And he will almost certainly die prematurely from either accelerated cardiovascular disease, cancer or emphysema. This, in addition to the adverse health affects on those he lives and works with.

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That's assuming he made it back from Iraq and that he keeps on smoking.

The problem is that smokers become addicted and smoke too much. I'm not convinced that smoking in moderation is terrible for your health. Pipe smokers for instance live longer than non-pipe smokers, though it is likely that this is not due to pipe smoking but a result of the type of people who smoke pipes.

I live in coastal California, so I don't see much smoking. The only thing that is considered hip to smoke out here is marijuana. Somehow the pot smokers don't think it is bad for their health.

I only smoke three or four cigars a year, so I'm not worried that I'm harming my health in any statistically significant way.

That's assuming he made it back from Iraq and that he keeps on smoking.

The problem is that smokers become addicted and smoke too much. I'm not convinced that smoking in moderation is terrible for your health. Pipe smokers for instance live longer than non-pipe smokers, though it is likely that this is not due to pipe smoking but a result of the type of people who smoke pipes.

I live in coastal California, so I don't see much smoking. The only thing that is considered hip to smoke out here is marijuana. Somehow the pot smokers don't think it is bad for their health.

I only smoke three or four cigars a year, so I'm not worried that I'm harming my health in any statistically significant way.

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That's BS! Any amount of tobacco, in any form, increases the risk of numerous diseases, especially cancers of the mouth and throat. Marijuana doesn't contain nicotine, or any of the numerous other toxic chemicals contained in cigarette tobacco during curing. Cigar and pipe tobacco is less dangerous, but, still very dangerous. You think pipe, cigar and moderate smoking is safe. Go for it, in the privacy of your home with your family. No skin off my nose.

But, we are not all going to die "prematurely," and cause those around us to die prematurely, because we are foolish enough to become addicted to a highly toxic, dangerous, drug.

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My quibble with this perspective is that tobacco isn't highly toxic. That's why it makes such a good drug, unlike say meth, though not as good as coffee. If you can constantly suck on cigarettes for 40 years straight before it kills you, by definition that isn't a highly toxic drug - that's a mildly toxic drug.

The idea that second hand smoke, especially from someone smoking outdoors say on another tennis court, is going to kill you or seriously harm your health seems mostly fantasy. The problem with smokers is that they tend to stink.

But, we are not all going to die "prematurely," and cause those around us to die prematurely, because we are foolish enough to become addicted to a highly toxic, dangerous, drug.

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This notion of a "premature" death is ridiculous. It suggests you're going to die before you're "ready", except noone wants to die before they're ready.

And quite frankly, I don't hear anyone verbally lynching a group about having to breathe in charcoal smoke from the neighbors barbecue, CO gas while sitting at a traffic light, forest fires, the scent of fried junkfood as they pass a mc donald's, or anything else that is a short term annoyance. Leave everyone who is not you, alone to live how they please.

This notion of a "premature" death is ridiculous. It suggests you're going to die before you're "ready", except noone wants to die before they're ready.

And quite frankly, I don't hear anyone verbally lynching a group about having to breathe in charcoal smoke from the neighbors barbecue, CO gas while sitting at a traffic light, forest fires, the scent of fried junkfood as they pass a mc donald's, or anything else that is a short term annoyance. Leave everyone who is not you, alone to live how they please.

BTW, your right to live how you please ends at my nose, and eyes. Equating the smell of fried food to the smell of burning cigarette smoke is equally idiotic.

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No, you argue that breathing in smoke from some guy for 4 minutes is deffinitely going to give you health problems. That is simply untrue and you know it. Ocasionally breathing in second hand smoke is an annoyance, and something you can completely control simply by walking away.

No, you argue that breathing in smoke from some guy for 4 minutes is deffinitely going to give you health problems. That is simply untrue and you know it. Ocasionally breathing in second hand smoke is an annoyance, and something you can completely control simply by walking away.

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That's a lie, otherwise known as a strawman, that you manufactured to argue against, since you can't argue against my actual premises. I never argued anything of the kind.

And, BTW, if someone is smoking near me, I'm not the one who is going to walk away. He is.

Really?? What then, were you implying with: "But, we are not all going to die "prematurely," and cause those around us to die prematurely, because we are foolish enough to become addicted to a highly toxic, dangerous, drug."?

That nonsmokers are going to die "prematurely" of something else? I don't think so...

Really?? What then, were you implying with: "But, we are not all going to die "prematurely," and cause those around us to die prematurely, because we are foolish enough to become addicted to a highly toxic, dangerous, drug."?

That nonsmokers are going to die "prematurely" of something else? I don't think so...

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Another lie, another strawman to argue against since you can't argue against my actual premises. I never expressed, nor implied, that non-smokers can never die prematurely. I said that smokers will die prematurely, for one reason, or another.

That's a lie, otherwise known as a strawman, that you manufactured to argue against, since you can't argue against my actual premises. I never argued anything of the kind.

And, BTW, if someone is smoking near me, I'm not the one who is going to walk away. He is.

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< If you were there first, I can't imagine any decent person not willing to be the one to move away from you. If I were a smoker and was there first, I'd love to see you try to force me to move.

"And he will almost certainly die prematurely from either accelerated cardiovascular disease, cancer or emphysema. This, in addition to the adverse health affects on those he lives and works with."

Right there, you imply that those he lives and works with will develop health issues as a result of being around him. A false statement since you cannot predict whether or not he smokes around these people.

"But, we are not all going to die "prematurely," and cause those around us to die prematurely..."

< If you were there first, I can't imagine any decent person not willing to be the one to move away from you. If I were a smoker and was there first, I'd love to see you try to force me to move.

"And he will almost certainly die prematurely from either accelerated cardiovascular disease, cancer or emphysema. This, in addition to the adverse health affects on those he lives and works with."

Right there, you imply that those he lives and works with will develop health issues as a result of being around him. A false statement since you cannot predict whether or not he smokes around these people.

"But, we are not all going to die "prematurely," and cause those around us to die prematurely..."

No, you argue that breathing in smoke from some guy for 4 minutes is deffinitely going to give you health problems. That is simply untrue and you know it. Ocasionally breathing in second hand smoke is an annoyance, and something you can completely control simply by walking away.

If you feel I somehow am wrong for arguing against a statement you most deffinitely made, feel free to clarify. Trolling the thread, denying that you said something when it is clear to anyone you did, isn't going to help your argument. The fact is, you implied being around someone who is smoking will cause you health issues, and a "premature" death.

If you feel I somehow am wrong for arguing against a statement you most deffinitely made, feel free to clarify. Trolling the thread, denying that you said something when it is clear to anyone you did, isn't going to help your argument. The fact is, you implied being around someone who is smoking will cause you health issues, and a "premature" death.

Another lie, another strawman to argue against since you can't argue against my actual premises. I never expressed, nor implied, that non-smokers can never die prematurely. I said that smokers will die prematurely, for one reason, or another.

Dying from cancer, emphysema and heart disease isn't a very enjoyable way to live your life.

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The first bolded word is part of the definition of "strawman", since you brought up that subject...

Your second bolded word is in fact inaccurate, but even if it were true, since even you agree that statistically plenty of folks die "prematurely", smoker or not, so it would fall into the category of: "true but of little importance".

Listen, everyone born after 1930 gets it: smoking has risks. What has been proven again and again is that citizens who don't spend effort in the area of risk assessment, do a very poor job of comparing risks between subjects.

Saying: "smoking is risky" is an empty statement. Saying: "smoking a cigarette is more dangerous than living in NYC for 2 days (in 1979) or living in Denver for 2 months", is making a statement that has some context. BTW it is also untrue, of the three, smoking the cig would be the least dangerous...

The first bolded word is part of the definition of "strawman", since you brought up that subject...

Your second bolded word is in fact inaccurate, but even if it were true, since even you agree that statistically plenty of folks die "prematurely", smoker or not, so it would fall into the category of: "true but of little importance".

Listen, everyone born after 1930 gets it: smoking has risks. What has been proven again and again is that citizens who don't spend effort in the area of risk assessment, do a very poor job of comparing risks between subjects.

Saying: "smoking is risky" is an empty statement. Saying: "smoking a cigarette is more dangerous than living in NYC for 2 days (in 1979) or living in Denver for 2 months", is making a statement that has some context. BTW it is also untrue, of the three, smoking the cig would be the least dangerous...

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OK, you have no idea what you're talking about. You don't know what a strawman is. But that's fine, I didn't bring it up for you. It was for any intellectually honest readers who might come across this thread. Worse, your a habitual liar. You just make s**t up as you go along.

OK, you have no idea what you're talking about. You don't know what a strawman is. But that's fine, I didn't bring it up for you. It was for any intellectually honest readers who might come across this thread. Worse, your a habitual liar. You just make s**t up as you go along.

Same here in Brazil. In some regions, the addicts have to go outside if they want to smoke their crap. It's humiliating.

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First of all, nicotin addiction is considered a disease (ICD F17.* I would guess without looking it up), like diabetes, arthritis or any other. so there's absolutely no need to mock over these people. Would be much better to accept them being a patient and not some inferior being.

second, the best way to live a long and satisfying life would be to show some composure and let other people live like they want. Trying to always be the better person can be exhausting and pretty annoying to others.

I can't stand it, there is someone who had a habit of smoking near the courts... And one day I had trouble breathing while I was playing. Long story short, he said 2HS was to blame and diagnosed me with exercise induced bronchospasms and had me use an inhaler. They should think about other people.

I can't stand it, there is someone who had a habit of smoking near the courts... And one day I had trouble breathing while I was playing. Long story short, he said 2HS was to blame and diagnosed me with exercise induced bronchospasms and had me use an inhaler. They should think about other people.

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Unless it was an indoor court it's extreme unlikely you inhaled a dose of SHS big enough to cause you trouble. Ever heard about stress-induced asthma? Maybe you just got agitated so much b/c you seem to hate and fear nicotin, that your lungs responded with spasms.

These numbers aren't very comparable. Counting war deaths is a straightforward enterprise compared to trying to estimate smoking deaths which is based on limited statistical samples and questionable statistical models.

Evidence seems to show that smoking is bad for your health - hardly a new idea. However, the smoking death statistics are mostly an estimate as smoking isn't listed as a cause of death. Originally, the CDC didn't release their data set or model as to how they calculated the famous or infamous 400,000 number. Hopefully that has changed.

A big problem for these estimations is that smoking strongly correlates with socio-economic class in the US which also correlates with a bunch of seemingly poor health choices. Separating out the true cause isn't something that you can necessarily do with statistical analysis.

Where I live in Vancouver, BC Canada there is no smoking indoors in public places & a $500 fine for smoking in a park... I love it. As a former smoker I will cross the street when I see the smokey death wafting in front of me ;-)

Where I live in Vancouver, BC Canada there is no smoking indoors in public places & a $500 fine for smoking in a park... I love it. As a former smoker I will cross the street when I see the smokey death wafting in front of me ;-)

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way too extreme.
You "inhale" so many toxins daily that passing by a smoker on the street will absolutely not affect your health, except that you can smell it which triggers your extreme reaction.
If they changed the smell of it and made it more poisonous, you would not even notice it...until they put the Ads all over the place (just like what happened with the Tobacco stuff...)

way too extreme.
You "inhale" so many toxins daily that passing by a smoker on the street will absolutely not affect your health, except that you can smell it which triggers your extreme reaction.
If they changed the smell of it and made it more poisonous, you would not even notice it...until they put the Ads all over the place (just like what happened with the Tobacco stuff...)

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Only if you are a smoker... I have some liquid poison to inject when your ready {holds out a needle}. There is enough poison in the world thank you ;-)

I can only laugh about the hysterical way North-Americans deal with tobacco nowadays.

Smoking forbidden outside? But noone cares about lying on the beach next to a 4-lane-road all day, all month, all year. Inhaling all the good stuff produced by the cars, combined with dust particles from the road surface (highly toxic). But it would be impossible to WALK a few meters to the beach, instead build a road next to it, so we can park the car within 10 feet of our beach towels. Seen on multiple locations in the States, last in Ft. Lauderdale.

No misunderstanding, I absolutely love the USA, but sometimes you guys are just killing me.

Smoking is so rare these days that when you pass someone smoking it feels like an attack on your capacity to breathe, even in public spaces.

And I'm not a big fan of the noise and dirt from automobiles and I wouldn't sit anywhere near one if it could be helped.

Before its even a question of health its one of the way smoke invades your body without it being in the least desired.

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Rare where???
I am in Tokyo now, went to a restaurant and asked for a non-smoking table. They took us to a "special" section that has 3 tables, behind the walls. The rest of the restaurant is smoking...

I don't know what's happening in Tokyo and there is always a certain fashionability about smoking amongst the young on the bar and nightclub scene.

But its pretty rare given that in some countries smoking rates are below 20% of the adult population.

The collapse of communism caused an epidemic of drunkeness and the current great recession in the US is also shortening life spans, so economic crisis and forms of risky behaviour are probably correlated.