Happy St. Patrick's Day from MSNBC: 'Tradition of Irish Catholicism Was a Bigotry Against LGBT People'

On Monday's MSNBC News Nation, host Tamron Hall teed up
Michael O'Loughlin from The Advocate to promote his screed against the
St. Patrick's Day parade organizers in New York and Boston for not
allowing gay demonstrations at the respective events. Hall wondered:
"What do you believe is the hold up at this point?...you see polls
across the country where people, in their views of same-sex marriage of
people who are gay and lesbian, greatly changed over the past ten years
or so." [Listen to the audio]

O'Loughlin ranted: "You know, no one loves tradition like the
Irish. And unfortunately, part of the tradition of Irish Catholicism was
a bigotry against LGBT people." Moments later he predicted:
"Give it a year and who knows where we'll be." Hall agreed: "Absolutely.
And give it a year and the list of sponsors who may pull out of these
parades could be longer as well."

Later in the exchange, Hall cited O'Loughlin's Advocate Op/Ed: "...you wrote, 'It wasn't long ago in this country that the Irish and Roman Catholics were both subject to extreme bigotry.' I think it's a significant point as we have this conversation, as you pointed out in your piece."

O'Loughlin replied:

Sure. You know, my father keeps a sign in our kitchen at home, "No
Irish need apply," just to remember the bigotry that the Irish
experienced in this country when they first came over. So it's
unfortunate that some Irish people who are leading these parades are
kind of passing that bigotry on. But I'm hopeful that in the next few
years we'll see a change.

Here is a full transcript of the March 17 segment:

11:49 AM ET

TAMRON HALL: Welcome back. Decked out in green, crowds are lined up
along New York City's Fifth Avenue to take part in the biggest St.
Patrick's Day parade in the country. Well, in a stunning announcement
late yesterday, Irish beer-maker Guinness dropped its sponsorship,
citing the event's policy of exclusion of the gay and lesbian groups.

Under the parade's organizer's policies, members of the LGBT community
are allowed to March. However, they cannot carry signs identifying
their sexual orientation.

The company, which is the biggest sponsor of the parade, released a
statement saying in part, "Guinness has a strong history of supporting
diversity and being an advocate for equality for all."

The bold move by Guinness joins a growing list of those protesting the
policy, including Heineken, which pulled out last week, and New York
City Mayor Bill de Blasio, who's boycotting the parade as well.

The almost exact situation clouded Boston's parade yesterday, with the
city's mayor Marty Walsh also boycotting and the maker of Sam Adam's
beer withdrawing its sponsorship.

Joining me now, Michael O'Loughlin, contributor for The Advocate
magazine, who recently wrote about the controversy. Michael, thanks for
your time here.

MICHAEL O'LOUGHLIN: Sure, happy St. Patrick's Day.

HALL: I am so curious by the actions taken by these major sponsors, if the policies will change this time next year?

O'LOUGHLIN: You know, I think they will. You know, back in 1995, the
Supreme Court said that these organizers had a right to discriminate and
we support their free speech rights, but sponsors and politicians also
have the right not to participate. And there's been an impressively fast
shift in support for same-sex marriage and LGBT rights. So it's not
surprising that there's increasingly a lot of backlash this time of year
against these parades.

HALL: So for clarification here, so people understand. If you are gay,
you can – if you're a firefighter whose gay, you can march with your
firefighter group and go along. But if you're in an organization that
identifies itself as a lesbian/gay organization, you cannot have your
banner in the parade in New York City.

O'LOUGHLIN: Sure. And it's important to remember that for LGBT people
who have been kept in the closet for so long, it's not helpful to ask
them to go march back into the closet and not identify with a core part
of themselves.

HALL: What do you believe is the hold up at this point? To your point,
I mean, listen, you see polls across the country where people, in their
views of same-sex marriage of people who are gay and lesbian, greatly
changed over the past ten years or so. We're talking major cities here
as well, Boston and New York, which bucks the perception that these
kinds of things only happen in small towns like where I'm from. But
rather, these are big-city problems that are counter to the polling
nationally.

O'LOUGHLIN: You know, no one loves tradition like the Irish. And
unfortunately, part of the tradition of Irish Catholicism was a bigotry
against LGBT people. Now with Pope Francis and other Catholic leaders
saying, "Let's take another look at these things," I think the Church
and the military – the parade in Boston's sponsored by a military group –
they've both come around and said, you know, this isn't right. So it'll
be slow, but hopefully by this time next year there'll be a compromise.
We almost saw a compromise in Boston this year with a group of openly
gay soldiers marching. So give it a year and who knows where we'll be.

HALL: Absolutely. And give it a year and the list of sponsors who may pull out of these parades could be longer as well.

I'm curious, I mean, usually when a company pulls out sponsorship –
yes, they have their core values, as Heineken says, "We believe in
equality for all. We are no longer sponsors of Monday's parade." But we
also know that they are in fear of losing business.

O'LOUGHLIN: Sure, and you know, as public perception increasingly
supports LGBT people, I think companies have to realize that they need
to be on right side of history. And it's great that a few prominent
sponsors this year decided to take that step and support-

HALL: And – go ahead, I'm sorry.

O'LOUGHLIN: Oh, no. And just support the right of LGBT people to be themselves.

HALL: And just quickly here, you wrote, "It wasn't long ago in this
country that the Irish and Roman Catholics were both subject to extreme
bigotry." I think it's a significant point as we have this conversation,
as you pointed out in your piece.

O'LOUGHLIN: Sure. You know, my father keeps a sign in our kitchen at
home, "No Irish need apply," just to remember the bigotry that the Irish
experienced in this country when they first came over. So it's
unfortunate that some Irish people who are leading these parades are
kind of passing that bigotry on. But I'm hopeful that in the next few
years we'll see a change.

HALL: Alright, Michael O'Loughlin, thank you so much for joining us,
The Advocate magazine. We greatly appreciate, Michael, thank you.

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