I'v got 2 PAPST and 1 Verax 80 fans. IMHO The PAPSTs
are real crap. The Verax is quite good, but only under 2000RPM,
then it generates high pitch noise (probably bearing noise)
which is quite unpleasant.
The problem is that it reaches 20CFM when over 3000RPM.

The question is whether there is something better
than Verax. I thought about Thermaltake Smart Case Fan 2
which is rated 20CFM 17Db at 1300RPM which seems interesting.

I don't know where u are max7 but have u tried the 80MM Panaflows FBA08A12L a LOT of ppl in these forums use the panaflows and they just might be what u're looking for... but I've heard from ppl here that they're hard to get in Europe

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I'm afraid you'll be disappointed with Panaflo. It's definitely even worse than Papst, based on my experience. People are presumably using Panaflo only because it's significantly cheaper and more widely available than competitors, like Papst or PC&P Silencer. I guess most people would prefer Papst over Panaflo if they had the same price.

Why do you think Papst is a crap? Which model of Papst did you try? If you think it's a crap at 12v, I'd say any fan is a crap at its default voltage. (I'm not saying Papst is the best fan in the world.)

PCP&P's Silencer is at least better than Panaflo if 7-volted although you won't be able to get 20CFM out of it then. There are also some less well-known cheap fans, usually made in China, that are good if undervolted, but I don't think they are available in Europe. Sometimes you can find such a fan inside a cheap PSU, like Codegen's.

I have to agree with Ausone. As I have previously posted, I have found Panaflo to be disappointing. They are better than many I have heard, but they are not worth the money (they are expensive here in Australia) and not that easy to get hold of. I also mentioned that I have heard a quieter, more powerful fan (Quietek, made in China), but nobody wanted to respond to this.

I recently put together a P4 system for a friend with an elcheapo PSU, and now that you mention it, Codegen does ring a bell - I'll check this. Anyway I was again disappointed to find that the fan in this PSU was quieter than my Panaflo. I'm beginning to suspect that there are probably quite a few different fan manufacturers building quiet (and cheap) fans. Whether this is by design or accident, who cares? Just because we choose a "name" brand doesn't mean that it's better. I think there is a lot of untapped potential out there.

By the way, in case anyone's wondering, I am a classical musician with excellent hearing.

check out this new fan. 19cfm and 11.7 db. dont know if this is really revolutionary though, considering the most silent papst is 19.4 cfm with 12 db.

Nice, though. Papst fans have been in development for 20 years, while this type of case fan might have a way to go before being as silent as the form factor would allow. Antec sells a Cyclone Blower that is a very similar design, with 42 CFM / 26 dba. Of course, that number might be 1 inch away, it might be down the hall, they don't say. But, unlike the silentpc.nl fan, the cyclone blower is actually for sale, and goes for as little as 10 dollars. Who knows how loud it would be at 7v?

What is up with the name cyclone blower? Aren't they touting this as a silent fan?[/url]

==============
The reason for this is that the rest of my system is rather quiet (around 17 dBA adding the noise produced by all moving parts excluding any form of drives). I only have 3 fans in my PC and all are of the very silent type: 1x80mm Power Fluid fan with fluid bearings (21CFM/9dBa) used as case fan and 2x80mm Pabst 8412NGL fans (19.4CFM/12dBa), one located in my power-supply and the other mounted on top of my ThermalRight SLK800 CPU heatsink. This allows me to run my 1400MHz Tualatin Celeron @ 1666MHz with a lower temperature than when running the CPU at stock speed with the stock cooler.
===============

Has anybody ever heard of the Power Fluid fan? 21CFM @ 9dBA would be awesome!

I have the Antec cyclone fan -- it is relatively quiet though I very much doubt the 42CFM number. And these slot fans suffer from a location issue -- you might be able to cool a video card with one, but as far a case cooling, they are less than ideal.

Those Power Fluid fans definitely seem interesting. I searched a little and came up with this discussion in Danish comparing them to Papst. I found a site that can translate from Danish, but it came out pretty garbled. I tried to clean it up and here's what I made out of the most interesting post:

Quote:

I've had Pabst in my machine , however I changed them for Power Fluid. Power Fluid has lower CFM than Pabst , but they're more silent. I've got Power Fluids in my machine now: 2 80mm in the PSU , 1 80mm for harddisks, and 1 120mm for the CPU with a Zalman heatsink. My idle temperatures are29 degrees at CPU and 33 degrees at motherboard. The 120mm also cools my motherboard and ram, only a little bit. That noisiest thing in my system is my GF4 and that's louder than my Power Fluids

Of course, this translation could be very wrong. I'd definitely like to know more about these Power Fluid fans, though. If anyone can speak Danish maybe they can puzzle out where the search feature is on the http://tweakup.dk forums and try to find some info.

Here's an article written by the Tweakup staff comparing the Papst 8412N/2GL and the Power Fluid 80-1600. Again, it's in Danish, so here is a link to a machine translation of it.

The gist of the article seems to be that the Power Fluid is as quiet and as powerful as the 12dB Papst. The Papst clicking is mentioned as something that develops over time, and the authors wonder how well the Power Fluid fans hold up over time. The authors also note that the Power Fluid fan requires assembly (attaching the 3-pin connector onto the wires), but the Papst comes ready-to-go.

The chippen.dk site indicates that the Power Fluid 80-2000 might actually be quieter than the 80-1600, so it would be nice to see a comparison with that fan.

Nice, though. Papst fans have been in development for 20 years, while this type of case fan might have a way to go before being as silent as the form factor would allow. Antec sells a Cyclone Blower that is a very similar design, with 42 CFM / 26 dba. Of course, that number might be 1 inch away, it might be down the hall, they don't say. But, unlike the silentpc.nl fan, the cyclone blower is actually for sale, and goes for as little as 10 dollars. Who knows how loud it would be at 7v?

What is up with the name cyclone blower? Aren't they touting this as a silent fan?[/url]

That number is from down the hall. I had one of those - the first thing I got rid of, and it made a big difference. I seriously thing they reversed their DBAs and CFMs. 26 CFM @ 42 dba sounds much closer to the actual spec. Undervolting doesn't do much unfortunately.

Quote:

PCP&P's Silencer is at least better than Panaflo if 7-volted although you won't be able to get 20CFM out of it then. There are also some less well-known cheap fans, usually made in China, that are good if undervolted, but I don't think they are available in Europe. Sometimes you can find such a fan inside a cheap PSU, like Codegen's.

Really? Cool. I just ordered 3 PC Power & Cooling silencers. They should be here on Monday.
Right now I am using seriously undervolted loud fans (50 dba @ 12v - 25? dba @ 3 v)

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here's my subjective experience with papst, panaflo, and silencer (i own or have sampled ~5 papst, ~10 panaflos, 4 silencers). take this information as personal experience only, and not as matter of fact.

papst is quieter at 12V than panaflo. airflow is similar but may be more on the panaflo.

at 5-7V, panaflo and papst noise is subjectively the same. airflow is subjectively around the same range (it's slow so it's harder to tell differences at that voltage).

silencer, would not start at 5V. subjectively much louder at 12V, including free air. seemed to be even louder (versus panaflo) when some airflow impedence is present. may have pushed more air than the panaflo at 12V, if i remember correctly.

i would tend to stay away from any fan that doesn't have publish fan curves, and doesn't print by which standard they are measuring their fan noise.

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