cruzer... no? that would seriously not make any sense at all, because there is some entries with less than 10 "public votes".

probably we had a misunderstanding there because of my lame english :D back then i said public votes (regarding the compo ofcoz), because i thought its "public voting" when everyone at csdb can vote at any time during the compo, and ppl can see the votes (also the ones with no handle next to them) at any time during the competition.
that for me was another definition of public votes in a way.
i should have explained that better. lession learned

MYD will GTFO. I accidently "decided" to get on one of the strangest, fucked up, drunk trips last night instead of working on our release. Now - realizing I have to go to work in an hour - I know: I should have stayed at home :-)

In anticipation of [insert groupname here] being unfairly treated in this competition, Offence decided 4 weeks ago not to take part, as a gesture of sympathy and solidarity with those infringed upon. Stick it to the man!

nomistake: yep. no problem. i wanted to point out that we did not remove it, before someone else comes up with the next drama - that we would possibly have removed someones entry because we dont like them or whatever.

tbh i hope we can move on and bring this doty to a peaceful end now (sorry to those who would have liked the drama to be fuled more - i know - its always a good read)

In my opinion everyone should calm down & forget about the deadline drama no matter who is to blame, who said what, who is wronger than who else...

Axis & Yazoo are the orgas, they made a decision some approve of and some are mad about. I somehow can understand both and think both reactions including a little discussion here were foreseeable. Basta.

But is this really a reason for such negative vibrations or even a group's withdrawing their entry from the event? That makes me sad. :(

I don't mind the extended deadline at all and am looking forward for the new entries too! From the beginning I've considered DOTY as a big cooperation demo, rather than a competition. Thank you for the organizing efforts Yazoo and Axis!

When I saw the link to this compo for the first time, I went to the site and read all what is there. I read the statement about possible extension of the deadline, and I thought it is fair. After all, there is probably little to none compo which has never extended deadline, both in parties or online.

If it is the first time you are ever contributing to a compo, get used to it; compos generally, if not always, have deadline extensions for this or that reason. If you are the type "oh yeah, another compo, let's dive into making something, no need to read all this stuff in rules section now, I can look later", then it is certainly not the organizer's problem how you can fit dealing with the rules with your own life schedule.

What is really sad is, it is 2013, there is now almost a regular stream of these compos, which we did not have for many many years, and instead of people becoming happy about it, they are doing everything that can destroy this feeling, frustrate organizers and other contributors, as if they do not want any compo to take place ever anymore, just because they could not cope with the reality of compos.

Everyone has it's own preferences how to rate a demo. Some are looking for awesome code, others rate visual style and someone else votes it high because he just likes the music. I'd just like all of you voters to be fair from your point of view and keep personal antipathy aside, if there is.

I think it's okay when Yazoo increased the deadline, the reason is very simple, without enough parts it isn't a real compo...
second, i hate downvoting and i gave my own part just one point because some said selfvoting suxx, that's true...!
I can understood if Cruzer and Bitbreaker give only 3 points because both are top coders and there standard is much, much higher as my one for example...! Maybe it's boring somehow what the others did... Who knows...! So please Cruzer and Bitbreaker, give the votes the parts deserve...!

"and probably groepaz if i understood him right."
the only really negative thing is that chances are that you'll have to deal with watching my lame code although it didnt meet the deadline. its all your fault!!!!11111

A part with a dycp is something, it is there and it is. You are in every right to vote 3 on that cruzer and it is not a downvote. It is a vote of 3 of something that is easy to create and also for a coder of your status it must really be pretty lame.

For me i am a bit where i welcome all stuff made and almost the effort of doing something is worth some points in a way.

Hey newsflash... it is c64 and the year is 2013! Cool that people do stuff, just cool.

this is horrible - really... but in a few days i will be able to see all the positive comments (thanks for your guys support)
because when i have a closer look, the negative comments came almost only from delysid members and probably groepaz if i understood him right. it seems they think i want to steal their icecream personally and sell it to get rich with it.

i dont mind criticism (talking about this and the pm shitstorm) - but a little more moderate, with more social competence - and with being open to arguments (like that i said on the website that we would extend the deadline if anyone asks... april 13th... there was more than 2 weeks to complain about it)

whatever... now lets move on and try to make it as good as possible for the majority of the sceners supporting doty.

if you dont want to have a competition, then dont compete (with 7 entries there would not have been a compo at all)

and groepaz... it seems you read the text on the website, as you found something which doesnt make sense. so if you read it, you should also have been able to read the comment on the possibility of extending the deadline. so...
if you didnt - why is that my fault.

thanks to the participants for their good work. i hope these discussions dont take you down too much as all of you made a brilliant job!

yazoo: You made a big contribution with all this, sad as it is, the same really killed my efforts to do more for the scene also.. it is just not fun in this form! It is as if someone is sitting and waiting for others to do something just to break it all down... a wrong spelling and you are really going to get it in a way... fuck it... i make demos and hope that will remain fun for me...

You did just great on this, remember that and ignore all this... i struggeled a lot with beeing able to ignoring, really, had such a hard time the last months on that... but must just never try make anything for the scene again, it will just backfire and be all bad for me! I even had plans to arrange a big party with compos and prize money and all, were already talking to a sponsor for that, but i killed these plans around pixmas.

A big hello master of coolness to the ones with thicker skin than me that can cope with that... burglar and frantic and so on... I would have died of all the posts about how and that and bad and so... really, i would have died!

If you'd all just put the time into a release instead of all this whining, then we'd have 20 entries before the deadline. Also, i vote myself always with ten, because i'm good. Cope with it.
So don't make others responsible for it if you suck.

groepaz: there will probably not be a next time... there was too much work done (invitation, website, final release, whatever...) to be motivated doing this another time after all this FU PM-shitstorm whatevercomplains. if there are rules or other text which doesnt make sense as you have pointed out (which ofcoz is possible) it would be cool to say so before in a moderate way, instead of all this bashing.

"Is it everybodys consense to vote the own release with 10?"
now you know why the X results are like that =)

"i repeat: when we have extended the deadline, there were only 7 entries. and that way the whole competition idea did not make much sense. it starts to make sense with a minimum of 11 entries (we have 10 atm)."

sure, lets see.... "YOUR PART MUST NOT HAVE BEEN RELEASED TO PUBLIC BEFORE THE DEADLINE"
i am sorry to say, but unless you are sitting on even more, you dont have all those entries =)

and yes, FU. extending the deadline destroyed my excuse to be lazy. RAGE

(i recommend more well thought out rules next time, and keep in mind that what works on parties doesnt necessarily have to work online)

the trouble with csdb, one try to contribute but you just get much hassle and shit in return... Yazoo, you have this compo on here and thank you for that, it is the contribution and dedication from people like you that make things happen. You should just get great feedback here... Hipp hipp hurray for you!

Hard discussions here....
I can understand both sides...
I can understand the people who contributed there part in time and i can understand Yazoo...
But because Yazoo is the organizer, he can change the rulez as he want...

yep. plz check the old statement regarding the rules (especially blocks size, but also about extending the deadline) which i made april 13th as a reply to cargos request.
just scroll down here a little bit, and check the statement on the website
there i said that if someone asks to extend the deadline, that would be possible if that person sends a preview of an already started part.
this decision did not come out of the blue for those who call us unfair now... probably they didnt read the statement - ok. but what can i do

also check my reply from april 28 to the dr. j when he asked if its really the final deadline (scroll down)

unfortunately the request for extending the deadline came a little late.
still i think some people should not shitstorm me via csdb pm.

we would ofcoz also have extended the deadline for dr. j. who spent 3 nights without sleep (thanks for your hard work and contribution) or anyone else

It's been common practice in a lot of other CSDB based compos that the deadline could be extended if you sent a preview and asked for it. And it's been mentioned for this compo as well a long time ago. So it shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone.

@Burglar: so now i feel a bit stupid coz i didn't slept 3 days trying to finish to the deadline . its okey to extend for a few hours i am not extreme and non compromise person but c'mon it coming ridiculous when the website mentioned the strict rules . maybe it shouldn't be a "competition" from the first place and thats all . i gave my 2 cents for the issue

it's not about drama - it's about fair play!
and both of you have lost your credibility. everytime one of you says "deadline" now, people will think "yeah, sure - we get another week after that anyway"

did fairlight get another WEEK just before the official deadline? i don't think so.

if theres a chance to make this a success, i as the organizer tend to do what it takes to make it a success if theres the chance.

the initial idea is to make it a competition where ppl do their very best to get into the top10 parts.

and now theres the chance to have more parts and make the doty compo what it was supposed to be. really, if this would be you organizing the competition i wouldnt be sure that you would not have made the same decision.

i now will not try to defend myself any more. i have made clear my point of view (and the one of axis, as we talked about it)... and i see that also lots of ppl agree that it is a good decision to extend the deadline.

so, some are not happy with the extending (which i somehow understand)... but theres also ppl who like it, as it will bring on more nice parts. those would be less happy if we'd stick to the original deadline.

btw... i think at x-party as an example fairlight+offence did not make it to the official deadline, and they got the chance to finish their production anyways.
would you really have prefered the organizers to stick to exactly the original deadline and not have their demo in the compo? seriously?

also laxity would have to be disqualified in the doty compo, as they uploaded their part a little too late after the original deadline which was yesterday 21:00 cet.
to me its really not a problem, but it should be to you - then.

i think i gave my 2 cents about all this. and i see that some ppl dont agree - but we gotta live with it now. its not that i dont care about the complains, but the decision - be it good or no good has been made.

"sorry again, but we only try to make this what it was supposed to be. a competition"

I think that a competition has rules for a good reason. If you change it coz some people had no time to release something, the other people which where in time before deadline has now a prejudice. Thats not what it means to have rules at all.

I am sorry but i will not polish anything , you can polish forever any part you released in your life , its a matter of a group release . i am happy with our release and proud of it , i am not a big fan of voting systems but i do accept the majority and ofcourse the rules of the competition , right now i am unhappy with the extension and i try to be delicate

i have to add: its called DOTY competition (competition!) - so this seemed the only way to bring a little competition into it.
i repeat: when we have extended the deadline, there were only 7 entries. and that way the whole competition idea did not make much sense. it starts to make sense with a minimum of 11 entries (we have 10 atm).

sorry again, but we only try to make this what it was supposed to be. a competition

I'm all for extending deadlines, as in the end the final product will be better and the only thing that matters. And what Jackasser said, just use the extra time to brush up already-submitted stuff some more.

i think we said before, that if someone asks to extend the deadline a little, thats not a drama. so i dont really get whats wrong now.

probably because it was bob / censor asking, and axis and me are also in censor? dunno...

i can tell, that also slammer / camelot asked for extending the deadline a little, and he sent an almost finished preview to prove that he will come up with something.
so it wasnt just our groupmate bob asking for that.

really - what is this all about? why not just give them the chance to be part of doty.

the plan was to have a little competition for making it on the disk... and the decision about extending the deadline was made, when there was only 7 parts in the compo (alphaflight and laxity have uploaded after that).

lots of ppl have promised to make a part, but they didnt deliver (you know who you are :-) ) so... this seemed to be the only way to make it a success and make sure there is a little competition to make it on the disk

so whats really wrong to try get at least 10+ parts into the compo? especially when we know there are going to be minimum two more?

i feel sorry for those who are pissed off now, but it shouldnt be a big drama in my opinion.

yeah, just extend the deadline until you (axis/yazoo) are satisfied with the entries. while you are at it: how about changing some other rules, too? it would not hurt the people who already delivered their stuff for sure. everyone must be really happy about some other guys getting extra time if they want it. just in case you didn't get it: i was being sarcastic. and just like groepaz said: FU!

I support the extended deadline, dont think it changes anything appart from having more entries. would the chorus demo have more plots, or would cruzer have bigger amplitude if they had more time? dont think so.

Even if extended deadline might be enough to finish our entry I get the point of Dr.j and Reject. I'm not a big fan of deadline extending myself. On the other hand: most of us have deadline problems because of real life issues and therefore I don't really think that the ones who deliver (too) late are having a real advantage over the others.

I am sorry guyz i respect very much Bob/Censor and all the ppl who want to deliver their entry after 28th , but extending the deadline in the last day of the competition seems unfair from my point of view.

ok .. sorry to interrupt the whole compo...
but due to our circumstances with a newly released demo, we have decided to take "one of the parts from Comming Wonderland 12 as a Teaser" I here request to extend the deadline, I have sent the preview to Yazoo... for vieweing... but I am fucking exhausted to finnish it up today :( ... propably need to crunch the memory aswell :( a bit more...
loaders and stuff ... uuuhhh... need the extra time :)

7 entries, not bad. Glad to see this turned out to be a moderate success after all. Still hope there's at least 4 more that are waiting until the final minute, so there will actually be some competition for getting on the disk. :)

Dr.j: - yep - today at 21:00 (well, if someone uploads a few minutes later it doesnt hurt too much) is the final deadline - unless someone sends a preview via mail and asks officially if it could be extended by a very few days. as no one did that so far, i guess everyone can finish his part in time :)

I'm fighting the size limit as well. I'll probably be able to make it, but I'll have to use some more time than if I had e.g. 80 blocks at my disposal. So if it looks like there won't even be 10 entries, maybe it would be worth reconsidering?

cruzer: what...? the whole demo Frighthof took us 3 weeks to make from the scratch ;-)

hehe... ok, you are right. but i did at least expect one or two parts on a mediocre level. but still this can turn out nice for sure. just wanted to comment on this to remind ppl to start with something :)

Awesome, it's 20 years since I tried to bring it back: Demo of the Year 1993 Invitation
But then it had to be cancelled due to the lack of contributions, hopefully it will be more successful this time! :)

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