"Thank you for making Dota 2 a better community!"

Does anyone recognize this phrase? Yes, of course you do. It is the heartfelt thank you extended to the player by Valve after he reports a fellow player for misbehavior of any and all natures! What a beautiful, inspired, amazing community-building system.

Sarcasm aside, I have only played about 6 games of DoTA2 up to this point but I simply cannot believe how terrible this "community building system" is. First of all, as I understand it there is NO surrender option. Your team cannot vote to surrender the match. Which means that your 2-30 farmed opponents (I am not joking here, this was the score before they hit level 12) can freely prolong the game and farm their hearts out (pun fully intended) for a good 20+ minutes, when the game is so far gone that there is no reasonable chance AT ALL of coming back. And the best part? If you leave the game, you've "abandoned it". Yes, you get sanctioned for this. There's is no way this can make it to release, it's simply beyond bad. There needs to be a surrender option.

Secondly, the amazing love all the players can share with each other via the report system. This has abuse written all over it. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that when your team is loosing, you never want to accept any portion of the blame (if you're the average DotA player anyway) so what happens is, A starts yelling at B that he's a noob and that he lost the game for the team. What follows is a heartwarming gang bang facilitated by the report tool where 3-4 players report some guy just to vent their frustrations. And when the game finally ends, he's greeted by the "play" screen that is now informing him that he has been placed in a low priority que for 2 days due to player reports.

Thank you, for making Dota 2 a better community!

EDIT: Ok, reading this again myself I'm guessing it should probably be in blogs (since it's basically just a rant)... unless someone actually disagrees with the above two points in which case my mind will be blown and I imagine fervent discussion will evolve.

Why should there be a surrender option in beta? You're not playing the game for fun, you're supposed to be testing it. If there was a surrender button 80% of pubs would only last 20 mins, and a ton of shit wouldn't get enough testing.

Also that's the same message you get when you commend people, I don't see how this is an issue. This thread seems like a bunch of unwarranted whining and should probably be closed.

80% of pubs would end at 20 minutes? Only about 23.4494545% of my games would end at 20 minutes if I'm calculating correctly. I could argue that more people could test more hero combos if there was a surrender option.

I've also had games where all our t1 and t2 towers + a base tower were down at the 20 min mark, none of their towers were, and they had a 10 kill lead. Won that game. Don't know how but sure as fact if there was a surrender option it would have ended right at the 20 min mark. As far as reporting goes, I only ever see people get reported for actually being abusive/intentionally feeding or afking. Sure one person can be a dick and report everyone on his team for text abuse but when someone looks at the reports it will be pretty obvious what happened.

I''ve always hated the surrender option, and I've never reported anyone for being a noob, nor seen people reported for being noobs. Most people I've reported are leavers and people who give the game away purposefully.

Though I think the surrender option will be available once the game is released.

hmm in my 50 games of dota 2 i had about 3 people who were shouting at others and blaming their loss on others...( i reported one and muted the others)... in LoL which has a similar report function i think there are maybe only 10% of the games which end without a report....( and usually i have to mute about 3 people in each game)( hmm ok maybe the people in dota2 appear to be nicer to me because i play at a level where noone actually knows wtf he is doing)

no surrender isn't that great but most of the time usually someone from the loosing team abandons the game anyway

On February 20 2012 06:28 PHILtheTANK wrote:Why should there be a surrender option in beta? You're not playing the game for fun, you're supposed to be testing it. If there was a surrender button 80% of pubs would only last 20 mins, and a ton of shit wouldn't get enough testing.

On February 20 2012 06:28 PHILtheTANK wrote:Why should there be a surrender option in beta? You're not playing the game for fun, you're supposed to be testing it. If there was a surrender button 80% of pubs would only last 20 mins, and a ton of shit wouldn't get enough testing.

On February 20 2012 06:28 PHILtheTANK wrote:Why should there be a surrender option in beta? You're not playing the game for fun, you're supposed to be testing it. If there was a surrender button 80% of pubs would only last 20 mins, and a ton of shit wouldn't get enough testing.

100% false.

It's a beta.

Not a demo.

The purpose of a beta is to test the game.

Crazy, I know.

So dumb... people just stop playing when they feel the game is over. It doesn't get any more testing done than would happen with a surrender option. I mean, really? Ya dude that afk time so valuable to valve.

Besides, don't you think people would be inclined to spend more time playing if there weren't the possibility of the miserable situation where it just drags out after it's already over? Unless you have some word from on high confirming that it's for testing purposes I'm gonna assume it's just something they haven't added yet because valve is not composed of idiots. As you put it, it's a beta, it's not feature complete.

"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."

On February 20 2012 06:28 PHILtheTANK wrote:Why should there be a surrender option in beta? You're not playing the game for fun, you're supposed to be testing it. If there was a surrender button 80% of pubs would only last 20 mins, and a ton of shit wouldn't get enough testing.

100% false.

It's a beta.

Not a demo.

The purpose of a beta is to test the game.

Crazy, I know.

So dumb...

I had to stop reading right here.

I'm dumb because I recognize what a fucking beta is?

How about you get to actually winning instead of whining about that you can't lose fast enough. Most of my wins are come from behind anyways. If surrender was implemented, everyone who was even remotely behind would instant surrender 20 minutes. Nevertheless, it's completely irrelevant because this is a fucking beta and the purpose of a beta is to test, not to make it easier for people to quit games because they're losing.

I've played dozens of games, and I've only had maybe 5-6 that were the situation you describe of "totally unwinnable and 20 minutes of pointless death", and that's because someone on our team went "omg this is so pointless" and left, leaving us at a severe disadvantage.

This losing mentality needs to stop. Stop whining about not having a million ways to quit games when you're losing, and figure out a way to win.

Also, it's a beta. Not a demo. It's meant to test, not for you to faff about. I just felt I should put that out there again.

On February 20 2012 08:04 UniversalSnip wrote:There's nothing wrong with a report feature, it works just fine in lol.

On February 20 2012 07:57 Candadar wrote:

On February 20 2012 07:12 ZAiNs wrote:

On February 20 2012 06:28 PHILtheTANK wrote:Why should there be a surrender option in beta? You're not playing the game for fun, you're supposed to be testing it. If there was a surrender button 80% of pubs would only last 20 mins, and a ton of shit wouldn't get enough testing.

100% false.

It's a beta.

Not a demo.

The purpose of a beta is to test the game.

Crazy, I know.

So dumb...

I had to stop reading right here.

I'm dumb because I recognize what a fucking beta is?

Seriously? If you're not even going to read my post why are you replying? That's not tl standard lol.

"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."

On February 20 2012 08:04 UniversalSnip wrote:There's nothing wrong with a report feature, it works just fine in lol.

On February 20 2012 07:57 Candadar wrote:

On February 20 2012 07:12 ZAiNs wrote:

On February 20 2012 06:28 PHILtheTANK wrote:Why should there be a surrender option in beta? You're not playing the game for fun, you're supposed to be testing it. If there was a surrender button 80% of pubs would only last 20 mins, and a ton of shit wouldn't get enough testing.

100% false.

It's a beta.

Not a demo.

The purpose of a beta is to test the game.

Crazy, I know.

So dumb...

I had to stop reading right here.

I'm dumb because I recognize what a fucking beta is?

Seriously? If you're not even going to read my post why are you replying? That's not tl standard lol.

I don't feel the inclination to take a post seriously when it starts out with an insult.

Nonetheless, I'll quote myself.

How about you get to actually winning instead of whining about that you can't lose fast enough. Most of my wins are come from behind anyways. If surrender was implemented, everyone who was even remotely behind would instant surrender 20 minutes. Nevertheless, it's completely irrelevant because this is a fucking beta and the purpose of a beta is to test, not to make it easier for people to quit games because they're losing.

I've played dozens of games, and I've only had maybe 5-6 that were the situation you describe of "totally unwinnable and 20 minutes of pointless death", and that's because someone on our team went "omg this is so pointless" and left, leaving us at a severe disadvantage.

This losing mentality needs to stop. Stop whining about not having a million ways to quit games when you're losing, and figure out a way to win.

Also, it's a beta. Not a demo. It's meant to test, not for you to faff about. I just felt I should put that out there again.

Maybe you should realise that the game isn't over when you're losing 6-2 after about 10 minutes? The majority of whiners that I have met in the game refuse to try and get back into the game and as soon as they fall even slightly behind, its 'gg i afk farm now'. If you play better, you win more, you play better opponents, you see less of this stupidity. Also, get some friends or play IH if you hate it that much

On February 20 2012 08:14 Lyter wrote:Maybe you should realise that the game isn't over when you're losing 6-2 after about 10 minutes? The majority of whiners that I have met in the game refuse to try and get back into the game and as soon as they fall even slightly behind, its 'gg i afk farm now'. If you play better, you win more, you play better opponents, you see less of this stupidity. Also, get some friends or play IH if you hate it that much

Exactly.

I played LoL for a long time, which has a surrender feature. Well over half of my games, whether I won or lost, had the enemy/my team surrendering at 20-25 minutes because they were losing. It wasn't even that they were losing by a large margin, or any real margin at all. That's not even me exaggerating, I remember every other game having either my team or the enemy team surrendering or someone leaving because "its pointless".

This losing mentality is cancerous and only promotes bad play. Perhaps you would win more games if you went into games with the intention of winning and not surrendering as soon as it goes sour. Almost no games turn into "20 minutes of pointless enemy farming and us dying as it's completely pointless we're so far behind" as is the primary argument for a surrender feature. Not to mention, as been said ad hominem, the purpose of a beta is to test -- and it gets nothing done when everyone is quitting 20 minutes .

On February 20 2012 08:04 UniversalSnip wrote:There's nothing wrong with a report feature, it works just fine in lol.

On February 20 2012 07:57 Candadar wrote:

On February 20 2012 07:12 ZAiNs wrote:

On February 20 2012 06:28 PHILtheTANK wrote:Why should there be a surrender option in beta? You're not playing the game for fun, you're supposed to be testing it. If there was a surrender button 80% of pubs would only last 20 mins, and a ton of shit wouldn't get enough testing.

100% false.

It's a beta.

Not a demo.

The purpose of a beta is to test the game.

Crazy, I know.

So dumb...

I had to stop reading right here.

I'm dumb because I recognize what a fucking beta is?

Seriously? If you're not even going to read my post why are you replying? That's not tl standard lol.

I don't feel the inclination to take a post seriously when it starts out with an insult.

Well, that's your problem. Would be more productive to do the opposite.

How about you get to actually winning instead of whining about that you can't lose fast enough. Most of my wins are come from behind anyways. If surrender was implemented, everyone who was even remotely behind would instant surrender 20 minutes. Nevertheless, it's completely irrelevant because this is a fucking beta and the purpose of a beta is to test, not to make it easier for people to quit games because they're losing.

I've played dozens of games, and I've only had maybe 5-6 that were the situation you describe of "totally unwinnable and 20 minutes of pointless death", and that's because someone on our team went "omg this is so pointless" and left, leaving us at a severe disadvantage.

This losing mentality needs to stop. Stop whining about not having a million ways to quit games when you're losing, and figure out a way to win.

Also, it's a beta. Not a demo. It's meant to test, not for you to faff about. I just felt I should put that out there again.

I'm sorry you're so upset at the thought that people might do the exact same thing they do now, which is ditch, if there's a surrender option. The only impact it has is to let the people who WOULDN'T have alt + f4ed get out of the game without a leave or sitting around waiting for a game that's already over to be settled. Soooo much fun waiting for them to slowly push into our base 5 vs 4, really makes me want to play more.

On February 20 2012 08:14 Lyter wrote:Maybe you should realise that the game isn't over when you're losing 6-2 after about 10 minutes? The majority of whiners that I have met in the game refuse to try and get back into the game and as soon as they fall even slightly behind, its 'gg i afk farm now'. If you play better, you win more, you play better opponents, you see less of this stupidity. Also, get some friends or play IH if you hate it that much

Exactly.

I played LoL for a long time, which has a surrender feature. Well over half of my games, whether I won or lost, had the enemy/my team surrendering at 20-25 minutes because they were losing. It wasn't even that they were losing by a large margin, or any real margin at all. That's not even me exaggerating, I remember every other game having either my team or the enemy team surrendering or someone leaving because "its pointless".

This losing mentality is cancerous and only promotes bad play. Perhaps you would win more games if you went into games with the intention of winning and not surrendering as soon as it goes sour. Almost no games turn into "20 minutes of pointless enemy farming and us dying as it's completely pointless we're so far behind" as is the primary argument for a surrender feature. Not to mention, as been said ad hominem, the purpose of a beta is to test -- and it gets nothing done when everyone is quitting 20 minutes .

Doesn't happen at even mediocre ranking. Anyway if you are better surrender is more time efficient for getting losing games out of the way, = higher rating faster. It would definitely take longer for me to smurf an account to a decent rating without surrender function existing.

"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."