Anyway, I think I'll need to pull out even more facts to overcome this mob of Rolf fanboys. Let's take a look at some enemies. Here, in chapter 16, using the site that I tried to post earlier but this forum wouldn't for some reason...

Assuming Rolf gets 1.5 levels a chapter, he will be about 11/0, or 12/0. 9.4 str/11.5 spd. 18.4 att with steel bow.

15/0 fighter has 35-37 HP, 8-9 def, and 9-10 spd. phail.

15/0 mage has 24-25 HP, 6 def, and 10-12 spd. phail.

14/0 soldier has 30-31 HP, 9 def, and 9-10 spd. phail.

And then there are myrmidons who he can't double, and knights who he does like 5 damage to. And I don't really need to show why nearly everyone else is doing better; most have better str, use stronger weapons, hit res, and/or don't come underlevelled, so they'll have better att.

Do you think he is creating accounts just to back him up? That is so sad. If only I was a mod I could check their IPs. That just gave me an idea, let's ask a mod if they are the same people. I have Swift Finch in mind.

Dude, your examples are so wrong it's not funny. Seriously. Of course Rolf can double attack people and kill them. You've probably pieced together a lie.

Do you think he is creating accounts just to back him up? That is so sad. If only I was a mod I could check their IPs. That just gave me an idea, let's ask a mod if they are the same people. I have Swift Finch in mind.

Go right ahead. I have nothing to hide.

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Dude, your examples are so wrong it's not funny. Seriously. Of course Rolf can double attack people and kill them. You've probably pieced together a lie.

wtf? I took the stats of enemies from a site, and the person who runs it is a FE vet, so it's very reliable.

The first link is a very smart person giving points why Titania loses to Oscar (irrelevant to Rolf anyway). The second link doesn't prove anything. In fact, no-one probably cares it is irrelevant and complete spam to that forum board. All it says is:

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I made a topic saying "Sothe vs Rolf" and defended Rolf. You can see the topic here.

Both prove nothing! Death Wind already owned you when he told us that you lied, and there was no such topic, but now this?

This is getting out of hand. The evidence you are providing contradicts the truth and you are trying to prove us wrong by saying people in another forum are calling us idiots, even though no such people and topic exists.

Simon, guess what? You're ignoring everything smashfanatic said. I swear he's on-par with TemplarSimon. You're ignoring his facts and just saying open-ended "Rolf is better because he has better strength! He also has better defense! Sothe can't kill crap!" Guess what? SmashFanatic is saying true facts, bringing up all the stats, etc.

Also, the only person here who is actually posting relevent debate posts is IP. And how many posts did he make? 2 or 3. Smashfanatic made maybe around 10.

Oh yeah, did you notice Smashfanatic is by himself? Instead of flaming him with "stop being crazy and behave.", atleast notice what he is doing. He believes what he believes. You all are just pushing him farther down and down.

EtS. Be quiet. You don't know what you're talking about. We have already tried to reason with SF, but he just ignores us and types his thing. Look, I will slice every point he made, again:

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His bow is worse than a steel bow.

and wow, another person who uses the planning/strategy card. Do you not realize that having to wall or protect anyone is favoritism? And how Rolf always needs constant protection? Sothe is just staying away from the enemies entirely; Rolf has to be up close.

His bow, has a really good hit, and is a good bow to train him up. Rolf's Bow assists training him up. Rolf will need protection, but eventually, he will become reliable. If you are using a thief, they will run into battles, because there are chests everywhere that your thief can open in chapters. Long range magic can kill Sothe easily. Volke can defend himself, Sothe is too weak to. He dies off. The stats I posted before and the points I made previously point out why Volke is better than Sothe. Also, setting up walls is not favouritism. As Nightslayer said, it's strategy.

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The only thing the range does is allow Rolf to bypass most enemy counterattacks. That's it. This does not help his crappy stats or his bad joining time or his inability to counterattack himself.

Wow...this is exactly what I was saying before. The stats I posted before, you have ignored. Let's revise them again.

Looks good to me. His high strength allows him to wield the Steel Bow easily, exceptional skill and speed, there. His defence beats Titania's now (Titania 20/20 as well). At level 20 unpromoted, he has 12 defence. This beats Sothe's 10. Plus, getting Rolf to level 20 is easier getting Sothe to level 20. There are many reasons:

1) Rolf has a nice and easy-to-use bow.2) Bows beat knifes3) Sothe will probably be counter attacked if he attempts to attack someone4) Rolf can even use the longbow5) Sothe can't gain much EXP by thieving and whatnot. Sothe could get 10 EXP, Rolf can get 11 EXP from one battle.6) Sothe's stats < Rolf's stats7) Sothe gains half EXP due to blossom. 8) Rolf has much better strength than Sothe's.

Reasons for Sothe that you might bring up:

1) Sothe can avoid people and get EXP from opening chests and stuff!A: No, he will get attacked. Unless he is under heavy protection, he can get OHKO'd2) Rolf can also get OHKO's due to his terrible defence!A: No, not really. At level 1, his defence is already 6. Sothe's is only 4.3) At least Sothe can thief! Everyone beats Rolf!A: Actually, Rolf ends up as a great unit. He gets great skill and speed, and his strength is on a high level. His defence is great as well, and it surpasses Titania's by 4 points.4) You can back up Titania's defence with supports!A: People supported are rarely next to eachother. Unless you make it that way, it's hard to keep a ground unit up with a mounted unit anyway. Bad point.5) Rolf has a bad joining time and starts on level 1!A: Rolf joins earlier than Sothe. Sohe also comes on level. I fail to see what this point is trying to prove.6) Rolf can't do anything because he is on level 1 and is weak!A: Him attacking from a range means he can't get counter-attacked, and will actually give him an advantage.

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90% of all units can kill mages and archers. I'm not impressed.

Incidentally, a mage could OHKO Sothe pretty easily. Anyway, those were just examples. Rolf can kill soldiers and all kinds of enemies too! Soldiers are kinda slow.

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You should actually use realistic examples. NO enemy will ever be level 20/20, and no enemy aside from dragons or ashnard will ever hit him for 30 damage unless it's a crit. Very few enemies carry elixers anyway.

How quaint. The point was that he can be OHKO'd. As long as it's a strong unit. I mean, Sothe with 20 HP and 4 DEF...and a Warrior with 16 STR and a Steel Axe. That is more than enough damage to kill Sothe. (Steel axe Mt = 11). Or, a really strong warrior with 25 str and a silver axe (mt 16) beats Sothe at level 20 easily. 41 damage kills through Sothe's 31 HP and 10 DEF. Or, if you say that the warrior was too strong, just consider if two people attacked him.

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No it doesn't. Sothe is never fighting, so as long as he can take a single hit, he is fine.

He can't avoid fighters! He will fall to long-Range magic and ballistas. Also, usually chests are guarded by enemies. Thief will always find fights. That's why Sothe is a bad unit, since you have Volke. A unit that has a much better chance of survival.

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normal lol. try hard mode next time kthnx.

Wow, that is weak. Most people play through the game on normal, hard i just for a bit of a challenge.

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Last time I checked, Sothe's 1% chance of being played was greater than Rolf's less than 1% chance of being played.

And last time I checked, no one will use Sothe because you have Volke. 0% for Sothe, and 60% for Rolf. A lot of people use him. And why would his chance be low? He is the only good Sniper in the game. Why ignore that? I'll stop here and let you read the above. The reasons I gave why he is a good unit.

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The only time class has anything to do with it is when it comes to healers. Both Neph and Devdan both fall under "combat units". They just happen to both be halberdiers. Comparing Neph and Devdan is no different from comparing Devdan to Rolf, or Devdan to Soren, etc.

The reason I compare the two is because you only need one halberdier. Having two is kinda pointless. You're better of with using someone with a different class. Gives more variation to the party.

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His point is that Volke being better than Sothe makes him useless, which also applies for Rolf.

In case you didn't notice, Rolf has a STR growth of 40% Giving him a result of 13 strength at level 20. Beats Sothe's. Plus, Rolf can promote to raise it further.

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lol no. 1/4 chance of working is just bad.

Quite the opposite, quite the opposite. It means every four battles it will activate. This makes it extremely useful, as your units end up fighting a lot of battles.

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If something isn't reliable, then it's pretty much useless.

Stop being an idiot. We never rely on crits, it's just something that can happen if we are lucky. We never rely on it. And you can't say 'it's useless' because it clearly shows that it does a lot of damage.

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no one gave any proof as to why Rolf is good. You just keep saying "zomg he's gud!" No facts, no numbers, no stats, no comparisons to any other unit in the game, whatever.

Oh. My. God. We have given you SO MANY FACT, NUMBERS AND FIGURES to prove that Rolf is good, and yet, you still ignore that fact? Let me clear this up for you in an easy manner.

1) Rolf's stats beat Sothe's stats at unpromoted level 20.2) Rolf can promote, unlike Sothe3) Sothe gets half EXP gain.4) Rolf can attack from a range5) Sothe can die easily, he can't attack from a range, so when he fights, he can easily die in one hit.6) With the right strategy, Rolf can kill someone, and can be protected, by other members killing remaining enemies in he range or blocking their range.

There are many more facts too! Just scroll up for them. Also, your precious number facts are mentioned above.

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wtf? Keeping units within 3 spaces of each other is ridiculously easy to do. Much easier than keeping Rolf walled in at any rate.

Nope, there's lots to do on a map. It's not that it's not hard to keep them together, it's just that your units will have their won things to do. You can't always keep them together unless you were obsessive. Boosting people's stats by including supports isn't a good argument. People will always tell you the same thing.

Here is a quote from Nightslayer:

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You're bringing supports into this? you're actually going to be keeping her near people to get the support? Usefulness = down the drain

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wtf? Sothe can just move in to open chests after all enemies are gone, and I already gave an example of how he can steal physics.

Waiting for all the enemies to go is wasting turns. You need turns for BEXP. With Volke, he can go in without having to waste turns waiting for your stronger people kill enemies. He can survive hits if you train him. Training him isn't nearly as hard as training Sothe. Also, Volke is betterthan Sothe, esp. when it comes to melee fighting.

4) Volke has enough skill, to not have to worry about 5 luck. I'm sure he wont be critted either.

5) THE ULTIMATE POINT! VOLKE CAN PROMOTE AND ABSOLUTELY OWN SOTHE'S STATS.

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Mist does not want Rolf because Titania, Boyd, Jill, and Mordy are either faster or give better bonuses.

Marcia does not want Rolf because Tanith gives better bonuses and Kieran matches her movement.

This leaves basically Rhys.

And Rolf gets 12 avo from supporting Mist/Marcia/Rhys, not 15.

Rolf also doesn't even hit 20/20. Any unit who doesn't have staves or doesn't join overlevelled will have an extremely hard time doing so; Rolf, who is massively underlevelled, will be lucky if he even hits 20/15 by endgame.

You are just ruling off people...that is not right. Please rethink your strategy. And also remember that backing someone with supports is a weak argument. (For the reasons mentioned above)

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wtf "fairly high". His str is terrible and bows have low mt.

And you were accusing us of not providing numbers.He has 23 strength at 20/20, a Silver Bow boosts his attack to 36. An enemy generic unit could have about 16 Defence, that is 20 damage. He has 26 speed as well. This is enough to double a lot of units. 20 times two is 40 damage. Already, we can see that he will easily kill some people. Also, did you know that the MT of bows is about equal to swords (comparing silver items). Not only this, but they beat pathetic piddley widdley knives.

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Doing more damage reliably > doing more damage unreliably.

Don't you see what this means? It means snipers are useful because they can feather their opponent in one shot. I know This might mean it's unreliable, but still, is bound to happen a lot of times. This is what makes him even more useful! His ability to kill things like that and get some good EXP. We don't rely on the crits. We see that as a good added bonus!

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Volke's problem in 13 isn't dying, it's reaching all of the chests in time. All 6 chests are spread out pretty far, and time is very short. Unless you do a massive amount of shoving and whatnot, Volke will NOT reach all 6 in time. I actually had an easier time just having Sothe open a chest or two, and then running to the bottom ship.

This chapter can be done with one thief. It's called avoiding trouble babying Sothe but using 1 or 2 chest keys from other units. With enough effort, Volke can get all the other ones. There's only ever one chapter you need both, and that's chapter 20, when you are in Daein's capitol. However, Reyson can help you here. Looks like you don't need Sothe.

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Yes and that's it. Volke's biggest and really only notable lead over Sothe is that he can a take a few more hits (and has Shade). Both have phail offense, but you are going to use one regardless to open things and steal physics.

No, you only need Volke for this. I feel like I am repeating myself too many times. Volke is the better one. The stats I mentioned above explain why (and the reasons). Accept them and move on. Volke is everything you need.

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You'd also be using one of the 30 or so units who outclass Rolf instead of using Rolf as a fighter.

Rolf is a good unit because of...I'll stop here, you can scroll up and read why. Remeber what I have said about his high speed and skill(27 and 26), and great defence that beats Titania's (20) and his good attack (23)? He also has good Luck (19). The leaves resistance. Not too bad either, 14 is acceptable. He is a great unit, not only does he get a crit bonus (yes I'm aware crit is unreliable, but it is stil very useful), he is also the only good sniper in the game. He is on my top 12 unit (and that doesn't make him number 12 either, I'm just saying if I ever picked 12 units to make a party, he'd be in there).

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Which doesn't really matter since Rolf's offense is phailure until he gains a ton of levels.

Oscar's STR is 6 when he is on level 3. Rolf's STR is 5 on level 1. I'm pretty sure Rolf can compare to Oscar in the long run. It's a tie...both on 23 STR.

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None of the chapters will ever have a large amount of reinforcements (like the swarms you would find in FE7 or 8). Most chapters actually have NONE.

Maybe you ignored the fact that you get a lot in hard mode.

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wtf? He has a 0 spd lead over Kieran and a .5 spd lead over Oscar at 20/1. Actually, he's likely behind them, since they'll be way past 20/1 when Rolf finally hits that level, and both can use the knight ward, which adds +30 to the user's speed growth.

Didn't we already state that using items to determine growths is a bad argument? I could just give a band to Rolf, and change everything! I could give Rolf a Wyvern Band to give 5% to Str. Now it beats Oscar's. See? Now then, here is the facts:

Actually, 50% is remarkable. It would mean you have a half chance of absolutely devastating your enemy. Read the points above I made about why crit is good. Sure, it may be unreliable, but if it works, it devastates your enemy.

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Or you could just use someone who would kill thsoe enemies reliably. A bunch of people have better att than him before he gets Ragnell.

Actually, we was stating that Ike can cut through enemies without a scratch. On the odd occasion when it does activate, he recovers HP (if he has lost any). Aether is an excellent skill.

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Sure. If having good offense had 100 weight, then these crappy instant kills have something like .000000001 weight.

Umm...? How is this meant to make sense?

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Most enemies are not going to reach the group's initial starting point. Actually, I don't think ANY enemy ever will. So Sothe already starts out of range, and since Sothe is not going to fight anything, it's pretty easy to keep him out of range.

...until you move him in range to open chests and steal items from enemies.

As for your last statement, it is completely biased. I have already shown that Rolf has a good speed, yet in almost every example, he isn't double attacking. Now that is a...how you would say...'phail'. (omg pwn't)

Okay, all done. I have sliced all your points. All points...done. It took me ages, but I am done now.

However, he will probably just ignore some points and try and bring them back again. Ones proved wrong before...oh well. I'm done here, I think.