Why Christians listen to atheists who quote Scripture to them is beyond ironic, and beyond my comprehension. This Truth is for all, even those who reject God, His Son the Lord Jesus Christ, and the Word.

Matthew 5:39 King James Version (KJV)
39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

This has been used by atheists to try to get Christians to lie down and let thieves, murderers, rapists, and any other advantage taker run amok over them. Here, Jesus is referring to insults and provocations. Christians are not supposed to fight, argue, or engage in any other similar behavior. However, they are NOT to lie down, especially in their own house, and let others take advantage of them or their family.

Proverbs 25:26 King James Version (KJV)
26 A righteous man falling down before the wicked is as a troubled fountain, and a corrupt spring.

1 Timothy 5:8 King James Version (KJV)
8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

And Jesus even encourages the ownership of weapons for defensive purposes, but not for offensive purposes.

Luke 22:36 King James Version (KJV)
36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

Here is a story illustrating how Christians are not supposed to use violence in offense against those who reject Jesus. And this is totally separate from war. But Christian nations should not war in offense, unless there are direct threats that cannot be stopped through other means. But that is for another thead, not this one.

Luke 9:51 And it came to pass, when the time was come that he should be received up, he stedfastly set his face to go to Jerusalem, 52 And sent messengers before his face: and they went, and entered into a village of the Samaritans, to make ready for him. 53 And they did not receive him, because his face was as though he would go to Jerusalem. 54 And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did? 55 But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. 56 For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village.

The Scriptures say to submit to lawful authority. Our Constitution is our authority, and gives citizens the right to bear arms. Unlawful politicians have subverted the Constitution, in the name of "public safety", as an excuse to slowly erode the 2nd amendment. An unarmed people are slaves and subjects. An armed people are citizens. I believe it was Jefferson who said, "An armed society is a polite society."

21 When a strong man armed keepeth his palace, his goods are in peace:

jessejordan419

08-23-2012, 01:01 AM

Psalm 149:6-9 King James Version (KJV)

6 Let the high praises of God be in their mouth, and a two-edged sword in their hand;

7 To execute vengeance upon the heathen, and punishments upon the people;

8 To bind their kings with chains, and their nobles with fetters of iron;

9 To execute upon them the judgment written: this honour have all his saints. Praise ye the LORD

mrveggieman

08-23-2012, 07:47 AM

I can't recall if it was you gorrillawaits or the other guy but one of ya'll did start a thread that pretty much said that christians said that they are pretty much supposed to lie down and let people walk over them. Even all of the hard line christians clowned the writer of that thread. Also as far as war if the united states is a christian nation like you want it to be how the hell can you conservatives justify the iraq war when it was proven that sadaam was of no immediate threat to america?

shrewsbury

08-23-2012, 08:42 AM

who proved that? the iraqi people?

mrveggieman

08-23-2012, 09:51 AM

who proved that? the iraqi people?

The nonexisting WMD proved it.

shrewsbury

08-23-2012, 10:07 AM

so him and his family killing people they don't like and killing for fun is ok and no threat.

and why are we still there? why are we at more places now? why is gitmo still opened?

you guys will blame bush to the end of days, which is fine my me, but when you are doing the same and more, there is no one to blame but bush?

mrveggieman

08-23-2012, 10:38 AM

so him and his family killing people they don't like and killing for fun is ok and no threat.

Not to sound cold hearted but that is not our problem that is the Iraqi people's problem. Just like Iraq did not get involved in america's ills when it was legally and socially acceptable to discriminate against people based soley on race not to mention to lynch someone because of race we had no business getting involved over there. How can america be in any position to tell another country they are wrong when we still openly discriminate against consenting adults for choosing the person that they want to be with? America is slowly learning to correct it's social ills and Iraq could have did the same if we did not get our noses involved by overthrowing the only stable gov't that they had and now that place is in complete chaos. Im sure that the Iraqi people would love to thank america from the bottom of their little hearts.

and why are we still there? why are we at more places now? why is gitmo still opened?

you guys will blame bush to the end of days, which is fine my me, but when you are doing the same and more, there is no one to blame but bush?

Response in bold.

Wickabee

08-23-2012, 10:43 AM

so him and his family killing people they don't like and killing for fun is ok and no threat.

and why are we still there? why are we at more places now? why is gitmo still opened?

you guys will blame bush to the end of days, which is fine my me, but when you are doing the same and more, there is no one to blame but bush?

Actually it was Cheney, but ultimately, veggie is right. Iraq wasn't your problem.

shrewsbury

08-23-2012, 11:49 AM

wickabee, again I agree with you, but i have to add neither was all the other places we have helped since Obama was in office.

Wickabee

08-23-2012, 11:53 AM

wickabee, again I agree with you, but i have to add neither was all the other places we have helped since Obama was in office.

There's a huge difference between helping with foreign aid and "helping" by turning a country into a war zone over oi...I mean non-existent WMDs.

mrveggieman

08-23-2012, 11:53 AM

wickabee, again I agree with you, but i have to add neither was all the other places we have helped since Obama was in office.

I'm not sure how you can consider illegally invading a foreign country, overthrowing their president and leaving that country in ruins and mass chaos as "help".

Wickabee

08-23-2012, 11:55 AM

I'm not sure how you can consider illegally invading a foreign country, overthrowing their president and leaving that country in ruins and mass chaos as "help".

To be fair, Saddam was a problem and I'm sure many Iraqis are happy he'd dead.
He just wasn't your problem.

JustAlex

08-23-2012, 05:32 PM

Why Christians listen to atheists who quote Scripture to them is beyond ironic, and beyond my comprehension. This Truth is for all, even those who reject God, His Son the Lord Jesus Christ, and the Word.
Then allow me to explain.

MANY atheists were once christians, like me.....we read the bible just like you and many other christians and we saw just how flawed it really is.

When I and any other atheist uses scripture it's because we want to show just how easy it is to make the bible say anything you want it to say.

There's a big reason why the Christian religion is splintered into HUNDREDS of denominations.....and that is that everyone has his/her own interpretation of the bible.

They're either ALL correct or no one is correct.

Ex-Christians such as myself have come to the realization that they are all incorrect.

To be perfectly honest with you and everyone else, I'm more Anti-religious than Anti-God......It wouldn't bother me if god was indeed real, however there is no way the bible or any other religion is real.

pspstatus

08-23-2012, 06:24 PM

To be perfectly honest with you and everyone else, I'm more Anti-religious than Anti-God......It wouldn't bother me if god was indeed real, however there is no way the bible or any other religion is real.

Feel exactly the same way. In fact I hope there is a God. That would answer so many questions. At this point I doubt it but I'm not completely close minded to the possibility. As far as organized religion goes, quite frankly I think it can be helpful but much too often it becomes dangerous.

Wickabee

08-23-2012, 06:30 PM

To be perfectly honest with you and everyone else, I'm more Anti-religious than Anti-God......It wouldn't bother me if god was indeed real, however there is no way the bible or any other religion is real.

I'd like to believe you alex, but you just described my exact feelings on the subject and you and I do not see eye to eye on a lot of things.

JustAlex

08-23-2012, 07:10 PM

Feel exactly the same way. In fact I hope there is a God. That would answer so many questions. At this point I doubt it but I'm not completely close minded to the possibility. As far as organized religion goes, quite frankly I think it can be helpful but much too often it becomes dangerous.
A god would in fact answer a lot of questions, but unfortunately it would bring up a lot more questions along with it.

For example who created God?

And of course once you ask that question it becomes into an infinite question....who created the creator of god and the creator of the creator and so on.

God has always been an easy way for humans to explain the inexplicable.

How did we get here?
How did everything form?
Why are things the way they are?

Well....."God did it".....how?, it doesn't matter he's god, he can do anything.

It's basically a magic genie that can do anything he pleases and doesn't require explanation.

I'd like to believe you alex, but you just described my exact feelings on the subject and you and I do not see eye to eye on a lot of things.
I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

After all, everyone has a different way to view everything, there are some things which we might share a similar thought and other things which we look at in extreme opposites.

To be fair, sometimes I don't properly explain my thoughts or they come out the wrong way and that leads to misunderstanding and unnecessary argument.

However, I think I have already shown that I'm not afraid to be wrong, nor does it hurt my ego to ask for forgiveness when I say something stupid or hurtful.

Tivo32

08-23-2012, 11:07 PM

A god would in fact answer a lot of questions, but unfortunately it would bring up a lot more questions along with it.

For example who created God?

And of course once you ask that question it becomes into an infinite question....who created the creator of god and the creator of the creator and so on.

God has always been an easy way for humans to explain the inexplicable.

How did we get here?
How did everything form?
Why are things the way they are?

Well....."God did it".....how?, it doesn't matter he's god, he can do anything.

It's basically a magic genie that can do anything he pleases and doesn't require explanation.

A Christian who has spent time honestly searching and studying the Bible can explain what they believe to be reasonable and creditable answers to those questions. Enough so that they place some faith and security in those answers.

JustAlex

08-23-2012, 11:29 PM

A Christian who has spent time honestly searching and studying the Bible can explain what they believe to be reasonable and creditable answers to those questions. Enough so that they place some faith and security in those answers.
Yes, I know, but at the end of the day, those "answers" are in actuality an interpretation.

BTW, the #1 response I get when I ask "Who created God?" is usually......God has always been, he has no creator, he is the beginning and the end.

Sorry, that's not a good answer....AT ALL!

If you want to say that (without any proof) then I can easily say....The Universe has always been, it had no creator, it is the beginning and the end.

Tivo32

08-23-2012, 11:35 PM

Yes, I know, but at the end of the day, those "answers" are in actuality an interpretation.

Fair enough. But they're still answers. It's a person trying to make sense of life given the framework and lens they view the world through, in this case Christianity and the Bible.

BTW, the #1 response I get when I ask "Who created God?" is usually......God has always been, he has no creator, he is the beginning and the end.

Sorry, that's not a good answer....AT ALL!

You may not like that answer or feel like it's a good answer, but that's the answer (at least the Christian answer).

If you want to say that (without any proof) then I can easily say....The Universe has always been, it had no creator, it is the beginning and the end.