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Re: Confederate Flag

Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth

Well, it is entirely your choice to show that there was not a movement toward eliminating slavery written into the USC, or that the debate was not well in hand in the North after 1809...That would be proving me wrong.....instead of taking the easy way out by ironically engaging in accusations of politically based revisionism!
That is precisely my point, that is what allows you to ignorantly ask how the symbol causes issues between the races of the US.

Alexander Stephens:

Our new Government is founded upon exactly the opposite ideas; its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery, subordination to the superior race, is his natural and normal condition.

So... one guy said something dumb.....

How many people have said dumb things in the past decade that in 100 years will be viewed as abhorrent.

Re: Confederate Flag

Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth

Oh, I see, we are going to divert to the argument for perfection.

Hardly. I'm simply proposing you use the same standard and same amount of insight that is used on the Confederate Flag, now on the American Flag. Yet when I forced that to happen, the argument became "absurd". Why then couldn't someone have a valid view that the argument against the Confederate Flag was equally "absurd"?

Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth

That is cute. I view it this way, we are nation with the stated goal of equality under the law and have been working towards this goal. The Confederacy was not founded on that goal, in fact is was based on the opposite belief that Black are inferior to Whites. We should not endorse a system with that ideology.

Like I said, to you slavery trumps all and you're not willing to use that same insight and that same amount of criticism against the American Flag, which as I stated earlier, is viewed with just as much animosity and oppression as many view the Confederate Flag.

Apparently the way it's viewed is the calls for one flags removal is valid, the same view of the OTHER flag's removal is "absurd".

Re: Confederate Flag

Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth

My argument is not that since the US (or other nations) engage in war, we should end state sponsorship of our flag. The Confederate flag should have its state endorsement ended since it represents a slave based system. The current US flag (and the current US govt) is not representative of a system based on slavery.

If you want to call states of war "slavery", it is entirely your prerogative to do so, but I think it is absurd.

And the U.S. Flag represents raping, pillaging, looting, and burning cities of the south during the Civil War, WITH Approval from the Chief Executive, the Tyrant Abraham Lincoln.

Re: Confederate Flag

Originally Posted by Ockham

Hardly. I'm simply proposing you use the same standard and same amount of insight that is used on the Confederate Flag, now on the American Flag. Yet when I forced that to happen, the argument became "absurd". Why then couldn't someone have a valid view that the argument against the Confederate Flag was equally "absurd"?

The absurdity was the equating a govt based on slavery with a govt that goes to war. Those 2 things are very different.

Like I said, to you slavery trumps all and you're not willing to use that same insight and that same amount of criticism against the American Flag, which as I stated earlier, is viewed with just as much animosity and oppression as many view the Confederate Flag.

No, I do not see large segments of the US population wanting the US flag treated the same way as the Confederate BF.....but then I am not living in your arguments worl, so our mileage will vary.

Apparently the way it's viewed is the calls for one flags removal is valid, the same view of the OTHER flag's removal is "absurd".

Now you are conflating the 2 argument while still confused about what is the absurd comparison.

Originally Posted by Drumpf

"I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters."

Originally Posted by jaeger19

I am a medical provider. Try having the pressure of someones life in your hands.

Re: Confederate Flag

The absurdity was the equating a govt based on slavery with a govt that goes to war. Those 2 things are very different.

Both were war - they are not different.

Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth

No, I do not see large segments of the US population wanting the US flag treated the same way as the Confederate BF.....but then I am not living in your arguments worl, so our mileage will vary.

I didn't ask you your opinion on the US populations temperature on the subject - I'm asking why you cannot attribute the same critical views of both flags and why you deem one valid and the other absurd given a level playing field. So far, you haven't been able to answer the question.

Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth

Now you are conflating the 2 argument while still confused about what is the absurd comparison.

I'm not conflating anything but you are not apparently comfortable with using the same critical eye on both, which is interesting.

Re: Confederate Flag

Uh, no, it it commonly understood that slavery and war are in fact very different actions, it is absurd to equate them.

I didn't ask you your opinion on the US populations temperature on the subject

But that is the context of the whole thread, what is the view of the Confederate BF being an endorsed state symbol

- I'm asking why you cannot attribute the same critical views of both flags and why you deem one valid and the other absurd given a level playing field. So far, you haven't been able to answer the question.

I have in fact answered that, you have lost track....again.

I'm not conflating anything

Yes, in fact, you did.

but you are not apparently comfortable with using the same critical eye on both, which is interesting.

The same critical eye...on slavery.....and on war? Oh but I have, I understand they are very different things and not to be absurdly equated.

Originally Posted by Drumpf

"I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters."

Originally Posted by jaeger19

I am a medical provider. Try having the pressure of someones life in your hands.

Re: Confederate Flag

Um, that one "guy", the Confederate VP, was expressing the credo of the Confederacy, the ideology of the govt.

I don't give a rats ass about the Confederate Government as much as I care about the states having a right to leave a government that they no longer consent to govern them.

Which was supported by nearly all founding father's writings and politicians of the time up to such point as the government has a compelling interest to claim, after hundreds of thousands died in a bloody war, that secession was unconstitutional.