iheartscotch:cgraves67: Russ1642: I say fine the drivers and let them know that they can't blame their GPS every time they do something completely retarded.

This. You can't forfeit responsibility for your own actions to a machine.

The fine is huge; for crossing an active runway without tower permission, that is.

I've seen pilots do it accidentally and the tower comes on and says "ok, now you're on the runway and there's a plane on approach because you didn't listen to me. What would you like to do about it? Are you just going to sit there?" Shaming them over the air seems to work well.

There are plenty of tiny regional airports like that. No fence, no barrier, no gates, no tower; just the runway and some automated lights. Those airports don't support anything bigger than a cropduster or three. They don't have any outgoing passenger flights.

There are plenty of tiny regional airports like that. No fence, no barrier, no gates, no tower; just the runway and some automated lights. Those airports don't support anything bigger than a cropduster or three. They don't have any outgoing passenger flights.

I did my training at a fairly busy local airport that has private hangers along the runway that you can drive right up to without having to go through any kind of security and the hangers have direct access to the taxiway.

Russ1642:iheartscotch: cgraves67: Russ1642: I say fine the drivers and let them know that they can't blame their GPS every time they do something completely retarded.

This. You can't forfeit responsibility for your own actions to a machine.

The fine is huge; for crossing an active runway without tower permission, that is.

I've seen pilots do it accidentally and the tower comes on and says "ok, now you're on the runway and there's a plane on approach because you didn't listen to me. What would you like to do about it? Are you just going to sit there?" Shaming them over the air seems to work well.

I did it once; in my defense, the tower gave me the go-ahead. It was a very interesting day.

We actually had some rich guy land wheels up on a closed runway, that we were on. He did it pretty good too; the plane didn't tumble over, like you see in the movies. I felt sorry for him; he was in one of those really cool swallow tailed Cessnas. That's got to be a huge bill.

lohphat:How can motorists gain access to an airfield in the first place??? Are gates and fences too expensive in AK?

Ftfa: "They had to enter the airport property via a motion-activated gate, and afterwards there are many signs, lights and painted markings, first warning that aircraft may share the road and then that drivers should not be there at all."

HAMMERTOE:lohphat: How can motorists gain access to an airfield in the first place??? Are gates and fences too expensive in AK?

Ftfa: "They had to enter the airport property via a motion-activated gate, and afterwards there are many signs, lights and painted markings, first warning that aircraft may share the road and then that drivers should not be there at all."

There are plenty of tiny regional airports like that. No fence, no barrier, no gates, no tower; just the runway and some automated lights. Those airports don't support anything bigger than a cropduster or three. They don't have any outgoing passenger flights.

Even lots of (somewhat) bigger airports have fairly easy access to private hangar areas and the ramp. Most of the security requirements only apply to airports serving passenger aircraft carrying 12+ passengers, IIRC, so if that isn't a big part of what the airport does you can often drive right onto the apron (and nothing to keep you off the taxiways and runways except your own common sense - but I have had the fun of facing down a King Air and nearly panicking, not knowing which way I should go to avoid his whirly-blades of death). Of course the airport I took flying lessons at (regional airport, nothing bigger than a turboprop operating there most of the time) actually had gates at all vehicle access points, but they were all programmed with a super-secret emergency access code that would open them, which my instructor told me the first time I met him (911).

Russ1642:I say fine the drivers and let them know that they can't blame their GPS every time they do something completely retarded.

That is the FAA approach. I had to have that sort of conversation on an unrecorded line with a construction crew at my little airport when they were failing to ask for permission to cross a runway.

Dallas Love field had a cop chase get to the runway and the FAA was pissed to a criminal extent. I think the thing that started the chase had a lower criminal rating that the federal case the FAA threw up, considering that the chase also meant cops were scurrying around the runway.

/Although having access to a 10k foot runway to speedtest a hot rod can be fun

lohphat:Yes but at small airports there are access gates for hangar access. This is no podunk non-towered field. It's an international airport. There better be fences and guard booths.

I trained at a regional airport with a tower that averages a hundred or more landings per day. There is no gate for hanger access. I realize that a regional airport isn't the same as a 250K passengers per year international airport but there's only so much security you can put into place if you have a significant amount of GA traffic.

There are plenty of tiny regional airports like that. No fence, no barrier, no gates, no tower; just the runway and some automated lights. Those airports don't support anything bigger than a cropduster or three. They don't have any outgoing passenger flights.

This isn't a tiny regional. I mean, FAI is a fairly small airport as far as internationals go, but it has 737s, A-320s, and actually more than a few 747s, particularly cargo versions. It's where Boeing sends it's planes for cold weather testing. We had the Dreamliner up there a few years ago. Until my wife and I moved out of the area a few months ago, I was a bush pilot flying out of there. From the looks of the incredibly tiny picture the BBC put up, Apple was sending people through the general aviation area, right on taxiway Delta, left onto taxiway Bravo, across the little runway 20L past the float pond, and stopping them right before the big runway 20R. And I could see how easy it would be for a car to get that far too. Lots of little private planes parked out there, and plenty of folks drive their cars right up to their little Super Cub or 152 and just take off, the tower probably wouldn't notice a damn thing until the idiot just looking at their GPS drove across 20L without stopping to ask for permission. It's a pretty laid back airport, I had a radio tuned to ground and tower frequency in my truck, and would drive between the GA side and the International side quite often. You just had to ask permission, and they'd let you go.