Posted:15th Mar 2001They have the dance gymnastic events wil couples and the singles with the ball/ribbon/hoop. They have or are going to have ball room dancing. Thay have synchronized swimming for god's sake..I think it should be an extension of the Tae Kwon Do competition. Make it a weapons event, like in most Martial Arts tournaments.That would be off the hook! rightdrew------------------"Only the warrior that hears the call will know when to leave, Where to go" -unknown

Posted:15th Mar 2001I'm working for the World Games at the moment which is an international multi-sports event for sports that can't get into the olympics. There are some cool sports, trampoline, rugby 7's, dance sports but no Poi If somebody was willing to set up an International Poi Federation and apply to the IWGA (International World Games) -you never know we might see POI at the 7th World Games in Duisberg. If you are interested in seeing what the 6th Games are about then check out http://www.wg2001.or.jpIwould love to see Poi in the next World Games!!Kat------------------"London is a city coming down from its trip and there's going to be a lot of refugees" - Danny,Withnail & I

Come faeries, take me out of this dull world, for I would ride with you upon the wind and dance upon the mountains like a flame.

Posted:15th Mar 2001im with Kat on that one. poi should be an olympic event or with superman as poi being a weapons competition. poi would really com in handy against an opponent in a fight.SsJ KaKaRoTtO"The world is hell!"

Posted:15th Mar 2001I wouldn't be so excited about a move to make poi an Olympic event. There's a lot of bureaucracy involved; the sport must be practiced in a certain number of countries (not a problem for poi) each with national federations with a certain number of members (clearly a problem for poi). I used to be a triathlete, and I saw the sport subtly transformed by the drive to become an Olympic sport--not for the better, IMHO.In my mind, poi is too strongly a counter-cultural phenomenon to survive the transition to Olympic event in any form we'd recognize. I think it's a fair bet that if poi ever *did* make it to the Olympics, it would not be with fire.I am not a snowboarder, but I get the impression that hardcore snowboarders have similarly mixed feelings towards the Olympics--on the one hand, the recognition is great; on the other, it is painful to see a countercultural activity become institutionalized. Perhaps Kat can step in here.

Posted:16th Mar 2001I personally would hate to compete in a Poi or a snowboarding event. Besides the fact that I'm really not good enough,I know that it would take from the enjoyment if I was worrying about competing. I don't like competing - bad memories of bitchy little girls on the Irish dancing circuit when I was a kid I suppose. For many people though the thrill of pitting your skill against others is half the excitement. I think the reason that many boarders don't like competition is that the relaxed comraderie that exists between boarders is threatened during competition. That risk exists if Poi became a competitive olympic event also. Poi could be classed as a demonstration sport however, where top class Poi'ers demonstrate their skills. That way Poi'ers can strut their stuff without introducing a competitive element. Off the record though, as an insider I would say that there is a lot of backbiting within federations and National organisations. Adamrice makes a very valid point.------------------"London is a city coming down from its trip and there's going to be a lot of refugees" - Danny,Withnail & I

Come faeries, take me out of this dull world, for I would ride with you upon the wind and dance upon the mountains like a flame.

Non-Https Image Linksorry, dont mean to offend or be rude, but i rekon,( and this is only oppinion), that doing poi as a competition or weapons event is a TERRIBLE idea. it goes against everything that i learned poi for. When i spin fire i love to think of happy things, and try to enjoy the spiritual side of it, not thinking of harming a fellow artist with my poi. Non-Https Image Link even though the shaolin monks do something very similar to poi (7-part staff), at least there is a noble and understandable reason for it.sorry if that sounded too much like a moan, C'and'U-------------------------------"some people see the world as it is and ask why? others see the world as they want to, and ask, why not?"

Posted:18th Feb 2002hmmmmm, well, seeing as how the winter olympics are on right now, ijust thought id bring this back up...i do beleive poi could make it into the olympics relatively unalteredits only counter culture because the people who do it involve it other forms of counter culture, such as the raves and clubs...when you take away the lights, and the music, and the drugs, and the tight leather pants, or baggy raver pants, guess what, you still have the poi, you still have the moves, and you still have the same incredible effect (at least for me)i know i can spin on a beach, in a swim suit, with no music but the waves for hours, and be more happy than when i spin in a club or dance environment...you put me in a dark room with judges watching me and a medal at stake, and guess what, its still the same sport...for those who truly love the sport, and do it merely for the sport, it will survive a transistion to the olympics...let us take snowboarding for example, its now an olympic sport, and guess what, people still turn the same tricks, and board the same way, now, they just dont get to go puff a joint afterwards, if anyhting, going to the olympics purifies the sport and makes it more about the sport, not the activities associated with it...well, thats my 2 pence, no offense

Posted:18th Feb 2002Nooooooo....If you make it an Olympic Sport next thing you know it'll be the latest craze after kickboxing. Lifestyle sections in the Sunday morning paper will talk about "the all new poi workout", where you can go for lessons, and the workout video, and how great it is for working the upper arms and shoulders...Ughh...[This message has been edited by Rozi (edited 18 February 2002).]

It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.

What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...

Posted:18th Feb 2002Whiffle Squeek said what I was thinking. IT would not make it any less of a sport. IT would actually get more people to try it, and to apreciate it. Those who can, would be admired, and they would have a place to A) show off to a larger audience or B)experience "the same incredible effect" on a larger scale. I dunno, I guess my two pence doesn't count for much, but that's what I think...

*Live as if you were to die tomarrow, learn as if you were to live forever* ~Mahatma Ghandi*Imagination is more important than knowledge*~Albert Einstein*dream*

Posted:18th Feb 2002The thing is, I don't think of it as a sport. I think of it as an art. I don't like the idea of performances being judged on points for technical difficulty and artistic merit--like, say, figure skating. Making it a graded event would make it more formulaic, more stunt-oriented, with the performers wearing pasted-on smiles and silly, ugly costumes.No thanks.

Posted:18th Feb 2002I think it would be cool to participate in olympic competition, against the best poi'ers in the world. Look at how much competition in figure skating has increased the level of ability. In the 1930's ice skating was patheticaly simple, but look at what they do now. you have guys who can do quadruple jump spins, and double backflips and all kinds of stuff. If poi were an olympic event, then maybe more people would do it, and that is not a bad thing. poi is good for my heart, soul, and body. and I think more people should be exposed to it so they can do it if they want to. These HOP video compilations are doing the same thing, but an olympic event would be even more benefitial to the progress of poi (and benefitial to this web site I think...$$$)

Posted:18th Feb 2002I agree with adamrice with the art comment. (When will speed painting be included Non-Https Image Link)Bearing in mind only 28 sports are represented - it's pushing it! How about: (some of these may already be in the Olympics) rugby, cricket, Aussie rules, lacrosse, any number of other team sports, bmx, motor racing... there are just too many other sports with a greater fan-base.If anything it would be slotted into the rhythmic gymnastics along with the ribbon (which is currently only for women) and then the poi would become second to the gymnastic skills.Not gonna happen! Non-Https Image Link

Posted:19th Feb 2002what is 'counter cultural'??? something you find on a counter. as far as i can see, and i do have a telescope, there are just more and more stars.what are you countering?there is obivously a desire by some to compete agaisnt each other by showing their skills with the comets/fire or sticks, let them go and express that part of this wonderful sport/art/xxxxx, it can only make it a richer activity for all.

Posted:19th Feb 2002While getting poi (and staff too for that matter) into the olympics would get it loads more exposure and interest, I'd much rather keep it non-competative.It would ruin it for me to see loads of people taking up spinning who only want to be better than everyone else. ------------------Bovril - It's liquid cow y'know

But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

Posted:19th Feb 2002This conversation came up in my household this weekend; since two of the others are firebreathers, we were trying to figure out how to score points; height, volume, duration of blast, special shapes that form in the fireball?

Posted:19th Feb 2002but for the people who are gonna get truly good at this sport, and be the ones going to the olympics, they arent gonna do it just for the competition...i bet you that figure skaters who go to the olympics dont just do it for the competition, i bet they got this good because they truly loved the sport and thats why they put in so many hours to become so good...i bet they love to go out on a forzen pond somewhere and just skate...you dont advance this far in sports unless you really have a passion for it...if anyhting making twirling an olympic sport would bring out those who are truly passionate about the sport...and bendy? do you think curling has a bigger fan base than poi? or trampolining? i bet you that poi could easily compete with these and many other sports already in the gamesand i dont beleive it would become slotted with the ribbon twirling and such, especially if it comes intact with the fire aspect, because correct me if i am wrong, but didnt club twirling used to be an olympic sport? if it was, then poi could easily be viewed as a whole seperate sportand have you seen the ribbon twirling bendy? totally lacks the intensity and feel that twirling has, it could never be contained within a subcategory...and to adress the art issue, i also beleive that it would remain untouched in this aspect, i mean we wouldnt be able to dress in silly costumes as the would catch on fire, and you wouldnt be able to see them in the dark, and most people dress up when they perfrom anyways, at least to some degree, and as for it becoming formulaic, agian, look to figureskating, the people with formulaic programs dont do well, because they are formulaic, the ones who win are the ones with flowing beautiful skating, the programs that keep the integrity of the art form intact, so i dont beleive that would be lost either...

Posted:19th Feb 2002Heh heh - pictures some dude in the olympics wearing tatty old jeans and no shirt - but with a bib with a competitor number Non-Https Image LinkClub twirling still is in the Olympics, and like I suggested it is in the rhythmic gymnastics alongside the rope, ribbon, ball and hoop (I meant that poi would be alongside ribbon - not as a sub-category Non-Https Image Link)Figure skating is formulaic to an extent. There are certain moves that are required and if they are not performed the skaters do not score as well.I guess my main reason for thinking it doesn't belong is because I have never thought of it as competitive. Sure I know that some people are better, but who is to say that a person is better than someone with a totally different style that is just as good.To become a competitive sport it would need to incorporate rules -> not a good idea in my mind Non-Https Image Link

Posted:19th Feb 2002Stop the presses!!! I can kinda agree with some of you on this one!!! I think that poi as an olympic sport would be awesome, but not at the cost of casting a dark cloud over our little bit of fun. I agree with Bendy that rules would be a bad thing to try to incorperate into poi. I am sure with the amount of brains that we have here the HoPers would be able to make Poi an olympic event if the truly wanted to.------------------"Flag of the free heart's hope and home By angel hands to valor given,Thy stars have lit the welkin dome, And all their hues were born in heaven!Forever wave that standard sheet, Where breathes the toe but falls before usWith freedom's soil beneath our feet And freedom's banner streaming o'er us!"Albert J. Beveridge

Posted:19th Feb 2002Actually MYMA, in figure skating, gymnastics and in any Olympic- competitive "art" you *are* judged on more than if you just fall down. There are technical ways that are concidered "more appropriate" for every move, and if they aren't done, points are deducted. There is a set amount of movements that *HAVE* to be incorporated into routines or points are deducted. Music *can not* have words, and it is encouraged that it more classical in form. Costumes are regulated over...too high, too low, too plain, too ornate are all reasons for point deduction. This also includes hair, which *must* be kept back from the face, and make-up, which can not be theatrical, per se.And this is the vague beginnings of it, not to mention the time restricitions (routines have to be within a set amount of time).Now, imagine something like this being applied to poi. For instance, being told you have to have a 3 beat and 5 beat weave, a windmill, 2 various turns, at least ten consecutive steps of footwork and body turns, a behind the back move, two releases, over the head work as well as half the routine must be same direction moves, half are opposing direction moves in 2 1/2 minutes and all of them *mut* be technically correct or you lose points, and that is your short program. The costume must cover the body from at least collar bone to at least mid thigh with no see through portions. No destracting or offensive-to-the-eye patterns can be used for material, and regulation shoes must be worn. No techno mixes, no live and no music with words can be used, only music that fits a classical form composition. You can not have a martial art or too gymnastic of a style, or else you haven't created a sport, you have redefined an exsisiting one, so style is then governed over. If these rules are broken, you face disciplinary action or disqualification.And this isn't even touching that all equipment used would also be regulated completely. (There goes my beloved leather and choke chains!)In addition to that, these *kids* spend years honing their skills. They get up at 4 am so they can practice for a few hours before school. They do their homework on the way to practice after school. They have no social life, no weekends. In fact, many, many of them live with their coaches instead of their family. They are governed over what they can eat and what they can do. It is a rigorous lifestyle that very few if any on this board are accustomed to, or would want to have. And you have to have an approved coach, btw, to get into the qualifiers. And this is just the beginning of the beaurocratic bs around amatuer competitive sports (Olympiad's are concidered amatuer, remember.) And this isn't even talking the money involved in these sports for competition entry fees, travel, coach, room and board, costumes, equipment....I know all this as I was a very hyper child and so spent several nights a week in dance, ice skating and gymnastics (and other activities) until I hurt myself in skating (my parents liked to keep me busy). I remember what it was like and would hate for our beloved spinning arts to turn into something so regulated that it isn't noticable as personal expression or as a fun activity any more. Sure it's great exposure and a money making enterprise but at what price? I am going with everyone else here and saying No Thank You.------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...http://www.pyromorph.com[This message has been edited by Pele (edited 19 February 2002).]

Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

Posted:20th Feb 2002man i posted this a looooong time ago. And i still stand by it.I think it would be sweet to have it as an Olympic Sport.The Olympics are competitive but its about so much m,ore. Its the only time people from all races, religons, cultural backgrounds, colors, or whatever pull together in peace and in unity and without predigedous. To support each other, help each other.I also think that the olympics keep true to the history of any sport/activity. It wouldnt be treated like a boxing match. For one thing, we would be the ones setting the standards and the rules. The costumes wouldnt have many limits on them, espcially if they were traditional in nature. I have a good friend that is waiting for them to make ballroom dancing an Olympic event. I sure as hell dont consider ballroom dancing a sport. Judges would be selected from our groups, ones that know about Poi.I can see though how alot of the traditionalist would not be for it (Pele, adamrice)and I respect that alot. You just dont want to see something that you are passionate about, and something that you pour your souls into to become commercialized and have it lose its roots and meanings. but...i think we could set standards that would not diminish what Poi is all about. And it would be a beautiful thing for me to turn on the T.V. and see Pele in a traditional outfit, representing New Zealand, spinning and receiving the first Gold medal in the Poi Competition.Superman... [image]http://www.homeofpoi.com/ubb/images/icons/smile.gif">------------------[/image]He Murders Some Part of the World These Are the PaleDeaths Which Men Miscall Their Lives All this I Cannot Bear to Witness Any Longer Cannot the Kingdom of Salvation Take Me Home"

Posted:20th Feb 2002Well, It's more of a sport that Chess :http://www.fide.com/cgi-bin/material/material.pl?id_material=125&page=1&id_rubrics=&search=Olympics&detail=yes "In the future, when Chess will be represented at the Olympic games . . ."But before we jump into the Olympics think about this:Drug Testing!Um, is smoking pot considered a performance enhancing drug for Poi Spinners? Or is that only for snow boarders and bass players? Non-Https Image Link

For a good Prime, call:29819592777931214269172453467810429868925511217482600306406141434158089

Posted:20th Feb 2002"Okay, and she's out there with 100 cm cables with 10 gram beaming poi, and she's doing a nice job so far. This poi spinner from the UK started in clubs and was picked out by her coach while out busking on the sidewalk....""And so far she's having a really nice turn, Bob. There's a nice job on the compulsary 3-beat chase into a the turn.... smooth transition into the butterfly, back into a 5-beat chase, now taking it behind the back! looking good, goes for the turn....""Oh no! The beaming poi whacked her in the back of the head! She's down for the count! Her coach and the paramedics are on the field. I think the routine's over. And the Russian judge is giving her a 8.5 for the KO shot."(sorry... couldn't resist... Non-Https Image Link )

Laugh, and the world laughs with you. Cry, and the world laughs at you. It's your choi

Posted:20th Feb 2002LOL TEK...that was good! Superman, when do I defect to New Zealand? Cool. And here I thought I'd have to represent the US Non-Https Image Link As for the gold....LOL..you crack me up too!And would you be able to compete Super? I mean, with all those extras powers, and do the Olympics allow extra terrestrials? Non-Https Image Link------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...http://www.pyromorph.com

Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

Posted:20th Feb 2002I don't think it would be judged in the same way gymnastics are. The rules would probably be more open, and creativity would be more apreciated then in some sports. This is just my vision, but I think that it would be looked at in the same way art is looked at. For it's own personal beauty, not the pre-set standards are...This may be unrealistic, but I think this would be one of the only ways it could make it to the Olympics with out changing it.

*Live as if you were to die tomarrow, learn as if you were to live forever* ~Mahatma Ghandi*Imagination is more important than knowledge*~Albert Einstein*dream*

Posted:20th Feb 2002But there are things which should not be Olympic events. Being a tournament playing chess player I (along with most chess players) think that chess should NOT an Olympic event. It's a game, it's competitive, and at times it becomes art. But it's not a sport.Poi, to my realativly short experience, seems to be neither a sport nor a game but an activity that can also approach and become art. I think Poi is more akin to Ballet than ice dancing. Like most juggling arts the person performing the feat usually gets more happiness and fun out of it than the people watching.Poi just seems to be too much of a personal experience and personal expression to be a "sport".Also, although I was joking about the drug testing aspect earlier, it's a real concern. If chess qualifies as an Olympic event then all the qualifying tournaments must be conducted under the stringent anti-drug rules. This doesn't seem like a bad thing until you realize:1. There has never been a drug scandal in a chess tournament, so there's no problem that needs to be mitigated.2. There is no know drug that is proven to increase the cognative capabilities of a chess player.3. The cost of a drug test (up to $300) is prohibitive for most players. There would have to be testing for every player of every tournament that is used to qualify for the Olympics.FIDE, the international chess federation, has already announced guidelines for the use of caffine and nicotine during chess tournaments. Now there's a reason not to make chess an Olympic event. How many other sports allow the participants to step outside for a quick smoke break during their event? Non-Https Image LinkSo no, I don't think putting Poi in the Olympics would add anything to the art of Poi. In fact, it may very well do it harm.

For a good Prime, call:29819592777931214269172453467810429868925511217482600306406141434158089

Posted:20th Feb 2002almost all events in the olympics, that arent team sports, are incredibly personal events...and here i speak as both a runner and a skiier, there are rare times when im more in touch with myself than when im on the eigth mile of a ten mile run, or carving down a double black diamond...this doesnt change in competition, when i race, i race for myself, and not for my team, its all personal satisfaction, even though it is now a competitionpoi is the same way for me, its an incredibly personal event and even if i was being judged on it i dont think that would change...i mean if you think about it, arent you being judged each time you perform? yet dont you still get the same satisfaction and delight out of it?because no matter how you do it and regardless of the circumstances you do it under, isnt it still the same activity?and also, if the required national federations were set up, theyd be set up by poi people who would know and understand poi, and then, i dont beleive its format would come anywhere close to that of figure skating or gymnastics...and blah, maybe i just really badly want to see more twirling on tv...id love to be able to watch somethig on tv and understand it with the understanding i have for twirling, and be able to say, "hey, i can do that"and then maybe when i tell someone i do poi, or staff, theyll have an inkling of what im tlaking about...im with Superman, i just think it would incredibly cool