LOL. In every church I have been in the last 40 years lay leaders, or church staff has been involved in adultery. Both the Fundamentalist (Baptists) and then Xenos were the worst in terms of serious sin going unchecked. The former was due to the pharisaical nature of the culture that eliminated all transparency. The latter sinned so boldly as to lose sight of God's ambassadorial call and need for transformation. Neither were pressing on towards the prize.

Finally got around to reading your posts. Were you a member of Fishouse or Xenos? Some of your comments, especially about the Xenos group in Akron seems like you are actually unfamiliar with Xenos. Or rather your familiarity is from outside looking in. Originally I had thought you were wounded by Dennis as many have been but now I am starting to think you may be just someone who hates seeker-friendly churches wherever they pop up.

Xenos is hated by Fundamentalist groups around Columbus for allowing smoking (they used to have a smoking section at the back of the central teaching) and drinking at their church events (Catholics should appreciate that... Bingo anyone?). Xenos takes Paul's comments in 1Cor. "I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some," very seriously. While fundamentalists traditionally understand that people must clean themselves up before they go to God, churches that reach out to the broken and needy recognize that God cleans people up through relationship with him not by following rules of men ( don't drink, don't smoke, don't chew, or run with those who do).

<quoted text>LOL. In every church I have been in the last 40 years lay leaders, or church staff has been involved in adultery. Both the Fundamentalist (Baptists) and then Xenos were the worst in terms of serious sin going unchecked. The former was due to the pharisaical nature of the culture that eliminated all transparency. The latter sinned so boldly as to lose sight of God's ambassadorial call and need for transformation. Neither were pressing on towards the prize.

Have you witnessed this first hand? Or are these rumors you came across from various individuals?

Because I had never heard of the word Xenos before, I looked up the meaning. It is a Greek word meaning alien. Therefore, the church's name is Alien Christian Fellowship. Now tell me they are not a cult.

<quoted text>I have had my doubts about dating in Xenos, take a look at scripture. 2 cor 6:14 "do not yoke yourselves to unbelievers" if following scripture makes a church a cult, then have fun at your fake church..

Because I had never heard of the word Xenos before, I looked up the meaning. It is a Greek word meaning alien. Therefore, the church's name is Alien Christian Fellowship. Now tell me they are not a cult.

I don't think the name is an essential part of what makes something a cult or not; however, if you are more interested on the reason behind the name, I will shed a little light. The name is based off of passages like Phil. 3:20 which says: "For our citizenship is in heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ". If that verse is true, then we are aliens, or foreigners of this world. There are others verses similar to that which use the Greek work "Xenos" to describe that we are foreigners in this world destined for home (heaven). So the word not only applies to the Xenos Christian Fellowship but to other saved believers outside of Xenos.

Several reasons why we can't be a cult:

-We believe other Christians to be going to Heaven (we're not exclusivists)-We have open finical records and pay to be audited every four years.(This is extremely rare and most churches do nothing like this and some end up corrupt my money)-Elders are limited in income-There is a plural leadership -Giving is not mandatory-Unlike other megachurches like Benny Hens or Joel Osteens, our pastors don't have a lot of money. Many mega church pastors in other churches have multiple private jets, mansions and 300,000 dollar cars with no open financial record open to public as to where there income from the members is going... -We worship Christ, not our leaders. -We teach directly from the Bible-We acknowledge other Christian views as credible-We work with many other churches and Christian institutions world wide and local including: Trinity Evangelical Divinity School, Younglife, Word Relief, Youth for Christ and many, many others. -Our summer institute has many well known and respected teachers from around the world come to teach including: William Lane Craig, Lee Strobel, Mark Mittelberg, John Lennox, Randy Newman and many more. Those are just a few for this years and from last years summer institute.

Here's the thing: It makes sense for a couple to share a ministry, correct? If someone in Xenos were to date someone in another church, they would be advised to start attending each other's churches to decide which church they would settle on if they ever got married so that they could share their evangelism. This is just much more difficult and less likely to happen than meeting someone in your church. It works the same way in other churches as well. It just makes practical sense.

Studying the "body of Christ" passages like Romans 12:3ff; 1 Corinthians 12ff; Ephesians 4:1-9 and 1 Petet 2:4-12 - we do recognize that the body of Christ extends beyond our church, but these roles can only be effectively practiced at the local church level and when local churches - or missions are working together.

My daughter is required to "check in" with 3 different girls who are not much older than her each week. No matter what she does, it is never "enough". She is spending many hours a week going to meetings yet if she spends time with her parents or other friends she is questioned. She has been crying and emotionally disturbed by the way that she is micro-managed yet is afraid to break away from these people because she is afraid of what they will say about her and fears the loss of their love...I say that their love is conditional anyway. Who needs that? I guess that she's had an ear full of slander about others who have left. Also, as a parent, I've observed that her mentor avoided meeting me and has no desire to meet my daughter's parents as she attempts to mother my child herself. I am a believer myself, so I don't know why I'm to be disrespected...is it because I don't go to Xenos? Don't these people respect that fact that true believer's have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit? Do they not respect that God is able to direct the believer without constant intervention? Are they saved by "works"?...my guess is that they would deny that, but when you read about all the rules and requirements for being in a good standing,

My daughter began attending Xenos Christian Fellowship in Columbus Ohio after one of her friends at school invited her. The church service was called a 'Central Teaching', & at this meeting the members taught my daughter that Jewish people are sinners & that the holocaust did not take place! I am extremely disgusted with what this so called Christian church is teaching to young people under the guise of being a bible centered church. I am seeking legal counsel to find out what legal recourse I have. Have any of you had anything like this occur? Please post if you know anything about this church.

But the Jewish people are sinners. And the Holocaust was perpetuated by the Jews that humanly sacrificed their own blood (people) to establish the state of Israel.

My daughter began attending Xenos Christian Fellowship in Columbus Ohio after one of her friends at school invited her. The church service was called a 'Central Teaching', & at this meeting the members taught my daughter that Jewish people are sinners & that the holocaust did not take place! I am extremely disgusted with what this so called Christian church is teaching to young people under the guise of being a bible centered church. I am seeking legal counsel to find out what legal recourse I have. Have any of you had anything like this occur? Please post if you know anything about this church.

Because I had never heard of the word Xenos before, I looked up the meaning. It is a Greek word meaning alien. Therefore, the church's name is Alien Christian Fellowship. Now tell me they are not a cult.

<quoted text>Have you witnessed this first hand? Or are these rumors you came across from various individuals?

Not first-hand in terms of witnessing the adultery (or being an adulterer). But first-hand in terms of being there when the adultery was admitted to by both parties. By the way child molestation remained unchecked through the Catholic Church for over 60 years and was known to the last two popes (ratzinger reported it to pope John who did nothing) were complicit in the cover-up so didn't mean to leave them out of my discussion of sin in the church (don't get me started on the curio).

My point is that both Fundys and seeker-friendly churches need to be on their guard. Both are legitimate church structures in my view but miss out on significant portions of transformation that comes from an humble understanding of sin and grace. As a result both can be poor ambassadors of Christ. That said, both group realize that we are called to be an ambassador at least! Most so-called Christians I meet have no idea that they are called to represent Christ in their lives. To them saying "I'm a Christian" is the same as saying "I'm Irish on my mother's side".

Because I had never heard of the word Xenos before, I looked up the meaning. It is a Greek word meaning alien. Therefore, the church's name is Alien Christian Fellowship. Now tell me they are not a cult.

LOL. Xenos site says "The name Xenos is derived from a Greek word whose primary use in the New Testament denotes sojourners in a foreign land, a biblical description of Christians whose ultimate home is in heaven. A secondary usage of the word xenos denotes "one who provides hospitality." - See more at: http://www.xenos.org/aboutxenos/history.htm#s...

Curious Also, seems you were not curious enough to investigate the history that was right on Xenos' web page. People, the prefrontal cortex is there for a reason...no not absorbing helmet to helmet impacts! But cognitive reasoning.

My daughter is required to "check in" with 3 different girls who are not much older than her each week. No matter what she does, it is never "enough". She is spending many hours a week going to meetings yet if she spends time with her parents or other friends she is questioned.

Karen, see my original post #589. This church has a tight culture, with unbounded immature leaders at all levels. It is not a cult by doctrine but just as a controlling overbearing person can be painful to an adult spouse but necessary to a autistic child, so too Xenos can be helpful to unchurched, cultural misfits, who lack any boundaries. the tight culture helps these individuals assimilate into a Christian culture. The problem seems to be that your daughter is actually an adult! you have raised her with boundaries and respect for others. She feels manipulated because she is manipulated! I advise you to encourage her that adults not only bound themselves from bad behavior but also bound others from manipulating them! Encourage her to respect for others views and choices is part and parcel of this adult behavior. Lack of respect is not tolerated by adults, only children!

Finally, your daughter will hopefully learn more about scripture and discipleship, evangelism and fellowship. She will also be less likely to marry some overbearing manipulative child in the future.

I'm so sorry Karen. I remember seeing similar things happening. Is your child a minor? If so, I would give her "leaders" a call AND the church leaders. Challenge them. They often claim this stuff does not happen or justify their actions. You are her mother. They have no rights here when it comes to a minor child. If she is not a minor, well, there is not much you can do.

Karen K wrote:

My daughter is required to "check in" with 3 different girls who are not much older than her each week. No matter what she does, it is never "enough". She is spending many hours a week going to meetings yet if she spends time with her parents or other friends she is questioned. She has been crying and emotionally disturbed by the way that she is micro-managed yet is afraid to break away from these people because she is afraid of what they will say about her and fears the loss of their love...I say that their love is conditional anyway. Who needs that? I guess that she's had an ear full of slander about others who have left. Also, as a parent, I've observed that her mentor avoided meeting me and has no desire to meet my daughter's parents as she attempts to mother my child herself. I am a believer myself, so I don't know why I'm to be disrespected...is it because I don't go to Xenos? Don't these people respect that fact that true believer's have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit? Do they not respect that God is able to direct the believer without constant intervention? Are they saved by "works"?...my guess is that they would deny that, but when you read about all the rules and requirements for being in a good standing,

Oh please. Karen says her kid is being manipulated by leaders and your reply is she will learn more about the Bible? Please tell us how that will happen when her leaders are obviously not being biblical?

UberGenius wrote:

<quoted text>Karen, see my original post #589. This church has a tight culture, with unbounded immature leaders at all levels. It is not a cult by doctrine but just as a controlling overbearing person can be painful to an adult spouse but necessary to a autistic child, so too Xenos can be helpful to unchurched, cultural misfits, who lack any boundaries. the tight culture helps these individuals assimilate into a Christian culture. The problem seems to be that your daughter is actually an adult! you have raised her with boundaries and respect for others. She feels manipulated because she is manipulated! I advise you to encourage her that adults not only bound themselves from bad behavior but also bound others from manipulating them! Encourage her to respect for others views and choices is part and parcel of this adult behavior. Lack of respect is not tolerated by adults, only children!Finally, your daughter will hopefully learn more about scripture and discipleship, evangelism and fellowship. She will also be less likely to marry some overbearing manipulative child in the future.

<quoted text>Finally, your daughter will hopefully learn more about scripture and discipleship, evangelism and fellowship. She will also be less likely to marry some overbearing manipulative child in the future.

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