Who knew ***** and ***** were mythic creations!?

Im not fooled. After 50 pages on those websites where the GM staff reports "Investigating the issue" Your not fooling me.

I know you guys support and probably created those websites. I know you wont ban the spammers or have any "issues" with them existing too. I cant be fooled especially when I see you guys not doing anything about it.

I have a hard time dealing with the fact that you wont fix bugs. I have a hard time playing the poorly coded game you guys give to us. When I keep getting advertising ingame and have GMs out right ignore them yet if I say "grape" in chat (minus the g) which I did within the last month and got instantly suspended. I know one thing.

Today I have officially confirmed via the lack of decision and being given ample time that infact mythic is most likely without a shadow of a doubt behind these websites in some fashion. Either they made them and are secretly protecting them or they are infact bribing them and mythic is agreeing to it.

So what are your thoughts with these two new official mythic websites?

Stratics Veteran

it is odd how the spammers are in General Chat which requires a full account. If they are spamming on full accounts, then by the rules of the game they should have had the accounts banned from all the reports from various shards. So if someone says vulgar things and gets busted like 3 times they will get banned and Mythic wont get their monthly subscription, Yet if a illegal website spamming account gets reported over and over and over, EA/Mythic seems to think the spammers monthly subscription money is too important to lose.... hmm

Yep that is a good point. Full paid accounts spamming yet no punishment.

And I like how its always "investigating the issue"

I was never investigated when I was suspended. It was a minute later and I was in jail and kicked. I see a little difference in treatment to be honest. Never banned/never touched vs within a minute suspended/kicked.

Stratics Veteran

Conspiracy theories aside. ***** shows that there is a desire on the part of the players for some form of vendor search utility, and even beyond that, one that isn't limited to Luna and Zento. ***** is a page I haven't visited so don't really know anything about.

I do, however, use ***** as all information is potentially useful and it's just easier to do a quick search on an item I'm wishing to buy to find it at the best price (of the available options) without having to spend all day wandering the entirety of the game to find "that one vendor". Or, if I'm trying to sell something, a quick search will give me a price check so I can decide if it's worth selling and at what price.

As for the RMT aspect, that in no way bothers me. As long as the goods being sold are obtained by legal in-game means and there is no transaction fraud involved (payment stolen without goods delivered, goods delivered but payment rescinded), it's 100% perfectly ok in my book. Let the free market reign.

For the record, scripting, duping, and other types of exploiting the game to obtain goods and resources should be eliminated as much as possible and those involved should be removed from the game. Being involved in or supporting RMT is NOT being involved in or supporting exploiting by nature. However, yes, I do know and understand that many RMT sales are based on the exploitation of the game.

That's why I favor two things:

1. An ingame vendor search system. Some people have asked for Auction Houses, but I think it would retain the spirit of UO to retain the vendor system and put in a search program.

2. An out of game Marketplace Auction site where registration is tied to your ingame account(s) (Your EA/Origin Acct maybe?) that allows for transactions to be in either ingame gold or real life cash (Cash transactions incurring nominal fees to support the system). The site would be completely neutral, run by Bioware/EA, and monitored so that listings and those listing them can be investigated for exploitation ingame and punished accordingly.

Stratics VeteranAlumniStratics Legend

As everyone is aware it is against our rules to name those illicit sites, however since there seems to be strong resentment against the idea of removing or locking the post, I've made do with editing the post titles.

Stratics VeteranAlumni

Conspiracy theories aside. ***** shows that there is a desire on the part of the players for some form of vendor search utility, and even beyond that, one that isn't limited to Luna and Zento. ***** is a page I haven't visited so don't really know anything about.

I do, however, use ***** as all information is potentially useful and it's just easier to do a quick search on an item I'm wishing to buy to find it at the best price (of the available options) without having to spend all day wandering the entirety of the game to find "that one vendor". Or, if I'm trying to sell something, a quick search will give me a price check so I can decide if it's worth selling and at what price.

As for the RMT aspect, that in no way bothers me. As long as the goods being sold are obtained by legal in-game means and there is no transaction fraud involved (payment stolen without goods delivered, goods delivered but payment rescinded), it's 100% perfectly ok in my book. Let the free market reign.

For the record, scripting, duping, and other types of exploiting the game to obtain goods and resources should be eliminated as much as possible and those involved should be removed from the game. Being involved in or supporting RMT is NOT being involved in or supporting exploiting by nature. However, yes, I do know and understand that many RMT sales are based on the exploitation of the game.

That's why I favor two things:

1. An ingame vendor search system. Some people have asked for Auction Houses, but I think it would retain the spirit of UO to retain the vendor system and put in a search program.

2. An out of game Marketplace Auction site where registration is tied to your ingame account(s) (Your EA/Origin Acct maybe?) that allows for transactions to be in either ingame gold or real life cash (Cash transactions incurring nominal fees to support the system). The site would be completely neutral, run by Bioware/EA, and monitored so that listings and those listing them can be investigated for exploitation ingame and punished accordingly.

Edit: yes, something should be done about the ingame chat spamming.

Click to expand...

Search engine, yup. That's what I thought we might be gonna get with Magincia, instead of the unused uselessness that is there now. Does anyone use it? Now if they had put in a big Buddha statue, or a giant "all-knowing purple llama of merchandising" in the town square, where we coould go there and dbl click it and type in a name, and get vendor locations where the items are.

Kinda like the outside sites that can't be named are doing, but which Mythic seems unable to code. And if it were an official search that means that all the vendors would be included, even the way out of the way places would be automatically checked.

We can call this my .02, if someone will loan me .01 to go with the one I have

Stratics VeteranStratics Legend

................however since there seems to be strong resentment against the idea of removing or locking the post...............

Click to expand...

Uhu ?

I find 4 posts other than yours and the OP in this thread and, to my understanding, I cannot seem to read any "strong resentment against the idea of removing or locking the post" in any of them..........

So, I honestly do not get from where you are getting this impression that there is "strong resentment against the idea of removing or locking the post"......

This said, I just want to add that I personally think that rules should be applied in all cases just the same yet, I am annoyed and quite some from Chat spam but I have to see that not much seems to be done about it since I keep seeing that spam on the General Chat Channel on a shard I play, as well as I keep seeing Luna and Zento maintain their vendors' privileged status over vendors elsewhere and there is still no global search utility that would allow all vendors to be on an equal footing wherever they may be as it should rightfully be, IMHO..........

I may well be wrong, but if there are rules, it is my opinion that these rules should be always enforced in any and all cases just the same.........

So, yes, I am all in favour of keeping this thread alive and discuss the issue because I hope that by seeing this thread, eventually something might be done to make what is not allowed in the game, actually not possible (you know, I am talking about stopping scripting, hacking, cheating........) in all cases.

Stratics VeteranAlumniStratics Legend

As everyone is aware it is against our rules to name those illicit sites, however since there seems to be strong resentment against the idea of removing or locking the post, I've made do with editing the post titles.

Stratics VeteranStratics Legend

Kinda like the outside sites that can't be named are doing, but which Mythic seems unable to code.

Click to expand...

That is something I really have a hard time understanding.

I mean, I would love to hear an official representative explain to me what might be the difficulties to give to the game a Global Search Engine that would finally put all vendors on an equal footing, regardless from where they may be.........

Besides, this would strenghten competition and help maintain prices down and thus, help fight the rampant inflation. And it is good to do something for the game that would reduce inflation, right ??

Can someone please explain to me why it is so difficult to get an official word about a Global Search Engine for Ultima Online ??

If these sites did not exist then Luna and Zento would still be the better places to browse as they are close to banks and moongates... this is why houses there are at a premium and so they should be.. if you rent/buy a house on the high street in real life you pay more than if you got one out of the way from the main flow of people because you wont get as much passing trade....

Rather than complaining and making baseless accusations - why not make some suggestions on it?

Legal action would be tough to pursue - EA would have to show that a law was broken or that UO was physically or financially harmed in some way to get the sites shut down.

Banning the in-game accounts that spam the advertisements is ineffective due to trial accounts - and the literally thousands upon thousands of new account codes floating around out there (I know I have several hundred myself due to the various expansions - especially the "Buddy Codes" from the 7th anniversary edition.)

Creating a vendor search system of their own in game would be difficult for two reasons - 1.) The age and antiquity of the original client and server code. 2.) The lack of item ID numbers assigned to every item in game. Lets face it - the newer games learned from the mistakes of UO. Sure - certain sites do it - but they do not scan the database - they use a bot that runs through a prescribed route physically uploading the information from each vendor along the way - it is not the same as an in-game system.

So what action do you think would help? Lets hear some brainstorming and suggestions.

Stratics VeteranStratics Legend

If these sites did not exist then Luna and Zento would still be the better places to browse as they are close to banks and moongates... this is why houses there are at a premium and so they should be..

Click to expand...

Like a House near the sea might be more preferable that a House in a swamp or a House on a small secluded island might be more preferable than a House with around a ton of other Houses and so forth........

What I am trying to say, is that, IMHO, it should NOT be search sites to determine a surge in Housing value in Ultima Online but simply in-game terrain variation and players' preferences.

Therefore, if the Developers finally added a Global Search functionality to UO where any and all vendors would be listed just the same, regarless of wherever they may be, finally all Houses in UO would see their prices vary only because of in game terrain variations and not because of other things.

I think that it is really about time that the game finally sees a Global Search utility for vendors, regardless of where they may be located in UO.

Stratics VeteranStratics Legend

Banning the in-game accounts that spam the advertisements is ineffective due to trial accounts

Click to expand...

Did they change the limitations to trial accounts ??

It was my understanding that trial accounts only had the ability to have access to the HELP Chat Channel, none else.........

Did I know it as wrong ?

Sure - certain sites do it - but they do not scan the database - they use a bot that runs through a prescribed route physically uploading the information from each vendor along the way - it is not the same as an in-game system.

Click to expand...

Is this activity in line with the game rules or is it not ?
And, if it is not in line with the game's rules, why it is not ended ??

I think that game rules should either be applied in all cases, and all accounts violating them should be penalized, or none should.

Tazar: UO does not need to pursue legal action, they just need to have a GameMaster patrol chats which is easy to do. Trial accounts CANNOT SO NO ON EVER FROM THIS POINT ON BECAUSE ITS SO DUMB TO SAY THEY CAN,

I hope by that spamming you understand forever and ever. They are using full accounts or atleast buddy coupons. Now why not ban them?

You said tazar: "and the literally thousands upon thousands of new account codes floating around out there (I know I have several hundred myself due to the various expansions - especially the "Buddy Codes" from the 7th anniversary edition.)"

So if they shouldnt ban them... why let them continue? Why not just have a GM take the page, oh yes hes clearly advertising for this website. Ban. Rinse repeat a few hundred times and the codes will go down, if anything they will have to recreate characters and we will see something being done. If they ban them yet they still show up every day, I would be much more satisfied then they clearly not doing it. The ID number in chat is spamming for over a month. Your method clearly shows no progress as NOT banning them isnt helping.

"The age and antiquity of the original client and server code."
Simple, apon server saves, everything is cataloged. Add that to a master 24 hour database. Simple, works and works with there existing code. If they can release new content, dont underestimate the code. It can be done really easily. Apon save, this vendor has what items: List them, update to website. Its the exact same system as MyUO was, and that existed for so long showing items and characters. Just modify it for vendors. So easy its sad.

In short: Ban every reported website spammer. If a message contains: Visit ***** and get 50USD on your first purchase of items. We now list publish 73 items in our database.

Seriously, I will get my dog to validate all those messages and ban appropriately. Theres not going to be any misbans.

Secondly, add a vendor listing system. Several suggestions on this thread alone. If UO wants money, why let some third party sites steal your sales? Simple.

Thirdly More limitations. Trial accounts can no longer be on the malas facet. Why should a trial account anyways. Try the game in britannia, if its good, play. Let them know, by creating a trial account we dont give you access to malas because we have abuse issues with it. So your limited to britannia. I should be payed a yearly wage since I just fixed a big issue yet it was so simple.

Rather than complaining and making baseless accusations - why not make some suggestions on it?

Click to expand...

This comes up every few months, and countless suggestions have been made before in regards to an ingame search ability.

I won't try to guess the complexity of building such an engine. While scanning all the existing vendors in the game might be out of reach, perhaps a new interface can be created that will add all *new* items to a database and all vendor owners to chose whether they want to be included in a searchable database?

I have not personally seen any of the spam ads, but I know that anyone who relies on the chat system will be annoyed by it. I am not sure if there are rules against it but, if there are, they should be enforced. Short of banning, the offending account's ability to use the chat system should be disabled for a period of time.

It was my understanding that trial accounts only had the ability to have access to the HELP Chat Channel, none else.........

Did I know it as wrong ?

Click to expand...

Trial accounts get to spam help channel - but they can also do many other things like dropping books, etc. The change to trial accounts was a help - but not a solution... as you can see. There are just too many new account (not trial) codes out there with 15 to 45 days game time included.

Is this activity in line with the game rules or is it not ?
And, if it is not in line with the game's rules, why it is not ended ??

I think that game rules should either be applied in all cases, and all accounts violating them should be penalized, or none should.

Click to expand...

It is not allowed according to the rules - but again - the activity is not done in game (other than using those new account codes to advertise and collect data). It would take legal action to stop the sites and to do that - EA would have to prove a crime occurred - or they were harmed in some way.

Back to my original statement... suggestions rather than complaints please.

If the thread is to be only complaints and baseless accusations - I'll lock the thread - or maybe move it to SNR. Please add something positive - ie: Constructive Criticism.

Tazar: UO does not need to pursue legal action, they just need to have a GameMaster patrol chats which is easy to do. Trial accounts CANNOT SO NO ON EVER FROM THIS POINT ON BECAUSE ITS SO DUMB TO SAY THEY CAN,

I hope by that spamming you understand forever and ever. They are using full accounts or atleast buddy coupons. Now why not ban them?

You said tazar: "and the literally thousands upon thousands of new account codes floating around out there (I know I have several hundred myself due to the various expansions - especially the "Buddy Codes" from the 7th anniversary edition.)"

So if they shouldnt ban them... why let them continue? Why not just have a GM take the page, oh yes hes clearly advertising for this website. Ban. Rinse repeat a few hundred times and the codes will go down, if anything they will have to recreate characters and we will see something being done. If they ban them yet they still show up every day, I would be much more satisfied then they clearly not doing it. The ID number in chat is spamming for over a month. Your method clearly shows no progress as NOT banning them isnt helping.

"The age and antiquity of the original client and server code."
Simple, apon server saves, everything is cataloged. Add that to a master 24 hour database. Simple, works and works with there existing code. If they can release new content, dont underestimate the code. It can be done really easily. Apon save, this vendor has what items: List them, update to website. Its the exact same system as MyUO was, and that existed for so long showing items and characters. Just modify it for vendors. So easy its sad.

In short: Ban every reported website spammer. If a message contains: Visit ***** and get 50USD on your first purchase of items. We now list publish 73 items in our database.

Seriously, I will get my dog to validate all those messages and ban appropriately. Theres not going to be any misbans.

Secondly, add a vendor listing system. Several suggestions on this thread alone. If UO wants money, why let some third party sites steal your sales? Simple.

Thirdly More limitations. Trial accounts can no longer be on the malas facet. Why should a trial account anyways. Try the game in britannia, if its good, play. Let them know, by creating a trial account we dont give you access to malas because we have abuse issues with it. So your limited to britannia. I should be payed a yearly wage since I just fixed a big issue yet it was so simple.

Click to expand...

I don't think it is near as easy as you make it sound - but I appreciate that there's finally some suggestions here.

Stratics VeteranStratics Legend

It is not allowed according to the rules - but again - the activity is not done in game (other than using those new account codes to advertise and collect data).

Click to expand...

Well, I may be wrong in my thinking, but it is my guess that, "if" the activities are not allowed according to the game's rules, then the game should have the possibility to easily ban accounts that, against the game's rules, are advertising sites which is not allowed OR collecting, in a way not allowed, the data used by sites. Am I wrong in my guessing ?

Does the game have the right to ban and cease accounts not following the game's rules ?

Now, if my above guessing is right, and the game has the right to easily ban accounts advertising sites where not allowed OR collecting data in a way not allowed, then increased difficulties in collecting data and no in game advertising "perhaps" the problem would be a tad less of a problem ??

Well, I may be wrong in my thinking, but it is my guess that, "if" the activities are not allowed according to the game's rules, then the game should have the possibility to easily ban accounts that, against the game's rules, are advertising sites which is not allowed OR collecting, in a way not allowed, the data used by sites. Am I wrong in my guessing ?

Does the game have the right to ban and cease accounts not following the game's rules ?

Now, if my above guessing is right, and the game has the right to easily ban accounts advertising sites where not allowed OR collecting data in a way not allowed, then increased difficulties in collecting data and no in game advertising "perhaps" the problem would be a tad less of a problem ??

Is this constructive criticism enough ?

Click to expand...

Again... there are too many new prepaid accounts out there for this to have any impact in a reasonable amount of time - Unless the game were given more resources to have full-time around the clock dedicated staff waiting to handle it.

Stratics VeteranStratics Legend

Again... there are too many new prepaid accounts out there for this to have any impact in a reasonable amount of time - Unless the game were given more resources to have full-time around the clock dedicated staff waiting to handle it.

Click to expand...

Well, but I guess that even if there is a large number of codes out there, I would expect that eventually all these codes should run out if accounts get banned day after day for not respecting game's rules.......

I have no clues how many prepaid accounts codes are floating out there, hundreds ? Thousands ? Regardless the number, starting banning them I would see it as a step towards reducing them 'till there will be no more. Not doing anything or hardly anything will keep them staying out there and always float around.

Personally, I think it is better a hopefull approach towards solving the problem, than hardly any approach at all...........

Besides, if the bans will work along with the creation of an in-game Global Search utility it is my opinion that the two things together would make the issue no longer an issue.........

Stratics Veteran

So why are there rules to guide players in their playing the game if then those rules are void by the simple fact that one is a player ?

I am confused..........

To my understanding, either rules are there to be enforced or I do not see the point of having them at all.

Cheaters are players too and because of that game play against game's rules should not be enforced ?

Fine. But then this means to me that the status of being a player overrides any rule there is and, therefore, no player should be penalized for not following the game's rules.

I mean, I can only understand that rules are enforced and applied to any and all players, I just cannot understand any different handling of them.

Click to expand...

Yes it is against the TOS to post websites in chat, but GMs dont ban p(l)ayers spamming RMT sites unlike say immediately terminating accounts for homophobic slurs because there is no financial benefit for EA to do so. These cheaters are p(l)ayers too and they pay for many accounts.

As everyone is aware it is against our rules to name those illicit sites, however since there seems to be strong resentment against the idea of removing or locking the post, I've made do with editing the post titles.

Click to expand...

Thank You, should be more of that, like when honest accidents happen.
The ***** that I see in game in Non-RMT, that I know of

Stratics Veteran

Im not naming any sites, but the guy with name "Promoter" (i dont think there is any real player using that name, right?) joins general chat on every shard. On LS, I ignored him then after about 5 days, he shows again and that means he has a new account, or he made a new char on the same account. I think he got a ban and started a new account. So in theory the guy needs to create 6 accounts for month, just to spam on gen chat. He dont need other than a trial to get the vendor info.
So, 6 accounts.. thats 70-75 bucks. Lol. Thats nothing compared to what they get from people paying for stuff or gold on those sites.
Even if those accounts from the sites gets a ban every 2/3 days instead of 5, they will continue doing it and spending 75-150 bucks on accounts if necessary.

So ban their accounts has proved that its not the solution. Funny thing is, I ignore the spammers, but I wont lie.. i use those sites to search for stuff on different shards. Most people use them, and most are annoyed by the spam, haha.

Stratics VeteranStratics Legend

Im not fooled. After 50 pages on those websites where the GM staff reports "Investigating the issue" Your not fooling me.

I know you guys support and probably created those websites. I know you wont ban the spammers or have any "issues" with them existing too. I cant be fooled especially when I see you guys not doing anything about it.

I have a hard time dealing with the fact that you wont fix bugs. I have a hard time playing the poorly coded game you guys give to us. When I keep getting advertising ingame and have GMs out right ignore them yet if I say "grape" in chat (minus the g) which I did within the last month and got instantly suspended. I know one thing.

Today I have officially confirmed via the lack of decision and being given ample time that infact mythic is most likely without a shadow of a doubt behind these websites in some fashion. Either they made them and are secretly protecting them or they are infact bribing them and mythic is agreeing to it.

So what are your thoughts with these two new official mythic websites?

Click to expand...

My thought is that nothing you say has much validity because it is all based upon the fact that you are very upset that you were rightfully punished for saying a word that every player in UO knows is taboo(and for pretty good reason)

The fact that you are trying to link your justified suspension with a 3rd party spam is just silly IMO. They are obviously separate issues and you are doing nothing more then trying to stir up **** by linking them.

All of a sudden you have huge issues with ads and EA?
Did you ever voice these concerns before you said the R word and got punished? If not then you are kinda bogus IMO.

Stratics is the oldest continually running MMORPG Fansite on the Internet. Founded in 1997 Stratics has served the Ultima Online Community for 18 years. We strive to provide the most complete social experience for Ultima Online players.