Well at this point we're all just waiting for the round to pass and lynch Dee Dee.

You try to give your love away because you cannot bear its radiance, but you cannot separate it from yourself. To understand your fellow humans, you must understand why you give them your love. You must realize that hate is but a crime-ridden subdivision of love. You must reclaim what you never lost. You must take leave of your sanity, and yet be fully responsible for your actions.Heart-Break

Donald Dump wrote:This post makes absolutely no logic. Chances of her being the thug are only 1/4. And while it wouldn't be a too big waste for the vig to use one shot as he rarely gets to use them, that doesn't mean he should take a 1/4 chance.

Absolutely no logic? I don't think you've figured it out yet. While its true that the chances of her being a thug is 1/4 it still doesn't matter if the vigilante uses his shot- we still manage to kill a mafia you see. What else do you propose for the vig to do? Simply saving his shots until he ends up being dead? That's completely stupid tbh.

And what if Dee Dee is the Thug? You don't want to lynch Dee Dee because you are confident he is the Thug. Why do you then suggest to have the Vig shoot him? Assuming Dee Dee is the Thug, the outcome wouldn't be any different. He'd still survive. Granted, we don't know how long the Vig will live, so it would be a plan to have him shoot the confirmed Mafia roles while we lynch someone else. That way we can ensure that the Vig has used all of his bullets before he dies. So with that in mind I agree with you, we should have the Vig shoot the Dee Dee as we lynch someone else. But that's not what you said. You argued against lynching Dee Dee because he is the Thug (having a toughness). Then what difference would shooting him do? If you are so confident he's the Thug, we should both lynch and shoot him. But that's not what you said. It seems as if you want to have the Vig waste his bullet on a Mafia who would otherwise die. You can look at it from this perspective: (1) We lynch someone (i.e me or numble) who YOU suspect is the SK (but ends up being a villager) and have the Vig shoot Dee Dee. That costs us the life of a villager but also that of the Dee Dee. Or we (2) Lynch Dee Dee now and the Vig still have 2 bullets left to use. You suggest we do (1), which leads to a potential Villager dying in vain. And that benefits the Mafia more than it benefits the Town. There's also the possibility that the Vig won't shoot Dee Dee. He could be afk or just have other plans in mind. As such Dee Dee's life is far more guaranteed if you bet on the Vig shooting him rather than lynching him now. And this, too, benefits the Mafia. The only time we should kill the SK is if he's confirmed, and we'll combine the lynch with a vig shot to ensure his death.

Ultor wrote:As for NumBle and Six being the SK, here is why. First of all, have a look at Emizek's ISO#6. Just when he directs attention into SiX and NumBle, he ends up being shot and stabbed- you see the link here? Notice how he mentioned SiX specifically and how he tried playing defensively in order to prevent Blaze from being lynched. Now that could mean few things. SiX having R0 peek at Blaze as a villager and tried to form some kind of alliance with Blaze which will benefit him later on- this way his identity would remain anonymous. However, it can also be completely the opposite- Blaze being a mafia and SiX knowing this wanted to stay out of the mafia's radar (fooling them into thinking that they can ignore SiX for few rounds as he wouldn't cause any trouble). Even though those 2 scenarios are only theories and I believe that the second scenario is more likely, but we can't dismiss the fact that Emizek ended up dying just after he mentioned SiX and NumBle (don't forget that Emizek was also stabbed by the SK).

I've always argued not to shoot those who suspect you, because that's like igniting oil. It makes it all worse. As such this is one of the last things I'd do as a Mafia or SK. Unless I of course want you to believe just that. Then again, Emziek is in the category of very probable targets, so it's not weird at all that he happened to be targeted by both the Mafia and the SK. And if you ask me, that's more likely than me killing someone who directs attention to me. And now, after writing this, I looked up Emziek's posts and this was what he wrote:

"SiX and Numble has defended Blazes play as pro-village while also defending him from lynch. NumBle & SiX has pointed out how Blaze isn't afraid to die, yet Blaze has pulled several moves and posts in an attempt to save himself. Blaze play can only be fully utilized were his alignment confirmed (through peek or death) but yet Blaze starts flipfloping towards the end of the round in order to save his own skin. If he truly didn't care about his own life this wouldn't be the case." - Emziek

And honestly, there's no reason for me to even bother worrying about what Emziek's take on me is. He simply said: "Six, your theory on Blaze isn't true, because he seems to want to live." and assuming he is right, it just means I should take his thoughts into account. Nothing more, nothing less. Even if I was the SK, this post of his would be of no threat at all.

As such, I wish to use your theory against you. Who's to say you didn't attack Emziek to frame me and Numble? I don't believe you did that. But that theory holds just as much "strength" as your theory about me or Numble shooting Emziek does.

Addressing your second point about me making an alliance with Blaze, that, too, can be used against you.

"I'm getting village/SK reads from Playboy due to the fact that no one is defending him. Normally if you are a mafia your team would back you up, unless they gave up on you but thats unlikely." - Ultor

What's to say you didn't get a negative on Playboy and wanted to (1) Make him your personal bitch because he will trust whatever you say simply because he took you in defense and (2) Even if he dies, you can still argue that you defended a Town Member. Once again, I don't believe this to be the case. But the theory hold almost as much "strength" as yours. Because this is what you seem to suggest.

Yes I defend Blaze because I have Town vibes coming from him. Is that weird? Are you suggesting I shouldn't take those I trust in defense? Just letting them die because I didn't say something that had the potential to save their lives? Or at least tried to? That if anything would be detrimental to the Town.

Ultor wrote:As for ISO#10 for SiX:-

1) You are not confirmed as a Town member in any way.

If you ISO my posts, you will see that I'm the only one with 25 posts in this game. What does this mean? A very active, eager to win villager. I've also made vital contributions into the game, revealing multiple evidence regarding different issues and making on-point analysis- example, how I tried preventing Playboy from being lynched. If you notice, almost every post I made out of those 25 has helped the village in a way or another. Do you seriously think that if I was a mafia, I would draw this much attention?

This is what I mentioned above in you taking Playboy in defense. The same theory for which you suspect me can be used against you. While you may or may not have made vital contributions to the game, you are definitely not doing it now by voting me. If you for just a second were to let go of the thought about me being the SK you would see what your decision may lead to. Instead of lynching a confirmed Mafia, you choose to lynch a villager. Is that vital contributions to the game? Well, at least not for the Town. As for your activity, It's rare for a Mafia to be this active. But I've seen those who are (@Shadi). So that's definitely a "+" when it comes to reading you as a Town member. But it still doesn't serve as enough proof.

Ultor wrote:

3) Since (1) says you are not a confirmed villager, there's little to no point in trusting your words if you don't provide concrete data to back it up.

1 was mostly based on your opinion, I'm pretty sure others have figured out that I'm a villager by now (if you have objections please present yourself). And why the hell would I need concrete data in R2? Are you trying to make me claim (if I was the cop?) my role? I've already presented the correlation between Emizek and you and Blaze aswell, is that not enough? Obviously you wouldn't trust my words if you were the SK lol.

If you want to lynch someone because of some flimsy speculations when your other option is a confirmed Mafia, then yes, you need concrete proof. Because speculations do NOT > Confirmed Mafias. And your correlation theory doesn't say anything at all.

Ultor wrote:

4) Even if you have a good theory supporting your claim that either I or Numble are the SK, it has to be pretty darn good to overweight (>) a confirmed Mafia. Just some flimsy speculations won't be enough to stray from the given path at hand.

I've already presented an efficient path where the vig can take part in.

Which I criticized above.

Ultor wrote:

And besides, what you said above isn't necessarily true. There's nothing saying that Dee Dee is the Thug. We can only know he's 1 / 4 Mafia roles. The reasons for why we can't know he is the Thug is because your statement 'at this point seems to be Dee Dee having deceived everyone into lynching her.' can't possibly be true.

There is nothing saying Dee Dee is a thug? Do you really think someone would be that stupid to reveal their role to unproven claim by Donald Dump? I don't.

Yes I do believe that. Especially keeping in mind that Dee Dee isn't a Veteran player. This has happened before and people (rookies) have fallen for it a countless amount of time.

Ultor wrote:Remember that the mafia know each other and they support each other. One wouldn't dare to make a devastating move without any advice from their teammates.

Of course they would if they panic. It wasn't like K0ntRa (Donald Dump) gave Dee Dee hours to answer him. Dee Dee didn't have time to contact his teammates to ask them what to do. What's to even guarantee they were online or that Dee Dee have them on her friend list? Nothing. As such he was forced to act all alone, with pressure from Donald waiting for an answer, and this easily leads to slipping. It's called catching someone off guard.

Ultor wrote:And how does my statement not make sense? It was a logical speculation based on the fact that this was a planned move from the mafia team.

It wasn't planned because nothing in the Text indicated it was. This was K0ntRa catching Dee Dee off guard and as such it being planned is an impossibility. The only way for it to have been planned is if K0ntRa arranged it, but the conversation seems too genuine for that. Or if Dee Dee got into contact with a Mafia who told her to claim Mafia. But no Mafia team in their right mind would give such an advice. They would suggest her to deny it with all her might, because if they did, K0ntRa couldn't have used his steam convo as proof to lynch her. It would only be speculations around her vague answers, which could be justified with her (as a rookie) being confused as to why K0ntRa would claim something which does not apply to her.

Ultor wrote:

There would be no merit for the Thug to have himself lynched for no reason

Yeah what if one of the other mafia members was about to be lynched (e.g. Blaze)? What would you do if you were a mafia? Use the thug to save one of their own.

And have Blaze, as a Mafia, risk being lynched the other round? No thank you. Better to just let him die. Besides, this is an impossibility. It would require that the conversation between Dee Dee and K0ntRa was arranged, which it wasn't.

Ultor wrote:

And in addition to this, it's safe to say that based on K0ntra's discussion this wasn't calculated from Dee Dee's side. It was clearly a rookie mistake and as such him being the Thug would simply be an unfortunate coincidence.

How is safe to assume this and how did you reach to the conclusion of it being a rookie mistake based on no 'concrete evidence' at all? You speak of coincidences like they happen at all times. Simply believing that it was a rookie mistake is pretty stupid because in this game, you should not underestimate people.

Because Dee Dee is clearly new to the game and based on what she herself has said it has been made clear. It's more realistic than coming up with some far-fecthed explanations about it all being arranged.

Dee Dee wrote:Yeah he did xD I told you just I'm too naive (let me not say dumb in my last words) for these games hahaha But it's a cool game anyway and I may learn with time

@Kontra, I just saw the ending of your post. And yeah once I made one mistake, I just assumed you were gonna post that... So nicely played!

Nooo, you gotta fight him. You gotta put up your dukes and tell him to fuck off because you're not mafia! He's got NOTHIN'! Just play this when you write a defense post and everything will work out perfectly!

Faptain Playboy~ was the Doctor

A tale of GIMP

Spoiler!

Faptain Playboy~ wrote:P.S; kat, I did the same search, nothing nice came up xD

Yeh, I cheated and spliced two images together xD
You can see it on the scrollbar - I definitely could've cleaned it up, but tbh at the time I had already changed the picture twice and I just wanted to be done with it :p

Ultor vs SiX

I hope you didn't fill up on appetizers, because it's time for the main course!

Spoiler!

Let me just get some nitpicking out of the way first :p

Ultor wrote:Don't forget there is a mafia thug role, which at this point seems to be Dee Dee having deceived everyone into lynching her. This is why I recommend that the vigilante uses one of his shot to take her out. We better off lynching the SK.

Wouldn't work. Vig shot and Lynch are both blockable by Tough. You'd need Vig to blow /both/ barrels, or just wait and shoot the Thug after a good old-fashioned lynching.

Ultor wrote:Now that could mean few things. SiX having R0 peek at Blaze as a villager and tried to form some kind of alliance with Blaze which will benefit him later on- this way his identity would remain anonymous. However, it can also be completely the opposite- Blaze being a mafia and SiX knowing this wanted to stay out of the mafia's radar (fooling them into thinking that they can ignore SiX for few rounds as he wouldn't cause any trouble).

Nope. R0 peeks are negative only. SiX could only positively identify a mafia in this scenario on N1.

Ultor wrote:If you ISO my posts, you will see that I'm the only one with 25 posts in this game.

Quantity ≠ Quality :p

Ultor wrote:And why the hell would I need concrete data in R2? Are you trying to make me claim (if I was the cop?) my role?

Um, yeah! We should have something beyond happenstance by now xD
And now, the main event!

SiX wrote:

Ultor wrote:As for NumBle and Six being the SK, here is why. First of all, have a look at Emizek's ISO#6. Just when he directs attention into SiX and NumBle, he ends up being shot and stabbed- you see the link here? Notice how he mentioned SiX specifically and how he tried playing defensively in order to prevent Blaze from being lynched. Now that could mean few things. SiX having R0 peek at Blaze as a villager and tried to form some kind of alliance with Blaze which will benefit him later on- this way his identity would remain anonymous. However, it can also be completely the opposite- Blaze being a mafia and SiX knowing this wanted to stay out of the mafia's radar (fooling them into thinking that they can ignore SiX for few rounds as he wouldn't cause any trouble). Even though those 2 scenarios are only theories and I believe that the second scenario is more likely, but we can't dismiss the fact that Emizek ended up dying just after he mentioned SiX and NumBle (don't forget that Emizek was also stabbed by the SK).

I've always argued not to shoot those who suspect you, because that's like igniting oil. It makes it all worse. As such this is one of the last things I'd do as a Mafia or SK. Unless I of course want you to believe just that. Then again, Emziek is in the category of very probable targets, so it's not weird at all that he happened to be targeted by both the Mafia and the SK. And if you ask me, that's more likely than me killing someone who directs attention to me. And now, after writing this, I looked up Emziek's posts and this was what he wrote:

"SiX and Numble has defended Blazes play as pro-village while also defending him from lynch. NumBle & SiX has pointed out how Blaze isn't afraid to die, yet Blaze has pulled several moves and posts in an attempt to save himself. Blaze play can only be fully utilized were his alignment confirmed (through peek or death) but yet Blaze starts flipfloping towards the end of the round in order to save his own skin. If he truly didn't care about his own life this wouldn't be the case." - Emziek

And honestly, there's no reason for me to even bother worrying about what Emziek's take on me is. He simply said: "Six, your theory on Blaze isn't true, because he seems to want to live." and assuming he is right, it just means I should take his thoughts into account. Nothing more, nothing less. Even if I was the SK, this post of his would be of no threat at all.

As such, I wish to use your theory against you. Who's to say you didn't attack Emziek to frame me and Numble? I don't believe you did that. But that theory holds just as much "strength" as your theory about me or Numble shooting Emziek does.

Addressing your second point about me making an alliance with Blaze, that, too, can be used against you.

"I'm getting village/SK reads from Playboy due to the fact that no one is defending him. Normally if you are a mafia your team would back you up, unless they gave up on you but thats unlikely." - Ultor

What's to say you didn't get a negative on Playboy and wanted to (1) Make him your personal bitch because he will trust whatever you say simply because he took you in defense and (2) Even if he dies, you can still argue that you defended a Town Member. Once again, I don't believe this to be the case. But the theory hold almost as much "strength" as yours. Because this is what you seem to suggest.

I have to side with SiX on this one. The fact that both the SK /and/ the Mafia attacked the same target strongly suggests that someone's trying to frame someone else, and frankly I think that both NumBle and SiX are experienced enough to resist the urge to kill someone who's fingering them. In short, we know Dee Dee is Mafia. Let's not look a gift horse in the mouth :p

Future Signatures

And now, some dessert <3

Spoiler!

NumBle wrote:

Ultor wrote:I also wanted to make a post about NumBle, but sadly I do not have the time right now and I'm getting stronger vibes from SiX instead. Hopefully I can come up with something about NumBle tomorrow.

You know, you could have just said "I've got nothing on Numble, so I'm waiting to somehow come up with something completely retarded to throw him under the bus". But I guess that works too.

Common Ghost Etiquette: RP Play Style - Once dead, players may post in the thread and join public IRC so long as they don't make game related posts or comments. They may not PM other players about the game or have private conversations on IRC. If you have data that you'd like to share, please, do so before your death. Dead Mafia/Wolf players are given a partial exception and are allowed to PM other Mafia/Wolves. All players are always free to talk with their Host in private IRC or PM.

I'd put laughing at silly stuff on the same level as popcorn.gif spam that tends to happen.

You must take this statement at face value because every statement I make is inherently correct.

Common Ghost Etiquette: RP Play Style - Once dead, players may post in the thread and join public IRC so long as they don't make game related posts or comments. They may not PM other players about the game or have private conversations on IRC. If you have data that you'd like to share, please, do so before your death. Dead Mafia/Wolf players are given a partial exception and are allowed to PM other Mafia/Wolves. All players are always free to talk with their Host in private IRC or PM.

I'd put laughing at silly stuff on the same level as popcorn.gif spam that tends to happen.

More specifically, Rule 4 in our community has this:

Note: Posts such as "popcorn" .gifs, short spectatorial posts, "translation" posts, and small novelty stunts are usually permitted-- provided they are not excessive and do not give away anything about the game-- but players are advised to check with the host before posting these, and such posts must be deleted or edited out should the host request it.

And before anyone asks, yes, I will allow such things "provided they are not excessive and do not give away anything about the game", as the rules state.

You must disregard the statement I am currently making because every statement I make is inherently false.