Oh but performace issues ARE what they once were. They have not diminished in any way whatsoever.

The algorithm of choice is something entirely different.
I'm talking about using malloc/free versus Java garbage collection, to name one example.

The Boss pays me a lot of money, and I'm sure he wants me to produce as much as possible and not waste my time with memory management.

Note that I do almost all my programming in C++, but I'm getting quite good at Java because I feel that my productivity is higher in Java than in C++.

06-10-2004

DavidP

>I believe Java is not used widely outside of universities.

Really? I truly wish that was so because I am not a big Java fan, but I believe you are wrong. Just open up your newspaper and go to the jobs section. Or get on to monster.com. You will notice otherwise.

>C# is the way to go and it will prove even more evident with Longhorn.

C# is a beautiful language and I would love to develop in it, and there are certainly several jobs in C# out there right now. But as long as Microsoft isnt porting it to every platform known to man just like what has been done with Java, C# will only be used with Windows (and now with Linux since a 3rd party group ported it to Linux). It isnt fully multiplatform like Java is, and therefore there will still be a very large market out there for Java programmers. I would love to see C# become much bigger, because I like C# a lot, and I think it eventually will. But that wont be for awhile yet because Microsoft is only focusing on C# for Windows and nothing else.

06-10-2004

Sang-drax

How come you dislike Java so much, but love C# so much? They are as I understand quite similar.
C# has gotten much from Java.

Java does not allow overloading of operators. Being able to overload operators has always made things quite convenient. For example, in C++ you can simply overload the << and >> operators using ostream and istream to output or input any type of object you want. That is a heck of a lot better that using the trillion different types of readers, writers, input streams, and output streams that Java has.

Java has always been quite bulky when it comes to typecasting, and using primitive data types is always a nuisance when you want to put them into a list or tree of some sorts because you always have to create a new object. And then when you get them out of the data structure you have to typecast out of it and then get the value using something like intValue() or whatever. This specific problem is now solved with the new features being added in Java 2 1.5.0, but they should have been added a LONG time ago. C# has never had that problem.

Also, Java's String class is gimp and can do virutally nothing. There is a class (is it StringStream...or something of that nature) that is meant to give Strings more versatility, but even it does not measure up to the string class of C#, and BOTH C# and Java's string classes dont measure up to the STL string class of C++. The STL string class of C++ is the most versatile and powerful string class I have ever seen in my life.

06-10-2004

caroundw5h

I said I wasn't gonna get caught up in this redundant and ridiculous verbal shove of "my language is better", but:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidP

It is saying those kind of things that make you a bad programmer.

Hardly. Are you serious?

Quote:

C++ is the future of intense perfomance applications and games. Java is the future of multiplatform applications and embedded applications. C#....who knows where that will go

I wish I had the crystal ball you have. I"d love to see the future. too. Can you tell me where the latest algorithm for optimizing the net is gonna come from? or maybe what the next best language is gonna be. I"m sure you know about the ones that are in development now. Using new programming techniques. Tell me please.

Quote:

....Python? It might be used, but it aint going to ever be the flagship of anything. Sorry, bud.

what does being a flagship have anything to do with the language. You use whichever language is best for the task at hand. If you want ease of use, little learnign curve, high productivity. Python is the way to go. I don't think Eric raymond said python was his favorite language for sh**s and giggles. You might also wanna check out who uses python.

DavidP. honestly, this argument is redundant. I can't imagine how many times it blazes across boards on the net. If you want more info about the relevance of python, do a search
, ask NASA, check out the popular file sharing tool that corporations are trying to cash in on now, you might have heard of it its called bittorent. Or better yet, if you wanna know about python just ask google
they'll tell you exactly how relevant python is. And while your at it read this little article.

as to how old i am. Check my profile. and WTF about that quote: jack of all trades master of none?? whats the relevance.

I wasnt saying Python is a bad language. I wasnt saying it is not used in the professional world. I was simply countering your immature remark of:

PYTHON OWNS!!!!
PYTHON IS THE FUTURE!!!!

Because your remark has about 0% truth in it.

06-10-2004

caroundw5h

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidP

I wasnt saying Python is a bad language. I wasnt saying it is not used in the professional world. I was simply countering your immature remark of:

PYTHON OWNS!!!!
PYTHON IS THE FUTURE!!!!

Because your remark has about 0% truth in it.

dude you need to lighten up or get out more. notice the smilies in that post??

as for remarks having truth, how can you talk of truth and then not give me scientific evidence of your quote

Quote:

C++ is the future of intense perfomance applications and games. Java is the future of multiplatform applications and embedded applications. C#....who knows where that will go

I"m kidding. That too is a joke. heres the smilies to prove it.
:D :p and the last one ;)

06-10-2004

Zach L.

If you all step back a minute, maybe you'll see just how ridiculous this argument is getting. It is quite good entertainment, I must say.

06-10-2004

gandalf_bar

Thank guyz..... you are very helping......
My mind changes now.......

06-10-2004

loopy

I'm learning C, I have a ways to go yet. : )

06-10-2004

jverkoey

we should start a new board here at cboard classified as "completely useless flamewars" and use it as a museum of entertainment so we can see all of the people's simple questions that got turned in to flame wars ;) I've gotta say I agree with Zach here. Let's look back at the original question, which was basically "which other language should I learn?"

I'd have to say you should learn whatever suits you best. Like many people have already pointed out, there's pros and cons to each language, so it's really just a matter of what you'll use it for. I personally know C/C++ very well, but I've also taken a class on Java so I at least partially understand it. I've found that just like with spoken languages, once you learn a second language, other languages become much simpler to learn because most follow the same rules.

So in other words, if you need to learn C#, learn C#! and same goes with Java or Python or whatever else!

If you don't need to learn anything else, I'd suggest learning either Java or C#, as both of them are being used more and more nowadays (i'm pretty sure at least...check me if i'm wrong). So i'd suggest going with one of those two languages as a secondary.

-Good luck!

-The opinions above may or may not be correct, so if any of them don't agree with yours, I'm sorry in advance (to prevent any further flaming)

06-10-2004

Mister C

Quote:

we should start a new board here at cboard classified as "completely useless flamewars" and use it as a museum of entertainment so we can see all of the people's simple questions that got turned in to flame wars I've gotta say I agree with Zach here. Let's look back at the original question, which was basically "which other language should I learn?"

I'd have to say you should learn whatever suits you best. Like many people have already pointed out, there's pros and cons to each language, so it's really just a matter of what you'll use it for. I personally know C/C++ very well, but I've also taken a class on Java so I at least partially understand it. I've found that just like with spoken languages, once you learn a second language, other languages become much simpler to learn because most follow the same rules.

So in other words, if you need to learn C#, learn C#! and same goes with Java or Python or whatever else!

If you don't need to learn anything else, I'd suggest learning either Java or C#, as both of them are being used more and more nowadays (i'm pretty sure at least...check me if i'm wrong). So i'd suggest going with one of those two languages as a secondary.

-Good luck!

Very well said...jverkoey

I usually here this question many times in a semester.

Also, some of you are very misinformed about some of the languages mentioned in this post. Do research!!