‘Baby’ shoots Terrorists Point Blank without beating around the bush

I had loved its trailer and it was the most awaited movie of 2015 for me.

Akshay has been choosing some really interesting scripts of late. I loved his OMG. I enjoyed Special 26 and Holiday was one of the best films of 2014. I had liked Holiday for its unapologetic take on anti-terrorism but it is Just a trailer compared to the giant that Baby is.

Baby is THE most hard-hitting film on anti-terrorism made on so far. I had called Holiday the anti-Haider of 2014. Baby just pulverised Haider to ashes. It doesnt sympathise with terrorists. It is not made to tell the backstory of terrorists and how “haalat” made some become one and make a hero out of them. This film is made to show HOW TERRORISTS deserved to be treated. Yes that is what this film is about. If looked another way this is the perfect sequel to “A Wednesday” where a common man irritated by the terrorist attacks makes the Govt realize how lazy and incompetent they had become. Baby takes on from there and shows what Govt has/can do if it really decides to treat terrorists the way they should be.

The direction is brilliant right from the way it starts. Akshay Kumar’s introduction fight scene is something that he deserved for years. Brilliantly choreographed by Ciril raffeli, the famous action choreographer of the cult film “District 13” incorporating various martial forms from aikido to wing chun to jujitsu with sheer brilliance. Another great action sequence is the one with Taapsee Pannu (superb in a guest role) with Sushant Singh totally believable and realistic and it feels good that there are still choreographers working in Indian studios who can think of directing a scene like this.

To say that Akshay Kumar owned Baby is an understatement. This is his finest movie to date whether its the acting or his lean agile appearance and his impeccable body language. Its a landmark film in his career and its the wet dream of every Akshay fan. Anupam kher was great in his small role. His chemistry with Akshay is as good as Special 26.

Finally the man of the moment, Neeraj Pandey. excellent direction from start to end. I think the first half had some slack in the family scenes portion which were not required. Same thing was there in Madras Cafe also. Don’t understand this need of showing “family scenes” of the hero. The dialogues are hard hitting without any mincing of words and Neeraj makes his point across extremely well. The one-on-one conversation of Akshay with two terrorists in two different scenes are brilliant and devoid of jingoism. The whole scene of Taapsee taking Sushant to hotel with Akshay in the background is brilliantly directed and acted. The planning and execution of Bilal and Rasheed Naz is shown superbly. And just like Madras Cafe, here also you know what the end is going to be yet you are filled with excitement right till the end. Apart from the intro scene of Akshay, the intro of Rasheed Naz is equally brilliant. The whole atmosphere created in that scene induced goosebumps. His looks had similarity to Osama and in second half to Saddam Hussein.

Yes this is my second film of 2015 after I and it is already my favorite of film of 2015 .

there are so many brilliant nuances in direction. Remember the scene with rasheed naz where akshay is fighting him in hospital room and the way neeraj builds up the tension with a Fucking door knob!!

also loved the scene where tapsee leads sushant to his hotel room and akshay in background leaps across wall steps of a temple in kathmandu with the ease of jumping through small staircases. his body language was so authentic

Your review isn’t that different from mine on most things. You have problems with my review because it isn’t orgasmic enough or because I mentioned some flaws or because I praised Haider.

“Baby just pulverised Haider to ashes.”

LOL

Haider was from the POV of Haider, a Kashmiri Muslim and whereas Baby is from the POV of a counter terrorism unit. As I said in my comment before you have problems with Haider because it showed army in bad light and that it wasn’t balanced. Now that you have watched Baby tell me where is the scene of bad Indian cops arresting innocent people and torturing them or may be some innocent guy who they mistakenly tortured thinking he was a terrorist? As I said these are all silly arguments. Haider is fine from its POV and subject and Baby is fine from its POV and subject.

“If looked another way this is the perfect sequel to “A Wednesday” where a common man irritated by the terrorist attacks makes the Govt realize how lazy and incompetent they had become. Baby takes on from there and shows what Govt has/can do if it really decides to treat terrorists the way they should be.”

Good point. In A Wednesday the common man takes out the terrorists who are in India and here the govt is shown capturing/killing terrorists abroad.

“I think the first half had some slack in the family scenes portion which were not required. Same thing was there in Madras Cafe also. Don’t understand this need of showing “family scenes” of the hero.”

When I responded to Sanket saying the movie slacked in parts and that family scenes were not good you attacked me and here you say the same.

You have ignored the Bilal escape scene. It was badly executed and could have been completely edited out and instead just have Bilal as a Indian terrorist operating from Saudi.

“And just like Madras Cafe, here also you know what the end is going to be yet you are filled with excitement right till the end.”

Have you seen Argo? The final part of the movie after Bilal’s killing is completely inspired from Argo.

“Apart from the intro scene of Akshay, the intro of Rasheed Naz is equally brilliant. The whole atmosphere created in that scene induced goosebumps. His looks had similarity to Osama and in second half to Saddam Hussein.”

Rasheed Naz wasn’t that good in this. He was way better in Khuda Kay Liye where he played a Muslim preacher preaching fanaticism. His look was same in the early parts. I thought he looked Kurdish after he is shaved but yeah he can pass off for Saddam Hussein.

haider showed indian army as villians. baby showed terrorists as terrorists without any giving any scope to sympathise with them. I have explained this stance of mine a lot of times but let me quote a dialgue from shootout at lokhandwala to make my point clear (hopefully you have seen that movie)

it is unimaginative in the context of the film because the other sequences are brilliant.it could have been handled better .its not a terrible scene. we have seen worse in hindi films. there are many better ways to show escape.but you have compared the first fight scene of akshay to ETT. can you tell me what was the similarity in the choreography? ett action was OTT and filmy while baby one is completely real with actual fighitng techniques. ett fight was done by jawed el berni . this was done by akshay. why not talk about that too? you write a long para on the bilal escape scene but trying to dismiss the first fight by saying its like ETT which is not only factually wrong but also misleading.

“You have problems with my review because it isn’t orgasmic enough”

I have a problem with you calling baby a film having stereotypes and politiclaly correct. Danny never wore his religion on his sleeve. infact i never realised danny is a muslim at any point in the film. the dialgues which you are portraying as being “politiclaly correct” are on the contrary point blank firing on terrorists and exposes their hypocrisy.

when he talks about the guj riots and says i write “indian” in column it doesnt sound jingoistic at all. neeraj pandey wrote that scene in that way.by “indian” he meant a person who is non-muslim yet has more concern than a person wearing religon on his sleeves and yet inside having no concern for even his ppl. but at the same time he doesnt drop a sweat to call a spade a spade.the first scene was great too when he threatens jamal that his family will be brought at the same place were bomb is planted.all these scenes were written to establish the hypocrisy of terrorists.

i have not seen argo but you say the movie loses its plot after it becomes “ARGO”. the movie never loses its plot. infact the movie tightens and reaches its peak in climax.

“haider showed indian army as villians. baby showed terrorists as terrorists without any giving any scope to sympathise with them.”

We had the Indian army discussion a lot on the Haider review thread and I already addressed most of it here. Link

Bollywood movies usually have the conventional narrative where the Indian Army is all good and they never even mention any innocent people getting arrested/tortured as suspects or half widows. Haider mentioned stuff like the war widows or torture camps which no mainstream Bollywood movie ever mentioned. One can do the patriotic thing by burying his head in the sand and think that the Indian army or Indian cops are all good and those things never happen but that is not the reality.

Going after known terrorists and killing them is perfectly alright but one can’t ignore innocent people getting arrested/tortured too.

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“it is unimaginative in the context of the film because the other sequences are brilliant.it could have been handled better .its not a terrible scene. we have seen worse in hindi films.”

It is a terrible scene in the context of this movie because it is a filmy scene which you expect from some regular masala movie and not from a Neeraj Pandey movie.

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“but you have compared the first fight scene of akshay to ETT. can you tell me what was the similarity in the choreography? ett action was OTT and filmy while baby one is completely real with actual fighitng techniques. ett fight was done by jawed el berni . this was done by akshay. why not talk about that too? you write a long para on the bilal escape scene but trying to dismiss the first fight by saying its like ETT which is not only factually wrong but also misleading.”

I said “The movie’s first action scene is somewhat similar to the first action scene from Ek Tha Tiger.” not exactly similar.

But lets see the similarities. Both are hero’s entry scenes and both are set in some middle eastern country. Salman plays a RAW agent whereas Akshay plays a counter terrorism agent. Both scenes involve the hero chasing a guy through some small lanes. And in both cases the guy being chased is a rogue agent who has helped the enemy.

Now Akshay’s escape from that bathroom was filmy with a nice big exit just set up for him in the bathroom. There was nothing great about the shootout scene either which is just a regular movie scene.

Yes the actual one on one fight between Akshay and the rogue agent was very good. But I was talking about the scene not the actual one on one fight choreography.

I did not write a long para on the Bilal scene in my review. I wrote only two lines. “Kay Kay’s escape scene is completely ridiculous. For the ten thousandth time in a movie a vehicle is halfway over a bridge/cliff.”

When I said “The movie tries to be politically correct.” it wasn’t a knock on the movie. After saying that I elaborated on how it balanced the bad Muslim characters with the good Muslim characters. The reason why I mentioned the Akshay story was not because Akshay said something jingoistic. In fact I said in my review that “Even though there are the occasional crowd pleasing dialogues Neeraj avoids getting jingoistic.”

Here is what I said “Akshay responds with how he saved a Muslim family in Gujarat riots against Hindutva guys by killing 7 and getting shot and how he writes Indian as his religion.”

Read the lines again. The point was that the movie was not afraid to have Akshay say that he killed 7 Hindus in order to defend a Muslim family and to mention Gujarat riots and Hindutva.

These scenes/dialogues are enough to show that Neeraj is being even handed and no sane person can accuse him of being anti Muslim.

But if we apply the PK/Haider criticism logic then this is not enough. Muslim fanatics can argue that Neeraj has to show at least one operation by Baby where there is a Hindu militant outfit to balance all the Muslim militants shown in the movie. Muslim fanatics can argue that Neeraj should have shown some innocent Muslims arrested and tortured by bad cops just for balance. This is why I said those PK/Haider criticisms are silly.

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After the politically correct part I said “There are some stereotypical things however like the Muslim streets both in India and Pakistan always having the pictures of moon and star.” Note the word however meaning the above mentioned story and points weren’t stereotypical. When they initially showed Pakistan there was that streets lined up with moon & star and I thought they are showing it like that as it is supposed to be Pakistan just like Tere Bin Laden did. But then they showed the Indian Muslim locality near Taufeeq’s house the same way. So that’s definitely a stereotype.

Now let me tell you one thing which you may or may not have noticed. When Taufeeq is being interrogated the bearded Muslims outside are all angry. Now this would look stereotypical but Akshay says a dialogue at the end where he says if we can’t find Javed we will show this whole video on Breaking News and we will see how much these people outside love you. That’s a subtle way of telling that those Muslims outside are not going to support him once they know he is supporting terrorists.

I completely understood the hypocrisy of terrorists that Neeraj was trying to show. Yes Akshay’s threat to have that terrorist’s family brought to that same place was very good.

Even after giving the Lokhandwala quote , you have still missed my point. sigh! I know there may be bad ppl in army just like any other govt organization but the lokhandwala question is plain and simple yet enuff to show who is a bigot and who isnt : a person with a gun is standing at your doorstep – who would you want it to be – maya dolas (terrorist /criminal) or acp aftab khan( govt officer).

the fact that you compared “somewhat similar” scene and didnt even make a fleeting comment on the actual excellent choreography of the combat but then loudly remark about how “ridiculous” bilal escape is which i am yet not saying is terrible in the context of the film. it may look a bit outdated thats it. you are overreacting like mihir fadnavis who is just angry bcos aamir could not make a film like this in his life. there is nothing filmy about the exit also unless you have suddenly shifted your std of bw to documentaries. this is a bw movie. again a loud nitpicking bcos of vested interests.

You don’t get it at all. You are talking from the perspective of some one living in Maharashtra or AP and for that person the choice is pretty obvious. But for someone living in Kashmir or North Eastern states the choice isn’t that obvious where the army’s reputation is not like it is in the rest of India. In the 1980s if a cop showed up on the doorsteps of a Sikh family in Punjab do you think their choice would be that obvious when the cops had a reputation of arresting innocent people and torturing them.

You think its just a coincidence that two movies about agents both have a initial hero entry scene set in some middle eastern country involving a rogue agent.

Its not just about being outdated. Something hanging over the bridge/cliff has been done to death in movies. There was a scene in Raja, No Entry and Welcome. I remember watching a Hollywood movie too where there was similar scene with a truck. And when the vehicle is tottering on the edge Kay Kay is so confident of escaping. He is in the same vehicle and he could die too but he makes sure the vehicle falls down and then just walks off.

You wrote about the first action scene and praised the choreography by Cyril Raffaelli then why did you not mention anything about the choreography of the escape scene? You are now saying that “this is a bw movie.” If that’s the case then why criticize any BW movie’s action scenes unless its a “loud nitpicking bcos of vested interests.” If that scene is done by Cyril Raffaelli isn’t that terrible? That’s what I said that kind of scene is fine for a Subhash Ghai/Rohit Shetty movie not a Neeraj Pandey movie.

thanks for answering to the point.baby made the same choice. dont want a further debate on this

“you not mention anything about the choreography of the escape scene?” I didnt find it bad enough or good enough to mention it. its not an implausible scene. its not somethign out of the blue or superherioic. its a scene which has been done and dusted. thats all. while the choroegrpahy of combat is not seen generally in bw movies so that has to be mentioned. you did the reverse. didnt talk about the great combat scene but overeacted on a scene which is cloched(not stupid or ridiculous)

one more example of your desparate nitpicking is the scene after tapsee fight. you said akshay had a “regressive” expresson on his face when he sees tapsee has knocked out sushant. either you missed the scene before or you didnt understand it. akshay asks her to keep him busy by some conversation and is surprised to see what hapened later.The female was an agent herself .. And obviously she is capable and trained for any kind of combat .. So look in the akshay ‘s face is definitely not kind of ” how did you do or being a female “” .. It’s about things taking this surprising turn

Suprabh Bajpai 3 hrs · Edited *********SPOILERS GALORE*******Please don’t read further if you haven’t seen BABY yet (and also shame on you for that) The scene where Akshay interviews the potential militancy candidate convert responsible Student who informs him about Taufeeq’s whereabouts was one of the most remarkable scenes of the film for me. It is remarkable how Akshay approaches the situation making the guy a little comfortable and and yet being so particular about extracting information. That Scene and the one where he’s following Tapsee Pannu in Nepal – he is in the skin of the character like one couldn’t believe it. For people who have seen the Bourne Identity, would vouch for the commitment Matt Damon shows in becoming Bourne- I have no doubts when I say this Akshay was not Akshay in the film, he was Ajay Singh Rajput. I believe there was tremendous potential of acting in this role and he played it to perfection. What I liked most in the film was that there was NO- Absolutely NO Small talk. It was purely business. Neeraj Pandey had just one mission- to show how it is – whether you like it or not. That’s why he doesn’t hesitate in showing Akshay and Rana passing time waiting for the right moment to attack, or to show that the aim of the BABY (the team) is not to show heroics but to get the job done. Whether its shooting in the back of the head or to simply do as little as required. In one of the initial scenes of the movie Danny says- Take the call, and Akshay shoots his own officer, without an ounce of emotion- why? – because there’s no goddamn time for emotion. Its simply business. Take any other director in place of Neeraj and one may have seen a violin background score with grief on the face of shooter. What makes the movie’s action worth the money- is that its immensely believable. It shows that both the officers and the terrorists are trained people and quite comparable- so it is only the shock value (and whoever is more talented), and the timing that makes the difference- one little mistake and the other guy could put you down. The opening fight scene shows Akshay using his training skills rather than his 10 pack abs doing the fighting. This is how men with lives on the lines fight. The most superlative aspect of BABY is most definitely the attention to detail by Neeraj Pandey. The scar Akshay gets halfway through the movie stays on his face for the rest of the film- why..again because that’s how severe they were… The last 40 minutes are gripping as hell… there again attention to detail is amazing. I am so convinced that Neeraj has constructed the story based on actual events rather than just some fictional plot.(or at least he was inspired by the events). Kudos to Tapsee’s cameo as well..and full marks to Neeraj for actually showing that women are useful for their skills and not seducing the villain. Now to one of the major aspect of the story- which is – that Neeraj Pandey does give a damn about the country and does NOT give a damn about Hindus and Muslims.. India is threatened by Muslim terrorists and he does not hesitate to show that. India is plagued by Muslim traitors and he does not hesitate to show that and there are Muslims who would put their life on the line to save India- and he does not hesitate to show that–In a nutshell he doesn’t give a damn who the hell you are…if you are a terrorist or helping the terrorist- you deserve a bullet in the head…It was amazing how Danny a muslim officer so casually talks about muslim jihadis and young children being mislead..Why is he so casual- because he is an officer and Country comes first.Hell YEAH I can go and on… but I think, the picture is pretty clear.. This is the best espionage thriller to ever come out of Hindi cinema and amongst the best thrillers of bollywood of all times. Akshay Kumar- you have come a log way and your performance would be hard to beat…I can’t believe another actor pulling this role of with the same intensity…and Neeraj Pandey- you are a genius. P.S. The feeling of authenticity in this movie was so immense that the first thing that came to my mind when I saw the Nepal sequence in the movie was this.. Amazing Deja Vu

BABY — 9 on 10 ( I deducted 1 point because I think some of the most important lines in the movie were in english- especially the ones by Danny…and also because I think first half could have been a little shorter,)

@sputnik – this is for your Argo comparison. a view of someone who has seen it.

Suprabh Bajpai Some people are saying that the climax is inspired by ARGO and to those people I say– It is actually what ARGO’s climax should have been. Ben Affleck actually made it fictional and deviated from what actually happened.. BABY does not take that route- rather it just builds tension but doesn’t succumb to unnecessary cheap thrills. 3 hrs · Unlike · 1

Suprabh Bajpai In baby– the part of airport sequence “starting from the phone call to air traffic control” was barely a couple of minutes while in ARGO that thev airport sequence was the whole climax.. Argo had fictitious stuff like security guards running behind the passangers..in BABY nothing of that sort happens.

Suprabh Bajpai Calling baby’s climax copied from argo is simply belittling it. baby had a rather long climax starting from the hospital.. The airport sequence was just a part of it.. It’s ridiculous

your pk/haider angle is irrelavant and even ridiculous to some extent.

” Muslim fanatics can argue that Neeraj has to show at least one operation by Baby where there is a Hindu militant outfit to balance ”

why should a muslim own a muslim terrorist or see him as “muslim”. why is there the need to own such a heinous act just bcos it was done by a person belonging to your religion? just discard him and call him a “terrorist”. if baby shows some muslims as terrorists, a normal muslim should see it just as a “terrorist” like the muslim character danny in the film. he is the prime example of the progressive character that he is playing. why should there be a balance on terrorism based on religion?

pk bashed religious faith of one community while being almost sucking upto the other. India is a secular country

“why should a muslim own a muslim terrorist or see him as “muslim”. why is there the need to own such a heinous act just bcos it was done by a person belonging to your religion? just discard him and call him a “terrorist”. if baby shows some muslims as terrorists, a normal muslim should see it just as a “terrorist” like the muslim character danny in the film. he is the prime example of the progressive character that he is playing. why should there be a balance on terrorism based on religion?”

Now lets reverse the situation. Lets say someone makes a movie about Saffron terror on one or more of the following – Samjhauta Express bombings, Ajmer Dargah attack, Malegaon blasts, Mecca Masjid bombing and just has a couple of dialogues about attacks by Islamic militants. Do you seriously thing the right wing or Hindu fanatics will not have any issues with this movie? They will use similar arguments as in case of PK/Haider. They will say how come the filmmaker did not show all the other Islamic militant attacks or how he did not balance the movie.

This is why this balance thing is a silly argument.

“why should a muslim own a muslim terrorist or see him as “muslim”. why is there the need to own such a heinous act just bcos it was done by a person belonging to your religion? just discard him and call him a “terrorist”

Do you really think a Hindu fanatic will do this if the word Muslim is replaced by Hindu in the above sentence?

Some Muslim fanatics had a problem with Vishwaroop because it showed Muslim militants and this is what I said after watching “There was nothing offensive in the movie so don’t understand what the controversy was about.”

There are Muslim militants in the world today and if a movie shows Muslim militants there is nothing wrong in it. Why does one even need Danny to be a Muslim in the movie?

i am agaisnt fanatics. i hope you are also not a fanatic. so you should have absolutely no problems with the depiction of terrorists in baby. let fanatics say whatever they want. why are you bringing thier perspective? let danny be a muslim. i didn even realise danny is a muslim in the first place! i read it later in someone’s comment. can you believe it!

you are equating the terrorism shown in baby with the balancing argument i made for pk.you are equating terrorism with religion. you are associating all muslims with the terrorist activies of a select few. you are in a way defending terrorism. do you realise this?

Where did I say I have a problem with the depiction of terrorists in Baby.

“you are equating the terrorism shown in baby with the balancing argument i made for pk.you are equating terrorism with religion. you are associating all muslims with the terrorist activies of a select few. you are in a way defending terrorism. do you realise this?”

Balancing argument in PK was based on religion and I opposed it. I am opposing Balancing argument in Baby too.

But for those who used the Balancing argument in PK should use it here too. Terrorism is not being equated with religion. One Religion is being equated with another religion. So using that logic Baby should have one Islamic militant outfit, one Hindutva militant outfit, one Khalistani militant outfit and one Christian militant outfit (NLFT) to keep it balanced.

Many Hindus in India liked PK and they did not have any problems whether its balanced or not. The people who had problems with PK were the Hindu fanatics.

Using your own words “let fanatics say whatever they want. why are you bringing thier perspective?”

“After the Bilal operation the movie loses plot and it just becomes a rip off of Argo. The whole scene will be interesting only to those who haven’t watched Argo.” “Baby’s first half slacks but the second half is very engrossing. Don’t know why Neeraj decided to borrow the ending from the already famous Oscar winning Argo.”

When I said the movie loses plot I meant that until then it was interesting as I did not know what’s going to happen next. I said in my review that “the surprise scene in Bilal’s room is the best scene of the movie.” I said that because Rasheed Naz suddenly showing up in Bilal’s room was completely unexpected. It was like they suddenly hit the jackpot.

So what they do after that was very important for the movie. But once Akshay said we want to bring him back I knew that the rest of the movie will be like Argo. And as I said “The whole scene will be interesting only to those who haven’t watched Argo.”

Argo was about the CIA attempt to rescue six US embassy officials who are hiding in the Canadian Ambassador’s home during the Iranian revolution by posing as filmmakers trying to scout locations for a sci-fi movie.

On my first watch I said “Saw Argo. Good movie – it takes a while to get started but the last 30 minutes were quite thrilling even though I knew the ending as it is based on a true story.” Link

But then after I researched a bit I said “the movie took too many cinematic liberties. Most of what was shown in the movie never really happened. I have to now say its just a good masala movie partly based on a true story.” Link

I re watched it again later and this is what I said.

“Re-watched Argo and I think the last scene is completely ridiculous. There is a scene where the Air Traffic Controller (ATC) tells the pilot that he is second in line to fly. So instead of going to the ATC and asking him to to tell the pilot to stop the plane them driving on jeeps with guns to stop the plane is completely BS.” Link

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Me & suprabh had a debate over Argo and SDM here and here is my comment.

“I don’t care if Argo showed Iranians in bad light as long as it stayed true to the actual things that happened. The movie obviously discarded the Canadian involvement but then added stupid scenes of them going out and getting stuck which never happened and the whole ludicrous airport runaway scene when that thing never happened. The movie should have ended with them boarding the plane itself just like it happened in real.”

Now coming to suprabh’s comments I don’t know if you remember that him and me had big arguments on sanity over Argo when Special 26 came out. I don’t have access to those comments anymore but suprabh was defending Argo and the airport scenes.

I am glad that suprabh now feels that “Ben Affleck actually made it fictional and deviated from what actually happened..” and that “Argo had fictitious stuff like security guards running behind the passangers..”

“Baby had a rather long climax starting from the hospital.. The airport sequence was just a part of it.. ”

LOL I did not compare just the airport sequences. I said “After the Bilal operation the movie loses plot and it just becomes a rip off of Argo.” The whole movie Argo is about getting a few Americans out of Iran. And once Akshay says they have to take Rasheed Naz out of Saudi it became Argo. In Argo they used the whole fake movie producers bit which actually happened in real whereas here it is medical tourism.

“rather it just builds tension but doesn’t succumb to unnecessary cheap thrills.”

Rasheed Naz suddenly getting up and stabbing Akshay and the whole tussle or Akshay being called out from behind or the Saudi investigator calling the ATC are presicely “unnecessary cheap thrills” which were there in Argo too. In Argo they are all taken into a separate room and they show their movie skit and then the guard makes a a call to the US producer.

The Saudi investigator calling and then waiting for a couple of minutes where the Airport guy keeps asking and then deciding to just leave them is as filmy as it can get.

Saw baby again. this time i liked it even more than the first time (if thats possible). didnt mind the length of first half. only minded the family scenes which were not required. apart from lead, there are two characters written which i felt are masterstrokes from neerj pandey – one is Rasheed naz – an amazing actor with extraordinary screen presence. every scene of him he has such a towering presence and his expressions, his accent , his voice are just too awesome. the other is anupam kher. I think he comes at a right time in the film with his smart comic lines. that scene where they are waiting for the meeting of menon to finish, anupam gets irrirated and his lines are hilarious “abey khatam kar , khatam kar”. i usually dont laugh in theatre (even if i find a scene funny)but his scenes made me do it.

“Undoubtedly, Neeraj Pandey’s realistic approach to the sensitive theme works wonders for the film. Akshay’s been the Khiladi and has aced the action genre ever since he entered the industry. But Baby is unlike his other films. Here you won’t find Akshay battling 20 goons at once. It’s not another action packed Dabangg or a Chennai Express, where you see the lead taking on a group of men with ease and comfort. With a rather believable stance to cinema, the scenes and the sequences are also choreographed in a way which adds to the ambience of the film. Akshay’s character does not indulge in impossible and unbelievable stunts. Rather, he makes it all the more accepting and convincing, unlike his Rowdy Rathore avatar!”

downloaded baby and saw the scenes i loved again. akshay is great in the hand to hand combat. the chroegrahpy is well planned. first when they fight , akshay waits for him to attack . all good fighters do this to gauge the strength and weakness of the opponent. then the next two attacks, akshya blocks and attacks at the same time(wing chun) approach. at the third instance he attacks first (krav maga appraoch) .its a brilliantly done choreography. only someone like cryil raffeaeli could have done this

when minister asks danny “when you say you disown ajay, how much of it do you realy mean?” danny says “i mean it fully sir” its so professional

Rasheed naz was brilliant in all his scenes – the way he interrupts a media reporter saying “bhaijaan!” he has a very commanding presence

@anupma kher – from his first line itself i knew he was going to rock when he says “main is aadmi ke saath kaam nahi kar sakta”

@sputnik – one aspect i loved in the film is rasheed naz speech in the beginning . it is like actual speeches made by fanatic relgios leaders by mixing relgions talks with hatred. just before the speech he says “Allah humse koi bada kaam karana chahta hai” and then greets the crowd with “Bismillah he raheman nir rahim …assalam alaikum warahmatulah wahbarakatuhu ” i loved it how he said that 🙂

a small part of a comment made by me on sanity (fb group)on the first shootout scene of akshay on why he doesnt shoot the nearest person also:

He tackles the first one physically but not the rest by following the basic principle of all martial arts. I can explain this to you from many different angles and fight forms but for argument let me choose krav maga angle. in krav maga, when the enemy is far, you try to reach out to him with a weapon, when he is two -three feet part, you dont punch , you only kick and when he is just shoulder apart you only throw punches. this domain is a separate topic in itslef known as “close body combat” . when the distance is not even one shoulder apart, then you dont even use the hands, then you use the head to attack. now bring this principle to a broader sense. when akshay sees there are several men surrounded , he applies the close body combat approach and instead of uisng weapon, he physicaly attacks him. ye hui technique ki baat. ab practical aspect ki baat batata hun. suppose he had hit the guy closets to him also with a gun shot. then it would have alarmed the other ppl who were at a distance to him and then they woudl be in a better positon to counter attack akshay and chances of escaping them would have become less.

Baby is an outstanding achievement by an Indian director. This movie is the best movie ever in this genre.

Hats off to Neeraj Pandey. He is India’s best director. And three cheers to Superstar Akshay Kumar for a restrained but powerhouse performance. Every department of this movie is superb. Be it direction , acting by an ensemble cast, editing, story, screenplay, cinematography, everything is superb. The word of mouth is fantastic and even the critics rating are great too. This is cinema at its best.

Baby is not against Muslims as some vested interests are trying to make believe, people who have not viewed the movie. It is against terrorism. In fact there are several Muslims shown as heroic and patriotic. Danny Denzongpa plays Firoz, who heads the secret mission, is a Muslim. Ashfaq,the Indian agent in Al Dera is a Muslim.A young Muslim boy shows up the courage to expose the terrorists, and is appreciated by the hero Akshay Kumar. More than Akshay Kumar, the hero of the movie and his team, it is the Muslim characters in the movie who help in the fight against terrorism. So this movie is not anti-Muslim . In fact, Muslim and they are shown as heroic.

The film is not even anti Pakistan and has several Pakistani artists. In fact Pakistani actor Rashid Naz has given a superlative performance as the main terrorist. Only terrorism is the villain. And the movie hits out at terrorism.

Danny Denzongpa is fantastic, Aupam Kher puts in a spunky performance, Rana Dagubatti is good is a small role., Kay Kay Menon in a small role mesmerizes, Sushant Singh is good, Tapasee Pannu is awesome and does the best action scene done by an Indian actress ever. Madhurima Tulee is apt in her role and supports, and Murali Sharma is eye catching in his brief role.

Baby is a classic movie, I think the best movie made in India , in this genre ever. And director Neeraj Pandey is fast becoming a cult film maker what with a track record of A Wednesday, Special 26 and now Baby, Exemplary! And Akshay Kumar is fast becoming the most versatile actor ever, what with him juggling between so many genres and so many different roles, and doing them well.

Roll on the TAX-FREE status please…..this is my humble request to the Government of India , so all Indians can see this spectacular and patriotic movie.. All this is so motivating and moving and patriotic. Bravo Baby… This technically brilliant movie which is the best ever in this genre should get its due and be appreciated.

Baby should be given a TAX-FREE status by the Indian government. This should be the appeal of all Indians.

completely agree on all the things you mentioned. this is by far the best movie in its genre. and among the best movies in all genre too. yes it should have been made tax free long ago. it deserves to be far more than a pk but then akshay is not a nautanki like aamir

” Airlift is an uplifting and entertaining edge-of-the-seat thriller and is the story of the biggest ever human evacuation in the history of mankind. Starring Akshay Kumar in lead role as Ranjit Katyal, he plays a wealthy and powerful Indian businessman who has always seen himself as a Kuwaiti rather than an Indian. His character realises that he no longer wields any influence on the Iraqisand that he and his family are in as much danger as anyone else. Ranjit unknowingly becomes the man who all 1,70,000 Indians look up to for getting them out safely from Kuwait.Airlift is the story of Indians stranded in Kuwait during this traumatic time. “

“I’ll probably wait for the right director to do a full-length action film. Had it not been for Neeraj and the way he’s shot my sequence in Baby, it wouldn’t have made so much of an impact. If I find a capable director, I’d love to do it again,” she said. ”

Since the film deals with a sensitive theme of terrorism, how did you go through research of the subject in question? Because we are talking about real world and real situations rooted in reality, research is something that goes as an absolute necessity; that’s the demand of the subject. If you have to tell an effective narrative then you need to be well read on that. That is something part and parcel of the story telling. There was tons of reading involved in terms of books, articles on newspapers and internet, as well as videos. There was a lot that went in before written word on Baby was finalized.

a very interesting comment from suprabh on the saudi officer’s charcacter in the climax:

Suprabh Bajpai do you know why the saudi inspector let BABY go?

Suprabh Bajpai 2 possibilities..Me and my friend discussed yesterday– that the inspector was also from secret agent from RAW planted in Saudi for such scenario..OR he just let them go, because he wanted to do the right thing

Suprabh Bajpai there are reasons for the first theory: the Saudi agent spoke hindi in one scene.,. Then Danny in one scene says, they have one more contact in Saudi (apart from their regular guy who helped Akshay) and also because he said you will have in-flight support (which normally means during the flight but could be taken another way)

Suprabh Bajpai Think about it.. How did the inspector know- that there was a medical patient in the flight? It was clear that the inspector knew more than an ispector would– one way or the other

………………….

neeraj pandey chose to give background of ashfaq and chose not to give the background of saudi officer.neeraj pandey has kept the ending open for discussion. believe whatever you want. that is why he is a great director

This exact discussion has been on IMDB since Day 1 and I had already read it.

“So why does the investigating detective let them go? Act of humanity? A paid agent like Ashfaq? Impressed by the sheer devilry and daring? What?”

“A paid agent at most. We heard Shuklaji saying the investigation was being headed by an officer they knew very well. The agent AKA police officer had sensed every move made by the BABY agents in Bilal’s room. As an investigating officer he had to conduct a thorough investigation. A brilliant masterpiece indeed”

Danny says Ashfaq had influence and he would get out in a few hours every time he was arrested but Ashfaq also says that the officer investigating is trouble. If he was on their side and Ashfaq already knew him from the beginning then why would that be trouble? Also the officer thrashes that worker who helped them? Why would he do that if he was on their side. Ashfaq has some other contact because he says he made their records disappear and Akshay says make some others records disappear too. Why is he trying to make records disappear when the investigating officer is already on their side? And if I remember correctly most of the characters were speaking in Hindi. One can take it as a cinematic liberty since it is a Hindi movie intended for Hindi audiences.

The officer figured it out there is a medical patient because it is obvious that the Maulana disappeared from the hotel and he obviously will not go along with the Indian agents in a conscious state.

The agent letting them go is just a filmy device to create tension and nothing more. Its the same thing that Neeraj did in A Wednesday where Anupam Kher meets Naseer and lets him go.

In real life a Saudi agent is not going to let the Indians abduct a terrorist from their soil when he is wanted by the US and has a 20 million dollar reward on him.

This is the kind of over reading that some SS members do to Abhishek’s movies.

you seem to have some personal issues with suprabh. he had inboxed me this the day he returned after seeing it. but asked not to make it public till he first talks about it on fb. thats why i have posted it now. the way you put your guard whenever anything positive related to baby is discussed is hilarious. atleast on some days, dont wear the “haider cap” 😉

it is not overreading. its an open ending. and open ending is subject to audiences imagination. what ashfaq says about saudi officer or his actions prior to the climax could be or could not be taken at face value. this is a neeraj pandey film , not a farah khan film. the saudi officer is the only saudi local who speaks in hindi. did the health inspector who came to check rasheed speak hindi? did any of the local airport authorities speak in hindi? only the indians and pakistanis in the film used to speak in hindi.

That IMDB thread has been there since day 1 as I said. If Suprabh has to say something he can come here and say it himself. Why do you have to post his views?

You posted his comments about Baby’s comparisons with Argo too. Its funny that someone who liked Argo’s ending and argued for it during Special 26 suddenly thinks Argo’s ending is bad just because he liked Baby whose ending is inspired from Argo.

The movie has no open ending. When they clearly escape its not an open ending. Its clear that the Saudi officer let him go just as Anupam Kher let Naseer go in A Wednesday.

If the Saudi investigating officer was on Indian side what was Neeraj doing with the whole climax? Fooling Indian audiences as if that Saudi guy is going to catch Akshay and co when he is batting for their team. Why did Ashfaq have to say his name and say he is investigating and its bad news? He is the one who has the contacts with someone big but he does not know it is that Saudi investigator?

That Saudi investigator says some dialogues in Hindi but he also says lot of dialogues including the last ones in English. The health inspector only had a couple of lines in English and a couple of lines in Arabic with the doctor. When Saudi investigator is speaking in Hindi the guys working under him are replying to him in English. If he speaks in Hindi to guys who do not know Hindi how do they reply to him? And why would a Saudi guy speak in Hindi to Arabic speaking guys? By speaking in Hindi to Arabs he is revealing his secret that he is a Indian agent to Saudis. What rubbish.

Yes this is a Neeraj Pandey film not a Nolan movie like Memento or Prestige. So stop trying to over read into this movie.

i am posting his views bcos i find it interesting and no person on tq made that point before.

the questions which you are raising for baby, something very similar were raised during s26 by piyush and others that neeraj pandey has “cheated” the audience by showing something different about jimmy in first half and then completely different later on. at that time you were defending s26 as a smart movie bcos it was not an anti-terrorist film. now when neeraj has upped the ante by not even spoon feeding the “cheat” in baby, you are posing the same silly questions which piyush raised during s26.

” The health inspector only had a couple of lines in English and a couple of lines in Arabic with the doctor. ”

show me any dialogue of arabic local resident there who spoke in hindi at any point of time. your comment makes no sense.

“Anupam Kher: People can’t believe that a film so slick, so realistic without any clichés in it, has come from India. Akshay is a commercial, popular actor. For an actor like that, who sometimes has to play to the gallery and people love him like that, there is not a single fake moment in the film with his performance. That itself is an achievement. It’s very easy in a Hindi film to acquire fake moments. Not because we are bad actors but because in a movie like this, silence is more important than words.”

Baby is an outstanding achievement by an Indian director. This movie is the best movie ever in this genre. Hats off to Neeraj Pandey. He is India’s best director. And three cheers to Superstar Akshay Kumar for a restrained but powerhouse performance. Every department of this movie is superb. Be it direction , acting by an ensemble cast, editing, story, screenplay, cinematography, everything is superb. The word of mouth is fantastic and even the critics rating are great too. This is cinema at its best. Baby is not against Muslims as some vested interests are trying to make believe, people who have not viewed the movie. It is against terrorism. In fact there are several Muslims shown as heroic and patriotic. Danny Denzongpa plays Firoz, who heads the secret mission, is a Muslim. Ashfaq,the Indian agent in Al Dera is a Muslim.A young Muslim boy shows up the courage to expose the terrorists, and is appreciated by the hero Akshay Kumar. More than Akshay Kumar, the hero of the movie and his team, it is the Muslim characters in the movie who help in the fight against terrorism. So this movie is not anti-Muslim . In fact, Muslim and they are shown as heroic. The film is not even anti Pakistan and has several Pakistani artists. In fact Pakistani actor Rashid Naz has given a superlative performance as the main terrorist. Only terrorism is the villain. And the movie hits out at terrorism. Danny Denzongpa is fantastic, Aupam Kher puts in a spunky performance, Rana Dagubatti is good is a small role., Kay Kay Menon in a small role mesmerizes, Sushant Singh is good, Tapasee Pannu is awesome and does the best action scene done by an Indian actress ever. Madhurima Tulee is apt in her role and supports, and Murali Sharma is eye catching in his brief role. Baby is a classic movie, I think the best movie made in India , in this genre ever. And director Neeraj Pandey is fast becoming a cult film maker what with a track record of A Wednesday, Special 26 and now Baby, Exemplary! And Akshay Kumar is fast becoming the most versatile actor ever, what with him juggling between so many genres and so many different roles, and doing them well. Roll on the TAX-FREE status please…..this is my humble request to the Government of India , so all Indians can see this spectacular and patriotic movie.. All this is so motivating and moving and patriotic. Bravo Baby… This technically brilliant movie which is the best ever in this genre should get its due and be appreciated.

Baby should be given a TAX-FREE status by the Indian government. This should be the appeal of all Indians.

And I think Super star Akshay Kumar and director Neera Pandey both deserves a National Award.

In all this excitement I have one thing to say about Superstar Akshay Kumar . Akki in Baby is looking very good, fit and young, even younger than some young heroes. Very different from the new old man avatar he is sporting now a days.He should not be seen in public with the salt and pepper beard and grey hair. He thinks it is a fashion statement and he even looks good even as an old man, but that will ruin his fan following. As in India the fans will only worship a young hero. The slight hint of age and you start loosing the fan following. The Khans Salman, Aamir and Sharukh are 3-4 years older than him but will never be seen in public in grey hair or beard. They groom themselves to look younger. Now Akki is better and younger looking than some of the youngest heroes so why is he hell bent on sporting the salt and pepper beard and grey hair. He is going to drive away all his fans His films will flop as no fans will go to see a hero who is old and he will be left playing character roles. The opening of his movies have already been affected due to this. If he does not pull up his socks and revert back to looking young he will go down. Please Akki we love you too much to go down like that. You are the best youth icon Indian youth can follow what with your humility after all that achievement, disciplined and right fitness policies. Please don’t snatch away that opportunity from our Indian youth . Akshay, I think partly the blame for Baby a modern day classic and a remarkable movie, the best in its genre, getting a low opening is because you were running around doing promotion with the salt and pepper beard and grey hair. No one will go to see an old man perform stunts. The sight of grey hair is a turn off for most Indians. And I think you are to be blamed if your Superstar status is harmed. We the fans have requested you to not make public appearances looking old but you still continue to do so and see the outcome. A fantastic film like Baby missed out on a great opening and has average collections.

he was not sporting the grey beard look during baby promotions as far as i know. and what is the big deal if he does? it makes him look more human. if he can manage to look young in the movie it is enough. no one cares how a star looks offset and neither does it affect the opening of a movie LOL 😀

baby was always going to open low. a movie of this genre has a limited audience . we have seen it with madras cafe. but such films trend if made well do trend at a lower end and thats what is happening with baby. and isnt that good for akshay? his movies used to crash after weekend much like salman

“But your film shows a slew of brave hearts led by Akshay Kumar, countering terrorism. Isn’t that escapist heroism? You mean you don’t believe there are people out there who are combating the dangers to make sure we are safe? I feel the Intelligence agencies have vastly improved in their damage-prevention skills. I’ve no doubt the brave hearts like Akshay and his team exists in our country. Otherwise, how do devastating terror plans get foiled? You believe in humanity-saving heroes? Men who have a mindset of country-above-all-else do exist. They are the reason why we survive so many attacks,”

Q: One of those rare occasions when your film has got critical acclaim. ‘Baby’ is also doing well at the box office. Akshay Kumar (laughing): It’s the first time that a film of mine has been given four-and-a-half and five stars by critics. I don’t know whether I will get awards for my performance, but I am sure about being nominated. It’s been two weeks since the movie released and I am still getting messages about people appreciating it. It’s a really nice feeling when you and the people associated with a movie are happy. The entire credit goes to the director of the film, Neeraj Pandey. The director truly is the captain of the ship. –

True, this genre is specific to a certain audience. But to get the love and support from all over is just heart-warming beyond what I could imagine. This film has soul, it has a purpose, but more so it has a reality we all face everyday. Terrorism is something we’ve all learned to live with unfortunately, yet we will never know just what some people go through to protect us as much as they do, Baby is that reality.”

“Something else to make you happy… Baby has taken off in a big way in the second and third week. Did you expect it to be a slow winner?

We always knew Baby was always going to have a slow and sturdy opening, and rise on its own sweet time!! With no commercial element to it whatsoever, no songs, and because of its political agenda, it was always meant to be a word-of- mouth film. We all knew it would be a slow winner which is why we’re so happy that even in its second week it was appreciated more than I could have wished for .”

” If Saurabh has to say something he can come here and say it himself. Why do you have to post his views?”

@sputnik- In the end seen the movie after returning from Meghalay. Its an outstanding movie and I liked it.(without bringing in religion factor in it)

Dont expect more than this from SUPRABH Bajpayi or Bajpayee. Sth like that. He is like this only and never leave any chance to make his points this way. Please ignore him. He is the main reason for destruction of NG (keeping silent on Wall-D, when he was making most nonsense and inflammatory communal comments and posts.)

hypocrisy and nonsensical arguments are made by those who defend the pro-terrorist sentiment in haider. i never stressed “balancing” in haider. there is no need to balance terrorism. my main point was its a pro-terrorist film and its anti-national and everyone knows sputnik and few here who love such films and harbour such communal feelings.

you can clearly see the agenda in sputniks review. he obviously has a problem with the hard hitting content of baby and his stupid nitpickings are laughably poor.

and those having a problem with suprabh bajpai a big LOL to them. there is nothing wrong in whatever he has said about the film. i dont find anything communal in his review or the comments he has written. put your personal problems with him aside.

You did ask for “balancing” in Haider saying they did not show the bad things that terrorists do and that they showed the army only in bad light. So don’t try to now say that you did not stress for balancing in Haider. I was just pointing out the silliness of the balancing argument. If Haider/PK needs balancing so does Baby.

“my main point was its a pro-terrorist film and its anti-national and everyone knows sputnik and few here who love such films and harbour such communal feelings.”

Get over this silly patriotic thing that the govt/army is always right. I always believe in saying what’s right even if it may not be politically correct. I give a rat’s ass if someone thinks I am anti national for that.

And don’t try to propagate your feelings on to me. I am not the one who constantly makes arguments about Khans vs non Khans or who is constantly trying to run down or prop up some star’s box office collections.

I loved A Wednesday which was also a anti-terrorist film which came out in 2008 and I said it was “definitely the best movie of the year”. I also said there was nothing offensive with Vishwaroop which some Muslim fanatics had opposed.

I loved Zero Dark Thirty which was also a anti terrorist and pro torture movie and I thought that was the best movie of the year. “Excellent movie and excellent direction. Its long but I liked it a lot. It obviously will be nominated at the Oscars for Best Picture and Best Director and will most most probably win too. I liked it more than Lincoln, Argo and Django Unchained.” Link

In Baby there was a scene where Akshay just talks about bringing that terrorist’s family to the mall where the bomb is placed. Baby is literally a “Baby” if one compares it to Unthinkable in terms of hard hitting and gruesome content. In that the terrorist’s wife is brought and killed and his children are about to be tortured. I liked that movie and here is my comment.

“Liked the movie. It raised some thought provoking questions – how far one is willing to go with the interrogation of the captured terrorist when there is an imminent attack. Movie can be deemed pro torture.” Link

The reason why I liked A Wednesday or Unthinkable is because these raised thought provoking questions. A Wednesday showed the plight of a common man who has to live in fear daily because of the terrorist attacks and is fed up. Its the same reason why I liked Haider because it also raised thought provoking questions. It wasn’t a movie about Indian Army vs Terrorists like Roja/MissionKashmir or all other Kashmir based movies. It was a movie which tried to show the plight of common people stuck between two countries.

“stupid nitpickings are laughably poor”

I nitpick almost every movie. And those were valid criticisms. If Baby’s first half had avoided the wife angle and Kay Kay Menon track in Indian jail and escape and all that Baby would have become shorter, slicker and more engrossing. I nitpicked Haider too about its length, second half and climax/ending but you choose to ignore that.

“Something else to make you happy… Baby has taken off in a big way in the second and third week. Did you expect it to be a slow winner? We always knew Baby was going to have a slow and sturdy opening, and rise in its own sweet time! With no commercial element to it whatsoever, no songs, and because of its political agenda, it was always meant to be a word-of- mouth film. We all knew it would be a slow winner which is why we’re so happy that even in its second week it was appreciated more than I could have wished for.”

“You did ask for “balancing” in Haider saying they did not show the bad things that terrorists do and that they showed the army only in bad light. ”

LOL! of course because unlike you i dont equate terrorists= indian army. for army i wil always ask for balance while for terrorists i will NEVER ask for balance. they have to shown as criminals as devils and they have to be treated the way its done in baby. if this doenst show your communal side, then what else?

” I am not the one who constantly makes arguments about Khans vs non Khans”

Just a couple of comments before you said “i never stressed “balancing” in haider” and then you do a volte-face saying “for army i wil always ask for balance”. LOL

“they have to shown as criminals as devils and they have to be treated the way its done in baby. if this doenst show your communal side, then what else?”

I never said I had a issue with how terrorists were treated in Baby. Like I said before I don’t care about the balancing. Baby is absolutely fine from its POV of a anti terrorism unit. So how does it show my communal side?

I was pointing out the hypocrisy of the “balancing” argument. When you make silly nonsensical arguments about balancing for Army in Haider or PK then it should apply to Baby too. You have the problem with army’s portrayal not being balanced in Haider then you should have a problem with some Anti terror fighting unit being completely goody goody too. There have been innocents who have been arrested and tortured too who had nothing to do with terrorism. Baby did not acknowledge or tackle that. Baby doesn’t say a word on terrorist attacks by Hindu/Christian militants. So by that balance yardstick it is not balanced and all the silly arguments against Haider apply there too.

Neeraj is making a sequel to Baby. I hope he makes a movie this time on Hindu militants since he has already made two movies on Islamic militants. I doubt that will happen but I am pretty sure the right wing fanatics on twitter and elsewhere will have problems with its depiction and will call for “balancing” by showing Islamic militants also then.

“everyone who has read your haider review knows how much gaga you were going on it and how much you loved its pro-terrorist take”

I certainly wasn’t going gaga over Haider the way you have been going gaga over Baby. And anybody who has read my review or comments can see that. I already have said whatever I had to about Haider in my review thread. So there’s nothing more to add.

you may be recognising terorists by their religon . i dont. you may be feeling the need to own muslim terrorists as your ppl, i dont. whether he shows hindu militants or muslim militants wil be questioned only by those who are communal by nature and harbour an anti-national feeling in them. the more you speak on this issue, the more i am assured of your pro-terrorist and communal sentiments.

“I certainly wasn’t going gaga over Haider the way you have been going gaga over Baby.”

i wil OBVIOUSLY go gaga over baby. it showed how we have to treat terrorists. if you had any sympathy for common man and country, you would have gone gaga too.but obviously your vested communal interests take over everything. you were calling that crap film haider as one of the “boldest films” in your review just bcos it was a pro-terrorist film. that time also i had questioned your ill intentions.

“you should be ashamed of your pathetic attitude. its the same feeling that terrorists harbour agaisnt their country.”

I don’t know if you are being daft or deliberately trying to misread everything.

“how can an argument for asking for balance for indian army ever be nonsensenical unless you belong to taliban or IM?”

Why the hell does a movie need to balance the portrayal of Indian army? Is the maker on the govt payroll or is he Army’s PR to portray it in a balanced or good manner. A director can make a movie on a rape/torture/murder case where the Army was involved and show it to be completely at fault if it was. Another director can make another movie on Kashmir floods rescue or or some anti terror operation and show the army to be completely good. A war movie like Platoon portrays the US army in bad light whereas another war movie like Black Hawk Down portrays the US army in good light. Its all about context and what the movie is about. If the director showed something that’s not true and he made up bad stuff about the army then criticism about that movie is perfectly valid. Vishal Bharadwaj made a movie from the Kashmiri’s people’s POV. Another filmmaker can make a movie from the POV of the Indian Army who has to protect Kashmir from terrorists both inside and across the border in a hostile environment.

“you may be recognising terorists by their religon . i dont. you may be feeling the need to own muslim terrorists as your ppl, i dont. whether he shows hindu militants or muslim militants wil be questioned only by those who are communal by nature and harbour an anti-national feeling in them. the more you speak on this issue, the more i am assured of your pro-terrorist and communal sentiments.”

What a load of BS. I already said I have no issues with Baby showing Islamic terrorism. If you don’t associate religion with terrorists then you should have no issues with the depiction of Hindu militants in a movie too. Islamic militants have been shown in numerous Hindi movies and if Neeraj has the balls then he will target Hindu militants in his sequel. Those who liked Baby should also like that. If they bring up balance or have issues with portrayal of terrorists then they are the hypocrites or bigots. And that has been my point all along.

“you were calling that crap film haider as one of the “boldest films” in your review just bcos it was a pro-terrorist film.”

Yes I called Haider one of the “boldest films” because it did not parrot the official govt line about Kashmir. It tried to bat for the common people of Kashmir and it had the guts to talk about issues which have been brushed under the carpet like AFSPA, half windows and torture camps. I don’t remember a Bollywood movie ever talking about Nehru’s speech at Lal Chowk or mentioning Plebiscite. I also said “its good that India did not ban the movie” and that’s what happens in democracies where movies can be made which are critical of govt or the Army.

Its funny that the real occurrence of AFSPA, half windows and torture camps does not damage the Army’s image but a movie mentioning it damages the Army’s image. No govt or Army will ever be perfect. There will always be some bad apples and some bad things will always happen. When the govt/army delivers justice to people who were at the wrong end then nobody will be able to point any fingers at the Army. Even the filmmaker who makes a movie on any of those incidents will have to show that the Army punished the bad guys. But when the govt/army tries to hide behind this facade that the Army is always right or tries to brush off everything bad/wrong then that’s a bigger problem than some movie’s depiction of them.

And just because people criticize the govt (which almost everyone does) or some official position of the govt it does not make them anti national or pro terrorist. In a democracy people will have different opinions/positions and that’s all fine. If some people have some genuine grievances and if they are protesting using peaceful means then its alright. But when they cross the line and start using violence and killing innocent people then they are terrorists. It no longer matters whether their cause was just or valid. They have have to be punished period. It could either be punishment by courts (hanged/life imprisonment) or getting killed in a crossfire. I give a rat’s ass as to what religion they belong. I have never supported non violence or terrorism ever and I never will. Even after reading all this if you keep mouthing the same stuff then I can’t help it.

“Why the hell does a movie need to balance the portrayal of Indian army? ” because they are not terrorists, haider is.

“f Neeraj has the balls then he will target Hindu militants in his sequel.”

only a bigot will ask for this kind of ridiculous request. everytime you ask for “hindi” militants, you own the “muslim” miitants as your own ppl.

“. It tried to bat for the common people of Kashmir ”

not every kasmiri wants to separate from India or harbour anti-national feelings about it. this is like making a movie on khalistan and saying every sikh wants to separate from india

“No govt or Army will ever be perfect. ” yes but the terrorist will ALWAYS be bad regardless of how much you suport some of them just bcos they belong to a particualr community which you bat for(inspite of ridiculously proclaiming yourself as atheist)

everytime you defend haider and try to nitpick baby, i wil bring this point. EVERYTIME for the rest of your life

If Indian Army does something wrong in some place or some incident then the filmmaker is absolutely right in showing what happened. He does not need to balance the Army’s portrayal because someone’s silly sensibilities are getting hurt.

“only a bigot will ask for this kind of ridiculous request. everytime you ask for “hindi” militants, you own the “muslim” miitants as your own ppl.”

No only a bigot will call this a ridiculous request. You can’t even entertain the thought of a movie showing Hindu militants and you are giving advice to others to not own militants because of their religion. Apply this advice to yourself. I give a rat’s ass if some movie shows Muslims as villains but I will always point out the hypocrisy of bigots.

“not every kasmiri wants to separate from India or harbour anti-national feelings about it. this is like making a movie on khalistan and saying every sikh wants to separate from india”

Nobody knows how many Kashmiris want to separate from India coz there was never a Plebiscite held which they were promised by the Indian govt and which the UN ordered. So this is all a moot point. Anyway Haider was set in 1990s when insurgency was at its peak. So it obviously will show that Kashmiris wanting to separate from India. If someone makes a movie on Khalistan when demands for it were at its peak in the 1970s and 1980s then it will obviously show every Sikh wanting to separate from India. Maachis was set in the 80s and it showed the Police as bad guys who tortured innocent people. It even had the protagonists turn into terrorists and take revenge against the Police. I don’t remember anyone calling that movie anti national or pro terrorist back then.

“everytime you defend haider and try to nitpick baby, i wil bring this point. EVERYTIME for the rest of your life”

I wrote reviews for both Haider and Baby. I liked both movies and I nitpicked both movies. You choose to ignore the nitpickings of one movie whereas whine about another movie’s nitpickings and that is your problem. I will always praise a movie if I feel there is something good and I will nitpick/bash if I feel there is something wrong with it. You cannot change my opinion by trolling me.

“yes but the terrorist will ALWAYS be bad regardless of how much you suport some of them just bcos they belong to a particualr community which you bat for(inspite of ridiculously proclaiming yourself as atheist)”

Despite having made myself absolutely clear on everything you deliberately keep lying about my statements and making stupid insinuations. I have no interest in arguing with you anymore.

i dont have a problem with showing some army ppl as vilians. but in haider army is painted pitch black while haider who carries a gun in his school bag is shown as a hero who does the “right” things. i cant stand terrorist glorification.you may be liking it

“You can’t even entertain the thought of a movie showing Hindu militants ”

i cant entertain the thought of recognising terrorists as “hindus” and “muslims”, you may be liking doing it

“Nobody knows how many Kashmiris want to separate from India” then why say haider speaks for the “common man” in kahsmir? isnt that your presumption?

anyway i dont think you are going to change your stand on this. so keep praising haider and keep ignoring (holiday) or reluctantly priaising(baby) anti-terrorist films. its your choice at the end of the day

@bABA – I never wanted to comment on this but now i have to. I am visiting Kashmir for last 2 – 3 years regularly during my summers. The people of Kashmir (Srinagar) call Indian army as “Kutta” and Pakistan as whole Kutte ki Aulad’. Every family (almost have lost their child/children) because of atrocities of BSF or firing from Pakistan army.

The first half of Haider is total real, have no doubt about it. Our Army is a kind of villain here. They have raided the houses in middle of the night and take away Kashmiri youths without any reasons and also the daughters (to rape them, please dont argue on this like Suprabh).

The Kashmiris hate Pakistanis the same way, they hate Indians (including me).

In the end Haider is a wonderful movie if consider reality same as Baby.

“The first half of Haider is total real, have no doubt about it. Our Army is a kind of villain here”

yes exactly. and it is so surprising that kahsmir is in existence and a part of india today because of those “villians” and its those “villians” who saved the locals during the recent floods , not the heroes like LeT and IM.