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Dec 1, 2016

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There's going to be a managerial reshuffle in the Pl soon with Pep and Poch leaving their clubs. We missed out on the last one when Klopp and Pep changed clubs and joined our rivals. There's no time to wait and confirm suspicions that Ole is a failure. Take the hint and go for one of Poch, Nagel-watzisname. Guaranteed we can't end up worse off with any of them. Also certain is their ceiling potential if things go right is far higher

Leave Wayne Rooney alone!!

There's going to be a managerial reshuffle in the Pl soon with Pep and Poch leaving their clubs. We missed out on the last one when Klopp and Pep changed clubs and joined our rivals. There's no time to wait and confirm suspicions that Ole is a failure. Take the hint and go for one of Poch, Nagel-watzisname. Guaranteed we can't end up worse off with any of them. Also certain is their ceiling potential if things go right is far higher

despite the protests, wears Ugg boots

There's going to be a managerial reshuffle in the Pl soon with Pep and Poch leaving their clubs. We missed out on the last one when Klopp and Pep changed clubs and joined our rivals. There's no time to wait and confirm suspicions that Ole is a failure. Take the hint and go for one of Poch, Nagel-watzisname. Guaranteed we can't end up worse off with any of them. Also certain is their ceiling potential if things go right is far higher

I wouldn't say he's been a failure. Ole has laid the best foundations yet. He's been the only that's had the balls to give youngsters a real chance and not rely on the same shite/wait til they're injured to do so. I suspect that was part of his plan laid out when hired. I do doubt he's the way forward after the summer plans though.

idiot

He's said he wants to get back into management soon and all reports have suggested the board are intent on continuing with Ole. Don't think it'll happen myself. Don't see him waiting around for Ole to inevitably fail.

Full Member

He's said he wants to get back into management soon and all reports have suggested the board are intent on continuing with Ole. Don't think it'll happen myself. Don't see him waiting around for Ole to inevitably fail.

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I wouldn't say he's been a failure. Ole has laid the best foundations yet. He's been the only that's had the balls to give youngsters a real chance and not rely on the same shite/wait til they're injured to do so. I suspect that was part of his plan laid out when hired. I do doubt he's the way forward after the summer plans though.

despite the protests, wears Ugg boots

Greenwood, Chong, Williams. All 3 of the others? Jose brought McT through so fair play there, and LVG stumbled into giving Rashford a go, but Ole has clearly looked to include these as part of his plans.

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Greenwood, Chong, Williams. All 3 of the others? Jose brought McT through so fair play there, and LVG stumbled into giving Rashford a go, but Ole has clearly looked to include these as part of his plans.

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I wonder who is this magical "hierarchy" when they use the word in the context of United? Because, from outside - there seems to be no "hierarchy", it's just fecking Ed Woodward – he doesn't have director of football, the board is an absolute joke, with accountants and memmbers of Glazer family.

Full Member

There's going to be a managerial reshuffle in the Pl soon with Pep and Poch leaving their clubs. We missed out on the last one when Klopp and Pep changed clubs and joined our rivals. There's no time to wait and confirm suspicions that Ole is a failure. Take the hint and go for one of Poch, Nagel-watzisname. Guaranteed we can't end up worse off with any of them. Also certain is their ceiling potential if things go right is far higher

There is no guarantee that Poch or Nagelsmann will do any better than Ole did. Poch got himself fired from Spurs (!) and Nagelsmann has no experience in EPL. You may say they have potential, you may even say that you think they have much higher potential, but talking about guarantees is crossing the line into an imaginary world.

Nobody is going to fire Ole before the end of the season. And he's far from failure yet:

1. If he finishes in top 6, his work this season will universally be considered satisfactory, by experts, even if he doesn't win Europa League.
2. If he finishes in top 6 and wins Europa League, gets us CL qualification - he season will be considered success.
3. If he finishes in top 4, the season will be considered an outstanding success.

and then with City's CL ban, he can even get CL qualification with 5th place, which would still be considered success.

There're still many realistic ways Ole's season would be considered success or great success, and a pretty straightforward way in which it would be considered satisfactory. And he doesn't ruffle the feathers with Woodward, so - why would anybody fire him?

Ole would need to finish 7th or 8th or worse and lose Europa League for him to get sacked, and even then it's not a sure thing.

Not sure what him going to Inter has to do with it.
Greenwood has obviously been brought through by no accident, which you've chosen to gloss over now.

As for the difference between Williams and Rashford, well, if you want to give credit to LVG for it that's fine but Ole has still done more with youth than him.
But the difference is that LVG didn't really want to use Rashford at all, whereas Williams has clearly been in the plans. It took a chain reaction of unfortunate events for Rashford's debut to happen, and even then only happened at the last minute (see the last sentence):

Louis van Gaal was on the brink of laughter as he assessed the promotion of Marcus Rashford to first team duty back in February 2016, intoning that the alternative to providing cover for first-choice striker Anthony Martial was simply having no cover at all.

As the Dutchman prepared his United side for the second leg of the Europa League meeting with FC Midtjylland, his options were diminishing all the time. There was no alternative to victory against the Danes, having won just six of the previous 19 games, including a 2-1 reverse in the first leg, while in his selection process he had only Rashford and Martial available to spearhead his attack.

Skipper Wayne Rooney was injured, Javier Hernandez had been sold and James Wilson loaned out, while Will Keane had suffered a groin injury just three minutes after entering the Reds’ FA Cup win over Shrewsbury Town as a substitute three days earlier. Adnan Januzaj, named by van Gaal as his alternative alternate, was cup-tied in the Europa League. And injured.

So, when Martial’s hamstring felt tight during the pre-match warm-up, the latest setback in a season of eye-rolling exasperation handed the floor to a player whose name wasn’t even in the United Review squad list, so late was his call-up.

With Williams, it only took Shaw being injured, which was obviously going to happen at some point.

Again, what's got your goat about it? There's a weird tone considering we're not having an argument. Or at least I'm not. I'm guessing you just despise Ole and can't see past it.
If you can't see that he has been more about our youngsters than others then I dunno what else to say.

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If by some miracle we get champions league football, Ole will still be the gaffer next season. If we dont I think Pocc will be given the reins. There has been talk of Nagelsmann and Rose in the press occasionally, but I think Woody will go for a safe option

Juventus fan who used to support United

There is no guarantee that Poch or Nagelsmann will do any better than Ole did. Poch got himself fired from Spurs (!) and Nagelsmann has no experience in EPL. You may say they have potential, you may even say that you think they have much higher potential, but talking about guarantees is crossing the line into an imaginary world.

Nobody is going to fire Ole before the end of the season. And he's far from failure yet:

1. If he finishes in top 6, his work this season will universally be considered satisfactory, by experts, even if he doesn't win Europa League.
2. If he finishes in top 6 and wins Europa League, gets us CL qualification - he season will be considered success.
3. If he finishes in top 4, the season will be considered an outstanding success.

and then with City's CL ban, he can even get CL qualification with 5th place, which would still be considered success.

There're still many realistic ways Ole's season would be considered success or great success, and a pretty straightforward way in which it would be considered satisfactory. And he doesn't ruffle the feathers with Woodward, so - why would anybody fire him?

Ole would need to finish 7th or 8th or worse and lose Europa League for him to get sacked, and even then it's not a sure thing.

Full Member

If by some miracle we get champions league football, Ole will still be the gaffer next season. If we dont I think Pocc will be given the reins. There has been talk of Nagelsmann and Rose in the press occasionally, but I think Woody will go for a safe option

Full Member

There is no guarantee that Poch or Nagelsmann will do any better than Ole did. Poch got himself fired from Spurs (!) and Nagelsmann has no experience in EPL. You may say they have potential, you may even say that you think they have much higher potential, but talking about guarantees is crossing the line into an imaginary world.

Nobody is going to fire Ole before the end of the season. And he's far from failure yet:

1. If he finishes in top 6, his work this season will universally be considered satisfactory, by experts, even if he doesn't win Europa League.
2. If he finishes in top 6 and wins Europa League, gets us CL qualification - he season will be considered success.
3. If he finishes in top 4, the season will be considered an outstanding success.

and then with City's CL ban, he can even get CL qualification with 5th place, which would still be considered success.

There're still many realistic ways Ole's season would be considered success or great success, and a pretty straightforward way in which it would be considered satisfactory. And he doesn't ruffle the feathers with Woodward, so - why would anybody fire him?

Ole would need to finish 7th or 8th or worse and lose Europa League for him to get sacked, and even then it's not a sure thing.

Full Member

There is no guarantee that Poch or Nagelsmann will do any better than Ole did. Poch got himself fired from Spurs (!) and Nagelsmann has no experience in EPL. You may say they have potential, you may even say that you think they have much higher potential, but talking about guarantees is crossing the line into an imaginary world.

Nobody is going to fire Ole before the end of the season. And he's far from failure yet:

1. If he finishes in top 6, his work this season will universally be considered satisfactory, by experts, even if he doesn't win Europa League.
2. If he finishes in top 6 and wins Europa League, gets us CL qualification - he season will be considered success.
3. If he finishes in top 4, the season will be considered an outstanding success.

and then with City's CL ban, he can even get CL qualification with 5th place, which would still be considered success.

There're still many realistic ways Ole's season would be considered success or great success, and a pretty straightforward way in which it would be considered satisfactory. And he doesn't ruffle the feathers with Woodward, so - why would anybody fire him?

Ole would need to finish 7th or 8th or worse and lose Europa League for him to get sacked, and even then it's not a sure thing.

There doesn't have to be a guarantee to label it a realistic projection, it merely needs to be arguable on the basis of past and present evidence. There's no guarantee Poch can do a better job than Tony Pulis, none, none at all, but it's highly likely and a basket worth putting one's eggs in. None of us look through crystal balls before giving projections. I like Poch, people say he got sacked but get this, Poch in the midst of rock bottom made a CL final and was nominated alongside Pep and Klopp for manager of the year. Says a lot about his pedigree.

You know what? I change my mind, I've talked myself into it, Poch is guaranteed to do a better job than Ole at any managerial job in football. I don't care if it's on the moon or in Alaska

Full Member

Not sure what him going to Inter has to do with it.
Greenwood has obviously been brought through by no accident, which you've chosen to gloss over now.

As for the difference between Williams and Rashford, well, if you want to give credit to LVG for it that's fine but Ole has still done more with youth than him.
But the difference is that LVG didn't really want to use Rashford at all, whereas Williams has clearly been in the plans. It took a chain reaction of unfortunate events for Rashford's debut to happen, and even then only happened at the last minute (see the last sentence):

With Williams, it only took Shaw being injured, which was obviously going to happen at some point.

Again, what's got your goat about it? There's a weird tone considering we're not having an argument. Or at least I'm not. I'm guessing you just despise Ole and can't see past it.
If you can't see that he has been more about our youngsters than others then I dunno what else to say.

Chong point is pretty clear. If he was happy with his development there wouldn’t have been an issue with his contract renewal and him looking to leave for Inter. We aren’t an average club that lose youth team prospects.

Rashford and Williams are the same and I identified why pretty clearly again.... Shaw got injured against Crystal Palance and Williams was not the starting left back or on the bench the next week.

Greenwood well see Wayne Rooney or the guy who brought through Micheal Owen basically any hot talent in your academy... then genuinely tend to get minutes. I also called him a generational talent. Meaning he’s a bit special.

Go check out the starting line up against Arsenal at home in LVG’s last season and tell me he didn’t bring through youth like Ole. I mean what are you smoking. I want some.

despite the protests, wears Ugg boots

Chong point is pretty clear. If he was happy with his development there wouldn’t have been an issue with his contract renewal and him looking to leave for Inter. We aren’t an average club that lose youth team prospects.

Rashford and Williams are the same and I identified why pretty clearly again.... Shaw got injured against Crystal Palance and Williams was not the starting left back or on the bench the next week.

Greenwood well see Wayne Rooney or the guy who brought through Micheal Owen basically any hot talent in your academy... then genuinely tend to get minutes. I also called him a generational talent. Meaning he’s a bit special.

Go check out the starting line up against Arsenal at home in LVG’s last season and tell me he didn’t bring through youth like Ole. I mean what are you smoking. I want some.

That is a good point. Woodward seems like a person that would even scapegoat his own family if he needed to save his skin, so - surely he won't hesitate to throw Ole under the bus. That said, I think he can sell top 6 / no CL under "rebuild" enough that he would be ok.

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There doesn't have to be a guarantee to label it a realistic projection, it merely needs to be arguable on the basis of past and present evidence. There's no guarantee Poch can do a better job than Tony Pulis, none, none at all, but it's highly likely and a basket worth putting one's eggs in. None of us look through crystal balls before giving projections. I like Poch, people say he got sacked but get this, Poch in the midst of rock bottom made a CL final and was nominated alongside Pep and Klopp for manager of the year. Says a lot about his pedigree.

You know what? I change my mind, I've talked myself into it, Poch is guaranteed to do a better job than Ole at any managerial job in football. I don't care if it's on the moon or in Alaska