When people were blaming Beavis & Butthead when kids did stupid things, was it Beavis & Buttheads fault or the parents who didn't raise their
kids or supervised them?

That show didn't cause that generation, it was about that generation.

By the way, Beavis and Butthead rule.

But do you see where I'm going with it? That is why they were pulled the first time, after that kid who burned down his I can't remember if it was
his house or shed but after that MTV said that B&B could not say fire.

I sure that was correct during the starwars movies, matrix movies ect ect! why do people in foriegn nations think they are superior to Americans? Why
do they insist on acting like their small country does things better when there is evidence that shows they don't. Americas problems are much harder
to solve just based on the size of our country alone.

OKay, for one, I am not a foriegner- I am american, born and raised in Los Angeles..... from a Hollywood family (all in the film making business-
grandpa was nominated for an Oscar, made one of the most famous films of all time filled with violence and blood)

I have never met any european that made even the slightest suggestion that America wasn't the leader of the filmaking industry! I did not understand
the topic to be "who makes movies better", but rather "does the violence in americas movies influence or play any part in the high violence rates in
the country". Whether the movie is well made or not has nothing to do with it. America is known globally for it's violent content in film, AS WELL as
it's quality in film- murder well portrayed.

-Maybe it should be asked- does the way americans overeact to the slightest possibility of criticism influence their violence rates????

-Maybe it hould be asked- does the way americans overeact to criticism influence their violence????

You must not be a big asian film buff because there are alot of japanese movies that I think put the violent american movies to shame. I saw 1 of them
and never again and I watched the one that was supposedly less messed up than the rest. The movie was called Ichi the killer.

I think. There are no parents depicted in the cartoons, right? Are they what we used to call the "turn key kids", or "latch key kids"?

Theirs was the generation where both parents worked and the kids were on their own. Even when the parents came home they ignored them. So they grew up
pretty much on their own.

If I may carry this a bit further. Now those parents have kids and know how to raise them even less. So guess what? They have no direction and spend
even more time playing video games instead of interacting with the real world.

No doubt. I don't want to say it does, either. But two points-
Getting "used to" violence does away with the instinctual "stops"- the reactions of the body which help in blocking violent acts.
We can compensate for that with moral systems which condemn said acts. Some do- they join religions which propose such systems, for example.
But not everyone. This is a free country in that respect. For those without a specific "clan" to adhere to, they are left only with the national
culture expressed through popular art to provide their morals.

Hence we come to the second point- the hypocrisy...
Our heroes carry big weapons, they blow things and people up. That is what our popular culture tells our kids over and over. Our heros enter the scene
with arms in each hand and knocking off the many bad guys surrounding them.
Okay for most of us, we make a difference between innocents and "bad guys"- so we don't recognize these mass murderers as heroes. But we cannot say
we didn't approve of Sly or Bruce or Arnie doing the same thing when the ones being killed were official "bad guys".

You may be right on that, I admit I don't watch many (or any) though I am familiar with their reputation.
Though their reputation is not for mass killing with firearms, but either with barehands or weaponry such as knives.
Am I mistaken?

That is a good thing to bring up in the question of the influence of violent images in film though!!!
Wasn't it in China, the same week, that someone attacked people with a knife??
That is definately suggestive that images might play a part in these acts....

I think. There are no parents depicted in the cartoons, right? Are they what we used to call the "turn key kids", or "latch key kids"?

Theirs was the generation where both parents worked and the kids were on their own. Even when the parents came home they ignored them. So they grew up
pretty much on their own.

If I may carry this a bit further. Now those parents have kids and know how to raise them even less. So guess what? They have no direction and spend
even more time playing video games instead of interacting with the real world.

Look at whats happening to the kids...

that term is a bit before my time but I think latch key kids. Yeah that's pretty much it, but the other thing is that instead of parents blaming
themselves and taking responsibility for what their kids do they blame everybody/everything else.

The media is just as bad, If one grabs onto an idea they all jump on it so now your being bombarded with stuff too.

Im not out raged. I dont own guns. I also consider most stupid. I have no problem protecting others as well as myself from the TPTB. Dont take alot of
smarts to see obvious cover ups and lies and turn it back on them. Grow up

Agreed,.parents (or the lack thereof) are the primary factor in helping kids grow up. Without them they don't develop coping skills or learn to deal
with emotions, peer pressure, etc.

So they watch TV or play video games and learn exactly nothing from it. When it comes time to face the real world they are ill equipped to deal with
all the stress That tends to build tension. Some turn inwardly destructive, drugs and alcohol. Some turn their pain outwards and become destructive
towards things or god forbid, other people.

They blame others for their failures and take their anger out upon them.

You may be right on that, I admit I don't watch many (or any) though I am familiar with their reputation.
Though their reputation is not for mass killing with firearms, but either with barehands or weaponry such as knives.
Am I mistaken?

That is a good thing to bring up in the question of the influence of violent images in film though!!!
Wasn't it in China, the same week, that someone attacked people with a knife??
That is definately suggestive that images might play a part in these acts....

You are right but not all the time, There are some movies that pretty much only use guns. I have 2 that kind of come to mind but I'd have to research
more because alot of the movies just blend together. But Wasabi which stars Jean Reno they use guns I believe I do know he carries a gun and in one
scene there is a bank robbery and the robbers all carry guns. And then I think Ong Bak or the protector there was a scene with a few people with guns.
Let me research this a bit more and I can get you a list.

John Woo movies have gun play
Leon the Professional (Jean Reno, It's a french movie)
Supercop

I wish I could remember the rest.

oh another one called the machine girl where she loses her arm and somebody makes it so that she can put guns there.

Just for sharp instruments Kung Fu Hustle comes to mind and so does Drunken Master 2 I believe. Where both gangs are basically called the Axe gang and
carry around hand axes.

Originally posted by alldaylong
The flaw in your argument is something you stated yourself. "These Movies Go Out All Over The World". Then why are incidents such as Sandy Hook not
happening in the UK, France Germany, Italy Spain etc etc? If they do happen they are very rare incidents, not on a regular basis like the US.

Yes, we are hypocrites in many ways. Like others have stated, many of us grew up watching slasher and horror films and yet, we'd never commit that
violence. We went in droves to see Star Wars and watched Anakin slay a classroom full of school kids. The voices which raised an alarm over that were
drowned out with excuses "lighten up, it's just a movie". Just like the trilogy Hunger Games and it's subject matter. See, we want it and so we
term these films "entertainment". We relabel the images of evil and depravity because we enjoy watching the violence on some level. I cannot find
the source at the moment, but I recently read an article which described a cinema in the early part of the 1900s which had showed some real images of
a war in which men were being shot. What happened? The entire cinema full of adult men and women started screaming, crying and vomiting at seeing the
images. This is the NORMAL response to seeing bloodshed, as nearly every parent can tell you when their young child accidentally walks in on an adult
show featuring bloodshed that their parents may be watching. But soon that child starts to accumulate these images of violence in their brain and
heart, and it slowly but surely desensitises and hardens them to it. Why are we allowing this to our happen to our children?

This latest incident of a classroom of children gunned down highlights our hypocrisy. I've thought since then of the 4,000 babies brutally cut up
through infanticide on that same day, and yet a majority in our nation don't bat an eye. What if somebody took eight primary schools and scattered
them with those 4,000 babies' body parts and blood, then called the police and media? What if the 1,000,000 slaughtered this year were placed in
2,000 primary schools? What if those images were plastered all over our tv and newspapers? Would there be a national outcry too? Why is it that the
MSM wouldn't cover it?

Because we are hypocrites. If it's something that we define as a "good thing" we desensitise ourselves to it through hardening the heart and mind.
We redefine murder as abortion and violence in film as "entertainment". Unbeknownst to many of us, it is a product of indoctrination. The Romans
didn't start out enjoying watching Christians and it's war prisoners being fed to the lions in arenas, but something twisted their hearts and minds
to not only allow it but to cheer as they watched it. And they didn't have speaking images flooding into their brains 24/7 like we do today, the
power of which is huge. I am in agreement with most that it's not a gun that kills, but the person holding it. But when the population has enough
young adults with hardened hearts, it cannot produce anything but a society that becomes hardened. Instead of tackling what CAUSED the hardening
hearts, that society will look to removing the weapon instead of what produced the love of violence in the first place. We WANT to watch those violent
images so we label it as entertainment. We WANT the right to have all the sex we can so we redefine baby murder as abortion. The speaking images of
media indoctrinate the masses into this hypocrisy, the "teachers and leaders" of today who sway the crowds as they did in Jesus' days on Earth.

No good can ever come from evil. No matter how much WE redefine it as good, it will always produce the consequences of evil - misery and death. Films
and tv show violence to desensitise us to it, and as we are desensitised to it, greater and greater degrees of it are tolerated. And if it
desensitises us to it, it certainly has it's impact on us as the hearts of humanity become calloused. Those Romans gleefully clapping to real life
humans being ripped apart by lions were not produced over night but steadily through teachings. Today, those same teachings are mass produced and
beamed into our living rooms and cinemas transforming innocent violence rejecting little ones into violence tolerating adults. You are what you
"eat". You may never pick up a gun like this killer in Conneticut, but most will fight to ban/not ban guns instead of examining the simple truth
that violence is begetting violence and begetting hardened hearts that will ultimately sit in an amphitheatre watching real life humans being fed to
lions. Just wait until this latest generation becomes adults. They already largely resent the elderly for having retirement incomes, they already are
viewing the elderly and disabled as burdens on society and already blame humanity for heartlessly destroying the environment. Just wait until those
deemed "responsible" are publically identified as the "culprits" by the very same media which has indoctrinated them to believe these things in
the first place.

He was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that it could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be
killed.

Thank you, I enjoyed reading that. You should paste that whole post into a thread on a weekend morning so others can read it.

We redefine murder as abortion and violence in film as "entertainment". Unbeknownst to many of us, it is a product of
indoctrination.

The external [ ex ] quote at the end prompts me to ask, do you think the reference to the Image of the Beast in Revelations is talking abut modern
Media, i.e., TV, movies and internet?

I've always been intrigued by the notion of, "They made an image unto the beast and caused it to both move and speak." The "image" being the one
on a modern TV or computer screen. People that lived a long time ago would call it an "image" (like a painting) that "speaks". Has to be modern
media devices like a tele-"vision"..

Scary Movie Franchise... Seriously thanks for the laugh. Pulp Fiction? that's like the greatest movie ever made, do you watch anything other than
Disney? If you are going to talk about movies being a problem please mention the ones that are actually disturbing...

Vacancy. The Strangers. Saw1-10, Collector. And I hate to say it because it was a favorite of mine back when I was a teen but Natural Born killers is
pretty rotten as far as moral values go. There is nothing wrong with a boogieman story, that's not real and wont be it's the stories that could be
real like the above mentioned, those are the ones we should have a problem with.

I thought this not too long ago, I can sit down and watch some pretty messed up crap on the tv and im okay, I go about my business the next day but
yes I do think not everyone can handle it and I think that for movies with cruel violence such as Hostel (not freddy, he's not real) should be rated
R and they are but Rated R should be raised so that one can not see them until the age of 19.

I do believe that younger minds need less violence in their lives, less news too because lets face it thats the scariest stuff imagineable. Everyone
is too apathetic and these movies only help to make it more so. Fresh minds deserve to be nurtered first.

Please dont assume that ALL Americans allow their children to watch rubbish, mine dont. I have a strict rule in my house "if you cant learn from it,
discovery, science, sesame street than it's rubbish". They are allowed only Disney movies and the pg ones I see fit. They have never once watched a
R movie.

The President is doing what he is doing because that is his agenda. Its not about the kids, it's not about the violence. Its about him getting what
he wants and what he wants is to abolish our right to bear arms. plain and simple.

If you want to do something start a petition and tell people to sign it but please stop calling out all us Americans like we are the only ones with
problems, it's really starting to tick me off.

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