The trouble is WIlliam had things handed to him, getting the ORder of the Garter, and other honors and did not have to work for them. His grandmother had mansions renovated for William and Kate but they did not have to work for this. Camilla had the training from the PR guru Mark Bolland. A pity that Charles did not put his sons through the rigorous training. WIlliam is the future of the monarchy and he just seems to sail through without even trying (even avoiding public speaking lessons which he sorely needs). WIlliam is not a teen anymore he's 34 with a wife and two children. A 'job' was created just for WIlliam so he could avoid full time duties. I don't get the pampering of him, he is a future King. The Bolland treatment should have been applied to WIll and Harry once Bolland stopped working with Camilla.

^I think after Diana's death, HM felt sorry for PW and PH and also became less strict. I think she and other members of the RF have coddled PW and PH more and are paranoid about pushing them too far, but now they don't know how to deal with them not working hard enough or having high enough standards.

^^You are absolutely correct. Maybe, in time, and with guidance, and I know I'm dreaming here, Camilla may be able to be a positive influence after HM passes away on these three logheads. I'd forgotten about Bolland and it's a superb model by which to go in PR/philanthropy stewardship.

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\\\"I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.\\\" Thomas Jefferson

I don't think Camilla is the right one to guide them considering their history. She needs to keep her own head above water and look out for herself. Bolland or someone really skilled at PR and etiquette should work with them. They could have a Lionel Logue type of mentor who works with them. Sometimes an outsider is needed rather than a relative. In this case, I think an outsider and a professional is sorely needed. WIlliam should start with speech training and maybe continuing education in various fields other than the geography he majored in after he dropped art history. I don't think quite honestly they will listen to Camilla considering her history with their mother. It would be like Anne Boleyn trying to mentor Mary Tudor, Henry's daughter.

^Good point. Probably a lot of resentment and people tend to listen to "experts" vs family. However, Camilla should be serving as an example of how it should be done and take 5 minutes to figure out how to do it better and get cracking with a PR firm that knows what they're doing because she's doing it right, they are not.

Who, for instance, would ever approve of any media stating that the Cambridges and Harry are looking forward to a vacation after working so hard? It's laughable. Say nothing instead. Or else the DM is sticking it to them, which is more likely.

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\\\"I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.\\\" Thomas Jefferson

Charles clearly did not at all see to the development of his sons and heirs and at this point, game over. Both clearly do not want to emulate their father in preparedness and basically prefer to just wing it and fancy themselves as free spirited and spontaneous. Yet it gets old as they get older.

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Charles paid more attention to Camilla's preparation than to William and Harry. He started the coaching of Camilla back in 1997, before Diana passed on. The Queen also seemed to just hand out honors to William without his having had to earn them. These two are now in their thirties, yes it is a shame that Charles and his mother did not make sure William and Harry had the best preparation. Camilla does not represent the future of the monarchy, she would most likely have a relatively short number of years as consort (and could very well retire). William and Harry are the future. Other than a 10 week farming course that William probably never completed, there has been seemingly little effort to get him ready.

Not true. Many peolpe marry just because money, loneliness, status and several other reasons. Charles himself married a woman who he didnt love and who he had no wish to have a 'real marriage' with, get 2 his heirs and led separate lives, was always his intention. Philip himself just married Liz becasue money. JFK just married Jackie because she was convenient to his political career. And many other cases out there. By all accounts, Camilla has always been madly in love with Andrew P-B.

I think Camilla has behaved herself very well since marrying Charles. The way they came together is complicated and messy, but in life, you fall, you make mistakes, and it's how you persevere and pull through that that shows what you are made of. As Cate said, punishment for transgressions is not up to us and we are asked to forgive anyway. PR or not, if you can't pull yourself together, it just doesn't work. Look at the rest of them.

I disagree. Their friendship with Penny Junor says nothing good of C-C. They obviously has no wish to let Diana rest in peace. To malign dead is big no no in my book.

I stand by my opinion on this--which is I don't think Charles and Camilla are "soulmates". But it does make Charles look reprehensible if this was his plan. Stephen Barry did report in his books that Diana said she wanted "lots of children." Apparently Charles did not communicate with Diana on the number of children he wanted and expected. Maybe Camilla and APB were the soulmates but she I think preferred the example of her great grandmother being a mistress of a Prince of Wales. I honestly don't think JFK even had a soulmate, he appreciated Jackie but he was basically a womanizer. But that's for another thread.

I agree with you about Junor who is said to be writing a biography of Camilla. I can only imagine what sort of awful things she will write about Diana. Recently there was a photo of Camilla and Penny giggling together at a party. Camilla must be having a field day.

Cammie is the very last person Willy and Harry would listen to. She needs to stay out of their lives period. As for PR maybe Chuck could hire Sophie to help them. He seems to like her and she is media savvy.

Sandy - agree about the Bolland treatment - Harry and Will needed better training - and Bolland sure rehabilitated Camilla's in the sense that she got her make over and also learned how to behave better on engagements

Neither needed training, they needed to GROW UP and stop playing the dead mommy card. Both need to basically stop self indulging. Both should have been building their own foundation for their adult lives, just like everyone else. Harry and William should have been prepping for the future, not just skiving off at bars and clubs and basically indulging in every baggage creating gratification. Charles likely couldn't get through to them since it's obvious that they refuse to listen and see red flags and warning signs. The Diana issue aside, Charles did build a fabulous charitable organization for them to work on, but they refuse to step in and work on it and learn/grow, despite the reality that in their position, they still act like a bunch of spoiled teenagers. Charles is used to unquestioning obedience, obedience that was drilled into him and obedience that was something he grew up never challenging. He never went off during Christmas and 'did his own thing' and he NEVER was anything other than cooperative with the courtiers.

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Charles appeared to be attempting to get William interested in the Duchy of Cornwall work which he would be inheriting. Aside from a photo op and a ten week course, which Will probably never completed, there has been little evidence of WIlliam training there. The problem was that WIlliam was treated with kid gloves so to speak when he went to Uni and did not have to work much as a royal and could do what he wanted except for photo ops here and there. The overcoddling did not do him any good. He should not have gotten the Order of the Garter until he earned it. Harry should have been given a slate of duties that he would be required to complete before he got vacations. It is sad now that the boys are in their thirties and many twenty somethings are more mature than they are. William even publicly whined about the big adjustment to marriage and children. That is so pathetic. The Queen should have done something early on and in cooperation with Charles TOLD not ASKED the boys to work.