They like us! They really, really like us! Muslim terrorists in the U.K. targeted Canadian flights.

LONDON — Air Canada flights to Toronto and Montreal were targets of a well-advanced terrorist plot to blow up at least seven jetliners simultaneously over the Atlantic using bombs stored in drink bottles and assembled aboard the aircraft, according to claims by British prosecutors.

In August, 2006, a group of 19 British men were arrested in London with a bomb laboratory that had the tools to construct the components of liquid-chemical bombs that would be difficult for airport security to detect, stored in Lucozade drink containers with electronic detonators. Eight of those men, including the alleged ringleaders, are on trial this week.

Charges have been dropped against some of the 19, and others are still in the judicial system.

[...]

The Canadian dimension of the plot only became public yesterday, when a judge revealed to potential jurors in the trial of the eight men that Canadian flights were allegedly targeted.

[...]

Canadian officials confirmed yesterday that Air Canada flights were among the potential targets, which also included flights to the United States. They said that the plot had involved targeting a number of flights on the same day.

Still think Muslim immigration is a good thing? If these terrorists could get into Britain then they can get into Canada. And if they are "home grown" terrorists then all the more reason to ban Muslim immigration altogether. If Islam, even in an advanced, civilized, pluralistic environment like the United Kingdom is producing terrorists then what does it say about that religion? I'm sorry but it may very well be in the interests of Canadians and their safety that Muslim immigration to Canada be curtailed outright. Islam has failed to police itself and weed out its dangerous fanatics allowing these people, it seems, to operate without harassment within the Muslim community. That being the case then discriminating based on religion and country of origin is justified. Not all immigration is good immigration.

18 comments:

Anonymous
said...

Unfortunately, the appropriate action to curtail Muslim immigration will only take place after a plane-load of Canadians have been sacrificed over the Atlantic Ocean. Then political authorities will over-react and instill some draconian law to round up and incarcerate the law-abiding Muslims in Japanese-style concentration camps.

However, there are other immigrants and their offspring whose presence should have been curbed a couple of decades ago. They reek criminal havoc on Toronto streets every day of the week, but hardly a whimper of protest identifying the source country ever leaves the lips of most Canadians.

Those people like us too, because we're so politically-correct to even utter the B-word in public. If so, it's only in whispered tones with trusted confidants.

Never been there, nor do I have any interest in traveling there, but that source country is located somewhere south of Florida.

None of the eight terrorists in question were immigrants - - they were all native-born British citizens. And in fact most of them didn't come from Muslim families (they were converts). So it looks to me like ending "Muslim immigration" would have deterred this terrorist attack not at all. Nice try, guys.

None of the eight terrorists in question were immigrants - - they were all native-born British citizens. And in fact most of them didn't come from Muslim families (they were converts). So it looks to me like ending "Muslim immigration" would have deterred this terrorist attack not at all. Nice try, guys.

What does any of that have to do with the price of tea in China? They're still Muslims right? How did that religion get here? Islam is one of the fastest growing religions in North America because of immigration. Why import this potential domestic threat? And it is not only terrorist threats we should be concerned about but Islams opposition to a secular and pluralistic society. Go live in Saudi Arabia for a year then come back and talk to me.

And the fact that they were all British born is what is so scary about it. What doctrine persuaded them to behave and think as such?

Nice try but no matter what apologists such as yourself, who for some irrational and paradoxical reason come to the defense of a religion that is theologically opposed to the pluralistic and liberal society I assume you are defending, can convince me that Islam does not posses a real threat to the safety of Canadians. If Islam in multicultural Britain is producing people like these men how naive of us to assume such a thing will not happen here.

Your ostrich like "head in the sand" position isn't constructive and only makes possible a future terrorist attack here on Canadian soil. Your smug, ideologically committed "Let's look the other way" view is what terrorists are counting on. Muslims, even moderate Muslims, have failed to police themselves and purge their communities of undesirables. Therefore we must do what the cannot, or will not, do. Lives are at stake.

So let's examine your reasoning: Canada was almost attacked by terrorists who were a) not immigrants, and b) if descended from immigrants, those immigrants weren't necessarily Muslim. So how have you come to the conclusion that this is a problem to be solved by ending "Muslim immigration?" How would restricting British immigration by religion have made one bit of difference to Canada? Even if 100 per cent of Muslim immigration were ended, that terrotist cell (and the July 7 cell) would still have been in place! Your logic is exactly the same as saying that the London Blitz could have been prevented if German immigration to Britain had been stopped and Queen Elizabeth's family had been deported back to Germany.

If I were to apply your logic you applied on Islam. That since all terrorists kill in the name of Islam, then Islam must be teaching terrorism. If this is so, then Christianity must be teaching terrorism, bloodshed, murder, rape too, as that is what the pope told to the crusades and they went to kill Muslims and Jews.

Before assuming things about a religion, one should maybe read up on a religion to know what one is talking about.

You are missing the point by more than a few thousand kilometers so let me make it as plain as I can.

It is very clear, and I cannot see how you can disagree with what I am about to write, that Islam, or elements of it, is dangerous and it kills people. You follow? There are more than enough world examples that illustrate this. Only the most ostrich-like, heavily indoctrinated, robot of leftist ideology would fail to see this.

I am not saying restricting British immigration I am saying Canada should hinder the growth of Islam in this country by placing server limits on its importation from whatever country it comes from. This can be accomplished via a cherry-picking approach.

This country respects freedom of religion and if Canadians pick up the Qu'ran and decide to become Muslims that is their protected right however almost of Islam's growth in North America is due to immigration and less so from converts. Ironically, while Muslims practice their right to religious freedom their religion theologically limits or even bans religious freedom. I don't know how you can defend that.

Even if 100 per cent of Muslim immigration were ended, that terrotist cell (and the July 7 cell) would still have been in place!

First of all you don't know that and you cannot even begin to defend that assertion. However, if that may very well be true it may also have been avoided if Muslim immigration had been banned some time earlier. By allowing the assured influx of Muslims into the country we only make all the more certain of future terrorist attack against Canadians, or other targets like U.S embassies, on Canadian soil. This is a real possibility and when it happens, God forbid, are you going to take responsibility for it and console the grieving families by explaining that Islam is a religion of peace? Since leftists never accept responsibility for the negative consequences of their actions on society we all know whose fault it will be won't we?

Your logic is exactly the same as saying that the London Blitz could have been prevented if German immigration to Britain had been stopped and Queen Elizabeth's family had been deported back to Germany.

I don't even know how to make sense of this.

Muslim immigration allows terrorists to slip into the country. This isn't to say that all Muslim immigration is bad but evil elements can slip into the country with the mass. Muslim communities allow terrorists to disappear and operate in Canadian society by blending in with the crowd. And even though no Muslim terrorist has entered the country via immigration Islamic theology is potent enough to produce "home grown" terrorist such as the ones on trial in Britain right now. Muslims bring with them a religious theology that produce dangerous people. No guarantee can be given that Muslim terrorist actions will not happen here or against Canadians elsewhere yet we can minimize the possibility of those acts ever occurring by restricting Muslim immigration. The math is simple: less Muslims, less potential terrorist threats.

It's a dangerous world, Canada doesn't have to be. Ottawa's responsibility is to the safety of Canadians and if an immigrant group carries a potential threat, like people infected with a dangerous virus, it makes no sense to release such a threat onto society. The fault is with Muslims.

If I were to apply your logic you applied on Islam. That since all terrorists kill in the name of Islam, then Islam must be teaching terrorism. If this is so, then Christianity must be teaching terrorism, bloodshed, murder, rape too, as that is what the pope told to the crusades and they went to kill Muslims and Jews.

The pope said that? I didn't know that. I must confess I am ignorant of the history of the crusades but apparently you are very learned so if you will, can you supply me references where I may research that quote myself. You know the one where the Pope told the crusaders to shed blood, rape, and murder and to kill Jews and Muslims. And while you're researching it tell me how the crusades were not a response to Islamic militant expansionism?

Besides, give me modern examples of the Christianity of the crusades.

Here's a tip: try living in the now. What do the crusades, an event that happened millenia ago, have to do with Islamic terrorism of today. How is talking about the crusades going to prevent Canadians from getting blown up on an airplane?

Yes, it is pretty obvious that you seem pretty ignorant of history, though it has to be taken into consideration before making statements of the kind you make about Muslims.

Here is a source for you: "The Crusades were a series of military conflicts of a religious character waged by much of Christian Europe against external and internal threats. Crusades were fought against Muslims, pagan Slavs, Russian and Greek Orthodox Christians, Mongols, Cathars, Hussites, and political enemies of the popes.[1] Crusaders took vows and were granted an indulgence for past sins.[1]

The Crusades originally had the goal of recapturing Jerusalem and the Holy Land from Muslim rule and were originally launched in response to a call from the Eastern Orthodox Byzantine Empire for help against the expansion of the Muslim Seljuk Turks into Anatolia."Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades

The Muslims or Mohammad was never the first to take up a weapon to fight, in fact the only time he had to fight was for defense.

An example is an example whether old or new. That is a lame defense. Instead of asking to show the prove from the bibel you say I should give one from history. The reason why I brought up the crusades was not to blame christianity, but rather to show that people in the name of religion preach things that are not originally in the religions. However your approach shows me that you've shut off your mind towards everything and are just simply anti-islam.

Nonetheless, people like yourself have always existed and could not change much, like Hitler. People, like yourself are temporary, and no sane person pays attention to what you say, hence why nobody will ever stop any Muslims from entering Canada, or any other country, nor will they ever be thrown out. As this is not your birthright to throw anyone out.

And I am enjoying how you suffer from the inside seeing Muslims in canada and not being able to do much about it.

However, if you are truthseeker and want to know what Islam is really about then you should do a little research and you will realise that Islam has nothing to do with terrorism.

"Nonetheless, people like yourself have always existed and could not change much, like Hitler".

When losing a debate, it's always obligatory to throw in "Hitler's" name just to rub salt into the intended wound. Although Comrade Stalin was the bigger tyrant who was directly responsible for about 20,000,000 deaths through starvation and mass murder, he is seldom given a second thought.

Evidently, its quite clear the controlled mass media have done an excellent job at brainwashing easily-led dupes into following their pied-piper lead that Hitler was the biggest tyrant ever spawned. Try reading some recent history related to Churchill's Dresden bombing raids or Eisenhower's POW death camps after WWII.

"People, like yourself are temporary, and no sane person pays attention to what you say, hence why nobody will ever stop any Muslims from entering Canada...."

Just more ad hominem attacks and insults and they reveal their traitorous colours with that sentiment; Canada is under attack by the invading 5th columnist Muslim world. No mention here of having faithful adherence to our sovereign nation... just an invasion mentality.

"And I am enjoying how you suffer from the inside seeing Muslims in canada and not being able to do much about it. "

Ahhh, he or she will be back to read it. They can't resist. Besides even if he or she doesn't their points need to be addressed and clarified.

The anon, who I am convinced is a Muslim, who wants us to believe the incorrect assertion that the crusades where acts of aggression against the "peaceful" Muslims of yore should do better at providing relevant source material than a lame Wiki entry. Wiki, by its nature, is unreliable and subject to bias. No reputable scholar, or student gunning for an A paper, ever cites Wiki.

Also, having failed to supply a quote where the Pope instructs the Crusaders to rape, shed blood, and murder, I can assume you're just as ignorant of Crusader history as you claim I am, relying heavily on a basic understanding of the events often skewed by historical revisionism seeking to cast Christianity in a negative light particularly if all your sources are by Muslim authors.

Since this is about Muslim expansionism I will focus on the Crusades reaction to it. As for the Crusaders dealings with the other groups that is beyond what the scope of this post.

"The Crusades originally had the goal of recapturing Jerusalem and the Holy Land from Muslim rule and were originally launched in response to a call from the Eastern Orthodox Byzantine Empire for help against the expansion of the Muslim Seljuk Turks into Anatolia."

From your own source we read that the Crusades "had the goal of recapturing Jerusalem and the Holy Land from Muslim rule and were originally launched in response to a call from the Eastern Orthodox Byzantine Empire for help against the expansion of the Muslim Seljuk Turks into Anatolia." In short, and supported by your source we learn that the crusades were, in fact, a response to Muslim expansionism. How did the Muslims come to rule Jewish Jerusalem? How did once Christian Egypt, and other parts of Christian north Africa, fall to Muslim influence? How did Islam capture southern Spain? Why was Constantinople, named after the first Roman Emperor to convert to Christianity, renamed Istanbul? Was it all due to mass conversions to Islam because everyone saw the beauty of that religion? Or was it forced conversions via implied death threats and mass expulsions of non converts?

The Muslims or Mohammad was never the first to take up a weapon to fight, in fact the only time he had to fight was for defense.

Only Muslim revisionists say these things which is why I think "anon" is a Muslim. If "he" you mean Mohammad then that maybe true but he left a book of God's word that gave divine consent for his followers to convert the world by sword or Qu'ran. See above for more details.

An example is an example whether old or new. That is a lame defense.

No it is not. What history has shown us is that Christianity has matured to become the pacifist religion that it was always meant to be. Islam still needs a lot of growing up to do and that being the case Islam is a potential threat. But is the discrepancy due to scripture? Perhaps a closer investigation of the Qu'ran is warranted.

The reason why I brought up the crusades was not to blame christianity, but rather to show that people in the name of religion preach things that are not originally in the religions.

What was preached in the Crusades? Was Christian Europe supposed to lie down and let the Muslim conquerors take over by threat of death like the Muslim siege of Jerusalem? Does "jihad" mean anything to you?

If I am anti-Islam it is because Islam is anti-west. Islam is theologically opposed to religious pluralism, secularism, gay and lesbian rights, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of association. Islam tolerates nothing but "God's will" which is whatever the reigning Imam says it is. Islam is, in its theology, opposed to everything that makes modern day Canada a great country. Islam is not here to bring us diversity because Islam, but its character, is opposed to diversity.

Nonetheless, people like yourself have always existed and could not change much, like Hitler.

Ah yes, Godwin's Law. Nice to see you.

And I am enjoying how you suffer from the inside seeing Muslims in canada and not being able to do much about it.

No I can influence the immigration system which is the prime source for Islam's growth in this country. Few people convert to that religion. However I will defend a Muslim's right to practice his or her religion here even though I feel Islam is not compatible with Canadian values and in fact posses a domestic threat.

However, if you are truthseeker and want to know what Islam is really about then you should do a little research and you will realise that Islam has nothing to do with terrorism.

Oh no, I know enough about Islam and I happen to like Canada the way it is and was but am dreading what it will become. Islam may have nothing to do with terrorism but it sure is the cause of much of it and this even you cannot deny. And because of this I think the Canadian government is putting the lives, and quality of life, of Canadians in jeopardy by allowing the unfettered immigration of Muslims.

For the record I will state that I am opposed to a ban of all Muslim immigration because I do know that the vast majority of Muslims in the world are not terrorists. But I do support a "cherry picking" approach to Muslim immigration because of Muslim terrorism and the Caliphate aspirations of many Muslims here and abroad. Immigrating to Canada is not a human right and most Canadians like the country the way it is. If we wanted to live in an Islamic state we would convert and move to Saudi Arabia.

Here's a clarification of Godwin's Law:(Something new to learn everyday!)

"As a Usenet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one." There is a tradition in many groups that, once this occurs, that thread is over, and whoever mentioned the Nazis has automatically lost whatever argument was in progress. Godwin's Law thus practically guarantees the existence of an upper bound on thread length in those groups. However there is also a widely recognised codicil that any intentional triggering of Godwin's Law in order to invoke its thread-ending effects will be unsuccessful."

I saw a great documentary recently, "Islam: what the west needs to know". It does like the movie "Fitna", taking quotations directly from the Koran to show that when taken literally, Islam really is NOT a relgion of peace. Unlike Fitna though, it isn't just a piece in shock value. I have read the Koran and always suspected that there was no peace in it. However, I was quite confused with the contradictions. For instance, at one point it says, "there is no compulsion in religion". Elsewhere it says, "kill the infidels where ever you should find them". The movie shed light on why we find such contradictions. There is a verse in the Koran that says that Allah is allowed to change his mind. So there is no contradiction in the Koran. Mohamed was just a schizophrenic war mongerer (and pedophile) and wrote the Koran to suit his purpose of expansion. I find that the argument about Christianity and the Crusades/Spanish Inquisition by many to be laughable. At least when Christians were being crazy they didn't have access to nukes. Imagine if they had. Actually, no imagination required, we have medieval minded people who do have access to nukes, and who do want to destroy the west.

Discussing Muslim immigration is tricky. I believe the vast majority of the world's Muslims are just like everybody else. They just want to work and raise their families.

However radical Islam is a virus Muslims haven't been able to cure themselves of and wherever there are Muslims you can be sure that radical Islam is being preached somewhere. Even though the vast majority of Muslims are law abiding, it only takes a small minority to be a real concern. Is national security worth sacrificing for the sake of diversity?

Also, many Muslims, even peaceful ones, believe it is Islam's destiny to dominate the world. This can be achieved without the sword. Just outnumber everybody. Are Canadians comfortable with Canada, or portions of it, becoming an Islamic state? These are real concerns that shouldn't be ignored. Canada is our country as well and it is our democratic right to influence its direction.

paxcanadiana " you must be a stupid redneck piece of shit" when you said this " No I can influence the immigration system which is the prime source for Islam's growth in this country. Few people convert to that religion"

Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world for a reason you idiot. Soon we will rule the world get your head outta your ass...Canada is ours