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It's not scare tactics, it's the reality of the situation. Scott is just spelling it out for us so we know where we stand. If Mattel doesn't get enough people to sign up in July then 2014 as we (will) know it isn't going to happen. It's likely they would still find a way to get some figures out that have already been sculpted, but nothing is guaranteed without the numbers to back it up.

But then how do you explain them being able to offer the Filmation sub without even needing guaranteed sales? If the line is in such dire straights, why would they even conceive of adding another sub? It just makes no sense! If Pepsico is having trouble selling enough grape soda to stay in business they're not going to launch another line of grape soda on top of the grape soda they already sell.

Let's also not forget that not even 6-months before the 2013 sub, Scott is on record saying (paraphrasing here) that MOTUC could lose HALF its subscribers and still be ok. But then miraculously the 2013 sub barely squeeks by? Puh-leese.

This line is not in any type of danger. I'm willing to eat my shoe if 2014 does not make it. And you can hold me to that.

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by WDWFreak53

I agree...I don't understand how it's a scare tactic.
If not enough people are buying Mustangs...I can guarantee that Ford would stop selling them. No matter how much of a fan following it has.

But if Ford is not selling enough Mustangs, do they then start selling a new line of the same Mustangs and call it a Filmation Mustang?
If this line were in trouble, there is no way they would have offered the Filmation sub without even needing a sub meter!

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Behold the new Fug-Lee-Faces, for he is 10% more respectful of other peoples' feelings!
Of course, your mileage may vary.

But then how do you explain them being able to offer the Filmation sub without even needing guaranteed sales? If the line is in such dire straights, why would they even conceive of adding another sub? It just makes no sense! If Pepsico is having trouble selling enough grape soda to stay in business they're not going to launch another line of grape soda on top of the grape soda they already sell.

Let's also not forget that not even 6-months before the 2013 sub, Scott is on record saying (paraphrasing here) that MOTUC could lose HALF its subscribers and still be ok. But then miraculously the 2013 sub barely squeeks by? Puh-leese.

This line is not in any type of danger. I'm willing to eat my shoe if 2014 does not make it. And you can hold me to that.

- - - Updated - - -

But if Ford is not selling enough Mustangs, do they then start selling a new line of the same Mustangs and call it a Filmation Mustang?
If this line were in trouble, there is no way they would have offered the Filmation sub without even needing a sub meter!

You mean...like the Mustang II?
A smaller Mustang that costs less? Yep.

You mean...like the Mustang II?
A smaller Mustang that costs less? Yep.

But the Filmation sub does not cost less...and for all intents and purposes, it is the SAME THING as the regular sub, just different characters. It would be like if Mustang IIs were just different colors not available in the regular Mustang line.

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Behold the new Fug-Lee-Faces, for he is 10% more respectful of other peoples' feelings!
Of course, your mileage may vary.

But the Filmation sub does not cost less...and for all intents and purposes, it is the SAME THING as the regular sub, just different characters. It would be like if Mustang IIs were just different colors not available in the regular Mustang line.

Well, to be honest, when they announced and sold the Filmation sub, the 2013 sub did sell well enough.
The 2014 sub will not go through if they don't get enough orders...and if they don't get enough orders for the main sub, I highly doubt a Filmation sub will be green-lit. A smaller, "LESS EXPENSIVE" (per year) sub may go through though.

Well, to be honest, when they announced and sold the Filmation sub, the 2013 sub did sell well enough.
The 2014 sub will not go through if they don't get enough orders...and if they don't get enough orders for the main sub, I highly doubt a Filmation sub will be green-lit. A smaller, "LESS EXPENSIVE" (per year) sub may go through though.

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Behold the new Fug-Lee-Faces, for he is 10% more respectful of other peoples' feelings!
Of course, your mileage may vary.

The Filmation sub went through because of the "Strike while the iron is hot" idea.
If 2014 doesn't sell enough, the iron has cooled off and they won't offer it.

Do you really think that if the 2013 sub barely made it that they would have offered a Filmation sub on top of it?
Think about it...You're a bread salesman and you just barely sold enough loaves of wheat bread to make it worthwhile. Now, part way through the year, knowing that just barely enough people are buying your wheat bread, do you now offer whole grain wheat bread? You'd be crazy to assume enough people are going to buy it.

So my point is, that I feel it is highly doubtful that 2013 barely made it. And again, Toy Guru publicly stated just months before that MOTUC could lose HALF its subscribers and still be fine. So, to think that 2014 won't go through is kind of like worrying you won't get rain in Chicago this year.

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Behold the new Fug-Lee-Faces, for he is 10% more respectful of other peoples' feelings!
Of course, your mileage may vary.

How the heck is that a scare tactic?!?! It is just a hard fact. If not enough people sub (which is what this line is built on now) than it goes away. Simple as that. EVERY toy line dies at some point due to lack of interest. This one is also not going to last forever and now that we have blown through the majority of vintage figures 2014 is gonna be a hard sell.

Not a scare tactic, per se, but really a poor job of promoting your property. How about "We have a very awesome and robust selection of figures we have planned for 2014 and we look forward to doing more figures in the future!" Sounds more positive to me, but really saying the same thing.

Promote this line? Surely, you jest! Plus, as we are beaten over the head with over and over again, this line is given crumbs as far as resources/budgets go. Certainly they wouldn't want to spend any money to potentially EXPAND the line :-P

But this line is crumbs to Mattel, while it must be profitable or it wouldn't continue, how much do you think this line affects Mattel's fiscal sales? 2%? 1%? less than 1%? It is probably extremely insignificant to Mattel with the exception of the brand recognition and the possibility of it making a comeback through media and eventually to mass retail.

Originally Posted by MegaGearMax

So Gygor ripping Vykron in half was approved? The Sorceress, Man-At-Arms, Stratos and Zodac getting killed off was approved too?

Man, I'd hate to see what Mattel didn't want to see in the bios!

And they are all fictional characters for an adult collector line, I have zero problem with characters being killed off as the story progresses.

Originally Posted by chaoslordmarduk

So stop putting obstacles in our way

What are these obstacles? You subscribe, you pay, they ship you the figures. Pretty simple, while being an international fan may cost you more, it's not much different than me buying a figure from Japan or another international market.

Originally Posted by Fug-Lee-Faces

But the Filmation sub does not cost less...and for all intents and purposes, it is the SAME THING as the regular sub, just different characters. It would be like if Mustang IIs were just different colors not available in the regular Mustang line.

Except this subscription attracted fans who didn't buy the regular sub (and presumably some regular subscribers passed on it) because they've seen some figures won't be available for day of sale and it is also not as big of a commitment. This was also offered after the success of the Castle Grayskull pre-order.

[QUOTE=Haephestus;3238095
And the absence of He-Man and She-Ra themed Barbies is bizarre, especially given the recent relaunch of Jem and the Holograms and the numerous "themed" Barbies that are released by Mattel and aimed at adult collectors. Similarly, Hot Wheels sized MOTU vehicles was an interesting suggestion that was completely misinterpreted by Mattel.[/QUOTE]

No kidding. Talk about a wasted opportunity.

I asked Scott about this at the Mattel booth years ago at SDCC and he said to talk with the Barbie rep at the booth. I went over to the Barbie rep and she told me to talk to scott.

Originally Posted by Zodach

It's not scare tactics, it's the reality of the situation. Scott is just spelling it out for us so we know where we stand. If Mattel doesn't get enough people to sign up in July then 2014 as we (will) know it isn't going to happen. It's likely they would still find a way to get some figures out that have already been sculpted, but nothing is guaranteed without the numbers to back it up.

I agree. Mattel's in this to make money people. They don't do this out of the generosity of their heart. If they don't get enough guaranteed sales they can't continue the line. I'd rather have a warning like this than a announcement coming out of nowhere announcing the end of the line.

This was also offered after the success of the Castle Grayskull pre-order.

Not really relevant. The Filmation sub was obviously green-lit by management WELL before Castle Grayskull even went up for pre-order, and is considered a completely different beast. It would have been offered even if the CG pre-order flopped. Fug is right on. If the 2013 sub sold as poorly as Scott says, upper management at Mattel absolutely never would have put the resources out there to offer another sub program on top of it. Not a chance.

It's all quite funny because in the end, it was the FANS that wanted a sub program just to guarantee they get the figures they want. And Mattel quickly turned that around to "if you don't sub, we can't make the figures" -- even though they were more than willing to 'risk it' and make the figures without a sub in the first place. And even though years of doing this has given them the sales data they need to easily make figures without 'guaranteed' sales from subs. They know how many people are buying.

Why does Mattel act like a bunch of amateurs at every possible opportunity, then? Beats me. Maybe the lot of them are just absolutely terrible at their jobs. Scott sure is, and if his level of competence is representative of the entire corporation, then I'm surprised they haven't folded under the weight of their own lack of vision. They're a billion dollar company that probably makes half of what they COULD make with proper management on every level.

Even so, MOTUC is only in as much danger as every other line Mattel makes that isn't Barbie and Hot Wheels. Meaning, Mattel can screw it all up in a matter of seconds and cancel it at any time. Just enjoy it while it's here and don't worry so much about the stuff you and I will never have any say in.

2. Toy Guru has stated that 5 out of 6 figures from the filmation sub will have day-of-sale product. But what about the main sub? will there be more figures in 2013 that won't hit mattycollector's shop?

Yes, it is very likely there will be additional 2013 figures without Day of stock in 2013 as noted when we sold in the sub last summer.

Come on! Production quota's must have been locked in, so they know exactly what is gonna be sold and what isn't at day of sale Guessing Clamp Champ or NA He-Man will get no sale stock since they will be trying to sell the 2014 sub around that time

But seriously! Why does the most minimal revelation, still have to be a major reveal/announcement? Why not just say right now what is gonna be sold on Matty?

But then how do you explain them being able to offer the Filmation sub without even needing guaranteed sales? If the line is in such dire straights, why would they even conceive of adding another sub? It just makes no sense! If Pepsico is having trouble selling enough grape soda to stay in business they're not going to launch another line of grape soda on top of the grape soda they already sell.

Originally Posted by KnightDamien

Not really relevant. The Filmation sub was obviously green-lit by management WELL before Castle Grayskull even went up for pre-order, and is considered a completely different beast. It would have been offered even if the CG pre-order flopped. Fug is right on. If the 2013 sub sold as poorly as Scott says, upper management at Mattel absolutely never would have put the resources out there to offer another sub program on top of it. Not a chance.

While it is true the Filmation sub was offered after the 2013 sub reached the minimum order mark and also after the success of the Castle Grayskull pre-order, I am not yet convinced both these events were necessary pre-cursors to whether the Filmation sub went ahead or not. Sure, the 2013 sub was probably early enough that had it failed, sub-Filmation may never have got off the ground. But sub-Filmation was well advanced by the time of Grayskull given Mattel's lengthy production schedule.

My guess on this matter is that Mattel invested significantly in obtaining the fan-demanded Filmation rights and have a quota for how many figures they want to produce to make the deal pay off. So far we have had Shadow Weaver and Fang Man and soon Octavia in the normal subscriptions (Palace Randor could have been made anyway under the same logic used for Queen Marlena and Adora). Three figures for such an expensive licence probably not a great bargain on Mattel's behalf.

So my theory suggests the Filmation sub plan was green lit, in the knowledge there was a level of fan demand - TG could deliver what the fans had been calling for and support the business plan. In that way there was no need for a Filmation-sub thermometer as after the minimum 2013 sub level was reached sub-Filmation was going ahead no matter what! Now even if 2013 is the last year for MOTUC they have got at least 9 additional Filmation characters added permanently to the ranks of allowed Mattel MOTU.

Kastor’s Korner: Is the rapid sell-out of Strobo at Early Access a good demonstrative tool to show Upper Management that more convention exclusive SKUs should be added? Many related conventions similar to Power Con offer “sets” and “teams”. White “200x” deco Marlena/Filmation Captain Glenn, Kamo Khan, and Comic Ram-Man vs Comic Trap-Jaw, and green Granamyr are examples of easy figures to produce with no/minimal new tooling and it’s a good venue for them, no?Mattel: We may have a few surprises up our sleeves!

I do not see sales for unique but obscure character Strobo with Zodak head as totally equivalent to offering re-paints of existing release figures, but I do strongly support the idea of Convention repaints. It does seem to be a perfect way to utilise some of the one-use only sculpts such as Granamyr and Ram-Man. A comic Ram-Man repaint vs mini-comic Trap Jaw 2 pak would be awesome!

Do you really think that if the 2013 sub barely made it that they would have offered a Filmation sub on top of it?
Think about it...You're a bread salesman and you just barely sold enough loaves of wheat bread to make it worthwhile. Now, part way through the year, knowing that just barely enough people are buying your wheat bread, do you now offer whole grain wheat bread? You'd be crazy to assume enough people are going to buy it.

So my point is, that I feel it is highly doubtful that 2013 barely made it. And again, Toy Guru publicly stated just months before that MOTUC could lose HALF its subscribers and still be fine. So, to think that 2014 won't go through is kind of like worrying you won't get rain in Chicago this year.

Well...if you go back and watch the video of TG when he announced that the minimum was reached, he was excited, said that we hit 135% and that since we pulled in that number, he could go ahead with "more" that would be announced at ToyFair. That announcement was Club Filmation.

If we hit 100%...Filmation may have not been possible.

On top of that, the CG preorder "blew it out o the water" so yes...the iron IS hot.

Yep...if I needed to sell 100 units of wheat bread and I sold 135 units...and on top of that well outsold my marble ryes, the yes, I'd sell whole grain wheat.

If the 2014 subscription ends up not happening, I'd still be shocked if there weren't at least a few figures released in 2014. There is still money to be made on the most popular figures like Horde Troopers and Two Bad.

If the 2014 subscription ends up not happening, I'd still be shocked if there weren't at least a few figures released in 2014. There is still money to be made on the most popular figures like Horde Troopers and Two Bad.

Castle Grayskull comes out December 2013. They have TWO MOTUC subs going the second half of 2013. OF COURSE the 2014 sub will happen!

All the subscribers? How many were there? I don't think this was a significant number.

As subscribers that were screwed, not DOS buyers....do you think any number is acceptable? I mean screw a subscriber, you don't do anything for the line the next year, correct?....So, sorry, any subscriber screwed with no way to remedy it (meaning actually getting the screwed out of figure)....is totally unacceptable, no matter how minimal the actual number, a subscriber is a subscriber after all, and the life blood supposedly of MOTUC.... The 2013 sub was hurt by all the 2012 BS, and whether someone actually got screwed out of Fisto or not, even those that got him properly knew it wasn't right....no matter how minimal, it was one of the many things that didn't help the 2013 sub out.

Yeah, tell that to all the subscribers who got the Sorceress in a Fisto box.

This Fisto issue has been around for a very long time. I have never seen any numbers though. Does anyone really know how many subscribers (approximately or that claimed they) didnt actually get a Fisto? Honestly if it is like 10 or 20, though ****** for the parties involved, that really is not that big of a number, especially if we are talking 10,000 subs or something. I am not making excuses for Matty, because they really should have done something to make up for this, but this situation is used A LOT in arguments about Matty and I really dont know how significant it was over all.

2. Toy Guru has stated that 5 out of 6 figures from the filmation sub will have day-of-sale product. But what about the main sub? will there be more figures in 2013 that won't hit mattycollector's shop?

Yes, it is very likely there will be additional 2013 figures without Day of stock in 2013 as noted when we sold in the sub last summer.

Really?

Who?
Mantenna? Castaspella? maybe a Horde Troper two Pack? or Geldor

For me it is nothing im worry about, because i have a Main and a Filmation Sub.
But Fang Man,Sea Hawk? and maybe an Mantenna or Horde Trooper only to get when you have Sub, is hard for a REAL Fan.
Even when he has not Sub.

For me it is nothing im worry about, because i have a Main and a Filmation Sub.
But Fang Man,Sea Hawk? and maybe an Mantenna or Horde Trooper only to get when you have Sub, is hard for a REAL Fan.
Even when he has not Sub.

Geldor is a pretty good guess since he was chosen by subscribers voting.

For me it is nothing im worry about, because i have a Main and a Filmation Sub.

I have both subs too, but the crappy thing about no DOS is that sometimes I want TWO or THREE of a figure. Like Fang Man...I TOTALLY would have bought a second. No DOS screws us subscribers too!

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Behold the new Fug-Lee-Faces, for he is 10% more respectful of other peoples' feelings!
Of course, your mileage may vary.