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I couldn't bring myself to discuss this until the emotions settled down. I only wanted to deal with the grief of this situation before I made impulsive decisions and comments.

Intelligent debate and solutions requires compromise. I've watched all sides posting their views and I wanted to witness what they were really saying without injecting my feelings.

And OVERWHELMING majority of everyone I know wants reforms. When I hear people associated with our club say it's needed, I'm pretty sure it is. I'm reading all my gun toting kin talk about the need. I personally don't know one person who has an assault rifle or wants one.

Wolfie

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Complacency is the enemy. Challenge yourself daily for maximum return on investment.

Yeah, well -- stats are funny aren't they -- you can always find something to help make a point. Recently the local Richmond rag has gone on and on about how there has been an INCREASE in gun sales in VA during the last few years, yet violent crime has DECREASED in the same time period. All during bad economic times when crime generally goes up. They are using this to show how gun control advocates are WRONG -- more guns don't equal more violence.So........... have at it - but consider -- PERHAPS, just PERHAPS - pulling out a gun avoided an assault from happening -- this would not play into your stat. (No -- I don't own a gun - though I am/was an Expert marksman in the Army)

I would welcome any solution that addressed the issue of gun violence including giving up my guns . I think the tendency to blame law abiding citizens who hunt or own guns as being part of the problem is misguided . People that don't hunt that choose to own guns are not the problem but rather a symptom of the problem .

Recently the local Richmond rag has gone on and on about how there has been an INCREASE in gun sales in VA during the last few years, yet violent crime has DECREASED in the same time period.

How many of those guns are bought and then travel up I-95 to kill people in the Northeast where there are stricter gun laws? A lot. Mayor Bloomberg & Nutter complain all of the time about Virginia's looseygoosey gun sale laws.

I'll trust a study by an Ivy League peer reviewed study before the Richmond Times-Dispatch any day of the week (or quasi-analysis from some random person on the internet).

I think the tendency to blame law abiding citizens who hunt or own guns as being part of the problem is misguided

Well, I'm not sure how misguided that is. As far as I know, Lanza was a law abiding citizen until Thursday.

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"I have tried hard--but life is difficult, and I am a very useless person. I can hardly be said to have an independent existence. I was just a screw or a cog in the great machine I called life, and when I dropped out of it I found I was of no use anywhere else."

So how many guns do you have wolfie? Do you sit at the kitchen table in your soiled underwear cleaning them like Wumpy?

Not sure what this has to do with the topic of gun violence? Perhaps having a father who was a deputy and a veteran of the Korean Conflict instilled a different mindset about weapons and the need for protection?

But I will answer your question, I have 2 guns. My 410 was a birthday gift from my dad on my 13th birthday. And I have only had to pull it one time. About 15 years ago, someone kicked in our front door. I'm guessing he thought no one was home. Thankfully, I was in the bedroom when I heard the commotion and met the guy in the hallway. Cocked and pointed, and definitely prepared to use it. And yes, I'd have no problem using it to protect myself and my loved ones.

Wolfie

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Complacency is the enemy. Challenge yourself daily for maximum return on investment.

Now, how is that Miss P has (probably) lived in much more dangerous localities than the rest of you for the past 25 years (read: inner city -- Brooklyn, Philly and (not the suburbs) downtown Richmond, nor in any upscale areas of these three cities) and never felt the need to "protect myself"? Yet you folks out in the sticks seem to think that there are roving bands of criminals around every thistle thicket?

Being non-American, this is a very bizarre debate to observe. The right to bear arms is supposed to be for protection - but that didn't help Nancy Lanza shot with her own gun. Apparently she had a legally purchased AR-15-type rifle, that's a semi-automatic designed for the US Army. Why on earth would anyone need one of them?

It's up to America of course, but I wish the gun control lobby all the best in their endeavours.

Now, how is that Miss P has (probably) lived in much more dangerous localities than the rest of you for the past 25 years (read: inner city -- Brooklyn, Philly and (not the suburbs) downtown Richmond, nor in any upscale areas of these three cities) and never felt the need to "protect myself"? Yet you folks out in the sticks seem to think that there are roving bands of criminals around every thistle thicket?

Those of us that live in the "sticks" don't have 100 police officers 5 minutes away.

Now, how is that Miss P has (probably) lived in much more dangerous localities than the rest of you for the past 25 years (read: inner city -- Brooklyn, Philly and (not the suburbs) downtown Richmond, nor in any upscale areas of these three cities) and never felt the need to "protect myself"? Yet you folks out in the sticks seem to think that there are roving bands of criminals around every thistle thicket?

Exactly. I find such logic to be, erm, interesting.

Speaking of gun violence and "protecting oneself", did you read about the man (in Florida, of course) who shot and killed yet another teenager because he felt "threatened"?

"I have tried hard--but life is difficult, and I am a very useless person. I can hardly be said to have an independent existence. I was just a screw or a cog in the great machine I called life, and when I dropped out of it I found I was of no use anywhere else."

Those of us that live in the "sticks" don't have 100 police officers 5 minutes away.

Exactly, and then if your home is marked as a "faggot" location, you've added an additional target to your back. We've had a couple of incidents around here were gays were targeted. In one of these attacks, they spray painted hate words all over the place and then torched their barn. They killed several horses just because the couple were gay. You probably saw that in the news as you're fairly close to us.

I would venture to guess that home invasions happen more in the rural areas than urban locations. We don't have immediate responses for police protection.

But these scenarios do nothing to discuss the need for comprehensive gun reform. Again, based on everything I'm reading from friends and family, the overwhelming majority feel it's time to address realistic change.

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Complacency is the enemy. Challenge yourself daily for maximum return on investment.

Philadelphia had a homicide rate of 20.7 per 100,000 residents (highest number of the US's 10 most populous cities) in 2011. If you live in a rural area please look up your rate and pro-rate it for that number and let me know what it is. It doesn't matter if a cop is five feet away when they're addressing numbers like that.

I've yet to personally hear a gun fired in the past 8 years of living here.

Otherwise you're just feeding the Gun Culture Machine for cultural reasons, and I'll be happy to post a continual stream of pictures of six year old victims for the remainder of this thread. I'll also guarantee you that the hoards of gun owners saying there's (now that children were killed) that there's "comprehensive gun reform" needed they won't lift a finger to press their congressional representatives to do so, or elect other politicians that are willing to do so.

CEDAR LAKE, Ind. -- Authorities say an Indiana man who had 47 guns and ammunition in his home has been arrested after allegedly threatening to kill people at an elementary school near his home.

Cedar Lake police were called to the home of 60-year-old Von I. Meyer early Friday after he allegedly threatened to set his wife on fire. A police statement says Meyer also said he would enter Jane Ball Elementary School and "kill as many people as he could."

Authorities found 47 guns and ammunition worth over $100,000.

Prosecutors filed felony intimidation charges against Meyer on Saturday, one day after the massacre at an elementary school in Newtown, Conn. He is being held without bond.

We don't have those kinds of statics because around here everyone knows that everyone owns a gun and aren't afraid to use them. You can post anything you like, it won't change my mind nor will you change the criminals mind.

Another needless tragedy caused by a man who felt bigger than himself because he was packing. They had every right to have their music playing and if it bothered him that much he could have pumped his gas else where.

I used to have a couple of guns myself, along with a concealed weapons permit. It was far too much responsibility than I cared to have. Besides forgetting them in the car at times, I just didn't like having them with children in the house. I haven't felt the need to have one since selling them 14 years ago.

By comparison, I felt much safer sleeping at night when I had my pitbull Neo than when I owned guns. And, as far as someone robbing me out on the streets? While it's been a blow to my pride, I find giving them what they want pretty much ends the ordeal rather quickly..... a gun in your face really makes that gold chain unimportant anyways.

Thinking back, I'm really glad I didn't own one when I went through that mental breakdown a year ago last April. Hanging yourself is pretty tough to deal with and pulling a trigger would have been too easy.

Sure, RampidRod. Let us give guns to every single person out there. This logic of "if someone else in the room (or at the mall, the movie theatre, the university campus, etc.) had had a gun this wouldn't have happened" makes so much sense.

All that it would take, especially at a moment of fear (if not paranoia), is for someone to feel "threatened" for us to have a battlefield.

« Last Edit: December 16, 2012, 02:14:59 PM by Rev. Moon »

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"I have tried hard--but life is difficult, and I am a very useless person. I can hardly be said to have an independent existence. I was just a screw or a cog in the great machine I called life, and when I dropped out of it I found I was of no use anywhere else."

There's a degree of awareness about how all of these conversations play out, how everybody plays their appointed role. We all know how the "national conversation" on guns will happen, with liberals saying there are too many guns, and conservatives yelling that we're politicizing it and also, too, arm the kindergarten teachers and the problems will be solved.

This is part of the ABC News experiment I referenced earlier. They hold a mock campus shooting. They gathered students who had gun training and experience. They were "killed" and ended up shooting other students in the chaos. I have seen several posts on facebook saying we just need to arm teachers and students on college campuses. This is an interesting video.

On a side note, several were also posting how on Friday a man in china stabbed about 24 young kids at a school. They all reported how the students were all killed and that someone could just as easily kill several people with knives. I thought it would be very difficult to kill that many with a knife. Anyway, on This Week this morning, George said they all survived the knife attack. Anyone know the truth?

On a side note, several were also posting how on Friday a man in china stabbed about 24 young kids at a school. They all reported how the students were all killed and that someone could just as easily kill several people with knives. I thought it would be very difficult to kill that many with a knife. Anyway, on This Week this morning, George said they all survived the knife attack. Anyone know the truth?

None of the Chinese children died.

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"I have tried hard--but life is difficult, and I am a very useless person. I can hardly be said to have an independent existence. I was just a screw or a cog in the great machine I called life, and when I dropped out of it I found I was of no use anywhere else."

That would be wonderful, but realistically will not happen, not in the US. But why dont you take that magic wand you have and whirl it around in the air and give it a go.

Why now is the focus of this thread on going after JG, Wolfter, and myself beacause we own guns? I thought we had moved beyond repealing the Second Ammendment earlier in this thread and were starting to talk about 28day waiting periods, shutting down Gun shows, etc??

That would be wonderful, but realistically will not happen, not in the US. But why dont you take that magic wand you have and whirl it around in the air and give it a go.

Why now is the focus of this thread on going after JG, Wolfter, and myself beacause we own guns? I thought we had moved beyond repealing the Second Ammendment earlier in this thread?

Look ass-wipe even you aren't dense enough not to understand the response I was giving to Windy what's-her-face "imagine" scenario. I haven't gone after you or anyone else for owning a gun or suggested we get rid of the second amendment. Got that? And just to make a bed wetter like you feel better, you can go beat off knowing that I own a 38.

What saddens me are the people who, in the wake of these horrible things, insist that "this is not the time to have these discussions. This is a time to mourn."

Then there's a period of respectful mourning, and then there is not ever, not ever ever, any discussion. Because Lindsay Lohan or a plane crash or the fiscal cliff.

As a society we have a charming yet dangerous collective ADD. If we don't address the issues while they are burning, our natural aversion to these controversial and nuanced topics easily overwhelms our (rapidly) diminishing passion for change. Especially if that change involves in any way a hardship on the collective society in the form of taxation to support mental health (OBABACARE!) or the admission that we are in the process of dissolving our social glue.

After the last few massacres, when people on this forum begged to wait until a reasonable period of respectful mourning had passed before having these discussions, how many discussions ensues a week or two later? What local or national or global controversy erupted in the meantime that was a (welcome) distraction?

It never changes because those of us who have the stomach to insist upon the discussion are shouted down by those who cannot bear to have it. Maybe this time will be different because it was children. I like to hope so. But my money is on token change, if that.

Because this time next week, Mayan Apocalypse, Uganda, Michigan, and no doubt, Lindsay Lohan.

Forgive me if I seem jaded. It's been that sort of week.

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"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

I'm starting to feel like I'm the lone cocksucker who doesn't own a gun. In fact, I've never seen one close up except walking by a police officer.

My dad gave me the gun years ago and it's in a box hidden away in a closet. I really don't care if people own guns because I would like to believe most people are responsible. However, I do believe we should ban assault rifles, have effective background checks and quit de-funding mental health services. I do get infuriated when idiots equate gun control with trying to take away their guns.

My dad gave me the gun years ago and it's in a box hidden away in a closet. I really don't care if people own guns because I would like to believe most people are responsible. However, I do believe we should ban assault rifles, have effective background checks and quit de-funding mental health services. I do get infuriated when idiots equate gun control with trying to take away their guns.

Thread gospel.

And this queen doesn't own a gun either. Never fired anything more than a BB gun or a cap gun as a kid.

I'm starting to feel like I'm the lone cocksucker who doesn't own a gun. In fact, I've never seen one close up except walking by a police officer.

Girl, please. I have never felt the desire to own a gun nor would ever consider buying one. Not even after I spent the longest 15 minutes of my life tied, faced down with duct tape over my mouth, and with a gun being poked repeatedly against my back by a coked up thief who kept on saying "I feel like capping a motherfucker tonight". Owning a gun wouldn't have helped me or my coworkers that night and I doubt it would help me in the future.

Logged

"I have tried hard--but life is difficult, and I am a very useless person. I can hardly be said to have an independent existence. I was just a screw or a cog in the great machine I called life, and when I dropped out of it I found I was of no use anywhere else."