Rev. Rowan Redbeard wrote:People are not defined by the groups they are associated with.

Therein lies the problem, Rev. In a lot of cases they are, because they define themselves by the group they choose to associate with. Hell, I do it, too. I associate myself with the FSM. In a way, that defines me. But I encourage, and give people reasons to look beyond that. A lot of people don't do that with their chosen group. They cuddle up with it, let the group do the deciding, and go about their lives in the easiest way possible. Sad, but true.

At the same time, when you piss people off, they often speak before they groupthink (sic). Then you can ask questions about the things they said without groupthinking, and gain a personal response. And then you're two people having a conversation over a cup of coffee instead of two groups yelling slogans at each other. Sounds nice, eh? The trick is just how much you piss people off before they start lobbing mortars over the backyard fence.

I still defend the Gospel as a lovely bit of satire. And if you want an example of profiling == still funny, look up a group of guys (I think they were English) who called themselves Monty Python, and read/watch/listen again to what they had to say about Belgians, Hungarians, Australians, Chinese, or damn near any major group. It wasn't nice. But it was damned funny.

We have a section for the discussion of the book, and this isn't it. I will therefore MOVE this thread to the section it belongs in.

True terror lies in the futility of human existence.

Malcolm Reynolds is my co-pilot.

"The only freedom deserving the name, is that of pursuing our own good in our own way, so long as we do not attempt to deprive others of theirs, or impede their efforts to obtain it. Each is the proper guardian of his own health, whether bodily, or mental and spiritual. Mankind are greater gainers by suffering each other to live as seems good to themselves, than by compelling each to live as seems good to the rest." - John Stuart Mill

I do not fully understand if I should distance myself from this humor and stand up for what feel right and in my mind makes the most sense in this sometimes illogical world or stay hushed because such people I respect are telling me it is offensive.

Ok, the fact is, offense is the responsibility of the offended. If someone is offended by pornography, they avoid porn sites. Someone's into temperance, they can choose not to drink. If someone's offended by something I say, so long as I'm not their guest, then, by gob, they can drag their sorry butt out of earshot. People should not have to worry about whether their self-expression is going to offend someone.

However, I'm an artist, so I have particularly strong views on the matter of society-enforced self-censorship. You may see things differently. Ultimately, it's only you who can decide that one.

Vote Pieces for Pope! She didn't buy me off with the funny hat, I swear!... She made me a cardinal.

fueledbycoffee wrote:Ok, the fact is, offense is the responsibility of the offended. If someone is offended by pornography, they avoid porn sites. Someone's into temperance, they can choose not to drink. If someone's offended by something I say, so long as I'm not their guest, then, by gob, they can drag their sorry butt out of earshot. People should not have to worry about whether their self-expression is going to offend someone.

I don't know what the situation is in the US, but here in Blighty, there are a lot of people who get offended on other peoples behalf. I got yelled at last Christmas buy some white, middle class guy who said the reindeer horns I was wearing "might be offensive to asians" (my Sri Lankan friend Tharmeni was with me - she had a lot of fun laying into the guy telling him how offensive it was him telling her as an asian what she should or shouldn't find offensive!).

There have been cases of people saying they can't display a china ornament of a pig because "muslims might get offended", cases of people complaining about a car ad where people shake their booties as it "might be offensive to people with Parkinson's disease" (no I'm not kidding). In nearly all the case the group in question who are supposed to be the ones who would be offended have turned around and basically told these over-zealous no-brains not to be stupid.

If you're offended by something I say, go away from me. I don't force you to be there. If you're complaining that someone else you don't even represent *might* get offended... I'm sorry. I ain't going to stop.

I got yelled at last Christmas buy some white, middle class guy who said the reindeer horns I was wearing "might be offensive to asians"

Ok, I'm probably missing something here, but... WTF?

WTF is right. Why would Asians be offended by someone wearing reindeer horns?

As far as the book is concerned, I'm STILL looking for it. I look like a headless chicken running around books stores searching in the genres I think the book might be. I may have to order it from an online bookstore...

I got yelled at last Christmas buy some white, middle class guy who said the reindeer horns I was wearing "might be offensive to asians"

Ok, I'm probably missing something here, but... WTF?

WTF is right. Why would Asians be offended by someone wearing reindeer horns?

They wouldn't - it was this white, middle class guy who thought they might. Bless.

The funniest bit about this whole thing came after Tharmeni had been going at this guy for like 5 minutes about who offensive it was that he should be trying to tell her what to be offended over. He muttered "oh god" at which point she jumps in with "ooh ooh I'm telling. Someone might find that offensive".

See, There is one thing that got to me.. Here in Crossville, Tennessee. The flying spagetti Monster was on display and people thought it was a joke.. But if Jesus or Moses was up there...Noodly Master forbid...they never find it to be a joke. Essentially, They may find it offensive, but as we have said before..Everything is offensive to somebody!

Rev. Rowan Redbeard wrote:Implying that Born Again Christians are insane is insulting and inaccurate. They have faith in something and believe it powerfully. They may be fanatical, but that is not the same as insane.

Also, faith is about belief without evidence. If these athletes do believe in a God that is all knowing, how can it be stupid to think that He is paying attention when they praise Him? (My use of capitals is due to the fact that it is a specific god being talked about.)

He is also stereotyping throughout the book (which is something that I have major issues with). People are not defined by the groups they are associated with.

Rev. Rowan Redbeard wrote:Implying that Born Again Christians are insane is insulting and inaccurate. They have faith in something and believe it powerfully. They may be fanatical, but that is not the same as insane.

Also, faith is about belief without evidence. If these athletes do believe in a God that is all knowing, how can it be stupid to think that He is paying attention when they praise Him? (My use of capitals is due to the fact that it is a specific god being talked about.)

He is also stereotyping throughout the book (which is something that I have major issues with). People are not defined by the groups they are associated with.

KicknGuitar wrote:I'd hate to say it (especially since I enjoy it so much) but in all seriousness and in all the senseless things I experience, the Satire I receive from Pastafarianism is the most senseless-less!I love humor in general, from the risque to the corny. The FSM is one of the humorous attractions. Yet the way I view the concept of it is in an antitheist point, and so the satirical connections between the FSM and most Religion I find on the money. Sadly some are offended by this.

I do not fully understand if I should distance myself from this humor and stand up for what feel right and in my mind makes the most sense in this sometimes illogical world or stay hushed because such people I respect are telling me it is offensive. They usually claim that it is mocking them as if to their religion is stupid (which I believe) and therefore are stupid (which I can only partly believe since I know of their knowledge and it is NOT all religious, so it is possible they are not completely stupid in that respect, mine. If I have not expanded enough, feel free to ask me to do so on a specific.

Please give reasons too, or we be travlin' up shit's creek wit' out 'eh sail or paddle... or an E-Tec Evinrude!!

There is a time and place for Pastafarianism. If you want to talk with people personally and seriously about religion, then leave the pasta out of the conversation. Politically, to rally the soldiers behind a banner, the FSM is more powerful than any reasonable and sane person would envision. Flashback to last year:

LAKELAND - Public floggings hurt, even when administered by satirical sacred noodles.

Ask the Polk County School Board. The panel made news last month when five of its seven members declared a personal belief in the concept of intelligent design, the religiously based explanation of the development of life believed in by many Christians.

Four of those five sympathetic board members said they would like to see intelligent design taught in Polk schools as an alternative to Darwinian evolution, at a time when new state standards mentioning evolution by name for the first time are under consideration.

Just like that, it appeared the Darwin wars had found their newest battlefield.

Yet a few weeks later, the controversy is dying with a whimper. There's no board support for a challenge to the proposed standards. Some of the five school board members blame the local newspaper for trying to start a fight.

"It's not our agenda," said Tim Harris, one of the board members. "My personal opinion and how I vote don't always jibe."

What happened? You can start with the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

The satirical religious Web site asserts that an omnipotent, airborne clump of spaghetti intelligently designed all life with the deft touch of its "noodly appendage." Adherents call themselves Pastafarians. They deluged Polk school board members with e-mail demanding equal time for Flying Spaghetti Monsterism's version of intelligent design.

"They've made us the laughingstock of the world," said Margaret Lofton, a school board member who supports intelligent design. She dismissed the e-mail as ridiculous and insulting.

All hail the power of the Noodly Being. Ridiculous and insulting? Absolutely, and that is either a good thing or a bad thing, depending on the context.