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No, buying more than 1 copy of the base set seems to be a bit of a waste, as rule 2 of the tournament rules indicates that no detachment can include more copies of the same card in that colour than come in the base set.

Close, but not quite. The rule actually says no detachment can include more copies of the same card in that colour than come in the expansion its printed in.

So if orange detachment has 3 of warjack A printed in the base set, and then an expansion has one of warjack A printed in the orange detachment, you will be able to customize your orange detachment to have 4 of warjack A - three from the base set and one form the expansion.

This does not allow you to override the maximum of five of any one titled card though. So, if the expansion had 3 warjack A AND the base set had three warjack A, you'd still be limited to five (3 and 2 or 2 and 3).

The options for expanding and modifying detachments make this very intriguing to me. Also note, that there is nothing in the rules (or otherwise) to indicate that a warjack printed in an expansion (even the same titel) will have the same stats/ abilities as the one in the base set.

Originally Posted by FearLord

Basically, by the tournament rules, no one can customize their deck at all until an expansion is released...

Aside from determining what three detachments to use together, and which three of the five warcasters to use this is correct.

I like the look of this game. I think PP did a good job capturing the feel of the Warmachine tabletop game for High Command. Warcasters on the tabletop control a battlegroup, cast spells, and use a single feat; warcasters in the card game grant a battlegroup bonus, have a spell-like ability, and enter combat once before they're removed from play. Stealth's implementation makes sense for the card game—units with Stealth are harder to destroy. Long Gunners are assumed to be firing from the back lines. Locations are scenarios, after a fashion. The selection of warcasters and attachments is similar to army construction. Etc. And the card game plays to Warmachine's fluff rather than its rules; assassination is simply not an option. The warcasters drive the action, and they're major players. I like that.

Overall, I'm excited to get my hands on this game and share it with the geeks in the office. It should make a great lunch-time diversion when we're not playing Guillotine. My only complaints about what I've seen so far after reading the rule book:

1. Like FearLord, I'm not certain whether cards in your hand are supposed to count at the end of the game. I don't think they do, though. But 1:00 a.m. is approaching, so I no longer trust my eyes.

2. "Capture Example 1" on page 8 fails to mention that Will gets to move his Charger to his discard pile, courtesy of Fort Falk's "When you capture this location" rule! That Charger, by the rules, cannot go back to the discard pile. ("If a player captures a location with a 'When you capture this location' rule, he must follow that rule before adding the location card to his discard pile.")

On #2 - normally they go to Occupying Forces. So first you check for When you capture this location rule - resolve that (discarding the Charger) then discard Fort Falk to discard pile, then rest of the cards go to Occupying Forces. At least as far as I understand it.

Originally Posted by Devilsquid

I also employ a "Darkwing Duck" philosophy, when the game starts going against me...it's time to get Dangerous...

Originally Posted by Impostor

And then, Grim Angus said "Trollbloods shall be the one true people entitled to Tough."

1) I started a thread specifically about this question and Will confirmed that cards in hand are still part of your army deck, so they do count for scoring. The only slight issue here is what happens when you end the game by running out of locations - its only the Day of Reckoning card that tells you to destroy units, so its seems these might be stranded in play of the game ends this way. I suspect this won't actually happen in practice very much at all though, and 99% of games will end by the day of reckoning card coming out. Until I hear otherwise, I'll just destroy them anyway I think...

2) As Fort Faulk's rule says "can" it should be optional - you just have to choose whether you're using it before moving on to the next step.

3) What is the specific issue with the end of page 11? If its to do with the detachment customisation rules, keep in mind that the tournament rules are slightly different.

Thanks for the information about the scoring rules. I saw the thread earlier this morning. I hope we get clarification on what happens when you run out of locations. I suspect the video is correct.

Regarding the Fort Falk card, you're right: it says "can" rather than "must." I was thrown off by the late hour and the "must follow that rule" clause. I think PP missed a great opportunity to explain two rules with one example, though.

Ah! A little typo - that is a little unfortunate, but not huge problem in my eyes especially compared to the fact the rules list the "running out of locations ends the game" in two different ways... I'm hoping the reason no one noticed this is it literally never happens in play, and they've only included the rule in case a weird set of players just refuse to engage each other at all and all work on a single location each, all of them scoring one every round...

So its more of a "in the unlikely event that you run out of locations, x happens" than a real rule... I've never played it, but I really can't see how anyone could cycle through them quick enough on paper... maximum number of full turns is 14, can't effectively get any cards to a location until the 3rd turn at the earliest, which means turn 4 is the first turn you can actually capture stuff... 11 rounds to capture 15 objectives with players obviously working to prevent each other doing it...

1) The game ends fast. You don't have a lot of time with a functioning economic before the game ends. Will have to play more to get a better feel - most likely just because it is a fun game

2) VP in the deck can be worth more than locations. Khador has a detachment with 20 VP in it alone - in the other end cryx has one with only 2. There is most likely a good reason for this, and all our games have been very close. I imagine that detachments with few VP are better at taking and holding locations due to being easy to deploy

Still an AMAZINGLY funny game though!!!

Last edited by strangedane; 08-12-2013 at 10:23 AM.
Reason: Clearing it up

1) The game ends too fast. You don't have a lot of time with a functioning economic before the game ends. 2 friends and I tried playing where we only turned a new winds of war card every second time, was more fun!

2) VP in the deck are worth SOOO much more than locations. Khador has a detachment with 20 VP in it alone - in the other end cryx has one with only 2.
In our last 3-man game, the winner decided to let the other 2 players waste all their resources on taking locations, while she just purchased her entire reinforcement deck into her armydeck. When the game ended, she had one location (4VP) and I had 3 (worth 18VP) and she won by 4 still. Unless we have misunderstood something about the armies (which is possible with only 3 games so far), it seems a bit unfair that one army contains 45VP in their detachments, when another has 63 if memory serves.

Still an amazingly funny game though!!!

Your 1) is something I've been worrying about a little - the game does seem a little short in terms of turns... Guess I need to try it out a bit first though.

2) is interesting - I'll need to see the cards though before I can make any judgements...

Extending the rounds worked great I think, if you find the original game to be slow then give it a try. Another thing we considered were saying the game only ended when all locations were taken (this would also help with the thing I mentioned in point 2). When the Hordes edition comes out, we will try taking all the winds of magic and mix them together@ Fearlord:

Extending the rounds worked great I think, if you find the original game to be slow then give it a try. Another thing we considered were saying the game only ended when all locations were taken (this would also help with the thing I mentioned in point 2). When the Hordes edition comes out, we will try taking all the winds of magic and mix them together.

Of couse people should try out the original rules first, we only extended the game because we really enjoyed it and wanted to see what would happen if we made it last longer.

One thing I cannot find, is this a game where everyone needs to bring his own deck or is it more like Dominion where we just get together and use the main set and expansions collectively?

As I understand it, you can choose to play it collectively by simply using the decks in the main set and just distributing these among the players present, but you can also choose to have players bring their own decks that they've built from home. The second possibility is apparently only theoretical at the moment, since people are saying that it isn't possible to customise the decks using just the cards in the main set, so it's only when expansions come out that deck customisation becomes possible (and only with customisation are players able to create their own decks from home).

But I suppose that once expansions do come out, then if you want to use them, it must be understood to be a "customise your own decks" kind of scenario. If customised decks are built in advance, then you can't really include extra cards for customisation in a collective use game. Unless you make a separate "everyone customises their deck" phase before starting the game, I suppose.

One thing I cannot find, is this a game where everyone needs to bring his own deck or is it more like Dominion where we just get together and use the main set and expansions collectively?

JN

Well, everyone's deck is separate, but The base set has all 4 main factions, and apparently expansions will similarly contain things for those four factions, so one person with the game will have everything you need to play with friends. However, at tournaments and the like, you'd be expected to bring your own single deck, and we have yet to see how Mercs and Retribution might be added on.

Looking for a game in Brisbane, Australia? Come along to Pubhammer! The friendly club in a Pub! We meet every Sunday night from 6ish at The Junction, Annerley (opposite Ace Comics and Games). Feel free to PM me or look us up on Facebook (Pubhammer group page) for more details.

So it is not what I'm looking for then... I guess that means I'll put my money on the board game instead..

Possibly, but I'm just wondering what you were looking for there? Not taking the mickey, just honestly wondering how dominion works differently in terms of turning up with cards - the only difference I could see is that someone without cards could turn up to Dominion tournament and just use others card sets (because players in a game all use the same cards).

/That said, Omega Protocol looks pretty sweet anyway

Last edited by maddermax; 08-11-2013 at 05:41 PM.

Looking for a game in Brisbane, Australia? Come along to Pubhammer! The friendly club in a Pub! We meet every Sunday night from 6ish at The Junction, Annerley (opposite Ace Comics and Games). Feel free to PM me or look us up on Facebook (Pubhammer group page) for more details.

So it is not what I'm looking for then... I guess that means I'll put my money on the board game instead..

To clarify what was said in a couple of the posts above, the game is a lot like Dominion in the ways I think you were asking. You will be able to simply have one copy of the game (and any add-ons/expansions) and be able to play with your friends. According to everything shown, it has enough cards to offer some pre-game options for deck-building within each faction (IE which warcasters/warlocks and in turn detatchment groups you select), and then can play right out of the box with 4 players. Your friends/family don't need to "bring their own deck" to play.

In the future, as more expansions are released, or even let's just say the Hordes release happens, and you want to play Circle with your friends who only have the original WM release- you could just bring your Circle cards/deck and be able to join them, but it wouldn't be a necessity; you could still play with their copies of the WM factions. The only time all players may be required to have their own cards/deck is the aforementioned example of a tournament, but that's likely going to be up to the event organizer, depending if they have copies of the game to use, etc.

Well taking tournament out of the equation, Dominion only requires one person to have the base game and the expansions while high command requires everyone to invest like any regular CCG or LCG. Both are still deck building games however. I was mainly looking for a game that can be brought to board games night and not something that needs everyone to custom build their deck. I already have A game of Thrones for that and don't wish to invest in another card game. Like I said, Omega Protocol will fill that need instead

Well taking tournament out of the equation, Dominion only requires one person to have the base game and the expansions while high command requires everyone to invest like any regular CCG or LCG. Both are still deck building games however. I was mainly looking for a game that can be brought to board games night and not something that needs everyone to custom build their deck. I already have A game of Thrones for that and don't wish to invest in another card game. Like I said, Omega Protocol will fill that need instead

JN

the game is exactly that, you do not build your deck unless you want to, and as of right now is not really possible since if you just buy 1 box there is nothing to customize, you "play as packaged"

But there will eventually be a possibility for people to custom build their deck instead so it is still a card game like Magic or the others. It is fine but I really wanted a card game with the board game feeling like Dominion is. But since PP is giving us a neat board game next month, I'm still ok...

Fair enough. Without the random distribution of a CCG (IE, booster packs) and in turn no rarity of cards, it will never really be on the same level as those games, and will always be closer to a board game, or Dominion, or an LCG at most. Your opponent may be able to put together his own ideal deck of casters/detatchments, but nothing would be stopping you from acquiring the same cards in the same way as your opponent; everyone is on the same playing field as far as card availability.

Yes like any LCG but like I said I own one of these already and it is enough for now. Playing more than one card game is too much for me since Warmahordes is already taking so much time of my not so much free time

Question for those who either have played the game or at least know the rules very well. When do you draw cards to your hand? It seems like a simple question but from what I gathered from the PDF rules and the video it looks like you draw cards to your hand at the end of the order step, is that correct? If so does that mean that when you draw cards to your hand that the order step is done and the battle step starts.

If that is correct then I guess what I am trying to work my head around is that the cards you draw will not be used for your current turn but instead would be used for your next turn.

Well taking tournament out of the equation, Dominion only requires one person to have the base game and the expansions while high command requires everyone to invest like any regular CCG or LCG. Both are still deck building games however. I was mainly looking for a game that can be brought to board games night and not something that needs everyone to custom build their deck. I already have A game of Thrones for that and don't wish to invest in another card game. Like I said, Omega Protocol will fill that need instead

JN

If you want High Command to be exactly like Dominion you can play it exactly like Dominion. One person brings the High Command box to the weekly board game night and everyone picks a faction, picks 3 warcasters and 3 detachments and goes. No extra cards or customization. Much like Dominion, you can also get expansions. Again, one person can buy the expansions and the format for the game can continue to be one person bringing the game to board game night, everyone picks a faction, 3 warcasters and 3 detachments and on you go.

The only difference is that you can choose to customize the detachments once the expansions come out - much like you can do a mix of Intrigue and Prosperity or Core set and Alchemy for Dominion - and that for tournament play you would be expected to bring your own 3 warcasters and detachments. I should note however, that people can easily split at least the faction deck parts of a High Command box pretty easily - how the Winds of War and Locations get split is a bit more difficult, though for local tourneys as long as you have one box per two people you are fine.

It is not a LCG or CCG like Magic - you do not buy booster packs, have to keep up with the joneses or continually tweak your deck. If you are looking for a game like Dominion, High Command can play out of the box and with expansions in exactly the same way.

@PG_Strangedane - That second bit is the first thing I have heard that concerns me. Would you say that luck played a factor in allowing the purchase strategy to work or does it seem like a pretty optimal strategy? That could kill it for competitive play pretty easily if such a non-interactive strategy is dominant and it seems like something that could easily be missed in playtesting. Having such a variance in VP for detachments is pretty surprising - I was wondering myself if location VPs were enough or if taking locations was easy enough to outweigh the VPs on cards. I suppose if cards with less or no VPs have stronger stats it could balance it somewhat but only if locations can be captured quickly enough to make a big impact.

Originally Posted by Devilsquid

I also employ a "Darkwing Duck" philosophy, when the game starts going against me...it's time to get Dangerous...

Originally Posted by Impostor

And then, Grim Angus said "Trollbloods shall be the one true people entitled to Tough."

If you want High Command to be exactly like Dominion you can play it exactly like Dominion. One person brings the High Command box to the weekly board game night and everyone picks a faction, picks 3 warcasters and 3 detachments and goes. No extra cards or customization. Much like Dominion, you can also get expansions. Again, one person can buy the expansions and the format for the game can continue to be one person bringing the game to board game night, everyone picks a faction, 3 warcasters and 3 detachments and on you go.

this i what i plan on doing, you can even pick the casters randomly if you want

Well taking tournament out of the equation, Dominion only requires one person to have the base game and the expansions while high command requires everyone to invest like any regular CCG or LCG. Both are still deck building games however. I was mainly looking for a game that can be brought to board games night and not something that needs everyone to custom build their deck.

What we are trying to say is that HC doesn't *require* anyone to invest like a regular LCG. If you want it to be a collective game like Dominion, all you have to do is choose to play it like a collective game, and have everyone who plays use the decks that come from the collective box. The personal collections aspect of the game is completely optional.

If you think that just the fact that there will be the *option* for people to have personal collections and personal decks makes you want to not play it like Dominion, then fair enough, I can understand that. But don't state that HC "requires" or "needs" personal decks when as far as we can tell, it really doesn't.

Question for those who either have played the game or at least know the rules very well. When do you draw cards to your hand? It seems like a simple question but from what I gathered from the PDF rules and the video it looks like you draw cards to your hand at the end of the order step, is that correct? If so does that mean that when you draw cards to your hand that the order step is done and the battle step starts.

If that is correct then I guess what I am trying to work my head around is that the cards you draw will not be used for your current turn but instead would be used for your next turn.

Sorry for any confusion just wanted to ask.

That's correct - you spend as many cards as you can in your order step. You can bank a single card, but you must discard the rest. Then your draw 6 more cards and move onto your battle phase. This is probably quite good for keeping the game flowing, as you've got a whole round to start planning purchases and rushes, etc - this will obviously depend on what your opponent(s) do, but will give you time to plan what you could do...

That's correct - you spend as many cards as you can in your order step. You can bank a single card, but you must discard the rest. Then your draw 6 more cards and move onto your battle phase. This is probably quite good for keeping the game flowing, as you've got a whole round to start planning purchases and rushes, etc - this will obviously depend on what your opponent(s) do, but will give you time to plan what you could do...

It's also important for the various "discard a card" effects that can happen during battle, such as "Knock Down". If you didn't draw cards before the battle, those abilities would be much reduced in effectiveness.

Looking for a game in Brisbane, Australia? Come along to Pubhammer! The friendly club in a Pub! We meet every Sunday night from 6ish at The Junction, Annerley (opposite Ace Comics and Games). Feel free to PM me or look us up on Facebook (Pubhammer group page) for more details.

@PG_Strangedane - That second bit is the first thing I have heard that concerns me. Would you say that luck played a factor in allowing the purchase strategy to work or does it seem like a pretty optimal strategy? That could kill it for competitive play pretty easily if such a non-interactive strategy is dominant and it seems like something that could easily be missed in playtesting. Having such a variance in VP for detachments is pretty surprising - I was wondering myself if location VPs were enough or if taking locations was easy enough to outweigh the VPs on cards. I suppose if cards with less or no VPs have stronger stats it could balance it somewhat but only if locations can be captured quickly enough to make a big impact.

Well, in a two player game at least, there should be no hope at all of such a strategy working (although a delaying strategy might, depending on the cards). I am assuming the Cryx detachment with 2VP's in it is the Orange one which has 5 Mechanithalls, 3 Necro Surgeons, 2 Slayers and 2 Necromancy, which also happens to have both very cheap costs and great internal synergy with itself... I think this is a detachment that may well have an easier time taking locations than some others, so this may well be a consideration when choosing your casters / detachments... I would be interested to see how many VP's each deck can produce at maximum though (i.e by selecting the 3 detachments that have the most) and how these compare to each other.

EDIT @Strangedane - did you play your 'longer' variant when you had your game where one player just concentrated on purchasing, because I could certainly see how that might effect things... In a normal game you wouldn't have the time to purchase enough of the Reinforcements deck to make sure you were getting the best VP's...

Yes it was in the longer game she did that. Me and my brother fought over locations, and she bought through her reinforcement deck. Of course she also fought for locations but not as much as we did.

Regarding the detachments: It is my hope (and belive, PP makes great games) they will have tested the game enough so that all armies are equal. I have a day off soon, then I will sit down and look through all armies and their detachments, see if the amount of VP/deck matches how easy it is to get them on the table.

If you want High Command to be exactly like Dominion you can play it exactly like Dominion. One person brings the High Command box to the weekly board game night and everyone picks a faction, picks 3 warcasters and 3 detachments and goes. No extra cards or customization. Much like Dominion, you can also get expansions. Again, one person can buy the expansions and the format for the game can continue to be one person bringing the game to board game night, everyone picks a faction, 3 warcasters and 3 detachments and on you go.

The only difference is that you can choose to customize the detachments once the expansions come out - much like you can do a mix of Intrigue and Prosperity or Core set and Alchemy for Dominion - and that for tournament play you would be expected to bring your own 3 warcasters and detachments. I should note however, that people can easily split at least the faction deck parts of a High Command box pretty easily - how the Winds of War and Locations get split is a bit more difficult, though for local tourneys as long as you have one box per two people you are fine.

It is not a LCG or CCG like Magic - you do not buy booster packs, have to keep up with the joneses or continually tweak your deck. If you are looking for a game like Dominion, High Command can play out of the box and with expansions in exactly the same way.

But people said that could customize your detachments and that expansions were expected every months...that's pretty much an LCG right there if that's right.

But people said that could customize your detachments and that expansions were expected every months...that's pretty much an LCG right there if that's right.

JN

Huh, sounds like another game I've heard of. It comes out with expansions, you can customize what sets you want. You might have heard of it. It's called Dominion.

The only difference is that you have the option of separately customizing the individual factions. Not the mandate. Not the requirement. Not the only way to play. It is perfectly playable exactly the way you play Dominion now. You can have one person buy the box, you can buy expansions as you wish or don't wish and include expansions as you wish or don't wish - exactly the same way Dominion works.

Originally Posted by Devilsquid

I also employ a "Darkwing Duck" philosophy, when the game starts going against me...it's time to get Dangerous...

Originally Posted by Impostor

And then, Grim Angus said "Trollbloods shall be the one true people entitled to Tough."

Huh, sounds like another game I've heard of. It comes out with expansions, you can customize what sets you want. You might have heard of it. It's called Dominion.

The only difference is that you have the option of separately customizing the individual factions. Not the mandate. Not the requirement. Not the only way to play. It is perfectly playable exactly the way you play Dominion now. You can have one person buy the box, you can buy expansions as you wish or don't wish and include expansions as you wish or don't wish - exactly the same way Dominion works.

Difference is that each player doesn't have to customize their personal deck beforehand when playing Dominion with expansions. As more and more expansions come out and there are many cards to choose from for one faction, it's going to be unrealistic to NOT have pre-set decks. It would just take too long to set up. And advantage will go to the players who have pre-set tweaked decks.

We have no idea at the moment how frequently expansions are expected, but I doubt there will be that many...In terms of keeping up with people, it's been implied that expansions will be for all factions at the same time. For tournaments, you are limited to no more of a certain card in a certain colour as come in that card's set, so no one can customise at present, because the main game is the only thing out, and it already has the max of each card in each colour. If you're planning to play in tournaments, it would probably be a good idea to keep up with expansions. If you're a group of 4 friends who want meet and play, share a copy of the game and any expansions you buy and you all get the benefit. If you don't fancy spending more money on it, you all continue to use the base game decks without issue. The only problem I could see for casual play is if one player buys a 4 deck expansion, but doesn't let the rest of the players use the new cards, which would be kind of a **** move if you're just playing for fun...For casual play, I plan to own everything and just let people I choose to play it with have a go with whatever they fancy...

It is not a LCG or CCG like Magic - you do not buy booster packs, have to keep up with the joneses or continually tweak your deck. If you are looking for a game like Dominion, High Command can play out of the box and with expansions in exactly the same way.

what? You absolutely do have to tweak your deck. Once you get an expansion, you will have more than twelve cards for any given detachment. As the detachment can only be twelve cards, you then have to choose which cards you include in your detachment in addiiton to deciding on the detachment colour.