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I'm already paying my cable company $120 per year for the privilege of watching NBCSN, so there's no way I'm paying even more for NBC Sports Gold.

Just to clarify this, the $120/yr is a "sports surcharge" in addition to the cost of normal cable TV channels. The $120/yr is a surcharge necessary to watch NBCSN and other sports channels. So if I'm already paying a surcharge for NBCSN, why should I pay even more for their phone app?

Great, i just bought the Verizon phone because of the Indycar connection. I agree how is money going to attract more fans. Other than Indy practice I can live without it. More money for something that was already expensive has me depressed. Next thing will be pay toilets.

I can say from experience the NBC gold is the best sports app out there for streaming. I've purchased the cycling package before and it worked awesome, especially compared to watchespn or foxsportsgo. Works great on chromecast, roku, iPad or computer. Might be tough if you have an integrated smart tv, but any of the $20 devices or a hdmi cord from a computer.

If it includes races, not necessarily live, but full a few hours after the event i'll gladly pay the price for it. To be fair I don't pay for cable so to drop money for my favorite sport is an absolute bargain for me.

My understanding is NBC Sports Gold will have all IndyCar sessions plus Lights not broadcast on TV. So you'll still need a cable subscription for races on NBCSN. Obviously some qualifying sessions may also be shown on TV, at least that was my impression when the broadcasting deal was announced.

This Gold package feels a bit like a *********. I mean, the purpose of OTT services is usually to offer an alternative to cable subscription. Of course, NBC doesn't want to be killing cable so instead this package complements their TV coverage. But it's really only the hardcore fans that want to pay for this, and I doubt you're going to pay a lot if the cable subscription alone already feels too expensive.

What I'm worried about is what happens to the YouTube race uploads. NBC Gold will have race replays so does that mean an end for the YouTube uploads? Also, this can make following the sport more difficult for the fans overseas. Can overseas fans watch the practice and qualifying sessions. What about race replays?

not sure about that. NBC gold streams all ASO cycling races, including the Tour de France, which NBC extensively broadcasts. The difference is NBC gold allows for commercial free and on demand viewing

not sure about that. NBC gold streams all ASO cycling races, including the Tour de France, which NBC extensively broadcasts. The difference is NBC gold allows for commercial free and on demand viewing

Apart from that one Miles quote about all track activity in NBC Gold, it's always been said Gold will not have live races, only replays. And that's, unfortunately, what makes sense for NBC. The fact that F1 had to give the TV rights for free to ESPN shows live races in an OTT service hurt cable subscriptions. NBC wants to keep IndyCar fans paying for NBCSN and that's why they put only practice and qualies plus race replays to Gold.

So it doesn't include live races. Meaning that this is just a way to get more money out of the hardcore fans, and not a way to expand their audience to cable cutters (like myself, who lives in an area without cable and can't afford $60 CAD a month for satellite and can't justify $25 CAD a month for a single sports streaming channel).

I'm currently watching via DAZN, which also streams a bunch of other sports for about 10€ a month. On the IndyCar side, however, it's just the races - with really awful German announcers. So if Gold gets me access to everything AND the actual NBC announcing crew, that's a win for me.

I'm currently watching via DAZN, which also streams a bunch of other sports for about 10€ a month. On the IndyCar side, however, it's just the races - with really awful German announcers. So if Gold gets me access to everything AND the actual NBC announcing crew, that's a win for me.

Have they said IndyCar will be available internationally? Many of the NBC Sports Gold passes are only available in the United States.

Have they said IndyCar will be available internationally? Many of the NBC Sports Gold passes are only available in the United States.

I don't think they mentioned anything about that, or just that it's still undecided. If they made it available, I would get it, but if not, I hope they at least keep the existing options open here. Would be nice to be able to choose the original commentary though, one of the German announcers still brings up that Hinch peed himself at Barber because he was so scared to drive in those conditions - not because they had to stay in the car for the first red flag. And he also mentioned how RHR married Robby Gordon's daughter

Fast forward to a year from now... The bean counters will declare it a great success, bringing in 'x' dollars, even though the number of people watching has dropped significantly.

The number of people watching practice online for free on youtube doesnt do anything for Indycar. Indycar isn't getting a casual fan just accidentally typing in "Indycar Sonoma Practice 1". This is a smart move for Indycar economically because they know the diehard fans like me will pay for the $50 a year NBC Gold plan just like many others will. It'll help both Indycar and NBC.

Also the move to NBC for next year will bring in a hell of a lot more people than this year. This year we had 5 races on ABC (and Indy 500 qualifying). Next year we have at least 8 races on NBC. Those three additional races on NBC will bring in more viewership than 5 network races on Always Bad Coverage. So your theory that the number of people dropping I believe is completely dumbfounded, but we shall see.

World's biggest Ryan Hunter-Reay fan!

When not discussing opinions, I try my best to only post facts, if I post something factually incorrect please correct me with a source (if possible)

The number of people watching practice online for free on youtube doesnt do anything for Indycar. Indycar isn't getting a casual fan just accidentally typing in "Indycar Sonoma Practice 1".

The potential for growing IndyCar's fan base through YouTube has nothing to do with some random person searching for "IndyCar Practice" and everything to do with YouTube's 'Suggested for You' AI algorithms which populate your initial YouTube homepage with content based on your search statistics and previous views (among other data).

I'm sure Mark Miles and IndyCar share your limited understanding of both the technology and the growth potential there, which is why the YouTube platform was never successfully exploited by IndyCar. Indeed, as I stated above, I believe IndyCar's best potential for growing the fan base comes from crossover interest groups. Some of the most frustrating comments I read on this message board are things like 'Auto racing is dying off' or 'Millennials don't work on cars, so they'll never be racing fans'. Both these comments presume that IndyCar has already captured 100% of the potential fan viewership base and that there's no room for growth. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Off the top of my head I can think of two YouTubbers - one runs a Hardcore PC Computer Enthusiast channel, the other runs a channel that was dedicated to BMX. Both have multi-million subscribers on their YouTube channels. The PC Enthusiast also occasionally does car videos/discussions, while the BMX guy has focused on drifting as of late. Both of these examples represent cross-over potential fan base markets that IndyCar could gain exposure to through YouTube's suggestion algorithms.

FYI - the BMX guys happens to be a young Millennial (actually might be too young to qualify as a Millennial in fact) and both get large numbers of views on their car videos. IndyCar would kill for that kind of exposure.

Originally Posted by RHRfan#1

This is a smart move for Indycar economically because they know the diehard fans like me will pay for the $50 a year NBC Gold plan just like many others will. It'll help both Indycar and NBC.

I wonder how many Gold subscribers they'll actually get? And I wonder what IndyCar's take from the subscription fee actually is? As some have pointed out above, not streaming live races on Gold also seems like a huge missed opportunity for IndyCar, because they're completely neglecting the cord-cutter market with this incarnation of their streaming product.

Originally Posted by RHRfan#1

Also the move to NBC for next year will bring in a hell of a lot more people than this year. This year we had 5 races on ABC (and Indy 500 qualifying). Next year we have at least 8 races on NBC. Those three additional races on NBC will bring in more viewership than 5 network races on Always Bad Coverage. So your theory that the number of people dropping I believe is completely dumbfounded, but we shall see.

On Trackforum I've seen ABC blamed from everything from World Hunger to the National Debt. I've accepted that other posters are smarter than me and therefore acknowledge that simply switching from ABC to NBC will bring about a miraculous increase in viewership to IndyCar.

To that end I've noted your post and would like to revisit it next year. However, so that we have a basis of comparison, can you quantify the percentage increase that goes along with your prediction of "hell of a lot more people" so that we can see if it indeed pans out as everybody believes it will? Thanks.

On Trackforum I've seen ABC blamed from everything from World Hunger to the National Debt. I've accepted that other posters are smarter than me and therefore acknowledge that simply switching from ABC to NBC will bring about a miraculous increase in viewership to IndyCar.

To that end I've noted your post and would like to revisit it next year. However, so that we have a basis of comparison, can you quantify the percentage increase that goes along with your prediction of "hell of a lot more people" so that we can see if it indeed pans out as everybody believes it will? Thanks.

If you think that 5 network races is better than 8 network races, you are very misinformed. If it was 5 on ABC vs only 5 on NBC then I wouldn't have said what I did, which is that 8 network races is better than 5, most educated race fans understand that.

The potential for growing IndyCar's fan base through YouTube has nothing to do with some random person searching for "IndyCar Practice" and everything to do with YouTube's 'Suggested for You' AI algorithms which populate your initial YouTube homepage with content based on your search statistics and previous views (among other data).

I'm sure Mark Miles and IndyCar share your limited understanding of both the technology and the growth potential there, which is why the YouTube platform was never successfully exploited by IndyCar. Indeed, as I stated above, I believe IndyCar's best potential for growing the fan base comes from crossover interest groups. Some of the most frustrating comments I read on this message board are things like 'Auto racing is dying off' or 'Millennials don't work on cars, so they'll never be racing fans'. Both these comments presume that IndyCar has already captured 100% of the potential fan viewership base and that there's no room for growth. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Okay, Auto racing is dying off, and Millenials don't work on cars, so they will probably never become racing fans. The fact that Auto racing is dying off is a fact, and studies have shown that Millenials for the most part couldn't give a **** less about cars, but where you fall short is that you think those comments presume that Indycar has already 100% of the potential fan viewership base and there is no room for growth. I certainly never said that, who has? Of course Indycar can grow.

If you think that 5 network races is better than 8 network races, you are very misinformed. If it was 5 on ABC vs only 5 on NBC then I wouldn't have said what I did, which is that 8 network races is better than 5, most educated race fans understand that.

Recall that it was discussed in the time that ABC was actually offering more races on Network TV than NBC was. So under those auspices, I reject your current explanation of 5 vs 8 (which is why I said we should use percentages) since it would have actually been 10 vs 8 in favor of ABC if the discussions at the time were true. Because, after all, every educated fan understands that 10 is better than 8

I'm still waiting for your percentage, by the way.

Originally Posted by RHRfan#1

Okay, Auto racing is dying off, and Millenials don't work on cars, so they will probably never become racing fans. The fact that Auto racing is dying off is a fact, and studies have shown that Millenials for the most part couldn't give a **** less about cars, but where you fall short is that you think those comments presume that Indycar has already 100% of the potential fan viewership base and there is no room for growth. I certainly never said that, who has? Of course Indycar can grow.

The typical excuses are often presented (along with the other common ones e.g. there's 587 TV channels now vs 3 back in the day, etc.) as rationale to why IndyCar is doing hunky-dory in terms of their 0.x TV ratings that they often pull in. My point is that there are many sources of potential new fans that IndyCar could tap into with some creativity - but instead of growth, they've chosen to focus on (what I believe) will be a very few dollars in the short term by going behind the NBC Gold paywall.

Recall that it was discussed in the time that ABC was actually offering more races on Network TV than NBC was. So under those auspices, I reject your current explanation of 5 vs 8 (which is why I said we should use percentages) since it would have actually been 10 vs 8 in favor of ABC if the discussions at the time were true. Because, after all, every educated fan understands that 10 is better than 8

I'm still waiting for your percentage, by the way.

The typical excuses are often presented (along with the other common ones e.g. there's 587 TV channels now vs 3 back in the day, etc.) as rationale to why IndyCar is doing hunky-dory in terms of their 0.x TV ratings that they often pull in. My point is that there are many sources of potential new fans that IndyCar could tap into with some creativity - but instead of growth, they've chosen to focus on (what I believe) will be a very few dollars in the short term by going behind the NBC Gold paywall.

I don't have a percentage for you but I will give you a number of total viewers. I also don't have all the numbers right in front of my face or saved on a spreadsheet like you might have but if our 5 network races this year brought in a total of 8 million viewers (pure guess), then my guess for next years 8 races on NBC I expect a total of 12 million viewers. I would call 4 million more people "a hell of a lot more people", wouldn't you?

Also we can agree to disagree about NBC vs ABC, I utterly hate ABC broadcasts of Indycar and I have for the last 15 years, I am very optimistic about NBC next year with how much they claim they will promote the series and most importantly the Indy 500, something ABC stopped caring about (my opinion).

All of the networks are trying to come up with pay-walled sites FOR THE DIE-IST OF DIE-HARDS, using either events they already own the rights to, such as, in NBC's case, IC practice, qualifying and reruns; or material obtainable at no cost, such as lower division and non-revenue college sports and material from other English speaking countries.

For 95% of IC fans, the "free" material on NBC and NBCSN will be more than sufficient.

My understanding is NBC Sports Gold will have all IndyCar sessions plus Lights not broadcast on TV. So you'll still need a cable subscription for races on NBCSN. Obviously some qualifying sessions may also be shown on TV, at least that was my impression when the broadcasting deal was announced.

This Gold package feels a bit like a *********. I mean, the purpose of OTT services is usually to offer an alternative to cable subscription. Of course, NBC doesn't want to be killing cable so instead this package complements their TV coverage. But it's really only the hardcore fans that want to pay for this, and I doubt you're going to pay a lot if the cable subscription alone already feels too expensive.

What I'm worried about is what happens to the YouTube race uploads. NBC Gold will have race replays so does that mean an end for the YouTube uploads? Also, this can make following the sport more difficult for the fans overseas. Can overseas fans watch the practice and qualifying sessions. What about race replays?

I have the same feeling - it would be great if NBC Gold allowed me to be a "cord cutter" and still get all the IndyCar content I want. For that, I'd pay the season subscription. But if I need a freakin' $120/mo cable subscription, then they want me to pay MORE for the side scraps, that's going the wrong direction.

Also, I sometimes watch races on youtube when I miss them live. Of course, it's not as good, because generally you know who won, you know some of the race storyline by the time you view it. So really it is not as valuable as the live race. But now, when races are on NBC live, they are free over the air. To watch the less valuable delayed stream, they are charging EXTRA. Uh, no thanks.

Apart from that one Miles quote about all track activity in NBC Gold, it's always been said Gold will not have live races, only replays. And that's, unfortunately, what makes sense for NBC. The fact that F1 had to give the TV rights for free to ESPN shows live races in an OTT service hurt cable subscriptions. NBC wants to keep IndyCar fans paying for NBCSN and that's why they put only practice and qualies plus race replays to Gold.

This is why Comcast buying NBC should never have been allowed. But Comcast openly and brazenly bribed the FCC, with zero consequence, and this is what happens.