I don’t quite understand what you’re objecting to here. Different cultures will have different definitions of masculinity and femininity – and much bad comedy will be made based on the misunderstandings so produced – but my definition holds cross-culturally.

No one seems to have addressed my little offering seriously. I am sad.

–Devin

]]>By: rani79http://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149254
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149254#62 – I’m sorry, it’s just plain wrong to suggest that a child needs a mother and a father to grow up healthy and or happy – and it is double wrong to suggest that a child needs a mother and a father that were born a specific sex or gender.

Studies have shown that children of LGBT parents are at least as healthy, happy, and well adjusted (if not more) than children from conventional marriages. What’s most important is to have parents who wanted you, and prepared for you and made a very intentional decision to bring children into their lives. Thomas obviously has – rock on.

]]>By: Smjorhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149257
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149257#62 – I don’t think anyone here has said that gender doesn’t make any difference. People have said that it is fluid and subject to change, and people have said that it shouldn’t matter, but I don’t recall anyone laboring under the delusion that it doesn’t matter.

That said, two gender parenting isn’t necessary for the healthy development of a child. Need examples? How about all of the examples of gay couples raising well-adjusted children? How about the endless examples of single parents raising solid kids? I knew a girl in high school who was being raised by her grandmother and her aunt, and she seemed pretty okay.

If that’s not enough, let’s take a look at nature. Two gender parenting is not generally the norm among mammals. Males are programmed to spread their seed as far and wide as possible and, as such, don’t tend to stick around for the rearing. Elephants raise their offspring in communities that do not include any adult males.

I think that while gender identity is important to each individual’s sense of self, it is not very relevant to their child. I think that most children are not very concerned with what is in mommy’s pants as what is in mommy’s heart.

]]>By: Dorthygalehttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-150282
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-150282There have been several comments about adoption. I can only guess that most of these come from people who have never adopted. Adoption is not quick. Not simple or easy. It is intensive, expensive, painfully slow, and a process where the adoptive family has no control or say whatsoever.

A quick and easy home insemination and a transgendered father giving birth is SOOOOOOO much easier than adopting.

Don’t misunderstand, adoption is wonderful. I’m an adoptive mother, that’s the path to my children. But it’s hard and slow. So much harder and less certain than your average pregnancy and delivery. Our society doesn’t make adoption easy or inexpensive.

It seems a little flipant to say “well why didn’t he just adopt” when there is no such thing as “just adopting.”

That’s my opinion anyway.

]]>By: sonny p fontainehttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149515
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149515rani79 @30
“This article was incredible – I am in awe of his bravery and strength. Thank you for posting this”
really? i mean, i’m happy for him and admittedly more then a little jealous, and not that pregnancy isn’t tough, but come on. really?
]]>By: JustanAngelhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-158731
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-158731I’m sorry this is wrong and I can see how and why some in the transgenger community are upset by this! This isn’t a man that is pregnant, its a woman who lives on the outside as a man but everything inside her is female. Its a female who cut off her breasts, took testorone, grew some facial hair, but yet still has her ovaries and uterus…..I think he/she is a little confused! The only reason they went public with this was to sell the book he/she is writing! That’s my opinion!
]]>By: UnfunnyBoinghttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-159244
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-159244Wh crs. Th md clms mn s prgnnt, s t trns t, t’s wmn, g fgr. S sh blvs sh s h, k, hv n grnds fr rgng tht, f sh s sffrng frm sm fflctn, mntl r physcl, g hd nd grw brd? Wht s tht nywy? s t nt ngh t b lglly prnncd ml? Sh hs t grw brd? mn, sh lft bg prt f bng wmn n hr bdy, s brd rlly gnn fd tht t f hr mnd?

]]>By: rileyhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-156941
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-156941All I can say is WOW!!! First, let me say that I am a transman and there are alot of ignorant things being said in this post! I know your entitled to your opinions, but, well, whatever. I know people are not comfortable with this issue. If they were, this article would never had been published but I agree that we need more stories like this out there. Without knowledge, there isn’t any education. Honestly, I’m sure that he could care less about how you feel about him having a child and more power to him. It had to be a difficult journey for him and his wife to take. So I say, don’t pass judgment on this man. Let him live his life.
]]>By: DoctorE123http://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-156688
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-156688I may be a little conservative… but I didn’t realize that you can surgically remove your breasts and take hormone testosterone pills and THEN call yourself male… maybe I am mistaken but I thought that giving birth was the main thing that distinguished us females from males…

i believe if you want to be a transgender.. go for it I guess.. but you can’t partially become male and still keep your abilities to have children.. if you want to give childbirth stay female!

btw, breast feeding is the best way to feed your child for many reason, how can someone do that with no breasts?

]]>By: JustanAngelhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-158736
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-158736One more thing, if they really wanted a biological child then why didn’t he/she just have them freeze her eggs and have a surogate carry the child?? That can be done! It’s great they want a child and be parents, that’s not what I’m against, what I’m against is this woman claiming she’s a man! I really do believe its a publicity stunt for books sales!
]]>By: Moonhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149265
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149265Rush Limbaugh’s head just exploded!

If we just a donkey to give birth to a human being, we can also get Hannity and Savage’s head to explode!

Hahahahaha! Good job, transgender dudette/dude/whatever!

:D

]]>By: Jeffhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149010
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149010How fascinating. How sf is this? And it makes me very uncomfortable, but in a way that indicates I have a bit of dogma to hunt down and kill.
]]>By: scottfreehttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149268
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149268It may in some ways be dated now, but I highly recommend the chapters in Butlers gender trouble dealing with psychoanalysis.

Although in practice, transgender should be simple [ie you’re transgendered, I’m over it already], I agree with #62 to some extent; in the realm of theory, it tends to be more complicated. With FtMs I understand surgery isn’t done; testosterone injections swell up the clitoris into a small penis, and thats as good as technology currently allows, although in a few years, who knows? But even MtF isn’t a massive medical procedure. Both genetic men and women come from the same stuff; to make the change, simply rearrange.

Anyway, its a whole other argument, but I agree with Freud that gender is more less derived from having to deal with ones parents. You eventually identify with your competitor for love. Or not, if you’re weird. For Freud, everyone starts out bisexual. Butler added to that gender as a performance conditioned by desire [which as Lacan says is /always/ desire for the desire of the other]. The Buddhists here may disagree, but one cannot escape desire, and therefore gender. It does not follow that there are only two genders, however. Admittedly, people are more or less the same, but why not say there are as many genders as sexualities?

I really wish I had the link, but an Australian group issued a manifesto demanding new artificial sex organs more efficiently designed for sexual pleasure. Really, up with that sort of thing.

he is biologically a female. he started life as a female, lived life as a female, and then mid-life decided he should be male.

Wow, huge amount of sympathy you have there for someone who had to live for years in a body that was WRONG and DID NOT FIT. Have you even thought about what that must be like? Those of us who are born in bodies that fit our brains should support people who aren’t as lucky, not laugh at them and make their lives even harder.

I’m sitting over here admiring the love this couple must share, that after so much work and effort for Mr. Beattie to finally get a body that matches (to some approximation) the gender he is in his head, he would set that process aside for a while in order to help his wife have a baby. That must have taken a lot of serious thought, and I wish both of them well. Their child may hear about gender issues sooner than a lot of children–but I trust they’ll handle it in an age-appropriate fashion, and I bet you their kid is never going to be the one yelling dirty names at the gay kid in school, either.

I do admit one of my immediate thoughts on seeing this article was, “oh dear, wonder what the mpreg folks are saying,” though. I don’t think I want to know!

]]>By: Blainehttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149269
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149269Here… I can be someone for everyone to hate:

Side A: Not your life. Be glad your mother didn’t have a full beard. There was once a time where people didn’t have machine or baboon hearts. That time is gone.

Side B: If gender doesn’t matter, then why change it in the first place? A person’s sex doesn’t match their gender, they change it… fine. But this whole mix-n-match, one from column A one from column B salad bar approach IS WEIRD. The vast majority of people do not do this. You can go on and on about how it’s beautiful, or special or anything you can conjure – you will never trump, ever trump, the fact that it’s just bizarre. Doesn’t negate any of your points… just deal with the fact that it’s odd.

Side C: I’m quite sure there’s biological stratum of gender, but it’s not a naturally occurring phenomenon for this to manifest itself physically.
Just because medical science is now allowing for us to build physical representations of these levels doesn’t mean everyone should be like “Oh, what an understandable phenotype!”

So in conclusion, layer whatever caring and sensitive or confused and aggravated patina over the following, indisputable truths:

Genetically male humans don’t give birth.

We’re now at a point where we’re surgically manufacturing ones that do.

Focus on whichever of those two points that irritates you and beat it into your skull until you accept that fact.

]]>By: Teresa Nielsen Hayden / Moderatorhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-159509
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-159509UnfunnyBoing, Katib, if you won’t read the preceding thread, or read up on the subject — i.e., if you won’t pay attention to anyone else’s opinion, even if they know quite a lot more than you do — I see no reason why we should feel obliged to go on paying attention to your opinions.
]]>By: Takuanhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-159256
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-159256what an extraordinary person.
]]>By: Takuanhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149017
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149017hoo-boy! Just one has to blow it for everybody…now all men everywhere have to learn how to work the washing machine.
]]>By: Antinoushttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149273
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149273Honestly, it just looks like you are trolling for a flame war with me, and I have no idea why.

Perhaps you could re-read your own comment and then read most of the other subsequent comments, particular the ones from women and transgendered persons. That might help you understand that a lot of people are offended by the question, Can a transgender woman ever experience life exactly as a genetic female without even having the capability to bear a child? You have asked if women can truly be women if they can’t be used as baby machines.

]]>By: Hottsburghttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-158745
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-158745I am not hating on anyone here. Seriously, who really cares one way or the other. I think that people have the right to live however they want to. I am happy for this couple and believe that they will be good parents. Sexuality is not a concrete thing. That is more of an idea or concept in which there cannot be a concrete anything. Sexuality deals with feelings. Feelings are fluid and cannot be helped. However gender is a different thing. When born there are only 3 possible categories, male, female or hermaphrodite. None of which should define how you live your life. It’s a matter of fact you are one of the three and that can never change regardless of what you do to yourself or who you identify with. If you are a guy that feels like a woman than fine. But you are still a he. Now you may request that people use one pronoun over the other but fact is fact. Plain and simple, women have eggs, men have sperm. Hermaphrodites on the other hand fit into both categories and may or may not be able to have their own child with their own seed (egg or sperm or both). The “male” that is having this baby is a woman. If this guy had a womb implanted into him like Arnold in Mr. Mom, he would be a male having a baby.
]]>By: Takuanhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-159769
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-159769Dear WTT

The posts you see here were gutted of their vowels for breaking the rules of civil discourse. A lot.

]]>By: jjasperhttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149019
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149019He’s not the first FtM transperson who’s been pregnant. I’ve met one. He ended up being a pretty good parent too.

I guess it’s a sign of how out of sync with most people I am that I’m really not even thinking this is interesting news.

#63, I see your point–there aren’t any long-term studies on what happens when trans men who have taken testosterone in the past have children. We do know that testosterone levels drop off pretty quickly after you discontinue testosterone shots, and that several trans men have had healthy kids. On the other hand, we do also know that fetuses are extremely hormone-sensitive. That’s why I personally hope to adopt, but there’s a definite chance I’ll be discriminated against by adoption agencies, and in the event that I ever split with my partner, I would lose out on the rights courts tend to afford biological parents.

Also, what rudimentary scientific evidence there is about the brains of trans people suggests that our brains are morphologically more similar to the gender we identify with rather than our birth sex.

I might have chosen a different word. I’m sorry to hear that you believe that your ability to breed is what makes you a woman.

]]>By: labshttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-158750
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-158750Congratulations to the happy couple – obviously, they made a conscious decision to have a child. We should all wish them well – regardless of pronouns.
]]>By: AnnoyedCapitalisthttp://boingboing.net/2008/03/24/transgender-man-is-p.html#comment-149279
Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000#comment-149279#49 Diatryma: “On a related note, is there a preferred pronoun cue I can learn to figure out what to use? Dress doesn’t always help, nor hair, nor physical appearance. Is there a polite way to ask in an ambiguous situation?”

This is exact same issue I have. Everyone has a default. I don’t believe the man who insists you call him “Dr.” is any less offended than the person who underwent this surgery. If you proposed this gender question, meant for the transgendered, to a strange-looking “normal” should she or he not be offended by your presumption? My point is that getting offended at these things that even the kindest heart can make is absolutley silly and pedantic.

The best response for the person offended would be to politely ask for a change. An kind person would comply. Should you run into me and demand my compliance, however, you will be met with my pronouns: “sex-she” and “sex-he”.