You bring up a lot of excellent points about infrastructural problems, but it is a leap to suggest that the solution for this is to have parents legally obligated to support their adult kids. If anything, policy changes regarding taxation, student loans, and so on need to take place - which is an entirely different issue.

Given how things are though, the point many of us are making is that adults should tackle whatever issues they face head-on. Life isn't easy, but we all need to be autonomous at some point.

First off - I have never once discussed the absolute shit I grew up with. It is none of anyone's business unless I decide to share it to trusted individuals. So this attack on "this made me who I am" and "I learned from this" I find offensive. Because guess what? The utter shit of my past IS what has made me the strong willed, never keep me down, determined woman that I am. And I do believe that it isn't till you have been tested to your breaking point that you learn what you can do. It is just like tempering metal.

I have also stated that I believe parents should help their adult children so long as the adult child is working, in college, or both. . I certainly do not expect my parents to pay my way while I do nothing and contribute nothing.

And no, having something handed to you just because you've become an adult does not build character. Working for what you want does.

I can't really agree with the sentiment that hardship is necessary to make you a good person. If it was, why bother trying to improve your family's life at all? After all, the harsher you are to them, the stronger they'll become. We raise our children, we take care of them, we try to keep them out of trouble precisely because we want them to live better lives than we did.

I'm not saying there's no place for letting them figuring things out on their own, and using tough love; but you seem to be implying that hardship for its own sake is the only way to improve a person's character and worth to society. I would agree that every child should be made to do some degree of hard work in their lives, taught the value of working for something and how to be self sufficient; but tossing your children to the wolves and hoping the survivor's come back stronger for it isn't exactly what I'd call modern day parenting.

I don't mean to imply you're suggesting that, I'm trying to illustrate that hardship isn't ALWAYS a good thing, and it doesn't ALWAYS improve you. There's hardship you can learn from and then there's just hardship that makes your life more difficult.

I mean, I was spoiled as a child, and I know I've come out worse for it. Especially once we no longer had the money we used to have. I simply wasn't prepared for a world where I actually had to take on responsibility for myself. I like to think I've been making strides towards improving myself in that area, but the point is I know first hand the downsides to pampering your child too much. But I think its natural and healthy to try making life for your child comfortable, so long as you make sure to temper it by teaching them responsibility.

I would rather make our country into one where working 3 jobs to get by is not something that we should of expect people (nor should it be necessary to get situated enough to move on) -- that's a much broader issue than parental support though, and I would agree that just extending parental obligation would be addressing a symptom of the problem and not the problem itself.

But seriously, it's our parents fault that the world is shittier than the world their parents left them. It's also biologically accurate to say that 18 is not really a very good cut-off point to label people adults because 18 year old kids generally do not have fully developed adult brains -- and the part that is underdeveloped tends to the be the part that is most important for a new adult: the part that is responsible for appreciating the consequences of actions & making wise decisions. The prefrontal cortex tends not to be fully developed until closer to 25, and 7 years of poor decision making ability can fuck people up pretty well.

So I do think that it is worth considering that adulthood might naturally be something that comes later in people's lives and account for that somehow (even if it isn't through elongated parental responsibility.)

But seriously, it's our parents fault that the world is shittier than the world their parents left them. It's also biologically accurate to say that 18 is not really a very good cut-off point to label people adults because 18 year old kids generally do not have fully developed adult brains -- and the part that is underdeveloped tends to the be the part that is most important for a new adult: the part that is responsible for appreciating the consequences of actions & making wise decisions. The prefrontal cortex tends not to be fully developed until closer to 25, and 7 years of poor decision making ability can fuck people up pretty well.

So I do think that it is worth considering that adulthood might naturally be something that comes later in people's lives and account for that somehow (even if it isn't through elongated parental responsibility.)

Really? I have four children. My oldest, at almost 24, lacks maturity. He works, and works hard, but he hasn't learned to tend to needs before wants. This is despite my many, many, MANY attempts to teach him. It is no longer my responsibility to hold his hand and protect him from the consequences of his decisions. My second son is 21. He is training to become a manager of a fast food restaurant. He is pretty good at budgeting his money and doesn't have the issues his older brother does about need vs want. My third son is 20. He works full time in a foundry and serves in the reserves till time for him to go active duty. He busts his ass at two very physical jobs and is the best at handling need vs want. My daughter is 18. She graduates this summer and is going to be going to college. She works now and will continue to work because she knows it is her responsibility and that there are consequences if she doesnt.

Trying to say "oh a child is not an adult until 25 because they can't comprehend the consequences of their actions till then" is bs. In my opinion. All of my kids could easily tell you the consequences for the choices they make. And it is not my job as a parent to protect them from those consequences. It was my job as a parent to teach them before they turned 18 that every decision has a consequence and that they have to accept the consequence.

I did that. Now it is time for them to learn to stand on their own. I am there to cheer them on. I am there to lend the helping hand when it is warranted. I am there to give them advice and help them make tough choices. I am not there to pay their way through life and be their safety net when they make stupid decisions. I love them more than life itself but they have to learn to stand on their own two feet.

Trying to say "oh a child is not an adult until 25 because they can't comprehend the consequences of their actions till then" is bs.

It is literally true & proven that the average person's prefrontal cortex does not finishing developing until 25 so I have no idea how it's BS to say so. You're also vehemently arguing against a point I'm not making so I have no idea what the fuck's up.

It is literally true & proven that the average person's prefrontal cortex does not finishing developing until 25 so I have no idea how it's BS to say so. You're also vehemently arguing against a point I'm not making so I have no idea what the fuck's up.

Using biology to justify our concept of adulthood isn't a good basis. Adulthood is defined based on many factors - which include economic productivity, capacity to do work, taxation, and so on.

It would be insane of me to suggest that because biologically females start menstruating around age 12, that this justifies lowering the age of consent. For very good reason, we set the federal age of consent to 18 - due to factors outside biology.

Just because it does not finish developing until 25 does not mean a person can not comprehend the consequences of their actions and should be still labeled a child and thus still the responsibility of the parents. I mean, if it were to be changed so that adult is now 25 then let's see... The age of consent for marriage changes. The age to join the military. The age to vote. The age to consent to sex. The age to drink. The age to decide to be sterilized (some states it's 21 and x number of kids). Any one under the age of 25 wouldn't be able to enter into lawful and binding contracts so no renting apartments with leases or buying homes or cars that require payments. So yes, at that point the parents are forced to legally support their offspring.

I didn't suggest that the legal age for adulthood should be raised to 25 nor that dependency should be assumed 'til then. I'm pretty sure all I said was that it is worth considering what we know of the role of the prefrontal cortex in decision-making and the way that we handle young adults.

It was my job as a parent to teach them before they turned 18 that every decision has a consequence and that they have to accept the consequence.

I did that. Now it is time for them to learn to stand on their own.

This is kind of exactly my point. That is your job. Luckily, YOU successfully completed it.

Had you not taught your kids well, you would suffer no consequences whatsoever.

Because no matter what gold star or shit job a parent does, everybody maintains that at 18 a person is suddenly wholly responsible for their own life even while they are the ones who have to cope with the consequences of their upbringing—something that was forced upon them without their choice.

This is kind of exactly my point. That is your job. Luckily, YOU successfully completed it.

Had you not taught your kids well, you would suffer no consequences whatsoever.

Because no matter what gold star or shit job a parent does, everybody maintains that at 18 a person is suddenly wholly responsible for their own life even while they are the ones who have to cope with the consequences of their upbringing—something that was forced upon them without their choice.

First, you are under the misconception that my parents did a good job as parents. You shouldn't make assumptions since you do not know for fact. Two, yes. An adult is responsible for their own life and have to learn to not only accept the shit of their past but to cope with it. It's not easy. It sucks like hell to learn to face the shit that shouldn't have been done to you. I know this in ways that you cannot even begin to imagine. But that is part of being an adult.

The reason I worked so hard with my kids is because I know first hand what it is like to have parents that did a shit job. I spent my late teens and early twenties blaming my parents for every crap decision I made. For every drink I took. For every failed attempt to launch. But I learned that I couldn't keep blaming them. I had to learn to accept that I didn't get that wonderful childhood and I had to learn that just because I had a shit childhood I wasn't entitled to others - be it my parents or anyone else - taking care of me till some dubious time that I felt like I could stand on my own.

Do I think the way I went about learning this lesson is the be all, end all - that everyone should follow the same path? No. And I don't believe that the amount of time it took me is how long it should take others. But do I believe that shitty parents should be forced to continue financial support of their adult child just because they did a shitty job? No. At some point a person has to take that leap.

"First, you are under the misconception that my parents did a good job as parents. You shouldn't make assumptions since you do not know for fact."

No, no I'm not. I never said such a thing and nor did I ever imply it.

"It sucks like hell to learn to face the shit that shouldn't have been done to you. I know this in ways that you cannot even begin to imagine."

You know nothing of what I can and cannot imagine. For you to say in one breath that I don't know about your life and then to presume that you know about mine in the next—what hardship I have experienced and therefore what hardships I can fathom—is disrespectful and uncalled for.

You and I disagree. I have no problem with your viewpoint. You believe parents shouldn't be financially responsible for the shortcomings of their children as strongly as I believe that children should not suffer for the shortcomings of their parents. I gladly respect your opinion and acknowledge its merits.

But I will not allow you to twist my words and weaken my credibility with statements about me and my comments that are unfounded and untrue, even as I'm sure you speak without malice and did not mean to offend.

I ask that should you address me again, you do so with respect and understanding, as I offer you the same.

EDIT: I have no ill-feeling toward you, and desperately hope there should be no mistaken or imagined hostility between us.

I think the bottom line is that none of us have had a completely ideal upbringing. This isn't a competition between any of us as to who has had the hardest experiences - because all of us have faced struggles and hardships in our own ways.

One thing I have learned is that life just isn't fair. Some really horrible things happen to really good people, and there's no explanation for it. But I've also learned that one of the only things that frees us is having autonomy. It is in being able to hit a reset button and stop ourselves from blaming others for our unhappiness or position in life, and taking ownership of how things are in our life. There's nothing more liberating than knowing that you determine your own successes and failures moving forward.

It's scary though, but ultimately, I think it is those experiences of self-doubt and confusion that ultimately develop traits that we revere as a society, such as wisdom and maturity.

It was my job as a parent to teach them before they turned 18 that every decision has a consequence and that they have to accept the consequence.

I did that. Now it is time for them to learn to stand on their own. I am there to cheer them on. I am there to lend the helping hand when it is warranted. I am there to give them advice and help them make tough choices. I am not there to pay their way through life and be their safety net when they make stupid decisions. I love them more than life itself but they have to learn to stand on their own two feet.

I sort of understand this but why is 18 the magical number? You said it yourself, your 24 year old is not an adult and your 21 year old is. I have the same, except my girls are 17 and 19. The oldest still likes to spend her money on stuff she doesn't really need. I will help her our as long as it's needed. Saying your kid is adult at age 18 is a bit short sighted in my opinion. Every kid is different. Some are adult at 16, others take until their late 20's to reach that.

I'm not saying you should buy them everything they need and help them out when their television is broken but, there is of course a difference between supporting your child and spoiling it, but when your son or daughter comes to you telling you he hasn't got money to eat, whatever the reason, you'd have to be stone cold if you turned away from that in my opinion.

They're your children, through better or worse, till death does us part.

In my opinion, this is not a one size fits all issue. Because not all parents prepare and teach their children how to function in the world. I've seen a lot of parents that just plain don't teach their children. In my own family, I have seen parents that do everything for their children, never teaching them anything along the way and then BAM, cut them off at age 18 without a dime and sometimes without a place to live.

I don't believe that a parent should be completely financially and legally obligated to fully support their child after age 18, barring some kind of debilitating circumstance that makes the child physically and or mentally unable to care for themselves. I also don't think that an unprepared new adult should be cut off and made to stand on their own before they've been taught to stand in the first place. As with a lot of things, there needs to be that 'happy medium'. Maybe have some kind of rule that if a person is not financially able to support themselves then the parents are obligated to provide shelter and food. That doesn't mean they also have to provide a vehicle, spending money or any other luxury items. Maybe have the child be more of a tenant after age 18 and they have to contribute to the household.

In my own situation, I am on disability due to issues that make it near impossible for me to hold down a job outside the home. However, I contribute to the household. I pay all my own bills both medical and other. I pay my own food, my portion of the cell phone bill (since we have a family plan) the cable/internet for the home and I pay all my own personal expenses. I also have begun the process of starting my own home based craft business. I was not taught to function in the real world and it's taken me 14 years to be able to try and stand on my own two feet.

I'm not sure there's an all encompassing solution to this. As others have suggested, there need to some rules so that a new adult isn't just leaching off their parents/family indefinitely. But there also needs to be some kind of rule that a person can't just toss their children out onto the street with no place to live, no money and no way of supporting themselves.

Yes, there will be the person that doesn't ever try and is completely reliant on their parents for everything. Then you have the poor soul that was never taught anything and cut off with nothing. And there's the regional issues as well. There are some places (my city is one) that makes a person jump through hoops in order to get that first apartment or job. And sometimes there will be lingering financial issues that if a person has to live in a certain area or has to take a certain job, it won't be conducive to making that person self sufficient and productive. It will only make that person drown in poverty. Sometimes there just plain isn't the opportunity for a person to better themselves or stand on their own at a certain time. Yet, if a person is given a bit more support for a few years, they can really make something of themselves.

"Parents" themselves are all over the board. Some are rich, some are poor, some are smart, some are responsible, some are serial killers and drug lords, some are professionals. You can't expect every "parent" to be responsible. And the irresponsible ones are experts at weaseling out of any legal obligation.

"Children" are the same - some are irresponsible and spoiled, who will take advantage of any legal obligation. Some are perfectly fine people who just have parents.

These categories literally cover everyone in the world.

It's absurd to expect a 50 year old woman with a stroke to work hard to pay her daughter's way into college. It's equally absurd to expect a brilliant 20 year old woman with a passion for high tech to work minimum wage jobs for 5-10 years because her parents won't pay for it "because it builds character".

This is the government's role. Governments are there to ensure decent social mobility. Psychiatry bills should be mostly paid by governments.. how the hell do you expect someone to get a job and make herself useful if she's mentally crippled? Good students and good colleges should be supported by governments. It's a waste to society otherwise.

If someone has a lot of money and wants to buy a faster career track for their not-so-bright child, that's their luxury to do so. If someone is born into a bad family, they have to work harder and be a little smarter and braver to stand out from their peers.

I sort of understand this but why is 18 the magical number? You said it yourself, your 24 year old is not an adult and your 21 year old is. I have the same, except my girls are 17 and 19. The oldest still likes to spend her money on stuff she doesn't really need. I will help her our as long as it's needed. Saying your kid is adult at age 18 is a bit short sighted in my opinion. Every kid is different. Some are adult at 16, others take until their late 20's to reach that.

I'm not saying you should buy them everything they need and help them out when their television is broken but, there is of course a difference between supporting your child and spoiling it, but when your son or daughter comes to you telling you he hasn't got money to eat, whatever the reason, you'd have to be stone cold if you turned away from that in my opinion.

They're your children, through better or worse, till death does us part.

I never said I would not feed my child if he or she came to me and told me they had no food. However, I am going to want to know WHY the child has no food. Blew it all on things not needed instead of buying food? I won't give money... they can come eat dinner with me and figure out how to put food in their house.

If I constantly "make things right" for my kids they'll never learn to solve their own problems. It'll always be "call mom!"

Good students and good colleges should be supported by governments. It's a waste to society otherwise.

Key point being that good students should be supported by governments. We really don't need more people going to college just for the hell of it. An expansion of federal scholarship programs would allow talented and hardworking students to pursue their studies.

The word good, that's the whole issue right there. Good parents make productive adults. Bad ones don't. Good children who take what their give them and use it to better themselves also make productive adults.

But parents that take no responsibility for their children, sit them in front of a tv or video game and can't be bothered, those are the ones that don't make productive adults. I have a cousin that was allowed to run roughshod over his father. No discipline, no consequences. It was just 'play your game and don't bother anybody'. You know what, he's a lousy human being now. Won't hold a job, blaming anyone else he can for his short comings.

I happen to agree that only dedicated students that will really try should be sent to college. I watched two cousins have the world handed to them on a silver platter and both threw it away. The first, got into the top college in the state. By his sophomore year,he was being looked at by recruiters from several top companies (so we were told, no names were mentioned) He had a high gpa and he was having everything paid for him by his mother and stepfather. Didn't have to work, was a full time student. He tossed it all down the drain to go and make untaxable money in Iraq for three years. Money he can't touch until he's 65 or older because it will be heavily taxed. He's drowning debt and working customer service at a call center. His sister went into a teaching program at her high school that taught her enough she would be a qualified teachers aid or sub when she graduated. She had a partial scholarship and a letter of intent. Meaning in two more years she could teach. She tossed it away to go and go and live with some guy and now she works at a gas station.

Me, I had a chance for a partial scholarship. But because I didn't have the money to make up the difference I had to pass. Instead I would have had to settle for a vocational program. And the school I went to, being a female, I had no choice but to take cosmetology. I suffered a breakdown because of it. I got therapy for six weeks and was accepted at a school for gifted teens but I had no transportation. I suffered another breakdown and here I am. I was given nothing, I was severely sheltered and abused. And after years of therapy, I found a way to finally start to stand by myself.

That's what I mean by good being the word to look at. Good parents don't neglect or coddle their children. They teach them to stand.

As a step mother who has 2 children..24,22 and 8 I love my kids...I really do...but the 22 year old and his 20 year old girlfriend needs to get the hell out of my house soon. I don't mind helping him out...but we have made it clear to him..you stay you will get a job and you will keep said job and you will pay rent. He is a smart kid. He is about to become a father himself soon and I know he will be OK. I work from home...and it will not be possible for them to raise a baby in a spare room. I work taking phone calls so a baby screeching in the back round is not going to work...and unlike their cat who goes into heat(which I am paying to have fixed in 2 weeks) And can be kept in their room...A baby cannot.

I will be there to support them but they need a place of their own...they are starting a life with a kid..and we do not have the room for a baby. They were supposed to be with us for a month or two when their old place fell through.(literally part of the roof collapsed) And I will be here for anything they need. But there is a point where they need to stop depending on us and start their own lives.They have been here for 11 months now and they will be moving out at the end of next month which I am happy for them. They will have their own space and they can have more privacy as well as I get my own privacy back and I will no longer be forced to clean up after them.(The 8 year old boy is better at cleaning up his messes then these two.But we also only get him on weekends.)

We are helping them...we arranged for the truck...we are getting their cat fixed so they have extra money...but we knew they were taking advantage of us when they were supposed to get the cat fixed and they instead decided to buy a laptop they did not need they just did not like how thier computer lagged while playing World of Warcraft. (this was also before they knew they were expecting)The baby sort of smacked them upside the heads and made them realize...whoa...OK we need to start growing up here.

So while I will always be here for them and we will steal the baby on occasion they will not be moving back in with us unless something catastrophic happens like a house fire or they are suddenly evicted and then it will come with a time limit.

Oh and have a mentioned that the reason they can now get a place is because every time they paid us rent we would take 50% for house expenses and 50% went into the lock box and we gave it back to them to pay their damage deposit and most of first months rent.

I have also lived with my stepdaughter and her two boys...that was an adventure as well...but eventually she got back out on her own and she is fine now. I love my kids but there is a point when they went from needing help to simply taking advantage of us.There is a line from needing a hand to getting too comfortable.

Ive have fought with the government for benefits I require for my children, for my need to...you know... live. And it frustrates me that your considered an adult when your 18 but you cant truly go out on your own and do it. You need mommy and daddy for college, for information to insurance, benefits and all that Jazz. Not to mention, our soldiers can got to war at 18 but not drink until 21. I believe that until a 'adult' is 21 they can not go over seas or off on missions until they are old enough to truly be adults. I believe we should make up our minds, are we adults when we are 18? or 21?

As a mother I will always take care of my children until the day I die, never abandon them and support them through everything I can, but that doesn't mean that if my (when they are 18) son or daughters decide to do something completely idiotic after they turn 18, that I am as liable as they are. That doesn't mean that I wont stand by them and help them. But still, its something that really needs to be figured out.

I believe that magical age of adulthood is exactly what it is supposed to be. It’s easy to say parents should continue to support their children once they have passed that magical birthday but the problem is if parents continue to supply their eighteen year old the same way they would their two year old, the parent is actually hurting them. My two at the ages of fourteen and twelve, know that at sixteen they will be expected to have a part-time job to pay for the luxuries a sixteen year old wants. They both know that upon graduation they are required to have a part-time job and continue on with their education or a full time job. It may seem harsh, but I had rather have two self-sufficient adult children than one or both free loading in my basement at forty.

No, I wouldn’t kick them out at eighteen but reality would hit hard. No job means endless nights spent with the parents because they can’t afford to go out. At sixteen I worked full time while attending school, at eighteen I did the same. My parents didn’t give me everything that I wanted, and for that I am thankful, because I learned to do it on my own.

There is no guarantee of a tomorrow, and I would actually want to know that when I leave this world, I prepared my two to take care of themselves. Life is hard and it’s expensive, but that is life and it’s easier learned early in life than it is later in life. Sure you let them be kids and enjoy life, but you also have to teach them to want to better their lives.

For example I have a nephew who is over the magical age and quickly approaching legal drinking age. His grandparents, my in laws, raised him. He was allowed to do anything he wanted and giving everything his heart desired, never once having to learn to do anything for himself. Now while I applaud that he actually made it through high school and with a diploma to boot, he has a wife and a baby. Where do they live? With my father in law who is in poor health and for whatever reason continues to support him and his family. It doesn’t matter that the father has found himself relying on his own children at times because he doesn’t bring in the money to support an additional family.

My nephew has certainly taking the stand that everything in life is owed to him and he never has to work. His only income is the food stamps that he brings in and the few hours his wife does work, other than that nothing. He can’t be bothered to mow the lawn or clean up after his family, because in his mind he shouldn’t have to and it’s someone else’s responsibility. Money that he does come across doesn’t go to help with the bills it goes to whatever crazy purchase he and his wife want to make. The problem is when my father in law who is in poor health, is gone, those two ‘adults’ aren’t going to have a clue and they have a baby.

Even if you push the age up a few years and say parents should be responsible until their child is twenty one, the same problems are going to exist when they are twenty two. How many eighteen year olds are willing to lose those privileges of being an adult? When you force the responsibility back onto the parents, then the privileges should go to. That’s my two cents, though.

As a disabled 20 year old, I'll be quite biased on this, but I swear I'm not being whiny or greedy.

For my entire youth until I was 18, my parents were the ones responsible for making sure that I was ready to go out into the world and live, successfully, at that deadline. Instead, I was mentally and emotionally abused, and my ability to function was incredibly crippled. And now, I have to deal with people saying shit like "You're over 18; you should be able to do that by yourself" all the time. But no, I can't do those things by myself, because the parents who were responsible for making sure I could failed to do so.

I don't think parents should be able to "put up with their kids" and then toss them out into the abyss at the first opportunity. An extended obligation to support your children might, at the very least, be more motivation to make sure they're ready to fly the coop as soon as possible.

I'd love for my dad to be legally responsible for my adult psychiatric hospital bills, seeing as he's the reason I was admitted.

I realize this is a very narrow viewpoint, but I just wanted to throw something in there.

I'm in a similar boat. I'm still with my mother and am 20 years old... Disabled with mental conditions and emotionally abused as well. However, my "emotionally abused" isn't cause of my parents (they tried their best) it's cause of many many other people and how I grew up in my area.