“The United States should look within to cut down demand for opioids which are fueling its deadly drug crisis rather than stressing unsubstantiated claims that China is the major source of these chemicals,”

Looks like the Chinese can see the forest for the trees. Gee if China is the problem why are Chinese not dying.

No leftists and coddling are the problem. Need to get tuff or die.

We don't reach for handouts we reach for those who are down . "Garth Brooks "

You have got to stand for something . Or you will fall for anything "Aaron Tippin"MAKE ALBERTA GREAT AGAIN

Jflem1983 wrote:“The United States should look within to cut down demand for opioids which are fueling its deadly drug crisis rather than stressing unsubstantiated claims that China is the major source of these chemicals,”

Looks like the Chinese can see the forest for the trees. Gee if China is the problem why are Chinese not dying.

No leftists and coddling are the problem. Need to get tuff or die.

Sorry jflem but China is the major source of fent and carf. While our medical system may have created a dependency issue that the Chinese system did not, the Chinese are pure and unscrupulous entrepreneurs at recognizing a demand and filling it within a lax gov't oversight system and exporting it. I am not sure if the Chinese gov't is just lax in it's oversight and enforcement or just pretending it doesn't happen secretly wishing for the consequences that it takes on the North American economy to advance their own interests.

Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

Over the past several decades, huge drug problems have sprung up in different cities around the world. In the 70's, there was the heroin crisis in New York City. In the 80's, there was a big drug problem in parts of Australia. These drug epidemics happened because someone arrived on the scene and started to flood the streets with drugs.

In New York one of the big distributors was Frank Lucas who imported super pure heroin from the Golden Triangle on American military aircraft. The Vietnam War provided the perfect opportunity to bring in huge amounts of drugs.

So, with all of this available heroin floating around, overdoses spiked, more plentiful drug supply meant more people were getting addicted. When Lucas and his family were busted and put away, the drug problem in New York returned to more normal levels. I don't think making drugs even more available will help - if they're easier to get, more people will try them "just once, to see what it's like."

Back in the 70's, cops played hardball, at least in New York. Nowadays, it seems like cops can't do anything. Criminals have all the rights, convictions are being thrown on all sorts of ridiculous technicalities. When people are convicted for importing huge amounts of drugs, they get a slap on the wrist. If the trial went on for a long time, their sentence is reduced for time served. There's no deterrence any more (other than getting killed by another gang).

Someone's importing these opoids (not all are being stolen from someone's medicine cabinet). Find them, bust them, and put them away for a long time.

The courts have to start getting tough on drug crimes (not talking about simple possession here). You get busted for importing or distributing over a certain amount, you go to prison for 20 years, minimum.

Let the cops do their job and make judges accountable for their stupid decisions.

Traffic in heroin, meth, carfentanyl and fentanyl should be met with punishment that is roughly equal to the drugs. Death penalty for traffic in large amounts. Street level dealers need longer prison terms. Plus, oh yeah, the lash.

If you have weak penalties for traffic in these dangerous drugs, people will traffic. Those nations with harsh penalties don't seem to have much of a problem. It's obvious.

maryjane48 wrote:Be great when all hard drugs are by govt. Then those supporting organised crime as in those against that are shut down .

As hobby points out the only reason crime pays is because of the drug war .which was the single biggest waste of money unleashed on tax payers of any country

IMHO even if all the drugs on the face of the planet were legal and sold in The Government Druggie Stores I'm betting there would still be a black market and people would still be dying because (1) it would still be cheaper to buy it on the streets for some folks and (2) the street drugs would still be laced with fentanyl which kills. Organized crime isn't going to give up this very lucrative piece of the pie easily - they will always have customers don't ever kid yourself. Government won't pass up an opportunity to make more taxes so they will set their price tags higher for the "convenience" of doing clean drugs. I avoid saying "safe" drugs because no matter who is peddling it, the drugs will destroy your brain and body so you are not "safe" if you are doing drugs. You might not get dead today, but even with the Govt supply you will eventually get dead because they absolutely obliterate your body and brain.

Are all you people who are for legalizing it suggesting that since addiction has been labelled an illness they should get their drugs for free? Or through Pharmacare with reimbursement? Alcoholics don't get their fifth for free. Smokers don't get their puffs for free (look how expensive puffs are - lots of people were able to quit just because they weren't going to pay the price of a pack).

I'll be damned if I am going to start paying my taxes so people can freely do drugs. So it will be sold in Government Drug Stores and people won't be able to afford it because drugs will be WAY more expensive than booze. Eventually they will lose their jobs because they will be zoned out of their brains most of the time with seriously destroyed brain cells, won't be able to hold down a job, on the dole, and looking for subsidies for their fix. Be a frosty day in hell my friends that I would ever support that.

maryjane48 wrote:Be great when all hard drugs are by govt. Then those supporting organised crime as in those against that are shut down .

As hobby points out the only reason crime pays is because of the drug war .which was the single biggest waste of money unleashed on tax payers of any country

IMHO even if all the drugs on the face of the planet were legal and sold in The Government Druggie Stores I'm betting there would still be a black market and people would still be dying because (1) it would still be cheaper to buy it on the streets for some folks and (2) the street drugs would still be laced with fentanyl which kills. Organized crime isn't going to give up this very lucrative piece of the pie easily - they will always have customers don't ever kid yourself. Government won't pass up an opportunity to make more taxes so they will set their price tags higher for the "convenience" of doing clean drugs. I avoid saying "safe" drugs because no matter who is peddling it, the drugs will destroy your brain and body so you are not "safe" if you are doing drugs. You might not get dead today, but even with the Govt supply you will eventually get dead because they absolutely obliterate your body and brain.

Are all you people who are for legalizing it suggesting that since addiction has been labelled an illness they should get their drugs for free? Or through Pharmacare with reimbursement? Alcoholics don't get their fifth for free. Smokers don't get their puffs for free (look how expensive puffs are - lots of people were able to quit just because they weren't going to pay the price of a pack).

I'll be damned if I am going to start paying my taxes so people can freely do drugs. So it will be sold in Government Drug Stores and people won't be able to afford it because drugs will be WAY more expensive than booze. Eventually they will lose their jobs because they will be zoned out of their brains most of the time with seriously destroyed brain cells, won't be able to hold down a job, on the dole, and looking for subsidies for their fix. Be a frosty day in hell my friends that I would ever support that.

I want to say that when I speak of not paying for drugs I am meaning the mind-altering/destroying drugs (ie crystal meth and other poisons of choice). I do think there is a place to have pain meds such as the Oxy family included in health care on an ongoing, life-time if necessary prescription basis, closely monitored. Yes, they will most certainly cause an addiction, but don't leave the patient living rough on the streets in a lunatic state harming themselves and other unless they are not given by the doctor, leaving the person in pain heading for the local street dealer. The Oxy family, as far as I am aware, are extremely addictive but aren't mind-altering. An Oxy addiction will not interfere with a person's day-to-day family and work life other than make it better to be as free from pain as the drug can keep them.

If anyone wants to point out that I am out to lunch in my assessment of Oxy, please do. As far as I am aware, it only causes problems if it is taken away and leads the person to the streets in a pain-filled state on a search to find more anywhere they can and find themselves using Fentanyl.

Opiate addiction "can be" a relatively manageable condition if the drugs are taken orally, this is correct. But an addict will need to have increasingly larger and potentially lethal doses to feel "high" which will push them into seeking more-dangerous methods of delivery, or increasing strength of dose.

Therefore, it is really only reasonably managed as "part" of an overall drug succession program.

Osoyoos_Familyof4 wrote:Opiate addiction "can be" a relatively manageable condition if the drugs are taken orally, this is correct. But an addict will need to have increasingly larger and potentially lethal doses to feel "high" which will push them into seeking more-dangerous methods of delivery, or increasing strength of dose.

Therefore, it is really only reasonably managed as "part" of an overall drug succession program.

I see your point. It would have to be assessed on an individual basis for sure which is where the monitoring comes in - some people's pain doesn't actually increase to a point they need a stronger dosage, but they develop a sort of tolerance to it requiring the larger dosage to feel any relief. So perhaps life-time Oxy won't work afterall if that's the case. So what is the other "part" or "parts" of that pain management practice? Oxy(?) and what?

Jflem1983 wrote:“The United States should look within to cut down demand for opioids which are fueling its deadly drug crisis rather than stressing unsubstantiated claims that China is the major source of these chemicals,”

Looks like the Chinese can see the forest for the trees. Gee if China is the problem why are Chinese not dying.

No leftists and coddling are the problem. Need to get tuff or die.

Sorry jflem but China is the major source of fent and carf. While our medical system may have created a dependency issue that the Chinese system did not, the Chinese are pure and unscrupulous entrepreneurs at recognizing a demand and filling it within a lax gov't oversight system and exporting it. I am not sure if the Chinese gov't is just lax in it's oversight and enforcement or just pretending it doesn't happen secretly wishing for the consequences that it takes on the North American economy to advance their own interests.

Remember back in 97. China white hit van city. Wiped out a bunch of junkies. This is just a remix of 20 years ago. Cycles will repeat if not dealt with.

The changes we make today will take 20 years to bear fruit. Hopefully what ever choices are made . Leads to less heroin not more .

All my dead friends started off as children who were loved by their mothers. The face of a mother burrying her son at 25 or 35 is a horrible site. Ive seen it many times.

Moat of you on here are older . Consider yourselves lucky u didnt have this poison in your day .

Personally i would like to see drug testing kits made available. I feel it woupd save more lives than the disgusting junkie bus.

Look calling it a safe injection site is wrong. These drugs are lethal. We need to as a group tak a step back. 100 years ago we were not a country of heroin adicts. A bit of pain might be better than being a drug adict.

We don't reach for handouts we reach for those who are down . "Garth Brooks "

You have got to stand for something . Or you will fall for anything "Aaron Tippin"MAKE ALBERTA GREAT AGAIN