Originally Posted by Ernest Jones
...........Also, just to reiterate, my point isn't so much about the procedures as the "why". Why you can take a drop near the point of entry in the case of a hazard and why you can't take a drop near the point where you "think" you lost the ball or where it left the course.........

It doesn't answer your question "Why?" but the difference has the authority of antiquity. When a group of golfers known as the Gentleman Golfers of Leith put together the first known set of Rules in 1744 they recorded that same difference between losing a ball and putting one in the water.

If your Ball comes among watter, or any wattery filth, you are at liberty to take out your Ball & bringing it behind the hazard and Teeing it, you may play it with any Club and allow your Adversary a Stroke for so getting out your Ball.

If you shou'd lose your Ball, by it's being taken up, or any other way, you are to go back to the Spot, where you struck last, & drop another Ball, And allow your adversary a Stroke for the misfortune.

PS: this isn't the second time I've made the analogy, you just read the other thread first.

Yes. I concede this point.

But nothing else.

IMO it is far more important to know what the rule is before you start wondering why it is what it is (recognizing that some might disagree with that view). And confusing the former in an attempt to get the latter is likely to be more confusing than anything else for someone who does not know the rules well.

You are still more limited in the dropping area, because you cannot take a relief drop from a water hazard and drop in the hazard. In most cases, this makes the area for the allowed drop up to 50% smaller. Also, when taking relief for an unplayable lie, there is no guarantee that your ball will not bounce back onto the same lie, and no recourse but to declare it unplayable yet again (with an additional penalty) if it does. Once dropped correctly under the rules, the ball is in play no matter where it may end up as long as it isn't closer to the hole. You are guaranteed (in fact required) to obtain complete relief from the hazard for the lie of the ball when dropping from a water hazard.

I do not think the bold is correct that you need to take complete relief from the hazard. For free relief (cartpath or whatnot) you do have to take full relief at NPR (nearest not nicest point of relief)

That is quite correct. You do not have to take full relief from the water hazard - you could be standing in the hazard to play your ball. The ball, however, must be completely clear of the hazard [Rule 20-2c(i)] and I think that may be what Fourputt meant when he said relief for the lie of the ball.

That is quite correct. You do not have to take full relief from the water hazard - you could be standing in the hazard to play your ball. The ball, however, must be completely clear of the hazard [Rule 20-2c(i)] and I think that may be what Fourputt meant when he said relief for the lie of the ball.

(If it was just a slip-up, Fourputt, that's your get-out clause )

I used that phrase specifically because you are not guaranteed relief for stance or swing, only for the lie.