Re: beer thread - 07/14/0302:36 PM

Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/14/0304:56 PM

Will Said in another thread...

In reply to:

IMHO, if it's an all malt beer (or fitting for the beer style), balanced (or fitting for the beer style), and free from defects, the argument about quality is specious. Though Becks is mass produced, it would be difficult to say it is of inferior quality to an expensive Belgian ale. Liquor is another story, however.

Beautifully said! I could not agree with you more. Perhaps I should be more careful about using words like "enjoyable" or "preferable" rather than "good" Your point is excellent; American Premium Lagers (Miller, Bud, etc.) are technically flawless, define the style, and nobody should call them "Bad" beers. Yet they certainly lack the character and depth that I seek in a beer-drinking experience. Plus, all that rice in Bud gives me a crushing headache.

I guess the "judgement" for me relates to not only the issues of accepted style adherence and lack of technical flaws, but also to that "enjoyability factor". Some people simply prefer some styles to others, and even within style there is enough wiggle room for some significant differences. I prefer hoppier Porters and fuller IPA's; not everyone does.

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/14/0308:01 PM

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/14/0309:19 PM

Robert Pirsig was the "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenace" guy right? Didn't he go crazy and kill himself? I'm trying not to think about all that veneer stuff too much.

Adapting his philosophy to blind liquor, beer and wine purchasing at stores like Trader Joe's has been good, though. Basically: buy expensive stuff that comes with crappy labels, no stories, gold foil, etc... Bound to be good, just poorly marketed.

Quality in liquor is more objective than in beer because of the distillation process. Depending on which part of the distillation is bottled, the price and quality of the spirit will be affected. The foreshots are toxic, if I remember correctly, and the feints? or last runnings are of poor quality - harsh, medicinal, whatever. Obviously, to obtain max yield (and profit) one would blend as much of the poor quality stuff as he could. Additionally, there are two types of stills commonly used: the pot still and the continuous still. From what I understand the pot still is less efficient, but is capable of yielding finer spirits (discarding the foreshots and the last stuff). Further, many spirits are double or triple distilled - removing more impurities each time. Doesn't mean it's going to taste better, but it does seem to yield stuff that is less likely to give you a hangover. I have a triple distilled single malt Scotch that I bought in quantity at $12.99 a bottle that goes down like water and causes no distress in the morning, but many connoiseurs shun it because it is too light tasting and it is a lowland malt. But the quality cannot be disputed.
Also, the amount of time some spirits spend laid up in wooden barrels improves their flavor - quality I don't know.
Regardless, all of these things that improve quality also decrease yield and should make the product more expensive to produce. In zymurgy, it's a slap bang process that utilizes basically cheap ingredients, has a quick turnaround time and demands less precision from the maker. There is little you can do in brewing beer to justify the exorbitant cost of some of these beers. Specialty malts and rare hops are just not that expensive.

The easiest way to demonstrate the differences in quality of liquor is to buy three bottles of Cognac from the same maker - one VS, one VSOP, and one XO ($20, $30, $100). Drink a third of one bottle the first night, a third of the next a couple nights later, and the last a couple more days later. Besides the huge difference in taste (in refinement of what should be the same basic flavor) between the three, you will notice that the better stuff leaves you feeling a little more spry in the morning.

Re: beer thread - 07/15/0312:02 AM

Not that I'm a beer expert, but I do know that beer in a clear or green bottle normally equals skunk juice! It's apparenly how light affects the beer. Corona tries to get away with their skunk juice by suggesting lime with it as if were to make it more refreshing (they dare not mention masking the skunk taste!). I admit it...I fell for it about 13 years ago while in college and thought it was such a cool concept because of the lime. That was before I was choosy about my alcoholic beverages. Now it makes me ill thinking about it because I hate skunky beer.

Ahhh, drinking in the young days (late 80's) reminds me of even more sickening memories...Sun Country Wine Coolers (in the 2 liter bottles), MD 20/20 (Mad Dog), Malt Duck, and all the other cheap alcohol at the time.

Re: beer thread - 07/15/0312:32 AM

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/15/0302:53 AM

Peter, I've not had that beer. Thank you very much for the recommendation - I'll look for it! I like a good West Coast IPA, but don't get Brits (or certain others) started on the topic of "true" IPA. There are those change-resistant folks who deny that American application of Columbus/Cascade/Chinook hops to that style is an abomination rather than expansion to a new and distinctive style. I used to really groove on that big hop nose and grapefruity flavor. But the palate fatigue is just killer - after a couple, I really can't taste much of anything. If you can get a good one on cask, then you've got something.

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/15/0302:58 AM

Will, thanks so much for sharing. I know too little about distillation, and your tutelage is welcome. You nailed the Zen reference; much of that book revolves around a search to define "quality". It seemed pretty deep when I was 18. In retrospect, it seems a bit ponderous and self-indulgent.

I really like Kentucky Bourbon. What should I be drinking?

Sonicfox - interesting that you should bring up the whole "light struck" issue. I discovered a few years ago that the CANNED version of Heineken is absolutely transcendent compared to the horrible bottles I'd been subjected to on the West Coast all these years.

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/15/0312:59 PM

I don't know a whole lot about bourbon other than what I know I like. Some possibilities:
-Blantons is the best tasting I've ever had. Costco had it for awhile but they're all gone. Was $38 a bottle there. Must be better bourbons but I've never tasted any.
-Makers Mark is a good all around bourbon. Not so expensive that you feel like a fool using it in mixed drinks, but is also smooth and tasty enough to sip straight.
-Jim Beam is as low as I'll go. I use it only in mixed drinks. Found it on sale for $13 per 1.75L bottle and stocked up last year. It's harsh straight, but doesn't seem to cause too much internal damage.
-Evan Williams Single Barrel was absolutely an awesome deal when it first came out, but prices have climbed. It could be my imagination, but it also seems like quality dipped.
-Elmer T. Lee is good. Especially if you can find it under $20.
-Wild Turkey ain't bad. I prefer the 101 proof.

I don't know if you like your booze straight, but try the good stuff warm, without ice or water, in a nice glass. Take little sips, let it sit on the palette for awhile, and go slow. You won't get drunk, but you will get mellow.

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/15/0301:32 PM

This could be sacrilage, but the way I (and my wife) figure it, we don't drink enough to waste time with the cheap stuff. In other words, I use medium-good quality liquor in everything, including mixed drinks. No matter what the scientific evidence says, a fine tequila in a margarita tastes better, has a wider soundstage, transcends the live experience... Oh wait, wrong thread.

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/15/0307:47 PM

Gott'a love this.. Electronic gear, music and movies, and adult beverages, all on the same site.. Too cool..
So, can we get someone to put together a list of all the better brews and suggestions that have been listed ?
Isn't it kind of interesting, as one can grows older (I didn't say necessarily wiser) one begins to slow down and enjoy the simpler pleasures life offers ? Such as a fine painting, a well writen book, a great movie, and of course, the perfect potation to complete the moment.. Ahhhhhhh....
Here's a funny thing.. I find myself sort of role playing with a lot the movies I watch these days.. We have the sound, the picture, why not the taste ??
If it's a old murder mystery type, I'll have scotch/rocks.. If a action movie, beer, but imported or made by the same country as the primary role in the movie.. Following me here ? James Bond, you guessed it, "Shaken, not stirred".. French/wine, cowboy/wiskey, Greek/Oyzo, etc, etc..
Next time you drop in Hunt for Red October, be sure you pour yourself a shot of Vodka.. I mean, Waadka..

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/15/0308:33 PM

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/16/0312:39 PM

Hey MIKEY, I recall that you are in OC. If you haven't already, go check out Hi-Time Cellar in Costa Mesa. HUGE selection of everything. It's a two story emporium of everything alcoholic. Decent prices, not the lowest on everything, but they do run some smoking sales on stuff.

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/16/0303:14 PM

Thanks Mark.. You know, I've been told about that place a couple of times.. I'm in Huntington Beach, like ten minutes away, and never make it over there ? Go figure..
Looks like ZeN will be stopping by this Saturday to give my system a listen.. I'll stop by Hi-Time and grab some suds..
What's best in this area again ? I'm not much on all the ales, micro brews, and such, as I love and drink mostly the beers Hecho de Mexico.. I've injoyed many a fine beer, but with all those brands, makes, etc, I can't keep up with it..
Any help, again, would be appreciated..

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/16/0304:24 PM

Huntington Beach sounds pretty nice right now - it is an even 100 degrees outside right now in Corona. My favorite Mexican beers are the Dos Equis Brown and Green, Bohemia, and I reckon Negra Modelo is OK. If you like Corona (the beer) you probably won't like most of the beers these guys have been mentioning. Try some of the Czech pilseners you will find at Hi-Time, some are just awesome on a hot day - nice balance of malty sweetness and fine hop bitterness. Of course, German lagers are usually excellent. The best of those I ever had was Kulmbacher Reichelbrau on tap. Haven't seen it in years, though I haven't really been looking. Bavarian wheat beers are always nice on a hot day (Weihenstephaner is a good one, but you can't go wrong with any of them). Lastly, try Lindemann's Framboise. Its a Belgian beer fermented with raspberries (3.99 at Trader Joes).

Re: beer thread - 07/16/0305:22 PM

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/16/0305:44 PM

Yeah, my wife loves them and I have to admit that I'll sneak a gulp off hers when she isn't looking. I tried for years to make something comparable with mixed results. Mine were decent beers, but nothing like the real stuff. Turns out there are a lot of homebrewers trying the same thing. They import small wooden barrels from Belgium, use Belgian ingredients (their raspberries are apparently different than ours), and do their best to imitate the crazy yeast strains in that beer. After hearing all that, I told the wife it couldn't be done.

Freaky Yeast - 07/16/0306:16 PM

Gotta love those wacky Belgians. We have a Framboise on special occasions (like New Year's eve) instead of champagne. It's so pretty, rich, and effervescent. But the Lindeman's is quite a bit sweeter than most Lambics. Stale hops, wild yeast, wood, fruit... and still a beer. Love it.

I like the Bohemia best of the Mexican beers by a wide margin. But, especially on draught, you can successfully argue that the best Vienna lager in America is a Mexican beer (Dos Equis Amber).

I thought I posted earlier, but must have spazzed out....

Wanted to thank you all for the bourbon suggestions. I've been devoted to Maker's Mark for many years, but will expand my horizons as you've outlined and as the local gov't outlet allows.

Re: Where's Robert Pirsig when you need him? - 07/16/0307:24 PM

Thanks again Mark.. Sorry about the temp out your way.. I guess that explains your interest in the COLD an bubbly Yeah, living a few blocks from the beach is hard to beat..
I just made a print of this thread.. Will take it to Hi-Time Cellers tonight and fill my little cart to over-flowing..

Re: beer thread - 07/21/0302:32 PM

Hey I can contribute here!

You've probably seen these before, but along with malpropisms, I like historical references to our common phraseology:

It was the accepted practice in Babylon 4,000 years ago that for a month after the wedding, the bride's father would supply his son-in-law with all the mead he could drink. Mead is a honey beer, and because their calendar was lunar based, this period was called the "honey month" or what we know today as the "honeymoon".

Before thermometers were invented, brewers would dip a thumb or finger into the mix to find the right temperature for adding yeast. Too cold, and the yeast wouldn't grow. Too hot, and the yeast would die. This thumb in the beer is where we get the phrase "rule of thumb".
I've gotten quite a few email about this one. Here's what seems to be the consensus on the real story: The term "rule of thumb" came from colonial-period USA, there was a law that stated that a man wasn't allowed to beat his wife with anything larger around than his thumb.

In English pubs, ale is ordered by pints and quarts. So, in old England, when customers got unruly, the bartender would yell at them to mind their own pints and quarts and settle down. It's where we get the phrase "mind your P's and Q's".

Beer was the reason the Pilgrims landed at Plymouth Rock. It's clear from the Mayflower's log that the crew didn't want to waste beer looking for a better site. The log goes on to state that the passengers "were hasted ashore and made to drink water that the seamen might have the more beer". Furthermore, some anthropologists speculate that Neolithic people made the switch from wandering and hunting-gathering to farming in order to raise grain to brew beer.

After consuming a bucket or two of vibrant brew they called aul, or ale, the Vikings would head fearlessly into battle often without armor or even shirts. In fact, the term "berserk" means "bare shirt" in Norse, and eventually took on the meaning of their wild battles.

In 1740 Admiral Vernon of the British fleet decided to water down the navy's rum. Needless to say, the sailors weren't too pleased and called Admiral Vernon, Old Grog, after the stiff wool grogram coats he wore. The term "grog" soon began to mean the watered down drink itself. When you were drunk on this grog, you were "groggy", a word still in use today.

Many years ago in England, pub frequenters had a whistle baked into the rim or handle of their ceramic cups. When they needed a refill, they used the whistle to get some service. "Wet your whistle", is the phrase inspired by this practice.

Re: beer thread - 07/21/0303:12 PM

Sorry, acx

Honey Moon does relate to honied mead, but is a practice of the Anglo Saxons, maybe the Celts before them.

"Rule of thumb," relates to an English legal concept carried over into the New World by the common law. A man was permitted to beat his wife with a switch, but the switch could be no thicker than his thumb. Hence, the "rule of thumb." We've come a long way.

Re: beer thread - 07/23/0302:06 PM

Rolling Rock is my old standby. Just tried a new one from California called Sierra Nevada, since I'm from there I had to try it, very tasty light ale and nearly 6% alcohol. Tsing Tao is a very nice light beer from China. Then another favorite I can't seem to find around Chicago is Henry Weinhard's Private Reserve.

Re: beer thread - 07/23/0306:08 PM

Re: beer thread - 07/25/0308:11 PM

Move to Chicago and lose your favorite west coast beers, eh? On the upside, you have a plethora of new regional breweries to sample from. I remember having some excellent beers from Philly that I haven't seen available here in soCal for a long time. Don't remember the names but they were very distinctive: medium hopped, nice malt sweetness. Kind of like Sam Adams but more malt and a different hop finish.

Re: beer thread - 07/25/0308:23 PM

On the way back from opening day at Del Mar we stopped at Karl Strauss in Carlsbad for dinner and beers. Their oatmeal stout was nice without the oily tannins of some oatmeal stouts. Reminded me more of a cream stout, but without the sourness. Amber lager was blah. Red Trolley Ale was very nice, excellent, in fact. Their Belgian red imitation was one of the better fake Belgians I've had, but still can't seriously compare to the real deal. So many Belgian style ales seem to just be laden with off flavors that aren't working together.

The place was also a bit pricy as brewpubs go. If you guys in LA/OC make the road trip to Del Mar, I'd recommend the San Marcos Brewery instead. It's a little out of the way, but worth the extra few miles. More convenient would be the Rock Bottom in the Irvine Spectrum - the "Chicken-Fried Chicken" is awesome, huge and cheap. The beers only so-so.

Re: beer thread - 07/25/0308:23 PM

Re: beer thread - 07/25/0308:26 PM

Re: beer thread - 07/28/0311:31 AM

If you remember those ones from Philly be sure to post them...I'm in that area and am always on the lookout for some new good ones to try. It's nice having so many microbrewers in the area. Yuengling Lager is pretty good..started out local but they've been growing...not sure if you remember that one.

Re: beer thread - 07/29/0311:56 AM

Has a unparalleled selection of bottled beers - some really obscure stuff. Strong English beers from various vintages. On Embassy row, a bit of a walk from the Metro, but not bad. A mecca. Food was only so-so for me. Funky little brick basement kind of ambiance.

Capitol City Brewing Co.
1100 New York Ave., NW
Washington, Washington DC 20005
Phone: (202) 628-2222
There is another location on Mass Ave - I like this one much better. It is in the same building as the Smithsonian Postal Museum in the old Post Office next to Union Station. (This is not the Old Post Office Pavilion, which is a spectacular place in another part of town, but I digress). Modern, medium scale brewpub. Credible beers. Big menu. Cool place. Easy to get to. No reason not to go.

District Chophouse & Brewery/ Rock Bottom Restaurants, Inc.
509 7th Street NW
Washington, Washington DC
I see that this place has been purchased by Rock Bottom. Pity. When I was there a couple years ago, it was still independent. Spectacular meats - Ruth's Chris quality (and pricing). And some of the most memorable beers I've ever had, including an imperial stout aged in oak that absolutely reeked of vanilla. Sublime. I'd call first. Near the basketball arena.

John Harvard's Brew House
1299 Pennsylvania Ave. NW
Washington, Washington DC 20004
Phone: (202) 783-2739
In the basement of the Warner Theatre. REALLY good place. Good food. Outrageously good beer, including something on cask usually. Very highly recommended. Easy walk from the Metro (sorry, can't remember the line/stop) and from the Mall.

While it's not a brewery, you can get incredible food and a fine selection of wonderful beers at the Old Ebbitt Grill, a DC institution with great art, dark wood, and a private club feel. Busy, but worth it. Not far from the White House.

Re: beer thread - 07/29/0307:14 PM

Yea, I miss some things about California, least of all the smog, but I did try a new one the other day, it was a berry and wheat flavored beer. A little strong but pretty tasty, I wouldn't drink it everyday, but it was a nice change of pace beer. I wanted to get more Sierra Nevada, but my g/f wanted to try this instead.

Re: beer thread - 08/01/0306:06 PM

Bump! Long live the beer thread.

I'm judging homebrew at the Western Washington Fair later this month. It's my only "professional" beer judging gig. Should be fun, as always. Sometimes, you get really memorable beers at these competitions. Like the year I was judging the Fruit/Herb category and had the, um, honor of evaluating what I can only assess as the definitive Beet Beer. Incredible color, and it really expressed the ingredients. But I really don't care for beets much...

Re: beer thread - 08/07/0312:49 AM

I've got a few quarts of 5 year-old Scottish Ale/syrupy shiite left. I'm sure you would find it memorable. I remember what it tastes like, that's why I use it to marinate wood chips for my BBQ.
Everytime I crack one open, though, I give it another try - just in case it smoothed out. Nope, same old shiite every time.

Re: beer thread - 08/07/0309:05 AM

Re: beer thread - 08/07/0310:30 AM

no, no. take a can of beer, and completely open the top. drink 1/2 of the contents. after cleaning a chicken and removing the neck etc, stuff the can up it's butt. (that's why it's also called Beer Butt Chicken). remove the warming rack (s) from your grill. place the chicken upright on a cooking grid. turn grill on on the opposite side of the grill the chicken is on. you are using indirect heat. close the lid, temp about 350 degrees. cook about 20 min per pound. for the last 5 minutes, turn on low heat under chicken. be sure to watch the bird so it doesn't get toasted. then enjoy.
ps. maybe not allowed here, but we also sell gas grill parts.
pss. cleaning tip: to clean your grill, take a piece of tin foil. place it shiny side down on the cooking grids, and light grill on high. close lid, and wait. when you feel the fire dept is about to pull up, it's done. brush off residue.
dan

Re: beer thread - 08/07/0311:29 AM

I probably should comment on the potential toxic hazard created by burning the water insoluble ink off the beer can inside a bird.
Then there is also the internal lining used by some companies to keep the beer 'fresh' that may not combust into particularly nice compounds.
But hey, enjoy the flavour!!
(If you use canned Guinness at least remove the widget first ok?)

Re: beer thread - 08/08/0304:57 PM

Re: beer thread - 08/12/0312:41 PM

It was my good fortune to be able to go out to the lake yesterday and drink mass quantities. However, judging by my hangover today, one of those beers may have been of inferior quality. The suspects: Molson Canadian, Bass Ale, Sam Adams, Bud Light, Stone Pale Ale, Main St. Brewery's Wit, IPA, and Pale Ale. I'm guessing it's the Molson.

Re: beer thread - 08/12/0301:16 PM

Mornin' BigWill.. Was it hot this weekend or WHAT ?!?
My wife and I also got out of town and took a trip up to the cabin.. Barton Flats, on the way to Big Bear..
Finding some bottles of Sam Adams in the fridge, I couldn't recall if I had brought it up there to get it out of the house, or as a special treat for my next visit ?
Upon popping the cap and taking a long slow pull it all came back to me.. Yuck, Banished Booze !! hahaa
Lucky for me I had stashed some Tecate up there, so all was not lost..

Re: beer thread - 08/12/0301:17 PM

Re: beer thread - 08/12/0303:06 PM

I'm betting on the Bud Light, too. Bud uses quite a bit of rice in their mash, and it always gave me a headache until I realized the connection. Some chemist could probably explain how the size of the protiens from the different grains impacts the molecular structure of the final product, but I'd just want another cold Full Sail.

Re: beer thread - 08/14/0311:50 AM

Hey Will, not yet. It is scheduled for Aug 24. Unfortunately, there is the very real possibility that I may have to move that weekend and be unable to judge. I'll keep you posted. Thanks for the link, Adam.

Re: beer thread - 08/14/0305:43 PM

Nice link Adam. Pretty good prices too, though I didn't check shipping costs.
A site I check before travelling is www.beerme.com. It has directories and reviews of breweries and brewpubs all over the US. Useful for telling you where there at, if nothing else.
Cheers!

Re: beer thread - 08/14/0306:22 PM

Re: beer thread - 10/31/0311:01 PM

Just needed to bump this thread up

I am TOTALLY enjoying "Terrible" by my friends at Unibroue in Quebec. It is a dark Belgian style at 10.5% ABV. I defy ANYONE to find a better beer for handing out Halloween candy and catching up on the forums. Oh sure, that's a pretty narrow functional use, but hey, this is a simply scrumptious beer. Really. Could be the best beer of all time.

Next up - Jubelale: the winter seasonal from Deschutes Brewery in Bend, OR. yum yum yum yum yum. You guys should be jealous.

Did I mention that they PAID me to judge at the homebrew competition at the Western Washington Fair last month? Life is SO good!

Re: beer thread - 11/07/0307:57 PM

Re: beer thread - 11/08/0308:06 AM

better no let the bride see this report. while she usually has ONE glass of red every two to three days, she did have a beer last night with pizza while watching nemo. as you all are aware i do enjoy harpoon, and to keep peace with her, bucklers too. now being introverted, i better make the coffee and open the front door so customers can enter the building. oh yea, forgot my empties this morning to turn in at the packie on my way home from work, damn. if she sees the empties stacked in the garage, it's kinda a give-away.
dan

Re: beer thread - 11/12/0308:47 AM

man, you're a man on a mission..underage drinking...what would mom or dad say?
i enjoy the following, and i should qualify this by saying i drink lite beer only when it's the last resort.
harpoon ipa
sam adams boston ale
bass ale
these are only a few. my preference for hard stuff is johnny walker black on ice; forget about the red. but remember, sip it, don't drink it like beer or you'll never find the door so you can get home. naturally, having a teenager myself, and, for you legal types, i don't endorse underage drinking.
dan

Re: beer thread - 11/12/0310:44 AM

Re: beer thread - 11/12/0301:59 PM

The flavorful, cheap beer I used to enjoy was Weinhard's Dark. It is definitely NOT up to the style standards of Porters or Stouts, but my experience is that those types of craft beers are never cheap. Like most things, you get what you pay for.

I've long advocated drinking less quantity but higher quality. But, I can't say I advocated that when I was 18.

Sampled a couple of fabulous beers over the weekend, of similar style. Each was ~11% abv with monumental residual sweetness and body. Eku 28 is from Kulmbacher in Germany. Amazingly smooth, but almost cloying. Dogfish Head Immort Ale was from CT (I believe) and had much nicer hop balance. Each had characteristics reminiscent of Skullsplitter and Samichlaus, two other huge holiday beers.

I'm still REALLY enjoying this year's incarnation of Deschutes Jubelale.

Re: beer thread - 11/12/0303:50 PM

what is 3 years going to do for you?
when you're 75 maybe a lot.
harpoon india pale ale, the again, as mentioned sierra nevada pale ale is tasty too. recently tried a vermont brew, one of otter creek's. can't remember the name , not bad, but then again, 1/2 bass ale and 1/2 guiness is a holiday favorite of mine too.

Re: beer thread - 11/13/0312:18 AM

Those out of balance beers just don't make sense to me. I absolutely love malt but not like that.
I remember a few years ago Samuel Adams made a beer they called a "triple bock" - tasted just like soy sauce to me. Those German and Swiss beers you mentioned aren't as bad as that stuff, but when you consider the legions of flavorful, quaffable beers available - one must ask, "Why punish the palette with such syrupy shiite?"

Re: beer thread - 11/14/0311:53 AM

Thanks for the reply, Mark. I always enjoy talking about spirits with you.

On a "drinkability" and pure "enjoyment" scale, I'd agree with you. Those styles that are DESIGNED to be at the absurd extremes of a particular flavor component can be challenging, and are not really intended for a large serving size. I remember the SA Triple Bock; I was thinking about pouring it on pancakes.

And let's not hold harmless the over-hopped IPA's while we're at it. Again, particularly West Coast versions are intended to have 70+ IBU's of Cascade/Chinook/Columbus type hops (grapefruit city). But that level of bitterness has simply ceased to appeal to me; those beers are surely as one-dimensional as the strong, syrupy, malty varieties I mentioned earlier.

AND I think it is wonderful to have all of them!! Quaffability is not the only goal. Having a unique sensory experience, and tasting a profoundly expressed flavor can be a very joyful part of life. I guess I'd liken drinking Eku 28 to eating hot peppers or skydiving - not something I'd want to do every day, but a great opportunity to experience part of our world.

Re: beer thread - 11/14/0301:35 PM

I haven't tried it, but I know Blue Moon's Pumpkin Ale is fairly decent. I know it's a Coor's beer, but my wife and her friends really like it. It gets her usual Michelob Light out of our fridge, which is nice.

Re: beer thread - 11/14/0301:45 PM

Re: beer thread - 11/14/0304:49 PM

I believe that both Anchor *Christmas* and Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale are already available, along with the seasonals from other NW brewers (Winterhook, Winterbrau, Wassail, Jubelale, Snow Cap, etc.). Yippee!

I've had the Buffalo Bill's Pumpkin; I believe it is available year-round. As you said, it's an interesting experience more than a session beer. But it definitely expresses its Pumpkinhood eloquently.

Re: beer thread - 11/25/0303:27 PM

BUMP!

Just wanted to chime in that I bought a bunch of wonderful beers for Thanksgiving festivities.

Besides the previously-extolled Jubelale, I've now had a chance to savor this year's Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale and Full Sail Wassail. The Sierra is typically hoppy, but lively and fresh. The Wassail is darker (like the Jubel and Snow Cap), with strong alcohol notes and a dry nuttiness that I enjoy.

Don't miss Hennepin, a Belgian farmhouse-style ale from Brewery Ommegang in Cooperstown, NY. It is a long-time favorite of mine, and we used it to toast the passing of HOF'er Warren Spahn, who died yesterday at 82.

We always have a bottle of Lindeman's Framboise at holidays; love the intense, sweet/tart Raspberry flavor. Try it instead of Champagne.

Did not enjoy Perla, a Polish Pils. Just not as good as the Bohemian classics. Golden Pheasant is a satisfying new one (to me) from the Czech republic.

Still looking forward to Santa's Private Reserve from Rogue, La Fin du Monde from Unibroue and a few other tasty treats. Plus, we bought a five-litre can of Beck's at Costco the other day - session beer for after we've sampled the good ones.

Re: beer thread - 11/25/0310:53 PM

Not sure if these two have been noted already. Affligem dobbel boch and Sami klaus. The affligem is simply the finest tasting beer ive ever had. Pop the cork, let it set for a moment, then pour it into a widemouth glass. He who finishes off the bottle is in for a treat. A beer for sipping not for guzzling. The Sami Klaus is a different story. I try to limit myself to two as it is expensive and potent. Make sure you have an inexpensive back-up to finish off your nite. You wouldn't want to waste this beer once the goggles are applied.
Cheers
Billy

Re: beer thread - 11/26/0302:34 AM

HIJACK!!!

was wondering about good hard liquor drinks people like

i currently like, although my expierence is somewhat limited, jolly ranchers and long island ice tea. For those that dont know, jolly rancher is ussually made with apple or watermelon schnapps(i prefer watermelon), and vodka. if making a lot, a lime drink mixer(or whatever drink mixer) is used. The drink is served chilled or over ice

Re: beer thread - 11/26/0302:02 PM

Re: beer thread - 11/26/0306:34 PM

Tom, I'm disappointed in you. I thought for sure you would prefer your whiskey straight. I find all liquor better warm (except crap like peppermint schnapps and maybe vodka - but who drinks that straight?). Not "warmed", but room temperature. Or in the case of cognac, warmed by the palm of my hand.
With ice in the glass I feel rushed to drink up before it melts. It also freezes up the taste buds.

Re: beer thread - 11/26/0306:45 PM

Hawkson:
Tequila Sunrise, Whiskey Sour, rum & coke, nothing fancy.
But, depending on where you live, you might want to take advantage of the local fruit to make margaritas and daquiris. In my area strawberries are abundant. The advantage to having them locally grown is that you can get them when they've been picked ripe rather than green (not the ones from grocery stores, they've been picked green for longer shelf life). Strawberry margaritas are best with super-ripe, almost rotten strawberries (frozen-thawed are better than supermarket-fresh), good 100% agave tequila, FINE triple sec (but not too much, don't want them syrupy), sweet & sour, lots of powdered sugar, and FRESH lime. Blend using crushed ice. Serve in appropriate glasses and watch the ladies get plastered.

Re: beer thread - 11/27/0303:39 AM

Mark - you're right, of course. I was just trying to say something witty regarding the "mixed drink" query. It IS a waste of good whiskey to have it touch anything except a clean glass before it hits your lips. That being said, there is room in my life for all sorts of experiences, and I sometimes stoop to ice or even (gasp!) a whiskey sour.

We've been drinking Margaritas on the rocks lately (although I wish I could afford REALLY good Tequila....). The magic formula seems to be 4 Tequila, 3 Triple Sec and 2 fresh lime juice. Tequila gives me a very different feeling than alcohol.

I also had a chance to drink Widmer's Winternacht, which struck me as vastly superior to prior years' offerings.

Finally, everybody should have a bottle of Lindeman's Framboise Lambic on hand for the holidays. We much prefer it to champagne. While it is quite sweet for a Lambic, my wife (and her mother) are crazy for that big, pink, fizzy raspberry richness.

Re: What do people do to eggnog these days? - 12/19/0306:38 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/19/0308:59 PM

A few years back we attended a rehearsal dinner at the Yardhouse in Long Beach (CA), and they had the Lindemans for something like 13.95 a yard!!! I did the math, found it was much less than the store price and proceded to drink all the girly beer I could drink. That stuff is outstanding!!!

Re: beer thread - 12/19/0309:08 PM

Tom, et al, have you had a chance to try the reincarnation of Lowenbrau Munich stateside? I drank a sixer the other day on the way home from the dentist. Maybe the years have clouded my memory, but I remember Lowenbrau Munich as an outstanding, truly exceptional, malty lager. Distinctive, herbal and far smoother than the Zurich version. The latest version seems to be more an imitation of Miller's corn-based Lowenbrau than the original Munich I had years ago.
I guess my experiences with the original Lowenbrau Munich made me partial to the brand. Once when I was riding my motorcycle back from Vegas and got caught in a sand storm, I holed up in a little desert motel. The liquor store next door carried 40oz bottles of Lowenbrau malt liquor. If my memory serves me right that stuff was GOOOOOD. Have never seen it in a store anywhere else.

Re: beer thread - 12/19/0310:59 PM

Yeah, that stuff (lambic) is good. I need to break out my bottles. Hmm... not driving anywhere tonight!

My eggnog is the organic stuff from Trader Joe's (it's much, much better than Safeway or whatever, but i haven't tried their regular), which is about 8-10 oz eggnog, 1-2 oz milk (to thin it a bit), and 2 oz whiskey. Yum!

Re: beer thread - 12/19/0311:50 PM

You simply cannot beat real home made eggnog.
It is nothing like that store bought stuff. After one glass you can choke on the richness of the froth.
After two glasses the spiced rum kicks in.
After three glasses, you may hallucinate you are some guy named Peter....

Re: beer thread - 12/20/0312:33 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0309:51 AM

On my travels a couple of weeks ago I had the opportunity to sample 10 or 15 different kinds of Asian beer. All pretty good (disclaimer: I'm no connosieur - is that even how you spell that word???) and all had a North American style. You can certainly see the Anheuser/Busch influence. My understanding is that the major Chinese brewery Tsingtao (pronounced 'shingtao') aligned with Bud and has been a major influence on every brand in the area.

My personal favorites though, were Beer Lao (found everywhere in Cambodia) and LaRue Beer (found mostly in Vietnam). But there were lots of good ones to choose from and in those 2 countries, a can was routinely had for $.50

The other great thing was Red Bull was everywhere in those countries - and they free-pour booze so all the drinks are damn strong!!!

Re: beer thread - 01/29/0406:45 PM

Nice bump, Tom. Babys in my lap frequently now so my eloquence will suffer. Had an occasion to try the Unibroue La Maudite. Not bad. Reminded me alot of many red homebrews I made where I packed alot of 2 row and crystal malts into the mash.

Re: beer thread - 01/30/0402:24 PM

I live in Chico, right next to the Sierra Nevada brewery! It's the largest independent brewery (in the US?). The owner is a great guy, and they have awesome food for reasonable prices. It varies from pizza to hamburgers to steak. They're currently growing their own hops for specialty batches. They also have a very nice auditorium. He hired local workers to put in custom marble staircases, murals on the walls, and all sorts of things. Beats the heck out of the Budweiser plant.

My personal favorite is Sierra Nevada Wheat with a lemon. Crystal Wheat is pretty good as well. Pale Ale is the commonly seen varient. Has anyone tried a Bigfoot? They have a reputation. There are quite a few other ones. I'm not big on Celebration (Seasonal Winter Ale). Their brown ale is alright for a dark beer.

Chico State is known as a huge party school. I think they got #2 in the last Playboy list. The previous list had them at #1.

Re: beer thread - 02/09/0405:39 PM

Time to drag this one out again!

I had my first taste of barleywine yesterday at a local bar&grill, and I apparently started out with the best one available in the US: Rogue Ale's Old Crustacean Barleywine. Talk about a meal-of-a-beer! I had no idea what I was in for. Semi-sweet, thick, and very tasty. Just one made me hand my keys over. (The alcohol content is similar to wine at over 11%!)

Re: beer thread - 02/09/0406:38 PM

So I'm minding my own business wandering through the various forums here to pick up whatever information I can from the collective knowledge about audio, speakers and Axiom stuff. All of a sudden......BAM - BEER THREAD. Yeah, this works!

I live in Rocheter, NY and this is where they make Genesee beer. (Genesee is an old celtic word that loosely translates to "aardvark sweat"). However, I grew up in Pittsburgh. While I saw mention of that fine pilsner Rolling Rock, I have seen no mention of Pittsburgh ambrosia - Iron City Beer. The beer of the Steelers. The nectar of the Ohio Valley. I grew up quaffing this by-product of the Monogahela River and it is a little known treasure.

I should also mention that ordering surf & turf in Pittsburgh will get you a plate of Kielbasi and Carp. No matter, the Iron washed the steel mill pollution away. It also does a nice job restoring a pitted or rusty paint job on your car.

Re: beer thread - 02/09/0407:57 PM

Re: beer thread - 02/09/0408:07 PM

Right on, Peter! That sounds like comfort food, to be sure.

Thanks sincerely for the language lesson. I love stuff like that. Especially when it's about sausages.

I'd like to nominate Ray for best Axiom newcomer or some kind of fluff nonexistent award. He came to the right party, IMO. Ray, is Rochester close to Albany/Troy? I was at the Brown and Moran Brewery in Troy some years ago and had a truly memorable meal with some great beers.

Regarding the Old Crustacean - you're right. That is a big, big, beer. And, as Rogue was one of the pioneer craft breweries of the Northwest beer renaissance of the 1980's, it set a standard of sorts. But not a standard without controversy; barley wine is a traditional english ale type, but the West Coast versions are much more aggressively hopped than their progenitors. So much so that, like IPA, many beergeeks favor connoting a completely separate style (American IPA, American Barleywine, etc.). The only other recourse is to fight continually about whether beers like Old Crustacean are "overhopped for the style".

Rogue's brewery is on the scenic Oregon coast in Newport. Great place. Great beers.

Re: beer thread - 02/09/0409:11 PM

Tom - my entire life is built on a solid foundation of fluff! Thank you for the nice welcome. Troy/Albany are about 4hrs. away by car. I haven't heard of the brewery, but I try to frequent micros when I can. They usually put out a good product. I also notice the beer gets better the longer I sit there testing it.

As for the rest of you guys, while the linguistics exercise was very fulfilling, I have reached max salivation levels reading your posts. In the final analysis, I'm usually less concerned with how to say/spell it as long as there are seconds available!

From a philosophical perspective, I've always felt that the question of which came first , the chicken or the egg, was too esoteric. The more important question to be debated there should have been "was pizza or beer first".

Re: beer thread - 02/09/0410:52 PM

Beer to the resuce!

This evening my wife was rushing to complete a stir fry before she had to head out. She read the label on the suace she had bought and saw that it made 4 servings, so she dumped the whole bottle in. She realized too late that for 4 servings you're only supposed to add a half-cup. Beer cuts the salt quite nicely.

Re: beer thread - 02/10/0403:45 PM

I'm with Peter. Meads vary from sublime to Bug Spray. My personal efforts tended towards the latter. To me, the best ones are the sweet, dessert wine type. Like late harvest Reisling, but honey flavored.

It is actually quite difficult to achieve a sweet mead, because honey ferments out completely. It is not uncommon for a dry mead to have a specific gravity "thinner" than water because there are literally no residual sugars. Sweet meads require very careful yeast management whereby the strain of yeast is susceptible to being "killed off" by the increasing alcohol content during fermentation.

Spiced mead is called Metheglin. Mead with fruit is called Melomel, with malt "Braggott". Love those names. Check out the
BJCP Guidelines for more info.

There are many fine commercial Meaderies. They are typically small, local operations. A good wine shop should be able to help you.

Re: beer thread - 02/10/0406:44 PM

twodan, you can also use beer to soak your wood chips before BBQ'ing. I've reserved a few bottles of bad homebrew (was supposed to be a Scottish ale, but it is just WAY too sweet, syrupy and strong) for that purpose. Works real well.

Re: beer thread - 02/10/0411:43 PM

Sipping on a cognac tonight. It was labeled as an XO but only cost $20 at Trader Joes. Claude Chatelier or something like that. For $20 it's a good buy. Very strong orange flavors, a little wood/tobacco, and a bit of heat on the finish, but pleasant and very clean nonetheless.
The Portuguese beer "Super Bock" they have at TJ's is definitely something to not write home about - unless your letter starts, "I had the most unremarkable beer today..."

Re: beer thread - 02/11/0412:00 AM

Re: beer thread - 02/11/0401:47 AM

BigWill,

I've yet to try any beer with "Bock" on it's label that I'd buy again. (And that's before I found out bock means goat!) It's strange because as far as I know a bock is just a dark lager. Perhaps tomtuttle can recommed a good bock?

Bock - 02/11/0409:38 AM

Re: Bock - 02/11/0411:51 AM

Right on, Jason. Excellent choices on the Bocks.

Bock is a traditional, strong German lager style, not necessarily dark in color. They are distinguished by not only their strength, but also a sweet maltiness. Traditional German brewing techniques include a decoction mash, whereby the temperature of the mash is elevated in several steps by removing part of the mash, heating it and then returning it to the main mash. This technique develops tremendous depth of malt flavor, and can be easily discerned in the best German beers. Since they focus on displaying malt, Bocks are probably the best example of the melanoidins created by this process.

Doppelbocks like Jason recommends are the "biggest" examples of the style (and my favorites as well - especially the Paulaner). However, there are good pale bocks as well. I just can't think of any that are brewed in America off the top of my head.

It is an economic problem, really. Making lagers in general is more expensive because the fermentation takes longer and requires refrigeration. Consequently, you have probably noticed that most "craft" breweries focus on Ale styles rather than Lagers. Budmilloors beer factories still make lagers profitably largely because of not only economy of scale, but also because they require less of the basic ingredients (Bud is not very flavorful for a reason) and stretch their grain bill with less costly fermentables (rice and corn instead of barley).

Many of the American bocks that you see are not very good because they exist more as a marketing ploy rather than as a stylistic expression of the brewer. I don't know that I would recognize Shiner Bock as a "bock" in a blind tasting, for instance. The American brewing tradition came primarily from German immigrants, but post-prohibition economics dictated that marketing was more important than adherence to traditional styles and techniques. It is simply impossible to do decoction mashes in huge quantity, yet companies wanted to diversify their offerings - hence, let's call the "dark" beer our "bock".

In general, if you can get a Bock from a local craft brewer, it will probably be pretty close to style, but to me, nothing can compare to a fresh, carefully handled example from Deutschland.

Hey Mark, thanks for the tip on the Cognac! Keep those kinds of tidbits coming, please!

Re: beer thread - 02/11/0410:12 PM

Hi Jason,
Club is a Labatt's product that I assumed was a widely available Canadian beer (but maybe I was wrong). I actually thought they took it off the market after all those teenagers went blind a few years back!

Re: beer thread - 02/12/0407:15 PM

Re: beer thread - 02/12/0407:33 PM

Colt .45?!?!?!?
Even when I was 16 I was able to recognize that stuff as swill. I prefered the Bull at the time, but Mickey's and King Cobra would also do. The best thing about the Bull is getting all that glitter on your hands as you peel off the label in a drunken stupor.

Re: beer thread - 02/12/0407:42 PM

Bell's is, I think, one of America's best breweries. I am only fortunate enough to drink their beer if a buddy or I get near Chicago and bring bottles back, which is very very rare. Great, great beers. You lucky sod.

Re: beer thread - 02/13/0408:35 AM

this will be printed for the bride to read. lately she has been buying "free range" grocery items. i have mentioned bottles of beer or scotch are not caged during their maturing processes; didn't impress her.
dan

Re: Bock - 02/18/0404:49 PM

JasonG,

Thanks for the tip on the Paulaner Salvator. I bought the last 3 bottles from the store I went to last night. I cracked one open as soon as I got home and enjoyed every last drop -- minus the ones my wife nabbed.

Re: beer thread - 02/19/0408:16 PM

Re: Bock - 02/19/0410:15 PM

I'm glad you liked it... Paulaner's Oktoberfest and Hefe-Weizen are both good examples of their respective styles as well.

I had the opportunity to try Sierra Nevada's Bigfoot Ale tonight for the first time. I took one sip and broke into laughter. According to the label it is 9.6% alcohol, and according to my mouth the other 90.4% is hops extract. It's tasty, but ridiculously exaggerated. Sierra Nevada claims that it rates ninety bitterness units (IBUs); by comparison, Sierra Nevada Pale Ale has 37, and Budweiser is in the neighborhood of 15. I'm glad it's finally available in Ohio.

Re: beer thread - 02/20/0405:06 PM

Re: beer thread - 02/20/0405:25 PM

James, good for you! I'm jealous.

I respect the tradition, scale and Texas-ness of Shiner. I want to reiterate my other comments on that brand; it can be a fine beer, especially depending upon the atmosphere, circumstances and your expectations.

But it ain't no Bock. Even Shiner enters that beer as an "American Dark Lager" at the GABF. So, it is competing against Weinhard's Dark, maybe Leinenkugels, etc. It is not the same STYLE of beer as Paulaner or other true bocks brewed in Germany or at craft breweries in the US. "Shiner Bock" is an expression of marketing, but not an accurate stylistic classification.

Re: beer thread - 02/20/0409:22 PM

Re: beer thread - 02/20/0409:26 PM

Re: beer thread - 02/20/0409:36 PM

Tom, last night was Makers Mark - on top of Pilsener Urquell and Pete's Wicked Brown. Tonight: cheap wine, BBQ porterhouse in the rain and some cognac. You know you're a fool when you're BBQing in the rain.

Re: beer thread - 02/20/0409:40 PM

I'm a little familiar with that Fischer stuff. Drank a ton of it acquiring those flip top bottles for homebrewing (too lazy to sanitize caps you know).
It's not bad, but don't end your quest for the perfect beer yet.

Re: beer thread - 02/27/0407:56 PM

I like some of the Fischer Beer. It often suffers from bad handling and, like Heineken, tastes skunked to me. Is Alsace in France nowadays? Harumph.

I've not had that Stone beer, but they do make some good ones. Are they the ones who make "Arrogant B*stard"? That's a hop monster too.

I had a Piraat ale last night. Bliss, I tell you!! It is a non-abbey Belgian Trippel (10.5% abv). Hoppier than I'm used to for the style, but not at all out of balance. Really delightful. Highly recommended.

This thing needed a bump. I don't sleep at all well when the beer thread gets down to page 2.

I'm going to Florida in a few weeks. Is there real beer there? My previous visits indicate "not really" as an answer.

Re: beer thread - 02/27/0408:40 PM

I like Red Stripe on a hot day (it's Jamaican, though, not Floridian).
I'm not the Belgian connisseur you are, Tom, but I tried a few recently. I had a big Duvel, a blue Chimay and a white Chimay on Super Bowl Sunday. I thought the Duvel was excellent when you consider it's alcohol content, but not worth $6. The Blue Chimay was a little disappointing - IMO not as good, not as rich and raisiny as the LaTrappe Dubbel I sometimes splurge on. The Cinq Cents, I thought, was pretty impressive. Not something I feel comfotable drinking on a daily basis ($8!!!), but excellent. Thanks for reminding me to pop for a special brew every now and then. Oh, and the Unibroue does compare favorably to the Belgians - good tip.
Anybody up for an Old Rasputin from North Coast Brewing(?)? Very nice HEAVY stout. Much like BJ's Tatonka.

Re: beer thread - 02/28/0404:15 PM

So many names of beers, so many we cannot get in Canada.
How about for the Canucks, a little Big Rock to bring some sunshine into their day.
(Incidentally i own some stock in this company. Buy BIG boys!!)

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/03/0412:33 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/03/0403:00 PM

"InterbrewAmbev"?!?!? There is something REALLY wrong with that.

I'm not a beer historian, per se, but this global development is reminiscent of the consolidation of American breweries that took place throughout the 1960-1980's. Respectable regional breweries were bought out and closed, with the brand names living on as pale imitations of their former selves. I'm deeply saddened to see this kind of thing happen. Pretty soon, the only thing anybody will be able to buy is one brand called Budmilloors. I mean really, on a global scale, how many soda pop companies are real players besides Coke and Pepsi? It reminds me of the movie "Demolition Man" where, in the future, the only restaurant is Taco Bell.

So, I implore you, support your local brewery. If you don't, we could all be doomed to spending an inordinate amount of time homebrewing.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/03/0407:57 PM

I have to admit that I've only smelled boiling wort once when a friend was trying his hand at homebrewing. And I should probably mention that the end result was absolutely horrible. Could the two things be related?

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/04/0403:28 AM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/04/0412:34 PM

Peter, that's what I concluded. It's all a matter of context, time, and the value of "hobbies". Before my kids were born, I had the time for hobbies, and felt fulfilled by making beer. Now, time is more precious, and I don't feel like I need more "interests" than I have.

Plus, I have a better job and I drink less, so I can afford to buy what is satisfying. But I have two really nice, big brewkettles, about 6 pop kegs and other crap in my garage that I can't seem to bear the thought if getting rid of.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/04/0408:51 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/05/0405:15 PM

looks as though the beer talk has run its course, but i have seen some mention of alcohol. if you are into sippin' whiskey, take a shot at KNOB CREEK.. it is super smooth, with just a sweet hint of maple. started drinking it about a year ago and never looked back. dont insult it by mixing it with coke, just slow sip it. very good stuff.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/05/0406:36 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/05/0406:47 PM

Okay, just for the record, the beer thread may have "lulls", but it will never, ever "run its course".

BigWill's right about the Blanton's. I've only had it once, but it was memorable. I don't like Knob Creek enough to pay 50% more for it than I pay for Maker's Mark. I liked Booker's a lot, but I can't afford it at all.

But EVERYBODY knows that the best mixer for premium bourbon is Purple Gatorade. Sheesh.

I honestly don't know if I still have any hops in the freezer. They'd be about that vintage, though. The malt is long gone. I understand that Lambics use "aged" hops.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/05/0407:26 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/05/0410:48 PM

Since the discussion is taking a bourbon direction, I'll mention Jack Daniel's in passing. It's just right for the sitting on the deck after golf and sipping, mixed only with ice. With that in mind, I recently ran across Jack's new, older brother - Gentleman Jack. It's charcoal filtered a second time and aged another couple of years.

Smooth is such feeble word to approximate it's contact with your mouth. Almost none of it gets down your throat, rather it evaporates on your tongue and lingers like a soft Kentucky night in August. It's like a fine liqueur with an attitude. It's also damned expensive.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/05/0410:54 PM

Here we are... it's Black Maple Hill Premium Single Barrel Bourbon, aged 16 years. Fantastic stuff. Mind you, I've never had bourbon before this, other than Jack Daniels, which I didn't like (Side note: According to one website is not bourbon, due to the manufacturing process or something. No offense meant.) It's almost like congnac in its tendancy to evaporate in your mouth, similar to Ray3's posting about Gentleman Jack. Great stuff.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/05/0411:37 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/05/0411:45 PM

You guys are right. As I sit here inspecting my friend Jack's vessel, Isee that this is actually a sour mash. The Gentleman, however, is angel's ambrosia. I had to stop drinking cognac Will; it made me feel pretty.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/05/0411:48 PM

Because that ol' bourbon doesn't have a website... I tried to link to the Bevmo listing for it, but their thing doesn't work with links. Here's the name, if you'd care to search for it yourself: Black Maple Hill Bourbon 16 Year.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/06/0409:16 AM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/06/0401:06 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/06/0401:13 PM

hmmmm Never been big into bourbon - I'll have to check some out.
What about single malts?
Just perused the liquor cabinet - Lagavulin, Aberlor 15, Cragganmore, Dalwhinnie, Springbank unfiltered, Balvine Doublewood - may have to take a tour of Scotland tonight..

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/06/0402:21 PM

I've got Lagavulin 16 year. It had a very smoky flavor initially, but it seems to be mellowing. Very tasty, although I'm afraid I have to drink it on the rocks rather than straight. That's not a big faux pas, is it? (again, I don't know much about Scotch; this is my first bottle...)

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/06/0404:47 PM

tomt, i like makers mark also.. i just been digging on the KNOB CREEK, plus, it isnt 'that' much more expensive than the makers mark. the touch of maple, is exactly that, a touch.. i wouldnt consider it overly sweet at all. i have never tried bartons before.. i only started drinkin' alcohol here in the last few years.. mainly a beer drinker. being in texas, i have a connection to the shiner products.. plus, really enjoy going to fredericksburg for some micro-brew.. best beer in texas.. gillespie county..

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/07/0407:28 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/08/0407:56 PM

Sorry about that, kcarlie - I reread that last post today - sounded a little harsh. Really though, I have found that fine whiskey, cognac, tequilla, rum (yes rum!), all taste better (sweeter and more mellow) at room temperature. Au naturale, the way The Maker intended it to be.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/09/0401:05 AM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/09/0408:58 AM

discovered a great conac. i'm sure i will spell it incorrectly, but here goes pierre ferrod. they have three blends. i find the least expensive the smoothest. it makes VSOP taste like nail polish remover, though i've never tried it.
dan

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/09/0411:10 AM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/10/0411:31 PM

I've read good things about that tequilla, but have been unable to part w/ $50 for it. Do you know what quality of Scotch, Cognac or Bourbon you can get for the same price? Tequilla is, after all, kind of a wild - yet simple and uncomplicated - liquor. Costco had 1.5L bottles of a silver called Milagro that was absolutely of the finest quality. Not as boldly flavored as some high dollar silvers, but it was smooth going down and easy on the head the next morning.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/11/0412:34 AM

DL30: With a scotch collection like that maybe you can field this question for me. Ever try Talisker? I've been told it's plenty peaty like Lagavulin, which I much say I am a huge fan of. But I haven't tried it, and at ~$50 a bottle I'm always tempted to pop for something tried and tested instead like Oban or Cragganmore.

Re: beer thread - 03/11/0403:43 AM

BigWill,

The only reason I've had both the El Tesoro Silver and the Reposado is that my roommate at the time was having a party while I was out of town. When I got back, I noticed that there was only a shot or two left in the bottle Reposado (which had been nearly full prior to the party). I told him how much it cost me and asked him to replace it. He accidentally got me the silver instead. I was a little miffed that it wasn't an exact replacement, but it was a chance to try something different.

Re: beer thread - 03/11/0409:42 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/11/0410:30 PM

Highly recommend Talisker - I've tried Laphroaig, Craggenmore, Glenmorangie and the commercial stuff like Glenfiddich. The only one I've ever bought more than the first bottle of was Talisker. I drink it with an ice cube and a dash of water ... and I don't consider myself a scotch drinker - I'm more of a beer and vodka person.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/13/0412:55 PM

ringmir: I don't think I have ever tried Talisker, but SeanF gives it a good rec. If it's similar to Lagavulin then I would give it a go. I love the peaty scotches although sometimes Laphroiag seems toooo peaty, almost like chewing on a chunk of peat.

Back to beer. For those in Chicago, If you are a fan of Guinness, Go to Mulligan's in Roscoe Village. They have $3.00 Imperial Pints as a daily special. It's kind of a unfriendly bar, but they have 5 real dartboards as well to pass the time between ordering more Guinness....

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/17/0409:37 AM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/24/0409:42 AM

i just noticed the beer thread was falling down the chart, so i thought i would get it back to the top..

while at the bar the other night, i strayed from my usual lone star(gotta stay loyal to TEXAS), and ordered a pabst blue ribbon.. now, the last time i had one, was when i was about 12 years old, i used to steal them from my dads stock.. anyway, it wasnt bad.. it had a little bit of a sweeter taste that i dont like in beer, but definitely drinkable..

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/25/0410:50 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/26/0401:52 AM

You guys are killing me. Stop it. I mean it.

Okay, I was in Florida on business recently. It is a beer wasteland. Talk about a complete lack of beer culture. There was virtually no market penetration for ANY kind of draft beer in typical restaurants. Bottles of Heineken is about the best you can do. Pitiful. I like my beer living, please.

I came home and finished off some Sierra Bigfoot to compensate. Totally luscious. Didn't somebody say it was too hoppy? I'd disagree; it needs that many IBU's to balance out the huge malt/alcohol profile.

I had a Rogue Shakespeare Stout and a Fish Mudshark Porter last night. Huge, remarkable, wonderfully rich beers from the Northwest.

Thanks for the bump. I really enjoy hearing the stories about what everyone is drinking. Except that bullsh*t about PBR.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/26/0401:00 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/26/0402:03 PM

Sid, sid, sid. You know I can't let that slide

"cheap" beer is inexpensive (and tastes bad) because it uses less malt, hence fewer fermentables, hence less alcohol. It simply costs more to make strong beer because doing so requires more ingredients.

Most budget domestic lagers (Budmilloors, PBR, etc.) are 3.2% alcohol by volume (ABV) because that is the maximum strength allowed to be sold in grocery stores is many states. The vast majority of craft beers whether lagers or ales, exceed that amount, some by 300% (like Sierra Bigfoot and other barley wine style ale).

So, yeah, you CAN get just as blasted on cheap beer, but you have to drink many more of them, ingesting more fermented adjuncts (like rice, which gives me a screaming headache), and dispensing more, um, by products.

So, for me, even if I'm just trying to get loaded, I'd rather drink three good beers than nine bad ones. It's more enjoyable and more efficient.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/26/0403:09 PM

Tom
you're quite right. We're lucky here in Canada where really the weakest beer available is 4%. Most is around 5%. I'm actually blessed with a resistance to hang-overs so the extra beer consumption never hurt me.

Unfortunately, what I find in Manitoba (and especially rural MB) it is really difficult to find any kind of specialty/microbrew beers, and when you do, they're usually very expensive. Very few rural bars have anything on tap (Coors or Bud best case). When I'm in the big city (Winnipeg) though, I won't touch anything but 'live' beer. Harps is my fav!

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/26/0404:07 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/26/0405:10 PM

good choice Ken. You could always try the Everclear too if you want to forget your worries (or who you are, or where you live, or control over your mind and body) for an evening.

Another great option that I like to partake in is home brew from a local Hutterite Colony. They can make just about anything into wine - dandelions, rhubarb, rasberries, chokecherries, and the list goes on. They often mix it up using old 5 gallon plastic oil containers (probably cleaned out first, but likely not well) and bottle it in old liquor bottles. The alcohol content varies wildly, but one thing is for sure - it'll knock you on your A!

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/26/0405:55 PM

My thoughts exactly, Tom. Thanks for reminding me about barleywine again. My last was an Old Crustacean -- and I had no idea it was as potent as wine. I'd like to try some others to compare and contrast.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/26/0407:41 PM

Hi Peter - Don't they still have a barleywine festival at some brewpub in SF? The Toranado maybe? You should check it out.

I once had the great good fortune of judging barleywines at a very prestigious homebrew competition in Seattle - at 8:30 on a Saturday morning. My co-conspirator was renowned beer writer Larry Bausch. We did a great job, and I loved the beers (most amateurs willing to invest the time in a barleywine know what they are doing), but my palate and my equilibrium were both pretty much shot well before lunch time.

The Rogue you mentioned is fabulous. I really like the West Coast style, which is massively hoppier than traditional British counterparts.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 03/27/0404:02 PM

Do you think there is a more worthy topic for a perpetual thread?

I really like Boddington's in a can with that widget nitrogen thingy. Smooth and creamy.

Definitely ring me up next time you're in the Northwest. We have a humdinger of a baseball stadium in Seattle. Baseball is kind of like Hockey, but without the ice, fighting, clock and pads. You might really like it.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 04/02/0408:18 PM

Bump.

Needed to increase my post count.

ObBeer: I enjoyed the Half-Pipe Porter from Employee-owned Full Sail Brewing in Hood River, OR. It is one of their seasonals. Very full-bodied and delicious. A great example of one of my favorite styles.

What do you guys like to do with Gin? The wife bought a bottle of Sapphire on impulse, and it's really not in my wheelhouse, mixologist-wise. Chill a glass, shake with ice, whisper the word "vermouth" and pour is about all I can bear to do.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 04/03/0412:57 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 04/03/0406:07 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 04/04/0401:08 PM

Noooooo! My wife and I are starting to do some serious number crunching to figure out if we can afford to buy a home in the SF Bay Area in the next year or so. She has decided that switching from real and delicious beer (my term), to contaminated water (e.g. MGD) will help us save toward a downpayment.

There are only two bottles of Anchor Summer Beer left before the 12-pack of MGD is all we have. I think I'll hide those Anchors in the back of the veggie drawer.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 04/04/0401:14 PM

Sell the wife.

Good beer is a quality-of-life issue. How much are you REALLY going to save by being miserable?

I'd just pledge to drink less, but of the same quality. I regularly exhibit what my wife considers to be poor behaviour by expressing a preference for water rather than the draught beers listed by a server at a restaurant.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 04/04/0402:12 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/03/0406:44 PM

I thought this thing needed a bump.

I tried the fresh-squeezed, sweet, pink, Texas grapefruit juice with the Bombay. I like Texas better with every one of bigjohn's posts. Glorious. Really. But I still like vodka better than gin. Fresh-squeezed juice totally rules. We buy Costco cases of navel oranges just for that purpose. I can't bear to do the per-glass cost accounting.

Peter guzzled that case of MGD, but just won't admit it.

I conducted a double-blind test and proved, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that good beer tastes different than spring water. I know how relieved you all must be. Results will be published in an upcoming journal of some ill-repute.

Got some Modelo in cans recently and it was delicious; I've basically made a pledge to only buy canned beer if the supplier handling could possibly funk my mellow. That is, Mexican and Dutch beers (you know who you are) - your west coast distributors are leaving your product in full sun on the loading dock, and it stinketh mightily.

The seasonal offering from Deschutes is something called "Cinder Cone Red". Kind of malty, but still pretty aggressively hopped with noble-type hops (not citrusy at all). It's kind of nice, but did not give me goosebumps.

I also recently had LaConner Pilsner (small brewery north of Seattle). Much too full-bodied to be in style, but nice and clean. I think they fiddled with the yeast and fermentation temperatures so that they could get a Pilsner-like Michaura M-55, no wait, *beer* to market without compromising the effect of slow throughput in the brewery. It's a lager style beer with suspiciously ale-like tendencies.

They raised the price of Maker's Mark at the packie. We don't call it "the packie" here of course, but I just like that term so much that I'm going to promote it ceaselessly. Love that Maker's Mark. How was it again, Wicked Pissa?

Is there a cigar thread somewhere? I know nothing about them, and have no desire to be "a smoker". But every few years I have the good fortune to be in mid-load when a friend shares one with me, thus effectuating a unique satisfaction, especially when accompanied by dark beers.

Do you guys use coasters? Is the table you set your drink on during HT in front of, behind or to the side of the listening position? How do you feel about that? Done any studies on the effect of a liquid-filled, semi-cylindrical object within the audible field?

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/03/0409:08 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/03/0409:26 PM

hey, beer is back.. !!!

tom- i couldnt help but notice you mentioned drinking some modelo.. i will mention a few other good mexican beers to try.. i am sure you have had them, or heard of them, but i figure i am at least doing my best to keep the beer thread alive..

stay away from corona, that is the 'coors light' of mexican beer.. very generic.. average

i like sampatico.. only in bottles(all i have ever seen) it is a dark beer, very full flavor. very rich taste.

tecate.. this is the 'budweiser' of mexican beer. hearty, full, and robust.. good sixer for the lake will do anytime.

carte blanche.. this is my beer of choice when in mexico. it goes down smooth, and easy. dont get you too drunk, but thats good when in mexico. and it seperates you from all the tourists who are drinking corona. it isnt great, but not bad either.

and my favorite.. dos equis & tres equis.. stands for 2x's & 3x's. its common in the US, but i still like it. it has a very hearty, thick taste. it has a slightly unpleasant odor when you first open the bottle, but the flavor is fantastic. much like sampatico, just not as sweet.. almost bitter, but not very.. the only difference i can tell between the 2x and 3x, is the 3x seems darker and thicker.. heading toward a guinness texture, but just not that thick. but totally different flavor(reference to guinness for thickness only purposes).. by far my favorite mexican beer. at least of the ones i have tasted.

as you can tell, i am not a professional beer explainer?? i just call it as i taste it. if you havent had any of those, try em.. good range of texas/mexican beer.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/03/0409:27 PM

Excellent thread!

I'm going to have to plug my favorite local brew - Penn Gold as I am enjoying one right now. It is a nice and tasty German style lager similar to what you would find in Bavaria. I favor the German lagers over anything else. The Penn Brewery also makes Penn Weizen (great) and Penn Pilsner (okay I guess, if Pilsners are your thing).

If you ever find yourself in Pittsburgh, make a stop at the Penn Brewery for some German beer brewed in accordance with the Reinheitsgebot (the German beer purity law). You can even get a beer there in the large 1 liter glass mugs as in Bavaria. Its reassuring that the owner learned how to make beer in Germany. My German fiancee loves this beer but forever maintains that Kolsch from Cologne is the best in the world. These Germans are very provincial about their beer so I tend to agree with her. : ) I didn't read the entire thread but I would enjoy reading about great places to find beer in other cities. I shall dig back in the thread and maybe I'll learn something new.

I also enjoyed Shiner Bock while living in Texas and beers from a Kalamazoo, Michigan brewery. Can't remember the name right now, however.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/03/0409:38 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/03/0409:45 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/03/0409:55 PM

Bren & pmbuko (edit), I don't know the code for one of those umlaut thingys so I went with Cologne. Of course, I could have used the latin Colonia but that would have been ridiculous.

holy schnikeys! I just read Ray3's initial post in this thread. The guy is a yinzer! I didn't mention Iron City because, well, I honestly wouldn't wish that stuff on anyone. I buy a case every now and then though. You gotta have a cast iron stomach. And he's right, when tailgating for a Steeler game, not drinking Iron City is punishable by death.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/04/0406:10 AM

Being new to this forum this is one of the post I have tried to read most. I have been stationed here in Italy for roughly 2 years and Bavarian beer is by far one of my quest..that is to try them all. And having been stationed in the great N.W., now there is a place that also has great beer, just to think of all those micro breweries. But now I have to save all these names of beer that everyone is talking about for I have 2 more weeks and I finally will be back in the US and I can order my Axioms and SVS...been holding off waiting to get back to the States before I ordered, but I have talked to Amie many times in the last 6 months or so and have ordered many samples. But anyway back to the beer I have to say my favorite beer over here is Franziskaner..one of those Bavarian beers. I hear that you can get it in the States but it taste nothing like the .5 litre over here.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/04/0409:10 AM

tom, recently tried otter creek copper ale, a vermont made brew. it has displaced harpoon in the 'fridge. my vessel of choice is a wine glass. reminds me of a fine woman when i look at it in the wine glass. nice round body, and fine head. my wife appreciates that analogy, yae right.

5) The last is Stoudt's Scarlet Lady, another of my favorites. And I must say that I would rather spend a night this lady with again than some of the other ones I knew in college. (Certainly not all however!)

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/04/0410:41 AM

Re: beer thread - 05/05/0404:47 AM

OK,
Went out lastnight and found a couple of new Belgium beers. The first was Chima Pares Trappistes- a very good dark beer should be considering it is 9%vol and it came in a .33ltr bottle. Very good beer strong but excellent body..at least I thought so...after a few of those I tried the other: Dubuisson "Bush" Amber...good beer but after having a few of the others the mix was not the thing to do and I could have not been in the testing mood then. The Bush beer was 12%vol and it had more of a strong alcohol presence. I dont know if any of the 2 Belgiums have been mentioned before but I must say that I did enjoy the Chima.
New guy trying to build up post count I guess. If anyone knows of some really good beer over here that I should try let me know. It has got to the point I really dont know what all I have tried so I started putting the beer caps that i have tried in a glass so I could keep up with it. Dont even ask what my wife thinks about this.....

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/05/0409:07 AM

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0409:10 AM

Has anyone commented or tried the Czechvar "Budvar" the original Budweiser? I have slowly started to move to a lighter beer due to me moving back to the States, I call it: weening myself off the tit, I guess you could say. It is truely a great tasting beer, a lot lighter than what I'm used to and it comes in a .33ltr bottle vise to the regular .5 ltr. Anyway for those of you that are not familiar with this beer this is a link that I found to be quite intresting. http://home.att.net/~marcobrau/czechvar.html.
Anyway this is one of those topics I tend to hope keep alive..this is really a important subject...beer that is!

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0403:06 PM

Hey Wyn,

Thanks for the bump - and for posting your drinking impressions while in Europe. I am jealous of your beering experience (that's right, I use "beer" as a verb. Gotta problem with that? Anybody? I didn't think so).

You'll be able to find the Chimay in the states. It is fairly widely distributed. Orval is another Belgian we can get here.

It's a good plan to "wean" yourself off of real beer. Depending upon where you are stationed next, you will almost certainly find the selection exasperating relative to your current wealth of choices. Beer Culture seems to vary widely in the US; while states like WA, OR, CA, CO (and many others) have many craft breweries, I know for a fact that Florida is a wasteland.

I adore Budweiser Budvar. Great great beer. It is actually very difficult to make a beer that "small" that is so flavorful. Again, though, I don't see it where I live.

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0404:13 PM

well jack.. if you are ever in san angelo(doubt it), you are more than welcome to come over and watch a COWBOYS game with me. the houston TEXANS(they picked a stupid name, kinda redundant) are starting to get fun to watch too. my wife finds me rather worthless during football season.

on friday nights, we go watch local high school football.. saturday day, we go watch the local college games. saturday night, i am usually watching college ball on TV, or playin poker with my buddies while we watch a college game. of course, sunday is full with pregame, noon game, 3 o'clock game, 7 o'clock ESPN game.. then highlights.. then, of course, monday nights game.. all in all, my weekends are pretty full.. but, i always seem to find the time to have a few beers in the middle of all that.

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0404:24 PM

I like Czech beers. I don't think I've had the Budvar, but Trader Joes carried 500ml bottles of a primitively packaged Czech lager shortly after the Iron Curtain came down. It was very good. Blue and white label... Any idea what that could have been??? Budvar's label is red, right?

Re: beer thread - 05/18/0401:02 AM

Yes, its Red and Gold. I will go out today if possible and see if I can locate the blue and white label one. I leave here Friday..so much for opsec. Anyway, the beering has been a blast over here and I just came from Wa. State and what a wonderful beer state it is. But I do have an extensive bootle cap collection of what I have tried over here, but by far my favorites are Franziskaner Hefe-weizen and some of the local "roso birra alla spina" Red beer on tap! Good stuff.

Re: beer thread - 05/18/0404:59 AM

Re: beer thread - 05/18/0408:17 AM

San Miguel...OOOooooh...nice. Was Stationed in Okinawa for a while and I really like that beer. True, local is way better. As a matter of fact I have Pan de sal "sweet bread" on my desk right now. I come all the way to Italy and my neighbors wife is Filipino. La dolce vita!!!

Re: beer thread - 05/18/0409:12 AM

You know, while I haven't looked in Boston, I used to be able to get Franziskaner in Phildelphia. Check this page and take heart I don't recall at the moment where you said you were returning to, but in general it can be found over here...

Re: beer thread - 05/18/0410:42 AM

San Miguel seems to be like the Budweiser of SE Asia. There were ads everywhere in Vietnam and Cambodia for it, strangely enough though, it wasn't always the easiest beer to buy. Most small stands/shops had domestics only at a fraction of the cost of bottled water!

Re: beer thread - 05/19/0412:48 AM

Thanks ringmir,

I had a friend that just went back to L.A. and she stated that she found Franziskaner there but it came in a little green bottle and was like $7-$8 a six pack, over here I was getting it at $3.00 a six pack until two months ago and it went up to $4.50 a six pack and these are .5 ltr bottles. Also I mentioned yesterday I was going to see if I could find the Blue and White labeled Czech beer, well to say the least yesterday was a beutiful 75 degrees and I already had a cold sixpack of Budvar at the house so I ended up sitting outside drinking this wonderful cold beer while looking at the southern Alps. When I finished the Budvar I noticed my friends left some Holland Grolsh, not a bad lager considering they advertise they have have been brewing since 1615, but to me hands down the Budvar was better at least at the moment.......

Re: beer thread - 05/20/0402:03 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/20/0403:07 PM

I said "usually".

I don't think the Indians brewed (but the Aztecs made "pulque" I believe - a kind of low alcohol wine made from Agave) so it could be argued that the New World brews are all bastardizations of existing beer styles.

The California style of hefe-weizen is simply wheat beer with the "wrong" yeast strains used. Anchor Steam is a lager brewed at warmer west coast temps. Our American Pale Ale is probably along the lines of the original IPAs from Britain. Our current over-hopped IPAs may be an original, eh? I had a 4oz sample at the local brewpub last week and I think I can still taste it.

Re: beer thread - 05/20/0403:31 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/20/0404:35 PM

I'd agree with Big Will; I'm not sure there is a truly "original" style of beer from America, although the Anchor Steam Beer is unique.

Stylistically, there are some derivatives that are sufficiently different as to negate meaningful comparisons with their progenitors. Specifically, the west coast IPA style that incorporates Centennial/Chinook/Cascade/Columbus hops in obscene quantities rather than the traditional Goldings, Fuggles or other English varieties. The resulting "grapefruit" flavor is unmistakable. Same deal for Barley Wines, and to a lesser extent, robust Porters.

I was kind of thinking that I no longer really adored IPA's until I came across Dogfish Head 90 minute IPA from Delaware. It is just fantastic. Huge beer at 9% ABV, and very hoppy with 90 IBU's. Yet amazingly balanced and drinkable. Very highly recommended. That's the real trick; to make a fantastically hoppy beer that does not taste ONLY like hop resin.

Re: beer thread - 05/20/0405:15 PM

Ack! I've been remiss! When I was in Colorado last week, by I had some great local brews. The one that stood out most was 90 Shilling, from Odell Brewery. 90 Shilling, from Odell Brewery Very easy drinking with good balance between what one would associate with both lighter and darker beers.

Re: beer thread - 05/22/0405:31 PM

If you are ever passing through the Montreal Airport, stop at Moe's and get a Rickard's Red on tap. Good blend between light and dark with out the heavy aftertaste of most dark beers. they've just recently starting selling it bottles.

Re: beer thread - 05/22/0405:48 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 05/23/0401:10 AM

Replying to my own post, mostly because tonight was an excellent night. I have discovered that indeed all the beers I loved in philly (and listed in my old post) can be obtained at a select number of liquor stores and bars up here in boston.

You know, as many great beers as there are out there, you tend to settle down with a subset of them. And it's just not a happy thing to move and not be able to find them anymore. So tonight, when I found them, lets just say I had my fill And brought a few home for tomorrow!

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/18/0403:45 PM

I am delighted to report that I had the great good fortune to spend Tuesday evening in the company of pmbuko at my home. I considered starting a "Let's Stalk Peter" thread or something, but with 3000+ posts, he really doesn't need his own thread.

We beered. Exuberantly. Joyously.

Along with my lovely bride, we enjoyed Hofbrau Original, Elysian ESB, Piraat, North Coast Pranqster, North Coast Old Rasputin, Piraat, Young's Old Nick and Rogue Old Crustacean. And homemade brownies with homemade caramel ice cream and caramel sauce (god, there's a dessert that desperately needs a catchy name. Just Eat It, perhaps).

We conversed comfortably. We listened happily. We became instant friends.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/18/0406:24 PM

What Tom says is true. In a desperate attempt to shrink the globe -- well, the country at least -- I'm on an unofficial and unsanctioned tour of Axiom owners' homes.

Tom's house was the third stop on my tour, and I had the luxury of an entire evening that I didn't have on my second stop (sorry Ajax!). Tom's family was wonderfully welcoming and I felt at ease very quickly. After all, they have an indoor dog. I've never met an indoor dog family that I didn't like.

During my visit, I was spoiled with good company, good beer, good music, and good dessert. The end result of it all was that I was much less interested in critical listening and was having quite a hard time keeping the silly grin off my face.

I returned to my hotel room just after midnight and slept very well. Beer was still on my mind the next day, so for dinner I looked for a good brew-pub and found the perfect spot: Pike Brewery (not far from that place where they throw fish all day). In addition to brewing their own beers, they have a great selection of foreign beers.

To go with the chicken wings appetizer, I ordered a Kilt Lifter Sotch Ale. Delicious! Next I ordered an Ayinger Celbrator Doppelbock to go with the fantastic Reuben sandwich. It was amazing, and even came with a little white plastic goat souvenir.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/18/0407:49 PM

No apologies necessary, Peter. Because of my responsibilities, I regret that our visit was necessarily brief and that I was unable to show you some real hospitality. But, I was sure glad you came by, and I enjoyed your company tremendously.

Shortly after your visit, I said some nice things about you in a post to your brother Adam. He tried to disabuse me of those silly notions, but I assure you he was unsuccessful.

Next time you visit family in the area, circumstances permitting, maybe we'll be able to do it right. I'm looking forward to it.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/21/0407:24 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/22/0408:42 AM

Ok guys, just thought I'd drop in and share. I'll be having my first Beer Flight Wed. night at a local fine dining restaurant all served by the girl I'm talking to/dating. Their list is incredibly unique. They carry 9 Belgian ales (YUMMY) and 2 are Trappists (Chimay and Achel). That helps my quest to try all 6 Trappists, and so far I'm halfway. They did carry another Belgian that I can't remember the name of but only 1000 cases of it are made each year and WOW!!! was it great. Plus it's only $12 for the big bottle. Anyway, here's a question for you guys. One of the styles on the flight is a German "Smoked" ale, so has anyone tried a "smoked" ale? It should be very interesting, needless to say. They also carry a kelp ale.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/22/0409:32 AM

I have not had one, but in my homebrewing adventures I've read a few recipes for them and thought about making one. Seems that you just smoke the grain for several hours before you proceed with anything else. I've read that it generally adds a slight smokey finish, depending on the duration of smoking and the amount of smoked grain used.

Re: beer thread - 06/22/0409:04 PM

I'm going to reply to my own post, I just wanted everyone to know that I have finally made it back to the good ole USA, actually living in Jacksonville Arkansas. Went to the Class Six "beer store" and they had some very familar beer that I was enjoying in Italy, so it wont be too bad. Actually I'm just glad I'm back on line and can once again enjoy this site. This is the first post I've read so I have alot of catching up to do.

Re: beer thread - 06/22/0410:58 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/24/0407:18 PM

Well, last night I plunked down almost $10 for a 4-pack (count 'em -- FOUR) of North Coast Old Stock Ale, vintage 2003.

Vintage, for a beer, you ask???

Well, the box says this beer will improve with age and recommends cellaring it for a year or more! Have a look at the brewery's description:

As a continuation of North Coast Brewing Co.'s commitment to quality, our Old Stock Ale is crafted in the tradition of our critically acclaimed Pranqster Belgian Style Golden Ale and Old Rasputin Imperial Stout. It's brewed with classic floor-malted Maris Otter Pale Malt and Fuggles Hops imported from England, so it's a beer to be served proudly.

Like a fine wine, North Coast's Old Stock Ale is intended to be laid down. With an original gravity of over 1100 and a generous hopping rate, Old Stock Ale is well-designed to round-out and mellow with age.

We know it's hard to believe that this exquisite beer can actually improve, but trust us. The waiting can be an excellent exercise in self-discipline and the reward is built in. It's been vintage dated so you'll know how long the clock has been running (of course the Solomon-like approach would be to buy some for now and some for later).

We suggest a year's cellaring to let the complex flavors develop, but the longer you wait, the greater the drinking enjoyment.

For maximum enjoyment do not serve this beer cold. To fully appreciate the complex flavors we recommend serving Old Stock Ale at room temperature. This release is limited to 1200 cases.

This may just be the most complex beer I've ever tasted. Definitely a sipper, and it really does taste better at room temperature, too.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/24/0407:32 PM

Hey Peter. Where does North Coast Old Stock Ale come from. I ask, because so many businesses in my area call themselves North Coast "this," and North Coast "that."

Yuh see, we're on the southern shore of Lake Erie, and across the lake is that foreign country, Canada. So, that means we're on the North Coast of the United States. Isn't that clever? Of course that's true for the southern shores of Lake Superior, Huron, and Ontario as well as Erie. So conceivably, North Coast Old Stck Ale could be from anywhere between Minnesota and New York.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/24/0407:34 PM

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/24/0410:26 PM

I've had several different bottle conditioned ales before and they were all better a year after I bought them than the day I bought them. Don't wait too long though (ie, 2 or 3 years), and don't let them sit at room temperature. If your choices are refrigerated or 70s-80s, go with refrigerated (although 50s is really ideal.) It really does round out and mature the flavors in the beer. The beer I'm fermenting in my basement as we speak is going to sit in bottles for a few months before I drink it (except a bottle or two of course...I'm not that patient)

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/24/0410:41 PM

Bottle-conditioned is absolutely key to cellaring beer. You must have live yeast in the bottle in order to age a beer, and it must be strong (and preferably also quite hoppy). And you have to be prepared for "change", which is not to everyone's taste "improvement". Oxidization WILL occur, and not everyone fully appreciates the sherry-like notes imparted.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/25/0412:32 AM

I discovered through years of homebrewing, and reading about homebrewing, that live beers can mellow and improve with aging BUT...
-not at warm temps!!!
-not for too long
-and, if you're going to serve them cold, let them sit in the frig for 1-2 weeks.

That last bit is true of any live beer. Letting it sit in the frig for a week or two will encourage more yeast to fall out of suspension and hibernate at the bottom. As a result, the beer will be smooother and cleaner. It seems hop oils and husk proteins like to cling to the little yeast cells. The more cells in your glass, the more astringency you will taste. Pour smoothly and all at once to avoid pouring the yeast pack into your glass.

BTW, that Pranqster is not to my liking. I'm tasting hefeweizen malt liquor when I drink it.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/25/0403:20 PM

I might have to buy some more and keep it hidden in the back of my closet, where the temp is pretty constantly cool -- probably around high 50s to 60ish. Is that too warm? If so, then the fridge will have to do. Also, should I lay them down or keep them vertical -- any diff?

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/25/0407:15 PM

The comment about cork is right on, don't want the cork drying out just like a bottle of wine. If you regrigerate it you are techincally "lagering" it (prolonged storage at temperatures between 32 and 45 degrees). The beer will not benefit from this unless it was fermented using a quality lager yeast. If the label claims it's an ale, refigerating it is likely to drastically slow any bottle maturation it may undergo because its simply too cold. Granted, I think that's better than letting it sit out at high temperatures for any lengthy period. What I guess it comes down to is, if you are going to drink it in less than 6 or 8 months, you'll do fine to leave it at 55 degrees. If you plan to let it age longer, or you think you'll be pushing temperatures closer to 65, then you ought to refrigerate it.

The last bottle conditioned ale I had was Victory V-10. I left it at about 60 degrees for 8 months, and it improved significantly.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/25/0411:01 PM

I still think you should stand the cork finished bottles up in the frig for awhile before cracking them open. If not... remove the bottle from the frig, carefully maintaining its horizontal posture, have a friend remove the cork and another friend ready with the glass to catch the flowing beer.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/25/0411:29 PM

You ought to refrigerate it for two or more days before drinking anyway so that the beer isn't flat when you open it. And pour in one smooth motion so as not to disturb any sediment. By the way, I just sampled my beer when I moved it to the secondary fermenter... darn tasty if I may say so. Hoppy but smooth, with a subtle underlying sweetness.

Re: beer thread (BEER NEWS) - 06/26/0410:00 AM

I've got Papazian's book. Pretty happy with it. I don't have all the latest stuff and can't do all grain, just the core parts for 5 gallon batches from extract. 5 gallon kettle, 6.5 and 5 gallon carboys, airlocks, etc. All in all I really enjoy it, take a couple hours out of one day to get a new batch going. Then an hour or two a week later to put it in the secondary, and then sometime in the next 3 weeks or so get around to bottling it. Not too much time really since you get to spread it out, and you get your own home made brews. Perfect for a poker game or bbq Right now I'm brewing a recipe a guy at the local homebrew store gave me. I need to get a hydrometer next so that I can get a more accurate idea of how alcoholic my beer is. My method right now is, drink a few and see how I feel...

As styles go, I like more flavorful beers generally. So I tend towards IPAs and porters. I'm on my way to catch a plane for San Francisco at the moment though so I can't elaborate too much. If I can get on over there I will, otherwise I'm going to have a lot of reading to do in a week...

Beer = civlization - 07/05/0401:51 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/05/0401:58 PM

Interesting article, but I can't help but feel like it's a soft sell ad for crapass American swill beer. " America's brewers don't claim to make the beer of eternity, but we are proud to provide Americans with beers of exceptional quality today." Eurch!

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/21/0406:04 PM

Okey dokey, as threatened, to give you Axiomholics a place to express yourselves - here is the newly bumped beer thread.

ObContent: WhatFurrer brought up Anejo and other boutique tequila. Personally, I can't afford the stuff, though I would like to. Am I the only one who perceives "good" tequila as markedly more expensive than comparable brands of different kinds of spirits? I mean, I know you CAN spend lots of money on good hooch, but it seems to me that a decent bottle of Bourbon is $30-40 and a decent bottle of tequila is $50+. And there is very damn little tequila between the rotgut and the premium.

Draught beer rarely gives me a headache. I don't know how you guys can drink multiple american megabrews on weeknights. Good for you; I'd be a mess.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/21/0408:21 PM

I've found pretty good tequila around $40, but I'm afraid I haven't really started dabbling in the really interesting, boutique brands. I've just had the superpremium from known brands, such as (yeah, I know) Cuervo something-more-expensive-than-1800-in-an-interesting-bottle and Herraduras Tres Generacianos. (I will now slaughter Spanish spelling!)

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/21/0408:31 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/21/0408:35 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/21/0408:53 PM

I'll have to second your impression of tequila pricing, Tom. $40 bucks will get you a very nice bottle of bourbon or Scotch.
I try to keep it in the $20 range for tequilas : Puerto Vallarta ain't bad, but it's very light; Herraduras Blanco and Reposado are both lively, but the prices have gone up from $20; Milagro is a silver that goes down like water, but it's prices have risen too; Cuervo Tradicional is 100% Agave.
I currently have a bottle of Cazadores Reposado ($50 for a 1.75L), which is very good. I also have a bottle of del Dueno Anejo ($20 for 750ml) which is not.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/22/0412:39 AM

When it comes to tequila, I generally go for Sauza Hornitos. It checks in around $25 and I think it's excellent at that price. Definately my tequila of choice. If I want to put in more, I go with Patron. The only time I'll go cheaper is if I'm throwing a party or something, and then I just get Cuervo.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/22/0402:08 AM

This reminds me that I need to try a bottle of tequila a coworker of mine gave me. He takes an annual month-long vacation to Mexico to visit his family, and one of his cousins either works for or runs a company that makes tequila. He brought me back a bottle, but I've yet to crack it open.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/22/0411:02 AM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/22/0412:15 PM

Hey Andrew - thanks for the recommendation. What happened to your avatar today?

Last night, I had a (reliably delicious) Black Butte Porter with pizza from a favorite local hole-in-the-wall. Adding to the pleasure was our venue next to the outdoor, 50-meter pool on the shores of Puget Sound in which my daughter was jubilantly enduring yet another swimming practice. Of course, I had to be clandestine about the beer, but you'd be not at all surprised how well a nice porter slides into a coffee travel mug.

Often, the ability to savor the beer in the glass is really about the people and the place. That was the best beer I've had in a long time.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/22/0412:32 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/22/0401:06 PM

tom, you "sneaky pete". what kind of an example are you setting for the kids? is what my you know who would have said to me. i can picture you now...dark glasses, baseball hat, and a coffee mug in a brown bag; you rascal.
dan

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/22/0404:11 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/22/0404:18 PM

Of course my wife was appalled. More than usual, even. It is exceedingly rare for me to pull that kind of stunt. My genetic code requires me to do something stupid periodically to remind her how utterly simple Men are.

As far as an example for the kids goes, I'm a firm believer in not glamorizing alcohol. My kids routinely see me drink ONE beer with dinner, 3-4 nights a week. I always offer them a taste. They rarely accept, and invariably find it yucky. It's just a beverage.

American liquor laws are retarded, with the possible exceptions of Vegas and New Orleans.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/22/0406:14 PM

My first trip to Vegas when I was 17 was awesome. Drinking and gambling in every casino we stopped in - $.25 Old Milwaukees and well shots at the Westward HO! Complimentary bloody mary/champagne fountains. Walking the strip and downtown, riding in taxis, all with a bottle of beer in hand! Much better than Disneyland.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/23/0410:01 AM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/23/0410:06 AM

i remember seeing somewhere that a hotel has put in a whole mulit-million dollar star trek experience at one of the casinos in vegas. apparently, its supposed to be better than 3-D, they are calling it 4-D.. it incorporates, live action, with animatronics, with video, and sound, and lights, and etc..

my brother-in-law is a big trekkie, and he wants to go to it real bad..

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/23/0405:01 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/23/0407:02 PM

Speaking of beer and Vegas... a friend with a real German wife, born and raised in Bavaria I think, went to the HofbrauHaus in Vegas and apparently she got all misty eyed. They said it was the real deal. You can find 10% off coupons in the ubiquitous hotel magazine.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/24/0412:08 AM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/24/0407:46 AM

tom, maybe it's time for a beer shoot-out. skip the tv sets, avr's and speakers. i would guess we all can afford a six pack or single to back up your test results. guess the only major stumbling blocks would be imported vs domestic, and cans or bottles.
does this need it's own thread?
dan

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/24/0410:45 AM

LOL!!

If BigWill and I ever manage to span the thousand miles between us, you can be sure there will be a Axiom Beer Shootout Report. As to whether we'd have the discipline to do it double-blind, well, it depends on your definition of double-blind

I have probably already mentioned that I am a Certified Beer Judge, so I actually have some experience with and guidelines for psuedo-objective tasting. Once upon a time, some friends and I did a series of tastings of commercial beer using scoring sheets and double-blind conditions. The problem was, we found that the time it takes to actually analyze, score and debrief the beers really detracted from the experience of "drinking a beer with friends".

In homebrew competitions, I typically can judge only ~5 beers per hour, while drinking 2-3 ounces of each. You owe the brewer thoughtful analysis and comments. Depending on the style, it becomes very difficult to give credible feedback beyond about 8 beers - fewer for stronger or hoppier styles. Palate fatigue.

That being said, it can be fun and informative to pick a style, assemble some examples, have the designated steward serve the beers, and try to describe what you like and why using the style guidelines.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/24/0412:19 PM

I never submitted any of my beers for review by the judges, Tom, but I did talk to some judges who were rating homebrews for customers of a particular supply store. They weren't happy campers - it seems everybody was submitting their "problem" beers and these guys had to drink it. LOL

I did share an oatmeal stout with the head brewers of BJs in Brea years ago. It was a good one (hard for me to say how good it was - it was my baby). They were polite in their praise, but not effusive.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/24/0401:14 PM

I've done totally unprofessional judging of cordials (homebrew liquor!). There was a lovely Irish Cream that I still have in the fridge... Needless to say, I was totally $#!^-faced at the end of the evening...

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/24/0404:44 PM

bigwill,
where did you find Budvar (never heard it called Czechvar)? my wife is off-the-boat czechoslovakian (slovak) and i've travelled there several times. her dad is a beer nut and he prefers budvar over pilsner. i love them both but like pilsner better. i didn't know you could buy budvar in the states. every time someone from her family comes to visit, they bring budvar or gambrinus or zlaty bazant. awesome all, but budvar and pilsner are the best!

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/25/0403:10 PM

I don't know where you're located (i'm in soCal). There is a "new" chain out here called BevMo (maybe Beverages and More?) that carries the Czechvar. Also HiTime Cellars in Costa Mesa - though they had run out as of 2 weeks ago.

http://www.hitimewine.com

It's a great store to visit and they also ship stuff (i'm sure it costs $).

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/25/0403:11 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/29/0407:27 PM

Well, I just returned from my gambling/drinking binge in our local wine country. At risk of sounding snobby, I suppose I should have asked something like, "Do you really think the lining in a can of Keystone gives it a bottled beer taste?", or, "What's better - OE or the Bull?" JK

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/29/0407:48 PM

Hey, hey, hey, 4 in a row.

I bought some of this wine on my trip (click on the Meritage):

http://www.mountpalomar.com/wines/wines.htm

It was my 2nd favorite from all the wines we sampled over two days. Unfortunately, the best wine we sampled does not appear to be available online. Maybe if you call them they'll hook you up (it's the reserve Cabernet from Sperling Vineyard):

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/30/0410:44 AM

Going to Philadelphia today for a week. Pretty psyched about it too. I'm going to pop by the microbrewery (Iron Hill) in my home town, maybe swing by Victory too if I have time. Probably bring back a case or two of Yuengling.

Re: Beer = civlization - 07/30/0404:27 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/06/0402:21 PM

Bump. Somehow this thread made it down to page 2. That's completely unacceptable. After attempting to hijack a thread in another area with beer-related items figured I should bring the discussion over here, where it belongs.

What are some suggestions for good watering holes in Colorado Springs, CO? I'll be there for 2 nights in a couple of weeks on business. I'd like to get some tasty beer while I'm there. Thanks.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/06/0406:09 PM

I understand "good" watering hole. I'm just having trouble with the concept of a "bad" watering hole. Doesn't compute. The whole thing gets to that old joke that when you are reviewing the female clientele, the only difference between a 4 and a 10 is eleven beers.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/09/0409:30 AM

In reply to:

only difference between a 4 and a 10 is eleven beers

quit lying ray!! you would take a 4 home after a shot of tequila and a rub on the thigh.. oh, wait, that was me.

here is a good question. being that the majority of us are intelligent, common sense kind of people.. why do we continue to drink heavily, knowing that it will just set us up to make some real bad decisions sometimes?

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/09/0402:32 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/09/0409:13 PM

bigjohn, I continue to drink heavily because I can't find anything that gets close to making me feel as lousy as a premium hangover. I once attempted "death by tequilla". That was, perhaps, the best hangover I ever had. Even now, just typing the words cuases my eyelids to hurt.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0412:07 PM

Well I guess it's back to the beer we go. I have to add another Belgian to my list. Come to think of it, I can't say that I've ever had a bad Belgian beer. Is there actually such a thing? Anyway, I had a Duvel last night. The bottle opened with a nice "psssss" Poured the glass and for a second there I thought it was Champagne. Nice golden color, BIG head on top, and LOTS of carbon. Taste was rather delicate and with all the carbon it tickled my tongue at first. The finish was a full of that wheaty taste and lingered for several minutes. Definately one worth picking up again.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0412:31 PM

Duvel is nice. Subtle, clean, strong.

Tom got me on a Belgian kick earlier this summer. By far the most impressive of the bunch was Karmeliet Tripel. Softer, yeastier, WAY fruitier than Duvel. In fact it was the fruitiest tasting beer I ever had that didn't actually claim to have fruit in it. Strong kiwi and pear finish, bready yeast flavors, great head retention and crystal clear. Expensive, but great.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0412:42 PM

Funny you should mention Duvel.

The other night, I had a Maredsous 8, which is brewed by Duvel under license for the Maredsous Abbey. It was a delicious dubbel, reminiscent of (but not identical to) Duvel. As you said, very highly carbonated, but rich and complex. I am always amazed how such strong Belgian beers can be not only complex but also light in body. I'll drink it again, and can recommend it without hesitation. Shoot, I'm just happy to be able to get beers like this at my local grocery store.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0401:20 PM

I wish our stores carried more Belgians. My ultimate beer quest is to find Westvleteran (and to try all of the Trappistes). Fortunately one of our better stores has learned that Belgians are quite popular around here and in the last year have gone from stocking 1 (Chimay Red) to 5 different Belgian brews. I just hope that this trend continues. For some reason Hoegaarden is VERY popular. They got in 2 cases worth last Wed. and sold all of it by that Fri. *grumble* I'll have to keep an eye out for that stuff.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0401:29 PM

Tom, I'm probably telling you something you already know, but mash temperatures affect the amount of fermentable sugars available to the yeast. Mashes at the lower end of the temperature range result in beers high in alcohol and low in body (all/most the sugars are converted by yeast into alcohol) while higher temp mashes result in lower alcohol brews with fuller, sweeter malt body. And Belgians are known to use adjuncts like candi sugar, too, right?

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0404:34 PM

In the case of Belgians, the complexity in the flavor tends to come from the yeast strains used. Belgian yeasts contribute esters to the final brew that imparts some characteristic flavors (generally regarded as banana & clove flavors). If you make a beer, and then ferment half the batch with a belgian ale yeast, and half with an american ale yeast, the resulting two beers will taste quite noticeably different. And the one with more "complexity" to the flavor will certainly be the belgian.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0407:04 PM

ringmir, those beers you were making should be close to drinkable now, huh?
I'm definitely going to try to get back into it myself. I'm going to get a large frezer chest and use it as a fermenting cellar/storage cellar. Maybe be able to brew in the summer.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0409:10 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0410:14 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/10/0411:15 PM

Indeed...the ESB I made I've been enjoying for a while. I have a Belgian wheat I need to bottle, I'll do that by saturday. Next brew session is a vanilla cream stout, probably do that in a week, to drink come winter.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/11/0410:38 AM

For the vanilla cream stout I am planning to brew up a cream stout, and while it's in the primary I'll soak 3 good quality vanilla beans in a small amount of vodka. Then I'll add that when I transfer it to the secondary.

For a hemp ale I don't know what to tell ya. Dry hopping is great for adding aroma, but does nothing significant to flavor or bitterness. If you added it in the boil, it would extract more of the oils and whatnot, but you would probably drive off any flavor or aroma depending on how long you boiled it.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/11/0412:35 PM

I was more interested in extraction of the active ingredient rather than flavor. It's irrelevant, though. I haven't so much as seen a piece of weed since 1989. It seemed like an interesting proposition - one that would certainly be popular up there in the Bay Area. Think how much of that beer you could sell in the parking lot of a Dead concert!

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/12/0401:18 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/12/0402:04 PM

Interesting idea! Not sure how well it would work, since THC supposedly needs to be "activated" by heat at fairly high (ha!) temperatures. I don't know if I believe that, though.

Regardless, the effects of ingested THC are markedly different from inhalation. Onset can take hours, for one, and the effects tend to last longer and be far more intense. Plus, depending on your recipe, you frequently only get the THC and not any of the other psychoactive cannabinoids. That's one of the reasons why medical marijuana patients prefer to smoke rather than use Marinol, the (legal) prescription synthetic THC pill.

Speaking of alcoholic beverages that would appeal to Dead concertogers, though, I have heard stories of extracting the psilocybin from magic mushrooms by soaking them in vodka. I'm not sure who's crazy enough to be interested in drunken tripping (I'm not), but if anyone is, I imagine it would be the same sort of person who is still following the Dead around.

Maybe when I go to Bonnaroo again next year, I'll throw some pieces of portobello in a bottle of Five 'o Clock and try to make a few bucks off the dirty hippies stoned enough not to know the difference

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/17/0403:50 PM

*BUMP* Ok back to page one. You guys are slacking. Anyway, thought I'd add a few things. First off, the Belgians have been dethroned this year. Westvleteren Abt12 lost to AleSmith Barrel Aged Speedway Stout in the RateBeer Best Summer 2004. GO USA!!!!

Also, I picked up a 6 of Hoegaarden (WHO-GAR-DEN) this weekend and I must say that this is the one beer that I could drink at any time other than winter (Stout and Porter season). It is by far the smoothest and most unique wheat beer I've had thus far. Well maybe a tie with Duvel. Anyway thought I'd let you guys know.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/17/0404:20 PM

since it was bumped, i will add a story!!

i got out of the house for the first time last night since the baby was born, and went to drink a few and smoke some cigars and watch MNF with my buddies. i was in a hurry, and short on cash so i stopped at the convience store and they had MILLER HIGH LIFE in a 32 ounce tall-boy can for $1.49. now, i have NEVER had MILLER HL.. i have had miller lite, and genuine draft, but never the original. to be honest, i dont like miller lite or the GD, but a bargain is a bargain!! i looked in the beer cooler for something else to fit my needs, but there was nothing standing out to me. so, i grabbed 2 cold cans, a bag of pork skins, and headed toward the counter.

once i got to my buddies house, i pulled out one of the cans and sat it on the coffee table, and went to the kitchen to put the other can in the fridge. well, when i got back, they were all looking at me like i had grown a penis out of my forehead. their look of astonishment was rather unsettling.. i assured them it was OK, i hadnt been abducted by aliens, and that i was trying it out cause it was cheap. i mean, i got diapers and stuff to buy now.. i cant be wasting good money on expensive beer.

so, i pop the top and raise it up for a smell.. **sidenote**, a 32 oz can feels about like trying to drink from a 55 gallon drum. OK, take a whiff, and its not too bad. not great.. they are still lookin at me, so i think the penis on my head has gotten bigger.. finally take a drink, and to my surprise, its not all bad. it seemed a little bitter, but not unbearable.. it got easier with each drink, and by the second quarter, it was just like any other beer. i decided to start pouring the next can in a glass and keep the can in the fridge, it kinda got warm at the bottom of the first one. it went down fine, and i am proud to say that i have found my new choice, that is, as long as it stays $1.49 a can!! i am the consumate bargain shopper!!

BTW- i think this goes to prove, i am just a beer whore.. i have found that i will drink any beer, dark or ale, regular or light, cold or warm, thick and thin, expensive or cheap!! it dont matter very much at all.. to be honest, i think i have only turned 2 beers away in my whole life.. one was a samual adams, YUCK.. and the other was a german beer that had stuff floating in it.. the barback said it was to add flavor, i just felt like i was drinkin from some cowboys spit cup!

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/17/0405:50 PM

I would point and laugh just on general principles (and because you invited me to), but I'm very much in the "whatever makes you happy" camp. I'm glad you enjoyed the Miller. I've found that those beers taste better if you can't smell them. No headache?

So, there was not ACTUALLY a peni$ growing out of your forehead, then?

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/17/0407:23 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/20/0412:42 PM

It's sad when you are looking at a AV site and the longest thread is about beer. But then again, it is beer.

Has anyone tried Stone Ale. They make some great stuff. I live in San Diego and seem to be surrounded by Ale houses. Green Flash (so-so right now but will grow) Pizza Port (international gold) Carl Strause (Nice after work beer) and Stone (all around great. With 3 out of the 4 within a 10min drive it is like hitting a gold mine in San Diego. With all of these great houses around me I think that I have to tell you all the New Castle Brown is the winner hands down. If you have not tried it do yourself a favor. It is a "Brown" but drinks like a very rich lite.

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/20/0412:52 PM

Really there would be much longer threads if all the posts about their respective topics were confined to one place. What happens though is that topics are raised and forgotten and re-raised, over and over again in various threads. The beer thread just helps us to refrain from thread jacking with beer comments.

Finally! - 08/20/0401:38 PM

Found a beer that I liked. It's Flying Dog Horn Dog. It's a barleywine style, and I really enjoyed the complex flavor. And it didn't have that nasty aftertaste that always makes me want to gag when I drink beer. Anyone else tried this one?

Re: Beer = civlization - 08/20/0402:46 PM

You're a lucky b*st*rd to be living in San Diego. I usually stop by the San Marcos Brewery on my way to Del Mar every summer, but I've been wanting to visit that PizzaPort place. And I was unaware that Stone operated a brewpub. Whereabouts are both of those places located, if you don't mind?

Re: Finally! - 08/20/0403:01 PM

Re: Finally! - 08/22/0401:08 AM

Pizza Port is in Solana Beach, about 1 mile from the Del Mar Race Track. If you know Del Mar well then exit Lomas Santa Fe (off the I5). Head west on Lomas Santa Fe untill you hit the Pacific Coast Highway 1, turn right and the Pizza Port is on the left right as you turn onto Pacific Coast Highway. Easy to find but if you get a little lost then ask, everyone knows where the place is. Good beer.

www.pizzaport.com

Stone Brewing is located in San Marcos, about 20 min NE of Del Mar. They make Arogant Bastard Ale along with a few others. Fridays are great days to hit that place up.

www.stonebrewing.com

Green Flash brewing is located in Vista, about 20 min NE of Del Mar. They have daily taistings as well and the Brew Master is one of those guys that will keep the beer running free without a limit on the taistings. He will also tell you everything there is to know about beer making.

Re: Finally! - 08/22/0410:21 PM

Re: Finally! - 08/22/0411:35 PM

I've probably tried about 2,000 of them. My wife likes them quite a bit. I prefer something with a bit more alcohol if I'm spending my own money. I tried to make a Newcastle-style Brown Ale at home but I just couldn't stand to make a beer that weak.
BJ's Red comes in at around 7-9% ABV and has the same kind of flavor - just concentrated. Another you might like is the Gordon Biersch Marzen - which can be found in bottles at the supers.

Re: Finally! - 08/22/0411:58 PM

BJs is great, but I think they do pizza better than beer. Man I love that stuff, but they're only down south.

Ok, I might as well come clean now. I drank not one, but TWO CANS OF MILLER HIGH LIFE today. My friend was throwing a white trash party, and that's what I brought. The secret to making it taste good is to first take a sip of Keystone Light, then use the Miller HL to wash the nasty flavor away.

Re: Finally! - 08/23/0409:26 AM

my sister-in-law stopped and stayed with us this weekend. she has been on a 5 day road trip from cali to austin.. anyway, she brought me a 6-pack of west coast beer. it is called 'extra pale ale' from the slo brewing company in san luis opisbo. i assumed it was from a micro brewery there, til i read the label on the bottle, and it says "bottled in chicago, ill"..

without being too harsh, i would say i didnt care for this beer at all.. when it says "extra pale", thats exactly what it means. the beer had a very stale , unpleasnt taste to it. and it left a bitter aftertaste. definitely not a beer that i would drink on a regular basis. i will finish the six pack just because i cant let it go to waste, but i am terribly unimpressed with it as a whole.

Re: Finally! - 08/23/0403:43 PM

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! I created a monster! In its short life, the politics thread has already managed to overtake the beer thread! waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! drink more people, then the politics don't matter so much! (the previous statement is a load of crap, btw.)

Re: Finally! - 08/23/0407:48 PM

ringmir, you're going to pay for that. The Karmic backlash will be terrible, I'm sure. I had already noted with immense sadness that the serious, albeit civil, discourse on the politics thread had overtaken the joyful wanderings of the beer thread.

Obbeer:

I like the Stone beers a lot. Any brewery that makes credible strong beers has my respect and gratitude. It seems to me that there is slimmer margin and lower sales volumes compared to chick-friendly beers. Stone (and others) are creating big, satisfying beers for real beer drinkers.

The SLO beer is probably just another marketing ploy. There are lots of beers that exist in name only, being produced by the beer factory du jour. I've always hated Pete's Wicked for that reason. There are others, including the once-venerable Sam Adams. Beer needs a sense of place; an inorganic marketing campaign impugns my sense of joyful drinking.

Peter, I hope you feel better after unburdening yourself. You are welcome home any time, prodigal beer drinker.

Newcastle is one word. Sorry - Mark will undoubtedly berate my sense or propriety, but that was killing me. It's known as Newkie Broon to natives, btw. I like somewhat sweeter and stronger beers, personally, but that is clearly the standard by which all Northern English Brown Ales are measured.

Re: Finally! - 08/23/0408:12 PM

Gordon Biersch Marzen, another San Diego beer. I had my wedding reception at Gordon Biersch Beer Garden in San Diego. Beautiful place for a wedding (chick thought), great place for a wedding with beer (guy thought)

Re: Finally! - 08/23/0409:16 PM

lomb7, I had my wedding "reception" at the GB in Vegas. Couldn't have been happier.

bigjohn, SLO Brewing used to have quality beers. I haven't had one lately (years) so I can't comment, but I agree with Tom that many excellent beers are being ruined by marketing, accountants, and multiple brewing locations. Add Redhook to that list Tom.

BJs was incredible when their first brewery opened years ago in Brea. The brewers there were great guys and really did a good job making BIG, BIG, BIG beers. They were kind enough to be my yeast suppliers for a couple of years. They frequently made beers that were so high in fermentables that the yeast (wyeast 1056 most of the time) would conk out as the alcohol content rose above 10%. 5 pints of that stuff ($2 pints at happy hour!) was about all I could handle.

Anyways, their quality suffered when they opened new breweries and tried to have each site specialize in making only one or two beers. Don't know how good they are now.

Re: Finally! - 08/25/0409:20 AM

One of these days I'm going to make a barleywine...haven't gotten around to it yet though. I figure I'll toss in some champagne yeast to finish it off when the yeast conks out on me. Have you ever used wyeast 3021 or 3347? Or white labs wlp715? I'm going to have to look into it, figure out which is best...

Re: Finally! - 08/25/0401:50 PM

I believe on a couple of occasions I had a reason to use champagne yeasts, but I just used the dried version. Both of those you listed seem like good choices I suppose. With the proper ale yeast and some energizer I believe you can get up to about 11-12%, but the champagne yeasts are more often used.
I'm sure you know this already, but super strong brews require a lengthy mellowing time in the bottle - a year or more sometimes. Hard to wait that long. You'll also need proper cellaring facilities.
I cleaned up my garage and rebuilt some brewing equipment this week. Got it all ready to go, except I need a new mash tun. Ice chest style, infusion mash tun. Any thoughts on design, copper vs PVC, or maybe used on line sources?
Thanks

Re: Finally! - 08/26/0408:55 AM

I have been doing extract brewing for a while and am looking into making "the move" to all-grain myself. I'd probably set up something like this for my mash tun. There's some variations where instead of the slotted copper tubing people use the stainless steel hose braid that some flexible tubing comes wrapped in. I've heard that with a little trial and error people get 75-80% efficiency with a simple setup like this, so I don't think you can beat it for cost effectiveness. Looks like a pretty simple saturday project if you've got a torch, otherwise the stainless hose braid is probably easier and supposedly works just as well.

Re: Finally! - 08/26/0401:06 PM

Yeah, my friend made a copper one like that. I've also seen PVC versions, which strike me as easier to assemble (I'm torchless).
The primary advantage to going all grain is cost. You may not notice any improvement in your beers (assuming you're using some specialty malts now in your extract beers), and the grain creates a lot more work and possibility for problems like tannic harshness and infections.
OTOH, when you hit a good one there does seem to be a little more "pride of the creator" in your enjoyment of the beer.

Re: Finally! - 08/26/0402:06 PM

Yeah, I am using specialty malts, pretty frequently actually. I know it's cheaper...the draw for me is the artistry of it more than anything else though. So long as you can stick your temperatures properly, everything should work out nicely. You should look into the stainless hose braid option. This has a few pictures of it under the "cooler detail" header down the page a bit. If you go with PVC make sure you get something "food grade" that can tolerate the temperatures without releasing any nasty toxic chemicals...

Re: Finally! - 08/26/0402:07 PM

Hi guys,

I don't really brew any more - I'd rather spend any given Saturday with my kids than washing buckets. But I made my share of beer (and then some), having brewed >100 batches all grain. I am convinced that some brewers are engineers, some are cooks, and some are scientists, but we are ALL janitors.

My mash tun is a cooler with the PVC manifold. You need to use the kind of PVC that is rated for Hot water (not the regular, white kind). I don't know the lingo, but it is kind of tan in color. My joints are NOT glued (just shoved together), because I am not convinced that the PVC cement, even for that rated pipe, would be impervious to temperatures near boiling, and I want to be double-sure I can get it absolutely clean each use. The PVC is easier to work with, but you still should get on that sweating-copper-joints-with-a-torch bandwagon. I mean, it's a big, fiery thing! Closest you can come to a flame thrower in suburbia! Insert Tim Taylor noise here. It is not difficult to do, and you simply CANNOT make perfect creme broulee without a propane torch; it is the only way to carmelize/harden the sugar on top without heating up the custard underneath. My wife is convinced that I am borrowing her kitchen tool when I need to do plumbing, rather than vice-versa.

I'd disagree somewhat with my friend bigwill about the inherent qualitative differences between extract and all-grain brewing. I feel that I can pick out an extract beer, even a well-made one, virtually every time. There is something about the residual protien and residual sugars that just isn't "there" with extracts. Likewise, the ability to mash the specialty grains with the rest of the malt (rather than do some infusion during the boil) actually reduces the tendency to leach astringent compounds from the grain. I don't think that properly-made all-grain beers are any more susceptible to infections than extract beers; in each case, you just have to be careful what happens AFTER the boil. It's sanitary at that point regardless of how you got your sugars.

It takes more time. But man, there is NOTHING like the smell of a barley mash! And you have much greater control over the entire process.

Look at it this way - extracts are basically "canned food". If you are going to spend the time, money and energy to make something truly delicious, don't you use FRESH ingredients?

Re: Finally! - 08/26/0403:10 PM

I will go to all grain, it's just a matter of when really. There are other problems with extract too. It's impossible to get the color of a beer right, you're reliant on consistency of the extracts, etc. As for the torch, I've already got an acetylene torch so...yeah. It's a fun thing to own. I've done some minor plumbing work with it, so putting together something for a mash tun doesn't seem too complicated. Ever want to get a bbq going in a blizzard? No problem, large torch tip, fingers crossed that you don't overheat the grill... (oxy-acetylene of course is even more fun, but then it's fingers crossed you don't burn through the grill.) I am the engineer type of brewer myself. I think your classifications are spot-on. There's organic chemistry for the chemists, procedure and equipment for the engineers, and culinary freedom for the cooks.

Re: Finally! - 08/26/0403:53 PM

Thanks for your expertise, Tom.
When I mentioned an increased chance of infection in all grain beers, I was referring to the likelihood that ringmir will be storing, pouring and measuring his malt in the vicinity of his fermenters, bottles, bottling pail, etc... In that situation there is an increased chance of the lacto-bacillus bug getting started. Just makes sanitation of even greater importance.

I'm going to start back up this winter. The old lady quit her job to be stay-at-home mom. It's either start brewing or start drinking Lucky Lager.

Re: Finally! - 08/26/0404:30 PM

Mark, you're right, of course. I did not consider the environmental impacts of living with grain when considering the all grain brewing process. I'll just shut up now and leave it to you "Active" brewers

Do they even still make Lucky Lager? That was a legendary beer. Loved those picture puzzles they used to have in the caps!

Re: Finally! - 08/26/0407:35 PM

No way, Tom! Don't shut up now. That was just my INTJ personality not being sensitive enough to your feelings. Seriously, I would love to be able to discuss homebrewing with you guys.

Just as seriously, I was actually scouring the ads for some Old Milwaukee sales, but I didn't find any. That's a cheap beer I can live with. By Xmas, though, I should have some nice homebrewed ale available (maybe start with a stout or porter) - if any of y'all are coming to soCal.

Re: Finally! - 08/27/0407:45 PM

If anybody needs a vintage Schmidling Malt Mill, I might be able to help you

Okay, this is a totally shameless, Str$$m-free bump. Criminy, what a train wreck.

Mark, one of these days, you and I ARE going to drink beer together. It might be one you've made, it probably won't be one I have, but it will very likely be the best beer I've had in a long while.

I'm going home to my lovely wife and charming children now. There will be Deschutes Obsidian Stout and Mirror Pond, Paulaner Oktoberfest (yippee!) and Elysian Porter to choose from when I exit my vehicle next to the beer fridge in the garage. The distance from the bottle opener to the glass will seem interminable.

You guys should go listen to some music sometimes. And maybe roast a pig or something.

Re: Finally! - 08/28/0402:41 AM

Re: Finally! - 08/28/0402:46 AM

Re: Finally! - 08/30/0401:33 PM

BigDaddyTom,
I tried that Deschutes Mirror Pond Pale Ale yesterday. Very good, but I prefer the Stone Pale Ale or the pale at my local brewery. The Mirror Pond had a great malt body; a noticeable, yet not too assertive, hop presence; and a clean finish. About halfway through the bottle, though, that citric tartness of the Cascade hops was all I could taste. I don't really like Cascade hops that much.
I'll try the Stout next time.
Did you ever notice any difference in your beers by cracking the malt yourself as opposed to having the store do it? I always bought in bulk, so the first batch would use freshly cracked (previous day usually) malt and the next batch or two would use stored stuff.
Is that malt mill a little dinky one or a big one?

Re: Finally! - 08/30/0405:18 PM

Hey bigwill,

I can't disagree with your perceptions of the Mirror Pond. It always tastes fresh, balanced and reliable to me, but it does definitely present the hops in a non-nuanced way. The Stout and Porter are just super.

I always cracked my grain the night before.

The maltmill is not commercial-grade; it is for the homebrewer. I'll snap a pic if I have a chance. Nicely crafted American product, but homebrew shops are now more able to accommodate this kind of service than they were 10-15 years ago. Back then, I was buying sacks of grain as a co-op venture with my club because there was no credible local retail homebrew presence.

Re: Finally! - 08/30/0405:32 PM

I'm thinking that If I tell you guy's I really like MGD.............you may come down on me a little. What can I say, I like the stuff which is odd for me as I don't like a lot of US made beer.........or Canadian for that matter. I tend to drink MGD, Corona and every now and then Sleemans.

Re: Finally! - 09/05/0410:46 PM

Re: Finally! - 09/05/0410:58 PM

I nominate rigmir for the "post of the year" award. (Since there is a lot of misunderstanding going around these days, I feel it necessary to explain that I'm completely serious about what I just said. I laughed aloud when I read the post, and marveled at its simplicity, its lucidity, and it's profundity. I liked it.)

Re: Finally! - 09/05/0411:57 PM

Re: Finally! - 09/06/0401:05 AM

Re: Finally! - 09/06/0403:33 PM

Yeah...finished brewing up a brown ale last night, transfered it to the carboy, drank some sccotch and a few homebrews, came on here, and saw the politics thread progressing along and the beer thread off the page. Figured it needed a bump. So, IPA in hand, that was what I came up with... *shrug* Glad it gave you a chuckle

Re: Finally! - 09/06/0407:16 PM

Hey ringmir, one way to get some malty authenticity to your extract beers is to use a few pounds of whatever (specialty malts or even a few pounds of 2 row) in a small icechest as sort of a mini-mash. I used to use an old Coleman jug with a spigot on the bottom, barely sparge at all, let the wort collect and settle in a bucket or pan, and then siphon it off into your brewkettle - leaving the debris behind. Not the best way to do it, but if you don't disturb the grain bed too much and don't sparge too much, you may like the results. And you'll get a feel for the extra work grain brewing entails.
Are you using any sort of temperature controlled brewing area? Or is it cool enough where you live to just let the carboys set on the ground?

Re: Finally! - 09/06/0411:54 PM

I do some mini-mash with most of my brews actually. Generally not more than 2 lbs of grain though. I think it does help a decent amount. Eventually I'll move to all grain, but I'm moving around too much still to accumulate that much equipment. As for the weather, I'm in Boston right now, so if I leave the carboy in the basement the temp holds right around 70. A month ago I had to run a "swamp cooler" set up on it or else the temps would have been around 76. In the winter I'll have to see, I'm hoping it will be cool enough at the rear of the basement (away from the furnace and all) to be within lager temps. If not I'll move it up to my room and make sure the thermostat stays in the ale range. At my old place I just left the carboy in my room in the winter and it stayed in the ale temperature region.

Oktoberfest - 09/13/0411:23 AM

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/13/0411:35 AM

For traditional German styles, the classics endure - Hofbrauhaus and Paulaner. I know, not inspired. Of course, if you can find a local brewer with the guts to make those styles, toss a nickel in his cup. Problem is, I don't think you can get the depth of flavor in those big lagers without doing a decoction mash and enduring a good, long fermentation - both aspects being technically and economically beyond the reach of most small, craft breweries.

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/13/0411:50 AM

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/13/0411:54 AM

Tom Tuttle, we have a brewery here in Pittsburgh that makes a German style lager, Hefeweizen, and a few seasonal beers. Throw a nickel in their cup indeed; I support this place at least once a week. : )

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/13/0412:09 PM

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/13/0412:12 PM

To nitpick...a Hefeweizen is a traditional German style, but it's technically an ale. Lagers are fermented using a bottom fermenting yeast as opposed to ales where the yeast is top fermenting. Additionally the temperature ranges are different, lagers are fermented (and aged, referred to as "lagering") at cooler temps than ales.

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/13/0401:16 PM

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/13/0401:26 PM

Yes, Peter, but you know it can never work

Andrew's got it covered on the classic examples. Great beer time of year. I forgot about Goose Island. Full Sail used to brew an ENORMOUS Fest beer. I mean really, steroids. Big and chewy, but so unlike the subtler versions as to be nearly out of style. Recognizable and wonderful, but silly strong.

We'll never catch the politics thread in number of posts, but the quality of life is much better here. Anybody drink any good or new beers with the onset of football season?

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/13/0401:41 PM

I did not know there was a Hofbrauhaus in Cincy. New reasons to travel to Ohio! I was very interested when Bigwill alerted me to the existence of the one in Vegas (which I've also not seen, yet). Is the one in Cincinnati also an authentic reproduction of the hall in Munich?

I've been to the one in Munich. Neener neener.

Fat Tire is the cash-cow of New Belgium Brewing in Fort Collins, CO. They make great beers. Fat Tire is reliable and can be quite good if you get it fresh. I've found that it is better on draught, and is a welcome site in places where it might be the only beer with character in bars that serve multiple variants of Budmilloors. I like the stronger styles they brew better, but Fat Tire is a pretty nice amber beer, with a depth of flavor (from the yeast) uncommon in mass-market American beer.

If I come to Pittsburgh, can I eat all the yummy food and stuff without having to drink Iron City?

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/13/0402:49 PM

Tom: I think the one in Cincy isn't a reproduction but its run by the folks in Munich. Actually, I think its in Kentucky but right across the river is Cincy. Many times I've pondered a road trip there.

I've been to the Hofbrauhaus in Munich also. Did you check out Augustiner Keller also? Ohhhhh, there's nothing like an evening at the bier garden.

My lady is from Cologne so, by birthright, she is forbidden to appreciate the Bavarian or Helles style lagers over the Rhineland beers. Its Kolsch all the way for her.

Yeah, if you find yourself in the Burgh, I definitely recommend that you shun Iron City for the Penn Brewery or the Sharp Edge Beer Emporium (fine Belgians, etc.). Sometimes I think Iron City goes down as smooth as broken glass.

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/16/0412:41 AM

Costco in my area has the Spaten Oktoberfest at $20/case - not bad. I like the Paulaner a little better, but wtf it's Costco. I would love to try HB Oktoberfest - never even seen it. Celebrator is tremendous and expensive.
IF ANYONE EVER HAS THE CHANCE TO BUY SOME KULMBACHER REICHELBRAU (the pale one) PLEASE, PLEASE GRAB ME AS MUCH AS YOU CAN CARRY!!! I had semi-erotic dreams about that beer for a long time - it goes great with mushrooms (mushroom appetizers, of course ).

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/17/0402:16 AM

Ok guys, since this weekend is Octoberfest I figure I might as well celibrate, but I haven't really ever explored many German beers. I'm too stuck on Belgians at the moment. Anyway, I have had Spaten Optimator, and Beck's dark before and I enjoy them both. However, I turn to you guys for some German suggestions. Preferably no Lagers or Pilsners though. Thanks in advance.

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/17/0407:39 AM

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/17/0410:35 PM

I'm highly partial to their pale myself.

I'd suggest that you check your local brewpub for keg prices - you'll likely find a good deal on something. I believe my local brewpub has kegs in the $80 range. The beers can be hit or miss, so it may be wise to sample a few before purchasing. My buddy recently acquired a kegerator from costco - it's about the only thing he wants to talk about any more (not counting T&A, poker, and trips to the river).

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/23/0409:21 AM

Ok so this thread was almost off page two...needed a bump.

I made a beer for my mother this past weekend, hopefully it'll turn out well and she'll like it. (She's not a beer drinker at all.) I took a risk and decided to make a vanilla milk porter. (Essentially a milk stout with no roasted barley.) I figure, if nothing else it will be unlike any beer she's ever tasted. The desired result is a healthy dose of vanilla underlying a moderately sweet, creamy porter. Something to drink cold with a slice of apple pie at christmas time. She recently got elected as a district justice in my hometown, so the beer is being dubbed "JudgeMental".

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/23/0409:43 AM

when i was at the grocery store on tuesday, i noticed they have beefed up their beer section, and enlarged it to include lots of import and microbrew beers. so, i grabbed a six pack, and told my wife i was gonna try a different one each week. i grabbed a sixer of St Pauli's Girl. i know, i know, its kind of common, but i have never had one, and i liked the picture of the girl on the bottle

BTW- i never noticed til tuesday, but the HUGE display of beer at the store is almost like art.. it was a 7ft high, 30ft long mural of colors and textures, and designs. i found it somewhat mesmurizing to look at.

i think next week i will try an italian beer that looked interesting. i have an idea, maybe i need to make a list of hopefuls and post here for ya'll to advise me on. it will at least keep the thread alive on a weekly basis. ?

Re: Oktoberfest - 09/23/0409:50 AM

I had made a similar "art" observation once regarding beer displays. There's this place called Springfield Beer Distributor in Philadelphia that I used to frequent all the time. It's basically a huge warehouse with pallets of beer. They're arranged in isles and grouped by brewery, and each pallet has a different type of beer. The first time I went in there, I felt like I had entered a beer museum or something. It is a wonderful thing, and I haven't been able to find any store remotely close in size up in Boston.

Beer is Bread - 09/23/0412:23 PM

Thanks for the bump, Andrew. And especially for the update on your brewing art. I brew vicariously through you and others now, as I lack the time. So keep those updates coming.

Sounds like you are really out on a limb with the JudgeMental (great name, btw!). I'll look forward to hearing more about it. All-grain or extract? Congratulations to your Mom; that is extraordinary!

I've been saving the six-pack holders from beer for years. I figure someday I'll cut them appropriately and make a collage of some kind in the garage. The art can be wonderful. Much more whimsy in beer than in wine.

ObTastingNote: I had a Three Philosophers belgian from Brewery Ommegang in Cooperstown, NY the other day. They make a beer I really like (Hennepin - a Belgian farmhouse-style ale). The Three Philosophers was billed as quadruple-fermented blend of their Belgian ale with Lindeman's Kriek. Well, it was rich and effervescent, but it did not express the lambic or the fruit with any kind of eloquence. Disappointing.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/23/0406:38 PM

bigjohn, I like that ST Pauli's better than Becks. Expresses more of the German malt character that I love. I just picked up a little 5L mini keg of Kulmbacher Pils (no Reichelbrau! ) for this Saturday's games. I'm looking forward to it.

ringmir, that beer is out there, man! Making a good clean simple beer not challenging enough for you?

Tom, got any thoughts on the best methods for dry hopping/aroma hopping? I've tried Hallertau plugs in the secondaries, flash boiled pellets of many varieties in the secondaries (couldn't get up enough nerve to just dump them in there), and HEALTHY quantities of aromatic pellets at the end of the boil. Just never seemed to be able to get the nose I wanted.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/23/0407:01 PM

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/23/0408:34 PM

Mark, I don't know what to tell you. I'm not exactly in brewing trim right now; you know I really gave up after my kids started to be interesting. However, I'd offer the following.

I share your concern about sanitation and hop additions in the fermenter. My most successful dry hopping did not involve bottles; I have several corny kegs and only rarely bottled. There is obviously much less chance of anything funky happening if your beer stays refrigerated and is force-carbonated. Bag o' plugs in the keg.

As to variety, I know you don't like the cascade/chinook/columbus varieties because of the citrus flavor, but maybe if you use them just as a dry or finishing hop, you would get the aroma punch you want without the grapefruit you don't. I've never been big on noble hops in homebrew; I always liked to make big-bad ales, and felt I needed either the American C hops or Fuggle derivatives to get what I wanted. YMMV.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/24/0411:44 AM

bigwill- i drank 2 of the st paulis girl last night while watching survivor, and liked them very much. there was definitely a 'hearty' touch to it, but it was not at all over-bearing. i was talking to one of my friends, and he said to try it at 'room temp'.. ? ah, no.. i like beer cold.. not real sure why he would even suggest that?

i think next time at the store, i will write down a few of the ones i am interested in, and post on here for suggestions. i really think i will like about 90% of the beers i try, but i would prefer some back-up from ya'll. every once and a while, i get one that is down right bad, and then i get angry for paying $7-$8 bucks for the six pack of beer that i will have to force myself to drink. perfect example, samuel adams.. WAY too hearty and bitter for me.. didnt like that beer at all!!!

i trust in ya'lls beer experience, and hope you can lead me in the right direction. after years of lone-star and shiner blonde, i figure its time to branch out a little.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/24/0412:10 PM

John, on the room temp beer question: A lot of the potential flavors in a beer are significantly subdued when you drink it very cold. So far as I am aware in general, the colder your food, the less you can taste it. Obviously there are some beers that don't have much taste to begin with, but others will taste different at room temperature than they do cold. Most people wouldn't recommend drinking any beer at room temperature except very rich brews like stouts and barley wines.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/24/0412:31 PM

In reply to:

So far as I am aware in general, the colder your food, the less you can taste it.

This is most likely due to the nature of liquids and vapours. Considering that the taste buds can only distinguish 4 basic flavours (sweet, sour, bitter and salty) the majority of our ability to "taste" comes from the nose. Aromas from a cold beer would be more subdued as the vapours released under such temperatures would be less than if it were warmer.
Secondly a truly cold beer may also numb the taste buds ni the mouth thereby dulling the detection of the 4 basic flavours. A brutally bitter beer should be less bitter embibed bitterly cold.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/24/0401:41 PM

I believe I have read that the taste buds are desensitized to "sweet" at colder temps. The reason why ice cream doesn't seem overly sweet. When that is applied to beer making, the brewer must make his beer to be consumed at a specific temperature in order to balance the malt sweetness and the hop bitterness.
bigjohn, in Europe they frequently drink ales at cellar temps from what I've heard, but I doubt anybody drinks lagers at summer time Texas temps!

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/24/0403:19 PM

Has anyone heard of the German practice of serving certain styles of beer with a warm water bath? My German teacher in high school said that some pubs (is that what you call them in Germany) would give you a bowl of warm water to set your mug into to keep the beer warm.

At the time, I didn't know any better, but now it sounds pretty revolting. Room temp is one thing, but warm??

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/24/0406:34 PM

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/24/0406:44 PM

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/24/0406:56 PM

I've been wanting to try that Ruination Ale. Tom seems pretty high on the Dogfish Head as well. I'd be very curious to know what you think of them.
I called in sick today and cracked open my mini keg of Kulmbacher Pils. Pretty good. Very herbal, fine bitterness, fine carbonation (can't stand beers with big bubbles), nice malt body, but not quite as huge and toothy as my dream beer - Kulmbacher Reichelbrau.
Speaking of "want", anybody watch "Survivor"? I'm bummed they voted out Dolly - she was absolutely smokin'.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/25/0401:15 AM

Alright then.....back on topic:
(You can take that survivor stuff to some less important thread!)

I've got a 90 minute IPA poured for myself here, and my thoughts are as follows...

A nice golden amber, slighty off-white head, fine carbonation, a decent amount of lacing in the glass. The nose is definately cascade hops(I suspect dry hopped with it, the bottle says it's dry hopped but doesn't list which hops), but less so than something like Victory hop devil. The flavor is pretty tough to describe, there's a lot going on in this beer. First, for something that clocks in at 9% ABV, this beer doesn't pack the alcohol whallop one would expect. Don't get me wrong, the alcohol is certainly there, but it's buried underneath so much hops, toasted and crystal malt that you don't really notice it. For me, the first sip is an explosion of hops, piney and citrusy. That fades to a kind of thick sweetness, balanced out by a tremdous amount of bittering hops and a distict malt undertone. Halfway through a bottle, the alcohol content begins to make itself known by a very faint warming of the throat and chest as it goes down. The aftertaste is reminicent of grapefruit, and lingers seemingly forever. I have a feeling I'll be tasting this beer untill I brush my teeth and go to bed tonight.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/25/0412:38 PM

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/25/0412:47 PM

That was a good description, ringmir, thanks. I'll bet you can still taste that beer today, eh?
That IPA reminds me of many I've had. Tastes like spruce. Not my cup of tea.
Slightly off topic, I had another bottle of the $2 Charles Shaw Shiraz that won some gold medals at an int'l tasting event. Smells like a lumber yard - must have been aged in some very fresh barrels.
Tried CSI Miami, couldn't get into it.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/27/0404:07 PM

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/27/0405:19 PM

In reply to:

What do you guys play?

it depends on what mood we are in..

the majority of the time(75%), we play standard no limit hold'em.. it cracks me up that this particular game has gotten sooooo big here in the last 2 years, and i have been playin it since i was a kid(literally). when i was in elementary, we used to play it with M&M's.. my dad was a big card player, so i grew playin poker, gin, spades, hearts, rummy, and then learned uecker once i got into the army. i cant remember a family gathering when we didnt have some sort of card game going.. anyway, got off track..

we usually play no limit hold'em, but often just do dealer choice. 5 draw, 7 stud, mexican sweat, omaha, etc.. and my buddies like to roll dice, but i aint into that..

we just have fun, and keep the money at minimums.. but, saturday, we had 7 guys show up to play, and it was payday, so they wanted $20 dollar buy in, winner take all.. i got some good cards, and 4 hours later, i was victorious.. i ended up buying more beer and pizza for everyone, and then watched the rest of them roll dice the rest of the night. they were mad cause i wouldnt roll with them and let them get their money back.. boo-hoo..!! they know i dont roll the bones!

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/27/0405:28 PM

It's euchre where my family comes from (Indiana). I'm curious if you learned different rules... Peter has this rule where you can steal the deck (!) and he'd never heard most of the myths and hints (sit with the bathtub, etc.).

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/27/0407:05 PM

I've always liked 7 card stud, but the hold 'em tournaments on TV have got me hooked.
Different game when you're playing $2-4 hold 'em than the no limit game, I discovered. Gotta play a lot more hands and call more bets. And slow-play. And crank those free beers as fast as you can.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/27/0408:39 PM

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/27/0409:05 PM

ok so, poker is a much more reasonable thread-jacking for this thread than "Survivor". Personally I'll play some poor-man's hold 'em every once in a while ($0.25 $0.50 blinds, low limit). This way if I'm the big loser for the night I can still chalk it up to "cost of entertainment" and not feel like I'm walking away pants-less. But I'm really not much for gambling in general.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/28/0412:27 PM

Could you guys at least give a passing mention to the kind of beer you usually drink when gambling? Sheesh. And last time I checked, watching reality TV was not the sort of activity with which one typically associates consumption of delicious beverages. So yeah, smoking, drinking and gambling go together.

I recently had a Porter from St. Peter's Brewery in the UK. It was really fabulous - much more robust and hoppy than most traditional English beers. It was in great condition, too.

Re: Beer is Bread - 09/28/0401:04 PM

On those rare occasions that I play hold'em, I generally drink Knob Creek Bourbon. Sometimes I smoke a cigar. I tend to prefer a maduro, generally from among Padron, Ashton, Avo, Hoyo de Monterrey, Macanudo, or CAO.

Going to be bottling a brown ale tonight and transfering the JudgeMental (vanilla milk porter) to secondary and adding the vanilla to let it sit another few weeks. I'll siphon off a sample and let you guys know how it tastes.

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/03/0412:28 AM

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/04/0409:34 AM

bigwill- actually, i am going to the grocery store this afternoon, and will have a short list of beers that i am thinking about trying. i will put the list on here, and see what ya'll think. maybe do a poll if i can figure out how to do one?

i think i will get some italian beer that i saw last time i went shopping. they make great food and great wine, chances are the beer should be pretty good too!!?

BTW- i will check and see if they have any of the ones you have listed.

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/04/0403:23 PM

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/04/0403:45 PM

Yes, Andrew, but are you "all excited" about it?

Red Stripe is good lawnmower beer. Personally, I think the problem with it is the water. But I am speculating irresponsibly.

Bigjohn, I like bigwill's recommendation about Boddington's. You might also rediscover Heineken; buy it in cans, not bottles. Really. Finally, you might like some of the (now disappearing) summer beers made by various breweries. If you see any Kolsch or Cream Ales, those would be good next candidates, too.

Winter beers are released! I had a Deschutes Jubel Ale the other night. Rich, alcoholic and aggressively hopped, as always. Anybody seen Sierra Celebration yet?

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/04/0404:04 PM

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/04/0404:55 PM

i actually had a red stripe the other night at the bar.. i was 'paying off' a buddy of mine who won a football bet, and he is a bartender.. i told him the least he could do was buy me a beer after i delivered his winnings.. he asked what i wanted, and i said "dealer choice".. so, he gave me a red stripe. he also gave me a mexican beer that i had never had before.. it had the same similar taste of a corona.. kinda bland.. but i liked the red stripe.. it was light, and smooth.. if that is considered a lager, then i would say that is the kind of beer i prefer.. i cant stand the heavy, samuel adams type beers.

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/04/0404:57 PM

Mark, I was certainly too glib. I'm not sure there is anything "wrong" with Jamaican water per se, and I certainly don't have time to do an in-depth study of the typical mineral content of the water used in Red Stripe beer.

However, you know that there are any number of minerals that could be present in brewing liquor that could impact a number of the processes, from starch conversion to hop utilization. As to which ones appear (in a perhaps disproportionate amount) and how they might impact the ultimate flavor of Red Stripe in particular, I must confess that I am speculating wildly.

I suppose the bottom line is that I've never gotten as excited about that particular beer as some other people have, and I have also not been able to put my finger on "why" that is. Since I can't isolate why I don't find the hops, malt or yeast compelling, I'm blaming the water.

Jamaica has a huge bauxite industry, and I understand that, on any given island, the water supply can be inordinately saline compared to more traditional supplies of larger scale. So yeah, it could be the minerals. Get some scientist in here.

I am often reminded that some brewers are cooks, some are engineers, some are chemists, but we're all janitors. I'm a cook; I like the ingredients best. Some people like to build systems that move liquid around; they are engineers. Some people really know what's happening in the pot and fermenter.

I mean, it's a competent beer and I understand people liking it. I just don't think it's very interesting or distinctive. With cost and calories as criteria, I drink elsewhere. You know, Budweiser is "light, sweet and clean".

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/04/0407:35 PM

Certainly Red Stripe is an unremarkable beer from a connoiseur's standpoint, but it tastes like a quality 2 row lager with very, very subtle hop and yeast presence and a nice malt sweetness. Not as spicy or thin as Bud, eh?
It's not my all-time fave but I thought bigjohn might like it - and he does! bigjohn, German hefe-weizens (and some American hefe-weizens, but NOT PYRAMID) you will likely also like. Maybe Tom knows of a nice dunkel, too? I can never remember the brand names by the time I'm done with them.

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/04/0409:09 PM

>>How about those Asian beers like Kirin, Tsingtao, etc.?

When I was in Korea there was a pretty active brewery industry, lots of Germans came over ~20 years earlier and kicked off the industry.

I didn't like most of the beers, but one of them (OB, I think -- "Oriental Breweries") was VERY good. Only problem was that the government subsidized rice and soju (imagine sake distilled down to ~40% alcohol) but not beer ;((

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/04/0409:57 PM

Good suggestions, Tom. Don't be intimidated by a little bit of dark color, bigjohn. Beers like Downtown Brown, Newcastle and Dos Equis Amber are really quite mild and not necessarily high in alcohol.
I'm guessing you won't like the snappy German and Czech pilseners, but it never hurts to try. I just bought 9 of the little Kulmbacher 5L mini-kegs at $10.99 each. Actually 6 Kulmbacher Pils and 3 Kapuziner Weisse (I forget the distinction between weisse and hefe-weizen, but wtf it's beer). They've made great improvements to the little mini-kegs if you remember the old ones - built in valves on top and bottom.
I tried one of the EKU mini-kegs this past weekend. Good, but not as nice as the Kulmbacher Pils. Spicier hops, little more raunchy malt flavor in the EKU.

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/05/0409:59 AM

well, i got good news and bad news.. the good news.. my wife called me at work yesterday and said that she had some free time and that she would go ahead and go to the grocery store.. YEAH!!! i was very happy that i wouldnt have to be going. now, the bad news.. i didnt get one of the beers from the lists ya'll gave me.. i did however, tell her to get me a six-pack of "whatever".. she laughed and said, "are you sure?".. i assured her that beer was beer, and the chances of her picking a bad one were very small.. after she got home, and we were unpacking our bags, i saw that she got me the mexican beer Bohemia. she knows i like mexican beer(sampatico, dos equis, tecate, negro, and more), so she thought i would like it. she also stated she liked the bottle cause it had a very bold, distinctive design. so does a plasma TV, but ya dont see her going out and pickin up one of those..

anyway, the beer was warm, so i didnt get to drink one last night.. i will have a few this evening, and give you my impressions. i am well versed with mexican beers, so hopefully this one will stand up to the others i have tried.

i HAVE written down the beers that ya'll have suggested, and i WILL give them a try..

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/05/0412:16 PM

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/05/0404:30 PM

I adore Bohemia! That is, bar none, my favorite Mexican beer.

But you may not like it; like Mark said, it is not terribly sweet. I think it is the best Czech Pilsner brewed west of Prague. But that's probably because I don't get to Prague very often. I don't know if they use actual Saaz hops or not, but it is certainly that same floral hop aroma.

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/06/0404:04 AM

BigWill, might I ask what EKU brew did you have? I had an EKU 28 this past weekend and I can't say that I've ever had anything like it. To me, it's more of an after dinner drink, but I can see it with fish maybe. Rather sweet, very smooth, no bite in the alcohol. Anyhow, at 11%, two of those would have my head spinning. Anyone who could handle a mini-keg of EKU 28 deserves some kind of award, that's if they could remember it.

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/06/0409:38 AM

OK, i had a couple of the Bohemias last night during the debate, and i really liked them. a lot of people use lemon slices in mexican beer, i didnt..

i dont know all the 'proper' terms for analyzing beer, but i will do my best. upon opening, the Bohemia did have a somewhat 'skunky' smell that is common with lots of mexican beers. although, it was not as strong of a smell as i have experienced with others. the taste was mildly firm, but not bold. there was more flavor on its way down, other than when first entering the palate. it had a very, very mild bitterness to it, not at all sweet. and the afterbite was pretty firm, just enough to remind you that you had just drank a pretty solid beer.

overall, i liked the Bohemias, but have tasted better mexican beers. it was good, but not my favorite. i would definitely recommend it to anyone, and think it would go great with a big plate of enchilidas w/beans and rice!!

EXTRA-- i almost forgot.. there was a good thing and a bad thing. the bad is, there is a foil covering that goes from about half way up the neck, and covers over the top of the cap. its no biggie, but when you pop off the cap, it leaves little foil strands that you have to peel back. this is nothing more than a mild nuesence, but i did get a piece of foil in the bottle, and that made for an almost 'spittake'.. the good thing is, the shape and neck design of the bottle make for a smooth and quick pour of the beer. no guggling or back-splashing. i found myself finishing each beer with 4-5 swigs.

thats all.. i know kinda lame, but i tried.. i will buy a different 'new' beer next week, and post my thoughts!!

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/06/0412:54 PM

Spock, I had the EKU Pils.

bigjohn, you may want to check with Tom for proper beer tasting procedures. No limes in Bohemia, BTW. Use limes in Corona, Tecate, Carta Blanca, XX Green. I'm not a fan of Mexican beer, but to each his own, eh?

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/06/0401:16 PM

I'm not the beer-tasting Police. I just want bigjohn (and everyone else) to enjoy their beers.

And I also don't want to disappoint bigwill.

Pouring the beer into a glass yields greater opportunity to discern more flavor. Most of the nuanced flavors you perceive actually come from your sense of smell, so releasing those compounds (instead of keeping them literally bottled-up) makes it easier to fully experience the beverage. Likewise, especially with styles that are inherently more carbonated, pouring the beer into a glass releases some of the carbonation, thus dissipating the CO2 "bite" on your tongue, which not only tames the perception of bitterness, but also allows you to more easily perceive other flavors on the palate.

Got a case of that Deschutes Jubelale at Costco. Life is good.

Also had a Hoegaarden Wit beer a couple days ago. It was subtle and wonderfully complex. The coriander and curacao were not individually identifiable, but mingled with the yeast to provide the rich and distinctive flavor I'd missed for too long. It was fizzier than I remembered. Unique color, too.

Re: Beer is Bread - 10/08/0401:07 AM

I had dinner and a couple drinks at a great pub near the Oakland Marina today. I went with a known good beer to star off: Old Rasputin Imperial Stout, by North Caost Brewing. They served it properly at room temperature. Very tasty.

Next I went out on a limb and ordered what was described on the menu as "Think of it as a liquid cigar": Aecht Schlenkerla Rauchbier (Original Schlenkerla Smokebeer). It's a maerzen style beer made entirely of smoked malt. When the aroma first hit my nose, it reminded me of beef jerky. It tasted nothing like cigars, but it did have an intriguing smokey flavor. Unfortunately, the novelty wore off rather quickly and I found myself thinking it would have tasted better unsmoked.

Re: beer thread - 10/11/0411:54 PM

I didn't know Colorado was on the west coast!? Since I live in Nebraska, does that mean we are now a mountain state? But I agree about Fat Tire and other New Belgium products, I like their Abbey Ale and Trippel even better. The brewery tour is fun as well.

Re: beer thread - 10/12/0409:40 AM

I just checked the Fed Ex status of my M60s and it's, " On FedEx vehicle for delivery"!!! Now I have two big decisions to make. What will be the first music I play on my new Axioms? And what beer will I be drinking?
I'm leaning towards Charles Mingus (debating which disc) and New Belgium Abbey Ale.
Any suggestions?

Re: beer thread - 10/12/0411:32 AM

Re: beer thread - 10/12/0412:13 PM

Hey, stick to the subject!

Last Sunday whilst participating in the weekly Pub Trivia game at Berkeley's oldest pub, I had a very delicious Schneider&Sohn Aventinus, a wheat doppelbock. It may just be the best wheat beer I've ever had. Highly recommended!

Re: beer thread - 10/12/0402:08 PM

Chimay is a great idea. I only buy Chimay on special occasions (it is a bit expensive), but if getting a new set of speakers isn't a special occasion, I don't know what is.
It'll kill me, but I have to wait till tomorrow to hook up my M60s, as the wife and I have tickets to see Richard Thompson tonight. An embarrassment of riches.

Re: beer thread - 10/12/0403:59 PM

It is very competitive. A typical game includes a couple general knowledge rounds, a matching round, a picture round (ID the person(s) in the pictures), a music round (ID the band after listening to a 30 - 45 second clip), and a random category (e.g. Early European History).

I've never been on a winning team. Depending on the week and how much we've had to drink, we've finished anywhere from 3rd to somewheere in the bottom 5. There are usually 15 - 25 teams competing. This last Sunday, we were in second place after a couple rounds, then dropped to 3rd, then 5th, then 7th, then 11th. A sorry record, but at least it was a nice prime number progression.

Re: beer thread - 10/13/0408:15 AM

There was a place on Penn campus that had a trivia night on Thursday nights. I would go for $2 imperial pints of murphy's stout, and play. I played quite a bit, and our team hit 1st twice, 2nd once, and 3rd four or five times. Prizes were $65 off your bar tab for 1st, $35 off for 2nd, and a case of beer for 3rd. We always got a case of murphy's when we got 3rd. Loved that place, best cheese fries I've ever seen anywhere, by a very very long shot (and half price after 11 at that!)

Re: beer thread - 10/13/0401:35 PM

Re: beer thread - 10/13/0401:47 PM

i thought i might comment on the beer i tried last night.. being that i have been 'experimental' as of late, i tried a newcastle brown ale. i think it was imported from scotland.. it had a very dark, almost murky color to it. the taste was not as strong as the color would imply. it was stout, but not strong by any shot. it had a very mild bitter taste at the end, but not at all over bearing. all in all, i would say it was a good beer, not great. and at $3.75 a bottle at the bar, i will go elsewhere..

Re: beer thread - 10/13/0404:03 PM

Well I'd like to think that since the game was freqeuntly played by Penn students and professors, people there were at least halfway intelligent. That said, I doubt I would be very competitive at a national level. We just had a good team of diverse-knowledge people.

Re: beer thread - 10/13/0406:37 PM

Re: beer thread - 10/13/0407:00 PM

Re: beer thread - 10/14/0411:31 AM

Hey John...it's great to see you "experimenting". New Castle is the first brown that I ever had and it's a great place to start. From your description, it sounds like you had it in the bottle and not on tap. The reason I say this is that for some strange reason, New Castle has a different character on tap. The tap seems to calm the "mild bitter taste at the end" which makes for a better pint for my tastes. So if you get a chance, be sure to try it again on tap and see what you think. The restaurants you might try are Outback and Carabas(sp?).

Speaking about browns, I picked up a Corsendonk Abbey Brown Ale so I'll have to report back on that one. We have a new place here that carries a lot of new beers (more BELGIANS!!) so I'm trying a few new ones each week or so. I'm hoping they get some Kasteel Kriek soon. YUMMY!!

Re: beer thread - 10/14/0411:59 AM

[homer simpson] Mmmmm. Corsenkonk. [/homer]

I decided (again) that Czechvar (aka Budweiser Budvar) is the best beer in the world. When I first had it (near Prague, many years ago), I was convinced of the same thing. The time and place contributed mightily to the assessment, I'm sure.

But I just got a bottle of it for the first time in a long time, and holy mackerel! That beer is a miracle of balanced crispness. What a wonderful, interesting, drinkable brew. You can taste every ingredient in perfect harmony. Bliss, I tell you. Even just in my kitchen, 10,000 miles from the Czech republic.

Re: beer thread - 10/14/0412:18 PM

yes, the newcastle i had was in the bottle.. my wife and i are going to outback on saturday for lunch, so i will see if they have it on tap and try that. thanks for the heads up.

i thought the beer was good, but it sure wasnt the best beer i have ever had. that night i was at little 'yuppie' bar here in town, and it was $3.75 a bottle.. just a little high for me.. i am used to $1.75 lone stars...

you and tom got me wanting to try that corsenkonk.. i will see if it is avail at the grocery or liquor store.. and maybe the czekvar(budvar) also..

Re: beer thread - 10/14/0412:37 PM

Uh oh...WARNING...Belgians can get quite expensive, but I find that their worth every penny. The Corsendonk was about $4 per 11.2 oz. bottle. I'm sure Chess can give some great suggestions as well, but here's a few that you could look for.

Hoegaarden - it's one beer that I could drink ANY time. I don't think that there's anything out there that can beat it's drinkability. Wheat beer with orange peel, SIMPLY BRILLIANT!!!
Lucifer Golden Ale
Duvel Golden
Chimay (Red White or Blue label, they're all great)

Best of luck. Oh and Peter, thanks for the heads up on the Corsendonk. It sounds like I'll really enjoy it.

Re: beer thread - 10/14/0403:05 PM

Re: beer thread - 10/14/0403:07 PM

Who, me? You mean Tom, right? [oops, I see you caught the error yourself]

Anyway, I bought a sixer of Czechvar about a month ago and enjoyed it. I wouldn't go so far as to call it the best beer in the world -- I prefer darker brews, myself -- but it was very balanced and drinkable.

Re: beer thread - 10/14/0406:24 PM

Bigjohn, I don't know if you'll love the Corsendonk. Like most big Belgian beers, it's a breed apart. If you're used to domestic pale lagers, it is going to be quite a departure for you.

Try the Hoegaarden or the Czechvar instead. Or any of the German pilsners from the big Bavarian breweries (Hacker-Pschorr, Hofbrauhaus, Paulaner, Spaten, etc.).

If you do have an interest in the Belgian beers, you might try something from New Belgium Brewery in Fort Collins, Colorado first. Much cheaper. Not quite as good as the original, but certainly true to style. Try the Abbey or the Fat Tire (Amber). If you find that the yeast/alcohol profile of those beers is something you enjoy, then savor a bottle of Chimay, Duvel, Corsendonk, La Chouffe, etc.

Everything is better on draught, especially British beers.

Peter, I like darker beers too, but there is just no place to hide any flaws in a beer as sublimely nuanced as Czechvar. It is much more difficult to make a perfect pilsner than a robust porter. My favorite beer is the one I'm drinking at any given moment. But man, that Czechvar was really good.

Re: beer thread - 10/14/0411:22 PM

Yes! I'm glad to find another New Belgium fan. I just had a couple of Abbey Ale's tonight when I was setting up my brand new M60s. I've been reading the posts for a while now, and now I know what everyone was talking about - love at first listen. (I also recommend New Belgium "Trippel" - tasty and packs a wallop at 8.5% alcohol content - big bang for your buck - sort of like Axiom.) I can also heartily recommend the New Belgium brewery tour if you are ever in Fort Collins, and wife and me went on it last summer, you leave with a nice buzz, and it doesn't cost a pennny. Can't wait to get home from work tomorrow and listen to more music!

Re: beer thread - 10/15/0401:15 PM

Re: beer thread - 10/15/0401:36 PM

I've seen a lot of homebrew recipes for pumpkin ale. They call for a can or two of pumpkin pie filling in the boil (or in the primary?). Never made one of those, but I do have about 6 quarts of awful 4 year old homebrew at home that you are welcome to.
I think I finally found its name - "Revolting Ale".

Re: beer thread - 10/15/0402:01 PM

Re: beer thread - 10/15/0403:42 PM

Re: beer thread - 10/15/0403:44 PM

Yeah some friends of mine made mead like that. It was really horrid. On the other hand, they also made some stuff that tasted horrid when it started out, but after sitting for a couple years, was really good.

Re: beer thread - 10/15/0407:17 PM

This thread has got me all pumped up to start brewing again. Soon as the weather breaks (93 F yesterday ) I'm there, dude.
That Czechvar is very good - quite a bit better than Pilsener Urquell - more balanced, better malt body, less snap with the hops, more intriguing hop flavors and aromas, but I still think Kulmbacher Reichelbrau is the perfect beer.
One of the Belgians that Tom recommended to me was the Carmeliet Tripel. It was stupendously fantastic - an unusual and memorable beer. I'll second the recommendation to y'all.

Re: beer thread - 10/18/0410:02 AM

OK, for my next beer tasting experiment...

i went to the grocery store and bought a six pack of a german beer called Bitburger(premium in gold label). i honestly thought it was one of the better beers i have ever tasted. not sure of color cause i drank straight from the bottle, but the taste was very straight forward. it had a great aroma, with a solid but not overbearing taste. there was next to no bitterness, which i have come to expect with german beers. the flavor was very full, with no unpleasant aftertaste.

i would HIGHLY recommend this beer. this was my first time to try it, and i would give it a solid 9, on a 10 point scoring system. BTW- while drinking the beer, i was eating brats with chili, and watching the cowboys fumble the ball to the steelers, and eventually loose the game. so, keep that into account if you think it might have affected my impressions of the Bitburger.

Re: beer thread - 10/19/0412:23 AM

Hey bigjohn, good call!! You have inspired me to get reacquainted with Bitburger. My previous experience with it was in Germany years ago - it is a very big brand there, with a huge marketing campaign. Catchy slogan - "Bitte ein Bit" (please, one Bitburger). I recall thinking that it was fairly dry and quite bitter - not uncharacteristic for a German pilsner. I am a little surprised that you liked it so much, as I'd have thought it was appreciably more highly hopped than your baseline beers.

I'm currently enjoying another offering, new to me, from Unibroue in Chambly, Quebec. Don de Dieu is a great, big wheat beer. 9% alcohol, soft, yeasty, sweet and smooth. Amazing balance, and wonderfully rich. Has the pronounced clove/banana esters you'd expect. Highly recommended.

Re: beer thread - 10/19/0409:16 AM

tom- i would agree that the Bitburger was a little dry, but not overly bitter at all.. like i said, i really enjoyed it a lot.. i will most definitely buy it again.

peter- goode is a great BBQ place.. i reckon you will dig it the most.. just make sure to save some room for dessert, and get a piece of their pecan pie. it is to die for. it is sweet and creamy, and just about melts in your mouth.. then you bite into one of those big pecan halves, and you KNOW you eating something goode..

try it, you'll like it...and may i suggest to have a tall glass of milk at the ready.

Re: beer thread - 10/21/0402:45 PM

Re: beer thread - 10/21/0402:52 PM

we are leaving for houston in the morning(friday). we have a rehersal dinner on friday night, then a big reception after the wedding on saturday.. so i dont know how much avail time we will have to go find places to eat.. my wife has made it clear that we WILL go to goode, so who knows from there.. i would love to find a place that has some fresh gulf shrimp. i know they bring em up the houston shipping channel every day.

Re: beer thread - 10/22/0411:26 AM

Re: beer thread - 10/25/0407:51 PM

unfortunately, we were so caught up in wedding activities, that we wernt able to really go anywhere..

we had some gourmet pizzas at the reception hall in the church after the rehersal. then, we went straight to bed friday night.. we had some kalachies from a little german bakery on saturday morning on our way to the church. after the wedding, went to a place in downtown houston called 'Sambuca'.. kind of a hip, trendy little jazz joint. food was good, but not great. after that, we just wanted to get the heck out of houston, so we headed back home.. oh well.

no goode, and no gulf shrimp.

BTW- i just got back from the grocery store, and bought my next 'experiement' beer.. it is called 'Bavaria', from holland.. i will have a few tomorrow and give you my impressions.

Re: beer thread - 10/27/0409:52 AM

OK, now the review on the 'Bavaria'.

in my recent experiements, i have expected most of the foreign beers to be too powereful, and have a overly strong flavor that i wouldnt like. i have been pleasantly surprised. the st paulis girl, newcastle, and bitburger have all been very pleasing, and not at all what i had been expecting. the 'Bavaria' that i tried was even MORE weaker than the others. it had a good flavor, almost sweet, but had no bite what so ever.. in fact, i would almost compare it to an american light beer. it was lacking pretty much everything. its not that it was bad, just not memorable. when i have a beer, i wanna know that i am 'having a beer'... the Bavaria was unremarkable in all aspects. it had no particular aroma, and the eventual bite that i was waiting for, never came.

all in all, a very plain, bland beer.. perfect for the guy who likes zimas, but wants to drink a beer so his friends wont laugh at him. on a 1-10, i give it a 5.. i WONT be buying this one again.

of all the ones i have had, the bitburger is still the best. i look forward to another sixer of that, once my 'experiemental' stage is over..

Re: beer thread - 10/27/0411:06 AM

Hey John, keep it up. It's fun to read about your recent experiments. It reminds me of when I was at the beginning of my "quest for the perfect beer". I see that you're mostly trying Lagers and Pilsners. I started with ambers, porters, and stouts because I assumed that lagers and pilsners wouldn't have any or enough flavor for my tastes. However, I quickly learned otherwise. Some others you could try are Red Hook (Blonde or Sun Rye), Peroni (Italian). I only wish there were more German beers around here to try. Lately I've found that I really enjoy a good Belgian Golden (Duvel, Lucifer), or Pale Ale (Corsendonk Pale Ale). Anyway, enjoy the ride and all the beers.

Re: beer thread - 10/27/0412:07 PM

well, thanks.. i am such an amateur, that i really couldnt tell you the difference between lagers, pilsners, porters, and stouts. i mean, if was to drink one or the other, i wouldnt know which one i had.. ? make sense..? my choices thus far have been simply based on the country of origin. i did see the peroni at the store, so i will try that next week.. there was also a japanese beer that looked interesting.

i need to go to a beer web-site, and learn more of the proper terms and lingo to use when judging beer. i am just kinda wingin' it. i dont claim to be a professional, nor am i paid for my endorsements. its pretty much, do i like it, or do i not!! thats about as simple as i can make it

i will try the peroni, and i need to go out to the liquor stores and try and find some of the others mentioned in previous posts.. i checked, and the grocery store dont carry none of them. all the liquor stores are on the out-skirts of town.. its illegal to sell liquor in town, other than at a bar.. so much for living in a religiously based town. oh well, i dont mind the drive.

Re: beer thread - 10/27/0412:49 PM

I had never heard of that "Bavaria" and didn't want to taint your impression of it, but that is a Dutch beer named for a region in Germany? Obviously made for the export market. I'd have to agree with you, bigjohn - all the Dutch beers I've tried have all been pretty mild and unexciting.

Most Japanese beers that we can buy in the states are now made in Canada. At risk of offending our Canadian friends, the beer is not as good. Those Japanese beers were pretty unremarkable in the first place, IMO, but now they also have the tannic bite of 6-row barley. I'd save my money for something from Europe or a North American craft brewer.

Re: beer thread - 10/27/0401:15 PM

In reply to:

Dutch beer named for a region in Germany?

bigwill, i have not, and will never question your beer knowledge, but this is the beer i tried. it even says on that web-page that it is "a light, refreshing and less harsh beer than traditional Dutch beers".. and it even goes on to say, "it is styled to appeal to a broader american market with a lighter feel and less hop bitterness and aftertaste".

sounds to me like they took ALL the taste out of it? i would agree with all of that. it has NO bite, it is VERY light, and was less harsh than anything else i had tasted. very bland.. i hate when they cater to use americans!! just give us the normal stuff!!!

Re: beer thread - 10/27/0405:27 PM

In reply to:

Ever have Rolling Rock, Michelob, or AB Amber Bock

yes i have, all three actually.

the rolling rock is nothing special.. smooth and simple, like icehouse or a lighter heineken. not bad, but not memorable at all. i like all the michelob products. bold, good taste(not like budweiser). and the amber bock is nothing like regular bud. it is the classic heavy, bold dark beer. very rich, strong aroma, slightly bitter at the end. living in texas, i grew up drinking shinerbocks and lone stars, so the amber bock is a little too thick and bitter.

i have never tried the world select, but am more than willing to try.. maybe that needs to go on my list.. but the peroni is next..

Re: beer thread - 10/28/0409:08 AM

My understanding is that what we get here in the US as Kirin, Asahi, or Sapporo are all now brewed in Canada.

John, I wanted to mention that you should take some care in selecting beer from ratebeer based on it's rating alone. A lot of the people who contribute to that site (and others like beeradvocate.com) tend to give high marks to very hoppy beer or bold dark beers that don't quite fit the idea I've gotten of what you're looking for.

You might want to start looking through the bjcp style descriptions (great resource tom, had that bookmarked for a while now ) at some commercially available offerings in different styles that sound appealing to you. That way you can get a better feel for the styles you like. Then on the review websites you can check for reviews of particular styles and choose what you sample based on those.

Re: beer thread - 10/28/0409:33 AM

spock, tom, and ringmir- thanks for the advice and web-sites.

as mentioned, i definitely need to take a trip out to the liquor stores, and see just what is avail to me, as far as selection. the grocery store stock is starting to get depleted. i havent been out there in a while, but i know they have a much better selection.

all this has got me thinking.. back in 95, i went to clearwater, florida for spring break. we went to a grocery store, and they had a mix & match special. for $6 bucks, you could get any beer from any six-pack, and make your own 'custom' six-pack. i dont know if it was just a spring break special, or if that was something they did all the time.. either way, i thought it was a great idea. it would sure help me out if i could do something like that now. that way, i could try 6 different beers at a time.

Re: beer thread - 10/28/0410:46 AM

Now that you mention it, I do notice that people on ratebeer.com like a lot of hops. I'm curious if it's because many of them live in the Western US. It seems that many of the West breweries love to pile in the hops. Rogue Dead Guy Ale and especially their Santa Ale are two that come to mind. I was talking to the owner of our local wine and beer store and apparently bright tasting wines (like found in hoppy beers) are popular out West. To each their own I guess. On the other hand, I always love a fresh pint of Fuller's IPA.

Re: beer thread - 10/28/0410:59 AM

I remember when I was a kid, my dad collected some beer cans. One that stuck in my mind was a brand called, "Old Frothen Slosh" from the Pittsburgh Brewery. It had pictures of heavy set women in a bikini with beauty pageant ribons drapped across them.

Re: beer thread - 10/28/0412:07 PM

I always thought it was more of a beer culture thing personally. Clearly the majority of people that review beers on these sites regularly are people who are passionate about beer. I think that a larger portion of those people have grown accustomed to more flavorful and complex beer, and prefer it themselves, and the bias shows in the rankings. There are accurate reviews of tons of beers on the sites, but I've just found that the actual rankings are always skewed. A killer lager just doesn't get ranked as highly as a killer IPA.

Re: beer thread - 10/29/0410:54 AM

Re: beer thread - 10/30/0411:04 PM

Fosters and Harp are now made in Canada, too. I noticed at the store yesterday that Kirin Ichiban is made in Los Angeles.
This is all the result of NAFTA, I think. Good and bad to it. The foreign beers are no longer true, but I can buy Moosehead on sale at $8 a twelver. And the price of MGD, Pabst and King Cobra has fallen for you Canadians, eh? LOL

Re: beer thread - 11/02/0409:06 AM

This thread was in need of a bump. Anyone have access to Magic Hat beer? (Something of an interesting site to navigate, mouse over the red button to get an idea where things are...) It's all over the place up here in Boston, and spreading from what my friends tell me in Philly. They are able to get more and more varieties of it lately. Not sure on how large the distribution has grown, but I think they're worth checking out if you want something new.

Re: beer thread - 11/07/0403:02 PM

Another bump.

I am in the process of trying to finish my first bottle of Anchor Brewing's 2004 winter seasonal ale: "Our Special Ale" (Yes, I realize it's not even noon yet on Sunday. )

Yechhh! It pours like a porter/stout and even has the roasty aromas of one, but flavorwise, it has no center. By this I mean it has plenty of foretaste (aroma) and aftertaste (which is metallic and bitter), but not much in between.

I had my brother try it to make sure I wasn't crazy. He agreed that it wasn't worth buying, especially since a sixer cost me $8.39.

If you doubt that this brewery can turn out something substandard, don't take my word for it and try it yourself. But if you want to save your cash for more worthy beers, please pass this one up.

Re: beer thread - 11/07/0404:34 PM

Re: beer thread - 11/07/0410:28 PM

I see Mark has been converted to a Jubelale evangelist. Good!

Peter, I've never really loved the Anchor winter seasonal compared to some of the other west coasters (like Full Sail, Sierra Nevada, etc.). I've not yet tried this year's, and I appreciate the warning. I'll look for a single instead of a sixer

Re: beer thread - 11/07/0411:56 PM

I'm going to try to convince my wife to stop by the Deschuttes brewery in Bend, OR on our drive up to Yakima for Thanksgiving. We'd just have to break left from the 5 onto the 97 in Northern California and it would take us straight through Bend, and the rest of the way to Yakima.

Re: beer thread - 11/09/0401:53 AM

Re: beer thread - 11/09/0401:35 PM

i saw that stuff on TV.. it is more of a novelty thing that this company does around thansgiving every year. the price is supposed to be $15 to $17 bucks for a 5-pack. seems kinda high for a beverage that you hope you will never have to actually drink..

at the grocery store last night, i bought some Peroni beer(italian). it was warm off the shelf, so i am giving it time to cool off.. i will drink a few tonight and relay my impressions. at my grocery store, it was $4.69 a sixer in bottles. not a bad price.

BTW- i was in the mood for fish last night, so i bought a nice grouper filet. it was a little more expensive than i would normally pay, but i like grouper, and our market rarely gets it, so i figured it was worth it. i had never blackened grouper before, so i gave it a shot, and it was by-god the best fish i think i have ever made. it came off the skillet with a nice crispy edge, and a bold, spicy kick.. yet was flakey and moist in the middle. delicious!!! they had some fresh talipia, i think i might swing by after work, and get me some of that.. might go well with the peroni?

Re: beer thread - 11/09/0407:02 PM

Wow...that grouper sounds great. I really need to start cooking fish. Well, John, glad you were able to find some Peroni and I look forward to hearing your impression. I was out of town this weekend (Baton Rouge and Alexandria) so I was able to find a few new brews. Here's the list:

Boddingtons (England)
Rogue American Amber
Abita Christmas Ale

Of course I also picked up a Chimay Red since I can get the big bottles for $6 a pop. Here it's $11 a bottle. I still can not figure out how they sell it SO cheaply down there. I'll probably try a couple of the new brews this weekend so I'll let you guys know.

I did find another favorite last week, Paulaner Hefeweissbier. I've never tried a Hefeweizen so I gave it a shot and WOW was it good. Nice wheat taste with a tasty mix of citrus (orange and lemon I think). I can see this as a perfect hot summer day beer. Very refreshing. I'm getting ready for stout/porter season though. Bring on the cold weather!!

Re: beer thread - 11/10/0411:27 AM

Re: beer thread - 11/10/0405:49 PM

Boddingtons is good stuff, and I have yet to try anything from Rogue that I don't like. Haven't tried the Abita though, make sure to give some thoughts on that one. As for the Chimay price...I don't remember exactly but I know I used to get the blue for $10 in philly. There's a place I could buy cases of it there and I forget how much they were, I believe right around $100.

Re: beer thread - 11/11/0409:24 AM

well, i am a little late, but i have my Peroni review.

i took the sixer over to a buddies house on tuesday evening and we drank it while he was showing me some new programs on his computer. the beer had a very slight skunky smell, but it was extremely faint. the flavor was slightly sweet, but not too much so. it was a medium body, not very much bite at all. and i thought it went down pretty smooth, but my buddy commented that he thought it was 'less carbonated' than regular beer. hence, maybe why it was going down smooth? no extra carbonation to irritate the throat. who knows. but we both noticed that the beer had little to no 'head' in the glass. even when you poured it kinda sloppy, it formed almost no head at all.. kinda weird?? anyway, it had a bit of a malty after taste, but nothing memorable.

overall, i thought this was a nice beer for a change, but nothing worth writing home about. it was basically average, just a nice, non threatening, easy to drink beer. could go well with any meal, but dont expect it to turn any heads. my buddy compared it to rolling rock. ? definitely a good choice for a change of speed every once and a while.. and at under $5 bucks a sixer, a relative bargain for a foreign beer. overall scale of 1-10, i give it a 6.5..

i think my next shot will be at a japanese beer that i saw. they also had some canadian beers that i havent heard of. i am still having a good time being experiemental. havent found a 6-pack yet, that i didnt finish..

Re: beer thread - 11/11/0412:31 PM

I finally got a six pack of Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale yesterday. It is one winter seasonal that I always enjoy.

This year's batch is, to me, much less balanced than in the past. Perhaps it is revisionist history; obviously, it would be very difficult to conduct a valid vertical tasting of a style that really should not be cellared, and I don't have any of last year's batch left anyway. Nevertheless, I found the 2004 Celebration Ale to be a little disappointing, if only because it did not meet my expectations.

It is a deep copper color with a robust and creamy head. The aroma absolutely slaps you silly with Cascade-variety hops - huge and citrusy. The flavor is completely consistent with that impression, as the grapefruit hop flavor dominates. It is quite bitter, but the hop flavor is much more pronounced than the bitterness, leading to the vision that they just dumped a truckload of Chinook hops (or Columbus or whatever "C" hop) into the boil at the very end.

It's a big, strong beer - and would have to be, to be drinkable with the hop levels. But the malt just never really presents itself in an interesting way, and the whole thing comes off rather one-dimensional. It is much more accurately characterized as an American IPA than a winter warmer or Old Ale.

Bad Vodka + Brita Filter = Good Vodka ??? - 11/11/0405:17 PM

Re: Beer Thread - 11/11/0405:36 PM

Re: beer thread - 11/11/0411:42 PM

I'm going to beat Peter to the punch (I went along for the dinner). Peter tried the Weltenberger Dunkel and I tried the Weltenberger Alsa (sp?) Bock. They're pretty similar beers and both are quite nice. Not too bold or too mild - a nice mix in the middle with a mellow, malty flavor. Good stuff.

The food was outstanding as well. I had the pork rib roast with apple and plum compote, pickled red cabbage and mashed potatoes, and I'm absolutely stuffed!

Re: beer thread - 11/12/0409:50 AM

pmbuko -- I saw something similar on TV...Tech TV's Unscrewed with Martin Seargent, I beleive. They used a filter specifically made to filter cheap alcohol and a brita (special one cost like $100) and almost everyone that tried it liked the brita better (no blind tests, though). The assistant that was doing the tests was loaded (or pretended to be) by the end of the show. It was hilarious!

Re: beer thread - 11/12/0412:44 PM

Yes, the food was excellent! They make a fantastic sauerkraut!

My beer was loaded with malty goodness and had just a tinge of hoppy bitterness to balance things out. It went down really smooth. The only problem was the food was so good (I had the schweinebraten with beer sauce) I didn't drink the beer fast enough to order a second. I guess I should have gone with the full liter instead of the half.

Re: beer thread - 11/12/0401:33 PM

Re: beer thread - 11/12/0406:42 PM

I'm feeling a little schizophrenic after the politics thread but wtf... I like German beer, too.

bigjohn, I had Peroni once about 10 years ago. My memory of it is as you described - no need to try it again. Peroni is an oddity. I would really recommend further experimentation with German 1/2 liters (for cost savings), English ales, and affordable pilseners from eastern Europe. You'll likely develop a pallette (sp?) and discover some new tastes without wasting money on beers you won't like.

BTW, the persistence of a dense head of foam in the glass is indicative of a well made beer (assuming it is not simply over carbonated).

Re: beer thread - 11/15/0410:56 AM

yea, the peroni was not too bad, not too good.. just beer. sometimes that is OK, but most of the time, i wanna KNOW i am drinking something.

i am headed to the grocery store either this afternoon or tomorrow, so the next taste test is soon in hand. my selection is starting to run thin at the grocery store, i might have to start going out to liquor city and see what sort of selection they have out there. i still havent found one that was undrinkable, but the extra pale ale from san luis obpispo was pretty horrible. if i stay clear of those types, i should be fine.

BTW- my wife had her first drink in over a year this weekend. she didnt drink during her pregnancy, and she decided to have a few glasses of wine. i got her some that she really likes.. it was 'Texas Red' from the llano estacado wine company. bottled in 2000. there are several small wineries popping up in texas, and this is one of her favorites. i made a nice almond toasted roast, that was drizzled in wine sauce, and tossed veggies in a red wine vinagrete dressing. i had to use the whole bottle somehow... it was good dinner, and she had that warm, fuzzy look, so i think she got a little buzz on!!

Re: beer thread - 11/15/0403:46 PM

steve- we actually took a tour of the fall creek winery in tow a few years. we go to lake buchanan at least twice a year, and we decided to go on up to tow and have a look. it was pretty cool to see the whole process from beginning to end. very nice people and definitely worth a looksee if you are in the area with a few hours to kill.

Re: beer thread - 11/15/0405:14 PM

Never had any wine from Texas, but I had a couple bottles of pricey Viognier from Virginy a while back. They were good, well worth the $0 that I paid for them.

Next time you visit soCal you could stay here:

http://www.pechanga.com/contact/contact.asp

It's a very nice hotel, it's about 5 minutes from the Temecula wine country, great temperatures even in the summer, about 1 1/2 hour drive from Disneyland, Sea World, and San Diego.
The casino table minimums are a little high and they don't comp drinks, so... BYOB.

Some of the Temecula wines were very good, and the wine tasting is always a blast.

Re: beer thread - 11/16/0401:35 AM

Well I must say that today was a good day of brew findings. Here is what's in the fridge (-1)

My brew for the evening was the Duchesse De Bourgogne. It's my first Flemish sour ale and my impression is HOLY CRAP MY MOUTH IS IN LOVE. I can honestly say that I've never tasted anything like it. Distinctly sour (duh) at first that fades to the incrible, sweet complexity underneath. I can't even begin to say what all I was tasting, but I know that my mouth was very happy. I will DEFINITLY pick this one up again.

Also, the local shop is getting in Rochefort 8 and 10 this week so I'll add those to the fridge. (to join the 6) The owner said that he had to special order them and that they would only be there for a couple of days. Likely, this is the only time I could ever be lucky enough to find all 3 Rochefort brews.

Re: beer thread - 11/16/0409:44 AM

Re: beer thread - 11/16/0410:33 PM

I'm in Boston this week and walked by a "Fine Wines and Rare Beers" store on my way back to the hotel from dinner. I might have to step inside tomorrow and see what they have. Your post has be salivating.

Re: beer thread - 11/17/0401:15 AM

Re: beer thread - 11/17/0402:08 AM

In reply to:

I am in the process of trying to finish my first bottle of Anchor Brewing's 2004 winter seasonal ale: "Our Special Ale" (Yes, I realize it's not even noon yet on Sunday. )

Yechhh! It pours like a porter/stout and even has the roasty aromas of one, but flavorwise, it has no center. By this I mean it has plenty of foretaste (aroma) and aftertaste (which is metallic and bitter), but not much in between.

I had my brother try it to make sure I wasn't crazy. He agreed that it wasn't worth buying, especially since a sixer cost me $8.39.

Time for me to flip-flop. I'm drinking one of these right now - and actually, I like it! Right after it's opened it is pretty unpleasant, but I've had it sitting in the glass (even cracked out the special beer glasses) for a while and it really is quite nice. It's not all about the bitter finish now - the center has filled out a bit and balances the finish with a nice, smooth sweetness. One might even say it has a nice caramel center to counteract the spicey finish, if one felt so inclined. Actually, the finish mellows quite a bit after sitting for a while, too.

Re: beer thread - 11/17/0402:32 AM

I've been meaning to post a follow up to this beer as well. It needs to be had at or near room temperature for all the flavor layers to be evident. It's been growing on me. Still, there are better seasonals.

Re: beer thread - 11/17/0408:39 PM

All the Berkeley-style political discussions on other threads got me a hankerin' for Anchor Steam and some blotter acid. Fortunately, the liquor store only carries beer. Anchor's Liberty Ale has always been one of my favorites. Bought a sixer tonight - excellent, none of that citrusy hop flavor so many west coast pale ales have. Bitter to be sure, but nicely done and clean, clean, clean.
I also bought a 12er of some other beer that looked to be brewed in Frisco (actually brewed in Gilroy well south of Frisco) called Coastal Fog. It's purty darn good for $9/12.

Re: beer thread - 11/17/0410:58 PM

Well, I stopped by the Rare Beers store in Cambridge on my way back from dinner. They had a great selection. Lots of Belgian and Trappist beers to choose from, as well as a bunch I'd never heard of before. The guy behind the counter was a beer lover and he looked happy to see me head straight for the Belgians. After looking around for a while, I picked up a bottle of "Trappistes Rochefort 10" since it was recently mentioned and I'd never had it before. It's open right now next to me.

When I brought it to the counter, the guy said "That's a serious beer. Perfect for a cold night." When I handed him my credit card (I was light on cash tonight), he pointed to the $10 minimum credit charge sign. So I said "I guess that means I'll have to buy something else!" That got a chuckle from him.

I asked him what his favorite was and he immediately pointed to the "Westmalle Tripel", another Trappist ale. I'll probably save that for tomorrow.

Now on to the Rochefort 10 tasting notes. All I have to drink from in the hotel room are the small water glasses. It pours a dark cloudy caramel color and has a creamy/frothy head that settles to a steady . Small streams of bubbles caress the sides of the glass on their way to meet the head from below. The smell? Whoah. Strong malty notes with a hint of sweetness.

Re: beer thread - 11/17/0411:37 PM

Re: beer thread - 11/17/0411:39 PM

Wow Peter, nice finds indeed. I picked up 2 Rochefort 10's and an 8 today. I can't wait to crack open one for Thanksgiving. It sounds like you're really enjoying yours. I wish I could find Westmalle around here, but my local rare brew shop just got in a few more things to make me happy. First is the Corsendonk Christmas Ale (8 pack with the glass). I hope their not to expensive because they'd make a great gift. Second is Thomas Hardy's Ale (barleywine). Thirdly, the big one, Gouden Carolus Cuvee Van De Keizer, or Gouden Carolus Grand Cru of the Emperor. It's only brewed once a year to celebrate the birthday of Charles V and the 2004 vintage has arrived. The owner said not to worry about him running out. He received 3 cases today and he has 6 more on order. I can't wait to grab one of these for the holidays. Needless to say, I'm a very happy man right about now.

Re: beer thread - 11/17/0411:46 PM

Re: beer thread - 11/18/0410:59 PM

I'm drinking the Westmalle Tripel now. Wow! This stuff is amazing. Very frothy and thick head that stays for a long time, leaving a dot on my nose as I sip. It's an organgy-golden color with a bright and fruity aroma. The taste is crisp with hints of citrus, and the texture is buttery. Lovely. I'll have to find this again.

Boston has been good to me. I finished early, so I get to head back home first thing in the morning. And then I have to repack my bags for the road trip to Washington.

Tom -- I'm not going to have time to make the side trip to Puyallup. Aw shucks.

Re: beer thread - 11/19/0412:02 PM

Pity. You just don't want to share that Rochefort.

Hoping everyone traveling to be with loved ones for the holiday has a safe and satisfying journey, and a happy thanksgiving. Those of you NOT traveling can drink more, so probably don't need any additional tidings from me.

My wife made pumpkin ice cream this week. It totally ruled. I think that could be the highest, best use of a vegetable.

Re: beer thread - 11/19/0404:11 PM

Re: beer thread - 11/22/0412:47 PM

I made out quite well this weekend and found my new favorite bar. It's an older hotel in the downtown Saskatoon area with a lounge/bar on the main floor called "Winston's". They have 130 different types of bottled beer (mostly import) and 30 different types of beer on tap. I was able to try my first Czecvar (sp?) and I was very impressed. I think I'll be headed back there more often.

Re: beer thread - 11/22/0407:12 PM

FYI, (learned at the brewery this Saturday):

In December, Deschutes is releasing (in limited quantities, dammit!) a double-strength Mirror Pond Ale, dubbed "Mirror Mirror", made in the Barleywine style and aged in oak barrels. I don't think I'll be able to get my hands on it, but perhaps I can live vicariously through you, Tom?

I made it to Yakima in about 24 hours total, stopping over near Mt. Shasta Friday night. Damn was it cold in that tent! I'm here through Saturday. ...

Re: beer thread - 11/23/0409:46 AM

UUMMMMM.. ice cream.....

OK, back to beer.. i had said that my next beer review would be the italian 'Peroni', but that is not so. my wife surprised me on sunday afternoon by going to the grocery store, so she picked out a sixer for me. she decided to go a little off the beaten path, and got me some 'Saint Arnold Amber Ale', made and bottled at a micro-brewery in houston.

my first impression while pouring into the glass was that it was gonna be very strong, cause it had a very 'full' aroma. the color was a dark, almost cloudy, orangy-brown(if thats a word?).. it had a very small head, and was lightly carbonated. upon first taste, i realized the aroma gave me the wrong impression. dont get me wrong, it had good flavor, but not as strong as the smell would indicate. the flavor was mildly malty, but not overbearing. it had an almost creamy texture, but i contributed that to the low carbonation. the flavor was rich and sweet, and lasted in the mouth for a few good seconds after swallowing, with just the slight hint of bitter at the end. an overall above average beer, that was extremely drinkable, and enjoyable.

i would give it a 7.5.. that particular microbrewery(Saint Arnold), has several different holiday and seasonal beer that they produce. the amber ale definitely has me wanting to try other flavors from them. hopefully, our grocery store will get their winter stock, and i can give that a good taste test.

Re: beer thread - 11/23/0411:33 AM

Re: beer thread - 11/23/0403:00 PM

Right on, bigjohn! Sounds like you're heading in the right direction.
I, OTOH, due to self-imposed budget constraints, recently brought home 2 cases of Old Milwaukee in cans. Actually, I like the stuff alot - especially out of a high quality crystal pilsener glass.

I also brought home a bottle of Old Whiskey River - the bourbon that Willie Nelson markets. Super smooth, but ridiculously sweet, simple, almost bland. Nice stuff, but nothing to write home about.

It came with a free concert CD (good performance, so-so recording), so overall... not bad for $20.

Re: beer thread - 11/23/0403:48 PM

In reply to:

bottle of Old Whiskey River

i have tried this also. i was drinking some 'Knob Creek' whiskey at the time, and a friend suggested for me to try the willie brand, and said it was similar to 'the knob'. i really didnt think so. old whiskey river isnt bad by any means, but it doesnt have the warm bite of the knob, and the knob has a great maple flavor that lingers well after you have swallowed it. not very comparible at all in my opinion.

i have recently been drinking some Ron Anejo Aniversario rum. it is not too expensive, and comes in a nifty little leather pouch. definitely a nice change of pace from your normal capt morgan or bacardi.

Re: beer thread - 11/24/0405:00 PM

Tom, Grant's went out of business. Sad, according to my sis-in-law, who got free beer from there. Maybe there's a connection???

Anyway, the place to go now is Bob's Keg and Cork, across the street from where Grant's used to be. I went there last night and had cask-conditioned Mirror Pond, then a cask-conditioned ESB that started with a B, then a Black Butte, and then a Guinness. It was a good night.

Re: beer thread - 11/29/0405:04 PM

I got back from Yakima, Washington safely yesterday. I drank a lot and ate a lot -- which translated into good times and lots of fun.

We went wine tasting along I-82 the day after T-Day and hit about 8 wineries. The Yakima Valley wine growers have a yearly event the weekend following Thanksgiving where they serve food either made with or specifically paired with their wines. Yum!

We came home with 1 bottle of GewŁrztraminer, 2 bottles of red wine, 3 bottles of port, and 1 bottle of ice wine. A good haul, overall. Oh, and I stopped at the Deschutes brewery in Bend on the way back, as well.

Re: beer thread - 11/29/0405:20 PM

I'm glad you had a good trip, Peter. Hope to see you next time you come north.

There ARE good wines from Eastern Washington. Glad you found a few.

I had an 2004 Anchor Old Foghorn yesterday. Someday, maybe I'll have the discipline to cellar some barleywine. Probably not. It was quite sweet, but really nicely balanced and very clean. I would have anticipated a bit more hop nose, but it was highly drinkable. Delicious American barleywine.

I also had a Scuttlebutt Old No. 1 barleywine from Everett, WA. MUCH more alcoholic than the Foghorn (12.9% abv!), and not nearly as smooth and balanced. A well-crafted beer, clearly within the parameters of the style, but a little rough around the edges. I found the alcohol bite to be a little distracting.

Re: beer thread - 12/02/0410:26 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/03/0407:52 AM

I'm hearing good things about the St. Bernardus 12 and there's one sitting in my fridge. Sounds like I'll enjoy it. Another one that I added this week is Beersel Oude Geuze and it'll be my first gueuze.

Re: beer thread - 12/03/0408:10 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/03/0412:47 PM

On the 120 min IPA note... I can't find it anywhere. I've been looking for it for more than a year now in various places around Boston and haven't found it. I guess the next time I go to Philly I'll scour the map for it. I really like the 90 minute, and every now and then am in the mood for really strong brew. Mmmm....beer.....Friday..... the work day needs to end...

Re: beer thread - 12/03/0404:48 PM

ring- see now thats why you gotta see if you can get it in a keg! actually i think it's only in bottles, you might have to go online to get it. the place i go only gets a crate of about 20 at a time and honestly they dont sell a lot (which is good for me). only bad thing is it was like 12 bucks a bottle, but man is it worth it! (asuuming you like hops...)

Re: beer thread - 12/04/0410:31 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/04/0405:06 PM

**OK guys.. this is an ALL POINTS bulletin for help.**

i went out to liquor city this afternoon to get some rum for our company christmas party, and i decided to look for some of this great beer ya'll have been telling me about. low and behold, they had some. i was SO excited, i could hardly control myself(think kid in a candy store). anyway, i got the 2 that ya'll have been highly recommending. the 750ml Corsendonk Pale Ale, and the 750ml Chimay Ale Peres Trappistes Premiere. both cost me $7.25 each.

so here is my question.. i noticed that BOTH beers were the type with 'stuff' floating in the bottom. or, settled in the bottom as the case may be. so, when i drink these, am i supposed to 'swirl' it around, and get all the stuff off the bottom? or, am i supposed to pour it very slow, and make sure the stuff stays settled on the bottom? in my past, i havent cared for the beers that had the 'stuff' in the bottom, but i am open for something new. so, do i mix 'em up, or be gentle with them, and keep the stuff in the bottom. also, the bottles are corked. so, once you open it, can you recork it and put it back in the fridge, and how long will it stay good? i dont plan on leaving it in there for a long time or nothing, just curious. if its as good as ya'll keep saying, i dont suppose it will be in the bottle very long at all..

ringmir, spock, bigwill, peter, and tom. i am waiting on ya'll. you have the beer 'expertise' i need, and the information i am looking for. please help me out. i plan on drinking these while watching football tomorrow, so ASAP.

BTW- they also had some IPA's, but i will wait to try that. and they carry the beer Duval, but they were out. hopefully, they will have that next time.

Re: beer thread - 12/04/0407:13 PM

With any of the Belgian Ales you should pour them slowly attempting to leave the sediment in the bottom of the bottle. Preferably you will be using a tulip shaped glass. I know this sounds beer-snobbish but it really does make a difference. The Trappist ales flavor will improve as it warms, refrigerator temperature is too cold. Most dark heavy ales are best around 55 degrees, at that the temperature the flavor really opens up - it's quite amazing actually - how much an ale's flavor changes as it warms up. (BTW - you are in for a treat - I discovered Chimay in college when I was an employee at a liquor store that specialized in imported beers and Chimay remains one of my all time favorites to this day - because of it's price, about $12 for Grand Reserve around here, I save it for special occasions, like the day my Axiom M60s arrived.) ENJOY!!!

Re: beer thread - 12/04/0407:50 PM

I had a great Belgian find yesterday, an ale I'd never had before. I went to a grocery store I usually don't go to and I found 11 big 25.4 ounce bottles of Abbaye des Rocs "Brasserie de l'Abbaye des Rocs" Burgandy Ale in the clearance bin for $3.99. Being familiar with the GREAT Chimay, I bought 2 bottles and tried one that same evening and WOW, what a great beer. I went back this morning and bought the remaining 9 bottles. Beer Nirvana.

Re: beer thread - 12/04/0409:32 PM

Wow, bigjohn, you're out on the beer ledge! Careful!

I hope you enjoy those beers. They are wonderfully rich and complex. And strong.

I'd agree that there is really no point in trying to recork them.

I don't completely subscribe to fiberking's guidance about the sediment. I think it comes down to personal preference. All you've got there is yeast - that miraculous organism that makes beer and bread possible (thus sustaining life on the planet). It's good for you. It will cloud your beer somewhat, but will not impact the flavor any, if at all - unless you try to ingest ONLY the yeasty part.

I agree with the guidance about temperature and glass shape. Use a big wine glass if you have one.

I pour my first one-two glasses and then, when there is only about a half-inch of beer in the bottle, I swirl it mightily to make sure I get any remaining yeast in my last glass. I am convinced that the B vitamins in the yeast help me feel better and balance the effects of the alcohol. Plus, I figured I'm paying like $40/gallon for nectar from Belguim, and I damn well intend to get my money's worth.

At any rate, it should not dramatically alter your experience whether you get all or none of the yeast at the bottom of the bottle. Don't sweat it.

Let us know how you like them. I am very curious about your impressions!

Re: beer thread - 12/04/0410:24 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/04/0411:01 PM

what you might want to do is get the bundled packs with a couple bottle and the accompanying beer. ive noticed recently that alot of belgians are doing this, especially around the holidays. ive gotten a corsendonk pack with abbey brown and abbey pale, a st. bernardus with aby 12,prior 8, pater 6 and tripel. and today i got a chimay pack with a red, white, and blue. so its really a great deal since you get outstanding beer plus the glasses with the logos on 'em. oh yeah, ive got Dominion's oak Barrel Stout; try it if you can get it!!

Re: beer thread - 12/05/0408:49 AM

Well, I'm very late coming to this one but I generally agree with Tom. The yeast is very good for you (B vitamins), and if it's mixed in with even a small amount of beer you really won't taste it at all. I don't swirl it out at the end, but I just never worry about leaving it in the first place. Sometimes from the outside of the bottle it looks like there's more there than there really is. For whatever reason, as it settles sometimes it clings to the walls of the bottle and actually looks like there's a thick layer, when in fact there's a very thin layer that's just clinging to the glass (if that makes sense.)

As for recorking it... you can do it, if you really don't want to drink it all at once. Basically you just somewhat carefully force the cork back into the bottle. If you're going to leave it overnight I would recommend trying to stick the cork back in it. But, I wouldn't recommend leaving it overnight I drink those 750 ml bottles pretty infrequently (as someone else here mentioned, because they're kinda pricey here) and so when I do, I like to get the full alcohol whallop all at once.

Re: beer thread - 12/05/0409:34 AM

hey, thanks guys for clueing me in!! i will bust 'em open and drink 'em during the football games today. i sure hope that i like them also. i have a fear that i have allowed myself to get too worked up over them, and might be disappointed...? who knows. i will give them a serious taste test, and convey my findings.

Re: beer thread - 12/06/0402:11 AM

I picked up a sixer of Widmer's Snow Plow winter brew. It's a "Milk Stout" and is very tasty. It's mildy sweet, apparently from the lactose they use during the brewing process. The lactose is how the "milk" style gets its name. It takes the edge off the bitterness often associated with stouts and gives the beer a smooth, creamy mouthfeel. It's not overly complex, but there's enough going on on your palate to intrigue even those who demand to be kicked in the teeth when they drink.

Re: beer thread - 12/06/0402:31 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/06/0409:18 AM

john, congrats on the finding a few Belgians. I had a Corsendonk Abbey Pale Ale this weekend and I must say that it's one of my favorites. I've decided that I prefer it to Duvel. I'll also be picking up their Christmas Ale for the holidays soon (gift pack with glass) and I can't wait to try it. Anyway, I really hope that you enjoyed the 'Donk and Chimay (Red).

Re: beer thread - 12/06/0410:33 AM

OK, heres my reviews or thoughts on the new beers.

first, i tried the Corsendonk Abbey Pale Ale. upon opening, i smelled the cork, and it almost smelled like wine, kinda fruity. i poured it slowely into my wide mouthed beer stein, and immediately noticed the BIG, white head. this beer had a huge head, that was full and soft, almost like a cloud. the beer color was rich golden color, with a tinge of cloudy from the yeast. it had a very rich aroma of fruit. and the taste, was very similar. it was mildly fruity, with a hint of spice. not too bold, but enough to arouse your taste buds. aftertaste was slightly sweet, not bitter at all. which was a surprise, because most other pale ale's i have drank, had a bitter aftertaste. this wasnt the case with the corsendonk. i DID swirl the yeast off the bottom on the last pour, which made it cloudy, but that last glass was a real kicker. almost like a liquid meal, very full, rich, and hearty. i would drink it with a meal, but almost prefer it alone, as to not have anything to interfere with its flavor. overall, i thoroughly enjoyed the corsendonk. 8.5 outta 10.. very good, will drink again.

and then there was the Chimay Premiere Red. i was most looking forward to this beer, cause i have a soft spot for dark, amber beers. i was not disappointed. the Chimay had a good head, and the color was deep amber, beautiful. slightly cloudy from the yeast, but perfectly acceptable. the aroma was even more bold than the corsendonk. strong scent of hops and yeast, with a hint of fruit. flavor and texture were devine. it seemed to swirl around the taste buds, almost creamy. and the flavor was also bold and hoppy, and stayed strong in the mouth. the light fruity flavor would come and go as the creamy, malty texture passed with a hint of bitter at the end. as before, i 'swirled' the yeast in the last cup, and it was supreme. murky and cloudy, bold and strong. very delicious and truly satisfying. i think i can say it was one of, if the THE, best beer i have drank. i was very pleased and ready for another. 9/9.5 outta 10.. very delicious.

and i will say that after these two 750ml bottles, i had a decent little buzz. i had a warmth radiating from my chest to my arms. very filling. these were both spectacular beers, with the Chimay Red getting a slight advantage. at $7.25 a bottle, its not something i would drink every day, but definitely a holiday or special event kinda beers. i now have the 'bug' to wanna go try ALL those different beers that i never tried before. i will be branching out to try an IPA, and the Duval. hopefully, i can get my hands on a Chimay Blue.. thats supposed to be good also.

thanks ya'll for all the help and suggestions. i am looking forward to my future journeys into the unknown.

Re: beer thread - 12/06/0410:49 AM

Since you liked the Red so much, all I have to say is wait until you have the Blue. It sounds like it will be beer heaven for you. Another Trappist to watch for is Rochefort 10. I've found that the Trappistes tend to be very semilar in taste. (Not that it's a bad thing) Although Orval definitely deviates from the Trappist norms and I wish I could get it around here.

HOLY CRAP I bet you did have a buzz. Two 750mL bottles would have me passed out on the floor. I once had 1/2 a bottle of Chimay White and that was enough for me. Now a good IPA to watch for is Fuller's IPA. It's a very nicely balanced brew and I think would be a good start with IPA's. Good to see you enjoying your beer journeys. Cheers!

Re: beer thread - 12/07/0402:21 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/07/0410:33 AM

*UPDATE*
i was telling my buddy about how good the corsendonk and chimay red were, and he insisted that we try some while watching the football game last night. he really liked them both, but was blown away by the corsendonk. he liked the fruity, boldness of it. he said he would definitely go get some more before christmas.

and while i was at the liquor store, i picked up a sixer of a winter brew called, Pyramid Snow Cap Ale. it is made by a micro brewery in seattle. this beer was simply unpleasant to me, and my buddy. maybe it was becuase we drank the 'good stuff' first, but neither of us cared for this pyramid winter brew. it was the darkest beer i think i have ever drank. and it was thick and syrupy, but in a bad way. the alcohol smell was VERY overpowering, and the flavors seemed liked they were tripping over themselves in your mouth. it was too spicy, with overlaping hints of chocolate, nuts, licorice, and pepper. its almost like the brewers tried to throw too much into this beer, and it just tasted confused and complicated. it kinda reminded me of a very bad cough syrup. too thick, too busy, and bitter going down. i will be generous, and give this a 4 outta 10.

needless to say, i wont be trying the pyramid snow cap again.. but, i did find the suggestion box at the liquor store, and told them to carry some chimay blue, and the corsendonk winter ale. lets hope they do.

Re: beer thread - 12/07/0402:00 PM

John,

You'll find that most winter ales have a fairly complex spicy quality to them. I would describe them generally as a having a strong malt backbone, no hop aroma, a slight hop bite, and some peppery/chocolate spiceyness. With as much as they try to put into these beers, balance becomes the most important factor. Some of them turn out really nicely, and others can only be explained as you did with your "tripping over themselves" comment. If I see a winter seasonal in a bar I haven't had before I'll get a pint, and if it's good then I'll pick up 6 or 12 when I go to the store. As for Pyramid, I'm not a huge fan in general. I drank a lot of their brews when I was living in Seattle one summer working for the evil empire. They make a pretty good hefe-weizen though.

Re: beer thread - 12/07/0402:20 PM

I don't like the Snowcap anymore, either. I think the alcohol dominates the profile. Furthermore, Pyramid is no longer anything like a "microbrewery". Their corporate story is pretty interesting, and shows how overexpansion ruined the products. They started out at a small place in downtown Kalama, Washington. Then, they moved to a bigger place. Then, they abandoned their roots and moved operations to Seattle (where they still have a cash-cow uber pub across from Safeco Field and Seahawks Stadium). Then they bought out the brands and soul of Poulsbo's Thomas Kemper brewery. They fired head brewer Rande Reed a few years ago, and he found his bliss at Snoqualmie Falls Brewery, which still makes some fabulous beers on a much more limited scale. I think all the Pyramid bottled beers are undrinkable; they must pasteurize or filter the life out of them. On draught, they are somewhat better. Snowcap used to be sublime, when the west coast winter warmer style was in its infancy. Now, it's just a strong beer with a big marketing budget.

Not that I'm bitter or anything.

I had a Fish Tail Winterfish the other night on draught. Much sweeter than I remember, and not roasty at all. Kind of like barleywine lite. Not unpleasant, but there are other seasonals I prefer.

Re: beer thread - 12/07/0402:51 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/08/0403:11 PM

I'll join in on the Pyramid bashing - not good beers at all. In particular, I do not like the hefe weizen - coarse, grainy, tannic, bitter, etc... Not what I want in a wheat beer.
I much prefer the delicate, estery German-style hefes to the "California" style.
Had 2 more cans of Old Milwaukee last night. Cans opened with a pleasing "whush". Nice head, fine carbonation, faint hop nose, clean malt profile with little cereal grain noticeable. Not bad for $4/12.

Re: beer thread - 12/08/0403:42 PM

Well I suppose I'll chime in for a good brew. I broke out the St. Bernardus 12 last night. I enjoyed it in a Duvel sniffer. Anyway onto the review. It poured a nice dark brown color and a really nice thick and creamy head. Nice sweet aroma that reminds me a bit of brown sugar. From the first few sips I could tell that it had not quite warmed up enough even though I let it sit for several minutes. Then when it warmed the flavor was tremendous. It had the usual Belgian spicy taste, but with a faint smokey or roasted flavor. This "smokey" flavor is not something I've tasted in any other Trippels and gave it a very original character. I'll definately say that this one ranks up there with the Trappistes.

Re: beer thread - 12/08/0406:30 PM

spock- what a coinkydink, i was drinking the abt 12 last night too! i definitely agree with your review. ive actually gone through about 4 bottles of it in the past week! ive got chimay red,white, and blue waiting for me at home too, so i've got that going for me...which is nice.

Re: beer thread - 12/10/0408:41 PM

Don't ever let me tell you I don't like my job. Around 3:30 today my boss started getting antsy, so he asked "What time does happy hour start?" I did a little web research on the two closest spots and came to the conclusion that 4:00 was it.

So at 3:50, we left shut down the office (my office consists of 3 whole people) and walked to Jupiter in downtown Berkeley. They always have a nice selection of beers on tap. I had a pint of Drake's Jolly Rodger, a scotch ale/barleywine style beer. Quite tasty, and potent. And the boss paid, too.

Re: beer thread - 12/11/0412:12 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/11/0401:45 PM

Well here's my other "Beer Adventure" for this week. Here's what I enjoyed this week. Beersel Oude Geuze.

Note that these are first impresssions and I plan on getting this one again. This is my fist venture into the Gueuze. Sadly I had to pour this one quickly since once the cork popped (flew) out a rush of bubbles followed. So I had to pour as quickly as I could to save the bubbly. Bad cork popping on my part probably. The head was huge on this one and poured a copper hue. First taste was sour but not overbearing and finish was slightly dry. In the finsh was a "wild" taste that made me think of a field of wheat by the farm. The fruity hints were semilar to grapefruit without the bitter aftertaste. In all, very unique brew, but not for those who are new to Lambics. A fruit Lambic would be a better place to start.

Re: beer thread - 12/14/0406:09 PM

May have been a touch too warm. Warm bottle conditioned beers will gush.
I'd either chill it to low temps (and allow it to warm slightly in the glass) or use a large pitcher in which to make the initial pour. I usually take the latter approach with my homebrews.
I know you guys love those sour Belgians, but I think I'm going to stick to Old Milwaukee for awhile.

Re: beer thread - 12/14/0410:44 PM

Thanks for the tip. I kept it in the 'fridge around 40, but I did let it come to around room temp. That must have done it then. Anyway, I don't think that I can give up the Belgians though. They're just too tasty. Enjoy the Old Milwaukee.

Re: beer thread - 12/16/0407:38 PM

I'm a big fan of Sam Smith's oatmeal stout. If I see the Barney Flats I'll be sure to get some, although I don't think we get Anderson Valley up in Boston. I would definately give the Sam Smith a shot if you haven't tried it.

Re: beer thread - 12/16/0408:30 PM

I haven't had it in a few years, but it does seem to be regarded as the std for oatmeal stouts. I made a couple, but they always seemed to come out oily, resinous, lacking head retention, and lacking finesse.
Best stout I ever made was a mash/extract combo using 6.6# of Mellimicks (sp?) Irish Stout extract and something like 8# of 2 row (for a 10 gal batch). It was AWESOME!

Re: beer thread - 12/20/0401:32 AM

In reply to:

Corsendonk Christmas Ale

dang it!! i asked the owner of the liquor store to see if he could get that, and he said the distributor in austin didnt have it. so, unless i go to dallas, i dont think i can find any. i really liked the regular corsendonk. in fact, i bought three bottles of it for me and my buddy to watch football tomorrow night.

Re: beer thread - 12/20/0409:24 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/20/0410:10 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/20/0401:53 PM

the beer gods must be looking out for me!!!

after speaking with the owner of the Pinkies liquor store(largest liquor store chain in texas) on friday, he could see the disapointment in my eyes when he told me that he couldnt get the beers from his austin distributor. so, after i left his store, he called the dallas distributor, and managed to get me some Chimay Blue, and the Duvel. he just called my house, and told my wife to let me know.. so, i am running over there after work to grab it. i am SO excited.

talk about some great service. i will be sure to shake that mans hand today. i just think that is pretty dang cool!! unlike peter, i WILL post a review..

Re: beer thread - 12/20/0405:01 PM

In reply to:

You small town people are so good to each other

why, yes we are.. we even wave people through at a 4-way stop..

all kidding aside, i am very pleased with the effort that guy put forth. he could have just let me keep drinkin the corsendonk and chimay red, but he didnt. my wife said when she talked with him, he told her, "i could tell he REALLY wanted to try those beers". well hell yes i did.. by-golly..

Re: beer thread - 12/20/0408:09 PM

John, sorry to hear about the Corsendonk Christmas Ale quest. I was able to pick up their gift pack last week and I've had a couple already. I must say that it's quite good and not as heavy as many other Belgians (ie. Trippels). It might be 8.5ABV but it's such a well balanced brew. The funny thing is that it's the first Belgian that I've had with a very noticable hops presence. I plan to enjoy all 8 bottles. Oh yeah, and this year's Christmas day brews are Gouden Carolus NoŽl and Cantillon Kriek. I can't wait to enjoy these. Anyway, I hope you enjoy the Chimay Blue and Duvel.

Re: beer thread - 12/20/0409:57 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/21/0411:05 AM

OK, here is review, nursing a very tired head.

when i went to pick up the Chimay Blue and the Duvel, it was out of the cooler. so i had to run home and put it in the freezer to chill it as fast as possible. went to my buddies about 7, and started drinkin. we did the Chimay Blue first.

first impression upon opening was a strong wine smell, like we had opened a bottle of merlot. it pours a murky dark, with a medium head consisting of small bubbles that desipate fast, but leave a very creamy lace over the top of the beer. first taste confirmed the aroma, very fruity and sweet, very wine like. it had a heavy flavor of yeast, and the 9% alcohol content was very evident. not at all over powering, but you knew you were drinking a strong beer. the sweetness had many layers to it.. it had hints of raisin, caramel, and butter with a touch of bitter at the end. it did have a hint of spicyness, but the variables of the sweet flavors dominated. very bold, good beer. i liked this beer, but not as much as i liked the Chimay Red. i dont care for wine that much, and every time i would bring the glass to my mouth, that strong smell of fruit made my brain think it was wine, and not beer. my buddy agreed. overall, a good complex beer, with PLENTY of alcoholic kick, i give it an 8 out of 10. i prefer the RED, but wouldnt turn this down.

after that bottle was finished, we let out palates reset, and then went to the Duvel. when opened, it had more of a flowery small, and not a fruity smell. it pours a rich golden color, very beautiful with the thickest/creamyist/stiff head i have ever seen. literally, the head is thick, like the meringue on a pie, i kid you not. it clings to the glass and stays forever. i joked that i needed a straw to get to the beer under the head. anyway, flavor was a mild spice, with again, hints of sweetness. not as sweet as the Blue, and not quite as bold. the Duvel was slightly more tame, less complex. i would call it balanced.. good mix of spice and sweet, but not too much of either. the floral tones stayed evident, with hint of bitterness at the end. and the 8.5% alcohol content is very obvious. it tended to stand out, alerting you to its power. texture was not creamy, and not dry.. again, just a nice in the middle balance. overall, good strong beer. great golden color, with impressive head. i give it 8.5 out of 10.

it was a good night of drinking. after those two, we also split a bottle of the Corsendonk Pale Ale. needless to say, we had a decent buzz going. thats one thing i want to comment on. these are STRONG beers, and i mean in alcohol content. when drinking them, i get a warmth that radiates from my chest, into my stomach, and down my arms. i can feel the 'wave of drunk' as it washes over me. a rather weird sensation.

this has been so fun. i appreciate you guys turning me on to these beers. i will stick to my regular beers for your normal fishing and BBQing adventures, but these belgiums have made a space for themselves. i will definitely select these for holiday and special occasions. in fact, i bought 2 extra bottles of the Blue and Duvel to enjoy on christmas eve. although, i might save one for christmas dinner!!

Re: beer thread - 12/21/0402:07 PM

Good stories, bigjohn! I love reading tales of "discovery" on the beer thread.

My wife would probably raise her eyebrows pretty high if the man at the liquor store was calling my house!

I'm betting you would have liked the Duvel and the Blue much better if you had tried them in reverse order. The subtleties of the Duvel were likely lost because you had the more wild beer first.

I'm not a Belgian specialist like these other guys, but my favorite Chimay was the Cinq Cents (dunno what color that one would be). La Trappe Dubbel is another of my favorites (technically not a Belgian, but WTF). And the Carmeliet Tripel (Karmeliet?) that Tom recommended is wild and unique - very cool beer.

And I will again assert that best practice would be to chill these live beers in the frig for a week, create a nice tight yeast pack in the bottle, and pour all at once into a large vessel - leaving as much yeast in the bottle as possible. My beer-making books are all boxed up in the garage, but I am certain that I read (from a credible source) that harsh/bitter oils and proteins are likely to be clinging to those yeast cells.

Re: beer thread - 12/21/0402:27 PM

That is certainly the advice I've heard regarding the yeast the most frequently. I just haven't followed it too rigorously and have never been bothered by the outcome And, that yeast is quite good for you.

Re: beer thread - 12/21/0405:43 PM

This stupid thread caused me to buy the last 6 bottles of Bornem Tripel that my BevMo had ($1.80 a bottle! ). I was tempted to grab the Corsendonk Xmas Ale, but at $7.49 I resisted.

Also cleared them out of their remaining stock of Casilleria del Diablo Cabernet ($5.70 a bottle! ). If I'm not mistaken, it was someone on this forum who recommended that wine last year. Good call, it's excellent with smoky BBQ'd tri-tip and steaks.

Re: beer thread - 12/21/0409:02 PM

bigjohn, I want to thank you sincerely for sharing your journey and impressions with us. I find your descriptions to be at the same time accurate and illuminating. You obviously have taken great care to parse out the flavors your discern, and I really appreciate you taking the time to convey them to us.

For my own part, I had both draught and bottled Deschutes Jubelale, draught Pyramid Snowcap and bottled Young's Winter Warmer today (yes, it was a very good day, thank you very much). Not surprisingly, the live (draught) versions were delightful. While I appreciate the nuance of the Young's, it was simply not as "alive" as the local versions. I liked the Snowcap quite a bit - a night and day difference from the bottled version.

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0403:49 AM

I could hardly stand the inveiglement of the Corsendonk Christmas Ale any longer, so when my brother asked what I was saving it for, I promptly opened it. Well, promptly would be the wrong word since that cork did NOT want to come out. After much huffing and puffing it finally gave way with a satisfying pop, followed by thin wisps of condensing carbon dioxide. Now, lest you think I'm trying to compete with bigjohn's recent and most excellent beer review -- well, ok, I AM competing.

This ale poured with an enormous tan-colored frothy head, despite my attempts to minimize turbulence in transfering it from the bottle to my special Polish-crest, gold-rimmed tasting glasses. While the head settled, I gazed upon the deep amber-caramel color of the beer and eagerly anticipated its flavor. First sip. Hmmmm. Tastes slightly of plum, but the mouthfeel is exquisite. I'll let it warm up a bit before continuing the analysis.

The plum is still there, though it may be just because the word is still in my head and I can't think of another for that particular impression. Let me taste a bit more.

Mmmmm. Sooo nice. Such rich and creamy, well-rounded goodness. I have to stop typing and focus on this beverage. You win John.

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0409:40 AM

tom- thanks for the nice words. i have very much enjoyed my journey while tasting all these beers, and i have y'all to thank for it. i can bet my paycheck that i would have NEVER even considered buying those belgiums before talking with ya'll about it. so, muchas gracias a todos..

peter- i win? i didnt realize it was a race? J/K.. i just hate the fact that there are TONS of more beers that ya'll have mentioned that i cant get. i want to try them all. next time i am in dallas, i am gonna find a speciality store and get one of each.

FUNNY SIDENOTE- the other day, when i drove out to the liquor store to get the beers, he brought up the whole cases. 12 in a case.. he looked at me like, "here's that beer you wanted".. i was slightly confused, until he grabbed the scanner at the register, and started to scan the WHOLE case.. i was like, "wait, wait man..i cant buy this whole case, my wife would kill me!" he kinda chuckled, and asked how many i needed.. i felt bad, cause i know he 'special' ordered this stuff for me, but if i would have brought home $175 bucks of beer, i would be sleeping on the couch.. but the way i look at it, not too many people know wabout the beer, so at least they will have it for a few months. i got new years, my birthday, the super bowl, valentines day...... there is plenty of opportunities to go buy it all up!!

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0412:09 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0412:32 PM

OK...this thread is getting HUGE! How much beer to you guys drink????

Anyway...I thought I'd share a slightly humorous moment with you.

I didn't realize this until our Christmas party last Saturday, but gays and straights drink entirely different stuff. Over the years we've amassed a nearly full bar of booze at our place. You name it...scotch, gin, vodka, Baily's...whatever, we've likely got it. So before the party I went out and needed to grab a couple bottles of things were were short on. Namely some good vodka (we only had a huge bottle of Absolute that someone had brought to a previous engagement), a bottle of tequila, and some Amaretto. Anyway...we've got everything ready...we're fully stocked, and I realize we don't have a single bottle of beer in the house. I mention this to Roger and his reply was, "Don't worry, fags don't drink beer."

And you know what? He was right. One person asked for a beer all night, and it was the one straight guy at the party. The rest of use were drinking mostly shots and martinis. NOBODY else even mentioned beer.

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0401:28 PM

For some reason when read that post, I imagined you initially writing "had a very fruity flavor to it" and then adding the "/wine" part for the sake of being PC... made me chuckle whether it was true or not.

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0403:00 PM

It's the first thing I mentioned! I actually bought a bottle of Johnnie Walker Red simply because we didn't have any scotch. I've never drank the stuff myself. Smelled good though. I'll have to give it a try.

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0403:13 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0403:19 PM

In reply to:

Bacardi & Diet Coke

one of my good buddies drinks Royal Crown & Diet Coke religiously. he swears by it, and wont even drink it with regular coke..... funny.

although, he has said crown is pretty good with club soda, and a wedge twist of lime. as for me, i have never been much of a liquor drinker. my dad was an abusive alcoholic who drank canadian mist by the half-gallon. after years and years of smelling that sour, sweatty whiskey smell on him, it makes me not want any part of it as an adult. oops.. sorry, not trying to be a downer, just rambling...

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0405:52 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0406:38 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/22/0406:38 PM

That Fantome de Noel reminds me of the Belgian Ale Trader Joes used to carry for $2 a bottle in the early '90s. It was pretty darn good - I drank so much of it for so long I quit buying it. Wish they had it again now, though.

Re: beer thread - 12/23/0409:54 AM

How many of you guy's can HONESTLY tell me you enjoy the flavor of any alcohol drink? I know the "buzz" is what makes everything enjoyable but the taste is what I'm wondering about. My Dad said for years when I was 12 or so that beer is an acquired taste and when I get older I would appreciate the taste. Well, the flavor of any alcohol is still yucky but the "buzz" is fine.

Re: beer thread - 12/23/0409:58 AM

them is fightin' words!

while i will admit there are some awful tasting beers and liquors, you can find ones that taste very pleasant. check out this FULL thread, and you will get TONS of suggestions for beer and liquor, most with detailed descriptions. go buy you one, and see what you think!

Re: beer thread - 12/23/0411:34 AM

Yo! The trick (other than knock you on your ass type drinks such as a Zombie, etc.) is high quality liquor. It also helps, believe it or not, to drink it out of the appropriate glass at the appropriate temperature in the appropriate manner. In other words, Congac tastes terrible if you gulp it.

Re: beer thread - 12/23/0411:40 AM

Speaking of port. (On of my favorite drinks...)

When we were in the Paso Robles area, we stopped by a vineyard called Justin. They had a port-style wine called Obtuse that was terrific. I bought a bottle for myself and another as a gift for a friend. Yummy stuff.

Re: beer thread - 12/23/0411:50 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/23/0411:56 AM

57 bottles of liquor in various states of disrepair, including some homemade cordials (probably 10 bottles)
21 bottles of wine/port/champagne
2 bottles of beer (probably quite skunky by now.)
1 bottle of lambic.

Re: beer thread - 12/23/0403:21 PM

Re: beer thread - 12/24/0409:16 AM

Hey you're right about that sweet stuff Bigwill...I still have a weakness for good chocolates...like truffles and anything with g*o*o*d milk chocolate. Southbend chocolate co.- Ghiradelli - Godiva - Lindt and a candy bar called ?Toborone? not sure of the spelling on that one but it is good and almost difficult to get an easy bite due to the triangle shape.

Re: beer thread - 12/24/0402:15 PM

Ken and I and the friend we were living with at the time back in 1997-8 were rather large lushes. Some of the bottles in my liquor cabinet are remnants of those days. Every Friday and Saturday we'd look up recipes for mixed drinks, or make them up on the spot. And then we'd stay up playing computer games until dawn. Crazy days, those were.

Re: beer thread - 12/27/0402:15 PM

>>How many of you guy's can HONESTLY tell me you enjoy the flavor of any alcohol drink?

I'm guessing "all of us". I don't think it's so much that it takes years to "acquire the taste" but rather it takes years to "find what taste you like" rather than the stuff your parents like.

Bad wine, cheap liquor and beers you don't like will always taste bad, even after 25 years of trying to aquire the taste. My father used to let me sample (small samples) different beers and I didn't like any of them. Still don't like them today -- he and I just have different tastes in beer and probably always will. Part of the reason the beer thread rolls along so well is that there is an extraordinary variety of tastes and styles of beer, probably more so than any other food or drink going.

Wines and cognacs are a bit different. If you have a really good wine most people will agree that it is really good although there are still personal tastes (white/red, sweet/dry etc..).

I had a chance to try Remy Napoleon when I was relatively young and suddenly the whole "alcoholic drink" thing started to make sense. It wasn't particularly strong, just incredibly rich and delicious. I find the same with good Burgundy or Shiraz wines -- the alcohol just helps to carry the aroma to your nose and adds to the experience.

Anyways, not here to promote alcoholism or anything, just saying "don't let anyone push you into pretending to like something you don't enjoy, and keep your eyes open for the tastes you do enjoy".

If you just want the buzz almost anything will do (except Johnny Walker Red of course), and you can save a lot of money by not buying the good stuff

Re: beer thread - 12/29/0406:34 AM

Re: beer thread - 12/29/0409:22 AM

Driving through Kentucky one day we came upon a sign by the road that said something about Makers Mark Distillery. Found the place and the lady host brought out a tray of the most unusual chocolate candy. Of course it was filled to the gills with none other than Makers Mark. On that hot summer day driving through the countryside I realized a person can get shnockered on candy. I wish now I took the opportunity to seal my very own bottle of Makers Mark in the tourist shop with that red wax.

Re: beer thread - 12/29/0409:46 AM

i toured the Jack Daniels distillery in lynchburg, tennessee, several year ago. it was very cool. to see the process from water to whiskey is extremely interesting. we drank several 'lynchburg lemonades' in the gift shop, and they were very good. worst part of the tour was the 'mash' room. thats where the mixture sits in HUGE, 3 story vats, and ferments.... awful smell, but you cant deny the finished product!!

Re: beer thread - 12/29/0411:45 AM

Sounds like the Lynchburg Lemonades have the same kick as the Makers Mark candy. At the Coors brewery in colorado they let you stay in the lounge after the tour and have fresh beer. Out east...I can't remember what state or brand of cigarette..They let you tour the actual factory where cigarettes are made and boy oh boy was that place clean. Wife and I were only ones on tour that day...at the end of the guided tour the host asked what kind of free pack of smokes we would like for visiting.... I don't know how about Marlboro. She said that is made by the OTHER company....oop's

Re: beer thread - 12/30/0403:25 PM

I've got another awesome beer to recommend. Unibroue Terrible- A dark ale on Lees (whatever that means). It definitely shares some characteristics with other Unibroue brews (especially Maudite). It pours a very dark brown (almost black) with a tightly packed, fairly crisp head and just the slightest hint of carbonation. The taste is outstanding. Great body, slightly sweet and fruity (hints of apricot and raisin) but extremely well balanced with an extremely smooth and creamy finish. Probably the best dark beer I've ever had. And the most potent too at 10.5% alcohol. Needless to say I felt quite nice after finishing off the bottle. I highly recommend this one.

I also bought a Chimay Red to see what all the fuss is about, but I think I'll save that for tomorrow.

Re: beer thread - 12/31/0401:57 PM

"A dark ale on Lees (whatever that means)."

It means the beer is bottle conditioned - naturally carbonated by yeast (which remain dormant at the bottom of the bottle with the beer "resting" on it). Champagne is said to be done in a similar fashion, but I've never seen the yeast at the bottom of the bottle. Maybe the "punt" at the bottom of the bottle is effective at trapping the yeast cells?

Re: beer thread - 12/31/0409:53 PM

Speaking of champagne, I saw a little news bit on TV yesterday about where the bubbles come from. Yeah, yeah, you're all saying it comes from the carbonation. That's what I said, too, before I watched the segment.

The bubbles are a result of the carbonation, yes, but they couldn't form with the assistance of dust. Yup. Dust. In a completely dust-free environment, when poured into completely dust-free glasses, sparkling wine lies dormant and cannot form bubbles.

Re: beer thread - 01/01/0511:15 PM

I can third the statement about "Terrible". Had a bottle a few months ago and really enjoyed it. It's odd for them to use the term "lees" when discussing a beer, generally that term is seen in conjunction wth wines. (When discussing a beer it is traditionally called "trub") But it does refer to the yeast sediment in the bottle, a sign of a bottle conditioned ale.

Re: beer thread - 01/02/0502:11 AM

Re: beer thread - 01/13/0511:50 AM

BUMP...

OK, this had dropped all the way to the bottom of the second page? we cant be having that!!!

i introduced the Duvel to a few more friends this weekend. i went and got 4 bottles, and split it between the 3 of us. they were all impressed with the heavy, lasting head. and not to mention the flavor. i noticed if you uncork the bottle and few minutes before you plan to pour, it helps to reduce the amount of head that is produced. that is a BIG help considering, even when you pour it slow, it can still be a 50/50 split in the glass of beer and head. its cool the first time, but then you just wanna drink it!!

got poker night on friday, gonna go grab a sixer of something new. i saw some 'honey beer' from a brewer in colorado.. might give that a shot. what ever i get, i want it to be strong. that way, by the end of the night, i dont care if i win or lose..

Re: beer thread - 01/14/0507:29 AM

Re: beer thread - 01/14/0509:30 AM

O'Douls.... ? that stuff has the same effect on me as kryptonite has on superman.. it leaves me convulsing in the fetal position.

yes, Celis is still highly avail. my favorite texas made beer has always been Shiner. they make their standard amber bock, plus a nice gold lager called shiner blonde. and seasonals including a summer and winter stock. they have an awesome end-of-summer concert at the brewery every year that i used to go to. but, havent been able to make it the last few years, but still loads of fun just the same.

Re: beer thread - 01/14/0508:07 PM

WOOHOO!! glad to see this thread back where it belongs. Maybe we can beg Amie to sticky it to page 1. Anyway, I picked up a couple new brews today. First was St. Bernardus Pater 6. I've had the 12 and WOW was it good. The other one will be my first biere de garde. I'm new to this style so I don't really know what to expect. The one I got was Jenlain Biere de Noel. I saw that it has orange in it so it sounds pretty good.

During the holidays I had a few other Christmas brews. My favorite was Phantome de Noel. VERY spicy brew. I also noticed that it wasn't as sweet as many Belgians can be. A nicely balanced and complex brew. Sadly I'll have to wait till next year to get it again. Then came the Cantillon Kriek. WARNING!! if you don't like tart tastes then stay away from this one. The only kriek I had before this one was Lindemans which was more of a dessert style brew. The Cantillon was very dry and VERY tart. If you're not ready for the first sip, you will pucker from this one. Small sips were the way to go. I actually did enjoy it and I discovered that it great with dark chocolates.

Now for some REALLY good news. I was talking with the owner of the rare brew store and he's going to get some cases of Westvleteren Abt 12. This is one beer that I've read so many good things about. If it's better than the Rocheforts than all I can say is MMMMM! Anyway, that's my beer journey update.

Re: beer thread - 01/14/0509:32 PM

I liken Cantillon to a sort of liquid sweet tart / sour patch kid. Only much much better than that might imply. Personaly, I love the stuff, but it is indeed *tart*.

I just finished one of my vanilla milk porters that I mentioned here a few months back. The vanilla doesn't come through too much, mostly because it's a more fruity vanilla, the Tahitian (sp?) variety, which doesn't taste like your typical Madescascar vanilla. Not that you can get this one at your local store, but it pours nice and dark, similar to Guinness in color. The head is almost khaki, and seems to settle at around a half inch and hold strong. The beer itself is surprisingly refreshing, given the sheer quantity of lactose (milk sugar) that I added. I was expecting a more cloyingly sweet, thick brew. The result is actually more pleasing I think, with a subtle sweetness and a clean, slightly nutty malt profile that goes down very easily. As it warms in the glass the beer develops more of that Tahitian vanilla flavor, a vaguely fruity vanilla quality that blends nicely with the sweetness of the lactose.

I'd like to make another batch in the future using some high quality Madagascar Bourbon vanilla to get a stronger traditional vanilla flavor, but my brewing schedule looks like it's taking a turn towards IPAs for the next few batches. I want to do a few experiments with different hop schedules on top of the same base ale so I can compare things in a controlled manner.

Re: beer thread - 01/16/0504:54 AM

I've got another awesome beer to recommend - Pauwel Kwak. It's a Belgian specialty amber ale, and it is absolutely delicious! Light and dense head, golden/light caramel color with what seems to be very light yeast - it floats throughout the bottle without any stirring necessary. It's very smooth, with a fairly sweet and malty flavor and finish that is just awesome. Very, very satisfying!

Highly recommended!

(Peter, I'm saving a bottle of Unibroue Terrible for when you get back)

Re: beer thread - 01/16/0503:48 PM

Haven't heard of that one, Adam. I did grab a bottle of something called Salvation (?) from a N. American craft brewery. Supposed to be a Tripel style, I think. Its laying up in the frig to settle.

Ringmir, it sounds like you know what you're doing. Are you using any wheat at all to help with head retention? I know you're extract brewing, but it isn't hard to do small mashes (1 or 2 lbs) on the stove. And with all the fermentables in the extract, the success of your mash is not critical.

After searching my brain cells a little further, I remember that the best stout I ever made was a simple McMellick's Irish Stout extract/carapils combo. I don't think I added any hops or malt. It was a slam dunk, but boy was it good. Clean and fresh and smooth, no tannic harshness, not overly roasted - just big malt body and creamy cafe au lait finish.

Re: beer thread - 01/16/0504:42 PM

I've only just started to look at this thread - if anyone here lives in NYC, there's a fabulous place to get beer: Bierkraft on 5th Ave in Brooklyn. They do weekly tastings and have an amazing selection of literally hundreds of beers.

Re: beer thread - 01/16/0510:16 PM

Will,

I use some grain with the extract. That one I used, in addition to the extract (a small percentage of which was wheat):
.75 lb. Crystal 120
.5 lb. Carafa II
.5 lb. Chocolate Malt
.25 lb. Special B
.25 lb. Carafoam

I do a very mini-mash on my stove in a smaller, thick-walled stockpot. It hold it's temp pretty well, only loses 2 degrees or so. I will eventually get a setup with a cooler and all, I'm just a bit space constrained at the moment, apartment living being what it is.

Re: beer thread - 01/16/0510:30 PM

I had never used it before myself, it's likened to Carapils, supposed to increase mouthfeel without altering the flavor profile. I thought it might go nicely with the lactose, since I wanted a smooth mouthfeel. Hard to say if it helped since there were a lot of wildcards in thsi brew. But, I was happy with the result, so I'll likely try it again in something ligher and see if I notice the effects.

Edit: That does look like a nice mash tun / sparging system, but I think I'm going to make my own when I go that route. I've got an acetylene torch and a sawzall, among other tools. And I love the engineering side of brewing just as much as the rest of it. Making the equipment is half the fun, making the beer if half the fun, and drinking it is the other half the fun.

Re: beer thread - 01/20/0512:10 AM

Well guys I had the Jenlain Biere de Noel and I must say that I was impressed. It was my first to the style of biere de garde. I was expecting it to be similar to a barleywine or eisbock, but I was wrong. It wasn't that heavy, but quite an enjoyable brew. I remember reading some guy's review saying that the orange was overbearing. I strongly disagree with that review. Everything in this brew screamed balance. A nice touch of malt, enough orange to know it's there, and a bit of hops to finish it off. Not much in terms of a head, but the aroma made up for that. While I won't say that it's the most complex beer I've had, it definitely gets points for its drinkability. The worst thing about this brew is that I have to wait an entire year to get it again.

Re: beer thread - 01/20/0510:20 AM

actually Nick, i seem to recall the Politics thread had this one beat by a fair margin. It's died though, so every post here inches this thread closer and closer....

back on topic to the off topic, does anyone happen to have any good ideas/tips where I might find some lesser known brands of beer in Saskatchewan/Manitoba???? I've pretty much tapped out the imports @ the Sask Liquor stores and wondered if anyone had any good suggestions where I might look for others.

Re: beer thread - 01/20/0511:51 AM

Spock, thanks for the nice review. It made me thirsty.

Nick, no, this thread will never die. Upon some things, it IS possible to focus. Unfortunately, Scott is correct about the amount of traffic and passion in the ill-fated Politics thread of 2004. Better to focus on our shared joys than on our differences, I say.

Scott - Good luck with that!

btw, I drank my last bottle of 2004 Full Sail Wassail the other day. Fabulous beer.

Re: beer thread - 01/20/0502:08 PM

The Salvation Ale from Avery brewing in Colorado was only OK - super strong, nice toffee flavors - but as much like Scottish Ale as Belgian Tripel. They didn't seem to use a Belgian strain of yeast. Reminded me quite a bit of some of my big out-of-control homebrews.

Re: beer thread - 01/23/0505:23 PM

got a new beer i am gonna try today when i go to my buddies to see the patriots-vs-steelers. i just picked it up at the grocery store.

its from the JW Dundee brewery in rochester, NY. its their American Pale Ale. they also had an amber lager, but i wasnt looking for anything dark or heavy. i will for sure let you know how it goes down. and lets hope the steelers can put a whoppin on the pats.!!

EDIT- i just discovered by looking online, that this beer is actually made by the Highfalls Brewing Co, and this particular flavor i got is brand new. it had medium to bland ratings on ratebeer.com, so i aint expecting nothing spectacular.

Re: beer thread - 01/24/0503:29 PM

well, the JW Dundee American Pale Ale from highfalls brewing co, was about what i expected. it had a dark golden color, with very little head. it had mildly smooth tones, with no spectacular flavor of anything. i very tame tasting beer, with ever so slight hints of fruit. but nothing to make your taste buds scream. it had a medium bitter after taste, but not as bad as some other pale ales i have tried. it was almost too easy to drink, and i found myself finishing a 12oz bottle in about 3-4 gulps. this beer is not bad, and not good, just boringly average. on a 1/10 scale, i give it a 5.5... and at $5.29 a sixer, i can spend my money elsewhere.

ya'll need to start drinkin and reviewing some beers. this thread has been trying to die for a few weeks now, and i just cant let it go.

Re: beer thread - 01/24/0503:45 PM

I'll be doing another review when the Westvleteren comes in. I'm also going to see if I can still pick up a bottle of Phantome Hiver, their fall/winter brew. The taste of pumpkin and cloves sounds intriguing.

Re: beer thread - 01/24/0504:21 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/24/0504:50 PM

yes, of those, all i have had is the Duvel. and spock is correct, it has the most unique, exquisite head you have ever seen. its extremely thick, often compared to the meringue on top of pies. it has a flowery aroma, and has a delightfully balanced taste. you get both hints of sweet and pepper at the same time. the strong alcohol content(8.5%) is very evident, but not over powering. i really think this a great beer. you are in for a treat!!

Re: beer thread - 01/24/0506:05 PM

Okay, bigjohn, I'll bite.

Yesterday, purely on impulse, I picked up a sixer of Old Chub Scotish ale from the pioneer of canned craft beer, Oskar Blues in Lyons, Colorado.

It was strong, malty, balanced and tasted very fresh. It was, by a wide margin, the best tasting canned beer I've ever had (displacing Boddington's-with-a-widget). I totally buy-in to the concepts (and descriptions) on their website, and I will be giving them more of my money. I might even stop on the way home and pick up some of their Dale's Pale Ale.

Enthusiastically recommended. But pour it in a glass if you're drinking it at home, willya?

Re: beer thread - 01/25/0509:37 AM

In reply to:

Okay, bigjohn, I'll bite

or drink, as the case may be!!

thanks for the review. i dont believe i have ever heard of that beer, but i will definitely be on the lookout for it. i agree, it is hard to find good beer in cans, so i am curious to see just how good this brew is.

Re: beer thread - 01/25/0504:42 PM

I had a sixer of E.J. Phair Lager over the weekend (actually a fiver - got one left). Strong lager, noticeable alcohol content. Lots of malt body. Huge billowy head - almost over carbonated. Some sediment in the bottle, but the packaging made no mention of it being a live beer. Maybe it was not entirely filtered and the remaining yeast made use of some unused fermentables while in the bottle?

Also grabbed 12ers of Red Tail Ale and Blue Heron Pale Ale from Mendocino Brewing. Both good beers, but I prefer the Red Tail by a fair bit. Sweet, estery amber ale, plenty complex, but still easy to like. The pale is a more typical example of west coast pale ales, well hopped but not overly citrusy.

Re: beer thread - 01/25/0505:07 PM

i actually saw the blue heron ale at my grocery store, so i just might give it a go.

i sure dont want ya'll to feel obligated here to post a review, i just figured you were gettin tired of hearing mine. so, i just put out the call for help. i appreciate you last few contributors. it just makes me sad everytime i see this thread drop down the page..

so, keep drinkin, and let us know what you think. i think its time for me to start trying the IPA's. been putting it off for a while now. time to dive in!!

Re: beer thread - 01/27/0503:30 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/27/0503:46 PM

Well, I'm finally going. Tomorrow night, Adam and I are taking beer-virgin-tastebudded Ken to The Toronado for a guys-only belated-birthday night. (Happy 28th, Ken!) The goal is to not stop trying beers until he finds a kind he likes. I hope they do tasters!

To help make this possible, we're all loading up on pizza beforehand, and none of us is driving.

Re: beer thread - 01/27/0503:53 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/27/0504:55 PM

that sounds like a great time peter

if he has to drink til he finds a good one, start with the dark bocks. those are super heavy, and way strong, so chances are he should have a plenty good buzz once he gets thru those.. after that, a small pile of dog poo should taste good.. hell, he wont know the difference, or even care for that matter!!

Re: beer thread - 01/27/0505:11 PM

That doesn't sound like the right place to start for Ken. From what I've gathered over the years, we need to start not necessarily with a lighter beer, but one which emphasized malts over hops. Big on the midpalate, soft on the aftertaste.

Re: beer thread - 01/27/0505:18 PM

Bingo!

The one beer I can say conclusively that I enjoyed was Horn Dog. That was also how I realized that beers have to be at the right temperature. The first one I had was great. Then I had another a week later that had been in the fridge, and it was horrid! Surprised the hell out of me...

Re: beer thread - 01/27/0505:20 PM

I love barleywines, and not just because they're typically around twice as potent as your average brew. The Toronado is having a barelywine festival next month. We'll have to go back. I know Adam and I are already planning on it.

Re: beer thread - 01/27/0510:18 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/28/0512:32 PM

I know it's not the greatest beer in the world - according to Tom, what's he know? - but my Costco discounted their last 3 cases of Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale to $9.97 per case. I grabbed them all and even managed to get them to discount the last one to $7 - it was missing 3 beers.
I haven't tried it yet, but at that price (and with 6.8% abv) I figured it was a pretty solid bargain.
Everybody on the Axiom forum seems to appreciate a bargain, eh?

Re: beer thread - 01/28/0505:01 PM

Tom, you sarcastic a$$. I advise you to go check your Costco (clearly what I implied).

Actually, I'm having the second one of those Sierra Nevada's right now (finals week - minimum day - hope I don't spill beer on someone's essay). What struck me immediately is the spruce and pine with citrus hop character - not at all in style, is it?

Too bad, too, because the body is excellent, great head, clear as day - a well made beer. The hop character has subsided some with a temp increase and it is definitely drinkable.

I'm envious of you guys in the northwest - all the pubs you link to seem cozy and nice. Ours tend to be large and corporate down here - or small, grimy and dangerous. And the people here aren't quite as warm and friendly either - maybe friendliness is directly inversely proportional to the number of freeways an area has?

Re: beer thread - 01/29/0511:43 AM

Re: beer thread - 01/29/0503:11 PM

Oh. My. God. The Toronado furnished us with a lovely and tasty, if sometimes deafeningly loud, evening. Three rounds is all it took to make all three of us a bit loopy, though Ken was the furthest gone, by far.

I'm feeling a bit lazy at the moment so I won't go ito too much detail on these beers, but all I can say is that after drinking the Unibroue Ed.2004, Adam and I though it would be impossible to beat as a favorite. But then I ordered the Carolus Noel. Oh. My. God! Absolute heaven on the palate. So much going on in this beer.

Re: beer thread - 01/29/0503:31 PM

I can't wait for the barleywine festival now. If just to return to Toronado and their amazing selection of beers.

I'll give a brief ranking of all the beers (written on the back of a coaster from toronado):

#8 - Two Rivers Cider - Ken wimped out on us the last round and went for a cider, so it's last place by default, but it was good for a cider
#7 - Alaska Smoked Porter - The only thing of real interest in this beer is it's finish, which is interesting upon first taste, and bitter after a whole glass of it. Not a terrible beer, but nothing special.
#6 - Ommegang Three Philosophers - Fairly complex flavor, but the finish was a little too hoppy and dry
#5 - Speakeasy Godfather (barleywine) - I had not tried barleywines before this evening, so I really liked the flavor of this one. Maybe a little bitter, but only in comparison to the much better Anchor Foghorn.
#4 - Schreider Aventinus - I only had a small sip of this one, but I really liked it. - A dark wheat beer with a somewhat straightforward but definitely not boring taste. Very satisfying - especially in the huge glass it was served in (I think that's what did Ken in). #3 - Anchor Old Foghorn (barleywine) - Well balanced, fruity, and just plain tasty. This was the agreed upon champ of round number 1.
#2 - Unibroue Edition 2004 - Holy crap this is an awesome beer! Smelled sort of like spiced cider, with a fittingly fruity taste with hints of apple and nutmeg. Great body, great balance of fruit and spice, and just a very easy drinking beer. After we'd finished this off (the king of the first 2 rounds), I told Peter I'd be very surprised if we could top this one. Then along came...

#1 - Het Anker Gouden Carolus Noel - It smelled like a muscat, and one might think it would be overly sweet judging from the smell, but what an amazingly delicious beer! Sweet (but not overly so), with a luxuriously creamy taste. Like Peter said: Heaven on your palate!

Overall a great night out. Evidently Peter has found a place online that sells the Het Anker for $10.40 for a 750mL. Going to have to get a few bottles of that!

Re: beer thread - 01/30/0503:32 PM

I will agree with Adam's post in all conditions. Needless to say, I should NOT have had that cider... Oh my god, that was the worst hangover I've ever had. There's a reason I wasn't around at all yesterday. The Aventinus was really tasty. (it wasn't THAT huge a glass, just a half litre...) BTW, I should mention that I don't drink often, and weigh in the neighborhood of 125 lbs. That excuses me somewhat for being totally wasted on 3 beers, right?

Re: beer thread - 01/30/0503:54 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/30/0504:31 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/30/0505:53 PM

OK, finally I feel like I can start posting here. Before today I had no idea where all the great beers you guys were talking about could actually be purchased. In Ontario (Canada) the government runs all the beer and liquor stores, and practically speaking the beer stores are run by Molsons and Labatts.

So... stopped in the beer store today and was surprised to find that Unibroue products had magically appeared on the shelves. Given the "guns & axioms" thread going on I figured "Trois Pistoles" (strong dark) should be the first purchase.

Just poured one and took a few sips -- WOW. Don't know how it figures in the grand scheme of things and don't pretend to be able to make a critical review, but the complexity of tastes was a real eye-opener. More like a rich sauce or a real fine wine than the kind of taste I'm used to getting in a beer.

Re: beer thread - 01/31/0512:16 AM

Re: beer thread - 01/31/0508:27 AM

Excellent info in this latest barrage of posts here...
The reason I say so is that I was eyeing a bottle of the Edition 2004 in the store yesterday and I thought I'd pick it up later this week. From what I hear I may have to go pick a few bottles up today

What I did pick up was some Stone Ruination, Stone's 8th Anniversary, and Bear Republic XP Ale. Drank the XP (eXceptional Pale) last night and I was impressed although it was not what I was expecting. It was incredibly well balanced, very clean and crisp but with fairly complex flavor. Essentially a mild malt undertone with evident but subdued hop character. A nice golden color, not a particularly noteworthy head but nothing I would take marks off for. Again though, very well balanced and drinkable. A pale ale any lager drinker could appreciate.

Re: beer thread - 01/31/0509:10 AM

peter- thanks for telling me a little about you night of beer and friendship at the tornado. and thanks to adam for the 'rank by taste' chart.

and funny you should mention the ommegang three philosophers. i had asked my wife to get me a proper duvel glass for my birthday(which was saturday), and she got me a whole set of 6 glasses from the ommegang brewery, which can be seen here.. all of the glasses have the markings for the particular beers made from ommegang, one being the three philosophers. i was real happy that she got me the set, but now i am wanting to try the beers, and the website says that they can only ship the beers within state lines(NY). so, unless my liquor store can get some, i might be out of luck. all of the ommegang beers got good reviews on ratebeer.com, and i figure since i got the official glasses, i need to give them a shot. BTW- i will also use the wide-rimmed three philosophers glass to drink my Chimay..

Re: beer thread - 01/31/0509:55 AM

Well, Big John, the Ommegang line is great (IMO), and plentiful here in Brooklyn. Funny, I just bought my own proper duvel glass on Friday! Which Ommegang beers can you get, which can't you? Maybe there's a way we can get you some (legally).

Unlike last week, when I'd had almost all of the beers before, these are all new to me, and so I'll review them after tomorrow night's tasting. In the meantime, anyone here had these beers before? I wonder if they're only available in NY, given the name...

Re: Beer = civlization - 01/31/0502:46 PM

just a sidenote to my new collection of glasses i got for my B-day. two of the 6 had small chips in them, one on the bottom, and one on the top lip. i was surprised cause they were packed VERY well, and they are fairly thick glass. anyway, i called the ommegang company this morning to see how this could be fixed. i wasnt expecting a return on the one that was chipped on the bottom, but i expected them to replace the one that was chipped on the top. the guy i talked with was totally cool, and offered to replace them free of charge. so, my 2 new(and hopefully unchipped) glasses are in route, and should be here in 10-14 days.

it was nice to have a place give great CS. when dealing with axiom, you get used to it.. but, the treatment is not always the same elsewhere. so i give 2 thumbs WAY UP to the ommegang brewing company!!

EDIT- Engine Joe, i asked the guy on the phone if he has any distrubutors in texas, and he said no. the closest dist. he had to texas was arizona or mississippi. so, looks like i wont be getting any ommegang products til i decide to leave the state. unless someone in NY might be able to send me some.. gee, i wish i new someone in NY? man, that would be great......

Re: Beer = civlization - 02/04/0502:38 AM

Re: Beer = civlization - 02/04/0510:08 AM

actually, that rum is the best i have ever had. not that i am a big rum fan or nothing, but it makes bacardi taste like kerosene.

i cant get the Ron Anejo Annervasario here in san angelo, so i had my buddy pick me up these two bottles when he went to san antonio last week. he even bought one for himself, and liked it very much. he also got some Grey Goose vodka, which i have never had, that he is bringing to my Super Bowl party.. so i will get a chance to see what that tastes like to.

Re: Beer = civlization - 02/04/0512:43 PM

Re: Beer = civlization - 03/03/0503:45 PM

BUMP...

ah, it was breaking my heart to let this fall off the charts. are we just beered out guys? tomorrow would have been one full month with no response on this thread. and you call yourselves a bunch of alcoholics.. shameful!!

i am sad to say that i havent been out to the liquor store since i bought all that beer for the super bowl. i have been surviving off a few coors yella bellies, and some keystone light tallboys. i know, i should be in detention..

the grey goose was pretty good. it had a slight citrus twist in it, so we mixed it with sprite, and it was hardly noticable. i even made one pretty strong, and it still tasted very tame. still got a full bottle of anniversario left. saving it for a special occasion, just not sure which one yet.

Re: Beer = civlization - 03/03/0504:07 PM

I bought a kegerator from a friend of a friend.
It's working out pretty well, though I'm concerned about my weight. To help offset the increased beer intake (the first 7.75 gallon keg lasted 9 days) I've given up lunches.
For my wife's b-day I'm going to get her a keg of Lindemann's Framboise - alittle pricey, but what the heck it IS her b-day.

Re: Beer = civlization - 03/03/0504:11 PM

You're a good man, John. I was starting to miss this thread.

Two Mondays ago, my brother and I went to the Toronado in SF and sampled 8 of the available barleywines they had on tap. I have the sheet with all the names on it somewhere at home, but can only remember a couple of names off the top of my head.

Our first round consisted of 4 6-oz. pours, which we shared. The most memorable was Alaskan Big Nugget Barleywine. It rated the 5th best (out of 50 or so brews) according to the pub's judges. It was quite dark, if I remember correctly, and tasted similar to but bolder than their Winter Ale.

The second round consisted of 3 3-oz. pours -- barleywine is potent stuff and we'd already learned out lesson with the 6-oz pours in the first round -- and a full 12-oz glass of Deschutes Mirror Mirror. (Lesson? what lesson?) I couldn't resist ordering that much because I thought I'd never see it again.

The Mirror Mirror was my favorite of this round, and byt the time I was a third of the way through it, both of us were getting pretty silly, and full. I still feel guilty now that I was unable to drink the last couple ounces because it was time to go and I needed some food -- NOW.

All in all, a great experience. Next time, it's 3-oz tastings all the way through.

Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/03/0505:48 PM

Speaking of beer - I was recently out for dinner in rural Manitoba with family friends (Sid, Chess - Boston Pizza in Portage la Prairie) and asked if they had Guinness. The waitress looked at me like I'd just ordered Schellenphlegmenbacher or something. She thought I was jerking her chain by making up a beer, rolled her eyes and went to the bar to see if they had it. She came back sheepishly and said "yes, we have it in cans."

Was kind of weird to be somewhere where the Record Book beer wasn't at least recognized.

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/03/0506:17 PM

on the other side of the spectrum is when i was liberty-portin' it (is that a real phrase? for the purpose of this anecdote it is!)in Plymouth, England and some of the pubs there had Guinness on tap and Guinness Extra Cold. They're exactly the same with the exception of the temperture. This was the only place i've seen this and i'm not sure if this was a result of the high submarine sailor transient population or what. maybe they figgered that american have to drink their beer cold since an unfortunately large percentage of us drink Bud and crap like that! (NOT ME!! NOT ME!! NO HITTING!!)

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/03/0506:40 PM

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/03/0508:10 PM

Just how warm do they serve their ales in England? They're at least "cool" aren't they?

Bigjohn, I didn't touch the CO2 pressure from what it was when it came to me (6-8 lbs/in???). I had some foaming initially with the first keg (Karl Strauss Oktoberfest) so I turned off the CO2 and let the beer flow naturally for a day or two. When output reduced to a trickle I turned the CO2 back on - no problem.
Maybe your uncle just has it cranked too high?

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/03/0508:53 PM

I try not to repeat myself, so I haven't been posting to this thread. Have missed it, though. Thanks for the bump and the contributions. I enjoy this part.

Finally got around to a Unibroue Edition 2004. Lovely.

Had a really great Hacker-Pschorr Fest bier. Surprisingly good, considering it was in a bottle.

Great local beer from Georgetown Brewing in Seattle called Manny's Pale Ale. Not widely distributed, but a super clean and drinkable American Pale.

Still loving Pike XXXXX Stout. Julie made me some ice cream with it the other day (subbed that for the Guinness in the original Emeril recipe). It was good, but we're going to keep working on the recipe.

I'm jealous of Peter and bigwill. Good call on the Framboise. What time should me and the missus stop by? She loves that stuff. Lindemans makes REALLY sweet lambics, but they are wonderfully intense and very approachable.

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/04/0511:50 AM

well not real warm, but not real cold either. kinda like if you pulled a beer out of the fridge and set out on the counter for 30 min. at least the stout was like that, the ales and ciders were a little colder.

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/04/0512:04 PM

In reply to:

out of the fridge and set out on the counter for 30 min

thats what i do with my duvel's, chimay's and corsendonk's. they seem to open with flavor when they have the chance to set up for a while on the counter. it also gives time for the duvel to loose just a bit of head. if you uncork a duvel and start pouring immediately, you are gonna get about 80% head, and that a little excessive..

and my Duvel glass works perfect for enjoying the full flavor. there is a small D etched inside the bottom of the glass, that creates a beautiful, constant stream of bubbles that seem to appear from nowhere. i even got 2 glasses in case i want to share with a friend.. i rarely do..

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/04/0512:12 PM

and thats a good call on your part, it really does open up the flavor. if you pour it real slow down the side (preferable the INside)the head is kep to a minimum, which for a belgian is about 50% of the glass! . over in belgium anytime you get a beer on tap its just barely chilled and most of the time unfiltered. the good thing about being in the navy was the sheer number of awesome beer makin' countries we got to visit! i managed to bring back Palm, Corsendonk, and Grimbergen glasses from over there which my wife happened to break shortly after. hmmm... i wonder if she..?? naahhhhhh. a good place to get them is the gift packs they have near the holidays. i got a hold of a corsendock, Chimay, and a St. Bernardus this season. now i've just gotta clear some room on the shelves for more!!

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/04/0505:10 PM

Being March and all, I wondered if anyone could recommend a Mšrzen they particularly like. It could be the style, but I've never had one that knocked me off my feet. Sudwerk and Gordon Biersch are some local breweries that make the style.

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/04/0509:48 PM

I really like the Gordon Biersch Marzen when it is on tap at their breweries - not so fantastic in the bottle, though. I'm trying to think of a notable German Ur-Marzen, but I can't remember any specific names. Sounds like a job for the Tominator!

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/07/0503:59 AM

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/12/0507:46 PM

i have been up since 8 this morning catching up on yardwork that was long overdue.. my wife kept shuttling me water all day, and i told her i was gonna go buy some 'good' beer when i got done!! she says, "oh, the wine beer?" she calls it that cause she thinks its cute and all in the bottle with the cork. blah, what do women know anyway.

went to the liquor store, got a shower, ate a sandwich, and now i am ready to bust one open. i bought more than i should have, but i was thirsty, what else can i say.

5 bottles of Duvel
2 bottles of Chimay Red
1 bottle of Chimay Blue
1 bottle of Corsendonk Abbey Brown Ale
and then i got some new ones that i will post a review of later.
1 bottle of Rogue Santas Private Reserve Ale from the Oregon brewing co.
then, i got Franziskaner Hefe-Weisse(red-foil), and the same in a Dunkel version(gold-foil).

i had been told the regular weisse red foil was pretty good beer, and the dunkel was just sitting next to it in the cooler, so i figured what the hell?

i was goona get one of the arrogant bastard brands, but they were out. i swear, our liquor store can be so hit-or-miss sometimes.

anyway, got plenty of beer stocked up for the next couple of weeks. gonna go pop open a duvel right now..

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/13/0504:14 PM

OK, had the Franziskaner Hefe-Weisse Dunkel(gold-foil).

i had no real expectations on this beer cause i bought it on a whim. it had a strong fruity flavor upon opening, and poured nice and thick. in the glass, the beer is very dark, almost cloudy, and the head is full and silky. the aroma still lingered kinda fruity, with subtle hints of banana and cloves. the flavor was mild, not very strong, with no real bite or punch. it was a good overall flavor, but nothing that really stood out. not too malty, and the aftertaste was very pleasant, with a slight hint of cinnamon on the end. i liked the way the silky head would cling to the glass after a drink, then slowly slide back to the bottom.

overall, a good but not great beer. i think i had set the bar too high. this dunkel was a bit too mild, and never achieved the 'bang' i was wanting. creamy and malty, with a great little pinch of flavor at the end.. i give it a 7 out of 10.

Re: Beer. Dark, rich and tasty. - 03/15/0511:51 AM

upon opening, this beer didnt have the strong, fruity aroma as the Dunkel. it pours slightly watery, not thick, and a nice slightly cloudy golden color. if it wernt for the slight cloudiness, i would almost think this was a golden ale. very rich in color. head was very minimal, and not as silky as the Dunkel, and decipated fast. flavor had same hints of banana and citrus, but once again, not as strong as the Dunkel. there was a hint of sweet & tart, like when you smell a fresh cut lemon. not over bearing at all, but definitely evident. this beer also seemed lighter on the palate, less creamy. smooth aftertaste, with a pinch of the wheat flavor appearing at the end.

overall, decent beer. i think a fair companion to the Dunkel. i would rate them almost the same, but i have a preference to the dark beers, so this one gets 6.5 out of 10. the low alcohol content(5.5%), and the price($2 bucks for a 16oz bottle), make this a beer that probably will not make my normal rotation. it has a good taste, but not good enough to warrant its price. and if i did have to choose one, i would take the Dunkel anyway.. i just like the dark beers more!!

Need some beer advice. - 03/15/0512:04 PM

I'm very picky about two things. The beer I like and the coffee I like.
I'm sure many of you are not fans of XXX amber, but it is MY favorite, and is hard to get sometimes. Most stores carry the XXX lager (green bottle) but not the amber.
What would be a good alternative or simular to XXX amber?
If I have to have a beer and they dont have the amber, I usually get Negro Modello, but sometimes the local stores dont have that either.
Just looking to try some simular beers.

Re: Need some beer advice. - 03/15/0512:53 PM

I do like Chimay, its just not something I want to sit down and drink alot of. Also isnt it supposed to be served at room temp.?
As far as Shiner goes, I use to drink it all the time, but somewhere along the line I think they changed it. That or my tastes just changed.
I actually dont mind a Bud every now and then and would probably buy it more often, but it gives me BAD and I mean BAD GAS. One Bud could fuel my car for two days. So I only drink it if I'm desperate and I dont have to be around anyone for a couple of days.

Re: Need some beer advice. - 03/16/0512:10 AM

Re: Need some beer advice. - 03/16/0512:47 AM

I've had Anchor Steam also, and although not bad, to me it has a bitter finish that I dont care for much. XXX Amber in an ice cold mug has the perfect thickness, lots of flavor (kind of a nutty taste), and a smooth finish.
Looking for something along those lines.

Re: Need some beer advice. - 03/16/0501:10 AM

Re: Need some beer advice. - 03/17/0509:58 PM

I do believe he was referring to taht beer, pmb. There was an unremarkable XXXX from Australia (Cattlemaine?) imported to the states some years ago, and we all know what XXX stands for, so...
Side note: just ordered that keg of Lindemans for the old lady's b-day. I got her toilet seats for Xmas (they were very fancy! ). Do you think she'll appreciate a keg of beer?

Re: Need some beer advice. - 03/17/0510:01 PM

Re: Need some beer advice. - 03/17/0511:54 PM

Sorry I did get a little over zealous with the Xs. XX amber, just had a few in a frosty mug. Mmmmmmm Mmmmmmm.
I guess XXX was just wishful thinking, but would be a good name for a beer.
XXX kinky beer.

Re: Need some beer advice. - 03/18/0506:08 AM

Re: beer thread - 03/20/0510:38 PM

Well, the keg of Lindemann's Framboise has been tapped. Too much of a good thing, IMO, but the old lady sure is tickled pink.
Pics - of framboise in a 2L antique blown-glass German master pouring stein - if you ask nicely.

Re: beer thread - 03/23/0509:43 AM

Re: beer thread - 03/23/0510:30 AM

I didn't realize just how much raspberry is in it until we got this keg. It has so many berries it's almost fibrous.
I had attempted to homebrew a reasonable facsimilie on a number of occasions, but only used 3-4# of berries for 10 gallons of beer. I see now that that was ridiculous. Made some decent rasberry hefeweizen, though.

Re: beer thread - 03/23/0511:51 AM

Re: beer thread - 03/24/0510:01 AM

Tom, the wife is happy - surprisingly so for a woman who received a keg of beer for her b-day. I've had a couple glasses of the Lindemann's, but like you, one glass is about all my taste buds can handle. As soon as that keg is dust I'll be replacing it with the local brewpub's pale ale.
BTW, I ended up buying that Front Avenue grill from CostCo. Thanks again for the info you sent me.

Re: beer thread - 03/24/0510:24 AM

i finally drank the bottle of Rogue Santas Private Reserve Ale last night. thought i might get the review in.

first, let me start by saying that i have come to the conclusion, that i just dont like the speciality winter ales. this is the third i have tried, and it tasted very similar to the other two. the Rogue was a very dark, ruby red cloudy color. head was average, but left a nice lacey trail on the glass. it smelled malty, looked malty, tasted malty, and had a malty finish. throw in a good hint of hops, plus some citrus and 'woodsy' flavors, and you get the idea. i thought it had a bitter finish(just like the other winter ales), and left a stale taste in my mouth. the beer was very straight forward, bold and aggressive flavors, daring you to like them or not. i would have to say i did not..

like i was saying, the Rogue Santas Reserve falls in the same pile as the other winter speciality beers. they all have an overall flavor that i just dont care for. i did like it a little more than the pyramid snowcap ale, but didnt like it no where near enough to buy it again. i give the Rogue Santas Reserve a 4.5 out of 10. if you tend to like the winter ales, then give this a shot, but i think its an overall style of beer that i just dont find appealing.

Re: beer thread - 03/24/0506:23 PM

bigjohn, I don't care for those winter warmers much either - especially the heavily hopped west coast styles.
I AM surprised that you didn't rate higher the dunkel weisse you had a while back. I really suggest you give those subtle German styles (export pilsener not being one) a more extended sampling.
They're not heavily hopped, they don't have wild yeasty flavors or exotic ingredients so you will be inclined to say they are bland; but, if you focus the attention of your palette on the purity of the malt flavors and the delicacy of the hop bitterness/aroma I really think you'll come to appreciate the subtle differences between those old world beers and our new world imitations.
Regardless, we enlightened beer intellectuals are looking for "nuance", right?

Re: beer thread - 03/24/0507:51 PM

Well, sometimes I'm just thirsty

Well put, bigwill. Except that part about "imitations"; I think you can make a pretty good case that there are several meaningful innovations or new styles developed in the new world. Now, you may not *enjoy* all of them, but I'd contend that those West Coast IPA's and Barleywines, Steam Beer, Pre-Prohibition Pilsner, et. al. are distinctly and deliberately different styles than those traditionally brewed in Europe, and are not inherently "worse".

But yeah, I'll take a good Munich Helles any time.

I've had bad luck with bottled versions of the Northwest Winter Warmers. The draught versions seem to be much more reliable. I still like Jubelale a lot, but like bigjohn, I don't care if I ever drink another Snowcap from a bottle. Any of that style beer that you would be drinking NOW would have been brewed about last October, so keep that in mind, too. Most beer doesn't age very gracefully, and I perceive that style as being particularly susceptible to oxidization.

Geez, with all this talk about "nuance" and being nice to people about non-Axiom speakers and stuff, pretty soon we're going to be accused of being "sensitive" or something.

I have to go home and drink beer right now. Maybe use some power tools, too.

It was interesting to discover that the Belgian Christmas brews tend to be a bit more spicy and less on the sweet side. I just hate that I have to wait till the end of the year to get these again.

Anyway, I'll admit I've been procrastinating this particular review lately. I felt that one bottle wasn't enough to award this one "the favorite brew" title, but after a second one the following weekend, IT WAS. So I gladly award FantŰme Hiver my favorite brew so far. It definitely had the best and most complex aroma and a little bit of everything to keep me guessing what I liked so much about it. There was a touch of sour in the finish that reminded me of the Flemish sour ales, but not as dominant or pronounced. The finish was also a touch silky and dry. I remembered the FantŰme de NoŽl was spicy, but the Hiver had a lot more in the mix. Clove, pumpkin, and nutmeg were the only spices I could pick out and none of them overpowered the others. The alcohol really was more of an afterthought in the taste which is always nice. My first glass was with a steak and the second was with dark chocolate. The great thing about the dark chocolate is that is made me more aware of the sour finish. I think the Hiver would go best with duck or lamb (wow that makes my mouth water just thinking about it). I just hope that my local store can get more of the FantŰme brews because if they're all of this quality, then I may have also found my favorite brewery. So if you guys have access to the FantŰme brews, by all means give them a try. The local store has one Hiver left and it's all mine MINE!! MINE!!!

Re: beer thread - 03/25/0509:31 AM

bigwill- well, of those two, i definitely like the dunkel much better. like i said, i guess i just have a soft spot for the dark beers. and it really wasnt a case of not liking them, it was just a matter of economics. i didnt find either of them good enough to warrant $2 bucks for a 16oz bottle. but i agree with you on the mild flavors. i think i had my mind all geared up to get that kick of flavors that i have become used to in tasting all these new beers, and both of them were tame by comparison. but, with that sentence i broke the first cardinal rule of beer tasting, never compare one to another. rate it on its own merits. see, i wouldnt be any good at this professionally. i would be open to try more of these traditional Germans, got any suggestions? maybe a good hefe-weisse?

spock- glad you were able to find some good winters for yourself. its kinda funny, you mentioned the Hivel as having the spicyness, and with all the various flavors keeping you guessing.. thats exactly what i dont like about the winter beers. i find the spicyness to be distracting, and the bombardment of the various other flavors tends to just be too much for me. its just not my cup of tea.. but, if thats your thing, then thats cool. to each our own, right? but it does kinda stink for you that you can only get them 3-4 months out of the year.

i was looking last night, and i still got 3 Duvels and 2 Chimays left in the fridge. i guess i havent been as thirsty as i thought. i gotta get to drinkin!

Re: beer thread - 03/27/0511:13 AM

Tom, of you're right about my use of the word "imitations". "Bastardizations" would have been far more appropriate. Seriously, there are plenty of great North American craft beers, but there as many or more that are not very good pretenders. Some coloring malts and/or a big hop presence doesn't make a beer great all by itself.
I particularly love all the beers I have tried from Kulmbach in Germany (Kulmbacher Reichelbrau, Kulmbacher Pils, EKU, etc...). Whether it's the malt, the water, the brewers' unique processes, or yeast, or whatever, those beers are unique.

Re: beer thread - 03/30/0504:15 PM

I know it's the beer thread, but I found an inexpensive new tequilla that is really good - fantastic for the price. I'm a little reluctant to tell everyone, as it may one day result in higher prices on the stuff, but I feel guilty not sharing.
It's called "Tequilla Mico". Currently $20 for a 1.75L bottle. While it is not 100% blue agave it is fat, smooth and full of agave flavors (for a reposado/anejo) like any good pure agave tequilla. Very satisfying. The difference between it and Patron is not at all like the difference between straight and blended (neutral grain spirit)whiskeys.
In a side by side comparison with conventional Jose (yuk!) the tequilla Mico won by a landslide.
For you brand-conscious folks, apparently it is made by the same folks who blend Patron.

Re: beer thread - 03/30/0505:05 PM

patron is one of, if not THE best tequila i have ever tasted. i cant stand cuervo, cuervo gold, or the cuervo 1800.. it all stinks..

thanks for the tip, i will look for the Mico.

and funny you mention this.. one of my disc golf buddies told me yesterday that he got this tequila that he wanted me to try. i cant remember the exact name, but it was something like 'teqe almondine'. he said he has never seen it here, but bought several bottles of it while skiing in colorado this winter. he said it is only 60 proof, and has an almond flavor to it. he said mix it half/half with a glass of 7-up, and it is the best mixed drink he has ever had.. now thats a BIG statement.

Re: beer thread - 03/30/0507:50 PM

pmb, the BevMo by my work carries it for 19.99 - MSRP is 47.99 they say! Take that with a grain of salt, you know how stores like BevMo are.

bigjohn, there are many brands of that almond tequilla. But everyone that I have tried all tasted like almond extract/cough syrup. If you like Southern Comfort more than Wild Turkey then it might be for you.

Re: beer thread - 03/31/0508:18 AM

I will have to check it out, because that is quite a good price. I generally get Sauza Hornitos, it's ~$25 a fifth and 100% agave. But when you're buying tequila for an event, it's impractical, especially when people just put it in margaritas or something anyway.

Re: beer thread - 03/31/0505:43 PM

We have no BevMo in the Evergreen State. Stupid state-run monopoly liquor stores.

btw, I recently had a small but illuminating showdown between several doppelbocks on a couple of different occasions. We compared Ayinger Celebrator, Paulaner Salvator and Spaten Optimator. I have neither the time nor gumption to give you full tasting notes (a la bigjohn, to whom I apologize for my lack of clarity and description). However, to my surprise, I much preferred the Spaten for its overall balance, depth and complexity. I always knew it was a lovely beer, but had not compared it critically to the other two before.

Thanks for the Tequila tip!

Several of you know that I have reduced my LDL cholesterol by ~40 points over the last two years through what I have come to refer to as the Bourbon and Oatmeal diet. Oh sure, I try to say "no" to the yummy fats and espouse portion control, but the core tenets remain Snoqualmie Falls Oatmeal (with craisins and 2%) for breakfast and bourbon for dessert (after dinner, not after breakfast). Never underestimate the power of mental health.

Anyway, in an ultimately misguided quest for variety, I have been trying to find an affordable bourbon I like as well as Maker's Mark. I recently thoroughly auditioned Jim Beam black label and something called 1492 (from the same distillery that makes Elijah Craig and Evan Williams brands). To me, neither came close to Maker's Mark.

Re: beer thread - 03/31/0511:02 PM

Re: beer thread - 04/01/0508:35 AM

I would have to say that I prefer the Optimator as well. It was months ago, but I did a similar test rather spontaneously. I was in a Philly bar with a good selection, picked a category and started drinking down the list. I should do that more often

Re: beer thread - 04/01/0511:38 PM

Re: beer thread - 04/05/0507:59 PM

I had lunch at a new Indian buffet place ($6.99, all you can eat) a couple blocks from my office today. The food was excellent, but this is the beer thread, right? They have about 100 different bottled import beers available there: German, English, Belgian, Canadian ... it's all there. Sadly, I was not able to have any (I only drink AFTER work), but I shall return.

Re: beer thread - 04/05/0509:57 PM

Re: beer thread - 04/05/0511:28 PM

I believe the latter beer is plentiful around here. I'll have to give it another try (it's been many, many years since I had one). If you can find the Anderson Valley (Andersonville?) Barney Flats Oatmeal Stout up there, it is an excellent beer as well, IMO.

Re: beer thread - 04/06/0509:27 AM

indian buffet, sounds delicious. i would have to say i dont think i have ever had 'authentic' indian food. but, i know its supposed to be spicy, so that works well with me.

we went and ate at our favorite local mexican restaurant last night(Chilango's), and they had banners up advertising their summer beer specials. every tuesday night, all summer, is $1 dollar any beer. including corona, bohemia, carta blanca, tecate, dos equis, modelo, and pacifico. so, looks like i know where i might be spending my tuesday evenings.

Re: beer thread - 04/07/0510:00 PM

I'm still working on that last case of Sierra Nevada Celebration ale while the old lady takes her own sweet time finishing that keg of framboise. Someone also gave me a case of the Sam Adams winter brews (minus the Cranberry Lambic which I insisted she keep for herself). So far, the Holiday Porter and Winter Lager are real standouts - excellent beers by any measure. Probably a little older than Tom would prefer, but I notice no oxidation. If you see them clearanced, I'd grab 'em.

Re: beer thread - 04/08/0505:15 PM

yeah the Flying Dog is some good stuff. my local store carries a 12-pack sampler of their's that i get all the time as my "just sittin' around" but not quite "session" beer. they do have butt-ugly labels though, i have to agree! their "In Heat Wheat" hefeweizen is pretty tasty too.

Re: beer thread - 04/15/0509:14 PM

Re: beer thread - 04/16/0505:29 PM

I watch the World Poker tour on the Travel Channel religously - I even tape it. The other shows - especially the celebrity games - aren't nearly as good.
I love poker. Unfortunately I only get to play about once or twice a month. Always small stakes too.
Maybe we should have a hold 'em tournament down at 2x6's new beach mansion?

Re: beer thread - 04/18/0503:57 PM

POKER-POKER-POKER-POKER.
we have a regular friday night game, and then we also try and get together on sunday afternoon to play.. but the sunday game will stop once football season gets here, and the friday game will move to saturday night so we can go to high school games. some of the guys have mentioned wanting to get a game going during the week(tue or wed), but i dont know how well that will go over with the wife.

we have a good bunch of guys that play every week. varies from 8-11, depending on who is in the doghouse or not. we are low stakes $10-$20 a hand. that way, it aint breaking you if you lose, and if you win, its enough to at least fill the truck up with gas. we are pretty aggressive at raising the blinds, so games are usually done within 3 hours. that way we can try and get 2 games in a night.

i have been trying to get on with different tables cause i am geting tired of playing with the same people every week. we all know each other too well, and we are not improving our game any. i played at a new table this past friday, and got heads up with a guy, and he drew a king on the river to beat my jacks. it would have been a $90 dollar pot, oh well, maybe next time.

BTW- i took some chimay to drink while i played.. i didnt want to risk breaking a glass, so i used a 16oz plastic solo cup.... yuck... it tasted awful. after that, i am convinced what you drink from makes a huge difference.

Re: beer thread - 04/20/0507:34 PM

Re: beer thread - 04/20/0508:29 PM

I think this is just riding on the tails of "redbull and vodka" really. There've been beers around with coffee additions for quite a while, although I'm not sure what the caffeine levels would get up to in them. I was just talking at lunch today with a friend about making a coffee stout in the near future, and trying to somehow jack up the coffee addition to have some significant presence. I think that's still more like traditional beer though than... this, this thing you've linked....

Re: beer thread - 04/21/0509:04 AM

Re: beer thread - 04/21/0512:27 PM

That would not surprise me at all.

Long Live the Beer Thread.

I've been enjoying Big Sky Crystal ale from a brewery by the same name in Missoula, MT. It's lawnmower beer, but tasty, crisp and clean. Support your local brewer and all that. They make the more widely distributed Moose Drool Brown Ale, which is a very credible beer, but I typically only drink it if the other alternatives are Budmilloors. If you like Fat Tire, you'll like Moose Drool. It has color and flavor, but it's not terribly rich or challenging.

They also distribute some beer in a nifty alumabottle thing. Kind of freaky.

Re: beer thread - 04/22/0509:14 AM

cant get big sky in texas yet.. interested in trying though.. looks like a nice alcohol content on the moose drool.

i had a bottle of Chimay blue last night with dinner. i pan seared some cayenne rubbed butterfly pork loins, and drizzled with a brown sugar rum sauce. mashed sweet potatos, and some broiled squash, sprinkled with red pepper flakes and olive oil. VERY tasty. the Chimays complex flavors were a great companion to the sweet and spicy flavors on my plate. i sure might have to do this one again..

i have found that the Chimays go very well with food, but i prefer the Duvel's on their own. for some reason my taste buds dont like the Duvel's golden ale with food. is this odd? have y'all had similar experiences.. i would be interested to know which beer/food combos y'all think are really good..?

Re: beer thread - 04/22/0511:52 AM

Re: beer thread - 04/22/0512:01 PM

I had some Mackeson Triple Stout with mwc yesterday. It's a very tasty "milk stout" -- brewed with lactose. It's the second milk stout I've tried and I must say I really enjoy the style. This one is very dark with a light brown head, smoky flavors, slightly bitter, slightly sweet. Very well balanced and hearty.

Re: beer thread - 04/22/0512:28 PM

my own cooking show...? heck, I WISH!!!

i probably do 80% of the cooking at my house. shannon, bless her heart, had a mom that NEVER cooked, so she was just never exposed to it very much as a child.. me, on the other hand, my mom was the classic HUGE meal, everyone at the table, and lets eat. so, it is just second nature for me to cook. and it sure helps the fact, that i really LOVE to cook. oh yea, and i really LOVE to EAT too.... plus, shannon teaches night classes at the college three nights a week, so me and the boys are usually on our own for dinner. and i am too cheap to buy the 'instant' food from the grocers freezer. that pre-made, pre-packaged stuff; most of it just dont taste good to me, and it costs WAY too much.

in the past few years, i have really gotten into making sauces. i got a 'sauce' recipe book a while back, so i try different ones all the time. you would be amazed how different you can make a meal taste, just by making a simple sauce. and since most are wine or alcohol based, thats just an added bonus. that brown sugar rum sauce i made last night goes great with pork. its one of my favorites.

i am also looking forward for summer to get here full swing.. i like to BBQ on weekends, and then eat the leftovers thru the rest of the week. that way, all i have to do is worry bout vegetables on a nightly basis.

ken- you need to come on down buddy!! i seen the pics that dennis posted.. you could use a little 'meat on your bones'.. i will fatten you up nice.

peter- i have an aversion to milk based alcohol products. like baileys creme, or tequila rose.... ugh.. or bulldogs.. eck.. i cant handle them. so, i dont think i would like that beer at all.. but, glad you liked it!! and i hope you had a good time while in dallas.

Re: beer thread - 04/22/0512:31 PM

bigjohn, it's not milk-based and has no absolutely no milk flavor. If anything, it has a slightly milky texture or 'mouthfeel'. Lactose is just milk sugar and doesn't taste like milk. If you can find the beer, give it a shot.

Re: beer thread - 04/25/0509:56 AM

WOW...Chimay was really popular this weekend. To celibrate my new house, I opened my bottle of Chimay Red. It was my first experiment with aged brews so I was saving it for an occation such as this. It was aged for nearly 6 months at nearly 45 degrees. The results were terrific. I remembered that a fresh bottle of Chimay Red is a touch bright and bit dry. The aged bottle was very mellow, the sweet tastes were more present, and the alcohol was extremely faint. The other thing was a slight almost vanilla flavor that came through. *YUMMY* I'm going to pick up a Chimay Blue the next time and see how it turns out. I've read that it ages the best. Speaking of the Blue, you should try it with duck. *drools*

Peter, thanks for the review of Mackeson Triple Stout. I've been curious about that one for a while now. I'll pick some up soon.

Re: beer thread - 04/25/0511:59 AM

That seems to support my earlier assertion that live beers need to be layed up in the frig for awhile to cement the yeast pack at the bottom. I don't know if 6 mos is necessary, but I always had good results after 2 weeks with my homebrews.
And the keg from hell, the one that would not die, that Lindemanns is finally dust. I replaced it Saturday with a beautiful, intriguing pale ale from my local brewpub. Absolutely sensational stuff. So full of yeasty esters, huge hop nose (Fuggles?), mildly bitter, quaffable but not cloying. The brewer should be proud of this one.
It will probably be gone well before you visit, Tom, but maybe the next batch will be similarly good.

Re: beer thread - 04/25/0512:33 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/02/0509:17 AM

**BUMP**

i just found this out last night, so i was excited to tell someone. nedless to say, my wife was less than excited about it.

we were hangin at the lake last night, and one of my buddies asked if i had seen the "beer store" around the corner from my house.. it came as a surprise to me, cause i like to think i am on the cusp of beer stylings and lifestyles, here in the mecca of west texas..

apparently, this new store just opened last week, and they havent even been advertising yet. my buddy said they have a HUGE assortment of foreign, and micro brew beers that arent avail anywhere else in town. plus, he said you can mix-and-match 6 packs of any kind of beer for $7.99. i figure thats only $1.33 a bottle, so thats not bad prices at all. he said the regular 6 packs run about $5.99-$6.99.

i am gonna swing by there after work today, and see what they have avail. hopefully, they might have some of the beers that have been mentioned on here, that i have never had the opportunity to get before. think i will start with a mix-and-match, and see if i get some good ones. i will let you know how it goes..

Re: beer thread - 05/03/0510:22 AM

OK- got my mix-and-match six pack last night. went and shared them with a friend, and we both had similar findings on what we did or didnt like. quick review included for each..

Carlsberg Elephant- 7.2% alcohol.. sweet malt liquor, with pronounced skunky smell.. seemed a definite Heineken knock-off to me. poured with nearly no head, and was a light gold color. not impressive at all. barely average, even if you were real thirsty..4 out of 10.

Full Sail Pale Ale- 5.4% alcohol. pleasant sweet smell, but not fruity. pours a clear amber, with light head and low carbonation. easy hoppy taste, with slight bitterness. classic 'pale ale' dryness at the end, but not to overbearing. good, but not spectacular. will drink again. 6 out of 10.

Spaten Optimator- 7.2% alcohol. poured a dark brown, almost purple in the light, with hardly any head at all. TONS or aroma, and loads of flavors. caramel, nuts, raisin.. they are all there, blended very well. powerful flavors, but well done with sweet finish. 2nd best of the night, 7 out of 10. give this one a shot!

Samuel Adams Cherry Wheat- 5.2% alcohol. dark golden color with good carbonation. sweet aroma, like cough syrup. hints of amaretto, and light hops. but its all overpowered by the cherry flavor. WAY to sweet in my opinion, almost seemed like a beer flavored wine. and everytime i would bring it to my mouth, i got the sense i was drinking a DR Pepper. not my cup of tea, but worth a shot if you happen to like fruit based beers.. i dont.. 4.5 out of 10.

and best of the night..
New Belgium Trippel made in ft collins, co.- 7.8% alcohol. awesome color, almost a neon orange or copper in the light. sweet fruit aroma of banana and grapes. the strength of this beer is VERY evident. complex flavors of cloves and pepper. spicy hops mix well with subtle sweetness. complex but balanced. bold but not overbearing. very hearty and tasty throughout. slight smokey finish, a meal in a bottle. best of the night!! 7.5 out of 10!! will get some more this weekend.

great little store, just up the street from my house. only been open a few weeks, but owner said word of mouth is spreading. good selection of beers and wines. nice cigar humidor also. cant wait for my next mix-and-match sixer!!

Re: beer thread - 05/03/0511:46 AM

Re: beer thread - 05/03/0504:25 PM

bigjohn, congrats on the new beer store. I can't disagree with you on any of those, but you may have been a little harsh on your evaluation of the Elephant. It isn't a great beer but it ain't all that bad. I remember downing a sixer of those on the North Shore of Oahu and getting a little shaky. They're best icy cold, of course. Other Danish beers (including Carlsberg) are much better, though.
I'm surprised that the German beer had no head. Could have been your glass. Sometimes if your glass is dirty, oily or soapy it will prevent head retention.
I think you're only supposed to rinse your beer glasses most of the time - not wash them with soap. And don't dry them with a towel. Just shake it dry.

Re: beer thread - 05/03/0504:33 PM

bigjohn, I love your beer reviews. Thank you very much for taking the time to compose such wonderful descriptions.

I'd agree with bigwill on both counts. The Carlsberg you had was CLEARLY not well-handled; it's not supposed to be skunky - that perception is a clear indication that the beer is light struck (been sitting around under flourescents or elsewhere too long). At its best, that is a wonderfully clean and subtle beer.

In addition to bigwill's comments about glassware, is it possible that you were pouring the Optimator too cold?

Re: beer thread - 05/03/0505:09 PM

i agree with both of y'all on the head situation.. as a whole, none of the beers had particularly impressive heads. we were using some mid-size wine glasses, cause we had nothing else. after each tasting, we would just run water in it, swirl it around, dump it out, and pour in the next beer. i do feel that had an affect on the beers not coming to full potential on their heads, but i certainly didnt use that as a large deciding factor for their overall rating.

and if you both say the elephant should be better, i will believe you.. but, upon opening, there was a STRONG skunky smell, and the flavor was mild and somewhat bland. i must have got a bad handled batch, cause i would say it was one of the least favorites of the night. my buddy thought so also.

we let all the beers sit up on the counter for about 20 minutes before we started to open them.. i would say the temps were between 40F-50F. i have started doing this with my chimays and duvels also. flavor opens up once they have been sitting out for a while.. at least i think so..

i will definitely try a different flavor from the New Belgium Co. that trippel was WAY good, i dug it the most! i think they had about 3-4 different kinds from New Belgium, so i have my work cut out for me.

they did have a request list, and the owner said he would make real efforts to try and get the beers that people want to try. i requested for him to get the Rochefort 6,8,or 10. and also some of the beers made by the ommegang brewery in new york. hopefully, he can come thru for me. i am gonna go back thru the 46 some odd pages of this thread, and write down some others that ya'll have mentioned. never hurts to try, right??

i think i will mix-and-match some more this weekend. i will let ya know how those turn out.

Re: beer thread - 05/04/0512:10 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/11/0510:57 AM

i had the pleasure last night of trying ALL of the beers offered by the New Belgium Brewing Co. i did a mix-and-match, and grabbed one of each they had avail. wont go into lots of detail, but across the board, all the beers were of above average quality and taste, and i would drink all of them again.

New Belgium Trippel- as mentioned before.. great!! had to have another.
New Belgium Fat Tire- hearty, like a fat loaf of toasted rye bread. pleasing and delicious.
New Belgium Sunshine Wheat- light, golden, sweet, and fruity. very refreshing and no heavyiness.
New Belgium Blue Paddle Pilsner- very layed flavors. hoppy, much different than the others.
New Belgium 1554 Black Ale- WHOA! stand back on this one fellas. super dark, big head. thick, aggressive, bold. not for the weak, and ends with the standard suprising dryness of an ale. this one is for dinner, NOT a backyard guzzler..
New Belgium Loft- tart and citrusy. light and silky. easy drinker and very refreshing.

i cant say enough about all of these.. this brewery definitely has its stuff together. all of these were great, some just greater than others. i would buy ALL of them again, depending on the situation.

OK, thats all.. i think i will try a sixer of an asian mix next time.. they have many to choose from.

Re: beer thread - 05/11/0506:49 PM

Wow...thanks John, now I'm really thirsty. On a side note, I'll be in Austin the weekend of June 3 so I'm going to search for all of the great American microbrews that I can't get in Louisiana. I've had Fat Tire on tap a few times over the years and "yum" is the first word that comes to mind. So guys, what should I look for and where would be a good place to check? I know that I'm going to look for the folowing:

Plus I'll be watching for any of the Belgians that I've missed out on and any of the brews by the Dogfish Head brewery. Oh yeah, and I'm going to see Dredg for the first time. Should be a fun weekend with good music and great brews.

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0503:45 PM

had a few bombers of some new flavors last night.

Stone India Pale Ale- 6.9% alcohol. i have found that i just dont like the flavors of most pale ale's. this one was no different. it pours a rich orange color, with a nice creamy head. fruity and herbal aroma, with strong hopps. thick texture, but not too thick. very vivid flavors through out, but hint of bitterness over the whole thing. alcohol kicks in on the swallow, with the classic pale ale dryness at the end. a bold and hearty drink, that is just not my cup of tea. but, for those who prefer IPA's, this one might be right up your alley. 5.5 out of 10.

Rogue Shakespeare Stout- 6% alcohol. my first swary into a true stout.. and as above, i just dont think i am a fan of this type of beer. it pours thick and black, non-transparent with a slight creamy brown head. much busyness in the aroma. smoke, chocolate, coffee, and nuts. and flavor much the same. get an initial sweetness, then aggressivly bitter coffee and a bold smokey aftertaste. the beer had a thick creamy texture, almost like a milkshake thats melting. once again, not my cup of tea. but, for those who like stouts, might be worth your time. just not a favorite of mine.. 5 out of 10.

this was my first time to get 2 beers that i didnt really care for. i certainly wouldnt call them bad, just not the type of flavors i prefer. both were a little too bold for me, and seemed too busy with flavors. and the pale ale's have that bitter dryness at the end that give me 'beer face'. i hope to get some more later in the week and hope for the best.

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0503:55 PM

Excellent descriptions as always, bigjohn.

Those are both very highly hopped beers. I suspect it is not only the quantity but also the variety of hops that you don't care for. Cascade / Chinook / Columbus varieties impart a particularly grapefruity or citrusy flavor that some people just don't love.

As for the Rogue, I love it. You should have tried it as an accompaniment to some nice vanilla ice cream.

For my own part, I had a Unibroue Edition 2004 on Sunday. I will tell you in all seriousness that it completely saved my weekend. Expensive and worth every penny.

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0504:04 PM

In reply to:

some nice vanilla ice cream

see... i would NEVER think to pair those together.

i was kinda cautious to speak badly of these beers, cause i have heard people say nothing but good things about them, which is why i tried them in the forst place.. but for me, there overall flavor and balance are not appealing to my palate. i tend to prefer beers that have a strong flavor, but headed in one direction. when i get the beers that have layers and layers of bold flavors fighting each other for space, i tend to find them too busy, and dont like the conclusion.

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0504:09 PM

bigjohn, as Tom indicated I'm betting you don't like the citrusy hops in so many west coast ales. I don't either. I wouldn't write off all "pale ales" though. How about Bass? Not really "pale" but the bottle says it is.

Tom, hate to disappoint you, but I just installed a 15.5 gal keg of Dos Equis Lager in the kegerator. It will likely still be there by the time you visit. In my defense, we had some hot weather for a while and it seemed an economical and refreshing choice.

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0506:17 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/17/0506:23 PM

I think Dos Equis on draught is the best Vienna Lager in North America. Honest. I find the bottled version to be uniformly stale and lifeless, but oooh baby, give me that live one any day.

Yes, Peter, I will have a brief sojourn to Surfin, USA next month. Primarily business, but the opportunity to beer with bigwill is clearly the main draw; I don't willingly get on airplanes without extreme reward. I'll also be taking in a Padres game with my brothers-in-law. With luck, perhaps I'll also taste some offerings from the San Marcos and Karl Strauss breweries.

Re: beer thread - 05/18/0512:18 AM

Re: beer thread - 05/18/0510:30 PM

Just to clarify - I have a keg of XX LAGER not XX AMBER Lager. I'm fixin' to go buy a bushel of limes and a side of carne asada for your visit, Tom. If you like avocados and insanely hot chili, let me know - I'll load up the gat and head into the barrio for the absolute best avocado salsa (not guacamole!) on the planet.

Re: beer thread - 05/18/0511:11 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/19/0509:12 AM

In reply to:

avocado salsa

OK.. that sound good.. i wanna come too!!

i had a sixer of the new belgium trippel last night.. my wife shuttled me the last two, so i had no idea how much effect they were having on me.. once i got up to 'relieve' myself, i felt the power of the brew.. knocked my shin on the coffee table, and my shoulder on the bathroom door.. thank you beer..

Re: beer thread - 05/19/0502:45 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/19/0506:13 PM

the Westmalle is good stuff! i had a couple of bottles of it 2 or 3 months ago. my favorite belgian is Grimbergen, and sadly the last time i had was when i was in Brugge for a liberty port. unfortunately no place in VA carries it, so i guess i'll have to break down and order it on the internet and pay out the nose for it and hope it's not bad by the time it gets here!

Re: beer thread - 05/22/0501:16 AM

I can't believe somebody mentioned this beer! "a Westmalle Trippel, made by some Trappist monks in Belgium" It is the beer that I enjoyed most while in belgium. Very reserved people, but very very good beer.

Re: beer thread - 05/22/0503:34 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/22/0506:02 PM

they've got a bunch in the local Wine and Beer stores here. it's really easy to get aroiund here. and i totally agree, the belgians are outstanding people! very friendly to americans (at least in 2000) and the women are too fine!

Re: beer thread - 05/24/0505:28 AM

Re: beer thread - 06/06/0501:26 AM

Speaking of Belgium...

I arrived at Ken's house to take care of his cats while he's on vacation in Mexico and found a couple bottles of Unibroue Edition 2004 sitting there waiting for me. Yes, I knew they are for me because they came with a belated birthday card. ) Pretty cool.

Re: beer thread - 06/06/0509:39 AM

In reply to:

I propose that we move this thread to "the water cooler"

i could do it either way. i would just hate for all the great info in this entire thread to get lost. i still reference it often for beer and alcohol decisions. if we could some how move the entire thing..? dont know if thats possible.?

i have drank MANY different beers over the last few weeks. i tried to make a review of them all, but without taking detailed notes at time of drinking them, i found myself forgetting the good and bad details of each.

so, i decided to simplify the process.. i have placed the beers in three categories: Bad, Average, Good. these ranks indicate my 'overall' impression of the beers. (sorry tom, i will do better next time)

Re: beer thread - 06/06/0501:46 PM

Bass Ale is average?! AVERAGE?!?! Bass Ale is a great beer! Balanced, complex, yet still drinkable. I think you need to send away for Tom's beer tasting correspondence course. But I'll second your opinion of Harp. Since production was moved to the Labatt's facility in Canada, Harp has lost all of it's former delicacy.
Ditto for Whitbread (now made in Ohio). It was once a good, complex, well balanced ale, but is now a nasty melange of incongruous flavors. A shame in both cases.

Re: beer thread - 06/06/0502:19 PM

well, if it makes you feel any better, it was my favorite in the 'average' class.. i was actually looking forward to drinking some Bass, cause i had heard such good things about it. it wasnt unpleasant in anyway, i think it just lacked the bolder punch i prefer. i just remember it being non-distinguishable, which in my rating scale, made it average..

i would love to take a course or two of tom's correspondence course. even though i have enjoyed writing my little reviews, i will be the first to tell you that i am working on very little experience. sometimes i dont think i use the proper 'terms' to express what i am trying to get across. oh well, just keep at it, and eventually i might start making sense.

Re: beer thread - 06/06/0504:50 PM

Reply #1000. The Beer Thread Rocks.

Sorry, guys, there is no point in a correspondence course for beer drinkers. Drink what you like and share your joy with others.

I like Bass on draught A LOT. Classic. It is one of many beers that seems to travel poorly due to not only bottling practice (pasteurization and/or filtration) but also the perils of bad handling (extremes of light and temperature).

I had a sixer of Bitburger recently (no, not all at once). I had forgotten how utterly fabulous that beer can be. Crisp yet flavorful. Wonderful German Pils.

I also enjoyed a Pietrus beer from Corsica; an amber ale brewed with chestnut flour. Brown, fizzy and dryish. Interesting, but not compelling enough for the near-Belgian price.

Move the thread, but don't lose the content. Like bigjohn, I sometimes refer to our prior conversations here when needing advice, particularly on spirits from bigwill.

So far I had the Rogue Mocha Porter. Not bad at all. Faintly sweet start, nice balance on the bitterness with a touch of roast in the finish. It went really well with peanuts. My only gripe is that I would have liked a touch more of the roasted flavor, but that's just me.

Tonight I'm going to enjoy the Cantillon Vigneronne. Should be a very unique brew since it's a fruit lambic made from muscat grapes. I'll write a review as usual.

Re: beer thread - 06/07/0509:56 AM

of that list, i would really like to try the Orval and the Ayinger Celebrator Doppelbock. i have heard nothing but great things about those 2 beers. in fact, i have had several people mention the Ayinger by name, and say it was "the best beer i have ever had". when you hear that a few times, it makes you wanna try it and see what all the hype is about.

i can tell by this list, you prefer the dark, stronger beers, so i reckon you will like that new belgium black ale. i find myself liking ALL the beers from the new belgium brewing co. if you can find it, try the trippel and the abbey from them. really great every day drinkers.

EDIT- BTW, where in austin did you go to get these beers..? that i will know next time i am down there..

Re: beer thread - 06/07/0510:22 AM

John, next time you're in Austin, check out Grapevine Market. It's off of 183N. The selection was nice for micro brews and several of the harder to find Germans. On the other hand, I was really disappointed by their Belgian selection. They only stocked 2 of the Trappist brews (Orval and Chimay) which are the most common to my knowledge. I was hoping to find Westvleteren or Westmalle, but no luck there. I also didn't find any other brews by Fantome. The store back here in Louisiana actually has a better Belgian selection, but I can't enjoy any micros. Thank you Abita and Louisiana's stupid taxes.

Re: beer thread - 06/08/0511:45 AM

Re: beer thread - 06/08/0501:24 PM

I didn't think we should *kill* it, just move it. Does the software behind this board allow threads to be moved? I thought that was pretty standard issue in forum software... and would clearly be the ideal answer.

Re: beer thread - 06/11/0502:35 PM

OK, i have to tell this story, just cause its on my mind, and i havent talked with anyone but my wife and my 10 month old this morning(afternoon, whatever).

so i go to a new guys house, who i have never met, to play poker last night, and there are these frat boys there drinking Michelob Ultra. i come in with my sixer of New Belgium Trippel, and they ask "what ya got there". eager to show them good beer, i volunteer a bottle for them to pass around and have a taste. "pretty good", one guy says, "but its kinda heavy". i say, "yes, its a strong beer, but nothing like a stout or a porter". and then heres the kicker, the kid responds.. "that's what i like about the michelob ultra, you can catch a good buzz, and it aint even like drinking beer"... UUHHHH, THEN WHY BOTHER IDIOT!!! i wanted to go to the store and buy him some wine coolers and shove 'em down his throat. but i couldnt really 'go off' on the kid, cause i didnt know any of these people, and i wasnt about to try and make any enemies.

the real fun came later in the evening, when the frat boys got in a heated conversation about how beer can taste different in bottles/cans/plastic containers/or on tap. now i completely agree with them on this subject, but they had a little different angle. see, one guy was drinking coors light, but it was in those tiny little 7oz cans. i have no idea what the point is in those anyway.. but, he SWORE that the beer in the 'little' cans tasted better than the same beer in the 'bigger' cans. he went on to tell us that he and his buddies did 'blind' taste tests, and he was able to pick the coor light that came from the smaller can, cause it tasted better. .?/!$*@@$%(&){}.. what??? are you kidding me..??!!! an aluminum can is an aluminum can, $hit for brains!!! i think if i would have been a little drunker, i might have slapped him. and to think his parents are wasting thousands of dollars for him to get a college education. i did point out to him though, in accordance with his thoery, if coors light ever came out with beer in 2oz cans, it would be the BEST ever.. he agreed.

BTW- i ended up getting 4th place out of 20 players on the poker game. they were paying 1st-2nd-3rd, so i missed the cut by one. i had pocket 8's on a short stack, and he called me with pocket Jacks.. hey, thats poker...

Re: beer thread - 06/11/0510:52 PM

Re: beer thread - 06/12/0502:25 AM

I remember trying Michelob Ultra at a pizza place. My buddy and I were looking to see what the place had on tap. This was right when Michelob Ultra came out, and I had not seen any ads for it yet. The guy at the pizza place let me try a bit because I expressed some interest in it--I mean, it has the word "Ultra" in it, right? Wrong. Man, that stuff tasted bad. Still gives me the shivers thinking about it.

Re: beer thread - 06/12/0502:27 AM

Good story BigJ.
I can't wait for the next time i head down to Texas. I believe my next trip is to Dallas though (possibly Peru first) so any visititations may require some extra travelling.
I'm not much for poker but along the same lines, i'm not much for Micheolb Ultra either. I would join you with the Trippel GRATEFULLY anytime.

Is there really such a thing as chicken fried steak? Or is this some kind of urban myth?

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0512:30 AM

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0509:30 AM

chess- no urban legend. chicken fried steak is very real, and VERY delicious.

its usually made with a lesser cut of steak, like cube steak or round steak. its tenderized, then seasoned and breaded, and fried in oil, much like you would do to fried chicken. it somes out crispy golden on the outside, with the steak nice and juicy on the inside. always smothered in a cream gravy, and served with mashed potatoes and a slice of texas toast(thats how i like it).. its very delicious, and is a menu standard at most every texas restaurant. i highly suggest for you to try one while down here. and to me, the best chicken fried steak is at your local mom & pops type restaurants, 'greasy spoons' as we like to call them. the major chains are never as good.

hope you have a good trip, and let me know what you think of the 'chicken fry' if you get one!!

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0510:25 AM

BigJ,
That is unfortunate then. During my week long trip to Austin, not a single restaurant in the downtown had it, at least none that we came across including some steak houses. In fact, the only place that did serve it was the upstairs lounge in our hotel, and you know how typically low brow the pub fare can be in hotel bars.

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0510:30 AM

Chicken fried steak, good eating!

That reminds me whenever I was working near Lubbock, a little town called Idalou. There was a little hole in the wall resturant that absolutely had the best BBQ brisket I ever had, they'd make you one of those juices running down the elbows hamburgers that had a pattie the sized of a small saucer and about an inch thick. Anyway, a co-worker friend from North Dakota and I went there for lunch one day and I ordered whatever with some fried okra, the dude looked at the fried okra and asked me 'what in the heck is that?'...this 36 year old fella had never in his life seen fried okra! I was amazed, heck I thought everybody ate fried okra.

About those little beer cans, I worked in Arkansas with a guy that would buy them because he could slug one or two of 'em down while his airplane was being loaded for another crop dusting job! I've worked with numerous folks from all over the US for a lot of years but he was the first that I had ever come across who drank while flying.

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0510:40 AM

In reply to:

not a single restaurant in the downtown had it

i would normally be very surprised by that statement, but then i have to remember you were in austin. they do everything a little different down there. the attitude of the whole city, is to do stuff different than everyone else. they even have t-shirts with the motto, "Keep Austin Weird".. so, i cant be too surprised that you couldnt find a good chicken fry down there.

i am slightly surprised that you couldnt find it at a steak house. most ALL texas steak houses offer a chicken fry. it is often considered a 'poor mans' meal, so if they were higher end restaurant, they might have considered it beneath them, if you know what i mean. either way, i hope you are able to find a good chicken fry plate on a return visit.

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0510:45 AM

In reply to:

i would normally be very surprised by that statement, but then i have to remember you were in austin

Get out and away from town. As BigJohn stated earlier, some of the best home cooked grub is from those little hole in the walls. Usually at a very respectable price and a whole heap of a serving to boot!

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0502:25 PM

Restaurants here in soCal have started doing "chicken fried chicken" with garlic mashed potatoes and gravy. I hate to admit it, but I like that better than those cheap steaks. Nobody does brisket here as well as the one I tried from Texas, though. Must be the wood.

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0502:29 PM

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0502:35 PM

i had a few new beers on sunday during the NASCAR race that were excellent. thought i might share since this is the place for it..

Ayinger Ur-Weisse- i had been wanting to try ANY of the Ayinger products cause i had heard nothing but great things about them. imagine my surprise when i saw that my little beer store got in a case of the Ur-Weisse in their last truck. i poured it in my tall hefe glass, and it was nice and cloudy brown. head was thick with fat bubbles reaching to the top of my glass. nice aroma of fruit, mainly bananas & apples it seemed to me. kind of mildly thick malty texture, tiny bitter at the end, but great all around. rich and full flavor from front to end. i really liked this beer, and plan on making it part of my normal rotation. i give it an 8 out of 10.

Julius Echter Hefe-Weisse Premium- poured cloudy as i expected, but more golden than the Ayinger. not as dark, and more lacy head. smaller bubbles and thinner. fruity aroma again, more wheat prominent. little more of an orange flavor to this one, but not as rich as Ayinger. i know i shouldnt compare, but its hard not to. less bold, a little watered down. good beer, but didnt really reach out and grab me. i think alone, i would have liked it. but drinking it back to back with the Ayinger, it was definitely 2nd best. i give it 7 out of 10.

i saw a few more new ones in the store that i am looking to try. they had the Paulaner Salvatore and the Fullers ESB. i have been eye-balling the Samuel Smiths Oatmeal Stout and the Taddy Porter, but i normally dont like beers THAT strong and thick. oh well, might get a wild hair one day..?

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0503:01 PM

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0503:41 PM

haha, naw, i remember them. it was only 2, so it was pretty easy this time.. a few weeks back, i had 12 different kinds within a 4-5 day period, and i was having a VERY hard time remembering them all. i usually try and take some notes so i dont get my thoughts confused when i am trying several at once. so, by comparison, yesterday was a piece of cake!!

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0507:47 PM

I was starting to worry about all thos chicken-fried [insert meat here] comments. They were robbing me of beer info.

I've still got a couple bottles of Unibroue Edition 2004 staring at me in the fridge. My brother is not working today, so I intent to open one today. So gooooood. Thanks for the review of the Ur-Weisse. I can get many of Ayinger's beers easily here, but I've not yet had any.

By the way, I really think you'll like the Samuel Smith's Oatmeal Stout. It's not as heavyu as it sounds and is very very smooth and tasty. Give it a shot.

Re: beer thread - 06/14/0508:54 AM

I highly recommend you try the Sam Smith Oatmeal Stout. While it is thick and dark, it's not particularly strong. It's a very easy drinking stout actually. Maybe not so much so as Beamish or Murphy's, but quite drinkable. Now if you want a stout that'll make your toes curl, pick up an imperial stout like Victory Storm King or Weyerbacher's raspberry imperial stout, although I don't think those particular two are available out there.

Re: beer thread - 06/14/0509:44 AM

thanks for the suggestions fellas.. i think i will go out of my 'comfort zone', and get a samuel smith oatmeal stout. both of you cant be wrong...?

ring- i have not seen those other stout's you mentioned. we are VERY limited in what kind of beers we can get out here. i think on my next trip to austin or dallas, i am gonna take a beer 'wish list', and go to a few stores and just see what i can find.

Re: beer thread - 06/14/0511:45 AM

+1 for the Samuel Smith's Oatmeal Stout. Definitely one of my favorite stouts. Their Porter and Imperial Stout are worth grabbing too. If this will be your first stout, then you're in for a pleasant treat.

Re: beer thread - 06/14/0511:53 AM

I'll triple the oatmeal stout recommendation. Also try Barney Flats Oatmeal Stout if they have it.
I like the dark German wheat beers, too. They're soft and drinkable, but with complex yeast esters. Other brand names escape me. Maybe Tom, will suggest a few.

Re: beer thread - 06/14/0502:49 PM

Barney Flats Oatmeal Stout is from the Anderson Valley Brewing Company. Everything they make is excellent. A visit to their brewery has been on my list of things to do. Perhaps the next family camping trip will be in the Anderson Valley...

Re: beer thread - 06/15/0511:37 AM

i didnt get the oatmeal stout, but i did grab a sixer of the-

Paulaner Salvator- 7.5% alcohol. i had been looking forward to trying this dopplebock for a while. it pours a rich mahogany color, very clear, with small whispy head. strong fruity aromas with raisins. had a very rich and full caramel flavor, with hints of molasses and toffee. silky texture, with strong presence of malt. overall powerful flavor that finished slightly dry and bitter. very good beer with presence of alcohol very dominate. will definitely have again. might go good with a salty, cold-cut hoagie. 7.5 out of 10.

Re: beer thread - 06/15/0512:24 PM

Gaining any weight, bigjohn?

I had a couple of beers yesterday myself. Now that my spring sport coaching assignment is over I get home at 2:30 - leaving plenty of time for drinking.
Warmed up with about 2L of Dos Equis from the keg. I then moved on to the Affligem Dubbel that Tom left in my frig. Excellent beer. Dubbels tend to be my fav Belgian style. Bananas and chocolate, some raisin. Excellent, soft and estery. Went great with beans & weinies. Against my better judgement I also opened the Affligem Trippel. When cold, it started with raunchy malt and had a curious mineral finish. Plenty of alcohol. Warming, the bananas came to the forefront. I forget the second glass, but I remember thinking that I much preferred the Dubbel.

Re: beer thread - 06/15/0502:44 PM

Thanks for the update John, I'll have to try the Salvator again some time. I don't remember it being a bad brew, I just prefer Spaten Optimator to it. Now I still have that Ayinger Celebrator in the fridge and I suspect that it will be my new favorite Dopplebock.

It looks like yesterday was a day for beer sampling. I sadly finished my last Young's Double Chocolate Stout last night and I'm glad I still have their Oatmeal Stout to look forward to. The Double Chocolate is really a good stout and it finishes with a nice and smooth roasted flavor that draws me to this style. The chocolate is there but just enough to justify it's title. I do recall more chocolate presence when I had it on tap though. I wish I could get this stuff without having to go on a roadtrip.

Re: beer thread - 06/15/0502:54 PM

after doing a search, i see that i gave the Spaten Optimator a 7 out of 10. it had the same type sweetness, with raisin and caramel flavors. i remember liking it very much.

i talked with the owner of the beer store yesterday, and he said he has had a few more requests for the different Ayinger beers, so he was gonna try and make a solid effort to get more in. he also informed me that he would not be able to get any beers from the Rochefort and Three Floyds breweries. apparently, there isnt even a distributor in Texas for those makes of beer. so sad for me..

i am gonna have to try one of the chocolates or oatmeals. i just wuss-out everytime i am in there..

Re: beer thread - 06/20/0512:23 PM

OK, this needs a bump.. i just tried one of my buddies 'fruit' beers this weekend....

Abita Purple Haze Raspberry- 4.8% alcohol. pours slightly hazy(how ironic), with an amber/purple color. very sweet smelling, bold fruit aroma. reminded me of Kool-Aid.. drinking this one was hard. i think if it didnt say "beer" on the bottle, you would think it was a wine-cooler. it was kinda fizzy in the mouth, and had a dry tart taste throughout. overall taste was uninspiring, and ended with a slight metallic flavor..? i should have learned my lesson with 'fruit' beers after i was sooo disappointed with the samual adams cherry wheat. i give the Abita a 3 out of 10. not good at all.

BTW- i had a bud light in a bottle for the first time in like 3-4 months, and i realized just how bad it is. it was very spritzy, with a sickly-sweet flavor. almost like apple cider that had gone bad a little. i drank it cause its all that was avail, and it got easier with every sip.. but, after tasting all these good beers, i just dont see myself going back. its too hard..

Re: beer thread - 06/20/0501:40 PM

That pseudo-cider flavor is what you end up with when you add corn sugar to a beer to bump the alcohol content but not contribute anything to the body. Given that the beer has very little flavor to begin with, it's extremely hard to mask.

Re: beer thread - 06/20/0502:01 PM

i wasnt aware of that.. thanks for the brew lesson..

a friend of mine in college tried to make his own beer several years back, and it came out BAD.. after tasting his, and seeing the effort he put into it.. i just decided that it was MUCH easier just to go pick some up from the store..

Re: beer thread - 06/20/0502:28 PM

Re: beer thread - 06/20/0502:46 PM

.....and the bottled water thread, is in the "Technical Questions" section...?

i think the wine thread is in the correct spot.. this one just got started here, and thats where it has stayed. i think the title can be moved, but we would lose all the information in the thread.. so, i think it was decided to just leave it be.? at least thats my opinion..

Re: beer thread - 06/20/0502:50 PM

Well, happy belated Father's Day for the dads around here. Anyway, I got my dad a bottle of Lindeman's Framboise (rasberry) and picked up a Kriek (cherry) as well. John, these fruit beers might change your mind about this style so try to find them. You might remember that BigWill has mentioned the Framboise. Both are terrific and make a delicious after dinner drink. I find that I prefer the Kriek because it's a little more balanced than the Framboise. The Kriek has that nice dry, grassy finish that's been growing on me lately. I hope you're able to find these.

Re: beer thread - 06/20/0508:27 PM

I'll second that.

Now that Peter's gotten his birthday present (a bit late!), I can talk about the Unibroue Edition 2004.

YUM! That stuff is great. I guess I do like some beers. Very complex flavor, although it's been over a month, so I could tell you what. For what it's worth...I was able to finish my half of the bottle without feeling like I needed to gulp it (which happens with some red wines, and a lot of beers). My wife also enjoyed it a great deal. So today I went out to Beverages and More and bought 3 other Unibroues--Les Trois Pistoles, La Fin du Monde, et EphťmŤre. I've also got another Edition 2004 waiting for me along with a Quelque Chose.

Re: beer thread - 06/20/0508:56 PM

Re: beer thread - 06/21/0501:05 AM

Excellent, Ken! I still really like the Unibroue beers a lot. I shared a bottle of the Trois Pistoles with my father-in-law on Sunday - it was as wonderful and rich as I remember. Amazingly light in body for such a strong beer.

Peter, do let us know about the 2005. I've not seen it yet here. I sure did enjoy BevMo on my recent visit. Wow. I love America.

Re: beer thread - 06/24/0502:46 PM

Wow. In about two and half weeks, this thread will be 1 year old. I'm jumping the gun a little bit, but in honor of that anniversary, I thought I'd share a website with you all that I recently discovered.

Re: beer thread - 06/25/0502:15 AM

Re: beer thread - 07/20/0505:38 PM

I loved that Belgian Shop link, Peter. Thank you.

I thought this thread needed a bump. Lots of newbies around who may not have yet experienced the glory of the Beer Thread.

Speaking of experiencing the glory, I recently had the good fortune to drink some Cazadores Reposado. Changed my life, I tell you. While it will be difficult for me to justify spending $36.95 on a fifth of Tequila, this stuff transcends.

Yes, we do have a lot of tax on the state-controlled liquor sales in Washington.

Re: beer thread - 07/21/0505:21 PM

BigHombreTom! That Cazadores is good stuff. I was first introduced to it by a student in my class a few years back who said his dad and uncles would "drink the tequila with the deer on it and sleep in the front yard". My Costco has it at $30/L.
How about Herradura? A little more spicy than the Cazadores, but very good and in the ball park price-wise, too.
Lots to choose from in tequila.
I picked up a bottle of Unibroue 2004 and Terrible after reading pmb and his crew go on and on about the stuff. Gonna lay them up in the frig for a while.

Re: beer thread - 07/21/0510:51 PM

Re: beer thread - 07/21/0511:09 PM

I tried both Optimator Spantin Munich and Salvator Double Bock. I liked them both very much but probably the Salvator better because it had less texture in the aftertaste.
Any other suggestions along those lines?

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 07/27/0512:30 AM

Getting back to the drinkable beer...

I'm on the second half (well, quarter) of a bottle of Unibroue's La Fin du Monde. Wonderful beer, again (surprise!). It has a nice start, a bit of spice in the middle, and a very complex after. Great stuff!

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 07/27/0511:45 PM

ken- yes, i am surprised to see that you DO actually like beer..

i thought you were a mere rookie just a few months ago..? or do i have you mixed up with someone else..?

i recently tried the Erdinger Hefe Weizen. it was pretty decent. cloudy with an active and medium head. smelled of classic hefe, fruity banana with touch of spice. good flavors, a tad sweet, and not as bold as i would have expected. and i noticed that it had a slightly watery finish. flavor didnt seem to hold strong. overall though, i liked the beer, and thought it was a pretty good representation of a mild hefe.

BTW- i buried another sixer of the paulaner salvatore double bock while playing poker last friday.. OUCH... i ts was a very slow saturday morning...

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 07/28/0509:59 AM

Nope, that's me. I still don't like the hoppy stuff. I've been drinking some hefeweizen (what I can find of it, at least) and the Unibroues. Small doses, though. I knew that champagne stopper would do some good!

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 07/28/0504:26 PM

billy
Looks like I might have to come over and help you ivestigate that black hole in your fridge. In case you haven't seen my post, I went ahead and ordered the 60's should be here tomorrow. But to keep to the topic of the thread. One of my all time favorites is Bellhaven Scottish Ale
You guys are far more sophisticated in the jargon so all I'm gonna say is it is a dark beer with a very clean taste. In a word, it is damn good. OK two words.
oz
oz

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 07/30/0507:22 PM

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 08/09/0505:37 PM

My sister-in-law and her fiancee drive down from Yakima over the last couple days and stopped at the Deschutes brewery in Bend. They were nice enough to call and take orders, so I had them pick up a case of Twilight, a summer seasonal brew which I've not had before. True to form, Deschutes has not let me down. This is a somewhat lighter beer than their others, but eminently drinkable and refreshing. I was a little impatient and drank mine before it had a chance to adequately chill, but enjoyed it anyway.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 08/25/0506:23 PM

this is a great little brew house here in Saskatoon and have won some apparently prestigious awards at Monde and World Beer Cup. Some great beer and we were lucky enough to speak at length with the Brewmaster last week, though more on a topic related to the actual malt product used. Very interesting indeed.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/05/0506:06 PM

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/05/0507:24 PM

You know, Ken, I had been thinking the same thing. I was concerned that the "what are you listening to" thread may overtake the beer thread in posts, but certainly not in content value.

We have already established your soft spot for Belgian beers, so don't try to peddle that "I don't drink beer" schtick.

Okay, ObBeer.

I recently conducted my annual Oktoberfest tasting, including Spaten, Hacker-Pschorr and Paulaner. I loved getting a nice, fresh case of the Spaten at Costco, and have enjoyed it very much. But, to me, the Paulaner still can't be beat.

My latest beer love is Session Beer, from our fine friends at Full Sail in Hood River, OR. It comes in 11 oz stubby bottles and a decidedly non-micro white box. Very unassuming. I did not, at first, know it was from my favorite employee-owned brewery. What a splendid and refreshing beer! It reaffirmed my faith in the notion of a subtle yet satisfying American beer. This is what BudMilloors could have and should have been - an all-malt, pre-prohibition lager. Dangerously drinkable yet a surprisingly deft expression of the brewer's craft. It also has Rock / Paper / Scissors game on the underside of the caps. Very highly recommended.

I miss bigjohn and bigwill.

I've also had a couple of big (9%+ alcohol), sweet Polish porters lately. Too many consonants in weird places for me to remember the names. Fun and interesting beers from an unexpected source.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/05/0507:28 PM

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/06/0501:06 PM

Well guys nice to see the Beer Thread back to page 1. I haven't really tried many new brew as of lately, but I do have some good news (for me at least). The local place that I shop gets many of it's hard to find brews from a distibutor in New Orleans so I was worried it would hurt their selection. I stopped in the other day to see how they're doing and I quickly saw that the place has now doubled in size and built a wine tasting bar. Things must be going well. I talked to John, their beer guy, and he said that their beer stock is going to double and that a bunch of new selections are on order. I asked him about the distributors and he said that they were only down for a week and now they've had four others send them their beer lists and will gladly send them whatever they request. At this point I was quite happy to hear the great news. I also got to look over one of the lists and here's a few they have on order.

Ayinger Ur-Weisse
Ayinger Celebrator Doppelbock (WOOHOO!!!)
Rogue HazelNut Brown Nectar (I've been wanting to try this one for some time now)
Rogue Jazz Guy Ale
Rogue Shakespeare Stout
Orval
Unibroue (several and I'm so glad to see this one)

He said he's also expecting more of the Fuller's brews, a few more Germans, and also some more micro's. He also said that all of the crazy, special Winter brews will be available again. November needs to hurry up then. Now if they can find anything from Weihenstephaner and Westvleteren I will be very happy.

I did try Fuller's ESB last night and really enjoyed it. The only other ESB I've had is Red Hook ESB, and Fuller's is much better. Really nice balance of hops and malts. I was also surprised by it's nice aroma.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/07/0504:49 PM

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/07/0505:23 PM

Hey, it's the Bukowinski brothers chiming in on Begian style beer made in Canada.

I guess my work here is done for now.

I can't always get the Edition (either 2004 or 2005) but can always get Trois Pistoles, La Fin du Monde, Blanche de Chambly and Maudite. I just never really warmed up to the Maudite. I don't disagree with you about the Edition, but its rarity and price don't allow me to drink it as often.

Of course, I am doing more than talking about beer, unlike some people I know.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/07/0505:28 PM

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/07/0509:34 PM

Tom, your taunt caused me to lose self control while I was at the supermarket picking up some chile powder. I ended up also buying a (cute little) case of Session Beer. It's pretty tasty and I could see myself accidentally going through a few too many in one sitting. I also picked up a 1 pint+6oz'er of Lagunitas Capuccino Stout. I'll report on that one later. I'm going to wait until Adam is around so I can share it.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/08/0506:41 AM

The 2005 is nothing to write home about - at least by Unibroue standards. I prefer the Terrible for a dark Unibroue.

Tom, I tried the Sessions lager tonight - it's definitely one of the better lagers I've had, but I guess I'm just not much of a lager fan. Not that I didn't like it, but it's not the flavor I usually go for in beers. I prefer things a little heavier.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/09/0501:08 AM

Adam, I do too. Typically, if I can't get a porter or a stout or a dubbel, I'm grumpy. But I've just found the Session to be so unpretentious and refreshing that I'm smitten. It's just so nice to have a clean, pale all-malt lager with North American hops.

Peter, it pleases me no end that I goaded you into having a beer. Clearly, your quality of life needed a nudge, and that $10 wasn't going to make a difference on your down payment anyway.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/09/0503:03 AM

The Lagunitas Cappuccino Stout is quite tasty, and its improving as it de-chills in my glass. It's not as dark as I was expecting -- I can almost see to the bottom of the half-pint glass I poured. (Hey, I'm sharing with Adam.) It's almost the color of Black Butte. As for taste, it has a hint of sweetness, but the majority of the flavor comes as the beer glides past the mid-palette. Faintly bitter, which perfectly counteracts the first hint of sweetness. Overall, it's rich, dark, and tastes of coffee (ya think?)

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/11/0507:26 PM

I've had a few new brews - new to me at least. Most impressive was the Moynihan's (?) Imperial Stout from some brewery in California. AWESOME!!! PERFECT!!!

Stone Brewery's 9th Anniv. Ale was good. It reeked of hops, literally like an open bag of whole hops. It was bitter, but not quite to IPA standards. And it was - wonderfully - completely lacking in the wood chip dep't.

A Polish bock called Kiper was nice - malty and yeasty like homemade bread - but I think my sample was a bit old and possibly cooked at some point.

That Sessions Lager sounds like my cup of tea. I'll look for it at BevMo, Tom.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/11/0508:15 PM

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/11/0511:40 PM

OK, i will bite also.. i have breezing thru once a week and reading posts, but not a lot of time to actually respond to any. call me a peeping tom, if you will..(wow, 2 puns in one)...

anyway, i will post a pic of my 'seasonal' bottle of Corsendonk i got last night.. its a 3 quart bottle...YES, 3 QUART.. its about 2 1/2 feet tall, and weighs about 15 pounds. the guy at the beer store said that they are collector bottles, that they make them special for the holidays, and this was the first, and only shipment he would get.. i couldnt help myself, i just had to have it.. not real sure if i will actually drink it, but its damn hard not to. i will post a pic of it later this week. its insane!!!

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/12/0512:42 PM

So good to hear from you, Bigjohn!

How much did that mondo Corsendonk set you back?

I love it that now, Duvel is your "old standard". Your preferences seem to have evolved. How does your lovely bride feel about those Belgian beers? Do you find that these styles of beer accompany Chili well?

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/26/0507:26 PM

BigdaddyTom!
I tried that Session lager (actually I tried 11 of them on the golf course last week ).
It is good clean stuff. Carbonation followed by mild caramel malt sweetness, a hint of nuts, with a pleasant dry finish.
Very good for downing in quantity. Subsequent belches were bile and hop free.
I will wait for the price to fall some before grabbing more, though.
Ended up getting a keg of local fest lager rather than the stout, which was exhausted. Also good stuff.
Cheers all.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/26/0508:13 PM

I've been pleasantly surprised (e.g. "My, that's not as bad as I was expecting!") by pumpkin beer in the past. Just make sure you have a tried and true standby to cleanse your palate should something go terribly wrong.

I've got another Lagunitas Cappuccino Stout waiting for me in the fridge. I'm debating with myself whether or not to share it with my brother.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/26/0508:58 PM

I was soo close to trying some pumpkin beer last week. I don't like pumpkin pie, though, so it stilled my desire. However, my love for trying new beer may win out in the end. After all, it soon will be Halloween. Perfect time to buy.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/27/0511:44 AM

Well, I've had the Buffalo Bill's Pumpkin beer before, and I used to make a similar, spiced brown ale during the holiday season when I was an active homebrewer (before my kids became more important than washing buckets in the garage). I think it's nice to have ONE each fall, but I'd totally agree about having something else handy.

Re: Oh, the humanity! - 10/27/0504:12 PM

I don't know how I've avoided the pumpkin beers, but I have. Enjoy those, fellas.
Tom, the Wine Spectator ran an article some months ago on alternative cuts of beef that was kinda old news to me, but some of you guys in the north and east may enjoy it.
The Wine Spectator article talks about flap meat, tri-tip, skirt steak and the flat iron steak (which I have not tried).
Some El Salvadorans turned me on to the flap meat for tacos, but I think I'm going to start using it with taters and such, as well. I much prefer it to lean loin steaks.

Re: beer thread - 01/01/0608:00 PM

I am reviving the almighty beer thread! My wife and I went to Goose Island Brewery for lunch today. At the brewery they have a lot of small batch brews for drinking pleasure that they don't seel retail.

Anyway, they had a beer called Sahti, which was described as a traditional Finnish/Estonian beer. This beer was great! It was a creamy yellow color (similar to duvel) had a spicy/hoppy nose, fruity taste, and clean, clean, clean, clean finish. I can honestly say I have never tried a beer quite like it.

I was hoping that someone (Tom T.?) might be familiar with the style and might now of a bottled version that I could find for my drinking enjoyment.

Re: beer thread - 01/02/0610:30 PM

that sounds horrible!! Anyway - I found out why the Sahti tasted so clean - supposedly the oats for the malt are soaked with juniper berries, or mixed with juniper berries somehow before malting.

Good stuff - hopefully Tom Tuttle can chime in with something similar (please please please)

For tonight's glorious win over Noter Dame we had: Stella Artois, Staropramen, Sam A's Light (surprisingly tasty although mostly for the wife and gals), Guinness, Michelob Amber Bock, and "O.K." Beer from the Polish store down the street. All of it went down well with my wife's Chilli and barbecue chicken sandwiches.

And to top off the celebration a tipple of Aberlour's A'bunadh with PLENTY of water.

Re: beer thread - 01/03/0612:49 AM

Re: beer thread - 01/03/0610:21 AM

Re: beer thread - 01/03/0611:30 AM

In reply to:

Wow, that's a new one to me. I don't recall ever having any beers from Finland - or Norway and Sweden for that matter.

Two Norwegian beers you might want to stay away from, assuming you could even find them, are Hansa and Polar. Now granted, the Norwegian Navy provided the crew on my boat with about 30 cases of Polar Beer free of charge for a big party they were throwing us, but it still tasted like warm Busch Light. Come to think of it that may be why they gave it to us... Hansa was the local brew in Bergen, kind of a local derivation of the Hansa from Germany brought up but the Hanseatic merchants a couple hundred years ago. It really wasn't that bad, however you'd get the worst headaches after a few of 'em. Rumor had it that they had a fair amount of formaldehyde in them; I just know I got the worst hangover in my life off of that beer!
To paraphrase Eric Idle, "This is a bottle with a message in, and the message is Beware. This is not a beer for drinking...this is a beer for laying down and avoiding."

Re: beer thread - 01/03/0612:49 PM

Dear David,

I wish I could help you, but that style is not familiar to me.

Upon further research in Brewing Techniques and The Finnish Society for Traditional Beers, it appears that my ignorance should not be entirely unexpected. I do not know how "traditional" the version you had was, but the style is apparently very old and quite rustic - including wooden mash tuns, open fermentation, bouquets of juniper twigs and finnish baker's yeast. I'm pleased (but not surprised) that you enjoyed the Goose Island version; that brewery is wonderful, but I strongly suspect that they dramatically modernized the procedures.

At any rate, Sahti seems to be rare, even in Finland. There is another interesting article from Michael Jackson.

In what ways did the beer you enjoyed differ from similar Belgian or Flemish rustic ales, or from Weinheinstephaner-types? I'd assume that the replacement of hop profile with juniper is the defining characteristic, although the reviews suggest that the Goose Island version expresses Rye pretty profoundly.

Honestly, your best bet might be to brew it yourself I discovered a mention that Lammin Sahti Oy produces a bottled version, but the possibility seems rather remote, and they do not offer an english version website.

I deeply appreciate you providing me the nudge to learn!

My dear wife gave me several interesting beers for Christmas, and I will try to report on them in due course.

Re: beer thread - 01/06/0609:17 PM

Ken and I enjoyed a Maredsous 10 (triple ale) last night while giving the M3s and PB10 a workout. Very nice! Light amber color, with a very thick head. Smooooth but not boring - good mouthfeel (oooh, tasting terms ) and a nice finish. Even Ken liked it!

Re: beer thread - 01/06/0610:44 PM

Ok for all those Guinness drinkers out there, I've never had one. I've been drinking beer since 9th grade, and am now 38, and have tried many types of domestic/import but never Guinness.

So what can I expect? Should I try it out of the tap at a bar, if they know the correct way to pour Guinness? Or, can the can's or bottles with the special Widget be just as good? According to the website there is an extra stout version, but what about the regular Draught, is there just one kind or different flavors?

Re: beer thread - 01/06/0611:56 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/07/0612:48 AM

Randy, my understanding is that there are literally dozens of different types of Guinness throughout the world. It is actually a fairly subtle beer by American hop/alcohol standards, and the relative hardness of the water makes a profound difference in the overall flavor profile.

Like Peter said, a live, draught beer is always going to be better than a canned one, but the widget version is pretty good.

Re: beer thread - 01/07/0609:16 AM

Thanks guys, I may have to give one a try this weekend. The Guinness website is pretty cool, they over some visuals explaining how the widget system in the bottles/cans works to create the turbulance that ultimately seperates into the two parts......

Re: beer thread - 01/07/0608:24 PM

Tom,

Thanks for the info. Definitely won't be trying to make it anytime soon - I think I enjoyed the finish because fo the juniper berries - kind of a hint of pine, and I do enjoy gin drinks (esp, Bombay Sapphire). Plus I was slightly hungover and it was a lighter beer, and quite drinkable in my state.

I will have to try to expand my beer horizons further, never tried any of the unibroue products - maybe because it's spelling is too close to "unibrow" to relay pleasent thoughts to my brain (I mean, how good could a unibrow taste?)

I was hoping one of the gents of Polish ancestry that frequent these boards could recommend some of the Polish beers/malt liquors to try since there is a large Polish grocery right down the street.

Re: beer thread - 01/08/0612:05 AM

Re: beer thread - 01/08/0603:10 AM

Hopefully it's a little different than the regular Unibroue Edition 2005, which if I remember correctly was pretty unremarkable as far as Unibroues go. A bit of a disappointment considering how amazing the Ed. 2004 was.

Re: beer thread - 01/08/0603:11 AM

Re: beer thread - 01/08/0608:47 PM

I've had some really remarkable Polish Porters. I don't recall the names or breweries at the moment, but they were very sweet and very alcoholic. Most excellent, but not nearly as hoppy as American versions or as subtle/complex as English ones.

Re: beer thread - 01/08/0611:50 PM

Unfortunately, I decided to try the other beer I bought at Trader Joes today. It's an "meh" wheat beer. The thing is I didn't notice it was a wheat beer when I bought it. It's from Magic Hat Brewing and is called Saint GoŲtz, "A Blessed DARK WHEAT Ale"

Re: beer thread - 01/09/0612:34 AM

That's too bad pmb.
TJs used to charge the same rate for singles purchased individually as opposed to purchased in sixers. Maybe they still do? Makes it easy to try just one.
Wish there was a TJs near me - I mean SERIOUSLY wish. I was bummed when the one near my old house quit selling cold beer.
I'm sure I already offered this advice, but I always had good success at TJs by buying the stuff that was poorly packaged, yet still commanding a good price. Liquor in particular.

Re: beer thread - 01/09/0602:32 PM

I got a Magic Hat sampler 12 pack the other day and it had a couple St. Gootz in it. I agree with your assessment, actually I've been pretty unimpressed with all of the Magic Hat beers. Not nearly as good as The Brooklyn Brewing sampler that's out the there. Their "Monster Ale" barleywine style is pretty good (pretty strong too, don't drink on an empty stomach!)

Re: beer thread - 01/09/0605:04 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/09/0606:20 PM

I'm hankering to crack open that magnum of Anchor Xmas Ale. I like their Steam beer and Liberty Ale.

Had a good Slovak beer on the golf course the other day (Oak Quarry - fabulous course that I can get steep discounts on, if anybody wants to play ). The beer was called Golden Pheasant, I think. I liked it. Herbal, malty, finely bittered. Really a nice lager. It absolutely blew away the Grolsch that I was also drinking that day. Pretty yucky.

Re: beer thread - 01/09/0609:47 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/09/0610:14 PM

What's up Mr. Porter!

So I opened the Trader Joes / Unibroue 2005 Ale tonight -- and since I have nobody to share it with, drank all 750mL of its 9% ABV goodness! I'm pretty sure it's just the Unibroue 2005 Special Edition rebranded, although without a direct A/B comparison, I can't be sure.

It's much tastier than that other crap I've got in the house, but now that I've finished the only other beer, all I'm left with is crap.

Re: beer thread - 01/09/0611:52 PM

Re: beer thread - 01/10/0612:03 AM

Re: beer thread - 01/10/0607:01 AM

I've never tried the Guinness they sell locally. A friend of mine visitied Ireland about 5 years ago, and when he returned, he told me it was the worst beer he had ever sampled. And he has sampled many of them. I'll have to give it a try, and I'll let you all know how it is, a week later, once I get over being sick.

Re: beer thread - 01/10/0611:14 AM

must just be a personal taste thing. When I was in college(ever so briefly) I used to think Guinness was too bitter and stuck with drinking Murphy's. Now, I can't get enough of the stuff! I'll usually put down about 8 at the pub every Thursday, and maybe throw a Car Bomb into the mix for a little variety.

Re: beer thread - 01/16/0605:06 PM

Sampled some of those clearanced Xmas beers yesterday while playing internet poker (wife and kid went to Camp Snoopy - don't rat me out).

The Anderson Valley Winter Solstice was a nice brown ale based recipe. Started great, soft and nutty, a little hint of chocolate and caramel, but then it went very watery early in the finish. Too bad.
I'm just guessing, but they probably watered down what was originally a very, very high gravity beer (the bottle claimed 6.9%).

Next I cracked open the magnum of Anchor 2005 Xmas ale. OOOOOOOH MAN! Probably based on the Anchor Porter, it is a big , big beer. Prodigous brown head, oodles of chocolate flavors, hint of caramel, excellent - truly excellent - velvety mouthfeel. Monster alcohol content, though the bottle didn't state what it was. I'd guess in excess of 8-9% easy. Great beer.

Between the poker and beer I forgot to have lunch and got pretty trashed.

Re: beer thread - 01/16/0609:10 PM

Just remembered, that Anchor Xmas Ale probably has a nice dose of oatmeal, as well. Chewy and resinous. And more honey than caramel flavors. Maybe a wee, wee, wee bit of orange peel, too. Definitely not overdone with the orange flavors - they may have even been non-existent.

Re: beer thread - 01/17/0610:55 PM

Not that I've tried that many, but I've found my new favorite local brewery: Old Dominion. From the looks of it, they don't distribute further west than Ohio, though. I bought a pack of their Winter Brew (seasonal) and was very surprised. From what I can tell, it's basically an IPA. It's well rounded, meaning it's not just trying to punish your tongue with hoppy bitterness. Don't get me wrong, I like the occasional hop overload (Bear Republic Racer 5 anyone?), but this beer is fantastic and very drinkable.

The label reads:

"... this winter warmer is a big ale that is lushly hopped with Liberty, Cascade and Centennial hops. Whole leaf Cascade hops are added in the lauter tun."

Re: beer thread - 01/18/0608:43 PM

I forgot that you had migrated east. Going well? Not too much culture shock?

I've never heard of anybody putting hops on top of the grain bed during sparging. It's been a while, and I'm not like a total expert or anything, but I doubt that sparge water is hot enough to extract much of the acids in the hops.
OTOH, that brewer clearly knows what he is doing - why would he waste hops?

Re: beer thread - 01/19/0611:39 AM

Haven't met enough people for culture shock to set in yet. Our biggest complaint (and if that's the case life must be pretty good) is that there really aren't any places to (legally) let the dog off the leash. Our dog is used to the SF Bay Area lifestyle with plenty of off-leash trails and parks. She gets a little stir crazy if she doesn't get to run around often enough. She has only destroyed one thing so far in frustration, but since it was only a bad of banana chips, she got off with a warning. I wasn't as lucky.

My wife has instituted a morning jog schedule and we now alternate taking the dog for runs. It was my turn today. Had to keep moving to avoid freezing my limbs. There's a wooded and semi-secluded park less than a mile away that gets zero use in the morning and I let her loose there to blow off steam and chase some squirrels.

Re: beer thread - 01/20/0603:00 AM

Too bad sending animals across country is such a hassle.

Back to Beer - I found a really interesting beer at BevMo. Gulden Draak Ale, a dark Belgian Triple/barley wine that is very tasty. The link describes it well: "Gulden Draak balances a natural malt toffee-like sweetness with a mellow happiness and some hoppy accents. The aroma is round, sweet and reveals the 10.5 alcohol by volume." Yum!

Re: beer thread - 02/04/0611:34 PM

On Ray3's recommendation, I stopped by a local Wegman's supermarket this evening -- and they're not joking when they say super. Among the many fine items I purchased was a bottle of Gouden Carolus Triple, from Het Anker brewery in Belgium. I've had one beer from this brewery before -- Gouden Carolus Noel (seasonal) -- which was perhaps the best beer I've ever tasted.

Needless to say, I can't wait to open this bottle. But not tonight. Ok, so I still might open it.

Damn! I could not resist. Sitting next to me in a Polish-eagle-crest-emblazoned beer glass is a pale orange brew with a tight white lacey head. Faint citrus and mild hoppy notes on the nose. I'm waiting for it to warm up a bit before I taste it....

Ok. Here goes.

Oops! Half the glass is gone and I almost forgot to finish the review. This is the most unique Belgian triple I've tasted. I'm not sure if it's my favorite, but it's definitely up there. It's subtle and complex at the same time. A "whole mouth" exerience. Kinda coats the tongue and excites the sweet, sour, and bitter taste buds all at once. Very smooth mouthfeel, and a bit chewy.

Re: beer thread - 02/05/0612:34 AM

Re: beer thread - 03/01/0607:59 PM

Why do my favorite beers have to be seasonal?? I picked up another Gouden Carolus beer a few days ago and decided to crack it open with dinner tonight. This one was their Grand Cru of the Emperor (scroll to bottom), brewed each year only on Feb. 24th. This bottle happens to be a 2005, so it has aged a year, and boy is it tasty! This one ranks right up there with the NoŽl I had last year during a particularly good beer outing. It's not quite as smooth as the Noel, but it's got layers upon layers of flavor. I'd call it malty and semi-sweet if forced to use few words.

Re: beer thread - 03/02/0607:17 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/09/0604:40 PM

I had a tasty but forgettable Rogue Chocolate Stout on my birthday. Definitely stouty, definitely chocolatey, but lacking in depth and oomph. I was hoping for more as I've not yet delved into Rogue's repertoire. Perhaps I don't need to.

Re: beer thread - 05/09/0605:54 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/09/0606:09 PM

Hola, Peter and James! The Beer Thread Lives!

Peter, I've found that - sometimes - Rogue beers get a bit stale. From the perspective of my own market, I can understand why. They are a bit more expensive than the beers I often compare them to. Consequently, it is possible that the Rogue you had may have suffered from bad treatment.

Personally, I had a Rogue XLS Imperial IPA on Saturday, and it was fantastic. Really deep, rich and well-balanced at 9% abv and 74 IBU.

We also had a La Chouffe and I found it as delightful as ever.

As promised, I drank a Lagunitas Censored Rich Copper Ale in your honor last night.

Re: beer thread - 05/09/0607:52 PM

I had mentioned to Peter a few weeks ago that I found a new (to me) Unibroue at BevMo - Don de Dieu. It's a triple that used be only available in Quebec, but has since been released internationally. I probably neglected to mention anything here because it actually wasn't anything special (by Unibroue standards, anyway). Somewhat like Fin du Monde, but not quite as well balanced - it's a bit too sweet. Still a very nice triple, though.

Re: beer thread - 05/10/0604:55 PM

This may have been covered in an earlier post (no, I haven't read the whole thread, I've got mental illness to stamp out, people!), but I am wondering what you guys think of the "Born on" dates and other suggested expiration dates for beer.

Being an amateur, I am enjoying my Sam Adams Octoberfest as much now as I did in October.

Re: beer thread - 05/10/0605:32 PM

I've tried the cranberry lambic from Sam Adams. Yuck. Now regular Sam Adams, on the other hand, yum. My favorite is the black lager, though. Picked up a few in the winter seasonal case at Costco. Gotta love that Costco.

Re: beer thread - 05/10/0606:11 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/10/0610:03 PM

Sage advice, Ken.

Or if you're not yet ready to step up to Unibroue - you could try Brother David's Triple (from Anderson Valley Brewing Co - they also have a double). I'm having one right now and it's actually really nice. Nowhere near as complex as some triples I've had, but definitely not boring either. A little lean, maybe even lightweight when compared to a Unibroue or some of the authentic Belgians, but on it's own it's very tasty without being 'chewy,' nicely balanced and easy-drinking. Good for those times when you're not looking for a meal in a bottle.

Re: beer thread - 05/10/0611:00 PM

Let me make an addendum to my previous post.

Brother David's Triple isn't that lightweight. As it loses it's refrigerator chill it seems to gain a bit of body (still retains it's balance, though), and right about now the 10% alcohol is starting to hit.

Re: beer thread - 05/10/0611:12 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/12/0605:26 AM

I have not read this thread, nor do I intend to. I'm not an exotic beer kind of guy(yet ). But . . . I have come across something through a friend that I found very agreeable. Some of you may enjoy it so I thought I'd share it with you, (I had the one with the burgundy colored label)
http://www.chimay.be/laterz ,
Stone__Man

Re: beer thread - 05/12/0609:15 AM

Re: beer thread - 05/12/0612:02 PM

It's taken me a while to get caught up. I'm stilll NOT, of course, but don't want to let your note slide any farther

In reply to:

So why does the Newcastle at my local Thai restaurant always taste better than the same beer at (I think) the same temp from my frige at home?

Excellent question. The first thing I'd ask is whether or not the restaurant is serving you draught beer while you are drinking a bottle at home. I have found that small, malty beers (like Newkie Broon and Dos Equis) often suffer terribly from the filtration and/or pasteurization process inherent in bottling. The bottles also may be handled better/worse depending upon the supply chain. It's still a long trip across the pond.

Yes, I love Costco. Quality merchandise at a fair price. Good employer, too.

I should think that Peter would be able to suggest some additional local beers in your area. My recollection is that Old Dominion makes some lovely beers. You really should pick up a bottle of Lindemann's Framboise, though. It will change your life.

I've not had the Sam Adams Black Lager. As the company grew more successful, I think it sort of abandoned its roots and the quality has suffered a bit due to increased scale. IMO. I know that they are a very large "contract brewer" now; most of their beer is produced at factories owned by others. I will freely admit that the original Lager remains an engaging beer; there is something about the Hallertau Mittelfreuh hop signature that is uniquely, pleasantly spicy and the balance is just right. I never cared for the Ale, though, and it seems like they've gone the way of Pete's Wicked by supplementing a fine signature beer with "flavors of the month" that leverage their brand reccognition. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

If you like the black lager, there is a very good chance you would enjoy New Belgium 1554 (from Fort Collins, CO).

Re: beer thread - 05/12/0612:28 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/12/0601:48 PM

Hi Tom, and thanks for the thorough reply.

I should have specified that both Newcastles were indeed bottled. I have had experiences with draught beer being markedly superior to bottles, as in the Sam Adams Octoberfest I had last fall at a rib joint that was so great that I bought a case of it at Costco. The bottles just don't compare.

I'm wondering if you are onto something with the whole supply chain issue. Maybe the restaurant just gets fresher bottles.

Thanks everyone for your suggestions. My wife likes to give me grief that I like both dark beers and near beers. I'll admit to being eclectic.

My favorite fruity malt beverage was actually Woody's Ice, imported from England. Only ever saw it in a boutique market in Georgia years ago. Had a great blueberry flavor. Now there's an ever-expanding selection of "alcopops", with lots of the big companies rushing to get into that market.

Re: beer thread - 05/12/0602:05 PM

In reply to:

Yes, we know about that one. It's good.

I don't know how else to ask this except to just ask at the risk of seeming like a TARD lol so here goes.

do you (or anyone) feel drinking the chimey gives an almost opiate sorta ... HIGH? That may not be the most accurate discription but its the best I can do. I VERY much enjoyed it. I felt quite happy, like high happy not drunk happy. (I know I'm laughing at me too LMAO)

Re: beer thread - 05/12/0604:30 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/12/0605:00 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/20/0610:05 PM

Picked up a 4-pack of Dog Fish Head 90 Minute IPA (only 4 for $8??) and a 6er of the same brewery's Raison D' tre. I shared a bottle of the IPA with my wife this afternoon and it may be the best IPA I've ever had. It's won all sorts of awards and, by golly, it deserves them. It leaves my previous favorite (Bear Republic Racer 5, no slouch) in the dust.

Now, I am about to taste my first sip of the Raison. It's Newcastle-dark in the glass, but smells nothing like it. Here goes. Bitter, and sweet. With many layers in between. Where the IPA filled you mouth with a banshee scream of HOPS!, this one yells too many things at once to decipher. But why pick it apart when it's just so good? I've never tasted anything quite like it. Perhaps the Belgian beet sugars ad green raisins used in the brewing process account for that.

Re: beer thread - 05/23/0612:35 AM

hey guys.. just dropping in. its been a while.. and please, not lets make a big deal of it.. hehe.

i still need to post pics of the most MASSIVE BOTTLE of corsendonk you have ever seen!! i kid you not. my local beer guy here got them for me from houston back in the fall. the bottle is easily 2 1/2 ft tall. its a 3 liter bottle. it weighs like 20lbs.

i was gonna open it and drink it at my super bowl party, but i started on knob creek and coke around noon, and by game time there was no need for me to open it. and the bottle is equal to about a 12-pack, so i will need some help with it.

anyway, i will get those pics posted here in a few days. i just gotta share my joy of beer in huge bottles.. its just kinda cool. aint it.?

BTW- i did get a new 'toy' a few weeks ago. might have to post some pics of it too.(dirty minds stop here!!)

Re: beer thread - 05/23/0612:40 AM

But John, it's a big deal indeed, because we've missed you terribly! We'll be waiting anxiously to learn of your new "toy" and except for our newer members we have a good idea of what you may have in mind for it.

Re: beer thread - 05/23/0606:59 PM

Re: beer thread - 05/24/0608:28 PM

I feel special, because I know Amie and the Axiom elves did this on purpose. 61,000 views and they moved the whole darn thread!

obbeer: Got a badly aged batch of Pike Naughty Nellie's the other day. It is usually a beer I really enjoy, but clearly this was past its prime. Way.

Also working my way through a sixpack of Hale's Red Menace (with a picture of the Fremont statue of Lenin on the front). Your basic American Red/Amber beer, I'm sorry to say. Nothing wrong with it, but I just always find those beers to be pretty lifeless.

Re: beer thread - 05/24/0610:49 PM

good to see all the regulars in here.. i was looking at my post count, and thought, "man, was i here a lot, or what.??" used to be at least.

things are all well here. just havent been on the computer much anymore. i think i kinda got burned out on it. like i told someone, it was a 'faze'. i still creep every once and a while, but obviously not posting much..

i have some pics to post, eventually, and i helped set up another system for a friend of mine, and we are gonna post those pics as well.. he even topped me by getting a 42" hitachi ultravision plasma. the a$$hole!! hehe

but, this is beer, and i am in the wrong place to talk about that. ya'll take it easy, and i will catch you later.

Re: beer thread - 06/10/0601:45 AM

Re: beer thread - 06/10/0602:16 AM

Tom, whenever I read your posts on this thread, I get sooo thirsty for a good beer. It must be the way you describe the taste of every one of them! My problem is, none of the beer you mention is available at my local grocery store. The store is good sized with it's own separate liquor store which seems to have a nice variety of beer, but I get overwhelmed trying to choose it. You see, I hardly ever drink beer, but when I do, it's normally at the folks house who always have nothing but Busch Light or Coors Light. It's not that they don't like good beer, but they are cheap and prefer beer that you can drink a few cans in a row and not get full (you know...light beer=less filling?!)! So can you recommend something that might be grocery store friendly in the midwest (besides the obvious foreign imports like Guinness, Bass, etc.)? I like a smooth beer that's not too bitter, if that helps. I just don't know where to start!

Re: beer thread - 06/10/0609:54 PM

Mary, you are too kind.

I actually think bigjohn does a much better job than I do of describing the flavors and nuances of the beers he experiences. Hopefully, it's not that I lack the ability, but I certainly do lack the will to convey that level of detail. I guess I feel like most folks around here know the broad strokes of most styles by now, so I don't feel like typing "opaque, with a slight reddish hue. Earthy, with spicy hop overtones" etc.

Since I have no way of knowing what bottled beer brands might be available in your area, the best I can probably do is steer you towards some styles and advise you to "think globally, drink locally". That is, I'm a big fan of local American craft breweries.

You might like to try American Wheat Beers (or Hefeweizens). They are often soft and drinkable. Due to the wide variety of yeasts employed - and the fact that the interplay between the yeast and the wheat is the defining characteristic of the style - Hefeweizens do tend to vary from sweet and soft to pungent and sour. However, marketing-wise (as opposed to stylistically), it is obvious that many micro breweries use their wheat beers as "entry-level craft beers", and they often become the brewery's cash-cow (see Pyramid and Widmer).

You would probably also enjoy anything called a Cream Ale. The Sleemans (from Canada) is remarkably good, I think. Breweries also often make things they call Blond Ale, which is typically a little less hoppy/alcoholic than their Pale Ale.

Most small breweries don't have time or inclination to make lagers any more, even if they did have the facilities. Lager yeast (as opposed to Ale Yeast) reguires a longer and colder fermentation, which necessarily costs more and reduces throughput. You might enjoy any craft lager, particularly if it is labeled or alleged to be "pre-prohibition" style (meaning that it is an all barley-malt beer, as opposed to the current American factory versions that employ large amounts of headache-inducing adjuncts like corn or rice). I still like the Session Beer brewed by Full Sail in Oregon; it comes in an unassuming white box full of 11 oz stubby bottles (12 packs only).

Pale Ales are a crapshoot, at best. Many American brewers have distinguished themselves from their European pregenitors by simply ramping up the hops to Eleven - effectively making the beer an India Pale Ale instead of the subtle and balanced version God intended. Not that I don't love a good IPA, but some brewers are afraid to use the term but not at all reticent to use the corresponding hop levels.

Better for you would be an ESB (Extra Special Bitter). Typically red in color, the best examples are lively but wonderfully balanced. Don't be put off by the color, and fresher is always better, especially with this style. An Ordinary Bitter is - not surprisingly - an even smaller beer, more difficult to brew but a joy to drink.

It would appear that you have a couple of brewpubs in Davenport (Front Street and Granite City). You might like to go there and order a sampler of their beers and chat with someone knowledgable. You also might be surprised at the wonderfully complex and unexpected flavors you end up liking.

I'll again offer up that I think Heineken in a can is completely different and much superior to the bottled version.

My Dad always drank the cheapest beer he could find. Hamm's is just what "beer" tasted like to him. I've always kind of thought that people who drink Lite Beer are missing out, or that they just don't really like the taste of beer that much. God loves diversity!

Re: beer thread - 06/10/0611:06 PM

Me, I like a beer that can turn me into a drunken fool after half a glass. But y'all knew that...

Mary, I don't know if there are any in your area, but Trader Joe's or Whole Foods (or other organic/natural/premium/whatever) grocery stores often carry a wider variety of beers than your usual supermarket. Might be worth a go. Out here, Trader Joes has/had a 2005 anniversary beer that I believe is simply a relabeled Unibroue Edition 2005. It's certainly made by Unibroue. Now, I haven't tried this beer yet (just had anothe of my horded 2004s last week), but as it is made by Unibroue, it should be nicely nuanced, rather high in alcohol, and very easy to drink. The Unibroue beers are generally very good (as are most Belgians or Belgian style beers I've tried), although you usually won't find them in a grocery store, unfortunately.

Re: beer thread - 06/11/0606:30 PM

Thanks so much for your thorough reply, Tom! I think I know what I'll do...I'll go to the store and write out a list of what they have for you so you can help me choose a few! As if you have all the time in the world, huh?

Ken, I will try your suggestion as well although I have a feeling I'll strike out trying to find that beer around here. We do happen to have a small health food store here, but I've never thought to check out their beer section before. I'll definitely see what they have the next time I'm there. Great idea!

Here's another question that perhaps someone can answer for me. Is there a way you can tell how old the beer is? Can it get too old to drink? Recently, I saw some Asahi beer (which I happen to like) on the shelf but the bottles looked really dusty like it had been sitting there for awhile. I didn't buy it thinking maybe it had gone bad or something.

Also, I try to avoid beer out of clear or green bottles because all I've tasted are skunky to me. Do you think this is why Heineken tastes better out of a can than their green bottles? I remember while in France a long time ago, I drank Heineken a lot on tap and really enjoyed it. From memory, I think it was also better than the bottled version which seems a bit skunky to me. I've never tried it out of a can. Anyhow, I've heard that the reason these beers are skunky is because of a reaction to light. It is why most beer is bottled in brown bottles. Hmmm?!

Re: beer thread - 06/11/0607:55 PM

Short version (ie, all I know), yes, that's why many beer bottles are brown.

On a side note, Tom, and anyone else, really, do you know how soon I'll have to drink my stash of 2004? I think I've got 4 or 5 bottles left, and it would be a tragedy to have it go bad. Generally we drink one a month or so.

Re: beer thread - 06/11/0610:22 PM

Re: beer thread - 06/11/0610:27 PM

Re: beer thread - 06/12/0601:20 AM

Mary, I hope that it is a big list

Quote:Can it get too old to drink?

Absolutely. Unlike good red wines, most beers have a very definite optimal shelf life. Both hops and alcohol act as preservatives, so styles high in one or both are more likely to sustain prolonged storage without negative effects. You are definitely correct to eschew small beers (like Asahi) that are of dubious vintage. Lack of refrigeration is bad. Light is bad. Dust is bad. Many beers have a origination date coded on the label; I'd have hoped the practice was more prevalent by now.

Some beers get better with age, but those are clearly in the minority, and you would have to enjoy the particular effects of the aging (some people like sherry notes, others don't). Generally, beer is better fresher. The Unibroue 2004 is a good example of a beer that will age well under the right conditions; it is relatively high in alcohol and is bottled on lees (there is live yeast in the bottle). Even with those factors, you would still want to ensure that the bottle remained at cellar temperature (50-60 degrees F). Higher temperatures WILL degrade the beer.

Likewise, your observation about the negative effects of light is absolutely correct. Many beers - again, especially those that are light in color, low in hops and low in alcohol - are highly susceptible to being "light struck", which imparts a particular "skunky" aroma and flavor to the beer. That factor is certainly part of the reason why I prefer cans to bottles for those beers made 9,000 miles from home.

The effect is quick and profound. There are several reasons why the traditional German Bier Stein came into being. While some of the factors are likely anecdotal rather than deliberate, they remain valid. To whit, a closed lid on a ceramic vessel accomplishes many things. It not only keeps the beer colder, but also prevents the effect of sunlight, keeps bugs (like yellowjackets) out of the beer, helps maintain carbonation, and prevents leaves and chestnuts (or other detrius) from landing in your precious vessel of suds. It is an altogether ingenious invention. But, my last name has many vowels, so I come from Alsatian bias.

Ken, as long as you keep the Edition 2004 refrigerated, it should last virtually indefinitely. Heat and light are your enemies. If you eliminate them, that is a beer that will perservere nicely.

Brown bottles are better than green which are better than clear. However, none is immune to the effects of light and heat. Though we are conditioned to think otherwise, can technology is really much superior to bottles nowadays due to not only the light factor, but also the ability to negate negative Ph/metallurgic reactions by coating the aluminum with inert plastic materials.

That being said, there is really no substitute for live beer (on draught or on lees). ANY beer that is bottled or canned will change both during the packaging process as well as during storage, most of the time much to their detriment. I vividly recall talking to the brewer at Redhook when he observed that the diatomacious earth filter they used to ensure bottle stability actually filtered the beer so much that it changed the color. Pasteurization and ultra-filtration - in my opinion - rob any beer of its life and character. While necessary for shipment and storage, you pay a significant price in quality. Beer has only four ingredients - water, malt, hops and yeast - and the measures taken to ensure that the yeast is dead-in-the-bottle rob the beer of one of its essential elements.

Re: beer thread - 06/12/0601:29 AM

Re: beer thread - 06/12/0601:33 AM

Sean, that's nice of you to say. But there are lots of way beergeekier people than me, for sure.

I know some stuff. However, on a really fundamental level, Brewing Chemistry is a "hard science", and I'm a generalist/humanist. I care more about the people enjoying the beer than what happened to make it Beer.

In homebrewing, it is said that some people are chemists, some people are cooks, some people are engineers, but EVERYBODY is a janitor. I just don't enjoy wearing rubber boots and washing buckets enough to devote more time to beer. I pretty much stopped brewing when I decided I'd rather spend Saturdays with my kids than sanitizing equipment in the garage.

Re: beer thread - 06/12/0611:07 AM

Quote:Mary, besides HyVee's, you might also visit World of Spirits on Jersey Ridge Rd.

HA!HA! Thanks, John! I love it when you guys do research for others...in their local area! How did you know it was HyVee? I could have been talking about Super Target or Walmart!

Thanks Tom for the great information! Oh...and I have tried Granite City, but not the Front Street Brewery. I only tried one beer at Granite City, but I enjoyed it. We also have the Blue Cat Brew Pub which is just across the river in Rock Island, IL. I went there with my dad a long time ago for lunch and we each had their sample platter which was six 4oz beers per platter! I remember liking some of them, but some were funky as well (like ginger flavored). We drank them all anyway and came back to work a just a little bit "schnockered".

Re: beer thread - 06/12/0611:59 AM

Hey, Tom! Maybe I'll go to John's Grocery the next time I'm in Iowa City. I almost forgot about these guys. They've got a huge selection of beers. When you get the chance, maybe you can browse their list and let me know if you've tried any! Am I making too many demands?

Re: beer thread - 06/12/0603:01 PM

That is a spectacular website. I'll bet it's even better in person. Wow!

Perusing their astounding selection did give me a few additional ideas. Again, I urge you to focus on American craft breweries if possible. There are few reasons to NOT "buy American" in this case.

I am not familiar with all of these beers, but I am well acquainted with some of the breweries.

I have always liked beers from Breckenridge, and their "Summer Bright" might suit you. Lakefront Brewery has an excellent reputation, and the Klisch Pilsner and ESB both appear to be nicely balanced, smaller beers. Goose Island Brewery makes some fantastic beer, and their Summertime appears to be pretty approachable. I have had good beer under the Berghoff label, and they have a Pils and a Lager you might enjoy.

I'd again urge you to consider Cream Ales, although the only ones at John's I could vouch for are Boddingtons (in cans with the nitrogen widget) and the previously mentioned Sleeman.

Finally, you might really enjoy Wit beers. The style is light, soft and distinctive, with unmalted wheat, curacao orange peel and coriander. I see that John's has one contract brewed for them (Generations White Ale), and it might be worthwhile if you've not experienced a Hoegaarden.

I might be able to be more helpful if I had more examples of beer that you really liked and why.

Re: beer thread - 06/12/0610:55 PM

Mary, it's well-known all over town that you shop at Hy-Vees! Besides, whenever I'm in Davenport, I'd certainly shop at Hy-Vees(except I'd go to Fareway for meat, of course)and then head over to World of Spirits....unfortunately I've never been in Davenport and my info results from the fact that Google knows all, together with a guess. The guess was from reports that for a supermarket Hy-Vees had a pretty good separate beer/wine section, which sort of matched your description of where you shopped. There were also comments that World of Spirits had probably the best beer selection in the Quad Cities area.

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0601:06 AM

John, your post freaked me out at first! I thought, "there's NO WAY that John ever comes through Davenport." You were very convincing though!

Randy, yes, the Captain's Table is very good. But to be quite honest, I don't go out to eat that often around here because I normally leave disappointed. I can't stand when I spend a lot of money on mediocre food which seems to happen quite often around here. It could be that I'm just too picky as well!

Ken & Tom, I just checked out reviews of John's Grocery in Iowa City, and I guess they are just loaded with beer...more than what's even listed on their website! The last review was written at the end of May and they mentioned that Unibroue is coming in the near future!

What's funny is that I haven't been to John's since I was in college which was probably just to get a keg of Miller Lite for a party we were having. Everyone got their kegs there! I didn't think of checking out anything else because the place was sort of a dump, but little did I know what we were missing out on! But when you're a young college student, all you want is something cheap to get drunk on. We never thought too much about experiencing different flavors...unless it was schnapps. Ewww...don't care for schnapps too much now.

Re: beer thread - 06/13/0604:05 AM

If I were trying to say that, I'd have said "onto one hand."

Oh, and I've never blacked out. It's amazing what some people cannot recall the next day. "Yes, you were really running around screaming 'Mommy loves me!' at the top of your lungs while riding a broomstick and slapping your exposed butt cheek."