232 comments:

Do you think Sharpton and Jackson compete for what dollar exist in the race-hustling game? In other words, if that's the case, is there pressure between them to be the first "resist we much" on the scene at a new white on black crime?

No, Hat, the major racial issue facing our country is that there is a significant part of the black "community" that have either the intelligence of - well, of you - (never use the words niggardly or black hole or picnic, because they're racist) or are convinced that every morning is Groundhog Day and that Bull Connor is waiting outside the Lorraine Motel with his firehoses and police dogs.

Regarding Zimmerman as a pblic figure, it seems to me that in this case, Zimmerman only became a public figure partially because of the fraud (editing the tapes) was committed by various media outlets. He was not really enough of a public figure when the fraud was committed.

Matt Yglesias likes to make fun of conservatives for believing that the major racial issues facing America are the unfair favoritism that minorities are receiving as well as the possibility that white people will be called racist.

I guess we can add to that the threat to white people from racially based violence from black people.

Yes, the major racial issue facing our country is the threat of marauding gangs of blacks terrorizing the white population.

Glad you finally noticed. For every crime a white person commits against a black, nine are committed by blacks against whites. There is a concerted effort by the liberal media to hush this up. Have you heard about:

1. The white kid who was systematically harassed by black teachers and classmates and ultimately set on fire?

The reason that the Zimmerman case even makes the news is because it's a man bites dog story. Ninety-four percent of all black homicides are perpetrated by blacks. However, when you see this statistic, your response is "Yawn", as it is with all race hustlers.

We may have race riots in Florida so I hope they enjoyed their time on the fashionable side of this story.”

The thinking of O'bama and his politico's is interesting. They let O'bama go out and take a position (AGAIN) on a sensitive racial issue. He was always going to win 95% of blacks. perhaps racial confrontation might help drive black turn-out that is 95-5 in his favor, but... Florida is a swing state O'bama really needs to win. demonizing a White-Hispanic in Florida has got to budge those Florida Latino's in the wrong direction. Race riots would backfire against the race mongers IMHO.

Regarding Zimmerman as a pblic figure, it seems to me that in this case, Zimmerman only became a public figure partially because of the fraud (editing the tapes) was committed by various media outlets.

I think that it’s entirely possible that the editing of the 911 tapes by NBC might rise to the level of “actual malice” (knowledge that the information was false or a reckless disregard for the truth) which is the burden of proof for a public figure suing for defamation.

Andy R. said... We may have race riots in Florida so I hope they enjoyed their time on the fashionable side of this story.”

Yes, the major racial issue facing our country is the threat of marauding gangs of blacks terrorizing the white population.

4/2/12 1:35 PM

How many race riots have you ever been in? I have been in two them. Lots of people killed and injured and tremendous property. So if the the race grifters stoke up a race riot in Miami lets send you to walk the streets unarmed in the middle of the riot.

Andy R. said...But it is certainly a more significant racial issue than whites terrorizing blacks. Black-on-white homicide is six times as common as white-on-black homicide.

Racism in this country manifests itself in more ways than just murder.

Also, is your contention that the white people being murdered by black people are because of racial reasons?

You have any proof that no white person has been killed by a black person due to racial animus? You have any evidence that Zimmerman killed Martin because of racial animus? Or that all killings of blacks by whites are are racially motivated. You are amazing, how is it possible to be so stupid and still be able to breathe?

This weekend working spring break with quite a few hoodie wearing roving groups of young people it was noticeable that groups of all color skins were more aggressive.Makes me wonder if the agenda of the media is to make it safe for juvenile males to beat the @#$# out of anyone in authority.

Turn it all around. This was intended to be a JournoList 2.0 effort to limit 2nd Ammendment Rights.

Now we find that its Freedom of the Press that's being abused, conspiracy to libel and instigate race warfare. So I think we need stronger safegaurds in place to limit the Press. They should not be able to do this again without consequence.

"Is there going to be a mass organizing event to persuade people to call NBC sponsors and demand that they not advertise on the NBC network where they deliberately edit tapes to mislead the public?"

-- This seems like a valid reason to boycott NBC and put pressure on their sponsors. If I, you know, actually paid attention to NBC to begin with, I'd join a boycott of NBC. But... this doesn't make sense for me, since they are a non-entity in my life at the moment.

Seriously -- Rush insults a woman who gave testimony to Congress she has admitted to not fully researching (saying she didn't know cheaper alternatives were available), people get upset [rightly so, since his language was a bit rough], and declare an all-out media war on him.

NBC deliberately edits tapes to make a man look like a racist murderer and... some tut-tutting and "people should be fired." ABC uses a graphic to hide part of a video, later admits video does indeed show injury they insisted was not there initially and... nothing?

I wouldn't call that one "racially" motivated. More like a bunch of young idiots trying to take advantage of the situation. Probably done more for the adrenaline high and bragging rights than actually stealing something.

That being said, the flash mob thing is very real here in St Louis and, gasp, it's always happening in black neighborhoods. Scores of white kids are NOT driving to black neighborhoods to commit these crimes.

Again, its not limits to the 2nd Ammendment that we need, its safegaurds to the 1st. Freedom of the Press has been corrupted and abused. We need stonger laws in place so that if they do this again, they can be sued into extinction.

I find it interesting that the young man who was killed is always referred to in the media by his first name "Trayvon" - thus emphasizing his African heritage - while the young man who did the killing is always referred to by his last name "Zimmerman" - thus emphasizing his white heritage. Didn't newspapers and TV and radio outlets used to have a style manual that demanded consistency in these things? Is the term "white Hispanic" in there anywhere? I've never heard it before.

Could it be possible that the shooting was not racist because everyone knows that we live in perilous times, no matter what your race, and these two confused thinking young men tragically met on a famous dark and rainy night.

But could it be possible that the cover-up done by authorities looks 100% racist, and that has been the bomb the the media has been more than happy to set off?

So why are we rational folks taking sides and enlisting in in a Media Staged race war like we are the White Gang that must prove its courage against a Black Gang? Do we go get our Gang Colors and Tats next?

Why don't we just treat what happened as a shooting death to be fully investigated in a proper forum and the case closed with appropriate punishments?

The emotional hype our Professor disdains is erupting from both sides.

But it is not coming from Trayvon's parents, and that should be good news, not more reason to slander the Black Gang.

And why should NBC have it's license renewed when it is presenting disinformation?

I don't know why it should, but I do know why it will: because former NBC parent-co. CEO Jeff Immelt is still in the Obama administration ensuring that gobs of GE cash finds its way to re-election fund and gobs of helpful stories appear on NBC in exchange for gobs of taxpayer money going into things like GE wind turbines.

Fen said...Turn it all around. This was intended to be a JournoList 2.0 effort to limit 2nd Ammendment Rights.

That's my take too. This is less about race than trying to garner sympathy/support for handgun control. Bob Wright echoed that the other day (paraphrase): "I don't want guys like Zimmerman walking around with guns"

I find it interesting that the young man who was killed is always referred to in the media by his first name "Trayvon" - thus emphasizing his African heritage - while the young man who did the killing is always referred to by his last name "Zimmerman" - thus emphasizing his white heritage

This is a standard tactic on the Left.

The first name makes him "one of us", part of the family (witness the much-reprinted photo of him when he was 12). You get the feeling that somebody like Sharpton or the Rev Jessuh will start saying things like, "We picked cotton together. We crossed Omaha Beach together...".

As for Mr Zimmerman, I read one piece that opined if he called himself Jorge, instead of George, that would have affirmed his Hispanic legacy.

Why don't we just treat what happened as a shooting death to be fully investigated in a proper forum

It already has been. The DA, based on crime-scence evidence and witness testimony, decided that Zimmerman acted in self-defense.

and the case closed with appropriate punishments?

How about you pay for Zimmerman's defense? $100,000 to prove what we already know in an effort to satisfy the ignorant and irrational racemongerers. Seems like a small price to pay to keep up appearances, yes?

I must admit that I really enjoy watching my RL liberal friends react to all this.

They are still 3-4 days behind the information loop. I don't say anthing or try to correct them. Its been a very amusing week watching how easily they were manipulated.

You'd think after the Obama HopeyChange con they would be more wary. And it really amazes me how people who are so intelligent and educated can be so very ignorant AND stupid on topics like this. Its as if they were never taught to think for themselves.

Let me add, as someone who hasn't really commented on this case (other than to say that it was obvious to me that Zimmerman was indeed guilty of shooting Martin -- duh) that NBC's selective editing of the 911 tape is horribly, horribly bad.

I'll be very curious to see how many people are fired because of it. Or will they issue a We're sorry if you were offended-type non-apology?

"Trayvon was 17. The images used by major media make him look like he was 14 or 15."

I have a 15 year old daughter and a son that just turned 19. Having plenty of familiarity with how kids look during the middle school ages and high school, I immediately doubted that the shown pictures were of a high school kid.

I also looked up Trayvon's high school and saw that its mascot/nickname wasn't what was printed on any of the football uniforms he was shown in. Over the years, I've learned to be skeptical of the press, if for no other reason than that many journalists aren't that smart although they may be good with words.

Ron, I think the use of Martin's first name is meant to personalize him. While the use of Zimmerman's last name is meant depersonalize him. .

That was my thought as well. There’s been a concerted effort by some (the MSM, the grievance industry, and certain politicians) to make Trayvon Martin as sympathetic and palatable to the public as possible as he is a martyr for ____________ (fill in the cause of the day here). This is in line with initially showing three to four year old pictures to make the “victim” look as young and as innocent as possible. Many people won’t follow the story past the initial reporting and their first impressions of the reporting may be as far as they get in the story.

On the other hand, that can cut the other way as well. People are learning that some of the audio and video footage that’s been put out by ABC and NBC was doctored and that (contrary to initial reports) that the police did in fact take Zimmerman into custody and interrogate him, that they did interview witnesses – including two who said that they saw Martin pounding on Zimmerman, and that the decision not to prosecute was made by the prosecutor rather than the cops. In which case we could see the pendulum swing the other way.

Matt Yglesias likes to make fun of conservatives for believing that the major racial issues facing America are the unfair favoritism that minorities are receiving as well as the possibility that white people will be called racist.

I guess we can add to that the threat to white people from racially based violence from black people.

Going on the little I know.. (and its admittedly very little) I'm remembering a quote from Arthur Conan Doyle that goes something like this..

There comes a time when for every addition of knowledge you forget something that you knew before. It is of the highest importance, therefore, not to have useless facts elbowing out the useful ones.

I ask myself, in this case.. what is a more reasonable explanation of this tragedy?

That Zimmerman went out and premeditatedly sought to kill someone a la Bernhard Goetz?

Or that a young man full of himself (as his tweets attest) thought somebody was following him and thought 'I can take this guy on and kick his ass' a la the youts that tried to mug Bernhard Goetz?

When in the case of Bernhard Goetz the race component was finally stripped away at trial.. Bernhard Goetz was acquitted of the more severe charges and only found guilty of illegally possessing a fire arm.

"Right wing objects to editing of a tape? That's fucking funny, I don't care who you are."

-- This is an example of actual extensive editing, for those upset and unable to determine that introductory, clearly goofy scenes used to set the mood are not the actual point of videos showing people agreeing to help a man engaged in child prostitution.

Does this help you see how most folks understand the accusation someone "edited the tape?" NBC changed the actual meaning of the tape and left things out without letting people know; O'Keefe put the entire thing online for you to view, with a noted, shortened "just the highlights" version.

ScottM--The Walgreens raid might have been oppurtunistic theft but it was thought up and/or executed by more than three people in an affray.And the first response out of the roving little groups of juveniles when confronted by authority was "What the F you going to do about it B"And I'm only about forty years older than them.

Andy R .... I gather from your comments that you're living in the USA now (again?). You might want to update your Google Resume, if you know what I mean .... 'cause as it is now, you certainly would have no idea of black/white race relations of any sort.

Now, me, I've lived several places around the world, so I recognize that as a value....however, I have lived mostly in and around Detroit where I was born, and given that, I suspect I have a much finer feel for black/white relations that you do. 1967 certainly was a banner year, one where I drove to work in the inner city every day, armed to the teeth, for very good reason (42 deaths reported, more in fact) as, yes, there really were marauding black bands, killing people, and being killed.

Funny how, even with that, I had more black freinds in the 60's and 70's than white, how I still love this place warts and all, and still find the majority of the city population to be rather ordinary, more like me than not. Yep their are the noise makers, like Malik Shabazz, but somehow we still get by in peace.

Your condescension doesn't compliment you.

PS: what is in the water today, I keep running off at the mouth ... OMG, it's Biden disease!!

When in the case of Bernhard Goetz the race component was finally stripped away at trial.. Bernhard Goetz was acquitted of the more severe charges and only found guilty of illegally possessing a fire arm.

The weapons charge came several rounds after the original trial, when the Lefties didn't get the verdict they wanted.

It was what they had to settle for. Today, he'd be charged with "hate crimes" and "civil rights violations".

As, I fear Mr Zimmernam will, when the don't get the verdict they want (after which, of course, will come the customary race riots in which half the black part of Miami is burned to the ground).

If his name was Jorge Gonzalez.....do you think we would even be having this discussion?

Probably not. I doubt the cops would have done the cursory investigation and believed everything "Jorge" said. He would have at least spent the night in jail and his self-defense story would have been met with skepticism.

On balance.. the purported racism attributed to Zimmerman with the aid of what NBC could only have been thinking fake but accurate editing.. is way less detrimental than what NBC seems to have done here.

NBC took steps to do this.. it was not like a Zimmerman reacting on the fly.. although it would be beneficial to find out if Zimmerman had received any training..

NBC is part of a giant corporation that presumably has guidelines.. a corporation that shouldn't even be compared to what could a citizen may or may not be thinking at what can only be described as a stressful situation.

Alex...I do not bow to Al Sharpton. The old fool is temporarily empowered by a stage which would not exist but for the crafty cover up.

He and the liberal media can be stopped the day the evidence is presented to the public by the Authorities whose job it is.

Why do you bow to the Zimmerman family, as Seminole County has done, and argue to prevent that evidence from being presented in court under cross examination?

The Zimmermans are the ones playing everyone with crafty tales of being the victims that are facing violence, and stating that is already the guilt of everybody who wants to see an end to the cover up.

They are ahead of the curve with a guilt acccusation like an advance blood libel. What are they really afraid of coming out?

'Yes, the major racial issue facing our country is the threat of marauding gangs of blacks terrorizing the white population."

When it does happen, blacks are the ones who suffer the most violence, not whites. Then their neighborhood becomes radioactive to business investment and jobs, and race relations again get set back years, which also mostly hurts blacks.

As demonstrated by your comment, you couldn't care less about it. That's very left of you.

After all that damage is done to black communities, you can tell them to vote for people like you who really care about them.

Well I gotta say that I thought Trayvon was a young kid shot in the back by one of those racist nuts I know exist and the murder covered up by some Southern police department. Come to find out he was a six-foot-tall football player who wanted people to think he was tough and who was shot from the front during a struggle with a Jewish-Hispanic man of about the same size and weight who had African-American relatives and friends. And the police wanted to prosecute.

It is interesting that TradGuy completely changes his tune re: Zimmerman on the same day the NYT orchestrates the lefty reversal on Z man. TradGuy is still maintaining that the local police perpetrated some kind of cover up. Hmm.

For Althouse:this reversal by the NYT was inevitable (as I predicted a few days ago) as soon as the left figured out that Z man is hispanic, not white. The only surprising thing is that it took so long for the NYT to retool its propaganda.

The NYT, under the beyond lefty partisan leadership of Punch Sulzburger, provides the intellectual leadership for the lefty propaganda machine and sets the daily news agenda for the various lefty MSM outlets (i.e. most of TV and print news). The NYT "change of heart" will ripple through the remainder of lefty media very rapidly.

Right wing objects to editing of a tape? That's fucking funny, I don't care who you are.

There is a difference between editing videos to make it seem something that didn't happen actually happened. I suspect you think that's what happened with Breitbart and ACORN, as well as Breitbart and Shirley Sherrod. However, when he released the full, unedited videos, the videos didn't provide context or explain away the awfulness of ACORN or Sherrod.

The editing of the Zimmerman tape was specifically to make Zimmerman look like a racist. There is a big difference between:

"this guy looks like he's up to no good, he looks black."

and

"Zimmerman said, 'this guy looks like he's up to no good. Or he's on drugs or something. It's raining and he's just walking around, looking about.'

The 911 dispatcher then asked Zimmerman, 'OK, and this guy, is he black, white or Hispanic?'

The Trayvon story didn't flow into the American mainstream like it was supposed to do. It was supposed to breech still-existing divides and wash away recent threats to new levies.

The Trayvon story was meant to rechannel the racial narrative but instead it just pooled and eddied. The damage will be repaired--without reparations.

The potential still exists for another Trayvon story--maybe even a real one with a "better" narrative. Nothing changes in some people's minds. Nothing will change in some people's minds until every last fair-skinned descendant is thoroughly chastened for the nation's second original sin.

Probably not. I doubt the cops would have done the cursory investigation and believed everything "Jorge" said. He would have at least spent the night in jail and his self-defense story would have been met with skepticism.

Really, that's how it would've gone down if he'd half Hispanic (dad side) instead of half Hispanic (mom side)? Where did you glean that amazing piece of knowledge, did it come in through your tin-foil hat?

PS - The cops didn't believe everything he said, it was the DA who made the call not to prosecute because he didn't they had enough evidence to convict Zimmerman. And guess what - They don't!

I would really like to see a discussion of what legally defines "public figure." Reynolds surely knows, so his reference is probably valid. But Zimmerman is only a public figure because the press has demonized him. It doesn't seem fair, and I know fairness is VERY important to progressives.

OMG. Is that really the actual transcript compared to the NBC edit? That may be the most obvious case of Big Lie propaganda that I have ever seen in American "journalism". Wow, I still can't believe it!

Had the Police Chief and the State's Attorney acted as professionals from the start, there would be no "looming race riots". Had there been an arrest and a grand jury presentment, with or without an indictment, none of us would know of Trayvon or George.

I'd love to know what circumstances brought these two clowns to the scene that night. Something smells.

The gloriously absurd "White Hispanic" was the gaudiest reach yet by the carpetbagger classes. Funny though, that led us to collectively realize we had a "White African" in the White House.

Funnier still, a more correct construction of this frenología frito de nuevo would be 'White Hispanolas;" begging the performance of an implicitly hysterical musical satire that (with a little luck) would inspire Eric Idle to arise from retirement with Cleese in tow, mugging a likeness of il Duce del Fascismo in blackpantherface with Farrakhan a fiddling.

"I'd love to know what circumstances brought these two clowns to the scene that night. Something smells."

-- Martin was walking back to where he was visiting, and presumably lost since he was new to the area. Zimmerman was on his way home and saw someone who was acting in a way you don't associate with people in a neighborhood they know.

Think about walking in a parking lot; there are behaviors you expect and those you don't. Someone walking between cars, moving toward a given destination is behaving "as normal," as is a woman standing by the driver's side of a car digging through her purse. A guy who is walking someone in the parking lot, weaving between lanes and looking in cars is acting suspicious. He may have a legitimate reason, someone said they were coming to pick him up, but he doesn't know what car they drive, etc. Likewise, someone just standing near an entrance or an exit might be acting like you expect, checking their watch, looking to see if a bus/ride has shown up. But if there's someone in a parking lot, leaning against one of the pillars watching people as they walk out, that's not normal.

Unfortunately, in this case, Martin's behavior was because he was lost, not because he was a criminal. From there, bad decisions on everyone's part escalated an already tense situation.

That's what brought them there. Mistakes.

----

"What is your problem with the voice analyst's conclusion?"

-- He doesn't have a sample of Zimmerman screaming help me to compare against should be a big one.

And yet you still fellate your Little Black Jesus, who hasn't changed an iota of the "torture" you wank yourself raw over when it comes to the right.

I know Hat and garbage are the internet equivalent of a homeless bum shiting his pants and screaming about the Bilderbergers, Freddie, but the rest of us are a bit more intelligent. Go peddle your selective outrage at the Kos pigsty.

Patrick Ryan @6:25... Thanks for weighing in cogently. You seem to get it.

I belive you meant that you wanted to know what brought the Police Chief and the States Attorney to the scene that night acting like two clowns and not as Professionals would act.

Just to irritate my friend Dr Spock-Revenant, what if Zimmerman, Sr is in Federal witness protection of some sort.

The father somehow has told the locals what he expects for them to do and someone made a call to to the Florida higher ups who showed up did it. One of whom has oddly gone on leave and washed his hands of the case in favor of Feds.

Also Zimmerman Sr seemed to have a good legal mind, and he definitely has a good PR advisor, and he has never been shown on camera and he has been taken to a secret location.

Had there been an arrest and a grand jury presentment, with or without an indictment, none of us would know of Trayvon or George.

An arrest for what?

I'm not in favor of arresting people on trumped-up charges just to keep a bunch of racially-obsessed lowlifes happy. If that's what it takes to have "racial harmony" then you'll need to explain why racial harmony is a goal non-black Americans should be interested in.

Oh Garage. Did you have your buddies do your homework in middle school, too?

I'll go out on a limb and say that if this voice analyst said it was Zimmerman, Instapundit, you, and everyone else on the right would be his biggest backer. Drudge would have the red sirens going off, and this guy would be living in the Fox studios. I'm not saying the left isn't tribal, but you guys are as predictable as the sun rising in the east.

"I'll go out on a limb and say that if this voice analyst said it was Zimmerman, Instapundit, you, and everyone else on the right would be his biggest backer. Drudge would have the red sirens going off, and this guy would be living in the Fox studios. I'm not saying the left isn't tribal, but you guys are as predictable as the sun rising in the east."

-- Just like that Heritage memo was totally not fake or stolen, right?

People on both sides get suckered easily. Here, at least (and on most blogs like Hot Air and Ace), conservatives are well, more conservative and tend to wait. Moe Lane, too, seems very reserved before buying whatever comes out.

It is a skill the right has learned after having their trust abused time and time again, such as the Duke Lacrosse case.

The media does the left no favors by cocooning them in safety from dissenting ideas and facts. When it does that, you get the fallout we had last week where the left realizes: "My God, some people don't actually agree the mandate is constitutional!" when they hear arguments that have been being made for nearly two years.

Last time I checked.. people get fed on predictability.. predictability is a good thing.. when was the last time you did anything without making a prediction in no uncertain terms as to the outcome of the endeavor?

Let me recommend that everyone read all of Tom Maguire's posts on his JustOneMinute blog that relates to the Martin-Zimmerman fiasco. Very informative, well researched stuff that kept me reading for more than an hour this afternoon.

In the Duke Lacrosse case it was obvious to a lot of people, oddly mostly conservative, that the DA and liberal press were railroading white people of privilege because it suited their narrative.

The similarity here is that again we can see the press is all about a narrative leftists want to promote, for self serving interests.

The difference is the way the conservatives are behaving. They aren't saying Zimmerman is innocent. They are saying they don't know. Leftists want this to be about Zimmerman's guilt, or failure of the system to prove his guilt, in order to advance their agenda, and they seem prepared to go pretty far in order to do so.

I don't know the circumstances of the shooting. Zimmerman's story seems credible, but I don't know.... In the world of factuals, I don't think there is any credible information that Zimmerman is a racist. But there is a wealth of information that indicates that the media is trying to portray him as a racist. Not just this edited NBC tape. CNN claims that in some other tape, Zimmerman can be heard calling Trayvon a "coon". When you listen to the tape, you can hear no such thing. It's indicepherable. I don't know the race of the 911 operator, and my bet is neither did Zimmerman. It doesn't make sense that he would be using that kind of language....But it's now the accepted narrative that Zimmerman called Trayvon a coon and that he spotted him because he was black and wearing a hoodie. These things are just not true, and they have been used to poison the case against Zimmerman.

If you look up the histories of the Dreyfus, Sacco & Vanzetti, and Alger Hiss cases, you will see that the evidence is irrelevant. It's like a religion. People believe what they want to believe, and no evidence will shake their opinions.

MSNBC, et al. made George Zimmerman into a public figure by falsely reporting about him, and they can't later hide behind that higher public-figure standard when he sues them for defamation (or would it be "false light," assuming FL recognizes that cause of action?). His burden of proof in a defamation action is the least of his worries, right now.

As for the voice "expert," why all the MSM coverage when it undercuts the Martin-family version? The funeral director said Martin had not a mark on him (save for the gunshot wound) which totally supports Zimmerman's claim that Martin was the aggressor (and so Zimmerman must have been the screamer).

Much ado, much ado.

The bigger story is the arbitraging of Martin's death by leaders in the African American community -- including Obama and his buy-my-hoodie-show-your-team tweet -- and the complete and utter absence of outrage from the AA community.

What garage is trying to say, if I read between the lines.. 'its not often my side is in retreat this badly.. ever since the Fluke flop.. followed by the Supremes Oral fizzle.. and now (the old reliable racial play) Trayvon/Zimmerman tumult is turning into a major embarrassing tangle'...

Matthew, he has been told that at least a dozen times. I've seen it. Okay, fine, three times. Okay fine, once before. My point is that it doesn't matter how many times that ridiculous comparison is debunked, it is thought useful as a nettle so you'll see it over and over X ∞.

1) They consulted 12 analysts and only used 2 of them for their story. Guess why?

2) Actual experts in the field say that you need the subject to provide a record of his own voice using the same words and tone that you are testing against. Your experts didn't do that.

3) The Chronicle claims its not a match, when its actually 48% (again, likely because of point #2). So simply don't trust them, especially after the way the CBS experts were deliberately misrepresented to back up Dan Rather. We've seen this game played out before.

4) Its unscientific. Instead of saying "its only a 48% match of Zimmerman so by elimination it must be Martin", they should have tested against Martin's voice. I'll wager they would have returned a result less than 48%.

Tom Owen. Is he really a "forensics expert?"Well, no. He has a B.A. in History, not forensics.

Well, surely since he's an expert, he went to Harvard or Yale or Oxford, right?Well, no he went to Bellarmine College in Kentucky. You've heard of Bellarmine College, right? ......What about his wife Jennifer Owen ... surely she's a hotshot FBI forensics examiner, right?No, she makes Powerpoint presentations and is a secretary with a political science degree, not a forensics degree.

But surely they have an advanced forensic acoustics laboratory where they conduct their forensic analysis right?No, they just have a computer in the basement of their house in New Jersey right next to the railroad tracks.

But surely he's a member of the American Board of Recorded Evidence?Yes, but he and his wife run the Board. He's the chairman, and she's a board member. The Board is run out of a weight-loss clinic in Springfield, Missouri along with a bunch of other dubious "boards," "colleges" and "Institutes."American Board for Certification in Homeland Security‎ - Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield, MOAmerican Association for Integrative Medicine Inc - Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield, MOAmerican College of Forensic‎ Examiners International - Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield, MOCCollege of Wellness - Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield, MOAmerican Psychotherapy Association - Address: 2750 East Sunshine St. Springfield, MO

There are no colleges or real boards here. There's a fat farm weight loss clinic at that location. They appear to have certified themselves experts by running this board themselves.

Now, let's examine the software they used to perform their analysis. How good is it?

Well, given two KNOWN samples of speech by President Richard M. Nixon, the software only matched two recordings to a 86% match.

Remember, Mr. Owen said he'd expect a 90% match before he concluded that the voices were identical. Although when he's testifying in murder cases, he claims a 68% match is enough to send someone to prison for the rest of their life (CT v Sheila Davalloo). Even in the software makers own demonstration of the product, using two KNOWN samples of speech from the same famous person, there was only an 86% match.

What about the algorithm they're using to make the comparison? How good is it? UNKNOWN. That's proprietary. They won't tell you what they're actually measuring.

The guy's a fraud. But, fraud, as a form of lying, is one of the foundations of left wing thought and ideology.

I guess you could argue that a racist would leave a low speed chase 911 call trail.. and shoot Travon in the chest.. as made clear by the immutable laws of physics, when someone is running away from you and you shoot them.. the bullet turns in mid air and strikes you in the chest.. as proven by the Warren Commission.

One of the things that we know for sure (unless the police are just making things up) is that Zimmerman said as he was put in the police car that he had called out for help and no one helped him. This is from the police report.

For the voice to not be Zimmerman he would have to have precognitively recognized the importance of the help screams and formulated a plan to mislead the law by claiming to be the screamer.

He would have had to do this within minutes of being sucker punched and beat about the head, then shooting and killing a man for the first time in his life, and then being held at gunpoint while still armed by the police, and then being cuffed and placed under arrest.