Click to access website

17 June 2006

A debate in a Dubai newspaper about the Ottomans and their role in the Middle East

In one of the latest issues of Dubai English language daily "7 Days" (30 May2006) reader Rocky O'Rourke expressed the following view regarding thepresence of Western powers in the Middle East during the last period ofOttoman rule:

" the British were 'meddling' in Iraqi affairs for almost 100 years becauseIraq was occupied by a brutal Ottoman Empire who took sides with Germanyduring WWI. The people of Iraq and surrounding countries were oppressedunder a vile Turkish regime - ring any bells? Hand-in-hand with the Germanwar-mongers the Ottomans also threatened the whole Gulf region and beyond".

This triggered a long debate in the online version of the newspaper (seeblow links)

Hassan A. Demir a Turk living in Dubai wrote (31 May 2006):

"Rocky O'Rourke tries to justify involvement of the British in the MiddleEast by blaming Ottomans. In fact exactly 100 years ago British troopsentered Basra again with the same slogan: "We will save you .." and it tookhalf a century for them to leave... During 400 years of Ottoman Empire rulein the Middle East, all Muslims were united under one flag, they wereleading power in this part of the world and Jerusalem was open for allreligions".

Another reader called Mariam K. made the following comment (2 June 2006):

"Brutal Ottoman Empire, and a vile Turkish regime you say? In whose opinion?The West? Unfortunately, there are quite a lot of Arabs that have fallen forall the Western ideologies regarding the Ottoman Empire; one victim isAlbert Hourani (author of the book The History of Modern Arab Peoples.) Asfar as the Arabs are concerned the Ottoman 'empire' did rule a vast region,and it did in fact take off from Turkey; however, it was not under brutalTurkish rule but under Islamic rule. Arabia was flourishing between the 9thand the 14th century; meanwhile, the French and the Brits came along anddabbled with the Arabian affairs. And it was nothing but all that dabblingthat led to the fall of the empire. Arabia was blooming with knowledge atthe time..."

It is obvious that Mariam K. is confusing the time when Arabia wasflourishing (from 9-14th centuries, as she clearly mentions), with the morerecent period of the Ottoman rule (16-20th centuries), during which Arabiawas not "blooming with knowledge".

The debate continued on 5th June 2006.

A reader signing KH (Karim Hanna, a Lebanese national, as revealed later inthe debate) from Dubai did not agree with Mariam K.'s theory. He broughtthe following story:

"Let me tell you a little story about my grandfather (among others) whosemother sold her house for a bag of flour during the Ottomans' hungeroppression of the Levant not too long ago.

My grandfather is still alive and very well may I add and he can recall manystories from that period in the early 1900s. People were forced to gowalking in the streets picking whatever they can from horse droppings inorder to survive. (Please excuse my last description but Mariam forced me todo this). The Ottomans starved people Ms Mariam and I really don't knowwhere you got your information from. You even went so far as to describeAlbert Hourani who is a prominent historian as a victim of Westernideologies; this goes to show that you yourself don't have a mind of yourown and obviously have been fed information contrary to historical facts.All empires / superpowers have their negative and positive aspects but thefact that you claimed the Ottoman Empire was neither vile nor brutal just totake a cheap shot at the West, is going too far. We should always state thefacts as they are regardless of which piece of land we are born in.

May I also add a small point which is the Armenian genocide or holocaust.You might have overlooked the figure of one million Armenians Ms Mariam whowere tortured and slaughtered but then again this is why I am writing toyou.

Well thankfully my grandfather's memory is very clear and he's in prettygood shape. Just hearing him recalling the story is quite moving. Basicallythe Turks in Lebanon would burn any food they found being distributed to thepeople rather than allow them to eat it. These were normal everyday peopleand not soldiers or anything. One-third of the population was lost due tostarvation. He says people's stomachs were bloated due to starvation andthose who lit fires to keep warm were accused of signaling to the allies'ships at sea and were sent to a village called Alley in Lebanon to beinterrogated, and later disappear.

It was only when the allies arrived that people were rejoicing and weregiven an option to be mandated either by the British, Americans or French.Since the Maronites had the power in those days they selected the French.People debated though and some wanted the Americans or British rather thanthe French. It's funny. It was that simple. You may recall the movie'Safarbarlek' by the Rahbanis which gives an idea of those days and how itwas. My grandfather even talks about the Armenian experience and thegenocide they went through at the hands of the Ottomans. Those that survivedwere forced to walk all the way to Syria by the Ottomans. Quite anexperience.

I would also like to clarify that they didn't eat horse's dung, but ratherthe seeds or nutrients found in horse's dung. Just a clarification".

In response Hanife Mcandrew posted the following answer to Karim Hanna:

"I am a 31 year old Turkish woman who is coming from another ethnic groupcalled the Laz (northern east of Turkey) and I have lived happily with myArmenian, Jewish and Kurdish friends during my entire life. What reallysurprises me here are people like you who know a little about the subjectbut write as if they are experts on the subject.

The Ottoman Empire (1299-1920), was a super power for over 600 years andwidened its borders on three continents (1453-1683). Many differentnationalities and religions lived under the same roof, so to speak, ofcourse running such an enormous Empire was not an easy task. As with anyother Empire, the Ottomans had negative and positive aspects to it. Butpeople like you always want to emphasize the negative and overlook thepositive.

Did you know that the Ottomans send over ships that were full of foodstuffsto Ireland during the Irish Famine (1845) while the British Empire looked onwith total apathy? Did you know that the Ottoman Sultan Bayazid 2ndwelcomed 93 thousand Judeos (Spanish Jews) who were forced to leave Spainbecause they would not convert to Christianity (1492) And you are sayingthat Ottomans starved people what planet are you living on? Please readmore

What is so amazing is that in the west, the French government, especially,have been encouraging people to bring up this so-called genocide subjectagain and again. I want to ask you who killed over a million Algerians underFrench colonial rule? and I have yet to read even a single article orcomment about this subject on this paper. Please be brave enough to writeyour full name dear K H "

Answer by Karim Hanna:

"This is Karim Elias Hanna. I wrote the facts above. First and foremost, whyare you attacking me? What do you mean by 'people like you'? Does retellinga story told by my grandfather require expertise? Furthermore, what kind ofa request is it to ask me to show my name? Is it to see if I am Armenian?Are you going to change history with my name?"

At another point of the debate Karim Hanna affirmed his views by thefollowing interesting comment:

"The mistake Mariam and Hanife make is that they mix so many events togetherwhen the subject is clear. The fact that this happened in Algeria, thenIreland and that the US nuked Japan and that the sky is blue does not negatethe fact of what happened in Lebanon".