username wrote:. In Dudjom Rinpoche's letter Chatral was named his vajra regent and mandala center and the letter was not that long before his death.

So then if you know the details what is the date on the letter? I'd like to understand the roots of these various accounts, I am only interested in truth.. if you have evidence that I am mistaken I would love to see it, or at the very least know the source.

Contentment is the ultimate wealth;
Detachment is the final happiness. ~Sri Saraha

Dudjom Rinpoche asked Chatral Rinpoche to remain and train his main reincarnation and meanwhile till he is ready again, be his regent. Once the main reincarnation was calimed to be found in Tibet by Taro Lhamo Khandro, people approached Chatral Rinpoche for clarification. The all seeing protector of the world, Chatral Rinpoche said he will not announce anything until he has consulted the wisdom mind of Dungsey Thinley Norbu. Dungsey Thinley Norbu confirmed and Chatral Rinpoche finally announced the rebirth of his friend.

Dudjom Rinpoche's letter about his student and also as he called him in public and even written prayers to, as one of his main teachers known as Chatral Rinpoche who is Heruka in person as prophesied by name and deeds in old terma and the mind emanation of Guru Rinpoche himself:

"To all endowed with sentience — beings large and small — who live and circle within the realms of existence; at this time the Awareness-Holder Trogyal Dorje (Chatral Rinpoche) has received from me the oral lineage instructions of the profound teaching — heart-blood of the dakinis.

I have entrusted him with the lineage of the meaning, empowered him as the person to act as my Regent to guide beings, and encouraged him to impartially steer the ship of disciples to the path of freedom.

Therefore, any gods, demons or humans who help Trogyal Dorje in an appropriate manner will naturally gain benefit and happiness in this and future lifetimes. However, if even the slightest thoughts or acts of wrongful animosity toward him should arise, the armies of imperious guardians of the doctrine — endowed with wrathful power and eyes of wisdom — will come to his assistance.

They will most certainly sever the life force of beings that have form or block the senses of those without form and banish their name that remains. Where there is a chance of such profit or loss, be extremely careful!"

You make it sound like Shenpen Dawa RInpoche is Thinley Norbu Rinpoche's son but Shenpen Dawa RInpoche is the younger son of HH Dudjom RInpoche, --the son he had with his second wife/consort Sangyum Kusho la. So Shenpen Dawa Rinpoche and Thinley Norbu RInpoche are half-brothers. My understanding is that towards the end of his life HH Dudjom RInpoche made Shenpen Dawa RInpoche his regent-- which is why he is the head of all of the official centers that his father established in the U.S. and Europe. Thinley Norbu Rinpoche of course holds the lineage in that he can transmit the full cycles of Dudjom as can his own sons Dzogsar Khyentse Rinpoche and Garab Dorje Rinpoche. And Chatral Rinpoche of course.

Then yes, there are the Dudjom Yangsis, from Tibet and Bhutan respectively. And yes there are many great Lamas and Rinpoches that are empowered to transmit Dudjom tersar wangs but it is hard to know how many hold the entire cycles. Lama Dawa Chodaak Rinpoche and Lama Tharchin probably in the west, Bhaka Tulku Rinpoche and Tulku Pema Wangyal perhaps.. but there must be quite a few more in India, Bhutan, Nepal and Tibet whom I am not familiar with.

Sorry, my mistake.

/magnus

"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

Adamantine wrote:
I meant I will ask/find out more Lamas that can give the wangs/transmissions in India / Nepal / Bhutan. Not that I would ask about Trulshik Rinpoche-- it is certain that he carries these. He is very old and very busy though, so it may be hard to make a specific request, --if he is offering the wangs already though that is another matter. You recently missed Thinley Norbu Rinpoche in Pharping Nepal giving the entire Dudjom cycle. Within this year hopefully the Tibetan Dudjom Yangsi will return from his three-year retreat from Tibet and then possibly offer wangs once again. He would be another ideal. I have no idea why you would not receive from Garab Dorje Rinpoche?

I see , thank you . Who I decide to take it from is a personal decision, I have nothing against Garab Dorje per se, just not interested in having him as a Tsawai Lama. I understand that it would be nearly impossible to get it from Trulshik Rinpoche, let alone any lengthy time with him. If you could look into whos giving it out here, that would great, thank you.

It also occurred to me that Taklung Tsetrul Rinpoche would have the transmissions for some of the Dudjom tersar, perhaps not all.

Another one who is mostly in Nepal, which is not far from you-- and is a special Lama is Pema Riksal Rinpoche. You can read his Bio here http://www.namkhyung.org/?id=15 He received transmissions and wangs directly from HH Dudjom RInpoche but he also holds a special lineal descent of the Dudjom ter through Namkha Khyung Dzong which was the ngakpa lineage descending from Dudjom Lingpa through his rainbow-body disciple Delgyal Rinpoche. Pema Riksal RInpoche is the son of the second Delgyal Rinpoche.

Contentment is the ultimate wealth;
Detachment is the final happiness. ~Sri Saraha

Namdrol wrote: But when the whole Dudjom tersar is given, and not merely Dudjom Tersar i.e. Dudjom Rinpoche's pure vision cycles, it also includes the transmissions from Duddul Dorje, Dudjom Lingpa, and Dudjom RInpoche.

And then what about the ter of Dzongter Kunzang Nyima,Dudjom Lingpa's speech emanation? His son Tulku Theglo came to the U.S. a few years back and gave transmissions of his father's terma along with Dudjom Lingpa's, which seems like it's own version of the "whole Dudjom tersar" being given.. but yet this and Dudjom Rinpoche's are not given together.. I wonder if this may happen in the future, perhaps it is only a rare person like Gyatrul Rinpoche who holds all of these transmissions.

Contentment is the ultimate wealth;
Detachment is the final happiness. ~Sri Saraha

The fact that Taklung Tsetrul Rinpoche holds it is good, I doubt I'd be able to receive the entire thing from him from what I've been told, he gives things in small bits , checks carefully on the student before giving more . Which is excellent.

Taklung Tsetrul Rinpoche is one my own teachers teacher, so I'm feeling more confident that my teacher may hold it. Again, I'll get clarification from my teacher when he returns about this , ty .

Adamantine wrote:
And then what about the ter of Dzongter Kunzang Nyima... this and Dudjom Rinpoche's are not given together.. I wonder if this may happen in the future, perhaps it is only a rare person like Gyatrul Rinpoche who holds all of these transmissions.

Since the Kunzang Nyima wangchen was given at Khenpo Namdrol Rinpoche's Palri Pema Od Ling in Austin, I bet he received it all... If so, he probably also holds the Dudjom Tersar. Also, Lama Chonam Wazi received all of both at Tashi Choling two or three yrs ago and since lately he's really started teaching more and more, I wonder if some day he'll begin giving empowerments. Or even Sangye Khandro. Hard to say on those last two though, as humble and unassuming as they are. But maybe they'll eventually be pushed into it by either Gyatrul Rinpoche or Trinley Norbu Rinpoche lol. Oh and I'm pretty sure Gyatrul Rinpoche's nephew Lama Drimed received all of both cycles down at Orgyen Dorje Den, and maybe he'll eventually take on the role of vajra master.

Adamantine wrote:
And then what about the ter of Dzongter Kunzang Nyima... this and Dudjom Rinpoche's are not given together.. I wonder if this may happen in the future, perhaps it is only a rare person like Gyatrul Rinpoche who holds all of these transmissions.

Since the Kunzang Nyima wangchen was given at Khenpo Namdrol Rinpoche's Palri Pema Od Ling in Austin, I bet he received it all... If so, he probably also holds the Dudjom Tersar. Also, Lama Chonam Wazi received all of both at Tashi Choling two or three yrs ago and since lately he's really started teaching more and more, I wonder if some day he'll begin giving empowerments. Or even Sangye Khandro. Hard to say on those last two though, as humble and unassuming as they are. But maybe they'll eventually be pushed into it by either Gyatrul Rinpoche or Trinley Norbu Rinpoche lol. Oh and I'm pretty sure Gyatrul Rinpoche's nephew Lama Drimed received all of both cycles down at Orgyen Dorje Den, and maybe he'll eventually take on the role of vajra master.

Well it'll be interesting to see what happens.. I believe Tulku Theglo Rinpoche was
plannng to return again soon too, but perhaps that's dependent on permissions
from the respective governments.

Contentment is the ultimate wealth;
Detachment is the final happiness. ~Sri Saraha

Khenchen Palden and Khenpo Tsewang have actively promoted Dudjom Tersar. How many times has the entire tersar been transmitted here in the U.S.?
Among their centers' main practices are Dudjom's Green Tara and Vajrasattva, they've given the wang/lung/tri for both Khandro Thugtik and Tsokye Dorje numerous times, held retreats using the Richo, etc.
No, their mission has never been to uphold Dudjom's lineage exclusively, but his teachings are very much a feature of their mandala and when Khenpo Tsewang talks of him, you can tell how strong the connection is. However, with the obvious success transmitting DT it only makes sense that they spend as much effort as they do establishing Tsasum Lingpa's terma.
Khenchen received the entire DT from Dudjom Rinpoche, but also held Chogyur Lingpa's entire cycle, Chetsun Nyingthig, Longchen Nyingthig, Nyingthig Yabshi and others.

"I would say that Khenpo Ashe is my root lama, but I have many root lamas, like H.H. Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche, H.H. Dudjom Rinpoche, and others." - Khenchen Palden

Not sure why I didn't think of this before, but Katok Getse Rinpoche spent many years with Dudjom Lingpa's grandson Tulku Nyila and received the whole Tersar from him and Getse Rinpoche is based in Nepal, so that might be something to look into. He is seriously an amazing lama. I'm really not one to be all goo goo gaga over a lama on the strength of his important title or impressive reputation - this lama is absolutely the real deal.

Didn't want to say it before, but he probably just found out his root guru like numerous Nyingma/Kagyu lamas years ago received the whole shebang from Dudjom Rinpoche himself and is probably practicing it.

username wrote:Didn't want to say it before, but he probably just found out his root guru like numerous Nyingma/Kagyu lamas years ago received the whole shebang from Dudjom Rinpoche himself and is probably practicing it.