i'm confused....did no one read the thorough review that FBIS did after he received his car back from Vishnu? i mean there are no drag or 60-130 times like everyone's crying for....but he did provide independent dyno results (consistent 630+whp runs before updated DME flash). no way am i jumping in on the "bag on Vishnu/FFTEC ST kit" ...i like layin' low on the sidelines...but FBIS' dyno results were consistent with what was expected i think. there are obviously many factors involved when talking time slips (suspension setup, tires, driver mod, etc.)....but at least the power is there.

Vishnu basically built a DYNO QUEEN. And because majority of people on the forums are stupid & fail to understand how to read a dyno graph, everyone just brags about how much WHP it makes. But like a lot of people over here / people who've argued with the ST, an RB car running a quality tune with PUmp + Meth/Race Gas/E85 can perform equally in the 1/4 mile (no 60-130 times still).

Who cares if the power is there, if it's completely useless then why even bother having it at all? If anything it just makes you look like a bigger $#@! after spending ~$10k on the ST kit & then losing to a car with xxx WHP less

Vishnu basically built a DYNO QUEEN. And because majority of people on the forums are stupid & fail to understand how to read a dyno graph, everyone just brags about how much WHP it makes. But like a lot of people over here / people who've argued with the ST, an RB car running a quality tune with PUmp + Meth/Race Gas/E85 can perform equally in the 1/4 mile (no 60-130 times still).

Who cares if the power is there, if it's completely useless then why even bother having it at all? If anything it just makes you look like a bigger $#@! after spending ~$10k on the ST kit & then losing to a car with xxx WHP less

That applies to a lot of platforms and cars in general. If you're a dumbass and can't match a chassis properly with a power level; then you will have an inherently slow car no matter how much power you got. I said from day one; this will never be a viable 10 second daily driver... there is simply too much to give up to gain so little and still keep the characteristics of a BMW. But nooooooo.... everyone argued and argued. This whole entire chassis is useless above 500 WHP.

That applies to a lot of platforms and cars in general. If you're a dumbass and can't match a chassis properly with a power level; then you will have an inherently slow car no matter how much power you got. I said from day one; this will never be a viable 10 second daily driver... there is simply too much to give up to gain so little and still keep the characteristics of a BMW. But nooooooo.... everyone argued and argued. This whole entire chassis is useless above 500 WHP.

why is this exactly?. suspension characteristics better for track work or something?

i mean.. surely if you had a fully built vargas Stage 3 setup making 800whp it'd be good for 10's? lol

That applies to a lot of platforms and cars in general. If you're a dumbass and can't match a chassis properly with a power level

Well I don't think the chassis is useless above 500 WHP, I just think it's useless at this power levels without a serious investment (suspension, drivetrain, LSD, and chassis reinforcement). Even the HPF E46 M3s need heavy reinforcement to the subframe or else it's a matter of time until you basically rip the backend out.

BUT the problem is that Shiv doesn't wanna own up to this because that means additional investments & everybody over there wants big HP on a budget. I'm pretty sure the Supra guys encountered this, but ask BoostLogic/Titan Motorsports what it takes to build a 1,500 WHP Supra & they'll prob warn/prepare you that you're check books about to take a beating.

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

why is this exactly?. suspension characteristics better for track work or something?

i mean.. surely if you had a fully built vargas Stage 3 setup making 800whp it'd be good for 10's? lol

LOL... u got it...

Originally Posted by benzy89

Well I don't think the chassis is useless above 500 WHP, I just think it's useless at this power levels without a serious investment (suspension, drivetrain, LSD, and chassis reinforcement). Even the HPF E46 M3s need heavy reinforcement to the subframe or else it's a matter of time until you basically rip the backend out.

BUT the problem is that Shiv doesn't wanna own up to this because that means additional investments & everybody over there wants big HP on a budget. I'm pretty sure the Supra guys encountered this, but ask BoostLogic/Titan Motorsports what it takes to build a 1,500 WHP Supra & they'll prob warn/prepare you that you're check books about to take a beating.

All of a sudden my whole comment makes a whole lot of sense if you consider the investment, effort and cons involved as opposed to getting a different car altogether.

That applies to a lot of platforms and cars in general. If you're a dumbass and can't match a chassis properly with a power level; then you will have an inherently slow car no matter how much power you got. I said from day one; this will never be a viable 10 second daily driver... there is simply too much to give up to gain so little and still keep the characteristics of a BMW. But nooooooo.... everyone argued and argued. This whole entire chassis is useless above 500 WHP.

exactly. imo...you're buying the turbo kit (or any turbo kit on any platform) to give you xxx amount of hp....not to properly set up the car for making spectacular runs. this topic has been beat down more than Asa Akira in an interracial gangbang....NO turbo kits include suspension/chassis mods, lsd, weight reduction, etc. why is this kit expected to be any different? when Shiv did his initial testing and runs for Edmund's mag (or whatever it was)...he disclosed every mod that had been done as far as chassis setup, etc. i looked at that as showing what the kit was capable of....not what my car would do if i bolted the kit onto a completely stock car. yeah...i'm sure there were some readers out there who thought "wow....i can bolt this sucker on and run 10's all day"...but i think we can agree that these are folks who should not have a setup like this in their posession.

anyways.....someone asked for the link to FBIS review. here's both links...one on his initial impressions (this includes dynos) and the other with his impressions after reflash (no dyno info):

All of a sudden my whole comment makes a whole lot of sense if you consider the investment, effort and cons involved as opposed to getting a different car altogether.

I mean, to justify the expense, it comes down to two specific factors (IMO):

If you decide to move to a different platform, is it better suited (or a more proven) platform? If you're jumping into a 997 Turbo, GTR, Z06, I think you're making a better choice long-term

How much are you realistically ready to invest into the car? Figure a reasonable used N54 335 is $25k & you want to boost it up take it to nearly ~700 WHP, you better be ready to double your initial investment & put another $25k in.

Yeah, I agree with everyone that 40k AUD (42k USD) for a turbo is steep, but you have to look at it from the Australian context. There are currently NO options for anyone in any RHD market for ANYTHING past stage 2 upgrades. There just isn't.

If someone is willing to develop a product for a new market, they probably deserve a price premium. Obviously, not everyone is willing to pay that price. However, Advan have said there will be 1 kit on the shelf so they really only need 1 buy to pay that premium.

Remember, people pay $800+ (840USD) for their hidden trunk meth tank. Not to mention you yanks need to pay an extra $200 shipping to the states.

Unfortunately, everything in Australia is expensive. My 2008 135i would be worth 40k (if it were stock) and my 2007 335i would be worth a similar amount. My 2010 SS RHD Camaro is still insured for $100K! Seriously. What are these cars worth in US? A third of that?

The US market has many more cars especially BMW's so they will be cheaper. Still, $40k for a turbo setup is $40k for a freaking turbo setup. A gallardo kit from UGR starts at $25k. RHD S54 M3 kits are cheaper. Even with a built motor.

If someone wants to pay that go right ahead. Maybe we should start a list now...

Of course it's useless, we don't see his brilliance. So, we're idiots.

i should probably just give up on my swap then >_>

Originally Posted by dontask

Yeah, I agree with everyone that 40k AUD (42k USD) for a turbo is steep, but you have to look at it from the Australian context. There are currently NO options for anyone in any RHD market for ANYTHING past stage 2 upgrades. There just isn't.

If someone is willing to develop a product for a new market, they probably deserve a price premium. Obviously, not everyone is willing to pay that price. However, Advan have said there will be 1 kit on the shelf so they really only need 1 buy to pay that premium.

that's true . the 'best beaches in the world' tax. but everyone thought vishnu's $10k was steep... and like i said, my whole build won't total $40k. and even if it does, subtract $12-$15k for startup overheads.. and you're left with a lot of profit.

I still have no explanation why vishnu's kit wouldn't it RHD anyway, i really would just think it's a downpipe pathing issue which is easy enough to overcome for a single?

Just a thought.. when i'm done, if the results turn out as good as i hope... i should probably look into monetizing it then, if you can charge such large figures? haha

Originally Posted by Sticky

The US market has many more cars especially BMW's so they will be cheaper. Still, $40k for a turbo setup is $40k for a freaking turbo setup. A gallardo kit from UGR starts at $25k. RHD S54 M3 kits are cheaper. Even with a built motor.

If someone wants to pay that go right ahead. Maybe we should start a list now...

$40k is getting into AMS-GT-R territory too isn't it?

. isn't about the $50k mark a 1000hp S54 HPF kit?

ED:

$20,500.00 for a RHD twin turbo 602Bhp kit$49,500.00 for a LHD single turbo 1100BHP kit$31,995.00 for a LHD single turbo 960 BHP kit.

I still have no explanation why vishnu's kit wouldn't it RHD anyway, i really would just think it's a downpipe pathing issue which is easy enough to overcome for a single?

The Vishnu ST kit doesn't work for the same reason the bigger HPF S54 Turbo Kits don't work on RHD E46 M3s. There's just not enough clearance for the drive shaft to clear the manifold & larger single turbo. It's just a lot easier for the drive shaft to clear two smaller turbos & shorter routed manifolds.

The Vishnu ST kit doesn't work for the same reason the bigger HPF S54 Turbo Kits don't work on RHD E46 M3s. There's just not enough clearance for the drive shaft to clear the manifold & larger single turbo. It's just a lot easier for the drive shaft to clear two smaller turbos & shorter routed manifolds.

isn't it just a single 4" downpipe of the vishnu? it can follow the stock path then.?

and isn't the steering rack situated slightly to the rear of the engine block? i'll have to look at mine again, but last time i checked it was miles away from the block/turbos. if you can't fit it in a turbo kit like that, there'd be no way you could even fit a high-mount :/.. if it has to do with the downpipe.

and with the manifolds being a similar shape and not much biggerthan OEM... well you'd have to have them multiple inches larger... and especially for the N54, the single turbo roughly situated in the middle of the block, between 4/5, compared to the rear twin sitting underneath the middle of the second cylinder.. miiiiiiiiiiiiiles away

that HPF twin kit is a totally different story as it's low low low low mounted lol. practically a stealth mount... you couldn't even fit them in the N54 stock locaton.. and the whole fitment of the S54 is.. well not designed to have a turbo (or even two) - the N54 doesn't have it's turbos (or a large one) mounted right next to the RHD.. in fact, looking at pics of the visnu setup, it's 'front' mounted, roughly where the front turbo would be in the stock setup... and yeah, it looks like the DP goes straight, right through where the rack would be