[SHOT 2016] Kriss and Sphinx History

I stopped at the Kriss booth to see if they were going to share when we might see the Sphinx Standard starting to ship when I noticed a beat to hell Vector in a glass case. I stopped my friend Mytchel mid sentence to ask what the deal was with the Vector. Mytchel informed me that I was looking at Vector number 1, the prototype, serial number 1. I am not the biggest fan boy of the Vector even though the new Gen 2 9mm is amazing to shoot, but I can truly appreciate something special like Vector number 1.

I also spied three Sphinx pistols in the case next to it that looked a bit off and not quite like the Sphinx SDP that I have grown to love. The case had Sphinx 2000 and 3000 models that were used as the basis that the design of the Sphinx SDP pistols was born from. When I asked Mytchel if there were plans to bring the 2000 or 3000 back into production I was told that there were mo plan at this time. Maybe if all of you yell loud enough they might bring these great sporting pistols back to the market.

Patrick is a Senior Writer for The Firearm Blog and works in the shooting sports industry. He is an avid recreational shooter and a verified gun nerd. With a lifelong passion for shooting, he has a love for all types of firearms, especially handguns and the AR-15 platform. Patrick may be contacted at tfbpatrick@gmail.com.

The above post is my opinion and does not reflect the views of any company or organization.

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Twilight sparkle

I wouldn’t really call that beat to hell, I’ve recieved guns from the factory looking worse than that, unless the camera is having issues capturing everything.

Patrick R.

For something on display at shot it was pretty rough.

aguywhoknows

The 2000 and 3000 series won´t come back, no matter how loud we all yell.

There might be a replacement called SDP Production, which is a all-steel SDP with a special slide and maybe upgrades like a magwell and stuff.

Patrick R.

A guy can hope right?

LV-426

These are some neat prototypes too…….

mikewest007

Wow. Last time I saw stuff like that, it was in “Alien: Resurrection”.

Kovacs Jeno

Sphynx Switzerland gone bankrupt. Finito.

aguywhoknows

Yes, but all the rights to the guns were transfered to Kriss. Sphinx Systems as a company is dead, the products (Sphinx SDP and so on) will live on.
Few former Sphinx employees work for Kriss now and do things like customer service based from Switzerland.

iksnilol

SOoo… the Americans own Sphinx now?

…

Won’t surprise me if quality takes a nosedive :/

Marc

“KRISS USA is the North American extension of the Switzerland based KRISS Group”

I’m sure they just expanded into the US because of international arms trade shenanigans.

iksnilol

Oh, thank sweet Buttery Jesus.

Phew.

I was kinda worried there… No offense.

Stan Darsh

From what the rep said, all Sphinx firearms will now be made entirely in the U.S. from now on and be branded Kriss products. No more Swiss manufacturing at all, from now on it is all American.

iksnilol

Ah…

Well, I saved about 3500 USD.

BrandonAKsALot

Ahh, the Kriss/Vector. The single worst firearms purchase I have ever made in my life. And I owned a Taurus. I could not sell that thing fast enough.

C. Her

I’m curious to why? I’m a wannabee Kriss owner that has been slowly saving up for this toy that has no hunting purpose and no competition purpose.

BrandonAKsALot

Just as a precursor, I lusted after one for 4 years before I bought one. I was a huge fan of the idea and I love exotic and different firearms. I had the newest version of it at the time about 2 years ago.

First off, when I received the gun one of my first impressions was just how cheap the whole thing felt. The polymer was super easy to flex everywhere, there were sharp seems where it was joined, and most of the controls seemed to have little to no thought behind them.

The charging handle is near impossible to work if you don’t hold it correctly. I mean, it is physically impossible to pull if you do not have your hand as close to the body of the gun as possible. The trigger is meh and the bolt catch is right were I would comfortably rest my hand, so when the bolt would lock back, it was very unpleasant. It hurt like hell to say the least.

The stock is just so badly designed. The LOP adjustment requires you to loosen screws and the stock latch thing that keeps it in place just does not work. It’s a hook that catches on the stock, but the stock is so loose and wobbly that if you tilt the gun around, it will fall off the latch and open up. Not to mention is just the flimsiest stock I’ve probably ever used.

The sights, while quality being Diamondhead, were not even close to bore sighted and that is unacceptable for a $1500 gun. The design of the gun, being two halves, with the barrel on the bottom and the sight plane on the top, suck. I zeroed in my red dot and it lost zero by the next range trip. Plus, the non-captive pins for takedown are just dumb and a poor design choice IMO. This isn’t HK in the 50’s, so it’s time to move on to captive takedown pins or a similar retained option.

Now to the real meat of the thing: the Kriss system does nothing positive IMO. The movement of the bolt off axis actually created a super unpleasant vibration throughout the entire gun and made it more difficult to stay on target. I felt a considerable amount more vertical vibration than I’ve ever felt with any other blowback firearm. Quick follow up shots were just not happening for me with it. Plus, it just ran so filthy for some reason. After just 50 rounds, there was carbon residue everywhere and it was all over the outside of the ejection port. Beside the Micro Eagle, it is the only other firearm I actually hated shooting. Everything about it was just so awful and it kind of hurt after a while. I put 600 rounds through it and was so heart broken by my disappointment, I immediately sold it at a loss just so I didn’t have to look at it anymore.

Patrick R.

The design makes a ton more sense if it is in it’s intended configuration.

BrandonAKsALot

I can see the aid in muzzle rise, but at the expense of sight picture. I’ve never used a blowback .45 before, but I don’t see much on the claim of reduction of actual felt recoil. You can’t cheat physics and the impulse from the cartridge is already transferred to the firearm before the action ever begins to move. I have just never been so depressed about a gun.

Patrick R.

I have shot full auto blow back .45s and found the recoil on the .45 Vector to be much more manageable.

BrandonAKsALot

Unfortunately you can’t really compare apples to apples with it to see how much the off axis bolt travel really does. The ergonomic configuration of it does offer an advantage with the barrel being low and inline with the grip. There’s no way to say how much of it being more controllable is directly related to that or not because there is nothing else that is designed in that way.

There are really a lot of variables and forces to look at and even things like bolt travel distance can change a lot about felt recoil. Bolt weight obviously plays a major factor and maybe if they do release the 9mm we can see it compared to an MP5 since there isn’t a roller delayed .45 ACP sub gun or carbine.

Adam

I know two guys in the Philippines who are really disappointed, Both guns broke in exactly the same spot around the 3000-4000 round mark on full auto.. I know both were using reloads.. but they use the same reloads in their IPCS guns..

Patrick R.

Care to share more information? Where did they break?

Adam

Apparently broke Just behind the magazine well, a crack about 5-6 cm long running lengthways. They will probably just go up to Danao and get whole new lowers made for a couple of hundred each.

C. Her

I really appreciate you taking the time to explain to me about your experience. Everything you’ve said makes absolute sense especially with the barrel on the lower half but sights on the upper half. Luckily the newest generation II Kriss’s will have a milspec sized tube to fit stocks made for AR’s and it is no longer foldable, but will this improvement be enough for me to finally whip out my credit card? I’ve only had 50rds of experience with the 1st generation Kriss sold to the civilian market. I will have to take a closer look and research user reviews because I don’t want this to be a $2,000+ mistake ($1500 for the Kriss and $500 budgeted for an Aimpoint red dot). Plus the other thing that bothers me was that they used to have a lifetime warranty that is now only 1 year. What prompted this sudden drastic change? Thanks again sir.

BrandonAKsALot

Definitely try it first if you can. I don’t know, maybe I expected it to be something it’s not, but I was not happy with it in any way.

SpartacusKhan

I really like the idea of a full size sphinx coming back, great pistols – but I have grown to prefer CZ in all cases. There’s always Tanfoglio as well, though.

Andrew Max

you should see the old P90 prototypes.

LV-426

Awesome!

Captain Obvious

Well….the Sphinx pistols are pretty ugly and the Vectors themselves look like some sort of a Rube Goldberg contraption. So thanks, but no thanks.

Patrick R.

You should probably get some glasses.

Patrick R.

Have you not seen a Glock in slow motion? I think we can all agree that those are tough as nails. That kind of movement is not uncommon with polymer guns.

BrandonAKsALot

My issue with the polymer wasn’t a concern of it breaking or anything like that. It was more a comment on it’s a very pricey gun and just felt cheap. There are metal reinforcements in the key areas, so I wouldn’t say it’s just some dinky toy. You can see how much the stock bends in the video though, which goes back to how much I hated it. I loved the look of it, but it’s so flimsy feeling and has way too much movement.