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CT, we're all here in the same situation trying to help you out with our opinions and such but you keep digging deeper. Right or wrong, you're coming across like that guy that shows up as a single but nobody wants to play with.

CT, we're all here in the same situation trying to help you out with our opinions and such but you keep digging deeper. Right or wrong, you're coming across like that guy that shows up as a single but nobody wants to play with.

I read the OP's original thread. I didn't see anything over the top in any of his comments. I agree with the majority of responders that at that age let the kid be a kid. I have a very good friend of mine whose daughter is just wrapping up her second year on the LPGA Tour. She did a lot of snow boarding when she was younger.

For what it's worth on the most recent No Laying Up podcast with Kisner he says to make it on tour you need to be winning at every level you play at... it's at about the 21 minute mark here: NLU Podcast

For what it's worth on the most recent No Laying Up podcast with Kisner he says to make it on tour you need to be winning at every level you play at... it's at about the 21 minute mark here: NLU Podcast

Did he win an individual event while in college? He was a very good player in college on a very good team that won the NCAAs as a team.

For what it's worth on the most recent No Laying Up podcast with Kisner he says to make it on tour you need to be winning at every level you play at... it's at about the 21 minute mark here: NLU Podcast

Did he win an individual event while in college? He was a very good player in college on a very good team that won the NCAAs as a team.

I can't find those stats but did learn he was a four time all american.

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Good reply

This WaPo article reports on the decline in youth participation ("Why 70% of kids quit sports by age 13") and comes to some similar (but many different, unmentioned) conclusions:

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Good reply

This WaPo article reports on the decline in youth participation ("Why 70% of kids quit sports by age 13") and comes to some similar (but many different, unmentioned) conclusions:

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Curious what the source of the reason for quitting is. Is it self-reported by the student?

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Good reply

This WaPo article reports on the decline in youth participation ("Why 70% of kids quit sports by age 13") and comes to some similar (but many different, unmentioned) conclusions:

I am also going to turn this around a little. In today's world, adults are saying kids are soft, they don't have the appetite for competition, and they aren't learning how to "man up" which is what sports teaches us. What these naysayers is missing is simple. When I was a kid, after school I called my friends, we would grab our soccer ball, baseball equipment, football equipment, hockey equipment, and meet at the school and play. We played it all, and not once did a parent ever come to watch or oversee us to make sure we were technically correct. We did it every afternoon after school and every weekend day. Then once a week we bit the bullet and went to "real" practice where we were told what to do (we didn't all play on the same teams or sports, but you get the idea). We loved sports, we loved playing, and in our small group of 10 or so, 6 of us went onto play college sports (soccer, hockey, baseball, and basketball were represented).

In today's world, this doesn't happen. Every athletic event is scripted. The nature of coaching is improving, and the critique will eventually take the fun out of it. Kids arent soft, or whatever, they are tired. Tired of not being allowed to play. Tired of constant criticism. Tired of not being themselves, but rather each action is a rung on the ladder in improvement.

At age 23 I was offered a professional contract (low level, not millions for sure), but I realized it wouldn't be fun anymore. So perhaps that is why I see the whole issue in the way I do, but what we are doing to youth sports is heinous. The ESPNization of fun.

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Curious what the source of the reason for quitting is. Is it self-reported by the student?

The studies I read as a M.Ed student were years ago (6-8 years maybe). I only remember the general tone of the studies and the results, but yes I believe the results were self reported by the children themselves.

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Curious what the source of the reason for quitting is. Is it self-reported by the student?

The studies I read as a M.Ed student were years ago (6-8 years maybe). I only remember the general tone of the studies and the results, but yes I believe the results were self reported by the children themselves.

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Good reply

This WaPo article reports on the decline in youth participation ("Why 70% of kids quit sports by age 13") and comes to some similar (but many different, unmentioned) conclusions:

So, will your son continue to ski this year? What is your thought now?

I stated in the other thread that we will probably continue recreational skiing as a family.

It's not a big deal either way - we only go a few times a year, and while we enjoy the time together it is neither a long-standing tradition nor highly anticipated essential activity; it was more a question of how much we should be considering potentially risky/dangerous activities as the kids mature and develop and become more serious about sports.

As an aside, many of the responses in both threads talk about 'burnout'. Due to the cold northeast winter, the duration of the golf season is, at most, 7.5 months a year. My son plays a competitive winter sport, which he also takes a break from during golf season (April to Oct), as well as another casual sport year-round, so there is cross-training across multiple disciplines.

I guess one question I would ask is, what is the probability of over-training/burnout if you are barely playing 2/3 of the year?

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Good reply

This WaPo article reports on the decline in youth participation ("Why 70% of kids quit sports by age 13") and comes to some similar (but many different, unmentioned) conclusions:

So, will your son continue to ski this year? What is your thought now?

I stated in the other thread that we will probably continue recreational skiing as a family.

It's not a big deal either way - we only go a few times a year, and while we enjoy the time together it is neither a long-standing tradition nor highly anticipated essential activity; it was more a question of how much we should be considering potentially risky/dangerous activities as the kids mature and develop and become more serious about sports.

As an aside, many of the responses in both threads talk about 'burnout'. Due to the cold northeast winter, the duration of the golf season is, at most, 7.5 months a year. My son plays a competitive winter sport, which he also takes a break from during golf season (April to Oct), as well as another casual sport year-round, so there is cross-training across multiple disciplines.

I guess one question I would ask is, what is the probability of over-training/burnout if you are barely playing 2/3 of the year?

I think it all goes back to the title of the other thread '...serious elite junior golfers" Probably ruffled some feathers with that. Maybe if it had said, 'Are there sports you won't let your junior golfer play or participate in?' and then you expounded your concerns about the dangers of skiing in the comment section it would have been received better.

I know I would have piped in with Football being an off limits sport. I have two cousins that were highly rated baseball prospects that were injured playing football which directly influenced my decision to keep our boy out of organized football.

Perhaps you aren't tying the two posts together, but if you are, you are missing the boat with this statement.

Did you know only 25% of all kids who start in sports in high school graduate as a student athlete? The number one reason for kids quitting sports is their parents and the game becomes no fun anymore. This also explains the rise in extreme sports because kids gravitate toward games their parents cant ruin for them since they nothing about them. The number 2 reason is their friends don't play anymore.

So, building on reason #2, in early adolescence the parents sway over a child's decisions give way to peer influence. So, if your child falls into a social group less like themselves, they will subtly change to match their peers. This could mean quitting sports, partying, or any other myriad of things kids do.

Finally, elite athletics is a genetic lottery. And even then, given #1 and #2 there is no guarantee. Think about Marinovich, Jamarcus Russell, and any other number of athletes who won the lottery, but lost the battle.

Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future. There is no denying learning a physical skill at a young age is an advantage, but to become elite is not established at a young age.

Now, if you want to stop skiing because you want to give your kid his best shot at winning a golf league championship, more power to you. If you want your child to develop into a top tier person, let him live a little. If you want your kid to grow up to a top tier athlete, then expose your child to as many sports as possible, get out of the way, and let the kid play.

All of this is backed up by studies. None of this is opinion excepting "Success at an early age ensures success in beer leagues of the future."

I wish you luck with your child, I wish you luck with your aspirations. Kids are a wonderful gift with no instructions and (sometimes sadly) no reset button. Give them to best, and hope at 30 they are beautiful people whether they are mowing lawns or holding the Claret Jug.

Good reply

This WaPo article reports on the decline in youth participation ("Why 70% of kids quit sports by age 13") and comes to some similar (but many different, unmentioned) conclusions:

So, will your son continue to ski this year? What is your thought now?

I stated in the other thread that we will probably continue recreational skiing as a family.

It's not a big deal either way - we only go a few times a year, and while we enjoy the time together it is neither a long-standing tradition nor highly anticipated essential activity; it was more a question of how much we should be considering potentially risky/dangerous activities as the kids mature and develop and become more serious about sports.

As an aside, many of the responses in both threads talk about 'burnout'. Due to the cold northeast winter, the duration of the golf season is, at most, 7.5 months a year. My son plays a competitive winter sport, which he also takes a break from during golf season (April to Oct), as well as another casual sport year-round, so there is cross-training across multiple disciplines.

I guess one question I would ask is, what is the probability of over-training/burnout if you are barely playing 2/3 of the year?

I would say burnout is a symptom of not having fun and monotony of the task. Certainly you have the monotony beaten because of the weather. The fun part can still happen with excessive focus on training and improving. That's my opinion, no studies on this one, but lots of people burnout regardless of locale. Hockey players burn out even if they don't play in the summer. Golfers, football players, all sports have seasons, and invariably, each sport has a fair amount of burnout to the juniors participating.

As for overtraining, from a physical standpoint (particularly because they are playing other sports in the interim) is minimal, but I am not a physiologist either. Just based on reading I have done over the years, but still an opinion.

In my opinion the culture has changed kids quite a bit. I spent most of my childhood playing pickup games...football, baseball, basketball, etc. I don't see a lot of kids in packs playing sports together much. I see a lot of youth practices (team) but the unorganized "lets go play" doesn't seem to happen as much. Does this have an affect? I would think kids spending much more time on their computers, phones, and xboxes would have a great affect on our kids and culture. I know this may be off the topic a bit but it might be one reason for the decline in participation in a lot of activities.

In my opinion the culture has changed kids quite a bit. I spent most of my childhood playing pickup games...football, baseball, basketball, etc. I don't see a lot of kids in packs playing sports together much. I see a lot of youth practices (team) but the unorganized "lets go play" doesn't seem to happen as much. Does this have an affect? I would think kids spending much more time on their computers, phones, and xboxes would have a great affect on our kids and culture. I know this may be off the topic a bit but it might be one reason for the decline in participation in a lot of activities.

It's an interesting question, and it's probably true that kids don't get together to play unorganized sports as much on the weekends as they used to, but when I was in grade school we had about a 20 minute morning recess and 30-35 minute lunch recess as well as P.E. for 45 mins in the afternoon. For me, that was enough time playing pick up basketball, football, soccer, etc. Enough that it would get repetitive and we'd move on to the next thing after a few weeks before circling back to whatever sport was our favorite (probably football). This was from 2000-2006 I think for elementary school. It really wasn't until college that I my friends and I started hanging out at the courts in our free time and playing pickup basketball since it was much easier to find enough people to play games with basketball than football or any other ball sport.

To get back to your question... Yes I think the shift to digital forms of entertainment have an affect on burnout or disinterest or whatever you want to call it. It's easy to lose track of time while playing video games. The rewards and incentives within games are spaced far enough apart to feel challenging and fulfilling but close enough together so you don't lose interest or get too frustrated. It's hard for real life to provide that same incentive structure as a well made video game. The environment is very well controlled even though the game designers make you feel like you have choices or free will.

However, I don't think the responsibility of recognition of spending too much time on a device belongs to the child. It's on the parents. Unfortunately, a lot of parents take the easy way out and put their kid in front of a TV, computer, or console instead of nurturing a curiosity and love of sport and the outdoors.