Despite presumptions otherwise, the Nokia Lumia 1020 is selling at least as well as the Lumia 928

If there is one controversial area in regards to the stellar Nokia Lumia 1020, it would be its price. In the face of deals elsewhere like on Amazon.com, the $299 contract price is traditionally higher than most flagship devices in 2013. At least that’s the perception, even if erroneous. It’s a bit dishonest when tech sites focus on that subject since the AT&T 32GB iPhone 5 sells for the same $299 (and the 32GB Galaxy S4 runs for $249).

Last we checked, neither come with a groundbreaking 41MP camera.

Some could argue that the Lumia 1020 has no right to command the same price as the iPhone 5, but that seems a little pretentious for our tastes. Still, there’s a feeling in the air that the Lumia 1020 is not selling well or making much of an impact.

We of course don’t actually know what Nokia or AT&T have for sales projections of the device, so whether or not it’s a disappointment or success is simply conjecture at this time. Even with AT&T experimenting with price drops, we can’t take that as a sign of anything except isolated market testing.

Nevertheless, some new data from AdDuplex, who runs advertising on Windows Phone, appears to show that the Nokia Lumia 1020 is selling as well, if not better, than the Verizon Nokia Lumia 928. That device launched just three months ago on the massive US carrier for $99, making a comparison to the Lumia 1020 on AT&T quite germane.

Data from AdDuplex is broken down into weeks and shows a representation of that device on their ad network. Three weeks of data are covered and while exact numbers aren’t revealed, you can see the trend with the Lumia 1020 scaling higher than the Lumia 928 during its first three weeks of availability.

Currently, the Lumia 928 commands about 5% of the Windows Phone market in the US after three months (the Lumia 920 has 16% after seven), and as far as we know, no one is suggesting that device is a flop.

Alan Mendelevich, who wrote up the AdDuplex data, notes that their data “…weren’t adjusted according to our own growth (more apps on the network, etc.) so the results are probably slightly skewed in the 1020s favor”. While that may be true, seeing as only three months have passed between the two launches and the positive trend for the Lumia 1020, it’s safe to say that’s it is far from “doom and gloom” like a few in the tech world are intimating.

In our opinion, the Nokia Lumia 1020’s success will be one of long term perception in the smartphone world. Specifically that Nokia will be seen as a serious player who can still offer innovative new technology to consumers, despite their “underdog” status. The real sales for Nokia will be in volume with devices like the Lumia 520.

To put it another way, the Lumia 1020 brings the headlines, but the Lumia 520 brings the people.

Are you talking about the first graph, showing the 1020 vs the 928? Is there some kind of legend you could provide for that graph? I have to admit I don't know how to read it beyond "oooo, that bar is really tall so that must be good"

That chart is supposed to give an idea of how first 3 weeks of 1020 compare to 928. We don't have any sales data so there's no point for us to speculate about some actual sales figures. If we put ANY numbers on the Y axis I can bet you will see 80% of the blogs reposting them as sales numbers all over the internet. That's no what we want to encourage :)

Nokia isn't going to sell many phones in Canada as long exclusivity deals continue (920 exclusive to Rogers) and total bummers such as the 925 not being offered in Canada. If Rogers gets an exclusive on the 1020, we all lose... well, except for those on Rogers. Very few in Canada even know about WP8, it is very sad. :(

The Lumia 928 captured 5% of the Windows Phone market in the US after three months or 1/3 of the Lumia 920 after almost eight months. That doesn't seem like underselling. You also have to factor in the that Lumia 928 was 1/3 the price of the Lumia 1020.

I don't have any evidence other than Windows Phone's less than stellar performance in the US, so no need for the accusatory tone.

Think of it this way; if Nokia and USA's largest carrier can't sell more flagships for $99 than they can on a smaller carrier for $299, why is that? What's going wrong, because something is, somewhere.

That makes no sense though. If the Lumia 1020 was doing worse than the 928, you would presumably argue that the 1020 is not doing well, despite it's high profile status.

The Lumia 928 captured 5% of the US market for Windows Phone. That's not trivial and doesn't imply, as far as I know, underperforming sales. Even so, the 928, only offered in two colors and is more conservative for the Lumia line, just may not be as popular as it could have been.

We're also only comparing Lumia numbers to Lumia numbers, so overall sales of the devices is still up for grabs when comparing to Android or iOS.

Also, the 928 might have done even better than it's doing now if it had launched alongside the 822. I feel like a sizable chunk of 822 users would have opted for the 928 if had it been available at the time, but locked themselves into a 2 year contract with the 822 because they didn't want to / couldn't wait for the 928 to come out (understandable, since the 822 is a great phone anyway). Considering that 822 users make up 18% of the total WP userbase, I think that's a pretty significant impact on potential 928 sales.
I personally almost bit with the 822 when I switched to Verizon (especially when they lowered the price to free with 2 yr contract), but I knew there was a more flagship level Lumia coming in the then near future, and I'm glad I waited because I'm loving the 928 so far.

Thank you for the graph - it does not feel too lonely after seeing 8% for the L900 owners. And this 8% is a factor. We are the "pioneers" of the Windows platform on the Nokia devices, the passionate, enthusiastic part of that early spring 2012 movement, the base of Windows Phone platform built up to date. But unfortunately we are the largely forgotten base. Well, that's life .. And this scenario is typical. So, I am not complaining. It just has been the longest 2 years of the at@t contract for me since I start buying ONLY Nokia phones. Most of this 8% chunk in couple of months will be eligible for the upgrade on at@t. How will it split between L920 and L1020? Seems like L920 could be free at that time for another 2 years contract, and L1020 will be $100 less, and not just in "some places".
The exclusivity is killing Nokia in USA and Canada, especially now, when providers are becoming more flexible. If not L925 restriction to T-Mobile, this would be the most popular Nokia device in the USA now. But unfortunately, the ordinary potential customers of this device simply do not know about the phone because it is not advertised on TV at all. Yes, L1020 is a great camera phone, but it is true that not everyone needs the 41 Megapixel expensive greatness in the pocket every day.
I chose to be with Nokia many years ago, and as a result my family split between at@t and Verizon. So, I would probably have to wait till the next spring - to finally "unite" with my wife, and have her Verizon network in my hands in a form of L928. Sadly, it would not be the phone that I would prefer to keep in my pocket.

You should ask for an early upgrade. I bought the 900 on AT&T, and then half a year later upgraded to the 920. Only paid $99 for it! HAd to whine with online reps, including supervisors, in two lenghthy sessions, but got what I wanted!

Actually, AT&T screwed us on the upgrade. In June, they changed their upgrade eligibility from an effective 19 months to a literal 24 months for everyone whose contract runs out after March 1, 2014. I.e., we're not going to wait for another couple months, but until next April. We're talking 1020 successor at the least.

I'd like to think that sales of the 928 would be substantially different if it had launched along side or shortly after the 920. It was late to the market, and many people (the spec buyers) were most likely dismissive of it being "old" tech. The patience of our Verizon WP enthusiasts was pushed to the limit with the 928 launch.

I think Daniel is annoyed that no matter what the Microsoft statistic or news is that's being presented, people bend over backwards to find a way to interpret it as negative. Sometimes that's true, but that is ALWAYS how it is interpreted by the vast majority of the internet, regardless of actual Information or facts. It gets pretty annoying as a WP fan... imagine being head of a WP site.

That's preposterous, for one, because when you say, "smaller carrier," the assumption is "small," likeT-Mobile, or Created cket. AT&T is narrowly behind Verizon, in term of customers. Plus AT&T commands not just the most loyal iPhone customers, but the most loyal Windows phone customers (or customers, period). I think you have a misinterpretation, if you think WP is supposed to seek at iPhone, or Galaxy number just yet. Its doing quite well for a "catch up," OS, in 2013, against two juggernaut incumbents.

In fact, 928's have been available for free since at least around the time fo the 1020 launch on Amazon and now direct from Verizon too. Therefore, for current new/renewal customers now, it's free vs. $299, so the higher sales (or at least usage) rate for the 1020 is even more impressive.

I bought my 928 a few days after the 1020 launch. I had been a Sprint user (still on my WP7 HTC Arrive, because I didn't want to give up a physical keyboard), grabbed a 1020 on launch day, but unfortunately, AT&T had no coverage in my area, so I returned it and went straight to Verizon and "settled" for the 928 as the next best option in my area. Great phone, but I'd gladly pay more for the 1020 if I could use it.

In fact, if Verizon gets something similar when the AT&T exclusivity period ends (or any high-end Windows Phone with a physical keyboard), I'll pay full price for it rather than wait the full 2 years for my contract to end.

VZ's flagship Lumia 928 was selling for free by mid August still .If you go to 928 bugs and defects thread on this forum one should not see as many posts as there are for a 928 device that is 5% of a windows platform that in turn occupies a 3.5% share of the total mobile space. Nokia is a great handset but WP8 is one buggy not ready for prime time platform that's for sure

Think youre right. VZ spents months promoting the Lumia 928 as its flagship windows phone it introduced in mid may. By mid august "flagship" was selling for free at VZ. Warning(I had a 928). There is very little tech support for the 928 at VZ. Twice I went to VZ stores with my 928 with questions. I might as well have been speaking chinese. Both times VZ reps tried to sell me androids/iphones and even $200 bluetooth speakers to deal with my windows questions. I walked out. My advice sign up with another carrier who might have a more established relationship with Nokia than VZ does; 928 , im afraid was all marketing for VZ who is pushing hard S4 and Iphone5's to make room for the new Iphones/samsungs coming out in september

It can only go 2 ways. Nokia will either rise to be king and ruler of the smartphone world in a few years time... Or they'll make a mistake and crash and burn and the world will be doomed to iPhone and we will all have to worship the Apple logo. Personally I'm hoping they rise.

We have to worship the Apple logo
It's the bitten apple fron the Eden.
The victory mark of the Snake.
The Mark of the Beast.
The antichrist is a ruthless businessman who takes over the world
To only way to stop him is to buy a Lumia 1020 right now!
Collect all the colors and one for your partner and kids, too.
Bribe your mother-in-law, your boss, your rivals, your enemies, etc

I do think it is realistic to expect a device that finally gets the "masses" to buy though. This has been the device with the best chance so far and while the device may be doing OK, it hasn't brought people out of the woodwork.

Actually the last device I'd have suspected to sell to the "masses" is the 1020. It is a niche device specifically aimed at people who value photography a lot. And still I'm sure it will sell better than the Galaxy S4 Zoom and similar devices. It's a technology demonstrator to hammer the point home that the best Camera Experience can be found on Nokia devices.

Mass sales are more likely to come from either regular High End devices from the 8xx, 9xx series or the Low End devices from the 5xx, 6xx series. Given the competition and how things progress currently my bet is with 5xx and 6xx but we'll have to wait and see how the new devices in Fall are doing. Given that Blue won't arrive before 2014 it's gonna be a rather bumpy ride.

Nokia doesn't have the clout for non-carrier exclusivity. They don't have a device like an IP5 or SGS4 that sell in the millions of units. Not until then can they tell the carriers, who advertise for them with hero-device status, to go to hell because the carriers will tell them to go to hell right back.

That's in its first month. Sales may be slowing down now, but 5 million units of one specific model in one month is nothing to sneeze at. It took Nokia three months to sell 7 million units of 4 different models and their variations (92x, 82x, 72x, 62x).Hopefully with the release of the 52x series, things may start to change.

So how's the HTC One sales going, even when it is one of the more attractive Android phone? HTC business is going down, fast! 3Q revenue is expected to be in the range of NT$50bn to NT$60bn, down from NT$70bn in 2Q. Gross profit margin is expected to be in the range of 18% to 21%, down from 23.2% in 2Q. Operating margin is expected to be in the range of 0% to -8%, down from 1.5% in 2Q. That's what you are missing.

They bet on the High End Market and failed to gain enough traction. There is nothing worth mentioning below the One yet and that is what is hurting HTC so much now. Previously people said: too many models, concentrate HTC and look where it took them.

It's one thing that Nokia understands. Especially in the current situation you have to cater to as many customers as possible. Concentrating on the high end only gets you crushed between Apple and Samsung.

Now, if Nokia brought back the FM transmitter, that would be something that would get me excited. I know, the current versions of WP supposedly don't support that, but whenever they can twist Microsoft's arm to let them do it...

I did, and I would if it was on wp8, but not having it isn't a big deal, though I would like to have it and am disappointed that its not in the update. The reason its not a big deal is no voice commands ( that I know of) to change stations. That would make it special. But no biggie...hell I can't even get the damn update on my 822.

While having FM Radio as an option is one I love, I don't use it way to often. Again, I love having it as an additional option if I don't feel like using up my data plan, but it's certainly not a make or break feature.

I doubt anyone is going to chose their next phone based on the inclusion or exclusion of an FM Radio built in.

The 1028 will roll out with time, likely after GDR3, so it will more than likely get the advantages of a 1080p screen and quad core processor. Granted, Windows Phone doesn't need it, thanks to being so buttery smooth, but it won't hurt, either.

How common is for people in the US to buy phones outside of carriers? Is that common practice? How large are Verizon and AT&T in terms of clients? I think all of that should be taken in consideration.

Anyway, I don't really care for the US market. I prefer to get the numbers of the bigger picture, aka, the World. Only that will determine the success of flop of the L1020. And since the phone hasn't released worldwide...I think it's soon.
Though, one has to take in consideration that the L1020 is a niche phone and not a "real" flagship (meaning, it isn't meant to take the place of the L920 as the device meant for the normal consumer).

"How common is for people in the US to buy phones outside of carriers? Is that common practice?"

Rare, very rare. BUT, it could be changing with the things like what T-Mo started with their JUMP! program. People are upgrading more, but they're not buying outside of the carriers as almost no one sells unlocked devices.

True about the RoW info, though it's still interesting to gauge numbers early on. Also true that it's a niche phone for select market.

How is anyone to know this device exist in the US because there is absolutely zero advertising for the 925 on t-mobile US. It seems t-mobile is taking the sprint approach to advertising windows phone. This is where Microsoft needs to unlock its billions of dollars locked away overseas.

My wife and I dropped one of our boys off at first day of school today. We both took out our 1020s to take a pic of him. All I hear as I pull out my yellow 1020 from the four other kids in the classroom is "Damn. That's that new phone from tv. You guys must be rich! Check that out". This yellow 1020 is highly noticeable. My wife's white one is pretty slick too. On the way back to the car I asked her, are we rich now?

Sigh, I wish I had gotten a yellow over black, if I'm going to own a Nokia, I want to do it with pride, having a swaggerous step as I carry around a yellow Lumia 1020, kept safely from falling out of my buttery hands thanks to the built in camera strap. Glad to see your rich though, congrats!

This Phone hopper at work is back in the Windows Phone Camp! He left a Galaxy and got a 920 after I did and kept it for a few months but wanted WOW Chat so he left the 920 for a GS4. He always talked about how he missed the Windows Phone OS and how slick it was. Well he's back!! He suprised me when he whipped out the 1020! He paid a pretty penny for that phone because he had to pay to cancel his T-mo contract and then pay to the new AT&T fees. Luckily he's single.

Nice to see this device doing well in the face of adversity from tech blogs tying to skew its name. Honestly, complaints about price are just as over hyped as complaints about lack of apps. That's especially true when you consider the contract for your phone is going to cost you at least $1,500 in the long run, and that's being very optimistic.

And as the article said, the elite iPhone 5, 32GB will set you back $300 on contract, and last I check, it has LESS features than this phone, especially in the camera department. Unfortunately, the iPhone, after all these years, still manages to maintain some sort of aura about it, that makes people want to pay so much money for the phone. No idea when, when plenty of other phones gives you so much more for less. Still, I guess it's not a fragmented mess like Android, and at least Apple uses quality, industrial parts in their devices unlike a Korean based company I know...

I look at it this way, I have a white 1020. I personally don't care how many people do. The less the better. I am more I interested in seeing the OS it self grow. The less people that have one, the more attention getting it is to me. I live in a city of about 60,000 and I haven't seen another person with one yet. I am sure they're out there. I do know this, almost every day, someone says, "is that the fancy camera phone or the 41 megapixel phone?". That leads to showing pics I've taken to a little demo of the OS it self. If everyone had one then it be the Honda accord of phones. Right now, its still the Bentley of phones. You know one when you see it. It demands attention.

$299 is too much.. I know it's fantastic device but Nokia/att/msft should know that in order for WINDOWSPHONE to sell a lot, they have to make it affordable..devices now a days are getting better and better but pricing is crucial!!

The real win or die fight is in the budget category. Its pretty difficult to compete there with fancy, ir expensive, materials like the iPhone is made of, and it has little more than that to offer. Everyone likes taking pictures and videos, and if money is very tight, a device that dies a credible job and is a good phone represents a lot of value for the money. Looks for the currently pricy photographic hardware in Nokia's flagship phones to be I next years mid priced ones and scaled down but still impressive ones in next years budget phones. Meanwhile Apple will have little new to offer the budget conscious phone buyer. Already their flagship handset, previously praised for having a high quality camera, is 2 large technological leaps behind Nokia. Not being an innovator is going to start to cost Apple dearly.

If we go by sales, I don't think Nokia even wanted to sell the 1020 as their best selling device, but more as their premium device, I.e. Not a hot cake seller. So this kinda speaks more about how the 928 is doing really. The 1020 is geared more for hobbyist and enthusiasts, not for the general consumer. Its more of a mi dshare move "oh that phone with that awesome camera, they're next phone is what?!"

Of course. I just referred a coworker to get the 928 from Verizon he came back telling me the VZ sales person was trying to get him to buy an apple product instead. He didn't get it though. He said he'll get it on Wednesday.

I like Nokia strategy. Get mindshare with the high end, then trickle down some high end features to the low end. They clearly understand sales volume / market share will win app support. In the end we all win with more app. Imagine if a Lumia 425 is being developed..that combined with the free data deal with operators for Facebook access....look out...

Honestly, I think always having an exclusive deal with ATT on the new Lumia models is hurting their sales. They need to go nationwide on all carriers at the time of launch if they want to up their sales. Why would you limit a phone like that? It just doesn't make sense to me.

wow, this is probably the first time I see the Verizon Nokia Lumia 928 prominently featured on an article on this site. Seems like WP darlings 920 and more recently the 925 get all the attention, despite the 928 being better than both in at least two aspects.

I think that the reason why they went with AT&T exclusivity was in order to get some expousure for the phone in the stores. If they would have launched with all carriers in think it would be in side self with every carrier. And other reason is the markting push from AT&T. AT&T L1020 concert add has aired in tv 1339 times so far. (http://www.ispot.tv/ad/7OMP/at-and-t-nokia-lumina-1020-concert-song-by-the-colourist ) I think all adds from all the carries for lumia 1020 would have been zero if they would have launched with all the carriers. I just dont think that Nokia has the momey at the moment to do the marketing push by them selfe at the moment and the wp products are not yet in suchs a demand that they would get enoug visibility in the stores without exclusive deals. But things are changeing and mabe next year we will see Nokia wp phones launching in all carriers at the same time.

It seems to me like Nokia is the number one selling phone on ATT Featured filter/New arrival filter and that Lumia 520 is the number one GoPhone. At least they appear on top ( I dont know if that is relevant to salesnumber to be honest. But on Amazon It is the same stituation. ATT new arrivlals Lumia 1020 is number one, two and three.

The only way to find put actual sales numbers is to wait for the Gartner Group's Q3-2013 numbers when they're released in October, in order to get a better grasp of the sales for each device for a good comparison.

Also, for what it looks like at this moment, Nokia's main focus for distribution in the US market has been GSM carriers (as they have added a few more), while still stagnant with only Verizon on the CDMA side (I could go on on this, but many eill blame it on Sprint alone rather than seeing the big picture).