One thing I noticed upon second viewing, I got the impression that, in the last sequence, Asuka was about to walk away by herself and leave "gaki Shinji" there to his own devices, but finally decided to go back and fetch him (follows scene of her pulling him out of the entry plug and comically stretching his face).

"People need more stfu in their diets." (NemZ)"It was brainf@rt at first sight." [LiLi on Romance, II]

LiLi wrote:One thing I noticed upon second viewing, I got the impression that, in the last sequence, Asuka was about to walk away by herself and leave "gaki Shinji" there to his own devices, but finally decided to go back and fetch him (follows scene of her pulling him out of the entry plug and comically stretching his face).

There seems to be a thread of people "needing" Shinji even though they "hate" him. Like, they know he's the only one with truly legendary heroic powers. That's why in desperation, Asuka asked Shinji for help at the beginning of the film. Like a prayer of some kind. It just happened to get answered because he was actually there.

But maybe I'm pulling that out of my ass.

"The closer you resemble a samurai, the higher your chances for survival." -Carl Sagan (What the!?)

A reminder: speculation goes into the relevant thread(s)- such as this one. Observations about the film and questions about scenes go here.

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The thing is that movie 2 ends with Misato shouting at Shinji to save her. There was no way for him to know he'd trigger a Third Impact. Plus, when he woke up dude didn't knew what happened. Last thing he remembers is saving the girl like a boss, he wakes up and everybody hates him without telling him ANYTHING, not even that 14 years passed since then. And then, without further ado, they put an explosive collar around his neck in case of. WTF.

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I thought I'd clear up a few things described in the various transcripts posted in the thread:

- Eva 01 is with Wille, acting as the power source for the Wunter or whatever's the name. - Eva 06 was abandoned in Central Dogma during Third Impact (further confirming that the 2.22 "preview" events are actually what happened during the 14 years timeskip). - Eva 13, thus, is totally new and not a combination of anything like I read in some places. Wille caught its signal as soon as Kaworu and Shinji activated it.

- There's absolutely no indication of what's left of humanity beside Wille (and not just their ship, they have like a whole fleet) and NERV (which is just Gendo and Fuyutsuki + Rei clone). If the 2.22 preview is anything to go by though, it would means a lot of people survived though, since NERV was officially shut down and everything.

- Kaworu was indeed killed by the necklace (which means Misato), definitely not the lances self-stabbing (the goal there was to stop unit 13 and the Fourth Impact btw)

- Kaworu's goal was to use the two lances (Cassius and Longinus) to create a kind of new impact that would the restore the world to its previous state, in order to bring Shinji the happiness he "deserves". But once they reached Central Dogma, he noticed something was wrong with Lilith and then that the two lances were actually the same. He ponders about what it means while Shinji pilots unit 13 by himself against Asuka's 02 Kai, and seem to come a conclusion. He asks Shinji to stop everything, but being totally engrossed by the perspective of things going back to the way they were, Shinji doesn't listen to him, Asuka nor Mari, and takes the lances. He starts a Fourth Impact as intended by Gendo, stopped by Kaworu self-stabbing unit 13 with the lance and dying.

- Gendo is still working with (rather than for) SEELE. They're not answering him throughout the movie though. When the Fourth Impact starts in the last part of the movie, he goes back to them and "kill" them: their souls are actually into the stone things, which used a power source. Gendo does a speech while Fuyutsuki powers down each member one by one. Gendo thanks them for guiding humanity this far and say humans owe culture and everything they have to them. Before "dying", the N°1 SEELE member says that everyone went down as they wanted.

- What happened to Rei II is a mystery. When Shinji asks Ritsuko, she says they thoroughly checked Eva 01 and could only find him, there is/was nobody else inside. Later in the movie, when Rei (III?) begins to doubt there's something's wrong with her (she definitely doesn't realize she's a clone at first), we see her visiting another Rei in a tub. It may just be me, but the other Rei stroke me as more emotional and I wondered if that wasn't Rei II.

And yet, we see them Asuka and I believe Mari get new plugsuits in the course of the film, the events of which seems to be about a day or two. So, yeah, I don't get it either. Any info on why/how those two get new plugsuits mid-film?

Seele00TextOnly wrote:And yet, we see them Asuka and I believe Mari get new plugsuits in the course of the film, the events of which seems to be about a day or two. So, yeah, I don't get it either. Any info on why/how those two get new plugsuits mid-film?

Eva-01's Fruit of Life, providing unlimited energy along with unlimited energy→mass conversion, lets Wille finally hook up the replicator that Hyuga made from old ham radios during college.

I'm a little confused regarding Mari's role in the ending. I've seen various comments here and there pointing out things like her somehow stopping Fourth Impact, potentially being left behind in the wreckage (or alternately being rescued offscreen by Wille?) But how does it all fit together? It's hard to make sense of what clearly was a very chaotic sequence without actually seeing it.

Blue [s]Dream[/s] Monday, or anyone else who can help me out with this, is there anything you can tell us about the 12th Angel? Finding details about that thing is a bitch. I've been relying on a description from a single source for quite some time now. (Most folks I've asked don't seem to have enough of an idea of what the hell they've seen to really elaborate.)

So just to clarify, the 4 Angels we get in 3.0 are those 2(?) Nemesis Series Angels (one from first 6 minutes and one that attacks Wunder), the 12th Angel (corrupted Mark.06 or 09 or something?) and the 13th Angel (Kaworu)?

And the Nemesis Series are manmade Angels (Seele interference???) compared to the actual Angels?

Really makes me curious what happened to the 11th but either it was dealt with during time skip or will be addressed in 3.33 BD/DVD (maybe?) or it'll be mentioned in Final. I'd hope for something like that, at least.

Anyway, I'd love to expand on this informative thread http://forum.evageeks.org/thread/13490/MASSIVE-SPOILERS-Explanation-of-Evangelion-30/ , but it's hard when we don't have a lot of information at the moment. Really want to add more info about Angels and Evas so any confusion would be lessened. (At least I'm not clear on what's the deal with any of that!)

Sailor Star Dust wrote:So just to clarify, the 4 Angels we get in 3.0 are those 2(?) Nemesis Series Angels (one from first 6 minutes and one that attacks Wunder), the 12th Angel (corrupted Mark.06 or 09 or something?) and the 13th Angel (Kaworu)?

The Mark.09's "corrupted" form is a Seele safeguard, I'm sure - Not the 12th Angel. The 12th was within[?] Mark.06 and fused with Lilith, then Evangelion 13.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking when I was watching it. Like I mentioned to you in that PM, I think the Nemesis Series are possible remains of the 11th, weaponised by Seele/Nerv. That's just what I put together in my head though.

Sailor Star Dust wrote:Anyway, I'd love to expand on this informative thread http://forum.evageeks.org/thread/13490/MASSIVE-SPOILERS-Explanation-of-Evangelion-30/ , but it's hard when we don't have a lot of information at the moment. Really want to add more info about Angels and Evas so any confusion would be lessened. (At least I'm not clear on what's the deal with any of that!)

Heh. Don't know if I could really provide anything useful unfortunately, aside from what I wrote earlier in our discussion the other day.

Kendrix wrote:Shinji's prison cell on the Wunder. Discribe it to me.

Okay, so Shinji doesn't really have a prison cell on the Wunder per se. First we see of him on there, he's just been salvaged from Unit-01. He comes to on a medical gurney, being wheeled down a hall. He has the choker on and he is strapped down heavily by a device on the gurney. Then we see him in an elevator on this same gurney, guards in the four corners of the room with their guns trained on him, dead-on (As if he were some incredibly dangerous, vicious animal. Think something out of Silence of the Lambs/Hannibal Lecter). He's then brought before the crew/Misato in the bridge, unbound.

After that scene, he's in a holding room with Sakura. One wall is perspex[?] glass, with Misato and Ritsu on the other side. There doesn't seem to be much in this holding room. A bed and chair, maybe. They can pass objects to him though through the perspex. They can also flick a switch turning said perspex wall opaque. Pretty much all we see up to when Rei Q busts him out and he leaves with her.