Let's see... made one for Cheeky using about 6-7 yards (this does not include the petticote) she is small and slender. Made one for Aurore who is closer to my height but not as tall, I would hazard to guess about 5'7"- 5'9", again slender and used nine yards for her gown(again this does not include the petticote)... she has a much lovelier train due to having a much better length. Granted for Cheeky's height, her train is quite suitable... but for both gowns I used the entire width measurement of the pattern posted.

remember whilst using that over skirt pattern, that it gathers at the waist and so one needs to take into consideration how much of it is used for the waist to floor measurement and how much you want left over for a train...

Oh the hedgehog look! That's fantastic, isn't it? I was bouncing off the walls when I spotted that. Laughed as that became retro in the late 18th c. LOL, ironic, hmm?

~Lady B

Nothing new under the sun, Lady B. Everything repeats itself with just a bit of tweaking.. I had a phenomenal hedgehog wig whilst doing the later end of the Rev. War... worked great for balls unfortunately never rode well under a dragoon helmet...

LOL... That darn Afro- hedgehoge look. :) At least would make for a heck of a prank - bad helmet hair.

Anyway... back to the bodice gown....

I would imagine one would have to factor in how long one wants the train to be, right? Since your using the length of the fabric rather than the wideth like on mose 18th c petticoats and overskirting. Aye? Maybe 6-7 yards sounds about right. :)

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Interests:The Callenish gunner has just hoved into view looking for safe anchorage in these waters... purveyor of bladed and flintlock weaponry also leather accessories ..........painter of portraits and period scenes by avocation I'm getting my armoury business underway and will be doing as many festivals as I can ...right now along the east coast or great lakes

Thank you ....much of what is displayed in museums of extant clothing has been sewn together at later dates as to allow for display and were not the construction of the period (at least from what I was told at the Edinburgh Museum). But, since this is not my main area of expertise and my hard documentation is not extensive and I was dealing with recollection of 40+ years ago. I'm so glad of the contribution of someone who has more extensive expertise than myself(doesn't always take much in tailoring). I was also told at the time that common womens' stays were often cut differently because they didn't have the luxury of not raising their arms; much the way that few women today wear haute couture in their daily lives but they wear practical clothing that fits their lifestyles and budgets.

posted below are the front and back of a current gown { from our time}...

see where the shoulder is ...

{now i know thegown is a bit loose on me} but i am going to incorporate the sleeve placement on a set of stays pattern and make a bodiced gown ( top and bottom coodinate but are not one} (drafting the pattern from the stays superimposed with sleeve as they are attached to the dress pictured...

As to the terminology... we refer to the boned, separate bodice top as a bodice gown to clarify it from the actual mantuas of the time which were loose gowns, with pleated backs, sewn down or often just belted, which were not boned but worn over stays. I believe Kass MaGann coined the term

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Also I am not quite sure what you mean by the statement "The only picture that comes through on this thread is showing a MANTUA, with the skirts pulled back."

The term mantua, as we use it for GAoP, in origin seems not to be used until 1670s when referring to the loose gown, which did not lace up the back, which a few of the illustrations, when viewing the originals, certainly show lacing up the back..

Ah need to correct myself and offer apologies for getting the term wrong on this one...this is indeed referred to as a boned bodice by Waugh...I was recalling the wrong garment, which is an earlier jacket on the proceeding page...

Caption for the photo states: c. 1650-60. Boned bodice of blue moire silk. The construction of the foundation of this bodice is shown in Fig. 12. (If anyone wishes to see this please let me know and I will scan it in as well).

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It amazes me that the difficulty in making the the pieces of the bodice was very time consuming and sewing them together. In today's world we at least can make patterns that are more comprehensive and can be altered to our needs and having a sewing machine is the best!