So original setup was 8-3-2-1 and we're down to 5-1-1. Should be in the bag with SK in {adnapemit, mpolo}. If there is bastardry in the role we still can afford to lynch both of them, plus now we can even coordinate roleblocks and other night-actions.

@bessie: do you want to claim Maker? Also, what's your win condition so that you can be alive at the end of the game but not win?

Sabrar, how do you know that the maker is an independant? They could be town. Not that it really matters.

If matt was the only person to target someone, would the targeted person's action go through as intended?

Another redirector? This game would have been a right headache if they had survived!

N2 -So, matts action could not have stopped adnapemit, only redirected it. But as no one else targeted adnapemit, I'm not sure what would have happened. So unless they withheld the kill, they are not the SK.

That leaves SDK or bessie as people who might have been blocked from killing.

Sandman is a typical Guardian Angel role. The "maker" was probably chosen at random from all other players and could be town or scum. Almost certainly not a special role/alignment based on matt's role PM.

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Gopher being scum doesn't make sense unless we still have 2 scum left, as he isn't in {adnapemit, mpolo}.

The logic is true for everyone else as well, now we're just making contingency plans in case Dj/mpolo received a bastard role and both him and adnapemit is Town.I'm inclined to lynch adnapemit as well. We can coordinate who to block besides mpolo.

Sabrar wrote:@bessie: do you want to claim Maker? Also, what's your win condition so that you can be alive at the end of the game but not win?

My win condition does not require me to be alive at the end of the game to win.

Sabrar wrote:So original setup was 8-3-2-1 and we're down to 5-1-1.

Matt’s maker doesn’t necessarily need to be an independent aligned with him. I think the maker is probably just assigned to someone randomly without their knowledge. If the maker is independent and aligned with matt, what would be their win condition? We could still be at 5-1-1 though.

SDK wrote:So I guess we lynch adnapemit now and probably just win?

I think we need to lynch adnapemit, but I’m not sure it will end the game. I think there is another independent. And no it's not me.

Madge wrote:Note that a side effect of the magic that brought you to life means that your Maker has no idea who you are.

I've read the above and because of the wording I thought that the Maker would be aware of the existence of the Guardian Angel but not know the identity of him. In my opinion that makes better sense if the Maker is indie as well, though I could easily be wrong in both of my assumptions.

SDK wrote:Roleblocker is more powerful than doctor in the late game.

Not if SK has a kill that can't be role-blocked but can be prevented by making his target untargetable.

A thought - in this game, I could see an unblockable and/or ninja SK being possible. I could also see the SK only being able to kill every other night in that case, which would explain the lack of second kill N2 and why Gopher didn't see anything else suspicious from anyone that night. I don't think it makes any difference to what we do today.

I received nothing from adnapemit. I think it entirely possible that she doesn't have the claimed ability, but even if she does, matt targeting her (and potentially getting killed for the effort) would likely also have received whatever she planned to give.

I now understand what was going on with matt, his claim and so on. N2, adnapemit might have had no action (claimed immunity), so matt redirected nothing onto himself, ignoring my block because redirection comes before block. Matt, suspecting adnapemit to be a killer targets her again in an attempt to take the kill, thus drawing it away from his maker. If he failed again, he'd know that the killer can't have been his target, but only if nobody else targeted his target. Unfortunately, it doesn't confirm adnapemit as killer, since matt could just as easily have been killed by mpolo or whoever.

@Sabrar - you could always try blocking mpolo with me, in case using a kill on a blocker always succeeds. I think you should not disclose your target before the night though.

Vote adnapemit

L - 2.

Who did you target, Sabrar and SDK? I'm guessing mpolo never submitted their cop action, though I suppose they could pretend that they didn't so that suspicion continues to fall on adnapemit.

According to the PM here, DJ's target on N1 was Gopher of Pern (and N2 was bessie). According to the description of the power, these people should have received a list with a mod assurance that there was at least one scum on it. It would be major bastardy for that to be a lie, so there is a lot of suspicion connected with not revealing the lists. I understand that there is some possibility of redirection, though. I have read the last two pages at least. I have to take my mother to a doctor's appointment, which may last a while.

Sabrar wrote:@bessie: assuming adnapemit is the last scum, what in your opinion is the reason that you did not receive the list N2?

I’m a commuter. Gopher of Pern should be able to confirm this. Gopher of Pern, what was your tracking result on me N2?

adnapemit wrote:Do you have an unblockable kill bessie?

I think someone has an unblockable kill because I haven’t seen a power yet that can kill me if I decide to commute. Unless I’m completely misunderstanding my role and/or the order of night actions, which seems to happen at least once every game.

This only confirms that Dj targeted you and you didn't target anyone else (unless Ninja). Standard Commuter should be immune to unblockable kills, as the page Madge linked to has it at lower priority than roleblocks/kills.However redirection is at even lower priority so according to this it could be possible that kalira's ability would have been able to kill you (she targets you before you commute, you die because you don't target anyone).

bessie wrote:Gopher of Pern should have a "no result" on me, as opposed to a "didn't track anyone" result.

Not necessarily. If Gopher's ability is "informed of the targets of all players" or similar, he may not have received any result from anybody who didn't target anyone.

@mpolo - are you saying you didn't submit an action last night?

Sabrar wrote:I thought scum would be afraid of his vote-blocking

Personally, I'm constantly afraid I'll vote block a player whose vote is critical to town's success, but that's just me. It could become important if approaching LYLO, I guess, but by the same token could cause town to lose if I guess incorrectly.

By the way, I'm beginning to feel like Trial of the Pariahs again, with the way this is turning out (adnapemit, almost certainly last scum and cornered, game apparently almost wrapped up and me with a roleblock etc). I just hope there isn't another silversmith incident :/

I had assumed that I was going to have Internet access upon getting here, but there was no computer, and Kindle access to Internet is not something I was going to put myself through. So, no, I did not submit an action last night. From what I'm reading, adnapemit seems the most likely scum, but I am really taking other people's word for it. I would like to read a bit more into this. Perhaps someone who has the details of the case against adnapemit could summarize the argument to make this easier.

O.K. From my point of view, that's actually a pretty strong case -- assuming we trust the person who gave the information. There is presumably only one scum left, given the elimination of the mafia, so that it is unlikely that there is collusion involved in this.