It's strange to think that the F-19 was designed for carrier use, and yet it has never had exposure to the public. It seems unlikely that it was ever
operational in that role.

Didn't the military have a plane named "Tacetblue" - (groundwork for calculating the reflection and absorbtion properties of radar waves reflecting
off precision surfaces), which was retired before the public even became aware of its existance? I think the only reason they tell the public about
an aircraft, is if they want money or funding for that program.

...Still I believe Phil has some truths woven in with his exaggerations. I think these people who do lectures tend to add a bit to the story, in
order to make it interesting and have something new to say. Doesn't make it right, but there still could be some truths into what he says. I think
theres more disinformation than actual truths, which makes it hard to filter out the real cases, almost impossible...Yet we persist..

Question to John Lear - > I watched a video, in which a archivist claimed to have worked for a secret area of the military archiving UFO data. He
states that the infamous date of "2012" is a mass landing of UFOs, and that he personally read this out the data he archived. Whats you thoughts on
this, and how do you think the military would handle this situation? Personally I think that the secret military order and the Illuminati would be
opposed to this and do everything in their power to stop it. Possibly spread disinformation about them, portraying them as hostile, to gain support
for mounting a defensive intiative against them. This is just a wacked out theory, but hey, its all possible to me.

"Undergound cities for government officialls all over the US" -Undegound shelters yes, but I don't know of any that are whole cities for
20'000+ people.

If you consider that in Britain there is an underground city, build in the 1950's, 240 acres land with 60 miles of road at 120ft deep ment to house 4
to 5000 people, that was publicly sold in 2005, it wouldn't be that unimaginable that there are secret underground cities in the US and plenty of
other countries that are larger.

Originally posted by Freezer
[Question to John Lear - > I watched a video, in which a archivist claimed to have worked for a secret area of the military archiving UFO data. He
states that the infamous date of "2012" is a mass landing of UFOs, and that he personally read this out the data he archived. Whats you thoughts on
this, and how do you think the military would handle this situation?

My opinion is that all weird and disastrous stuff predicted for 2012 is malarky. Since I am usually wrong in my predictions about things you should
prepare for a mass landing and trouble.

Lets assume there is a mass landing. We have to ask why? Suppose one giant saucer lands for every square block of civilization. Are they going to be
passing out food and blankets? Or maybe hundred dollar bills? Are they going to be telling us something like....the meaning of life? I mean just
consider the absurdity of a mass landing.

Its going to cause traffic jans with everybody and his brother wanting a lookyloo. Within minutes there will be taco stands all over the place. The
IRS guys will be trying to figure out under what subsection of the code they can tax. The California tax guys won't worry about any subsection
they'll just start taxing.

Larry King will be trying to find someone to interview. Oprah people will be trying to figure out a way to get O in the door. It will be a mess.

First of all you have to understand that if there is any mass landing its just going to turn out to be an ad for Geico. I guarantee you that.

Second of all its not 2012 its 2013. Unlucky 13. 2+1+3=7. Lucky 7 but add 6 and what do your get? 13. Right unlucky 13.

Originally posted by SteveR
That's quite a feat, keeping the sailors, mechanics and technicians of a aircraft carrier quiet. Nevertheless, it's interesting to think about.

No, actually its not. First of all they don't brief all the sailors, mechanics and technicians that there is an F-19 on board. Very few people know
about it. Oh yeah, I know: no secrets on an aircraft carrier. Just keep on believing that.

Second, the F-19 is kept hidden. Whoops, oh yeah, can't hide an airplane on an aircraft carrier. Just keep on believing that.

Third, the F-19 is only launched at night. And a limited number of people know about it.

Now if you insist on claiming that we can't keep sailors quiet, then tell me how TWA 800 was blown up from a naval vessel and some STILL think it was
an arcing fuel pump (what total drivel).

Originally posted by johnlear
Lets assume there is a mass landing. We have to ask why?

My best guess would be that they have tried to communicate with the people of earth, and failed. As you know the military suppresses this type of
activity, and maybe the aliens know this. Perhaps they feel the only way to get through to us and send us a clear message, (without the military
interference) is to make it real obvious. We certainly haven't taken the hint, that they're here, and maybe for very good reason, as our planet is
getting destroyed, and they perhaps know the end result, and our trying to warn us of impending danger.

Originally posted by johnlear
Lets assume there is a mass landing. We have to ask why?

My best guess would be that they have tried to communicate with the people of earth, and failed. As you know the military suppresses this type of
activity, and maybe the aliens know this. Perhaps they feel the only way to get through to us and send us a clear message, (without the military
interference) is to make it real obvious. We certainly haven't taken the hint, that they're here, and maybe for very good reason, as our planet is
getting destroyed, and they perhaps know the end result, and our trying to warn us of impending danger.

Originally posted by johnlear
Now if you insist on claiming that we can't keep sailors quiet, then tell me how TWA 800 was blown up from a naval vessel and some STILL think it was
an arcing fuel pump (what total drivel).

Good points John. Do you have any thoughts as to what the F-19 was used for on its deployment? Just testing operations, or was it to be used for
combat missions?

Originally posted by Ghost01
Wait, the crash that killed Gen. Bond was intentional?

Why?

In my opinion the F-19 was classified above Gen. Bond's level. He accidentally discovered the existence of the F-19 in 1977 during a tour with Ben
Rich at the Skunk Works where it was being designed. (Skunk Works, Rich & Janos ISBN 0-316-74330-5 Pages 48-49).

What was to be gained by killing Gen. Bond?
Tim

To shut him up about the F-19. There is something about the F-19 that is so secret that even today, 25 years later, it is a well kept secret; as well
kept as the secret that the Skunks Works produces many what we call "UFO's".

The Mig 23 crash story was pure bs. Gen. Bond was killed in an F-19.

I believe that in my lifetime I will eventually find out why the F-19 was such a secret. But I don't know now. I believe it had something to do with
the fact that I think that Ben Rich was Mossads 'mole' in the Skunk Works.

Watch this thread carefully as the professional F-19 debunkers move in.

Originally posted by sp00ner
F-19 as a secret? The same F-19 that was a video game back in the early 80's? Or am I misunderstanding something? I quickly read the previous posts
so excuse me if I missed somethings along the way.

We are talking about the Lockheed F-19 that was produced side by side with the Lockheed F-117A. The F-117A was an Air Force airplane the F-19 was a
carrier based Navy airplane. For some reason the F-19 was much more secret than the F-117A. I don't know why. Yet.

Since the unification of the numbering system in 1962, U.S. fighters have been designated by consecutive numbers, beginning with the F-1 Fury.
F-13 was never assigned (presumably due to triskaidekaphobia among pilots, who are notoriously superstitious), but after the F/A-18 Hornet, the next
announced aircraft was the F-20 Tigershark.

Originally posted by sp00ner
F-19 as a secret? The same F-19 that was a video game back in the early 80's? Or am I misunderstanding something? I quickly read the previous posts
so excuse me if I missed somethings along the way.

We are talking about the Lockheed F-19 that was produced side by side with the Lockheed F-117A. The F-117A was an Air Force airplane the F-19 was a
carrier based Navy airplane. For some reason the F-19 was much more secret than the F-117A. I don't know why. Yet.

Yes, I understand that, but I was a little confused at the 'secret' statement. You implied it was, even still, 'secret'. I was wondering what that
meant exactly, since there was toys and video games of the F-19 back in the day.

Originally posted by sp00ner
Yes, I understand that, but I was a little confused at the 'secret' statement. You implied it was, even still, 'secret'. I was wondering what that
meant exactly, since there was toys and video games of the F-19 back in the day.

The airplane itself is still secret. Nobody has a picture of it. Nobody will admit it exists. But it does.

My opinion of the toys and video games and the Monogram model is that in somebodys infinite and apparently very accurate wisdom 'they' flooded the
market with F-19 stuff, including model airplanes, to make absolutely certain that nobody thought they were hiding anything. Even the Monogram model I
believe to be almost exactly what the real F-19 look like. The disinformation program was sheer genius in my opinion.

Hmm... as a kid I always heard of the F-19 and not the F-117... you say they were built side by side? Perhaps that was the point? Show the F-19 all
day while you build the F-117 with less fanfare?

Usually a flight simulator about a top secret plane is stopped dead in the tracks, but in this case, the simulator, toys, models, etc, etc, etc...
all available. Hell, I got the F-19 model on a tour of Cape Canaveral. That plane is what got me into sims, I think the game was by Janes even.

I don't know if we're still talking about Schnider at this point or not but I've read through some of his articles and seen a few videos of his
lectures. At first I was caught up in the secrecy and mystery of his stories but eventually I starting to suspect he was a fraud.

Let's say for arguments sake aliens are real, I honestly don't think you could "stumble" upon a group of underground Grey aliens by drilling a
hole through a cave wall. As technically and mentally advanced/aware as they are, I'm sure they would have noticed that this was happening or at the
very least felt the tremors...and maybe just left. What about their UFO's? No fly overs that noticed humans with giant burrowing machines around the
area of their secret base?

Greys are said to be telepathic...yet a whole group of them didn't see Phil and Co. coming?

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