Turning Point (Warriors 105, Dallas 101 — OT)

You could pick from among so many of them, couldn’t you? No point in trying to count all the crucial moments in this swinging back-and-forth game — a game in which neither team had a moment of separation. Check out the quarter scores if you were too breathless or exhilarated to give a damn about doing that before. And what gut-check and coming-of-age individual performances. So shouldn’t the title read “Turning points,” plural, if there were so many?

Or was the game as a whole one (singular) “turning point” in its own right — even as a game so early in the season?

6-5…OR…5-6. The numbers look innocuous.

No big deal?

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But what if we consider this…

What might have been

Harrison Barnes has just made a big-time spin move into the lane and then risen to create breathtaking separation for a clean, point-blank 10 ft jumper with 22 seconds left that would’ve given his team the lead. The jumper falls short. Heroic W’s hands bat the rebound around. The ball bounds high above the lane, and then, if it’s possible, Barnes climbs even higher than before, snatches the ball out of middair, and makes it his own again. Wisely, he immediately pitches it to the safety of an open teammate on the perimeter…

OH SH–, that’s not possible. Thompson didn’t just do that (again?).

Dallas time-out. The W’s are instantly no longer taking the last shot in regulation for a road win. Now they’ll be scrambling madly on defense to try to avert — or at least postpone — another bone-numbing, error-caused loss.

15 seconds left now. And inexplicably, even though OJ Mayo has been lighting up the W’s down the stretch, and even though Mark Jackson hasn’t made one adjustment against Mayo, continuing to leave Thompson naked defensively against him, Rick Carlisle puts the ball in Vince Carter’s hands for the last shot. Did Carlisle think, no, this time, during this timeout, Mike Malone will insist on some defensive adjustment? Did he think, of course, they’ll expect and key on Mayo — I’m going to attack the rookie with Carter instead?

But the rookie defends Carter beautifully in isolation. He cuts off the driving lane and rises (yes, memorize that verb with Barnes — rises) and contests Carter into a pull-up jumpshot miss.

But think about it.

What if Carlisle had put the ball back into Mayo’s hands again (still defended by the same guy Mayo had already established such rhythm against — the same desperate guy who 7 game seconds earlier had just quick-shot away his team’s own chance at a last second win)? It wouldn’t have taken much, would it? A nudge foul. A desperate reach. Another made Mayo jumper. Penetration and dish for someone else’s game-winning shot.

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What would the pit of your stomach have felt like then? What would Thompson have looked like walking down the exit corridor this time? What would the moment have meant for Jackson?

6-5…OR…5-6. The bald numbers might look innocuous. But the feeling wouldn’t have been. You’d have been hurling execrations — not bathing in the warm hope you feel now.

Curry

Curry didn’t just rewrite a few lines of the role he had played against the Thunder. He rewrote and reinvented the whole damn lead character. I know it was against a motivated Westbrook the night before — but still in 24 hours (and on a back-to-back) Curry went from his worst defensive effort of the year to his best. How many plucky, determined plays did he make, often in sequence, at both ends of the floor?

The moment of the ankle turn freaked me out. Had I a shepherd’s crook long enough, I’d have pulled Curry off center stage right there and then. But instead he became even better, even tougher, more resolute, steely. He put the team on his back for stretches (which is not to say there weren’t other steely contributions). But Curry led them. He was the straw that stirred the drink.

And the basketball wonk in me wants to cite (again) Curry’s acute perceptiveness:

“I think…coming off pick-and-rolls in the past couple games, [I was] just coming off a little soft. [Tonight I was] just trying to get in the paint, get to the basket, make plays, and force the defense to make a read…and [then] we executed on the back end.”

There were innumerable examples tonight of Curry coming off screen-and-rolls hard and then out-reading the adjustments the scrambling Dallas defense tried to make.

Rookies

I’ve got nothing original to say. You saw it. Barnes’ maturity and consistency. (Pinch me, Dorothy, and tell me it’s really true that this kid’s only 20.) Tank you very much.

And I’ll happily buy a Green Flash for anyone who can produce actual footage of Ezeli recoiling even a millimeter from head-on collisions with other huge, strong men barreling right into him. Hell, my Subaru bumper crumpled less when it hit that rock wall than Kaman did when he discovered he couldn’t get a shoulder past Ezeli and barfed up that contorted half-ass 18 ft “fallaway jumper” at a critical juncture in the game. (Is that what we should call that shot — a “jumper”? Looked more to me like Kaman was crying “uncle.”)

I know there are howls that Jackson needs to play Ezeli (much) more. Part of me wants to acknowledge Jackson for bringing Ezeli back into the game in OT. But another part of me wants to thank Kaman. If not for Kaman, perhaps no further sighting of Ezeli either. And Ezeli did more, much more, than match up well against Kaman.

Because Bogut’s still out, should we re-evaluate the Bogut—Ellis trade?

No.

Let’s put it this way. I like Ellis and Udoh. But even so, in hindsight, I’d trade Ellis and Udoh for Barnes and Ezeli straight-up. That’s right. Consider an injured Bogut a throw-in, and the W’s still made a good trade.

Rotation

Did I leave anyone out in the discussion of rookies?

Oh, yeah.

If I heard the report right, Jefferson’s getting an MRI, and Jackson said that Jefferson will be out “awhile.” When Jefferson returns, will the same spot in the rotation still be waiting for him?

Tonight Landry’s minutes weren’t cut to 15 because of Ezeli. Those minutes were cut because of Green. Call Green a “glue” guy. Call him a “swiss army knife.” But the other thing that’s already apparent is that he moves much quicker laterally than we were led to believe he could. Already, notably, Green’s capable of jumping out and switching any screen — and cross-guarding another position. His 7 boards in 26 minutes aren’t a joke either, nor are they an aberration. Doesn’t much look like Green’s role is going to shrink, does it?

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Lopez just dunked on Gasol on a drive last night that he is a very good post player capable of baby hooks from both hands.

Lee vs Lopez –> death sentence.
Lee vs Humphries –> we have already watched this movie before and it was not pretty on the rebounding/physicality department.

We definitely have to play Ezeli more tonight and he is NOT PERKINS at all. Sam, do you even watch Ezeli playing at all?
Ezeli is the most nimble/quick 6-11 260 pounder I’ve seen in recent years.

Sam

believewhat,

I agree that Lopez is a decent offensive player. However, half of those highlights are from one game against Toronto where I think he was being guarded by that horrible Italian center who plays less in the post than Nowitzki, and the other half are from one game against Dallas. In the Dallas clips most of his points come from free throw range shots, and when he does score near the basket it’s during a defensive lapse where there is nobody near him or the basket or on a fast break where there is nobody near him or the basket.

He’s not as bad a post scorer as some guys, but he definitely isn’t going to try to back anyone up to the basket.

earl monroe

The point is not so much we CAN’T criticize-sorry

Sam

bry,

Ezeli is young and athletic, but I don’t really see him taking advantage of a size mismatch and dropping 20 points on a subpar defender like Lopez. He is effective for us right now because he is fighting bigs under the basket, and I don’t think there is going to be anyone to fight in our game against the Nets tonight.

I’m getting a little pushback on the Lopez comments right now, but I would just argue that the Brook Lopez I have seen in the NBA is very different than the one that played at Stanford. I expect we’ll see a good amount of time for both my preferred lineup in this game and the Ezeli-Lee lineup that you and believewhat would rather have, so we should see some of these questions answered.

I’ll be at a sports bar watching both the Wizards and the Warriors games tonight, but I’ll try to get some some posts up late tonight here on the East Coast or early tomorrow on the matter.

believewhat

sam,

I would rather proven wrong on Lopez for today’s game. Like you said, we can see different matchups tonight. Interesting game ahead.

Our Team

I haven’t watched Lopez play much in the pros, particularly since he’s been hurt a lot, but I watched him play a lot at Stanford and he had a very impressive low post game. He’s not a banger but he’s very long and has excellent hands and spin moves either way but particularly to his right hand. Either Ezeli or Biedrins can guard him; again, he’s not a banger at all. Personally, I think he could “go off” with either Lee or Landry guarding him. And since we don’t want to see a Humphries redoux of last year on Lee, or DWill taking Curry to the hole all night, I hope MJ keeps Ezeli or Biedrins in the game when Lopez is on the court, and they can give some help to Lee and Curry on D as well.

Chris L

Lazarillo,

My daughter was at Carroll something like 2004-6. (I’ll get the exact dates when she and I go up to the game together tonight). Carroll was very good and kind to her.

I swear I can visualize step-by-step the walk from Carroll to Blackfoot — past the Great Northern and new stuff and then through a more depressed few blocks. Forget the name of the B & B up on the hill where my wife and I would stay when we’d visit. Some mayor (not from Helena) was once staying there, too, and he explained the geographic economy of Montana this way: that the eco-tourist west was doing really well, the flatland east was really struggling — and that Helena was at the crossroads between the two. Made alot of sense to me.

What are you doing in Helena now?

jsl

believe: Good stuff!

And as harsh a critic as I’ve been of Jax’s in-game coaching — which has been atrocious, in general, and which revealed itself so obviously in the Mavs game when he kept playing Klay, a guy who was just getting worse and worse — I happily note that Jax showed several good signs in that game.

Tho, again, he went small in Q4, after watching Kamen just eat DLee alive, he smartly (finally!) played Ezeli at the end and in OT. Worked very well, didn’t it? And MT’s look back at the game also points out how Jax let Curry run the show (i.e. instead of just running off screens) and — get this — even called for Curry to set HB up on that penultimate shot in regulation (i.e. where Barnes missed, but ended up snagging the board, and . . . passing to Klay).

You mean right now for Minnesota, right? They have 6 injured players right now. I mean once Rubio and Love return that is going to be one formidable team, so I am assuming you would include them in the group the Ws will be battling with?

murinur

I absolutely loved Epke Udoh on the defensive side of the ball…. but when it came to rebounding he was just not good enough. Sorry Epke, glad your gone.

Looking at our rookies….

Festus Elizi already has a better career high in offensive rebounds than Epkes’ career high

Draymond has a better career high in defensive rebounds

Harrison has a better career high in total rebounds and in a very young season has already beaten Epkes’ career high not once but twice

believewhat

Good timely article that dubs coaching staff can use. Nets tearing opponents in 1st half and one of the worst in 2nd half.

What is over and under that Klay will find his game today. I will bet on Klay only if nets 10 times in returns

believewhat

col,

“You mean right now for Minnesota, right? They have 6 injured players right now.”

I factored that in also factored in that when their star players come back, they will struggle initially, so they will not be really at full strength till mid Jan or so. Time won’t be on their side in the tough conference. They are winning more than expected, over achieving that is. Credit to Adelman but I expect them to lose more than win till Love and Rubio comes back by mid December. As warrior fans we know better than anyone about injured players coming back and then playing with what looks like six new players on the t’wolves roster who never played with Love and/or Rubio.

Like I said, I have lot of spare time today

Chazmire

Apropos of nothing: Since fe stands for iron on the elemental chart, Festus Ezeli — Ironman!

Mopedelic

If the way the respective teams fared against the lakers is any indication, this is going to be a difficult match up for the Ws, unless the Nets are dead tired from their close loss to the Lakers last night.

That team has more talent (Williams, Johnson, Lopez, Humphries, Wallace, etc…) and provide bad match up for the home team. Red alert everywhere: Williams-Curry, Johnson-Thompson, Wallace-Barnes, Lopez-whoever, Lee-Humphries). Tough going! The coaches may be a wash: Avery vs MJax!

Chris L

That’s an alert, succinct pre-game itself, Mopedelic. Hopefully some fire-in-the-belly early by the W’s can set the right tone. Lee has been fiercely focused on the boards himself since Denver. And Ezeli’s crucial — not just against Lopez — but as a deterrent against Williams’ penetration and post-ups. Also to cordon off defensive rebounding space so that (especially with Humphries) defensive rebounding doesn’t become a free-for-all rugby scrum.

believewhat

mopedi,

You forgot the bench, which is bright spot for dubs. I don’t see how they can stop Carl Landry either.

SJ Jim

Because we’re 6-5 without Bogut and Rush, and have won some on the road, we should just be happy? We should assume that we weren’t capable of being 7-4, or 8-3? If our coach says idiotic things (akin to “If we had some ham, we could have ham and eggs… if we had some eggs” *) after games, we should just ignore that and congratulate him because he’s 6-5 as a sophomore coach? Sorry- I ain’t buyin’ it. We should focus on trying to be the best we can be… period. Jackson seems to be improving, which is good. When he stumbles or has brain farts, he should expect to be criticized- strongly, if necessary. Of all the fans in the league, I think we have the right to do that.

* JanG @117: “SJ Jim: Good comments and I completely agree with you…

…If you were percieved as the goat, having a bad game, turning the ball over on successive plays, allowing your man to torch you, but had one chance to redeem yourself with a wide open three, a shot he probably sinks in his sleep, would you take it? Though we all agree that it would have been prudent to work the clock, I do like that kind of mentality as opposed to, say AB getting rid of the ball in a nanosecond for fear of getting fouled. If that shot went in, all would be forgiven and in that instant, he goes from goat to hero. Gutsy shot, cold-blooded assisin, slump over, savior, team leader!”

You’re agreeing with Jackson, not me. I don’t care if that was Kevin Durant taking that shot. It was a bonehead shot. It’s got nothing to do with “guts”. I’m serious- if he had made the shot, I would still be unhappy with it. The BOTTOM LINE, however, is that he wasn’t shooting well, and DIDN’T make the damn shot! All the “what if” stuff is nonsense. And by the way, I think Klay Thompson has a lonnnggg way to go to prove he is some kind of elite shooter with a chance to be “one of the best in the league for many years”, as you put it. I hope it happens, but I haven’t yet seen evidence that he’s earned that kind of praise. He’s got a nice stroke, and very good range, but there are a lot of guys who can shoot in this league. What about consistency? What about clutch shooting? What about shot selection? He still hasn’t even learned how to avoid taking a lot of bad shots.

El Topo

Earl,

Yes, none of us here has coached in the NBA..but quite a few have coached at lower levels. Somehow, I can’t seem to recall where MJax coached before he got his current gig. And we’ve had 1+ tear to evaluate his performance, and some who were willing to give him some slack (for example, me) are no longer willing to do so.

1) Poor rotations.
2) Unwilling to remove under-performing players.
3) Playing small ball at the wrong moments.
4) Not calling TOs when opponents make a run.
5) Throwing Klay under a bus.
6) Not correcting ball hogs like Monta.
etc.

So what are we supposed to do when we see these things? Praise him?

SJ Jim

By the way… “a shot he probably sinks in his sleep”…??? Seriously? I’m pretty sure he was wide awake for for all twelve (?) shots he missed in that game, including that one. I think somebody might have brainwashed some people about how good a shooter Thompson actually is. Can we hold off on the Ray Allen, Reggie Miller (etc) kinds of compliments for just a little while?

bryhsiao

Sam, you obviously dont remember what Humphries did to Lee before.

What kind of argument is it that we need to have a C to punish Lopez’s soft defense?

You completely miss the point.

Having a C like Ezeli in there majority of the time is the presence down low that opponents think twice before they truck into the paint.
Also Lopez can be contained if matched up with height and mobility.

Lee against Lopez literally just cancelled out Lee’s scroing by Lopez scoring and maybe lose more on that end.

What we need is to contain Lopez to score 10ish and little rebounds by Ezeli’s aggresive/active defense and activity on O rebounds. And also at the same time help out on stopping Joe Johnson/D Williams getting easy uncontested layups against Lee at C.

Also Lee will still get his 20points easily at PF against Humphries. Why does he has to do that against Lopez and pick up stupid reaching fouls because Lee are at disadvantages in leagth/weight and defensive instinct/skills?

Also Humphries is not chopped liver that he knocked Lee around last year and got many offensive rebounds with pure athleticism and hustles.
With Ezeli in there helping out, it would give Lee more breathing room.
Lee wont be in foul trouble and will be fresh with Landry’s sub in the end of the game.

IMO, what we gain by playing Lee at C, we lose on all other ends. zero help D, zero blocking ability, no presence to stop penetration, foul troubles on our bigs because they reach/scramble.

especially we need help on GWallace crashing the board as well.

Sorry, Sam, I do not agree with you at all.

Our Team

Watching how H. Barnes fares against G. Wallace tonight should be worth the price of admission.

Ditto Curry v. Williams. Can Curry play the type of penetrating floor game and effective defense that he did against Collison (and against CP3 last month), but this time against a bigger, physical pg?

MarvAlbert’sRug

SJ Jim @ 166, 168–

Amen, brother!

jsl

OT: You got it.

I’d add the DLee-Humprhies match-up. Never thot that much of Hump’s game, but he sure took it to Lee last time. My guess is that Lee plays a lot tougher this go round. And a key for me will be if he finally starts blocking out.

Now, Earl, let me join ET in pointing out many of us have coached much longer than Jax; and seem to see things more quickly and clearly than he does, tho as noted above he gave us some positive glimmers in the Mavs game.

So, were I he, I’d start Curry-Jack-HB-Lee-Ezeli, and flip Curry and Jack on DWill at both ends of the floor. Then, four to six minutes in, I’d plug in Klay for the weaker of the two starters defensively. I’d use Jenkins at least 10-12 minutes, and keep rotating smalls — holding them all under 32 — so that they stay fresh and fast thru the end.

Properly approached and played, this is an entirely winnable game.

strummer

hey i once coached summer camp ball, so i’m more qualified to know the ins and outs of coaching NBA ballers than MJ is. ahem.
but like any other fanatic arm chair seen it all nba fan for over 5 decades, i do reserve the right to kibitz, now and then!

coltraning

@ Believe

Here’s hopin on Minny, though there is room for them and us in the playoffs and I think we are the best two teams in that 6-10 range, esp. as the news on Bogut sounds promising.

On Klay’s Kontinued Klueless Komedy in the Klutch, not to pile-on, but I don’t give a damn if you are Ray Allen on his best day, you DON’T take a 3 pointer with 20 seconds left and a fresh possession in a 90-90 game. No 1/2 way adequate JC player would pull that and expect anything other than to be benched. I mean c’mon, you do not need to be John Wooden to know that.

earl monroe

@167 Topo- you don’t have to praise him, temper the criticism with the possibility that maybe there are things going on we don’t know about or possibly that he is letting young guys play thru mistakes for future improvement.

Lets go one by one, by the way these numbered “negatives” in caps about Mark Jackson are Topos not mine, my comments are in are in parenthesis.

1) POOR ROTATIONS. (its early in the season, new players are mixed in with returnees, this will happen, look at the defensive numbers, this team is markedly better than last season right now, so the rotations are better now than before}

2) UNWILLING TO REMOVE UDER-PERFORMING PLAYERS. (underperforming after 11 games? you mean Thompson? I would not sit him, he has vast potential, this team is rebuilding, I would keep playing him. David Lee? Curry?
Players may not be playing as well as they can, but again its early. Who do you mean? Roles have shifted now that Rush is out, fortunately Barnes is playing well otherwise it could be worse.

3) PLAYING SMALL BALL AT THE WRONG MOMENTS. (This is your opinion, as a coach Jackson has to make the call, it doesn’t mean he’s wrong, its a judgement call, you write it like you are right and he is wrong, I may agree with you on this at times, but it doesn’t make him a horrible coach}

4) NOT CALLIN TO’S WHEN OPPONENTS MAKE A RUN. (maybe he wants the players to play thru mistakes, especially early in the season, many coaches coach this way, its a judgement call, he knows his players, with the exception of the Memphis game, the players/team has seemed resilient)

5) THROWING KLAY UNDER A BUS. (Throwing Klay under the bus would be not playing him, he keeps playing the kid, sometimes a coach knows what needs to be said to motivate, I don’t know enough about this and what goes on behind closed doors)

6) NOT CORRECTING BALL HOGS LIKE MONTA.(Last year no one had a choice, and if you look at the numbers, on a Warriors team decimated by injuries he was the “man” and the “man” takes the shots. Ellis’ offensive stats with the Warriors were not horrific probably slightly better than the league average. BTW if you think its easy to sit star players in the NBA when fans come out to watch them think again)

Oh and one other thing, I would take Mark Jacksons 17 years as an NBA point guard in lieu of a coaching resume.

The jury is still out on Jackson he is not perfect by any means but he deserves the benefit of a doubt.

earl monroe

@173 ha ha ha yes you do

Sam

IT has always bothered me that Jackson, who made it clear a long time ago that he intended to coach, consciously chose not to take any of the many assistant coaching jobs the opened up for him over the years throughout the league.

He chose to continue being a talking head on TV until he was offered a position at the highest level in the coaching profession that many, many excellent coaches work towards their entire career.

I don’t blame him for taking the job, there is just something about the way it was just given to him that rubs me the wrong way.

Does anyone know of any other examples like that in professional sports where someone received a head coaching job without any prior coaching experience at any level?

bryhsiao

btw Westbrook is killing CP3 right now on the block and made CP3 0-6 right now.

I guess Curry wasn’t the only “soft” point guard in the league that cannot defend Westbrook eh?

bryhsiao

btw Love is back and rounding into form. 9-16 FG, 8rebs in just first half.
JJBerea is back too.

This saturday game vs Minny is going to be very very interesting and tough even when we are at home.

“Sources said West was instrumental in [MJ's] hiring, as he had made it clear he wasn’t looking for a ‘retread’ coach and that he preferred candidates who played the game professionally. That background and his national television spot clearly give Jackson credibility among the game’s modern-day players and could perhaps come in handy during free agency”

What is over and under that Klay will find his game today. I will bet on Klay only if nets 10 times in returns”

Go Dubs !!

believewhat

dubs better be careful with the 3PT shot, don’t shoot too many. Dubs leading by 10 but if they should stop conceding offensive rebounds. Need Ezeli there.

believewhat

After the time out, coach stupidly brought back Landry+Lee. Deron and Lopez will attack basket and why not. Two posessions in two baskets for Lopez. Can’t keep trading baskets, need to make stops.

JabG

All good! Klay is back…whew! W’s are 6-0 when leading at halftime, best in league. Liked the way MJax had them double DWill in Q4 to get him to give up ball. Curry is getting into a groove. Like what I’m seeing!

JanG

And W’s outrebound Nets 43-35. Wow!
And what’s up with Joe Johnson? Even CJ stunk.

Fantom

klay!

I yiyi yi

Good win

Sam

Bry and believewhat,

I don’t know how that game answered our prior debate over Lee/Landry versus Lee/Ezeli. I would say I win the argument because of how we played in the first half, but there were definitely moments that the small lineup killed us.

Regardless of that, Ezeli needs to learn how to guard people 15 feet from the rim. That’s where Ezeli got humiliated.

Sam

That said, Ezeli overall did well overall. It’s guarding PF/Cs with a great mid-range to driving game that kills him.