Thanks, again, Aerys - it worked like a charm except that as you say it uses the HTML ToC and not the one in the toc.ncx file. Is there any way of being able to show the one in the toc.ncx file?

AFAIK, there isn't a way to specify due to a difference in how KF7 and KF8 mobi files are built by KindleGen.

You know it's hard to control if a READER is using KF7 or KF8 so it just makes more sense to have the HTML TOC and NCX contain the same entries rather than having diminished usability of the TOC for a reader using the KF7 one.

I've seen this fix some subtle problems with the behavior of some floating elements near the tops of pages in some of my books. It probably won't help in your case, given that you're dealing with an image rather than a glyph, but if it does, let me know.

Well, I haven't quite tried it THAT way, but, hell...at this point, I'd join a cult and sacrifice goats (okay...that part is a lie) if it helped. I've been cursing this book for bloody days. I'll try it.

As always, thanks. And for anyone else out there: even if you think your idea is wacky, or that I've "probably" tried it--never hesitate to speak up. I'm always appreciative of input, and newbs coming along may NOT know some of the tricks--so all that input has value. ;-)

Any item that is in the toc (HTML? and/or NCX? -- ours are usually identical), but preceeds the "start reading location" is assumed to be frontmatter. This, like all good theories, is based on one anecdotal instance in which all the usual epub-like guide items are there (title page, copyright, dedication, etc.) but don't appear in either TOC, yet there was one item in the TOC (a map) which wasn't in the guide, of course, but did end up in frontmatter.

And by the way since I have a FireHD but don't have a Fire, I wonder whether the different behaviors are reflected in the Kindle emulator?

Any item that is in the toc (HTML? and/or NCX? -- ours are usually identical), but preceeds the "start reading location" is assumed to be frontmatter. This, like all good theories, is based on one anecdotal instance in which all the usual epub-like guide items are there (title page, copyright, dedication, etc.) but don't appear in either TOC, yet there was one item in the TOC (a map) which wasn't in the guide, of course, but did end up in frontmatter.

And by the way since I have a FireHD but don't have a Fire, I wonder whether the different behaviors are reflected in the Kindle emulator?

Albert

Hey, Albert:

Well, y'know, I don't think that the emulator reflects the differences, because we have the ncx versus html toc issue (the FireHD 8.98 uses the ncx, and the Fire doesn't; don't actually know factually about the Fire HD). What I care about is the inability to move frontmatter around as I see fit, or more importantly, as dictated by the client. As stated in my original rant about the frontmatter/toc issue, when we put an important Treasure Hunt clue (for real treasure, in the real world) in the frontmatter, prior to the TOC, Amazon stoutly refused--refused--to move the SRL to the clue page, (intro) where we'd put it.

We've basically determined to deal with it simply--not my nature, as you all know--and keep frontmatter frontmatter and put anything that "must be read" after the TOC. What I have fought against is trying to put the TOC first, because I think that reeks of amateursville, but, this "nothing before the TOC can be the SRL" issue is a PITA. On the other hand, Amazon just published a book of ours in which the top of every chapter is displaying all the first lines of the XHTML, so, isn't THAT fun? (They've been having major intake issues for days, with errors [=screaming clients, "what's wrong with my file!!!!"], so my hope is that once they've decided to stop improving whatever the freak needs "improving" this time, it will be fixed).

The issue I have is, sure, we all have to keep up with the latest this and that, but the Russian Roulette version of ebook-making (will this work on K4iPad THIS week?) is just really frustrating and worse, for me, expensive. I mean, it's like almost every book is the first book one's made, if you see what I'm saying; one bloody surprise after another. Still screwing around with image-crafting for images (like fluerons, or chapter-head images) that are not full-sized, to work on all Kindle devices perfectly. It's an endless battle.

The issue I have is, sure, we all have to keep up with the latest this and that, but the Russian Roulette version of ebook-making (will this work on K4iPad THIS week?) is just really frustrating and worse, for me, expensive. I mean, it's like almost every book is the first book one's made, if you see what I'm saying; one bloody surprise after another. Still screwing around with image-crafting for images (like fluerons, or chapter-head images) that are not full-sized, to work on all Kindle devices perfectly. It's an endless battle.

Hitch

Preach it, Sistah!

Hoo boy, do I feel your pain. I recommend heavy doses of the Serenity Prayer, and lighter doses of Wild Turkey.

As for the emulator, I can't experiment ATM because of a big thunderstorm that prompted me to shut down the non-essential servers (including my Windows boxen) but IIRC I know it doesn't accurately emulate the "go to" menu item in that it lists all the guide items (even the non-supported ones) and they function. For all devices, I think.

So once the storm passes, I will gin up (or is that Jinn up?) a test case with different HTML and NCX toc's and see how it goes. I would hate to have to buy another couple of Kindles but if that's what it takes...