I was waiting for you What hubs are you running?And I also recall the V2 rim coming in at ~380g. The wheels I referred to previously are V1 though. As I said, I'd love to be convinced that I could run a set (I weigh 170-175) but that rear wheel flex is a hard image to shake for me.

I don't mean to interrupt this conversation, but is this your actual build or a planned build? I read somewhere that a triplet lacing requires some sturdy rims, the 340 would be the last thing that comes to mind in terms of sturdy...

Actual build, not planned, and I've run them for years now. Bearings are still super smooth front and rear.

Triplet lacing was necessary because the rims have a low tension rating, and running the calculations on what spoke tension would be needed with a 24h set up and that flange spacing, triplet was necessary. I learned about all of this through the WheelBuilding Thread... it's in there somewhere, me asking the question, a following discussion on triplet lacing for the 340 rims, and so on.

I had heard the finish of Archetypes was similar to the C2 - there was even one comment suggesting they may come from the same factory as the profile is exactly the same (except for said pointy bit), but who knows . . .

Given that, why would anyone go for the Hed C2 if the quality of the Archetype is just as good, weight comparable, looks better (IMHO) and the price far better?

All of the positive evidence that H Plus Son has a good product in the Archetype has come about just in the last few months. Hed has a pretty good head start when it comes to proven reliability. There are plenty of people willing to pay an extra $30ish/rim for that track record. In a couple of years the same question may be incredibly valid.

And for the record, I just ordered a pair of Archetypes. I am willing to take the "risk" for most of the reasons you mentioned above.

H Plus Son have a good track record in the Fixed S/S scene so I'm confident in the quality of their rims. The price of HED rims in the UK is high so it makes the Archetype a good option. We've built plenty of both types of rims. Since the Archetype had additional alloy added to the nipple bed they will hold as much spoke tension as the Ardennes but they are 25g heavier. The Archetype has a consistently truer brake finish than the Ardennes. So for a UK purchaser the increase in weight is offset by the Archetype being significantly cheaper.

Hed has a pretty good head start when it comes to proven reliability. There are plenty of people willing to pay an extra $30ish/rim for that track record.

Retail is ~$70 vs $120. Hed no longer sells any <24h... which reduces their suitability for normal size people.

The finish on the two looks the same...bead blasted except that the Archetype has a black anodized brake track that quickly gets worn off. Welded joint, offset drilling, same dimensions, about the same weight.

I wouldn't call the C2 stellar for reliability (like every other rim there have been some reports of cracking), but they have been extremely straight and round. So far I've only built one set of the Archetypes and they were ok.

Although StradaJon I thought that the Hed and the Archetype were both 470g? So no weight difference - or are the Heds coming in well under the published weights?

I understand the Archetype was 450g and could hold max 120kgf tension, but the newer ones with thicker spoke beds are 470g and can hold 130kgf (same as Hed).

In Australia, the retail price difference seems the same as the UK - AUD95 for Archetypes (incl shipping) and circa $150 for Heds. So in my mind given the good experience of Strada, WMW and Spinelli amongst others with the Archetype, it makes sense to save the $100 a set. . .

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