OuroborosCobra/2008 Talk Archive

This is an archive of discussions from 2008 previously located on User talk:OuroborosCobra. As it is an archive, please do not edit these discussions. Feel free to open new conversations on the original talk page.

Hi, I think it is only fair to tell you that I have just nominated you for administrationship on MA/en. I personally hope it will succeed, and I hope you do that to :-P. (if you don't remember the way to nomination-page: MA:NFA). Have faith in the Prophets. -- Rom Ulan 21:10, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Thank for for the nomination, though I doubt I will pass this round. Still, this will give me an opportunity to hear how people want me to improve in the future. --OuroborosCobratalk 18:43, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

I understand why you did that, but it was kind of a legit prode on whether such a thing could be made into a background note. I'm also curious if such a plot concept has appeared in novels or comic books. I also dont think anything should be removed from a talk page except pure vandalism, even if it is just fans talking about stuff. The exception I can think of would be fans carrying on a lenghty conversation on a talk page about something that has nothing to do with the article.

I did reword the comment to focus on my asking a question. If you still feel it must be removed, then I suggest an article talk page note saying that its been moved to my personal talk page and make the move as such. Cool? Thanks. -FleetCaptain 20:56, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

You started it off by saying "I know this will never make it into the article, but...", that makes it not a prode about a background note. I can tell you that the answer to putting it in the article would be a "no". It is way too speculative, off base, and not the least bit what happened. Our talk page policy makes clear what talk pages are for, content relating to the article and changes to be discussed, and as you worded it yours was not. We have been removing off topic conversations for awhile now, intentional vandalism or not. Your topic essentially fell into the latter, "lengthy conversation which has nothing to do with the article". It did not start as having to do with the article, and responses weren't going to have to do with the article. I hope that explains why I just outright removed it. I haven't had a chance to look at your changes (and probably won't for awhile, I have work to get done), but if you changed it to talk about possible notes or changes to the article, it can stay on the talk page (even if the answer is a "no", since it will be a legitimate question). --OuroborosCobratalk 21:01, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

I trimmed it way back to just a simple background note in Star Trek IV which had nothing to do with the paradox question. Although I am still curious if such a thing has ever appeared in a novel or comic book. As stated on the article talk page, maybe I'll try and write such a novel one day (if I ever get published the non-Trek novel I'm working on right now!) Thanks for you inputs. -FleetCaptain 21:31, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

You told me to calm down and take a chill pill on Shran's page when I yelled for help in removing a copyrighted image. You don't understand. It wasn't MA I was worried about. It was the wife of the friend who I got the image from. This is what happened.

Bill Cobbs was here in Tobago filming a movie. My close friend and his wife are working on the set. So, Cobbs granted them some nice photos of him with them, which they took with their own cameras. I immediately thought of MA and asked my friend for one, telling him what I intended to use it for: to put it here on MA in the Cobbs article. After all, he took the picture, he is the copyright owner, right? He said ok. "What luck!", says I. Your own friend hooking you up with a Trek Actor image that he took and giving you full rights to use it!

Except that, as it turns out, his wife signed a contract stating, among other things, that no images, personal or otherwise, were to be used online. My friend knew this. But he was so tired from the work that he apparently did not hear what I said about using the image online when I told him what I intended to do. So, I put it on, in the Cobbs article, giving him full credit as the owner, and email him the link so he could see it.

Five minutes later, his wife calls me, demanding in no uncertain terms that I "Take it off now!" She explains why, and makes it clear what trouble I'd be in if I did not. What trouble? If anybody from the film company saw it, the company would come after them. And who'd she put them onto as the culprit? ME! Lawsuit! Fines! ME! And they'd have no trouble finding me. They'd get my address and name from her! Would they have understood the copyright violation was unintentional? I wasn't about to let it stay there long enough to find out. I've never even seen the inside of a courtroom in my life.

Understand now why I was so frightened? You tell me if you wouldn't get scared in that situation. – Watching...listening... 22:15, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Actually, in that scenario, only the people who signed the contract would be in trouble. They could have given them your address and name, but they couldn't have done anything with it, legally. The responsibility falls on her to ensure that image never gets on the internet. If it happens, the fault is her's, no one else's. No one can be in a breach of contract with the exception of the person who signed the contract. She was just scared of getting her own butt sued, is all. --From Andoria with Love 22:34, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Well, thankfully, nobody is suing anybody. And I was commended by Tim for moving so quickly on this copyvio. Friendship remains intact. Actually, she is my friend too. Just not as close as him. Shame, though. It was a nice pic.:)– Watching...listening... 23:30, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

You made a personal statement about Alan. There was no reason to do so. --OuroborosCobratalk 22:07, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

I have already apologized to Alan for my unintentional offense, not that it is any of your business. The matter is closed.– Watching...listening... 02:49, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

If the matter was "closed", you would not have shifted the focus to attacking me and my general practices as an editor in that discussion. --OuroborosCobratalk 03:09, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Why so serious? Let's not bicker and argue about who attacked who. This is a happy site! Let's see some smiles! Give each other a hug! Show some brotherly love! Nothing Brokeback-ish, of course. :P --From Andoria with Love 03:36, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Well, I did have two Ledger movie refs in there. In his honor, of course. In fact, I just rented The Brothers Grimm. Been wanting to see it, anyway; now seemed to be an ideal time. :/ --From Andoria with Love 03:56, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Wow. I was just skimming some "Talos" article (for memory's sake) and saw a Mintchocobeer guy switch it to "Talosian System" (like it matters), then this Oroboro dude switches it back...immediately. :-P As if he was just waiting at his computer all day and had nothing better to do, huh? When I saw how many articles Oroboro 'edited', and how much talk is being contributed...? LOL!!

You people take this stuff WAY too seriously. The Shatner guy was right on when he said: "Get a life! It's just a TV show!"TotallyUninterested 01:08, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Rules are rules, and I was enforcing one. In this case, actually following what was on screen. You can't claim to be accurate if you then aren't. As for the more personal natured comments, I do have a life, thank you very much. If you were really looking at my contributions, you will note the change in "occupation" on my user page yesterday. I have a job, where I go and make money. I don't need to sit at home writing idiotic attacks on what other people decide to spend their free time doing. Tomorrow, I am working with teenagers on a project to build a micro-gravity drop test tower. Teaching science to our youth. Sunday, I'm going out to hang out with friends. You know, that silly thing us computer obsessed people don't have, a social life. Except I have one.

I'm sorry you find silly that I enforced a rule. If you don't like it so much, then go make your own silly site. --OuroborosCobratalk 01:19, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

You're pretty fair on this site. You might want to take a look at what happened at this article. Ive formally protested this admin's actions as I feel its a gross abuse to lock an article one is directly involved with editing and then state that another user you disagree with is "edit warring" when in fact there was an active talk page discussion underway to improve the article. -FleetCaptain 06:03, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

While I tend to agree that Alan was out of line in his initial action with the protection and revert, and further out of line with specifically violating the instructions of the active MA bureaucrat (Cid Highwind), I have some past history with this particular admin. I'm probably going to have to sit this one out, unless it gets worse. --OuroborosCobratalk 20:29, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

You probably can take that notice off the American Awards article. It was a situation of a brand new user adding back in material which had already been placed in a background note. The user just didnt understand and once I explained it to him/her, they stopped. Thanks though for watching the article. -FC 23:07, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Actually, I was probably going to be adding it even if that little misunderstanding had not happened, as a large number of small edits were going on in a short time. I just used the edit summary for a little joke. --OuroborosCobratalk 23:11, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

The person to which you addressed that notice bears a little bit of watching. I think we are dealing with just someone new but I had to go and undo some damage to military award articles. I see a habit of adding in real world information to articles and making multiple fast edits. Like I said...just bears watching. -FC 03:09, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

I have made a few (less than memorable) contributions in the last two days and couldn't help but notice that you have commented on my comments in minutes. That's dedication. (Vince 02:10, 2 March 2008 (UTC))

I came to you in good faith to get your opinion because I respect it. Why are you making personal attacks like saying I am a "stick in the mud" and not an adult? I am a 32 year old naval officer with 13 years of service in places like Japan, Korea, and the Persian Gulf and I have a decoration for service off the coast of Iran. I have nothing to prove to you. Please tone down your comments. That administrator who moved that page violated policy pure and simply. It’s now being corrected by others so the problem seems to be solved. I suggest that this conversation be closed before you say something that could really damage your reputation on this site. -FC 13:56, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

You were being a stick in the mud. The discussions to make it so other people couldn't edit this article, so that you could even have this in a state where it could go to EAS, had been going on for days. You weren't ever agreeing to most anything, saying things like "no your just over reacting" and crap like that. Then another editor came along and made the case greater than I even could, by demonstrating the problem you were being slow about letting us fix for you. This is the big thing you don't seem to get. This move was done to help you, and all you can do is whine about it. As for the second, I never accused you of not being an adult, I accused this entire discussion of no longer being adult. It still isn't adult now. If you want the conversation closed so much, then just stop responding to it. --OuroborosCobratalk 14:00, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

I'll close the conversation then but I would hope that you don't refer to other users with name calling in the future. That's very unprofessional. Have a great day. -FC 14:03, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

You know what, you are still choosing to not read what I am writing. This is utter bullshit. Get off my user talk, and keep the discussions on the article talk pages. At least there the refusal to read comments can happen in one place. --OuroborosCobratalk 14:05, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

I’ll make this my final comment then. I listened to everything you said and the article doesn’t belong here, yes it can be moved, and I will work to that effort. I also removed the entire military service chart from the United States armed forces article which is an added bonus. I am however very sad to see that you have directed names towards me and are now directing profanity towards me. In any event, I hope you have a wonderful day. -FC 14:20, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Ahhhh! You fought a glorious battle worthy of bloodwine and song! May we one day meet again on the field of battle!!

You're still not reading anything I say. I didn't call you not an adult, I called this conversation, this situation not an adult. I didn't direct profanity at you, I called this situation bullshit. Now you are choosing to "archive" after responding again, as if you are the only party that gets to decide when a discussion on my talk page is done? What the hell? --OuroborosCobratalk 14:31, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

My apolgies for linking to the wrong user :-o You said you wanted it off your user talk page so I made a final comment and posted it here. I was afraid that if I did it on your page it might be seen as vandalism of a user page after I was told by said user to no longer edit this page. Anyway, this entire situation looks like it's been fixed and I have to go to work. Have a great day and keep on trekkin'. -FC 14:34, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi. An unregistered user appears to be interested in keeping a note of when Data uses contractions. I've suggested keeping such a list off the main article page, relegating it to the talk page or the user's own page(s). I'd appreciate the opinion of an experienced MA contributor such as yourself. Could you please leave your recommendation in the discussion? Thanks. – Pesky 12:11, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

My old alias User:BlueMars can not be logged in anymore. Most likely that is because I used an identical user name and password... (at least I think so). Nevertheless I noticed that you've reverted a redirection I just created from BlueMars to my new account User:36ophiuchi. How may we solve this problem? --36ophiuchi 13:10, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Wasn't aware you were BlueMars. Usually edits like that made by another user are vandalism. --OuroborosCobratalk 13:17, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

I see your point. However, now that this issue is clarified, I'll rechange the user page and implement the redirect again. After all, I've just copypasted my old user page... --36ophiuchi 23:48, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Hey, I just read about you being in the CAP. I am a cadetsergeant in the Air Training Corps here in the UK. I've always wanted to do IACE with the CAP and see how they do things in the US. Great to meet you! -- TrekFan 02:42, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

There might be some things going on in the real world that you are not aware of. I ask that we leave it at that. Thank you very much for your comments. I ask we pursue this no further. Have a wonderful July 4th holiday and thank you for your contributions to this website! -FC 14:36, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Ah. I had no idea, and when comparing the two versions of the template, the second one was ugly. With no explanation in the edit summary as to why changes were being made, and someone who seemingly was almost never on MA, I made my choice. --OuroborosCobratalk 04:46, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

That's fine, I should have mentioned it on the template talk page or something. I think we're done with the template, though, as that doesn't seem to be the cause of the problem. --From Andoria with Love 04:51, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

Thank for clearing up the objection there, it does make sense not to have it. Have you ever seen that Buck Rogers episode? Mark Lenard is some kind of alien who can take off his own head and carry it around. Then there is a purple guy who lives in a cave and chases Buck and friends around a desert. Not to mention the "sauce was excellent" line which ranks right up there with "please sit and entertain me" and "there is a multi-legged creature crawling on your shoulder". Its a good episode if you can ever find it on the Sci-Fi channel. -FC 16:38, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

With all due respect, but so what the community agreed on it? First of all, from the talks it doesnt look to me like the community agreed to anything, it was just done and the discussion just died, and even so...I have provided a long, detailed, as well as valid explanation as to why the current quote is just inadequate. Apparently open discussion and taking into account valid reasons for changes are not accepted or encouraged around here. Are you telling me this is set in stone now and everyone who tries
any changes in the article will be dismissed and told off immediately in order to not risk the article’s status? Looks to me like someone just wants to be right here for the sake of wanting to be right, regardless of the (very valid mind you) arguments posted
regarding a change. The whole point of a wiki like this is so that things can be changed and improved. I don’t see how supposedly you have any authority over anyone else to determine what should be changed. The quote selected is plain and generic. At least if you don’t want Yar’s quote there, go and find a better one.

Anyway, I’m not gonna argue with you about this – god forbid the status of this gold-piece of an article be changed...oh and by
the way, it's Admiral Hanson not Hayes!!! – Distantlycharmed 20:21, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

The fact that you open with "so what?" regarding community consensus shows that you do not understand the entire philosophy of how wikis function. Community consensus is the very cornerstone of it, and if that means that you don't get what you alone seem to want, then so be it. --OuroborosCobratalk 20:24, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

My main point was that this is not, nor should it be, set in stone. And the fact that I have given a detailed explanation/justification
as to why the quote should be changed is evidence of me obviously not being impulsive about this. In an open forum like this
new ideas and inputs supported by valid arguments should be taken into account and considered, not just rudely deleted and
categorially dismissed. This is not Congress...The quote that was selected can be put under any federation captain's name...
and a few Ensigns, and Commanders and Lieutenants for that matter...– Distantlycharmed 21:17, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

...and I stated disagreement with you on the point that it can be used for any officer, and justified myself without a 3k long post that no one is going to read. Terribly long posts are not conducive to being read. As this is a featured article, and went through a review process with the quote that is not yours, "set in stone" may not be the word for what we have but high extreme caution would be. Right now, all you have is one person wanting change, one not. That is not community consensus what so ever, unlike the featured article status. --OuroborosCobratalk 21:24, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

To chime in, I agree with OC. This quote should not be changed. But I really wanted to ask is this the same user as User:Aamin Marritza? If so, I would recommend sticking to one account to avoid a sockpuppet charge. -FC 21:43, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

No it's not. I have not changed my username or account. Just because someone critisizes an entry doesnt make them an imposter. Gee, a little paranoid aren't we? ...– Distantlycharmed 23:55, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

Not paranoid at all. Just trying to help you if in fact you were the same person who created a 2nd account due for whatever reason. Thats the quickest way to turn people off from your views by creating multiple accounts which argue the same point (and it cant be denied that A.M. was arguing exactly the same point and even suggested exactly the same quote you used and did so within just a few daysof your posts). But, since you've said its not the same user, then there is no reason to disbelieve you. -FC 00:16, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

Why are you getting so overworked about a simple quote? If you had such an objection about its use, you should have brought it up on the nominations page when the article was up for FA, as per MA policy. The article was passed and is now an FA. -- TrekFan 00:13, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

Well I am not the one guarding its conents like a treasure. Plus back then I wasn't a member or didn't look at the article until now. And for someone else brining up the same argument: well, has it ever occured to you that maybe it is because this quote is really bad and misplaced - and it could be that someone else out there, in addition to the people who objected the quote in the discussion, might also object to it? No of course not because that possibility cant exist. Anyway, end of discussion for me as well folks....– Distantlycharmed 00:37, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

I saw the edit war over the Picard article quote. We have had our own run-ins. I do not mean what I am about to say in a bad way; I genuinely mean it as good advice.

You are a great contributor here. But you always get into spats, quarrels and arguments with other users, and you have to have the last word. Stop this. It makes both you and the other party look small and foolish. Walk away if the other party is stubborn, even if you are right. If he is wrong, refer the matter to an administrator and let them handle it. That way, only the other party looks small and foolish and you look intelligent and mature, as I am sure you are. Think about it. – Watching...listening... 22:20, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but no. In the case of the Picard article, I stand by my belief that we were essentially dealing with a vandal (possibly sockpuppet). We had a single person who took it upon themselves to go against overwhelming and clearly demonstrated community consensus to change an article to their own point of view. This is entirely unacceptable behavior. Then there are other articles where I just get out of it, and lave the argument, such as the very very long going USS Melbourne debate. Yeah, I was there at the beginning of that, but I've basically given it a wide berth other than to occasionally pop in and support whoever will end the stupid thing the fastest. Granted, I am more cynical and less nice than when I first came to MA, but this came after dealing with very poor and entirely rude, mean, and personal attack behaviors perpetrated by a still standing admin and a high standing user with little or no resulting action from people like the other administrators and the bureaucrat here. Essentially, I learned that it doesn't pay to be nice. I try not to be overly mean, but I'm not going to hand hold vandals and those intentionally circumventing the rules of the community. Not anymore. It just doesn't pay off. --OuroborosCobratalk 00:26, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

Well...I like you OC. You have displayed extreme maturity on this site and, as you are one of the few contributers that has actually admitted your age, I can say you act far more mature than the age you state yourself to be. Keep it up and you are a benefit to this site. Best! -FC 03:43, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

Cobra and I do not always agree, but I would not describe him as argumentative or prone to getting into such situations. I think in virtually every situation he has been involved in he has acted properly, and as he said vandals don't need to be handheld.--31dot 18:05, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

Sorry about the comfuston, bit reading over the talk bit, trigger a few bits, I am a person who has a vision imparment, a is a ST fan, I have a few problems with english, I have learning disabilty in both enlish and math. I am still new at this, trying my best to recall is not easly for me nor is posting that is why I left in talk for. Trying to watch the infromaton on tape is getting at time hard. As for interaction, the LCARS wouls show a image as feedback, make a sound, tell you somehting and light up a part of the display area. I hope this explans things, I somewh– at know where the action is taking place but trying to put into words is hard for me.-GinnyStar-STD MOT 06:09, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

What? It was a comment I made and I chose to delete it. That's all. – Distantlycharmed 07:37, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Well I changed my mind and decided I dont want that comment there. Please cite me the exact policy phrase that says you cannot remove comments after so and so many days and I wont. I would really like to see that. Thank you. – Distantlycharmed 08:14, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Well as a matter of fact it says archive, dont delete...but only if a talk page is really long, which this one isnt, so please feel free to archive it if you want. But it also says that you can delete "personal attacks" - and even though this was not a personal attack on anyone, but an opinion about a character (albeit not a nice one) I decided to delete it upon further reflection about Seven. And since this is not a talk page, I didnt want to start a new debate about why I changed my mind about Seven etc. I didnt do it earlier because sorry, I was busy with school. Boo. The reason I removed the response of the other person to mine was precisely because I didnt want that comment to be just hanging over the air. So, please either archive it or I will remove it. Thanks.– Distantlycharmed 08:26, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

oh blah blah blah...get a life. Dont you have anything better to do? Fine keep it. I wouldnt want you to spontaneously combust over a misplaced deletion. God forbid...– Distantlycharmed 08:41, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Dont blame you a bit for thinking the way you did. Just wanted to let you know on a personal note that I'm not that petty as to suggest a policy in an attempt to use it like some kind of secret weapon against another user. I did withdraw the suggestion because it was pointed out the NPA page and Talk Page guidelines already covered it. As far as that other nonsense you saw, I'm 33, a naval officer, and have a wife, dog, and a mortgage. I could care less what someone thinks over the internet and I am walking away from that, just like you said. -FC 06:05, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

I would really like to invite your input on what to do about the Able Seaman situation on Starfleet ranks. Fletcher's notes DO list the rank by that title which contradicts several other Star Trek productions which call that pin simply as Crewman. Please chime in over at Talk:Starfleet ranks. Thanks. -FC 20:02, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps you could shed some light on the Trekkie/Trekker definition. (Vince 01:25, 5 December 2008 (UTC))

I want to be a leftist Marxist Communist guerilla with right wing Maoist views with a tendency towards moderate radical fascist centralist tendencies with a habit of not knowing what I'm talking about! -FC 15:34, 12 December 2008 (UTC)