They should have gone to the World Social Forum instead of going to the World's Corrupt and Capitalist Forum (WEF) in Davos.

“In the vollies of bullets, in the thunder of bombs, there are a few who just do not stop, knowing that they are surrounded by death, knowing that they could leave their wives widows and children orphans, but they just keep on moving because something is pumping in their hearts, and flowing through their veins known as honor, devotion, motivation. Death over surrender. This is why they say ‘Death before disgrace’. Pak Army Zindabad.”

In this whole episode memorable moment was when Amr Moussa sitting far right to Turkish PM, hurriedly got up from his seat to shake hands with Turkish Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan before he walked of the stage.

I guess thanking him for what Arab world is unable to do.

Yeah, but then Ban Ki Moon suggests him to sit down and he follows. He should have stormed off with Erdogan. In fact why the hell is he attending this piece of crap conference and sitting there with Peres in the first place??!!??

and shame on Ban Ki Moon that he sits there with Peres when Israel has knowingly flouted UN resolutions and repeatedly bombed UN run schools and compounds across Gaza. What a moron.

“In the vollies of bullets, in the thunder of bombs, there are a few who just do not stop, knowing that they are surrounded by death, knowing that they could leave their wives widows and children orphans, but they just keep on moving because something is pumping in their hearts, and flowing through their veins known as honor, devotion, motivation. Death over surrender. This is why they say ‘Death before disgrace’. Pak Army Zindabad.”

Yeah, but then Ban Ki Moon suggests him to sit down and he follows. He should have stormed off with Erdogan. In fact why the hell is he attending this piece of crap conference and sitting there with Peres in the first place??!!??

and shame on Ban Ki Moon that he sits there with Peres when Israel has knowingly flouted UN resolutions and repeatedly bombed UN run schools and compounds across Gaza. What a moron.

World has tried Marxist ideology and now capitalism is failing. World is looking for alternatives as evident by World Social forum and Muslim are sleeping, Ideally muslim should be setting up their own Islamic organization similar to IMF and WEF, but we are busy hosting Doha rounds to patch up WTO. I think Dr. Mahatir Has been saying this for quite some time now.

I must say, Iran should have been careful as to what they said in their speeches. They gave some rediculous remarks such as "Israel needs to be wiped off from the face of this world" which made them lose their credibility in front of the world. Matters should have been held in the way Turkish PM handled them. It wasnt anything outrageous but it got the point across. Turkish PM did it more professionally.

If Iran followed such a path it would have more support today, which brings me to the next point....

Today Iran, Turkey and Pakistan have the ability form a formidable force. Turkish and Pak relations are already well. Iran - Pak are pretty neutral, if anything a little bit towards the friendly side. All three have a lot to gain if they work closely together quietly.

Benefits1. Turkey & Iran want to get rid of the Kurds in Iraq2. Iran and Pakistan want to hold on to their part of Baluchistan and keep it from separating. Both can work productively to crush BLA if needed or RAW supported agents.3. Pakistan will provide a nuclear umbrealla to these nations 4. All three can gain a lot militarily and economically.

GDPIran = $382.3bil Pakistan = $160.9 bil Turkey = $798.9bil

Population Iran = 65mil Pakistan = 172mil Turkey = 71.8 mil

Thats a combined GDP of $1.342 TrilA combined population of 308 million

I must say though Pakistan really needs to improve in order for Turkey and Iran to have a benefit from such a Nexus. Other than the nuclear umbrella we need to be economically stronger.

I must say, Iran should have been careful as to what they said in their speeches. They gave some rediculous remarks such as "Israel needs to be wiped off from the face of this world" which made them lose their credibility in front of the world.

The power of media is such that it makes people believe and repeat wrong things. Iran did not say it will wipe out Israel because of nothing. Israel initiated it by threatening to attack Iran's nuclear power plant and underground nuclear facilities. This is blatant aggression against Iran and act of war, to which Iran rightfully responded. But the western media portrays Iran as the lunatic. When US destroyed Iraq and Taliban, Iran automatically became the powerhouse in the region. This makes Israel very nervous in the long term. Under Bush administration, they were trying to get America to attack Iran too.

He is great Leader and should join his hand with Achmed from Iran, they have the same interest in some case this are first steps for a good future politics in middle east, now it is time for Pakistan leaders .....

salamualikum

shukar ha koi ghairat tu baqi hai.. gr8 man.. and Khalid .. do we have any leadership in Pakistan at current moment?

if there was zaid hamid, wht a scene wud have been there just think... i think that man has sum guts to be a leader...

Allah Hafiz

Pakistan airforce, Pakistan army and Pakistan navy.. are Second to none for me.. israelies sucks.. as well as americans.. no matter they r better in quantity ... but they r lacking wht we have got all .. its faith in our Almighty Allah. and . our history stands proud..

.. and inshaAllah we will be the one who will conquer this world of mushrikiens and change it to a symbolized islamic state..! INSHALLAH

...,From the martyrs at Badr 1400 years ago, the martyrs of South Asia in 1947, 1965, 1971, 1993, 1999, 2002, and the martyrs of Kashmir, Falasteen, Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya, Bosnia, and anywhere else in between - We will not forget. We will not fail. We will not give up. We will not let you down. We will rise and we will carry the flag of Islam for our future generations to live in peace and prosperity. InshaAllah....

David Ignatius the moderator is Jewish born 26 may 1950 work for Washington post. check wikipedia.that is why the didn't give enough time to finish his speech. all the world see what the ZIONIST doing. well done Erdogan

Good bless great leader Erdogan and great Turkish people. We are going to be witness of creation of great axis, Turkey, Iran, Pakistan, Malaysia, Indonesia.

Older generations might not live to see it but younger people will live in very turbulent times. They are going to watch decline of old powers and growth of youngMuslim nations, China, Russia, Brazil, Venezuela. Economic power as well as political influence will shift in that direction.

Erdogan did it with class, pure class. He made the entire proceedings look shambolic and biased in favour of Shitrael.

The most that Arab could do is get on his feet,shake Erdogan's hand and watch a man with BALLS walk off stage.

This is the reason why Turkey will always be my number one choice for the foreseeable future to lead the Muslim world.

Long live Erdogan.Long Live AhmedenijadLong live Chavez!

I wish I could say the same for a Pakistani leader, but I cant. They are all crappy little sycophantic ass-kissing bastards.

Edited by Hellraiser006, 30 January 2009 - 01:02 PM.

The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammed. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he? " (Lamartine, Historie de la Turquie, Paris 1854, Vol. 11 pp. 276-2727)

"FOUR YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF JUSTINIAN, A.D. 569, WAS BORN AT MAKKAH, IN ARABIA THE MAN WHO, OF ALL MEN EXERCISED THE GREATEST INFLUENCE UPON THE HUMAN RACE ... MOHAMMED ..." [John William Draper, M.D., LLD., in his "A History of the lntellectual Development of Europe",- London 1875.]

"I HAVE STUDIED HIM - THE WONDERFUL MAN - AND IN MY OPINION FAR FROM BEING AN ANTI-CHRIST, HE MUST BE CALLED THE SAVIOUR OF HUMANITY." [George Bernard Shaw, in "The Genuine Islam,- Vol. 1, No. 81936.]

Voltaire (on the Jews) :"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race." (Lettres de Memmius a Ciceron, 1771)

"Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

"There is none worthy of worship but He, glorified be He: [Far is He] above that which they associate [with Him]" (Qur'an 9:31)

Not equal are the owners of the fire and the owners of the Garden. The owners of the Garden, they are the victorious. [Quran 59:20]

Allah knows best [who are] your enemies. Allah is sufficient as a Friend, and Allah is sufficient as a Helper. [4:45]

Fudayl ibn Iyaad said: "Verily, if an action was done sincerely for the sake of Allah but was not correct, it will not be accepted by Allah. And if the action was correct but not done sincerely it will not be accepted until the act is sincere and correct. For it to be sincere, it has to be done for the sake of Allah, and in order for it to be correct, it has to agree to the sunnah."

the Messenger of Allah pbuh says; “whoever does not care about the affairs of the Muslims is not one of them.”

The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammed. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he? " (Lamartine, Historie de la Turquie, Paris 1854, Vol. 11 pp. 276-2727)

"FOUR YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF JUSTINIAN, A.D. 569, WAS BORN AT MAKKAH, IN ARABIA THE MAN WHO, OF ALL MEN EXERCISED THE GREATEST INFLUENCE UPON THE HUMAN RACE ... MOHAMMED ..." [John William Draper, M.D., LLD., in his "A History of the lntellectual Development of Europe",- London 1875.]

"I HAVE STUDIED HIM - THE WONDERFUL MAN - AND IN MY OPINION FAR FROM BEING AN ANTI-CHRIST, HE MUST BE CALLED THE SAVIOUR OF HUMANITY." [George Bernard Shaw, in "The Genuine Islam,- Vol. 1, No. 81936.]

Voltaire (on the Jews) :"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race." (Lettres de Memmius a Ciceron, 1771)

"Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

^What are you talking about. Arabs dont shake hands with enemy? Egypt (largest arab country), jordan, qatar, morocco, mauritania have embassy, or official trade with israel. Egypt to this day has not opened gaza crossing to dozens of trucks with food and medicine waiting to get into gaza. They not only shake hands, they kiss ass. Musharraf shook hands, so did Erdogan and other Turkish leaders, Turkey also has full relations with israel. Know the difference between shaking hands and kissing ass. Know to recognize difference between good leaders and poor ones. You had an outstanding leader before, now you have a mediocre one. Pakistan was supposed to produce great leaders equal or better than Jinnah. Jinnah was not supposed to be the only one.

Lets not critisize Arab leaders. Take it from me. If it was Musharaf He would have stand up, and would have tried to shake hand. Atleast Arabs dont shake hands with enemy openly.

Hosni Mubarak is an Arab leader. He was shaking hands and kissing that tranny Israeli foreign minister Livni days before the slaughter began. please think before you type.

The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammed. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he? " (Lamartine, Historie de la Turquie, Paris 1854, Vol. 11 pp. 276-2727)

"FOUR YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF JUSTINIAN, A.D. 569, WAS BORN AT MAKKAH, IN ARABIA THE MAN WHO, OF ALL MEN EXERCISED THE GREATEST INFLUENCE UPON THE HUMAN RACE ... MOHAMMED ..." [John William Draper, M.D., LLD., in his "A History of the lntellectual Development of Europe",- London 1875.]

"I HAVE STUDIED HIM - THE WONDERFUL MAN - AND IN MY OPINION FAR FROM BEING AN ANTI-CHRIST, HE MUST BE CALLED THE SAVIOUR OF HUMANITY." [George Bernard Shaw, in "The Genuine Islam,- Vol. 1, No. 81936.]

Voltaire (on the Jews) :"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race." (Lettres de Memmius a Ciceron, 1771)

"Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

RAFAH, Egypt — More than two dozen trucks loaded with food, aid and goods intended for the Gaza Strip were stranded on the Egyptian side of the border Thursday, leaving truckers with little to do but sip tea and exude frustration.

Erdogan is confident true leader. He knows his power base is among the people. Pakistan's system although democratic for some reason does not produce real leaders. Feudals with parties who are party head for life. Same as Arab monarchs, or one party state leaders who have to look to America for political, economic, military support. They are looking to score small advantages. Egypt views its border with gaza as a tool for self-advantage. For example, when it wants to pressure America in handing out more dole.

I guess such passion for Islam is in Turkish blood, not sure if you know about this though but in late 1800s, French made a play in which they disrespected Prophet Muhmmad (PBUH) and the then Sultan of Otoman Empire sent a message to them that if you go ahead with this play then it will be the decleration of Jihad and the French stopped the play and all this was said by the Ottomans when thier empire was taking it's last breath !

*¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤**¤*Cry you like women over a kingdom (Pakistan) lost which you could not defend like men.

I guess such passion for Islam is in Turkish blood, not sure if you know about this though but in late 1800s, French made a play in which they disrespected Prophet Muhmmad (PBUH) and the then Sultan of Otoman Empire sent a message to them that if you go ahead with this play then it will be the decleration of Jihad and the French stopped the play and all this was said by the Ottomans when thier empire was taking it's last breath !

I think that incident was about the British. The Sultan said he would mobilize his entire army and navy to invade England if the play went ahead. The play was cancelled and the British built a mosque as a gesture of friendship (in actual fact they crapped their pants).

The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammed. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he? " (Lamartine, Historie de la Turquie, Paris 1854, Vol. 11 pp. 276-2727)

"FOUR YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF JUSTINIAN, A.D. 569, WAS BORN AT MAKKAH, IN ARABIA THE MAN WHO, OF ALL MEN EXERCISED THE GREATEST INFLUENCE UPON THE HUMAN RACE ... MOHAMMED ..." [John William Draper, M.D., LLD., in his "A History of the lntellectual Development of Europe",- London 1875.]

"I HAVE STUDIED HIM - THE WONDERFUL MAN - AND IN MY OPINION FAR FROM BEING AN ANTI-CHRIST, HE MUST BE CALLED THE SAVIOUR OF HUMANITY." [George Bernard Shaw, in "The Genuine Islam,- Vol. 1, No. 81936.]

Voltaire (on the Jews) :"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race." (Lettres de Memmius a Ciceron, 1771)

"Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

Europeans are afraid of Turkey because they know history and seen what the young turks did in Galipoli. They still cry on Anzac day.

If Turkey chose right path then I think so non-belivers are in deep trouble, they stem thier roots back to the Mongols with tough history.

Imagine a Turkey with a 100 million muslims, over a trillion dollars in GDP, minus the unnatural secularism and a real fervour for Islam and Muslims. A Turkey that looks East and not West, a Turkey that can unite the Muslim once again under the banner of Islam. I pray to Allah I live to see that day.

The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammed. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he? " (Lamartine, Historie de la Turquie, Paris 1854, Vol. 11 pp. 276-2727)

"FOUR YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF JUSTINIAN, A.D. 569, WAS BORN AT MAKKAH, IN ARABIA THE MAN WHO, OF ALL MEN EXERCISED THE GREATEST INFLUENCE UPON THE HUMAN RACE ... MOHAMMED ..." [John William Draper, M.D., LLD., in his "A History of the lntellectual Development of Europe",- London 1875.]

"I HAVE STUDIED HIM - THE WONDERFUL MAN - AND IN MY OPINION FAR FROM BEING AN ANTI-CHRIST, HE MUST BE CALLED THE SAVIOUR OF HUMANITY." [George Bernard Shaw, in "The Genuine Islam,- Vol. 1, No. 81936.]

Voltaire (on the Jews) :"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race." (Lettres de Memmius a Ciceron, 1771)

"Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

There has to be sea change in the Muslim world and among Muslims. These kinds of incidents and leaders are small steps. Arab had banked on recognizing israel, but got nothing. Today an ordinary Muslim cant move around in the international world without being profiled as a terrorist. This is not the humiliating position Muslims should be in. Many of us have too much history and pride for that. We need a freakin empire or something. Hundred years ago there were few Muslims in Europe and North America. I dont care if hundred years from now it goes back to the same. Better than kissing ass and getting kicked in the teeth too.

is this what he said! Mashallah i like this guy, you know my two best freinds are turkish Sinan Arslan and Burak Okumus and they both told me today after juma that for the first time in thier lives they was proud to be turkish, so many people are sooooo happy everyone loves this guy overnight, just little bit of standing up and all muslims are behind Erdogan even Indonesians

I dont know why more muslims leaders dont do this, it would give them so much respect and credability in the muslim world, congrats Turkey I think so you are in good hands!

"The mosques are our barracks, the minarets our bayonets, the domes our helmets, and the believers our soldiers"

is this what he said! Mashallah i like this guy, you know my two best freinds are turkish Sinan Arslan and Burak Okumus and they both told me today after juma that for the first time in thier lives they was proud to be turkish, so many people are sooooo happy everyone loves this guy overnight, just little bit of standing up and all muslims are behind Erdogan even Indonesians

I dont know why more muslims leaders dont do this, it would give them so much respect and credability in the muslim world, congrats Turkey I think so you are in good hands!

Why should you be surprised at what he said brother? He is a muslim isnt he? Please dont confuse him with our 'leaders'.

Those are beautiful words though......

The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammed. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he? " (Lamartine, Historie de la Turquie, Paris 1854, Vol. 11 pp. 276-2727)

"FOUR YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF JUSTINIAN, A.D. 569, WAS BORN AT MAKKAH, IN ARABIA THE MAN WHO, OF ALL MEN EXERCISED THE GREATEST INFLUENCE UPON THE HUMAN RACE ... MOHAMMED ..." [John William Draper, M.D., LLD., in his "A History of the lntellectual Development of Europe",- London 1875.]

"I HAVE STUDIED HIM - THE WONDERFUL MAN - AND IN MY OPINION FAR FROM BEING AN ANTI-CHRIST, HE MUST BE CALLED THE SAVIOUR OF HUMANITY." [George Bernard Shaw, in "The Genuine Islam,- Vol. 1, No. 81936.]

Voltaire (on the Jews) :"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race." (Lettres de Memmius a Ciceron, 1771)

"Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

Why should you be surprised at what he said brother? He is a muslim isnt he? Please dont confuse him with our 'leaders'.

Those are beautiful words though......

but there is many muslim leaders! but not all of them speak like this man, i never knew he said these lines i actully havnt heard the whole thing yet maybe thats why i was suprised im listening to it on youtube now!

Al Khaild- Those words are going into my Signature!

"The mosques are our barracks, the minarets our bayonets, the domes our helmets, and the believers our soldiers"

My respect for Edrogan and the Turkish people. They show signs of leading the Muslim Ummah. Followed by close second with Iran. These 2 countries can become the leaders who lead the way for all muslim countries.

Pakistan, I am afraid, is not even showing sign of any leadership. With people like Gilani, Zardari at the helms, I think even Somalia is a better candidate than Pakistan (no offense to Somalia).

a country that still maintains military and economic cooperation with israel and recognize it diplomaticly , becomes the hope of Muslims all over the world because its PM made an argument with israel president.

whereas a country that still maintains hostile relations , full economic embargo with israel and finance Palestine and supports its resistance with billions for so long , its leader gets called a dog ?

what Erdogan said is welcomed , but he should make these words real and worthy of something by terminating his military and economic relations with israel.

Turkey is a natural leader for the muslim world ..... its a pity our RCD didn't work out as planned ..... I hope the ECO is looked at more seriously and eventually becomes more unified to parallel NATO and the EU .... and a beacon of leadership for the rest to follow ....

Pakistan ZINDABAAD!

People who have no hold over their process of thinking are likely to be ruined by liberty of thought. If thought is immature, liberty of thought becomes a method of converting men into animals.

It is time that I reopen the tavern of Rumi: the shaikhs of the Kaaba are lying drunk in the courtyard of the church.

Unbeliever is he who follows predestination even if he be Muslim, Faithful is he, if he himself is the Divine Destiny.

Psychologically speaking, all states, whether their content is religious or non-religious, are organically determined.

Thou art not for the earth, nor for the Heaven the world is for thee, thou art not for the world.

well Musharaff made a point of meeting Israeli leaders on the sidelines of all international forums. World Jewry even considered him an ally of sorts. That speaks volumes about Musharaff. Some people call it political pragmatism, I call it treachery. While Musharaff was shaking hands with every kike he could meet, Isarel was busy selling India weapons to use against Pakistan and Palestinians were being slaughtered, starved and beaten.

Erdogan is very different. The problem with Turkey is their army. It is filled with rabidly secular generals who are allergic to the word Islam. They are the defenders of the constitution and will not hesitate to overthrow a government to keep Turkey in this state of limbo.

The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammed. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he? " (Lamartine, Historie de la Turquie, Paris 1854, Vol. 11 pp. 276-2727)

"FOUR YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF JUSTINIAN, A.D. 569, WAS BORN AT MAKKAH, IN ARABIA THE MAN WHO, OF ALL MEN EXERCISED THE GREATEST INFLUENCE UPON THE HUMAN RACE ... MOHAMMED ..." [John William Draper, M.D., LLD., in his "A History of the lntellectual Development of Europe",- London 1875.]

"I HAVE STUDIED HIM - THE WONDERFUL MAN - AND IN MY OPINION FAR FROM BEING AN ANTI-CHRIST, HE MUST BE CALLED THE SAVIOUR OF HUMANITY." [George Bernard Shaw, in "The Genuine Islam,- Vol. 1, No. 81936.]

Voltaire (on the Jews) :"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race." (Lettres de Memmius a Ciceron, 1771)

"Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

well Musharaff made a point of meeting Israeli leaders on the sidelines of all international forums. World Jewry even considered him an ally of sorts. That speaks volumes about Musharaff. Some people call it political pragmatism, I call it treachery. While Musharaff was shaking hands with every kike he could meet, Isarel was busy selling India weapons to use against Pakistan and Palestinians were being slaughtered, starved and beaten.

Erdogan is very different. The problem with Turkey is their army. It is filled with rabidly secular generals who are allergic to the word Islam. They are the defenders of the constitution and will not hesitate to overthrow a government to keep Turkey in this state of limbo.

bro ..... about Musharraf .... I have to disagree with you ..... he didn't accept or give anything to Israel ..... and it is only wise to talk to any nation to try to understand them and for them to understand our mentality .....

About Turkey ..... the Turk Army is a proud Army with a long long history .... and the current government is in place and the Army has not acted against them .... and will not

The thing about the Turk Army is they will act against any foreign power if they perceive a threat to the Turkish nation ..... no matter which political party is in Government .....

plus .... as Pakistanis .... we should not be "ahsan-faramosh"..... our Turk brothers and the Turk Military establishment has always been 100% supportive of Pakistan and have always been there to help us in times of war ..... the Turk Military establishment has never forgotten the support of the Muslims of the Subcontinent when we were collecting donations and sending whatever we could to The Ottoman Army in the beginning of the century - they mention this ll the time and each time you meet any one of them - so despite them believing in a secular political system - they hold our past support of the Ottoman Army very close to their heart ....

Pakistan ZINDABAAD!

People who have no hold over their process of thinking are likely to be ruined by liberty of thought. If thought is immature, liberty of thought becomes a method of converting men into animals.

It is time that I reopen the tavern of Rumi: the shaikhs of the Kaaba are lying drunk in the courtyard of the church.

Unbeliever is he who follows predestination even if he be Muslim, Faithful is he, if he himself is the Divine Destiny.

Psychologically speaking, all states, whether their content is religious or non-religious, are organically determined.

Thou art not for the earth, nor for the Heaven the world is for thee, thou art not for the world.

bro ..... about Musharraf .... I have to disagree with you ..... he didn't accept or give anything to Israel ..... and it is only wise to talk to any nation to try to understand them and for them to understand our mentality .....

About Turkey ..... the Turk Army is a proud Army with a long long history .... and the current government is in place and the Army has not acted against them .... and will not

The thing about the Turk Army is they will act against any foreign power if they perceive a threat to the Turkish nation ..... no matter which political party is in Government .....

plus .... as Pakistanis .... we should not be "ahsan-faramosh"..... our Turk brothers and the Turk Military establishment has always been 100% supportive of Pakistan and have always been there to help us in times of war ..... the Turk Military establishment has never forgotten the support of the Muslims of the Subcontinent when we were collecting donations and sending whatever we could to The Ottoman Army in the beginning of the century - they mention this ll the time and each time you meet any one of them - so despite them believing in a secular political system - they hold our past support of the Ottoman Army very close to their heart ....

Bro, Musharaff couldnt offer anything concrete to Israel because he could not sell that to the Pakistani people. This is why these meetings were never publically acknolwedged but it is an open secret.

As far as the Turkish army is concerned, i appreciate what you are saying, but putting their help for Pakistan to one side, their commitment to Islam is zilch. Their cosy relatuionship with Israel is proof of that. They do not mind shaking hands with kikes whose hands are dripping with Palestinian blood.

The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammed. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he? " (Lamartine, Historie de la Turquie, Paris 1854, Vol. 11 pp. 276-2727)

"FOUR YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF JUSTINIAN, A.D. 569, WAS BORN AT MAKKAH, IN ARABIA THE MAN WHO, OF ALL MEN EXERCISED THE GREATEST INFLUENCE UPON THE HUMAN RACE ... MOHAMMED ..." [John William Draper, M.D., LLD., in his "A History of the lntellectual Development of Europe",- London 1875.]

"I HAVE STUDIED HIM - THE WONDERFUL MAN - AND IN MY OPINION FAR FROM BEING AN ANTI-CHRIST, HE MUST BE CALLED THE SAVIOUR OF HUMANITY." [George Bernard Shaw, in "The Genuine Islam,- Vol. 1, No. 81936.]

Voltaire (on the Jews) :"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race." (Lettres de Memmius a Ciceron, 1771)

"Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad told reporters on Saturday that Erdogan's move to leave the Forum after a row with Israeli President, Shimon Peres has disgraced the Israeli regime.

He hailed the Turkish premier and said that Erdogan's act reflected the will of the Turkish nation and that of all nations in the region and he has the support of the public.

Erdogan left the Davos Forum after his critical comments on the Gaza conflict were cut short by the panel's moderator David Ignatius.

The Turkish prime minister was warmly welcomed by his people upon arrival.

The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammed. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he? " (Lamartine, Historie de la Turquie, Paris 1854, Vol. 11 pp. 276-2727)

"FOUR YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF JUSTINIAN, A.D. 569, WAS BORN AT MAKKAH, IN ARABIA THE MAN WHO, OF ALL MEN EXERCISED THE GREATEST INFLUENCE UPON THE HUMAN RACE ... MOHAMMED ..." [John William Draper, M.D., LLD., in his "A History of the lntellectual Development of Europe",- London 1875.]

"I HAVE STUDIED HIM - THE WONDERFUL MAN - AND IN MY OPINION FAR FROM BEING AN ANTI-CHRIST, HE MUST BE CALLED THE SAVIOUR OF HUMANITY." [George Bernard Shaw, in "The Genuine Islam,- Vol. 1, No. 81936.]

Voltaire (on the Jews) :"They are, all of them, born with raging fanaticism in their hearts, just as the Bretons and the Germans are born with blond hair. I would not be in the least bit surprised if these people would not some day become deadly to the human race." (Lettres de Memmius a Ciceron, 1771)

"Our race is the Master Race. We are divine gods on this planet. We are as different from the inferior races as they are from insects. In fact, compared to our race, other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement. Our destiny is to rule over the inferior races. Our earthly kingdom will be ruled by our leader with a rod of iron. The masses will lick our feet and serve us as our slaves." - Israeli prime Minister Menachem Begin in a speech to the Knesset [Israeli Parliament] quoted by Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts," New Statesman, June 25, 1982

plus .... as Pakistanis .... we should not be "ahsan-faramosh"..... our Turk brothers and the Turk Military establishment has always been 100% supportive of Pakistan and have always been there to help us in times of war ..... the Turk Military establishment has never forgotten the support of the Muslims of the Subcontinent when we were collecting donations and sending whatever we could to The Ottoman Army in the beginning of the century - they mention this ll the time and each time you meet any one of them - so despite them believing in a secular political system - they hold our past support of the Ottoman Army very close to their heart ....

yes this part is taught in turkish schools as kids, Ottoman Empire ordered 2 battleships from britain and money for them was collected from all over muslim world, then in 1914 britain refused to give the ships to Ottoman and would not be delivered and kept the money, Turks was outraged

Then Ottoman was given 2 battleships by Germans which was used in the attack against the Russian black sea fleet and the storys goes on, thats why even today Turks like German naval weapons and has almost German built navy

QUOTE (Hellraiser006 @ Jan 31 2009, 03:27 AM)

Erdogan is very different. The problem with Turkey is their army. It is filled with rabidly secular generals who are allergic to the word Islam. They are the defenders of the constitution and will not hesitate to overthrow a government to keep Turkey in this state of limbo.

Yes Turk military is defender of constitution and not islam but only on paper, turk has over 1 million men army many generals who are good muslims thats why they have not overthrown Erdogan because they like him, if turk army was so secular they wouldnt allow Erdogan to come to power and also turks is becoming more and more islam as thier popularity grows in muslim world

"The mosques are our barracks, the minarets our bayonets, the domes our helmets, and the believers our soldiers"