I don't know how old you are, but if your memory went back a little farther, you might remember the real value difference in the stocks, not just recently.

Heh, I'm probably older than you think ;-) Of course you're right if you want to go back that far. If you bought Microsoft in 1986 and sold in 2000 you would certainly be happy :-) But have you ever heard the disclaimer they put in ads for investments, "Past performance does not indicate future trends" I don't want to come off as a Microsoft basher, I own shares of both companies but my time frame is similar to the chart I posted earlier. And it's tough to compare these companies because they are fundamentally very different.

We're getting pretty far from the topic of this thread, and I'll admit that I'm largely to blame for that.... sorry. But I think the discussion has been civil and it should provide a bit of perspective on why FCP for Windows isn't likely to appear anytime soon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by John F Miller

Apple TV? Oooh, wow! Hmm, can you say "Media Center Edition"?

OTOH, comments like these are more likely to steer this thread in a bad direction....

Hmmm, prior to the advent of the i-pod and i-tunes Apple was drawing most of its' profit from software licenses (Quicktime technology). Don't forget that Apple has been in the PC market for some time with its' database software Filemaker. It's also worth noting that more than a few folks running FMP on Macs have complained that with the latest versions of FMP (7, 8 and 8.5) Apple has been favoring the PC side; perhaps because PC sales outstrip sales for Apple platforms. As the number of Apple machines continues to shrink (there are more people running Windows 98 and ME than there are using OSX) I have no doubt that Apple will start looking at the PC market very seriously - money is money.

It's also worth noting that more than a few folks running FMP on Macs have complained that with the latest versions of FMP (7, 8 and 8.5) Apple has been favoring the PC side; perhaps because PC sales outstrip sales for Apple platforms.

Hmm, I'm not really plugged into the "filemaker community" but I have worked with the software extensively ever since the first version in the 1980's. This summer I did a major re-write of a big shared database which we use to run the production department here at the Opera Company. I have always run Filemaker on the Mac, and continue to do so. But most of our company has moved to PC's, so I needed to support them in this re-write.

I am really happy with Filemaker 8.5 myself. We also deployed a new machine (a Dell server maxxed out with RAM and fast SCSI drives) running Filemaker server 8 and that thing really flies. They have done terrific job optimizing the server, which used to be a real dog in earlier versions. Now my database (which is big, with almost 400 fields and thousands of records) is just as responsive over the network as it is on a local machine, and it's nearly as fast running remotely over DSL as it is on the office LAN.

But my experience is really quite the opposite with the Mac vs PC versions. There are few bugs when running on the PC (or should I say "features") which I haven't been able to resolve yet. Specifically, there are things which don't print correctly under Windows XP, and out IT guys are as baffled as me. Then there's also the fact that PDF's are supported in the Mac version in ways which don't work on the PC, since PDF is a native file format for OSX.
BTW, Apple spun off FileMaker, Inc. as a subsidiary a number of years ago, although they are wholly owned by Apple.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Schmitz

As the number of Apple machines continues to shrink

Well there are a lot of ways to look at market share, but I don't think it's accurate to say the number of Apple machines is "shrinking". Many people don't realize they have around a 12% laptop market share here in the US. In fact, they are announcing earnings today:

Macintosh computer sales also surged, rising 40% to $2.4 billion. Mac shipments rose 28% to 1.61 million units, more than double the growth of the overall PC market. The results show that demand for Apple's products remains strong despite stepped-up competition from rivals such as Microsoft Corp

It is kind of hard to say Apple is mainly a hardware company when all they are doing now is taking some of the best PC components and building great turnkey PC systems.

AFAIK what Apple is doing now isn't different from what Apple has always done. They assemble their computers w/parts made by third parties (just like Dell or HP). To the best of my knowledge Apple has never designed and fabricated it's own procs, mobos, RAM, etc.,. The only thing that's different is Apple's move away from the PPC architecture so now they get their CPUs from Intel instead of IBM or Motorola.

Jobs, he's always been a proprietary dork when compared to Gates, and for some reason everybody thinks he's this nice guy...well he ain't, he's a greedy and controlling DRM cyborg

Yes a businessman...and when the whole legit music online thing started out, he was the only one who figured out how to compromise between the "screw the MAN...um..man" attitude and the corporate..."We control it or everyone dies" attitude. But he's a proprietary dork for a reason...he's selling a whole package...if there's a problem with your DELL computer, who do you call...once they answer and find out it's not a hardware problem, who do you call then...if it ends up being a driver problem...who do you call then?

Apple has taken ownership of everything in your computer (assuming you buy through them)...they generally will help you troubleshoot other companies products as well. In order to do this, they have to keep control over the whole package. Which brings us back to the initial point of this thread...the software they write is there to serve the hardware they've tested and chose to be the foundation of the Apple experience...even their packaging espouses this holistic approach to their computer lifestyle they are selling.

<rant>
If you want a PC...buy a PC, stop trying to tell apple what to do...they're doing more for their shareholders right now than most other tech companies...and doing it by doing more for their customers. If they were just any software company...or just any PC manufacturer, they would be competing in a whole different marketplace...one that is already choked with dell and gateway and HP and John Franklin's Discount PC House Custom Cheese Log Powered Windows Box which eventually you find out doesn't have a license to sell Windows from Microsoft...thereby putting you in violation of licensing agreements with MS and having their lawyers stomp on you after the napster police come and steal your daughters for dowloading the newest Jessie McCarthy track from some server in poland.

If you want Final Cut, Get a Mac...Buy a second drive to put windows on so you can play your games that you will lose out on by switching to the Mac...every other piece of software on your windows machine can be replaced with a mac friendly analogue.

In case you can't tell, this discussion frustrates me...mods, feel free to kill this post, but dangit...show me your business acumen before complaining about being wronged by Mr. Jobs and his cohorts. While everyone else was floundering, he found a new way to get it done.
</rant>