To everyone who joined these forums at some point, and got discouraged by the negativity and left after a while (or even got literally scared off): I'm sorry.

I wasn't good enough at encouraging people to be kinder, and removing people who refuse to be kind. Encouraging people is hard, and removing people creates conflict, and I hate conflict... so that's why I wasn't better at it.

I was a very, very sensitive teen. The atmosphere of this forum as it is now, if it had existed in 1996, would probably have upset me far more than it would have helped.

I can handle quite a lot of negativity and even abuse now, but that isn't the point. I want to help people. I want to help the people who need it the most, and I want to help people like the 1996 version of me.

I'm still figuring out the best way to do that, but as it is now, these forums are doing more harm than good, and I can't keep running them.

Thank you to the few people who have tried to understand my point of view so far. I really, really appreciate you guys. You are beautiful people.

Everyone else: If after everything I've said so far, you still don't understand my motivations, I think it's unlikely that you will. We're just too different. Maybe someday in the future it might make sense, but until then, there's no point in arguing about it. I don't have the time or the energy for arguing anymore. I will focus my time and energy on people who support me, and those who need help.

-SoulRiser

The forums are mostly read-only and are in a maintenance/testing phase, before being permanently archived. Please use this time to get the contact details of people you'd like to keep in touch with. My contact details are here.

Please do not make a mirror copy of the forums in their current state - things will still change, and some people have requested to be able to edit or delete some of their personal info.

The more I try explaining and writing about "anti-school people who like learning," the more I find myself looking for a good, re-usable word for this group.

Why a word? It's unnecessary when talking amongst ourselves, but it becomes very useful when trying to get the public to see us as a legitimate class of people who are worthy of consideration. It's crazy that, as individuals, we are often not taken seriously, just because what we're about isn't well-described by any of the stereotypes in people's minds ("honor student", "lazy dropout", "troubled youth", "school phobic", "gifted but learning disabled," "whining teenager," "druggie," "ADHD," "just difficult.") There's no positive or even neutral category in most people's brains for someone who resents forced schooling AND wants to and does pursue learning on their own terms AND is not doomed to "flip burgers" AND therefore should be listened to, not punished or treated for being this way. In order for things to change, this concept must be created!

Ultimately, there should be books, articles, and/or films about us that most teachers, psychologists, and even the general public know about, so that when they meet or hear about someone with these characteristics, instead of being confused, dismissive, or angry, they can say "oh, it's one of THESE interesting creatures." And likewise, when someone who has felt that way for years, maybe feeling alone and never really understood by their friends, parents, and teachers, can say "I'm one of THESE interesting creatures."

The thing is... the term "anti-school" doesn't work for this purpose. Some people hate school out of pure laziness and disinterest in learning, and that's not who I'm referring to. Some people like aspects of school -- maybe they have a good teacher, or college is acceptable whereas they hated high school. Maybe they're even a good student and want to stay in school but they still basically question the whole thing and still learn outside of school and see beyond its limited purpose. And "anti-school" is too negative.

Maybe there doesn't even need to be one word. Maybe a phrase. Maybe multiple words or phrases. Maybe, just an idealized character that people could make reference to.

Smart people who require a more flexible education because they feel stifled in school?
Would be nice if it was shorter. Though noobs would probably respond "Why don't you take more advanced classes?" ... it needs to tackle that as well.

This is a great idea, we need to come up with something everyone can agree on, and then I'll go rewrite the entire site to use that term all over the place so that it spreads moar.

Support School Survival on Patreon or Donate Bitcoin Here: 1Q5WCcxWjayniaL92b8GfXBiGdfjmnUNa2"Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it." - André Paul Guillaume Gide"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination." - Albert Einstein"I'm pretty sure there's a lot of beauty that can only be found in the mind of a lunatic." - TheCancerEIPD - Emotionally Incompetent Parent Disorder

The term actually doesn't need to mean anything on its own. We could make something up that sounds interesting, like "indigo children" (note: this actually exists), people will get curious, Google it, and we just make sure we have some results for it that explain it nicely. Easily done by making a page on Wikipedia for it, and hope and pray they don't delete it.

Support School Survival on Patreon or Donate Bitcoin Here: 1Q5WCcxWjayniaL92b8GfXBiGdfjmnUNa2"Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it." - André Paul Guillaume Gide"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination." - Albert Einstein"I'm pretty sure there's a lot of beauty that can only be found in the mind of a lunatic." - TheCancerEIPD - Emotionally Incompetent Parent Disorder

Quote:Smart people who require a more flexible education because they feel stifled in school?

Spwramfebtfsis

Hmm... I'm liking the first part there -

Spwarm (looks like Swarm... with a P. Let's be the Spwarm!)

Febtfsis

Hmm...

Spwarm Febtsis

Order of the Spwarm Febtsis.

Sounds kind cool. But nobody would ever remember it.

It is better to ask for forgiveness than for permission. - Neal VitaleI'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints. The sinners are much more fun.Everyone can back up their opinions. Some people just do it a whole lot better than others. - RebelnerdHere's to the men and women who did what was considered wrong, in order to do what they knew was right.'Of course it is happening inside your head, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?'" - JK Rowling

Support School Survival on Patreon or Donate Bitcoin Here: 1Q5WCcxWjayniaL92b8GfXBiGdfjmnUNa2"Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it." - André Paul Guillaume Gide"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination." - Albert Einstein"I'm pretty sure there's a lot of beauty that can only be found in the mind of a lunatic." - TheCancerEIPD - Emotionally Incompetent Parent Disorder

"A 'no' uttered from deepest conviction is better and greater than a 'yes' merely uttered to please, or what is worse, to avoid trouble." - Mahatma Gandhi

"The irrationality of a thing is no argument against its existence, rather a condition of it."

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
-Ben Franklin

"when I was a kid I used to pray for a bicycle. then I realized that god doesn't work that way. so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness."
"I would rather die for something I believe in than live for anything else."
"What is the task of higher education? To make a man into a machine. What are the means employed? He is taught how to suffer being bored." – F W Nietzsche

I like PEAS. Just sounds a bit funny when applied to people... "he's a PEA...S"

I like the "free-learner" idea, I just think it could be easily open to misinterpretation... 'cause they're not free, but they wish they were.

self-determined learner?
One problem with "learner" is that in some countries they use that as a synonym for "student" or "pupil"... which could be a bit confusing for some people. But I can't think of a better word to use there.

Support School Survival on Patreon or Donate Bitcoin Here: 1Q5WCcxWjayniaL92b8GfXBiGdfjmnUNa2"Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it." - André Paul Guillaume Gide"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination." - Albert Einstein"I'm pretty sure there's a lot of beauty that can only be found in the mind of a lunatic." - TheCancerEIPD - Emotionally Incompetent Parent Disorder

I like free-learners the best.
Short, easy to remember, to the point, not a stereotype, etc.

An it Harm None, Do What Ye Will
An it Harm, Do Only What Ye Must

Lighten up! This life was made for experimenting, making mistakes, falling on our faces, and standing up to do it all over again.
Live for Learning.

Carla Franklin may be a whore. She may be a wonderful, kind, moral woman. Seeing as I don't know her personally, I cannot know for sure. However, I find her actions (suing Google, requesting the personal info of her critics, getting angry over random internet idiocy that she should ignore and be bigger than, trying to get this site in trouble because of a few users' commentary on the situation, etc.) pretty ridiculous and unwarranted. If she didn't want people to to be talking about/judging her, well 1. that's impossible, she's a human, and 2. she shouldn't have been a model or agreed to be on film. AND 3. she DEFINITELY shouldn't have sued Google and made all this fuss over a few random idiots whom she probably won't ever know expressing their opinion. Mmkay? MMKAY.

I think that works, though it doesn't encapsulate all of the above. Well, it'll take more than a phrase, anyway, to encapsulate all that. It'll take explanations, examples, a re-training of the average person's stereotype.

hewhodestroysall Wrote:Honestly I never figured the point of the esrb.
Point is you can't censor reality.

U.S. Supreme Court Justice Abe Fortas, Tinker v. Des Moines (1969) Wrote:In our system, state-operated schools may not be enclaves of totalitarianism. School officials do not possess absolute authority over their students. Students in school as well as out of school are "persons" under our Constitution."

Rebelnerd Wrote:Human rights are being violated by US law enforcement. This is what the media is here for, you're supposed to be the watchdogs! You're supposed to stand up for the downtrodden, not belittle them as though all their problems amount to nothing more than some angry glares toward parents and sabotaging their computers.
I've seen so much shit done to youth and for some reason, this has made me angrier than I've felt in years. Abuse and oppression happens all over the world. It's a terrible reality of modern society, but we've all accepted that it happens and we're doing what we can to fight it and build a better world.
But this...this mindless, condescending disrespect toward people who have no legal voice with which to defend themselves, this reduction of parents' betrayal into a cheap crack about kids being computer-savvy...it's like watching a surgeon joke about life insurance while his patient bleeds to death on the operating table. The media's job is to protect society from oppression and they've drawn a clear line between the people worth protecting and the people that don't matter. How can they people sleep at night?

You're a journalist. DO. YOUR. FUCKING. JOB.

(04-28-2010 08:17 AM)Liquid Wrote: Laws never seem to help people fight School. Laws only matter if the students are braking them...

(12-03-2011 07:40 AM)SoulRiser Wrote: Solution to all these problems: don't fuck people you can't negotiate with in a civilized manner.

(02-09-2012 02:14 PM)Absentinsomniac Wrote: The only solution is democratic self-paced education where students can excel in what they are good at and work on what their not if necessary, AT THEIR OWN DAMN PACE IN THEIR OWN DAMN WAY.

Iam, i hate school (place of learning) like learning new things and mastering complex things and iam doing good, but iam becoming crazy in this prison they have put us all in!!!!! the things they teach needs changing, real training needs to be given to staff better training and make less sarcasam in the classroom, the goverment need to go back to step 1.

SurvivalWarrior Wrote:Iam, i hate school (place of learning) like learning new things and mastering complex things and iam doing good, but iam becoming crazy in this prison they have put us all in!!!!! the things they teach needs changing, real training needs to be given to staff better training and make less sarcasam in the classroom, the goverment need to go back to step 1.

hewhodestroysall Wrote:Honestly I never figured the point of the esrb.
Point is you can't censor reality.

U.S. Supreme Court Justice Abe Fortas, Tinker v. Des Moines (1969) Wrote:In our system, state-operated schools may not be enclaves of totalitarianism. School officials do not possess absolute authority over their students. Students in school as well as out of school are "persons" under our Constitution."

Rebelnerd Wrote:Human rights are being violated by US law enforcement. This is what the media is here for, you're supposed to be the watchdogs! You're supposed to stand up for the downtrodden, not belittle them as though all their problems amount to nothing more than some angry glares toward parents and sabotaging their computers.
I've seen so much shit done to youth and for some reason, this has made me angrier than I've felt in years. Abuse and oppression happens all over the world. It's a terrible reality of modern society, but we've all accepted that it happens and we're doing what we can to fight it and build a better world.
But this...this mindless, condescending disrespect toward people who have no legal voice with which to defend themselves, this reduction of parents' betrayal into a cheap crack about kids being computer-savvy...it's like watching a surgeon joke about life insurance while his patient bleeds to death on the operating table. The media's job is to protect society from oppression and they've drawn a clear line between the people worth protecting and the people that don't matter. How can they people sleep at night?

You're a journalist. DO. YOUR. FUCKING. JOB.

(04-28-2010 08:17 AM)Liquid Wrote: Laws never seem to help people fight School. Laws only matter if the students are braking them...

(12-03-2011 07:40 AM)SoulRiser Wrote: Solution to all these problems: don't fuck people you can't negotiate with in a civilized manner.

(02-09-2012 02:14 PM)Absentinsomniac Wrote: The only solution is democratic self-paced education where students can excel in what they are good at and work on what their not if necessary, AT THEIR OWN DAMN PACE IN THEIR OWN DAMN WAY.

I really adore this idea, and am ashamed that I had not found this thread earlier. I have this idea, not for the word mind you...but the means to find the word. To take a lost word and reinvent it. I will look for some words that I find to be possibilities for redefinitions and post them here...feel free to do the same. http://phrontistery.info/clw2.html

Hidden stuff:

helctic adj 1658 -1658 (although this word doesn't mean schooling necessarily we can modify it to drag out education.)
acting to drag or draw out

sparsile adj 1891 -1891 (We can modify this word as well, and call its followers Sparsites or something of that matter)
of a star, not included in any constellation

stiricide n 1656 -1656 (School is the house, we are icicles....or more over; we are stiricidal)
falling of icicles from a house

surgation n 1688 -1688 (this one is a joke of course)
erection of the penis

tollation n 1688 -1688 (While some may fall into schools braainwash, we are tollators, we tollate it...)
act of lifting

tornatil adj 1661 -1661 (We are made upon a wheel of change, the Tornatilians)
made with a wheel; turned on a wheel

vinitorian adj 1656 -1656 (Being not merely part of the vine, we stand out as Vinitorians...)
of or pertaining to tending vines

And the cool thing about this is, if we use this method to find the word to use, it shows that we are not just uneducated rebels without a cause - we actually looked up some history to find our word. XD (well, one of us did)

Support School Survival on Patreon or Donate Bitcoin Here: 1Q5WCcxWjayniaL92b8GfXBiGdfjmnUNa2"Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it." - André Paul Guillaume Gide"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination." - Albert Einstein"I'm pretty sure there's a lot of beauty that can only be found in the mind of a lunatic." - TheCancerEIPD - Emotionally Incompetent Parent Disorder

I like autugry as well, there is something empowering by redefining a word. I feel as though if we were to choose the word, nay idea behind autugry, we can make it into a banner a self discipline of sorts. We can make a wikipedia entry for it, a urban dictionary...hell we could send it to Webster to be redefined.

If we were really trying to start a movement, this would definitely be a good first step.