Ask: Death of Free To Play? (Ep. 7)

On this episode of Ask MMOBomb, Magicman replies to viewer question about the neverending war between consoles and PCs, if free-to-play will die out, and throws in a few video creation questions for good measure. Make sure to submit YOUR questions for next week’s show!

Ask MMOBomb is an MMOBomb.com weekly exclusive where we answer questions from our viewers. While questions should be Free to Play games related, they don’t always HAVE to be if you question is something we think viewers REALLY want to know. So feel free to ask anything you want! Questions are chosen from YouTube, Facebook and our website comments on the previous episodes, and emails sent to [email protected] Get those questions ready and let’s have some fun!

40 Readers Commented

Magicman, you made a great point about how the likelihood of reaching max level is far higher if one subscribes to a game. There are a couple of other factors as well:

1. The number of the max level itself.
2. The amount of time (grind) necessary to reach that level.

One example of a F2P MMO that satisfies both criteria for a high chance of level maximization is DCUO. Its max level is 30. It’s possible to reach it in one weekend if a player really wanted to do so and without much deviation from simply playing through the main/story quests.

If anyone would like to lose their “max level” virginity easily, this would be the game.

Unfortunately, I won’t be able to help anyone with this since I stopped playing due to my disagreement with some of its game design decisions. I was also playing it on the PS3.

I am just wondering if ya’ll have ever thought of covering B2P games and why or why not? Now with the success of GW2 and The Secret World changing to a B2P model I think we are going to see more games going in the direction. Though not 100% F2P in many respects the B2P model is cheaper then some so called F2P models. I also think that the B2P model overall makes more sense for the large triple a MMOs then the F2P model as they get the initial launch day surge in revenue that the investors are looking for while the player gets a great game that they can enjoy for the life of the game.

Catching up to some news in the mmorpg industry I’ve noticed something that could be the initial stages of a consolidating trend: titles launching as p2p and going f2p in a relatively short span.
Nothing new here, really; but I began to ‘ruminate’ on such life challenging musings and started to think of what ifs.
How would you receive one marketing “ploy” from a company/publisher that would very transparently offer 6 months of early access to their new game?

I’m thinking on the news about The Secret World (and their new strange ARG-like video log), Age of Wushu (and it’s early access beta), and even SWTOR and some speculations about TERA – we can throw Blade and Soul here as well, since no one really know how they’ll port it over for the western audience.

The catch of this ploy here is that they would be very frank and straight forward: 60 bucks (10 usd / month) for 6 months early access on the servers – maybe adding a few trinkets, cosmetic, for good measure.

I myself would welcome such a tactic – emphasizing the publisher’s honesty and transparency as good measures. But opinions are very diverse and here’s my question: how do you think about it? Is it a wolf in sheep’s clothing money grab? Would you sympathize with it or hate such idea?

Don’t think in terms of game characteristics, for instance, a steep xp curve or other things that could prove very relevant for such analysis. Just the main idea. On a review would you bash it and be vocal against it or would you show sympathy?

You know there should be a special name for us people that like to jump or bounce from one mmo to another. I found something totally obvious, we can be called MMOBombers, we fly around bombing mmos and then fly over to the next target mmo. Lets “FlyBomb” the next mmo guys!.

I managed level cap in WoW during Wrath of the Lich King and Cataclysm, but I stopped playing about 2/3 of the way through Cata, and haven’t gone back. I also have two capped toons in SWTOR, but I don’t play it anymore, and refuse to touch it until they fix their free to play model.

As far as free to play goes, I’ve reached summoner level 30 in LoL, but I’ve barely even leveled in most other titles. In BLR, I’m level 27, and I’ve put 53 hours into it since it launched on Steam, and I don’t know how many before. They’ll probably raise the level cap again before I hit the current one.

Hey Magic Man! I had a very important question on the thread of your last video. I really hope you answer my question on your next video. Why in any first look video is social panel & chat restrictions not talk about? If you want to cover a good aspect of any game that is the first thing that i look at when gaming online. MAKING FRIENDS!

I think F2P model is one of the best models ever because i got so tired of buying a game for $50-$60 and the game being crap and now with F2P i can play the full game completely for free and then if i like it and i play it a lot then i put money into it.A win win situation

Love the show i watch all the time, the only F2P game i have ever got max level on is DDO have 2 TR’s its not the best looking game but i love it to death lol, have had max lvl on EQOA and GW2 but have played MANY others n stoped in mid 20′s.

At one time I had a couple chars in Vindictus capped but it has been raised a couple times since then. I currently have 2 chars capped in Forsaken World but I don’t play it much anymore. Had a char capped in Grand Chase but the recent update raised the cap. As for F2P going away I don’t think its going anywhere but I do feel the mmo “riff-raff” will start to disappear.

My problem with the lvl cap on MMO’s isn’t the game, is the classes that are inside the game
I can’t stay with one very long, i just fell to play other and then other and then other. I play Gw2 now and the highest character i have is an elementalist lvl 50, and it isn’t even hard to lvl up in that game. Now I play warrior but i’m already feeling to play thief, then I might get back to the elementalist but not for long and on and on…. This is why from F2P games the game I played most was EE, since I could just switch classes so easyly, yet I haven’t hit lvl cap here but I was close.

Firstly, consoles will never take over pc gaming and vice versa. People will always be more willing to buy a ps3 for $499, than to pay $2k+ for comp to play the same game. Plus, the whole niche thing, console gamers tend to stay true to their system even though there is some crossover.

F2Play will never die, Magic hit it on the head. It makes money! PERIOD. Not just from the games, but sites like this. The advertising makes a ton of money, and rightly it should. We all love this site and god forbid if it went away! *enters fetal position*

Have I ever gotten to max level on a free2play game: Yes, but not often. This goes back to the whole gamer ADD thing. (I’ll take credit for bringing that up again! LOL) I tend to switch games before I have a chance to get high level.

My Question: Do you think a truly “sandbox” mmo (such as Wyrm Online etc.) will ever gain massive popularity amongst gamers? It seems that everyone wants a great one, but they just never seem to have big fan bases.

I had taken a little break from contributing with posts and such. Work has been killing me lately, but I promise I have been tuning in. It’s good to be back and involved.

I agree concerning console vs pc gaming: one will never take over the other.

I find that in my gaming lifetime, I’ve been switching back and forth between them. I started with console, switched to PC, switched to console, switched to PC again (gaming laptop this time). Then my laptop eventually could not play the newest games anymore and I didn’t have any other reason to upgrade, so I switched back to console and stuck with that for many years. Eventually, even surfing on da interwebz became too tedious for it anymore, so I got a new game-worthy laptop, and now I’m back to PC gaming again. I haven’t played on my PS3 for months and finally understood all the hype about Steam.

Why do some people stick with consoles or PCs exclusively? Why are there great “sandbox” MMOs that just don’t gain big enough fan bases? (rhetorical questions as a way of introducing my next paragraph)

There are many reasons that can be used answer both questions. My take on it is the idea of “comfort zone”. If people are comfortable in playing in one way, they don’t feel like changing the way they play to try something new.

For console gamers, they’re used to playing with a gamepad/arcade stick (wii-mote too, but hardcore gamers will disagree). They also like the simplicity of popping in a disc (or selecting a game already downloaded into the console) without having to deal with hardware (graphic card) compatibility issues. I got sick of dealing with those issues myself so I can sympathize, but I’m happy to see that those issues are not occurring as commonly as they used to… or maybe I just haven’t tried enough modern games yet on my new laptop.

For PC gamers, they’re used to the keyboard + mouse set of controls. They will never give up the accuracy of the mouse (personally, I use a trackball). Some of the PC gaming crowd also enjoy the flexibility of upgrading to the next greatest video card every year if they have the cash for it. As Magicman already mentioned, this can easily be more expensive than buying a console.

The “comfort zone” idea also applies to the question about why most people have not been friendly towards sandbox MMOs. Somewhere in the history of MMOs, the “holy trinity” class-structure was established and now people automatically expect it when they’re thinking of MMOs. Anything extremely different from that structure will become too difficult for them to wrap their head around. If you give them a sandbox MMO and tell them they can do whatever they want, they’ll just come back asking you “What do I do?” *slaps forehead* That’s the point, you’re not told what to do so that you can do what you want to do! At this point, they’re probably severely confused and give you a blank look as if staring into emptiness, or thinking you’re crazy for suggesting a game that has no set goal because it would be pointless. *slaps forehead again*

The gaming spectrum is quite vast.

On one end of this spectrum, there are games that are so structured that you have nearly no freedom as to what you can do. These tend to be traditional offline games where you go from one level to the next, playing the game exactly how it wants you to play. Most players don’t even think about it and believe they have a lot of freedom on how to play, but that’s only an illusion because for the entire game, all that they do is go through the level, beat the boss, and repeat for the next level. If that were an MMO, people would probably call it “grindy”. Another way of describing this type of game is “linear”.

On the other end, there are games that most people don’t even consider games. These are mostly called virtual worlds (like Second Life). There are no set levels to beat. Heck, there may not even be anything to beat. There’s no particular goal to “beat” the game. Why would anyone play this? Doesn’t that mean it’s a pointless game, therefore, it’s not a game at all? The main idea of this type of “game” is that you decide what’s fun for you and you do what you consider fun. It won’t tell you what to do because it doesn’t know what to tell you: everyone’s idea of fun is not exactly the same. The idea is to have fun, not to “beat” the game. This is the ultimate form of “non-linear” gameplay.

Most MMOs are somewhere in the middle of this spectrum. The theme park “holy trinity” MMOs are closer to the first end of the spectrum because you know exactly what you should be doing for your role and deviating from playing that role as its intended would yield weaker results. Sandbox MMOs are closer to the other end of the spectrum because they tend to use a skill-based system where you pick and improve the skills you want so that you’re not limited to a specific set of skills in a class system. The enjoyment comes from having the freedom to play a character the way you want. There won’t be anyone to tell you “You’re a tank, so tank!” because you’re not a tank (although you can be if you want to be). You do what you want and no one can tell you otherwise.

The problem with sandbox MMOs is that since it can’t tell you what to do, it won’t be as effective at guiding you (if it guides you at all) in how to play. This means there’s a high learning curve for those who don’t know what they want to do. Using the idea of “sandbox” (which is why it’s called that), it’s like throwing a boy into the sandbox without telling him what you want him to do. If the boy doesn’t already know what he wants to do, he’ll just be lost. Throw another boy who knows what he wants to do and he’ll have the greatest time of his life, whether it is building a sandcastle or simply throwing the sand around (or at you). There’s no right or wrong way of playing. The player does what he/she wants just to have fun.

Personally, I would love to play a truly sandbox MMO. A truly fun game provides the player with options. Lots and lots of options. So much so that it simulates complete freedom. I would like to see an MMO that I keep going back to because it’s fun, not because of a daily activity, or to play an instance over and over again (even though it’s not that fun) just so I can earn enough “points” for the next awesome set of gear so that I can survive the next tier of instance and repeat that same process again. Sounds familiar? That’s because it’s closer to the “linear” end of the spectrum. Granted, it’s possible to still have fun with a linear game, but it’s definitely not a game that you will keep playing over and over for many months/years consecutively, which is what MMOs expect.

Anyway, back on topic… the “comfort zone” for most people is “linear” gameplay. It may be due to the fact that most of the popular games, especially before MMOs were created, were linear. Don’t be fooled by the marketing terms “non-linear” or “your actions have consequences”; they’re still linear games, it’s just that they have multiple “lines” intersecting each other to create the illusion of freedom.

Linear games are also easier to create, “balance”, and tweak in some other ways, hence there are more linear games out there and developers have more experience making a linear game “good”. Specifically for MMORPGs, linear USUALLY means “holy trinity” (some exceptions), which is easier for the developers to balance than a classless system where players can figure out creative combinations of skills to become overpowered. Linear/class-based (holy trinity) is easier for the players to understand and easier for the developers to control. WIN/WIN for most people, right? Yes, most, but not for people who enjoy fun in freedom or for people who want something new/different.

I’m really just wondering if there will ever be an MMORPG that keeps you playing day after day based solely on “fun” and not just because you’re trying to earn something by doing certain activities over and over (even though they’re not that fun)… an MMO that you would play daily, not because of dailies, weeklies, monthlies. Play daily, not dailies! (I don’t play WoW, but I heard about those dailies. Yuck!)

I don’t know much about MMOFPS’s (or FPS’s in general) and MOBAs, but it seems a lot of people are playing those over and over again because they’re having fun. I’ve been thinking of giving LoL a try, even if it’s just to play against bots at first just so I don’t get destroyed so soon, meaning I will be later. LOL (pun intended).

Maybe someone here who has more experience with these other genres can elaborate on the differences in fun between all these genres.

Hello everyone,
I´m a “bouncing games man” too but i believe that is for that i dont feel the “fun” part of the game in early levels (Or the cash shop is a pain) so i jump game to game (In the f2p MMORPG worl, in Legue of legends I been playing for 2 years) My question is how do I know if a f2p mmorpg game is worthy to achive final levels (not necesary lvl cap) without expending weeks playing or watching youtube videos? (It dont work the videos for me) I know that is a silly question but i belive that someone has a “key” answer. I cant play p2p, the dollar is too expensive for me (I’ll explain later).
By the way, I miss the cartoony guy from the first videos of “Free To Play Weekly”, it will be great to give him some sort of “funeral”. And great show and Saludos desde Argentina! (Greeting from Argentina!)

If a game is unfun at lower levels then it obviously isn’t worth your time. Plain and simple. Developers should not expect you to tolerate countless hours of BS just to get a little enjoyment out of their game.

F2P will never die, but maybe in the future companies will learn from their mistakes and do F2P models right way not like SWTOR. Consoles and PC will fight each other till the end of the world or when the ultimate gaming rig that completely unites them into one will come. And im to lazy to reach level cap in any serious mmo, i tend to jump from one to another that way never reaching the end.

well magicman , i been around mmobomb a long time now , and my question is ….. why this year theres not a single f2p good game relased at december ,…. by this time last year i would be playing 2 o 3 games at the time , so far the only good games ive heard of are hawken ,firefall, and wizardy , and theres no open beta relase date yet .

You’re right, the release schedule seems a bit open this December. Granted a few titles are pushing into Open Beta (which might as well be a launch in the F2P world anymore) but this might be worth exploring next episode….
-Magicman

Magicman u make a good point as far as it goes for why u didn’t release the “how to mmobomb show”but i have to add something.PEOPLE ARE LAZY MAN(i add caps in purpose)noone will seriously google something they interested in if there is a VIDEO on youtube(or anywhere else)that explains u how to do the thing u tryin to find out.People prefer to listen to someone explainin that thing to them then reading a guide and i will make an example for that.I personally have watched harry potter or the hunger games movies.I personally didn’t read the books although i was going too because there are movie aka it was easier/faster/better for me to watch the movies than spend idk how much time in reading all the books.So my point is don’t think about if u gotta launch it or not just launch it and see what happens.u meantioned on ur f2p cast episode 40(with Brim)that u never expected people to be so interested in the f2p cast right?then again here we are celebrating 1 year of it :P(i think u got my point lol)

Max level means you love the game for sure.Even though there are so many choice’s out there In the end if you love it you play it retail or f2p. Reviewers are a special case since they play em all we should keep looking to them to avoid the junk. Great episode Magic man!.

i have never had a max lvl mmo character i got that gamer add bad, i mean its not just games i jump around each game i end up have like 5+ characters of different classes and races experimenting with them.

dont feel bad..ive been mmo gaming since daoc and have never maxed a toon..close but never complete..i even have a zerk on eq2 thats only lvl 30 and thats my main(but thats from playing for free and locking exp to get ap ;0)