Sep 29, 2006

Dr. RC Sproul’s ministry, Ligonier Ministries, has been instrumental in leading thousands of Christians into a daily deeper walk with Christ. This is an extremely important ministry for Christians world-wide today and we need to pray for them daily. But what is to be the legacy of this heretofore God-honoring ministry? Are we going to let the world laugh as it crumbles into the gutter? Who will be left holding the reins after Dr. Sproul? In all actuality, Dr. Sproul is no longer holding the reins, and we need to look at the family who is, to hold them accountable.

My blog is not a forum for gossip. My only purpose in presenting the following information is to call all Christians to unite and plead with Ligonier to clean up their inward workings, that their orthopraxy would match their orthodoxy once again! If you are a financial supporter of Ligonier, you have a double responsibility to contend with and confront Ligonier with their sin. Christians, we must unite together to call Ligonier to repentance. If Dr. Sproul has blessed you with his ministry, you owe it to him to gently restore this ministry to a place of righteousness once again.

Ryan Dick is the son of Tim Dick, who is the President of Ligonier Ministries, a position which should be held to the standards of "elder" in the Bible. Ryan is also the grandson of Dr. RC Sproul, who is an elder both in his church and in his ministry, Ligonier. Ryan lives at home with both his father and his grandfather, which make them doubly accountable for him and his actions. Scripture is very plain when it tells us that the qualifications for an elder is one who rules his own house well, having his children in submission with all reverence. This article will show if Tim Dick and Dr. RC Sproul are qualified in this area.

Ryan is also an employee at Ligonier and has been during the entire time period of his posts that I have copied here. I am including the dates and his My Space page here as well. If you were a donor to Ligonier at any time during the last couple years, you will get an opportunity to see how your donor money is being used to pay this young man's salary.

All his comments here were made during the time frame of his employment at Ligonier. I wonder how many of them were actually posted AT work? Sabrina (his girlfriend) sent this comment to Ryan on 5/5/06: "What are you doing on myspace at work? Hmmm..."

While there are other sites that have dealt with Tim Dick personally, this particular article is written to expose the wickedness in Ryan Dick’s heart. Of course, we all have wicked hearts, but there are limits as to the exercise of them.

As you read these comments, please see if these show a son who is reverent. Is he reverent to God? His father? His grandfather? Girls? His job? Ligonier? If you are financially supporting Ligonier Ministries, you need to be aware that you are paying this young man’s salary by your gift to the Lord. Is the father of this young ruling his own house well? Is the grandfather of this young man ruling his own house well? Who is holding them accountable?

What is even more important is that this young man seems to think that he will take over Ligonier some day. This is an OUTRAGE! The following is a cleaned up version of Ryan’s comments online so that it will not be offensive in language, but you should feel great moral outrage after you read these. I have linked to all his comments directly; you can check the threads from there if you feel the need. I wouldn’t recommend it.

(Update: The links were taken down immediately after I posted this article.) Why were these links taken down? Why was Ryan's My Space page taken down? While these comments have been removed, there is certainly no evidence of repentance.

First thread: Someone is giving away free auto stickers and asks people who want them to just reply with their name, address, and what color they want. This is the one post you will want to click on to verify who aframdw says he is.aframdw: Ryan Dick2741 Deer Berry Ct.Longwood Fl 32779Blue

This is his signature block. If you can’t read it, just know that it’s not very nice.I love you Sabrina...1f u c4n r34d th1su r34lly n33d t0 g37 l41d

Thread: A girl gets drunk and throws up in a boy’s car and causes a lot of damage. The boy wants her to pay for the damages.5/9/06 aframdw: He** yah make that b**** pay....If it happend to me i wouldnt care if i had the money to pay for it my self **** that i would make the person who trashed my car pay for it....**** i would tell the mom fine see you in court...i wouldnt care if it was the civic or one of the lexus'....How old is she

Thread: About cars.2/8/06 aframdw: I can say the same thing "just wait" im going to be taken over a family company and i will be able to get what ever car i want when im older if thats the route i choose....But im not sure if thats what i want so there for i dont dream about it now or brag about it or say what im going to get i just keep my mouth shut drive my lil civic and pimp the FAMILY CARS when i wana look fly in a baller car...and i dont lie either i tell ppl its not mine....Just dont talk about it untill you get it thats all u have to do

Another thread about buying cars.

4/20/06 aframdw: Dude the way you work the floor model is buy the warrenty on it and then you just have to know how to make it not work without making it look obvious then they give you the new model...

Thread: What would you guys think about this for an offical meet spot (started by aframdw)2/28/05 aframdw #1: Its just an idea in the works but its got a good chance........What would you guys think about an offical meet spot my dad talked about buyn a warehouse or parking area to make an officle meet and show spot so that we dont have to have hassles of rice and fights and b/s and we would open a small restraunt as well or a lil burger stand thing.....anyways if it was just like a 1.00 a week per person to come chill and we would have security to make sure nothing goes wrong and we would host big shows there as well....Just let me know what u think.......Its just a thought right now but he would do it trust me I need to be able to show him what kind of turn out we could have weekly and monthly so anyways thats it..

3/9/05 aframdw #9: goes to keeping the place in shape and well operated.......Unless my dad changes his mind and does it for free........But one prob is no one is responding on the sites i put it up on i have to show him we can have alot of ppl there and so far its not working.....Its alot of money for him to put into a place and then not have anyone come out

3/10/05 aframdw #19: Well if we dont get a prop just for this we already have alot of office property that we own and could use and we just bought 43 acers for a college we are starting that have some sweet spots for photos.........So no matter what we can have a place.....Only thing wrong with those two places are ones in lakemary and one is buy the seminole town center and i dont think ppl would want to go to them btu they would be free i think

Other person asks: wait if your dad owns a lot of office property, why not ask him if we can use a parking lot that he owns?3/22/05 aframdw #24: Thats what we are leaning to since no one is really responding but its more of a liability thing for that....It will take more work...And there would defffff be nooooo burn outs........3/22/05 aframdw #26: Well i think there is a way to get a tax break for him if he buys a prop for us

3/23/05 aframdw #29: not in it for the money......Its to give us a place to chill in peace

4/9/05 aframdw #35: im going to see if we can meet at his office for now...But i also need to talk to eric and see if he would want to

4/26/05 aframdw #42: i just need eric to tell me if he wants me to talk to my dad about using our office or not

5/9/05 aframdw #45: Well if we do it at the office it would prob be free but i have to talk to eric and my dad

1/23/06 aframdw #50: u wouldnt have to worry about other ppl coming it would only posted on the forums and most of us here know if someone is from the forums or not and its my prop so i can kick out who ever...

3/7/06 aframdw #56: I havent had time to work on it at all since i got moved up...But there is on thing for sure...I will not allow any rice or any dumb drivers what so ever with all the stuff that has been going on...And there are cameras everywhere so we would have it on tape if needed to turn someone in for burning out and messing up the black top....But anyways when i get a chance to work on it a little more i will...We are having our national conf. this week which means working 7am-11pm and 3,500 ppl coming

Other person: your place looks tight aframdw definitely "NO" dumb driver allowed to pass your gated house3/19/06 aframdw #61: LoL i wouldnt hold it at either of my houses it would be at our office...

4/13/06 aframdw #67: Prob. Every month...I havent had time to anything right now b/c i am now the Asst. Event Planner and Meadia Relations so i have been really busy....Hey we just used sonnys 2 weeks ago

5/23/06 aframdw #75: Lake Mary....But so far right now i dont see when i would be able to set anything up....or have time and look at the legalities (

Another thread about cars.

10/10/04 aframdw: Thats why im glad im selling it and getting a lexus so I wont be called rice by ppl that think they know what they are talking....Im going to talk down on all the ppl that i know that talked down on me b/c i drove a civic.....Nope im not that low

Thread: Pictures of naked women. I am posting the link, but I highly recommend Christians don’t look at the thread.5/5/06 aframdw: LoL i opend it at work before i looked at the NWS part of the title o well

Thread: Talking about money.Other person said: But its a fact that he makes more then you and me combined...a milionaire and counting.11/3/04 aframdw #111: Maybe more than me yes but lol not in a few years when i take CEO of the family comp its a 12mill comp now and is sup to tripple in the next 3-5 years ..........So yah he makes more than me but i bet my gpa makes more and my dads pretty close.............So dont count ur cookies on that one

Other person: Wait wait wait... let me get this right..Your family owns a $12,000,000 company right now, and in the next 3 to 5 years it's going to be worth $36,000,000+, and you drive a ****ing $12,000 Honda Civic?11/4/04 aframdw #119: Ummm YAh i do and i did it buy choice....You got a prob with that...? just b/c we have money doesnt mean i have to flaunt it i was planing on doing a bunch of other stuff to it but its just a pain in the *** thats why im getting a lexus I also never got a nice car in hs b/c i was sick of allways being the rich boy even tho i still got crap cuz i got a diff car every year to year and a half....Was going to get a 350z but i didnt get the 75% florida bright cuz i only went to the sat once and didnt care cuz i dont have to pay for college anyway....This time im buyn the car on my own with my own money so im more happy about it anywaysEveryone else in my family drives a lexus also....If you would like me to prove it come by to one of or all three of our houses there is one in lakemary one in seminole and one in deland ill give you a tour of them if you would like or come by and see the company if you would like.....http://www.ligonier.org/Man i love it when ppl talk so much **** to me and they dont know what they are talking about .....o and if u want my cell pm ill set up a date for u to come by when ever you want i can get off work when ever

Other person: How do your parents get so much money if the company is a NOT-FOR-PROFIT ORGANIZATION? Come on! Did you really think things through before you posted a link to "your" company? First of all, it's a public corporation, which means you can't just take over. Second of all, I found this in your annual report. "Ligonier Ministries, inc (the Ministry) is a not-for-profit corporation that operates as a educational organization." I just am confused how you complain about the miseries of being a "rich boy" and then flaunt it all over OF how rich you are. And come to find out, it's all a front anyway. "Your" corporation is DONATION based- you ask religious christians to give you money so that you can "awaken as many people as possible to the holiness of God by proclaiming, teaching, and defending God's holiness in all its fullness."11/4/04 aframdw #125: Well no i dont flaunt it around sorry this is the first time i have every talked about it and yah its a non profit and to make as much money that we do there is other things we do besides lig IF U HAVE ANY IDEA WHO RC is then you would know that.....ITS a front come over to my house i bet i could fit 2 of urs into just one of mine......Yall are some funny *** ppl and if ur a gurl u got a big *** mouth.....Yall talk some funny ****....COme over b4 u talk **** u have no idea

Other person: Wow, you know, I really don't know who RC is, so I guess I'm just dumb. But honestly, I expected better from the person who is getting ready to take over a multimillion dollar non-profit organization that helps spread the word about Christianity and proclaim the holiness of God. I mean, maybe I'm wrong (I'm only Jewish after all) but I thought Christians were supposed to be kind, modest, gracious people. Honestly, I don't care how big or small your house is. Only god can judge you, right?11/4/04 aframdw #131: Getting ready lol no i have awhile years....And im a more down to earth normal person just cuz im christian doesnt mean i have to act perf and wear all white and never say a bad word thats where ppl have the wrong view......

Thread: Jobs.Other person: Yeah i do.. I'm a rent-a-pig just started like a week ago because my last post fired me because i was always watching dvd's on my laptop If it weren't my dads company i wouldn't be able to work anywhere because i tend to slack off11/5/04 aframdw: LoL same here that and im allways about an hr to 2hr late lol...Yah i saw u the other day i was taken my brothers friend home in my lil brothers car...(gray 03 altima) Ill stop buy sometime and check out ur car cuz my gf loves supras and i dont know anyoen that has one anymore...If thats cool with u lol

Tim Dick, what in the world are you thinking here? Should this person be working for you at Ligonier Ministries? Does this person have any business at all working in a Christian ministry anywhere? Tim, you need to get your son under control and you need to fire him ASAP!

RC Sproul, is this the legacy you are wanting to leave? This young man represents YOU! Since he is your grandson, we call on you now to fire this young man who is so totally irreverent to God and you and your ministry. Public relations? Please, RC.

Vesta Sproul and the rest of the board of directors, this man may be related by blood, but he is not what the Christian community needs to represent Christian ministry. We are abhorred by what we read. It is time for him to leave Ligonier.

Tim, RC, and Vesta, we plead with you for this young man’s soul. It is obvious that the holiness of God is not very important to him. Please invest your lives in him before it is too late.

Christians everywhere, please call Ligonier at 800-435-4343 and e-mail customerservice@ligonier.org and write to all the addresses I have posted in my original Contending'>article and express your outrage. We must unite together and bring restoration to this once-God-honoring ministry.

And everyone, please pray for this young man’s soul, for Ligonier, and for Christ to somehow be glorified in this situation.

Sep 27, 2006

I had a nice little chat with "Senior Management" at Ligonier on Monday afternoon, and I thought you readers would like to know about it. "Senior Management," or at least one of them, is John Duncan. He was patient with my questions and spoke with me for more than two hours. I was grateful for the time, because dealing with a real person is so much easier for me than with a nebulous entity like "Ligonier" - especially now that customer service has been forbidden to talk.

John was upset, however, that I had accused Ligonier of “deeds of darkness.” I explained that “deeds of darkness” is just another term for sin, and that we all sin, both believers and unbelievers alike. He did not think Ligonier had sinned in this matter with Frank Vance, however. I, of course, repeated I Corinthians 6 to him, about Christians not suing Christians, at which time he shocked me by saying that Frank Vance has never professed to be a Christian, so they were operating under the assumption that Frank Vance is not a believer, and therefore they had the right to sue him.

Let me stop here and say that even if Frank Vance were a lying Muslim, as Doug Wilson has concluded, the best thing Ligonier and Tim Dick could have done would be - nothing. Frank Vance was a “nobody” in the blogging world and in Reformed circles, so his little blip on the screen would have been nothing more than a fleeting rant. Nobody would really have cared much about what was happening inside Ligonier if Tim Dick hadn’t made a public spectacle of demanding his rights when somebody called him a name.

However, let’s get back to Ligonier’s and John Duncan’s justification for suing Frank Vance. John stated over and over and over again in our otherwise delightful conversation that Frank Vance had not professed to be a Christian. By the time we finished conversing, I decided that I needed to see for myself if that was indeed true.

As I was looking through various posts and comments, I noticed that many people didn’t use their real names. Being the story of the day, we all wonder who Frank Vance really is. I wonder who Passerby is on Frank’s site? I wonder who Hoping is on my site? I wonder who Charitable Onlooker and Practicing Attorney and Maggie and Wendi are? I don’t have any links to them and they don’t tell me their real names, so should I just discount all their comments? Why aren’t they forthright in telling their names as well? This is how the blog world works right now and we need to hold everyone to the same standard. Well, I may not know who Frank Vance is, but I think I do know who Passerby is, and that’s important. Frank told Passerby that he knew he was John Duncan, and neither Passerby nor John Duncan have refuted that. I mention this only because one commenter on my blog accused Charitable Onlooker of being “Senior Management” and there was a quick denial there.

Passerby has, however, posted this comment: “(please accept the anonymity of those of us who don’t want five blogs spending their days slandering us).”

Hang in there with me as I bring this all to my point. John Duncan repeatedly told me that Frank has never professed Christianity. John Duncan speaks exactly like Passerby and Hoping and has not refuted that he is Passerby or Hoping. Now I would like to bring you to another significant comment Passerby left on drbrooker.net on September 17th in speaking of Frank Vance.

“I am a senior manager at Ligonier. ,,, We have never encountered this degree of malice and distemper from a professing believer.”

John, you almost had me convinced in yesterday’s phone conversation.

What does Frank have to say about whether or not he is a believer? Here is a whole post about why it is biblically unlawful for Ligonier to sue him because Christians are not to sue other Christians. If Frank were not a believer, would he go to these extreme lengths to exposit Scripture on this point? He has quoted numerous Scriptures throughout his entire blog. He has made many references to Christianity, to the Reformed doctrine, and to Christians and churches. Is that how unbelievers generally talk? Personally, I’ve never heard unbelievers speak that way.

Here is a comment that Frank posted last week telling Passerby that perhaps Frank’s “own Pastor and Elders could have been party to a mediation process,” if Ligonier hadn’t already sued him in the first place. Last I checked, the Muslims don’t have “pastors” and “elders.” That sounds like a Christian church to me.

Frank once said, “"Through it all, at no time did Ligonier Ministries or Tim Dick ever admit that they had filed a lawsuit against me, a fellow Christian."

And Mike answered, “There is no solid reason to believe this; - The part about you being a Christian, that is. Your actions are inconsistent with such a statement.”

I guess Mike thinks Frank is a believer, too.

At no time did Ligonier ever ask, “Frank, are you a professing Christian? Are you a member of a Christian church? Could you share with us your testimony of how you came to faith in Christ?” Even now they’re not asking. It seems they’d rather not really know. They didn’t ask because they didn’t care. The only reason they seem to care now is because they’ve come under withering criticism for violating I Corinthians 6, and their only escape clause is if they can show that Frank is NOT a believer after all. I repeat, even if Frank were a Muslim, or some such unbeliever, is that truly a biblical justification for suing him? Aren’t there better ways to handle name calling?

Maybe Frank Vance’s “tone” is not what John Duncan would have used in a similar situation. But we cannot accuse someone of not being saved merely by their “tone.” Frank is a man who obviously spends much time in church and in the Word. I’m not sure I’ve ever come out on my site and quoted, “I am a Christian; therefore, you cannot sue me.” But with the amount of Scripture I’ve used, it ought to be obvious that I’m not an infidel. I’ve read your statement, John, “Senior Management,” and at no time do you profess to being a Christian either. You use the same phrases and terminology Frank has used throughout his site. Does that mean that you are a Christian because you use that terminology, but Frank can’t be one because he uses that same terminology?

In our conversation you came across as a kind man, John, but your justification will not wash with me. Shouldn't you and Tim Dick have shown this concern about whether or not Frank is a believer BEFORE you sued him?

Here is a comment “Law Dude” posted yesterday afternoon that I thought was worthy of a full post.

Law Dude said...Mr. Vance, In all my years practicing law, I can't say as I've ever seen a case where a plaintiff published a written notice claiming they'd withdrawn their lawsuit when they hadn't even drawn up the motion to withdraw it, let alone submit the motion to the court. To see a Christian ministry engaging in this sort of dishonest behavior is scandalous. I'm sure you are on top of this case but I just wanted to let you know that I just got off the phone with one of the judge's clerks. She confirmed that as of 4:30 today Ligonier still hasn't filed anything with the court to have the case dismissed. If others would like to verify it for themselves, it's all public information. Anyone can call the clerk and ask. Case No. 06-CA-1669-16-KCourt Clerk's Phone: 407-665-4378In my professional opinion I don't think Ligonier ever had any intention of withdrawing the case. I think what they were hoping to accomplish is to con you into believing that they withdrew the case so that you wouldn't pay attention to their continuing motions and ex parte hearings in court. The fact that just last Thursday they had another ex parte hearing with the judge to figure out how to legally effect service is rather strong evidence that they're not planning on dropping this case. It appears that they're still lying to the judge and claiming that there's no way of contacting you. More than likely here's what Ligonier and their lawyers were hoping to pull off. Eventually, if you didn't respond. then they'd perhaps be able to get a default judgment against you. With that default judgment, then they could get your blog shut down and there goes your public forum and you'd have a hard time issuing a public statement on the deceptive way they went about getting a legal judgment against you. Very slick but also very unethical. I'm going to make a point of calling the court every day until I know that the case has actually been dismissed. I also think it's important that this case be dismissed with prejudice. With prejudice means that it can't ever be brought again. I'd like to also suggest that your readers call Ligonier every day and ask why they still haven't filed anything with the court to withdrawn the lawsuit they publicly said they'd already withdrawn last week. Why is a donor funded Christian ministry publicly lying?

Jen here: I just called at 10 a.m. again today and the suit is still pending, still open. It has NOT been dropped, nor has a motion to drop it been filed. I happened to check Mapquest today to find out why it is taking so long for the papers to get from Ligonier’s attorneys’ office at 390 N. Orange Ave. in Orlando to the courthouse at 301 N. Park Ave. in Sanford. It is a distance of 23.9 miles, or 30 minutes as Mapquest predicts.

Let me see now. Ligonier wrote two statements on September 20, 2006, saying that “the complaint was withdrawn” (past tense), meaning that on or before September 20, 2006, Ligonier withdrew the legal complaint (which they still have not admitted was a lawsuit!). To be fair, they didn’t actually send out those statements until just after close of business Friday afternoon, September 22. Today is September 27, and there is STILL no motion filed to drop the suit.

This particular court opens the mail and processes walk-in papers by opening ALL mail each day as soon as it arrives and enters it as “received” in the computer on the day that they receive the paperwork. As of today, September 27, they still have not received anything from Ligonier’s attorneys.

Just how long does it take to go 23.9 miles, I wonder? Eight days and counting!

Sep 25, 2006

Doug Phillips, who was my elder for several years, taught me that God’s Word addresses every situation in life, but that rather than looking for a single verse to support our “beliefs,” we must look at the whole counsel of God to determine precisely what God wants us to do and how we are to live our daily lives. As we consider this situation with Ligonier, I want to stay focused on our responsibility as Christians in these types of circumstances. Sola Scriptura.

If we are to develop a biblical worldview in life, it must differ from the world’s ways; as Christians, we should stand head and shoulders above the world in the way we conduct ourselves. Let’s take a look at a few of the world’s ways and see how we are doing.

“The West Point Military Academy has a Cadet Honor Code which is defined as "A cadet will not lie, cheat, steal, or tolerate those who do." West Point expects that all cadets will strive to live far above the minimum standard of behavior and develop a commitment to ethical principles guiding moral actions. An officer who is not trustworthy cannot be tolerated. USMA expects its graduates and cadets to commit to a lifetime of honorable living.

“A leader of character knows what is right, and possesses the moral courage to act on that knowledge. The principles of truthfulness, fairness, respect for others, and a personal commitment to maintaining values constitute that fundamental ideal known as the Spirit of the Code. A leader of character will apply the Spirit of the Code when making decisions involving ethical dilemmas.

“The Corps of Cadets bears the responsibility to resolve all possible violations of the Code through detailed, independent investigations and, when required, Honor Investigative Hearings. If a cadet (or anyone else) suspects that a violation occurred, then she or he is expected to approach the individual to clarify what happened (this step is optional). If that approach resolves the issue; i.e., the cadet making the allegation realizes no Honor violation occurred, then the issue will be dropped. However, if the person making the allegation still believes a violation may have occurred, she or he is obligated to inform a member of the Honor Committee within 24 hours. Failure to do so is considered "toleration," which is itself a violation of the Honor Code (the 24 hour rule is a guideline, cadets are not automatically in violation of the Code if they take more than 24 hours to report a violation). Once a suspected violation is reported to a member of the Honor Committee, it must be investigated.” This investigation then leads to several levels of hearings and judgments, similar to our judicial system.

The US Army drills and instills seven core values into all its soldiers:

Loyalty

Duty

Respect

Selfless Service

Honor

Integrity

Personal Courage

These seven character traits are not only inculcated in and demanded of each soldier, but they are also a foundation for promotion. All officers and NCOs are rated annually on how they embody these seven character traits, which then forms a basis for potential promotion.

How are we as Christians doing so far? Are we standing head and shoulders above the world’s ways? Have we all demonstrated God’s ways in our handling of the Ligonier situation?

I was having a conversation with a friend once and she had asked me a question. She said, “I know you are just going to ask me, ‘What does the Bible say about it?’ but I don’t know what the Bible says about it!” Maybe that is where we need to start.

What does the Bible say about this situation with Ligonier? First, we need to understand that it is our responsibility as Christians to judge one another. This concept of judging others has been greatly taken out of context in our day. This Scripture is not referring to a pharisaical “holier-than-thou” type attitude where we either think we are better than others or we put it upon ourselves to tell other Christians all their sins. The Bible never tells us to do either of those. This type of judging regards things that pertain to this life, even the smallest matters, Scripture tells us; it is the settling of differences, as we clearly see the connection to the previous verse that tells us not to take matters to the world’s courts. Not only is this verse a clear prohibition of lawsuits, but it appears to ban all forms of using the world’s courts to settle matters between professing Christians, such as injunctions. So our first point is that Christians are to judge one another in ALL matters, big or small.

Next, we are told that we should have nothing to do with the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but rather to expose them. Since “deeds of darkness” is just another name for sin, we see that we are actually told to expose sin. There are certainly biblical times, ways, and means to do that, though, so we can’t put all our money on just this verse. But we do need to realize that there are definitely times to expose the evil “deeds of darkness.” We are having no problems following this Scripture lately!

Most people will probably think of Matthew 18 next, so let’s look briefly at its three steps.

First step: Go alone to the person who offended you.

Second step: Take one or two others with you. Notice that this verse does NOT say that the others must have witnessed the offense, but rather that they be witnesses to the conversation.

Third step: Tell it to the church. “Church” here does NOT necessarily mean the local body of believers you fellowship with. It MAY mean that, but it is not limited to that definition. The “church” here means to the extent that other believers are affected by this offense, or those who have a need to know.

Fourth step: Treat him like a heathen and a tax collector.

This situation with Ligonier and this verse reminds me of Martin Luther. Luther realized as he studied God’s Word for himself that he had a responsibility to judge what was going on in the church at that time. He realized that he had a responsibility to expose the “deeds of darkness” within the very church he loved. He also followed the steps of Matthew 18, but when he got to step number three, the “church” meant all the believers had a need to know. It is not easy to be the messenger and tell God’s own people to repent, and Martin Luther was not very well loved in his day. People today want to shoot the messengers that are exposing the “deeds of darkness” within Ligonier, but God clearly tells us in this Scripture to take it to the whole church, if necessary. To the extent that the sin is made public, exposure should be given to the same extent. I wonder where we would be if Luther didn’t have the intestinal fortitude to call the church to repentance.

Do we have an example in Scripture of exposing evil deeds to the whole church? This might seem like a really small matter, but it must have been important enough to not only confront the sinner, but also to take it to the whole church. Peter was eating with the Gentiles, as God had called him to do, but when James sent some visitors, Peter lost his first vision and withdrew from them and separated himself, fearing those who were of the circumcision. Paul says that he had to confront Peter to his face; but even that wasn’t enough. Paul then put it in writing for the whole church to see, for all time! Sometimes I’m glad I didn’t live in the Bible times, because I wouldn’t want my sin to go down in history for the whole world to continue to see for thousands of years! Anyway, Peter’s sin of fearing for his reputation doesn’t seem like that big of a deal to us, but Paul thought it serious enough to tell the whole church.

What is our attitude to be during all this exposure and confrontation? First, I think it’s important that we walk the very fine line of being as wise as serpents, yet as harmless as doves, since we are as sheep being sent out into the midst of wolves. I am not going to call anyone a wolf in this Ligonier situation, but let us say that God knows each of our hearts, and He knows His sheep, and He knows if there are any wolves. We do, however, bear a responsibility here to be wise in discerning when people are conducting themselves as Christians or not; the Bible says that we will know that they are Christians by their fruit, by the way they behave. While we are busy being wise, let us be just as busy being harmless. I fear there is much harm being done in this situation.

And not only are we to be harmless, but we are to restore those who are caught up in sin with a spirit of gentleness. You know, I think that old saying still rings true: You will catch more flies with honey than with vinegar! When we put others on the defensive, why are we surprised when they defend themselves? This is certainly one of the hardest areas for me, but I truly desire to have a gentle spirit so that I may help bring restoration where there is still sin.

Sometimes as Christians we are called to confront sin in other believers. The Bible tells us that Christians are to judge between Christians, in both small and large matters; that we are to expose the “deeds of darkness;” that we are to follow the three steps listed in Matthew 18, which include telling it to as many Christians as it pertains to; to be as wise as serpents in being alert for wolves in our midst, yet harmless as doves in dealing with them; and to restore sinning believers in a spirit of gentleness. For those who are doing the confronting, let us remember to do it God’s way.

Sep 21, 2006

Brrring. Brrring. Brrring. (phone ringing at Ligonier Ministries, Inc.)Ligonier: Thank you for calling Ligonier Ministries, the home of "Renewing Your Mind" with RC Sproul. … For all other inquiries, please press '5.'

Ligonier : Ligonier Ministries. How may we help you today?Joe Christian: I have been a supporter of Ligonier for quite a while now, but I am a little concerned about what is being reported in the open press concerning Ligonier. Is it true that Ligonier has filed a lawsuit against a Christian?Ligonier: I am not able to comment on that at this time. It would be best if you e-mailed customerservice@ligonier.org.Joe Christian: You can't comment -- does that mean there is a lawsuit but you can't comment or there is no lawsuit but you can't comment?Ligonier : I am not able to comment on that at this time. It would be best if you e-mailed customerservice@ligonier.org.Joe Christian: It does seem there is a lawsuit. Can you tell me why Ligonier is suing a fellow believer when that is a clear violation of I Corinthians 6?Ligonier: I am not able to comment on that at this time. It would be best if you e-mailed customerservice@ligonier.org.Joe Christian: Well, how about you personally? As a Christian, and I'm assuming you are a Christian since you work for a Christian ministry, don't you think you personally should take a stand when Scripture is being violated by a policy or action of that ministry?Ligonier: I am not able to comment on that at this time. It would be best if you e-mailed customerservice@ligonier.org.Joe Christian : Can't you just answer 'yes' or 'no?'Ligonier : They won't let us say anything else. It would be best if you e-mailed customerservice@ligonier.org.

Frustrated? Confused? Feel betrayed? Heard through the grapevine that Ligonier is denying the lawsuit? I did. I called to check and was told that no lawsuit had been filed. I called back and now they won't say anything. Don't know who's really telling the truth?

Well, it turns out that Ligonier did file suit against a Christian blogger. And we were able to track down a copy of it. It's right here, in black and white. Take a look at it for yourself. It's not very long.

What does it all mean in plain English? Well, it means that Ligonier as an organization, along with Tim Dick as an individual, filed a lawsuit against Frank Vance, a professing Christian, on August 25th for allegedly defaming them by the comments he made on his blog, Contending for the Truth. Tim Dick and Ligonier also ask the judge to act quickly to order Frank to stop saying bad things about Ligonier. They say the judge should issue this order quickly even without hearing Frank's side of the story because it's urgent and because they could not contact Frank to give him notice of the suit.

The above story is today’s version of events at Ligonier. To read last week’s version of events on the same subject, read here.

Once again, Ligonier, the Christian community calls upon your organization and the individuals responsible for this unbiblical lawsuit to repent. Dr. and Mrs. Sproul, Mr. Dick, board members, and any employee who has misinformed callers and supporters concerning the existence of this lawsuit, please, please repent of this latest transgression of God’s Holy Word, which we as Christians commonly call “lies.” For the sake of the gospel and for the holiness of God, please turn from the course you are on.

Sep 18, 2006

When we were still on a spiritual “milk” diet, God brought Dr. RC Sproul into our lives to put some spiritual “meat” on our bones. He taught us many things that we had never heard before, but had been desperately hungering for: holiness and truth. It was as if we stepped out of the Dark Ages and into His marvelous light! RC taught us the foundations of reformed doctrine without being extreme on either side. He taught us the doctrines of Grace in a clear, biblical, and gracious manner. We consider him to be a spiritual father to us, of sorts. And for that, we are eternally grateful.

Likewise, we have visited St. Andrews Chapel several times while traveling, the church where Dr. RC Sproul is the teaching elder. This is, by far, the most worshipful church we have ever been in. Everything about both the outward structure and the format and form of the service is truly glorifying to God. We were filled with a quiet sense of awe as we entered the sanctuary filled with people, quietly listening to classical arrangements from a strings ensemble while each was preparing their hearts for worship. The sanctuary is laid out in the shape of the cross, with an elevated pulpit in the center. Dr. Sproul explained that the only thing that was truly elevated there was the Word of God, that the Word of God was central to worship in that place; and it truly was, the times we were there. The incredible biblical art and the glorious classical God-honoring music truly created an atmosphere that would lead each one into worship that glorified God.

As I consider what is happening currently in Ligonier, I want to hold them accountable for the current sin that seems to permeate certain aspects of this Christian ministry, but I always want to give credit where credit is due. I pray that Ligonier as a ministry will repent and set the highest of standards for Christian ministries everywhere.

Sep 15, 2006

Nathan, the prophet, went to see David, the king, one day. He told him a heart-wrenching story: “There were two men in one city, one rich and the other poor. The rich man had exceedingly many flocks and herds. But the poor man had nothing, except one little ewe lamb which he had bought and nourished; and it grew up together with him and with his children. It ate of his own food and drank from his own cup and lay in his bosom; and it was like a daughter to him. And a traveler came to the rich man, who refused to take from his own flock and from his own herd to prepare one for the wayfaring man who had come to him; but he took the poor man’s lamb and prepared it for the man who had come to him.”David was furious and wanted to kill the man on the spot AND make him pay restitution.But Nathan said, “You are the man! God blessed you with everything; why have you despised the commandment of the LORD, to do evil in His sight? You have killed Uriah with the sword; you have taken his wife to be your wife, and have killed him with the sword.” He then pronounced the Lord’s punishment for David’s disobedience of the Lord’s command, saying, “For you did it secretly, but I will do this thing before all Israel.” So David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the LORD.”Here we have the man after God’s own heart committing at least two very grave and serious sins in secret, a man of God doing evil in His sight. Thankfully, someone has the guts to stand up to the King of Israel and say, “You are the man! You are the sinner. Repent!” And because David was a man after God’s own heart, his wicked heart was teachable and tender when confronted with his breaking of the law, God’s law.Proverbs tells us that “those who forsake the law praise the wicked, But such as keep the law contend with them.”God calls those who keep His law to contend with the wicked (those who forsake God’s law are wicked). Even though David was a man after God’s own heart, he was behaving in a very wicked way and God was extremely displeased with him. God sent Nathan to contend with David. Look at the fruit of that contention!We don’t like confrontation, we don’t like contention. It is much easier to bury our heads in the sand and pretend like it doesn’t affect us than to “get involved.” Contending with those who forsake God’s law is hard work and just plain isn’t fun. It’s too much work. The other person might attack us. They might retaliate. What if they don’t repent? It’s too much of a risk, we reason. Someone else will do it.Will they? Who is that someone else? If you are reading this, that someone else should be YOU! Are you following the story of sin in great men of God? Then get up and do something about it. Don’t let it be an issue of gossip in your life. Whether you write or speak about it, or whether you just read or hear about it, it is still little more than gossip if you don’t get up and DO something about it.Maybe you don’t know what to do. Great! Then you came to the right place! I am going to give you some ideas of exactly what to do about a current situation where Christian leaders need to have their feet held to the fire leading to repentance.Edmund Burke once said, “All that is required for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.”Are you willing to let evil triumph in the Lord’s work? Or are you willing to contend with those who are breaking God’s law at Ligonier Ministries?Every Christian can, and should, pray. That is the first thing.The following three posts are open letters to Dr. RC Sproul, Vesta Sproul and the board of directors, and Tim Dick, president of Ligonier Ministries. I would strongly encourage each person reading this to cut and paste these letters into Word and mail them to Ligonier (addresses provided). If you do not financially support Ligonier Ministries currently, please delete that part and still send in the letters. Ligonier needs to be inundated right now by Christians who will contend with them for breaking God’s law.You may also call Ligonier Ministries at 800-435-4343 and tell them the same things. I do not recommend e-mailing, but you may. Ligonier’s customer service e-mail is customerservice@ligonier.org. This e-mail account is read by Tim Dick, who then forwards it to the person responsible. I asked Ligonier today if RC’s e-mails were forwarded to him. They assured me they were, although RC does NOT have e-mail. I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt. Let me just mention that a hard copy is more binding than e-mail and much more likely to go to its intended recipient. Here are some additional addresses to use for the Board Of Directors

When you write or call, please remember to consider all of God’s counsel about how we are to handle ourselves as Christians, such as with charity, being kind, and in a spirit of gentleness. “Let no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth, but what is good for necessary edification, that it may impart grace to the hearers.”It is time to call Ligonier Ministries to repentance.

Dr. RC Sproul, 2741 Deer Berry CourtLongwood, FL 32779-3071Dear Dr. Sproul,We are so grateful to you for all the years of incredible Bible teaching you have imparted into our lives. You have taught us about the holiness of God and why He wants us to obey Him. You have helped change our hearts and our lives to live in a way that glorifies Christ and enjoys our Creator. We are so appreciative of all that you do for the work of the Lord in this fallen world.Yet we have this against you: Ligonier Ministries, under the direction of Tim Dick, is blatantly violating I Corinthians 6, by filing a lawsuit against Frank Vance, a fellow believer. We know that Mr. Vance has made some allegations against Tim Dick in particular, and Ligonier Ministries as well, but you yourself said that the Gentiles should never judge between the Israelites, just as the world should not judge between Christians.We respectfully implore you to have Ligonier Ministries and Tim Dick, as president of Ligonier Ministries, drop this lawsuit which is contrary to the ways of the Lord.In addition, we would ask that you answer the charges Frank Vance makes against Ligonier regarding duplicity in a contract with Don Kistler.We would also hope that in all the areas of your family over which you have control, that you would meet the qualifications of an elder according to God’s Word. I Timothy 3:4-5 says that an elder is “one who rules his own house well, having his children in submission with all reverence (for if a man does not know how to rule his own house, how will he take care of the church of God?)”. Only you know the truth in this area. Please set a good example for the rest of us in ruling your own house well.These are all important issues to the kingdom of God as a whole, since you are a public figure in that arena. The “world” is watching. God is watching. We plead with you to repent for the sins listed above, to immediately drop the lawsuit, and to set the godly example of an elder for all Christians who have been so blessed by your ministry.It is with profound regret that we will need to discontinue our financial support of Ligonier Ministries if the lawsuit isn’t dropped by Friday, September 29, 2006. We pray that you would have a teachable heart like David did when Nathan confronted him with his sin and say, like David said, “I have sinned against the LORD.”Our prayers are with you daily.Your grateful servants,Mark and Jennifer Epstein

Vesta Sproul 2741 Deer Berry CourtLongwood, FL 32779-3071Dear Vesta and the Board of Directors of Ligonier Ministries,We are so grateful to Ligonier Ministries for providing many great resources, such as books, radio programs, sermons, CDs and iPods, TableTalk, conferences, and a great many other incredible resources that teach us about the sovereignty of our great God and how we are to live our daily lives in that light. Thank you for all the hard work you do to help Christians grow in their daily walk.Yet we have this against you: Ligonier Ministries, under the direction of Tim Dick, is blatantly violating I Corinthians 6, by filing a lawsuit against Frank Vance, a fellow believer. We know that Mr. Vance has made some allegations against Tim Dick in particular, and Ligonier Ministries as well, but there is never any excuse for disobeying God. As board of directors, we hold you directly responsible for this despising of God’s Word.We respectfully implore you to have Ligonier Ministries and Tim Dick, as president of Ligonier Ministries, drop this lawsuit which is contrary to the ways of the Lord.In addition, we would ask that you answer the charges Frank Vance makes against Ligonier regarding duplicity in a contract with Don Kistler.These are important issues to the kingdom of God as a whole, since you are a public ministry in that arena. The “world” is watching. God is watching. We plead with you to repent for the sins listed above, to immediately drop the lawsuit, and to be a godly example of ministry in this sinful, wicked world.It is with profound regret that we will need to discontinue our financial support of Ligonier Ministries if the lawsuit isn’t dropped by Friday, September 29, 2006. We pray that your ministry would have a teachable heart like David did when Nathan confronted him with his sin and say, like David said, “We have sinned against the LORD.”Our prayers are with you daily.Your grateful servants,Mark and Jennifer Epstein

Tim Dick, PresidentLigonier MinistriesP.O. Box 863595Orlando, FL 32886Dear Mr. Dick,We are so grateful to Ligonier Ministries for all the years of incredible Bible teaching Ligonier has imparted into our lives through Dr. Sproul’s teachings. He has taught us about the holiness of God and why He wants us to obey Him. Ligonier has helped change our hearts and our lives to live in a way that glorifies Christ and enjoys our Creator. We are so appreciative of all that you do for the work of the Lord in this fallen world.Yet we have this against you: Ligonier Ministries, under your direction, and you personally, are blatantly violating I Corinthians 6, by filing a lawsuit against Frank Vance, a fellow believer. We know that Mr. Vance has made some allegations against you in particular, and Ligonier Ministries as well, but we ought to obey God first – in all situations. You are despising the Word of God by filing this lawsuit.We respectfully implore you to drop this lawsuit which is contrary to the ways of the Lord.In addition, we would ask that you publicly answer the charges Frank Vance makes against Ligonier regarding duplicity in a contract with Don Kistler.We would also hope that in all the areas of your family over which you have control, that you would meet the qualifications of an elder according to God’s Word. As president of a Christian ministry, you are in a position of biblical leadership and therefore must meet the qualifications of elder. I Timothy 3:4-5 says that an elder is “one who rules his own house well, having his children in submission with all reverence (for if a man does not know how to rule his own house, how will he take care of the church of God?)”. Only you know the truth in this area. Please set a good example for the rest of us in ruling your own house well.These are all important issues to the kingdom of God as a whole, since Ligonier is a public ministry in that arena. The “world” is watching. God is watching. We plead with you to repent for the sins listed above, to immediately drop the lawsuit, and to set the godly example of an elder for all Christians who have been so blessed by Ligonier ministries.It is with profound regret that we will need to discontinue our financial support of Ligonier Ministries if the lawsuit isn’t dropped by Friday, September 29, 2006. We pray that you would have a teachable heart like David did when Nathan confronted him with his sin and say, like David said, “I have sinned against the LORD.”Our prayers are with you daily.Your grateful servants,Mark and Jennifer Epstein

Sep 13, 2006

Recently large demonstrations have taken place across the country protesting the fact that Congress is finally addressing the issue of illegal immigration. Certain people are angry that the US might protect its own borders, might make it harder to sneak into this country and, once here, to stay indefinitely.

Let me see if I correctly understand the thinking behind these protests.Let's say I break into your house.Let's say that when you discover me in your house, you insist that I leave.

But I say, "I've made all the beds and washed the dishes and did the laundry and swept the floors; I've done all the things you don't like to do. I'm hard-working and honest (except for when I broke into your house).According to the protesters, not only must you let me stay, you must add me to your family's insurance plan, educate my kids, and provide other benefits to me and to my family (my husband will do your yard work because he too is hard-working and honest, except for that breaking in part).If you try to call the police or force me out, I will call my friends who will picket your house carrying signs that proclaim my right to be there.It's only fair, after all, because you have a nicer house than I do, and I'm just trying to better myself.I'm hard-working and honest, um, except for well, you know.And what a deal it is for me!!I live in your house, contributing only a fraction of the cost of my keep, and there is nothing you can do about it without being accused of selfishness, prejudice and being anti-housebreaker.Oh yeah, and I want you to learn my language so you can communicate with me."

Why can't people see how ridiculous this is?!

Editorial in some newspaper by a very smart lady, but I can't find the original source.

Sep 10, 2006

Some Christians are up in arms about Ligonier Ministries suing Frank Vance, a fellow believer, and rightly so, as it is plainly against Scriptural teaching. But my question is: where do they go? Where are the ecclesiastical courts of which a Christian can avail himself? If Christians are to judge one another, who are they, and where are they?

Oh, there is some semblance of provision within denominations for "courts," per se, but they are extremely limited in their scope, and I'm not so sure how truly unbiased the "upper echelon" in a denomination truly is. Why, for example, did all those sexually abused altar boys wait until they were adults in their own right to take the abusive priests to court, and a worldly court at that? Where were their God-given advocates, their church "courts?"

We see that RC Sproul, the younger, for example, was defrocked by a Christian "court," but did it really mean anything? Did it really change anything? Were the judgments followed? Why did Doug Wilson feel he had the right to defy a Christian "court" and re-frock RC? Did the "court" truly have any meaningful authority?

What is the everyday Christian to do? God's Word clearly provides for Christians judging one another and amongst ourselves, but have we provided an acceptable alternative for carrying out God's plan for legal ethics and issues? Where are the wise men that God has established as judges for the church today? Would Christians really obey them? Where is their authority?

When Moses was worn out from adjudicating 3-4 million Israelites, his father-in-law, Jethro, came up with a brilliant plan: "You shall select from all the people able men, such as fear God, men of truth, hating covetousness; and place such over them to be rulers of thousands, rulers of hundreds, rulers of fifties, and rulers of tens... And so they judged the people at all times; the hard cases they brought to Moses, but they judged every small case themselves. "

Rulers of thousands.Rulers of hundreds.Rulers of fifties.Rulers of tens.

Where are these able men now? Where are those such as fear God, men of truth, hating covetousness (that's an interesing qualification, by the way! - God clearly foresees bribery in the justice system, doesn't He?), men who are able to adjudicate the SMALL matters, and men who are able to adjudicate the HARD cases? Where are they today?

I recently read a story about Constantine, in the 3rd - 4th century AD, bemoaning the ineffectiveness of his own courts and judges, but at the same time having a deep admiration for the judges of the Christian church. He then asked the Bishops to wear the judicial robes of that day, which were bright and colorful, out on the streets among the people, to denote that Constantine approved of the bishops as judges. Here we have a story of the church doing a better job in adjudicating than the world, as it should be.

But that was then. What do we have now? I recently checked out the Peacemakers website and found they have an allowance for being a go-between among differing parties. This is certainly a step in the right direction, but I don't think they have any legal authority, per se.

I know of several young, dedicated Christian men who are studying to be lawyers of the world. I wonder what they will do with their training?

I am a strong believer in NOT complaining about something unless I have an answer. If Ligonier Ministries cannot sue Frank Vance, under biblical authority, what should they do? First, we do have Matthew 18, of which apparently Frank Vance already has used every possible application, but has Ligonier Ministries availed themselves of Matthew 18 yet? Second, we have I Corinthians 6, where Paul says that if we can't get able men to judge, then "Why do you not rather accept wrong? Why do you not rather let yourselves be cheated?" This is not always a viable answer, but it is Paul's answer when the church won't do its job and judge itself.

This is a call for the church to wake up and take over the judicial system, at least the judicial system that involves Christians. There is a need for judges of thousands, judges of hundreds, judges of fifties, and judges of tens, on a daily basis, in every town. Denominational ecclesiastical courts aren't cutting the mustard.

Sep 9, 2006

You Are 12% Control FreakThere's no way you're a control freak. You're totally laid back - and able to take life as it comes.While you definitely have a healthy mental attitude, don't get suckered into letting someone control you.

I have written several times about one of my very favorite Bible teachers, RC Sproul. Before we ever heard of "reformed theology," we started listening to RC Sproul every day on the radio. Most of what he taught seemed to be accurate when lined up with the whole counsel of God. We greatly appreciate the meat of his messages and many a sermon has transformed our lives. This kind of biblically sound teaching is called "orthodoxy" - correctness of beliefs - and is sadly lacking in so many churches today. Once we had a taste of it, we craved more and more in-depth sound biblical teaching.

As we started listening to other reformed teachers, we eventually found out that "reformed" does not necessarily mean "reformed," just as "baptist" doesn't necessarily mean "baptist." We still find RC Sproul to be the best teacher of orthodoxy as it lines up with God's Word, especially since he does not seem to take an extreme position on anything, which is often what turns off so many people to reformed theology.

However, orthodoxy must always be wed to orthopraxy - correctness of actions. Why do we study God's Word? There are certainly many reasons, such as to know God, but out of our daily study should come the fruit of orthopraxy, that is, the fruit of a changed life. Knowing what God has to say about something (orthodoxy) and doing what God says (orthopraxy) are, unfortunately, sometimes two very different things. However, in God's eyes, they must always be fully wed. God will hold us to a higher degree of accountability when we have studied His Word, seen clearly what He tells us to do, and then do the opposite.

God does not look lightly on divorcing orthodoxy and orthopraxy.

Having then been both an avid listener and a financial supporter for years to Ligonier Ministries and RC Sproul, I was deeply grieved to hear that Ligonier, through Tim Dick, RC's son-in-law, is suing a fellow believer, in obvious contradiction to God's Word, which says clearly that a Christian will not take another Christian to the courts of the world.

I want to make clear that RC Sproul himself is NOT suing Frank Vance, the man who has exposed some very serious sins within the ministry of Ligonier and also some of the personal life of RC Sproul's family, who runs Ligonier. However, by not stopping these actions, which must be fully known to RC Sproul, he is implicitly condoning suing a fellow believer.

I am NOT an internet assassin, nor do I condone internet assassins, but since I have written here previously praising the works of RC Sproul (for which I still think he is a great Bible teacher), I feel an ethical obligation to let others know that his superb orthodoxy is currently divorced from his orthopraxy. I will not relate the details of what is going on at Ligonier Ministries, but you may read about it here. When Matthew 18 seems to be exhausted, the internet has provided a way to expose those who need to be exposed, for various reasons. Many brethen spent two years appealing to those in the wrong, only to meet with continued resistance and lack of repentance. As a supporter of RC Sproul and Ligonier, and having attended his incredible church several times, I fully appreciate being made aware of how my money is being used, and how orthodoxy is currently divorced from orthopraxy in this group of people, although I am deeply grieved and saddened by this whole scenario.

I pray for a quick and complete repentance from all involved, and until such time, feel we must withhold our financial support. Will I still listen to RC Sproul? Probably. I have long ago learned not to throw the baby out with the bath. But my enthusiasm for his incredible teaching will be dampened slightly.

May the Lord open his eyes to the correct orthopraxy, even when it's the hard thing to do.

Jen's Story About Being Excommunicated by Doug Phillips

About Me

Having been recently delivered from the bonds of legalism, I am learning to live life by the grace of God alone. I am sold out for the truth of God's Word and I stand ready to be used however the Lord directs me.