Here's the thing I don't get about Kickstarter Rage: It's not like this is just a complete charity thing. You're getting stuff for your money. Either a copy of the game/movie when it comes out, or some kind of inside look at the making, or a t-shirt....something. Whether or not the something you get for the price point is a good deal is up for debate, of course, but welcome to the free market.

It's not about people being suckers. If it's something that interests you, that you want to support, that will then give you back some kind of unique item or experience in return for your financial support...what does it matter if it's from a Hollywood studio or the crazy homeless guy in the park? Kickstarter is just a tool to enable this unique give and take between creator and consumer to occur.

Skarekrough:Harbinger of the Doomed Rat: EyeballKid: Harbinger of the Doomed Rat: Those chuckleheads were never told they were going to get paid for playing with Amanda Palmer. Then when they didn't get paid some of them got biatchy about it, and now people are saying Amanda Palmer has a sense of entitlement?

Yes, don't hate the sleazy manipulator, hate the suckers who fell for it. Sorry, you don't have a hopeless infatuation with Amanda Palmer, you just have a horribly farked up sense of values. My apologies.

Which of Ayn Rand's works is your favorite?

Yes, what a horrible manipulator she was. She said, "Hey, anyone want to play on stage with me for free?", people said "Sure!", then freaked when she didn't hand them cash at the end of the night. They knew exactly what they were (well, weren't) getting, then pitched a fit when they didn't get it. If she had promised payment, suggested or hinted that there would be payment, I could understand saying she was manipulating them, but she didn't. It was pretty farking clear from the outset that they weren't going to get paid. They were self-entitled biatches who decided they deserved something they weren't offered, which is a whole fark of a lot more like Ayn Rand than you seem to think I am.

As a musician it's a shiatty thing to do to another musician.

Anyone who has earned their stripes should know this. Anyone who has had to put up with the nearly endless BS that comes from being a gigging musician knows it.

Anyone who does work that does not pay a straight guaranteed salary can sympathize with this point of view. And as easy as it is to blame her, you should really be mad at the musicians who agreed to be exploited (yes, exploited) like this.

Number 1 rule for anyone who wants a serious career in a creative field: DON'T WORK FOR FREE! I don't care if you love the artist, if you think this would be a great experience, or if you just really want to hug Amanda Palmer. If your work is good enough to get someone else paid you get yourself paid.

And you don't necessarily do it for yourself but for the other aspiring professionals trying to eke out some semblance of a living using what is usually their only marketable skill. When you undervalue yourself--especially on such a high level--you undervalue everybody else. You make it that much easier for the next greedy bastard who doesn't want to pay for work to say, "Well I can get these guys for the price of a couple of beers." It's why so many novices are afraid to or don't know how to ask for compensation, no matter how much time they sacrificed for the work.

Still, those musicians signed up for that. They only have themselves to blame if they have a hard time finding paying work in the future.

space1999:Melissa Joan Hart is trying to do the same thing, but she's failing miserably:

http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/318676760/darcis-walk-of-shame/

Please remember that everyone who pledges gets something in return. Think of it more as pre-ordering the movie, or getting a special award that would not otherwise be an option. For example, for $1,000 you get to attend the after-party with the cast and crew. I can assure you, I would never be able to do that otherwise.

Harbinger of the Doomed Rat:EyeballKid: And the film's soundtrack will be recorded by Amanda Palmer and a bunch of schlubs who are thrilled to have the privilege of having played for Amanda Palmer.

People who hate on Amanda Palmer because some folks willingly volunteered to play music with her and didn't get paid for it are idiots.

The thing about playing in Chuck Berry's band was that even with someone as terrible as Chuck Berry is they always had money in their pocket in addition to saying that they backed up Chuck Berry for a night when he came through.

When Bootsy played for James Brown and they worked out a riff it was still James' tune, but you'd better believe that at the end of the run everyone was getting paid. They might have been fined here and there, but they was getting paid!

Which is why Amanda Palmer is such a despicable person for being willing to do what she did. She might as well ask who wants to wash her laundry, fill up the tank on the tour van or buy her dinner. It's predatory and disingenuous and illustrates a glaring level of arrogance and unwillingness to appreciate her fans by taking advantage of them.