Well Matt, we'll just have to collectively stimulate the economy elsewhere as we shoot at Havasu, Mohave, Redlands and Purgie. Won't be the same, but at least we won't have to shoot cans off of fence posts.

What's that old saying, one door closes and another opens? Given enough time and effort by the right folks, at some point in the hopefully near future, we'll shooting ATA targets again in Las Vegas.

The historic places like Vandalia, Phoenix, and now Las Vegas can never be replaced they can only have something try to takes its place and thats a tall order that will probably never be filled ... Sparta was built to replace Vandalia and to this day there are people who are saying it will never be the same, some even say its better ... You never know, you know ..? WPT ... (YAC) ...

The county's business plan does not call for them to sponsor events - they expect others to organize events and pay them a facility fee. So unless someone steps up to put on ATA events, leagues, etc there will be no competitive events.

The "Public Phase" (the only one funded) has 25 skeet/trap fields. The soft opening was last weekend and the official opening is planned for mid Jan.

Any expansion beyond the current "Public Phase" will have to be funded by outside organizations or profits from operations.

They are already $900,000+ in debt as they had to "borrow" tax payer money to pay for fixtures, furniture, vehicles, maintenance equipment, etc that had not been factored into their $60+ million dollar budget. They cannot afford to hire employees for operations and are appealing to the community for volunteers to assist with day to day operations. So unless someone gives them a pot of money, don't expect anything beyond the initial phase.

It is very nice. It was built for something big. They have 24 skeet/trap overlays, and in the pamphlet that we picked up, they have plans for extending it 24 more in the same line, and then 48 more in front of the original traps. There is soooo much room. They have camping hook ups, closer to the traps than the parking in Sparta. The yardage markers are inlaid in the concrete. The building in the above picture is the Shotgun center. When we were there, they were planting trees behind all the trapfields. There is an archery range, rifle/pistol range about a mile or so north of the trap fields.

Steve Carmichael, the manager of the Las Vegas Gun Club mentioned in a thread last Fall that he had tried to work something out. At that time the Clark County folks wanted too much money for supplying targets, etc. Perhaps he could share what he knows so we can judge how far we might be from a reasonable number we could work with. Ron Renouf

I have looked into the potential of hosting NSSA tournaments at the new facility; the same rules and fees apply for ATA tournaments. As of today here are the policies:

CCSP will not host tournaments regardless if they are trap, skeet, archery, handgun, rifle or else wise. They only want to sell targets to a 'Registered User Group' who will assume full responsibility and liability for operation of the tournament.

To be a Registered User you must be a bonafied business or association. You must purchase $1,000,000 in general liability insurance. Targets will be sold to you for a price of $30.00 per case of 135. The price does not include referees, only targets and a target boy to keep the machines full. You have to pay to bring in your own professional referee. You pay for all shrinkage (broken, view targets, setting machines, etc). You must pay to bring in portable toilets. You must pay to bring in an extra garbage dumpster and if you are going to have vendors you must pay to have a CCSP approved security agency onsite overnight to assure that the vendors products are not stolen. Vendors must pay CCSP an extra fee (I don't remember exactly but it is like $25). If you would like to hold a banquet, they have facilities available that you can rent. You can bring in your own caterer or they have food service staff.

Any of you guys see any connection to their "selling" targets at 30 bucks a case? I think those advising on the rental rates have a few misconceptions of how clay target games are governed. I can see their reasoning now; Well,, the club just up the path charged 30 bucks a case and made money???? What a joke. Mentioning paid "referees" says skeet shooters was advising somewhere along the line too. They will eventually figure it out or wind up with a ghost club.

Maybe the ATA could work with one of the casinos to help sponsor shoot(s) with a package deal for room rates, coupons for shows/meals/car rentals, etc.

I have read that 'Vegas is hurting due to the economy. Now here is a venue that appears to have the potential to become a "destination" and marketed. Shooters and a promoter would, it seems, win. One can just imagine, if it were someow "legal" from a tax status and legal standpoint: "The ATA and the (Bling-Bling Hotel) Present The Nevada Grand"...

One can, for example, also look up Wendover, Nevada/Utah. Way off the beaten path, yet people east of the area are offered very resonable packages to fly in and stay. Why? Gambling and entertainment are desired recreational activities.

Must admit: I am not from a business background at all and could certainly be accused of "running my mouth" here, so I hope a successful business person can give some feedback.

I may be wrong on who posted, but I think some time back the person running the Vegas club said that Casino support for shooting events was no longer something that Casino's wished to support. Not enough bang for the buck...

But who knows, as times change and it may be worth a shot, but first, there has to be agreement on what they are going to charge to hold a shoot, as it stands now, much to expensive and a sure money loser...

Joe...I think of, for example, Terible Herbst supporting off-road racing, the Mint supporting off-road racing, etc. Years and years ago, I believe some casinos were supportive, that is gave breaks in rates to, offroad motorcycle racers riding Barstow to Vegas. Seems to me shotgunners that fly, or in any way travel to 'Vegas, will be well-heeled enough to make support profitable for Clark County after all numbers crunched.