Here’s some excellent news from Louisiana, where a state judge has ruled that Gov. Bobby Jindal’s outrageous school voucher program giving state funding to private religious schools that teach creationism and climate change denial is unconstitutional. Damn right.

One of Gov. Bobby Jindal’s signature accomplishments, a private school tuition voucher program, was ruled unconstitutional by a Louisiana judge Friday, the Associated Press reports:

State Judge Tim Kelley said Friday that the program improperly diverts money allocated through Louisiana’s public school funding formula to private schools. He also said it unconstitutionally diverts local tax dollars to private schools.

Kelley ruled in a lawsuit backed by teacher unions and school boards seeking to shut down the voucher program and other changes that would funnel more money away from traditional public schools.

Jindal (R-La.), who is frequently touted as a potential contender in the 2016 Republican presidential race, pushed the legislation through the state’s legislature in April. Two statewide teachers’ associations and a group of school boards filed legal challenges shortly thereafter.

Jindal said in a statement Friday afternoon that he would appeal the ruling.
In addition to the lawsuits, the program was criticized for letting students attend religious schools that teach Young Earth Creationism — the belief that the universe is no older than 10,000 years.

Jindal’s response to this setback for his religious fundamentalist agenda:

‘Today’s ruling is wrong-headed and a travesty for parents across Louisiana who want nothing more than for their children to have an equal opportunity at receiving a great education,’ Jindal said. ‘This ruling changes nothing for the students currently in the program. All along, we expected this to be decided by the Louisiana Supreme Court.’

Make no mistake — the underlying cause behind Gov. Jindal’s voucher program is to erase the boundary between church and state, especially (but not limited to) the teaching of the scientific theory of evolution. He may be trying to position himself as a “moderate Republican” lately, but Jindal has been more successful than any other Republican politician at blurring the lines and legitimizing the long range anti-science educational agenda of the religious right.

The annual gathering known as the Republican Advance kicked off with a smorgasbord battle waged by GOP candidates for governor, lieutenant governor and attorney general, and featuring something unexpected on the menu: Oliver North.

The retired Marine and Iran-contra figure headlined the hospitality suite for Pete Snyder, a technology entrepreneur and recent Fox news commentator running for lieutenant governor. While attendees swooned over state Sen. Mark D. Obenshain’s brisket and praised the quality of Attorney General Ken Cuccinelli II’s cannoli, North’s surprise appearance was the talk of the annual gathering.

“Just bringing Ollie — that is impressive,” said Larry Cirignano of Alexandria, state director of American Catholics for Religious Freedom. “But ask me the guy’s name who did it.”

[...]

“Virginia’s a conservative state, and when we stick up for our beliefs, and our values, and our principles . . . we win elections,” state GOP Chairman Pat Mullins told the gathering at breakfast Saturday. “When we choose to run like Democrats, we lose elections because we haven’t given anybody a choice.”

Cuccinelli, who received a standing ovation before and after his remarks at breakfast, hammered home the position that Virginia Republicans need to embrace their traditional platform.

“Conservatism is not dead. It is not old. It is not worn out. It is still alive and thriving,” he said. “. . . We’re not going to lie down. We’re going to get right back up.”

Not everyone was ready to fall in line. Among the 650 activists at the weekend-long event were some who would have preferred Bolling over Cuccinelli, partly because they think his less-confrontational style might have played better with swing voters. Many were still talking about how Bolling had exited the race, with statements that he would not endorse Cuccinelli and hints that he might consider an independent bid. His actions — and his decision not to attend this weekend’s events — seemed to loom larger for the crowd than Republican Mitt Romney’s failure to win the White House just weeks before.

[...]

Cuccinelli is famous for, among other things, his witch hunt against Penn State scientist Mann. And yes, he's a creationist.

For the VA GOP to bring in Ollie North and call it an "Advance" says something.

I for one do not see the religious conservatives giving up ground in the GOP willingly.

In a 2008 interview on CBS’s Face the Nation, Jindal said that he wanted students “to be presented with the best thinking, I want them to be able to make decisions for themselves, I want them to see the best data. … I’d certainly want my kids to be exposed to the very best science. I don't want any facts or theories or explanations to be withheld from them because of political correctness.” The problem, of course, is that if the “best science,” in the view of a local school board, includes creationism, the students in that school system are being cheated. Presenting an idea that has no scientific support as if it were the equal of a thoroughly tested scientific theory is academic dishonesty of the rankest sort.[Link: www.slate.com...]

Many Republicans would love to see the public education system be financially gutted and instead have the private education system be government-subsidized. One reason: they regard any form of public education (k-12 or college) as part of a subversive left-wing plot to corrupt and brainwash our youth.

Unlike the public school system, private schools would not be restricted from propagating right wing revisionist history in their social studies classes, nor proselytizing religious ideology and promoting corporate-funded anti-environmental propaganda in the science classroom.

Vouchers are intended to allow students from (once again) highly motivated families attend costly private schools which they would otherwise not be able to attend. The funding for the vouchers comes from the state or federal government, i.e., the government is essentially subsidizing the private school industry. Since private schools can select student admittance based on the family's financial status and academic ability, this would create a further divide between the "haves" and "have nots" in our society.

Since vouchers only account for a portion of the cost of tuition at a private school, families in the lower third of the economic range would still be excluded from attending, resulting in the public school system being further saturated with the poorest students, the lowest achieving students (including ELD and learning disabled), and those that are least motivated to attain academic success.

Furthermore, comparing performance data between public and private schools is not scientifically valid -- the latter can select students for admission based on entrance qualifications, and they can remove students from their programs based on poor conduct or academic performance. Therefore, the performance data becomes extremely skewed compared with public schools which legally must accept anyone who resides within its residency boundaries.

Please take a look, sorry the article is all images that because of format can't be posted here, but please take half a minute to go look. This is Bobby Jindal's idea of a fair approach to teaching creationism side by side with evolution. He wants all of us to have to pay for it, taking money away from his states already shitty public schools to fund private voucher schools where they can teach this kind of trash while also re-introducing de facto segregation.

So I'm going to chime in and point out it goes beyond creationism. Some of the "approved" materials used by private schools are wall-to-wall indoctrination into a very narrow wingnut mindset, wherein right-wing ideology is presented as factual, and the whole of history and philosophy is channeled through partisan lenses (link to Wonkette's review of a Christian textbook). It's teaching kids to be JBS wingnuts. That's part of what Jindal wants government money to go to (note: the board making decisions about where money can be allocated also said "No" to an Islamic school, so religious freedom isn't an excuse.)

O.T. Kinda an early offtopic there don't you think? You couldn't wait 15-20 minutes to post that? If this was an overnight video or music thread or afternoon video bump then sure go for it, but this thread actually has a topic.

I wouldn't say anything at the risk of derailing the thread but jumping on a brand new thread to go offtopic on the very first post just ridiculous and very poor netiquette. If I didn't say anything then I would be suborning more people to act similarly. Sorry freetoken. :(

O.T. Kinda an early offtopic there don't you think? You couldn't wait 15-20 minutes to post that? If this was an overnight video or music thread or afternoon video bump then sure go for it, but this thread actually has a topic.

I wouldn't say anything at the risk of derailing the thread but jumping on a brand new thread to go offtopic on the very first post just ridiculous and very poor netiquette. If I didn't say anything then I would be suborning more people to act similarly. Sorry freetoken. :(

O.T. Kinda an early offtopic there don't you think? You couldn't wait 15-20 minutes to post that? If this was an overnight video or music thread or afternoon video bump then sure go for it, but this thread actually has a topic.

I wouldn't say anything at the risk of derailing the thread but jumping on a brand new thread to go offtopic on the very first post just ridiculous and very poor netiquette. If I didn't say anything then I would be suborning more people to act similarly. Sorry freetoken. :(

Yeah, I'm not getting how Freetoken's post is OT. Both the Jindal story and the Cuccinelli demonstrate that conservatives/Republicans have not learned one frigging thing from the election. And that was barely a month ago.

Offering a critical take on James Carville's famous political dictum "it's the economy, Stupid," Gov. Bobby Jindal told the Family Research Council's Values Voter Summit Friday night that at a deeper level "It's the culture, Stupid." That was the title and theme of Jindal's speech before Christian conservatives who heard from five Republican presidential candidates Friday ... (snip)
......
Jindal also heaped praise on Tony Perkins, the former Louisiana legislator who leads the FRC, which places conservative Christian values -- particularly on issues like abortion and gay rights -- at the center of its politics.

Because school voucher program funding that is spreading from state to state is exactly the same topic as how "moderate" republicans aren't really moderate? Nevermind I'm off this thread before I drag it any further off topic,you guys talk about what you want and I will see you upstairs later.

Because school voucher program funding that is spreading from state to state is exactly the same topic as how "moderate" republicans aren't really moderate? Nevermind I'm off this thread before I drag it any further off topic,you guys talk about what you want and I will see you upstairs later.

Huh. Now you run off with a post about school vouchers, which I never mentioned. Huh. B'byeee!

Knowledge-Based Education – We oppose the teaching of Higher Order Thinking Skills (HOTS) (values clarification), critical thinking skills and similar programs that are simply a relabeling of Outcome-Based Education (OBE) (mastery learning) which focus on behavior modification and have the purpose of challenging the student’s fixed beliefs and undermining parental authority.
[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]

I have to echo something that Shiplord Kirel said a couple months back- how exactly did creationism end up inflicting the greater part of "mainline" American Christianity?

I've watched the moderate churches around me fall by degrees, and it is not a very enjoyable sight. It's depressing to go into a church and hear the congregants talking about goddamn Masons.

Heck in 1972 in Catholic school I learned that Genesis was not to be taken as an historical account of how the Earth and how life came to be. Now 40 years later I see people who identify as Catholics, like Marco Rubio and Rick Santorum spouting bullshit right from the Southern Baptist manual.

When I was 8, I had a very short argument about dinosaurs with my buddy's dad who was the preacher at the Pentecostal Church in my neighborhood. He said Dinosaur bones were just rocks that looked like bones and I laughed..

But his kid was a good friend of mine, we threw snowballs at cars together..

When I was 8, I had a very short argument about dinosaurs with my buddy's dad who was the preacher at the Pentecostal Church in my neighborhood. He said Dinosaur bones were just rocks that looked like bones and I laughed..

But his kid was a good friend of mine, we threw snowballs at cars together..

you should have thrown snow balls at his head, then apologized for thinking that you assumed his head only looked like a head but was merely a small boulder.

Bobby Jindal may be the Mitt Romney of 2012: very comfortably shape-shifting his positions on any and all issues, to get through whatever door he needs to get through to move forward in his campaign for the presidency.

You've gotta be flexible to appeal to the small-government Republicans, the big-government Christian theocracy Republicans, and the Dixiecrat racist Republicans. I have a feeling that Jindal is thinking about this in some detail.

Bobby Jindal may be the Mitt Romney of 2012: very comfortably shape-shifting his positions on any and all issues, to get through whatever door he needs to get through to move forward in his campaign for the presidency.

You've gotta be flexible to appeal to the small-government Republicans, the big-government Christian theocracy Republicans, and the Dixiecrat racist Republicans. I have a feeling that Jindal is thinking about this in some detail.

Bobby Jindal may be the Mitt Romney of 2012: very comfortably shape-shifting his positions on any and all issues, to get through whatever door he needs to get through to move forward in his campaign for the presidency.

You've gotta be flexible to appeal to the small-government Republicans, the big-government Christian theocracy Republicans, and the Dixiecrat racist Republicans. I have a feeling that Jindal is thinking about this in some detail.

Jindal is better at dealing with average people than Romney. not as much business sense, but more personable.

Bobby Jindal may be the Mitt Romney of 2012: very comfortably shape-shifting his positions on any and all issues, to get through whatever door he needs to get through to move forward in his campaign for the presidency.

You've gotta be flexible to appeal to the small-government Republicans, the big-government Christian theocracy Republicans, and the Dixiecrat racist Republicans. I have a feeling that Jindal is thinking about this in some detail.

It will never work. He can never look the part. Image is everything in the GOP. Really.

Bobby Jindal may be the Mitt Romney of 2012: very comfortably shape-shifting his positions on any and all issues, to get through whatever door he needs to get through to move forward in his campaign for the presidency.

You've gotta be flexible to appeal to the small-government Republicans, the big-government Christian theocracy Republicans, and the Dixiecrat racist Republicans. I have a feeling that Jindal is thinking about this in some detail.

Good thought but.. nope. The WASP contingency is done experimenting with outsiders. They tried a Mormon and a Catholic this time and it failed spectacularly.

Jindal is better at dealing with average people than Romney. not as much business sense, but more personable.

There is zero chance Bobby Jindall will appeal to the GOP base as a Presidential candidate. Oh don't get me wrong. They'd love to have him around to prove they have some dark-skinned supporters, but not as President.

Good thought but.. nope. The WASP contingency is done experimenting with outsiders. They tried a Mormon and a Catholic this time and it failed spectacularly.

Yes, in 2012 the GOP tried a Mormon and an "Ayn Rand Catholic", a strange combination indeed. Sarah Palin in 2008 was even stranger. I agree, they will go for "normal" in 2016, or at least try to. The pressure from "the base" may doom that effort, however.

Yes, in 2012 the GOP tried a Mormon and an "Ayn Rand Catholic", a strange combination indeed. Sarah Palin in 2008 was even stranger. I agree, they will go for "normal" in 2016, or at least try to. The pressure from "the base" may doom that effort, however.

The sad thing is, I think Mitt was such a bad candidate that it may have ruined the chances for Jon Huntsman next time. The GOPers will just assume Huntsman is Romney Lite.

In digging around the net looking for some historical links to the far right nuttiness that has nested itself in the GOP I noticed that the now strangely deforming "World League for Freedom and Democracy (WLFD)" has a a Facebook page:

When my wingnut friends try to say that there is nothing Government can do to help create jobs, I ask them what would happen if we turned off power to all the red lights at intersections everywhere and made them all 4-way stops.

When my wingnut friends try to say that there is nothing Government can do to help create jobs, I ask them what would happen if we turned off power to all the red lights at intersections everywhere and made them all 4-way stops.

I was thinking about this once when I was in center city Philadelphia and I was looking at the thumb drive building (Comcast Tower). That SOB is going to last a long time, but someday that thing's gonna have to come down.

Religion and science have been having a bit of a bout in the ring that is the Gavi Gangadhareshwara Temple. While religious believers have held that the phenomenon of the sun rays passing through a window and illuminating the deity inside a cave on January 14 – Makara Sankranti Day – is ‘the Will of God’, three researchers beg to differ. Linking it to the solstices, they say the celestial event also occurs on Nov 30, making it a twice-a-year event rather than an annual one as is widely believed.

[...]

Well, good for the astronomers for describing what is going on, but step back and think of this: here we are in 2012 and there are still communities of people who ascribe simple effects from planetary motion as being magical occurrences from "gods".

Later today, for the first time ever, I will take to the airwaves to relate my story, of being held in custody for 40 days in Baltimore correctional facilities. There were no charges. There was no warrant. Not even bail. When friends and family, including Maryland State Del. Jill P. Carter -- a defense attorney -- made official inquiry to the correctional facilities, they were all soundly told, I was not there. Even popular talk host and former State Senator Larry Young could not locate me through official channels.

Altho some reckless statements by Mr. James MacArthur have been pointed out, I'm not jumping to any conclusions just yet.

The difference is that some "Sovereign citizens" do get full of enough rage to act violently, even towards cops. This guy was just an angry little loser.

There was the nutjob in Fairhope Alabama last week that shot and killed a Baldwin County policeman. His mom tried to have him committed, but the state budget cuts landed him in a community based treatment center (aka mom's trailer) instead. link..

Heck in 1972 in Catholic school I learned that Genesis was not to be taken as an historical account of how the Earth and how life came to be. Now 40 years later I see people who identify as Catholics, like Marco Rubio and Rick Santorum spouting bullshit right from the Southern Baptist manual.

I had the same experience in a Catholic high school in the 1980s. Excellent, intellectual monk taught the Old Testament as history/literature, with heavy focus upon how the various diaspora events led to creation of myths like the story of Daniel, Jonah, etc. It was super interesting, and I'm not religious. I'd consider repeating the class now even. Biblical literalism is bizarre.

Rep. Scott DesJarlais (R-TN), who has refused to leave office in spite of revelations of numerous affairs, including one where he pressured a mistress to have an abortion despite his political opposition to it, defended his position on a conservative radio show Saturday.

According to The Huffington Post, DeJarlais told Ralph Bristol he still considers himself “very solid” in his views.

“I don’t think, Ralph, that I implied that there was nothing in my past,” DesJarlais said. “I didn’t go back and dig up all my personal shortcomings and display them. I went through this divorce a long time ago. I made a very poor decision in my first marriage. I know God’s forgiven me.”

5 batmobiles through the years:
[Link: www.nypost.com...]
I like the original the best.

I'd actually go with the one from the Tim Burton movies, myself. It was distinctive as the Batmobile, while not being stupidly over-engineered or thin like the ones from the execrable Joel Schumacher's FAIL and EPIC FAIL. While Adam West's Batmobile was cool for its time, my own mind came of age in later times, times when the criminals and terrorists are too dangerous for Batman to drive a convertible. Given Batman's need for protection against small-arms fire, the Burton-era Batmobile seems the best to me.

[Link: www.telegraph.co.uk...]
The boat, by its appearance, would seem an unlikely place to stash that amount of gold. The "Summer Bliss" is a fishing boat with rust streaks on its white cabin and no visible security

Whats that I smell,,, , oh yes,, the unmistakable whiff of An Inside Job!!!

[Link: www.telegraph.co.uk...]
The boat, by its appearance, would seem an unlikely place to stash that amount of gold. The "Summer Bliss" is a fishing boat with rust streaks on its white cabin and no visible security

Whats that I smell,,, , oh yes,, the unmistakable whiff of An Inside Job!!!

If you are half as charming in person as you are here, ask her out! I know she wouldn't say no, I wouldn't, wink wink nudge nudge knowwhatImean?

I worked with a married couple years ago. Wanna know what his pick up line was? "Are we fucking or are you wasting my time?' Heh. Side note: I trained him and he eventually became a restaurant manager. Last I knew he was working at Senior Frog's in Coco Walk (Miami)

I worked with a married couple years ago. Wanna know what his pick up line was? "Are we fucking or are you wasting my time?' Heh. Side note: I trained him and he eventually became a restaurant manager. Last I knew he was working at Senior Frog's in Coco Walk (Miami)

I find it hard to believe he didn't get backhanded across the jaw for that line. He should have been backhanded, surely.

I find it hard to believe he didn't get backhanded across the jaw for that line. He should have been backhanded, surely.

I was giving him a 50 cent raise so I sat him down and said "so tell me happened the other night and I'll tell you if you're right". He looked at me, all kinds of confused. I kept that going for about 2 minutes. Then I told him about his raise. Classic.

It's sorta the same deal as the pink air recce spitfires in WWII. Given where they're supposed to be used the outrageous color turns out to be the one that works the best. Put them elsewhere and they're "shoot me now" signs.

I was giving him a 50 cent raise so I sat him down and said "so tell me happened the other night and I'll tell you if you're right". He looked at me, all kinds of confused. I kept that going for about 2 minutes. Then I told him about his raise. Classic.

Different people, I guess. I would have reacted to your sentence by saying "I do not understand what you are asking."

The Washington Post has a better article on that new Iranian sub. Iran also put launched its latest Moudge-class ship, named the Sahand. The articles call her a frigate (FFG) owing to her small size (1,500 tons standard displacement), but Iran has dusted off the designation of Destroyer Escort (DDE) and applided it to the class. One shouldn't ignore these new surface ships from Iran: Their C-803 SSMs pack a hard punch. AEGIS is designed to meet this sort of threat, thankfully.

The Washington Post has a better article on that new Iranian sub. Iran also put launched its latest Moudge-class ship, named the Sahand. The articles call her a frigate (FFG) owing to her small size (1,500 tons standard displacement), but Iran has dusted off the designation of Destroyer Escort (DDE) and applided it to the class. One shouldn't ignore these new surface ships from Iran: Their C-803 SSMs pack a hard punch. AEGIS is designed to meet this sort of threat, thankfully.

I keep hammering that Iran 2012 is not Iraq 2003 or Iran 1987. They have logistics. They train, small and large scale, with integrated operations. And their weapons systems are solid tier 2 and situational tier 1.

It's absolute night and day, listening to Geithner and Boehner on Fox. The former's laying out the reality that the Dems won't back down and that the GOP's gonna have to swallow its pride and accept a deal that won't be popular, and the latter's whining that Dems aren't "serious" and that we may very well go over the cliff because he's such a nice guy who insists on the debt being addressed, while promising future hostage negotiations every time the debt limit needs to be increased.

The Sunday funnies, er talk shows seem to be setting the stage for this week. The Dems have made their line in the sand, refusing to agree to further tax cuts for the rich, while the GOP is set on spending the coming week whining that Obama's "not serious."

One of the ugly consequences for the Republicans is going to be the reaction to hyperbole.

They've been calling it a cliff. They've been acting as though it's going to immediately drop us into another Great Recession.

Come January a lot of people are going to be looking around asking where the cliff went. Oh, there'll be a bit of a bump that'll show for the first quarter or two, but cliff? Not so much.

And the consequence will be that Republican predictions of doom are going to be treated even more frequently as hyperbole and hysteria. "Oh, it's just John again, predicting the end of the world because we're almost out of beer in the fridge."

The teeth-gnashing, soul-grinding pettiness, self-involvement and anti-gestalt of it all makes me want to break something. So I was extremely surprised and heartened when Occupy came around and made me think, for a precious moment, that left-wing activists had discovered how to effectively cooperate for the universal good for the first time since the birth of the labor movement. Here they were - the people who usually made careers out of impotent complaining and obscure rhetoric - standing side by side with folks who don't normally protest as well as folks who push change through the ordinary mechanisms of politics. With one voice, they were raising awareness of the profound inequality in America, and the fact that the political classes have only served a tiny fraction of the people for decades. And the message got out. "99%/1%" is no longer some obscure ideological term, but a recognized demographic reference.
....
Occupy hadn't risen to prominence because of wavy fingers, drum circles, or any of the thousands of totally irrelevant things it came to be associated with through sheer self-inflicted scatterbrainedness. It had gotten attention because the inequalities in America had reached epic proportions, and were being perpetuated by the erosion of democracy in governance. In other words, it was about democracy, pure and simple - or at least that was the source of energy that brought it the national stage. But precious few seemed to understand that, particularly among diehard activists who had originally created it, or if they had at first they seemed to forget - so much of the rhetoric came to be about "sticking it to The Man," offending bourgeois sensibilities, defying the police, blah blah blah, and the unity message that had made it significant came to be identified as some kind of compromising Trojan Horse intended to distract Occupiers from the real mission of post-capitalist anarcho-syndicalism or some other obscure bullshit.

If there be an object truly ridiculous in nature, it is an American patriot, signing resolutions of independency with the one hand, and with the other brandishing a whip over his affrighted slaves.-- Thomas Day

One of the ugly consequences for the Republicans is going to be the reaction to hyperbole.

They've been calling it a cliff. They've been acting as though it's going to immediately drop us into another Great Recession.

Come January a lot of people are going to be looking around asking where the cliff went. Oh, there'll be a bit of a bump that'll show for the first quarter or two, but cliff? Not so much.

And the consequence will be that Republican predictions of consequence are going to be treated even more frequently as hyperbole and hysteria. "Oh, it's just John again, predicting the end of the world because we're almost out of beer in the fridge."

It's a cliff that the GOP created, thinking that even if they couldn't win the election, they could still use the threat of it to pressure Democrats into accepting a deal on their "terms." Instead, the Dems have called their bluff and now they're stuck trying to work up an excuse for why they can't be held responsible if we go over the cliff.

Americans debate "Native-inspired imagery by Victoria's Secret" resulting in Victoria's Secret pulling ads and apologizing followed by Americans going back to ignoring the plight and living conditions of American-Indians on Indian reservations.

"Oh, it's just John again, predicting the end of the world because we're almost out of beer in the fridge."

Yep, it's just hyperbole and their 'sky is falling' cries of wolf won't play very well after the new year. And if they don't work out a compromise by the third week in January, President Obama's SOTU address is going to be like a red hot poker shoved up the GOP's collective ass.

They've done that with spirit bears in BC too.
Since becoming an adult I have not be able to understand the mindset of killing for killing's sake.

I've never understood the need for hunting in an era when you could buy half a year's supply of meat from the local supermarket for what you'd spend on a single weekend hunting trip. Perhaps I'm just not suffering the appropriate level of testosterone poisoning.

I've never understood the need for hunting in an era when you could buy half a year's supply of meat from the local supermarket for what you'd spend on a single weekend hunting trip. Perhaps I'm just not suffering the appropriate level of testosterone poisoning.

My younger brother was a big hunter. He and I used to argue about it before his testosterone killed him.

Heck in 1972 in Catholic school I learned that Genesis was not to be taken as an historical account of how the Earth and how life came to be. Now 40 years later I see people who identify as Catholics, like Marco Rubio and Rick Santorum spouting bullshit right from the Southern Baptist manual.

Same here. I learned in Catholic School about Science and Logical Thinking.

Why the Catholic Politicians are spouting Evangelical Rhetoric is beyond me. The Vatican hasn't changed their views on Science.

Wisconsin manufacturers and farmers are poised to cash in on the biggest state tax break they’ve received in decades, a move hailed by business groups but questioned by others worried about the annual tax revenue loss of more than $100 million.

The Republican-controlled Legislature included the “domestic production tax credit” in the 2011-13 state budget. It applies to production in Wisconsin and on Wisconsin property that’s assessed for manufacturing or agricultural use. Over the next four years, income taxes on these sectors will be reduced to nearly nothing.

Having admitted that he "made a very poor decision" in his first marriage when he cheated on his wife and pressured his mistress into have an abortion, Uncle Fester stunt-double and anti-choice U.S. Rep. Scott DesJarlais (R., Tenn.) insisted on a conservative Nashville radio show that God has "forgiven" him for being such an inveterate asshat, and asked "fellow Christians" to "consider doing the same."

DesJarlais, you may remember from the October weeks preceding our collective post-election fugue, is the Tea Party, family values-oriented Congressman (and physician!) who ran into a nasty bit of reelection trouble when a transcript of him bullying his ex-mistress/patient into having an abortion bubbled to the top of DesJarlais' swampy personal life. Things only got grosser from there — DesJarlais defended himself by explaining that the transcript wasn't so awful because his mistress wasn't even pregnant, and, besides, he was going through some tough emotional times. Have a little empathy, jeez. Soon, another former mistress came forward, telling tales of DesJarlais' professional inappropriateness, alleging that, as a doctor, he'd often try to romance some of his patients and write recreational prescriptions to whomever he was sexing.

Through it all, DesJarlais displayed the political fortitude to continue referring to himself as "consistent support of pro-life values," and has assured the good residents of Tennessee's Fourth Congressional District that, not only does he have no intention of resigning his seat, he'll be running for reelection in 2014.

I'm in the building industry, high end residential. Rumor going around my local business circles is that there's a lot of pend up demand and waiting on projects till after this fiscal cliff gets worked out. Clients with properties and designs in place, just waiting to mail the deposit check to the builder to get started. This typically happens after presidential elections during financially difficult times or recessions as people wait until the dust clears.

I'm pretty sure that as much as the technical financial shock to the system may contribute, the sheer fact that our government is so dysfunctional will destroy confidence and may be an even more significant impact to a recession than the changes to spending.

HuffPo: ...Labor and health care experts portrayed Walmart’s decision to exclude workers from its medical plans as an attempt to limit costs while taking advantage of the national health care reform known as Obamacare. Among the key features of Obamacare is an expansion of Medicaid, the taxpayer-financed health insurance program for poor people. Many of the Walmart workers who might be dropped from the company’s health care plans earn so little that they would qualify for the expanded Medicaid program, these experts said.

“Walmart is effectively shifting the costs of paying for its employees onto the federal government with this new plan, which is one of the problems with the way the law is structured,” said Ken Jacobs, chairman of the Labor Research Center at the University of California, Berkeley.

I have to say, the news reports I've heard have pretty much been the same...KC football player goes into work, thanks the coaching staff for their support, then kills himself...oh, and he apparently shot his girlfriend to death too.

I have to say, the news reports I've heard have pretty much been the same...KC football player goes into work, thanks the coaching staff for their support, then kills himself...oh, and he apparently shot his girlfriend to death too.

In front of her mom. Really screwed up. I don't want to even consider how the NFL is dealing with this.

They have done this several times in the past. I don't understand the logic. If you want peace, why make moves like this that piss off already trigger-happy people who will respond by launching rockets? Never mind...I answered my own question.

They have done this several times in the past. I don't understand the logic. If you want peace, why make moves like this that piss off already trigger-happy people who will respond by launching rockets? Never mind...I answered my own question.

Yeah, the Israelis should just totally continue to supply free electricity and water to Palestine and Gaza forever. Oh and all the Jews should just totally leave but still give them free stuff.

Hi You! How is the weather this fine Sunday in Philly?
I think the reporting has been pretty fair. I haven't heard any report that didn't start with Javon killing his girlfriend in front of his mother.
( which is weird.. My wife and I never argued in front of our mothers. You'd think we were Ozzie and Harriet )

Hi You! How is the weather this fine Sunday in Philly?
I think the reporting has been pretty fair. I haven't heard any report that didn't start with Javon killing his girlfriend in front of his mother.
( which is weird.. My wife and I never argued in front of our mothers. You'd think we were Ozzie and Harriet )

Why do they have to supply them with 'free' electricity and water? If you force a group to rely on your largess you exercise control over that group.

When funds are withheld to pay for the utilities you get the headlines ISRAELIS WITHHOLD PALESTINIAN REVENUE like they are totally stealing, not taking money that is owed to them to pay for stuff like gas, electric and water THAT ORDINARY SLOBS LIKE YOU AND ME HAVE TO PAY FOR or it will be turned off.

The deal, to be implemented in three stages, begins with Egyptian companies pumping fuel into Gaza under contracts signed with individual companies.

In the next stage, the Islamic Development Bank will fund projects to increase the capacity of Gaza's only power plant by 40 megawatts.

Finally, Gaza will connect its electricity grid to Egypt's and convert the power plant to run on gas instead of diesel.

Egypt decided to let more fuel into Gaza and increase the amount of electricity it supplies to the Palestinian enclave on Tuesday, a move aimed at easing a power crisis that has embarrassed the ruling Hamas movement.

When funds are withheld to pay for the utilities you get the headlines ISRAELIS WITHHOLD PALESTINIAN REVENUE like they are totally stealing, not taking money that is owed to them to pay for stuff like gas, electric and water THAT ORDINARY SLOBS LIKE YOU AND ME HAVE TO PAY FOR or it will be turned off.

Oh yeah, on Reuters:

Israel also announced it was withholding Palestinian tax revenues this month worth about $100 million because of a $200 million PA debt to the Israeli Electric Corporation.
Yasser Abed Rabbo, a senior Palestinian official, said confiscation of the funds due the cash-strapped Authority and vital to meeting its payroll, was “piracy and theft”.

Could anyone here get away with not paying their utilities and then crying PIRACY AND THEFT if the power company cut them off?

Hi You! How is the weather this fine Sunday in Philly?
I think the reporting has been pretty fair. I haven't heard any report that didn't start with Javon killing his girlfriend in front of his mother.
( which is weird.. My wife and I never argued in front of our mothers. You'd think we were Ozzie and Harriet )

I don't understand arguing in front of other people. First, it's none of their business and second, I don't need their involvement.

When funds are withheld to pay for the utilities you get the headlines ISRAELIS WITHHOLD PALESTINIAN REVENUE like they are totally stealing, not taking money that is owed to them to pay for stuff like gas, electric and water THAT ORDINARY SLOBS LIKE YOU AND ME HAVE TO PAY FOR or it will be turned off.

I understand this is an emotionally charged issue for you. My point was that the idea of Israel giving 'free' stuff to the territories as humanitarian aid is inaccurate. It's a form of control.

It's a well calculated form of control to limit the opportunity for violence, and to provide bargaining chips. Unfortunately the situation there isn't simple, nor is it one sided, which is why the US has tried many times to get both parties to the table. Cashing in any of those chips can be dangerous and result in unexpected consequences.

Under the terms of a deal announced on Tuesday, the Palestinian Authority government in the West Bank will supply Gaza with fuel purchased from Israel for so long as the Hamas-controlled Gaza electricity authority pays for it.

Announcing the deal on Tuesday, Hamas spokesman Taher al-Nunu said it would involve the delivery of around 500,000 liters of fuel daily to Gaza.

“The price of the delivery will be covered by the Gaza electricity company’s revenue,” he said.

A spokesman for the PA government confirmed the deal, calling it a “temporary measure” that would be implemented “so long as the electricity company in Gaza continues to pay the petrol company the necessary funds.”

What is the current government's long term plan for the West Bank? It's one thing to cut off funds to a corrupt authority, but I can't understand why Israel would then want to ingratiate themselves even further into the West Bank with the construction of new settlements.

What is the current government's long term plan for the West Bank? It's one thing to cut off funds to a corrupt authority, but I can't understand why Israel would then want to ingratiate themselves even further into the West Bank with the construction of new settlements.

What is the current government's long term plan for the West Bank? It's one thing to cut off funds to a corrupt authority, but I can't understand why Israel would then want to ingratiate themselves even further into the West Bank with the construction of new settlements.

These are not "new settlements," they are existing neighborhoods in heavily populated areas of Jerusalem. It is idiotic to imagine that Israel is going to uproot a large population living in established neighborhoods of Jerusalem.

I'm a little confused though. How can the West Bank ever be an independent state if it's dotted with settlements? Would they be evacuated once a peace agreement is settled on? This is leaving Jerusalem out of the equation. How can the West Bank be an independent Palestinian nation if it's dotted with settlements?

I'm a little confused though. How can the West Bank ever be an independent state if it's dotted with settlements? Would they be evacuated once a peace agreement is settled on? This is leaving Jerusalem out of the equation. How can the West Bank be an independent Palestinian nation if it's dotted with settlements?

Some of the remote settlements can be evacuated. Alternatively, the residents could be offered Palestinian citizenship.

Some of the remote settlements can be evacuated. Alternatively, the residents could be offered Palestinian citizenship.

OK, so this is something that would be considered. I'm still learning and not doing a very good job of educating myself. So if I were to assume that all of the West Bank is Palestine would I be wrong? Or would there be new borders that would need to be agreed upon? Am I agreeing with pre or post 1967 borders?

I'm a little confused though. How can the West Bank ever be an independent state if it's dotted with settlements? Would they be evacuated once a peace agreement is settled on? This is leaving Jerusalem out of the equation. How can the West Bank be an independent Palestinian nation if it's dotted with settlements?

There are a series of land swaps that have already been agreed to by both sides. The issue of settlements is relatively easy. . The sticking points in peace negotiations are Palestinian demands about right of return, possession of the Temple mount and having their capitol in East Jerusalem.

OK, so this is something that would be considered. I'm still learning and not doing a very good job of educating myself. So if I were to assume that all of the West Bank is Palestine would I be wrong? Or would there be new borders that would need to be agreed upon? Am I agreeing with pre or post 1967 borders?

"Based on the 1948 cease-fire lines with mutually agreed land swaps" -- President Barack Obama (as well as Presidents George W. Bush, Bill Clinton, George H. W. Bush, Ronald Reagan)

You remember that appalling misogynist site, The Spearhead, I posted quotes from a couple of nights ago? The guy who runs that site and others who run sites equally as bad like "The World According to Bob" have their very own forum.

I found it from a reference in one of Bob's posts, if you thought that The Spearhead was bad then you are really going to "love" this place. I give you...

The Israeli official did not specify where the 3,000 homes would be built, but said the areas for additional “planning and zoning” of housing would include the large Israeli settlement concentrations in the West Bank, among them the town of Maaleh Adumim east of Jerusalem and an area connecting it to the city, known as E-1.

It would be logistically and demographically impossible to retreat to 1967 Jerusalem.

Israel would never agree to that either. I think that's obvious but a lot of people seem to think that Israel should go back to pre-1967 borders. It just won't happen and unfortunately that's a big stumbling block. Leaving Jerusalem out I see the borders as in the third second map here which is the 1967 more or less:

Israel would never agree to that either. I think that's obvious but a lot of people seem to think that Israel should go back to pre-1967 borders. It just won't happen and unfortunately that's a big stumbling block. Leaving Jerusalem out I see the borders as in the third map here which is the 1967 more or less:

The first picture in that series is not accurate. That is not 100% of "historic Palestine." Historic Palestine (as shown in maps made during the Ottoman era) included areas east of the Jordan river (which today belongs to Jordan), and did not include the Negev.

The first picture in that series is not accurate. That is not 100% of "historic Palestine." Historic Palestine (as shown in maps made during the Ottoman era) included areas east of the Jordan river (which today belongs to Jordan), and did not include the Negev.

These are not "new settlements," they are existing neighborhoods in heavily populated areas of Jerusalem. It is idiotic to imagine that Israel is going to uproot a large population living in established neighborhoods of Jerusalem.

Lest we forget millions of Palestinians were forced out in the 1940's.

The reality is that Hamas and others wants all of it and that's just never going to happen. They continue to deny the existence of the state of Israel while expecting others to accept the existence of a state of Palestine. They should at least on a general basis accept its existence and move on from there.

The reality is that Hamas and others wants all of it and that's just never going to happen. They continue to deny the existence of the state of Israel while expecting others to accept the existence of a state of Palestine. They should at least on a general basis accept its existence and move on from there.

They don't even seem to be edging towards this. They're in denial and thinking that it will go back to pre-1947 is magical thinking. Ambassador Prosor was right. They could have had a state by now and it's largely their own fault. They could have settled on the 1967 borders and be done with it.

Dave Blount over at Moonbattery shows his amazing incitefulness and the sharpness of his always agile and outside the box thinking...

You can expect marijuana to be not only legal but subsidized by your tax dollars in the foreseeable future, for the same reason the government subsidizes poverty. A stoned electorate is a compliant electorate.

Free welfare blunts for everyone! Yay!

///

The video at that post is anti-legalization but is done in a fairly entertaining rather than preachy way. It isn't just repeating a bunch of discredited talking points, it instead attempts to bring some other ignored points into the discussion.

They don't even seem to be edging towards this. They're in denial and thinking that it will go back to pre-1947 is magical thinking. Ambassador Prosor was right. They could have had a state by now and it's largely their own fault. They could have settled on the 1967 borders and be done with it.

Just So. But please do remember this, because you will sometimes in frustration think of chasing false leads. In those times, remember what you said here.