Free will, prayer, and God's intervention - Think Atheist2017-08-18T05:15:59Zhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/forum/topics/free-will-prayer-and-god-s-intervention?commentId=1982180%3AComment%3A1167465&feed=yes&xn_auth=noAsk your friend how this work…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-16:1982180:Comment:11688562012-08-16T08:44:26.532ZYahwehhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/Yaweh
<p>Ask your friend how this works.</p>
<p>Person A prays to win in a poker game, and he wins, and credits god. But then person B who is dying of cancer prays he gets better but dies horribly later on. Does this mean that God cared more about Person A winning the poker game than the dying Person B?</p>
<p>Ask your friend how this works.</p>
<p>Person A prays to win in a poker game, and he wins, and credits god. But then person B who is dying of cancer prays he gets better but dies horribly later on. Does this mean that God cared more about Person A winning the poker game than the dying Person B?</p> Got one of my christian frien…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-16:1982180:Comment:11687562012-08-16T01:25:45.970ZDaniel Patrick Dayhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/DanielPatrickDay
<p>Got one of my christian friends to reluctantly answer.</p>
<p>According to him:</p>
<p>1. Prayer does work.</p>
<p>2. Anytime something happens out of the ordinary or is greatly contrary to expectation is a sign of God's intervention. Any anomalies in data or patterns is a sign that god is changing something, if god wasn't pulling strings, then everything would always go according to pattern and prediction. (Science is only good for the things that god isn't currently dealing…</p>
<p>Got one of my christian friends to reluctantly answer.</p>
<p>According to him:</p>
<p>1. Prayer does work.</p>
<p>2. Anytime something happens out of the ordinary or is greatly contrary to expectation is a sign of God's intervention. Any anomalies in data or patterns is a sign that god is changing something, if god wasn't pulling strings, then everything would always go according to pattern and prediction. (Science is only good for the things that god isn't currently dealing with.)</p>
<p>3. God does not alter free will at all, he simply changes the conditions around individuals to set them up for a specific path. It's up to the person in the end to decide whether to do one thing or another. That's why some prayers don't seem to get answered, god tries, but some one somewhere didn't follow his plan.</p> You're not god. Not impressedtag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-15:1982180:Comment:11685782012-08-15T12:31:53.615ZYahwehhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/Yaweh
<p>You're not god. Not impressed</p>
<p>You're not god. Not impressed</p> I love the video too, and I t…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-15:1982180:Comment:11684492012-08-15T02:46:29.535ZRon Vhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/RV
<p>I love the video too, and I try to share it whenever an opportunity arises.</p>
<p>I love the video too, and I try to share it whenever an opportunity arises.</p> Regarding 2.2: How can he int…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-15:1982180:Comment:11684422012-08-15T02:09:35.635ZUnseenhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/Unseen
<p>Regarding 2.2: <font face="georgia, palatino">How can he intervene without occasionally interfering with free will</font>?</p>
<p>Setting aside all the contradictions involved in the properties of free will, let's say that through His Omniscience, God know what is and what will be, including what you and I will do as well as what He will do. If free will exists, and if all mankind has it, one can be sure that God does, too. So, He already knows what every person will do, and he also knows…</p>
<p>Regarding 2.2: <font face="georgia, palatino">How can he intervene without occasionally interfering with free will</font>?</p>
<p>Setting aside all the contradictions involved in the properties of free will, let's say that through His Omniscience, God know what is and what will be, including what you and I will do as well as what He will do. If free will exists, and if all mankind has it, one can be sure that God does, too. So, He already knows what every person will do, and he also knows when and where He will interject Himself in our affairs.</p>
<p>Don't confuse prescience (foreknowledge) with predetermination (everything already laid out, some having already happened, some happening, and some yet to happen).</p> Love this! Prayer is an illus…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-14:1982180:Comment:11681752012-08-14T07:20:06.866ZGina Westonhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/GinaWeston
<p>Love this! Prayer is an illusion. Brilliant Video! Totally sharing. =D</p>
<p>Love this! Prayer is an illusion. Brilliant Video! Totally sharing. =D</p> God speaking!!! Why in H.E.…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-13:1982180:Comment:11679652012-08-13T20:02:09.265ZDale Headleyhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/DaleHeadley
<p>God speaking!!! Why in H.E. double chopsticks, would I give my creations “free will”? If I did something stupid like that some of them might not even believe in me.</p>
<p>God speaking!!! Why in H.E. double chopsticks, would I give my creations “free will”? If I did something stupid like that some of them might not even believe in me.</p> So how does the "the Golden a…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-13:1982180:Comment:11677672012-08-13T18:48:38.413ZEdhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/EdwardDelauter
<p>So how does the "<span>the Golden and Blessed Perfection of Jesus Christ" make a decision between two athletes about to compete in a race against one another? I see it all the time: they look to the stars, kiss their cross around their neck, and make the obligatory 4 point tap on the chest. As if the grand sky fairy would actually have an interest in which follower was to win the race. </span></p>
<p><span>Woe is me for I suffer not from senseless indoctrination.</span></p>
<p>So how does the "<span>the Golden and Blessed Perfection of Jesus Christ" make a decision between two athletes about to compete in a race against one another? I see it all the time: they look to the stars, kiss their cross around their neck, and make the obligatory 4 point tap on the chest. As if the grand sky fairy would actually have an interest in which follower was to win the race. </span></p>
<p><span>Woe is me for I suffer not from senseless indoctrination.</span></p> Heh... it's great... but I do…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-13:1982180:Comment:11677562012-08-13T17:00:27.980ZSkycomet the Fallen Angelhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/Skycomet
<p>Heh... it's great... but I doubt it will work at all on theists.because they are impermeable to any sort of logic that runs counter to their beliefs. They would answer with a cop-out along the lines of "God works in mysterious ways that we can't understand." </p>
<p>Heh... it's great... but I doubt it will work at all on theists.because they are impermeable to any sort of logic that runs counter to their beliefs. They would answer with a cop-out along the lines of "God works in mysterious ways that we can't understand." </p> Does God intervene in daily a…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2012-08-13:1982180:Comment:11679302012-08-13T13:47:02.196ZJustNorrikhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/JustNorrik
<p><span><span><em>Does God intervene in daily affairs today?</em><br></br><br></br>My response is, do unicorns offer any solutions to our economic crisis? </span></span></p>
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<li><em><font face="georgia, palatino">If not, what is the point of prayer? <br></br><br></br></font></em><font face="georgia, palatino">I cannot find any use for prayer, meditation I can understand. The idea that christians or for that matter any religion, who believes God has a plan, but then in turn prays is saying to God "hey I…</font></li>
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<p><span><span><em>Does God intervene in daily affairs today?</em><br/><br/>My response is, do unicorns offer any solutions to our economic crisis? </span></span></p>
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<li><em><font face="georgia, palatino">If not, what is the point of prayer? <br/><br/></font></em><font face="georgia, palatino">I cannot find any use for prayer, meditation I can understand. The idea that christians or for that matter any religion, who believes God has a plan, but then in turn prays is saying to God "hey I don't like your plan, since I know better than God what I need, I'll have to ask for it.."</font><em><font face="georgia, palatino"><br/></font></em></li>
<li><em><font face="georgia, palatino">If so:</font></em><ol>
<li><em><font face="georgia, palatino">Why do we see no evidence of intervention? <br/><br/></font></em><font face="georgia, palatino">I think if it did exist we would see some type of predictive model, just out of seeing God's methodology in choosing which prayers to answer and which prayers God didn't answer.</font><em><font face="georgia, palatino"><br/><br/></font></em></li>
<li><font face="georgia, palatino"><em>How can he intervene without occasionally interfering with free will (which most of my Christian friends assure me he does not do)?</em><br/><br/>Well nobody can have free will within religion, as if there are religious rules and dogma, it asserts that God has a plan and one must follow the rules/dogme in order for God's plan to work correctly. Or if one prays or has free will, God has no plan. </font></li>
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