Episodes

Article Info

Tagged as:

Radio Free Mormon: 23: Dumbing Down Revelation

Radio Free Mormon tackles the pillar of revelation. In his normal RFM fashion, he lays out like a legal case the fact that Mormonism has gone from a religion that encouraged and expected its membership to have direct revelation from God, his son, and his angels to a faith that has stripped away any real dependenace or expectation of revelation. From handshakes to discern ministering angels to being told today that such things like a angelic visit or even a real voice not only should not be expected but simply won’t happen!!!!

22 thoughts on “Radio Free Mormon: 23: Dumbing Down Revelation”

I haven’t listened to the podcast yet, but I just wanted you to know in advance, how delighted I am to find a new post from you.

There is something wonderful in how you state things. I have never been a fan of snark, but your particular brand of snark has caused me to have a change of mind…… I love your snark!

Sometimes snark is a substitute for intelligent writing, but this is not the case with you. You cause me to think, laugh, and thoroughly enjoy your work as if were a good mystery novel, or good si-fy movie.

Anyway, ready to dive into the podcast, having a smirk of delight at the possibility of what you’ve uncovered this time.

Gale, I will second your post. It’s always a little treat of my day when RFM has a new podcast out. I enjoy his insight and intelligence. I agree with you on his presentation, it is like a well written short story that is entertaining to listen to. Well done RFM! And given the change up of leadership today I am sure you’ll have material for years to come, which suits me just fine. 🙂

I haven’t studied Joseph Smith as much as you have, but when he dismissed others’ visitations by angels, because real angels don’t have wings, did Joseph Smith not believe in Isaiah’s words when Isaiah wrote of the seraphim who are a type of angel? Or are Isaiah’s description of angels to be taken as figurative and not literally? Or was JS puffing smoke as he frequently did?

I believe that, in a section of the doctrine and covenants, there is a revelation/interpretation of Isaiah where in Joseph Smith indicates his understanding the wings are symbolic, and meant to suggest ability to move and travel.

Of course I liked the episode, and there was plenty of delicious snark to go around. I chuckled several times, and then you brought in the sage words of Stephen King, which I found to be quite sobering.

Angel “Honor Code”.
Bodies inanimate!
New revelation won’t contradict former revelation!
Diminishing areas in which we may receive personal revelation (don’t bother god with the small stuff like whom you should marry)

When I listened to your sound-bytes of Elder Oaks, I didn’t get any feeling of commitment behind his words. He seemed apologetic, even stumbling through it. It seemed like he was more interested in not saying anything that he could be held accountable for than he was in declaring the word of the Lord.

The more I listen to these men, the more I get this impression. They don’t even have confidence in their own words. And, they certainly don’t communicate that confidence to me either.

Experience has shown, at least as taught by the LDS Church, that once the sun goes down on the prophets, a reformation is not sufficient, but a restoration must take place.

I think the LDS Church has reached this point in the past 40-years.

There is no amount of reformation within the church that is going to take care of the problem.

And I think this may be an illustration of the parable about the talents; that those who failed to improve their talents not only don’t get what they could have had, but the original talent(s) given them are taken away, as well.

I am glad you like the Stephen King quote. If I didn’t enunciate it clearly enough, the actual quote is, “Fiction is the truth inside the lie.”

“Are you or one of your children a homosexual and looking to find justification for those feelings and tendencies that God created them that way instead of them choosing it?
I just find it odd that if all the issues one could choose to attack, this is the one you chose without explanation.”

The implications and assumptions of your question are troubling. The problem is not that people are looking for excuses or justifications for sexual orientation. The problem is that some religions – like ours – have fabricated a sin-narrative around sexuality that God has never done himself. Just like we fabricated the blacks-are-cursed-and/or-less-valiant narrative to justify the priesthood ban. In both cases, the church caused incalculable damage that deserves outrage and “attack”.

You don’t still believe that blacks are cursed and inferior, do you? If RFM “attacked” racism in 1974, would you have asked him a similar question? You may not have listened to Episode 262: “An Examination of the LDS Church’s Position on Homosexuality With Bryce Cook”, or explored the website linked in the show notes https://mormonlgbtquestions.com/ . Spend some time considering what and who Jesus did and didn’t condemn and then reflect on what is worth “attacking” and you will probably have the answer to your question.

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Your Message:

Your Name*

Your Email*

Testimonial

I feel like I know you, even though we’ve never communicated, because you have been a significant support in the faith journey of both my wife and my daughter. Thank you for your contribution to the dialogue, and for being a source of comfort and Community for those of us in my family undergoing a mormon faith journey.

Bryce C

Contact Bill Reel

To contact Bill Reel please email him directly at ReelMormon AT GMAIL DOT COM. Your feedback, comments, and suggestions are welcome and appreciated. Thank you for Listening and may the Lord warm your shoulders.

Find us On Facebook and Twitter

Mormon Discussion Book Store

Support the Podcast and Donate Today

Mormon Discussion Podcast supports listeners in their faith transition and encourages them to lead with faith. Donate today to a good cause while supporting Latter Day Saints like you! Your Donation is 100% tax deductible

Make your Amazon purchase from here to support the podcast

Featured Links

Requested Legal Disclaimer by the LDS Church

Mormon Discussion’s podcast production is certainly not connected to The Mormon Church aka The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. It also is most assuredly not approved or endorsed by Intellectual Reserve, Inc or The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

Any of the awesome content or the solid opinions expressed, implied or included in Mormon Discussion Inc’s awesome podcast lineup and production are solely those of Mormon Discussion Inc. and/or its program hosts and not those of Intellectual Reserve, Inc. or The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Mormon Discussion Inc is a 501(c)(3) and is in the arena of journalistic work and is part of a free press. A free press is fundamental to a democratic society. It seeks out and circulates news, information, ideas, comment and opinion and holds those in authority to account. The press provides the platform for a multiplicity of voices to be heard. At national, regional and local level, it is the public’s watchdog, activist and guardian as well as educator, entertainer and contemporary chronicler. Under the “fair use” defense, however, another author may make limited use of the original author’s work without asking permission. Fair use is based on the belief that the public is entitled to freely use portions of copyrighted materials for purposes of commentary and criticism.

The fair use privilege is perhaps the most significant limitation on a copyright owner’s exclusive rights.

Subject to some general limitations discussed later in this article, the following types of uses are usually deemed fair uses:

Criticism and commentary: for example, quoting or excerpting a work in a review or criticism for purposes of illustration or comment. A book reviewer would be permitted to quote passages from a book in a newspaper column, for example, as part of an examination of the book.

News reporting: such as summarizing an address or article, with brief quotations, in a news report. A journalist would be permitted to quote from a political speech’s text without the politician’s permission.

Research and scholarship: perhaps quoting a short passage in a scholarly, scientific, or technical work for illustration or clarification of the author’s observations. An art historian would be able to use an image of a painting in an academic article that analyzes the painting.

Nonprofit educational uses: for example, when teachers photocopy limited portions of written works for classroom use. An English teacher would be permitted to copy a few pages of a book to show to the class as part of a lesson plan.

Parody: that is, a work that ridicules another, usually well-known, work by imitating it in a comic way. A comedian could quote from a movie star’s speech in order to make fun of that star.