Another good malkorok 10n parse, hopefully we will get it down on hc this week and i will have something good to show for heroic malkorok.I think I can improve it a bit more messed up a sdance to malkork turning randomly to do the frontal cone and me noticing it too late, cant wait for WoD for the behind the boss requirement going away.http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ch...e/?s=144&e=279

What about being ranked on Malkorok HC ?
Especially when you are in progress on it. Rogue brings way more than DPS during this encounter. Soaking void and balls. If you want to get rank you need someone else to do the dirty work, but rogue are the best melee to do it.

What about being ranked on Malkorok HC ?
Especially when you are in progress on it. Rogue brings way more than DPS during this encounter. Soaking void and balls. If you want to get rank you need someone else to do the dirty work, but rogue are the best melee to do it.

Its your raid leader's call, mine lets me sit on boss and tunnel, while spriest soaks the balls, and a ret takes the melee voids. I was at 410k on our closest attempt (11%).

Hey bromo, I recently switched to sub for farm for fun and I have seen your logs before. They are quite impressive. Do you pop SB SD right away or do you wait for FW to almost fall off then start SB SD? I was just curious because I have seen rogues do it both ways. Thanks in advance.

Hey bromo, I recently switched to sub for farm for fun and I have seen your logs before. They are quite impressive. Do you pop SB SD right away or do you wait for FW to almost fall off then start SB SD? I was just curious because I have seen rogues do it both ways. Thanks in advance.

I do the same as Cytoma mentioned above. I tend not to worry about FW at all during the start of a fight. I have found it more beneficial to pop all CDs immediately after subterfuge drops since you will have sleight of hand up with your SD/SB/Trinket. You will output far more dps with your AP nearly doubled from your trinkets/other procs at the start.

Thank you very much guys, that makes a lot of sense I forgot about that Master of subtlety as well. Also as far as rupture is concerned, do you guys keep rupture up as much as possible unless FW is about to fall off and a FW eviscerate would outweigh the rupture? Sorry for all the questions, but I feel these small details aren't mentioned in too many places, but make a solid difference in dps. Thanks!

If you have a 5 point ready and 1 sec on FW I usually go ahead and eviscerate. Combo points regenerate quickly as sub with honor among thieves so the downtime if rupture was also at say 1 second will be minimal. I haven't looked too much into this, so take it as my personal opinion.

awesome that makes a lot of sense, but otherwise you keep rupture up even during a FW when FW is gonna be up for a bit right? Also during SD if hemo falls off and assuming you have rupture up, you just wait till you are out of SD right because a FW ambush is greater than a FW hemo I believe? I know these are nit picky questions, but I feel like I don't know where else to look.

I was not refreshing rupture during FW at all at one point and then changed that after reading some things and found it to be a gain worth keep up as much as possible, with the exceptions of either 2 ticks of rupture (4s) left in FW or when the rupture will not last full duration. I found through testing that the gain from a noncrit Evis with FW over non-FW is worth almost equal to 2 ticks of rupture, one crit and one noncrit as I run with over 50% crit in raid. If I skip 2 ticks of rupture uptime or less and pop an evis it will be a gain even if small. During dance it should be all Ambush spam and Finishers, just get the Hemo up in the 10s after dance is over but FW is still up.

Wow that answered a lot, thank you. You guys just refresh Slice when its needed right you don't cut a previous one short before some FW uptime just to try and not refresh it during FW right? My thought is with relentless strikes SnD costs nothing so you don't lose energy and you will have to spend those cps anyway whether before or during FW so I think it is just better to refresh it like normal no matter what state you are in, correct?

I'd refresh when there is 2s left or less on it as a general rule regardless what else I am doing.The idea is to get the max uptime out of the combo points going into SnD so you are using as few as possible for that maintenance buff, so that the rest of your combos are all spent on damage. Certain situations may dictate when it might be ok to clip it a little. One example specifically is at the end of shadow dance when it only costs 25 energy and you would have to refresh during FW either way, using it during the dance and saving that 10 energy by delaying an evis until after dance while FW is still up, may let you get another ambush off which then would be a clear gain. Also refreshing a little early before using a potion means that all of your combo points during the potion uptime will be going to damage as well, where a potioned 5pt evis is a large gain over having to use those combos to refresh SnD. I'm not advocating to always refresh early in that case though, I'm saying if you have probably 5s or less then its ok to clip a little. Refreshing at like 15 though basically wastes combos you've previously used and so then it offsets the potion gain. If you get to choose when you are using a potion (if lust is on pull then you get to pick when best time to pot is later in fight), definitely wait until just after you've refreshed it and then build some combos so you get as many finishes off during the potion as possible. But all that said, we're talking somewhat small gains here and just refreshing when its about to expire is not going to hurt your damage compared to refreshing too early or letting it fall off for any significant amount of time would.

That is what I figured. So you always wanna use 5 point finishers if possible to get the full use out of relentless strikes. Again guys thanks for all the help. It is really hard to compare Iron Jugernaut logs because sometimes uptimes are all over the place and the dps is still high, but I guess with Sub it's more about using the right builders and finishers when you are in SD and/or in FW rather than keeping hemo and rupture up at all costs. Thanks again!

If I said something that mislead you my apologies, but keeping up sanguinary veins is as important as snd. Now you dont have to keep both hemo and rupture up at all times (you should try but with the situations already discussed one or the other can be down for a short period of time) but you must always have one up for sanguinary veins and that would take priority. If you have to clip hemo to make sure SV doesnt fall off before dancing/getting a rupture back up, then do it, its cheap, gives a combo point, and maintains SV and the loss on clipping is minor in comparison to the loss of having no SV up.

Oh no, when I said " rather than keeping hemo and rupture up at all costs", I meant it as both of their uptimes combined being more import than anything else. I know SV is very critical, but as you said, as long as one is up on the target at all times, there are 2 situations in which one can fall for a bit as long as the other is on for SV. Those being the cases of hemo falling off during SD(assuming rupture is up) and the last 2 ticks of rupture aka 4 seconds of FW letting rupture drop to do a FW eviscerate and the nredo rupture after(assuming hemo is up). Do you take the vanish glyph? Is is that big of a gain? Because I run with it and after I vanish and use ambush it just feels clunky for the next 5 seconds and I usually just end up doing a normal rotation just with ambush in place of BS.