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The Two Difficulties In Countering Wahabism In Sri Lanka

Before proceeding further I want to explain the title of this article, more specifically the question mark placed on it. By Islamic fundamentalism is today meant Wahabism and its clones. There are Wahabis who claim that what Wahab taught was one thing and that what. Wahabism has meant in practice is quite another. That is true to some extent, but it is a question that need not detain us because it remains that at the core of what Wahab taught is the tenet that those who don’t accept what Wahab taught – including orthodox Muslims and Shias – should all be declared apostate and be killed. Another core tenet is that the veneration accorded to the shrines of saints and monuments in the holy places of Islam amounts to shirk, polytheism, which is the one unpardonable sin according to orthodox theologians. They should be killed and those monuments be destroyed.

Wahabism holds therefore that the millions and millions and millions of Muslims who led pious Islamic lives as orthodox Muslims and Shias down the centuries will all be consigned to eternal hell-fire. It is impossible to believe that so perverse a version of Islam can possibly have staying power. Unsurprisingly over the two and a half centuries of its existence Wahabism has been no more than a minority cult, and it remains so today despite all the oil billions spent to propagate it. Even within Saudi Arabia, where Wahabism is the official version of Islam, only twenty five per cent are Wahabis. Why then have I placed a question mark over the title of this article, implying that it could have staying power?

I must make some clarifications at this point. The fundamentalist drive to return to the roots in order to seek self-renewal or the renewal of a society is something that has to be respected. I have argued the case earlier, using as illustrative material two iconic American art-works, Fred Zinneman’s film High Noon and Martha Graham’s ballet Appalachian Spring. But Islamic fundamentalism in the form of Wahabism is something else: a monstrous perversion of Islam that cannot have much staying power. However it could prove to be a hardy plant in some places, like a spiky rebarbative cactus with those unIslamic black burqas and other horrors. The explanation might be found in a sage observation of the great Einstein: there are only two infinite things, the universe and human stupidity, and Einstein wasn’t sure about the universe. However in the Islamic world as a whole Wahabism will surely come to be regarded as an aberrant form of Islam with an appeal only to a tiny proportion of Muslims who are afflicted with deep psychological problems. I will add one more reason for that expectation, in addition to the ones I have touched on earlier. There are five million Muslims in France and many more million Muslims in other Western countries. How many of them wear the burqa showing they are in sympathy with Wahabism? An infinitesimal proportion of them only. I take that as proof definitive, beyond rational dispute, that Wahabism in the Afro-Asian countries is the product of social coercion backed by the petro-dollar.

However Wahabism is not going to disappear overnight. About two decades ago Olivier Roy, one of the two best-known Islamologists in France – the other is Gilles Kepel- predicted the quick demise of ‘political Islam’. Retrospectively he would seem to have been badly mistaken, but he will certainly be proved right in a slightly longer-term perspective. The violence and terrorism of Wahabism and its clones are best explained in terms of the transition to modernity – according to the theory of Karen Armstrong and Emmanuel Todd that I have already expounded. The latter predicted in his 2002 book that the fundamentalist fervor would die out both in Saudi Arabia and Pakistan – the two great headquarters of Islamic fundamentalism today – by about 2022. It has to be expected that the fundamentalist drive will have nothing like its present potency without the petro-dollars backing it. It seems commonsensical therefore to say that the fundamentalist drive has reached its climacteric and will enter its phase of decline. Fundamentalism in its extreme and violent form can break out here and there in the Islamic world, but it is not going to constitute a major problem for the rest of the world.

There are two difficulties in countering Wahabism in Sri Lanka. One is that it is difficult to find a Muslim who avows Wahabism. There are two significant physical markers of Wahabism: long beards and females who are robed in black burqas. Such Muslims invariably declare either that they are Salafis, meaning that they have returned to pristine Islam, or that they practice Islam in its true form and labels such as Wahabi are completely meaningless. Most Wahabis can therefore be expected to say that articles on countering Wahabism have no relevance to them and should be just ignored. But we know that the curricula in the madrasas is Wahabi, we know that there is Saudi funding behind them, we know that Wahabi practices have come to prevail, and we know that the traditional orthodox Sufi-inspired tolerant Islam that served our Muslims so well for so long is being totally eradicated. Considering those facts we have to ask whether the Wahabis are shame-faced about Wahabism because they suspect that Wahabism is incompatible with Islam. Anyway the fact that the Wahabis themselves won’t avow Wahabism suggests that Wahabism and its clones cannot possibly be the wave of the Islamic future.

The other difficulty in countering Wahabism is that there is now wide currency for the notion that it is not for every Dick, Tom, and Harry to interpret the Koran, a task that should be left to the theologians who have years and decades of Islamic study behind them. I declare that that notion is pernicious nonsense because it is outrageously unIslamic. To whom was the Koranic revelation given? It was given not to the erudite of the time but to an impoverished member of the Meccan merchant aristocracy who was illiterate. To whom did he convey the revelation? It was to Ahmed, Yusuf, and Izeth, the hoipoloi Muslim equivalents of Dick, Tom, and Harry. We must remember that Islam is an extreme form of Protestantism which establishes a direct unmediated relationship between the individual and God. That is why there are no priests in Islam, meaning individuals who only are ordained to perform certain religious functions. Therefore the notion that Ahmed, Yusuf, and Izeth should have no say in interpreting the Koran and Islam should be branded as heresy.

I concluded the first part of this article by making two proposals to counter Wahabism, both of which would promote national integration. The first was to use the madrasas to correct the misconception that Buddhism is a form of idol worship, a point that applies also to Christianity and Hinduism. I had a strictly orthodox Islamic upbringing but I used to relish the prospect of going to see the Vesak lights. Today there are Muslim children who will have none of it because doing that would be tantamount to idol worship. Using the madrasas to correct misconceptions about the three other religions practiced in Sri Lanka would not amount to proselytisation. It would just be a counter to the idiotisation of our Muslims through Wahabism. We should not allow an aberrant form of Islam, a minority cult, which depends so much for its hold on social coercion and the petro-dollar, to become a possible contributory factor towards wrecking our ethnic relations.

My second proposal concerned the two verses in the Koran according to which Jews, Christians, and Sabians who believe in the one true God and lead virtuous lives will go to heaven. We Muslims must struggle to bring about a form of Islam in which those verses are given central importance. This is clearly a matter which requires in-depth treatment elsewhere. I will merely declare here that Islam is of all the world religions arguably the most widely ecumenical, and also that it is fully consistent with modernity. I will conclude by quoting Ernst Gellner, who in addition to his other attainments had expertise in Muslim sociology: “By various obvious criteria – universalism, scripturalism,, spiritual egalitarianism, the extension of full participation in the sacred community, not to one, or some, but to all, and the rational systematization of social life – Islam is, of the three great Western monotheisms, the one closest to modernity”.

Latest comments

Frank/January 23, 2016

First there was Fart 1. Now CT readers have to endure Fart 2. This Fossil is reputed to be an octogenarian. When is he going to be encased in a glass box at the Colombo Museum?

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Amarasiri/January 23, 2016

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Frank

Read the Article.

Don’t react like the Satan Following Wahhabies and their Clones.

Do not treat Stupidity as a Virtue. See what Einstein had to say. His IQ was quite high and won a Nobel Prize too.

“However it could prove to be a hardy plant in some places, like a spiky rebarbative cactus with those unIslamic black burqas and other horrors. The explanation might be found in a sage observation of the great Einstein: there are only two infinite things, the universe and human stupidity, and Einstein wasn’t sure about the universe. However in the Islamic world as a whole Wahabism will surely come to be regarded as an aberrant form of Islam with an appeal only to a tiny proportion of Muslims who are afflicted with deep psychological problems. “

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Sinhala_Man/January 23, 2016

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Did anybody force you to read this?

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Amarasiri/January 23, 2016

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Frank, has a comprehension problem.

We need to help him.

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Jilani/January 23, 2016

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Biggest difficulty muslims have fallen into in srilanka is learned people like youll kept quite when all muslim governing bodies were infected with wahabbi germs like acju, halal, moon sighting,waqf etc. Today these wahhabi ulemas and muftis have built their base because the image created is they are responsible people and deserve to be head of the community instead they are slowly poisoning the system. Innocent muslims are getting trapped to their agendas on the sly

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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Jilani

You summarized it well. This has been the way throughout history.

This happened 800 years ago, when the reason vs. revelation debate went on. The Ulama and religious scholars won out over the Philosophers due to political reasons. True for other religions as well. Some information for thoughts on the transcendental, of or relating to a spiritual or nonphysical realm.

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Moderate man/January 23, 2016

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Sylvia, you are like a frog in the well and like a parrot repeating the same old crap

Why don’t you check the number of people the Americans, the British and the Russians have killed in the last 25 years, in Iraq, Afghanistan and Syria, you will be astonished, mind you they are not Muslims.

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Sylvia Haik/January 25, 2016

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Moderate man, I should feel flattered I’m in your mind but I don’t know for what. I also don’t give a rat’s ass what you think of me. If you have the intelligence to comment on the subject in hand, the author Izeth Hussain is stating that Wahhabism is the cause of the demise of Islam. I happen to agree. The only reason it has not been kicked into oblivion is the Saudi’s petrodollars. Sadly some, Muslims are influenced by these petrodollars. You can see the changes in the last 30 years. From never having seen a burqa to today’s burqa clad women even on the pillion of motorbikes and driving cars.

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niyaz/January 23, 2016

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This writer is ignorant of Islam he is a liar of islam there is no wahabism in Islam abdullah ibn wahab purified shirk n bidaa of those days they were worshipping graves n saints like these days you see in devatagaha mosques grave in Sri Lanka so this writer is ignorant of Islam real Muslim means he grows little beard atleast see his picture full shaven so he is misguiding n misleading Muslim we lament his stupid mentality about islam

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Amarasiri/January 23, 2016

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niyaz

“This writer is ignorant of Islam he is a liar of islam there is no wahabism in Islam abdullah ibn wahab purified shirk n bidaa of those days they…”

Wahhabis follow Iblis and believe Stupidity is a Virtue. Those Iblis following Wahhabis will end in Hell Fire on day of Judgement, along with Iblis, as per Islamic Theology.

Amarasiri’s has a Question.

“What did Shaik Muhammad Abdul Wahab teach the Meccan and Medina Quran’s did NOT teach?. Call other Muslims Non-Muslims and Kill them, based on instructions from Iblis, Satan.Examples are killing of Shia Muslims, Sufi Muslims, Ahmedia Muslims, Christian, Jews abs other people.”

Please give a direct answer without beating the bush.

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Abu Abdullah/January 26, 2016

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Amarasiri I can only compare you to a ubiquitous cartoon despised and detested even by the very cartoonist that created you. Is buffoonery something that runs in your family?

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Abu Abdullah/January 25, 2016

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Bro Izeth it baffles me that a man like you, a Muslim, summons the courage to dish out absolute crap and ignorance sans any regret. You say “Another core tenet is that the veneration accorded to the shrines of saints and monuments in the holy places of Islam amounts to shirk, polytheism, which is the one unpardonable sin according to orthodox theologians. They should be killed and those monuments are destroyed” I have to ask you this. Are you a Muslim? Do you affirm the testimony that none has the right to be worshiped in truth except Allah? If you do how could you talk about according veneration to shrines even implicitly? Islam is not democracy in case your mind is cankered with a slew of muck. Read the Quran again, you’re right the only sin Allah does not forgive is associating partners with Him.

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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Abu Abdullah

“Read the Quran again, you’re right the only sin Allah does not forgive is associating partners with Him.”

Can you answer, Amarasiri’s Question, which so far any Wahhabi or its clone has failed to answer satisfactorily.

Amarasiri’s has a Question.

“What did Shaik Muhammad Abdul Wahab teach the Meccan and Medina Quran’s did NOT teach?. Call other Muslims Non-Muslims and Kill them, based on instructions from Iblis, Satan.Examples are killing of Shia Muslims, Sufi Muslims, Ahmedia Muslims, Christian, Jews abs other people.”

Please give a succinct and direct answer.

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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niyaz

For your information and Education. Be careful of Iblis, Satan. Quran warns 25 times in Iblis. Following Wahhabism and its clones will get you in Hell fire along with Iblis, on the day of Judgement.

Wahhabism

Flag of Saudi Arabia.
The Wahhabi movement was recently revived by the 18th century teacher Sheikh Muhammad ibn Abd-al-Wahhab in the Arabian peninsula, and was instrumental in the rise of the House of Saud to power. The terms “Wahhabi movement” and “Salafism” are often used interchangeably, although the word “Wahhabi” is specific for followers of Muhammad ibn Abd-al-Wahhab. The works of scholars like Ibn Taymiyya, Ibn al Qayyim and Muhammad bin Abdul Wahhab are used for religious guidance. Critics claim that Muslim Terrorism is the direct offshoot of the fanatical Islamic cult known as Wahabism, which runs Mecca and believes in the destruction of non Islamic cultures and is financed by Saudi Arabia.

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Jim softy/January 23, 2016

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What Mr Hussein says is Islam maturing. After that, it is only going down and not coming up.

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Jim softy/January 23, 2016

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Mr. Hussein:

Decline of Christianity started in 1700s in europe. Since then it went down. Now the church is expanding in Asia and expansion in Asia is their millinnial goal.

Islam is now about 1400 years. I think in another 300 years Islam also reaches the same situation.

On the other hand, Buddhism is among western physicists, mostly among quantum physicists. So, the pure buddhism may decline but buddhism won’t disappear from earth. that will not happen.

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Amarasiri/January 23, 2016

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Jim softy

“On the other hand, Buddhism is among western physicists, mostly among quantum physicists. So, the pure buddhism may decline but buddhism won’t disappear from earth. that will not happen. “On the other hand, Buddhism is among western physicists, mostly among quantum physicists. So, the pure buddhism may decline but buddhism won’t disappear from earth. that will not happen. “

Buddhism is held in High Esteem in the West with Alternate views. See Below. After Reviewing make your own conclusion.

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Jim softy/January 24, 2016

Even during Buddhs’s time, there were people who did not like it because the Truth made their stomachs starved.

What is you a christian hiding behind bashing both islam and buddhism.

Because, you never criticize christianity.

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Amarasiri/January 24, 2016

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Jim softy

“What is you a christian hiding behind bashing both islam and buddhism.”

“Because, you never criticize christianity.”

Please, give me a list of religions for Amarasiri to bash.

However, it has to be relevant to the write up. Otherwise, not being relevant CT will edit it out.

So why not recruit, new writers to write about the other religions to write Articles on. Then Amarasiri will bash them. Recently Amarasiri refused to be an angel for Gabanism, and suggested that they recruit from BBS, Ganasara Thero and the Ex-Cronies of MaRa.

Suggestions:

1. Hinduism

2. Judaism

3.. Zoroastrianism

4. Chinese Folk Religion

5. Roman Hods

6. Greek Gods – Zeus-ism

7. Taoism

8. Shinto

9. Sikism

10. Korean Shamanism

11. Caodaism

12. Baha’i Faith

13. Janism

14. Chendoism

14. Hoahaoism

16. Tenrism

16. Gabanism ( more recent)

17. Add yours to the list

.

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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Dear Jim softy,

“What is you a christian hiding behind bashing both islam and buddhism.”

” Because, you never criticize christianity.”

Amarasiri hears your cries of neglecting Christianity. Thank you for pointing it out. Given below are some “corrections”.

All religions were born out of ignorance and fear, and the many that survive to this day do so because they invest an elite few with power over their so called “flocks,” and so the inculcation of mythology to children is presented as “necessary,” and families and societies elevate this nonsense to something that “must be believed.”
The fact is: religion is unnecessary, and often harmful, and if more people were taught science, humanism, ethics, morality and understood it, we would live in a far better world.﻿

The title of this video hits the head of the nail. Unusual for YouTube. Yes, he DOES destroy Christianity. Then again, when you apply logic and reason to ANY religion, destruction of it is inevitable.﻿

This is what a Christian said:

“If anyone here is in the mood for a sampling of the dazzling extent of Christian gullibility and ignorance, just read the comments below. Wow, mass delusion indeed. This is the power of indoctrination, and it demonstrates just how vulnerable the fearful and the young are to psychological predation. I survived my mandatory Jesus-worshiping childhood indoctrination, but most do not, and I feel embarrassed for them.﻿”

Jim Softy, are you Happy now? Why are you jealous for other beliefs and Gods? Stick to yours and for heaven’s sake don’t kill them.

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Jim softy/January 24, 2016

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Sinhala_Man/January 24, 2016

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Dear Jim softy,

Is this what religion means to you? Gaining power over others by impressing them with powers of levitation etc.?

The three synoptic gospels (lives of Jesus) record that, before Jesus began preaching, the devil tempted him. The second temptation was to jump from the pinnacle of the Great Temple (of Solomon?) in Jerusalem when huge crowds had gathered; then all would be impressed and accept this new religion. This was rejected by Jesus.

There was a man whose life overlapped a little with ours – to a slight extent in my case: our teacher came in to our little Literature class and announced, with such great sorrow, that T.S. Eliot was dead, that we spontaneously observed a long, long, silence.

Anyway, Eliot wrote a very “modern” play with a title that makes it sound like a detective novel: “Murder in the Cathedral”. There Becket ( Archbishop of Canterbury in 1170 A.D.) tells the devil:

“The last temptation is the greatest treason;
To do the right deed for the wrong reason”.

Some people have been faulting us for giving Wikipedia references; I think that most of us are aware of the limitations of “Wikipedia Knowledge”. However I feel that it could be superior to the Encyclopedia Britannica because, those who know it is wrong, can edit entries. People are too lazy to do even that, and then criticise those who apologetically take short cuts. As for the evidence for religious myths and this showing off of levitation – well, it’s best not to get too insulting because humans get very emotional about these things – and then say that they are being very objective, and revealing truths that hold for all time.

For each of us religion tends to mean a different thing. For many it is an insurance policy – so that we get to heaven, and not to hell. If one contradicts such statements people who hold on to these beliefs get mad. My feeling is that throughout history (and we will soon be history ourselves) people dared not speak some of the things that they sensed. They came to religion in various ways, for various reasons. Tolstoy embraced Christianity towards the end of his life. He went back to the Greek gospels and translated them in to Russian (I read their English translation as a schoolboy). He left all the magic out: Virgin Birth, miracles of various sorts; I can’t now remember what he made of the Resurrection. The point he made for himself: all that was not important; just live your life! “Soma” can pray five times a day, if that helps her be better; let a Buddha statue help a person “fix his mind on the transcendental”. Is there a God who hears each of our prayers, nay, knows our every thought? Now what sort of computer would that be? None of this is important surely!

At least one has to say this much for the miracles Jesus is said to have performed according to the Gospels: they all had a purpose – almost always an altruistic but mundane one.

We have to ask ourselves two things:

1. Why do we need religion?

2. What is our concept of God? It is said that he made us; or did we make God?

We have evolved from an amoeba. How did that first amoeba come about? I just don’t know. There are many things that a creature of limited intelligence like me doesn’t know. Somebody among the comments on these IH articles had said that there is something in the make up of human beings that necessitates religion.

Immanuel Kant: said to be difficult to read even in German because his sentences are so long, and I have only dipped in to little bits in English. Yet his Categorical Imperative makes sense: You do good because it is good. No other reason. I’m sure Gautama Buddha would have agreed. I’m trying to find out, from IH what Islam says. Is IH blasphemously arrogating to himself the interpretation of all the truths of religion? Some devout and “orthodox” Muslims may think so. I don’t.

On the levels of spirituality and ethics can you really improve on Kant? I have summed it up very simply (I await correction by scholars of Kantian philosophy – I humbly acknowledge that it may be that I’m being simplistic).

More to the point, can those scholars of “Salafist Islam” – or whatever is the true Islam, please improve on Kant?

Of course this sort of philosophy is not “satisfying” – we have nobody to help us along. But the question is: “Are not most of these magical stories about religion merely myths?” And we then proceed to tear each other to bits. All reading this are “Sri Lankans” in the broadest sense. Are we going to continue tearing our country apart and subject our people to misery merely because each of us wants an inner feeling that “all is well”?

For Muslims, worldwide today, Islamaphobia is a problem. Let me, on behalf of all “infidels” apologise for making you feel rather insecure. In terms of my life, it was very recently that I decided that I should ferret out the telephone number of IH and just give him the satisfaction of hearing a tinny voice coming from the Alexander Graham Bell invention that what he has been writing is appreciated even in my remote village. In terms of this saga of articles, however, it was many moons ago. He acknowledged that apart from reading all the responses to his own articles, he cannot follow all that is happening, even in Sri Lanaka as recorded in articles in CT. However, let me draw the attention of all Muslims to the fact that there ARE Tamils who acknowledge the injustices suffered by them in the North.

A recent article says in passing:

“we have suicidally antagonised the Muslims and rudely dismantled the secular spirit of Jaffna University.”

Amarasiri (is the guy human? – How does he find the time to do all this? But then, he has given a rational explanation to us, in such a way that we could also explore). Amarasiri has been commenting on these articles, but most of us seem to focus on what is said about one or two little things, and ignore the rest.

May I suggest that Muslims and Sinhalese take a look at his writings, remembering this, however: many of the blogs appearing in his name represent installments of a 14 year old out-of-print book that he has given a soft copy of, to put out in weekly installments – or something like that. On the other hand, this article has been written very recently, about contemporary events. His writing of history has all the objectivity of Thucydides, and he will go down as one of the great chroniclers of the Sinhalese-Tamil wars. Some chapters ARE devoted to recording what amounted to Muslim genocide in the North. He is one of the chroniclers! There must be others. Rajan has attained something like nirvana; he is at peace with all around him. Another warning: he is NOT his brother, Jeevan, who was Vice-Chancellor of Jaffna University.

By training Rajan was something else; his PhD is in Mathematics – and that was all that he wanted to harmlessly teach, as he explains in this 12 minute Vimeo:

I think that we must be selective in our reading, but I think that we “moderates”, or those who humbly claim, like Abou ben Adhem, that we “love our fellow men”, must start linking up with others who would like to build here, in Lanka’s green and pleasant land, something that prepares us for “heaven”. I don’t think that there is some magical place somewhere up in the sky myself, but please:

Can’t we try to be just a little better than we are now?

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Native Vedda/January 24, 2016

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Jimmy the dimwit

“What do you say about the above youtube clip.”

What the youtube clip shows is he is a great Guru who has mastered the nature defying art through constant learning and meditation and you are a stupid Sinhala/Buddhist racist.

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Amarasiri/January 24, 2016

You can fool some of the people some of the time, but not All the People, all the time.

This should not fool anybody who knows basic physics. Then there are many, who do not know basic physics.

There was a time when I had really high hopes for cable channels like the Discovery Channel – I had hoped that they would be bastions that would promote sound science amidst a sea of sensationalistic cable TV docudrama and crapola (can you tell I don’t watch TV or cable?) Sadly, the more time that passes, the more and more I shake my head in shame for what has happened to the Discovery Channel. Case in point: the newest show on this “science” network, “The Supernaturalist”.

The overly credulous nature of this clip, and how Dan White – the supposed skeptic – plays it up as legitimate (honest!) is downright pathetic. There are some very basic questions to ask regarding a scenario like this:

1. Why isn’t the filming done in one continuous shot? Note all the breaks in the clip between the time the monk sits down and when he “levitates”.

2. Why does the monk have to sit where he does, in front of a wall full of curtains that can easily obscure a device which can lift him?

3. Why doesn’t Dan White ask the obvious question as outlined in #2 above, instead of standing there looking like an idiot with his mouth agape?

4. Why doesn’t Dan White, our token “skeptic”, take a moment to simply walk over to the side to make sure there isn’t a mechanical arm or similar contraption connecting the monk to something behind the curtain. On a related note, why isn’t this camera angle shown?

A simple application of Occam’s Razor is all that is necessary to slice through what is very clearly a bullshit display put together to get ratings. Folks, this is a big joke, and if anyone takes it seriously the only one’s laughing will be the executives at the Discovery Channel who are guffawing at having one over on gullible viewers. Fortunately, there is a silver lining: I have been inspired to incorporate this footage and a critical analysis of it into my upcoming talk at The Amaz!ng Meeting 9 in Las Vegas next week – it will make a good lesson for my students :)

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Sinhala_Man/January 23, 2016

IH is amazingly clear in his thinking. I have no desire to be unkind to you; But are you sure that it’s you who are right?

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Shoaib Akhtar/January 24, 2016

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Few point on differences of Wahabism and Sufism

1.
Wahabism-Calls mankind to the worship of Allah like that of sahaba
Sufism-Calls mankind to their shrines and mazar for blessing, even film actor/actress are allowed to go to these mazar to ask saint to make their film super-hit.

2.
Wahabism-Ask mankind to have imaan and amaal as of that of sahaba, not to do shirk and bidah
Sufism-Ask mankind to be like their peer, visit their mazar, do julush, do fatiha and niyaz without any fail, and do all types of shirk and bidah invented by their group as that has been being practiced for long time, so can’t be wrong..

3.
Wahabism-Allah ya madad
Sufism-Gaus ya madad, Ali ya madad

4.
Wahabism-Understand Quran and hadees as sahaba has understood
Sufism-Understand Quran and hadees as ulema of their group are explaining, as they are very learned and can never be wrong, even though they are interpreting Quran to prove celebration of maulid which sahaba never did in their lifetime.

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Amarasiri/January 24, 2016

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Shoaib Akhtar or Any Wahhabi or its Clone,

1. “Wahabism-Calls mankind to the worship of Allah like that of sahaba Sufism-Calls mankind to their shrines and mazar for blessing, even film actor/actress are allowed to go to these mazar to ask saint to make their film super-hit.”

Mankind was called upon to Worship God, Allah in the Bible and Quran. Thre was No need for an Abdul Wahhab or Wahhabism. The World did fine without Wahab and his Guru Ibn Taymiah, the Iblis, Satan followers who kill those who worship God, like Shia, Sufis and Ahmedia Allah to be killed.

Seeking a blessing is not the same as worship. When one seeks blessings from the priests or the parents, it s not worship. It is approval, respect.

Seeking blessings from Dead Saints, or people is also showing respect. It is the same as showing respect for Prophet Mohamed, seeking blessings, even though he is dead, can’t do anything. When you say Prophet Mohamed, Peace Be Upon Him, PBUH, it also means showing respect. Nowhere in the Quran it says, do not show respect. In fact, it also believers to show respect for the Parents.

So, this Wahhabism, is a White Flag operation by Iblis, Satan Devil to mess up the Muslims.

2. “Wahabism-Ask mankind to have imaan and amaal as of that of sahaba, not to do shirk and bidah Sufism-Ask mankind to be like their peer, visit their mazar, do julush, do fatiha and niyaz without any fail, and do all types of shirk and bidah invented by their group as that has been being practiced for long time, so can’t be wrong..”

Read Hamid Al Ghazali, 1,200 CE, the Great Islamic Scholar. He said that the Sufis had it righter., and love of God, from the heart.

The Wahhabis have Hate, that comes from Satan. Iblis, Devil

3. ‘ Wahabism-Allah ya madad Sufism-Gaus ya madad, Ali ya madad”

Read answer above for Item 2.

4. “Wahabism-Understand Quran and hadees as sahaba has understood Sufism-Understand Quran and hadees as ulema of their group are explaining, as they are very learned and can never be wrong, even though they are interpreting Quran to prove celebration of maulid which sahaba never did in their lifetime.”

Can you answer, Amarasiri’s Question, which so far any Wahhabi or its clone has failed to answer satisfactorily, so far.

Amarasiri’s has a Question.

“What did Shaik Muhammad Abdul Wahab teach the Meccan and Medina Quran’s did NOT teach?. Call other Muslims Non-Muslims and Kill them, based on instructions from Iblis, Satan.Examples are killing of Shia Muslims, Sufi Muslims, Ahmedia Muslims, Christian, Jews abs other people.”

Please give a direct answer without beating about the bush.

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Ceylonese/January 24, 2016

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Amarasiri

NO PEOPLE WITH INTELLECT WILL EVER WASTE THEIR TIME READING YOUR CUT AND PASTE THAT YOU SPEW IN THIS FORUM AS THEY ARE NEVER BACKED BY SOUND SCHOLARSHIP, ISLAMIC OR OTHERWISE, RATHER UNRELIABLE PROPAGANDA FROM UNAUTHENTIC SOURCES.

PERHAPS TROLLS WILL FIND THEIR GRAVE ETERNALLY PAINFUL.

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 24, 2016

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I AGREE WITH YOU FELLOW CEYLONESE. I DID NOT READ YOUR COMMENT BUT I KNOW THAT IT IS GENUINE, HONEST AND TRUE. I DID NOT READ IT BECAUSE I DO NOT LIKE CAPITALIZED TEXT. IT SOMEHOW PUTS ME OFF.

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Maghribi/January 24, 2016

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Copy Paste is the methodology of the extremist group of Daesh.

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Amarasiri/January 26, 2016

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Maghribi

“Copy Paste is the methodology of the extremist group of Daesh”

Please stick to the issues raised, arguments forwarded and not be distracted.

Is the Sun going around the Sun as the Ancients and the Church claimed, as per Joshua in the Bible?

Amarasiri’s has a Question.

“What did Shaik Muhammad Abdul Wahab teach the Meccan and Medina Quran’s did NOT teach?. Call other Muslims Non-Muslims and Kill them, based on instructions from Iblis, Satan.Examples are killing of Shia Muslims, Sufi Muslims, Ahmedia Muslims, Christian, Jews abs other people.”

Please give a direct answer without beating about the bush and being distracted.

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Amarasiri/January 24, 2016

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Ceylonese

This was Amarasiri’s original Question that has been asked and the Iblis-Following Wahhabis have so far Refused to answer. Is that an IQ problem? Can’t reason, can’t think, just recite problem of the Wahhabies?

Islam was doing fine for 600 years until Ibn Taymiah appeared, as a follower of Iblis-Satan 600 years after Prophet Mohamed.

Islam was doing fine for 1,300 years until Abdul Wahab appeared, as a follower of Iblis-Satan 1,200 years after Prophet Mohamed.

Why can’t you just answer honestly.

Is the Sun going around the Sun or is it the Earth that rotates on its own axis and goes around the Sun. 25% of the Americans , 34% of the Europeans and probably 50% of the sri Lankans ans Saudi Arabians believe in the former.

Amarasiri’s has a Question.

“What did Shaik Muhammad Abdul Wahab teach the Meccan and Medina Quran’s did NOT teach?. Call other Muslims Non-Muslims and Kill them, based on instructions from Iblis, Satan.Examples are killing of Shia Muslims, Sufi Muslims, Ahmedia Muslims, Christian, Jews abs other people.”

Please give a direct answer without beating about the bush.

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J.Deane/January 25, 2016

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>

The answer to Amarasiris’ perennial question.
“What did Shaik Muhammad Abdul Wahab teach the Meccan and Medina Quran’s did NOT teach?. Call other Muslims Non-Muslims and Kill them, based on instructions from Iblis, Satan.Examples are killing of Shia Muslims, Sufi Muslims, Ahmedia Muslims, Christian, Jews abs other people.”

Myth – Calling Muslims kaffir based on ignorance and fighting with them

A charge on the Shaikh is that he considered all men of the Qibla Kafirs and he regarded it permissible to engage in wars with the Muslims.

Shaikh Abdul Wahhab (RH) said:

“And we do not declare them infidels who on account of ignorance and lack of guidance worship those idols which are built on the graves of (Shaikh) Abdul Qadir, Ahmad Badwi, and other elders like them, then how can we call them infidels who are not guilty of committing the sin of polytheism or did not come to us by migration and have not been guilty of committing any kufr.”

On the issue of those who have abandoned worship and the issue of grave worshippers:
Ahmad bin Nasir bin Usman Muammari Najdi (disciple of Abdul Wahhab) said before the ulema of the Haram Sharif in 1211:

“The Shaikh did takfir of only those idolators who asked for boons from the saints and the virtuous, those who committed shirk and polytheism even after receiving full proof and clarification about the way of God. And moreover they were the first to initiate the war. It was then that the Shaikh battled with them and shed their blood. Under such circumstances the Quran, the sunnah and the ijma are all in his support.”

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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J.Deane

Thank you for answering Amarasiri’s Question. However, Amarasiri respectfully disagrees with your answer, because there is no support in the Quran for the Killings by the Wahhabis and their clones. May be there is support in the Holy Book of Iblis-Satan written by Ibn Taymiah and Abdul Wahab. Tou need to cite this reference, if it is there.

1.“Myth – Calling Muslims kaffir based on ignorance and fighting with them”

This is historical Fact, not Myth. The non-Wahhabi Muslims were told to convert 3-times to Wahhabism, and if not converted killed.

This “Right” to Kill other Muslims, who say La Illa Ha Illah, There is no God, but God, was not given in the Quran.

It was given by Iblis, Satan to Abdul Wahhab, the Iblis-Wahhabi.

2. “On the issue of those who have abandoned worship and the issue of grave worshipers: Ahmad bin Nasir bin Usman Muammari Najdi (disciple of Abdul Wahhab) said before the ulema of the Haram Sharif in 1211: “

They are Najdi, where the Satan, Iblis is supposed to come.

3. Hadith of Najd
The Hadith of Najd is a famous hadith with several chains of narration about three geographical locations. While all Sunni Muslims accept the group of hadith as authentic, the exact location of the area referred to as “Najd” is disputed.

So, we have the Iblis, Satan Trickster who has misled Abdul Wahhab and the Clones to Kill Muslims so thatr they will end up in Hell along with Iblis, as per Islamic Theology.

The Iblis argument, is that the Reverence of these Muslims to their parents, and earlier teachers, including Prophet Mohammed, Peace Be Upon him, is Shirk, when it is not, and use this excuse to disrupt the Muslims Worshiping God, Allah.

4. If this is shirk, All Muslims Practice Shirk, then All Muslims who show Reverence to Prophet Mohamed, Prophet Isa (Jesus) are all practicing Shirk, because he is dead, and cannot do anything.

Iblis Satan has really Fooled the Wahhabis and their Clones.

Fortunately, only Muslims with Low IQ, at the bottom of the scale, join the Iblis Wahhabi and their clones. This is the Case in Saudi Arabia and other places.

Everybody knows, Satan ,Iblis is trickster, except the Wahhabis and their clones.

The angels, being creatures of pure reason without lower animal desires, do not sin. When God created Adam, he commanded all the angels and Iblis (whose high rank allowed him to worship Allah with the angels) to prostrate to Adam. All the angels did so, but Iblis refused, and was deprived of Allah’s Mercy because of his arrogant disobedience. For this God cast him out of Jannah (paradise), and intended to punish him. Iblis begged God to delay the punishment until Yawm al-Qiyāmah (Last Judgment), and his request was granted

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J.Deane/January 26, 2016

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“It is sufficient to consider a man a liar when he narrates everything that he hears.” [Sahîh Muslim]

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Amarasiri/January 26, 2016

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J.Deane,

“It is sufficient to consider a man a liar when he narrates everything that he hears.” [Sahîh Muslim] “

Yes. That is what the Iblis-Following Wahhabis do. They narrate everything Ibn Taymiah says, and everything Abdul Wahhab, says, and go to Karabala to Kill Muslims, based on Instructions from Iblis.

Now that job is taken over by the Other Wahhabies and their clones such as ISIS, Salafis, Towheed, Najdis etc.

Amarasiri’s has a Question. Still not answered.

“What did Shaik Muhammad Abdul Wahab teach the Meccan and Medina Quran’s did NOT teach?. Call other Muslims Non-Muslims and Kill them, based on instructions from Iblis, Satan.Examples are killing of Shia Muslims, Sufi Muslims, Ahmedia Muslims, Christian, Jews abs other people.”

The Wahhabi movement was recently revived by the 18th century teacher Sheikh Muhammad ibn Abd-al-Wahhab in the Arabian peninsula, and was instrumental in the rise of the House of Saud to power. The terms “Wahhabi movement” and “Salafism” are often used interchangeably, although the word “Wahhabi” is specific for followers of Muhammad ibn Abd-al-Wahhab. The works of scholars like Ibn Taymiyya, Ibn al Qayyim and Muhammad bin Abdul Wahhab are used for religious guidance. Critics claim that Muslim Terrorism is the direct offshoot of the fanatical Islamic cult known as Wahabism, which runs Mecca and believes in the destruction of non Islamic cultures and is financed by Saudi Arabia.

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J.Deane/January 26, 2016

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I Say Sheik Muhammad said what I quoted. Amarasiri says NO NO NO Wikipedia says,that so and so said what so and so said, that Sheik Muhammad said. So understand dear Amarasiri what state of confusion Iblis, Satan, Lucifer and Mara has trapped you in.
Amarasiri says

quote..”The Wahhabi movement was recently revived by the 18th century teacher Sheikh Muhammad ibn Abd-al-Wahhab in the Arabian peninsula, and was instrumental in the rise of the House of Saud”. Unquote

What type of chicanery is this? one may ask! The word Wahabism connotes its origin from Wahab. How can Amarasiri say quote..“the Wahabbi movement was revived by the 18th century teacher Sheikh Muhammad ibn Abd-al-Wahhab….unquote”. This is a perfect case of CONFUSION being worst CONFOUNDED by Iblis himself, perhaps!
I think the honest reader can gauge who the real IBLIS, SATAN and I am not willing to waste my time with charlatans. I prefer to stick to the advice Stay away from arguments even if the truth is on your side, so that you can end a pointless argument.

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Amarasiri/January 26, 2016

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J.Deane

Wahhabism, is not even Islam. It is Iblism, Satanism.

iSIS is Wahhabis of the 21st Century. Wahhabism was from the 19th Century.

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Amarasiri/January 26, 2016

RE: The Two Difficulties In Countering Wahabism In Sri Lanka and Saudi Arabia

Wahhabism, is not even Islam. It is Iblism, Satanism.

Save Yourself from Hell Fire. Give up your Wahhanism and Iblism.

Wahhabis – Salafis – Sheik Imran Hosein

Wahhabism is a movement that was first founded by the Muhammad Bin Abdul Wahhab with a British Spy Hampher. At present days, they do not like the term Wahhabi. That is why, they are now giving their identity as Salafi. In Indian Sub continent, they are also known as Ahle Hadith or Gayre Mukkallid. But their one of the most preferable scholar Bin Baz use the term ‘WAHHABIYAH’.

There are some books which are telling you the truth about this movement.
1) Book “CONFESSIONS of A BRITISH SPY and British Enmity Against Islam” where the British spy tell how he brainwashed Muhammad Bin Abdul Wahhab

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

“NO PEOPLE WITH INTELLECT WILL EVER WASTE THEIR TIME READING YOUR CUT AND PASTE THAT YOU SPEW IN”

Why are the Iblis, Satan Following Wahhabies, Their clones and agents afraid to clearly articulate their Iblis-Satan-Wahhabi Ideology, that came to Islam 250 years ago.

Islam did fine without Washabism for 1200 years, and still does fine without Wahhabism.

This is historical and circumstantial proof that Wahhabism and its Clone Versions are NOT NEEDED for Islam or For Muslims.

Then who beeds it? The Iblis, the Satan, The Devil.

Why? Because on the Day of Judgement, the Iblis, Satan, Devil will be in Hell Fire, as per Islamic Theology.

So, Iblis has mislead, Ibn Taymiah, Abdul Wahab and others to create doubt and havoc among the Muslims.

Have you heard about the Satanic verses, during Prophet Mohamed’s(Peace Be Upon Him) time?

The angels, being creatures of pure reason without lower animal desires, do not sin. When God created Adam, he commanded all the angels and Iblis (whose high rank allowed him to worship Allah with the angels) to prostrate to Adam.[1] All the angels did so, but Iblis refused, and was deprived of Allah’s Mercy because of his arrogant disobedience.[13] For this God cast him out of Jannah (paradise), and intended to punish him. Iblis begged God to delay the punishment until Yawm al-Qiyāmah (Last Judgment), and his request was granted.

Have ye thought upon al-Lat and al-Uzza
And Manat, the third, the other? (53:19,20)

These are the exalted cranes (intermediaries)
Whose intercession is to be hoped for.

Are yours the males and His the females?
That indeed were an unfair division! (53:21,22)

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Maghribi/January 24, 2016

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Attention Muslims

Wahabi is a tribe in Arabia just like many of others scattered around the Arabian peninsula. Please don’t get duped by the deviant writer’s. Muslims do not give allegiance to a tribe rather a practicing Muslim is the one who follows the Noble Quran and the authentic sunnah of our beloved Prophet Muhammed (pbuh).

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 24, 2016

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Muslims, Why all this fuss?

Izeth, I know that you will not answer the following question. You are just going to ignore it. The reason of course is reason or more correctly the lack of reason. No reasonable reasoning or logical logic can answer it. That is why you will keep mum.

As Marwan has so precisely and concisely pointed out, “It is a case of complete submission to the one and true God – Allah, and accepting Prophet Muhammed (Sal.) as His last and final Messenger.” – Period.

What a great religion Islam is! As far as I know, only one religion is simpler and hence greater than Islam: Gabanism, which says only 4 words. Do I have to spell those words again. I hope not. Try to remember them OK.

Sorry for the diversion in to Gabanism. I have this annoying habit of diverting frequently. Coming back to our subject, basically, if that is all that Islam is expecting from its adherents, why do you Muslims go around killing each other. Cannot you understand a few simple sentences. I can understand why you guys want to stab us. But why the fellow Muslims?

Why do you need Tom, Dick and Harrys or even Izeth, Raed and Rodrigo to interpret them? Why do you need any interpretations at all? Are all of you at the same IQ level as Jehan? Do you guys need an interpreter when your mother says “Dinner is ready. Come and eat”?

Here is a song that I wrote on Islam, my tribute to the true Muslims like Raed.

Islam is so simple – Hence it is so great – Believe it
Don’t try to interpret – Don’t try to analyze – Believe it
Don’t try to write – Don’t try to speak – Believe itDon’t try to kill – don’t try to stab – Don’t fight at all – Believe it

It is based on the song sung by Eliza Doolittle in My Fair Lady, when Freddie tries to woo her with a lot of flowery words that make Eliza say ‘yuk’. What she wants from Freddie is just for him grab her and give her a long and passionate KISS . The original words in the last line are “Don’t talk at all – Love me!” but Freddie low on IQ, just like you guys, doesn’t get it.

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Amarasiri/January 24, 2016

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EDWIN RODRIGO

“Coming back to our subject, basically, if that is all that Islam is expecting from its adherents, why do you Muslims go around killing each other. Cannot you understand a few simple sentences. I can understand why you guys want to stab us. But why the fellow Muslims?”

Interesting Question why the Iblis-following Wahhabi won’t answer.

There are Muslims who follow Allah.

Then there are Wahhabis, who follow Iblis, Satan.

The Wahhaabi Iblis, Wahhabi-Satanis have called themselves Muslim after around 1,750 CE, and caused this confusion. The Wahhabis are the Satanis who kill mostly other Muslims. The Satan, who has been released and freedom to mess things up until the day of Judgement, is behind it.

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Moderate man/January 24, 2016

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Edwin Rodrigo

Here is the answer for your question-

Total number of death in WW1-38 Million
Total number of death in WW2- 80 million
Iraq-450,000 deaths
Afghanistan – 120,000 deaths
Syria -250,000-deaths.

This is without number of wounded and collateral destruction

Now use your lop sided brain to find out who is responsible for all these deaths, then you will find the answer for your question.

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 24, 2016

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Immoderate men perhaps?

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Mutaween Watcher/January 24, 2016

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السلام عليكم‎

Izeth Hussain is hereby reminded that the Wahabi are the custodians of Al Mecca and Al Medina,

Izeth Hussain is also reminded that when Aramco will be IPO’ed soon to be the biggest thing the workd has ever seen he is barred from buying any shares.

Izeth Hussain is advised to continue the Harami task of hiding Sri Lankan muslims are in fact Eelam Tamils and that he need not fear the Sinhalese wrath and slag off his own religion like this

Mutaween Watch

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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Mutaween Watcher

“Izeth Hussain is hereby reminded that the Wahabi are the custodians of Al Mecca and Al Medina, “

Thre was Islam for 1300 years before the Iblis-Following Wahhabi’s and their clones appeared.

Muslims did not need Iblis Following Wahhabis and its Clones to be Muslims and Follow Islam. Almost all of them went to heaven except a few very undesirables who carried out Iblis work.

Then Iblis got Wahhabi to do his work. to get the Muslims to Hell.

Traditional Sunni Sufis who oppose the movement classify it as movement of only thirty years old, and as the modern outgrowth of a two-century old heresy spawned by a scholar of the Najd area in the Eastern part of the Arabian peninsula by the name of Muhammad ibn `Abd al- Wahhab. Most of the violent terrorist groups come from the Salafi movement and their sub groups. In recent years, the Salafi doctrine has often been correlated with the jihad of terrorist organizations such as Al Qaeda and those groups in favor of killing innocent civilians.

They are called Wahhabi and their clones.

The Quran Warns against Iblis over 25 times.

Iblis was proud and considered himself superior to Adam, since Adam was made from clay and Iblis from smokeless fire. For this act of disobedience, God cursed him to Jahannam (Hell/Purgatory) for eternity, but gave him respite until the Day of Judgment, after Iblis requested it. Iblis obtained permission from God and vowed that he would use this time to lead all men and women astray to Hell. In this way, he would prove humanity’s inferiority, and justify his act of defiance. For refusing to abide by the will of God, Iblis was cast out of Heaven, and thereafter he was called “Shaytan” (Satan).

Give up your Wahhabism, and avoid getting to the Hell Fire with the Satan, Iblis as per Islamic Theology.

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The Professional/January 24, 2016

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Archaeological excavations now reveal that Buddhism had been in Sri Lanka before the arrival of Arhath Mahinda. King Devanampiyatissa embracing Buddhism and providing state patronage for propagating it make Buddhism as the only religion or philosophy established with state patronage 2600 years ago. All other religions have been established forcibly on this land. Gradual social integration has resulted in Kovils, Mosques and Churches being built in areas, which were predominantly settlements of Sinhala Buddhists. History of coastal region of South-Eastern Sri Lanka is the best case in point. History gives the right to majority of Sri Lankans to ask for making Buddhism the state religion.

However, that will not answer the issue of the spread of Wahabism in Sri Lanka. Western Pandits who at the moment are trying their best to eradicate religious fundamentalism, while swearing on Bible before commencing governance, want secular constitutions in countries with internal conflicts. If we are to find a home grown solution with ethnic and religious harmony we have to go for an inclusive economic, social, environmental and physical development without strings of religion and language attached. In such an environment, law enforcement over fundamentalists and fundamentalism will be easier.

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Native Vedda/January 24, 2016

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The Professional

“King Devanampiyatissa embracing Buddhism and providing state patronage for propagating it make Buddhism as the only religion or philosophy established with state patronage 2600 years ago.”

What does state patronage mean?

The king orders and the people follow the orders.

Buddha wasn’t around 2600 years ago and Tissa was a later king.

According to Prof Sunil Ariaratne Buddhism came to this island from South India. Please contact him if you need more details.

How come many earlier kings were known as Siva and not Jamis Muttu Banda?

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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The Professional

Native Veddah Says:

“According to Prof Sunil Ariaratne Buddhism came to this island from South India. Please contact him if you need more details.”

Tamils and Sinhala people have embraced Buddhism almost at the same time, says “Buddhism in Tamil Nadu” a research article published by Institute of Asian Studies. It says Mahinda Thero, son of Asoka, passed through South India visiting Kanchipuram, Kavekripoom Pattinam,, Nagapattinam, Pandia kingdom, Madurai, Pothigai Hills, and spreading the religion before reaching Sri Lanka.

He said there is similiarity among the cave temples found in Thiruparankundram, Kazhugu Malai, Marudamalai, Anamalai and Veerkaimani in Madurai and Tirunelvel districts and the caves of Sri Lanka “Mihindukuhava” where Mihinda Thero was believed to have lived.

“If we believe Mihinda Thero and his followers went through Tamil Nadu to reach Sri Lanka, then we have to accept that the ‘Tamil Buddhist’ has emerged before ‘Sinhala Buddhist’,” the professor said.

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 24, 2016

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Professional, I agree with most of the things you have said. It is a good thing that Allah waited for Buddhism to settle down in SL and other Buddhist countries before sending his favorite Prophet to the world. If he came a few hundred years earlier, then we would have had no Buddhism anywhere in the world. If you do not agree with me, just look at what happened to countries like, Afghanistan, Indonesia and so on.

It was nicely timed by Allah to stop the Jews and Christians who at that time were equally bad, nay much worse than, Islam is now. See how Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) gave a taste of their medicine to those scoundrels. He fought 65 wars and won all of them. That is a miraculous achievement that no one before or after has even come close to.

Similarly Allah does not want the so called ‘Muslims’, some of whom are a disgrace to the real meaning of the word Muslim, to do things unchecked. He is fine tuning things, tweaking a dial here, adjusting set point there. Mark my word, he knows what he is doing. It has to be like that, otherwise he would not be Allah after all.

Gaban Atha has told me many things about Allah and Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) that no one else knows about. Unfortunately, all that is highly Classified and marked as ‘For Edwin’s Eyes Only’. That is why I cannot release it to the press. But gradually as they are declassified by Allah, I will reveal them. All in good time my friends – all in good time.

Just to give you guys a sneak preview of things, why do you think Gaban Atha is on an inspection tour of the Universe? Allah and Gaban Atha understand each other like Amarasiri and Edwin do. We disagree on many things but see eye to eye on many others. We sort of fill up the gaps that the other one leaves. That is what team work is all about and Allah and GA are a heavenly version of such a team, that we cannot comprehend fully with our limited intellects.

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TheHorsesFoot/January 24, 2016

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Assalamu alaikum sir,

Thank you for the article.

With regards to your statement:
“My second proposal concerned the two verses in the Koran according to which Jews, Christians, and Sabians who believe in the one true God and lead virtuous lives will go to heaven”

This judgment would be independent of the religion one professes to follow. Therefore to believe in any of the Abrahamic religions would not be a prerequisite to enter paradise.

By the same logic those whom the Quran defines as ‘unbelievers’ (kafir) are not necessarily those who profess to not be Muslim or a person of the book. An unbeliever is an individual who, having come to know and understand with certainty God’s existence, still rejects the following of Abrahamic religion and practices evil and causes harm. This would be a kafir in the truest sense.

Several parables in the Quran exist demonstrating how reward and punishment is in proportion to the enlightenment of the individual. For e.g – the story of the viands from paradise in Surah Maidah (5:112 to 115)

Another example is the story of Fir’oun (Pharoah), wherein he professes belief in the one true God, when his death was imminent, however this was not accepted (Chapter 10, verse 90 and 91).

For these reasons I would rather prefer that Muslims be taught that to enter paradise it is more important to do what is good and reject what is bad, and stand up for justice under whatever circumstances, and to try to purify in soul. It is important that Muslims understand that the mere label of what religion one professes to follow is not a criteria upon which judgment will be done.

The Quran then distills itself nicely to its fundamental purposes – provide guidance and relief (to those virtuous individuals who seek such things) and a best individual and social practice for those who become believers in the one true God.

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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TheHorsesFoot

“The Quran then distills itself nicely to its fundamental purposes – provide guidance and relief (to those virtuous individuals who seek such things) and a best individual and social practice for those who become believers in the one true God.”

For 1,200 years Muslims were practicing Islam, before the Iblis-inspired Wahhabi Wahhab appeared in the scene in 1750s. Wahhab was tricked by the Iblis, Devil to go an kill the Muslims, by using varying excuses.

Iblis has been very successful in converting the Wahhabies and their clones.

The teachings of the Abd Al-Wahhab are more often referred to by adherents as Salafi, that is, “following the forefathers of Islam.” This branch of Islam is often referred to by others as “Wahhabi,” a term that many adherents to this tradition do not use. Members of this form of Islam call themselves Muwahhidun (“Unitarians”, or “unifiers of Islamic practice. Salafism is a puritanical and legalistic Islamic movement and is the dominant creed in Saudi Arabia. The Salafi sect is a group who believe themselves the only correct interpreters of the Koran, consider moderate Muslims to be infidels, seek to convert all Muslims to their way of thinking and to insure that its own fundamentalist version of Islam will dominate the world.

Traditional Sunni Sufis who oppose the movement classify it as movement of only thirty years old, and as the modern outgrowth of a two-century old heresy spawned by a scholar of the Najd area in the Eastern part of the Arabian peninsula by the name of Muhammad ibn `Abd al- Wahhab. Most of the violent terrorist groups come from the Salafi movement and their sub groups. In recent years, the Salafi doctrine has often been correlated with the jihad of terrorist organizations such as Al Qaeda and those groups in favor of killing innocent civilians.

This is what the Iblis Followers Wahhabis and their clones do. Kill those who follow God as per instructions from Iblis, Satan.

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jehan/January 25, 2016

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Death is certain. If you look at average age people die. Say 100 years people will live, then die. If here-after is infinite years of pleasure or punishment.
the number of years lived on earth is 100/infinity = 0
Think what will happen if a person is punished in hell for infinte years for 100 years or less of disbelief. Allah is certain. Idol worship will lead to hell fire, infinite punishment .
Beleive in one Allah and Prophet Mohammed is his messenger.
No religion is accepted other than Islam. Come and learn Islam, you will be successfull in this life and hereafter.All other isms be it buddihism,hinduism lead to hell

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 25, 2016

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[Edited out]

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Sinhala_Man/January 25, 2016

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So all that you have done is invest in an insurance policy!

Good for you, I will forego it.

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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Sinhala_Man

“So all that you have done is invest in an insurance policy!”

Caveat Emptor. Buyer Beware.

Satan, Iblis is a trickster. All the Wahhabis and their clomes will be in Hell with Iblis, Satan as per Islamic Theology.

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TheHorsesFoot/January 25, 2016

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@Jehan,

Punishment will only be meted out in proportion to the evil done. Punishment is not for eternity.

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Amarasiri/January 27, 2016

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TheHorsesFoot

“Punishment will only be meted out in proportion to the evil done. Punishment is not for eternity. “

You you have a Table or Handbook of Punishments for Offenses.

It will be very useful for believers, so that they know the punishment they are expected to get.

Example: All those who follow the Iblis-Satan Wahhabis and their clones, on the Day of Judgement, will be sent to Hell Fire along with Iblis-Satan.

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 25, 2016

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Religion and Infinity

My first reaction was to discount Jehan’s comment as the blabbering of an imbecile. But when CT edited out my first comment I started to look at it from a different point of view. What I found is that the use of infinity, as Jehan has done, opens up many doors to philosophy and mathematics but in a way that he has least expected.

AS Amarasiri said on January 23, 2016 at 9:37 pm, “Einstein: there are only two infinite things, the universe and human stupidity, and Einstein wasn’t sure about the universe”. Jehan’s infinity must be the one that Eistein was sure about. Not only Jehan but all those who believe in monotheistic or atheistic religions are partners of that infinity of stupidity.

Jehan says, “Think what will happen if a person is punished in hell for infinite years for 100 years or less of disbelief. Allah is certain. Idol worship will lead to hell fire, infinite punishment…

the number of years lived on earth is 100/infinity = 0 “.

So what if someone is a believer and goes to heaven? Still we get the same formula: 100/infinity. The only difference is, one is positive infinity and the other negative infinity. Strictly speaking, we cannot divide a number by infinity, because infinity is only a concept in our mind and not a number. What we can do is to proceed as follows, in a rigorously mathematical way.

Let x = the number of years someone lives.
Let y = the number of years he is committed to hell or heaven. y is a very large number. If one believes in Allah then y is positive.
If y is negative. Either way y is a large number.

We divide x/y and get a number z = x/y. z is the index of pleasure (or pain) of the person concerned. We can also have a convention, where if z is positive the person will be in heaven and vice versa.

Now we go on increasing y. In mathematics this is called make y tend to infinity. When we do that, z becomes smaller and smaller (i.e.) As Y tends to infinity z tends to zero. The only difference is that the believer will approach zero from positive side while the non believer will do so from negative side.

The important thing here is to understand, that there the practical difference between the believer and the infidel becomes vanishingly small as y increases to very very large values. The difference can be made as small as one wants by making y large enough. But it can be never zero. Jehan may say triumphantly, “That is what I said.”

But wait a minute now, The believer leads a pious life foregoing the pleasures of life, always afraid of the wrath of Allah and the knowledge that you are under surveillance by Allah 24/7. Meanwhile the infidel does not care about Allah, Satan, Iblis or Pabilis or anybody else and has great fun all his life. If I were basing my life decisions on Jehan’s formula I would prefer 1000 times to be the infidel.

Who knows? One day Jehan may become as famous as Einstein for discovering the formula (z = x/y), which I have the pleasure (or the pain of jealousy) of naming as Jehan’s formula.

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Amarasiri/January 26, 2016

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EDWIN RODRIGO and Jehan,

“Who knows? One day Jehan may become as famous as Einstein for discovering the formula (z = x/y), which I have the pleasure (or the pain of jealousy) of naming as Jehan’s formula.”

You two are off the track here.

The Correct way to look at is is like Pascal’s Wager.

Pascal’s Wager is an argument in apologetic philosophy devised by the seventeenth-century French philosopher, mathematician and physicist Blaise Pascal (1623–62). It posits that humans all bet with their lives either that God exists or that he does not. Based on the assumption that the stakes are infinite if God exists and that there is at least a small probability that God in fact exists, Pascal argues that a rational person should live as though God exists and seek to believe in God. If God does not actually exist, such a person will have only a finite loss (some pleasures, luxury, etc.), whereas they stand to receive infinite gains (as represented by eternity in Heaven) and avoid infinite losses (eternity in Hell).

Pascal’s Wager was based on the idea of the Christian God, though similar arguments have occurred in other religious traditions. The original wager was set out in section 233 of Pascal’s posthumously published Pensées (“Thoughts”). These previously unpublished notes were assembled to form an incomplete treatise on Christian apologetics.

Historically, Pascal’s Wager was groundbreaking because it charted new territory in probability theory, marked the first formal use of decision theory, and anticipated future philosophies such as existentialism, pragmatism and voluntarism.

The Wager
The Wager uses the following logic (excerpts from Pensées, part III, §233):

1. God is, or God is not. Reason cannot decide between the two alternatives.

2. A Game is being played… where heads or tails will turn up.

3. You must wager (it is not optional).

4. Let us weigh the gain and the loss in wagering that God is. Let us estimate these two chances. If you gain, you gain all; if you lose, you lose nothing.

5. Wager, then, without hesitation that He is. (…) There is here an infinity of an infinitely happy life to gain, a chance of gain against a finite number of chances of loss, and what you stake is finite. And so our proposition is of infinite force, when there is the finite to stake in a game where there are equal risks of gain and of loss, and the infinite to gain.

6. But some cannot believe. They should then ‘at least learn your inability to believe…’ and ‘Endeavour then to convince’ themselves.

Pascal asks the reader to analyze mankind’s position, where our actions can be enormously consequential but our understanding of those consequences is flawed. While we can discern a great deal through reason, we are ultimately forced to gamble. Pascal cites a number of distinct areas of uncertainty in human life:

We understand nothing of the works of God unless we take it as a principle that He wishes to blind some and to enlighten others.

Uncertainty in skepticism. It is not certain that everything is uncertain.

Pascal describes humanity as a finite being trapped within an incomprehensible infinity, briefly thrust into being from non-being, with no explanation of “Why?” or “What?” or “How?” On Pascal’s view, human finitude constrains our ability to reliably achieve truth.

Given that reason alone cannot determine whether God exists, Pascal concludes that this question functions like a coin toss. However, even if we do not know the outcome of this coin toss, we must base our actions on some expectation about the outcome. We must decide whether to live as though God exists, or whether to live as though God does not exist, even though we may be mistaken in either case.

In Pascal’s assessment, participation in this wager is not optional. Merely by existing in a state of uncertainty, we are forced to choose between the available courses of action for practical purposes.

Is the Schrodinger Cat dead or alive? Will the Schrodinger cat end up in Heaven or Hell? What about the Wahhabies and their clones? They may be following Iblis, Satan, called the Amarasiri-Hypothesis, because they kill Muslims who follow God, and on the day of Judgement, Iblis , Satan will be in Hell Fire along with its followers.

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 26, 2016

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Probability & God

Amarasiri,

“If God does not actually exist, such a person will have only a finite loss (some pleasures, luxury, etc.), whereas they stand to receive infinite gains (as represented by eternity in Heaven) and avoid infinite losses (eternity in Hell).”

If Amarasiri wants to apply such ideas to probability, Amarasiri has to do it properly. Pascal and Amarasiri are not on the right path of probability here. Let me do it right.

There is are many other reasons why assuming God does not exist is the most sensible thing to do. Supposing I come out with these ideas,

You will go to eternal hell if you do not believe all of the following:

1) Gaban Atha is God and creator of the universe.

2) There is a pot orbiting newly found Planet 9 and God is inside that. Mail order a replica from Edwin for only Rs 500. You will become a millionaire in 6 months. (Terms & Conditions Apply.

3) Edwin is the Gaban’s universal maintenance engineer. Worship him 3 times a day if you want things to run smoothly.

4) Amarasiri is the Satan and he should be killed on sight.

5) Pabilis is Iblis. Don’t eat anything he prepares, because he spits in to the pot.

I can think of such reasons ad infinitum, which in my opinion have a probability of being true the same as the Allah hypothesis.

Take your choice.

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 26, 2016

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God or Satan?

Pascal’s wager is a sugar coated pill and attempts to get in to the brains of low IQ people hiding inside a strong looking Trojan Horse of logic. It looks like Amarasiri has fallen for it. It also solves a mystery for me, namely, why as Amarasisi says, the IQ of Sri Lankans is so low.

Let us analyze Pascal’s wager mathematically. First we restate his narrative in a formal mathematical format as follows:

Hypothesis (H) Statement: God exists.

Choices: A person has 2 choices, namely

C-1: Accept H as TRUE.

C-2: Reject H as FALSE.

Pascal now tries to be reasonable with those who have not bought his story and talks about probabilities.

p1: Probability that H is TRUE (may be small). The ‘may be’ here is the key word. It is one of the marketing lines.

p2: Probability that H is FALSE (could be large). He does not want to leave any room for criticism and acknowledges that this could be high at least for arguments sake. Of course, there is no other way for Pascal. If he says p1 may be small p2 has to be high because (p1 + p2) = 1.

Now Pascal launches his advertising campaign. Consider the rewards and penalties.

R1: If C-1 is the choice and H is TRUE then the reward R-1 is immense. (i.e.) R1 is infinite.

P1: If C-2 is the choice and H is FALSE then you lose nothing. (i.e.) penalty P1=0 (almost).

R2: If C-1 is the choice and H is FALSE then the reward R2 is nothing. (i.e.) R2=0 (almost).

P2: If C-2 is the choice and H is TRUE then the penalty P2 is immense (i.e.) P2 is infinite.

That is why he says, If you gain, you gain all; if you lose, you lose nothing. It is similar to buying a lottery. The cost is low but reward is huge.

So why don’t we accept it and live as if God exists?

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The problem is that someone like Edwin can bring an alternative hypothesis.

H = Following Satan is not a good thing.

Now the new situation is:

R1: If C-1 is the choice and H is TRUE then the reward R-1 is nothing. (i.e.) R1 =0.

P1: If C-2 is the choice and H is FALSE (Following Satan is a good thing) then you lose everything. (i.e.) penalty P1 is infinite.

R2: If C-1 is the choice and H is FALSE then you escape Satan’s wrath and maybe he will reward you too. (i.e.) R2 is immense because of the absence of huge penalties, which in itself may be considered as a big reward.

P2: If C-2 is the choice and H is TRUE then the penalty P2 is nothing (i.e.) P2 =0.

Which is more prudent?

Accept the existence of God or Follow Satan?

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Amarasiri/January 26, 2016

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EDWIN RODRIGO

“3) Edwin is the Gaban’s universal maintenance engineer. Worship him 3 times a day if you want things to run smoothly.”

Since for EDWIN, God Gaban Exists, because he is the maintenance engineer, the probability of God Gaban exists, P(GG) =1, he cannot have his fling and sins, because, if he misbehaves, EDWIN going to God Gaban” Hell is =1, and suffer for eternity.

So, the best best for EDWIN in this short life is to behave.

If on the other hand God Gaban comes out and say, I am a fake, I am a Satan-Wahhabi or a Sinhala “Buddhist”, then EDWIN, because he is the maintenance engineer, he can have his fling and sins, because, there is no God Gaban to punish him.

The open question is that will the other Gods take over the fake God Gaban’s Business, and punish all the Gabanites?

So, EDWIN, is still at risk, even if God Gaban does not exist.

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 26, 2016

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Educating Amarasiri

Amarasiri says: “So, the best best for EDWIN in this short life is to behave.”

Why do you think I didn’t follow my own hypothesis No. (3). Because I am well behaved.

Here is an easier hypothesis to follow: No. 5

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 26, 2016

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Correction: Why do you think I didn’t follow my own hypothesis No. (4). Because I am well behaved.

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Amarasiri/January 27, 2016

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Educating EDWIN RODRIGO.

“Amarasiri says: “So, the best best for EDWIN in this short life is to behave.””

Allah is a better God than your God Gaban. However, if in this short life you behave, you should be all right.

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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Izeth Hussain

RE: The Two Difficulties In Countering Wahabism In Sri Lanka

Amarasiri has been advancing the Iblis-Satan-Wahhabi Hypothesis to explain the the Wahhabism phenomenon , using Islamic Theology as applied to Iblis on the Day of Judgement for not submitting to God, and the desire of Iblis-Satan to mislead the people, and the Wahhabies fell for it.

You may have to take another angle, saying that the Wahhabis, is not Islam, is not recognized as Islam, and is not accepted as Islam by the Four Islamic Schools, even though they try to creep under the Hanbali School.

Why is that Wahhabism and its Clones are not under Islam? Because they are not Islamic. They are Iblisic.

This article summarizes the different branches and various types of schools in Islam. There are three types of schools in Islam: Schools of Islamic jurisprudence, Islamic schools of Sufism better known as Tasawwufī-tārīqat and Aqidah schools of Islamic divinity. While all branches recognize the Qur’an, they differ in which other authorities they acknowledge.

This article also summarizes Islamism – the view that Islam is also a political system – and Liberal movements within Islam based on Ijtihad or interpretation of the scriptures

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Moderate man/January 25, 2016

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Jehan good question, if you can answer the below then you can find the answer for your question–

A man rapes a woman, the job last for only 30 minutes, but the judge sentence him for 30 years in rigorous prison, shouldn’t the judge sentence him with any sort of punishment only for 30 minutes, why does he have to punish him for 30 years. this is man’s justice.

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Sepala Munasinghe/January 25, 2016

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Wahhabism, a branch of Sunni Islam, owes its influence in modern day Islam due to a pact made by its founder, Muhammad Wahhab with Muhammad Saud after the collapse of the OttomanEmpire.
This pact enabled the Saudi Dynasty to consolidate its hold on what later became Saudi Arabia in return for supporting the spread of Wahhabism in the Middle East and elsewhere. Petroleum dollars earned by the Saudis assisted them in keeping to their side of the bargain.
Today, we have the spectacle of uncontrolled and un-regulated flow of Saudi money, coming into countries with very small Muslim minorities spreading its ultra conservative Islamic Wahhabism.
This has the effect of undermining the peaceful social cohesion that existed in those countries whilst producing Muslims with extreme views of their faith.
Until the administrations in those countries take steps to control and regulate Saudi incursions into their social fabric, via
petroleum dollars, Wahhabism would be cancerous, eating into Societies that were otherwise peaceful, before its advent.

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Amarasiri/January 26, 2016

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Sepala Munasinghe

“Wahhabism, a branch of Sunni Islam, owes its influence in modern day Islam due to a pact made by its founder, Muhammad Wahhab with Muhammad Saud after the collapse of the OttomanEmpire.”

Wahhabism does not fall into any of the Islamic schools and branches, but the Wahhabies are trying to sneak into the Hanbali school. They should form their own school the Satan School, because they specialize in killing Muslims and non-Muslims alike, and want to end up in hell fire, like their mentor, Iblis, Satan, who has already been condemned to Hell fire on the Day of Judgement, as per Islamic theology.

Colonel Sir Tatton Benvenuto Mark Sykes, 6th Baronet (16 March 1879 – 16 February 1919) was an English traveller, Conservative Party politician and diplomatic adviser, particularly with regard to the Middle East at the time of the First World War. He is associated with the Sykes-Picot Agreement, drawn up while the war was in progress, regarding the partitioning of the Ottoman Empire to Britain, France and Russia.

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Moderate man/January 25, 2016

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Sepala M

Do you think it’s right to advise an account or a doctor or even a cricketer to forget the fundamentals of their respective fields when they practice it or play, how good they will be, is it correct? in that case why do you want people to forget the fundamentals only when it comes to practicing their religion, does it make any sense?

The fundamentals of all the major religions are the same, they only preach good, if not it can never be a major religion

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Amarasiri/January 25, 2016

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Moderate man

“The fundamentals of all the major religions are the same, they only preach good, if not it can never be a major religion” Except Wahhabism and its Clones.

Do you have an answer to Amarasiri’s’s question regarding Wahhabism?

Amarasiri’s has a Question.

“What did Shaik Muhammad Abdul Wahab teach the Meccan and Medina Quran’s did NOT teach?. Call other Muslims Non-Muslims and Kill them, based on instructions from Iblis, Satan.Examples are killing of Shia Muslims, Sufi Muslims, Ahmedia Muslims, Christian, Jews abs other people.”

Please give a succinct answer.

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Amarasiri/January 26, 2016

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Moderate man

“The fundamentals of all the major religions are the same, they only preach good, if not it can never be a major religion “

Do Good- Go to Heaven. Do Bad Go to Hell. Do Nothing, stay in Limbo?

Christianity from Judaism to Constantine: Crash Course World History #11

In which John Green teaches you the history of Christianity, from the beginnings of Judaism and the development of monotheism, right up to Paul and how Christianity stormed the Roman Empire in just a few hundred years. Along the way, John will cover Abram/Abraham, the Covenant, the Roman Occupation of Judea, and the birth, life, death and legacy of Jesus of Nazareth. No flame wars! Let’s keep the commentary civil.

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jehan/January 26, 2016

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 26, 2016

Relativity
When you are courting a nice girl an hour seems like a second. When you sit on a red-hot cinder a second seems like an hour. That’s relativity. ( Albert Einstein )

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Moderate Man/January 26, 2016

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According to Islam, time, like everything else is created, you exist this time zone when you die or even when you go to sleep; this could be easily verified by this method: if ever you wake up in the middle of the night, try to ascertain how long you have slept without the aid of a clock, you will never be able confirm whether you slept for 15 minutes, 15 hours or even 15 years.

So the time dimension in the next world or hereafter will be totally different to this world, in other word if there is no time, everything will be eternal or infinite.

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EDWIN RODRIGO/January 26, 2016

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This is a very good point. The recently discovered planet No. 9 of our solar system takes 20,000 years to go around the sun. That makes 20,000 EARTH years = 1 New Planet year.

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Amarasiri/January 27, 2016

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Moderate Man

Fighting over God in a free country,

The same God?

In God Delusion by Richard Dawkins, where he says: “The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.”

Nicely put and He does not seem to have missed anything there. Every time I read that, I wonder how so many people can be so stupid and idiotic to believe in their God knowing what his past behavior has been.

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Moderate Man/January 27, 2016

I don’t know what the Old Testament says or who Richard Dawkins is, but I can give a small analogy about the point Dawkins is trying to make, which also can be proven to be correct in its own right:

Imagine you are the owner of a house, you built it with your hard earned money, and putting your time and effort etc., doesn’t this give you the right to do anything with it, you can color it the way you want, make it, break it, turn it upside down, do whatever whether it’s right or wrong because it belongs to you, same way if God is the actual creator of everything he can do anything he wants or be, why would he give a damn about what his creation thinks.

However, if you read the Quran properly you will understand the true attributes of God, and whatever he says about himself make good sense, and there is no contradiction. See if you can find any.

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Amarasiri/January 29, 2016

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Moderate Man

“However, if you read the Quran properly you will understand the true attributes of God, and whatever he says about himself make good sense, and there is no contradiction. See if you can find any. “

So, Amarasiri’s has a Question.

“What did Shaik Muhammad Abdul Wahab teach the Meccan and Medina Quran’s did NOT teach?. Call other Muslims Non-Muslims and Kill them, based on instructions from Iblis, Satan.Examples are killing of Shia Muslims, Sufi Muslims, Ahmedia Muslims, Christian, Jews abs other people.”

So, we have the Iblis-Wahhabis Interpreting the quran , in thir own way, to make Iblis-Wahhabi “Islam”, called Wahhabism.

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