-=-=-
SECTION ONE: A bit on her bands, dealing w/ SP's stardom, how the band started
out, a lot about Jimmy, etc.

We started talking a bit before I brought out the micro-tape recorder.
Bascially about her band, how she didn't want to announce herself as working
for SP...

(start of tape):

L- I kept my pumpkin identity a secret for as long as I could. And,
uh... I don't know why... Probably because they were afraid of- Just
because in Chicago, the other side of Chicago is probably different,
but, you know how bands get really big, and all of a sudden it's like,
so big that everyone thinks they're not cool anymore? It's really bad
here in Chicago.
E- the 'indier-than-thou' thing...
L- Right. Exactly. So, the people, the other two people in my band,
like, when people be like, "Oh, well, what do you guys do for a
living?" they're like, "Well, we're students, and she's... a
BARTENDER, right?" Ya know... And I was like, "Oh, yeah- bartender."
Ya know, or whatever. So... Some people knew, and most people that
I tell, it's like "could you not print it?" Because I-, I wanted
Motorhome to make it on its own, not- riding someone else's
coattails kind of a thing...
E- Yeah, like, not - "Featuring the Smashing Pumpkins fan club person
on drums"...
L- Exactly, exactly. I mean, I wanted people to listen to it, but...
Now I don't know.
E- Like, Catherine's kinda like that...
L- Right, "D'arcy's husband's band"... [laughs]
E- Yeah. That's how a lot of people on the newsgroup talk about it.
L- Yeah. I dunno. It's so weird. It's weird being on the inside to talk
about this...stuff... Ya know? Because, everybody, like, that band is
[?] at the same time- as from when the pumpkins were first starting.
And, uh, they were all friends, they all hung out... And there was
another band from Chicago at the time, Big Hat, which was real, like,
dreamy, eclecticy thing... And, ya know, Billy had a lot to do with
them, seemed pretty much, just 'cause they all hung... out... And, ya
know, like normal cliques, like everyone hangs out, so, ya know, this
person will produce that album, I think he produced one, if not two of
their albums... I don't know. I'm not too positive. I won't say I never
really cared that much, it's not that I don't care, because I'm definitely
a -huge- fan of theirs, even though they're my friends, but there's a
really, a real weird line - of - of like, taking them seriously. I mean,
every time I see them on the cover of Rolling Stone, it's like if you
go to Great America, and you get like, that fake Sports Illustrated-
like picture taken, it -always- looks like that to me. Always, always,
no matter how many times I see them, I'm always- baffled, I'm like
"this isn't -real-..." Like when James did that fashion show?
E- yeah, for Anne Sui...
L- I was just like, "Oh my god! He got to meet Kate Moss! Oh my god!" Ya
know, it's like, I mean, imagining- an old friend of yours from high
school that you hung out with & support, like, really did make it. And
made it beyond, like, regular... I mean, there's a difference between
making it & paying your bills, which is like a normal musician's dream,
and making it to this grand... HUGE status, of super-stardom...
No, I mean- Billy inducted... fucking -Pink Floyd- into the Rock 'n Roll
Hall of Fame... I mean, I can't even imagine -meeting- Pink Floyd, and
he's like their -peer-. Ya know what I mean? It's amazing... I mean, I
think he deserves it, he's -brilliant-, and, to this day, I can listen,
I probably listened to Gish, like, 100 million times, and I still get
these little butterflies... And being a drummer, I'm also like, a Jimmy-
freak... It's like, he offered to give me drum lessons once- and I was
trying to like, well, No, I did, I sat down with him, but it's like, I
sat behind his drum set at Pumpkinland, and it's like "Alright, ya know,
I got some time before we start recording the album, and I know I've been
telling you that I'd give you drum lessons" and I'm like, "You have to
understand something" 'cause I was totally like oogly, I'm like "I won't
be able to play" I mean, that's like Jimi Hendrix offering somebody
like, guitar lessons... [laughs] Ya know? So I sit down behind the drum
set, then I was all fucking... "WOOO!" [Djzhdjzhdjzhdjzh], 'cause like, his
drum set, you could like hiccup and it'd be like [brrrikichika], 'cause
there's like, drums & shit -everywhere-, cymbals, you know, I have like my
three little drums & my two cymbals... Try to make the most of it... He's
just got like, 500 million... I'm surprised he doesn't have a gong behind
him at this point. So, I just had the 2 seconds, and all he did was like
smack my wrists, and tell me to sit up straight, and tell me I had my
feet in the wrong spot, and gave me a book and said "read this"... Aawww.
I had this, for some reason I had this grand illusion that I was gonna
like walk out of there you know, playing... crazy- chop...
E- 'single-stroke rolls', and...
L- The things that Jimmy, Jimmy's- technically perfect on top of being
creative, from being a drummer... It's amazing that he can come up with
the type of stuff he does, and not just off the hip. I mean, it's totally
mapped out & thought about, and, you know. I mean, he can sit down and
-write-out-, like, all of his drum sheet music, like, he did that for like
Tristessa or something for me one day, he's like, "Oh, here", & just like,
got some sheet music & like wrote out the drum part, and said "Go home &
try this out, this is the beginning of Tristessa." and I was like-
"Wooowww! Cool!"... ya know? So, it's funny, because- I mean, it's like my
friends, like, I can sit with them and have lunch like we're having now,
but I still have to admit that I get a bit oogly, when they do stuff for
me... "Hiii, you're a -star-!... But you're Jimmy..." Y'know, Jimmy the-
schmoe- friend of mine from Joliet... Ya know? When he first dyed his hair
black... it was so funny to all of us, because- How the story goes with
Jimmy is, it was... oh, I guess it's all on the video I think, isn't
it? That Jimmy, like- they hired him, to sit in with them? Well I guess,
the Pumpkins, it was uh, Billy & James, and I -think-, I think D'arcy was
with them, I'm pretty positive. But they were just playing with, and a
drum machine. And Joe Shanahan gave them an opening spot for Jane's
Addiction...
E- On the condition that they get a real drummer.
L- Right. So, they had to like -hire- somebody.
E- And they just happened to get Jimmy, who is like, perfect...
L- Right, right. But the thing was, I mean, it's perfect now that you've
listened to it, but the fact, like- especially back in the 80s, like the
punker-than-thou thing now... I mean, it was really before there was an
indie scene, so to speak, 'cause there was no such thing as indie rock,
and Alternative Nation and all that crap back then... So, Jimmy walks in,
and he had on like, a flourescent pink muscle shirt, and like, real bad,
like, suburban hairdo, like, jock... And here was like, y'know, Billy &
James, were like, black, gothic, like, big, poofy hair- y'know, so- and
with makeup on & stuff, so he's...
E- They wore makeup?
L- Well, yeah, but not regularly [laughs], but I mean, they were...
E- Not like Motley Crue in those days...
L- Right, right, right. I mean, little eyeliner...
E- ...early Kiss [laugh]
L- Right. Just... 'cause, whatever. So, I'm sure, I'm sure Jimmy walked in
and was like, "Look't all these fuckin' -freaks-. OK, well, gimme my 75
bucks and I'll practice with you..." y'know? I mean, that's really how it
was. I think they were, their big thing was like, "Oh, he's a studio
drummer for Pepsi" or something like that, y'know, he had some like weird
professional drumming gigs, and that's how he made money, and he gave
lessons, and... And then he just stumbled into this band, and... he
must've liked... Billy's writing, & stuff, 'cause... At first they had to
flat out -pay- him, like, everything they made at the shows, they had to
give to Jimmy, he was like a hired drummer... and then he's, like "I wanna
be in the band, you guys don't have to pay me anymore"... That's how that
happened... But it's funny, 'cause I think back to all the original
original fans... like, you've heard the first demo thing, like, someone
bootlegged it, released it...
E- the 4/10/88 show?
L- Like Jennifer Ever & all that stuff...
E- Yeah...
L- [laughs] I still have to laugh. [laughs] I mean, it, everybody has to,
it's like, 'you crawl before you walk' kind of a thing...
E- I still think all that's good...
L- It's still good, well, it's funny because, you wouldn't necessarily be
like "this is most excellent classic rock" like Gish is gonna end up
being, but- y'know, you have to... I dunno. You still gotta crawl before
you walk, so that was their, like, finding-thier-niche stage.

E- Still, a lot of people have talked about, like, wishing they could hear
Jennifer Ever, like, in a concert...
L- You know what, though? That song East I really like. And I really,
really, I mean, I was totally like, "you -gotta- put this on the album"...
when Gish was coming out... Like "It's my favorite song! What do you
-mean- you didn't put it on? C'mon! I love that song..."
E- Sun...
L- Yeah, and they're just like "Well... y'know, we were trying to find our
sound..." That's one thing. Motorhome, whenever we- Billy was gonna
produce our single, and, uh, we went in the studio with him and
everything, but we just, like, junked the session, 'cause he didn't have
time to, uh... finish, like, finish everything, 'cause he was about to
start- actually, that's how he found CRC, where they recorded Mellon
Collie, is we were recording there, and he came in and he was like, "Wow,
this is a really cool studio..." And, um... They, like, got their phone
numbers & stuff, 'n, so I'm just like "You guys owe me like a -million-
dollars..." 'Cause I'm sure that, y'know, Virgin paid you like five
kazillion dollars for them to be in there, so like, I'll take my finder's
fee, thank you... But, um. I don't know. He came in to do a Motorhome
thing, and, it just didn't work out. So he set us down & talked to us
about, which I always found to be interesting, about his songwriting
process... Like, how he does stuff? And he was telling me, he takes
-every- song... and dissects it, and rearranges it in every single possible
manner. He'll take the hook & put it here, put it there, 'n he's like,
he's so funny, it's like "Sometimes I'll feel bad, because it's like,
I'm driving everybody else crazy... 'Cause, one time I'll come in to
practice, and I'll be like 'OK!' and have it all mapped out, 'let's play
it like this'..." They can play it like 100 times, so he can listen to
it, take the tapes home... and then come back the next day and like,
"OK, this goes here, & that goes there, & this goes here..." and he's
like "it's like a little puzzle, and I always put it back together until
I find exactly what I want..." It was really cool, 'cause he was like
"You should be able to take any of your songs and, y'know..."
E- Rearrange 'em
L- Rearrange them. He's like, "You don't have to play things, like..."
Wow, yummy! (food arrives) Alright! I love food. Heh. It's weird. It's
like, I don't eat a lot at any one time, like there's no way I'll never
finish this... But I eat, like, all day long. All I do. It's like, I go
here, & I go there... Just food in general. Probably just have some like
oral fixation or something, that's where the smoking...
E- Should I put that on? [laughs]
L- Laura Ann has an oral fixation. And now that she's trying to quit
smoking, she's gonna be a big, fat cow. [laughs]
E- Well, you have a ways to go... [laughs]
L- Yeah, I know, well, I'm lucky I have a decent tolerance, 'cause I drink
a -lot- of beer... [laughs] That's why I was thinking, "If I stop eating
meat, there'll be less things for me to choose from, and I won't get
-really- fat..."
Being a vegetarian is so complicated.
E- Yeah, my mom is...
L- A lot of my friends are vegetarians, and like- I couldn't bring myself
to like, read the sides of everything I eat, like
E- This's got eggs in it! Gelatin...
L- Cow hooves! Last night, the guitar player in my new band... Sara...
she's so funny, like. I grabbed, like Fiddle Faddle or something, and she
totally grabbed it & starts reading the side of it, and I'm like "Oh,
lemme help you..." Y'know, I'm like, "It's beef popcorn products." What do
you think is in Fiddle Faddle? What could they possibly put in it? What
kind of like, animal excretions could be in here? [laughs]
E- They used to have gelatin in Cool Ranch Doritos... So my mom couldn't
eat 'em...
L- No!?
E- Yeah!
L- Did she write 'em a letter? "Dear Dorito company..."
E- No... [laugh] I guess they don't have it in there anymore... I don't
know why or when they stopped, but...
L- I know why, because...
E- maybe they were petitioned by a bunch of angry vegetarians...
L- ...that was like, the anal-retentive vegetarians who were like "Doritos
are the staple of my -life-... I can't eat anything else, so please take
the gelatin out..."
E- Out of Cool Ranch...
L- I dunno. My bubble-blowing thing is something... everybody... in
Chicago, it's like, I chew gum while I play drums to keep time... Just,
out of habit... When Motorhome, Motorhome was my first band, it's sad
we broke up... 'cause I miss them as people... I mean, imagine hanging
around with someone for 3 years, and all of a sudden you don't really
see them anymore... You saw them like 5 days a week... But we weren't
jiving, anymore, you know. I have more rock in me, and they were getting
more mellow. So, um... I dunno. We used to, when we first met, me &
Kristin were friends. And, we were total sugar junkies, like, really bad.
I mean, we'd like go to one of those little corner Mexican stores, and
we bought like, a case of Blow-Pops. And that's how the gum thing started.
That's how I learned to play my drums. I- Jimmy called me one night, you
know, and he's like "You used to play drums in high school, right?"
I'm like, "Well, [psh] kinda, I used to play the -triangle-, because all
the guys wouldn't let me play anything 'cause I was a girl..." And so,
he's like, "I wanna sell my drum set, but I want to keep it in the
family." You know, so I have the set that they recorded Gish on...
E- Wow.
L- like, his first drum set, yeah. Yeah. But it's not- now- my- the, Gish
was recorded on it, Catherine's first EP was recorded on it, and my
first album was recorded on it. So I'm like, "This is a Rock 'n Roll Hall
of Fame drum set"... [laughs] But, um...
E- Can I induct that one?
L- [laughs] Yeah, really... Well, my next 3 albums that are gonna come out
this fall... I'm in 3 bands right now, and all three-
E- Three?
L- All three are gonna have albums out this fall.
E- Wow.
L- So I'm gonna be a very busy-busy lady. But I- it's so weird, though,
because I -refuse- to give up my pumpkin job, I mean, I- I LOVE- it.
And not just because it's like a dream job come true for like anybody,
but because I've actually become attached to- a lot of the people, and
y'know, it's how I, I don't know how to explain it, it's like a little
Zen thing. I sit there with my letter opener, like on my recliner, n'...
E- Read all these fan letters...
L- Right. But I'm -so-, like, 'n just, people come over, and they're like
"Oh, my god," y'know, "How can you do that?" I'm like, "well I have
to do it steadily... Or else, I end up getting, like, mountains and
mountains of letters, so, I have to pretty much do it...

E- How many letters come in every day, usually?
L- You know what, I check the mail, oh, which, I s'pose I shouldn't have
done there, people get so mad, like, they send me, like, Federal Express,
like, to ask me a question that they have to know for a book report, but
I only check the mail about every other week, 'cause- I mean, it's about
how long it takes me to catch back up. Y'know? So, it's stupid to go
there every day, 'cause it'd just sit there in my house anyway for two
weeks. So I kinda wait. I get a bag about, y'know...
E- Waist-high...
L- About this high, about this big... Every other week. It's a lot of
mail! I've never sat there & actually counted, but, I mean, just from the
stuff that I send out, and like the stamps I buy, & stuff- I would assume
that we get a couple thousand letters- a month. You know. That's why it's
a full-time job.
E- That's all?
L- That's ALL?
E- Well, a month...
L- That's a lot of work...
E- Well, I s'pose, I mean, you have to read everything, and figure out
what you gotta write back to 'em... OK, now that we're like, on my track
here [laughs]
L- OK
E- What are, like, the most frequent things that people, like ask- for...
L- I, oh, ask FOR? Or ask?
E- Or ask, or whatever
L- ...are they married. Y'know.... Things like, if you read
E- Personal life.
L- The thing that's really funny is that the questions asked in the fan
mail are questions that have been answered in, like, any-
E- Yeah
L- major article... And, actually, my next newsletter, why I was waiting-
'cause I'm always waiting for them to come home, and I was just gonna put
one out on my own, like, without their approval, but just- they- woulda
had a heart attack. They're always like "you can't -say- that!" All I
know about them is like, whatever, when they're fighting with their
girlfriends, or when they're getting married, & I know like all their
personal life stuff, and I'll like write this stuff out, and they're like
"what are you -doing-?" "What?" ya know? It's like, "our PR person says
this is what we're supposed to be like," or whatever, and I'm like "Well,
I don't care about that stuff," I just know, y'know, whatever. That you
just bought a Mercedes. Y'know?
E- On the Q101 thing last fall
L- Oh, yeah.
E- where they had Billy & James on there, this girl called in & asked if
Billy was married, and he's like "yeah", and she like started crying, &
she's like "Really?" He had to explain to her that he wasn't that great
to live with...
L- His wife is the coolest. Chris is- not only is she, like, drop-dead
beautiful- have you ever seen a picture of her or anything? I think they
keep that pretty...
E- Just the- is it her locket that's on the inside of Pisces Iscariot?
L- See, I'm supposed to know all these things, but... I'm gonna find out
who all those pictures are.
E- Like, all the ones on the inside of Siamese Dream?
L- Oh, those are just- the graphic artist got those.
E- Oh, they're just general, random
L- No meaning. yeah. The thing, oh, Gish is really funny, too- the cover
of Gish- was originally, like a big huge collage w/ all kinds of stuff
that D'arcy did, and the, what they have on there now, that middle
picture of them...
E- the globe
L- ...was the middle of it. But when she submitted it, to Virgin, they said
it looked too much like the Jane's Addiction album which was really big
at the time, and she's was like "Well, I wasn't trying to like, rip them
off or anything," and they're like "Aw, no, it looks exactly like it, you
have to change it." So, she's just like [KXXX, KXXX], like, cleared
everything off, & just like, zoomed in on the middle, & she's like "There"
Y'know? "Oh wow, that's great," and she was like "Fuck you..." Well,
whatever, it's cool, so... But there's a lot more to it, like the initial
illusion of it...
E- should make it into a poster...
L- Yeah, really
E- I swear, there're like- myself included, there are people who would,
like, that would buy tapes of their jam sessions. I mean, like- Pastichio
Medley- I mean, you've got 70 little clips of songs that are like- it's
like, you wanna hear the rest of the song, because, like, the riffs are
so cool, but you're like, "aargh!"... it's like a teaser...
L- He is the riff-meister.
It's really weird, because people ask me lots of specific questions,
like, all the time, and, like, I don't know what Billy's thinking when he
wrote this song, or whatever, and those are the kind of things that I get
asked a lot, I mean- there's little things I know, like, I know the names
of his cats, or whatever, like, crap like that...
E- Lily...
L- Or, I dunno. I don't know how to explain. So a lot of people, I feel
really bad, I mean, I wish I could sit down & like, write every single
person back like I used to, and be a lot more informed than I am. Right
now, until they come home- I mean, when they're in the United States,
it's easier, but with them being in foreign countries for the past 6
months, I've been like, extra- closed out of their lives... But when they
come back, things are gonna be- better. I have more time. Not for long.
So what else do people wanna know?
--

E- What's the most annoying things people ask about? ...I just have to ask
that, because a lot of people ask the same annoying things online a
lot, so...
L- Well, I don't know. I don't really find anything annoying, but I find
like, things funny. Just the people that are obviously drunk, or just
really stupid, that write these, like, nonsense letters. Or, like, I'll
open up a letter, and it'll just say, like "You fucking rule". And that's
it! Y'know, and I'm sitting here looking at this & thinking to myself,
like, you spent 23 cents, er, whatever...
E- 32
L- Er, 32
E- -Used- to be 23... Waay long ago...
L- Yeah, I know, and you wasted -my- time opening this, I mean, they're
not gonna see it... Or, stuff like that, that's another thing that's
weird, too, is like- I have to admit that I am, that's why I'm always
like, "Be nice to me". 'Cause people start letters like "Dear fucking
assholes who open this mail, I've sent like, 10 letters to -Billy-, and
he hasn't written me back, so you fucking suck", so like, obviously I get
through the "Dear fucking asshole" and it goes straight in the garbage.
[laughs] So, I'm always like, "Hello. I'm sorry you were so bitter..."
Y'know... [laughs] There's just some people that have really, like,
reamed me... But it- like the dollar for the lyrics- That was an
accident. That was- whoah, I didn't finish that story. When they
reprinted the, the Siamese Dream without the lyrics booklet, they had to
make a decision, like, that day, about it, and they wrote in there, like,
write to -me-, and, like, send a dollar to me, and I'll send you the
lyrics. And all of a sudden, y'know, I'm just opening the mail like I
always did, and I'm getting all these dollars. So I'm writing these
people back, sticking their dollars back in the envelopes, & like "What
are you talking about? I don't -have- any lyrics"... They didn't even
-tell- me. The management company did it, they didn't ask the
band, and they didn't tell me that they printed it in there... So I'll
say, I must've sent back like a couple hundred dollars, and then I was
finally like, This is a little too much of a coincidence that all of a
sudden people are pummeling me with questions about lyric sheets.
Because, for Gish, people asked a lot, but not -that- much, where all of
a sudden they started coming in... So I asked the management company,
they're like...
E- Did you -have- the Gish lyrics? [laugh]
L- No. Billy won't. I've sat him down & talked about, either transcribing
them, or doing, like we were gonna do a contest or something, originally,
and he's like, "I will write out, like a hand-bound..."
E- Yeah, I heard about that- "for someone to treasure and exploit"
L- Right, right, exactly. We were gonna do that, but then he was like,
well, we just dragged our feet, & we were just like "forget it" Or like
"Well, we'll do it -one- day..." That's the story of the fan club right
there: "Yeah, what a great idea- we'll do that one day..." And then by
the time, it's like "Oh shit, we gotta put a newsletter together" and
it's like, we don't even proofread it, we just stick everything together,
I think in the last one I spelled the album wrong. Or, I spelled it
right, 'cause I checked, but the printer spelled it wrong, but I was just
like "Just print it! I don't care!" So it was always like "Hurry, hurry!
Wait... Hurry, hurry, hurry! Wait..."
E- I have these little drawings I did for each of 'em, with little notes
on each of 'em, the one for Billy was mostly about lyrics, & I was like
'Well, ya know, what I did for Soul Coughing was, they have an email
address, and I emailed him a few times & I figured out most of the
lyrics, but some parts were really hard to understand... I asked if he
could correct them, and he said "Oh, sure, I'd just send the lyrics to
you, but I can't through AOL..." So- you can't like, attach files or
whatever, so- I sent him my lyrics, for his album, and he sent it back
corrected.' So, that was really cool. So I was like, "So, Billy, wanna do
that?" [laugh]
L- He's really weird about it. I mean, I think it's because, I mean, he's
said it a million times, it's like, he didn't think he had grown to being
a good lyrical writer until Siamese Dream, so... I don't know if I would
venture to say he's embarrassed & doesn't want anyone to know...
E- Like, "What are the lyrics to 'Egg'?"
L- Right, they're too, they're so horrid that he doesn't want anyone to
know... But, I don't think that that's it. Because, he's so brilliantly
articulate. I mean, he amazes me.
E- Even the first stuff,
L- Oh, yeah
E- Like, pre-Gish. I have, like, I wrote, everything from My Dahlia to
Medellia, I've tried to figure out, I have most of it written down,
except for like the few songs that have only been played live, like When
You Die Inside, it's like "RAARAHRAHA" and then you can understand like
one part...
L- Now I'm getting all oogly, I'm like "I love them..." [laugh] OH,
listen- I have like, a dream-come-true story. I got- when they did
Lollapalooza, I actually got to go like, I sat onstage behind Jimmy. And
I think that was one of the first times that it really, like, clicked-
like, "holy -shit-, I mean, these guys are like, -stars-!" I mean, it
took like, that long for it to click. I mean, I open letters like every
day. And it doesn't click. But something like that, where I sat right
behind him, and of course I wanted to shove him off & like, play "Heey!
It's mee!" But, obviously I can't play like he can, so... They turned the
lights on to the crowd, and that's when it, like, totally hit me
E- seeing 40,000 people out there
L- Little smiling faces, people jumping up & down, yeah! I freaked out!
And then, you know, they play a place like the Double Door the next time,
and it's so small, and that's when I'm like "This is more like it. This
is the band that I knew." All these stadium rock crap... And he acts
different, too, now. Because, I mean, he's putting on a show, and he's
very conscious that he has to keep people interested as well as play
things fluently, you know, and it's so weird, it's weird. But even
like the small venue stuff, where he would play to like, 10 people,
y'know, once upon a time when nobody liked them... And he was still
totally, well, he had all that hippy hair back then, and he would just
-wail- on his guitar, & just go crazy bonkers, and his hair is so funny,
because he had this long hair, and it was always just, like, dripping
wet. I mean, they could have the air conditioning on, and be like, the
Arctic Tundra inside the club, and Billy would just be like -drenched-
with sweat... Like, how do you do that? You drink too much water...
[laugh] I'm sure there's something interesting...

E- Well, back to the mail thing- how much of the mail does the band
actually read? Like, I know one person told me they sent a picture of
like, him & his wife and Billy, and they like sent it in...
L- Oh, just recently? Like, from Brazil or something like that?
E- I can't remember.
L- Do you know how many photos I get? At one point I started a wall of
all the, like, school photos, all that kinda stuff that I get, like, the
15-year-old people that send me like, their sophomore year pictures
E- Pictures of them & Billy? Oh, or just of them?
L- Oh no... and all the love letters, that's my favorite: "Dear Billy,
here's me in my underwear..."
E- [laughs}
L- Little do they know, it's like me & my friends sitting around my room,
like, "Ooh, -baby-! Look't -her-... She's -naked-..." You know, and the
thing that's weird about that, is those are the kind of letters he
doesn't want to get, because his wife gets jealous... So he's like, I
give him such huge boxes that he puts in his living room & reads 'em &
stuff, but actually I wish I knew the name of the girl: Billy and I used
to do a lot more than we're doing now because this one girl ruined it for
everybody. I mean, he would actually write, hand-write people back. And
everything I gave him, he would go through it & write them back, and be
like, "ok, I need more"
E- Wow...
L- And he was really into it, because he was like "I feel, they wrote me
specifically, or if you read it- I want you to go through all the mail
that's addressed -to me-, or anything that you get that you think I
should answer, or that you can't answer," stuff like that. And he was
-really- good about that, like, right after they toured for Siamese Dream
and he came home... And then this one girl- he called people too, he'd
like read their letter & then he'd call up & be like "Thanks for writing,
this is Billy Corgan," or whatever, and I'm sure they were like "Yeah,
right" until they got off the phone and realized "Omigod, it was him,
omigod!" But he would call people, he was really good about it, like,
people- that were, I mean- when Siamese Dream came out and he said that
he was suicidal and all that kinda stuff, -every- suicidal person, like,
in the -whole- country wrote a letter like "You understand me! and if you
don't call me back, I'm gonna jump off a cliff on- November 22nd..."
y'know, or whatever, and I was like "Oh My God." I mean, it's really sad,
I mean, some of these people, I mean, I used to be like that, and I mean,
they're really serious, and it's not that I'm making light of somebody
else's problem, but- when they move those problems onto like, stars...
It's always the things you read about, and then I'm the person that's
actually, you know- I'm thinking to myself, "if this person kills
themself, -I'm- responsible if I don't give this to Billy & he doesn't
call her." Y'know? I mean, that's a pretty deep thing. And it'd really,
it's really weird, but we would sit down & go through stuff, but he
called this one girl once, or faxed her, something, all I know is she
basically started stalking him & he had to like change his number & she
sent a letter like -every- day for, y'know, I mean, she like sent him
letters like every single fuckin' day. I mean, half those bags, y'know,
would be like, her. [laughs] So, it got, and then she was like freaking
out if he didn't call her back, and all this stuff, so... One bad
apple...
E- I heard that someone tried to legally change their last name to Corgan,
or something...
L- That's funny. That's really funny...
E- And like, claimed like, he was the father of her child or something...
L- I was just gonna say, I don't even think his -wife- changed -her- name
to Corgan... But she did.
She did the first two T-shirts, his wife did those. The devil & angel
ones? She drew those. Isn't that funny? I mean, he told her what to draw,
she's like "well, it wasn't like, my inspiration", he's like "well, I
want a devil with his foot on the planet" or whatever, y'know, so she's
like "alright..."
E- Doesn't she work at the Art Institute?
L- She restores stuff for them, I mean, I haven't talked to her in a while
E- Should I not give this out either, have people stalking Billy's wife...
L- No, you can just say she restores art... That's what she does, I
mean... I think, when they were- comfortable enough, to put it that way,
she stopped working her retail job, or whatever. And, um, she'd just
graduated from the Art Institute, and started doing stuff that was good
things, like she restores books, & she restores like, old artwork, so
she's the person that like fills in all the little gaps, isn't that
weird? I mean, she's like, as far as I'm concerned, she's like, a really
important person. Like, other people, you don't even realize, like, you
go to see a Monet, and she's the person that like, touched up the
haystack.
E- Fill in the cracks...
L- Right. Isn't that funny?
Their wedding was just beautiful... Oh! Shoot, I had pictures for you.
E- Ooh!
L- I'll mail 'em to you.
E- OK...
L- I've got an old photo of, like, when they were recording Siamese Dream,
like a big one, too... Like, they all had long hair & sunglasses, and
they were all layin' there, and I'm like, aw, this is so hokey, I gotta
take one. And, I gotta- I have lots of pictures from D'arcy's wedding,
but I can't give them to you.
E- Aww.
L- 'Cause they're weird about that stuff. Like, I have a really great
picture of Billy & his wife, but I'm pretty positive that they
E- Right.
L- don't want that anywhere, so... There's as picture of me & Butch Vig,
though... so, you can put that on the... I was like "Yeaaay!"
E- There was a huge thing with like, when Mellon Collie came out, and it
was like "Flood ruined the album" and "They should've stayed with Vig"
and all this stuff, and it's like, whatever. And they were tryin' to
like, people saw James on the Rockumentary where they asked him about
Flood, and James just goes "Well, he's English, and I don't really want
to talk about it" And they're like, they totally took it seriously
L- Right...
E- ...it was really bad...
L- No, he's a very nice man. He's very little. I had no idea. He's like,
teeny. I mean, he's probably about, -maybe- as tall as I am.
E- Isn't Billy, like, 6'4?
L- Billy is a giant. And I always tell people, I'm like, that's why he's
such an amazing guitar player, is his hand is probably as big as my -foot-.
E- I don't suppose you would happen to know, like, how far he can reach on
a piano...
L- No, but probably pretty far.
E- Yeah, I play piano. I like, figured out Mellon Collie, & wrote out the
score for like the cello & synth parts
L- Wow! Very cool.
E- I was gonna try & figure out the piano solo in the middle of Soma
L- He might send that to you.
E- Huh?
L- I said he might send that to you.
E- Send?
L- Well, I'm sure he's got the score written out at his house somewhere...
I was over there one day when he was doing that- that Joy Division thing
that he did
E- Isolation
L- that he did as "Starchildren" So, he was like, figuring it out like, on
his little keyboard, like, up in his- in his house, he has a - he has, I
guess it's like a 2-story, it's an old house, so like there's different
stairs that go up that go up different places
E- duplex...
L- So, he just took one of the bedrooms, and it's like his own little
studio, so he's got like an 8-track, and a DAT, and a rack with maybe 4
guitars at the most, I mean, you would think, like, Billy Corgan would
have like an entire warehouse, but it's like the size of a little bedroom
in anybody's house... Little keyboard, his little DAT player, his little
headphones, he's so cute, he'll sit there with his little headphones on,
and he gets so excited, n'- I felt so bad that day, because I totally had
somewhere to go, and I was just stopping to drop off some mail, I'm like
"Oh, here's some more mail" "Come upstairs, come upstairs!" So I go
upstairs and he's like a little kid, he gets so excited, he's like "OK,
listen to this, omigod- " [doodoodoodoo] "What is it? What is it?" And
it's like "Wait- it's not New Order- it's Joy Division, isn't it?" and
he's like "Woo! Omigod, I'm so excited you know what it is!" he's like
"I'm gonna do this compilation," y'know, n' he's like, totally like,
sitting there, & geeking out on his instruments, you know?

E- I heard that they did a cover of 100 Years by the Cure for some other
thing, but it never got released?
L- Possibly.
E- I would -love- to hear that.
L- It's very possible. They have so- That, and the thing it that I'm like
-so- not knowledgable... I'm so not-knowledgable about that stuff,
because there's -so- much. I mean, when I first heard those Peel
Sessions, I mean, they did those when they were in England, so- usually
the stuff here, I know what's going on, because I'm keeping in touch with
them more, but the stuff that they do overseas & stuff... it's just- I'm
like "Oh my GOD! You did an Animals cover? Cool!" & they're like, "Oh,
yeah, forgot to tell you" or whatever. And they're like "Yeah, we just
did it off our hip" or whatever. Fuck you guys. Off your hip... James has
so much stuff- in the can, now that he has - in the can, my favorite
expression, now that he has, he has a little studio in his house now.
E- Wow.
L- I think- I'm gonna say, I think he did that whole song w/ the Veruca
Salt chick at his house.
E- ...Said Sadly?
L- I'm not positive, but I know that the studio that James has in his
house is like, the only digital, like, all-digital studio in the city of
Chicago.
E- Wow.
L- He has some super- someone was trying to explain it to me- I haven't
seen it yet. I keep wanting to get over there, I'm almost like blowing it
up into these huge proportions, like, they were like "Yeah, he miked,
like, every room in his house, so he can like go into a closet and play
something & it'll beam down to his board or something" and I'm like "SHUT
UP!!" So I don't know if they were just pullin' my chain, or if it's
really true, but... That's so cool. I guess it's just like, any music
geek's dream come true. I mean, it's like, what would you do if you got a
million dollars? I would mike -every- room in my house! You know, the
story how I'm picturing it, like, wow, then a studio in the basement-
Yeaah! But they all have houses now. Like Jimmy's house- it's like a
little grandma house. Very cute, nice neighborhood, it's not like, like
this big, huge, pretentious mansion, it's totally like a house in
Chicago. I mean, when I looked at it, I was like "Oh my god! I mean, this
totally looks like my great-aunt's house" ya know? It's like- the
stairway's really small, that goes, & he has a basement where he has a
drum set, & I got to play that one, too. And he has like, a bass guitar,
& he's like "I'm tryin' to write stuff, but, y' know, when you're working
with geniuses, you get discouraged more than you get encouraged."
E- It was funny watching him play guitar w/ Cheap Trick
L- He was good, though
E- and in the Rhinoceros video, they have him playing guitar...
L- He's really a good guitar player, like, surprisingly enough. Played on
the Starchildren first, when that first started
E- It's just like, Billy & anyone else?
L- Well, no, it was Billy & Neil from Catherine, and um, I think they had
Eric playing with them, the cello player
E- Remschneider
L- But now I don't even remember, because they played- every time they
played it was a different lineup. The first time I remember it was- the
first time ever, it was Neil, Billy, and Jimmy on bass. And that's it.
E- Wow.
L- And I'm sitting there, and I wish I could remember who they opened for,
it was some ridiculous bill, I mean, it might've even been like a small
thing, like a local band, or something. But it was before anything
happened. It was when the pumpkins were medium-big in Chicago. But back
when we first got signed & stuff, you would think that their hometown,
everyone would be all goo-goo-ga-ga over them... They were like, they
were doing well, because, doing well in Chicago was really hard, I mean,
back then, the big bands were, like, I think Material Issue, starting to
make it, but- the type of music that they play, or the type of music
that's popular now, wasn't popular then. So when they got signed, it was
like, people- nobody wrote about it in the local paper, nobody cared... I
mean, quite honestly, until Gish like, sold 350,000 copies, I mean, even
in between the time it did- nobody wrote about it. Nobody really cared.
Once in a while, they'd get like, Illinois Entertainer. One of our local,
like, really shitty magazines, that for some reason, people read... They
have like, an award thing- and they give away actual awards- Oh, that was
another thing we were gonna give away through the fan club. Is uh, James
got an award for like, the best guitar player, or like, the best
performance on an album for Gish, and Billy was like "I played everything
on Gish..." And James got the award for best guitar player, and James did
not accept it, I think like, Jimmy accepted it, it's still in the box.
And Billy's like, still, to this day, he's like "it always baffles me,
'cause, since we have two guitar players, and I'm the singer, people
assume I'm the second guitar player," but then he's like, "I'm the -lead-
guitar player, I do all the solos..." He was also reading, Billy used to
read this book, like, 2000 best guitar players of all time, and it has
like, "James Iha" and Billy was totally like, "That's supposed to be
-meeee-!"
E- Well, he's very appreciated.
L- Oh, no- he is. But, I mean, at first, when that happened, when he
wasn't being appreciated, it was just like salt in his wounds... It's
like "-I- played the lead guitar part!" But then they just thought it was
funny. Y'know? I didn't go to the award show, but I'm sure Jimmy was just
like, "James would like to thank you -very- much" y'know, like snickering
under his breath... So. There's a bunch of other, like, things that
they've gotten, like, bogus awards for things they didn't even do, that
people just gave them to have them there, or something... Billy's like
"We'll give all those away, like, through the fan club, and people can
just have them & appreciate them."
E- Funny...
L- So what's another question? Oh, people ask me for their shoes, too. I
always thought that was weird.
E- Shoes?
L- The first time I-
E- Like, "send me Billy's left shoe"??
L- The first time I got the request, I thought it was funny- I was
actually gonna go buy a pair at the thrift store & just send 'em to this
guy, and just find this monster, like size 50 shoe, put 'em in a box &
tell 'em it was Billy's or something. And then it, like, I got -like,
which- I'm sorry, like 5 requests for somebody's shoes is just ridiculous.
And, I mean, I've gotten at least 5 requests.
E- Ever get requests for like, a lock of hair? Stuff like that...
L- Oh yeah, stuff like that. The voodoo stuff? Always. Anything. Well,
people want things that aren't too ridiculous, like, pics, or photos,
even, but there's just so- avidly against it being some commercial thing,
that it's kind of inconvenient for me. Because I think a picture, or
like, a signed, autographed picture for like, some sick girl in, you
know, Ottawa, Kansas... I mean, there's no reason why I couldn't do that
for them. I mean, really! I mean, I think I have enough brains where I
wouldn't fall for like, too many scams, I mean, I wouldn't send them to
every single person, but there's people that do really nice things -for-
-them-, that don't get things back, and I don't want them to feel
unappreciated, but people like, take the time to do like, these huge
drawings & paintings, & oh, we get lots of those, too... I mean, I take
them to the practice space, I mean- like, people who make videos- people
make videos, too, send 'em in... I always take them to the practice space
& show 'em to the band. We sit there & there like on the dining room table,
and when we're on a break, we'll just like, watch videos. They're
enjoyable. This one kid sent like a video letter... And we all sat there
and watched it. We were all- oh my god. This poor kid. He was so cute,
and he was like he was really talking to them, and all of a sudden he'd
get like all shy & look down & stuff, & be like "If you're really watching
this..." n', you know... Totally freaked out that he was even making this
video. Sorry. Next question.

E- Do you have any idea what their doing next?
L- They're just going to get ready to go on a tour of America...
E- So there won't be like another 8-track single or something?
L- Not that I can see, because I don't see them having any time, unless, I
mean, I know they have a -lot- of stuff that wasn't put on the album...
E- Yeah, they always have a lot of stuff
L- Well, it's funny, 'cause when I saw him write that thing out for the
last newsletter, it had like, the longest song & the shortest song & all
that, and he just wrote it for me and then they weren't even on the album.
'Cause, he wrote it out, like, before I got the tracklist or anything...
E- He wrote, like, "God Squirrel" and "Pee"...
L- I know, because the whole thing about that, which I haven't even had the
chance to talk to him about...
E- Are those actual songs?
L- I don't know if he re-made them, or
E- Or if it was a joke, like, he's just fuckin' around with us again, like-
oh yeah, that one interview, he said the new album was gonna be called
"Jupiter & Chloe"...
L- He probably changed his mind.
E- Actually, it said- somewhere, he said he got this survey from a magazine,
he just filled out a bunch of stupid answers, just-
L- Right... They do that a lot.
E- So...
L- But they're pretty... I mean, with me, though, they're pretty... they
don't... they don't, like, fuck around with me for the sake of fucking
around with me, 'cause I'll just yell at them... It's like, he just did it
really fast, ya know? So, I don't know...
E- "Longest song: God Squirrel"... So there is a "God Squirrel" out there
somewhere?
L- Perhaps... And then it's like, well, maybe it's 'God', and then they just
did, like, some crazy, hour-and-a-half remix of it, like, as a joke, while
they, like, mixing down...
E- Like "Die" at the end of Pastichio Medley
L- Right. 'Cause I thought to myself- There's NO way... on this planet, that
any musician, like, even a drummer, can play- track a song that is an hour
and 12 minutes long, or whatever, y'know? It would take you- a YEAR, to mix
it down & everything, and add all the parts to it. So, there has to be
some loop or something that was plugged in, with like, an extra hour...
E- We were just assuming it was a total joke, and we started-
L- But "Pee", I'm sure, exists somewhere...
E- like, "Oh yeah, it's on the secret Cabal version of MCIS"
L- It's probably somebody peeing.
E- "...that only the Cabal gets... (there is no Cabal)..."
L- Did you get the vinyl version with the extra track?
E- It hasn't come in yet where I live.
L- I have one waiting for me at [?] I don't even know what the extra track is
yet. I've been waiting for it to come in-
E- There's two- one's "Tonite Reprise" and one's "the Infinite Sadness",
which I guess is an instrumental... Tonite Reprise is pretty good, it's on
the Tonight, Tonight single...
L- I -know-... I have that... I have everything they've put out there. I
don't have -any- products from them ever, I've had to go to the store &
-buy- everything. I send them a bill for it, so they buy it for me, but...
E- You have to go out & get it... don't like, get it early or anything...
L- Just like every other fan, I don't get everything. There's a lot of things
that people ask me about, and really, I don't have it, I've never heard it...
But, I mean, I probably heard it at one point or another... But one time I
could -kick- myself, I go over to Billy's house, and we're sitting there
talking, he's pulling all this stuff out, he's- It's always show and tell at
his house, he's always like, "Look at -this-" and "I got -this-"... Pulls
out all these singles... The smile thing- er, the Disarm single- he gave me
like, this big vinyl version of it... He's like, "I -drew- that, & he's
like all excited, he's like "Isn't it -cool-?" I'm like "Wow," and I
thought he was just showing 'em to me, but I left, and he calls me like
a couple days later, and he's like "Well, you left all your stuff
here." I'm like "All what stuff?", y'know, and I'm like "I brought-" it
was the first time I brought him Motorhome stuff, and I was all like,
nervous that he was gonna hate it... And, uh- I was like "I got my
tape, that's all I brought with me..." He's like "Oh, well I gave you
all those singles & those records & stuff, and you didn't even take
'em..." And I was -totally- bummed out, 'cause I was like, I -know-
I'm not gonna see him for another fuckin' YEAR... So it was, gone, I'm
sure he gave 'em to somebody else...
E- Aww...
L- But wait- they did give me one thing: they gave me the soundtrack for
the video. One of those things-
E- Earphoria?
L- Yeah... They gave me one of those CDs.
E- I had to get a bootleg version of it.
L- I had to like, take it out of the practice space & stick it in my pants,
sneak out with it... They had a box of 'em there, I'm like "Can I have
these?" "NO..." ..."Why not?" "You're gonna give 'em to all your
-friends-" I'm like "No I won't, the fan club -are- my friends... [groveling]
They're the only friends I have..." ...But you have to give me bribes,
I have to have things like, bribe people to help me. But they're like,
sending me the T-shirt thing now, which is- hard- trying to stay on top
of that... it gets to be- y'know, the difference between one dollar and
twelve dollars is a lot so I wanna make sure people get their t-shirts as
soon as possible... And then I always rag about them not saving me
anything- like the tour shirts- I'm like, when you print stuff, just
send me a box, and I'll leave 'em in my house, 'cause I wanna have this
stuff that isn't available anymore... 'Cause it's like, I'm supposed to
be the fan club, and then I'm always like, well, what is the difference
between the fan club and, like, a record store, I mean, if you can get
the t-shirt anywhere, what's the difference? Like, I want all the
limited edition stuff, I want my -own- like, fan club-only stuff, I
want that. They're like "Oh, yeahyeah babe, call ya back. Fax that back
to you. Okey dokey, now!" ...Three years later. "How 'bout those fan
club t-shirts?" "O-Kay, babe. Yeah. Fax it to ya."... So they change
management companies, so I'm having high hopes that they'll totally be
into, like, helping with this kind of stuff...

(end tape side one)

--

-=-=-
SECTION EIGHT: hopes for the fan club, cool fan club things she hopes to
do, noone's ever around, her own bands

L- I hope this helps... I hope you get something out of this, I hope it's
not just rambling...
E- Well, I mean, -anything's- like, cool, y'know... a little Jimmy story...
L- Well that's what, see- that's my whole thing, like, anything's something.
And that describes like, how they've been dealing with my-
E- You wanna give something that, like, they can't get anywhere else-
L- Right-
E- Like, before everyone else finds out.
L- Right- I mean, that was one thing that really- like the one time I got
something- well, no- and then they send me the tour dates, and then they're
like-
E- And they tell you not to tell anyone...
L- "Well... here's the tour dates, but you can't send them out" because
they're not finalized yet... But like, they had the on-sale dates, and
they were like, two weeks ago, so I don't understand, are they on sale
or are they not on sale? Are you gonna wait until they're on sale for
me to send something out? Well, that makes it worthless... And that's
why I was thinking, like, I really wanna get on them about doing a
caller thing or something.
E- Cool.
L- I don't know. We'll see if that works out. But I mean, I'm gonna
really press for that, because, for this particular tour- for the
people who are already in the fan club- to make sure that they can go
to the shows. Because, I have to admit, it just -sucks- ... when you
can't go see them, because you're just like, the wrong caller at
Ticketmaster, or something like that, or you're the 16th person in line
and they run out of tickets on the 15th person. I mean- just because
you're a fan, why do you have to like, sleep out for tickets and like,
give up 3 days of your life, or drive to like the other side of the
planet- why can't you just, like, get the tickets? ...I dunno. We could
buy like, admission, like, I want to make everybody's life, like,
-easier-, I want it to be, like, a -nice- thing to be a part of the fan
club, and not like, just- I d'know. I mean, anybody who takes the time
to do something like that, is above and beyond- the normal schmoe that
hears Bullet with Butterfly Wings on the radio, but their daddy owns
whatever and they can get tickets over the people who really -deserve-
to go and -enjoy- the show. Y'know? Also, I'm like, also being a
musician, I'm like really weird about that, too. It's like a soul
thing, I mean, how can you connect with people that are only gonna
stand up and cheer for one song, you wanna connect with the people that
really care about you. And that's why they're playing arenas this
summer, and there's also the pros & cons to that... [...] It's hard for
-me- to go to the shows. I mean, going to those Riviera shows? They
wouldn't even let me bring someone with me. As a matter of fact, I went
out online at one point, and I'm like, I don't have a ticket for the
show... And somebody was-
E- Kristen was gonna-
L- I know- was gonna take me with her... And then I wrote her back and I
was like, I got a hold of them in the last second, but I was -totally-
pissed. I mean, I was totally beside myself, I was thinking- I work for
you -every- day, and I know for a fact that your, like- aunt's...
brother's... son is probably going on your guest list and I'm not
going, there's something wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong! Y'know? They're
like, "Well, our guest list is really full..." and they just figured
that I don't care. They're just like, Oh, I've seen them a hundred
million times. Which is true...
E- Still...
L- But I -do- care, I'm a -huge- fan. I can't -wait- to see them live.
Every time I see them, I am- the happiest person in the whole world.
E- I wish I could go to every show within a 100-mile radius.
L- No, I think I'm gonna go out with them, if I have the time this
summer. Maybe like, hang out at the bus. Harrass them. And I'm gonna
take photos...
E- Take me with you!
L- Yeah, and I'm gonna take photos & I'm gonna do, like, the whole- I'm
gonna do like, a really, super, kick-ass newsletter this summer, I
mean- I feel like if I do one crazy, kick-ass, fold-out, like,
exploitation, really fun- really fun newsletter, it would make like,
the whole last crappy 8 years, like, worthwhile. Y'know? There'd be all
kinds of stuff. I was trying to get D'Arcy to do stuff, for a long time,
but now that she moved, like, way up into Michigan- I'm like, "HOW am I
gonna do this?" It seems like, whenever they're off, she just goes up
there. Just like, hangs out. She has like, horses & stuff, and...
E- Apple orchards...
L- Yeah, Catherine built a studio up there, so Kerry's always up there
right now, finishing his album... So... But I have, I have- I stole one
of his guitar players for one of my bands- Jerome Brown, that used to
be in Catherine, is in my band now. So I have, The Prescriptions, which
is playing Saturday, and then we're playing Lounge Acts the week after
that, too, Lake Forest. And- Glow is the one with Jerome. Like- have
you ever heard the Smoothies? They were like, a punk band from Chicago?
Sarah- Sarah from the Smoothies, she left them, is the guitar player I've
been talking about that I keep hanging out with, from my new band, the
Prescriptions.
E- Alright- I know someone, the last time I was in Chicago, like,
someone else on the mailing list like took me around & brought me to
Jim's Grill, and she had a Smoothies' 7-inch, and she played it for me,
so... I'll tell her about that.
L- Well, Sarah's in my band. She's mine. She's all mine, mine, mine.
E- And that's in... Glow?
L- Oh no, that's Prescriptions. Glow is uh, me, and Jerome Brown... This
girl Lisa K- Um, she's one of those people that knows everybody- she sang
on like, the last Polera album, she sang on like one song, so she
actually has album credit, so I'm always like, well, you could say Lisa
Klebzig of Polera, you're on the album, and she's like "Shut up, I only
went LALALALALA! at the end of one song..." And I'm like, "Well, all
right. You weren't really in Polera, but... Polera- affiliated, there
ya go" and she's like "Well, you might as well just say 'Minnesota-
affiliated' cause I'm like affiliated with every band from Minnesota,"
which is true... But she's really good. We're a lot lighter, not
as rocky, it's a bit fluffier, but I like it. 'Cause I really like pop
music... But I really like to play, like, weird-timing rock stuff- so
I'm glad to be a part of something like Glow, 'cause, what I listen to,
you look at my CD collection, it's all, like- early 80s stuff...

E- What -do- you listen to?
L- Oh, god...
E- That was one of my questions...
L- Oh, that's one of my things, what do I listen to?
E- Yeah... Like, besides the pumpkins.
L- Well, yeah, people always say, like "Oh, sorry" and they'll turn the
pumpkins off the radio, just 'cause I'm there, 'cause they're like "You
must be fuckin' -sick- of this shit..." Y'know? I'm like, "No!" And
like, every time I go to a bar, I like put $5 in the jukebox and play
like, every single pumpkins song that's in there... But I don't know...
"Surfer Rosa" by the Pixies has to probably be one of my favorite
albums. But I'm total, total, like, 80s person. I don't know, like- all
the stuff came out in like, the mid or early 80s, like, seriously, I-
I'm not ashamed to say that. Y'know... Up to Tinderbox, Siouxsie and the
Banshees, and, y'know, the early Cure albums- like, Boys Don't Cry is
good, but not great, but the- the real, like dreamy ones in the middle,
E- Faith
L- Yeah, all that stuff, I love that crap.
E- I listened to that on the way down here...
L- I know, I know... totally...
E- My next one's 17 Seconds, I still need to get that...
L- Joy Division, and the first New Order album, that Factus 50 or
whatever it is... That first New Order album is so Joy Division-esque,
that I- really, really like that one. And... All the touch & go stuff,
I have that, like, rock chick thing... I definitely like, LOVE the
Jesus Lizard. I love, like, Slint, Freakwater... Freakwater's like
country, but they're funny... Plus it's like, I have a soft spot for
Freakwater, 'cause she's the drummer from Eleventh Dream Day, and she
plays, like, guitar & strings, so I'm always like "That'll be me one
day... I'll learn to play something besides the drums, and then I'll
have like a side- star project."
I've always been into lounge music, like, even before it became like,
this big - scene... So I have lots of like, Clark [?] albums, and... I
don't know, Esquivel stuff... I like that. But that's like, background
music, I guess... Uh, I don't know what I've been listening to lately.
Lately I've been listening to Polvo - a lot. Polara. Oh, Sleater
Kinny, I got to play with them- I play in a punk band, too.On top of my
2 bands. I'm sitting in with this, like, punk rock band. And we opened
for Sleater Kinny, which is another supergroup of ex-riot grrls, but
they're albums really good- I mean, I'm not really into that like,
screamin' bikini girl stuff, so when I like something like that, it's
usually really, really good. But I like it a lot, and they're really
cool people, which probably made me like it. Y'know? It's like, I probably
wouldn't like it if they were mean & horrible people, I'd be like "this
album -sucks-!" But they're really fun. I don't know. I got this really
bad punk compilation, whatever- I worked at Cargo for a little while. I
read what it said, something like "The best punk album of all time"
it's totally like "What-ever", had like a safety pin through the
-world-, like on the cover, I'm like "How hokey," but I started reading
the back of it, and it's like, -everything- I listened to when I was in
high school. Elvis Costello, like the Ball, n', you know, a couple Sex
Pistols songs, n' like early Siouxsie stuff, n'- I mean, not at all
what I would consider punk rock, but then when I started thinking about
it, it's like, old English punk rock, like Generation X was on there, I
just- I got this compilation, and I think that's what's in my CD-player
right now. They're so funny, 'cause I put it in, and I knew like, the words
to like, every single, like, hokey, old, 80s, quote-unquote "punk rock,"
y'know, I like, never considered it punk rock when I was listening to
it, but- so hilarious. I love it. So there, that's what I listen to. [laugh]
E- I think I've asked about everything I have, but... except for- a few
people were wondering about bootlegging, like- do they really, like,
not want people taping stuff?
L- Yeah. As a matter of fact, they told me a story once, where they went
to Reading Festival, and they played a really bad show, and they were
really upset, like, really- cranky, poopy about it... And, uh-
E- Of last year's Reading?
L- No, I think it might have been the- maybe a couple years ago... It
was a while ago. It could've even been before Siamese Dream. I don't
remember, I just remember them- saying that they played a really bad show,
and they were really upset about it, and then they were kinda walkin'
around the crowd afterwards- that's why I'm thinking, like it couldn't have
been recently, because they couldn't very well walk around the crowd
anymore [laugh]. But they were walkin' around the crowd, and they went
to these booths, and people literally record the shows, dub them on the
tapes, and have them available, like, an hour after the show, like,
they speed-dub 'em right there. And they walked up to the booth, and
took like -all- the guy's tapes. They're just like "It's illegal, and-
we- hated the show" and they're like [chchchchchchch]. And they said
that they knew that the guy just went back to his van and made some
more, but it just made 'em feel good that they took 'em away. Sometimes
they get angry, but- also from a musician's point of view, it's just
like, when someone bootlegs something, you don't have the option to
veto it, you don't have the option to put it in the order that you want
it to be heard in. Y'know, you can't say, like, "Oh, god, y'know, I've
done that so much better another day..." Y'know? And I know that people
don't care, they appreciate no matter what, but it's just- like, for
being a musician, like, from a perfectionist point of view, it's like-
every time- there's one recording of my old band, I have just like, one
little [tsh] - like, off. One. But I know it's coming, and every time I
hear it, I'm like "Ohno, ohno- AWWww, God." and so, I mean, I can't even
listen to the song... So I would assume that'd probably be why they're
anti-bootlegging. 'Cause I mean, the whole money thing at this point- I
mean, there are like, the huge legalities to it, but like, I pretty
much say that they don't- care... about like, money & stuff. Y'know?
Once you get to a point, where you're comfortable, or whatever... But
even before that, they never cared. None of them are very, like,
materialistic people. And, somebody- there's a point where I was
thinking of quitting playing and becoming Billy's personal assistant.
Yeah, I mean, I had the opportunity earlier this year, when he changed
personal assistants. I really thought about it & thought about it, and
of course, my mom's like "Aw, y'know, he's a -millionaire-, n' you
should totally do this & stuff, & he's gonna, like, pay you -so- much
money" and I'm like "Mom- you know where he comes from?" I'm like, the
man was working in a record store. And then all of a sudden he's a rich
rock star. I mean, he thinks $5 an hour is a -lot- of money. I mean, he
still thinks like that, even though- y'know, he has, like an abundance
of wealth behind him at this point. It all came to him just by being
himself, so he goes to the thrift store. And he still buys shirts that
are, like, don't fit him right. Y'know what I mean? It's just, that's
how he is, I mean, he doesn't -think- like a big, stuck-up rich person,
he thinks like the same person that he always was, and- y'know, he
doesn't have to worry about coming up with his rent, or anything, and
I'm sure that it's added a lot of problems to his life... I mean, it's
something you don't think about, but you -have- to think about it,
because somebody could be really, like, robbing you blind, like, your
broker, your investor... I know that Billy- he's just so smart. It's
weird, like, explaining him to people who don't know him, that are
already enamored by him as a stage personality, and I can say, like, as
for being his friend & stuff, I- -love- him, and I respect, like,
-everything- that comes out of his mouth. Like, he- thinks- he has such
a- sort of a comforting people as a friend, like, if I had a problem?
Like, whatever, y'know, my mom died or whatever, he would be- if he
was around- he would be the person I would want to talk to, because, he
is -so- articulate, and -soo- comforting, he's like this big- first of
all, he's this big, cute teddy bear with these big hands, and when he
hugs you it's just like [sigh] Everything's safe, he's like, "Oh, come
here" & he's so sweet, and he will- no matter how busy he is, I mean,
if I seriously was, like, sad & stuff- he would sit there & explain to
me like, why my life is so great. And he could just be like, making all
this up, like, crap [laugh] but, y'know, he'll just say it to me in such
a way, & make you feel like a million bucks. But his insight to life,
which I believe is what made him so successful, 'cause I mean, people
have like, an energy- and either you have an energy that pulls people
in, or you don't, which is something people have, it's not something
you can learn... I don't know. I don't know how to explain that, but,
we don't wanna get on my little metaphysical [laugh] freak-out fest. He
just has this, like, warming, knowledgable quality about him. Y'know?
And- really, really great, super smart, and I really believe he made like,
everything happen.

--

-=-=-
SECTION TEN: lots on James, high school, fishing

L- OK, that's everybody. James and I have been friends the longest. I
went to high school with James. And we- I moved to another high
school, like right after we met, we were hanging out for like a year,
and uh- he kinda hung around all the geeky guys, y'know... I guess,
so-to-speak, he was one of the geeky guys. There was this whole group
of geeky guys, who are now, everybody's like, they're the coolest
people, I mean, our whole little peer group: there's James, there's
this guy Bob R., who also became like, a Rock- legend, another friend
of ours, Darren, became like this filmmaker, he makes like videos &
stuff, and our other friend became a sound guy, y'know, he's like the head
sound guy for like the Smoking Popes & the Metro, and then there's me,
and then another friend of ours, like, whatever... So when you go back
to the reunion, it's like "Wow! Here they come!" And when we were walking
down the halls or whatever, it was "Ohp, here they come." When we used
to hang out, there was a whole group of people, and we just- everybody
played an instrument, and we all sat around and drank beer, and they
had a bands called the Feds, which became Snaketrain, so they were
always together... They, the boys, I was like, the girl that was with
all the boys. [laugh] And- but then I moved to Lake [?]. Didn't hang
around my [?] friends much anymore. And then when I graduated, I was
still hanging out with them, and then the Smashing Pumpkins started,
and I guess that's like my affiliation, I went to the- James' new band.
Funny. But he's always been very quiet. Real smart, really into like,
sitting in his room & playing his guitar. He's very, very silly. Well,
obviously. I mean, you can, like, see that- but the whole group of
people we hung around with, like, that whole uh- sense of humor style
that he has- imagine, like, a whole group of guys, like...
E- Totally sarcastic...
L- Oh, -totally- sarcastic. I mean, in high school, we used to sit
around and totally get all wasted... and it wasn't a good night until
they were all standing there in their like, tighty-whitey underwear,
like, [singing] "We're DRUUUUNK! Yes we aaare" y'know, like, everything
was a joke, like, every song that they would write would always be like
some crappy joke song, y'know, they were hilarious. And they were- we
would just do the stupidest things, just, all acquired this very dry
sense of humor over the years. Even to this day, like, when our group
of high school friends get together, it's all like- very - very dry,
everybody like, making fun of somebody. It's like, an endearing thing.
It's like "Oh, your hair looks really stupid" "Oh, well, thanks"
y'know. Stuff like that. And- D'Arcy I've never really known that well.
We've hung out like, a couple of times, chatted, y'know. She's super
sweet, y'know, but- I mean, I don't really- I don't have, it's like, I
can't give you a friend opinion on her, because- everything, I mean,
we've hung out at the same place at the same time, and we've had like,
numerous conversations, but I couldn't sit here & tell you anything
about her... Y'know? 'Cause I've never really got to know her
personally. We've sat down a couple times. This one time she sat me
down, they were playing at the lounge act, or something, and it was
when I was working for my parents. It was so funny, because she said
something like "Omigod, you have like, a job? You're like, the only
person I know that has goals in your life, and you're attaining them, &
you're so young," n', y'know. At the time I was running a business, and
I was 19 or 20, she's like "That's so great, y'know, you really have
your shit together." That's always stuck in my mind, because two years
later, I just like freaked out, and all of a sudden it's like, I'm in a
band... [laughs] I like, threw all that away. And I wonder if she still
like, thinks I'm cool, or if she thinks, like "God, you stupid freak, you
fell for it!" [laughs] "Now you're just like the rest of us." But
she's- she's hilarious. And Jimmy, like- as a guy, he's just like, a
normal, sweet, wonderful person. He's another person, he would do,
like, anything for me. I showed up at the practice space once on my
motorcycle, and he had his motorcycle and his car there, and he totally
got mad at me, he's like "You're driving without a helmet?" So he gave
me his helmet and he's like "You wear this home, and you go buy one,
and you come back." And I'm like "I getta wear your helmet?" And I'm
like [khxxkhsxh] - crush my head into it. "Awesome." So, but he's like,
he's very like, over-fatherly towards me, and I think it's because I
play drums now, and I think he's so proud of me, and he's so- I feel
like, proud too, because he knows he gave me that drum set, I wasn't
playing at -all-, and now, it's like, now I have a career path.
Because, I mean, just because he gave me his drum set, I mean, I
totally was, didn't even think about playing drums until 3 years ago,
whenever he gave it to me. Sat down, started to play in my house, real
quiet, my friend Kristen, started playing Motorhome, and that's how I
learned to play drums, playing with a band, so... He sees me & he's
like "How's my drums doin, ya keepin' 'em nice & neat?" and then I'm
thinking about 'em, with all the dust & crap, and totally out of tune,
and I'm like "Oh, yeah- they're great! (Shit!)" Y'know, gotta go home &
clean 'em up in case he comes to one of my shows, ya know.
I think I've told you my whole life story up to this point. I was born
in North Carolina, moved to Chicago... Been here ever since, never
leaving... I have a summer home in, uh, Wisconsin, Merrimac... Spend a
lot of time water skiin'...
E- [laugh]
L- I used to like fishing, but, not anymore, 'cause I started really-
it's like, it is relaxing & it's fun, but- I started really thinking
about it, and I'm like, oh my god, can you imagine, like standing
around with like a group of your friends, and you see a sandwich, and you
go over and you grab the sandwich, and all of a sudden there's like
this big hook in your mouth, and someone's like, pulling you away from
your friends, and drags you like, out of the Earth for a minute, and
then like takes the hook out of your mouth, and just tosses you
randomly back in, so you like, have to go & find your friends again,
and you're in like, horrible danger, because you've lost your school,
n'... it just seems more inhumane than people think about, I'm like
God, that must be so mortifying, to all of a sudden, like, have this
big metal hook, like, up the top of your mouth. And just get yanked out
of the water... "Aw, that was a fighter! Whoah! Yeah, woo-hoo!"
E- [laughing]
L- So I don't fish anymore.
E- O-kay...
--

-=-=-
SECTION ELEVEN: Billy's house, tour ideas

L- So... I dunno...
E- Uhh...
L- I think I've exhausted all my pumpkin stories that I can think of. I
wish I had more... They're probably about ready to beat us up...
E- You could show me around some secret stuff...
L- I don't know any secret stuff. I mean, the practice space is so far
away, it's that- it'd take the next 4 hours to go out there. It's
pretty far west. Aaand- lemme see. I can't take you by Billy's house,
he would just kill me... Did your friend take you by there when you
were-
E- No...
L- Billy's old apartment was over by Jim's Grill. I mean, I can't think
of any, like, pumpkin landmarks.
E- So, he like, gets really mad when people go by his house?
L- Well, not mad, but I mean, I wouldn't want to be like, the person
responsible for pointing his house out to someone and having him be
like "What'd you do that for?! Enough people like, come by here..."
E- Well, his house was in that magazine, I can't remember what it was,
but...
L- Yeah, I'm sure you could find it, but... It's still his home.
E- I'm sure he doesn't want people walking by his house & like, staring
at it...
L- People do. They always have.
E- I s'pose.
L- It's just like, he's never there, so who cares? I mean, the man is
home, like, a month a year, on and off. I mean, and this time, they're
practicing in Michigan, they're not even practicing here in Illinois
for the tour. So, they're not gonna be home at all. So, I can't decide
if they're gonna- well, just from reading the tour dates that have,
like, all the practice things on there- and I'm assuming they're
practicing there because- they're doing it at some arena, they're
practicing in an arena- I'm assuming they're doing it for the sound
guys' sake, so they can get the- get the groove goin'. When I saw
"practice" on there, I was thinking to myself, "Why?!" You've been on
tour for god knows how long, Jesus Christ, how much more practice could
you possibly need? Unless they're having like, their TLC choreographers
come in and do the "5 6 7 8, do the cabbage patch... allright"
Y'know... "This is where the smokebomb comes in... and you beam down
off the..."
E- The pyrotechnics in here...
L- Right, "and then the UFO flies in and beams Billy down onto the
stage..."
E- And then the big statue of Eddie comes up...
L- [laughs] Right. That would be awesome, I hope they do crap like that.
I've always teased them, I'm like, "You guys are so plain & boring, why
don't you do like, something crazy..."
E- Like Iron Maiden...
L- "..like, hire me, and I'll just run around in a pink bunny suit."
E- [laugh]
L- "and like, hand out candy to people or something", y'know? Something
just like, "Yeah, I saw that band with the big pink bunny, did you see
that?" Awesome... That'd be great. If my bands weren't touring this
summer I would totally weasel myself a job. Be like "I'll carry stuff,
look, I have muscles from playing drums" flex it...
E- You can get me a job...
L- I know, but they're always- I've tried that before, they're like
"Ohh, little Laura" I mean, they're seriously, like, so fatherly to me.
And, I'm the same age, they have no reason to be. "I'm an adult, what
do you mean by that?" But they're like, "Ohh, nonono, we'll have some
guys carry that for you." Y'know? ...But they've gotta have some bad,
lacky job, like, y'know- just stand there, be like "You can't go in."
How hard can that be? [laugh] You know? "Nobody in the dressing room"
Hurrayyy! "Here's 50 bucks." Y'know? Alright! I can't even be a drum
tech, though, 'cause I don't really know much about 'em. Still
learning...
E- So... I was gonna take some pictures & stuff...
L- I'll send you some stuff.
E- I have my camera here...
L- Well, the whole editing process, remember? I wasn't even thinking of
taking you back to pumpkin HQ... Fan club headquarters... Or I woulda
cleaned up.
E- I'm sure, like- I guess I can stop this.

It certainly was. I'm aware of how massive the Pumpkin's status was after SD, and even moreso after Mellon Collie in 1996, but the way she describes the fans, and even her own interactions with the band has made me realise how MASSSIVE they were.

What's weird to read is how he started out feeling like, super-connected and super-obligated towards establishing personal fan interactions. (It comes across as very sweet in a way, but also very naive.) I guess he got too close too the fire and got burnt too many times to keep up that type of interaction. Not to mention that is was unrealistic to maintain that type of relationship once MCIS blew up in the mainstream.

When I read this article over a decade ago, I must say I read it with a much different perspective than I have now--I was very impressed with the effort Billy put into these relationships. Now I suspect that he may have just been courting fans in the way he's court a young, attractive girl--so insecure in his attachments and so starving for the unconditional love and affection he never had, so willing to woo them by any means necessary just to keep them around and keep them connected to him.

Now I suspect that he may have just been courting fans in the way he's court a young, attractive girl--so insecure in his attachments and so starving for the unconditional love and affection he never had, so willing to woo them by any means necessary just to keep them around and keep them connected to him.