If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Congratulations are in order to Vargas Turbo Tech as well as Cobb tuning and ProTuning Freaks for raising the bar as to what the BMW N54 inline-6 twin turbo motor is capable of. There are two platform records here the first of which it is important to note was achieved without methanol injection. There are certain tuners on the N54 platform that mask their ability to upgrade and control the stock fueling system and any fueling issues are "solved" by dumping in a ton of methanol.

Well, with no meth and the cars own fuel system (with High Pressure Fuel Pump tweaks courtesy of Vargas Turbo Tech) responsible for all the fueling 673 wheel horsepower was achieved in STD correction on a Dynojet. That is a record for horsepower on the platform without methanol injection and was done with a blend of MS109 fuel and 93 octane.

Meth injection was then added and the figures rose to 693 wheel horsepower. If more time was available for the parties involved including Josh at Cobb as well as Jake and Dzeeno at ProTuning Freaks the 700 wheel barrier likely would have been crossed. This will happen sooner rather than later now but this is still a major milestone and a new era the N54 is entering. The motor is finally starting to mature and although it is not on a comparable power level yet with the top BMW aftermarket options this is a huge step step forward for a platform that spent considerable time in limbo due to fueling and tuning issues.

It must be satisfying for all involved especially Vargas Turbo who was doubted by many early on due to being a fresh entrant on the N54 tuning scene with many fanboys blindly following another tuner providing a turbo upgrade. Vargas Turbo Tech, Cobb, and PTF have surprisingly quickly surpassed the results from a competing turbo kit that uses a single turbo setup and have done so without relying on meth injection band-aids. A true fueling upgrade is here as well as a turbo upgrade making some serious power and setting the standard.

Congratulations and much respect to all the parties involved, dyno graphs and videos are below.

For some reason when I posted I was thinking response and low end torque, you know, the feeling of engine response when you hit the gas.

So you were incorrect? Yep, glad you see that. Because a turbo can give you the rush of torque that makes it feel fast but doesn't give it the response of a high revving NA motor with ITB's. And not the flat curve either.

Originally Posted by V8Bait

Agreed, the S65 V8 shines for road racing. Power, torque, gearing (yes sticky, commonly overlooked in relation to engine RPM), and tuning make a car responsive to pushing the throttle down when it's in gear.

Yep, exactly what I said.

Originally Posted by V8Bait

But I also now know where you stand now. I don't think I've ever seen somebody so taken by the S54 and S65 in my life

The engineers who judge these motors seem to agree with me.

Originally Posted by V8Bait

So it makes sense why you would jump all over others for saying neither is gods gift to automotive enthusiasts. I mean you were contradictory in your article anyway, you say how the S65 is the last true M engine that was pure M, and then you say it was detuned from the factory stroke wise and used recycled V10 bits.

It's not a contradiction at all. It is the last true M motor. It also does use the S85 V10 parts and is not as good as it could be. I find the S54 more impressive. These are not contradictions at all. The S65 is the last motor to follow the TRUE M Philosophy.

Originally Posted by V8Bait

And you applaud iron blocks in the S54 and then applaud aluminum blocks in the S65.

I thought this was made quite clear? The iron block is applauded for its aftermarket strength and the change to the aluminum-silicon in the S65 is clearly identified as for weight saving reasons for road racing where the S65 has shown superiority to the S54. This is clearly mentioned, what's hard to understand?

Originally Posted by V8Bait

It's not worth spending my time debating this with you. Because in the end, you aren't interested in a debate or a discussion. You are interested in name calling.

It's name calling for me to reference articles, awards, and professional racing? I said you didn't know what you were talking about and on those points you in your own post just agreed with this. That wasn't name calling, it was accuracy, that you just supported.

It's a fantastic example of professional racing in a high stakes environment. It's not kiddie BS like strapping on an aftermarket blower, ok?

The M3 engine superiority comes from its superior design which doesn't need 5.5 liters to kick some serious ass in road course racing. Just like how the Porsche GT3 can do it with a six-cylinder.

It is BS racing as fake as the WWF. The ideal outcome for the promoters would be an all manufactures photo finish. They have come out & said as much. With restrictors & weight we should be able to get these cars within a 1/4 second of each other. They engineer weighted ballast & restrictor plates to do just that. Its just an engineered spectacle.

Why not just dress up a bunch of Chevy Volts in pretty custom bodies to look like BMW’s, Porsche, Corvettes etc. get photo finishes & save a lot of money. Works for NASCAR. Real racing would be open by induction, displacement & weight. Within that just run what you brung. Cubic inches have a quality all of their own that the Europeans have been emulating with the AMG 6.3 ect.

There is nothing wrong with a blunt instrument solid as an anvil that will run forever & crap on the high strung small displacement technical marvels. Except of course if you have a high strung tech marvel that is getting thumped by the blunt instrument. Hey lets change the rules the Yank Vettes are winning to much.

It will be interesting to see your car run whenever you manage to get it finished.

So then you understand that the different motors get different restrictors (or none at all) in order to equalize them. So you understand the comparison in that context is useless.

Unless you just want to argue and can't admit you're wrong, in which case you'll reply to this post with some more "points".

How is it useless when the BMW's got slowed down and have lower displacement? And there is a displacement cap to equalize it, not done solely by air restrictors. Sorry, you also mentioned that some don't even have air restrictors in the GT class which means you don't seem to know ALMS or how the regulations apply or have been changed.

I didn't realize the results were pre-determined, good point. Really, nice one!

Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory

The ideal outcome for the promoters would be an all manufactures photo finish. They have come out & said as much. With restrictors & weight we should be able to get these cars within a 1/4 second of each other. They engineer weighted ballast & restrictor plates to do just that. Its just an engineered spectacle.

They want to make the racing as exciting as possible and considering I just got back from a race in person I would say they have succeeded. It was incredible to watch the Z4's come from behind and take it.

Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory

Why not just dress up a bunch of Chevy Volts in pretty custom bodies to look like BMW’s, Porsche, Corvettes etc. get photo finishes & save a lot of money. Works for NASCAR. Real racing would be open by induction, displacement & weight. Within that just run what you brung. Cubic inches have a quality all of their own that the Europeans have been emulating with the AMG 6.3 ect.

These aren't Chevy Volts, this isn't Nascar, and the cars represent their production shape and production motors. This isn't DTM racing.

Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory

It will be interesting to see your car run whenever you manage to get it finished.

Because this has something to do with what? Engine response? Professional racing? Or just a left field negative comment?