Comments on: Miami-Dade mayor: “The freedom-loving people” of Miami want Ozzie Guillen firedhttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/
Baseball. Baseball. And then a bit more baseball.Thu, 22 Feb 2018 05:48:59 +0000hourly1http://wordpress.com/By: g2-3c5b498d48de9435d74d063fd723eb8fhttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/comment-page-2/#comment-282815
Wed, 11 Apr 2012 14:22:18 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282815“The freedom-loving people” of Miami need to embrace freedom of speech.
]]>By: thraiderskinhttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282481
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 18:54:27 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282481Its not that I don’t realize all the political flame-throwers out there, but plenty of Democrats pull the 1st amendment card when it jeopardizes their agenda, but say little when it is something they disagree with, take a look at how the ACLU works. Bill Maher is a comedian, but he is also a major political donor, who just gave 1 million dollars to Obama’s re-election. Rush Limbaugh might not be your traditional donor, but he is a political commentator who makes him money by making off-the wall comments for the “benefit” of conservatives. Yet a phone call was made to a young woman who was called a whore, by flame-thrower Limbaugh, but OUR President didn’t feel the need to call a young woman after she had been verbally assaulted by Bill Maher? While Maher may be a political comedian, the entirety of his show is not a comediac act and he generally goes after major political issues, including very serious ones. It is simply one of many double-standards that the Right gets hit with, but the left goes by unscathed, I wish I could implament the Bill of Rights only when it suits me.
]]>By: Old Gatorhttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282377
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 17:15:46 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282377First of all, Obama made that call to a woman who had just given congressional testimony. Maher is a comedian criticizing a cultural cartoon. There is a difference between intervening in a matter of public policy and concern, and intervening in a private pissing match between two clowns. But that distinction is subtle and clearly eluded you.

As far as this so-called anti-conservative talk show bill, how far did it get among the Democratic house members? How precisely was it worded, anyway – not that I would ever doubt your interpretation of it, of course. I grant you that this is an unfair question is some ways because it does take focus and discipline to move a bill through congress and we are discussing Democrats here. But you single out a couple of whack jobs, and I’m talking about behavior endemic to an entire party. Again, a subtle difference. Don’t hurt yourself thinking about it because tectonic activity is subsuming this thread under about three thousand others already.

]]>By: koufaxmitzvahhttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282283
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 16:26:18 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282283A logical consequence of free speech used by a baseball manager is not to fire the baseball manager because a vocal minority wants him gone. A logical consequence is to conduct a boycott of the enterprise, if you so desire, but to demand that the man, who has apologized profusely, lose his livelihood over one line of an entire interview reeks of ignorance.

Sorry, Dan. Lest you believe that your postings here should be shown to your boss with demands that you be demoted for wasting company time and whatnot. Anonymous folks sure do like to shout.

]]>By: Gamera the Bravehttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282277
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 16:21:40 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282277js,
I was appreciating the sarcasm of your statement, when I came to the (I suspect) gratuitous addition of the word “prolonged”.
That word graduated your comment from “pretty funny” to “all my co-workers are wondering why I am laughing my ass off right now”…
]]>By: js20011041http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282245
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 16:06:50 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282245autmorsautlibertas

There is a vast difference between organizing for a cause being a part of a cause that uses its strength in numbers to suppress the voice of dissenters. I am a part of what would be considered a special interest group. I am a member of the IAFF firefighters union. What we do is fight for what is in our best interests. I fail to see how the destruction of Ozzie Guillen’s career does anything positive for the Cuban community. That is the difference between what you are arguing for and what I am arguing for. Just because you have the freedom to do something, that doesn’t make it right. I have the absolute freedom to stand on a street corner holding a sign that says “I hate niggers.” That doesn’t make it right. I’m not saying that the government has the authority to intervene and tell Cubans that they don’t have the right to protest. I’m simply saying the response to the comments that Ozzie Guillen made have been so completely far over the line that I can’t help but think that Cubans have done themselves more harm than good in this case.

]]>By: rooney24http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/comment-page-2/#comment-282236
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 16:02:41 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282236At what point did ANYONE expect Ozzie to change and not say everything that was on his mind (which are often dumb and/or offensive)? The team knew what they were getting when they acquired him. It is ridiculous that some think he should be fired over one stupid statement.
]]>By: autmorsautlibertashttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/comment-page-2/#comment-282234
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 16:01:37 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282234I still stand by the “run him out of Florida” statement. Such statements are not consistent with his responsibilities and position. Ozzie alienated a large portion of his team’s fan base. This incident has potential to affect the team financially. On “business” grounds alone, the Marlins should discharge him. Based upon the reaction of the Cuban-American community in Florida, I suspect that they will not be able to forgive him.
]]>By: autmorsautlibertashttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282200
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:45:18 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282200JS- Where did you get the idea that I was a Cuban-American? I am a white mid-westerner who has protected other people’s freedom of speech in court. Also, although the term “special interests” has been given a negative meaning by the liberal press, “special interests” play an important role in our system of government. Special interests are formed when a group of citizens who have a common political ideas join together to make their opinions heard. The National Organization of Women, The National Rifle Association, AARP, and the various environmental groups would fit into this category. A group of Americans organizing around a common belief is completely consistent with liberty. If they choose to call for someone’s head, that is their right, just like it your right to oppose them.
]]>By: cur68http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282193
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:39:41 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282193Gator my friend, I’m not sure what goes on South Of The Border from me sometimes (due in large part to my ear drums being frozen solid), but all this “Fire Ozzy” crap is beyond stupid. I thought your country believed in freedom of speech? Persecution for political belief, sexual preference, or religious leanings was against your laws, wasn’t it? How is this not persecuting Guillen for some relatively mild comments about Castro’s longevity as a political leader? Sorry if this sounds like I’m making you account for your countries curious interpretation of some pretty straightforward laws, but I don’t know how you stand it there, and frankly, I just want to say, WTF /..\ ?
]]>By: citizenkane9http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/comment-page-2/#comment-282190
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:33:11 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282190Let’s go over hisory here. Castro toppled the regime of Fulgencio Batista, who was a dictator. Under his regime, many peasant Cuban’s lived in a life of misery and many were imprisoned and killed. Castro, with a small band of revolutionaires, took over the government and for that he should be praised. A large majority of Cuban’s, who “fled” were the aristocratic members of society, who benefited from Batista. The reason there is so much hatred for Castro, in this country and the reason the blockade is still in effect is that Castro used the Soviet Union as a pawn to promote his agenda. His agenda came from the hatred of most Cubans for the United States because of their involvemnt in the Spanish American War. The Cuban’s had a history of wars with Spain, for which they lost and finally, at the end of the 19th century they were winning their latest war with Spain, via attrition. At this point President McKinley decided that the United States should get involved because, at the time, sugar was an important commodity. After the war, the United States decided to take control and signed the Platt Amendment, which said that Cuba could be an independent country, in name only and that they could not refine their own sugar, borrow money from any other country, except ours and they could not allow any other country to have a military base in Cuba. Because of the fact that Cuba had all of this sugar, and that most of the money went to the United States were it was refined Cuba saw little profit. Castro was born in 1926 and most of his generation had a deep hatred for our country. This was evident during the Bay of Pigs, when the assumption was that the people would welcome the soldiers with open arms and aid in the invasion. Of course, this did not happen and Presiden Kennedy cancelled the air strike that was planned and the soldiers were captured. It was an embarrasment for this country and a victory for Castro. Anyway, the fact of the matter is that Cuba, a tiny island has held the United States at bay for over 50 years and the “Batista” Cubans have been fighting him ever since. Now, Catro did become a ruthless dicator over time, but the fact of the matter is that today, most of Cuba’s population is literate and they all have health care. What Ozzie said would only offend “Batista” Cuban’s, who in my opinion, are as hypocritical as anyone who speaks the word freedom with one side of the mouth and who want to suppress that freedom with the other side. Where I come from, there is a saying about “Batista” Cuban’s, we call them come mierdas.
]]>By: js20011041http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/comment-page-2/#comment-282189
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:32:13 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282189Yes, if that were the case the Jews would be a special interest group with an axe to grind. Why is that so hard to understand? Why does holding him accountable for this particularly benign statement mean putting pressure on the team to fire him? Why is it unacceptable to for the Cuban community to simply condemn his words without trying to get him fired? Under your thinking, is it appropriate for those who condemn the reaction of the Cuban community to organize boycotts of all Cuban businesses?

And by the way, I’m still waiting for an explanation for your “they should run him out of Florida” comment.

]]>By: kiwicrickethttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282188
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:30:43 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282188Nice
]]>By: js20011041http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282177
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:23:00 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282177Kevin, you and I are just going to have to agree to disagree on this. What the Westboro Baptist Church does causes some emotional harm to the families of the soldiers, but they can be ignored. In fact they are often placed far enough away from the funerals as to have almost no perceivable presence. What these people are doing has real, tangible effects. I do think that using a mob mentality where whoever is loudest and angriest gets to suppress the opinions of those that oppose them is disgusting. There are ways to voice your dissapproval without trying to destroy someone’s career.
]]>By: autmorsautlibertashttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/comment-page-2/#comment-282171
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:21:21 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282171JS- Under your reasoning, people should be able to say whatever they want and face no negative reaction for doing so. So, if Ozzie said, “I love Hitler” you would conclude that since Jewish people would protest vocally and call for the Marlins to fire him, they are a special interest with an axe to grind? People have a right to make whatever statements they wish, but the public has a right to interpret those remarks however they wish, and respond with their own expression of freedom of speech. Ozzie CHOSE to publicly comment on a controversial subject, he does not get a “pass” on the response from the public because he was merely exercising his free speech. If a man chooses to make a public statement on a controversial subject, he must answer his critics publicly. Ozzie chose the forum and the subject matter. No one is trying to “oppress” free speech, they are just holding him accountable for things HE said.
]]>By: Kevin S.http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282148
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:11:08 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282148I actually think that what Guillen said was fairly benign. Foolish, but benign. That doesn’t change the fact that the Cuban-American community getting up in arms against him isn’t nearly as repugnant as what WBC does. There’s orders of magnitude of difference there.
]]>By: rcalihttp://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/comment-page-2/#comment-282141
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:09:23 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282141It’s just Ozzie being Ozzie everybody. Selig has let this clown run his mouth for years and now it’s coming back to bite MLB.
]]>By: js20011041http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282133
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:04:24 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282133Dan

Why does Guillen necessarily need to explain his statement? This isn’t a case of the President or some other political figure saying “you know the one thing Hitler got right? The extermination of the Jews.” It was largely innocuous statement made by a baseball manager. Why can’t people either say they disagree with him, or simply ignore him? Why is it ok for Cubans to ask for his head on a stick but Guillen offering respect for Castro’s ability to survive is going way over the line?

]]>By: dad95http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/#comment-282131
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:03:04 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282131Thank you Old Gator for the correction on the Mr Gimenez.Since I wrote that post,I see Ozzie is suspended for 5 games for his comments.Just a bandaid…..Gotta find a new favorite team now.
]]>By: js20011041http://mlb.nbcsports.com/2012/04/10/miami-dade-mayor-the-freedom-loving-people-of-miami-want-ozzie-guillen-fired/comment-page-2/#comment-282112
Tue, 10 Apr 2012 14:56:28 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=136586#comment-282112That’s exactly it. There is a way to express your disapproval of Guillen’s comment without deliberately trying to ruin his career. And given the group that is outraged in this instance, it’s especially hypocritical.
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