As I said in This topic I'm really getting sick of being ignored, having to work to be even vaguely accepted then having people piss off.

I keep hearing wedding bells from my flat and part of me wants to go down and scrawl graffiti on the walls, or spray the place with paint, or do whatever I can to ruin it. Of course, I wouldn't do this, but it's getting dam hard not to feel jealous of people, especially those who just walk into relationships or can be accepted instantly.

How do you stop hating? individually, I don't hate anyone, but collectively I'm finding it dam hard not to feel a huge amount of jealosy, especially when I contemplate all those people who I went to uni with who are now wrapped up in their partners and mariages. Being content being alone would be easy if I didn't live in the midst of a crowd of other people, indeed sometimes I'd really like to be robinson cruso.

Undoubtedly it'll happen again, I'll meet another new group of people, I'll work to be accepted, then someone will tell me all their personal problems, likely say lots of admiring things, I might even get that lovely little lie "you would make a great boyfriend" however all of it means nothing, because people still don't bother! and it's hard not to hate for that. HArd not to hate thw women who just need to sit their and do fuck all to find a relationship, or the men who wander into places and push themselves forward or make fucking eye contact ucking all evening! god how do you stop hating!

As I said, individually, Idon't hate anyone, indeed if I think of ever perpetrating an act of hatred, even a verbal insult I just recoil from the idea, because fundamentally I still feel empathy, ---- but how do you stop the jealousy, how do you stop hearing those wedding bells and wanting to spit?

Oh yes, there are people in worse situations, but that doesn't really help, that's like someone punching you in the stomach and then saying "well at least your leg isn't broken" it still dam well hurts!

Two posts today on jealousy - yours and Brian's (si). I'm glad you posted and I keep reading here because it helps me discover new things about myself. I'm probably one of the people you hate though because I have a wife and 4 kids and sometimes don't appreciate them like I should. I have been jealous during parts of my recovery and really didn't know why. I've been thinking about it most of the morning since reading these posts.

I think the reason I sometimes don't appreciate what I have AND the reason why I went through a phase of being jealous is that down deep I didn't like myself. I didn't think I was worthy of having the things I had at the time AND jealous of the things others had. I think the jealousy comes from seeing it and wanting it, but down deep knowing that I'm not worthy of it at the same time.

When I started my therapy again last year I tried to reintegrate back into society in a way I hadn't done in decades. I was lucky because I did have a wife and 4 daughters who for some reason love me, although I don't always feel worth being loved. My issues were about interacting with other men. I remember trying to make some guy friends and when I would see them being good friends with other guys I would have these intense feelings of jealousy - how could they have that friendship with other guys so easily. I wanted that kind of friendship too! What was wrong with me that I couldn't make these kinds of friendships?

I don't think I ever answered that question for myself. I just kept plugging away in my recovery. I think at some point I started to like who I was becoming. As I started to do that I was able to let go of the jealousy and just be happy with the friendships that I had just the way they were. I could be OK with how they progressed as opposed to how I wanted them progress. If they didn't progress or ended, and some did :-(, then I just kept moving on. I kept putting myself out there and made new friends.

I know I don't have the same feelings of jealousy that I did when I started trying to get better a year ago this summer. Is it because I love myself more now. IDK. I'm still figuring this stuff out, but it felt that as I got more confident and put myself out there more I started to just be happy for those around me as opposed to just wanting what they had.

Do I still want some close guy friendships? Yep, but I just focus on how to do that now as opposed to seeing how every other guy seems to be able to do this without any trouble. I'll get there.

I hope this helps in some way. It helped me.

_________________________
"Me too"-I don't think I will ever get tired of saying or hearing these two words. My StoryProgress

Dark Empathy - you and I have shared the same sense of jealousy, and we even PM'ed each other about it a couple of times. I understand your anger and frustration all too well.

Reading your post reminded me of those feelings - and then made me realize its been a couple months since I felt the burning jealousy eating away at me.

Rich made the valid point that as he liked himself more and more, the jealousy started slipping away.

Something's happened to me in the last couple of months - I'm starting to like myself. Even dig myself. Starting to see myself as a fine wine, and as I age and get wiser, how awesome I'm becoming. Wow, did I just say that? I'm becoming awesome?

Anyway - the feelings of jealousy are slipping away from me to. And I suppose it is in direct correlation to how good I feel about myself. I'm staying on this path.

I appreciate the comments, but the problem is for me it feels like I've been there, done that, and guess what, they didn't have the T shirt.

Earlier this year I went to a new production, I met a fantastic group of people, I even got to almost feeling as though I was part of the group. I helped people out, heck I hugged more people (of both genders), than I have for years. I thought "oh yeah, this is it, this is what I used to have"

It also doesn't help that all the people I used to think were my friends, were always there, were the people who, on those few occasions I felt so much pain I needed another person just to be there I could talk to, have got married, moved miles around the country and don't bother.

Oh yes, I'll have to do all this again, to meet a new group of people and have to work so dam hard just to have people even recognize I exist, and I'll even get people telling me their problems but that's as far as it goes, I put in all the work and get no where!

I can sit and think happy thoughts about me until the cows come home, but fundamentally the problem isn't me, indeed as sartre said, hell is other people.

Other people are really admiring, I'm really clever, I'm really tallented, I would make a great boyfriend, but if this is all true, then why don't other people sodding bother? it's as if I'm basically a peace of artwork people occasionally either admire or ignore, just a statue in the corner that might show off craftsmanship and nothing more.

Relating to others simply as friends is bad enough, ---- but when you put relationships into the mix, or the sort of connect I've seen betwene people who are together, well it's just dam hard not! to hate, because fundamentally if I'm such a lovely person,then why is the closest anyone has ever wanted to get to me while spitting in my face? why have I had my own sperm slapped in my face and never been kissed?

"oh yeah, you'd make a great boyfriend?" well thanks a great deal, it's easy for you! to say that.

And the sad thing is, that if someone did! say that I wouldn't be able to tell them to sod off, because for all the jealousy I still can't will to hurt others.

I just feel at the moment with recovery, with me, I've done as much as i can do alone, and not in the therapist sense, just in the sense of needing someone, ---- particularly someone in a loving romatnic sense, since how the hell do you change genophobia when nobody actually wants! that sort of connection with you.

I know myself, I know what I feel, I know how I react and can disregard worthlessness, but none of that helps, because fundamentally soceity is a club I missed out on being a part of, and there's a strict no talking to none members policy!

God I wish I was female, it's so fucking easy for women!

Don't believe me? just look at the stats for single disabled men as per women, it's much higher! I'm not joking, I did actually find a report on this!

Sorry for what you are going through. I wish I had more insights for you. I do think that if I didn't find and marry the women that I did I too would be alone without much prospect of finding another person to live out the rest of my life with.

Did you ever think about just giving up on the idea of finding someone to spend your life with? What would that life look like? I only say that because it was when I stopped getting close to anyone to keep from getting hurt that I met my wife and unexpectantly fell in love. Maybe if you give up on it, but leave the door open it will happen and if it doesn't you will still be moving on and trying to find some happiness.

Also, it sounds like you can met people quite easily (I can't). Have you tried just looking up someone that you met and just flat out asking them why it didn't work out? What do you have to lose? Maybe they will talk to you and you will learn something new about yourself. I learn new stuff about myself all the time. I wish I didn't. Can't there ever be any smooth sailing once in while...

_________________________
"Me too"-I don't think I will ever get tired of saying or hearing these two words. My StoryProgress

Yes, tried that, see my resolution. I resolved in 2009 not ot feel that anymore. The problem is it didn't work, neither did it magically cause me to suddenly get together with someone.

As to "Someone I used to be together with" you don't understand what I want. I don't want an until death do as part relationship, I don't even know what that means, I just want an emotional, physical connection to someone, something that goes beyond friendship. maybe that lasts, maybe it doesn't, I don't know, I've no experience because nobody wants that sort of connection with me on any basis whatsoever!

Looking up someone I met and asking why it didn't work out? well it didn't work out because I never met anyone in that sense. Oh yah,i! felt a lot, I fell in love like a fool, always with friends, always with people I got on with, heck not even infstantly, but it never did me any good at all, even when I passed all my demons and actually did something to show what I felt, like take someone's hand or admit it, --- the three times I've done that it failed myserably "oh I'm flattered!" was the resposne I got, ---- flattered?

Again, part of me wants to just hate, but it is so dam hard for this.

I used to think I could easily connect with people as friends, but I'm now really questioning this. once I've sat through being ignored, someone will dane to speak to me eventually, and then we chat, I use all that social armory to put people at ease, people spend time, people tell me their problems, ---- then they merrily fuck the hell off! Oh yeah wow, he's amazing, we have to remember he fucking exists sometimes!

I ought to be a therapist, people treat me like one after all, come for the appointment then sod off, and at least I might as well have people pay me if they are all so dam self obsessed as to not want to give me even a bit of friendship, accept I have no idea what the hell i'd do with the money anyway.

I
agree that my access and use of the MaleSurvivor discussion forums and
chat room is subject to the terms of this Agreement. AND the sole
discretion of MaleSurvivor. I agree that my use of MaleSurvivor
resources are AT-WILL,
and that my posting privileges may be terminated at any time, and for
any reason by MaleSurvivor.