I'm not one for snap decisions and I do realize that there is still plenty of time left in the season... but it kind of feels like the season's over. The offense just has too many injuries and inconsistent young players and as skatingtripods said our pitchers all seem to be hitting a wall.

Looking forward to the offseason spin/excuse machine when Shapiro tells us that a 76-86 team "contended."

This season has been fun but let's not kid ourselves. In any decent division, we would have been buried by late June. They've battled admirably despite injuries but those injuries did pretty much exactly what you'd expect. Since that Red Sox series in May, we've played at a pace that prorates to around 68 wins.

"Well then I guess there's only one thing left to do...win the whole, f***in', thing."- Jake Taylor

Kingpin74 wrote:Looking forward to the offseason spin/excuse machine when Shapiro tells us that a 76-86 team "contended."

This season has been fun but let's not kid ourselves. In any decent division, we would have been buried by late June. They've battled admirably despite injuries but those injuries did pretty much exactly what you'd expect. Since that Red Sox series in May, we've played at a pace that prorates to around 68 wins.

Depends how much value they put in the injuries. Also depends how much they take in to consideration their shortcomings. They'll tell us that a full lineup will be enough, but there are serious issues on this team. Mostly, Santana has no position. He's a key component of your offense.

Quite frankly, I'd dangle him in a trade this offseason if you get a 1B/OF for him. I'm fine with Marson catching every day so long as you're getting production from the other positions. Catcher should be a spot you can dedicate to defense and not have to expect offense from.

Based on the Ubaldo trade, they're going to make every attempt they can this year for a piece that helps with contention, even at a monetary cost. They just need one of these free agents to work out for them.

A God Damn dead man would understand that if a minor league bus in any city took a real sharp right turn, a Zack McCalister would likely fall out. - Lead Pipe

skatingtripods wrote:Based on the Ubaldo trade, they're going to make every attempt they can this year for a piece that helps with contention, even at a monetary cost. They just need one of these free agents to work out for them.

Kingpin74 wrote:Looking forward to the offseason spin/excuse machine when Shapiro tells us that a 76-86 team "contended."

This season has been fun but let's not kid ourselves. In any decent division, we would have been buried by late June. They've battled admirably despite injuries but those injuries did pretty much exactly what you'd expect. Since that Red Sox series in May, we've played at a pace that prorates to around 68 wins.

Depends how much value they put in the injuries. Also depends how much they take in to consideration their shortcomings. They'll tell us that a full lineup will be enough, but there are serious issues on this team. Mostly, Santana has no position. He's a key component of your offense.

Quite frankly, I'd dangle him in a trade this offseason if you get a 1B/OF for him. I'm fine with Marson catching every day so long as you're getting production from the other positions. Catcher should be a spot you can dedicate to defense and not have to expect offense from.

Based on the Ubaldo trade, they're going to make every attempt they can this year for a piece that helps with contention, even at a monetary cost. They just need one of these free agents to work out for them.

Sure, a full lineup would help, but who in their right mind is going to think that Hafner and Sizemore will make it through a season unscathed? Both are likely to spend considerable time on the DL. I would guess Sizemore would be brought back, mainly because there are really no other good internal options. I hate to say this, because I really like Grady as a player, but I am as certain as I can be that is his best days are behind him.

I would not be too quick to get rid of Santana, as I think most teams would try to lowball us on him. I think he will be back. Kipnis, A. Cab., and Chisenall will likely be the opening day starters. Another big decision will have to be made on Laporta, who basically looks completely lost and not shown a bit of improvement all year. I think he will be given another shot, but with a much shorter leash. Clearly, he has not an ounce of trade value.

Masterson and Jimenez will be two of the starters, and clearly Carmona's team option will be exercised. I am fairly certain Tomlin will be back as well, mainly because the internal options are lacking. Huff would be the likely fifth starter, with some chance of a veteran FA signing, or some starter picked up in a trade coming on board.

If I were dangling someone, I think it would be Chris Perez. He might get us an outfielder, especially if packaged with a Raffie Perez or Sipp. I like our internal options in the bullpen and think two or three positions there could adequately be replaced.

Kingpin74 wrote:Looking forward to the offseason spin/excuse machine when Shapiro tells us that a 76-86 team "contended."

This season has been fun but let's not kid ourselves. In any decent division, we would have been buried by late June. They've battled admirably despite injuries but those injuries did pretty much exactly what you'd expect. Since that Red Sox series in May, we've played at a pace that prorates to around 68 wins.

Depends how much value they put in the injuries. Also depends how much they take in to consideration their shortcomings. They'll tell us that a full lineup will be enough, but there are serious issues on this team. Mostly, Santana has no position. He's a key component of your offense.

Quite frankly, I'd dangle him in a trade this offseason if you get a 1B/OF for him. I'm fine with Marson catching every day so long as you're getting production from the other positions. Catcher should be a spot you can dedicate to defense and not have to expect offense from.

Based on the Ubaldo trade, they're going to make every attempt they can this year for a piece that helps with contention, even at a monetary cost. They just need one of these free agents to work out for them.

Sure, a full lineup would help, but who in their right mind is going to think that Hafner and Sizemore will make it through a season unscathed? Both are likely to spend considerable time on the DL. I would guess Sizemore would be brought back, mainly because there are really no other good internal options. I hate to say this, because I really like Grady as a player, but I am as certain as I can be that is his best days are behind him.

I would not be too quick to get rid of Santana, as I think most teams would try to lowball us on him. I think he will be back. Kipnis, A. Cab., and Chisenall will likely be the opening day starters. Another big decision will have to be made on Laporta, who basically looks completely lost and not shown a bit of improvement all year. I think he will be given another shot, but with a much shorter leash. Clearly, he has not an ounce of trade value.

Masterson and Jimenez will be two of the starters, and clearly Carmona's team option will be exercised. I am fairly certain Tomlin will be back as well, mainly because the internal options are lacking. Huff would be the likely fifth starter, with some chance of a veteran FA signing, or some starter picked up in a trade coming on board.

If I were dangling someone, I think it would be Chris Perez. He might get us an outfielder, especially if packaged with a Raffie Perez or Sipp. I like our internal options in the bullpen and think two or three positions there could adequately be replaced.

Interesting thought on Perez. I get queasy thinking of re-shaping a bullpen but you may be right that a kid like Pestano appears to have the mindset and pitch mix to succeed as a closer with the remaining spots backfilling as needed.

I wouldn't be too quick to count out Carrasco as the 5th guy in the rotation over Huff. If he matures some and uses what he's learned he'll be just fine. He was dominant for three weeks before, I hope, that elbow flared up and caused him (and us) a lot of angst.

Santana needs to grow up as a hitter and a player (and as a person). The kid has ridiculous offensive skills when his head isn't up his ass and he's one of the few plus hitters on the team. At least potentially. If LaPorta flames on you can move Santana to !B 3 times a week if not permanently. Maybe there's a catcher somewhere between Santana and Marson both offensively and defensively that you can acquire and plug in behind the plate, keeping Marson as a backup.

A week ago I didn't think we'd be writing the epitaph for 2011. 5 days ago exactly they were 1 1/2 back. Then everything went to hell.

18 trips to DL with guys like Choo, Hafner, Grady, Carrasco, Fausto, etc, Asdrubal completely hitting the wall, Kipnis's spark extinguished by injury, and a few meltdowns from a staff that been running hot killed this club.

But they were relevant for 5 more months than I thought they'd be heading into the season.

Hate to say it, but the playoff push looks to be over, granted, Heck of a season by the tribe, mostly buoyed by a STRONG first month and a half where they played out of their mind.. but reality has set in, and reality is, this team has a strong pitching staff that has the potential to be quite good, and a group of hitters who, if they can all put it together (big if) and stay healthy (REALLY BIG IF) could put together a VERY strong playoff push next season and perhaps for a few seasons to come..

But, 2011.. as far as playoffs go, is done, Detroit dealt the fatal blow with the sweep, and I dare say Seattle has hit the nail head into the coffin, and I anticipate KC will hammer it deep (as they seem to do often to the tribe)

Just remember, 2011 was better than ANYONE expected, and that is something to hang your hat on.

Watching this series vs the Mariners was like watching "The Empire Strikes Back" the 1st time on VHS as a kid. A total downer compared to the "A New Hope"/April & May of this season. "The Wedgie Strikes Back". Good guys should had won but the evil guys destroyed us at home.