3/26/2013

Georgia's Carry Permit Laws, on my mind

There is no doubt that if I had continued to live in New York City, as I did growing up, my life would be very different. I'm sure I would have never discovered my passion for guns and the shooting sports. I am thoroughly grateful that I live in Georgia now, and have the freedom to learn about all sorts of firearm systems and get a lot of hands on experience as well. Still, Georgia's relaxed stance on firearm permitting, doesn't always make me totally comfortable.
My biggest issue with the Georgia firearm permitting system, is the lack of an educational requirement before one receives a permit to conceal carry. I believe that for an American to keep a gun in their home, there should be minimal limitations, because it is their right to defend their property. However, when a person leaves their home while concealed carrying, there is a chance that they will feel the need to defend, not just themselves and their property, but me and mine. Just as it is the right of each of us to defend ourselves, it should also be our right, not to defend ourselves. Frankly, if a fellow pedestrian has not had proper training, I would prefer that they not have the ability to defend me, (or more likely, have the ability to exacerbate the situation).

I may be taking the concept of leave well enough alone to an extreme with which most would not agree, but I believe training is an integral part of responsible firearm ownership. And on this point, I am unable to bend.

8 comments:

Dan
said...

States with training requirements have a much lower percentage of carry permits, but not fewer firearms accidents. Accidents with firearms and crimes with firearms occur in permit holders at a fraction of the general population, training or not. Research has repeatedly shown that required training only makes it harder for law abiding citizens to get permits. Did you know permits cost well over $500 in some states due to training costs? No one is saying training is bad, it's actually the best money you can spend, but government sanctioned training is an infringement on the right to carry.

As a fellow Georgian who has held a GWL since returning to the state in 2001, I agree with you - training is an important part of gun ownership and responsible concealed carry.

But I do not agree that it is the government's place to require training to exercise a right. We already let them infringe that right by issuing licenses in the first place. We are licensed to exercise a right? How gracious of them.

How do you feel about an fellow pedestrian who comes to church with you? What if their Bible training isn't sufficient? They shouldn't be licensed.

Or what if your law training isn't sufficient? Why shouldn't the police be able to search your home any time, in that case?

Or what if the mandated training also included a required lecture from Kasim Reid on his great work supporting MAIG?

Obviously I'm trying to be hyperbolic to prove a point. But that point is that I would rather get training on my own than be forced to, in order to exercise a right that is already infringed by the very concept of government permission.

First, I want to commend you two on your approached to this discussion. Too often, the use of expletives seems more important than the use of facts and the comments become counterproductive...to put it mildly.

Rooster, I wrote this piece because you asked what issues I had with GA gun laws. Working at the range, I was shocked at the number of patrons who were grossly negligent and completely untrained. I feared for my safety regularly, because guns were treated like high-end paperweights rather than complicated machines.

As for your range experience, on the one hand I would favor a firm stance: If I owned a gun range the policy would be that only safe gun handling is allowed, and everyone who demonstrates otherwise will be asked to leave.

At the same time, I would offer safety training, and it would be obvious in range that safety was important. In fact, I would offer it free to new gun owners, although I would probably bump up prices a little to cover the training.

On the other hand, I know you're trying to run a profitable business in a competitive industry, and driving away customers isn't a good policy anywhere. Balance is required. There are right ways and wrong ways to deal with unsafe customers, and you need to find the right way.

You know, it's interesting that in Arizona there were gun ranges that were against constitutional carry, because it took away their guaranteed training income for permits. That's sad, because a good training program would be successful whether it was required or not.

By the way, here is my experience with 3 different states's licensing procedures. http://fillyerhands.com/2011/04/05/adventures-in-permitting/

Gabby, I too live in Georgia and have paid my GWCL Tax (GeorgiaWeapons Carry License fee). My issuewith the “lack of an educational requirement” is that like many governmentsanctioned programs it turns into a monopoly with only one “official”program. Another problem is the “legal”or “litigious” atmosphere in the country today. Instructors have to be trained in the official program and thenprotected from the person who wants to sue the instructor for “failure to warn”if they get into trouble with their fire arm. This drives the tax (fee) up and in my county it is $70 each plus $5 toSO for finger printing. This was a $150tax on my wife & me to exercise our right.

To the comment “I believe training is an integral part ofresponsible firearm ownership”. I agree. If an incentive program to lower the fee for taking a weapons trainingcourse were in place I could indorse the requirement. Maybe we could use the 1.6 billion rounds ofammunition that Homeland is purchasing.

I'm from Texas. They require 8 hours class and then 50 rounds into a target. The 8 hours is mainly teaching you the laws of reqarding cancelled carry and whats expected of you out in public if you draw and then shoot. Two different things in Texas. I found it very interesting and learned that carrying makes you responsible for your actions. Something I hadn't considered. She, my instructor, gave us some what ifs and had describe what we should do. Then she taught what we should do. You take a written test and must score over 70%. Then you go shoot at a target at different ranges and you have to score above 150 out of 270. Total costs to get a CHL is about $250, 120 for training and 130 for finger prints, photo and application. The process is pretty nice: you got to this one place and they take your picture and your prints. You go online file out the form and put in your tracking number and pay with credit card and a few weeks later you get your ID. The one thing about the Texas CHL is that you carry whatever you want and how many you want as long as they are concealed.

My feeling for this personally is you shouldn't need a license to carry openly or concealed. No open carry in Texas since governor Richardson in the mid 90s. However, I do like the class training. Made me awear of things I hadn't thought about and now I know what the law is for using a firearm. So I think the training is necessary. There are so many idiots out there. I see it the range all the time. 8 hours though, is little too much. So I have mixed emotions about training and licensing.

Before getting my license, I thought it was dumb. I thought you should just be able to carry regardless. The training would just be extra for yourself. I still would like some good training on stressful situations. I think that would be good for me and give me a challenge. Not available in my area. Well, I lost my train of thought...that's my two cents.

I think it's great that they discuss the actual laws and realities, surrounding what happens when you conceal carry! Nobody will be become a better shot in one day, but can learn to make better decisions and start thinking thru "being prepared". Even though you found 8 hours to be over kill, I'm glad to hear that you really got something out of it!