Petco is very big and GAB is very small so absolutely not. I think his numbers would be more similar to those in Arlington if he pitched in Cincinnati. The Reds would be better off going with someone like Germano whos younger and cheaper.

BEETTLEBUG

02-19-2006, 10:20 PM

Petco is very big and GAB is very small so absolutely not. I think his numbers would be more similar to those in Arlington if he pitched in Cincinnati. The Reds would be better off going with someone like Germano whos younger and cheaper.

OK Thanks

schroomytunes

02-19-2006, 11:40 PM

I would go after him if he signed for less than 2.5 million per season as long as we only offer him a 1 year deal.I think he gives us that added starter we are going to need as the season wears on. I would let Germano start in AAA all year to see what he has to offer. Our rotation would be:

--I think we are going to see Wilson be brought along slowly(pitch counts) so we are going to need that 6th rotation starter. Plus it allows us a possible bargain chip come the trading deadline if Krivsky plays his cards right. I would try like hell to schedule Milton,Wilson,and Astacio to start as many games on the road as possible to lessen the effects of GABP, which would make their stats look better to possible trade partners.

flyer85

02-19-2006, 11:59 PM

If they are I hope they keep telling him "NO".

Falls City Beer

02-20-2006, 12:03 AM

I see absolutely NO merit in a move like this. I actually doubt this will happen.

KronoRed

02-20-2006, 12:12 AM

Ortiz part 2.

Pass.

Phhhl

02-20-2006, 12:15 AM

Astacio would have been a very nice aquisition 5 years ago. Not anymore.

Slyder

02-20-2006, 01:51 AM

Nothing wrong with exploring options, you never know where the next Pete Schourek or Avery or Jimmy Haynes or Paul Wilson or Cory Lidle or Todd Jones will come from. You just gotta remember to cash out on him while his values high.

RedEye

02-20-2006, 02:03 AM

Astacio scares the crap out of me. PLEASE tell me we're not going to sign him. He and Milton would compete for the HR allowed title!

Heath

02-20-2006, 09:42 AM

Nothing wrong with exploring options, you never know where the next Pete Schourek or Avery or Jimmy Haynes or Paul Wilson or Cory Lidle or Todd Jones will come from. You just gotta remember to cash out on him while his values high.

Let's put this nicely - about one or two of those panned out - or one and a half.

Schourek had a wonderful '95 season.
Avery didn't fare so well.
Jimmah had a great year (for him)
Paul Wilson is plain mediocre.
Cory Lidle got absolutely lit up in this town.
Todd Jones was serviceable enough to get the new-look rocks of the franchise Andy Machado & Josh Hancock.

I don't think a one-year rental of Pedro Astacio is worth the Reds time.

However - if he does sign, and goodness knows we need more VJUMP's (Veteran Journeyman Useless Mediocre Pitchers) he better sign for a minor league deal with an invite, and hope he pitches like crap.

MartyFan

02-20-2006, 09:58 AM

Astacio scares the crap out of me. PLEASE tell me we're not going to sign him. He and Milton would compete for the HR allowed title!

AWESOME...I have been wondering who would do that now that Ortiz is gone!:beerme:

cincinnati chili

02-20-2006, 10:05 AM

Harry Caray used to call him "Pistachio," and not on purpose.

Johnny Footstool

02-20-2006, 10:27 AM

They would have better luck throwing $2.5 million in small bills out into the street.

westofyou

02-20-2006, 11:36 AM

I see absolutely NO merit in a move like this. I actually doubt this will happen.
I can see it happening for 1.5 million.

Maybe some incentives, the Reds are in trouble with starters, bodies at an nominal cost in todays pitching marketplace are a reality, perhaps the new ownership group doesn't frowm on playing aggressivly at the $5 table?

However he only threw 44 innings in 2003-2004, last year his arm was pretty much well rested, after 126 IP last year at 36 that can be a different story this season.

I know most of the world thinks something big and beautiful is going to happen, but that's not likely to be anytime soon, the owners been here for 31 days and the GM 11 days and the reality is that time is not of the essence this year.

Most players aquired right now are toilet paper spackle in a big ole dike.

Heath

02-20-2006, 11:53 AM

I can see it happening for 1.5 million.

Maybe some incentives, the Reds are in trouble with starters, bodies at an nominal cost in todays pitching marketplace are a reality, perhaps the new ownership group doesn't frowm on playing aggressivly at the $5 table?

However he only threw 44 innings in 2003-2004, last year his arm was pretty much well rested, after 126 IP last year at 36 that can be a different story this season.

I know most of the world thinks something big and beautiful is going to happen, but that's not likely to be anytime soon, the owners been here for 31 days and the GM 11 days and the reality is that time is not of the essence this year.

Most players aquired right now are toilet paper spackle in a big ole dike.

I'll take him for .5 million and loaded incentives.

NC Reds

02-20-2006, 11:57 AM

Just say no.

Falls City Beer

02-20-2006, 12:27 PM

I can see it happening for 1.5 million.

Maybe some incentives, the Reds are in trouble with starters, bodies at an nominal cost in todays pitching marketplace are a reality, perhaps the new ownership group doesn't frowm on playing aggressivly at the $5 table?

However he only threw 44 innings in 2003-2004, last year his arm was pretty much well rested, after 126 IP last year at 36 that can be a different story this season.

I know most of the world thinks something big and beautiful is going to happen, but that's not likely to be anytime soon, the owners been here for 31 days and the GM 11 days and the reality is that time is not of the essence this year.

Most players aquired right now are toilet paper spackle in a big ole dike.

I'd wager you that $1.5 million that Belisle will put up far better numbers this year than Astacio will.

Spending that money on Astacio would be the profoundest waste of time and resources of the offseason. Let me put it this way: would you want the Reds to spend $1.5 million to keep Ortiz around?

M2

02-20-2006, 12:58 PM

With Milton, Wilson and Williams tentatively slated to be in the rotation, I find it hard to get up in arms about Astacio. At this point I figure he has to pitch for food. I'd go Heath's route: a $500K offer if he makes the team with incentives to bring it up to $1.5M. If he's no good in ST then you've ventured nothing.

lollipopcurve

02-20-2006, 01:18 PM

With Milton, Wilson and Williams tentatively slated to be in the rotation, I find it hard to get up in arms about Astacio. At this point I figure he has to pitch for food.

Agreed (though I like Williams to surprise). If there were a young kid or two who was ready to fill the #5 spot, I'd say stay away. But there's no one on the doorstep, much less the street, so I say bring him in on a one-year deal. If he pitches well, he's tradeable.

markymark69

02-20-2006, 06:29 PM

Petco is very big and GAB is very small so absolutely not. I think his numbers would be more similar to those in Arlington if he pitched in Cincinnati. The Reds would be better off going with someone like Germano whos younger and cheaper.

I would agree that the PETCO factor must be brought up. I would also like to see Germano or Gosling get a chance. Two young arms, lets' see what they can do?

Falls City Beer

02-20-2006, 06:33 PM

The Reds would be better off going with someone like Germano whos younger and cheaper.

The Reds would be better off going with Air Bud.

pedro

02-20-2006, 06:48 PM

The Reds would be better off going with Air Bud.

I don't think Germano is that worthless. He did pretty well here in portland and the stadium here is pretty much a band box.

KronoRed

02-20-2006, 06:54 PM

The Reds would be better off going with Air Bud.
http://www.cincinnati.com/freetime/movies/other/img/airbud_rev_175x271.jpg

Falls City Beer

02-20-2006, 07:05 PM

I don't think Germano is that worthless. He did pretty well here in portland and the stadium here is pretty much a band box.

No, I was referring to Astacio. Sorry for the confusion. BTW, I agree that Germano's kind of interesting in a middle reliever sort of way. Not that we don't need middle relievers or anything.

I saw that movie the other day with my daughters and my nephew--I was rolling the entire time. My younger says to me, "Daddy, why are you laughing so much?" And I had to explain that I think animals dressed up are hilarious. Cute stuff, though.

M2

02-20-2006, 07:29 PM

I don't think Germano is that worthless. He did pretty well here in portland and the stadium here is pretty much a band box.

If they bring Astacio on, does that mean he is on the roster for sure?

I know that in one previous report "Special K" said he was only looking to add depth to the talent so that Narron would have more options to consider...to me, that means that anyone who is claimed or signed is done so with the full potential of being sent packing if they are not going to be an asset to this team, this year.

If that is the case, bring Astacio in and let him compete with Germano and Gosling and the rest of the bodies in camp.

pedro

02-20-2006, 07:47 PM

IIRC, Portland graded out as the best pitcher's park in the PCL.

That may be true (well it's second anyway), but it isn't a very big place and the PCL is a notorious hitters league is it not?

M2

02-20-2006, 08:15 PM

That may be true (well it's second anyway), but it isn't a very big place and the PCL is a notorious hitters league is it not?

It is, but Portland seems to be one of the places where a guy can hide.

westofyou

02-20-2006, 08:19 PM

It is, but Portland seems to be one of the places where a guy can hide.
Part of that factor is that the Padres haven't had any hitting prospects at PDX yet, that drags down the mean.

But it's a claustraphobic little place and night games prior to the summer are damp.

captainmorgan07

02-20-2006, 08:22 PM

i heard air bud throws about a 75 mile an hour curve ball that'll break bats in half. JUST KIDDING

M2

02-20-2006, 08:27 PM

Part of that factor is that the Padres haven't had any hitting prospects at PDX yet, that drags down the mean.

But it's a claustraphobic little place and night games prior to the summer are damp.

The quality of the hitters shouldn't affect the rating because it compares their road performance (and that of their opponents) to their home performance. It's all relativity.

Dampness is probably the chief culprit.

Falls City Beer

02-20-2006, 08:29 PM

i heard air bud throws about a 75 mile an hour curve ball that'll break bats in half. JUST KIDDING

Dude fields his position like a madman.

"Get the ball, Bud. Get the ball; that's a good dog."

M2

02-20-2006, 08:33 PM

Dude fields his position like a madman.

"Get the ball, Bud. Get the ball; that's a good dog."

So you've seen "Air Bud: Seventh-Inning Fetch?"

Heath

02-20-2006, 11:22 PM

I prefer Snoopy playing shortstop.

Falls City Beer

02-20-2006, 11:36 PM

So you've seen "Air Bud: Seventh-Inning Fetch?"

No, not yet. I'm trying to get the girls to rent Most Valuable Primate this weekend though. Chimps. Awesome.

pedro

02-21-2006, 12:07 AM

No, not yet. I'm trying to get the girls to rent Most Valuable Primate this weekend though. Chimps. Awesome.

I was once in a band named "the Chimptations"

M2

02-21-2006, 12:14 AM

No, not yet. I'm trying to get the girls to rent Most Valuable Primate this weekend though. Chimps. Awesome.

I find any chimp-based drama without a Don Addams voiceover to be lacking.

RFS62

02-21-2006, 12:21 AM

I prefer Snoopy playing shortstop.

Good call.

Heath

02-21-2006, 01:36 AM

I was once in a band named "the Chimptations"

I'm sincerely afraid.

The worse case scenario is if you drag out a .jpeg of your album.

Topcat

02-21-2006, 02:45 AM

Astacio is like vomit with out the bag. Just a big mess and a horrid smell:thumbdown

bianchiveloce

02-21-2006, 08:58 AM

Astacio would be terrible choice even as a one year roster filler. I wouldn't give him a plug nickel to come to camp. At 36 years of age, he is clearly on the downside of his career with little hope of being a positive contributer to the Reds.

His numbers at San Diego's Petco is more a reflection of the park factor rather than a resurgence of his skills. While at San Diego, he pitched 60.2 innings with a Hits/9 of 8.07 and a BB/9 of 3.89 which resulted in 11.96 baserunners per 9 innings. It is true that his G/F ratio while pitching for San Diego was 0.97, but his career G/F is 1.41.

The Reds would be better served to save the money and give someone else in camp a chance to step up as a roster filler for 2006.

gonelong

02-21-2006, 09:44 AM

Good call.

That might be the first picture of Snoopy "throwing" a ball that I have ever seen. Do you know if this was from an original cartoon, or something done after the fact?

Now that I think about it, did this come from a cartoon that showed Snoopy turning two, maybe with Linus at 2B?

PTUI !

GL

KearnsyEars

02-21-2006, 09:53 AM

I like him alot. I said that earlier he is the only one of the remaining and available FA out there I'd consider. I mean, I signed him on MVP baseball and he is so solid and reliable to get me through, oh, say 6 or 7 innings every start, so why not give him a shot?!?!? No but seriously i hope we do it. He can easily be a very good #4 starter for this team and I think his experience would be a plus. He can still pitch and win 15 for a team in this league.

Heath

02-21-2006, 10:09 AM

That might be the first picture of Snoopy "throwing" a ball that I have ever seen. Do you know if this was from an original cartoon, or something done after the fact?

Now that I think about it, did this come from a cartoon that showed Snoopy turning two, maybe with Linus at 2B?

PTUI !

GL

No, I remember that cartoon - Snoopy fielded the ball with his mouth and then tossed it Linus to give the start to the 6-4-3.

gonelong

02-21-2006, 10:19 AM

No, I remember that cartoon - Snoopy fielded the ball with his mouth and then tossed it Linus to give the start to the 6-4-3.

That might be the first picture of Snoopy "throwing" a ball that I have ever seen. Do you know if this was from an original cartoon, or something done after the fact?

Now that I think about it, did this come from a cartoon that showed Snoopy turning two, maybe with Linus at 2B?

PTUI !

GL

I found it on the net a few years ago, I think. No idea if it was from a strip.

I'm a big Snoopy fan. I've modeled my life after him, in fact.

westofyou

02-21-2006, 12:09 PM

I found it on the net a few years ago, I think. No idea if it was from a strip.

I'm a big Snoopy fan. I've modeled my life after him, in fact.
Snoopy's first apperance in a baseball themed Peanuts strip

http://www.deadballart.com/redszone/snoopy.gif

M2

02-21-2006, 12:40 PM

I always thought Snoopy was unfairly blamed for the shortcomings of the team around him. He carried those kids.

gonelong

02-21-2006, 01:22 PM

I always thought Snoopy was unfairly blamed for the shortcomings of the team around him. He carried those kids.

Actually, I don't remember him getting much blame. He was the obvious team MVP year in and year out.

Excellent range a SS and challenged Ruth's single season HR record. Might have had it if that round-headed kid hadn't got picked off second.

Though he did cost the team one of their few wins when he was caught in the gambling scandal.

GL

KronoRed

02-21-2006, 01:30 PM

Agreed.

They were armatures, he was the only pro out there

Should have demanded a trade

westofyou

02-21-2006, 01:34 PM

Should have demanded a trade

Actually Charlie Brown traded Snoopy to Peppermint Patty for a package of good guys that instantly made the team better. But PP was a taskmaster and Charlie Brown missed Snoopy and well.... you know the rest.

pedro

02-21-2006, 01:36 PM

That Peppermint Patty was clubhouse poison. Plus her personal trainer Marcy was a little "off".

KronoRed

02-21-2006, 01:38 PM

Yeah..anyone calling people "Sir" has to play with other players emotions

Does this sound about right? I know that early on they didn't really have set positions, but as the strip went on I think this is pretty much how it played out.

GL

I really liked Pig Pens game. Got to like a guy who's not afraid to get his uniform dirty.

Heath

02-21-2006, 01:55 PM

Solid outfielder too, in a pinch.

Obviously a Willie Mays fan.

I created a wallpaper once with that Snoopy and the 1959 Mr. Red (with glove) logo chasing that ball.

Very cool -

I actually thought Snoopy was a better hockey player than baseball player. He never could get over the Woodstock hump though.

gonelong

02-21-2006, 02:00 PM

Solid outfielder too, in a pinch.

Obviously a Willie Mays fan.

Excellent balance and the quickest paws I have ever seen.

http://www.eteams.com/sugarlandheat/images/snoopy-bat.gif

KronoRed

02-21-2006, 02:05 PM

I really liked Pig Pens game. Got to like a guy who's not afraid to get his uniform dirty.
The Orginal Scrappy

RFS62

02-21-2006, 02:13 PM

Wow. Found one of Eric Milton in little league.

pedro

02-21-2006, 02:18 PM

Wow. Found one of Eric Milton in little league.

hey now. don't go "player hatin" my man chuck like that. :)

westofyou

02-21-2006, 02:24 PM

Pig Pen started out at 2nd base, but his play was covered up with so much dirt Charlie Brown overlooked him once during practice.

gonelong

02-21-2006, 02:48 PM

Pig Pen started out at 2nd base, but his play was covered up with so much dirt Charlie Brown overlooked him once during practice.

I am pretty sure that Shermy, Lucy, and Linus all had turns on the mound as well. It seems to me that Linus was pretty succesful in his stints.

GL

westofyou

02-21-2006, 02:49 PM

Linus did really well when CB had tennis elbow, but bowed out in an act of humility rarely seen.

M2

02-21-2006, 02:51 PM

Supposedly when Snoopy would come down with a case of the worms he could be a red ass.

RFS62

02-21-2006, 02:53 PM

Supposedly when Snoopy would come down with a case of the worms he could be a red ass.

Well, that would explain a lot.

gonelong

02-21-2006, 02:55 PM

Wow. Found one of Eric Milton in little league.

I found one of him this off-season.

http://www.rose-hulman.edu/%7Evalerija/Stuff/peanuts2-13.jpg

http://http://www.rose-hulman.edu/%7Evalerija/Stuff/peanuts2-13.jpg

RFS62

02-21-2006, 02:55 PM

Holy crap!!!

Our crack investigative team has just come up with this photo of Josh Hancock on the day he was cut!!!!

He does not look happy about it.

gonelong

02-21-2006, 02:59 PM

wn
Supposedly when Snoopy would come down with a case of the worms he could be a red ass.

Dude went on some benders once in awhile, thats for sure.

http://www.ilederien.com/images/snoopy.gif

Heath

02-21-2006, 03:30 PM

wn

Dude went on some benders once in awhile, thats for sure.

http://www.ilederien.com/images/snoopy.gif

But, hey, he served our country well.

http://red-baron.blog-cafe.net/images/snoopy4.jpg

Mods - we might want to split off this thread. If it ever got out in MLB-Message Board Land that we had a 5 page thread on Pedro Astacio and didn't read it the content, we might be the laughingstock of all baseball message boards.

KronoRed

02-21-2006, 03:36 PM

Nah, the other boards envy us ;)

Heath

02-21-2006, 04:12 PM

Nah, the other boards envy us ;)

That's right - we proudly hold the record for Most Pages Discussed of Tuffy Rhodes. :rolleyes: :D

captain11

02-21-2006, 05:22 PM

You can never have enough arms. If this doesn't cost you too much, you never know when you can get lucky and find a guy who has a solid year in him.

KearnsyEars

02-21-2006, 05:24 PM

Astacio is like vomit with out the bag. Just a big mess and a horrid smell:thumbdown

I am telling you guys, he can pitch! He could pitch in Coors Field and he can pitch here!

He will make the Wilson signing of a couple years ago and jimmy 15 win haynes look silly when he posts a sub 3 ERA with 25 quality starts!

Close the deal on this one Krivsky! Get em'

Lets make a splash by getting our own pedro! :beerme:

Tommyjohn25

02-21-2006, 05:30 PM

Wow...what in the world happened to this thread? I went maybe three or four hours without reading it and I come back to THIS??!! :laugh: :laugh:

Doc. Scott

02-21-2006, 05:33 PM

You can never have enough arms. If this doesn't cost you too much, you never know when you can get lucky and find a guy who has a solid year in him.

Yeah, but I think I'm tired of not finding out who's a prince and who's poop until the All-Star break. I'd like to have a little more assurance that we've got mild competence in the starting rotation.

He will make the Wilson signing of a couple years ago and jimmy 15 win haynes look silly when he posts a sub 3 ERA with 25 quality starts!

Pedro has NEVER posted a sub 3 ERA in a season where he's thrown more than 82 innings, and that one short season he went under 3 was all the way back in 1992. The past 8 seasons his lowest ERA is 4.69. Why would he suddenly now drop under 3?

KronoRed

02-21-2006, 05:59 PM

Pedro Martinez maybe

Slyder

02-22-2006, 12:10 AM

Let's put this nicely - about one or two of those panned out - or one and a half.

Schourek had a wonderful '95 season.
Avery didn't fare so well.
Jimmah had a great year (for him)
Paul Wilson is plain mediocre.
Cory Lidle got absolutely lit up in this town.
Todd Jones was serviceable enough to get the new-look rocks of the franchise Andy Machado & Josh Hancock.

I don't think a one-year rental of Pedro Astacio is worth the Reds time.

However - if he does sign, and goodness knows we need more VJUMP's (Veteran Journeyman Useless Mediocre Pitchers) he better sign for a minor league deal with an invite, and hope he pitches like crap.

I was naming people who I thought gave "something to the reds" during their tenure. Granted I hadnt seen Avery's numbers recently but I thought he did better than he did.
Todd Jones deal was victimized by Dan O's stupidity and ineptitude. Corey Lidle we got Elizardo Ramirez and a couple others for, and I remembering many saying Ramirez looked pretty good at Louisville and could come in and perform at least possibly out of the pen this year. Which anything under 4.5 would equate to what Lidle did for this club (not much). That is why I mentioned Lidle. And Again we just got to remember to deal while the value is high should Astachio have a "good" season. If he comes in and bombs he wont ever see Cincy.

alex trevino

02-22-2006, 12:24 AM

Pedro Martinez maybe

How about Pedro Borbon he is still unsigned....Hell you could probably sign his son too.

Barbarossa

02-22-2006, 01:38 PM

Latest rumor is(according to CBS SportsLine.com), the Nationals are in the picture now. They have offered him a minor league deal and an invite to camp. Perdo is going to decide between the Nationals and the Padres in the next 48hrs. Looks like we may have dodged the bullet?:beerme: