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(previously jeetijohal, account deactivated at her

Publicity is publicity, even bad publicity is good publicity is the religious principle of media marketers. If the Sikh elders have decreed it offensive, I will not watch it, although naturally curiosity was aroused as to the matter contained therein causing controversy, the task and agenda of media is attentions grabbing scandal mongering. They have succeeded in this marketing ploy. The media become arrogantly contemptuous of religiosity, and any furore adds to the much needed hype to bolster profits and showings and cast respectable upholders of the sanctum of religion as extremists, casting their own offense upon the victim. Lowering standards is a slippery slope to the hell the western modernist media and its perverse anti-cultural influence upon the citizens of its own nations whilst demolishing culture, honour, morality and traditions in the false and deceptive cause of free licence and freedom of expression and speech in their native and foreign lands is deplorable. We commend the Sikh elders in their stance and would hope the film is banned or the offensive scenes deleted for maligning the good name of Sikhism, in a libel case as would any individual or corporation defamed or compromised by infringments upon their inherent standing and reputation. ...

There are orthodox Sikhs and non orthodox Sikhs who smoke, drink, snort drugs, inject etc. some sects of Sikhs are renowned for strong family values, hard work ethos, excellent hospitality and a boisterous lifestyle. Sikhism is ingrained and hardwired into their psyches, and they are further respected for being devoutly Godward in spirit regardless of their outward exuberance. Whilst orthodoxy is much to be respected, it fails and falls in its sacred purpose if the said practitioners intermittently and incessantly berate hardline drinkers and revellers, making their piety seem a resented sufferance than a the true liberation of will and Spirit that puritan living is.

Offense when maliciously intended is offensive. I make no personal remarks about others and tend to square any situation where seem conveyed offense if launched from other quarters. Sikhism is a strong, noble and proud faith. It has suffered many onslaughts, 1984 remains fresh in our minds, it remains without independent state status. Sikhs are being attacked not by conventional assaults but by the cutting of their hair and irreligious barbs upon their person. If this is not offense with malicious intent to do harm, then the defendant is assuredly impaired in sense and fairness. This too is an inferred offense none feel inspired to amend. Civilised societies tend to refrain from opportuning others of criticism, whilst others of less integrity conceitedly affront, oppress and inflict harsh suffering without any shame, decency or sign of humanity at all. We would not with the modern western ailment to reach Eastern shores and implem4ent measure to stem any such intrusion. It is deeply disheartening to find Sunny Deol implicated in this entire sorry saga. It would appear the nightmare/natak and the reality/haqeeqat is not entirely dissimilar in its macabre volific silence in anguish.. Viewer discretion required, images contained herein may be deemed offensive : -

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SPNer

The giving and taking of it really confuses me. An offence when given has absolutly no power if it not taken. What I mean by that is if somebody tries to offend me and I choose to not take offence then they have failed.

To my mind it really is that simple.

It confuses me then when things like this happen. I have not seen the film, but I can saftly assume that the forour is because it shows Sikhs as Sikhs are not in reality. Cutting hair perhaps, smokeing or drinking maybe?

Well I know Sikhs who cut their hair, I know also that some smoke and drink, these are Sikhs but more importantly they, like all of us, they are weak willed manmukhs. We are not perect that is why we have religion in the world, to help us strive to be better.

So this film may portray Sikhs doing unsihklike things. It is also I asumme a work of fiction. So I think what does it matter if this film portrays Sikhs as unsikhlike, is it true?

Perhaps some Sikhs do act in this way, maybe that is the feeling of ill will, too close to the truth? In which case it is hypocritical to try to ban this film.

Perhaps it is all lies, in which case why get upset, its all a lie, we know it is untrue, why should it matter to us what non sikhs think of us, or whether or not they belive the lies?

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1947-2014 (Archived)

Guru Fateh! You have made interesting statements about making a conscious effort to rise above personal reactions, so it is possible to move in the direction of having genuine responses. IMHO do not believe in banning much of anything because people can choose to watch, read, and ultimately to be affected by something that is alien to their own way of thinking and feeling.

I would like as a thought experiment to take a look at a few aspects of the discussion.

First, the original post dates to May 2005 when the movie in question had been released and caused a furor in some circles of Punjab. That was 4 years ago, and today we are still wondering if it should be banned.

Who has seen the film and was it ever banned? Unanswered questions for me. I can recall the debates, but don't recall that they ever led anywhere.

The initial post was uploaded by Neutral Singh, a forum member who typically likes to get us to look at our assumptions, and question them, and become perhaps aware of our biases. Did any discussants here at SPN or anywhere become more aware of personal biases to the extent that assumptions were challenged and perspectives broadened a bit? I don't know the answer to that either.

It was interesting though to re-read this discussion and take a look at the comments made in the newspaper article itself (linked in Post 1)

'Jo Bole So Nihal' offends Sikhs: SGPC"says:Nothing is wrong in the film. I am also a sikh. You people are just disturbing the peace of the country when people are not tenced then why are you fools shouting shut up your mouth. if u do not like it then do not watch it and do not kill innocents because of your publicity. Sikhism is pure community with is being disturbed by few foolish sikhs like you
[23 May, 2005 0836hrs IST]

says:This is to cccoolio as u truely said about sikhism that its big and mature then why ur thinking is so narrow.If it doesn't suits to sikhism so do u think that disgrace will suits to hinduism.Thought is really ridiculous and funny.We are fine till the things are not effecting our integrity and life and we dont bother whether it is effecting others or not this is how we people think and that shows how well we understand humanity and our normal religious doctrine.Sorry to say that we all are losing our religions........
[20 May, 2005 1401hrs IST]

says:Bollywood is deliberately offensive to sikhs most of the times. The naming of the film with a religious phrase when the film has nothing to do with religion is deliberate mischief to draw mileage from foreseen controversies. Then showing a sikh smoking cigarette or cutting hair mid-way in the movie is cheap attempt to denigrate the religion. If the movie hero image cannot be sustained with a turbaned hero then why have such a character in the first place? show a Hindu cop for God's sake. And why name the movie with a religious phrase when the hero's character is obviously a shame on the religion to begin with. There are too many things here for the director/producer/sunny deol to feign ignorance. Bollywood only hurts itself with these cheap tricks. Sikhism is too big and mature a religion to get affected anyway. but the taste it leaves is a bad one for common people.
[19 May, 2005 1852hrs IST]"

Now more than 4 years later the same sentiments are active in forum discussion and all kinds of discussions. Sometimes the views of others are like a mirror. We are loosing our religion, we don't like Hindus, we are offended by Bollywood which is full of cheap tricks... But also... mind the difference between your point of view and the view of another, don't let your biases harm others, the images of the film defame Sikhs, but Sikhism is too strong to be harmed by a few sikhs, and why don't we become offended when another religious group is defamed.

Something magnetic is present in the topic that brings us back to these chants -- 4 years later. But the maybe I shouldn't be amazed.

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SPNer

You are right! It is nigh on impossible to think out side of not only our cultural bias but our personal bias. I'm not sure if you know of Sikh.net, and please forgive me for advitising it here but I am also present as member of their forum, where even know we are having what I think is a good debate over bias(specificly within a religions context).

I postited there that if you hold to any belief, idea, ideal or principle then you do indeed have a bias. It seems only natural to me that if you belive in a creator God then you are biased towards a belife in God, and of course where the opposite is true your bias would be opposite.

To my way of thought think I would like to meet this Neutral Singh, he sounds a throughly decent fellow.

So we come to 'ways of thought'. I honestly do not reconise where this thing of mine comes from, I mean of course my stance re: being offened and taking offence, I can only say that ever since I was a child, this subject has caused me great confusion.

In my head it is very clear cut. I don't know where you are Kaur or where you grew up, but here in England we have a saying that we teach our kids when they are very young, I wonder if you have heard of it?

'Sticks and stones may brake your bones but names can never hurt you'

It is incredulous then that as adults we seem to have forgotten this.

Heh one of the things I find amazing is the capacity of humanity to not learn from it's mistakes. War for example will it never cease?

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