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On this week’s episode of The Waves, Hanna, June, and By the Book’s Kristen Meinzer discuss Elizabeth Holmes, the Stanford dropout who charmed Silicon Valley—and just about everyone else—before her company, Theranos, was exposed as a failure and a fraud. The story has spawned a book, a podcast, and soon an HBO documentary. How did she do it, and why are we still so fascinated by her rise and fall? Then, PEN15 is a new series in which thirtysomething comedians Maya Erskine and Anna Konkle play versions of their middle-school selves—and star alongside actual teenagers. The hosts debate whether the gimmick works and discuss how the show’s refreshing frankness about the sexuality reflects a wider trend in streaming TV. Finally, they’re joined by Nina Burleigh, author of Golden Handcuffs: The Secret History of Trump’s Women, to discuss the president’s relationship to Ivanka, his grandmother Elizabeth (“the original Trump”), and more.