The case for and against has been made and strongly argued by both sides, but the danger now is that - with nothing really new to add - the thread runs the risk of descending into more heated comments with all that that means.

.......quit ringing your hands and worrying about what other members post ,if the thread makes you uncomfortable I suggest stop reading it

The case for and against has been made and strongly argued by both sides, but the danger now is that - with nothing really new to add - the thread runs the risk of descending into more heated comments with all that that means.

.......quit ringing your hands and worrying about what other members post ,if the thread makes you uncomfortable I suggest stop reading it

warspite1

Seeing that the thread was going nowhere, the same old arguments were simply being repeated, and the good old race card came out to play, I simply made a polite suggestion you ignorant ****. What a pathetic loser you are. I suspect you think you are like your avatar - a real hard ass. Nope, you are just an ignorant ****.

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty - Horatio Nelson 1805.

They have equal rights. But, is it an equal right to be in a combat unit if your standards have to be reduced for you to get there.

The floor is yours.

RR

Maybe you're right. And I apologize for bringing race into the discussion. I guess history will be the ultimate judge of what women are and aren't able to do. More doors seem to be opening for women and we'll see what happens as a result.

_____________________________

Favorite/Awesome games from Matrix

War in the Pacific/AE Panzer Corps Commander Europe at War John Tiller's Campaign Series The Close Combat Series (all versions) Advanced Tactics Gold

They have equal rights. But, is it an equal right to be in a combat unit if your standards have to be reduced for you to get there.

The floor is yours.

RR

Maybe you're right. And I apologize for bringing race into the discussion. I guess history will be the ultimate judge of what women are and aren't able to do. More doors seem to be opening for women and we'll see what happens as a result.

Thanks Gary. I hope everyone has the opportunity to do what they want if that helps them to be successful. It's the part of individuality that gets lost in equality?

Remember it was/is individual rights that led the American Revolution to a country conceived in "liberty". While equality was the theme of the French Revolution, where it led to bloodshed, dictates, and eventually an Emperor.

I am sure that history's "judge" will see both success and failure. Our American "treasure" should not be spent unwisely.

BTW, years ago I was passed over for a job. The job required lifting heavy things and light construction skills. Though, I was 6'2" and had past experience in construction, I lost the job because I was not a "black female". Seems for the sake of equality they wanted both a female and a minority (which met the company affirmative action mandates). The one they picked was hired and then later let go when she could not perform her physical part of her duties, got hurt, and then later failed to show up for work. Later I got the job because "black females" were hired in other parts of the company.

I guess I might have looked at this segment of the discussion more personally than I wanted. If I was harsh toward you I would like to offer my apology to you.

RR

_____________________________

“The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.” ― Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

Germany's unforgivable crime before the Second World War was her attempt to extricate her economy from the world's trading system and to create her own exchange mechanism which would deny world finance its opportunity to profit. — Winston Churchill

ORIGINAL: warspite1 Can I suggest that we bring this thread to a halt now? Its good that Matrix have allowed this thread to continue - we've seen threads closed early where just the likelihood of an argument getting out of hand makes it safer to end it soon - and this discussion has been worthwhile.Hopefully we can be trusted to be allowed more thought provoking topics to discuss in future.Just my 2 cents.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sarge .......quit ringing your hands and worrying about what other members post ,if the thread makes you uncomfortable I suggest stop reading it

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1 Seeing that the thread was going nowhere, the same old arguments were simply being repeated, and the good old race card came out to play, I simply made a polite suggestionyou ignorant ****. What a pathetic loser you are. I suspect you think you are like your avatar - a real hard ass. Nope, you are just an ignorant ****

……. so lets get this straight, you’re worried that if the thread continues someone (like you) is bound to resort tochildish name calling and Matrix will no longer give us the liberty to have OT discussion ?

good thing you’ve self-appointed yourself to mod or things might get personal ........

Germany's unforgivable crime before the Second World War was her attempt to extricate her economy from the world's trading system and to create her own exchange mechanism which would deny world finance its opportunity to profit. — Winston Churchill

The case for and against has been made and strongly argued by both sides, but the danger now is that - with nothing really new to add - the thread runs the risk of descending into more heated comments with all that that means.

Its good that Matrix have allowed this thread to continue - we've seen threads closed early where just the likelihood of an argument getting out of hand makes it safer to end it soon - and this discussion has been worthwhile. Hopefully we can be trusted to be allowed more thought provoking topics to discuss in future.

As far as this debate is concerned, sadly the fact is is that those of us in the "no" camp have already "lost"; women are out there now, on the frontline. Only time will tell who is right and who is wrong.

Just my 2 cents.

And thank the forum gods that politics never entered...er, wait, the entire discussion is "POLITICAL". Odd how healthy political discussions can go on and on but sometimes the wrong "word" can bring a "POLITICAL" discussion to a halt, because it is...OH NEVER MIND. Logic not welcome.

_____________________________

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

ORIGINAL: parusski And thank the forum gods that politics never entered...er, wait, the entire discussion is "POLITICAL". Odd how healthy political discussions can go on and on but sometimes the wrong "word" can bring a "POLITICAL" discussion to a halt, because it is...OH NEVER MIND. Logic not welcome.

LOL! You da man!

I wondered who else saw it that way.

RR

_____________________________

“The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.” ― Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

Oh dear Lord. I have seen the light. Women are all in, if they look like that.

Titanwarrior89, I have for YEARS seen the odd disconnect when pol discussions take place. Never seen any, not even close, rhyme or reason to the application of rules. I have been led to the obvious-it is what a moderator says it is. Debates can rage and rage on FREAKING POLITICAL ISSUES and suddenly, somewhat farts a little to loudly and the hammer comes down. This thread, as well as ACW thread are sterling examples.

Most likely, this post is to be deemed as too political. PFFFTTT.

_____________________________

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

Oh dear Lord. I have seen the light. Women are all in, if they look like that.

Titanwarrior89, I have for YEARS seen the odd disconnect when pol discussions take place. Never seen any, not even close, rhyme or reason to the application of rules. I have been led to the obvious-it is what a moderator says it is. Debates can rage and rage on FREAKING POLITICAL ISSUES and suddenly, somewhat farts a little to loudly and the hammer comes down. This thread, as well as ACW thread are sterling examples.

Most likely, this post is to be deemed as too political. PFFFTTT.

_____________________________

"Before Guadalcanal the enemy advanced at his pleasure. After Guadalcanal, he retreated at ours".

They have equal rights. But, is it an equal right to be in a combat unit if your standards have to be reduced for you to get there.

The floor is yours.

RR

Maybe you're right. And I apologize for bringing race into the discussion. I guess history will be the ultimate judge of what women are and aren't able to do. More doors seem to be opening for women and we'll see what happens as a result.

Thanks Gary. I hope everyone has the opportunity to do what they want if that helps them to be successful. It's the part of individuality that gets lost in equality?

Remember it was/is individual rights that led the American Revolution to a country conceived in "liberty". While equality was the theme of the French Revolution, where it led to bloodshed, dictates, and eventually an Emperor.

I am sure that history's "judge" will see both success and failure. Our American "treasure" should not be spent unwisely.

BTW, years ago I was passed over for a job. The job required lifting heavy things and light construction skills. Though, I was 6'2" and had past experience in construction, I lost the job because I was not a "black female". Seems for the sake of equality they wanted both a female and a minority (which met the company affirmative action mandates). The one they picked was hired and then later let go when she could not perform her physical part of her duties, got hurt, and then later failed to show up for work. Later I got the job because "black females" were hired in other parts of the company.

I guess I might have looked at this segment of the discussion more personally than I wanted. If I was harsh toward you I would like to offer my apology to you.

RR

Thanks RR. I felt a little on the defensive there for awhile but I guess I set myself up for it. Probably deserved what I got. Live and learn I guess.

_____________________________

Favorite/Awesome games from Matrix

War in the Pacific/AE Panzer Corps Commander Europe at War John Tiller's Campaign Series The Close Combat Series (all versions) Advanced Tactics Gold

1. The debate was all getting a little heated blah blah 2. I made a suggestion to call a halt as the argument had pretty much run its course, i.e. there was no new arguments being put forth, and the whole race thing was thrown in (never a good move) etc etc. I am not a "self-appointed" mod, but I made what I thought was a sensible suggestion. 3. You could have responded by simply ignoring this and continuing the argument, you could have waited for Gary Childress to respond (the floor was his), or you could have told me in a polite and civilised manner that my suggestion was not necessary and that the debate would continue. 4. Instead you decided to respond with "....quit ringing your hands etc etc", which of course was designed to be belittling.

Two things here: a) maybe that is how you behave and talk to people in real life when someone says something that you don't agree with, or b) its how you choose to behave in forum land, safely tucked behind a keyboard and in front of a computer screen - I don't know which is correct - only you do - but either way its not very helpful is it?

I am quite sure that in both a) or b), if someone comes at you with a bullying, hectoring tone, you react strongly - and that is what I did with you.

Interestingly, having made my post, look at the response from both Gary Childress and MrRoadrunner, both of whom have taken a step back and apologised to each other for things getting so heated.

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty - Horatio Nelson 1805.

ORIGINAL: warspite1 Interestingly, having made my post, look at the response from both Gary Childress and MrRoadrunner, both of whom have taken a step back and apologised to each other for things getting so heated.

It was not the content as much as the tone. Sometimes keyboard "muscles" get into what you want to say?

Had we been in a bar, before nights end, I am sure that Gary and I would be buying each other drinks and regaling each other with stories of our earlier life experiences.

Or, betting women to do chin ups and pushups.

RR

_____________________________

“The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.” ― Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

ORIGINAL: warspite1 3. You could have responded by simply ignoring this and continuing the argument, you could have waited for Gary Childress to respond (the floor was his), or you could have told me in a polite and civilised manner that my suggestion was not necessary and that the debate would continue.

4. Instead you decided to respond with "....quit ringing your hands etc etc", which of course was designed to be belittling.

Two things here: a) maybe that is how you behave and talk to people in real life when someone says something that you don't agree with, or b) its how you choose to behave in forum land, safely tucked behind a keyboard and in front of a computer screen - I don't know which is correct - only you do - but either way its not very helpful is it? I am quite sure that in both a) or b), if someone comes at you with a bullying, hectoring tone, you react strongly - and that is what I did with you

Seriously ?, now your lecturing me on forum “etiquette ? I told to stop “ringing your hands” and you immediately go off this crazed rant:

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1 you ignorant ****. What a pathetic loser you are. I suspect you think you are like your avatar - a real hard ass. Nope, you are just an ignorant ****.

You’re a real fricking head case , get yourself some anger management !

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1 Right, let's just be clear:

If this was “real life”conversation as in your example ,you’d being ingesting your nutrition from a straw for the next 6 months …that clear enough

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

Germany's unforgivable crime before the Second World War was her attempt to extricate her economy from the world's trading system and to create her own exchange mechanism which would deny world finance its opportunity to profit. — Winston Churchill

Germany's unforgivable crime before the Second World War was her attempt to extricate her economy from the world's trading system and to create her own exchange mechanism which would deny world finance its opportunity to profit. — Winston Churchill

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

The case for and against has been made and strongly argued by both sides, but the danger now is that - with nothing really new to add - the thread runs the risk of descending into more heated comments with all that that means.

And thus warspite1 joined the ranks of histories great predictors of the future.