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I've been on and off OKC for the past few months and, full disclosure, I don't get 100 messages a day. In fact on a good day I might get two. I'm not super hot, average at best. I'm relatively nerdy and straightforward which probably plays as boring, but I put myself (my real self) out there and I don't mind getting judged for it because then I meet guys that I think I might really have a future with.

This means when I get messaged I'll pay you special attention. I'll respond with long messages, really try to engage with you, give you more than a fair shot to get off on a good foot. Even if I don't think we'll work out, I'm going to send you a message telling you that politely and (hopefully) kindly.

With all that being said, please, PLEASE, if you're interested in a woman, give them an opening to continue the conversation. You don't have to ask me out in our first few back and forths, but give me a question or a fun fact that I can bounce off of. This is not just an issue guys have with girls, it works both ways on this site.

If you're tired of girls disappearing off the face of the earth, this might be one of the problems.

Similarly, you should have something interesting in your profile that a guy can reference. Are guys supposed to just come up with a unique, random, interesting fact about the world or witty statement for each of the 10-20 messages they send per day? Not really possible, not really worth it. Help 'em out.

Sadly, this is what I try to do instead of using some sort of one-liner. If I get a response, big IF on that one, a lot of them are really short and they don't really expand on anything or ask me any type of follow ups. I started to just take these as a polite rejection of sorts.

I send out messages, too, and have a pretty low response rate. I think that's just par for the course.

Here's a message I sent recently, haven't gotten a reply back. Everything I said was related to what he wrote in his profile:

I like how you write. You convey such personal energy!

What is it that you like about Kierkegaard?

How good are you at tin whistle? Do you play jigs?

What kind of dancing do you like - do you swing or tango? Or is it strictly club dancing where you get to be a bit crazy? Do you like live music? (jazz band, classical, rock, Arabic...)

"Allegro Non Troppo" is probably one of my favorite animated films ever. I love the Valse Triste, and the Bolero segments the best. I happened to see Bolero with I was 13, when I was flipping channels, and it made a huge impression on me. I was pleased last year when I found that Netflix had this film.

Too many topics, too many questions! The messages I like to receive basically ask me one or two questions based on one thing off of my profile. Your initial message should make the reader WANT to respond back (if they find you attractive, have high match, etc) and not put a lot of pressure on them to address everything in your message.

I would have stuck to one topic, e.g. the literary/Kierkegaard topic or the dancing one. What you have here just seems like a bunch of non-sequitors, even though I know you were trying to address things on his profile.

You're just composing messages by throwing a bunch of questions out at people. There's no personality or reason why somebody would want to write back unless they want to sex you based on your pics. This message would be better if you only had the first and last paragraphs and deleted everything in-between. You aren't specifically asking a question at the end, but you're sharing a personal experience that can easily be responded to by sharing their own.

She isn't going on 30 dates a month, so guess what? Lots of guys that message her still aren't getting replied to. And those that do get replied to are likely wasting their time with her.

For every 30+ guys a month that message her, how many realistically does she go out with?

So even if you are a "low-rated" girl the odds are still ridiculously stacked in your favor.

As someone who gets 1 view a day if I am lucky, these "down and out" women make me laugh. 2 messages a day I'd feel like a fucking goddamned pimp. If I got one message every week I'd be fucking thrilled.

Low rated guys like me are lucky to get a message every few weeks, and most peter out before a date.

I've experienced this several times. It sucks when the first and second back and forth goes so well, and then the third message leaves you nothing to work with. The conversation is usually done for me there

Not to discount what you said. Messages should be enough to continue the conversation, especially openers.

I have to say though, that as a guy, your post comes off a bit entitled. You're LUCKY that not only can you message guys, but guys will just come to you, one at a time or two at a time is a bad complaint.

We'd be happy to have that kind of interest, bad messages or otherwise.

TL;DR - your complaint should be a rant to other girls, who might sympathize with your plight. Putting it out to guys is like complaining about your evian bottle size to a rural child in Saharan Africa.

Post script - I'm not attacking you, and in fact appreciate you try to respond to each guy, you seem very nice. I'd probably send you a long introduction if we lived in the same place.

I definitely get that a guy's perspective versus a girl's perspective would be completely different. But I wanted to make it clear that the old cop out "girl's get tons of messages filled with dick pics all the time" excuse doesn't apply to everyone and that we're not all disappearing on you because of a full inbox. There can be other reasons and I think this is a valid one.

On the ladies' scale of attention I'm on the lower end, but if I were a guy I'd be outpacing a ton of you. It's just very different on the other side of the fence. I'm very lucky that I have interest, god knows it's more than I get in real life, and I'm happy for it (especially because the guys replying are usually one's well suited to me) but that doesn't mean I'm not disappointed when a cute guy I think I have a lot in common with can't glance over my profile long enough to ask a question about my major.

Either way, definitely no offence taken. We're just two different people coming at it from two different angles. I appreciate hearing from your side of things!

I went on one of the threads on here where someone checked my star and dot status, so the number of stars averaged by all guys who have rated my pics and/or profile. I was a 3-, meaning I averaged less than three stars overall.

It's a feature that only pay accounts have and I was curious. Compared to most of the other girls who asked for ratings I was definitely on the lower end.

Ah, ok. I've never seen those threads. I don't really come to this subreddit very often. I'm just now noticing that you live in Baltimore (username should've been a giveaway). Coincidentally, so do i. Have you ever been to Red Emma's?

That it does, you might even be able to pass for a native. Red Emma's is pretty cool. It's like this anarchist coffee/book shop/store in Mount Vernon, definitely a unique place. Want to go some time? We can do it up CBD-style.

I don't think a lot of guys here would not message a girl because they thought they wouldn't get a response. Most of us are grizzled vets of OKC and know that it's just up to the fates who will respond to us.

I'd guess 90% of guys here would be sending you a message that focuses on your profile, questions, etc.

On the other hand, you should realize that we don't get any of the treatment you do by and large. We send out messages almost exclusively and have a very small return rate.

Even in context you are complaining about things we'd love to have. And it's not greener on this side of the fence. Your audience here is again, by a great percentage, guys who send long and thoughtful messages.

Your gripe would be our joy, so really, it's a painful gripe to hear pointed at guys here. You're honestly complaining about something you're fortunate for. Remember that. If you really think the guy is awesome, return his message by pointing out his profile and asking him questions.

I think you're under the impression that I'm waiting for guys to message me. I'm not. I contact guys just as often as they contact me and although I probably get blown off a lower percentage of the time than the guys I do get blown off frequently. And I don't take it personally.

What I'm complaining about here is that if a girl contacts you with genuine interest, or you contact a girl and she replies with genuine interest, it's on both parties shoulders to maintain conversation. I've seen this exact complaint come from guys quite a bit saying that us women reply with one line answers.

I understand that OKC by design is tilted unfairly towards women but that doesn't mean that some of us don't get very similar, albeit not identical, treatment as guys do. I've had this happen quite a bit where instead of saying "thanks but no thanks" they string me along with one sentence answers with no opening to pursue something further.

I think the attitude of "poor me, I'm surrounded by women too conceited and narcissistic to even read my carefully worded, perfectly prosed message" is very near-sighted. There are a lot of women who don't get those dreamy messages every day, who put time and effort into profiles and don't get nearly as much attention as the other girls. Guys do as much window shopping as the girls do.

This complaint doesn't apply to all guys and maybe you're already doing everything you need to in order to find the right girl, but on a subreddit where we're trying to figure out how to meet more, better matches this is something that guys should and can consider. Are you keeping up your end of the bargain after the initial contact? Maybe. But some other guy might not.

I've had this happen quite a bit where instead of saying "thanks but no thanks" they string me along with one sentence answers with no opening to pursue something further.

A lot of guys are very very very concise online. It's not them being disinterested it's that a lot of men are passive rather than active online. If you're contacting them they figure their reply is showing interest in and of itself. I don't try to make conversation online. I just push for them to set up a date with me and push my number right at them.

I'd be interested in the statistics behind your statement "Guys do as much window shopping as the girls do."

And I don't doubt girls get similar treatment to guys during a messaging encounter, just I'm saying that the opportunity girls have is much higher. You might have a similar fail rate after the messaging starts, but the opportunity for messages is much higher. You have a much higher response rate statistically.

And yes. My point. You don't get blown off as much.

What we're talking about here is a one line intro message from OP. Conversation one -liners are always a bad sign, and can happen to anyone. If you're interested, you'll ask a question. If you're really not, then you won't.

IF someone is feeding me one line answers, I'll immediately ask them out before I force the conversation any further.

The point of this argument is to say to OP, look. Guys would love to be in that position, and still get that treatment.

In general, for guys, our opportunity chance is much less than women. That's just a fact we live with. I'm not complaining about it, but it's hard to hear complaints about having too many.

In real life, I sympathize with women more. They can't do their !@#$ing laundry without having a guy come over with the come hither expression, asking for the "time". It'd be annoying. OR at a club, having guys grope and grind on you with no provocation, simply because that's what they assume will potentially work 1/1000 of the time.

I admit. I'm happy when I'm a guy and I'm traveling and I have to worry less about taking that friendly offer for a ride and don't have to immediately worry as much statistically about sexual predation, etc.

On OKC, messages are harmless. They don't take up physical space, and it's rather easy to click the profile, look at rating, look at picture, glance profile and decide. NOPE.

And yah, I agree guys complain from time to time about the skewed nature of OKC. I'm not, that's the game. You have to eventually get over it and just send messages. Be glad when it works, because eventually it does!

Anyway, I didn't mean any disrespect to you, but I thought you were responding out of the argument. IE, thinking I was complaining about the nature of OKC/women/etc. I am really specifically commenting on OP's distress at something that is relatively benign, to an audience that would love to have that problem.

Again, had she been complaining about sexually explicit messages, or guys being complete dicks, I'd be in her corner. I'm glad I don't have to deal with the latter, that's for sure. The former.. well it'd be nice until it got old. Which I imagine would happen fast.

You're LUCKY that not only can you message guys, but guys will just come to you, one at a time or two at a time is a bad complaint.

You're a man. You get advantages that women don't get, even just physically, let alone in other parts of society. The fact that you don't have to give birth ever in your entire life should make up for the fact that you have to speak to a woman first in a dating situation.

Guys: stop complaining that you don't get messages sent to you. You are messaging the people you are interested in, so you are always for sure that the people talking to you are the ones you want to have talking to you. Women have to wade through messages from people they aren't interested in at all. How is that lucky? It sounds like a pain in the ass to me. To me it sounds like guys are actually lucky.

I sincerely hope that you didn't actually believe that you had to tell me that. I don't know why you stopped to say this, especially when someone else already said it. You're both idiots, but at least they were original.

Your addition to the conversation is incalculable. Priceless, that's what you are.

The original comment was about how women have a small privilege; not having to send out messages. And then he, as happens many times on this sub, complained about how the OP shouldn't mention that privilege because he has to take time to send out messages and doesn't get to enjoy things like that.

I pointed out that his life was full of privilege that a woman doesn't get to enjoy, one of those privileges being that he doesn't have to give birth.

Can you say that an individual woman doesn't HAVE TO get pregnant? Yes. Can you say that women as a whole gender don't have to get pregnant, even here you can technically say it.

In general, in making this and most any point using an example, we stick to commonly accepted notions of what the idea means. SO in the world as we live in it today, do women as a whole group have to have children in order for our species to perpetuate itself, yes. Can some of those women avoid this task, yes.

I should not have had to break this down in order for you to understand how an example works in an argument. If you want to be a pedant, there is almost always an exception to every rule.

Does the original commenter HAVE TO send out messages? Nope, but he won't get dates on OKC without it. Does a woman HAVE TO get pregnant? Nope, but she won't have her (non-adopted) child without it.

If OP had been complaining about being harassed, sexually or otherwise, I could have sympathized.

On your Guys: comment. You know. You could go and look for guys you're interested in and mostly ignore the ones sending you messages too.

I can complain on the basis that I have a much lower percentage chance of getting a response from someone I'm interested in, and have a low pool of people who are seeking me out.

You're complaining that your virtual buffet has entrees you don't want, but also includes your favorite dishes. IMO a bad argument.

I'm also not complaining that we get low messages, I'm just saying that OP's complaint, directed at guys, isn't really a good one.

Honestly, you don't have to condescend and bring up sexism. There's no place for that in the argument. I have sisters, I have a twin sister. I know very well and worry over the plight of women in society and their safety enough.

This argument was simply about a specific issue, not a broad one, and to be honest.. if your complaint is that you only take in your messages, instead of sending out messages to people you're interested in. It's really not a great argument.

Instead of having the ability to screen interested parties, and have a better % chance response from people we're interested in, we have to seek out our dates every time, and deal with the fact that 10-25% return is a good response rate.

At the end of the day, I wasn't complaining about my plight. I do well enough. But it is irksome to have someone complain about what we'd consider a great position to be in.

You've already screened your messages for interested people because you're only sending to people you're interested in. Even if you only get 25% of your messages back, 100% of those are from people you're interested in.

Also from having seen the messages women get and then say "all he had to do was send me a normal message, he was cute and I was interested but he blew it in the first message" I seriously don't think you're any worse off and still contend that we're in a better spot. I think you're judging the position poorly, and it seems like most of your argument is that you don't want to have to type out messages.

How many women on this sub have complained that not the right kind of guy is messaging them? What is everyone's advice every time? Message guys yourself. The real usefulness of the site isn't sitting back and waiting for the right someone to message you, its picking who you want and making your best go at it. Unless you're a hot guy or a hot girl, your prospects are probably going to be pretty weak as far as getting messages.

As a guy, I wouldn't want to be chosen anyway. I like to go after things, and do the choosing.

Guys: stop complaining that you don't get messages sent to you. You are messaging the people you are interested in, so you are always for sure that the people talking to you are the ones you want to have talking to you. Women have to wade through messages from people they aren't interested in at all. How is that lucky? It sounds like a pain in the ass to me. To me it sounds like guys are actually lucky.

And as a woman who does message some men that interest her she gets to hear "you must be ugly or desperate" since I'm not so so so busy waiting in the shadows for men to come at me from all directions.

I remember 2 summers ago seeing a cute dude on my visitors list like 4 times over 2 weeks. I did everything to poke at him (revisit his profile, rate him 5 stars, blah blah) and finally finally he messages me. We went on four dates. I could have messaged him first but, you know, then I'd seem desperate. Instead I sat there pining for him ... desperately.

Yeah, I did that to this one girl on OKC. She was cute, she was a fantastic match (Seriously, it got up to 99% after we answered a few of each other's questions), but she didn't seem to be looking for someone quite like me, and with her Q&As, I knew she had to be getting hit up right and left. So while it'd be nice, the odds were fairly stacked against me.

You know what she did? She messaged me. We talked. Turns out that a number of things I'd listed on my profile were major turn-offs, but after talking, they didn't seem that bad. We met up. The sex has been freaking awesome, for both of us. The snuggling, even better. The clue-by-fours to the head that I need on a regular basis, not so much- but they're certainly helpful. If she hadn't messaged me, I'd probably never have realized the interest was mutual.

It's how redditors, even ones in this sub, talk about women who actually message men. You know: we must not be hot enough to be passive users just sifting our constantly full inboxes. Hey man, sometimes I turn everything off and just hunt for my own fish. Yeesh.

Wow that's a great point. Up until now I thought that even women who were single their whole lives were forced into immaculate conception. Thanks for taking the time to give me the knowledge that I guess everyone else just figured that, as an adult, I already knew.

Your post gives me hope to keep trying. I always try to leave interesting questions in my replies. I think I speak for all the guys here when we say, we appreciate you taking the time to not only respond to us, but put thought behind it. May you find an awesome guy who appreciates that!

As opposed to the "Oh look, I have 300 new messages. This one looks hot, he's Monday. There's a shirtless dude that sent me a dick pick, he's more like a Thursday, when I'll be looking for a random for sexytimes. That just leaves Tuesday and Wednesday."

Thanks for the well wishes! And don't give up! There are a bunch of girls like me out there. I may not be a size 2 but I watch football on Sundays, can debate with some knowledge whether Star Trek or Star Wars is more awesome and make a mean roast chicken. :)

I intentionally keep messages short. I'm at best average and I fall on the too old side for the site / women as many men my age are looking for women in their 20s-to-early-30s only still. I turn off my visitors so if I want to message a guy I just message a guy. I don't do coy shit to get them to message me and I hardly log in.

I keep my exchanges quick and brief because I don't want to invest in a dud. I keep my dates easy. A bar after work usually on a bus route. It's at best an excuse to have drinks since I am just a social drinker.

I would rather feel out guys before meeting them but I've found over the years the longer I talk to a guy online the less inclined I've been to meet them. A lot of people blow it when you begin chatting with them. Cue: dude who seemed okay until he began asking me what my bra size was (I said I don't wear one) and then trying to get me to send him pictures of my boobs.

What's worse is he wanted to meet me and then we're talking, on gchat, and after conversing a few times he says, "can I ask a personal question?" I said, "sure but I might not give you a direct answer." Cue asking my bra size &/or how big are my boobs. More than once when I said "this isn't a question I am willing to answer." Finally blocked him and he kept on stalking my profile for weeks.