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Good day, denizens of OC.net! Per our tradition, the forum will shut down for Clean Monday, beginning around 9pm Sunday evening (2/18) and ending around 9pm Monday evening (2/19). In the spirit of the coming Forgiveness Sunday, I ask you to forgive me for the sins I have committed against you. At the end of Great and Holy Week, the Forum will also shut down for Holy Friday and Holy Saturday (times TBA).

I notice that some people on the forum prefer the term "Ethiopean" while we Ethiopians and the rest of the world use the word "Ethiopian".

"Ethiopean" - Is more liken to saying "European" or "Caribean". Thus seeming (to me) to describe a vast area of many different peoples but bound by one common existence.

This is not unacceptable to me at all. But most people are not aware that at one time the term "Ethiopia" meant black people and was used to describe the entire African continent as well as all of southern Arabia and India regardless of cultural differences or the myriad physical traits. The same as how people use the term Caucasian today. Caucasian is very broad and includes all the white people on earth regardless of complexion, culture and language etc.

The ancient Greeks formed this term Ayi-te-yo-pie-yah or as we say today Ethiopia. this word is not Greek persay since it is derived from a Cushitic Phrase. But it is not wrong in my view to allow the Greeks credit for the term.

They were trying to describe a people who were vast and distant in all respects. Vastly dark, vastly Tall, vastly spiritual, Vastly ancient in thier customs, Vast in all human kind ("the first of mankind"....Herodotus). As far as the Greeks were concerned the vastness of these people were as vast as space...dark...black....mysterious and distant beyond distant. Thus they applied "Pie-yah" to denote an infinitive. The term "Pie-yah" comes to us as the mathimatical 'Pi'= 122 divided by 7 or 3.14....etc. The Term Ayiteyo is an application of two phrases (partly Greek) together implys 'blackened' by the Gods...Some may say..by the 'sun'. The Greeks are not supposing blackened by the sun (as western scholars like to over simplify); they are trying to link God to the cause directly to invoke mystery and spirituality. The Greeks are clear about the suns part in darkening the skin but they atribute this to God by virtue of using 'Aey'.

So for thousands of years we had "Ethiopeans". Even what we call the south atlantic ocean was known first in maps as 'Oceanus Etiyopicvs' or the Ethiopic Ocean. This was the Ocean that all the slaves from Africa sailed across and was thrown into by the tens of millions. After the European 'scramble for Africa' the term Ethiopean was not realistic. The African continent was already renamed after the roman general Africunus. The word Aferika is a indigenous "African" word that was Latinized to Africa. The Romans started it but the slave trading Catholic Portugese and Spanish re-applied the term to justify thier power over the continent. Ethiopia that we know today is a nation made of of many many so-called 'countries'. It is really an empire that was not colonized by Europeans or any other nation so it still is 'Ethiopia'

The people of the country Ethiopia are nationals and are thus 'Ethiopian' not 'Ethiopean' which would apply to any "black" person anywhere. It can be said also that "Ethiopian' can also be applied to all blacks as well. This is not incorrect; but I am trying to make a point of the two terms.

To be honest, I've never read word 'Ethiopean' anywhere but here just now. When I was Muslim, I recall reading how Muhammad took refuge with a certain Ethiopian king when he (Muhammad) first began to preach his new religion. I don't recall any details except that that Ethiopia has been Christian since the days of the Queen of Sheba in the Bible.

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"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying

Anyway; The picture that I hope is here is of HRM Emporer Hiali Selassie I (center) during a meeting in Uganda which he covened to discuss the Africa as one empire. HRM was keen on regaining the lost legacy of the far past when Aferika was known to the ancient world as ETHIOPIA. This was a life long dream that he was given from his father HRM Emporer Menilik. Menilik did regain alot of "Africa" back into the Ethiopian Empire which included Sidamo, Somali, and areas to the north.

After HRM Emporer Hiali Selassies time the newly born united nations placed Eritrea the most northern province back into the Ethiopian empire from being under the iron foot of the Italian occupation with Italy under Mousalini. Eritrea however has become its own nation since then and is no longer part of the empire.

It must be understood that biblically the area we see today which is the nation of Ethiopia is the Ethiopia of Scripture. This area we see today was closest to the eastern world but had sway over all Africa or "greater Ethiopia".

Also I do believe that the word 'Ethiopean' is a mis-spell. I thought that the word was however interesting and thus used it in this thread as an 'example' or metaphor of a very scholarly aspect and the historical impatus to the word 'Ethiopia' and 'Ethiopian'.

The words of Haile Selassie when he visited Jamaica in 1966: “You all have come from many tribes; you have encountered many difficulties. But you have always had confidence. It is my hope that with that confidence you are going to continue to overcome your difficulties and march towards prosperity and progress and unity.”

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"The Unity of the Church, as Your Holinesses well know it, is the will of God and ought to be an inspiring example to all men. It should always be a help and not a hindrance to the unity of men of different religions."-Emperor Haile Selassie To the Conference of Oriental Orthodox Churches 1965

I've noticed that on almost every picture of H.I.M, he is holding his hands in a diamond-like shape. I've heard this is to symbolise the Star of David, from whom the Ethiopian emperors descended following Solomon's marriage to the Queen of Sheeba.

However, I've only ever heard this Star of David explanation from people holding beliefs akin to the Rastafarians, who view him as the incarnation of God the Father, and so I would like to get an explanation from a more Orthodox source.

Is this a symbol unique to Ras Tafari Makonen (Haile Selassie), or is it more widespread in Ethiopian culture?

Certainly the Ethiopians were privileged, but others also got Christianity early. Romania has no date of conversion, because the religion they practiced when the first missionaries came was identical to Christianity. There is also evidence of Christianity in Iraq and Iran dating to the Babylonian Captivity. There is even a hybrid Jewish-Christian religion called Zoroastrianism which has such mysteries as holy fire, incense, and even a type of Eucharistic sacrifice.

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"It is remarkable that what we call the world...in what professes to be true...will allow in one man no blemishes, and in another no virtue."--Charles Dickens

There is also evidence of Christianity in Iraq and Iran dating to the Babylonian Captivity.

Huh!? The Babylonian Captivity took place during the the reign of Nebuchadnezzar. So, we're talking at least 550 years before Pentecost!!!

(That was my earlier point to Jibrail Almuhajir who spoke about Christianity in Ethiopia since the time of the Queen of Sheba. Legends are nice, but, at a certain point, one must be reasonable. There ain't no Christianity hundreds of years before Christ's birth. Period.)

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But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)

The words of Haile Selassie when he visited Jamaica in 1966: “You all have come from many tribes; you have encountered many difficulties. But you have always had confidence. It is my hope that with that confidence you are going to continue to overcome your difficulties and march towards prosperity and progress and unity.”

HIM visited every land that Africans were dragged to during the European slave trade. He was as I said before to extend his right as regent to all his subjects; even those scattered.

He loved his people and wanted deeply to express that love and provide (especially to those scattered) with a knowlegde of themselves, their history, their language...The Holy Church. He knew that Africas heritage is ancient and diverse. He also knew that modern Ethiopia had and has power that no other African country has....the true heart of the African people. Ethiopia had-has the power to unite all Africa under its banner.

Ethiopia today is still the symbol of Pan -Africanism and unity of the black people. She pocesses the key to the true African pass. Ethiopia today is a microcosm of the entire black universe. This is due to the fact that this country has never been colonized or conquered by Europe or anyone else....at anytime in history. Today Ethiopia is the headquarters of the African Union headquarted in Addis Abebe Ethiopia.

Nearly all African countires use the green, gold and red in some form on its national flag which is the green, gold and red of Ethiopia.

Som modern Ethiopians today do not appreciate the "globalised" use of 'Ethiopia' and "its" national symbols among the various black nations and peoples; they feel that Ethiopia is for Ethiopians. I agree with this modern view only in a sense.

But what my compatriates are missing is that the Pan-Ethiopianism started by HIM regards the larger ancient empire which many of todays Ethiopians no little about. Thus Ethiopia is for Ethiopians....from all over the world!!

HIM hired Aftrican-Americans to help build the country up after the 2nd world war. He saw them as the most highly educated block of (Ethiopians) blacks in the world at the time. and that they also had 400 years of experience dealing with Europeans and western ideas. Not that he placed them above lets say Jamaicans or blacks in other places. If a person looks carefully at the time and circumstances; like it or not he was correct. It worked.....

African Americans packed and left in large numbers. They established the first flight school which today is called "Ethiopian Airlines"...Yes! started by African Americans. Nursing schools, trade schools and political idealism which helped to develope an awareness of what is really meant by western influence.

When the US State Dept began to see this; much pressure was placed on HIM and his floundering goverment. Rules were established to prevent African Americans from serving the Ethiopian government. This is a huge point and I can not explain it here but much was lost due to the US policy which was basically racism.

HIM had one last thing to stand on which was actually the first thing he established among diaspora (Ethiopians) blacks. The Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahadu Church.

HIM wanted all his people to have what he called "their church given to them by God through the Holy Spirit". This was said in stark contrast to the various prostestant religions heeped onto the diaspora (Ethiopians) blacks by their white slave masters. HIM respected the fact these slave descedants kept the faith in Christ through these racist churches over the years and created something meaningful for worship out of them. He did nevertheless want the Ethiopian Church to be choice. Especially for those whose hearts were hardened against the church due to the slave/racist christainity of the prostestants. ....It worked!

The first property owned by The Ethiopian Church outside Ethiopia and Jerusalem was purchased by African and Caribean Americans. Ethiopian Clergyman that served these churches learned english FAST and in accordance with HIM all people were to be called "English speaking" or "western born" to indicate (indirectly) the 'Ethiopianess' of the people. The Church of Ethiopia brought people to God most importantly and provided away back home after 400 + years of slavery and degradation ( sadly the 'degradation' part is still in the world for blacks today).

Another response to the racist US policies was the establishement of The Ethiopian World Federation. It was established in England while HIM was in exile by royal decree. At the side of the emporer were 4 African Americans and 3 Ethiopian nationals. 1 national was made his attache and head of the organization. This organization had offices and chapters all over the United States in no time. All the members were African Ameicans and Caribean (or diaspora Ethiopians). There is much more to this story.

I must note that what is known as the 'Ethiopian World Federation today IS NOT the same. This current organization is trying to keep the organization alive. Sadly it is in name only. The emporer is not living so he can not obviously run it. Some of the people who are trying to keep this alive believe that HIM is still alive so maybe this is what drives them. This is very very unfortunate.

I just want to demonstrate that HIM Haili Selassie saw "Ethiopians" all over Africa ....all over the world and he intended on cementing 'his' Ethiopia back together. This was not some narrow minded concept or way of thinking like "Ethiopia is for Ethiopoians" like you might here some unfortunate Ethiopain nationals say lately. HIM was blessed to see the bigger deeper point of humanity and that his country is really a true world power with the Church at its head of course. He knew you can not have power without God allowing it.

He just needed to collect his people.

He even established an entire provence (Sheshamaneh) to be for re-settlement of blacks (Ethiopians) from all over the world; from the USA most specifically for reasons stated.

He did good. But he had new problems emerging at his capital....with very sad results.

I am happy for his vision.

Today the Ethiopian Orthodox Church is the largest Orthodox community in the world (where 2 or 3 gather so will I Be....so we are humbled and exalted in few numbers as well...Amen); thanks to God and the blessing he sent on HIM Haili Selassie.

I hope this info will help other to get a lttle understanding of what Ethiopia is especially with her love for God.

We are Orthodox yes. And as such have been working to help retrieve & repair a damaged race; damaged by unfathomable tortures of the mind body and spirit. A race that has endured being the largest single forced migration of human beings in the history of the world. Who would care..

Some people think "well they (African descendents) are doing fine now with great political power in the USA, Caribean, Africa etc. We have educated them well and given them christianity and good opportunities"

Sad!

This kind of person would also think it good to keep a bird and its descendents in cage just because it has from birth only known "the cage".

Ethiopia said: "teach the bird to fly so that it can see the world (its life) the way God meant for it to see the world; it does not matter how well it has adapted to the cage and how it has progressed within that adaptation"

Thus.....................

Ethiopia after all the Godless greed filled wars of the west had ended went out to find her lost sons and daughters.

Certainly the Ethiopians were privileged, but others also got Christianity early. Romania has no date of conversion, because the religion they practiced when the first missionaries came was identical to Christianity. There is also evidence of Christianity in Iraq and Iran dating to the Babylonian Captivity. There is even a hybrid Jewish-Christian religion called Zoroastrianism which has such mysteries as holy fire, incense, and even a type of Eucharistic sacrifice.

ytterbiumanalyst I hope that I misread the post or you used a word incorrectly but Zoroastrianism predates Judaism and in fact it is generally believed that Judaism was a branch that split off of Zoroastrianism. A quick note that Zoroastrianism is practiced today and it is also generally accepted that the 3 wise men were Zoroastrians because they were very learned on the subject of astronomy.

I've noticed that on almost every picture of H.I.M, he is holding his hands in a diamond-like shape. I've heard this is to symbolise the Star of David, from whom the Ethiopian emperors descended following Solomon's marriage to the Queen of Sheeba.

However, I've only ever heard this Star of David explanation from people holding beliefs akin to the Rastafarians, who view him as the incarnation of God the Father, and so I would like to get an explanation from a more Orthodox source.

Is this a symbol unique to Ras Tafari Makonen (Haile Selassie), or is it more widespread in Ethiopian culture?

No..

This symbolic way of holding his hands together is his sovreign right as regent and blood line of the king and prophet David himself. This hand jesture is not to be used by anyone other a person other than a true heir AFTER coronation. To do so otherwise is simply false.

Some people may use it to remember HIM life and the love for the hope that the moanarchy will come out of exile in the USA and be re-established in Ethiopia.

Huh!? The Babylonian Captivity took place during the the reign of Nebuchadnezzar. So, we're talking at least 550 years before Pentecost!!!

(That was my earlier point to Jibrail Almuhajir who spoke about Christianity in Ethiopia since the time of the Queen of Sheba. Legends are nice, but, at a certain point, one must be reasonable. There ain't no Christianity hundreds of years before Christ's birth. Period.)

Yes, you're correct. I was thinking of the Ethiopian mentioned in Acts. Thanks for pointing that out.

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"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying

I've noticed that on almost every picture of H.I.M, he is holding his hands in a diamond-like shape. I've heard this is to symbolise the Star of David, from whom the Ethiopian emperors descended following Solomon's marriage to the Queen of Sheeba.

However, I've only ever heard this Star of David explanation from people holding beliefs akin to the Rastafarians, who view him as the incarnation of God the Father, and so I would like to get an explanation from a more Orthodox source.

Is this a symbol unique to Ras Tafari Makonen (Haile Selassie), or is it more widespread in Ethiopian culture?

No..

This symbolic way of holding his hands together is his sovreign right as regent and blood line of the king and prophet David himself. This hand jesture is not to be used by anyone other a person other than a true heir AFTER coronation. To do so otherwise is simply false.

Some people may use it to remember HIM life and the love for the hope that the moanarchy will come out of exile in the USA and be re-established in Ethiopia.

Some people make the jesture (innocently) out of ignorance.

Generally this is not used in Ethiopian society.

This hand gesture is used by Rastafarians to symbolize the Holy Trinity and to honor His Majesty Haile Selassie I. Even after my baptism I have continued to use this holy gesture, and it has often led to opportunities for me to share my Christian faith. When people ask me what it means, I am able to discuss the holy trinity with them and also share knowledge about Emperor Haile Selassie and the true and ancient Church of the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Faith.

This is the first time I have heard that it should not be used by those who are not coronated. But thank you Amdetsion for explaining this. I will still use this symbol though, because it is rich in Christian meaning and holy significance. As Amdetsion points out: "Some people may use it to remember HIM life and the love for the hope that the moanarchy will come out of exile in the USA and be re-established in Ethiopia."

Selam

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"Whether it’s the guillotine, the hangman’s noose, or reciprocal endeavors of militaristic horror, radical evil will never be recompensed with radical punishment. The only answer, the only remedy, and the only truly effective response to radical evil is radical love."+ Gebre Menfes Kidus +http://bookstore.authorhouse.com/Products/SKU-000984270/Rebel-Song.aspx