I am wondering when it comes to larger shoots, such as satellite grands, zone shoots, and state shoots, that there is not a standard program and requirement for targets shot and trophy awards. I have noticed that some satellite grands give more trophies, while others choose to only give away those provided by the ATA in some events. Why is there not a standard requirement that governs these shoots?

Some Zone shoots give category trophies and runner-ups to each class and categories during class championships, while others do not. Some states give out of state trophies, while others have open trophies, while still others do not give them to special categories (such as out of state HOA or HAA in each category). If All-American points are decided by trophies won, shouldn't each satellite grand, Zone shoot, and State shoot be required to follow the same format to make them all equal, and then points multiplied by the number of entries?

It bothered me that at this years Spring Grand, that for the last two major handicap events, there were not any yardage trophies given, just "place" trophies. Well guess what? Every "place" trophy for those events were won by 27 yarders. It bothers me that some other shooters shot the best scores and beat every other person from their respective yardage at a major shoot, and have nothing to show for it. It just doesn't seem right.

Before everybody jumps on me, thinking this affected me or somebody I know, for the record, it does not. I don't know who would have won any of the yardage groups, and I did not compete at this event. I was merely a spectator, but was surprised to learn of this situation, and it just made me curious, so I thought I would ask others to see what the answers might be? I do genuinely feel bad for any of the shooters that did shoot a good score that day and have nothing to show for it other than a punch on their card. Maybe that was enough?

RE the yardage trophies point, colobiggun, there are goodly number of shooters that firmly hold onto the idea that Handicap is each competitor against the entire field of shooters and there simply is no place for watering down the trophy list by having multiple categories of winners et cetera in such an event. Really big shoots have first through multiple places anyway and adding yardage groups, having classes, then junior, sub junior, lady, senior, and so on does little to appropriately honor the top shooters of the handicap event. The above is one of my personal beliefs too and I admit it. I'm not always in the majority with this opinion......breakemall.....Bob Dodd

A Satellite Grand will attract many of the very best shooters (27 yard), and the very best shooters win more than I do.

When place trophies are used, there will be some shooters who would have won a trophy if yardage groups would have been used, but did not because place trophies were used. When yardage group trophies are awarded, there are frequently shooters who do not win trophies but would have won a trophy if place awards were given.

Pat, good call! Is the object of our game to attract as many top notch shooters to shoot for places OR consider spreading the wealth around a bit more? Who needs to be hooked a tad more, those guys already at the top of their game OR the rest of the shooters? I learned long ago if you want to catch flys, you'll catch many more with honey than you will with HS!

I believe at the Southern Grand next month there are no short yardage trophies, they are going with place trophies entirely. They are however giving runner-up category trophies all week.

Creating category trophy standards at all zone and satellite grand shoots is an issue 'colobiggun' and I have discussed in the past. Some zone shoots give their category shooters much greater opportunity for obtaining AA points than others. The southwest zone, where our kids shoot, probably has the least amount of 'category' all american points available compared to the other zones around the nation.

A bit off thread but for those who didn't know Lindenwood University brought members of their collegiate trapshooting team to the Spring Grand. Should the satellites or grand american have a collegiate team trophy in the championship singles event for these shooters? Similar to a husband/wife award except it is a five person college team. It would create a competitive environment for the collegiate teams to practice before their national tournament and bring more young adults to these events. I think watching a collegiate team shooting together in their team vests/uniforms is very inspirational for the younger shooters. Gives them a goal to 'aim' for. Thanks