Instead of posting a new thread that receives about 5 responses and then slowly disappears i thought i'd bump this one and keep it at the top of the board considering that my question is about the Zombie and that this thread/book is all about that.

I suppose i'm asking djmont the question first as he wrote a book about it, but i'd like to hear the definition from others, what is it that makes a Zombie a Zombie? Is it the fact that it has 3 shots of rum? All Tiki/Tropical drinks have pretty much the same/similar ingredients, just in different ratios so is it the drinks potency that defines it? I mean there are other drinks out there that have a lot of alcohol in them. Why aren't they called Zombies?

Good question - since this drink's contents have been unknown for so long, the name's taken on more of a symbolic meaning (i.e., a cocktail that'll get you really drunk, and fast), at least that's the way I've always viewed it, from ordering them back when I drank underage at a bunch of now-gone Chicago Tiki joints.

There are some common elements in the best versions but Kill Devil is right. All the bars that wanted to serve a Zombie but had no idea what went into Donn's original probably just called their strongest, most rum forward drink a Zombie.

The same question basically popped into my head yesterday when I switched up from Aku Aku Zombies and made a Jet Pilot that used the exact same 3 rums and had 5 other ingredients in common. But the Zombies were served in chimney glasses and garnished with mint and the Jet Pilot was served in a double old fashioned glass with no garnish, which clearly made them totally different drinks!! _________________"If you keep on drinking rum, the world will soon be quit of a very dirty scoundrel."
Robert Louis Stevenson

On 2013-11-01 03:55, swizzle wrote:What is it that makes a Zombie a Zombie?

That's a good question!

"Zombie" has basically become shorthand for a strong rum drink, usually with fruit juice. But since that includes most rum drinks, it's not very useful.

I would say that in order to be a Zombie, a drink needs: a lot of rum, preferably including overproof rum; fruit juice(s) of some type; and spices of some type. And as mentioned above, it really ought to be served in a chimney glass.

I'm not sure you can narrow it down any more than that.
_________________David J. Montgomery
Professor Cocktail

i agree with that djmont. one feature of the DtB 34 zombie punch that i've discarded is the grapefruit. i find it more important and prominent in the navy grog, and using it in the zombie muddles the distinction btw the two drinks, imo.

i still feel the maiKai 151 swizzle is really a zombie-- its got strong rum, some juice, and plenty of spices (falernum, angostura, cinnamon stick).

Generally speaking, I'm not much of a fan of grapefruit juice. If you want that Don the Beachcomber Zombie flavor, though, I think it's essential. I do, however, usually cut it back a little. (If I'm not using pre-made Don'x Mix.)
_________________David J. Montgomery
Professor Cocktail

I'm not a fan of grapefruit either and the recipe by David Embury doesn't use it and i love that version. A world renowned bar here that has now closed used to make an amazing one which didn't have grapefruit juice either.

On 2013-11-03 14:28, swizzle wrote:I'm not a fan of grapefruit either and the recipe by David Embury doesn't use it and i love that version. A world renowned bar here that has now closed used to make an amazing one which didn't have grapefruit juice either.

Maybe if they had used grapefruit they would still be open. . .

White grapefruit juice is honestly a funny ingredient for me as well. I like the flavor but it can overpower certain drinks for me. I'm a huge Donga Punch fan, but even with an assertive rhum agricole I usually go 1:1 grapefruit to cinnamon syrup in the Don's Mix rather than the 2:1 the original formulation calls for. On the other hand, four ounces of grapefruit in a Reverb Crash brings a great balance to that drink, so I think it really comes down to a case by case basis how much is the right amount.
_________________"If you keep on drinking rum, the world will soon be quit of a very dirty scoundrel."
Robert Louis Stevenson

Since we've detoured to grapefruit juice for a moment, I'd like to point out that there's the whole white/pink grapefruit issue out there. I bought a house with an awesome pink grapefruit tree, it doesn't get any fresher than that tree-ripened stuff for me, and it's free. I've been using pink alot, and some in the cocktail world actually look down on that. I think it's primarily because (so they have told me) the pink stuff is sweeter than the white. I haven't observed that myself, and I don't think it's a huge deal, but then again I've been using my own fresh pink stuff so much that I'm not a good judge of pink vs white at the moment. Anyone have some thoughts and personal experience they'd like to share about pink vs white?

I find the pink grapefruit we get in Florida to be very noticeably sweeter than white grapefruit juice. Then again, in a good season we can only get fresh white grapefruit for 2-3 months out of the year, so being a stickler for white grapefruit juice dooms me to store-bought bottled stuff for most of the year.
_________________"If you keep on drinking rum, the world will soon be quit of a very dirty scoundrel."
Robert Louis Stevenson

I've never compared them -- we pretty much have to resort to the bottled stuff here -- but I think the complaints are the additional sweetness in the pink and the fact that the color muddies up the drink.

I find that, for me, the citrus in a cocktail can easily overpower everything else. I don't know if my palate is more sensitive to the acidity and/or bitterness, or whether I don't just care for it, or what. So I usually cut back on the citrus in any drink I make. I use 3/4 oz. in Mai Tais, Daiquiris, Margaritas, etc.

Don's original Zombie recipe only has 1/3 oz. of grapefruit juice in it, but if I'm mixing completely from scratch, I'll go 1/4 oz. grapefruit and 1/4 oz. cinnamon syrup. I find that you still get that bitterness the grapefruit brings, but you don't taste too much of it.
_________________David J. Montgomery
Professor Cocktail