H.E. Garchen Rinpoche's Teachings on How toReceive an Empowerment Online:

The touching of the vase to the crown of the head is the outer empowerment. The inner empowerment is to visualize yourself as the deity. The real empowerment is to realize the nature of your mind.

When you cultivate bodhicitta, that is the real deity, and when you do this, that is when you actually receive the empowerment over the internet.

If you live near the temple and think, "Oh, I don't need to go to the temple; I can just receive the empowerment over the internet," that is not the right motivation. If you have the opportunity to come to the temple, then you should come.If you don't live nearby and cannot come, but with all your heart would like to, that is the right motivation for receiving the empowerment over the internet.

Whoever has faith and devotion will receive the empowerment regardless of where they are, because the dharmakaya pervades like space. Even if you come to the temple to receive an empowerment, if you have no devotion you still will not receive it.

To quote Lord Jigten Sumgon, "You receive the empowerment only when you understand the meaning of the empowerment."

heart wrote:I really think you have to watch this live if you really want the empowerment. Recordings are no good.

/magnus

Magnus is right, the dharmakaya only pervades everything during the empowerment. The rest of the time you are SOL.

If people have faith in this, then fine. I don't personally believe one can receive a valid empowerment though a recording. But that is just me following the advice of my guru. Your mileage might vary.

heart wrote:I really think you have to watch this live if you really want the empowerment. Recordings are no good.

/magnus

Magnus is right, the dharmakaya only pervades everything during the empowerment. The rest of the time you are SOL.

and how does not the dharmakaya pervade everything if its not empowerment. dharmakaya pervades everything period.

and what is SOL.

I read in the bardo guidebook by Chokyi Nyima Rinpoche that if you dont generate realization during the empowerment, you dont receive the empowerment. you just receive the blessing of having participated in the empowerment. and i think this is a common misunderstanding among westerners that what empowerment actually is. people just think that if the vase or torma touches your head you receive the empowerment. i think that way you only get permission to practice the deity if you get the lung with it, connection to the deity and the guru. but no empowerment. you dont receive the blessing and the realization that the guru is offering you. i think you will receive as much as you are open and receptive. and from my point of view, dharmakaya pervades everything and transcends time so recording or not its the same. and sometimes when i listen to a recording of something its like God is directly talking to me, so i defenitely think and believe that there are blessings and empowerments in the recordings, allthough it is not the same as receiving empowerment live in the gompa or through livestream.

but if Garchen Rinpoche says you can receive the empowerment through the recordings i would believe him, and this is the second thread i have come across someone saying you can receive them through recordings. i think its mostly up to you if you are open to receive the empowerment or not.

If the thought of demons Never rises in your mind, You need not fear the demon hosts around you. It is most important to tame your mind within....

In so far as the Ultimate, or the true nature of being is concerned, there are neither buddhas or demons. He who frees himself from fear and hope, evil and virtue, will realize the insubstantial and groundless nature of confusion. Samsara will then appear as the mahamudra itself….

If the thought of demons Never rises in your mind, You need not fear the demon hosts around you. It is most important to tame your mind within....

In so far as the Ultimate, or the true nature of being is concerned, there are neither buddhas or demons. He who frees himself from fear and hope, evil and virtue, will realize the insubstantial and groundless nature of confusion. Samsara will then appear as the mahamudra itself….

KonchokZoepa wrote:but if Garchen Rinpoche says you can receive the empowerment through the recordings i would believe him, and this is the second thread i have come across someone saying you can receive them through recordings. i think its mostly up to you if you are open to receive the empowerment or not.

Then why watch the recording, you could just pick up any empowerment you want at any time, no? Good luck with that!

/magnus

"To reject practice by saying, 'it is conceptual!' is the path of fools. A tendency of the inexperienced and something to be avoided."- Longchenpa

i think you ignored that quote and did not really read it. or want to hear it.

If the thought of demons Never rises in your mind, You need not fear the demon hosts around you. It is most important to tame your mind within....

In so far as the Ultimate, or the true nature of being is concerned, there are neither buddhas or demons. He who frees himself from fear and hope, evil and virtue, will realize the insubstantial and groundless nature of confusion. Samsara will then appear as the mahamudra itself….

KonchokZoepa wrote:i think you ignored that quote and did not really read it. or want to hear it.

No, the only quote by Garchen Rinpoche in this thread is not talking about recordings. I have taken several empowerment's from Garchen Rinpoche in live webcasts and the quote above corresponds to what he said in those teachings. He wasn't talking about recordings, he was talking about live streaming.

/magnus

"To reject practice by saying, 'it is conceptual!' is the path of fools. A tendency of the inexperienced and something to be avoided."- Longchenpa

The touching of the vase to the crown of the head is the outer empowerment. The inner empowerment is to visualize yourself as the deity. The real empowerment is to realize the nature of your mind.

When you cultivate bodhicitta, that is the real deity, and when you do this, that is when you actually receive the empowerment over the internet.

If you live near the temple and think, "Oh, I don't need to go to the temple; I can just receive the empowerment over the internet," that is not the right motivation. If you have the opportunity to come to the temple, then you should come.If you don't live nearby and cannot come, but with all your heart would like to, that is the right motivation for receiving the empowerment over the internet.

Whoever has faith and devotion will receive the empowerment regardless of where they are, because the dharmakaya pervades like space. Even if you come to the temple to receive an empowerment, if you have no devotion you still will not receive it.

To quote Lord Jigten Sumgon, "You receive the empowerment only when you understand the meaning of the empowerment."

i dont think this quotes outrules recordings.

If the thought of demons Never rises in your mind, You need not fear the demon hosts around you. It is most important to tame your mind within....

In so far as the Ultimate, or the true nature of being is concerned, there are neither buddhas or demons. He who frees himself from fear and hope, evil and virtue, will realize the insubstantial and groundless nature of confusion. Samsara will then appear as the mahamudra itself….

The touching of the vase to the crown of the head is the outer empowerment. The inner empowerment is to visualize yourself as the deity. The real empowerment is to realize the nature of your mind.

When you cultivate bodhicitta, that is the real deity, and when you do this, that is when you actually receive the empowerment over the internet.

If you live near the temple and think, "Oh, I don't need to go to the temple; I can just receive the empowerment over the internet," that is not the right motivation. If you have the opportunity to come to the temple, then you should come.If you don't live nearby and cannot come, but with all your heart would like to, that is the right motivation for receiving the empowerment over the internet.

Whoever has faith and devotion will receive the empowerment regardless of where they are, because the dharmakaya pervades like space. Even if you come to the temple to receive an empowerment, if you have no devotion you still will not receive it.

To quote Lord Jigten Sumgon, "You receive the empowerment only when you understand the meaning of the empowerment."

i dont think this quotes outrules recordings.

It certainly doesn't include them. This above is more or less what he said during one livestream I participated in. It was obvious to me he was talking about livestream and not recordings.

/magnus

"To reject practice by saying, 'it is conceptual!' is the path of fools. A tendency of the inexperienced and something to be avoided."- Longchenpa

I am eager to hear the official response. This is an interesting issue that lamas have very divergent viewpoints about.

In order to ensure my mind never comes under the power of the self-cherishing attitude,I must obtain control over my own mind. Therefore, amongst all empowerments, the empowerment that gives me control over my mind is the best,and I have received the most profound empowerment with this teaching.-Atisha Dipamkarabrtsal ba'i bkhra drin

The answer from the Garchen Institute is unambiguous and as follows (emphasis added):

We were told the following by Garchen Rinpoche for empowerments that Garchen Institute has put on Ustream. The recordings can be included as well as the livestream. It is not my impression that these apply to all empowerments available online, but for the ones he’s approved. Other lamas may have different requirements and it is important to follow the instructions of the Lama giving the empowerments.

Hello Everyone,

We have received several inquiries asking if one actually receives the empowerment if done by streaming, and following is Rinpoche’s reply:

“The touching of the vase to the crown of the head is the outer empowerment. The inner empowerment is to visualize yourself as the deity. The real empowerment is to realize the nature of your mind.“When you cultivate bodhicitta, that is the real deity, and when you do this, that is when you actually receive the empowerment over the internet.“If you live near the temple and think, ‘Oh, I don’t need to go to the temple; I can just receive the empowerment over the internet,’ that is not the right motivation. If you have the opportunity to come to the temple, then you should come.

“If you don't live nearby and cannot come, but with all your heart would like to, that is the right motivation for receiving the empowerment over the internet.”