You're a nicer person than myself! As an 'old beginner', I'm more selfish...and would rather NOT share precious hands-on time with my teachers on beginners. (It's all about meeeeee! LOL! ) Critical mass, IMHO, doesn't really appear until there are enough bodies at a certain skill level. Until then, you feel the drag of a mixed class.

I like to have the white belts around so that I don't feel like the most uncoordinated person in the dojo. That's interesting about the mixed class statement.Since I started Goju ryu I guess I've always been the lower rank.(I liked that.)There wasn't any demands placed on me and it was cool. Now through promotion and attrition I'm the highest kyu in our club and I'm not too keen about that. I think that receiving my black belt years ago in TKD kind of left me with some things I'm still working through. I imediatly was thrown into teaching classes. I was not prepared for that,or ready. It's for this reason that I would rather just be one of the lower ranks and train. I know..time to man up. I guess that when I remember how pathetic my technique was as a 2nd in TKD I want to be extra good "old beginner" in Goju ryu.The thought that I could be promoted as some kind of old guy curtesey just makes my blood boil.I want to earn any rank that comes my way. Whew! that was too heavy.Sorry about that.Any way I've blathered on enough. Time to get ready for class.

The last couple of months, I've been teaching some of the classes, since my instructor was on a tight working schedule. Teaching is really eye-opening. Bit hard though, since it takes away on your own training during class (at least, that's what it tended to do on mine).My motivation: we showed up, we want to train, so we train. Since I was the senior at those times, I felt that I had to give my attention to these students with less experience. Share my experience. (My instructor may sometimes ask me to fill in for him. So he must trust me, that I can cope with teaching I guess.)(Two of the new ones recently passed their first greenbelt-exams, which gave me a good feeling about it.)

I suspect much of this is due to the increased popularity of MMA. The overwhelming majority of young people who begin training do so to learn to fight. Traditional martial arts just don't seem "hard core" enough to them. Frankly, I think the audience for most traditional martial is quickly being narrowed to older people and toddlers.

You are definitely onto something in terms of new, young male students Fileboy.

However, from what i've seen the MMA places around here don't have any more longevity in longer term student retention than TMA dojos do...minus comepetitors..which have to be a small % of the students. They seem to do way more in terms of initial volume of students at a time for sure, but I don't see any more staying around than would in a TMA dojo. people in general are pretty lazy..it seems like the standard behavior of do a few classes, realize you won't be awesome immediately, then quit promptly crosses all disciplines and styles!

So I have to think that in the wash things will probably even out.

I think that generally the adult student looking for TMA is looking for something beyond just fighting usually.

I think that generally the adult student looking for TMA is looking for something beyond just fighting usually.

I agree.Adults who join our school tend to stick around while, as Fileboy pointed out, the young males who show up tend to want to fight more than anything else, and usually end up at an MMA school.They go there with big dreams, but after a while they realize that becoming a fighter like the ones they see on T.V. requires full-time dedication, and two or three MMA sessions a week won't cut it.Originally, I was considering joing an MMA school when I started out. I didn't want to fight competitively, but I wanted to train like a fighter. (Short of getting my head bashed in inside the cage). I spoke with the staff at the school, and they seemed intent on getting me into the cage, and didn't seem particularly interested in what I wanted to do, so I checked out traditional schools and joined one.It turned out to be a good decision for me.

What saddens me is when the teacher puts student numbers ahead of student progression.

What i mean by this is that, as an assistant instructor my sensei likes to remind me that if i push my fellow students too hard, mainly in the initial fitness workout, then they might not come back the following week. I don't try to push anyone beyond their capabilities but I do try to encourage them to push themselves through at least some dis-comfort. The saying 'no pain, no gain' has truth in it, i believe.

All of my training to get to the point of where i am now, in my self-discipline, self-confidence and ability, came from being pushed hard. I don't bully. I motivate.

What i am trying to say is that i find it hard to think about teaching when I have to worry about hurting peoples feelings.

What pleases me is that although i hear the groans of the student putting themselves through a hard workout, when they pass me at the door on the way out and tell me that they enjoyed the class really. This is the satisfaction of teaching.