When John Kerry and John Edwards stood on the stage of the Fillmore Auditorium on Friday and spoke of unifying America, the message was meant to be universal. "We believe in lifting people up and bringing people together," said Edwards.

It was aimed at everyone, but especially at people like Kim Sayers.

Sayers, of Denver, is a Deaniac. It was Howard Dean who inspired her to get involved in political action at the age of 57.

there's a ton of Kucitizens who are very disappointed with the platform and the seemingly pro-war bent of the party. They're anti-Bush and will probably vote for Kerry, but there's still no guarantee. A lot of them are looking closer at Cobb and the Greens these days, too....

Voting for him is pure delusion. He would be a lousy president if he even had any possible chance of even getting elected, which is probably about .0000003%.

Kerry is not "pro-war" and is actually pretty progressive in many issues. Anyone who is for pulling our troops out now and leaving Iraq a destroyed nation with an infrastructure that Bush blew up could easily be called "pro-humanitarian disaster" or "pro-genocidal civil war".

Like Mike Malloy said on his last radio show, people need to grow up. This election is too important to just play a crybaby that can't get the Democratic party to go to the far-left. It's not going to happen. Get Kerry in and then go the next step by making sure he stays progressive and get incrimental changes in and build from there.

Voting for Nader or Cobb is handing your vote to Bush. Enough of that selfishness and it's called losing the election. Period.

Why are you guys so darn over-the-top? Did I say your "dissent" was treasonous? Was it implied that "progressives" aren't allowed in the Democratic party? Even when many of Kerry's issues and beliefs could be lumped into the foggy "progressive" label, do you think that you aren't welcome to voice your opinion?

delusional or selfish - or calling people "cry-babies" - is along the same vein as the repubs calling us treasonous for not supporting their candidate.

At least it feels amazingly similar to me these days.

Note added in edit:I keep thinking I will feel better tomorrow. Thursday was harder than I could have imagined. I don't feel like I have a voice that speaks to me in this campaign anymore, and some (but not all) Kerry people have made it all the worse. I'm sorry if I jumped down your collective throats.

I've had to talk with various people I would describe as crybabies and delusional tinfoil hatters when doing grassroots stuff for Kerry.

Either they are hot-headed, angry screaming banshies with no clue of Kerry's issues and call him a "corporatist" or "international terrorist" and say they are voting for Nader or they are simply flakey burnouts that are voting Green because Kerry is "pro-war"... in the end, they are usually lazy, uninformed malcontents that have personal issues to work out and their mindless anger is channeled that the World is going to end soon or that Kerry is the devil... or whatever.

I recently had some woman come up to me and try to turn over the Kerry table we had set up...she screamed at the top of her lungs that she was for peace and was a Buddhist and then went off on some tirade about how Dennis was set up by Skull and Bones to lose... it was too bad there were no black helicopters nearby or I would have pointed them out and she might have run back to her big polluting VW van with the Save The Earth bumpersticker and on her way to Walmart to get some more grow lights.

We must get rid of the Chimp at all costs. If you don't get that, then I have no idea what to tell you.

He simply wanted the ability to use force to "disarm" Saddam as a last resort. He really didn't want to blow up Iraq, honestly!

How is Kerry "pro-war"? Try this: he has stated, during the campaign, that he WILL NOT reduce the bloated Pentagon budget-- he won't even cancel programs like Star Wars, which DON'T WORK, and never will work. He wants to INCREASE "defense" spending in certain areas, even though the Pentagon cannot account for over $1 TRILLION in funds it has "misplaced".

The US is by far the world's largest arms dealer, and is responsible for arming and financing some of the most dangerous regimes and terrorists of our times. Most of the deaths caused in the world are caused by our tax dollars, which have armed the likes of Suharto in Indonesia (1,200,000 dead), Pol Pot in Cambodia (2,000,000 dead), Pinochet in Chile (10,000 dead), D'Aubouisson in El Salvador (200,000 dead), Duvalier in Haiti (many thousands dead).... and this is just a tiny sampling. Like it or not, we have blood on our hands. And neither Kerry nor Bush is too interested in cleaning it off, either.

BTW, why did you all of a sudden assume that, because I dislike Kerry, that I will be voting for Cobb or Nader? As I have stated, repeatedly, on this board, I AM VOTING "FOR" KERRY-- or, "against Bush" if you insist.

Am I happy about it? No. I know Kerry is part of the problem with this country, along with the DLC and the Democrat "power brokers" who have the backing of the corporations who really control this country. However, Kerry's not as big a part of the problem as ShrubCo is, and he shows signs of being intelligent and persuadable, when the corpocrats are calling the shots for him.

Kerry doesn't HAVE to win anyone over. WE should be smart enough to realize how dangerous Bush is. he is the perfect machine for the reight wingers. He's dumb enough to be molded, very far to the right and extremely charismatic. Kerry can't run the way we want him to. WE have to understand that and vote for him anyway. We can vote for the Naders and Cobbs when the GOP runs someone like Chuck Hagel. It's like I keep saying, if america votes Bush back in this year, we deserve him. THAT INCLUDES US!!!

I don't mean to pick on you for this one because there are dozens of posts like this anytime Nader or Cobb comes up. You know, there are some people who think they would be throwing their vote away if they support someone who continues the war in Iraq and four more years of corporate government. Insulting Greens doesn't win them over.

but I really wish some on the party's left would realize that there's plenty difference between Kerry and Bush. Thats all I want. Hell I agree with them on the issues but I dont think Kerry's that bad of a guy, I dont like some of his votes but not only is he a hell of lot better than Bush, he has a great record, so I get upset if people go after him like hes some Bush clone or even a conservative democrat when the record shows hes not. I dont have a problem with the party's left wing but I do wish some members of it would realize that Kerry has good intentions. I dont agree with Kerry on everything believe me but he'll fight for most of what I believe in and he shares my value, thats good enough for my vote.

and teacher creature for your considered opinions. They are refreshing. I am new to the DU but am disheartened by posts similar to those you responded to. (Hmmm-left that hanging, didn't I?)

There will be no "Grand Coalition" of the "Willing to vote Bushwa out" without bringing in Greens and Independents and finding a way for the DP to recover those blue collar reagan Democrats who are no longer voting for candidates from the DP.

Kerry enjoys a liberal reputation, but IMO he is shackled by the DLC and the money drive. This, I believe, is much of the reason the reagan Democrats exist, why the Green Party is growing and why Independents now outnumber both DP an Repugs on most state voter rolls.

Attitudes such as those expressed in this thread only serve to keep those potential allies away.

I just wish they would try to see that at heart Kerry may not agree with us on everything but he cares and he does have a great vision. I dont hate third party voters but I do wish they would support the dem nom, Kerry's a lot better than what we could have had I think, and considering he's our most liberal nominee since '88 at least some will argue since '68, I am proudly supporting him. This is a man whose record is a near parrell to Kennedy and Wellstone. He doesnt have their kind of attiude I admit but when Kerry gets going, he kicks ass I think. The four more years of Bush today was a great ass kicking I thought too, and he not only is a great nominee but he's a smart and compassionate man.

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