as a representative is how this has been politicized so quickly. >> do you dare come on my show and say iamusingtheslaughter of 20 little 6 and 7-year-old children? >> how many children do you have? >> joe, how many children do you have? >> i have four children, tim. answer my question. >> so do i and i refuse to let you say because you have children or anybody else that we need to actually politicize this. >> joining me now, delaware attorney general beau biden whose father vice president joe biden is leading the new task force and los angeles mayor and the current president of the u.s. conference of mayors and a member of the mayors against illegal guns and also joining the conversation is congressman john yarmouth of kentucky. stand by. the nra started the press conference. >> i welcome you here this morning for the purposes of beginning our discussion of the topic that's been on the minds of american parents across this country. that is what do we do about the tragedies of the sort that struck in newtown, connecticut to avoid such events in the future? like most americans, we were shocked

rifles like theoneusedbygunman adam lanza. >> it's the president's job to promote a plan that fixing, satisfies the needs of the country. he is the commander in chief. he's the consoler in chief but the commander in chief. joining me from newtown, connecticut, is chris jansing, host of "jansing & company." chris, we heard a lot of different things about flowers running out of local shops there in town because of the outpouring the support for the victims. as we watched the scene there grow. describe what you've been witnessing as you people prepare to bury two of these little 6-year-olds. >> everybody that i talked to, thomas, in this community,s especially the families have told me that they feel the support here and literally around the country. i was talking to principal hochsprung's daughter, erica. we heard from her this morning. she said one of the things that has heartened her is hearing from teachers all around the country, house inspired they would have been. she said if my mother would have had one message to anybody, it would have been read a book to a child. and they've b

for the lowest price. and if it finds one, you get refunded the difference.justuseyourciti card and register your purchase online. have a super sparkly day! ok. [ male announcer ] now all you need is a magic carriage. citi price rewind. start saving at citi.com/pricerewind. >>> a good saturday afternoon. i'm craig melvin. you are watching msnbc, the place for politics. 24 days to the cliff. what's it going to take to keep the government on track and keep the nation from going off the rails? we'll talk about that. plus, the push for marriage equality could get a huge lift from the high court. we'll examine what's next for those who want to see same-sex marriage become the law of the land. meanwhile, in egypt, they are just trying to get a functioning government off the ground. we'll go live to cairo where along with tear gas the words in the air today are martial law. >>> first, though, some developing news from south africa where nelson mandela is in the hospital right now. the former president is undergoing medical tests. that's according to the government. these tests have been planned for

. they say they feel the support, thomas. >> nbc's chris jansing reportingforusthere.the host of "jansing & company" here on msnbc. chris, thanks so much. senator joe lieberman speaking on the house floor right now. talking about what this tragedy has meant to him. he's an independent. we'll listen in for a second. >> -- the act of a madman. or mad people. this time, they said it reflects a deeper problem in our society. and i believe what causes that change is that 20 of the victims in newtown, connecticut, were young children. and there is not only a heartbreak across our country about this, not only anger, but i think there's guilt. and we all ought to feel guilty because as a society, what the attacks in newtown said to us is that, we have failed to fulfill what would seem to be our most natural -- natural law. if you will. responsibility which is to protect the safety and lives of our children. >> senator joe lieberman talking on the senate floor saying they ought to feel guilty, referencing himself and his other colleagues, that americans aren't protected by stricter gun laws in thi

't know it. look at the leadership that we haveleadingus. imean, it's like lemmings. come on. >> all right. that's what's being said right now. joining us from capitol hill is nbc news correspondent mike viqueira. we have some elements from what we understand to be a deal at the moment. what would you say the mood is right now? what are some of the other details? break it down for us. >> richard, it's funny. at this point we're stuck sort of reading tea leaves. yes, we've had indications with more detail than we've got in days on what the outlines of that deal might be. but i got to tell you any deal if it were to pass both houses of congress here in the last 12 hours before midnight would carry with it the seeds of further confrontation and not that much further down the road. maybe two, perhaps three months. let's take a look one more time at what is being discussed now. mitch mcconnell and joe biden talked into the wee hours until 12:30 last night and 6:30 this morning. $450,000 as the threshold for couples, $400,000 for individuals over which your taxes would go up about four per

ofus. basedon what you heard there, what, if anything, what more have we been able to clean about this shooter? >> well, quite a bit. we continue to clear up this confusion, almost the equivalent of the fog of war that has existed for the past day and a half. we're now told that there is no formal report of any altercation that took place between the shooter and the three or four staff members or teachers that some reports said took place on thursday. we now know, officially, that there's no known connection between the mother in the school, although we labored under the impression all day yesterday that she was a kindergarten teacher. somehow, erroneous information passed on to us. we know from the medical examiner, who personally conduct ed seven of the autopsies, realizing there's many more victims, seven of the autopsies, all which he indicated were first graders, and that each of these -- each of these children suffered between 3 and 7 gunshot wounds each. now, this is with a 223. this is an assault rifle. some information has suggested that the victim's mother had access or

this done. they know pretty much what has to be done. and they would like toseeusjustdo it. and get out of here. >> congressman, are the outs in the favor of this two-step process of getting something done that will save the majority of americans 98% from tax increases come the new year? is that mainly the game plan at this point, with time running down? >> well, i hope it is. i would love to see a big deal. you know, i served on the so-called supercommittee. i was a member of the biden group. and throughout all of that, we were working on how to get to a big deal. but even back then, we were looking at a $1.2 trillion deal to just get beyond the so-called sequestration. and that would be a down payment on the bigger deal to come later, getting up around $4 trillion to $5 trillion. so i think that's still there. so i think it's still a two-step process. we may be talking different numbers. >> right. >> but there's always going to be two steps. >> we just heard from south carolina, senator jim demint who is going to predict that they get their wish. also accusing the president of intenti

he met with jack and the rest of the team and i hope you get the same sense and commitmentfromusaswe engage with you. there aren't a lot of wall flowers in here, we're eager for a two-way exchange nonetheless and hopefully your takeaway will be a useful purpose in the dialogue so i'm shortening up my speech significantly so mr. president, thank you again for joining us today, we'd love to hear from you. [ applause ] >> well, good morning, everybody. it is great to see awful you. many of you have had a chance to see individually or in small groups over the last several months but it's good to be back at the business roundtable. jim, thanks for your leadership. originally my team had prepared some remarks, they always get nervous when i'm out there on my own, never know what i might say, but given the dialogue that we had the last time, i thought it was useful for me to abbreviate my remarks, speak off the cuff at the top and spend most of our time just having a conversation. let me begin by saying that all of you in this room are not just business leaders, not just ceos of your

violence and an organizer with 1 million moms for gun control. >> they can keeppushingusandbumpingusandmoving us back. >> it's the holidays, you want to get home, but at the same time, what are you going to do? >> on this holiday weekend, thousands of flights delayed and we're watching that as the winter stom wallops the midwest and good day to you. i'm richard lui. the stalled fiscal cliff debate and the january deadline now just ten days away. president obama and his family are vacationing in hawaii and congress is on holiday recess after no new breakthrough and both sides are holding out and they'll be able to reach a deal. >> call me a hopeless optimist, but i actually still think we can get it done. >> of course, hope springs eternal and i know we have it in us to come together and to do the right thing. >> nbc's kristin welker is in hawaii and the president is still in talks while he's there or are the the talks on hiatus? >> richard, my sources tell me this is very much a working vacation for president obama and at this time there's no conversation between the president and

to play the blame game. this is about toputusoverthe edge. >> perry, i want to start with you. if perception is reality and the blame is going to matter to somebody, which side is it really going to matter to? ivities the blame is on both sides. what's driven this whole process is republicans are very opposed to -- just the republicans who will vote for any tax increase. we learned last week from the plan b vote. once we go over the cliff, republicans are ready for a tax cut, not an increase. right now that's what the big challenge is. >> chip, is that the biggest strategy here, get to the third and pass the third, the new congress comes in, boehner danger doesn't exist anymore, his speakership stays in place and grover norquist gives a thumbs up to up? >> i don't think that was the strategy a week ago. i think the speaker was trying to put the deal together, as we've seen the senate not -- i think that may become the strategy. i've always thought they would wait until the last hour, put a band eight on it, but wait until the iii so they can vote for a tax cut makes sense as w

for that perspectiveforustherein washington, d.c. >> let's bring in our panel to talk more about the politics of this heated debate. jake, start with you. you work on the hill and the question now is is there 60 votes in the senate, there are 218 votes in the house for gun control legislation to get passed? >> i think before you start count being the votes you have to consider whether speaker john boehner will even bring this to the floor. he was asked last week if he supports gun control measures, he said he was very noncommittal, he said he'll look at anything but speaker john boehner and house republicans are not likely to bring this to the floor in the way that president obama wants. they do not boy biand large favor an assault weapons ban but it's absolutely going to be a huge fight going forward. >> it it makes it to the floor? >> i don't think it will make it. i think the house republicans, there are not 218 votes as congress stands right now and if president obama wants to engage congress on this, it will be an uphill battle for him. >> let's listen to chuck schumer responding to wayn

and apparently at that decideded to take his own life. >> what else, michelle can youtellusaboutthose final moments before adam lanza decided to kill himself? >> reporter: well, those are certainly the detailsa we're hoping that we'll learn about, perhaps at this press conference or in the coming days, exactly the length that adam lansa had to this school, in fact what happened, perhaps they'll have a little bit better timeline. when first responders and law enforcement arrived on scene, they arrived to a very active shooter situation, a very chaotic situation and of course what was left behind is just devastating in terms of what they had to cope and deal with in terms of not just the emotions of this, but also processing that crime scene. so that they're say whether take the most time. >> the stories of heroism that happened inside sandy hook elementary school. the teacher who for all intents and purposes risked her life in an attempt to save the lives of her children there. and i do want to call our viewer's attention to the left side of the screen here, president obama who is at andrews

basicallyusedastarget practice for this person in webster, new york. two were shot and killed on christmas eve in upstate new york. there's the suspect right there. william spangler spent time in prison for murdering his grandmother. he shouldn't be access to weapons at all. police say that he left a note behind saying he was doing what he liked to do best, killing. they think in the burned remains to find his sister. they have found human remains but they haven't said whether or not it is his spangler's sister or lot. lynn, the fact that we're talking about this, do we do it now through the prism of newtown? he had also a weapon, the ar-15 rifle, one of the weapons that spangler used. do we look at it through the prism of newtown? >> newtown, virginia tech, columbine, northern illinois shootings, how many more do we need? so, you know, it's been said that newtown now might be the so-called tipping point. the -- i don't see yet and this will be an issue for the new congress coming in, because i can't imagine anything done in the lame duck session. what if i were wrong, that wo

that day are something that, again, has got tobeusedasa measuring stick for the elected representatives of this country, that, you know, she did her job and now it is time for us to do our job. >> you talk about the different tone and the distinction that we're hearing, there are certain voices on the right that are lending different type of perspective to this, like texas governor rick perry. the latest to advocate training and arming schoolteachers. the teacher heralded for putting the kids in cabinets in her classroom. her services held today. then bob mcdonald yesterday saying that it is a conversation worth having about, arming teachers. do you think that's an answer for connecticut and schools across the country? >> i don't. school safety is clearly something that we need to inventory. i'm a member of the education and labor committee next january and have written to the chairman saying, you know, we need to have a real information sharing of best practices. right now school superintendents are getting inundated with solicitations from security firms. we need to help public school

on the table? >> you're exactly right. it's not reality. the simple math doesn't add up.iusetheanalogy, it's like going tos an fast food chain and, there's calories involved in that, you might gain a little bit of weight. >> not if nobody sees you eat it. >> at the end of the day you know what you ate and you're going to gain the weight. the fact of the matter is it's simple arithmetic here. when you take a look at entitlement reform that, is the real driver here to bring down our deficit and to bring fiscal sanity back to washington, d.c. as it relates to medicare, as it relates to social security. that's the real conversation that we as the american people need to have around our kitchen tables. >> an interesting note to point out amid this debt crisis going on, new jersey governor chris christie is at the white house asking for more aid in the aftermath of hurricane sandy. the president is going to ask congress for $50 billion. new jersey and new york will no doubt want a big slice of that but disaster relief is being held hostage by the fiscal cliff. how much pressure does this additio

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