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Wow that is a really strong accusation to make of a derby winning jockey- are they really sure it was something? I just went to check on my Funny Cide picture that was in the paper, but it seems that my mom threw it out. Oh well!

"Riding is just a bunch of nuts and bolts. If the rider is nuts, the horse bolts!"
"Proud member of the 'I canter' clique!"

It's interesting to me that in one article I read, Santos is quoted as saying that he's not holding anything but he is wearing a bracelet. Then in the other article, he talks about holding something to cue for the outriders?

If in fact the articles are accurate, the fact that he's changing his story is probably not a good sign.

It definitely looks like there is something in Santos's hand. The article says that it was originally reported that he said he was carrying a "cue ring" during the race, but it was later said that there was a misunderstanding and what he said was that he was wearing a "Q-ray" bracelet for arthritis. I've seen numerous photos and have not seen any sort of bracelet on his right wrist. Further, why would a bracelet be between his fingers? As for the "cue ring", I do not understand why he would need any sort of device, if there was such a thing, to call to the outriders. Did anyone else notice a look of alarm to Funny Cide? Perhaps Santos was indeed carrying a buzzer or other illegal device, which would have worried the horse, if not have caused actual discomfort.

I'd hate for this to be the case, but all evidence points toward it right now.

[This message was edited by Thoroughbred on May. 10, 2003 at 05:36 PM.]

This is a link to the photo in question, and it definitely gives the appearance that something else is in his hand. I can't imagine Santos would be so stupid as to risk his entire career by carrying a buzzer (which no one has directly suggested, only implied) in the most photographed race in NOrth America, if not the world.

It certainly turns the Triple Crown upside-down. If Funny Cide is ultimately disqualified, then Empire Maker is declared winner--which means his reason for skipping the Preakness to rest for the Belmont would be moot, and he would be the one in position for conquering the Triple Crown. It puts Frankel in a very unusual position, to say the least.

It is reminiscent of the 1999 Arkansas Derby, where jockey Billy Patin was charged with carrying just such a device (and was taped dropping it onto the track) and longshot winner Valhol was eventually disqualified and the purse redistributed. It was hung up in the courts for a while, but ultimately, the disqualification--and resulting suspensions--stood.

This could be an event of such historic proportions as never before seen in horse racing, perhaps only comparable to when Dancer's Image was disqualified for being illegally medicated in 1968 and Forward Pass was named winner.

The implications are beyond huge. Funny Cide's victory was historic in its own right for beiung the first New York bred, the first gelding in 74 years, and the first winner for a first-time-at-the-Derby trainer.

Man, could this get ugly. At the least, it will all be verrrrrrrrrry interesting.

I used to think the world was against me. Now I know better...some of the smaller countries are neutral.

I am from hunterland so I don't know to much about racing, but I did watch the derby as I have every year of my life. But I do not understand, what would it be? <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> buzzer or other illegal device, which would have worried the horse, if not have caused actual discomfort. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> How can a buzzer cause pain or discomfort? I am really out of the loop here! Can't you tell. And also, what is an outrider..I feel sooo dumb right now! Sorry!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Lauruffian:
....comparable to when Dancer's Image was disqualified for being illegally medicated in 1968 and Forward Pass was named winner.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

And that terrible substance that caused Dancer's Image to be disqualified?? Bute. In an amount far lower than is legal today.

While a buzzer will ( I hope) NEVER be made legal.

But I just seems too bizarre to me --- WHY would a jockey of Santos's cailber use a buzzer when it would be so easy to detect in a picure? And what happened to it? From the moment when he passed the finish line and was picked up by the outrider, he had no chance to get ride of it.

The whole situation is just too bizarre to be believable. If untrue, it has tainted Santos's career forever which is a shame since he a a quality journeyman jockey.

From what I have heard of Barkley Tagg over the years, he is as honest as they come. I find it impossible to believe that he was a party to something like this.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I always live within my means, even if I have to borrow to do it.

Yeah, Lord Helpus, it's so incredibly contrary that Dancer's Image would never have been disqualified in modern racing...but, it was illegal at the time. But I agree, a small dose of a then-banned substance is one thing--but a buzzer??

This just in: Bobby Frankel has announced he will run Empire Maker in this Saturday's Preakness. I do not have the exact quote (saw/heard it on TVG), but essentially, he said it may take a year or more for this to be resolved, so he has to take a chance in the meantime. He just may have the Derby winner, and he can't pass up a possible Triple Crown while legalities are sorting.

This will be one very interesting Triple Crown campaign.

I used to think the world was against me. Now I know better...some of the smaller countries are neutral.

I just read a few articles about this, and at first I thought it was all just a bunch of B.S. Then I saw the blown-up picture and it does look like there is something (other than a whip) in Jose's hand.

I really, REALLY hope it isn't as bad as it looks. I can't imagine why a jockey would even try something illegal in the Kentucky Derby. I mean, it is one of the biggest races in the world and all eyes are on you. There are always thousands of pictures taken of the winning moment, and the chances are good that someone will get an incriminating photo.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>How can a buzzer cause pain or discomfort? I am really out of the loop here! Can't you tell. And also, what is an outrider <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
A "buzzer" is an electrical device used to shock the horse and make him run faster. Some jockeys have gotten in trouble for using them, but never before in such a big & important race.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I can't imagine why a jockey would even try something illegal in the Kentucky Derby. I mean, it is one of the biggest races in the world and all eyes are on you. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That was my first reaction, then I thought how many times have we seen an olympian's medal stripped, a BNT set down, a cyclist failing a drug test in a big race, a questionable baseball/bat in a major game, a superbowl player on steroids, and well you have to accept that it does happen even if it's perfectly obvious that all eyes will be watching.

"Speak yer mind. But ride a fast horse"

Definition of "Horse": a 4 legged mammal looking for an inconvenient place and expensive way to die. Any day they choose not to execute the Master Plan is just more time to perfect it. Be Very Afraid.

There's now an article up at Bloodhorse.com regarding Frankel running Empire Maker on Saturday. Here's his quote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>"If they disqualify (Funny Cide), even if it takes years in court, I got a shot at the Triple Crown," Frankel said. "How can I not run now? I don't know what the stewards are going to do, but they do say it looks suspicious. I had already resigned myself to the fact that I lost the Derby, and now, you never know. The drama continues."

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I used to think the world was against me. Now I know better...some of the smaller countries are neutral.

Santos is saying he said "Q-ray for arthritis," not "cue ring for outriders," is what he was carrying and that he'd been misheard and thus, misquoted. I did a quick search on the internet, and found this picture of the Q-ray bracelet in gold.

In my humble, unprofessional, and sheerly first-glance opinion, the bracelet does not seem to be the same shape and size of what may or not be in his hand in the questioned photo. That object seems bulkier, like a D-battery or heck, a large gumball. But I don't have one and again, I may not know what I'm talking about. Take it all as you will.

I used to think the world was against me. Now I know better...some of the smaller countries are neutral.

Barclay Tagg is quoted on the BloodHorse site saying that he has seen the picture hugely blown up and, in that state, it's clear that what you're seeing is Funny Cide's ear (the dark part) and Bailey's silks (what appears to be a reflection in the other photo.) Looking again at the smaller photo, I can see how that might be so.

However, the thing I can't understand about that though, is that if Santos has nothing else in his hand, why would he have been holding his whip in such an odd manner? Wouldn't you think he'd have all his fingers curled around it, to make sure he wouldn't drop it?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>However, the thing I can't understand about that though, is that if Santos has nothing else in his hand, why would he have been holding his whip in such an odd manner? Wouldn't you think he'd have all his fingers curled around it, to make sure he wouldn't drop it?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It's possible he was in process of switching the whip's position. Just past the wire you see him (in video) kinda spin it around to the forward position, rather deftly done (and kinda cool). Just another thought that I'm sure the stewards are considering--checking all the video to see just what he was doing when the photo was taken.

I used to think the world was against me. Now I know better...some of the smaller countries are neutral.

I agree with Lauruffian's suggestion that he was in the process of switching the whip position - I believe at this point that he was returning it to the neutral position. However, I seriously doubt that the dark space in Santos' hand is Funny Cide's ear and Jerry Bailey's silks. When you look at his forefinger, it looks like there is an object protruding in front of it. I don't think it's a shadow. Do you agree? Also, one question: Does anyone happen to know what a buzzer looks like? Not that that's the only object he could have been carrying, but that would be the most likely, I think.