"I'm sort of happy about this because this shows people that politics is about things that affect people's lives. On the other hand, I'm sad for Wisconsin because this is all the wrong kind of politics.... We've gone from clean-cut to really being on the cutting edge of the new form of American politics — battle to the death, win at any cost."

Said Mordechai Lee, a professor of government affairs at the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee.

And this is what really got me:

The state's nine legislative recall elections compare with a total of 20 across the nation since 1913, according to Joshua Spivak, a senior fellow at the Hugh L. Carey Institute for Government Reform at Wagner College in New York. Wisconsin has had two.

Amazing. We really have gone crazy.

IN THE COMMENTS: Meade said:

As Mrs. Stapleton said to Fred Clark (the Undemocratic Party District 14 candidate for senate), "it's a crime" that these recalls are happening at all. The cynical true purpose of these recall elections is to reverse the democratic expression of the voters in last November's general election. A vote for the so-called "fake" primary candidate tomorrow is a vote against the recall election itself - a waste of time and money and an insult to all Wisconsin citizens.

114 comments:

Don't forget, you have Minnesota to your east. We no longer have a Governor making decisions for us, we have a "Special Master" who is deciding what should be funded and what shouldn't. Expect new car sales to drop to near 0 in the next couple of weeks.You might have to look to the Dakotas for sanity to the west.

My dyed-in-the-wool-democrat mother-in-law, who is from the upper-Midwest (though not Wisconsin) and who campaigned for and raised money for Obama, was railing about how awful teachers' unions were last night. I was astonished.

We are now in the early stages of an earthquake in how we view government as a nation. The debate will play out over several years, and get more not less intense. The small government-big government divide is not new, but the stakes are. As a nation we face financial failure. Not next week, or next month, or probably next year. But soon, if we do not change how we do things.

These changes will gore so may oxes that some wild politics are inevitable. We will have demonstrations, lawsuits and at some point perhaps considerable violence. I expect some strong third party Presidential candidates at some point. It will seem--and be--chaotic.

It will not be clear for some time who the long term winners are. It will shift back and forth. But the reckoning will come, and it will have to include huge cuts in government spending. Otherwise we will be broke.

Wisconsin is on the leading edge of this upcoming long term battle. That's a good thing. It will stay crazy for a while in our wonderful country and wonderful state. But because we are starting earlier than many, perhaps it will end sooner here.

“Your Excellency,” said a policeman, coming up to him, “what if you were to try the repose of home? . . . It's dangerous for your Excellency even to stand here.”

This policeman, as I heard afterwards, had been told off by the chief of police to watch over Andrey Antonovitch, to do his utmost to get him home, and in case of danger even to use force—a task evidently beyond the man's power.

“They will wipe away the tears of the people whose houses have been burnt, but they will burn down the town. It's all the work of four scoundrels, four and a half! Arrest the scoundrel! He worms himself into the honour of families. They made use of the governesses to burn down the houses. It's vile, vile! Aie, what's he about?” he shouted, suddenly noticing a fireman at the top of the burning lodge, under whom the roof had almost burnt away and round whom the flames were beginning to flare up. “Pull him down! Pull him down! He will fall, he will catch fire, put him out! . . . What is he doing there?”

“He is putting the fire out, your Excellency.”

“Not likely. The fire is in the minds of men and not in the roofs of houses. Pull him down and give it up! Better give it up, much better! Let it put itself out.

I choose instead to spend my money securing the liberty and freedom of my family and my tribe of friends.

Go ahead. Give away your money. But I'd suggest that you think twice before you try to take MY fucking money, asshole.

(Incidently, in Massachusetts citizens are allowed to pay a voluntary higher rate of 5.5% state taxation. US Senator John Kerry pays the lower rate. Not the voluntary higher rate he would impose on the rest of us Americans.)

As Mrs. Stapleton said to Fred Clark (the Undemocratic Party District 14 candidate for senate, "it's a crime" that these recalls are happening at all. The cynical true purpose of these recall elections is to reverse the democratic expression of the voters in last November's general election. A vote for the so-called "fake" primary candidate tomorrow is a vote against the recall election itself - a waste of time and money and an insult to all Wisconsin citizens.

You're surrounded by Illinois, Minnesota, and Michigan, among others. I wouldn't call that 'surrounded by sanity.'

I have an idea. Give Garage Mahal a stage at the capitol so he can regale everyone with stories about his black neighbor and how awesome high speed rail is. Then you'll look less bat-shit crazy by comparison.

No, your state is run by a mob. A public employee unionista mob. This is what you get when taxpayers aren't being represented at the negotiating table because unionistas kick up the dues to the bosses, who grease the palms of their democrat legislative cock-suckers and the tax-payers get nothing in return except the circus show that has become Madison. You live in a broken state run by broken people who don't give two shits about what you think because all they want is your money and more of it.

"I'll gladly pay more and receive less, as long as Paris Hilton is not asked to! Anything else is tyranny."

No silly. If the government forced you to pay more for less--that would be tyranny. Likewise, if the government forced Paris Hilton to pay more so that you could pay less, that would be tyranny. And if you insist that Paris Hilton's lovely curvaceous ass should pay for your lame saggy ass' retirement, that would be tyranny.

This argument is trotted out for every recall and impeachment. "They're trying to undo the election!" Well, it appears that Wisconsin has a legal system for fixing election choices that turn sour. Is the original election so sacred that the recall should never be considered? Why have the recall provision at all, then?

A recall is a drastic measure. If this particular recall effort is as fake as Meade suggests, it will probably fail miserably. If it's still that lousy and yet succeeds, then Wisconsin has bigger problems than we all thought.

Perhaps the barriers to obtain a recall election should be higher, or perhaps Wisconsin would fare better with no such provision at all. Me, I like recalls and threats of impeachment. We have very little of that going around, and more of it would scare career politicians.

I would wager I paid more taxes last year than you and that little shitstain troll Coketown made year.

By "troll" he means "people who make points of such erudite nuance and profound complexity that I cannot hope to respond."

The point I made that got his panties in a twist was pointing to data at the BLS website on Madison's labor composition, showing 1/3 of all jobs are taxpayer funded. He responded by calling me a "dumb fuck." Now I'm a troll. Just don't call me the N-word!

A friend of mine, today, said that it's all comes back to the contempt for open government and blitzpolitik. They would've never been elected on this agenda. I agree.

And therein lies the problem, an entrenched population of self-interested government employees that would NEVER vote to reduce their own income/benefits/influence. The only solution is smaller government, more responsive to the needs of, you know, the rest of the citizenry who pay more in taxes than they receive in benefits.

I remember Linda! (Mrs. Stapleton) ... And, I remember the phone call her telephone recorded ... when Fred Clark was "dialing for votes" ... was so good ... that beyond her "IT'S A CRIME" ... was that after she hung up Fred wanted to call her back. He also wanted to beat her up!

As to a fake candidate, why not run one in wisconsin. The dems ran one in 2008. And, he was a better choice than McCain. (Alas, as choices go ... because the stupid party tends to neglect choosing compence over family money) ... Fake ... make get in before "accurate."

No Ann, Wisconsin is not seeing the sudden transformation you describe: “We've gone from clean-cut to really being on the cutting edge of the new form of American politics — battle to the death, win at any cost."

Revolutions and counter-revolutions, the things you’re seeing in Madison, don’t happen like that.

What we’re seeing is what happens when the ruling class loses control. Wisconsin is Syria without the gunfire. The Liberals have been in control for so long simply won’t accept the last election. As long as Republicans accepted defeat gracefully, they were tolerated as a voiceless, powerless minority whose function was to as demonstrate that there were two parties. But the thought of them actually exercising power, and moreover exercising power in opposition to established policies … well who in the hell did they think they were?

Wisconsin’s Democrat politicians are demonstrating that they are no more clean-cut than any Chicago thug. They did not just discover the power of mob rule; they knew how to use it as soon as their hold on the state was loosened.

The battling harridans on the Wisconsin Supreme Court bench are not clean-cut jurists but gutter politicos who don’t hesitate to make sexist accusations of assault if it means that they can regain control.

Surface tranquility is always seen in one-party states. The willingness to use violence and thuggery usually keeps things quiet until the people rebel. That’s when violence breaks out and people who had no problem with the regime ask “what happened, everyone was so happy … and proud … and clean-cut.”

But I couldn't help thinking that with the Euro worth .04% over the dollar ... that the "failure" will be in Brussels. Europeans will tear themselves apart. And, the german's ... as soon as they can turn Merkel's ass into a football ... will go back to the old "deusch-Y-mark" ...(somtimes I can't spell.)

When the german's regain their currency ... there will be stabilization. Greece, Portugal, Spain, Ireland and Italy will be so broke people will sell treasures for a piece of bread.

While, America will be glad there's an Atlantic that separates us from them.

Alas, for Japan, the monsters in charge are worse than their Shoguns. They're lying shits. So Japan still has to recover from the nuclear mess they've made through engineer incompetence. And, their ability to mount LIES!

In America? Lying to the public at large is not quite so easy.

While I still think Murdoch, in England, at 80 ... will win his war against the Guardian. And, Labor. But the Iron Lady has dementia. Tony Blair is a crook on the order of the Bush's and the Clinton's.

While who knows? Assad thinks he's gonna win. And, we've got our Ambassador trapped in our Embassy in Damascus. They've got about a week's worth of food ... behind the secured part of their fortress.

Americans aren't going to fight each other ... because the left has wilted. All they have are paper mache puppets. And, parades that let in the light between small clusters of people.

While obama? He can't even fill up a stadium's seats with supporters, anymore.

Carol, the Europeans are going to fail too, and probably sooner than we do. I'm not sure about the dollar thing though. I never even thought about owning gold for most of my pretty long life. Now I have a lot of it. Right now the Administration and the Treasury are letting the dollar sink because it's the only way we can compete in an export economy. Then comes the great reflation.

The good news is, if we are willing to accept the pain, we can come out much better. But it's going to be very painful.

The people who have gotten us into this--and they are not all democrats by a long shot--are going to have about the same historical reputation as Neville Chamberlin.

Good point. I see that the scene of the shame, Lake Mendota, was actually included either way, because the 54,160 sq. miles figure includes inland waterways and only excludes the Wisconsin portions of the Mississippi, Lake Michigan, and Lake Superior. I used to think those waterways were good buffers against surrounding insanity. (A Vikings fan? Really?) Now I suspect our neighbors know the feeling in reverse.

We watched as the bubble expanded ... and everybody thought they were making unearned profits.

You bet, ahead, it will be painful.

You bet, when people look back ... who used their homes as ATM machines ... and bought themselves "fancy stuff." Including cruises, cars, and vacations ... And, thought they'd never end up in trouble ...

Well. Guess what.

There's really no other way to teach people the various values that work over time.

We are a nation that has survived more time than most people thought was possible.

We survived because people wanted to risk their lives on leaky wooden boats ... that were powered by the winds. And, could make you seasick for weeks, if not months, at a time ...

And, people still came! Because they could pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

We were a nation where it was worth the sacrifice, because almost from the beginning this nation provided a free education.

Do you know the value of just knowing how to read and write?

I read a long time ago about China. How it's a hard life. And, only one out of a hundred would be taught to read. Being able to do so meant that 99 peasants were sweating in the fields. Providing meager sustenance.

Life was NEVER easy!

We're going to have to go back there.

And, the next wave of technology that's come along since telephones and the steam engine ... isn't on the horizon right now.

We still go forward.

Plucking off the government parasites, however, will mean more people without skills ... who can't figure out how to put their boots on. Let alone rise up. And, pull them on.

Well, is there a garden where you don't have to go in, every once and awhile, and pull up the weeds?

The Republicans did not run on the most of the agenda and bills they are passing and that is why a good %50 of the citizens want a recall. This seems a sane response to pols who have gone power mad themselves.

The Republicans did not run on the most of the agenda and bills they are passing and that is why a good %50 of the citizens want a recall. This seems a sane response to pols who have gone power mad themselves.

The same old lies for refusing to abide by the results of an election.

The Republicans did not run on the most of the agenda and bills they are passing

You mean like:"Obama was vigorous in his attacks on Clinton for including an indvidual mandate in her plan. Now that the Democrats in the House have included a mandate in health reform legislation, he's fine with it." Politifact

Or

"In 2006, then Senator Barack Obama argued and voted against raising the debt ceiling saying, “Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.” Today, during a White House press conference on raising the debt ceiling, President Obama suggested the Democrats and Republicans in Washington are the “professional politicians” most capable of managing the nation’s debt." TIME

Or Guantanamo, or civil trials of terrorists, or attacking Libya, or the GM bailout, or any of the flip-flops or un-campaigned on issues President Obama has implemented that 50% of the population don't like?

Does your RECALL OBAMA bumper sticker go over or under your RECALL WALKER sticker, RV? Because to claim one as "power mad" without including the other would be just plain hypocritical.

purplepenquin said...I find it really funny how the same crowd of people who say unions have to vote to certify each&every year are having a hissy fit about these recall elections.Did I say "funny"? I meant "hypocritical."

Look if the GOP gets recalled tomorrow, then the WI voters deserve what they get. It pays to be consistent in life. Or maybe garage is right that WI voters really are pro-union and they got hoodwinked by Walker.

As Mrs. Stapleton said to Fred Clark (the Undemocratic Party District 14 candidate for senate), "it's a crime" that these recalls are happening at all. The cynical true purpose of these recall elections is to reverse the democratic expression of the voters in last November's general election. A vote for the so-called "fake" primary candidate tomorrow is a vote against the recall election itself - a waste of time and money and an insult to all Wisconsin citizens.Brilliant! I agree completely.

So what Meade is saying (and you too, since you "agree completely), is that democracy is good only when the results are the ones you and he wish for.

The recall law allows the voters to express buyers remorse. They apparently did not realize that they were voting to destroy the civil service of Wisconsin in order to enrich already powerful entities.

Maybe the reason there were so few recalls in the past is that the state has never seen such a radical and destabilizing change in government before.

Democrat Mike McCabe is a fucking moron. He doesn't even know how big his own state is.

Before you call people "fucking morons", you should carefully check your facts. Otherwise you end up looking like a fucking moron.

While the land area of Wisconsin is indeed 54,000 square miles, the total size of the state is 65,000 square miles (there are a lot of lakes in Wisconsin). There is more than one way to measure the size of a geographical region.

Pogo said...So tomorrow will Wisconsinoids kick themselves in the ass by replacing R with D?

Stay tuned.

Alex said...Look if the GOP gets recalled tomorrow, then the WI voters deserve what they get. It pays to be consistent in life. Or maybe garage is right that WI voters really are pro-union and they got hoodwinked by Walker.

Today are just the primaries, the recall elections are in August. Now we may see recall candidates fail today, even if they do prevail they still will need to beat the incumbent next month.

Freder, that crap doesn't float around here. We've watched since Day 1, and the "radical destabilization" was a direct attempt by the Dems/Unions to overturn an election. Not a sudden realization by voters, but a massive rejection of the voters by the Government employees and their Union paymasters. They fled the State, occupied buildings, destroyed property, threatened officials, etc. not because they wanted to be part of the process, but because the process meant that their side lost. You're lying to pretend otherwise, no matter how you couch it.

roesch-voltaire said...The Republicans did not run on the most of the agenda and bills they are passing and that is why a good %50 of the citizens want a recall. This seems a sane response to pols who have gone power mad themselves.

The GOP most certainly did run on the bills they are passing...cutting costs, cutting taxes, reducing government and regulations, voter ID, concealed carry.

Bullshit, it's a crime. It's the law of Wisconsin. We are exercising our legal rights. These elected took radical measures they refused to put in front of voters last fall.

Where were your objections when Scott Walker got into Milwaukee County Exec Office with recall?

What's going on in Wisconsin is a putsch, plain and simple. Next week the knuckle draggers will ram through a redistricting plan with no public debate, no maps done by local governments. This is lock down their grip on power. Period.

Hey, have you wingers heard of Rupert Murdoch's phone-bugging scandal? They bugged 9/11 victims! Where is your outrage?

Bullshit, it's a crime. It's the law of Wisconsin. We are exercising our legal rights. These elected took radical measures they refused to put in front of voters last fall.

Bullshit, yourself. She used "it's a crime" as a figure of speech. And the radical measures have been before the voters for years. In fact, they came from the voters. Wake up from your utopian lefty dream world.

Where were your objections when Scott Walker got into Milwaukee County Exec Office with recall?

I don't object to recalls. I object to these recalls for the reason stated.

What's going on in Wisconsin is a putsch, plain and simple. Next week the knuckle draggers will ram through a redistricting plan with no public debate, no maps done by local governments. This is lock down their grip on power. Period.

Putsch schmutsch, reductio ad nazium boy. It's legal democratic republican push back, plain and simple. Your guys have been pulling a slow one for 50 years. Our guys pulled a fast one in 6 months. So suck it up and quit your blubbering.

With all the out-of-state money pouring in from the likes of ACTBLUE, Wisconsin is in danger of losing control of it's own destiny. It is a certainty that those democrats involved in the recall and who have accepted money from ACTBLUE to unseat Republicans will be expected to toe the progressive line.

Wisconsinites will become nationalized on their way to citizen of the world status. If they are successful they will be marginalized by the very masters they look to for support.

To those Wisconsinites who live outside the wire that is Madison, you are about to lose control of your state to outside interests who don't consider the sobriquet "cheesehead" to be anything but a pejorative.

So Japan still has to recover from the nuclear mess they've made through engineer incompetence.

I bet the engineers didn't recommend building a nuclear reactor on the seashore next to one of the most active faults on the planet.

And once the politicians decided who was going to get paid off to site it there, I bet when then engineers said "Here's how you build this to ensure that there's no problems with a tsunami or earthquake" the politicians said "That'll cost too much. Scale it down. We'll never have to worry about a 9.2 earthquake."