Pro and Con 1607

Just look at the planetary lineup on May 29, 2011

Dear Doves, MJ Agee, a wonderful Christian author and theologian opened my mind to the many signs a wonders God places in the Heavens to testify of His truth and fathfullness. This week, Marilyn noted on her website Bible Prophecy Corner a new explosion in the Crab Nebula.

Reading up on the Crab Nebula I discovered that it first exploded on July 4th 1054AD. In seminary, Church History class, I learned about the Great Schism, which also happened in 1054AD. It was ratified in July of 1054 dividing the Roman Catholic Church from the Eastern over matters we will discuss below. See bold type below.

New explosive activity in the Crab Nebula occured on April 12th 2011.Watch the Middle East and in particular watch Israel for prophetic signs and wonders. Earlier, I posted a story about the apparent reunion of Hamas and Fatah mediated by Egyptian government. This unity clears the way for military attacks upon Israel. The meeting which resulted in this new alliance happened on April 12th 2011. Exactly the same day as the violent explosion in the Crab Nebula!! Very significant indeed, so significant that it warrants the biggest explosion ever witnessed by mankind. Additionally, this new explosion violates every previous cosmic explosion with properties unlike any earlier supernova.

Now, what matter caused the Christian Church to split apart and remain divided to this day. Read below please note writing in bold. From Wikipedia

Mutual excommunication of 1054
Most of the direct causes of the Great Schism, however, are far less grandiose than the Filioque. The relations between the papacy and the Byzantine court were good in the years leading up to 1054. The emperor Constantine IX and the Pope Leo IX were allied through the mediation of the Lombard catepan of Italy, Argyrus, who had spent years in Constantinople, originally as a political prisoner.
Patriarch Michael I ordered a letter to be written to the bishop of Trani in which he attacked the "Judaistic" practices of the West, namely, the use of unleavened bread. The letter was to be sent by John to all the bishops of the West, including the Pope. John promptly complied, and the letter was passed to Humbert of Mourmoutiers, the cardinal-bishop of Silva Candida, who translated the letter into Latin and brought it to the Pope, who ordered a reply to be made to each charge and a defense of papal supremacy to be laid out in a response.
Although he was hot-headed, Michael was convinced to cool the debate and thus attempt to prevent the impending breach. However, Humbert and the Pope made no concessions, and Humbert was sent with legatine powers to the imperial capital to resolve the questions raised, once and for all. Humbert, Frederick of Lorraine, and Peter, Archbishop of Amalfi, arrived in April 1054 and were met with a hostile reception; they stormed out of the palace, leaving the papal response with Michael, who in turn was even more angered by their actions. The patriarch refused to recognize their authority or, practically, their existence.

Jewish custom and unleavened bread led to the Great Schism. Now, the hatred of the Jews causes another explosion in the Crab Nebula and the breach between Hamas and Fatah is apparently healed. War is coming to Israel What do you think? Agape

My reply

Thanks much for all your kind words and interesting information. It all ties in so well.

We know war will come to Israel, but we also know that God will step in and save them. They will certainly need him on that day. Agape

My reply to a post on Five Doves site

Re: (VIDEO) ``THE WHEAT HARVEST IS CAUGHT UP AT REVELATION 12 IN THE FALL FEAST OF TRUMPETS WHEN THE ANGEL BLOWS THE SEVENTH TRUMPET`` MUST SEE!!!"

I listened to the video twice. It didn't say anything about the wheat harvest being caught up in the fall Feast of Trumpets when the angel blows the seventh trumpet.

I'm glad, because the 7 angels are not given the 7 judgment trumpets (Rev 8) until after the Tribulation saints(the wheat harvest) are already in Heaven (Rev 7:14). They were caught up when the last trump of God sounded.

1 Thess 4:16,17 tells us about the First-Trump Rapture (the barley harvest). It says, "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the TRUMP OF GOD (not a trump sounded by an angel): and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

I Cor 15:51-54 tells us about the Last-Trump Rapture (the wheat harvest). It says, "Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we (including Paul) shall ALL BE CHANGED, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, AT THE LAST TRUMP (of God): for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed (i.e., become immortal). 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption (at each Rapture), and this mortal must put on immortality" (only at the last Rapture). So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory."

The proper sequence is shown in Rev 7:14 (the Last-Trump Rapture has just taken place) and Rev 8 (the 7 trumpets are given to the 7 angels).

The type of the two Raptures is given in Nu 10:2-4. The Lord told Moses to "Make thee TWO TRUMPETS of silver; of a whole piece shalt thou make them: that thou mayest use them for the calling of the ASSEMBLY, and for the journeying of the camps. 3 And when they shall blow with THEM (both), ALL the assembly shall assemble themselves to thee at the DOOR (symbol of a Rapture, Rev 3:8) of the tabernacle of the congregation. 4 And if they blow but with ONE trumpet, then the princes (i.e., the 24 elders of Rev 4:4, the 12 patriarchs and the 12 apostles), which are heads of the thousands of Israel, shall gather themselves unto thee."

Heb 12:22-24 tells us about the GENERAL ASSEMBLY IN HEAVEN at the time of the 2nd Rapture, when the foolish virgins and rest of the Tribulation saints are caught up. It says, "ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, 23 To the GENERAL ASSEMBLY and CHURCH OF THE FIRSTBORN (the wise virgins), which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, 24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant."

The Tribulation saints are raptured when the sixth seal is broken. Then, Rev 8:1,2 says, "And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was SILENCE IN HEAVEN about the space of half an hour. 2 And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets."

There is also silence on Earth while Christ is seated as judge at the Judgment Seat of Christ. Hab 2:20 says, "But the LORD is in his holy temple: let all the EARTH KEEP SILENCE before him."

Rev 8:3-6 says, "And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne. 4 And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand. 5 And the angel took the censer (representing the asteroid Wormwood, Rev 8:11), and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake. 6 And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound."

Isa 22:16-19 says, "What hast thou here (Babylon)? and whom hast thou here (the Satan-possessed False Prophet), that thou hast hewed thee out a sepulchre here, as he (Satan) that heweth him out a sepulchre on high, and that graveth an habitation for himself in a ROCK? 17 Behold, the LORD will carry thee away with a mighty captivity, and will surely cover thee. 18 He will surely violently turn and TOSS THEE LIKE A BALL INTO A LARGE COUNTRY (destroying Babylon, Iraq): there shalt thou die, and there the chariots of thy glory shall be the shame of thy lord's house. 19 And I will drive thee from thy station, and from thy state shall he pull thee down."

Evidently, Wormwood will break in two at the Roche Limit, 11,000 miles out. The mountain-sized piece of Rev 8:8 will impact the Mediterranean Sea washing Gog's army out of Israel's hair. Smaller rocks that are released will start hitting Earth when the sixth seal is broken.

Rev 6:12,13 says, "And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind."

The Last-Trump Rapture takes place before the seventh seal is broken in Rev 8. Agape

Cairo to move Meshaal's Hamas base to Gaza. Assad threatens Israel with war

http://www.debka.com/article/20920/

The real danger to Israel of a military flare-up lies in Damascus which continues to call the Palestinian shots.

My reply to a post on Five Doves, Re: Craig Opal (9 May 2011) "The Imminent 6th Seal Rapture?"

> > If we want to be even more perfect and literal on the Rapture, we need to come to the realization that we are living in between the 5th and 6th seals already and we would find it is still a pre-tribulation Rapture, but it's not where most pre-tribbers think it's going to happen, which many say is before the 1st seal. Just study the 5th seal alone and you will see it can't be a future event, instead it's long since been broken along with the other four.

I can't see how we could possibly be living in between the 5th and 6th seals now. At this point in time, no seals have been broken. Jesus hasn't even been given the 7-sealed Title Deed of the Earth.

Rev 17:14 takes place right after the Rapture has taken place. Of Jesus, it says, "he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that ARE WITH HIM are CALLED, and CHOSEN, and FAITHFUL." They are the Philadelphian saints.

Mt 22:14 says, "many are called, but few are chosen." The faithful Philadelphians are chosen.

At the time of this First-Trump Rapture of I Thess 4:16,17, which is before the Last-Trump Rapture of I Cor 15:51-54, Rev 17:12 says, "And the ten horns you saw are ten kings who have NOT YET received a kingdom".

At the present time, Earth has been divided into 10 regions, but the ten kings that will rule over these regions have not yet been elected. We are now approaching the time of the first Rapture. After we are gone, the 10 kings will be elected.

The First-Trump Rapture takes place in Rev 4:1. Heaven's door opens and the miraculous Trump of God says, "Come up hither."

No trumpet sounded by an angel starting in chapter 8 says, "Come up hither. Rev 8:1,2 says, "And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour (while the judge is being seated at the Judgment Seat of Christ). 2 And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets." Those angels have not received their trumpets yet when both the First-Trump Rapture and the Last-Trump Rapture take place.

In Rev 4:4, we see John and 23 other elders (12 patriarchs and 12 apostles) sitting on thrones in Heaven. When John gets his resurrection body and is caught up to Heaven, we will be caught up to Heaven with him.

We know that the 12 patriarchs are elders from Num 10:1-4. It says, "the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 2 Make thee two trumpets of silver (because there are two Raptures); of a whole piece shalt thou make them: that thou mayest USE THEM FOR THE CALLING OF THE ASSEMBLY (Heb 12:23), and for the journeying of the camps. 3 And when they shall blow with them (plural, i.e., both), ALL the assembly shall assemble themselves to thee at the DOOR (symbol of a Rapture) of the tabernacle of the congregation. 4 And if they blow but with ONE trumpet, then the PRINCES, which are heads of the thousands of ISRAEL, shall GATHER THEMSELVES UNTO THEE."

Heb 12:22-24 says, "But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, 23 To the GENERAL ASSEMBLY and CHURCH OF THE FIRSTBORN, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, 24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant".

Peter is one of the elders.
1Pe 5:1 says, "The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed."

In Rev 5:9, all the First-Trump-Rapture saints out of all nations are seen in Heaven singing the "new song."

Having been caught up with John and the other 23 elders that are part of the Body of Christ in 4:1, these saints are in Heaven in time to witness Jesus being given the seven-sealed Title Deed of the Earth. The first seal is not broken until 6:1, after the Rapture in 4:1 and after Christ recieves the 7-sealed book in 5:7.

Since the First-Trump Rapture has not yet taken place, the elders are not crowned or enthroned, and Jesus has not yet been given the seven-sealed book. Therefore, none of its 7 seals have been broken.

> > Is the 6th seal Rapture Imminent?

No. It is the Last-Trump Rapture. It comes on the Day of God's Wrath just before the two asteroids of Rev 8:8-11 impact Earth.

> > Yes I believe it is. In our pre-trib zeal, lets not be so eager to jam a Rapture event into scripture where it does not belong or is described. Revelation Chapter 4’s “come up here” language, is only speaking to John, not a large group of people as we see at the sixth seal.

Of the saints caught up in the First-Trump Rapture, Rev 5:9 says, "they sung a NEW SONG, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood OUT OF EVERY KINDRED, AND TONGUE, AND PEOPLE, AND NATION".

At the Last-Trump Rapture, the saved Tribulation saints are too many to count.

After telling us about the 144,000 Israelites, Rev 7:9,14 says, "I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands...14 These are they which CAME OUT OF GREAT TRIBULATION, and have WASHED THEIR ROBES, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb."

The first Rapture was for the Philadelphians, for whom the Lord had no words of condemnation. Therefore, they were wearing white robes. The Laodiceans were not wearing white robes at the time, so they got left behind. They wash their robes and are caught up in the second Rapture. No believer will be left behind the second time.

> > Why would those under the altar in heaven ask Jesus at the 5th seal, when he was going to avenge their murders, if the 7 yr. tribulation had already started? Wouldn't they know like everyone else that there is just 7 short years left?

They ask because part of the Tribulation has already run its course.

> > Is the 6th seal Rapture Imminent? Yes I believe it is.

No. The First-Trump Rapture precedes the breaking of the first seal. The Last-Trump Rapture of the Tribulation saints precedes the breaking of the 7th seal.

> > Also this group of people seen in heaven at the sixth seal has “come out of” the great tribulation, not “come through” as some have incorrectly quoted. Even the original Greek says they have come out of it, not through it.

If they come out of the Tribulation, they have been in the Tribulation.

> > The only question then becomes which portion did they come out of, and we see clearly that they have come out at the beginning, because earlier in the beginning of the seal, the people of earth proclaim God’s first day of wrath is here. So then God’s wrath begins at the 6th seal, not beforehand.

The great and terrible Day of God's Wrath has arrived when the 6th seal is broken just before the Tribulation saints are caught up in the Last-Trump Rapture. God's wrath begins in Rev 8 at the breaking of the 7th seal.

Rev 8:1 says, "And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was SILENCE IN HEAVEN about the space of half an hour.

Both Heaven and Earth are silent while Christ is seated as judge at the Judgment Seat of Christ.
Hab 2:20 says, "But the LORD is in his holy temple: let all the EARTH keep silence before him."

Rev 8:2 says, "And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets."

The 7 trumpets come out of the 7th seal. The 7 vials come out of the 7th trumpet.

Rev 11:15-19 says, "And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. 16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God, 17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come (future tense, the Second Advent will be 7 months in the future); because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. 18 And the nations were angry, and THY WRATH IS COME, and the time of the dead, that they should be JUDGED, and that thou shouldest give REWARD unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth. 19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail."

The two stone tablets seem to have represented the two asteroid pieces that will impact Earth that day. Remember when Moses brought the tablets down the first time, he threw them down and smashed them? That pictured the asteroid pieces hitting Earth.

One rock as big as a mountain will hit the Mediterranean Sea. Satan's home, Wormwood, will obliterate Babylon near the Euphrates.

Isa 22:16-19 says, "What hast thou here? (Babylon) and whom hast thou here (the Satan-possessed False Prophet), that thou hast hewed thee out a sepulchre here, as he (Satan) that heweth him out a sepulchre on high, and that graveth an habitation for himself in a rock (named Wormwood)? 17 Behold, the LORD will carry thee away with a mighty captivity, and will surely cover thee. 18 He will surely violently turn and TOSS THEE LIKE A BALL into a large country (not tiny Israel): there shalt thou die, and there the chariots of thy glory shall be the shame of thy lord's house. 19 And I will drive thee from thy station, and from thy state shall he pull thee down." Agape

FOOD FOR THOUGHT

If the he lamb offered on Firstfruits stands for Christ, does the Firstfruits of barley harvest stand for Philadelphians?

A New Look, The Mystery of the WAVE SHEAF OFFERING Revealed at Last!

By William F. Dankenbring
http://www.triumphpro.com/wave-sheaf.htm

Much confusion exists concerning the meaning, significance and symbolism of the "wave sheaf" offering of Leviticus 23. Just what is the "wave sheaf"? How does it tie in with the sacrifice of Jesus Christ for our sins? How does it tie in with the "firstfruits from the dead"? Here is a NEW LOOK at the mysterious "wave sheaf" offering and its amazing, wonderful symbolism!

...In Leviticus 23 we read, "And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a SHEAF of the FIRSTFRUITS of your harvest unto the priest: and he shall WAVE THE SHEAF before the Lord, to be ACCEPTED FOR YOU: on the morrow after the sabbath the priest shall wave it.

"And ye shall offer that day when ye wave the sheaf an he lamb without blemish of the first year for a burnt offering unto the Lord" (Lev 23:l0-l2).

What is this "wave sheaf" offering? What does it symbolize and represent?

Notice that it is a sheaf of the "first fruits," and it is offered to God before the Israelites can harvest the spring harvest. God commands, "And ye shall eat neither bread, nor parched corn, nor green ears" -- that is, produce from the new harvest -- "until the selfsame day that ye have brought an offering unto your God: it shall be a STATUTE FOR EVER throughout your generations in all your dwellings" (Lev.23:l4).

Spiritual Type and Antitype

In the book of Romans, Paul writes to Christians, saying, "For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now. And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the FIRSTFRUITS OF THE SPIRIT, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body" (Rom.8:23)....

In the book of James we read: "Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a KIND OF FIRSTFRUITS of his creation" (James 1:18)....

This Passover-sheaf, or rather omer, was to be accompanied by a burnt-offering, of a 'he lamb, without blemish, of the first year,' with its appropriate meat- and drink- offering, and after it had been brought, but not till then, fresh barley might be used and sold in the land....

Notice! In the past, many have ASSUMED -- and many STILL assume -- that the "wave sheaf" offering referred to Jesus Christ, who was the offering for our sins upon the stake (II Cor.5:20). But does this make any sense, when we stop to think about it? It was accompanied by the offering of a male lamb without blemish -- which itself typified Christ! It was waved by the high priest before God, to be accepted of the Father -- and the high priest typified Christ, our "high priest" in heaven (Heb.7:24-28; 9:24; 10:10). Furthermore, this "wave sheaf" was offered AFTER the sacrifice of Christ our Passover Lamb (I Cor.5:7-8). The Passover lambs were slain in the afternoon of Nisan 14 -- the precise time when Yeshua the Messiah was slain for us!

Clearly, then, the wave sheaf -- contrary to what many have assumed and believed -- does NOT refer to Christ at all -- but rather is made possible BY the Sacrifice of Christ, which precedes it in time sequence!...

Nisan 16, it is prepared and waved before the Lord and accepted of Him as "THE FIRSTFRUITS" of the harvest.

Do you begin to comprehend? Do you see? The wave sheaf offering is an offering which is a BUNDLE OF SEPARATE BARLEY GRAINS, FROM A NUMBER OF PLANTS, AMOUNTING TO AN "OMER" -- about five pints, or two and one half quarts. This offering followed the offering of Christ, as our Passover lamb, who paid for our sins. It was accompanied by the burnt offering of a lamb -- Christ -- without blemish (Lev.23:12). The wave sheaf itself, then, is NOT CHRIST!

What then is it?

The Wave Sheaf Offering, composed of MANY individual grains, offered together, made possible by the sacrifice of Christ, represents US -- TRUE CHRISTIANS -- those called of God during this age, as His "FIRSTFRUITS"!...

The "wave sheaf" itself typifies the entire true spiritual body of Christ, the "Church of God," those who have the Spirit of God during this dispensation or age!...

The fifty days between Passover and Pentecost typify the CHURCH AGE, and our struggle to overcome, and to prepare ourselves, to MEET GOD at the second coming of the Messiah -- on Pentecost, the day God came down from Heaven and touched Mount Sinai, and gave His Law to mankind....

True Christians are they "which have the FIRSTFRUITS of the Spirit" (Rom.8:23)....James wrote, "Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of FIRSTFRUITS of his creatures" (James 1:18)....

What, then, about Jesus? He is called a "firstfruit" of many firstfruits and the Firstborn of many brethren (I Corinthians 15:20; Romans 8:29).

My comments

Paul says of them, "Salute my well beloved Epaenetus, who is the FIRSTFRUITS of Achaia unto Christ" (Rom. 16:5).

"There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the spirit. . . But ye are not in the flesh, but in the spirit, if so be that the spirit of God DWELL in you. Now if any man have not the spirit of Christ, he is none of his" (Rom. 8:1-9).

In James we read: "Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth that we should be a KIND OF FIRSTFRUITS of his creatures" (James 1:18, RSV).

"But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ's at His coming" (verse 23).

Christ, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep

"Of His own will He brought us forth by the word of truth, that we might be a kind of firstfruits of His creatures" (James 1:18). Revelation 14:4, speaking of the 144,000, firmly nails down just who the firstfruits are: "These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb."

Paul titles Him "the firstborn among many brethren" in Romans 8:29. In I Corinthians 15:20 he clearly links firstfruits—and therefore a harvest—with a resurrection: "But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep."

Leviticus 23:9-14 says, "And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 10 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest unto the priest: 11 And he shall wave the sheaf (Heb. omer) before the LORD, to be accepted for you: on the morrow after the sabbath the priest shall wave it. 12 And ye shall offer that day when ye wave the sheaf an he lamb without blemish of the first year for a burnt offering unto the LORD. 13 And the meat offering thereof shall be two tenth deals of fine flour mingled with oil, an offering made by fire unto the LORD for a sweet savour: and the drink offering thereof shall be of wine, the fourth part of an hin. 14 And ye shall eat neither bread, nor parched corn, nor green ears, until the selfsame day that ye have brought an offering unto your God: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations in all your dwellings."

The wavesheaf consisted of an omer of barley, still on the stalk, cut at the beginning of the spring harvest. Since it came from the very beginning of the harvest of the firstfruits, it can be called the first of the firstfruits (Exodus 23:19). A comparison of Exodus 23:14-19; 34:22-26; Leviticus 23:10-11 and Nehemiah 12:44 confirms that each Israelite possessing a harvest was required to give an offering.

It looks like the agricultural harvests in Israel became types of God's spiritual harvests of souls into His Kingdom. Just maybe the Rapture will be on Firstfruits.

Incoming e-mail, Re: WHY NOT TAKE SCRIPTURE 'AT IT'S WORD'

I cannot find anywhere in Scripture that says the tribulation is any longer that 3 and 1/2 years in length. I think that 7-years is a mistaken theory. I do not equate the 'whole 70th Week' with the tribulation, just the second-half. The angel of the Lord in Daniel said that it is "time, times and half a time" ie. 3 1/2 years. YBIC

My reply

I do my best to take Scripture at its word. It usually explains itself. However, it is not safe to build a doctrine on one passage without comparing it to other scriptures that have a bearing on that same subject.

The 3 1/2 years for the last half of the 70th week of Daniel are estimated time. That segment is to be shortened.

Dan 12:1-12 says, And at that time (when the False Prophet will be deposed, see previous verse) shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time (Day of God's Wrath, end of last 3.5 years) thy people (the 144,000 Israelite tribulation saints) shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. 4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to THE TIME OF THE END: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. 5 Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. 6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, HOW LONG SHALL IT BE TO THE END of these wonders? 7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half (3.5 year Great Tribulation, LAST HALF of 70th week of Daniel); and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the HOLY PEOPLE, all these things shall be finished."

If the last half of the 70th week of Daniel will be 3.5 years, it stands to reason to think that the first half of that 70th week will be 3.5 years. There is no way the entire 70th week can be 3.5 years.

Dan 9:24 says, "Seventy weeks (shabua, sevens) are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy."

The first 7 weeks of years (49 years) came true in history. Therefore, the last week of years (7 years) will come true in history. Jesus will be anointed King of kings and Lord of lords at the end of these 7 years.

However, the last half will not end up being exactly 3.5 years long. Mt 24:22 says, "And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."

Dan 8:13,14 tells us how much it will be shortened. It says, "I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? Dan 8:14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed" (on the Day of God's Wrath, probably Sept 14, 2015).

If you subtract 2300 days (using inclusive reckoning because it is a block of time) from Tishri 1, 5776, Sept 14, 2015, you will find out that the 2300 days could have started on Pentecost, May 29, 2009.

It looks like there are 1260 days of Tribulation near the end of which (Nov 8, 2012) they build the Temple and start sacrificing and then 1040 days of Great Tribulation when they can't sacrifice because the False Prophet will desecrate the Temple at the beginning of the 1040 days.

Mt 24:21,22 says, "For then shall be GREAT TRIBULATION, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."

From date: Monday, September 14, 2015, Feast of Trumpets, probably Day of God's Wrath
Subtracted 1040 days

Resulting date: Thursday, November 8, 2012

Therefore, it looks like the False Prophet may desecrate the Temple about that time. Agape

Incoming e-mail, Re: THE 'GREAT TRIBULATION' BEGINS IN THE 'FIRST MONTH' WHICH IS NISAN:

(6 May 2011)
"BOTH THE 'RAPTURE' MAY HAPPEN and THE 'GREAT TRIBULATION' MAY BEGIN, IN THE 'FIRST MONTH' WHICH IS 'NISAN'....."

THE 'GREAT TRIBULATION' BEGINS IN THE 'FIRST MONTH' WHICH IS NISAN:

The Prophet Daniel said: 'the man dressed in linen who was above the water' swore by Almighty God that the length of the tribulation would be for "a time, times and half a time". That means it will be 3 and 1/2 years long. We know that Jesus will return at His 'Second Coming', AFTER the great tribulation, on the Feast of Trumpets (Tishri 1) to fulfill the 'Fall Feasts' just as he fulfilled the 'Spring Feasts'.

Therefore, the tribulation BEGINS 3 and 1/2 years BEFORE the 'Second Coming' of the Lord on the 'first day' of the '7th month' which is 'Tishri'. The '1st month' which is 'Nisan' is 3 1/2 years preceeding the '7th month' which is 'Tishri'.

Therefore, the 'great tribulation' can BEGIN ONLY in the 'first month' which is 'Nisan'.

THE 'RAPTURE' HAPPENS IN THE 'FIRST MONTH' WHICH IS NISAN:

Jeremiah 5:24
"Let us now fear the Lord our God, who GIVES RAIN, BOTH THE FORMER AND THE LATTER, IN ITS SEASON. HE RESERVES FOR US THE APPOINTED FEASTS OF THE HARVEST."

Hosea 6:3
"Let us pursue the knowledge of the Lord. His going forth is established as the morning; HE WILL COME TO US LIKE THE RAIN, LIKE THE LATTER AND FORMER RAIN TO THE EARTH."

James 5:7-8
"Therefore be patient, brethern, until the coming of the Lord. See how the farmer waits for the PRECIOUS FRUIT OF THE EARTH, waiting patiently for it UNTIL IT RECEIVES THE EARLY AND LATTER RAIN. You also be patient. Establish your hearts, FOR THE COMING OF THE LORD IS AT HAND."

Joel 2:23
"Rejoice in the Lord your God; for HE HAS GIVEN YOU THE FORMER RAIN FAITHFULLY, and HE WILL CAUSE THE RAIN TO COME DOWN FOR YOU - The former rain, AND THE LATTER RAIN IN THE FIRST MONTH."

Therefore, the rapture will happen when Jesus, who is the 'latter rain' comes down for us in the 'first month' which is Nisan.
According to Your Word, Come Lord Jesus!