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Ugh. Do I have to admit this? OK, I’m on Facebook. I was checking my Facebook page today to see what kind of dorky shit the people I know who have Facebook pages were doing and I happened to spy a teensy little ad in the column to the right of the page. The ad was for a place called Dimples Kids Spa (nice name — pardon me while I puke), which is located in Brooklyn Heights. I love New York sometimes, but I really hate it sometimes too. If someone can come up with a disgusting, insulting way to part people and their money, it’ll happen here first. This place has been open for a bit, so I’m sure there’s something similar in LA by now, but whatever. New York is the world capital of offensive profligacy, the city that offers the rich asshole the largest variety of opportunities to communicate the fact that she/he is evil by doing things like pissing off to eat a $1000 ice cream sundae after blindly waltzing past a woman begging for change for some corporate shit-burger with no nutritional value. And what better way to tell the world and all of its poor people that they can collectively huff a dong than to throw hundreds of dollars away on spa treatments for children?

Hence we have Dimples Kids Spa. If you live in Brooklyn Heights and just can’t figure out how to waste your money quickly enough, toss your kid into your Orbit Baby Infant Carrying System (MSRP $900), stop off for an $8 non-alcoholic beverage, and then drop her ass off for a spa day (drop your son off at the park where he can exercise and develop coordination and motor skills). At Dimples, your little girl can “indulge” in hair, nail, and facial services, and they even do parties! Their services include temporary tattoos (what your daughter really needs is a temporary lower back tattoo), manicures, pedicures, chocolate facials, strawberry honey facials, hair braiding, hair styling for the “evening” (you know, for all of those black-tie events), and flat-ironing. Because nothing looks less sexy on a kid than wavy hair.

What the fuck!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Has everyone lost sight of what spas (massage services notwithstanding) and salons are really about? They do nothing other than enable women to waste their lives and money striving for the ever-elusive beauty standards that our society sets up for them. And whence do those standards derive? From boners. Salons and spas exist to help women increase the number of men who want to fuck them, and that’s it. All of this bullshit about “self-indulgence” and “empowerment” and “me time” is fucking absurd. I mean, sure, it’s a good idea, if you have to waste several hours a week on your appearance, to make the wasting of those hours as pleasant as possible, but women wouldn’t do any of that shit if we weren’t told that we are blowing it as human beings if we don’t look like gold-dusted, semi-moist cartoons.

The fact that the average woman’s idea of the ultimate way to spend a day so often involves hundreds of dollars’ worth of beauty treatments ought to show you that there’s something seriously amiss with femininity, our cultural ideas of what’s sexually attractive, and capitalism. Feminity is a fucking jail sentence, not an “indulgence.” It requires that we sacrifice our time, energy, and self-worth chasing a goal we’ll never reach, the goal of being adequate as human beings when “adequacy” for women means hotness and when the definition of what’s hot changes every second. Our social construction of what is attractive binds women into a never-ceasing downward spiral of self-hatred and doubt, because our social construction of what is attractive springs from misogyny and is abetted by capitalism. Capitalism doesn’t work if we have a sense of “good enough,” and the entire world of marketing and product development exist to remind us that there’s no such thing as “good enough.” We don’t have enough shit, we aren’t hot enough, we haven’t put forth the effort or spent the money that we need to. We have to take that next step on the staircase to nowhere in order to be a little bit less worthless.

I have a good idea! Let’s introduce our daughters into this fucking mess as early as possible so that they’ll never have a chance to escape it! Let’s make sure that they learn that their lives ought to revolve around how much sexual attention they can get from men, and quick! Get ’em started on mani-pedis, facials, and the idea that the natural texture of their hair is an abomination as early as possible. It shouldn’t be that hard to convince a female child to accompany mom to the salon in the current Pepto-Bismol environment young girls are forced to live in, just tell her there’ll be lots of pink shit and that she’ll feel like a princess. Of course it’s not inappropriate to sexualize a 6-year-old and to encourage her to objectify herself. It’s good, clean mommy-daugther bonding action!

For those of you new moms, Dimples Kids Spa has an even better option. They do baby mani-pedis, so you can get your daughter onto the femininity track as a baby so that, by the time she’s five, wearing nail polish and having facials will come as naturally to her as tilting her head and pretending to be stupid and dainty when men talk to her. Hey, if you don’t get her used to the idea early on that she exists on this Earth to be looked at and lusted after, she might get the foolish idea that she’s a human being, and we all know that leads to disappointment, frustration, and a sense of unfairness — and then on to FEMINISM! And we wouldn’t want that. Men don’t want to fuck feminists, and if no one wants to fuck you, what power have you got as a woman?

Wake up, you fucking dupes. If not for yourselves, then for your daughters. I understand that as things are, sex appeal is one of the few sources of power that women have, but it doesn’t have to be that way. We don’t have to allow our worth as human beings be determined by advertisers, by the fashion industry, by how much male lust we can garner, but the only hope we have is that we start teaching young girls the right things, and the right things don’t include chocolate facials. I didn’t start hearing that it was my responsibility numero uno to put shit all over my face, fingers, and hair every day in service of the fuckability mandate until I was an adolescent. As such, I stood some chance of seeing it for the inconvenience and outrage that it is. Had I been coated in face masks and nail polish at the age of 6, I’d have stood absolutely no chance, especially if the coating took place in a cutesty party environment and if it was presented as a bonding experience with mommy.

I just de-lurked to say that this is a truly face-melting rant and I love it! You really got down to all the connections and problems that make this kids’ spa (which, at first glance, seems gross, but not too big a deal) totally reprehensible. It’s indoctrination into the religion of the beauty mandate… trapping girls early, just like you said, and it works along with every other screwed up requirement for women in our society.

We’ve got one in Columbus, OH called Sweet & Sassy. The name is enough to make me want to vomit. I found out about it because my friend took her 11 & 7 yr old daughters to the grand opening and then told me about it. I said “Are you fucking kidding me? Why would you encourage this fucked up shit?” And I fucking shit you not, she said don’t swear in front of the girls. Way to completely miss the fucking point. We are taking giant steps backwards in women’s rights and people are happily signing up to help dismantle any strides that have been made.

Ugh. Back in high school when I desperately needed a job, a friend referred me to work at Club Libby Lu (which is currently shut down all over the country, thankfully). I worked there for about a month before I had to quit due to serious moral issues. We were basically getting paid to turn little girls into prostitots while their “doting” parents stood around with video cameras as their kids changed into sequined tube tops and skirts. They had us teach the girls choreographed dance routines to both Hannah Montana songs and some pretty lyrically questionable hip hop songs, while the parents coaxed them to shake their hips and pose. I actually walked out of a party one day when a little girl started crying because she didn’t want to wear makeup, and her mother forced her to. The mom ended up coming back and yelling at us because the makeup gave the girl a rash. Terrible parenting, terrible store, and good riddance that it’s gone. Saks was smart to close it down.

Wow. Dimples Kids’ Spa? That does make me feel quite uncomfortable to hear. Anything that tells little girls they should want/need to go to a “spa” at that age makes me cringe. I have a feeling it is more about the over-indulgent parents (mothers who want pretty little babies) than the kids themselves.

However, I do have a side note about spas and beauty. The rising standards of beauty for women are not only perpetrated by men, but by OTHER women. If you ask men what they really want out of woman, they most likely will not tell you they want you to go pretty yourself up at a spa all day and come home to put on lingerie. Yeah, some men like that- hell, lots like it- but it isn’t all they want. Men want intelligent and compatible partners, too. A spa, for me, really is a place for relaxation. I don’t usually go, due to the cost, but I certainly don’t go to increase my boner potential (nor does any man seem to want me to).

I loathe the idea of turning any female into an object of sex. The concept of doing this to a child is atrocious. However, I remember how I felt when I was a little girl: being pretty ruled. It doesn’t matter how you raise a child. It doesn’t matter how equal you try to treat your little boy and little girl. Some girls will always want to dress up like Disney princesses and wear mommy’s makeup.

Does this program our children to think in stereotyped gender roles? Perhaps it does. Yet, perhaps when a little girl just wants to play around the way girls do, it is in fact empowering. I had makeup, Barbies, high heels, dresses, and all sorts of things that could be seen as offensive or stereotypical of the female gender role. Today, I am no prize pony, but i have no qualms about it. Plenty of men are attracted to me the way I am.

True confidence comes from within. Sure, the media and outside influence can make any woman today feel bad about her appearance, or make her feel like she must have sex appeal in order to have power. however, what is most important is to stress to our children the importance of intellect, respect, and gender equality, NOT to suppress a little girl’s natural tendencies.

What I do agree with you on is mothers pressing their little girls into something like this. A mother is a role model for her children, and if she teaches them that a girl’s role is to look pretty, a long life of unhappiness and unfulfilled expectations could ensue. Thank you for bringing attention to places like this. Even if their intentions were sound, people should be aware of the messages they are sending to today’s youth.

Did you really just insinuate that being brainwashed to perpetuate what I like to call Patriarchy/XXX2k Compliance [thanks Twisty] is a ”little girl’s natural tendency”?

There was a troll here once who insisted, in ALL CAPS nonetheless, that ”all women [actually, he said girls, but meant adult women] want to look pretty it’s natural they’re born with it.” On the subject of anal bleaching.
I really don’t think you want to be associated with that dude.

Yeah, getting a mud mask or whatever can feel really nice. It’s pleasant to get itchy dry skin and dirt off one’s self. I like to do that sometimes too, and I’m a hairy-legged makeupless queer who wears flat shoes. See, the desire to take care of one’s own body and bring oneself pleasurable sensations is by no means driven by an innate desire to ”look pretty”, and it’s definitely not an innate desire to go to a spa to have that done.

Horses, for example, remove dry skin and dirt from themselves by rolling in mud, then shaking really hard once the mud dries to flake it off. However, it has nothing to do with looking pretty for them. In fact, a mud-covered horse looks just like that — a mud-covered horse. It doesn’t attract male horses or make them breed more. It’s just what they do to feel good.
Meanwhile, hippos, rhinos, and elephants have birds land on them to peck dirt and skin off their hides. Primates groom each other with their hands, and so on. There is NOTHING innate about going to an expensive establishment staffed by either rich white people or former sex-trafficked immigrant women to have it done. Such practices are especially null when you are six. fucking. years old and it’s someone else’s idea to begin with.

Go outside and roll in a mud pit instead, or have some friends come over to pick fleas off of you, or hose you off with their trunks [or a hose, if you are not pachyderms]. It feels great, it costs less, it’s grand fun, and it’s much more ”natural.”
[Also, and this might just be me, but it’s what I would have rather done when I was A FUCKING CHILD.]

If you want to continue to think otherwise, fine, spend your money. But remember as you do — you’re buying snake oil.

That’s just awful. But people who create these things don’t care. They just want a way to capitalise on society’s expectations. Why should it matter to them that they’re perpetuating outdated gender roles, so long as their pockets are nicely padded?

I have never liked most spa services (except for massages), and whenever I got anything done it was usually my mom coercing me into it. no matter how nice some of them feel, the underlying idea that it’s my “womanly duty” to “improve” myself by doing them downright disturbs me.

I mean don’t get me wrong I still get bikini waxes when I can afford to
but those are more for practical reasons since I never wear anything that doesn’t reach my knees even when I’m at the beach.

I would like to toilet paper that place. Too bad I don’t live anywhere near New York. All I have to say is, thank you mom for not ever buying into that shit and raising me to do the same (…to not do the same? Uh, you get the idea…..)

I came across this from StumbleUpon. Absolutely agree with you 100%. Your description of what passes for ‘feminity’ in our society is SPOT ON. The world is completely mad, sick and wants women to be unhappy. I want a world better than that for my wife and daughters, and for me as well.

I led a girl scouts camping trip one weekend to get the mandatory community service hours I needed to graduate high school. Instead of teaching them how to camp or tie a knot or something, I had to teach 113 girls how to make thier own lip gloss. My co-workers taught how to make facials, paint nails, and make yarn purses that they could carry the shit they made home with them. I felt a bit sick doing it, but I think you’ve really hit the nail on its polished head here.

Ugh. So that’s why it is called girl scouts?
In Germany, it is, to my knowledge, just called the same for both sexes, and they get to do the same things.
Really, why even call it “scouts” if no scouting is done? Sounds ridiculous.

I’ve been reading this blog from the beginning and I think this is your best post yet. I kept laughing because everything you said is so true. I vow never to get a facial again because the last time I went, instead of the relaxing experience I expected, the woman kept telling me how “badly” I was treating my skin and all the $100 products I had to buy so I wouldn’t turn into an old hag. Are you fucking kidding me? Like I have time for a ten-step program every morning or the money to throw away on this junk. I swear, they’re making us do this so we don’t have time to think about the important things.

Besides, even if I did follow their impossible beauty regime to the letter, I betcha in twenty years the difference in my skin wouldn’t even be visible to the naked eye.

Personally, I enjoy spa treatments but I make them at home. It’s a zillion times cheaper and I get better results from a what germ and egg facial mask than I’d ever get at a spa. And I get to avoid the bizarre gender crap that I’d sometimes get as a man at a spa. Ick.

It’s really strange to me- boys and men are often taught to not care for their bodies, other than in a “get muscular” way. (leaving aside the short-lived metrosexual fad) And girls and women are often taught to obsess about personal appearance, often without regard to comfort, health, or personal preference. It’d be really wonderful if we could find a middle ground for everyone- care for your body and don’t obsess about it. But I’m not holding my breath.

Thank you for this post. There are so many different kinds of wrong about this concept for a business. It’s sexist indoctination and also classist indoctrination (what a waste of money when so many people are undergoing hard times!). It goes beyond repelling me to making me angry.

If you only burped, you still get a pass, especially if you tittered “Excuse ME!” right afterward and giggled a bit. Head tilts gain you points too.

Of course, if you *belched*, that’s another thing entirely.*

*(In this case, “excuse me” is optional, and best given a few beats after the belch, giving your audience enough time to realize it was you, and to give the impression you were analyzing or savoring it.)

that’s.. wow. I lack words. “fucking horrifying” might be a good start though.

for the record, I don’t know a single guy who thinks spa’s are anything other then ridiculous and absurd ways for rich women to waste money. and spas for children take that ridiculousness to a whole other level.

On the upside, I can proudly report that to the best of my knowledge there’s nothing like this in Oakland. across the bay in san francisco there probably is though.

While I found this post heavily enjoyable for the most part and agree with many of your points, I don’t think that the blame should lay entirely on ‘boners’.

A lot of people in feminism don’t seem to understand that a lot of women actually really enjoy being femme. I think a lot of it has to do with personality types – and some of us are simply more masculine than others. I happen to be slightly more feminine than masculine and come from a different experience than most women. I was raised against my nature (I’m MtF) and feminine expression was not allowed for me. There are many aspects of femininity that are natural in me and others. I happen to really like taking care of my skin, wearing a little foundation/eyeshadow, and take care of body hair(I hate it!).

There’s a gradient of grooming that each person deems is necessary for them, and there are messages that we want to put across to others via our appearance. Some of us are more femme than others is what I’m saying and we all have different reasons for doing what we do. I personally feel better about myself when I look better but I really hate attention from anyone.

We all want to look good according to our own values. I think the problem is that it’s a requirement a lot of the time for men to look one way and women to look another. I feel most comfortable (and sexy!) somewhere in the middle and true to myself. I understand that it’s hard to be true to yourself if you’ve been shoved into a role but perhaps it’s the *shoving* instead of the *role* that’s the problem.

I think they’re both problematic. Where does “femme” even come from? Why do we need different roles? Why can’t we all be human instead of human (male) and a variation on human (female)? Gender roles exist because gender hierarchy exists, and gender hierarchy is the cornerstone of patriarchy.

*quote: A lot of people in feminism don’t seem to understand that a lot of women actually really enjoy being femme. I think a lot of it has to do with personality types *
These would be the people raised in a vacuum inpenetrable by patriarchy I assume?

“Where does “femme” even come from?”
Depending on who you ask you’d get a different answer. I used to be a pissed off social constructionist. Now I’m taking a stance that gender is socially exaggerated. Where does the femme in me come from? I have no clue, but it’s definitely in my brain and not the result society making me that way. Society tried everything it could to beat the femme out of me and failed lol. There are a lot of male-identified people that are feminine – it’s the feminine gay men that usually get shit for being gay. Check out “Female to Femme”, too.

“Why do we need different roles? Why can’t we all be human instead of human (male) and a variation on human (female)?”

Yeah, that’s what I was trying to say – that we’re all human and there are an infinite amount of unique roles. I don’t think there is just ‘male’ and ‘female’ – and there are infinite ways to identify and express yourself. I wish we could all be seen as human and that we wouldn’t be graded on how our perceived gender ‘should’ behave. I’m fighting for that. That said, I’m not so sure the idea of the ‘femme’ should be thrown out as it is indeed a part of my being (well, I’m more of a *hard* femme who’s into soft butch girls/guys/bois..).

I’ve learned a few lessons over the past couple years about projecting my identity experiences onto others and thinking they were universal. It hurt quite a bit to realize that not all people are as agitated as I was about being forced into binary gender roles. Julia Serano’s Whipping Girl expresses a lot of my stances on Feminism/femininity/transgender stuff – ‘the scapegoating of femininity’. I acknowledge that I might be biased and am still trying to work it all out. Damn the world for being so.. complicated.

Take care and keep up the excellent/hilarious work! Anyways.. I’m against indoctrination of children of any kind. Dimples kids spa is disgusting on many different levels. :)

I agree and love so much of what you said, but I get off on playing with gender roles and feeling stereotypically feminine from time to time. It’s my thing. Do I need to be reeducated? I was a womens studies minor, you know.

well, you indicate that the only reason I would get a spa treatment is to give a man a boner. Or because his boner wants me to. Further, when I see a six year old with nail polish I don’t assume it has to do with an erection, but the idea of a spa for babies is so asinine that I had to write back tonight and say: I hear you in my own gloriously asinine and sold out femme sort of way, and I’m glad you said all this despite the fact that I think you are painting women into different sorts of corners with your expectations of what being merely human is all about. You’ve gained a new reader.

No, I said that beauty rituals are based in the idea that our worth is defined by our sexual attractiveness. I think it’s a problem to teach kids that this sort of thing is normal before they have any chance of applying critical thinking to it.

“Men don’t want to fuck feminists, and if no one wants to fuck you, what power have you got as a woman?”
Lol. Males are always eager to fuck anyone. Actually been a feminist helps to weed out losers who are terrified of women and are nothing but trouble. I mean you cant possibly date everyone, so some kind of selection system should be in place.

Since when does “lesbian” mean “immune to all patriarchal influences”? And do you not see the problem with gendered roles in lesbian relationships? The hierarchy and the restrictive nature of gendered expectations can exist even when there is no penis present.

Sure. But also I know a whole lot of femme lesbians who would counter that the devaluing of “femme” values and interests–by dismissing them as coming solely from the external “male gaze” and -not ever- from inside the individual’s own core desires–in favor of more “butch/manly” pursuits is also typical of deeply rooted institutional patriarchy.

Yeah, but I’m not proposing that anyone eschew behaviors associated with “femme” or adopt behaviors associated with “butch.” I’m saying that we ought not train our daughters that their goals in life ought to be limited to attracting as much sexual attention from men as possible. I’ve got a mixture of characteristics that includes some of both, but I’d rather neither concept exist. I don’t devalue traits associated with femininity. In fact, I tend to like the ones that don’t have anything to do with shopping or beauty rituals. But that doesn’t mean we don’t need to question them and take a look at what influences our choices.

They were talking about this stuff on the Today Show this morning. It makes me ill to think that anyone would tell a 6 year old they needed a make over. Makeup on a little kid like that? Their natural innocent beauty is being corrupted by corporate America. I don’t even agree with giving a girl under 13 more makeup than maybe some lip gloss or chap stick. Its one thing to let them play dress up in mommy’s makeup, or even get them one of those little princess makeup play sets to play with at home. But in public? Really? I don’t have kids yet, but when I do if I have daughters they will only be allowed to wear it at home for play until they’re about 13… it can then be negotiated. I saw this group of stage mommies at the mall a few weeks ago with all these little pageant babies with teased hair and more make up than I, a 24 year old woman, would ever wear even to go out clubbing. Seeing as how the girls weren’t old enough to even comprehend what I said (none over the age of 3), I just said loud enough to hear “Damn child abusers, ever heard of Jon Bonet Ramsey?” I got dirty looks, but I felt like if I hurt their feelings then good. Why would someone want their little girl to grow up thinking their beauty is all they have going for them? What if they get in an accident or something happens that they lose their looks? They need to be confident in their intelligence and who they are as a person, not in what spa mommy totes them to every week to make sure they’re the “prettiest little girl in town.” Pfft… Its parents like that who keep pedophiles in materials to beat off to. I wonder if they ever think of that?

Wow, some people sure are inventive! I’ve never been to a spa, never had a manicure, pedicure or facial, never paid to get my hair styled and I certainly don’t feel the worse for it! I have a wonderful boyfriend who really doesn’t care if I haven’t washed or flossed. It’s a pity more people don’t have the chance to have the same.

To ice the cake, look who “decides” what is “attractive” in women. Who creates the hairstyles of the year, the clothing designers — mostly gay men!! What’s up with that, anyway?

Imagine a world in which natural people were accepted as attractive. Where the Michael Jacksons would keep their natural appearance, where men and women would be at home in their own skin, not spending time and money trying to become someone else’s ideal. The economy might collapse! Oh, wait! It already has!!

Well, Yeah. its pretty sick.. but.. and let me just say before opening this up- I’m a single mom, with a gorgeous little girl and shes growing up great- a nice mix of being into princesses and watching zombie movies,

but.. I mean.. their haircuts are really inexpensive.. I mean.. I pay more than that to get her hair trimmed up down here in Atlanta..

and I will admit.. she likes nail polish.. granted.. her first experience was when she raided my sisters nail polish drawer when we weren’t looking and used it as makeup (she was 3. The pediatrician just laughed at me and gave me the “kids will be kids” bit, despite the hot pink metallic shimmer on my daughters eyelids and cheeks)

but the fact is.. hey.. the kid digs it… and she likes talking to the nail ladies and seeing how they do the little artsy bits.

toddlers in tiaras- that’s a little far fetched for me… I cant stand seeing the little girls going through waxing and fake tans and god knows what.. but this…

I mean for the most part its just the simple silly little things that most little girls do anyways, and provided you don’t let it all go over the top, and make sure to raise your child with some common fucking sense and some logic (which is unfortunately a rarity these days), then whats the real issue here?

It’s not so much the business that’s in the wrong here.. it’s the parents that take the ideals of a feminine appearance WAYYYYYY too far.

In any case, my boyfriend just moved to Brooklyn, and I’d probably take my little one there to get her hair french braided… because I suck at even doing ponytails. For only 5 bucks, that’s a steal.

I totally agree that its Very wrong to drag kids into the beauty-madness going on.

First of all I should say this: Fasionwise I’m from a pretty laid back country, so women wearing heels and lipstick to work are an ecxeption (apart from in finance and politics). That might explain my angle on the issue.

I dont think the beauty-frenzy of this age has much to do with sex or men, either. Most of the encouragements I’ve received to doll myself up have been from other women!
I dont know many men who care about (or notice!) the details of the effort I put into beauty every now and then.

The question is, how do we make insecure women stop encouraging other insecure women (or their children) to get in the beauty-race for better self esteem?
I think an empowering effort with insecure women is necessary, and not just a rant amoungst a crowd that agrees to never spend money at a kids’ spa.
Does that make sense?

Fantastically done. I’ve been reading a lot about sexualization+feminization of infant, toddler and school-age girls a lot lately, and, while it’s all been mind-blowingly infuriating, I haven’t been able to analyze or even rant coherently about it all yet.

Add to this spa garbage the high heels and hair pieces for infants, as well as photoshopping pictures of babies so they look like dolls — and I have quite a collection of Men Hate You If You Own A Vagina, and that you don’t get to avoid it, not even when the Vagina Owner isn’t even crawling yet.

I agree that this place is totally reprehensible. Also I hate men. But I do like to shave, smell good and take care of my skin. I also strictly adhere to a green lifestyle and only use my own brand of cleansers and moisturizers which are completely eco friendly and organic and void of any toxic or remotely harmful substance. I do it because I want to be optimally healthy w/o all the scary chemicals that men say women have to soak in to be pretty. Anyway, my question is this:

If this was an eco-friendly “spa” that offered reasonably priced goods that were truly healthy for children and their parents to be using, as well as promoting a more responsible way of life, wouldn’t that be okay? Especially if it was totally disconnected from the sexualization of young girls. I mean, relaxation is important for a healthy, well rounded person.

I think it’s good to teach children to incorporate relaxation techniques as well as good skin care practices. Not to be sexy for men mind you, but for personal health and well-being.

I’m just trying to figure out if it’s the spa concept that’s upsetting, as well as the fact that the place discussed is disgusting.

Btw I love this site, it’s funny, well-written, and says everything I get way too flustered to put into words.

That might be alright, but it isn’t what’s up here. I’d say that children of both genders learning that relaxation is a part of health, and that taking care of oneself can be fun isn’t a bad idea. The problem is that this place is basically preparing girls to aspire to be Sarah Jessica Parker.

I’ve never been to a spa myself since I consider it a massive waste of money. Maybe if I was rich and didn’t need to work or go to school I’d totally be going to the spa all the time. Problem is, I’ve always considered spa treatments as a means of relaxing AFTER A HARD DAY’S WORK! Therefore, neither rich folk nor children qualify, sorry. Those sorts of luxuries need to be earned not given freely, way to teach your kids to be brats.

Great, one more reason I don’t want to have children. First pedophiles and now kids day spa operators, think kids are short/small/whatever adults. I’m in an area where the day spas have 25-50% adult male customers. I can’t imagine why a male or female child would want to or need to go. Some children are teased enough for not wearing some kids fashions, which are ever on the increase. Spas are going to make it worse. meanwhile the up and comming psychiatrists are smiling. I’ll wait a few more decades to have kids, the way technology is going.

Although I do get where you’re coming from, I live near Dimples and have been inside, and it’s no where near as bad as what you’re portraying it as. I, being a feminist, originally had the same ideas you had, but then I talked to some of the parents to find out what the HELL they were thinking– and despite what you might think, they were. Most of the parents told me that this was just a special thing for the child– not a weekly or monthly thing to make sure their nails are perfectly polished, their hair is doing fine, etc. Most parents only take their kid in for their birthday, or every few months. The girls I talked to aren’t concerned about how clear their skin is, they just like the edible chocolate facial (if I were 6, and if I could smear some of my favorite food on my face without having mommy get mad, I sure would). Also, the owners of Dimples, Joe and Daria, are EXTREMELY nice and–get this!– liberal. They like kids, and little girls sometimes want to know what their mother does at the salon (is painting your nails THAT bad? Most women like painted nails because they think they’re pretty, all my guy friends say they could care less about what colored chemicals are on a chick’s nails.). Is that such a crime?

All I can say is WOOOOOOW on this post and its entire thread. I want to start by saying I do understand what this author is saying… but… to an extent. Although I must admit that it was very well written, it almost seems like she gathered her own personal experiences and feelings she has already developed against the idea and just capitalized on it because there was nothing else better to do at the moment. Wait a minute… then would you look at that…. everyone else jumped on the bandwagon lol! Everyone from the people who truly disliked the idea to the followers and the ones who were just afraid to say that they disagreed.

I want to point out a few things the author touched on: “making your 6-year-old sexy as fuck, flat-ironing. …because nothing looks less sexy on a kid than wavy hair, Salons and spas exist to help women increase the number of men who want to fuck them, and that’s it. All of this bullshit about “self-indulgence” and “empowerment” and “me time” is fucking absurd, and Get ‘em started on mani-pedis, facials, and the idea that the natural texture of their hair is an abomination as early as possible.”

I must admit that I had to laugh a few times while reading this post but it also made me a little sad. Why does a day spa for kids have to be a bad idea? Why do we have to stoop to the level of saying these parents want their children to look like hookers, hoers, or prostitutes? Why is it that if some mothers want to bring their little girl’s “dress up fairy tale” to life, they are now bad parents and are prepping their little girls to get fucked? I mean, WOW… And can I add that you can go to any toy store, children’s clothing store, Target, Walmart, etc… and find dress up stuff for little girls….

I actually think it’s an adorable idea depending on how it’s executed. Most mothers will occasionally take their little girls to the nail shop or a hair salon anyway… or even polish their nails and toes at home. So why not have a place that caters only to kids where they don’t have to be around adults, adult gossip, and the other boring things that often goes on in these salons? Why can’t they go to a fun place of their own where they can have their nail/toes polished (nothing more), hair styled in fun styles (no cutting, dying, flat ironed, permed, etc…), play dress up like they do at home but with other children their age?

I do agree that mother’s shouldn’t force their children into such things as getting makeup. It’s supposed to be fun and if a child doesn’t want to do these things, then fine. When parents do things like this, they are now taking the fun out of it… they turn it into something else. I also agree that these mothers shouldn’t be encouraging their children to pose certain or provacative ways/”moving their hips.” However, I really think this post took it to place where it really didn’t need to go… it wasn’t necessary. It’s kind of funny because when I thought of day spas for kids, alot of this distorted thinking never came to mind. I guess, if you step into the author’s world and respond to her thoughts, then yes, it is disguisting. But who thinks like that and takes it to that kind of level?? Wow…

Furthermore when I go to a Salon, believe me, I’m not even thinking about “increasing the number of men who want to fuck (me)…” but maybe some do… I would probably go because it takes me too long to do my own hair and I can’t do it as well as they do. I just recently started doing my own hair, nails, and toes and this was only because it saves money and I finally learned how to do it! But why not treat myself and have someone else do it sometimes…. for myself…

I think many people have the wrong idea of kid spas, or maybe they just had a bad experience, or have even been or seen a kids spa that wasn’t age appropriate. But I honestly think that if it is age appropriate, it could be alot of fun for many little girls and a little break for the parents.

A fish in water doesn’t know it’s in water. Read more of this blog SR, and maybe you will come to see that you are all wet. Because using pretty princess stuff from Walmart as an argument is just…….well words fail me.
Which is not to say that I am criticizing you for doing your nails or your hair.

Also, – you’re – the one who drew parallel between dressed-up children and prostitutes, then misspelled ”whores” as ”hoers.”

No one around this blog who is not a troll, refers to anyone else as a ”whore”/”hoer”. Nor do they draw the immediate correlation between ”woman performing femininity” and ”hooker.” That was all you, my friend. All you. Which indicates that you haven’t done a whole lot of critical thinking.

And I’m not really into to being nice to people who are into women’s subjugation. Much less insinuate that everyone else on a radical feminist blog, most of whom have done so much critical thinking that their heads hurt — mine does — is just ”jumping on the bandwagon.” Those aren’t classical feminist-dismissing techniques at all, and I haven’t encountered them a hundred times or anything.

LOL @ Sneeky. You know, reading is fundamental… especially with comprehension… You should try it… If you would have read my post thoroughly and with some understanding, you would have recognized that I was simply stating that people in general can find/see these “pretty princess” items in stores such as Walmart, Target, Toy Stores, and kid clothing stores ANYWAY. It doesn’t mean you have to buy them there or at all Sneeky… come on… Therefore, why not just create a store of their own with these things in it. They sell it everywhere else anyway. In addition, doing my hair or nails has nothing to do with Walmart. This section of the post was separate from finding “pretty princess” items in various stores. Again “reading with comprehension.”
@ Joy… Joy, Joy, Joy… Yes, I made a typo….. oops! I was probably thinking about hoes. Reading all the responses just kept making me think about HOES… I don’t know, lol… And no, no cupcake… within the original topic’s post, the author states “ At Dimples, your little girl can “indulge” in hair, nail, and facial services, and they even do parties! They do nothing other than enable women to waste their lives and money striving for the ever-elusive beauty standards that our society sets up for them. And whence do those standards derive? From boners. Salons and spas exist to help women increase the number of men who want to fuck them, and that’s it.” This sounds to me like THE AUTHOR “drew parallel between dressed-up children and prostitutes” And you guys followed… She also drew a correlation between ”woman performing femininity” and ”hookers,” BASICALLY! Where do you think I got the idea from? lol That’s all these kids want to do… is play dress up. Hell, they play dress up on Halloween don’t they? But some of us always have to take it to another level… sad. Oh yeah, and oops again, it looks like she has a few typos of her own .
Oh yeah Joy, and I love this one from you. ‘And I’m not really into to being nice to people who are into women’s subjugation.” Okaaaay???? Lol. Well, I guess I better back up now lol. Or, oh no!! I better not respond anymore or Joy’s going to be mean… WOW.. Good one! Keep it coming. And what’s really sad, it that my originally response wasn’t meant to start shit, it was my opinion on the topic and the various responses from it. But oh well, huh?

@ Sneeky: Oh yeah, and this statement you made right here “A fish in water doesn’t know it’s in water. Read more of this blog SR, and maybe you will come to see that you are all wet,” was pretty nice I must admit…

Sigh. I wasn’t trying to be threatening, just to explain why I responded harshly. I’m not ghetto, gangster, or even particularly threatening at all. Just a short, gangly female person in flat shoes and glasses, trying to live a life free of a patriarchy which exasperates and oppresses her.
A decision she came to via independent thought, which she then followed onto the internet, where she discovered this blog.

I won’t waste any more time even responding to you, much less harshly, though, because you clearly are not going to get what anyone here is trying to say.

@ Joy: Now that’s more like it. Why weren’t you that sweet in the beginning, huh? I mean, was it really that serious to get all fired up over someone else’s opinion that was different from your own? No, it wasn’t… However, I applaud you for standing by your views, but… it could have also been done differently and much more tasteful, you think?

And trust me, I get the author’s expression of “independent thought” and as I stated before, I understand where she’s coming from as well as some others to an extent. Buuuuuut…. I was also expressing my “independent thought” and didn’t particulary care for the way you responded to it. In result, I reacted accordingly. Remember, you don’t have to always like what others are saying, but you should probably think about how you’re going to say something before just letting it all out the wrong way.

Also, condescension tends to get other people fired up. Especially on feminist blogs.

I’m not saying we all enjoy a nice circle-jerk or pile-on and can’t handle outside opinions, but stomping in here telling us we’re all wrong because, essentially, our ladybrains are stupid, is not the way to go either.

ND, this is your post and your blog, so it’s your call. Did I read wrong or is this a troll?

@ Joy: Actually, my original post was premeditate. I never said you guys were all wrong, just a few of the statements I saw were… to me… And I stand by them. Joy, maybe you should re-read my original post with an openmind and you will see that that wasn’t the case. So tell me sweetness, who’s the pot again calling the kettle black?

Joy, in your words “you ladies need to be more gentle and nice or no one will listen to you.” I absolutely love and agree with this statement, however, perhaps a few of the points ND put in her post contradicted this statement. If it were drawn out another way, maybe a little less harsh and onesided then my reponse would have been different. The same goes for you, if your response were a little less harsh, we wouldn’t be here playing this ‘tit for tat’ game today… We’re both strong minded WOMEN and I see that, which is probably why this hasn’t ended. It’s time to let it go…. And yeah ND, I hear that its now your call… besides… I would love to meet you (smile)…

Please knock off the patronizing, SR. It’s annoying. And you might want to check out the Feminism 101 blog on my blogroll. There are plenty of posts there that might help you understand why telling a feminist how to word her own opinions isn’t cool.

And the fuss isn’t about ”making little girls into whores” or about anyone’s experience at a kids’ spa.
It’s about forcing children to practice and play out stereotypical gender roles in an extremely egregious way, therefore molding them into an uncomfortable prepackaged slot which is harmful to anyone, adult or child, who occupies it. Disney Princesses and all other manners of such trappings serve the same purpose, and thus they are equally problematic.

At least I think that’s what everyone’s been saying; it’s what I’ve been saying and feeling. Radical Feminist 101 stuff.

“Cupcake” is a gendered insult and in its entirety that comment of SR’s is one of the worst I have seen here (and it is at that point that I suddenly felt SR was most likely male). Though Joy is right as usual, it’s worth it for the crazy head-twisting about boners–>exploitation. By the way, SR, you should WRITE IN ALL CAPS LIKE THIS; we’ll be more likely to understand you if you do. :)

First, I love cupcakes. Second, my point, SR, was that the prevalence of Pretty Princess Crap ™ is part of the problem. You are the fish and the patriarchy is the water in which you swim as demonstrated by the fact that you take for granted that training little girls from birth to be pink bedecked ornaments is acceptable. The spa is just a more blatant and frankly creepier example of the same thing. I also suggest reading Feminism 101. You may disagree with some of the things stated there but it will give a good overview and be helpful to you should you choose to continue to participate on this blog.

” people in general can find/see these “pretty princess” items in stores such as Walmart, Target, Toy Stores, and kid clothing stores ANYWAY. It doesn’t mean you have to buy them there or at all Sneeky… come on… Therefore, why not just create a store of their own with these things in it. They sell it everywhere else anyway.”

Erm…if the problem is dedicated stores for this sort of thing, than yes. If stores dedicated to this sort of thing are only a symptom of the problem, than no. I think the latter was what was aimed at.

“I’m not ghetto, gangster, or even particularly threatening at all. Just a short, gangly female person in flat shoes and glasses, trying to live a life free of a patriarchy which exasperates and oppresses her.”

That sort of makes you alot more threatening than the insufferable ghetto or gangster wannabes.

“By the way, SR, you should WRITE IN ALL CAPS LIKE THIS; we’ll be more likely to understand you if you do. :)”

isme, yes, I am the worst nightmare of the P. Because they can’t dismiss me as a ”militant lesbo”, ”bleeding-heart liberal arts major”, or ”hairy feminazi.”
(Even though I have been known to date women, am kind of a tree-hugger, and don’t shave.)

The best they can do is ”silly little girl,” but that can only last for so long.

The P’s worst enemy is someone who knows what she’s talking about, and isn’t afraid to talk.

My point was, I’m sure you grasped it but I wish to reiterate — I wasn’t trying to get all up in SR’s grill and threaten hir.
I was going more for ”explaining why I don’t do the ‘nice, quiet little girl’ thing,” not ”saying I’m going to come to SR’s house and spray-paint it” or whatever.

In our local mall there was a place that gratefully shut down a few years ago. It was a Hanna Montana inspired “make over” salon for little girls under 10. Luckily, it was something my daughters never wanted to do. I would see little girls going in as cute little girls and coming out as tiny hoochie mommas and it appalled me.

I happen to believe that girls should be allowed to be what they want to be and that feminism should not mean that you can’t still do things that make you feel girl (it is all in the reason your are doing it), but places like that demean more than they empower.

The whole phenomenon makes me cringe too, Blaize. Good that you go with your daughters’ wishes. When I see anything like a ‘baby beauty pageant,’ or what you and ND describe, it reminds me of what my mother put me through. I’m pretty sure she knew that I was being sexually abused by my grandfather, yet she would still buy me some pretty awful, lacy, hoochie looking outfits… at 12. The fact that it was the ’80s’ didn’t help, but now that I think of it as an adult, it was like she was preparing me to be permanently submissive to the male gaze. I’m not sure I can begin to forgive her for that. I also remember when I was about 9 years old, and a day after suffering a particularly extreme episode of abuse, my mother took me over to see the ships at fleet week in Boston, and was commenting on all the sailors ‘checking me out.’ I was mortified and confused.

It’s horrifying to be a witness to women themselves being complicit in patriarchal oppression. Sadly, there are still many examples of this.

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[…] Dimples Kids Spa, making your 6-year-old sexy as fuck. "If you live in Brooklyn Heights and just can’t figure out how to waste your money quickly enough, toss your kid into your Orbit Baby Infant Carrying System (MSRP $900), stop off for a $8 non-alcoholic beverage, and then drop her ass off for a spa day (drop your son off at the park where he can exercise and develop social skills). At Dimples, your daughter can “indulge” in hair, nail, and facial services, and they even do parties! Their services include manicures, pedicures, chocolate facials, and flat-ironing. Because nothing looks less sexy on a kid than wavy hair! […]

[…] Dimples Kids Spa, making your 6-year-old sexy as fuck. “If you live in Brooklyn Heights and just can’t figure out how to waste your money quickly enough, toss your kid into your Orbit Baby Infant Carrying System (MSRP $900), stop off for a $8 non-alcoholic beverage, and then drop her ass off for a spa day (drop your son off at the park where he can exercise and develop social skills). At Dimples, your daughter can “indulge” in hair, nail, and facial services, and they even do parties! Their services include manicures, pedicures, chocolate facials, and flat-ironing. Because nothing looks less sexy on a kid than wavy hair! All of this bullshit about “self-indulgence” and “empowerment” and “me time” is fucking absurd. I mean, sure, it’s a good idea, if you have to waste several hours a week on your appearance, to make the wasting of those hours as pleasant as possible, but women wouldn’t do any of that shit if we weren’t told that we are blowing it as human beings if we don’t look like gold-dusted, semi-moist cartoons.” […]