Marlon Samuels stood there at the non-striker's end. Head down, motionless. His helpless and sorry figure summed up the terrible state of West Indies batting so far in this series. The previous delivery, Ravi Rampaul, West Indies' last man, had gone chasing an away swinger from James Anderson, edging into the hands of the third slip. That meant Samuels missed out on scoring consecutive centuries in the same match by 24 runs.

This was the second time in the match that Samuels, who had lofted Graeme Swann out of the ground for 16 runs, including two straight sixes in the previous over, was left stranded in such a frustrated position. In the first innings, it was his captain Darren Sammy, who having compiled a resilient maiden century, played an irresponsible pull shot to be caught in the deep at a crucial juncture. Samuels and Sammy had re-built the West Indies house after the early collapse on the first day. West Indies could have crossed the 500-mark but Sammy's departure only hastened the visitors folding up the first innings at a good, but not good-enough total.

West Indies were not in a similar position today, but it takes just that bit of application and determination to turn a corner. Samuels is the best example of that theory working. Unfortunately none of his top order batsmen had learned from him, as well as their own mistakes.

Consider this: in the four innings played in the series so far, not one among the West Indies' top order has managed to score a half century. But the more incredulous fact is that the West Indies top-four comprising Adrian Barath, Kieran Powell, Kirk Edwards and Darren Bravo have scored an aggregate of just 203 runs in the two Tests. Samuels, on his own, has managed 310 runs.

At Lord's, Barath had survived two hours on the first day to return not out at lunch. But as soon as he returned to crease, he went and pushed at the ball which he had left alone all morning. In Nottingham, he was clueless about his position and committed to playing the balls once again he should have let go. In the second innings at Lord's, Powell had shown his weak mindset when he took on Stuart Broad, who had tempted him to go for the pull. The previous delivery, Powell had been alerted by his batting partner Shivnarine Chanderpaul, about two fielders being placed in the deep, yet Powell consciously fell into the trap.

Edwards' bad luck at Lord's, when he was run out inadvertently for no mistake of his in the second innings, did not go away as he reported sick yesterday and survived just two deliveries, recording his second duck. His form in the first innings of both Tests has been no better with the England fast bowlers exposing cracks in Edwards' poor defence easily. Bravo had been done by Chanderpaul's erroneous call on the first day of the series last Thursday, but on Sunday he repeated the same mistake Powell had made minutes earlier, chasing a wide delivery outside the off stump delivery and edging.

"This group of players has been criticised because of the decline of West Indies cricket. You come to England, you are playing the No. 1 team in the world, it is difficult to expect that you are going to come and beat them."

West Indies coach Ottis Gibson

Not only does it reveal a poor choice of shot selection from the West Indies batsmen but it also highlights a weak temperament. Ottis Gibson, West Indies coach, said the problem was a "combination of both" technical and mental skills: "It is not entirely a technical thing. It is being able to repeat your skill over and over again. That is what top teams in the world do: they test your technique; they test your character; they test your mental strength. Perhaps that is where we are falling short," Gibson said. "They are doing the hard work but they are not doing it for long enough."

Gibson said West Indies would utilise the two-day tour match in Leicester to not only give more batting time to some of their ailing batsmen but also probably reshuffle the batting order to encounter the top-order failure. He did not rule out moving one of the pair of Samuels or Bravo to No. 3 in place of the struggling Edwards. "We have got a good week off to go back and sort of reflect on where we are the moment and what we can salvage out of the rest of the series with one Test match to go and look at all the different options that we have available; may be moving Marlon or Darren to three or Darren."

Across the two Tests, West Indies have won many sessions of play while fighting hard in others. A good example came during the first session on the third morning when the pair of Ravi Rampaul and Kemar Roach put West Indies back in the game after the bowlers had been dominated by the pair of Andrew Strauss and Kevin Pietersen on the second afternoon. "We were outstanding yesterday to get eight wickets for 169 runs considering the way we had bowled the day before where we leaked runs from both ends," Gibson said.

He said by blocking one end, West Indies had successfully suffocated England captain Andrew Strauss, who found it hard to accelerate once he had scored his century. "We made it tough for him and then that caused him to get out," Gibson said. But his batsmen had not learned when they were put under the scanner.

"When England make it tough for us, we get out far easier than they do. That is a concern. But we have shown that when we do the right things we can cause problems to the England team but we are not doing it consistently enough at the moment."

Gibson said though he was disappointed that West Indies had lost the Wisden Trophy, he would still not be disheartened by the critics, who were expecting his team to beat a strong side like England. "This group of players has been criticised because of the decline, if you like, of West Indies cricket," Gibson said. "You come to England, you are playing the No. 1 team in the world, it is difficult to expect that you are going to come and beat them. We challenged them at Lord's, we challenged them here for periods as well but not for long enough to create any winning opportunities."

Can you imagine WI cricket to be sucusessful without all these 12 guys not being in the sqaud? === correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't they all in the squad before Gibson arrived? They hardly performed miracles themselves

shantiratnamaj
on May 31, 2012, 8:55 GMT

we all know how much of greats cricket has seen from this lovely West Indies, and we all know not only batting everything will be a mental struggle if West Indies cannot find anyone better than Ottis Gibson to be their coach. Gibson and Sammy have survived too long thanks to the focus of the WICB and the public being on the WICB case against Gayle. In a time when West Indies cricket would be genuinley and consistantly rise Sammy and Gibson will not survie in their current roles. It's not a military team - its a cricket team which has to compete with competitive teams around the rest of the world - the issues Gibson is focusing on will never get the best for cricket in West Indies. Bravo, Pollard, Samuels, Smith, Narine, Bishoo, Chandrapaul, gayle, edwards, russel, roach sarwan. Can you imagine WI cricket to be sucusessful without all these 12 guys not being in the sqaud? They can beat any team if they're given the freedom to play together and focus on cricket. make bravo captain.

JG2704
on May 31, 2012, 8:22 GMT

@Sinhaya on (May 31 2012, 01:05 AM GMT) You say "Gayle, Russell and Pollard will be far better against the England bowlers" Fact is that Gayle aved 25 last time he played in England and WI have been far more competitive this time round. Re Russell - you know very well that ODI/T20 form does not necessarily get carried to test level and in different conditions too. Edwards was averaging around 50 pre tour and besides with Pollard and Russell - where would they play? The prob positions have been 1,2 and 3 and that's not where these 2 guys play. I'm guessing one could play alongside Sammy but Sammy has averaged 46 with the bat in these tests. Would you seriously expect Pollard/Russell to do better than that?

Sinhaya
on May 31, 2012, 1:05 GMT

@JG2704, Russell has a batting average of 32 in ODIs. Just one test is not suffice to get an idea of his test credentials. He needs to be given more chances. Even Pollard must be given a chance at test level to prove his worth. At least they will score bravely and score something rather than acting like sitting ducks which applies to Barath, Powell and Kirk Edwards. It has been the frail top order of Windies that has been their downfall so far.

JG2704
on May 30, 2012, 21:23 GMT

MrPontingToYou on (May 30 2012, 15:32 PM GMT) Again , I'm responding to a person who said that these guys can't do any worse with the BAT than the current crop. Pollard aves 37 in 1st class cricket at a much lower level and as far as I'm aware he has played no 4 day cricket outside of WI - definitely none in England. Going straight from IPL to England (different format/different conditions) with Pollard's at best ok record would likely end in serious disaster. As for Russell - yes you said before that he bowled on a very flat track but then if he is an all rounder you'd have to say he failed with the bat in that match. Has he played any 4 day games in England etc? There is probably a better argument for Russell but to me Pollard would end up being a poor man's Sammy. You certainly can't say why is Pollard being ignored when looking at his stats and the levels/conditions he's played at.

A_Vacant_Slip
on May 30, 2012, 19:31 GMT

@5wombat - you making good point about India. How they must hate to see West Indies doing so well. @landl47 - yes condition sublime for batting if England 710-7..... 544, etc. What is wrong with India batting if they cannot make those score but England can? Explanation can only be that India batting not very good on good batting pitch, or England bowling very good on good batting pitch. Either way - India outclassed.

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 18:37 GMT

i wish more of w i players were playing for record may we would have a winning team

Outswinging
on May 30, 2012, 15:40 GMT

It is quite obvious that the top order, one to four, is not prepared for this challenge. There is also a need for runs from the wicketkeepers slot. Please stop this talk about Bravo being Lara-like; currently, this is obviously not so. Changes are needed - post haste. Yes, give Gayle another look, he understands the gravity of the situation and actually brings some maturity to the team. Simmons would certainly be a better option that any of the four. Move young Bravo to #3; move Shiv and Samuels could be moved up the order; Russell and/or Dwayne Bravo brought in as all-rounders. There is the Pollard option. Additionally, Narine has proven his worth and should be given an opportunity immediately.

However, more importantly, there needs to be a better arrangement between the IPL's schedule and that of the ICC.

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 15:36 GMT

Selectors please don't destroy KIRK EDWARDS any further. He is a promising #3 & we need him for the home series. A stint in the ENG league will solve his problems. He just needs a rest to clear his head.

MrPontingToYou
on May 30, 2012, 15:32 GMT

@ jg2704, not sure if you know that much about russell and pollard, but both have done well in the 4 day game. pollard averages 37 with the bat, and altho his bowling avg is'nt that great, his bowling has improved recently. not saying pollard is a certain test cricketer, but i think if he carries on with first class cricket he may well become one. russell has a bowling avg of 21, an excellent strike rate of 38, and two first class centuries already, and somehow you don't think he can be a worthy test player..? i already told you, its silly to judge him on the one test he played on a dead galle pitch, he came in to bat when the score was already over 550 with no time to build an innings, and yes he only took 1 wicket in the match... but that score and the fact that gayle scored 333 should tell you the kind of pitch it was. cant judge a man so early on stats alone. russell is a special talent, and should at 8 instead of sammy.

Yevghenny
on May 31, 2012, 10:52 GMT

Can you imagine WI cricket to be sucusessful without all these 12 guys not being in the sqaud? === correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't they all in the squad before Gibson arrived? They hardly performed miracles themselves

shantiratnamaj
on May 31, 2012, 8:55 GMT

we all know how much of greats cricket has seen from this lovely West Indies, and we all know not only batting everything will be a mental struggle if West Indies cannot find anyone better than Ottis Gibson to be their coach. Gibson and Sammy have survived too long thanks to the focus of the WICB and the public being on the WICB case against Gayle. In a time when West Indies cricket would be genuinley and consistantly rise Sammy and Gibson will not survie in their current roles. It's not a military team - its a cricket team which has to compete with competitive teams around the rest of the world - the issues Gibson is focusing on will never get the best for cricket in West Indies. Bravo, Pollard, Samuels, Smith, Narine, Bishoo, Chandrapaul, gayle, edwards, russel, roach sarwan. Can you imagine WI cricket to be sucusessful without all these 12 guys not being in the sqaud? They can beat any team if they're given the freedom to play together and focus on cricket. make bravo captain.

JG2704
on May 31, 2012, 8:22 GMT

@Sinhaya on (May 31 2012, 01:05 AM GMT) You say "Gayle, Russell and Pollard will be far better against the England bowlers" Fact is that Gayle aved 25 last time he played in England and WI have been far more competitive this time round. Re Russell - you know very well that ODI/T20 form does not necessarily get carried to test level and in different conditions too. Edwards was averaging around 50 pre tour and besides with Pollard and Russell - where would they play? The prob positions have been 1,2 and 3 and that's not where these 2 guys play. I'm guessing one could play alongside Sammy but Sammy has averaged 46 with the bat in these tests. Would you seriously expect Pollard/Russell to do better than that?

Sinhaya
on May 31, 2012, 1:05 GMT

@JG2704, Russell has a batting average of 32 in ODIs. Just one test is not suffice to get an idea of his test credentials. He needs to be given more chances. Even Pollard must be given a chance at test level to prove his worth. At least they will score bravely and score something rather than acting like sitting ducks which applies to Barath, Powell and Kirk Edwards. It has been the frail top order of Windies that has been their downfall so far.

JG2704
on May 30, 2012, 21:23 GMT

MrPontingToYou on (May 30 2012, 15:32 PM GMT) Again , I'm responding to a person who said that these guys can't do any worse with the BAT than the current crop. Pollard aves 37 in 1st class cricket at a much lower level and as far as I'm aware he has played no 4 day cricket outside of WI - definitely none in England. Going straight from IPL to England (different format/different conditions) with Pollard's at best ok record would likely end in serious disaster. As for Russell - yes you said before that he bowled on a very flat track but then if he is an all rounder you'd have to say he failed with the bat in that match. Has he played any 4 day games in England etc? There is probably a better argument for Russell but to me Pollard would end up being a poor man's Sammy. You certainly can't say why is Pollard being ignored when looking at his stats and the levels/conditions he's played at.

A_Vacant_Slip
on May 30, 2012, 19:31 GMT

@5wombat - you making good point about India. How they must hate to see West Indies doing so well. @landl47 - yes condition sublime for batting if England 710-7..... 544, etc. What is wrong with India batting if they cannot make those score but England can? Explanation can only be that India batting not very good on good batting pitch, or England bowling very good on good batting pitch. Either way - India outclassed.

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 18:37 GMT

i wish more of w i players were playing for record may we would have a winning team

Outswinging
on May 30, 2012, 15:40 GMT

It is quite obvious that the top order, one to four, is not prepared for this challenge. There is also a need for runs from the wicketkeepers slot. Please stop this talk about Bravo being Lara-like; currently, this is obviously not so. Changes are needed - post haste. Yes, give Gayle another look, he understands the gravity of the situation and actually brings some maturity to the team. Simmons would certainly be a better option that any of the four. Move young Bravo to #3; move Shiv and Samuels could be moved up the order; Russell and/or Dwayne Bravo brought in as all-rounders. There is the Pollard option. Additionally, Narine has proven his worth and should be given an opportunity immediately.

However, more importantly, there needs to be a better arrangement between the IPL's schedule and that of the ICC.

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 15:36 GMT

Selectors please don't destroy KIRK EDWARDS any further. He is a promising #3 & we need him for the home series. A stint in the ENG league will solve his problems. He just needs a rest to clear his head.

MrPontingToYou
on May 30, 2012, 15:32 GMT

@ jg2704, not sure if you know that much about russell and pollard, but both have done well in the 4 day game. pollard averages 37 with the bat, and altho his bowling avg is'nt that great, his bowling has improved recently. not saying pollard is a certain test cricketer, but i think if he carries on with first class cricket he may well become one. russell has a bowling avg of 21, an excellent strike rate of 38, and two first class centuries already, and somehow you don't think he can be a worthy test player..? i already told you, its silly to judge him on the one test he played on a dead galle pitch, he came in to bat when the score was already over 550 with no time to build an innings, and yes he only took 1 wicket in the match... but that score and the fact that gayle scored 333 should tell you the kind of pitch it was. cant judge a man so early on stats alone. russell is a special talent, and should at 8 instead of sammy.

lyl67
on May 30, 2012, 15:14 GMT

Let us face it the present Wesi Indies is just not good enough, the experience element is missing, the youngsters are promising but they need the help of the seniors. Gayle, Bravo, Smith is still absent together with Russel, Narine and Pollard youngsters who will come through if given the chance. THe managers should undertake a course in management, maybe, they will then see where they are going wrong in handling the players in every aspect. Come on swallow your pride, do something positive. Manager and Coach please wake up from your slumber.

should change course, the one you are presently on is not working.

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 15:00 GMT

this west indies team will continue to struggle. we need to field our best team. why cant the selectors pick the best players. whats the problem? what is wrong with the WICB? we need gayle, powell, fudadin,bravo,shiv,samuels,ramdin.sammy,rampaul,roach,narine

CarlH
on May 30, 2012, 14:30 GMT

Please continue to blame Gibson for this and that, yet he has been the only coach to stand up to the errant players and demand discipline and accountability. Year in year out, with the "stars" we have lost test match after test match - People forget that when gayle was captain we won only 3 of 20 test matches not in anyway better than what Sammy has done as captain (won 2 from 18 matches), with a far less experienced team, but on that consistently fights tooth and nail with the best teams in the world...
With this continued professional approach, WI will soon see the results of their hard work

cricthoughts
on May 30, 2012, 13:04 GMT

Coach and captain will always be blamed, but truth of the matter is that top order failed consistently both tests, ramdin also failed terribly as a wicketkeeper, the past greats Gayle and Sarwan failed miserably also ppl , they need to believe they can win and give it their best. I rather young ones try hard losing than talented ones going there and doing nothing.

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 12:29 GMT

Bharath's problem is that while he is more in the mold of the defensive Darren Ganga, he aspires to be a Chris Gayle; he aspires to go play in the IPL. Caught in this dilemma, he doesn't know which ball to block and which to hit into the stands.
Somebody has to tell him that there is actually an in-between approach to batting - one that is neither as dour as Ganga;s style and one that is not as pyrotechnical as that of Gayle's; but one that made Sachin and Lara and Ponting great.

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 12:05 GMT

Another Test in which West Indies played well in patches, but against opponents with superior batsmen, bowlers, fielders, experience, facilities, funding, organisation, depth of talent, technology and any other facet of the sport you can imagine on and off pitch, they also played badly in patches, and were duly hammered. Another Test in which almost nothing was learnt.The saga continues with a little twist. Comparing apples with apples, the we hv been performing in a similar manner over the past 15 years. However the strength and depth of talent of opponents in the past was considerably greater with a few exceptions. This present team could not play 3 days against S. Waugh Aussies or the early Ponting Aussies. The WI teams of the past beat them. The Indian teams that turned out in the last 2 series against the WI would have been trashed by WI teams in the past 10 years......Our cricketers have talent that takes them so far and no farther. We need management and technical helo fast!

mar2000
on May 30, 2012, 11:58 GMT

The cricket pundits are like the Politicans when on opposition . They seems to know every answer to everything until they get into office .The current West Indies top order just not "good enough" for Test Cricket .In the West Indies these same players are the "Cream-of-the-crop" , but when put to the "TEST" they are all over the place ,can only last for a short period of time out in the middle looking real good or very bad against "top" line Bowlers.

MrPontingToYou
on May 30, 2012, 11:40 GMT

@ Paley73, while i agree with you about nash, the truth is samuels took his place, and there is no for him room on the team at the moment. i was actually hoping he would've gotton the #6 spot, but no one can deny that samuels has made that his for now. sarvwan has usually always failed for WI in the big series, his stats are misleading, also his issues with training and disipline just re-enforce the point that his test career should be over. the batting is'nt as bad as people make out, especially if gayle were to open again and provide some experience at the top. the other opening position is weak, but 3-6 is good, edwards and bravo are both young and need more experience on pitches they are not familiar with, i hope they both play county cricket in england. the #7 position is also a bit of a concern, ramdin is a decent keeper, but thats about it, and the sad thing is there are no immediate prospects for test level.

MrPontingToYou
on May 30, 2012, 11:23 GMT

not at all sure why people would expect deonarine to come into the team and make a difference, he managed only one decent score of 55 in 3 tests against oz on pitches he is familiar with. he also failed to get to a century during the entire domestic series, even though he managed to pass 50 a few times... that says it all really. also people are bit harsh on k.edwards, cook went through something similar a few years back, and the english fans were calling for him to be dropped... his head was all over the place when he drove, and he appeared to be lost at the crease, but rightly england stuck with him, and since then he has shown the class that i for one knew he had. well edwards is also a class batsman who has already scored a couple centuries in his short test career, thats something most WI batsmen are unable to do, faith must be kept with him at the #3 position. hopefully a few days off, and a good knock in the 2day game will set him back on track.

JG2704
on May 30, 2012, 10:42 GMT

@S.Jagernath on (May 29 2012, 22:12 PM GMT) So if these surfaces were particularly bad for batting then how come England managed to bat ok on them? At Trent Bridge India actually had a first innings lead. At Edgbaston , I guess what must have happened was England must have shaved the grass off after India's 1st innings and then after England got bored of batting after scoring 700+ for 7 they must have stuck the grass back on or maybe they had some special grass which grows within minutes? You're right , it can't possibly be that India were outplayed.

JG2704
on May 30, 2012, 10:42 GMT

@Sinhaya on (May 30 2012, 00:51 AM GMT) Pollard? Russell? On what basis do you think they would do better with the bat? Pollard does not average well for WI in T20/ODIs which is supposed to be his speciality. Russell played one test and check out what he did with the bat. Why would these guys suddenly do a whole lot better - and in English conditions too?

Silva-Surfa
on May 30, 2012, 9:46 GMT

The constant calling of the IPL players is not the solution, why?..because they will never be available on a consistant basis, they might be available for the odd test match, but never for a whole series. As far as i'm aware, none of those guys have a contract and apart from Pollard, Dwayne Bravo and Russell, making themselves available during the ODI/T20 series, the test match schedules always seem to clash with major competitions such as the IPL in the summer and the BigBash on winter tours. Samuels managed to negotiate a role to play alittle of both, but would the others make a sacrifice like that?..Gibson, the selectors and Board have to be accountable for alot of the current failings, but what are the excuses when our "superstar" players were playing and we've still been at the basement of the test rankings since the late 90s?..just trying to put some perspective on this, in the sense that there's a much bigger problem in Caribbean-Cricket, than simply playing the blame-game.

Syed_Yasir_Shere
on May 30, 2012, 9:22 GMT

Ottis Gibson is such a mean person. His favoritism has caused so much difficulties & disaster for West Indies. WI board has to remove such viruses from the team. Chris Gayle is a legendary player & he must get a chance instead of useless Barath. Edwards should be replaced by Simmons & Dwane Bravo is a very good choice against Powell, at least he can score some runs & a handy bowler as well . As far as bowling is concerned Roach, Rampaul & Sammy are doing fair enough on these seaming pitches while Shillingford should be replaced by mysterious & splendid Narine.

Cric_whiz
on May 30, 2012, 9:20 GMT

@ wombats...your memory only recollects the Ashes win in Australia & the Indian home series win, why do the POMS always forget the hidings they have received more recently by Pakistan ( England could barely pass 200), India lost the series as the board's planning was abyssmal & also the injuries to Zaheer, Gambhir did not help the cause....Before we even think about India dishing out good hiding to england later this year, POMS have bigger prbs in facing the Saffers, who will win the sereis 2-0...

anver777
on May 30, 2012, 7:36 GMT

Top order's negative approach & continuous failures is the main reason WI not getting a big score, for the moment only Shiv,Marlon & Sammy scoring runs for them.
Gayle has to be there to give WI a sound start !!!!!!

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 7:16 GMT

So out of all the great West Indies batsman that have ever graced this most wonderful sport, West Indies still can't find a batting coach to knock some technical skill into their current batch of players? Something is seriously wrong here.

YorkshirePudding
on May 30, 2012, 6:42 GMT

@Nagraj Gollapudi, I'm a bit mystified by this comment : "This was the second time in the match that Samuels was left stranded in such a frustrated position", as I seem to recall that Samuels was out in the first innings, therefore not left 'stranded' for the second time. You could also argue that his inability to farm the strike effectively is the reason this happened, just as Chanderpaul must have regretted not taking a single at lords in the first innings.

YorkshirePudding
on May 30, 2012, 6:39 GMT

@mar2000, thats the problem you call for heads too quickly, just as England did in the late 90's when they had a revolving door of players, managers, coaches, who if they suffered a couple of bad runs where ousted from thier position, and as usual the Media picked players because over others either based on reputation from 5-10 years earlier or because they were the latest to be bandied about, having struck a ton against one of the home county teams....Change starts at the Islands, as it is onlythe Chief execs of the the Islands who can get rid of the current WICB board and elect a new one.

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 6:33 GMT

IPL is over, please include Gayle, Bravo,Pollard and Narine, this will be good team to fight England

5wombats
on May 30, 2012, 5:51 GMT

@S.Jagernath on (May 29 2012, 22:12 PM GMT) - an eye-watering comment from you; "if surfaces covered in grass are good for batting then this is not cricket..." you're joking, right?

simonviller
on May 30, 2012, 5:26 GMT

The desire to see WI win ,is evoking a rash of mean and vicious comments about the coach in particular . Whether one likes another or not , rational should be the criterion for our comments ,but instead ,the coach is being blamed for just about everything that goes wrong ; now that can't be right people . .. Others are calling for Gyle and Narine in the next test ,but how do we know that these guys want to be in the test . Narine for starters may not avail himself for the next test if his coach has any say in the matter and Gayle's situation is an on-going puzzle ,so move on to your next suggestions guys .

dreaddyy
on May 30, 2012, 5:21 GMT

Why are we dancing around the point and being so wordy about the sad state of our cricket. The fact is our batting seems incapable of putting together two solid innings. If we score well in one innings it's almost a sure thing we're not topping two hundred in the second. Like someone mentioned, our openers are the problem. Neither of our current opening pair has ball marks on their bats this series. And the shame of it is we have Chris Gayle out there available. Is WI the only team not picking the best players available? We've got almost a whole team sitting out when they can be bolstering our cricket. I'm not sure why Deonarine was dropped. We could've done with his services both with bat and ball. I might be a bit out of touch but since when are players unavailable for test cricket because of contractual agreements with clubs. Nash shouldn't been in this side. We need a batting coach. Where are Greenidge, Haynes, Richards, Richardson, Rowe, Lloyd, Kallitauran, Gomes etc?

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 5:07 GMT

Gibson jokey yes. He and the board are doing a job.

Android4
on May 30, 2012, 5:04 GMT

Gibson is a virus to West Indies cricket. When a lack of confidence is seeded it spreads. He needs to go. Even by force. They need to get in a reptuable and experienced batting coach along the lines of Geoff Marsh.

It should be an absolute priority to get Gayle and Sarwan back in the side. This is a higher priority than retaining Gibson and pleasing the corrupt board.

YorkshirePudding
on May 30, 2012, 5:01 GMT

@Rally_Windies, This tour Bravo is averaging 18.75 with the bat, compared to england this series thats only just better than Broad and Prior (avg 17.5).....@Godfrey Pieters, I thought Shillingford was the answer, thats what a lot of WI's fans were saying before the last test.....@bharath74, you might tell yourself that the WI's have the best players in the World at the moment to comfort yourself, but the reality is that they only have 1 playing in the top 10 test rankings, 1 in the Test Allrounder rankings, even in the ODI/T20 arena they never have more than 1 in the top 10.

landl47
on May 30, 2012, 4:37 GMT

@S. Jagernath: England made 544 in the second innings at Trent Bridge last year and 710-7 in their only innings at Edgbaston. Are you trying to say those weren't good wickets for batting?

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 4:23 GMT

@S.Jagernath well those "grass covered wickets" looked pretty good for batting when India were bowling, I thought the pitches were pretty balanced giving a chance for both bat and ball, India were just awful.

neerajprasher
on May 30, 2012, 4:05 GMT

it's not.Get Gayle,Narine, Bravo,Russell,Smith in the team.You will see the difference.

QingdaoXI
on May 30, 2012, 3:56 GMT

@all my West Indians Brothers, First Remove this Gibson and Hilarie from there post, They are utter waste and from when they have join west Indies performance has dip too down. Second they doesnt have good relation with senior players issues with Gayle and sarwan are in front of all of the world. So better appoint new selector and selction commitee and then find new Coach may be a forgeiner with other coaching staf too. Than appoint Sarwan as a test Captain for Atleast 4 Years, Gayle ODI Cap Till world cup 2015 and Bravo Sr T20 capt till 2014 T-20 World cup, defiantely result will improve. Separate teams for T20, Test and ODI.
my test team: Gayle, Ganga, Bravo Jr, Sarwan, Chanderpaul, Samuels, Ramdin, Taylor, Roach, Edwards, Rampaul, Deonarine, Nash, Bishoo, Shilly.
T-20: Gayle, Barath, Simmons, Samuels, BravoSr, Polly, Kooper, Russel, Narine, Roach, Rampaul, Best, Fudadin, D Mohd.
Odi: Gayle, Simmons,Samuels, Bravo,Fudadin, Bravo, Polly, Russel, Narine, Roach, Rampaul, Bishoo, Barath

bluestar555
on May 30, 2012, 2:47 GMT

As the coach says we are improving its almost been two and half years now still this is the result. Mr.Ottis Gibson if you are a person of integrity and respect your region please for heavens sake resign from your Job. You were a hopeless cricketer when you played for WI and you are a more hopeless coach now.Lara, Chanders, Gayle, Sars have performed for WI, its people like you who couldnt do your bit when it really mattered, I still remember the 96 semifinal were you just scored 1 run and got out.What will you know about the WI pride, when you dont have your self pride, you are the most shameless & selfish coach i have come across.

dummy4fb
on May 30, 2012, 1:49 GMT

Hats off to all the comments but no one listens. The series is lost so why not try the guys you brought in. Rest Sammy and try Samuels as captain just to see if it will make a difference. He will get team support from Chanderpaul, Deonarine and Fudadin who were all previous captains. Gayle, and Narine may not make the third test so this would be my team. Gibson constantly gambles so why not gamble one more time.
Play Barath, Fudadin, Bravo, Chanderpaul, Samuels, Deonarine, Ramdin, Roach, Rampaul, Shillingford and Tino Best.
Ramdin must improve his batting or go.
Sammy, please report sick. Take one for the Team.

England will change their team to try out other players in preparation for SA.

I am wondering why WI is playing New Zealand in Florida? Is there a Sponsor down there or do we expect flood in the Caribbean?

Play Tino and Edwards, rest Chanders and Roach vs Leicester.

There is still need for a WI batting coach like Carl Hooper who has patience and who can teach and lead.

Sinhaya
on May 30, 2012, 0:51 GMT

@JG2704, of course what I said was the best solution in terms of Windies batting debacle. Gayle, Russell and Pollard will be far better against the England bowlers.

rienzied
on May 30, 2012, 0:39 GMT

Since the IPL is over, I dare the WICB to put in Sarwan, who is playing in UK, Gayle and Narine, into the team for the 3rd test. I would love to see Sammy and Gibson have the gumption and insist on this short term fix. We as die hard fans need to see a turn of fortune, and it would be great to see Jimmy anderson, borad, finn and bresnan be given a tough time by the new top order. And it would be nice to see Swann realise he is not the 'ants pants' in finger spinning...

mar2000
on May 29, 2012, 23:57 GMT

Mr. Gibson, please request a BATTING COACH for the top 4 batsmenin the WI team.
Put in a bid for GRENNIDGE or DRAVID .Use your POWER because here in the Caribbean we call for HEADS real fast . Yours will be next even though you are doing gerat with the Bowlers .

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 23:32 GMT

Is Gibson the problem ? Yes . Sarwan said he destroyed him mentally he ttied to do it to Chanda and Gayle and now Samuels the only o ne he cant bully is the only batsman making runs. The YES MEN are beaten down and lack confidence. He is a bowling coach and nothing more but this trio Hunte, Hillaire and Gibson will only suçceed in moving WI cricket to non Test Match status. Three Blind Mice I say.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 23:18 GMT

Does any know how to get rid of the WI coach and board? Really!!! I get the impression that these guys are like tenured college professors who cannot be removed esaily due to their tenure-ship. I respect everyone's opinion(s) though i dont necessarily agree with all. But i think enough talking has already taken place and now is the time for some action to be taken concerning this deplorable situation that the WI cricket has been plunged.
Pleeeeeaaaasseeeee someone please let us know the procedure to effect the ousting of Hillary, Hunte, Gibson and co.

RodStark
on May 29, 2012, 23:17 GMT

To some degree I think the criticism is a bit harsh. After all, what result would you expect when the #8 team is playing away against the #1 team? I also think it's a bit silly to expect WI to suddenly pick a lot of players who aren't even part of the touring party. That said, I do think they could add Gayle and Narine to the squad--after all, they'll be part of the one-day team after the tests. Then I'd like to see the following team in the final test: Gayle, Barath, Samuels, Bravo, Chanderpaul, Deonarine, Sammy, Ramdin, Roach, Rampaul, Narine. That team would be a LOT better.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 22:44 GMT

Not once the bias minded Gibson mention Sarwan or Gayle

MrPontingToYou
on May 29, 2012, 22:30 GMT

the bowling has'nt been spectacular either. apart from a couple spells from roach and rampaul its been ordinary at best.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 22:14 GMT

Tappee 74. I have never heard of anything so ridiculous as dropping Chanderpaul. I can only agree with you if WI can find three of the likes of Samuels, and after replacing the present top four. Chanderpaul is the main stay and everyone knows that he will go when he sees it fit. That is when WI reallly get back on track. If even as some people thinks that he plays for himself, You can't really blame him. He is rated the number one test batsman.
How long will the fans listen to Gibson excuses. I asked earlier, where is the batting coach? Sending boys to do men work just don't cut it.
Not because England is the number one test team means they cannot be beaten. Just look at the damage which Roach and Rampaul did. How many english batsmen made high scores. With the exception of Chanderpaul, Samuels and Sammy's lucky knock, had the top four produced, England would have been beaten. Even though Gayle, Sarwan and Big Bravo is missing, Deonarine and Fudadin would have seen WI through.

S.Jagernath
on May 29, 2012, 22:12 GMT

@5wombats...You definitely were not watching the Indian tour of England,if surfaces covered in grass are good for batting then this is not cricket.India actually did get to 300 at The Oval,thanks to Rahul Dravid carrying his bat on a bouncy surface.Put a West Indian on the Trent Bridge or Edgbaston of last summer & they will dance.Including Brian Lara & Shivnarine Chanderpaul.

S.Jagernath
on May 29, 2012, 22:03 GMT

The West Indian batsmen were very luck not to encounter the Trent Bridge of last summer that was covered in grass,under cloudy skies with plenty of bounce.There might have been a few heads loose after that sort of test.

decaby
on May 29, 2012, 21:26 GMT

i am convinces that WI isnt playing to win any Test match... what the difference playing Eng Aus Bangla... if WI aint playing to win then whts the point playing... i think tht the think cap on the echelons of WI is on wrong... when u hv 4 in experience batters and expect success i think mental is your place... blind leading the blind .... separate them... with youngsters losing confidence will be low and tht mental block will always be in the fore front...if my coach keeps telling me i am not playing to win then whts my point...

bharath74
on May 29, 2012, 21:15 GMT

WI presently has got the best players in the world, but due to poor administration they are not getting the right combination. Get back Gayle,Pollard,Bravo,Narine,Sarwan,Taylor..and pick the best 11. Please get someone like Gary Kirsten , John Wright, or Stephen Fleming as a coach.

jahbert58
on May 29, 2012, 21:09 GMT

1. Barath, another chance he is capable of scoring runs. 2. Fudadin, try him! have nothing to lose. 3. Bravo,lara look alike but lack foot work, try been yourself. 4. Samuel, becoming of age! keep improving. 5. Chanderpaul, his style of batting not suited for#5 should be opening. 6. Deonarine, shouldn't have lose his place so give him another chance. 7. Sammy,can bat and capable of making runs but not serious enough as a captain. 8. Ramdin, good keeper but capable of making more runs. 9. Roach, enough with head down!keep your head up let batman know who is boss. 10.Rampaul, can hit the ball! lose the weight 11.Edwards, not himself

codeiscricket
on May 29, 2012, 21:05 GMT

ive watch west indies over a decade now and there seems to be one constant problem even in the lara days, and that is a strong opening pair, how many times have we witness over the past decade and in this series west indies are down 2,3 . 4 wickets beore they reach 50 runs ,they are bottom heavy and the only way we can compete is to build a solid fundation for guys like shiv, samuels etc its so frustrating to see wickets fell so fast early we need a solid openning pair and a number 3, all great teams have that look at the other top nations they have that, when WI was great we had greenidge , haynes, fredericks, we need guys with the temperiment to stay at the crease and build solid starts

@ noplay on (May 29 2012, 13:30 PM GMT) To be fair WI have had times when they were on top. In this game I felt they had the better of the 1st day and in the last test I was genuinely worried when we were 4 down in the 2nd inns and don't forget that Aus and Eng are 2 of the top 3 sides in the world

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 20:36 GMT

This team is ruined by politics...they should get rid of Gibson and Sammy...Sammy is not a leader who can inspire this team, also they have better all rounders than him...the 15 member team should look like this:
1. Gayle
2. Barath
3. Samuels
4. Darren Bravo
5. Dwane Bravo
6. Chanderpaul
7. Sarwan
8. Ramdin
9. Pollard
10. Narine
11. Bisoo
12. Rampaul
13. Roach
14. Fiedel Edwards
15. Jerome Taylor

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 20:11 GMT

Firstly, I cannot live with a Whitewash. So let's c how we can avoid it. It was suggested by a cricket pundit that we play 3 quicks & a spinner. The 3 quicks r Roach, Ravi, Fidel.NO spinner was named. Now this means that we would have to further weaken our batting. No problem. He didn't say who he would drop,so I will fill in the blanks. Kirk is a basket case, so I'll put him on the FAFlt for home. I'll retain my openers, subject to Gayle. 3 Bravo;4 Samuel; 5 Shiv 6 Ramdin; etc. Now for this plan to work, my spinner has to be Narine. He is a gamble, but a worthwhile one. Will the ENG give him his visa in time? I don't know. He can prove a match winner. If u can't make runs, then u have to take wks. It is as simple as that. Over to u.

SirViv1973
on May 29, 2012, 20:04 GMT

In terms of the 3rd test there is no prospect of Sarwan suddenly being recalled and besides he is contracted to Leic for the rest of the summer. Gayle's inclusion is highly unlikley as he has been asked to meet the selectors on 3 june just 4 days before the next test. So WI need to ultilse the squad they have. For this game wouldn't it be an idea to bring in Deonarine to open instead of Powell, move Samuels up to 3, Sammy may as well bat 6 as only Chanderpaul & Samuels have outscored him in the series and bring in the extra bowler in Edwards. It's a makeshift batting line up but I don't think it will do any worse than what we have already seen in the series. Perhaps the Gayle situation could be resolved before the next series against NZL & maybe someone like Pollard could be looked at in the longer form of the game. @Cambrose11, Simmons is not the answer his test record is worse than Barath/Powell, Nash could do a job but is contracted to Kent for the rest of the summer.

5wombats
on May 29, 2012, 19:43 GMT

@Yevghenny. Hi mate - agreed. West Indies bowling light years beyond india. No comparison possible, West Indies just much better. As for the batting - West Indies much better here too. West Indies have passed 300 twice out of 4 attempts. india never passed 300 in 8 attempts in perfect batting conditions. Also look at the top 3 india batting averages; Dravid 76, Mishra 38, Yuvraj 35. West Indies top 3; Samuels 103, Chanderpaul 78, Sammy 46. Out of those two which would you say was the stronger batting side? Obviously West Indies - they pass 300 and they have good batting averages. Look at the margins of defeat inflicted on india; Innings + 242 (that's fairly conclusive!), Innings + 8, 319 runs, 196 runs. These were hopelessly one-sided games. Look at the margins of defeat for West Indies; 5 wkts, 9 wkts. Which is the more competitive side? West Indies. india were supposed to be "world number 1" when they came to England. It sure didn't look like it. Please publish.

SirViv1973
on May 29, 2012, 19:38 GMT

@KDOC, Far too may iffs in your comments! the days of West Indies having a four prong seam attack are long gone at the moment there are only2 seamers showing the class to take wickets at this level Roach & Rampaul! WI bowling appears to have more strength in the spin department at the moment with Shillingford,Bishoo & hopefully at some point Narine. Also your comments re Eng current attack are way off the mark this is the best allround bowling attack in world cricket right now bar none!

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 19:00 GMT

Call up Gayle,Pollard,Dwayne Bravo,Narine and Deonarine and get rid of Powell,Edwards,Shillingford,Barath and Otis Gibson

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 18:44 GMT

i am more convince that gibson is not the the best thing for w i cricket a coach for a team should be the most unbiased person in that change room as a coach u can't show your preference for some player more than others and what i am talking about is three player made century chanda. in barbados marlon in england and sammy in england and i would want sky sport to isolate all three celebration by the caoch and tell me the man has a good hart to all his players chander. only there because his plan never work samuels is not one of his little yes man so the only one he could grin from ear to ear for was sammy and i think thats a shame

cracker2012
on May 29, 2012, 18:40 GMT

Sounds like Gibson is paying for is sins against Sarwan.

rayinto
on May 29, 2012, 18:31 GMT

No Brainer -swallow your pride and bring back Gayle & Sarwan. We need experience to groom the youngsters - otherwise they are set up for failure. Also, we need stars to make a star team!

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 18:28 GMT

" a combination of both mental and technical skills" Is he correct? Well let us c if the stats can help us. I would interpret mental to mean, unable to concentrate for long periods. And technical as flaw in technique, unable to adapt to conditions. 1st test, Barath faced 142balls -13(4s)-66runs. Powell:67-2-13; Edwards:18-0-1; Bravo:131-7-50. 2nd test, Barath29-1-7; Powell 53-7-34; Edwards 21-1-7; Bravo 61-4-25. Ok, Barath is more mental than technical, but is also losing confidence. Powell is technical & mental. Edwards is all technical. Bravo is clearly mental. What is also evident is that their confidence is down.And like most things, the game of cricket is about confidence. Maybe u c it differently.

whatawicket
on May 29, 2012, 18:20 GMT

MS batting for the WI has been a revelation. i just thought he was similar to pollard, just a tonker who in the T20 fails more times than he suceeds .but hes playing like a proper test match batter. i know the pitches have been very good but he was facing the best bowling attack in world cricket. he was correct and played each bowl on its merits. he should remember this for the future.

miltsee
on May 29, 2012, 18:15 GMT

From the comments of Mr. Gibson, it seems as if the team just showed up to be there. They have no intention of fighting. Why did they not just send the "A" team, or the under 19s?

miltsee
on May 29, 2012, 17:56 GMT

If you keep doing the same thing, how can you expect improved results?
Use the experience that is on the sideline. They are shining against world class players! Bury the grudges and get on with the game

Fogu
on May 29, 2012, 17:54 GMT

Really Tappee74, really!! Chanderpaul gave respectability to the score and he is teaching key players how to bat with his example. You want to get rid of the best player Windies have going for them. Wow!

satspeare
on May 29, 2012, 17:50 GMT

@ tappee74 Drop Chanderpaul?? wow! Brillant idea. Match winner is needed instead? Can anyone question the match winning ability of BCL and yet we lost many matches with even the Prince on the team! Cricket is a team sport and yes Shiv is a tea, player who has given years of service to prove it. The youngesters need tp prove themselves but they are in over their heads especially since they little guidance available on the team. my team for the last test 1 Gayle 2 Deonarine 3 Samuels 4 Fudadin 5 Chanderpaul 6 Sammy 7 Ramdin 8 Roach 9 Rampaul 10 Narine 11 Tino Best. If selection has to be made from the squad, then Barath & Gabriel replaces Gayle and Narine. Do need to bring back Nash, Taylor, Sarwan, Santokie and Benn into the conversation soon. Cannot continue to load the team with inexperience and expect us to magically win. And yes, time to have new people in WICB also.

wiseguy101
on May 29, 2012, 17:33 GMT

I have a friend and i like him alot, a whole lot. he told me his car is broken so because i like him so much i decided to try to repair his car. after hours at it, i made a bigger mess of it. then i told him lets go to the mechanic because i don't know how to fix it.
I hope Gibson and Sammy realize their folly soon.

nafzak
on May 29, 2012, 17:20 GMT

Stop blaming Shiv for Bravo's runout. Bravo is the one who made the call & who started running as soon as Shiv hit the ball. Bravo did not wait to see if the ball was fielded & was intent on running as soon as the ball was hit. Shiv instinctive reaction like all batsmen, if the ball is hit in the vicinity of a relatively close fielder, is to take a couple of steps and if he misfields, then run & if he does not misfield, then stay put. One cannot blame Shiv at all for bravo's runout. I also disagree with those who say that Shiv is only playing for records and is not a match winner. Show me a match winner who did it by himself. The great Richards had Greenidge, Haynes & a whole lot others not to mention the greatest fast bowlers in the world. Put Richards with this bunch minus Shiv and he'll probably fare the same. All that said, it is Gibson, Hilaire, Hunte and the selectors led by Mr. Butts, who should go. They are a bunch on nincompoops.

mar2000
on May 29, 2012, 17:18 GMT

The youngsters in the WI batting line up will continue to struggle because of the "poor" foot work . Here in the Caribbean these kind of batsmen will come into the WI squad with such poor qualities . A batting Coach is very much needed in the WI camp and the one person that come to mind is GORDON GRENNIDGE .

Rally_Windies
on May 29, 2012, 17:17 GMT

Asraf12..

I agree about dropping, Barath, Powell and Kirk, ...but I do not agree with dropping Bravo.... he has failed in 4 innings, but still averages over 40.... He is performing better than all but 3 English batsmen, and after Chaderpaul is has contributed the most runs, Samuels has scored some runs and still cannot reach near to Bravo's aggregate in the last year..

Kirk I would have also defended, but scores of 0,1,7,0 in four innings do not deserve two more tries, he is woefully out of form and needs to be temporarily dropped for his own good...

One has to ask why someone who came to England averaging 50 in Test cricket, looks worse than a tail end batsman ...... Does his coach have anything to do with that?

lyrad92
on May 29, 2012, 17:16 GMT

PLEASE WEST INDIES CRICKET BOARD!!!!!FIRE GIBSON AND ALL THE SELECTORS!!!!

Paley73
on May 29, 2012, 17:15 GMT

The West Indies have two players in England who are currently playing county cricket and who are familiar with the English conditions. Sarwan and Nash. Why not include them. Not that Sarwan has any interest in WI now. Barath, Powell, Edwards and Bravo have done little. Apart from Gayle, Pollard, Russell and Narine, there is Dwayne Bravo, Dwayne Smith, and a few others that can be selected.

ilyasx
on May 29, 2012, 17:13 GMT

I was supportive of Gibson and the board in what they were trying to do after the lack of success over 15 years and also watching the poor attitude of the senior players whilst playing for the West Indies. However, this alternative strategy is starting to fail as the inexperienced players are strugling as they have been on and off for the last few tests. The first 4 batsmen have talent but it will be destroyed if they are not provided with senior colleagues at the top of the order to help them. Its unlikely that Gayle will be allowed to play in the next Test and Sarwan is mentally past it - cannot handle the short ball anymore. THerefore the options are limited so may as well give Fudadin and Deonarine a go to see if they have anything to offer. Leave out Powell and Edwards (whose flawed technique against the moving ball is making him look like a park cricketer, but a good player on slow West indian and Indian wickets).

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 17:06 GMT

Its the same old story all over - the batting lets us down. Does the W.I have a batting coach? If they do, then its time for him to go! He is incompentent . Mr Gibson does not seem to know that mental skills and technical skills complIment each other. If one has the technical skills , then one is going to use the mental skills to apply the technical skills. Any one who has some semblance of a cricket sense and saw the W.I batsmen approach to playing the moving ball would have deduced that these batsmen lack the technical skills. It is a sad reflection of the cricket academy in the islands. Has any of these young batsmen ever been shown Greenidge and Hayes' approach to playing fast bowling? Maybe not - instead they are shown films on baseball. One must also understand - for those who want Gayle, Sawan etc back on the team - that they will not be selected. Mr Gibson's mindset is to select players whose ability mirrors his at their level. Gayle Sawan etc are out of Gibson's league.

Butee
on May 29, 2012, 17:06 GMT

Sorry, i've just awaken from a DEEP IPL SLEEP. The only people with the "Mental Struggle" is the W.I. Fans. We still cannot comprehend what Mr. St. Hilaire and Ottis Gibbson is doing with W.I. cricket. I just heard that W.I. & New Zealand will be playing in Florida Ha Ha BIG JOKE.

edwards is a good batsman but barath, powell and darren bravo need to be dropped. even roach score more than barath. its time for IPL west indies XI to join in test XI.

Indiaforever
on May 29, 2012, 16:46 GMT

Overall I would say that the criticism that Kirk Edwards is getting from everyone is not needed. Yes he has had a terrible tour, but he is a youngster coming to the UK for the first time. He is also a player who scored a hundred on debut and deserves his place in the team, maybe just not in the UK. Also like the Indian line up in England and Australia which was a top line up which throughout the 8 test matches was never changed and was expected to come back strongly which never happened, the same thing has happened with the WI line up. Although they have come up against one of the best attacks and James Anderson with the new ball is sooo good, he averages at least 2 wickets with the new ball. So not all the blame can go to WI but credit has to go to England. I personally am supporting WI because cricket needs a strong WI team back, they look like they can become a good team but they need to be managed properly and I dont think that Ottis Gibson is the perfect man for the job.

SoLucien
on May 29, 2012, 16:37 GMT

@tappee74 If you get rid of one of the only players who actually earn their place in the team. Who is this current team is a match winner? Sammy? Bravo? If the rest of his team members were guilty of trying establish personal records we would be having different kinds of debates because we wouldnt be losing as often.
He has shown a tendency to be selfish but that can be used to our advantage if the others who bat around him play off him.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 16:32 GMT

It seems quite clearly that Otis Gibson has difficulty coming to grips with his failure as a coach and is now trying to deflect his ineptness to understand that the critics are frustrated with him and not the players.No body except the coach thought that the outcome in England would have been otherwise than it is.This is cricket.The peoples in the Caribbean understan full well that you cannot get rid of all your expianced players and expect a bunch of young talents to be winners without guidance.That cannot be provided by the coach and his assistant.Check their resume.Think about this for a second when Barath and Kieron opens the innings who is the leader or teacher?They are thrown into the breach with no cover.One day we will rue their demise.No fault of their own.The board and coach must come to the reality that ego and pomposity is hurting aproud cricket loving carribean comunity.Yes a serious reality check is indeed in order.No mr. Gibson .The emporer is naked.

cambrose1211
on May 29, 2012, 16:28 GMT

Whatever happened to Lendl Symonds & Nash? First of all the WICB needs to be sacked and a new board be appointed along with a coach. Gibson is looking for excuses. England are NOT playing like the No. 1 team. I watched both tests and it clearly showed poor management and coaching in the WI team. A trap is set and yet the batsmen chase after the short ball? These are professional cricketers.
Until and unless drastic changes are not made in the WICB, the coaching staff and team WI cricket will never raise above the rest!

Silva-Surfa
on May 29, 2012, 16:27 GMT

Have the Windies got a batting coach? last time i checked it was Haynes. The pattern in recent test match series is that they seem to perform reasonably in one innings, then fail horribly in the other. It's as though they've been told what to do, but seem incapable of executing it in both innings. The top four inparticular have struggled badly in England, despite Barath, Powell and Bravo failing to convert the starts they had, Kirk Edwards hasn't even got into double-figures and he's our number three, as well as the vice-captain. From what i saw of him at Trent Bridge, i appreciate that he was ill, but his body-language suggested that he didn't want to be out there due to his self-confidence being completely shot.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 16:09 GMT

The management of West Indies cricket needs to be changed and the process of selecting players analyzed so as to ensure accountability.The Caribbean people have waited with bated breath for a new day in West Indies cricket

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 15:24 GMT

Maybe Gibson who has not achieved much with his hard approach is not helping....there is a lot of talent but maybe he is not taping into it

mrhamilton
on May 29, 2012, 15:01 GMT

Enough is enough. Barath,powell,edwards must be dropped for now and Gayle and Sarwan recalled.I would move samuels up to no 3 and have sammy in at no 6. This would than allow another bowler who should be either j taylor or fidel edwards. Narine or bishoo must be the spinner not shillingford.

Yevghenny
on May 29, 2012, 14:31 GMT

West Indies remind me of England late 90's early 00's. Test match batting that lacks belief that they belong at this level. I think their bowling is not too bad, certainly much better than India, Sri Lanka.

tappee74
on May 29, 2012, 14:21 GMT

WI needs to get rid of Chanderpaul.He is not a match winner,and he is only keen in establishing his personal record.

KDoc
on May 29, 2012, 14:12 GMT

Frankly, I am not sure how England is the #1 team. They don't look like it. Anderson is the only bowler with unpredictable bounce and swing. The WI top order made Broad and Bresnan look like bowlers. If WI had a 4 prong pace attack and each of the top four WI batsmen made 50+ each, they would have beaten England.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 13:58 GMT

The only man to criticize is mr otis gibson!!! you cannot man manage!! Time to find a new coach

Goodfellow
on May 29, 2012, 13:36 GMT

You cannot win matches if you have only two batsmen - Samuels and Chanderpaul. Bring back Gayle and Sarwan at least. By the way, congrats to Sammy for getting a century. How Englnad allowed him to get away with that is a mystery for he does not even deserve a place in the team much more to be captain.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 13:35 GMT

In sport anything is possible but it was very highly unlikely the No 8 team can win a series against the No 1 team in England. The touring party has two batsmen, Deonarine and Fudadin, worth ccnsidering for the next test. Marlon Samuel has UP his game and team members just need to do likewise. Best wishes guys

Sinhaya
on May 29, 2012, 13:34 GMT

Please call up Gayle, Pollard, Russell and Narine. At least they will score 30 each rather than single digit scores posted by Barath, Powell and Edwards!!

noplay
on May 29, 2012, 13:30 GMT

I never expected West Indies to beat England. Unlike Gibson, however, I have a different concept of " challenge". Challenge means we have some chance of winning, if not, then a good chance of saving the game. We had neither. We must behave like other teams. Don't win an occasional period. Win matches. Even the best teams lose periods, but their goal is to win the match. Was Gibson boasting about how the bowlers got 8 wickets for 169. England got 10 for 166. Was Gibson boasting about how the bowlers suffocated Strauss AFTER he had made a hundred? DUH! On the issue of mental strength Rudi Webster was celebrating with KKR.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 13:27 GMT

As far as Otis Gibson is concerned it is everybodys fault. Moreover for him everyday is another excuse. One day it is "too many old players". On other days, he claims, "they are not fit". Today, he blames the players for not having the mental capacity to endure. Wrong. As a Golfer, and avery good one, infact I am ranked in the top 5% of all golfers in the world, I can tell you that the coach can MAKE you game WORSE. I was a single digit handicap when I decided to get golfing lessons by a Pro Golfer. The coach changed everything I was doing and my game declined to the point I stopped playing for a while.
Similarly, I believe that the batting coaches are creating unnecessary changes to the Likes of Barath, Powell, Bravo and Edwards. You cannot coach these men during the tournament. Batting can only improve with practice, practice and more practice. You need to practice UNDERSTANDING the bounce, pace, arm action, angles of the bowlers delivery etc. Practice understanding how to think.

Rally_Windies
on May 29, 2012, 13:11 GMT

Is batting a mental battle against the opposition or a battle against the Coach and Board?

Players who have been wonderful are deteriorating and becoming worse the longer they stay under Gibson...

Kirk.. amazing on debut....
Chanders was amazing immediately after being dropped.
Samuels is amazing after spending time OUT the team playing in the IPL ..

It seems, apart from Sammy, every single other person on the team, their batting deteriorates the longer they are coached by Gibson.....

Maybe this is what Sarawan and Gayle were talking about.. even Chanders complained ....

and is it just me? or does Kirk now look like a batsman copy of Ottis Gibson?

Honestcricket
on May 29, 2012, 13:11 GMT

Where is depth in the batting ? If Gibson has written this to give the image that the current team can grow into a strong one, he is wrong . If the agenda is to keep Gayle away , he is wrong as well . WI should understand CG is wanted today by other countries other than WI . Cut the EGo and make a team mixed with both old and new and you will have a good team soon

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 13:08 GMT

It's really sad to say this but the West Indies should be related to an Associate team or into domestic cricket. With the IPL and other leagues, the few talented players may have a second resort.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 13:08 GMT

This has been a on-going problem. Since we had some wholesale changes for various reasons, the batting department has suffered. The bowlers seem to be able to hold their own, but can't really be supported unless the batsmen puts some runs on the board. Looking back, our recent test series losses (Eng/Aus/Ind) have been due to the batters not being able to score consistantly in both innings, if we do, we might give ourselves a better chance at winning. To be honest i had a bad feeling, going into the evening session on Saturday and our topsy-turvy form confirmed my fears. On a positive note Marlon Samuels looks like showing the maturity, discipline and patience to go with that talent of his. Let's hope it continues. Also to give props to Sammy, he's shown that despite his limited ability with the bat, hard work and dedication can take you to that next level.

darren_1146
on May 29, 2012, 13:03 GMT

As a West Indian supporter, I can't begin to explain the frustration and despair that we are feeling in the Caribbean right now. To sit and watch our batsmen fall like flies is utterly heart-wrenching. Everyone blames another party, whether it is the board or the coach.
But from where I sit, I see a group of men coming together to put in a day's work, who are contented on doing the bare minimum. I don't see a team playing with heart or vision. The West Indian don't want a team that merely aims to be competitive, we want a team that wants to win........

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 13:02 GMT

Mr can't man manage Ortis Gibson still do not get what the problem is, it is team balance of mixing the youths with some experience players, and why is he set on fighting against the senior players instead of managing them an make the team #(1) one again under his leadership please don't tell me that you are one of those yes only managers here is some advise, as a former business manager myself strong leaders lead difficult and yes people and make them both successful.

cyborg
on May 29, 2012, 13:00 GMT

interesting comments coach , the guys played their shots and got out , its simple really , give west indies credit for their fight okay , it was good old test match cricket

demshep
on May 29, 2012, 12:53 GMT

Going into a Test match with an attitude of trying to win should be the only attitude. You a have to believe you can win if you don't ... you'll stay where you are. He should be telling them he believes they can win and push for it ... not making these statements that England is No. 1 .... etc. Whether you win or loose ... the ultimate goal is to WIN.

Asraf12
on May 29, 2012, 12:44 GMT

I was nice that Marlon come off his mark its about time. He is a great player. Keep up the good work.

Asraf12
on May 29, 2012, 12:42 GMT

We don't need to rearranged the batting line up, what we need is to drop, Adrian Barath, Kieran Powell, Kirk Edwards and Darren Bravo. Just like Otis did with Chanderpaul, Sarwan ad others Senior Players when they weren't performing............ Remember Otis?. NO PLAYER IS A KING in the TEAM, Not even Captain SAMMY. We lost the Series Already, Why we don't play Deonarine and Fudadin? and Bring Back Gayle, and Dwayne Bravo. And drop Edwards, he is out of from and play a second spinner; Sunil Narine.

No featured comments at the moment.

Asraf12
on May 29, 2012, 12:42 GMT

We don't need to rearranged the batting line up, what we need is to drop, Adrian Barath, Kieran Powell, Kirk Edwards and Darren Bravo. Just like Otis did with Chanderpaul, Sarwan ad others Senior Players when they weren't performing............ Remember Otis?. NO PLAYER IS A KING in the TEAM, Not even Captain SAMMY. We lost the Series Already, Why we don't play Deonarine and Fudadin? and Bring Back Gayle, and Dwayne Bravo. And drop Edwards, he is out of from and play a second spinner; Sunil Narine.

Asraf12
on May 29, 2012, 12:44 GMT

I was nice that Marlon come off his mark its about time. He is a great player. Keep up the good work.

demshep
on May 29, 2012, 12:53 GMT

Going into a Test match with an attitude of trying to win should be the only attitude. You a have to believe you can win if you don't ... you'll stay where you are. He should be telling them he believes they can win and push for it ... not making these statements that England is No. 1 .... etc. Whether you win or loose ... the ultimate goal is to WIN.

cyborg
on May 29, 2012, 13:00 GMT

interesting comments coach , the guys played their shots and got out , its simple really , give west indies credit for their fight okay , it was good old test match cricket

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 13:02 GMT

Mr can't man manage Ortis Gibson still do not get what the problem is, it is team balance of mixing the youths with some experience players, and why is he set on fighting against the senior players instead of managing them an make the team #(1) one again under his leadership please don't tell me that you are one of those yes only managers here is some advise, as a former business manager myself strong leaders lead difficult and yes people and make them both successful.

darren_1146
on May 29, 2012, 13:03 GMT

As a West Indian supporter, I can't begin to explain the frustration and despair that we are feeling in the Caribbean right now. To sit and watch our batsmen fall like flies is utterly heart-wrenching. Everyone blames another party, whether it is the board or the coach.
But from where I sit, I see a group of men coming together to put in a day's work, who are contented on doing the bare minimum. I don't see a team playing with heart or vision. The West Indian don't want a team that merely aims to be competitive, we want a team that wants to win........

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 13:08 GMT

This has been a on-going problem. Since we had some wholesale changes for various reasons, the batting department has suffered. The bowlers seem to be able to hold their own, but can't really be supported unless the batsmen puts some runs on the board. Looking back, our recent test series losses (Eng/Aus/Ind) have been due to the batters not being able to score consistantly in both innings, if we do, we might give ourselves a better chance at winning. To be honest i had a bad feeling, going into the evening session on Saturday and our topsy-turvy form confirmed my fears. On a positive note Marlon Samuels looks like showing the maturity, discipline and patience to go with that talent of his. Let's hope it continues. Also to give props to Sammy, he's shown that despite his limited ability with the bat, hard work and dedication can take you to that next level.

dummy4fb
on May 29, 2012, 13:08 GMT

It's really sad to say this but the West Indies should be related to an Associate team or into domestic cricket. With the IPL and other leagues, the few talented players may have a second resort.

Honestcricket
on May 29, 2012, 13:11 GMT

Where is depth in the batting ? If Gibson has written this to give the image that the current team can grow into a strong one, he is wrong . If the agenda is to keep Gayle away , he is wrong as well . WI should understand CG is wanted today by other countries other than WI . Cut the EGo and make a team mixed with both old and new and you will have a good team soon

Rally_Windies
on May 29, 2012, 13:11 GMT

Is batting a mental battle against the opposition or a battle against the Coach and Board?

Players who have been wonderful are deteriorating and becoming worse the longer they stay under Gibson...

Kirk.. amazing on debut....
Chanders was amazing immediately after being dropped.
Samuels is amazing after spending time OUT the team playing in the IPL ..

It seems, apart from Sammy, every single other person on the team, their batting deteriorates the longer they are coached by Gibson.....

Maybe this is what Sarawan and Gayle were talking about.. even Chanders complained ....

and is it just me? or does Kirk now look like a batsman copy of Ottis Gibson?