Blake_T wrote:building off Brad's throwing a hammer idea, pick up a pen or pencil and hold it at one end and backhand it across the room (you don't need to use much if any torso rotation for this). try to make the pen fly straight ahead with a lot of zip. i'm 99% certain you will fling the pen without your elbow straightening all the way but you will likely have tons of wrist extension.

part of timing means you have to allow for certain motions to happen when they should and not trying to force an absolute body position without regard to the flow of the disc.

tossing a pen/pencil a dozen times or should probably give you a rough idea of how much the elbow will want to straighten (keeping in mind a larger mass object will make it straighten a bit more than the pen) in order to facilitate wrist extension.

always remember that it's how you impart the forces you generate onto the disc that are more important than any body position.

Wow. I think I have been messing around with throwing pencils for a while as an easy training method from here in the office. Well, after a co-worker making fun of me today, i thought i would fake him out and act like i was going to throw the pencil at him. Loose grip on the pencil, reached back to right pec and then "Let `er Rip! Only i tried to hold tight to the pencil at the very last second.

Felt great. Didn't realize that is where i want to be bearing down last second. Can't wait to try this later tonight after work with some plastic.

Its going to be Epic.

Accuracy is Slow. Slow is Smooth. Smooth is Fast. Fast is Far.The Less Effort, The Faster and More Powerful You Will Be - Bruce LeeKnow What You Throw. Throw What You Know.It's Not A Routine If You Have To Think About It.-=| Click Here To See What's Currently In My Bag |=-

WOW! That's one of the many words I can use to describe this thread guys. When I asked a simple question, I never though it would get so in-depth and help so many poeple! I have been keeping up with this thread since day 1 and trying to soak it in piece by piece instead of trying too much too quick. I can honestly say that the tips and awesome exercises yall have donated have help my game improve drastically. Not only am I throwing in the 350' range, I am more importantly parking more and more shots around the basket. Its getting to be perfect weather out there and its only up from here on out! Thanks to all who have chipped in and dont let me stop yall from keeping the great posts comin'.

Wow. I can honestly say that I have never felt like I had such control over a disc and how much snap i can generate!

I had to basically club up on a few discs since some of my more "tuned" discs were getting a little squirley on me. Not a bad thing. Not at all. Manged to bang out a 500foot hyzer flip shot with a mildly beaten wraith. Just got up to flat and took off.

Even the guys I were playing with, who i play with frequently, noticed that I was busting out some very accurate and very high speed shots. And the spin! I have never had a long distance hyzer shot hit the ground and start to roll back towards the tee box! I think they were all trying to throw pencils or sharpies by the end of the round.

This has got me really stoked and I cant wait to play again tomorrow! I think this might be what finally gets me to a 500foot flat and straight throw. This and wrist and hand strength training. I dont think i have every felt this much control and power before. I need to get some footage of my throw up after Bowling Green Ams and get my form critiqued. Im not sure that I was chopping my elbow much before today and i could really tell that I was chopping the elbow while trying to "catch the pencil" as I guess you would call it.

Tomorrow im heading to an open course just so i can throw some rollers and see what they do!

Accuracy is Slow. Slow is Smooth. Smooth is Fast. Fast is Far.The Less Effort, The Faster and More Powerful You Will Be - Bruce LeeKnow What You Throw. Throw What You Know.It's Not A Routine If You Have To Think About It.-=| Click Here To See What's Currently In My Bag |=-

Sorry if im overtly excited. I havent had a real game-changing break through really in almost a 2 years when i first broke the 400 foot flat golf shot.

Since that time, i have gone through many changes in form. I started by working from a standstill shot to slowly incorporating steps until i got to a very slow and smooth 3 and a half x-step throwing form.

From there I began to rework my throw mechanics. I have a very natural slight hyzer to my throws so I decided to take advantage of that power range. I went from a very Scott Stokley-esqe and the sling shot method to a Ken Climo inspired throw. Accuracy went up, power went down. Focused on trying to get the power back by doing a little Feldberg style. Power came back, accuracy on disc angles went away. Brought in a little Steve Brinster bent elbow. Power was great. Felt effortless, and could really control disc angle. Lost my flight lines. Switched to a Carolina style bent elbow and got the flight line back but lost the power. Tried doing like Nikko does, with the no point arm locked, cocked, and ready to rock style. Got the most power out of all the forms. Clean lines on hyzers and anhyzers. Even had a few splash outs and a bunch of near aces. Only issue was everthing was coming out at 2 o`clock instead of 12 o`clock. Tried to compensate with my angle on the TeePad, but i just couldn't do it. First real disc golf techniques i got from Scott Stokely's book, and i just really understand and love the idea behind the sling shot technique. I have to throw on a line and dont like having to throw in to a line.

Got to thinking about it and Barry Schultz does this sort of reach on this throw. Unlike some pros, he reaches towards 10 o`clock, back to 6 o`clock, then comes out on 12 o`clock. Tried it just once and it was like night and day. Been throwing it for 3 days now and I have to say it is working great for me. Power, Angle Control, Accuracy, Distance... now to master the form.

Then, today i figure out about when to really try to grip the disc at the last second...

Im simply estatic. Only now i feel that my sidearm is lacking. Got to start reworking the accuracy on it.

Im not going to mess with my style or technique anymore unti after Bowling Green. Count on seeing some footage after that. I want to see what other little stuff im missing.

Last edited by USAnarchy on Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:32 am, edited 2 times in total.

Accuracy is Slow. Slow is Smooth. Smooth is Fast. Fast is Far.The Less Effort, The Faster and More Powerful You Will Be - Bruce LeeKnow What You Throw. Throw What You Know.It's Not A Routine If You Have To Think About It.-=| Click Here To See What's Currently In My Bag |=-

BeachBum wrote:Thanks for the inside drills JHern...it does feel effortless when I do this. Obviously I am trying to strong-arm the disc, becuase without a disc in my hand, I get a lot more snap from my wrist using my lower body to bring me from my reachback. Cant wait to practice and incorporate this into my routine.

Great! Glad it helped. The feeling of the throw is everything. You could technically get your body into all the correct positions and everything during a throw, but still be throwing with the arm muscles instead of using your core to whip your arm passively. Only your muscles will really know the difference (well, we'll be able to see that the arm doesn't whip forward as fast either). So getting the feeling of using the torso to whip your lower arm out from the elbow as a fulcrum is the most important thing, and to strive for the feeling more than any other aspect.

Give this a few weeks and focus on it, and you'll be up to 350' in no time.

Have fun!

Ok, question for Jhern and others. I have been trying several different things to prevent me from strong arming my drivers (this doesn't happen on mids/short range shots). First, I've been doing Feldberg's "towel tip." I can pop a towel with my BH drive form like no other. It's loud and very fast. However, when I get out to the field or the course, I regress and get only very limited snap. I think it's pretty much as others have said about getting a disc in their hand and what that does.

What can I do to improve and incorporate the towel technique I've learned into actual practice? This is one of the most baffling aspects of my game I've encountered in the 10 years I've played.

Help!?!

Daniel

My putter doinks harder than yours!

Z Pred~E*Boss~E*TB~Roadrunner~Fuse~Buzzz~Comet~Aviar

Frank Delicious wrote:I try to psyche people out on my card. I usually do this by getting nude around the 4th hole.

Your arms only goal is to get the disc to the right pec then it can go wild. It helped me just to limp arm the throws for a while. You'd be surprised how far you can go without consciously trying to pull hard with your arm.

Redisculous:

Lateley I feel more like I am just trying to throw my arm with my torso than throwing the disc with my arm.

Fact 1: 300 ft is about as far as most men can throw using primarily the strength of their arm to propel the disc. For women it is closer to 230 ft.

Fact 2: The fact that you get the same distance no matter how you do your step implies that you aren't getting anything out of your legs, which drive your torso, which is the platform for your shoulders...

Your arm is of order 10X less powerful than your legs/torso. Stop throwing with your arm! Your arm is only useful for positioning and gripping, other than that, it is purely passive. Your arm needs to be turned into a whip that is driven by the powerful motion of your legs/hips/torso/shoulders.

Here's an exercise I might suggest:

Stand still with your arms at your side, completely relaxed. Turn your hips and torso back slowly and then rotate your hips quickly to the open position. Your arms should be whipped out and around in a windmill motion, without you using a single muscle in your arms. That's the feeling you should be aiming for.

Next do the same thing, except extend your throwing elbow out sideways from your body and hold it there (as if you put a vice around your shoulder). Allow your lower throwing arm and hand to hang limp from your elbow. Do it as if your arm were asleep and some mechanical device was locked onto your shoulder to keep the elbow pointed out side ways from your torso. Don't allow your elbow to move forward or backward, nor up nor down. It is completely locked in place, as if you no longer even had a shoulder joint and your upper arm were fused into your shoulder so that it would always point out sideways.

Now slowly turn your hips and torso back, and turn them abruptly open again. Don't use a single muscle in your arm! Now you should find that you've turned your arm into a whip. Your lower arm should be whipping forward super-fast. In fact, you can whip your lower arm forward way faster in this manner than your arm muscles could ever dream of doing. Your arm muscle strength decreases rapidly as speed increases, so they are useless anyways...trying to use them will only slow down this motion. You'll find that whipping your lower arm forward in this manner, with the elbow "stopped," will feel relatively effortless in comparison to trying to throw with your arm as you've probably been doing before.

Practice getting this feeling for a while. (Later you can work on the grip and positioning in finer detail, but for now focus on using your legs/hips/torso/shoulders as the powerful motor for whipping your arm forward.)

First time poster here on DGR just wanted to thank JHern for dropping this awesome bit of knowledge. I've been using this exercise for over a month now and it has been extremely helpful. Boosted my max from 350' (swingin for the fences) to a upwards of 420' with a lot less effort and a lot more fluidity.

Whoa, whoa, whoa. There's still plenty of meat on that bone. Now you take this home, throw it in a pot, add some broth, a potato. Baby, you've got a stew going.

Accuracy is Slow. Slow is Smooth. Smooth is Fast. Fast is Far.The Less Effort, The Faster and More Powerful You Will Be - Bruce LeeKnow What You Throw. Throw What You Know.It's Not A Routine If You Have To Think About It.-=| Click Here To See What's Currently In My Bag |=-