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Friday, 11 January 2019

Plans and Lies - the long betrayal

Back in the early 1970s, prior to the last EEC Referendum in 1975, Britain's ministers and civil servants were fully aware of the loss of democratic power they were signing up to. They were also concerned to hide the truth from the British public. From a secret Foreign Office file - FCO 30/1048 - the truth is even now emerging. Just one single paragraph -

26. To play an effective part in the Community British members of the Commission and their staffs and British officials as negotiators will necessarily assume more political roles than is traditional in the UK. The Community, if we are to benefit to the full, will develop wider powers and co-ordinate and manage policy over wider areas of public business. To control and supervise this process it will be necessary to strengthen the democratic organisation of the Community with the consequent decline of the primacy and prestige of the national Parliaments. The task will not be to arrest this process, since to do so would be to put considerations of formal sovereignty before effective influence and power, but to adapt institutions and policies both in the UK and in Brussels to meet and reduce the real and substantial public anxieties over national identity and alienation from government, fear of change and loss of control over their fate which are aroused by talk of the "loss od sovereignty"

To translate into modern vernacular, 'Unelected officials will assume more power. This is needed to allow the EEC itself to develop new powers in new areas. Power will flow to the Commission and its officials from national democratic Parliaments. We mustn't stop this, for it would hinder the Community's expansion into a Superstate. We have to control the public's reaction to their losing real and democratic power'

16 comments:

Anonymous
said...

As we see, in high-profile cases on crime, divorce, planning etc., this so-called seventy-five percent of UK law that is supposedly made in Brussels does not include family and divorce, nor Town and Country Planning. Nor does it cover crime and sentencing. Heath, education and professional standards are outside its remit, as are land, property and inheritance, along with most tax bar VAT. National defence and security are not covered, nor are electoral matters, and nor is media regulation. Driving and parking rules and penalties appear to be for us too, along with employment and trade union matters - except for for health and safety. The list goes on seemingly forever. This seventy-five percentt seems to be getting rather hard to find. Surely the Leave campaigns would not misIead anyone though?

since to do so would be to put considerations of formal sovereignty before effective influence and power

And there we have the best reason to 'remain'. Handled better the UK (as I believe that document makes clear elsewhere) would now be running the EU and equal in power and influence to Germany...with France and Belgium 'also rans'. Only downside I think would be the EU Comm President being called "T.Blair".

But a clear majority of British voters in 2016 said explicitly they didn't agree with their governments and bureaucrats giving away their democratic rights, and they wanted them back.

It's not really a coherent or equitable response to say that they've lost marginally fewer democratic rights than might otherwise have been the case, and therefore their decision should not be implemented.

Mark - it's a red herring. No UK law except in the very limited area of Property can go against EU law; the fact that some of our own laws remain intact only means they are not yet contrary to EU law. None of the laws listed are exempt from EU legal supremacy - they just haven't got around to superceding them yet.

BBC- in response to claims of 13% only laws are Eu. And 64% are made in Eu.from 2016.The bbc fact check could only establish for definite that the figure was definitely greater than 13% and definitely less than 64%.

according to Sir Paul Jenkins, a former Treasury solicitor who headed up the Government Legal Department. He thinks the whole debate is a red herring.

"This is one of many areas in the EU debate where both sides describe meaningless nonsense as facts," he says."The impact of EU law varies from sector to sector. In many areas - public order, crime, defence, health - EU laws have minimal impact. But in others - workers' rights, trade - the impact is much greater because the single market and the free movement of workers are at the heart of what the EU is about. The way we organise our NHS is not."

Surely the purpose of harmonisation is that gradually, so that we don't notice, all legislation becomes the same across all the EU?

It is a long slow and ongoing "project". It is harder and more noticeable for the British people, because they have a tradition of habeas corpus, whereas most continental nations have coded systems either the same as, or akin to the code napoleon (corpus juris).

Any moronic remainer that thinks that remaining in the EU is some kind of safe ground. They are fooling themselves. If germany wants, they can make our economy just as dodgy as that of Greece, Italy, Spain etc.., they have conquered Ireland, so they are being lenient there.

But anyway, once the "harmonisation" process is complete, 100% of our laws will be the same as the EU..... It is just a matter of time.

Wait until they start to ramp up the EU FTT! That'll be when they are confident enough to believe that they have conquered London.

Nothing has happened by "stealth" in the EU. It has all been by overt proposals, put before the EU Parliament and the Council Of Ministers, and after long debate and consultation too.

Those proposals have only been within the limited competences of the Lisbon Treaty furthermore. Yes, that can be extended, but only with unanimity, i.e. any state can veto that, as the UK would have done on defence.

If you don't bother to inform yourself, then that's no-one at the EU's fault.

This site seems to be a bunch of paranoiacs, trying reassure one another that they're the sane ones.

If you don't bother to inform yourself, then that's no-one at the EU's fault.

‘This is Prostetnic Vogon Jeltz of the Galactic Hyperspace Planning Council. As you will no doubt be aware, the plans for development of the outlying regions of the Galaxy require the building of a hyperspatial express route through your star system, and regrettably your planet is one of those scheduled for demolition. The process will take slightly less than two of your Earth minutes. Thank you.’

‘There’s no point acting all surprised about it. All the planning charts and demolition orders have been on display in your local planning department in Alpha Centauri for fifty of your Earth years, so you’ve had plenty of time to lodge any formal complaint and it’s far too late to start making a fuss about it now.’

Anon, The UK currently has a codified Constitution - it's called the Lisbon treaty (now the TEU and TFEU). There are thousands of pages of EU law and we must not only obey it but ensure that any other laws we make bow to the EU, however nonsensical. EU law has primacy over our own (Declaration 17). Every UK law must comply. Every one.

From knitted wool coated sheep ornaments to GDPR, from waste disposal to the way Junior Doctors are organised within the NHS, EU law controls every aspect of our lives. The reality is we cannot amend, modify or reject any of the EU law (except by leaving). And we cannot stop the flood of new law made under the constitutional provisions of the TEU and TFEU.

Why are you so afraid of change? Why are you so fearful of independence?