seems to me like their are different kinds/tiers of legionaries in the teutoburg forest video, with the weaker ones actually wearing exactly the same armor as those in the prologue campaign preview.
the armor of the stronger ones does look, well, stronger, but i don't think the weaker ones look unprofessional. this isn't the medieval era where everyone was wearing plate armor, after all :D

i'm surprised to see that the units in the prologue video are called "veteran legionaries" though, as they do indeed look more like hastati or principles to me.

I'm pretty sure the difference in armor is due to different time scales. As you progress through Rome 1, you start off with the units like hastati and town guard ect. who wear less armor than cohorts that came later, I'm pretty sure it was after the reforms that the new armor also came along, you don't see it for quite a while.

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The waiting is killing me, I just want to play now! staring at it in my steam library somehow hoping time will go faster..

Originally Posted by want my Slimjim

You don't stand next to someone and speak In Spanish in an uncrowded area. Thats not a freedom concept.

Anyone have any idea when we might be able to pre download, my guess is no but you guys have better sources than me.

So did I. HoC mentioned somewhere that he had already upgraded to legionary cohorts or something like that. Which is why he tore through the Italian Spearmen so easily. Though, personally, I don't think he should have been able to in the prologue. Personally, I think he should have had his ass handed to him in that one but the AI did not handle that battle very well at all.

As far as a preload? I've heard Steam will have one, no idea when it starts, but I got mine through GMG. Now I've heard GMG sometimes send out keys early, but have not heard if or when that will happen for Rome 2.

Sir Robin, the Not-Quite-So-Brave-As-Sir-Lancelot.
Who had nearly fought the Dragon of Angnor.
Who had almost stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.
And who had personally wet himself, at the Battle of Badon Hill.

So did I. HoC mentioned somewhere that he had already upgraded to legionary cohorts or something like that. Which is why he tore through the Italian Spearmen so easily. Though, personally, I don't think he should have been able to in the prologue. Personally, I think he should have had his ass handed to him in that one but the AI did not handle that battle very well at all.

As far as a preload? I've heard Steam will have one, no idea when it starts, but I got mine through GMG. Now I've heard GMG sometimes send out keys early, but have not heard if or when that will happen for Rome 2.

they did say he shouldn't do that in the prologue, he completed it, then it gives you the option to stay, or start the proper campaign, he chose to stay. so the prologue is probably on the very easiest setting, wouldn't expect an amazing AI on there.

but it was a weird battle to show, wasn't that impressive in the way HoCs army was so much better than his opponent, it was never going to be a hard battle.

I'm pretty sure the difference in armor is due to different time scales. As you progress through Rome 1, you start off with the units like hastati and town guard ect. who wear less armor than cohorts that came later, I'm pretty sure it was after the reforms that the new armor also came along, you don't see it for quite a while.

as i said in my previous posts, that's what i thought, too.

but apparently the units in question are labelled "veteran legionaries", which means they are at least from after Marius' reforms. and the same units can be seen in the teutoburg forest (alongside apparently higher tier ones) which is, historically, very late i think.

Originally Posted by SirRobin

So did I. HoC mentioned somewhere that he had already upgraded to legionary cohorts or something like that. Which is why he tore through the Italian Spearmen so easily. Though, personally, I don't think he should have been able to in the prologue. Personally, I think he should have had his ass handed to him in that one but the AI did not handle that battle very well at all.

agreed, but wasn't it just normal difficulty or something? i imagine even the stat increases from hard would have made a big difference, especially against his equites.

also, i cringed a bit when he tried to "unload the artillery"...

Originally Posted by serenka

they did say he shouldn't do that in the prologue, he completed it, then it gives you the option to stay, or start the proper campaign, he chose to stay. so the prologue is probably on the very easiest setting, wouldn't expect an amazing AI on there.

sounds about right.

but it was a weird battle to show, wasn't that impressive in the way HoCs army was so much better than his opponent, it was never going to be a hard battle.

i think if the defenders would've been 'playing' well, they still could've won (or at least done much better) by denying the romans a clean landing, especially since they clearly had the ranged advantage.
on the other hand, if the roman player would've used the artillery ships proberly, he might've been able to harass the defenders on the beach pretty good, both before and during the landing /shrug

but apparently the units in question are labelled "veteran legionaries", which means they are at least from after Marius' reforms (107 bc). and the same units can be seen in the teutoburg forest (alongside apparently higher tier ones) which is, historically, very late i think.

I went back and watched teutoburg forest video. The makeup of those units appeared to be the same from rome 1. So legionaries, urban cohorts and Auxillia none of which look anything like the units used in the video. Historically speaking Teutoburg took place near the end of Augustus's life. He was the first emperor after Ceaser. So relatively early in empire (9 ce).

agreed, but wasn't it just normal difficulty or something? i imagine even the stat increases from hard would have made a big difference, especially against his equites.

That was the one part of the battle that made me facepalm. Dismounted cav units took on and beat 3-4 spear units.....

i think if the defenders would've been 'playing' well, they still could've won (or at least done much better) by denying the romans a clean landing, especially since they clearly had the ranged advantage.
on the other hand, if the roman player would've used the artillery ships proberly, he might've been able to harass the defenders on the beach pretty good, both before and during the landing /shrug

He had such a huge advantage in unit quality that tactics really wouldn't have mattered much. The player also did a good job of attacking the ai on three sides.

Sir Robin, the Not-Quite-So-Brave-As-Sir-Lancelot.
Who had nearly fought the Dragon of Angnor.
Who had almost stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.
And who had personally wet himself, at the Battle of Badon Hill.

More than enough for me! Shogun 2 looks fantastic even on the lower end.

agreed.

Originally Posted by theturn

I went back and watched teutoburg forest video. The makeup of those units appeared to be the same from rome 1. So legionaries, urban cohorts and Auxillia none of which look anything like the units used in the video.

i think the ones at around 1:38 look to have pretty much the same kind of armor as those in the prologue video. it's kinda hard to tell exactly though, with only 720p.

Historically speaking Teutoburg took place near the end of Augustus's life. He was the first emperor after Ceaser. So relatively early in empire (9 ce).

that's indeed much earlier than i thought, but still a good century after Marius' reforms. and since the units in the prologue are called "veteran legionaries", not principles, i think it's pretty save to assume that the same is true for those.

That was the one part of the battle that made me facepalm. Dismounted cav units took on and beat 3-4 spear units.....

indeed.. i'm guessing "italian speermen" is mostly a militia unit, but still.. they outnumbered the equites about 2:1, and equites are only light cavalry without swords, too. their special ability appears to be pretty op, at least on lower difficulties.

He had such a huge advantage in unit quality that tactics really wouldn't have mattered much.

probably not enough to win the battle, but at least have the romans take heavy casualties. the combination of missile fire plus charging downhill into a unit that isn't in formation and only has a fraction of it's full strength deployed at that moment, could be quite devastating - at least on not-so-easy difficulties.

The player also did a good job of attacking the ai on three sides.

well yeah, but only after he had time to deploy and position his entire army without losing a single man :P

i think the ones at around 1:38 look to have pretty much the same kind of armor as those in the prologue video. it's kinda hard to tell exactly though, with only 720p.

I could be wrong but those look like Auxillia, again hard to tell because of the quality. But even they don't have feathers in their helms like the ones from the prologue. If you go back to 1:26 you actually get a much better look at the units I think you are talking about and you can see clearly they are Auxillia because of the spears. That's the same unit you see in the front when his legionaries move in just more mixed up with the Germans.

well yeah, but only after he had time to deploy and position his entire army without losing a single man :P

lol yeah the AI did give him plenty of time to maneuver. Though what most people forget is that Utah beach was the exception on DDay many of the other landings went smoothly. It wasn't till later they ran into trouble mostly in towns and bridges. So what I'm trying to say is you can let them land unopposed and still give them hell later.

I could be wrong but those look like Auxillia, again hard to tell because of the quality. But even they don't have feathers in their helms like the ones from the prologue. If you go back to 1:26 you actually get a much better look at the units I think you are talking about and you can see clearly they are Auxillia because of the spears. That's the same unit you see in the front when his legionaries move in just more mixed up with the Germans.

oooh, good catch! i was so focused on the armor that i didn't notice they were using spears xD /facepalm
looking at the unit cards now, it suddenly makes a lot more sense that the ones with the round shields look so strangely different from the other two^^

in that case, you're right, the actual legionaries' armor in that video looks a lot better and stronger than of those in the prologue.

there doesn't seem to be too much difference between principles and the early cohorts, though. they are both wearing only chain mail.

So what I'm trying to say is you can let them land unopposed and still give them hell later.

well yeah, but i do think the landing would be the best moment of attack, at least in this case. the slope down to the beach was quite steep, and the defenders had more (and longer range) missiles. also, this settlement itself was rather poorly defendable, with several very wide and straight streets leading to the center. giving the heavy roman infantry time to fully deploy, get in formation and move to equal ground level was just a wasted chance - at the very least for some decent harassing before the all-in melee fights started.

well yeah, but i do think the landing would be the best moment of attack, at least in this case. the slope down to the beach was quite steep, and the defenders had more (and longer range) missiles. also, this settlement itself was rather poorly defendable, with several very wide and straight streets leading to the center. giving the heavy roman infantry time to fully deploy, get in formation and move to equal ground level was just a wasted chance - at the very least for some decent harassing before the all-in melee fights started.