I, too, share enough reasonable doubt upon his guilt. I dont know why, I just do. Its not that I believe his insane Satan worshiping cult story checks out (it is a bit far fetched), its something else.

Rufus Lee King:Hack Patooey: He awoke to find three men and one woman, whom he described as having blond hair and wearing a floppy hat. They chanted "kill the pigs" and "acid's groovy" before attacking him, MacDonald said.

"He and his attorneys will argue that new DNA tests show that hair samples found underneath the fingernail of one of the victims did not come from a member of the MacDonald family and presumably were from one of the killers." So, one of the daughters might not have gotten it while playing rough house with a neighbor? As to the nutbag who claimed she was in the house and then changed her story on the stand, her existence was included her in Fatal Vision and it basically said everyone realized she was an attention whore whose mental balance was unstable.

The guy is a lying sleezebag. He is guilty as hell. Wait a few decades and obscure the case and reasonable doubt will creep in. The evidence in the case was clear in the first trial. His violent temper was well known. I doubt many people will recall this case.

Hack Patooey:He awoke to find three men and one woman, whom he described as having blond hair and wearing a floppy hat. They chanted "kill the pigs" and "acid's groovy" before attacking him, MacDonald said.

Hack Patooey:He awoke to find three men and one woman, whom he described as having blond hair and wearing a floppy hat. They chanted "kill the pigs" and "acid's groovy" before attacking him, MacDonald said.

#include "smellslikebullshiat.h"

I read that during the stabbings they were also chanting "and for all the little piggies life is getting worse"

Can you elaborate? From the description on wikipedia it seems a pretty open and shut case. Especially condemning is the fact that the wife and children were stabbed 10-30 times and beaten with a club and this guy just had superficial injuries.

Rufus Lee King:Hack Patooey: He awoke to find three men and one woman, whom he described as having blond hair and wearing a floppy hat. They chanted "kill the pigs" and "acid's groovy" before attacking him, MacDonald said.

#include "smellslikebullshiat.h"

Yes, that's a bit much, ain't it?

Yup.

"We've been sold a bill of goods about this case," Morris said. "It's as phony as a three-dollar bill."

As phony as a tale about candle-carrying ninja hippies chanting "acid is groovy" and "kill the pigs"?

I read Fatal Vision many years ago, and I read through the Wikipedia page on the case just now and yeah, he did it. His lawyers are throwing out little tidbits of evidence that are just lost in the noise when matched up against the evidence in favor of him being the murderer. Which is what defense lawyers do. If all they've got is what is reported on CNN he shouldn't get a new trial. It sounds like stuff that was used in his last appeal.

Lenny_da_Hog:Rufus Lee King: Hack Patooey: He awoke to find three men and one woman, whom he described as having blond hair and wearing a floppy hat. They chanted "kill the pigs" and "acid's groovy" before attacking him, MacDonald said.

like i was saying, i watch all those damn True Crime genre TV shows. there's more than one episode about this case. i'll be gotdam'd if this boy didn't get railroaded. farking Green Berets are top shelf material. best of the best. they don't crack crazy and run amuck, unless you happen to be The Enemy.

KrispyKritter:Qel: Brace yourselves for the armchair CSI s and Prosecutors.

like i was saying, i watch all those damn True Crime genre TV shows. there's more than one episode about this case. i'll be gotdam'd if this boy didn't get railroaded. farking Green Berets are top shelf material. best of the best. they don't crack crazy and run amuck, unless you happen to be The Enemy.

Yeah, I'm going to go with physical evidence over your character assessment.

KrispyKritter:like i was saying, i watch all those damn True Crime genre TV shows. there's more than one episode about this case. i'll be gotdam'd if this boy didn't get railroaded. farking Green Berets are top shelf material. best of the best. they don't crack crazy and run amuck, unless you happen to be The Enemy.

Apparently you weren't paying much attention about 10 years ago, were you?

MAYORBOB: So, one of the daughters might not have gotten it while playing rough house with a neighbor? As to the nutbag who claimed she was in the house and then changed her story on the stand, her existence was included her in Fatal Vision and it basically said everyone realized she was an attention whore whose mental balance was unstable.

Regardless, a jury should get to make that determination about the DNA evidence.

StoPPeRmobile:Lenny_da_Hog: Rufus Lee King: Hack Patooey: He awoke to find three men and one woman, whom he described as having blond hair and wearing a floppy hat. They chanted "kill the pigs" and "acid's groovy" before attacking him, MacDonald said.

#include "smellslikebullshiat.h"

Yes, that's a bit much, ain't it?

Yeah, just when Charlie Manson was all the rage, too. How convenient.

So he stabbed himself in the lung?

You say this as if self-injury is an unbelievable prospect. Just a couple of weeks ago in Alaska there was a story about a guy who had a friend shoot him with a shotgun so he wouldn't have to go to active duty in the ME.

They chanted "kill the pigs" and "acid's groovy" before attacking him,

Hippies only act like that in paranoid anti-hippy propaganda pieces.

He and his attorneys will argue that new DNA tests show that hair samples found underneath the fingernail of one of the victims did not come from a member of the MacDonald family and presumably were from one of the killers.

I'm guessing the woman MacDonald married doesn't have MacDonald DNA...

cman:Speaker2Animals: Just today finished Morris' book -- and it seems MacDonald got railroaded.

I, too, share enough reasonable doubt upon his guilt. I dont know why, I just do. Its not that I believe his insane Satan worshiping cult story checks out (it is a bit far fetched), its something else.

Meh, I still think that MacDonald, a clever enough guy, saw the group of hippies wandering around the vicinity that night, knew others had seen them, and figured he could pin the murders on them, thus creating reasonable doubt (if only the jury believed him). It's hard to recall nowadays, but back then, right after the Manson murders, murderous hippie cults were as believable in the Middle American mind as murderous Muslim terrorists are today.

If it was today, MacDonald would likely claim he saw a couple of black youths wearing hoodies killing his family, with the same hope of creating reasonable doubt.

Lenny_da_Hog:StoPPeRmobile: Lenny_da_Hog: Rufus Lee King: Hack Patooey: He awoke to find three men and one woman, whom he described as having blond hair and wearing a floppy hat. They chanted "kill the pigs" and "acid's groovy" before attacking him, MacDonald said.

#include "smellslikebullshiat.h"

Yes, that's a bit much, ain't it?

Yeah, just when Charlie Manson was all the rage, too. How convenient.

So he stabbed himself in the lung?

You say this as if self-injury is an unbelievable prospect. Just a couple of weeks ago in Alaska there was a story about a guy who had a friend shoot him with a shotgun so he wouldn't have to go to active duty in the ME.

As I recall the case, the family lived on base. So for his story to be true, a group of three "hippies" got past security, went wandering around the base, in the middle of the night, commits 3 horrific murders, and wanders away, again, unobserved. Just seems a little farfetched to me.

mr intrepid:As I recall the case, the family lived on base. So for his story to be true, a group of three "hippies" got past security, went wandering around the base, in the middle of the night, commits 3 horrific murders, and wanders away, again, unobserved. Just seems a little farfetched to me.

It's been awhile since I've read "Fatal Vision", but I should dig out my copy and re-read it. However, I'm pretty certain you're correct about them living on base since I recall the MPs visiting the home regularly (it was still considered a crime scene) and doing routine things like defrosing the refrigerator freezer.

StoPPeRmobile:Lenny_da_Hog: StoPPeRmobile: Lenny_da_Hog: Rufus Lee King: Hack Patooey: He awoke to find three men and one woman, whom he described as having blond hair and wearing a floppy hat. They chanted "kill the pigs" and "acid's groovy" before attacking him, MacDonald said.

#include "smellslikebullshiat.h"

Yes, that's a bit much, ain't it?

Yeah, just when Charlie Manson was all the rage, too. How convenient.

So he stabbed himself in the lung?

You say this as if self-injury is an unbelievable prospect. Just a couple of weeks ago in Alaska there was a story about a guy who had a friend shoot him with a shotgun so he wouldn't have to go to active duty in the ME.

Lung? Sounds farking crazy.

So what kind of injury did the chickenshiat in Alaska sustain?

I'd remind any naysayers thinking MacDonald's injury could/could not have been self-inflicted about the Stuart case in Boston. The husband shot his wife to death, and then to establish his story that they'd been attacked by a random black mugger, shot himself. In the abdomen. And survived. And he wasn't even a doctor. So the fact MacDonald was stabbed in the lung provides no evidence either way, that he was stabbed by a mugger or stabbed himself.

Bathia_Mapes:mr intrepid: As I recall the case, the family lived on base. So for his story to be true, a group of three "hippies" got past security, went wandering around the base, in the middle of the night, commits 3 horrific murders, and wanders away, again, unobserved. Just seems a little farfetched to me.

It's been awhile since I've read "Fatal Vision", but I should dig out my copy and re-read it. However, I'm pretty certain you're correct about them living on base since I recall the MPs visiting the home regularly (it was still considered a crime scene) and doing routine things like defrosing the refrigerator freezer.

Back when MacDonald was in the Army, Ft. Bragg was an open post. There were restricted areas on base but most of the base was open to the public.