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Two that come to mind are george brazil and mike diamond. Some in these shops will actually make over 100k per year. So now you have names, am I still a liar in your eyes?

Wake up and smell the coffee folks if your only going to believe what the union is telling you and want to call us that know better liars then so be it, live in the dark. Problem is most people spend more time shopping for a new car than they will shopping for a job. Once most people get settled into the union life, or what they think is a good job, they think they are at the top of the food chain and they quit looking.

If your making 50 per hour don't expect overtime, if you do get called out after hours most of the time you will make a part of the emergency fee but don't expect to make 75 or 100 per hour. Overtime is usually avoided within any shop anyway. If the shop is large enough you'll only be on call for a week every month or so.

So what you are saying is you 50 an hour but if you work overtime you still get 50.
Sounds like a real sweet deal!
I tell you those who think they are getting better then union rate there is always a catch. Next thing you will tell me is you buy your own tools.

the SAGA continues......

I sincerley respect your opinion AND RIGHT, to choose wheather you work union, non union, refrigeration, accounting, etc....
But I just haveta say.. that REALLY.... We all, if you are in the working class,make more because some years ago, people got together, and said we too want to make a decent wage, own our homes, and live good!

Well, the grass roots union movement DID that for all of us!

I totally believe there is alot to be said for TODAY's union, compared to that union, but I STILL am gratefull for my wages. Even BEFORE I worked union, I KNEW the reason I made what I made, and our wages here in this part of the country were so high, was because of the strong unions around here.
I have lived in 6 different states, from Cali to In., and FACT is that the states where the unions barely exist, ALL wages are lower..

but hey, we ALL are refer guys and I respect everyone that works hard for his money like this! Look at us... on here at night.. we are a different breed!

Look these are the FACTS ......you non-union BRAINWASHED morons need to get this thru your head , with all things being equal you make MUCH more $$$$$ working union with better benefits these are just the facts fellas. If you choose on "principle" to make less money for the same work , doing it non-union you are cheating yourself and your family . Most of the NONSENSE I hear from you non -union techs is COMICAL!! The owners of the company you work can say all he/she wants about being a "family", the idea is too be with YOUR OWN family !!

I've worked both sides of this issue, and there is NO comparison. I make at least 110k per year in the check without even trying . I've got the paystubs to prove it. So you keep your "principals" I'll keep my 110k and time with my own family!!

About 12-15 years ago in Alberta, Canada they pretty well did away with the unions. The rates dropped like a stone over 10-15 an hour over night.
They are now getting smart and getting the unions back, but it has taken this long. I believe the unions there are now the fastest growing.
Unfortunatly over time those that have it good will lead them selves to believe that they are making the money they make because they are smart and the boss likes them and not because of the unions.
Slowly the unions will get smaller and next thing you know a job at Walmart will be a good job.

OT...........NO, getting paid 1, 2, 3, or more hours to do a 1 hour job YES, actually that happens all the time. Would you call that over time or 100, 150 or 200 per hour?

So who is brainwashed? A guy working 4 hours on a job that pays 6 or 8 hours but there is no OT, or the guy that works 8 hours getting paid at union scale that pulls OT when it is available? Remember your going to work more than one job today, it's not uncommon to bill out 10-12 hours in a 8 hour day. I've had 20+ hour days and actually only worked 8-10 most of those with a helper.

Tools, yes you provide your own hand tools, if they break on the job most of the time they will replace them, after all it's just a write off.

Believe me for every reason you can give to work union I can give just as many why it's not necessary and how you can make as much or more without the union. So it is unlikely that we will ever change the others opinion at least on these boards.

I actually started off in the trades working union, the only way I may ever go union is if I decided to start a union shop in another state as I believe it would make it a bit easier operate.

Retirement...........lets see my dad never worked union, and never even worked in the fields I do, he retired at 44, he/we lost my mother to cancer when he was 69 so they traveled the world for a good 23 years before she got cancer. If he had to retire at 60 or 65 they wouldn't have had hardly any time left. So actually I'm on a clip to try an retire in 6 years, I will be 45. I already have lost 4 friend to cancer around my age and 4 more that have it now. Believe me you can't retire soon enough.

Me personally, I wouldn't want a job where I had to work overtime.I don't work it even at double time and we are over 36.00 an hour w/o benefits.There is much more to life than giving the gov more tax dollars and going out and buying more crap to put in a garage or house.My time off is valuable, I work as many 4 day weeks as I can afford and just don't over extend myself.I think there is too many people wrapped up in how much they can make but too each his own I guess, it just isn't for me.

I love all this noise from the two sides. Think about it, are you happy with where you are, what you're doing, how much you're getting paid and who you're working for? If you are, great enjoy your life. If not maybe you should change, explore all the options first. Someone is always trying to tell you how much better they have it than you. Half my union techs love working union, the other half hate it. Reality (and yes I have the paystubs to prove it) I make considerably more than my union counterparts and have a very good benefit package. My health insurance is far better than what the local has and the local admits it, my retirement account is growing quite well with the employer's donations. Do I tell my techs to quit the union, no it's thier choice and I respect it as they respect my choices. Remember, a closed mind gathers no knowledge.