BMDB data

John Turnbull was born cir. Dec 1817 Haithwaite Gate, Par. of Nichol Forest, CUL, ENG, (place as Hathwat Gate.)2 He was christened on 24 Dec 1817 Nichol Forest, CUL, ENG; the entry showing that Robert and Eleanor were living at Hathwat (sic) Gate.2 John Turnbull married Isabella Martin, daughter of Gilbert Martin, on 5 Dec 1844 St Cuthbert, Carlisle, CUL, ENG, cert shows that: John was a book keeper resid. Liverpool, s/o Robert Turnbull, joiner; Isabella was resid. Blackfriars St, d/o Gilbert Martin, builder; John and Isabella were both of full age and signed their names, married by license by Benjn Ward, wit: Thos Nanson (?Hanson) and Margaret Martin.4,5,6,7 John Turnbull died on 26 Jun 1885 Whiteclose Gate, nr Carlisle, CUL, ENG; his h/stone agreeing his age (67) but the St Cath's dth index showing him as 66.1,8,9,3 He was buried with Isabella Turnbull at the Richardson St Cem., Carlisle, CUL, ENG, the h/stone reading: John Turnbull who died at Whiteclose Gate near Carlisle 26 Jun 1885 aged 67, late of Prospect Place, Stanwix. Also of Isabella his wife who died at Carleton Villa, Stanwix Nov 10th 1899 advanced in years and Ellen their daughter died at Cambrian Villa, Stanwix, Aug 10th 1903 and John their son who died at Cambrian Villa, Stanwix, Feb 21st 1913 aged 53; Burial index adds Ellen d 13.8.1903, Isabella 10.9.1899, John 26.6 1885, John 21.2.1913, Ellen's looking like a burial date instead.1,9

Well, yet another of the Turnbull sons found. For the last 3 yrs Rose and I have been intermittantly corresponding to see if we could solve the mystery of her John's parentage. With children named Robert and Ellen and both a Carlisle and London connection, he "felt" to me that he should be the John, brother to my 2x greats, James, sons of Robert and Eleanor of Nichol Forest, Cumberland. Proof however was elusive, and Rose's John rather economical with the truth when it came to where and when he was born. The first known date/place (c 1818, Arthuret) was from his age at his dth in Carlisle, which was close enough to a Dec 1817 baptism in Nichol Forest. Subsequent census information proved both hard to find, and contradictory. He was eventually found in all census records 1851 to 1881, and these resulted in birth dates/places as varied as: c. 1823 England (1881 when he was in Scotland); c. 1823 Scotland (1861 census when he was in England); c. 1821 Nicol Forest (from 1851); and c 1818 again (1871 census). Combining all of these with his marriage cert, again eventually found, did indeed prove he was the son of Robert Turnbull, joiner.Which id was subsequently confirmed when Bridget found and sent me the 1891 obit of James, published in the Carlisle Patriot, copying Huirangi (NZ) papers, and adding "Mr Turnbull was a native of Haithwaitegate near this city and brother of the late Mr John Turnbull of White Close Gate."10,8,5,11,12,13,14,4,3

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.. we were trained to meet any new situation by reorganising; and a wonderful method it can be for creating the illuson of progress

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The time we have at our disposal every day is elastic; the passions that we feel expand it, those that we inspire contract it; and habit fills up what remains

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So just as it is not the desire to become famous but the habit of being laborious that enables us to produce a finished work, so it is not the activity of the present moment but wise reflexions from the past that help us to safeguard the future

— Proust "Within the Budding Grove"

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