This is the last unit of the team to look at, after covering the defense and the offense, and this year, we seem to have really tried to upgrade the special teams, especially the return game. Shockingly, we’ve even brought in competition for long time long snapper John Denney. There will also be competition for the place kicker spot as well, but the real competition will be for punt returner and/or kick returner. Special teams aren’t just the specialists, such as the K, P, KR/PR, there the guys who fly down the field with abandon, and sacrifice their bodies in violent collisions either blocking the pursuit, or trying to race past and disengage blocks to make the tackle.

Let’s take a look at who we’ve brought in this season, both from the draft, and as UDFA’s.

Kenyan Drake

Jakeem Grant

RB Kenyan Drake will not only be in the mix at RB, but he will also provide the team with some special teams help. Drake was the gunner at Alabama, and that’s a very important cog in the special teams coverage. WR Leonte Carroo will be in the mix at WR, but also will be in competition for KR/PR with incumbent returner Jarvis Landry. Shifty, blazing fast WR Jakeem Grant also will be heavily involved in the competition for return man, with Landry and Carroo. Landry would play every down and do every return, but that’s too much of a drain, so the Dolphins are looking to give him some help, to keep him fresh during the game. I’m excited to see if these guys can upgrade our return unit, which was pretty solid already with Landry.

K Marshall Koehn

Long Snapper Ryan DiSalvo

Punter Matt Darr

K Andrew Franks

Punter Matt Darr has proved his mettle, and will be unchallenged for the punter spot. Last years kicker Andrew Franks, who was solid last season, especially on kickoffs, now faces another contender, rookie K Marshall Koehn. Rumor has it Diggs put in a good word for Koehn and got him the in, but I can neither verify nor dispute that. Koehn (pronounced Cane) is a very versatile athlete, who also played WR and DB, as well as playing baseball, soccer and for Stanger, lettered twice as wrestler in High School. This is no ordinary kicker! Very strong leg, and regularly placed kickoffs in the end zone, he should make the challenge fun to watch this preseason.

Besides the regular position battles, I’m definitely looking forward to see how our return game shakes out, because now, my thought is Damien Williams will step aside and let the new talent juice up our return game. They are called the “hidden yards” in a game, but as we all know, strong special teams can really help out the team, both with strong coverage on kicks and punts, and electric returns, long punts, ALL play a crucial part in the battle for field position.

738 Responses to What’s up with our Special Teams?

Years on a contract are irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. They are just a formality to control the bonus money cap hit which must be allocated evenly across the length of the contract.
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Guaranteed $ is the only thing that matters and that is driven by the probabilities to achieve production in YR1-3 (age/injury profile probabilities). Anything beyond 3 years is really risky to guarantee. Since contracts can be renegotiated along the way, the team can re-adjust along the way to market value and to smooth out cap issues YR/YR.

I thought the grand scheme meant everything? So cap hit and bonuses already paid for Jones means nothing? Yeah so these players want the bonus up front, then when it’s time to account for it in the salary cap they want to ignore it.

Bottoming with Jones is, he cares more about his money than winning. His play suggests the same, as he freelances at times to get stats, instead of doing his job. We surely need him, but he isn’t the end all. On the other hand $3M more per year isn’t going to kill the future cap. So they need to just get together and figure it out.

I don’t get that comment about Jones’ play. Freelancing means you don’t care? He played great for us, and maybe it’s because he freelanced. By stats do you mean INT’S? TD’s? We don’t need those, right? 😉

He made lots of plays, but not noted in his stats are plays he didn’t make, because he was out of position. We targeted Isa, because they thought he’d complement Jones’ style of free lancing. Thomas and Aikens often looked bad on plays, because they didn’t complement Jones.

Pig, every situation is different, each team doesn’t handle every situation the same. Of course there’s going to be situations that the team has to give in. You can’t take one or two examples and say this team did this therefore that’s how they do it.

As I said yesterday though, I’m not reading into this Jones issue too much.
Usually media gets information from teams/agents after a parameter has been discussed and one side wants to push the deal towards their end of the parameter range.

An NHL TEames is supposed to be announced, then the next day the LV travel board is supposed to recommend the Raiders. $1.5B the Raiders need to get a new stadium, practice facility, and corporate offices. Raiders and league to put up $500M, they want LV to put up the other $1B, I don’t think it’s going to happen.

Piggy,
I know you may be more traditional but the Raiders in LV makes alot of sense.
The Raiders still have a big fan base in Southern California and LV is closer to them than Oakland. There is a new high speed train corridor (although private) that is being built out to Vegas from the LA area. Eventually what is known as the Southwest (rail) Network will link Phoenix to LV and Denver to LA via Salt Lake City & LV using high speed trains.

Piggy,
Rooted in Oakland only by history.
Only reason Al Davis moved them back to Oakland from LA is because he had just driven the Rams out of town. Davis wanted to cut into the Niners market and take some of those fans back to his Raiders empire. With the Ram out of town, the fanbase had no team to choose which would have the effect of not losing fans to the Rams brand.

With the Jones deal.. I think the main issue against it is, they don’t want to open up a can of worms going forward with other guys who decide not to comply/honor a signed contract ether .. but as stated by Mike and others, bump him some, agree to more cash if need be to keep him happy and here, but also build in an out for us in case last year was an anomaly..

A three-time Pro Bowler, Chancellor signed a four-year, $28 million extension after the 2012 season, but the deal didn’t take effect until 2013. The Seahawks refused to budge on restructuring a contract that had three years remaining, asserting that it would lead to a stream of players seeking new deals in the early stages of their contracts.

It’s impossible to know how any team besides the top 5 and bottom 3 from last year will do, but especially one in which there is a new HC, a bunch of new starters (at least a third of the 1st 22 were not even on the team last yr), and a holdover roster that includes more problems than stars. We have one of the most hard to predict teams I’ve ever seen.

I think the only “Problem Holdovers” we have would be Dion FF and the Jones situation if they let it become one.. i thought we had enough talent last year to contend in division, but they did not play anywhere near what i thought the talent level was.. here’s to improving on that..

It’s a tough situation. I suppose we can play hardball with Jones, and it’s possible he comes back like Chancellor did. If his demands aren’t that unreasonable, and they’re doable for us, I think I’d rather work it out, and have him play the entire season for us. I do get that you’re worried about setting a precedent, but every case is different, and that’s how they will always be treated. There are always exceptions to the rule.

We even have a first year GM, a football Czar who failed at his last job,and an owner many fans fault for many of our recent problems, although he is one of the wealthiest and spends freely. We have a new stadium that might not even be ready and a killer schedule of tough teams to beat any year, including two games on the road to start the yr that any team would see as near-automatic losses, given NE and Seattle’s traditional “best in NFL” records at home.

Mike : i would think if they value him as a star, they could as i said above, do some Give and Take to keep him happy, and also to leverage themselves better on Cap hits, and an out if he doesn’t perform after signing..
if they don’t think he’s All That ,and assume they can replace his presence then sure Paly a game of Who Blinks First.. I’d prefer he was on the field week one of PS.. He was one of only a few who were Ballin last year..

The thing with Jones is even more difficult because these are his prime earning years, but also his prime years to pile up stats and good tape for his next contract (which might be his last BIG one), so he can ill afford to take a big hit in fines. If he holds out even a few games, he will lose a half a million dollars easy, which he might never recover no matter how good the contract he eventually signs.

From the team’s perspective, they were really counting on his vet leadership and INTs and tackles on the back end to anchor the D, and they have no one near that reliable to sub in his spot even for a few games. Plus he is missing the install of an entirely new Defense and getting in good with a ton of new guys and his new DC.

We have Extreme ? marks at RB, OG, CB, LB, and now even Safety with the Reshad holdout. Extremely young at WR, P, K. All disappointments at TE. 4 of the top 5 DEs are new to the team and the 5th is an all star with a torn achilles. How do you predict from that? 4 of the top 5 OL are returning from injuries. We have a QB half of his own fans hate. They say he ain’t clutch.

AH i had read into as Problem Personalities… i will admit i am a little uneasy on the RB situation at the moment.. We are VERY Hard to predict i give ya that

WR and TE i don’t see as a problem at all..
OG i think they have added a lot of solid but not spectacular bodies (i see no Fox, or Columbos Lurking)
CB i believe is actually improved (Grimes was not good last year) Lippett Al Quida and Maxwell seem improvements in my eyes..

Darr was (sorry Stanger) an Awesome find .. Franks no slouch, but he is a kicker, so they are all the same really 🙂

i hope for growth from our UDFA LB from last year.. and a return to heath from Jenkins.. Unit should be improved..

And QB.. Its now No Excuse Year.. i also hope Doughty can become Moore’s replacement by years end as well..

Naples: I’m not going to jump on the Lolipop brigade and say we are gonna start 2-0, but we have played Both Seattle and NE tough last couple years.. even last years game in NE, despite the score, we were in that game right up until the end of 3rd 1/4 and Wake and Parker’s injuries..

We had a very strange college draft where we ignored our 2 biggest needs at OG and LB to take 2 more WRs which was our strongest, youngest position and a back-up TE and CB and QB who will all 3 probably never see the field this year. But I love Duarte, a starter for U frickin CLA!!!

We ended up with a very small UDFA class and no tryout guys this year. To be coached up by a first time HC, a first-time DC, and a non-play-calling old guy at OC who has never been tapped to be a HC. But all 3 are well respected. The rest of the staff is pieced together from very successful guys to very unknown, plus some hold-overs from a failed regime.

It’s better to play SEA at the start of the season when they aren’t yet well tuned, and it’s also better to play NE w/o Tom Brady. That doesn’t mean we win both or either, but I think we’re playing them under decent circumstances.

All the RBs on our team added together don’t have 500 career yds in the NFL, right? Our veteran has been cut 3 times. Our starter only played half a season one year. Our back-up is either a rook with a broken arm and a broken leg, a failure named Isaiah Pead, or a bubble-quality UDFA guy.

Our biggest name, highest quality recent draft picks are a bust suspended his whole career for drugs and a pothead so hard-core that we have video of him using a gas-mask bong. This year’s draft includes the smallest man in the NFL and a guy suspended during his senior year for assault and battery (?).

nbcsports​.com >> Report: Eugene Monroe expected off Ravens roster before week is out http://buzztap.com/-5O27Du
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Looks like some of the bigger cuts are about to start falling. Unfortunately for us we are more needy at OG, because as an OT prospect i would have really considered us going after him.

“That’s just how the media plays it; you would think Johnny Manziel is this freaking great kid, but he’s f–king terrible,” Murphy told Kennedy. “Jameis didn’t do half of the s–t that [Manziel] has done. And I’m sorry, excuse my language, but I’m just passionate about it. It really frustrates me to see the media try to make a guy out to be a bad person, just because of the color of his skin. That’s not right.”
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This is a strong reason why racial tension is gaining ground. Making race a part of everything just accentuates the divisiveness of the country instead of focusing on how to make things better. There will ALWAYS be racism, but when you see it around every corner, that’s paranoia.

I have seen 0 things regarding Winston that have been racially charged and i dont know if Murphy has looked around recently but Cam Newton was the NFL’s golden boy last year as far as the media was concerned, and Manziel has not been portrayed as a “great kid” he has been shown to be the spoiled brat cock up of a human being he is. I personally say i was impressed with how Winston handled himself last year and if anything im less concerned with his character flaws now than i was perviously, and the media is part of the reason for that.

Some people look at everything through racial eyes, and many in the media make racial issues out to be more than they are. I look at players as players, not by their skin color. Well sometimes I do, I don’t want a team full of white DB and WR. I could care less what color Wake, Suh, and Tannehill are.

D, I didn’t think you made it up, I asked where is came from. Who’s saying Johnny Manziel is this freaking great kid? Most people view him as a spoiled brat who ruined his career and is on a totally destructive path. I don’t see anyone saying anything bad about Winston.

Steve,
Those missed games come from one season almost entirely. Last year he missed 10 games with injury. Prior to that he was a Consistent starter with very few missed games. Albert has had a career of not playing whole seasons. Albert has in the past 4 years managed at best 14 games, that was last year, in the 3 previous 12, 9, and 11. For Monroe it was 16, 15 (did not miss the one due to injury) 11, 6. Even just tallying up the games, Monroe had more starts than Albert over the course of the same number of years. I dont see how you can say Albert is less risky than Monroe.

It really doesnt matter, i said i would have considered him IF we had need at OT, which we dont so its kinda moot.

The 15 games missed were the last 2 years, so if you say he missed 10 last year, then he missed 5 the year before. Not sure how you can say he missed them almost entirely last year? Gotta be a reason the Ravens are done with him, pay vs games played and/or they have a replacement.

It’s a common theme. My friend and I were just talking about it. We get the lead off hitter on quite a bit, he never scores. They get 2nd and 3rd and nobody out or even bases loaded, they don’t score. I’m just being realistic, other than pitching, they’re not very good right now.

Winston was accused of rape at FSU and pretty much embarassed the program the last season there

I pretty much think Manziel is hated by all
he looks pretty much done in the NFL too
so any future stuff is probably only to catch so much steam

But when Manziel was a TAMU and had the NCAA scandal
he really got the benefit of the doubt by many
The guy was obviously not serious about football and should not have been a 1st round pick
I think to a certain degree people looked the other way with Manziel
but they aren’t looking the other way now
it took a lot of fucks up to get there though
Manziel probably had more 2nd chances than most

I think there are a lot of double standards in sports concerning race

but this is a horrible example
bc they both are fuckups

and what Winston was accused of in college was a crime
whereas Manziel was accused of a NCAA infraction

but in the last couple of years
Winston is the boyscout and Manziel is a complete disaster

Winston is not in the news so much lately
but I guaranty one little slip up and he is going to be criticized harshly for it
and he should be

he has earned some criticism from his FSU days

Not the best example of it
bc its hard to say Winston was not involved in some pretty bad things

Never bought a baseball jersey with a name on it…..but I’m thinking about it.
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NEW YORK — Jameson Taillon was almost untouchable in his second major league start. Pittsburgh’s touted rookie took a no-hit bid into the seventh inning, dominating the New York Mets while pitching the Pirates to a 4-0 victory.

The kid’s special,” Pittsburgh catcher Chris Stewart said. “I think this is just the beginning.”

The team isn’t even allowed to talk to Jordan — how can they make any kind of call? This is only his agent talking.
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Jordan’s trainer said recently that Jordan has lost 12 or 13 pounds and weighed under 270 pounds.

If Jordan is reinstated, Hendrickson said the team hasn’t said whether he’ll play defensive end or linebacker upon his return to the team

Stanger, I’m taking anything away from Taillon. I only caught the end of the game. It was still 0-0 and I was in the other room listening to it and heard the two 2-run HRs. If a good pitcher has a chance at a no-hitter, the Mets are a good candidate.

Guess you missed the possible no hit thing. And if you were only listening now and then get why. Even the broadcaster weren’t till like the end of the fifth. Was like they were keeping up the tradition of don’t talk about it to the pitcher in such situations.

With that said I’d try to get him an extension during the season, otherwise waiting 2 years to do it will cost us $15M. Doing it during the season means no raise this year, but you can get him for this year’s price or close to it.

Big Ben wanting to go for 2 after every TD has brought the question, should teams go for 2 or PAT after every TD? It has to be situational, go for 2 when up by 7 with 2 minutes left, go for 1 up 8 with 2 minutes left. Up 3 with 2 minutes left go for 1.

I tend to think coaches are a little too conservative with the 2 point conversion and it can be used more often

I know I do it in Madden…..lol

Seriously, I think it would be an advantage of you score 1st
and want to go up 8-0
then see what the other team does if they score
settle for being a point down or going for 2

if they go for 2 and tie it at 8-8, you didn’t hurt yourself
if they don’t go for 2, you are still up by 1 pt

If you go for 2 point and fail but then score again later, its not a huge factor most of the time

if you go for 2 and fail, and they score and take the extra point – that’s when it hurts you – but you have the whole game to make up that extra point differential and may get a chance to go for 2 points later

So I think scoring in the first qtr first would be a good place to start using the 2 point conversion to get an early edge and make them chase you

Some periodical named “undefeated” wrote a really positive piece about Winston including some information about Murphy’s football camp where Winston volunteered

And then a bunch of other media outlets blasted that article b/c of Winston’s past

so now it has context

Personally I think the criticism of Winston is fair
but I thioink Murphy’s comment defending Winston makes a lot more sense
people aren’t over what he was accuse dof at FSU
I know I am not
and probably won’t be

but there are a bunch of athletes who have had episodes that are in the same boat:
Ray Lewis, Rothlisberger and Michael Vick come to mind
I hate all those guys
Why is Winston any different?

I’m not so sure what they’re saying about the Undefeated is warranted. We all know Winstons past so, because of it, does that mean every article written about him, for the rest of his life, have to include the rape allegations, or its a bad article?

Yeah
no question that was the rumor Tim
and it was a little more than the rumor
there were complaints made the night of the alleged rape/assault
and the PD didn’t do anything to investigate it for at least 2 weeks (and they dropped the investigation very quickly)

it was a pretty clear case of pref treatment IMO

Reading about this stuff again reminds me that Winston is in fact a piece of shit…lol
Thanks Louis Murphy

What they’re saying on Undefeated writing the article is they should’ve mentioned the rape allegations I think it’s BS, who are they to tell someone else what they can write? Try on here to even suggest telling someone what to write and… It gets rather redundant, like a Walker or Omar report.

Undefeated isn’t painting him as a saint, they’re just reporting. Pig, if someone has an issue with Jameis, don’t read articles about him, but to try to push morals on someone is BS. If we had accurate info on all the shit people have done in the past this issue wouldn’t even rank. Doesn’t excuse what he did, just puts it in perspective.

Toba
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Lol that actually took me a sec. I was gonna turn it into a Curling comment , but think my last Canadian comment ” I’ll have Nunavut ” went over like a lead balloon
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I laughed out loud when I first read “none of it” in Eskimo, Manitoba, but I guess my “You rock” comment was taken to be about your generally high football IQ statements and your willingness to be optimistic rather than LOL about your Eskimo jokes.

Anyway, living in North Naples as I do makes me feel like you are a kindred spirit, seeing as how you live at the North Pole and all.

I hardly see how Tunsil could be worse than Thomas was last year. So I am optimistic at LG.

The question is whether Thomas improves under the new coaching and scheme. You have to compare the Thomas of right now to the Tunsil of right now because it is unfair and totally useless to compare the Thomas under Philbin/Lasor versus the Tunsil against college boys. (Although our OL coach last year Benson was supposedly a great OL coach in his past life, and Tunsil not Thomas was rated #1 overall in his draft class.)

At OG we have Tunsil, Thomas, Turner, Douglas, Urbik, maybe Bushrod, maybe McClendon and Steen has a long-shot chance as well. That is 8 and we need to keep 4. If we start James and Albert at OT, then we need back-ups at both tackles. So maybe we keep Young and figure Tunsil and Bushrod could back up both OG and OT.

But nobody can play two spots at once, and we MUST have a REAL back-up C because that lost us at least 1 and maybe 2 games last year.

If Albert goes down and Tunsil moves over, then who is playing LG? An improved Thomas? He’s started more games in the NFL for several seasons, incl. last year, than anybody else on the team besides Pouncey and Albert and maybe Bushrod. Where did Bushrod play college? Towson? That ain’t Tennessee where Thomas played. He may suck, but Thomas is one of our best OGs.

Thomas might very well not make the team. But if he does improve drastically and fast, then he will make the team. Maybe the new OC, OL coach, and HC scheme will benefit a quick-footed OG like Thomas more than most guys. Personally, I think Turner and Douglas have more upside.

But if we are trying to see if we have improved our team, then we have to compare our last year starter against our this year starter. So at LG that means we need to compare Thomas of last year against Tunsil of this year.

If Gase is saying Tunsil has to earn the LG job, then the guy he has to beat out is Thomas, since he had the starting LG job last year.

Douglas and Urbik have been working at C and both G spots. Thomas, Turner and Tunsil are also working at G and T. Bushrod hasn’t had a lot of practice time yet due to coming off of injury but I read today he’s lining up on the right side. Then there are long shots competing as well. We’re gonna find two guards somehow out of this group.

Please don’t play Thomas at OT. He was REALLY bad out there.
We need to keep 8 or 9 OL, depending on how healthy everybody is.
4 OGs, 3 OTs, and 2 Centers or 1 guy who is a back-up C and OG. And a guy who is a back-up OG/OT. As Gase says, we’ll play the best 5, but the question is who are the other 3-4, because in the recent past, we have had to start the back-ups a LOT.

No idea with this regime but I only remember 10 when we had injuries and were bringing guys in or signing them up from the PS. If you only bring 7 to the game, I’m not sure more than 9 total makes sense. Unless you’re loaded with talent and we’re not. Is a 10th guy going to be so good we can’t find that guy off the street?

I think the 7th and 8th spot could be between him, Turner and Bushrod. Young might be the 9th guy as a pure tackle but not active unless there is an injury and he has to start the next week. Other guys can play multiple positions as backups.

It’s unusual for a team to keep 10 OL but not illegal.
They usually want more skill players.
If they keep 6 WRs, 4 TEs, 4RBs, 3QBs, that is 27 on offense.
53-kickers is 50. Half on D is 25 left for offense, so 2 of the above must go.
Usually that means they keep only 2 QBs and 9 OL, but there are variations.

This year we might want to keep 3 QBs if we think Douty won’t survive PS exposure.
More Defensive guys play STs, so then you get an imbalance like 27 on D and 23 on O. then you really have hard decisions such as only 5 WRs and 3 TEs. Some decisions depend on whether the KR comes from WRs or from DBs.

But all of you guys already know all this. Choices still must be made.

I dont know that im ready to say Tunsil doesnt play LT, I think so much could change from now until the season starts that Tunsil could win LT, and Albert kicks inside. Thats also barring any sort of discussion about potential injuries or whatnot. I do think if healthy Albert and Tunsil are both starters on our OL,

I think Pouncey and his position are pretty much locked, and pretty certain of that for James as well. RG i really am not sure. I would have pretty solidly put Bushrod as my most likely guy were he healthy this whole time, but at this point i think it could go a lot of ways and there are a lot of guys who have a lot to prove to establish themselves as front-runners.

If forced to pick, I think Douglas is my more likely candidate at this point until Bushrod has shown to be health and we have a chance to evaluate him at OG. I pick Douglas because at leat with him i think there is more question or if he will be good or bad there, but with the other two we know they dont play well so less negative is a positive for Douglas lol.

Naples i think you keep 10 if you have concerns about the health of a starter. If you feel pretty confidant about the overall health of your starting unit, you probably dont worry about carrying an additional guy, if you do you keep 10 so that if that guy cant keep healthy, your depth across the OL isnt hit as hard when they go down. Hedging your bet kinda move.

No idea with this regime but I only remember 10 when we had injuries and were bringing guys in or signing them up from the PS. If you only bring 7 to the game, I’m not sure more than 9 total makes sense. Unless you’re loaded with talent and we’re not. Is a 10th guy going to be so good we can’t find that guy off the street?
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Thats also a good point, it does depend on whom that 10th guys is. You still have your PS guys if you need to bring someone up, but if your 10th guy is a warm body, you can get someone to come in and provide the same depth as that guy, except maybe a little behind on the playbook. That 10th guy isnt going to help you in the game that your starter goes down, he so you dont have to scramble to find someone so you wind up really thin somewhere.

Sometimes PS guys are developmental types who are not ready and that’s why you see teams sign guys off the streets during injuries. They target guys who have played in the league before and are at least further along and a better option for now.

A 9th or 10th OL isnt someone you really expect to ever play even if a starter goes down, they might be one of the 7 you suit up though so if you suffer a second hit to your starters then they start become a real option.

Last year we carried Hazel as a 6th WR all year, and he contributed nothing. That was maybe a mistake on our part, but it’s a new coaching regime, so they are not necessarily bound to deviate from last year’s mistakes. I want to keep 6 WRs this year.

A few years ago we kept Devlin as a 3rd QB and before that Pat White, both mistakes on our part as they neither one contributed anything to our team on game day. But teams do do that.

Douty had such huge numbers in college that he might be attractive for a team to poach off the PS in an emergency. However, he is considered too green to just throw on to the field, so maybe not.

A lot depends on preseason performance. If he tears it up and looks game day ready, then we’ll have to protect him as a 3rd QB. Of course then the question becomes, is Moore expendable this year instead of next? I do not think Douty wins games for us if Tannehill misses whole games, but then again, can Moore win games in the NFL any more?

Well i think thats where Grant comes in, because in Gase’s system he likely fulfills a both depth at RB and receiver, allowing us to carry 1 less of one of those two spot officially, and that could open the door for us to carry an extra TE for example, and that could open up sme extra plays. Duarte covers both TE and WR, so add him as a 4th TE and Carry 5 receivers, add an extra OL. There is a lot of flexibility on our roster as to how we move the numbers around, maybe with so much overlap on offense we actually carry an extra guy on defense to cover potential injury there. Thats why these hybrid players can really help making filling out a roster easier.

Concerned about Drake, hammies can be such a nagging injury, but if he was walking with a limp, its not a real serious one. If it had been a bad hamstring pull they would have practically had to carry him off.

D, as of right now Albert says he feels the best he has since back in his earlier days in KC. He was drafted at 315 and that’s what he’s back to. He carried too much weight last year because he had to rehab over conditioning. We have a healthy Albert going in. He’s a more experienced NFL LT than Tunsil. I think Tunsil could learn a lot playing LG for a few years next to Albert and Pouncey. Unless Albert breaks down, I think he’ll play out his contract or at least two more years. Don’t fuck with your investments and get too cute. Protecting RT is paramount. He’ll play better with better guys up front.

Im not concerned with what Albert says, the Dr’s will know if they feel he has good range and that the previous injruy is fully healed. Im not also saying Albert IS going to get hurt but i do think when you fill out your roster, if in the team Dr’s are saying yeah he’s about 80% right now so just have to see…you are thinking about keeping 10, if they are saying he looks great,you probably keep 9.

Just like what Steve was saying about getting excited about the coaches saying so and so looks really good im impressed with their progress…. yadda yadda yadda….you take a player saying im 100%, best i have felt in years….with a grain of salt, because well they say that shit all the time and there really isnt many that would say different even if it wasnt true.

Why would you think Albert is only 80% when he’s in better shape now than last year and he finished out the season playing really well at times? Last year was the 75-80% season. He has been able to do everythong this offseason when last year he basically missed all the camps rehabbing and making it back for opening day.

That’s the big mess I was alluding to. Are Gabe Hughes, first ever NFL player from Fl Tech, MarQueis Gray(??), and Dominique Jones from Shepherd College any more than camp bodies? sad to say.
The patsies* don’t have 7. They KNOW who is playing. They have 2 Studs and AJ Derby?? and Clay Harbor. They’ll carry those and that’s it.

Why would you think Albert is only 80% when he’s in better shape now than last year and he finished out the season playing really well at times? Last year was the 75-80% season. He has been able to do everythong this offseason when last year he basically missed all the camps rehabbing and making it back for opening day.

Until he goes down, Albert is a core LT for us.
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Didnt you get from my post that was a hypothetical? I think you make your mind up when people have an agenda sometimes when we dont.

Only thing im concerned about is for us to have stability on the OL, i literally pulled 80% out of air with no intention of it meaning anything but to make the point that if they have concerns about Albert …..also i used Albert as an example, though i feel he is a relevant one, since he has had a couple seasons now he spent part of injured.

You brought Albert into my convo btw. If you read back when i was making the concern over injury statement i said “concerns over the health of a starter”. I know i was talking Albert’s injury history before but that was not the case when i was making my comment to Naples.

Relax man! Not sure why you think everything I say to you is so adversarial. It’s a discussion. Some people act like Albert has only one leg and he’s 40 years old way too often here. He’ll be 32 a couple of days before we select a new president. LOL

I feel Drake was drafted as a speed player with big plays in him. Carroo was drafted as a Matthews/Landry type – tough and productive with some big plays in him. Grant as a short, super quick and fast mismatch guy, and Duarte as another mismatch guy more up front. It seems like we’re trying to make it impossible for opposing defenses to matchup with us on a consistent basis. I think that comes from Gase’s philosophy. It’s all about mismatches and the QB making the right reads. Then throw in some runs to keep things balanced.

Defensive players had to do five pushups toward the end of practice because they got beat by the offense in a drill mimicking the final play of the game.

“The fun part of it is five pushups, and you try to get everybody to pick a side,” Gase said. “I was waiting for [executive vice president of football operations Mike] Tannenbaum to [choose a side], but he stayed in the back.”

from mando,
“So far, without pads, Thomas and Turner are holding serve on their spots while Tunsil is running mostly second team. (Tunsil has gotten first-team reps the past two days but not as many as the other two, which can change at any moment).”

“Gase downplayed the importance of who’s playing with the first team, noting that he doesn’t ask offensive line coach Chris Foerster “who do you have starting today…. We are just going to keep working on different groups. We will keep running guys in there.”

Tim,
I’m excited about Duarte’s role as well.
In that presser a few days ago, Gase said that the scouts/coaches liked his WR skills out of the TE position. He said that other teams saw him as a tweener (some saw him as something other than TE). Gase mentioned his receiving skills but did add that he doesn’t know if he can block yet at this level but that “we’ll see what happens when the pads come on” .

I dont think Duarte will be able to fill the role Cameron played last year, not even close. I also though dont think thats what he is there fore this year and i think in Gase’s system he could have the level of productions Cameron had in Lazor’s. I think though Cameron in Gase’s system compared to what i feel Duarte will do in Gase’s system isnt comparable. Im hoping both go off this year.

There is more than one way to look at the Tunsil not getting all the first team snaps. It can be negative as in you are choosing to believe that Tunsil has not been better than two guys who stunk last year, so he in turn must stink. You could reverse that thought and say, Tunsil is playing decent but Turner and Thomas have improed their game to make it competitive, or you could just believe what Gase is saying and go with us taking looks at all of them at different positions. Turner was getting first team looks at RT too, now he’s getting them at RG. There is too much going on at the OG positions that i wouldn’t be surprised seeing just about anyone not named Pouncey or James, getting some first team looks there.

I agree, and i also think it may show that Turner and Thomas are starting to respond to the coaching we have now. I think its overall a positive sign of having players that are more cometative than they have been before.

D
I didn’t mean that Duarte would be starting at TE, I just meant his production this season could be more than Cameron’s was last year. He’ll be moved around a lot, playing 2nd TE in line, or sometimes in the slot, or maybe even out of the backfield. I just think once he proves he’s reliable, he’ll get opportunities.

Thats about how i feel he will be used. He wont be a starting TE but i dont think he was drafted to be. He’s another mismatch guy. Line him up in the slot, out of the backfield, part of a 2 TE package, like you are saying. More Hernandez type of player, minus the murder.

Not at practice today: Jarvis Landry, Mario Williams, Jason Jones.
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Wonder why Landry isnt there. The other two are on personal leave, but seems its been all week now, so hope it wasnt something bad.

Kenyan Drake, who left practice with an apparent hamstring injury yesterday, is sitting out today’s practice. He signed his deal though.
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Expected, but i dont think he would be there if it had been a serious hamstring pull.

D,
I don’t think it’s anything bad with Landry but ya never know I guess.
I think in these OTA the coaches look for fundamentals and most of the veterans usually have that kind of stuff down. Judgement errors during games is usually what separates the good ones from the bad ones on game day.

QBs are trying to throw an end-zone fade into a trash can. Matt Moore the only one to do so so far.
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Good that is one thing Tanny REALLY needs to work on is his RZ touch passing.

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For sure. I think the only true change up I’ve seen from RT near the end zone is that tear drop, grenade like toss, throw into the endzone to the TE (to Dion Sims down the middle).
I think his footwork is to blame most of the time on those type of throws .
He needs better coordination on his pivot to throw motion.

I know you are asking Randy but just as some additional observation. Id say he doesn’t have the greatest movement skills, his footwork is ok but not great and he gets a little high on a few of his pass pro snaps. He does seem to be an aggressive finisher on plays, he seems to be pretty strong and he uses his strength and size well sealing out blockers. He also uses his hands pretty well also. Almost ever play they had him pulling the RB has to delay to get behind his blocks though so he really doesn’t get to the second level very well. I cant see him being able to play OC for us, he has some potential as an OG. I think with time and coaching on the flaws i pointed out could be a solid backup there, maybe low end starting potential but its going to take a lot of work for him to get there.

Coach Adam Gase said it would have been more of a challenge for Tunsil to go from left tackle to right tackle than left tackle to left guard.

“When you put a guy on the left side, he’s playing the two positions that really they’re making the calls together whether it be in the run game or the pass game,” Gase said. “So it’s not like he’s learning something completely different.

“Whether it’s left guard or left tackle it’s easy for him to go back and forth. It’s a big difference when you go from the right to the left. It’s a completely different view.”

While it’s tough to evaluate offensive linemen in minicamp practices without pads, Tunsil said you can still get a feel for a players’ athleticism.

“But putting pads on is a different thing,” he said. “Just wait ’till we get the pads on. Everything should be good.”

We can’t hit consistently. We’ll get 2 hits today and lose 3-0. I wonder if we’ll take a look at that Cuban star Yulieski Gourriel, or maybe even Jimmy Rollins or Jose Reyes. Not only can’t we hit, but we can’t run the bases either. Station to station base running means you need lots of hits, so I won’t be surprised if we make some kind of move to get a bat. Just read Wright might be out the whole season.

Ouch on Wright, but you guys should be OK against us tonight. You are getting Nicasio…..another contestant in the Bucs’ “who won’t be in the starting rotation at the end of the year” game show. Locke hit the bankrupt on the wheel last night.

D,
Saw your response to the question I posed to Randy regarding Carter and appreciate your feed back.
It does look like he needs alot of work and that he seems nibble footed but has issues with his body lean and how to use his upper body (extending arms or how to cut down defenders in the 2nd level).