S.Korea surrenders to Creationists pressure to remove Evolution from textbooks.

Mention creationism, and many scientists think of the United States, where efforts to limit the teaching of evolution have made headway in a couple of states. But the successes are modest compared with those in South Korea, where the anti-evolution sentiment seems to be winning its battle with mainstream science.

A petition to remove references to evolution from high-school textbooks claimed victory last month after the Ministry of Education, Science and Technology (MEST) revealed that many of the publishers would produce revised editions that exclude examples of the evolution of the horse or of avian ancestor Archaeopteryx. The move has alarmed biologists, who say that they were not consulted. “The ministry just sent the petition out to the publishing companies and let them judge,” says Dayk Jang, an evolutionary scientist at Seoul National University.

The campaign was led by the Society for Textbook Revise (STR), which aims to delete the “error” of evolution from textbooks to “correct” students’ views of the world, according to the society’s website. The society says that its members include professors of biology and high-school science teachers.

The STR is also campaigning to remove content about “the evolution of humans” and “the adaptation of finch beaks based on habitat and mode of sustenance”, a reference to one of the most famous observations in Charles Darwin’s On the Origin of Species. To back its campaign, the group highlights recent discoveries that Archaeopteryx is one of many feathered dinosaurs, and not necessarily an ancestor of all birds2. Exploiting such debates over the lineage of species “is a typical strategy of creation scientists to attack the teaching of evolution itself”, says Joonghwan Jeon, an evolutionary psychologist at Kyung Hee University in Yongin.

I always thought that South Korea was a progressive and modern society. What the hell happened?

I believe one doesn't have to believe in only one or the other. I believe that we were created by God. That doesn't mean evolution doesn't occur. To think all life started as single cell organisms and over millions of years we evolved to what we are now with the complexity that is a human being to me is just as much a miracle than believing in God. I believe both are equally worthy of being accepted.

I believe one doesn't have to believe in only one or the other. I believe that we were created by God. That doesn't mean evolution doesn't occur. To think all life started as single cell organisms and over millions of years we evolved to what we are now with the complexity that is a human being to me is just as much a miracle than believing in God. I believe both are equally worthy of being accepted.

I'm not going to turn this into a religion debate because that's not why I made the thread, but I will say this: Evolution is a fact. For this, it needs to not be removed from academic studies, not less so than other-standard biology or astronomy or math. Even if we ignore who complained to have evolution removed from the textbooks, this is still an outright egregious action on the South Korean Ministry of Education's part.

I believe one doesn't have to believe in only one or the other. I believe that we were created by God. That doesn't mean evolution doesn't occur. To think all life started as single cell organisms and over millions of years we evolved to what we are now with the complexity that is a human being to me is just as much a miracle than believing in God. I believe both are equally worthy of being accepted.

Remember that religous topic's are banned on this forum, but for now it seems to be going ok, so if i see any arguements il be locking this thread asap, please keep it on topic and try not to attack each other beliefs.

All I was saying was that I fully believe in evolution...but as a form of creation I think that is subject to debate. I don't think it should be taken out just that other methods of creation are commonly accepted as well could be mentioned in the book...including creationism. Evolution is indeed a fact...it happens all the time but evolution as the means of creating all life on the planet...that is not a fact. There are huge holes in evolutionary theory that can not be proven other than with beliefs and assumptions on scientists part. I totally respect anyones opinion and don't think anyone should force one on any other person. I see nothing wrong with teaching creationism as long as they teach other theories as well.

We all know one thing that is absolute TRUTH...and that is men with power always will slant the way history is taught. There is no way around it we see all over that History is slanted one way or another based on those teaching it and from what side it comes. From country to country there is variations and I would guess that none are exactly accurate. I think it a shame to just teach one idea on this matter. Give the facts and opinions of both and let the child decide. There are more people of religous faith in the world than not and I would guess that a majority believe in some type of creationary theology. They have numerous reasons for believing that and also you can state scientist have their theories as well. We shouldn't force one opinion over another. A free mind is important for children to decide...not be endoctrinated. I see no reason both couldn't be given a spot in textbooks and say there is no absolute agreement. Just like saying how the solar system was developed. Some theories say it was from a star going supernova and there are other theories too. Fact is they are all theories...no one knows. That is why we get taught a few leading ideas. A good author then doesn't make an assumption but just gives those facts. It could be done in this instance as well. They shouldn't leave out evolution at all...they should include both...but to say having creationism in a school is some how an outrage to me is just being narrow minded.

All I was saying was that I fully believe in evolution...but as a form of creation I think that is subject to debate. I don't think it should be taken out just that other methods of creation are commonly accepted as well could be mentioned in the book...including creationism. Evolution is indeed a fact...it happens all the time but evolution as the means of creating all life on the planet...that is not a fact.

Evolution has nothing to do with how life began on this planet. That is the study of abiogenesis, which details how inorganic material becomes what we consider to be life.

Originally Posted by davin_g

There are huge holes in evolutionary theory that can not be proven other than with beliefs and assumptions on scientists part. I totally respect anyones opinion and don't think anyone should force one on any other person. I see nothing wrong with teaching creationism as long as they teach other theories as well.

Opinions have nothing to do with the scientific model. Furthermore, evolution is the most complete scientific theory that we have. Simply put, it's infallible

Originally Posted by davin_g

We all know one thing that is absolute TRUTH...and that is men with power always will slant the way history is taught. There is no way around it we see all over that History is slanted one way or another based on those teaching it and from what side it comes. From country to country there is variations and I would guess that none are exactly accurate.

A truth is an objective state, so thus it cannot be known. Regardless, yes, much of history is either unknown or skewed.

Originally Posted by davin_g

I think it a shame to just teach one idea on this matter. Give the facts and opinions of both and let the child decide.

There are no facts supporting creationism, so I guess that's ruled out then.

Originally Posted by davin_g

There are more people of religous faith in the world than not and I would guess that a majority believe in some type of creationary theology. They have numerous reasons for believing that and also you can state scientist have their theories as well.

The abundance of ignorance is not a call for academic acceptance. Humans are a social species that accepts the norm as the truth, so of course there are many people who are religious.

Originally Posted by davin_g

We shouldn't force one opinion over another.

Science is not an opinion. You need to break away from that mentality.

Originally Posted by davin_g

A free mind is important for children to decide...not be endoctrinated.

I've never seen anyone consider facts, reason, and evidence as a method of indoctrination before. Besides, an indoctrination to what? Really, it's wholly ironic that you even bring this up.

Originally Posted by davin_g

I see no reason both couldn't be given a spot in textbooks and say there is no absolute agreement. Just like saying how the solar system was developed. Some theories say it was from a star going supernova and there are other theories too. Fact is they are all theories...no one knows.

I need you to listen to me. Please, listen: Creationism is not a theory. Evolution, even as you said, is a fact. I believe the dissonance here is glaring now. If we accept every faithful concept with the same value as observation and logical output then we would never progress as a species. I could then propsoe that the universe merely 200 years old and that its creator is a pink muffin, and that would deserve its place in a textbook then. This is what you are saying.

Originally Posted by davin_g

That is why we get taught a few leading ideas. A good author then doesn't make an assumption but just gives those facts. It could be done in this instance as well. They shouldn't leave out evolution at all...they should include both...but to say having creationism in a school is some how an outrage to me is just being narrow minded.

If you want to learn about mythology, then take a specialized class or go to church. Meanwhile, leave the academic achievements of mankind to the schools.

Evolution has nothing to do with how life began on this planet. That is the study of abiogenesis, which details how inorganic material becomes what we consider to be life.

Opinions have nothing to do with the scientific model. Furthermore, evolution is the most complete scientific theory that we have. Simply put, it's infallible

A truth is an objective state, so thus it cannot be known. Regardless, yes, much of history is either unknown or skewed.

There are no facts supporting creationism, so I guess that's ruled out then.

The abundance of ignorance is not a call for academic acceptance. Humans are a social species that accepts the norm as the truth, so of course there are many people who are religious.

Science is not an opinion. You need to break away from that mentality.

I've never seen anyone consider facts, reason, and evidence as a method of indoctrination before. Besides, an indoctrination to what? Really, it's wholly ironic that you even bring this up.

I need you to listen to me. Please, listen: Creationism is not a theory. Evolution, even as you said, is a fact. I believe the dissonance here is glaring now. If we accept every faithful concept with the same value as observation and logical output then we would never progress as a species. I could then propsoe that the universe merely 200 years old and that its creator is a pink muffin, and that would deserve its place in a textbook then. This is what you are saying.

If you want to learn about mythology, then take a specialized class or go to church. Meanwhile, leave the academic achievements of mankind to the schools.

I guess I misunderstood the topic. I thought they were upset that evolution wasn't accepted as the only theory behind how life formed here. While I completely agree evolution has occured we don't have full evidence. There are quite a few missing links along the line from single cell organisms to modern human beings. Even then to believe that those organisms just appeared....how did we get those? Did inanimate objects just begat living objects? Point being is having creationism as a part of the teachings along side to me is no problem. It is widely accepted as just as truthful as for how we have life here as the other. Neither can be proven 100%. Faith and science have an obundance of similarities.

I do think not including evolution in the textbooks is a terrible oversight. It has many practical applications and as been said a very widely accepted view of creation of life here. 100% fact it has not been proven.

As much as I want to go on a full scale rant against these idiots, I'll bite my tongue to keep the thread open..needless to say you can probably guess my thoughts given my utter disdain for any form of religion. lol.

Although there are far too many wild assumptions and strange claims in the theory if Evolution, I still believe every student needs to be taught that stuff. This is kinda sad. I also think that education needs to be separate from faith and personal beliefs so it should be evolution in the books not creationism (unless its religious studies we are talking about)

I guess I misunderstood the topic. I thought they were upset that evolution wasn't accepted as the only theory behind how life formed here.

I don't really understand it either. For many religious sects, there's some agenda against the theory of evolution and it being taught in schools. Normally you find this true with young-earth creationist, but I don't know if this is the case here.

Originally Posted by davin_g

While I completely agree evolution has occured we don't have full evidence. There are quite a few missing links along the line from single cell organisms to modern human beings.

There's really nothing overt that hasn't been explained about the 3.5 billion year evolution cycle of all known life on Earth. The divergence of species, the adaption to breathe air and survive on land, and the development of genders is well explained already. We have species now going under similar changes.

Originally Posted by davin_g

Even then to believe that those organisms just appeared....how did we get those? Did inanimate objects just begat living objects?

Yes.

Believe it or not, but there is no accepted definition for life. To begin with, where do we draw the line? All of life is inorganic matter arranged in a specific fashion. You, me, and everyone else are made of iron, oxygen, zinc, nitrogen, and an assortment of other elements. Self-replicating molecules are already observed within nature -- that's exactly what DNA is, along with certain crystals which do grow and develop, then there's the synthetics created in labs.

The specific way that life came about is indeed unknown, which is why the subject is normally skipped over in many school teachings. If it is taught at all, then the leading theories are taught in tandem. Keep in mind that the first 'life' was incredibly simple, and that it took nearly a billion years of random order before the first multi-celled organism appeared.

Originally Posted by davin_g

Point being is having creationism as a part of the teachings along side to me is no problem. It is widely accepted as just as truthful as for how we have life here as the other. Neither can be proven 100%. Faith and science have an obundance of similarities.

The fact that leading theories cannot be be proven with 100% undeniable super certainty is not reason to teach entirely baseless imaginings along side it in an academic environment. What is accepted as the truth by many out if ignorance is irrelevant; the universe is not impressed or swayed by human whims.

Originally Posted by davin_g

I do think not including evolution in the textbooks is a terrible oversight. It has many practical applications and as been said a very widely accepted view of creation of life here. 100% fact it has not been proven.

Evolution concerns the beginning of life just as much as it explains how to prepare a bowl of cereal.

Although there are far too many wild assumptions and strange claims in the theory if Evolution, I still believe every student needs to be taught that stuff. This is kinda sad. I also think that education needs to be separate from faith and personal beliefs so it should be evolution in the books not creationism (unless its religious studies we are talking about)

There is also the fact that evolution has A LOT more cold hard facts supporting it than creationism..which has none frankly.

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