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Sony: don't play old games anymore buy new ones.

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I hate to be the bore here... but does anyone actually play PS2 games on PS3? Aside from hardcore gamers who, chances are, have a PS2?

Except for downloadable free demos, that's all I play on my PS3 so far. I have a huge backlog of PS2 games, the upscaling and smoothing works great on my TV, and it's nice to have wireless controllers with bluetooth range.

What prompted me to get a PS3 was that I finished my garage and put a TV in there. Of course, a TV needs a DVD player, and if I'm gonna play DVDs, why not games? So I committed to spending the extra $75 for a PS2. Well, as long as I had my wallet out, why not a PS3? I lucked into the Sony card deal which let me get one for a bottom line price of $350. Figured I could eBay off my free Blu-rays for $50 (I've got four TV+DVD players in my house, plus another in the car. Movies that will only play in the livingroom won't fly), so the extra budget for the PS3 came in at $225. Knowing that it could be my last chance at getting an EE-chipped system, I went for it.

It may not be for everyone, but thinking of it as a high-def PS2 works for me. I still get a taste of the latest and greatest with the free demos, and have a huge selection of great games with the PS2 library.

It's funny. I found that there's a certain threshold where the graphical detail ceases to matter to me. I think it is most illustrated in the difference in appearance between GTA: Vice City and GTA: San Andreas. One looks appalling, the other is just fine. I find the graphics in the later PS2 titles to be plenty good enough.

So there's the point of view from someone for whom BC was absolutely essential.

Ratchet and Clank along with that FPS who's name I can't even remember...which doesn't bode well. I sure as shit knew the name of Heavenly Sword and Lair, both of which I was close to PS3 buying before the reviews hit. Uncharted! It came to me. It sounds like it will be a really solid game but it just doesn't appear to be drawing the attention needed to be considered a killer app.
Oh and there is the 3rd party FPS called Haze that has some buzz around it. Things are not looking up for the PS3 this Christmas. Especially with the $50 cheaper 360 being packaged with two really good games.

Assassin's Creed and CoD4 will both co-release on the much larger install base 360 as well, so I wouldn't consider those "killer apps" for the PS3....and if Haze, Ratchet and Clank, Kane and Lynch and Uncharted is all the PS3 has....wow, this is going to be a brutal season for Sony.

Assassin's Creed and CoD4 will both co-release on the much larger install base 360 as well, so I wouldn't consider those "killer apps" for the PS3....and if Haze, Ratchet and Clank, Kane and Lynch and Uncharged is all the PS3 has....wow, this is going to be a brutal season for Sony.

By that logic, all 360 has is Mass Effect.

Those are all games that will be available on the PS3 by christmas. Oh and they look good. R&C is getting decent scores across the board and Uncharted is getting good previews as is haze.

Assassin's Creed and CoD4 will both co-release on the much larger install base 360 as well, so I wouldn't consider those "killer apps" for the PS3....and if Haze, Ratchet and Clank, Kane and Lynch and Uncharged is all the PS3 has....wow, this is going to be a brutal season for Sony.

By that logic, all 360 has is Mass Effect.

Those are all games that will be available on the PS3 by christmas. Oh and they look good. R&C is getting decent scores across the board and Uncharted is getting good previews as is haze.

The 360 already got it's system seller app for the year, Halo 3....which will continue to sell consoles all the way through Christmas. If you think R&C is going to be a system selling app, I think you are seriously overestimating R&C. I am sure most PS3 owners will buy it, but Sony needs to sell consoles. I am sure R&C is going to be a great game, but lets be serious here...no one is going to go "Oh snap, I need to buy a 500 dollar PS3 to play Ratchet and Clank".

Assassin's Creed and CoD4 will both co-release on the much larger install base 360 as well, so I wouldn't consider those "killer apps" for the PS3....and if Haze, Ratchet and Clank, Kane and Lynch and Uncharged is all the PS3 has....wow, this is going to be a brutal season for Sony.

By that logic, all 360 has is Mass Effect.

Those are all games that will be available on the PS3 by christmas. Oh and they look good. R&C is getting decent scores across the board and Uncharted is getting good previews as is haze.

The 360 also had a few other titles that came out a month or so ago, namely Bioshock and some game called Halo 3.
Whereas the PS3 got... Lair and Heavenly Sword...
Yeah sorry, but no one in their right mind would pay more money to play less fun games... or the same games.

Assassin's Creed and CoD4 will both co-release on the much larger install base 360 as well, so I wouldn't consider those "killer apps" for the PS3....and if Haze, Ratchet and Clank, Kane and Lynch and Uncharged is all the PS3 has....wow, this is going to be a brutal season for Sony.

By that logic, all 360 has is Mass Effect.

Those are all games that will be available on the PS3 by christmas. Oh and they look good. R&C is getting decent scores across the board and Uncharted is getting good previews as is haze.

The 360 already got it's system seller app for the year, Halo 3....which will continue to sell consoles all the way through Christmas. If you think R&C is going to be a system selling app, I think you are seriously overestimating R&C. I am sure most PS3 owners will buy it, but Sony needs to sell consoles. I am sure R&C is going to be a great game, but lets be serious here...no one is going to go "Oh snap, I need to buy a 500 dollar PS3 to play Ratchet and Clank".

Be serious, anyone whos going to buy a console for halo has done so. They're not storing up their liquid awesome for Christmas.

Assassin's Creed and CoD4 will both co-release on the much larger install base 360 as well, so I wouldn't consider those "killer apps" for the PS3....and if Haze, Ratchet and Clank, Kane and Lynch and Uncharged is all the PS3 has....wow, this is going to be a brutal season for Sony.

By that logic, all 360 has is Mass Effect.

Those are all games that will be available on the PS3 by christmas. Oh and they look good. R&C is getting decent scores across the board and Uncharted is getting good previews as is haze.

The 360 also had a few other titles that came out a month or so ago, namely Bioshock and some game called Halo 3.
Whereas the PS3 got... Lair and Heavenly Sword...
Yeah sorry, but no one in their right mind would pay more money to play less fun games... or the same games.

Because your opinion of what is fun speaks for...well everyone? Heavenly Sword I own, I've played, I loved. You even fucking seen it?

Saying a game is getting good previews is pretty dumb. Nearly every game gets good previews.

IGN said you're looking pretty handsome these days.

The point is, if someone wanted those killer apps, they could play them cheaper on the 360.
Why pay more for the same game?

Don't go into a price arguement here because the PS3 is now the same price as the Halo edition and Elite, INCLUDING GAMES and the charge kit and the wireless adapter and the blu ray drive. Its only 50 quid more than a Premium, again with games and shiznit the Premium doesn't.

Another thing.
In my recently arrived issue of Game Informer, I expected to see ad upon ad for the huge wave of games for all systems.
The first PS3 ad I see?
For Resitance: Fall of Man. The launch title.
Really Sony? Really? Advertising the game that game out with the system? Come on.

Assassin's Creed and CoD4 will both co-release on the much larger install base 360 as well, so I wouldn't consider those "killer apps" for the PS3....and if Haze, Ratchet and Clank, Kane and Lynch and Uncharged is all the PS3 has....wow, this is going to be a brutal season for Sony.

By that logic, all 360 has is Mass Effect.

Those are all games that will be available on the PS3 by christmas. Oh and they look good. R&C is getting decent scores across the board and Uncharted is getting good previews as is haze.

The 360 already got it's system seller app for the year, Halo 3....which will continue to sell consoles all the way through Christmas. If you think R&C is going to be a system selling app, I think you are seriously overestimating R&C. I am sure most PS3 owners will buy it, but Sony needs to sell consoles. I am sure R&C is going to be a great game, but lets be serious here...no one is going to go "Oh snap, I need to buy a 500 dollar PS3 to play Ratchet and Clank".

Be serious, anyone whos going to buy a console for halo has done so. They're not storing up their liquid awesome for Christmas.

If you actually buy that load of horseshit you just spewed, you are pretty out of touch. There are plenty of people waiting to get a 360 for Christmas so they can play Halo 3. There are entire articles by economists about how Halo 3 is going to propel the 360 to great heights this holiday season. You might want to do some actual research before you yap next time.

Because your opinion of what is fun speaks for...well everyone? Heavenly Sword I own, I've played, I loved. You even fucking seen it?

What we have here class, is a fanboi. Someone who is unwilling to accept that Sony has a serious problem this holiday season if the best they can bring to the table is Heavenly Sword and Ratchet and Clank.

Because your opinion of what is fun speaks for...well everyone? Heavenly Sword I own, I've played, I loved. You even fucking seen it?

What we have here class, is a fanboi. Someone who is unwilling to accept that Sony has a serious problem this holiday season if the best they can bring to the table is Heavenly Sword and Ratchet and Clank.

It's pretty obvious you're running out of steam when you resort to labelling people fanboys. Not even fanboys but a 'fanboi' like you're too hip to just say fanboy.

I'm objective, I see the console selling for fun at the store with the price drop, I don't see a problem when I look at the games available and think the upcoming ones all look good and in some cases (Uncharted), great. What particularly grates me is that you're bashing on Heavenly Sword and Lair when I seriously doubt you've played either and just are hating on them because of what other people say. I on the other hand have played Halo. I didn't feel like I'd seen the second, or in this case, third coming. But at least I can say I've played it.

Saying a game is getting good previews is pretty dumb. Nearly every game gets good previews.

IGN said you're looking pretty handsome these days.

The point is, if someone wanted those killer apps, they could play them cheaper on the 360.
Why pay more for the same game?

Don't go into a price arguement here because the PS3 is now the same price as the Halo edition and Elite, INCLUDING GAMES and the charge kit and the wireless adapter and the blu ray drive. Its only 50 quid more than a Premium, again with games and shiznit the Premium doesn't.

Why pay less in order to pay more later?

Calm down man, we can discuss with inside voices.
For the 'Good' 360, you get two games, 20 GB HDD, the 360, and a wireless controller and headset. $350
For the 'Decent' PS3, you get the PS3, 40 GB HDD, Wireless controller, and Spiderman 3 in Bluray. $400
I'd rather go with the one that COMES with games.

Saying a game is getting good previews is pretty dumb. Nearly every game gets good previews.

IGN said you're looking pretty handsome these days.

The point is, if someone wanted those killer apps, they could play them cheaper on the 360.
Why pay more for the same game?

Don't go into a price arguement here because the PS3 is now the same price as the Halo edition and Elite, INCLUDING GAMES and the charge kit and the wireless adapter and the blu ray drive. Its only 50 quid more than a Premium, again with games and shiznit the Premium doesn't.

Why pay less in order to pay more later?

Calm down man, we can discuss with inside voices.
For the 'Good' 360, you get two games, 20 GB HDD, the 360, and a wireless controller and headset. $350
For the 'Decent' PS3, you get the PS3, 40 GB HDD, Wireless controller, and Spiderman 3 in Bluray. $400
I'd rather go with the one that COMES with games.

UK deals come with any 2 Sony published titles which gives you an option of about 8 games. Plus 2 movies.

You guys can prove me wrong when you are able to post some research findings that document these upsurges of 360s with Halo attach rates during the Christmas period.

I know plenty of people here at work who stop by and ask me about Halo 3. They don't own a 360 yet. After we talk a while they usually give me the yeah I am going to have to pick that up someday. There are a ton of people casual gamers, younger people with little discretionary income etc, that will be picking up a 360 and a copy of Halo over the next year. Shit a bunch of friends are just waiting for the price to come down before they get on board. If you only play a few hours a month $350 is still too much to justify on a toy. Not to mention how many children are going to be waking up to a 360 and copy of halo 3 on december 25th. Simple logic tells me that Halo and the 360 has a lot of sales ahead of it.

But honestly DW board warrior all you want you kind of lost all credibility in my book when were ranting about the GT4 delay saying it was going to drive people to suicide. Every statement you make is multiplied by the power of fan boi.

Because your opinion of what is fun speaks for...well everyone? Heavenly Sword I own, I've played, I loved. You even fucking seen it?

What we have here class, is a fanboi. Someone who is unwilling to accept that Sony has a serious problem this holiday season if the best they can bring to the table is Heavenly Sword and Ratchet and Clank.

It's pretty obvious you're running out of steam when you resort to labelling people fanboys. Not even fanboys but a 'fanboi' like you're too hip to just say fanboy.

I'm objective, I see the console selling for fun at the store with the price drop, I don't see a problem when I look at the games available and think the upcoming ones all look good and in some cases (Uncharted), great. What particularly grates me is that you're bashing on Heavenly Sword and Lair when I seriously doubt you've played either and just are hating on them because of what other people say. I on the other hand have played Halo. I didn't feel like I'd seen the second, or in this case, third coming. But at least I can say I've played it.

I've played both, and both are terrible, sorry to burst your bubble. They are glorified technology demos at best. Again, if Heavenly Sword and Lair is all Sony can put up against BioShock and Halo 3, Sony has a problem.

What makes you a fanboi is that you refuse to realize that the PS3 is sputtering. It's game library is a joke, and what's on the horizon are not killer apps. I am glad you enjoy Heavenly Sword and Lair, but 90% of the rest of the game world doesn't agree with you. Of course, we are all just losers who don't know the grand power of the PS3, right?

You guys can prove me wrong when you are able to post some research findings that document these upsurges of 360s with Halo attach rates during the Christmas period.

I know plenty of people here at work who stop by and ask me about Halo 3. They don't own a 360 yet. After we talk a while they usually give me the yeah I am going to have to pick that up someday. There are a ton of people casual gamers, younger people with little discretionary income etc, that will be picking up a 360 and a copy of Halo over the next year. Shit a bunch of friends are just waiting for the price to come down before they get on board. If you only play a few hours a month $350 is still too much to justify on a toy. Not to mention how many children are going to be waking up to a 360 and copy of halo 3 on december 25th. Simple logic tells me that Halo and the 360 has a lot of sales ahead of it.

But honestly DW board warrior all you want you kind of lost all credibility in my book when were ranting about the GT4 delay saying it was going to drive people to suicide. Every statement you make is multiplied by the power of fan boi.

Because your opinion of what is fun speaks for...well everyone? Heavenly Sword I own, I've played, I loved. You even fucking seen it?

What we have here class, is a fanboi. Someone who is unwilling to accept that Sony has a serious problem this holiday season if the best they can bring to the table is Heavenly Sword and Ratchet and Clank.

It's pretty obvious you're running out of steam when you resort to labelling people fanboys. Not even fanboys but a 'fanboi' like you're too hip to just say fanboy.

I'm objective, I see the console selling for fun at the store with the price drop, I don't see a problem when I look at the games available and think the upcoming ones all look good and in some cases (Uncharted), great. What particularly grates me is that you're bashing on Heavenly Sword and Lair when I seriously doubt you've played either and just are hating on them because of what other people say. I on the other hand have played Halo. I didn't feel like I'd seen the second, or in this case, third coming. But at least I can say I've played it.

I've played both, and both are terrible, sorry to burst your bubble. They are glorified technology demos at best. Again, if Heavenly Sword and Lair is all Sony can put up against BioShock and Halo 3, Sony has a problem.

What makes you a fanboi is that you refuse to realize that the PS3 is sputtering. It's game library is a joke, and what's on the horizon are not killer apps. I am glad you enjoy Heavenly Sword and Lair, but 90% of the rest of the game world doesn't agree with you. Of course, we are all just losers who don't know the grand power of the PS3, right?

Not ALL, just you for as long as you keep typing 'fanboi'. I think you should take a trip down to Ninja Theory, tell them that you think their game, what with all the motion capture, time, effort, etc put into it, is a tech demo. I'm curious t he response you will get.

And Lair, the only complaint I heard was the use of the Sixaxis. But hey, if you can't generalise, what arguement do you have?

When people, myself included, got over the hype of Bioshock, I think most realised it was pretty shit. Linear and completely lost the plot half way through. So it isn't your holy grail of gaming. And no, it was on the PC to, so I'm not just bitching on a 360 game.

BTW, the 90% of the world you polled...I'm curious, was this an Internet vote, phone or door to door or what? I'm genuinely curious into the methodology used to contact 90% of the world, including those in remote countries without any means of electronic communication. If a small native tribe are ragging on Lair, perhaps you are right.

You guys can prove me wrong when you are able to post some research findings that document these upsurges of 360s with Halo attach rates during the Christmas period.

I know plenty of people here at work who stop by and ask me about Halo 3. They don't own a 360 yet. After we talk a while they usually give me the yeah I am going to have to pick that up someday. There are a ton of people casual gamers, younger people with little discretionary income etc, that will be picking up a 360 and a copy of Halo over the next year. Shit a bunch of friends are just waiting for the price to come down before they get on board. If you only play a few hours a month $350 is still too much to justify on a toy. Not to mention how many children are going to be waking up to a 360 and copy of halo 3 on december 25th. Simple logic tells me that Halo and the 360 has a lot of sales ahead of it.

But honestly DW board warrior all you want you kind of lost all credibility in my book when were ranting about the GT4 delay saying it was going to drive people to suicide. Every statement you make is multiplied by the power of fan boi.

You guys can prove me wrong when you are able to post some research findings that document these upsurges of 360s with Halo attach rates during the Christmas period.

I know plenty of people here at work who stop by and ask me about Halo 3. They don't own a 360 yet. After we talk a while they usually give me the yeah I am going to have to pick that up someday. There are a ton of people casual gamers, younger people with little discretionary income etc, that will be picking up a 360 and a copy of Halo over the next year. Shit a bunch of friends are just waiting for the price to come down before they get on board. If you only play a few hours a month $350 is still too much to justify on a toy. Not to mention how many children are going to be waking up to a 360 and copy of halo 3 on december 25th. Simple logic tells me that Halo and the 360 has a lot of sales ahead of it.

But honestly DW board warrior all you want you kind of lost all credibility in my book when were ranting about the GT4 delay saying it was going to drive people to suicide. Every statement you make is multiplied by the power of fan boi.

When did I say that people would commit suicide over Gran Turismo?

doh my bad GTA4. Missed the A haha. You were upset that day.

I'm pretty sure I was exaggerating but yeah I was and am pissed. Should have completed the main story by now.

You have to look at it from this standpoint:
Which makes most sense to the guy with a small budget?
Buying the recommended 360 and get another game (Plus the two in the box) as opposed to getting the shittier PS3 and getting less games? I mean, $50 more for what? Free online? Not worth it.
I'm not saying the PS3 itself is a bad thing.
But the pricing, the games behind it, and just common sense dictate the person buy the 360.

Because your opinion of what is fun speaks for...well everyone? Heavenly Sword I own, I've played, I loved. You even fucking seen it?

What we have here class, is a fanboi. Someone who is unwilling to accept that Sony has a serious problem this holiday season if the best they can bring to the table is Heavenly Sword and Ratchet and Clank.

It's pretty obvious you're running out of steam when you resort to labelling people fanboys. Not even fanboys but a 'fanboi' like you're too hip to just say fanboy.

I'm objective, I see the console selling for fun at the store with the price drop, I don't see a problem when I look at the games available and think the upcoming ones all look good and in some cases (Uncharted), great. What particularly grates me is that you're bashing on Heavenly Sword and Lair when I seriously doubt you've played either and just are hating on them because of what other people say. I on the other hand have played Halo. I didn't feel like I'd seen the second, or in this case, third coming. But at least I can say I've played it.

I've played both, and both are terrible, sorry to burst your bubble. They are glorified technology demos at best. Again, if Heavenly Sword and Lair is all Sony can put up against BioShock and Halo 3, Sony has a problem.

What makes you a fanboi is that you refuse to realize that the PS3 is sputtering. It's game library is a joke, and what's on the horizon are not killer apps. I am glad you enjoy Heavenly Sword and Lair, but 90% of the rest of the game world doesn't agree with you. Of course, we are all just losers who don't know the grand power of the PS3, right?

Not ALL, just you for as long as you keep typing 'fanboi'. I think you should take a trip down to Ninja Theory, tell them that you think their game, what with all the motion capture, time, effort, etc put into it, is a tech demo. I'm curious t he response you will get.

And Lair, the only complaint I heard was the use of the Sixaxis. But hey, if you can't generalise, what arguement do you have?

When people, myself included, got over the hype of Bioshock, I think most realised it was pretty shit. Linear and completely lost the plot half way through. So it isn't your holy grail of gaming. And no, it was on the PC to, so I'm not just bitching on a 360 game.

BTW, the 90% of the world you polled...I'm curious, was this an Internet vote, phone or door to door or what? I'm genuinely curious into the methodology used to contact 90% of the world, including those in remote countries without any means of electronic communication. If a small native tribe are ragging on Lair, perhaps you are right.

Oh noes, what is Ninja Theory gonna do if I call their "game" a tech demo, cry? Seriously, go read the internet beyond your Sony suckle fest and you can clearly see that Heavenly Sword and Lair are basically the laughing stocks of console gaming right now.

Yes, you are right good sir, everyone has decided, because of your view point, that BioShock was the suck. Everyone who liked it is just a tool, they should be playing Heavenly Sword instead. And when they beat that in five hours, they can go play Lair with those ripped of motion controls that took a patch to even work somewhat correctly.

Not ALL, just you for as long as you keep typing 'fanboi'. I think you should take a trip down to Ninja Theory, tell them that you think their game, what with all the motion capture, time, effort, etc put into it, is a tech demo. I'm curious t he response you will get.

And Lair, the only complaint I heard was the use of the Sixaxis. But hey, if you can't generalise, what arguement do you have?

When people, myself included, got over the hype of Bioshock, I think most realised it was pretty shit. Linear and completely lost the plot half way through. So it isn't your holy grail of gaming. And no, it was on the PC to, so I'm not just bitching on a 360 game.

BTW, the 90% of the world you polled...I'm curious, was this an Internet vote, phone or door to door or what? I'm genuinely curious into the methodology used to contact 90% of the world, including those in remote countries without any means of electronic communication. If a small native tribe are ragging on Lair, perhaps you are right.

Hmm, I'd have to agree with Gnometank despite my ignorance. You sound like a fanboy.

At any rate, it doesn't matter how Ninja Theory feels about their game. The Bouncer was a glorified tech demo. Gungriffon Blaze was a glorified tech demo. DOA XBV was a glorified tech demo. These are all games that were early in the system's life cycle designed to show off capabilities but absolutely nothing in terms of gameplay depth. A tech demo can require mountains of effort and still be a tech demo.

And you're the first person I've heard sticking up for Lair. Every single person I know or kinda know or know people who know who played it has said it's total junk. I'll take that as the common perception.

And as far as 90% of the world, he said 'game world'. Reading comprehension ftw. Also, 'hyperbole'. Look it up.

PS. Bioshock was fun, but I'll agree it wasn't worth the hype. I'd still rather get a 360 than a PS3 simply beecause of library. I know I'm part of the common thought there - I'm only hardcore when it comes to PC gaming.

I never said they should play HS instead. Way to write off Lair in one wild, swinging punch though. Congrats on that.

Also, I'm done talking to you, I'm tempted to continue only because I'd hate for you to think your viewpoint or arguements were in any way valid, effective, rational or even considerable for inclusion in the intertubes. However, you do sound like a bit of a douche and what you've said in this topic plus your 360 signature badge thingy lead me to believe that your viewpoint might not only be skewed, but set in stone.

EDIT: 90% of the gameworld isn't more rational than 90% of the world. Its just as stupid a thing to say.

Pac Man's character is difficult to explain even to the Japanese -- he is an innocent character. He hasn't been educated to discern between good and evil. He acts more like a small child than a grown-up person. Think of him as a child learning in the course of his daily activities. If someone tells him guns are evil, he would be the type to rush out and eat guns. But he would most probably eat any gun, even the pistols of policemen who need them.

I never said they should play HS instead. Way to write off Lair in one wild, swinging punch though. Congrats on that.

Also, I'm done talking to you, I'm tempted to continue only because I'd hate for you to think your viewpoint or arguements were in any way valid, effective, rational or even considerable for inclusion in the intertubes. However, you do sound like a bit of a douche and what you've said in this topic plus your 360 signature badge thingy lead me to believe that your viewpoint might not only be skewed, but set in stone.

EDIT: 90% of the gameworld isn't more rational than 90% of the world. Its just as stupid a thing to say.

Hey I just want to point out that I have all 3 consoles but I personally believed that I've been robbed by sony.

My current 2 fav games for ps3 is tekken5 online and warhawk. both DLC games.

I own resistance

vf5
lair
and HS

I personally feel robbed for paying $240 on these games. Whenever I put in VF5 everyone tells me to "set that piece of shit on fire and put on tekken"

resistance, some parts of singleplayer were really well done, but for the multiplayer it just isnt cool. I mean it's alright for an fps, but some parts of it just plain suck like 40 player games is just one big clusterfuck.

my wii is handy for when I have my gf over or family and we can just have fun playin warioware or wiisports but I bought my wii to play SMASH BROS. thats the one and only reason I got it. right now the wii is all party games and iwant something with substance. I've yet to play metroid but my friends were laughing at the reviews because everyone was like "YOU HAVE TO PLAY THIS, ITS A RELIGIOUS EXPERIENCE"

as for 360, The Orange Box is the glitcheist piece of shit I have ever played in my entire life.
but whenever I have ppl over we just play 4 screen halo 3 and have a blast....even the little kids. its more fun than the wii.

in my eyes, the only way the PS3 is gonna survive is if they live up to the "DEATH OF THE DISC" mantra. That for some reason appeals to me that I no longer have to go to the store to pick up Warhawk or tekken. If mgs4 isnt a bombshell like halo 3 was we might not see a PS4.

I've read through most of this thread and I haven't seen this mentioned. Why didn't Sony just pull a Nintendo and re-release their old first party PS2 games on bluray with minimal improvements? That way they could make money selling 'PS3 games' and could use those games to easily pad their release schedule to make up for everything good coming out in 2008. They wouldn't have to worry too much about BC then, because 3rd parties would probably follow suite and you'd get the DMC, RE, MGS collections etc.
There's no disadvantage to this that I can think and would give them easy money. Being perceived as a machine with a bunch of PS2 ports is much better position to be in than machine that has '4 good games' on it.

DW, you seem to be approaching this as though it's in a vacuum - as though the PS3 and XBox 360 are on equal footing going into the Christmas season. They're not. Not by a long shot.

In terms of system sales, nothing matters by the library. Why would someone who owned neither console but was absolutely going to buy one and only one this Christmas choose one over the other. And don't talk about potential. No one but technophiles cares about potential. No one but enthusiasts care about Blu-ray or HD-DVD because it's still in the air which format will win, hell if either format will catch on at all. Not to mention that all movies are available on DVD, but few on BD or HD-DVD and they cost more. No one but total fanboys care about the brand name.

So what does that leave? The library.

PS3 killer aps available at Christmas time:
Assassin's Creed, CoD4 (Maybe). What else? That list you brought up before has games I've never heard of and if someone like me who follows the industry passively doesn't know about them, how is the general public going to see them as killer apps?

Xbox 360 killer apps available at Christmas time:
Gears of War, Halo 3, Assassin's Creed, CoD4 (Maybe), Mass Effect. Not to mention a flexible library with games like Viva Pinata and PGR4.

Xbox 360 is thumping PS3 for the same reason PS2 thumped XBox. Arguing the PS3 is going to do better than XBox 360 is like saying you though XBox did better than PS2.

I've read through most of this thread and I haven't seen this mentioned. Why didn't Sony just pull a Nintendo and re-release their old first party PS2 games on bluray with minimal improvements? That way they could make money selling 'PS3 games' and could use those games to easily pad their release schedule to make up for everything good coming out in 2008. They wouldn't have to worry too much about BC then, because 3rd parties would probably follow suite and you'd get the DMC, RE, MGS collections etc.
There's no disadvantage to this that I can think and would give them easy money. Being perceived as a machine with a bunch of PS2 ports is much better position to be in than machine that has '4 good games' on it.

Shadow of the Colussus might work well for that. They could keep the gameplay intact, but use the PS3's hardware for all the effects that they had to fake on the PS2. It would probably be a good way to demonstrate the relative power of the PS3.

This sound like a bait and switch. They take the BC stuff away. Retail wise they will be sold out by next year maybe. Then 2 years down the line when the great games have come and gone they will being a premium PS3 back with full hardare BC