One of the interesting decisions for the roster is going to be Harper. Depth chart wise, he is #6 in the pecking order right now (behind Rice, Tate, Baldwin, Kearse and Williams) ... and that's only because Harvin isn't active. If Harvin is active and on the opening roster, Harper doesn't make this team.

The dilemma: Do we keep Harper on the roster where he will be buried, or do we risk him to waivers and hope he makes it to the P.S.?

Bob Condotta was on KJR a little while ago and expects the Hawks to "force feed" Harper tomorrow to see if he can show something.

I know it's not a popular opinion, but Harper has a shot to win a job over Williams if he shows he's better on special teams. Because that's where they will mostly be playing this year.

I'm not saying I think it will happen ( I think Williams has earned his spot), just that I think a lot of people have already anointed Williams a roster spot prematurely. Harper could prove to be more valuable as a blocker and special teamer.

I agree with Bob. They have to force feed Harper to see what he's "got", but even then it's just pre season. I wonder if JS has "buyer's remorse" when it comes to the Harper pick? I for one didn't think Kearse would take the strides he's taken from last year to now, and Williams has been outstanding stretching the field. There is such a small sample size with Harper that he simply might fall by the wayside because of the log jam at receiver. Good problem to have I guess...

TCS wrote:I agree with Bob. They have to force feed Harper to see what he's "got", but even then it's just pre season. I wonder if JS has "buyer's remorse" when it comes to the Harper pick? I for one didn't think Kearse would take the strides he's taken from last year to now, and Williams has been outstanding stretching the field. There is such a small sample size with Harper that he simply might fall by the wayside because of the log jam at receiver. Good problem to have I guess...

Go Hawks!

tcs

If anything, I think they would look at the pick as worth it for the competition alone. If getting Harper int he mix pushed Kearse and Williams to work harder to make the team and tap into their potential, then I would think the Harper pick was worth it.

TCS wrote:I agree with Bob. They have to force feed Harper to see what he's "got", but even then it's just pre season. I wonder if JS has "buyer's remorse" when it comes to the Harper pick? I for one didn't think Kearse would take the strides he's taken from last year to now, and Williams has been outstanding stretching the field. There is such a small sample size with Harper that he simply might fall by the wayside because of the log jam at receiver. Good problem to have I guess...

Go Hawks!

tcs

I doubt it (buyers remorse) - this draft will always probably look weak when held up against some of JS and PC's previous drafts because the roster is so stacked and deep, it was going to be hard to draft players who were going to crack it.

As it looks right now, it's uneven at the very best with the ceiling being "pretty good" (Michael, Hill and Willson).

I understand the Harper pick - they have always wanted that big, physical possession guy.

TCS wrote:I agree with Bob. They have to force feed Harper to see what he's "got", but even then it's just pre season. I wonder if JS has "buyer's remorse" when it comes to the Harper pick? I for one didn't think Kearse would take the strides he's taken from last year to now, and Williams has been outstanding stretching the field. There is such a small sample size with Harper that he simply might fall by the wayside because of the log jam at receiver. Good problem to have I guess...

Go Hawks!

tcs

I doubt it (buyers remorse) - this draft will always probably look weak when held up against some of JS and PC's previous drafts because the roster is so stacked and deep, it was going to be hard to draft players who were going to crack it.

As it looks right now, it's uneven at the very best with the ceiling being "pretty good" (Michael, Hill and Willson).

Truth. I don't even know whether or not to root for Harper making the squad as we've seen so little of him. Hopefully he'll get extended playing time tomorrow...

If we go by the 3 season rule, then it's too early to give up on him. Just like Tate. However, if he's a non-entity in practice, then there's not much you can really do this point but hope he clears waivers.

I've been surprised they haven't fed Harper the ball more this preseason. I was pretty high on him when we drafted him, and felt he had a decent shot at making the team. Of course, this is before Williams and Kearse really started to shine. It is a huge dilemma, but a good one. It's not a bad draft if they draft guys who can't crack the 53 because of the talent already there. If they'd drafted players that made the team only because everyone else was so bad, it'd be arguably a worse draft.

I hope he can make the PS this year, because I certainly don't see him beating out the other receivers, and I think he still has the potential to be quite good. It'd be a shame to lose him to another team, only to watch him shoot to stardom with them.

"The ultimate number is W's, and that’s what matters in Santa Clara. As such, Jed York does not own the 49ers; Russell Wilson does." - Paul Gutierrez

Sarlacc83 wrote:If we go by the 3 season rule, then it's too early to give up on him. Just like Tate. However, if he's a non-entity in practice, then there's not much you can really do this point but hope he clears waivers.

Herein lies the dilemma. Do we keep him on the roster as the #6 WR - at the expense of another position we could use a body -or risk him to waivers and hope?

And then what happens when Harvin gets activated?

No wonder John Schneider sounded so tired on the radio today...this stuff has to weigh on him and Pete.

Pete and Wilson have both stated that Harper has done very well during practice. Part of the problem during the Preseason is that he hasn't been getting the ball, or put in the game much. When the ball has been thrown to him he has caught it. Hopefully they showcase him and he can beat out Williams.

Force feed him in game four. Give him enough work to get a couple deep bruises, which would allow us to stash him on IR.

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sutz wrote:So, if they 'force feed' him the ball, doesn't that mean he has a chance to showcase his abilities in a way that makes him less likely to survive waivers?

Lol! Didn't think about that. However, do we even want him taking up a PS spot (As we have other needs)? I can't remember hearing anything glaringly positive about Harper throughout TC and pre season, though I very well could have missed it.

OkieHawk wrote:Pete and Wilson have both stated that Harper has done very well during practice. Part of the problem during the Preseason is that he hasn't been getting the ball, or put in the game much. When the ball has been thrown to him he has caught it. Hopefully they showcase him and he can beat out Williams.

Harper is another receiver in the same vein as Baldwin, Tate, Harvin (Size wise). The only truly big (Tall) receiver we have is Rice. I would rather keep Williams than Harper, if for nothing more that a "change up". Plus Williams has more experience in the NFL. I suppose we could get into upside between the two, but I'm thinking about this season...

I think you have to try getting him on the PS. If someone else grabs him, just the way it goes. Right now it seems he hasn't been able to win in the competition. That $440K signing bonus probably hurts but now is not the time to start varying from your stated mantra.

Coug_Hawk08 wrote:Why the hell would anyone claim him? He hasnt shown potential or ability. He is not 53 caliber. If someone is SO weak at WR that they can carry him and leave him inactive on gamedays, OK.

He is PS material for sure, imo. 53 spot is way too valuable.

Exactly. We always forget that all 31 other teams have their own Christ Harpers they are trying to stash. It's not like they aren't making tough cuts too.

Harper's only on the fringe because Kearse and Williams have flashed a ton in camp and in pre-season. I think the sudden depth we have at WR is unexpected. People around here were ready to dump Kearse and considered Williams a long-shot before camp started. Just bad luck and timing for Harper. If it's me, I'm rolling the dice that he'll clear waivers and hit PS, especially since he's likely competing for a spot with our backs and O-linemen.

Sarlacc83 wrote:If we go by the 3 season rule, then it's too early to give up on him. Just like Tate. However, if he's a non-entity in practice, then there's not much you can really do this point but hope he clears waivers.

Herein lies the dilemma. Do we keep him on the roster as the #6 WR - at the expense of another position we could use a body -or risk him to waivers and hope?

And then what happens when Harvin gets activated?

No wonder John Schneider sounded so tired on the radio today...this stuff has to weigh on him and Pete.

When the time comes to clear a spot for Harvin, we'll have at least 6 weeks of real game film with the 1's to help with the decision.Maybe all the WR play lights out (One of those "good problems"), or one is clearly way behind and it makes the decision clear.

Sarlacc83 wrote:If we go by the 3 season rule, then it's too early to give up on him. Just like Tate. However, if he's a non-entity in practice, then there's not much you can really do this point but hope he clears waivers.

Herein lies the dilemma. Do we keep him on the roster as the #6 WR - at the expense of another position we could use a body -or risk him to waivers and hope?

And then what happens when Harvin gets activated?

No wonder John Schneider sounded so tired on the radio today...this stuff has to weigh on him and Pete.

When the time comes to clear a spot for Harvin, we'll have at least 6 weeks of real game film with the 1's to help with the decision.Maybe all the WR play lights out (One of those "good problems"), or one is clearly way behind and it makes the decision clear.

Yes, but I doubt there will be much "film" on Harper as the #6 WR. I'd be surprised if he is even activated on game days.

The dilemma is do we eat a roster spot because we want to keep him or throw caution to the wind and hope he clears waivers.

Yes, but I doubt there will be much "film" on Harper as the #6 WR. I'd be surprised if he is even activated on game days.

The dilemma is do we eat a roster spot because we want to keep him or throw caution to the wind and hope he clears waivers.

I was more speaking of the WR core as a whole. Whomever goes into the regular season as the lowest WR of the chart isn't guaranteed to stay there. When we need to make room for Harvin the FO will know who the real contributors are.

I am fine with going 5 WRs until we get Harvin back as the 6th. A lot of teams go 5 even without a 6th coming back, and if there are injuries where we need to fill in our roster, there will always be guys out there on the PS, whether it's ours or someone else's. Clark seems like a good bet to slip through waivers, and he's looked better than Harper.

Maybe another team claims Harper, but I haven't really seen much yet that would make me care even if they did. If we can keep Harper via the PS then great; he's a classic PS type player.

HawkFan72 wrote:If anything, I think they would look at the pick as worth it for the competition alone. If getting Harper int he mix pushed Kearse and Williams to work harder to make the team and tap into their potential, then I would think the Harper pick was worth it.

I agree with your take completely; they said throughout the draft process that it was going to be tough for rookies to make the team. As a result, they brought in a bunch of guys with high upside but question marks in other areas to provide competition for the existing players. Some of those will stick and some won't but it isn't the end of the world if our late round draft picks get cut and end up on practice squad or another team.

For those worried about 2014, remember that we will have free agency plus another full draft before then. Even if Harper survives the season on practice squad he will still be competing for a spot on the 90 man roster next offseason with all of the new WR we bring in to compete every season.

WRs take time to develop, and Harper was raw coming out. That was no secret to the Seahawks when they drafted him. I know everyone wants everything right now, but I'm betting Harper is stashed on the 53 somehow, at least until Harvin comes back.

Fuzzman55 wrote:WRs take time to develop, and Harper was raw coming out. That was no secret to the Seahawks when they drafted him. I know everyone wants everything right now, but I'm betting Harper is stashed on the 53 somehow, at least until Harvin comes back.

Hey its possible. But lets be honest here. The way NFL players are being coached up through High School and College, we do expect more right away now. This isnt the same league as 10 years ago. These players are way faster, way stronger, and way smarter when it comes to football. We should have all expected that reality. There will always be projects, but too much talent is available at a higher frequency. If you cant cut the cake right away, someone else will.

hawksincebirth wrote:So Russell has leverage but marshawn doesn't ? I thought its next man up. Hey we got t jack and bj Daniels right ??

Fuzzman55 wrote:WRs take time to develop, and Harper was raw coming out. That was no secret to the Seahawks when they drafted him. I know everyone wants everything right now, but I'm betting Harper is stashed on the 53 somehow, at least until Harvin comes back.

Hey its possible. But lets be honest here. The way NFL players are being coached up through High School and College, we do expect more right away now. This isnt the same league as 10 years ago. These players are way faster, way stronger, and way smarter when it comes to football. We should have all expected that reality. There will always be projects, but too much talent is available at a higher frequency. If you cant cut the cake right away, someone else will.

I definitely get that line of thinking, but look at Golden Tate. Can you imagine moving on from him in his first or second year because he wasn't putting it together on gameday? Now, to be fair to Tate, all you ever heard from practice was that he was ripping it up and making spectacular catches. We haven't heard Harper praised at that level. But if the Hawks made the Harper pick knowing his development might take some time I'm not sure they're going to change course now.

Also, Williams seems to be a roster lock to a lot of people, and he probably is, but how many years has he been in the league? Talk about a slow development. Harper could possibly be the better player when his ceiling is reached. How much better can William be? This is obviously the stuff coaches get to see in practice that we have no idea about.

DavidSeven wrote:Harper's only on the fringe because Kearse and Williams have flashed a ton in camp and in pre-season. I think the sudden depth we have at WR is unexpected. People around here were ready to dump Kearse and considered Williams a long-shot before camp started. Just bad luck and timing for Harper. If it's me, I'm rolling the dice that he'll clear waivers and hit PS, especially since he's likely competing for a spot with our backs and O-linemen.

This is true. We went from WR as a perceived problem spot to WR as a perceived strength in very little time. And it is a dilemma. Harper has a lot of potential to be a big time player. That he hasn't developed as quickly as some would like puts us at risk of losing what we felt was a future asset at receiver. Our bump receiver is no longer a guy like Bumpus who couldn't make it anywhere else either, and it isn't a guy like Obomanu who reached his ceiling as a backup receiver and special teamer. Harper's shown the potential of being another quality receiver, but happens to be too green and undeveloped to make an impact on the 53 right now. Therein lies the dilemma.

"The ultimate number is W's, and that’s what matters in Santa Clara. As such, Jed York does not own the 49ers; Russell Wilson does." - Paul Gutierrez

I am in the camp that thinks he makes the 53 but will probably not be active on game day. Harper was raw even in college. His tape screamed project but he had some unique characteristics that when developed could allow him to become a very good player. It is not as if JS and PC thought they were getting a polished player when they drafted him, there is no way they could have from watching his college tape. They were willing to take him in the 4th round (ahead of guys that were much more NFL ready right now like Patton)because they were willing to let him develop. I do not see how their minds would suddenly change on that now.

could be his potential as a receiver is better or worse then say another position with someone on the fringe.. at what point do you decide to keep the better potential over a position? you could make a statement that there are weaker position groups that we will cut simply based on top end potential?

for example.. consider this..we carry 10 db's usually. and 9 are awesome and one has the potential to be an average DB some day.And we have harper who lets say sucks now but has the potential to be the best receiver of all time.when cutting to you Single it to the position group or do you look at the entire teams position groups, I mean we are talking about depth. and future depth at this point right?

pcbball12 wrote: I do not see how their minds would suddenly change on that now.

The sudden and unexpected emergence of Kearse and Williams as NFL-ready talents is what I think would change their minds. This is information they didn't have back in April. If the choice was among Harper's potential, Obamanu, or Charly Martin, then there wouldn't be much of a dilemma. It's just bad timing for Harper. We have an embarrassment of riches at WR, and we just don't have the space to stash someone for the sake of development.

I'm not saying he's a sure-fire cut, but I think the top-5 is basically set in stone. With Harvin due back at some point in the season, it's going to be hard to justify keeping Harper, especially with tough decisions to be made at RB/FB/OL.

PC - Hey Harper come over hereHarper - what up coachPC - OK I want you to play lights out then in the 2nd half I want you to run a route and just fall down and grab your legHarper - ok coach whatever you say

After the game Seahawks announce that Harper is on the IR and will be back next season

I think Harper is waived and will clear waivers as he's not shown much in preseason play. I'm not so sure he's actually being considered as the 7th best WR on the roster. He's got great size and great potential but is a lot like Durham and hasn't shown enough. Whatever the team does with him is fine with me as Harper would for sure be axed if there was another roster need and when Harvin returns anyway.

Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to completely take the final step. That was done and the final step was taken. The OLine still needs work.

I think Harper has been quiet in preseason by design. I think they are not giving him many reps so that there won't be stats or film for other organizations to scout. Schneider and Co. have been quite mum when it comes to discussing our receivers with the media.

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If your gonna try to stash a guy I would not try to sneak him thru waivers if you like him, too many WR's down right now all over and teams will take a flyer on a body like his just to see if he can be a threat to take coverage off your established guys.

I'm sure if he is as raw as advertised he gets turf toe or a hyperextension of his lymph node or something that will IR him while he learns about the NFL.

If they truly need a guy they just bring back Swain for a game or 3 and he bounces back and forth like Butler did a few years ago.

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pcbball12 wrote: I do not see how their minds would suddenly change on that now.

The sudden and unexpected emergence of Kearse and Williams as NFL-ready talents is what I think would change their minds. This is information they didn't have back in April. If the choice was among Harper's potential, Obamanu, or Charly Martin, then there wouldn't be much of a dilemma. It's just bad timing for Harper. We have an embarrassment of riches at WR, and we just don't have the space to stash someone for the sake of development.

I'm not saying he's a sure-fire cut, but I think the top-5 is basically set in stone. With Harvin due back at some point in the season, it's going to be hard to justify keeping Harper, especially with tough decisions to be made at RB/FB/OL.

Going back to when we first claimed Williams off of waivers, JS has made it clear how high he was on him. He went as far as saying he was his 2nd rated YAC receiver in the entire 2010 draft. The team has been high on Kearse since last year, even though probably not expecting quite the emergence that he has had this preseason. I am assuming JS knew that both of them would look better and quite frankly be better than Harper is this year, considering how raw Harper looked from college tape. Harper could very well be cut like most think he will, I just don't think it is that easy.

The team will of course keep him around if they can but he needs to show he's better than others or has the realistic potential of being so soon.

Whatever the team decides will have carefully considered.

Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to completely take the final step. That was done and the final step was taken. The OLine still needs work.