It never ceases to amaze me as I read the ads on this site, how many will not ship an item, but when they are looking to buy, HOW MUCH SHIPPED TO ME!!! If you truly have something that is not a shippable item, that is one thing, but so many times I see items that are easily shippable, and the more than likely had them shipped to them. It seems like a lot of hams are just plain getting lazy. I myself would have purchased several items if the seller was willing to put forth a little effort on their part. Nuff said!!!! You want to sell, GET OFF YOUR DUFF!!!!

W5ROY wrote: It never ceases to amaze me as I read the ads on this site, how many will not ship an item, but when they are looking to buy, HOW MUCH SHIPPED TO ME!!! If you truly have something that is not a shippable item, that is one thing, but so many times I see items that are easily shippable, and the more than likely had them shipped to them. It seems like a lot of hams are just plain getting lazy. I myself would have purchased several items if the seller was willing to put forth a little effort on their part. Nuff said!!!! You want to sell, GET OFF YOUR DUFF!!!!

73 de W5ROY A Shipper Roy

Maybe they are as tired as I am when the buyer lies that the shipped rig arrived broken and tries to scam you for a partial refund. When I hand it to the buyer personally, he can't pull that rabbit out of his hat with me.

You can't pack 'em good enough to avoid shipping damage. The better you pack a rig, the HEAVIER the shipment gets AND the harder to handle it gets. I shipped a high-end commercial receiver in a wooden crate lined with FOUR INCHES of upholstery foam. The crate DOUBLED the weight of the shipment to about 90 pounds. The carrier bounced it hard enough to jar loose a circuit board inside one of the modules!

Let's face it, new packing materials AREN'T CHEAP. Have you priced one new box lately? OUCH!!! Then double it, add peanuts and bubble wrap. The cost of packing THE RIGHT WAY adds up fast! Sometimes, it isn't worth it to ship used gear.

Finally, a seller may not want to be LEGALLY LIABLE for damage to somebody's purchase because of negligent packing. Let's face it, whenever you're handling somebody's property, YOU'RERESPONSIBLE FOR THE DAMAGES IF YOUR NEGLIGENCE CAUSED OR CONTRIBUTED TO THEM!!!!

When I saw the words peanuts in your reply, I knew you do not know how to pack. If it is worth selling or buying, it is worth the money to ship it right. Just today , I received a package from Ca. with a radio, and it was well packaged, and not a sign of damage to packaging or contents. You gotta pay if you wanna play.

W5ROY wrote: It never ceases to amaze me as I read the ads on this site, how many will not ship an item, but when they are looking to buy, HOW MUCH SHIPPED TO ME!!! If you truly have something that is not a shippable item, that is one thing, but so many times I see items that are easily shippable, and the more than likely had them shipped to them. It seems like a lot of hams are just plain getting lazy. I myself would have purchased several items if the seller was willing to put forth a little effort on their part. Nuff said!!!! You want to sell, GET OFF YOUR DUFF!!!!

73 de W5ROY A Shipper Roy

It protects you and me.
If I sell you something and you mess it up by mistake""And we all make them"" you would put bad feedback on me for not honoring your mistake. So that said "and Ive been had like that"" if you buy from me you'll come here and turn it on and show me you can work it and if you can't I will give you a crash corse on it, and we will both put it in the plastic and seal it up in theorigional boxes and you'll be satisfied that when it left here it was wroking acording to specks, and if you do get home and forget to hook up an antenna and blow it up, and leave me bad feed back then I'll have a recorse. Believe me a guy left my house with a radio in his seat, and came back and said it wouldn't talk , and I went to his car and looked and had to lecture him right there,, He had just hooked it up in his car and never hooked up the Antenna. I've seen that happen a few times, If he had tore the radio up he would have wanted me to take it back and fix it at my expence,, and at that time I'd have kicked him where the sun didn't shine.

I shipped all kinds of stuff last year. Things from Antennas to heavy Radios ( up to 100 pounds) and Amplifiers. Over 50 items.
I have shipped all over the world Too!
Not one item was ever damaged during shipping. I have the UPS store do the packing. That way, they guarantee safe delivery.
Using the " Pick Up only " excuse is a cop out, in my opinion for someone that is just Lazy.
If I am willing to pay you to ship it and am willing to pay you to "have it packed correctly" and insured... whats the Beef?

W5ROY wrote: When I saw the words peanuts in your reply, I knew you do not know how to pack. If it is worth selling or buying, it is worth the money to ship it right. Just today , I received a package from Ca. with a radio, and it was well packaged, and not a sign of damage to packaging or contents. You gotta pay if you wanna play.

I do know how to pack and I do know that peanuts are not an appropriate packing material for heavy objects. I listed "peanuts" as an example of packing materials that a seller/shipper would have to buy if he didn't have a supply on hand.

Most of my shipments are used tubes for collectors. They go out wrapped in bubble wrap, four to six layers of it securely taped. Peanuts or crushed newspaper is used to fill the carton.

Now, for my R-392 or AN/GRR-5, packing therm is a whole different story.

n6wk wrote:I shipped all kinds of stuff last year. Things from Antennas to heavy Radios ( up to 100 pounds) and Amplifiers. Over 50 items.
I have shipped all over the world Too!
Not one item was ever damaged during shipping. I have the UPS store do the packing. That way, they guarantee safe delivery.
Using the " Pick Up only " excuse is a cop out, in my opinion for someone that is just Lazy.
If I am willing to pay you to ship it and am willing to pay you to "have it packed correctly" and insured... whats the Beef?

Gordon
N6WK

I don't know who told you that. If UPS packed the Item you sold and it was broken in shipment, they would refuse to pay it becaue it wasn't in it's origional Factory packaging..
That is their rules.
I was told that at UPS here in Princeton. They said ""We'll seel" you insurance, but if it isn't in its origional packaging it wont be made right by us. Not even If we pack it. Thats their own words to me. 73's KC8GBF

Finally, a seller may not want to be LEGALLY LIABLE for damage to somebody's purchase because of negligent packing. Let's face it, whenever you're handling somebody's property, YOU'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE DAMAGES IF YOUR NEGLIGENCE CAUSED OR CONTRIBUTED TO THEM!!!! "

End Quote.

It seems to me that until that item gets in my hot little hands in the shape it was allegedly sent, that the seller IS DEFINITELY liable for its condition.

Or put another way-PAck well, and you had better insure, too. Cuzz if you send it to me and it gets trashed, YOU are responsible for it.

Am I wrong on this guys(and gals)? Aren't we pricing our items so as to pack well and insure that they get to the buyer in good order, and if they do NOT-Aren't WE still the owners?

Finally, a seller may not want to be LEGALLY LIABLE for damage to somebody's purchase because of negligent packing. Let's face it, whenever you're handling somebody's property, YOU'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE DAMAGES IF YOUR NEGLIGENCE CAUSED OR CONTRIBUTED TO THEM!!!! "

End Quote.

It seems to me that until that item gets in my hot little hands in the shape it was allegedly sent, that the seller IS DEFINITELY liable for its condition.

Or put another way-PAck well, and you had better insure, too. Cuzz if you send it to me and it gets trashed, YOU are responsible for it.

Am I wrong on this guys(and gals)? Aren't we pricing our items so as to pack well and insure that they get to the buyer in good order, and if they do NOT-Aren't WE still the owners?

If you buy from ME, I guarantee that is what will happen.

K8VF

When you look at a tracking number lots of hands handle the item when it leaves your hands and you have no controle over it. So I personally won't be responsible for what someone else does with my package,, watch the us mail drop your package in the pick up box behind them and UPS sends it up a belt into another room and it probably flips or drops inside that room.
One guy who repaired an amp for me told me if I wanted the amp back I'd come and get it because he and UPS was having go arounds over damaged amps they have sent back repaired to the owner,, so i drove and got it,.. I didn't blame him since UPS was not honaring their Insurance that he bought due to the amps not being in the origional factory packaging..
IMHO the origional packaging wont pretect those heavy amplifiers anyway..
So rest assured if I send it out, when I drop it off it's you'rs to keep. I ve stated on here I will only sell pick up only, If you say ship then it's your baby when I do.
If I was a buyer I'd buy those expensive Items from dealors,, good Legitimate dealors, they will do the fighting for you if it is damaged in shipping. 73's KC8GBF

Shaggy as one who is now retired from the express shipping business i find what you claim UPS told you to be without merit. If i was told that it had to be in the original shipping carton i would one demand they show me that in there rules as in all my yrs in the business i've never heard of any such requirement. What i do know and it is standard with all shipping companies and that is proper packaging and as with my company a minimum of 2 inches of protection around top,bottom and sides was all that was required. I suspect either the person you spoke to was not properally informed or was new but certainly uninformed.

N9LCD wrote:You can't pack 'em good enough to avoid shipping damage. The better you pack a rig, the HEAVIER the shipment gets AND the harder to handle it gets. I shipped a high-end commercial receiver in a wooden crate lined with FOUR INCHES of upholstery foam. The crate DOUBLED the weight of the shipment to about 90 pounds. The carrier bounced it hard enough to jar loose a circuit board inside one of the modules!

Let's face it, new packing materials AREN'T CHEAP. Have you priced one new box lately? OUCH!!! Then double it, add peanuts and bubble wrap. The cost of packing THE RIGHT WAY adds up fast! Sometimes, it isn't worth it to ship used gear.

Finally, a seller may not want to be LEGALLY LIABLE for damage to somebody's purchase because of negligent packing. Let's face it, whenever you're handling somebody's property, YOU'RERESPONSIBLE FOR THE DAMAGES IF YOUR NEGLIGENCE CAUSED OR CONTRIBUTED TO THEM!!!!

N9LCD

[/u]

You most certainly can! I packed and shipped an SB-220 and tubes to Hong Kong. It arrived just fine.
73
Jim W7RY

Up until recently I would ship just about anything.
In the past years I have shipped hundreds of large pieces of amateur gear. The list includes SP-600s to Japan and several ART-13s and Globe King 400s and 500s. ,HT-33s whatever ! In all of those years there has been but one claim and I can guarantee it was from a fraud/scammer. The fellow literally whacked the encoder knob on a Yaesu 757 . The 757 was part of a package that included a power supply, microphone and wattmeter. Of course he wanted a full refund while he also demanded that he be allowed to keep the complete package. How do I know he whacked the radio ? His girlfriend, who issued the original check told me all about it a few weeks later. It arrived in perfect condition and he had planned the scam from the start. That is how he planned to re-pay her.
A real problem with packing and shipping is that the buyer is very often the cheap one. When hit with the actual shipping costs they can have absolute fits. It is as if they expect the seller to subsidize the shipping costs and in fact the seller too often does. Another trick buyers like to pull is demanding double boxing and virgin packing supplies AFTER a price is quoted and paid. Shoot , they will even want it shipped to a more distant area after the fact .
By arranging for local pick up there is less room for complaints from the buyer as he is usually able to see and operate the item before paying. Our local UPS Depot in Madison Heights Michigan has absolutely refused to accept insured shipment of ham gear unless it is in the OEM shipping container..period ! This is their practice for all electronic gear and is so stated on the wall behind the counter
Further it is a pretty lame to conclude that a person not caring to ship an item is "lazy" ! There are some people who actually are no longer able handle larger , heavier items for shipping. Pretty myopic not to have a grasp on that. There is nothing wrong for a person to ask for shipping from another individual who is able and willing to ship,even if for whatever reason they are unable or even unwilling to ship an item themselves. So long as it is made clear in the offer to sell, of course.

Bottom line if you are too lazy to pick it up...........

Last edited by kg8lb on Wed Jan 20, 2010 1:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

KG8LB as a retired former express packaging Co. employee would you please explain to me how requiring only Ham Equipment must be packaged in OEM packaging so it can be insured makes any sense,being as that does not guarantee the original material used to ship the item was used. I'm saying that assuming your referring to UPS the company and not a in name use only UPS packaging store. All the Package i ever picked up or shipped were already sealed and ready to ship and unless there was play inside the package and by that i could feel movement i shipped as recieved.Thus when the reciever got his package with damage they are required to keep all original packaging material so we could decide if proper packaging was used in order to pay insurance.

VE6WR wrote:Pardon my naivete. Where do you get hundreds of pieces of amateur gear to sell? On disability now and need something to do with my time. haha. I know.. don't expect anyone to reveal their secrets.

We have helped clean up quite a few estates over the years, combine that with an affinity for buying non functional gear and returning it to service and it is quite easy to ship hundreds of uniits . My eBay feedback is well over 600 (100%) .and roughly half of that was as a buyer. No secrets.

BTW, as for the other fellow's "comment"; Yes, our local, Madison Heights, MI UPS office has a notice hanging on the wall refusing to accept electronic gear,INCLUDING HAM gear (but not restricted to ham gear) that is not in the original packing and they do enforce that issue with very few exceptions. I did not say they ONLY refused to accept ham gear,that was your leap.. but ham gear is usually considered electronic gear... Basic logic.

Another of your departures from logic, It is not for ME to explain thier policy to YOU. That is up to THEM. I am merely relaying the point regarding their chosen practice.

Another factor of course is the possibilty that the industry has changed , maybe even evolved in your post-retirement years. For example very little freight in the US moves by equine means.

On the other hand , the local UPS store will gladly accept ham gear that is well packed or packed by them. Of course the cost is a bit higher using that method.

W5ROY wrote: It never ceases to amaze me as I read the ads on this site, how many will not ship an item, but when they are looking to buy, HOW MUCH SHIPPED TO ME!!! If you truly have something that is not a shippable item, that is one thing, but so many times I see items that are easily shippable, and the more than likely had them shipped to them. It seems like a lot of hams are just plain getting lazy. I myself would have purchased several items if the seller was willing to put forth a little effort on their part. Nuff said!!!! You want to sell, GET OFF YOUR DUFF!!!!

73 de W5ROY A Shipper Roy

My thoughts EXACTLY ROY. If a person doesn't want to mess with packing / shipping, etc. do what I do...take it to the UPS Store and have THEM do it. I as well would've purchased many items if the seller was willing to ship.

Few if any "UPS Store" type service shops know how to pack heavy electronic equipment. If it is larger than a small urn, it will be put into a single strength box with a whole lots of "peanuts" and after rattling around in the box on the back of a truck, the peanuts will be mush and your unit WILL be damaged.

Also, be aware that UPS will not cover damage by "their" stores. Each store is on its own to deal with UPS claims. YOU will be very CRANKY after having to deal with the UPS store regarding a claim which is their fault.

I think you guys need to follow the rest of the new world and STOP using UPS. USPS only asks that it is properly packed, no definite of "proper" has ever come to the surface.
I use USPS Priority Mail at every opportunity. In the past 5 years, no damage ever noted. One lost package, they fell over themselves locating it.
I am 100% satisfied with the Priority Mail System.
Nuff said

I ordered a RigTalk interface from West Mountain Radio. They shipped it Priority Mail with a delivery confirmation. We traced the shipment to the 60657 carrier station where it was scanned out for delivery. Probably to the USPS' "great black hole".

I like Priority Mail, especially if the shipment fits into a flat rate box. Otherwise, it's the cheapest, "slowest" way.

One of the drawbacks of the USPS is their size and weight limitations. A well-packed -390A is two if not three cartons.

At least FedEx offers a "freight" option. Anything over 150 pounds goes "freight". What's their difference between "freight" and "ground", I don't know.

YES, proper packing and shipping can be expensive. I had a buyer back-out of paying $1,000 for my Racal RA1795, weight 45 pounds. He thought $200 was too much for new, double-boxed, foamed-in-place packing plus fully insured FedEx residential delivery to the West Coast. I'm now willing to give a discount for pick-up. Saves me having to handle an over-sized, over-weight carton.

Well guys, I just shipped a mobile amp to Tx. from NM., and it got there just fine USPS priority mail. I use bubble wrap around the item, and then cut custom pieces of insulation building foam to protect knobs and other protrusions. I have NEVER had a problem shipping this way. It just takes a little time and effort. If you honestly want to sell, and care about your reputation, it is very possible 73 Happy shipping and hamming. Roy

ship about 8-12 SB-220 amps a month. When I used to use UPS the damage was often. They NEVER paid a claim. I got stuck every time making good on damages. I finally got wise and use Fed EX, I have shipped about 75 or more SB-220 amps with them and not one ounce of damage. Someone shipped back in same packing UPS and the unit was destroyed and I am at a loss being the receiver of the item. UPS would not pay the claim for repairs. They charge you for insurance and NEVER pay on damages. Contacted the shipper, he shrugs his shoulders and says it was packed well and it was insured. He is not paying. I'm out. UPS wil destroy your amplifier no matter how well you pack it. If it arrives safely consider yourself lucky. If it arrives damaged consider yourself LOST. UPS are a bunch of MORONS.