Minelab E-TRAC Forum

Thought I would provide an update on one of the best finds I made in 2017. Some of you may recall me posting about a counterfeit 1829 Bust dime that I found at a colonial home site earlier last year. It was the second signal I dug at the site and at the time I knew it was an unusual find but I didn't really realize just how rare it really was. I began hitting the internet to find any information on early counterfeit coinage and soon discovered that the bust dimes were considered to be quite rare. Seems most of the fakes in circulation at the time were large cents, half dollars and gold coins. Very few seemed to have bothered faking the tiny dime. I also found out that a numismatist named Winston Zach, who had written a book on bust dime varieties, was getting ready to write another book about the counterfeit bust dimes. I found an email for him and sent a message about what I had found. After a few emails back and forth he offered to perform an XRF analysis on the coin to determine the metallurgical content of the coin and whether it was a "genuine fake". He also offered to write a certificate of authenticity and lab photograph the coin for me free of charge if he could include the data in his book. I went ahead and sent the coin to him in California and for the next few weeks he kept me updated on what was happening. After he was done he sent the coin back with the certificates and analysis and emailed me the following information:

"Based on the following information I found your 1829 dime to be a 'cast' counterfeit:
1) XRF analysis (see attached) shows primarily tin, with minor amounts of lead and arsenic, and traces of copper (and probably other metals);
2) when tapped on the edge the piece does not 'ring' or 'resonate' like a struck coin does;
3) this piece appears to match, to the best of my ability, variety JR-11 - this match to an authentic coin cannot be duplicated without using mint-dies which were not often lost or removed from the Mint."

It turns out that my dime was made of tin, was cast using genuine US mint dies and is now one of only twenty four counterfeit bust dimes known at this time. It is only one of four from the 1820's and all the rest are dated in the 1830's including six dimes dated 1838. (Bust dime production ended in 1837)

Dig it all as you just never know what that low tone signal may turn out to be. Can't wait to see what we all find in 2018!

QuoteRichard-N-FL
Cool find man. Even though I'll never find one in Florida, what does it show on the Etrac?

Hi Richard,

It rang up 12-13 just like a nickel. You have a very good chance finding old coinage in Florida. I hunted in Tampa for 15 years and people found Bust, Seated and Spanish silver there regularly. Lots of Seminole War battles and forts throughout Florida as well.

QuoteTony N (Michigan)
Very interesting find! Is a fake more valuable for that year than a genuine coin from the mint?

Thanks Tony. The counterfeits seem to be worth more up until you get into the EF-40 and higher grades. That's when genuine Capped Bust dimes start getting pricey. Just finding a counterfeit dime to add to a type collection is infinitely harder though.

What a great find. I would have to think that is just as rare or rarer then the original coin itself.
I am amazed at how may people out there are able and willing to help us identify and value are finds. I have had badge experts help me as well as button experts, military just about anything I had no idea what it was their have been people willing and able to help. I even had an organization help me find the family of a W.W. 1 Canadian solider who's dog tag I had found. It was Unfortunate the family contacted me and had no interest in the tag. Anyway great find and I look forward to your 2018 finds.

What a great find. I would have to think that is just as rare or rarer then the original coin itself.
I am amazed at how may people out there are able and willing to help us identify and value are finds. I have had badge experts help me as well as button experts, military just about anything I had no idea what it was their have been people willing and able to help. I even had an organization help me find the family of a W.W. 1 Canadian solider who's dog tag I had found. It was Unfortunate the family contacted me and had no interest in the tag. Anyway great find and I look forward to your 2018 finds.

Rick

Hey Rick,

They are a lot more rare than the real thing and I feel very lucky to have been able to dig one up.

The people we get to meet in this hobby is part of the joy we get from metal detecting. Winston Zach was the consummate professional and was a pleasure to work with. He also has a background in geology and archaeology and was thrilled to have heard it came from a colonial home site in Knoxville. It gave the coin more of a life and a provenance than if it had just been travelling in circulation and "Uncle Albert" ended up with it in his coin case. Nice to meet someone in that field that did not look down on our hobby. He even ended one of his emails with "Happy Hunting". LOL As a matter of fact, if I had not found that coin it may have remained in the ground and rotted away without being able to share it's information for his book. "Saving History" really had meaning that day I dug it up. Can't wait for his book to be completed.

Quotediggervance
Hey Greg do those hold any kind of value do to the rarety and history

Right now, there are only two for sale right now. One is a holed tin counterfeit from the 1820's like mine for sale right now and it is offered at $450.00. The one I found is definitely in much better condition than the one for sale and is not holed. The only other one for sale right now that I have found is one from the 1830's made from lead for $300.00. Here is a link to the site where they are both for sale. Who knows, maybe once the book comes out it will spark even more interest in these coins.