There's A Good Reason Military Medics Train On Live Animals And NOT Dummieshttp://www.businessinsider.com/theres-a-good-reason-field-medics-train-on-live-animals-and-not-dummies-2013-2/comments
en-usWed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 -0500Tue, 03 Mar 2015 18:05:49 -0500Michael Baileyhttp://www.businessinsider.com/c/51199a646bb3f74a47000018WarMed_117Mon, 11 Feb 2013 20:27:00 -0500http://www.businessinsider.com/c/51199a646bb3f74a47000018
The Goats were sedated, and they were euthanized after the procedure. Each goat had a dedicated Vet Tech at the table and there was a veterinarian LTC overseeing the whole procedure. Even when this training was preformed in Iraq by one of the PA's on my first deployment, the Goat was anesthetized.
The "life-like" dummies, are still dummies. They do not scream, grab you, and ask if they're going to live, have "rolling veins", hiss when you relieve a pneumothorax or do any of a hundred other things a real body does. I was trained extensively on such manikins and was totally unprepared for combat in 2004.
It should not be taken lightly, preparing for war. It is something you hope you never have to do, but Soldiers do not get to choose when where against whom or even IF they fight a war. You can either be prepared to fight, or you can be unprepared to fight, but once that first bullet goes zipping past, it's too late to learn lessons you should have known, and whatever politics that might have lead you to your current state do not matter anymore.http://www.businessinsider.com/c/5119466eecad044c3f000004Nathan WilsonMon, 11 Feb 2013 14:28:46 -0500http://www.businessinsider.com/c/5119466eecad044c3f000004
The author of this article never said that the goats received no pain medication. When I completed this training in early 2010, the animals definitely DID receive pain medication. Each animal had a person assigned to it, and they were specifically monitoring the goat's vital signs and administering anesthesia. When we finished our procedures on the animals, they were quickly and painlessly euthanized. We were taught to respect the animals that gave their lives so we could learn from them.
I learned things I could not have learned from a dummy.
In response to the comment about lifelike human simulators: Those simulators are nowhere near real enough. I was trained with one of those in medic school, a few years before TC3, and because it was obvious it was not really alive, it just didn't have the same impact. Saving a life requires not being afraid to squeeze tightly on a bleeding stump, and knowing you need to look everywhere on the body for a vein big enough to hit with a needle. Whereas on a simulator, you need to be extra careful around it because it costs so much money.http://www.businessinsider.com/c/5115734269beddb877000009EthanCooperFri, 08 Feb 2013 16:50:58 -0500http://www.businessinsider.com/c/5115734269beddb877000009
I think the author is overlooking one very crucial, lifesaving point. Animal advocates and anyone who opposes live goats being hacked apart with tree trimmers while they are still completely conscious and moaning are asking for the military to switch to the superior, life-like human simulators that are already in use in many military programs in the US and abroad. Much like the Annie dolls used to train people on CPR, which have saved countless lives, these advanced simulators are so realistic that they bleed, talk, respirate, and die. And soldiers can practice on them again and again until they are completely comfortable with the procedure, not just once as with a live animal. It is not necessary for us to inflict pain and suffering and kill in order to prevent pain and suffering and save lives, so why would we?http://www.businessinsider.com/c/511534996bb3f70579000003KellyFri, 08 Feb 2013 12:23:37 -0500http://www.businessinsider.com/c/511534996bb3f70579000003
While I love animals, I do believe they are for our use, whether we eat them, wear them, or harness their power. It does make me squeamish to think about injuring/killing animals for study, but the purpose is practical, and so necessary. What it comes down to is that if our medic troops can use this to save lives, then it's a soldier's life over a goat's life any day. Any day. Thank you, troops, for the service you do.http://www.businessinsider.com/c/5114d8076bb3f7af49000018GeorgeFri, 08 Feb 2013 05:48:39 -0500http://www.businessinsider.com/c/5114d8076bb3f7af49000018
Dude, stop trying to frame this as if it is a good thing. War is never good, training for war is never good. We against them and them against us never brought anything good into this world.http://www.businessinsider.com/c/51145836eab8ea2261000014thefuture22Thu, 07 Feb 2013 20:43:18 -0500http://www.businessinsider.com/c/51145836eab8ea2261000014
Don't worry, in 5 or 6 years, once the economic collapse has taken place, you'll be able to replace the goats with people from the prison system.
I mean, we must maximize the ability to learn and save lives and nothing would be better than practicing on a live human.
So in about 5 years or so you'll be able to order up a couple dozen prisoners, shoot them in the neck and then practice saving them.
The only downside is that the military industrial complex will have to fight with the pharmaceutical industrial complex for access to the prisoners, since they will want to use them to test drugs also. Although you could always test the drugs on them first and THEN shoot them in the neck and try to save them.
All i know is a lot of lab rats and goats are going to be happen when the system finally collapses.http://www.businessinsider.com/c/5114569b69beddfd44000011LauraThu, 07 Feb 2013 20:36:27 -0500http://www.businessinsider.com/c/5114569b69beddfd44000011
does that make it ok to be inhumane, the animals were given no pain medication, not put under Anastasia, had limbs broken, cut up without even a local. this is cruelty and show absolute zero compassion.http://www.businessinsider.com/c/51144e0a69beddfe31000009Donald SensingThu, 07 Feb 2013 19:59:54 -0500http://www.businessinsider.com/c/51144e0a69beddfe31000009
Combat training cannot be merely difficult. It must be as realistic and hard as possible. The ancient Roman generals boasted that their exercises were bloodless battles and their battles simply bloody exercises. They also told their troops, "The more you sweat in peace, the less you bleed in war." Still true today.