The truth about the Bulls and Thibodeau.

I would like to start this by acknowledging many people on this site will not like what I have to say here. However, I could care less if what you're about to read is nothing close to your opinion.

Anyway, let’s get started. I use to respect Thibodeau as either the best coach in the nba or second best to pops, but I have officially changed my mind about Thibodeau. After his constant b*tching about the league f*cking over the bulls, it really has turned me off. In addition, he does not punish his players for their dirty play and it speaks the truth that Thibodeau is just an average coach that implements a dirty defensive system with talented players.

Moreover, I was angry throughout game 3. The bulls are simply not playing basketball. Their whole system and play setup is currently pathetic and add that their defensive system is mainly on just being physical/making dirty plays against the heat. I MISS DENG, he is a true defender and I cannot name a point in his career where he has made a dirty play. Next, Mohammed bear hugged lebron and lebron yanks free. Mohammed didn't even attempt for the ball.. it was pathetic. Mohammed then flops to the ground after james shakes him off. Angry and embarrassed in front of his home crowd, Mohammed gets up with a p*ss poor attitude and shoves lebron pretty hard. Lebron of course then sells it. However, that wasn’t even the first incident that p*ssed me off about the bulls and their dirty play. After Anderson collided with robinson, Noah, a rising-dirty player with a constant p*ss poor attitude goes and shoves birdman who is on the ground attempting to get up. It was disgusting and really makes the NBA look like a joke. Also, when these bulls whine on t.v AFTER they commit countless dirty/physical plays, how are the refs suppose to even react to them? It's like a bully complaining to a teacher than his victim punched him in the mouth.

In conclusion, this bulls team is destined to constantly fail. They will come close, but they are just not good enough. Their attitudes WILL get the best of them and they have immature players. Until they grow up, smarter teams with smart coaches will always succeed in getting past the bulls, even if the bulls were healthy. Miami destroyed the bulls in 2011 when rose was healthy, and Miami had a terrible bench then compared to now. So the argument that the bulls are not healthy and that’s what separates them from winning a ring is actually an excuse, totally false, and lacks any concrete evidence to back up such a ridiculous claim. Face it, as long as Thibodeau encourages dirty plays and constantly whines, the bulls players will continue to take themselves out of the game. Coach Thibodeau is a decent coach, but honestly, he is nowhere on the level of pops or even phil Jackson.

The plays that you've described don't make the NBA look like a joke. You're talking about it like it's something new that just the Bulls have, that's basically what's been going on in basketball for the last 30 years (probably longer, but I haven't seen any games before that time), many great teams made dirty plays (though none of the plays you described are really dirty, to me the dirty plays are those when a player tries to intentioally hurt another player, now that's dirty), the Bad boy Pistons were maybe one of the dirtiest teams ever and they were GREAT.

And in 2011 the Bulls had a different team, sure the best players have remained the same (though some have improved over time), but it's still a different team, it's just silly saying that having 2 of your 5 starters injured (and one pretending to be injured) is not the reason why they are not as good as they can be. Of course it is.

But this team isn't great. The capitalize on the opponents mistakes or depend on Nate to get decent looks ONLY. They are playing desperate, and God bless their will to win. But when a team can't win without resorting to punk tactics, which the Bulls clearly cannot, its crossed a line of tact that I think ruins the game.

And this isnt the 90's. The way refs have been calling flagrants should tell you its not the 90's. You can't have this "they cant call every one" mentality in todays game and not expect to get vilified. This is a skills game. Play like you got some.

What punk tactics are you talking about? Hard fouls? There better be hard fouls in the playoffs, otherwise you aren't trying to win. The Bulls are a physical team and have the best defensive minded coach in the game. Of course things are going to be rough, especially in the semi's of the NBA playoffs.

I guess Miami doesn't resort to any punk @ss moves huh? Oh wait, Chalmers basically throwing a punch at Noah on a pick. Wade throwing the ball at someone. Battier basically jumping on Noah's back as he's on the ground. Lebron's multiple flash elbows he throws when things get a little too rough for his pampered @ss.

Either you're a Heat fanboy or refuse to see that the Heat do some pretty questionable sh*t too. If it's too rough for you go watch figure skating.

I dont really agree with you, but I dont really disagree with you either. I think Thibs is a good coach. I dont particularly like the way he handled the post game interview, but I take as an upset coach trying to defend his team. I disagree with what he's saying though. He's inferring that the refs are giving the Heat the calls. I feel like the calls have been going both ways. This series has been about composure. When something dont go the Heat's way, they let it go and move on to the next play. Thibs called that a flop when Lebron fell to the ground. Yes Bron is big and strong, but Nazr is even bigger and stronger. Bron was complaining to the ref when Nazr lunged and shoved him in the chest. Anybody will fall from that. Bron wasnt even looking so of course he was going to fall.
As far as the Bulls go, they are playing way too emotional. All of the extra clapping and talking and pumping up the fans will not help you, if you dont play basketball for 48mins. It seems like their only strategy is to try and play physical and rattle the Heat. The Heat are too smart. You're never going to get one of their players to do something stupid. It's just not going to happen.

I do give the Bulls credit for staying close and making the Heat battle. They are under-manned and they deserve credit for that. However, I dont think that means they would beat the Heat with a full roster.
I'm most disappointed with Joakim Noah. He's a great player, and i love his energy. But he's definitely putting too much energy into extracurricular stuff. He's a player that gets the crowd pumped up. But he's not a tough guy and should stop trying to be one. It's only getting him in foul trouble and hurting his team. It's not affecting the Heat at all. He's too emotional to be a tough guy. Tough guys aren't emotional. They're tough all the time. He's spent most of this series either clapping his hands or crying and moping.

I dont think the Bulls are going to win another game in this series, but if they are, Noah is going to have to man up and play Basketball.

I agree with the OP to an extent. But what's the difference with how the Bulls play compared to the 2 time NBA Champion Detroit Piston "bad boys"? Chuck Daly allowed it. He was still considered one of the greatest NBA coaches the league has seen. Coach Thibs is still a great coach to me. These guys don't play dirty. Just way more physical than most. Jordan and Pippen would get it wayyyy worst against those guys back then compared to what the Heat have dealt with. Like another poster said, Dirty is trying to hit a guy below the belt. Or elbowing a guy in the head like what Ron Artest did to Harden last year. Intentionally trying to hurt somebody is dirty. Noah just pushed Chris Anderson off of his teammate. Yea he might have over exaggerated a little bit but you got a 6'11 guy taking his sweet time getting of a 5'9 guy who has probably been your best player. If you look at the replay Robinson was trying to push Anderson off him around the same time Noah was running over to push him. I don't consider pushing dirty. Now I don't agree with how Mohammed retaliated. He was just embarrassed like the OP said. You foul a guy like the way he did Lebron and you bound to get some type of reaction. It wasn't even like Lebron was sprinting full speed or was wide open. So what was really the point of him fouling Lebron like that? I dont think Noah was wrong but dont agree with how Mohammed handled things. I do agree that he shouldnt have retaliated the way he did. He was embarrased got up and tried to prove his toughness. He forgot where he was. You are playing in the NBA playoffs. Not a pick up game at the YMCA. But because the game has become so finesse and the league has changed rules so much to help competition, when players play like the Bulls it's labeled dirty. I agree with what Charles Barkley says, the NBA has become soft. Respect is one thing, but you don't have to like who you play against. I believe the Bulls respect the Heat. They just don't like them. They are playing to win. Would any of you guys smile and dap a guy up after he beat your ass the way the Heat beat the Bulls in Game 2? Some people call it being a sore loser but the Bulls are just frustrated because they know they can beat these guys. They have done it in the playoffs and the regular season. I feel like the refs haven't been calling the games fairly and I think it's taking an emotional toll on the Bulls. They feel like nobody wants them to win so the Heat will always get the calls the Bulls don't. But they do have to play with a controlled rage. They can't afford to keep doing stuff that they know may warrant a technical or an ejection because all these technicals and ejections are what's going to make it harder for them to win another game let alone the series.

I agree with the OP to an extent. But what's the difference with how the Bulls play compared to the 2 time NBA Champion Detroit Piston "bad boys"? Chuck Daly allowed it. He was still considered one of the greatest NBA coaches the league has seen. Coach Thibs is still a great coach to me. These guys don't play dirty. Just way more physical than most. Jordan and Pippen would get it wayyyy worst against those guys back then compared to what the Heat have dealt with. Like another poster said, Dirty is trying to hit a guy below the belt. Or elbowing a guy in the head like what Ron Artest did to Harden last year. Intentionally trying to hurt somebody is dirty. Noah just pushed Chris Anderson off of his teammate. Yea he might have over exaggerated a little bit but you got a 6'11 guy taking his sweet time getting of a 5'9 guy who has probably been your best player. If you look at the replay Robinson was trying to push Anderson off him around the same time Noah was running over to push him. I don't consider pushing dirty. Now I don't agree with how Mohammed retaliated. He was just embarrassed like the OP said. You foul a guy like the way he did Lebron and you bound to get some type of reaction. It wasn't even like Lebron was sprinting full speed or was wide open. So what was really the point of him fouling Lebron like that? I dont think Noah was wrong but dont agree with how Mohammed handled things. I do agree that he shouldnt have retaliated the way he did. He was embarrased got up and tried to prove his toughness. He forgot where he was. You are playing in the NBA playoffs. Not a pick up game at the YMCA. But because the game has become so finesse and the league has changed rules so much to help competition, when players play like the Bulls it's labeled dirty. I agree with what Charles Barkley says, the NBA has become soft. Respect is one thing, but you don't have to like who you play against. I believe the Bulls respect the Heat. They just don't like them. They are playing to win. Would any of you guys smile and dap a guy up after he beat your ass the way the Heat beat the Bulls in Game 2? Some people call it being a sore loser but the Bulls are just frustrated because they know they can beat these guys. They have done it in the playoffs and the regular season. I feel like the refs haven't been calling the games fairly and I think it's taking an emotional toll on the Bulls. They feel like nobody wants them to win so the Heat will always get the calls the Bulls don't. But they do have to play with a controlled rage. They can't afford to keep doing stuff that they know may warrant a technical or an ejection because all these technicals and ejections are what's going to make it harder for them to win another game let alone the series.

You mean superstars in the NBA get calls? NO! If you disagree with Thibs on that, you need to do some research.The Bulls have roughed it up a bit this season, starting with the game that ended the winning streak. However, they haven't done anything extraordinary in terms of physicality. I have seen a lot worse in NBA history. Thibs, like every good coach, teaches his teams to be physical and attack them first. You heard Spo teaching exact same thing. The Heat have done their fair share this series as well. Wade throwing the ball at Marco, Chris Anderson's antics, Chalmers choking Noah. LeBron's "yanking free" as you call it, I saw it as LeBron locking arms and tossing Nazr, that's why he got up upset, etc. Not mad about any of it, it is just playoff basketball. The only thing I fault the Bulls players on is their behavior in the game 2 blowout. Getting blown out by nearly 50, having physical play brought back to them, and have the refs still giving calls to the HEAT superstars is rough but they needed to do a better job of maintaining composure.

I disagree because grabbing a player the size of Lebron to stop them from going on a fast break is not going to injury them. It is frustrating but when has anyone ever been hurt from a bear hug foul. You have to foul Lebron like that. Also you have to understand, this is a physical series so when Lebron knock him on the ground, he had to retaliate to some degree. They way he did was pretty dumb. Miami starting doing the same physical stuff. This is playoff basketball. I don't always agree with but it has been consistent. This is where the refs should earn their money and call a fair game to limit some of the physical stuff that gets out of hand.

I don't agree with what you said about coach tibbs.......but i do agree that he shouldn't act like the heat are getting all the calls. If the heat are getting more calls it's only because the bulls are setting that tone by looking to foul on almost every other play, so even when they don't foul the refs think it's coming.

You're telling me Muhammad needed to foul Lebron like that in that situation.... Explain to me why during a slowly jogging Lebron with 3 defenders in font of him at the center of the court needed to get fouled. An if a 7ft 300 pound man bear hugs another 6'8" 300lbs man, I expect one of them to fall. And if Lebron spinning to get free of a bear hug, that's a fully expected reaction to that, not you you to get the technical because you got flagrant fouled unnesesarily. #c'mon man!

They're doing the only thing they can to try to hang with Miami. Their roster is so depleted they're clawing for every point or defensive stop they get. It's playoff basketball, this isn't the first series to get physical. This same Heat team vs Indiana last year beat the crap out of each other. I like this scrappy play. No one is going for another players' head, no one is throwing closed fisted punches, it's just physical basketball. Thibs has done a great job.

So you don't like the attitudes of game 2 and 3, that doesn't change anything about Chicago roping the higher seeded Nets, catching Miami off guard and taking game 1, and a lot of that is from coaching. Destined to fail? Making it out of round 1, was an enormous victory for this years Bulls team. Whether you like it or not. Their accomplishments this season far surpassed expectations and Thibs was a huge part of that.

Is a 3rd year cosch somehow not being as good as Pops or Phil Jackson supposed to be a knock? Steph Curry isn't as good as Michael Jordan or even Oscar Robertson. Sounds like a pretty meaningless comparison, doesn't it?

Thibodeau never complains. It's always "no excuses", so I was a little surprised with his post game.

However, every coach complains, especially when it comes to how the games are called. When you look at what the Bulls have done this season, I don't know how anyone can say Thibodeau isn't a great coach. This team wasn't even supposed to make the playoffs.

I think he was clearly frustrated with the way the game was called, especially in the 4th quarter. Missed foul, which should've been a four point play on Wade. Poor over the back call on Noah. Not to mention, LeBron played 44 minutes without one foul call.

No excuses when they lose, but a million for why they win. Lol some of your guys posts are pathetic. Just say you hate the damn team with a passion. I admit it about the Lakers all the time. I can't stand that team. But some of you guys just won't come out and say it. Quit being chicken &$#%#&@! and say it.

This is interesting because the OP basically nailed why the Bulls flunked out of the first round last year to the Sixers who were at the time a tough blue collar team mixed with savvy vets and ambitious young guns. Even before Rose went out in game one the Sixers were going toe to toe because they matched the Bulls physicality and in the end showed more heart which is the real reason they won the series.

Atleast Nate Robinson is getting his due because he's balled hard his whole life and is finally getting recognized as the dynamic impact playmaker who can win games at the end that he's always been.