Apart from having to stand in line my experience with Will Call has always been positive. In fact last year the Will call supervisor who helped me when I came back to the city on Thursday night was WONDERFUL. I think his name was something like Mother Hen, maybe getting to meet him and give him a hug is also a pretty big incentive for me to volunteer.

Jovankat wrote:I had been thinking about volunteering but kept thinking it would clash too much with camp set up during early entry and at the start of the week...

I used to think the same. I do my bit of work as part of a theme camp and didn't know if I would be spreading myself too thin by taking on shifts with PG&E. I did a few shifts in 2011 and 2012 with Gate and Perimeter. Those provided me with some of my best experiences on playa (Perimeter gets to look at the city from the OUTSIDE of the fence). Now I've moved on to my 2nd department, one that really challenges my skills and ability to keep cool. I may try BO in the future. Point is, especially if you have been for more than two years, there is a lot more to experience when you join up with a volunteer group. If it's not right for you, what have you lost? A few hours on playa.

This from the guy that gets a free ticket and every other perk a senior staffer gets! Lets get rid of the free tickets for the medical staff too, right?

trilobyte wrote:
Speaking personally, fuck incentivizing. Participate and volunteer because you can and want to help, not because you're in it for rewards.

Anyone taking offence at anything in my posts - tough. It's only an internet forum. Stop being overly sensitive. you are shallow and banal. Eplayans who spend hours a day posting need to make in person friends and mentally masturbate less.

And as is often the case, playapatrol gets it wrong. After years of year-round volunteering Burning Man did start gifting me a ticket, but it's hardly why I spend my time here or help other teams when they need it. There aren't any other perks either (nor am I a senior staffer by any stretch of the imagination) - I go through all the stuff any other theme camp goes through to register (and more often than not haven't gotten our first choice of locations), and build and bring my stuff just like anybody else.

Speaking personally, I think that incentivizing is an incredibly weak way for a team to get quality volunteers. I wouldn't want anyone on the mod team who was 'in it for the ticket' or driven by any perceived rewards other than the satisfaction of helping out. Volunteers driven by incentives tend to be flaky, when the going gets tough they bail when they realize the work isn't worth whatever it was they thought they were getting.

trilobyte wrote: Volunteers driven by incentives tend to be flaky, when the going gets tough they bail when they realize the work isn't worth whatever it was they thought they were getting.

Perfect response. I think the key to getting folks to return year after year to the volunteer positions is that the work is mostly fun and or interesting. (This is why emptying the portos is not a volunteer position)

Sure there are some perks. I've collected some cool swag, some department clothing (shirts hats), a hot meals while working shifts. These are cool extras but they are not the reason I do it. I do it 'cause, for me at least, it is one more cool thing to do at TTITD.

The work being fun and interesting is an incentive though and so is the satisfaction of helping out, incentives don't have to be monetary or material. I suspect the org wouldn't actually even need to add any incentives, just do a better job of promoting those that already exist.

Any volunteer doing work for BMORG is here because they want to be - The hours required for a comped ticket do not even come close to what most people make in the default world. Fiscally it makes sense for me to simply bill a client for the hours I would work on playa if money was my incentive. Most volunteers do this because they dig it. Any perks are a courtesy.

Warning...off topic. This year I spoke with several volunteers that were EA like me. I Greet. I love it. They do Census, Gate, DPW and all get things like early entry, commissary meals, showers, guaranteed able to buy tickets, low cost tickets (guaranteed), free tickets etc...although that's all I can think of right now. As a Greeter you can buy a ticket or maybe a low cost ticket if you work 4 hours EVERY DAY. I'll keep Greeting for half the burn and take my chances at getting a ticket. Thanks. Be in it for the fun not the carrot.

Those aren't buttermilk biscuits I'm lying on Savannah

Pictures or it didn't happen Greycoyote

Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see.Arthur Schopenhauer

We ended up talking about it a bunch in my camp, since I was leaving so often.

My theme camp lead said that he'd love to do something like that out there, but maintaining the pumps and misting system in the camp was his "job". I totally get that. He also added he could do it with a beer in his hand.

Some folks job out there is building big art, or little art... To me, volunteering and having a task out there is the difference between going on vacation to a city, and living in a city.

I guess, the perks I get out of the work is citizenship. I'm not saying that's YOUR (editorial you) pathway to that feeling, but it's mine.

Sometimes "our" ranger brings a dessert to camp for us all to share, which is the closest I get to the commissary. Three bites of cheesecake, nice, but woohoo.

I volunteer here, not so much on the playa. I have my art project, plus RHPS and some years, the fire conclave. That's enough for me. Yes, the conclave gives me the opportunity to purchase performer ticket, but that is so iffy late in the year, I buy my tickets full price. I don't rely on the gift ticket for modding because it didn't even exist for many years. Not why I do it. I am attached to you fuckos and want to keep "our place" tidy and nice.

I imagine the will call volunteers don't ask to do what has to be a frustrating job during their playa time just because they might get a shower, meal, or a ticket. They probably take a lot of pride in their work, and are likely just as upset that things did not run well. I have no problem with them being treated well.

Nipple wrote:I mean, we can also keep standing in this parking lot and complaining to each other that the lattes taste like shit.

I work for one of the departments out there. My joining was started by a thread like this. I thought: If I *REALLY* want to have an opinion in a do-ocracy, in a reputation economy, maybe I should show up.

So, yeah... my opinions on some subjects mean a lot more than random guesses from outside the candy store, because I bothered.

I suggest you bother, too.

Fuck the attitude that problems are to be solved by someone else. I challenge you to dump a bucket of ice on your head to improve Will Call wait times next year.

Much as I applaud the sentiment, living in the UK prevents me from doing anything other than having a good old moan and suggesting alternatives.

The 1st would be to totally get rid of will call in the desert, have ticket check stations at the beginning of the 445 and 427, not compulsory but can verify a ticket is valid and have will call in a office space somewhere in Reno. Signs along the route. No ticket no entry. Will call is in Reno. All ticket issues must be sorted in Reno period. Getting to gate, no ticket, no entry.

SunrayU75 wrote:
Much as I applaud the sentiment, living in the UK prevents me from doing anything other than having a good old moan and suggesting alternatives.

The 1st would be to totally get rid of will call in the desert, have ticket check stations at the beginning of the 445 and 427, not compulsory but can verify a ticket is valid and have will call in a office space somewhere in Reno. Signs along the route. No ticket no entry. Will call is in Reno. All ticket issues must be sorted in Reno period. Getting to gate, no ticket, no entry.

I work out there with a lot of people who aren't from the U.S.

Not sure what the U.K. has to do with it. Is it by decree of the crown? Anyway...

Getting rid of Will Call in the desert? So, outsource the ticket staff? Have the volunteers that run box office stay in Reno for the duration of the event?

During our parking lot brainstorm, we talked about off-site Will Call. The best we could come up with for our friends descending from the north was a separate playa closure with a box office/will call. And on in Gerlach for those making the southern approach.

Probably a million reasons that two will call sites would be impractical, but that didn't matter.

It just helped pass the time and to not let the frustration consume us!

The Will Call experience/memories are fading pretty fast while the awesomeness of everything else prevails.

forty_eight wrote:Probably a million reasons that two will call sites would be impractical...

Are tickets designated for different people? So, if you said 6 months ago you'd be coming from the south, but in the meantime you moved north...
There are separate ticket "pools"--low income, staff, two tiers--how you'd split that between two or more offices...And that would create a traffic hastle (or another one, in addition to the ones we already create) near the office as people line up and wait. And there'd be no chance of getting a ride from someone who had tickets...
I think KISS applies here, and having tickets in Reno is not simple.

The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.
Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

SunrayU75 wrote:
Much as I applaud the sentiment, living in the UK prevents me from doing anything other than having a good old moan and suggesting alternatives.

The 1st would be to totally get rid of will call in the desert, have ticket check stations at the beginning of the 445 and 427, not compulsory but can verify a ticket is valid and have will call in a office space somewhere in Reno. Signs along the route. No ticket no entry. Will call is in Reno. All ticket issues must be sorted in Reno period. Getting to gate, no ticket, no entry.

I work out there with a lot of people who aren't from the U.S.

Not sure what the U.K. has to do with it. Is it by decree of the crown? Anyway...

Getting rid of Will Call in the desert? So, outsource the ticket staff? Have the volunteers that run box office stay in Reno for the duration of the event?

I live in Portland, OR. Reno is hours out of my way...

Living in the UK means I can't easily volunteer to help replace the ticketing system. Are you suggesting I give up work? Some of my camp mates are professionals in this matter and have offered advice. Will see if the BM are open to suggestions or have their head stuck in the dust.

You don't need to go to will call if you live in the US because they will send you the tickets in the post, so can drive straight in. As I suspect is true of most people who drive in from the north.

People living outside the US aren't so lucky and have Will Call every time. All of these people would arrive in Reno on their way there. Having the ticket office there makes perfect sense.

No. There is no reason to move Will Call. It has worked perfectly fine for years, right where it is. The highway and Gate road line are huge limiting factors on how many people can get to Will Call within a certain time period. The volunteers at the box office aren't doing anything wrong, either. Just keep everything about Will Call the same next year, except streamline the process as much as possible (work with Ticketfly on that) and have backup plans if there's any risk of being understaffed.

SunrayU75 wrote:
Living in the UK means I can't easily volunteer to help replace the ticketing system. Are you suggesting I give up work? Some of my camp mates are professionals in this matter and have offered advice. Will see if the BM are open to suggestions or have their head stuck in the dust. You can totally volunteer your time at the event. Hell, if you're going to be standing in Will Call for six hours, maybe you could pull a shift. "Head stuck in the dust"... yes, the box office folks have been straining to hang on to this crazy ticket machine for years at this point. Thank god your camp mates are around to rescue them. Why haven't they turned up sooner?! *pat pat* Burning Man is a fairly complex beast, it's not as easy as writing a couple lines on a message board.

You don't need to go to will call if you live in the US because they will send you the tickets in the post, so can drive straight in. As I suspect is true of most people who drive in from the north. Totally true... except in all of the cases where it's not, or if you're riding in a car with someone where it's not the case. For instance: My ladyfriend coming to the burn from Portland, with someone from London. Guess they're going to Reno...for some reason.

People living outside the US aren't so lucky and have Will Call every time. All of these people would arrive in Reno on their way there. Having the ticket office there makes perfect sense. This is also completely true, except for when it's not. Reno is not the gateway to the US. That's St. Louis. We should put Will Call there, and bus volunteers to St. Louis every morning... or hire someone, I guess. Temps...temps... we need temps! Throw money at the solution! Why are my ticket prices so high?!

Sorry SunrayU75, I'm Australian and I just volunteered to help with Will Wall next year so being a foreigner isn't much of an excuse. And as explained elsewhere in the thread there are lots of reasons other than being a foreigner for using Will Call and lots of people don't need to go via Reno.

That said I'm not entirely convinced having some Will Call outposts couldn't work, didn't Burner Express have a way of getting Will Call folk their tickets that wasn't actually stopping at Will Call? I guess there could be three delivery options; Post, Playa Will Call and Reno Will Call. But as has been pointed out that would require a.) Reno based volunteers who either don't get to go to the event or have to wait until later in the week to head out b.)playa based volunteers having a (at least) 6 hour round trip added to their 6 hours shift or c.) temps being hired who obviously cost more than volunteers. So I'm also not entirely convinced that would work either.

This brings me to a question American Boyfriend and I were wondering about the other day; at Will Call do they a.) have all the orders printed and put together with the right number of tickets and vehicle passes and when you arrive they find your envelope and give it to you, b.) just have dirty great piles of tickets and vehicle passes and when you arrive they check your order and take the right number of each off the piles and give them to you or do they c.) have tickets with all the artwork etc but no bar code loaded into printers and when you arrive they print your barcode onto a ticket and give it to you? AB was convinced it wasn't option a. but the tickets have different prices on them and orders have specific ticket numbers assigned so a or c seemed most likely to me. It's not entirely relevant to this conversation but I am curious.

I wasn't talking about volunteering for the actual event. I built and helped out at the camp I was in, that consumed the best part of 5 days of the 10 I was there. How much more do you want me to put into the burning man? I quite like leaving my camp from time to time to see what others have built.

I wasn't talking about volunteering at all. I was talking about making changes like moving will call which is a BMORG issue. Not really close enough to the people that run the event and can't get close either, living where I do. I think you'd need to to have any say in how the ticketing is done.

So if people are wedded to a broken system, how about having a few box offices? If you insist on standing in line in the baking heat in the old Will Call, because it compliments your Burning man experience, fine. Just give me an option of standing in line somewhere cool before I even set off. Surely sorting all ticketing issues out before people arrive at gate makes lots of sense.