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Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

Originally Posted by Childo

i don't know why but all the story seems familiar to me.
A secret organisation at the beginning of grand line (beginning of the half), with a shishibukai at his head (but he takes a name code so no one knows of course) and of course a person who was once part of the organisation with luffy (law = new vivi). Not to forget Smoker as a main character
Looks like Barock Works for me ( Crocodile can call plagiat this time)

Oda loves to draw parallels between events and characters, this seems very deliberate. Doflamingo is clearly has more influence in world affairs than Crocodile, and his organization likely has greater reach. Crocodile did not have any one like Vergo, a marine VA, in Baroque Works. The question I still have is how far Doflamingo's influence really goes. Does he have powerful minions in other important organizations? I also wonder when the Strawhats will actually confront him. Will they proceed with their plan to defeat a Yonkou first, or was this what Law was talking about when he said events will proceed quickly. Maybe he meant that he will explain his plan to defeat a Yonkou after capturing Caesar, but once Caesar is captured Joker will counter quickly, forcing them to deal with Doflamingo related events before they can actually execute the plan.

Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

Correct me if I'm wrong, but we clearly see that when Law took Smoker's heart and put it in Tashigi, she had his DF ability. So how in hell could Law still use his DF ability without his heart ?

Welcome to the theory forum. XD

Now, let me correct you and clear up your misconception. Law taking out Smokers heart is a different technique than him being able to switch character's personalities. Remember that Chopper's body got to keep his abilities, while Franky was inside his body. The DF power can't be taken and put into another character by anyone not being Blackbeard as far as we know. After Law defeated the marines, he made them switch personalities too. As someone not familiar with Smoker's or anyones DF ability, she wasn't capable of using it to her advantage.

Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

Originally Posted by Whocares

Hello everyone,

Correct me if I'm wrong, but we clearly see that when Law took Smoker's heart and put it in Tashigi, she had his DF ability. So how in hell could Law still use his DF ability without his heart ? This theory makes no sense in my opinion with that example given by Oda.

Welcome whocares!

Complementing Schabrak explanation, you have to distinguish between these two different powers of Law: (i) the power he uses to exchange personalities, for instance here; and (ii) the power he uses to cut and divide people or things, like here with Tashigi.

Both powers have different effects on their victims. The first one exchanges personalities but not DF power. So, that is the case Schabrak refers to: Frankie can use Choppers powers since he is chopper's body. The point here is that the power remans with the body, not with the personality. This is the proper explanation for the fact that Tashigi's personality can use smoker power being inside Smoker body.

The second one works different; the point here is that isolated parts of a DF user that has been attacked and divided by Law, can use that DF power. The perfect example here is kinemon's head: without the torso (and therefore without heart) kinemon's head can get warm clothes for people who put a leaf or a stone over their heads, as it happened here with kids and mugis.

The last example shows why a DF user can keep living without heart and also using his DF powers, once he has been successfully attacked by Law cutting power. And that is why heart theory is still possible.

Btw, IMHO, the best argument against heart theory is this one. But as we don't know well DoFlas power yet, it is not a conclusive one.

Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

Originally Posted by Whocares

Hello everyone,

first time posting here, I love when someone come up with a theory, but I don't understand the Law's heart one... If I'm right, you think that Donflamingo or someone else, could have take his heart and this is why he is on his knees. Correct me if I'm wrong, but we clearly see that when Law took Smoker's heart and put it in Tashigi, she had his DF ability. So how in hell could Law still use his DF ability without his heart ? This theory makes no sense in my opinion with that example given by Oda.

So there should be another reason to Law suffering when Vergo came. Perhaps a weakness or something else. I don't think too that it's from Vergo's DF ability, I'm totally presuming but he could have something like the "sticky sticky fruit" because stuff seems to stick at him (hamburgers...).

I have no idea of what is going to happen next, and that's what i love about One Piece !

What Law did with Smoker, Tashigi and some of the SH's was not a literal heart swap, if anything it was a "mind/personality" swap that transpired. The easiest way to demonstrate/draw that would probably be to draw one of these symbols "<3". However that symbol isn't a heart nor does it look anything like a heart, we all saw that a heart in OP looks like a real heart and not like some cartoon symbol. We also saw that a body can fully function without a heart being inside of it. You add that with how Law reacted when Virgo arrived and what he told Luffy about wanting to get something back and you have the "Law Heart Theory". A lot of it makes sense, but then again this is Oda so if it turns out to be something completely unexpected it shouldn't be surprising. And as far as Vergo knocking Law out goes, i'm going to go out on a limb and saw that DoFlamingo's right hand man can probably more then handle himself and he is just that strong.

"Upon the back of his body not a wound of retreat scars it."
One Piece is a series created by a genius, it's a masterpiece, it's like a fine wine, it only gets better with time.

Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

Originally Posted by Whocares

Hello everyone,

first time posting here, I love when someone come up with a theory, but I don't understand the Law's heart one... If I'm right, you think that Donflamingo or someone else, could have take his heart and this is why he is on his knees. Correct me if I'm wrong, but we clearly see that when Law took Smoker's heart and put it in Tashigi, she had his DF ability. So how in hell could Law still use his DF ability without his heart ? This theory makes no sense in my opinion with that example given by Oda.

So there should be another reason to Law suffering when Vergo came. Perhaps a weakness or something else. I don't think too that it's from Vergo's DF ability, I'm totally presuming but he could have something like the "sticky sticky fruit" because stuff seems to stick at him (hamburgers...).

I have no idea of what is going to happen next, and that's what i love about One Piece !

I'm not a big fan of the heart theory, actually I am one of the first who have been supporting the DF theory - based on Vergo's face, him not moving at all before Law, and the dust clouds all around Law and before him - but your counter-argument is not valid for the simple reason - not even talking about you mixing physical and unphysical hearts - that any of the two hearts doesn't affect the body's abilities.

The unphysical hearts (soul hearts) which were exchanged between Tashigi and Smoker does not affect abilities which stay in the body which ate the DF - Tashigi has Smoker's logia body - and the heart theory talks about the physical heart (real heart) - for example the one who had been taken away from Smoker by Law - and which also doesn't affect abilities. The proof of this statement is that Tashigi in Smoker's body can still use Moku Moku powers even if the physical heart has been removed from Smoker's body.

So Law could have had his physical heart removed from him and he still wouldn't have any problem using his DF powers. As for now, Law's powers cannot make the DF powers leave the body of the user who ate the fruit - only Blackbeard can and for a moment - but just the souls. Anyway, let's say again I don't fall for the heart theory.

Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

Originally Posted by McNuss

Does he? We don't know exactly what Doflamingos power is, but the manga gives evidence that he controlls people with invisible strings, just like puppets. If that's the case, his fruits power would most likely be limited to movement control. It clearly is not brain control, because all subjects he controlled were seen trying to resist the control.

So I don't see how he could force Law to use his devil fruit power on himself.

It's true that we don't know how Doflamingos power works, but it doesn't change the fact that he would have been able to do so.
Even if his power has got something to do with invisible strings and he can't force people directly to use their DF powers, he still could have done it undirectly. All he had to do against Law is wait for him to make his "Room". After the "room" is "opened", he could force Law to point his sword or hand or whatever towards his chest to get Laws heart.

If Law doesn't use his ability, i think he would stand no chance against Dofla at all. So he was a part of Doflas crew and it seems like right now he isn't. Law knows / could know a lot about Dofla (that he is Joker, Vergo working under him, ...................) and i think that he is the kind of guy who would secure Laws loyality no matter what (Vergo mentioned that they would have killed him if he had tried to go up against them. Dofla dealt with Binami, Disco, Moria,.......). And i don't think that Dofla is like Luffy and Law told him something like" I'm going. But don't you worry, i will keep quiet about your secrets". No, i'm quite sure that Dofla would want some sort of deposit (maybe Laws crew, maybe his heart, maybe both).

And my second thought after i read the chapter was "Dofla being a Yonkou", Dofla being Kaidou. Or maybe "Kaidou" working for Dofla.

It's based on an other theory, so it's far from being proven. But just a guess:

.)Yonkous reign over their territories like emperors, if you want to survive you need the protection of a yonkou or fight him. We have seen Binami and Law (so far) who worked for Dofla but had their own crew. Dofla owned at least one slave store.

.)Dofla has some sort of connection to Vegapunk. First of all, i do believe that the guy behind the desk was Vegapunk or at least someone connected to him (i have got no prove, it's just a feeling). Dofla knew what happened to Kuma, he was the one arriving together with him at HQ after Crocodile was taken out. He was the one beating Moria (with an army of PF which Vegapunk created).
So if Dofla and Vegapunk are connected and Dofla is Kaidou it would explain http://www.mangareader.net/103-56333...apter-595.html

this island. The guard reminds me of the pacifista, maybe a prototype?

.) we haven't seen the face or the symbol of kaidou so far, have we? Why is that?
Why did Kaidou tried to stop Whitebeard? Or did he only tried to keep shanks away?

.)Dofla is a royal shichi with islands, a crew, other crews working for him, a connection to the upper class of the wg, a V.A who is part of his crew, he makes secret experiments with CC and him being a Yonkou would fit the "puppet master" personality + explain the "defeating a Yonkou" thing from Law (+the key thing - Dofla works with CC, so i assume that he wants something from him - if Law knows what that is, he could use "that" like CC is using the drugs or Dofla maybe using crew / heart against Law)

i just realized that if Dofla really is a Yonkou or a Yonkou working for him, he would have influence over all Great Parties in OP (only exception would be the revolutionary army, but he was connected to kuma, so who knows)

Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

But still he could be working for DOfla or together with him. I don't see the connection to Kaidou yet because he is currently the strongest unknown character in one piece and I think he will get his own spotlight later on in the series, with his own story !

Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

About the heart theory, I think it's quite feasible. Even thought there is nothing indicate that Doflamingo can force someone to use DF but there is nothing refutes it as well. So the door is still open for that.

At the bottom panels CC told law about the candy and how the kids won't be able to run away from him. Then law mentioned that CC remind him of someone nasty *cough*Doflamingo*cough*.
So maybe he was referring to how Doflamingo using law's heart to keep him under control in the same way CC uses the candy to prevent the kids from running away.

So Vergo said that they don't trust CC, but that still implies that they do work together with him officially so we can asume that CC thinks that they trust in him and they work for the same goal.
But as we all know Doflamingo, he gives a shit on most of his subordinates (like Belamy, Disco,....).

Therefore I think that CC gets fooled and used by Vergo/Dofla/Monet.
It was also CC who talked to "Joker" Doflamingo ... so they defenitly have a deal and he knwos that Vergo is on PH!

What CC doesn't know (as far as we know) is the position of Monet (being a spy)

Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

thanks for your statement. However,I doubt CC is aware of joker being doflamingo,since even smoker knew about a certain joker in the Marine. also,Law said he knows vergo's identity only because he used to be doflamingo's subordinate too http://mangastream.com/read/one_piece/80016071/22 .hence I'm pretty sure CC knows about vergo being a marine but is unaware of him being doflamingo/joker's subordinate.

Re: One Piece 673 Discussion / 674 Prediction

Originally Posted by Wha

Yonkous reign over their territories like emperors, if you want to survive you need the protection of a yonkou or fight him. We have seen Binami and Law (so far) who worked for Dofla but had their own crew. Dofla owned at least one slave store.

Dofla knew what happened to Kuma, he was the one arriving together with him at HQ after Crocodile was taken out. He was the one beating Moria (with an army of PF which Vegapunk created).
So if Dofla is Kaidou it would explain...

this island. The guard reminds me of the pacifista, maybe a prototype?

we haven't seen the face or the symbol of kaidou so far, have we? Why is that?

Why did Kaidou tried to stop Whitebeard? Or did he only tried to keep shanks away?

I don't think Bellamy was in Doflamingo's crew, his crew was rather an affiliate to him as he had his own crew/ship/flag.

What if those two came from Mary Joa, that would explain their simultaneous arrival. The Marines have knowledge about the appearance of Kaidou as well as Doflamingo. They are not the same person or it would mean that the Marines are incompetent to the highest degree.

Maybe that was iron island, with iron citizens and iron trees? We already have Franky and Vegapunk doing cyborg experiments, there could be scientists in Big Mam's or Kaidous crew too.

Because we don't need to know his face, just as we didn't know the admiral's or shichibukai's faces until we needed to. Kaidou obviously wanted Whitebeard to suffer a defeat enabling him to start an expansion into those territories or free himself of the pressure that could come up with WB being the strongest person on earth.