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Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

just for clarification, being willing to see both sides of an argument only translates into supporting the republican party to a hyper partisan. I haven't voted for a republican in a general election in ever.

MY partizan hackery?

thats a joke.

You just said in a thread that you see no reason why you can't believe in a republican candidate even though they are anti gay because they may be prolife and things like that.

then you just said the exact opposite here in the case of mr Quinto. You expect him to be out and perfectly gay or he isn't a good role model.

what a laugh

We're gonna sit down and have ourselves a drink! And after we're done - after *I'm* done, you can run upstairs and take whichever one of them little pills makes you feel the best~Dolores Claiborne

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Originally Posted by loki81

maybe it's just me, but when someone like ZQ says "it gets better" what I hear is "it gets better... as long as you change your voice and never speak out in public about who you are because even in the most liberal industry in the world, I still have to hide who I am."

that's not the kind of message that I'd want to send to a gay kid; I think I'd rather hear silence than hear that.

You might might know more about Hollywood than I do, but I wouldn't call it the most liberal industry in the world. If it were, I think more actors would be out.

I'd think of fashion as the most gay-friendly industry in the world, but that's more a guess than something backed up by evidence.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Originally Posted by stacyp

Have you ever taken a moment to think about the fact that he is also saying that if you just be yourself, and do not stand on top of a mountain and scream out your sexuality, things will be OK too? He's not hiding. He's just not bowing to the publicity machine, or anyone else's sense of what it means to be "out."

Ever thought about that fact that just living as a HUMAN BEING is helping? He's not some evil fag sitting in his home watching gay people die and keeping his mouth shut.

He's never been shy about speaking on behalf of the community. Just because he's never once pulled an all out media blitz on his sexuality does not make him any less relevant.

BRAVA!!!!!!!

We're gonna sit down and have ourselves a drink! And after we're done - after *I'm* done, you can run upstairs and take whichever one of them little pills makes you feel the best~Dolores Claiborne

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Originally Posted by Unclean

The industry is large, complex. Many of the creative talents (writers, directors, actors, designers) may be liberal, and may even be LGBT themselves, but then you've got all the money people (producers, company executives), who may not be so liberal, or who may tend to only think in terms of the bottom line. If the money people assume that anything tainted with the gay will always make less money than other projects, they may be much less likely to back projects tainted with the gay.

Their assumption is a bunch of horseshit, but there you are.

Thanks for explaining it. You said a lot of what I was trying to say, but I wasn't totally sure of the specifics.

Originally Posted by stacyp

These kids need to know that they have allies and people they can relate to, rely on, talk to.

Young, old, out, open, closeted or quietly being themselves is no longer relevant.

They need to know that somewhere, somehow, they are not alone in the world. Someone gets it, someone gets them. Having a variety of people say those words is helpful.

Most of the kids that have been affected by bullying all said the same thing - nobody did anything. The more people who speak up an say they get it, the more these kids will understand they do have allies.

I agree they need people that get them and they need people that will speak up. I think part of the issue is defining what "get it" means. Does it mean getting what it feels like to be bullied or does it mean just getting what it feels like to be bullied for being gay or does it mean getting that bullying is wrong.

I still would like some evidence that ZQ is gay, but so far no one has come up with anything.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

That is why we need to be happy different people who have had different experiences are speaking up and speaking out.

There is not one thing to "get." There are many. Even if we are only speaking of the LGBTQ community, each person is struggling with a different issue.

Each new voice may be reaching out to just that one person who needed to hear that one word from that person.

There is not one thing there are a whole bunch of things. And everyone in their life has said "yes but I'm so different!"

I think being bullied for being gay is different than being bullied for being fat, which is different than being bullied for being Muslim. Among each group though, I would expect to find some commonalities. I think if I'd seen a video with an out, gay guy, it would resonate better for me than if a straight guy did it.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

>>>Doesn't matter for this whether he is gay or not, whether he is out or not. What matters is that he is showing that he gets it, and he cares.

When did this start?

Nothing is more important than getting this guy out of the closet. Why? So we can cross him off the list, stop caring about him (Neil Patrick who?) and start focusing on other would-be-gay famous people. And let's not let this "kids committing suicide" thing detract from the real issue, now, shall we?

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Originally Posted by stacyp

An important part of my point is that sometimes going into further detail about how and why you relate is actually taking you out of the running for being helpful.

My point is, everyone's level of need is different. And if we go into further detail about our lives, someone who is going through something entirely different will just simply shut off and say "damn, they don't know what I am going through after all."

Just knowing that SOMEONE is out there reaching out is sometimes enough. Should others stop going further? No. But I am of the belief that even a small help is help needed.

I think that makes sense. Some people will need detailed reasons, while others will not. As long both are out there, I think the maximum amount of help wil be given out.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

It's been a great hope of the gay community that straight people will come to our deffence. Annie Lennox came out as HIV positive, even though she admitted later that she wasn't. She said that she felt the pain and loss of the disease because so many of her gay friends had died of the illness.

But we have this habit of saying they are gay if they are supportive, and that tends to scare the straight men that really ARE supportive of the gay community from being as helpful as they could be.

We're gonna sit down and have ourselves a drink! And after we're done - after *I'm* done, you can run upstairs and take whichever one of them little pills makes you feel the best~Dolores Claiborne

Re: Zachary Quinto is so fucking Hot

I saw him in person 9/26/10 and he is not hot.. People look so mch better on TV for some reason.. I mean, He wasn't gross but I wouldnt call him hot.. Just a normal looking dude walking down the street in Hells Kitchen, NYC.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Originally Posted by elvin1

You all will have to excuse me but we can NOT be picky about people who speaks out for our rights and to prevent kids committing suicide. I don't give a shit what he calls himself or he's in the closet or if he's got a butt plug up his ass.
We need all the support we can get and I don't give a shit of you are GLBTQ...etc, etc...

We are still a minority and we need EVERYONE on our side.

Wed should be thanking the motherfucker.

I am not being picky about the people who are standing up for us.. I applaud anyone who will, like I said above to stacy I just want this to be better executed. If everyone is promising these kids it will get better without any similar thread of thought or explanation it just doesnt really make sense and i think it will detract from the potential

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Just knowing that SOMEONE is out there reaching out is sometimes enough. Should others stop going further? No. But I am of the belief that even a small help is help needed.

You make an excellent point about small steps. I am gay, I don't have kids, nor do I have a platform where I can try to help people.

But what I CAN do is be out as gay to my family (and not obnoxious about it or overbearing) and my nieces and nephews just see that being gay doesn't equate to being a monster or a sinner. It's not quite the same thing as a public figure coming out on the cover of a magazine, but I sincerely hope it will have those kids thinking twice before they try to bully someone for being different. And if they do and I find out about it, well, that will be one less present they will be getting at their birthday. If all else fails, money works.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

You don't have to run the campaign to do something to help gay kids. You could start your own campaign, or do something else.

My question remains, what are you doing to make things better?

I've had discussions with my parents and have posted things about this issue on my Facebook wall.

I think he raises a legitimate question. The message for this campaign should be more clear. Why do things get better? I think that would help at least some people out more than the campaign is currently doing.

Originally Posted by Mikami

Yeah but, if you're criticizing someone for how they're trying to help the community, I would hope that they're trying to do something as well.

I would too, but that doesn't mean Mercury gets to try and stifle questions either with his own question.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

we all need to do some volunteer work for our local gay community centers.

talking online is not enough.

it didn't save Tyler. He needed a real person at his university to be in his corner for him and apparently there was no one there.

That can't go on. IF you have dealt with coming out, then you are old enough to offer advice and be a role model. It doesn't mean you have to be June Cleaver, it just means you have to show that you are out and strong.... that you made it through the hard part and became stronger for the self awareness.

Mr Quinto's video is an outreach that many many people will hear. Most of us normal people do not have the tool of fame.

we just have to do it one to one, one on one.

We're gonna sit down and have ourselves a drink! And after we're done - after *I'm* done, you can run upstairs and take whichever one of them little pills makes you feel the best~Dolores Claiborne

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

i dont think it should matter whether he is gay or straight, closeted or not. as others in this thread have said, he's standing up for us, and trying to reach out. any message that encourages people to find help if they need it should be a step in the right direction, no matter what is taken from the context, if there is any hidden message at all.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Well I'm sure that's very helpful to the thousands of gay kids who feel isolated and hopeless.

For people who think this campaign isn't helpful, there is a solution: do it better. Of course it's easier to do nothing but bitch about others than to actually do something.

I don't have the power to stifle anyone here. I asked a question. If anyone's answer stifles them, that's on them, not me.

I do what I can. I'm sure you are affecting thousands of teens and are at the heart of The Trevor Project.

Unless you have the money to do it better, even if you do it better, you aren't going to hit the same amount of people. If you'd like to give me a million dollars, I'll come up with a better campaign.

You just say "What have you done?" in hopes that people will be shamed into a non-response due to some sort of guilt. That won't work with me.

Oh and stacyp, when I was a kid, I actually had an attention span. I'm sure there are kids out there with attention spans now as well. I think we should have short messages and long messages, but you seem to think there should only be short ones.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Originally Posted by altlover85

I do what I can. I'm sure you are affecting thousands of teens and are at the heart of The Trevor Project.

There are many ways to help. The Trevor Project isn't the only way, nor is the It Gets Better project. In fact I do do something, but I'm not sure of its relevance here because I'm not the one complaining about people trying to help gay kids.

Unless you have the money to do it better, even if you do it better, you aren't going to hit the same amount of people. If you'd like to give me a million dollars, I'll come up with a better campaign.

So is it more productive to bitch about those who do something while doing nothing?

You don't need a million $ to start or contribute to a grass roots project. The projects you're talking about didn't start with a million $ either. They started with people willing to walk the talk.

In fact the Trevor Project, which was founded in 1998 only now - 12 years later - has a budget of about $1 million. Had its founders sat around saying "Oh no I can't do anything until someone hands me a million dollars" it never would have become what it is now.

You just say "What have you done?" in hopes that people will be shamed into a non-response due to some sort of guilt. That won't work with me.

Your projections are yours, not mine. I'm asking those doing the bitching what they are doing to make things better themselves. I await answers.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Originally Posted by RazorzEdge88

I feel so ambivalent about this topic.

I agree with the sentiment of the OP, and I think self-analysis is healthy. It doesn't hurt to sit back and ask: "is what's being done really effective?" If you have these conversations, it might help refine the message and make advocacy more effective.

But I also find myself agreeing with stacy - a circular firing squad doesn't do a lot of good, and anyone making any effort to help should be praised and not spurned.

This is one of those things that will just come down to individual perspective and personal preference, in the end.

I think evaluating and refinement are good. I also think detailed stories based on gay experiences are worth hearing as are short messages that are supportive in a general way.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Originally Posted by loki81

I'm not a worldwide celebrity, obviously I'll never have the reach of ZQ, but that doesn't mean that he's 100% perfect and I'm 100% wrong on every level.

for what it's worth, I've donated money to multiple organizations like hrc and the trevor project and, back when I was actually writing, wrote an article for my college's magazine to share my own personal experience with homophobia.

If you still have it you ought to post it and share it with us. That is the kind of thread the young guys that are still in the closet need to read here to help them figure it out.

we don't have to have the answers, but we have to start having the conversation, or they will keep dying, and thats just unnaceptable for all of us.

We're gonna sit down and have ourselves a drink! And after we're done - after *I'm* done, you can run upstairs and take whichever one of them little pills makes you feel the best~Dolores Claiborne

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

But i'll take that answer as "no, I don't have proof, i'm just shooting off my mouth because i've nothing better to do than try and rile people up", announce that i've won, and smile.

I've said that you're a fangirl - silly and ignorant person who doesn't have any proof that someone is straight, but demands proof of gayness because saying or believing that someone is gay is an insult, bad thing.

Re: Zachary Quinto is so fucking Hot

I like men with dark hair - so yes, I find him really hot. And his voice - like WOW - I always imagine him talking in to my ear in that quiet but intense voice - in bed, with him on top of me....

Love that 'It gets better' vid - he sounds like he really does care about what he is saying. Not just a celebrity doing it for good publicity or because he thinks he should.
I hope I haven't affended anyone by saying that - I know it is a sad and tragic subject matter.

Re: Zachary Quinto is so fucking Hot

Originally Posted by mark0ne

Love that 'It gets better' vid - he sounds like he really does care about what he is saying. Not just a celebrity doing it for good publicity or because he thinks he should.
I hope I haven't affended anyone by saying that - I know it is a sad and tragic subject matter.

Of course he really cares. He's gay. i don't get how there are people who don't realize this by now.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

even if every closeted actor came out, do you think it would really help? I mean check out the tabloids - they are full of gay rumors.

we've heard them all,we know the names and I don't think they would shock John Q Public. people comming out in their families, their communities (especially teachers) now that could make a difference.

making videos, and directing kids to the Trevor project or other hotlines is a great idea, cause it gives the kid someone to talk to. troubled kids don't need a celebrity spread in People Mag to reaffirm their choices. Their alone and need flesh and blood compassion.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

even if every closeted actor came out, do you think it would really help? I mean check out the tabloids - they are full of gay rumors.

The more people who are out, the better. I don't think there's a real argument against that.

Regarding this particular issue, I'm glad people are doing something good, whoever they are and whatever their orientation - confirmed or speculated. The lives of the kids who may be saved or comforted are real, and not just ideological abstractions.

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

do I think that announcing to the world that your marriage(s) was a sham, and your kids just a convenience would make you a good example? no, you would be revealed as a liar.

I admire Scott Evans - who is out, and committed to the equal rights. It will be interesting to see how far up the entertainment food chain he is able to go. But funny, even here on JUB, it's his straight brother Chris that attracts attention.

it's easy to say "come out come out" when your pay check isn't dependent on mass appeal. Look what happened to the guy who played George on Grey's Anatomy. Did anyone offer him a new series? A movie? He's on Broadway right now, and I think that's how that industry works.

it's a business, and if you were offered say, $100,000 a week over 5 years, would you be so certain? Think about it.

Last edited by barnbuddy; October 8th, 2010 at 03:05 PM.
Reason: incomplete sentence

Re: Zachary Quinto's "It Gets Better" video

Originally Posted by barnbuddy

why would a confessed liar be a positive example for young people? and what about your duty as a parent? "Oh by the way, kids, I married your Mom for positive publicity. I like her, but hey, but I have great sex with extras on the film lot"

Telling the truth is better than living a lie, so yes that would be a great example for young people.

Lying to your own kids can't be good for anyone. You can love them and be a good parent regardless of your sex life.