the 4 British contractors in Iraq have been held hostage for over 1 year now and it turns out one of the poor buggers has commited suicide. We all have been told by the goverment that behind the scenes there have been negotiations but according to their captors there has been hardly any dialogue between them and the powers that be. Their demands are simple, release 9 iraqi prisoners in Basra and the lads will be free to come home. I for one could'nt give a toss about the famous cliche ''We don't negotiate with terroists'' and i would rather see these boys come home, enough is enough and i could'nt give a toss about 9 prisoners in Basra either. Its's a fair deal in my eyes and in war you win some and you lose some. Everybody wins in this case and everybody goes home. Yeah theres a huge stigma attached to Security contractors and they all knew the risks when they went there to work but these are guy's that once put their lives on the line for HM armed forces and they deserve more. Fecking no marks for Brown and co.

the 4 British contractors in Iraq have been held hostage for over 1 year now and it turns out one of the poor buggers has commited suicide. We all have been told by the goverment that behind the scenes there have been negotiations but according to their captors there has been hardly any dialogue between them and the powers that be. Their demands are simple, release 9 iraqi prisoners in Basra and the lads will be free to come home. I for one could'nt give a toss about the famous cliche ''We don't negotiate with terroists'' and i would rather see these boys come home, enough is enough and i could'nt give a toss about 9 prisoners in Basra either. Its's a fair deal in my eyes and in war you win some and you lose some. Everybody wins in this case and everybody goes home. Yeah theres a huge stigma attached to Security contractors and they all knew the risks when they went there to work but these are guy's that once put their lives on the line for HM armed forces and they deserve more. Fecking no marks for Brown and co.

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So we release nine Iraqi prisoners who are intent on continuing their own mini war against our forces who are still in Iraq.
Any person who signs up with a security company to work for large amounts of money knows the risks that they are working under. The fact that they once may have been in the service of the crown does not come into the equation. Putting their lives on the line while in the services is a duty which must be done. Putting their lives on line after leaving is a voluntary exercise normally in pursuit of wealth.
So do not blame the government for putting lives at risk, blame the individual.

If you believe that security contractors are on large amounts of money for the job that they do then you clearly have no clue about the security industry in Iraq. Do you feel these guys should be abandoned? Anyone who doe's is a callous basteward.

I don't dispute that the responsibility lies with the individual if he as a civilian is kidnapped in Iraq. But as a British national his goverment should do their upmost to secure their release. If not why the feck pay your taxes and why the feck pay a previous service to your country.

If you believe that security contractors are on large amounts of money for the job that they do then you clearly have no clue about the security industry in Iraq. Do you feel these guys should be abandoned? Anyone who doe's is a callous basteward.

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So I take it that they are in Iraq to act as kind beneficiaries to the local population.
Why would anyone work in Iraq who doesn't have to?
Am I being naive to think that the main reason is financial?

I don't dispute that the responsibility lies with the individual if he as a civilian is kidnapped in Iraq. But as a British national his goverment should do their upmost to secure their release. If not why the feck pay your taxes and why the feck pay a previous service to your country.

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From what I understand working long term abroad means that tax is not paid in the UK. As for paying previous service, I served for 22 years and did it because I enjoyed the job, the conditions were not too bad and the pay was OK. I certainly did not GIVE these 22 years to my country, like everyone else I sold them.

There is a high threat of kidnapping across Iraq. Five British nationals were abducted from eastern Baghdad on 29 May 2007. The threat of kidnap remains high. Particular caution should be exercised throughout all of the country, especially when moving and working outside the International Zone in Baghdad, including in the cities of Baghdad, Basra, Fallujah, Al Ramadi, the towns of Najaf and Kufa and on the Baghdad-Amman highway. Individuals have been kidnapped at their residence, work and in transit. Kidnappers do not discriminate on the basis of nationality, religion, gender, age or profession. Since April 2006, large numbers of people have been kidnapped, of which a number resulted in the death of hostages. Travellers should be aware that further kidnaps might be planned.

You should be aware that the long-standing policy of the British Government is not to make substantive concessions to hostage takers. The British Government considers that paying ransoms and releasing prisoners increases the risk of further hostage taking.

The provision of close security protection is extremely important for those working in and moving around Baghdad. But this in itself does not remove the threat â€“ a number of those who have been kidnapped include individuals who had security arrangements in place.

British Citizens, including those working for private security companies, are strongly advised to reassess security arrangements and consider carefully when planning movements throughout Iraq, especially when moving outside the International Zone in Baghdad.

We understand that the Government of Iraq has closed six border crossings with Iran at Kella, Saranban-Golle, Taiwella, Parweez Khan, Muntheria and al Sheeb.

Pay attention to the bit on policy.

They were aware of this when they went to the country.
No way should any priconers be exchanged.

The flaw in your thinking is the fact that the kidnappers arn't the nicest chaps in the world. Do you think they'll stick to their word? What if they change their demands to 15 or 20 prisoner releases? You could release any number of prisoners - they could still execute the kidnapees.

If you believe that security contractors are on large amounts of money for the job that they do then you clearly have no clue about the security industry in Iraq. [They may be on substantially less than they were 2-4 years ago but it is still "what they get paid for" to use a quote oft use about the military] Do you feel these guys should be abandoned? [No, but nor should we release fighters to gain their freedom]Anyone who doe's is a callous basteward.

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Sorry should have introduced myself, C A L Lousbasteward is the name. Had you been on a DTS when you posted this?. So we release the 9 and they possibly kill 1 or more each (ratio of 2.25 dead to 1 living) or alternatively they then take hostage another 3 and demand 10 released, they go on to kill 1 or more each (ratio of 2.75 dead to 1 living), get the picture? Now if you would like to throw money at it that may be different, oh yeh but they may just buy weapons or electronics, damm, there's my career in politics over then!

I am not a hostage negotiator but i would like to hear from the goverment that more is being done behind the scenes. Thanks for reminding me of the flaw in my thinking! I never realised that the kidnappers probably Jaish al Mehdi aren'nt the nicest chaps in the world

So you don't believe in following the government advice on travel but do believe that when you drop in the shit the government should pull the strings to get you out of it.
Grow up take responsibility for your own decisions. You are in the real world, if you get captured the government isn't even going to trade a kilo of pork sausages for you.
Realise you work in Iraq or Afghanistan at your own risk.
Now Thailand is different, I've worked there and didn't even check the government site.

No thats right Slim Your that switched on you obviously realise theres a huge security problem in Southern Thailand the moment with Islamic extremism. Cheers for the patronising advice my friend.

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The Thais have had that problem since before I first worked in the Kingdom (1989). yes it has grown some but is still not of the same magnitude as Iraq and Afghanistan. The Thai navy and army are also involved in border disputes in the North of the country. Once again little is heard of that.
Thailand is still an extremely safe place to live and work.
Now if you want to go and voluntarily put your life on the line for the sake of a few thousand Baht that is up to you. However I'm pissed off with those who do that complaining that the government should pull them out of the shit that they have got themselves into.
It is not the governments job to get those who put themselves in danger out of the shit.

Yes it is a safe place to live. My home is there.
Now back to Iraq. I did'nt hold alot of sympathy for the likes of that gutless arseh0le Norman Kember and his ungrateful pals and i fully appreciate that all who loiter the badlands appreciate the risk they are taking but when i see that 4 of our citizens are still 1 year later no nearer to freedom than when they were first captured I feel pity. I would hate to see these men endure the horrible death that many have gone before. None oif us can fathom the conditions they may be in.

Yes it is a safe place to live. My home is there.
Now back to Iraq. I did'nt hold alot of sympathy for the likes of that gutless arseh0le Norman Kember and his ungrateful pals and i fully appreciate that all who loiter the badlands appreciate the risk they are taking but when i see that 4 of our citizens are still 1 year later no nearer to freedom than when they were first captured I feel pity. I would hate to see these men endure the horrible death that many have gone before. None oif us can fathom the conditions they may be in.

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Of course no one wishes to see people captured and held captive, however it comes with the job.
As for paying your taxes, I suppose that you are a tax exile so why should the UK government use tax payers money to free someone just because he holds British passport?
If you pay your tax to the Thai government then if you are captured perhaps they should help.
One little piece of advice though, it is worth paying UK National Insurance. Perhaps one day you will wish to return and without sufficient stamps your benefits (like state pension) may be difficult to claim.

I pay my National insurance and this thread was'nt started because i fear i may be kidnapped, i'll make sure i never get into that situation. Also there's nothing to suggest these guys did'nt pay their taxes. It depends on your rotation days and contract. Not everybody on the circuit is a tax exile.