A desktop version of Windows 10 for ARM-based chips may be in development

Is Windows RT coming back from the grave in a new form? Some recent support documentation from Microsoft shows that the company may be developing a version of Windows 10 for PC desktop users that will run on ARM-based processors.

The Audio Engine Core Test page on Microsoft's MSDN site lists, "Windows 10 for desktop editions (Home, Pro, Enterprise, and Education) ARM" as among the operating systems in its specs. It also shows a listing of "Windows 10 Mobile x86", which may confirm that the company could release a version of the mobile OS that will run on x86 processors made by companies like Intel.

However, it's the Windows 10 ARM desktop listing that's more interesting. Microsoft launched another ARM-based OS, Windows RT, alongside Windows 8 in 2012, which was used for their first Surface tablet, among other products. However, the OS couldn't run any legacy Windows programs like Windows 8 could, and that limited its apps considerably. Microsoft chose not to offer a full update to Windows 10 for Windows RT-based devices.

As Petri notes, it's possible Microsoft could offer an emulator for Windows 10 ARM desktop users that can run older x86-based apps. However, there's also the question of how well they would run in an emulator.

A desktop version of Windows 10 for ARM-based chips may be in development

I'm confused. I did a search for fir Windows 10 on Arm to see if there were known issues with specific wifi adaptors. I have access to an Arm based msi netbook that previously had Windows 7 on it. I successfully updated it to Windows 10 Pro 32 bit and it runs fine albeit a little slow (1gb Ram). Only issue, Qualcom Atheros wifi is flaky. Am I missing something?

Surely this wouldn't be too difficult to create for them given that Windows 10 with Desktop & start menu on ARM already exists through Windows 10 Mobile with Continuum. They have most of the pieces there already, only it would be limited to Universal apps or virtualised apps.

How is autodesk going to compile their Autodesk software into this ARM device? Is Microsoft finally going to open Visual Studio to make software companies compile their code and allow ARM to run win32 libraries (dll and exe)?

If that is true, then its a homerun for Microsoft

If not, then its going to have the same issues that the Surface RT had and it will be a writedown of billions, impacting Microsoft's finances.

I agree. Bad strategy. This only has a potential if the store apps gets anywhere near the offerings of a Win32 app. I think they should create their own chipset for their ARM devices and not go with the conventional sources like the B.S Snapdragon chips.

Microsoft is trying to demonstrate to their competitors they can upgrade older models . And that thing with 1 billion devices. They want to make the noes arc . Bring it all on board. Think about wp 7.8 devices.

That's why they're fixing their OneCore subkernel before proceeding the development again. Once their subkernel is fixed and optimized (and yeah, their bug's nest), they will start adding features and killing remaining bugs around their system.

AMD just released ARM server processors. OneCore runs Windows 10. OneCore works on ARM, x86, etc... Just a matter of time before PC's have ARM SOC's in them. Screw legacy apps. Universal Apps are the future for devs.

I don't think it's exactly this, but I am sure it's part of the Windows 10 everywhere... let's be real, there is already Windows 10 and continuum. how is that not a part of this? Microsoft is trusting on universal apps to grow and become better, besides the bridges. even win32 to store sounds good. So I am sure it's just to make Windows Mobile more like Windows desktop, and Windows desktop more like Mobile. One Core and happy life, almost same OS everywhere, but "same" apps. and bridges that would fill many gaps that Windows RT failed at.

I am also one of those who would love a surface rt update. I still feel that I could have lived with only universal apps. I have a laptop and a desktop if I need full blow programs. I was and still am quite content with the way the surface rt is. I just like windows 10 so I would like Windows 10 in some form on the surface.

Folks MS CEO Nadella and Other Microsoft heads have to find out why some developers are not making apps for Windows 10 devices and eliminate these obstacles. Worst comes to worst Microsoft should hire new programmers an make apps for their own devices. After all Microsoft is Primarilly a software company. They can make great soft ware for their own products and other folks products. All Microsoft smart phones and Tablets that use ARMS CPU's have gotten lousy responce from some leading developers since Windows 7 smart phones came out.I am not Radical when i think Microsoft should make an Intel CPU x86 smart phone that can run all it's windows 10 current and future Desktop computer Windows 10 store Apps and Microsoft's NEW Universal apps and also run some of the Millions of Desktop PC programs that an Intel x86 CPU smart phone chipset can run well.this is Microsoft's best bet in mobile

It makes sense, just take all the best parts of Windows RT, Windows Phone 8/8.1, and Windows 10 IoT along with Project Centennial to run classic Win32 apps to make a fully-functional desktop version of Windows 10 for ARM chipsets. The bigger question is whether anyone will buy a redux of Windows RT this time around.

This makes Continuum sound even better as a possible desktop dual-boot solution for phones. It also gives a Surface Phone more for chip manufacturers, not having to solely talk with Intel, and lets the next line of Qualcomm-based Lumias possibly get into the party for running desktop software.

To me it's the x86 for mobiles that's more interesting. We've seen RT and it didn't make it. Maybe they'll reinvent it. But the true game changer might be the mobile x86 connected with a truly powerful phone hardware. That would be the ultimate personal computer.

I'd buy that for a dollar. Not sure this is worth MS's development time in terms of resurrecting the old Surface RT or Nokia tablets (and the few other RT-based devices out there), as there weren't many on the market to begin with. Then again, with the stated goal of 1 Billion devices running Windows 10 MS may be looking to add anyone they can. Personally I'd love to get my SurfaceRT back in the mix as a daily driver instead of it's current role of bedroom Netflix/newsreader. But I think this development path is likely looking forward as a means to bring new ARM devices to market en masse.

Seems pretty straight forward to me. An average consumer will never know the difference between the processors (I have many friends with AMD laptops that don't know what an AMD chip is), so as long as the bridge works properly (and we already know the amazing feats that they pulled off with Astoria), it won't be a big deal.

Not anymore, dude. Now, Windows 10 will be pretty much like Android, while they're in the different kernel (Windows is x86 based and Android is ARM based), they can emulate the different architecture to run on their own (ex. Windows 10 ARM will run x86-based programs, and Android can run ARM-based apps with their Intel x86 CPU).

ARM & Intel use almost the same instruction size in 32 & 64 bit modes so there is minimal difference in program size. But while running there is considerable difference -> most operating memory is pointers, which on 64 bit systems are twice larger than 32. If you're not convinced or studied system architecture, look at the windows min requirements:

Depends on the phone/tablet. For things like the HP Stream or Lumia 550, I probably wouldn't notice a difference. For my Lumia 950, I wouldn't really do anything different, just better. 64-bit allows for better stability, more channels for (theoretically) doing the same thing faster (processing huge amounts of data from the camera comes to mind), and better encryption. Nothing mind blowing, but they'd help.

You know the differences between processing numbers in Excel 32-bit and 64-bit one using =POWER(2,50) right? That's another reason of 64-bit OS is required, because 64-bit can do more complex computation where 32-bit CPU can't, thanks for a wider data bandwidth available.

The Surface RT/2 ran a processor with an ARM architecture, while these compute sticks are x86. So basically, you could have a super high end tablet with 128GB of RAM and 56TB of storage, and they still couldn't run Windows 10

Licensing restrictions. I'll admit to not being an expert in commerce and law, but I believe the technical reason that they can't upgrade it from Windows RT to W10M is because it's impossible to just buy a license for W10M, so technically, Microsoft has no way to license it to themselves.
There's also the fact that that requires flashing the BIOS and putting high quality drivers for the Tegra 3 and 4 in W10M. That's honestly a lot of work for a product that didn't sell well.

I personally have an original Surface RT, but I'd put Surface 2 in that category too. And then, of course, there's the Nokia equivalent device as well that I know was well-liked by some, but is fast becoming more and more of a door stop since many applications are moving to Universal apps, which don't run on 8.1...

First of all that is quite interesting. I hadn't thought that they would attempt to port App-V to ARM, but given the article and your comment I kinda get to thinking that might actually be what they are doing. That would also explain why Project Centennial is taking so long. I mean if they were just making small adjustments to App-V on x86, it shouldn't really be taking so long. It might also be related to some of the changes made to the OneCore in the latest build.

If they could ensure that any .appx packaged win32 app would be runnable in a virtualization container, regardless of processor architecture, even ARM, that would be really powerful. One challenge, of course, is that virtualization would require a lot of processing power, which is why I would be concerned if they could make it run on older Surface tablets.

This makes me think that we are going to see the death of Windows 10 Mobile too. I mean once they have "big brother" (get the wordplay?) Windows run on ARM, then little brother (or sister) won't be needed, just as long as they make sure that the big brother UI will adapt to phones. Now think of what Continuum would be like when you connected your phone (or ARM based HDMI stick) to a big screen. You could have FULL desktop. Pretty exciting if true. I'd also like to see a remote control friendly UI for when a running on an HDMI stick. This could even be what would be running the rumored entertainment only Xbox smaller sibling.

Btw. just a disclaimer for those that got (or didn't get) the wordplay: I do not believe that Microsoft is spying on and selling all of your private data, it was just a sarcastic pun. There, now I went and ruined it, but it's that or troll food.

Could not agree more, although I don't think Windows 10 Mobile will go away that quickly... Remember, Windows 10 Mobile runs on both ARM *and* x86. That's really useful for lower spec devices, including those of the Intel variety that would struggle with the non-Mobile version of Windows 10. Honestly, I would completely settle for Microsoft relaxing their seemingly arbitrary 8-inch maximum screen size for Windows 10 Mobile, particularly now that we have Continuum. While I know not everyone would like this option, but I would personally *love* to be able to install Windows 10 Mobile onto my original release Surface RT.

Actually, if you read the source article, you'd know that the listing for someone that worked on the x86 to ARM JIT was lists working on it over 2 years ago. Plus, this "they couldn't think of that" argument is silly. Hindsight is 20/20.

This is true however taking it at face value and not architecture value, I would love a amd dual core cpu with their compute cores for the gpu with their 3d memory modules. Basically say an A6 chip in a phone

AMD64 doesn't mean a "64-bit CPU" in general. AMD64 is the common name of the 64-bit version of x86 instruction set, called x86-64. There are some other 64-bit cpu arch like PowerPC, MIPS and even a [Intel] IA-64 (but abolished in favour of AMD64). And afaik there's an arm64 too. :)

But let's see: if Windows 10 ARM will be released sometime in the future, those who are left behind with Win10-like start menu UI on Windows 8.1 can also be upgraded -- if their hardware is supported, though.