They don't really bring it up much on the show, but Catelyn is also revered because of her father, Hoster Tully. Many of the men who swore themselves to Robb did so because of the Tully connection - Robb's great uncle Brynden Tully is also aiding him. It's also why Robb was able to cross the bridge at the Trident - the Freys were one of the houses pledged to House Tully. Walder Frey (the one in charge - from the books we know that you can't swing a dead cat without hitting someone named Walder! Even Hodor's name is actually Walder.) would have been even less willing to speak with Catelyn, in spite of the little slights he threw in her face, if not for the Tully connection.

Just to add a bit more from the book....the man who wanted to kill Jaime when he was recaptured - the one whose son Jaime killed when he escaped - is Lord Rickard Karstark. He good reason to want Jaime dead. Jaime killed two of his sons in book 1 in action we didn't see on the show - this was the battle stuff they didn't have the budget to film. Karstark was already gunning for Jaime before Jaime killed another one of his sons.

I don't think Robb is nearly the man that Ned was. Yes, Ned had a ridiculously rigid sense of right and wrong that eventually got him killed, but he was also much smarter than Robb. I think JON is Ned's true son. Bran is smarter than Robb as well, IMO. Again, I may just feel this way because Robb isn't a POV character in the books, while Jon and Bran are.

05-24-2012, 10:32 PM

tbamom

Re: Game of Thrones on HBO

I do love me some Jon Snow....Bran has that little pubescent moustache happening now.

05-24-2012, 10:38 PM

CCL

Re: Game of Thrones on HBO

I don't think Robb is half the men Ned was...but, then, the Ned we met was much older. Robb hasn't been holding his mother captive however - she could have gone back to Winterfell but she chose to remain with him at the war camp. As he is in charge at the war camp, she has to follow his rules, just as the other men/women do. And I do think Robb has been very much affected by the goings-on, just as much as his mother. One can't say that one's grief is worse or more important, in my opinion. All of a sudden he is thrust from being a son to being the head of his household and the leader of an army waging war to avenge his father. While he always expected to inherit and lead, it wouldn't have been in this situation, and he was untried/untrained for it. It's a big change for him.

I'm not sure this is a spoiler but

Click to see Spoiler:

I've never thought of Jon having Ned's traits as I never really thought of him as Ned's son as his true parentage is unclear. But, thinking of it, he is very like Ned in that they both have/had strong senses of morality, to a fault etc.

So if Arya joins the Guild can she never leave? Do they send an assassin after her if she does? Can the assassins ever retire? Questions, questions.

05-24-2012, 10:39 PM

Critical

Re: Game of Thrones on HBO

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbamom

I do love me some Jon Snow....Bran has that little pubescent moustache happening now.

Isaac is getting really mature looking. I saw a pic of him at an event and hardly recognized him without Bran's longer hair. I hope for the show's sake that he doesn't hit a growth spurt soon. It's going to look ridiculous having Hodor carry Bran around if he's like 5'7".

05-24-2012, 10:54 PM

tbamom

Re: Game of Thrones on HBO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Critical

Isaac is getting really mature looking. I saw a pic of him at an event and hardly recognized him without Bran's longer hair. I hope for the show's sake that he doesn't hit a growth spurt soon. It's going to look ridiculous having Hodor carry Bran around if he's like 5'7".

Ha I had never thought of that. He's going to need a bigger snuggli

05-25-2012, 09:09 AM

cantstopwatchin

Re: Game of Thrones on HBO

In Catelyn's defense, she did think Bran and Rickon would be safe in Winterfell, away from the fighting and all that, so she met up with the son she thought would be in the most danger after she left The Vale. And we saw Rob last week say he wanted to ride to Winterfell and fight Theon but was reminded of his responsibilities. Neither had any idea Theon would take the turn he did.

I've always been torn on her release of Jamie - as a mother, I'd do anything to save my children as well so I can empathize with that but having a hostage in hand is much better than sending him back to his sister, I think. I don't know - I can make arguments in my head for both.

As to Rob, I think he is smart and a good leader. He's won every battle against the Lannisters and if Theon hadn't betrayed him, he wouldn't have had issues starting up in the North.

Technically, if we believe that Jon is Ned's son, then Rob would also be like Ned in that respect too - having fallen in love with someone other than the woman he was betrothed to or, in Ned's case, already married to. So he really could be like Young Ned. However, I believe Jon is a Stark but through Lyanna...meaning that Ned was never unfaithful...but that's a whole other discussion. :)

With all this discussion, I'm really thinking I want to go back and read the books again...

05-25-2012, 10:38 AM

KatesMom

Re: Game of Thrones on HBO

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCL

I don't think Robb is half the men Ned was...but, then, the Ned we met was much older. Robb hasn't been holding his mother captive however - she could have gone back to Winterfell but she chose to remain with him at the war camp. As he is in charge at the war camp, she has to follow his rules, just as the other men/women do. And I do think Robb has been very much affected by the goings-on, just as much as his mother. One can't say that one's grief is worse or more important, in my opinion. All of a sudden he is thrust from being a son to being the head of his household and the leader of an army waging war to avenge his father. While he always expected to inherit and lead, it wouldn't have been in this situation, and he was untried/untrained for it. It's a big change for him.

I'm not sure this is a spoiler but

Click to see Spoiler:

I've never thought of Jon having Ned's traits as I never really thought of him as Ned's son as his true parentage is unclear. But, thinking of it, he is very like Ned in that they both have/had strong senses of morality, to a fault etc.

So if Arya joins the Guild can she never leave? Do they send an assassin after her if she does? Can the assassins ever retire? Questions, questions.

And let's not forget, the Robb in the books is 14 years old! That is a LOT of responsibility to put on the shoulders of a 14 year old. Most boys (and yes, they are still boys) are ridiculous at 14. Imagine losing your father and then being thrust into being not only the head of the household, but now the head of the entire North. His men have put him up there, but they are also waiting for him to mis-step, which is much clearer in the book. He needs to show that he is not weak and not given over to emotions. That is why he had to do what he did with his mother. And that is why his relationship with Talisa/Jeyne is so problematic, given the promise he made with the Freys to ensure the crossing at the Trident.

As to Jon,

Click to see Spoiler:

while he is most likely not Ned's son, I agree with CSW, I think he is still definitely a Stark, but through Lyanna. And given who most believe his true father to be, he has some "serious" blood in him on both sides!!

05-25-2012, 10:45 AM

ClosetRTWatcher

Re: Game of Thrones on HBO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poppy Fields

I doubt that those men, who worship him, would stop respecting him for not arresting his mother. Especially in that they all know what the widow of Ned Stark has been through. They also hold her in high esteem.

It occurs to me that perhaps he did it to insure her safety? I don't know that it's common knowledge that she was the "liberator," though.

I do think it is common knowledge that she let him go (or quickly becomes common knowledge).

I do believe it would hurt him to not arrest her. Karstark wanted to kill Jamie after Jaime killed his son, so he is extra ticked off that Kat let him go. If Rob didn't do something to appease him, Karstark would have been out fomenting dissent in the ranks. The last thing Rob needs is a divided army!

05-25-2012, 11:19 AM

Poppy Fields

Re: Game of Thrones on HBO

I think what Robb really needs is 10-15 more IQ points.

05-25-2012, 12:01 PM

KatesMom

Re: Game of Thrones on HBO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poppy Fields

I think what Robb really needs is 10-15 more IQ points.

What Robb really needs is to grow up! I know he is older on the show - but seriously, what 14 year old could handle all this and not make a few foolish decisions (or more than few) here and there!