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Not sure on what union company you work for but I have friends at Hill and Hussmann and I'm going to interview with Hill next week, my friend gets 45+ a week in the winter over there. My other friend at Hussmann said they are banking on some Vons stores, I sure hope they can get them!

Hills looking. So best of luck on the interview!

My worry with Hill and Hussmann is, they're large company's like Source. And when the office gets too big....I've seen it first hand, go from good to bad.

I'm at CRS, a small shop down here who's based outta Hayward in Northern Cali.

My apprenticeship training courses in NO WAY prepared me for the job I do every day.

Not the 5 years of schooling

Not the STAR exam

Not the continuing education courses

Nothing.

Now, I've spent my own time, on this site, on the internet, in the books that I compulsively collect and read, on the RSES website reading the SAM manual and you want to talk about education....

So, in short, the union's apprenticeship program didn't do a lot to prepare me for the job that I do today.

I'm not saying that it made me who I am either but it did push me to go to school for 2 times a week from 6-9pm it makes you want to learn for the money. I agree 90% of my training came from the field learning and watching my supervisor. I feel that the union will give you better morals then a new kid not coming up in the union! I have seen people come and go but they guys that go thru the apprenticeship seem to do better in their career.

I'm not saying that it made me who I am either but it did push me to go to school for 2 times a week from 6-9pm it makes you want to learn for the money. I agree 90% of my training came from the field learning and watching my supervisor. I feel that the union will give you better morals then a new kid not coming up in the union! I have seen people come and go but they guys that go thru the apprenticeship seem to do better in their career.

My experience is the exact opposite of this.

My experience is that those who go through the apprenticeship have the same "gimme" mentality that too many in this country have.

They expect the "cushy" jobs and big money without having to put in the blood, sweat and effort to EARN their way to those jobs.

They have the mindset to do just enough to get by rather than doing whatever is necessary to do the job and, when called on it, fall back on the union to "rescue" them.

By comparison, those that have worked outside the union and get a life experience credit transfer into the union tend to work harder and are more willing to put in the time and effort to build their skills on their own time and to continuously advance their skills and knowledge.

My experience is that those who go through the apprenticeship have the same "gimme" mentality that too many in this country have.

They expect the "cushy" jobs and big money without having to put in the blood, sweat and effort to EARN their way to those jobs.

They have the mindset to do just enough to get by rather than doing whatever is necessary to do the job and, when called on it, fall back on the union to "rescue" them.

By comparison, those that have worked outside the union and get a life experience credit transfer into the union tend to work harder and are more willing to put in the time and effort to build their skills on their own time and to continuously advance their skills and knowledge.

As I said, this is my experience and your mileage may vary.

What really gets me is when a non union tech comes into the union and gets his journeyman card with little to no effort... This has nothing to do with phase loss. The standard should be they have to take the UA apprentice test as well as the UA STAR exam. Most of the new Journeyman all have to do it but why shouldn't they?? If a guy comes from non union I'm all for it, thats just making our union stronger, but they should have to do the same as the other journeyman do..

What really gets me is when a non union tech comes into the union and gets his journeyman card with little to no effort... This has nothing to do with phase loss. The standard should be they have to take the UA apprentice test as well as the UA STAR exam. Most of the new Journeyman all have to do it but why shouldn't they?? If a guy comes from non union I'm all for it, thats just making our union stronger, but they should have to do the same as the other journeyman do..

When I joined Local 230 down here in San Diego, I had a year to take the same test that an apprentice does when he turns out in order to keep my journeyman card.

So Hillphoenix is Union in CA? I was told that they're non-Union here. Guys at Source (and even non-Union Hussmann here) tend to compare their 60 Hrs paychecks to 40 Hrs Union shops paychecks. Of course, the 60 is higher, but the Union shops are about $5/Hr higher. I'd rather work for a Union shop at 40 Hrs with two pensions and health & welfare paid for. I'm not going to complain about paying membership dues and working dues because it is what it is.

What really gets me is when a non union tech comes into the union and gets his journeyman card with little to no effort... This has nothing to do with phase loss. The standard should be they have to take the UA apprentice test as well as the UA STAR exam. Most of the new Journeyman all have to do it but why shouldn't they?? If a guy comes from non union I'm all for it, thats just making our union stronger, but they should have to do the same as the other journeyman do..

I came from non union side 10+ years ago. When I came over , they asked others in the trade about me, I spoke with the people hiring me,and blamo,I became a "journeyman" (whatever that means)

I never went through the union schooling.I know many that have also worked around it as I have. Some of these guys are the best in the trade. I know guys that are union for life that are awesome, I know lifers that are dumb ass hell.

Just because you spend time in a room with another guy talking to you , means NOTHING.

Not everyone takes the same path from A-B , but when we arrive , it's all the same. We all pay our dues in different ways. ( I know , I payed mine)

Being a tech union/non-union and learning in the field, could be argued, is a better way to learn.

Can't we all just get along? SoCal HP is the best ever,the rest suck(flame suit on)