I remember, after Yag's retire Plushy said like I feel like I'm in fog. Zero visibility, but continue walking alone.
Yag and Plushy, I think that they were not only rival but also kind of traveling companion. They had the same goal. Though they never became friends.
Now I just hope their success in each life

I remember how terribly upset I was in 2000-2001 every time I watched Yagudin standing on the podium below Plushenko. I felt sick from such injustice! And my friends laughing spoke to me:"What you need to understand is that Plushenko is only a kind of a flea that sits on a dog. And the dog needs this flea, because without it his neck would become numb." And, indeed, Yagudin aiways said about his laziness. Therefore, naturally, after Yag had retired Plushenko couldn`t help but feel the way he himself described. A dog can somehow do without a flea, but a flea without a dog... I suspect that a flea without a dog needs to go to search another dog!

If yagudin was not feeling threatened by Plush he wouldnt have left for Tarasova and wouldnt have changed to skater he became afterwards.They both were fighting eachother and each season trying more and more, and first years Plushenko was a youngster trying to catch up cause he came out to seniors two years after yagudin.
When he finally started to win, what was injustice?plushenko in 2000-2001 had a fabulous season, yag was not having a great season, thats all. And that was not the only season Plush won against him. In 2000 he was doing great everythign except his meltdown at worlds. It didnt matter for me who won what and how many times, the best of them two everytime won, thats a sport and it is healthy.
Yag has said that his bad 2001 season and the dominance of plush was what pushed him to work harder and win the Olympic Medal. And Plush after 2002 said " I now look back and there is none" as arrogant as it sounds it was sincere and true. He had not someone to challenge him to try something more. That was not his fault. Joubert considered his next rival, was trying better when Plushenko was in games, great example Worlds 2005.
I agree with kudryavka, they were athletes that had the same goal, speaking about a rival like a flea and dog is a but ridiculous, just my opinion. Every athlete wants to be challenged.

I will have to agree with Mathman here, Joe. Yagudin had other exquisite wins in career beside the SLC 2002 Olympics.
For me, his "Lawrence of Arabia" program which won his second world title means even more, because it was following a fresh injury he was struggling with all week long.
Just watch this program, which gives me chills even now after 10 years and tell me if you can find any bobbles:

I will have to eat my words! I had forgotten that wonderful 'Lawrence' and why I did, I do not know. I think I was concentrating on that Euros win over Abt with which I did not agree, and then when he was being compared with newboy, Evgeni, which at the time, seemed like he was done.
A thousand pardons to all Yags' fans. His skating was, for me ,much better than Evgeni's.

You seem to contradict yourself. If you consider wonderful performance as an absolutely clean performance then you shouldn't like Lambiel at all! cos personally I can hardly remember at least two clean performance in a row from Stephane.

Fashionista Let's not belabor my likes and dislikes. It's me and I was wrong to say that Yags had only one good skate in his competitive career. His 'Lawrence' was superb. The phrase, 'I'll eat my words", is admittedly that I made an error in judgement. How many posters can admit that?

I remember how terribly upset I was in 2000-2001 every time I watched Yagudin standing on the podium below Plushenko. I felt sick from such injustice! And my friends laughing spoke to me:"What you need to understand is that Plushenko is only a kind of a flea that sits on a dog. And the dog needs this flea, because without it his neck would become numb." And, indeed, Yagudin aiways said about his laziness. Therefore, naturally, after Yag had retired Plushenko couldn`t help but feel the way he himself described. A dog can somehow do without a flea, but a flea without a dog... I suspect that a flea without a dog needs to go to search another dog!

Why do you hate Plushy?!! Are you Yagudin himself?!

I can understand Yag's atittude for Plushy. Because he was a person concerned of the Y/P war. But you (Of course, me too) are just audience. The thing which we know are only the tip of the iceberg. We don't know what happened between them.
BTW, I can imagine why Yag hated against Plushy (and Mishin.) I guess that is not only for sports. Once, Yag have been saying that Mishin is like a father. However Mishin had not chosen him. This was a terrible shock for Yag, who don't have dad. It seems an one of the cause of their relationship.

If yagudin was not feeling threatened by Plush he wouldnt have left for Tarasova and wouldnt have changed to skater he became afterwards.They both were fighting eachother and each season trying more and more, and first years Plushenko was a youngster trying to catch up cause he came out to seniors two years after yagudin.
When he finally started to win, what was injustice?plushenko in 2000-2001 had a fabulous season, yag was not having a great season, thats all. And that was not the only season Plush won against him. In 2000 he was doing great everythign except his meltdown at worlds. It didnt matter for me who won what and how many times, the best of them two everytime won, thats a sport and it is healthy.
Yag has said that his bad 2001 season and the dominance of plush was what pushed him to work harder and win the Olympic Medal. And Plush after 2002 said " I now look back and there is none" as arrogant as it sounds it was sincere and true. He had not someone to challenge him to try something more. That was not his fault. Joubert considered his next rival, was trying better when Plushenko was in games, great example Worlds 2005.
I agree with kudryavka, they were athletes that had the same goal, speaking about a rival like a flea and dog is a but ridiculous, just my opinion. Every athlete wants to be challenged.

I totally agree with you, in particular part of "injustice."

"flea and dog," it was so funny.... This metaphor which Yag chosen was too emotional!! I know that Yag intended to talk about "the story of dog," but it seems to me just silly "cat-fight." :chorus:

Last edited by kudryavka; 03-18-2009 at 03:24 AM.
Reason: I forget to write it

I can understand Yag's atittude for Plushy. Because he was a person concerned of the Y/P war. But you (Of course, me too) are just audience. The thing which we know are only the tip of the iceberg. We don't know what happened between them.
BTW, I can imagine why Yag hated against Plushy (and Mishin.) I guess that is not only for sports. Once, Yag have been saying that Mishin is like a father. However Mishin had not chosen him. This was a terrible shock for Yag, who don't have dad. It seems an one of the cause of their relationship.

Well, isn't Yagudin too clement and kindly to hate Plushy, so his fans do it for him? Some people may believe they know the truth, by means of the newspaper or television or PM or anything they read or watch or listen.

And every hero need a devil on his contrary, just as Harry Potter has Voldemort as enemy. The behaviour to present the love to one and detest to another whenever and wherever is understandable, especially when one of them has topic recently.

btw1, I feel Plushy's attitude to Yags very cute. I hope they can keep the chill relationship instead of being friends

btw2, about the metaphor, I'd like Yags to be dog and Plushy to be cat

Some people may believe they know the truth, by means of the newspaper or television or PM or anything they read or watch or listen.

Their view of the world are very simple. "One day, a bad guy was killed by the hero. We're all happy. Because we know everything about the guy through rumors. According to them, the guy was such nasty!! It pissed me off, isn't it?!! The hero is absolutely right. - Happy ending." They know "everything" about their scapegoats through the other people's eye

Fashionista Let's not belabor my likes and dislikes. It's me and I was wrong to say that Yags had only one good skate in his competitive career. His 'Lawrence' was superb. The phrase, 'I'll eat my words", is admittedly that I made an error in judgement. How many posters can admit that?

It's not about your post about Yagudin who turned out to be nothing because he had only two good performances per his career, it's more about your double standards policy (if you remember at least one perfect skates of Abt or Klimkin then let me know).
And BTW you must have missed the whole 1998-1999 and 2001-2002 seasons -AFAIR the majority of Yagudin's skates were perfect. Unlike all the others'.

because i had my doubts if i remembered right when i answered about plushy in 2000(nothing to do with rival with Yag), from wikipedia, plush was winning the first place from beginning of season 1999-2000 , whole season 2000-2001 and 2001-2002 until grand prix final, so it was not an excuse of injury of his rivals or luck, 16 out of 17 competitions he came first, with one interval of Worlds 2000 where he didnt lose only to yag but he popped the whole program big time, so he also lost to himself.
Out of subject, can anyone tell me when quad was introduced in sp?was ti 1998 or 99, i cant find that info.

It's not about your post about Yagudin who turned out to be nothing because he had only two good performances per his career, it's more about your double standards policy (if you remember at least one perfect skates of Abt or Klimkin then let me know).

But then again, you can't blame someone for liking one skater better than another, whether anyone skates perfect performances or not. Joe likes Abt and Klimkin. That's OK by me. Some of my personal favorites are Karam and O'keefe, Watanabe and Kido, and Vakhtang Murvanidze.

They are not as good as Navka and Kostomarov or Brian Joubert, but I still like them.

It's not about your post about Yagudin who turned out to be nothing because he had only two good performances per his career, it's more about your double standards policy (if you remember at least one perfect skates of Abt or Klimkin then let me know).
And BTW you must have missed the whole 1998-1999 and 2001-2002 seasons -AFAIR the majority of Yagudin's skates were perfect. Unlike all the others'.

Ahhh, I see and understand. You have to realize I am a critic of performance tied in with technical prowess. Certain presentations appeal to me. You've probably never seen Klimkin's Swan Lake or Abt's Rach - Works of Art for me!
It's not just the medals that I admire. btw, do you like any skater who is not Russian?