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MoPho wrote:Giant sells their SLR 0/1 disc brake wheel sets with 20H radial lacing on the front/ 24H cross lacing rear. I have a set I bought used for spare wheels and they are quite good, and reasonably priced

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This thread is about disk brake wheels. You should NEVER lace a disk brake wheel radially. It will not be able to withstand the torque created under braking.

This thread is about disk brake wheels. You should NEVER lace a disk brake wheel radially. It will not be able to withstand the torque created under braking.

Well talk to Giant about it, their engineers seem to think you can.

Edit: went and had a look, and they are radial laced on the non disc side and crossed on the disc side. 20/24 spokes. My Enve wheels are 24/24.

I'm not sure whether you realize but manufacturers could care less about longevity and strength because everyone is in the RAT RACE to save grams! Less spokes = less weight = opportunity to consumer wallet. Front wheel should be laced 2x with 24 spokes as bare minimum. Wheel builders recommend 28 spokes on front wheel.

Racing is a three-dimensional high-speed chess game, involving hundreds of pieces on the board.

mpulsiv wrote:I'm not sure whether you realize but manufacturers could care less about longevity and strength because everyone is in the RAT RACE to save grams! Less spokes = less weight = opportunity to consumer wallet. Front wheel should be laced 2x with 24 spokes as bare minimum. Wheel builders recommend 28 spokes on front wheel.

Except they are not that light, they do seem plenty strong, and for the $500 I paid for them, I am not too concerned about longevity (and it's not like spokes can't be replaced). And I'm not sure whether you realize but manufacturers are liable if they knowingly make an unsafe product

Regardless, there are wheels currently being built that don't conform to your claims, and I am sure there will be more to come.

mpulsiv wrote:I'm not sure whether you realize but manufacturers could care less about longevity and strength because everyone is in the RAT RACE to save grams! Less spokes = less weight = opportunity to consumer wallet. Front wheel should be laced 2x with 24 spokes as bare minimum. Wheel builders recommend 28 spokes on front wheel.

Except they are not that light, they do seem plenty strong, and for the $500 I paid for them, I am not too concerned about longevity (and it's not like spokes can't be replaced). And I'm not sure whether you realize but manufacturers are liable if they knowingly make an unsafe product

Regardless, there are wheels currently being built that don't conform to your claims, and I am sure there will be more to come. .

Manufactures are liable for what? You break spokes and get new ones, simple as that. This cost peanuts for manufactures to satisfy their customers. Everyone from the the road race scene is pushing the envelope to shave as many grams as they possibly can. You, as a consumer have a choice of wheels and first thing you look at is grams! Sure, you can get away with under build wheels with lower spoke count but you'd treat them as dedicated race wheels with low km/miles.

Racing is a three-dimensional high-speed chess game, involving hundreds of pieces on the board.

mpulsiv wrote:Manufactures are liable for what? You break spokes and get new ones, simple as that. This cost peanuts for manufactures to satisfy their customers. Everyone from the the road race scene is pushing the envelope to shave as many grams as they possibly can. You, as a consumer have a choice of wheels and first thing you look at is grams! Sure, you can get away with under build wheels with lower spoke count but you'd treat them as dedicated race wheels with low km/miles.

What are you on about?! You guys are saying that you CAN'T build disc wheels with 20 spokes, insinuating that it's not safe. If a manufacturer is knowingly building wheels that are unsafe they can be liable. Every Giant TCR disc and Defy is coming with these wheels, they are every day wheels not race wheels. PERIODIf your concern is merely about breaking a spoke every now and then, who cares?! I broke spokes on my rim brake wheels too

You, as a consumer have a choice of wheels and first thing you look at is grams!

Calm down. You could probably build a 10 spoke disc brake wheel if you went a bit out of the box designing it. What about a disc wheel with a disc brake, couldn't this count as a one spoke wheel? How about a three spoke aero wheel with a disc brake?

20h hubs designed for disc brakes are almost nonexistant (i'd love to see one ). For simplicity you could do 24h unless you wish to create something exotic.

An interesting discussion topic would be to compare the torsional force in a disc brake front wheel (hard braking) with a rear wheel (hard acceleration). Which one stresses the spokes the most? Extralite for example has determined that a fw hub should be 24h and rw hub 24/28h. Maybe it should be the other way around?

I plumped for Prime RP-38 with extra British Cycling 10% discount came in under £700. Weight is tad over 1600g, 38mm carbon rims and they run Novatech hubs. Very pleased with them. Easy to run tubeless and they roll very very well.