Trump was elected thanks to arrogant assholes like erimir and you, mick, bullying voters. [...] Vote for her or get Trump.

My God, what an asshole I was. Pointing out how voting works in a first-past-the-post system. So bullying of me to point out that only Trump or Clinton could win, just because it was true.

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You can't fucking bully people into voting for a POS if the only reasons are negative.

I had plenty of positive reasons to vote for her. But you don't evidently care much about the US remaining in the Paris accords, investing in green energy, millions of Americans getting healthcare, the US Supreme Court having a liberal majority (which could affect a large number of issues, such as voting rights, gerrymandering, police abuse, labor rights and more. Look up the Warren Court, the last liberal SCOTUS), affordable childcare and college education, police reform, raising the US minimum wage, investing in diplomacy, gun control, abortion rights, disability rights, etc.

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Originally Posted by davidm

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Originally Posted by erimir

And sorry, but you don't get to just act like war with Iran was an inevitability. Your assumption is basically that Hillary is Killary, therefore she would've undone one of Obama's signature accomplishments and gone against the large majority of her party's congressional caucus because she just loves murder or some stupid shit. It's not based off of her actual statements on the issue.

Well, of course, in 2008, Killary threatened to “totally obliterate” Iran if it attacked Israel with a nuclear weapon. Hmm! Who does that sound like, vis a vis North Korea?

Trump said "North Korea best not make any more threats to the United States. They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen." Not about if it attacks South Korea with nukes or the like. But nice try.

An unwise and overly hawkish statement which was meant to make Obama look weak on Iran, and had the effect of encouraging anti-Iran sentiment in the US, so I disapprove... but which hardly demonstrates that Clinton was dead-set on starting a war with Iran, which is what you were responding to.

A lot has happened in US-Iran relations since 2008, and Clinton was part of making that happen as a diplomat. She campaigned on sticking with the Iran deal and opposed Republican attempts to expand sanctions on Iran last September. There's a reason you're bringing up old shit instead of making the case that Clinton demonstrated a clear intention to go to war with Iran.

Like literally, your entire response to "war with Iran was not an inevitability" is a statement she made once in 2008? Well, she said IF Iran launches nukes, we'll retaliate, so obviously she intended to invade this year

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But there she was, good old Killary on the campaign trail in 2008, threatening to totally obliterate another nation — which can only be construed as the obliteration of its population.

And why is it that it can only be construed that way, as opposed to talking about their military and manufacturing base? I don't see any particular reason to think that she wasn't merely being hyperbolic (words like "destroy" and "obliterate" being frequently used in this way, to mean "defeat soundly").

It's weird how you and Watser don't apply this sort of literal analysis to the slogans "Death to Israel" or "Death to America" though, which are used by Muslim leaders in a few countries and organizations, including by the Iranian government.