If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood

True, but can Akamaru hit Kiba, or the other way round?
I don't think so. And she showed here she can possess two bodies, meaning she can likely possess both of them.
Ino's jutsu is pretty good is you see past the barrier "woman in Kishi's universe"

Nicely remembered.
Certainly. A dog will definetely be able to be controlled into doing anything.
If she can make other people attack their comrades, then a dog is well within her range.
What can Kiba do without his dog hahaha.
2nd Bottom of the rookies right now is Kiba then.

Naruto/Sasuke <-- These two are not up for debate please. I don't know or care atm who is strongest.
Sai
Neji
Shino
Lee
Choji
Shikamaru
Sakura
Ino
Hinata
Kiba
Tenten

How about this for the rookies.

Kiba is now out of it since Ino can control Akamura since he is a dog afterall. Kiba is dead.
Hinata can Gentle Fist Akamaru instantly, as she knows the dog well. Kiba is dead.
Sakura just has to land one hit on Akamaru. Kiba is dead.

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

^ Can the Byakugan see Ino's jutsu?
If so ( probably it can, considering the combo enabled Ino to snipe Obito with 100% accuracy thanks to Hinata's guidance ), then Hinata.
If not, then its a case rock paper scissors:

Hinata can't beat Ino, Ino can't beat Sakura, Sakura can't beat Hinata.
Sakura has nice feats, but not only the Byakugan + Juuken combo is the nightmare of taijutsu users, but Hinata showed she can use Vacuum Palm, meaning she would hit Sakura from mid-range while she wouldn't be able to do a thing.
Likewise Sakura overpowered Ino's mind jutsu in the past, and considering her growth one can assume the same thing would happen a second time

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

@Uchiha_Blood

I think a lot of people forget this, because we haven't seen the rookies in a long time, but if you go off power scaling all the rookies should all still be a great deal stronger than ino. Just measure how much ino has grown from part one to now and give Kiba that same improvement. Ino has never been a fighter while Kiba is. Ino was the weakest in part 1, she was the weakest before the war, and she only seems strong now because we haven't seen shit from the others. Ino is undoubtedly the weakest of the rookies if you base it on one on one combat ability. Now if we are talking about usefulness then she moves up quite a few ranks while kiba is close to the lowest(if not the absolute lowest).

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

Originally Posted by NinjaStar

@Uchiha_Blood

I think a lot of people forget this, because we haven't seen the rookies in a long time, but if you go off power scaling all the rookies should all still be a great deal stronger than ino. Just measure how much ino has grown from part one to now and give Kiba that same improvement. Ino has never been a fighter while Kiba is. Ino was the weakest in part 1, she was the weakest before the war, and she only seems strong now because we haven't seen shit from the others. Ino is undoubtedly the weakest of the rookies if you base it on one on one combat ability. Now if we are talking about usefulness then she moves up quite a few ranks while kiba is close to the lowest(if not the absolute lowest).

How?
we are going by what we have been shown.
In terms of ability, Kiba needs Akamaru.
Ino just has to control Akamaru, which is well within her capabilities if she controlled either Obito or the Juubi.
Ino controls Akamaru and attacks Kiba. Kiba can't hurt Akamaru or anything.

Hinata like I said can just Vacuum Palm Akamaru. Sakura just has to hit the dog. Game Over.
Kiba has disappointed me. Same tactics always. Charge in with the Fang over Fang stuff. It's awesome in combos with other people, but in One-on-Ones he will be owned.

Tenten is the weakest actually.
Ino will control her. Let's face it.

You have to give data on how Ino is genuinely the weakest. Yeah as a character she was shown to be pathetic along with Sakura who was also shown to be pathetic as they cry for Sasuke who never once hinted that he liked them back and they know full well he would kill them if I came across them but they'd both defeat Kiba lol.
It's him and the dog. You take out the dog, it's over.

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

Originally Posted by Airgrimes

How?
we are going by what we have been shown.
In terms of ability, Kiba needs Akamaru.
Ino just has to control Akamaru, which is well within her capabilities if she controlled either Obito or the Juubi.
Ino controls Akamaru and attacks Kiba. Kiba can't hurt Akamaru or anything.

Hinata like I said can just Vacuum Palm Akamaru. Sakura just has to hit the dog. Game Over.
Kiba has disappointed me. Same tactics always. Charge in with the Fang over Fang stuff. It's awesome in combos with other people, but in One-on-Ones he will be owned.

Tenten is the weakest actually.
Ino will control her. Let's face it.

You have to give data on how Ino is genuinely the weakest. Yeah as a character she was shown to be pathetic along with Sakura who was also shown to be pathetic as they cry for Sasuke who never once hinted that he liked them back and they know full well he would kill them if I came across them but they'd both defeat Kiba lol.
It's him and the dog. You take out the dog, it's over.

Oh lol i didn't want to give "data" on how she is the weakest because of how off topic i felt it might be but if you insist...

I'll add to what i said about power scaling and every rookie being stronger than what we last saw of them(which includes kiba). Ino has 3 main qualities(as far as i can remember) when it comes to Battles: 1. Medical ninjutsu 2. her clan abilities 3. good old fashion plain taijutsu. Because we are talking about one on one battles her medical abilities can be completely disregarded. She isn't as good as Sakura to be able to heal herself mid battle, so thats one of "talents" that are out.

Now im aware that she has shown a vast improvement but it wasn't in taijutsu, it was her clan jutsus. I think we both can agree that Kiba is at least slightly(being generous) better than her in taijutsu or rather "close quarters combat", right? I mean Kiba is faster, his main focus is fighting(so he is likely to focus on it more which means better results) whereas Ino's is support, and there is essentially two kibas that Ino has to fight. I think its pretty clear that she is inferior in that regard but if you disagree i will be more than happy to elaborate.

So now that we have taken med ninjutsu off the list and taijutsu all she is left with is her clan abilities. While i will concede that if she hits Akumaru she can control him i have my doubts about her being able to control Kiba let alone both of them together. Besides the fact that Kiba is less intelligent than Sakura he has never shown anything that would indicate he has less mental power than her. What i mean is that Sakura forced Ino out by sheer will power IIRC, but we have seen that Sakura's resolve wavers all the time and she is far from being the most mentally stable/resilient of rookies, yet she as able to force Ino out(although this was with Naruto's help). As far as im concerned Kiba has never shown the same lack of resolve and confidence that sakura has and during his fight against the sound four member(i forgot his name ) he showed great determination, especially when it came to Akumaru. Again, my point isn't that kiba is some sort of mental Fort Knox but rather if Sakura could kick her out completely the least Kiba could do is resist her control if not kick her out all together, even if it took some time. But thats not the end of it...

IIRC Ino's main weakness of her mind transfer jutsu was(and still is???) the speed of the jutsu. It was amazingly slow back in part one. True that her dad complemented her saying that her timing had gotten better but every opponent it was used on was either unconscious(fodder zetsu), immobilized by Shikamaru(gold brother), or completely unaware(Obito); the later of which took 3 clan members(including ino) assisted by 3 hyuga and it only lasted for 2(?) seconds. Shikamaru has always said that she shouldn't use the jutsu unless she was absolutely sure the jutsu would hit because its super slow and if it misses her body is fucked(and not in the good way). Its not like Ino is jut hitting everybody with jutsu straight up. In fact i don't think she has EVER landed it on somebody without assistance, the art of surprise, or a crazy once in a life time plan. Now i point out the fact that her jutsu is slow only to to add to my next point.

Kiba is fast. Back in part 1 when he fought against Naruto one of the few things people complemented him on was his attack speed. He was so fast Naruto couldn't form the one seal it takes for kage bunshin. He was completely outclassing him(though Naruto was tired and he had a seal placed on him) and if it wasn't for PIS Naruto would have lost. If we want to also use the databook, at the start of part 2 Kiba had a 4.5 in speed which is tied for the highest of the rookies. It means he is in the same tier as people like Lee, Neji, and Sasuke. Add the fact that he has food pills and Akamaru(two kibas) that only makes his speed all the more deadly. But im not done lol...

Now lets say despite ALL OF THAT and Ino somehow hits Kiba or Akamaru, so what? She hit one opponent. If the person that doesn't get hit stabs Ino's defenseless body while it just sits there then the fight is over. Period. It doesn't matter if she took over one of their bodies if she can't defend her own. Nothing is stopping Kiba(because he is at least capable of thinking of this) from just killing Ino to end the fight except a poorly controlled Akamaru(which im sure she doesn't know how to use to his full potential). If she hits Kiba instead we have already seen that Akamaru will attack Kiba if need be. Ino is a support type and that is that. She lacks offensive capabilities, much like Shikamaru, but unlike him she isn't one of the smartest people in the manga.

Kiba would get one shotted by Sakura but people give Hinata waaaaaayyyy too much credit. Sure she showed some new moves but she has yet to show that she can see the Tenketsu, let alone hit them. So without that she won't be cutting him off from his chakra supply. Also just because she is a hyuga doesn't mean it is the end of the world going to fight one in taijutsu, especially somebody of Hinata's level. If you can i would like you to show me somewhere that she has EVER shown significant or at least a little impressive skill in Taijutsu. ANYWHERE. EVER.

Please baby baby baby please don't make me defend Tenten. Im already sick to my stomach that i had to for Kiba. She is stronger than Ino(in one on on combat) and that should be clear. See their tournament fight to see why.

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

Originally Posted by NinjaStar

@Uchiha_Blood

I think a lot of people forget this, because we haven't seen the rookies in a long time, but if you go off power scaling all the rookies should all still be a great deal stronger than ino. Just measure how much ino has grown from part one to now and give Kiba that same improvement. Ino has never been a fighter while Kiba is. Ino was the weakest in part 1, she was the weakest before the war, and she only seems strong now because we haven't seen shit from the others. Ino is undoubtedly the weakest of the rookies if you base it on one on one combat ability. Now if we are talking about usefulness then she moves up quite a few ranks while kiba is close to the lowest(if not the absolute lowest).

Because Ino grew way more than Kiba did, was displayed way more than Kiba, expecially in this war.
Same Ino who fought and wasn't slaughtered by Asuma, an Elite Jounin empowered by Edo Tensei.
What Kiba showed after the time-skip? A better nose. And that's about it, even Tenten with the fan has better feats than Part 2 Kiba, honestly

Originally Posted by NinjaStar

Kiba would get one shotted by Sakura but people give Hinata waaaaaayyyy too much credit. Sure she showed some new moves but she has yet to show that she can see the Tenketsu, let alone hit them. So without that she won't be cutting him off from his chakra supply. Also just because she is a hyuga doesn't mean it is the end of the world going to fight one in taijutsu, especially somebody of Hinata's level. If you can i would like you to show me somewhere that she has EVER shown significant or at least a little impressive skill in Taijutsu. ANYWHERE. EVER.

Please baby baby baby please don't make me defend Tenten. Im already sick to my stomach that i had to for Kiba. She is stronger than Ino(in one on on combat) and that should be clear. See their tournament fight to see why.

Keeping up with Neji while fighting the Zetsus ( saving his butt once, as implied by Neji's words ), and showing better stamina than the guy.
Not to say she's stronger than Neji, but she's definitely on Kiba's league, considering also she has an overwhelming advantage:
with the Twin Lions, she can parry whatever Kiba does with the exception of the Twin Wolf, while Kiba can only dodge, and even then he would fall prey to Vacuum Palm. If Hinata mastered Kaiten, then it isn't even a contest imo.

1010 is the strongest.
Why? Who other entity in Naruto is famous for the number 10 ?

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood

Because Ino grew way more than Kiba did, was displayed way more than Kiba, expecially in this war.
Same Ino who fought and wasn't slaughtered by Asuma, an Elite Jounin empowered by Edo Tensei.
What Kiba showed after the time-skip? A better nose. And that's about it, even Tenten with the fan has better feats than Part 2 Kiba, honestly

Im fully aware that kiba hasn't shown anything other than his improved sense of smell but do you think he stopped getting stronger? Rock lee, like Kiba, hasn't shown a damn new thing in the entirety of part 2. Do you think he had the same strength as part one? Probably not. Actually 100% not. Neji is having a shitty ass performance but im sure he is still stronger than than all the other rookies save for Lee(depending on number of gates now) and Choji. Ino went from being useless to being useful. Thats why it looked more impressive. Its like going from negative 20 to positive 5. Sure she increased 25 points but her ending score is still lower than where everybody else has been for a long time. She could have kicked a damn rock across the floor and we would have gone crazy for her because she still would have been doing something more impressive than all her past feats combined. Its true that what im doing is making an assumption but based on common sense and data books its a guarantee that Kiba has gotten more powerful. There is no reason to think otherwise. Im not saying make up new techniques or feats. Just powers scale based on the average increase of the rookies.

Quote:

Keeping up with Neji while fighting the Zetsus ( saving his butt once, as implied by Neji's words ), and showing better stamina than the guy.
Not to say she's stronger than Neji, but she's definitely on Kiba's league, considering also she has an overwhelming advantage:
with the Twin Lions, she can parry whatever Kiba does with the exception of the Twin Wolf, while Kiba can only dodge, and even then he would fall prey to Vacuum Palm. If Hinata mastered Kaiten, then it isn't even a contest imo.

She kept up with Neji because of the air palm tech, not in terms of speed or taijutsu. They fought back to back but they were fighting Zetsu. Again i ask, when has she EVER done something remotely impressive in close quarters combat? Also while yes she did show better stamina than Neji we know that Hinata was getting special treatment during the war. When they thought hinata was about to be killed they all freaked out but they didn't give a damn when Neji was captured by the zetsu. They have been babying her. It is Neji's duty to protect her because she is the heir to the thrown lol. He is probably tired from running around all day making sure she didn't get killed.

Also what is twin lions even do? It could make her hits stronger, it could make her hands chakra disruptors, it could make her overall stronger, or it could be used for decoration. My point is we have NOOOO idea how it works or what is does so we can't factor it in. Its impressive that she has used shown a jutsu Neji hasn't but until we know what it does, Kiba still eats her.

Quote:

1010 is the strongest.
Why? Who other entity in Naruto is famous for the number 10 ?

Lol i honestly don't think she gets enough credit but i don't want to look like a fool arguing for her of all people...

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

Originally Posted by NinjaStar

Im fully aware that kiba hasn't shown anything other than his improved sense of smell but do you think he stopped getting stronger? Rock lee, like Kiba, hasn't shown a damn new thing in the entirety of part 2. Do you think he had the same strength as part one? Probably not. Actually 100% not. Neji is having a shitty ass performance but im sure he is still stronger than than all the other rookies save for Lee(depending on number of gates now) and Choji. Ino went from being useless to being useful. Thats why it looked more impressive. Its like going from negative 20 to positive 5. Sure she increased 25 points but her ending score is still lower than where everybody else has been for a long time. She could have kicked a damn rock across the floor and we would have gone crazy for her because she still would have been doing something more impressive than all her past feats combined. Its true that what im doing is making an assumption but based on common sense and data books its a guarantee that Kiba has gotten more powerful. There is no reason to think otherwise. Im not saying make up new techniques or feats. Just powers scale based on the average increase of the rookies.

Don't base your opinions on Databooks, according to them Asuma is overall as strong as Hebi Sasuke and has a solid point above Hidan in taijutsu and speed, and yet Hidan toyed with Asuma while dodging Shikamaru's shadow.
Oh, and Tenten has the same level of intelligence Sasuke has, while Naruto is as smart/smarter than Neji

Still I get what you are saying, though I don't think we'll ever see confirmation of it:
Kiba is arguably the less relevant Rookie right now, even Tenten has the Rock Lee spin-off to give her a boost in popularity

Quote:

he kept up with Neji because of the air palm tech, not in terms of speed or taijutsu. They fought back to back but they were fighting Zetsu. Again i ask, when has she EVER done something remotely impressive in close quarters combat? Also while yes she did show better stamina than Neji we know that Hinata was getting special treatment during the war. When they thought hinata was about to be killed they all freaked out but they didn't give a damn when Neji was captured by the zetsu. They have been babying her. It is Neji's duty to protect her because she is the heir to the thrown lol. He is probably tired from running around all day making sure she didn't get killed.

Also what is twin lions even do? It could make her hits stronger, it could make her hands chakra disruptors, it could make her overall stronger, or it could be used for decoration. My point is we have NOOOO idea how it works or what is does so we can't factor it in. Its impressive that she has used shown a jutsu Neji hasn't but until we know what it does, Kiba still eats her.

Well they panicked because there were 5 guys ready to pierce ( ) her, and they managed it because they were disguised Zetsus.
The fact that she saved Neji's butt here also proves she isn't really useless.

As for Twin Lions, you're right we don't know, but we can assume it does:
-juuken damage, since its a Juuken move, counting Hinata's posture.
-its pretty strong, considering we know that manifestating visible, pure chakra its pretty taxing and difficult to do.
-has some form of resistance, being a giant chakra glove.

As you said its a lot of assumptions, but apparently Kishi doesn't want to bother showing other rookies in-fighting other than Team 10

Quote:

Lol i honestly don't think she gets enough credit but i don't want to look like a fool arguing for her of all people...

Why would you look like a fool?
1010 is beast, before the time-skip she was the strongest female Rookie ( I use the term for comodity, even though she isn't a rookie ) no doubt, and her attack isn't bad overall, considering she throws a shit-load of weapons at you.
For her style of fight, she would be very dangerous, say, against Sakura

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

Ninja Star that was a wall of text lol.
It's a good point. Kiba kicks Ino's ass in terms up-front physical combat, but here this;
Ino takes over the mind of a dog. uses the dog to attack Kiba. Surely Fang over Fangs at Kiba would change the fight?
It's by no means an ass-kicking from Kiba. In theory Ino can still win.

Hinata just has to Vacuum Palm Akamaru and the fight is over. Kiba's mindstate WILL change if his dog died. Hinata COULD kill Akamaru.
Sakura COULD kill Akamaru just the same with a hit. Fight over.

Kiba without Akamaru is really not the same threat as he is with his dog.
I can accept Kiba > Ino I guess, considering it's true that we havent seen Ino take over an opponents body in a one on one fight or without assisstance.

Kiba should defeat Tenten obviously.
But how strong do you think Kiba is without his dog?
Surely similar to how strong Kiba would be without his bugs?

And btw, Neji > Lee. I think Kishi has realized giving Lee the gates would be too much after we've seen the toll it puts on the Kage level Gai Maito.

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood

Don't base your opinions on Databooks, according to them Asuma is overall as strong as Hebi Sasuke and has a solid point above Hidan in taijutsu and speed, and yet Hidan toyed with Asuma while dodging Shikamaru's shadow.
Oh, and Tenten has the same level of intelligence Sasuke has, while Naruto is as smart/smarter than Neji

Still I get what you are saying, though I don't think we'll ever see confirmation of it:
Kiba is arguably the less relevant Rookie right now, even Tenten has the Rock Lee spin-off to give her a boost in popularity

Yeah i know what you mean about databooks but i was throwing them out there to drive the point home. The problem is though we are most likely NEVER going to see what Kiba can do lol. I agree, he is the damn most useless/least relevant of all the rookies now but that doesn't stop him from beating Ino's ass in a fight. Though i can see Asuma being as strong as a base Sasuke. It doesn't take into account power ups and special effects of jutsus.

Quote:

Well they panicked because there were 5 guys ready to pierce ( ) her, and they managed it because they were disguised Zetsus.
The fact that she saved Neji's butt here also proves she isn't really useless.

As for Twin Lions, you're right we don't know, but we can assume it does:
-juuken damage, since its a Juuken move, counting Hinata's posture.
-its pretty strong, considering we know that manifestating visible, pure chakra its pretty taxing and difficult to do.
-has some form of resistance, being a giant chakra glove.

As you said its a lot of assumptions, but apparently Kishi doesn't want to bother showing other rookies in-fighting other than Team 10

Damn i guess i forgot about that stuff. I must have blocked it out because i was so disappointed with how Neji was being handled(neji fan). But still Neji might have worse stamina than her now(for some reason) but he would still beat the hell out of her in a one on one fight. She has all of Neji's jutsus but she doesn't know how to use them as well.

Quote:

Why would you look like a fool?
1010 is beast, before the time-skip she was the strongest female Rookie ( I use the term for comodity, even though she isn't a rookie ) no doubt, and her attack isn't bad overall, considering she throws a shit-load of weapons at you.
For her style of fight, she would be very dangerous, say, against Sakura

Because even though i agree with what you are saying i couldn't help laughing as i was reading it. Thats how big of a joke tenten is. Nobody is even willing to give her character a chance because of her caliber. Its kinda like minato but in reverse. People assume he can beat anybody because of his caliber/hype but if you break it down, there are a lot of people he can't beat because of his current skillset. I do think tenten is stronger than a handful of the rookies...or at least she isn't the weakest.

@Airgrimes

Well she has to actually hit Akamaru but if she does than the fight turns into can Ino beat Kba while protecting her body. I personally don't think she can. Also she has never used her opponents jutsu while she invaded their body(only straight up taijutsu) so i doubt she could use fang over fang.

Why would one air palm be the end up Akamaru? I now it blew back a lot of fodder zetsu but again, they were fodder. And yes i do think Kiba would get his world rocked by Sakura.

I think Kiba without his dog is stronger than Shino without his bugs. Shino doesn't have any sort of close combat feats at all so if you take away his bugs he is left with nothing but his intelligence which is frankly nowhere near high enough to be a game changer.

I think Neji passed rock lee up after the time skip only because he actually showed improvement whereas Lee hasn't shown anything at all since part 1. But i don't think thats the reason he hasn't shown him use gates. I think the reason is that Gai is essentially another rock lee except stronger. Why show both when you can only show one? Its likely why Neji hasn't gotten much pt either, because Hinata is the one doing everything. They have the exact same skillset so why show both when only one will suffice?

Re: WHERE THE HELL ARE THOSE ROOKIES?

Originally Posted by Jessie

So after the last chapter, the rookies didn't do much as the fodder took center stage in Shikadad's plan.

It feels like Kishi might be cleansing the battlefield. After a bunch of ninja get wiped out, the rookies move into the spotlight. Madara is going to kill, and the only thing more powerful than him is the rookie's plot shields. Madara can wipe out 10,000 ninja, but he can't kill Rock Lee and the others The K11 are the true immortals.

I can also see Shikaku losing contact with the army forcing Shikamaru to take over. Ino's dad probably reached his limit.

The only problem is Ino has to fight with someone who can guard her body or she is totally useless. The is the fatal flaw of the mind switch. It only works as part of a team.

should have been expected because this is a world war not just a kohona war so every village had a role. i think people thought the rookies were the only ones showing up but it was the whole alliance and the rookies were not gonna show off. if this was just kohona they would have been important but every village has to play a role.

Can we agree that someone in this manga that is close to Naruto, needs to die? So Naruto can prove to Obito that you don't have to change your outlook on life just because someone close to you died by anothers hands.

If you were to get rid of one person, or a few people from the rookies or the army that is close to Naruto, who would you think would be a good character to die for that growth or adult development in Naruto?

someone close to naruto already died it was jiriaya and he did not break like obito i think the whole dying thing has been dealt wit. unless kishi will make it redundant again and have tsunade die.