By submitting this Internet-Draft, each author represents that any
applicable patent or other IPR claims of which he or she is aware
have been or will be disclosed, and any of which he or she becomes
aware will be disclosed, in accordance with Section 6 of BCP 79.

Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering
Task Force (IETF), its areas, and its working groups. Note that
other groups may also distribute working documents as Internet-
Drafts.

Internet-Drafts are draft documents valid for a maximum of six months
and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other documents at any
time. It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts as reference
material or to cite them other than as "work in progress."

Additional security concerns with Teredo are documented, beyond what
is in RFC 4380. This is based on an independent analysis of Teredo's
security implications. The primary intent of this document is to
raise the awareness regarding the security issues in Teredo as
deployed today.

Simon of the Playa wrote:it's the chinese AIIZ, it's ALWAYS the chinese.

they know you know they know you know.

i only use Commodore 2000 original hardware so i never get touched.

My Atari has better games. Kick ass in donkey Kong.

And didn't you mean Cheese. Not chinese, it's always the Cheese!

I gotta wang here..

A new chapter seems to be opening in the saga of the Wang VS! A New VS that runs independently of the legacy VS hardware is on the road to release. It uses Dell PowerEdge servers and Linux to provide an environment that is 100% binary compatible with the VS. It IPLs and runs the VS OS and all presently supported VS software. Software dependent on obsolete or rare I/O devices may not be supported. The New VS requires licensed software from TransVirtual Systems and Getronics (Wang). A joint announcement is working its way through Getronics corporate PR and is expected to be made public Real Soon Nowâ„¢.

In addition, recent contact attempts by The Unofficial Wang VS Information Center and by TransVirtual Systems seem to reveal the existence of far more off-maintenance VS sites than heretofore suspected. The population of surviving VS sites may be TWICE what had been previously estimated.

Dork wrote:As far as upgrading or changing to a new type of forum goes, here's how I see it.

The process of upgrading would be a pain in the ass. I have somewhat limited access to the servers. Enough to run queries on the phpbb database and modify files within the current eplaya directory but that's it. I'd want to be able to create a new db/directory to play around in and do a test run. Maybe even give users a chance to look at and make comments. Trying to get additional access to BM servers is usually a big hassle and takes a long time with many iterations.

Those who love the new software will pat me on the back then tell me what else I should be doing with it. Those who hate the new software will piss and moan, and tell me what I should do to fix it. Many of the suggestions from these groups will be rather difficult to implement and/or contradict with each other. I'll inevitably piss some people off by not implementing their suggestion, or not doing it properly, or doing it too slowly. Some will bitch and ask for the old stuff back. Most won't care either way.

In the end, we'd have a site that looks a little more modern and has a few new features that won't necessarily make the forum any more useful or generate any more traffic.

So I weigh the almost certain large pain in my ass of upgrading versus the occasional whine about things being out of date and it's an easy decision.

As I've said before, if anyone would like to step up and take over the reigns and can make it through the vetting process (which means you haven't royally pissed off anyone in the org yet and are patient enough to wait months for things to go through) I'd be happy to help you through the process.

You can please all of the people some of the time, some of the people all of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time. Seems like these words must have been first coined by a software developer!

I say upgrade the forum to what you consider the latest and greatest and then delete all your contact information!

JK

JK

JKhttp://www.mudskippercafe.comWhen I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle.Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me

Apollonaris Zeus wrote:don't spend any of your unpaid time to improve the forum. If you're on the payroll that's fine, if not screw it!

well, thats not really the payment, and this is besides the point, but the best volunteers take payment with the feeling of positively contributing something they believe in and feel good about helping. (right now that includes antim)

but dork, you have done more than enough to sweat over things. you fixed the major problems that were effecting this board and yet you continue to help out with other things. this place owes you, not the other way around, so i really hope you dont ever feel that way.

most people who know your contributions really apprecite it, most simply dont know.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not stressed out. Other than the occasional user freakout this is a pretty easy job.

I'm glad to hear Wang is still around! My dad worked for them back in the day. I was too young to really understand what he was doing for them but I remember seeing huge stacks of 3-ring binders full of documentation of some sort with WANG written on them. I wish I could have saved a few.

convince the org they need to replace a bunch of network cards, load a bunch of software patch modules, and reflash firmware on network equiptment to solve a phpbb spamming problem that has already been easily fixed by one person loading some phpbb modules.

i will provide you with the phone number of cameragrl (the current paid tech lead of the org), cat (the current sysadmin lead), their co-located hosting and connection service provider, and will hunt down and give you the net admin contact. they will drop previous negative attitudes had of you, and be able to directly talk despite the first two mentioned they want to avoid anything to do with you.

really, its not anyones problem on eplaya because others simply dont listen to you. so move on and stop rambling here, or try and get actively involved with them.

spectabillis wrote:convince the org they need to replace a bunch of network cards, load a bunch of software patch modules, and reflash firmware on network equiptment to solve a phpbb spamming problem that has already been easily fixed by one person loading some phpbb modules.

i will provide you with the phone number of cameragrl (the current paid tech lead of the org), cat (the current sysadmin lead), their co-located hosting and connection service provider, and will hunt down and give you the net admin contact. they will drop previous negative attitudes had of you, and be able to directly talk despite the first two mentioned they want to avoid anything to do with you.

really, its not anyones problem on eplaya because others simply dont listen to you. so move on and stop rambling here, or try and get actively involved with them.

Have a seat and relax. I already have Cameragrl's number and email addy. She knows me and quite well thank you very much. She has never doubted me. (and she is pretty hot too. Great programmer.)
I like the way I help out the webteam just as I do.
And, nope you still dont know what you are talking about when it comes to IPV6. You do not need to change anything and you DEFINITELY dont need to change any nics.
Where are you getting your info from cause it is totally wrong.

Post a link and or stop while you're ahead. You're embarrassing yourself.

yes, ipv6 is greatly helpful and would definately being deployed by the org. the problem is using this site as the reason to do it, because ITS NOT NEEDED FOR THAT REASON ya fucking dipshit.

and since you dont get this i will explain the hardware problem in yet a different way, again, in order to break past your lack of understanding. on servers, there is the network card that connects the server to the network. the operating system talks through the network through that card, by using a software driver to do it. much of the org hardware uses software drivers that only support ipv4, not ipv6, so you have to update them with new drivers. but since they are older network cards, the companies that made them dont release new drivers because they sell new cards and drivers that support ipv6 instead. so the org has to replace the cards, update patches to the os that includes the new drivers. now thats not all the hardware, but it is a good enough portion to make it unattractive. and sure, some routers/switches have firmware releases that will let people migrate from ipv4 to ipv6, but once again, not all companies have the updated firmware to support that migration so you run into the same problem.

if you want to help, rather than blathering on and on about it here (which is annoying to the people that matter since you wont stfu about it) then volunteer your services to audit the org infractructure while accessing thier maintenance contracts to find what they support (if they even have a support contract, which on a lot of hardware they dont). then find if the hardware companies have the needed updates and document what and where they are for the net and server admins to obtain them. THEN, for those items that dont have the needed means to support ipv6 you will need to document a new enterprise-wide configuration that works around those elements, along with a cost statement of the stuff they need to buy as replacements for a progressive ipv6 support roadmap. add to all this the need to verify and support what they colocation facility provider has and will support.

but yes, i not only read most of the info, but i read the initial ipv6 rfp's way-back-when it was first proposed and its nothing new. i had to do that for a statement of support that we submit to our telecom customers, as well as following up with our developers to scope out programming effort needed for some software agents to support it. and yes, i had explained all of this bmorg stuff to you before, because of the insistance of clogging up just about every technical discussion with it, i even just looked over your cite request to realize you seem to have developed an almost ipv6 ocd condition.

so i guess you didnt read the writing on the wall, which seems to be different that whats given to you to your face, since there are obviously two different things being told to you and everyone else...

... grow up. make those mature decisions needed to overcome your history, and get actively involved to make a difference rather than complaining about it here. this will be my last post for now despite knowing that your going to continue a bunch of other false accusations and innuendos, but i will probably have to repeat it again in a few months when you forget it all.

jkisha wrote:Did you guys ever date? You both sound like lovers scorned. Now stop it, both of you!

JK

Look at the posts right above yours..

In one he baits looking for a response.. 3 mins later he posts again about the lack of response.

While I have no personal grudges to hold against anyone it is kind of annoying seeing this go on for soo many years. This is the sort of infighting that makes us all look bad. This goes wayy beyond the occasional blowup that dies down amongst users within a few days.

Toolmaker wrote:While I have no personal grudges to hold against anyone it is kind of annoying seeing this go on for soo many years. This is the sort of infighting that makes us all look bad. This goes wayy beyond the occasional blowup that dies down amongst users within a few days..

unfortunately thats very true - petty and infantile true. the eplaya administrative decision was made long ago by org senior staff to simply avoid the permanent banning or explicit exclusion of individuals, due to the general beliefs based on the ten principals.

this naturally gave rise to an acceptance atmosphere of some seriously antisocial behavior, which plagues not only this board, but is symptomatic to certain areas of burningman as a community. we have all heard and seen the drama in various forms throughout different groups, but places like tribe and eplaya are the worst examples because they provide both a public audience, and a forum that can actually encourage this behavior because it quickly attracts others prone to the same tendencies.

its been one of the biggest lessons in what not to do that i document in online social networking.

I always get a laugh out of the "sky is falling" (my computer is being hacked) threads. Usually it winds up being a standard message from a webserver about a file being missing or something.

spectabillis wrote:

Toolmaker wrote:While I have no personal grudges to hold against anyone it is kind of annoying seeing this go on for soo many years. This is the sort of infighting that makes us all look bad. This goes wayy beyond the occasional blowup that dies down amongst users within a few days..

unfortunately thats very true - petty and infantile true. the eplaya administrative decision was made long ago by org senior staff to simply avoid the permanent banning or explicit exclusion of individuals, due to the general beliefs based on the ten principals.

this naturally gave rise to an acceptance atmosphere of some seriously antisocial behavior, which plagues not only this board, but is symptomatic to certain areas of burningman as a community. we have all heard and seen the drama in various forms throughout different groups, but places like tribe and eplaya are the worst examples because they provide both a public audience, and a forum that can actually encourage this behavior because it quickly attracts others prone to the same tendencies.

its been one of the biggest lessons in what not to do that i document in online social networking.

Certainly a test of the radical inclusion principle. Why it needs to be tested in such ways I doubt I will ever know. But I always wind up making mental connection to censorship arguements and coming up with the same conclusion. If ya don't like it dont read it. We have the ignore feature for users that choose not to be bothered.. I recall in the past some folks were actually curious as to how many people were ignoring them. Rather than try to be more civil which makes a hell of a lot more sense.

Ya gotta have a thick skin to hang on eplaya.. I'm just glad the actual playa is alot different.

Toolmaker wrote:Certainly a test of the radical inclusion principle. Why it needs to be tested in such ways I doubt I will ever know. But I always wind up making mental connection to censorship arguements and coming up with the same conclusion. If ya don't like it dont read it. We have the ignore feature for users that choose not to be bothered.. I recall in the past some folks were actually curious as to how many people were ignoring them. Rather than try to be more civil which makes a hell of a lot more sense.

there were some interesting influences at work, and in retrospect i am guilty of falling into the same trap at times. one was the experimental nature of burningman and the belief that alternative social means could be found and developed to mitigate interpersonal differences that gives rise to conflicts. this was largely the motivation behind the early incantation of the rangers and independant collectives like sanctuary, and attempted to use those as a model on the eplaya.

yes, absolutely, one of the primary goals was to enable people to freely apply a community approach to self-moderation, which is why there were built-in tendencies for the whole moderation intervention role to be only a temporary measure that could improve the general state of the board back to a self-moderating site. it was my blind belief that the community could still sustain that ability, mostly due to the number of incredibly talented people that made a significant portion of the community. the failure of that was - that ratio has greatly dropped as those people found it easier and more beneficial to simply leave.

. I'm just glad the actual playa is alot different.

thats the difference, but its not complete. in general, face-to-face social encounters have the benefits of other communications like facial cues and body language. conflicts and drama still continues at the event, but its far more open to reorganization and exclusion where people have the added freedom to associate and collect apart from the whole, which you cant do when all clustered together on a board based on phpbb. note that tribe is different with distributed groups, but the main consolidation point of the burningman tribe is plagued with the same antisocial problems.

if you dont like it, they dont act like one by repeatedly posting ignorant shit and ignoring good advise of others who point things out to you that would greatly benefit what you want to achieve.

in the absence of outright banning people, which should have been done to you long ago because you lack the ability of change, its not others responsibility to parent you - its your responsibility to handle yourself. so as long as you act like an ignorant problem child, you will naturally be treated as one,

Valid arguments are one thing. AZII and I disagree on IPV6 but dont call each other names.
Not only that, it was not me that brought up the IPV6 topic first.
Believe it or not AZII makes better sense than Spec.
At least he somewhat knows what he is talking about.
This Spec thing is something else.
I have no chip, and anyone that is interested in IPV6, I am more than happy to oblige, but there is no reason to be rude.
Either one knows what they are talking about and can do it civil or they cant.

It's that simple. Spec has been pretty obnoxious.

Not only that, Spec would never dare speak to me that way in person for several reasons.
One, I'm a nice guy and second, I'm a pretty big fuckin dude.
So if he feels the need to get ridiculous on the net, great.
Otherwise.....................