I only found proof that he's 3rd court. Overwrite that proof with actual manga material and you win.

You say Chitose "could" dodge and let Tachibana handle it. I don't think Tachibana can win against what 2 1st stringer couldn't win. As he, by himself, is just a 3rd court level. That's where Konomi placed him. National! Shiraishi had trouble against 3rd court until he takes off his gauntlet. It's nothing to be ashamed of. But Momoshiro is 1st court material. And Tachibana just aren't going to win against someone who is 1st stringer when he can't win against someone who is 3rd court. Beast Aura+Abare Dame puts him equal to 3rd court before syncho. It's not going to do anything to Momoshiro who is 1st stringer.

Chitose is pretty much fodder here. As soon as he hit a ball by Momoshiro, he's out.

Theory crafting is fine, but really, SPoT is a different manga than PoT. Characters are in different tiers now. Momoshiro is in 1st stringer tier. WoK is just 3rd court. I don't see what's so hard to understand. If you can't show me a proof from manga that they aren't 1st stringer material, then don't bother posting anymore.

You're an idiot if you can't tell the difference between a Doubles Tier and Singles Tier. Seriously.
WoK are 3rd Court Tier in Doubles when up against a Synchro pair.
Individually, they would have creamed Washio or Suzuki.
Individually, you yourself have no idea how Tachibana or Chitose would do against Momoshiro.

You say because Momo has a No.19 badge he is now 1st String material sure, but in Doubles he is 1st String material.
Not in Singles. Same with Kenya. They are a 1st String pair.
individually, Kenya is quite poor and will be exploited.
To say Momoshiro is a 1st String level Singles player because he bt No.s12/18 means you think Kenya is also a 1st String tier player and is individually tiers above Tachibana and Chitose.

So you have to recognize that Momo/Kenya have only proven to be 1st String material in Doubles and only due to BJK.

Originally Posted by -Ken-

Eh, do you place him above 3rd court level? Where, then? Proof? Please? From what we've seen, I think Nakagauchi would lose against Tachibana, but not by a huge margin. I don't think Tachibana > Shiraishi in National, and National! Shiraishi was put into a hard time by 3rd court.

If you don't have proof, it's assumption. Simple. Show me a proof in SPoT that place him above 3rd court.

It isn't so simple, Shiraishi was dominated against a Doubles pair due to Miyako and Matsudaira's stats complimenting each other so well.
He was paired with Kirihara who wasn't in Devil Mode, so we basically had Prefecturals!Kirihara in that match.

Had it been in Singles I don't think it would have been such a harsh 4-0 slamming from Miyako or Matsu against Shiraishi.
Simply because Nakagauchi > Matsu and Miyako in Singles I think it has been implied.
After the GG removal, it was basically the same Prefecturals!Kirihara that was smashing away against them taking it to 4-4 whilst Shiraishi was taking it easy.
So no, I don't think that 3rd Court was really at the same level as Nationals!Shiraishi in Singles.

Shiraishi/Akaya, being a makeshift pair with no combination prowess unlike Miyako/Matsudaira also, there are several factors you're missing.
Washio/Suzuki having combination prowess, whereas WoK not having played together in a year, so to determine their Singles abilities from this isn't right.

Re: Tier List (Singles and Doubles)

Originally Posted by Airgrimes

You're an idiot if you can't tell the difference between a Doubles Tier and Singles Tier. Seriously.
WoK are 3rd Court Tier in Doubles when up against a Synchro pair.
Individually, they would have creamed Washio or Suzuki.
Individually, you yourself have no idea how Tachibana or Chitose would do against Momoshiro.

So does it matter here in this case? WoK Are 3rd court tier in doubles. Momoshiro/Kenya are 1st stringer tier in doubles. That's it. They aren't playing in Singles, they're playing in doubles. Higher tier win.

Most of the thing I post is probably assumption if it's not a fact that I support using some evidence from the manga.

If you knows you're on my ignore list and you quote my post, there's high chance I would ignore you. Or answer you and not look at your response.