Dual Hotas---HELP

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Admiral

If interested in experimenting with dual stick then I highly recommend picking up Thrustmaster t16000.m, the last time I checked it was cheaper to buy them individually than in the twin pack.
You won't find sticks with better hall sensors for less than $200.
They're not perfect but at that price it doesn't hurt terribly to pick up one to two to experiment with too determine whether you like dual stick.

Hallucinogenic Owl

You should, I know you're worried about the flight model changes but even that'll be tweaked over time and different ships will still have different flight profiles so it'll be good to get used to things changing.

There is also one thing i like to add while i think that dual stick, with or without throttle, are probably the most immersive thing you can get its not always the best (best in terms of combat) input device. I actually prefer Dual sticks on small non gimbaled ships while i like HoSaM on larger gimbaled ones.
Gladius / Sabre - > fixed -> dual sticks
Freelancer, Starfarer -> gimbal -> Hosam

"Just for flying around": dual

Also if you decide later on to go the "cheap way" with t16000m you might want to add voice attack and/or elcato stream deck and/or some other stuff to enhance your input devices

If you're not shooting a gimbal, what are the advantages of a dual stick over a stick and throttle? My concern with the 16000s is the buttons are all off the stick itself, and I really like the X56 throttle's button placements.

Admiral

You can even use two (HOTAS or not) sticks, and a throttle body. They don't even have to be from the same manufacturer. In most configurations, that tends to use up real-estate you could otherwise use for your keyboard but if you mount things with that in mind you should be fine.

Grand Admiral

If you're not shooting a gimbal, what are the advantages of a dual stick over a stick and throttle? My concern with the 16000s is the buttons are all off the stick itself, and I really like the X56 throttle's button placements.

Grand Admiral

I appreciate all this, and congrats on the excellent racing!, but I still want to understand the advantage. Are you somehow both flying normal controls and straifing at the same time? You're obviously getting higher accelerations with twin sticks. What do you use the twin sticks for?

And if you're locking the gimbals on the Sabre, why not just replace them with fixed, bigger guns?

Grand Admiral

I appreciate all this, and congrats on the excellent racing!, but I still want to understand the advantage. Are you somehow both flying normal controls and straifing at the same time? You're obviously getting higher accelerations with twin sticks. What do you use the twin sticks for?

And if you're locking the gimbals on the Sabre, why not just replace them with fixed, bigger guns?

Well I should said fixed guns for that what it I use most but some time I use locked gimbals, depend a bit on what ship it is.
I only change guns on my primary dogfighter but not always, other ships I fly mostly stock guns.

How I use the dual stick combined with throttle..
Okay let see on my right stick I have jaw left/right nose, pitch up/down nose and role on the twist, then fire guns, missile, decouple, look back and targeting on top keys.
On left stick I have strafe froward/back push, left/right strafe push left/right and twist left strafe up and twist right strafe down, then on keys it's lock missile, afterburner, boost, landing gear etc..

Then on my throttle stick is the main thrust forward momentum combined with boost and afterburner when needed, that I use when casual flight.
Soon as I enter a more complicated flight as racing or dogfighting I put main thruster on throttle stick to 0 and fly exclusively using left stick for strafing thrust, strafing combined with boost and afterburner. On rare occasion I even use some throttle stick like leave it on 25-50% main thrusters so if I do let go of left stick I still carry momentum forward.
This is mostly used when I explore or searching and want to go slow but some time speed it up I combine them in many different ways dependent on what ship it is.

Where to put key assignment is where you find them most useful, I have focus on the keys I use most when flying, dogfighting, racing on top buttons on stick and on throttle.
The rest of keys I have on Thrustmaster MFD, Stream Deck button box I even use some buttons and switches on my racing wheel..

CHEERS!

Last edited: Jan 15, 2019

Get the info needed to have a opinion or the words you speak don't mean nothing.​

Yes with dual stick it allow you to use all direction independent or combined, that is the biggest advantage.

example: you can strafe a bit right and forward at the same time and strafe a bit down to using left stick as with your right stick you turn nose left with a bit of left role and down nose which would create a left down turning spiral circle. Using boost and afterburner can vary speeds on the different directions pushing more forward strafe then right will give more boost to forward etc. etc..

But keep in mind at this FM we have right now afterburner only effect main thrusters forward/reverse, boost only effect directional thrusters strafing in all directions.
Combining boost and afterburner with strafing can give you very high speed fast in almost any direction and as such also very fast stops and turns.

That is correct I do not use pedals since it's not a aircraft and the space ships have a lot more directions it can move so pedals for me just didn't work.
Tho I know some use it successfully, guess it's a personal feel thingy.

CHEERS!

Last edited: Jan 15, 2019

Get the info needed to have a opinion or the words you speak don't mean nothing.​

Hallucinogenic Owl

@Mich Angel and @marcsand2 , I'll be setting up my HOTAS and HOSAS this week in preparation to come out of SC hibernation.

Once again I feel I'll end up doing everything from scratch, as so much has changed. That being said, I may message one or both of you for some input on how to get Windows/SC to recognize all of my controllers. I seem to recall having an issue where only 2 of my 3 would be detected. We'll see if this holds true upon testing.

Admiral

@Mich Angel and @marcsand2 , I'll be setting up my HOTAS and HOSAS this week in preparation to come out of SC hibernation.

Once again I feel I'll end up doing everything from scratch, as so much has changed. That being said, I may message one or both of you for some input on how to get Windows/SC to recognize all of my controllers. I seem to recall having an issue where only 2 of my 3 would be detected. We'll see if this holds true upon testing.

Lateral and vertical Strafe!!! You fly towards the point where you nose is pointing. If you want to get around a target, then you must point your nose next to the target and fly past it, then turn your nose back to the target..... unless you can strafe lateral / vertikal. Keep your nose on the target while strafing around it.

Some people bind strafe sidewards and strafe forward/backward to the left stick, then the strafe stick replaces throttle. I prefer to bind left/right up/down to my strafe stick, but I also use throttle and rudder brake pedals.

Grand Admiral

@Mich Angel and @marcsand2 , I'll be setting up my HOTAS and HOSAS this week in preparation to come out of SC hibernation.

Once again I feel I'll end up doing everything from scratch, as so much has changed. That being said, I may message one or both of you for some input on how to get Windows/SC to recognize all of my controllers. I seem to recall having an issue where only 2 of my 3 would be detected. We'll see if this holds true upon testing.

Grand Admiral

Lateral and vertical Strafe!!! You fly towards the point where you nose is pointing. If you want to get around a target, then you must point your nose next to the target and fly past it, then turn your nose back to the target..... unless you can strafe lateral / vertikal. Keep your nose on the target while strafing around it.

That's what I'm talkiing about. So you can point your nose at the target and strafe right while you yaw left, and you essentially rotate around the target while keeping it in your sights. That's a brawler move! and exctly what I want. And if i understand, you can't do that effectively without a second stick? You can't bind the little top-hat joystick at the top of the main stick to strafe, or it is just not as precise/effective?