kvd wrote:...Word is that the water sales that THEY advertised pre-event were inconsistent if not completely cancelled. Lots of people got screwed bigtime by this,...

kvd wrote:... I heard reports that people didn't get water,... Though they did say they would be open 24 hours, and that doesn't seem to have happened...

From JackRabbitSpeaks V15:#32:08.25.11"...Open 9am-1am, but open 24 hours on Saturday and Sunday, August 27 and 28... Call the office or email gerlachgid@yahoo.com with any questions or to arrange fill-ups during the event week."

trilobyte wrote:... The only people I've ever known to have complaints ended up having more to their stories when asking questions...

O.K. kvd. To get this straight:

* you've "heard" of problems - no first hand personal experience of problems (where full details are available) - so you don't know if any of the alleged "problems" occurred during the published service hours, if they went to the right place, or if they checked for signs on the door like "please call xxx-xxx for service" or "back in five minutes"

* you're bitching about no 24 hour service, implying you (and others) expected it all days, yet 24-7 isn't what was published

* the water contact info was published, yet no mention if the people having issues getting water had bothered to acquire that information or use that contact info if they had it or what happened when they did

kvd wrote:... it sucks for all of us if said stupid hippies are raiding hoses and spigots in Gerlach, no?...

No kidding?But why would you blame anyone other than those raiding?I wonder if any got charged with theft of water, trespassing or such.

kvd wrote:OK, first of all, I had my water. I've been doing this a lot longer than most of you, and know plenty about the DESERT as whatever doosh was so kind to font up. No fucking duh. This one isn't about me...

Good job you weren't counting on getting water in Gerlach, you didn't get your water availability info right.

You've been 'doing it a lot longer than most of us', yet without first hand personal experience of problems, based on unsubstantiated allegations and your claim of facts different from what's published, you go and bitch and defame the whole town? Highschool kids washing cars? WTF kvd. Then, yeah, kvd, this is about you.You owe those you insulted an apology.Man up.

Jar Jar Sith Lord.Odd. No bears in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries..... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

EspressoDude wrote:remember the phrase "RADICAL SELF RELIANCE", one of the BurningMan principles. Bring your own water, food, gas, etc. Gerlach is a great place, Bruno a nice gentleman who with his wife have a place at the counter at Bruno's for dinner, a couple times when we were there also.

Buying supplies in Gerlach is a 'let's top off' the gas and water. You don't show up with tanks and jugs on empty. It is a small town and people pour their hearts and resources into the event, and when they are gone, well you are out of luck.

would you try to cross the snow bound Rocky Mountains, expecting to buy tire chains when you hit snow....?

Hey Espresso Dude,I have to disagree with you here. Gerlach says they have the water to supply anyone that needs water, at a minimal fee. Well, honestly not that minimal but its still worth it. I personally consider planning to get your water in Gerlach to be Self Reliant. If you are paying for your water from some municipality why not make it the last municipality on the journey?

I have personally taken it a bit further to make sure I will be able to get my water. With our RV doing what ever sort of mechanical issue at what ever time it wants, I give my self a 20 hour window when I could arrive in Gerlach. SO, I contact the Gerlach Community Improvements folks, and emailed with Sheilla the head gal that runs the water sales. I've gotten my water there two years in a row with out a single issue. Though, she has assured me that if I get there and no one is there, to call her. I didn't notice it this year, but last year there was big sign that said "If unattended please call ###-###-####"

When traveling through the Rockies, no one tells you that at the base of Eisenhower pass, there will be a real friendly guy and gal hanging out selling tire chains, and there sure as shit aint a phone number you can call if they aren't there.

Though, these folks that assume the citizens of Gerlach are there to bend over backwards for them, make me sick! We are really really lucky that most of the communities from I-80 to BRC are supportive, if not at least accepting, of our crazy burner asses.

Why don't ya stick your head in that hole and find out? ~pieholePlan for the worst, expect the best. Make the most out of it under any conditions. If you cannot do that you will never enjoy yourself. ~CrispyDave

ibdave wrote:So kvd, lets get this right.... You had water because your a long time burner... Longer than most of us.. (13th yr for us) Then after the best time EVER( by most accounts) on the Playa, you come on here to BITCH about OTHERS PROBLEMS(water) that didn't effect you IN ANY WAY???? wow, what a fucking fucking douche bag you are.... [/b][/size]

Ok, asshole. It did have an effect on me. Primarily, I gave out some water to pals who heeded the JRS advice to get water in Gerlach. Secondarily, another group of friends had to split back to 447 to go get water, which sucked for them, and I like them, and don't like it when it sucks for them.

Best time ever? It was pretty great, for sure. If I had to pick a year it would be back when we got to play with guns.

The "drug orgy in the desert" comment? Not my view, actually. I was riffing on what it appears to be to lots of outsiders. Sarcasm. It wasn't clear, so, my fault. I've actually never tripped at Burning Man, though I have in plenty of other places and times.

We fully intended on getting screwed in Gerlach (then go hoping to find Goathead yet again at one of the bars), but as soon as we sat on the bed at Bruno's we were both pretty much fast asleep.... only to awaken to a deep and disconcerting absence of oontz the next morning as the whole town was in a blackout.

Loved Gerlach.

Loved the feisty staff at Bruno's too. They were serving thru injuries (sprained foot and broken hand that I knew about) and thru the beginning of the blackout, with particularly peppered personalities that made No Bones about keeping it all under control. It was awesome to see.

I found it really funny that on that night, the playa had plenty of power but Gerlach didn't.

And Bruno's can be it's own type of hilarity, watching people come and go, and watching Bruno kick people out for dressing too skimpy then seeing them get all self righteous and indignant about it. Get a fucking clue, honey, it's his restaurant, not yours. Have a little respect. Sure, he's kind of a putz, but when you're in a person's place you gotta respect them or GTFO.

Bay Bridge Sue wrote:(Add another +100 for good measure. Make that 150 for your "by our drug orgy in the desert" comment. You ain't no burner. You're a poser, I don't care if this was your 26th burn out of 25. You ain't no burner. You're one of the ones our awesome adopted citizenry in G/E were talking about when they mentioned "This isn't like the burners before - the new ones are surly, demanding, and rude".

We that have been know. You can't hide the obvious. So go now. Decompress. Chill the fuck out. And maybe you can go to something like Death Valley or West Texas or Hell, Mexico, next year - maybe that way you won't have to be offended by the people who BUST THEIR FUCKING ASSES to work with us to pull this thing off in the desert.

I apologize for the strong language and attitude, but reading that drivel done went and pissed me off!

Again, sarcasm didn't come through with that particular comment. Save for the occasional joint, I've never actually done drugs in BRC or on other trips to Black Rock. There's enough there going on for me to not want to pile acid up on top of that.

But how the hell can you think it is so god damned rude to call this situation as it was? Bold advertising to all burners about water being available, the money going for a good cause, and then have it not be available. How is that not a fuckup? A spade is a spade. But, whatevs. People learned who needed to learn, I guess. I hope they comes up with more fundraising ideas for the school, if the water thing doesn't work out, or whatever the funds were going to go to. I don't actually know who was even selling it, I just kind of assume it's for the school, like the car wash. They have an amazing opportunity to fund raise because of all the generous and thankful people who travel through there, despite the new and more memorable surly folks.

And I do get what you mean by some of the newest burners being surly, demanding and rude. I've experienced that inside BRC, and other threads have touched upon it as well. There's a pretty entitled vibe going around the youngest of the 18+ crowd and it's depressing to see, not to say that it's just that age bracket that I've seen this shit from. All we can do is take 'em under our wing and try to pass on some values to them, which I think happens a lot out there. I behave like a guest in Gerlach, Empire, and everywhere else along 447 (the other places I pass on the way are so big that I'm just anonymous there). I was actually kind of freaked out to be following signs for the car wash, driving around the residential streets in the town, as I've always felt that was off-limits for me as an interloper. I can't imagine that the residents want burners driving around their side streets, lost or otherwise. The inconvenience to those communities just from tens of thousands of people rolling through during that one week makes 'em heroes, let alone all the ass busting that goes on and the surrounding weeks where there is a lot of activity in those normally sleepy places. We're lucky to be tolerated and that thing above, about taking the douchey types under our wings to nudge them in a positive direction, could turn out to be pretty important.

kvd wrote:Did anyone else get screwed in Gerlach? Word is that the water sales that THEY advertised pre-event were inconsistent if not completely cancelled. Lots of people got screwed bigtime by this, and even worse, some of those people took it upon themselves to 'borrow' water from locals who weren't home. The folks who own the storage yard had this happen, though at least one of them left a note with a name an address to send a bill and an apology for taking the water when they weren't home. Wow, that was might wide of them considering they were stealing and trespassing.

The other thing was the fucking car wash! They closed it early Monday afternoon, apparently, and didn't even bother to take the signs down aloing the highway and in town, emploring burners to stop in for the car wash and bake sale. Not a screw job to most, unless you count getting conned into driving around the side streets looking for them. Darn those rotten kids!! Quitting when they knew they were tired and had set a time for that. And dang them for hand making their own signs and not taking them down. They sould be punished forgetting such a major part of the car washing business.

Big screw job for those of us who store campers and equipment in Empire, though, as leaving shit caked with playa dust basically destroys it.

I do everything possible to support the community there, where we burners create quite a ruckus even on our best behavior. It really sucked to have these things happen.

Well, shit happens when required reading isn't done or while in Gerlach ask,"Hey where do you get the water if no one is there?"

To:

Again, sarcasm didn't come through with that particular comment. Save for the occasional joint, I've never actually done drugs in BRC or on other trips to Black Rock. There's enough there going on for me to not want to pile acid up on top of that.

But how the hell can you think it is so god damned rude to call this situation as it was? Bold advertising to all burners about water being available, the money going for a good cause, and then have it not be available. How is that not a fuckup?

The only fuck up made here is the person who wanted water didn't ASK anyone where to find it or get the number to call when no one is manning the water pick up sight.

A spade is a spade. (Is that the same as...of it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck...etc?) But, whatevs. People learned who needed to learn, I guess. I hope they come up with more fundraising ideas for the school, if the water thing doesn't work out, or whatever the funds were going to go to. I don't actually know who was even selling it, I just kind of assume it's for the school, like the car wash. They have an amazing opportunity to fund raise because of all the generous and thankful people who travel through there, despite the new and more memorable surly folks.

And I do get what you mean by some of the newest burners being surly, demanding and rude. I've experienced that inside BRC, and other threads have touched upon it as well. There's a pretty entitled vibe going around the youngest of the 18+ crowd and it's depressing to see, not to say that it's just that age bracket that I've seen this shit from. All we can do is take 'em under our wing and try to pass on some values to them, which I think happens a lot out there. I behave like a guest in Gerlach, Empire, and everywhere else along 447 (the other places I pass on the way are so big that I'm just anonymous there). I was actually kind of freaked out to be following signs for the car wash, driving around the residential streets in the town, as I've always felt that was off-limits for me as an interloper. I can't imagine that the residents want burners driving around their side streets, lost or otherwise. The inconvenience to those communities just from tens of thousands of people rolling through during that one week makes 'em heroes, let alone all the ass busting that goes on and the surrounding weeks where there is a lot of activity in those normally sleepy places. We're lucky to be tolerated and that thing above, about taking the douchey types under our wings to nudge them in a positive direction, could turn out to be pretty important.

Why the sudden change? Personally, I would feel more than guilty (and I have in the past) for blasting something like the town of Gerlach and/or Empire on assumptions or allegations. (I've never blasted G/E and never will) I wish I knew they sold water there. I would've spent my money there. I would've reduced the weight of things in my small car. I did read the JRS, but I forgot about the water being sold. My bad. Plus I loved bruno's. They had good food and a great crew!

Bold advertising?? I went for a car wash but was way too late. Kids need their rest. I filled up with gas and the nice young man was pleasent and efficient! No waiting. I was treated well as a burner there, talked with a lot of the locals whom I found to be very pleasant, helpful, and awesome people!

Sometimes I'm confused by what I think is really obvious. But what I think is really obvious obviously isn't obvious.

Oh yeah, well I heard at the bake sale they didn't even have chocolate filled pineapple upside down cake!

Talk about a major fuckup! Darn those Gerlachians for not having all the types of baked goods that I might have wanted at 3 a.m. if I had gone to the bake sale but I didn't because I already had my cake because I've been to the playa 8 million times and had sex with Bruno one time when we were both blacked out.

ZaphodBurner wrote:The difference between buying a ticket from a scalper and prostituting yourself for one is, if you suck dick for a ticket and brag about it, burners will still respect you.

The car wash thing is something I've had no interest in since I first went back in 2002. Having a playa covered vehicle rolling across the plains of Kansas or Nebraska or into Kansas City and having the locals give you the WTF look is priceless. I'll wipe off my lights, make sure I can see out and the rest waits for a while. Playa dust on the truck is like a badge of honor for many of us. (Keep your fingers off it unless you draw a Burning Man symbol in it!)

If I want to support the local communities I buy ice at Camp Artica because those funds support the locals and I see some proof of that in the afterburn report. We have an idea where the money really goes.

As far as the Empire store goes in 9 years of going to Burning Man I've stopped 4x. Each time the service sucked, the pricing is atrocious, and the selection for a remote general store sucked ass (and yes I've been to much more remote places than empire and Gerlach to be able to compare). Oh and almost getting hit because people can't fucking drive didn't help improve my disposition either.

In any event....I come back to this: Radical Self-relianceBurning Man encourages the individual to discover, exercise and rely on his or her inner resources.

In short it's a fucking desert. You leave NOTHING to chance. I carry extra water, extra gas, extra spare tires, tire patch kits, tow straps, extra food, yadda, yadda. When the gas stations are backed up with a mile long line and slow ass people at the pumps I can say screw that and drive right on to Reno and get gas there. I'd much rather have to dump extra water along I-80 than not have enough and I try and bring extra to give out too. Bottom line is at the end of the day it's up to you to be prepared and not rely on anyone else to do it or have what you need in a remote location. Doesn't matter what they advertise as being available, with 50K people rolling through there are no guarantees.

Kinetic V ~~~~~~I bring order to chaos. And I bring chaos to those who deserve it, wherever that may be.

kvd wrote:Did anyone else get screwed in Gerlach? Word is that the water sales that THEY advertised pre-event were inconsistent if not completely cancelled. Lots of people got screwed bigtime by this, and even worse, some of those people took it upon themselves to 'borrow' water from locals who weren't home. The folks who own the storage yard had this happen, though at least one of them left a note with a name an address to send a bill and an apology for taking the water when they weren't home.

The other thing was the fucking car wash! They closed it early Monday afternoon, apparently, and didn't even bother to take the signs down aloing the highway and in town, emploring burners to stop in for the car wash and bake sale. Not a screw job to most, unless you count getting conned into driving around the side streets looking for them. Big screw job for those of us who store campers and equipment in Empire, though, as leaving shit caked with playa dust basically destroys it.

I do everything possible to support the community there, where we burners create quite a ruckus even on our best behavior. It really sucked to have these things happen.

Fuck You

It is a town of about 150 people that puts up with your shit for a good month.Most people in town get NO TIME OFF during that time.We try to accommodate you, DPW, the fucking LEO's and every one else.Last I heard at least two of the kids that worked the car wash are now sick, nothing serious, just too much fun, and sun.

Again

Fuck You

heh heh heh +1000

Excuse me Ma'am, your going to feel a small prick._______________________________________

It's already been said, but I can't help chiming in with my two cents. WTF indeed. Last I knew Gerlach was not the company town for BMorg. I'm sure the influx of Burner money once a year helps their motivation, but I honestly think they love hosting us for a short time and will bend over backward to make our experience a little better.

This Burn, when coming through Gerlach late Saturday/Sunday after the Burn, the ladies in the grocery store offered me a free freshly baked piece of carrot cake and a cup of coffee. Chatting with these ladies and snuggling their kitten helped me immensely in transitioning from playa to the default world.

I've had nothing but good experiences with the folks in Gerlach over 3 burns. Next year will be my first as an RV owner. I plan to fill up on water in Gerlach and don't anticipate any problems with that. KVD needs to take this year to question whether he should actually be at Burning Man. Perhaps something a little self-reliant would be a better fit.