5:18pm:Strong unofficial housing sector and consumer confidence data helped the Australian sharemarket finish ahead on Tuesday, despite some heavy losses in QBE Insurance and ALS Ltd as company reporting season continued with more disappointing news.

The benchmark S&P/ASX 200 Index and the broader All Ordinaries Index each added 0.2 per cent, on Tuesday to 5588.4 points and 5580.6 points respectively. Gains in the big four banks, Telstra, and the biggest supermarkets led the index.

QBE Insurance Group was the heaviest weight on the local bourse, as it dropped 11.1 per cent to its lowest value in more than six months at $10.57 after warning current half-year results will take a hit from the need to set aside an extra $170 million for claims from its Latin American business.

There are more than 100 million people living in his home province of Guangdong who eat about 12 million tonnes of grains year. But the demand for cereal is far greater - about two times as much as the province feeds livestock and for other industrial uses.

And this is where Australia comes in. The country exports about 26 million tonnes of grain a year, enough to meet the total demand of Guangdong.

Mr Zhu's comments came a day after the Business Council of Australia urged Australian governments to rethink their role in the economy by promoting industries that have natural advantages such as agriculture.

5:09pm: Some analysis from BusinessDay columnist Elizabeth Knight on the telco wars:

Australia’s number three mobile phone carrier, Vodafone, made a pretty ambitious statement on Tuesday about its 4G coverage: that it would be as – or even more – extensive than that of Telstra in capital cities by the end of the calendar year and significantly ahead of Optus.

This coverage leapfrog should put the trouble-plagued carrier in a far better position to compete with its two major rivals. But having a quality product or service at an attractive price is not always a guarantee of success.

Indeed, both Vodafone and Optus have been improving their respective networks for the past couple of years, but convincing the consumers has proven difficult – an issue that has played beautifully into the hands of Telstra, which has continued to increase its market share despite being more expensive than its rivals.

4:35pm: There are signs home ownership could get more affordable, as lower interest rates, increased construction activity and a growing population threaten to stabilise property prices and rental income.

According to National Australia Bank data, Australia’s population growth has surged in recent years, helped mainly by growing migration. This has provided an added boost to construction in a low interest rate environment.

Growth in rental accommodation has slowed over the past year, and appears to be facing a further decline.

“A better balance should eventually also show up via a slowdown in house price appreciation,” said NAB global head of research Peter Jolly.

4:33pm:QBE's credit rating won't be affected by today's downgrade, says S&P. "While the expected earnings for interim 2014 are slightly credit negative, they can be accommodated at the current rating and do not represent a downgrade trigger event under our existing negative outlook."

The strong performance of its Australian business and return to profitability in North America counter the surprise weakness from Latin America.

3:45pm:Argo Investments senior investment officer Chris Hall said that while he was disappointed to see QBE surprise the market with another downgrade he is hopeful the worst is now over leaving the stock poised to re-rate over time against an improving macro-economic backdrop, particularly in the U.S.

“As long as there are no more operational blow-outs, rising US interest rates should help drive earnings growth and help the stock recover over the next couple of years,” he said.

Mr Hall said the company has been conscientious in completing the actuarial review and disclosing the information to the market, and that the write-down was not serious enough put it at risk of needing to raise more capital.

3:34pm:ALS is having a bad session, down around 5 per cent. Patersons says the market does not like profit guidance of $74 million which would represent a one-quarter fall in underlying net profit over the previous corresponding period.

The geochemical and energy businesses are doing it the toughest because of market conditions.

3:01pm: Bank of America-Merrill Lynch analyst David Errington has done some profound research on the significance of cost cutting and finds that cost cutting often reduces a company’s ability to grow.

"We believe that good cost control and discipline is the cornerstone of a strong company. However, our point is that when cost outs become the main focus of a company, and when they (cost outs) become the driving/underlying force of earnings growth for that company, more likely than not (in our experience) that company will go backwards in terms of its ability to grow future earnings," he says.

Now, Errington is not an equity strategist, he is an analyst with specialist knowledge of the consumer sector so the following is not an all-encompassing list.

"There are two stand out businesses in our coverage that are currently growing sales – Bunnings (Wesfarmers) and JB Hi Fi... Companies that have followed cost reduction strategies that we believe have seemingly compromised their businesses (both past and present) include (not an exhaustive list) Myer, PacBrands, Goodman Fielder, Coke Amatil, Wesfarmers (industrial businesses), Coles (pre Wesfarmers), Foster’s, and Treasury Wine."

Costs are critical: but consumer companies are especially sensitive to a singular focus on costs

2:33pm:Fonterra Co-operative Group has cut its farmgate milk price forecast to $NZ6/kg from $NZ7/kg for 2014-15 and a dividend somewhere between 20 cents and 25 cents a share. Global dairy prices have declined 16 per cent since June 1.

“We have seen strong production globally, a build-up of inventory in China, and falling demand in some emerging markets in response to high dairy commodity prices. In addition, the New Zealand dollar has remained strong," said chairman John Wilson.

2:14pm: The latest economic data shows business confidence is the new drag.

Business confidence among Australia’s largest listed firms has fallen sharply over the June quarter, undermined by the tight federal budget and coinciding with a reluctance to spend.

The outcome is at odds with a separate report from ANZ-Roy Morgan that indicates consumer confidence has finally recovered from the blow dealt by the Treasurer’s fiscal consolidation.

According to National Australia Bank’s quarterly ASX300 business confidence survey, which records the top 200 Australian stocks, plus the top 100 small caps, confidence has fallen to +3 points from +11, a decrease of 9 points. General business confidence is +4 points.

Export sales came off 2 points to +5 points due to the high Australian dollar, but still remains at elevated levels, the report said.

2:08pm: Some sharp analysis from BusinessDay columnist Malcolm Maiden on the QBE fiasco:

"The problem with repeatedly setting targets and missing them is painfully obvious to QBE chief John Neal.

QBE was expected to post a net profit of about $535 million in the June half. After the latest downgrades that Neal has announced, the group says a net profit of $390 million is likely. The difference is $145 million, or just over 11 cents a share, but at lunchtime QBE's shares were down $1.30, almost 11 per cent.

QBE, like all companies, trades on a multiple of its earnings, but that only explains about half the decline. The rest is a confidence hit, taken because QBE keeps on blind-siding its shareholders.

Neal would only say that the group's dividend policy was unchanged at the briefing he held to explain the earnings guidance downgrade."

1:41pm: Explosive report from Jacob Greber over at The Australian Financial Review. He reveals Australia must keep total government debt below 30 per cent to maintain its triple-A rating with Standard & Poor's, the first time S&P's target has been revealed.

1:21pm: The Reserve Bank may be forced to cut the official cash rate before the end of the year to beat back of a wall of foreign money that has driven the Australian dollar higher, according to Goldman Sachs Asset Management’s bond expert Phil Moffitt.

Moffitt, a 30 year veteran of the bond market and one of Goldman’s most senior Australian partners was speaking at the sidelines of the $935 billion asset managers’ client conference in Sydney.

He said the confluence of weak domestic growth, an expected fall in inflation as the carbon tax is discarded and the high currency was pointing towards a potential cut in the official rate cut below its current 2.50 per cent setting.

“The game plan has been the RBA to hold rates stable, and accept the currency is overvalued, in anticipation of the Fed moving [to lift US interest rates],” he said.

1:02pm: Here's CommSec's take on the positive consumer confidence number and housing stats:

This should translate to an uptick in retail spending. CommSec expects the Reserve Bank to wait to February to start the “normalisation” process for interest rates, but can’t completely rule out a rate hike in December.

"Homebuilding and home renovations will be the linchpin of the Australian economy growth story over the coming year."

12:21pm: The competition regulator is making enquiries to determine whether Qantas Airways and Virgin Australia Holdings have made misleading statements in relation to their ability to recover the carbon tax.

In its carbon monitoring report for the June quarter, the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission said the airlines had told the regulator they did not expect airfares to fall once the carbon tax was removed because they were unable to pass though the costs to customers.

Qantas had introduced a carbon surcharge on domestic fares in the lead-up to the carbon tax being put in place. It had said fares on Qantas and QantasLink flights would rise by $1.82 to $6.86, depending on the length of the sector.

The surcharge was removed earlier this month, just before the carbon tax was repealed. The airline, however, claimed it was an administrative task and would not impact the final fares being paid by consumers.

Virgin had said tickets would rise by $1.50 to $6 depending on the sector length as a result of the carbon tax, but it later told investors it was unable to recover the carbon tax due to stiff competition in the domestic market which had led to overcapacity and pushed down airfares.

11:51am: QBE has completed its conference call with analysts and it sounds like the downgrade this morning might not be a massive blow to payout prospects.

The company said it will wait until its formal results announcement Aug 19 to disclose the dividend but for now, it maintains its target for up to 50 per cent of cash profits to be released as dividends.

11:47am:Australian iron ore miners have sought to variate crucial reference points that help to set contract prices for the bulk commodity, in a bid to temper China's push for lower prices.

The benchmark iron ore price has been below $US100 per tonne for more than two months, and Chinese buyers have been unwilling to buy lower grade iron ore unless offered a discount of between 15 per cent and 20 per cent below the benchmark price.

Those discounts are much bigger than have traditionally been offered by the likes of Fortescue Metals Group, Atlas Iron and BC Iron, forcing those miners to inject some creativity into the bargaining process.

Instead of continuing to set prices in accordance with the previous month's average iron ore price, BC Iron managing director Morgan Ball said his company had been offering buyers a choice of several reference periods against which to calculate the iron ore price.

11:46am: The surge in new apartments continued to drive new dwelling sales in June, rising almost 16 per cent compared to May, while growth in new home sales was moderate.

Across the June quarter, overall new dwelling sales numbers rose 2 per cent, according to the Housing Industry Association.

Month-on-month, the number of new dwellings sold in June rose 1.2 per cent and detached home sales were down 1 per cent.

“Detached house sales increased by 2.6 per cent in the June 2014 quarter despite falling in the final month - that is a healthy note on which to finish the fiscal year,” HIA chief economist Harley Dale said.

11:30am:Zillow, the REA Group wannabe of the United States, has acquired rival Trulia for $US3.5 billion in stock. One of Zillow's big investors is James Packer, so it's a stock we like to keep tabs on from afar.

11:02am:The number of business start-ups in Australia has jumped by 23 per cent compared to the previous quarter and by eight per cent from a year earlier according to Dun & Bradstreet, supporting a positive mood.

More businesses have failed too. Year-on-year business failures have increased by 9.6 per cent to 9,927.

10:51am: Standard & Poor's has looked at the Australian residential property price rally and sees this as a "resurfacing of risk" for the banking system.

S&P is alert to the prospect of repayment pressures for new home buyers when interest rates rise with or without income pressures stemming from the jobs market. The good news is that it thinks Australian banks can handle this without jeopardising their credit ratings, mainly because loan losses will probably be contained to new borrowers.

But it does outline the prospect of a tail-risk event emerging from a combination of repayment pressures, house price declines, higher unemployment and slow growth. That leads S&P to expect "negative rating pressures to emerge across Australia's banking system".

The rating refers to the credit score banks are given by agencies such as S&P and a lower rating usually implies a higher cost of wholesale funding.

10:33am:Deutsche Bank has stuck to its buy recommendation on Aurizon as it edges towards becoming a true Western Australia infrastructure company. A $5.5 billion investment in the West Pilbara could be on the cards and the broker thinks this could be partly funded by bringing in a junior partner or selling a stake in its Queensland assets, thereby trimming the investment dollars put up by Aurizon to perhaps as low as $400 million.

Lew's private company, Australian Retail Investments, lists some of its Country Road share acquisitions going back to January 1998. He was picking up stock for as little as $1.91 around the turn of the century, but it is startling to think he picked up 4.1 million shares as part of the rights issue less than two years ago for $2.66 a pop.

He sold those shares to Country Road's other shareholder, South Africa's Woolworths, on Friday for a whopping $17 each.

That's a profit of more than $59.3 million on shares that cost $11 million less than two years ago.

9:49am:Consumer confidence has retraced all of its losses following the May federal budget. That's according to ANZ-Roy Morgan.

Consumer confidence rose a further 2.4 per cent to 116.2 in the week ending July 27.

Chief economist Warren Hogan said: “The good news is that the headline impact of the budget appears to be temporary and the more enduring features of the economy, such as rising share and house prices, job creation and a stable world economy are now driving consumer attitudes to spending and finances.”

9:43am: BetaShares thinks that limited upside ahead for the Australian dollar means this is a good time to diversify into foreign assets.

Chief economist David Bassanese (full disclosure: former Financial Review columnist) reckons the currency is around 16 per cent overvalued and should be trading at US82 cents.

BetaShares proposes that if the Australian dollar were to fall to US70 cents over the next six years, investors would be 36 per cent better off investing in United States financial assets excluding the benefits of interest, capital gains and dividends.

Embattled global insurer QBE Insurance Group has disappointed shareholders with yet another shock profit downgrade, signalling a drop in insurance profit for the six months to June due to festering problems in its Latin America division.

QBE, which has shaken investors’ confidence in recent years following consecutive earnings downgrades each profit season, expects to book an insurance profit margin of 7 to 8 per cent for the first half, compared with consensus’ expectations of around 10 per cent.

The group’s net profit is now expected to be around $390 million, a significant drop from the $477 million posted in the first half of fiscal 2013.

Here's what happened on debut: Healthscope has defied a weak market to return to public ownership at a 5 per cent premium to the offer price of the private hospital, medical centre and pathology operator’s $3.6 billion float.

No doubt there were some nerves among private equity vendors TPG and the Carlyle Group, as well as its roster of six investment banks, when the stock opened at midday unchanged against its issue price of $2.10. It then immediately dropped 1¢ to $2.09.

But after almost 91 million shares changed hands on Monday, the stock closed the trading session 11¢, or 5.2 per cent, higher to $2.21.

9:16am: The Tax Office is looking to claw back up to $200 million in revenue from property developers who have inappropriately claimed capital gains tax concessions.

On Monday, the ATO issued a warning to developers using trusts to turn profits from property developments into capital gains, saying they would be audited and potentially face hefty penalties.

Several hundred commercial and residential developers are using special-purpose trusts to claim that the proceeds from developments are capital gains, rather than income, so they are eligible for a 50 per cent capital gains discount.

"The prospect of Nine Entertainment’s two major legacy shareholders, Apollo and Oaktree deciding to retain some of their combined 36 per cent shareholding beyond the August 2014 voluntary escrow period is a mixed blessing.

While there may not be any firm decisions made by either, insiders are suggesting that come September 1, we won't see a wave of shares hit the market.

The current thinking is that both will sit tight until the outcome of the government review on changes to the media ownership rules is decided and this should take place around September or October.

Nine has been leading the charge on pushing for the relaxation of rules to allow networks to increase their ownership reach of the national audience beyond 75 per cent - an outcome which would allow it to acquire a regional operator. Its most likely target would be Southern Cross Media."

Quotes Search

"It is not a crime to enter Australia without authorisation for the purpose of seeking asylum. Asylum seekers do not break any Australian laws simply by arriving on boats or without authorisation.

Article 31 of the Refugee Convention clearly states that refugees should not be penalised for arriving without valid travel documents. What may be considered an illegal action under normal circumstances (e.g. entering a country without a visa) should not, according to the Convention, be considered illegal if a person is seeking asylum. "

http://www.refugeecouncil.org.au/f/myth-long.php#illegal

Got it now?

Commenter

Allan

Location

Prahran

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 5:08PM

after the belled again...from up to down in the twinkle...avagoodone

Commenter

BearshapedBulll

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:52PM

".....rising US interest rates should help drive earnings growth and help the stock recover....."

Rising US interest rates will also bust their budget given that they have a $600 billion budget deficit and paying $220 billion per year in servicing their $17.5 trillion debt.

They're entering the end game.

Commenter

Dr No

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:39PM

I may have missed it but as far as I have read Mitch hasn't said we are about to have a budget-related market collapse yet this week which has led to him selling his entire portfolio for the fifteenth time. Is this capitulation a sell signal?

Commenter

Sticks

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:48PM

Have I ever said I would do that. I don't remember but I'm sure that as my keenest fan, who obviously hangs on every word I say, you have that comment recorded for posterity.For the record, I don't think that we will have a Budget-led market collapse. However I do think that the needless and extreme Budget cuts are holding the economy and the market back. Joe's talk in NZ let the cat out of the bag.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:59PM

You have been calling for a collapse and 'selling down' for over three months and trying to relate it back to the budget. Nice to see you changing the record though. The last one was broken. Maybe it really is time to sell.

Commenter

Sticks

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:20PM

@Sticks There's a world of difference between a sell-down and a collapse. I did predict that, based on what happened in the April to June period in each of the last 3 years when the Allords fell a consistent 8% over that period in each of those 3 years, the AllOrds would be sold down to 5100 or thereabouts at 30th June. That didn't happen. Be thankful. Be even more thankful that it didn't collapse.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:59PM

5...6....0.....ohhhh so close

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:39PM

5594 is the best so far today, last week 5598, one would think just a matter of time, specially with the banks a little bit back in favour!

Commenter

Mister5100

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:55PM

I think the turtle will put his head over the 5600 mark, but just until some key ex div dates. Then back to 5500 Aug/Sept

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:19PM

There seems to be some self-limiting factor in the way trades occur that if a key index level is in danger of being breached transactions are scheduled to occur that drive it back. Much like the resistance stocks seem to show in breaching a value ending in 05 or zero.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:22PM

NAB - the market seems to like the new leadership +0.9%!

Commenter

It's All About Making Money

Location

Lennox Hd

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:38PM

this market. so many false breaks of support and trend lines. will there be any down days?

Commenter

j

Location

syd

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:29PM

Hey weren't we here 8 years ago?

Commenter

Pollyanna

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:26PM

TRY qtr prod released to the market @ 11:42 this morning, price went straight into freefall from the bell,down 30% inside 1 minute....inside trade? nah just a physic correction brought on by morning tes leaves.crikey sometimes i really do wonder if we're being taken for a ride.....ASIC!!! echo

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:25PM

@mitch - our economy is still over-heated. A slight decrease in the level of growth - i.e. no a contraction, just a decrease in growth - would be welcome in this country.

We need to cool off consumption and concentrate on productivity growth and investments instead.

Commenter

Dr No

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:25PM

nice to know i have been missedjust sitting here getting p----dcheering on UXCjust like my mate BSBas for my choice of drinkshmmm, just let me thinksbeer on winesure to declinewine on beernever fearso without much pizzazzpass the shiraz

Commenter

cyril

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:20PM

hey matesomething to celebrateback to break evena divd lift would be pleasinghappy to holdhope to see green before i'm oldalways searching for the next big thingbrings with it doubt,elation and sometimes a sting

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:44PM

"3:01pm: Bank of America-Merrill Lynch analyst David Errington has done some profound research on the significance of cost cutting and finds that cost cutting often reduces a company’s ability to grow."Applies equally well to economies. Are you listening Joe? No harm in cutting wasteful spending but redirect the cash to improving the economy, eg infrastructure, eg NBN, health, education.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:16PM

Yep.

The road to recovery.

Cut outlets, cut stock, cut staff - and watch the bottom line grow!

As long as the banks are cutting the available credit facilities to recognise the reduced assets of the business and the reduced.capacity (including capacity to grow).

There may be an improved liquidity position from reduction in stock, reduction in Trade Debtors and reduced Trade Creditors but I trust our very clever bankers are not mislead by the balance in the trading account and dig deeper.

Commenter

Rupert

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:34PM

Spending $300k on a room never used and $800 on a door knob never touched. Don't you worry, this is Abbott's model of cool, calm and collected ...

Commenter

Viking

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:04PM

You'd be better off doing a bit of research before commenting. The room was an ALP white elephant created for an issue that should never have of existed

Commenter

Tim

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:29PM

Hey I was wondering if my short at $2.8 for LNG is looking good? thoughts?

Commenter

Pollyana

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:04PM

open estimate for LNG tomorrow is already $3.70.......OUCH

closed $3.25 on Friday!

Commenter

Captor

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:28PM

Wth a capital rasing on the cards it might be ok...pending whether it got called to cover or closed out already?

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:29PM

Good summary of unemployment by country, normalised to US standards.

Funnily enough Australia is lower than Denmark when compared on a lie for like basis.

http://www.bls.gov/fls/intl_unemployment_rates_monthly.htm

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:01PM

Nice try mate, but the info is old. Look at latest and you will see Denmark 4% vs Oz 6%.

Commenter

Viking

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:02PM

CCL could be in buy territory at around $9.15 (as it was this morning) given that Alison has blamed the last guy for all the issues and driven the price down.

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:52PM

Hope so Lion They have been very very quiet. Results next month.Good luck

Commenter

Harry Rogers

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:12PM

try $8 for a buy in price.

Commenter

DR

Location

syd

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:16PM

Sorry DR I dont see it happening at $8

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:38PM

"the next tidal wave of ore is high quality so the entire price deck is going to plunge.

China now sets the iron ore price, not Pilbara miners, and all the fiddling in the world won’t change it."

Not much spruiking of fmg going on these days. Remember Charlie and his buy call at $10? LOL what a short that was.

Commenter

Allan

Location

Prahran

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:42PM

Hows your LNG short?

Commenter

Pollyana

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:02PM

@Dr No "Putting the government budget on a path to balance and no debt will increase confidence." That's what Joe Hockey keeps saying.

"2:14pm: The latest economic data shows business confidence is the new drag.Business confidence among Australia’s largest listed firms has fallen sharply over the June quarter, undermined by the tight federal budget and coinciding with a reluctance to spend."Business disagrees. Joe Hockey is a lawyer, not an economist.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:33PM

"Australia must keep total government debt below 30 per cent to maintain its triple-A rating with Standard & Poor's"

And not a chance it will do that because it has flogged off income producing assets to pay for their own fat salaries, entitlements and pensions while receipts are dropping like a rock.

Harassing the unemployed and asylum seekers to dog whistle national sentiment won't help.

Commenter

Allan

Location

Prahran

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:31PM

Lmao! "Dog whistle" bring back Bob Brown I say atleast he could speak without bringing the greens party down to 4th grade school girl antics.

Commenter

Stugo

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:07PM

"... Harassing the unemployed and asylum seekers..."

So you think that being unemployed and living off Centrelink or arriving illegally on a boat so that you can live off Centrelink is the normal circumstances of events do you? Anyone who tries to limit these occurrences is "harassing"?

Commenter

Dr No

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:09PM

It's not illegal to unemployed or arrive by boat and you should not be harassed for doing either.

Commenter

Allan

Location

Prahran

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:35PM

I think you will find that it is illegal to arrive by boat.

Commenter

Dr No

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:41PM

No I won't find it is illegal to arrive by boat. Because it is not.

Commenter

Allan

Location

Prahran

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 5:05PM

Cheer up Hugo. Follow my shorts and you might make some money instead of losing money on those two dumps you're renting out at a loss.

@Dr No the economics forecasters are predicting a reduction in the rate of growth of GDP, stemming from Budget cuts.@JohnBB check out WAX, WAM, DJW, WIC, ALF, ALR, WAA, MIR, CDM to name just a few. Good f/f dividends with price stability. Prospects for capital gain if the yield hunters push up the price chasing the dividend.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:26PM

Never ending cycle, feeling good yesterday, added $2500 to the portfolio, down $1500 today and the day is not done!

Commenter

winsome churchill

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:23PM

Yep, which LICs, Mitch? Winning on this market is hard-work-for-me at the moment.

Commenter

Roger

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:17PM

So S&P, (thanks for the GFC), says that Australia needs to keep gov't debt to less than 30% of GDP to maintain our AAA credit rating. That does not mean that Australia needs to stop borrowing to spend. What we should be borrowing for is projects that boost our GDP. If both sides of the equation are growing we can still maintain that arbitrary 30%. Debt will go up but so will the capacity of the economy to pay off both the new debt and the old debt. But try telling that to a gov't that only wants to stop spending. Its attempt at savings will come to nought as Budget cuts produce increases in unemployment, boosting the welfare bill and reducing the tax take from workers' wages, business profits & the GST.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:16PM

Are you saying that borrowing money for sending cheques out in the post to every Tom, Dick & Harry and the school building program was not GDP boosting?

Commenter

Dr No

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:34PM

Remember when Swan said debt would top out at 6-8%? Maybe if we didn't have white elephants like the NBN, BER and pink batts, then we wouldn't have S&P making such comments. The main problem we have is the Labor opposition to accountable spending.

Commenter

Tim

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:57PM

Dr No, of course it was great, it was Labor's idea. Mitch also supported abolishing the pacific solution until they changed their mind without ever admitting they got it wrong. Labor good, Liberal evil. It's not hard.

Commenter

Tim

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:00PM

@Dr No Those exercises were an extraordinary measure in extraordinary times but nevertheless that expenditure would have boosted both debt and GDP. The gov't would have collected taxes as that money was spent by individuals buying their flat screens and businesses building the school halls and buying materials and paying their workers. There would have been several rounds of extra spending from that cash with tax being collected each time. The spending was approved of by Treasury, the RBA and economists.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:03PM

@mitch - those were indeed extraordinary times. Iron ore was at $160 a tonne, the skills-shortage was acute with McDonalds flying in workers from the Philippines, school leavers were earning $180,000 a year emptying dustbins in the Pilbara, the government was borrowing $40 billion dollars sending cheques out in the post...

Commenter

Dr No

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:15PM

Dr No, they were extraordinary times. Record gov revenues, record terms of trades, record debt/deficits. Extraordinary indeed.

Commenter

Tim

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:52PM

I find it interesting that Liberal Party parrots like Tim constantly talk of the ALP's over spending, but as far as I can tell, the only ALP policies being ditched are the Carbon Tax and Mining tax. Every other initiative is being kept!!

So surely that means the Libs SUPPORT almost all of the ALPs spending?

They are simply cutting health, education and the dole, as that's what the Libs do. I mean, they have private health insurance, private schools and rich daddies to bankrole their lifestyles so the Liubs can't see why there needed.

Isn't the Libs motto " if you don't like it, get rich - just like our grandparetns did!!!"?

Commenter

Life IS Good

Location

The Real World

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:51PM

Hello everyone.

I'm a young guy recently started in my first full time job. I am looking to build some money over the long term and think that a managed fund that allows me to make deposits weekly out of my paycheck would be a good way to go.

I have only about $3,000 at this stage. Would anyone recommend a good managed fund that accepts such a small client?

Commenter

GreenHorn

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:08PM

I think my first managed fund only required 4k to enter (it was with BT) so I would say that is your lowest amount you need to stump up. Unlike myself though, I would not recommend BT. It performed like a dog (I entered 2007, just before the GFC) the performance of that fund however did spur me on to do direct investing into the markets, so i guess it was the best decision i ever made!

Commenter

DR

Location

syd

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:41PM

@GreenHorn, you need to also consider your risk profile, and objectives (is this for a rainy day, do you need to be able to access the money, savings for a house deposit etc). If you are talking very long term I would consider Super. It only gets taxed at 15% and waiting till you are 50+ to build your balance is potentially too late. I'm mid 30's and surprised how many friends dont even know what they have in super (it is your money dont forget)This gives a good guide to super balances (average) by age group. I have a target to have at least 3 x the average

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:42PM

With that amount you're better off looking at an Exchange Traded Fund (ETF). They're like managed funds but are listed on the stock exchange and typically will track an index. Head to the Vanguard or iShares websites to see what they have which you like the look of. A broad-market ETF like VAS (Vanguard Australian Share ETF) is probably a good start. You'll then be able to either reinvest the distributions from the ETF or make regular contributions by buying more shares in the ETF periodically.

Commenter

Luke16

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:43PM

managed funds are sharks. do your own research and buy 3 stocks on the ASX. watch and learn. the more you learn now the more you will make later on when you have more money to invest.

Thanks guys some good food for thought here. I might use this money for a house deposit but I doubt I would be doing that for at least 7 - 10 years. Really at this point I am just trying to build a pile of money for the long term.

Market to hit 2800pts. Short on CBA for the ninth and final time. House prices have been declining when taking into account inflation, house prices will crash due to housing boom! SBM is a gift get on board you won't be dissapointed, I was.

went ahead and brought some US currency today...best rate i could get was 90.7c

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:47PM

Yep, typically is 4% margin from the official exchange rate

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:52PM

As an investment or travel? Why wouldn't you buy the share USD?

Commenter

JohnBB

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:24PM

BSB, where is the best place to buy currency online?

Commenter

njj

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:03PM

travel back up..jus accum as it looks good.but no getting away from the good ol fee structure.rather invest on the asx.

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:08PM

i just check bestexchangerates.com.au and go from there,most of the time its bankwest or 1 of the big four...dont know if they sponsor the site? but seems fairly consistent,then it goes thru AE xpress on bpay for pickup when ready.

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:21PM

Which LIC's do you like Mitch and why?

Commenter

JohnBB

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:45PM

@1:02 "rate hike in December"@ 1:21 "cut official cash rate before end of year"These firms earn big money advising and managing cash for their clients and you would think their skills and knowledge would produce consistent advice, even between firms. Just shows that they don't have a clue. You are basically paying them fees to throw darts at the dartboard for you. Good or bad pick you still pay,

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:38PM

Not really, just means one persons take on the enormous amount of economic data out there is different from someone else's. The future is hard to predict you know....

Commenter

DR

Location

syd

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:20PM

Interesting (unusual) rise and then fall in DSH today, commencing about noon and lasting about 45 minutes. But why?

Predictably you will have expected me to agree and it is so obvious why the $AUD is so strong!

Sitting on your hands and doing nothing hasn't worked so far. I would be inclined to take some action and it is not as though the decision is irreversible. If things appeared to be going pear shaped, only take a month to restore the status quo.

So why not take he plunge next Tuesday. 25 points to start with is at least a start, but 50 is the ideal number to cut by!

Commenter

Xenaphon

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:36PM

If interest rates go down will this drop the Sydney property market?

Commenter

Newbie

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:32PM

Won't affect it very much at all. 25 or even 50 basis points is not going to make many people more qualified to buy in Sydney and it certainly won't affect the majority of buyers who are the Chinese paying cash!

Commenter

Captor

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:43PM

No, cheaper loans will just encourage people to buy and pay more and bid property prices up.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:49PM

So a crash then? Steve Keen's replacement Harry Dent better be right this time. So sick of so called economists calling a correction that never comes. I only have a finite time on this planet. If I was a vampire I may just live to see one of these predictions come true.

Commenter

Newbie

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:00PM

Xenophon wants to release super for fhb's....is this a joke? Grants went straight to the vendors pockets in higher prices. This will be exactly the same. Is yhere anyone in Parliament that knows what they're doing?

Commenter

JohnBB

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:08PM

NVT trading halt.

Commenter

ps

Location

syd

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:55PM

How do you know this? Only ann is response to media speculation. No ann for trading halt

Commenter

doglover

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:23PM

nah not this end anyways

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:39PM

Finding growth stocks in a market that will be dragged down by a gov't intent on reducing spending and thus contracting the economy. Good luck with that. The only sectors with growth possibilities that come to mind are housing, telecoms and health and both of those "h" sectors are on shaky ground. But telecoms will do well because we cannot seem to function without our phones, internet, email and data. As for my buying I'm regularly topping up my holdings of LICs as they pay good fully-franked dividends and manage their investments better than I ever could.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:47PM

The more you go on about the market contracting, the more it seems to expand.

Putting the government budget on a path to balance and no debt will increase confidence. The government is not the only player in town you know ...

Commenter

Dr No

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:38PM

"KPMG’s corporate tax leader David Linke said the fact Australia did not have as wide a pay gap between the rich and poor showed its tax system was working as it should."

What a giggle. Ask people earning well over 100k, many im sure 500k, if the disparity is fair AND pay them for the report. What a world. The cattle are getting restless Abbott et al. If a stampede starts you wont stop it and your greedy corporates will lose a lot.

So we're heading to the disparity of countries like the US? No we're not because people like me will get our cattle prods out for the good of my country. These people are despicable.

Commenter

JohnBB

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:33PM

Qantas and Virgin lying about prices??

Better still find some history where they have told the truth now that would be a real headline!

Commenter

Harry Rogers

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:27PM

Nice one @harry

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:42PM

Come and get ya bull meat! On sale, get ya bull meat! he he

Commenter

Bull

Location

Butchers

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:06PM

The iron ore miners will soon have their 'Putin moment'. The same as Abbott was going tough against Putin the iron ore miners are trying to muscle up against China. It will end in tears with much lower prices. Abbott as we have seen is just an empty old white shirt and does not present the muscles which Putin has, and the same with the iron ore miners. The market is flooded with iron ore and the Chinese will call the bluff and prices will collapse. Please be warned.

Commenter

Viking

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:06PM

Bearing in mind Putin and the Russians have history behind them of starving 26 million of their own people for ideology.

Stop attacking a PM who actually does something more than the cowards of commentary.

Commenter

Harry Rogers

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:30PM

So Harry you are extolling the virtues of our idiot in chief who has by proxy accused the leader of one of only two super powers in this World of heading a Terrorist organisation.

He also sends in unarmed police officers to a place outside of their jurisdiction that is smack bang in the middle of a war zone.

And you think both of these things are good ideas?

Commenter

Joe the POM

Location

Geelong

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:28PM

Joe

Are you serious? Do you genuinely believe that Putin has no interest in the Ukraine. Give me a break? Of course all the ex Soviet states are lining up to return to mother Russia aren't they?

Have a talk to some Slovaks, Czechs Poles and the list goes on and see if they consider Russia a threat to their sovereignty.

Do you know any current history at all?? Have you ever lived in any of these countries or visited them ? I have!

Abbott is doing the only thing Russians respect and that is confrontation if not they will and always have run over the top of people. Fact not fiction! Do you know anything about Putin's history??

Commenter

Harry Rogers

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:47PM

You are running an ideological line. Putin is not a Terrorist. He may be supporting Russian separatists, but that does not make him or them Terrorists. Was Obama a Terrorist for offering support to the Syrian rebels a couple of years back?

Your perspective and that of Tony Abbott's does not mean they are true, they are just your opinions, but definitely bad examples of international diplomacy.

Commenter

Joe the POM

Location

Geelong

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:52PM

Down down, prices are down.

Commenter

Coles

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:05PM

Looks like an up day at the moment??

Commenter

Irish Phil

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:18PM

he he sorry I am not very smart.

Commenter

Coles

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:17PM

we know @coles...he he!

Commenter

no banks .. no party!

Location

you've no idea coles

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:44PM

No matter how much you like the second tier stocks the biggest problem in Australia is these stocks market depth. Just watch how quickly they dry up when a shock appears in the markets.

I have no favourites any more just logic.

Commenter

Harry Rogers

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:02PM

Dogs are barking quite loud today....the only value left in a full priced market.Im taking a page and agreeing with myself to buy the same stocks each month no matter what the price is.......gotta pick 3 and run with them,revue at year end or if a torpedo comes.Hard part is deciding which ones to pick,criteria being growth stocks making a profit and returning a divd of better than 4%.....and as torpedo proof as can be in this modern stormy watered market.quandry.

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:00PM

Always a danger to follow charts or history or extrapolation of market prices because it is never factual and purely psychological human failing.

So with a note of caution I suggest the current IPO prices and future upcoming floats are the classic signs of a major imbalance about to tip.

Commenter

Harry Rogers

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 11:57AM

QBE, another classic example of "over ambitious " Aussie business think that they can conquer the world and under-estimate its own capabilities...what tis the business case to invest in Latin America -- just blindly follow "go global" and "emergency market opportunities". time for NAB to come back to ASIA!

Commenter

Up and Down is Norm

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 11:17AM

Yeah, lets never try and do anything.

Commenter

Paul

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:23PM

Is to do something meaning and within own capability...IN ASIA...

Commenter

Up and Down is Norm

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 4:01PM

A suggestion for business flooded with email applications from those on the dole seeking jobs. Forward each and every application to the relevant gov't dept so that there is at least an official record of each job seeker complying with their 40 applications a month requirement. If eventually gov't tells businesses to stop doing that businesses will be entitled to ask why they should continue to be bombarded with those emails and applications just to suit gov't policy. Gov't might come to realise what pain on business its stupid ideology inflicts when it bears that pain itself.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 11:12AM

Its difficult even for a graduate to generate 10 proper applications a week, so this will quickly eliminate anyone without good administration skills from the statistics. So the govt will acheive its real aim - get people working poor like the US on 6$ an hour and reduce the minimum wage. Meanwhile $ 10 k a year negative gearing, capital gains tax and FBT rort cars will continue for the "work for avoid tax " groups.

And the spam it will generate to companies. (ie more red tape).

Lets see there are 1 milllion unemployed and only 200k jobs, (which some employed people also apply for). Let alone 200,000 457 visas plus backpackers after these jobs. A few more charity jobs to help the new poor though.

Commenter

What they really want

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:23PM

@What they really want, how about they get a job to look after themself (any job) then find the one you really want. Its a lot easier to get a job if you are already working as it shows ethics and committment. Personally im on the dole because the CBA doesnt need a CEO, but its what I really want so its ok.

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:10PM

@wwwish one little problem. There is 1 job for every 6 applicants. Are they all going to sit at the one desk or man the same machine at the same time or take it in turns. Now if we had a gov't that was serious about creating jobs instead of telling local employers to get lost then you might have a point. To create jobs govt's have to spend money to encourage business to invest. This gov't is just intent on stopping spending and jobs are disappearing as a result. The car industry and the renewable energy sector are examples.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:46PM

@mitch, a friend of mine has a company employing around 40 people yet when he advertises a job he gets next to zero (sub 2% of applicants) Australian citizen applicants but lots from working tourist visas etc. Australians dont want the work. You cant hire them if they are not applying

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:56PM

@Wwwish LionPlease give your friends contact details. I will apply for the job and I am Australian citizen.Hopefully he does not want somebody with 457 visa.

Commenter

xyz

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:46PM

xyz, he has a cleaning business, if you can get me your contact details I will happily pass his details on to him. (its located in Melbourne, inner south east suburbs)

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 3:13PM

Good point @mitch, the government doesn't want lower unemployment, it only wants lower unemployment STATISTICS.

If it genuinely wanted lower unemployment, it would immediately get rid of the ridiculous 457 visas that no Australian other than Gina wants. High unemployment suits Gina, then she can more easily turn Australians into the $2 a day African workers that she so desperately wants.

Eric Abetz and the like see The Grapes of Wrath as a text book.

Commenter

Fred

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 11:09AM

Agree fred. So we tell them stop it or we'll vote you out.

Commenter

JohnBB

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 1:12PM

I guess the CEO of QBE still has the Board's "full confidence" after the latest debacle and another profit warning scandal. What will it take for the Board to remove this sleepwalker and get somebody who can perform in the role and deliver value to the shareholders?

Commenter

Viking

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:56AM

you mean acknowledge climate change? wake up that huge rains and floods are going to get worse every year? anyone living within a km of the ocean is screwed?or flog insurance that is basically worthless?

Commenter

smilingjack

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 11:23AM

QBE's problems come from its aggressive expansion phase overseas under the previous, much celebrated CEO, especially the Americas and Europe where, like a typical Oz company, they had no special insight other than a lack of fear due to ignorance of the risks. Now they are "right sizing". lol Where, oh where in the world is the next nasty surprise?

Commenter

Catch 22

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 11:43AM

A Dutch court fines Russia $50 billion, essentially for re-nationalising oil production after it was stolen by the oligarchs.

Of course, Russia will never pay, nor should it.

Commenter

Fred

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:39AM

Ohhh mannn!....QBE you are an object lesson in investor disappointment. You are on par with Boom Logistics and a step away from HIH. How can an ASX20 company be so badly managed after a strong history of great management? Your senior staff really need to forecast accurately again.

Commenter

Elric

Location

Melnibone

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:39AM

when the world markets all do the same people will be scratching their heads going " I didnt see that coming". all the people selling shares for a living told me it was a good investment. I cant believe the banks lied to us. world markets are massively over valued. salaries are being frozen or reduced world wide. except bankers of course. none of it is going to stop the biggest crash in history.its inevitable to quote arnie. your only postponing it.

Because Cochlear is struggling against its main competitor Sonova. Just look at Cochlear's share price vs. Sonova. Sonova has increased 50% in last year.

Commenter

Viking

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 11:33AM

Talk about increasing red tape for businesses, the government's policy for the unemployed will drastically increase red tape for businesses across Australia, causing the unemployed to bombard their offices with phone calls, emails, letters and visits.

Why can't this government invest in the unemployed like what is done in more responsible countries such as Denmark with their innovative policy called Flexicurity (flexibility with security) where the unemployed get trained in relevant practices, jobs and trades whilst unemployed and get paid some money whilst doing it.

Just to punish unemployed people and as Abetz is doing claiming they are a burden on the tax payer is playing a losing hand and will not drive this country forwards and take it where it needs to be.

Commenter

Viking

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:34AM

The Danish job market regulations are a lot better than in many other countries in Europe, but one fact still remains. We've got lower unemployment than Denmark.

Commenter

Dr No

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:44AM

This process has nothing to do with encouraging those on the dole to seek work. It is all about discouraging them from applying for the dole in the first place by putting such punishing requirements in place to receive the dole. That way they will never be part of the official unemployment statistics that are going to get progressively worse in the coming 2 years as more and more jobs disappear.

Commenter

mitch of ACT

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:48AM

@Viking, we do this already, they are tafe's, university, and training courses available via centrelink. Tafe and Uni courses allow people access to Newstart allowance which when studying removes the requirement to look for work. Funding levels of the Tafe and Unis is a different matter....

Commenter

Wwwish Lion

Location

Melbourne

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:55AM

Dr No, presently the official unemployment rate in Denmark is around 4%, but 6% in Australia. You should then consider that in order to be 'employed' in Australia you only need to work 1 hour per week, and you are pretty much on your own. The beauty of the Danish system is that it trains you for a real job where you can find employment. This is a 'win-win' for the country as well as the person.

Commenter

Viking

Location

Sydney

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 11:16AM

@Dr NoWe have lower unemployment rate because of John Howards con job where definition of unemployment was changed to "someone is deemed to be employed if they worked for one hour". The real unemployment must be defined by number of people looking for job. Our real unemployment is much higher may be more then Denmark. I am IT professional with uptodate skills but I cannot get job because of slaves imported on 457 visa and my age. I fail to understand why age should matter when I am ready to work without preconditions. I just want to work.

Commenter

xyz

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:03PM

Memo to Big End of Townre: reducing Australians to greatful, abject submission

xyz said:

"I just want to work".

Plan on track. T. Abbot & J. Hookey

Commenter

Make them beg

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 2:19PM

NAN showing the way for small caps also with a 40%+ revenue increase and 25% + sales for the Qtr. While in the big asx200 side of town its profits in freefall so far...who said theres no profit growth expected? damn brokers too scared to look outside the safety of top 200 are missing out

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:30AM

No suprises QBE plunging. Will brokers change rating to sell I wonder? Nope. Its a bargain at these prices Buy! Buy!

Commenter

CEO

Location

UBS

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:26AM

It's the usual for QBE. I bought in at $10.30 just after opening, with a sell order at $10.95 for today. Halfway there.

Commenter

Calculator

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:44AM

Better sell now ... and take a tiny profits. Afternoon market could be uglier for QBE!

Commenter

Up and Down is Norm

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 11:19AM

I prefer to think of it more as an afternoon with great personality.

Commenter

Calculator

Location

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 12:02PM

At the opposite end of the alphabet where all the action has been,those with faith see some upside in UXC,those in the know dump TRY like a hot potato...but why?market update is good [UXC]assay results look ok,and bringing the project fwd is not good? [TRY]will a down day bring the bears out from hibernation i wonder.

Commenter

BearshapedBull

Location

Mugpunters Lounge

Date and time

July 29, 2014, 10:21AM

What happened there!? At one point, the plunge was over 31%. I used to own TRY, and I'd have probably bought again today if I noticed it going into the 80s. Has now recovered to 97. That would have been an easy 20%.