54 comments on “Knicks Morning News (Monday, Jan 07 2013)”

Although I can never get enough of endless discussions of WP 48 and whether high usage player x is more efficient than low usage player y, rumor has it that there’s a game being played tonight at MSG. I think this is a great test for the Knicks; Boston seems to have rediscovered some of their defensive mojo since getting Bradley back and is coming off two solid victories against Indy and Atlanta. And unlike the old days (I.e. last year) it’s the Celtics who have something to prove.

Should be interesting, I’m going to the game and I think the crowd will be at its bloodthirsty best.

d-mar:
Although I can never get enough of endless discussions of WP 48 and whether high usage player x is more efficient than low usage player y, rumor has it that there’s a game being played tonight at MSG. I think this is a great test for the Knicks; Boston seems to have rediscovered some of their defensive mojo since getting Bradley back and is coming off two solid victories against Indy and Atlanta. And unlike the old days (I.e. last year) it’s the Celtics who have something to prove.

Should be interesting, I’m going to the game and I think the crowd will be at its bloodthirsty best.

I’m hoping for a 30 point beatdown, although I doubt there’s any chance of it happening. The good news is the Knicks won’t have a rebounding disadvantage for once.

Juany8: I’m hoping for a 30 point beatdown, although I doubt there’s any chance of it happening. The good news is the Knicks won’t have a rebounding disadvantage for once.

I’m a little nervous about JR, Kidd, or Prigs bringing the ball up against Avery Bradley. Aside from the fact that he fouls every possession and never gets called for it, that dude is really good at ball pressure. May need to have Melo bring the ball up a fair amount tonight.

We should know pretty soon about our defensive stopper. Iman just tweeted about an hour ago that he was going to the doctor. My guess is he’ll be back on the court 1/21 against the Nets. Will give him 2 weeks to work on conditioning and getting the sets down pat.

The Lakers debacle is getting more interesting by the day. You have to think Nash is really second-guessing his decision to play for LA rather than NY.

Chemistry problems. Kobe-Dwight almost-fistfights. Pau sulking. Good thing D’Antoni has such a great history of communication with his players.

If I’m the Lakers, I see how this next few weeks goes before the trade deadline. If it’s not better (and I don’t think it will be), then I think they have to trade not Pau, but Dwight. Gotta figure Dwight will jump ship if this team can’t even make the playoffs.

Dwight to Atlanta for Horford, Morrow, Stevenson, and maybe a pick.

Who says no? Gotta figure LA won’t get a better player back than Horford, who is really really good and really young, signed for 3 more years after this one at only $12M per. An Atlanta #1 pick or 2 would refill their draft coffers. Stevenson/Morrow are both expiring so save $. And even if Atlanta has a $20M cap hold for Dwight, they’ll have more than enough cap space to go after another max contract or two if they renounce Josh Smith. And who knows – maybe the Clips flame out unexpectedly – maybe CP3 wants to come home to play with Josh Smith and Dwight.

The New York Times is running a piece on Chandler’s “tap outs.” It seems Chandler has created a couple of plays unique to his physique and I’m wondering what the advanced stats people here think of them.

First of all, Chandler is one of only a handful of NBA players with a weird stat — his field goal percentage is higher than his free throw percentage. Most of the others are big men with decrepit free throw shooting — like Dwight Howard and JaVale McGee. Chandler shoots a terrible but not painful 68% from the stripe. He just exceeds it with 69% from the field.

Of course, “from the field” is the odd term here. Tyson has figured out a simple way to have a FG% a full ten points higher than just about everyone in the league — it’s amazing nobody else has thought of it. All you need to do is start all of your field goal attempts holding the ball two feet directly above the cylinder. If you can do that, and you are 7’1″ 240, then most all of your shots will fall.

The MSG guys were trying to call this the “Gotham Lob” or something. But it is clearly the “Chandler Oop.”

Between the Chandler Oop and the Chandler Tap Out, the guy has developed a few new categories of play that I don’t think we’ve really seen much of before.

Frank:
The Lakers debacle is getting more interesting by the day.You have to think Nash is really second-guessing his decision to play for LA rather than NY.

Chemistry problems. Kobe-Dwight almost-fistfights. Pau sulking. Good thing D’Antoni has such a great history of communication with his players.

If I’m the Lakers, I see how this next few weeks goes before the trade deadline. If it’s not better (and I don’t think it will be), then I think they have to trade not Pau, but Dwight.Gotta figure Dwight will jump ship if this team can’t even make the playoffs.

Dwight to Atlanta for Horford, Morrow, Stevenson, and maybe a pick.

Who says no?Gotta figure LA won’t get a better player back than Horford, who is really really good and really young, signed for 3 more years after this one at only $12M per.An Atlanta #1 pick or 2 would refill their draft coffers.Stevenson/Morrow are both expiring so save $. And even if Atlanta has a $20M cap hold for Dwight, they’ll have more than enough cap space to go after another max contract or two if they renounce Josh Smith.And who knows – maybe the Clips flame out unexpectedly – maybe CP3 wants to come home to play with Josh Smith and Dwight.

I don’t even think you can trade Gasol at this point unless you’re willing to virtually give him away for cap relief solely. The team really does look old and tired though. Their bench outside of Jordan Hill and Meeks to a lesser degree is just complete and utter shit. That doesn’t project to change at any point unless you think Steve Blake is the difference.

It’s easy to watch them and immediately have horrible flashbacks to D’Antoni’s tenure last season which was some of the most deflating basketball I’d ever watched, barring Linsanity obviously. The Lakers might need to blow this up much sooner than anybody anticipated.

Interesting article by Haberstoh discussing the Heat’s rebounding that deals directly with some things that were bandied about on here yesterday. He notes that the Heat are actually worse rebounding with Haslem in for Battier even though Haslem is a stronger individual rebounder. If replacing a guy who gets fewer rebounds with one who gets more doesn’t necessarily lead to your team getting more rebounds it would seem like basketball is a game involving a lot of interaction effects. Just a thought.

On the Lakers, they were a total mess last night. The rumored fight between Dwight and Kobe sounds like total BS (it comes out a week later from a Nets beat reporter?) but they’re clearly not on the same page as a team, and Dantoni is not the guy to get them there. Hiring him for that team was a truly tragic error, I still can’t believe that intelligent people liked that hiring at the time. Their talent is being so minimized. Nash doesn’t have the ball on O enough to make up for being a revolving door on D, Howard can’t get any post touches, Gasol never ventures closer than 18 feet from the basket, and Kobe is doing almost the same thing he’d be doing if he was playing with Smush Parker and Chris Mihm.

I still think they could get something for Gasol, teams will still think you can rejuvenate him if you put him in a position to succeed, but I also think they should consider trading Dwight. They’d still get a kings ransom for him, and honestly he hasn’t been quite the same this year. Maybe he’ll get all the way there eventually, but backs are tricky. If you think there’s say a 25% chance he doesn’t resign and a 15% chance he’s never quite the same guy…I might take Al Horford instead.

The Honorable Cock Jowles: And the posters on this board tend to agree that this makes him a limited offensive player instead of a staggeringly efficient one.

no, it makes him both. there have been more than a few games this year where a single defender has totally shut him down, no one can do that for the guys who are the premium offensive players in the league.

Chandler has been doing those tap-outs for years now, FWIW (I didn’t read the Times piece yet). I bet if you charted them, he did them the most when he was on the Hornets and Chris Paul was his PG, he was like a ball return machine that year.

On the Lakers, they were a total mess last night. The rumored fight between Dwight and Kobe sounds like total BS (it comes out a week later from a Nets beat reporter?) but they’re clearly not on the same page as a team, and Dantoni is not the guy to get them there. Hiring him for that team was a truly tragic error, I still can’t believe that intelligent people liked that hiring at the time.

heh, who liked it at the time? I remember a lot of people laughing about it, hiring a guy who doesn’t believe in post-up play for a team with two centers.

The Honorable Cock Jowles: And the posters on this board tend to agree that this makes him a limited offensive player instead of a staggeringly efficient one.

jon abbey: no, it makes him both. there have been more than a few games this year where a single defender has totally shut him down, no one can do that for the guys who are the premium offensive players in the league.

Exactly – he is a staggeringly efficient, limited offensive player on his own shots. There’s nothing wrong with that. I don’t think anyone would disagree that if you move him farther than 5 feet from the basket, he’s basically useless offensively on his own shots. But again, that totally underestimates his very very broad impact on everyone else’s shots when he rumbles into the lane. When he’s on the move after the pick, he’s 15-20 feet away from the basket, but he causes multiple defenders to collapse into the lane because he is so staggeringly efficient if you let him catch it where he wants it on the move. But as others have noted, when the other team has a very good and mobile center that can run with him, he’s had trouble scoring – no surprise, but he has really struggled in 6 games total against Asik, Noah, and Howard (everyone struggles against them).

But honestly I don’t really remember specifically who wrote what. Mostly I was just referring to my perception of the NBA-sphere’s reaction which seemed to act as though his failed NY tenure didn’t exist, and was saying things like “Pau will be an awesomer version of Boris Diaw!” and “the new showtime”. If you look at the thread on here some commenters were pretty positive towards it:

In retrospect it seems to me like Phil was really the one guy maybe capable of making it work. Everyone has been obsessed with the system in discussing their changes, it’s all Triangle this, Princeton that, SSOL, but ultimately if you’re not managing your players from a mental perspective and getting them to buy in the system is basically irrelevant. They’re not losing because of the system, they’re losing because they’re giving up transition layups off of MAKES. Not once, but multiple times per game.

I feel bad for MDA but he really seems like a guy who is destined to be an offensive coordinator (like Norv Turner in football). It really does seem like he had the perfect storm in Phoenix. Only 1 alpha dog in Nash, who happens to be as low-maintenance an alpha-dog as you could ever hope for. A young superstar in Amare who didn’t make noise. And a bunch of other guys happy to be 2nd bananas in Marion, Joe Johnson, Barbosa, etc. He could just draw up his plays, lean on Marion to clean up everyone on the defensive end, and Nash to police a team that didn’t even need policing.

Now on the Lakers, he has 3 alpha-dogs, with one of them being the meanest alpha out there (Kobe). You have Nash, who looks more and more like he’s willing to fade into the background there. You have Dwight, who’s an overgrown baby who’s been coddled his whole life. And sulking at the end, you have Pau Gasol, who’s like Charlie Brown with the why’s everyone always picking on me? Even Phil would have a hard time tying this team together into a cohesive unit.

jon abbey: heh, who liked it at the time? I remember a lot of people laughing about it, hiring a guy who doesn’t believe in post-up play for a team with two centers.

D’Antoni would do fine in LA if they could trade Gasol for an equal value stretch PF to space the floor so Nash/Howard can run the P&R.

People forget, but Jackson often did NOT play Gasol and Bynum together down the stretch of games because it wasn’t working well. Odom was critical to that team (when he was in shape prior to last year). He could play with either Gasol or Bynum and you’d always have 2 highly productive players on the court together. That way you could limit Gasol and Bynum together when it wasn’t working. Plus, Bynum was hurt a lot of the time anyway. LA started declining when they traded ODOM because then they had to play Bynum/Gasol together or there was an even bigger drop in productivity.

LA’s failings have little to do with D’Antoni. They have no bench and 2 centers.

stratomatic: D’Antoni would do fine in LA if they could trade Gasol for an equal value stretch PF to space the floor so Nash/Howard can run the P&R.

People forget, but Jackson often did NOT play Gasol and Bynum together down the stretch of games because it wasn’t working well.Odom was critical to that team (when he was in shape prior to last year). He could play with either Gasol or Bynum and you’d always have 2 highly productive players on the court together.That way you could limit Gasol and Bynum together when it wasn’t working. Plus, Bynum was hurt a lot of the time anyway. LA started declining when they traded ODOM because then they had to play Bynum/Gasol together or there was an even bigger drop in productivity.

LA’s failings have little to do with D’Antoni.They have no bench and 2 centers.

And that team would still be a sieve defensively. D’Antoni is not going to develop any kind of genius defensive strategy to stop the bleeding and Howard is not playing like the DPOY level of yesteryears. They are old and there is no reason to expect internal improvement at any point.

Have you watched the Lakers play under D’Antoni? They actually have sets where Gasol is a spot up shooter behind the arc. They do not run enough post ups for a team that has 3 great post scorers. Instead they are masquerading as a run and gun team who’s burts of energy offensively expose them defensively.

They should be playing in a halfcourt, slower game where there lack of athleticism wouldn’t be such a glaring weakness. I think Sloan would be a great fit.

The Lakers are way underperforming their Pythag record, which is 19-14. They’re 1-5 in games decided by 5 points or less. They rank #9 overall in SRS. They’ve been unlucky in addition to being, well, not all that great.

Unfortunately the schedule is not going to get a lot easier for them anytime soon– their next three games are at Houston, at San Antonio and then home against OKC. You could easily see them losing all three of those and looking at a record of 15-21.

lavor postell: And that team would still be a sieve defensively.D’Antoni is not going to develop any kind of genius defensive strategy to stop the bleeding and Howard is not playing like the DPOY level of yesteryears.They are old and there is no reason to expect internal improvement at any point.

Have you watched the Lakers play under D’Antoni?They actually have sets where Gasol is a spot up shooter behind the arc.They do not run enough post ups for a team that has 3 great post scorers.Instead they are masquerading as a run and gun team who’s burts of energy offensively expose them defensively.

They should be playing in a halfcourt, slower game where there lack of athleticism wouldn’t be such a glaring weakness.I think Sloan would be a great fit.

I’ve watched a lot of their games and have concluded that you can be in the conversation for GOAT and behave like a teenaged girl (Magic Johnson). I also think most Lakers fans are spoiled brats and/or idiots.

1. Howard says he is not 100% physically yet and it’s impacting him offensively and defensively (but he getting better).

2. Nash just came back form injury, says he’s not 100% yet, and is still learning his new teammates.

3. Gasol IS a teenage girl. I’ve never even heard of a more sensitive 7 foot professional athlete than this guy.

4. Once you get past the starting 5, they are a D league squad. Chris “freaking” Duhon was one of the most critical players on the team for awhile.

Adjusted for home/away and schedule, they are not playing as badly as their record and will get better.

They will be fine once they are 100% healthy, but they can’t play elite basketball when 2 key players are less than 100%, a 3rd is constantly having hissy fits and getting his panties in a bunch, and they have no bench at all.

3. Gasol IS a teenage girl. I’ve never even heard of a more sensitive 7 foot professional athlete than this guy.

Truer words have never been spoken.

I agree that once they are 100% healthy they will be better, but even at full strength they need 4 guys to carry the entire load for about 40 minutes a night. I just don’t see them being a threat to OKC, SAS, LAC or even Memphis at this point.

I’m actually upset Rondo is out. The Celtics were very mediocre in the early part of last season and then put it all together and made a nice run. They were playing poorly recently, but there was a little internal blowup and then they played very good back to back games. I was curious to see if they had turned the corner and whether we could beat them if they had. They are old, but IMO they are still capable of playing very good basketball when they are are all 100% healthy and ready to turn it on.

I watched the Celtics walkthrough at my gym. Here is what to expect tonight:

1. Celtics will blitz the PnR. If Novak is on the court, his defender will stay glued to him (Rivers literally told Bass that he would rather he stay on Novak and watch a dunk than be in the lane to block a shot). If Novak is not on the court, Boston will leave the opposite corner jumper open with the expectation that they can rotate to that shooter while the skip pass is in the air.

2. Celtics will blitz the Chandler handoff at the top of the key. KG will go with the ball handler for the double team and the man playing defense on the original pick will slide to Chandler. There will be a wide-open 3 pointer for the man who initially set the pick at the elbow extended.

3. Celtics will press at least a couple of times during the game. They worked on picking up full court.

4. There will be a lot of open 3s for Jason Kidd and Prigs. They are going to force the Knicks PGs to beat them from distance.

5. On offense, Celtics will run a set where KG is lined up on the weak-side corner. Most times he will run off an off-ball screen at the weak-side block, looking to post-up on the strong side block. On at least one occasion, the weak-side block man will slip his pick and flash to the front of the rim.

As expected, KG was more intense during practice than anyone else. Paul Pierce was the MC, getting on Avery Bradley for shooting like Jeremy Pargo.

Doc Rivers is a really detail-oriented and involved coach. He had assistants running the defensive walk-through, but when they came to points he wanted to emphasize, he jumped into a defensive stance to demonstrate exactly how he wanted the Celtics to play.

ephus:
I watched the Celtics walkthrough at my gym.Here is what to expect tonight:

1.Celtics will blitz the PnR.If Novak is on the court, his defender will stay glued to him (Rivers literally told Bass that he would rather he stay on Novak and watch a dunk than be in the lane to block a shot).If Novak is not on the court, Boston will leave the opposite corner jumper open with the expectation that they can rotate to that shooter while the skip pass is in the air.

2.Celtics will blitz the Chandler handoff at the top of the key.KG will go with the ball handler for the double team and the man playing defense on the original pick will slide to Chandler.There will be a wide-open 3 pointer for the man who initially set the pick at the elbow extended.

3.Celtics will press at least a couple of times during the game.They worked on picking up full court.

4.There will be a lot of open 3s for Jason Kidd and Prigs.They are going to force the Knicks PGs to beat them from distance.

5.On offense, Celtics will run a set where KG is lined up on the weak-side corner.Most times he will run off an off-ball screen at the weak-side block, looking to post-up on the strong side block.On at least one occasion, the weak-side block man will slip his pick and flash to the front of the rim.

As expected, KG was more intense during practice than anyone else.Paul Pierce was the MC, getting on Avery Bradley for shooting like Jeremy Pargo.

Doc Rivers is a really detail-oriented and involved coach.He had assistants running the defensive walk-through, but when they came to points he wanted to emphasize, he jumped into a defensive stance to demonstrate exactly how he wanted the Celtics to play.

ephus:
I watched the Celtics walkthrough at my gym.Here is what to expect tonight:

1.Celtics will blitz the PnR.If Novak is on the court, his defender will stay glued to him (Rivers literally told Bass that he would rather he stay on Novak and watch a dunk than be in the lane to block a shot).If Novak is not on the court, Boston will leave the opposite corner jumper open with the expectation that they can rotate to that shooter while the skip pass is in the air.

2.Celtics will blitz the Chandler handoff at the top of the key.KG will go with the ball handler for the double team and the man playing defense on the original pick will slide to Chandler.There will be a wide-open 3 pointer for the man who initially set the pick at the elbow extended.

3.Celtics will press at least a couple of times during the game.They worked on picking up full court.

4.There will be a lot of open 3s for Jason Kidd and Prigs.They are going to force the Knicks PGs to beat them from distance.

5.On offense, Celtics will run a set where KG is lined up on the weak-side corner.Most times he will run off an off-ball screen at the weak-side block, looking to post-up on the strong side block.On at least one occasion, the weak-side block man will slip his pick and flash to the front of the rim.

As expected, KG was more intense during practice than anyone else.Paul Pierce was the MC, getting on Avery Bradley for shooting like Jeremy Pargo.

Doc Rivers is a really detail-oriented and involved coach.He had assistants running the defensive walk-through, but when they came to points he wanted to emphasize, he jumped into a defensive stance to demonstrate exactly how he wanted the Celtics to play.

This is fascinating, thanks for posting. Anybody have Woody’s email or cell #?

I for one am quite happy Rondo is out. Wins are wins, and in a divisional game against an opponent we are all expecting will make a run at some point this season, I’m happy to put one in the W column any way possible. Whatever, we still don’t have Shump or Rasheed, and Amare is only 50% of himself. Of all teams, we shouldn’t feel bad about playing a team with a guy out. Has any team had it worse than us (except maybe Minny)?

Meanwhile, off topic but Twitter is saying that RGIII has a torn ACL and PCL. That guy Shanahan literally should be fired just for leaving him in the game. Exposing the best young QB, most dynamic playmaker, and most marketable player to repeated hits from 300 lb dudes with an obviously injured, previously repaired knee is definitely a fireable offense, NFC East champ or not.

Frank:
I for one am quite happy Rondo is out. Wins are wins, and in a divisional game against an opponent we are all expecting will make a run at some point this season, I’m happy to put one in the W column any way possible. Whatever, we still don’t have Shump or Rasheed, and Amare is only 50% of himself.Of all teams, we shouldn’t feel bad about playing a team with a guy out.Has any team had it worse than us (except maybe Minny)?

Frank:
Meanwhile, off topic but Twitter is saying that RGIII has a torn ACL and PCL.That guy Shanahan literally should be fired just for leaving him in the game. Exposing the best young QB, most dynamic playmaker, and most marketable player to repeated hits from 300 lb dudes with an obviously injured, previously repaired knee is definitely a fireable offense, NFC East champ or not.

Big Shanahan guy, but this is tough. John Elway played his entire NFL career with a partially torn ACL. These decisions should be in the hands of doctors and no one else. Andrews made the call to let him play in the first place. It could have gone at any moment

ruruland: Big Shanahan guy, but this is tough. John Elway played his entire NFL career with a partially torn ACL. These decisions should be in the hands of doctors and no one else. Andrews made the call to let him play in the first place. It could have gone at any moment

Will be a lot of finger-pointing assuming the rumors are true. Andrews has already come out saying that Shanahan put him back in without asking him, hasn’t he?

Frank: Will be a lot of finger-pointing assuming the rumors are true. Andrews has already come out saying that Shanahan put him back in without asking him, hasn’t he?

Yes. He said that Shanahan didn’t even allow the doctors to look at him when he came to the sideline. If I were management, I would put serious thought into firing him outright for such mismanagement. This is a franchise quarterback we’re talking about. If he actually was cleared to play by doctors, it’s a much more difficult situation.

Actually I’m now worried that the knicks are going to have a let down. We actually do a good job of getting up for the BIG games so far this season. The only elite team we didn’t really show up for (and I think that was bad game mgmt on Woody’s part) was Memphis. With Rondo out, hope our boys still realize this is a BIG game