First of all, Church itself never said Earth is Flat.They said it is Static.And those are two different things.

Globe Earth was accepted more than 2000 years ago, when Disc Earth model was abandoned as useless and flawed.It was LONG BEFORE NASA and other space agencies in the world.

God told us to be fruitful / fertile and multiply.He is guiding us STEP by STEP, when our mind is ready for it.He said "repopulate the Earth" and He knew we will overpopulate and need to spread to other planets.

Space agencies are trying to allow us to spread throughout the Universe.If we live all in the same planet, the next big asteroid will kill us all.Who will carry on the God's Word?

Denying example with dinosaurs won't make it disappear.

So, which one is REAL "message from the Devil"?The one that encourages us to spread throughout the Universe?Or the one that sabbotages space agencies and tries to keep us all in single planet?

I'd say the one that concentrates us all into same risk.

"Earth is flat, don't go, let's all die together."

And Church really never said the Earth is Flat.

Very trippy.....Wow I thought this was supposed to be a FE site not some God shop. What a heady combination Flat earth and sky faeries...wow

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You can call me GwynethI said thatOh for the love of- Logical formulation:FET is wrong, unsupported by evidence, and most models are refuted on multiple fronts; those that aren't tend not to make enough predictions to be realistically falsifiableJane said these

"It's your model!"Let me know when you can deduce the measurements of your Earth from theory alone.

"Look, we know the size and shapes of all continents and countries. We know the circumference of equator of the real earth (globe, flat or egg-shaped).We know the distance from the equator to the North or South Pole."How? Don't just say "We do!" or "People found it!" What people measured the exact distance, and how are you assured of its reliability given the terrain that would inevitably be part of such a journey?

"Look, we know the size and shapes of all continents and countries. We know the circumference of equator of the real earth (globe, flat or egg-shaped).We know the distance from the equator to the North or South Pole."How? Don't just say "We do!" or "People found it!" What people measured the exact distance, and how are you assured of its reliability given the terrain that would inevitably be part of such a journey?

What do you mean "what people"?

So many people do Geodesy, so many people do Navigation, so many people do Astronomy, ...How to list their names?

But I "know" at least some of them are competitive, and if someone would make erroneous claimsthe competitive ones would immediately jump against and say "it is wrong, I know better".(I'm 55 y/o and I believe that by now I know at least something about human nature.)

Since in main premisses things like that don't happen any more, I tend to mostly believe them.

~~~~~

Why I mentioned those people and fields?

This is why:

Do you know how long is Nautical Mile, and why is it longer than Statute Mile?How is it defined?

Do you know how is measured one minute of latitude?Know something of Geodesy and Triangulation?How theodolite works, how is it used, how is error calculated, ... ?

Do you know how to use sextant, what is Apparent Horizon Dipand why is it important for accuracy?

"It's your model!"Let me know when you can deduce the measurements of your Earth from theory alone.

"Look, we know the size and shapes of all continents and countries. We know the circumference of equator of the real earth (globe, flat or egg-shaped).We know the distance from the equator to the North or South Pole."How? Don't just say "We do!" or "People found it!" What people measured the exact distance, and how are you assured of its reliability given the terrain that would inevitably be part of such a journey?

Nobody needs to know exact distances to compute the shape of the Earth, because theoretical flat earth distances are massively different to round Earth distances by thousands of miles.. VERY rough approximations are sufficient.

As far as continents go these have actually been measured with a tape measure and surveyors form of a protractor. Today distances are measured electronically using speed of light calculations.

Even distances measured by ships or submarines can be relied upon because over sufficient time, journey times for the same ship will correlate to the distance travelled over the water.

So not surprisingly there are no flat earth maps which make any sense at all.

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Visit the Apache Point observatory, they have a laser, which beam does not only go to the moon, but does also come back.McDonalds Observatory also has laser.

Looks like the try is even "nicer" than you thought. :-)

Must be an illusion. It's impossible.

It's scientifically proven, therefore its fact, again, we did this test in college, if you aim wrong, the laser doesn't return.. disproving it being the dome, and disproving the moon is reflective all over

its been tried and tested

its funny how religious FE's ask for evidence and claim things must be an illusion.. how about proving angels are anything other than aliens? the Bible states they 'came from the sky', well any 'beings' who come from anywhere but earth are classed as extraterrestrials right? How about proving noah lived to 800yrs old, or that Jesus walked on water?

asking for evidence is an insult, us globe earthers provide irrefutable evidence that still gets dismissed with one word answers by religious types.. but they fail to answer why all religions tell the same basic story, jesus, buddha, horus, dionyses, Krishna (and many many more) all born 25th december, of a virgin birth, star in the east, 12 followers, died on a cross, dead for 3 days, resurrected etc etc

I'm not asking you to explain all this, I've done my research, the answers are obvious.. I'm simply pointing out the irony in you, being religious, asking us for evidence, claiming something is impossible so it must be an illusion, when the same can be done with the most part of religious books

"Nobody needs to know exact distances to compute the shape of the Earth, because theoretical flat earth distances are massively different to round Earth distances by thousands of miles.. VERY rough approximations are sufficient. "DET reduces the error.

And as per usual, no one provides sources of measurements or how they have determined accuracy. Just swift evasion and spjunk rather obviously trying to change the topic.

So, all that means is that there's still an error with your DET model.

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Quote from: rabinoz

Can you imagine the new (Flat Earth) First Officer on a QANTAS flight QFA27 heading from Sydney to Santiago, saying "We cannot fly that route, at 25,400 km, it's almost twice the maximum range of the 747-400"

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Visit the Apache Point observatory, they have a laser, which beam does not only go to the moon, but does also come back.McDonalds Observatory also has laser.

Looks like the try is even "nicer" than you thought. :-)

Must be an illusion. It's impossible.

It's scientifically proven, therefore its fact, again, we did this test in college, if you aim wrong, the laser doesn't return.. disproving it being the dome, and disproving the moon is reflective all over

its been tried and tested

its funny how religious FE's ask for evidence and claim things must be an illusion.. how about proving angels are anything other than aliens? the Bible states they 'came from the sky', well any 'beings' who come from anywhere but earth are classed as extraterrestrials right? How about proving noah lived to 800yrs old, or that Jesus walked on water?

asking for evidence is an insult, us globe earthers provide irrefutable evidence that still gets dismissed with one word answers by religious types.. but they fail to answer why all religions tell the same basic story, jesus, buddha, horus, dionyses, Krishna (and many many more) all born 25th december, of a virgin birth, star in the east, 12 followers, died on a cross, dead for 3 days, resurrected etc etc

I'm not asking you to explain all this, I've done my research, the answers are obvious.. I'm simply pointing out the irony in you, being religious, asking us for evidence, claiming something is impossible so it must be an illusion, when the same can be done with the most part of religious books

What is kind of funny is that you have been explained to, by a roundy none the less, that we have been bouncing lasers off the moon since 1962, long before we supposedly littered the planet with reflectors, yet you still insist that it somehow proves the shape of the Earth.

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Visit the Apache Point observatory, they have a laser, which beam does not only go to the moon, but does also come back.McDonalds Observatory also has laser.

Looks like the try is even "nicer" than you thought. :-)

Must be an illusion. It's impossible.

It's scientifically proven, therefore its fact, again, we did this test in college, if you aim wrong, the laser doesn't return.. disproving it being the dome, and disproving the moon is reflective all over

its been tried and tested

its funny how religious FE's ask for evidence and claim things must be an illusion.. how about proving angels are anything other than aliens? the Bible states they 'came from the sky', well any 'beings' who come from anywhere but earth are classed as extraterrestrials right? How about proving noah lived to 800yrs old, or that Jesus walked on water?

asking for evidence is an insult, us globe earthers provide irrefutable evidence that still gets dismissed with one word answers by religious types.. but they fail to answer why all religions tell the same basic story, jesus, buddha, horus, dionyses, Krishna (and many many more) all born 25th december, of a virgin birth, star in the east, 12 followers, died on a cross, dead for 3 days, resurrected etc etc

I'm not asking you to explain all this, I've done my research, the answers are obvious.. I'm simply pointing out the irony in you, being religious, asking us for evidence, claiming something is impossible so it must be an illusion, when the same can be done with the most part of religious books

What is kind of funny is that you have been explained to, by a roundy none the less, that we have been bouncing lasers off the moon since 1962, long before we supposedly littered the planet with reflectors, yet you still insist that it somehow proves the shape of the Earth.

1. I never once claimed it proved any shape 2. The difference in the accuracy proves the difference between the '62 tests.. BOTH prove the distance is nowhere near the FE claims

"So, all that means is that there's still an error with your DET model."No, it means DET reduces the error. It is possible to reduce something to zero. I admit that the uniplanar map has obvious flaws that cannot easily be explained away, but you should also admit that any means of measurement feature error. If you can provide and verify distances that falsify DET, I'll listen, but the key word there is verify. Don't just say "It's wrong!" or "These distances are accurate!" A lot of the larger scales distances of relevance are typically calculated by the assumption of a Round Earth, and are too large to be easily verified or tested by everyday people.

Can you imagine the new (Flat Earth) First Officer on a QANTAS flight QFA27 heading from Sydney to Santiago, saying "We cannot fly that route, at 25,400 km, it's almost twice the maximum range of the 747-400"

Yet we still don't have comercial visits to space. Makes no sense. None of what they do makes sense. Everything is marketed for money but space!?! BS, it stinks to much to be true.

Sorry, I don't understand the connection between long range lasers and commercial space visits? I don't really understand the rest of your post. None of what who do makes sense? What connection are you making between marketing and space?

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Quote from: rabinoz

Can you imagine the new (Flat Earth) First Officer on a QANTAS flight QFA27 heading from Sydney to Santiago, saying "We cannot fly that route, at 25,400 km, it's almost twice the maximum range of the 747-400"

"Nobody needs to know exact distances to compute the shape of the Earth, because theoretical flat earth distances are massively different to round Earth distances by thousands of miles.. VERY rough approximations are sufficient. "DET reduces the error.

And as per usual, no one provides sources of measurements or how they have determined accuracy. Just swift evasion and spjunk rather obviously trying to change the topic.

Gave you sources of measurement.

Measurement started with Aristotle and his 45 000 miles, continued with Eratostenes and his 25 000 miles,till modern Geodesy that measured 40 000 km around equator, and 10 000 km from equator to pole.

There are most certainly lasers whose beams can reach the moon, as was shown as far back as 1969 with the first moon landing. The astronauts set up a retroflector - a sort of parabolic mirror that has to be aimed very precisely so that any laser beam coming from the Earth will be reflected to its source - and it was immediately demonstrated to have worked - one of the ways that we know that the astronauts were really there. All the moon landings set up retroflectors and they are the only equipment still working.

There are other threads on this forum asking why the govt (I should think "every government that has existed anywhere for the last 500 years") is denying the flatness of the Earth. The usual FE answer is "money". Just that. Nobody explains how lying about the shape of the earth generates money. There is also the explanation that a Round Earth encourages a belief in evolution .... but there were people who believed in a round earth for a thousand years before Darwin thought up evolution, and even now there are people who will vehemently deny evolution yet insist the earth is round. Also some notion that a round earth encourages "sun worship" -- I've met literally thousands of people who believed the earth was round and literally zero who worshipped the sun.

Can you imagine the new (Flat Earth) First Officer on a QANTAS flight QFA27 heading from Sydney to Santiago, saying "We cannot fly that route, at 25,400 km, it's almost twice the maximum range of the 747-400"

"Measurement started with Aristotle and his 45 000 miles, continued with Eratostenes and his 25 000 miles,till modern Geodesy that measured 40 000 km around equator, and 10 000 km from equator to pole."So, measurements made by assuming the world is a ball, beyond "measurements are just made." Great job there.

"Measurement started with Aristotle and his 45 000 miles, continued with Eratostenes and his 25 000 miles,till modern Geodesy that measured 40 000 km around equator, and 10 000 km from equator to pole."So, measurements made by assuming the world is a ball, beyond "measurements are just made." Great job there.

We could look in

Quote from: the Wiki

Finding your Latitude and Longitude

LatitudeTo locate your latitude on the Flat Earth, it's important to know the following fact: The degrees of the Earth's Latitude are based upon the angle of the sun in the sky at noon equinox.

That's why 0˚ N/S sits on the equator where the sun is directly overhead, and why 90˚ N/S sits at the poles where the sun is at a right angle to the observer. At 45 North or South from the equator, the sun will sit at an angle 45˚ in the sky. The angle of the sun past zenith is our latitude.

Knowing that as you recede North or South from the equator at equinox, the sun will descend at a pace of one degree per 69.5 miles, we can even derive our distance from the equator based upon the position of the sun in the sky.

LongitudeTo find your longitude you just need to know how many hours apart you are from Greenwich, UK and a vertical stick to know when the sun is at its zenith over your present location.

To calculate the distance from the equator to either pole to the equator we use this bit "Knowing that as you recede North or South from the equator at equinox, the sun will descend at a pace of one degree per 69.5 miles, we can even derive our distance from the equator based upon the position of the sun in the sky."

So the distance from the equator to either pole is 90˚ x 69.5 miles = 6,225 miles, pretty close as the current figure is 6215 miles (to the nearest mile).

The Wiki does not explain so explicitly about the degree of longitude, but does say "to find your longitude you just need to know how many hours apart you are from Greenwich". The implication from this is simply that the flat earth sun rotates at a constant angular velocity as it circles around the north pole. In other words. a degree of longitude (at a given latitude) is the same all around the earth.

So, if we know the length of one degree of longitude at the equator we can find the equatorial circumference,

"But, if you want to suggest that, at the equator the degree of longitude is not 69 miles, you will have a fight on your hands with every mapmaker and navigator."Most of them think the world is round, I'll have a fight on my hands with them regardless.

"But, if you want to suggest that, at the equator the degree of longitude is not 69 miles, you will have a fight on your hands with every mapmaker and navigator."Most of them think the world is round, I'll have a fight on my hands with them regardless.

Don't you think that since navigators

have to guide ships and aircraft to places on the real earth that they might be the ones who would know shape of the real earth?

Electronic navigational aids Decca, Loran and GPS were not always around, before that they had to rely on dead reckoning and celestial navigation, even in flying aircraft.

This is Kingsford Smith's route from USA to Australia in 1928.

Just give a thought to navigating over that route from Oakland, CA to Brisbane, QLD in 1928, landing only at Hawaii, Fiji and Brisbane.

You would have be confident that the distances were correct and flat earth distances (and navigation directions), even on your DET, are quite different from on the globe.

"Measurement started with Aristotle and his 45 000 miles, continued with Eratostenes and his 25 000 miles,till modern Geodesy that measured 40 000 km around equator, and 10 000 km from equator to pole."So, measurements made by assuming the world is a ball, beyond "measurements are just made." Great job there.

"Assuming"

Did you ever hear of sextant? Don't tell me you didn't.Do you know what is Apparent Horizon Dip, and why it is important?Do you know how navigators calculated position at sea?Based on what? Why it worked?

Did you ever hear of theodolite? Also, don't tell me you didn't.Do you know any part of Earth not measured by geodesists?Did they "assume" or measure all angles and distances?Do you even know what is triangulation?Also, do you know why big enough triangles measured on Earth's surface are non-Euclidean triangles?

Do you have to "assume" anything when you can measure it in real life?

Why they made that big Geodesic expedition in Peru?

"French minister of the navy understood that it was necessary to know the exactshape of Earth in order to accurately navigate the oceans."Why is navigation so accurate if they were wrong?

However, what are the potential motives that "the man" has, as far as keeping the truth about Flat Earth a secret goes?

Flat earth with a dome would indicate that everyone on Earth is trapped like pets in a gigantic fishbowl. Such a revelation could trigger mass depression, suicides, rioting, and looting in some areas.

Promises of space exploration brings a lot of money laundering opportunities. Gift insiders billions of tax money to go to space, spend millions in Hollywood productions, and pocket the difference.

Flat Earth=finite resources and less volatility for the Government pension funds that trade on Wall Street. Hyped false promises of flooding markets with rare minerals gathered in space brings opportunities worth trillions to short selling insiders.

I would daresay that a lot of scientists consider it their duty to reveal the truth without regard to whether people find it depressing or amusing. In fact, the revelation of a dome would probably start an entirely new science and industry to try to drill through it. I am not sure how a FE indicates limited resources more than a RE but proof of a FE might invigorate new science and industry to explore over the edge - for all we know there are resources - and maybe even forms of life - beyond the edge (or beyond the dome).

And it's a simple economic fact that there's not enough money to go around to bribe everyone to keep quiet about a FE. Do you honestly think the severely underpaid teachers and professors around the world are being secretly bribed?? At the same moment, if there were any truth to a FE, the one scientist who first reveals it to the world would be assured of money, fame, and pretty lab assistants! Isn't that sufficient motivation?