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Re: Redwing update

yes, have been through all of Arne's stuff.
Strangely, I've only ever read about problems with the Hasler-Macleod design. No windward performance when more than a few panels are reefed, it all weather vanes behind the mast. There's a chap I'm in contact with cruising the Atlantic now who also has that complaint. I'm sticking with Reddish and closely following the junks shown in Hong Kong photos on that website you posted.

My Badger hull is mostly planked. Its looking pretty spiffy at the moment.

Re: Redwing update

ok, I wasn't having a go about your choice of design, was wanting to know about the pros & cons. I'll be mindful of how the battens stack as they are reefed.
Re my hull: I'll have to get pics of it, its under cover right now.

Re: Redwing update

I didn't think you were. I had planned to use the Fenix rig but was talked out of it because of the batten problem. It seems there are 3 variants on the Hasler/MacLeod rig. 1 is the standard design as in the book, panels cut flat. 2 is the with the panels cut flat but fitted with hinged battens and 3, the one I'm going with is straight battens but the panels have 8% camber cut into them.
There is a design in develpment where a slot is cut vertically in each panel at the mast. All panels have camber cut into them. This will explain it better than I can.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/junkri.../Split%20Junk/

Re: Redwing update

not traditional looking enough...

I read one of Colvin's books back in the 80s, unfortunately I was still hooked on the Western sloop rig. I decided against the junk rig at the time for much the same reason. I SHOULD have read Annie Hill's book Voyaging on a small Income instead...but I didn't know about it.

Re: Redwing update

Originally Posted by WX

I read one of Colvin's books back in the 80s, unfortunately I was still hooked on the Western sloop rig. I decided against the junk rig at the time for much the same reason. I SHOULD have read Annie Hill's book Voyaging on a small Income instead...but I didn't know about it.

Well you couldn't, it wasn't published till 2001.
FWIW I also have Van Loan's "Design and Build your own Junk Rig", (which predates PJR), which I might use. My mind changes every month...

Re: Redwing update

it wasn't published till 2001.

Actually the copy I have here was published in 1993 but what you say still stands..it wasn't around in the 80s. Unfortunately in the 90s my sailing dream took a big nosedive due to a relationship I was in, but that's another story. Which ever style you adopt I would strongly recommend that you either build in camber in your panels or use hinged battens. Both have been properly tested at sea and will give you better performance than flat cut panels.

Re: Redwing update

the camber is easy to put in when you make the sail just take a dart at each batten.
the hinged battens are a bit more difficult. me I plan on putting in some camber and the gurney flap. the camber just for the small performance boost and the gurney flap cause it reduces the chance of hang ups and adds performance. both are easy to do on home built sails so there seems to be no down side.

Re: Redwing update

The 24' sloop we sail now always has a foot or more camber in the sails regardless of how tight its sheeted, reefed or not, pretty silly to make a junk sail without it. Hinged battens probably makes the best shape, just dont think i can trust hinges of my own making..
Anyway, final decision on sail plan is a long way off, yet to finish the hull (laminated another 2 sheets today).

Re: Redwing update

Two year won't be enough. A bamboo stem will reach full height in a season but won't be ready to use for two to three years. I will probably use bamboo for my battens as I have it growing here, I should get them cut so they have enough time to season. I will use a timber yard and boom.
2MT, I will be cutting the camber in as I make my sail. Instead of cutting the top and bottom of the panel straight you cut them in a curve to set measurements. This is all based on the work done by Arne Kverneland, Norway. My rig was actually designed by another Norwegian.

Re: Redwing update

Hmm Kverneland I will look him up.

I put the camber in my own and it worked out well with the darts.
always more for me to learn. I would not have thought of curving the top and bottom cut. Have you decided on a fabric for the sail itself?

Erica and I where talking today about some different options. I think i see a trip to the discount fabric store in our future.

Re: Redwing update

Odyssey III, I can get it in burgundy (pretend tanbark) for around $19.50 a linear metre here in Oz.
Here's a link to the Junkrig forum, you will find Arne's files...underFiles.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/junkrig/

Re: Redwing update

We where thinking a jewel tone color fast satin brocade. its a junk rig so we thought it would be fun to play a little. Our last one was made from a canvas paint tarp. I was also thinking of treating another paint tarp sail with Linseed oil and see how that works.

Re: Redwing update

Its fun to tinker a bit

Pete Hill rigged a Freedom junkrig Ketch with polytarp sails. Reddish made his sail design from a polytarp for his boat and sailed it around Britain. No worries. I will be making mine sometime this year and I'm looking forward to it.

Re: Redwing update

ok, I may have to try source some grown bamboo.
Last year in Bali, we came across some large bamboos hanging on a wall on the beach, they were outrigger sticks for their trad outrigged canoe boats.
They were approx 10 metres long and 20 to 25cm diameter, about the size of the mast I need. I calculated a staved or birdsmouth mast made from oregon would weigh 70 to 80kg. But I could pick this huge bamboo with one hand, no more than 7 or 8kg. Astounding!
Too bad its too big to fit on a plane..

Re: Redwing update

Working on the cockpit engine access hatch. This hatch actually gives me access to the stuffing box etc...or will when it's all installed.
This photo was taken a while back.
Framing the coaming.

This shows the...not quite sure what you call them, other than coamings or weather stops. Anyway the bits that actually stop the water from getting in

I have since shaped sanded it all back and made the hatch cover but the camera went flat on me...bloody modern technology. Sometimes I think I should dust off the old SLR, though these days I'd probably have trouble finding somewhere to get the film processed.
I haven't settled on a method of dogging the hatch down yet..it will be low tech anyway.

Re: Redwing update

Gary, yes it is raised and yes it does make the cockpit sole a bit complex. I really don't want to rip out the whole cockpit and do it again...though it may well happen sometime down the track. I realised that for anyone shorter than me they were going to have trouble bracing themselves while steering and the quickest way around it was to raise the height of the hatch.
I've been working on this boat for too many years now to go back and do stuff again, I just want to get it in the water. Once I've sailed a bit and seen what works and what doesn't I probably won't mind doing a few changes and mostly likely will as I'm not happy with the size of the cockpit. It's too deep. The small rectangular opening will hold the fuel tank.

Re: Redwing update

A set of hinges on one face of the hatch that will allow the cover to come off when rotated beyong 90 degrees, with a soft refrigerator door seal all around, and cam lock fasteners on the opposite side....will allow a screwdriver to twist a few turns to release, then lift for inspection, or continue to lift and then remove the lid as required.

Wakan Tanka Kici Un
..a bad day sailing is a heckuva lot better than the best day at work.....
Fighting Illegal immigration since 1492....
Live your life so that whenever you lose, you're ahead."
"If you live life right, death is a joke as far as fear is concerned."

Re: Redwing update

Gary I have been thinking more along your lines but using captive bolts. I had thought about hinges and clasps but then i would have to have padlocks for when I'm not there as well.
Chuck what do you mean by camlock fasteners?

Re: Redwing update

Nice to get alot of the painting behind you WX...good boost for the moral.Speaking of boost, are you anticipating getting suddenly and rapidly boosted off the thunderbox anytime soon,thus the beefy wc door catch?

Re: Redwing update

An enclosed head was always a given for me. Now I know I could have put a very nice nav station in the space occupied by my glorified bucket and I know the French have been known to have molded a dunny seat into the stern of some of their plastic yachts but for me....I'll have a dunny with a door thank you very much

Re: Redwing update

The mast begins.

Length 9 metres, diameter at partners 212mm, made up from 8 staves @ 83mm x 40mm...birdsmouth construction. Yesterday was my second day working on it and I have to say I achieved very little. I forgot my planer and had to use Peter's, unfortunately his blades were blunt and needed changing but I kept getting one cutter out of alignment...eventually I threw up my hands in dispair and then Peter pointed out there was a little metal jig for setting up the cutters...UGH.
Anyway, next week will be different

Re: Redwing update

No photos just yet but some time ago Peter delivered my mast staves and I stacked them on the shed floor...which made walking around cumbersome.
yesterday I scrounged 4 44 gallon drums and set them up in the shed as my mast bench, I already had one drum and I need one more which I will get today. I've squared off one end of each stave and written the length measurement on them so I can work out which sections of stave will go with which. The next job is to make my scarfing jig and I figure I'll design that around using my power saw. One other job I have to do before I can get into assembling the staves is to build a 2 metre extension onto one end of the shed...my mast is 9 metres and my shed is 7 metres and I want the whole thing under cover. Luckily the required footings and steel posts are in place and all I have to do is add the structure.

Re: Redwing update

And over she goes.

And that is where we have to leave her till I scan some more. The date of the turnover by the way was 21 December !986...Never in my wildest dreams did I think it would be many years before I would see the launch day....still waiting.