Comments on: Report: Cardinals offer Holliday eight-year dealhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/
Baseball. Baseball. And then a bit more baseball.Sun, 02 Aug 2015 22:44:32 +0000hourly1http://wordpress.com/By: custom printed apparelhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-2/#comment-16638
Mon, 08 Feb 2010 22:56:04 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16638Do you guys think the Saints will make it to the Super Bowl again next year? Who you think will make it? I’m hoping the Cowboys maybe the jets:-).
]]>By: DiamondDuqhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-2/#comment-16637
Wed, 16 Dec 2009 08:33:58 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16637You people must read what you want to read. Disparity means “The condition or fact of being unequal, as in age, rank, or degree; difference” which doesn’t mean the entire makeup of their payroll was for the reasons I listed. I was merely pointing out, in regards to the $62 million difference between the Yankees payroll and the next highest payroll, that it wasn’t entirely player buying. Just the examples I listed account for half of that difference and all of those examples had nothing to do with “buying players”.
Certainly the Yankees have the resources to do anything financially that they want but that’s not due to their baseball operations. The Yankees lose more money from their baseball operations than any team in baseball. Ask the Pirates, Royals, Nationals, etc. if they want the Yankees to cut their payroll, they certainly don’t because that’s essentially taking money out of those teams pockets.
If the Yankees were really in the business of simply “buying players” and keeping them from other teams, they would have certainly offered Lackey a contract, Holliday from day one, etc. If the Yankees were as “evil” as everyone makes them out to be there would be no high profile free agent signings anywhere, the Yankees would sign up every player of any significance but they don’t because this perception all of you Yankee haters have is just that, a perception with no legitimacy.
]]>By: Joehttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-2/#comment-16636
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 22:50:39 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16636The Cardinals have a lot of money to spend right now. If anyone here thinks they arent thinking of Pujols and the deal he will require, you are absolutely out of your mind. Pujols has already said he would take a “hometown” discount IF the Cards front office put a bat in front of him. Well…..here is the bat. They know what they are doing and have a max with Holliday. I’m guessing it will be about 15 Mil for 7 yrs. Then next season Albert will get about 20 Mil a year. Not the highest in BB, but again, he said if the front office does their job he would sign at a discount. The Cards have also said they will up payroll this year to about 120,000,000. That is not bad since they are only at 87 mil now. That will allow them to resign a Rasmus when he comes around and a Yadi when his is up. They are doing great! Get Holliday and the Cards are in the Playoffs for a while.
]]>By: TigerS Boy ToYhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-2/#comment-16635
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 16:53:59 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16635DON’T FORGET THEY GET A HIGHER SALARY TO DEAL WITH
THE IDIOTS IN THE NEW YORK MEDIA CIRCUS …………..
I CAN’T BELIEVE I’M SITTING HERE READING ABOUT GROWN
ASS MEN CRYING AND COMPLAING LIKE A BUNCH OF MISERABLE
OLD WOMAN, THIS SUCKS!!!
]]>By: TigerS Boy ToYhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-2/#comment-16634
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 16:49:48 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16634THE YANKEES DIDN’T SIGN ANY OF THESE LOSER, NOT OUR PROBLEM.
I DON’T REMEMBER CASH- MAN CRYING OVER THE PAVANO CONTRACT.
]]>By: TigerS Boy ToYhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-2/#comment-16633
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 16:48:29 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16633PEOPLE COMPLAIN BECAUSE THE YANKEES WIN…………….
LOSERS CRY BECAUSE, WELL, THEY LOSE.
AJ IS CORRECT AND HE SHOULD NOT APOLOGIZE FOR THE YANKEES
WINNING, I WON’T!!!
WHAT YOU FELLAS NEED TO DO IS CALL YOUR TEAM OWNERS AND
TELL THEM STOP STUFFING THE YANKEES MONEY IN THEIR POCKET
AND PUT IT IN THEIR PAYROLL.
THER IS NO CRYING IN BASEBALL.
]]>By: Mikehttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-2/#comment-16632
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 16:41:37 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16632Dont go to the games. Plain and simple., stop being saps.
]]>By: TigerS Boy ToYhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16631
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 16:40:22 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16631AJ, YOU ARE CORRECT AND I AGREE.
]]>By: joe fhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16630
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 16:20:47 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16630That is nonsense. Last off-season, they signed CC, Burnett and Teixiera. Those 3 combined made over $50 million last year.
]]>By: Materialmanhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16629
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 15:55:30 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16629Seems like alot of money to me and I’m a Cardinal fan.
]]>By: MilitaryManMChttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16628
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 14:56:28 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16628You sound like a whining little candy a$$ yanks fan…imagine that.
]]>By: John Pileggihttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16627
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 14:33:43 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16627It is a shock to see the Cards be this aggressive. If Holliday enjoys the team and the city, one would think he would not over negotiate it. But, Scott Boras is the guy who bid the Mets up on Beltran and then called the Yanks and offered him for less. Who knows what Mr. Boras will do.
]]>By: peterhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16626
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 14:20:29 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16626As demonstrated, much of the salary disparity isn’t due to “buying a WS” but rather rewarding guys for winning WS’s, 5 to be exact.
-Tex, Sab and Giambi were just good ‘ole farm system products huh? That’s why the wank’s GM went out and spent $200 mil on other team’s players right?
]]>By: Oldimerhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16625
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 13:44:19 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16625People see this as a vain attempt at “Keeping up with the Yankees”. Having a marginally winning team currently requires spending idiotic money to maintain any continuity or competitive advantage. The Yankees are not the cause, only the benficiaries of this stupid MLB approach. Resentment for what they have bought will never be equalled by any other franchise. So accept it, don’t keep trying to make rationalizations for why everyone else is immune to criticism.
]]>By: Jotzinhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16624
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 13:33:07 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16624Some very valid points have been made but I arrive at a different conclusion. The Cardinals are and have been a very intelligent organization. They are playing Scot Boras. They fully do not anticipate that Holliday will accept the deal which will allow them to move on to their Plan B or Plan C options. What they do accomplish is to demonstrate to their fans, baseball and more importantly to King Albert is that they are committed to winning. Additionally, King Albert won’t have wandering eyes about his contract as they will still maintain the salary room to offer him ridiculous money which he most likely deserves. If Holliday accepts, fine. They will utilize him for his value and trade him right before he becomes useless.
]]>By: DiamondDuqhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16623
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 11:56:50 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16623Your logic is partially flawed in that much of the Yankee’s payroll is due to overpaying their own players for no reason other than to reward them for their service. Obviously Derek Jeter’s value on the open market isn’t $21.6 million/year but it is for the Yankees. The next highest paid SS, is Tejada who makes $7 million/year fewer than Jeter and it is arguable whether he’s even a SS anymore and arguably the best SS in baseball, Hanley Ramirez only makes $5.5 million/year. So say Jeter is overpaid by $10+ million/year and for no other reason than compensation for his contribution to the Yankees, they didn’t buy him.
Similarly, Mariano Rivera makes $15 million/year for his contributions to the Yankees. Compare him to someone with similar HOF credentials and someone else who is one of the best current closers in baseball, Trevor Hoffman and Jonathan Papelbon respectively, each make in the neighborhood of $6 million/year, $6 and $6.25 million/year respectively. Say there’s another, at least, $5+ million/year in overpayments. Jorge Posada makes $13.1 million/year compared to other catchers of similar age and ability such as Jason Varitek or Jason Kendal or A.J. Pierzynski who make $5, $5 and $6.25 million/year respectively which adds another $5+ million/year the Yankees are overpaying players for their contributions. Not to mention that Pettite is worth nowhere near his new contract on the open market either and that the Rangers gave A-Rod his current deal and the extra $5 or so million/year after he opted out were just to make him happy, he wasn’t in danger of going anywhere else because no one was going to pay him that kind of money.
As demonstrated, much of the salary disparity isn’t due to “buying a WS” but rather rewarding guys for winning WS’s, 5 to be exact.
]]>By: Davidhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16622
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 11:48:14 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16622Cards have Wainright, Carpenter and Lohse signed for multi-year. Waino was in his first year of new contract in 2009. Also, Carp has at least 2 years left. If he is still pitching well, probably would work with the Cards Organization as they have paid him well even when he missed two seasons in a row.
I think the Cards are being more than fair for Holliday and once signed ( if Boras doesn’t screw it up for greed )Mo will put all attention back to Albert for a lifetime contract. Pujols has stated numerous times for his love of St Louis and will make good with long-term Contract. It doesn’t need to be A-PED…oops, A-Rod money per say…but will avg 20 mil or so a season. I think Albert does recognize the amount of money it is to where he is happy. He wants a winning team every year and the Cards have done that within a reasonable payroll.
]]>By: Bill-Sonorahttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16621
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 11:45:36 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16621I don’t think this report is true.
]]>By: MHhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16620
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 11:37:44 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16620Yeah Poor Yankees, everyone is picking on them !!
]]>By: peterhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16619
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 10:46:18 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16619Cards have a low payroll, but need to lock up wain, ap, carp, etc. Plus they are saving some money losing glaus this year. AP says team competitivness is a top priority- Cards showing they are committed.
]]>By: Rob Woodsonhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16618
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 10:33:30 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16618Okay AJ lets look at thpe why people always complain about New York.
2009 Payroll
Yankees – 208,097,414
Phillies – 111,209,046
Red Sox – 122,435,399
Mariners – 112,053,666
Cardinals – 87,703,409http://espn.go.com/mlb/teams/salaries?team=phi
God forbid anyone try and keep competitive with the YANKEES!! Give me a break St. Louis finally tries to land more than one IMPACT player and keep up with the rest of the majors including the Cubs which are in their division and have a payroll of 134,058,500. The numbers don’t lie, the number 2 team in the payroll list is NY Mets with 145,367,987, a whopping 62,729,427 difference, which would pay for Alex Rodriguez and Derek Jeter with about 10 million to spare. HMMMMM!, why do people get all outraged???
]]>By: Old Gatorhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16617
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 10:23:28 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16617Wel-l-l,not so fast. Pujols comes off his deal in two years. If they’re giving Holliday this kind of money and security, what do you think Prince Albert is going to want out of an extension in his walk year in 2011? Dear Buddha, he’s going to want something that makes A-Rod’s temporary albatross effect on the Rangers look like the curse of the Wandering Jew. Who on the face of this lonely speck in the cosmos do you think is going to be able to afford two contracts like that? The Borg and who else? The Cardinals? Please. They give Albert what he’s gonna want, they will field a team of Pujols, Holliday and seven other current sandlot ballplayers to be named later for what they’ll have left to spend. If they have anything left to spend. Committing to Holliday like this is an almost sure guarantee of watching Albert play in Borg pinstripes in 2012.
]]>By: MarinersFan22http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16616
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 10:01:34 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16616Mariners throwing big bucks?
Mariners signed Jr. to a 1 year deal for $2M+ incentives.
Mariners signed Chone Figgins to a $36M deal for 4 years. (Beltre’s previous 5 year deal for $64M cost more per year…)
Jack Wilson re-signed for a 2 year/$10M deal, coughing up $1M for the next 2 years to get rid of Betancourt.
Minor league deals for Cory Patterson and a few others. That’s all the ink that’s on paper.
Even with the year with Cliff Lee (if it goes through) at $9M, they’ve still got plenty to lock down Felix to a well-deserved contract and be players for Jason Bay if they decide to go that way.
They’re in on a lot of deals, but Z knows how to get value for the team’s dollars. I’m very excited to see how the rest of the off-season plays out.
]]>By: AJ Gallohttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16615
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 10:00:48 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16615Your last two sentences are so true. But I don’t think either of us will see it in our lifetimes.
]]>By: SpoortsFan8888http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16614
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 09:58:22 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16614Baseball is spending itself to financial ruin.
Competitiveness is a joke if you have just a handful
of teams that can afford to make such an offer
to, basically, an above average outfielder.
I saw a few of Holliday’s road games when he
played in the AL for Oakland last year.
He was not hitting and his outfield
defense was nothing special.
Looks like some sucker team will get a few
years of decent production(if that many)
out of Holliday and then regret paying every
year after those 2 years after his skills
fall off the cliff and production becomes
very mediocre.
Both leagues have many players whose contracts
now look very foolish because of lack of production:
Magglio Ordonez? Gary Matthews Jr? Soriano?
Juan Pierre?? Barry Zito? Gary Sheffield?
Milton Bradley? and on and on and on.
You have to hand it to Super Agent Boros
he gets top dollar for his players even
when they do not deserve it.
MLB needs a true system of complete revenue
sharing and a true salary floor and cap
like the NFL.
Only then will MLB have true parity and competitiveness.
]]>By: SportsFan8888http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16613
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 09:56:46 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16613Baseball is spending itself to financial ruin.
Competitiveness is a joke if you have just a handful
of teams that can afford to make such an offer
to, basically, an above average outfielder.
I saw a few of Holliday’s road games when he
played in the AL for Oakland last year.
He was not hitting and his outfield
defense was nothing special.
Looks like some sucker team will get a few
years of decent production(if that many)
out of Holliday and then regret paying every
year after those 2 years after his skills
fall off the cliff and production becomes
very mediocre.
Both leagues have many players whose contracts
now look very foolish because of lack of production:
Magglio Ordonez? Gary Matthews Jr? Soriano?
Juan Pierre?? Barry Zito? Gary Sheffield?
Milton Bradley? and on and on and on.
You have to hand it to Super Agent Boros
he gets top dollar for his players even
when they do not deserve it.
MLB needs a true system of complete revenue
sharing and a true salary floor and cap
like the NFL.
Only then will MLB have true parity and competitiveness.
]]>By: AJ Gallohttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16612
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 08:42:17 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16612I don’t know. The Phillies, Red Sox, Mariners, Cardinals are all throwing the big bucks around like they’re the Yankees. But I don’t hear any outrage coming from anyone around the major leagues concerning the money that’s being spent. That only happens when it’s the Yankees spending the money. And why is that? If it’s wrong, and “if” is the big word there, but if it’s wrong it’s wrong across the board. There are no degrees of wrong. One isn’t less wrong than another. Wrong is wrong.
]]>By: DiamondDuqhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16611
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 08:39:33 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16611This deal is a farce based more on length than market value. I think, and obviously I do not know Holliday personally, a 6 year deal for similar total money would be more enticing. Getting another deal at 36 is going to be a lot easier than at 38 and puts him at around $21 million/year rather than $16 million.
]]>By: ron jenningshttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16610
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 03:35:15 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16610let the bum go..He’s not worth it….and he can take scott boras with him..
]]>By: Arendellhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-cardinals-offer-holliday-eight-year-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-16609
Tue, 15 Dec 2009 01:47:28 +0000http://localhost/wp/nbchbt/?p=2791#comment-16609This is a commitmen to wining BB by St. Louis. Good for you. I do hope he sees the long term $$ of this and takes it. S.B. will not want him to, and neither will S.B.’s in there pocket team (NYY).
But for all of BB I pray that M.H. Take this great offer. Him and Albet for the next 8 years.. Ochy.
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