I may send Bob an e-mail with a link to where he can order some Colonblow.
Sounds like he is full of,..........something.:whistling:

:rofl::rofl:

bac1023

07-21-2010, 14:48

So that's two potential customers Bob lost already over this.

In this day and age with communication to hundreds or even thousands of people so easy, these builders have to get it right. In the event they don't, and mistakes happen, they need to go out of their way to correct it quickly.

That was true in the past as well, but only to a small fraction of today. If you got screwed over in the past, you may tell a few, maybe a dozen people. Today, its many times that.

You're right Alan, if it wasn't for these forums, Bob probably would have told you to go pound sand. :upeyes:

HAIL CAESAR

07-21-2010, 14:54

So that's two potential customers Bob lost already over this.

In this day and age with communication to hundreds or even thousands of people so easy, these builders have to get it right. In the event they don't, and mistakes happen, they need to go out of their way to correct it quickly.
Oh, I agree. All I wanted was a working gun that was free of major faults.
That was true in the past as well, but only to a small fraction of today. If you got screwed over in the past, you may tell a few, maybe a dozen people. Today, its many times that.

You're right Alan, if it wasn't for these forums, Bob probably would have told you to go pound sand. :upeyes:

He did tell me to pound sand....till I started posting pics of the gun. Then I got a offer to rebuild the gun.

Tactical black

07-21-2010, 14:55

I want to get a 10mm and they looked like a good candidate but after reading HC post(s) about how great the company is I took them off a list of possibles.

pistolwrench

07-21-2010, 15:04

"In this day and age with communication to hundreds or even thousands of people so easy, these builders have to get it right. In the event they don't, and mistakes happen, they need to go out of their way to correct it quickly."

True stuff.

HAIL CAESAR

07-21-2010, 15:06

To answer what I wouldn't talk about earlier in the thread, last week I sent Bob the annual email about when the gun would ship as he said it would ship last week.
He replied;

Hi Alan,

If you would like a refund. No Problem. I can see you are not

happy and will never be happy with whatever we do..

Just let me know I will have a check sent to you today.

Have a great day..

Let me know if you need any further help,

Thank you,

Bob

Fusion

fusionfirearms.com

607-343-4013

The message came through as I was checking emails and I immediately sent;

Mr. Serva,

Yes, I think a full refund would be fine.

I haven't heard form him since..............

freedom790

07-21-2010, 15:07

So that's two potential customers Bob lost already over this.

Three. I was heavily leaning toward getting a fusion a couple weeks ago until I was turned off by threads like this and hit or miss reviews. My re-enlistment gift to myself was going to be a Fusion Scout Elite, but too much of a gamble to roll the dice on Fusion pistol.

Trey83

07-21-2010, 15:07

I want to get a 10mm and they looked like a good candidate but after reading HC post(s) about how great the company is I took them off a list of possibles.
That's three here on GT alone.

So that's two potential customers Bob lost already over this.

In this day and age with communication to hundreds or even thousands of people so easy, these builders have to get it right. In the event they don't, and mistakes happen, they need to go out of their way to correct it quickly.

That was true in the past as well, but only to a small fraction of today. If you got screwed over in the past, you may tell a few, maybe a dozen people. Today, its many times that.

You're right Alan, if it wasn't for these forums, Bob probably would have told you to go pound sand. :upeyes:
I think we would all agree that it isn't that mistakes were made, though that would be disappointing. It's the fact that Mr. Serva won't correct the mistakes that were made.

Tactical black

07-21-2010, 15:09

He's better off doing that with his quality :rofl::rofl:

So what are you going to buy instead?

faawrenchbndr

07-21-2010, 15:10

....I'm sure Fusion has already lost some potential customers right here on GT.

I'm one of them,........

Tactical black

07-21-2010, 15:11

That's three here on GT alone.

I think we would all agree that it isn't that mistakes were made, though that would be disappointing. It's the fact that Mr. Serva won't correct the mistakes that were made.

I agree if they had made it right and handle it professionally I probably would still consider buying one but the way they handle it was ridiculous. :steamed:

HAIL CAESAR

07-21-2010, 15:11

"In this day and age with communication to hundreds or even thousands of people so easy, these builders have to get it right. In the event they don't, and mistakes happen, they need to go out of their way to correct it quickly."

True stuff.

You know, mistakes do happen. I understand that. ( Don't know how they all happened on one gun..but I digress)

But at first Fusion refused to fix the gun and make it right. Then only when I posted about it on forums that I got an offer to have the gun fixed.

He accused me of dropping the barrels and that is what caused the tool marks......and a lot of other things.

Chuck, you have A WHOLE LOT of experience. Ever seen a barrel that was dropped cause cutter marks? How about a dropped gun causing egg shaped holes in the frame??

faawrenchbndr

07-21-2010, 15:14

To answer what I wouldn't talk about earlier in the thread, last week I sent Bob the annual email about when the gun would ship as he said it would ship last week.
He replied;

Hi Alan,
If you would like a refund. No Problem. I can see you are not
happy and will never be happy with whatever we do..
Just let me know I will have a check sent to you today.

Have a great day..
Let me know if you need any further help,

Thank you,
Bob

Fusion
fusionfirearms.com
607-343-4013

The message came through as I was checking emails and I immediately sent;

Mr. Serva,

Yes, I think a full refund would be fine.
I haven't heard form him since..............

After that,.....I would send him one of my lawyer's business cards.
That would get his attention I am sure!

bac1023

07-21-2010, 15:14

Ever seen a barrel that was dropped cause cutter marks?

:faint:

:animlol:

Trey83

07-21-2010, 15:19

Ever seen a barrel that was dropped cause cutter marks? How about a dropped gun causing egg shaped holes in the frame??

Wow I had better be more careful. I didn't know that dropping a gun could result in the reversal of the manufaturing process.

Here is a pic of a Fusion gun's barrel ramp and frame. Look at the ramp face, frame, and the lower "ears" of the ramp.

The owner was told that it is within quality standards for Fusion.

Now the guy did buy a kit from Fusion, but he paid Fusion extra to have the barrel fitted to the frame and slide so he wouldn't have to do it. Doesn't look very "CUSTOM" to me.

That's horrible. :shocked:

HAIL CAESAR

07-21-2010, 17:52

edit..deleted!!!

Can anyone tell me why my original post keeps reposting?????:rofl:

Ruggles

07-21-2010, 17:54

I may sign up my 12 year old for Mr Serva's 7th grade shop class next year at the Middle School. He may be working on your next pistol...or fixing this one in 1st period before French class.

Forget your son, I just decided after seeing that pic that I can be a custom 1911 maker too!

Not taking orders with a 87% down payment of course :)

Base model $2800, we will work the details out after I receive your payment.

Let me know if anyone is interested!

glock2740

07-21-2010, 18:06

It couldn't be any worse than the last one.:rofl:
Hopefully this one will be as I ordered, work, and not look like a baboon Dremeled a RIA.

And thanks.
Hey. A well trained baboon can do some mean work with a dremel. :rofl:
I hope your new gun turns out top notch. I like the Fusions that I've seen. Never have got to shoot one, but they seem like really nice guns.

HAIL CAESAR

07-21-2010, 18:11

Hey. A well trained baboon can do some mean work with a dremel. :rofl:
I hope your new gun turns out top notch. I like the Fusions that I've seen. Never have to shoot one, but they seem like really nice guns.

Well..the replacement gun is 5 months overdue. Finally Fusion offered to send out a refund check that day and I jumped all over it. That was last week.

Haven't heard hide nor hair from him since................

faawrenchbndr

07-21-2010, 18:17

Personally,........I will NEVER buy so much as a grip screw from Bob Serva after this BS!
I believe Bob should go back to something a bit easier for him to deal with.
Is IBM still in business? Wonder if he could get his old job back?!:whistling:

bac1023

07-21-2010, 18:20

Well..the replacement gun is 5 months overdue. Finally Fusion offered to send out a refund check that day and I jumped all over it. That was last week.

Haven't heard hide nor hair from him since................

That's really poor business. :shakehead:

HAIL CAESAR

07-21-2010, 18:24

That's really poor business. :shakehead:

I don't know what to say anymore......

It's a bad deal. I wonder if I'm getting a gun, a check,....or neither.

bac1023

07-21-2010, 18:49

I don't know what to say anymore......

It's a bad deal. I wonder if I'm getting a gun, a check,....or neither.

You better get one of them in short order.

We can make life pretty damn miserable for him over on the 1911 boards.

This is BS :steamed:

HAIL CAESAR

07-21-2010, 18:54

You better get one of them in short order.

We can make life pretty damn miserable for him over on the 1911 boards.

This is BS :steamed:

Most posts that are unfriendly to Fusion get (poofed).

Guess being a paid industry sponsor has a few perks.

bac1023

07-21-2010, 19:19

Most posts that are unfriendly to Fusion get (poofed).

Guess being a paid industry sponsor has a few perks.

Yeah, that sucks.

PMs work too though. ;)

Hopefully, he comes through on your refund and you won't have to deal with that idiot again.

After getting a PM from HC detailing the emails he sent.... the NICEST thing I can say is that Fusion just plain blows donkeys.

Shipwreck-The-Sequel

07-22-2010, 12:17

Man, I came so close to ordering from them on 2 seperate occassions - from quotes I had gotten for different builds...

I am glad I didn't.

When I was deciding which way to go a couple of years ago, I dredged up old threads on every site I could find.... I initially skipped Ed Brown and ordered my Custom Shop Springer because of an Ed Brown problem I personally knew about - my local shop had a guy have a problem with his brand new Kobra Karry - and Ed Brown treated him rather crappily. My shop no longer carries Browns because of that incident.

However - after looking at more and more awesome pics of Brown 1911s - I took a chance and got one anyway, about a year later. It all worked out well.

But, incidents like this DO cost customers. It is unfortunate when someone gets this type of service.

Please let us know when all this gets resolved.

BlayGlock

07-22-2010, 12:57

Sorry about so long on the 7 weeks thing.

I ordered a SS slide stop and thumb safety and a set of adjustable fiber optic sights that would just fit into a 70 series GI slide. The order arrived with a note saying that the sights were back ordered. Three weeks go by and I make first contact about them, wait several days, call again and finally talk to somebody over there who says they are still not in stock. Two more weeks go by and I make contact again, and did not hear anything back. Two more weeks go by and I finally send Mr. Serva an email asking for him to rectify the situation. He contacted me back saying they did not have those in stock anymore and refunded my credit card. They were pleasent enough, but I had a hard time getting in contact with anyone there.

Well good luck, Hail I hope you get things worked out with the man, and either get your gun or the money:thumbsup:

Hokie1911

07-22-2010, 14:49

After getting a PM from HC detailing the emails he sent.... the NICEST thing I can say is that Fusion just plain blows donkeys.

I think that's the general consensus at this point. Mr Serva, by my count, has lost at least a half-dozen builds (maybe more) from the regular fellas that lurk in here, not including any other forums.

usurp31

07-22-2010, 14:52

It's a tough call; I think all of them can put out a bad product and this particular incident has been a pain for HC for sure. I personally won't rule them out though as I do like some of their products and there have been plenty of people who have been happy with their Fusions as well.

HAIL CAESAR

07-22-2010, 14:54

There is a lot of people that are really happy with their Fusion guns. Unfortunately some haven't even gotten them yet.

HAIL CAESAR

07-22-2010, 14:56

And I have not heard one gunsmith, not even one, say one good thing about Fusion.

bac1023

07-22-2010, 14:57

And I have not heard one gunsmith, not even one, say one good thing about Fusion.

Not a good sign at all.

HAIL CAESAR

07-22-2010, 15:03

Not a good sign at all.

No, it isn't.

I should have known better...and listened to others.:brickwall:

Brian when I get up your way I'll stop over. I owe you a free shot, head or gut, it's your choice.

Then we can talk guns.:wavey:

usurp31

07-22-2010, 15:03

bac, I thought you had a Fusion that you liked or am I thinking of a person with a similar screen name? By the way I just noticed you have over 42,000 posts! Holy cow Batman.

bac1023

07-22-2010, 15:23

bac, I thought you had a Fusion that you liked or am I thinking of a person with a similar screen name?

I do like my Fusion. I've always said its a nice production quality 1911. Its not a custom or semi custom gun, despite what people think. You can customize them to whatever you want, but quality and fitting is that of a production gun, nothing more.

http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu81/ollituc/000_2477.jpg

http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu81/ollituc/000_2482.jpg

Now, mine is an early Fusion, built shortly after they were founded. It seems like QC has really taken a severe turn for the worst lately.

If I had gotten anything like Alan did, I would have made sure I detracted a many people as possible on buying them.

bac1023

07-22-2010, 15:33

By the way I just noticed you have over 42,000 posts! Holy cow Batman.

Yeah, isn't that nuts? :headscratch:

:animlol:

DRAGON1970

07-22-2010, 15:35

After getting a PM from HC detailing the emails he sent.... the NICEST thing I can say is that Fusion just plain blows donkeys.

:rofl:

CMG

07-22-2010, 15:39

bac, ... By the way I just noticed you have over 42,000 posts! Holy cow Batman.

But only 39 without pics!

:rofl:

bac1023

07-22-2010, 15:40

But only 39 without pics!

:rofl:

:rofl::rofl:

Maybe so :whistling:

GJ1981

07-22-2010, 17:11

I never saw the big deal with Fusion honestly. I have never seen one in person but the photos online weren't anything special, IMO. After reading through this post I can say without a doubt I would never consider buying one, new or used.

98_1LE

07-22-2010, 17:26

I have an early Fusion, considerably lower S/N than bac's :tongueout: even, which is fit better than the Les Baer TRC I owned. I don't have much experience in the way of high end 1911's to compare it to, but am incredibly satisfied. And at this point, would be leery of ordering another.

bac1023

07-22-2010, 18:06

Brian when I get up your way I'll stop over. I owe you a free shot, head or gut, it's your choice.

Then we can talk guns.:wavey:

Hey, I always have time for gun talk. :)

My Fusion is decent from a production gun standpoint. I just never thought they were anything special, as some others do.

That said, mine was built when Bob still cared. Its obvious that he's checked out. :dunno:

bac1023

07-22-2010, 18:08

I have an early Fusion, considerably lower S/N than bac's :tongueout: even, which is fit better than the Les Baer TRC I owned. I don't have much experience in the way of high end 1911's to compare it to, but am incredibly satisfied. And at this point, would be leery of ordering another.

Seems like the early ones were best.

Quack

07-22-2010, 18:20

Seems like the early ones were best.

that's what happens when production/demand goes up.

so how long until you think Bob sells Fusion and starts another new company?

bac1023

07-22-2010, 18:24

so how long until you think Bob sells Fusion and starts another new company?

At this rate, not long.

Hopefully, he does right by Alan first.

HAIL CAESAR

07-22-2010, 20:48

I saw some early Fusion's. Which is what I made my decision on. They were pretty decent guns. So I was thinking the newer ones were even better.....I was wrong. The pre-2009 guns are the best ones they made.

Even Bob Serva has said some things are "how we make them now".

This was a pic that he commented on that is how we make them...
http://i390.photobucket.com/albums/oo349/hailcaesar_photos/Fusionchamber.jpg

jethro21

07-22-2010, 21:04

My RIA GI and compact don't have tool marks like that....

Quack

07-22-2010, 21:48

And people are saying the Remington machine marks are bad..

faawrenchbndr

07-22-2010, 21:53

'Caesar,........I saw the thread on that popular 1911 forun was closed.
Guess Serva got it locked? I know he has been on here before,........
I find it amazing that he has not atempted to explain.

sumdude0011

07-22-2010, 21:58

not to get off subject, but has anyone here built a fusion 1911 from one of their parts kits? How's the quality of the parts? Will it take two years to get them? I'm seriously thinking about building next instead of buying, so should I keep an eye on this company or look elsewhere?

faawrenchbndr

07-22-2010, 22:07

After reading this thread, I'd suggest you look into Caspian!:whistling:

Quack

07-22-2010, 22:31

Skip fusion and get a kit from Caspian, STI, Wilson.

faawrenchbndr

07-22-2010, 22:35

Skip fusion and get a kit from Caspian, STI, Wilson.

Can you still get a Les Baer frame/slide?

CMG

07-22-2010, 22:42

Like I told Alan in a PM regarding Fusion's lack of empathy for his pistol's obvious issues:

A shame, as they could just do things right the first time, and have a nice business going!

not to get off subject, but has anyone here built a fusion 1911 from one of their parts kits? How's the quality of the parts? Will it take two years to get them? I'm seriously thinking about building next instead of buying, so should I keep an eye on this company or look elsewhere?

You ought to read this thread. This guy got a kit and it is a mess. Read his Blog too as there have been several things go astray.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=277951

He has a link to his blog in his posts.

Alan

beltjones

07-22-2010, 23:16

Hey, this is the same guy from 1911forum with the screen name "Chimono" from the link HAIL CAESAR posted above.

As you can see from my blog (if you care to look, lol), I'm a died-in-the-wool Glock aficionado. I have the Glock 17 I bought in 1999 - the G17 I'm going to make IDPA master with before the end of the year - on my lap as I type this.

Anyway, I'll lead off with one point: Serva sold Dan Wesson to CZ. Or more appropriately, CZ bought the Dan Wesson brand from Serva. I'll tell you one thing that is certain - hardly an acquisition goes down where the company being acquired is well-managed. It just doesn't happen. Almost as a rule, one of the ways the acquiring company sees value in the deal is via an improvement in management. That ought to tell you something about Dan Wesson pre-CZ, and Fusion now.

MD357

07-23-2010, 00:06

Dan Wesson (pre-cz) had some issues with some proprietary crap. They are leaps and bounds better now.

CMG

07-23-2010, 01:19

Dan Wesson (pre-cz) had some issues with some proprietary crap. They are leaps and bounds better now.

+1 :cool:

okie

07-23-2010, 01:34

Don't guess I will be buyin a Fusion, none to soon:alex::faint:

beltjones

07-23-2010, 05:48

Dan Wesson (pre-cz) had some issues with some proprietary crap. They are leaps and bounds better now.

Exactly. CZ saw that they could increase the value of the brand/company by getting rid of Serva, so they bought him out. It's one of the most common stories in business mergers and acquisitions.

Glocked-N-Loaded

07-23-2010, 06:40

Don't guess I will be buyin a Fusion, none to soon:alex::faint:

No doubts! HC, that suck's buddy and hopefully you hear something, anything, soon. I talked with Bob once about a custom order on a 9mm bobtail. Seemed like a real pleasant and passionate guy and I was seriously considering purchasing one. This story and several others I have read have definitely changed my position and I will most certainly not be purchasing a $1200-1400 1911 from Fusion. It would appear by all accounts that indeed Bob has checked out. I like to research my purchases and read reviews from people that actually have them in hand and have not been compensated like gun rags, this is a perfect example of why that research is so beneficial.

2c5s

07-23-2010, 09:01

I own an April of 08 Fusion Scout in 10mm. I had some minor issues after delivery, nothing major, but enough for me to scratch my head on how QC missed them. All in all, a well fit and functioning pistol. Then slowly but surely, threads started to pop up concerning major QC issues, guns that would not run, wrong orders, out the door wait times....... Well, since 4/08, I've since purchased four other 1911 style pistols. NONE of them from Fusion.

I've read glowing reviews from people claiming Serva is a champ on the phone with questions etc. I never got that impression. From the sounds of it, my Fusion is going to become a poorly desired collectors item. :rofl::rofl:

HAIL CAESAR

07-25-2010, 13:28

Just an update.

No gun, no money.

Per posts on TOS, Bob Serva has never heard of Chuck Rogers or Bob Rodgers, and a promise to show how they hard fit all there Drop-In (match barrels). Hopefully they will show how they test fire short chambered guns. And all target guns have a 2.5 inch guarantee at 50 yards.

bac1023

07-25-2010, 13:51

Just an update.

No gun, no money.

:faint:

When I saw the thread pop back up, I thought you were finally going to report some good news.

This is nuts.

Hokie1911

07-25-2010, 14:29

:faint:

When I saw the thread pop back up, I thought you were finally going to report some good news.

This is nuts.

Yeah, I was thinking it was the "finally...a resolution" post.

98_1LE

07-25-2010, 14:43

What is TOS?

CMG

07-25-2010, 14:48

The used-car salesman over there probably never thought you'd accept the refund... who'd take their money back over such a fine product as they offer? :upeyes:

I suspect you'll get another pistol, but I'd be really surprised if it was "right"!

faawrenchbndr

07-25-2010, 14:49

Just an update.

No gun, no money.

Per posts on TOS, Bob Serva has never heard of Chuck Rogers or Bob Rodgers, and a promise to show how they hard fit all there Drop-In (match barrels). Hopefully they will show how they test fire short chambered guns. And all target guns have a 2.5 inch guarantee at 50 yards.

Wow,.....what an azzhat, and a liar!
There is not way he could convince me he had not heard of & seen Chuck Rogers or Bob Rodgers work!
He only WISHES he had come up with the "Golf Ball" treatment,......as do others.

faawrenchbndr

07-25-2010, 14:50

What is TOS?

The Other Site? :dunno:

bac1023

07-25-2010, 14:51

The Other Site? :dunno:

I believe so.

HAIL CAESAR

07-25-2010, 14:55

The other site. 1911 forum.

faawrenchbndr

07-25-2010, 16:52

The other site. 1911 forum.

Seems he can do no wrong over there,........:dunno:
Oh, thee of little knowledge! :faint:

Texas Bulldog

07-25-2010, 17:19

sigh... nevermind. not worth it

faawrenchbndr

07-25-2010, 17:22

sigh... nevermind. not worth it

Saw you posted a pic then removed it.
Was that a Taurus? :dunno:

HAIL CAESAR

07-25-2010, 17:44

wow, quite the circle jerk going on...

Same guys bashing fusion. Im not saying what happened is right, but i think HC is simply a nightmare to deal with. Take for example the feed ramp pic of the gun that isn't even his. He leads you to believe that it was his gun, someone even asks if they sold you a used gun.... then those pics are "Enhanced" by HC which make it look worse than the original pic. I don't know anything about the other guy's post in the 1911 forum for guns smithing but typical HC fashion, he joins in a bashes another thread until it closes.

I wish Fusion would cut you a check, I for one am sick of hearing you and i know i am not alone. You will go anywhere you can get an ear to listen and moan.

my .02c and i don't care what anyone thinks of it.

Well, first.

I never said that the guy with the messed up frame and barrel was me, not did I say the pics were mine. He has even posted here, and I linked the thread to which peolple were discussing his pistol in one of my post.

I did not alter his pic. I got the pic from a pic he posted on the thread and blew it up and lightened it to see it better....with his permission.

Anyone here can do the same. Just save it and lighten it up to see the results yourself. I just have LightRoom 2.1 so it is a bit easier for me.

I did not change the photo other than adjusting the exposure. If you think I "Photoshoped" it, you are wrong. The pic sizes were only 60k'ish. They are much to small to do any type of "Enhancing" to fake a pic. (At least to poor an image to do anything that a 3rd grader couldn't tell.)

Here are the pics Chimano/BeltJones posted on the other site. You can use this link and see the originals he posted. You can go to it here.http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=277951

You can clearly see that his pics and the ones I lightened and cropped are the same.

I wish I would get a check, but I think it is off at IonBond.:whistling:

Hokie1911

07-25-2010, 17:56

sigh... nevermind. not worth it

If you're so sick of his problems with Fusion, then why do you keep coming into a thread he started.... ummmmm, about Fusion....and making useless comments bashing Alan? Get over yourself bro and move on. You like Fusion... good for you. You got a good Fusion build....even better. Don't come in here threadcrapping and demeaning him for keeping the rest of informed about his issues. I, for one, was about to send in a deposit on a bobtail, and I'm glad I didn't. For those of us that have been around here for a while, we actually appreciate the insight and knowledge that guys like Alan bring to the forum. There are plenty of other threads you can waste bandwidth in....or better yet...go hang out in 1911forum or wherever else you lurk.

HAIL CAESAR

07-25-2010, 18:02

If you're so sick of his problems with Fusion, then why do you keep coming into a thread he started.... ummmmm, about Fusion....and making useless comments bashing Alan? Get over yourself bro and move on. You like Fusion... good for you. You got a good Fusion build....even better. Don't come in here bashing him for keeping the rest of informed about his issues. I, for one, was about to send in a deposit on a bobtail, and I'm glad I didn't. For those of us that have been around here for a while, we actually appreciate the insight and knowledge that guys like Alan bring to the forum. There are plenty of other threads you can waste bandwidth in....or better yet...go hang out in 1911forum or wherever else you lurk.

Thanks Hokie and the rest.

I am not saying that every gun Fusion puts out is a train wreck, just saying mine was. Also I am saying I am not alone in this world.

Here is a PM I got from a guy.

This is completely off the record. I do not want to take anything public at this point.

First the wait was quoted 12 to 16 weeks and it turned into 37. No biggie, just frustrating.

When it arrived:
The first thing I noticed was the severly underfit thumb safety. Horribly fit and no-functional.
Next:
My build sheet specified "slide stop cut short and frame countersunk" Bob shipped it without these features.
And...
The trigger was absolute garbage. (verified by a gunsmith on this forum) He had worse things to say...

How did it shoot you ask?

It wouldn't. The weapon chambered a round ok, but would not eject or feed... anything, ever.........
Turns out the barrel was throated terribly...

Again, please do not "out" me~
I will simply NEVER buy another Fusion pistol, frame or part.

Thorazine

07-25-2010, 18:12

So that's two potential customers Bob lost already over this.

Bob lost my business a while ago.

A couple simple questions were overlooked multiple times in a few emails sent to him.

He dodged them I guess?

Or there were just beneath him as I am a nineteen eleven newbie.

HAIL CAESAR

07-25-2010, 18:13

Oh, and by the way. I talked to the smith that fixed the gun for the gentleman above. (printed in red).
It was a wreck too. He verified everything said above. He also said that he has had several Fusions on his bench for the exact same issues..short chambered, not throated, thumb safeties just beat into the gun, terrible fit or non-working grip safety, wrong feed ramp geometry, and so on.

Of the other smiths I have talked too, there experiance is the same. Most refuse to work on them any longer.

faawrenchbndr

07-25-2010, 18:21

Guess it's like in the aircraft business,.......
It REALLY sux to have to fix someone's screw ups! :honkie:

bac1023

07-25-2010, 18:22

Obviously, Texas Bulldog is either Bob Serva's friend or works for the company. What Fusion did to Alan is totally unacceptable. That said, as bad as it is, we wouldn't be talking about it if that idiot would just give him a refund. :steamed:

Hokie is right, its best if you stay out of this thread.

As far as Fusion is concerned, I've stated my opinion for years now that says they're nothing special. Sure I like mine, but its the equivilant of a decent production gun, nothing more. If mine was delivered anything like Alan's, you can bet I'd be warning as many people as possible to stay away from them.

Bob deserves to lose business over his treatment of Alan and others. If this thread helps to do that, I think it should be a sticky. :dunno:

HAIL CAESAR

07-25-2010, 18:27

Thank you Brian. It does help sometimes thanks to all you fellas support.:yawn:

I still haven't forgotten that I owe you one. Have you decided if your going to hit me in the gut or the head??:supergrin:

MD357

07-25-2010, 18:43

HAVE YOU EVER BUILT A 1911!!!???

:supergrin:

exact same issues..short chambered, not throated, thumb safeties just beat into the gun, terrible fit or non-working grip safety, wrong feed ramp geometry, and so on.

Funny thing is, I talked to my pistolsmith just yesterday about our PMs, he said he had the exact same thing happen with a guy that brought one in to him earlier this year. Now Flipper says he's a moron so who knows. :dunno:

Shipwreck-The-Sequel

07-25-2010, 19:00

I have noticed that whenever you post something negative about one of the semi custom makers - people come out of the woodwork to attack you.

A couple of years or so, I reported about a major headache a local guy had when he bought a Brown at my local gunshop (I later met the guy online and he kept me updated via PM)... I got attacked by guys for no reason. I now have a Brown myself, and I do love the gun. But, that doesn't invalidate the crappy treatment this guy got as well as the gun store (the store doesn't even sell Browns anymore because of this).

Around that time, when people posted complaints about their nighthawks - they got the same treatment - their beloved NH company couldn't possibly have messed up.. And if they did, you weren't supposed to talk about it. The same goes for LEs Baer and the other builders too... This is on the two 1911 forum websites.

It really gets nauseating..

I did see someone mention this thread on one of the 1911 forums, and made fun of it... I assume this guy came over to stir the pot.

I am a big time 1911 fan, and I love my Ed Brown and Custom Springfield. But, it seems that out of all the brands and complaints about different gun companies... The 1911 fans seem to make it a religion if you say anything bad about their fav brand....

CMG

07-25-2010, 19:09

I wish Fusion would cut you a check...

I'll bet Alan wishes the same! The problem is, it's unlikely to happen with the used-car salesman in charge.

Oh, and have a safe trip back to where honest disappointment isn't allowed, so long as the manufacturer pays their money. :upeyes:

MD357

07-25-2010, 19:20

I'll bet Alan wishes the same! The problem is, it's unlikely to happen with the used-car salesman in charge.

Oh, and have a safe trip back to where honest disappointment isn't allowed, so long as the manufacturer pays their money. :upeyes:

That got locked in a split second. I was watching that thread. It stayed up for hours, then minutes after Bob Serva got logged in...2 threads were closed. :whistling:

I need to donate a sack of money so I can have my own unchecked advertising site.

faawrenchbndr

07-25-2010, 19:34

Karma will come around and kick Serva right square in the jimi!

Hang in there Alan, I would have lost my flippin mind if I were in your shoes!
This shows a lot about your charachter as well as Serva's!

MD357

07-25-2010, 19:38

I have to say I don't know who chuck even is...I can tell you that Vernon Harrison called on Friday and told us our pistols are the best her has ever seen that have come though hi academy and now he has to have one for his carry gun.... And I guess if he doesn't like our parts he must not like most of the custom makers parts... Because many of them are all the same.....Anyway... Grip screws are one of our best sellers....http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gifhttp://www.glocktalk.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif He is missing out....

......................:faint:

Cerebrus

07-25-2010, 19:44

I cant even find that thread on TOS.. nice pot stirring HC..:whistling:
Altho I must admit you are handling this way better than I would be..
just my .02

bac1023

07-25-2010, 20:09

Thank you Brian. It does help sometimes thanks to all you fellas support.:yawn:

I still haven't forgotten that I owe you one. Have you decided if your going to hit me in the gut or the head??:supergrin:

:animlol:

Don't mention it, my friend.

Fusion was doing better at the time of that huge discussion. Obviously, things went downhill there. I never thought they were great, but they were decent.

Now, they aren't even decent. :shocked: I'm sure they still build some good stuff, but the QC is a joke and the man in charge is a fraud.

BlayGlock

07-25-2010, 22:21

After visiting several other 1911 forums and see what is going on and how they treat folks Ive got to say that this is my favorite 1911 forum. Lot of asshats out there, especially at 1911 auto.

HAIL CAESAR

07-25-2010, 22:28

:animlol:

Don't mention it, my friend.

It means a lot..to me. I appreciate all the support!!! Right now being able to talk about it to you fellas is the only think keeping me sane.

After visiting several other 1911 forums and see what is going on and how they treat folks Ive got to say that this is my favorite 1911 forum. Lot of asshats out there, especially at 1911 auto.

This is a great forum. We may not know it all, have it all, seen it all, sometimes we fight, use big boy language, and kid around insensibly,.....but this is still the nicest place around.

BlayGlock

07-25-2010, 22:46

This is a great forum. We may not know it all, have it all, seen it all, sometimes we fight, use big boy language, and kid around insensibly,.....but this is still the nicest place around.

I agree. Its kind of like Cheers around here. Or Happry Days. Hookie is The Fonz.

bac1023

07-26-2010, 04:03

This is a great forum. We may not know it all, have it all, seen it all, sometimes we fight, use big boy language, and kid around insensibly,.....but this is still the nicest place around.

Agreed.

This is the best 1911 or gun forum on the web, in my opinion.

faawrenchbndr

07-26-2010, 06:28

After visiting several other 1911 forums and see what is going on and how they treat folks Ive got to say that this is my favorite 1911 forum. Lot of asshats out there, especially at 1911 auto.

I'm on two 1911 forums,......I do 50 times more reading than posting on those.

Hokie1911

07-26-2010, 07:41

I agree. Its kind of like Cheers around here. Or Happry Days. Hookie is The Fonz.

Hookie? Sweet, hopefully that's pre-jumping the shark. :whistling:

Tactical black

07-26-2010, 07:51

I agree. Its kind of like Cheers around here. Or Happry Days. Hookie is The Fonz.

Well, duh....I thought ALL Fusions came with that personal guarantee from Mr Serva.

I just remember PBP arguing in a thread a while back with someone about how his smithwork was as good as the top smiths around.

Here's the post were he claims his base colt emory cloth and $100 to $200 in parts and he can make his gun perform as well as any semi custom gun. :rofl::rofl:

That might be true of your Colts, but...give me a base Colt, a few pieces of emory cloth, and a budget of about $100-$200 for parts and I will have the Colt performing equally as well and any "custom" maker on the market for a whole lot less investment. Give me a few hours with my beadblaster and you will not even be able to tell the finishes apart.

As for warranty and fit. Colt will replace any gun with no questions asked if it is defective. I have experienced that myself firsthand...and fit does not come much better than this example below (which is my Colt Commander).

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r89/PlayboyPenguin/SlideFit2.jpg

Hokie1911

07-27-2010, 07:09

Here's the post were he claims his base colt emory cloth and $100 to $200 in parts and he can make his gun perform as well as any semi custom gun. :rofl::rofl:

HAHAHHAHAHHA. That's it! That was a great thread.

Tactical black

07-27-2010, 07:13

HAHAHHAHAHHA. That's it! That was a great thread.

The funny thing is I ended up buying two colt's but I plan to send them both off to competent gun smiths not to some ghey clown with emory cloth...:rofl::rofl:

Hokie1911

07-27-2010, 07:20

The funny thing is I ended up buying two colt's but I plan to send them both off to competent gun smiths not to some ghey clown with emory cloth...:rofl::rofl:

:animlol:

2c5s

07-27-2010, 10:06

He just finished your Fusion and is just waiting for FedEx to pick it up.

http://www.hoosiergunworks.com/images/taurus_rusted_busted.jpg

OMG, you owe me a new keyboard for that pic!!

2c5s

07-27-2010, 10:12

HC, I can't fathom Serva not sending you a check after he asked if you want a refund. I guess he's showing you exactly what happens when someone calls them out on their crappy work. It's a real shame you have to go through this crap. I don't know how that guy sleeps at night! The only word that comes to mind is: loser!!

beltjones

07-27-2010, 13:11

HC, I can't fathom Serva not sending you a check after he asked if you want a refund. I guess he's showing you exactly what happens when someone calls them out on their crappy work. It's a real shame you have to go through this crap. I don't know how that guy sleeps at night! The only word that comes to mind is: loser!!

The key is calling them out on it. It's typical narcissistic behavior. It seems that if you'll continue to kiss Bob's ass, he will at least continue to deal with you. If you harm his sense of self by publicly showing his mistakes, he shuts down.

There is NO reason for Alan's replacement gun to have taken so long - especially considering we saw on the forums weekly pictures of other customers finished guns that were going out the door. Bob obviously sat on Alan's gun because his feelings were hurt.

In my case, even when we were having contentious email exchanges, he would at least respond. As soon as I posted a few pictures of his work he stopped responding to my emails.

From the get-go, I told Bob that due to my work schedule I could only reliably correspond with him via email. That was very clearly communicated. As soon as I posted the thread on the 1911forum.com gunsmithing forum, he told me to call him, and FusionDave started PMing me, saying that they really only wanted to talk with me on the phone. Did they want to say things to me that I couldn't cut and paste into the forum, or did they insist on a phone call knowing that I wouldn't be able to call them (and therefore, they could take the blame off of themselves for the fact that no one is communicating)? I can't say.

Hokie1911

07-27-2010, 13:23

My whole beef with the situation is how it was handled. A pistol went out with some QC issues. It happens to EVERY manufacturer. Where I would be unhappy with it happening to me, I would understand and you deal with it. What is BS though is how it was handled when Alan alerted Bob/Fusion of the issues. For them to deny problems, blame him, and the time frame this is taking is absolutely freaking ridiculous. This should have been resolved MONTHS AGO, or a full refund promptly given.

faawrenchbndr

07-27-2010, 13:24

At this point,......I'd buy a Taurus before a Fusion!:whistling:

Serva is acting like a spoiled little brat 6 year old.
He's dragging this out because someone pointed out his lack of perfection.

Hmmm you would think that Bob would want to send a corrected pistol out right away. Just for the soul reason that HC is making such a big stink out of it. If HC gets the new gun and all is ok I am sure that HC will post more pics and some praise for Alan finally fixing the problem and therefore restoring fusions name. :dunno:

faawrenchbndr

07-27-2010, 14:15

Hail Caesar IS Alan.

Bob Serva is the crooked bastage behind Fusion.

Hokie1911

07-27-2010, 14:19

So THAT'S what the holdup is. Alan just needs to fix it and all will be well. :rofl:

faawrenchbndr

07-27-2010, 14:20

So THAT'S what the holdup is. Alan just needs to fix it and all will be well. :rofl:

I wonder if it CAN be fixed?! :dunno:

SouthpawShootr

07-27-2010, 15:53

Have you noticed Bob's : "We want to thank all of our good customers..." post, and then the moderator's: "Do Not Post Any Grievances Here" at the top of each 1911 manufacturer's subforum?

I hadn't seen the moderators post. Ridiculous. If I'm thinking of buying a gun, especially an expensive so-called semi-custom job, I want to know if people have beefs with the 'smith. One report I might be inclined to dismiss as an isolated circumstance. Two, I'm starting to get butterflies. Half dozen or so, I just crossed the guy off my list. Most important is how the 'smith or manufacturer handles the problem. If I see something like: "let's talk about this" or "send if back and let me fix it," then I'm inclined to give the guy points. Followed by a glowing report of how well the problem has actually been fixed restores my faith. Comments like: "somebody has been enjoying his chemistry set too much" and the like towards a customer who's unhappy makes me go elsewhere with my money.

Hokie1911

07-27-2010, 15:57

I hadn't seen the moderators post. Ridiculous. If I'm thinking of buying a gun, especially an expensive so-called semi-custom job, I want to know if people have beefs with the 'smith. One report I might be inclined to dismiss as an isolated circumstance. Two, I'm starting to get butterflies. Half dozen or so, I just crossed the guy off my list. Most important is how the 'smith or manufacturer handles the problem. If I see something like: "let's talk about this" or "send if back and let me fix it," then I'm inclined to give the guy points. Followed by a glowing report of how well the problem has actually been fixed restores my faith. Comments like: "somebody has been enjoying his chemistry set too much" and the like towards a customer who's unhappy makes me go elsewhere with my money.

Exactly. Why do people ALWAYS rant about how good Springfield's CS is? Because they obviously have had problems (as any maker inevitably will) and they do not hesitate to make it right.

SouthpawShootr

07-27-2010, 16:09

As soon as I posted the thread on the 1911forum.com gunsmithing forum, he told me to call him, and FusionDave started PMing me, saying that they really only wanted to talk with me on the phone. Did they want to say things to me that I couldn't cut and paste into the forum, or did they insist on a phone call knowing that I wouldn't be able to call them (and therefore, they could take the blame off of themselves for the fact that no one is communicating)?

That's usually the case. I've found that many, many people postively will not communicate via email. It has nothing to do with how tech-savy somebody is. Absolutely nothing to do with customer service, building a rapport or any of the usual drivel used to justify a phone call only policy. They don't want to have something they have written used against them or used in a criticism of their position. I come across it all the time at work. It's more efficient to communicate via email. Unless you're a poor writer, there is little room for misunderstanding and you can have something printed out for reference if something is hazy. What's not to like about it?:dunno:

Hokie1911

07-27-2010, 16:12

That's usually the case. I've found that many, many people postively will not communicate via email. It has nothing to do with how tech-savy somebody is. Absolutely nothing to do with customer service, building a rapport or any of the usual drivel used to justify a phone call only policy. They don't want to have something they have written used against them or used in a criticism of their position. I come across it all the time at work. It's more efficient to communicate via email. Unless you're a poor writer, there is little room for misunderstanding and you can have something printed out for reference if something is hazy. What's not to like about it?:dunno:

THAT, my friend...is called a paper trail. That leads to accountability....which obviously Mr Serva and his company have/want none of.

98_1LE

07-27-2010, 16:32

My whole beef with the situation is how it was handled. A pistol went out with some QC issues. It happens to EVERY manufacturer. Where I would be unhappy with it happening to me, I would understand and you deal with it. What is BS though is how it was handled when Alan alerted Bob/Fusion of the issues. For them to deny problems, blame him, and the time frame this is taking is absolutely freaking ridiculous. This should have been resolved MONTHS AGO, or a full refund promptly given.
This is where I am at. I am a satisfied Fusion customer, but am elated that I did not have issues. I would love to let someone that can shoot, or better yet ransom rest, my Fusion.

But, I must point out something, right wrong or otherwise, I learned the hard way long ago on performance car message boards. That is resolve your issue with a vendor before slamming them on the Internet, or sharing much of the experience. Your odds of a successful resolution are greatly better this way, IMnsHO.

Quack

07-27-2010, 16:42

The key is calling them out on it. It's typical narcissistic behavior. It seems that if you'll continue to kiss Bob's ass, he will at least continue to deal with you. If you harm his sense of self by publicly showing his mistakes, he shuts down.

There is NO reason for Alan's replacement gun to have taken so long - especially considering we saw on the forums weekly pictures of other customers finished guns that were going out the door. Bob obviously sat on Alan's gun because his feelings were hurt.

In my case, even when we were having contentious email exchanges, he would at least respond. As soon as I posted a few pictures of his work he stopped responding to my emails.

From the get-go, I told Bob that due to my work schedule I could only reliably correspond with him via email. That was very clearly communicated. As soon as I posted the thread on the 1911forum.com gunsmithing forum, he told me to call him, and FusionDave started PMing me, saying that they really only wanted to talk with me on the phone. Did they want to say things to me that I couldn't cut and paste into the forum, or did they insist on a phone call knowing that I wouldn't be able to call them (and therefore, they could take the blame off of themselves for the fact that no one is communicating)? I can't say.

Should've called and put out a Mel Gibson tape on the net :rofl:

faawrenchbndr

07-27-2010, 16:44

98_1LE

Ger with 'Caesar,.......he has a paper trail a mile long, BEFORE, this thread was started.
Promises were made by Serva, to fix, and then to refund purchase price.
Serva has failed on all promises thus far.

Hokie1911

07-27-2010, 17:35

98_1LE

Ger with 'Caesar,.......he has a paper trail a mile long, BEFORE, this thread was started.
Promises were made by Serva, to fix, and then to refund purchase price.
Serva has failed on all promises thus far.

http://www.ginside.com/content/2008/05/google-search-epic-fail.jpg

...but not your Fusion. :rofl:

faawrenchbndr

07-27-2010, 17:39

:rofl::rofl:

bac1023

07-27-2010, 17:45

:laughabove:

2c5s

07-27-2010, 19:58

But, I must point out something, right wrong or otherwise, I learned the hard way long ago on performance car message boards. That is resolve your issue with a vendor before slamming them on the Internet, or sharing much of the experience. Your odds of a successful resolution are greatly better this way, IMnsHO.

True, but most of us on the car boards have learned to stick together over the past 10 years and realize, where there is smoke there is fire. Except for this thread showing support, the gun boards are way behind with this blind nutswinging devotion. Serva will get his.

BlayGlock

07-28-2010, 13:54

I just saw where the mod on TOS added a sticky that says you should not post Grievances here. Are you kidding? What else are you supposed to do on a gun forum but discuss the good and the bad? That is the sole purpose of thier existence. I am going to find the appropriate thread on that site and let them know how stupid of a policy that is.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?p=2777966#post2777966

Recently a sticky was added saying to not post any grievances. I realize that this is your forum and you are free to run it as you please. However, I think this policy is asinine and misguided. If the purpose of this forum is to discuss the respective 1911 makers it is certainly pertinent to include information about a brands product and customer service, or lack thereof. If the discussion turns to name calling and petty insults then such posters should be removed. To remove a thread simply because someone had a negative experience, especially if it is a negative experience of a sponsor or friend, comes across as disingenuous will degrade the integrity of this forum.
Best Regards

Quoted to preserve exactly what was said.

beltjones

07-28-2010, 15:29

I just saw where the mod on TOS added a sticky that says you should not post Grievances here. Are you kidding? What else are you supposed to do on a gun forum but discuss the good and the bad? That is the sole purpose of thier existence. I am going to find the appropriate thread on that site and let them know how stupid of a policy that is.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?p=2777966#post2777966

Quoted to preserve exactly what was said.

It's sad, but not surprising, that people immediately criticized your post. "Hey, the mods know what's best for us! It's better to be civil and peaceful than factual! If you don't like it, get out!" lol. Typical.

BlayGlock

07-28-2010, 16:40

I guess they need to be babysat?

beltjones

07-28-2010, 16:47

I guess they need to be babysat?

Worse. They LIKE being babysat.

HAIL CAESAR

07-28-2010, 20:24

Well folks.....I just got home from a trip and found out I had a refund check from Fusion!!

I guess it is finally over.....thank GOD.... and I think I have to thank you guys too. I really think it was pressure put on by posters that let to this.

I know the sentence below in red will sound very bad to some, it even sounds bad to me. But after all I have been through I hope you understand my inner thoughts that I am typing for all to see...

Now I am just waiting for the check to clear the bank......

SouthpawShootr

07-28-2010, 20:28

Glad to see you got a resolution to your problem. I was really hoping to see a new pistol though. It might have shown what this particular maker can do when they want to make things right. Oh well. Congratulations on the check.

Quack

07-28-2010, 20:31

finally...i think it was crappy that he was always posting new guns while you still haven't received your's back.

hmmm, i guess TOS is just like magazines that have to write fluff on the advertisers products.

Hokie1911

07-28-2010, 20:39

Good for you Alan. Time to move on. Valuable lesson learned.

Trey83

07-28-2010, 20:43

Well folks.....I just got home from a trip and found out I had a refund check from Fusion!!

I guess it is finally over.....thank GOD.... and I think I have to thank you guys too. I really think it was pressure put on by posters that let to this.

I know the sentence below in red will sound very bad to some, it even sounds bad to me. But after all I have been through I hope you understand my inner thoughts that I am typing for all to see...

Now I am just waiting for the check to clear the bank......

I am glad you got the refund. I'm sure that was the best thing that could have happened.

So have you thought about what you are going to get instead of the Fusion?

bac1023

07-28-2010, 20:44

Congratulations Alan.

You must feel as though a heavy weight has been lifted from your shoulders.

Cerebrus

07-28-2010, 20:49

Bet yer glad that is just about over with..now head over to C&S and pick up that new Trident.. :supergrin:

98_1LE

07-28-2010, 21:37

This is great news!

faawrenchbndr

07-28-2010, 21:44

Well folks.....I just got home from a trip and found out I had a refund check from Fusion!! .....

I'm happy for you, Now I agree go buy a trident and let us know how it is.

Tactical black

07-28-2010, 22:03

Congrats on the check I look forward to hearing about whatever you decide too buy instead. :cool:

HAIL CAESAR

07-28-2010, 22:08

Thanks everybody...and yes it does feel like a huge weight has been lifted.

I still want a 38 Super CCO with a extra 9mm barrel. Or a 9x23 with 9mm CCO.

This time I ain't messing with anybody, I'm building it myself.:tongueout:

2c5s

07-28-2010, 22:49

Thanks everybody...and yes it does feel like a huge weight has been lifted.

I still want a 38 Super CCO with a extra 9mm barrel. Or a 9x23 with 9mm CCO.

This time I ain't messing with anybody, I'm building it myself.:tongueout:

Congrats!!!!!!

CMG

07-29-2010, 03:43

Well folks.....I just got home from a trip and found out I had a refund check from Fusion!!

:wow:

That's terrific news!!!

Now I am just waiting for the check to clear the bank......

:rofl:

Not an unexpected response to me, but at least that instrument is easily actionable if it fails to clear! :embarassed:

awpk03s

07-29-2010, 04:21

Congrats.... glad to hear they FINALLY came through with something. What a ridiculous situation, I will never buy anything from Fusion after all of this, I know that.

gruntmedik

07-29-2010, 16:20

Man, am I glad this came to an acceptable end for you. :thumbsup: It is really hard to understand why places/people that do business like this are still in business.

I'll wait to offer official congrats once the check clears. :supergrin:

BlayGlock

07-29-2010, 16:29

Glad this got resolved.

HAIL CAESAR

07-29-2010, 18:19

I just saw on another site that a guy ordered a Fusion 9mm CCO in March of this year and he got it today.

So that pretty much confirms it for me that Serva was lying to me all the time and never planned on rebuilding and sending me a pistol.:steamed:

pistolwrench

07-29-2010, 18:33

Sheesh!
Give the guy a friggin' break.

Yup, I always cheer for the Underdog. It's that Yin/Yang thing.
Mr. Caesar has been made whole. Serva made mistakes and is paying for
them.
Let sleeping/dead dogs lay/lie.

If I was in Serva's position, after all the bad press, and then the statement by HC that HC's lovely wife was going to macro-photograph EVERYTHING......well I might have backed out as well.

HC has a bit of a history as being loud and not always right. I had him on my **** list for quite a while. He's prolly still there, I have not been motivated to check.

Attention to detail costs money. Plain and simple. If one is looking for
a custom 1911 at a fraction of the cost of what the Big Dogs charge,
don't expect the same quality.

Signed "Soon to be Flamed".

:cool:

usurp31

07-29-2010, 18:38

I dig your sig line PistolWrench.

HAIL CAESAR

07-29-2010, 19:07

Sheesh!
Give the guy a friggin' break.

Yup, I always cheer for the Underdog. It's that Yin/Yang thing.
Mr. Caesar has been made whole. Serva made mistakes and is paying for
them.
Let sleeping/dead dogs lay/lie.

If I was in Serva's position, after all the bad press, and then the statement by HC that HC's lovely wife was going to macro-photograph EVERYTHING......well I might have backed out as well.

HC has a bit of a history as being loud and not always right. I had him on my **** list for quite a while. He's prolly still there, I have not been motivated to check.

Attention to detail costs money. Plain and simple. If one is looking for
a custom 1911 at a fraction of the cost of what the Big Dogs charge,
don't expect the same quality.

Signed "Soon to be Flamed".

:cool:

I did not expect "the same quality".

I expected to get what I ordered, not whatever parts they decided to use.

I expected barrels correctly chambered.

I expected parts to be free of major flaws. No oblong holes causing parts to lean and other issues.

I expected for it to be delivered in the time promised or a reasonable time frame taking "stuff happens" into consideration. 2,3,4, times the time promised is not "reasonable". Especially when you don't start to even work on the pistol till AFTER the due date.

I expect not to be lied too. Don't tell me this week that it will be "shipping to IonBond tomorrow" then say the same thing next month. And the next month don't say it is just getting the barrels fitted. Don't tell everyone on the forums that IonBond is holding the gun delivery up, when you just emailed me and said you where just fitting the slide and frame.
( Which brings this to mind; How do you get away with lying and saying that a gun you promised in 16 weeks that is now over 30 weeks is IonBonds fault?? ESPECIALLY since you didn't sent it to IonBond till 28 weeks???)

BTW, I tried to get a refund. I was told that he did not do that. He said he would only make me a new gun. So I had no choice other than take the wreck of a pistol that he sent me. So I agreed to a rebuild, what else could I do??
He absolutely promised me a gun in 6 to 8 weeks. He said it would be a "all hands on deck top priority." 7 months later after saying I was going to photograph the beggezus out of the gun.....I get a offer for a refund.

I will back up anything I said with emails or PM's.

Sorry if I am on your **** list. Can't believe it is just over that I disagreed with you on the idea you can ream a 38 Super barrel to safely accept a 9x23 cartridge and still shoot 38 Super. A subject that is heatedly 50/50 split down the gunsmith community on whether you can safely do it, or not. Some of the best say you can, some say you can not without the possibility of serious catastrophic safety concerns. I decided to look at it myself, the schematics, and to error on the side of caution when shooting a +50K PSI handgun cartridge.

bac1023

07-29-2010, 19:41

Sheesh!
Give the guy a friggin' break.

Yup, I always cheer for the Underdog. It's that Yin/Yang thing.
Mr. Caesar has been made whole. Serva made mistakes and is paying for
them.
Let sleeping/dead dogs lay/lie.

If I was in Serva's position, after all the bad press, and then the statement by HC that HC's lovely wife was going to macro-photograph EVERYTHING......well I might have backed out as well.

HC has a bit of a history as being loud and not always right. I had him on my **** list for quite a while. He's prolly still there, I have not been motivated to check.

Attention to detail costs money. Plain and simple. If one is looking for
a custom 1911 at a fraction of the cost of what the Big Dogs charge,
don't expect the same quality.

Signed "Soon to be Flamed".

:cool:

Chuck, I don't think anybody expects Fusion quality to be anywhere near as good as a custom gun from somebody like yourself. However, they aren't exactly cheap either and you should get what you pay for.

At $1100-$1200 for my early Fusion build, I got what I paid for, nothing more. Alan's later gun wasn't built nearly as nice as my Fusion and I believe he paid more. He was then given the run arounds by this clown that calls himself a custom smith and business owner. :upeyes:

.

Rinspeed

07-29-2010, 19:42

Sheesh!
Give the guy a friggin' break.

So is this the kind of crap you were putting out when you charged $1800 for a pistol. That would have been what 15 years ago. :rofl: :tongueout:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y29/Rinspeed/9mmbarrelstamping.jpg

HAIL CAESAR

07-29-2010, 19:52

Chuck, I don't think anybody expects Fusion quality to be anywhere near as good as a custom gun from somebody like yourself. However, they aren't exactly cheap either and you should get what you pay for.

At $1100-$1200 for my early Fusion build, I got what I paid for nothing more. Alan's later gun wasn't built nearly as nice as my Fusion and I believe he paid more.

Thanks Brian, you expressed exactly what I was trying to say without the emotions I am feeling.:wavey:

BTW mine was $2,380.

bac1023

07-29-2010, 19:58

Thanks Brian, you expressed exactly what I was trying to say without the emotions I am feeling.:wavey:

BTW mine was $2,380.

Yeah, Fusions have really gone up in price in the few years he has been in business, especially if you order "custom" options.

I actually bought mine right off his website pre built. It was one of the first run of 1911s he built. For the deal I got, its worth it, but I said many times what I thought they were and what I thought they weren't. Most people didn't get the great deal I got and I don't think Fusion quality is more than $1100-$1300 worth, especially nowadays.

Cerebrus

07-29-2010, 20:00

Yeah, Fusions have really gone up in price in the few years he has been in business, especially if you order "custom" options.

I actually bought mine right off his website pre built. It was one of the first run of 1911s he built. For the deal I got, its worth it, but I said many times what I thought they were and what I thought they weren't. Most people didn't get the great deal I got and I don't think Fusion quality is more than $1100-$1300 worth, especially nowadays.

From what I have seen, I would totally put my Loaded up against a Fusion and feel like that I have come out on top of the deal.. just my .02

CMG

07-29-2010, 20:03

Sheesh!
Give the guy a friggin' break.

Yup, I always cheer for the Underdog. It's that Yin/Yang thing.
Mr. Caesar has been made whole. Serva made mistakes and is paying for
them.
Let sleeping/dead dogs lay/lie.

If I was in Serva's position, after all the bad press, and then the statement by HC that HC's lovely wife was going to macro-photograph EVERYTHING......well I might have backed out as well.

HC has a bit of a history as being loud and not always right. I had him on my **** list for quite a while. He's prolly still there, I have not been motivated to check.

Attention to detail costs money. Plain and simple. If one is looking for
a custom 1911 at a fraction of the cost of what the Big Dogs charge,
don't expect the same quality.

Signed "Soon to be Flamed".

:cool:

I guess the trip to NY went well, eh? :whistling:

HAIL CAESAR

07-29-2010, 20:08

I do agree...and should have agreed with you last year.:embarassed:

Would I tell a person to never buy a Fusion??? No.

I would tell them to only buy it off of a person so they could see it themselves first and hopefully have a qualified person look over it first. And maybe even shoot it to see if it works!!!!
I would also tell them to try and find one used or LNIB as they seem to only bring 60% of original price. If the gun I would have bought would have cost.........considerably less, and not had the oblong frame holes and short chambered barrel I might not have had the objections to it as I did.

As it was I could have bought any $1,000 , or sub 1k, 1911 and added a cheap 38 Super barrel and not had near the defects and flaws I had with that Fusion.

HAIL CAESAR

07-29-2010, 20:13

From what I have seen, I would totally put my Loaded up against a Fusion and feel like that I have come out on top of the deal.. just my .02

I think you would have come out on top. And if you did have issues SA's customer service is top notch.

bac1023

07-29-2010, 20:17

From what I have seen, I would totally put my Loaded up against a Fusion and feel like that I have come out on top of the deal.. just my .02

I'm not a huge Loaded fan, but they're definitely better than what Fusion served up to Alan.

Carrots

07-30-2010, 15:19

Glad to see sense finally prevail, a refund should have been offered and sent out 7 months ago.

glock2740

07-31-2010, 15:31

Well, it sounds like this thread is ready for the old LOCK to be put on it. Say goodnight Gracie. :wavey:

faawrenchbndr

07-31-2010, 15:50

..... Say goodnight Gracie. :wavey:

Hey,......that's my dog's name! :supergrin:

Ruggles

07-31-2010, 16:16

Any bad publicity that Fusion has received has been very well earned. If HC was one of those customers that could never be satisfied (and by no means do I think he is) then Fusion should have done what any quality business would have done and given the customer a refund and moved on. Fusion seem to have decided to go down a dishonest road instead when they clearly delivered a low quality product. That tells me all I need to know about them.

Fusion lost any potential business I would have ever given them based on their treatment of HC, and for that I thank him.

glock2740

07-31-2010, 16:32

I agree with you Ruggles. I've always wanted a Fusion. And I'm sure they make a great gun. But, due to what I've read on here, I don't see a Fusion in my near future, but, this is the first I've ever heard about their quality not being fairly top notch. Either way, this horse has been beat to death. I'm 100% sure that Bob Serva isn't a scam artist. :deadhorse:

:rofl:

faawrenchbndr

07-31-2010, 16:40

Any bad publicity that Fusion has received has been very well earned. If HC was one of those customers that could never be satisfied (and by no means do I think he is) then Fusion should have done what any quality business would have done and given the customer a refund and moved on. Fusion seem to have decided to go down a dishonest road instead when they clearly delivered a low quality product. That tells me all I need to know about them.

Fusion lost any potential business I would have ever given them based on their treatment of HC, and for that I thank him.

I agree with you Ruggles. I've always wanted a Fusion. And I'm sure they make a great gun. But, due to what I've read on here, I don't see a Fusion in my near future, but, this is the first I've ever heard about their quality not being fairly top notch. Either way, this horse has been beat to death. I'm 100% sure that Bob Serva isn't a scam artist. :deadhorse:

:rofl:

Darn Skippy,...........Bob screwed up! :deadhorse:

HAIL CAESAR

07-31-2010, 21:42

glock2740,

I see were your coming from. But mine isn't the only one. Please search TOS for locked thread...you'll find more "issues".

I would say to look for certain disasters, but the posts and threads have been mysteriously deleted.....

faawrenchbndr

07-31-2010, 21:55

glock2740,

I see were your coming from. But mine isn't the only one. Please search TOS for locked thread...you'll find more "issues".

I would say to look for certain disasters, but the posts and threads have been mysteriously deleted.....

Linda funny how the "censor police" only LET you read what THEY want you to on TOS.:whistling:

HAIL CAESAR

07-31-2010, 22:01

Linda funny how the "censor police" only LET you read what THEY want you to on TOS.:whistling:

Actually is is sad ( and scary) for the potential customer seeking knowledge and experiences. You gotta take the good with the bad as far as posts go, so you have an information site and not a paid cheerleader ad.

Quack

07-31-2010, 22:09

Linda funny how the "censor police" only LET you read what THEY want you to on TOS.:whistling:

who in the hell is Linda? :tongueout:

CMG

07-31-2010, 22:17

Buy a Fusion?

Maybe, one day, after the BS has killed their value, and Fusion is bought out by someone (like CZUSA) who will take a bit of pride in their offerings.

After all, it worked out well with Dan Wesson.

bac1023

07-31-2010, 23:24

Actually is is sad ( and scary) for the potential customer seeking knowledge and experiences. I gotta take the good with the bad as far as post go, so you have an information site and not a paid cheerleader ad.