Jared Dudley Performance Discussion Thread (P. 6)

Dudley won't play this well for us every night, but when he gets fully healthy he will play closer to today than his past games. I think the worst of Jared is behind us.

Silasie

11/24/2013 - 05:51 PM PST

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I thought he had tendinitis which if I recall is a chronic condition that needs 6 months odd to heal. Which probably means he's not 100%, has some pain but can play through it.

pageC4

11/24/2013 - 06:16 PM PST

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He won't play this well every night, but if he can solidly give us the 10 points he averaged last season then that's all we need. It's no secret that Blake Griffin is our best offensive option (22 points per game), Paul chips in 19.3 a game, Redick 16, Jordan 10, so Dudley doesn't need to be the high scorer he was today. If he builds back up to that 10 PPG average then he's doing his job offensively.

DocHollywood

11/24/2013 - 06:30 PM PST

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Strange if his difficulty running and 70% range-of-motion has just suddenly healed with all the minutes he's been hobbling around playing. That's just not at all how tendonitis works. I think what happened today was Chris Paul was looking for JD more than usual once Jared started building some confidence in his shot. You know he's had to be feeling like **** with his recent inability to really contribute like normal. Jared having confidence in his game will be critical in allowing him to productively play through this injury. I'm glad to see him have a good game, but nobody should expect to see last season's Dudley until he takes some real time off, otherwise his tendonitis will absolutely not heal.

tense2

11/24/2013 - 06:44 PM PST

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Yes, he has been dealing with tendonitis no matter what the last poster said.

tense2

11/24/2013 - 06:47 PM PST

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All he needs to do is play and shoot like his past history indicates.

tense2

11/24/2013 - 06:49 PM PST

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I guess Doc and Jared are just lying, since you seem to know what's really up.

DocHollywood

11/24/2013 - 07:22 PM PST

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I know right. Never let the truth get in the way of a good debate LOL

Clippers_FTW

11/24/2013 - 07:39 PM PST

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ohhhhh so that is who he was supposed to be..

Flushyriver

11/24/2013 - 10:47 PM PST

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I don't know if the worst of Jared truly is behind us, but if he can knock in 2 corner threes for us on a more consistent basis. That alone will make our offensive sets so much more effective in the future as help defenders pay more attention to the shot. Great to see him have a nice scoring night though. Should really help his confidence.

clipperboy24

11/24/2013 - 10:48 PM PST

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Well if it didn't hold him back today why did it hold him back yesterday? Something doesn't add up...

tense2

11/24/2013 - 11:01 PM PST

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It's a conspiracy....you haven't figured that out yet

pageC4

11/25/2013 - 10:29 AM PST

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yeah this is unfolding into an interesting scenario. I certainly don't think he keeps up games like yesterday, but if he can give us 10-12 points per game that exactly what we brought him in for. over time we will see what version of Dudley we have

Silasie

11/25/2013 - 10:35 AM PST

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He was shooting better last night but was he moving better? The two aren't always linked.

EwanB

11/25/2013 - 10:37 AM PST

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guys got a pure jump shot. Agree with most of you guys, unlikely he's going to play like this every night but if he can make a couple of corner 3's and play solid D he'll be doing us fine

Silasie

11/25/2013 - 10:44 AM PST

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Spot on. His has a great stroke, and with all the offensive fire power we have we don't need that much out of him. But if the opposition know that they have to guard both Reddick and Dudley on the perimeter then it is much harder for them to defend CP and Blake.

pageC4

11/25/2013 - 10:51 AM PST

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Bingo! therein lies the problem with this slow start to the season for Dudley. I think the open looks it gives the rest of our players is huge. its why we need Dudley to be the scorer we brought him in for. his hot start yesterday just blew that game open for us

Voyeur

11/25/2013 - 10:58 AM PST

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It's weird that JJ Redick averages more rebounds than Dudley. But yeah, if he can hit those open shots it makes things easier for everybody.

pageC4

11/25/2013 - 11:01 AM PST

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really? damn, Dudley needs to get more boards

tense2

11/25/2013 - 12:38 PM PST

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It might be just a little of both so far this season. Dudley's comments from the LA times Clipper's win article:

Jared Dudley, who has been dealing with tendinitis in his right knee, had his best game of the season, scoring

a season-high 21 points on eight-for-10 shooting, including four for five from three-point range.

"We've been shooting the ball pretty well," Dudley said. "Me personally, the same shots I had [Sunday] I've had all season. I just feel more confident, getting into a little better groove."

People here don't seem to realize Dudley is a better shooter than Redick. He is actually better at shooting the 3 ball and is much better at mid-range.

seanrooks

11/25/2013 - 01:17 PM PST

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^There are a few different things that make a player a good "shooter." For example, Steve Novak is an incredible shooter, possibly the best standstill, spot-up shooter in the league(according to a bunch of players who have been on his team). But why isn't he as good as, say, Ray Allen, or Steph Curry or Redick? Because a big part of being a good shooter is not only if you can make a shot, but if you can take a shot. As in, getting open, and being able to get your shot off. Ray Allen may not necessarily be the best pure shooter ever(though he's in the conversation for sure). What puts him above the rest is his insane ability to get open off of screens, shoot on the move, shoot off the dribble(in his younger days) and his insanely quick and elevated release. these are all things Dudley doesn't have--he's slow, unathletic, and doesn't really shoot on the move(if it is on the move, it's moving slowly). What makes Redick better is that he can do all those things that Dudley can't. So maybe his percentages are lower(which is strange when you look at his career numbers) but Redick is the better "shooter," at least in my eyes. I think it's also evident in the fact that he's nearly doubling Dudley's scoring output on the season.

CP3Heliflopter

11/25/2013 - 01:34 PM PST

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Good point but Dudley is still easily the better mid range shooter by far(though Redick was great from mid range last season, Dudley has been great from 16-23 feet for many seasons). Redick is better at getting open and he shoots at a higher volume from 3 point range because of that. He is also much better at cutting.

Nearly doubling Dudley's scoring output doesn't mean much considering Dudley has been dealing with tendonitis all season. I see Dudley as a 11-13 ppg guy on this team. Redick is the more versatile offensively player so he will probably score around 15-16 ppg.

tense2

11/25/2013 - 01:50 PM PST

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Yup, Dudley is an above average shooter at his position in FG% and 3PT%.

tense2

11/25/2013 - 02:10 PM PST

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All that "running around, moving and getting open" may look good, but it doesn't matter if the ball ain't going in the hoop.

Redick is an average FG% shooter and an above average 3PT shooter for his position. Dudley is an above age shooter in both areas for his position.

Redick's doubling Dudley's scoring output is because:

Redick in 29.3 MPG has 12.1 FGA's per game to Dudley's 6.8 FGA's per game in 27.1 MPG.

All that running around/moving does help JJ get to the FT line more with 3.3 FTA's per game to Dudley's very very poor .08 FTA's per game.

My complained so far this season for Dudley is to friggin shoot more, but maybe his injury and lack of confidence has thrown a wrench into that....don't know.

clipperboy24

11/25/2013 - 02:20 PM PST

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If reddick only shot when he was wide open he would most likely have a higher fg% and 3pt%.

It's not an apples to apples comparison. Dudley is not very active on defense which forces other to create opportunities for him to be open. Just watch him play, he rarely cuts or moves which puts pressure on other players because Dudley's defender can cheat because he knows he will stay put. If Dudley was asked to shoot more often and move more often, I would bet money his % goes way down. It's a catch 22 and unfair comparison.

Voyeur

11/25/2013 - 02:31 PM PST

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It makes sense to me that the guy who's primarily a spot up shooter, taking shots when he's open, has a highter field goal % than the guy who's constantly moving without the ball and takes more shots in general.

Ideally, Redick's play applies a lot of pressure on the defense, while Dudley supplies the daggers.

jarca

11/25/2013 - 02:37 PM PST

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Dudley a better shooter than redick is like saying jordan is a better shooter than griffin. Money ball people would also have you believe that Dudley is better than afflalo and deng lol

tense2

11/25/2013 - 02:41 PM PST

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They've taken almost the same number shots in their career (Redick with +-81 more FGA's) so the shooting more isn't valid. The "moving" part is subjective, so we may never know "that". Not sure how you bet on that.

tense2

11/25/2013 - 02:55 PM PST

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Applying the Jaca logic again.

CP3Heliflopter

11/25/2013 - 04:29 PM PST

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But Michael Jordan is a better shooter than Griffin.

david

11/25/2013 - 04:35 PM PST

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Yep- Dudley pretty much never takes a shot unless he is wide open. You run hard at him, he is not going to shoot it. Not exactly sure who is the better shooter, but if they were in a contest, I'd think most likely Redick will win.

Thus far this season, however, Jamal Crawford is leading with 41% from deep, and he is certainly not a guy who is afraid to chuck it up with a hand in his face. So I'd venture to say that Jamal is a better shooter than Dudley as well.

jarca

11/25/2013 - 04:37 PM PST

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Your way of thinking is obsolete. Apparently you don't have to watch the game. You can just analyze stats

CP3Heliflopter

11/25/2013 - 04:43 PM PST

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I think Dudley is the better shooter when open but guys like Crawford and Redick are better at shooting more contested shots.

tense2

11/25/2013 - 04:48 PM PST

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You're free to "think" anything you want if it suits or makes you more comfortable in what you "believe" in.

david

11/25/2013 - 05:05 PM PST

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It's certainly possible that Dudley is better at shooting open shots. I wonder if there there is a stat on open jumper %. With Dudley, since that's pretty much all he shoots, I think his 3 point % is likely very close to his true open 3 pt %. Running off of screens and then shooting a 3 on the move certainly would drop one's %, so I think that's the main reason why Redick's % is lower.

But I'd like to see them in some sort of a 3 point shooting contest and we can get a better feel of who is the better open 3 point shooter. That is of course unless there is indeed a stat on open 3 pt shooting % & then a direct comparison can be made.

There is no denying that both are very good shooters. I think that a player who can do more than just shoot open 3's within the offense is more valuable come playoff time, however. That's when defenses are extra vigilant, & open 3's are tougher to come by.

Voyeur

11/25/2013 - 06:29 PM PST

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I think having both healthy is the best of both worlds. However Jared could stand to grab some rebounds.

Agent0

11/25/2013 - 08:32 PM PST

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Dudley is also quite good at the one dribble pull-up from mid-range. Remember that in comparison to Redick, Dudley is a taller player, so he has some advantages in getting shots up. He probably isn't a better in the gym by themselves shooter, but what is more important is who can get off shots are a better rate in games. Dudley has an argument there, and height / length does play into that.

The real question is when did anyone say Dudley was "better" than Afflalo and Deng? He was certainly better value since he makes $4.3M and those guys make $7.6 and $14.3M respectively. Afflalo now of course is better value if he maintains 22/5/5/.620 TS%, but he's also shooting 50% from 3PT, so that won't stay.

In previous seasons though Afflalo was a guy who was at best posting a scoring rate of about 1-2 more pts/36 above Dudley, nothing to get excited about. He was a 16/3/3 player compared to a 15/5/2 player, nothing to get excited about for $3M more.

Jared averages 5 rebs/36 for his career and is at 2 rebs/36 this season, so I have no clue what is up with that. He's doing less than half his career REB% this season

CP3Heliflopter

11/25/2013 - 08:43 PM PST

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^Exactly. The main advantage Dudley has over those players is that he has a great contract while you can argue those two players are overpaid.

Agent0

11/25/2013 - 09:21 PM PST

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Yea, I don't think anyone is saying they wouldn't easily take a guy like Deng at the MLE or Afflalo at $4M. Please, of course, easy peasy.

Most people forget or don't realize that that is one of the most important "stats"....$. Bang for the buck.

clipperboy24

11/25/2013 - 10:00 PM PST

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Jared Dudley has 2,000 more career minutes. Don't think FG attempts is the correct bench mark.

tense2

11/25/2013 - 10:01 PM PST

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He's hurting...didn't know that.

Movement laterally is a problem for someone trying to play defense.....hmmm, maybe thats why he looks slow to some people.

tense2

11/25/2013 - 10:07 PM PST

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I guess...for some.

clipperboy24

11/25/2013 - 10:20 PM PST

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That's nearly a seasons worth of minutes. Which would be 500+ more FG attempts for Redick. If you try to act like that is statistically insignificant you need to reevaluate your selective use of statistics.

tense2

11/25/2013 - 10:37 PM PST

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Maybe he shoots better, maybe he doesn't. He's got a big enough sample size/history to make an educated guess which direction he'd go in. Depends on your mind set I guess.