I don't know if we're just burnt out from last year or what, but I'm ready to dump HOD RTR just due to the time it takes us. I've dumped some of it, but frankly it's taking the joy out of the day. And since it has student notebooking pages, if I don't do some aspects, the pages are blank in some areas as a constant reminder that the workload is too much.

I also am not excited about the Bible Study this year. We are reading Philippians again and reading chapters 1-4 ALL YEAR! My dd knows this ad-nauseum. She is bored with it.

So perhaps we need just a year off from HOD, which is all I'd take, and leads me to think about MFW RTR as it's the same basic time period with a good Bible Study attached to it. I'd probably still use some of HOD aspects of the devotional and parts of science, since they have a common science book. But would like to use MFW for history and Bible study.

Anyone compare. I don't to exchange a time problem for another. I think I just need a break from HOD.

I'll link you to a couple of threads on another forum where I posted a good bit of detail about MFW RTR in one thread, and did a comparison of HOD and MFW in another thread. At that time I hadn't seen the HOD RTR manual yet, but I have since then. Since my high schooler has worked independently for about three years now, and my dd #2 didn't want to repeat MFW RTR last year as a 7th grader, I bought HOD RTR for her thinking it might be a good fit because she could work independently from it. However, some of the things I said about HOD CTC in one of the threads below are also true (for me) of HOD RTR, particularly with the amount of time-consuming little "details" for an elementary level overview. Very tedious. Also the notebooking... I feel like the HOD prepared NB pages, while certainly beautiful!, are "confining" in that the student is "boxed in" to do exactly this or that in each box. It's much easier for the student to personalize and add their own special touches to MFW NB pages. At least that's how it works out at our house.

We felt the same way as you about the Philippians study in HOD. Our pastor was preaching through Phil. at the time, which is one reason I thought my dd would be blessed by the study in HOD, but it didn't work out that way. She thought it was boring, slow-moving, and got old really fast. She told me directly that she got more out of our pastor's sermons.

In the end, I just had my dd read some of the books scheduled in HOD last year (she had already read some of them in MFW RTR a few years earlier, and still remembered them, so I didn't make her re-read them unless she wanted to), and then I hand-picked any extra assignments I wanted her to do. But for the most part, it was kind of a waste. She ended up doing more from MOH volume 2 (not 3, in HOD) than anything else.

Well really, that's what HOD ended up being... supplemental for MOH 2. Over the course of the year, she ended up not finishing or even doing half of what was in HOD. She had already done world geography with MFW, and she had already done Astronomy with MFW. As a 7th grader last year, she did Apologia General for science.

Sorry to sound so negative, but you asked for opinions and a comparison, so there's mine. My youngest is doing MFW CTG this year, and will do MFW RTR next year unless I decide to insert ECC in between. Then she'd do RTR the following year. But I'm sticking with MFW for her. I've thought several times that HOD would be a better fit for both of my younger kids, and kept trying it at different levels, but MFW just works better for us regardless of the level.

LOL Donna, I know who you are. I'm going to go check the links. I think besides not liking the Phil study, we're just still burnt out from last year. I feel like we never quit. Perhaps this would be a good change of pace for a year....
Off to go read links.............

Okay...one question. We already covered Rome last year. Do you know when it ends in MFW RTR? I thought I read 13 weeks. I don't think we want to relive it. DD knows that era pretty well as well, unless it's shown in a different light or I can review it. Does the Bible Study tie into that era. I mean we could just do read alouds or the like and the Bible portion and the Roots study if it ties into it until Rome those weeks are finished. Otherwise, I'm not sure what I could do for 13 weeks. Actually doing this sounds sort of peaceful to me at this point. We could do all the other MFW stuff for 13 weeks and Read alouds/chapter books on it instead of the study itself till we hit where we're at now.

So I guess after reading the links (which are awesome by the way) would you know if I could go from HOD CTC to MFW RTR?

aliac,I'm just thinking aloud here...but have you considered doing most of HOD RtR together? After a tough year with CtC and nearly ditching HOD, we started RtR out at half-pace this year. It's been a whole new experience for us...a very good one. I read most of everything aloud and because we are going at our own pace (now at about 3/4 pace plus math each day) it's not a burden to do so. I did consider MFW RtR this year but we would have needed to skip the first 1/3 of the guide in order to not have major overlaps. I also considered Biblioplan but I love having my days carefully guided including science, etc. We are considering dropping the Philippians study only because my dd loves her current Devotional she started this summer and wants to continue it. The Bible Memory work is wonderful, songs included.

Back to MFW RtR: I did purchase and review it and I really liked what I saw but I was concerned that without the book basket, it lacked excitement. HOD RtR feels like MFW RtR with the books scheduled. A few years back when we did MFW Adventures and LOVED it, I did a really poor job of disciplining myself enough to use the Book Basket so I'm guessing that element would be lacking in our home. That's actually what sent me looking (and moving) to HOD. Sometimes, that strict schedule that defines HOD makes us feel too restricted. Whatever the case, bring the love back into your home and make your days joyful by either making a temporary change or permanent one.

Another thought might be to drop all curriculum for several months besides math/grammar and do an interest-led break. We took a full 3 months off this summer with the exception of math/grammar and it really, really helped. CtC was in-depth with a capital I-D but I don't feel the same frustrations at all with RtR. I love the activity choices and book selections. It feels like a completely different publisher to me and much more like HOD's Preparing. I think you might be having a hard time getting over last year (I'm still a little traumatized (lol) and I don't believe I will do HOD CtC again without making some serious history substitutions...I know some love it but it was very tedious for us).

aliac,I'm just thinking aloud here...but have you considered doing most of HOD RtR together? After a tough year with CtC and nearly ditching HOD, we started RtR out at half-pace this year. It's been a whole new experience for us...a very good one. I read most of everything aloud and because we are going at our own pace (now at about 3/4 pace plus math each day) it's not a burden to do so. I did consider MFW RtR this year but we would have needed to skip the first 1/3 of the guide in order to not have major overlaps. I also considered Biblioplan but I love having my days carefully guided including science, etc. We are considering dropping the Philippians study only because my dd loves her current Devotional she started this summer and wants to continue it. The Bible Memory work is wonderful, songs included.

Back to MFW RtR: I did purchase and review it and I really liked what I saw but I was concerned that without the book basket, it lacked excitement. HOD RtR feels like MFW RtR with the books scheduled. A few years back when we did MFW Adventures and LOVED it, I did a really poor job of disciplining myself enough to use the Book Basket so I'm guessing that element would be lacking in our home. That's actually what sent me looking (and moving) to HOD. Sometimes, that strict schedule that defines HOD makes us feel too restricted. Whatever the case, bring the love back into your home and make your days joyful by either making a temporary change or permanent one.

Another thought might be to drop all curriculum for several months besides math/grammar and do an interest-led break. We took a full 3 months off this summer with the exception of math/grammar and it really, really helped. CtC was in-depth with a capital I-D but I don't feel the same frustrations at all with RtR. I love the activity choices and book selections. It feels like a completely different publisher to me and much more like HOD's Preparing. I think you might be having a hard time getting over last year (I'm still a little traumatized (lol) and I don't believe I will do HOD CtC again without making some serious history substitutions...I know some love it but it was very tedious for us).

:grouphug:

This year I vowed to read it all. Even with one kid that is proving tough! So we are doing most together. That isn't working either! We talk too much! LOL!

Well, if I drop it all, then we're (gasp) behind. We're already at the highest grade level and it's not that the info is hard, it's that the days are crammed and I'm sick of saying hurry up! She's getting it all. It's not difficult. I don't want crappy work for the sake of time. If she's going to create something she wants to do it well, but I don't want to be behind because she wants her creations to look nice or not do experiments and their drawings because of "time". I also think there are some that she'd rather see more intricate as far as activities. We've already moved on to the Apologia Notebook pages as there's more activites. Hence...time issue. But otherwise, Apologia would be a bore.

However I thought to drop it all for the 13 weeks that MFW is an overlap of Rome and use HOD's "storytime books" maybe from extensions and just read for fun that historical period as our history. Since HOD is history heavy anyway, we could find joy in other subjects for those weeks. This way, we could go deeper into the HOD science and do all experiments and delve into the MFW Bible period we'd miss for the 13 weeks, doing those activites along with the 3 R's and the IEW writing at a not-at-lightening speed pace. Then after the 13 weeks, we can gradually get back into things using RTR. We'd come out in the same place having a year of less anxiety!

On the other hand I do worry about book basket. But then again if I only use MFW for this year as a breather which is the plan, book basket won't be that significant as a skip if we end up doing so. Frankly, I'd use HOD's selections anyway. They've always proved to be a hit! If we used MFW long term, that's a huge deal for me. Not scheduled, not done! But I only plan one year of MFW.

Traumatized is a good word! We enjoyed CTC. DD really liked it. She liked every-single-book except Mr. Pipes. But frankly, we are really can't do another year like that at that pace.

Okay...one question. We already covered Rome last year. Do you know when it ends in MFW RTR? I thought I read 13 weeks.

Yes, about Week 13.

Does the Bible Study tie into that era.

Absolutely. After reviewing a bit the OT prophecies of Christ and His coming during the height of Rome's power, you read a good chunk of the book of Acts as you're learning about the spread of the church and the Gospel. You memorize a long passage from the book of Romans and begin memorizing 1 Cor. 13. (And then you go on to read a large chunk of the New Testament after that.) You learn about the origin of the Bible, how it got to be the Bible as we know it today, and why and how it is that we can trust it as God's inerrant Word. You study the early church and missionary journeys of Paul. In fact, Acts is scheduled as both Bible and History (some days one or the other, and some days both), so you're not just learning about Ancient Rome during this 13 weeks, but you're learning about the significance of Ancient Rome AND the early church as they relate to one another.... directly from the Bible. The Bible is used as a spine during this era as much as Augustus Caesar's World is... which is phenomenal, btw, given the way Marie brings in the biblical worldview via her teacher notes in the TM.

I mean we could just do read alouds or the like and the Bible portion and the Roots study if it ties into it until Rome those weeks are finished.

The roots study is related because it's the Latin roots, so much of the vocabulary is also in your history and Bible studies. But there's more... at the same time you're learning where Roman numerals came from (one of the first lessons you do from EFTRU, before getting into the Latin roots), you're also learning about the founding of Rome and how children were educated in that day, and there are activities related to that topic.

Otherwise, I'm not sure what I could do for 13 weeks. Actually doing this sounds sort of peaceful to me at this point. We could do all the other MFW stuff for 13 weeks and Read alouds/chapter books on it instead of the study itself till we hit where we're at now.

Oh, there is PLENTY to do during that 13 weeks!

So I guess after reading the links (which are awesome by the way) would you know if I could go from HOD CTC to MFW RTR?

Yep! Some of the first 13 weeks in MFW RTR will be review for the time period in general, but Marie's teaching style is very different from Carrie's. Plus Marie just covers some unique topics during that time.

And if you happen to decide to get God and the History of Art, the history and culture and how religion played a significant role in art will spill over into that, too. Music is a study of the composers of that time period, and you learn about the biblical influences upon the composers and their works, as well.

Let's see, I think you probably read Twice Freed in HOD CTC, right? When did you read The Bronze Bow? Those are two of the first read-alouds scheduled in MFW RTR, so if you're not up for re-reading them again this soon, just replace them with something from Book Basket. There's a LOT to choose from in Book Basket... about 400 titles, give or take. You get video recommendations, too.

On the other hand I do worry about book basket. But then again if I only use MFW for this year as a breather which is the plan, book basket won't be that significant as a skip if we end up doing so. Frankly, I'd use HOD's selections anyway. They've always proved to be a hit! If we used MFW long term, that's a huge deal for me. Not scheduled, not done! But I only plan one year of MFW.

Couple of thoughts on Book Basket:

-- Many of the HOD books are listed in MFW's Book Basket. (MFW was done first, btw, so no, Marie didn't steal any ideas from Carrie. )

-- Marie has asterisked several titles in Book Basket as recommendations for purchase if you prefer not to bother with the library.

Either way, there's no reason you can't go ahead and buy the books you like to use in lieu of MFW's Book Basket. And you might find that your homeschool runs just a little bit more efficiently by using MFW for your "core" subjects, and buying HOD books to use in place of the library (for Book Basket) ... every year.

But then again, maybe not. You may use MFW for a little while, enjoy the break (or not), and have your relationship with HOD completely refreshed by having taken the break. You won't know if you don't try.