Whats the best part of this? The idea of a prominent Democrat interrupting his partys Mediscare demagoguery to scold the right on increasing health-care costs for seniors? The fact that he thinks ObamaCare, which isnt even defended as a cost-saving measure anymore, will effectively bend the curve on that? Or his palpable annoyance at the notion that enumerated powers might throw up a constitutional roadblock to something progressives really, really, really want to do?

But never mind that. Is he right? Hes unquestionably right on how the left will spin the aftermath of the mandate being dumped: They tried, now its the rights turn. Hope the GOPs ready. Let me rephrase his question slightly, though, and ask whether an adverse ruling would also be the best thing to happen to Obama, specifically. On the one hand, it would be an enormous humiliation to have his signature domestic achievement repudiated as an unconstitutional power grab. Thats one of the reasons that righties are so excited to see the mandate tossed. Once O-Care is gone, whats left of Hopenchange except high unemployment and mind-boggling debt? Killing Bin Laden is awesome but if thats all he has to point to in November, hes done.

Would that humiliation cost him any votes, though? Or would it actually gain him votes by sending the left into a frenzy of utopian outrage? Obama could tell them, quite correctly, that the difference between universal health care and the status quo turned out to be one Supreme Court appointment. If they want to make sure this doesnt happen again, its imperative that he be reelected. Thats a compelling pitch, much more so than clean coal or high-speed rail or whatever the hell hes planning to talk about on the trail. And not only does he gain votes, he gains the right to do something that he loves loves loves doing  namely, passing the buck. The public hates the mandate and theyre going to hate the horrendous cost of this giant clusterfark once it goes into effect in two years. But once its gone, O doesnt have to worry about that anymore. He can dress the program up rhetorically in all manner of what might have been nonsense  it would have lowered costs and there would have been no rationing and the whole thing would have been totally amazing  and use the comparison to bludgeon whatever Republican alternative plan emerges. In other words, losing O-Care would be a momentary embarrassment that just might get him reelected by turning out his base and would spare him the much greater embarrassment of watching this boondoggle melt down in the years to come. Hey, maybe thats why Verrillis argument was so bad today. Dude, theyre throwing the fight. (Kidding, kidding.)

Carville is right, but the problem is that voters are WAY more attentive to politics now than before 2008. The Dems believe, “Hey, we lose Obamacare in SCOTUS and we get back some seats in the House and Senate because the voters will forget.”

This will NOT happen. People are scared and can see a very violent future coalescing from all of the Democrat’s policies. It would be even more obvious if the GOP ran on these failed policies, but I guess the GOP is too stupid to hold the Dems feet to the fire and win with 10X the turnout as their issue-avoiding asses are doing now.

ObamaCare being struck down would be the best thing ever to happen to Democrats

This nonsense is all CYA for the supporters of Obummer. How will Obummers singular achievement being eliminated be exciting for the Commie Pinko Left? They will be totally demorilized and Obummer will be left with absolutely nothing to sell himself to those dopes. He will be considered an utter failure for squandering so many resources and losing so many House and Senate seats over something that never came to be.

Obamacare has swept generations of Rats out of office on all levels of Govt'. If it is struck down, all that will be for nothing.

9
posted on 03/27/2012 8:21:12 PM PDT
by Lazlo in PA
(Now living in a newly minted Red State.)

In other words, losing O-Care would be a momentary embarrassment that just might get him reelected by turning out his base and would spare him the much greater embarrassment of watching this boondoggle melt down in the years to come.

The flaw in this argument is that there aren't enough voters left in Obama's base and there are a lot more voters who will be happy if Obozocare gets thrown out.

To listen to the messiah and his supporters on the far left, if SCOTUS tosses Obamacare then Zero wins; if SCOTUS upholds Obamacare saying it is constitutional, the Zero wins. It is a win-win for Zero. LIBERALISM IS A MENTAL DISEASE.

Once Obama Care is gone, whats left of Hope and Change except high Unemployment and mind-boggling debt?
________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Now, there’s a campaign line for the GOP if I ever heard one!!!

21
posted on 03/27/2012 8:41:31 PM PDT
by no dems
(I've always been crazy but that's the only thing that's kept me from going insane.)

The Left has been at their Holy Grail for more than 80 years. There not like Cubs fans, they will be demoralized. The independents will be just fine with a smack down. Conservatives will be energized. Nothing succeeds like success. Remember, this time, the Left is on defense, and no matter the verdict, they cannot score.
If the Left loses, there will be a lot of finger pointing. Just think how it will look when a Dem Senator tries to defend their unconstitutional vote.

there aren't enough voters left in Obama's base and there are a lot more voters who will be happy if Obozocare gets thrown out.

I'm not so sure. I'm afraid if the court kicks this back it will motivate the dem base. We'll get 24-7 discussions on the cost of health care in the media. The "masses" as 'bam regards them, will grow increasingly nervous about their health insurance in a lousy economy. This is potentially the political 'perfect storm' for Republicans.

Bottom line: the Republicans had better put together a health care plan to present in its place. And they better put it in simple, 4th grade level terms that will be attractive.

James Carville: ObamaCare being struck down would be the best thing ever to happen to Democrats

Yawn. How Clintonian. Car-vile is like the proverbial cat skidding on its ass on the linoleum floor and smacking up against the wall and falling flat on its face, that then gets up, looks around and says, "I meant to do that."

Repudiation of 0bamacare in trade for re-electing 0bama? Reminds me of two sayings. One starts: “A bird in-hand ...” and the other is “Be careful what you pray for ...”. I'll take repudiation for $100.

If Obamacare in its entirety was tossed by the USSC then the Democrats would be able to claim they had done their best to help the common man, only to be thwarted by the "conservative" leaning USSC. They also wouldn't have any political risk when Obamacare measures kicked in and killed the job market.

I think what will happen instead is that the mandate will get thrown out, but the rest will remain with nothing to pay for it. This will be really bad for Democrats. They will lose a critical revenue stream for the bill with no way to make it up. The cost of the program will explode along with the corresponding federal deficits.

We will all be hosed, but the Dems will have a tough time shedding the blame.

C'mon, James.....Stretch Armstrong couldn't get away with this much of a reach. The process of passing it and the law itself are more unpopular than they're willing to admit. They're just hoping it becomes enacted so people will just accept it.

Obama could tell them, quite correctly, that the difference between universal health care and the status quo turned out to be one Supreme Court appointment. If they want to make sure this doesnt happen again, its imperative that he be reelected.

I don't think they want to go there. The right could make a compelling argument that if Obama has the chance to get another vote for his power grabs, there is no END to what he could foist on the American people. THAT should be bone-chilling to the voters.

The GOP-TP solution to healthcare is simple and I am serious about this:

1. Minimize government involvement in healthcare including Medicare and Medicaid and by that meaning give rationed scaled voucher amounts to seniors and poor and let them spend their alloted amounts on health providers that they choose. Give them access to counselors to prioritize their healthcare dollars appropriately but make them responsible for getting the most for their allotment.

2. Promote Retainer Fee Medicine where healthcare providers get their relationships back with their patients and kick the government out. Require that providers obtain actuarial certification of their health dollar allotment pool and regulate how they must allocate it to stay solvent, in other words make providers accountable to patients that invest their health allotment in them.

Now it may seem like a lot of regulation but it’s not. It’s no more of a burden than requiring a licensed contractor to be bonded and insured according to state law. It will create new opportunities for private certified health actuaries but I view that as a good thing. Healthcare actuarial grade financing is too important to leave to overworked providers who don’t have the skills and training to run their practice profitably.

The USSC decision, one way or another, does nothing to address gas prices, nothing to address our bond ratings, nothing to address the immediate deficit, nothing to change the fact that this socialist machine has increased our national debt by $5T in 3 years. Unemployment is sky high, employers are not hiring in large numbers in large part because of Obamacare.

The parasites who support Obama will riot over this, over Trayvon, over contraception, over unions held in check in Wisconsin, over whatever they want to protest. They produce nothing of any value. Still, it is very possible that Obama will win reelection. Killing Obamacare is critical, but there are so mnay problems our beloved country faces.

Can Romney lead us back to the right path? I am underwhelmed by that possibility. I really have doubts that Romney can win, much less lead us back to the right path. This whole Supreme Court situation is very scary if Obama can win again. Scalia and Kennedy are getting old. Obama is so, so close to finally bringing this country down.

James Carville: ObamaCare being struck down would be the best thing ever to happen to Democrats

Sure, James. They would be the party that had singlehandedly passed an unconstitutional law that had to be struck down by the Supreme Court. And that would make them more popular amongst folks who are not Democrats how? And how did the repeal of the Volstead Act enhance the political prospects of the Prohibitionist Party?

If America loses "free health care" because the law was not written quite right, then the obvious next step is to re-elect Obama so that he can get it right next time.

That's contorted reasoning. The Dems had total control over Congress. No Rep voted for Obamacare. So the Dems now get a second chance to write another 2,700 page bill and shove it down the throats of Americans again?

The costs of Obamacare have already doubled to $1.7 trillion, the biggest entitlement program expansion ever. At the same time the US is borrowing 42 cents of every federal dollar spent. Our national debt equals our GDP now. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

Why didnt Congress just expand the Medicare program and its taxes? Even though it is already broke and dysfunctional, anyone employed has to pay into it.

Current Medicare will consume the entire federal budget if it is not reformed. Medicare has been running in the red since 2008. The Medicare Trust Fund (Part A) has been cashing in its IOUs to make up the shortfall, which means the General Fund must come up with the dollars to redeem the IOUs. By law, Medicare Parts B and D, are funded by only 25% from the premiums with the remaining 75% being funded by the General Fund. By 2030, one in five residents of this country will be 65 or older, twice what it is today. And by 2030 there will be only 2 workers for every retiree.

I think what will happen instead is that the mandate will get thrown out, but the rest will remain with nothing to pay for it. This will be really bad for Democrats. They will lose a critical revenue stream for the bill with no way to make it up. The cost of the program will explode along with the corresponding federal deficits.

If the mandate is struck down, Obamacare will collapse like a house of cards. It will be unsustainable.

The way I see it is the vouchers are apportioned to states who dispense them to beneficiaries with hands off except that the provider be licensed with the state.

Patients should be required to see first a health care counselor or advocate at an intake to plan their year expenditures before a voucher is activated. The counselor/advocate could be an MD, an ND, an LNP or any credentialed administrator approved by the state.

The counseling requirement is subject to abuse by government trying to dictate what, where, who but the counselor will only have authority to counsel on health budgeting and also reviewing a retainer fee provider service agreement and actuarial certification.

The patient will sign a retainer fee contract with a provider but have the right to cancel with 15 day notice.

That’s it, nothing else required by government to impose. Health matters are left to patients and their providers.

“
Sure, James. They would be the party that had singlehandedly passed an unconstitutional law that had to be struck down by the Supreme Court. And that would make them more popular amongst folks who are not Democrats how? And how did the repeal of the Volstead Act enhance the political prospects of the Prohibitionist Party?”

The real question is how does Obama go to the American people and defend the individual mandate? His current defense is already rebuddled not by republicans but by himself in 2008.

Carville is a bit nutty here if he thinks the left is going to rally to the defense of Obamacare. Conservatives are going to campaign against this oppressive monstrous one way or the other. Liberals rallying to its defense just paints a nice clean target on their back.

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