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Posted - 2009.01.29 23:43:00 -
[121]
I'm really not that concerned about wormhole NPCs being impossible to fight as a solo player. Some of them will be, but if the clever players of Eve can't find a way to ninja-rat, I'll eat my hat.

Sniping from extreme distance, speed tanking, kiting, warping away and warping back -- that's just the beginning of a long list of things to try. Some will fail miserably against the AI. Inevitably, some will "work" -- maybe not efficiently, but work nonetheless.

Will it be worth the time and effort? Ghu only knows. But it's not going to be completely sterile for solo players; nothing CCP has ever built has turned out like that.

Posted - 2009.01.29 23:50:00 -
[123]Edited by: CCP Ytterbium on 29/01/2009 23:52:20Bartholomeus Crane: We followed the AI thread with great interest as we value all feedback but as you said CCP Incognito is the main Dev you want to look for more details, which should be arriving in the future.

Rex Lashar: that's excellent feedback and we take it very seriously. Most if not all the points you list have and are considered on a constant basis. Again, I cannot unveil details here, but we know the implications of the NPC bounties/loot, and any belt change coming in the expansion is double-checked to make sure it remains reasonnable in your listed factors.

Concerning the solo concerns for W-space: we took into consideration all player styles during the Sleeper design process. That means soloing is possible for the easiest situations you will face, but as mentionned CCP Gangleri, it will be challenging to do so. For fighting against Sleepers ourselves, we can tell you not to expect the current "shoot and loot" approach toward existing NPCs.

On more difficult situations, a proper small/medium gang made of versatile ship classes and roles will be recommended. Again, depending player skill and experience, this can vary greatly as it may be possible to do so in less numbers, like the level5 mentionned example, but that falls into a question of how much efficient would it be to do that.

In all cases, remember that W-space remains an unknown, hazardous area and as such teaming up with other players even on situations meant to be solotable will increase your chances significantly.

Even though I don't mine, I feel miners get marginalized by all these alternative mineral sources and that it renders capital production far easier than it really should be. A reduction in mineral output for standard NPC pirate factions is also warranted simply on the premise that we now have a wide scale deployment of Rogue Drones. For anyone who considers this necessary and important part of NPCing, they have the option.

2. Don't, under any circumstances, boost bounties.

Despite having POS, skill, market and other smaller isk sinks in the game, the amount of money coming into the system is higher than the amount going out. NPCs are the top contributor, followed by insurance system. 0.0 rewards do not need to be boosted, provided your lowsec BS spawns are not common.

If you don't heed this warning, at least consider removing all mission bounties to compensate. ISK rewards in missions should be controlled by the agent, making the social skills more useful and career mission running a viable profession. So instead of 1mil reward with 1mil time bonus it could be 5mil/5mil.

Last I heard, all static content was eventually gonna be migrated to the dynamic distribution system (exploration) with crappy asteroid belts being easy to find with onboard scanner (a la Encounters). I hope that change eventually comes. If it does, a serious increase in rewards for lowsec and high sec is questionable and 0.0 completely unjustifiable.

Most of the risk in asteroid belt NPC hunting comes from the fact that a good player can pinpoint you in 30 seconds, far faster than the 1-2 hours it takes to find a mission site. Point is, don't boost rewards because the risks are higher now and then drop the risks later. That would effectively result in two boosts.

4. NPCs might be dumb, but at least they should warp scramble.

I am of the opinion, like many players here, that you shouldn't be so conservative in your new AI deployment. Most people would welcome it because it would result in a fun game. If people die because they presume to be able to do lvl 4's or BS spawns without help, they will quickly adapt.

But, even if you do NOTHING to traditional PVE content, please for the love of god reintroduce warp scrambling. Remember when battleships knew how to warp scramble? I do. Every frigate and cruiser should have a chance to warp scramble, and every tech 2 interceptor/hac NPC should always scramble. Close range pulse/blaster battleships should have a chance to scramble as well.

In my honest opinion your post if full of fail.50% of 0.0 space actually needs a boost. Probably more.The impact of Hauler spawns on available Minerals is very low i&d guess.If anything is unjustifiable then a rewardboost in highsec, if anything is questionable then a rewardboost in good 0.0 if anything is surely needed then a boost of bad 0.0 and moreimportant a boost of lowsec lowsec. If you would gibe BS a warp-scrambler you would nerf ratting so much. In special younger players who need a lot of time to kill 2-3 BS wouldbe easy targets for ganksquads. And you want tell me that it is profitableto rat in a system with about 10 belts with more then one person.Go home and reconsider everything you wrote. Its crap.

Originally by:TesalQuestion 1: Is any of this content for casual players, or for players who want a relaxed lifestyle. Are we going to have to have fleets to kill NPC's now? For people who play EvE in one hour time blocks, this will make the game impossible to play if they have to spend an hour setting up a fleet.

How will this make the whole game impossible to play for you? Not all content is meant for solo players in a massively multiplayer game, big surprise.

Wasn't talking about "solo" players, rather "casual players". Some are miners and missioners, others are pirates who show up at the same gate every Sunday for an hour or two. Some are burned out vets who log on to say hi for a little while. Not everyone plays EvE for 6 hour time blocks. A casual player can only log on for an hour or two at a time or maybe thats all his GF will allow .

Originally by:TesalQuestion 1: Is any of this content for casual players, or for players who want a relaxed lifestyle. Are we going to have to have fleets to kill NPC's now? For people who play EvE in one hour time blocks, this will make the game impossible to play if they have to spend an hour setting up a fleet.

How will this make the whole game impossible to play for you? Not all content is meant for solo players in a massively multiplayer game, big surprise.

Wasn't talking about "solo" players, rather "casual players". Some are miners and missioners, others are pirates who show up at the same gate every Sunday for an hour or two. Some are burned out vets who log on to say hi for a little while. Not everyone plays EvE is 6 hour time blocks. A casual player can only log on for an hour or two at a time or maybe thats all his GF will allow .

You could still do the mission arcs, you could still profit from the new t3 ships. Perhaps it could be easier for you to find exploration sites in future cause some of theactive players rather go to w-space? You cant demand that everything in this exploration isfitted to your playstyle. I wont use this mission arcs but its ok for me that they are comingand bring some fun to our empire players.

Originally by:CCP YtterbiumOn more difficult situations, a proper small/medium gang made of versatile ship classes and roles will be recommended. Again, depending player skill and experience, this can vary greatly as it may be possible to do so in less numbers, like the level5 mentionned example, but that falls into a question of how much efficient would it be to do that.

The problem with the level 5 mission comparison is that the two are fundamentally different things. Level 5 missions were just like level 4 missions, but bigger. Same resources, same profit, same strategies, the only difference was a potentially higher rate of income.

On the other hand, these new NPCs are something completely different. If I can't solo a level 5 mission, who care, I just run level 4s. If I can't solo these wormhole encounters, I don't get to do wormhole stuff at all. All those shiny new T3 ships? Forget it. Pirating people in wormhole space? Forget it, unless you can bring a gang to handle both the target and the npcs that will kill you as soon as your target goes down.

"Shoot and loot" may be a bit boring, but at least it puts the focus where it belongs: on the player-player interactions.

Posted - 2009.01.30 00:22:00 -
[128]Edited by: Lagn Gita on 30/01/2009 00:24:53Edited by: Lagn Gita on 30/01/2009 00:24:23so in order to make w space worth the apparent risk, needing small/medium gangs(which means more mouths to feed not just a dude and his alt) for anything above the starter stuff and the logistics w space will involve, t3 stuff will be expensive making t3 ships expensive, meaning they will only be used for missions.

We will not be changing mission rats, mainly because mission dungeons are carefully designed and balanced environments. If we were to throw a wrench in there and just 'see what happens' with the thousands of different dungeons it would be a waste of time. Time we would rather spend on improving the tools behind the entire thing so that the level designers can use them to make more awesome stuff in the future.

I wouldn't want your programmers/game designers to even touch level design with a 5 foot pole... But surely your level designers have a whole 8 hours every day(who needs sleep anyway ) that they could spend going over every single mission and reducing the number of npc's.That being said, I still would prefer to feel more like I'm just someone that got lucky to become a capsuleer and not some super awesome Rambo-god mowing down countless ships left and right as if it's just another day at the office. Well in all seriousness, why not create the new missions(which are coming too afaik) with stronger npc's and just slowly phase out the old ones, as was done with the previous generation of mission content(pre-deadspace), geez I miss the old The Assault and The Blockade?Another final thing that could really make missions way more interesting, procedural content generation a la Left 4 Dead. Missions that are rarely exactly the same, ooh mama!

Originally by:CCP YtterbiumConcerning the solo concerns for W-space: we took into consideration all player styles during the Sleeper design process. That means soloing is possible for the easiest situations you will face, but as mentionned CCP Gangleri, it will be challenging to do so. For fighting against Sleepers ourselves, we can tell you not to expect the current "shoot and loot" approach toward existing NPCs.

On more difficult situations, a proper small/medium gang made of versatile ship classes and roles will be recommended. Again, depending player skill and experience, this can vary greatly as it may be possible to do so in less numbers, like the level5 mentionned example, but that falls into a question of how much efficient would it be to do that.

In all cases, remember that W-space remains an unknown, hazardous area and as such teaming up with other players even on situations meant to be solotable will increase your chances significantly.

Fair enough, I suppose I could sucker in a few corpmates somehow.

So if these NPCs simulate PvP experiance will we be fitting things like scramblers to stop them from warping out when they are low health? Will they run away if outnumbered? I hope they're not too elusive.

Originally by:Bonny LeeIn my honest opinion your post is full of fail.

Go home and reconsider everything you wrote. Its crap.

I cant believe you consider that good feedback ccp :p

Hello there, space friend.

I predate you by four years, most of it spent in 0.0. Two years before you even created your character, I was fighting warp scrambling Battleship NPCs. Did you know they existed? Did you know warp scrambling by NPCs was common?

By the time you were learning how to fly a cruiser, I was helping build the first Titans by farming NPC hauler spawns. Averaging three or four spawns a day, dropping up to 60mil trit each. But as you say, that's completely negligible!

But ignoring the fact that me > you, the reason my feedback may be considered valid, is because 0.0 has been boosted in a dozen different ways already. All of them have failed to change the status quo, and yours are no different, space friend.

Posted - 2009.01.30 01:48:00 -
[134]
Please be very careful in changing economic sources and sinks. I have left a large number of games over the years as they have had too many money sinks and I was sick of constantly scratching for money. This game has a great number of many and varied ways to make money while enjoying the game without it feeling like you are grinding. I don't see this part of the game as broken so please don't fix it. My two bobs worth.

Originally by:Bonny LeeIn my honest opinion your post is full of fail.

Go home and reconsider everything you wrote. Its crap.

I cant believe you consider that good feedback ccp :p

Hello there, space friend.

I predate you by four years, most of it spent in 0.0. Two years before you even created your character, I was fighting warp scrambling Battleship NPCs. Did you know they existed? Did you know warp scrambling by NPCs was common?

By the time you were learning how to fly a cruiser, I was helping build the first Titans by farming NPC hauler spawns. Averaging three or four spawns a day, dropping up to 60mil trit each. But as you say, that's completely negligible!

But ignoring the fact that me > you, the reason my feedback may be considered valid, is because 0.0 has been boosted in a dozen different ways already. All of them have failed to change the status quo, and yours are no different, space friend.

Pwned. ^5s Rex.

Rex, I really agree with you with respect to your original post.

Mining has been diluted over and over again with things like the drone regions, mission loot and so on. Minerals need to come from mining, and very little else.

I also think that the bounties across all rats could stand to be trimmed a bit. Everything is too cheap and easy these days. But most certainly we don't need 0.0 rats to be buffed for an even greater flow of NPC farmer isk to ruin the economy further.

Same with scrambling BS. NPCs are FARRRR too easy right now. Any idiot can rat triple 1.85m BS spawns with complete safety and no commitment. Local spikes? No worries, you're aligned, just warp out, cloak and wait.

Anyway, I hope CCP have learned from their biggest mistakes, like the drone regions etc.

Posted - 2009.01.30 02:17:00 -
[136]
in the forum on WH's, one of the devs said that this expansion would improve solo play.i hope this to be true. and i also hope that they do take this chance to balance risk/reward. most of my friends are in big 0.0 allys, and they are as safe as most high sec mission runners, except when they are on the edge of the ally's sov.now i don't like the politics of the allys so i stay in a small corp(15 members). would love to go 0.0 other than ninja rating.

now this forum you hint that you plan to nerf solo and further reward the big 0.0 allys for there closing off of 25% of eve content from most ppl. and sit back and call us names(carebears) because we will not be just another number on there spread sheet. any poverty in 0.0 comes from the idea of NBSI. witch makes 0.0 only dangerous to those of us that don't belong to the big allys.but yall don't advocate better rewards for us.ninja rating is the most dangerous thing in the game, and is only about as profitable as lv 4 mission ruining,but wow what i could make if i was willing to put up with high docking fee's,high cost reprose and manufacture lines, and the taxes, that including the required fighting or the refusal of being able to do some of the things (anything that is very profitable) now this would be the perfect way for solo and smal corps to go 0.0, it would be nice if we could go to the real thing, but this gives you a chance at the great rewards with out the useless allys.now the miners want to stop mining with guns, well the only reason trit cost 4isk is that they can't provide enough of it, even with half of high sec mining velds because it is the most profit, even over all the 0.0 ores.so it would seam that they are not being nerfed with over influx of mins from gun mining.and no i don't care if you are 4 yrs old, that does not change the cause and effect.my biggest hope that this expansion will be geared towards the ability of newer players,small corps,and the big allys.i am not looking to have anything handed to me. but a fair chance to get some of the umber good loot and fun.and if you are 4 yrs old, you had at least a chance at that, even if you were one of the last.and sure ccp should care about the older chars as well as the newer ones, but if they only provide the better content to the end game, then they will run in to the problem of WoW and FFXI, and every other game, they need the newer ppl more than they need the older.srry but it is true.and it is not fair for them to work only for the newer ones, and i would hope they never would. but crying that there may be something good in the game that the allys can't control is not right either, and crying because it does not serve you better than the general does not help and just makes you look winy.

ccp everything i have read other that the devs above post seams like this will be the greatest expansion in any game i have played.plz don't let your ingame friends talk you into helping the already over powered 0.0 allys(and they have earned most of it) when you have 75% of your player base that has never had a chance to go where no one has been before and threw hard work and guts be able to bring home some of the umber gear.

thanks, and srry if i go overboard,this has had me so hyped, and to read that us carebears that only want a chance at a semi fair fight and really good loot would once again be denied.

Posted - 2009.01.30 02:17:00 -
[137]
Sounds like CCP is trying to build an environment in which midsized (50-100 member) mixed independent PvP/Industrial corps can flourish. None of CCPs previous attempt to reach this goal have worked, somehow I doubt having plex level systems in going to result in anything more then W-Space being claimed by three or four major alliances.

If CCP wants to break up the power blocs, nerf titans and change the system of claiming Sov to something other then POS warfare. Hell even the alliances that benefit most from POS warfare want the system changed. In short CCP PLEASE NERF US, TAKE AWAY OUR ABILITY THE HOLD SPACE WITH POSES, RENDER OUR SYSTEM CONTROL POSES USELESS JUNK, PLEASE WE'RE BEGGING YOU NERF US INTO OBLIVION!

Quote:Of course, the nature and type of these new spawns will be put into scale towards null and high-security space as we plan to even out rewards, not destabilize them further. To be clear, no pirate battleship spawn will make it into high-security space.

Forgot to ask earlier but..

Does this mean the 'evening' goes both ways, and agent missions will be changed? Or will they continue to be treated separate from NPC hunting/exploration?

Originally by:Jas DorSounds like CCP is trying to build an environment in which midsized (50-100 member) mixed independent PvP/Industrial corps can flourish. None of CCPs previous attempt to reach this goal have worked, somehow I doubt having plex level systems in going to result in anything more then W-Space being claimed by three or four major alliances.

If CCP wants to break up the power blocs, nerf titans and change the system of claiming Sov to something other then POS warfare. Hell even the alliances that benefit most from POS warfare want the system changed. In short CCP PLEASE NERF US, TAKE AWAY OUR ABILITY THE HOLD SPACE WITH POSES, RENDER OUR SYSTEM CONTROL POSES USELESS JUNK, PLEASE WE'RE BEGGING YOU NERF US INTO OBLIVION!

it would be nice if they did a sec instead of sov, let sec float by the number of ppl/deaths, hence if you hold a part of 0.0 that was secure and no one is dieing the sec goes up, this solves the 0.0 rewards for areas that are safe, but it could never go above 0.49. and the higher the sec the more things an ally can do in it, so cryo jamers would only work in systems an ally truly held and not in the war zone on the edge.

Originally by:Bonny LeeIn my honest opinion your post is full of fail.

Go home and reconsider everything you wrote. Its crap.

I cant believe you consider that good feedback ccp :p

Hello there, space friend.

I predate you by four years, most of it spent in 0.0. Two years before you even created your character, I was fighting warp scrambling Battleship NPCs. Did you know they existed? Did you know warp scrambling by NPCs was common?

By the time you were learning how to fly a cruiser, I was helping build the first Titans by farming NPC hauler spawns. Averaging three or four spawns a day, dropping up to 60mil trit each. But as you say, that's completely negligible!

But ignoring the fact that me > you, the reason my feedback may be considered valid, is because 0.0 has been boosted in a dozen different ways already. All of them have failed to change the status quo, and yours are no different, space friend.

First Titans you say? Well, we all know the first Titan was piloted by the head of an alliance who of course was full of amazing leadership, not only that, but a strategic and tactical genius, full of the best players this game has ever seen.

While I don't care about the post, or the player, a little known fact is character age does not indicate player age in the game.

Posted - 2009.01.30 03:40:00 -
[142]
Can you tell us whether it might be possable that any of the Sleepers will be interacted with in ways other than shooting them? Is diplomacy an option? Will they give missions? Can you get faction standing with them? Is it all too top-secrent right now?

The above of course assumes that the Sleepers are still a: sentient, b: human, c: in controll of themselves, d: remotely interested in being friendly... there's certian implications of having foriegn powers come in and raep their new neighbors for technology, ya know!

Posted - 2009.01.30 04:01:00 -
[144]
The thing that concerns me is the segment of the blog which talks about NPCs making "better" targeting choices.

To me, it sounds like it is going to be almost impossible to keep NPCs from shooting at your drones, if you're flying any ship with +% drone damage on it. Since drones can barely survive a strong sneeze, it seems to me as though those ships are going to just become pointless. I wouldn't even be surprised to see the Sleepers using those special NPC cheat mechanisms to give themselves 9 high slots, and fit 2-3 smartbombs.

Sure, it's just the Sleepers to start, but how long do we really think it will be before the changes filter all the way down to the noobship piloting belt rats in .8 space?

Originally by:JimBob Leeroyin the forum on WH's, one of the devs said that this expansion would improve solo play.i hope this to be true. and i also hope that they do take this chance to balance risk/reward. most of my friends are in big 0.0 allys, and they are as safe as most high sec mission runners, except when they are on the edge of the ally's sov.now i don't like the politics of the allys so i stay in a small corp(15 members). would love to go 0.0 other than ninja rating.

ccp everything i have read other that the devs above post seams like this will be the greatest expansion in any game i have played.plz don't let your ingame friends talk you into helping the already over powered 0.0 allys(and they have earned most of it) when you have 75% of your player base that has never had a chance to go where no one has been before and threw hard work and guts be able to bring home some of the umber gear.

thanks, and srry if i go overboard,this has had me so hyped, and to read that us carebears that only want a chance at a semi fair fight and really good loot would once again be denied.

I totally agree with you Jimbob. Pilots of smaller corps need to speak up NOW!CCP needs to address the smaller corps and enable them to access 0.0 with being a member of a Mega corp/Alliance and deal with the politics and wars. W space could be that opportunity.

Since there will be so many to possibly be discovered, there should be a way to limit access to the newly discover W area unless you are associated with the pilot who discovered it.It then would benefit the corp/alliance that the pilot is a member of. Instead of "having" to be a member of a larger corp/alliance just to be in 0.0 space.This would promote exploration to smaller corps with access to better ores and resources. It would also provide materials to the economy with a risk vs reward.Since CCP has mentioned taking a group into W space would be recommended, one could also consider this as a training ground for the small corp to enter 0.0 space and joining a mega corp/alliance with something of experience to offer.

Quote:Team Epic's first goal was to restore balance throughout the known regions of New Eden by spreading NPCs where they were direly needed. As such, with the expansion arrival, expect various pirate battleships to arrive into low-security areas to ambush the unprepared pilots. Of course, the nature and type of these new spawns will be put into scale towards null and high-security space as we plan to even out rewards, not destabilize them further. To be clear, no pirate battleship spawn will make it into high-security space.

Originally by:CCP GangleriOur goal for the Sleepers was to make each encounter more like a PvP battle, so if you bring a solo BS against a gang of Sleepers you are going to lose, hard. Unless you are that good, guess we'll have to see.

In other words, if you don't have a corporation, you aren't welcome in the new content. Thanks for caring about all of your solo players, I'm sure we'll have lots of fun grinding highsec level 4s to pay someone else to get us some T3 stuff...

you can buy the tech 3 stuff on the market when players sell it, just like how right now you don't need to get tech 2 parts to build it yourself.

Also, just because you can't go get blood raiders to drop BPCs for you doesn't mean you can buy them.

Honestly, I have always hated how eve was so solo. I hope they make wormholes OMGWTFHARD. Find me one other mmorpg where you can solo big stuff. What's that? you can't find any? That's damn right you can't. Eve can finally have raids, thank freaking god, maybe the new missions will actually be interesting instead of AFK play. Because all "I want to solo everything" says to me is "I want to AFK make money for free!"

So get used to it, mmorpgs are suppose to have content that many like minded players can come together to complete. The best part about eve, is unlike wow, there will be no caps on these "raids" and there will be no damn instancing.

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