suzi wrote:Stop calling them raptors, they're clearly herons of some sort, this is embarrassing. If these make it into the canon as raptors, OTT has become dogmatic and fanatical. The descent into extremism begins.

They're clearly tiny flamingos

From the one looking up in frame 1397, I immediately thought comorant.

The story of my life in xkcdmafia:

Tigerlion wrote:Well, I imagine as the game progresses, various people will be getting moody.

BoomFrog wrote:I still have no idea what town moody really looks like.

Within 10 Newpix they will have found wood enough to build a raft. They will spend 2 newpix dragging it to the river1. They will give up. They will meet up to the river 3 newpix after that. They will follow it for 5 newpix, then they will find a bridge and cross.

1not as big a the sea2.2big.

You need to multiply all your numbers by 10. It would take about 100 newpix to gather wood and build a raft, for example.

Basically boils down to North American vs most of the rest of the world.

OK. The link was a good discussion. Thanks, foilman!

I have two things to say on the subject.

1) LEGO is concerned about trademark erosion, and they are trying to prevent people referring to locking bits of plastic as legos. Once that is firmly entrenched without them defending their trademark, then LEGO bricks can go the way of the Zipper slide fastener. So to really resist their attempts to shape the language, you need to refer to their product improperly: "Hey, these don't fit together very well." *Looks at the bits of plastic* "That's because there are Mega Bloks legos mixed in with the LEGO legos--sorry about that."

2) LEGO is generally treated as a mass noun in Europe, but is not treated that way consistently in North America. I'm sympathetic to both, but when Lego is used to refer to the pieces our family's usage tends toward the singular noun. I think that's because the most common usages are "Pick up your Legos" and "I need some more blue Legos to finish my xxxx. Can I get some from your yyyy?" In these cases, the pieces are definitely being talked about in a countable, individually manipulated objects. We rarely refer to them as bricks.

I'm having to do a mini-blitz here to ketchup, so hopefully I won't see these same comments later on, but. . .

First: regarding the fact that "Lego" is a brand name. Here's an old Texas joke. (This works best when spoken with a strong Texas drawl.)

A man walks into a diner and sits at the counter.Waitress: "What can I get you?"Man: "A coke."Waitress: "What flavor?"Man: "Orange."

This is funny (and accurate) because in small-town Texas, people refer to all carbonated beverages as "cokes" (hence the lower-case "c") and you just have to be specific about what flavor you want: an Orange Crush, a Dr. Pepper, or, for that matter, a Coca-Cola.

I thought of this because of the discussion about the Lego company's concern about losing its brand. I haven't seen the Coca-Cola company suffer legal issues in Texas yet, but I'm sure they've worked hard at protecting their brand. (Although I'm sure they had to distribute lots of Xeroxed memos to educate their employees, distribute Band-Aid Brand Adhesive Strips to the employees they had to beat up over this, and consume a lot of Kleenex Brand Facial Tissues to the executives who cried a lot of tears out of stress.)

Second: regarding the pluralization of "Lego". Some people have commented that "Legos" isn't a word because "Lego" is already plural, like "sand" or "water". How many of you out there have heard people talk about having "50 e-mails in my inbox"? This one has been like fingernails on a chalkboard to me since I started hearing it a decade or two ago. I don't think you can have 50 e-mails any more than you can have 50 mails delivered by the mailman. You can have sand, water, mail, and e-mail, but you can't have sands, waters, mails, or e-mails. (Unless you're talking about classes or categories, such as "sands from five different beaches of the world", which is not the usage we're talking about here.)

I have always said, "I have 50 e-mail messages in my inbox." I guess this is analogous to saying "I have 50 Lego bricks".

Third: regarding the wheelbarrow. I don't remember who posted the picture of the wheelbarrow and asked what people call it, but so far in my mini-blitz, I haven't seen any other name for it (other than snarky responses). I'm hoping it'll be addressed again in an upcoming post. I'm curious what the author had intended, because at the moment, I don't have a clue what else it would be called other than "wheelbarrow".

My brother took a college linguistics class from a professor who specialized in regional dialects. One fun thing he did in his classes was to have his students read a short paragraph, and based on the way they pronounced certain words, he could generally identify within 100 miles or so where in the US that person grew up. (When my brother did the exercise, the professor correctly recognized that my brother grew up in a military family that traveled extensively, and he could identify several of the places we had lived.)

Another fun thing he did in the class was show pictures of common objects (such as the wheelbarrow) and ask students to write down what they were called. Some of them included:- a bottle containing a carbonated beverage- the valve-like device attached to the side of your house that you might attach a garden hose to- a paper container that the grocery store puts your purchases into so you can carry them out

Someguy945 wrote:You need to multiply all your numbers by 10. It would take about 100 newpix to gather wood and build a raft, for example.

Not if the GLR doesn't want it to take that long. And they wouldn't have build the raft, would have found the wood and try to drag it to the river1. They would have decided that that was to heavy and would have left it before they found the river.

That is, if this wasn't an alternate dimension where my predictions didn't come true.

1Increase by 2 and look it up again.2Hmm, where did I leave this one?3neat.

Mikeski wrote:A "What If" update is never late. Nor is it early. It is posted precisely when it should be.

suzi wrote:Stop calling them raptors, they're clearly herons of some sort, this is embarrassing. If these make it into the canon as raptors, OTT has become dogmatic and fanatical. The descent into extremism begins.

They're clearly tiny flamingos

From the one looking up in frame 1397, I immediately thought comorant.

What about a Limosa Limosa?

The past is full of traps, charms and mirages, but if you just keep up with with what you are doing it will all be fine.

suzi wrote:Stop calling them raptors, they're clearly herons of some sort, this is embarrassing. If these make it into the canon as raptors, OTT has become dogmatic and fanatical. The descent into extremism begins.

They're clearly tiny flamingos

From the one looking up in frame 1397, I immediately thought comorant.

Yech. I hope not, or else that tree where Cuegan nestled won't live much longer

Someguy945 wrote:You need to multiply all your numbers by 10. It would take about 100 newpix to gather wood and build a raft, for example.

Not if the GLR doesn't want it to take that long. And they wouldn't have build the raft, would have found the wood and try to drag it to the river1. They would have decided that that was to heavy and would have left it before they found the river.

That is, if this wasn't an alternate dimension where my predictions didn't come true.

1Increase by 2 and look it up again.2Hmm, where did I leave this one?3neat.

Um, the river is 1, not 3. the tree is3

1Small2big3neat.

“have i gone mad?im afraid so, but let me tell you something, the best people usualy are.”― Lewis Carroll, Alice in Wonderland

k.bookbinder wrote:I feel that this is a glorious morning. They have found that which is small when compared to the sea1, the river2. Also, I believe it reinforces good Edfel's map. I believe his cartographic predictions about the path of river and the path of Cuegan's journey to be very accurate.

Randall bless the Holy Catographer!

The only problem with the map now, is that it doesn't cover Cueball's Berry Adventuretm.

From the one looking up in frame 1397, I immediately thought comorant.

What about a Limosa Limosa?

Bill and size are wrong for flamingo. Neck, bill, and legs are wrong for cormorant or anhinga. Too large to be Limosa or similar type Sandpiper or Killdeer. And Cuegan left the shore of the sea1 long ago where such birds would more likely be found (though Killdeer are fairly common well inland near large bodies or water such as lakes4). Also, neck too long.

1 It is big.4 Of which we have not seen in Time, yet.

"HAL9000" This thread is a goldmine for signatures."StratPlayer" All in all, that sand paper rubbed me the wrong way."charlie_grumbles" The secret of the geeks. "Copy, Borrow, Steal, Succeed""ucim" There's a forestful of treeish people here. Welcome! Confused? See here.

Neil_Boekend wrote:Xips/dips and all that are just weird IMHO. Why would you connect the One True Time Measurement to Outsider units?

Spoiler:

An outsider "day" is simply 2.4 decanewpix. A couple of "days" is a couple of decanewpix (a couple isn't precise enough to warrant a calculation)An outsider "week" is just 1.68 hectonewpix, and a couple of "weeks" is a couple of hectonewpix.An outsider "month" is 0.712 kilonewpix, a couple of "months" is a couple of kilonewpixAn outsider "year" is 8.554 kilonewpix, a couple of "years" is a few dozen kilonewpixAn outsider "Century" is 0.8554 meganewpix

and so forth.

Sadly, we are all children of the Outside, and were raised in its ways. And many of us spend too much Time ketchup blitzing to bother with spending more of it converting Newpixian measurements into numbers our Outside brains can more easily comprehend. It is too late for us pre-Timers. But for the child born today, in the Time of Time, there is still hope. Learning the ways of the OTT while young, these new Newpixians will grow beyond the capabilities of we wretched, Outside-born souls.

Here are my thoughts on the birds-that-some-wish-to-call-by-some-other-name-than-bird:

Knight Temporal of the One True ComicBlitzGirl the Pink, Mopey Molpy Mome

Neil_Boekend wrote:Xips/dips and all that are just weird IMHO. Why would you connect the One True Time Measurement to Outsider units?

Spoiler:

An outsider "day" is simply 2.4 decanewpix. A couple of "days" is a couple of decanewpix (a couple isn't precise enough to warrant a calculation)An outsider "week" is just 1.68 hectonewpix, and a couple of "weeks" is a couple of hectonewpix.An outsider "month" is 0.712 kilonewpix, a couple of "months" is a couple of kilonewpixAn outsider "year" is 8.554 kilonewpix, a couple of "years" is a few dozen kilonewpixAn outsider "Century" is 0.8554 meganewpix

and so forth.

Sadly, we are all children of the Outside, and were raised in its ways. And many of us spend too much Time ketchup blitzing to bother with spending more of it converting Newpixian measurements into numbers our Outside brains can more easily comprehend. It is too late for us pre-Timers. But for the child born today, in the Time of Time, there is still hope. Learning the ways of the OTT while young, these new Newpixians will grow beyond the capabilities of we wretched, Outside-born souls.

Here are my thoughts on the birds-that-some-wish-to-call-by-some-other-name-than-bird:

Indeed, BlitzGirl. Well said! We all, pre-Timers, share this burden. For the Children-of-Time, theirs is a better world, fraught not with heretical Time time conversions with the Outside. How wonderful it shall be.

"HAL9000" This thread is a goldmine for signatures."StratPlayer" All in all, that sand paper rubbed me the wrong way."charlie_grumbles" The secret of the geeks. "Copy, Borrow, Steal, Succeed""ucim" There's a forestful of treeish people here. Welcome! Confused? See here.

Ebonite wrote:My brother took a college linguistics class from a professor who specialized in regional dialects. One fun thing he did in his classes was to have his students read a short paragraph, and based on the way they pronounced certain words, he could generally identify within 100 miles or so where in the US that person grew up. (When my brother did the exercise, the professor correctly recognized that my brother grew up in a military family that traveled extensively, and he could identify several of the places we had lived.)

Another fun thing he did in the class was show pictures of common objects (such as the wheelbarrow) and ask students to write down what they were called. Some of them included:- a bottle containing a carbonated beverage- the valve-like device attached to the side of your house that you might attach a garden hose to- a paper container that the grocery store puts your purchases into so you can carry them out

Naturally, each of these had more names than people realized.

I really want to meet this professor, I'd love to find out what he thinks of my speech. Especially if I've just returned from visiting my relatives in Nebraska. (I've never lived in Nebraska, but I inevitably sound like a Nebraskan for at least a few hours after constant exposure.)

Also, in order of how likely I am to use each word:Soda, the name of the specific beverage, Cola, drink or pop. I try to avoid pop unless I've heard a native use it.Faucet, spigot or tap.Bag or sack.

PastPost exhumation... ZBerg's post count is still 1, so... Also, "The Bible According to Mark Twain" sounds interesting. You futurefolk will have enough Time to discuss it before I reach this post.

ZBerg wrote:Ummm, I can't believe that I finally registered. I've been lurking since long before the beginning of time (for about 35,000 Newpix). I've followed the OTT off and on, and got mighty confused when I first started following and saw everyone's sigs with BlitzGirl rallying. Being out of touch with modern culture, I thought it was a popular reference, but even Google let me down. I've been through the haiku's and the songs and the brilliant Boom-De-Yadda.I've been through all of that to finally join the sentient and say this: is no one else reminded of The Bible According to Mark Twain?

I may post again, maybe not. And here's to hoping I don't get buried in the annals of Time.

And, with that, I've been made Miner of the Annals of Time. Wait, Exhumer of the Annals of Time? No, thanks.

Patriarch of the Western Paradox Church (ret'd)-All the stars are dust on my screen -- Marsh'nThe best computer game is a compiler. -- ExodiesI thought I was wrong, but it turned out I was mistaken. -- ucimYou have to grow older. You need not grow up. -- bmonk

From the one looking up in frame 1397, I immediately thought comorant.

What about a Limosa Limosa?

Spoiler:

Bill and size are wrong for flamingo. Neck, bill, and legs are wrong for cormorant or anhinga. Too large to be Limosa or similar type Sandpiper or Killdeer. And Cuegan left the shore of the sea1 long ago where such birds would more likely be found (though Killdeer are fairly common well inland near large bodies or water such as lakes4). Also, neck too long.

From the one looking up in frame 1397, I immediately thought comorant.

What about a Limosa Limosa?

Spoiler:

Bill and size are wrong for flamingo. Neck, bill, and legs are wrong for cormorant or anhinga. Too large to be Limosa or similar type Sandpiper or Killdeer. And Cuegan left the shore of the sea1 long ago where such birds would more likely be found (though Killdeer are fairly common well inland near large bodies or water such as lakes4). Also, neck too long.

My brother took a college linguistics class from a professor who specialized in regional dialects. One fun thing he did in his classes was to have his students read a short paragraph, and based on the way they pronounced certain words, he could generally identify within 100 miles or so where in the US that person grew up. (When my brother did the exercise, the professor correctly recognized that my brother grew up in a military family that traveled extensively, and he could identify several of the places we had lived.)

Another fun thing he did in the class was show pictures of common objects (such as the wheelbarrow) and ask students to write down what they were called. Some of them included:- a bottle containing a carbonated beverage- the valve-like device attached to the side of your house that you might attach a garden hose to- a paper container that the grocery store puts your purchases into so you can carry them out

Naturally, each of these had more names than people realized.

Spoiler:

I really want to meet this professor, I'd love to find out what he thinks of my speech. Especially if I've just returned from visiting my relatives in Nebraska. (I've never lived in Nebraska, but I inevitably sound like a Nebraskan for at least a few hours after constant exposure.)

Also, in order of how likely I am to use each word:Soda, the name of the specific beverage, Cola, drink or pop. I try to avoid pop unless I've heard a native use it.Faucet, spigot or tap.Bag or sack.

My wife is a linguist who is currently helping to edit a dictionary of english among the Great Smoky mountains regions. Having grown up south of south, in the southern area of Florida, then having moved north in my collegiate years, near to the origins of my grandparents, in Ohio, then once again south, now living in the midlands of South Carolina, I've had to make a number of adaptations to my speech. Soda became pop (which my grandfather called soda-pop) and then soda once more. I was perplexed, having first arrived to my new home, when people spoke of buggies. I had initially thought they were referring to strollers (or prams). It was sometime before I realized they were referring to shopping carts.

"HAL9000" This thread is a goldmine for signatures."StratPlayer" All in all, that sand paper rubbed me the wrong way."charlie_grumbles" The secret of the geeks. "Copy, Borrow, Steal, Succeed""ucim" There's a forestful of treeish people here. Welcome! Confused? See here.

From the one looking up in frame 1397, I immediately thought comorant.

What about a Limosa Limosa?

Spoiler:

Bill and size are wrong for flamingo. Neck, bill, and legs are wrong for cormorant or anhinga. Too large to be Limosa or similar type Sandpiper or Killdeer. And Cuegan left the shore of the sea1 long ago where such birds would more likely be found (though Killdeer are fairly common well inland near large bodies or water such as lakes4). Also, neck too long.

'Tis a shame that there are not wooded regions through which they travel. For if there were, we might be privileged to see a pretty pair of tits: (Yes! This is SFW)

Spoiler:

"HAL9000" This thread is a goldmine for signatures."StratPlayer" All in all, that sand paper rubbed me the wrong way."charlie_grumbles" The secret of the geeks. "Copy, Borrow, Steal, Succeed""ucim" There's a forestful of treeish people here. Welcome! Confused? See here.

Order of the Sillies, Honoris Causam - bestowed by charlie_grumbles on NP 859 * OTTscar winner: Wordsmith - bestowed by yappobiscuts and the OTT on NP 1832 * Ecclesiastical Calendar of the Order of the Holy Contradiction * Heartfelt thanks from addams and from me - you really made a difference.

Ebonite wrote:One fun thing he did in his classes was to have his students read a short paragraph, and based on the way they pronounced certain words, he could generally identify within 100 miles or so where in the US that person grew up.

speech accent archive wrote:Please call Stella. Ask her to bring these things with her from the store: Six spoons of fresh snow peas, five thick slabs of blue cheese, and maybe a snack for her brother Bob. We also need a small plastic snake and a big toy frog for the kids. She can scoop these things into three red bags, and we will go meet her Wednesday at the train station.

Knight Temporal, and Archdeacon of buttermongery and ham and cheese sandwiches. Nobody sells butter except through me.Smiley by yappobiscuits. Avatar by GLR, buffygirl, BlitzGirl & mscha, with cari.j.elliot's idea.Haiku Detectorstarts a trend to make way formy robot army.

Ebonite wrote:<snip>Another fun thing he did in the class was show pictures of common objects (such as the wheelbarrow) and ask students to write down what they were called. Some of them included:- a bottle containing a carbonated beverage- the valve-like device attached to the side of your house that you might attach a garden hose to- a paper container that the grocery store puts your purchases into so you can carry them out

Naturally, each of these had more names than people realized.

In order of how likely I am to use each word:Soda, the name of the specific beverage, Cola, drink or pop. I try to avoid pop unless I've heard a native use it.Faucet, spigot or tap.Bag or sack.

- 'coke,' and occasionally 'soda.' Never cola, pop or (as some ethnic groups in the south say): cold drink -pronounced: drank.- Spout or spigot. Faucet is something I'd say about an inside equivalent (like in the kitchen sink or bathroom sink).- Bag.

Angelastic wrote:Was it the paragraph used in the speech accent archive?

speech accent archive wrote:Please call Stella. Ask her to bring these things with her from the store: Six spoons of fresh snow peas, five thick slabs of blue cheese, and maybe a snack for her brother Bob. We also need a small plastic snake and a big toy frog for the kids. She can scoop these things into three red bags, and we will go meet her Wednesday at the train station.

Wow, speaking that out loud made me extremely conscious of my accent.

Last edited by Valarya on Fri May 17, 2013 2:59 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.

XonqNopp wrote:I will not ketchup today, not until next Tuesday... Because today I get married (the civil mariage, so little ceremony with little people, the religious mariage is next month)

So, I hope you will have a nice week-end and I hope the end of the OTC will wait for me, after all I have waited for it!

Couldn't read this last night (blurry vision). I see the social convention is to say congrats. Since today is probably happening now, this marriage should have had already happened, so definitely Congratulations, XonqNopp!

ttscp wrote:I've been thinking about what it means for the OTC if it is a story. (Not that it has to be; I am biased to think in stories because I am a storyteller, but that's another story.) Story and plot are closely connected so I mix the two concepts in my thinking a lot.

Thanks ttscp for this thoughtful analysis of the story/plot. I don't think though that Hollywood plot conventions apply. Someone was saying a while ago that the dialogue seemed not quite natural, a bit autogenerated or machine translated. I didn't feel that about the language, but I do get that sense about the plot.

It's definitely like a slowly unfolding puzzle, with enough clues scattered about to keep us guessing, but the overall aim is far from clear. It feels as if the narrative is partly, but not completely, driven by some arbitrary factor - as if the setting and characters were decided in advance, but the way events unfold within that context is determined by rolling a dice (or butterflies altering currents in the upper atmosphere, or...).

Not that I'm saying the whole experience can be reduced to sports commentary, but maybe there is an element of that?

I'd say some Hollywood conventions apply and some don't. I only used Hollywood plot points because (1)1I know them, (2)2 they provided a convenient way to estimate the overall length given what we'd seen so far and (3)3 there probably is some relation between the proportional length of beginning/middle/end segments no matter what the medium.

(I once had a fascinating conversation with a painter (oil on canvas) about plot. He thought about it almost the same way I (the short story writer) do. That was at the same party where I talked to June Foray without knowing who she was (she even told me she did cartoon voices).)

Your points are good, I can't really refute them, but I can say that some puzzles (I think of Myst) definitely have elements of story and some stories have puzzle elements, so it may be a matter of choice what we call it.

1 not a footnote, a numbered talking point. If it were a footnote it would say small as in river2 see 1, but replace small with big and river with sea3 neat. I really do think this arrangement of talking point and footnote is neat.

Always act to increase the survival chances of the largest group you are a part of.

Dracomax wrote:You hogging the cupcakes? I have some raptors1(not telling you which kinds) that would like to talk to you about that...

I have a feeling they are neither tits nor boobies. But really... I've been busy doing all this pope-stuff while all y'all been partying. A Pope's job is never done - all this "Bless me this" and "Forgive me that", and I guess I forgot myself.

ETA - @XonqNopp - Molto Congratulations! May you have many happy yips together!

Jose

Order of the Sillies, Honoris Causam - bestowed by charlie_grumbles on NP 859 * OTTscar winner: Wordsmith - bestowed by yappobiscuts and the OTT on NP 1832 * Ecclesiastical Calendar of the Order of the Holy Contradiction * Heartfelt thanks from addams and from me - you really made a difference.

Ebonite wrote:<snip>Another fun thing he did in the class was show pictures of common objects (such as the wheelbarrow) and ask students to write down what they were called. Some of them included:- a bottle containing a carbonated beverage- the valve-like device attached to the side of your house that you might attach a garden hose to- a paper container that the grocery store puts your purchases into so you can carry them out

Naturally, each of these had more names than people realized.

In order of how likely I am to use each word:Soda, the name of the specific beverage, Cola, drink or pop. I try to avoid pop unless I've heard a native use it.Faucet, spigot or tap.Bag or sack.

- 'coke,' and occasionally 'soda.' Never cola, pop or (as some ethnic groups in the south say): cold drink -pronounced: drank.- Spout or spigot. Faucet is something I'd say about an inside equivalent (like in the kitchen sink or bathroom sink).- Bag.

Soda, coke, and pop were the most common choices for the beverage.Faucet, spigot, and tap (as in "tap water") for the second one.Bag, sack, and poke (as in "pig in a poke") for the third one. Definitely a southern US thing, in my opinion!

Angelastic wrote:Was it the paragraph used in the speech accent archive?

speech accent archive wrote:Please call Stella. Ask her to bring these things with her from the store: Six spoons of fresh snow peas, five thick slabs of blue cheese, and maybe a snack for her brother Bob. We also need a small plastic snake and a big toy frog for the kids. She can scoop these things into three red bags, and we will go meet her Wednesday at the train station.

I couldn't tell you authoritatively since my brother was the one who read the paragraph. He took the class in the late 1970s; was the speech accent archive in existence back then? (Probably not online, but maybe in printed version?

XonqNopp wrote:I will not ketchup today, not until next Tuesday... Because today I get married (the civil mariage, so little ceremony with little people, the religious mariage is next month)

So, I hope you will have a nice week-end and I hope the end of the OTC will wait for me, after all I have waited for it!

Couldn't read this last night (blurry vision). I see the social convention is to say congrats. Since today is probably happening now, this marriage should have had already happened, so definitely Congratulations, XonqNopp!

I hope you don't mind. I've only this cup full of writing utensils for which to raise in your honor. But raise it I do! Congratulations!! May you have a marriage that is happy always, and as long as Time itself. Not necessarily the OTC Time, since that may, or may not come to an end, but the more abstract concept of time, which many believe to be infinite. Though, as I understand it, this may be up for debate...where was I going with this?

"HAL9000" This thread is a goldmine for signatures."StratPlayer" All in all, that sand paper rubbed me the wrong way."charlie_grumbles" The secret of the geeks. "Copy, Borrow, Steal, Succeed""ucim" There's a forestful of treeish people here. Welcome! Confused? See here.