Just watched the video for the first time. Song's okay, video's better. I'm not sure why there's breast-feeding, but it's pretty funny. When did old people start enlisting young people to keep up appearances? Neil Young/Pearl Jam...Aretha/George Michael...Neil Young/Devo--how far back does that go?

Nice! Sincerely wondering this in terms of pop music, though. I don't think any of the '50s guys--Elvis, Berry, etc.--ever actually engaged in this sort of thing, at least not on record, unless I'm forgetting something; they did get career boosts from things like Lennon's Rock and Roll Revival show. Mitigating factors aside, Frank and Nancy might be a good starting point.

I meant something more like who's a bigger help to whom in terms of widening her current audience. Just guessing. I was probably thinking of my grade 6 class: 100% of them know who Nicki Minaj is, two-thirds know Madonna, and I'd be surprised if even half have heard of MIA. But that's a pretty narrow perspective, so you're probably right.

dan are you seriously suggesting that the woman who won an oscar for best song in a movie and who rapped with kanye and jay at the grammys while she was pregnant is desperately in need for exposure?

Madonna hasn't had youth/critical culture impact since like the mid-nineties. Nicki and MIA have FOUR BARS apiece on this track. They are there as a sap to those two audiences; no one is gonna listen to that madge track and say, hey I should check this MIA chick out!

dan are you seriously suggesting that the woman who won an oscar for best song in a movie and who rapped with kanye and jay at the grammys while she was pregnant is desperately in need for exposure?

Madonna hasn't had youth/critical culture impact since like the mid-nineties. Nicki and MIA have FOUR BARS apiece on this track. They are there as a sap to those two audiences; no one is gonna listen to that madge track and say, hey I should check this MIA chick out!

You are massively underselling/misunderstanding Madonna's position in pop music. The woman is a still-working pop legend; the appearance of both Nicki and MIA on this are pandering moves to current pop and indie dance audiences but the reason they both said yes* is because IT'S FUCKING MADONNA.

* though in fairness, Nicki would have said yes if it was Diamanda Galas; she seems to be addicted to guest spots

no argument; the question was who gets "more" out of it and the idea that we're discussing exactly what "more" is in this context makes me feel like a moron so I'm happily conceding whatever your position is

Are you serious? Those were the highlights for me. His more lean production with the electric guitar is why I love that album. A great balance to what would've been a preening, pretentious synth album.

yeah they were great at the time when she was doing it when it initially released but they can get irksome if not in the right mood. Plus, I do miss listening to Madonna with a guitar/bass/piano/whatever rockist boring instrument every once in a while.

Madonna hasn't had youth/critical culture impact since like the mid-nineties

I'd push that a little forward to include Music, but I basically agree. Which is not an aesthetic judgement on the the two or three albums that followed, and I love lots of music made by people who are on the other side of their moment or whatever you want to call it.

uh, lex I did? I liked Music fine but it felt flimsy; American Life was terrible and after two listens Hard Candy left zero impact. Hung Up was, what, '08? I only vaguely remember it; it was clearly not for me.

mh: everyone who buys us or people or star or whatever the hell sure does. She was watermelon big at the grammys, it got a lot of press. the oscar thing with rahman was huge international news for like a week.