Just get an iPad with beatmaker2 and an Mpc element or a mpd8 **** all that other noise Beatmaker2 is basically JJOS on the iPad u get the touch screen and if u got the element or the mpd u get the mp pads also..

Tapuno wrote:No, its not the fat **** I was supposed to **** but never did.And, no that is not a dude. Its my sister.

Disclaimer - I'm not a typical Elektron 'fanboy' - I hate that term full stop, but I do love what they make. They get a fair few mentions here purely because from what I can see, the Toraiz and most of it's current OS/feature set does not compete.

Definitely one for the DJS rather than the producers.

So I went to the West End/Soho in London today and had a play. Interestingly it was in West End DJ, but not on display in West End Production - which tells me first off (backing up my other views below) that it's more aimed at DJs than producers. This doesn't justify it's huge price tag - if it's the machine it's been often quoted as being (game changer/MPC killer etc), then I'm not sure if Pioneer themselves would agree. I may be wrong, but I'd be surprised if they are claiming it is better than any other hardware sampler out there - maybe on the DJ market, but certainly not the pro-audio/electronic instrument market.

I don't particularly like the look of it, the coloured pad lights make it look gimmicky - and it's overall physical size make it seem cumbersome compared to the Elektrons - the step sequencer buttons remind me of the ones on the Roland MC808, which you may or may not like, I didn't. The coloured pads make it look cheaper than it is, and felt no better or worse than my MPC5000. Ok, my MPC5000 is huge, but it's so huge, you respect it - and it looks chunky, tough, technical and sure of itself. The Toraiz looks like a typical product you'd find in the DJ controller market. It also has a non-tilting (is that a word?) screen, and on first look I couldn't see a top panel knob to adjust the contrast. The lights in the shop were glaring, and as a result I couldn't see the screen at all without moving away from the unit into an inconvenient and actually quite silly looking position.

Overall it looks a bit 'toy' - it has a brushed metal finish which is kind of glossy - not a patch on the scientific look of the Octatrack or even the semi-matt finish on my MPC5000. I look at my MPC and think 'it looks like the **** mothership, I look at my OT and think I'm a scientist - the Toraiz makes me think I'm a huge club DJ or a 15 year old, of which I am neither.

I really can't see how it has received remarks elsewhere like 'MPC Killer' and 'Game changing' - the Octatrack has it's flaws (polyphony, slightly thin sound and limited outputs in comparison to the beef and connectivity of an MPC), but is miles ahead of anything out there.

Even my Yamaha SU700 feels more physically solid and in usage, more technical. At present, the Toraiz feels more geared towards DJ controller people who want an extension of the basic sampling found on some DJ mixers and are happy using pre-prepared and/or pre-looped/timed material, presets and the like. It's like a slightly better built and slightly more solid and heavy feeling Roland TR8, with a touch screen and a Dave Smith filter. Hooray.

Maybe Pioneer embarked on this project to compete with Akai's Touch when they realised it wasn't standalone - but seemed to have forgotten about the Octatrack (which only falls short in a few areas but outshines most of it's flaws in general by being so flexible). The Octatrack caters for DJs, producers, live musicians, synthesists, sound designers, anyone who want to manipulate sound either tightly, loosely or both.

There seemed to be no in depth sample mangling features, like automating interesting parameters like the start/end points of samples (always a winner). Even if this is a soon to come feature, releasing a machine of this price bracket with an underdeveloped OS is poor.

Wasn't really impressed with the sound, couldn't give a **** about an analogue filter as that seems to be one of the biggest plus points - bizarre.

I'm also wondering if this whole touch screen thing is being ridiculously overhyped as the analogue filter is - I'd rather have a super charged sampler that can mangle the **** out of anything you throw at it. I owned an MPC Touch for a short time and this also seemed to rely on the touch screen rather than anything groundbreaking in terms of sound manipulation or workflow - ridiculous considering it interfaces with your computer. Plus it crashed far too much.

Ultimately, until the OS starts showing signs it could be an Octatrack kilier, I'm not interested (I'm also no longer a DJ).

I could go on but I have a life, so to round up - I'm really not sure where this machine sits in the array of current devices.

What do I think is needed? I've been saying it for years, an MPC5000 mixed with an Octatrack and a Boss RC505 - right there you have a workstation synth, sampler and live looper - what's so difficult about that?

16 pads (not 12 like the Rytm)Multiple outs (like a good MPC)A built in analogue or analogue modelling synth (like the 5000), but more adsvanced (automation of pretty much everything)A live overdubbing looper (not like the current and cumbersome Pick UP machines in the Octatrack)Angled/movable screenParameter locks/mod-matrix/etc.

Lampdog wrote:What I've read on Korg Electribe sampler yeah it seems more powerful AND a large amount cheaper .

... and, if you want analog filter (presumably LP filter), MOOG MF-101 Lowpass Filter is about 300 bucks, and Korg Electribe sampler is about 400 bucks. It is just very hard to justify buying SP-16... It is even more expensive than Octatrack (which is super powerful, looks gorgeous, and I want!)

stop frontin and get a MURF 105 and an octatrack. Just kidding.

Actually I use the octatrack I got used for 920USD and a rodec restyler 600USD. Little over 1500 but gets the job done. Or you can get a used MPC 1K/200XL (500USD) + rodec restyler 600USD. But you can get decent analog filters via perfect circuit audio for less than 600 plus get a sampler to rock to. The thing that's bad about this filter is it doesn't have a full matrix so you can't get it to scream all the way. If you can get it to overdrive (scream) + LFO (reshape the waveform) then you are set for a filter.

I'm guessing the reason you can't record the filter is because it's analog. The only way you can record filter sweeps is if you can resample what the machine is playing in realtime. See if you can do that as a workaround.

I'm guessing Pioneer will implement features lacking for their flagship version. For what it is, its not worth $1500. They should drop the price to $799. It need NDC chopping but copy and paste will do fine. I'll wait until 2017 and come back to see any progress.

After inhaling the H-bomb, the prehistoric monster from the Boom Bap era has risen.

Ok let me add my 2 cents. I literally heard about this product today (October 11, 2016) and I immediately got excited because this is exactly what I wanted, a Stand Alone production Workstation. At least that's what I thought this was, until I read reviews and peeked at different forms like this one. I thought this was going to be what MPC should have done with the MPC touch. But apparently after reading, it is miles away from that. But I will say this, this product does have some potential. It is at least a step in the right direction. I see great things coming from this. Either pioneer expands on this product and make it better and add more features or companies like Native Instruments and akai will step up and make a modern stand-alone production Workstation that we all want. Yes this product is disappointing but I do think we are headed in the right direction. Of course we have to remember that Pioneer DJ is just a company that makes DJ equipment, so we can't expect them to give us producers everything we want, but I will give them kudos for trying. As far as the price, I really do think that Pioneer is reaching. It's not even worth half that. For $1,500 I should be able to not ever turn on my laptop for production ever again. I mean beaterator for the PSP can do a lot more than this sampler can do, and that's about as basic as you can get as far as music production goes. But I am excited to see what comes about. Hopefully this will put fire under Akai's and Native Instruments' butt. Let's just wait and see what happens.