Ghostcrawler on Tri Spec
It appears uniqueness is part of the reason we won't be seeing Tri Spec in Patch 5.3.

Patch 5.2 Hotfixes: April 30

Originally Posted by Blizzard
(Blue Tracker)

Raids, Dungeons, and Scenarios

Throne of Thunder

Lei Shen

Lei Shen's hitpoints have been reduced by 10% on Raid Finder difficulty.

Static Shock from the North Conduit now deals 300,000 damage at 0 energy, down from 650,000 on Raid Finder difficulty.

Blue Tweets

Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment

PvE
Stack ranking healers based on meters is like stack ranking cars based on max speed. It doesn't tell the whole story. (Source)

Are you guys really okay with months of LFR becoming useless by Valor Gear? All that time spent on gear is wasted.
Aren't you always replacing your gear every few months though? What is the specific valor concern? (Source)

What's diff between reason Blizz used 4 shared lock-out vs. normal raiders feel complld to do normal+LFR each week?
Why do you run LFR as a N raider? What is there for you? (Source)Valor Points. At our current progression we are still scrapping for any source of upgrade. Plus the SP-A rep to buy.
You won't get additional rep for doubling up, but if you are on e.g. 3rd boss in N then it might make sense to do the rest in LFR. (Source)
To be fair, that's fairly min-max behavior. If you're on 3rd boss on N, a couple more valor pieces isn't what's holding you back. (Source)Normal Raiders feel the LFR mandatory cus of the stuff. LFR ToT stuff ilvl should be = to 489 to prevent that.
If you're a N raider, you are earning 522+ ilevel. (Source)
If you don't have much 522 because you're stuck on an early boss, then getting a few 502 probably isn't what's blocking you. (Source)
If you like earning ilevel as fast as possible, by all means go for it, but I wouldn't consider it mandatory. (Source)

Didn't you just hotfix nerf health in Horridon and Sounds like a gear issue to me. Those weren't mechanic nerfs.
We don't make fights that are target dummies. Nerfing numbers means you can afford more mistakes on the mechanics. (Source)
As I said, if improving gear is fun for you, that's great. Just don't obsess unnecessarily over marginal ilevel improvements. (Source)

We need Normal tuned down. The amount of non heroic guilds finishing Nrrmals in time is negligible
We're happy with N difficulty for 25. It was a little hard for 10s, but we made some fixes. (Source)

for 'real' raiders progression is the motivation. raiding for loot is an outdated vanilla attitude.
That hasn't been our experience. Raiding is fun, but becomes less so the moment you stop getting rewards. (Source)

What's with the can't release spirit until whole raid whipes mechanic? I find it kinda annoying I wish I knew why it was there
It solved a whole lot of problems where players wouldn't get credit or loot if they released before a kill. (Source)

I'd always thought testing times are based on when you guys can get all *your* hands on deck to observe, no?
There's an element of that for sure. Being on the west coast doesn't always work to our advantage. (Source)
If you're a two-night-a-week guild, are you going to sacrifice one of those just to help us out? I mean we appreciate it for sure. (Source)
My point was we get a lot of testing by heroic raiders. It's harder for normal raiders to justify spending the time. (Source)

It would have to be a sizable reward to get me to leave my guild groups for the thankless world of pug tanking.
We really don't want you to do that. I fundamentally believe WoW is more fun with friends than solo. (Source)Hard to believe that, when raid tuning means either settle for LFR or ditch underperforming friends.
Would you be satisfied if you could run Raid Finder with just your friends? Or is your expectation to run an easier ver of normal? (Source)

What if..... you didn't change the ilvl or stats on LFR gear ,but made the gear blue quality.
A whole lot of players use LFR. We want to preserve the prestige of N and H raiding, but don't want to push folks out of LFR. (Source)

in ToT almost every encounter has a tank swap based on a debuff stack, are we gonna see different mechanics in the next tier?
If we can come up with good ones. We (and tanks) soured on the "soak up the cleave" mechanic. (Source)

I get bored whenever I feel I can't progress, be it gear or stuck on a boss or whatnot.
Frustration at lack of progression is a common problem. (Source)
However, it happens when players can't kill a boss and also when they kill everything and run out of content. No progress. (Source)

Actually you can force. Called remove LFG/LFR and you'll see 'communities/interaction' occur instantly.
Er, for some players, sure. Others just log off when they can't get a group. (Source)
I had friends and still sat in chat for 2h looking for Arcatraz pugs. Not the best of times. (Source)

why is mob tagging still in the game? surely fostering co-operation is a good thing?
It is, but tabbing SW:Pain on every mob in a zone isn't our idea of cooperation. (Source)

GC, will we ever see a return to the way VPs were awarded thru heroics in WotLK? Some people can't log in every day!
You can keep running dungeons on the days you can log in. You keep getting valor beyond the first run. (Source)In the DS model, 7 runs capped you. Now, takes 18 runs if you do 1 per day, and 1 more run per missed day.
Fewer players capped when it was 7 a day. Totally understand that that model worked better for some players. (Source)

What is your design for PvE set bonuses? Stronger as tiers progress? Or just fun bonuses, should people have 4pc or offpieces?
I personally like the idea that off pieces can be competitive, but it's a hard sell to many players (and some designers). (Source)I know that for throne of thunder with thunderforged pieces alot of people will be dropping tier pieces for BiS thunderforged.
I think that's kind of cool rather than tunneling in on set pieces only, but we'll see how it feels in a few more weeks. (Source)Why do we even have off-set pieces? So that armor looks different? But all offset match set artistically anyway.
One reason is players like to match their gear (easier with transmog now). (Source)
Another is that raid quality armor takes about a month for an artist to make and we make 22 (including PvP) plus weapons. (Source)

Challenge mode was the biggest waste of resources, unpopular, unappealing, not worth it. Scrap it.
Disagree. It's more popular than expected and I personally find it a ton of fun. It's cool to use all your abilities for a change. (Source)

Exodus Done With 25 Man Raiding
Late last week Killars posted an interesting message as to why Exodus is done raiding. They ended up in 8th place in Tier 15, down from 6th place in Tier 14.

Originally Posted by MMO-Champion

Yes, I'll confirm the news here for anyone not in the loop or questioning the rumors. will no longer continue to function as a 25 man raiding guild. No plan to go 10 man as of yet, but that really doesn't matter because 25 man is what the hardcore raiding scene really is about and Exodus will no longer be competing in such a scene.

Why? How? Well this game isn't to blame. In the last few years this game (despite many people quitting and guilds dying) isn't to blame for vodka/Exodus' demise it's the raiding community. I don't mean this is a pointing the finger sort of way, it's an inevitable sort of flaw in the competition of the top end raiders. You see... we've basically been killing ourselves off slowly since day 1.

In the last few years we've certainly picked up the pace, but the "hardcore raider" is a dying breed and it's certainly becoming a more difficult breed to be a part of. What I mean by this is of course the time commitment and the level of shear dedication and determination it takes and costs to be at the very top. This isn't to poke fun, but to just shed light of why many people, and subsequently, many guilds will fall. Raiding for many many hours on end is fun, CAN be exciting, and at the end of it all can really prove who really wants that world first/us first/realm first the most.

Unfortunately we (hardcore raiders) pushed too hard. Tier after tier we just keep adding to the insanity in both farming preparations and actual progressing. It's almost as if progression itself never really ends after a end tier boss dies. Combine this with Blizzard actually putting new content out faster, alts playing a big role, PTR/BETA, dailys, coins, BMAH, well... you just get lost in it all. Right now there are a few legit world first guilds left. The competition is slim because the competition is literally eating each other (well not that literally). Good luck to everyone left in the race for this expac, but I don't know how much longer this sort of thing can last.

'Real life' is a term I tend to hear a lot and its such an oxymoronic term. Your life is your life, and that is all there is to it.

Raiding that hardcore would never be for me, but I wouldn't sneer at them just because they found something they are so passionate about. I happen to raid 12 hours a week, and to me that's a perfect balancing act that I can schedule. I have plenty of time to be social, finish up all my studying and coursework, as well as hold a part time job. I also enjoy playing with the people whom are in my guild, sometimes more-so than the people I see everyday.

Anyways, what you seem to fail to realize is that there really is no room for that many guilds at the top to be competing that kind of level. It has less to do with having a commitment than it is to do with finding a replacement with that kind of commitment. If you take the whole raiding population, maybe 200 of them have the skill, commitment, and time to be able to play at that kind of level. They are already all taken, so when a top guild loses someone it is almost impossible for them to get a replacement. Top guilds cannibalize one another and eventually the weaker ones will die out.

Correct, but that misses my point. All I am saying is that EXACTLY what he said today, is what most casuals have been saying since vanilla. It is like a lightbulb finally went on in his head and he had this epiphany..... 7 years later than the rest of us. It isn´t a matter of them having dedication, or skill or anything.. it is them dedicating their waking lives to a video game... most of us figured out long ago that that is a pretty stupid thing to do.

I respect what the vodka guys did in the past, but what a load of emotional crap to be honest. There is no reason to assume that the hardcore raider is a dying breed and that it will all eventually collapse into one big massive uniform heap of casualness and LFR enjoyment. They are quitting because they can no longer attract the talent necessary to compete for a top 5 spot, and that is simply because the amount of dedicated top tier raiding guilds has increased due to the increased popularity of certain top guilds, the almost celebrity cultus that has come with the streaming phenomenon, the addition of high profile sponsorship deals and the exposure the cream of the crop is getting from both the player base and WoW media.

A least quit in style instead of predicting the apocalypse of hardcore raiding.

lmao, you refuse to see the truth huh? No one can keep that level of dedication up forever. They are right, eventually it will happen maybe not any time soon but one day those top guilds WILL die out, and as you put it "will all eventually collapse into one big massive uniform heap of casualness and LFR enjoyment".

Not yet. Give it some time though. I'm sure someone will ask for it sooner or later.

People wanted dual specs in the past, now tri-specs. Soon it will be Quad Specs, Penta Specs etc. Then, when we have all the combinations we could think of ever needing, we want it to be even easier to switch between them, even in combat, because of some arbitrary reason, maybe a boss fight requires 3 tanks in phase 1, but only 1 in phase 2; "Would be nice to switch to DPS in combat, else I'm useless half the fight!".

See where I'm going? It never ends until you have all the possibilities at the click of a button, and without moving an inch.

You might be able to get the same thing by visiting a trainer, however, once there, you have to choose which is good thing in my opinion. Let there at least be something left that requires you to move somewhere.

As a matter of fact:

See? Didn't take long

Learn to live with the fact that you have to choose sometimes. Else, what's next? We get to have all Primary Proffs as well? Sure would be nice. Never have to pay obscure amounts of gold for craftable things like gems, enchants etc.

But that's just it, there's not a choice as it is now. If you want to change specs you can do it already and quite easily. Tri spec would just add convenience and that's what people keep saying. Speccing is not a hard choice and never really has been except maybe in vanilla where 50 gold was still a decent amount of gold. People respec trees and talents even now on a per fight basis if they want to, again, the reason they want tri spec is for convenience. Talent trees are not about choices other than if you want to go through the hassle of visiting a trainer, rearranging your bars, and using a trivial amount of gold. That's it.

Also, people have wanted multiple specs forever, it wasn't just let us have 2. You're trying to make it into some kind of slippery slope argument that I just don't see when it comes to respeccing mid fight, all buffs, every profession etc (which btw, many people do have every profession already through alts more or less). As far as additional specs beyond 3, I personally don't see much need but I wouldn't be against it at all for reasons already stated.

Bear in mind that a guild is made up of people, and each person in that guild has their own reasons for stopping with the raiding scene. The statement posted is just an overall explanation, there's a hundred more reasons for why the guild's progression is falling apart---not necessarily reasons worth sharing with the rest of the internet.

A popular guild falling apart doesn't mean the game is in decline or some other interpreted "truth", everything that has a beginning has an end---new guilds will rise to take the spotlight.

That said, I personally agree with that the "cycle" seems never-ending. It was fun in Classic to advance through the content, it was still exciting to progress in BC and explorer the world further, it became less interesting in WotLK when they started throwing in apparent filler content like TotC and it because really dull in Cata with DS. MoP raiding to me became more about the mechanics than exploration or the story (did you really care about facing the Sha of Fear as to say, a lore figure like Kel'thuzard/Vashj?) and the new raiding tier hasn't even made me resubscribe yet (just because I truly do not give a damn about the new generic monster "Mogu" race, their background story and active plots are just dull in my opinion).

I might resubscribe for the whole raid on Orgrimmar content patch if they actually intend to do that, because that would actually feel like a Warcraft game's story (which we've had next to nothing of in MoP, despite all the promises).

all the PVE heroes whining its funny seeing as you get the most attention in this game and yous till fucking whine

People like you are what's wrong with the world.

You think that just because you enjoy PvP it's the only way to play the game, I've seen so many hardcore PvPers that go on about how bad PvE Heroes are and then completely fail themselves in raids not only on mechanics but on overall dps output as well. Most pvpers don't know shit about the game outside their PvP rotation and because of that they fail in raids. This is also the reason they seem to avoid raids, It's not actually because you guys think it's easy, it's because you guys don't want to be caught out by others as being completely terrible outside pvp.

This attribute is most present in PvP dedicated rogues.

I can't wait to see all the crying when patch 5.3 comes out and PvPers start getting smashed by (as they put it) "PvE Heroes"

Also just wanted to point out 'Yous' is not a word, the correct usage in your sentence is "game and you still(*) fucking whine". The way this works is that you have already established that you are talking about a group of people earlier in the sentence and therefore do not need to reaffirm it with fake words that you made up.

You think that just because you enjoy PvP it's the only way to play the game, I've seen so many hardcore PvPers that go on about how bad PvE Heroes are and then completely fail themselves in raids not only on mechanics but on overall dps output as well. Most pvpers don't know shit about the game outside their PvP rotation and because of that they fail in raids. This is also the reason they seem to avoid raids, It's not actually because you guys think it's easy, it's because you guys don't want to be caught out by others as being completely terrible outside pvp.

This attribute is most present in PvP dedicated rogues.

I can't wait to see all the crying when patch 5.3 comes out and PvPers start getting smashed by (as they put it) "PvE Heroes"

Also just wanted to point out 'Yous' is not a word, the correct usage in your sentence is "game and you still(*) fucking whine". The way this works is that you have already established that you are talking about a group of people earlier in the sentence and there for do not need to reaffirm it with fake words that you made up.

I would argue that hardcore PvPers are make some pretty awesome raiders due to the fact that PvP teaches situational awareness a lot better than current entry PvE ever will

You think that just because you enjoy PvP it's the only way to play the game, I've seen so many hardcore PvPers that go on about how bad PvE Heroes are and then completely fail themselves in raids not only on mechanics but on overall dps output as well. Most pvpers don't know shit about the game outside their PvP rotation and because of that they fail in raids. This is also the reason they seem to avoid raids, It's not actually because you guys think it's easy, it's because you guys don't want to be caught out by others as being completely terrible outside pvp.

This attribute is most present in PvP dedicated rogues.

I can't wait to see all the crying when patch 5.3 comes out and PvPers start getting smashed by (as they put it) "PvE Heroes"

Also just wanted to point out 'Yous' is not a word, the correct usage in your sentence is "game and you still(*) fucking whine". The way this works is that you have already established that you are talking about a group of people earlier in the sentence and therefore do not need to reaffirm it with fake words that you made up.

Oh, so it's people like him, is why the world is so fucked up? Gotchya!

I would argue that hardcore PvPers are make some pretty awesome raiders due to the fact that PvP teaches situational awareness a lot better than current entry PvE ever will

Hardcore PvPers are good at reactions, much less so in regards to situational awareness and coordination with 24 other people. A lot of the ones that I played with actually had a tendency to zone out during "easier" phases in fights then die when it ramped up. Not all of them are this way of course, some are just overall good players. By good players though, I really just mean have the ability to focus and possess game knowledge. Those are the only real requirements to playing this game well imo.

EDIT: Sad to hear about Exodus, but knew it was going to happen. It is WAAAAY too hardcore now. It used to be that you would just have a main raid once a week. Once you finished it with your hardcore push for world first, it became a gentle 4 hour raid week with a lot of free time. Now you have like 4 sets of alts with gear so that you can gear main raiders up super quickly and it is a neverending process of farming gear, gold, and other nonsense. I think that Algalon is the first boss that introduced the idea of using alts, though I dunno when they extended the alt process to every tier. It is beyond ridiculous at this point though.

lmao, you refuse to see the truth huh? No one can keep that level of dedication up forever. They are right, eventually it will happen maybe not any time soon but one day those top guilds WILL die out, and as you put it "will all eventually collapse into one big massive uniform heap of casualness and LFR enjoyment".

Sound weird but True, but also remember blizz knows that just 25% of the end population actually raid, so while this hardcore guild decide to call it quits as soon as more hardcore guild quits also maybe there will be no need to keep releasing a new raid every other patch...

Im wishing the day 10man become the standard and you have 5man raid...

PS; I feel that its just time someone come up with a different way to progress @ end game...

EDIT: Sad to hear about Exodus, but knew it was going to happen. It is WAAAAY too hardcore now. It used to be that you would just have a main raid once a week. Once you finished it with your hardcore push for world first, it became a gentle 4 hour raid week with a lot of free time. Now you have like 4 sets of alts with gear so that you can gear main raiders up super quickly and it is a neverending process of farming gear, gold, and other nonsense. I think that Algalon is the first boss that introduced the idea of using alts, though I dunno when they extended the alt process to every tier. It is beyond ridiculous at this point though.

The first time I recall the alt issue coming up was M'uru. We needed another heroism and ended up getting an alt one decently geared up somehow but it was a pain. We contemplated an alt warlock but those of us who could press buttons because we had a warlock alt in the end took turns playing the warlock char whose owner had RL issues. I don't remember our rank at the time and it wasn't even that great, US 50 ish? Maybe higher ranked guilds just had enough of each class to never consider it before WotLK.

The first time I recall the alt issue coming up was M'uru. We needed another heroism and ended up getting an alt one decently geared up somehow but it was a pain. We contemplated an alt warlock but those of us who could press buttons because we had a warlock alt in the end took turns playing the warlock char whose owner had RL issues. I don't remember our rank at the time and it wasn't even that great, US 50 ish? Maybe higher ranked guilds just had enough of each class to never consider it before WotLK.

That isnt the alt issue that I am speaking of. Most people have an alt or two that is pretty reasonably geared. I myself had alts that were brought into raids when necessary, as did other people. This was optional and not everybody had one. You also didnt run raids with like 8 main heroes and 17 alts to gear up all of the mains at the beginning of each tier.

Also, most top guilds had extra actual people sitting and waiting for a spot or when they are needed. So you would have 25 in the raid and an extra 5-10 people of various classes waiting to get in just sitting on the bench. Our guild was only top on the server (MAYBE top 250 in the US apart from minor breakout performances) and we werent particularly hardcore but we still had people on the bench all the time.

That isnt the alt issue that I am speaking of. Most people have an alt or two that is pretty reasonably geared. I myself had alts that were brought into raids when necessary, as did other people. This was optional and not everybody had one. You also didnt run raids with like 8 main heroes and 17 alts to gear up all of the mains at the beginning of each tier.

Also, most top guilds had extra actual people sitting and waiting for a spot or when they are needed. So you would have 25 in the raid and an extra 5-10 people of various classes waiting to get in just sitting on the bench. Our guild was only top on the server (MAYBE top 250 in the US apart from minor breakout performances) and we werent particularly hardcore but we still had people on the bench all the time.

Oh I agree it definitely got way, way worse until we got the ridiculousness it is now. We had a bench but I imagine a top guild would have had to have a really large bench to be able to class stack before alts could be geared the way they can now. (I also imagine maintaining that bench has gotten much harder)

Oh I agree it definitely got way, way worse until we got the ridiculousness it is now. We had a bench but I imagine a top guild would have had to have a really large bench to be able to class stack before alts could be geared the way they can now. (I also imagine maintaining that bench has gotten much harder)

Most top guilds had enough to run 2 full raid groups, one being the "best of the best" and the others being the filler players. At some point between then and now they decided that it was best to just have one really good raid group so that they dont have to teach people the fight when they come in. I am fairly certain that the Algalon push is what made alt raids much more prominent.

Why nerf Lei Shen's health? It makes no sense..
LFR wipes in the transition phases, where you can't target Lei Shen, so health is irrellevant.. Nerfing his health, only helps you get to transition phase a bit faster, and thus wipe faster..

If anything should be nerfed, it should be the length of transition phase: Shorter transition = less screwups by players = less risk of wipe.

i think based on ghostcrawlers responses.. he probably died around a year ago when cata first came out. blizz then replaced him with a brain dead monkey and another employee that does the spellchecking on the monkey's replies.