Chapter 1: The day of the kidnapping. The surveillance video showing Rafferty driving up the street outside Tori's school and McClintic walking Tori up the street. Witnesses from and around Oliver Stephens public school will talk about seeing Tori.
An identification officer will use photographs and maps to show the route from Woodstock to Guelph.
Tori's mother, Tara McDonald, will testify about the frantic hours the family spent looking for Tori.

Chapter 2: Terri-Lynne McClintic. "She was an essential part of all that happened," Gowdey said. "I expect her credibility will be a major issue in this case."

Chapter 4: the Mount Forest death scene, which the jury will visit. "It will be difficult to go to the very place where this happened, I know that, but understanding the crime scene is crucial to understanding the crime," Gowdey said. Photographs, some of them graphic, will be used to explain "exactly how the killing happened."
"Unfortunately it is only through them that you can fully understand (the) evidence," Gowdey said.

Chapter 5: Police interaction with Rafferty.

Chapter 6: The searches of Rafferty and McClintic's residences and the evidence found.

Chapter 7: The Honda Civic. What was found inside.

Chapter 8: Rafferty's connection to the Mount Forest area.

Chapter 9: Comments Rafferty made to friends after April 8. "He had some interesting things to say to other people about Terri-Lynne McClintic and about the kidnapping itself," Gowdey said.

Chapter 10: The May 15 weekend and Rafferty's actions.

Chapter 11: The BlackBerry. The BlackBerry allowed police to track his movements April 8 and after.

Chapter 12: A recap of the surveillance video.
http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/r.../19463111.html

Salem's warning from last week:
Okay everybody - LISTEN UP! We are not bashing, accusing or blaming Tori's family here. It won't be allowed.
Children walk home from school every day without incident. Parents are not perfect, it's just not possible. Tori's parents DID NOT do this to her. TLM and an accomplice DID. That is where the blame goes.
We had a lot of family bashing in the early parts of this investigation after Tori went missing and a lot of baseless accusations - NONE OF WHICH PROVED TO BE TRUE. Victim and family bashing will not be allowed during this trial.
Thank you,
Salem
---------------------------------
and reposting SoSueMe's warning:
As some of you may have noticed, the members following this case are dropping in numbers. It's disheartening to us because we need and welcome discussion of both sides of every issue on Websleuths.
Zero tolerance means ZERO tolerance. Please discuss this case with respect to your fellow members. Subtle and veiled harassment and/or talking in code about other members will not be tolerated.
A word of caution on the Alerts in this forum. If you alert a post, make sure it is a clear violation of our Terms of Service. A difference of opinion is not a violation of TOS.
Please note that everything discussed in court and printed/tweeted is now within the realm of discussion. WS has never and does not now have a policy of "innocent until proven guilty." That is for the court room. Here, we discuss, speculate, theorize and judge according to the opinions we develop from following the case.
Keeping that in mind, abuse of our alert system is a good way to find yourself in timeout or worse. Abuse of the alert systems includes, but is not limited to:
Alerting repeatedly on the same poster;
Demanding a specific outcome;
Alerting on the same post more than once.
Once you have alerted a post, move on and don't question the decisions of our Administrators, Moderators or Owners.
Following this trial is very important to our members and we're going to see that they have their day in court. The "zero tolerance" policy in this forum will continue and it will be enforced.
Thank you and please carry on.
Sue aka SoSueMe
Websleuths Co-Owner

LONDON, Ont. — For a fellow who was purportedly “horrified” when Terri-Lynne McClintic first abducted and then abruptly killed a little Woodstock, Ont., girl in the spring of 2009, Michael Rafferty appears to have pulled himself together rather quickly.

Indeed, Mr. Rafferty did what any man who had just watched a shocking child murder might do: He went onto a dating website called Plenty of Fish and proceeded to become involved with no fewer than two women.

The suggestion that Mr. Rafferty, now 31, was aghast when McClintic purportedly killed the eight-year-old came from his lawyer, Dirk Derstine, during his cross-examination of McClintic last month.

Im going to suggest to you that Mr. Rafferty came back [to the car] after the death, was horrified, but helped you clean up. You can agree or disagree with that, Mr. Derstine told McClintic, who vehemently disagreed.

Proof that the defence put his client at the crime scene. Direct quote from Mr. Derstine himself.

matou

04-13-2012, 07:27 AM

I wonder if they are skipping over Chapter 8 because of scheduling issues and will return to it later on?

Chapter 8: Rafferty's connection to the Mount Forest area.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 08:10 AM

I wonder if they are skipping over Chapter 8 because of scheduling issues and will return to it later on?

Chapter 8: Rafferty's connection to the Mount Forest area.

Good point. I hadn't even noticed that until you pointed it out. hmmmmm

I wonder if there was something that the defense objected to when they had that "legal issues" day?

It's too bad if they skip over it because this would've added another big piece to their case and nail to his coffin.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 08:12 AM

Just thought of something, perhaps it wasn't necessary for them to do the connection to the Mt. Forest Chapter because his attorney already admitted the accused child killer was there.:twocents:

matou

04-13-2012, 08:21 AM

Just thought of something, perhaps it wasn't necessary for them to do the connection to the Mt. Forest Chapter because his attorney already admitted the accused child killer was there.:twocents:

Maybe it was Miss Lane who already mentioned him living in Drayton with relatives when he was in grade school? IDK:waitasec:

daisy.faithfull

04-13-2012, 08:27 AM

Just thought of something, perhaps it wasn't necessary for them to do the connection to the Mt. Forest Chapter because his attorney already admitted the accused child killer was there.:twocents:

That could be, the Crown didn't know that the defence was going to admitt that MTR was at the crime sceme until after opening statements.

I still hope they don't skip it, I was wondering if it could provide some answers about where TLM and MTR between when they left the crime scene and when they got back to Woodstock.

snoofer

04-13-2012, 08:31 AM

Good point. I hadn't even noticed that until you pointed it out. hmmmmm

I wonder if there was something that the defense objected to when they had that "legal issues" day?

It's too bad if they skip over it because this would've added another big piece to their case and nail to his coffin.

I doubt that the crown will just omit this section; I am expecting it was moved for good reason and that section will have just as much impact as yesterday's testimony.:twocents:

Kamille

04-13-2012, 08:55 AM

Just thought of something, perhaps it wasn't necessary for them to do the connection to the Mt. Forest Chapter because his attorney already admitted the accused child killer was there.:twocents:

Well if his only "connection" is that he lived in Drayton during his preteen years then I would skip it because that's stretching it. But to devote an entire chapter to it, I would hope there is a lot more info...like jobs held etc. And it is important to establish that TLM did not "direct" MR to the rural property but rather MR drove directly to it out of Guelph and knew where it was and why he was taking Victoria there.

MOO

ETA: I guess it's possible that the people who live in Drayton, a very small town, spend a lot of time in Mt Forest which is a little bigger to do shopping etc rather than going into the larger city of Guelph. And his Aunt and Uncle may have taken him there often and they may have known people from Mt Forest that they visited with regularily. Lots of farmers in that area and I would imagine they get together for farm related fairs, auctions etc.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 09:02 AM

Rafferty trial shifts to new chapter

A new chapter in the Crown's case against Michael Rafferty is set to begin Friday in a London courtroom  what the accused said to friends after disappearance of Victoria 'Tori' Stafford.

He had some interesting things to say to other people about Terri-Lynne McClintic, about the kidnapping itself, Crown Attorney Kevin Gowdey told jurors in his opening remarks.

The Crown finished Thursday what it called the car chapter, which examined evidence found in Rafferty's 2003 Honda Civic.

"We did talk one time about abducting kids and how they take the kids and make them be like their own," ex-girlfriend Sarah Hodge, 31, testified, elaborating a few seconds later, "how people take their kids and abduct them and they just grow up thinking that they're their real parents."

Rafferty was obsessed with the Stafford case, testified Hodge, who said she started dating him April 14, 2009, six days after Tori disappeared while walking home from her Woodstock school.

9:13
Mike Knoll: @Guest - you'll need to contact the courts following the trial.
9:13
Comment From Guest
Will the full transcript from the trial ever become available?

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 09:19 AM

Mike Knoll: @lev - the defence didn't make an opening by choice - it's entirely optional. This could be seen as a tactical move.

Comment From lev
that's interesting that the Defence doesn't make an opening statement..do you have historical information on this...is it just a British based process....do they both get closing statements; so many of us watch too much American tv..

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 09:20 AM

@Carol - most days both parents are there. Here and there they will miss. There is always someone from Tori's family in court.

Comment From Carol
Are Tori's parents still attending daily?

tmhco

04-13-2012, 09:22 AM

I just saw this tweet and whatever you believe about the evidence, thought it quite poignant.

"There is never a better measure of what a person is than what he does when he's absolutely free to choose." JMO

Flowercb

04-13-2012, 09:42 AM

Just thought of something, perhaps it wasn't necessary for them to do the connection to the Mt. Forest Chapter because his attorney already admitted the accused child killer was there.:twocents:

If they can prove that Rafferty was really familiar with the area or "partied" there in the past, they can make a connection to the fact that he looked for a familiar succluded area to do the deed.:detective::dervish::moo:

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 09:46 AM

@Meghan - yes, it's possible.
9:43
Comment From Meghan
Could it be possible that Rafferty's Mother (at least) might be called to the stand?
9:42
Mike Knoll: @Guest - no idea where she is but I can confirm she hasn't been in court.
9:41
Comment From Guest
Anyone know where Mclintic"s mom is? and was she ever in court?
9:41
Mike Knoll: @Follower - we have been unable to contact Rafferty's family and won't be able to try again until following the trial.
9:41
Comment From Follower
Has there every been any comments from Rafferty's family on what has happened? How they perceive his involvement, etc?

-B. Armstrong - ex lover, met at BBeef/work, had girly talks with MR, supplied oxy drugs numerous times to MR including the day Tori was murdered.

-Miss Unknown (Pub ban) - 37, MR met her on POF April 12/09, MR told her about TLM in detention centre being questioned about Tori's abduction.

-S. Hodge - 31, C&Y worker MR met on POF April 14/09, saw each other every day for two and a half weeks. Said he was a dance instructor. She mostly drove them around, MR on phone setting up dance appointments. MR told her he took oxy, he thought he had colon cancer. MR spoke to her about people abducting children raising them as their own. Obsessed with Tori's case listening to news and reading newspaper.

-M. LaBute, MR met her at her workplace Staples March 09, saying he was new in town. She told MR she wasn't interested, described MR as nervous and needy. Spent a lot of time on phone keeping track of his workers claiming to own contracting business.

RaffertyLFP: Latimer said Rafferty frequently changed his sign in on MSN to "I want out" I need pain killers" and " Bring Tori home

nettie_82

04-13-2012, 10:29 AM

50?!?!

This guy needs serious help even if he is found not guilty in all this. I hope all women in Canada are watching this and he never has another date again in his life. If he was female he would be called a s***.

- Miss WS - GF at the time of his arrest. Dated for five to six weeks.

-J. Wood - woman known to MR. She was in her Honda in GLF parking lot day of his arrest. Her car also seized by LE.

-Amanda - MR admitted to LE during taped interview May 15/09, he dated her a few times. MR claimed Amanda was a friend of TM and her daughter a friend to Tori. Note: This could be another Amanda as the one who I think knew TM is the other Amanda below.

-B. Armstrong - ex lover, met at BBeef/work, had girly talks with MR, supplied oxy drugs numerous times to MR including the day Tori was murdered.

-Miss Unknown (Pub ban) - 37, MR met her on POF April 12/09, MR told her about TLM in detention centre being questioned about Tori's abduction.

-S. Hodge - 31, C&Y worker MR met on POF April 14/09, saw each other every day for two and a half weeks. Said he was a dance instructor. She mostly drove them around, MR on phone setting up dance appointments. MR told her he took oxy, he thought he had colon cancer. MR spoke to her about people abducting children raising them as their own. Obsessed with Tori's case listening to news and reading newspaper.

-M. LaBute, MR met her at her workplace Staples March 09, saying he was new in town. She told MR she wasn't interested, described MR as nervous and needy. Spent a lot of time on phone keeping track of his workers claiming to own contracting business.

- Ashley R. - She's 25. In spring of 2009 she lived in London, near Fanshawe College. Met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty asked her to go to a stag and doe with him near the Hamilton area. She accepted. This was in early May.

- S. Latimer is 50 year old real estate agent who lives on farm outside Woodstock Met Rafferty in Jan 2009 on Plenty of Fish.

- M. Wagler met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty's post said he was looking for romance. On Good Friday (April 8th) in 2009, he asked her to go for breakfast in London. She declined.

- A. Chambers is 33 and lives in Woodstock - mother of two (boy and girl). Chambers knew Tori Stafford, at one point her family lived around block and Tori played with her daugher (age 16). Chambers said they started communication near end of March 2009 they went out for coffee, went bowling, he came over to house. Chambers said she first met with Rafferty on April 3 2009. Chambers said she had sex with Rafferty once.
They got along well. Their relationship became sexual, "once", she says. JMO - I think she is the Amanda who he stated to police was friends with TM.

Oldsoul2

04-13-2012, 10:30 AM

All these women show that MR was in fact not manipulated by any women like the defense claims.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:30 AM

In spring of 2009, Rafferty put statements like "I want out", "Bring Tori home,", "What an ass, now I have no plans for Easter"

RaffertyLFP: Latimer said "Bring Tori Home" stood out - she didn't know who Tori was - Latimer was curious but didn't communicate with Rafferty

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
In spring of 2009, Rafferty put statements like "I want out", "Bring Tori home,", "What an ass, now I have no plans for Easter"

...on his MSN display name. There were others. Only one involved Tori.

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
"Bring Tori Home," was written in bold on his display name. Latimer didn't know who Tori was. Heard she was missing days later.

RaffertyLFP: Latimer found out few days later that Tori was a missing girl in Woodstock

I think the second I saw the sign in "I need pain killers", I'd be hitting the block button

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:35 AM

RaffertyLFP: Latimer never asked Rafferty about "Bring Tori home

RaffertyLFP: Derstine starts cross - asks about Rafferty's MSN sign in "I thought I had it all but all is lost

No more questions from Venne. Derstine points out he had "I thought I had it all, but all was lost" on his MSN name. Latimer can't remember

She now agrees, after being read her police statement.

RaffertyLFP: Derstine asks Latimer about her later own MSN posting on Latimer's sign in - no further questions

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 10:35 AM

RaffertyLFP: Derstine starts cross - asks about Rafferty's MSN sign in "I thought I had it all but all is lost" [via Twitter]

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:36 AM

RaffertyLFP: Michelle Wagler is next witness

Gowdey has called Michelle Wagler.

RaffertyLFP: Wagler is 30 and lives in Kitchener works at University of Waterloo but lived in Tavistock in 2009

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
She lives in Kitchener. She lived in Tavistock in 2009.

Thinkzerz

04-13-2012, 10:38 AM

I am not trying to defend MR but having "Bring Tori Home" on MSN and being obsessed with the case along with having Tori's missing persons flyer. Isn't much evidence IMO. I had flyers of Tori in my home ( As i place them around my hometown) And i am sure to say obsessed with this case...most people were and still are such as us on this forum. If we weren't obsessed we wouldn't be wanting to hear all details in the court room.

However MR was involved so maybe the crown is going to use this in some way.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 10:39 AM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
#Rafferty's lawyer challenges Latimer about the wording of one of the accused's MSN Messenger statuses. She is excused.

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Latimer says she saw #Rafferty's "Bring Tori home" status on MSN, but they never chatted about the line.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:39 AM

She met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish.

She can't remember who started their discussion. His profile said he was looking for a romantic relationship.

RaffertyLFP: Wagler met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish (again!) Rafferty's post said he was looking for romance, She can't remember if he used his real name

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 10:40 AM

RaffertyLFP: Wagler met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish (again!) Rafferty's post said he was looking for romance, She can't remember if he used his real name [via Twitter]

RaffertyLFP: Latimer said Rafferty frequently changed his sign in on MSN to "I want out" I need pain killers" and " Bring Tori home

BBM-Are you friggen kidding me????

Oldsoul2

04-13-2012, 10:41 AM

I am not trying to defend MR but having "Bring Tori Home" on MSN and being obsessed with the case along with having Tori's missing persons flyer. Isn't much evidence IMO. I had flyers of Tori in my home ( As i place them around my hometown) And i am sure to say obsessed with this case...most people were and still are such as us on this forum. If we weren't obsessed we wouldn't be wanting to hear all details in the court room.

However MR was involved so maybe the crown is going to use this in some way.

He was there, that has been proven already

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:41 AM

They started talking via MSN and e-mail.

RaffertyLFP: Wagler first met him online in Jan. 2009. On Good Friday she said Rafferty asked her to go to Cora's in London - she said no

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 10:41 AM

RaffertyLFP: Wagler first met him online in Jan. 2009. On Good Friday she said Rafferty asked her to go to Cora's in London - she said no [via Twitter]

Juris_Prudence

04-13-2012, 10:42 AM

BBM-Are you friggen kidding me????

Was this BEFORE or AFTER police interviewed him at his home in May? Because when they interviewed him he referred to Tori as "that missing girl". :maddening:

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:42 AM

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
On Good Friday (April 8th) in 2009, he asked her to go for breakfast in London. She declined.

RaffertyLFP: Wagler said she saw Rafferty's MSN sign in post "Bring Tori home" Wagler said her own sign in read "Prayers for Tori"

RaffertyLFP: Wagler said Rafferty sent her a text in May asking why she wasn't communicating more,

Should read Good Friday was April 10th.

She mentions both of them had referenced a Tori and bringing her home on their MSN display.

SideKick

04-13-2012, 10:44 AM

BBM-Are you friggen kidding me????

MR's way of appearing he had zip to do with missing Tory.... as if! How many guys actually write stuff like that...? I don't think it is common at all.. in fact, my husband and son know my interests in WS's however, the last thing they would do is even take noticed of missing people... in a smaller town, yes, maybe.....

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:45 AM

RaffertyLFP: Wagler said Rafferty commented on Wagler's "Pray for Tori" post - he said "We are all praying for her"

Rafferty sent her a text in May, wondering why they no longer talked. He also told her "we're all praying for Tori."

They last communicated on May 13th. No more questions from either side.

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
The crown has called Amanda Michelle Chambers

Oldsoul2

04-13-2012, 10:45 AM

Was this BEFORE or AFTER police interviewed him at his home in May? Because when they interviewed him he referred to Tori as "that missing girl". :maddening:

Yeah, also said he hardly knew anything about the girl, just heard it around from people, meanwhile posting all this on msn

Thinkzerz

04-13-2012, 10:45 AM

He was there, that has been proven already

Yes i know, you must have misread my post.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:46 AM

RaffertyLFP: Amanda Chambers is next witness

RaffertyLFP: Chamber is very upset and breathing heavily

nettie_82

04-13-2012, 10:46 AM

How do you bring quotes forward from a previous thread?

Originally Posted by Sailor Bug
RaffertyLFP: The next day they went to Cora's breakfast place in London but they couldn't find it. He appeared nervous always on phone

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
He picked her up at 11 the next morning. Tried to go to a breakfast place in London, couldn't find it. Just got a coffee.

RaffertyLFP: Rafferty told her he worked as a hiring person for construction sites, that why he was always on the phone

I guess MTR has a thing for Cora's in London. It seems to be a common theme with his dating.

Jezbel

04-13-2012, 10:47 AM

RaffertyLFP: Amanda Chambers is next witness

RaffertyLFP: Chamber is very upset and breathing heavily

I bet this is the Amanda that was friends with TM, would explain her being upset :(

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 10:47 AM

RaffertyLFP: Amanda Chambers is next witness

RaffertyLFP: Chamber is very upset and breathing heavily

So sad for these women. :(

Kamille

04-13-2012, 10:47 AM

She met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish.

She can't remember who started their discussion. His profile said he was looking for a romantic relationship.

RaffertyLFP: Wagler met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish (again!) Rafferty's post said he was looking for romance, She can't remember if he used his real name

Geez...he was trolling that site big time. Ever heard of the Craigslist killer? Something really seems to be off about all this POF contact he was having with women of all ages.

MOO

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:48 AM

RaffertyLFP: Chambers is 33 and lives in Woodstock - mother of two [via Twitter]

She's 33. Lives in Woodstock. She lives with her two kids. Daughter is 16, son is 13.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 10:49 AM

I bet this is the Amanda that was friends with TM. :(

I think you're right

RaffertyLFP: Chambers is 33 and lives in Woodstock - mother of two [via Twitter]

:(

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:49 AM

RaffertyLFP: Chambers knew Tori Stafford, at one point her family lived around block and Tori played with her daugher

RaffertyLFP: Chambers said Tori's mom Tara was a "sweetheart' but didn't know her well

She and her children knew Tori Stafford. She also knew Tara McDonald. Got along well with her.

She met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish.

SideKick

04-13-2012, 10:49 AM

A good friend of mine had her profile up on POF and met a former rapist and crackhead... seriously, you never know who they are... however, it is very popular way of meeting people these days.... I guess.

CarrieBean

04-13-2012, 10:50 AM

How do you bring quotes forward from a previous thread?

Originally Posted by Sailor Bug
RaffertyLFP: The next day they went to Cora's breakfast place in London but they couldn't find it. He appeared nervous always on phone

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
He picked her up at 11 the next morning. Tried to go to a breakfast place in London, couldn't find it. Just got a coffee.

RaffertyLFP: Rafferty told her he worked as a hiring person for construction sites, that why he was always on the phone

I guess MTR has a thing for Cora's in London. It seems to be a common theme with his dating.

I can't keep track of the days. Was this invite after the last one, when they couldn't find it? Creepy.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:50 AM

RaffertyLFP: Chambers met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish She said he seemed friendly in conversation

On Plenty of Fish, "he seemed like a friendly type person", Chambers says.

CarrieBean

04-13-2012, 10:51 AM

RaffertyLFP: Chambers knew Tori Stafford, at one point her family lived around block and Tori played with her daugher

RaffertyLFP: Chambers said Tori's mom Tara was a "sweetheart' but didn't know her well

She and her children knew Tori Stafford. She also knew Tara McDonald. Got along well with her.

She met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish.

This poor girl.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:52 AM

RaffertyLFP: Chambers said they started communication near end of March 2009 they went out for coffee he came over to house

She says they got to know each other. They met. He went to her house, they went bowling.

RaffertyLFP: Chambers said she first met with Rafferty on April 3 2009

Kamille

04-13-2012, 10:53 AM

He was trying to make a date for the Friday after the murder?!? Did he give himself one day to "get over the horror"?

MOO

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 10:54 AM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Chambers also met #Rafferty on http://plentyoffish.com. Says they met for coffee a couple times, went bowling, out to a restaurant.

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Crown calls Amanda Chambers from Woodstock. She lived close to #ToriStafford. She used to come over to play with her kids. #Rafferty

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:54 AM

RaffertyLFP: They met at Tim Horton's - she was careful to meet at public place

They first met, in person, April 3rd 2009. They discussed that meeting on MSN.

RaffertyLFP: Chambers said she had sex with Rafferty once

They got along well. Their relationship became sexual, "once", she says.

Chambers is emotional as she testifies.

Oldsoul2

04-13-2012, 10:56 AM

RaffertyLFP: Chambers knew Tori Stafford, at one point her family lived around block and Tori played with her daugher

RaffertyLFP: Chambers said Tori's mom Tara was a "sweetheart' but didn't know her well

She and her children knew Tori Stafford. She also knew Tara McDonald. Got along well with her.

She met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish.

Maybe a connection to Tori that MR already had before he abducted her, maybe it wasn't random

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 10:56 AM

RaffertyLFP: On April 9 Rafferty texted her Chambers had gone over to Tara's to support her after Tori disappeared

They got along well. Their relationship became sexual, "at once", she says.

She said she was looking for Tori via text, after she went missing. Rafferty said the situation was sad.

SideKick

04-13-2012, 10:57 AM

Can you imagine!?!! Having met him around that time? I'd be pretty shaky too. A Murder Trial! Pray for these girls and give them peace. xxx

Thinkzerz

04-13-2012, 10:58 AM

I wonder if Tori was ever at her house when MR was?

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 11:00 AM

She was driving Tara McDonald's boyfriend, James Goris, to an appointment. Saw Rafferty on the street, when they started to text.

RaffertyLFP: Chambers went over to McDonald to comfort , search for Tori

Rafferty told her, that evening, he was out searching for Tori near the train tracks. Chambers was also looking.

crazyladi

04-13-2012, 11:01 AM

Yeah, also said he hardly knew anything about the girl, just heard it around from people, meanwhile posting all this on msn

He referred to her as "the missing girl" all of the sudden he knows her name?

I doesnt matter when the interview was, the fact that he was there when this happened and posted that on his MSN status sickens me.

SideKick

04-13-2012, 11:01 AM

6 degree's of separation...................>

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 11:02 AM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Chambers said #Rafferty texted her the day after #ToriStafford disappeared. She had gone to Tori's house to lend support to her mother.

Wondergirl

04-13-2012, 11:02 AM

She's 25. In spring of 2009 she lived in London, near Fanshawe College. Met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish.

RaffertyLFP: Reid first encountered Rafferty online late in April 2009 - they exchanged phone numbers

Their online communications started at the end of April, 2009. They started exchanging texts.

RaffertyLFP: After online conversation Reid and Rafferty decided to go to a stag and doe near Hamilton about May 9

Rafferty asked her to go to a stag and doe with him near the Hamilton area. She accepted. This was in early May.

This would be the Stag and Doe that TM/Tamtam testified to yesterday, then.

- Miss WS - GF at the time of his arrest. Dated for five to six weeks.

-J. Wood - woman known to MR. She was in her Honda in GLF parking lot day of his arrest. Her car also seized by LE.

-Amanda - MR admitted to LE during taped interview May 15/09, he dated her a few times. MR claimed Amanda was a friend of TM and her daughter a friend to Tori. Note: This could be another Amanda as the one who I think knew TM is the other Amanda below.

-B. Armstrong - ex lover, met at BBeef/work, had girly talks with MR, supplied oxy drugs numerous times to MR including the day Tori was murdered.

-Miss Unknown (Pub ban) - 37, MR met her on POF April 12/09, MR told her about TLM in detention centre being questioned about Tori's abduction.

-S. Hodge - 31, C&Y worker MR met on POF April 14/09, saw each other every day for two and a half weeks. Said he was a dance instructor. She mostly drove them around, MR on phone setting up dance appointments. MR told her he took oxy, he thought he had colon cancer. MR spoke to her about people abducting children raising them as their own. Obsessed with Tori's case listening to news and reading newspaper.

-M. LaBute, MR met her at her workplace Staples March 09, saying he was new in town. She told MR she wasn't interested, described MR as nervous and needy. Spent a lot of time on phone keeping track of his workers claiming to own contracting business.

- Ashley R. - She's 25. In spring of 2009 she lived in London, near Fanshawe College. Met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty asked her to go to a stag and doe with him near the Hamilton area. She accepted. This was in early May.

- S. Latimer is 50 year old real estate agent who lives on farm outside Woodstock Met Rafferty in Jan 2009 on Plenty of Fish.

- M. Wagler met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty's post said he was looking for romance. On Good Friday (April 8th) in 2009, he asked her to go for breakfast in London. She declined.

- A. Chambers is 33 and lives in Woodstock - mother of two (boy and girl). Chambers knew Tori Stafford, at one point her family lived around block and Tori played with her daugher (age 16). Chambers said they started communication near end of March 2009 they went out for coffee, went bowling, he came over to house. Chambers said she first met with Rafferty on April 3 2009. Chambers said she had sex with Rafferty once.
They got along well. Their relationship became sexual, "once", she says. JMO - I think she is the Amanda who he stated to police was friends with TM. Here is another OMG moment ... Chambers said #Rafferty told her he had a step-son named Jaden who had died 2 wks before they met. She said that pulled on her heartstrings.

- No name (#2) - The next witness is a 28 year old woman who met Michael Rafferty online thru Plenty of Fish (as Mychol) at the end of March 2009. The woman texted frequently and they met for coffee on a Friday near end of April, Rafferty claimed he was teaching dance class in Kitchener. They exchanged cell phone numbers. Communicated by text message. The woman said there was little info on Rafferty's Plenty of Fish post - said he "wasn't into games" that caught her interest. Rafferty told her he was a contractor and dance teacher and wanted to travel. The woman said Rafferty showed up at her workplace at one point. She was asked to go to the Stag and Doe, but said no, as she wasn't feeling well. Said it seemed weird to ask her. He seemed upset. She worked at Staples. He came into the store to say hi, brought a coffee. He asked why she wasn't more excited to see him. She was busy.

- Cooney - age 29, and lived in Kitchener in 2009. She also met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 11:05 AM

They later met at a Tim Horton's. She become emotional. Said they discussed Tori going missing.

They saw a woman in a white jacket, he said if it was her, I would tackle her. He seemed concerned, had a "big heart" about the situation.

He told her he was sure Tori was fine, and she would be returned safe.

RaffertyLFP: He (Rafferty) seemed to be concerned about Tori "had a big heart" said Chambers

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 11:06 AM

RaffertyLFP: Chambers and Rafferty went bowling next day he left abruply he seemed "wierd"

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
He said his car had been broken into soon after, met her at Crabby Joe's in Woodstock (after bowling during the day).

RaffertyLFP: They also met at Crabby Joe's He seemed jealous and weird

She never saw him again. Only communicated with him a few times via text. Called her May 2nd.

He wanted to get together. They never did. Rafferty said he had a stepson who had passed away, named Jaden. It "tugged her heart strings".

RaffertyLFP: Rafferty told her he had a stepson that died - was contractor and dance instructor

Latole

04-13-2012, 11:07 AM

They later met at a Tim Horton's. She become emotional. Said they discussed Tori going missing.

They saw a woman in a white jacket, he said if it was her, I would tackle her. He seemed concerned, had a "big heart" about the situation.

He told her he was sure Tori was fine, and she would be returned safe.

RaffertyLFP: He (Rafferty) seemed to be concerned about Tori "had a big heart" said Chambers

I feel so sorry for this girl.

Kamille

04-13-2012, 11:07 AM

6 degree's of separation...................>

It really is a small town isn't it? I wonder if he hit on TM's POF profile too but she was in a relationship with JG at that point so probably didn't keep up with it.

MOO

Wondergirl

04-13-2012, 11:07 AM

In spring of 2009, Rafferty put statements like "I want out", "Bring Tori home,", "What an ass, now I have no plans for Easter"

RaffertyLFP: Latimer said "Bring Tori Home" stood out - she didn't know who Tori was - Latimer was curious but didn't communicate with Rafferty

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
In spring of 2009, Rafferty put statements like "I want out", "Bring Tori home,", "What an ass, now I have no plans for Easter"

...on his MSN display name. There were others. Only one involved Tori.

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
"Bring Tori Home," was written in bold on his display name. Latimer didn't know who Tori was. Heard she was missing days later.

RaffertyLFP: Latimer found out few days later that Tori was a missing girl in Woodstock

She never asked Rafferty about Tori, or his display name.

BBM: BRING TORI HOME???? :furious: :silenced:

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 11:09 AM

Rafferty is wiping his eyes in the prisoners box.

RaffertyLFP: Chambers said Rafferty knew that she knew Tara McDonald

She last saw Rafferty April 12th, last spoke on the phone May 2nd. He was ask about Tori via text message. "Seemed to be really interested"

No more questions from Gowdey.

RaffertyLFP: Derstine begins cross. He asks Chambers about reaction in Woodstock to Tori's disappearance. Chamber said it was major

crazyladi

04-13-2012, 11:10 AM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
While she was out helping search for #ToriStafford, Chambers says #Rafferty called her and said he was also out looking for the 8-year-old.

:furious:

All I can say is OMG... What a disturbed individual. I am completely disgusted!! What a psychopath. He reminds me of Bernardo. Totally thought that he got away with this and that TLM would take the fall.

I am still questioning why TLM all of the sudden said she killed Tori. All of this makes me believe he helped for sure.

- Miss WS - GF at the time of his arrest. Dated for five to six weeks.

-J. Wood - woman known to MR. She was in her Honda in GLF parking lot day of his arrest. Her car also seized by LE.

-Amanda - MR admitted to LE during taped interview May 15/09, he dated her a few times. MR claimed Amanda was a friend of TM and her daughter a friend to Tori. Note: This could be another Amanda as the one who I think knew TM is the other Amanda below.

-B. Armstrong - ex lover, met at BBeef/work, had girly talks with MR, supplied oxy drugs numerous times to MR including the day Tori was murdered.

-Miss Unknown (Pub ban) - 37, MR met her on POF April 12/09, MR told her about TLM in detention centre being questioned about Tori's abduction.

-S. Hodge - 31, C&Y worker MR met on POF April 14/09, saw each other every day for two and a half weeks. Said he was a dance instructor. She mostly drove them around, MR on phone setting up dance appointments. MR told her he took oxy, he thought he had colon cancer. MR spoke to her about people abducting children raising them as their own. Obsessed with Tori's case listening to news and reading newspaper.

-M. LaBute, MR met her at her workplace Staples March 09, saying he was new in town. She told MR she wasn't interested, described MR as nervous and needy. Spent a lot of time on phone keeping track of his workers claiming to own contracting business.

- Ashley R. - She's 25. In spring of 2009 she lived in London, near Fanshawe College. Met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty asked her to go to a stag and doe with him near the Hamilton area. She accepted. This was in early May.

- S. Latimer is 50 year old real estate agent who lives on farm outside Woodstock Met Rafferty in Jan 2009 on Plenty of Fish.

- M. Wagler met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty's post said he was looking for romance. On Good Friday (April 8th) in 2009, he asked her to go for breakfast in London. She declined.

- A. Chambers is 33 and lives in Woodstock - mother of two (boy and girl). Chambers knew Tori Stafford, at one point her family lived around block and Tori played with her daugher (age 16). Chambers said they started communication near end of March 2009 they went out for coffee, went bowling, he came over to house. Chambers said she first met with Rafferty on April 3 2009. Chambers said she had sex with Rafferty once.
They got along well. Their relationship became sexual, "once", she says. JMO - I think she is the Amanda who he stated to police was friends with TM.

Feeling the need for a spreadsheet and a flowchart. :needdrink::whiteflag:

CarrieBean

04-13-2012, 11:10 AM

:furious:

Gotta go do my dishes and cool off for a few min. Got nothing but curse words to contribute at the moment.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 11:10 AM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Chambers said #Rafferty told her he had a step-son named Jaden who had died
2 wks before they met. She said that pulled on her heartstrings

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Chambers said #Rafferty "seemed to have a big heart about the situation" (Tori's disappearance), said he was sure Tori was okay.

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Chambers said she was upset about Tori's disappearance and #Rafferty tried to calm her by saying he was sure she would be returned safely.

Kamille

04-13-2012, 11:11 AM

BBM: BRING TORI HOME???? :furious: :silenced:

How about the "What an ass, now I have no plans for Easter" comment. WTH was that supposed to mean? TLM was picked up on Easter Sunday.

MOO

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 11:11 AM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
After their last in-person encounter, Chambers says #Rafferty would text her and ask if she had heard any more about #ToriStafford

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
#Rafferty's lawyer asks Amanda Chambers whether someone would have stood out in Woodstock if they weren't talking about Tori. She says yes.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 11:12 AM

RaffertyLFP: Derstine begins cross. He asks Chambers about reaction in Woodstock to Tori's disappearance. Chamber said it was major

Derstine asks if everybody in Woodstock was talking about Tori. She says most were.

"You almost would have stood out if you weren't talking about it?" Derstine asks. She agrees.

crazyladi

04-13-2012, 11:12 AM

RaffertyLFP: Chambers and Rafferty went bowling next day he left abruply he seemed "wierd"

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
He said his car had been broken into soon after, met her at Crabby Joe's in Woodstock (after bowling during the day).

RaffertyLFP: They also met at Crabby Joe's He seemed jealous and weird

She never saw him again. Only communicated with him a few times via text. Called her May 2nd.

He wanted to get together. They never did. Rafferty said he had a stepson who had passed away, named Jaden. It "tugged her heart strings".

RaffertyLFP: Rafferty told her he had a stepson that died - was contractor and dance instructor

Wonder if there is a missing boy somewhere.......hmmmm. Probably lies but I sure as hell would want to know if its a true fact.

Wondergirl

04-13-2012, 11:13 AM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews (https://twitter.com/#%21/AveryFreeFMNews) Chambers said #Rafferty (https://twitter.com/#%21/search/%23Rafferty) told her he had a step-son named Jaden who had died 2 wks before they met. She said that pulled on her heartstrings

Latole

04-13-2012, 11:14 AM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Chambers said #Rafferty told her he had a step-son named Jaden who had died
2 wks before they met. She said that pulled on her heartstrings

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Chambers said #Rafferty "seemed to have a big heart about the situation" (Tori's disappearance), said he was sure Tori was okay.

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Chambers said she was upset about Tori's disappearance and #Rafferty tried to calm her by saying he was sure she would be returned safely.

Now we need a list of OMG moments ... Liar, liar, pants on fire.
1) I have colon cancer
2) My son Jaden died 2 weeks ago

SideKick

04-13-2012, 11:14 AM

This is upsetting, I often ask myself why do I follow this thread?!
My answer is only one name - Tory :-) ♥

daisy.faithfull

04-13-2012, 11:15 AM

They later met at a Tim Horton's. She become emotional. Said they discussed Tori going missing.

They saw a woman in a white jacket, he said if it was her, I would tackle her. He seemed concerned, had a "big heart" about the situation.

He told her he was sure Tori was fine, and she would be returned safe.

RaffertyLFP: He (Rafferty) seemed to be concerned about Tori "had a big heart" said Chambers

do you see how manipulative he is, how skilled he was at fooling people?

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 11:15 AM

Recess. 20 minutes.

SideKick

04-13-2012, 11:17 AM

Now we need a list of OMG moments ... Liar, liar, pants on fire.
1) I have colon cancer
2) My son Jaden died 2 weeks ago

:rocker: and of course following the mood....... :banghead:

Kamille

04-13-2012, 11:17 AM

Wonder if there is a missing boy somewhere.......hmmmm. Probably lies but I sure as hell would want to know if its a true fact.

He's just like CA IMO. Takes something that is somewhat truthful and adapts it to himself in the form of a lie. Like when he said he was working at the juvenile detention centre. So I wonder if there was a deceased child amongst his friends and family somewhere and he adapted it to himself.

MOO

SideKick

04-13-2012, 11:18 AM

do you see how manipulative he is, how skilled he was at fooling people?

Just like CA!! omg.:twocents:

daisy.faithfull

04-13-2012, 11:18 AM

RaffertyLFP: Derstine begins cross. He asks Chambers about reaction in Woodstock to Tori's disappearance. Chamber said it was major

Derstine asks if everybody in Woodstock was talking about Tori. She says most were.

"You almost would have stood out if you weren't talking about it?" Derstine asks. She agrees.

Well yes everyone was talking about it, but he and TLM were the only two people that were lying about their involvement.

Kamille

04-13-2012, 11:19 AM

Feeling the need for a spreadsheet and a flowchart. :needdrink::whiteflag:

:floorlaugh:

But we have to remove the first "Amanda" on that list as she shows up as A Chambers on the bottom.

Wondergirl

04-13-2012, 11:20 AM

This is upsetting, I often ask myself why do I follow this thread?!
My answer is only one name - Tory :-) ♥

Ditto. :(

Thinkzerz

04-13-2012, 11:21 AM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews (https://twitter.com/#%21/AveryFreeFMNews) Chambers said #Rafferty (https://twitter.com/#%21/search/%23Rafferty) told her he had a step-son named Jaden who had died 2 wks before they met. She said that pulled on her heartstrings

I wonder if this is his sons name? Whom is alive. I was told from a friend who knows one of MR's ex's that he does have a son but has nothing to do with him.

But then again MR may have lied to her about having a son as he seems to lie a lot.

Kamille

04-13-2012, 11:21 AM

All I can say is OMG... What a disturbed individual. I am completely disgusted!! What a psychopath. He reminds me of Bernardo. Totally thought that he got away with this and that TLM would take the fall.

I am still questioning why TLM all of the sudden said she killed Tori. All of this makes me believe he helped for sure.

At this time I'm sure he totally thought he'd get away with it and that TLM wouldn't say a damn thing. He was very confident if you ask me.

MOO

crazyladi

04-13-2012, 11:22 AM

I am so angry its not funny. I always knew this douche bag was creepy and manipulative. I have dated losers like this and I wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt but after today???? NO BLOODY WAY. This sick individual needs to be locked up.

I feel so sorry for all of these women that were taken advantage by him and manipulated in believing he was someone he wasnt.

daisy.faithfull

04-13-2012, 11:25 AM

RaffertyLFP: Chambers and Rafferty went bowling next day he left abruply he seemed "wierd"

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
He said his car had been broken into soon after, met her at Crabby Joe's in Woodstock (after bowling during the day).

RaffertyLFP: They also met at Crabby Joe's He seemed jealous and weird

She never saw him again. Only communicated with him a few times via text. Called her May 2nd.

He wanted to get together. They never did. Rafferty said he had a stepson who had passed away, named Jaden. It "tugged her heart strings".

RaffertyLFP: Rafferty told her he had a stepson that died - was contractor and dance instructor

Was MTR married at some point? Don't you have to be married to someone to have a step son?

Kamille

04-13-2012, 11:26 AM

[/B]

Well yes everyone was talking about it, but he and TLM were the only two people that were lying about their involvement.

Not to mention he was going out of his way to talk about it. How many men in Woodstock were sitting around discussing it? And going out of their way to bring it up and being obsessed with it on the news? And why didn't the Crown come back with that? :waitasec:

MOO

Oldsoul2

04-13-2012, 11:26 AM

RaffertyLFP: Derstine begins cross. He asks Chambers about reaction in Woodstock to Tori's disappearance. Chamber said it was major

Derstine asks if everybody in Woodstock was talking about Tori. She says most were.

"You almost would have stood out if you weren't talking about it?" Derstine asks. She agrees.

****Derstine, he was setting up his alibi, why would he emphasis on this point and shed light on the fact that everyone was talking about it and if they didn't it would seem unsual, HE KNEW that already

Wondergirl

04-13-2012, 11:28 AM

Rafferty used a little bit of truth, in the lies that he spun.

Is there a name for that?

daisy.faithfull

04-13-2012, 11:30 AM

Not to mention he was going out of his way to talk about it. How many men in Woodstock were sitting around discussing it? And going out of their way to bring it up and being obsessed with it on the news? And why didn't the Crown come back with that? :waitasec:

MOO

Yup, and making such an elaborate load of bs about his involvement with the search. He was doing it to sound like such a sensitive, caring man, which just makes it sicker.

I have wondered a couple of times why the Crown hasn't pointed stuff like that out.

SideKick

04-13-2012, 11:31 AM

Rafferty used a little bit of truth, in the lies that he spun.

Is there a name for that?

Koolaide?

daisy.faithfull

04-13-2012, 11:32 AM

Rafferty used a little bit of truth, in the lies that he spun.

Is there a name for that?

Anthony-itis.

SFB73

04-13-2012, 11:32 AM

I feel bad for these lady's... Thru no fault of their own they are now associated with this individual. He had diverse tastes in women, from young to old, marching these witness' in likely was calculated by the crown to play to the women on the jury... how many of them today are thinking, WTF if they werent already before..... Im thinking few women would respect men who seem to have multiple ladies on the go. I believe, the line of lies told to these women was just a ploy to get what he was really seeking from these ladies. Relationships are short, because for the most part, people can figure folks out pretty quickly, especially older women, 17 year olds probably a bit more easilly mislead! For example, how many contractors do you know who conduct business from a beat to crap honda civic??? How many dance instructors probably would have no clue who Mikhail Baryshnikov is, if asked! Its easy for people to spot lies and if I was a lady using Plenty of Fish, Id be on a good defensive right from the start...

<modsnip>! lol

fats

04-13-2012, 11:32 AM

I feel terrible for these women who so innocently met MTR and now have been brought into this. I can't imagine how they must be feeling.

I feel a lot of compassion towards these unsuspecting women that MR seemed to be "stalking" and keep wondering if they were all potential victims?

I also feel they are doing their duty to society by testifying and feel that the publication ban on one witness is on tight either. They should not be hiding from doing their duty to testify---it will help many others in the future...:rocker:

loveisthemovement

04-13-2012, 11:32 AM

Just popping in to ask - the day he abruptly left bowling - would that have been the day TLM was arrested?? Would he have heard about it and had to check things out?

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 11:33 AM

Rafferty used a little bit of truth, in the lies that he spun.

Is there a name for that?

Cindy Anthony? Half truths, mistruths?

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 11:33 AM

Anthony-itis.

:floorlaugh: Better than my answer!

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 11:34 AM

Not to mention he was going out of his way to talk about it. How many men in Woodstock were sitting around discussing it? And going out of their way to bring it up and being obsessed with it on the news? And why didn't the Crown come back with that? :waitasec:

MOO

There are a lot of times when I wished the Crown would redirect and ask those types of comeback questions! I don't know why they're not!! :banghead:

Kamille

04-13-2012, 11:35 AM

Rafferty used a little bit of truth, in the lies that he spun.

Is there a name for that?

Sociopath? Caseyanthonyitis? :waitasec:

Oldsoul2

04-13-2012, 11:35 AM

Yup, and making such an elaborate load of bs about his involvement with the search. He was doing it to sound like such a sensitive, caring man, which just makes it sicker.

I have wondered a couple of times why the Crown hasn't pointed stuff like that out.

The Crown is doing just that by bringing in women after women to testify how they were duped by a man that is a compulsive liar. Guess they will wait to show the jury proof that everything he said was a lie but its pretty apparent at this point the jury already knows he was there while they listen to this hog wash he fed these girls. I'm sure the picture is pretty clear to them at this point.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 11:37 AM

I feel bad for these lady's... Thru no fault of their own they are now associated with this individual. He had diverse tastes in women, from young to old, marching these witness' in likely was calculated by the crown to play to the women on the jury... how many of them today are thinking, WTF if they werent already before..... Im thinking few women would respect men who seem to have multiple ladies on the go.

If you look hard on google, based on the information provided, many have photos online, for the nosey folks! lol

Makes me wonder if he just wasn't able to get it on with any of them and reverted to young girls (Tori). Even Tori wasn't young enough for him according to TLM. So, did he already experience a girl Tori's age? Questions to ponder as disgusting as it is.

fats

04-13-2012, 11:38 AM

If they can prove that Rafferty was really familiar with the area or "partied" there in the past, they can make a connection to the fact that he looked for a familiar succluded area to do the deed.:detective::dervish::moo:

That connection could be made. Also his actions speak louder than words. TLM was up in the helicopter trying to locate the area of the crime. He was the driver of the car and knew full well how to get there and find Tori's remains.

(https://twitter.com/#%21/MarkCarc1010)
4 women have testified at #Rafferty (https://twitter.com/#%21/search/%23Rafferty) trial so far about txt, IM and in-person conversations they had with accused after meeting him online.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 11:42 AM

RaffertyLFP: Court is resuming [via Twitter]

daisy.faithfull

04-13-2012, 11:42 AM

The Crown is doing just that by bringing in women after women to testify how they were duped by a man that is a compulsive liar. Guess they will wait to show the jury proof that everything he said was a lie but its pretty apparent at this point the jury already knows he was there while they listen to this hog wash he fed these girls. I'm sure the picture is pretty clear to them at this point.

I guess, but there's really are times when I really wish that they had not let the defence have the last word.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 11:42 AM

The jury is returning.

Next witness is a 28 year old woman from Woodstock.

RaffertyLFP: The next witness is a 28 year old woman who met Michael Rafferty online thru Plenty of Fish at the end of March 2009

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
She met Rafferty through Plenty of Fish. They eventually met for coffee. Near the end of March, 2009.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 11:44 AM

RaffertyLFP: The next witness is a 28 year old woman who met Michael Rafferty online thru Plenty of Fish at the end of March 2009 [via Twitter]

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 11:45 AM

RaffertyLFP: The woman texted frequently and they met for coffee on a Friday near end of April, Rafferty claimed he was teaching dance class

They exchanged cell phone numbers. Communicated by text message.

RaffertyLFP: The woman said there was little info on Rafferty's Plenty of Fish post - said he "wasn't into games" that caught her interest

Oldsoul2

04-13-2012, 11:45 AM

The jury is returning.

Next witness is a 28 year old woman from Woodstock.

RaffertyLFP: The next witness is a 28 year old woman who met Michael Rafferty online thru Plenty of Fish at the end of March 2009

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
She met Rafferty through Plenty of Fish. They eventually met for coffee. Near the end of March, 2009.

-B. Armstrong - ex lover, met at BBeef/work, had girly talks with MR, supplied oxy drugs numerous times to MR including the day Tori was murdered.

April 12, 2009 to Unknown Date -Miss Unknown (Pub ban) - 37, MR met her on POF April 12/09, MR told her about TLM in detention centre being questioned about Tori's abduction.

April 14, 2009 to End of April (???) -S. Hodge - 31, C&Y worker MR met on POF April 14/09, saw each other every day for two and a half weeks. Said he was a dance instructor. She mostly drove them around, MR on phone setting up dance appointments. MR told her he took oxy, he thought he had colon cancer. MR spoke to her about people abducting children raising them as their own. Obsessed with Tori's case listening to news and reading newspaper.

March 2009 to Unknown Date -M. LaBute, MR met her at her workplace Staples March 09, saying he was new in town. She told MR she wasn't interested, described MR as nervous and needy. Spent a lot of time on phone keeping track of his workers claiming to own contracting business.

Spring 2009 - Early May 2009 - Ashley R. - She's 25. In spring of 2009 she lived in London, near Fanshawe College. Met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty asked her to go to a stag and doe with him near the Hamilton area. She accepted. This was in early May.

January 2009 to Unknown Date - S. Latimer is 50 year old real estate agent who lives on farm outside Woodstock Met Rafferty in Jan 2009 on Plenty of Fish.

Spring 2009 - M. Wagler met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty's post said he was looking for romance. On Good Friday (April 8th) in 2009, he asked her to go for breakfast in London. She declined.

March 2009 to Unknown Date - Amanda Chambers is 33 and lives in Woodstock - mother of two (boy and girl). Chambers knew Tori Stafford, at one point her family lived around block and Tori played with her daugher (age 16). Chambers said they started communication near end of March 2009 they went out for coffee, went bowling, he came over to house. Chambers said she first met with Rafferty on April 3 2009. Chambers said she had sex with Rafferty once. They got along well. Their relationship became sexual, "once", she says. JMO - I think she is the Amanda who he stated to police was friends with TM. Here is another OMG moment ... Chambers said #Rafferty told her he had a step-son named Jaden who had died 2 wks before they met. She said that pulled on her heartstrings.

Late March 2009 to Unknown Date - No name (#2) - The next witness is a 28 year old woman who met Michael Rafferty online thru Plenty of Fish (as Mychol) at the end of March 2009. The woman texted frequently and they met for coffee on a Friday near end of April, Rafferty claimed he was teaching dance class in Kitchener. They exchanged cell phone numbers. Communicated by text message. The woman said there was little info on Rafferty's Plenty of Fish post - said he "wasn't into games" that caught her interest. Rafferty told her he was a contractor and dance teacher and wanted to travel. The woman said Rafferty showed up at her workplace at one point. She was asked to go to the Stag and Doe, but said no, as she wasn't feeling well. Said it seemed weird to ask her. He seemed upset. She worked at Staples. He came into the store to say hi, brought a coffee. He asked why she wasn't more excited to see him. She was busy.

April 12, 2009 to Unknown Date - Cooney - age 29, and lived in Kitchener in 2009. She also met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Cooney said Rafferty told her he was a contractor and ballroom dance teacher. She talked to him by phone first on April 12th. Cooney said Rafferty told her he was involved in search for Tori and was concerned. Said he was driving a woman to police for questioning. Rafferty discussed his family, said he didn't get along with his brother. She spent two hours with Rafferty, said she "wanted the date to be over". Had different views and values. He asked for 2nd date She declined.

2005 to December 2007 - Rachel Diwell - Diwell was 17 in 2005 and lived with her boyfriend when she first met Rafferty. Says they became inseparable. Friendship blossomed to more. Diwell said Rafferty lived in Guelph, has worked in landscaping, meat processing plant - aspired to be dance instructor but was unemployed. He showed her where he grew up. A farm house outside of Kitchener. They "drove around a lot". They would sometimes get out of the car and "become intimate." He drove. She only had a G1. Rafferty always seemed to know where he was going in the Guelph/Fergus area, she says. They took backroads. Rafferty washed his car regularly. She would help. They went to self serve car washes in Guelph, Kitchener and Cambridge. Rafferty told her he had back problems. They picked up percocets regularly. Diwell said she stopped seeing Rafferty around Dec. 2007.

Diwell met #Rafferty (https://twitter.com/#%21/search/%23Rafferty) in 2005 through and ex-boyfriend. Says they became inseparable. Friendship blossomed to more.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 12:11 PM

RaffertyLFP: Diwell said Rafferty lived in Guelph, has worked in landscaping, meat processing plant - aspired to be dance instructor but was unemployed [via Twitter]

CarrieBean

04-13-2012, 12:11 PM

insanity defence?:twocents:

I've gotten behind a bit here but...not a chance of that happening.

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 12:12 PM

I believe the audio interview was may 15 and he was arrested may 19.

Correct.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 12:13 PM

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
Next witness is Rachel Diwell.

She lived in Guelph in 2009. She was raised in Ayr.

She met Rafferty in late 2005. She was 17. She lived downtown above a bar. Lived with her boyfriend.

They became intimate eventually

Rafferty lived in Guelph at the time. He told her he wanted to be a dance instructor.

AM980.ca ‏ @AM980_Court
He showed her where he grew up. A farm house outside of Kitchener

They "drove around a lot". They would sometimes get out of e car and "become intimate." He drove. She only had a G1.

Diwell said Rafferty lived in Guelph, has worked in landscaping, meat processing plant - aspired to be dance instructor but was unemployed

RaffertyLFP: Rafferty told her grew up in farm property near Kitchener. They drove around in his Honda Civic

RaffertyLFP: Diwell said the interior of Rafferty's car was always clean. They drove down a lot of backroads near Fergus, Cambridge for something to do

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 12:13 PM

RaffertyLFP: Rafferty told her grew up in farm property near Kitchener. They drove around in his Honda Civic [via Twitter]

RaffertyLFP: Diwell said the interior of Rafferty's car was always clean. They drove down a lot of backroads near Fergus, Cambridge for something to do [via Twitter]

Wondergirl

04-13-2012, 12:13 PM

Hot Shower, anyone?

http://blackboxstrength.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/show4.jpg

fats

04-13-2012, 12:13 PM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews (https://twitter.com/#%21/AveryFreeFMNews) Chambers said #Rafferty (https://twitter.com/#%21/search/%23Rafferty) told her he had a step-son named Jaden who had died 2 wks before they met. She said that pulled on her heartstrings

SP told amber Frey that his wife died and I guess both of them used that "gain-sympathy-strategy" on their...I going to call them "victims" because they are not "girlfriends" He was deceptive with each of them. I think the time he got lost going to Cora's was a change of plans on his part---I think all these women are past potential victims. He was on the hunt...and his behavior was escalating.....good he is off the street now--let's keep it that way!!!!!!!

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 12:14 PM

She says Rafferty's car was very clean.

Rafferty always seemed to know where he was going in the Guelph/Fergus area, she says. They took backroads.

Rafferty told her he had back problems. They picked up percocets regularly.

RaffertyLFP: Rafferty said he had back problems and would often by Percocets

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 12:15 PM

RaffertyLFP: Travelled a lot of backroads in Rafferty's car "He always seemed to know where he was going" said Diwell [via Twitter]

- Miss WS - GF at the time of his arrest. Dated for five to six weeks.

-J. Wood - woman known to MR. She was in her Honda in GLF parking lot day of his arrest. Her car also seized by LE.

-Amanda - MR admitted to LE during taped interview May 15/09, he dated her a few times. MR claimed Amanda was a friend of TM and her daughter a friend to Tori. Note: This could be another Amanda as the one who I think knew TM is the other Amanda below.

-B. Armstrong - ex lover, met at BBeef/work, had girly talks with MR, supplied oxy drugs numerous times to MR including the day Tori was murdered.

-Miss Unknown (Pub ban) - 37, MR met her on POF April 12/09, MR told her about TLM in detention centre being questioned about Tori's abduction.

-S. Hodge - 31, C&Y worker MR met on POF April 14/09, saw each other every day for two and a half weeks. Said he was a dance instructor. She mostly drove them around, MR on phone setting up dance appointments. MR told her he took oxy, he thought he had colon cancer. MR spoke to her about people abducting children raising them as their own. Obsessed with Tori's case listening to news and reading newspaper.

-M. LaBute, MR met her at her workplace Staples March 09, saying he was new in town. She told MR she wasn't interested, described MR as nervous and needy. Spent a lot of time on phone keeping track of his workers claiming to own contracting business.

- Ashley R. - She's 25. In spring of 2009 she lived in London, near Fanshawe College. Met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty asked her to go to a stag and doe with him near the Hamilton area. She accepted. This was in early May.

- S. Latimer is 50 year old real estate agent who lives on farm outside Woodstock Met Rafferty in Jan 2009 on Plenty of Fish.

- M. Wagler met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Rafferty's post said he was looking for romance. On Good Friday (April 8th) in 2009, he asked her to go for breakfast in London. She declined.

- A. Chambers is 33 and lives in Woodstock - mother of two (boy and girl). Chambers knew Tori Stafford, at one point her family lived around block and Tori played with her daugher (age 16). Chambers said they started communication near end of March 2009 they went out for coffee, went bowling, he came over to house. Chambers said she first met with Rafferty on April 3 2009. Chambers said she had sex with Rafferty once.
They got along well. Their relationship became sexual, "once", she says. JMO - I think she is the Amanda who he stated to police was friends with TM. Here is another OMG moment ... Chambers said #Rafferty told her he had a step-son named Jaden who had died 2 wks before they met. She said that pulled on her heartstrings.

- No name (#2) - The next witness is a 28 year old woman who met Michael Rafferty online thru Plenty of Fish (as Mychol) at the end of March 2009. The woman texted frequently and they met for coffee on a Friday near end of April, Rafferty claimed he was teaching dance class in Kitchener. They exchanged cell phone numbers. Communicated by text message. The woman said there was little info on Rafferty's Plenty of Fish post - said he "wasn't into games" that caught her interest. Rafferty told her he was a contractor and dance teacher and wanted to travel. The woman said Rafferty showed up at her workplace at one point. She was asked to go to the Stag and Doe, but said no, as she wasn't feeling well. Said it seemed weird to ask her. He seemed upset. She worked at Staples. He came into the store to say hi, brought a coffee. He asked why she wasn't more excited to see him. She was busy.

- Cooney - age 29, and lived in Kitchener in 2009. She also met Rafferty on Plenty of Fish. Cooney said Rafferty told her he was a contractor and ballroom dance teacher. She talked to him by phone first on April 12th.

- R. Diwell - Diwell was 17 in 2005 and lived with her boyfriend when she first met Rafferty. Says they became inseparable. Friendship blossomed to more.

And the list of his lies grows longer and longer and longer......

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 12:15 PM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Diwell says she & #Rafferty drove around back roads near Fergus, Kitchener, Cambridge, Guelph. Says he always knew where they were going.

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 12:15 PM

Diwell says she & #Rafferty drove around back roads near Fergus, Kitchener, Cambridge, Guelph. Says he always knew where they were going.

RaffertyLFP: Travelled a lot of backroads in Rafferty's car "He always seemed to know where he was going" said Diwell

Rafferty washed his car regularly. She would help.

They went to self serve car washes in Guelph, Kitchener and Cambridge.

CarrieBean

04-13-2012, 12:16 PM

Updated GF List ...

Just bringing forward the GF list created by Swedie with the latest additions ... Poor Girls.

snipped for space. Won't be long before this one post takes up a whole page, I think.

I am not trying to defend MR but having "Bring Tori Home" on MSN and being obsessed with the case along with having Tori's missing persons flyer. Isn't much evidence IMO. I had flyers of Tori in my home ( As i place them around my hometown) And i am sure to say obsessed with this case...most people were and still are such as us on this forum. If we weren't obsessed we wouldn't be wanting to hear all details in the court room.

However MR was involved so maybe the crown is going to use this in some way.

the thing is 'he' was the only person able to bring Tori home after all is said... TLM couldn't find the location MR chose that spot. it's quit disgusting to me and it strengthens his guilt in hiding his involvment imo he really thought he'd get away with it

There was also a landfill near Riverston. It's close to side road 5/highway 6. Just south of Mount Forest, not far from the scene.

RaffertyLFP: Cruikshank was interviewed by Stafford investigators - gave them documents re sites that Rafferty worked

Cruickshank says police eventually contracted him about the Tori investigation. They asked for documents about Rafferty's employment.

Thinkzerz

04-13-2012, 12:38 PM

RaffertyLFP: One landfill is just south of Mount Forest

There was also a landfill near Riverston. It's close to side road 5/highway 6. Just south of Mount Forest, not far from the scene.[/QUOTE]

This Land field is about a 10 minute drive to Mount Forest from there.

Ardy

04-13-2012, 12:38 PM

I guess, but there's really are times when I really wish that they had not let the defence have the last word.

A very astute observation, about a situation that has prevailed throughout the trial. Derstine doesn't say much.......but has asked one or two questions which has negated a lot of Crown witness testimony.

The final words of the pathology and DNA experts are examples, where the jury is left with "there is no evidence that proves........" in their minds.

I am wondering why the Crown doesn't redirect.......but maybe because the defense could ask more questions and it would turn into a merry go round of questions.

There was also a landfill near Riverston. It's close to side road 5/highway 6. Just south of Mount Forest, not far from the scene.

RaffertyLFP: Cruikshank was interviewed by Stafford investigators - gave them documents re sites that Rafferty worked

Cruickshank says police eventually contracted him about the Tori investigation. They asked for documents about Rafferty's employment.

:jail:

Sailor Bug

04-13-2012, 12:39 PM

Showing a document from April 2006. Rafferty was on a work plan. He worked at the Riverstown facility.

RaffertyLFP: Cruickshank identifies worksheet from April 2006 with work crew identifying Rafferty- includes Riverstown landfill near Mount Forest

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 12:40 PM

Avery Moore ‏ @AveryFreeFMNews
Cruickshank is shown a map of Wellington County with marks signifying his company's work sites. 1 is just down the road from Mount Forest.

bbm

~n/t~

04-13-2012, 12:42 PM

A very astute observation, about a situation that has prevailed throughout the trial. Derstine doesn't say much.......but has asked one or two questions which has negated a lot of Crown witness testimony.

The final words of the pathology and DNA experts are examples, where the jury is left with "there is no evidence that proves........" in their minds.

I am wondering why the Crown doesn't redirect.......but maybe because the defense could ask more questions and it would turn into a merry go round of questions.

I hope when you state "negated a lot of Crown witness testimony", is your opinion.

Our mods added this cute icon for us. :moo: It stands for My Opinion Only. It should be used when you're stating an opinion versus fact backed up by a link.