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If thats decent, the please show me whats good? Then show me whats great....at the center position.

Amare wouldn't help Phoneix out now, so whats your point? Gortat is better than Amare and Morris is on his way to becoming a better all around player.

Phoneix finish 2 games under .500 last year, and they're 5 games under .500 this year, they're not the 50 win team they had back in the day, but it doesn't change the point Amare is damaged goods. You give Phoneix a good wing player, they become a good team again.

Dudley Grant Hill and Channing Frye won't get it done.

This Gortat thing needs to be given less significance. Phoenix are not a good team so it makes sense that there will be a player over performing. Check out his career stats and tell me how many years he's been playing this way for.

Morris. Are we seriously going to discuss Morris? I know the press has been talking about his similarities to Barkley but unless I see it for myself I will not pay any attention to it. His defence is no where near as good and neither is his shooting. Will he develop? Dunno. It's all speculative.

As for Stoudamire being washed up. You seem to forget he was our most consistent player last season. He almost won us the first game of the Celtics series when Anthony was shooting 5-18 (Injury followed unfortunately). I understand people's demands for more of an effort on the defensive end (though we all knew he was never that type of player) however it still stands that had he not come to NY last summer, you would be viewing an entirely different roster to what we have at the moment. Anthony, Davis, Chandler, J.R Smith; they all followed. Let's see some respect for someone who is still the natural captain of the team. To call him washed up this early, and to bring current non-entities into the equation such as Morris, while others advocate getting players like Bargniani, is some of the most non-sensical crap I've read. Give him this season before you start ranting. He's earned this much patience from us.

Lots of posts in this thread, I haven't read them all, but I know people are down on Amare.

He may not prove worthy of 100 mil, a deal he got - it seemed to me at the time - because the Knicks were desperate. After waiting 2 years for LBJ, and getting shut out, they were a bit panicked at the thought of getting zilch out that FA bonanza.

I think expectations need to be tempered. He can still help the team win, it's just that he's more like Chris Bosh (not a big 3 but big 2 1/2...) in Miami.

I think what Amare is missing is some booty
No lie if you remember we started out 3-8 last
year and quickly turned it around and went on a 8 game win streak
Funny this is around the time Amare started dating Amber Rose
Then he went on a 9 game 30+ scoring rout with 2 40 point games
We've seen this before with Kris Humphries and Kim K and how he played
Melo needs to get LaLa to hook Amare up with a broad

This Gortat thing needs to be given less significance. Phoenix are not a good team so it makes sense that there will be a player over performing. Check out his career stats and tell me how many years he's been playing this way for.

Do you realize that Gortat was Howard's backup for more than three years while in Orlando? Look at his per 36 stats last seson after he was traded to Phoenix:
15.8 PPG, .562 FG%, 11.3 RPG, 1.5 BLK, 1.4 TO.

Do you realize that Gortat was Howard's backup for more than three years while in Orlando? Look at his per 36 stats last seson after he was traded to Phoenix:
15.8 PPG, .562 FG%, 11.3 RPG, 1.5 BLK, 1.4 TO.

Do you realise that he didn't even make the playoffs last year, and is not looking any better for this year, whereas his predecessor (Stoudamire) made the Western Finals the year before? Are you all seriously going to compare Gortat to Stoudamire??!

Average teams always have one player playing beyond his means. It doesn't mean they are star quality.

I would take Gortat over Stoudemire any day of the week. Anyone who wouldnt doesnt really watch basketball. Even if u wanna argue Amare is still superior offensively, Gortat is a far superior rebounder and defender.

I don't why anyone hasn't mentioned that before but to me the main reason Amare struggles this year is SYSTEM we are playing.

Let's face it Amare is only effective in run'n'gun system when no defence is required. Just like during his Phoenix years with D'Antoni or last year with us. When D'Antoni came to NY Phoenix hired Terry Porter as head coach and Steve Kerr said that they should be a halfcourt team and what happened? Amare struggled to average 20 pts and he was 100% healthy until that eye injury happened. Next year they average 110 ppg and Amare is back to his normal self.

This year with addition of Chandler we play at much slower pace which makes amare useless because:

1. He doesn't play defence
2. He has no post game
3. His jumper is way off.
4. His one on one game is pretty bad too.

I'm pretty sure that if he was traded to a team like Denver he would be much more productive. In our current system he is lost and he won't get better because he just doesn't have instincts to play in that system.

I would take Gortat over Stoudemire any day of the week. Anyone who wouldnt doesnt really watch basketball. Even if u wanna argue Amare is still superior offensively, Gortat is a far superior rebounder and defender.

Man, can you imagine if we had Gortat to play next to/ backup Tyson Chandler?

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Originally Posted by TakMan

This Gortat thing needs to be given less significance. Phoenix are not a good team so it makes sense that there will be a player over performing. Check out his career stats and tell me how many years he's been playing this way for.

Morris. Are we seriously going to discuss Morris? I know the press has been talking about his similarities to Barkley but unless I see it for myself I will not pay any attention to it. His defence is no where near as good and neither is his shooting. Will he develop? Dunno. It's all speculative.

As for Stoudamire being washed up. You seem to forget he was our most consistent player last season. He almost won us the first game of the Celtics series when Anthony was shooting 5-18 (Injury followed unfortunately). I understand people's demands for more of an effort on the defensive end (though we all knew he was never that type of player) however it still stands that had he not come to NY last summer, you would be viewing an entirely different roster to what we have at the moment. Anthony, Davis, Chandler, J.R Smith; they all followed. Let's see some respect for someone who is still the natural captain of the team. To call him washed up this early, and to bring current non-entities into the equation such as Morris, while others advocate getting players like Bargniani, is some of the most non-sensical crap I've read. Give him this season before you start ranting. He's earned this much patience from us.

Its ridiculous you wrote that it's telling me you obviously never seen Morris play, therefor I can't take your post seriously anymore. Keef is Rasheed Wallace lite. He's never going to be a 20 point scorer, and he's never going to average 9 rebounds or 3 assists a game. His ceiling is a 15-17ppg, 6-8 REB, guy who adds toughness and outside shooting. He's only played 23 games and is a player you will hear about often.

Ask Orlando fans how they felt in Gortat. He was the best back up big man in the NBA who could of started on a lot of teams and he's showing that in Phoneix. Just stop talking about the Suns in general, doesn't make sense for you to discuss something you haven't researched about. If you think you know, then I don't think you know. Go find out about it.

BTW to the fools discrediting Gortat, how many of you guys seen Gortat play ? His defense, rebounding, intangibles, and toughness makes him a superior player to Amare, easily. He has a 21 PER this season. a career per of 17.7. In the past he would hack alot and pick up fouls. Now he's very smart on defense and spends more time on the court, which results to more production.

Respect for the captain of the team? What a bloodless statement. Amare is the laziest and most inactive player on the court. He's horrible at intagibles and he's scoring moves are predictable. We have to respect him because YOU say so? Get out of here with that**** man.

Wow, dude has back and knee problems, had no real chance to gel with team because of the lock out issues, plays on a team filled with new faces (including his), his big bro just past away, and he wants to get the rest of the team involved.

Just those factors alone I can easily give him a pass this year. I may not like some things about Amare but I can clearly see his game is distrupted due to timing and injuries. With that said... next year I know I'm not going to be as supportive because I knew he was going to get broken down due to the coaches fast pace system. This system is for players with young strong healthy legs. When we gave all that money to STAT knowing he has leg issues...I knew it wasn't going to be an easy ride for him.

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BTW Morris's role Phoneix has been replacing Channing Frye, his FG % is misleading, Gentry has him out on the 3pt line. For those who knows Morris' game, he's good in the post and his FG will only increase. He's a 40% 3pt shooter, so the fact you say he can't shoot is retarded. He has a jumpshot.

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Originally Posted by Real NY Baller

Wow, dude has back and knee problems, had no real chance to gel with team because of the lock out issues, plays on a team filled with new faces (including his), his big bro just past away, and he wants to get the rest of the team involved.

Just those factors alone I can easily give him a pass this year. I may not like some things about Amare but I can clearly see his game is distrupted due to timing and injuries. With that said... next year I know I'm not going to be as supportive because I knew he was going to get broken down due to the coaches fast pace system. This system is for players with young strong healthy legs. When we gave all that money to STAT knowing he has leg issues...I knew it wasn't going to be an easy ride for him.

Those are timeless physical limitations. Amare's mobility has degressed greatly. Thats the argument here. You add that to his matador defense, inability to set quality screens or picks, poor at boxing out...you have a bum ass player. Thats all we're saying.