I tend to group people into two groups too: smart vs. stupid (pardon the simplification). Even when well-traveled, stupid people tend to see what they want to see, in order to confirm their preexisting opinion. While smart people can draw smart conclusions even from third party sources.

Accept well traveled as a metaphore for curious and you may get my point better.

....people tend to see what they want to see, in order to confirm their preexisting opinion.

I've been watching this thread for some time now, observing the lot of you simply stoking your own prejudices with selective 'facts' and bluster. "...A tale told by an idiot(s), all sound and fury, signifying nothing." I actually feel sorry for you all. God save me from a bitter, opinionated, empty old age.

Just the same, I read every word, like a passerby taking in the aftermath of a traffic accident.

I've been watching this thread for some time now, observing the lot of you simply stoking your own prejudices with selective 'facts' and bluster. "...A tale told by an idiot(s), all sound and fury, signifying nothing." I actually feel sorry for you all. God save me from a bitter, opinionated, empty old age.

Just the same, I read every word, like a passerby taking in the aftermath of a traffic accident.

Mezzzzzzzzzzzo.

Sounds like you really want to join in the discussion in order to express your own bitter opinion.

"John C Inglis, the deputy director of the surveillance agency, told a member of the House judiciary committee that NSA analysts can perform "a second or third hop query" through its collections of telephone data and internet records in order to find connections to terrorist organizations. "

... so that "only phone metadata" thing is now starting to look a lot more creepier ...

I've been watching this thread for some time now, observing the lot of you simply stoking your own prejudices with selective 'facts' and bluster. "...A tale told by an idiot(s), all sound and fury, signifying nothing." I actually feel sorry for you all. God save me from a bitter, opinionated, empty old age...

Ah, quoting me and Shakespeare in the same post! I am truly honored, Sir!

But seriously, if you quoted a part of my sentence as an example of "a bitter, opinionated, empty old age," it is worth noting that what you quoted was actually an example of a cognitive bias, known in psychology of decision making as a confirmation bias. It happens to be a common human trait, not specifically related to old age.

Ah, quoting me and Shakespeare in the same post! I am truly honored, Sir!

But seriously, if you quoted a part of my sentence as an example of "a bitter, opinionated, empty old age," it is worth noting that what you quoted was actually an example of a cognitive bias, known in psychology of decision making as a confirmation bias. It happens to be a common human trait, not specifically related to old age.

I tend to group people into two groups too: smart vs. stupid (pardon the simplification). Even when well-traveled, stupid people tend to see what they want to see, in order to confirm their preexisting opinion.

Oh Slobodan! We all tend to see what we expect to see ("a common human trait" as you say of confirmation bias).

A distinction that might be workable is - a willingness to accept that we may be wrong.

Please stop your internal bickering and focus on the topic at hand as it is probably one of the most important topics that we'll have to deal with in this decade. Please stop replying to trolls so that we can prevent this thread from turning into drivel.

Snowden's leaking of material has led to increased scrutiny of what the NSA does. The problem with this is that as the scrutiny digs deeper, the story thus far has not gotten any better - rather it seems to just get worse.

It is an organisation that for quite some time had its very existence denied - "No Such Agency" was one of the early nicknames for it.

The problem we face is that right now, we don't know how far down the rabbit hole at the NSA goes.

If the NSA is willing to tell us that it is not the end point targets of phone calls that they analyze but also people two hops removed then given the secretive nature of the place, what is it that they do that they're not willing to tell us but should?

"No, just a refusal to acknowledge that one has taken benefit from others morality."

Previously --

It seems you wish to benefit but not be burdened by Kant.

Isaac, strange as it may seem to you, I actually believe myself to be one of the more moral people I have ever encountered. The only two I've met who outclassed me were my wife and her mother. I never, ever, caught either one in a lie. I find great difficulty with even the whitest of diplomatic fibs, so I studiously avoid situations that give rise to them. That's one reason I avoid direct responses in the Critique section much of the time.

As for benefitting from others' morality - I'm not sure where this is coming from - the humidity is very high; can you explain?