Topping labor's wish list - for now - is a push to raise taxes on wealthy Americans and discouraging Obama from agreeing to any deal with Republicans over the looming "fiscal cliff" that cuts into Social Security and Medicare.

Those are things that help all Americans.

Immigration reform - and a path to citizenship for 11 million undocumented Latino immigrants - would create a vast new pool of potential union members.

It could also create a vast new pool of strikebreakers. But it could be better for America overall for various reasons.

Arkanaut:Topping labor's wish list - for now - is a push to raise taxes on wealthy Americans and discouraging Obama from agreeing to any deal with Republicans over the looming "fiscal cliff" that cuts into Social Security and Medicare.

Those are things that help all Americans.

Immigration reform - and a path to citizenship for 11 million undocumented Latino immigrants - would create a vast new pool of potential union members.

It could also create a vast new pool of strikebreakers. But it could be better for America overall for various reasons.

//my $.02

The problem with this is that the democrats are basically admitting they lied to get the debt ceiling raised... and the Republicans will take full advantage of this. The Democrats promised to cut spending as part of the deal.. and part of that deal was not to raise taxes.

Whether its good or not is immaterial.. the democrats agreed to the deal.

Immigration is a different kettle of fish... how can we abide by the rule of law and admit at the same time that we farked up as a nation and basically caused this issue ourselves?

Arkanaut:Topping labor's wish list - for now - is a push to raise taxes on wealthy Americans and discouraging Obama from agreeing to any deal with Republicans over the looming "fiscal cliff" that cuts into Social Security and Medicare.

Those are things that help all Americans.

Immigration reform - and a path to citizenship for 11 million undocumented Latino immigrants - would create a vast new pool of potential union members.

It could also create a vast new pool of strikebreakers. But it could be better for America overall for various reasons.

//my $.02

No they don't. I sure as hell am not counting on either. I would rather keep the money out of my paycheck.

dwrash:Arkanaut: Topping labor's wish list - for now - is a push to raise taxes on wealthy Americans and discouraging Obama from agreeing to any deal with Republicans over the looming "fiscal cliff" that cuts into Social Security and Medicare.

Those are things that help all Americans.

Immigration reform - and a path to citizenship for 11 million undocumented Latino immigrants - would create a vast new pool of potential union members.

It could also create a vast new pool of strikebreakers. But it could be better for America overall for various reasons.

//my $.02

The problem with this is that the democrats are basically admitting they lied to get the debt ceiling raised... and the Republicans will take full advantage of this. The Democrats promised to cut spending as part of the deal.. and part of that deal was not to raise taxes.

Whether its good or not is immaterial.. the democrats agreed to the deal.

WTF are you talking about? The debt limit was raised when an agreement was made. That agreement was that there would be massive cuts in spending and tax increases that start on January 1, 2013 unless another deal is negotiated before then. At no time did Obama, or any Democrats in congress that I'm aware of, promise that a compromise to avoid the "fiscal cliff" would exclude raising taxes.

plcow:Arkanaut: Topping labor's wish list - for now - is a push to raise taxes on wealthy Americans and discouraging Obama from agreeing to any deal with Republicans over the looming "fiscal cliff" that cuts into Social Security and Medicare.

Those are things that help all Americans.

Immigration reform - and a path to citizenship for 11 million undocumented Latino immigrants - would create a vast new pool of potential union members.

It could also create a vast new pool of strikebreakers. But it could be better for America overall for various reasons.

//my $.02

No they don't. I sure as hell am not counting on either. I would rather keep the money out of my paycheck.

Yeah, yeah, I'd like to keep the money from my paycheck that goes to Halliburton too. Stop being a whiny little biatch, pay your bills, or move to a country where you pay less in taxes but still have it as good as you do in America.

max_pooper:dwrash: Arkanaut: Topping labor's wish list - for now - is a push to raise taxes on wealthy Americans and discouraging Obama from agreeing to any deal with Republicans over the looming "fiscal cliff" that cuts into Social Security and Medicare.

Those are things that help all Americans.

Immigration reform - and a path to citizenship for 11 million undocumented Latino immigrants - would create a vast new pool of potential union members.

It could also create a vast new pool of strikebreakers. But it could be better for America overall for various reasons.

//my $.02

The problem with this is that the democrats are basically admitting they lied to get the debt ceiling raised... and the Republicans will take full advantage of this. The Democrats promised to cut spending as part of the deal.. and part of that deal was not to raise taxes.

Whether its good or not is immaterial.. the democrats agreed to the deal.

WTF are you talking about? The debt limit was raised when an agreement was made. That agreement was that there would be massive cuts in spending and tax increases that start on January 1, 2013 unless another deal is negotiated before then. At no time did Obama, or any Democrats in congress that I'm aware of, promise that a compromise to avoid the "fiscal cliff" would exclude raising taxes.

? The debt limit bill included the super committee that was supposed to find an agreement. The democrats weaseled in the super committee trying to wrangle for tax hikes even though when they agreed to the super committed tax hikes were off the table.

The democrats own this mess.. they did the day they voted for the debt limit increase.

dwrash:max_pooper: dwrash: Arkanaut: Topping labor's wish list - for now - is a push to raise taxes on wealthy Americans and discouraging Obama from agreeing to any deal with Republicans over the looming "fiscal cliff" that cuts into Social Security and Medicare.

Those are things that help all Americans.

Immigration reform - and a path to citizenship for 11 million undocumented Latino immigrants - would create a vast new pool of potential union members.

It could also create a vast new pool of strikebreakers. But it could be better for America overall for various reasons.

//my $.02

The problem with this is that the democrats are basically admitting they lied to get the debt ceiling raised... and the Republicans will take full advantage of this. The Democrats promised to cut spending as part of the deal.. and part of that deal was not to raise taxes.

Whether its good or not is immaterial.. the democrats agreed to the deal.

WTF are you talking about? The debt limit was raised when an agreement was made. That agreement was that there would be massive cuts in spending and tax increases that start on January 1, 2013 unless another deal is negotiated before then. At no time did Obama, or any Democrats in congress that I'm aware of, promise that a compromise to avoid the "fiscal cliff" would exclude raising taxes.

? The debt limit bill included the super committee that was supposed to find an agreement. The democrats weaseled in the super committee trying to wrangle for tax hikes even though when they agreed to the super committed tax hikes were off the table.

The democrats own this mess.. they did the day they voted for the debt limit increase.

Arkanaut:plcow: No they don't. I sure as hell am not counting on either.

Well, that was convincing. Fark the seniors.

I would rather keep the money out of my paycheck.

How much do you think you should pay?

I didn't say fark the seniors, I just said I am not counting on receiving either service. If there wasn't social security and medicare, and I felt compelled to help seniors, then I would donate my time or money to helping seniors. I don't need the hugely inefficient organization, that is the federal government, managing my money or representing my values for me.

If I had an option of what I paid in taxes, I would say about $10k a year in flat taxes. That is what I have measured to be the value of the services that I receive. If I make more money, it is because I have increased my skillset and my ability to produce more value, and has nothing to do with there being magically better roads etc.

Don't worry, this really isn't up to you or anybody else in this country, I have already started to pick out my island.

dwrash:The new the moment they signed the debt agreement bill... The republicans made it VERY CLEAR that tax hikes were off the table.

LOL no. We just had an election that made it very clear that NOBODY gives a fark what Republicans make clear about anything. Taxes on the wealthy will be raised because that's what the American people want. You lost. Get over it.

un4gvn666:dwrash: The new the moment they signed the debt agreement bill... The republicans made it VERY CLEAR that tax hikes were off the table.

LOL no. We just had an election that made it very clear that NOBODY gives a fark what Republicans make clear about anything. Taxes on the wealthy will be raised because that's what the American people want. You lost. Get over it.

And the republicans retained control over the house (which holds the purse strings).

ghare:plcow: Arkanaut: Topping labor's wish list - for now - is a push to raise taxes on wealthy Americans and discouraging Obama from agreeing to any deal with Republicans over the looming "fiscal cliff" that cuts into Social Security and Medicare.

Those are things that help all Americans.

Immigration reform - and a path to citizenship for 11 million undocumented Latino immigrants - would create a vast new pool of potential union members.

It could also create a vast new pool of strikebreakers. But it could be better for America overall for various reasons.

//my $.02

No they don't. I sure as hell am not counting on either. I would rather keep the money out of my paycheck.

Yeah, yeah, I'd like to keep the money from my paycheck that goes to Halliburton too. Stop being a whiny little biatch, pay your bills, or move to a country where you pay less in taxes but still have it as good as you do in America.

Haha, it would be whiney if all I did was talk about it, but I put my time, money and resources where my mouth is. It's just a statement of fact. And there are plenty of countries that have it as good as America.

Out of curiosity, are the same people that complain because Americans have a superiority complex the same people who make statements like "move somewhere better then, if you can find it"

dwrash:max_pooper: dwrash: max_pooper: dwrash: The new the moment they signed the debt agreement bill... The republicans made it VERY CLEAR that tax hikes were off the table.

So, you are saying that Republicans are staunchly against raising taxes and the hissy fits they have and are continuing to throw over Democrats insisting on taxes increases are the fault of Democrats?

Duh?... and the hissy fit is because they were lied to by the democrats.

At least you are admitting that Congressional Republicans are in fact throwing hissy fits.

Now, could you point out when the "Democrats" agreed to not raise taxes?

Every single one of them that voted yes for bill that raised the debt ceiling..... duh?

They basically played 'whimpy' politics (you know, I'll gladly pay you next week for a hamburger this week).. the Republicans came to collect and they renigged.

You do know that the bill that raised the debt ceiling called for tax hikes correct? That bill called for the expiration of the Bush ear tax cuts for all income levels as well as massive spending cuts. Ever single Republican and Democrat that voted yes on that bill voted for spending cuts and tax increases.

Republicans claimed to get 98% of what they wanted out of that bill and now that their tax pledge idiocy has been exposed they, and their water carriers like you, are trying to blame congressional Democrats and the President. Remember, the mess we are in currently with the "fiscal cliff" is 98% of what Republicans wanted.

Topping labor's wish list - for now - is a push to raise taxes on wealthy Americans and discouraging Obama from agreeing to any deal with Republicans over the looming "fiscal cliff" that cuts into Social Security and Medicare.

dwrash:max_pooper: I see dwrash has scurried off without providing any citations for his ridiculous claims.

Nope.. I actually have to work for a living, so I only get short stints on here.

Next time you have a break between delivering pizzas you can provide a citation for your ridiculous claim that Democrats lied about wanting to raise the rate on the highest tax bracket or you could provide your own special definition of marginal utility. Or you could comment on Speaker of the House Republican John Boehner telling the President today that he is open to raising taxes.