quote:Alex Sanchez. 1st player caught juicing. He was tiny speedster with no power. If he was juicing, everyone was juicing. And there is no body type to a juicer. It's ridiculous to think so.

Bingo. It was all throughout baseball. If the PED Era deserves an asterisk, so do many others. You can't compare apples to apples in baseball eras, IMO.

That being said, I've always liked Bonds. Ever since he was scrawny and with the Pirates. The fact still remains that he is the only member of the 500/500 Club, much less the 400/400 Club. Truly a remarkable ballplayer... PED's or not.

quote: mitchell report was a long time after steroids were first a major part of baseball

I dont see your point.

At some level all serious baseball fans knew steroids/PEDs were a major part of baseball from the late 80s thru at least the mid 2000s (and probably still today).

At some level those fans and members of the media rejected users of PEDs as being cheaters - but they generally did not apply the same logic to the players they had personal affinity for.

Going back retrospectively to see how hypocritical almost everyone was on the subject is probably a healthy exercise IMO - but picking out individuals for special condemnation is probably just going to be a more refined form of hypocrisy on the subject.

Biggio FB% numbers climbed those years he hit 20+ HR, while his HR/FB% also climbed up a bit its not that much higher than his career numbers. Sounds like he just tried to start lifting the ball a little more

quote:i could see how those numbers would match up, he was a pretty strong hitter for most of his career.

Yea i agree with you. I'm simply stating that his increased HR numbers at the end of his career appears to be because he was hitting more FB. 10-20% more. His HR/FB% jumped a little bit but not enough to be statistically relevant. Totals HR are a decent indicator but HR/FB are a much more telling stat IMO.

quote:e hit 20 HR five times in 16 seasons, then hit 20 HR 3 of his last 4, which also had his 2 highest HR total seasons.

From 93 on he consistently hit 15-20 HRs a season. 94 (strike shortened) and 2000 (injury) were the only seasons he didn't hit 15+ HRs. Like I said before, going from 15-20 to 24 & 26 isn't much of a jump.

quote:Maybe he was already juicing. It isn't a magic elixir that guarantees 20+ HRs. Or maybe after his 1st year in the OF he felt he was lacking in some areas?

Maybe, but if he juiced then it really only helped him hit a few more HRs.

quote:Maybe he did? 1993 was his first 20 HR season and when he became more of a power hitter. Hmmmmm

Which was my point. If he juiced than it was probably early on in his career. That said, he never had injury problems which seemed very common in juicers. And this is the first time I've ever heard of Biggio being linked to steroids.

quote:Biggio FB% numbers climbed those years he hit 20+ HR, while his HR/FB% also climbed up a bit its not that much higher than his career numbers. Sounds like he just tried to start lifting the ball a little more

He drew fewer walks as well. I think he just became a bit more aggressive trying to get to 3000 hits.

"not on the first ballot" issue----what is the general unwritten criteria for not voting for one on the first ballot but then on a future ballot? if his stats (or whatever criteria) say he is HOF worthy, then he should be voted in immediately as his stats will not change from first year eligible to next. still, i do understand that there is some "significance" places on when one is voted in