.America, which has bullied the world throughout the Industrial Era is going to fool the world even in the last stages of human existence on earth.

America is only paying the interest on its debt [Actually it is struggling to even pay that].

It is mathematically impossible for America to pay off 16 Trillion Dollars of debt.

It would take America hundreds of thousands of years to pay off the debt, provided it takes no new debt and cuts down almost all of its expenditure.

People and countries are fools to believe that America is going to pay off its debt in future.

There is no future left for the human species.

Human future is not going to last more than a few years/ decades.

The planet is dying and gasping for last breath.

100 years of Industrial Activity has already decimated millions of other species.....Man is going to get decimated/ wiped out within the next few years.

More than 99% destruction of this planet has already happened.....Only the end of humans is yet to happen.

Most of the Biodiversity and Ecosystems have already been destroyed.

Species are not lost when they become extinct....Species are lost when they get decimated....Species were lost when their populations dropped from billions and millions before industrialization to thousands and hundreds after industrialization.

There are(were) millions of species in this world....Most of them have already been decimated because Industrial Activity has destroyed most of the forests....Millions of Plant and Animal species have been decimated by Mining Industry, Logging Industry, Construction Industry, Manufacturing Industry, Energy Generation Industry, Oil Drilling, Oil Refining, Transportation Industry, Millions of kilometers of Rail and Road Networks, Ports and Airports..

If we calculate the decline in populations of millions of species after industrialization the combined loss will come to more than 99%.

Millions of other species have been decimated.....Forests have been decimated.....Fish in the oceans have been decimated.....Trillions of Farm Animals have been butchered in Industrial Slaughter Houses.....Oceans have been made acidic and warmer......There are oxygen deprived dead zones in the oceans.....Rivers, Oceans, Land and Atmosphere have been poisoned by billions of tonnes of Solid, Liquid and Gaseous Industrial Waste......The entire planet is littered with billions of tonnes of Plastic Waste, Chemical waste, Metal Waste, Gaseous Waste, eWaste and Nuclear waste......Millions of animals, birds and fish have died from ingesting plastic.....Billions of acres of agricultural land has been poisoned by millions of tonnes of Insecticides, Pesticides and Fertilizers.... Billions of acres of Fertile Soil has been killed by Cement, Concrete and Asphalt.....Weather has become extreme, irregular and unpredictable.....Wind speed has reduced by 50% in the last 50 years.....Glaciers have melted, Arctic Ice has melted.....Thousands of tonnes of Nuclear Material and Waste will keep poisoning the planet with radioactivity for the next thousands of years.

Human future is not going to last more than a few years/ decades.

America is going to make an exit from this world, paying only the interest on the money it borrowed and never paying the principal amount.

The important issue here is not money......money is paper and plastic.....The important issue is the huge amount of environment that was destroyed by America with its consumerism that was sustained by borrowed money......Huge amounts of environment was destroyed to produce thousands of consumer goods and services bought by America with borrowed money which it is never going to pay back...

Monetary System of Industrial Society is a totally deceptive system through which Urban Population is fooling rest of the world about the importance of Urban Work.

Millions of Banks are frauds....IMF is a fraud.....World Bank is a fraud.

For 100 years Urban Population has fooled rest of the world about the importance of Urban Work.

For 100 years Urban Population has fooled rest of the world with Terminologies.....Progress, Growth, Development.

For 100 years Urban Population has fooled rest of the world with Figures.....Growth Rate, Economy Rate, GDP...

If Urban Society stops its supplies to Rural Society it will live forever.

If Rural Society stops its supplies to Urban Society it will die within a month.

That is the worth of Urban Jobs, Consumer Goods, Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP...

Progress, Growth, Development.

This is terminology for all unnecessary and destructive work being done by Urban Population.

Growth Rate - Economy Rate - GDP.

These are figures for all unnecessary and destructive work being done by Urban Population...

Urban Work has destroyed environment.

Industrial Activity is directly proportional to percentage of urban population.

Consumerism is directly proportional to percentage of urban population.

Destruction of environment is directly proportional to percentage of urban population.

Insanity, abnormality and criminality is directly proportional to percentage of urban population.

Unnecessary and destructive work is directly proportional to percentage of urban population.

In America 95% of population is urban.....That is why America is the mother of all extra, unnecessary and destructive work in this world....That is why consumerism is so rampant in America.....5% of world population consuming 25 - 40% of world resources.

In Europe 80 - 90% of population is urban.....That is why Europe is highly consumerist and destructive too.

In China and India, consumerism and destruction of environment have risen drastically with increase in urban population...

Human Species is totally redundant on earth.

Within the human species, the Urban Population is totally redundant.

Urban Jobs are totally redundant and destructive.

Urban Professions are totally redundant and destructive.

Urban Work has destroyed the environment.

Urban Work must stop immediately.

Give free food to the Urban Population, but for God's sake stop Urban Work (A fraction of world population is already producing food for entire population)..

Last edited by sushilydv on Fri Nov 08, 2013 12:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

My thought on Sushi is that he should cut back on the repetitious haranguing and hyperbole and tighten up on the definitions and analysis. He's starting from a good place but finally taking it into broken record mode and playing fast and loose with certain facts. I think he is suffering from a version of Gresham's Law. His bad stuff is distracting from his core of good.

The entire environment or biosphere will not die off with most species in a thermal maximum event.Sure, it will; probably take 230,000 years to absorb all the pollution, and another 3 million to develop the number of species extant at the beginning of this interglacial epoch.The initial stimulus for human overpopulation was the use of large then much larger amounts of fossil fuels to drive industrialization including agriculture and disposition of food. Techno and medical knowledge lead to tech to keep people alive while people did not control their lust and reproduction because most were too stupid and the techno medical thought they were doing good when they were not. The combination of the three, technology, over-breeding, industrialization with fossil fuels, has lead to the 2040s crash and the 2500 thermal maximum extinction of most but not all life.Crowd tolerance also had a powerful effect on urbanization and more gross overpopulation with more industrialization to feed them.Immorality of the masses lead to more pollution, trash, lust, and desires for worldly goods, greed, selfishness, increasing crime, and corrupt leadership.We've got 9 years to reduce emissions from all sources 90%, to prevent thermageddon. If not, then all that will be left is undug fossils, and new life forms in millions of years. Maybe "intelligent" life will develop again. Hopefully they will be smarter environmentally.

from JauntyAlbotross; "Goodbye

CODA

Though it seems

almost incredibleweather predictions

now grimly show

(as my heart screams NO)

our growing population's

growing money addiction

to the global corporation

makes the death

of planet Earth

inevitable."

_________________"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

.What makes me seethe with rage is the fact that most of the environment is already gone and there is no possibility of saving the little that is left.

When I had started thinking about environment and related issues nearly 20 - 25 years ago, I had no idea that by the time I would understand the problem there would be hardly any environment left to save.

Rate of environmental destruction has risen exponentially in the last few decades.

The amount of environment that was destroyed in the last 50 years will now get destroyed in less than five years.

One can only watch the destruction helplessly.

What was created by nature in millions of years has been destroyed by hundred years of Industrial Madness..

Technically "saving the environment" is an oxymoron. The environment doesn't disappear, it changes. The question is can we survive the rate of change, involving massive amounts of new solar energy capture, acidifying water ways, huge quantities of industrial pollution, per capita resource depletion, for instance water, hyper stress and social breakdown, WMDs etc. etc. My guess is on our present course we can't.

I once had a site promoting that which I thought at the time would be sustainable and nice; Earthship Villages. Built and lived in by intelligent strong people, with some having enough capability to manufacture batteries, solar panel, generators, inverters, and other power equipment to use. Plus the ability to protect themselves from hostile outside groups.Growing their own food, recycling everything, keeping the population constant or near so. Growing in the Earthships, using aquaponics, raising rabbits, chickens, outside grain and woods, with pasture, orchards--- a regular utopia, connected to other villages by radio or satellite. The sum total of human knowledge with each village. Kind of a high tech agrarian society with bartering food, manufactured items, education, labor, and child care.That was before I found out about the probability of going worse than PETM. Then I thought of underground fortresses with GenIV nuclear grow lights, a good aquifer, and similar living arrangement except underground.The outside villages would eventually lose all their outside growing, unless they went nomadic toward the poles. Even then time would run out for them. As it would for those underground who would have no survivable surface for two hundred thousand years.So one hope is to reduce emissions 90% within a decade and hope as we live through momentum and the 400 year cool down, almost all after a rapid die-off period.Another hope is for a geologic incident which reduces population through economic meltdown or loss of a season of growing globally.Another possibility is limited nuclear war that takes out the 500 biggest cities. Some have thought a pandemic could also do it.Katla(South Icelandic volcano) is due, so is La Palma and the Cascadia Rip. As a geology guy for life, I would say they are more likely than the others in preventing the AETM ELE.Either way of the several, it won't be an easy ride for people or many other life forms on Earth. Like the calm before the storms of my grandchildren, if my son has one. But he knows what is ahead, too. If I would have not had excessive hope in 1987, he probably never would have been born. Now, I am sorry for what man has done to this biosphere, and I feel for the children of the future. Crying out over the annals of time, those who could have been.

On the other hand there is that incredible ability of human beings to live in small spaces. Part of the logic of cities is you can concentrate resources in very limited areas by stacking virtual rabbit hutches endlessly on top of each other. There is a strange kind of horrid efficiency to it all.

"A new study sponsored by Nasa's Goddard Space Flight Center has highlighted the prospect that global industrial civilisation could collapse in coming decades due to unsustainable resource exploitation and increasingly unequal wealth distribution.

Noting that warnings of 'collapse' are often seen to be fringe or controversial, the study attempts to make sense of compelling historical data showing that "the process of rise-and-collapse is actually a recurrent cycle found throughout history." Cases of severe civilisational disruption due to "precipitous collapse - often lasting centuries - have been quite common."

Never before has collapse been on a global scale, or with the tipping points of methane turnover well passed.

_________________"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein

almost 200K hits! Wow, must be REALLY important. Certainly twenty times as important as the >no show "fence sitters"< crap thread.

_________________"With every decision, think seven generations ahead of the consequences of your actions" Ute rule of life.“We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children”― Chief Seattle“Those Who Have the Privilege to Know Have the Duty to Act”…Albert Einstein