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So, if the game was on a direct line to the other bird, then that would be picked first, and the dog sent back for the longer bird. We do not want our dogs ignoring game here.

Err ... You are picking up behind the line with a dead bird or two lying in the open. Someone cripples a bird and brings it down with a dead bird(s) between you and it. I always aim to leave dead birds during the drive, and pick only runners and cripples. So I train a form of ladder drill with just that scenario in mind. Not uncommon.

It's only fair to say that now my lead dog has departed, of the two remaining one is reasonably sure to stop on the whistle by a dead bird and take a big "back" to a cripple, and one isn't!

Err ... You are picking up behind the line with a dead bird or two lying in the open. Someone cripples a bird and brings it down with a dead bird(s) between you and it. I always aim to leave dead birds during the drive, and pick only runners and cripples. So I train a form of ladder drill with just that scenario in mind. Not uncommon.

It's only fair to say that now my lead dog has departed, of the two remaining one is reasonably sure to stop on the whistle by a dead bird and take a big "back" to a cripple, and one isn't!

Eug

I was referring specifically to trials and tests, where a dog would not be expected to ignore a bird it came across on its path (and would probably be penalised for so doing 'passing over game'). We don't send our dogs directly over dead birds to pick runners. We try to put them on a clear line. Doesn't always work...

I was referring specifically to trials and tests, where a dog would not be expected to ignore a bird it came across on its path (and would probably be penalised for so doing 'passing over game'). We don't send our dogs directly over dead birds to pick runners. We try to put them on a clear line. Doesn't always work...

Good judges over here don't set up that kind of blind. They would never give up the initial line so easily. Poison bird blinds are typically 5-10 degreees off of the correct line, with factors in the field or water creating suction towards the poison bird and a "TRAP" on the other side of the correct line that will cause the dog to go out of sight of the handler and judges. The most difficult ones will have the poison bird equidistant or nearly so with the blind bird.

Your FT game has it's own set of difficulties. Some fail to grasp that. They need to try to line their dog over a sheep fence. They'd "get it" then......-Paul

at field trials over here we don't place poison birds directly on the path to a blind. We will however pluck duck feathers or dip a stinky duck in water and fling it around to Baptise the ground that is directly on the path to the blind.
I will say that a dog well trained on poison birds and understands the game can be handled off of a poison bird that is very close to the line.
I recall sitting in the field throwing a poison bird in towards the line to the blind. It fell within a few yards, way closer than you would want. Anyway, an accomplished field champion is running the blind and to my amazement as the dog approaches the poison bird, without breaking stride or even looking at the bird, she literally jumped over it and continued the blind. No lie.

at field trials over here we don't place poison birds directly on the path to a blind. We will however pluck duck feathers or dip a stinky duck in water and fling it around to Baptise the ground that is directly on the path to the blind.
I will say that a dog well trained on poison birds and understands the game can be handled off of a poison bird that is very close to the line.
I recall sitting in the field throwing a poison bird in towards the line to the blind. It fell within a few yards, way closer than you would want. Anyway, an accomplished field champion is running the blind and to my amazement as the dog approaches the poison bird, without breaking stride or even looking at the bird, she literally jumped over it and continued the blind. No lie.

34. Repeated evidence of poor nose is in itself sufficient justification for elimination from the stake. Because scenting conditions are affected by so many factors, Judges should exercise extreme caution in invoking this penalty

Perhaps she had a "poor nose"

john

Last edited by john fallon; 12-09-2012 at 04:33 PM.

"i guess the old saying 'those of us that think we know everything annoy those of you that does' " --bobbyb 9/13/06

at field trials over here we don't place poison birds directly on the path to a blind. We will however pluck duck feathers or dip a stinky duck in water and fling it around to Baptise the ground that is directly on the path to the blind.
I will say that a dog well trained on poison birds and understands the game can be handled off of a poison bird that is very close to the line.
I recall sitting in the field throwing a poison bird in towards the line to the blind. It fell within a few yards, way closer than you would want. Anyway, an accomplished field champion is running the blind and to my amazement as the dog approaches the poison bird, without breaking stride or even looking at the bird, she literally jumped over it and continued the blind. No lie.

Good judges over here don't set up that kind of blind. They would never give up the initial line so easily. Poison bird blinds are typically 5-10 degreees off of the correct line, with factors in the field or water creating suction towards the poison bird and a "TRAP" on the other side of the correct line that will cause the dog to go out of sight of the handler and judges. The most difficult ones will have the poison bird equidistant or nearly so with the blind bird.

Your FT game has it's own set of difficulties. Some fail to grasp that. They need to try to line their dog over a sheep fence. They'd "get it" then......-Paul

According to my calculations, 5 degrees from the line to the blind means the poison bird lands about 6 yards from the line to the blind if thrown at 50 yards, and it lands about 9 yards from the line if thrown at 100 yards.

34. Repeated evidence of poor nose is in itself sufficient justification for elimination from the stake. Because scenting conditions are affected by so many factors, Judges should exercise extreme caution in invoking this penalty