This list is fairly low traffic, and by nature it is non-technical. I'd like
to move it to https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/ to see if that can help
increase engagement. Is anyone opposed? We can mark this list as "frozen"
and move back if the experiment doesn't work out.
--
Matthew Miller
<mattdm(a)fedoraproject.org>
Fedora Project Leader

Dear all,
You are kindly invited to the meeting:
Council (Open Floor) on 2019-01-30 from 10:00:00 to 11:00:00 US/Eastern
At fedora-meeting-1(a)irc.freenode.net
The meeting will be about:
The Fedora Council will hold our regular Open Floor meeting at 10:00am
US/Eastern in #fedora-meeting-1 on irc.freenode.net. All are welcome!
To convert to your local time, run:
date -d 'TZ="US/Eastern" 10am tomorrow'
Open Floor meetings happen every four weeks. They do not have a
preset agenda. Instead, we spend the first few minutes of the
meeting deciding what topics will be discussed. If attendees —
Council members and otherwise — have several topics of general
interest, the primary meeting chair (usually the FPL or FCAIC)
will put them in order, and after a certain amount of time
discussing the first, ask if it's time to move on.
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Council_Meetings#Open_Floor_Meetings
Source: https://apps.fedoraproject.org/calendar/meeting/9410/

Hello,
Following a discussion [1] on the devel list, Till encouraged me to
propose a "packager experience" (or possibly "packager quality of
life") Community objective to the Council.
Basically, the goal of this objective would be to organize people to
work on various annoyances (be they minor or major) that currently
exist in the packager workflow. This probably involves creating a new
SIG or WG focused on improving the packager workflow-- identifying
problems and figuring out solutions (likely by contributing to various
tools and other projects in the packaging pipeline like fedpkg, or
Koji/Bodhi/Pagure/etc.).
My understanding of the Objective proposal process here is that I
create a draft page on the wiki and then start a discussion on this
list, so I thought I would do just that. Here is a very early draft I
wrote on the wiki:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Objectives/Packager_Experience
I only recorded three issues on the wiki draft-- all to do with the
retiring of pkgdb2, as that's what started this discussion. But I'm
sure I can come up with more, and I'm equally sure the community would
as well once we started a discussion. (I think, for example, that
improving the package review process might also be something in the
scope of this objective).
These problems might seem a bit small, or minor, to be worthy of a
Community Objective to fix them, but I think that's part of the
problem-- something like having to manually request Pagure API keys to
create new packages (this was what the linked discussion on the devel
list was about) might only be a minor annoyance, but that means it
doesn't get attention, while bigger, more urgent things do. If we
could collect a list of such minor annoyances and set up a plan to fix
them-- and also set up a group or process responsible for fixing
similar issues as they crop up in the future-- I think it would do a
lot to improve the overall experience of packaging software in Fedora.
Thanks for your consideration!
Sincerely,
Ben Rosser
[1] https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.o...

Dear all,
You are kindly invited to the meeting:
Council (Tickets and Ongoing) on 2019-01-23 from 10:00:00 to 11:00:00 US/Eastern
At fedora-meeting-1(a)irc.freenode.net
The meeting will be about:
The Fedora Council will hold our regular Tickets and Ongoing meeting
at 10:00am US/Eastern in #fedora-meeting-1 on irc.freenode.net. All are
welcome!
To convert to your local time, run:
date -d 'TZ="US/Eastern" 10am tomorrow'
Tickets and Ongoing meetings happen every four weeks. We don't want
to be entirely ticket-driven (since that's a reactive process), but
this helps keep important issues from slipping through the cracks.
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Council_Meetings#Tickets_and_Ongoing_Meetings
The primary chair for this meeting (usually the FPgM, FPL, or FCAIC) should
reply to this message with this week's agenda.
Source: https://apps.fedoraproject.org/calendar/meeting/9414/

Dear Council,
For those who don't know me, I work for Red Hat as a designer in the
Desktop Team. I've recently been doing some user experience and product
research, which has Fedora Workstation as one of its main areas of interest.
I'm reaching out to let you know that this work is happening, and to give
you an opportunity to have input. The work is still in its initial stages
(stage 1 of 4, to be exact) and I plan on sharing my research results with
the Fedora community once it is complete.
I look forward to hearing your feedback. Below you'll find a brief summary
of the research goals and methodology.
Best wishes,
Allan Day
--
*Fedora desktop research introduction*
*Research goals*
The research has three high-level goals:
- Inform desktop strategy: identify what is important to our target
users: their requirements, desires, objectives
- Gain a better understanding of our target audience: identify how
different user groups differ in their requirements and attitudes
- Lay the foundations for future research, by identifying future
research topics and creating a sampling framework
*Research methodology*
The research is interview-based. Interviews are in-depth, semi-structured,
and being held face-to-face. This is designed to allow new insights to be
discovered. The research is intended to be exploratory and focused on user
perspectives.
Interviews are being conducted with four groups:
1. Front-end web developers
2. Computer science undergraduate students
3. Operating system developers
4. Non-technical office workers
These groups are designed to cover a range of user characteristics. For
practical reasons, they only cover of subset of Fedora Workstation users.
*Research outputs*
Research findings will be written up and made available to the Fedora
community, probably in the form of blog posts but also more permanent
records (likely including the Fedora wiki). It is also hoped that they will
be presented at Flock.

https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/fedora-council-december-2018-hack...
In December, the Fedora Council met in Minneapolis, Minnesota for
several days of meetings. With the holidays now behind us, here's our
summary of what happened.
Strategic direction update
==========================
The most important part of the meeting was our update to Fedora's
strategic direction. You may have read the [Community Blog post about
this] already. While the wording — or at least the fact that we've
written it down — may be new, the ideas aren't. This document
represents the next step from the efforts that began with [Fedora.next]
back in 2013. Our goal is to allow members of the Fedora community to
build solutions that focus on the specific requirements of their target
users. This means, among other things, a more decomposed and
self-service build process.
The earlier post generated a lot of discussion and feedback. I'm
planning a series of Community Blog articles summarizing and responding
to that feedback — stay tuned!
Objective updates
=================
We also heard from three of the four current Objective leads. (Our
Internet of Things lead, Peter Robinson couldn't make the meeting,
unfortunately.) The CI/CI Objective is wrapping up and Dominik Perpeet
will be publishing a summary soon. The Modularity Objective is also
ending its current phase. [Modules for Everyone] was a key feature of
Fedora 29, and the Modularity team is continuing to improve the
technical implementation as well as make it more approachable for
community contributors. Both Objective leads will be proposing next
steps to the Council in early 2019.\
The Lifecycle Objective is just getting started. It has two goals: make
the release process scale and allow & encourage more community ownership
for deliverables. This ties in tightly to the strategy update — this
work is required to get us to where we want to be. Paul Frields is
working to gauge what's needed to implement this now, including the
proposed long cycle for Fedora 31 ([discussed on the devel mailing
list]). The Council in general would prefer to keep to the regular
six-month cycle.
Mindshare
=========
The Mindshare team previously adopted a policy of spending up to $100
for release parties with minimal approval required. This has been
successful, and the Council would like Mindshare to build on this with
further investment. We agreed that Mindshare should adopt a policy of
allowing up to $150 for activities that promote the use of Fedora
solutions in communities. This could include release parties, web
hosting, or other relevant activities. We want to encourage
experimentation, so we're not requiring the activities to be successful
to get reimbursed — they just need to be successful to get future
funding. The Council's goal is to have 100 of these proposals funded in
FY2020 (which starts in March of 2019). In order to encourage funding
these proposals throughout the year, unallocated funds from this budget
will be pulled into the Council budget at the end of each fiscal
quarter. Look for guidance from Mindshare on how to make these requests
soon.
Communication
=============
We've started experimenting with using [Discourse] as the asynchronous
communication tool for some teams. For synchronous communication, some
teams are using Telegram in addition to — or instead of — IRC. Each
platform has strengths and weaknesses. After discussion, the Council
came to the conclusion that communication fragmentation is unavoidable.
In a project as big as Fedora, people work in different ways and have
different preferences. We leave it to each team to decide what
communication methods work best for their team.
To help connect everyone together despite this, we have requested a
central project management service from the Infrastructure team —
probably [Taiga], although we're asking the team to also look at GitLab
for this purpose. We'll have a dedicated instance, likely hosted, and we
ask each team to have a minimum presence on that tool, whether they use
it otherwise or not. The presence should, at a minimum, indicate the
team's communication methods for synchronous and asynchronous
communication and where project information may be found if not in the
shared tool. That way, there will be an automatically-curated list of
active teams. (See <https://tree.taiga.io/discover> for an idea of what
this would look like — imagine each project there is a Fedora team.)
Infrastructure
==============
The success of our strategy depends on improvements to our
infrastructure. The Infrastructure team has limited resources, so we
need to ensure they're able to work on areas that add the most value to
the project. This means a shift away from running all layers of the
stack and focusing more on application management. The goal is to have
the Infra team administering applications, not low-level infrastructure.
(Even if that makes the team name confusing — sorry!) We want agility
in our applications and deployment. We want drive-by contributors to be
able to realistically contribute to the infrastructure team.
We also talked about GitHub. Ideally, we want everything to be on open
source services (e.g. Taiga, Pagure, or GitLab). But, as a pragmatic
matter, we recognize that GitHub has a huge network effect — there are
millions of users and developers there, and millions of open source and
free software projects hosted there, including software that's
fundamental to the Fedora operating system. We'd like better integration
and syncing with tools like Pagure to give access to that network effect
on all-free software, but we also know that there isn't a lot of
developer time to make and maintain those kind of features. Therefore,
we're willing to accept people in Fedora hosting their subprojects on
GitHub. We've got to focus on what we do that's unique (and only do
things which are unique when we have a special need to meet our project
goals). Git hosting is not one of those things.
General Council business
========================
The Council wants to make it clear that community input is welcome on
Council matters. Members of the Fedora community may provide non-binding
votes on Council tickets and participate in meetings. Speaking of
meetings, we're replacing the Subproject report meetings with regular
updates from the FESCo, Mindshare, and Diversity & Inclusion
representatives. This should help provide better visibility into those
organizations for the Council and the community at large.
We will also move all Council policies out of the wiki to
[docs.fedoraproject.org]. The Council will use the wiki only as a
scratch space for works in progress. Durable documentation will live on
the docs site. We encourage other teams to consider doing the same.
Meeting Minutes
===============
We didn't actually conduct the meeting in IRC, but we took minutes in
the same way. Here's our detailed record.
#startmeeting Fedora Council Hackfest 2018
#chair mattdm bcotton tyll contyk dperpeet langdon dgilmore bex
jonatoni sumantro stickster
#topic Mission overview + Strategic framework
#info Community Members are encouraged to contribute to the decision
process with non-binding votes
#link
<https://qz.com/work/1468580/the-four-layers-of-communication-in-a-functio...>
#info mattdm shows his favorite graph
#topic Fedora Project Strategy: "How do we make our mission real?"
#action Dominik will speak more loudly
#agreed Council will replace subproject report meetings with updates
from FESCo, Mindshare, and D&I rep
#agreed Council adopts the strategy proposal (+9, 0, -0)
#action mattdm to post the strategy proposal to commblog
#agreed Council will make a final vote on the strategy proposal on 9
January 2019 (+8,0,0)
#topic Moving Council Policies to Docs
#agreed Council will move all Council policies and other durable
Council documents from the Wiki to docs.fedoraproject.org and remove old
wiki pages. (8,0,-0)
#info policies should be kept in a repo separate from other documents
for ease of watching
#topic Objective Update: CI/CD
#action
dperpeet to write up final objective report for publication on Community
Blog by January 1
#action dperpeet to propose a new Objective for future CI/CD work
#info the new Objective should include working with other stakeholder
groups including IoT and SilverBlue
#topic Objective Update: Modularity
#action langdon to propose a new Objective for future Modularity work
#topic Objective Update: Lifecycle
#topic $150 release parties
#agreed Mindshare should move the easy process to $150 and encourage
more non-RP uses (+9,0,-0)
#agreed: Mindshare should start providing $150 base support for
solutions to help them grow (+9,0,-0)
#agreed: Mindshare should start attracting larger requests and develop
a process. These requests are judged using Council provided Fedora
Project strategy as guidance. (+9,0,-0)
#agreed: Mindshare should target at least 100 $150 events in FY20
(+9,0,-0)
#agreed Unspent budget allocated to the $150 event program will be
pulled into the Council budget at the end of each fiscal quarter
beginning with FY20 (+10,0,-0)
#topic Localization
#action bex to begin a conversation in the translation community about
a platform that meets the needs of the translation workflow
#topic Logo
#info Adam Miller will not get a tattoo with our current logo because
people will ask him why he has a Facebook tattoo
#info The design team is working on getting a proposal to the community
to vote soon so we can select the new one by January 31 in final form
for production
#topic Infrastructure
#agreed The Council supports greater efficiency in the infrastructure
to allow more to be done, even when this means that we move away from
self-hosted or self-maintained infrastructure. (+9,0,-0)
#agreed The Fedora Project wants to advance free and open source
software and as a pragmatic matter we recognize that some infrastructure
needs may be best served by using closed source or non-free tools today.
Therefore the Council is willing to accept closed source or non-free
tools in Fedora's infrastructure where free and open source tools are
not viable or not available. (+9,0,-0)
#action contyk, FESCo to work with Infra to examine current
applications and determine: 1. which applications can be moved out of
the datacenter immediately or in the short term, 2. Which applications
have industry-standard open source or proprietary alternatives that we
could move to.
#topic Communication
#agreed Fedora will offer a central place for teams and SIGs to be
discoverable, do project management, etc. Having a landing page will be
a requirement for all teams and SIGs in Fedora. (+10, 0, -0)
#agreed The Council will ask the Infrastructure team to evaluate
providing the central place as Taiga versus Gitlab based on requirements
provided by Council. (+10, 0, -0)
#action mattdm to write requirements doc for these two things above.
#agreed The Fedora Council embraces fragmentation in our communication
platforms — this is a reality we can't fight. The Central Place will
provide a way for anyone to find the communication tools used by any
group. (+10, 0, -0)
#topic [Ticket #198]
#agreed Document proposed in ticket #198 is accepted for delivery to
Legal for drafting updates to the Trademark policy. (+10, 0, -0)
#topic Code of Conduct enforcement
#agreed The FCAIC is empowered to take action on Code of Conduct
reports with an additional +1 from another core Council member or the
Diversity & Inclusion Advisor and report back to Council. (+10, 0, -0)
#topic Ask Fedora and getting help
#agreed Council authorizes the hosting of a separate Discourse instance
to replace ask.fedoraproject.org to be funded out of Fedora community
budget. (+9, 0, 0)
#endmeeting
[Community Blog post about this]: https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/?p=6802
[Fedora.next]: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora.next
[Modules for Everyone]: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/ModulesForEveryone
[discussed on the devel mailing list]: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.o...
[Discourse]: https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/
[Taiga]: https://taiga.io/
[docs.fedoraproject.org]: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/
[Ticket #198]: https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/198
--
Matthew Miller
<mattdm(a)fedoraproject.org>
Fedora Project Leader

Dear all,
You are kindly invited to the meeting:
Council (FESCo/Mindshare/D&I Report) on 2019-01-09 from 10:00:00 to 11:00:00 US/Eastern
At fedora-meeting-1(a)irc.freenode.net
The meeting will be about:
The Fedora Council will hold our regular FESCo/Mindshare/Diversity & Inclusion Report meeting this week
at 10:00am US/Eastern. All are welcome!
To convert to your local time, run:
date -d 'TZ="US/Eastern" 10am tomorrow'
This meeting will be conducted via video chat at https://meet.jit.si/FedoraCouncil with notes taken in #fedora-meeting-1 on IRC.
This week's primary meeting chair (usually the FPgM, FPL, or FCAIC) will
reply to this message with specific information.
Source: https://apps.fedoraproject.org/calendar/meeting/5237/

Dear all,
You are kindly invited to the meeting:
Council (Open Floor) on 2019-01-02 from 10:00:00 to 11:00:00 US/Eastern
At fedora-meeting-1(a)irc.freenode.net
The meeting will be about:
The Fedora Council will hold our regular Open Floor meeting at 10:00am
US/Eastern in #fedora-meeting-1 on irc.freenode.net. All are welcome!
To convert to your local time, run:
date -d 'TZ="US/Eastern" 10am tomorrow'
Open Floor meetings happen every four weeks. They do not have a
preset agenda. Instead, we spend the first few minutes of the
meeting deciding what topics will be discussed. If attendees —
Council members and otherwise — have several topics of general
interest, the primary meeting chair (usually the FPL or FCAIC)
will put them in order, and after a certain amount of time
discussing the first, ask if it's time to move on.
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Council_Meetings#Open_Floor_Meetings
Source: https://apps.fedoraproject.org/calendar/meeting/9410/