Idoit40fans wrote:I can't imagine that he or either of the above players mentioned would be the best skater if they were playing against ex college and junior players, unless they were like 15 years removed from playing college/junior.

you would think but what it really shows is how good elite level (and anybody in the NHL IS elite level) athletes are. ex-college and junior players are REALLY good but anybody who gets to the NHL level, even if they're just a fighter or enforcer is going to be even better. until you play with those people, and I've had the good fortune of playing with some former pros, ECHL and NHL you don't really realize how far above they are from the average beer league player.

Is it a confidence thing then? How can someone go from barely able to skate to outskating other players? That does not compute. I assume they are more skilled than the average player, but I know that i've played with kids that are better skaters(undeniably faster) than pros.

any kid that's as fast as an NHLer is likely being scouted already. I know they seem really fast but most kids will never come close to being good enough skaters for the NHL. it makes me wonder how absolutely incredible players like Sid, Geno, Datsyuk, etc are.

no name wrote:THis really shows that the goon position if going by the way side. The role of fighter or protector will always be needed but one guy who only does that seems like it is out of the NHL. I think players like Asham, Avery, Rupp and a few others who can play a 4th line position effectively and fight are what teams are looking for. The Godards, McIntyre Domis of the league are not seem very often. Can anyone even name a full time goon that is still employed? i knwo there are still two or three left in the league. Gillies? after hsi suspension i havn't seen much of him.

Domi could throw and play, although there's a debate as to how cheap he was that can be had in another thread. Domi had one season where he was 4th in goals (2002-03, 15 goals) and was one goal away from tying Nik Antropov for third on the team.

One season of 15 goals might be a fluke, but he also scored 10 goals and 20 points three times while in Toronto.

Idoit40fans wrote:I can't imagine that he or either of the above players mentioned would be the best skater if they were playing against ex college and junior players, unless they were like 15 years removed from playing college/junior.

you would think but what it really shows is how good elite level (and anybody in the NHL IS elite level) athletes are. ex-college and junior players are REALLY good but anybody who gets to the NHL level, even if they're just a fighter or enforcer is going to be even better. until you play with those people, and I've had the good fortune of playing with some former pros, ECHL and NHL you don't really realize how far above they are from the average beer league player.

Somebody posted on here a few years ago that they played a pickup game against Jay Caufield. Even in his late 40s, Caufield was still blowing past beer leaguers like they were standing still and Caufield wasn't exactly known for his skating while in the NHL.

I hate the position of Enforcer-with-no-other-means-to-contribute as much as anyone. That said, while the position existed, Mr. Godard fulfilled the role as well as anyone we've had in a Penguins sweater.

Dickie Dunn wrote:Billy Tibbetts played in a summer league at Bethel Park Bladerunners years ago. He dominated (and got thrown out of the league).

Tibbetts is a rare breed. He essentially started his pro career in Johnstown with the Chiefs of the ECHL back in 95-96. In 58 games, he had 68 points and 300 PIMs and was a central player in a huge locker room divide that, if I recall correctly, resulted in a goalie losing a toe after having it stepped on by a player. Anyway, back on topic. Tibbetts wasn't brought up as a fighter the way a lot of guys are/were. Instead, he was a very skilled hothead who let his temper get in the way of his skill. I truly believe if he wasn't such a loose cannon he would have been a legit NHL second or third liner.