A Look at the Frost DK Changes So Far on the 8.2 Rise of Azshara PTR

This article will discuss the recent changes made to the Frost Death Knight on the 8.2 Rise of Azshara PTR and will cover both the current iteration of Frost, how each change impacts Frost DK, as well as discussing the value of the PTR changes to Runic Empowerment, Frost Fever and Breath of Sindragosa.\r\rThis article was written by Bicepspumps, our Frost DK guide writer. \r\rAbout the Author\r\r \r\rI'm Bicepspump, a semi-hardcore player currently playing on Kazzak. You can often find me on the Death Knight discord discussing rotations and builds, on my stream (B1cepspump), running some juicy Mythic +, or on my youtube channel where I've started doing video guides. Big shoutout to everyone on the Acherus discord that have given me valuable insight through numerous discussions. I take part in writing and optimizing the action priority list for SimulationCraft and continuously test different hypotheses using the SimulationCraft program. Furthermore, I work with the WoWAnalyzer website where I develop modules for the Death Knight specs. Please feel free to contact me on Discord as Bicepspump#6318, I'm always happy to have a healthy discussion! Outside of playing WoW, I study for a Master of Physics at the University of Oxford. I also enjoy playing Dota 2 and rowing. \r\r\r\rIntroduction\r\rBefore we get started with discussing and analyzing, let's look at what they actually are:\r\r\rWe have a few more class changes coming to the Rise of Azshara PTR. We made the initial changes and the following will be active on the PTR soon.Frost Death Knight\r\rPotenciación rúnica has a 2.0% chance to proc per Runic Power spent (from 1.5%)\rFiebre de Escarcha's chance to generate Runic Power increased to 30%\r \r Chance now diminishes on targets beyond the first\r \rAliento de Sindragosa now has a 50% increased chance to proc Potenciación rúnica\rAliento de Sindragosa costs 18 Runic Power\/sec (from 15)\r \r Developers' Note: Frost was starved of resources too often, especially when using Aliento de Sindragosa. This increases Frosts's Rune income baseline and includes a further change that returns many extra Runes while using Aliento de Sindragosa. Aliento builds will now be able to fill more global cooldowns with casts of Asolar, to make up for the lost Golpe de Escarchas. The cost of Aliento itself is increased to keep its overall duration roughly unchanged.\r \r\r\rCurrent Frost Death Knight Issues\r\rTo understand the impact of these changes, we first need to understand the current state of the Frost Death Knight. In the absolute majority of instances, players tend to choose the Aliento de Sindragosa talent in the final row. It outperforms the other two talents in terms of damage in pretty much all situations. However, it also brings with it large periods of downtime that has now plagued the spec throughout Battle for Azeroth.\r\rFrost used to be a fast-paced and proc-based spec. Now it ranks bottom amongst all classes in terms of Actions Per Minute (36) and experiences empty GCDs that occupy 30% (86.7 seconds) of time spent fighting. The below graphs are based on a 5-minute fight.\r\r\r\rWe can further break down this downtime into its components. We gain 42 seconds of downtime from pooling resources for Aliento de Sindragosa (we define the pooling period as the 20 seconds leading up to the use of Aliento de Sindragosa). We want to save up 80 Runic Power, as well as having 3 Runes active before we enter the Aliento de Sindragosa window. This can result in periods of up to 10 seconds of simply sitting there, waiting for your Runes to recharge. We gain 18 seconds of downtime from inside our Aliento de Sindragosa windows. We don't always want to spam Asolar, and we don't have resources to do so at the end of the Aliento de Sindragosa. Finally, we gain 27 seconds of downtime outside of the previously mentioned scenarios, simply from not having enough resources available. It's not uncommon to face periods of 4-6 seconds where you have less than 25 Runic Power (thus rendering you unable to use Golpe de Escarcha) and 1 or fewer Runes available (preventing you from using Asolar). This is largely due to the fact that Aliento de Sindragosa leaves you completely dry of resources once it finishes. You pretty much have 0 Runes and 0 Runic Power to play with. Due to our low resource generation, you then get stuck in this state until it's time to pool again. You pretty much never make it higher than 25 Runic Power or 2 Runes.\r\r\r\rImpact of Changes\r\rWe're now ready to discuss the changes in great detail. Let's start with the change to Potenciación rúnica.\r\rPotenciación rúnica has a 2.0% chance to proc per Runic Power spent (from 1.5%).\r\rThis change effectively introduces more resources in our rotation. Golpe de Escarcha now has a 50% of proccing Potenciación rúnica!. This change alone would reduce downtime by 14%, cutting off seconds in all three categories above (roughly 8 seconds from pooling, 4 seconds from Breath and 8 seconds from other). This change is nice on its own but still doesn't really fix the issues we have. Furthermore, it causes builds involving Desintegración to have too many resources (due to the extra Runes you gain from it).\r\rFiebre de Escarcha's chance to generate Runic Power increased to 30%.\rChance now diminishes on targets beyond the first.\r\rA change most likely made to bring resource generation in AoE and Single Target more in line. Previously, adding multiple targets would significantly increase the amount of Runic Power your Fiebre de Escarcha would generate (80% more on two targets, 144% more on three targets and 236% more on five targets). It's currently unclear how the diminishing return exactly works, but it's certain that it will make Single Target generation closer to what you can expect in AoE scenarios. This is a healthy change to the spec, making it so that you don't gain too much duration from fighting multiple targets. Furthermore, it provides more resources in Single Target, further reducing our downtime (only by 2.7%).\r\r\rAliento de Sindragosa now has 50% increased chance to proc Potenciación rúnica\rAliento de Sindragosa costs 18 Runic Power\/sec (from 15)\r\r\rThese are some interesting changes that alter the proc chance of Potenciación rúnica specifically for Aliento de Sindragosa as well as increasing the cost of Aliento de Sindragosa. You now have a whopping 54% chance of generating a Rune every time Aliento de Sindragosa ticks (22.5% on live). These changes keep the duration of Aliento de Sindragosa roughly the same but require you to use a larger amount of Asolars to keep it up! Due to the heavy drain, you are almost GCD-locked in spamming Asolars throughout the duration. A side effect of this is that there isn't room to use other GCD abilities. For instance, using procs of Helada blanca when below 50 Runic Power almost immediately drops your Aliento de Sindragosa. This also includes Corazón frío and Furia de la vermis de escarcha which you want to use at the end of Pilar de Escarcha. However, since you're relatively late into your Aliento de Sindragosa at that point, most likely low on Runic Power, you can't really afford them!\r\rThe downtime of Breath does decrease, being reduced by 70%. However, the ability is rendered very one dimensional since you end up simply spamming Asolar for 20-30 seconds. It feels bad to not be able to use your procs of Helada blanca, as well as not being able to use Corazón frío and Furia de la vermis de escarcha when their damage is buffed the most.\r\r\r\rConclusions\r\rOverall, the changes on the PTR reduce the total downtime for the Frost Death Knight, specifically during your Aliento de Sindragosa window. There is a total of 23 seconds less in downtime (27% reduction) of which 10 seconds are shaved off in the pooling phase, 12 seconds in the breath window and 1 second elsewhere. They, unfortunately, make Aliento de Sindragosa all about spamming Asolar, not leaving time to use any other spell. They do reduce the downtime when pooling but does not remove the clunkiness and huge empty GCDs in the rotation.\r\rThe changes are a step in the right direction, but they don't target the real issue with the Frost Death Knight. Aliento de Sindragosa drains too many resources from our rotation, creating huge amounts of downtime when it's not active. More Runic Power from Fiebre de Escarcha and a higher proc chance of Potenciación rúnica do help, but they're not nearly enough. To truly fix the issues we have, one would have to attach resource generating attributes to Aliento de Sindragosa that help to prevent downtime both in the pooling phase, as well as when the ability finishes. It's important to not increase the base resource generation by too much, since it will affect alternative builds in a negative way. You'll simply have too much resources: causing overcapping and resulting in bad gameplay.\r\rI'd personally like to see a Rune gain when activating Aliento de Sindragosa, generating 2 Runes on activation for instance. This would remove the need of waiting for Runes before activating the ability, greatly reducing the downtime associated with pooling. Furthermore, it'd make the opener much less clunky. You'd be able to use Asolar three times, immediately followed by the initiation of your Aliento de Sindragosa window. I'd also like to see something like a Runic Power refund after Breath finishes, maybe giving 15% of all Runic Power spent on the ability back upon depletion. This would help to kickstart your normal rotation and help you to bridge the gap between the Aliento de Sindragosa windows. Since these resources are directly attached to your Aliento de Sindragosa, they wouldn't cause issues with alternative builds.

Comentarios

Comentario de Tedastrasz

"all classes" I don't see Ret pally on that list, I think you'll find it's pretty close to the Frost DK, maybe even lower unless you get lucky with procs

Comentario de redfinale

on 2019-05-05T15:43:32-05:00

Personally, I'd have preferred a buff to the other talents in that tier at least (or a nerf to BoS), so that BoS isn't the clear cut choice every time. Every time I see a talent so drastically the better choice, I'm talking every guide you read will tell you to pick said talent or you're an incompetent dumbass kind of clear cut choice, it really makes you question Blizz's ability to balance classes any more.\r\r\rIf I see a talent like that's "Choice A is all single target no AoE, Choice B is a mix of the two, and Choice C is pure AoE" it gives you some play at least. Do you pick A or C for the respective fight but sacrifice damage for the opposite type of damage, or do you take the middle road with B and maybe not do the best single target damage, but you can at least AoE\/multi-target a bit better than if you went pure single target? But when you have talents that out perform the other two by such a significant margin...

Comentario de REXFUR

on 2019-05-05T15:44:28-05:00

It's just cut off on the image.\rGo to http:\/\/www.simulationcraft.org\/reports\/T23_Raid.html and scroll down and click "Actions per Minute \/ DPS Variance Summary" to see the full list

Comentario de Rizbey

on 2019-05-05T15:49:01-05:00

Disappointing. I don't like breath. Looks like this is just solidifying the build.

Comentario de ivantklasnic

on 2019-05-05T15:49:14-05:00

this list is from simcraft, ret pala is at 52 apm, so way higher than those specs, full lust is here: https:\/\/www.simulationcraft.org\/reports\/T23_Raid.html

Comentario de jaq1010

on 2019-05-05T15:50:47-05:00

The simplest solution is one they will never do; namely, replace Breath of Sindragosa with another talent. We've been doing this dance since, what, 7.1, 7.2, when Breath was easier to keep up, and all that ends up happening is tweaks that don't address the problem of resources or downtime. Rather than break the talent, they tried to make it harder to keep up for ludicrous amounts of time, and yet even with that, BoS remains the only choice from that row. An entirely new level 100 row might be the only damn thing that can fix this.

Comentario de CommanderF

on 2019-05-05T15:52:48-05:00

Gonna play Obliteration in 8.2. I'm not hardcore raider anyway.

Comentario de Sixtime

on 2019-05-05T16:00:34-05:00

I'm fine with downtime. I wouldn't mind having 90% downtime on fdk, just give me more dps.

Comentario de Chungtao

on 2019-05-05T16:04:35-05:00

I really like the in-depth theorycraft format of the post, keep up the good work! Looking forward to some similar stuff for other underperforming\/outdated specs as well!

Comentario de mymy379

on 2019-05-05T16:06:34-05:00

You now have a whopping 54% chance of generating a Rune every time Breath of Sindragosa ticks (22.5% on live).Haven't played for a while, but shouldn't it be 72% chance per tick?Live: 15 RP * 1.5% chance = 22.5%PTR: 18 RP * 2% chance * BoS bonus = 72%(I assume it's additive chance scaling, and not separately calculated for each single RP point..)Ignore that, it's a 50% BoS bonus to RE, not 100% like I (somehow) read.

PS non-BoS still not viable then?PPS Either it's zero action or smashing your keyboard like a madmad, why can't there be any middle ground when fdks are concerned. :(

Comentario de Bicepspump

on 2019-05-05T16:11:18-05:00

BoS only has a 50% increased chance of procing Runic Empowerment (you might've read the double chance that was in a previous change and also incorrectly displayed in an earlier version of this article).\r\rI think we'll have to wait for further changes as well as tuning to see what will be best in 8.2.

Comentario de Chaserbl

on 2019-05-05T16:12:29-05:00

Blizzard is totally out of touch with their playerbase of frost DKs.\rClass in general is so wonky, heavily tuned every single expansion, every single patch it's just pointless.\r\rI play DK cos I love this class (lorewise) but everything else is just horrible.

Comentario de Funkyo

on 2019-05-05T16:19:23-05:00

Stay unholy! Melee warlock ftw XD

Comentario de Aarkan

on 2019-05-05T16:29:32-05:00

If we can't cast rime, cold heart or fwf during breath that's going to be a real bummer. They could auto-cast rime procs during Breath and that would help with our overall damage, which I think is a lot bigger of an issue than the downtime we have. Whatever they do I really hope they keep Breath as the top, or a top, build. Breath of Sindragosa is a really fun ability though I would support changes for them to move some of our overall damage out of it and into period when it's not in use. It doesn't feel great to spike on the damage meters and then fall all the way to the bottom over the next minute.

Comentario de Dawnrider

on 2019-05-05T16:30:46-05:00

Frost used to be a fast-paced and proc-based spec\r\rWith a 1.5 sec GCD...way to go. DKs should be on a 1 sec GCD since, like energy classes, they are heavily limited on resources recharging.\r\rHow can classes with a 1.5 sec GCD have more APM than classes with a 1 sec GCD? Must be because of the energy regeneration.

Comentario de lolgo

on 2019-05-05T16:31:46-05:00

"This change effectively introduces more resources in our rotation. Obliterate will now have a 40% chance to proc Runic Empowerment and Remorseless Winter and Cold Heart will have a 20% chance." - maybe I am misunderstanding something here, but do Rune Spenders have to do with RE?

Comentario de lolgo

on 2019-05-05T16:40:35-05:00

You now have a whopping 54% chance of generating a Rune every time Breath of Sindragosa ticks (22.5% on live).\rHaven't played for a while, but shouldn't it be 72% chance per tick?\rLive: 15 RP * 1.5% chance = 22.5%\rPTR: 18 RP * 2% chance * BoS bonus = 72%\r(I assume it's additive chance scaling, and not separately calculated for each single RP point..)\rIgnore that, it's a 50% BoS bonus to RE, not 100% like I (somehow) read.\r\r\rPS non-BoS still not viable then?\rPPS Either it's zero action or smashing your keyboard like a madmad, why can't there be any middle ground when fdks are concerned. :(\r\rYour first reading was correct, dw. It's just they changed it from 100% to 50% on the PTR several days ago :)

Comentario de Bicepspump

on 2019-05-05T16:40:41-05:00

No, Rune Spenders don't interact with RE, this was an error present in an earlier version of the article.

Comentario de Mightylorddk

on 2019-05-05T16:47:02-05:00

This is going to make BoS only option for frost. Removal of Artifact weapon completely Obliterated frost. It requires a massive rework which cant be done with hotfixes.

Comentario de Nasska

on 2019-05-05T17:18:18-05:00

Please, make obliteration useful again. I don't even like breath of sindragosa and i only see changes for breath of sindragosa. It's not viable and not enough or that much interesting, it's a nice ability but doesn't make frost dk interesting and working properly.