Haven't all studies ever actually shown that violence has DECREASED per capita? I mean, it's easy to see violence increasing if you just look at the numbers, but if you take into account that the POPULATION IS INCREASING, well, no fucking shit?

Regardless, the people doing the school shootings have been individuals (or a few individuals) that have been mentally unbalanced, and should have seen professional help.

I miss the days when people blamed demons when a person went right off the deep end and killed a bunch of people :/

My only experience with the army is that a boss at a former job started treating me like shit when I told him that due to my disability, I can't join. After that, he started giving me shit for every little thing I did.

Innegativeion:So what data is in direct contradiction of his assertions?

/Snip

I know I know. Correlations don't prove anything, but the burden of proof is on the accuser. The man blindly speaks nonsense.

You can't say based on that data that violent video games cause a decrease in violent crime. However, that data makes a very strong case that violent video games don't cause it to increase either.

Yes, that is exactly my point.

As I said the burden of proof is on the accuser, Mr. Grossnman in this case. He fails to even acknowledge that his conception of a world overboiling with violence due to video games... is flat out wrong, much less try to form a counter-counterargument.

TheDoctor455:I am well aware of Swift's 'Modest Proposal', and the difference here is that he spent a great deal of time working on that, while you only spent a few minutes at most.

And even then, some people took the suggestion seriously.

My apologies for not spending an extensive amount of time on an unpaid internet forum post in which brevity is an optimal trait. I was mocking the man's beliefs by holding them up to scrutiny, pointing out a possible line of thought, and bringing it to a conclusion. I hope you'll forgive me for not wanting to write a damned essay on the subject.

TheDoctor455:I am well aware of Swift's 'Modest Proposal', and the difference here is that he spent a great deal of time working on that, while you only spent a few minutes at most.

And even then, some people took the suggestion seriously.

My apologies for not spending an extensive amount of time on an unpaid internet forum post in which brevity is an optimal trait. I was mocking the man's beliefs by holding them up to scrutiny, pointing out a possible line of thought, and bringing it to a conclusion. I hope you'll forgive me for not wanting to write a damned essay on the subject.

*rolls eyes*

Ehh... fair enough.

However, you first comment wasn't taking the idiot's statements to their logical extreme precisely BECAUSE he was ALREADY going to the logical extreme. What you were doing came off as redundant to me more than anything else.

Plus, my point with the time Swift took with his satire is simply that one should think very carefully before attempting it.

You know its funny, you find out what actually drives violence if you don't just blame the first thing you see that you don't like.

Example: I've spent a portion of my life in the ghetto. Those kids get into gangs and commit a lot of violent crime. Why? I can tell you, its not the videogames - I've played way more violent videogames than a lot of the kids I knew that joined gangs. Its because their parents didn't give a fuck. Its because they were adopted into a group of criminals that made them feel wanted and at home. Of course, the criminals in charge were full of shit, using them as pawns, but they didn't know better. These kids just wanted what everybody wants - to be accepted and have somebody who actually gives a fuck about them.

Andy Chalk:"We cannot deter these people," he said. "All we can do is track them down and kill them."

He's a Lt. Colonel with some authority in favor of using kill squads and subverting the media's first amendment rights.

Allow me to properly freak out.

Here's something everyone should probably know at this point: The military defends Democracy. They do not practice it.

They don't defend democracy - they defend whoever gives them orders. Its why the military invests so much into indoctrination, into becoming "a warrior", into becoming distinct from the civilian population, to isolate you from them. I'm not saying that anybody is doing this with the intentions of evil, but its just that the military is focused less about on loyalty to a nation, to its peoples, or to its ideals, and more focused on loyalty to whoever is holding their leash.

I like the fire metaphor, because when we did everything we could to keep fires from happening, we just made them worse. Fire is a natural part of things. It happens, and nature can survive. When we stopped that from happening, fuel built up and up until a lightning strike or the spark from a random rock hitting another ignited it, and what would have been a few small controllable wildfires over a decade became one massive uncontrollable crown fire, which not only spreads further and causes more damage but also kills old growth that can endure a small wildfire.

Translation: Try to stop bad things from happening by blocking their release points and the inevitable explosion will be far, far worse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wildfire#Human_involvement :It was learned that suppression of fire in certain ecosystems actually increases the likelihood that a wildfire will occur and increases the intensity of those wildfires.

Also, Vice City is over ten years old. Someone who played it when he/she was five can now legally drive, and we haven't seen an increase in running over prostitutes. And bonus points for the "murder for peace" angle. That's a good one.

No, the disintegration of the family structure and disregard of parental responsibilities are whats to blame for rising murder rates. If there ARE any rising rates. Hasn't murder and violent crime as a whole actually gone DOWN over the years?

See that? That text in bold? That's why there are morons gunning for regulating M-rated games, because the parents are too friggin' lazy to do it themselves, even though there is a detailed rating system, for a medium that is far better regulated than any other.

People astound me sometimes...

Don't be ridiculous. Why would parents have any responsibility over what their children do in their spare time? Why should it be the parents' job to look at the explicitly clear age rating on the box and decide whether it's appropriate for their children? Why, that would imply such ridiculous notions such as that the parent had to, well... parent their children!

Excuse me if I wasn't being obvious enough with the sarcasm.

By the way, America really needs to adopt the idea of actually restricting games based on age. Even making sure shops can't sell Mature (or R18+ as it's called over here) and making the M label stand out more (again, bright red over here in NZ) would make a world of difference... Or maybe people would still insist that it's the game developers fault and not their's for ignoring the label, I don't know.

How come when ever one of these "here we go again" articles goes up there is always one reference to GTA? What's funny is compared to a lot of games GTA is rather limp in it's gore ... imagine the outrage if they found manhunt or postal!?

On the flip side (I'm ghetto), you have great story driven games (anything with bioware on it for example).

I would say that the amount of violent games is very high, outside of sports games (some of which are violent themselves) there are few games (relativity speaking) that aren't violent ... not saying violence is bad, just there is a lot.

What a jumped up Pratt. That's all I really have to say about this deluded man who seems to think he can spout groundless nonsense because he has "Credentials".I think if I ever met him I'd have trouble not falling into an "Insulting French Guard" routine

Never mind all the gun-toting lunatics, by this logic we're also going to have:-Crazy dictators and warlords scraping with each other because they played too much Age of Empires-Balls off the tea trolley walls drivers who have played too much Mario Kart-Sailors with an intense hatred of whales from playing Assassins Creed Pirate-Out of control street brawls with fighters dishing out flying spinning kicks and goddamn fireballs from too much Street Fighter-On the brighter side, a wave of brilliant pitch-perfect singers due to Singstar and the like.-Oh yeah, Angry Birds. Lots and lots of motherfucking angry birds with their avian flu and explosive eggs in the near future.

Oh wait, apparently GTA (a game which is actually mild compared to other games and TONS of movies) and COD (which actually deifies soldiers) are the ONLY FUCKING GAMES IN EXISTENCE if you believe these complete and utter out-of-touch MORONS.

"There is a generation of vicious, vicious killers out there," he said. "The videogames are their trainers. They've been playing Grand Theft Auto every spare moment since they were six years old."

Maybe I hung out with the wrong crowd or I'm simply too old, but frankly I don't know anyone that plays GTA much sure it's fun for a bit here and there, sure I bet there are a few people who really like the sandbox world but it's been done better since. When you Consider that minecraft has sold 20 Million + copies it shows that most are interested in exploring new worlds then they are in simple violence.

OT: "[...] and also claims on his website to be "the founder of a new field of scientific endeavor" known as "killology."" - This right here should be a clue to everyone just how batshit insane this Lt. Col. really is. If you claim expertise in a field that doesn't even exist, you deserve to be left in the dust and ignored by all media outlets, even your own fellow crazies.

They don't defend democracy - they defend whoever gives them orders. Its why the military invests so much into indoctrination, into becoming "a warrior", into becoming distinct from the civilian population, to isolate you from them. I'm not saying that anybody is doing this with the intentions of evil, but its just that the military is focused less about on loyalty to a nation, to its peoples, or to its ideals, and more focused on loyalty to whoever is holding their leash.

As somebody who grew up in a military household and has served in the military, carrying on a tradition that my family has performed for at least 4 straight generations. Let me respond by saying, "HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA you can't be serious." Your just as crazy if not crazier than this guy if you truly believe that. Most soldiers, are untrusting of their leadership and usually perform their "mission" in a capacity that gets the job done and everyone home. Seriously, do you like your boss, why should we like ours?

OT: This guy (The LTC, not you MarsAtlas) is crazy, please ignore and carry on with your lives.

I've never understood people like this. There are SO MANY other factors that go into violence in society. Even if video games were on the list, they would be the least of our worries. Don't you have more important things to focus on?