I don't know how it felt like a rehash for you. MJ was oblivious to Peter's feelings for her for most of the first movie. At the beginning of the movie they came off as casual acquaintances rather than friends. In Spider-Man 2 they had become best friends, and MJ and Peter were on the same page regarding their feelings for each other, they had just reached a stage where Peter had decided he can't be with her for her own safety, and she had technically moved on with someone else but she still wanted to be with Peter.

Two different scenarios.

Technically yes, but the drama was still felt pretty arbitrary and uneeded. And the tension of 'will they won't they' was still the same, and feeling rather stale at that. I may not have disliked it as much if I hadn't already had to endure their drama from the first film.

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Oh I'm not condoning her treatment of John Jameson at all. I generally loathe MJ as a character in all three movies (Spider-Man 3 being her worst outing). I think she's generally a selfish creature who uses men to fill some emotional void in herself.

However I felt she trampled over more men in Spider-Man 1 than she did in Spider-Man 2. I mean to think she basically goes through Flash, Harry, Spidey, and Peter in one movie is hilariously bad. She throws her feminine wiles around like ninja stars in that movie.

Again it's possible that my endurance had just been worn out by the second film, but I still feel that her treatment of John was worse than anything she put Harry or Flash through in the first film. Agreed though; she was still pretty awful 'Spider-man'

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Ok, but you still haven't elaborated on what was so bad about this story other than saying you don't like it.

I just think its a silly story idea. If you want him lose his powers I feel that there must be better ways of doing it, I'm not sure what that would be, but there has to be SOMETHING. It's not like I lose my ability to walk or hold objects with my hands simply because I'm going through and emotionally traumatic time. So why would his 'Spider DNA' (or whatever) turn off like that? I know the answer is 'because his problems were related to his being Spider-man' and others will argue 'it's a comic movie, so why take it so seriously', but at the end of the day I felt it was pretty weak reasoning.

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"Here's your change"

Ock: "You're getting on my nerves"
Spidey: "I have a knack for that"

Train driver: "Any more bright ideas?"
Spidey: "I got a few yeah"

The whole scene in the elevator with Hal Sparks.

There was yahoos when he was delivering the pizzas, in the final swing, and when he went after the two car thieves on the way to MJ's play.

While I would hesitate to call "I got a few yeah" a quip (nitpicking I know), You do have a point here. Mostly I think it just didn't stick out to me. I still feel that Spidey wasn't as fun in this film, but that's just a personal opinion I guess. I should have remembered the elevator scene though.

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Fair enough. I'm not questioning your preference. Just some of the points you raised regarding Spider-Man 2.

Technically yes, but the drama was still felt pretty arbitrary and uneeded. And the tension of 'will they won't they' was still the same, and feeling rather stale at that. I may not have disliked it as much if I hadn't already had to endure their drama from the first film.

I don't know if I'd call the drama unneeded. Part of Peter's problem in this movie was letting people he cared about down. Aunt May, Harry, and MJ. All in different ways. But the same theme.

This again was the opposite to Spider-Man 1 where Peter was always there for MJ with a supportive kind word, as opposed to Spider-Man 2 where he was always letting her down because of his life as Spider-Man.

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Again it's possible that my endurance had just been worn out by the second film, but I still feel that her treatment of John was worse than anything she put Harry or Flash through in the first film. Agreed though; she was still pretty awful 'Spider-man'

I don't know, Harry said he was crazy about her, and like with John she was clearly using him to fill an emotional void. Though I agree jilting John at the altar is harsher than dumping Harry because she likes Peter.

But her behavior in SM-1 stood out for me more because of the high rota of men she went through, and dating Peter's best friend as opposed to a guy Peter doesn't know. It has to be some kind of record for a superhero love interest.

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I just think its a silly story idea. If you want him lose his powers I feel that there must be better ways of doing it, I'm not sure what that would be, but there has to be SOMETHING. It's not like I lose my ability to walk or hold objects with my hands simply because I'm going through and emotionally traumatic time. So why would his 'Spider DNA' (or whatever) turn off like that? I know the answer is 'because his problems were related to his being Spider-man' and others will argue 'it's a comic movie, so why take it so seriously', but at the end of the day I felt it was pretty weak reasoning.

Have you never heard of people becoming physically sick because of psychological stress? It's the exact same principle here. Except instead of breaking out in a rash, or getting dizzy, or having a panic attack, or throwing up etc, Peter's powers went on the blink. That was part of his deep seated yearning to not be Spider-Man any more and live a normal life.

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While I would hesitate to call "I got a few yeah" a quip (nitpicking I know), You do have a point here. Mostly I think it just didn't stick out to me. I still feel that Spidey wasn't as fun in this film, but that's just a personal opinion I guess. I should have remembered the elevator scene though.

It's probably because he endured more harsh times in this one as opposed to SM-1, where the only real negative was his Uncle's death. In Spider-Man 2, being Spider-Man was the source of his problems.

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"Sometimes I remember it one way. Sometimes another. If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"

Have you never heard of people becoming physically sick because of psychological stress? It's the exact same principle here. Except instead of breaking out in a rash, or getting dizzy, or having a panic attack, or throwing up etc, Peter's powers went on the blink. That was part of his deep seated yearning to not be Spider-Man any more and live a normal life.

I am aware of it and have seen my friends go through it, but something about the execution of the plot-line just didn't ring true to me.

The thing is, I don't HATE the movie/sick story, because if I did I wouldn't rewatch a couple times a year. I think Spider-man 2 was a solid action adventure flick, and a bunch of fun. But there is a distinction I make to 'what I enjoy' and what I feel doesn't quite work if I'm being a bit more critical. The explanation to Spider-man's sickness story just feels a bit silly or convenient (for the plot, not Spider-man obviously).

Now obviously the first film does come with a number of its own flaws as well, but if I HAD to pick my favourite Raimi flick I would choose the first, with Spider-man 2 coming in a close second.

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It's probably because he endured more harsh times in this one as opposed to SM-1, where the only real negative was his Uncle's death. In Spider-Man 2, being Spider-Man was the source of his problems.

You're probably right. And while I don't have any problem with Spider-man going through tough times (after all, it would be boring if he didn't) I still felt that it came across a bit heavier than was needed. In all fairness I don't know what I would have done differently, but that's how I feel. It is what it is.

3 is my personal favourite, despite being the weakest of the three. There's just so many things I love in that film.

1 is close behind, if it wasn't for some poor (Goblin-related) choices it'd be a flawless film. 2 would be last, even though I'd say it's probably the best film objectively. No idea why, I just look forward to seeing the other two more.