I already posted a link to the thread on RC-Monster. There are pictures there along with descriptions of how the programming and audio indicators are identical. Patrick the president of Castle also commented on the matter himself in the thread.

From what I've researched, the Trackstar seems to perform about as well as an MM system (and no I didn't just consult other HK customers on this). So sure it may have some cheaper parts, but if the end result isn't too much of a difference at a $100 difference, then I'll go with the lesser priced one. So I'm sorry if I'm attributing to this knockoff scheme, but I don't really care if any body thinks less of me because of it. Some of us really can't afford to spend a whole bunch of money, even if we are in a spendy hobby.

I want to get my old E-Maxx roller up & running, and with how much I still need to get, it'll be a while before it's finished & I won't be able to afford a fancy brushless system.

__________________
We're all just a little bit mad..................I on the other hand take The Hatter's cake!
-Slash (waterproof), V-maxx XL (waterproof)

I am also in the market searching for 1/8 scale ESC.. Following are my comments after reading the thread..

- Some one mentioned lower quality FETs and an older version internal BEC circuit. These are the same FETs that were in the last version of MMM, and is still there in Tekin RX8. Patrick (President of Castle Creations) said that essentially the new FETs in MMM creates less heat.. Good, but perhaps a little more heat is acceptable for a difference of 100 USD.

- Some are saying the HK does not have warranty. I and most of the other customer of HK continue to claim warranties, and are mostly given the option of a free replacement, or credit to our HK account. So i don't understand what is this thought about HK not having warranty. heck, Tekin only gives 120 days warranty on its RX8. I think the HK warranty is much better.

- If CC wants to compete, they have to have competitive pricing taking into consideration the globalization and interconnection of the world. If their prices are competitive in the first place, Trackstar would probably have never been there, and the MMM would have been in an even more RC Cars than it is now.. Perhaps even the 1/10 scale cars would have also been carrying MMM, and there would have been no CC 1/10 scale escs. I think they call this 'Economics of Scale', though I am not an economist. But I complete agree that Trackstar is a stolen design and that is BAD.

- Made in America??? Fine, if you are American.. I am not, so I don't have that problem. Infact, if you want to play by this rule, non-American should avoid buying USA products.. And now that is some thing you won't like..

I am also in the market searching for 1/8 scale ESC.. Following are my comments after reading the thread..

- Some one mentioned lower quality FETs and an older version internal BEC circuit. These are the same FETs that were in the last version of MMM, and is still there in Tekin RX8. Patrick (President of Castle Creations) said that essentially the new FETs in MMM creates less heat.. Good, but perhaps a little more heat is acceptable for a difference of 100 USD.

- Some are saying the HK does not have warranty. I and most of the other customer of HK continue to claim warranties, and are mostly given the option of a free replacement, or credit to our HK account. So i don't understand what is this thought about HK not having warranty. heck, Tekin only gives 120 days warranty on its RX8. I think the HK warranty is much better.

- If CC wants to compete, they have to have competitive pricing taking into consideration the globalization and interconnection of the world. If their prices are competitive in the first place, Trackstar would probably have never been there, and the MMM would have been in an even more RC Cars than it is now.. Perhaps even the 1/10 scale cars would have also been carrying MMM, and there would have been no CC 1/10 scale escs. I think they call this 'Economics of Scale', though I am not an economist. But I complete agree that Trackstar is a stolen design and that is BAD.

- Made in America??? Fine, if you are American.. I am not, so I don't have that problem. Infact, if you want to play by this rule, non-American should avoid buying USA products.. And now that is some thing you won't like..

I could be wrong, but just sharing my thoughts.

Basically if it has similar parts as the old MMM then it shouldn't do too bad performance-wise. So let me do the math here: $100 less, same performance, slightly lesser-quality parts(slightly shorter runtime)......I'm definitely willing to settle for the $100 cheaper option. For some of us thats quite a bit of cash, especially considering some of us had to sell our Traxxas Summit to survive through half of the last school term

I interviewed people inside & outside of HK, & they all agree that HK has good warranties. If I got the same response on many other sites other than HK, then I guess that means it must be true.

Since CC is an american company, they need to understand the current american economy. And in this current american economy, people are gonna do all they can to save money, even find alternatives to top brands. I bought a bag of imitation lucky charms for greater quantity at 3/4 the price, and it tasted EXACTLY the same. The same goes for these chinese knockoffs vs CC, if they want to maximize their business then they need to be competitive in their prices. The "Higher price=higher quality" phrase is a load of BS, and that train of thought WILL NOT work in this economy. Sure, if I could afford the system then I'd have it in both my Slash and my E-maxx. Currently, I can't even afford one setup. And I do agree that it was BS that their design got stolen, but I doubt that the higher-quality parts cost twice the price.

Same story with lipos, why buy a $160 3s from Maxamps when you can get the exact same thing from Turnigy for $30?

__________________
We're all just a little bit mad..................I on the other hand take The Hatter's cake!
-Slash (waterproof), V-maxx XL (waterproof)

I started with the first CC mamba25 for my 1/18: problems cogging. Later CC cam wtih a Mamba max for 1/10. Guess what: we had problems again, cogging and the supplied software could NOT run on Vista if you didn't open it as administrator. The first month we were supplied with different firmware versions. After 4-5month we had it running smooth.
Today I use the Chinese Hobbywing Xerun esc in my cars: cheaper and without any problems. They are even sensored! Even their software is running normal under Windows 7 64bit!
In my boat I have also a Chinese esc made by ETTI. In the boatingworld this is the best ESC at the moment and you know why? They are WATERPROOF!
CC is staying behind far away in the boatingworld and as for me: I am happy with my Chinese stuff!

By the way: 99% of the radiosets are manufactured in China or Japan and why don't nobody complain about that? I have never seen an US made radio!

I started with the first CC mamba25 for my 1/18: problems cogging. Later CC cam wtih a Mamba max for 1/10. Guess what: we had problems again, cogging and the supplied software could NOT run on Vista if you didn't open it as administrator. The first month we were supplied with different firmware versions. After 4-5month we had it running smooth.
Today I use the Chinese Hobbywing Xerun esc in my cars: cheaper and without any problems. They are even sensored! Even their software is running normal under Windows 7 64bit!
In my boat I have also a Chinese esc made by ETTI. In the boatingworld this is the best ESC at the moment and you know why? They are WATERPROOF!
CC is staying behind far away in the boatingworld and as for me: I am happy with my Chinese stuff!

By the way: 99% of the radiosets are manufactured in China or Japan and why don't nobody complain about that? I have never seen an US made radio!

Exactly. And economically, we're so far deep in the recession that some of us have no choice but to buy the cheaper chinese stuff. Much of the stuff we make here, china can make cheaper. We might be able to buy back some of our bonds if we could start selling china something it didn't have........Clean air? Clean water?.........Humanitarian policies?

__________________
We're all just a little bit mad..................I on the other hand take The Hatter's cake!
-Slash (waterproof), V-maxx XL (waterproof)

- If CC wants to compete, they have to have competitive pricing taking into consideration the globalization and interconnection of the world. If their prices are competitive in the first place, Trackstar would probably have never been there, and the MMM would have been in an even more RC Cars than it is now.. Perhaps even the 1/10 scale cars would have also been carrying MMM, and there would have been no CC 1/10 scale escs. I think they call this 'Economics of Scale', though I am not an economist. But I complete agree that Trackstar is a stolen design and that is BAD.

The thing is that CC spend hours of developing and testing the ESC. And make it constantly better (V1-V5). The engineers who created the ESC need to be payed too. This cost is called R&D and costs a lot of money.
What Trackstar does it just copy the design, produce it and sell it. They just have no R&D costs because they just copy it from someone else.

The thing is that CC spend hours of developing and testing the ESC. And make it constantly better (V1-V5). The engineers who created the ESC need to be payed too. This cost is called R&D and costs a lot of money.
What Trackstar does it just copy the design, produce it and sell it. They just have no R&D costs because they just copy it from someone else.

However the sad thing is that many of us right now can't afford to up & buy a spendy MM brushless system. So what's the next best thing we can do? buy the knockoff. What else is there to do? buy some other crappy brushless system that doesn't even compare? I'm sorry, but I doubt their sales will do very well unless they can bring their price down into the "affordable" range. Maybe put the R&D department on a budget?

__________________
We're all just a little bit mad..................I on the other hand take The Hatter's cake!
-Slash (waterproof), V-maxx XL (waterproof)

The thing is that CC spend hours of developing and testing the ESC. And make it constantly better (V1-V5). The engineers who created the ESC need to be payed too. This cost is called R&D and costs a lot of money.
What Trackstar does it just copy the design, produce it and sell it. They just have no R&D costs because they just copy it from someone else.

Lot of Chinese things are copied but I don't think Hobbywing isn't copying anybody. They have their own R&D since they are also produce industrial esc's. I'll stick to hobbywing, besides that CC manufacture their stuff in........China!

Lot of Chinese things are copied but I don't think Hobbywing isn't copying anybody. They have their own R&D since they are also produce industrial esc's. I'll stick to hobbywing, besides that CC manufacture their stuff in........China!

Just about everything in our economy is/was made in China. After all, this is an international hobby. Plus as a big business, CC knows that parts & labor come cheap in China.

__________________
We're all just a little bit mad..................I on the other hand take The Hatter's cake!
-Slash (waterproof), V-maxx XL (waterproof)

Ive only been in the hobby a short time and Its Hobbywing if I cant afford Castle. Nothing else. Ive tried other "chinese" esc's to have them die quickly. I like the ability to call up tech support and have help there or have my faulty product quickly replaced.
Now..Hobbywing products have provin them selves and made there footprint in the hobby world. It doesnt seem there copying anyones designs. Ive actually owned several EZ and XE Run ESC's and there about bulletproof IMO.
As for Toro, Trackstars, Quik and the countless other cheap ESC's you can keep them. You can buy a used ESC on the Tech for a few bucks more than the cost of one of the mentioned ESC's and still have CC tech support's there to help.

Ive only been in the hobby a short time and Its Hobbywing if I cant afford Castle. Nothing else. Ive tried other "chinese" esc's to have them die quickly. I like the ability to call up tech support and have help there or have my faulty product quickly replaced.
Now..Hobbywing products have provin them selves and made there footprint in the hobby world. It doesnt seem there copying anyones designs. Ive actually owned several EZ and XE Run ESC's and there about bulletproof IMO.
As for Toro, Trackstars, Quik and the countless other cheap ESC's you can keep them. You can buy a used ESC on the Tech for a few bucks more than the cost of one of the mentioned ESC's and still have CC tech support's there to help.

lol they make any EZ & XERun's for 1/8 scale?

__________________
We're all just a little bit mad..................I on the other hand take The Hatter's cake!
-Slash (waterproof), V-maxx XL (waterproof)

http://www.b-p-p.com/product.php?pro...8&cat=0&page=1 If you choose the ESC only, its $129 and mine came with the castle link in the box as well. Looks like they are out of stock right now, can't blame them at that price, I'm sure they will get more in. I guess nobody likes to actually save up and buy quailty stuff anymore from all this talk of basically being forced to buy the cheap stuff.

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