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Only 5% of them need to be sold at that price to fully cover all of the ACtM debt.Once that debt is settled the remaining shares or BTC will likely be given to a safe third party for distribution to the victims of Uyko. This is entirely legal and right.

You don't get my point. In a worst case scenario I expect the rest of Ukyo's wealth to be distributed proportionately to us, the debtees. It is not in our interest that one entity gets his isolated cut before.

I suggest to create a new closed thread dedicated to Ukyo.Loan debtees to discuss the resolution constructively. That closed thread should be accessed by Ukyo plus deptees above a significant amount only. I would say a reasonable minimum is 10 BTC? Any opinions on that? I have the impression that everyone wants to have a word in that and the lower the involved amount is, the more non-constructive the words are. Do we have a list of BTC addresses who are involved into Ukyo.Loan?

Only 5% of them need to be sold at that price to fully cover all of the ACtM debt.Once that debt is settled the remaining shares or BTC will likely be given to a safe third party for distribution to the victims of Uyko. This is entirely legal and right.

You don't get my point. In a worst case scenario I expect the rest of Ukyo's wealth to be distributed proportionately to us, the debtees. It is not in our interest that one entity gets his isolated cut before.

I suggest to create a new closed thread dedicated to Ukyo.Loan debtees to discuss the resolution constructively. That closed thread should be accessed by Ukyo plus deptees above a significant amount only. I would say a reasonable minimum is 10 BTC? Any opinions on that? I have the impression that everyone wants to have a word in that and the lower the involved amount is, the more non-constructive the words are. Do we have a list of BTC addresses who are involved into Ukyo.Loan?

So there is 128 addresses/people in total that have loaned Ukyo money in his loan and we are for example 14 people that have 4000 or more shares, 23 with 2000 or more shares and 36 that have 1000 or more shares.

Only 5% of them need to be sold at that price to fully cover all of the ACtM debt.Once that debt is settled the remaining shares or BTC will likely be given to a safe third party for distribution to the victims of Uyko. This is entirely legal and right.

You don't get my point. In a worst case scenario I expect the rest of Ukyo's wealth to be distributed proportionately to us, the debtees. It is not in our interest that one entity gets his isolated cut before.

I suggest to create a new closed thread dedicated to Ukyo.Loan debtees to discuss the resolution constructively. That closed thread should be accessed by Ukyo plus deptees above a significant amount only. I would say a reasonable minimum is 10 BTC? Any opinions on that? I have the impression that everyone wants to have a word in that and the lower the involved amount is, the more non-constructive the words are. Do we have a list of BTC addresses who are involved into Ukyo.Loan?

So there is 128 addresses/people in total that have loaned Ukyo money in his loan and we are for example 14 people that have 4000 or more shares, 23 with 2000 or more shares and 36 that have 1000 or more shares.

I suggest including the Graet.Loan people in this discussion if it will happen as the groups likely overlap.

I suggest to create a new closed thread dedicated to Ukyo.Loan debtees to discuss the resolution constructively. That closed thread should be accessed by Ukyo plus deptees above a significant amount only. I would say a reasonable minimum is 10 BTC?

This sounds like a good idea. Can you set this up?

I'm more than happy to do that (although I started to enjoy the "ignore" function in this thread).

A threshold of 10BTC was just a random suggestion without knowing the affected addresses. So ~10BTC would qualify 36 addresses. Is this acceptable? I'm just so bored of some non-constructive disrupting entities.

I suggest including the Graet.Loan people in this discussion if it will happen as the groups likely overlap.

I would suggest to stick with those 36 people (?) for the beginning and concentrate on a constructive process between Ukyo and its Ukyo.Loan debtees. No WeEx and no Graet.Loan. We can of course discuss the inclusion of more people in that thread.

I suggest to create a new closed thread dedicated to Ukyo.Loan debtees to discuss the resolution constructively. That closed thread should be accessed by Ukyo plus deptees above a significant amount only. I would say a reasonable minimum is 10 BTC?

This sounds like a good idea. Can you set this up?

I'm more than happy to do that (although I started to enjoy the "ignore" function in this thread).

A threshold of 10BTC was just a random suggestion without knowing the affected addresses. So ~10BTC would qualify 36 addresses. Is this acceptable? I'm just so bored of some non-constructive disrupting entities.

I suggest including the Graet.Loan people in this discussion if it will happen as the groups likely overlap.

I would suggest to stick with those 36 people (?) for the beginning and concentrate on a constructive process between Ukyo and its Ukyo.Loan debtees. No WeEx and no Graet.Loan. We can of course discuss the inclusion of more people in that thread.

No one bondholder is more important than the rest, regardless of size of debt. In any distribution, it would be proportional. IMO, the bets course of action is to get Ukyo to liquidate assets to pay bondholders, since this is what he used it for anyway. Assets may include bitcoin-denominated stocks, rights to ownership of invested projects, etc.

No one bondholder is more important than the rest, regardless of size of debt.

No one questions this. And this is also one motivation of becoming active. Entities are getting their part of the pie before the rest (I refer to that Activemining situation).

There are people involved with >100BTC in Ukyo.Loan. Considering the available information, sitting around and waiting seems to me no more viable. We all have the same interest in this story. It seems to me natural to aggregate resources and come together (with Ukyo) in a constructive discussion to a viable solution.

A thread where people are repeating non constructive accusations, verbal harassments and even personal threats (or was it the WeEx thread… I might mix them up) is no space for a constructive discussion with Ukyo. Going into a closed thread with a reasonable threshold seemed to me a attempt to find a progressing solution. Again: Nobody will put their interests above others! It's just about making progress. At the end everybody will be treated equally. I just want to find together a reasonable strategy for this story.

If you have a better solution I'm more than happy to learn about it. I'm so sorry but I came to a part where just sitting around and waiting with no information is no more viable for me.

No one bondholder is more important than the rest, regardless of size of debt.

No one questions this. And this is also one motivation of becoming active. Entities are getting their part of the pie before the rest (I refer to that Activemining situation).

There are people involved with >100BTC in Ukyo.Loan. Considering the available information, sitting around and waiting seems to me no more viable. We all have the same interest in this story. It seems to me natural to aggregate resources and come together (with Ukyo) in a constructive discussion to a viable solution.

A thread where people are repeating non constructive accusations, verbal harassments and even personal threats (or was it the WeEx thread… I might mix them up) is no space for a constructive discussion with Ukyo. Going into a closed thread with a reasonable threshold seemed to me a attempt to find a progressing solution. Again: Nobody will put their interests above others! It's just about making progress. At the end everybody will be treated equally. I just want to find together a reasonable strategy for this story.

If you have a better solution I'm more than happy to learn about it. I'm so sorry but I came to a part where just sitting around and waiting with no information is no more viable for me.

Proportional hits are a standard. Whatever is done, make sure it is constructive.

Even though I only own about 400 shares I think this is a really good idea. I can understand that Ukyo doesn't want to post here with all the trolls around. So we should try to establish a reasonable discussion and this is a good way to do so!

Even though I only own about 400 shares I think this is a really good idea. I can understand that Ukyo doesn't want to post here with all the trolls around. So we should try to establish a reasonable discussion and this is a good way to do so!

I'm a large holder, a new thread is useless. Just say/do what you have to say/do.

No trolls matter unless you let them matter. Stop distracting yourselves with it.

I gave my suggestions, has anyone approached Ukyo about liquidating assets? Has anyone researched what assets he held on Bitfunder, etc? I know he owns stocks in several ongoing concerns.

Ukyo, will you answer this? Can you liquidate your crypto-stocks to make a proportional buyback and dividend payout to ukyo.loan holders? Do you need help with liquidation?

Even though I only own about 400 shares I think this is a really good idea. I can understand that Ukyo doesn't want to post here with all the trolls around. So we should try to establish a reasonable discussion and this is a good way to do so!

I'm a large holder, a new thread is useless. Just say/do what you have to say/do.

No trolls matter unless you let them matter. Stop distracting yourselves with it.

I gave my suggestions, has anyone approached Ukyo about liquidating assets? Has anyone researched what assets he held on Bitfunder, etc? I know he owns stocks in several ongoing concerns.

Ukyo, will you answer this? Can you liquidate your crypto-stocks to make a proportional buyback and dividend payout to ukyo.loan holders? Do you need help with liquidation?

I haven't checked exactly what Ukyo had for assets on Bitfuder before today, did he have several account or only one ? Did he have large private investments in stocks off the official books like some thought in another thread where they tried to trace transactions from bitfunder, 5000 btc or something i think it was they mentioned sent to one asset that was listed on Bitfunder ?

From what i can see based on last prices (in the case of prices that is from bitfunder on stocks that haven't relisted on other exchanges many of those stocks prices were pressed down a lot in price at the time), then in the account i think one can tie to him he had assets/shares valued in the region of 1500 btc based on that but some of the assets might be problematic to liquidate fast and other he may have to go the legal way to get what is his like in the Activeminer case where Ken slaghter illegally dumped/force sold Ukyo shares, at least he claimed it was ukyo shares he sold.

guys, i need ukyo's company registration paper ...because I am going to find a lawyer to get back our BTC back. if anyone knows ,please share it with me ,thanks !!!

Or by costing him legal fees you will ruin us all.

How long do you plan to wait before you would consider that your money has been stolen. It has been about 3 months. So what then, wait another 3 months? 6? A year even?Would you even then, after a year, start to suspect your money was stolen? All the indicators point to this being the case, good luck with Jon coming back in the future and returning your money

It's a tough choice. He claims he has the money invested in new business ventures and that those investments should eventually return a profit allowing him to pay back the loan. Unfortunately he won't tell us what these ventures are or what their status is.

Since he has owned or ran several businesses in his life, he likely has some assets. If you sue him and he declares bankruptcy as a result, you won't get his house. The courts will likely let him keep that. But you may get something. After the lawyers take their giant share though. Before you do that, you should get a good idea of what his assets are.

I think I am still ukyo's biggest creditor, and I'm one of many. Ukyo's total liabilities are estimated at $2-$3 million between ukyo.loan and bitfunder. I'm getting a bit frustrated too. The well over hundred thousand that ukyo owes me would definitely make it worth my time to get the best lawyer I could find if I decide to go that route. Whatever you do, make sure you've thought it out very clearly first. You might end up costing yourself more money that you get out of it.

Do you want to join me with this ?the total liabilities from u and me is around 40k USD, and the legal cost for two of us should be the same as only one . it is worth to give a try, I think stay and waiting here would be useless. what you think?

I would, but I haven't decided definitely to go that route yet. I sent a message to ukyo a few days ago and I'm going to give him a chance to respond first.

Dear Mgio:I would give him more time thought, the cost and time I spend to Dallas isn't cheap , but Ukyo never reply My message, I do not know about u ?did he reply to u ?

guys, i need ukyo's company registration paper ...because I am going to find a lawyer to get back our BTC back. if anyone knows ,please share it with me ,thanks !!!

Or by costing him legal fees you will ruin us all.

How long do you plan to wait before you would consider that your money has been stolen. It has been about 3 months. So what then, wait another 3 months? 6? A year even?Would you even then, after a year, start to suspect your money was stolen? All the indicators point to this being the case, good luck with Jon coming back in the future and returning your money

It's a tough choice. He claims he has the money invested in new business ventures and that those investments should eventually return a profit allowing him to pay back the loan. Unfortunately he won't tell us what these ventures are or what their status is.

Since he has owned or ran several businesses in his life, he likely has some assets. If you sue him and he declares bankruptcy as a result, you won't get his house. The courts will likely let him keep that. But you may get something. After the lawyers take their giant share though. Before you do that, you should get a good idea of what his assets are.

I think I am still ukyo's biggest creditor, and I'm one of many. Ukyo's total liabilities are estimated at $2-$3 million between ukyo.loan and bitfunder. I'm getting a bit frustrated too. The well over hundred thousand that ukyo owes me would definitely make it worth my time to get the best lawyer I could find if I decide to go that route. Whatever you do, make sure you've thought it out very clearly first. You might end up costing yourself more money that you get out of it.

Do you want to join me with this ?the total liabilities from u and me is around 40k USD, and the legal cost for two of us should be the same as only one . it is worth to give a try, I think stay and waiting here would be useless. what you think?

I would, but I haven't decided definitely to go that route yet. I sent a message to ukyo a few days ago and I'm going to give him a chance to respond first.

Dear Mgio:I would give him more time thought, the cost and time I spend to Dallas isn't cheap , but Ukyo never reply My message, I do not know about u ?did he reply to u ?

The last I heard from him was at the end of January. That was before the MtGox collapse. If his new business venture was taking over business for MtGox in the US, then that is all lost now. In that case, the only thing left to do would be to contact our lawyers and force him to liquidate his remaining assets to pay off the loan. There is a possibility that his business ventures were not tied to MtGox, but until I hear from him otherwise, I'm going to assume that that isn't the case. I messaged him about two weeks ago and I haven't heard anything back yet. I'll give him another week or two. I'm sure he is really busy but he should at least be able to spend the time keeping in contact with his creditors. The total value of ukyo.loan is still well over a million dollars.

At the time he claimed to be working to get the necessary state-level MSB licensing and was preparing to have WeExchange take over the USD side of Mt Gox's businesses.

I am sure that this is the reason why he needed the loan.

I doubt that was the case, then they should have been able to start up with those states that don't need licensing much faster and the cost/timeframe for the remaining 43 states don't seem to match the loan size or time frame passed with what cryptsy and btcquick mentioned about the licensing subject. But maby the ide with such possible project on weexchange is only to present the project when there already registered in all states and when they could work on the whole USA market. If that was the thought to act as a payment gateway to the FIAT/USD market in the USA then other actors in the btcsector than the now defunct mtgox could benefit from that in the future.

If there actually is such thing in the process then there's a huge trust issue for weexchange/Ukyo to work on now after how things have been handled the last couple of months.

guys, i need ukyo's company registration paper ...because I am going to find a lawyer to get back our BTC back. if anyone knows ,please share it with me ,thanks !!!

Or by costing him legal fees you will ruin us all.

How long do you plan to wait before you would consider that your money has been stolen. It has been about 3 months. So what then, wait another 3 months? 6? A year even?Would you even then, after a year, start to suspect your money was stolen? All the indicators point to this being the case, good luck with Jon coming back in the future and returning your money

It's a tough choice. He claims he has the money invested in new business ventures and that those investments should eventually return a profit allowing him to pay back the loan. Unfortunately he won't tell us what these ventures are or what their status is.

Since he has owned or ran several businesses in his life, he likely has some assets. If you sue him and he declares bankruptcy as a result, you won't get his house. The courts will likely let him keep that. But you may get something. After the lawyers take their giant share though. Before you do that, you should get a good idea of what his assets are.

I think I am still ukyo's biggest creditor, and I'm one of many. Ukyo's total liabilities are estimated at $2-$3 million between ukyo.loan and bitfunder. I'm getting a bit frustrated too. The well over hundred thousand that ukyo owes me would definitely make it worth my time to get the best lawyer I could find if I decide to go that route. Whatever you do, make sure you've thought it out very clearly first. You might end up costing yourself more money that you get out of it.

Do you want to join me with this ?the total liabilities from u and me is around 40k USD, and the legal cost for two of us should be the same as only one . it is worth to give a try, I think stay and waiting here would be useless. what you think?

I would, but I haven't decided definitely to go that route yet. I sent a message to ukyo a few days ago and I'm going to give him a chance to respond first.

Dear Mgio:I would give him more time thought, the cost and time I spend to Dallas isn't cheap , but Ukyo never reply My message, I do not know about u ?did he reply to u ?

The last I heard from him was at the end of January. That was before the MtGox collapse. If his new business venture was taking over business for MtGox in the US, then that is all lost now. In that case, the only thing left to do would be to contact our lawyers and force him to liquidate his remaining assets to pay off the loan. There is a possibility that his business ventures were not tied to MtGox, but until I hear from him otherwise, I'm going to assume that that isn't the case. I messaged him about two weeks ago and I haven't heard anything back yet. I'll give him another week or two. I'm sure he is really busy but he should at least be able to spend the time keeping in contact with his creditors. The total value of ukyo.loan is still well over a million dollars.

I am going fly to Dallas this sunday, I have contact with a attorney already, I made a pointment with him by monday morning, Hope I can get some wise suggestion from him.

At the time he claimed to be working to get the necessary state-level MSB licensing and was preparing to have WeExchange take over the USD side of Mt Gox's businesses.

I am sure that this is the reason why he needed the loan.

I doubt that was the case, then they should have been able to start up with those states that don't need licensing much faster and the cost/timeframe for the remaining 43 states don't seem to match the loan size or time frame passed with what cryptsy and btcquick mentioned about the licensing subject. But maby the ide with such possible project on weexchange is only to present the project when there already registered in all states and when they could work on the whole USA market. If that was the thought to act as a payment gateway to the FIAT/USD market in the USA then other actors in the btcsector than the now defunct mtgox could benefit from that in the future.

If there actually is such thing in the process then there's a huge trust issue for weexchange/Ukyo to work on now after how things have been handled the last couple of months.

Ukyo did have an intention to integrate with Gox around last summer. I was shown a mock-up of the integration page by Ukyo back then. But that project seemed to just die, with the Bitfunder problems starting a few months later, so not sure if there is a link there or not. However, i do believe it inconceivable that Ukyo did not have funds on Gox.

Whats the amount of bitcoins owed for ukyo loan? Did the loan run under ukyo personally alone or was a company involved? And do you think that the stock-like thing of selling shares will have an impact legally?

Whats the amount of bitcoins owed for ukyo loan? Did the loan run under ukyo personally alone or was a company involved? And do you think that the stock-like thing of selling shares will have an impact legally?

Whats the amount of bitcoins owed for ukyo loan? Did the loan run under ukyo personally alone or was a company involved? And do you think that the stock-like thing of selling shares will have an impact legally?

I believe it's 2000btc.

Ah... not bad... together with the 6k from weexchange its a big amount.