The Palestinians have pressed forth to introduce a measure to upgrade them in the UN's eyes to a non-member observer state.

While being upgraded from non-member observer entity to non-member observer state doesn't sound like much, it does provide Palestine an opportunity to actually contribute and perform within the UN.

Most damning, of course, is that it would tell Israel and the United States that their treatment of Palestine is tantamount to suppression of what should be a legitimate, free country. An act bordering on apartheid, which the ICC (run by the UN, which could soon include Palestine) as "inhuman acts committed for the purpose of establishing and maintaining domination by one racial group of persons over any other racial group of persons and systematically oppressing them." I don't regard that as a possibility.

But essentially, this has the ability to be a game changer in favor of two-state negotiations in favor of the Palestinian people, as opposed to the Likud/GOP alliance, which does not want any such two-state solution. All the facts on the ground right now favor Israel, as they expand their land, take more of the Palestinian land, and pretend with each passing year that the '67 borders with agreed-upon land swaps is some crime against Israel's humanity.

The only real arrow in Palestine's quiver is international opinion. And this particular vote in the UN cannot be unilaterally shot down by the United States, so it is sure to be voted on, and sure to be passed by roughly 75% of the UN.

As such, the United States and Israel are, understandably, freaking the **** out. The US is threatening to withdraw funding for much of the UN. Israel is threatening to discard the Oslo Accord, which allowed Palestine self-governance. This could potentially mean apartheid in everything but name.

So things are going to get really, really fascinating.

I ultimately think that Israel and the US' bark is worse than their bite. Obama prides himself on effective diplomacy which cannot happen if he's going to war with the UN. Israel's Netanyahu is far less concerned with international opinion, but doesn't want Israel to end up on the wrong side of the distinction between internationally frowned-upon to internationally despised. Though he may be heading that way anyway.

Palestinians defied newly re-elected U.S. President Barack Obama by pushing ahead with a second statehood bid at the United Nations that will raise their profile at the world body and highlight the stagnation of the Mideast peace process.

The Palestinian Authority yesterday circulated a resolution to put the Palestine Liberation Organization on a par with the Holy See, according to a draft that will be put to a vote in the UN’s 193-member General Assembly, where the initiative has enough support to pass and the U.S. lacks veto power.

The latest steps by the Palestinians present Obama with his first foreign-policy challenge three days after he won a second term. A year ago, the Palestinians abandoned an attempt to be recognized as a full member state through the Security Council after Obama indicated the U.S. would use its veto there.

The PLO, which currently is an observer “entity,” is seeking a nonmember “observer state status,” according to the draft obtained by Bloomberg News.

By resurrecting the statehood issue in the General Assembly, the Palestinian leadership is trying to force the White House to pay attention to a moribund Palestinian-Israeli peace process that has dropped off the list of foreign-policy priorities for Obama.

In doing so, Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas is jeopardizing relations with Obama, as well as about $500 million in U.S. economic and security aid that members of Congress have threatened to cut if Palestinians proceed at the UN.

Issue Fades

The Palestinians have seen their cause fall into relative obscurity internationally since formal peace talks with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s government were frozen two years ago.

Peace talks stumbled over the issue of Jewish settlements in the West Bank, which Israel captured from Jordan in the 1967 Six-Day War. Abbas said he wouldn’t return to negotiations unless Israel froze all settlement construction in the West Bank and east Jerusalem. Netanyahu has refused to renew a 10-month freeze on construction that expired in 2010.

Abbas will present the resolution in person in New York, according to a UN official speaking on condition of anonymity. A vote is expected to take place by the end of the month, the official said.

Still, the move isn’t without risks.

When the Palestinian Authority was accepted last year into the UN cultural agency UNESCO, best known for its designation of “world heritage” sites, the U.S. response was to cut off funding that provides almost a quarter of the agency’s budget.

The U.S. has said that American law would require similar cutoffs for any UN agency that grants the Palestinians the same status as member states.

International Criminal Court

The upgrade may open the door for Palestinians to join other UN agencies, including the International Criminal Court, where they could ask for Israel to be tried for war crimes.

“Israel’s main worry is the ICC,” Palestinian chief negotiator Saeb Erakat said in an Oct. 24 interview. “They don’t want me to have a sword on their neck.”

The initiative could also jeopardize international aid that accounts for about 14 percent of the Palestinians’ gross domestic product and invite retaliatory measures from Israel.

As for the U.S., the administration’s position hasn’t wavered. The U.S. ambassador to the UN, Susan Rice, has said repeatedly that “unilateral actions,” such as the upgrade of the Palestinians’ UN status, would only derail efforts to restart direct peace talks between Israel and the Palestinians.

I’m not anti Semitic and certainly not pro Palestinian (no dog in the hunt) but if I had a foreign occupant force in my backyard I’d be taking shots at them. If I understood what rights the Jewish people feel they have to this land I might think differently. I haven’t found the answer to this so maybe someone can enlighten me.

They're not in their backyard. Israel withdrew completely from Gaza. You can't possibly consider the entire territory of Israel to be the palestinians' backyard do you? Do you consider the state of Missouri to be unlawfully occupied American Indian territory?

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"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.

I don't know whether the creation of Israel was a mistake or not. But like with the American Indian and US territory, it's ancient history now and Israel is a fact of life. 60+ year old grievances don't justify the terrorism and rocket attacks that palestinians continue to launch against Israel. Israelis would like nothing better than to live in peace next to their Arab neighbors. And if those Arab neighbors are unwilling to give the palestinian population a home, Israel has shown that they are willing to live peacefully next to a palestinian state. Unfortunately, there are a lot of palestinians who don't have peace on their minds.

That is a good analogy and how I view it. And I completely agree that nothing justifies the attacks on people of Israel, but I would probably feel differently if my great grandparent’s farm was taken by a foreign invader. I don't think that the fact that it was water under the bridge would curb my animosity.

They're not in their backyard. Israel withdrew completely from Gaza. You can't possibly consider the entire territory of Israel to be the palestinians' backyard do you? Do you consider the state of Missouri to be unlawfully occupied American Indian territory?

Read The Thousand Year War. It's written more for a young high-schooler but it still has great information and is not a tome. It will fill in information you've never heard. You can get it cheap used too.

You can use that in conjunction with watching the old movie which just makes events real. It at least shows the betrayal by the British to the Arabs which T.E. Lawrence witnessed because he worked for British intel and fought with the Arabs. It's actually a great flick.

Then watch the movie "Exodus" to see it from the Jewish side, which shows how they were friends with Arabs and how the UN partition divides them.

Remember the UN was spawned by the US originally. It replaced progressive Wilson's League of Nations.

I will and thank you. And I drew the same conclusion from the UN partition.

Well, that has nothing to do with what I recognizing Palestine as a state or whether or not we should all be under the global governance of the UN.

For one thing, the IAEA, although independent, reports to the UN General Assembly and Security Council.
I thought you were against the UN enforcing it's mandates for us? Or is this just for other countries and not us? I say you can't have it both ways. You're either for global governance for all or not at all.

However, there is NO real evidence of Iran being in violation of the IAEA. That's disinformation that has been reprinted in the neo conservative and conservative media because they want to start another war for regime change. Israeli intelligence, Mossad, is in broad agreement with the 2007 NIE, authored by the heads of all US intelligence agencies, that the Iranian regime suspended all efforts to build a nuclear bomb in 2003.

But I don't want to turn this thread topic into a major hijack and then bring Big Dick in to waste my time rehashing the same arguments and documents all over again via his rhetorical questions.

That is a good analogy and how I view it. And I completely agree that nothing justifies the attacks on people of Israel, but I would probably feel differently if my great grandparent’s farm was taken by a foreign invader. I don't think that the fact that it was water under the bridge would curb my animosity.

What foreign invaders? Jews were already there before Israel was created. In fact, they were terrorists fighting for a state before it was cool to be a terrorist fighting for a state. Certainly many others emigrated after Israel was created, but they weren't foreign invaders.

When Britain's mandate ended and the UN partitioned the area, two states were created; a Jewish one (which had both Arabs and indigenous Jews in it) and an Arab one (which was almost exclusively Arab). The Arabs didn't like it so they went to war and later were joined by the neighboring Arab states. Even then, the Arabs wanted it all. Israel ended up winning that war, but as a part of the war, many of the Arabs that were in Israel fled (or, I'm sure in some cases, were forced out) and became refugees. This is what they're talking about when the palestinians demand a "right of return". They want to be able to return to Israel and reclaim land that they or their forefathers left 60+ years ago. This will never happen.

But to make a long story short, not only were there not foreign invaders, but it was the Arabs who tried to destroy Israel when they lost their previously held land, not the other way around.

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"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.

I laugh at these people that think you're anti semitic for not blindly following Israels mandate. Both sides are Shem ites.

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"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father ... And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

"If the people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." - Thomas Jefferson