thought I would like the thick, hard vibram sole. I did for a bit. after a few weeks, noticed they weren't waterproof. first time got wet, suede upper got hard and discolored. shortly after, tongue started wearing out part above toes. in no time, a big tear across toes from instep to pinky, clear to socks. mostly used for park walking, as too heavy and clunky for jogging or kicking a ball. sole was built to last. upper wasn't. too bad I have a second pair in black I bought at same time, thinking these were a find. now, a loss. never again northface, never again.