I think he's stepped back a bit the last two games, but overall i'm happy where he is. I'm guessing the learning curve for a rookie middle linebacker is pretty similar as the learning curve for a rookie QB.

I think he's too quick for his own good sometimes. Kind of like ET (see FlyingGreg!) causing him to over commit. Many a times I saw him out of position allowing a huge run. But he's only a rook and he's been playing really well otherwise.

Yea, though the stats look good, Pete singled Bobby out specifically saying he made several assignment mistakes which lead directly to several of AP's long runs. Said he really missed having KJ Wright helping set him and the others. He's doing ok, but certainly not as good as a few games ago.

Overall he's been assignment correct to his gap as it moves. Our whole team has been getting cut back on for a few weeks in our own zone blocking manner. I certainly don't remember AP running anyone over though. He had a few stiff arms here and there, but he was making the right cuts N/S like his old self and staying fairly clean with the exception of a few runs like in GL. We had a lot of problems on the backside in run D. Many missed tackles on that sweep though and that wasn't backside. Regardless, Wagner again was one of the only players who played all snaps on D for a reason so If you're looking to complain as if one player is responsible for the entire run D you're watching the wrong sport.

Well, tackles are huge for fantasy football but not all tackles are the same for the team. I think the loss of Wright had more to do with our lack of run D plus we are talking about AP here. lol. Did Leroy contribute anything? I couldn't watch the game, it wasn't televised out here. I think we add another LB in the draft, we need a good one bad.

It will be interesting to see how all rookies play from here on out. At this point last year they were all preparing for the final games of the collegiate season. Now they're just past halfway of the NFL season, with every matchup being a big one. I'm excited to see how Wagner, Wilson, and Turbin handle the next two months. I hope they continue to mature and crank it up for the playoff push!

EastCoastHawksFan wrote:he deservers props but not from Sunday , His missed alot of his assignments which led to Adrian running wild.

re-watch the plays where the Vikings use Harvin as a decoy in motion and Adrian runs up the middle for a minimum of 10 yards ...everytime .

we were lucky they didnt give that man the ball 30 times.

And, for the life of me, I don't understand why they did not.

His knee is my only guess. They don't want to end his season by over playing him.

No I don't think that's the deal. They barely had the ball in the 2nd half. Seattle had the ball for over 9 mins in 3rd quarter and 12 minutes in 4th quarter. They just didn't have many opportunites and the pick which occured on 1st down ended the game for them. They were looking for some semblence of a passing game and it didn't work.

I think AP had like one run of 22 yards. He had 3 runs of no gain or negative yards. He only carried the ball 5 times, so we stopped the run game, and they couldn't pass for a 1st down to save their lives, which is a contributing factor to why we held the ball so long.

Seahwkgal wrote:Well, tackles are huge for fantasy football but not all tackles are the same for the team. I think the loss of Wright had more to do with our lack of run D plus we are talking about AP here. lol. Did Leroy contribute anything? I couldn't watch the game, it wasn't televised out here. I think we add another LB in the draft, we need a good one bad.

vin.couve12 wrote:Overall he's been assignment correct to his gap as it moves. Our whole team

Great assessment. I went back to my DVR and looked at some of the runs and you are right. It looks like what is happening is the Nose (Mebane most of the time) is getting pushed back hard single or double chipped. The guard is leading at the second level and Wagner hits quickly. However the runner is hiding and hesitating to get Wagner to bite and taking the opposite side cut behind the pulling guard. The big run in Q1 it looks like that is what happened. Wagner is aggressive and getting fooled.

Maybe move Kam closer to the A or B gap to help out?

Wagner looks pretty good the majority of the time and is in the right position. A few growing pains I guess

Seahwkgal wrote:Well, tackles are huge for fantasy football but not all tackles are the same for the team. I think the loss of Wright had more to do with our lack of run D plus we are talking about AP here. lol. Did Leroy contribute anything? I couldn't watch the game, it wasn't televised out here. I think we add another LB in the draft, we need a good one bad.

Leroy had a good game! 7-8 tackles and a sack...

Good to see some recognition for Leroy Hill. He was credited with 2 solo tackles, 2 assists and half a sack. It really helps to have a mature experienced veteran on such a young defense. Retaining Leroy Hill on the roster was a smart decision.

P.S. Seeing the veteran Hill, hands on hips, watching the rookie Greg Scruggs do his rediculous celebration dance was priceless.

When will people realize that tackles do not tell the story of how good a defensive player plays? Especially a MLB who has very important duties outside of tackling. Dont get me wrong. Wagner is playing nice for a rookie and shows a ton of promise. But saying he has a lot of tackles means he played a good game (when Carroll singled him out specifically as someone who did not), is as smart as saying Red Bryant has a bad game when he gets no sacks and few tackles.

Wagner really suffered from KJ Wright not being on the field. He helps him a lot with making calls. I have always been a bit worried about our depth a LB. I sure hope Wright gets well soon.

I'm excited about Wagner but I KNOW he has made huge mistakes which have given up several big plays. That's to be expected. Same thing happened to the guy before him. Didn't happen to Tat too much but MLB is a real mentally dependent position and like Wilson I expect us to see rookie Wagner improve week to week. Those mistakes are teaching points for him and the coaching staff. I'm impressed with his coverage skills and his pass rushing skills which I really did not expect to see from him. Those are a plus IMO. He should improve in his gap control and certainly the return to health of a couple of the bigs in front of him should help as well. Hopefully KJ Wright isn't out too long.

Thomas Paine: To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead

Seahwkgal wrote:Well, tackles are huge for fantasy football but not all tackles are the same for the team. I think the loss of Wright had more to do with our lack of run D plus we are talking about AP here. lol. Did Leroy contribute anything? I couldn't watch the game, it wasn't televised out here. I think we add another LB in the draft, we need a good one bad.

Leroy had a good game! 7-8 tackles and a sack...

Good to see some recognition for Leroy Hill. He was credited with 2 solo tackles, 2 assists and half a sack. It really helps to have a mature experienced veteran on such a young defense. Retaining Leroy Hill on the roster was a smart decision.

P.S. Seeing the veteran Hill, hands on hips, watching the rookie Greg Scruggs do his rediculous celebration dance was priceless.

I never thought I'd read a post using the words "Leroy Hill" and "Mature" together.

Just watched every play while focusing only on Wagner. Doesn't get a lot of double negatives because he doesn't necessarily blow his assignments, but doesn't get double plus very often either. On most of the running plays, he is a quarter second slow to diagnose. He needs to get downhill more quickly. The previous poster was correct, he got caught on the wrong side of the tackle quite often. The biggest reason for this is because he is reacting rather than attacking. He needs to be inside the hole already at the line of scrimmage, not two yards behind it, getting stuck in the wash. I'm not going to freak out about it, because if you're ever played any linebacker, you know it is ridiculously difficult to do. There aren't that many MLB's in the NFL that can do it, and only once every few years does a rookie do it right away. Part of it is diagnosing more quickly, and part of it is downright guessing correctly.

He made a FANTASTIC play on a Harvin sweep. Diagnosed it instantly, got downhill instantly, and blew it up two yards into the backfield. But on the running plays up the middle, he tends to hop and stop and read rather than attacking at the snap.

A few times he got full extension and got off of blocks quickly, but too many times, he played too high and allowed the blocker to get into his body.

The speed is there. He can go get it. No question. I still just don't know if he is built the right way to stuff the run right at him. The really great news with that is that there are far more teams that are better stopped with speed at LB than those that are stopped easiest by power. SF is really the only playoff team that could really expose Wagner, and maybe Chicago. Hopefully he gets more sand in his pants this offseason and can change his pad level a bit. I have no doubt he'll start to diagnose more quickly.