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The lack of Pokemon doesn't bother me nearly as much as the lack of post game stuff. BW2 had so much to offer as far as legendaries (past and present), White Treehollow/Black Tower, etc that this gen had almost nothing.

I generally don't mind the amount of new pokemon introduced this generation. In fact, I kind of see a pattern. In every new even generation, the new pokemon presented don't even make it past 150. The Hoenn region may have had 130-something pokemon, but that's awfully close to 150, so the odd generations are generally introducing new pokemon around the 150 mark.

To be honest I am fine with the lower number of new pokemon simply because so many others are available. There are a total of 454 pokemon available to you in these games and I for one enjoyed that faaaar more than having another 150 new pokemon.

The lack of Pokemon doesn't bother me nearly as much as the lack of post game stuff. BW2 had so much to offer as far as legendaries (past and present), White Treehollow/Black Tower, etc that this gen had almost nothing.

Well of course; XY are the first installments of Gen VI. Aside from GS for obvious reasons, the first installments never have much in the way of post-game.

Originally Posted by Lord Zoroark

Listen, you gotta remember these things; always avoid claims of Fennekin being (or becoming) part Fighting-type, don't tick off mods, and NEVER (and I mean NEVER!) suggest that Arceus is the God of Pokemon when Endolise is online. If you somehow make this mistake, run for the hills before he attempts to murder you via tongue lashing.

In addition to the fact that Twitter is an open resource available to be scoured at any given time, as linked above, consider the international breadth and depth of the fandom, the franchise you're discussing and the long-distant past date on that fake tweet (October 13 of last year). It doesn't strike you as odd that supposedly the one individual with the most control over the core titles stated something like that as publicly as can be but it wasn't discussed, was never covered by the gaming media or anything like that?

Last edited by BCVM22; 22nd January 2014 at 12:30 AM.

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Never underestimate the power of stupidity, of the one and of the many.Words to|live by

Another thing that kinda hurts it, are the type disstubutions, come on, did we really need 9 kinds of dragons, while us ground and bug lovers, are stuck with vivion and diggersby, it really needed to be more even.

I'm not too bothered by the lack of new pokemon overall, as I understand they need to give more longevity to the brand. However, as others have pointed out, some typings were really underrepresented this time around, and I was also annoyed that some of the Kalos pokemon take what seems like forever to encounter in the wild. I'm really happy with the pokemon we got, but I do wish that instead of focusing so much on the mega evolutions they could have added some evolutions to previous pokemon (maybe Jynx? Farfetch'd?), some baby pokemon of previous pokemon (a baby Tropius would be so cute!), and a new legendary trio. Those were the things I really wanted.

I'm really happy with the pokemon we got, but I do wish that instead of focusing so much on the mega evolutions they could have added some evolutions to previous pokemon (maybe Jynx? Farfetch'd?), some baby pokemon of previous pokemon (a baby Tropius would be so cute!), and a new legendary trio. Those were the things I really wanted.

Okay so as many of you may know, Kalos only gave us 69 new pokemon, and personally im not to crazy about it, to me it feels like gen 6 so far is really feeling like its the gen to get all the genwunners back, "oh look 2 mega charizards" and it feels like kalos is suffering for it.

But hey maybe im wrong, what do you guys think.

First of, I would like to present my definition of what I will mean by new pokemon in this topic:
-completely fresh unrelated family-lines, added to fill casual roles. Regular pokemon.
-Meaning starters and legendaries for example are irrelevant here, because they are a given, and their evolution through the generations is a huge topic of their own.
-ones related to previous pokemon are also irrelevant, whether they are evolutions, forms or mega evolutions, as they cannot appear without the previous pokemon appearing too.

This is such a common exaggeration, that it is really annoying me.
It's an exaggeration drawn from facing the raw numbers ("69 omg"), coupled with the fact that Kalos (which is typical of ALL EVEN generations) is trying to be as diverse as possible and obviously relying heavily on previous pokemon for that purpose.

Because of this, any disappointment due to lack of pokemon can absolutely be applied in the same way to JOHTO and SINNOH.
So unless anyone was just as disappointed with those two gens, they're a hypocrite or blinded by nostalgia. I never heard anyone moan about how lacking Johto was though.

All three of these generations are designed with the fundamental idea of complementing the franchise as a whole, NOT TO BE STANDALONE generations (which is what Kanto, Unova were, and Hoenn attempted to do).
Gamefreak cleverly alternates between these two "types of generations".
But people will moan about it regardless of what they do.

But let me try to show you visually how truly identical Kalos and Sinnoh are in their execution.

As far as regular, actually fresh pokemon go, it's the same "generation-plan" applied to different regions.

The only real difference is that
-Sinnoh had powerhouse evolutions for old pokemon, while Kalos has Mega evolutions instead
-Kalos wanted to include more pokemon than ever, which brought the regional dex up to a never before seen 450, making the new ones feel even more rare throughout the game.

But as I said, the same applies to Johto.

Sure Johto also has the typical early rodent in Sentret, and a Mareep for coolness. But beyond that it was pretty much just a Kanto 2.0

The main pests were Pidgeys and Rattatas throughout.
The common bugs were Caterpies and Weedles.
The caves were filled with Zubats and Geodudes.
Fishing with the old rod bringing up Magikarps.
Surfing still being a very Tentacool experience.
....
Heck even plenty of new locations of interest use Kanto-mon. Bellsprout Tower, Slowpoke Well..
..
It became the native region to Kanto-mon that didn't have a home in gen 1, like Lapras in Union cave, Jynx appearing in the Ice path...

Pretty much any "new pokemon" in Johto, were either:
-evolutions/babies
-the one new common pokemon every other route
-rare extras that you have to look for (fishing, headbutting, day/night-time-exclusive, swarms...)

Let me make this clear, I'm not saying Johto and Sinnoh sucked. I loved the direction each of the six gens took on their own merits. What I am saying is, there is no basis for being disappointed at gen 6 but not having done the same for gens 2 and 4.

Originally Posted by Azer

The mega-evolutions are cool, but it's not an excuse for the low number of new pokémon...

Actually, its as close as it gets, as every mega evolution is a unique new design and took about the same amount to design as if they were all regular evolutions.

Originally Posted by Chibi_Muffin

I think the type distribution was out of whack though, excluding Fairies (since of course they would show off the new type). Out of 69 Pokemon, there are nine Dragon types. Nine. That's five evolutionary lines. Despite it being the rarest type. Meanwhile, we only got one Bug line, one Water line that wasn't either version exclusive or a starter (and even then, one becomes a dragon) and four Normal lines of which only one was pure Normal. That isn't right.

I think that's why Kalos' Pokemon selection feels so small, even to me - the type diversity doesn't feel right. There's an overload of exotic types but the more common types are left out, so it feels devoid of filler, which in turn makes the number of Pokemon feel very small even if it isn't .

In these complementary generations, there will inherently be lack of additions to some types. Remember how people moaned about lack of Fire pokemon in Sinnoh?

Now if Unova, a region that can stand on its own without old pokemon being part of the basic concept, was lacking in some types, THAT would be the curious case.

Kalos had tons of Grass, Water, Normal pokemon to choose from to fill any given area, so naturally they would want to add fancier stuff to the mix.

Originally Posted by sunny phoenix

also GF has showed that things can change so its possible that pokemon z or x2 y2 might add a few more, a wild guess but may happen, its actually certain that they will add more megas in hoen remakes or the 3rd installment judging by the mega latias/latios

You're contradicting yourself there. Since Mega Lati@s are already in XY, it would mean that there wouldn't be any additional pokemon or megas besides Lati@s, otherwise they would have been found in XY in the same manner by now.

Originally Posted by Akanjăo

Tbh, Kanto (design wise) had the worst pokémons, by far. But who cares, they were sympathetic.
Unova's pokémon are far from being bad. People just hate it because it's fine/cool to hate new things and praise the old ones. I prefer Unova by a small amount over Kanto.

And I'm not saying less quantity = more quality. What I think, is that less quantity means they have a more free time to work on them. Something I don't see it happening when they need to create 150 pokémons or such.

These are all baseless assumptions about how the process goes for designing a generation. We don't know how long they designed any particular generation of pokemon. I mean we cannot even say that a generation is designed at a time. And there is even reasons to think this is not so. For example Shellos/Gastrodon designs already existed in gen 3, they just didn't make it into the games. Another example is the fact that the first games were going to have 190 pokemon at first, but 40 were taken out and saved for possible sequels if the games would make money (and those 40 are now all in gen 2).

So for all we know, they could very well be designing casual pokemon at a steady pace in the background, and are merely putting them into different sized groups as they are needed to fit the games of the next generation.

I for one, did not see any lack in quality in Unovas diverse additions..in fact many of them felt like they tried very hard to pay homage to the original 150 while still being unique, which might have been even harder to pull off than just adding new stuff.

Oh and btw, we do know that they always have projects running simultaneously, so for example while the HGSS hype was building, they were already working on BW for some time etc.

Originally Posted by Taodragon

Anyway, I'll admit that I'm disappointed in the lower number because I like seeing the new Pokémon and what new ideas GF brings to the table, plus it's always fun for me to use those new Pokémon in a new playthrough in a new region and the limited number kind of hurt that (the aforementioned poor type distribution also didn't help). Having said that, I can understand why there weren't so many considering all of the models, updates, and other features that GF had to work with when making this game so I can't hold the low number against them that much.

Yeah, it was probably the smart way to focus on new pokemon when they knew the handheld by heart, and focus on getting the look right and updating the mechanics correctly when they have to do a big jump like happened with XY.

I take generations like these as a nostalgia-ride. Try some of the cool new stuff, catch some old favourites and see what new tools they get etc. ;D

Also, we have no real hint about what's up next, but considering from there being barely any extra pokemon hidden in the games (3 events and 1 mega), gen 6 might be a shorter generation, with its purpose being to smoothly transition to the 3DS to set the stage for gen 7.

Then there is an unpredictability factor too. I mean they could randomly decide to do something radical and start a short two-games pseudo-gen 7 with Hoenn sequels that feature the usual starters from RSE but say "50 new Hoenn pokemon" and "30 years later" changes, nostalgic moments, more backstory or who knows what.

Originally Posted by Monek_OP

I think the lack of Kalos Pokémon was intentional. It's time to start slowing creation, especially with all the new features.

Looking at the trendline, if this continues at the average pace of how it was till now, the number of pokemon won't even hit 4 digits by 2020.

For a franchise that started off already above the hundred mark right off the bat... the number isn't going to suddenly get overwhelming at that rate.

Originally Posted by Sunset Star

The lack of Pokémon itself didn't bother me much. What genuinely bothered me how the only cross-gen regular evolution was Sylveon the Eeveelution. I can't be the only person who thinks there are too many Eeveelutions now, right?

omg yes! c__c

finally a disappointment I share XDDDddd

I mean, I don't have anything against Mega evolutions or anything, but there really should have been some regular evolutions along too ):

The only pokemon that didn't need one was Eevee. And if it wasn't for Fairy unexpectedly showing up, I would still be saying they exhausted the fitting types and should do "new eevees" instead at least...

The chances for a regular Banette evolution have dropped to zero now....oh well, the Mega is still way better than nothing!

Originally Posted by Elisus

The only thing that was flawed IMO was the distribution of them throughout the game and how low of a chance you had of running into some of them. I missed out on many new Pokemon playing through the game solely because I didn't even run into them when I spent time in the route.

Like, I didn't even run into an Inkay until post-game.

Remember how we could catch Mukrow/Houndour/Misdreavus/Larvitar/Slugma right outside newbark town?
Nope xDDDdd
But Kalos is nowhere near that example. They're all accessible in the playthrough, just not in-your-face.

The even gens they like to play this hiding game with us, where the new pokemon are few and rare, while the common ones are the usual stuff.
Like they want us to go specifically try and find all of the fancy new ones o:

Originally Posted by GreenEyes

I'm perfectly fine with it. Gen VI provided a nice selection of Pokémon both design-wise and competitive-wise (bar Dedenne & maybe Carbink). I loved the release of more normal-type Pokémon with a secondary type like Heliolisk, Diggersby & Pyroar. Also, there's some nice non-legendary, non-"pseudo-legendary" dragons (Dragalge, Tyrantrum, Noivern). I hated that Dragon-type Pokémon were mostly legendaries or pseudos bar 5 families (Kingdra, Flygon, Altaria, Druddigon & Haxorus).. not even a full team. Same with the focus on Ghost types like Gourgeist, Trevenant & Aegislash.

Also, Gen V was the gen of Bug, Dark & Steel, so I understand the lack of those types this time around and appreciate what's changed. Esp. the lack of Water & Normal types.

Yeah, it really felt like they tried to round it up nicely and of course make a basic set of Fairy-types.

I too loved that we had several secondary Dragons. Although they then went and made the pseudo-legend yet another Dragon anyway. That one might have been too much, but how could anyone hate Goomy D:

Originally Posted by Serebii

The way the developers undoubtedly see it, and the way I see it is that, even though it's a new feature and they have the same dex number, Mega Evolutions are in essence a new Pokémon.

Think about it:
Brand new designs
New types, stats, abilities

As such, when you add the 30 Mega Evolutions to the 71 new Pokémon, you get 101, which is just above Gen 2 in the amount of Pokémon.

Now I know they technically don't count, but they definitely factored into the developmental and design process as well as working out balance as new Pokémon.

Exactly!
I don't get it how Megas can get dismissed se easily by many people when bringing up the number of pokemon, when they all add the same amount of data as any regular evolution would.

i looked it up, and believe it or not, but it turns out that there is 29 pokemon related to prior poemon in gen 4, only 1 more then there is mega evolutions. when you count them out, there is 78 new kinds counting the legendaries.

thats actually pretty surprising, but the evolutions in gen 4 were mostly given to pokemon who needed them, unlike mega´s, who were kinda pointless on some pokemon.

Mega Evolutions should have only been a concept for Pokémon in a three stage evolutionary line or legendaries. The ones for Banette, Pinsir, Houndoom and Absol especially should have been a full fledged evolution.

Also, IMO, Mega Kangaskan should have not existed. That was such a troll of the fan request for the baby Kangaskan to be it's own Pokémon.

I was disappointed by the low number of new 'mons. I knew this generation would be on the small side, but I was still hoping for at least 100 new Pokemon. I was also disappointed that nearly half of the new Pokemon were revealed before the game's release.

Originally Posted by Hexin' Wishes

Mega Evolutions should have only been a concept for Pokémon in a three stage evolutionary line or legendaries. The ones for Banette, Pinsir, Houndoom and Absol especially should have been a full fledged evolution.

In these complementary generations, there will inherently be lack of additions to some types. Remember how people moaned about lack of Fire pokemon in Sinnoh?

Now if Unova, a region that can stand on its own without old pokemon being part of the basic concept, was lacking in some types, THAT would be the curious case.

Kalos had tons of Grass, Water, Normal pokemon to choose from to fill any given area, so naturally they would want to add fancier stuff to the mix.

Yes, but the problems were the types they chose to focus on. There were a lot of Dragons, specifically; five lines is what you'd expect from a larger gen. In a generation where we have a new type specifically to combat the existing Dragons, creating more of them is kind of missing your own point (yes, they might be easier to fight now, but the point is that they were being used too much, which having more of them doesn't help!). Again, having a strong bias towards Fairies this gen was expected for me, it's a brand new type so of course they are going to explore what they can do with it. What I wasn't expecting was for them to then make a lot of the new Pokemon of other rare types like Dragon and Rock as well. When you already have a good chunk of the selection be made of of something that's starting out as rare/uncommon, making everything else rare/uncommon makes your generation feel more like an expansion pack than a new adventure. Yes, I know the even-numbered gens are supposed to expand on older adventures, but in my opinion, it should still feel like it could stand of its own. Kalos' type diversity doesn't do that for me.

Similarly, I don't mind there not being a tonne of the more common types. But just one Bug type to pick from (and the common, weak butterfly, at that) and just one new Water type that is consistent across all copies regardless of starter or version? That's very limiting. I admit the Normal type thing was incorrect as they were experimenting with new type combos for that. But when it comes to Bug and Water... You don't get a lot of choice, particularly if you want Chespin or Fennekin. It makes team building a little hard for those who only want new Pokemon. It isn't a huge issue to me when it comes to the new Pokemon, but it's noticeable and makes me wonder what they were trying to go for. Yes, Sinnoh was missing Fire types and I know that, but for the rest of the types it seems fine. Kalos just seems very unbalanced to me.

Compared to older generations we simply got less Pokemon this time around, and we still have yet to get a Fire/Rock Fossil Pokemon (I'v been wating since gen 3 for it). Everyone has their favorites, some have better generations than others. Lets just be happy that the number of Pokemon avilable with the 3 Pokedex idea was high enough to make the lack of new Pokemon less noticable.

At 85/100 friends, so I'm being a little more selective of the safaris I add. Usually this amounts to me asking what your 3DS ID name is.
I have access to all starters from all generations, HA for only gen 1 and 6. Send a PM if there's one you want.

I was a little disappointed with the number of pokemon in the game but I think most of them have good designs and a lot of them are actually good too. The type distribution was totally off. 69 pokemon and 9 of them are dragons. There was only 1 new ground, bug, and poison evolution lines which makes 7 new pokemon all together. What's with the half normal typing for heliolisk, diggersby, and pyroar? Another issue is that some pokemon were intentionally screwed over with bad typings, moves, and abilities. Pyroar is good example. No one asked for a part normal typing. It has a terrible move pool with and useless abilities. Moxie? Really? It's a special attacker! Did they let the idiot intern work on pyroar unsupervised? The best you could do with pyroar is flame thrower, dark pulse/hyper voice, HP grass, and entrainment. I know game freak does that to a lot of pokemon but it seems they really wanted pyroar to fail. Let us not forget aurorus with 2 4x weaknesses in addition to 4 2x weaknesses. Not sure which is a worse typing, grass/dark or rock/ice.

At 85/100 friends, so I'm being a little more selective of the safaris I add. Usually this amounts to me asking what your 3DS ID name is.
I have access to all starters from all generations, HA for only gen 1 and 6. Send a PM if there's one you want.

At 85/100 friends, so I'm being a little more selective of the safaris I add. Usually this amounts to me asking what your 3DS ID name is.
I have access to all starters from all generations, HA for only gen 1 and 6. Send a PM if there's one you want.

I understand what you're saying, but one doesn't automatically beget the other, i.e. you haven't necessarily been denied additional fossil type combinations because there are three Rock/Waters and two Rock/Flyings. Particularly as the latter examples in both types differentiate themselves from their predecessors significantly despite the shared typing, i.e. Tirtouga/Carracosta isn't simply a clone of Kabuto/Kabutops despite the shared Rock/Water typing.

Last edited by BCVM22; 23rd January 2014 at 7:56 AM.

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Never underestimate the power of stupidity, of the one and of the many.Words to|live by