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Re: Konan vs Kakashi

Originally Posted by Rikudou King

What effective way can Kakashi deal with a bunch of explosive tags being shot at him and flying around? Even if they aren't in physical contact with him when they explode, they'll still have plenty of force at a distance.

Who says it will be the real Kakashi fighting/standing there and not a bunshin?

Isn't that her paper being burned? Irrelevant since Kakashi hasn't shown Katon in the manga IIRC, but yea...

Yeah - it just means katon can affect paper <lol2 > I mean, her paper may be chakra enhance but its still a paper - maybe its just slower put by fire.. and maybe other things like water and so on.
Looking by what normal paper looks like when applied with elemental chakra:http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/ch...5/page015.html
just begs the question whether it aplies to Konan's paper as well. Me thinks that yes, like paper, but probably its a little more durable and slower in the process of 'finishing it off' xd

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

Originally Posted by mattiaildivino

but why would konan attack kakashi first? I think kakashi's kamui would defeat her suddenly at the beginning of the fight. kakashi is faster.contrariwise konan needs time to prepare that technique then she can't use it.

Because she's up against the famed mirror eyed Kakashi? I highly doubt Kakashi would use Kamui right off the bat considering how danger it is for him and his normal fighting style. Konan doesn't need time to use explosive tags, as we saw when she used them on Madara at the beginning of that fight.

Originally Posted by juUnior

Who says it will be the real Kakashi fighting/standing there and not a bunshin?

Kakashi's habit of not pulling a clone until he has fought for a while?

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

Originally Posted by Rikudou King

Because she's up against the famed mirror eyed Kakashi? I highly doubt Kakashi would use Kamui right off the bat considering how danger it is for him and his normal fighting style. Konan doesn't need time to use explosive tags, as we saw when she used them on Madara at the beginning of that fight.

Kakashi's habit of not pulling a clone until he has fought for a while?

Depends on the situation. Kakashi used a clone off the bat when he helped Kurenai and the other dude. Also if i remember right he used a clone very fast vs 30% clone Itachi.

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

Why can't Konan also use a clone against Kakashi? She has shown remarkable abilities using a paper clone as well, even from long distances.

If Kakashi uses Kamui, all Konan needs to do is to completely fold herself into a paper, and then reform herself after the jutsu is over.

A raiton Bushin would paralyze her, yes, ut Konan usually fights from a distance, and I believe Kakashi would have a hard time getting in close with a sea of paper and exploding tags attacking it.

Last edited by hakuthehedgehog; June 23, 2011 at 06:42 AM.

Originally Posted by Darth Executor

On that topic, anyone else think Naruto's the type of guy who would cry after sex?

Originally Posted by Rikudou King

I fount it interesting that had Kushina not gotten knocked up, None of them would be in the current situation. She's more responsible for the Uchiha massacre then Danzo and co. Crap, Now Sasuke has a valid reason to use his hatred against Naruto.

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

I hate these arguements saying that Konan can'rt win because she doesn't have prep time. She made 600 billion tags in days! Frankly she won't even need a minute fraction of that against someone who isn't Madara. As far as it goes, Kakashi can only win if he uses Kamui and gets a kill with it; as as shown in the manga water and fire jutsus do not disrupt her, the same goes for the physical attacks.

However, while Kakashi only has one chance, (and he doesn't know this at the start of the fight!), Konan has an effect arsenal against anybody. She is invunerable, can turn any paper objects into any weapon, create clones with them (which I can imagine could be used in a similar effect to the exploding bunshin), and fly where she wants. Even with Kamui, I doubt that it would work. As shown with Madara, she was willing to use explosions in close proximity to herself to get out of the way.

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

Originally Posted by Nath Uchiha

I hate these arguements saying that Konan can'rt win because she doesn't have prep time. She made 600 billion tags in days! Frankly she won't even need a minute fraction of that against someone who isn't Madara. As far as it goes, Kakashi can only win if he uses Kamui and gets a kill with it; as as shown in the manga water and fire jutsus do not disrupt her, the same goes for the physical attacks.

However, while Kakashi only has one chance, (and he doesn't know this at the start of the fight!), Konan has an effect arsenal against anybody. She is invunerable, can turn any paper objects into any weapon, create clones with them (which I can imagine could be used in a similar effect to the exploding bunshin), and fly where she wants. Even with Kamui, I doubt that it would work. As shown with Madara, she was willing to use explosions in close proximity to herself to get out of the way.

She is not really invulnerable. Explosions and fire would defenetly harm her. If Madara never warped those tags away she would have died there.
Also let's not forget Kakashi has genjutsu.

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

On that topic, anyone else think Naruto's the type of guy who would cry after sex?

Originally Posted by Rikudou King

I fount it interesting that had Kushina not gotten knocked up, None of them would be in the current situation. She's more responsible for the Uchiha massacre then Danzo and co. Crap, Now Sasuke has a valid reason to use his hatred against Naruto.

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

Well, she can make herself invulnerable by completely folding herself into paper, but she wouldn't be able to attack in that mode.

Originally Posted by Darth Executor

On that topic, anyone else think Naruto's the type of guy who would cry after sex?

Originally Posted by Rikudou King

I fount it interesting that had Kushina not gotten knocked up, None of them would be in the current situation. She's more responsible for the Uchiha massacre then Danzo and co. Crap, Now Sasuke has a valid reason to use his hatred against Naruto.

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

That would be a though one for Kakashi.
I can't see his Kamui connecting. She just need to put some paper in front of her, and he will be using all his chakra to teleport the paper instead of her head.

And with the amount of paper bomb that she can put, he will have a though time connecting his Raikiri.
And we can't forget that the paper angel can fly too!

Without thinking, I'd give it to Konan, but I'm going to wait before voting.
I want to see the others opinions first.

True love will conquer everythingThe question now is : which of those two loves, is the true one?!
___________________

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

What would happen if all the paper would get burned? :P She can't really just stay like that. Also i presume there is a chakra cost to keep that form up.

Burn the paper with that? Kakashi never showed an ungodly amount of ninja tools with exploding tags.

No, she can't stay in that form indefinitly, but she could dodge Kamui with it.

Originally Posted by Darth Executor

On that topic, anyone else think Naruto's the type of guy who would cry after sex?

Originally Posted by Rikudou King

I fount it interesting that had Kushina not gotten knocked up, None of them would be in the current situation. She's more responsible for the Uchiha massacre then Danzo and co. Crap, Now Sasuke has a valid reason to use his hatred against Naruto.

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

Burn the paper with that? Kakashi never showed an ungodly amount of ninja tools with exploding tags.

No, she can't stay in that form indefinitly, but she could dodge Kamui with it.

You are missing the point. To be invulnerable means you can't get hurt in that form no matter what. So if she is invulnerable in that form and i take her and teleport her inside the Sun she should be just fine. Its irrelevant if Kakashi can or can't damage her.

If you wanted to state that in that form Kakashi has nothing to damage her then that is a completly diferent thing but she is not invulnerable.

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

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I feel like I'm back in the Bleach tournament...now it's omni-directional attacks from Konan? When has she done that without massive prep time? In addition, weren't her only fights against Jiraiya and Madara?

She has covered many people's entire bodys with her paper by layers flat sheets all over them whether for transportation or to suffocate them. Am I really not allowed to assume she can change the angle of her paper 45 degrees and turn it into a more offensive attacks? That's like saying a fighter can't punch someone in the knee because we've only ever seen them punch people in the face. When you have an ability like hers and have seen her use it in the intense detail she does, a certain degree of assumptions can be made. It's like dealing with Gaara or the Third KazeKage, only with paper.

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Did we ever see her paper interact with Suiton techs?

Pain hit her with his crab bubble technique when he was attacking Jiraiya and she was fine, and she's made her paper in the rain on multiple occassions.

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The way I see it, they have an initial clash, and Kakashi goes underground...a bunshin comes up and fights to ascertain her techniques...it'd be obvious that she's a long-range specialist, and that she'll make it quite difficult for him to get up close for Raikiri or anything else...so instead of wasting his time with b.s. techs (we could see a Suijinheki in here), he'd go for the Kamui kill. I dunno, she had a decent strategy against Madara, and you could argue that she didn't really want to kill Jiraiya, but I wasn't really impressed with her combat intellect.

As we've seen it, Kamui has always been a last resort technique. Even against Deva Path he only used it after he tried a bunch of different techniques. He will not start a fight with it. Even if he does, he will somehow have to get all of her paper in one shot and his Kamui's range is not that expansive. And then if he uses it three or four times to try and get her whole body he runs out of chakra and Konan wins.

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I mean, she did fight Jiraiya and Madara, so it's a bit unfair, but, again, without the prep time to prepare a ridiculous number of explosive-tagged pieces of paper,

All the major damage she did to Madara was done without prep time. He Izanagied her lake of explosive attacks so they had 0 effect on him. She blew off his arm and mask with a few paper tags she mixed in with her paper when he tried to absorb her, which doesn't require any prep time (we see people like Shikamaru and Sakura (might be anime only on her) spam explosive tags and while they are used stragetically he just pulled them out of his ass and threw them down).

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And this isn't even mentioning genjutsu...which we haven't seen Konan perform or do well against, while Kakashi is good with genjutsu AND has the Sharingan.

As I admitted earlier, she may have trouble with genjutsu, but he can only use genjutsu with eye contact (he's not Itachi). When she break her body into paper she has no eyes. And since everybody and their mother knows that Sharingan=Genjutsu she'd watch out for that. But if he managed to get one on her while in her real body, she'd be in a tough spot.

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Saw the posts on the Suiton and stuff...we saw a bubble attack from a summon friendly to Konan...not an actual hostile attack, so I don't see how we're saying suiton is completely ineffective.

Regardless who it was from, she was caught in the middle of his attack. He can't just decrease the intesity of the first half of his stream of water and then increase it when it passes her.

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Additionally, that fireball wasn't oil-enhanced...Jiraiya didn't attack her with fire after pwning her paper with oil.

Huh, I was pretty sure he did his oil mixing when he blew out his Katon, I'll go reread. But regardless, Kakashi can't use Katon or oil.

And I question if Raiton will have any effect on her. If we're going off the argument that many like to argue that her paper abides by the normal rules of paper (fire will burn it, etc, even though it only made like two pieces smolder and her main body which was still paper was fine), than paper is an insulator and won't conduct electricity and raiton will have no effect on her in that fashion. He'd have to get a direct hit on her with a Raikiri, but direct physical attacks are useless on her.

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What would happen if all the paper would get burned? :P She can't really just stay like that. Also i presume there is a chakra cost to keep that form up.

Didn't you just admit in your previous post that fire doesn't harm her in any significant way? Besides, Kakashi doesn't have Katon. Logic states, that in order to say someone isn't invulnerable you have to show how she gets hurt. She has never been hurt in the manga - she died after spending all her chakra and falling to a broken genjutsu cast by Madara. But regardless, she isn't invulnerable. Oil makes her paper stick and effectively renders her useless, but Kakashi has no oil jutsu.

Re: Konan vs Kakashi

Originally Posted by White Silver King

*sigh* Once again, suiton does not work on her. And the last time I checked, paper is an insulator so she can't be electrocuted. And can his dog even reach her? She can fly up as far as she needs or create walls of paper to take the attack.

Her paper doesn't exactly folllow any logic when you think about it. Think about it as her paper can't get wet/soggy or burn up like it would in our world so whats to say electricity wouldn't atleast stun her. She's obviously not invulnerable as Madara stated when Konan mixed explosive tags with her self it could of killed her aswell. Also you r right about the dog not being able to reach her as that slipped my mind for a second but if worse comes to worse Kakashi's kamui can suck up all her paper completely into another dimension.