CanesSkins26 wrote:1. Cam Newton isn't falling to #102. The Skins are not drafting Taylor at #10

Ok, Cane. The odds are that you are right on both counts.

Newton isn't falling to #10

and if Julio Jones is available and nobody trades up, it would be hard to pass on him. I voted for Julio on this thread for two reasons - I believe that is who we will pick. The other is we have been clamoring about having a big receiver for years - a big receiver of his talent and speed doesn't ccme along very often - he is a missing piece that we long for and if we are on the two year plan then we got a piece that we won't need later.

The fantasy guy (not league just pure fantasy) in me wants Taylor and then Paea in the second round. Carriker is holding his own at the left end - this would give us a powerful front three that teams would have to reckon with - remember defense wins championships - Remember the Ravens Super Bowl squad? We would not be T-H-E-R-E yet next year with those two but we would be on our way to building a powerful D.

CanesSkins26 wrote:1. Cam Newton isn't falling to #102. The Skins are not drafting Taylor at #10

I believe this, but wouldn't be surprised if both of them are on the board at #11

I want Julio Jones drafted at #10 but not by Washington. The word on Taylor is "boom or bust, the later he's picked the better he'll be"... (something about might not love the game but loves the money he can make)...

I hope Taylor is there at #41 but if they can't trade down in the first and get two additional 2011 top 120 picks then they should take Jones at #10 and either Dalton, Devlin, or Ponder (in that order) at #41. They can sign someone like Brandon Mebane from Seattle once the new CBA is worked out and free agency starts.

I'd be shocked if Newton is there at 11. Too many teams in the top 10 with qb needs and while he has question marks, some team will roll the dice. Taylor should certainly be available at #11. He has no business being drafted in the top 10.

Regardless of if Taylor is generally considered worthy of the tenth pick, he is (we agree) a good fit for Washington's needs. There also seems to be general agreement that Taylor will be gone by the time the Redskins pick again at 41. And that makes things pretty simple, because it means that, mathematically, IT DOESN'T MATTER if Taylor belongs in the top 10.

All that matters is if he belongs in the top 40 (and everyone seems to think he does) -- because 10 is the ONLY CHANCE the Redskins currently have to pick him before 41, at which point he's expected to be gone. As the NFL Draft is currently constituted, there is no way to realistically say "Hey, we like Guy X but we'd rather take him a few picks farther down the line".

Also Mike Mayock likes him, but seems to allude to "character" issues in his comment below. I will keep following up on that.

Mike Mayock Says: Phil Taylor is an intriguing nose tackle. He’s 338 pounds with rare movement skills. If you buy into the kid from a character perspective, Phil Taylor could make a huge difference in their (Chiefs) defense.

Terl's explanation is absurd. Taking a guy at 10 because he wont last to 41??? Ok, MAYBE that makes sense if a team has specific need and a player fits that need; however, we have needs all over the place. To pass on more talented players, at positions of need, to take a guy because he wont be available in the 2nd round a Cerrato-esque move.

CanesSkins26 wrote:Terl's explanation is absurd. Taking a guy at 10 because he wont last to 41??? Ok, MAYBE that makes sense if a team has specific need and a player fits that need; however, we have needs all over the place. To pass on more talented players, at positions of need, to take a guy because he wont be available in the 2nd round a Cerrato-esque move.

BAM! Cerrato-esque? You clubbed me hard on that one, Canes. It is not that he is #41 talent. His draft stock is rising. He will most likely go in the middle of the 1st round. Taking him at ten would be like Jacksonville taking Tyson Alualu last year at 10 (I know what you are going to say - look at Jacksonville - Touche')

Nose Tackle is a pivitol need. As everybody notes the Pack and the Steelers. If Taylor is the real deal and he won't be available at #41. He is worth looking at as a possibility.

I cannot logically argue against your point of taking a more safe bet talent at 10 like Jones, so I won't even try, because in reality. I would probably take jones, but:

"It's me fantasy and I can draft who I wanna." First Taylor. Then Paea at #41 and then Blaine Sumner with our first 5th rounder. My D- line will make everyone on defense better. So excuse me, while I go back to sleep and dream some more.

Smith pulled a major surprise Thursday night when he selected defensive tackle Tyson Alualu of Cal with the 10th overall pick after the Jaguars weren’t able to swing a trade to move down for more picks.

In most of the media mock drafts, Alualu was rated as a late first round or early second round pick and ESPN analyst Mel Kiper Jr. said the Jaguars reached by half a round.

Nose Tackle is a pivitol need. As everybody notes the Pack and the Steelers. If Taylor is the real deal and he won't be available at #41. He is worth looking at as a possibility.

I guess this is where I disagree. Yes, NT is a need. I just don't see it as any more of a need than other positions. I would argue that qb, wr, guard, olb, cb, etc. are all pivotal needs for the team. And I just don't see how it would make sense to draft Taylor at #10, when there is certainly going to be a more highly regarded player available that fits one of our other needs.

I agree - the mistake that some fans make IMO is they think that by adding a few players we might see a consistently competitive product on the field in the near future - this franchise was in a huge mess and needed a lot of things to happen and all of the changes are going to take time

the mistakes in trades and evaluations PLUS the defensive and offensive schemes are going to take more time - we are not suddenly going to have an O line or a defensive juggernaut

this franchise is still trying to get things together and we need at least another 2 drafts and some pretty astute additions thru free agency before we can even begin to hope that the product on the field will be consistently competitive again

Mike & Bruce did not exactly do a great job last year but we are in a better situation with them in charge than we were

they still need to show that they can both manage and coach at a much better level than they have done so far though

take the best player available - this franchise needs to upgrade at so many positions - I hope that if we cannot trade that pick they find a player that will be a really good player for the Redskins for many years

Nobody really expects the Redskins to do well - 8 wins is considered a winning season for Dan Snyder's Redskins Redskins should fire Bruce Allen & try a different way of managing this franchise

SkinsJock wrote:I agree - the mistake that some fans make IMO is they think that by adding a few players we might see a consistently competitive product on the field in the near future - this franchise was in a huge mess and needed a lot of things to happen and all of the changes are going to take time

the mistakes in trades and evaluations PLUS the defensive and offensive schemes are going to take more time - we are not suddenly going to have an O line or a defensive juggernaut

this franchise is still trying to get things together and we need at least another 2 drafts and some pretty astute additions thru free agency before we can even begin to hope that the product on the field will be consistently competitive again

Mike & Bruce did not exactly do a great job last year but we are in a better situation with them in charge than we were

they still need to show that they can both manage and coach at a much better level than they have done so far though

take the best player available - this franchise needs to upgrade at so many positions - I hope that if we cannot trade that pick they find a player that will be a really good player for the Redskins for many years

Exactly. This is going to take time. There is no "quick fix" solution to our problems. It's going to take several drafts and off-seasons to get our talent and depth to where it needs to be for the team to be a consistent competitor, especially given the quality of our division.

The single biggest negative on Julio Jones is that he has trouble holding onto the football, especially over the middle. Lack of concentration. Head not always in the game. Not the kind of player I would prefer the Redskins draft at #10.

Nose Tackle is a pivitol need. As everybody notes the Pack and the Steelers. If Taylor is the real deal and he won't be available at #41. He is worth looking at as a possibility.

I guess this is where I disagree. Yes, NT is a need. I just don't see it as any more of a need than other positions. I would argue that qb, wr, guard, olb, cb, etc. are all pivotal needs for the team. And I just don't see how it would make sense to draft Taylor at #10, when there is certainly going to be a more highly regarded player available that fits one of our other needs.

Ok, I will argue with you on this one concerning the importance of the nose tackle in the 3-4 defense.

Nose tackle is an all-important position in the 3-4 defense. The nose tackle takes on a double-team on almost every play. His job is to keep the offensive linemen off the inside linebackers so they can read, react and make plays. The nose tackle also is responsible for maintaining rush lanes on passing plays, so the quarterback doesn't have anywhere to step up in the pocket.

You will find countless quotes concerning the importance of the nose tackle in a 3-4. Your 3-4 goes the way of your nose tackle. Want to know how our 31st D could produce 3 Pro Bowlers and a 4th if Landry doesn't get hurt? Check out how often the nose tackles got pushed into the secondary. A solid nose tackle would have made a huge difference this season. Check out how many close games we lost. Notice I said a "solid" nose tackle would have made a differenc. Even a journeyman Anthony Bryant made a big difference in our D's performance when he was in there because he didn't get pushed around (No, he is not the full time answer).

I cannot make a strong case for Phil Taylor for #10, but I can make a strong case that the nose tackle position, whether it be draft or FA signing, will be addressed.

Like you said, they can't all be addressed, but when it comes to a triage situation, nose tackle takes priority.

Since Mike says that it is going to take three years, he might opt to sign Kris Jenkins as a stop gap for one year and hope he holds up and look at future draft prospects coming up for next year. The fact that he entertained a visit from Shaun Rogers says that FA is an avenue he is looking at and also evidence that Phil Taylor will not be our #10.

To sum up, Phil Taylor might not be the guy, but you will see a signing of a quality nose tackle this off-season because this position is critical to the 3-4.

Getting out of my fantasy mode, will will take the BPA at #10 and that probably will be Jones.

Sumner in the 5th, and rotate him with Bryant while he learns the ropes and I think that solidifies the NT position.

If we HAVE to pick 10th and cant trade down, I would look at Quinn, J. Jones, Aldon Smith in that order. Hopefully we can trade down and pick up another 2nd rounder. We just have too many holes to hold onto that 10th pick if trading down is a possiblilty IMO

skins2357 wrote:Sumner in the 5th, and rotate him with Bryant while he learns the ropes and I think that solidifies the NT position.

If we HAVE to pick 10th and cant trade down, I would look at Quinn, J. Jones, Aldon Smith in that order. Hopefully we can trade down and pick up another 2nd rounder. We just have too many holes to hold onto that 10th pick if trading down is a possiblilty IMO

From Wes Bunting @ National Football Post:

Blaine Sumner is a 6-1, 335 pound nose tackle prospect from Colorado School of the Mines. He's a three-year starter who accounted for over 30 tackles as a senior, 6.5 tackles for loss and a half sack. However, Sumner is a making a lot of noise this pro day season because of impressive numbers off the field.

The girthy nose tackle pumped out 52-reps on the bench at the Air Force pro day, breaking the all time Combine record of 49 which was just recently set by Oregon State's Stephen Paea.

Sumner is gifted powerlifter as well who has marks of 900+ pounds on the squat, 600+ pounds on the bench, dead lifts over 800 pounds and hang cleans 400+ pounds. All mind blowing numbers.

However, I got my first look at the guy on the football field yesterday and here are my thoughts…

Possesses some natural bend to his game when asked to coil up into this stance. Displays an above-average first step off the ball for his size, can gain leverage on contact and has a powerful lower half when working the bull rush. Can downright dominate at the point of attack when need be and overwhelm blockers into the backfield. Demonstrates better ball awareness than I expected and does possess some closing range in pursuit.

However, is a stiff, linear athlete. Doesn't offer much as a pass rusher. Is raw technically, too often leads with his head, doesn't maximize his length and lacks ideal hand placement initially into contact Allows himself to get upright too easily, especially in the face of a double, but is just so physically powerful he can get away with it at the small-school level.

Overall, the intriguing strength numbers have helped, gaining Sumner some additional attention during the post season. He's a naturally strong kid who when he keeps his base down can consistently overwhelm and work his way into the backfield. However, he's stiff, a limited as a pass rusher and simply plays too high when asked to anchor.

Me personally, I wouldn't give him a draftable grade. I see him more as a size free agent who I wouldn't mind having in camp. However, with the lack of ideal talent at the nose tackle position this year and the potential of being unable to sign free agents after the draft, I do think Sumner at least gave himself a shot at a draft pick late come April.

Heres my take: The kid is rediculously strong as has the size you need to play NT. His knocks were he leads with his head/Shoulders too much and does not generate a pass rush. But isnt that something he should be able to learn through work on technique? The pass rush does not concern me, bc thats not really his job as a NT. The fact is that he would be stronger and bigger then just about everyone he goes against every week. If we could teach him some technique and prevent him from getting pushed around (which he seems to be strong enough to prevent), this dude could be a steal, which is what u look for in late rounds.

You also highlight the fact that this guy would not give him a draftable grade, but right after that it says "However, with the lack of ideal talent at the nose tackle position this year and the potential of being unable to sign free agents after the draft, I do think Sumner at least gave himself a shot at a draft pick late come April. "

Heres my take: The kid is rediculously strong as has the size you need to play NT. His knocks were he leads with his head/Shoulders too much and does not generate a pass rush. But isnt that something he should be able to learn through work on technique? The pass rush does not concern me, bc thats not really his job as a NT. The fact is that he would be stronger and bigger then just about everyone he goes against every week. If we could teach him some technique and prevent him from getting pushed around (which he seems to be strong enough to prevent), this dude could be a steal, which is what u look for in late rounds.

You also highlight the fact that this guy would not give him a draftable grade, but right after that it says "However, with the lack of ideal talent at the nose tackle position this year and the potential of being unable to sign free agents after the draft, I do think Sumner at least gave himself a shot at a draft pick late come April. "

I personally want that to be us. What can I say, he's my mancrush

I was wondering what the draft experts were saying about him. On the pass rush thing, I haven't heard much about Phil Taylor being a pass rusher. I heard him described as more of a space eater type which I understand is what we want, so Blaine fits what we want. I am with you on him. The question is, is he coachable. I bet he is and I agree with you that he might be a steal. I say no way he doesn't get drafted and with our 3 - 7th round picks and needing a NT, how would we pass on taking a low risk chance on Blaine.