You also argue that hauling works via increased line speed and not additional rod bend. Ed Jaworowski disagreed with you almost 1 month ago at the fly festival in Waynesboro, VA

So long as both agree that hauling works, does it really matter why?

I will assume you are talking about increased distance.

For the record, I agree with Paul, and if weather permits and my video camera still works, I may be able to demonstrate that this weekend pretty conclusively, I think.

But, in words, I think that the fastest part of the haul occurs late enough in the stroke that the rod is already unloading while the haul speed is still increasing. So the rod is actually unloading during the haul and cannot be "increasing" rod bend. However, it is to a degree "delaying" both the rod unload, and loop formation as well. So in that sense, it IS increasing rod bend to some degree.

Since one can cast the same tight loops with and without a haul, that aspect is equal. Given equal tracking and overhang, the only thing left is line speed.to contribute to more distance.

Since it has been conclusively proven that rod bend doesn't contribute more than, tops, 25% to line speed whereas 100% of haul hand speed is contributed directly to line speed, I think the concllusion is in Paul's favor. Edit So, even if the haul added 25% more bend to the rod, that would amount to only 6 1/4% more to the line speed using the 25% figure for rod bend contribution.

You also argue that hauling works via increased line speed and not additional rod bend. Ed Jaworowski disagreed with you almost 1 month ago at the fly festival in Waynesboro, VA

Although I appreciate that there may be differences in opinion regarding techniques, Mr. Jaworowski may very well not acquiesce to many of my techniques, this does not make me wrong, it simply means that he disagrees with how someone else instructs or fishes.

Since it has been conclusively proven that rod bend doesn't contribute more than, tops, 25% to line speed whereas 100% of haul hand speed is contributed directly to line speed, I think the concllusion is in Paul's favor. Edit So, even if the haul added 25% more bend to the rod, that would amount to only 6 1/4% more to the line speed using the 25% figure for rod bend contribution.

+1. I hear you. Maybe I came across as agreeing with the rod-bend theory, but actually I'm about 90% sure I don't. I agree with you. I was just relating some of the information I've read on the sexyloops website. It's good stuff.

I am following this of course but I would like Paul to answer these technical questions. He has no internet connection as he fishes Bosnia right now.

You increase the line speed with the haul but an aspect that is mentioned rarely that you finish the haul AFTER the stop (I had to video myself to believe this because I was pretty sure you do it the same time, very hard to feel these slight differences) what helps you to have a longer straight rod tip path. You actually finish the haul when the rod reaches rod straight position while unbending. Because you still haul during this unbending you keep tension so the tip wont just "kick over" but straightens gradually, so the rod tip path will be straighter for a longer time. If you finish the haul too soon the rod tip will "kick over" and rise above the straight line so you will get a tailing loop.

Welcome to the site. I've been involved in some lively casting mechanics/physics discussions at Sexyloops in the past and have learned that even slow motion video does not always show what happens. On distance casts, Paul hauls well into counterflex and "appears" to not release the line until the rod has reach near maiximum counterflex.

During this discussion another discussion was goiing on called "Cast and Release", where the line is released "early" very slightly before or exactly "at" the rod straight position, and there is no "stop" on the presentation cast.

In an effort to pinpoint the exact and actual release point, and to see what the effect release timing has on loop shape, loop shape morph, and distance, I made up a comfortable momentary switch that could be held between two fingers in the hand with the line between the large button switch and the thumb which activated red LED's.

When the line is released, the light goes ON (or OFF depending on the switch connection) The switch and leds are ridiculously fast, reacting within just a few miliseconds. The switch has a total throw of about 1/16th inch.

I sent it to Lasse Karlsson who made a good video varying the release timing, but Paul has not yet cast while hooked up to it. Lasse also taped a marker to the line, and discovered that line begins shooting immediately with the earlier release(and haul) but is delayed significantly with the later release and haul. The led is on a stick in the foreground.

I am still hoping that one day while Paul is still young, strong and energetic, he will get the chance to spend some time on it (camera rolling) casting to a tape and going for max distance enough times to get a good averaging.

It is that light which made me eat my words about George Roberts' article on shooting line into the backcast even WHILE beginning the forward translational part of the forward cast. I had tried that George Roberts" method after reading about it, and posted on Sexyloops that I thought it was an editinig error and that it was not possible to cast that way.

After taking a video of myself to see how the light worked, I discovered I had been using that (his) technique for at least 35 years without even realizing it. Furthermore, when I consciously tried to do it from his description (of exactly how I cast) I could not cast at all.

It is that technique which causes me to disagree with Paul about the concept of "pre-load" (which is not that good a desciptive word) for what is meant by it - namely, sudden rod loading.

Yeah, I know what I'm doing - - UH HUH! DUH!!!.

PS: The only good thing about "Foot-in-Mouth" disease if that you usually remember each occurance.!

We signed up as business members here to promote the unique product we have worked on for more than a year. It is an application for mobile phones and tablets with maybe the finest fly casting instruction you have ever experienced. 3 hours of HD video right in your hands. No video streaming, so after you have downloaded it you won't need internet connection anymore to watch. You can take this instructional video to a field, pond or river and learn each cast using Paul Arden's step-by-step teaching method in combination with numerous practice drills taught.

Paul Arden is an AAPGAI Master Instructor with 30 years of teaching experience. He is one of the world's best distance casters and owner of the Sexyloops website.

My name is Ákos Szmutni, I am an FFF Master Casting Instructor, writer and filmmaker. I am responsible for the filming side of the project.

You can download the app in AppStore for your iPhone and iPad and in Google Play for Android devices. Sexyloops

We have a free video section so you can test if the application works on your phone or tablet. You will need approximately 4GB space and a Wifi connection to download all the videos. Despite Apple's specifications it won't work on iPhone 3GS only on iPhone 4 and later.

If you have any specific questions on the casts taught in the videos we have a section on our board dedicated for the app: The Board &bull; Index page After reading the flycasting threads on this great forum I am sure you will find many answers in the video for your casting related questions!

Yup seriously... an app for fly casting.
The thing is, it is a very well done production with crystal clear video and explanations of the cast. Some of the more advanced techniques clearly explained in these vids are techniques you probably won't learn by just going out and casting at random.
For those of us who take casting as a very integral part of fly fishing and who have been in situations where being able to make the casts catches the fish, we know there really is nothing wrong with learning as much about casting as you can.
I guess you can take books out with you or a video set-up if you want to review a certain casting technique but that gizmo in my pocket is way more portable and convenient and can also keep me in touch with the outside world if need be.
I carried a cell phone on the water back when they first turned portable. It was either walk off to the side of the river and quietly conduct business between fish and casts or sit in a cubicle, grumpy and pale, and make a living (for lack of another word) Maybe this is why I see few downsides to smart phones and apps such as this.
Fancy gear and the finest flies don't mean much if you can deliver the groceries at that one point on the water that fools the fish. This 'app' helps you do just that.
I reckon the bottom line is, to each their own for reasons particular to them.

Enjoy... and I really wish the river grabbers would back off and that every fisherman would respect the land.

I like it!! I find it to be very useful if I'm have trouble I stop for a few and watch one of the videos. It slows me down and I become more aware of my cast And faults. It's kinda like a pocket instructor but much cheaper. I don't think it replaces an instructor. I would consider myself an advance caster and have still learned a few new tricks. I think it is worth the cost.