I used to use the words "finishing hold" as that was clearer; but the words could haunt you in court. So I leave it to you to understand that message.

One of the takedowns HAS to be a shoot, either single or double leg. One of the submissions HAS to be the CVR or Carotid Vascular restraint. One of the clinches has to be the Russian Mount (we don't pin people on the street). One of the leg strikes is kicking from the ground (butt scoot) and all that that entails. One of the arm strikes has to be the chin jab/tiger claw.

Now; when used in combination (Ketsugo) you would be stunned to see how many ways 10 techniques work out. Dr. Mance says you can mix 10 techniques into about 10,000 different combinations. At least I think he said that; memory getting bad. I know it was huge!

Lets stay with that; how long would it take you to master 10,000 techniques? Bet it would take longer than learning 10 REAL well!

Now these skills must be mastered! Drilled over and over again as if your life counted on them, and it does.
How hard would you train if you HAD to fight Tank Abbott in 6 weeks? Ever thought that you might have to fight someone like him, with NO warning?

Now, a serious recommendation. Just about everything you need to use to make this selection can be found in "The fighters notebook". Chris was kind enough to buy me one for my birthday and it is simply one of the best works of it's kind I have ever read. BUY IT TODAY!

Now, lets see YOUR list! Your ten core techniques for true "real world" fighting. Lets talk about them.
Then we will show you how to train with them!

Subject: RE: INFOFrom:ILVQLOSDate: 08-May-00 | 08:32 AM
Arm strikes:(1) Uppercut w/fist or w/palm heel. If done w/palm heel add in fingers into eyes.(2)Axe-hand into trachea or any part of neck.

Leg strikes:(1) Foot stomp on top of his foot.(2)Front kick into his shin or roundhouse to side of knee.
Takedowns:(1)Osoto-gari w/crook of elbow clothesline or w/fingers into eyes face push.(2)Double leg takedown w/intention to lift and slam back o/his head into floor

Clinches:(1)Use head butt into face.(2)Hold back of neck and pull head down as smash knee into face/head, or knee into balls.

Leg strikes: knee to the groin, front kick to the knee (possibly from butt scoot).

Takedowns: double leg takedown, tai otoshi.

Subs: rear naked choke, cross armlock.

Not sure what is meant by clinches. Pin-wise, I'd go for a high mount or a rear mount. When I clinch, I reach both arms underneath my opponent's armpits and grab my own wrist. From here, I headbutt and use knees to the groin whilst looking for a ko soto gake throw.

No because this isn't a contest. Unless the person has a weapon; Don Knots isn't going to assault Tank Abbott.

However, Tank would go after Don...

Clinch as to tie him up (one standing one on the ground) to where you are in control and can monitor.
Yes, just noticed he left out stuff from the butt scoot..

Oh... speaking of Tank; look for post!

Subject: RE: INFOFrom:sharkelephantDate: 08-May-00 | 05:43 PM
why no pinning in the street? Is it because he may have freinds around? I wd think pinning would allow your arms freedom to strike or submit...

Subject: RE: INFOFrom:submission studenDate: 08-May-00 | 06:55 PM
I don't think a "hold down" or "Pin" is in line with MTripp's basic concept of combatives. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the main objective is to hurt some one so you can get away from them. Get them off of you so that you can get to safety. To hold them down would be inviting them to fight more.

2 leg strikes= (to get them away) straight kicks in the body, to create space. Round kicks to the legs,(to sweep or knock them off balance.

2 clinches= Wrestlers "head and an arm", or and "Over and under"

2 take downs= (from the clinch) hip toss, or tai otoshi, (from the shot) inside single (headbutt to the groin), "shuck and drag"

2 submissions= there are so many to choose from, I think that education and situation have to be factored into this one. Seeing as most subs would be used as breaks in this mind set. They would be snapped on and followed through with until damage was done, with out regard to fair play.

2 "submission/restraining" holds :CVR/ hmmm tough one....I'd rather have a basic knowledge of joint locking principles rather than any one lock/hold. But If i had to choose..i'd use ude-gatame/garami from the russian mount.

Chris

Subject: RE: INFOFrom:YeahDate: 09-May-00 | 01:54 PM
Eye strikes are great, but there has been some guys like Matt Thorton who believe eye Bounks, I think thats what he call them, wont win a fight for you. I have always been taught different and have used them in fights. I think they work great.

MTripp, Its funny that you used the word Ketsugo. That is what the art I am studying is caled. It is a mix of Ju-Jitsu, Judo, Akido, and Karate. I havent been studying it all that long so my list will be fairly rudimentary. 2 arm strikes: straight arm jab and upper cut/elbow to face. I would also add any strikes to the kidneys.
2 leg strikes: front kick to the groin and thrusting front kick to the knees.

2 takedowns: I have always liked the hip toss and single leg take downs. I worked as a bouncer for a while and would hip toss people to the ground upon occasion. learned it in Basic.

2 "clinches": Not really sure about clinches. but instead I have a couple of akido moves I like. Reverse wrist lock and finger locks to get out of hand chokes or shirt/gi grabs.

2 "submission/restraining" holds: we call it "Japanese Sleeper" everyone else calls it the Rear Nekkid.
Learned that from rasslin' when I was a young un'. And the standing arm bar, I think thats what it is called. Opponent is on the ground and you have their wrist secured with your knee on the back of the elbow.

We were talking about this same thing last night at class. The sensei was going over throws and he was doing hip tosses out of every postition. When I mentioned that, he said "You know, I can do alot of throws, but the hip toss is my favorite so I practice it out of every scenario." It got me thinking about learning ten or twelve moves and getting good at it and then just working on them. They have to be practical of course. I see these younger adults who have this idea about jumping spinning kicks and seeing how high they can hit. well, that's kool in the dojo, but what about when Joe scumbag wants yourt lunch money? I am in Martial Arts for two reasons. One is for my son who wanted to get involved in something and I go to help him along. The other is because I work in a prison and want a practical defensive art. Anyways, dave RatBastahd

Subject: RE: INFOFrom:SothyDate: 09-May-00 | 06:44 PM
just out of question...why the kicks?...some wrestlers/boxers do alright with that combination without throwing kicks (and you are more prone to get taken down with a leg in the air)...just curious, personally I like kicks...

Subject: RE: INFOFrom:Absolute StormDate: 10-May-00 | 04:30 AM
No. The results are in and it turns out I did. That's right, I was suprised as you are and demanded an immediate recount. Nevertheless, the results came out the same.
( :

I'm going to be told that punching with the knuckles can break them tai otoshi exposes my back and is therefore too risky in a real fight, the cross armlock invloves ending up on my back, which is dangerous if my opponent has buddies nearby. The standard mount doesn't give enough visibility to observe if my opponent is reaching for a weapon, or if his friends are coming to help, etc.

Sometimes, you have to accept certain compromises in life. Here, the compromise is that, in order to defeat the hypothetical Tank Abbott, I'm going to have to use some of the most powerful tools in my repertoire. If I reduce their effectiveness by modifying them to take into account multiple assailants, weapons etc, I'll may lose a fight to a single, unarmed man and be beaten to a pulp.

I didn't say I didn't like the advice given here. Quite the opposite, as I have said before. I just didn't want to give the impression that I hadn't given thought to those areas which may earn me criticism from certain quarters.

Re-reading my earlier post, perhaps it came out a little more aggressively than I had intended. Won't happen again.

Even so; there are people who do (police/military) and they study combatives too...

BUT, think about this...

You are running away to your car and now you want to get your keys out to get in and drive away...

But your right hand is broken.....

Subject: RE: INFOFrom:Absolute StormDate: 11-May-00 | 07:30 AM
I do take potential knuckle damage seriously, but I feel I have conditioned them sufficiently now (through makiwara) to withstand being used for several strikes. Admittedly, this would not be the case for everyone.

2 arm strikes: Palm strike and elbow. the palm can be thrown from a variety of angles and can be everything from a strike to a pushing striking blow. The elbow is simple to learn and non telegraphing

2 leg strikes: Front push kick, andthai style shin kick.

2 takedowns: Here is where I get controversial, Tani-otoshi and a thai throw where you hold low on the chest in a bear hug and walk the opponent back while you pull him towards you, Ihave used it live and it has worked well.

2 clinches: Easy, duckunder and arm drag.

2 restraints: Kinda a toss up, rear naked or hadake jime and knee on chest which can easily be turned into a Russian mount.

Storm, Wasn't trying to say those things weren't good, just want everyone to go home safe (the point of combatives).

Now don't take this the wrong way(bad set up I know).But IMHO there may be a slight flaw in your thinking (for combatives) the "Win or loose a fight" mentality (Or possibly just my interptation of what you typed). Win or Loose is not a option, Suviving is,then surving without breaking the laws, then survining without breaking the law and not getting injured in the process. I'm sure Coach will go into this further.
"The standard mount doesn't give enough visibility to observe if my opponent is reaching for a weapon, or if his friends are coming to help, etc."

Why do that to yourself and get booted in the head or better yet stabbed or shot...Work on thse things now so they get stronger.

"Sometimes, you have to accept certain compromises in life. Here, the compromise is that, in order to defeat the hypothetical Tank Abbott, I'm going to have to use some of the most powerful tools in my repertoire."
Right I agree, but make those combative techniqes your strongest so you won't have to compromise.
Just wanted to let you know, we not dogging you but we actuactlly care and want to help.

Click for larger pic Been in a Steven Seagal mood. Made some animated GIFs of him in action. Please check out this Steven Seagal movie....

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