There are plenty of riders who have safe and uneventful riding careers, but you don't hear their stories because they have nothing sensational to talk about.

I think that motorcycles are more dangerous than a car when all other things are equal, simply due to the lack of protection, but at the same time a lot of the motorcycle accidents are operator error one way or another (miscalculations, riding in adverse conditions, intoxication, riding an overly powerful motorcycle for the skill level) so the risk is manageable to a certain extent.

That's true, although I think "selfish" and "stupid" are unnecessary (or just plain wrong). One person driving a huge SUV, with heavy fuel consumption could be classed as more selfish, certainly.

And as a calculated risk, I don't think it's too bad, excluding the added potential risk factors you've mentioned. I think that a lot of motorcyclists bring much more risk awareness to the roads than many car drivers.

See, when I was riding a bike, I had to concentrate completely. It was something I could do, and do well. Nobody could deny it. I never failed, even when I crashed. I had accidents, to be sure, but they were few, and riding the bike gave me a few minutes or hours' respite from the cold, dark, lonely place that was the inside of my own head.

Bikes saved my life. I would surely have killed myself if I hadn't had bikes. I didn't even tell anyone I was planning to off myself, because I was fucking serious. It wasn't a cry for help. It was an end to unending torment.

I didn't do it because whenever it got really bad, I'd get on the bike and just ride the fuck out of there. It didn't matter where I'd go, it didn't even matter that the bike was slow and unreliable, because as long as I was riding it, I was out of my head and into the act of riding. Acts with purpose, singular, simple, straightforward; mass vs acceleration, anticipation vs expectation. Riding is easy. You never ask hard questions and you don't have to care about anyone else's opinion. It's simple.

Later, I discovered that I was not alone. Many riders ride for escape, for mental health, for a moment of flight in a life spent leaden.

Riding saved my life, and every time I ride, it saves it a little more. I'm doing better now, but in my darkest moments, I still get out and ride. If it were taken away from me, I don't know what I'd do.

That's a lie. I know exactly what I'd do- I'd spiral down again, slowly, a bit at a time, until I was a mess again.

I had the same experiences man, getting a motorcycle is ultimately what led me to go to college. I always thought of it like all the bad shit going on in my head would just come down through my neck, then through my right arm, right into throttle, through the engine, down the chain, into the tire, and every problem I had was left on whatever stretch of highway I was cruising down. I would say it definitely saved my life. Now that I don't have a functioning bike, I'm back to being depressed. Working on them makes me happy, but I wanna ride damnit. I NEED to ride.

I myself dealt with crippling anxiety and depression. Didnt leave the house for three months at one point. My riding has saved me completely. I finally moved 2300 miles from home and lemme tell ya, if i hadnt had the bike, there were a few places i probably would have said fuck it and turned around. Keep strong brother. Youre not alone and i am so happy you realized your bike will always be there as a HEALTHY escape. Keep riding and keep the rubber side down.

I absolutely agree with you. The riskiest part of motorcycling is how little cushion you have when things go wrong; either from your own miscalculation or when a car does something stupid to you. It's not selfish or stupid of us to do something that makes us feel truly happy, alive, and fulfilled. It is stupid and selfish of those people to blame motorcyclists every single time. It's like blaming girls for getting raped....

The woman who hit my boyfriend in her suv last weekend was the stupid, irresponsible one. Not him. He was wearing all his gear, obeying traffic laws, and doing his best to stay safe. I would never expect him not to ride.

People with famlies still engage in all kinds of behavior with inherent risks, like drinking alcohol, having potentially dangerous jobs like being a police officer or fire fighter or security guard. You will never hear someone tell a fire fighter he is stupid and selfish.

You can make the same comment about guns - you never hear about the millions of non-events associated with them, nor their use in defense, but exceptional events where somebody gets shot totally take over the popular perception.

I just went on a roadtrip and, depending on the countryside and what you can learn about a place when you're there to buy gas, have lunch, or pick up a "hey haven't seen you in a while, bro" bottle of scotch, reations are very clearly varried. (If you're interested: the ride)

I think showing up with gear on and some tacticool vest over mesh over underarmor must have looked pretty cool as it made some people pretty excited.

Or thought that you might do some crazy shit.

Or that you have a human head in one saddle bag and ten pounds of coke in the other.

That was about the spectrum of it on this trip. I'd be interested in seeing other peoples first hand social observations. xD

It would have been neater if I knew that Sprint doesn't work anywhere. I'll be remembering this next time.

I always make an extra special effort to be extra polite to everyone. I think not riding a harley helps. Okay maybe I did buy a shaft drive because I thought that it would be like riding a Tron lightbike. And so yeah, maybe I was right.

I try to keep away from either subject, and if they come up and I cannot avoid it I try not to get angry when I get the inevitable "Don't you love your children? How could you do this to them?" like I've already gotten killed/crippled while riding or shot everybody in sight.

It's also the same case with shark attacks. Is it selfish and stupid to swim in the ocean because of the few sensationalized occurrences that happen around the world. Just my luck that I ride and carry and surf, I must be stupid3

I don't get the selfish argument though. For example, I regularly hit 40+ mph on my road bike wearing nothing but a light helmet and some cycling clothes; is it more dangerous than doing 40 mph in a car? Sure. Is it an inherently selfish act? Not at all.

For example, I regularly hit 40+ mph on my road bike wearing nothing but a light helmet and some cycling clothes

This one cracks me up - as both a motorcyclist and a cyclist, I love seeing the perceptions of each contrasted against the reality of actually riding. I ride cyclocross and road, and I'll come back from the occasional race with cuts, bruises, trashed bike components...not to mention the countless casual mentions of "oh yeah, x person broke their collarbone". Nobody bats an eyelid. The ONE time I was rear-ended (granted, it was a freeway collision and totalled my bike), and I'm getting lectured on how dangerous motorcycles are, getting the whole "my aunt works in an ER, and you know what they call them? Donorcycles! Har har..." spiel, parents begging me to stop riding...

Meanwhile, the only damage I have from the crash is a hangover from drinking too much at the bar after I got home because my gear did what it was supposed to do.

I think the problem most people have is when you say "cyclist", they think of some rich old Fred that rides his bike on the weekend and talks about the TDF once a year, but when you say "motorcyclist/biker" they think of either a tattooed Sons of Anarchy wannabe or this guy.

The 80% of people that get out there and quietly and safely do what they do isn't nearly as memorable as the outliers.

Any vehicle without a crash cage around the driver is inherently more dangerous, in terms of what can happen to you when you crash, but I think that overlooks just how dangerous cars are and continue to be.

Yep, people are dumbasses. They believe once you're in a car your fucking invincible. So silly

Motorcycles are many times more dangerous than cars. Every study done has proven so. It is largely due to the fact that riders get almost zero protection, compared to cars providing a safe little box around its passengers.

Regardless of skill, awareness, etc - riding a motorcycle is undeniably more dangerous than a car. Other drivers often do stupid stuff, and motorcycles are often faster (acceleration wise) and harder to see.

I'm okay with that, and hope everyone else who decides to ride understands and accepts that as well, rather than deluding themselves into thinking I'm a good driver, it won't happen to me.

That said, people shouldn't be expected to stay inside where it's safe and never do anything.

Hell, driving a car is much more dangerous than walking. Therefore driving at all is selfish?

Some people will never be convinced. Motorcycles = bad to them, and that's all they'll ever think.

I recently saw statistics about motorcycle accidents with a deadly outcome in my area in Sweden. The fact was that six out of seven didn't have any drivers license for motorcycle...
Some motorbikes have the same power to weight ratio as a formula one car. And they think they can ride such a monster without proper training?...
EDIT:Google translate of the article in the local news
And "West Bengal" should actually be "Västra Götaland".

Yeah people buy a nice fast bike but don't take the time to learn first. You can certainly learn from scratch on a powerful bike but I feel it is much better to start with a smaller less powerful bike and then move to the sport bike once you can actually start to push the limits of the slow bike.

I wonder if this point is even considered by most people. I've seen so many of my friends get in bicycle accidents but it's no question about getting back on one. Public transportation is the safest the way I see it, but it's popular to be on a bicycle instead.

now, motorcycles go faster and if we all of a sudden stop while going fast, that might be a problem a cyclist doesn't encounter.

Just crashed 3 weeks ago due to miscalculation on my part. Broken collarbone. Am I upset? Of course. Do I blame anyone but myself? Nope. Am I planning on riding again when I regain full control of my shoulder again? You bet I am!

While I agree with you, as I read the comments below I realize we are on a motorcycle forum and therefore our opinions are very biased towards defending our hobby. But an ER doctor has his own swayed view where he happens to see far more deaths from sport bike riders, apparently. If so, I can actually understand why he feels this way, and I might feel the same way if I was an ER doctor. I'm glad I'm not because I don't want to be too afraid to ride my bike.

Its true. People also rarely talk about motorcyle accidents that were uneventful. I have personally had 1. I lowsided at about 20 mph and didnt have a scratch. My cousin went through a barbed wire fence at about 50. Fucked up the bike something aweful but again, no scratch on him.

The opinion in the pic is far from objective. Workin in an ER and dealing with trauma must be pretty rough. I'm sure they can't help but look at motorcyclists that have been hurt in accidents and wish they had more protection from a car.

I think most riders have also been saved by the fact that they were on a bike. I can brake and swerve so fast that I can avoid things I would have no choice but to hit in my car. You have better awareness of your surroundings and traffic, no blind spots, it comes down to the operator.

Exactly, I had a bus cut out in to traffic and drive in the turn lane next to me. As I was accelerating to get out of his way he made his move and got right in my lane. Luckily I was on the bike and I fit between the lanes of traffic.

I have experienced this. I totaled a bike doing just that, unfortunately. I came through some tight turns, to be welcomed by a sporty Subaru teaching through turns and coming into my lane. Had I been in my car, it would have been a hefty head on collision. Instead, I avoided him, couldn't repair angle, and started rolling. The bike crashed into the mountain, and I walked away with nothing but a spot on my ass.

True, but not always useful. Sometimes slamming on the brakes won't stop you in time no matter how good they are, and you'll just hit something at 40 instead of 70. That's great and all, but I'd rather go past it at 70 than hit it at all, an option which nearly always got on a bike, not so much in a car.

Anyone else ever just sit back and think about how many folks seem to think relationships should be based on control? As if the expectation is that people should change to fit the relationship instead of the other way around.

This sentiment of "selfish" riders, I think, is an illustration of this attitude. Bob likes riding. Bob has a girlfriend/wife. Suddenly, because that relationship exists, there's this expectation that Bob is obligated to the relationship instead of any other passions he might have.

I don't get it. I enjoy being with my partner because the two of us enjoy each other's company...just the way we are. We both ride; because I care about her, I do worry when she's out riding sometimes, but never in a thousand years would I expect her to stop riding to placate my fears.

You know what I think is "selfish"? Saying you love someone, and then expecting them to change who they are to accommodate you.

I think that the thought behind it is: Now that you share your life with someone, you are expected to take less risk with your life, as you not only affect yourself, but also your partner. Riding a motorcycle brings a bigger risk with it than driving a car, as you are far more vulnerable to die from -either your own or someone elses- mistake. Hence you should stop doing that.

Personally, I think it's for every couple to figure out together, what they expect of eachother.

That said, entering a relationship while you know the other person has a motorcycle, and then expect that person to drop that particular hobby, without talking about it is batshit crazy.

If my SO ever said anything about my riding and how I should stop, I would definitely stop... dating her. Motorcycling is more than a passion to me, so for anyone to ask me to stop / limit it would be unacceptable. However, if I were to have found a woman who is completely pro-motorcycles (which it seems that I have), me having children of my own would be about the only reason I could see in limiting my riding. At least until they're old enough to fend, but that is a personal battle I will have to make.

The way I see it, I can't decide for my partner where her risk/reward line sits. I can't decide for her whether doing a certain thing is worth the risk that it might affect me. All I can do is express my concerns and trust that she takes those into account as much as she feels appropriate.

Honestly, she does some things while riding that are beyond my personal risk limits. She knows how I feel about these behaviors; I don't lie to her or pull punches. Some of these things she's stopped doing or rolled back on after we've talked about them, some she has not. Because I care deeply for her, I do wish she'd stop some of these things...but it's still her choice, not mine.

If she ever has a fatal accident, I'll be heartbroken. But if anyone suggests that she was "selfish" after such a thing, they will (probably) get a fucking earful from me.

Well stated. My girl friend loves to ride with me, however she doesn't ride her own. I know my SO would not agree with some of the choices I make throughout my day as far as risk management is concerned, but she respects my skill level and she trusts that I know what is best for different situations. I take very few risks when I am riding 2-up, but when I'm alone, all is fair.

Agreed, I actually expressed this conversationally to my SO once, it is brought up as a point of offense in conversation now and again. But I wasn't joking, I'd actually choose my bike over her if a choice was being forced.

When my husband and I got married, he never once told me he expected me to stop riding. Yeah, he's expressed concern and worry once or twice, but that's never translated into wanting me to stop. He knows I take proper precautions and that's good enough for him.

Lol, again, I'm merely considering the rationale here, not saying that I agree eoth it. But if the financial repercussions are all you consider... There's also the part where you hurt your loved ones HARD by suddenly dieing on them...

Also some people prefer to live completely cushioned "safe" lifestyles and I totally understand that, I wouldn't ever try to force you to go basejumping or ride a motorcycle, so don't try to force me to live the way you do just because you're scared.

Exactly my thoughts as well. Calling someone selfish for risking their life implies that they owe their life to someone. It suggests that the reason we're living is to be there for others. If someone believes I'm selfish because I don't put their needs above my own need to feel the exhilaration and freedom of being on two wheels, then theyre a hypocrite.

Realistically, at the end of the day, we're all selfish. Every last stinking one of us. Even the ones who claim to be unselfish act out of self-interest.

When someone uses "selfish" as a pejorative, what they really mean is that they don't like the way that person prioritizes their life, but instead of expressing it in an objective manner ("boy, I sure wouldn't make those choices"), they make a sort of universal moral attack. ("What an asshole")

Calling someone selfish because he keeps riding when they have kids is equally annoying to me as calling someone a pussy because he stops riding when he has kids. Either way, he's the one who decides what his priorities are, and what's worth risking. It's not my place to judge him and pass my judgment off as universal truth.

It's not necessarily about control. Just to play devils advocate and to give an example where it's not necessarily wrong to ask your partner to quit riding: Having Kids.

I don't think it's completely unreasonable to ask your partner, who provides income and stability to you and your children's life, to stop doing something that could potentially cause massive negative effects on the children's futures. It doesn't mean the rider has no choice but to quit, and it'd be wrong to give an ultimatum. But, it's also not an unreasonable request, I think.

It definitely depends on both partners and their lifestyle, but it's not always a selfish, controlling, or unreasonable thing to ask out of a person.

So when one has kids one must: lose weight (reduce risk of heart disease), stop drinking and smoking (reduce risk of cancers), shorten commutes as much as possible (reduce risk of auto accidents), move to the suburbs (reduce risk of disease due to pollution and human contact), get rid of firearms (reduce risk of successful suicide), etc etc. Where does it stop? Having kids shouldn't negate who you are. If you're worried about fiances, up your life and disability insurance. If you're worried about them having two parents, get some god parents and tell your spouse it's ok to remarry. Keep the fucking bike.

A fair point...but the first question that comes to mind for me is "If you think your partner is engaging in risky behavior, to the point that you're concerned about their ability to support you, then why do you still knowingly depend on him/her?" To me, it's basically like saying "I'm not sure I can depend on him to keep supporting me...oh well, I hope I'm wrong!"

Frankly, if you depend on another person for support, then you already have the potential for there being massive negative effects in your life. That's true regardless of whether that person rides a motorcycle, crosses the street without looking both ways, or drives a convertible without a roll bar. Bottom line: Don't hitch yourself to an unreliable wagon and then complain when that wagon is...well..unreliable.

I have kids but I still ride. I do wear gear and try not to be too crazy since I want to be around for them as long as possible but there's no guarantees in life. Hell, I could stop riding entirely and still die in an accident in my car, or die of a heart attack, or cancer, etc. etc.

I wish I could find the link, there was an extremely powerful story by a woman who had serious cancer. She saw people treating her with kid gloves, or wondering how it was to know you were very likely to die soon. She wrote something to the effect of "I so badly wanted to yell at them that we're all dying, I'm going to die, you're going to die, today a meteorite could flatten your Volvo or you could fall down the steps and break your neck! Why are you in denial all the time!?"

I had a coworker the other day tell me that she 'could never be friends with someone who rode a motorcycle'. It came completely out of the blue; I'm not sure she knew whether or not I ride one. I was completely taken aback, and I said "Well I'm sorry to hear that." In my head I'm thinking 'I guess we won't be friends then!' but she's a coworker and I'm pretty sure she had no idea so I didn't say it out loud.

Whoa whoa whoa. Obviously you don't get it, the whole reason you even exist is to have a bajillion children to love, dote on and provide for! The desire to live any other way makes you a selfish weirdo.

I too work in an ER (East NYC: Squid habitat of NY) and I am reminded how stupid and selfish it is to ride a motorcycle intoxicated, against traffic, or at 5x the speed limit without any training or license *

The latest I've seen is a guy low side and touch his pegs to ground on a roundabout. Asked him what he was trying. Trying to get rid of his strips he said. He only wore jeans. Guess he had no concept of body positioning.

There's also the fact that a lot of people (myself included) can't get out and hit the twisty roads all the time. I commute. 90% of the miles I put on two wheels are from commuting or errand running around town. I get to go out and ride strictly for fun once every few weeks if I'm lucky. I can guarantee that I spend more time on the bike than most of the people who have derided me for my "chicken strips", and because of that, my tires wear more in the center.

The only people I've ever had comment on the "chicken strips" on my Buell (it's my commuting bike, the Guzzi's for the weekend fun) are people who don't ride, or rarely ride. It seems like something people say to let you know that they're up on the motorcycling nomenclature. Like a "hey, look, I know about motorcycles!" type thing.

I work for the fire department and also scrape riders bodies up and see people injured from bikes all the time. But you know what?

Life's short. Bikes are a blast, and I've also seen people killed in cars, boats, cutting down trees, doing nothing at all, working their daily jobs. Fuck it. Do what makes you happy, yeah it's dangerous. So is my job. But if I die or get hurt, I've fully accepted that risk when I signed up for my job or bought my bike. So leave me alone. Worry about yourself.

As someone else pointed out on here, this is a case of confirmation bias. If we all just stop by the local emergency departments to let them know that we rode a motorcycle today and didn't get hurt, that'd eliminate the bias. :)

So, this guy came in everyday for twenty years on his bike to tell me that he was riding safely and didn't get in an accident. Twenty years. I started to expect him at the beginning of my shift it had become so routine. Then today as I was walking up to the hospital, he didn't show up... I knew it. He's probably dead. Fucking motorcycles.

Lots of people come in to the ER from car accidents with fairly minor injuries, and a few with massive ones. They just tend to be brought in all the time. But most riders I've spoken with (myself included) tend only to go if the accident was really bad. If we can ride home after, we tend to.

This is wild hypothesis time for me, but it seems to me that most of the more minor accidents on bikes are self-inflicted/limited to one vehicle. Hell, I know mine have been...

When it's a car, if you self-inflicted the accident, chances are good you didn't get hurt, the car did. But if you had a slightly more major crash, it's probably between two cars, and you're going to the hospital to get some of that other guy's sweet insurance payout.

Definitely confirmation bias. I talked to the EMTs and nurses who helped me out in the ER when I crashed. They were honestly impressed with all the gear I was wearing. They said most motorcycle accident victims they see aren't wearing gear, but it makes sense because when everyone is geared up they don't often need to go to the ER.

I remember getting insurance quotes for different bikes when I was shopping for my first bike. I ended up with a Suzuki Gladius which cost me $900/year. For fun I put in a S1000RR. The quote was over $3000/year!

I ride a motorcycle and i accept the dangers. I am getting married and wish to have a family. I am aware that riding is inherently a selfish pleasure and this man is correct. It is a choice I Have to make among many other ways to secure the future of my loved ones. Some of my decisions wil be selfish. Everyone does that. But motorcycling is definitely much more dangerous.

Ive only had one friend die from a riding a street bike. He T-boned a minivan at 160mph and killed a married couple, their children, and the grandmother... But at the same time I have a couple dozen friends that have never so muched as tipped their bikes over.. You always hear the one horror story and not the safe driving stories.

Not to disrespect your friend, but many people act like there's nothing you can possibly do to maintain some semblance of safety on a motorcycle due to the death statistics, while I feel that many deaths are due to this sort of riding.

I got my motorcycle license in Honolulu, Hawaii. The MSF course only took 2 and a half days and people are already buying 600cc sport bikes full of confidence. I moved to Hong Kong 4 years ago and found out in order to ride a motorcycle here, you need to take a riders course by law, which is on a weekly basis and last for a little over a year. It takes more than a year to get a motorcycle license here in Hong Kong! I can tell you they are some of the most skillful and responsible riders in the world.

This is about a clear case of Déformation professionnelle (professional deformation) you could find. His viewpoints are caused by the many cases of horribly wounded/dead bodies of riders he encounters in his professional life, and all the consequent grieving relatives. He extrapolates those cases to a broader perspective, his view on motorcycles and riders in general. He has made a causal link between riding motorcycles and dying horribly and causing grief for loved ones.

You cant really blame someone for this, it happens to almost anyone that is regularly confronted by something in their professional life, it skews your outlook on the world around you.

I don't disagree with this at all. From a purely statistical standpoint, it IS stupid, and from a practical standpoint it IS selfish. Nobody needs a bike. It's purely elective, and the risks are higher than driving.

And yes, when you have people who care about you, engaging in selfish behavior comes at a risk to their well-being, and not just your own.

But people do all kinds of stupid and selfish things, like smoking and eating at McDonalds, because it makes them happy and everyone deserves a certain amount of personal agency, even if they have obligations to family and friends.

People have an odd idea that "safe" and "unsafe" are discrete, achievable states. Driving a car is perceived as "safe." Riding a motorcycle is perceived as "not safe." When you start with that black-and-white point of view, then of course you end up calling people idiots or selfish or any other number of names.

When I decided I wanted to drive motorcycle I made an active decision.

I accepted the risk and while the people around me might not agree with my choice, its my life not theirs.

Im willing to risk my life for the ability to drive, every single girl ive met ever since that ive become serious with have been told that with me comes the risk of me dying as well (.. Well duuh) im fully entitled to live my life just how I want to. Whenever I get kids the motorcycle might take a smaller place in my life but i dont feel a gf/wife is even in the same category.

I'm a paramedic and worked 4 years in one of the busiest systems in the surrounding Houston area and I can say over that time I only made 4 or 5 major motorcycle wrecks, all of them that were fatalities were intoxicated, excessive speed and no protective equipment, or running from the police. Not that my experience speaks for all, but I'm curious as to where this person would see these nightly, even weekly. What I did see nightly were overdoses, diabetes issues, and homicide/suicides. Those seem far more selfish and far more commonplace than me riding my motorcycle.

Funny, the closest I've ever come to dying after decades on a motorcycle was when a doctor mis-prescribed some meds. This was at an office visit.

There is a hubris in the medical profession, pretty much all areas, that makes it okay to assume they get the last word on any topic. What I'm learning as I get older is the more I get to know doctors and their ilk, the less intelligent I think they are. The more I get to know bikers who have been riding a few decades, the smarter they seem.

We all do "stupid and selfish," at some level. I've done ICU and I hope that when my time comes, it's fast and on my motorcycle. Not lingering in a ward with these self-righteous professionals poking and prodding me. Any of my loved ones would hope for the same for me.

I'm am EMT that rides a street bike. There is a vast difference between those who irresponsibly drive like the road is their bitch and those who drive to cooperate with other drivers and compensate for the mistakes of other drivers. Lumping all street bike riders into one group was mistake 1 (of many)

Realistically riding bikes is dangerous, and if you look at it from someone who cares and depends on you'd perspective it can be considered selfish.
My SO works emergency medicine, so she has to deal with an inconceivable amount of bike crashes and the victims families, so I see exactly where he/she is coming from.
The truth of the matter is that it doesn't matter whether an accident is the biker's fault or that of a "cage" driver bikes are far more dangerous. We accept that and deal with it. We even defend it, but the truth is that it is not a smart decision

Edit: to follow up on this one of my patents friends died on his bike a few years ago, he had been riding for close to 40 years, he came around a corner at about 40 mph, there was an accident and he tried to avoid it, bike slipped and he hit his head and died before they made it to hospital. He left a wife and two kids behind.
I love my little bike, I have fun and try to be careful, but the truth is that it is fucking dangerous and there is no getting away from that. You can be as careful as you want, but bad shit happens and riding bikes when bad shit happens it can kill you.
My Dad's advise, or rather his begging, was Monkey_monkey_you, please don't get a bike

I respect everyone's right to wear or not wear a helmet, but do you mind if I ask if the guy who died was wearing one? No judgment if he wasn't, it just gives me another data point for deciding what's right for me.

That's odd. The thing I find selfish is when someone who has no interest whatsoever in driving decides to buy the biggest, most inefficient and unnecessary vehicle they can find so that they can get behind the wheel and completely tune off as they drive. That way, when they have an accident, they aren't that bothered. That seems a lot more selfish to me.

written by a paramedic who sees nothing but horrible motorcycle crashes made by the stupidest of riders. when you know who is writing something it is easy to disregard their opinion as biased. i know plenty of people who have been riding 30+ years. yes crashes happen. accidents happen where ever you go. but that doesn't mean we're all idiot squids who run head first into a truck or don't know how to control a bike around a corner and go careening off a clif.

In fact the only "bad" thing shes doing its to put all of you guys in one basquet.

in ER the people call the bikers "organ donors" at the point of they hear about an accident and ask about where they are sending the organs, since they needed 1 heart at the time.
Theres a lot of stupid riders and you may say "theres a lot of stupid drivers" but those drivers dont instantly encounter the floor on 200km/h. They usualy have massive broken bones and other serius injuries but its harder to instanly die.

I've put about two years in the E.R as an EMT and just started riding. It's all about WHO is riding WHAT. Most riders that come in were riding intoxicated and/or doing something beyond their skill level. Cornering seems to surprise a lot of riders- going to fast, laying down the bike due to sand/gravel.

To be honest I see FAR more car accidents that were a result of poor poor driver judgement. Cars just seem to give the illusion of safety. You're still going 80 mph with an iphone in one hand, BigMac in the other and your knees doing the steering....

Statistically he's right. Riding is a higher risk demographic and it all comes down to personal choice. Some people smoke and live long uneventful lives; but most who do will suffer health complications.

That said, I don't feel that most of us ride in a selfish way. We ride with every intention of keeping safe and not hooning around. We ride with plenty of gear and behave defensively.

I have personally known four people that died riding a motorcycle - I have known several dozen who died "living" life. It's more selfish of other people who want me to live my life based on their fears, without any guarantees of actual safety, so that they can feel better.

I'll be devil's advocate and say that I see where he's coming from. I can understand the jaded life of those who work in emergency - the longer they work, the more jaded they become, and I see how they could grow to be spiteful of motorcyclists because, it is true, there are many idiots on the road who act stupid and end up leaving friends and families behind to grieve for their loss, which is definitely selfish in a way. I ride, and my mom is an OR doctor who sees her fair share of motorcyclists, and I see it in her eyes whenever I'm leaving the house and going for a ride.

So here is a bit of a different view. Everyone here is comparing motorcycling to everything else in terms of danger and that it isn't selfish because there are risks in everything. Well guess what. Every human being is selfish so let's get over it. And yes even selfless acts are more than likely a selfish act. Giving a homeless guy money? Selfless? No. It gives you a happy feeling. So go out there have some fun and stop caring what ignorant cunts like this think.

I had a friend die on a motorcycle. Not his fault. Some soccer mom in a minivan merged on top of him, pushing him against the guard rail. It tore his leg off and he bled out. When the ambulance arrived, we were all standing around with tears in our eyes in utter disbelief. The ambulance rider said loudly, "Looks like another donor-cycle wreck!" He thought he was being funny.

I have never checked the organ donor box on the back of my license since.

EMT and daily rider here. Yes dealing with crappy pay and a frustrating and stressful work environment can make us callous at times. But, a real professional will also know when to keep his damn mouth shut and "save it for station". I train new EMTs where I work, and that is one of the first things I pound into their heads. I'm sorry for what that EMT said about your friend.

Mate that is fucked on a few levels. Firstly the guy cleaning the wreck sucks but that is no reason to deny someone a potential life saving organ. Tick the box and possibly saves someones life. It's not hard and you will have no use for them anyway.