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Hey, it’s those guys! The assassin guys! Well, ‘attempted assassin’ guys, I guess? Yori’s still breathing, last I checked.

Hey, we saw Wonder Woman! It was PRETTY OKAY! Was it 93% on Rotten Tomatoes okay? Nooooo, it wasn’t THAT okay. Overall, though, the DC movies have set the bar so low, that almost any half competent film would likely get praised. Wonder Woman’s got a lot of heart, and I did feel some actual human emotions at the correctly intended places. So it’s probably worth seeing if you like superhero movies (and who doesn’t amirite?). Anyway, I’ve compiled a list of things we liked and didn’t like. I realize the “didn’t like” like is is a lot longer than the “like” list, but that’s because I’m super nitpicky about my problems with the film while feeling generally good about it over all (SPOILERS of varying degrees ahead).

Things we liked:

The humor. There was good humor, good character banter. I laughed a lot, which allows me to forgive a movie many other faults!

The costumes. They were cool. The WW1 uniforms, the amazon warrior armor. Good stuff.

The trench charge. I like it when superheroes do super heroic things, FEELS GOOD.

The bad guy twist. I didn’t see it coming! (Joe probably did, he always figures that stuff out)

Things we questioned:

The soundtrack. I’m not a fan of that wailing Wonder Woman theme. and it’s the only memorable piece of music in the film. It doesn’t even seem to represent the character in tone, so I don’t know why they kept it around after Batman v Superman.

Mustard gas could already dissolve gas masks (I’m told), the only reason it wasn’t used more during the great war was because it affected both sides equally.

Adding a hydrogen element to mustard gas doesn’t necessarily make it flammable (according to Joe. Feel free to correct me if I misunderstood that, Joe!)

If the plane Steven Trevor hijacked was originally going to fly to London to bomb it with Mustard Gas Level 2, he could’ve ditched the plane in the English Straight and swam to safety, instead of heroically blowing himself up.

Does every guy named Steve have to steal a big silly German plane so he can heroically self sacrifice?

The tank that Diana picks up to crush Doctor Poison with is a British model tank (I’m told). What it was doing on a German base in occupied Belgium is anyone’s guess!

Did Diana end WWI in the DC movie universe? She blows up the bad guy and suddenly in the next scene there’s a big celebration like the war is over. How much time passed? Maybe they signed the Treaty of Versailles somewhere in between scene changes.

The movie’s too desaturated. Gimme more color! A lot of the finale takes place at night and it’s really drab and boring cinematography.

The kilt wearing Sniper guy gets a bunch of characterization like he’s going to have this character arc that never happens. Hrm. Not the only plot thread left hanging, either. No backstory for Doctor Poison?

Bad guy Ares had a mustache and looked like an old British dude even when he was the God of War at the height of his power?? What a fascinatingly anachronistic fashion sense he had!

How much time is passing on Themyscira? Like there are no children, just a bunch of women who…don’t age? But Diana does age, but over a long period of time? Or not? How old is she, exactly? Does she just age normally and then live forever afterward?

Diana proclaims “I BELIEVE IN LOVE!” and then blasts a hole in the bad guy’s stomach, murdering him with horrific violence. FELT A LITTLE CONTRADICTORY.

Looks like Nataku has mastered the Honou-ko and will unleash it against all his foes.

LordBolanderFace

Cinemasins voice: “Tadashi, you did not hear that.” *ding!*

As for Wonder Woman, I’m on the fence. I saw one of the first trailers, and that line about, “I’m his secretary, that means I go where he wants and do what he tells me” line, while WW gives her a sympathetic look, really turned me off. I was like, ugh, is this going to be THAT kind of movie? I know that female empowerment has always been a huge part of what Wonder Woman is, and I’m okay with that, but… is it going to be THAT KIND OF MOVIE? Because if it is, I’ll pass.

Leo

It’s really not. Sexism is addressed, but that is sort of unavoidable when your main feature is a woman at the very front of the Great War.

okamitora

Allow me to back up Leo here. It really isn’t that kind of movie. It’s a very good, very well done movie.

purplelibraryguy

How many of “That kind of movie” are there actually? I always wonder what’s going on when I see people obsessively hating on a trend that does not, so far as I can see, exist.

http://www.nn4b.com suburban_samurai

Haha! This comment is on point!

LordBolanderFace

I’m not obsessively hating on anything, and I never said it was a trend. I hope it never becomes a trend. But the ones there are, I don’t like them. If you want to make a movie about female empowerment, more power to you. But don’t go acting like a woman having a job, and therefor having a boss who tells you what to do, is some form of oppression.

KungFuKlobber

“… to settle matters with Yorikiro.” How delightfully vague!

I haven’t seen the movie, but I’d just like to say there was nothing wrong with Wonder Woman’s funky 70’s theme and it should be used more.

Leo

About Wonder Woman, I did like the movie a lot, the direction specially, but don’t know how to feel about the end. Spoilers ahead, obviously.

On one hand we get the message that war isn’t as simple as a single bad guy influencing men into doing bad stuff, and that humans just make mistakes and kill people as a part of their nature, which is a great point to make, but on the other hand we do get a single bad guy influencing men into doing bad stuff, and once he is defeated soldiers from both sides go around hugging and celebrating that it’s over.

I really feel like the actual Ares might have been an executive decision, rather than the original vision, because it just feels out of place in contrast to the rest of the film.

Also, while I guess the power-up in the end was inevitable, it was nice seeing WW as a sort of DC Captain America for most of the film.

Burdened

Totally agree on the ‘one bad guy’ thing. Diana realizing that humans are flawed and that Ares isn’t the only one at fault – that’s a huge moment for her as a character. By adding that little scene after Ares’ death or whatever, it massively contradicts that character growth and made it feel empty and pointless. Wasn’t a fan of that.

I also loved the power up part, but I just wished they made it a bit more obvious that she could fly (which I assume she can – in BvS, the JL trailer, and the ending scene, it honestly seems like she was just jumping around. I really hope she can actually fly though). Wonder Woman without flight just seems wrong, even if she didn’t originally have that ability.

sageofthesky

“The tank that Diana picks up to crush Doctor Poison with is a British model tank (I’m told). What it was doing on a German base in occupied Belgium is anyone’s guess!”
Actually, some British tanks were captured by the Germans during the trench warfare, and the Germans then tried to reverse engineer/re-purpose them, to use against the British. So that part makes sense.

“Diana end WWI in the DC movie universe? She blows up the bad guy and suddenly in the next scene there’s a big celebration like the war is over”
I assume the ending the war thing was just that Germany was forced to surrender, having exhausted all their natural resources and manpower as happened in real life WWI, in addition to their big plan failing. The moment Germany was ready to surrender, even before the Treaty of Versailles, celebrations would have begun.

As for Ares and his mustache, everybody during WWI had those kind of mustaches, so I think it’s logical enough for him to blend in. Who knows, maybe he started the style.

Draxynnic

There were actually historical inaccuracies that got me more…

Unless I miss my mark, Steve wore a Blue Max as part of his disguise at the start of the film. That’s actually a pretty bad move for a spy. The Pour le Merite was the top German military award at the time, compared to which the Victoria Cross and Congressional Medal of Honor was handed out like candy – there were only a couple dozen awarded to aviators through WW1, mostly top-scoring aces, and many of them were dead by the final days of the war. Anyone wearing one would quickly attract attention, and almost as quickly be unmasked as not being a legitimate recipient.

Similarly, what was what looked like an Eindekker doing in the final years of the war? They could have made it an Albatros or a Fokker Triplane, and it would both be more recognisable AND more historically accurate.

Khno

well I’m not so sure german helmet were accurate either…
And the whole superhero in war thing is… I don’t know if it would have worked with diplomacy… a bit like introducing an H-Bomb in a knife fight and noone avoiding the fight, even when from the same family (germany was expecting to ally with britain only a few years before…)

Draxynnic

Well, one does have to expect in a superhero movie that certain allowances must be made for the movie to work. So one has to roll with those – but when you have a lot of unforced errors, that takes it from “artistic licence” to “did not do the research”.

Kid Chaos

Germany was getting ready to sign the Armistice (which the movie pointed out, repeatedly), so the relatively quick end to the war is justified. Steve blowing himself right. the fuck. up? Not so much. And once again, the DC-CU can’t get the colors right. Sigh. 😕

EBeth

Oh boy – what a charming little couple these two (Nataku & Honou-ko) must make! No wonder the Daisuke Clan was so decimated. I’ll bet these guys idea of a fun night out is an evening at an abattoir… 😝

LordBolanderFace

I can show you the gore,
Screaming, suffering splendor,
Tell me General, when did you last,
Cut off a man’s left side?

I can take out your eyes,
Tear your body asunder,
Sew your head back on down under,
Then go for a pony ride!

wow, jeez. no spoiler warnings? the movie JUST came out. It hasn’t even been a WEEK since it’s release!
(normally I dont care about spoilers but DAMN)

clogboy

“Hey, we saw Wonder Woman” so I’m going to discuss it in detail, as a trusted and time-honored tradition on this page.
The trailer video should’ve been a red flag already.

Nos Rin aka CTCO

and it is a time honored tradition to leave a SPOILERS message because it is easy to talk about a movie without giving away the BIG PLOT POINTS.
I’ve been on the interent for a very long time. trust me. it’s easy to not give away spoilers and still talk about a new movie.

clogboy

Then how would you do an in-depth review. Spoilers are implied whenever someone starts talking about a certain franchise.
It’s easy to warn, but not mandatory. We’re all guests here at a party that the moderator (SubSam) is hosting for free. And the moderator is making the rules (as is also a time honored tradition on the ‘interent’). It is by those rules that you get to enjoy the party.
tl;dr: don’t like the free beer they’re serving here, gtfo 😉

Nos Rin aka CTCO

you seem a little. salty over my simple asking for a warning next time.
are you okay? I don’t really know you so I’m not sure why the salt.
honestly I’m not going to get into a discussion over this if you’re going to act that way.
I mean is it REALLY too much to ask for a spoiler warning? It’s not like I’m asking for a free showing to the movie. chill out.

http://www.nn4b.com suburban_samurai

That’s a bad goof on my part. It’s a little late, but I threw in a spoilers warning.

Nos Rin aka CTCO

and the other guy jumped down my throat over my comment lol.
I dont mind spoilers really, I’m just used to seeing spoiler warnings for big events when people put up stuff about it.

Thanks for looking out bro.

Nos Rin aka CTCO

To be fair though, Marvel movies haven’t been Grade A themselves.
Civil War had a lot of flaws and was really disappointing. (outside of being present in the movie there was ZERO reason for hawkeye and antman to be in the movie. They both just wanted to be with their families and being part of what was going on was in direct contrast to exactly that.) That on top of a Single Brawl at an airport and also that it was really just about captain wanting to help his old pal bucky. I mean seriously, it was called civil WAR, there was no war. Overall is was a big fat dud. I’m tired of them trying to just copy all the big comic storylines and mash them all together. It’s a different medium. BE MORE FUCKING CREATIVE HOW HARD CAN IT BE?!
The captain america movies have really made me sad, this may just be me on this one but why have 2/3 of his movies simply been “oh no, everything has gone to fucking hell. we’re falling apart! betrayed by our friends!” I know conflict is important but fuck. why can’t the good guys just fight the badguys without FIGHTING EACH OTHER AAAAARGG, this is why I have always been a DC fan over a Marvel fan (besides batman and super man being bigger names and the justice league being more prominent on TV. although growing up my number 1 was spiderman (and technically I saw a captain america comic ONCE at a hospital and said he looked cool and named him number 2 when i was like 7-10))
I always saw marvel heroes fighting amongst themselves as much if not more then actually fighting the villians while dc heroes had the justice league and always worked as a team.
And I’m still seeing this shit in today’s movie.

The iron man films have overall been pretty poor on plot at best (although the action was relatively good.)
The last thor was widely hated from what I heard although the new one looks like a lot of fun. (although super sad for the fall of Asgard……)
And Age of Ultron didn’t do that well either. Outside the wonderful hammer jokes it was pretty meh.

Wolverine got killed by his EVIL CLONE Pushing him into a Tree. I mean, what? what? How more boring can you get? Thousands if not millions of villains to pick from but no, evil clone. how fucking boring. And seriously, a tree? at least fucking impale him on some damn farming equipment or something. for fucks sake. a TREE?! a TREE?! *insert NNFB treevenge joke here*
And wolverine in japan? weeabo much? Didn’t he use a katana? GROAN!!!
Oh and shall I bring up how much of a shitfest origins was? although I guess to be fair the wolverine movies technically aren’t part of the “MCU movieverse whateveryoucallit”

All negativity against marvel aside. i have FRELLING LOVED the Guardians movie. Amazing. So much fun. Loved them.

The infinity wars better be good.

At least DC is trying.
okay yes, BvS was mostly crap. they shoved at Least two comic storylines in. the strangely praised frank miller’s dark knight returns as well as the death of superman. two superly dark plots both in the same movie.
Ya, Zac snyder has made DC a wheee bit too dark and gritty for my tastes but hey, that is batman’s style. but it doesn’t fit superman.

Still. I am super stoked for Flash and for Jason Mamoa as Aquaman. HELL YEA!!! Cyborg feels a little out of place but i’m meh on having green latern since he’s kind of part of an organization rather then a unique hero at this point (but if they brought one in please let it be Jon Stewart! kind of have to pick a new one now that we got Ryan Reynolds wonderfully as Deadpool! can’t wait for that sequel!) Can’t really do the Martian Manhunter can we? I did so love him in Justice League though! (the 2000 cartoon series.) Cyborg is pretty cool though. I do like him. I guess they’re going along with the new 52? I haven’t read the comics but he’s prominent in the series of animated movies which are, alright. throne of atlantis had some annoying plot points that I hated like that, hey do this and everyone stops killing each other right before we’re almost dead instead of at the perfect moment right before the battle because HEY! we need to have a cool fight scene where the one who kills the enemies the most is the one who is actually part of the same people because That makes fucking sense…..

Anyway. YES. the “how do you know that name?! was really fucking weak. I mean batman also must have had shit in his ears because the moment superman got there he was like. HEY! Please Help Me! My Mother Needs Help!

Anyway I swear to God if Supes has a fucking mullet when he returns I am going to be pissed.
The second Justice League film BETTER be the Live Action Justice League Film I have ALWAYS WANTED!!!

sigh… another ten or twenty years for the reboot maybe?

Nos Rin aka CTCO

oh jeez. that’s a lot of rambling. >_> SORRY!!!

Nos Rin aka CTCO

Also I actually kind of like her loud and violent themsong. I am weird I know.

I’ll see the movie in a week or two, hopefully before I move.

http://www.nn4b.com suburban_samurai

Any Marvel movie has a narrative infinitely more coherent than Batman v Superman. That is easily the most convoluted and ineptly told story in a big budget superhero film to date. It also has the two DC greats fighting each other, which is kind of your complaint for the Marvel films! I don’t have much stake in either Marvel’s or DC’s movies because I’ve never been a huge superhero fan myself. So when one of their films is bad, I mostly shrug my shoulders and then write about it on the site. When a Star Wars/Trek film is bad, I violently flip a desk and then write about it on the site.

Nos Rin aka CTCO

Ya, BvS was pretty damn bad. No argument there. (also it was more my complaint about the Comics not the movies persay. about heroes fighting)
I never really got into star trek but I’ve always loved superheroes and always wanted to be one.
Star wars for me I just don’t care that much about the story I just like seeing the cool spaceships and other technologies.

I’m really crossing my fingers on Justice League movie but mostly just hoping the second one is better.

Nos Rin aka CTCO

I was just thinking…
“infinitely more coherent” might not necesarily be a good thing.
That could mean. “A plot so simple and basic a moron would get it.” which is kind of a yawn fest.

Also what is with all these marvel villains who are just evil clones of the heroes? Original Much? No.
Like they took it to a literal sense with Wolverine. Painfully so. sigh.

Kid Chaos

So, you spent your weekend at the movies instead of making a new page? 😜

okamitora

Oh, I dunno. The last Fantastic 4 movie was even worse than Batman v Superman, I’d say.

TheMaskedFerret

That was not a Marvel Studios (centric) move. Nor was it a part of the MCU (that I am aware of).

Merlin

Heh, I was referring to Batman v Superman being “easily the most convoluted and ineptly told story in a big budget superhero film to date.” I would say it takes the number two spot.

SlugFiller

So, they’re actually trying to come up with an excuse for the “send the powerful villains one by one instead of ganging up on the hero all at once” bit? Shouldn’t anyone mention the fact that Yori already killed two idiots who “could take him on alone”?

Incidentally, this is the trope I hate the most in Magical Girl and Super Sentai series. Not the “one villain at a time” bit. The “You’ve defeated us 99 times in a row, but you’re weak and pathetic and have no chance to win” bit. I feel like the Evil Overlord list needs to have “I will learn how statistics and pattern recognition work” added to it.

Wanderer

Technically, way back in the day it was outright said that Hirotomo ordered them to attack Yori one at a time. http://nn4b.com/comic/174 Probably because Hirotomo is doing some version of social darwinism; fighting the Demons of Sorrow will either toughen Yori up/get him to drop his naive idealism, or if Yori dies, then it just means he wasn’t strong to lead the Wataro clan.

Jake

“Diana proclaims “I BELIEVE IN LOVE!” and then blasts a hole in the bad guy’s stomach, murdering him with horrific violence. FELT A LITTLE CONTRADICTORY.”

Well, that may contradictory but at least she didn’t say “do you believe in life after love?”

okamitora

Hardly contradictory. She chose to be merciful towards the human. Her real fight was against Ares, who would only be stopped with violence, and she gained the power to match him by refusing to give in to him, even in her lowest moment.

endplanets

NOOOOOO, did this guy not watch Monster Ranchers or Power Rangers back in the day? Don’t send then one at a time.

Unhooked

So… what you’re saying is we need to turn Tadashii into a giant Tadashii so he can fight the combined zords of Yori, Ken, Cho, Ina, and Masuhiro? Maybe with the Purple Samurai as a sixth ranger?

Xinef

“Your honor comes second to the will of your lord?”
That’s a weird thing to say for a samurai.

A samurai’s honor IS the will of his lord. At least if we go by the bushido’s definition, honor equals fulfilling your lord’s will. So it’s a bit silly to have it second to itself 😛

Alas, there’s no need for bushido, so my point is moot 😉

http://www.nn4b.com suburban_samurai

yeah, he probably should’ve said “your honorable death comes second to the will of your lord”. It’s the same situation Tadashii was in after Genchu beat him. Tadashii wanted to end his life for his failure and Hirotomo forbade it.

Xinef

And I sort of agree with that. It’s much easier to repair your mistakes when you’re alive than when you’re dead. Unless you’re a jedi, but that’s beside the point.

Jonathan B

Regarding the actual comic: I’m wondering if this will give the one honorable guy in the mix, Tadashi, a chance to find out more of what’s going on and possibly change his mind. Although, samurai being samurai, finding out more of what’s going on could result in him committing suicide because both abandoning his lord and continuing to serve his lord seemed dishonorable. It could, however, also result in him deciding Yori was rightly his lord and serving him alongside Guy Who Is Totally Not Anything But A Random Translator Fisherman Even Though He Has A Sword With An Expensive And Distinctive Hilt. A lot of directions it could go.

Regarding Wonderwoman (SPOILERS of course):

After Wonder Woman blows up Ares, I took the soldiers from both sides crawling out of the wreckage together as not a symbol of war ending but a case of “we just saw two gods fight it out (and part of us got punched by one), everything around us blown up, and the fact that we actually crawled out of the wreckage alive is more important at the moment than a uniform.” Cataclysm survivor’s relief, if you will.

If, instead, you’re referring to the jump to London, Germany was already ready to sign the armistice, with the bad guys counting on the bombs changing that, so it’s not so much that Wonder Woman ended the war as that she prevented the event that would have kept it from ending, thus allowing the armistice to go forward after all. They did gloss over how we get from destroyed factory to end of the war, but then that’s a fairly normal thing for most any war film, focusing on the climactic events and then jumping ahead to see the payoff. They’d have needed at least another half hour to wrap up otherwise, maybe more.

Others have already noted that both sides captured each other’s equipment and reused it in the war, and in WW2 as well. A search for “german mark iv ww1” will show several pictures of the British Mk IV tank in German markings after capture.

Agreed about Steve not needing to sacrifice himself if he could steal the plane like that. For that matter, if he had a way to contact his own people so they didn’t shoot him down, he could even have flown it and landed it, capturing the plane and its bombs for study. Might not have chosen to, from the “better nobody have it” perspective and from the “what if someone doesn’t get the message and shoots me down near civilians” perspective, but that option was also there.

I didn’t feel like the finale was contradictory. Love protects, and sometimes that requires violence. Love is not so much the opposite of violence as a counter to the wrong motivations that often create violence. Hatred, greed, etc. Ares had made it quite clear he intended to kill her if he couldn’t convert her, on top of being an unrepentant threat to the well-being of all humanity, so it wasn’t contradictory for me.