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How much longer are you going to keep whining? Its been over 10 years since Johto ended, and the majority of the fandom continued watching well into AG and DP.

If you want to delude yourself this, then I can't help you.

You do realize shes right? Most older fans indeed quit with anime during mid Johto or right after OS era ended because of original trio departure.

That's why many of them still complain about original trio disband, or come back in anime few years later not having any clue what has happened in meantime. Asking random questions such as "wheres Misty?", "where is Brock?", "What happened to Gary?" etc.

Just like its case with other sagas where empty places left by older fans are filled with younger ones(target audience), same applies to Hoenn. In fact rather small number of OS era fans continued to follow anime past Johto.

You do realize shes right? Most older fans indeed quit with anime during mid Johto or right after OS era ended because of original trio departure.

That's why many of them still complain about original trio disband, or come back in anime few years later not having any clue what has happened in meantime. Asking random questions such as "wheres Misty?", "where is Brock?", "What happened to Gary?" etc.

And many of these people were likely just caught up in the initial fad of the series. Its the same way they don't like that there's nearly 600 pokemon now instead of 150.

Why do you think you rarely see people online who say that AG or DP was their first sagas? Its because most of the people watching those sagas were older fans like us who started in the Kanto era. Most kids who did start watching with those sagas simply don't come online I guess.

The show changes its main cast and pokemon every saga, that's what keeps it fresh for younger viewers. Ash stays because he's the main hero.

Granted Brock lasts in the anime a really long time, but that's only because they kept him for all of Hoenn and DP.

Well now they took Brock away too but at least two of the 3 original chars was included during the first 12-13 seasons (I don't know exactly what season was the last one for him). I guess that makes it a bit fresh but in many ways it is in stupid ways. Relearning stuff he learned in the begining of the anime. I know you probably not agree but I do think they did the "wrong move" to the fans cause it is feeling drawned out (and I have actually only watched 8 seasons now).

I can't speek for everyone but I have talked with many people that used to like Pokemon (still like the old ones) but they really don't like how they decided to design those new Pokemons. Im one of those for sure and when I see stuff like Genesect/regirock it feels like it's not Pokemon if you ask me.

I also don't think the majority of the fandom continuied that far. I don't have any sources but I think more new people started watching later and every now and then it comes more viewers and the same comes to people that stop watching. I would be very surprised if the majority watched for that long.

I also don't think the majority of the fandom continuied that far. I don't have any sources but I think more new people started watching later and every now and then it comes more viewers and the same comes to people that stop watching. I would be very surprised if the majority watched for that long.

The show has been airing for 15 years, all the original fanbase grew up and became adults. Anyone who was 10 years old when Kanto was airing is now around 25 years old.

Most 25 year old adults have moved on from cartoons in general. People grew up, went to College and had families, of course most people from 15 years ago won't be following anymore.

It doesn't matter though, because the writers attract new 5-7 year old kids to replace all the older fans. Hence why the show continues.

The show has been airing for 15 years, all the original fanbase grew up and became adults. Anyone who was 10 years old when Kanto was airing is now around 25 years old.

Most 25 year old adults have moved on from cartoons in general. People grew up, went to College and had families, of course most people from 15 years ago won't be following anymore.

It doesn't matter though, because the writers attract new 5-7 year old kids to replace all the older fans. Hence why the show continues.

Yeah I agree. I just fund this " and the majority of the fandom continued watching well into AG and DP" a bit weird but I do understand what you mean now.
It dosen't matter because they attract new people?

Well I guess that is the main difference between us here. I do think people that started watching the show from the begining is the ones that should be treated well. But this anime is never ever focus on people that has been following but on people that maybe will a few years from now.

Ofc they make so much money so I understand why they do it. I don't like when entertainment stuff is all about money after a while. I think most things that is succesfull (entertainment related stuff) first comes as a vision. A way to entertain people and in some cases inspire them. That is really hard to do if it goes from working with your heart into "wanna make as much money is possible".

I know the world work as it does but that dosen't mean I always like it.

The anime can continue, but Ash's story need to end. It's verging on ludicrousness to keep this character going for so long without showing any real improvement in his quest.

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

The show has been airing for 15 years, all the original fanbase grew up and became adults. Anyone who was 10 years old when Kanto was airing is now around 25 years old.

Most 25 year old adults have moved on from cartoons in general. People grew up, went to College and had families, of course most people from 15 years ago won't be following anymore.

It doesn't matter though, because the writers attract new 5-7 year old kids to replace all the older fans. Hence why the show continues.

If that was the case, then why are they still keeping Ash as the main hero? If their main fan-base are children who have no clue about Ash's background, his friends and exploits in other regions, they should just start the series over at some point with a new protagonist. It would give the writers much more versatility. This next generation can grow up with a new hero/heroine.

If that was the case, then why are they still keeping Ash as the main hero? If their main fan-base are children who have no clue about Ash's background, his friends and exploits in other regions, they should just start the series over at some point with a new protagonist. It would give the writers much more versatility. This next generation can grow up with a new hero/heroine.

I don't think the writers ever expected the same people from 15 years ago to still be following the show. Or at the latest, DP should have been the ending point since Best Wishes is the biggest reboot the show has ever had.

Brock is the only main character who lasted an unusual long amount of time, ever other main character is only there for 4-5 years.

And it's not just that. It's the fact that Ash seems to be regressing in Unova. If you want evidence, look at his blatant idiocy in his battle against Elesa. Look at his battle against Roxie where he needed six Pokémon to take down her three. And even though the animé isn't the games, Roxie did not necessarily seem to be the strongest of the Gym Leaders. I think she may have just gone against a group of weak opponents before Ash, who wasn't all that much stronger than the others that Roxie may have faced, if at all. The problem is that Ash is getting worse instead of better, like he's wandering around aimlessly on his journey, a journey that he will be perpetually lost on until the show comes to an end, and even then, it may end with him accomplishing nothing of consequence (I hope that this is not the case).

And many of these people were likely just caught up in the initial fad of the series. Its the same way they don't like that there's nearly 600 pokemon now instead of 150.

Why do you think you rarely see people online who say that AG or DP was their first sagas? Its because most of the people watching those sagas were older fans like us who started in the Kanto era. Most kids who did start watching with those sagas simply don't come online I guess.

Eh i could argue they're more frequent than some would think. Im not so much sure about DP, but many fans you can see on pokemon boards indeed grew up with Ag generation with Kanto and Johto not being first sagas they watched.

And here is defeating statistic and wake up call about older fandom. About half of older fans you can encounter on serebii, bulbagarden and similar sites don't follow anime at all anymore or stopped right after Johto just checking in to see if some new info about their favorite characters or pokemon popped up. Many of those posters aren't fully informed about newer sagas at all only basing their knowledge on screenshots and what they heard. There is also large chunk of fandom which don't even come in anime sections hanging around in clubs or shipper community quitting with anime long time ago.

Add to that large number of people you can meet on youtube, deviantart , pokecommunity and similar sites who "boycott series" until Misty comes back reuniting original trio, or those who drifted away when fad died out losing interest along with incomparably lower ratings new sagas have over older ones and it becomes obvious how only tiny fraction of once huge older fandom which was counted in millions in reality stick with anime.

If you combine all current older fans from OS era which follow anime i doubt number would exceed 5 digits.

Originally Posted by ArmadaUGS

Yeah I agree. I just fund this " and the majority of the fandom continued watching well into AG and DP" a bit weird but I do understand what you mean now.
It dosen't matter because they attract new people?

Majority of older fandom which followed pokemon since Kantop definitely didn't watched Ag or DP. Its enough to take look at ratings Kanto or Johto had and compare it with viewing figures Hoenn or Sinnoh had. They were significantly lower being reflect of people interest for pokemon fading away not being so popular anymore like it used to be in its prime time.

Pokemon is unfortunately one of those anime which mostly pay attention to advertizing rather than well written story as well suffering from courage to try out new things with established cast breaking its overused formula, only relying on cast cycling.

And as result of that show is in constant decline with every new generation having lower ratings than its predecessor. If character replacements in such frequent manner is good idea to go with returns would as result of it go up, instead of down.
It also brought nonexistent continuity and destroyed story with little to none references to past regions,friends or pokemon being present, with anime which is supposed to exist in same timeline as one entity making it look like joke compared to other shows.

Okay after I have been readin in some threads I seriously wanna ask if people think the anime is to long.

Cause in many threads it seems like some people think some chars have nothing left to do in the show (Like Brock/Misty/guess May etc is included too).

I totally respect everyone that has this opinion but I will say what I think is the bigger problem.

I do think the fact that the anime is 750+ episodes (guess they will continue with at least another 250) is the problem here.

The main focus has always been Ash and the road for him to become the champion. After this many episodes it gets very old. Ofc all the characters in the process will maybe eventually feel like they are drawn out.

I do think they should have ended this anime after maybe 300 episodes or something (winning Indigo/being a champ that fast would feel a bit to much unrealistic).

So maybe they should have made him win the Johto league and then challange elite 4 or something?

Anyway the real question I wanna ask here is if the chars or the length is the problem here (or if both/none of them are).

You're just now realizing that this anime is so long after all this time? Ofsource it is but if they keep making games, just like yugioh and beyblade, they will keep making the anime.

Kanto and Johto never had good writing, it just happened to be shown in a better time. Plus even if misty returned the popularity still would barely improve after the initial shock faded.

Depends what you consider to be good writing. Imo original series had more comedy, better dialogue and dynamic, and wacky and out of place plots with writers seeming to have much more liberty back in day, to spread wings of creativity and use their own imagination which is possibly one of main reasons why they are still hold in high regard among many fans even today.

As for Misty return goes, past showed how return of popular older character always bring boost to ratings attracting more fans outside of target demographic. Its enough to go back and check viewing figures when May, Dawn or Misty appeared. Ratings sky rocketed.
Not to mention out of all past female leads biggest demand is for first one with many internet places being flooded with such fans.

Either way its not only Misty, because any older character which is well accepted and popular can help to improve popularity.Since they can serve as extra igniter and motivation for viewers to maintain interest toward anime.

The first season was also possibly the only one written with entertainment being a higher prioriity than marketing. Also having a character from an older season return in no way signals the return of what made said older season good. Dawn came back and the junior cup had nowhere near as exciting battles with game mechanics being used more often like DP, in fact it was even worse.

The first season was also possibly the only one written with entertainment being a higher prioriity than marketing. Also having a character from an older season return in no way signals the return of what made said older season good. Dawn came back and the junior cup had nowhere near as exciting battles with game mechanics being used more often like DP, in fact it was even worse.

Dunno, if you ask me Orange Islands did excellent job in that department too being completely anime exclusive and Johto had some of that older "charm"in its better parts at times too. Mainly in start and to extent in Master Quest though.

Either way return of older character may not signal return of good writing, but he can potentially bring more enjoyable dynamic in cast, more continuity in series, fresh twist if hes been absent for too long(longer we don't see someone, excitement will increase higher) reinventing viewers interest to see update and in what direction his story may flow. Which can be annotated as step in right direction.

Which Dawn for example created to extent imo energizing already stale routine series got stuck in.

Yes it's too long, they should just get rid of Ash and Team Rocket already.

I totally agree. I liked the anime up until Best Wishes for the most part, but now its just ridiculous. Ash either needs to become a pokemon master already or just go home. :P The whole series keeps repeating itself over and over...There needs to be a new main character, new plot, some new twist. The last thing I want to see is something like Ash going to the Orre region. *shudders* Doubt that'll ever happen, but still.

You're just now realizing that this anime is so long after all this time? Ofsource it is but if they keep making games, just like yugioh and beyblade, they will keep making the anime.

When did I say I realized it now?
I was thinking about this topic after reading some threads and wanted to ask what other people think. And yeah I do understand they will continue doing the anime but that is not what this thread is about.

I personally never minded the length of any Pokémon season. Could they have made them shorter? Yeah. I mean all the Pokémon seasons do take a long time to watch but if you watch several episodes a day, you could get through a season quickly.