I'm trying to imagine the RIGHTEOUS FURY that would result if the CLS admissions dean came on here. $320k debt for the privilege of (worse than) 60 hour weeks and a measly 96k after taxes???? YOU FIEND!!!!!!

i am an attorney. i am actively making the world a worse place every day. my job is basically to make the electronics you buy more expensive. you really think I'm telling people not to go because I'm trying to sound cool on an internet forum?

Ok, so what the fuck are you going to do differently to get a more fulfilling career? What are you going to do to organize with others who want to change the profession and likely make a corresponding change in the country's economic landscape generally.

I have no idea why you do what you do. Im annoyed by the condescension and presumption and the lack of real action and the mostly lacking self analysis.

I think the ham-handedness was a bad call and I enjoyed ratfukr's approach but I will say in non-defense of the dean that:

1. It was dumb to try and suggest that LST is misleading when he apparently is going to carry the "You can get NYC big law from KU" narrative to his grave. Like, yeah, duh, maybe it's possible but it almost certainly ain't gonna happen. Call it puffery if you want but he couldn't abandon his deanspeak to fully admit that it almost certainly ain't gonna happen, even when called out on it. He tried, but then he chickened out and deanspoke. Not good.2. He dug himself into an even bigger turdular grave with the Birdnal's thing. It just makes him look like an even bigger sociopath and doesn't reflect well on his professionalism or the school in general, IMO. NAGL to do that on the Internet in a forum like this. Hopefully that was a teachable moment for him.

But yeah, I guess I wish TLS could be a bit more subtitle or reserved or something instead of coming in hot all the damn time (of course glass houses, stones, etc.)

BigZuck wrote:I think the ham-handedness was a bad call and I enjoyed ratfukr's approach but I will say in non-defense of the dean that:

1. It was dumb to try and suggest that LST is misleading when he apparently is going to carry the "You can get NYC big law from KU" narrative to his grave. Like, yeah, duh, maybe it's possible but it almost certainly ain't gonna happen. Call it puffery if you want but he couldn't abandon his deanspeak to fully admit that it almost certainly ain't gonna happen, even when called out on it. He tried, but then he chickened out and deanspoke. Not good.2. He dug himself into an even bigger turdular grave with the Birdnal's thing. It just makes him look like an even bigger sociopath and doesn't reflect well on his professionalism or the school in general, IMO. NAGL to do that on the Internet in a forum like this. Hopefully that was a teachable moment for him.

But yeah, I guess I wish TLS could be a bit more subtitle or reserved or something instead of coming in hot all the damn time (of course glass houses, stones, etc.)

Why is everyone so focused on out-of-state biglaw? It's like a paragraph in their marketing materials. Such a minor thing, especially considering I bet there are very few students who go to KU with a goal of nyc biglaw. Much fewer than those who go to t14 with the idea of something other than a corporate drone job. I bet in KU's brochure there's wayyy less emphasis on the few who get nyc biglaw than there is in T14's on comparably unicorny outcomes that way more people are actually dreaming of. Yet people aren't MAF at Harvard.

cotiger wrote:I bet there are very few students who go to KU with a goal of nyc biglaw.

Ehhhhhh...

I'm gonna go ahead and disagree (kinda)

I think the vast majority of people who go to law school don't know WTF they are doing or WTF it's about and just go because it's a respectable thing to do and they'll get a good, high paying job. Maybe they don't want that high paying job in NYC, maybe they want it in KC, but they want it and schools like this generally can't give it to them. But when you see crap like "it'll be tough but work hard and do well and our CSO can help you get a job in a top NYC firm!" that says "Hey, if I go there I can get a high paying job too!" I don't think it's unreasonable for the dean to get called on that BS and I don't think it's unreasonable for him to fully admit, "Yeah, you're right, that probably won't happen from KU no matter what you do." He almost did that but instead he couldn't help himself and he deanspoke. Again, NAGL

Maybe I'm not giving law school applicants in general enough credit though. I just don't think that anywhere close to a majority of KU applicants are going to that school looking for 40K small law/local government gigs. Not even close. Most of them probably don't know what big law is but what they want from law school is probably much more akin to big law than what they'll get from KU IMO.

cotiger wrote:I bet there are very few students who go to KU with a goal of nyc biglaw.

Ehhhhhh...

I'm gonna go ahead and disagree (kinda)

I think the vast majority of people who go to law school don't know WTF they are doing or WTF it's about and just go because it's a respectable thing to do and they'll get a good, high paying job. Maybe they don't want that high paying job in NYC, maybe they want it in KC, but they want it and schools like this generally can't give it to them. But when you see crap like "it'll be tough but work hard and do well and our CSO can help you get a job in a top NYC firm!" that says "Hey, if I go there I can get a high paying job too!" I don't think it's unreasonable for the dean to get called on that BS and I don't think it's unreasonable for him to fully admit, "Yeah, you're right, that probably won't happen from KU no matter what you do." He almost did that but instead he couldn't help himself and he deanspoke. Again, NAGL

Maybe I'm not giving law school applicants in general enough credit though. I just don't think that anywhere close to a majority of KU applicants are going to that school looking for 40K small law/local government gigs. Not even close. Most of them probably don't know what big law is but what they want from law school is probably much more akin to big law than what they'll get from KU IMO.

I think you're definitely on the right track here. As an undergrad at a large state school, it seems like most people who are considering law school have no idea what they want to do (or what their options even are out of law school), but in their head they'll be doing something similar to biglaw. That kind of talk probably only reinforces that skewed idea of what kind of job they can get from random TT/TTT law school.

it's one thing to be critical of ku for not placing many people in blit's an entirely different thing to criticize a misleading post that the ku dean made on this forum about bl placementi was amazed people found my post controversial and that some of you white knights itt couldn't distinguish the two (or maybe you were just having fun beating down straw men)do you really think deans should be allowed to post whatever they want on tls without other posters being able to respond critically to it?

also, if i can interrupt the circlejerk over the departure of our lord and savior dean freedmanmost of his posts on this forum are fluff, some of it is actively misleadingthere wasn't anything he was going to post in this thread you couldn't just e-mail him abouti'm not saying there's zero value in him being here, but his value has been grossly overinflated

Brut wrote:it's one thing to be critical of ku for not placing many people in blit's an entirely different thing to criticize a misleading post that the ku dean made on this forum about bl placementi was amazed people found my post controversial and that some of you white knights itt couldn't distinguish the two (or maybe you were just having fun beating down straw men)do you really think deans should be allowed to post whatever they want on tls without other posters being able to respond critically to it?

also, if i can interrupt the circlejerk over the departure of our lord and savior dean freedmanmost of his posts on this forum are fluff, some of it is actively misleadingthere wasn't anything he was going to post in this thread you couldn't just e-mail him abouti'm not saying there's zero value in him being here, but his value has been grossly overinflated

Complains about white knights.. is on a mission to expose the dean for his lies and save all those lifelong kansans with nyc biglaw dreams from ruin

I'm not saying this guy was a super chill dude who was a shining beacon in the darkness of law school admissions.

But you guys ran him off with super aggro pedantry after like 5-6 substantive responses.

Yeah, he could have had thicker skin, but considering that a significant part of TLS is admissions advice, it would be a richer place if it had enough courtesy to encourage actual admissions officers to be a part of it.