With China propping up regimes and trying to turn the South China sea into its personal lake, the need for a counterbalance in Asia is greater than eve. The only problem is finding who.

Russia, the US, and Japan (especially Japan) all have a history of being no better than China and ASEAN is just an economic union with members already in China's pocket. That leaves India as the only hope against Chinese domination.

However, while India does look like the best candidate for a counterbalance, they have several issues to resolve before being able to take on China. The biggest ones being rampant poverty and lagging in technology.

What does India have to do, can it be done, how likely is it, and after all those are checked, how would their overturning of China's tyranny play out?

Apparently having a bad history bars countries from acting as a counterbalance to another country?

"Corrupted by wealth and power, your government is like a restaurant with only one dish. They've got a set of Republican waiters on one side and a set of Democratic waiters on the other side. But no matter which set of waiters brings you the dish, the legislative grub is all prepared in the same Wall Street kitchen."-Huey Long

Community Values wrote:Apparently having a bad history bars countries from acting as a counterbalance to another country?

What are you saying? The comment is too vague for me to reply

Why can't the US and Japan be a counterbalance to China in Asia?OP seems to think its because of "history of being no better than China"

"Corrupted by wealth and power, your government is like a restaurant with only one dish. They've got a set of Republican waiters on one side and a set of Democratic waiters on the other side. But no matter which set of waiters brings you the dish, the legislative grub is all prepared in the same Wall Street kitchen."-Huey Long

Tokora wrote:With China propping up regimes and trying to turn the South China sea into its personal lake, the need for a counterbalance in Asia is greater than eve. The only problem is finding who.

Russia, the US, and Japan (especially Japan) all have a history of being no better than China and ASEAN is just an economic union with members already in China's pocket. That leaves India as the only hope against Chinese domination.

However, while India does look like the best candidate for a counterbalance, they have several issues to resolve before being able to take on China. The biggest ones being rampant poverty and lagging in technology.

What does India have to do, can it be done, how likely is it, and after all those are checked, how would their overturning of China's tyranny play out?

Yah, India is hardly innocent either. And if they become a superpower expect the shitty crap that superpowers do to happen.

Gun control, Monarchy, Authoritarianism and Totalitarianism in general, NSA, Fundies, Tankies and Nazis (they're both equally bad), Repubs and Dems, the Establishment, Racists, The KKK (May they all burn in hell)

Don't tread on me libertarianUnapologetic Jon Snow supporter."Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - -George Orwell

Tokora wrote:With China propping up regimes and trying to turn the South China sea into its personal lake, the need for a counterbalance in Asia is greater than eve. The only problem is finding who.

Russia, the US, and Japan (especially Japan) all have a history of being no better than China and ASEAN is just an economic union with members already in China's pocket. That leaves India as the only hope against Chinese domination.

However, while India does look like the best candidate for a counterbalance, they have several issues to resolve before being able to take on China. The biggest ones being rampant poverty and lagging in technology.

What does India have to do, can it be done, how likely is it, and after all those are checked, how would their overturning of China's tyranny play out?

Yah, India is hardly innocent either. And if they become a superpower expect the shitty crap that superpowers do to happen.

Tokora wrote:With China propping up regimes and trying to turn the South China sea into its personal lake, the need for a counterbalance in Asia is greater than eve. The only problem is finding who.

Alright, an opinion I could get behind...

Tokora wrote:Russia, the US, and Japan (especially Japan) all have a history of being no better than China

Unless said state is San Marino or Andorra, I doubt you'll find many states which are "better", whatever normative parameters you are using for such a blanket statement.

Tokora wrote:ASEAN is just an economic union with members already in China's pocket.

[citation needed], like how the European Union is in Germany's and Führer und Reichskanzler Merkel's pocket.

Tokora wrote:That leaves India as the only hope against Chinese domination.

Fair enough, if supported adequately.

Tokora wrote:However, while India does look like the best candidate for a counterbalance, they have several issues to resolve before being able to take on China. The biggest ones being rampant poverty and lagging in technology.

Again, fair enough.

Tokora wrote:What does India have to do, can it be done, how likely is it, and after all those are checked, how would their overturning of China's tyranny play out?

How likely? As likely as the United States falling from its position of superpower.

The Vistulangean Republic is an unitary parliamentary republic, with conservatism as the basis of its government. I aim to be as realistic as possible with it, using only factbooks and not referencing NS stats. Any and all feedback regarding inconsistencies, improvements and oddities is appreciated.

I actually hate anime. I am an anti-anime crusader."A life lived for yourself is a life worthwhile." -Everybody Sayori best girl

The Transhuman News - President Evelina signs a bill that will increase Transhuman military funding by 60% in the next year - Civil conflicts in Pakistan, two Transhuman divisions deployed to Lahore - General anti-government unrest in AP China

Vistulange wrote:How likely? As likely as the United States falling from its position of superpower.

So, pretty likely?

I would say no, not very likely, but to accurately analyse that "possibility", we would first need to answer some very fundamental questions, such as "what defines a superpower?", and maybe even "what is power?". Power can be, of course, construed as "capability of men to dominate other men", but this itself is a highly broad definition. For example, would American cultural influence over the world in the form of Hollywood and American films be considered power? Or is power solely measured through military means? The latter, truthfully, is mostly a relic of the Cold War, but still has defenders.

Therefore, I would argue - but not insist - that no, the United States is not losing its position as a superpower anytime soon, and almost certainly not in our lifetimes. What is happening is that China and arguably Russia are catching up (but I wouldn't hold my breath on Russia), as opposed to the United States losing power. Of course, it can be argued that a decrease in the relative power levels is losing power, but as the filthy constructivist I am, I am not the person to argue that.

Perhaps the world will become multipolar, as it used to be in the 19th and early 20th centuries. I seriously doubt it will remain unipolar, and already, the unipolarity of the system is shaking seriously, and some would even consider it toppled. The distinction is important, however, because there will not be an unipolar world: China will not replace the United States as the global superpower, but instead be a superpower itself, alongside the US.

I'm intentionally refraining from making predictions: One, I have neither the time nor resources to research for this topic; two, international relations scholars, academics and so on are notoriously bad at predicting the future. Might as well not do that.

The Vistulangean Republic is an unitary parliamentary republic, with conservatism as the basis of its government. I aim to be as realistic as possible with it, using only factbooks and not referencing NS stats. Any and all feedback regarding inconsistencies, improvements and oddities is appreciated.

I'd say the issue is more that India has no strategic interests beyond defense of its borders, and arguably securing petroleum, something the US is currently doing on their behalf. As a consequence they have no interest in power projection or a large navy and army.

Imperializt Russia wrote:Let us briefly contend that there is a pro-women bias in discussion of social issues

Begging the question. Modern culture is virulently anti-woman in that most women want a stable marriage and children, something that feminism denies them. Ostroeuropa is anti-woman because he is a radical feminist.

Ostroeuropa wrote:I'd say the issue is more that India has no strategic interests beyond defense of its borders, and arguably securing petroleum, something the US is currently doing on their behalf. As a consequence they have no interest in power projection or a large navy and army.

Rupudska wrote:Not really. China actually can't do much against India would it ever come to wars due to geographic regions.The problem is that India is such an incredible mess that it'd probably lose anyway.

That's exactly what I meant.

Teach us Mandarin, Risottia-sensei.

The Vistulangean Republic is an unitary parliamentary republic, with conservatism as the basis of its government. I aim to be as realistic as possible with it, using only factbooks and not referencing NS stats. Any and all feedback regarding inconsistencies, improvements and oddities is appreciated.

Ostroeuropa wrote:I'd say the issue is more that India has no strategic interests beyond defense of its borders, and arguably securing petroleum, something the US is currently doing on their behalf. As a consequence they have no interest in power projection or a large navy and army.

*Pakistan looms ominously*

Doesn't require the capacity for power projection, and can't fight its way out of a paper bag. Only its nuclear capacity keeps it a threat, and that is countered by Indias own.

India won't be a Superpower because it has no need for power projection capabilities. As a consequence it won't develop them, and as a consequence of that, most countries don't need to wonder about what India thinks while conducting their foreign policy with other nations, military policies, etc.

Economically it might eventually have extremely substantial clout, but that'd make it more akin to Germany or Japan, not a Superpower akin to the US, Soviets, or UK at its height.

Last edited by Ostroeuropa on Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Imperializt Russia wrote:Let us briefly contend that there is a pro-women bias in discussion of social issues

Begging the question. Modern culture is virulently anti-woman in that most women want a stable marriage and children, something that feminism denies them. Ostroeuropa is anti-woman because he is a radical feminist.

Unlikely to occur until they resolve their pretty substantial internal political problems. The administrative sub-structure of India is a complete and utter mess, so before the status of international superpower is even a viable option for India they'd need to get their various states and territories in line.

The other major problem would be China, which absolutely does not want India to get its shit together, since that would pose a major threat to their own ambitions abroad. To that end, they'll already buddied up with Pakistan, and are in the process of developing considerable ties in Southeast Asia. So India would also need to contend with the ambitions of the Chinese Dragon in its own backyard before pursuing grander designs further abroad.