I have a friend whose parents take us out to dinner when they come to town. The dad always brings coupons for chain restaurants and decides where we will eat and what we will eat, based on the coupons. Fine, he's paying, his rules.

What was odd was one time friend and I decided we'd order an app (to share, we said). We'd pay for it. The dad was visibly upset. And when friend oredered a soda instead of a water, dad was upset once again.

Okay, so dad pays, dad makes the rules. Yet when I paid for everyone's meals the dad still controlled everything! The level of control was astounding (yes, he is "Mr. Control" with a lot of things).

Oh, I waited on someone like this once, when I was a server at Chain Italian Restaurant!

The first request was that his family must order off the lunch menu, at dinner. That's absolutely fine -- dinner portions are huge! -- but then he wanted to order an item that was specially priced at lunch. I apologized, and explained that the computer wouldn't allow me to ring it in at the lower price at that time of day. (I had to bring him to the computer to prove this!) Cue first tantrum.

We got past that, and the rest of the group continued to order. One dared to order a fountain drink, and was reminded that only water was allowed. Cue awkward exchange as his mid-20's child tries to rationalize the $1.50 item... and fails.

Then one of the party ordered something that did not come with the free salad. I asked if they wanted to "add" the salad ($1.95, at the time). Cue second tantrum because "the salad just comes" and he was NOT paying for more. I apologized again, and explained the restaurant's policy (something about how it was fine for that person to share, but I'd have to charge them if the table needed a refill). He agreed.

All was fine until they of course did need a refill, when another tantrum ensued. After being yelled at multiple times, I was NOT budging -- I generally pretended not to notice if someone shared the salad, but not with this guy! -- and asked how he wanted to handle it. He finally agreed to pay for the refill.

The final tantrum came when I delivered the check. One person had ordered an item which, while listed on the lunch menu, wasn't a lunch portion. All of the lunch items are marked on the check with an "L" and it was noticeably missing upon his careful review. I explained that the correct item was received, showed the menu as proof of price, and explained that there wasn't a smaller portion at lunch.

By this point, the entire section of the restaurant is watching this grown man throw tantrums about every little thing. It was awkward, but a little bit funny... but I'm perverse like that.

He finally paid and left, with the entire party thanking me and apologizing on the way out. My tip? $1.95, the amount of the salad add-on. Tips from other tables who watched me calmly handle the tantrums more than made up for it... I think I actually came out ahead!

Ugh, I got stressed out just reading that. I can't imagine having to live with/spend lots of time with someone who was that joyless and controlling.

I complain about my dad occasionally, but I will say that he really enjoys taking all us kids/grandkids out to dinner and making it as enjoyable as possible. Appetizers, dessert, cocktails with funny names, he doesn't care as long as everybody at the table is laughing and having a good time. We didn't have a lot of money when I was growing up, so we didn't eat out a lot. I think he's trying to make up for that now.

My mother runs into food dictators more often than she should on account of my little brother. He has FAS and neurological complications from heavy prenatal exposure to cocaine (he's adopted). For whatever reason, keeping him on whole milk products instead of the reduced fat versions helps him with his behavior issues. Even though we can't explain it, it works, so she keeps him on whole milk. I was really surprised at the number of comments she gets about how "bad" whole milk is for him. Ummm, nope. I've seen the difference it makes. It's bad for everybody he has to interact with if he doesn't get the extra milk fat!

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Some people lift weights. I lift measures. It's a far more esoteric workout. - (Quoted from a personal friend)

I've felt like the food dictator a couple of times. Deserts are a big risk for cross contamination with peanuts. Lots of American Chocolate has peanut oil, the cookies might have pecans - but what brand were they shelled in a factor that also shells peanuts. They have Ice Cream - are they serving Tin Roof ice cream with the same scoop they serve my vanilla ice cream. The pie has gram cracker crust - what brand because one brand has peanut oil. I don't want to go through that line of questioning the server. So I decline.

Thing is when I decline - other people decline to "be polite". Honestly I don't mind please have your desert.

Now with family it is easier - we go to a local ice cream parlor that is safe for me and Cam. Or we just go buy Blue Bell.

Now the most I can give to my exBFFs pov is to acknowledge that if you are done and ready to go it can be frustrating to have someone lingering over dessert if you both came in the same car - but I think the mature thing would be to just say so and maybe ask them to either get it to go or maybe say they could get it next time, instead of aggressively trying to talk them out of doing what they want just because it inconviences you.

See, I think that would be wrong too. Just because you are the driver doesn't mean you get to boss people around. "You can get it next time." No, I'm getting it now, and you can nicely sit and spend the time *with me*, because wasn't the point of this to spent time *with me*?

And if you are the driver, one thing you have to be able to deal with is the idea that you don't get to completely dictate when the event wraps up, etc.

You've got a reason you need to leave now and it would inconvenience you *greatly* (ie, not just "I'm 'done' with this place/event")? Perfectly understandable--speak up and explain, and I'll join you in condemning the friend who would put her dessert over your logistics.

My mom is a little bit of a food dictator, but thankfully she will laugh at herself when she's called on it. She's more petite than everyone else in our family, and she's constantly trying to watch her weight. It is also true that she does tend to eat less than everyone else, but it is also true that she fills up on carbs (bread, appetizers, breadsticks, etc) so she's not really that hungry when the actual meal rolls around. So, when we're at a restaurant, she will often either want to split a meal with someone or, more often, she will decide to "just get a salad" and "have a bite of what everyone else is having." Restaurant potions are so huge that even that her expecting us to share is really not a problem. The problems arise when she starts negotiating what everyone will order so she can have "a taste" of all her favorite things. Also, she tends not to eat red meat out, so she will push us towards the fish and chicken entrees. If we've decided to split an entree, we already know what her preferences are, so it's not such a big deal, but there have been times when she might as well have a conductor's baton in her hand - that's how much she's tried to orchestrate the meal. Now, as then, we used a combination of politely ignoring it and saying exasperatedly "Why don't you just order your own meal?!?!?"

A certain ex-boyfriend later was reported as having taken a steak off his date's plate in a restaurant, saying "Women shouldn't eat meat." He's lucky I wasn't there.

A former friend of a friend didn't eat in front of other people and often ditzed out of eating on her own. This affected her attention span, memory, and other behaviors. I wonder whether she had a parent or older brother whose perception of the relationship women have with food should be the one foisted on Scarlett O'Hara.

Anyone who tries to tell me I'm eating too much or that anything is forbidden very quickly ends up on my Former Friends list.

My mom is a little bit of a food dictator, but thankfully she will laugh at herself when she's called on it. She's more petite than everyone else in our family, and she's constantly trying to watch her weight. It is also true that she does tend to eat less than everyone else, but it is also true that she fills up on carbs (bread, appetizers, breadsticks, etc) so she's not really that hungry when the actual meal rolls around. So, when we're at a restaurant, she will often either want to split a meal with someone or, more often, she will decide to "just get a salad" and "have a bite of what everyone else is having." Restaurant potions are so huge that even that her expecting us to share is really not a problem. The problems arise when she starts negotiating what everyone will order so she can have "a taste" of all her favorite things. Also, she tends not to eat red meat out, so she will push us towards the fish and chicken entrees. If we've decided to split an entree, we already know what her preferences are, so it's not such a big deal, but there have been times when she might as well have a conductor's baton in her hand - that's how much she's tried to orchestrate the meal. Now, as then, we used a combination of politely ignoring it and saying exasperatedly "Why don't you just order your own meal?!?!?"

I would have a real problem with this. She shouldn't try to passive aggressively control your choices to benefit herself. That sounds really selfish. You're a much more patient person than I am.

My mom is a little bit of a food dictator, but thankfully she will laugh at herself when she's called on it. She's more petite than everyone else in our family, and she's constantly trying to watch her weight. It is also true that she does tend to eat less than everyone else, but it is also true that she fills up on carbs (bread, appetizers, breadsticks, etc) so she's not really that hungry when the actual meal rolls around. So, when we're at a restaurant, she will often either want to split a meal with someone or, more often, she will decide to "just get a salad" and "have a bite of what everyone else is having." Restaurant potions are so huge that even that her expecting us to share is really not a problem. The problems arise when she starts negotiating what everyone will order so she can have "a taste" of all her favorite things. Also, she tends not to eat red meat out, so she will push us towards the fish and chicken entrees. If we've decided to split an entree, we already know what her preferences are, so it's not such a big deal, but there have been times when she might as well have a conductor's baton in her hand - that's how much she's tried to orchestrate the meal. Now, as then, we used a combination of politely ignoring it and saying exasperatedly "Why don't you just order your own meal?!?!?"

I would have a real problem with this. She shouldn't try to passive aggressively control your choices to benefit herself. That sounds really selfish. You're a much more patient person than I am.

Ha - well, I guess it's because it's not all that passive - she's pretty blatant about it. But to her credit she will not keep insisting or sulk when we want to do something else. And it's also not all the time...I think certain restaurants bring it out, now that I think about it.

My mother runs into food dictators more often than she should on account of my little brother. He has FAS and neurological complications from heavy prenatal exposure to cocaine (he's adopted). For whatever reason, keeping him on whole milk products instead of the reduced fat versions helps him with his behavior issues. Even though we can't explain it, it works, so she keeps him on whole milk. I was really surprised at the number of comments she gets about how "bad" whole milk is for him. Ummm, nope. I've seen the difference it makes. It's bad for everybody he has to interact with if he doesn't get the extra milk fat!

Waiters always try to give DS Diet Coke or Pepsi when we go out. That is really the only time he has soda, and he is in excellent shape. No matter what he orders to drink, he ends up with diet half the time and has to ask for a re-do.

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ďAll that is gold does not glitter, Not all those who wander are lost; The old that is strong does not wither, Deep roots are not reached by the frost."-J.R.R Tolkien

I remember going out with another couple and the poor wife couldn't win when it came to ordering. If she ordered a good side meal her husband would make some smart remark "Wow, you must actually have an appetite for once!" or "Gee that's a lot of food, do you think you can actually finish that?"

If she ordered lightly he gave her a hard time for being "just like all women who order light to look like they're being dainty and ladylike, then eat off their man's plate." I wasn't even that hungry but I made a point of ordering a burger so big I could barely get my mouth around it. I couldn't finish but I brought it home for later. And she ordered light anyway and proved him wrong by not even being able to finish the light meal she ordered and not touching his plate even when he pushed it at her.

They're getting divorced, and she's said she doesn't know why she didn't do it long before now.

My parents were food dictators too, of the "Do you know how many calories are in that?" or "Do you know what's in that?" One week we were on vacation with them and when it was time for us to leave to meet our plane, I told DH as we left "when we get to the airport and get through security, I want a big greasy McDonald's breakfast sandwich." LOL Nothing gets me craving unhealthy food like a food dictator or someone who is sanctimonious about healthy food.

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Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself. You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars. You have a right to be here. Be cheerful, strive to be happy. -Desiderata

My mother runs into food dictators more often than she should on account of my little brother. He has FAS and neurological complications from heavy prenatal exposure to cocaine (he's adopted). For whatever reason, keeping him on whole milk products instead of the reduced fat versions helps him with his behavior issues. Even though we can't explain it, it works, so she keeps him on whole milk. I was really surprised at the number of comments she gets about how "bad" whole milk is for him. Ummm, nope. I've seen the difference it makes. It's bad for everybody he has to interact with if he doesn't get the extra milk fat!

Slight threadjack here.....

As one who thinks that the most natural forms of food are probably the healthiest, I find this information fascinating.

I taught school in a rural district in an area with a number of dairy farms. I could always tell which children lived on farms and drank unpasteurized milk from the cooler in the barn. They had the most beautiful, glowing complexions.

Back to the food dictators.

I think that the person who posted in the other thread that food is a dominance issue is spot on. I would love to read about food issues among other apes. Perhaps Jane Goodall could make some interesting observations watching humans, too.

After reading the posts on this thread, I can name less than 10 people I regularly see and dine with that don't have food dictatorship issues.

My MIL and FIL both do, even when it is our treat. I enjoy a cocktail when we dine out, and I expect to pay for it, but that is apparently beyond the pale. We often order an appetizer to share, and we each order an entree. MIL and FIL love to order the smallest portion, and behave as if they should be put on the list for martyrs. They will only order water to drink, then shoot dirty looks at everyone else. My sisters and mother have a complex about ordering a moderately priced meal as well, then end up unhappy with their food complete with sighs and complaints.

I got over that a long time ago, and I now order what I want regardless.

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ďAll that is gold does not glitter, Not all those who wander are lost; The old that is strong does not wither, Deep roots are not reached by the frost."-J.R.R Tolkien

My mother runs into food dictators more often than she should on account of my little brother. He has FAS and neurological complications from heavy prenatal exposure to cocaine (he's adopted). For whatever reason, keeping him on whole milk products instead of the reduced fat versions helps him with his behavior issues. Even though we can't explain it, it works, so she keeps him on whole milk. I was really surprised at the number of comments she gets about how "bad" whole milk is for him. Ummm, nope. I've seen the difference it makes. It's bad for everybody he has to interact with if he doesn't get the extra milk fat!

Waiters always try to give DS Diet Coke or Pepsi when we go out. That is really the only time he has soda, and he is in excellent shape. No matter what he orders to drink, he ends up with diet half the time and has to ask for a re-do.

We have the opposite problem. DS has to have Diet because he is insulin dependent and you wouldn't believe how fast regular coke shoots his BG up! I have to test or taste cokes when we order at a restaurant, because waiters seem to think a teen shouldn't drink diet.