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In regards to the audio snippet 20/20 played to illustrate MM's abuse claims, I say this: Sometimes you become crazy when you deal with crazy. And not that I think JC sounded crazy or that it was abuse, but overall, dealing with Molly couldn't have been easy. Having a bipolar narcissistic mother, I know that sometimes I don't act like *me* when I have to deal with her bc of her issues. And of course we're all human, we all have times when we're not proud of our behavior but it's something about malignant narcissists especially that draws you into their web and makes dealing with them extremely extremely frustrating. IMO

And actually hearing the audio of JC arguing with MM made me realize that he didn't coddle her, she didn't always get her way with him, which had to absolutely infuriate her. She probably wanted control of him & she obviously didn't have it, which led to her insane hatred towards him. IMO

Originally Posted by otto

My only take away from the audio clip was that he was trying to say something and she was rudely refusing to communicate - and deliberately recording him after seeming to push his buttons and upset him.

I agree, when I heard the clip it took me back to the last picture of JC alive taken two weeks before his death where he looks sad and broken. It was at the dinner where MM told WC that she wanted JC to allow her to adopt the kids.

If you listen to the actual words in the audio clip rather than the tone I think JC had realised that MM was trying to isolate him from the children. It appears as though he has come home from work to have dinner and they have already eaten and she wants the kids to start making pancakes. He has obviously said before how he would like to eat together, when you are the sole breadwinner, ensuring that you all do things to make sure you are a part of the family is important. From the outside looking in, I would suggest things were escalating quickly, it does not surprise me that the prosecution believed the assertion that JC had had enough and was leaving MM. All the signs are there.

Another problem with that recording is the accent. Perhaps JC's accent had changed a bit while living in the US, but that sounded more like a Dublin accent to me. Other Irish people have also picked up on this.

Does anyone remember at the time that the voice message from JC Jr was received by MM she said it was a cruel prank? I seem to have some recollection of this for some reason but it is a bit vague and I can't recall the source. Will have a proper look for it later -does anyone else have a memory of this or am I imagining it?

Here's a video of the NC Womens Correctional facility. Quite a change from the home and life JC gave her.

So I just watched that all the way through.

There's one woman who's got life without parole for the first degree murder of her husband and she has no excuse, even saying he was a good man. She also used to work in a correctional facility.
Which goes to show that just because a person might work in a job related to containing criminals, it doesn't make them immune if they also commit a crime.
TM and his family are still under the impression that it should.

Also, MM is going to have a hard time if she tries her pity-me act, when there's women in that jail for the same offense as her, who also claimed self-defense. One woman shot her husband in the head - a much cleaner death than the one JC suffered. They're going to be like, oh, you only got 20 to 25 years, second degree?

I want to weigh in on this but it's not necessarily my belief it will succeed, or my hope it will happen. Regarding the appeal, I think it's possible they might not just be seeking a new trial, but two new trials. Or two separate appeals for TM & MM rather than in-concert?

TM may have been dragged into it believing something to be true that really wasn't. The jury foreman said they believe TM got physically involved when JC size over MM became a factor. I thought it was odd that TM testified knowing nothing about the brick? How could that be? Seems like the foreman could be saying there was once a lifeline for TM for self defense before the coverup. IDK

MM is a deceitful diva, a malingerer feigning DV, that has caused additional problems for TM, IMO. I think she is a sick girl, and her personality issues are real, but she has been deceiving the law now for two years. And is incapable of coming clean, not even for her father's sake. I wonder if TM could be persuaded to talk about his daughter in relation to the crime now that he's in jail? Who knows?

BTW The assertion that JC hurt MFC is over the top. What man would choke a newborn nursing mother of his own child? It defies reason and logic. Makes MM look totally beyond the pale. What a piece of work she turned out to be. JMO

Its a good call re the separate trials, will they have that option though I wonder? I thought it was the DA's choice whether to try them together or separately. But it would def be in TM's interests to have a separate trial. Seeing how the jury responded to him, he could try to present an image of someone who had no choice but to cover for his daughter. It might work better for him.

I do wonder if that's why SM (brother) has been absent from proceedings, perhaps he is exasperated that hid father is once again covering for his sister.

I agree, when you need to turn someone into a monster you lose all credibility IMO.

Does anyone remember at the time that the voice message from JC Jr was received by MM she said it was a cruel prank? I seem to have some recollection of this for some reason but it is a bit vague and I can't recall the source. Will have a proper look for it later -does anyone else have a memory of this or am I imagining it?

I think she is claiming that she received two voice-mails from JC, this one, which she believes was him being manipulated into coercing her into breaking her bail conditions by phoning him back, and another one she claims she received in the middle of the night where she was called crude names. I think it was the independent that wrote the piece on it, it was in the article where EMM defends MM from drinking margaritas and driving with the kids. (ironic given that she was drinking mojitos when she drove to collect JC after the party the night his father died)

Today's indo article. What I can't figure out from what has happened since the trial as in the abc interviews, the go fund account and now interviews to the press on the martens behalf is why none of this was introduced at trial. ME refers to evidence not presented but is there a reason it was not introduced? Perhaps a procedural or evidenciary issue, maybe the lawyer viewing this thread could give his thoughts on this. . I just don't see the point of talking about it now. My guess is they had banked on the kids interviews being allowed and that would have opened the door to them discussing home life, Molly's friends and family testifying and recordings etc being used. Is it because the interviews were not allowed, they could not go down this route as they would have been relying on the interviews as the evidence entered? . If there was no evidence why do they keep harping on about it. It can't be introduced either in the appeal as far as I know so what's the point of it all, it serves no good to anyone, it won't have any impact on their sentences. It's all quite bizarre!

The less oxygen that is given to this campaign the better, starve it & it will die.

“Did a couple of those arise to the point where if you just read them would the average person consider them a threat? Then yes, there have been a few.”He added: “Another family member, they were told you better sleep with your eyes open.”It is understood that those ‘veiled threats’ have come from Americans across the United States who are appalled at the fundraising campaign.

Does anyone remember at the time that the voice message from JC Jr was received by MM she said it was a cruel prank? I seem to have some recollection of this for some reason but it is a bit vague and I can't recall the source. Will have a proper look for it later -does anyone else have a memory of this or am I imagining it?

Totally agree...he stated in the article that its his own 'countrymen' who are threatening him. If they stopped putting themselves in the public realm, they wouldn't have to deal with the abuse. It is basic common sense really.

Totally agree...he stated in the article that its his own 'countrymen' who are threatening him. If they stopped putting themselves in the public realm, they wouldn't have to deal with the abuse. It is basic common sense really.

Apart for the fact that ME is taking another stance, they are now being "terrorised from across the ocean". Would someone please buy them a shovel.

I agree, when I heard the clip it took me back to the last picture of JC alive taken two weeks before his death where he looks sad and broken. It was at the dinner where MM told WC that she wanted JC to allow her to adopt the kids.

If you listen to the actual words in the audio clip rather than the tone I think JC had realised that MM was trying to isolate him from the children. It appears as though he has come home from work to have dinner and they have already eaten and she wants the kids to start making pancakes. He has obviously said before how he would like to eat together, when you are the sole breadwinner, ensuring that you all do things to make sure you are a part of the family is important. From the outside looking in, I would suggest things were escalating quickly, it does not surprise me that the prosecution believed the assertion that JC had had enough and was leaving MM. All the signs are there.

Logic lady completely agree. If you listen carefully at the beginning JC says something and MM then states 'are you finished' a child replies no. JC then gets annoyed saying he just wanted to have dinner with his family. Seems that he is arriving home and they are finishing up.

Just finished watching the 20/20 episode. Noticed at one point they included a picture of WC with the children and not JC. Surely they would have realised that was not him? The bit that really got me was MM at the end. When asked whether she was going to rebuild her life she replies 'you can't ever get your life back when something like that happens. My life ended that day they took the kids'. Nothing about the death of her husband. Always about the children.

Just finished watching the 20/20 episode. Noticed at one point they included a picture of WC with the children and not JC. Surely they would have realised that was not him? The bit that really got me was MM at the end. When asked whether she was going to rebuild her life she replies 'you can't ever get your life back when something like that happens. My life ended that day they took the kids'. Nothing about the death of her husband. Always about the children.

I had to listen to this twice because the first time I was distracted and couldn't stop laughing by the description of Molly as an "international model." What??????? Like she's Giselle or Kate Moss.......

In the recent TV documentary she described herself as a medical doctor who for whatever reason did not become a doctor, and instead at the age of twenty-four looked online for babysitting jobs. She hit the jackpot with Jason and rumor is that her first activity on day one as a babysitter was the seduction of Jason.