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Funny. I have the same feeling about every single one of your posts. This one is no exception.

Sacrificed on the altar to the gods Me, Myself and I. It's not the baby that's important to cherish and protect; it's the "woman's choice."

It "wasn't an issue" because (a) it wasn't performed often, (b) those that did perform abortions were on the desperate fringe, and (c) when they were performed, it was hidden away.

But your post, Willyboy, is your typical Grade A nincompoopery.

Why would he, pray tell? Why would you even think that even crossed his mind? How braindead are you, Willy, to criticize meg's post for being stupid and then follow that up with your own personal brand of stupidity?

Looks like Fag Boy has no reply to your post. He needs to get busy sewing quilts.

Absolutely fascinating: The principal pillars of Baalism were 1) child sacrifice, 2) sexual immorality (both heterosexual and homosexual), and 3) pantheism (reverence of creation over the Creator).Wow! Hits the nail right on the head . . .

Spot on if you ask me. Abortion is sacraficing a fetus's life in order for one to have an easier life. Isn't that the reason for abortion? A person aborts their offspring in order to avoid taking care of it and spending money on it and changing their lifestyle because of it. Abortion is ritualistic in nature. One goes to the priest/shamam (doctor), pledges tribute (pays the medical costs) and then a ceremony is performed that enhances the seekers life by sacrificing their child in a ritual (abortion procedure).

The sexual immorality condoned and approved by liberals is evident in their mantras of "free love", "if it feels good do it", "love the one your with" and the ever popular "why don't we get drunk and screw"

Want to argue about the deism and pantheism of liberals. Go look at those new age and wicca sites. I can pretty much guarantee you that those aren't conservatives buying all the healing crystals and shakra straighteners.

Last edited by FlaGator; 12-22-2008 at 07:25 PM.

Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level then beat you with experience.

Spot on if you ask me. Abortion is sacraficing a fetus's life in order for one to have an easier life. Isn't that the reason for abortion? A person aborts their offspring in order to avoid taking care of it and spending money on it and changing their lifestyle because of it.

Cmon Fla... I didnt think you would stoop to these ridiculous equivocations. I credited you for being more intellectually honest that this.

Again do we have to draw a picture? Burning, crawling, crying babies alive in ritual sacrifices to appease the gods.. or the early termination of a pregnancy of a fetus that by all rational explanation, cannot be defined as a person (except through superstitions of 'imbued souls'). Even remotely similar? No feats of logic can make it so.

Abortion is ritualistic in nature. One goes to the priest/shamam (doctor), pledges tribute (pays the medical costs) and then a ceremony is performed that enhances the seekers life by sacrificing their child in a ritual (abortion procedure).

By that logic, anything that has a procedure is a 'ritual'.

The sexual immorality condoned and approved by liberals is evident in their mantras of "free love", "if it feels good do it", "love the one your with" and the ever popular "why don't we get drunk and screw"

Please, illustrate the culture of 'orgies for crops' that is pervasive in a significant political movement today. I am happy to take up cause with those in the left wing in stamping out dogmatic, impractical sexual rules... but that doesn't make me or the left devoid of sexual morality. You are confusing 60's era sexual revolution 'free love' crap with today's platform of complete sex education (ie, b/c + abstinence).... and confusing it even further with religious ritual.

And once again, we look back at what the Baalists supposedly did... which were again ritualistic orgies for religious reasons... still no real connection.

What to argeu about the deism and pantheism of liberals. Go look at those new age and wicca sites. I can pretty much guarantee you that those aren't convervatives buying all the healing crystals and shakra straighteners.

There's nothing wrong with pantheism and deism (unless, like theism, you give them more credence than they deserve)..... but the article tries to relate these ideas to the Canaanites. There was nothing pantheistic there at all. The comparison is a sham.

Actually if you look more into Baalsm, you'll find there really isnt much if any record of them actually engaging in these practices, except for typical propaganda stories and rumors that many disparate cults and tribes spread around about each other in those days.

Cmon Fla... I didnt think you would stoop to these ridiculous equivocations. I have you credit for being more intellectually honest that this.

Again do we have to draw a picture? Burning, crawling, crying babies alive in ritual sacrifices to appease the gods.. or the early termination of a pregnancy of a fetus that by all rational explanation, cannot be defined as a person (except through superstitions of 'imbued souls'). Even remotely similar? No feats of logic can make it so.

By that logic, anything that has a procedure is a 'ritual'.

The only difference is that the god that they sacrifice their children to is the god of self. The self is more important than anything... including a child that they had a willing part in creating.

What is the rational explanation of most abortions? What purpose do most abortions serve?

Originally Posted by wilbur

Please, illustrate the culture of 'orgies for crops' that is pervasive in a significant political movement today. I am happy to take up cause with those in the left wing in stamping out dogmatic, impractical sexual rules... but that doesn't make me, or the general attitude of free love. You are confusing 60's era sexual revolution 'free love' crap with today's platform of complete sex education (ie, b/c + abstinence).

And once again, we look back at what the Baalists supposedly did... which were again ritualistic orgies for religious reasons... still no real connection.

I wasn't implying orgies or anything like that, but to give you something to consider think about what the potential negative out comes are for non monogamous, multi partner sex over an extended period of time. I'm not talking about orgies, I'm talking about general everyday casual sex. What are the positive outcomes?
Apply the same questions to married monogamous commited sexaul conduct between a man and a woman who wish to spend their lives together?

As for impratical sexual rules.. what is impractical about them. Warning I am baiting you in to a trap so be care with your answer.

Originally Posted by wilbur

There's nothing wrong with pantheism and deism (unless, like theism, you give them more credence than they deserve)..... but the article tries to relate these ideas to the Canaanites.

Actually if you look more into Baalsm, you'll find there really isnt much if any record of them actually engaging in these practices, except for typical propaganda stories and rumors that many disparate cults and tribes spread around about each other.

The point is not whether they are right or wrong but do they go hand in hand with the worship of Baal. Which they do. You really should read more than just stuff that agrees with your view. Hell, watch a couple of episodes of the Naked Archaelogist where he delves in to child sacrifice and Baal worship. Interesting linkages between the person of Jezebel and her ties to child sacrifice.

Last edited by FlaGator; 12-22-2008 at 08:21 PM.

Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level then beat you with experience.

The only difference is that the god that they sacrifice their children to is the god of self. The self is more important than anything... including a child that they had a willing to part in creating.

You misuse the term 'child'.

What is the rational explanation of most abortions? What purpose do most abortions serve?

Most abortions are for economic reasons. Most recipients are already in abject poverty, and abort out of necessity. Feel free to tell them that they simply cannot have sex till they aren't poor any more... throw as many Bibles at them as you can, I don't expect it to do much good. You'd be better off throwing them packs of condoms and a book on STD's.

I wasn't implying orgies or anything like that, but to give you something to consider think about what the potential negative out comes are for non monogamous, multi partner sex over an extended period of time. I'm not talking about orgies, I'm talking about general everyday casual sex. What are the positive outcomes?

Pregnancy and disease are the negative outcomes. Both can be easily avoided.

Apply the same questions to married monogamous commited sexaul conduct between a man and a woman who wish to spend their lives together?

The same.

As for impratical sexual rules.. what is impractical about them. Warning I baiting you in to a trap so be care with your answer.

They are impractical because you have no hope of significantly changing man's behaviour. You might as well make it your mission to convert the entire world to vegan. The rules become more impractical when you examine them with one another... Christian sexual morals come with its own positive feedback system. The de-emphasis, or outright taboo on B/C will not ensure that there are less out of wedlock pregnancies and STD's... but ensure that more abortions are necessary, or possibly push people into riskier behaviour such as anal sex (saw a recent article on this).

The point is not whether they are right or wrong but do the go hand in hand with the worship of Baal. Which they do. You really should read more than just stuff that agrees with you view. Hell, watch a couple of episodes of the Naked Archaelogist where he delves in to child sacrifice and Baal worship. Interesting linkages between the person of Jezebel and her ties to child sacrifice.

So should you... the article wasnt talking so much about crystal gazing loons, but environmentalism. In what way is Baalism of the Canaanites/Phonecians pantheistic/deistic?

Most abortions are for economic reasons. Most recipients are already in abject poverty, and abort out of necessity. Feel free to tell them that they simply cannot have sex till they aren't poor any more... throw as many Bibles at them as you can, I don't expect it to do much good. You'd be better off throwing them packs of condoms and a book on STD's.

The embryo will develop in to a child just as a carrot seed will develop in to a carrot one planted. To uproot the developing carrot is to kill it. To up root the developing child is to kill it. To intensionally kill it is to murder it. What you are saying here is that economic reasons are satisfactory for the termination of the development of a human being. And you believe Christians are backwards. You advocate the termination of a developing human because of monetary concerns. Abortion proves that we as a race have become so selfish in our behavior that we think of no one else when our own behavior causes us inconviences. Sacrifice the developing life for the sake of convienence... sad.

Originally Posted by wilbur

Pregnancy and disease are the negative outcomes. Both can be easily avoided.

Throw in adultery and you now have broken marriages, fatherless or motherless children, economic duress, and a multitude of other things that these situations lead to.

Originally Posted by wilbur

The same.

Wrong again. If you are a virgin and your spouse is one two and you stay true to each other there may be pregnancies but no diseases and no broken families due to sexual misconduct.

Originally Posted by wilbur

They are impractical because you have no hope of significantly changing man's behaviour. You might as well make it your mission to convert the entire world to vegan. The rules become more impractical when you examine them with one another... Christian sexual morals come with its own positive feedback system. The de-emphasis, or outright taboo on B/C will not ensure that there are less out of wedlock pregnancies and STD's... but ensure that more abortions are necessary, or possibly push people into riskier behaviour such as anal sex (saw a recent article on this).

We can seem to stop all the murders so why bother. Just because something happens doens't mean we have to condone it because we can't stop it. Social shame for out of wedlock pregnancies. Only medically necessary abortions. No abortions as after the fact contraception, you live and care for the creation of your choices. You misunderstand me if you think I feel this can end poor sexual behavior. It can't, but it can reduce the number of occurrences.

Originally Posted by wilbur

So should you... the article wasnt talking so much about crystal gazing loons, but environmentalism. In what way is Baalism of the Canaanites/Phonecians pantheistic/deistic?

I read lots of books that run counter to my believes. I do this for two reasons. 1) to see where my facts are wrong. 2) To test my opinions against the opinion of others. I am very will versed in Ba'alism. However, I misread what you were saying about ba'alism not being connected to environmentalism. You are exactly right and I apologize for the misunderstanding. Ba'al was another name for a god of gods named Hadad. This is not the same Ba'al that the bible refers to. That Ba'al was a fertility god of the ancient middle east. The older Hadad may be referenced by some new age environmental groups but I can't find anything absolute.

Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level then beat you with experience.

There's simply not enough facepalm in the world for the stupid contained in this article.

Abortion = child sacrifice?! You just have to laugh at this magnanimous stupid... words can't begin to describe it. Perhaps this fool should research the history of abortion within the orthodoxy... it simply wasn't an issue for a very very long time.

Honestly megs.. this article is even crazy for you...

Let's hope the author doesn't call for the same treatment of our fellow countrymen that was inflicted upon the Baalist Canaanites..

Of course, the current batch of Baal worshippers simply deny the personhood of the child that is ripped to pieces inside the mother and then sucked into a BioHazard bag. This is no way changes the fact of painful sacrifice of children...it merely makes it less visible and easier to deny. The child, God and Satan all know full well how horrible abortion is...and those that doubt it will learn eventually.

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In actual dollars, President Obama’s $4.4 trillion in deficit spending in just three years is 37 percent higher than the previous record of $3.2 trillion (held by President George W. Bush) in deficit spending for an entire presidency. It’s no small feat to demolish an 8-year record in just 3 years.

Under Obama’s own projections, interest payments on the debt are on course to triple from 2010 (his first budgetary year) to 2018, climbing from $196 billion to $685 billion annually.

The embryo will develop in to a child just as a carrot seed will develop in to a carrot one planted. To uproot the developing carrot is to kill it. To up root the developing child is to kill it. To intensionally kill it is to murder it. What you are saying here is that economic reasons are satisfactory for the termination of the development of a human being. And you believe Christians are backwards. You advocate the termination of a developing human because of monetary concerns. Abortion proves that we as a race have become so selfish in our behavior that we think of no one else when our own behavior causes us inconviences. Sacrifice the developing life for the sake of convienence... sad.

It might help to think about a fetus on its own terms, not in the terms of vegetables (but hey thats tempting!). This is simply one area where the pro-life side has relied upon forceful, emotive verbiage to do the talking for them... it hides a pittance of an argument that really loses is zeal once you start talking about things honestly and plainly.. after removing the window dressing of terms like 'murderer','slaughter'... and of course.. the article simply is the new reigning champ with its comparison to ritual child sacrifice. When you have to enter the realm of rational discourse armed with 'well they have a soul and stuff'.. its clear why the over the top verbiage must be used.

It is scientifically demonstrable that almost everything that truly makes us a person, an autonomous being, is our cognition... our brain. It is demonstrable that abortion harms nothing, causes no suffering or pain.. unless there are complications for the mother. It is factually demonstrable that abortion violates no ones autonomy/free will. These things are demonstrable with objective scientific facts, not whimsical fancies of some elusive soul entering fetus during conception (where in the nucleus does it hide?). There simply is no use in bothering ourselves over 'beings' that never had an iota of consciousness.

The nation nearly unanimously agrees that late-term babies, are actually babies and that late-term abortions are bad, so we can ignore those circumstances.

Wrong again. If you are a virgin and your spouse is one two and you stay true to each other there may be pregnancies but no diseases and no broken families due to sexual misconduct.

Its a mistake to equate 'sexual misconduct' with modern secular sexual ethics.. adultery and irresponsible behaviour is not really part of responsible and safe sex agendas.

We can seem to stop all the murders so why bother. Just because something happens doens't mean we have to condone it because we can't stop it. Social shame for out of wedlock pregnancies. Only medically necessary abortions. No abortions as after the fact contraception, you live and care for the creation of your choices.

Lets see... extreme social shame... no abortions... no morning after pill... discourages contraception... what could possibly go wrong? All those teens you imagine being nice and ashamed and accepting of the consequences for their indiscretions will actually be visiting the shady doctor in the back alley with a coat-hanger instead telling mom and visiting the confessional.

You misunderstand me if you think I feel this can end poor sexual behavior. It can't, but it can reduce the number of occurrences.

I think you are mistaken if you think so. Contraception reduces the number of abortions necessary. Illegality simply compounds the problems. Abortion rates are declining because of more effective contraception.