marielle wrote:Oh gods... Corona... I would have never had noticed if you haven't pointed that out!!!

I wanted to get back on the thigh and unyielding sea lanes to the habor... with Alice's case... she was a child when she was put into the Asylum, so it's easy to say that her habor had never been visited before she met Jasper... or do you think there had been pirates that made port with out permission?

I don't know about Alice. I assume she was a virgin and is the only one of the Cullen women that could have been so at the moment of transformation. Ugh, I don't want to think about docking without permission while she was human, but I suppose it is possible. Regardless, I tend to think of vamp to vamp contact as being more human to human, although there are different opinions concerning that. It's difficult to conceive of two slabs of concrete suddenly becoming malleable when in contact with each other, although I believe in SM's world that that is exactly what happens. It obviously didn't make a difference to Jasper, he never lost a battle, heh.

"It will take an amazing amount of control,” she mused. “More even than Carlisle has. He may be just strong enough…the only thing he’s not strong enough to do is stay away from her. That’s a lost cause.”

older_twilight_fan wrote:Marielle~ Many people do have some sort of muscle imbalance with certain muscle groups in their body.... where certain types of muscles will be almost overused and "tight", and the reciprocal (or opposite) muscles will be weaker and "stretched out", for lack of a better term.

I had to take that from the Halfway House. My mind was in the gutter too much.

marielle wrote:On the possibility of Jake not being able to make port... I think that maybe there is something to say for that Vampire skin does move... in the book it's descibed as satin over steel... it isn't like stone that is completely solid... so maybe the docking won't be a problem only the passage way into port is very tight and will remain very tight... but I can't imagine Jake having issues with that...

LOL, marielle, I can't imagine him having a problem with that either! as long as the aforementioned eternal virgin part is manageable. Jacob being so tall, I imagine he is ... proportional, so that would be quite the tight passageway there.

marielle wrote:I wanted to get back on the thigh and unyielding sea lanes to the habor... with Alice's case... she was a child when she was put into the Asylum, so it's easy to say that her habor had never been visited before she met Jasper... or do you think there had been pirates that made port with out permission?

I have read at least two fanfics that postulate that Alice was nonconsentually ported while in the asylum, and sad to say, I find it very convincing. It seems like wherever there are people, this eventually happens, and I think an asylum inmate in the late 1910s would have been extremely vulnerable. So much so that we can almost expect that a pretty, nubile, permanent inmate, without any family that cares for her, would be nonconsentually ported. Maybe this contributed to her amnesia.

I sent you a PM, but for anyone else...just switch the 2nd and 3rd letters around, and then add in the 'v'.

Now I feel dirty and unclean.

OKAY, everyone else is asking sex questions, now it's my turn.

Human male, female vamp sex. Sorry, still can't see it. I loved Openhome's stories and she came up with about the best answer so far, which is PRACTICE. That was funny. But....still can't see it, I tend to think in literal terms, it's just not happening.

Vamp male, human female sex. Possible, but barely. He is a marble statue, for crying out loud. There are no...adjustments possible, if you know what I mean. I just don't see it either, at least I don't see it being very enjoyable for either party. I frankly had enormous sympathy for Edward on the island, it must have been extremely frustrating. Bella appears to have enjoyed it more, but I really don't see that either.

All right, that isn't a question, it's more of an observation. By the time we got to the island, the immobility of the vampire flesh and its stone-like hardness was so ingrained into my mind that I had a difficult time envisioning anything happening and was thinking more in the line of "man of steel, woman of kleenex", figuring Edward would have gutted Bella like a fish.

I parted ways with Edward only one time, when they had both finished Bella's first hunt and Bella had attacked Edward, but he then reminded her of Renesmee. If I had been Edward I would have kept my mouth shut, everyone else could have waited, some things are more important, and dammit, his family knows he needed it.

OK, maybe also at the wedding I would have parted ways too. a) I would have ripped off Jacob's head, and b) I would have danced with Tanya...close...two can play that game. No, no, no, no, no, Bella, we're just very good, very close friends. Oh stop it Bella, don't you understand that she's in pain?

"It will take an amazing amount of control,” she mused. “More even than Carlisle has. He may be just strong enough…the only thing he’s not strong enough to do is stay away from her. That’s a lost cause.”

older_twilight_fan wrote:Marielle~ Many people do have some sort of muscle imbalance with certain muscle groups in their body.... where certain types of muscles will be almost overused and "tight", and the reciprocal (or opposite) muscles will be weaker and "stretched out", for lack of a better term.

I had to take that from the Halfway House. My mind was in the gutter too much.

was this really necessary??? I know this text was directed to me but with the gutter mind we have it makes me laughing loudly... and I so don't want to explain this to my mom!!!

smitten_by_twilight wrote:I imagine he is ... proportional, so that would be quite the tight passageway there.

Oh my............Taylor looks a lot different now and I don't know why....

smitten_by_twilight wrote:I have read at least two fanfics that postulate that Alice was nonconsentually ported while in the asylum, and sad to say, I find it very convincing.

Yes, I was re-reading Openhome's fanfic and she had it in it as a sugestion as well that why I got the idea...I would really hate to think about it, I can't imagine anyone doing that to her but if she was a growing teenager, completely cut off from her senses by meds and the treatment I wouldn't be surprised...

Corona, I think that's where the difference between male and female comes to play because I could easily image the pleasures of using cold solid things for pleasure... I mean a lot of women all over the world are using plastic unyielding stuff for that...but in Edward's case... I always thought that there wasn't much needed for a captain to disembark his sailors...maybe it isn't as satisfying for him but he still gets his release or Renesmee wouldn't be there...

I so understand your parting with Edward at the wedding, I always thought the ladies were more jealous because I would have been fuming if my competition wanted to dance with my bride on the wedding party... and yes I too would use the most beautiful free person there to gloat...

These violent delights, have violent endings...Like fire and gunpowder, they consume what they kiss

I actually wasn't considering his coldness (taken care of by the warm climate) or his immobility (which was a plus to an extent). Some aspects of that I think don't detract from the imagination at all.

There is one aspect to his immobility, though, that isn't beneficial. I can't say this any other way...it is impossible for him to adjust any angle. Trying to do so against human flesh would simply break bones and tear flesh. I tend to think literally, so apologies in advance for getting so close to the line. There is NO "give" there as there is between humans. None. None whatsoever. Which is why I don't see it the way I think SM envisioned it. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if Bella was still "technically" a virgin after her honeymoon...if we take the text on vampires literally.

Did that actually happen? No. Bella was...ahem...fully satisfied, and I'm happy for her. But it doesn't quite jive with what we know about SM's vampires either.

BTW, I am very good friends with Seth. When they are in wolf form, he said that he can't tell Leah from Jacob from behind. So there! All bark, no bite. Edward is the popsicle of death, and Jacob is the thimble of annoyance.

"It will take an amazing amount of control,” she mused. “More even than Carlisle has. He may be just strong enough…the only thing he’s not strong enough to do is stay away from her. That’s a lost cause.”

corona wrote:I parted ways with Edward only one time, when they had both finished Bella's first hunt and Bella had attacked Edward, but he then reminded her of Renesmee. If I had been Edward I would have kept my mouth shut, everyone else could have waited, some things are more important, and dammit, his family knows he needed it.

Yep. I tend to think that immediately after saying that, Edward must have been thinking "what did I say that for?"

corona wrote:OK, maybe also at the wedding I would have parted ways too. a) I would have ripped off Jacob's head, and b) I would have danced with Tanya...close...two can play that game. No, no, no, no, no, Bella, we're just very good, very close friends. Oh stop it Bella, don't you understand that she's in pain?

Most of us would do something different. But: ' "-because he'd still be the most loving and unselfish and brilliant and decent person I've ever met." ''...and his expression became horrified. "Did I hurt your feelings?" he asked, shocked.'' "And I thought I fought dirty," he said with grudging admiration. "He makes me look like the patron saint of ethics." 'With the exception of the criminality that is part of being a vegetarian vamp, Edward is inhumanly good. Not always that way, and maybe more so because he feels that he doesn't deserve Bella, but ... yeah. Besides: she didn't know Jacob was there until Edward danced her over; she didn't ask to dance with him, or even be alone with him.

corona wrote:There is one aspect to his immobility, though, that isn't beneficial. I can't say this any other way...it is impossible for him to adjust any angle. Trying to do so against human flesh would simply break bones and tear flesh. I tend to think literally, so apologies in advance for getting so close to the line. There is NO "give" there as there is between humans. None. None whatsoever. Which is why I don't see it the way I think SM envisioned it.

Ok, now I get what you're saying - possibly it is a gender issue to not be so focused on that aspect of the angling ... ahem ... anyway. While angle can be addressed somewhat ... ahem ... externally, I tend to agree with you that, taken literally, we would indeed be looking at a Man of Steel problem. Particularly with areas farther in ... I don't think I should use this word even on the Gutter thread - I don't think there is a colloquialism ... a gate to be passed by pirates prior to reaching the treasure chest, if that makes any sense. If not seriously damaging Bella was even a possibility, it would take so much self-control (for a virgin!) that I have difficulty seeing how it could be terribly enjoyable.

Nevertheless I have no seriously difficulty envisioning it the way SM wrote it because long before we got there, it was clear to me that the science in the books was thin and we were dealing with FAN-TA-SY. Relax, and accept 10 impossible things before breakfast.

corona wrote:BTW, I am very good friends with Seth. When they are in wolf form, he said that he can't tell Leah from Jacob from behind. So there! All bark, no bite. Edward is the popsicle of death, and Jacob is the thimble of annoyance.

So Jacob and Renesmee should have no physical difficulties, just annoyance BTW, Openhome, if you're reading, I still can't get the sparkly popsicle image out of my head. Next thread title: Popsicles and Pirates.

Smitten, trust me, I go with the flow for these books. Certain aspects of the TW world just don't hold up well under close scrutiny, but the vast majority of the time it's due to the worldbuilding aspects and not the story itself. Whenever they conflict, I go with the story. However it can sometimes be amusing trying to reconcile the two.

As far as Jacob goes, I'm only joking of course, and regardless of how I despise him, I have no wish that he and Nessie remain eternal virgins. I'm sure if SM writes future stories about them she will very coyly come up with some explanation for Nessie and then let our imagination fill in the rest.

"It will take an amazing amount of control,” she mused. “More even than Carlisle has. He may be just strong enough…the only thing he’s not strong enough to do is stay away from her. That’s a lost cause.”

Sorry for the double post, I submitted only once but my comments showed up twice.

"It will take an amazing amount of control,” she mused. “More even than Carlisle has. He may be just strong enough…the only thing he’s not strong enough to do is stay away from her. That’s a lost cause.”

corona, completely with you both on going with the flow and how it is funny to try to reconcile the worldbuilding and the storyline. Sorry if I came off as abrasive - I sometimes fail to edit my edge out, and things that would be fine when I say them in person can look very different in print. And I didn't take you literally about Jacob! It would be interesting to see how SM handled that aspect of their relationship, if indeed it becomes a sexual relationship. I don't think that SM is quite the shy, delicate flower that she might appear to be from the TS books, but I don't know that she's really thought this through in the depth (*snicker*) that we have here on the Gutter. Unless, of course, she's lurking