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Passion Vs. Comfort: Do You Have to Have Fireworks to Have a Successful Relationship?

Passion vs. Comfort. This is a post you don’t want to miss, inspired by a discussion on my (500) Days of Summer thread. Here’s the gist of it. Reader Lori writes:

I have been with a man who loves me, and has loved me, as close as one can get to unconditionally for over 13 yrs…. I was never totally madly in love with him, but he knew he wanted to marry me the minute he met me. I married him – BECAUSE he was a great guy in so many ways, minus the sky illuminating fireworks. Don’t get me wrong, intimate moments were always adequate…even pretty damn good at times. But never, well, you know…crazy great. Almost fourteen years later, I remain married and faithful, but with an empty space in my heart. And wondering if I aspired to mediocrity and lost out on the amazing feeling most of us have felt at some time, of true selfless love. I love him….but I’m not ‘in love’ with him. And that is what has happened to EACH AND EVERY married friend I have, (male and female) that married simply because of the reasons you mention… many have strayed, the others are simply living there…yet nobody’s home.

Because if you take as gospel what she says – “passion or bust!” – you might have a long and lonely road ahead of you.

Everyone I know that married because the partner seemed a great choice, would be a great dad, etc. ended up divorced or unhappy. The FEW couples I know who are happily married – still love to hold hands AND ‘make-out’ – THEY married someone they felt intense chemistry for & vice versa…and of EVERY one of the divorced friends, several who are dating but have not found love, only ONE tells me she made the wrong choice leaving. The rest say they would rather be alone, than with someone and lonely.

Please know, I am not a cynic. I have SEEN & BELIEVE IN great love & marriage, but it SHOULD NOT BE treated as a business decision – it sounds great in theory – but it just brings way too much misery for way to many down the road – you better be pretty damn sure you wanna come home to this person, sleep with this person, and walk on the beach holding hands with this person 50 yrs later…because divorce.. from what I have seen… hurts. And living in quiet desperation…hurts.

Listen, I’m a 37-year-old dating coach who’s been married for less than a year. As such, I’m not going to sweep Lori’s points under the rug or deny her 13 years of pain. She feels what she feels, she’s seen what she’s seen, and it’s perfectly valid. In fact, it’s very persuasive.

However, without negating Lori’s take on things, I’d like to try to balance it out a bit. Because if you take as gospel what she says – “passion or bust!” – you might have a long and lonely road ahead of you. And I’d rather you have a happy relationship instead.

Unfortunately, while I’d like to appeal to emotion (as Lori did), I have to appeal to logic. So first of all, let’s acknowledge that Lori’s working off a small sample size, and, like most of us, she finds evidence to support her existing worldview. Whether Lori knows them or not, there are plenty of happy couples who did not have instant magic and chemistry. I’m in one of them. It’s dangerous to extrapolate from five divorced friends who regretted their choice of husbands and conclude “this is how the world works”.

People who are generally satisfied in life are satisfied in marriage. People who are generally dissatisfied in life are dissatisfied in marriage.

Next, Lori’s making the assumption that every woman who didn’t have that ga-ga, giddy, wobbly-kneed feeling about her husband feels as empty as she does in her relationship. This is not the case either. People who are generally satisfied in life are satisfied in marriage. People who are generally dissatisfied in life are dissatisfied in marriage. This is further explained in “The Paradox of Choice”, by Barry Schwartz. I can’t say what the right reasons are to get married or what the wrong reasons are. Nor can I say whether you or your friends truly settled. What I can say is that it’s really easy to envy others based on what you think they have in their marriage. The reality is often quite different. Yes, even for couples brought together by passion.

A movie called “Serendipity” illustrated this point well. In it, John Cusack envies his best friend Jeremy Piven’s perfect marriage…until he learns near the end that Piven’s getting a divorce. Who’da thunk it?

Envy is always a sin, and grass is ALWAYS greener. Seriously, Lori could sacrifice her marriage to pursue her dream man. The fact that she doesn’t means that there’s something compelling keeping her married – and it’s not simply the kids. I suspect she realizes that even if she doesn’t have the divine spark, being single in your 40’s is no cup of tea, and perhaps a kind husband is not so bad after all.

Can you give me/us an idea of how many of your friends you think/know married people they weren’t in love with?… I’d like to know what percentage of people aren’t in love on their wedding day. I don’t want to “settle” but I think it would make it easier if I knew that it’s what a lot of people end up having to do.

For what it’s worth, I think MORE people are “in love” when they get married than not in love. Unfortunately, that “in love” feeling one experiences is often an illusion that masks severe cracks in a couple’s long term compatibility. Thus, being “in love” – what some might call passion or chemistry – is not necessarily correlated to a happy marriage. Doubt it? Look at all the times you’ve felt passion for someone, which, ultimately, amounted to nothing.

That leaves a certain percentage of people – fewer than the passion-seekers – who go into marriage without blinders on. I would guess most of them love their partners – much like Lori – they just don’t feel that THING that makes you feel like you just KNOW. These marriages have a greater likelihood at lasting, but only if these folks can get out of their “grass is greener” thinking. Once they go for greener grass, as Lori acknowledged, they find themselves in the same morass as every other single person – wondering how to find that elusive partner that gives them EVERYTHING, consistently disappointed that everyone’s falling short. If you’d rather be single and alone, well, congratulations, you’ve got your wish.

If you’d rather be single and alone, well, congratulations, you’ve got your wish.

I didn’t arrive at these conclusions from a textbook. I arrived at them as a newly married man, as a dating coach, and as a student of all sorts of dating and relationship advice. In short, I’ve long been asking the same questions that you have. After dating half of Los Angeles over 15 years, I didn’t rush into marriage – and I wanted to be sure that it felt the way it was supposed to feel.

I remember talking to Dr. Pat Allen, author of “Getting to I Do”. When I asked her how marriage was supposed to feel, she held up a blank index card to me. “On this side, you have passion.” She flipped over the card. “On this side, you have comfort.”

“Choose one.”

Yeah. It hit me like a ton of bricks, too. But I got it instantly.

It’s not impossible to have ANY passion with comfort or ANY comfort with passion. It’s that the two don’t coexist easily. The very thing that ignites passion is friction and instability. Once again, look at your past. Passion is usually brief, intense and rocky. Comfort, on the other hand, tends to be softer and more nurturing.

Comfort, therefore, is not nearly as exciting, but it tends to last longer. Studies say that passion usually dissipates in 18-24 months. Which is why people who expect their passion to last for 40 years, in essence, are trying to defy the laws of nature.

In marriage, you’re not making a decision for the next six months. You’re making a decision that’ll last the next 30 years. And just like one might choose different career paths for passion or comfort, people choose partners for similar reasons.

Consider the 45-year-old struggling actress who still thinks she’s going to be the next Julia Roberts. Guess what? She’s not. But kudos to her – she followed her passion, she followed sher dreams, she never settled. She showed them!

I use the Hollywood metaphor because I was a screenwriter in my 20’s. I pursued it for 7 years because I knew that SOMEBODY made it in this town, and dammit, I was as good as they were. Agents, managers, execs, contests and film schools all agreed. But after writing 13 screenplays before I turned 30, and not making a consistent living at it, I made a conscious and difficult decision: I was going to put passion aside for comfort.

Due to some combination of unrealistic expectations, Hollywood fantasy, and human nature, we seem to think that all our dreams should come true.

I could have been the penniless 40 year old guy who continues to take a 1-1000 risk with his life…or I could get a new career. You know what I chose.

I have absolutely NO regrets.

Hey, I admire those who refuse to compromise – especially that tiiiiiiiiny portion who finds both passion AND comfort in work or love. But make no mistake, it’s rarely that simple. Passionate couples fight and divorce more readily than comfortable ones. Successful writers run cold, and are forced to find new careers. It’s easy to envy everyone else; it’s just foolish to do so.

All of this talk reminds me of a favorite Billy Joel song, Vienna, from 1977. In it, he wrote:

You have your passion, you have your pride, but don’t you know that only fools are satisfied?

Dream on, but don’t imagine they’ll all come true.

Due to some combination of unrealistic expectations, Hollywood fantasy, and human nature, we seem to think that all our dreams should come true. Why?

Because we want them to. Because we’re good, deserving, people. Because SOMEONE has fantasies come true, why not ME?

Comments:

1

Ronnie Ann Ryan - The Dating Coach

Evan – I am blown away by your response. You are SO COMPLETELY ON THE MONEY. It’s a shame we are so impacted by the media and movies about what love should be. The “grass is always greener” is a tough mentality to kick. However it is faulty thinking that creates suffering.

A good follow up to your advice is “COUNT YOUR BLESSINGS!” Being grateful with what you have and what is working can sometimes counteract negative mental chatter that makes people feel crummy about their life and choices. If the grass is always greener else where, then you are actually already where the grass is greener according to others!

Lori – count the positives and see how you feel which may help close that empty spot in your heart. Fill it with gratitiude and see where that takes you.
.-= Ronnie Ann Ryan – The Dating Coach’s last blog ….10/1 CT Event Convention for Reinvention Westbrook =-.

I’ve been married twice and I’ve experienced both sides of the coin. My first husband was a lovely man, what is called today ‘a nice guy’. I loved him all of the 17 years we were married, however the passion wasn’t there, for me anyway, but I never looked elsewhere. He was a good man, the best.

After he died I met my 2nd husband who I felt a lot of passion for, I was like a moth to a flame. We fought a lot and yes the make up sex was amazing! It was a toxic relationship and we should never have married. He admitted he was always chasing the chemistry.

Now I’ve been single for quite awhile and I’ve been chasing the fantasy. Chemistry is a potent aphrodisiac and I do think you need a certain amount of chemistry to form a relationship in the beginning. After all we have to be attracted to someone to build a life together. But whilst the spark might burst into a flame eventually it will settle down into glowing embers and that’s what love is.

So whilst I’ve been chasing the fantasy I’ve been repelled by guys who want instant sex. It turns me off. I’ve come to realise I want what I had with my first husband. A solid good nice man who would take care of my heart choose what

I feel like I’m one of the lucky ones, but then again I think it’s because I’m predisposed to feel happy and lucky in all areas (whether I actually am by other people’s standards or not).

But I would suggest that relationships are skill-based as well as emotion-based, and there are a lot of things that you can do to bring zing into a comforting relationship.

Take a class together, learn a new hobby, visit all the crazy touristy things in your hometown that you’ve never been to, travel, move to another city, become vegetarian, join a kickball league, plan surprises for your partner, try new restaurants (especially authentic ethnic cuisine you’ve never had before), have a two-person book club where you read and discuss things you’ve never read before (or take turns sharing your favorites with each other), tell yourself out loud, every day, all of the reasons why you are lucky (there are lots of studies that show that positive out-loud self-talk has a huge impact on how you feel about something – also works really well if you don’t feel especially attractive, this is how I convinced myself I’m gorgeous!), learn more about his love style and yours and how you can best give each other what you need, read erotica or watch porn together, buy (or make up) sex games that lead you to try new things, have an honest conversation about what turns each of you on.

I think it’s easy to say that a relationship doesn’t have the “zha zha zhu” (as Carrie on SATC would say) when at least part of what is happening is that you’ve gotten into a rut with regards to your entire life. This happens to everyone, but there are tons of things you can do to switch things up, as my very short list above shows. Even things that you do “purely” for yourself, such as joining a gym/getting a personal trainer, going back to school for another degree (even if it’s just for fun and not to advance your career), or switching career fields will energize you in ways that give you a new perspective on your partner.
.-= Honey’s last blog ….One Super Important Thing I Learned From Dating Three Chicks At Once =-.

@ honey, i think this is the most mature post on here and i 100% agree happiness can’t be achieved with another person unless you are happy with yourself, I think evan makes great points in this article and i agree with him. Passion and comfort can both disappear and reappear to those willing to put forth the effort. putting forth the effort with the mentality of “it won’t happen” is not the partners fault, it’s that individuals. I know it is not always that clean cut, but nothing is, at some point in some way, there is a compromise, that’s what the positivity is there for, to help you realize why you made that compromise. Expecting a partner to be perfect is unfair because nobody is, usually the people expecting it. I am predominantly a cynic, and have found so much growth in the emotional department since i’ve started the positive thinking and positive self talk.

Evan selected certain passages from Lori’s posts to support his position. I’ll submit some others I found particularly poignant.

#15 Basically, I just wanted to put it out there from the womans side of marrrying mr. close to perfect it doesnt come without its pitfalls as i told my husband, he lived his life able to feel what it feels like to feel intense passion for a woman , i will probably never feel the same for a man.

# 24 after 5 yrs of dissecting the issue, aspiring to self awareness w logical choices, there is no perfect answer. Its a choice. Ive chosen a life (truth be told) of acquiescing, w the tradeoff of stability for my children. If it makes any difference to even one young passionate reader, think carefully forever is a really long time to love someone. To live safely, without love and passion, is.. in my experience..a life unlived..

#30 i knew i was not crazy in love w/him, but loved him enough, knew he d be a great dad, handsome etc. never felt intense chemistry, my friends think he’s great, ask jokingly if they can have him if i ever divorced. Before marriage I dated lots, had great boyfriends. At some point, I felt time was right to settle down. wanted kids & he was a good choice. I had no idea of the capacity to love/be loved at that time. If i had a magic wand, id wish to fall in love with him, rather than leave and make him sad. Ive tried everything short of the wand. Without that indescribable passion for another person that little something missing becomes a very big something.

#38 tried counselors & self help short of a magic wand (or hypnosis), you cant force yourself or convince yourself (or anyone else for that matter) to fall in love. To male readers: movie star looks have very little-nothing to do w/ it, ive felt great sparks w/some ok looking men & ended relationships w/handsome, successful men. All my friends agree: it is something you cant put your finger on charisma & chemistry.

So it’s wiser to choose Comfort over Passion because passion fades? It seems that comfort can become less comforting over time as well. So in the end, does it really make a difference which you choose?

“To live safely, without love and passion, is.. in my experience..a life unlived..”

You’re assuming that love is some exciting, passionate, and emotionally intense experience that will last forever. If you’re aspiring to live a life of passion, then you’re going to need constant change in your life to keep things exciting. ALL passion will fade. We are all wired to habituate to everything in our lives, including our love interest.

I’m not saying that comfort is going to be our savior. I’m just saying that it’s naive to think that you can live a life full of passion. That’s a very naive way of thinking.

I’ve been in both “comfort-only” and “passion-only” relationships and both have their drawbacks. When I was in a passionate relationship with someone, I enjoyed the time we had together, but I was mostly always miserable because there was no security in our passionate relationship. I would never really know if they would be in my life a week from now. It was great in those brief moments that we were together, but for the most part it was distressing never having any security.

About a year ago I met a guy that I was fairly attracted to. We started dating and during the first year our relationship was great. We had both passion and comfort – we always looked forward to being with each other on our free time and even planned for the future together. We were like best friends and also passionate lovers. After the first year the passion started disappearing. We’ve been together for 2.5 years and although the passion is pretty much gone, I stay with him because he offers security that no other guy has. He’s always there for me when I need him. He’s the time of guy that would literally do anything for me. I’d have to be stupid to give that up so that I could spend the rest of my life looking for brief passionate encounters.

No one is saying that comfort is going to be what makes you happy. I think what the author is suggesting is that realistically it might be the best thing we can get in a long-term relationship.

Actually, I chose certain passages, Selena, for space purposes – to synopsize what she was saying. But yes, it’s a viable question: does it make a difference which you choose? There are issues with both, as pointed out in The Post-Birthday World and The Paradox of Choice. I think, over 30 years, comfort makes a little more sense, unless you wanna be fighting with your husband when you’re expecting him to drive you to chemo. But reasonable people can disagree. Thanks for your contribution.

Evan, You’re absolutely right. In my coaching practice, the vast majority of my divorced female clients in their forties and fifties left their husbands to be with a man with whom they felt amazing chemistry. They knew in their hearts that they were leaving a boring, routine marriage to be with their true soulmate.

And, guess what? After six months to a year of reality, these relationships fizzled. And after a couple of years of being alone and dating, most of them wished that they’d worked on putting the sizzle back in their marriage instead of leaving.

You can create passion by being attentive, doing something new together, or flirting in a different way with the one you love. Helen Fisher’s studies show that you can bring chemistry back to a relationship by doing something novel or risky together–whether it’s something as mundane as taking a trip to somewhere you’ve never been to, or as exciting as skydiving.

Lori — it’s really hard for many single women in their forties and fifties. It’s difficult to appreciate how valuable a loving, supportive long term relationship with a good man is until you’ve lost it for good. Passion is easy to find–and lose. Long-term love and compatibility is much more complex and rare.
.-= Midlife Dating Coach Annie Gleason’s last blog ….Why MidLife Men? =-.

I cannot agree with your reply more. As someone who was in a non-passionate marriage and found passion with another person, left said marriage and the passion fizzled and that relationship died, I am living proof that passion comes and goes – support, compatibility and long-term love is complex and rare.

I have been dating for 2 years now and have had people passionate for me and me passionate for them and none of them work out. In my experience, passion is great for 6 months, but if you’re not compatible you will allow passion to cloud your better judgement and stay in a relationship that is not necessarily happy, good, compatible etc. If you are in a loving relationship, passion can be created, it takes a lot of work sometimes, but it can be created and sustained. Love and compatibilty are much harder to create and sustain.

So, if you find someone you are compatible with and there are feelings there but maybe not passion – go for it. Create the passion because the what is there is rare.

I am friends with several people who are having long term relationships. Some began with passion, some not. They don’t look much different after several years although, there seems to be more angst in the ones that began with passion because those folks didn’t really know each other very well– too busy doing other things.

Passion, unless a whole lot of things meld in very specific ways, can be the source of a lot of pain. I don’t think the same can be said for comfort.

There are no guarantees–and no guarantee you would find someone else that would ignite that spark and also want to be committed to you and your children. If it were all that easy we wouldn’t have thousands of people on the online dating sites and we wouldn’t need Evan to steer in this effort to find love. He can’t offer us any guarantees either—- just logical, unadorned good sense.

I’ve seen some people make some really stupid choices for passion and be very sorry later. (uh, one of them would be me) Might the prince arrive? Sure. I wonder what the odds are……..

Something like:
“Elyse and I weren’t what you might call ‘passionate’ when we decided to marry. We knew we both wanted a home and family though, and found in each other shared values and mutual respect.”

“Now after 20 yrs. of marriage we are still happy as clams when many of our friends who married for passion have long since divorced.”

“Sex? Well no. That was something we did in the early years in order to have our family. Once we conceived our little Timmy and Janie, we didn’t see the need.”

“Sex really is overrated. Elyse and I enjoy having separate bedrooms, we both sleep more soundly.”

You made a HUGE point in your opening line; you are happy in your relationship because you are happy overall in your life.

I think we sometimes go into these situations expecting the other person to GIVE us all the feelings we want to have, when really, those have to come from within ourselves. It’s not so much finding that person we want as BEING that person we want. I think that what we should really be looking for in our relationships is JOY. As Evan says, an intensely passionate relationship is usually fraught with tension and instability. It’s very dramatic knowing that you and the other person could split at any time. Comfort is good to have in a relationship, but I think sometimes comfort makes us very complacent and we don’t put the effort into the relationship that could make all the difference.

I think it would benefit Lori, and others in the same situation to take a look at why they feel empty and unfulfilled. It may not really be the marriage. It might be a matter of doing and finding the things that bring you joy, be it a relationship with God, a favorite hobby, etc. Ronnie is spot on about having a heart of gratitude.

So maybe finding a person with whom we experience JOY rather than passion or comfort might be the best compromise.

Totally agree. We have to be whole beings to be able to share that happiness with someone else. However, seriously, how many of us can really claim to be this whole perfectly balanced beings? Perhaps some of you will say you are, well, congratulations. I wouldn’t be so quick to judge the others though. I hate it when people say “Your relationships don’t satisfy you because you are dissatisfied with your life.” Even if it’s true, that’s a very harsh thing to say to someone, especially if we don’t know the battle people are going through because being dissatisfied with your life SUCKS. There are so many things behind it, so much pain and sadness, so much despair, I think Lori’s situation is really sad. I am in a relationship in which I do not feel passion, but I’ve felt it before, and it’s horrible to not feel it again. I don’t know that I want a “rational” relationship in which I do not feel that intense spark that makes it imposible for me to keep my hands off my partner. I think that’s the way it should be…:(

I agree with Maria. I dated then married a woman mostly out of comfort. She was smart, good job, cute, i knew she probably would be a good mother and i could trust her. Weve been together for 8 yrs but the last 4 yrs there has been no intimacy. Ive tried talking to her about it, telling her i wasnt happy, i felt that we were roommates etc. Ive been in my own bedroom for 2 years now. We get along like good friends but im now disconnected mentally and physically. We separated for a time and i started seeing someone else and both know about the other. Ive been with the other woman for a year now and she is amazing and like my best friend in everyway. Now my problem is i dont want to leave me kids. Im at a lose on what to do or expect

I liked all of Honey’s suggestions. You could also think about what things attracted you to your more passionate partners, and see if they would fit into your current relationship. For example, does a certain men’s cologne, way of dressing, hairstyle, etc spark your interest. Those could be good gift suggestions for your man (Honey’s suggestion of planning surprises for your mate) if he is open to trying new things. And maybe you would like a new makeover as well, to feel differently about who you are in the relationship. Sometimes, people just feel stifled and might not realize that they are stifling themselves.

Its good conventional looks that attracted them to their “passionate” partners. Often this fact is obscured by terms like chemistry but then chemistry is something they feel with men who are almost always conventionally.

So for the most part there isnt much a man can do to increase chemistry,attraction and passion. These things are very natural and effortless

I think a lot of people look solely to their marriage to make them happy “in life.” It’s like they forget the things that made them happy before they got married, or think they can’t enjoy those things any more because they got hitched.

Thanks for the sarcasm, Selena. Very constructive. So since you don’t seem to believe me, how about I post on behalf of those happy compromising people that you don’t think exist:

“I always thought that fireworks were the most important part of a relationship. For years I had short-term girlfriends where I was so enamored that I couldn’t imagine being with anyone else. Unfortunately, those women dumped me because there were parts of my personality they couldn’t accept. And I really decided that I wanted to be with someone who loved me in full. When I met my wife, I wasn’t infatuated with her. I didn’t call her ten times a day. I didn’t tell her I loved her until six months in. Yet I have yet to meet a better human being. Nobody is cooler, more fun, more generous, and kinder than she is. Oh, and we’ve got a great sex life. In other words, I’ve hit the wife jackpot. Do we have the same sizzle that I’ve had in past relationships? No. Do I have a relationship with a person who truly understands the meaning of cliches like “unconditional love”, “partner in crime” and “’til death do us part”? Hell, yeah.”

Feel free to pity me for being completely happy in my relationship. I can take it.

Just don’t make the mistake of assuming that compromising means getting 0 on the passion scale. As I’ve said, if you get a 7 in chemistry and a 10 in compatiblity, it’s far superior to a 10 in chemistry (that FEELING!) and a 5 in compatibility.

Evan,
Thank you so much for sharing this. I really needed to read this. I am with my ideal mate right now (personality-wise). He is the best person I’ve ever met and he is my best friend. We get each other completely and are both very comfortable. We literally never fight, and are always happy together. Yet, I’ve been fretting about our “passion”. I’ve tried to talk to friends and my sister about this, but nothing has helped. I have also talked to him 3 times about us not always connecting in the bedroom.

What’s going on is that we are great sexually, but not incredible. Before him I was with a guy that I had THE MOST INCREDIBLE sexual chemistry with, and I had not gotten over it (still forcing myself to let it go). I kept thinking I needed to be with him, but the reality is… he is judgmental, moody, arrogant, and selfish. I tell myself this constantly, but I can’t get over how much we turn each other on, I mean it’s UNREAL! The passion is unlike anything I’d ever felt before, even a year after fooling around and sleeping together. We started off as roommates and grew so sexually attracted to one another when we finally gave in, it was intense and explosive. Anyway… I thought I should be with him due to that passion, and although he admits he feels the intensity and it’s the best sex he’s ever had and then also tells me I’m everything he could ever want in a woman… he somehow said he didn’t see a future with me. I always wondered why he said that, it’s not like he gave “us” a chance to know that, and I don’t believe him anyway.

Marie
You should believe him. How can you have a future with someone “judgmental, moody, arrogant, and selfish”? At some point in the future your parents will get sick, or his will get sick, someone will get made redundant, you’ll get ill, or pregnant, one of your kids will get into trouble. Is sex going to help you then?
Still, I get that you can have great sex with difficult people (or outright aholes). I wonder if it’s a psychological interplay where the drama and emotion makes the sex more exciting. I doubt that it’s sustainable over the long time without increasing the drama quotient , eg he goes from just being “selfish” to cheating or gambling away your house.

“ although he admits he feels the intensity and it’s the best sex he’s ever had and then also tells me I’m everything he could ever want in a woman”

Its likely that he told that to other women as well.
Many men can feel that great sexual chemistry with a variety of women and the women dont have to be anything special either. Just know a lot of hot players and studs.

I was in the same situation a month ago, but can I or YOU be with a man that knows you and him have chemistry so he dont even need to try to keep you. hes so sure that hes got you that he dont even lift a finger coz he’ll know you’ll always be there. Then it makes me wonder is it both sides. look back at your lifetime have u ever met a man that liked you and u were like O BOY im not into him or hes 50/50. so how do u know that he really feels this passion on the same level as you. think! if you love a guy u wanna do everything for him. Dont forget a man is the same so if he loves u like you loved him he WOULD bent over backwards for you. the fact that he aint bending backwards for a woman he feels this great heart pumping love for for is a major alarm bell AS is a alarm bell if your dating the great guy that you dont have Passion for. So could it be that the guy whom u have a passion for THIS CHEMISTRY THING could it be that he knows how u really feel and hes felling it ONLY sexually so emotionally he dont bother to treat u good coz emotionally he dont really like you the way you like him. So even though u got chemistry, isnt his lack of LOVEEEE for you a MAJOR alarm bell. Whats happens if hes just being a man in this situation and saying GOSH this chick loves me soooooo much the sex is good the passion is good this is only sex to him. being in a relationship that a guy only sees u as sex and never does anything to make u feel like a Queen. My question to you is how long will it take until you start to feel as your heart in sinking and your loosing every bit of woman that u spent years trying to achieve the standards you put throughout your lifetime said to yourself even as a child or teen “if i eva fall in love my man will treat me like this and that” HOW LONG will it take till you realize u get nothing from a man just sex and HOW LONG will it take till you crumble emotionally and start to feel cheap, start to feel like a woman from the Ghetto where you’ve lowered your standards sooooooo low that u dont expect flowers you dont expect dinners you dont expect a MAN to treat u like a queen. When one day you wake up and realize your standards are sooooo low that all u expect from your man is get on the bed n open your legs. i guarantee that will not last loong as a woman to another woman we got this thing built in us that we demand respect and soon, very soon u will feel this sick feeling in your gut and hatred will build towards him and you will be so angry that YOU YOU YOU chose him and you will be so angry that YOU let a man treat u so poorly and YOUUUUU will be so angry at HIM at HE could treat you as a woman who is sooooo loving so great so strong so much respect for yourself so much to yourself as a woman that HE dont even notice. YOU will start to hate him your sex will fade and you will be angry that HE never could treat you like your worth something and that he treated u like nothing. Trust me im 32 i met him the Chemistry man. The first time i EVA felt this passion but after him treating me worse then every woman i knew in a relationship every woman i could think of. i realized i deserve better i deserve more. my guy was selfish and it was all about him. We had the best chemistry we would text and i would be GONE lol he knew it smart guy and didnt treat me real good WHY coz he knew he didnt have to coz i would always come back to the great sex. Now im not with him a month and truthfully i look back at how he couldnt even be non selfish for a woman who loved him LOVED HIMMMMM and it makes me feel sick. i look at him and i think he is such a loser. Any man that can seen a woman loves him and they dont feel the urge to treat her SOOOOOO good for the love she has for him, he’s a waste of time. He is not man enough and now our chemistry is dead coz my eyes are wide open and i deserve better i deserve a man that will see me as a woman not just an legs open girl. So if you find Passion and a guy that treats you like a Queen then stop reading this and marry him lol. But if you got Passion and he’s a useless selfish guy what a waste of time. He needs to man up big time and you beautiful women need to raise the bar.

Go find yourself a REAL man. coz real men know how to treat a woman real good always remember that.

Sorry, Evan, you may think Selena was sarcastic but that is my marriage to a T. Someone posted about people wishing they would have tried putting sizzle back in the marriage instead of walking away, but the kind of comfort marriage relating to Lori and to myself and others is that there was never any sizzle in the first place, so there is nothing to try to put back. I’m disappointed that all who are “comfortable” and are happy being that way automatically describe all passionate relationships to be rocky and unpredictable. That is not my view. I was not ever passionate about those “bad boys” or irresponsible type or those incapable of commitment…there were a couple of wonderful guys I had intense passion with and they were wonderfully good stable men, but I was too dumb and naive and let them go because I thought there were specific commonalities I needed to be happy in marriage. So I married that instead and now have the life Selena described. I will stay in my marriage because I believe in sticking to my vows and so does my husband. But I remember the feeling and knowing I sealed my fate to never feel even a sliver of that ever again, because even if I could somehow change, he’s never had a passionate or romantic bone in his body. And that’s what I crave…now that I’m no longer young and stupid and realize what I gave up. That look in his eyes. That barely contained intense desire. Gosh how I miss kissing. No, I married a roomate and no one who knows me has any idea we sleep in separate rooms and very very rarely have sex. To make matters worse I have the same domestic problems with him that all my friends who did/do have intense sparks with their spouses have. So I don’t see how my decision was any better. I think I would rather have had those intense two years and then just knowing he’s capable of those feelings be comforted that with the right effort I could bring it back out again.

Evan, from all your accounts, you and your wife share a great bond that includes respect, appreciation, friendship, love and sex. These are the necessary ingredients for a great lasting relationship.

I think readers get confused with the difference between “discovery of a greater level of satisfaction leading to happiness” with “settling for some stable features instead of finding a great bond”. I choose the word bond because it better describes what takes place when you see a deeper (and, yes, more exciting!) level of love that includes all of the necessary ingredients.

When we know we are settling, we start from a place of compromise and some level of dissatisfaction. If a deeper bond develops based upon appreciation for the amazing, unique qualities your partner possesses, as well as your shared experiences, great love can follow and the former dissatisfaction evaporates.

Conversely, if you feel great initial “chemistry” and attraction to someone, yet a deeper bond and appreciation does not develop, (or if you have opposing attachment styles–the psychological basis of attachment in relationships developed early in life), your once big bang of attraction quickly fades.

Life is very short. Follow your heart while using your mind. People reveal themselves to you. Observe carefully. Know yourself, honor your needs and desires and choose wisely. When you are happy with yourself you are far more likely to be happy in your relationships.

One caveat: Everyone is capable of making a bad decision. If you find you have, and decide to move on, know this: You both deserve a fulfilling relationship. Moving on may lead to a better relationship for both. Don’t listen to the fear stories. Dating is always a challenge, but people who know themselves and know what they want and need as well as what they offer,do find great relationships after divorce.

No one person will offer you everything you desire. Nor will you offer everything someone else desires. Evan, with all your experience, you know this and lived this. You found what makes you very satisfied and happy in a real relationship with a great bond versus an ideal of a relationship without the necessary ingredients for a great bond. Bravo.

A few lucky ones are able to get both, I am thankful I was one of those. Perhaps when you are very young and grow together it is easier because you aren’t so jaded. The intensity fades, but it turns into “compassionate love” and you realize that is more valuable that the chemistry ever could be. That doesn’t mean the sex isn’t still good and like anything you have to put some effort into keeping it good.
Now I am widowed, I look for someone who could be my best friend, lover and share common interests, some chemistry too but not necessarily off the scale. Thank you Evan for giving me the tools to know the difference and never giving up!

Evan, I would submit to you that you have found JOY which is what I think people who believe they want fireworks are really looking for if the truth be told. They may not have yet learned the difference. I would also submit that those who have a more balance passion vs. comfort situation will tell you the slow burn is much better than the heady rush.

May I ask a personal question, Evan? Does your wife know she is in any way a compromise?

I was also wondering about Lori’s husband if the man has any self-respect. :-/ She tells him openly of all her feelings (or, rather, lack thereof), yet he is happy just to have her in whatever capacity he can. (!)

Granted, I am a woman, and I absolutely must feel desirable in a relationship, but is it really that different for men?

If you choose to compromise, there will be NO passion.
If you make practical considerations, there will be NO joy.
If you don’t hold out for every single thing on your laundry list, you will be consigned to a sad lifetime of longing.
If a man thinks for one second that he is not absolutely perfect in the eyes of his wife, then he has no self-respect.

These statements are patently untrue.

What you’re failing to recognize is that EVERYONE who gets married compromises, in some form or another.

Ask the passionate woman who find that her husband is a workaholic, or emotionally unavailable, or a cheater. You get one thing, you give up another. Anyone who tells you otherwise isn’t telling you the truth.

So let’s not reduce my relationship, JuJu, to something as crude as “does your wife know she is a compromise?” That severely diminishes the intensity and joy of our marriage and reduces my wife to an object, which she certainly is not.

But does she know that I gave up certain things to be with her? Yes. As I know that she gave up certain things to be with me. As I know that anyone who marries you, JuJu and Selena, is going to have to compromise on something, too. To think otherwise is both arrogant and naive.

I respect your desire to hold out for the perfect guy, in the perfect, passionate relationship. I would request that you respect others who understand that life isn’t perfect and choose a different way of doing things. When Lori says she was unhappy with her compromise, she speaks for herself, not for all of us.

So let’s get away from this irrational absolutist thinking, which suggests that compromise is a bad word.

Because in marriage, it’s the ONLY word. No compromise, no partnership.

@Juju and Selena, I’ve heard stories about sex fizzling in the way you describe as well, and think it’s important for folks to realize that someone’s sex drive during the first year or so of a relationship is not necessarily reflective of their actual sex drive. It is entirely possible for one person to have a higher sex drive in the “honeymoon” phase and then have a very, very low sex drive for the remainder of the rest of the relationship. This is one of the reasons I think it’s important to date for a long time before getting married, because this is something that people have not always been in long term relationships enough to even know about themselves.

I know that her lack of interest in sex was one reason the BF ended things with his ex, and now he’s in a relationship (with me:-) where he is the partner with the lower sex drive (though I wouldn’t say it’s “low,” just lower than mine). While some of it is about attraction, there are things that affect sex drive in addition to attraction, and those things are just as important to know.
.-= Honey’s last blog ….A Love Styles Exercise =-.

Evan, I think you are misunderstanding Selena’s and Juju’s points and perhaps vice versa.

I think you are attributing the word passion a different meaning, which is at the heart of this misunderstanding.

Let me illustrate by sharing a recent story from my own life:

I am currently going through a separation. I was married for about two years. My wife is a beautiful person and I still love her very much. I would describe our relationship to have also been passionate in many ways. She would have made a great wife and mother. Yet, we are going through a divorce. Why?

In my heart I believe it is possible to love someone, yet realize that this person is not the right one for you to share the rest of your life with. Based on my personal experience, I believe there is such a thing as being able to just know in your heart whether someone is a right person for you. However, to be able to just know is not as simply as it may sound. For you to have the ability to just know, certain preconditions have to be met. To fully understand what I mean by these preconditions, read my blog post that I selected below.

But my point here is that there is a big difference in having a passionate relationship and having the ability to have a knowing in your heart whether this person is the one you are meant to share your life with. I think in the case of Lori, what she was trying to communicate is that although she loves her husband dearly, in her heart she feels like he is not the right one for her. This sometimes may or may not correlate with having passion or sex in your relationship. And I think this is where the confusion has entered to this debate.

Evan, I completely understand yours as well as many others logic behind the idea of compromising to have marriage based on comfort rather than passion. And I think your arguments are well presented and very logical. I am fully aware of and completely understand that to make any marriage work you have to compromise, no marriage will ever be perfect. And to think otherwise would be na ve.

At the same time, I know that for me, the one thing I cannot compromise is to do what I feel is the right thing to do in my heart, no matter how much I would try to rationalize it otherwise. And I think that is what Selena and Juju are also trying to point out.
.-= Mikko Kemppe – Relationship Coach’s last blog ….How Do You Know You Have Found The Right One? =-.

Actually, I think it is amazing to hear a guy talk about things in his heart. If the figure we call our heart when it comes to emotions was only muscles and blood, we would be animals. There’s something inside us that makes us have these emotions. I agree with you Mikko, sometimes you just know.

I have a strong hunch you’re going to end up like my former husband. We had a long run (20 years) of great sex and compatibility, until he decided he needed to be single and experience many women. He is now one of the most miserable people I’ve known and also physically ill. Lives with constant regret. I’ve moved on and found a wonderful man.

If you choose to compromise, there will be NO passion.
If you make practical considerations, there will be NO joy.
If you don’t hold out for every single thing on your laundry list, you will be consigned to a sad lifetime of longing.

Not quite. Or, actually, not at all so. I don’t think one necessarily (or even commonly) rules out the other. I would just prefer to tie my life with someone I know I want to be with, and sex for me personally is, maybe, one of the three or four most important components of a romantic relationship, so I want to make sure the person I choose for life is someone I want to have sex with indefinitely, and who wants the same with me.

I have been married to a man who wasn’t physically my type, and after only five years together I no longer wanted sex with him (he still wanted me as much as ever). Which didn’t mean, naturally, that I didn’t want sex in general – I did, just not with him. The man I would like to find now doesn’t have to be perfect at all, but from my experience I learned that he does have to be attractive to me beyond the initial sense of novelty.

If a man thinks for one second that he is not absolutely perfect in the eyes of his wife, then he has no self-respect.

Please don’t distort what I said. She told him that while he knows what it’s like to be intensely in love with a woman, she will never know what it’s like to feel the same for a man. She also told him hers is a life unlived. Theirs is a marriage that’s marginal at best (for her). I do believe my resulting question is legitimate.

And I never did dispute that marriage is a compromise, and that no one will be 100% what you want (nor will I be anyone’s *ideal* choice). Although I certainly would not want to hear my mate harp on everything he’s given up on or settled for by choosing to be with me. I don’t want him to rationalize his decision, nor do I want to have to rationalize mine.

Sorry I hit a nerve Evan. I didn’t mean to be sarcastic as much as I meant to light-heartedly portray some marriages I’ve heard described elsewhere. I read some sites that are not devoted to dating as much as they are to troubled relationships. A common, COMMON, complaint is where one spouse has totally lost interest in sex and the other is that their wits end with frustration.

Sometimes there seems to have been a bait and switch involved: the person seemed passionate at first, but cooled off in the months after the ceremony. In others, the spouse writing in admits things were never “that great” in the bedroom, but they thought the situation would improve after marriage. And sometimes they admit it didn’t really matter at first, but as the years went by, decades in some cases, the lack of passion came to be translated into a lack of love. Sometimes of simple interest in the other person.

And inevitably these people are emotionally torn on what to do. They describe their spouse as “a great parent”, “we get along very well”, “my best friend” , “would be terrible to divorce”. But like Lori mentioned in one of her posts, that little something that was missing at the start, had turned into something very big. An elephant in the room.

You may not have been crazy infatuated with your wife off the bat Evan, but re-read your post…you write about her PASSIONATELY. You do. As a person who interests you, and I guess you could call it a bonus that you have a great sex life. 😉

This is not the same as advising people to consider marrying someone for whom they feel little in the way of sparks just so they can avoid the horrors! of being single over 40. Though perhaps that was a fear of yours? Another thing Lori wrote, that I’ve read other people say elsewhere, was about preferring to be alone rather than LONELY in a marriage. This is what can happen when ‘comfort’ wears off just as it can when passion does.

Initially I thought your comment about fighting on the way to chemo was pretty lame. Now thinking about it, I’d LOVE to be fighting with someone on my way to chemo. Because it would show we were still passionate about each other, and life! Something I imagine I’d need going in for chemo. And other difficult situations.

Whoa ho! So many staggering assumptions I scarcely know where to begin. Talk about absolutest thinking my friend.

Compromise is more likely, certainly more palatable with some passion for backup.

Since when did JOY and practical considerations become mutually exclusive? Not in my world.

I don’t HAVE a laundry list, much less hold out for everything on one and drown in longing. There are dealbreakers, everything else depends on the individual.

There is a man alive who thinks he’s perfect in the eyes of his wife? Really? On earth?

I’m neither arrogant, nor naive and I think the concept of holding out for the “perfect guy” is ludicrous. There is no such thing as a perfect PERSON let alone guy.

CLEARLY, Lori speaks for herself, but it was YOU who chose to make her words an example for your essay EMK. She mentioned some of her friends, but no where in her writing did I see she mentioned YOU or “the rest of us” whoever “the rest of us” is. And she is not the only person who’s written here after finding “settling” wasn’t quite all it’s cracked up to be. YOU KNOW THAT if you read your own blog.

Selena #3, “It seems that comfort can become less comforting over time as well.”

So true. When you know you know. If you’ve never been attracted to the guy you never will.

I think this becomes an issue at the point of deciding whether to date – or continue to someone based on shallow criteria – i.e. hair color/height/occupation, etc. And you have to figure out whether you’re adding neorotic ‘roadblocks’ preventing you from pursuing your heart, or if it’s real. By the time you get to wedding day, if it’s not there, it never will be.

Your heart and gut never lie.

People who are holding hands after 40+ years are comfortable with themselves and are selfless toward their partners. If you feel as if you’ve settled upon wedding day it won’t change.

Lori: I’m gonna be brutally frank. Either get over yourself or get into yourself. You say you married the dude knowing you were doing it for reasons other than love — because the timing seemed right, or he’d make a good father, or to suit what other requirements you thought you needed to be an acceptable woman in the eyes of others (because heaven forbid you should be a “spinster”). But what you were actually doing was making yourself comfortable by using someone else, namely your husband. And now that you’re still not comfortable with who you are, within the acceptable sanctity of marriage, home & hearth, you believe it’s because this same guy isn’t shooting you to the moon between the sheets every night. You crave what you think other lucky couples have — sparks AND compatibility. Just who are these lucky, lucky couples, because I’d like to meet them and hear what they have to say about their constant contentment. Chances are they have their blah periods or times when they rack their brains trying to remember what it was about their spouse that made them lust for them way back when. OR they grow to despise in their spouse the very thing that made them seem so HOT in the first place. Marriage is a crapshoot and messy, and — you’re absolutely right — often winds up being very tepid at times. But ya know what? There’s a whole lot of women, myself included, who would be glad to have such problems. Instant chemistry is exactly that — instantaneous combustion not meant to last. When you’re in it for the long haul, sometimes you gotta break out the flint, do a lot of rubbing, and pray for sparks. Come on, Lori, you’ve HAD the full-flush hot stuff in the past with other guys — but is it just coincidence that you didn’t wind up marrying any of them??? No, silly, it’s because for one reason or another, they weren’t good long-term partners. When we feel unhappy with ourselves, the first thing we tend to do is point the finger at the “other,” and start looking over the fence… convincing ourselves that IF ONLY we had those glorious sparks, everything else would fall into place. Maybe you even have a particular dude you’re craving & you’re sure he could fill that void for you. But I can tell you — from the mouths of married women who’ve gone there, done that — it’s a fantasy, a delusion. As for your friends who say they’d rather be alone than in a non-sparks marriage with a nice guy — well, may they embrace that alone-ness, live long and prosper from within it. Meanwile, there’s plenty of women out there who would be more than willing to recognize these nice guys for who and what they are. But if you’re miserable now, you’ll no doubt still be miserable without your current husband. He, on the other hand, might actually wind up happier without you — because at least he’d be free to find a woman who not only thinks he’s good enough, but actually finds him to be damn good — and a nice, responsible guy to boot.

Stop talking with your girlfriends about your passionless marriages. It’s only going to make you focus more and more on the passion you feel is lacking and make all the good things move to the background. Put the passion you have for complaining about it into a pool dancing class or something like that. How passionate are you yourself? Do you dress a little sexy, do you laugh a lot, are you engaged with life? Shake things up. Comfort and familiarity is the death of passion. It’s easy to feel passionate in the first few months of a relationship … it’s a fantasy that you will feel the same passion after 20 years of marriage. There’s no one on this planet with whom you will experience this.

Every post allows me to see the issue from so many interesting angles, all valid/valuable perspectives (well..maybe w/ the exception of Zann…ha ha) The fact remains (and I am speaking from my heart…and its a pretty big heart), I stay not because there is some unspoken, secret love of the ‘comfort’, but because i would rather feel the empty space than to hurt my husband and my children. I am NOT afraid to be alone, I am not afraid that i could not find a sexy man to date if single (im not yet 40 by the way and Im fairly confident id be a fun date), I only mentioned a few friends, but unfortunately I have know many/heard of many who live in quiet desperation as well…i simply want to show the other side of the settling issue, or of the index card “passion / comfort” – because if there is anyone who questions the walk down the aisle now….make sure you are really REALLY sure, because in marriage, the puddle between you becomes the brook, becomes a stream becomes the river becomes the grand canyon…and its pretty damn near impossible to bring that thing back together.

Evan – i have read paradox of choice, and pretty much every other book i can get my hands on that you and several other relationship knowledge seekers have ever suggested – have you read the article from the Atlantic re happiness? http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200906/happiness
pretty deep stuff there… long but worthwhile and it seems you are quite the reader yourself. i think another part of the whole issue is that we, as humans, (as raw as it sounds)… are still so fresh out of the cave – and what worked (p.e.a. etc) to keep us together to create/nurture babies, and live to the ripe old age of 40 50 or 60, just simply maybe doesn’t often doesnt work anymore?! The article suggests that the happiest in old age amongst us have really lived, that it is better to squeeze the lemons into lemonade of life. My BIGGEST fear..much bigger than of being alone, is that i am teaching my kids, leading by example, to aspire to mediocrity in life.. or maybe better stated.. to endure a stale ‘comfy’ marriage because thats what people do. And because so many people do so as per societal conventions, there is adultery, divorce, blah blah blah…. statistics are only a small percentage of the amount of people who actually stray… and from what ive read the statistic is pretty high – my guess, from what i have witnessed (MANY people share their personal stories with me, even strangers…im logical and compassionate and overall non-judgemental – tollerant/intollerant of what i allow in my life but non judgemental when hearing others lifestories) is that there are many seemingly happily married couples where one person is in fact very lonely… look at alcohol abuse, drug dependency, depression meds, etc. in the western world – it is out of control – too many people want to numb themselves of their pain.

This is the same discussion that we always have – there are people who can have pleasurable sex without being attracted to their partners
and there are those who find sex distasteful with a partner who is not sexually attractive to them.

I know which one I am..
I am rather without sex and single – than distasteful sex in a relationship. (because that it would be after several years, when my partner would get his O, and I would always be without)

as simple as that.

So if I thought sex is not something that I need in a relationship, I could settle.

I would like to see for once that you are going to recommend that he starts a relatioship with a woman, whom he doesn’t fancy sexually ..
(Because that is what you are always recommending to women..)

It is easy, if you see plenty of members of opposite sex whom you fancy..
I don’t
– and I am not going to prostitute myself for rest of my life to have a relationship.

The reason this is not suggested to men is that men can be perfectly attracted to average looking women, sexually. The author undetstands that women are selective and find a much smaller number of men sexually desirable than vice versa. Its a statistical reality that a large number of women would feel they have compromised on desire since there simply arent enought hot men to go around

You are fixated on “conventional attractiveness” and pretend it’s a standard that’s not achievable for most men. Yes, I want a fit, strong sex partner who looks good in and out of clothes. Must he be Adonis face wise? Heck no. Should he exercise regularly & eat / drink in moderation? Yes, it’s good for him and his stamina, thus good for me.

You know what makes a man hot to me & so many others? Confidence, imagination, humor, kindness, self respect. More than once, when I couldn’t detect these qualities, my attraction to a potential hot lay disappeared before we ever got properly started.

You know what else turns me off? When I sense he’s not excited about me at all. We didn’t have fireworks in the beginning, but I really appreciated my mate more with each year. He’s a pretty great fit for me & I still think myself lucky to be with him, but I so regret our state of sex.

We got married (I felt sure, except I wondered why we didn’t have any sex for the 2 weeks before or half a week after the event), we planned for & had kids (we were both not sure, but turns out that was a great decision), and here we are, each trying to get some excitement on the side.

Oh it makes me so sad. Not because I mind him getting some strange on occasion. But because there’s not much passion for me. I guess he thought I was just right, and got so comfortable so fast, and he won’t do a thing he doesn’t “feel like” (I’m to accept this because “this is who he is”), which means no pleasuring me between the times when _he_ feels physical desire (which is not specific to me, I just happen to be there & available). He’s just smart enough, kind enough & responsible enough elsewhere that this isn’t a total deal breaker. But I need a friend with benefits, because I’m not yet forty & feeling so little passion is just sad.

If he wanted me, or were more happily generous with his attentions, I’d be panting for my husband right now. But he’s tepid at best, and, though I understand that’s his baseline drive with ANYONE, I can’t help but know that getting wet about him would be a kind of self betrayal. Like yearning for someone who doesn’t care for you the same way. I’m very GGG, but my trying to seduce him, whether getting dressed up, or prancing about in pretty underthings, or offering a morning rub or an afternoon bj, are 0% effective 98% of the time, and he views my interest in sex as unwelcome “pressure”.

Then, when he finally gets around to feeling horny AND actually doing something about it, it doesn’t mean there’ll be an orgasm for me, unless I give myself one. My girl parts are sensitive, he hasn’t the knack of rubbing them right, and rarely tries, as he says getting others off was/is way easier & I’m too fiddly.

Knowing all this, I (surprise!) don’t get wet quickly or very much, and he then interprets that to mean I’m not exciting because I don’t obviously want him. I think he views getting me off (which can take a while, especially as I get self conscious about his impatience) as mostly a chore, unless he’s ready to have intercourse for a while.

I married the man I wanted to be with, and was so hopeful our sex would keep getting better with lots of practice. He’d rather (occasionally) do what he knows with someone new who “just gets off” spontaneously.

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