On demand with Roamio

Does the new Roamio support 2 way communications with the cable card so that on demand and PPV can be used with the cable company ?

On TiVo's site they list on demand as a feature, but what do they qualify as such as they link that I think to comcast cc info?

Would this depend on the cable provider for support off of such? I my case it Mediacom who is currently deploying re-branded TiVo Roamio boxes with Mini's look multiroom viewing which have on demand and PPV buying capabilities so I know it technically possible but I'm not sure how my cable company has changed the original TiVo to accomplish such but they do claim theirs will not function with regular TiVo s for example MRV so if that's true there's no telling what else they changed to make (I'm not sure if they know a lot about normal TiVo's so I'm not taking their word for it).

So are there any Roamio owners out there that can comment on being able to do on demand and PPV content when they haven't been able to do such on older TiVo boxes?

TiVos on demand support is mainly through Comcast Xfinity. CableCARD is only one way. Comcast Xfinity works by using special VOD servers that allow the TiVo app to communicate with the via the internet, then redirecting one of the tuners to the proper VOD frequency. They also announced similar deals with Cox and Charter years ago, but I think both deals fell through. I'm not sure what they have available on the smaller providers. However even if it is available via the TiVos offered by your provider that does not guarantee it's available on retail units.

So is the listed "on demand" feature shown in the Roamio specs different than the older TiVo's which never listed that as a feature with cable cards? , for example the series 4 and older models with cable cards slots simply state is required to receive digital channels. I'm fairly sure I going to upgrade to the Roamio with Mediacom so I guess I will find out but I'm not holding my breath.

Technically there should be no reason why even the older cable cards capable TiVo's should be able to have two way communications to the cable cards but rather just cable companies not wanting to embrace the full capabilities of the cards which only cuts down on their income as for example the last 6 years I have never ordered a Mediacom PPV or purchased any additional on demand content.

I think the issue with On-Demand support is data, or the lack thereof. TiVo gets its guide data from a third party, not your local cable company. That publicly available data does not include On-Demand. To support On-Demand requires the co-operation of the cable provider to supply TiVo with the specific titles available, the method of requesting it, and the determination of the "channel" to tune to. In other words, the provider has to feed the available list to TiVo, TiVo formats and displays it to the user, who selects, let's say, the latest episode of "Community". Then that request has to be sent to the provider, who then sends back the specific channel that will be used to deliver the program to the DVR. For providers (like Verizon) who already use internet based communications with their STB's, it would be a relatively simple technological step for TiVo to provide On-Demand access. For others that use a reverse channel on the coax it gets a bit more complicated.

Regardless of the technical issues, the real stumbling block is that the cable companies would rather rent you a DVR for $19 every month than do the work to allow TiVo to offer On-Demand.

I think the issue with On-Demand support is data, or the lack thereof. TiVo gets its guide data from a third party, not your local cable company. That publicly available data does not include On-Demand. To support On-Demand requires the co-operation of the cable provider to supply TiVo with the specific titles available, the method of requesting it, and the determination of the "channel" to tune to. In other words, the provider has to feed the available list to TiVo, TiVo formats and displays it to the user, who selects, let's say, the latest episode of "Community". Then that request has to be sent to the provider, who then sends back the specific channel that will be used to deliver the program to the DVR. For providers (like Verizon) who already use internet based communications with their STB's, it would be a relatively simple technological step for TiVo to provide On-Demand access. For others that use a reverse channel on the coax it gets a bit more complicated.

Regardless of the technical issues, the real stumbling block is that the cable companies would rather rent you a DVR for $19 every month than do the work to allow TiVo to offer On-Demand.

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The problem is that the CableCARD standard was written back in the mid 90s when most people were still watching live TV directly on a television and all they thought was needed was a way to tune encrypted digital channels without a box. It's only one way. Cable company boxes have proprietary hardware inside that allows them to communicate with the cable head end, which makes VOD possible. However every system is different and there is no standard for a retail box like TiVo to implement. The systems in use by Comcast and RCN expose the communication side of their VOD servers to the internet so that 3rd party devices like TiVo can communicate with them via IP instead over over coax. Unfortunately doing that is not mandated by the FCC so cable companies have to do it voluntarily, and thus far only Comcast and RCN have done it and even then only in some markets.

Sure...and what is their incentive? They lose the box rental fees and get little or no incremental income. Without a mandate, I can't imagine many would bother.

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I forget about the box rental aspects, still people like me haven't missed what they didn't have, still they are missing out of potential revenue by establishing a standard that would work with both their boxes and others which use their cable cards.

It is frustrating in issues like this to know that there has been the technology for many years to accomplish something easy yet due to non-technical reasons (political & ruthless business practices) a solution is not delivered.

I really wish I could try my local cableco 's TiVo solution however while they available, they are only allowing new customers to have them. I might try contacting them though their customer support forum as they have online mods that work for the cableco and can make modifications to my account. (Mediacom 's phone support is terrible but their online is excellent).

Sure...and what is their incentive? They lose the box rental fees and get little or no incremental income. Without a mandate, I can't imagine many would bother.

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The incentive is the PPV and other pay stuff that is on OD, to keep my wife from paying for a movie I have set up the TiVo with a PIN for pay movies, she knows the PIN, but at least she will not start to watch a movie that she thinks is free that is really a pay for movie.

The incentive is the PPV and other pay stuff that is on OD, to keep my wife from paying for a movie I have set up the TiVo with a PIN for pay movies, she knows the PIN, but at least she will not start to watch a movie that she thinks is free that is really a pay for movie.

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Now, you don't get PPV from your CC do you? If so, who is your cable Co and how does that work with your tivo box? I can see the PPV on my TiVo, jut can't buy them.

Now, you don't get PPV from your CC do you? If so, who is your cable Co and how does that work with your tivo box? I can see the PPV on my TiVo, jut can't buy them.

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Theoretically, you should be able to call into your cable company and order PPV events over the phone. As such, the companies system would authorize the PPV channel on your CableCard for the appropriate time limit and then revoke the authorization at the end. This a a YMMV as it works for some people who have tried it, but not for others.

Theoretically, you should be able to call into your cable company and order PPV events over the phone. As such, the companies system would authorize the PPV channel on your CableCard for the appropriate time limit and then revoke the authorization at the end. This a a YMMV as it works for some people who have tried it, but not for others.

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Never thought of that, in this day of automation we forget the old ways of talking to another human to appease our own entertainment desires!

Now, you don't get PPV from your CC do you? If so, who is your cable Co and how does that work with your tivo box? I can see the PPV on my TiVo, jut can't buy them.

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Really? I thought the PPV options (e.g. movies) 'just work' on the Tivo. If not, why aren't they filtered out? (I'd want them filtered out anyway.)

Plus, I'm slightly skeptical that the On Demand info is provided from someone else? I have StreamPix (effectively a mini mini mini mini Netflix video-like option that adds to the On Demand options -- I got it as part of a bundle and have _rarely_ used it, but I have used it).. and I can use that through my Tivo too.. That's definitely by Comcast itself.

Really? I thought the PPV options (e.g. movies) 'just work' on the Tivo. If not, why aren't they filtered out? (I'd want them filtered out anyway.)

Plus, I'm slightly skeptical that the On Demand info is provided from someone else? I have StreamPix (effectively a mini mini mini mini Netflix video-like option that adds to the On Demand options -- I got it as part of a bundle and have _rarely_ used it, but I have used it).. and I can use that through my Tivo too.. That's definitely by Comcast itself.

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I have Mediacom and I can see the ppv channels including the what appears as the correct guide info but with a 2 tuner Premiere, if I change to the channel I just get a blank screen. As mentioned the TiVo website mentions Comcast as being given supported but only them, I guess if there were more they would list them.

I only asked as I was curious if the Roamio were different compared to older Tivos because my cable company uses Roamio for their TiVo supplied solution and they have told me their boxes have custom firmware to support their Ppv. Given the fact that I have yet to find anyone at Mediacom who knows anything about TiVo other than how to spell the word TiVo, I really didn't believe them, they explained this was due to that their Roamio could do two communications on the cable card while the normal TiVo's cannot.

It just saves me money not being able to buy Ppv, if I want something better I can watch Netflix or order a movie off Amazon.

Now, you don't get PPV from your CC do you? If so, who is your cable Co and how does that work with your tivo box? I can see the PPV on my TiVo, jut can't buy them.

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With Comcast and RCn you can. The way it works is the TiVo has a special aol that can communicate with the VOD server via the internet. Once you order a movie it dumps you to live TV where it has tuned the required frequency for your VOD "channel". All the communication between the TiVo and the VOD server happens over the internet. Unlike a real cable company supplied box where the communication happens via a two way connection over the coax.