I was at this casino minding my own business, and this guy came up to me and said, "You're gonna have to move, you're blocking a fire exit." As though if there was a fire, I wasn't gonna run. If you're flammible and have legs, you are never blocking a fire exit. - Mitch Hedberg

Some of the Wintersun vocals are "black metal", but Shagrath has no good clean voc, he couldn't compose a good song to save his life, play the guitar like Yngwie and lots of other things the Wintersun composer can do. BTW the Dimmu members put all their good ideas on the Old Man's Child albums

As for Anselmo and the sludge /stoner crap I mean it's good for some beer party with some retarded childhood friends

BTW when I see your username it always reminds me of the Summoning album... Now that's a good black metal band.

Yngwie is boring. He is the best technical guitar player, no doubt. But I find him boring, IMO Dimebag was the best guitar player ever.

Summoning is a good band, but I was just a teenager back then and I just can't listen to black metal atm. Also, not sure about Wintersun but a lot of black metal clean vocals didn't come from mail vocals but rather from bass player or so.

Btw if you don't like Pantera/Down etc, sorry mate you're beyond my help

Yngwie is boring. He is the best technical guitar player, no doubt. But I find him boring, IMO Dimebag was the best guitar player ever.

Summoning is a good band, but I was just a teenager back then and I just can't listen to black metal atm. Also, not sure about Wintersun but a lot of black metal clean vocals didn't come from mail vocals but rather from bass player or so.

Btw if you don't like Pantera/Down etc, sorry mate you're beyond my help

Yngwie is a good shredder and composer, he's not the über progressive kind but most musicians like him. Dimebag is not bad but he has the floods solo the cemetery gates solo and a few others I can count on my fingers. The s**tty genre he sold his soul to totally stifled him. All the clean solo vocals on the wintersun albums are from the boss, there are some backing vocs from the other members and some guest musicians in the choir.

Jeff Loomis is a good progressive guitarist imo. From the oldschoolers Marty Friedman

I agree some of the 80s shredders can be boring with their pentatonic/ blues scalesMany criticize Yngwie for his overuse of minor harmonic stuff but nobody can deny he's a great player/songwriter

Yngwie is boring. He is the best technical guitar player, no doubt. But I find him boring, IMO Dimebag was the best guitar player ever.

Summoning is a good band, but I was just a teenager back then and I just can't listen to black metal atm. Also, not sure about Wintersun but a lot of black metal clean vocals didn't come from mail vocals but rather from bass player or so.

Btw if you don't like Pantera/Down etc, sorry mate you're beyond my help

Yngwie is a good shredder and composer, he's not the über progressive kind but most musicians like him. Dimebag is not bad but he has the floods solo the cemetery gates solo and a few others I can count on my fingers. The s**tty genre he sold his soul to totally stifled him. All the clean solo vocals on the wintersun albums are from the boss, there are some backing vocs from the other members and some guest musicians in the choir.

Jeff Loomis is a good progressive guitarist imo. From the oldschoolers Marty Friedman

I agree some of the 80s shredders can be boring with their pentatonic/ blues scalesMany criticize Yngwie for his overuse of minor harmonic stuff but nobody can deny he's a great player/songwriter

You can count his solos on fingers?. Not sure what you meant there I'm afraid?

You can count his solos on fingers?. Not sure what you meant there I'm afraid?

Haha, I meant that even though Dimebag is a great player, he has the swing, the groove, the feeling, he has few solos and even those are very short. I mean common, even that junky Mustaine has some entertaining mega solos. Dunno much about the history of Pantera because I don't like the band but Dime should either have stayed glam and improve himself in that genre or he should have moved into prog metal or anything except the Anselmo era Pantera . However, I assure you that I really like and respect Dimebag.

dunno why you keep on saying that those guys are junkies, but what the hell. Sure thing you wouldn't know about it. Even with black metal bands.

But nvm, I really stopped comparing music looong ago, all I can say that IMO Phil has the best voice for the music I enjoy listening to.Pantera imo, will always stay as #1. Such originality is yet to be heard.All these new elves and goblins and whatnot in black metal don't know what originality is anymore. Writing about fairytales, dragons and such.I couldn't care less about how fast a certain melody is, or what a guitarist is capable of. All that matters is his vision. I'm more than sure Dimebag would have matched all those fancy high fast melodies by Yngwie if he wanted to. But that just wasn't his style.

Also 'Anselmo era Pantera', is the ONLY Pantera. All the stuff prior to '86 its just not it.I still don't get your remark of Dimebag tho... He has few solos? Almost every Pantera song has solo in it.About his quality.. Have you ever played guitar before? If you have, you'd know.

All these new elves and goblins and whatnot in black metal don't know what originality is anymore.

Who cares about the lyrics. Most of the innovations in metal MUSIC are in black metal and tech death. Anyway, Anselmo can be proud of his lyrics about selling drugs to the rich man's daughter. And shagging other people's girlfriends. Now that's very mature and "gangsta". You know what? I prefer goblins and elves anytime. No wonder I even know a Pantera fan who calls his fave band "peasant rock". He's also making jokes about Pantera being the favourite band of inbred meth fiends like the Smashing Pumpkins bassist chick. Seriously, even Pantera fans don't take this fanboyism thing as seriously as you....

I couldn't care less about how fast a certain melody is, or what a guitarist is capable of. All that matters is his vision. I'm more than sure Dimebag would have matched all those fancy high fast melodies by Yngwie if he wanted to.

No because Dimebag doesn't know crap about music theory K fanboy I didn't want to wake u up but Dimebag's influences are Van Halen, Kiss and the rest of the 80s musicians , Dimebag uses the same pentatonic, blues scales and the usual stuff like an average 80s player. Where is that big originality? In a fanboy's mind.

Dimebag is limited not only musically but also techically. Pantera fanboys are like "Maaan what a screech, omgz he tapped on that bending and wow, there was AH on that divebomb" but they never think about why he never uses sweep picking or other hard techniques.

Anyway, people can criticize any guitarist, Hammett uses wah effect to hide his s**tty playing, Mustaine never taps, Trey Azagthoth taps too much. To be honest that's very stupid. The only reason I went into this s**t-throwing contest is because I posted something that's not black metal at all and you use it as a basis to bash BM for being "immature" but hey , here's the solution: Anselmo's simplistic stoner project which I wouldn't even call music. Also, your arguments contain 0% music and 100% BS, man, that really provokes a Pantera bashing... Anyway, we should focus on the positive aspects of different genres and bands instead...

I really stopped taking you seriously after you called me a fanboy. I see you practice these things on a regular daily basis.You got too sentimental on such small things. I wanted to make this post as elaborate as I can, but it really should be this simple:

You don't like Pantera, I do.You don't care about the lyrics, I really much do care.

Also, you'll notice I haven't gone into 'sh!t throwing contest', I just stated that most of nowadays black metal bands are just copying the great musicians that came from that genre. Nothing against black metal tho. And you gave me that idiotic rasta smile referring to Down as stoner crap.....

On the subject of Lugburz... That was just first thing in mind as account name, taken from LOTR book. I don't mind fantasy books, although I don't read them as I used to when I was younger.But I don't like fantasy music.

You can say whatever you want about Pantera lyrics but no one can take them for granted.Most of the lyrics are just hatin' on popular trends, mainstream piece of crap etc etc.

Also, I stopped being fanboy of any band looong ago, so I really couldn't be insulted by your remark, but that was just immature comment tbh hehe

Anyway, there was no need for you to get cocky when I asked you whether you play guitar or not. I play it too, and I've had many endless discussions with others about the techniques of certain guitarists. What we all learned by that long ago, you can't compare them. You can compare their techniques, but thats hard as well, because some of them were not posting their 'master techniques' on yt just for showing off. Some of them don't need ultra fast solos to make a certain song better. Or to make headlines in fanboys magazines how fast was it.

I've had many endless discussions with others about the techniques of certain guitarists.

Really man? Good to know because none of your posts contain any detail which would support your claims about your knowledge of music/the guitar. Of course I believe you have a vast knowledge of metal and music in general. Just for the fun of it I could ask you some harmless questions which you wouldn't be able to google the answers to or just ask you to analyze the music and technique of certain guitarists in your own way, naturally I would know whether the answers are from you or some other source. However, I trust you and we don't need childish games like that anyway. Let's focus on metal instead. Here's a good "jam" from MAB:

Ty for that link, that was really good improvisation of classic, which btw my current guitarist played with his previous band.

Just to close our topic on Pantera, Yes thats my fave band, but not in thousand years am I a fanboy lol.I know what where influences of Dimebag's, he's eve buried in KISS's kasket lol. But that hardly says it all, the SOUND of his guitar is unique, nowhere near Kiss or Van Halen. Anyone would recognize his sound.

About your little games lol. Those actually might not work, as english is not my first language, so I prolly wouldn't know ALL the technical terms for certain techniques But yeah I do play guitar, which I must admit is collecting dust atm, because I'm currently playing bass. Although I was mostly playing riffs and such in previous band, while I left solos to much interested man hehe

It's not my mother tongue either Btw I have no problems with Pantera at all, and my favourite guitarist is actually Ted Nugent who's obviously inferior to Dime (I know I know we shouldn't compare them and he's from a different era to begin with but still), but he's a great guy and I spent years listening to his concerts as a kid. Here's another fav of mine, Trey Azagthoth. His solos are