Giratina93 wrote:Murderes... those sick, twisted ****ards deserve the death penalty completely for taking innocent lives... an eye for an eye... or, even better, give them a fate worse than painless death... give them suffering, to make them realize that what they did was the wrong choice.

Giratina93 wrote:Murderes... those sick, twisted ****ards deserve the death penalty completely for taking innocent lives... an eye for an eye... or, even better, give them a fate worse than painless death... give them suffering, to make them realize that what they did was the wrong choice.

Thumbs up for regressing as a society...

Thank you, Postmodernism... with it having obliterated all human reason, what's seperating us from total anarchy? What are our laws based on? flawed sense of justice? Let's all go out and kill one-another! DAMNIT! as if Modernism wasn't bad enough...

Giratina93 wrote:Murderes... those sick, twisted ****ards deserve the death penalty completely for taking innocent lives... an eye for an eye... or, even better, give them a fate worse than painless death... give them suffering, to make them realize that what they did was the wrong choice.

Thumbs up for regressing as a society...

Thank you, Postmodernism... with it having obliterated all human reason, what's seperating us from total anarchy? What are our laws based on? flawed sense of justice? Let's all go out and kill one-another! DAMNIT! as if Modernism wasn't bad enough...

Yes, a bad upbringing very much justifies it. You're just being hard-headed now. It has nothing to do with being weak or strong, really.

No it doesn't. Your parents don't control your behavior. Your childhood doesn't control your behavior. YOU control your behavior. Blaming it on something else is just denial, and a sign of weakness. There are people who come from abusive families, dangerous surroundings, and poor school education, and become very, very successful in life. Then there are those who go "Oh well, I had a bad life" and are a leech on society.

As I said, you can't justify murder. And to be clear:

Definition of MURDER1: the crime of unlawfully killing a person especially with malice aforethought

@ EE: Apparently, there is some gene that people are saying exists so that they treat it as a get out of jail free card. It makes you violent and need to fight. I personally see it as being in denial of being hateful and blaming it on something that doesn't exist.

Oh, and the upbringing thing is a load of..... well, you know. My teacher's mom was a drug addict, who abused her, and grew up poor and where there were lots of gangsters. And she's got a PHD in English. So take that, EE.

"If none can know what lies ahead, then losing one's way is just human nature."~ Yoshimitsu

"Would you hear my desire? To take this foul blade, and use it to blot out the light forever!" ~ Ganondorf

Godzilla Forever wrote:@ EE: Apparently, there is some gene that people are saying exists so that they treat it as a get out of jail free card. It makes you violent and need to fight. I personally see it as being in denial of being hateful and blaming it on something that doesn't exist.

Oh, and the upbringing thing is a load of..... well, you know. My teacher's mom was a drug addict, who abused her, and grew up poor and where there were lots of gangsters. And she's got a PHD in English. So take that, EE.

Good job.
I don't seem to recall saying every person in such a situation would turn into a criminal. So you've really proved nothing.
And genetics is a slight part of it, but not a lot.

Also, Gira, do you have any idea what the f*ck you're talking about? Dyou even know what post-modernism is...?

Godzilla Forever wrote:@ EE: Yes, we all know there are mistakes. But nothing is perfect. You can't expect everyone to be convicted correctly all the time, unfortunately. And if you're a murderer, I don't think you can rehabilitate them as you could a drug or alchohol addict. Like animals, once they taste blood, I don't think you can take them back.

Disagree with the animal statement. Look at the Michael Vick dogs. They're rehabilitated, and it was about 70 dogs. Lions aggressive toward people in Africa were even rehabilitated.

Evil Eye wrote:

Tyrannosaurus Titanus wrote:

Evil Eye wrote:That's exactly where your incorrect. There are situations other than the two you mentioned, and serial murder just for the sake of killing.

You should prooobably explain, instead of being vague. Your argument isn't looking so good because of it.

Indeed, probably What I mean is... take this instance, for example: this kid grows up in the slums or some gang-ridden place, born to unwealthy parents who fight and may even have to kill to survive, etc. He grows up all his life doing the same, around violence and whatnot, so he doesn't know, even if not lawfully, then morally, that it's wrong.That was kind of a bad example, but I'm ******* tired and cant think of better right now D=<

Totally agreed. Upbringing has so much to do with things. I wouldn't go as far as to say it justifies it, but it definitely plays a role. It's all about mentality, really. Depends on how much they can handle and still get through.

I saw the post about the English teacher. To me it basically matters on how vulnerable your mind really is. People react differently to the same situations. Maybe this teacher had help during this time, IE, a counselor. Maybe she had an "escape" to the situation or was even on medication. You never really know the full story of things, there's people on medication for mental problems walking around the streets.

Think about this. Say two countries bomb each other. US and Canada bomb each other. A Canadian kid on a school bus sees his mom blown to pieces by an American soldier. What is that kid thinking? I hate Americans. American kid is walking in a store and a Canadian officer holds them hostage and kills people. What is the kid thinking? I hate Canadians. They associate Canadians and Americans with blowing things up.

It does definitely depend on what you're exposed to. What happens around you definitely does affect how you will react to certain things, and your behavior. People make associations in their mind. A good example.. what is the first thing you think of when you go to the doctor? Getting a shot? Something painful? Children screaming? Or getting a simple checkup and chit chatting with the doctor and receptionist/secretary?

It depends on the experience. I LOVE psychology. Associations is used in dog training as well. A dog is abused by a tall man. The dog is now scared of tall men. Every time you see a "Tall man" you give the dog a treat. They associate treats with tall men. And treats are good. Therefore, tall men are a good thing. Same thing with the Vick dogs. They were brought up and CONDITIONED to fight. They had to basically do reverse psychology on them.

The same thing can happen with people. Little do any of you know I'm partially on this forum to get positive interaction with people in the least confrontational way possible- the internet. The internet is not confrontational.
I was teased for 8-9 yrs total. I began to associate people that are the same age as myself as, well, immature morons. It's not intentional. It's just psychology. If that's what you're exposed to, it can be associated with that specific thing. To fight it off is a bit of a task in itself, and again, it depends on the person and how they will react. It depends on THE person. The individual, and whether or not they ARE getting help to fight off that specific association.
It's also about control. If you can't control yourself, then you're going to do something totally insane. You need to rid of associations. It's uneasy, it's harder to do than it sounds (given I fear half the people I meet in person) but it can be done. Associations can lead into depression. Depression can get people to snap in more ways than one. Controlling your mind is needed, and again, that depends on how someone will react..
Associations can lead into violence. You again need control, and it again depends on how that person will react..

The teasing brings up the idea of Fight or Flight. Someone is teased. They associate all people who are 20 years old to be a**holes.
they:
a) totally snap and shoot up a school.
b) totally snap and fear everything on the planet, sitting in the corner of a dark room.
c) get help, rid of associations in the best way possible and control themselves and their mind/what they think to do during rough times.
Just my .. 50 cents.. I like psychology so I was quick to get into this.

EDIT:
These guys were in a country that was in the war. Now, I don't want this to turn into what the cause of the war was, but you're seeing people on BOTH SIDES being blown up. You associate the GROUP that blew him up with violence. You see innocent people as enemies. Therefore, you injure them. You kill them, you mock them.
That's my take on the actual soldier situation.

Proof of my point above about bullying was the story of a few years ago.. A college kid massacred a college. The Virginia Tech Massacre. Now..
The person who did this was never accepted and teased. If he had been Mr. Popularity or gave himself help he probably wouldn't have killed people in a college.

Problem is, PC, that we are not animals. We can think for ourselves. Teasing happens A LOT in schools these days, and most learn to accept it and move on, rather then take a rash action against the bullies.

A dog associates a tall man with pain the way it associates the outside with doing its business. They are very simple minded creatures. Its a staple part of humanity not to stereotype an entire group. Lets take 9/11 for example. For some people, this was the first contact they had with muslims of any kind, and all they knew about it was that thousands of people died. Should it be ok for them to grow up hating muslims?

Like I said: You can't condemn an entire people/nation/ideology based only on the actions of a small part of them. Some Americans are racist. Does that mean all of them are? No. We are human beings, we can think for ourselves, or let our experiences consume us. I prefer the former.

Tyrannosaurus Titanus wrote:A dog associates a tall man with pain the way it associates the outside with doing its business. They are very simple minded creatures. Its a staple part of humanity not to stereotype an entire group. Lets take 9/11 for example. For some people, this was the first contact they had with muslims of any kind, and all they knew about it was that thousands of people died. Should it be ok for them to grow up hating muslims?

Well, to be fair, even if it's not ok, people do. Examine the idiotic arguments against the Mosque on Ground Zero for proof =p
The other thing; humans dont have a better brain than dogs, as you're making it out to be. Just a differently evolved brain, adapted to a completely different purpose.

Tyrannosaurus Titanus wrote:Yes, we have a "better brain" in the sense that we have a higher ability to understand, communicate, and express emotions. As I said, dogs are simple creatures. Most animals are.

Science shows otherwise. Humans' brains are made for sorting information and problem solving, whereas dogs' are adapted for taking in senses and processing them. It used to be for survival, with wolves and all, but now that they're domesticated, it becomes somewhat unnecessary, thereby making them seem the way you just said.

I find it sick that our troops would kill for fun, but the death sentence? Kill our own troops? Anyways, there lawyers would just say they had like PTSD and the troops would just be labeld Mentaly unstable, recive treatment, be magically cured and go on with life.

"Hello, my name is Sheila, I am an Insane Rouge A.I." - Sheila

"I took a walk around the world to ease my troubled mind, I left my body lying somewere in the sands of time." -Kryptonite -==-Good Boy.

Evil Eye wrote:Science shows otherwise. Humans' brains are made for sorting information and problem solving, whereas dogs' are adapted for taking in senses and processing them. It used to be for survival, with wolves and all, but now that they're domesticated, it becomes somewhat unnecessary, thereby making them seem the way you just said.

So? The ability to process senses is a wide-spread trait among the animal kingdom. Its why dogs, cats, sharks, whales, everything under the f*cking sun has better hearing/smell/sight then us

Evil Eye wrote:Science shows otherwise. Humans' brains are made for sorting information and problem solving, whereas dogs' are adapted for taking in senses and processing them. It used to be for survival, with wolves and all, but now that they're domesticated, it becomes somewhat unnecessary, thereby making them seem the way you just said.

So? The ability to process senses is a wide-spread trait among the animal kingdom. Its why dogs, cats, sharks, whales, everything under the f*cking sun has better hearing/smell/sight then us

I know, but it also varies largely on the animal.
The only reason we don't is because we don't need it for survival, they do =p
anyway, back on topic?