Christian Bale:Seriously, is this term well known enough that a newspaper can just say "he admitted to taking two hits of spice" and everyone knows what they're talking about?

Local interest/problem after several sailors got booted from the military after failing a whiz quiz. Cue the sweeps hard-hitting investigative reports of local tobacco shops selling it. Cue the outraged legislation coming from the statehouse.

You have to be super careful with research chemicals though I must say MXE is kinda awesome. I don't even know why you'd fark around with synthetic pot considering with how much cheaper and safer real pot is compared to that shiat.

Spice, for the uninitiated, is or was a brand of synthetic cannabis. There are many. K-2 is another. Down here in the southern hemisphere there is 'Kronic'

Much as you may sneer at this as 'dumb shiat that doesn't work', it's not that. It's not oregano or some herbal blend that doesn't do anything. I assumed it was for quite a while, I was wrong. They do contain plant material of uncertain origin, to look a bit like weed, but the active ingredients are chemicals that have antagonise similar receptors in the brain to the real deal. As such they work, where work means give a similar high, to a greater or lesser extent. Some last longer, may give you the fear more than the high, whatever. generally these are referred to as synthetic cannabinoids. There are now a few chemical families of these identified. The metabolites of these substances tend not to show up on drug tests either, unless new tests have been defined, as they are distinct from cannibis metabolites.

The problem is that you have no idea what plant matter you're smoking, and the active ingredients are virtually untested and unknown to medical science.

The other issue is that as soon as one active ingredient gets banned, another is dreamt up and introduced to the 'new, improved, still legal!' product. So not only do you not know what you're taking, it's probably not even the same batch to batch, and could be getting more dangerous each time.

It's some kind of "synthetic cannabis," (new window) more or less. I don't think that it contains THC, but it tends to have a lot of other nasty sh*t in it. It's marketed as "herbal incense" and apparently gives a cannabis-like high. I'm only familiar with it because the military is going into a bit of a tizzy trying to crack down on it. There's worse stuff out there, yes, but the lack of quality controls and information of long-term use (short-term use messes you up, apparently) make it a bit of a big no-no. I'm not sure if there's a drug test for it yet, but again, I think that that's due mostly to a lack of quality controls and continuity, for lack of a better word.

L33t Squirrel:It's some kind of "synthetic cannabis," (new window) more or less. I don't think that it contains THC, but it tends to have a lot of other nasty sh*t in it. It's marketed as "herbal incense" and apparently gives a cannabis-like high. I'm only familiar with it because the military is going into a bit of a tizzy trying to crack down on it. There's worse stuff out there, yes, but the lack of quality controls and information of long-term use (short-term use messes you up, apparently) make it a bit of a big no-no. I'm not sure if there's a drug test for it yet, but again, I think that that's due mostly to a lack of quality controls and continuity, for lack of a better word.

/hope that his makes any sense//tired and only partially sober

Correct, no THC. Used to contain JWH-018, 24, 100 until those got banned. Fark knows what's in them now, but whichever chemists are working on this stuff know enough to keep producing analogues that are just this side of legal.

Omahawg:it tends to exasperate paranoia, feelings of doom, potential heart attacks, etc. but otherwise is a helluva...mediocre substitute to the real thing.

ain't nothing like the real thing, baby

Hmm...I have "a friend" who recently quit smoking because all he could find was crazy priced "high-powered KB" kind of stuff which gave him massive paranoia, panic attacks, etc. Have to wonder if he was actually getting this shiate instead.

Gothnet:Correct, no THC. Used to contain JWH-018, 24, 100 until those got banned. Fark knows what's in them now, but whichever chemists are working on this stuff know enough to keep producing analogues that are just this side of legal.

archnem:Hmm...I have "a friend" who recently quit smoking because all he could find was crazy priced "high-powered KB" kind of stuff which gave him massive paranoia, panic attacks, etc. Have to wonder if he was actually getting this shiate instead.

/too damn strong//whateva happened to regula weed?

TBH I used to get the fear from the real stuff it was too strong. The synthetics I tried a couple of years back were no better or worse. For completeness sake - I genuinely enjoyed the experience, and found it pretty close to the real thing. But it was an experiment (well, a few experiments :), and with all the downsides of smoking fark-knows-what, not one I'll repeating.

GWSuperfan:Gothnet: Correct, no THC. Used to contain JWH-018, 24, 100 until those got banned. Fark knows what's in them now, but whichever chemists are working on this stuff know enough to keep producing analogues that are just this side of legal.

Is HU-210 on the banned list yet? I know that was one that was in use

Not a clue mate! Likely depends on your local laws. They only just got around to banning the first few rounds of these here (Australia) a few months ago, all I really know is that the cat and mouse games continue!

the real deal is dandy when it's handy. meanwhile some of the packaged products are not lacking as a substitute.

yes the product does vary greatly. i've gone through a few brands that were ersatz. others produce different results from the same batch. much like dynamite, one has to 'tap it lightly'.

i wonder who is behind the sales of synthetic. someone is making quick and large coin just outside the reach of the law. it's tricky to provide capital for manufacturing & distribution of sketchy items.

Hopefully the experience doesn't scare that kid from real weed in the future, because that would be a shame. I'd hate to think he might go through his whole life thinking it was something dangerous and unpleasant.

I am going to shamelessly recycle my comment:This is proof that a police officers primary duty is to generate revenue. I am willing to bet money that 4/20 is one of the most boring days of the year for law enforcement. More problems happen every Sunday when the local football team loses than on 4/20. Really, what harm is being caused? Too much unity? One last crackdown before we finally vote to legalize?

Gothnet:archnem: Hmm...I have "a friend" who recently quit smoking because all he could find was crazy priced "high-powered KB" kind of stuff which gave him massive paranoia, panic attacks, etc. Have to wonder if he was actually getting this shiate instead.

/too damn strong//whateva happened to regula weed?

TBH I used to get the fear from the real stuff it was too strong. The synthetics I tried a couple of years back were no better or worse. For completeness sake - I genuinely enjoyed the experience, and found it pretty close to the real thing. But it was an experiment (well, a few experiments :), and with all the downsides of smoking fark-knows-what, not one I'll repeating.

Here in [foreign country], every decent-sized city's got a shop where you can buy this "herbal incense." I used to live in an area where the real stuff is plentiful, and would never have tried these synthetics. Now, after a couple years living in a place where mere possession of cannabis could get me imprisoned for 120 days without a criminal charge, followed by hard time, followed by deportation, I've slummed it now and again and bought a few different synthetics. My impressions:

There are about 100 different kinds at any given time. The types on sale last year have since been criminalized. The stuff I can get now will probably be replaced by something else in a few months. The effects are similar to, while being entirely unlike, weed Imagine the effect of a good sativa.... then multiply it a time or two for the first 10-15 minutes. After that, it drops off pretty quickly, resulting in a couple hours of general laziness, as if you'd smoked a cheap indica. Makes the noggin a little speedy at first. Mixing with alcohol is a BAD idea for this reason, and can lead to mild freakouts and vomiting. It does give you the munchies, and you also develop a tolerance REALLY fast, so it's not something you'd want to try every day if you're accustomed to doing so with weed.

So, I guess, all in all, if you're in a situation where you absolutely can't smoke/risk smoking the real stuff, and you're jonesing, it will do, but I wouldn't recommend it as routine recreation, even for serious enthusiasts of chemicals.

FatalDischarge:I am going to shamelessly recycle my comment:This is proof that a police officers primary duty is to generate revenue. I am willing to bet money that 4/20 is one of the most boring days of the year for law enforcement. More problems happen every Sunday when the local football team loses than on 4/20. Really, what harm is being caused? Too much unity? One last crackdown before we finally vote to legalize?

It's random herbs sprayed down with unknown chemicals. "Legal weed", but with a totally unnown safety profile. They switch from one chemical to another too rapidly for banning of any specific chemical to matter; if anything, it probably makes the stuff more dangerous because of the wider variety of untested chemicals users end up ingesting. Stick with weed, kids. And jenkem, that goes without saying.