tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post4158098617918158718..comments2016-03-09T11:32:05.283-05:00Comments on GROGNARDIA: 150 Years is a LONG TimeJames Maliszewskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comBlogger46125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-54641760063291484862011-05-17T12:32:36.505-04:002011-05-17T12:32:36.505-04:00Referee: I think it has a lot to do with remaking ...Referee: I think it has a lot to do with remaking the world in our own image. When we&#39;re born, the world is given to us as a work of art provided by people who have gone before. With apocalypse, that world is set aside and we are given a <i>tabula rasa</i> on which to create our own vision. Certainly, that was the thinking behind TNE&#39;s &quot;Virus&quot; background event.<br /><br />Of course, it isn&#39;t quite that simple, but nothing ever is simple. Even when the old world is wiped away, there are still other people, each with their own vision, and all of our visions are derived from the things which have gone before. To me, that&#39;s actually a great deal of the interesting portion of postapocalyptic literature and gaming, the tension between what we think of as our selves, inviolate, and what we have developed from our past and from our present environment.<br /><br />Plus, we get to blow stuff up.faoladhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03691952430041394614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-39974233838208903552011-05-17T09:54:16.756-04:002011-05-17T09:54:16.756-04:00What fascinates me is our continual obsession with...What fascinates me is our continual obsession with Armageddon or Rupture in our times? I understood it when the threat of atomic warfare between the major powers was real - but even then I gravitated toward the light of Twilight 2000 - That we will survive and prosper. I think that was killed TNE more than anything else - the prospect of the Shining Future ending up in ashes.<br /><br />It is ironic how our culture is littered with counterposing the heroics of a space age and Armageddon. True, the same technology is used to achieve the same results but one is a symbol of hope and the other symbol of negation. I think RPGs inherently reflect this tension and since the 1970s we seem to marching down this road more and more.<br /><br />But, what is it about Armageddon? That is so appealing in the mindset? Is it the Christian End Times and hope for salvation as part of the elect. Or is it the nihilistic tendency triumphant? Lots of questions - few answers.<br /><br />I know that I am resurrecting a dead thread but only came back to your site after a sabbatical in which it caused me to do some more thinking of about the influence of mainstream culture into RPGs and other forms of popular entertainment.Refereehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13766356281154069754noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-70381576299676042732011-04-23T10:51:28.763-04:002011-04-23T10:51:28.763-04:00I think people are over thinking the issue. Of cou...I think people are over thinking the issue. Of course when GW first came out, no one really thought about the amount of work needed ongoing to keep cities and towns in order. Since the destruction in GW takes place in the future, better infrastructures and building supplies would keep things around a lot longer than 20th century material. <br /><br />But overall, have fun with it. If you can accept a two brained mutant bison, accept that the Empire State building may still be standing after a century or more of neglect.Jackleg2011https://www.blogger.com/profile/07664681322748122090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-2361394889948396982011-04-22T18:51:09.100-04:002011-04-22T18:51:09.100-04:00http://www.japanprobe.com/2006/03/20/nagasakis-bat...http://www.japanprobe.com/2006/03/20/nagasakis-battleship-island/<br /><br />Hashima Island off Nagasaki. Abandoned in 1974, people have been prohibited from setting foot on the island since.<br /><br />Lots of crumbling concrete buildings.Jon Hendryhttp://openid.aol.com/jonhendry2noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-56962060137365390772011-04-22T07:13:32.505-04:002011-04-22T07:13:32.505-04:00Hi,
My name is Kirsten Williams and I work with c...Hi,<br /><br />My name is Kirsten Williams and I work with content for calculatem.com http://www.calculatem.com/ . We are now conducting a campaign towards blogs and for that reason, I am trying to get in touch with the person in charge of content and ads primarily on blogs.<br /><br />Is that you, or is there someone else I should speak to? Thanks for your time.<br /><br />Regards,<br />Kirsten Williams. :)<br /><br /><br /><br />kirsten.williams@multiadsagency.comKirstenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04424677820823833487noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-8341878999170146472011-04-22T04:56:42.246-04:002011-04-22T04:56:42.246-04:00Pekka said: &quot;The ruins of Detroit...&quot;
A...Pekka said: &quot;The ruins of Detroit...&quot;<br /><br />And that photo of the abandoned library DID NOT HELP!!Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-32575265081097893992011-04-22T04:54:13.398-04:002011-04-22T04:54:13.398-04:00Eeeesh, anytime stuff like this comes up I think o...Eeeesh, anytime stuff like this comes up I think of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_Abides" rel="nofollow">&quot;Earth Abides&quot;</a> which is possibly the most stick-with-me terrifying book I ever read. Really bothered me (in its fairly straightforward naturalism).Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-84135488404208972562011-04-22T04:43:40.503-04:002011-04-22T04:43:40.503-04:00Entirely tangentially, there are a couple of reall...Entirely tangentially, there are a couple of really useful tools for people making post-nuclear settings:<br /><br />http://www.carloslabs.com/node/20<br /><br />http://www.nucleardarkness.org/nuclear/nuclearexplosionsimulator/<br /><br />Each implements a method of determining the blast radius, fallout, and such for nuclear strikes at any point that you can find on Google Maps.faoladhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03691952430041394614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-79281959111901208232011-04-22T03:19:32.103-04:002011-04-22T03:19:32.103-04:00At least the first edition of The Morrow Project (...At least the first edition of The Morrow Project (TMP) had a table in the back describing survival of buidlings depending on age, construction, maintenance, and of course nuclear explosions. I don&#39;t have a copy handy for examples.<br /><br />As I recall the various TMP published adventures, almost all of had very few ruins to explore (Ruins of Chicago and Prime Base excepted). Those that did, only actively maintained installations (The Starnaman Incident and Damocles) were in good working order. Otherwise, I only remember post-War construction with good buildings.<br /><br />Overall, I don&#39;t think TMP generally strains suspension of disbelief by having ruins or a very few surviving constructions. Even so, the dramatic potential of an &quot;Ozymandias moment&quot; is too good to ignore, as you point out above.Jay Duggerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10181402451119462976noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-70734439650532668932011-04-22T03:17:49.862-04:002011-04-22T03:17:49.862-04:00Exactly -Duralloy
One of the things that do need ...Exactly -Duralloy<br /><br />One of the things that do need to be considered when thinking about GW vs MP is that the GW world was ultra futuristic. <br /><br />Remember the premise for the Shadow Years in GW were the case of dangerous idle hands which hit humanity. Everything was (mostly) automated and I could easily see some aspects of civil infrastructure still being maintained after the war - until of course the machines start to break down/go insane, etc. <br /><br />The way I have run my GW game over the last (gasp!) 30 years is that most of the outskirts of the cities have been overgrown by forest, breached ag domes, and nature but as you start to hit the city centers there tends to me more ruins. I have a system for generating ideas on why a city fell, what weapons may have been used, where it was situated: these all factor into the final condition of the ruins, if they even exists at all.<br /><br />Factors to consider<br />1) Weapons used or reason city fell. Deathlands would be devoid of most organic life but some disaster/emergency civil machines and AI may still be functioning. <br /><br />2) Original environment/biosphere, ex: orig. temperate forested areas would be more quickly reclaimed than one that was built in an arid area<br /><br />3) Status of AI/TT/CI and functioning infrastructural system or broadcast power. Are they still working, partially or if not when did it collapse, etc.<br /><br />Anyway that&#39;s my two domars on the subjectWolf138https://www.blogger.com/profile/05062655417556496043noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-24303308738339576622011-04-22T00:49:59.586-04:002011-04-22T00:49:59.586-04:00When I played Rifts as a teen, I always thought ho...When I played Rifts as a teen, I always thought how much cooler the game would be without all the fantasy and dimensional elements to the game. Just the Coalition States.Mighty Veilhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13091153241917134322noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-89271412525865606092011-04-21T23:46:20.595-04:002011-04-21T23:46:20.595-04:00On the flip side, Troy, Machu Picchu et al provide...On the flip side, Troy, Machu Picchu et al provided interesting research possibilities hundreds and thousands of years after they were abandoned (to say nothing of the Roman catacombs and the like). <br /><br />Would these dead/abandoned cities resemble anything like a real city? <br /><br />No way. <br /><br />But there would be nooks, crannies, passages, tunnels, basements, and so on. It would be an interesting, albeit dangerous, place to explore.Stephen Simpson, CFAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12872161469696334548noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-20657158672425917722011-04-21T23:24:10.434-04:002011-04-21T23:24:10.434-04:00@Nilonim
&quot;Let&#39;s not forget that part of ...@Nilonim<br /><br />&quot;Let&#39;s not forget that part of the reason buildings and infrastructure need to be constantly maintained is due to the fact that they are in constant use; 150 years of weathering, will indeed result in damage but will not be the same as 150 years of constant use...&quot;<br /><br />Sorry to disagree, but I think your reasoning is flawed here. Sure, stuff gets used and that requires some upkeep, but thats considerably different from the sorts of things that happen when mother nature is allowed to take over the situation. Once a few windows in buildings get broken and rain water starts to get in it doesn&#39;t take very long at all for things to start rusting and cracking. If it happens to be in an area subject to freezing and thawing (winter) its even worse. Here in winnipeg we pretty much have to rebuild our road system every year...<br /><br />And when it come to big structures/buildings, they require a solid foundation to remain upright. If the structure near the bottom gets weak, the whole thing comes down.<br /><br />Life After Man is a great show...Donhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00323022731513484213noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-2496430218543904862011-04-21T22:47:24.902-04:002011-04-21T22:47:24.902-04:00Duralloy, you damned dirty apes! DURALLOY!!
Word ...Duralloy, you damned dirty apes! DURALLOY!!<br /><br />Word verification: ovater - Darth Vader&#39;s constantly pregnant sister...toddroehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05668825555921002430noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-51439930268449408832011-04-21T22:03:09.591-04:002011-04-21T22:03:09.591-04:00It&#39;s a tricky thing. You want enough time to ...It&#39;s a tricky thing. You want enough time to pass so population is back up a bit and those pesky mutants have time to multiply, but not so much as to completely lose the past. One thing that might help is that perhaps future building materials are even more resistant to the elements. Something to consider.<br /><br />Lazarus Lupin<br />http://strangespanner.blogspot.com/<br />art and reviewLazarus Lupinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13498179029332944165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-15494357341967250272011-04-21T21:17:11.207-04:002011-04-21T21:17:11.207-04:00Reading this post and the comments, I immediately ...Reading this post and the comments, I immediately thought of Ray Bradbury&#39;s short story, &quot;There Will Come Soft Rains.&quot; Y&#39;all all need to read it.<br /><br />And J.J. Abrams came up with the name <i>Cloverfield</i> because he needed to call the movie something, and that was the name on the exit sign he saw each day on his commute.Desert Scribehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13862907749003106864noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-27576405189491195122011-04-21T20:52:37.752-04:002011-04-21T20:52:37.752-04:00You should read the Aussie Scifi &#39;out of the S...You should read the Aussie Scifi &#39;out of the Silence&#39; (1919). In it we find a Civilization 75 million years gone...and what they did to safeguard the remnants of their civilization.yellowdingohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07343984729318655540noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-8286699962106527132011-04-21T20:40:09.280-04:002011-04-21T20:40:09.280-04:00Let&#39;s not forget that part of the reason build...Let&#39;s not forget that part of the reason buildings and infrastructure need to be constantly maintained is due to the fact that they are in constant use; 150 years of weathering, will indeed result in damage but will not be the same as 150 years of constant use. If anything, were a disaster to occur today, the only things remaining in realitivly good condition (natural disasters notwithstanding) would be things built in the later 19th/early 20th century. <br />I think part of the appeal of the ruined metropolises is that while they serve as &#39;dungeons&#39; of a sort, they also serve to evoke the roman ruins which dotted Europe and the near east in the dark ages/early medieval period and this is itself the inspiration of much fantasy gaming (the fallen empire trope found in so much fantasy). <br />@rcarbol - i think the process is even faster than several generations - look at Earth Abides where before the narrator is even dead the post-apocolyptic surviors are mythologizing the pre-lapsidarian AmericansNilonimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17631112372990712584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-9127621997828723802011-04-21T20:18:35.259-04:002011-04-21T20:18:35.259-04:00This type of thing actually bugged me a TONNE in f...This type of thing actually bugged me a TONNE in fallout 3.<br /><br />Here it is, 200 years after a civilization that only lasted 300 years itself (moving from muskets and sword to atomic AI and lasers in that time)..and DC looks like it was bombed out 10 years ago.<br /><br />200 years, and no real rebuilding work. 200 years and people are eating canned goods and using ammunition from before the war. 200 years and cars still have fuel cells to explode (no one salvaged them 150 years ago?)<br /><br />Fallout New Vegas set in the same time period was much better. A new republic with its own centenary on its way, produces its own goods, its own food and ammunition. <br /><br /><br />Because really, 200 years is enough time for another world civilization to emerge, nuke itself in another war, and start fresh a THIRD time.Zzarchovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07714805545939725730noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-90536707952070185222011-04-21T19:23:17.319-04:002011-04-21T19:23:17.319-04:00One of my favorite examples for both Gamma World a...One of my favorite examples for both Gamma World and Morrow Project was Gene Roddenberry&#39;s TV pilots for <i>Planet Earth</i> and <i>Strange New World</i>.<br /><br />Both are set in Post-Apocalyptic North America, where an advanced science team is trying to rebuild society. <br /><br />Planet Earth<br /><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planet_Earth_%28TV_pilot%29" rel="nofollow">Planet Earth TV Pilot</a><br /><br />Strange New World<br /><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_New_World_%28television_pilot%29" rel="nofollow">Strange New World</a><br /><br />Also, <i>Starman&#39;s Son</i> and <i>2441 A.D.</i> from Andre Norton. These were and remain strong influences for my post-apocalyptic games.D Collinshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15106807777418881710noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-54870142830980251402011-04-21T18:47:40.475-04:002011-04-21T18:47:40.475-04:00Any show with a Mok in it should be given as much ...Any show with a Mok in it should be given as much latitude as it wants. ;)Osskorreihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14408780872015323307noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-75283617726817801412011-04-21T18:17:28.159-04:002011-04-21T18:17:28.159-04:00The whole thing reminds me of a scene in Thundarr ...The whole thing reminds me of a scene in Thundarr the Barbarian, where Ookla the Mok found a 1,000 year old comic book lying in the streets of an old ruined city. Dose it make sense in real life: hell no! Dose it make sense for the show: hell yeah, cuz it %&amp;$#ing Thundarr!!! I see Gamma World in the same regards, and Jim Ward even notes that decay is relative to the desires of the Ref.<br /><br />Plus, the 20th century items found in the Treasure Charts seems to be a parody of the times, as I found a few movies references and some other unusual items in the list (the flattened tuba and &quot;pleasure orb&quot; are two recognizable items, if you seen the movies they came from).Malcadonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03111796978336546944noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-6607207283792060182011-04-21T17:03:24.842-04:002011-04-21T17:03:24.842-04:00I wouldn&#39;t be surprised if many of our cities ...I wouldn&#39;t be surprised if many of our cities were basically eradicated by firestorms, hurricanes, tornadoes, or earthquakes. After 150 years, I would expect very little to remain that would have any value or utility.<br /><br />And another vote for Life After People. Pretty cool.Joseph Browninghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16274622778419965618noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-72215155502018704462011-04-21T16:39:28.053-04:002011-04-21T16:39:28.053-04:00I have a soft spot for &quot;Life After People&quo...I have a soft spot for &quot;Life After People&quot; since they were kind enough to demonstrate the collapse of Trinity Dam, near where I grew up in Northern California. :-)Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04563075580066984380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-9645303751989512932011-04-21T16:23:22.198-04:002011-04-21T16:23:22.198-04:00I grew up in Las Vegas and remember being excited ...I grew up in Las Vegas and remember being excited when I watched Damnation Alley and they showed Vegas half-buried in the sand.<br /><br />I&#39;d expect New York to be a big tangled/flooded mess... from sinking, towers toppling into each other and storms coming in from the Atlantic... but I&#39;d expect someplace like Dallas to still have a recognizable skyline.knobgobblerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14737954661234574830noreply@blogger.com