What you're talking about is already possible with current consoles for the most part. 1080p @ 60fps will be a walk in the park for the next-gen consoles. 1080p @ 120fps may even be feasible, natively, or even easy if they do something like 720p @ 120fps. These next-gen consoles need to differentiate themselves from their 6-7 year old current-gen versions, so they'll need to look and feel much better and faster, IMO.

Yeah if you want to have mario graphics still......I'd rather have QUALITY 1080p at 30fps.

It'd be like a trade off 1080p @ 30fps, but for Crysis 2 DX11 Texture pack visuals...
OR
the other end of the stick, 1080p @ 60fps, but for Farcry 1 graphics...................

What are you talking about with 120fps??? None of that matters when you play using a controller! Hook up the 360 controller to PC, play battlefield or something, you don't get nearly as much benefit of having 60fps as you would with a mouse/keyboard.

As for everybody saying Game Developers are out of touch and that 1080p should be a standard........just because YOU have a 55 inch 1080p and care about the difference doesn't mean half of the users care, when all they play on is their 24-32inch 720p screen off in the college dorms....

FPS is still an issue with a thumbstick, it's just more noticeable with a mouse.

Regardless what people say about the resolution argument, I just can't accept that developers should still be on 720p, after having been on that for 8 years now, and 1080p TVs having been out for 15 years. These consoles will be the only ones we have until about 2018-2020, do we really want to be stuck with 720p visuals until 2020? 720p 32in TVs cost less than $300 in some cases, that's really the high-end target for TVs we're targeting here?

What you're talking about is already possible with current consoles for the most part. 1080p @ 60fps will be a walk in the park for the next-gen consoles. 1080p @ 120fps may even be feasible, natively, or even easy if they do something like 720p @ 120fps. These next-gen consoles need to differentiate themselves from their 6-7 year old current-gen versions, so they'll need to look and feel much better and faster, IMO.

Yeah if you want to have mario graphics still......I'd rather have QUALITY 1080p at 30fps.

It'd be like a trade off 1080p @ 30fps, but for Crysis 2 DX11 Texture pack visuals...
OR
the other end of the stick, 1080p @ 60fps, but for Farcry 1 graphics...................

What are you talking about with 120fps??? None of that matters when you play using a controller! Hook up the 360 controller to PC, play battlefield or something, you don't get nearly as much benefit of having 60fps as you would with a mouse/keyboard.

As for everybody saying Game Developers are out of touch and that 1080p should be a standard........just because YOU have a 55 inch 1080p and care about the difference doesn't mean half of the users care, when all they play on is their 24-32inch 720p screen off in the college dorms....

FPS is still an issue with a thumbstick, it's just more noticeable with a mouse.

Regardless what people say about the resolution argument, I just can't accept that developers should still be on 720p, after having been on that for 8 years now, and 1080p TVs having been out for 15 years. These consoles will be the only ones we have until about 2018-2020, do we really want to be stuck with 720p visuals until 2020? 720p 32in TVs cost less than $300 in some cases, that's really the high-end target for TVs we're targeting here?

What you're talking about is already possible with current consoles for the most part. 1080p @ 60fps will be a walk in the park for the next-gen consoles. 1080p @ 120fps may even be feasible, natively, or even easy if they do something like 720p @ 120fps. These next-gen consoles need to differentiate themselves from their 6-7 year old current-gen versions, so they'll need to look and feel much better and faster, IMO.

Yeah if you want to have mario graphics still......I'd rather have QUALITY 1080p at 30fps.

It'd be like a trade off 1080p @ 30fps, but for Crysis 2 DX11 Texture pack visuals...
OR
the other end of the stick, 1080p @ 60fps, but for Farcry 1 graphics...................

What are you talking about with 120fps??? None of that matters when you play using a controller! Hook up the 360 controller to PC, play battlefield or something, you don't get nearly as much benefit of having 60fps as you would with a mouse/keyboard.

As for everybody saying Game Developers are out of touch and that 1080p should be a standard........just because YOU have a 55 inch 1080p and care about the difference doesn't mean half of the users care, when all they play on is their 24-32inch 720p screen off in the college dorms....

FPS is still an issue with a thumbstick, it's just more noticeable with a mouse.

Regardless what people say about the resolution argument, I just can't accept that developers should still be on 720p, after having been on that for 8 years now, and 1080p TVs having been out for 15 years. These consoles will be the only ones we have until about 2018-2020, do we really want to be stuck with 720p visuals until 2020? 720p 32in TVs cost less than $300 in some cases, that's really the high-end target for TVs we're targeting here?

What does FPS have in common with input devices? *Facepalm*

Faster input means faster movement (parallax), faster movement of the camera or other objects across the camera is more jittery looking at lower framerates.

This is the same reason why movies are considering an FPS increase. Fast moving camera or fast objects moving across view will look jittery. In a game fast moving controls are the same issue, because in games you're controlling the camera either directly or indirectly through input.

I've designed and implemented various control schemes and camera systems, I promise you that FPS matters based on the control type, to some degree (highly dependent on the game type). I have no problem playing any game at either 30 or 60 fps, but that doesn't mean I don't notice the jitter at 30fps, so I'd still prefer 60fps in all cases.Edited by lordikon - 11/8/12 at 5:56pm

You don't go from Farcry 1 graphics to Crysis 2 DX11 texture pack by cutting fps in half.
FPS is still an issue with a thumbstick, it's just more noticeable with a mouse.
Regardless what people say about the resolution argument, I just can't accept that developers should still be on 720p, after having been on that for 8 years now, and 1080p TVs having been out for 15 years. These consoles will be the only ones we have until about 2018-2020, do we really want to be stuck with 720p visuals until 2020? 720p 32in TVs cost less than $300 in some cases, that's really the high-end target for TVs we're targeting here?

you say 1080p has been around for 15 years? hahah you're full of crap if you think that means anything. it's 2012 and there's still no broadcasting in 1080p. Netflix/youtube/hulu..that 1080p is NO where near the quality of bluray yet. 1080p still hasn't really matured. The only thing that offers it is bluray, and if somebody has a PC hooked up to the tv. It's not like people are being held back by 1080p....unless you have a 60+ inch tv, or unless you're an idiot and sit right in front of your 50 inch tv, even though you have such great vision.....

You don't go from Farcry 1 graphics to Crysis 2 DX11 texture pack by cutting fps in half.
FPS is still an issue with a thumbstick, it's just more noticeable with a mouse.
Regardless what people say about the resolution argument, I just can't accept that developers should still be on 720p, after having been on that for 8 years now, and 1080p TVs having been out for 15 years. These consoles will be the only ones we have until about 2018-2020, do we really want to be stuck with 720p visuals until 2020? 720p 32in TVs cost less than $300 in some cases, that's really the high-end target for TVs we're targeting here?

I'm confused on the part where you said 1080p is out for 15 years did you mean by the end of next gens life cycle it will have been out for 15 years? If thats what you meant then I completely agree, why should these consoles have to be stuck at 1080p when 1080p should be dead and 1440p should be the new standard. maybe many people don't have 1080p tvs now but the certainly will in the next few years, how many people even had 720p tvs when the ps3 was released? Some people may still not have 720p tvs but why are we cutting out the people that plan on getting a 4k tv in the next 5 years or so.

Console cycles either need to be shorter or the consoles need to be more powerful. Technology advances rapidly but puting in higher specs now will prevent it from being outdated as quickly as i feel last gen has.

I'm confused on the part where you said 1080p is out for 15 years did you mean by the end of next gens life cycle it will have been out for 15 years? If thats what you meant then I completely agree, why should these consoles have to be stuck at 1080p when 1080p should be dead and 1440p should be the new standard. maybe many people don't have 1080p tvs now but the certainly will in the next few years, how many people even had 720p tvs when the ps3 was released? Some people may still not have 720p tvs but why are we cutting out the people that plan on getting a 4k tv in the next 5 years or so.
Console cycles either need to be shorter or the consoles need to be more powerful. Technology advances rapidly but puting in higher specs now will prevent it from being outdated as quickly as i feel last gen has.

Do you guys even think.....

it takes a BEEFY computer to run at 1440p.

Do you think MS and SONY really want to sell a $400 console that's gonna cost them $800 to make....

You don't go from Farcry 1 graphics to Crysis 2 DX11 texture pack by cutting fps in half.
FPS is still an issue with a thumbstick, it's just more noticeable with a mouse.
Regardless what people say about the resolution argument, I just can't accept that developers should still be on 720p, after having been on that for 8 years now, and 1080p TVs having been out for 15 years. These consoles will be the only ones we have until about 2018-2020, do we really want to be stuck with 720p visuals until 2020? 720p 32in TVs cost less than $300 in some cases, that's really the high-end target for TVs we're targeting here?

you say 1080p has been around for 15 years? hahah you're full of crap if you think that means anything. it's 2012 and there's still no broadcasting in 1080p. Netflix/youtube/hulu..that 1080p is NO where near the quality of bluray yet. 1080p still hasn't really matured. The only thing that offers it is bluray, and if somebody has a PC hooked up to the tv. It's not like people are being held back by 1080p....unless you have a 60+ inch tv, or unless you're an idiot and sit right in front of your 50 inch tv, even though you have such great vision.....

Broadcasting has little to do with consoles, other than what is broadcast can affect TV purchase decisions. 1080p hasn't fully matured, but that doesn't mean the next console shouldn't utilize it. It's not like they're going to eliminate support for 720p, so people with 720p devices will be fine. You guys arguing for 720p realize that Blu-ray are 1080p right, as of 6 years ago....and are doing fairly well (not quite as well as DVD took over VCR).

I sit 6 feet from my 55" TV because I like the wide field of view for games and movies (I don't watch TV shows on it very often), not because I have trouble seeing it. I'd think this is pretty obvious, people often have larger screens so they'll take up more of their view, not solely so they can sit further away.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattbag

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordikon

You don't go from Farcry 1 graphics to Crysis 2 DX11 texture pack by cutting fps in half.
FPS is still an issue with a thumbstick, it's just more noticeable with a mouse.
Regardless what people say about the resolution argument, I just can't accept that developers should still be on 720p, after having been on that for 8 years now, and 1080p TVs having been out for 15 years. These consoles will be the only ones we have until about 2018-2020, do we really want to be stuck with 720p visuals until 2020? 720p 32in TVs cost less than $300 in some cases, that's really the high-end target for TVs we're targeting here?

I'm confused on the part where you said 1080p is out for 15 years did you mean by the end of next gens life cycle it will have been out for 15 years? If thats what you meant then I completely agree, why should these consoles have to be stuck at 1080p when 1080p should be dead and 1440p should be the new standard. maybe many people don't have 1080p tvs now but the certainly will in the next few years, how many people even had 720p tvs when the ps3 was released? Some people may still not have 720p tvs but why are we cutting out the people that plan on getting a 4k tv in the next 5 years or so.

Console cycles either need to be shorter or the consoles need to be more powerful. Technology advances rapidly but puting in higher specs now will prevent it from being outdated as quickly as i feel last gen has.

1080p TVs have been out for 15 years, I had one 15 years ago, it was a Mitsubishi projection TV, with component inputs, supported 1920x1080 @ 60fps.

I'd be fine with 1440p support from these consoles, but I'm not sure how many 1440p TVs are out now (any?), or will be coming out, since there will be 4K. But yea, I definitely think these consoles should be targeting 1080p, 1080p TVs are cheap and fairly standard fare at this point, and yes, they're noticeably better looking than 720p for SOME, and for those with 720p TVs, they'll be just fine still.

Do you guys even think.....
it takes a BEEFY computer to run at 1440p.
Do you think MS and SONY really want to sell a $400 console that's gonna cost them $800 to make....

yeah this is true my pc was around 1200 to build and it doesn't even run games very well at 1440p cause of the low gpu power/vram and that doesn't include the price of the monitor!

however sony sold the ps3 at 599.99 at launch and I was only 16 years old and had money to buy one (i worked a lot) and they were actually losing money on the console. now a few years down the road you can buy them for 200 bucks so I don't think sony is gonna release their system at less then 500 this time around regardless of what specs it has(higher or low end)