If you know someone that collects cards and could use some sleeves, why not get them a Gift Certificate to PerfectFitSleeves.com, CLICK HERE

If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

habs, I know where you are coming from, but I will have to respectfully say no.

there is so much we do not know about the mind, body, and genetics, that it is possible for some or even most them to be born gay, I just don't see the need for nature to make someone purely homosexual. I would go for bisexual, but homosexuality does not fulfill the basics needs for a species to survive.

I could be wrong, and I don't mind being told I am, but if someone (not you) says they have genetic proof, where is it?

Add a little additional logic and reasoning in and see the flaw in your argument.

Being left-handed or right-handed is not an abnormality because regardless of which "handed" you are, you can still accomplish the primary function and goal of using your hand. You can still write, use a knife, throw a ball, brush your hair, button your shirt, etc.

Being straight or gay lacks that same "normal" argument because being straight, having a relationship and ultimately sexual contact has a primary goal of reproduction. Being gay prevents that primal accomplishment of reproduction.

I know someone will try to invoke the "But what if straight people don't want kids?" argument, and that is beside the point. I am speaking of the basic function. A hand, left or right, can perform the same basic tasks. A sexual choice, gay or straight, can not perform the same basic functions. Thus the comparison is flawed.

You seem to think that if humans can't reproduce something is off about them.

So I guess straight people who are infertile are abnormal, correct?

Because it doesn't matter who they are attracted to, even if they tried they CAN'T reproduce.

If you're talking about "basic function" of reproduction most gays (simply using statistics) DO have that, they just don't utilize it.....and nothing says that you should.

Now inevitably this will come down to someone saying that evolution says this and that. (And I see Shrew has already done that)

So let's address the evolution and gays.

First of all, I'm not a biology student, I'm not an expert on evolution, and therefore, whatever I say will be someone else's words, so instead of doing that, I will let the scientists speak on this matter:

I don't 100% agree with this, though. I do believe some gays, the vast minority, did choose to be gay. It just seems to me to be a little difficult to believe that not one single gay person made the choice to be gay. I will say though, that I feel it's equally ridiculous to think that all, the majority or even a thin minority made the choice. I do believe it's a very small percentage, but I'm pretty certain they're there.

If one can choose one way or another, I believe that person is bisexual.

And since bisexual CAN indeed go from one gender to another, then it's consistent that they might or do believe that they can "choose".

I believe that strictly gay or straight people can not choose.

Furthermore, I also believe in the "Spectrum of sexuality".

^In other words, One can be a "little gay" or "very gay" or a "little straight" and so on.

If you can choose one way or another, you are most likely at the middle of the spectrum.

[QUOTE]You seem to think that if humans can't reproduce something is off about them.[QUOTE]

no, you are. I am saying it is a choice, which there is nothing wrong with.
you are saying they are genetically encoded to be homosexual, I am saying, this would not be possible unless it was a genetic "mishap", nature would not wire us to be purely homosexual, or our species wouldn't last past a generation or two.

no, you are. I am saying it is a choice, which there is nothing wrong with.
you are saying they are genetically encoded to be homosexual, I am saying, this would not be possible unless it was a genetic "mishap", nature would not wire us to be purely homosexual, or our species wouldn't last past a generation or two.

What I believe is that we are born with a certain sexual preference which we can't control.

Some people are strictly gay or straight, some are bisexual, some are a little gay and so on.

You are fooling yourself if you think you can control who you are attracted to, because that's exactly what you're saying.

You're saying that strictly gay and straight people have chosen to be that way, when all the evidence points otherwise.

BTW, just so we are clear, evolution does NOT have an "end point".

IMO, many christians like to say that gays have chosen their sexual preference because they dare not believe that gays can possibly be born that way, this would mean that their god made them that way and since the bible is against homosexuality, there is a deep contradiction there.

They would have to conclude that either god is playing with these people, or that the bible is wrong about homosexuality.

Either way, it breaks down their system of control, their guidelines, it's like a robot trying to equate a paradox, it can't do it, it will self destruct.

Thankfully, I don't believe any gods exists, and if they do, they are certainly not the ones from religion because all religions contradict themselves one way or another.

I have never understood why so many people have convinced themselves that God cares about every single issue here on earth. Even when I was a devout Christian I understood that God loves us, but cares NOTHING about our lives here on earth. God doesn't care about Abortion, Gun Control, the US debt, Gay Marriage or weather your bills are paid on time. Those problems are all trivial to God. Life on earth is not fair, but God is just: That is what I was taught. For all those people who use religion to bashing on homosexuals are foolish. God says love all and that only GOD can judge us. People who use religion to discriminate are weak.

As far as being gay being a choice or not I really have no idea. Most lesbians I know are a lesbian for one reason, they hate men. I feel that all women have at least a mild physical attraction to one another since women are beautiful creatures. As shrew has said, weather its a choice or not it really shouldn't matter.

When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail."