Hit a wall... (Read 1279 times)

Hey folks, so I finished the C25K program a few weeks ago. And I've been holding steady at 30 minutes since then (with a little week off for cold issues). However, I'm finding that I've hit a wall. 30 minutes is still EXTREMELY tough for me to accomplish. Is this normal? Is there a way I can better condition myself so I can actually increase my time at some point?
Help?
Kimmer

Hey, Kim.
From what I can see here in NC, my best guess would be that your wall is probably mental instead of physical. You may need to "trick" yourself into getting past that barrier. Are you running outside? Try picking a distance you know you can do in 30 minutes and then slow your pace down. You'll be covering the same distance, but it'll take longer.
It's a little tougher if you're doing it all on the treadmill because, well, there's this little dial in front of you... If you must do it inside, try splitting your workout in two pieces. Maybe you coudl try something similar to the C25K program... like jog for 15 minutes, walk for 5 minutes, jog for 15 minutes. And then slowly increase the total jog time up to the amount you want to do. Once you get there, you can start decreasing the walk break.
Good luck!

I am running outside - and your advice is good. It would be hard for me to slow my pace down, I'm already barely running as it is (12:50/mile). I think I'll try doing to 15/5/15. That might work. And then I can cut the walking out to get to 35 minutes (which will hopefully be close to 3 miles so I can do a stupid 5K!).
Thanks Wingz!
Kimmer

You also don't always have to be increasing your training to be getting fitter. You will, and should, hit plateaus in your training where you sort of keep the mileage and time your spending about the same for weeks or months at a time while your body adjusts to the new workload. Then when that starts to feel easy you can increase the workload.

You also don't always have to be increasing your training to be getting fitter. You will, and should, hit plateaus in your training where you sort of keep the mileage and time your spending about the same for weeks or months at a time while your body adjusts to the new workload. Then when that starts to feel easy you can increase the workload.

I agree with mike. Sometimes, you get to a point where you're not seeing any real changes. The other thought is that maybe you can work on other things, too. Perhaps you could do some drills for form. If you're mixing running and walking, work on shortening your walks or lengthening the run segments. Those may also help you push past the 30 minute barrier.
Unfortunately, I'm not a time person, I'm a distance / pace person, so I can't speak too much in terms of the program, or the 30 minute thing specifically.

http://www.amazon.com/Galloways-Book-Running-2-Ed/dp/0936070277
Get the book. Read the user reviews. Follow his advice. He is perfect for where you're at.
If you follow his program, I *guarantee* you will be capable of a sub-1:00 10-k by Memorial Day. That's sub-10:00 miles for an hour. And able to finish a half marathon, if you want. Guaranteed. Probably sooner. And you'll have more fun, and do it more easily, and you'll be laughing at your current 30 minute barrier.
http://www.amazon.com/Galloways-Book-Running-2-Ed/dp/0936070277
I really need to start getting a commission for pushing Galloway. Think I'll drop him an e-mail ...

Kim... You're funny! A 12:50 mile is *fast* to me. Sure, it's slow to much of the rest of the running community... but it's faster than my 10K PR!
When I ran my first HM last weekend, I finished 639 out of 643. That says to me that 1) I'm not the absolute slowest person in the world, 2) you don't have to be fast to finish, and 3) there's room in the running world for people of all speeds.
I think you should ignore GorillaMan's "guarantee" because he's in no position to back it up. And everybody's response is different to different techniques. But there's something to be said for the Galloway method, that's for sure.
If this is a plateau, you'll get past it eventually. Be patient.
And if what you're doing is "EXTREMELY tough" then why do you need to do more, anyway? Running should be pleasure, not punishment.
There's some more $.02 for ya!

I think you should ignore GorillaMan's "guarantee" because he's in no position to back it up.

'Course I am, girly. Wanna bet on it? How about a lifetime of free entry into the virtual races? Plus, when she proves me right, you have to write 500 words about how great I am. Well, big-talker? Friendly wager?
(which reminds me ... does Zoom owe me a case of beer yet? You out there, Zoomy? Don't think i've forgotten! And I *know* your last ten miler was like 1:47. Should have my beer by X-mas!)

'Course I am, girly. Wanna bet on it? How about a lifetime of free entry into the virtual races? Plus, when she proves me right, you have to write 500 words about how great I am. Well, big-talker? Friendly wager?

I would never bet against another runner being able to accomplish a goal. I *want* her to succeed, and that goal's probably possible. I just think you overstate your case. You gonna guarantee that *I* can run a sub 1:00 10K by Memorial day? Now that's a wager I'd take.

I am desperately biting back a really funny joke right now. But since I prefer my face to stay pretty ... I'll just say CONGRATS on the half-marathon! Did you post this somewhere and I missed it?

Wise choice. I didn't post the placement before because it wasn't that important to me. I finished in 2:59:34, chip time, which is a 13:48 pace average. And I am thrilled with that time, BTW. And yes, I posted it over in the HM Trainer's group.

Your silence is deafening.
FWIW, Jake, I think you should start a Galloway group under "training groups."

No silence. No deafening. Just lost the thread in the shuffle. But since you popped it up here again ...
... okay, I reviewed your shiny colored training log, and yep - I'll make that bet. With a couple conditions:
1) You keep doing what you're doing. Training 4-5 days a week. No slacking. That's cheating.
2) Get your weekly long run up to 12 miles and keep it there.
3) Start doing speed work once a week. 400 meter or 800 meter intervals. If you don't have a track, estimate the distance and do them on the street. Start with maybe 4 x 400, walk/jog a lap, and repeat. Work up to 12x400 or 6x800 by April. Work up to running the 400s in 2:00-2:15, the 800s in 4:15-4:45. Gotta do some speed work to get faster.
4) Get plenty of recovery time. Rest every other day, or at least do a very gentle short run.
Do all that, and yep, by Memorial day you'll be able to string 6 10:00 miles together in a row. But to be fair to little old me, let's modify it a bit ... let's say you have to be *close* to 1:00 for me to win. So say under 1:05?
This is a sucker's bet. I already win. Ha.
As for Galloway, go read his book. And there's no need to start a training group. Cuz nobody ever uses those things (with the virtual race one being one of a couple exceptions). And Galloway already has a training program in a couple hundred cities anyway. Probably including yours. Go find it, and do what they tell you.
And don't forget --- when I win, you get to write a looooooooong essay about how wonderful I am. I look forward to printing and framing it. Make sure to use lots of nice adjectives, like "manly" and "insanely handsome."

No silence. No deafening. Just lost the thread in the shuffle. But since you popped it up here again ...
... okay, I reviewed your shiny colored training log, and yep - I'll make that bet. With a couple conditions:
1) You keep doing what you're doing. Training 4-5 days a week. No slacking. That's cheating.

Agreed. As long as cross-training counts as training if I feel the need to switch it up or just to keep healthy/semi-sane.

2) Get your weekly long run up to 12 miles and keep it there.

My long runs will be as long as needed and what my body can handle. 12's a fine number and I'll probably be somewhere around there, but I won't agree on a specific distance. I'm currently building back up for my 14 mile trail run Dec 2, so they should be in that range by the end of Nov. My plan is to keep my overall milage between 25-30/wk, with a long run between 10 and 15. That work for ya?

3) Start doing speed work once a week. 400 meter or 800 meter intervals. If you don't have a track, estimate the distance and do them on the street. Start with maybe 4 x 400, walk/jog a lap, and repeat. Work up to 12x400 or 6x800 by April. Work up to running the 400s in 2:00-2:15, the 800s in 4:15-4:45. Gotta do some speed work to get faster.

Realizing this gem of advice ("Gotta do some speed work to get faster") I'm already a step ahead of you and have some already planned out. But no, I'm not setting foot on a track. Got track-o-phobia. I'm up for tempo runs, fartleks, and intervals on a TM at this point. Once a week. No oftener. I'll be using the Runner's World's "Smartcoach" program for a guide, if that's okay with you. Since I'm training for distances, (I plugged in HM) it suggested some 1600 repeats. My handy-dandy-calculator told me that was about a mile. I can deal with that.

4) Get plenty of recovery time. Rest every other day, or at least do a very gentle short run.

Can't both rest every other day and train 4-5 days per week. Temporally impossible. Either I'm keeping on doing what I'm doing or I'm not. Can't have it both ways. I'll keep it down to 4-5 running days/wk, though, and make anything else something joint-easy like swimming or elliptical trainer. How's that?

Do all that, and yep, by Memorial day you'll be able to string 6 10:00 miles together in a row. But to be fair to little old me, let's modify it a bit ... let's say you have to be *close* to 1:00 for me to win. So say under 1:05?

Nope. 1:00.00 or less, chip-time. But I won't cheat and not try to make the goal time in the race. This is a bet I'd like to lose.

This is a sucker's bet. I already win. Ha.
As for Galloway, go read his book. And there's no need to start a training group. Cuz nobody ever uses those things (with the virtual race one being one of a couple exceptions). And Galloway already has a training program in a couple hundred cities anyway. Probably including yours. Go find it, and do what they tell you.

Well, since we've already outlined what the program's going to be, I don't see the point in that. Besides. I have a really scary school and work schedule that precludes most group committments...

And don't forget --- when I win, you get to write a looooooooong essay about how wonderful I am. I look forward to printing and framing it. Make sure to use lots of nice adjectives, like "manly" and "insanely handsome."

Sure. I'd be happy to. And if I win? I want flowers. Lots of them. And you have to tell your fiance why, of course.
I'll keep my log public/up-to-date so you can check up on me from time to time.
Note to Kimmer: my apologies for hijacking your thread. I'd like to hear how your experiment for making the runs longer went.

Wingz:
I hereby and forthwith and henceforth and lots of other impressive sounding non-words agree to the terms of your wager, with only one change: the 1600 intervals. That's fine (in fact ideal) for a marathon, but it's too long and too slow for a 10-k.
But I'll compromise. Because that's the kinda guy I am. You have to do 400s now (not 800s) every other week. At 2:00-2:15 pace. And not on a treadmill. Do it between mailboxes if you're scared of the mean ol' track. You ALSO have to run at least 3 5-ks between now and Memorial Day.
You can do your 1600s on the other weeks. This condition is non-negotiable, sadly; we gotta get those legs moving faster once in a while.
I'd ask what kind of flowers, but since it'll be unnecessary, why bother? Remember: I like adjectives. "Studly" is good. "Herculean" would be nice, too. I expect the first draft by June 3rd.
And yes - further discussions of your impending essay-writing should be on another thread. Feel free to start one, so that I can use it for pointing and mocking purposes.

I like your chances of winning this bet, Jake, but I wonder why you have such a bug up your but for the 400s and 800s since, a.) 1600s are a much more valuable workout for races in the one-hour range and, b.) for someone looking to lop such large chunks of time off training needs to be a blunt instrument, not a laser-guided surgical strike. So 800s/400s vs 1600s is really splitting hairs. And where in the hell did you get 2:00 or 2:15 pace? You mean per 400 I assume, as in 8:00-9:00 mile pace. In other words a good 4:00 per mile faster than any mile I can see in Janell's log and a good 2:00 per mile faster than her goal 10k pace. In other words WAY too frickin fast.
This is your bet and between you and Janell but since the conversation is happening in public I figured I'd ask.

I propose we move this to a new group: Jake's Wagers. That way, since he likes to make wagers, we can keep them all in the same place.
Jake, your mandatory times for the short intervals are faster than I am capable of at the moment, so that is not a fair condition. I will plug my recent race times into the McMillan calculator and give you a better interval range for me. I'll post it over on Jake's Wagers.
Three 5K's on top of my current racing commitments is a little tough, but probably doable. I've got a 10K in a week and a half, and then the trail run Dec. 2. I'm not comfortable squeezing any other races in between now and then, but I'll see what I can do starting with the new-year's race cluster. When's Memorial day? March or May? I get them confused... I'm thinking May. If so, then no problem. If March, I may not be able to meet that.
To be continued over in Jake's Wagers (social groups category)...