Steelers Lounge Podcast #57: Titans Recap – Mike Merriweather

We’ll be hearing all week about Max Starks, formerly of his couch, as the catalyst for the Steelers’ offensive line coming together. Maybe we’re giving him more credit than he’s due but … well, I’m fine with that. After not playing football for 11 months, Starks practiced a few times and when he stepped on the field, the standard was the standard and, ultimately, he played above the line (because style points don’t matter).

Some of the credit also goes to the “Hey, how about no 5-, 7-, …, 25-step drops” game plan that went a long way in keeping Big Ben upright and it even reminded us that Hines Ward can still play a little.

Also playing a little? The defense, including Juan Timmons and … Keenan Lewis. Seriously, Lewis’ effort (other than the late touchdown, which I’m not convinced was completely his fault) was one of the top three highlights for me, after the ROBO-PUNTER fake and Jonathan Dwyer’s first official NFL touch.

The Baltimore game in 2007 is the game that introduced James Harrison to the world.

Anonymous

A 15 yarder wipes out a 5 yarder. That’s standard. The odd thing is in this case the 5 yarder was instant. There was no play. It seems the rules would say the 5 yarder already happened, and in theory had been assessed, by the time the late hit came around. Also, Clark hit a runner tight-roping the sideline and no whistle blew the “play” dead. There’s no way he could be expected to know not to hit that runner.

Woodley was a factor. I think Keisel deserves a lot of credit. He’s makes a difference. Heyward also looked good. I think Hood is solid and is going to be a force in the coming years. But I think after two seasons or so of maturation Heyward has a shot at being another special DE like Smith used to be.

I agree about the state of the CBs. BMac can see dime duty over Mundy. What does it say about Curtis Brown’s development that they elected to put in a safety over him as the dime back?

The rumors about the front office liking Starks but not the coaches doesn’t seem right to me. I doubt there’s anything to it.

Regarding all the injuries, I wonder, are the Steelers missing Ariko Iso?

What’s the reasoning behind switching running backs on a series basis? Wouldn’t it make sense to mix them up within a series?

I think Wallace is the #5 receiver in the league behind Fitzgerald, Johnson, Johnson, and Welker. He’s clearly the Steelers’ #1. But #2? Ward on paper. In practice, any of Ward, Sanders, or Brown. And all three are good #2 receiver in the NFL. Have a look around the league. Our #4 guy, whichever it is, would be a #2 on all but a handful of NFL teams.

GlennW

> There was no play. It seems the rules would say the 5 yarder already
happened, and in theory had been assessed, by the time the late hit came
around.

If the rules were applied in such a manner, they would effectively allow for free cheapshots on such dead plays. As such, the personal foul always takes precedent. (I’m not saying Clark’s hit was a cheapshot– it obviously wasn’t– just making a point on the logic behind the rule. Clark’s hit was questionable but I do think the personal foul call was made based on the runner being out of bounds as opposed to the play being dead.)

Anonymous

I don’t see why that would be so. A cheap shot on a dead play would still yield 15 yards worth of penalty (lose 10 instead of gain 5). It just wouldn’t result in the current 20 yards worth (lose 15 instead of gain 5).

GlennW

Would be, or should be? Here’s the rule description for a minor/major double foul:

Section 3 Fouls by Both Teams
DOUBLE FOUL WITHOUT CHANGE OF POSSESSION
15 YARDS VERSUS 5 YARDS
If one of the fouls is of a nature that incurs a 15-yard penalty and the other foul of a double foul
normally would result in a loss of 5 yards only (15 yards versus 5 yards), the major penalty yardage is
to be assessed from the previous spot.

In the specific play in question I guess it could be argued that the false start and the personal foul were two separate “plays” (because the false start kills the initial play), but the officials ruled them as part of one sequence of events and properly so in my opinion. Regardless the fouls obviously do not offset, and the major personal foul results in an automatic first down.

Anonymous

I’m aware of the double foul rule. What I’m saying is that the events are discrete. Consider them in reverse order. A play ends and there’s a scrum after the play resulting in a 15 yard personal foul on the defense. That penalty is immediately assessed and is a dead ball foul because it happened after the prior play completed. If the offense then lines up and false starts, that 5 yard penalty is also assessed. The referee doesn’t announce false start by rule canceled by the prior personal foul. That’s what happened here. There was a false start. Bang, done. 5 yard penalty. Then there was a dead ball foul after the false start was over and done with.* The fact that a referee doesn’t blow his whistle loud enough doesn’t mean the false start is not immediately assessed, it only means its announcement is delayed. The personal foul happened on a non-play that occurred after a false start had been assessed. Sequentially that’s two fouls and two separate assessments. There is no double foul since that requires play-level simultaneity.

*I’m assuming it was a foul, which it wasn’t, for the sake of argument.

GlennW

Right, I can understand that interpretation per my last paragraph. For whatever reason the referee didn’t rule the plays as discrete, probably because there was confusion on the false-start penalty, the whistle was never blown and play continued. (Originally I thought your point was that the personal foul should have been completely negated because there was in fact “no play” and hence no subsequent penalty should have occurred, but your follow-on post cleared this part of it up for me.)

http://www.steelerslounge.com/ ryan

I must be losing my mind. I seem to only remember penalties — whatever flavor — always offsetting. Clearly, I am playing below the line.

Cols714

I wouldn’t read into Curtis Brown not seeing the field this year. The Steelers very seldom play rookies on D.

I think we should all be very happy with Keenan Lewis. He’s looking like he’s going to be a good one.

Anonymous

That’s not what I meant. I agree Keenan Lewis appears to have made a jump and is earning his play time now. I was talking about the dime package. They brought in Ryan Mundy, a third safety, as the dimeback, but isn’t the dimeback usually a corner? But you’re probably right about playing rookies on D. Probably asking a rookie to learn the dimeback role while also getting up to speed on slot and outside roles delays growth, unless of course LeBeau plans on running a lot of dime.

Cols714

I wouldn’t read into Curtis Brown not seeing the field this year. The Steelers very seldom play rookies on D.

I think we should all be very happy with Keenan Lewis. He’s looking like he’s going to be a good one.

kevin

Wallace is second in DYAR and second in value per play in the league. The number one receiver is different for each one. I would suggest strongly after Wallace lead the league in 3 major statistical categories last year for advanced stats that Wallace has an arguable case for being as good as any of those guys. I would put him fourth behind Fitz, Johnson and Johnson based upon history.

kevin

The Ryan Clark foul was bs. I played that back several times. The runner was still in the field of play. If they wanted to call a personal foul, it probably should have been for leading with the helmet.