Friday, March 25, 2011

How Much is Too Much?

Regular contributor Right Wingnut recently made a post “calling out” another regular contributor Martha for being a Trig Truther. This topic is one that I have never considered, so I was amazed to see the list of comments grow and grow until (at the time of my writing this) there were 87 comments. Most posts have maybe 20 or so comments. I am still relatively uninformed regarding the “Trig Truther” issue.

My question is how much delving into personal and private matters is too much as we seek to nominate the best, most qualified, most competent nominee to represent the Republican Party in the 2012 nomination. Does the Trig Truther issue matter? Should a parent/presidential hopeful be judged in part on how their kids turned out?

Every potential presidential candidate has a personal issue or two that their opponents like to dwell on.

Mitt Romney (my guy) has been criticized for taking a family trip with the dog in a kennel tied to the top of the car.

Sarah Palin has been criticized for having a daughter who is an unwed mother and for exercising questionable judgment regarding her traveling in an airplane when she was in her last month of pregnancy.

Mike Huckabee has been criticized because his son was involved in an animal cruelty case.

Newt Gingrich has been criticized for having at least two affairs.

There are probably others, but those are the ones that come to mind.

My personal opinion is that some of these personal issues matter, and some don't. Romney's dog incident doesn't really bother me. Before the days of hyper-protectiveness, I used to love riding in the back of my dad's pick-up truck as we carried water in two big barrels to feed our 3 horses and 1 cow. I loved standing up, holding on to the barrels and feeling the wind through my hair. I have seen enough dogs riding in cars with their heads out of the window to believe dogs like that feeling too. Besides, I'm sure he made necessary safety arrangements for the dog.

Sarah Palin's children have received way too much media attention. Palin's daughter who had a baby out of wedlock is not really an issue for me as there are a lot of good parents who have children who don't do everything their parents taught them. Whether or not Trig is the biological son of Palin is irrelevant to me also. I am the mother of two young children. My oldest daughter is 3 and a half, and she came to our family through adoption. My youngest (and surprise) daughter is almost 2. In my heart and mind there is no difference between the two. This is just simply a non-issue. What is potentially an issue in my mind is if Palin did in fact fly from Texas to Washington being 8 months pregnant, showing signs of premature labor with a special needs baby, that shows something of a lack of judgment.

Mike Huckabee is probably my least favorite of the potential GOP candidates, and I would love nothing more than to see his potential campaign crash and burn, but is his son's animal cruelty case Huckabee's fault or responsibility? I have enough other reasons to dislike Huckabee that I am willing to not pile on with this issue.

Newt Gingrich and his affairs are, without question, fair game in this campaign. It speaks volumes about his loyalty and judgment. No matter what other strengths he brings to the ticket, his history of behavior when in a position of power completely destroys his candidacy for me.

So which personal issues are valid to attack, and which are not? When are children and family off limits, and when are they valid targets?

I hope that the Republicans can get together and unite strongly behind a candidate to defeat Obama, because ultimately, that's the most important thing. All of this sniping and undercutting of people that we need on our side is counter-productive.

It's not just that she didn't share something and people dug and dug and dug to find some dirt - no. It's that she LIED about it in such a way as to make it her political platform. It's that she continues to tell and retell and change her story just to suit her political goals. It's that she puts herself out there as one thing and lives her life as another. That is a huge indicator that she is not electable to any important office. She blames everyone else for all of her woes, when most of them were caused by her own damned self.

Why is the post about the Trig Truthers gone now? I am the anon who posted the last few posts, offering solid food for thought - and I am not a liberal btw...and I am not a kool-aid drinker. Why did you take it down? Is it because I spoke the truth that so many of you don't want to hear?

No matter how clear the evidence is that Sarah did not give birth to Trig, you will NEVER convince her worshippers. They are blind, deaf and dumb when it comes to accepting the fact that their 'Esther' would ever deceive them in this cavalier manner. They can not handle the truth.

spend some time here. Even if you go in FULLY supporting Palin, you will come out with questions at the very least. The owner of this site was threatened by Palin supporters and left the blog up but never continued. there are others out there, but this one by far hit a nerve with the Palin camp because none others have been threatened in such a way. I know it's not what you want to hear but please, just keep and open mind and put it together for yourselves.http://palindeception.blogspot.com/

"I hope that the Republicans can get together and unite strongly behind a candidate to defeat Obama, because ultimately, that's the most important thing"...Noelle

-------------------------------------I'm glad you are saying 'a candidate' and not that the candidate should be Palin, specifically, Noelle.

It would have been quite easy for Sarah to prove she gave birth to Trig when these allegations first surfaced. Why she did not and why, to this day, she has not, is rather baffling since she has not hesitated to respond quickly to each and every other so-called slur. Her refusal to address this issue is puzzling, to say the least.

"Why is the post about the Trig Truthers gone now? I am the anon who posted the last few posts, offering solid food for thought - and I am not a liberal btw...and I am not a kool-aid drinker. Why did you take it down? Is it because I spoke the truth that so many of you don't want to hear?"

Right Wingnut, the author of the post, decided to remove it on his own, for reasons that you will need to hear from him.

The book PARADIGM SHIFT: The Palin Matrix covers the Babygate issue in detail, with references to all the relevant blogs. The book was written by a Democrat who supports the concept of nominating the best, most rational candidates on both sides. Among the Republican hopefuls, the author is a Romney supporter. Palin has taken political discourse in America down into the sewer, and her political power is based entirely on a very heinous lie.

Bosman, I do not demand that people listen to me. I suggest that people who think I am a lunatic idiot crazy person simply check out the story. That is ALL I ask. And obviously,you are all free to do or not to do that.http://palindeception.blogspot.com/

Her lies are of little concern to the faithful. It matters diddly squat that she lied about giving birth to Trig. They have invested so much time and effort into supporting Sarah that it would be unthinkable for them to admit that they have been duped.

This Trig Truther stuff seems crazy to me. I can't understand why we are wasting so much energy about it. Aren't we talking about a sweet little boy with Down's syndrome who is being provided for by his mother and father, Todd and Sarah Palin? I think he's her son; if he isn't, he's still her son because she is providing for him. I, personally, want her to spend more time raising her children before she runs for President. Still, there are plenty of political issues to talk about regarding Sarah Palin without getting into this stuff about Trig's birth. Find some other way to discuss your concerns about SP's character without dragging poor little Trig into the mess. Give it a rest! It's almost like a disease out there with some, who won't even identify who they are. I think this Trig Truther stuff is vile, and I condemn it at every level.

So it doesn't bother you at all, AZ, that the woman you support for POTUS and leader of the free world found it necessary to lie about giving birth to a special needs baby? You're OK with that.

BTW, the thinking folks who do not fall for Sarah's tall tale are also the people who want the best for Trig. Having a 'mother' who would blatantly lie about his birth is certainly not in his best interest. You may condemn those who are trying to expose the truth and call them vile but you are aiming your condemnation at the wrong target.

I think this Trig Truther stuff is vile, and I condemn it at every level.

OK, but your condemnation won't erase the memory of the Wasillans who got stiffed in the carpooling ring. Not long after Piper's birth, she kept ducking out of serving her turn ("servant's heart" notwithstanding) with the complaint that after her tubal ligation and cauterization it would be just too painful. You may wish to suggest that she lied to them about having had the procedure done, but it was common knowledge in her neighbourhood at the time.

Bosman, I'm sorry if it came across as if I am demanding people believe me--which was not my intention at all. I actually didn't even really mean to start the whole thing. It just happened with a slip of the fingers. I've believed there was some serious questions for well over a year, but never mentioned them before because, of course, the subject is taboo.

I remain convinced that there are questions about the dated pictures and the facts. I don't really care what anyone else thinks, because I'm satisfied in my own ability to research and think straight. I merely challenged people to go out and do the same if they are interested.

I believe, as do many, that the actions the Palin's took concerning the birth of Trig reflect poor judgment. I've said that from day one--even before Palin was chosen. It does matter because it shows priorities, decision-making ability, and character.

I also believe that if we can delve into Newt's or Rudy's affairs, then Palin's possible deceptions concerning her family are fair game.

And lastly, I too believe that Sarah Palin has enough problems with experience, record, and qualifications; without having to talk about her pregnancy.

This isn't about Trig. He's a real cutie pie, as are all kids like him.

-Martha

PS. I appreciate your site, and would not want to do anything to hurt the atmosphere around here. I also appreciate your defense of me over the course of my time at ROS and Race. (I'm still trying to figure out who you were at race, but I have my suspicions that you are having some fun over there lately.)

This would be more convincing if (a) you identified yourself, and (b) spelled her (adoptive) son's name correctly.

Did you ever go with her to the All About You Spa in Anchorage? January 2008 or thereabouts? If you did, you know that they require you to fill out and sign a medical form declaring—among other things—whether you are pregnant.

hard to fake that you fools

I would not accuse you out of the blue of being emotional, but your derogatory form of address does suggest it.

"Did you ever go with her to the All About You Spa in Anchorage? January 2008 or thereabouts?"...Ted Powell----------------------------------Is this the same Spa where Shailey Tripp gave Sarah a massage and didn't see any indication of pregnancy? Did Sarah tell them she was with child or did she say she was not pregnant at that time?

I am actually not a Sarah Palin fan. I do not support her for the Presidency at this time. In fact, I have some significant political problems with Sarah. There is a level of decency that has been crossed in the "Trig Truthers conspiracy" that I cannot and will not tolerate without speaking out about it.

I know it is hard to imagine that anyone would be sick enough to fake a pregnancy for political gain.

In Palin's mind, it is likely on the same "level of decency" as using political pressure in attempts to get an ex-brother-in-law fired, or denied worker's compensation (both eventually failed).(Wikipedia article)

This is tangential to the specific current topic, but very much relates to the broader topic of what sort of government do we want. Today is the 100th anniversary of the Triangle Waist Company fire, in which (at least) 146 people died. Follow the links, beginning at http://foknewschannel.com/the-triangle-shirtwaist-victims/, to see where a number of state governors apparently want to take us.

I was referring to many of those new folks here yesterday and today. Many WHO APPEAR to be only concerned about ONE ISSUE as far as Palin is concerned.

The ones who frequent or are members and contributors to sites dedicated to this Trig truther issue.

You on the other hand I believe ellie as well, are just questioning the possibility that the truther theory is correct. You and ellie don't dwell on this issue and like myself have been critical of Palin on OTHER issues that we look for as qualities a President must have.

You have every right, as do other to express your opinions.

I won't accept any type of apology from you on this, because there is no reason for an apology! You have every right to your beliefs and every right to express them. Also, I am happy that you are part of Right Speak and wouldn't have it any other way.

Palin's opponents use the trig truther issue because they can't go after her on policy. They know she lines up with a majority of American people on the issues. They also know that she can fill arenas like nobody else (Obama used to be able to do it, but not any more). Of course there are other attacks, like "quitter" and "stupid," "extreme," "racist" and "polarizing." None of them have anything to do with the issues or her record in office. That's how the left operates. They will do it to Mitt should he emerge as a threat to Obama. I expect this behavior from the left, but not from folks who are supposedly on our side.

Watch this video of her taken in India. She cannot tell the interviewer one thing about India. There is nothing there but platitudes and sound bytes.No one can seriously believe that she could lead America.

Hi everyone! Hope your having a great day! Just wanted to send you over to a newish site, that is presently discussing the ‘wild ride’. They have a no ban policy, so your comments won’t be removed or you banned. They will remove posts if you try to discuss Palin’s children. but wild ride, and free speech? Fair game! Rightspeak.net

Go forth and tell them the TRUTH!

And Malia? I’m Gop and LOVE your blog! I just wish we had thinking women on OUR side, like you!

Ellie has linked to this blog before. That's where Ted Powell comes from, and probably most of the others

1. What PROOF do you have that ellie and sparky are one in the same. Only an IP address that matches would prove that. I DON'T SEE THE PROFF.Without proof, you are only spreading accusations and that's not nice or right.

2. Just because you post links to a site, doesn't make you a member of that site. Heaven forbid, I've posted links to C4P. I am anything but a member/supporter of that site.

3. Those photo shots only prove 1 thing. You've got a lot of time on your hands to waste.

Bos, thanks from me too! We all have our opinions, and we should be free to express them. We have called Palin out on many, many issues. Martha and I just happen to believe that this aspect of her 'story' is just that. A story.

Palin as the conservative candidate has all manner of problems facing her prior to the Primaries.

Supposedly she's had a tubal ligation, according to those who really KNOW her - and yet she claims to have born a son. Let's say she did. If so it was under extremely questionable conditions, not withstanding two 12 hour back to back plane rides - while in labor? POOR JUDGMENT.

She claimed to be cleared of all charges in her B-I-L's state trooper firing case, and yet the investigator, Branchflower, was on the news that night stating that YES, she had been found violating ethics charges. Meaning, she lied - and there is video to prove it! What was she thinking?

She claims to be an energy "Expert," and yet her AGIA oil pipeline was never built, the ground never even have been broken. The project has cost the residents of Alaska many tens of millions to "explore the possibility" through a CANADIAN Oil Company! And, when she was appointed to head the Oil & Gas Commission, she quit that post less than a year later. So what exactly is the vast energy experience she spoke of?

Before she was against The Bridge to Nowhere (to service the Ketchikan airport) she was For it - AND accepted the federal funds and KEPT THEM. She used the funds elsewhere. There is a road that goes to the bridge that never got built. A beautiful, long, paved road - that is virtually unused.

Palin seems to enjoy being a political celebrity; she has a PAC, yet is not a candidate - and hasn't been a political candidate since 2008, yet has continuously, furiously had funds raised for SarahPAC.

Her previous "legal defense fund" while governor known as The Alaska Fund Trust also came under fire. An investigator, Petemunos (sp?), for the Alaska Personnel Board said the AFT legal defense fund set up for Sarah Palin when she was governor was illegal. How can she make so many wrong-headed moves?

And yet, despite her ability to raise considerable funds, SarahPAC supported few candidates and only in relatively small amounts.

Finally, she responds to each and every slight and /or criticism, no matter how trivial. This famously thin-skinned response is unbecoming to a conservative candidate. And her spokespeople are, to be gracious, fairly rough around the edges; the more apt description would be brazenly heathenish; their words and actions will surely come back to haunt her in the event she runs.

No, Palin is hardly a viable candidate, for so many more reasons than the birther scandal.

Bosman, this is getting ridiculous now!!! I frequent this site to discuss politics with like-minded people not to discuss conspiracy theories with liberals who hate Sarah Palin and twist every fact for their own little practice in fiction.

No offense but Rightspeak is not a big enough site for the Trig Birther thread to get noticed unless someone referred these people here. It is pretty obvious that it was either Martha or Ellie who did just that.

You guys can continue to believe that Ellie and Martha are just good, concerned Romney supporters but the facts are starting to pile up otherwise...

I might have included a quote from the Pipe Dreams article, but it turns out that the blog software disallows the 'blockquote' tag, so I decided not to bother. It would have been the second-last paragraph of the article, which was a quote from Mike and Tim Bradner's Alaska Legislative Digest, a publication said to have long been supportive of Palin.

I paraphrased, without directly quoting, a disgruntled ex-fellow-carpooler who reported on Palin's escalating excuses for skipping her turn driving the carpool. I have no idea whether the person in question was a "liberal" or a "liberal source."

I wonder if Palin supporters would get the same benefit of the doubt and praise from most of the Rombots (like Martha & Ellie do) if the table were turned and Romney was the subject of insane theories. Somehow I doubt it.

Right Wingnut:Jersey, Just ignore Ted. He's from the Malia Littman[sic] site I reference last night. He's not worth the effort.

jerseyrepublicanSo Ted, this is where your life and Mr. McGinness's life has turned out...quoting disgruntled ex-carpoolers?

j.r., I take it that you disagree with RW's assessment? (It's "McGinniss" btw.)

Unless by "quote" you mean "provide a link to" I'm still in doubt as to what "liberal sources" I'm accused of having quoted. However, if you decide to take RW's advice to heart after all, I can live with not knowing.

"Bosman, this is getting ridiculous now!!! I frequent this site to discuss politics with like-minded people not to discuss conspiracy theories with liberals who hate Sarah Palin and twist every fact for their own little practice in fiction.

No offense but Rightspeak is not a big enough site for the Trig Birther thread to get noticed unless someone referred these people here. It is pretty obvious that it was either Martha or Ellie who did just that.

You guys can continue to believe that Ellie and Martha are just good, concerned Romney supporters but the facts are starting to pile up otherwise..."

JR,I stand by my statement to Martha. I also agree with Socrates statements.

As to this site being big enough, let's say it's getting there. I have software and other resources set up that puts Right Speak at the top of google searches when posts come out on particular subjects. For example, if the subject is Sarah Palin, Once google has the information, and someone would search. "Sarah Palin", the post will show up near the top of the google search under "latest" on some days in under "most relevant". The same would work with a "Trig Truther" search. I wouldn't imagine to much competition on that subject on google, so I'M POSITIVE that when the story came out, It hung around on the top of google for awhile. I just checked today as well. After ALL THIS TIME, it is on page 3 of a google "Trig Truther" search.

As to traffic at Right Speak, in the last 3 months, alone we're averaging 1000-1200 hits a day. At the end of March, I plan on sharing information on our growth.

Our problem is getting folks who read the posts to comment on them. Also, to pry away the folks from the chat box to comment on the posts as well.

I agree that it is POSSIBLE for someone to stumble across the post via Google, However, lets look at the facts in this instance.

1. First, I Googled "Ted Powell." Surprise! He posts on the obscure Malia Littman blog. That is how I found the comment from "Sparky."

2. One of our regulars has linked to that obscure blog before, calling it "well researched," and admitting to being an commenter.

3. Right Speak, to my knowledge, is frequented by two Trig Truthers.

4. The commenter admitted to being "GOP"

5. The commenter knew all of the rules of Right Speak. "No ban policy."

6. The commenter called Todd, "Toddy" in another comment. Where have I heard that before?

7. Overall, the commenter has a familiar style.

8. Ted Powell all but admitted to JR that he is from Malia Littman's site.

If you don't think "Sparky" is who I think it is, who is it?

March 24, 2011 at 10:20 am

sparky

Hi everyone! Hope your having a great day! Just wanted to send you over to a newish site, that is presently discussing the ‘wild ride’. They have a no ban policy, so your comments won’t be removed or you banned. They will remove posts if you try to discuss Palin’s children. but wild ride, and free speech? Fair game! Rightspeak.net

Go forth and tell them the TRUTH!

And Malia? I’m Gop and LOVE your blog! I just wish we had thinking women on OUR side, like you!

Ellie has linked to this blog before. That's where Ted Powell comes from, and probably most of the others

On another note, I would estimate that only 10% of our readers ever leave a comment, if that. Up until recently, you could watch the traffic at C4P though the dashboard. It would specify how many registered members and how many non-members were on the site at any given time. 90% of the traffic at any given time was usually from people that weren't registered. Perhaps that's the case here as well.

congratulations Bosman! Your blog is getting to be quite the place to voice ALL views, not just one or two. Our party should be made up several viewpoints, peoples and ideas. It should never be run by one, or one group of people. Many conservatives are pro choice, and many progressives are pro life.

I did the same search you did, and found this blog as number two on google. Instead of stalking, I wonder if he can research?