Ding dong the franchise is dead. I'd rehire Jim Paxson, have him bottom this thing out again so we can get the #1 pick, rebuild around him, get agonizingly close to winning it all, then have him leave in 7 years.

"It's like dating a woman who hates you so much she will never break up with you, even if you burn down the house every single autumn." ~ Chuck Klosterman on Browns fans relationship with the Browns

That travesty Thurs night followed by this train wreck tonight - blessing in disguise.

Hopefully TMLP's illusions of "reloading" v. totally busting it down and rebuilding are dead.

Maybe not though ... with this GD casino coming to town. Between that and the mortgage co, 6,000 fans a night in the building for the next three years really impact both businesses. That and his massive case of short mans syndrome ... may not lead to sane decision making, even with the exposure of the last 3 days.

"It's like dating a woman who hates you so much she will never break up with you, even if you burn down the house every single autumn." ~ Chuck Klosterman on Browns fans relationship with the Browns

I think even Danny has to be realizing that the only way to get/keep fans in the seats is to give them at least one player to be excited about. No one on this team meets that description. I'm not sure whether Kyle Irving or Perry Jones or Harrison Barnes will, but I'm damn sure that Joey Graham and Anthony Parker and Jamario Moon won't.

I'm afraid this team is nowhere near hitting rock bottom. I wouldn't mind the losing if they did it with some fight and personality- but at this point they simply look to be "on tilt". Clueless, leaderless, no chemistry, all while learning an offense and a defense on the job. No group mind or identity. Yikes.

daddywags wrote:I think even Danny has to be realizing that the only way to get/keep fans in the seats is to give them at least one player to be excited about. No one on this team meets that description. I'm not sure whether Kyle Irving or Perry Jones or Harrison Barnes will, but I'm damn sure that Joey Graham and Anthony Parker and Jamario Moon won't.

Back up the truck, Danny.

Yeah, gonna go out on a limb here and say that Danny Ferry really doesnt care about the Cavs. It shows in this team. I mean, he has done nothing to make the team better in the off season. He cares so little he stopped being the GM all together..

Chris Grant on the other hand, he might want to listen to your advise on this one.

“Baseball is like church. Many attend but few understand.”- Wes Westrum

"The future is like a Japanese game show, we have no idea whats going on." - Tracy Jordan

"Gentlemen, Chicolini here may talk like an idiot and look like an idiot, but don't let that fool you. He really is an idiot."-Rufus T. Firefly

daddywags wrote:I think even Danny has to be realizing that the only way to get/keep fans in the seats is to give them at least one player to be excited about. No one on this team meets that description. I'm not sure whether Kyle Irving or Perry Jones or Harrison Barnes will, but I'm damn sure that Joey Graham and Anthony Parker and Jamario Moon won't.

Back up the truck, Danny.

Yeah, gonna go out on a limb here and say that Danny Ferry really doesnt care about the Cavs. It shows in this team. I mean, he has done nothing to make the team better in the off season. He cares so little he stopped being the GM all together..

Chris Grant on the other hand, he might want to listen to your advise on this one.

I don't know if it's possible to overstate the damage done by the Miami game. Every Cavs fan watched that game, even in person or on TV. The response was beyond disappointment; it was anger. Terry Pluto has received many emails from furious fans saying they won't go to another game this year, or that they're done with the NBA for good.

And now a blowout to a 4-15 team without their top scorer on the second night of a back-to-back. Wow. It looks like the players have packed it in and tuned out Scott. If something dramatic doesn't happen quickly this season is in danger of the bottom totally falling out, with 2,000 fans watching the carcass of a team go through the motions. It may already be too late. The death spiral is quickly picking up speed.

Prosecutor wrote:I don't know if it's possible to overstate the damage done by the Miami game. Every Cavs fan watched that game, even in person or on TV. The response was beyond disappointment; it was anger. Terry Pluto has received many emails from furious fans saying they won't go to another game this year, or that they're done with the NBA for good.

And now a blowout to a 4-15 team without their top scorer on the second night of a back-to-back. Wow. It looks like the players have packed it in and tuned out Scott. If something dramatic doesn't happen quickly this season is in danger of the bottom totally falling out, with 2,000 fans watching the carcass of a team go through the motions. It may already be too late. The death spiral is quickly picking up speed.

I'm not sure why any fans would have been surprised by the Miami blowout, or why their emotions would turn from disappointment to anger over that one game, you could see the writing on the wall from the start of this season. Maybe the casual Cavalier fan, but any half brained fan that follows this team should not be included in that group, unless they really bought into the false hope of the first two weeks...sheesh.

The Miami game could be seen a mile away, 2 NBA stars, both extremely athletic, both in their prime, both able to get to the rim at will. Meanwhile we lack any one player on our roster who could eve hope to contain just one of them. Then you add in a capable guy like Bosh...we were lucky to be in it for 1 quarter, even with the Heat under achieving so far this year.

IMO any Cavalier fan giving up on the season b/c of THAT game is a total moron, when they could have done themselves a favor and gave up on it about 30 days ago.

Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect."I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

Even with Miami being as mediocre as they are, any basketball fan should expect Lebron to rack up 40 and put up ridiculous numbers. That's what he does. Losing to Miami is fine - laying down to them is not.

Losing to the Timberwolves in this fashion is not OK. You're going to have off nights and a some losing streaks. But to lose to the Timberwolves by 40? That's inexcusable.

I held out hope for a 7th or 8th seed playoff appearance. But, I'm starting to think otherwise and maybe it's time to start looking at blowing up the team. Because they are playing awful these past few weeks.

Seems like we are coming along quite nicely for the blow it up crowd. 20 games; verdict is in. Who really cares what we lose by? Same fans that weren't here 8 years ago will be back the next time a contender is put on the court.

Question is can they put together another contender.

"When a man with money meets a man with experience, the man with experience leaves with money and the man with money leaves with experience."

Trust me OJ I was not suggesting you are a moron, but the real question isn't if they can build another contender at the Q, it's if they can do it before the Browns become good enough to make the Cavaliers completely irrelevant in this town.

Oops too late?

Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect."I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

Madre Hill, Superstar wrote:Is it too early to pose the question: Does Byron Scott survive the season?

How can he not? Nobody could win with this cluster fuck of a team.

That lock out can't come soon enough.

I'll take it a step further: At what point do you start questioning if Scott is part of the problem?

You're talking about a guy who won three titles as a player and coached the likes of Jason Kidd, Richard Jefferson and Chris Paul. He's used to winning, and he's used to at least having some raw materials to work with.

The Nets and Hornets were pretty much bottoming out in both of Scott's previous inaugural seasons. But this is by far the worst situation Scott has stepped into as a coach. When he took the job, there was still a chance LeBron would re-sign. Now, it's a psychologically devastated roster that probably needs about a 90 percent turnover just to get the ghost of LeBron out of the locker room.

I don't doubt Scott is still trying to fight the good fight. But deep down, he might be thinking "I didn't sign on for this. Come on Phil, retire already." And it might be showing through in his coaching, and in turn, rubbing off on his players.

Really, before Christmas of two seasons ago, the Cavs weren't that hot of an item. I had season tix that year and had a hard time getting people to go to games with me. Around Christmas, suddenly everyone wanted to go and the rest of the season people kept asking me if I had tickets available.

Cavs need to be something special to capture the city's interest. They're back to irrelevancy, as they have been for most of their existence. This is really nothing new.

Don't worry donny I know I am not a moron. I just see this as another of the death throes of an org. bottoming out. The fans that jumped on, are now jumping off, and the wild assertions of gloom and doom just make me laugh.

What they do/don't with Mo, Jamo, Boobie, Andy, and Hickson will tell me what this front office is all about. So far the moves they made, or tried to make (Lowry) have me mildly bullish. Would really have liked to see us purchase a draft pick, even then the 2 guys I thought to target Bradley/Bledsoe have been miss/hit...

"When a man with money meets a man with experience, the man with experience leaves with money and the man with money leaves with experience."

We have a really big issue where we aren't going to get any production from 2 of our starters (Parker & Graham/Moon), and the other three starters don't produce consistently. In any game we are going to be undertalented in at least 3 positions, if not all 5.

JJ is the only one I want to see on this team next year, and for the right deal he can go too.

JJN wrote: JJ is the only one I want to see on this team next year, and for the right deal he can go too.

If I had to keep one player for next year, it would be Sessions. He's a turnover machine at times, but he's also a consistent scorer. Give him minutes, he'll probably give you 15-17 PPG and 6-8 APG. His speed is probably the best single player attribute on the Cavs roster at the moment.

J.J......I'm just not as much of a fan. Inconsistent, low basketball IQ. Destined to be in and out of coaches' doghouses for his entire career. And I don't think experience is going to cure him. His ceiling is a decent, but flawed, role player. Not a future centerpiece.

JJN wrote: JJ is the only one I want to see on this team next year, and for the right deal he can go too.

If I had to keep one player for next year, it would be Sessions. He's a turnover machine at times, but he's also a consistent scorer. Give him minutes, he'll probably give you 15-17 PPG and 6-8 APG. His speed is probably the best single player attribute on the Cavs roster at the moment.

J.J......I'm just not as much of a fan. Inconsistent, low basketball IQ. Destined to be in and out of coaches' doghouses for his entire career. And I don't think experience is going to cure him. His ceiling is a decent, but flawed, role player. Not a future centerpiece.

Thank God the Cavs didn't lose JJ in a trade for Amare last season. If they had they'd be in pretty bad shape right now.

The non PHO trade has been gone over and over. Cavaliers waited out the Suns as long as possible. The lack of deal was 100% on the Suns. That said I agree JJ is shit, and should be dealt with a vetern to a team that can be fooled.

Or just an outright dump for salary/pick.

Low life IQ!

"When a man with money meets a man with experience, the man with experience leaves with money and the man with money leaves with experience."

Orenthal wrote:The non PHO trade has been gone over and over. Cavaliers waited out the Suns as long as possible. The lack of deal was 100% on the Suns. That said I agree JJ is shit, and should be dealt with a vetern to a team that can be fooled.

Or just an outright dump for salary/pick.

Low life IQ!

I know I know. I just didn't want actual facts to get in the way of a hilarious joke.

Scott DID sign up for this though. Scott, probably more than anyone, knew LeBron staying was at best 50/50, hell LeBron wouldn't meet with him before his hire. Scott had one advantage over TMLP and us as fans and local media, he was an outsider who possessed more objectivity on the situation than any of us would ever admit. Scott knew damn well he could be the captain of a sinking ship for 5 months.

He's jumping all over that Laker job if the opportunity shows up, he's the new Larry Brown minus the one ring.

Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect."I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

FUDU wrote: I'm not sure why any fans would have been surprised by the Miami blowout, or why their emotions would turn from disappointment to anger over that one game, you could see the writing on the wall from the start of this season. Maybe the casual Cavalier fan, but any half brained fan that follows this team should not be included in that group, unless they really bought into the false hope of the first two weeks...sheesh...

IMO any Cavalier fan giving up on the season b/c of THAT game is a total moron, when they could have done themselves a favor and gave up on it about 30 days ago.

I think a lot of fans were hopeful the team would at least be competitive and entertaining. For one thing we were getting an offensive-minded coach (as opposed to Roker's "you win with defense" approach) with a track record of developing a chronic loser into a Finals team, so that looked good. They also talked about a new, up-tempo, movement-oriented offense that would work better for players like Mo, Andy, Boobie, Jamo, Moon, and JJ than the "stand around and watch Bron and Andy run a two-man game over and over" game plan that Roker favored.

There was also talk about Scott whipping the team into phenominal condition so they could make up for shortcomings in talent by running opponents into the ground.

And they put out the idea that the players were motivated to prove they aren't garbage without LeBron.

So I was kind of expecting a feisty, well-conditioned, combative bunch that would get after people and find a way to beat weak and mediocre teams with movement, conditioning, and hustle. The opening win over the Celtics gave me hope that we'd see something like that. Looks like that was false hope unless Scott can pull a Dr. Frankenstein shock treatment on this corpse.

FUDU wrote: I'm not sure why any fans would have been surprised by the Miami blowout, or why their emotions would turn from disappointment to anger over that one game, you could see the writing on the wall from the start of this season. Maybe the casual Cavalier fan, but any half brained fan that follows this team should not be included in that group, unless they really bought into the false hope of the first two weeks...sheesh...

IMO any Cavalier fan giving up on the season b/c of THAT game is a total moron, when they could have done themselves a favor and gave up on it about 30 days ago.

I think a lot of fans were hopeful the team would at least be competitive and entertaining. For one thing we were getting an offensive-minded coach (as opposed to Roker's "you win with defense" approach) with a track record of developing a chronic loser into a Finals team, so that looked good. They also talked about a new, up-tempo, movement-oriented offense that would work better for players like Mo, Andy, Boobie, Jamo, Moon, and JJ than the "stand around and watch Bron and Andy run a two-man game over and over" game plan that Roker favored.

There was also talk about Scott whipping the team into phenominal condition so they could make up for shortcomings in talent by running opponents into the ground.

And they put out the idea that the players were motivated to prove they aren't garbage without LeBron.

So I was kind of expecting a feisty, well-conditioned, combative bunch that would get after people and find a way to beat weak and mediocre teams with movement, conditioning, and hustle. The opening win over the Celtics gave me hope that we'd see something like that. Looks like that was false hope unless Scott can pull a Dr. Frankenstein shock treatment on this corpse.

Good post. I felt the same. If nothing else, Gilbert had a responsibility to the season ticket holders to not blow the team up this season after making them re-up early last year. Turns out this roster just happens to play like a blow up franchise. As it is, this should speed up the timetable for blowing up the team. I thought we'd be here next year.