Having purchased a new VE Sigma .40 at christmas, I studied somehistory of this Glock knock off afterwards. I have been shown a simple tip to improve trigger pull ( reduction ).

I though I would ask opinions concerning this...and any other views of this weapon.

( It was all I could afford for a carry gun, taking CCH this month , Iknow there are better weapons , but did observe mostly favorable shoots on web. I have yet to shoot this gun ....)

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I bought the S&W Sigma .40 for a concelled hand gun. I was not able to go practice with the gun prior to the class. My instructor couldnt believe I was taking the class wiithout even shooting my gun. I ended up shooting a 97 on the test. The only two things I have found that I dont like is it has a plastice trigger and does not have a safty. It does have a pretty heavy trigger but being no safty I wouldnt back off on it too much.

It is a safe action pistol. DA only and no exposed hammer. It doesnt need an external safety. its never cocked. Pulling the trigger cocks and fires the weapon. and that little 2 piece trigger is a trigger safety that prevents the trigger form being inadvertently pulled. you kinda have to mean to shoot one of these glock wannabees.

Besides, IMO, the real safety with any firearm is snugly nestled between your ears..

I think im gonna sticky this thread.. I needed it a couple times here recently and had to dig it up out of the archives.

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Thank you JLA..and I hope it has helped some.

I will add the following since last original post here;

- The pistol is still doing fine, not only is my initial carry pistol still,
and did fine since initial CHL, I subsequently became an Instructor for
Texas in 2010, and used it for that, as qualifying requires both a revolver
and a SA or auto. I was at 242 with this pistol out of needing 225 as
Instructor to qualify from possible 250 allowed. Texas students require
190 or better with weapon of choice. A qualify with auto allows revolver
carry also, however revolver use allows only that type carry etc..

- I since learned this pistol, in spite of "so called" Glock lawsuit, was indeed
designed to have such a pull per trigger, as this is indeed, the only safety
aspect of the weapon, short of the "essential safety between the ears"
as mentioned.

- I have seen on various other sources, this "trigger pull" and action
feel, was a result of S&W desire to copy as close as possible the DA
feel of a Model 60 revolver. I have tried both, and can believe this.

- I have also " learned" and since proven, most were right on in their
advice that 500 rounds or so would produce about the same results as
the "mods" I had explored from others initially.

- I have subsequently left the pigtail spring off, however I have taken
others advice and used a spring similar to a ball pen type to indeed be
there to possibly keep the inner actual "work" spring in place.

- Besides the actual breakin or more important "practice and use and
general familiarity " with pistol, the most effective maintenance I do
want to add for any is regarding the plastic sear mount hump or section
that trigger (springs) assembly levers against per use. This rounded
portion and area responds well to a small amount of black lithium or similar
grease. It does remove some grittiness experienced by so many.

- The "other" way to improve trigger feel and grittiness I did not mention
or include in above initial post, I learned by my own examination. The trigger spring assembly shown (where pigtail is removed) has inner walls
or contact surfaces that produce friction as these "springs" that are shown
travel or work .....I noticed that the surfaces involved per the friction or
travel were rough and unfinished or unpolished versus the type of surface
one might expect from fine machining etc....in fact, turns out these
surfaces were left as is, per economics of manufacture , and are actually
one of the first areas looked at and worked when S&W (used) to do
free return work on these pistols initially.

I happened to have several sets of very fine relay files from years of
electronic work, and with these and the use of a good polish ( Mothers,
mag wheel cream) I "carefully" did indeed affect these surfaces with an
end result that greatly reduced any grit feel or grit drag etc..

- I know of no way to reduce "travel" of this trigger design, as it is what
it is. I also have since learned the use of "Glock" or 'Wolff " or similar
spring change outs that I was warned against, do indeed, at some time
when you are not expecting it, eventually cause or are likely to cause
a fail to strike or sufficient hammer strike to primer. So as poundage
reduction on a "carry weapon" was never my intent, I am glad I never
explored this option, and would advise against it.

- I would also advise is very important to effectively grease the
" 6 " points as described in manual. This weapon does not like or need
much oil.

I think im gonna sticky this thread.. I needed it a couple times here recently and had to dig it up out of the archives.

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I have the VE9, and I'm not used to that trigger pull yet, and I'm not sure if I ever will. After 1,300+ rounds through it the trigger pull has not improved, and I'm still all over the place with it. Most of my shots come in low and left, around the 7 to 8 o’clock position, which tells me I'm jerking the trigger rather than pulling it.

The one good thing I can say is I have never had one failure at all. It will fire anything I put in it. It is very reliable. I have been thinking about trying the trigger mod, but I'm afraid I would just bugger something up.

I have the VE9, and I'm not used to that trigger pull yet, and I'm not sure if I ever will. After 1,300+ rounds through it the trigger pull has not improved, and I'm still all over the place with it. Most of my shots come in low and left, around the 7 to 8 o’clock position, which tells me I'm jerking the trigger rather than pulling it.

The one good thing I can say is I have never had one failure at all. It will fire anything I put in it. It is very reliable. I have been thinking about trying the trigger mod, but I'm afraid I would just bugger something up.

Glad you "Sticyed" it, now I know wehere to find it if I get brave.

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Yes, I would not want to suggest anything that affects the safety of the
weapon such as lessening trigger pull to a dangerous level as some springs
and mods can do. And of course, one should have some familiarity with
mechanical workings and tooling.

I have added the following info after three years of using and carrying my
Sigma, and as to how I got this pistol, I invite any to read the thread
'My Sigma" in pistol forum.

The only thing I have done besides the basic mod/maintenance I show
in these pics ( I did not take pics, only annotated them ) is that I purchased and have used a metal guide rod and spring kit (19 lbs) as
to ensure integrity of use. I have since agreed with most posters on
S&W forums that such is not needed usually, as the plastic (Glock style)
rod should outlive pistol...however, for $29.00 AND having the original as a
spare, I have not regretted this change of guide rod etc...if anyone does
choose such a rod/spring change, be sure to "contact" them and make sure
you tell them VE or what you have, or you will surely receive a Full size
part.....!

One more "general" polishing mod I forgot to include, that has
done well "for me" anyway..

I will also add that if what I have read on S&W and elsewhere is correct, S&W has
sold per renewed contract over 100k by now of the VE series to middle eastern law enforcement
and military, including Iraq and Afghan etc....

- I have subsequently left the pigtail spring off, however I have taken
others advice and used a spring similar to a ball pen type to indeed be
there to possibly keep the inner actual "work" spring in place.

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Now this is where I get a little lost. This spring you describe as being similar to that of a ball pen type, does it replace the pig tail spring?

Thanks for posting the pictures yellerdawg, they were a great help in understanding this.

So you have polished as describbed in the pics, and if I understand correctly, you have removed the small pig tail spring, but have left both the inner and outer coil springs as they were?

Now this is where I get a little lost. This spring you describe as being similar to that of a ball pen type, does it replace the pig tail spring?

Thanks

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No Rocketman....the little pig tail is removed...."some" say it is a direct
result of the S&W Glock settlement (from S&W obviously copying so
much of a Glock, and that it wasnt there on very first Sigmas and only showed up till after legal issues...? ) others say its there to help ensure
sear resets after each shot...?

No, the "similar" to a pen spring mentioned, when you look, is actually
a LARGER spring that totally rides over, a smaller diameter INNER spring,
with much more tension, and actually does the work..the outer spring seems really there to keep this inner spring in check and installed..etc..

When I obtained the mod(s) originally and pics from S&W forum...the
mod actually shows taking inner smaller spring and using a dremel wheel
disc, shortening it by "almost" 1/8 inch, and also same to outer spring...in
order to reduce some pull....

I do not endorse changing the INNER spring at all, for possibility of indeed
affecting sear/trigger reset, but I do or did change the outer...most indeed
just got a ball point pen soft spring to replace with...however, I searched and found a "grab bag" of industrial compression and expansion springs
and found one same length. but half the tension...etc...but..a ball pen
spring would have probably done the same. I placed "original" outer spring in
little bag with factory proof case should I ever transfer weapon, however
if any have read My Sigma post...is obvious I will not get rid of this
pistol.

Please contact me with any further questions or comments...thanks..

yellerdawg

note per pics I added....

- I annotated about cutting outer spring as he explained...but...I didnt
and actually got a different and SHORTER (less tension) spring...and did
nothing to INNER spring. This way, "some" trigger/hammer pull was reduced yet important INNER spring still held in place....

And the grind wheel was to flatten any cut so a spring if shortened would STILL have a good area or foot to catch the little cam that holds it in
place in "hammer" assembly .....?

1- In post # 24....per pic I show where to polish hammer areas on
TOP of pistol, that long flat arm that comes from trigger to hammer
assembly....you just polish INNER of that flat arm, as "some" folks
experienced some rub or grit there....in fact...if you look close at the
pic, right between arm and frame where one of my green lines goes...
you see the little black plastic frame runner that actually can rub this
arm...

"Some" even showed filing or removing enough of that plastic area so
that nothing can rub....if yours is tight, then do that..otherwise just
polish arm (inside / next to frame) very bright. I also grease a drop
right at that point each cleaning.

And, this "arm" is what you carefully move from pivot point of hammer when you have used a punch (at top rear of pistol) to remove the only pin
you need to remove sear/hammer assembly....but...the end of arm that
connects to trigger stays intact, so handle gently, when removing and
if polishing etc...

2- I would not ask for any to do anything that they feel uncomfortable
about. I am an EE and Microwave and Digital Engineer by trade, but with
much time in a machine shop. I am not a gunsmith, just a smith per my
own weapons if desired. I looked and studied much before I did anything to
my Sigma, I did not by any means do all I saw being done by others,and
have in fact passed on some things I have determined myself to do, that
I have not seen elsewhere.

I have simply passed on the simplest means I know for any that may benefit, keeping safety and reliability foremost. And as I said, 700 to 1000
rounds will almost do as much to trigger feel as anything I have suggested or done....except...

If you do nothing at all, except clean it...get a set of punches so you can
take the one top rear pin out, remove sear molding and hammer springs, and do grease and lube the sear cam or lobe where I showed. If not...
eventually yours will indeed have plastic scoring as in pic I showed from metal to plastic wear.

Thanks so much for all the additional info Yellerdoawg. Nice pictures and illustrations.
I understand everyting now, and I may just trythis soon. I think I may start by just removing the small pig tail spring and doing some light polishing, and see how much it improves. Looks like I can always add the spring(s) back in, if something dosen't work right.

Newbie here. I recently bought the sigma .40 cal and loved the gun for it's price point, rugged nature, and reliability but loathed the trigger. It seemed like the gun had too much potential to be ruined by the heavy gritty trigger. I polished out the parts as mentioned earlier, used anti seize grease from permatex, removed the pigtail (that thing is like mosquitos, they serve zero purpose) and I swapped out the spring for an aftermarket that I purchased. I have over 1000 rounds of the cheapest crap ammo I could purchase, steel casings and brass, with zero failures. If I get a misfire with it the next time I fire it i will still consider this a very high reliability rate. What bothered me the most was not that the trigger was a little rough or heavy, it was my accuracy.... plain and simple. Consistently low and left unless I was trying to compensate then it was just consistently inconsistent. After doing all thee mods I learned something interesting..... the grouping to the left was very much a result of the trigger pull issues (that was not a surprise) but the reason that they are LOW and to the left is nothing to do with the trigger. the low issue is the fault of the lousy front site. Has anybody noticed how tall the front site is?? It is rediculous!! While searching for a solution to this I came across another forum where somebody discovered that you can purchase a HiViz fiber optic site for a Glock and after doing a little filing on the site you can replace the OEM one. Night and day difference!! I am not shooting low anymore. I would highly recommend this to anybody that is frustrated with the "low and left" issue. Also, many people are not even aware that the rear site IS adjustable for windage. You can use the plastick handle of a big screw driver to gently tap the site sideways in the slide but make sure you the "left" is not human induced. You wouldn't want to try and compensate for your twitching by adjusting the windage. You would really be inconsistent if you did.

Newbie here. I recently bought the sigma .40 cal and loved the gun for it's price point, rugged nature, and reliability but loathed the trigger. ...... I swapped out the spring for an aftermarket that I purchased. ....... Consistently low and left unless I was trying to compensate then it was just consistently inconsistent. ..... the low issue is the fault of the lousy front site. Has anybody noticed how tall the front site is?? It is rediculous!! While searching for a solution to this I came across another forum where somebody discovered that you can purchase a HiViz fiber optic site for a Glock and after doing a little filing on the site you can replace the OEM one. Night and day difference!!

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Welcome to the forum zvagias.
Glad you took the time to join and share your experience with your Sigma. Stick around you will like it here.

I would very much appreciate info on the after market spring you purchased, and a web site link and further instruction on the front sight replacement.

I was aware that the rear sight was adjustable, but I didn't want to mess with it, until I found out if its me or the gun. The Sigma is the first pistol I owned. I just recently got a .22 pistol, and I'm much better with it. I got the .22 for something cheaper to shoot and I thought it might help me shoot the Sigma better. It did just the opposite. After shooting the .22 the trigger pull on the Sigma is unbearable. I usually shoot at 25 yards and my shots are all low and left, and very often in the dirt on the low target that I shoot at.