Personally, at this point in my life, I wouldn't take anyone's advice on the question that you are asking, but in lieu of the fact that you want
someone to tell you and seem not to want to slog through the stuff yourself; I would recommend Levenda.

If you had slogged through it yourself, you would know why Greer is toxic; and a lot more. Start at Maury island, smyleegrl, and find your way from
there.

P.S. smyleegrl, it's a story; just a story. And it has been actively contributed to for 66 years; that's not so long. You must do yourself the justice
of reading the whole thing. I don't think that very many ever read it all quite the same way. But it's necessary. Go, read the whole thing, you'll get
a good head start over the summer and I am sure that we will hear from you about it next year some time.

Most of you are probably too young to know, but the problem with Greer began many years ago when he suddenly appeared within the UFO spectrum and
blended showmanship with taking big bucks from those that wanted his training to have mental links to the minds of the ETs. And not unimportantly, he
had no problem promoting materials that he knew (were told) were phony.

I went on a field trip with him and a group back in 1985. He was a showman then and has perfected his wares since. Just over a year ago he was
drumming up money for a whopper of a big zero-energy-type of org. He had a big, big name to head it that was coming along in a year ago last May.
This was his big announcement in about January of last year. Gigantic things were going to be happening in that field. Investors were wooed.
And....

Now we have a little monkey center stage.

I'm fond of an old saying that anything about UFOs that gets the public's attention is a plus because some of them may possibly start to think the
unthinkable. So, Greer has his place in the awakening. But don't give him any medals for it.

Of course I did. How many scientists were said to be crack pots for their theories and were later vindicated? I look at what good Greer has brought
to the table. Like I said, the disclosure project was a step in the right direction. Do I believe some of the statements from Greer about
governments withholding back engineered technology, you better believe it. Some of the UFO case studies prove that witnesses who have encountered
these alien technologies are now showing up in government research projects. This is a thread I made a while back on this subject.

Yeah, he has made some outlandish statements including the pictures you mentioned. Like I said, I reserve judgement on questionable statements and
photos. The question I have is this, if everyone can easily identify the photo is a moth, why would he even present it as something else? He's an
intelligent man, why would he present such a thing if it clearly looked like a moth. Can aliens or spirits take on other life forms? Who really
knows? Here is an experience I personally can relate (with pictures).

Most of my research is just trying to piece the puzzle together. That includes comparing witness testimonies with other UFO cases, common
descriptions of the vehicle structure, physical ailments and marks on witnesses, multiple witness sightings and the credibility of the witness.

P.S. smyleegrl, it's a story; just a story. And it has been actively contributed to for 66 years; that's not so long. You must do yourself the
justice of reading the whole thing. I don't think that very many ever read it all quite the same way. But it's necessary. Go, read the whole thing,
you'll get a good head start over the summer and I am sure that we will hear from you about it next year some time.

listen to any of Col. Robert Dean's lectures or interviews. He's a national treasure even if you don't
believe him. Almost from another era where men were gentlemen.

That's Command Sergeant Major Bob Dean, you are think of Col Dick French. Both of these people are complete frauds by the way. Bob Dean is just a
crazy bitter old coot, he's no "national treasure".

Mea culpa getting the designations wrong, I'm not military. Do you have any evidence that Dean is a fraud, did not have the high security clearance
he says he had, or see the secret papers he mentions? Or do you just like to call people names like someone in grade school?

listen to any of Col. Robert Dean's lectures or interviews. He's a national treasure even if you don't
believe him. Almost from another era where men were gentlemen.

That's Command Sergeant Major Bob Dean, you are think of Col Dick French. Both of these people are complete frauds by the way. Bob Dean is just a
crazy bitter old coot, he's no "national treasure".

Mea culpa getting the designations wrong, I'm not military. Do you have any evidence that Dean is a fraud, did not have the high security clearance
he says he had, or see the secret papers he mentions? Or do you just like to call people names like someone in grade school?

I have formed the opinion that his stories are BS. I have no idea whether he started out telling the truth, but after watching every interview I can
find with Bob Dean, I have noticed his stories continue to change and become more sensational, I've also noticed he avoids answering many questions
directly and just changes the topic and waffles on.

That may not have been the best advice that I could have given you, considering it's not easy to come by the guy's books.It seemed to me that if you
had the whole story and then you plugged in Greer, it would give you what you were looking for and more. I think that you would also be kind of
appalled at some of the stuff you might read. I don't mean the 'alien' stuff, I just mean all the key-stone cop, cold-war spy vs spy, fully-human
melodrama that you would read about. It'll make your head spin.

I have for a while now been experimentally trying to perceive the whole thing through a sort of narrative lens. As though the whole thing were a
story; and it is, really, just like a game of add-on only this one can rivet national and international attention. So that means that the people that
commit to adding to the tale are subject to all of the public scrutiny of any rock star; and when one of these stars fails? Well, you know how it goes
for the likes of Brittany Spears and such; they fall pretty hard. You had better do a good job if you are going to contribute; the public is paying
close attention and those that suck will be ridden out on a rail.

And that's what, I think. has happened to Greer, he failed his audience by being immersed in doo doo up to his neck and getting caught in it...

Your confusion on this matter is a source of amazement to me. I believe that the universe and its secrets, can be unravelled, disected, examined and
quantified, using scientific rigor and objectivity as the divining rod by which the water of knowledge can be located. The existence or otherwise, of
intelligent life in the universe, is a question which is best asked by, and can only be answered effectively by that method.

However, "Dr" Greer constantly uses totally scientifically unsupportable methods in his work. He claims to be able to commune with alien
intelligences by meditation, claims that poorly shot pictures of moths are some sort of energy being, has no objectivity, and does not respect the
scientific process. He does not use science in his work, but abuses it, uses his credentials to add weight to arguements which ordinarily have the
same mass as a neutrino (think about it for a sec).

It is not hatred for him, but what he does and says, much of which discredits the entire search for extra terrestrial life, by use of these totally
idiotic methodologies. Those who know the sciences observe his bunkum with disdain, and would have to also be singularly WISE to avoid lumping the
whole Alien/UFO subject together with his BS, and refusing to entertain either one in the valueable real estate of thier minds. It is people like
Greer who prevent serious scientists and researchers from devoting thier lives to the cause of investigating these matters, and without these serious
people on the case, all the FOIA requests, encounter reports and shaky videos in the world arent going to ammount to a damn thing, because without
these people, the forensic investigations, the examination of hard evidence found during those, and the independantly aquired results which are NEEDED
in this feild will not come about.

That covers the reason that I cannot accept him as a source, and cannot respect him as a researcher and campaigner for truth in the field of
UFO/Alien matters.

On a more personal note, I am sure that if myself, and Dr Greer were in a bar, and prevented from discussing the field of UFOlogy, alien
intelligence, and religion, that I would be able to go a full hour without sticking a beer bottle through his ocular cavity, and stamping on the
bleeding remains. But that would be the result largely because he strikes me as some what of a narcissist, and if there is one thing I cannot put up
with, its a person who thinks more of themselves than they ought to.

I met Greer a few years ago in New Mexico - we had a brief chat and he signed my book.
I was asking him about UFOs over Antarctica.
He seemed nice enough - his talk was great.
But he does have an ego - no doubt.
Nevertheless he is quite impressive.

many of the same people that blindly believe in an invisible God, yell fraud at Greer.

Why bring God into it ?
I don't believe in any God but I know from the evidence of the last decade that Steve is a business man with no real interest in the subject unless
there's a $ in it for him , to deny this is Ignorance much...oh yeah.

Also, in addition to my previous post on this issue, you asked wether there are any figures currently abroad in the field, for whom I have any
respect. This is a difficult question for me personally, because I believe that the OVERWHELMING majority of figures in the field are touched in the
head, or staggeringly lazy, poorly funded, and utterly incapable of approaching the subject in a manner which might see a final and definitive answer.
Very few, if any have both the honesty, and grasp of physics, chemistry, forensics, and so on, to actually make even a barely educated guess about the
things they discuss and investigate. Many are barely even particularly good historical researchers, and even the ones who are VERY good in that way,
cannot PROVE anything useful, only report what has already been written, said, and thought in ages past.

I believe that it should be the responsibility of all peoples of the Earth, and all governments, to amass thier resources and pile them into
propulsion research with the intent of allowing manned vessels to overtake the voayger probes, and actually travel to other star systems. I believe
that this is necessary, both for mans ultimate survival, beyond the life of the solar system, and for our quest to see the big question answered, and
actually locate some life forms from other galactic locations. I do not believe that our own solar system is likely to contain anything roughly
classifiable as intelligent life, although I would not refute the possibility out of hand. But it does seem to me that rather than looking from afar,
as we currently do with our massive space telescopes, we should be making EVERY effort, to actually look for ourselves, up close, at all the
interesting worlds that currently are known to us.

I believe that where the Earthbound search for truth is concerned, far too many people who are big names in UFOlogy are little more than persons
around whom vast finance and influence collect, for no reason other than thier ability to speak publically, and fool large numbers of morons into
believing that x is in fact y. Those who are not in the business of making people look foolish generally arent publically known, because they keep
thier work to themselves for thier own reasons, and thats all well and good. But unless MUFON and others like them, are going to actually get funding
for sophisticated laboratories, and begin employing VAST numbers of genius scientists to make sense of data as it comes in, I personally think that
most of thier efforts will be a waste. They might however, generate an awful lot of tourism and money when they do an annual meeting or a convention.
They serve little purpose otherwise as far as I am concerned.

I formed this opinion after quite some time here, watching and participating in various discussions on this topic, and being appalled at the levels
of complete idiocy and fallacy in arguements being made for alien visitation. It is fair to say that even IF one or more of the contact stories I have
heard is true, the morons promoting the information are hopelessly incompetent in delivering even the merest glimpse into the reality of the matter at
hand. UFOlogy is a victim of its own desire for a figurehead, but it is my belief that the subject should not NEED a figurehead. Why rest all ones
hopes and ambitions on the shoulders of a mere mortal? Utterly ridiculous. All the indigo children in the world couldnt possibly carry that weight on
thier shoulders. That is why I cannot respect these charlatans, because there is no way in the world that they can come up with proof of thier claims,
and yet they continue to accept the burden of peoples belief in them, purely to feel the comforting bulge of a full wallet, and spend nights in thier
hotel rooms molesting thier credit cards, and anything else they can get thier hands on.

I rest my hope instead, on the scientific method, on the chance that mankind will one day escape our home system, and set foot on totally alien
worlds, and it is by THAT method, or by proper examination of claims made here on this planet (which has NEVER happened, and is unlikely to EVER
happen if history is anything to go by), from which we might hope to gain a result. No one is currently doing it right. Its a bloody mess.

because I find myself uneasy accepting judgement of "evidence" from someone who gladly accepts fantasy as evidence enough for his own personal
enjoyment. I'm not naming specifically. More in general terms...

And I'm guessing there are many "believers" here on ATS who yell fraud at Greer. Because he has no evidence....of all things.

He has some credit in my book...whatever were his motives or are for doing what he does...at least the Disclosure project had real merit in my book. A
brave attempt, even though it failed miserably...but the core idea of it was valid...and I wish we had more attempts like these.

business man with no real interest in the subject unless there's a $ in it for him

Granted. I won't argue with that. But at the end...that fact does not invalidate everything he does. If you think it does...than you might reconsider
your life. Because, most things you do over the course of the day, have some financial interest or involvement behind it.

15k.) Video links/embeds: You will not embed or Post a link to a video without a reasonable description of its content and why it interests
you, is germane to the topics discussed on the Websites or the topic of an existing thread should you post it in a reply to an existing thread.

You didn't really make any attempt to do any of that. I hope your second post will be better.

In a nutshell, Greer went from serious researcher, gathering expert testimonials for Congress, to a UFO nutter who holds expensive campouts while
singing Kumbaya to summon UFOs...

I mean really, in essence, I think this transformation is why there is so much hate for the guy. He's a complete sell-out. Making money off it is one
thing. Stanton Friedman makes money off the subject...but he maintains his respect in the field.

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