GPS will no doubt be a strong reason to visit our site on a regular basis, and as we went through the whole developmental process we became aware that, used properly, GPS was a truly powerful tool. Still, like anything new, it also held the potential to be misused, abused and confused. Below is what we consider to be the "best" way to use GPS. As a time-saver and guide to an excellent layout.

If you read through the information you’ll notice that we constantly refer to GPS as a ”starting point” and a way to ”explore” the possibilities. If you will use the tool as we’ve suggested we think you’ll be very pleased with the results. If that sounds a little vague, perhaps it is. Perhaps the best way to understand how to use GPS might be a review of what I went through a few days ago with an 7’ 6” foot spinning rod. It’s a good example of a starting point followed by a little effort that led to exceptional results.

The reel was a Shimano STRADIC 4000FE. I carefully measured it (more than once) and got an A = 87.75mm, B = 77.8mm and C = 125.6mm. I charted these measurements on the permanent card I used to measure the reel and filed it for future reference.

I wanted K-Series guides and since it was a fairly stout rod I opted for KW double foots in the reduction train. GPS gave me a readout for every KW from 50mm to 5.5mm. Right away, I had plenty of ”custom” potential. Knowing I would ”like” a stripper in the 18 to 27 inch range, I looked at the 25 at 18.5 inches and the 20 at 24.9 inches. I like small guides in most cases including the reduction train so I decided to start with the 20mm at 24.9 inches. Reasonable spacing then led to a 12 at (GPS generated) 30.5 inches and a 5.5 at (GPS generated) 35.5 inches. The 5.5 seemed close to the 12 but I have a ”rule” of sorts in my head that goes something like ”no reel measurement is perfect, give yourself an inch or two forward or back on each guide in your search for perfection.” If the 12 moved back and the 5.5 moved forward, I’d be OK.

All taped and ready to go. With 3/8 oz of lead and 20lb braid I was hitting 50 to 51 yards out of the box. Not bad, but there was a bit of noise and a little vibration. I felt it could be better. I would cast and hold the rod to my ear and then cast and hold the rod up against a dark background to watch the line pass through the guides. I finally reached the conclusion that maybe this particular reel and line combo needed less ”early” choking and a little more room to breath as it fired toward the choke point.

Back to the bench where the 20 and 12 came off and the 25 and 16 went on exactly as GPS suggested at 18.5 and 28.7 inches with the 5.5 left at 35.5. I taped it, looked at it and moved the 5.5 forward one inch (see rule above).

All taped and ready to go. The same weight was now casting 55 - 56 yards consistently. The set-up was quieter and had just a whisper of vibration remaining. Picked up about 15 feet. Good, but I’ve kind of developed a feel for ”real good” and it wasn’t there yet. At this point I’m not positive it can get any better, so now I’m definitely in the experimental zone.

I had a hunch after watching the line so many times that the layout might get better with a little more height in the first couple of guides. I didn’t think I needed a bigger ring (I don’t think I’ve ever used a 30) but the height seemed like the way to go. Off came the KW and on went the KL single foots that would give me a millimeter or two more height and move guides back toward the reel a few inches. GPS told me to put the KL25 at 17.1 inches and rhe KL12 at 29.4 inches. Now I had a problem. I needed another reduction guide to get to my GPS choke point at 39 inches and KL stops at size 12! After doing some calculations myself and making a note to include KT guides in GPS, I added a KT10 at 37 inches, skipped the first runner at the choke point since the KT10 was so close and placed the first runner at 44 inches (I’ll go back later and adjust when I static load for the running guides).

All taped up and ready to go. Same weight. Smooth at cream, almost no vibration or noise with casts in the 59 - 60 yard range. This will be a great rod for 3/8 to 1/2 oz X-raps when I’m chasing fall speckled trout in the lagoons and rivers and should work good for grubs and slash baits in deep water as well.

So, is GPS for zombies who can’t think for themselves? Does it take the ”custom” out of custom rod building? Does it make everyone an expert rod builder?

GPS is a tool like so many tools used in rod building. Used properly and with reasonable expectations it can save huge amounts of time and help any builder stay on track to a final product that is as good as it can be. We hope you enjoy the journey!

Comments

Absolutely right TT. The reel sits an average of 3 to 4 mm higher than the blank and this additional 3mm is factored into the results. A variation of the height measurement has much less effect than a change of angle, so the really critical measurements are A and B. The first thing I usually do to try to improve the readouts is push guides out an inch or so to see if things improve since "height off blank" is the most likely culprit.

Posted @ 11/12/2011 6:16 AM by TT

I'm confused about the line drawn on the piece of paper that represents the blank. You then do all your measurements and calculations from/to that point. But, the reel will be in a reel seat, not flat on the blank. I would think that small bit of space would be important in getting the optimum measurements. Does this make any sense?

Posted @ 11/9/2011 4:39 PM by Mick

I was wrong in my analysis that concluded this method took the ideal line path through the center of the ring. Thanks for the clarification. Am making a 6 1/2 foot spinning rod right now, and have set up according to GPS. Will be test casting as soon as the wind drops below about 40. The setup is significantly different from my setup using the 27X, so will be interesting to see how it works.

I think this is a great example of how the combination of computer calculating and the internet can bring something of real value to us. My bro in law a few years ago predicted that the internet would be nothing more than a toy. I didn't agree then, and don't now. Nice work Fuji. You are in a super competitive business and this is a significant development that will encourage the use of your products.

Mick: GPS yields position that puts the top of the ring frame tangent to the projected line. This is Fuji's original concept and it strives to "cheat" the line down to the blank as quickly as possible. Trains with the line through the ring center become substantially longer and create other problems. If you prefer the center you can reduce the published height (Height Chart available on this site) by the radius of the ring size and work with the resultant height. That should be close to center

Bill: We are with you. Our static Load page shows a bend for positioning that clearly demonstrates the straight section in the tip which would call for more space between guides. However, one of us is confused on "bowstring" effects. I understand it to be the result of guides too FAR APART, creating a straight segment of line between a bent portion of the blank...like a bow string. Am I wrong? My casting rods usually end up with very close spacing (on a fast action tip section), say the third, forth and fifth guides from the tip - sometimes 3 inches with micros. Then more space near the tip, up to 5 inches and sometimes maybe more. Can we change the thinking out there...I dunno.

Posted @ 11/9/2011 11:19 AM by Stevens

I am extremely pleased to see a manufacturer involved in the proper use of guides for fishing rods. The detail included in your preliminary work will be extremely beneficial to those who build spinning rods.

Open blog type feedback is high unusual out in the open is really unique for manufacturers. Now everyone will now your secrets - when you find out what Alconite is let us all know!

I only build a few spinning rods for professional anglers who employ them for shaky head and drop shot techniques. The primary features they demand are lower rod weights and tangle free guide systems which result in more sensitive rods and improved lure time in water by reducing line tangle.

I look forward to the time when the subject of guide placement is expanded to casting rods with micro guides on top.

I build a lot of task specific bass casting rods using blanks with many different actions from shaky head to flipping sticks. Present angler thinking requires progressive spacing. Maybe some day rods can be built and sold to the public with guides placed in the proper position.

I would appreciate comment pertaining to the concept most custom rodbuilder use for guide placement. Many rodbuilders load test blanks to full load to tweak placement. For fresh water bass rods full load only occurs in situations when the line is not in motion such as hook set or short under boat runs. Careful examination will reveal that under these conditions the tip section of the blanks actually flattens out which would allow wider spacing. When a builder applies his concept of progression many will use additional guides on the tips section. Does the use of additional guides create a "bowstring" effect adding additional unwanted stresses to the tip section of the blank? When fishing the angler and the drag setting on the reel are in control of the load applied.

I look forward to the time Anglers Resource will with in on the subject of guide spacing on bass fishing rods. Many issues that are not resolved -

Thanks from the aged over medicated, OCD builders who desire to build better fishing tools!

Oh one more thing ( 9 - 6 )

Bill Stevens

Posted @ 11/9/2011 10:53 AM by Mick

Thanks for the explanation on the blog. It confirms what I thought. I still think we have not yet heard from those who believe the best layout will have the line basically lined up with the lower edge of the guide rather than lined up through the center as GPS yields. It does line it up theoretically through the center, right?