[Ret] Trinket ratings estimation [Dragon Soul 4.3+]

And hello again, my fellow pink warriors.
List was updated using weights from high-mid i403 gearset with HM Slicer weapon and more accurate dps for several trinkets, like AoK and BLF, based on logs data.

Weights from SimCraft 4.30.6 Live: Patchwerk, 100k, i403 set (chardev of Anaxie @ Antonidas).
Cooldown coefficients and general logic from Chippydip, I enhanced his napkin math with SimCraft.

Several trinkets listed twice: good case () is a perfect scenario (100% line up with cooldowns, enough crits to get your stacks up), while bad case () is the worst possible luck when using particular trinket.

I'll definitely have to look into it this weekend. Req's sims have haste falling way down in value while your Redcape stats show that it surpassed crit rating. Gonna have to grind out some numbers myself because someone (Simcraft or Redcape) is off by a mile.

Edit: really confused now. Where did you get that value for haste?

From Redcape: "Haste is now uniformly our worst stat - reforge away from it where possible."

I'll definitely have to look into it this weekend. Req's sims have haste falling way down in value while your Redcape stats show that it surpassed crit rating. Gonna have to grind out some numbers myself because someone (Simcraft or Redcape) is off by a mile.

Edit: really confused now. Where did you get that value for haste?

From Redcape: "Haste is now uniformly our worst stat - reforge away from it where possible."

Something is amiss.

Yup I dunno Redcape and Exemplar say has is the lowest value but their spreadsheets show it surpassing Crit which I find hard to believe. It's going to take more testing I'm still waiting to hear back from SC devs on how they are calculating haste.

Either way Kisko is right no trinkets with Haste other than the CW which is rated at a higher value then I think it's worth but I doubt anyone is actively using it. You should add Dwyers Caber into the list as it's a great replacement to the 359 trinkets and it's simming out pretty high as well.

The part about trinkets not having haste is correct, but with a stat weight that high haste would become something we reforge to instead of away from. That can't be right.

Using Redcape's newest spreadsheet, I have haste at 82, crit at 99, and mastery at 114. That is vastly different than the numbers you used. As it does not truly effect trinkets from a haste perspective, the inaccuracy of the current numbers could completey debunk these rankings because the crit and mastery values could be off by a very significant margin.

I see no reason for Haste to fall down since no mechanics were changed. That said, none of trinkets at the top have Haste anyway, even with those values, so ...

This was the exact gear list that I made too, Kisko, that came out on top over Helm and Gloves as offset pieces (7/7 Heroic access) for Humans. Assuming Belt, VP neck, VP bracers, and Essence cannot be upgraded

Yeah, thanx for this thread.Really debating which trinkets to use since I just got the BoE Apparatus of Khaz'goroth ,And tbh i did alot of dummie tests, reforged twice, swapped in and out gear to fit in Apparatus of Khaz'goroth.And even with lining up cd's and aiming for atleast some uptime from my other trink H HoR, I wasn't at all impressed.And I didn't see a jump in dps like I was expecting.With the AoK proc I was at right under 4k mastery rating<with the 5 stack proc>.But it seemed like i wasted all of a minute ramping up, and even saw my stacks drop once or twice.Granted my crit % is low, since I have changed some pieces around for new gear,and didn't have the crit buff's as i usually would in 25 man raids so.Ill try it out again and test it in an actual raid, see how it compares.And Prentice just wanted to say thanx for those kicka$$ Ret PoV videos man.I like your setup.Thanx again

Got Apparatus a few days ago, I was top on DKP and the only plate dps user in the raid anyways. Lucky me

I seem to have a little trouble critting to get 5 stacks up to use it though, but I've only got 2 drops so far (helm off Alysrazor as well) so hopefully will improve further on. Dont get me wrong, its not terrible to get the stacks, just I find it a bit frustrating that we have another ramp up thing to keep track of and crit isnt exactly in spades in Cataclysm : /

If stats remain correct, those conclusions are really helpfull, and we needed topic like this ASAP, frost DKs allready have it :/
So it looks like HC HOR will remain supreme over Essence, but below normal Vessel, which might be important info for alot of people, while apparatus is all over the place and still unstable. I bought one but re-selled because people were not too much happy about it, might try it if it drops from trash , or ill just buy it if it keeps climbing up.
We basicly presumed trinket BIS list is simmilar, only thing which i wasnt sure is which one is better HC HoR or rep trinket, looks like HC HoR still kicks over it, so i guess it and normal rag trinket shoud be our choice untill HC trinkets kicks in..

This was the exact gear list that I made too, Kisko, that came out on top over Helm and Gloves as offset pieces (7/7 Heroic access) for Humans. Assuming Belt, VP neck, VP bracers, and Essence cannot be upgraded

That's what I figured looking at our Tier that Chest is going to be the weak link and difference between it and offset one is larger than between offset gloves/helm vs Tier gloves/helm.

Originally Posted by Prentice

For clarity's sake, I am not attacking you, Kisko. Those stat weights are WTF!? Don't think that I am calling you out.

It's all cool. Haste at spreadsheet varies wildly, even with small changes to latency, etc, it was always like that. But I do have certain trust in Redcape's Str, Crit and Mastery numbers and that's all we need to compare current trinkets. The fact that you can get haste by 0.01 better than crit with BiS pieces and specific latency settings doesn't mean that we need to change our reforging strat.

Added Dwyer's Caber, I've basically made up ICD on it as 60 seconds, if it will turn out to be wrong I'll fix it later. I don't know what damage On Use does either.

---------- Post added 2011-07-06 at 11:31 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Jammed

I just got the BoE Apparatus of Khaz'goroth ,And tbh i did alot of dummie tests, reforged twice, swapped in and out gear to fit in Apparatus of Khaz'goroth.And even with lining up cd's and aiming for atleast some uptime from my other trink H HoR, I wasn't at all impressed.

That's sad to hear but bear in mind that AoK really needs full raidbuffs and high-level of gear to be effective.

For instance, those with 372 currently crit once per 9-10 seconds in raid, but I expect that at 391 we should be critting once per 8 seconds and AoK will have reasonable 40s (8x5) ramp-up time.

Btw there is a post on raidingretribution.net with a screenie from a GM's response.Every item can be upgraded to 391.For the ones now listed by the vendor,you just use the firestone on them and they get upgraded

Yeah, thanx for this thread.Really debating which trinkets to use since I just got the BoE Apparatus of Khaz'goroth ,And tbh i did alot of dummie tests, reforged twice, swapped in and out gear to fit in Apparatus of Khaz'goroth.And even with lining up cd's and aiming for atleast some uptime from my other trink H HoR, I wasn't at all impressed.And I didn't see a jump in dps like I was expecting.With the AoK proc I was at right under 4k mastery rating<with the 5 stack proc>.But it seemed like i wasted all of a minute ramping up, and even saw my stacks drop once or twice.Granted my crit % is low, since I have changed some pieces around for new gear,and didn't have the crit buff's as i usually would in 25 man raids so.Ill try it out again and test it in an actual raid, see how it compares.And Prentice just wanted to say thanx for those kicka$$ Ret PoV videos man.I like your setup.Thanx again

You lost your stacks on the dummy?! Seriously?
The only reason I can think of is you got too much dodges and parrys because in an actual fight I never lost the stacks

Btw there is a post on raidingretribution.net with a screenie from a GM's response.Every item can be upgraded to 391.For the ones now listed by the vendor,you just use the firestone on them and they get upgraded