Domestic violence workers find truth in Harry Reid’s jobless comments

Harry Reid's comments

Sun Coverage

While conservatives attacked Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid over his statement that unemployed men are more likely to be abusive than those with jobs, local and national domestic violence groups defended the senator.

Reid made the comments Monday on the floor of the Senate during debate over a jobs bill.

“I met with some people, while I was home, dealing with domestic abuse,” Reid said. “It has gotten out of hand. Why? Men don't have jobs. Women don't have jobs either, but women aren’t abusive, most of the time. Men, when they're out of work, tend to become abusive. Our domestic crisis shelters in Nevada are jammed; that’s the way it is all over the country.”

Conservatives used the statement to attack the senator, with one blogger saying, "Harry's wife ought to take this as a warning come November," and a Fox News commentator saying, “It's so insane, and I don't know how much lower Harry Reid can go.”

When questioned about the statement by reporters on Tuesday, Reid defended himself and said Las Vegas’ high unemployment has led to more domestic violence.

"I’m just telling you what two people working in the field every day say," Reid said. "There’s no question that people being out of work causes more people to be involved in domestic violence."

Domestic violence groups in Nevada say joblessness doesn’t actually make a person become violent, but it does make violent situations worse.

“People that are not abusive are not all of the sudden going to turn abusive because they lose their job,” said Maria Outcalt, a spokeswoman for Safe Nest, which provides shelter and counseling for domestic violence victims in Clark County. “Abusive behavior is not just because somebody is having a hard time. It’s not going to start all of the sudden.”

The number of people Safe Nest has served in the past year remained steady, Outcalt said.

But victims’ advocates said they still think unemployment has made their jobs more difficult.

“The sense of his remarks are true, in that it can make the situation worse, but I don’t know that being out of work alone causes domestic violence,” said Sue Meuschke, executive director of the Nevada Network Against Domestic Violence. “The economy doesn’t cause domestic violence, but certainly economic conditions can impact the circumstances.”

Victims are less likely to leave an abusive relationship when money is tight, Meuschke said.

“We’re seeing a reluctance on the part of women victims of domestic violence to leave the relationship because of the economy,” she said. “They see almost no options out there. If they leave, where are they going to get a job, where are they going to find housing, how are they going to support themselves and/or their children?”

Outcalt said that when a man is unemployed he spends more time at home, giving more time for abusive behavior to manifest itself.

In a 2004 study sponsored by the National Institute of Justice, researchers found that in relationships where the man is always employed, the rate of violence is 4.7 percent.

But when the man is unemployed once, that rate goes up to 7.5 percent, and if he has two periods of unemployment, the rate is 12.3 percent.

“The economy does not cause domestic violence but can make it worse,” said Sue Else, president of the National Network to End Domestic Violence, in a statement. “Senator Reid is correct in discussing how pervasive domestic violence is and what job loss can do to exacerbate the problem. The poor economy can fuel the fire of domestic violence and limit options for victims to escape. The numbers back up what Senator Reid is seeing in Nevada.”

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No matter how they try to spin it, it was a reckless generalization, and insult to the unemployed folks. Harry Reid needs to put a plug in it. Also Am I crazy, or are the clueless idiot elected so called leaders in Washington still defying the American people's will with this Health Care Reform Summit this Thursday? The latest numbers show unemployment still out of control, and the brain dead in Washington still stubbornly pursue the hated Health Care Bill? They are committing political suicide!!

Here we go again, I would like to think that we all believe in family values. But the conservatives say please don't confuse me with the facts, because those facts do not validate what think or what I would like to believe. Therefore, by stating the truth you are forcing me to face issues that make me uncomfortable or better yet you are asking me to show compassion for another human being.

I agree with the first poster, isn't it funny that the minute Hapless Harry sticks his foot in his mouth there is the LVSun to run cover for him and perform damage control. We saw the same thing with his "negro dialect" remark.

most liberals are stupid. they're $7 and $8 per hour workers...not the brightest bunch. so, in order to get this thing passed, this moron says something with NO proof or quotable statistic to scare people and to make anyone opposed to it seem like a terrible person.

His idea to advertise overseas to sell the idea to tour America is way too late, as well. While we could have been building the entertainment capital of the world, we have the housing disaster of the world... yea, come pay big bucks to see homeless people wandering around looking for jobs and empty houses... Great Job and Brilliant Idea!!!

i love when the owner of the Sun, Brian Greenspun writes and publishes an article giving great praise to Harry Reid but does not allow any criticism of his words via a comment section. Brian, you are a liberal biased person. I would never yell praise from the rooftop for Harry. What is wrong with supporting all candidates and not just selective. Is that what the press is supposed to do, give all candidates equal and fair treatment? Not at the Sun.

Harry, Harry.It's not WHAT YOU SAY, Harry, IT'S HOW YOU SAY ITthat gets people so mad!

There's obviously some causation in play. Would it really suprise people to find out that working guys that are suddenly hanging around the house all day for months on end with the noose getting tighter and tighter financially would not statistically be more prone to acting out?

Let's get to the real issues.People need jobs, and Harry's new jobs bill should help a lot here in Nevada.

"Women don't have jobs either, but women aren't abusive, most of the time. Men, when they're out of work, tend to become abusive. Our domestic crisis shelters in Nevada are jammed; that's the way it is all over the country."

Harry showed us all he knows nothing. I have plenty of past experience on this issue as an activist, been to commissions and committees and such. Because of that I did my homework. I know "Stanley X" from Armin Brott's "We Are the Target" in the August 1993 Penthouse. All the REAL studies, the ones without bias, show women keep up with men on the "who's more abusive" scale. Despite this publicly-funded DV services are nearly exclusive to women. Our sons, brothers, and fathers who need these services rarely have nowhere to go.

Think there's justice and equality in the courts when it comes to a DV accusation? Look this up on the SafeNest website: "Emergency Temporary Protective Orders" and find --

"Emergency Temporary Protective Orders (ETPOs) are available through the Crisis Hotline. These special protection orders are available if the batterer is currently in police custody for domestic violence. Law enforcement usually provides this information at the scene of the arrest. ETPOs are processed over the phone, signed by a judge and the batterer is served prior to being released from the mandatory 12-hour domestic-battery hold. The ETPO is a non-contact order that is valid for seven days until a Temporary Protective Order hearing is held at family court."

Judges sign these over the phone. No prior hearing with the parties before slamming the accused -- whose side the judge doesn't hear first -- and he can't go home again, not even to pick up his tools or see his kids. An accusation carries not only the guilt with it but the weight of the entire state machine -- thanx for the due process, courts!

Steve m - what about the "liberal elite" that you hate so much? Are they making $7-8 an hour?

"For the demographic reality is that, in America, the Democratic party is the new "party of the rich". More and more Democrats represent areas with a high concentration of wealthy households. Using Internal Revenue Service data, the Heritage Foundation identified two categories of taxpayers - single filers with incomes of more than $100,000 and married filers with incomes of more than $200,000 - and combined them to discern where the wealthiest Americans live and who represents them. Democrats now control the majority of the nation's wealthiest congressional jurisdictions. More than half of the wealthiest households are concentrated in the 18 states where Democrats control both Senate seats."

Harry Reid is such a disgrace and embarrassment. We know how he feels about Americans who visit our nation's capital; Harry thinks they smell. He doesn't like overweight people, although I'm not sure why. He makes racial remarks that would have decent people running for cover, and now he thinks out of work men are more likely to be abusers. If the rest of the country is expected to be politically correct, then certainly our politicians should also adher to the same rules. Harry is no better and not above the rest of Americans, whether he thinks so or not.

It's time to stop all the partisan politics, and Harry is one of the worst examples of that! He even tossed out a bi-partisan effort on the jobs bill. It's time to toss old Harry out!

Reid is full of crap and just says what he needs to so he can pull in the weak of mind. It doesn't help that the Las Vegas Sun hangs on to every word that come out of his mouth and gives them nice titles like "Domestic violence workers find truth in Harry Reid's jobless comments".

I have seen similar studies but comments like these have tainted the court systems and have denied good fathers the chance of getting custody of their kids.

Their was no need for Reid to mettle with this. Maybe he should stick to making brilliant observations about President Obama.

jr99 -- thanx. Used to write articles on the subject when I thought it still mattered. It's a lot like bible thumping, there's always another "study" that says the opposite of every point.

None of them change the fact if you line up 100 bona fide DV victims and only one is male, there is no justification for denying him the same level of service the other 99 get.

I've seen county DV committees with sitting judges and the court family services at the table as members. All done with our tax dollars. That these emergency orders are issued on the telephone is a gross denial of due process -- for them it's just another day at the office while they strip away all your most fundamental liberties.

Should we teach the public and our junior high school students (my daughters) the truth, or keep teaching them the current lies and abuse which our DV coalition teaches them?

Would you support not teaching them damaging hysteria, but instead teaching them helpful truth:

Facts: Males commit the least dating violence. Men and fathers commit the least spouse abuse, least child abuse and least child murders of their own children. MOST DV INJURIES AND DEATHS TO WOMEN result from women being primary DV initiators and attackers who don't let up, with additional abuse assistance from most politicians (Harry Reid...), their DV coalition and bought out "justice" system, until retaliation and tragedy result:

"IPV researcher Deborah Capaldi, Ph.D., a social scientist at the Oregon Social Learning Center, finds that the best way for women to be safe is to not initiate violence against their male partners." What is so awful about the our DV coalition teaching the truth to save men, women and children from abuse?

NOW, VAWA and our DV coalition are outraged that their partner organization Dept of Justice "stats" concede that men sustain 38% of DV partner injuries, even despite the DoJ being a partner in bias against men and fathers. Real unbiased bi-gender studies reveal that men sustain more DV injuries than women, according to both the women and men in those studies.

Men's DV injuries go under-reported and unreported, even very serious injuries. This practice of not reporting accurately is currently instructed and mandated by NOW, VAWA and DV coalitions to medical and justice system personnel, some of whom are illegally indoctrinated:

Search: Education for Injustice

DV laws manufacture and favor female victims. DV program money basically supports only women. Prosecutors get federal incentive money for convicting men, which additionally fuels 90% of convictions being male, further skewing public and political perceptions of DV reality.

Teaching DV TRUTHS REALLY HELPS REDUCE DV, DV injuries and DV deaths. But, most politicians (Harry Reid...) and their DV coalitions are violently opposed to this, helping men, women, and especially children. How could the DV industry ever be expected to profit, prosper and grow by using truth and real DV reduction in place of anti-male hysteria, lies and abuse?