Chiefs fans don't think our team is the best, or the organization. I think it's funny how a lot of Bronco fans think they're the Steelers and act like they're miles better than the rest of the division.

It's always confused the hell out of me that Kansas City fans would actually go around talking smack about anything related to their football team. I just can't wrap my brain around the thought process behind it.

I mean, surely nobody goes around in real life bragging about the Chiefs, right? What would they have to brag about that's happened in the past three decades? Maybe that's why there are those who seek out opponent message boards to attempt smack talk on: the anonymity of the internet makes it the only place safe to do so.

Chiefs fans don't think our team is the best, or the organization. I think it's funny how a lot of Bronco fans think they're the Steelers and act like they're miles better than the rest of the division.

A lot of Chief fans think they are going to win the division. Most feel they are better then Denver in almost every position but QB. That was their point of contention during Manning's short but agonizing free agent period.

Lot of Broncos fans think they are going to win the division too.

Difference between the two views, is most in the national media are picking/likely will pick the Broncos to win the division, where as few predictions are calling for the Chiefs to win the division. Not sure if that is really a good thing for the Broncos being the experts seem to be wrong as often as they are right.

A lot of Chief fans think they are going to win the division. Most feel they are better then Denver in almost every position but QB. That was their point of contention during Manning's short but agonizing free agent period.

Lot of Broncos fans think they are going to win the division too.

Difference between the two views, is most in the national media are picking/likely will pick the Broncos to win the division, where as few predictions are calling for the Chiefs to win the division. Not sure if that is really a good thing for the Broncos being the experts seem to be wrong as often as they are right.

I'm sure everyone but Raiders fans thinks they can win this division.

OK, take out the QB position for just a second...now compare the other 21 starters (+ST's) and look at the depth at each position.
If you don't think KC is stronger at most of the positions than I don't know what to tell ya.

Manning has struggled against the Chargers and Romeo Crennel's defense. Add in the fact that Denver couldn't stop the run last year (in a year without DMC and Charles) and did virtually nothing to improve that and you see why either of the 3 teams could win.

OK, take out the QB position for just a second...now compare the other 21 starters (+ST's) and look at the depth at each position.
If you don't think KC is stronger at most of the positions than I don't know what to tell ya.

Manning has struggled against the Chargers and Romeo Crennel's defense. Add in the fact that Denver couldn't stop the run last year (in a year without DMC and Charles) and did virtually nothing to improve that and you see why either of the 3 teams could win.

One area kc improved was the oline. I've told people here for a while now that the thing that is excellent about kc, especially on defense, is the speed. Sure, kc has talent but if the players don't have any faith in their QB, they may not play all out on every play. I think the players like Crennell, but now the players have a full off season with Crennell and will have an entire regular season with Crennell. We shall see if the honeymoon ends quickly, especially if kc strings a few losses together.

OK, take out the QB position for just a second...now compare the other 21 starters (+ST's) and look at the depth at each position.
If you don't think KC is stronger at most of the positions than I don't know what to tell ya.

Manning has struggled against the Chargers and Romeo Crennel's defense. Add in the fact that Denver couldn't stop the run last year (in a year without DMC and Charles) and did virtually nothing to improve that and you see why either of the 3 teams could win.

Blind ass homer...............

JC is a scatback and had one good year against a last place schedule and now he is rehabbing a blown out knee.

OK, take out the QB position for just a second...now compare the other 21 starters (+ST's) and look at the depth at each position.
If you don't think KC is stronger at most of the positions than I don't know what to tell ya.

Manning has struggled against the Chargers and Romeo Crennel's defense. Add in the fact that Denver couldn't stop the run last year (in a year without DMC and Charles) and did virtually nothing to improve that and you see why either of the 3 teams could win.

It's hard to compare some positions because we play different defenses. Can't really compare a 3-4 DE to a 4-3 DE, as they both bring different things to the table.

With that said:

1. O-Line-I think Denver's O-Line is at least as good as KC's, if not better. Good free agent pick ups and draft selections for KC tho. Hard to rate Denver's O-Line under an option style offense last season too.

2. WR-KC returns very average WR's if Bowe holds out. I think both Decker and Thomas will have break out seasons with Manning at QB. KC probably has more depth at the position then Denver.

3. RB-The history of RB's coming back and being nearly as productive in year 1 of an ACL tear... is basically non-existent. Most have had massive drops in production. Many RB's of Charles's similar size and style were never the same again. Maybe Charles will be an exception to that next season, but dunno why Chief fans are counting on it. If he isn't the exception, KC is not in a good place at RB.

4. CB-Flowers is probably the best corner among the teams. But Denver has a lot more depth imo at the position then KC after that.

5. Safety-This is the one position where I don't think it's even remotely debatable--KC is way better here.

6. Front 7-Denver has two very good pass rushers. KC looks to have two as well. Denver had 12 more sacks last season and 14 more tackles for loss. Is KC going to be considerably better next year? Denver considerably worse?

KC has a great 3-4 Middle Linebacker, one of the best in the business and Denver took a big loss in losing Bunkley on defense. DT is a bit of a concern for the Broncos... but based on last year, Denver gave up less yards per carry then KC.

Are the Chiefs going to do better with an unpolished rookie likely starting at NT?

My main point in all of this is that the notion that KC is considerably better at most positions is really not based in reality. They have a good team, and if Bowe signs and Charles is the exception to the rule--KC's offense should be more talented then Denver's (outside of the QB position). But we don't know what will happen there.

One area kc improved was the oline. I've told people here for a while now that the thing that is excellent about kc, especially on defense, is the speed. Sure, kc has talent but if the players don't have any faith in their QB, they may not play all out on every play. I think the players like Crennell, but now the players have a full off season with Crennell and will have an entire regular season with Crennell. We shall see if the honeymoon ends quickly, especially if kc strings a few losses together.

The players believe in the QB (or so they say). I strongly believe that our running game will be very good this year because our new OC is very good at formulating the running game. Last year Miami was 11th in rushing with Reggie Bush (who wasn't known as an every down back) and Daniel Thomas. He also was the OC who helped Peyton Hillis bust out in Cleveland in 2010.

But the OL is key. If Cassel has a year like 2010, it will be a good year, but we don't know what we're gonna get with anyone in the division.

Will Manning, Berry, Palmer, Moeaki, DMC, Charles, Rivers, Gates be healthy or perform like they did in the past?

Is Ingram, Poe, or Wolfe a difference maker?

So many questions. I think it's going to be a very close race between all 3 teams.

The players believe in the QB (or so they say). I strongly believe that our running game will be very good this year because our new OC is very good at formulating the running game. Last year Miami was 11th in rushing with Reggie Bush (who wasn't known as an every down back) and Daniel Thomas. He also was the OC who helped Peyton Hillis bust out in Cleveland in 2010.

But the OL is key. If Cassel has a year like 2010, it will be a good year, but we don't know what we're gonna get with anyone in the division.

Will Manning, Berry, Palmer, Moeaki, DMC, Charles, Rivers, Gates be healthy or perform like they did in the past?

Is Ingram, Poe, or Wolfe a difference maker?

So many questions. I think it's going to be a very close race between all 3 teams.

[QUOTE=Rolandftw;3601299]It's hard to compare some positions because we play different defenses. Can't really compare a 3-4 DE to a 4-3 DE, as they both bring different things to the table.

With that said:

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1. O-Line-I think Denver's O-Line is at least as good as KC's, if not better. Good free agent pick ups and draft selections for KC tho. Hard to rate Denver's O-Line under an option style offense last season too.

I don't think so man. Winston is arguably the best RT in the league. I think most analyst and fans would agree with that. Albert is no slouch either. He had a very good year last year. 24 pressures and 5 sacks given up. Very good for a QB that holds the ball long.
I was not overly impressed with Franklin last year. He was good in run support, but not in pass pro. And Walton struggled most of the time last year. Kuper was very good though.

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2. WR-KC returns very average WR's if Bowe holds out. I think both Decker and Thomas will have break out seasons with Manning at QB. KC probably has more depth at the position then Denver.

This is very close, but I think you only have 2 legit WR's. Bowe is a threat. Can you imagine what the guy would do with a franchise QB? Breaston is also a solid contributor. A relibable WR. Baldwin has looked much better so far. He's made some fantastic deep grabs in OTA's (which Cassel is sure as hell gonna need).

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3. RB-The history of RB's coming back and being nearly as productive in year 1 of an ACL tear... is basically non-existent. Most have had massive drops in production. Many RB's of Charles's similar size and style were never the same again. Maybe Charles will be an exception to that next season, but dunno why Chief fans are counting on it. If he isn't the exception, KC is not in a good place at RB.

The silver lining of this is that Charles got injured in early September. He's had more than the average time to heal. I think he'll still be a threat because he use's his straight away speed most of the time. Even at 75% he's still above average. I think Hillis is going to flourish in Daboll's system. Daboll was the one calling the run plays when Hillis broke out in Cleveland.
And you're forgeting Cyrus Gray. I think the kid is a solid all around back. Good in the flat and has good speed. Hillman looks like a good pick IMO as far as a weapon in the flat and and sweeps.
I wouldn't take a RB that will be 31 this year over the young guys who have better run blockers.

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4. CB-Flowers is probably the best corner among the teams. But Denver has a lot more depth imo at the position then KC after that.

Champ is Champ, but the depth isn't as deep as KC. Jalil Brown (another guy who stood out) is a good contributor, as is Javier Arenas who's been very solid in the slot. Add veterans Travis Daniels and Stanford Routt along with Menzie (who some Bama fans actually thought was as good as Kirkpatrick at times) and I think we have more depth. You guys have the best overall guy, but depth? I'm not so sure.

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5. Safety-This is the one position where I don't think it's even remotely debatable--KC is way better here.

Agreed.

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6. Front 7-Denver has two very good pass rushers. KC looks to have two as well. Denver had 12 more sacks last season and 14 more tackles for loss. Is KC going to be considerably better next year? Denver considerably worse?

I agree for the most part. It really depends on Poe and Wolfe. Push IMO.

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KC has a great 3-4 Middle Linebacker, one of the best in the business and Denver took a big loss in losing Bunkley on defense. DT is a bit of a concern for the Broncos... but based on last year, Denver gave up less yards per carry then KC.

I agree. Losing Bunkley is really going to hurt. He did a very good job for you guys last year. Why not keep him?

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Are the Chiefs going to do better with an unpolished rookie likely starting at NT?

My main point in all of this is that the notion that KC is considerably better at most positions is really not based in reality. They have a good team, and if Bowe signs and Charles is the exception to the rule--KC's offense should be more talented then Denver's (outside of the QB position). But we don't know what will happen there.

I don't believe KC is "considerably" better at any position except for Safety.

Too many questions, but I think KC will be a better blocking and run defending team next season.

It's hard to compare some positions because we play different defenses. Can't really compare a 3-4 DE to a 4-3 DE, as they both bring different things to the table.

With that said:

1. O-Line-I think Denver's O-Line is at least as good as KC's, if not better. Good free agent pick ups and draft selections for KC tho. Hard to rate Denver's O-Line under an option style offense last season too.

2. WR-KC returns very average WR's if Bowe holds out. I think both Decker and Thomas will have break out seasons with Manning at QB. KC probably has more depth at the position then Denver.

3. RB-The history of RB's coming back and being nearly as productive in year 1 of an ACL tear... is basically non-existent. Most have had massive drops in production. Many RB's of Charles's similar size and style were never the same again. Maybe Charles will be an exception to that next season, but dunno why Chief fans are counting on it. If he isn't the exception, KC is not in a good place at RB.

4. CB-Flowers is probably the best corner among the teams. But Denver has a lot more depth imo at the position then KC after that.

5. Safety-This is the one position where I don't think it's even remotely debatable--KC is way better here.

6. Front 7-Denver has two very good pass rushers. KC looks to have two as well. Denver had 12 more sacks last season and 14 more tackles for loss. Is KC going to be considerably better next year? Denver considerably worse?

KC has a great 3-4 Middle Linebacker, one of the best in the business and Denver took a big loss in losing Bunkley on defense. DT is a bit of a concern for the Broncos... but based on last year, Denver gave up less yards per carry then KC.

Are the Chiefs going to do better with an unpolished rookie likely starting at NT?

My main point in all of this is that the notion that KC is considerably better at most positions is really not based in reality. They have a good team, and if Bowe signs and Charles is the exception to the rule--KC's offense should be more talented then Denver's (outside of the QB position). But we don't know what will happen there.

... man you were making good points until you said flowers was better then champ... i had to stop reading after that

Don't be a smartass. As a Bronc fans you saw what Hillis was capable of so can the smartass........ Hillis will be a steady gain even if nothing there. JC will never get the hard yards. Scatbacks dance around...get one or couple or get stuffed a lot hoping and praying for
that one big one................

Speed is fine but you need consistency..............just like CJ...JC is not there......................

Don't be a smartass. As a Bronc fans you saw what Hillis was capable of so can the smartass........ Hillis will be a steady gain even if nothing there. JC will never get the hard yards. Scatbacks dance around...get one or couple or get stuffed a lot hoping and praying for
that one big one................

Speed is fine but you need consistency..............just like CJ...JC is not there......................

hillis has never been consistant from year to year in his entire career. He's a nice role player in any offense, but he will never be "the guy".