Been putting aptosid through it's paces for the last couple of months or so. Used to be a big fan of sidux as well.

My question/suggestion/request;

Are there any plans for a 'Core/Base/Minimal' version of aptosid? One that installs all the standard apps, utilities and aptosid-specific scripts/tweaks/apps/kernel, but doesn't install a desktop environment or GDM/KDM.

Reason I'm asking is;
I love Xfce, but when it comes to my netbook and older (read: very old) systems, I refer something lighter like ScrotWM, Musca, DWM or a spartan Openbox install. For the recent aptosid install, I started with the Xfce version and stripped all Xfce-related stuff (except for xfce4-power-manager) and some gui apps before I installed my tiling WM of choice. It would be much easier (and also much less chance of leaving cruft behind) if there was a version that only installed the base system and Xorg.

Yes, I know you'll suggest I do a Debian netinstall, add aptosid sources, and pick and choose what I want to install (or install ArchLinux or Free-BSD) . I already do that with some of my other systems (if it's to be Debian-based, I usually start with the the excellent GRML distro) but I like most of what aptosid offers (in it's Xfce version, at least ... dunno about KDE) with regards to the kernel, scripts, Ceni, dmakms, etc, and a 'Core/Base'version would save me a lot of time sorting what I need for different hardware.

If there already is a way to get the installer to install a base system without a desktop environment (or X), could someone let me know? I don't remember seeing that option the last time I did an aptosid install.

We are working on a very lite aptosid-LXDE version which will most likely match the needs of all users of older hardware, but also of purists and people who want to give most ressources to their applications instead of giving them to the desktop enviromment/manager.
Greetings,
Chris

We are working on a very lite aptosid-LXDE version which will most likely match the needs of all users of older hardware, but also of purists and people who want to give most ressources to their applications instead of giving them to the desktop enviromment/manager.
Greetings,
Chris

Think about going one step futher, aptosid-CLI. This could be a very small rescue disk / base installer with no wm and just the bare minimum of daemons. Include scripts to do an install and pick a wm/environment from there, and leave an option for CLI only. There is no need for anything other than CLI on an aptosid router, print server or media server. Personally I always do a lite install and purge/remove a lot of programs, then install the ones I want to use. Even with this method I'm sure I have unused lib files lurking on my machines.

@slam
I agree with the last post by @browe.
Personally, I'm not a fan of LXDE and don't think it'll be that much lighter then the Xfce variant. Standalone OpenBox > LXDE. The only useful part of the LXDE "suite" I would use in a standalone OpenBox session would be LXappearance. PCmanFM isn't as stable as Thunar in my experience (though that was probably an earlier version I used), and the LXpanel has got to be the fugliest panel in existence (give me bmpanel or tint2 anytime).
Still, much thanks for taking the time and effort to go lighter, even if it's only marginal.
Despite my reservations, I'll definitely give the LXDE offering a shot once released.
Thank you.

@browe
+1 to everything you stated.
aptosid-CLI would be a great offering. Sort of like a GRML, but with aptosid scripts/apps and SLH kernels.
I share your experience of finding unrequired libs remaining even after an apt-get autoremove. If I recall correctly, a netinstall of the standard Debian Squeeze iso (32 bit) with Ratpoison or ScrotWM added after only uses around 30+MB once up and running on a regular Pentium Dual Core desktop, a bit more on my netbook with acpi, bluetooth, irqbalance...etc included. It would be great if you could get something similar from an aptosid install.

In our internal build tests we already do use variants of aptosid "cli-only", there is also a cli-installer, and some of us do build their own (mostly server related) costumized isos already. However, stuff needs to be supportable and maintained, otherwise creating official supported releases out of all that does not make sense at all. Please also understand that our main focus is to make sid stable as a rolling release, and not spread even more flavours of snapshots from sid, because they are already outdated when released.

You see the problem?
Once you go really light, it's no longer possible to provide a "generic" solution that suits "everyone".

A light LXDE is likely the smallest we might go, if there is enough developer momentum behind it, as it is possible to come up with a functionally "complete" desktop environment covering all "usual" tasks for LXDE.

Regarding requests for "cli-only" or "just X" ISOs, it's safe to assume that we will "never" release anything like that. Aptosid is not the right tool for everything - and for heavily customized stuff you need a package based approach (d-i/ g-i).

I know it is a waste during installation, but how about just purging KDE after installation and just use fluxbox, which comes with, at least, the KDE version. Fluxbox is very light weight and works well.

And, although I am not that interested in that, I was wondering why the preference for LXDE over fluxbox. It seems that since fluxbox already comes with aptosid, it would be easier to make a light weight version with it...

I can appreciate the folks who are all about 'light, fast, moar, moar!' but given limited resources, I am casting a vote for what we have now, which is pretty hard to beat. Thanks again to the aptosid team.

I can appreciate the folks who are all about 'light, fast, moar, moar!' but given limited resources, I am casting a vote for what we have now, which is pretty hard to beat. Thanks again to the aptosid team.

Full ACK!

_________________i don't have hard drives. i just keep 30 chinese teenagers in my basement and force them to memorize numbers (bash.org)