I take great offense to the statement that all children are brats and I am really surprised to hear a teacher say such a thing.

I didn't say that. I disagreed with that statement. Some children are taught how to behave, others are not.

Cat, I am very familiar with Harry Wong and love him. I am having a year of parents who are trying to run the teachers. I have a new very incompetent principal who is racist and teaching students to use their color to get away with things. Also there are about 7 students who lie about everything I say or do (other teachers also) and they are believed and supported by the principal and the parents. This is what is making my year so bad. Other teachers are feeling the same, it isn't only me. We have two teachers out on sick leave. Several are looking for other jobs. We are having racial problems our district has not had for over 30 years. It is a nightmare.

Oh, man...can I relate! My last year was spent with a principal like that, so I do know indeed what you're going through.

And I do agree with sadie regarding school behavior...if parents had to spend just one day with their kids in a school sitting...they'd be appalled by how some of them behave. Other parents would, no doubt, be very proud of their kids, because some parents do teach their children right from wrong. AND some parents would be proud if their kids misbehaved because far too many parents, as in sadie's situation, like to think they can come in and run the schools, rather like some parents think they can bring their kids into a restaurant and let them do as they please.

Sadie..perhaps you can start a thread about schools and students' misbehavior. It might be interesting.

_________________

"Behind every great fortune lies a great crime."Honore de Balzac

"Democrats work to help people who need help. That other party, they work for people who don't need help. That's all there is to it."~Harry S. Truman

I also disagree with that statement and once again blame the parents for allowing their children to act that way. A child needs order in his or her life and without it, they turn into brats. They act out in school, in stroes, in places of worship and in places were we go to enjoy a dinner.

People, children included, do what they WANT to do..whether they're allowed to do it or not.
Example: I was brought up in a strict house. (At least when I was at my mom's.. ..my dad was a lot less strict. Ok, no rules. ) My younger brother and sister, who still live with my mom and step dad are brought up no differently. However, my little brother has a problem...with anything and everything. When he does things that aren't approved of, he's punished..whether it's no tv, video games, playtime, dessert, or a spanking. However, nothing ever makes a difference. His behavior is absurd, and has only gotten worse in the last couple years. He doesn't do his homework (and when he does, he throws it in the garbage on his way to class), he doesn't make friends because he's so mean to people, he says mean things to his sister (not me or my older sister of course-we'd beat his ass), he sets fires under his bed (!!)...anything that comes out of his mouth cannot be trusted. Anything that he does needs to be supervised. He can't be trusted to stay home by himself, or anything.
Is this my mom's fault? ... granted, I don't think a lot of the things that her and my step dad do are appropriate...but is it really their fault that he's this way? Or is it the fact that he's this way because it's the way he wants to be?

Does he do this stuff because he's allowed to, or because he wants to, and simply doesn't care what kind of punishment comes with it?

_________________"I may detest what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." -Voltaire

He does it because he is unhappy. He needs discipline in his life. If he throws his homework away, and somebody knows he does it, then he is being ALLOWED to throw it away.

If he says bad things to his sister and somebody knows it then he is being ALLOWED to do that.

You say they punish him, by stopping him from playing video games etc. I am willing to bet that they are still in his room. He just cannot use them for a period of time.

When I tell my kids they cannot watch television, I take it out of their room. When I tell them the video games are done. I take them out of their room.

As long as they are there, there is hope that they will be able to play again. Once they see them gone. That possibility no longer exist. If the games are in the main room. Put them away, disconnect them, take the machine and video games and put them away. Take all the cd's he listens to and put them away.

Bottom line though is the boy needs somebody to talk to. Lot of anger there.

Well, when he's banned from the tv or video games, he's not allowed to go into the living room, which is where they are. My mom and step dad work opposite hours and can't take him to school, so he takes the bus. It's been a while since he's thrown his homework away though, too. And yes, Cat, the thing that had me most worried too was the fire setting.
I kinda think of my little brother like my cat. He'll do whatever he can to get attention. And negative attention is fine.
I wish there was something I could do to help, but it's not really my business or my place.

Anyways, I was just trying to make the point that people (adults and children) do what they want to do, even if they're not allowed to. Adults do it....so if kids do it too, why is it that they're simply allowed too, instead of that they just want to, too?

_________________"I may detest what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." -Voltaire

the owners just don't see them as others do. i used to tell my boys that if they carried on (in a store or any public place) i would pull their pants down in front of everyone and spank the living daylights out of them)...lol the thought of being publicly humiliated was a nice deterent to some little whining brat.

In today's society, an act like that could find YOU in jail and your kid in Child Services...

However, my little brother has a problem...with anything and everything.

Do they take him out in public and allow him to misbehave? Like in a nice restaurant where others are trying to enjoy a nice dinner and conversation?

My son used to like to act up. I only had to leave once and sit in the car with him while my husband and daughter finished and enjoyed their meal. He never acted out again in a public place. He knew he would be leaving.

I have to laugh at what DK said. When my kids were grounded what they hated the most was losing phone privilages (before cell phones). When I was leaving one evening I overheard my kids arguing over who was going to use the phone first. I went over, unplugged the phone and took it out and put it in the trunk of the car. Man I wish I had a picture of the looks on their faces! Totaling removing something that is important has great power.

However, my little brother has a problem...with anything and everything.

Do they take him out in public and allow him to misbehave? Like in a nice restaurant where others are trying to enjoy a nice dinner and conversation?

My son used to like to act up. I only had to leave once and sit in the car with him while my husband and daughter finished and enjoyed their meal. He never acted out again in a public place. He knew he would be leaving.

I have to laugh at what DK said. When my kids were grounded what they hated the most was losing phone privilages (before cell phones). When I was leaving one evening I overheard my kids arguing over who was going to use the phone first. I went over, unplugged the phone and took it out and put it in the trunk of the car. Man I wish I had a picture of the looks on their faces! Totaling removing something that is important has great power.

Good idea... not just banned from using but removed completely from the house... must of been a real shocker for them...