Sam Swicegood was attacked on December 17th by a group of five teens and he defended himself with a part of a tent pole that was in his car.

The Deliverator never pulled that gun in anger, or in fear. He pulled it once in Gila Highlands. Some punks in Gila Highlands, a fancy Burbclave, wanted themselves a delivery, and they didn't want to pay for it. Thought they would impress the Deliverator with a baseball bat. The Deliverator took out his gun, centered its laser doohickey on that poised Louisville Slugger, fired it. The recoil was immense, as though the weapon had blown up in his hand. The middle third of the baseball bat turned into a column of burning sawdust accelerating in all directions like a bursting star. Punk ended up holding this bat handle with milky smoke pouring out the end. Stupid look on his face. Didn't get nothing but trouble from the Deliverator.

Since then the Deliverator has kept the gun in the glove compartment and relied, instead, on a part of a tent pole, which had always been his weapon of choice anyhow. The punks in Gila Highlands weren't afraid of the gun, so the Deliverator was forced to use it. But partially assembled tents need no demonstrations.

AFTER tax and fuel, some drivers can make 700 to 850 a week take home./been there..done that

Depends on the area. I used to do pizza delivery in an faux upper-middle class area, where everyone thought they were rich and acted like they were rich, but didn't really have the money for it. Sort of a "keeping up with the Jones" kind of suburban area. They were the worst tippers I've ever seen. I would usually make out with about $30-40 on a good Friday or Saturday night. Once I transferred to another store in a lower-middle class area, my tip earnings skyrocketed.

Probably coordinating deliveries (grouping orders for delivery by neighborhood, 4 pizzas per driver at a time) and handling the drivers' cash register (they have a separate register in the back for the delivery cash-handling). The "demotion" part is that you're not out there getting tips -- but you're also not out there burning up your own gas and oil -- or attacked by punks.

Recoil Therapy said it best in the 2nd post. Drivers are not supposed to fight back because it's cheaper for Pizza Hut to replace a dead driver than it is to deal with a lawsuit from a litigious punk who gets "traumatized" when a driver fights back.

/Delivered for the Hut briefly back in the early 90s. Had a damn good manager, though.

Recoil Therapy:The managers just want him to hand over the money & not do anything but hope that the thugs don't hurt him. If he were to hurt one of them then they (the robbers) might sue Pizza Hut because of emotional distress or some such nonsense. If he (the driver) were to get hurt himself, well worker's comp may go up a bit but he'd be easy to replace.

Not exactly. The whole notion of "Don't Be a Hero" is because big chains don't care (or file claims for such things as one store getting a register knocked over) and big and small stores alike are in no mood to get hit for a potential death claim on their work comp policies. Small companies don't want a hit to their experience mod and big businesses usually keep deductibles high enough that they'll be on the hook for the brunt of the claim.

When I delivered for Hungry Howie's, damn right use drivers all carried knives, and I even had a can of mace on me. We all knew it against the rules, but the managers were okay with it, especially since we had to deliver to a couple of urban demographic areas.

/closest I got to macing was a drunk male prostitute who wouldn't let me leave until I gave him my number//I'm a dude

Or am I missing something?Yes, this wasn't about defending himself, it was about having a weapon.

Actually, you're wrong. It wasn't a weapon per se, it was an improvised weapon. Basically it sounds like he was surrounded by a group of thugs and so he grabbed the biggest piece of flotsam he had within arm's reach in his car and used it to defend himself in the face of overwhelming numbers (five dudes).

It's a dumb rule to begin with, insisting that their drivers who carry cash and can be summoned to any location within minutes via a simple phone call, be helpless and unable to defend themselves. But if that rule is stretched to mean that they cannot defend themselves at ALL, even in the face of five dudes when they picked something up they essentially find on the ground, then it seems like it's nothing but pure greedy madness. A dubious attempt to shield the parent company from liability while actively putting lives at risk. Pizza drivers do get killed or seriously assaulted on a more regular basis then we'd like to think.

Pizza Hut was actually my first job when I was a kid, and when I got old enough to do deliveries I moved up to driver. All of us drivers were armed to the hilt. In the town I worked some delivery drivers had been beaten and robbed, and one guy was murdered, within recent memory. We all needed jobs, everyone had to eat and jobs in that part of Florida weren't exactly in overabundance, but none of us wanted to die for $50 and a pizza. When you un-arm yourself - or force someone else to be unarmed - you are putting that person's life in the hands of their attacker. You are asking the attacker to make the decision about what happens to the victim - does he die or live? Arming yourself helps to ensure that the decision of whether or not you'll ever see your family again remains in your own hands. Disarming someone you know has a decent chance of being put in a dangerous situation with an attacker is a deeply immoral act, IMHO.

cherryl taggart:spawn73: JasonGriffee: So, what did the managers want him to do? Or am I missing something?

They wanted him to not carry weapons in the car. That he defended himself wasn't the problem, it was the weapon he brought with him for that purpose.

(I assume the only legit reason to carry a half tentpole in a Pizzahut car is as a weapon, although it sounds like a sucky weapon).

The backseat of my car is the repository of all things kid-related. If my kid was super active in scouting, I would probably be able to find most of the parts of a tent back there. And if, I drive up to an intersection and an incident of attempted thuggery were to occur, I most definitely would be able to improvise a weapon out of the debris in my car. And my standard response to any question is "I panicked, because I was in fear of my life. I didn't know that a (insert noun here) could do that much damage to a person."

I'm not from USA, so not too familiar with Pizza Hut.

I thought they drove around in a Pizza Hut car? If it's their own car, then yes it seems plausible that there's a lot of stuff there that could be used as a weapon, even though it wasn't why it was placed there.

That explanation sounds plausible, because if you're going to drive around with a weapon, you would probably do better than a tentpole.

<b><a href="http://www.fark.com/comments/7509593/81573631#c81573631" target="_blank">tenpoundsofcheese</a>:</b> <i>No subby, he was demoted for carrying a weapon.</i>

I'm betting it was the fact that he fought back, and the "you were carrying a weapon" sounds better than having a company-wide policy of not defending yourself no matter what. When it comes down to it, anything is a weapon. Take off your belt. Now strangle somebody with it. Or drop a can of Coke in your sock and beat somebody viciously with it. Roll up a newspaper and slam the end of it into somebody's temple. I bet this guy was employee roadkill the minute he didn't capitulate.

Probably coordinating deliveries (grouping orders for delivery by neighborhood, 4 pizzas per driver at a time) and handling the drivers' cash register (they have a separate register in the back for the delivery cash-handling). The "demotion" part is that you're not out there getting tips -- but you're also not out there burning up your own gas and oil -- or attacked by punks.

Recoil Therapy said it best in the 2nd post. Drivers are not supposed to fight back because it's cheaper for Pizza Hut to replace a dead driver than it is to deal with a lawsuit from a litigious punk who gets "traumatized" when a driver fights back.

/Delivered for the Hut briefly back in the early 90s. Had a damn good manager, though.

He said it, but it was stupid.

People end up dead if they start a fight, especially if it's with a tent pole.

People usually don't end up dead if they just comply with the people robbing them.

Maybe the big mistake was reporting it. "Hey boss, I went to 2311 Mugging Drive and there were some guys fighting so I got out of there." No need to mention to the boss or cops that you were one of them.

Jake Havechek:I was a pizza guy for 3 years. Rich people and teenagers are the worst tippers.

I was a mover for 3 years, and I can attest to this. Ironically, the rich are terrible tippers. Half the time, they don't even say "Thank you." The poor don't tip either, but it's hard to blame them. Middle-class folk are the best and most consistent tippers.

/Teenagers don't hire movers ... all their shiat in the world fits in the passenger seat.

Pizza Hut is messed up with their delivery rules. Basically, you need more than 20 dollars on you when you make deliveries in some cases....but if you get robbed and had more than 20 bucks on you, you can get fired because drivers aren't supposed to have more than 20 bucks on them.

I remember there was one place we delivered where a there had been 2 or 3 robberies AND then driver got stabbed (we had the inner city route). PH decided not to drop that location despite no tips/always dangerous but allowed the driver who got stabbed to always skip those so someone else had to take it.

Corporate assets are not worth my life, even if they're valuable. I read a post here years ago that said "If a fire breaks out in the data center where I work, I'm supposed to activate a Halon fire suppression system that will save the equipment and kill me. fark that." Yep.

Actually, when you think about it, when was the last time you heard of anyone getting demoted in anything? Even in the military, on the rare occasions it happens, it's really just shorthand for "please accept this greatly reduced pay while we do the paperwork on throwing your loser/criminal ass out of the Army."

Work in general would probably be a lot more fulfilling if it were possible to try and fail at the next job up the ladder, or screw up without worrying about the only button on your boss's console being the big red one marked "FIRE." Oh well.

spawn73:cherryl taggart: spawn73: JasonGriffee: So, what did the managers want him to do? Or am I missing something?

They wanted him to not carry weapons in the car. That he defended himself wasn't the problem, it was the weapon he brought with him for that purpose.

(I assume the only legit reason to carry a half tentpole in a Pizzahut car is as a weapon, although it sounds like a sucky weapon).

The backseat of my car is the repository of all things kid-related. If my kid was super active in scouting, I would probably be able to find most of the parts of a tent back there. And if, I drive up to an intersection and an incident of attempted thuggery were to occur, I most definitely would be able to improvise a weapon out of the debris in my car. And my standard response to any question is "I panicked, because I was in fear of my life. I didn't know that a (insert noun here) could do that much damage to a person."

I'm not from USA, so not too familiar with Pizza Hut.

I thought they drove around in a Pizza Hut car? If it's their own car, then yes it seems plausible that there's a lot of stuff there that could be used as a weapon, even though it wasn't why it was placed there.

That explanation sounds plausible, because if you're going to drive around with a weapon, you would probably do better than a tentpole.

They make you drive your own car and just slap a Pizza Hut sign on top. You have to provide your own gas, insurance, and maintenance. They used to give drivers one dollar per delivery to offset the cost (lol) and then you keep your meager tips and get min wage hourly pay.

I thought they drove around in a Pizza Hut car? If it's their own car, then yes it seems plausible that there's a lot of stuff there that could be used as a weapon, even though it wasn't why it was placed there.

Drivers here (Pizza Hut and everyone else) use their own cars, usually with a sign on top.Both places I've driven for in the long distant past (one small shop and one slightly larger regional) , I used my own vehicle.

Pizza delivery lives off parental car insurance rates. If a driver had to insure his car as a 'commercial vehicle', no one could afford it on what they make.

"Didn't get nothing but trouble from The Swincegood"[farm9.staticflickr.com image 430x350]

Oh come on. Uncle Enzo would never fire a Deliverator for roughing up a couple of punks with a stick. Wouldn't even cross his neurons...

We weren't talking about the relevance of the reference in some hypothetical situation. Your complaint was a lack of Snow Crash references. Someone pointed out that you overlooked one.

Whether or not it was a perfectly contextual reference was never the issue.

However, it occurs to me that if you are indicating that you did not miss the reference, but simply dismissed it as being inadequate, that perhaps you're really attempting to cover for having actually missed the reference.

Jake Havechek:I was a pizza guy for 3 years. Rich people and teenagers are the worst tippers.

Plus the jerks who send their farking 5 year old to pay you so you have to count out the change to the last penny and give it to the little shiat.

I used to have my niece pay when she was living with us as a wee kiddo, but I'd hand her the cash and tell her what change to ask for. Our local delivery guy thought she was hilarious when she'd say "keep the change!" in that proud little kid way. Probably helped that I also stood there with her. I was teaching her, not using her as an errand runner.

mongbiohazard:Pizza drivers do get killed or seriously assaulted on a more regular basis then we'd like to think.

To be fair, they also get tips in the form of oral sex from attractive mature women who answer the door in a negligee more often than we think. Or so many a Fark thread would have me believe. I tried asking the kid who delivered MY pizza about it a few times, but now they have my number blocked for some reason.