Stanford has a complete and free Programming Methodology course online here: http://see.stanford.edu/see/courses.aspx that includes video lectures, textbooks, assignments and software. Teaches programming basics with eclipse/java. Leads into a follow up free class that they have where it moves to C++

i'm not sure why some people here are downplaying Java and instead recommending C#?

Thats probably me - I have for some reason steered a lot towards Visual studio stuff and away from things like Java and Python.

There's no real reason, other than I have some basic familiarity with Visual studio since I used to use Delphi back in the day. Also, as I mentioned before, I found the easy of which you make UI's very nice

i'm not sure why some people here are downplaying Java and instead recommending C#?

I'm a front-end UI dev and I have to work with that garbage almost daily. I'm sure someone out there is programming in Java better than the people I have to deal with, but I'm pretty damn fed up with it.

Java is the SUV of programming tools. A project done in Java will cost 5 times as much, take twice as long, and be harder to maintain than a project done in a scripting language such as PHP or Perl. ... But the programmers and managers using Java will feel good about themselves because they are using a tool that, in theory, has a lot of power for handling problems of tremendous complexity. Just like the suburbanite who drives his SUV to the 7-11 on a paved road but feels good because in theory he could climb a 45-degree dirt slope. -- Greenspun, Philip

Quote

Saying that Java is good because it works on all platforms is like saying anal sex is good because it works on all genders. -- Unknown

i'm not sure why some people here are downplaying Java and instead recommending C#?

Thats probably me - I have for some reason steered a lot towards Visual studio stuff and away from things like Java and Python.

There's no real reason, other than I have some basic familiarity with Visual studio since I used to use Delphi back in the day. Also, as I mentioned before, I found the easy of which you make UI's very nice

I do because for learning there is little better than dragging a button onto a form, double-clicking it, typing code and running it to see it work.

Of course that may not be for everyone, and certainly isn't how you would build a full application, but it is all about quick gratification to get started with.

i'm not sure why some people here are downplaying Java and instead recommending C#?

I used to recommend Java for learning how to code (and then moving on to a better language when you're going to code for real), but that role has been replaced by C# which is actually useful outside of school.

I'm out of a job as of Friday. I've got marketable skills and my current recruiting employer has a right to represent to try and find me some new contracts.

A quick perusal of other jobs at my target companies show a good number of Java positions, so my new "job" next week will be to spend half the day looking for employment and half the day learning Java. Finally.

I'm out of a job as of Friday. I've got marketable skills and my current recruiting employer has a right to represent to try and find me some new contracts.

A quick perusal of other jobs at my target companies show a good number of Java positions, so my new "job" next week will be to spend half the day looking for employment and half the day learning Java. Finally.

Do you already know any programming languages? Or are you looking to get into an entry-level programming job by learning Java?

I've spent the last 5.5 years coding banking systems using HTML, JavaScript, ASP.NET, the occasional foray into JQuery, XML data transfer to a proprietary transactional middle tier system, and performing system integration with legacy mainframe systems using a variety of solutions such as SOAP and Web services. And I've been working with various database systems since 1996, SQL since 2003.

I've spent the last 5.5 years coding banking systems using HTML, JavaScript, ASP.NET, the occasional foray into JQuery, XML data transfer to a proprietary transactional middle tier system, and performing system integration with legacy mainframe systems using a variety of solutions such as SOAP and Web services. And I've been working with various database systems since 1996, SQL since 2003.

i've been (finally!) learning Java the past eleven months. what i've mostly learned is that i really* don't like being back at school trying to chase grades again - especially on the back of working full-time - but i think it's been a worthwhile experience. i'm on the third-to-last assignment in the final 'Advanced Topics in Java' class, and i can look back at the hours i've invested over the past year and know i've accomplished something (trying as it has been, at times).

my biggest complaint with Java is that the examples skew heavily towards server and 'middleware solutions', which is a bit yawnsville for me. so to bring the fun back, i've been eyeing Atari 2600 development (!), and think i'll move onto that when classes are done. talk about low-level...http://atariage.com/2600/programming/

Coming off of 5.5 years of working on new systems for banking clients, there's a balance between front end processing and middleware and server solutions. Programming for the Atari might be fun, but writing code that's the computer equivalent of a warehouse operation where data's being received, re-packaged, and shipped back out is what pays the bills.

But then, I don't consider coding a hobby. I consider it the intersection of a career field that benefits from my ability to take a problem or set of requirements and generate a solution to meet those needs.

But then, I don't consider coding a hobby. I consider it the intersection of a career field that benefits from my ability to take a problem or set of requirements and generate a solution to meet those needs.

That's the difference between a programmer and a system developer. The former can come up with ideas and implement them well enough, while the latter can take a development project from its infancy to maturity in a business environment. That's why system developer education covers so many fields beyond mere programming.

I agree with others that have said start with a course or book on programming methodology. The 1st course I ever took was Structured Programming Methodology and it helped with every other language I've learned since. I prefer C++ and C#, but the reality is that 90% of my career programming was with Visual BASIC, VB.NET or database languages. If you goal is to be a hobby programmer or broaden you horizons, I think you would do fine with just about any language listed here so far. While I've mostly done application customization and database programming, I've seen both crappy and excellent code written in every programming language I know. By far the worse though, was the older versions of BASIC back in the bad old days of spaghetti coding. The newer versions of that language hovever, help prevent that madness.

Where C (any flavor) really shines IMO is that it's more symbolic than the other languages. That makes it a bigger challenge to learn initially, but after you have it you can write or read a page of code far faster than any other language. In terms of who's flavor to go with, I've never regretted using Microsoft's development environments for any of the languages I've worked with, and neither have the companies I've worked for.

The CIO for our largest client (we are a software development contractor) is really pushing for everything moving to GAE vs. .NET, which is sort of weird since they've already got a billion .NET apps, but that's beside the point... Just curious if people have used it and what their impressions are.

lol...didn't realize this was a dormant thread that had been resuscitated when I made my post. Still stand by what I said even though the OP's question was asked 2 years ago.

Quote from: kratz on June 03, 2013, 05:51:40 PM

Curious if anyone has started doing stuff in GAE?

The CIO for our largest client (we are a software development contractor) is really pushing for everything moving to GAE vs. .NET, which is sort of weird since they've already got a billion .NET apps, but that's beside the point... Just curious if people have used it and what their impressions are.

It's been a while since I've worked close to a .NET dev team (going on 5 years) but my guess is that since GAE is Google there's better support for Chrome and possibly other browsers. I never was very impressed with the support of it with browsers other than IE, but as I said my experiences are a bit out of date. It would be interesting to know how good the porting tools are for it, if they do in fact exist?

But then, I don't consider coding a hobby. I consider it the intersection of a career field that benefits from my ability to take a problem or set of requirements and generate a solution to meet those needs.

That's the difference between a programmer and a system developer. The former can come up with ideas and implement them well enough, while the latter can take a development project from its infancy to maturity in a business environment. That's why system developer education covers so many fields beyond mere programming.

Pretty much. My degree is MIS, a business degree fraught with all the attendant accounting, finance, marketing, and management classes. I've had conversations with business analysts where I call a requirement into question by trying to figure out the intent of the requirement rather than just coding to spec. Sometimes I learn more about the business case, sometimes I get the spec changed to something that makes more sense.