Post by on Jul 10, 2006 19:06:51 GMT -5

Hi out there in UNOMAS land!I am a new writer...just coming back because I am in transition.My son is turning 3 next week and I am calling an IFSP because I would like him to go to a typical preschool next fall. I really would like him to go to a Montessori, and so here we go...Wondering, any one out there could you chime in for me with some goals that would depend on typical peers being there?Also, anyone have their child in a typical preschool or Montessori...would you tell me how it happened, how it is going, and what the county provided for services and supports there?Thanks for any input!![/color

Post by momofrussell on Jul 10, 2006 19:56:25 GMT -5

WAIT!.. your son is turning 3 next week and no one from your home school district has called you or written you for a transition meeting into the school system and do an IEP?

They should have done some transition meetings with you and talked about placement already... I am sorry if they haven't.

Placement and services like therapies are determined by your child's needs... and should be placed in the Least Restrictive Environment or LRE... which for most kids would be a typical preschool setting. Some districts drive placement decisions by diagnoses or piegon hole us into a self contained setting... if you want a typical preschool then ask for it.

If you can get your IEP team to determine that Montesorri is "appropriate" and LRE, then the district would pay for it and still supply services. If you choose not to go through the team for the Montessori placement, you'd make it really hard trying to get them to pay or provide services.

I'd suggest you ask to see ALL options.... and keep an open mind to all of it. Go see a typical preschool, a self contained class and go see the Montesorri... you can even see a Head Start class too! Then decide what is appropriate for your child. I would also suggest you buy the book "From Emotions To Advocacy" from Pam and Pete Wright ( www.wrightslaw.com ). This book will help you understand and navigate the school IEP and law process well. It's a GREAT book!!!! It's an easy read to familiarize yourself with what goes on from age 3-21 in spec ed.

Post by Kristin on Jul 10, 2006 23:32:33 GMT -5

Clarice was in daycare from 6 weeks of age. They had a pre-school program for the kids 2 through pre-K. When she turned three we kept her at the preschool, but the district would bus her each morning to the preschool for kids with special needs. She'd return on the bus to the pre-school for lunch and spent the rest of the afternoon there. She napped on the bus, which was just a large van. It seems like it would be hard to put a 3 year-old on the bus, but she loved the ride in the morning. In the afternoon, she took a nap on the bus. She was tired for a few weeks until she adjusted, but I think it also helped make the transition later to the larger bus easier.

By doing this, she got the therapies like OT and Speech at the district's pre-school, but the life skills and socialization were done at the private pre-school. They even sent out the OT and her district's pre-school teacher to train the private pre-school staff to work on behavior/social issues and self-help skills in the pre-school. It was great for her, and the students at the pre-school.

I thought about Montessori, but here they have to be potty trained, which she was not.

My younger daughter is at the same pre-school. The teachers still ask about Clarice and talk about how much they learned by having her there. They still teach the toddlers how to sign for food, more, and water before they speak.

Post by cindylou on Jul 11, 2006 14:03:26 GMT -5

My daughter Kaylee is now 12.When she was preschool age we did get the school district to pay for her to go to a private preschool. They were not thrilled about it, but they did it.

At the meeting-the types of goals I added to her IFSP were somewhat like the following. Her GOALS drive her PLACEMENT. Placement cannot be decided before her goals--so if they are doing that they are not following the law.

I walked into my meeting and said (politely) "I have some goals I would like on her IFSP." (its best if you make friends with the powers that be ahead of time--for some reason the school people have always liked our family and been willing to to most of what we requested) (I always act as if it's a political game and I'm running for office--so I kiss the babies and make nice)

After appropriate speech modeling by typically developing peers, Kaylee will immitate the request for bathroom usage and correctly line up to use the bathroom 80% of the time.

After appropriate behavior modeling by typically developing peers Kaylee will demonstrate correct circle time behavior (sitting, cross legged with hands in her lap) 100% of the time.

Always to include "typically developing peers and the imitation factor" I was not making that up--Kaylee imitates well whatever is modeled to her. If she is in a classroom with all "special needs" kids with very little language-she will have nothing to imitate. If she is in a classroom with behavior problem kids she will imitate that. The reason Kaylee blends in sooo well with typical kids is because that's all she's been around. They don't put up with weird behavior-they tell her to stop.

We are fortunate that Kaylee functions well and independently. I pushed for inclusion all the way and that's all she's had. It works well for her-I'm sure it doesn't work well for everyone nor is it the only or best choice for everyone.

I'm in Hillsboro-near Beaverton. I noticed you're in Portland. Is it really the portland school district? Or Gresham-Beaverton-Tigard? You would have it easy in Tigard and Hillsboro. Everywhere else it will be a battle-but one that you should be able to win.

If you'd like to call me then send me a private email and I'll give you my #Cindy

Post by cindylou on Jul 11, 2006 14:05:50 GMT -5

Have to say though that from what I hear-Montessori is not very structured. I could be wrong--but have several neighborkids that went there and that's how their moms described it. Kaylee does much better with clear structure and that's kinda how public school function--so I enjoyed that her preschool was very much like a public school classroom in it's structure. Got her ready to move into regular Kindergarten and be used to a routine and discipline.

Post by on Jul 11, 2006 23:44:52 GMT -5

Hi there everyone!Thanks for your input. Here is the scenario for our family. I did have EI from when our son was born, but I hated some of the things they were doing and it wasn't comfortable for me so I quit and went for private therapy which was wonderful. Then I took a break from that and went back to the EI to see how it would go. Since Jan 2006, it has been good. The speech path especially has been very helpful and good with my son.Now he is turning three and she began to mention about what I would do after that. The speech path is my case manager. Anyway I visited the self contained classroom and hated, hated, hated it! most of the kids did not talk, and those who were typical were hispanic and spoke spanish. Not that spanish is not good to learn, but I don't speak spanish. So....I want my son in a typical classroom. So far they have not offered me anything of the kind and are telling me because he is preschool age, they are not obligated to provide anything more than what they can offer me. They are saying I am free to go public, but they won't pay for that since they have this wonderful "blended" classroom he can go to and because they have no money for anything else.So...I have the IFSP for this Thursday and I am having an avocate come with me, She won't say anything, but just be there to take notes and whisper in my ear I guess. I feel somewhat uninspired about it all, since it seems whenever I talk to administrators about this, they all glaze over and start talking about money. I just want my son to be truly EDUCATED if he is going to spend time somewhere, not BABYSITTED.So, please, if you have some more goals that you could send to me depending upon typical peers that would be great.Also...THESE GUYS ARE ALL TALKING PLACEMENT BEFORE GOALS. I think this whole thing is verbage really. The placement is driven by what they have to offer and the money they are willing to spend. What blows my mind is how much money they are willing to spend busing my son AWAY. ( TO AN APPROPRIATE SETTING) with other disabled children.So there you have it, my big attitude is showing eh?!I called about 12 typical preschools ...they all were excited until I said, oh and by the way, my son has Down Syndrome. There were some who would even fudge on the potty training issue, but DS, oh no, we are not equipped for that....Finally, I found a place and then another, willing, even cortial about it all. I was thankful, but still I must say dear ones, I thought...why do I feel like they are doing me a favor? I shouldn't feel that way. Anyone who has the blessing of being around my son is the one who is favored. He is so wonderful!!! I just would like him to have some friends and learn how to follow the directions and leading of his own peers and to play nicely with other little boys, maybe see how they jump and how they talk and how they have to wipe their mouth with a napkin too. It seems this whole preschool thing should not be so complicated should it. And then we could talk about therapy.... better not start with that one.Feels good just to talk some. Thanks for listening.

Post by momofrussell on Jul 12, 2006 8:59:24 GMT -5

So far they have not offered me anything of the kind and are telling me because he is preschool age, they are not obligated to provide anything more than what they can offer me. They are saying I am free to go public, but they won't pay for that since they have this wonderful "blended" classroom he can go to and because they have no money for anything else.

This right here what you said... this is pretty much illegal for your district to not offer you a typical setting as an option and say they don't have money to provide. They can't say that. Now, you can't go in and tell them they are being illegal.. you have to follow proper channels... but I will tell you... put in writing you want a typical class room for your daughter for appropriate placement based on her needs. And like I mentioned in my other post, I'd get that book I mentioned or a book that tells about the IDEA laws and quick so you know what the laws are. Put everything you want in writing and don't let them tell you "this is what our district does". We have federal laws, not "district" laws that allow our kids a proper education.

I think getting an advocate is a good idea. I am not one to usually jump at bringing advocates, but it sounds like to familiarize yourself with the process and around the bull crap they are telling you... it's probably best to bring one!

Post by meghans_mom on Jul 13, 2006 11:28:39 GMT -5

my daughter is 5 and entering kindy in the fall. for the past 2 years she has been in an integrated preschool. there are 15-18 kids, 1/2 with various disabilities -- some very 'minor' such as ST or OT issues, so the class truly has more typical kids in it than not. there were 3 or 4 kids w/ DS in her class. there was a special ed teacher, regular ed teacher and 3 aides as well as a full time SLT. The preschool she attends is FOR children with DS, but they developed these integrated classes to offer different opportunities, as well as for a place for the kids of the women who work at the school...so it works really well all around.it is a full day class, meghan was only allowed to get 4 therapies in a week, the idea being the typical kids were her peer-models, and being around them was better than being pulled out for 6 or 8 therapies a week.I loved the class, and it worked for us...in fact my son (typical) will be starting in this class in the fall so we can "give back" a little to keep it as an integrated class.I am trying to remember the goals we had for MM at 3 and can't really remember but by last year she was able to ride a trike, run short distances (like pulling teeth that one was)...she is also able to read about 80-100 sight words plus all the names of her friends and family, and simple sentences. She can count to 40 or so, and is able to write her name and most letters of the alphabet. Not all of these things were learned in school, we did alot with her at home as well.We didn't have "big" goals..like she should be able to read simple sentences, etc but we worked in each discipline individually to have it all come together, "she should be able to copy a verticle line, a hortizontal line, a cirlce, make a simple face""...be able to to run 20 feet (or whatever the distance was), throw a ball over hand, navigate a 4, 8, 10 inch step" "climb stairs using reciprocal feet", "dress and undress for the potty" it's better (in my opinion) to break the goals down into steps, rather than going straight for these large goals that may discourage you, your child or the therapists. meghan will be attending our district kindy next year which is a totally regular school...she'll have an aide and all of her therapies will be after school (it's half day) with the exception of PT which will be push in/pull out depending on need.good luck & keep us updated. laurie

Post by meghans_mom on Jul 13, 2006 19:51:12 GMT -5

also - look under my reply under "Lots and Lots of ??" I just posted a bunch of suggestions there for a 3 yr olds IEP -- i tried to remember what we had listed for MM, I should just go find my notebook...lazy lazy me.

Post by on Jul 24, 2006 5:43:00 GMT -5

Just thought I would update you all about my son and the IFSP.It didn 't go so well. After introducing Keeran and talking about his evaluations and where we saw him at currently, half of the participants had to leave. We tried to pin down the OT first with what services she would provide if we went private, which I told them I hadn't decided yet. (again, they had only offered me one option for preschool; their program, which has typical peers in it so it is adequate in their view).Anyway, the OT said she would come every other week for 20 minutes. Well, I said, in a nice way, you might as well not even come. How can you know a kids in 20 min every other week.Finally she agreed to come 30 min every week. After fighting for that, I told the case manager, we would need to go over the goals at another meeting because the time was out...it had started at 3:30pm and it was 6:30pm. My case manager said we could just type those in later and for me to sign the IFSP so he would have one before he turned 3.(he turned 3 last week) They IFSP was for the summer only ( the next 3 months) I was very frustrated afterward because I never really got the placement I wanted provided by the ESD, but they kept telling me because the Federal doesn't require kids to be in school until they are 7, they are not obligated to provide a completely typical setting. They are providing a "blended classroom", but the classroom I visited and saw, was horrible. It was not right for my son at all. Most kids had autism and didn't talk, the others were hispanic and spoke spanish. It would be better for my son to be home. So....anyway...now I am thinking of going private, but asked to change school districts because we live closer to another one. I haven't heard back about this yet and am really wondering how do I get things to happen. Do they just think I will give up if they keep stalling because I am about to!!I feel really pretty dissapointed in my case manager, who is my speech path. She was so great and I feel like now that I signed the dumb IFSP, she is off the hook for me. I talked to the avocacy center and they told me the same thing. They ESD doesn't have to provide a typical education setting, if the placement is with some typical peers.Anyone, anyone??

Post by on Jul 24, 2006 5:44:59 GMT -5

Just thought I would update you all about my son and the IFSP.It didn 't go so well. After introducing Keeran and talking about his evaluations and where we saw him at currently, half of the participants had to leave. We tried to pin down the OT first with what services she would provide if we went private, which I told them I hadn't decided yet. (again, they had only offered me one option for preschool; their program, which has typical peers in it so it is adequate in their view).Anyway, the OT said she would come every other week for 20 minutes. Well, I said, in a nice way, you might as well not even come. How can you know a kids in 20 min every other week.Finally she agreed to come 30 min every week. After fighting for that, I told the case manager, we would need to go over the goals at another meeting because the time was out...it had started at 3:30pm and it was 6:30pm. My case manager said we could just type those in later and for me to sign the IFSP so he would have one before he turned 3.(he turned 3 last week) They IFSP was for the summer only ( the next 3 months) I was very frustrated afterward because I never really got the placement I wanted provided by the ESD, but they kept telling me because the Federal doesn't require kids to be in school until they are 7, they are not obligated to provide a completely typical setting. They are providing a "blended classroom", but the classroom I visited and saw, was horrible. It was not right for my son at all. Most kids had autism and didn't talk, the others were hispanic and spoke spanish. It would be better for my son to be home. So....anyway...now I am thinking of going private, but asked to change school districts because we live closer to another one. I haven't heard back about this yet and am really wondering how do I get things to happen. Do they just think I will give up if they keep stalling because I am about to!!I feel really pretty dissapointed in my case manager, who is my speech path. She was so great and I feel like now that I signed the dumb IFSP, she is off the hook for me. I talked to the avocacy center and they told me the same thing. They ESD doesn't have to provide a typical education setting, if the placement is with some typical peers.Anyone, anyone??

Post by steffipoo on Jul 25, 2006 17:31:10 GMT -5

;D HI I am sooo confused.. Are you talking about his IEP??? IFSP is the in home family service plan from 0-3 then at 3 you do the iep. Actually at 2 and a half you do the transition to the iep. Someone taught me long ago a trick I will share. Whatever they say they can't do if it is something you want ask em to put it in writing. Sign and date it. NO ONE will put anything in writing with their signature on it unless it is the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth unless they want to leave their job. I am kind of unclear what you are looking to find out here if you could explain one more time with a bit more detail then perhaps I can try to help. hmmmm.....My girl went to a collaborative los angeles preschool which was part of our public school system with every kind of kid around. There were 10 sp ed students and 50 typical ed students. I loved it aas Olivia did too. She received 30 minutes ape, 1hr speech, and 1 hr ot per week. She did hers in a group setting with a few typical best pals who motivated her soo much. She's not one for one on one. Very social gal who likes a group. :)Tell me more and have you seen any other preschools in your area which you like as well? have you checked with your local downs syndrome association and what other parents in your area have been happy with and why? Thats a great start as its a local thing and the ds assoc in your area may have some great tips for you as well. Thats what they are there for. HUGS Steff

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