Yay Cubs.... do we get another Dale Nobody or someone legit? Pretty much the only big question since it seems all too likely we're gonna be in rebuild mode for yet another year...

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I don't know why anyone expected the Cubs to be contending within two years -- Jim Hendry left the organization a completely scorched mess. It takes time to get things back in order. Anyone who expected the Cubs to be "not shitty" until 2015 had their heads in the clouds.

And, really, Sveum wasn't a nobody. He was a finalist for the Boston managerial position in 2011 until Bobby Valentine came out of nowhere, and he's so highly regarded in baseball that the Royals snagged him as a coach the day after he was fired.

The person filling out the lineup card didn't matter at all for the last two years, and it certainly won't matter this coming year. The Cubs are a bad team, and it takes time to stop being bad. The Tampa Bay Rays didn't come out of nowhere, for example: This is Andrew Friedman's eighth year as the GM, and it's taken careful planning over the past eight years to build a solid organization.

That, and the #1 pick for 9 or 10 years, and then time to cultivate those players in the minors. Rays' GM is a genius and all, but having the #1 pick in every draft for a decade certainly helps restock the pantry...

Being a BAD team helps, as far as being able to bounce back. The worst thing you can do is be mediocre. Middling draft pick that won't pan out, expensive retread FA pickups, get one decent player at a time, but lose them to FA because you can't compete with just them alone. You really need to SUCK for a little while, restock, and then make some smart pickups.

As much as the Marlins piss me off, there's at least some logic to their plan where they suck out loud for a while, collect enough to make a run, and then burn it all down again for the pieces to start over.

Looking forward to this offseason for the Rockies. We'll trade Troy Tuliwitzki, Carlos Gonzales, and/or Michael Cuddyer for some rookies that will never pan out, and then sign some washed up pitcher who they claim will transform our rotation. All the while claiming they want to win a World Series. F-you Rockies management.

Being a BAD team helps, as far as being able to bounce back. The worst thing you can do is be mediocre. Middling draft pick that won't pan out, expensive retread FA pickups, get one decent player at a time, but lose them to FA because you can't compete with just them alone. You really need to SUCK for a little while, restock, and then make some smart pickups.

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I don't think you can make that same argument for baseball as you can for basketball or a franchise QB in football. Baseball has layers upon layers of minors, and it takes years for even top picks to make it to the bigs, assuming they don't flame out first. The MLB draft is a much bigger crapshoot.

Being a BAD team helps, as far as being able to bounce back. The worst thing you can do is be mediocre. Middling draft pick that won't pan out, expensive retread FA pickups, get one decent player at a time, but lose them to FA because you can't compete with just them alone. You really need to SUCK for a little while, restock, and then make some smart pickups.

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I don't think you can make that same argument for baseball as you can for basketball or a franchise QB in football. Baseball has layers upon layers of minors, and it takes years for even top picks to make it to the bigs, assuming they don't flame out first. The MLB draft is a much bigger crapshoot.

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Right. Let's take the 2008 draft, for example, in which the Rays drafted first overall, taking Tim Beckham. Beckham has been popped twice for violation of the MiLB substance abuse policy, and he's been decent, not great, in the minors, which is why he only finally made it to the majors last month, after rosters expanded. He's only 23 and has room to grow, of course, but after five season in the minors, you generally know what you've got with a guy, and between his lack of pop and suspect fielding (plus his off-the-field issues), Beckham is projecting to be a journeyman kind of infielder at best.

I don't think the high value prospects are going to spend that much time in the minors compared to the days of old. The Harper's and Strasburg's of the world will play enough minor league baseball to learn the team system and get plugged in quickly as long as there is room. Triple A is no longer the proving ground for the high end draft picks. Triple A is pretty much a holding pen for veteren players trying to make one last run and those back end prospects that will most likely scrap away for the remainder of their careers hoping to join the parent team as a fill in for an injured player or as a late season roster addition. A good season in Double A can pretty much get you that spring training invitation and eventually a roster spot.

I don't think the high value prospects are going to spend that much time in the minors compared to the days of old. The Harper's and Strasburg's of the world will play enough minor league baseball to learn the team system and get plugged in quickly as long as there is room.

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Yeah, but guys like Harper, Strasburg and Mike Trout are generational talents. They are hardly the norm.

Triple A is no longer the proving ground for the high end draft picks. Triple A is pretty much a holding pen for veteren players trying to make one last run and those back end prospects that will most likely scrap away for the remainder of their careers hoping to join the parent team as a fill in for an injured player or as a late season roster addition. A good season in Double A can pretty much get you that spring training invitation and eventually a roster spot.

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This is silly. Just taking the Cubs as an example, you only need to look at Corey Patterson, Felix Pie, Josh Vitters and Hee Seop Choi and now Starlin Castro to see players whose careers were ruined due to inadequate time in the minor leagues. A player doesn't get drafted and magically learn everything they need to know at AA, where the competition is laughable and many of the stadiums are launching pads. AAA is far from a place for veterans and scrappers -- it's probably the most important part of a player's development, because it's the closest he gets to major-league pitching / batting without actually getting thrown to the wolves.

I don't think the high value prospects are going to spend that much time in the minors compared to the days of old. The Harper's and Strasburg's of the world will play enough minor league baseball to learn the team system and get plugged in quickly as long as there is room.

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Yeah, but guys like Harper, Strasburg and Mike Trout are generational talents. They are hardly the norm.

Triple A is no longer the proving ground for the high end draft picks. Triple A is pretty much a holding pen for veteren players trying to make one last run and those back end prospects that will most likely scrap away for the remainder of their careers hoping to join the parent team as a fill in for an injured player or as a late season roster addition. A good season in Double A can pretty much get you that spring training invitation and eventually a roster spot.

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This is silly. Just taking the Cubs as an example, you only need to look at Corey Patterson, Felix Pie, Josh Vitters and Hee Seop Choi and now Starlin Castro to see players whose careers were ruined due to inadequate time in the minor leagues. A player doesn't get drafted and magically learn everything they need to know at AA, where the competition is laughable and many of the stadiums are launching pads. AAA is far from a place for veterans and scrappers -- it's probably the most important part of a player's development, because it's the closest he gets to major-league pitching / batting without actually getting thrown to the wolves.

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Brian McCann saw 9 at bats at triple A before joining the Braves. It happens all the time. It is team dependent but a lot of players will only play one season at triple if that. Many get a September call up. I'm not talking about the typical player, the whole conversation has been about top draft picks that can turn around a bad team. These top draft picks do not toil around in the minors for years on end as was suggested in this thread. Even a mediocre talent like Gordon Beckham only spent 28 at bats in Triple A. It isn't as uncommon as you think for 1st rounders to get a full season at double A with a cup of coffee at triple A before being plugged in. Obviously teams that are in contention can cause players to remain in triple A for a little bit longer, especially if there is an established player holding their position at the major league level.

^ I do care, actually. People actually have to watch those Fox broadcasts!

Strangely enough, I'm hoping for Bobby V. As shitty as he was last year as Sox manager, he's not half bad as a broadcaster.

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I get the feeling they might be replacing him with Eric Karros. They've been really pushing him on the Saturday baseball telecasts and I don't think it will be a big surprise or anything major.

In somewhat Giants news, the Nationals signed Matt Williams to be the new manager. Good for him. I remember watching him at 3rd base in the 90s and he was a hell of a hitter. I hope he does well in Washington.

I'm not talking about the typical player, the whole conversation has been about top draft picks that can turn around a bad team. These top draft picks do not toil around in the minors for years on end as was suggested in this thread.

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The problem is that those top draft picks who can turn around a bad team are very, very rare, and as a result this is a meaningless discussion. For every Mike Trout (who still can't turn the Angels around on his own, despite his only real statistical comparison in his first two seasons being Mickey fucking Mantle), there are a hundred Mark Priors, Matt Andersons and Matt Bushes. Any team that drafts hoping to luck into a generational talent is foolish -- and it certainly isn't the way Tampa Bay, for example, righted the ship (same with Oakland).