Just a word -- Lok was sent to Bogan NOT just because of his vision but because of things that he has done and that will become clearer as we go. He has also demonstrated madness and that would make his vision suspect, to say the least.

Just a word -- Lok was sent to Bogan NOT just because of his vision but because of things that he has done and that will become clearer as we go. He has also demonstrated madness and that would make his vision suspect, to say the least.

Hm, Lok did mention at least a few times he "won" the Despot War. Wonder what his definition of winning was (slaughter everyone in his way?). Lok definitely isn't a reliable source, but wonder how many factors led to his "fall". The chasm definitely didn't help, but most good Je'daii don't dare go too deep into that place anyway. Too bad doesn't seem like the Journeyers' vision is being taken that seriously yet either. They're concerned, but sticking Lok and Xesh on the same moon was probably a bad idea. Though guess the cuffs were supposed to tell them if Lok visited Xesh but... yeah, that didn't work out.

You know, one of these days, we should have a non-canon Council of Councils, made up of various members from the various Jedi and Dark and Blood (CE2 had that subtitle, right?) who do nothing but argue. That would be entertaining, with their first meeting trying to come up with a better name than Council of Councils... and never progressing beyond that point.

Just a word -- Lok was sent to Bogan NOT just because of his vision but because of things that he has done and that will become clearer as we go. He has also demonstrated madness and that would make his vision suspect, to say the least.

To be fair to the Je'daii, this is quite early in the time of their order so one could forgive them for some mistakes as everything is just... new to them. Its not like they are being negligent in watching their exiles since they do equip them with those tracer bracelets with a droid programmed to check that their charges are ok. Though perhaps they need to improve the droid intelligence... but really, in concept, its not too bad really. Dump exiles onto a moon with no other inhabitants and just make sure no ship lands. So, the prisoners are trapped without any means of escape even if they managed to fool the trackers. Practically though, there are outside elements that can break this prison process with a crashed fighter. Kind of curious now though on what Ashla looks like.

One other thing I like what John and Jan have done with the concept of DotJ is that they basically explain a TOR element with the Twi'leks. In the game, you have some pilgrims who say that Tython is their homeworld and that kind of left me scratching my head at first but with TOR... well, there are Twi'lek Tythonians so it helps explain that. At this rate, I wonder whether we might see Flesh Raiders in the near future

Given the insistence that Daegen Lok's vision would mean that everything the Je'daii stood for would change and their way of life would end...I'm hazarding a guess that he foresaw the splitting of Force-factions into lightside followers and darkside followers (either in general, or by directly predicting the Force Wars). Especially if this Rajivari guy is already established to be an early darksider in TOR. I got the gist from his and Ketu's conversation that that was an early proto-light/dark split.

We know that the timeline goes: Tho Yor > Adas > DOTJ's present. I was pointing out that Stradley said it's an established fact that the exiles corrupted the Red Sith even though everything I've read says that the Red Sith were already darksiders when the Exiles arrived.

Maybe for the most part, the Red Sith were basically like Nightsisters in that while they were 'dark', they were more neutral than evil., until the Exiles came around.

Hey everyone. I usually stick to LACWAC in the television forum because I'm a big TCW fan and read mostly 70's - 90's EU, but I just got the first three issues of this series and I'm really into it. This whole premise of the most ancient Jedi history ever revealed is something I would have wished for but not really expected. A new comic book store opened in my town after a while without one and I found these there. I don't have any issues of the first mini-series though, because they only had the last two issues so I didn't get them. I'm reading all three repeatedly because I like them so much and every time I read them they sink in better. Here are some thoughts on issue #1:

- I love KOTOR so seeing this mad Rakatan guy has automatic ancient-aura because of their role in the video game's story. I take it he's seeking a Force-rich world to fuel his ship with the Force. His Force hound and Xesh having such a strong connection in the Force is kind of a nod to KOTOR II.

- The abandoned stone city looks great in its own right, but also adds to the feeling of oldness.

- I'm fascinated by the "dark" moon being Bogan and the "light" moon being Ashla. In early drafts of The Star Wars the Jedi are referred to as the "Jedi Bendu of Ahsla" and the dark side of the Force is referred to as the "Bogan force" so that's obviously not a coincidence. I wonder exactly how much of this stuff came directly from George Lucas, or if that was just an influence the authors used.

- Since I don't have the first mini-series, Xesh's flashback was new to me. His old character design with that armor was SO bad-ass! Up there with Darth Vader, Savage Opress, and Darth Krayt!

- Well-used and well-spent page on Xesh's isolation, scraping tallies of days going by on the rock wall really sold it. Very cinematic in that and the other panels on this page too.

- Daegen Lok looks so much like a wizard coming out of nowhere, it's freaking great.

- I love the narrative line "Xesh finds reality twisted on itself" and it makes me think what it's showing is only happening in his mind. And Lok says he calls that Force power a mind twist, how awesome is that? Pretty damn awesome.

- Xesh not being able to take off his cuffs without getting caught with the Force and Lok being able to do it again made him seem like a true wizard. I love how this guy isn't a Je'daii and there don't seem to be any Sith, so he's just a miscellaneous Force wizard.

- In the middle of the comic (where you see the staples) at the bottom of the left-hand page, is that wisp of air in the panel before Sek'nos says "That's a trick I want to learn..." supposed to mean Master Tave turned invisible with the Force?

- Daegen Lok's flashback was cool. I found it interesting that when he had the vision and Hawk pulled him back and he asked Hawk if he saw it Hawk just said "I... we're getting out of here!" which I took to mean he did see it, yet apparently Hawk said nothing or lied about it since Lok got banished to Bogan for it and Hawk got nothing.

- I really like the whole Forcesaber concept and how no one has lightsabers. And even the Forcesaber is a rare artifact, none of the Je'daii have them. Having to turn it on by using the right kind of Force is intriguing.

- I also really liked the end where Xesh used the Force to power up the ship. Like Lok's mind twist and unlocking the cuffs, it has a wizard-y feel to it. It's not something we normally see Force-users do but despite being new in that sense it still feels somehow primitive. It fits the theme of the era perfectly.

Anybody have any ideas or thoughts on whether Hawk saw the Force-vision Daegen Lok saw, and if so, how he didn't get banished for it?

(Please no issue #4 spoilers, don't have it yet.)

He seems to have had the same vision but just never talked about it.

I got the same impression. But if that's what happened...am I the only one that thinks that was kind of a **** move on Hawk's part? I mean, the two were apparently friends at the time they had the Force-vision, but then Hawk goes on to let his friend get banished for being effected by this vision to the point that it makes the Je'daii think his friend is crazy, and Hawk never tells any of them he had the vision too? That's just wrong. Isn't it?

I got the same impression. But if that's what happened...am I the only one that thinks that was kind of a **** move on Hawk's part? I mean, the two were apparently friends at the time they had the Force-vision, but then Hawk goes on to let his friend get banished for being effected by this vision to the point that it makes the Je'daii think his friend is crazy, and Hawk never tells any of them he had the vision too? That's just wrong. Isn't it?

Hawk is rather ambiguous in general, as he is also one of the few of the people who had no problem getting the Force sabre to work.

I got the same impression. But if that's what happened...am I the only one that thinks that was kind of a **** move on Hawk's part? I mean, the two were apparently friends at the time they had the Force-vision, but then Hawk goes on to let his friend get banished for being effected by this vision to the point that it makes the Je'daii think his friend is crazy, and Hawk never tells any of them he had the vision too? That's just wrong. Isn't it?

Hawk was banished to Bogan too, but he allowed himself to be reformed while there, and came back from it.

Anybody have any ideas or thoughts on whether Hawk saw the Force-vision Daegen Lok saw, and if so, how he didn't get banished for it?

(Please no issue #4 spoilers, don't have it yet.)

He seems to have had the same vision but just never talked about it.

I got the same impression. But if that's what happened...am I the only one that thinks that was kind of a **** move on Hawk's part? I mean, the two were apparently friends at the time they had the Force-vision, but then Hawk goes on to let his friend get banished for being effected by this vision to the point that it makes the Je'daii think his friend is crazy, and Hawk never tells any of them he had the vision too? That's just wrong. Isn't it?

Yeah, I got the impression that Hawk kind of pretended that he was balanced by denying the vision just to please the council. Lok has the right to be mad about that to Hawk imo.

I got the same impression. But if that's what happened...am I the only one that thinks that was kind of a **** move on Hawk's part? I mean, the two were apparently friends at the time they had the Force-vision, but then Hawk goes on to let his friend get banished for being effected by this vision to the point that it makes the Je'daii think his friend is crazy, and Hawk never tells any of them he had the vision too? That's just wrong. Isn't it?

Hawk is rather ambiguous in general, as he is also one of the few of the people who had no problem getting the Force sabre to work.

That's true, but on the other hand, the Je'daii in general are pretty ambiguous about experimenting with different sides of the Force (which I'm going to write about in my review of the next issue). His ability to use the Forcesaber easily and aggression in showing it off might show that he leans more towards the dark side than than others (which you're right to connect to what happens with him and Lok), but I think ambiguous Force-philosophy is a characteristic of most Je'daii at this point.

I got the same impression. But if that's what happened...am I the only one that thinks that was kind of a **** move on Hawk's part? I mean, the two were apparently friends at the time they had the Force-vision, but then Hawk goes on to let his friend get banished for being effected by this vision to the point that it makes the Je'daii think his friend is crazy, and Hawk never tells any of them he had the vision too? That's just wrong. Isn't it?

Hawk was banished to Bogan too, but he allowed himself to be reformed while there, and came back from it.

Is that just a guess, or something that happened in the previous mini-series that I missed?

Anybody have any ideas or thoughts on whether Hawk saw the Force-vision Daegen Lok saw, and if so, how he didn't get banished for it?

(Please no issue #4 spoilers, don't have it yet.)

He seems to have had the same vision but just never talked about it.

I got the same impression. But if that's what happened...am I the only one that thinks that was kind of a **** move on Hawk's part? I mean, the two were apparently friends at the time they had the Force-vision, but then Hawk goes on to let his friend get banished for being effected by this vision to the point that it makes the Je'daii think his friend is crazy, and Hawk never tells any of them he had the vision too? That's just wrong. Isn't it?

Yeah, I got the impression that Hawk kind of pretended that he was balanced by denying the vision just to please the council. Lok has the right to be mad about that to Hawk imo.

I agree, if I was Lok I think I'd be pretty pissed at Hawk! Some "friend." Does the previous mini-series delve into their friendship more or is it just a flashback in this one?

That's true, but on the other hand, the Je'daii in general are pretty ambiguous about experimenting with different sides of the Force (which I'm going to write about in my review of the next issue). His ability to use the Forcesaber easily and aggression in showing it off might show that he leans more towards the dark side than than others (which you're right to connect to what happens with him and Lok), but I think ambiguous Force-philosophy is a characteristic of most Je'daii at this point.

Is that just a guess, or something that happened in the previous mini-series that I missed?

I agree, if I was Lok I think I'd be pretty pissed at Hawk! Some "friend." Does the previous mini-series delve into their friendship more or is it just a flashback in this one?

In the Prisoner of Bogan, Hawk mentions several times that he was banished to Bogan along with Lok. Hawk Ryo only was able to leave when he lied to himself and finally believed his own lie that the vision never happened. Lok never lied to himself, so he was left to stay on Bogan.

That's true, but on the other hand, the Je'daii in general are pretty ambiguous about experimenting with different sides of the Force (which I'm going to write about in my review of the next issue). His ability to use the Forcesaber easily and aggression in showing it off might show that he leans more towards the dark side than than others (which you're right to connect to what happens with him and Lok), but I think ambiguous Force-philosophy is a characteristic of most Je'daii at this point.

Is that just a guess, or something that happened in the previous mini-series that I missed?

I agree, if I was Lok I think I'd be pretty pissed at Hawk! Some "friend." Does the previous mini-series delve into their friendship more or is it just a flashback in this one?

In the Prisoner of Bogan, Hawk mentions several times that he was banished to Bogan along with Lok. Hawk Ryo only was able to leave when he lied to himself and finally believed his own lie that the vision never happened. Lok never lied to himself, so he was left to stay on Bogan.

Sorry about that, I reread #1 so much I forgot about that getting revealed at the end of #2, which I just reread now. Thanks for clarifying and again sorry about my mistake. I'll probably write about this in the thread for #2; that makes me think less poorly of Hawk, but he still seems somewhat shady to me.

- In the middle of the comic (where you see the staples) at the bottom of the left-hand page, is that wisp of air in the panel before Sek'nos says "That's a trick I want to learn..." supposed to mean Master Tave turned invisible with the Force?

Is he pulling a Mother Talzin from The Clone Wars episode Massacre and somehow using the Force to physically fade away, is he Force-speeding away and tricking the students, what exactly is going on there? Thoughts, anyone?