Do you think stalking is as hard to prove as rape?

I watch a lot of Investigation Discovery and they air shows that use to be part of their line up. One that I watch a lot is Obsession: Dark Desire and it's basically about one person becoming obsessed with another. Could be someone they dated or a co-worker or even just someone that passed walking down the street, these people become extremely obsessed.

One thing that's a common running theme though is, when ever the harassment escalates to a extreme level and they go to the police they always say "I'm sorry, there's nothing we can do. Unless they do harm to you, our hands are tied". I mean, that's very messed up. You could have a mountain of evidence but unless they come and attempt to kill you, there's nothing they can do? I think that's wrong.

That's why I titled the question the way I did because rape is a he said/ she said thing and unless there's a way to prove it, it's basically one persons word against another. Which is one of the many reasons much like stalking, no one believes the victim. Which is also wrong.

So, do you think stalking is as hard to prove or take police action against as rape is? And, do you think the rules for those crimes should be amended or changed in any way?

What Girls & Guys Said

Well, there is a good chance to prove rape provided the crime is reported in time and action is taken fast. Rape can be proved by medical tests etc etc, I don't know how exactly it can be proved medically but yes it can be done but the victim has to be strong enough to report the crime in time and have trust and faith in the authorities.

However in comparison to rape, stalking is something that is 10 times more tough to prove unless there is a video recording or someone close to you knows that you are being stalked by that person. If the stalker is very clever to make sure nobody else knows that they are stalking the victim then it can become very tough for the victim to prove that they are being stalked.

This is for real life scenario.

If the stalking is an online thing, then the victim has to save the PM's or anything that the stalker is saying so that there is some sort of proof of being stalked.

In short yes, stalking is much harder to prove. That's what I think about your question, that is my opinion.

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Anonymous

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The thing about stalkers and all of those weirdos, is that a lot of them are really good at hugging the line of inappropriate/illegal, without crossing it. You would be horrified by the amount of information that is available for public to access online. Is that information illegal to know? Of course not, it's just weird that someone would put in the effort to find it out. What's even weirder, is when people start using that information to figure out different things about the person. Super creepy, but again; not illegal.

Using publicly available information to find things out about someone only becomes illegal when they have placed a restraining order against the stalker.

I, for example, know where my ex (who I somewhat care for, but have no interest in being in contact with) works. I found that out, because I was curious about what her family business does one day. I could, in theory, mail her a bunch of stuff. It's a publicly available address, it's not illegal for me to do that. BUT SUPER FREAKING WEIRD

Not as difficult as rape, but pretty close. Many states are getting more strict on stalking. To prove stalking, you have to prove that the stalker has no other reason to be there and you have to be able to have enough documented encounters to prove a pattern. For example, if you shop at the same grocery store then you are out of luck. However, if you suddenly change grocery stores, he pops up and you can prove his routine has not changed otherwise then it is easier to prove. If you want to catch a stalker and have something stick, have someone be with you but not close enough to where the stalker knows that person is with you. Have that person observe your stalker and write down their patterns. Private investigators are specialists at this. Also, if you win the case part of the sentence can be that the stalker has to reimburse you the PI fees.

A rape case can be pretty convincing with DNA evidence and defensive wounds. It’s not hard to prove actual rape. A lot of cases fall apart because the evidence doesn’t support forced sex. With the modified definition of rape as of 2012, it’s one persons word against the other, but eh feminists wanted to make laws ambiguous and to avoid facts so now the smart move is just to deny that you ever had sex with anyone just in case they lied about consent. As far as stalking goes, in general I don’t see it as much of an issue unless someone is making threats to physically harm you and that’s pretty much how the law sees it as well. You just need to learn to ignore people and get on with life.

There are two sides to rape evidence. physical violation and intent. Violation is easily proven via NDA testing of bodily fluids. Intent is a whole other ball game: it usually boils down to a " he-said, she-said" type of deadlock unless there were credible witnesses.

Stalking can be "proven" by simply tailing the stalker and creating a record of his/her actions. However, depending on the governing entity (of the police, constabulary, etc), action may not be taken until there is physical attack (battery). The "stalking" may or may not be at a level where it is considered assault (threat of harm) as opposed to the battery (committing the physical harm).

You missed what it was educating u on be responsible for your self what u do how u conduct your self.. warning signs a. k. a behavior.. is incredibly easy to spot. When people ignore duties to them selves to avoid high risk places. people. and activities.. rough crowd says volumes.. yet compression is low.. so look to your selves weed out unacceptable behavior in your environment or adapt n survive.. my sister smashed her stalker so hard he forgot who she was. Be more conservitive with the way u dress sending sexual signals leads to sexual situations.. play safe

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Anonymous

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I hear what you're saying (from the victim's stand point), however there does need to be solid proof that they can prove it's harassment. Otherwise intentionally innocent people can be charged, and I don't think that's right either. Like you said, one person's word against another and what if that person just doesn't like you and falsely accuses you? So while I agree it's unfortunate that something extreme usually has to happen, I don't know how it could be amended so that people weren't also falsely accused either (potentially). Also, "evidence" can be very circumstantial.

Proving it isn't the bad part. People actually deciding to step up and give a crap about it is the problem. In most cases, unless there's some direct harm or intervention involved, people just brush it aside which isn't seen as a hardship by anyone other than the victim themselves. So ultimately, it's just as hard to prove, albeit since it happens over a longer time, gathering evidence is easier

No. It really isn't. They say things like that because hard evidence is straight up physical than it is intangible. They often make it out as if they don't want assumptions. But its done because they get paid for crimes. Not crime prevention. Crime prevention is costly. And yes, I do believe it should change. Many crimes could have been prevented when your able to take action in a logical manner. Forget unless somebody attempts to kill you. They wait until your dead.

In today's world, rape accusations, from women/against men, are almost instantly believed. In a rape case, if forced penetration occurred they can prove that with an exam. If there is semen, they have DNA. Then all they have to do is point out a guy. If it matches, then it's pretty clear cut. With no DNA they have to corroborate evidence. Which is good. It's much harder for a man to prove rape, and he will almost never be believed.

In stalking cases, most states have stalking laws. If you can prove someone is following you, they can be prosecuted. The easiest is license plate pictures every time you see the car. Or dash cams/security cams. Also, multiple reports raise flags.

I think both are pretty easy to prove if they are for real. I also think people need to report these things when they happen (waiting two weeks doesn't make things easier to prove). The waiting is where people lose credibility.

In the U. S., a number of states now have stalking laws. New York's stalking law reads; "a persistent and unwanted pursuit of an individual by another, that would cause a reasonable person to fear." They don't actually have to harm you to be arrested and charged. I don't know what the laws are like where you are.

Lawyer here: This question doesn't really make sense. Rape is forceful penetration of a penis into an orifice. Basically to prove rape you have to prove there was a sexual act (involving the penis) and that it was unconsentual. It's actually pretty straight forward and easy, it's just that nowadays the media and accusers like to say that if you're drunk, you changed your mind mid-sex, rough sex, got paid for it or regretted it after it then it's also rape...

If someone is stalking you then you need to go to court and get a restraining order based on the evidence you have. If they violate that order THEN the police can do something.

question how come rape is not consider rape if someone shoves items up someone orifices? would that be rape regardless if there no consent? like surely it's rape if I go and shove a spoon up your butt? I don't get why sexual assualt is different from rape but if you commit sexual assualt your a rapist. But sexual assualt is using other things besides a penis to penerate right?

Depends on the country, but mostly its because of the wording of the law.

For example in UK section 1 of the sexual offences act says that rape must be done with a penis. Therefore women cannot rape, they are always charged with sexual assault (though they usually receive the same sentences... In theory)

If a girl shoves a spoon up a guy's butt she is charged with "assault by penetration with an accessory" instead and should carry the same sentence as rape... But legally speaking its not called "rape".

@NatashaJ oh I agree, it really shows how sexist our legal system can be but changing the law is expensive and long. They're not gonna change it if it's not seriously broken. Try convincing old judges that women get lighter sentences than men and that the wording of these laws is probably a factor.

Im thinking tge. Way to get rid of a stalker is to embaress them on social media if the police refuse to do anything with all the proof the minute that person gets caught they will back off and assume they're being investigated not to mention the wvole world will stalk him so whoever it is will most likely quit their shit

You can stalk from far away and not get caught. I had to do it to my ex wife is how I caught her out cheating on me. I was in range for a video camera to make out who it was and who she was with. Then once I got it without her knowing I left. Too easy.

Yeah they're both very hard to prove but I don't rules should be changed. If you're going to try and convict someone of a crime you have to prove they did it. Otherwise it would be very easy for people to say "this person raped / stalked me." And get them locked up whether it's true or not.

If you start alleviating the burden of proof for certain crimes that's gonna be a slippery slope to nowhere good.

Stalking is not rape, but it's not legal. If you can provide with evidence of stalking, start making a log and maybe even pictures. Then it's easier for the police to get an restraint order. But it's not rape. Rape is sexual things done to a person ageinst their will.

Stalking is against a persons will too, no one asks for someone to become obsessed with them. None of these people asked for the person to harass them to the point they are afraid for their lives. Neither of those things are okay in my opinion and they shouldn't be other people either.

It is hard to prove. I’m not a lawyer, so I’m not sure how to fix that.

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Anonymous

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It might be hard to prove per day but do the courts really care the answer is nope same with rape it’s guilty till proven innocent just like that Brett kavanaugh casehttps://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SPH6DMCSC6Q

@Fuentes sorcery/Satanism/santeria etcetera thats all real. I dont know because im not one of them but this YouTube r called ken price knows all about it listen to him. he's black and has glases he knows all about these things.

Only in dreams or in the process of waking up hasn't happen in a few months now, i had a friend who was into witch craft stuff and beleive he was a wiccan i hadn't seen him in a long time abd quit being his friend in highschool so sometimes i wonder if he does anything to stalk or see where im at

@Fuentes these stalking things will get anyone paranoid. To remove negativity evil spirits , wash with sea salt, buy black tourmaline, neodymium rare earth magnets, orgonite piramid or pendant trust me those things work. I used them. I was afraid of these spiritual things and had zero knowledge but i found these items and they work Pass it on good luck😃

That any crime that criminalizes ordinary actions by the PERCEPTION of the victim is a very dangerous law. Such as the lady who was convinced that her mailman was stalking her as he came down ger street almost every day at the same time... He was just doing his job, but her paranoia was just triggered. Now imagine if the police were FORCED to act... It would be a waste of time and resources.