I'm no expert either but could that (Kimi needing more fuel saving than his team mate) be linked to the wrong turn Ferrari presumably made on Saturday with Kimi's setup? I mean, if his car carries more drag because of setup, that would have a detrimental effect on his fuel consumption, right?

Yeah I have absolutely no knowledge on this whatsoever, but in my minds eye as a complete layman I'm imagining that pushing to stay close to someone and overcome all the turbulence etc is a lot more (fuel) demanding than cruising around. I can't really see how you can do the former while saving fuel!

I agree, the way Vettel pushed hanging on so close to Lewis can't be positive in any way for fuel consumption. I think Kimi having to save fuel could have had something to do with how the car was setup, just guessing though.

Apple, you always know how to answer my weird questions, so here they come - bear in mind that the Russian GP was the first race in years:

1. Kimi was genuinely happy for Valtteri and congratulated him many times, whereas Vettel could congratulate Valtteri only in the backroom, but not before that. Was Vettel so angry for not winning the race?

2. What is going on between Kimi and Vettel? There was zero warmth or friendship between them, something has changed, since they used to be the best pals on the paddock, but what?

3. The commentators, (Brits or Americans), spoke in lenght about Ferrari's different strategies for Kimi and Vettel, pondering if Ferrari really will let Kimi pass when Vettel had his pitstop, wondering if Ferrari had miscalculated their strategy. Usually commentators only bash Kimi, never even making an effort to think further, but now they were clearly on Kimi's side and they believed Kimi was mistreated by Ferrari.... Why now??? They were silent during the years Ferrari clearly sabotaged Kimi's qualis and races, but now they seem to be absolutely certain. What am I missing? Is it based on real facts or a dislike of Vettel?

4. Where was Minttu? Isn't she usually in the garage following Kimi's races? Is her pregnancy so far that she couldn't travel to Russia?

Kudos to Putin and kudos to Russia for arranging a wonderful GP, it was awesome to see how Putin came to the back room and chatted with Kimi, presidents don't usually do these kind of things

Oops and one more question: Has Lettuce (Grosjean) still not learned how not to crash into other cars, or was this a singular event? It felt so homey to watch the race, because Lettuce took himself and another one out during the first lap

Apple, you always know how to answer my weird questions, so here they come - bear in mind that the Russian GP was the first race in years:

1. Kimi was genuinely happy for Valtteri and congratulated him many times, whereas Vettel could congratulate Valtteri only in the backroom, but not before that. Was Vettel so angry for not winning the race?

2. What is going on between Kimi and Vettel? There was zero warmth or friendship between them, something has changed, since they used to be the best pals on the paddock, but what?

3. The commentators, (Brits or Americans), spoke in lenght about Ferrari's different strategies for Kimi and Vettel, pondering if Ferrari really will let Kimi pass when Vettel had his pitstop, wondering if Ferrari had miscalculated their strategy. Usually commentators only bash Kimi, never even making an effort to think further, but now they were clearly on Kimi's side and they believed Kimi was mistreated by Ferrari.... Why now??? They were silent during the years Ferrari clearly sabotaged Kimi's qualis and races, but now they seem to be absolutely certain. What am I missing? Is it based on real facts or a dislike of Vettel?

4. Where was Minttu? Isn't she usually in the garage following Kimi's races? Is her pregnancy so far that she couldn't travel to Russia?

Kudos to Putin and kudos to Russia for arranging a wonderful GP, it was awesome to see how Putin came to the back room and chatted with Kimi, presidents don't usually do these kind of things

Oops and one more question: Has Lettuce (Grosjean) still not learned how not to crash into other cars, or was this a singular event? It felt so homey to watch the race, because Lettuce took himself and another one out during the first lap

@NCW I ain't Holi Apple but you can think of me as Holy Brat-Man

1. I didn't see any difference in his body language when he congratulated Vatteri, it's the same for everyone. Vettel too was normal. The scene might have been different but Vatteri a bit like Kimi isn't very chatty so what Vettel to do?

2. The friendship is okay. You don't expect them to come together and do something cheesy on camera or... do you? Manly hugs everyone...

3. Did you listen to the commentary? They used Kimi as a guinea pig to test the tyres and then brought Vettel in but if you look at the race you'll realize - the only thing that could have worked was if Ferrari was close to Bottas - less than 2 seconds and then undercut him. What they did was fall back to around 5 seconds and maintained the gap. The moment Vettel started to close in on Bottas to perform the under cut Mercedes called Bottas in and Ferrari was left with no option but to either pit Vettel in or hope Vettel would put in some really fast laps and doesn't run into traffic while Bottas runs into traffic. Vettel was the one who encountered a bit of traffic instead and finally he was pitted but barely gained any advantage over Bottas apart from the tyre advantage.

4. I have no idea about this.

Putin is always there and the conversations with the drivers are always awkward. Yesterday was no different.

Oops one more answer - Romain is a much better driver now than he was earlier but at times desperation gets to you. It was his mistake but I would deem it as a racing incident and move on.

There is nothing holy in me ,dingbat,believe me So..here are my takes of the events..1)Vettels former trainer was interviewed earlier this winter and he talked a lot about Vettels ,could it be said,strong obsession to win. He kept it also as Vettel weak point. Sometimes it takes him to dark side.I think it might have made him a bit angry at first,specially towards Massa,to which he showed his middle finger. By the time they were at the backroom,I think he was calm...but you know finns. They dont feel need to tell immiaditely what happened in the race,because they all were there. 2)Not so much joking pictures about Kimi and Vettel but they sure kept Gazzetto dello Sport magazines reporter on his toes, like twins who continue where the other one has stopped. Ferrari is competitive now. I think it will be seen later in the season . But for now, they are okay.3)Well..weird pit stops for Kimi have probably made some reporters to ask why,as it has looked like Ferrari had shot themself on their foot. Which they did. But lets see ..Kimi looked unhappy, maybe because he was just third.. but aldo he appears to be a bit jumpy about Ferraris tactics, as seen in Russia when he wasnt aware of positions on track. Problems with race engineer?4) yeah..I think Minttu will have their daughter in any day now.

Putin is there always as our Bat told there, Bottas told him to build more hotels as he said hotels are full. Well, thats the only occasion they are full,I heard. Socchi olympic village is empty monument.Lettuce..I had forgotten that nickname! He has had problems with modern cars , specially driving over the kerbs. Nowadays he doesnt drive over the ither cars,just pushes a little.

1. Kimi was genuinely happy for Valtteri and congratulated him many times, whereas Vettel could congratulate Valtteri only in the backroom, but not before that. Was Vettel so angry for not winning the race?

You didn't watch when they got out of the cars? Because Vettel did go towards Bottas and looked pretty stoked for him, giving him an extra pat on the back while Bottas was on his way to his team members.

_________________Supporting all drivers with surnames starting with "V".

Proud member of the "It's Toro Rosso, not Torro Rosso" action committee.

@ Holy Brat-Man, thank you for your reply, it gave a lot of thinking. Having not followed F1 in four years and suddenly getting a strong urge to do that again, I'm as clueless as one can be, relying only on my supernatural skills to read bodylanguage

Last year I tried to be witty and knowledgable on facebook's Kimi-forum and wondered if Schumi was in the garage (people ranted about a failed pitstop), and people got absolutely furious at me. I didn't remember Schumi's accident, so there was a lot of apologizing, a lot. Shame on me

@ Hoi Apple

Ah, totally forgot about Vettel's competitive nature, Pärmäkoski has talked about it many times. That figures!

Gazzetto dello Sport?! Oi, this raises another question... You know me very well, is it safe to read the Italian magazines concerning Kimi or is your advice to avoid them?

Leo Turrini, has he changed his good picture of The Holy Drunk?

I wondered why Kimi wasn't even told about the others, maybe Ferrari has a strategy that Kimi is also made aware of... Kimi won't settle for driver #2, he will quit F1 if this is the case

It was so cool to see Putin directing his words to Kimi, and Kimi saying something about the good weather. Kimi talking about the weather LOL

Oii, Lettuce pushes a little nowadays, seems like he is finally on a learning curve

Apple, remember when we met for the first time, here in the Kimi-thread ages ago? We used to "tease" some Greek guy, who threw back our punches with a smile on his face... he could take our twisted humour

@ Pole2Win, hi, are you The Brazilian? Nice to see you too

@ KIMBO2, I remember you, great to see you *hugs*

Kimi set the fastest lap in the race, so he is still the same. Especially if the reporters start mocking him again, then we know for sure that he is a force to be reckoned with!!!

@ mds

Keep in mind that I have supernational powers when it comes to reading body language, they kicked in immediately after the race. I have always defended Vettel to the very last, so it was surprising to get a bad feeling from his behaviour. Hopefully I'm wrong (which I never am ) - joking of course.

Oh Lord, next I'll be reading Ferrari's body language and get a lot of heat for that

Ferrari publicly criticized Raikkonen on his poor qualifying performance. he improved. IMO he is on top of his game and fully motivated. he wasn't very pleasant after the race at Sochi, and it's because he's not happy with not winning. Let's not forget that the last time Ferrari has one of their drivers win the title it was Raikkonen.

Incredible to think his fans had to wait 10 years to see their guy on Pole position. It must be a fantastic feeling so congrats to Kimi even though I am not his greatest Fan(I thought he would finish his career without a pole).

I turned off the TV after Q2(I was so pi**ed off) and was sure to see Vettel in Pole.Top Job..Very reminiscent of Schumacher here in Monaco in 2012.

ThisIs proof positive that drivers don't lose it once they get past age 30-something..Driving a car at speed can be done quite well, well past the age the media has conditioned the masses to believe.I remember time when grids were Choc full of drivers past 40 and they were not only quick, but the best of the crop because on top of their speed, they had enough experience to drive around the younger speed demons consistently.

Kudos to the ICE MAN for showing the world he's still one of the best in the sport.

ThisIs proof positive that drivers don't lose it once they get past age 30-something..Driving a car at speed can be done quite well, well past the age the media has conditioned the masses to believe.I remember time when grids were Choc full of drivers past 40 and they were not only quick, but the best of the crop because on top of their speed, they had enough experience to drive around the younger speed demons consistently.

Kudos to the ICE MAN for showing the world he's still one of the best in the sport.

It's impressive, but if a single good qualifying in Monaco (beating his teammate by less than a tenth of a second at that) is 'proof positive' for you, I think you might need to refine your definition...

ThisIs proof positive that drivers don't lose it once they get past age 30-something..Driving a car at speed can be done quite well, well past the age the media has conditioned the masses to believe.I remember time when grids were Choc full of drivers past 40 and they were not only quick, but the best of the crop because on top of their speed, they had enough experience to drive around the younger speed demons consistently.

Kudos to the ICE MAN for showing the world he's still one of the best in the sport.

It's impressive, but if a single good qualifying in Monaco (beating his teammate by less than a tenth of a second at that) is 'proof positive' for you, I think you might need to refine your definition...

May be you missed the point he was trying to make.Raikkonen on pole means(according to F1 MERCENARY) that Alonso(your favorite driver) could potentially drive for another 5/6 seasons and still be competitive.

As for the age thing, I don't think anybody has tried to claim that people are instantly and irrevocably uncompetetive after a certain age. It's definitely the case that reflexes degrade -- usually very subtly -- after a certain point, but that point isn't even the same for everybody, nor is the rate. There's no magic age where people aren't as good at racing or anything else as they used to be, and there's I think obviously a crossover point where experience more than compensates the slight loss of reflex, and a longer period where it does compensate it. I don't think this proves anything in that regard, unless one is trying to disprove a claim that after a certain set age somewhere in the 30s it's impossible to be quick, which I think (hope) nobody has said. Now, proving whether Kimi specifically still has it in him to be quick enough to set pole? That, obviously it does.

ThisIs proof positive that drivers don't lose it once they get past age 30-something..Driving a car at speed can be done quite well, well past the age the media has conditioned the masses to believe.I remember time when grids were Choc full of drivers past 40 and they were not only quick, but the best of the crop because on top of their speed, they had enough experience to drive around the younger speed demons consistently.

Kudos to the ICE MAN for showing the world he's still one of the best in the sport.

It's impressive, but if a single good qualifying in Monaco (beating his teammate by less than a tenth of a second at that) is 'proof positive' for you, I think you might need to refine your definition...

Dont know about vettel but kimi could definately have gone a touch quicker looking at his pole lap. turn 1 slide and a couple of apex's missed maybe a couple of tenths. hes up against a 4 time champ who is in his prime and driving like a machine now he has a smiff at victories and a title. i think to beat him at all, for an old man who is treated like a no 2 by his team, is damn impressive.

ThisIs proof positive that drivers don't lose it once they get past age 30-something..Driving a car at speed can be done quite well, well past the age the media has conditioned the masses to believe.I remember time when grids were Choc full of drivers past 40 and they were not only quick, but the best of the crop because on top of their speed, they had enough experience to drive around the younger speed demons consistently.

Kudos to the ICE MAN for showing the world he's still one of the best in the sport.

It's impressive, but if a single good qualifying in Monaco (beating his teammate by less than a tenth of a second at that) is 'proof positive' for you, I think you might need to refine your definition...

Dont know about vettel but kimi could definately have gone a touch quicker looking at his pole lap. turn 1 slide and a couple of apex's missed maybe a couple of tenths. hes up against a 4 time champ who is in his prime and driving like a machine now he has a smiff at victories and a title. i think to beat him at all, for an old man who is treated like a no 2 by his team, is damn impressive.

ThisIs proof positive that drivers don't lose it once they get past age 30-something..Driving a car at speed can be done quite well, well past the age the media has conditioned the masses to believe.I remember time when grids were Choc full of drivers past 40 and they were not only quick, but the best of the crop because on top of their speed, they had enough experience to drive around the younger speed demons consistently.

Kudos to the ICE MAN for showing the world he's still one of the best in the sport.

It's impressive, but if a single good qualifying in Monaco (beating his teammate by less than a tenth of a second at that) is 'proof positive' for you, I think you might need to refine your definition...

Dont know about vettel but kimi could definately have gone a touch quicker looking at his pole lap. turn 1 slide and a couple of apex's missed maybe a couple of tenths. hes up against a 4 time champ who is in his prime and driving like a machine now he has a smiff at victories and a title. i think to beat him at all, for an old man who is treated like a no 2 by his team, is damn impressive.

now watch him bin it tomorrow with a schoolboy error!

Someone posted the best sector times of Kimi and Seb to the qualifying thread. Kimi could have gone about a second faster and Vettel about 2 tenths or something like that.

ThisIs proof positive that drivers don't lose it once they get past age 30-something..Driving a car at speed can be done quite well, well past the age the media has conditioned the masses to believe.I remember time when grids were Choc full of drivers past 40 and they were not only quick, but the best of the crop because on top of their speed, they had enough experience to drive around the younger speed demons consistently.

Kudos to the ICE MAN for showing the world he's still one of the best in the sport.

It's impressive, but if a single good qualifying in Monaco (beating his teammate by less than a tenth of a second at that) is 'proof positive' for you, I think you might need to refine your definition...

Dont know about vettel but kimi could definately have gone a touch quicker looking at his pole lap. turn 1 slide and a couple of apex's missed maybe a couple of tenths. hes up against a 4 time champ who is in his prime and driving like a machine now he has a smiff at victories and a title. i think to beat him at all, for an old man who is treated like a no 2 by his team, is damn impressive.

now watch him bin it tomorrow with a schoolboy error!

Someone posted the best sector times of Kimi and Seb to the qualifying thread. Kimi could have gone about a second faster and Vettel about 2 tenths or something like that.

I did, copy pasted that post below.

Ok I got it

Potential fastest lap for the top 5 drivers.

Kimi - 71.153sVettel - 72.216Bottas - 72.223Max - 72.496Ric - 72.927

Pulling best sector times to get a potential fastest lap is a bit of wishful thinking, but regardless it shows that Kimi was on it during qualy. If Vettel and Kimi would have done their optimum lap time, he has Vettel beat by 1.063 seconds. If that would have happened this forum would have exploded!

He still has speed, and even when not at his prime he is still one of the best out there. Also is one of the reasons why I try not to say this driver is done or slow just by times relative to his team mate, same car yes, but still too many variables. For that you would have to evaluate times when both are happy with the car and their set ups and are getting 100% from it. If one is not happy a fair comparison is just not possible.