I also find it annoying that when Garrosh was attacking Theramore, and Jaina pleaded Thrall for help, he did not help, and said it wasn't his concern. But the moment Jaina was about to attack Orgrimmar, Thrall appeared to stop her, not wanting her to attack his ppl (despite claiming that the business between the Horde and Alliance is no longer his concern and not wanting to help Jaina) I used to respect Thrall, but now i'm not sure.

Thrall went there because the water elementals asked for his help. Jaina's enslavement of the elementals was directly impeding his ability to repair the Maelstrom.

Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment

´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

That sacrifice means nothing to most of the playerbase and is easily brushed aside in lore development.[COLOR="red"]

Its brushed aside by cretins who only think warcraft means WAARRRRR. They can't conceive of anything else of merit in the story. This is why nobody understood Jaina's resolve before she was driven mad, and why it matters so little to such people the significance of that change.

Thrall is an heroic character, and as someone else said, if he does something heroic, he's called a mary sue, if his faults are revealed, the same little cretins what him punished as a character for it, and all he's every done it try to do whats right.

Thrall is an heroic character, and as someone else said, if he does something heroic, he's called a mary sue, if his faults are revealed, the same little cretins what him punished as a character for it, and all he's every done it try to do whats right.

I agree, too many people don't seem to understand that what's right sometimes means sacrificing, and he gets accused of not caring when he makes a sacrifice for the greater good. Thrall learns from mistakes and has the wisdom of seeing a bigger picture. I guess that goes against the brain-dead yolo crowd's desires to only give a crap about the here and now.

The more criticism people spew out harshly, the more I feel generations are knee deep in being overly critical. There's no criticism and there's constructive criticism and then there is *Criticizing everyone and everything because you don't like it and feel criticizing everything makes things better*.

I fear many young people on the interwebz are like this. It really is starting to get on my nerves. It has nothing to do with being a sheep on my side. I just feel we are way to quick to criticize.

Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! My Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeluron Big fanboy of Yrel now. Love her now

garry could have been an amazing leader for the horde (the original direction blizzard was going with garry)

however blizzard got a billion writers to write him and he sort of turned schitzo so they decided to kill him off

It was like this from the beginning. Garrosh is like sheep. He'll go wherever the boat sails even if it is a storm of which not even Sargeras can perceive.

Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! My Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeluron Big fanboy of Yrel now. Love her now

I know but that's the best I can describe him. He isn't exactly a strong willed character.

Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! My Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeluron Big fanboy of Yrel now. Love her now

oh so you mean DOES have flaws then? Funny how the community forms the backhanded opinion that Thrall is a mary sue because he's an heroic character, and yet when it flaws are now spoken of (a mary sue can not have flews to Thrall is not a sue), NOW they want him exiled for that flaw?

Thrall isn't the problem. Its the tiresome, fickle and immature nature of the wow community.

Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! My Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeluron Big fanboy of Yrel now. Love her now

The more criticism people spew out harshly, the more I feel generations are knee deep in being overly critical. There's no criticism and there's constructive criticism and then there is *Criticizing everyone and everything because you don't like it and feel criticizing everything makes things better*.

I fear many young people on the interwebz are like this. It really is starting to get on my nerves. It has nothing to do with being a sheep on my side. I just feel we are way to quick to criticize.

Can you imagine what it would have been like, if lord of the rings when it was first published, was held under with the same kind of community wow has?

"Omg Frodo's a Pansy!"
"Aragorns such a mary sue!"
"I liked Denethor he was a way better ruler then Aragorn!"
"Legolas is ghey!"

Thrall doesn't deserve to be exiled. Garrosh, despite what people want to think, or their hatred for him was a great commander. And he was more than willing to die for what he believed in. Thrall saw potential. And we even saw Garrosh starting to grow at Stonetalon. Something cause him to take a last minute detour, and Thrall did not see that. He can't be blamed for it. Thrall is selfless. And that's one of the qualities of great leaders. Now, he shouldn't be sitting idle right now. He needs to get active in fixing this mess.

Can you imagine what it would have been like, if lord of the rings when it was first published, was held under with the same kind of community wow has?

"Omg Frodo's a Pansy!"
"Aragorns such a mary sue!"
"I liked Denethor he was a way better ruler then Aragorn!"
"Legolas is ghey!"

No I can imagine quite a bit. Maybe I'm nuts but I just don't see the point in criticizing everything.

Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! My Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeluron Big fanboy of Yrel now. Love her now

The more criticism people spew out harshly, the more I feel generations are knee deep in being overly critical. There's no criticism and there's constructive criticism and then there is *Criticizing everyone and everything because you don't like it and feel criticizing everything makes things better*.

I fear many young people on the interwebz are like this. It really is starting to get on my nerves. It has nothing to do with being a sheep on my side. I just feel we are way to quick to criticize.

I think it's more of a case of people relating these fantasy characters to something in their lives that they didn't like, or something that has hurt them. Let's take a look at Garrosh. There are people out there that actually hate him. Like not in a story kind of way, but in a way where he's almost alive to them. And it's weird. It's like he stands for a bully in people's lives that they never stood up to. And Garrosh is representing that for them. So they lash out against this fictional character as an outlet. Because people say some crazy shit about this imaginary character. Scrolls of Lore and the official forums showed alot of this.

But the internet breeds people being overly critical. Because people say things they would never say to another person face to face. The internet is the ultimate tool for passive/aggressive types. And that's why you get so much hate, and overly critical weirdos out there.

I think it's more of a case of people relating these fantasy characters to something in their lives that they didn't like, or something that has hurt them. Let's take a look at Garrosh. There are people out there that actually hate him. Like not in a story kind of way, but in a way where he's almost alive to them. And it's weird. It's like he stands for a bully in people's lives that they never stood up to. And Garrosh is representing that for them. So they lash out against this fictional character as an outlet. Because people say some crazy shit about this imaginary character. Scrolls of Lore and the official forums showed alot of this.

But the internet breeds people being overly critical. Because people say things they would never say to another person face to face. The internet is the ultimate tool for passive/aggressive types. And that's why you get so much hate, and overly critical weirdos out there.

Storywise Garrosh is good. Personally? He's a jerk. I tend to think more on a personal level because that's how I relate.

Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! My Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeluron Big fanboy of Yrel now. Love her now

What? No. Thrall needs not be punished for his err in judgement. The man accepts he made a mistake, it's not something he did with any malice. He thought Garrosh had taken to heart the lessons he and older wise Orcs had taught him. He's not responsible for Garrosh bastardising and ignoring the lessons he taught. He is responsible for putting Grom on a pedestal and not informing Garrosh how much of a bastard he was. But I guess this is how the writers want to go down; where a lifetime of horrible deeds and acts can be reversed by one deed, done more out of selfishness than selflessness. Thrall's Horde, one he sacrificed much for is collapsing on front of his eyes and the Alliance is (or should be) having a hand in that because of the outrageous and unchecked aggression Garrosh unleashed on them in the wake of the Cataclysm. It's going to be a tough road; the Horde will have to be an underdog following Garrosh' removal, if Thrall even returns to the Warchief seat.

---------- Post added 2013-02-22 at 09:06 PM ----------

Not every prophecy viewed will come to pass. They are purely potential outcomes.

For the first time in any thread ever I agree with you.

Thrall is trying to atone for putting Garrosh in charge (See Echo Isles) and I'm sure he will play a part in SoO. Exiling him, or even blaming him is a little over the top. There was no way of knowing that Garrosh would do what he did.