Please indent your posts with ":" if replying to an existing topic (or "::" if replying to a reply).

I will generally respond here to comments that are posted here, rather than replying via your Talk page (or the article Talk page, if you are writing to me here about an article), so you may want to Watch this page until you are responded to, or specifically let me know where you'd prefer the reply.

Moving articles

Re. "Joseph Wright 19??", just to let you know you should be able to untick the box "Leave a redirect behind" when you move something so there is no redirect left behind for me to delete! --Mith(Talk/Contribs/Edits) 16:37, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Good, I'll try think about that in the future (thought it only worked with images)! --Morgan 16:51, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

I've been thinking about that too - it would be good to have. From what I can remember, we only have (in the case of translations of The Hobbit), the list on the main article itself. Is a sub-page a good option in this case, or would a totally separate article be better (like "The Hobbit translations" perhaps "Index:The Hobbit translations")? --Morgan 11:03, 19 January 2012 (UTC)

I should also say that I think some translations merit their own article, like Hompen.--Morgan 11:06, 19 January 2012 (UTC)

I don't think it should be an index. "Translations of The Hobbit" and "Translations of The Lord of the Rings" etc. should be fine. I agree that some translations should have their own articles where appropriate.-- KingAragorn talk contribs edits email 12:15, 19 January 2012 (UTC)

It's a very old article, before we started being careful about sources. I had some source back then, but I can't be bothered to find it. Just tag the page with delete if it's questioned.--18:35, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

After looking at the history of the article I see you did add a few sources to the article. Unfortunally it only showed "testa". So I've removed the questioned sentences. --Amroth 19:34, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

While attempting to find a source, I found a Googlecatch entry of the old site by accident:

The Tolkien Journal

It's just all their books are re-releases from the 80s and this one looks old like the others. I can't find any record of it being out before, though (unless it was under a different title). --Mith(Talk/Contribs/Edits) 12:05, 30 June 2012 (UTC)

Pal. quote reference.

The reference is from page 422 of Unfinished Tales, The Palantiri ch;

Saruman had no doubt from his investigations gained knowledge of the Stones, things that would attract his attention, and had become convinced that the Orthanc-stone was still intact in its tower.

Thanks, Maclaren. I've restored your sentence after checking the reference. For future edits, just let me know if you're uncertain about how to add references using the templates and codes -- I would be glad to offer any kind of help.--Morgan 16:12, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

By the way, I didn't add a page number to the reference since the pagination differs between different editions of Unfinished Tales. Our UT template is fairly detailed, however, so it shouldn't be any trouble for people to check a reference just pointing to a section in this book.--Morgan 16:14, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

By the same logic we need to have permission for all covers used on TG. Has anyone contacted HarperCollins etc for permission to use their covers? New Line Cinema? --Morgan 18:22, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

There are numerous channels through which you could have communicated your point; talking is better than vandalising. We don't need permission from every single organisation whose work we use - fairuse is there and we should use it (and not abuse it). My rationale behind contacting the E.L.F. and the Mythopoeic Society (and Mith has sought permission from the Tolkien Society) is simple: they are Tolkien fans like you and I, and they are likely to give us permission. Therefore I'm operating on the principle that if I can contact the copyright holder (in hope of obtaining permission to use their work) then I will. Even if I could contact HarperCollins and New Line Cinema, their lawyers have better things to do than grant (or refuse!) individual requests from organisations like us.-- KingAragorn talk contribs edits email 19:01, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

No, you should have made it clear about extending this rationale to include covers of publications, in a meeting, for example. Changing the status of cover images to "will be deleted" is very frustrating when you have spent a lot of time compiling/scanning such; every Tolkien-related website or blog (scholarly or non-scholarly) I've come across assumes it's fair use to reproduce covers of publications. --Morgan 19:17, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

I had honestly forgotten that Template:Copyright-unknown included the words "This file will be deleted unless...", and that's why I wish you had told me that this was your grievance in the first place (and let me reiterate that I'm still annoyed that you resorted to vandalism rather than coming to me to discuss it). Let me explain what happened today: I saw that you used Template:Fairuse-cover[former link] on File:Parma Eldalamberon 12.jpg and, because Template:Fairuse-cover should not be used on new images, I replaced it Template:Copyright-unknown. I then decided to tidy up the other Parma Eldalamberon covers (including giving them their own category) and in the process I added Template:Copyright-unknown to all of them as we will probably get permission soon.

There has been no change in policy; we've used the new system for covers of publications since the new system was first established. I'm perfectly happy to discuss how we handle copyright for publication covers, if that's what you want (although, if this is the case, I wish that we had held it sooner). I'm sorry if my actions have upset or frustrated you, but I suspect that you wouldn't have been so annoyed if you had simply contacted me about it.-- KingAragorn talk contribs edits email 19:45, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

Bombadil sentence

And why did you remove the sentence I added? -- User:Mclaren01 4:56 PM, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

Hi Mclaren01, you made a great point; but I think we need to include a reference to back up your statement. That way the reader knows where that idea comes from. --Hyarion 07:15, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

"He might do so, if all the free folk of the world begged him, but he would not understand the need" Gandalf, the Council of Elrond, pg 259 I Wrote the sentence as a summary of this statement by Gandalf about Bombadilo's mentality. If you have a clearer, etc, sentence in mind you can consider that instead. -- User:Mclaren01 11:03 AM, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification, Mclaren. I will take a look at the issue tomorrow.--Morgan 00:23, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

Mclaren, this is my conclusion: right now the first part of your addition would already be included in the preceding sentence (that is, Tom not being "fully aware of the struggle of Light and Darkness", equivalent to your "A mindset clear of conceptions of 'Good' and 'Evil'"). The One Ring hasn't been mentioned before in the article, and it would therefore take a major rewrite to include your last part (" he would not understand overtures to keep and conceal the One Ring himself if all the peoples of Middle-earth begged him to") at this point, since the section "War of the Ring" follows.--Morgan 23:57, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

Hobbit in French

Hello Morgan. I just see your message on my discussion page. It's a new translation, made by Daniel Lauzon (also translator of the HoMe 3 at 5). I've change the url you've added for another where Daniel Lauzon have answering some questions and enlighted some of his choices. Druss 13:01, 1 January 2013 (UTC)

Black Speech

Hello there Morgan I was thinkong of bringong more details to the Black speech page but maybe it shouldn't be there where I put it so we must make a new Headline. However it would be nice if we could have a little bit more information about this language however rude he looked like.

Well, to me "ergative" is specialized linguistic terminology -- I'm not sure we need to include this on Tolkien Gateway and at the very least not just a quick mention. Fauskanger devotes a whole section of his article to the ergative case in relation to the Black Speech and Hurrian. If you find a good way to explain this in a simple way, it could possibly be included. I don't want to be the sole judge here! :) But IMHO think it suffices with a link to Fauskanger's article, for those wanting more detailed information.--Morgan 17:11, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

Ergative is a grammatical case that is used to explain the subject of transitive verb mostly in ergative-absolutive languages. But, alright if it's too complicated for TG then i will try to make more simple. However Tolkien himself was a philologist :)

We will end this conversation now, don't want to waste your time anymore.

New users

You don't need to add {{user}} to the user page of every new editor. It's only for those who write on talk pages and, therefore, leave a redlink lying around. --Mith(Talk/Contribs/Edits) 12:12, 19 January 2013 (UTC)