The Man With No Name

The Third Date Rule

I don’t really have anything all that intelligent to say about this, but I figured that I’d end up on the tail end of a google search with this entry’s title. Especially if a couple of people link to this entry.

I just googled it because (news flash!) I still don’t know what the hell I’m doing with dating. Over the past year I’ve gotten pretty good at first dates from the online world – they are all pleasant with conversation and laughs. But the second date is an awkward date because you’ve exhausted the basic small talk, and it’s time to really try and get to know someone on a slightly deeper level, and yet, the societal expectations that people are carrying around are still louder than their actual personalities. There’s still a lot of defensiveness and caginess.

And I think a lot of it is because of the third-date rule. I didn’t even realize, but the third-date rule is all over the place. I hadn’t even heard of it before Rachel gasped to Monica, “That’s my third-date sweater!” But I hear reference to it more often now, even once recently on a first date (that was weird). For those that don’t know, the Third Date is supposedly “the one”. “If either party declines sex on the Third Date, it’s a clear sign that the relationship is going nowhere.”

Now obviously that’s an item of contention for women – lots of women worry about the Third-Date rule and gnash their teeth and rend their garments, etc. But not as much has been written about how it’s kind of a lot of pressure for guys, too. There’s all this weird reverse psychology and game theory to it.

For example. Say you’re an innocent guy and an innocent woman. Then what happens is that you go out, and have a conversation, and go out again, and spend more time together, and eventually you might have some chemistry, and at some point you hop in the sack. It’s not on any particular date. It might be 2nd, 7th, or 18th – the point is it is entirely dependent on the dynamics between the two people. This is arguably the way it should be.

What’s funny is that most people will agree that it’s the way it should be. But the problem is that people aren’t that innocent, so all they can do is pretend to be.

So let’s say you’re an innocent woman and a worldly guy – a guy that is polished with the third-date rule. You go out for conversation. The guy knows there needs to be a smooth progression, so he makes sure to go for some sort of kiss or peck goodnight. The innocent woman is floored and flattered – first-date kisses don’t happen all the time. On the second date, the guy knows that the very next date is The Date, so he’s engineering a date that is a romantic open-ended get-together for some high-quality canoodling and maybe even some making out. The innocent woman is into him, but perhaps she’s wanting to move a little slower. Then the Third Date happens – the guy is pushing for sex to suss out the relationship possibilities. If the woman is into him but doesn’t want to have sex on a third date, then all of a sudden he’s letting her down easy and she’s wondering what the hell happened.

All right, now let’s say you’re an innocent man and a worldly woman. The woman is probably wondering why you didn’t kiss her goodbye on the first date. Then she’s wondering why you’re suggesting meeting at a fucking bookstore for date #2. She’s got no sense of hot-and-heavy progression so she might not even agree to date #3, or if she’s really into you, she’ll agree to come over to your house and then wonder why you’re not making a move. I imagine this has happened to me because a couple of times I invited dates over for tea, and they said yes, and then I… made tea. I mean, we literally drank tea. And then I happily wished them a good night, and then didn’t hear from them again.

Anyway, so say it’s two worldly people. It doesn’t matter if you’d both actually prefer to wait five or ten dates – there’s a third-date rule, and at least there’s the comfort of having a shared social foundation and silent language, one you don’t have to talk about. Maybe if you’re compatible, you have sex on the third date, and then months later blissfully admit to each other you could have waited longer. Or maybe if you’re both confident and sophisticated enough, you can obliquely refer to the third-date rule and mutually agree to lengthening it a couple of dates, without making it seem like an ambivalent semi-rejection of the other person.

But the whole problem is that you don’t know if the other person is innocent or worldly. That’s where the game theory comes in. Do I reject the worldly view, force the innocent route, and simply hope the other person is either innocent or is forcing it as well? Are they going the worldly route while secretly wishing they could be innocent? Do I just assume she’s worldly, go the worldly route, and risk offense if she’s innocent when I’d rather be innocent anyway? It’s a big mess. (If I were a really big geek, I would put this on a spreadsheet with multiplied percentages and everything.)

I basically hate the Third Date rule – and actually, I’m being a bit deliberately silly here because I know that the Third Date rule is not some ironclad thing everywhere – but there is the reality that everyone comes into dating situations with their own ideas of “timelines” and “progressions” that they then apply to the other person they don’t know, and that these timelines have to do with intimate enough subjects that they are difficult to talk about with someone you don’t know because it would weird the other person out. I think the Third Date rule just exists so that people have the excuse to have sex with people they don’t know without having to feel like they’re having casual sex, and without having to talk about it ahead of time.

1) Your assertation that “the Third Date rule just exists so that people have the excuse to have sex” appears to be, at least in my experience, almost completely true. Additionally, the sheer fact that said “innocent” people do not follow this rule further exemplifies this logic.

2) As you also point out, this rule seems to provide some mutual but unhealthy comfort/ignorance about important relationship topics: sex and game-playing. It really only stems from two things: fear of being rejected based on his or her opinion about something, and a personal denial that by discussing sex, he or she is admitting that they are more worldly than they want to believe. Ideally these are the things probably most worthwhile bringing up on a first date, if things like sex are important to you. As Kath says, do this, and the problem vanishes.

I’m about to go on my third date. I feel the pressure. Basically the girl wants more and has already–already!–wondered why a kiss hasn’t even crossed her lips. I like her and she’s cute, but, for Christ’s sake, I want it to happen naturally. Some women are just impatient: hurry-hurry-hurry and make it happen already! Whoa! Slow down and give me a chance to actually remember your name and your favorite color first, babe.

Anyway, so here I am, wondering if my slow approach is gonna lead to a sinking ship. Meanwhile, I have girl two and three waiting for their chance. It’s not like I don’t have charm and good looks, but sometimes those things can be a curse when what you want is depth, not quickie sex.

Oh, well. I guess I’ll have a few drinks on this date to loosen up my anxiety and see what unfolds. I think there’s some truth to the third date rule, generally speaking, because girls–on average–expect at least a steamy make-out session by then (or around that time).

I’m expecting a third date this weekend. The second one involved some very lucious kissing. Since I’m looking for a long term relationship, the sex can wait. Not that I truly could hop into bed with him yesterday… but first things first. I don’t want to confuse the issues. Great sex can cover a lot of flaws. We are a big boy and girl. If no sex on the third date means he wont come knocking at my door again..then his loss.

I just got back from my “third date” and yes, things did get a bit “hot and heavy,” if it were up to him we would have had sex, but I just wasnt ready. I mean, I am VERY attracted to this guy, mentally and physically, but don’t want to confuse things with sex. I want an actual committed relationship and through previous experience have learned that having sex too soon will leave you no where and with no one! As a previous person said, if not having sex with him on the third date means he won’t call anymore, than his loss! He was really sexy though LOL.

I hate all the rules and regulations that exist within the dating scene.

For example, I am 24 and never really ‘dated’. I’ve had three long term, serious relationships, but never classed my meetings as ‘first’ date, ‘second’ date etc.

Now I’m seeing someone, and we slept together on the second date. So does that make me a whore, sexually free spirited or a booty call? In my eyes, it felt right at the time, but if he’s playing it by rules, then will I see him again? Possibly not.

On Saturday, February 21st, 2009, I am planning to go on a third date with a woman with whom I am quite enamored. Things moved very quickly, and I am not complaining. On the first date, after lunch and a movie, we ended up back at her place, and after she kissed me, we went right into making out and sex, followed by literally sleeping together on the first date. I certainly did not write her off as a slut or anything bad whatsoever. On the contrary, I really appreciated her openness, and I felt that there really was a very strong connection between us. In fact, I found out during date #2 that we were BOTH silently thinking “I love you” throughout the make-out and sex session in date #1. We said those magical words out loud to each other on the second date, and I am still very eager and excited preparing for the third.
My point is this: I do not like artificial boundaries and rules to govern relationships. I think they are best left to develop on their own, naturally, according to what feels right and good to everyone involved. What worked for us may not work for some others, but I do not think we have done anything wrong so far. As the song says, “It feels so right, it can’t be wrong.” I just want to speak in defense of women who genuinely feel ready for sex earlier than the third date. It does not mean you are undesirable as a long-term mate. In fact, I am sincerely hoping that my relationship with this woman turns into something very long-term. We should all be free to follow our hearts at whatever pace feels the most natural for each specific pair of people.

As far as I understand it, there’s no need to have a game theory matrix, since the game is played with “open cards” — the correct solution is to just read people, and they tell you what they want, non-verbally. Maybe get books on cold reading or body language? I should do this, I’m actually quite bad at these. But once I know people I can generally read them.

If you’re worried, just err on one level up in the sequence of expressing interest. Like, don’t try to kiss her if you haven’t touched her first, put your arm around her and see how she responded.

Well, hello there.
Interesting how the internet allows for communication about the most intimate issues, and not even in real time…

I googled “third date rule” because I am currently dating somebody, for oh, about 3 – 4 months and even though he has initiated, I declined sex. I am 23.

First of all…I don’t get it, is sex just a procedure we go through like having lunch or something? How much can you feel for a person on the THIRD DATE? Granted, there are exceptions. And it depends if the date was a day long hike or a 2 hour movie. Or if there was communication between dates.

But, like I told my best friend. If you’re making FRIENDS with somebody, how well do you know them the 3d time you do something together? Not that well eh. But in a relationshipy, vulnerable, volatile place you’re ready to expose yourself and do the deed???

I feel like I live in an entirely different landscape from all these notions.

Sorry, but anyone hopping into bed with a person they hardly know, after meeting up merely three times BECAUSE THERE IS A RULE is a slut in my books. Male OR female.

It’s a lame excuse to justify sleeping around.

Who made that rule anyway? And why am I supposed to be bound by it?

Here’s a thought, let’s make up new rules.

From now on, if your second date does not confess to like peanutbutter sandwiches before the night is over, the relationship is doomed for all eternity and the sun will explode. However, if YOU confess to like jelly beans, she WILL bear your firstborn son. Unless she is brunette, in which case it may also be a girl. This rule shall now apply to all people dating anywhere, and college kids shall tear their hair out over it.

Very good article, I just had a second date. The first date went really well we both had a great time. She paid which was funny but I put my money down and she said ‘what are you doing It’s only $10’ so I let her. I kissed her at the end, first she gave me the cheek at first, but then she paused and we made out a little.

The second date went fine, after the movie, she tells me she got out of work and has no plans afterall. I said we can go back to her place if she’d like, we did. I helped her clean the dishes and she cooked me dinner, we made out a bit more, and she laid in my lap and watched tv. I tried to prgress things further, may have touched her innapropriately, only to be told ‘im not sleeping with you tonight’, boy was I confused.

I wish we had never gone back to her place, and could have just had a nice 3rd date. She seemed worldy but she’s trying to be innocent? Im not sure whats going on. But I think I offended her and screwed it all up. I sent her a quick txt yesterday said a few of us were catching up for drinks, no response

Very well written! However, I absolutely cannot even imagine worrying about, much less thinking about having sex with a stranger on a third date. Why would you want to have sex with someone you might not really have anything in common with or might not see again. I say let things groove for awhile and see where you’re headed.

I believe there needs to be some romance by the 3rd date. If not then you should just be friends and move on. The male has to be the one to communicate romance most of the time and if he doesn’t do it soon enough then the woman will put him in the friend zone.

Very on point. I don’t do good with rules or dating. I’ve been dating this guy for the past 6 weeks inwhich we’ve been on 4 dates. He works late and I’m a single mom so I can’t be available all the time. Everything was amazing we would talk everyday. Well our 4th date i stayed the night at his place and we had sex. Heard from him that night but not sin. I gave in and text him after nothing for 3 days. His vauge response, ” been pretty busy at work”. So that’s it? Is this him trying to play it cool? I’m not one to read between the lines or play stupid games. I’m losing sleep trying to find an answer on Google. When did people become such assholes and why is being honest so hard? I just want to know where we stand. Ughhhhhhhhhh. I must be the worldly one…..