Wow, lots and lots to read and trying to piece it together. I'm sorry, I'm just catching up and I'd like to ask the question to get a simple answer, if you guys don't mind.

I intended to open a Shapeways shop to sell my prop replicas as 3D printed kits to build. So, yes, it was from licensed stuff : Doom, Tron, Bioshock and such.
But, on the opposite, it was complete re-designs of those replicas : The Tron Lightcycle, for instance, has a pilot within ( something never done before ), and I did not copy any existing toys already made.
I just want to do the replicas that have never been made before, the ones I would love to have the chance to buy.

So question is : Even if everything else is different, will the fact that it has the appearance of something that is owned by majors get me or Shapeways a C&D letter, or worse ?

I don't know how copyright laws can be choking creativity when something you want to (re)create is based upon something you know already exsists in name. However I do know that the safest course of action is to create whatever you're creating, get a print, take some photos and ask the IP rights owners for permission to jump on their bandwagon*

*bandwagon = a name or product that a company has spent millions on to get the name where it is today.

The problem with that is in trying to get through to the appropriate person in that large corporation. And when you do it is just too easy for them to say "No", rather than giving it any serious thought.

I have been on the receiving end of a "cease and desist' and it ain't much fun! In my case I was approached by someone who showed me two very rough images from a movie that showed a decorative item she liked. She wondered if it would be possible to recreate it. I did. Started selling and for a while it was my most popular item in my shop. Then I heard from a company that was selling these same items. So closely did my model resemble theirs that they claimed I had bought one and 3D scanned it! Was going to fight it for a while but then gave up...

One of the key things to keep in mind is this: If you make a "Tron" model that is just slightly different to the movie version, and you advertise and sell it as a Tron model then you will indeed be looking for trouble.

Glenn, I've been on the receiving end of a 'claim' that involved a domain name, upshot was that I won as I could prove that the domain name was registered long before the company or trademarks were registered. (yep that took some homework to get there, but I stood my ground and had evidence to back it up)

The safest course of action for all things that may be thought of as someone else's design, copyright, patent* is to simply ask**, "What is your policy regarding the useage of 3D printed models resembling your design and what is the useage policy regarding the name attached to your design?" That exact same question stumped kNex so your mileage may vary with other IP rights owners in getting the rights to reproduce an iconic film model or use that 'household' name for your models.

*don't forget these terms have different legal meanings in different territories.

When you try to get in contact with Disney or another huge company like this one, you better be able to pocket out the big bucks because they are gonna charge you for using their franchise ( and that's normal ). So you better be a company already, able to sell a lot of stuff in stores.
When you are a nobody, like I am, the big company doesn't even want to be concerned with you. The numbers are way too low... But we are in sort of a grey area here : It's too low to produce a line of replica/toy, but they still won't allow a few sets to be sell. I mean, fifty lightcycle kits sold is a great deal for me, for Disney it's laughable.
So, nothing happen, nothing is produced.
And if someone still try, he end up on court. Awesome.

As for creatitvity, yes, I'm using someone else's design. BUT everything else is different : The approach on how to do it, the way to do it, the tricks you're using, the new ideas... and trying to do something better, something that has never been done before.
It's just an engineer's creativity rather than an artist's, but it's still the same brainjuice and efforts that are used here.

Sorry, I have better things to do instead of spending a lot of time trying to go throught all the barrages of " the big company ", to end up getting a " No, f**k off, you ant."

If your idea is 'the next big thing', go ahead, design it, get it printed, make the model page here on Shapeways for public viewing only (this way you have a published design generally recognised as having unregistered rights), then approach the IP owners with your idea/design. If they say no and go ahead with it anyway on their own, if nothing else, you'll have bragging rights and, you never know you, may be surprised when they offer you a job with their design department

Or just take that creativity in another direction for something that is totally your own and launch the product via a crowd source funding program like Kickstarter.

@ stop4stuff : I wrote a long reply to you, and then deleted it ( I'm sure you have better things to do than reading a novel ). In short, I'm not a genious and I do not create " the next big thing ". Just trying to do a good job.
Also, I'd say being in France cuts you out of certain opportunities, like Kickstarter for instance. Of course, there are other websites like Kickstarter but they do not have the same amount of backers, far from it.

@ Phxman : You are totally right, and I don't see myself in a legal battle against a major. This is why I end up doing nothing, unfortunately. End of line...

Davlin, as far as I can see there is nothing stopping anyone in France from starting up a Kickstarter campaign - I'm in the UK and looked at them before when they were limited to the USA only, but their T&C's have changed since then. If you find different please post a link. And my spelling might be carp, but I enjoy reading, it gives my brain something to do in between dreaming up solutions to design ideas - I might snap now and then but I don't bite.

You might contact the people behind this project out of Vienna, Austria and ask them how a European based project can work around Kickstarter's terms. They may be slow to reply, however, as their project just met its funding goal mere hours before it was scheduled to close. I'm sure they're busy celebrating right now.

But more important, some other crowdfunding sites have no such conditions or with some luck are limited to the country where you are... so the point would be how much really matters to be KS based? Or the important part is the promotion in other places where you are going to get supporters (for example a game project in game blogs, forums, etc) and they will work anyways if based in Indiegogo, Ulule, Startnext...? It is a similar thing than SW, if you think about it.

Hi, Shapeways, in your Terms and Conditions, you mentioned that
" You, as a designer, retain all your intellectual property rights in your 3D design, including without limitation any and derivative works like 3D renders. "
My question is:
Do we, the designers, get any evidence of our IP rights ? Such as " model last updated on (date) " or any other evidence ? Which we can present out if someone claims about copyright.

The statements below are my own opinion.. I am NOT an employee of Shapeways. If their legal council wishes to edit this, I encourage them to do so.

=======
The straight up answer is NO. You are not provided with "evidence of your IP".
Shapeways is not the keeper/executor of your intellectual property and the rights thereof. You must arrange for your own backups and documentation.
The language above "you retain..." is really more of a statement that Shapeways will not claim the work as their own.
The statement above does not indemnify you from liability if you copy someone else's work, nor does it position Shapeways as a "registrar" of your IP either.

I have a file in my shop:http://shpws.me/5eUm
It and every other model has a File Status like this:
cube.stl - Originally uploaded on 8 Mar 2012
But.. what this does NOT tell you is what the content or "shape" of the file was on that date.
At any time in the future I can replace that file with a ripoff of something you design, and then I can claim "prior art" based upon the file date above.Note: I would never DO this.. I purely have that model in place to prove my point for THIS discussion.

Shapeways is not in the business of protecting your IP at this level.
You must arrange to secure your IP independent of Shapeways.
This is not something they need to (or necessarily CAN) fix or even address...
If you feel the need to protect your IP, you should retain independent legal council.

Patience, Persistance, Politeness - the 3Ps will help us get us to Perfect Printed Products

I understand the status of Shapeways in the business. I'm not asking if shapeways could do as a register. Maybe Shapeways can consider recording and showing " Last Updated " instead of " Originally Uploaded " ? This can act as something like additional evidence.

I understand the status of Shapeways in the business. I'm not asking if shapeways could do as a register. Maybe Shapeways can consider recording and showing " Last Updated " instead of " Originally Uploaded " ? This can act as something like additional evidence.

Shapeways send you an email every time you upload a file. Not only that but every file on your computer has it's own creation date.
Most modern graphics software gives you the opportunity to fill in metadata for each your files. This is attached to each copy of the file and can be used for copyright notices in the same way that EXIF data is used for raster images.

One of my friends who works in a copyright related company told me that there is an official system of copyrights. This system allows you to upload your work and get an instant official time mark on the work. This time mark is internationally recognized.

As the field of 3D printing grows, we're starting to see more and more cases of copyright infringement, creative sharing, collaboration, and general discussion happening around what is "allowed", what is possible, and what is protected.

To address this, we want to put together a 3D Printing Copyrights 101 guide in the next few weeks, with the help of Michael Weinberg who wrote the awesome whitepaper "It will be awesome if they don't screw it up"

We've done a few blog posts covering the debate over the last two years, and now we want to consolidate new information and answer your questions.

The list so far includes:

101 to copyrights law: the difference between copyright, patents, trademarks and creative commons
What's the DMCA?
Common cases in 3D printing
Creative innovation
What else do you want to know?

It was, that with $10 you could file a copy with Library Of Congress
of any work and receive the stamped copy by return. For software
it was the first 10 pages of the listing - how it would work with a 3D
graphics file I do not know.

DMCA - what territories does your version cover?
An example, GoDaddy insist that their version complies with US law, however US law does not apply to the UK and UK precedent legislation states that an electronic signature can be limited to just the name of the person making the claim typed in an email at the time of the claim and not the US DMCA version of a digital copy of the actual pen-signed-on-paper signed signature. (yes, I've been there and shown them understanding that versions of an 'electonic signature' differ)

Anyone who is stupid enough to think that they can copy someone's or a company's work whether formally registered through whatever system or published, really deserves the pile of poo that will land on their head and all of the consequences that go with that pile of poo.

So, my 'copy/design/patent' design/rights 101 is "Carry on, rip someone off, do what you do and expect to get your ass sued coz you're a chuffin' numpty!" simples, all it is is a little bit of respect and appreiciation for the work of others.

And before you go, tap in Lego to Shapeways search, anything that has LEGO/lego/Lego in the title or a represenation of a LEGO minifigure is breaching The Lego Group's IP rights! Also have a look at how Apple define how their name can be used in relation to 3rd party/aftermarket products - it is different to how TLG chose to let their name be used

FFS, it ain't rocket science to do a bit of research so that one knows that the 'right thing' is donen or is it just that people are so greedy/stupid/DGaS that they just don't care?

I already suggested a long time ago that a simple lookup for word in the title of a model page should be compared against a table of KNOWN registered tradenames and the model uploader informed of their choice of model title.

Paul, while I'm not going address all your issues mentioned here I will tackle one, that of the Lego example. I think quite obviously Lego doesn't really g.a.s. about the modelers here creating and selling something that can be added in to the Lego universe. My feeling is their opinion is probably based on the fact that as long as something doesn't cut into their profits then they will gain a large amount of free advertising and product placement. Now, if a large factory in, ahem, China, was to start pumping out counterfeit Lego blocks that would be a different story. If some maker is producing items that Lego doesn't because there simply isn't a large enough market then how are they losing?

I liken it to the after-market auto parts industry - if someone wants to make a wicked rear light to trick out their 1995 Honda then what the heck does Honda care? They certainly wouldn't make any money by fitting out a factory and tooling molds to make the light for a virtually non-existent market.

The difference being that OOP car parts do come under 'fair use' laws, the USA in particular a has more relaxed stance on this compared to EU laws, however The Lego Group has a published 'Fair Play' policy (google Lego Fair Play) and the same as Apple, they have published usage on their IP rights.

I've been ripped off in the past by numpties who think that anything on the internet is fair game, yet on the internet it takes just as much time as it does to find something to rip off/ripped off as it does to ask for useage rights - greedy/stupid/DGaS ppls deserve whatever comes their way when they chose to ignore/not bother/think they're above the law (obviously, that is just my very biased yet totally true and law abiding opinion)

As far copyright is concerned, in the UK,the lamborghinis are OK, but the SciFi stuff clearly infringes copyright, since only 'artistic' works can be copyrighted. However car manufacturers for the last 20-30 years have been registering their designs so it is likely that these model will infringe the design registration. Whether this matters depends on whether Lamborghini's policy for licensing their designs to model makers.

Of course the people who made these models could have permission from the copyright/registration owners to use their designs, but I would expect them to say so on their model page.

Just my two cents in here: if your model is slightly different from the original, and you do NOT claim it as a 'recreation', and instead only say it was 'inspired by' their design, my understanding is that you are within your rights to do so. They'll probably still send you a cease and desist letter if you get too noisy however, and it's probably still easier and cheaper to give in than fight a legal battle.

EDIT: Just as an example using the discussion above, let's look at LEGO. If you post a model and call it 'a LEGO model' or 'a LEGO toy', you are breaching copyright. If however, you say it 'is properly scaled to work with LEGO products', well, that's wholly within your rights. LEGO doesn't have a copyright on that exact scale.

EDIT: Just as an example using the discussion above, let's look at LEGO. If you post a model and call it 'a LEGO model' or 'a LEGO toy', you are breaching copyright. If however, you say it 'is properly scaled to work with LEGO products', well, that's wholly within your rights. LEGO doesn't have a copyright on that exact scale.

Lamborghini - a few minutes on google reveals http://www.lamborghini.com/en/about/privacy-legal/terms-of-u se/ Whilst that is specifically for usage of itmes from their website, some more digging around also reveals that Automobili Lamborghini S.p.A. are quite hot in protecting their IP rights - specifically if their 'brand' is used in any way without express written consent, expect trouble!

Lego - from http://aboutus.lego.com/en-gb/legal-notice/fair-play/...However, universal awareness that creative products deserve better protection is fortunately increasing.In the LEGO Group, we believe that any original product design should be protected against copying for as long as it is produced and marketed. And that it should be possible to stop such copying and other infringements easily. We also believe that designs, company names and trademarks should not be used in unrelated settings without the owner's consent. Each year, our legal department handles hundreds of incidents involving infringement of our rights, keeps track of developments worldwide and regularly brings infringers to court, making sure that consumers can have confidence that anything bearing the LEGO Group's trademarks or characteristic product features is a LEGO brand product. This is in the best interest not only of our company but also of consumers, primarily children, all over the world.For that purpose, we have defined attitudes and practices intended to secure fair competition and fair dealing towards consumers. Some of them we can - and do - enforce by legal action. Some of them, we wish could be enforced where breaches occur...

It rougly takes about 10 minutes tops to find the correct information needed for any company's IP rights.

And don't forget kiddos, branded products have a brand name to help make them momorable - whilst it may seem that an individual may be paying homage to their favourite product, the IP owner gerenally sees any mis-use as an attempt to use their brand for profit and gets a bit upset.

fwif, I have been involved in a trademark dispute - the trademark owner attempted to claim ownership of a domain name I once owned. I won the case by default after I showed that the trademark owner had registered their trademark after I had purchased the domain name - I even offered to sell the domain name to them for less money than it cost them to instigate proceedings against me but they still pressed ahead. I found the whole episode quite amusing and then rubbed salt in the wound by letting the domain name lapse a few months later.

It really is worth spending a few minutes researching to find out what you can get away with or how much hassle to expect when the IP owner kicks off.

Maybe flickr is a good tool to help. You can take photos in several angles of your design, then upload to flickr. There is a mark aside the photo like "This photo was taken on November 19, 2012 using a Sony DSC-H10." could work as a time stamp.

Carine and Duann are at the US Patent Office in Washington D.C today at their conference on 3D Printing and we are meeting with Michael Weinberg from Public Knowledge next week so the Copyright 101 is coming soon!