Duke, the fourth-winningest squad of all time (1,946 wins), opens the off-Broadway show with a 6 p.m. meeting against No. 38 Michigan State (1,496), with all of the action available on ESPN — where else?

“When I think of Kentucky,” KU’s Johnson said, “I think of a winning program, a legendary program, Rupp Arena. That’s about it. It should be a good game just because of the stats.”

North Carolina, by the way, looms right behind KU in all-time victories with 2,034.

As far as the outlook for this particular season, Kentucky enters 1-0 (after Friday’s 108-58 victory over Marist) and ranked second in the land; KU is 1-0 (after a 100-54 pasting of Towson) and ranked 12th.

“It’ll be good. It’ll be a fun deal,” KU coach Bill Self said. “They’ll be fired up, and they’ve got men. It’ll be interesting to see how our young guys react.”

As well as Kentucky’s.

Young, talented NBA prospects on the UK roster include sophomores Terrence Jones and Doron Lamb, as well as freshmen Anthony Davis, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist and Marquis Teague.

Jones — he didn’t start in Friday’s opener the day after fleeing the scene of a car accident (he was only a passenger in the car) — might be the best of the UK bunch.

“He’d probably have been a lottery pick (had he entered the 2011 draft),” Self said of the 6-foot-9, 252-pounder from Portland, Ore., who averaged 15.7 points and 8.8 rebounds his freshman season.

“They say Gilchrist (6-7, 232, Somerdale, N.J.) is a lottery pick. Davis (6-10, 220, Chicago) is a lottery pick. Lamb (6-4, 210, Queens, N.Y.) may lead them in scoring. Teague (6-2, 189, Indianapolis) will eventually be a lottery pick. They’ve got other guys who will eventually play in the league. They’ve got some guys. They will guard and play hard. We are going to have to really bring it. I’m looking forward to putting us in that position to see what we do,” Self added.

First item on the scouting report: How does KU slow down power forward Jones?

“Just put Thomas on him. Thomas coulda went pro, too. It’s like that,” KU junior guard Tyshawn Taylor said of KU All-America candidate Thomas Robinson, who wasn’t about to make this match-up all about himself.

Dead silence was Robinson’s answer to a question of what he thought about Jones.

“They have a tough team with young, talented guys,” Robinson said. “At the same time, they are in our way. We’ll see ’em in the Garden.”

Veterans Taylor and Johnson likely will be asked to shadow point guard Teague, who is following in the footsteps of John Wall and Brandon Knight.

“You know, he plays a big role for his team. He is one of the only pure point guards,” Taylor said. “He’s a good player, but he’s a freshman still. He’s going to make mistakes. It’s like his second or third game in college. He is going to be really good, but I think me and Elijah have to put pressure on him. We are both 6-4. He’s about 6-0, so we’ve got to use our length and just play.”

The Jayhawks didn’t prepare for Kentucky — but they did discuss the Kentucky challenge — even prior to the Towson game.

“(We talked about them) in general terms,” Self said. “Hey, they’ve got men, and they’ve got a bunch of them. NBA people who have been to our practices and been to theirs ... they are saying, ‘They’ve got men.’ They’re competitive. We are also competitive when we get it turned up. We’ve not gotten it turned up consistently.”

Kentucky coach John Calipari, who took the Wildcats to the Final Four in his second season in Lexington — his sophomores say they are intent on winning it all in ’12 — is equally complimentary of KU.

“I just don’t know if we’re ready to play a team like Kansas,” Calipari said on his website, coachcal.com. “We’re this highly ranked team who could get beat by 100 teams in the country right now.”

Noted shooting guard/Queens native Lamb, who, like KU’s Taylor (Hoboken, N.J.) will be playing before a batch of relatives and friends tonight: “We know Kansas is a great team. We’re a great team, so we’ve got to go out there and compete with them.”

“Kansas is a great school, great team,” freshman forward Davis said. “I just can’t wait to go out there and play them. Coach Cal said they’re real physical, and if we start the game the way we started (Friday vs. Marist), we’re not going to win.”

There’s a chance these teams could meet in a rematch in the NCAA Tournament.

And, who knows, maybe in regular-season games down the line.

“I think it’d be a great home-and-home every year, wouldn’t it?” Self said. KU trails the series 19-6, all time.

NOTES

• KU has won the last three meetings between the teams dating to 2005. KU beat Kentucky, 88-76, in a second-round 2007 NCAA Tournament game in Chicago.

• KU’s single-game record of 150 points came against Kentucky in a 150-95 win over Rick Pitino’s Wildcats on Dec. 9, 1989 in Lawrence.

• Tyshawn Taylor on UK coach Calipari, who worked as a former Larry Brown assistant at KU: “I think he’s definitely one of the best coaches of this era, my era. He’s got a lot of guys in the pros. For the guys that want to be in the one-and-done position, he’s the guy for that. If you want to come to college and leave right after that, he’s the guy.” More from Taylor on coach Cal: “Probably that national championship game when he coached Memphis against coach Self, that’s one of the things I definitely remember about coach Cal. He lost to coach Self (in ‘08 title game).”

• Taylor on the Garden: “I think it’s an amazing place to play, real close to home. I’ll have a lot of family in there, which is a good thing. Last year, I remember it being cold (on early-December trip in which KU beat Memphis in the Jimmy V. Classic). I remember winning the game. I remember us watching a Knicks game the night before and just having a good time.”

• Elijah Johnson on the Garden: “I always thought the Garden was the best gym in the world and the fieldhouse second. The closer I got to college, I started to go with the fieldhouse over the Garden. I love the Garden, but the fieldhouse is more exciting for us.”

• Next season, Kansas will play Michigan State on Nov. 13, 2012, at the Georgia Dome in Atlanta, while Duke will play Kentucky in that Champions Classic doubleheader. On Nov. 12, 2013, the venue will be the United Center in Chicago with Kansas playing Duke and Kentucky facing Michigan State. “Prior to Maui, I don’t think we’ve had a group get together like this to generate more interest than this here,” Self said of the Classic.

• Self on Calipari’s strong recruiting: “He’s a good recruiter. They (UK coaches) are hungry. They’ve got a great product to push. They’ve done real well. He’s been able to do very well with the guys that are bonifide NBA talent guys, the one-and-done or two-and-done guys. They’ve got a guy who came back this year (Jones) that would have been a lottery pick last year. The thing about Cal that is a little bit misleading ... guys can get reputations as being real good recruiters. Rarely do really good recruiters get the reputation of being a really good coach. I think he’s a really really good coach. He gets his teams to play hard and guard and play unselfish. It’s the hardest thing to do with really young, talented guys.

“We’ve gone against them several times (in recruiting). They win their fair share. We’ve won a few. As long as he is there and really it doesn’t make a difference who is there or here, we will go against each other recruiting-wise no question and they’ve done a great job.”

Wow!! Where to start. Cal zero championships. Self's one is over the chooking Cal. UCLA has more championships than UK. Throwing Rupp in our face. What to say to that?.....................Oh yeah Rupp is a Jayhawk. You're welcome for Kansas breeding the cornerstone of your program. Naismith inveted baskeball. Common knowledge. Can't wait for the day Cal bolts because he knows the NCAA recruiting violations have caught up with him.

The Helms were voted on at the end of the season, if they don't count, then there should not be any National Championships given out to football teams since they are all voted on at the end of the season.

Wrong in so many ways... UCLA has more rings than Kentucky, James Naismith (KU) invented basketball and KU created Adolph Rupp. Cal is in no way the best coach ever! For starters Self beat him in the championship game and then you gotta look to John Wooden who I would say is the greatest of all time. The one thing I won't deny is that Kentucky is a great program, the rest of your "facts" are way off buddy.

You may have read a few of my posts regarding the same message yesterday. If a troll appears on this board, (Easily identified by their names), I immediately skip over their irrelevant, asinine dodo. Ignore someone long enough and they will go away with their head down, feeling sorry for their puny little lives. I sent in a general post yesterday, stating that a troll poster calling his/herself "UKALL..." (ie. yokel) wouldn't respond to my challenge to ignore them because I wouldn't respond back, and he/she didn't post anything afterwards. So, he/she lost. Or maybe he/she changed their name, because another troll, identifying themselves as "UKBBALL", suddenly started posting. Scared the dodo right out of "UKALL" so much they were afraid to post again.

Oops, forgot to add: Everytime I see Harry Potter removing his wand from the troll's nostril (in the movie "Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone"), and say, "Yeww! Troll boogies!", I think of the trolls who visit this board. Instead of saying anything else, what a perfect response to each of their posts. "Yeww! Troll boogies!"

I will ignore all his opinions and stupid comments. I won't ignore the fact that he seems to think UCLA doesn't have 7 rings. You'd think a genius from kentucky would know better. I didn't think they hit the methpipe that hard on weeknights.

"The scandal publicly broke early in 1951, when the New York District Attorney’s office indicted CCNY and several other New York colleges for fixing games. Kentucky's involvement in the point-shaving mess was still to be uncovered when the #1 ranked Wildcats arrived in Minneapolis in search of their third NCAA championship in four years. There they met No. 4 Kansas State, champion of the Big Seven. Led by 7-foot junior All-America Bill Spivey and sophomore Cliff Hagan, the Kentucky Cats won, 68-58, and coach Rupp had his third title.

In response to media questions during the tourney, UK coach Adolph Rupp boasted “The gamblers couldn't touch my boys with a 10-foot pole.” The victory celebration didn't last long, however. Shortly after winning the title, the scandal overtook the Cats. Obviously some gambler had found an eleven-foot pole, as five Kentucky players, over three seasons, were implicated.

An Assistant DA said that practically every game Kentucky played in the 1951 season involved gambling. Groza and Beard, stars of the 1948 U.S. Olympic basketball team and now professionals, were thrown out of the NBA. Spivey fought the charges, but never played another game in college, was banned from the NBA, and his dreams of a rich pro career ended.

When handing down the sentences of the Kentucky players, Judge Saul Streit unleashed a blast against the school and Rupp, calling Kentucky “the acme of commercialization and overemphasis.” He further said “I found covert subsidization of players, ruthless exploitation of athletes, cribbing at examinations, ‘illegal’ recruiting, a reckless disregard of the physical welfare, matriculation of unqualified students, demoralization of the athletes by the coach, alumni, and townspeople and the flagrant abuse of the athletic scholarship.” He said that Rupp "failed in his duty to observe the amateur rules, to build character, and to protect the morals and health of his charges." And he especially reprimanded Rupp for his association with Ed Curd, acknowledged as the biggest bookmaker in Lexington."

+1! How many wins should the NCAA (National Communists Against Athletes) vacate from KenFelony? ha ha. Seriously, its a mystery to me why UK is the only school that doesn't get penalized by the NCAA, even they are consistently one of the dirtiest programs in history. Makes no sense to me.

In the 80s, a journalist actually won a Pulitzer prize for reporting on rules violations at Kentucky. These would have been under Joe B. Hall who of course knew "nothing about it." These were the famous "$50 handshakes" given to the players by boosters. Result: no action taken. Bobby Knight is the all time KY hater and considered them to be absolutely corrupt at that time. He competed a lot for recruits.

I think Eddie Sutton got a bit of the backwash of this, but I really don't recall how he came to leave Kentucky.

Ted Owens just couldn't seem to beat them. We had a slightly improved team in Dec 83 under LB, and their Final Four bound team destroyed us at home, worst ever at home then. What I do remember is that after it was obvious that they might lose a few games, they cancelled the series. They squeaked in Jan '85, got beaten in Dec '86 and pounded in Dec '89.

It seemed like a long time before we played them again. I recall the 2001 tournament.

"For the guys that want to be in the one-and-done position, he’s the guy for that. If you want to come to college and leave right after that, he’s the guy." Tyshawn couldn't have said it any better. Oh CaliSleazy

I love T-Rob's quote, "...they are in our way. We'll see 'em in the Garden." Terrence Jones, Anthony Davis, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, Eloy Vargas, and Kyle Wiltjer better be ready to work their asses off on the defensive end trying to stop T-Rob. T-Rob will go off for 25 and 15 with the spot light on him in the Garden.

our bigs have to be more aggressive, get in the paints and try to draw fouls from them.
that's one way to force them to go away.
but, that goes the same for us, too. we can't afford to lose Withey or TRob early on.
i can't wait!!!

I agree. It's one of the many triumphs that college basketball has over it's football counterpart; you get to see good teams play each other from November to April. Plus, win or lose this can only make this team better come conference and tournament time.

Interesting that you bring this up. Just a couple days ago, I was also wondering about some of the regulars on this site and how it's almost become a fraternity of sorts and how someone could easily pass away without is really being aware. I guess that's just the price we pay to enjoy the anonymity of the internet.

I got the impression that Self was playing the dispassionate diplomat. Reading between the lines, I'd say he was thinking just about the opposite of what he said about Cal Lie Pari. No "board fodder" for the opposing team to post on their locker room walls.

He may be unemployed and a loser like you claim, but he isn't on another teams message boards talking smack. Just enjoy your season. No need to come here and try to act cool because your team is good again. Act like you have been there before. Focus on your team and we will focus on ours.

The last time HCBS and Johnny No Ring paced across from each other was in the NC game in '08. Since then, KU beat Memphis twice. Tonight, however, Memphis fans will be pulling for KU and for Johnny No Ring to limp off the court in defeat with his bad hips and foul mouth. And probably, the UMass fans also always pull for whoever his opponent is. He's just not a likeable guy!
(KU 92 - UK 89)

Look out Oedipus Judd is back for a remake of the Voight/Reynolds classic. Waste of time trying to crack your nuts. None to begin with-squat to pi$$. So what if you're the banjo player from Deliverance, don't know, don't care. Like missery smack-down, we could be burning our trash with less effort. Kentucky state penal institutions have residents in the attic with more brains & less lice. Get back in bed with your momma-Ashley...Oedipus Judd-that fits rather well don't you think? Your inbred momma did good Homer, not very cute but charismatic to say the least. Now GTFO.

In the Kentucky version of this clip I heard there is a moment where Cal is greasing his hair back and slipping a 100$ bill to Terrence Jones. Then they cut the clip short because they realized the UK program will be all irrelevant since all the wins will be vacated in 2 years...

My big fat gut tells me KU wins by 6 or UK runs us out of the gym. I hope they are focused and ready. Tyshawn has to step up and be the leader we keep hoping him to be. T-Rob has to be the BEAST he is and stay out of foul trouble!!

This is as tough a test for Kansas as Ive ever seen going into the 3rd game of the season. I hate using metaphors like "catch fire", but that is exactly what Tyshawn Taylor has to do; otherwise, their perimeter play will kill us mercilessly. Look for double-teams on T-Rob, so one of the other big men are going to have to step up and be a presence inside. Connor Teahan could really be huge for us tonight. No matter how you look at it, this game is going to have to be fought tooth and nail (scrambling after loose balls, hustling back in transition, and perimeter defense) if we are going to have a chance. This team IS capable of beating Kentucky tonight, but we have to be in sync as an offense and not play tight.

I am almost ashamed to affiliated with KU with all the nut jobs on here. It's just a basketball game folks. Two good teams with rich traditions on both sides. If someone from another team wants to post on here just let them but this is getting disrespectful. When do the children go to school and some adult post on this site? You all suck!!!

You just created your profile this morning. Now Im no fool, and I can see how a Kentucky fan, on game day with Kansas, would come here under the guise of a Jayhawk fan and chide the posters here. Is this really the level that Kentucky fans stoop to?

probably because it was 2:30 in the morning. they were on campus and struck by oncoming driver. apparently the oncoming driver was drunk. i would guess there are rules against being out @ 2:30 am, especially when they were returning from club where they enjoyed water for refreshment:)

from our prior conversation on the other thread (just thought it may be more convenient to post it for you here) :)

then we agree that Cal has not won anything significant (what he has won has been taken away for cheating).

so if the tourney is your standard, than how is cal not an underacheiver? is jim beoheim a good coach in your mind? who else outside of coach K, wooden, izzo, calhoun consistently brings home titles in march?

my point in showing how he has fared against UK is to show how he has beaten UK with less talented teams (as you point to with your recruiting banter). when it was nuetral, KU won and should have. when it was at rupp, both were top teams and KU won on the road. when it was at allen, UK should have won and got obliterated. that points to a coach who does less with more.

it seems like you would be able to see self's ability to develop his players (again, do less with more). you seem to love the fact that UK has won on prize recruits. yet, KU has enjoyed more success with LESS touted kids. how does that not make sense to you.
how many kids has UK/Cal sent to the NBA that weren't already NBA kids before they got to UK?

KU has taken kids from being middle of the pack recruits and put them in the NBA. How does that not point to a coach cabable of developing his teams/players? When has Cal done that? his kids are NBA ready when he gets em, and then they (surprise) go to the NBA. that is nothing to show he coaches em up.

marcus morris was the 29th best kid in his class (10th best at his position) when he came to KU. markieff was the 49th best (49th!!!!!/17th at his position). they BOTH went in the lottery last year (FAR ABOVE their position rankings would have suggested.

thomas robinson was the 31st best player (10th best at his position). he is projected as a lottery pick and FAR higher than the 10th best big man.

so, you see, KU has taken kids and helped them climb the in the ranks against kids that were said to be better prospects only 3 or 4 years earlier. guys like wall, cousins, orton, bledsoe, jones, lamb, etc. come to UK touted highly and get drafted accordingly. that speaks to them - not to their coach's ability.

if we go back to the origins of our conversation (whiich is long ago... ha), its basis had/has to do with you coming after self. don't mistake me for saying cal is not good at what he does. i don't like him because i believe he is shady. however, he gets talented kids and does win. i don't like that style as i am a college basketball fan and like to see kids come to school, stay and grow as players. in cal's system, it is much like a glorified AAU team. they come, showcase their game and go on to where they were headed anyway. i am very hopeful the new NBA agreement will lead to a more stable college game in which kids are growing to be better players than when they arrived at their respective programs.

my beef with you was when you question self doing less with more. he has done more with less than cal and i haven't been shown otherwise. so, when i ask what has cal won, i am saying that beneath the premise that you are saying self has not won enough. when in fact he has won a conference in 11 of his last 14 years.

anyhow, i do appreciate your dialogue. there should be room for fans to disagree, yet still discuss their views rationally. tonight should be fun... i hope we get a very good game. good luck!!

For the LJW: I'd love to see an addition to the kusports.com page--a box that shows the running total of BB wins for the top 3 (UK, KU, UNC). Let it run through the season and get the fans pumped up even more. Hopefully, we can gain ground on the other blues over the next couple of years (though this season could be a bit tough).

"KU’s single-game record of 150 points came against Kentucky in a 150-95 win over Rick Pitino’s Wildcats on Dec. 9, 1989 in Lawrence."

My wife and I were there, sitting in the backed chairs in the middle of the court on the east side as guests Lawrence business Pur-O-Zone. Man what a game. It was hard to believe when everyone realized that Kentucky was just going to run up and down with the Mighty Kansas Jayhawks and try to beat us that way. It was as loud as it could be in the Phog. The windows were all steamed up. It was freezing outside but t-shirt warm inside! Pitino was as brazen and unlikeable then as he is now. This was truly one of the greatest games ever played at the fieldhouse.

Tonite, in Madison Square Garden, if we play Kansas basketball, we can win the game. No doubt about it. Go Hawks!!!!

Looks like Vegas has KU as 7pt underdogs...not really sure what i expected this early in the season with so much uncertainty and so many unknowns. Any objective thougts on this spread? I personally thought it was a little high...

"Billy Has a Ring vs. Johnny No Rings or Having Been There Is Better Than Not Having Been There"

Johnny No Rings has more draft choices tonight; that much is for sure.

How many of them took their own SATs is open to speculation, as usual with a Johnny No Rings team since what occured in Memphis just after he left Beal Street for Lexington.

What is not open to speculation is that Billy Has a Ring has Johnny No Rings number.

Johnny No Rings choked big time in 2008 against Billy Has a Ring.

In fact, Johnny No Rings choked twice in that NCAA Final.

Choke #1 came down the stretch of regulation, when he let himself be out coached so badly that his team blew a sure lead.

Choke #2 came in the OT, when Johnny No Rings completely lost his composure and so caused his team to lose its composure and get beat in OT.

Ordinarily this might not be such a glaring failure on Johnny No Rings' part, because Bill Self had had quite a bit more head coaching experience, despite their similar ages.

But in this case Johnny No Rings was coaching a team full of ringers--a team that had no business even being on the floor--a team that because certain alumni had broken the rules in fact had quite a bit more talent available than KU had.

Johnny No Rings had the future Number One draft choice, a reputed ringer named Derek Rose. And And another reputed ringer named Cliff Dozier. And there were other reputed ringers, though enough time has passed that I cannot recall their names.

But Johnny No-Rings did not just have ringers. He had some legitimate players too. He had Chris David-Roberts aka CDR, an experienced All American. And he had a gimmick offense called Princeton on Steroids that he had actually gotten from a California high school coach, but elected not to call it by his own name.

Still, Johnny No Rings could win with more ringers, more depth, with a gimmick offense,m and with his alumni cheating his talent to sufficient level to get him to an NCAA Final.

can i add that johnny no rings failed to have his team prepared for the ONE play KU has run for YEARS when it needs a late three. my wife casually watches the games with me and even she knew we were running that dribble handoff to rio. she said, "we're probably going to run that handoff to mario where the post sets the high screen right after the handoff, huh". i said, "yeah, but surely memphis will jump that. EVERYONE knows that is our go to late in the game and we have burned texas with it late in big games that i don't know if memphis will let us run it." i guess i gave cal too much credit. the rest is history

Now tonight Johnny No Rings is back in a marquis game with Billy Has a Ring and he once again has more draft choices and more depth than Billy Has a Ring.

And once again everyone is picking Johnny No Rings to win the game handily and doubting Billy Has a Ring and modestly regarded team. Billy Has a Ring's team is not even in the Top Ten.

And just as it was back on that April night in 2008, tonight there is no evidence of wrong doing except for occasional rumors about investigations of this, or that, possibly illegal UK activity, just as there was no nothing but rumors about this or that illegal Memphis activity (though it turned out later that there was quite a lot of illegal activity, but I digress).

And much of the coaching staff and unofficial consigliores at Memphis are reputedly back again at UK tonight.

And much of the coaching staff and unofficial consigliores that the NCAA said it could not find sufficient evidence to charge with anything back when the group was at Memphis, will be back on the sidelines without sufficient evidence of any wrong doing for the NCAA to charge them with anything.

And just as much of that coaching staff and the unofficial consigliores once said at Memphis that they had nothing to do with any wrong doing at Memphis, they would probably, if they were asked if any wrong doing were occurring at UK, say once again that they would have had nothing to do with it. that said they knew nothing about

So: this is a situation KU fans and Bill Self should be familiar with and to whatever extent possible, comfortable with.

It is how it is in big time college basketball.

Some great programs are coached by head coaches that have not left a trail of forfeits in their wakes at prior jobs.

Some great programs are coached by head coaches that have left a trail of forfeits in their wakes at prior jobs.

And the talking heads, though they will likely mention the prior meeting of Billy Has a Ring with Johnny No Rings, they will also likely not comment on the ringers and forfeits Johnny No Rings said he had nothing to do with, nor the absence of ringers and forfeits that Billy Has a Ring has never had to deny.

And that is as it should be I suppose, since most knowledgeable persons point out that college basketball is a business.

A large percentage of UK's players leave after a year, or two. And since UK does not tout that a large percentage of these early departures come back and get their degrees, one tends to guess that UK's players are there mostly not to go to school.

KU too has had a few OADs, but not nearly so many, as any UK lurker will likely boast.

Johnny No Rings has after all pioneered and been a leading apologist for using college basketball as a one year college launch pad for the NBA. He has brought an AAU approach to college basketball. Get the best he can get. Let'em play. Rely on what they can already do before they get there to be the bulk of what they do while there. Teach the gimmick offense. it has, when he has not been victimized by forfeits (I say victimized, because he says clearly that he has done nothing wrong to trigger the forfeits), been very successful in winning games, though it has produced no rings...hence the nickname Johnny No Rings.

All of which prompts a question probably even to a casual observer.

Why hasn't Johnny No Rings beaten Billy Has a Ring?

Why does anyone even give Billy Has a Ring and his "right way" Jayhawks even a smidgeon of a chance against "AAU way" UK in Madison Square Garden tonight?

Why?

I have one hunch.

Billy Has a Ring once played Division 1 college basketball.

Billy Has a Ring has that tremendous competitiveness and will to excel that true jocks have coursing through them. Billy Has a Ring has broad shoulders and strong neck. He's got the body of a jock. He is a stud.

But Billy Has a Ring also has an off the charts basketball IQ, too. He has a stellar intellect for the game. He has won at Oral Roberts; that by definition means he has a ton on the ball. He has gone to the Final Eight at Tulsa of all places; that by definition means he has a ton on the ball. And he has gone to Elite Eights and Final Fours at Illinois and Kansas. And he has won the whole thing at Kansas.

Billy Has a Ring has moxie and a gambling streak in him.

Johnny No Rings has a large basketball intellect, too, and moxie and a gambling streak in him, too. It took moxie and a gambling streak to develop his AAU approach to D1.

But Johnny No Rings lacks something, doesn't he?

Johnny No Rings was never really a Division 1 college basketball player.

There's nothing intrinsically wrong with that.Quite a few good coaches overcome having never played the game at a high level.

And when Billy Has a Ring walks down the sideline toward mid court before during and after the game, Billy Has a Ring has that edge each time he looks into Johnny No Rings eyes.

When their eyes lock, both men know they are each excellent basketball coaches, each smart guys, each clever fellows, each trained under one of the wiliest of all time in LB.

But only one of them looks into the other's eyes and says, "I've played on these floors. I've played under the bright lights. I've played hurt against great ones. I've played against some of the great ones of my time.

The one that has really been there is Billy Has a Ring.

The one that wishes he had been is Johnny No Rings.

This sort of intangible matters at crucial moments, like dealing with adversity and stair downs and referee baiting, and knowing just how ferocious you have to be.

John Wooden knew he was flat out more ferociously competitive than almost all of the coaches he faced. John Wooden knew he was an All American and the Indiana Rubber Man. When his great mind flowered fully as a coach, the reservoir of confidence and competitive greatness that came from having been a great, great college basketball player compounded his brilliance.

Few great players have what it takes to become a good coach. But the few that do tend to become great coaches.

The world is full of marginal players that work themselves into being great coaches. Rupp. Smith. Knight, and Williams. Maybe even John Calipari someday.

But there is one other class of great coaches. They are the guys that were solid D1 players, not marginal ones, and not all time greats. Larry Brown fits this category. So does Billy Has a Ring. Johhny No Rings does not fit this category either.

Johnny No Rings has to do it all on moxie and cleverness. Its no knock on him. Everyone has to make the best of what they have.

But if you have a great coach who was a great player you have an incredible combination, and a solid player, also brings an edge.

Billy Has a Ring was no one's All American at Okie State. But he was a starting glue two at a D1 program. He played on the same floor, and stayed on the same floor with some great players. And he did it with less talent than they had.

Bill Has a Ring can never have the bottomless reservoir of swagger and competitive greatness that John Wooden had.

But Johnny No Rings can never have the substantial reservoir of swagger and competitive greatness that Billy Has a Ring has.

And its always better to bring a gun to a knife fight than the other way around.

It had been quite some time since I had read about what I referred to as reputed ringers on Memphis and after I posted, I decided to go back and refresh my memory a bit just in case my memory was faulty. It appears at least that my memory may have recalled things with oversimplification.

A glance at Wikipedia's page (a handy but certainly not definitively reliable source) on John Calipari indicates there may be some complexities about whether Derek Rose was a ringer because of SAT related improprieties, or because his brother reputedly travelled for free with the team for a time, or some variation of those things. I wish to apologize for any inaccuracy about Derek Rose's SAT issues, if I have in fact inaccurately portrayed them, and say only that it appears that some improprieties related to Derek Rose lead in part to the NCAA's decision that Memphis would have to forfeit its games.

Further, I errantly referred to Robert Dozier as Cliff Dozier. My apologies to both Mr. Doziers. Apparently there were some reputed improprieties regarding Robert Doziers' SAT scores, according to the web site I looked at.

And last, or so I hope, I note that I completely overlooked a reputed Associated Press story around October 7, 2011, in which it was reputed that John Calipari and Derek Rose reached a May 28, 2010 out of court settlement with attorneys representing Memphis fans. It was reputed that Calipari and Rose paid something like $100K in part, one infers to avoid litigation, for whatever reason. And Calipari and Memphis AD R.C. Johnson also reputedly reached some kind of agreement themselves to pay a separate $100K for Final Four bonuses.

As nearly as I can tell, the games forfeited (or vacated, whatever the correct legalese is) by Memphis played during Calipari's coaching tenure, remain forfeited.

And as nearly as I can tell in my cursory reading, the NCAA did not find sufficient evidence to charge John Calipari with any of the infractions that reputedly occurred at Memphis, as I indicated in my 4-part post.

Finally, all of the above 4-part post that this erratum statement refers to is opining and speculation by a fan.

No malice was intended in any case.

Just looking forward to a high profile game and opining on some apparent, possible parallels between this game and the 2008 NCAA championship game between KU and Memphis.

And the jaybate strikes again lol.
In response to the comment earlier, when it comes to KU basketball, there is no such thing as "just a basketball game". And to all the posters getting mad at the KU fans for defending not just our team, but our way of life, deal with it. If someone came into your home and started calling your wife fat and ugly, you would respond in similar if not more aggressive ways than most of us on here have. We are not just fans. KU is a marriage. And we are loyal as such. The team is our family. F.O.E. remember?

Source: Lawrence Journal World, March 02, 1984
Headline: Manning isn't only Kansas basketball signee looking good.
Partial copied from the article:
Do you remember Tyrone Jones? How about Altonio Campbell? And Milton Newton? Along with Lawrence High's Danny Manning, those three high school basketball players signed national scholarship agreements with Kansas University back in November.
Jones is also receiving plenty of coaching in his classroom work, too. In fact, first-year coach Westmore has set up a mandatory tutorial program for his players. Jones, who flubbed his freshman and sophomore years, made an academic comeback last year and is going down to the wire this year in a race to qualify for an NCAA scholarship. "At this point," said Westmore, "he's moving in that direction, but he's hot there yet. He's gotta make A's and B's from this point on. But he's worked hard and the tutoring has helped." Kansas aide John Calipari, who did the groundwork in Jones' recruitment, marvels at how hard the young athlete has worked.

“What if …” What if Calipari had not left Coach Brown’s staff …. and what if KU had offered the head coaching position to Calipari instead of Roy.

I know the Alumni Ass'n is sponsoring a watch party at The Parlor in Hollywood, but I also heard that a group of KU folks collect at Big Wangs in Hollywood right over by where last years alumni watch sight, Capitol City used to be. Any validity to that?

Source: Lawrence Journal World, January 14, 1985
Headline: KU jayvees to resume without leading scorers.
Partial copied from the article:
Kansas' junior varsity basketball team will be without its top two scorers when it resumes competition this week following the semester break. Coach John Calipari's team, 3-2, will play at Hutchinson Junior College on Tuesday night without forward Marvin Mattox and guard Milt Garner, both freshmen.
Although it was reported in Sunday's Journal-World that Mattox and Garner are academically ineligible, Calipari said that wasn't the case. "They're not ineligible," Calipari pointed out. "Coach (Mike) Gottfried just wants them to concentrate on academics the second semester."

“What if …” What if Calipari had not left Coach Brown’s staff…. and what if KU had offered the head coaching position to Calipari instead of Roy.

We're better. We have more experience. We have a more cohesive team. We have a better coach. We have a better system. We don't have freshmen starters playing on a big stage for the first time. We're fast. We have the best player on the floor. We are better defensively. We have less pressure as we aren't favored.

I've heard some people say that Self needs to slow the game down tonight. I think a lower scoring game gives us an advantage. If you put our starting five against theirs we have an advantage with a more experienced back court. Our depth is questionable, theirs is solid. So to take advantage of that you have to slow the tempo down, take care of the ball and really guard which is tough against a really athletic team. You have to pick your poison.

I hope Bill tries to run with them like Larry Brown did against OU in '88. Everybody will say he's nuts just like they did Larry. It's playing right into Calimari's hands, but I think he should open up the bench and throw them young-uns right into the fire and find out what he's really got. That second unit looked as good or better than the 1st against albeit a really bad team the other night.

Plus, Self's really got nothing to lose, which doesn't happen very often. KU's not gonna be favored to win for a change. So if he tries to run with them, we might get run right out of the building but they'll all say Kentucky was supposed to win anyway. But there are a lot of athletes on our bench too, just not tested ones.

I really like Nadir Tharpe... A LOT. He gives us a true point guard which will allow Taylor to come off more screens and look to penetrate and will let Elijah concentrate on scoring and not handling the ball all the time. I think Elijah is gonna emerge as a true star this year and needs to have a good game for the 'Hawks to win tonight. All I want Taylor to do is not eff up too much. He drives me crazy. Young and Wesley need to focus on defense and rebounding. We got out rebounded by Towson the other night... not good.

Despite all the detractors we have every reason to believe we can win this game... Three keys... 1) Stay out of foul trouble... 2) Out rebound them - we can't win if they beat us on the boards and get 2nd chance points... 3) The bench has to play well.

Also, if Connor can get open shots he could be huge. Dude knows he's gonna play and that he's got a green light to fire away. He's 17 or 18 for 21 from three so far including exhibitions.

Recruiting will not be enough much longer for the Squid. As grad % rates go up, Cal goes down, if not before, while vacating the w's from kuntucky record books. I can't think of another individual coaching anywhere that I despise more. Biggest liar & poorest coach out there. Dummying up grades & entrance exams, paying players & AAU shoe whores & pimps, yeah & no friggin' rings with all the solid gold recruiting classes. What an extremely sorry coach-still can't figure out when to foul & when not to. This scum is a joke. Was literally run out of the NBA & no one will take him back. He & Bruce Pearl should do a duet on the radio. Next time he cuts & runs from a college team he should get the death penalty for coaching. Oughta have it now.

+1 You and I agree wholeheartedly about Cal Lie Pari and his sleazy methods. However, I'm surprised the LJW didn't censor your post. Unfortunately, these days the airing of unsubstantiated finger pointing through the public airwaves/newspapers often leads to lawsuits. I'm not an attorney, but perhaps, adding the statement as Jaybate often does, "No malice intended." would be advisable.

would have been a nice night to have the Twins, Reed and Brady, heck Brandon as long as I'm winding back the clock.
We don't, so it is a learning experience, how thin are we, plenty thin and it gets exposed this evening.
A great teaching event for HCBS.

I think Jaybate must be like that "Most interesting man in the world" from those Dos Equis commercials......."When he's in Rome.....the Romans do as he does"......He lives vicariously through himself"......."When you look up 'trend-setter' in the dictionary-his picture is there"

Bulletin: Capel's assistant takes the fall. OU forfeits its few wins. Punished for Tiny Gallon being ruled ineligible. OU gets three years probation with 30 day reduction in recruiting season. Otherwise zip. Capel didn't do a thing.

Isn't it amazing how the assistant coaches and alumni always break the rules, but the head coaches don't.

I guess colleges just need to stop hiring assistant coaches and end alumni status and all the infractions will stop.

Right?

I wonder what kind of odds the ESPN/CBS/Gambling Industrial Complex would set on a head coach being found to have committed, or ordered, the infractions? 1000:1?

Bad, bad, bad, bad, bad, bad, bad, bad assistant coaches.

Good, good, good, good, good, good head coaches.

Assistant coaches bad.

Head coaches good.

Remember this.

Call it the Assistant Coach Is Always Bad Heuristic.

Bet on it.

Isn't it about time an award is given for the best fall taken by an assistant coach each season? Maybe call it the Lee Harvey Oswald Cut Out Award? Or maybe The Crazed Lone Assistant Coach Award?

If you wonder why a lot of guys don't come to Kansas, I think we have our answer. Watch Self railing on the guys in practice in this clip with Jay Bilas. This would be very tough to take day after day. It makes me love our guys even more. 84% does not come by going through the motions. Geez, how can a guy who is so smiley and nice have that shattering of a tone of voice in a practice? This is like watchingKnight without the neck chokes and uniform grabbing and chair throwing. John Wooden had this kind of intensity and rapier like tone. No wonder each year, one or two guys walk around looking like they are being dismantled nerve by nerve. They are. Bill Self is really tough and demanding. Holy cow! I knew he was, but until you "hear" it you can't believe it. This guy has a needle six feet long!!!! And this was for public consumption.

Looks like we're stuck with listening to Vitale slobber all over Calisleazy and Kenstinky. Wish I was in range of a Jhawk network radio station so I could turn down the tv sound. Oh well, needed an excuse to get a new flat screen and any heavy object within arm's reach will silence Vitale and send me to Best Buy tomorrow for a new tv.

They gave it their best shot for this early in the year. But, they got out played in the second half. Oh well, good game anyway. It'll help this team work on their weaknesses for conference play and an 8th straight conf champ!

For all the fans stranded overseas dying to watch the game, I just found the Duke vs. Michigan State game on veetle (add your own dot com). Go to Sports category and look for ESPN HD. Oh, I am soooo happy! Hopefully this channel will stay open for the next 3 hours. If you are stuck at work (it is 10:30 am here), there's a free veetle app for Android in the market so you can watch on your phone. It'll be the first KU game I get to watch this season.

I also want to thank all the frequent posters on this board. Your comments help quench my thirst when I can't watch the games.

For the last month, I have sat back and said nothing about the young punks who have trashed and mindlessly blasted anyone who dared question our level of recruiting. As a twice-graduated KU grad, I resent the tone of supposed KU fans who attack people who care about this program and receive nothing but garbage for pointing out the obvious--our recruiting has sucked for two years--and tonight's game is exhibit A--B through Z will be forthcoming.

Just because someone dares imply that "we should be doing better than we are doing on the recruiting front," which is, duh, only stating the more than obvious, doesn't give you the right to trash someone who is probably both more knowledgeable and cares more about their alma mater than you do. Our recruiting was clearly exposed tonight. If you don't agree, then you don't care as much about MY school as I do. Find another bandwagon to jump on, and, please let the REAL fans support our school--no matter what.

It's been Perry since Thomas and Elijah--and they're great, but this isn't good. In between, well, we need a bench because that's what we've recruited. Maybe a starter or two will emerge, maybe not.

However, attacking seriously loyal fans for disloyalty by questionning the obvious, that our recruiting effort has sucked of late smacks of a lack of academic standards--not in the players, but in the students, the fans.