Anyone who read the Kurt Cobain thread might have noticed a little dust-up between myself and Dangermouse. To sum up, I posted a bit of a eulogy for someone who I was sorry was no longer with us. DMouse responded by saying that he was glad Cobain was dead and a few other derogatory remarks, and it went downhill from there.

I maintain that too many people use the anonyminity of the internet to act in ways that they never would in face-to-face discussion, either out of manners or at least not wanting to get the crap beaten out of them. It especially seems that some people think that it's okay insert their opinion regardless of how appropriate it might be to do so in a real life setting. Dmouse seems to be a decent enough sort that I doubt he would walk up to people who were mourning someone in a public shared space like a bar or party and say "Well, I'm glad he's dead." It's hard to imagine anything more rude. But for some reason he thought it was okay on the board here.

Yes, these are discussion boards. But in my opinion that does not necessarily translate into license to pipe up and assert your point of view everytime you disagree with someone. Take techno music, as a random example. There's all sorts of threads talking about it pro and con all over the board. But if someone posts that they're coming to Burning Man and they're really excited about the theme camp they're creating and they're going to have this great rave dj spinning all the time - that's not the place to announce how much you hate techno. That's just being a jerk. If I had posted "Nirvana is the best band ever" (and I didn't say anything remotely like that in my little memorial), that's obviously inviting debate. Get the difference?

Now this topic, on the other hand, is completely open for discussion.

"Of what use is a philosopher who doesn't hurt anybody's feelings?" -Diogenes

An expectation of "board manners and courtesy" is fine and dandy, but an expectation of topics likely to come up on the Discussion Board in question among random discussion participants, that are more-or-less well-known to push certain people's buttons, and a like expectation of some amount of responsibility for encouraging whatever level of decorum in a self-initiated thread, is pretty much at the learner's permit level of BBS licensure, IMO.

Life's highway has its rabbits, lizards, antelope, coyotes, and more rabbits, right along with its drywall screws, mattresses, RVs, empty water jugs, discarded steering wheels, and other de facto metaphors. Don't let them get up yer pants and drive yer nuts.

I think you're mixing two issues. One is disagreement and the other is sensitivity.

In my opinion, it's perfectly appropriate to disagree. We all have opinions and there would be very few posts here if none of us shared them. We are not going to all have the same opinion on all issues. We should not feel afraid to express our feelings

Sensitivity is something else. I agree it's insensitive to say you're glad someone killed themselves because you didn't care for their music. It's also insensitive to make things personal. I can disagree with someone's recommendation of XYZ brand duct tape, but I can't call him an idiot for recommending it.

Asking yourself "Would I say this if I were talking face to face?" is a good test before posting something. In my case, I would feel free to express my opinions on techno, RVs, etc in person and I will continue to do it online.

Kelly, if you honestly have issue with me I'd appreciate if you take it up privately with me. While what I posted was been insensitive, I was not the one who launched into a personal attack. I appologize for being an insensitive ass, however that's just who I am both online and off.

These sensitive things happen in artists circles. that should be understandable enough. But to start another thread on the topic?

The cobain thread I thought was doing pretty well. running away from it because you dont like what one or another says on it is really bad form IMHO.

So what BRR made a statement that you did'nt like. refer to cites to counter his statement.
DangerMouse has been all over the board to make Kelly feel better and that's supposed to do what in the long run?

I'm at a loss. But since you already created this thread you may as well make some good out of it.

just my $00.02 (I'm sure many dont think much of it anyway but hey....)

DangerMouse wrote:... if you honestly have issue with me I'd appreciate if you take it up privately with me.

IMO, this is another of the weird things about the Internet.

KellY wrote:I maintain that too many people use the anonyminity of the internet to act in ways that they never would in face-to-face discussion, either out of manners or at least not wanting to get the crap beaten out of them.

The divergence between what is acceptable in a private message verses a public post is itself an issue of contention. I don't claim to have it figured out myself. And *certainly* do not think that anyone could use my posts as some sort of a guidepost to manners and courtesy. Not by a long-fucking-shot.

But I will say that posting a public message that an issue should be taken private, is in my opinion ignoring the fact that that very post could have been private.

I'd like to speculate that in addition to KellY's excellent point there are a couple others I can think of ....

1.) one of the things about the Internet that is different than in real life, is that shunning in real life gets noticed. Shunning on the Internet is all hypothetical. I actually saw a post on another board where people rated with a point system each other's answers, and one post was about a perceived lack of recognition about a post's high value.

2.) Some times people are unable to express themselves or certain feelings or certain thoughts face to face in a personal conversational dialog, and whatever-the-hell-you-want-to-make-of-that, its real.

That's why there are anonymous confession sites, that's why people write, that's why people gather in front of their computers.

And I would like to suggest, that's why Kurt Cobain sang his best stuff loud, raw, at a microphone, in front of crowds.

seriously, there is a kind of etiquette that does come with anonymity. I have had a post of mine changed from an open art forum (or whatever), to an out and out political discussion. now, granted, it did meet with the word of what it was called.

but you have to realize that people aren't going always going to agree. that's the nature of people.

personal attacks on the other hand should not be acceptable. just because someone has a differing opinion does not mean that they deserve persecution for it.

i see an irony that this is public because it does and doesn't need to be public. i think the idea is not to mention just one person, to address everyone as a whole... especially those that have gotten overly personal about the attacks.

BRR: Are you trying to impress someone with your command of Italian? This is a board dedicated to discussions of an event in Nevada, right here in the USA, where English for the moment is still the dominant language. We are not in Rome or Milan. How about going back to English if you want to communicate with the majority of us?

For those who can't read italian (which I can't either, but I know where to get fast free translation)

as translated into a language we can understand, BRR wrote:If you are going to introduce the emotion in a consignment is better fact in Italian. For example, for example Joe Bob is an ass of the horses, really plays emotionally satisfactory in Italian. The manners are an European invention of the north and only obtain in the sense of to obtain on the bus, eating the pasta, for example what retain is spread a lot more wide than the auction makes square of connection perhaps understands.

BRR: Thanks for stereotyping me based solely on my internet posting. I really enjoy being told I have no imagination or creativity, which if you actually knew me would be the very last thing to come out of your mouth.

In any event slinging mud does nothing to change the fact that the majority of this board's conversation is held in English. If you insist on using Italian, you'll be ignored even more so than you are right now.

I don't know how to take that last comment, so I'll take the high road. Some of us may not agree with what you say, but I for one read it and try to learn from it. So that's why I wish your posts were in English and not Italian. Bablefish translations are not the best to work with.

That is an unbelievably weird statement from someone who's response to almost any direct question regarding his posts and/or motives is "you don't get it" coupled with a refusal to offer any explanations.