Game 36: Flames at Blue Jackets, 12/27, 7 p.m. EST, FSOhio

I agree, I don't like Arniel, but I can hardly find fault with his decision for the shootouts. Was there a great deal of praise when we won 3 in a row in the shootout (I think it was)?

Things are so bad now, objectivity is completely lost. I'm pretty sure a lot of people are just aren't watching the game, look at the score, and decide it's time to start the hammering.

As I said earlier, I enjoyed watching us play for the first time in a long time. Still cringed at some silly unforced turnovers, but I liked the compete from the players. As I said earlier in the thread, it was the first time in a long time I didn't feel like we had a bunch of passengers. It was one of the few games were I felt like Carter was engaged for a few shifts in a row. Nash had some spunk. We had some attitude, collectively. For example, I saw Brassard actually fight through a check. We don't see a lot of that from him. It was real, live, puck hunger.

It wasn't the result we had hoped for (well most of us), but I enjoyed Blue Jackets hockey for a night.

I take objection with Howson saying "We aren't good enough". We have most of our top six under performing. We aren't competing. This team can win, even with our poor defense and questionable goal tending. I don't think it can go as far as we'd like in the playoffs, but it can make the playoffs (obviously this year is shot). The only reason I would like to see some players moved is that they don't compete as often as they are capable. That was the theme I was using with Dorse and DM. Those guys compete on most shifts. I'll take that over some of the other skill players that don't. Obviously you can't have a team of pure grinders, but they can set the tone. That's my biggest disappointment with RJ this year. Until recently (and even then it's been sporadic) he hasn't been competing. Without that level of compete, he isn't going to produce at this level.

I think that somewhere around half the players simply are not as good as people think they are. Vermette, Umberger, Pahlsson, Tyutin, Methot, when they bring their A-game to the rink, they still aren't good enough to provide wins when the opposing players bring their A-games too. As for last night's game, a hard-fought game is always more entertaining than a game played in low gear. But it would be nice if the games had meaning.

Competing for one game. Exactly what I said before. If you are going for condescending, perhaps I can draw it out with some crayons for you? You've heard of a process, correct? You start with competing for a shift. Then stringing together shifts, then a period. Then you go for two, then a whole 60 minutes. Eventually you string together 5 and 10 game segments. Eventually competing is a habit and you don't know anything else.

I can create a diagram for you if you like....

Don't need Gods guidance in anything that isn't bound to morality, but thank you for the thought.

However, thanks for the continued merriment.

Ok. Agree to disagree. Still don't know what "stage" we are currently in (I need the 64 Crayola Box I guess). These guys are supposedly professionals and we get giddy because they compete for almost one entire game? I guess I just have the bar set much higher than you my friend. I not only expect to compete but to score more goals, quit giving up leads in the third period, stop hearing the coach and players utter the word "fragile", quit giving up umpteen odd man rushes per game, etc. This is no ordinary hockey team. I was listening to a major sports station today and they were talking about the Islanders and said "hey, these guys aren't Columbus" over and over. We are the laughingstock of the NHL and we are trying to string a shift or two together? I'm sorry to rant but I simply cannot agree with your logic on this. I'll suffer my union blue until the either win or get run out of town but that doesn't ever mean that I have to settle for "pro's" mailing it in with effort.

I think that somewhere around half the players simply are not as good as people think they are. Vermette, Umberger, Pahlsson, Tyutin, Methot, when they bring their A-game to the rink, they still aren't good enough to provide wins when the opposing players bring their A-games too. As for last night's game, a hard-fought game is always more entertaining than a game played in low gear. But it would be nice if the games had meaning.

Ok. Agree to disagree. Still don't know what "stage" we are currently in (I need the 64 Crayola Box I guess).

Quote:

Competing for one game. Exactly what I said before.

Frig, seriously? How many times do you need it answered?

The rest of that stuff you blathered has nothing to do with the "debate" at hand if you want to even call it that. What does being the laughingstock have to do with one game of compete? Answer: Nothing. You are a confusing mess of all over the place.

How can you even, based on the conversation (and all 23 posts no less), decide what my "bar" is? You are making assumptions with no facts. I only stated that they competed for a game and that I enjoyed watching the game. That's it. That has nothing to do with the 3500+ posts of explaining what is wrong with this team and why what they are doing isn't good enough for six years now (and more before that on other boards). Not to mention who should go: players, coaches, GM's as well as a lot of other team evaluation.

No matter how many times you say "It isn't good enough" if you say once "Hey I liked what they did on the ice, even though they lost" we get people like you that come out of the wood works with your whole "I have a higher standard then you" nonsense.

Ok. Agree to disagree. Still don't know what "stage" we are currently in (I need the 64 Crayola Box I guess). These guys are supposedly professionals and we get giddy because they compete for almost one entire game? I guess I just have the bar set much higher than you my friend. I not only expect to compete but to score more goals, quit giving up leads in the third period, stop hearing the coach and players utter the word "fragile", quit giving up umpteen odd man rushes per game, etc. This is no ordinary hockey team. I was listening to a major sports station today and they were talking about the Islanders and said "hey, these guys aren't Columbus" over and over. We are the laughingstock of the NHL and we are trying to string a shift or two together? I'm sorry to rant but I simply cannot agree with your logic on this. I'll suffer my union blue until the either win or get run out of town but that doesn't ever mean that I have to settle for "pro's" mailing it in with effort.

Ever hear the expression, "you have to start somewhere"?

I don't see anyone giddy about anything.

I think you are having trouble understanding other opinions from your high horse. This isn't the comments section on the dispatch...actual discussions take place here, at least sometimes. Recognizing what actually happens on ice vs hyperbole would be a good start on your part, IMO.

I enjoyed watching lasts nights game. I haven't had that feeling very often all season. It might not last, in fact it probably won't. But for one game, I enjoyed watching this team again.

I know we are in perceptual cliff diving mode, it clouds our objectivity.

I understand the point of many that they enjoyed the game last night. Nothing wrong with that. Enjoy a well-played game, my point was really just to not expect the team to build on it or to draw any hope from it. They'll keep up their pattern of playing a decent game once a week, twice at most.

Hope won't come until there is a full housecleaning in the front office and a remaking of the culture.

Long-overdue reply: I took my son to a preseason game last year. Didn't go well. Way too young. Maybe stayed 10 minutes.

We made it through most of the 1st period before he started exhibiting the classic toddler signs of boredom. A quick visit to the cannon at the intermission was followed by a walk to the exits. Not bad for a 2-1/2 year old. (And the tickets were free, so nothing "lost") He also has a cold, so we didn't want to push him.

In that first period, we saw exactly one great shift out of the CBJ. Shame they couldn't convert that power play-like control of the puck in the offensive zone into a goal.

I caught the rest of the game on radio and then TV. Kinda odd to see 1/3 of the game, listen to 1/6 and then see the balance on TV. George & Bob come across as having the better time of the broadcasters.

I'm still amazed that Calgary is flirting with playoff-level status. Kipper was the only thing standing between them and a CBJ blowout.

Long-overdue reply: I took my son to a preseason game last year. Didn't go well. Way too young. Maybe stayed 10 minutes.

We made it through most of the 1st period before he started exhibiting the classic toddler signs of boredom. A quick visit to the cannon at the intermission was followed by a walk to the exits. Not bad for a 2-1/2 year old. (And the tickets were free, so nothing "lost") He also has a cold, so we didn't want to push him.

In that first period, we saw exactly one great shift out of the CBJ. Shame they couldn't convert that power play-like control of the puck in the offensive zone into a goal.

I caught the rest of the game on radio and then TV. Kinda odd to see 1/3 of the game, listen to 1/6 and then see the balance on TV. George & Bob come across as having the better time of the broadcasters.

I'm still amazed that Calgary is flirting with playoff-level status. Kipper was the only thing standing between them and a CBJ blowout.

Seemed like there were quite a few little ones there last night, DBJ, hope yours enjoyed what he saw. I noticed Leo was there with his family, including what must be a very new addition. Congratulations to Mr. And Mrs. Welsh (and the new kid's big brother!).

my point was really just to not expect the team to build on it or to draw any hope from it. They'll keep up their pattern of playing a decent game once a week, twice at most.

Sadly you are most likely correct. Fair point and I have no issue with it. I was only illustrating progression towards winning. There isn't close to enough evidence they have turned a corner obviously.

I'm still amazed that Calgary is flirting with playoff-level status. Kipper was the only thing standing between them and a CBJ blowout.

A couple of reasons. Their best players have been their best players. The other, their PK is pretty good and the PP is middle of the pack.

Last night we had their PK on the run and J-Bo saved a goal when he had Kipper sit on the puck a second before Cater poked at the puck.

The reality is if our top six was playing average, to their capabilities, we would be closer to 40 points than 23. Nash's production is pathetic. RJ, Vermette, and Brassard with 14 combined goals? That's what Glencross has all by himself. We should have another 20+ goals with those 4 guys.

Nice! The grand poobah of posts with another golden nugget to new people to the forum who haven't posted over 11,000 x's. GalileoSmith ain't too far off the mark. And that's no load of crap sir. Hilarious. Blahblahblahblah

I think you are having trouble understanding other opinions from your high horse. This isn't the comments section on the dispatch...actual discussions take place here, at least sometimes. Recognizing what actually happens on ice vs hyperbole would be a good start on your part, IMO.

I'm just a passionate fan. No high horse here. Just asking,after over a decade, to have people (ownership,management/coaches, players) who have a cohesive vision/gameplan/work ethic for rebuilding this franchise in order to make December games meaningful. We have a dedicated fan base that has seen a lot of bad hockey. But this year has been the proverbial cherry on top of the sundae. everyone in this organization is accountable and just because I called out Nasher (who I have stuck by until this year) doesn't mean that other guys on this team aren't as equally responsible for what we've seen ths year. I am stand firmly committed to blowing this whole thing up, clean house and we can truly begin to "start somewhere". The time will never be more opportunistic than now.

Nice! The grand poobah of posts with another golden nugget to new people to the forum who haven't posted over 11,000 x's. GalileoSmith ain't too far off the mark. And that's no load of crap sir. Hilarious. Blahblahblahblah

Uh huh.... Your mom... Nener, nener, nener.

I only brought up the post count to illustrate you don't know my "bar" and that you made false assumptions. It's not a badge of honor or pride.

On to the post itself. Vermette's A- game, for example, was stellar is 08/09. RJ is money in the playoff's and when he's competitive he is a stellar two way player. Sammy is close to done, although his play the last month is NHL caliber again. Methot is meh, but as a 5/6 he would be outstanding. As a 3/4 he's nothing special. Tyutin's game is stellar as a 3/4, he could be an average #2 with the right partner. Frankly you are making judgments on some players that are playing some of their worst hockey in their careers on a team with 9 wins. Foolish.

Yes, his statement was crap. You are in "We suck" mode, which makes your opinion on player evaluation about worthless.

Enjoy your New Year and come back fresh and ready to post something objective in 2012. You remind me of that guy that said we would be lucky to have 15 points by the end of the year and kept railing on me because he thought I was saying 22 points was "acceptable" or "Something to be proud of". He was just as far off base on all counts as you are now. He couldn't come up with a good argument to counter me so he just did some chest pounding and mocked me, because, frankly, he couldn't form a logical counter. You haven't to this point either.

I don't mind criticism of this team and it's players. Hell I'm one of the biggest criticizers around here. What I don't appreciate is blind hate with no objectivity. That sir, is you.

everyone in this organization is accountable and just because I called out Nasher (who I have stuck by until this year) doesn't mean that other guys on this team aren't as equally responsible for what we've seen ths year. I am stand firmly committed to blowing this whole thing up, clean house and we can truly begin to "start somewhere". The time will never be more opportunistic than now.

That, sir, is a train of thought I understand, accept and an opinion I valued reading. Blowing things up is an understandable opinion. I don't think we need to go that far. In a thread somewhere I posted where I would go first on the trade front and who I would keep. Basically the guys I would start the "rebuild" under.

It's not a bad topic as you see the players that people still value. Some of my reasoning is based on who is showing up in December and still playing (such as Brassard, thus moving Vermette). Some of it is based on who we aren't going to bring back next year anyway (the logical moves).