If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

I think the many people who have been saying they're confused by the series should take the opportunity to go back and figure out the things they don't get, and the people who consider regular releases more important to them than the actual story itself should reevaluate whether they should read DGM at all.

DGM sells too well in Japan to be cancelled. As they come out, every DGM volume (including the latest ones) jumps to #3 to #5-ish in the top 30 rankings on ANN. Also anyone who knows writing knows that Hoshino has put a *LOT* into this series. She and the editors who understand this are not going to allow this series to be thrown away so easily. I'm not sure what the story is regarding having assistants, but it seems to me the pressure is on for her to be doing all the drawing. She draws such real and varied expressions for her characters, I can see how it would be hard for her to express just what kind of expression she wants on Allen's or whoever else's face, for example, when something happens to them.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

Originally Posted by kannazuki

I think the many people who have been saying they're confused by the series should take the opportunity to go back and figure out the things they don't get, and the people who consider regular releases more important to them than the actual story itself should reevaluate whether they should read DGM at all.

DGM sells too well in Japan to be cancelled. As they come out, every DGM volume (including the latest ones) jumps to #3 to #5-ish in the top 30 rankings on ANN. Also anyone who knows writing knows that Hoshino has put a *LOT* into this series. She and the editors who understand this are not going to allow this series to be thrown away so easily. I'm not sure what the story is regarding having assistants, but it seems to me the pressure is on for her to be doing all the drawing. She draws such real and varied expressions for her characters, I can see how it would be hard for her to express just what kind of expression she wants on Allen's or whoever else's face, for example, when something happens to them.

Meh, I don't know. I haven't really thought this through, so I might make a mistake or two and jump to conclusions and all.

Well, well. DGM seems to sell well enough. I don't know the numbers, but I'll just trust your pieces of information. Those numbers seem rather safe. The thing is, DGM doesn't come out regularly, so it's not bought regularly, making those numbers rather weak in comparison to other manga, which sell less, but on a regular basis. Let's take a look at a year. Hoshino manages to squeeze out a single volume, which 5 people buy. Manga-X is bought by only 2 people. Manga-ka-X manages to publish 3-4 volumes in a year, though. Now do the math. (To be honest, I don't know how many volumes are released per yer when it comes to monthly releases, but you get the idea.)
As for the work put into the series.....who cares? Publishers sure don't. Soooo many manga got canned, even though the manga-ka put all his love into his/her series. Even more popular titles such as Shaman King or Saint Seiya. Now SQ isn't WSJ and there's a reason it got moved, but if she can't keep a monthly schedule either...I don't know...
As for "She draws such real and varied expressions for her characters..." Erm. No, really. That sounds as though she was the only one doing that. Her drawings are great and stuff, but that doesn't justify all the breaks. Moreover, if that were the case (that she needs half a year to get the right expressions) she'd sacrifice the plot and the reader's enjoyment of the series for comparatevily irrelevant stuff. Not the smartest thing to do.
Something that speaks for the series' survival is the one-shot Hoshino published in Miracle. Makes you think the editorial department trusts her enough for now.
Still, I don't have the feeling it's as safe as you make it sound. I for one would probably spend my money on other manga by now.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

As I understand it, Hunter x Hunter, which is a *weekly* in WSJ, goes on much longer hiatuses than DGM, and when it finally comes back, it's short and noticeably badly drawn... yet it sells well so it's been safe.

The "but they're not making money in between" argument (which I used to subscribe to myself) doesn't necessarily matter since they're not *spending* money in between either. As long as they aren't losing hordes of paying readers in Japan, it shouldn't matter to them. In addition I find it difficult to believe publishers are all that excited about taking chances with totally unknown new talent. That kind of risk is not something they're fond of in either publishing or show biz (something screenwriters and authors complain about all the time), from any of the Western industry literature I've read. I see little reason why that would be different in Japan. They also won't likely want to have to deal with the inevitable backlash from letting paying fans down. Hence all the apologies for worrying the fans in the actual hiatus notice they eventually published.

All the same, keep in mind I haven't been saying I know for sure it won't be cancelled. It's more that I don't see why people are taking this particular hiatus and treating it like a turning point. I think it makes more sense to follow Occam's Razor and go with precedent until we see reason to believe otherwise. If people are really worried about either cancellation or irregular releases and that has taken priority for them, then they really should just figure out whether they consider it worth continuing for themselves rather than going around speculating based on absolutely nothing that the series will be cancelled, and causing scares that might affect (thankfully only foreign) sales due the panic caused among people who don't think to calm down and check the facts.

Just speaking for myself alone here, I've found DGM immensely enjoyable until now and I'm prepared to read the story up until it ends, regardless of whether it's completed or not. Meaning that although I'd obviously prefer it continue, *it makes no difference to my purchases* if DGM is cancelled. I'm going to remain a fan regardless. I'm going to continue to enjoy going back and peeling back the layers of the series whenever I can. I'm speaking from a sort of acceptance that whatever happens happens, not just wishful thinking that it'll continue no matter what. The only thing that bothers me about it all is the potential chilling effect of people all over the non-Japanese net saying that the series is going to be cancelled-- because sadly, THAT probably has an effect on sales (just luckily for those of us who read Japanese, not in Japan).

So I think that rather than stirring up ill-founded, rumour-based panic that may lead to less sales and only go to fulfill the "cancellation" prophecy for foreign language localizations only (and lol I can just see how people would complain even more when they keep publishing in Japanese only...), people should make their choice and if they've decided to stay with the series, then take it as it comes.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

If I was Suiesha, I'd take DGM out of SQ completely and have it come out in volumes only.

Like most people have said above, DGM sells well. I doubt releasing straight to volume would have any serious impact on sales.
On that note, using Occam's Razor, that would be the next logical step: Hoshino couldn't handle weekly? No problem, bumped down to monthly. Hoshino can't handle monthly? Let's just go straight to volume release. Frequent monthly breaks aside, this is the second time we have such a long, out of the blue break. Unless Suiesha wants to keep on playing this game, some thing has got to give.

My problem isn't with the hiatus itself, but with the fact that it wasn't officially announced. Yeah, Hoshino had side projects to work on, but you'd think 7+ years publishing and both her and her editors would know where her limit is at. At the very least, they could have made it official and announced it before hand. Looking at her releases for the last 2 years, it seems she gets overworked with 30 pages a month, and takes very frequent one month breaks. Yeah, I think the art is wonderful and it's obvious she gives a lot of thought to each chapter, but seriously? 30 pages every 2 months?? But she still finds time and ability to work on time consuming side projects? If she hit a wall with DGM, and needs an extended break to gather her thoughts, then so be it. But I find it odd that, in this particular case, it appeared as if she totally blew off DGM for Valvrave and Ayakashi no Ou.

It's a mixture of everything that gets to me. I absolutely love this series, but looking at this closely, yeah. I think I should be worried that with every year we get less and less chapters, without an explanation or warning. Which becomes exponentially fishier when she releases side projects as well. On one hand, I wish Hoshino good luck and not to stress herself and take care of herself. On the other, I want to tell her to get her shit life together.

Bottom line: If Hoshino is bored of DGM, she should just say so. I'm sure Suiesha would accept DGM back with open arms when Hoshino is ready, but this game of cat and mouse is starting to get a wee-bit ridiculous.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

I'm not aware of any series that isn't serialized in a magazine prior to being released in volumes. It wouldn't make sense not to do so, for the sake of awareness and advertising money that can be earned from it being in the magazine.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

I'm with you until the stuff about side projects, and can you give some examples of other popular shounen series that went straight to volume-by-volume releases only? Honestly, I don't see how that would help anything at all. It's not like the volumes would get shorter.

The side projects are from last year. As far as I've seen, all she's announced as doing right now is judging a contest for new mangaka. And that contest's entries aren't even in yet. I see a lot of people jumping to conclusions about the mangaka's interest in her own series but I see no indication in the chapters, interviews, or anywhere else that she's "run out of ideas." On the contrary it looks like she's just getting to stuff she's been planning to reveal since almost the beginning of the series. What writer on the planet would "run out of ideas" at such a point? These are things a writer gets exhilarated about, not bored.

Those of us who are generally able-bodied at all times should consider how lucky we are to be so. Whatever else is possibly going on, there are definite physical issues at play here, and it appears that it's simply not done to have other persons draw a series for Jump publications at the very least.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

How goofy. xP

This is rather weakly drawn compared to the comic version of herself she usually draws for the volume extras. Where is it from?

And... Good or bad? Looks pretty neutral to me. She's just asking people to read her first piece in Miracle Jump (more precisely, she says she'll be happy if they do, but that's just Japanese style politeness).

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

Originally Posted by xi0

I'm not aware of any series that isn't serialized in a magazine prior to being released in volumes. It wouldn't make sense not to do so, for the sake of awareness and advertising money that can be earned from it being in the magazine.

Dont think its impossible but its more a symbiotic relationship between the manga and the parrent magazine.

Its also a brilliant setup where you basically sell the same stuff twice. Once bundled in weekly/monthly editions of Jump secondly the volumes of each respective manga. It keeps the sales up. Both of the magazines and the Volumes. Ofc the artists are under contract thus Jump profits twice of the same story. If not more due to bundles and foreign translated versions.

So seeing it release separate i doubt it. The relation that exists in japan with regard to its release method is to much embedded into the industry.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

Originally Posted by ca12nag3

Dont think its impossible but its more a symbiotic relationship between the manga and the parrent magazine.

Its also a brilliant setup where you basically sell the same stuff twice. Once bundled in weekly/monthly editions of Jump secondly the volumes of each respective manga. It keeps the sales up. Both of the magazines and the Volumes. Ofc the artists are under contract thus Jump profits twice of the same story. If not more due to bundles and foreign translated versions.

So seeing it release separate i doubt it. The relation that exists in japan with regard to its release method is to much embedded into the industry.

It's not impossible, I just don't know of such a thing happening. It's just how it's done. An author creates a series on a schedule and it's featured in a magazine. When the volumes come out, they're advertised heavily in the magazine.

And Shueisha doesn't really profit off of sales of its magazines. They're advertising for other merchandise - mainly toys, anime, videogames and the tankoubons themselves. If they're at all profitable, it's probably only in a marginal sense, in that they don't lose money by printing them. The weekly magazines use the worst ink and recycled paper. The biweekly and monthly magazines are somewhat better. But with something that has the circulation numbers of WSJ, costs are cut by cutting back on the quality for a reason. The bound tankoubons are sold for a lot more than the magazines and for good reason.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

The thing about straight to volume releases is that people won't know about the content. Even though I still find it strange, readers in Japan often leave out volumes and just don't buy them, because certain characters don't appear, they don't like the arc and all that jazz. So, many people would hesitate to buy it. Furthermore, every manga would suffer from less attention (yes, even One Piece)...releasing it only in volumes wouldn't help at all, quite the contrary.

I agree with kannazuki about the ideas thing. Hoshino had to plot worked out for ages. That's what I always liked about DGM. Then again, this fact makes her hiatuses even more bothersome. If you have everything in your head, just draw it, girl! I'm aware of her wrist problems, but that doesn't help the fact that DGM's pacing sucks horse balls. I don't care if she only releases 20 pages each month, but please, give us something on a constant basis. When she's on hiatus I'm forgetting details that make everything harder to understand and no, I don't have the time to re-read the series during every single hiatus. Moreover, there are other manga, other plots and characters, that want to fill my head. It's only natural that I stop caring about the series when I don't get anything to feed my interest.

Originally Posted by kannazuki

As I understand it, Hunter x Hunter, which is a *weekly* in WSJ, goes on much longer hiatuses than DGM, and when it finally comes back, it's short and noticeably badly drawn... yet it sells well so it's been safe.

You can't compare DGM to Hunter x Hunter. Two different worlds. HxH sells much more, is way more popular (and better) and by a successful author who has YuYu Hakusho and Level E under his belt.
Really no point in comparing them.

The "but they're not making money in between" argument (which I used to subscribe to myself) doesn't necessarily matter since they're not *spending* money in between either. As long as they aren't losing hordes of paying readers in Japan, it shouldn't matter to them. In addition I find it difficult to believe publishers are all that excited about taking chances with totally unknown new talent. That kind of risk is not something they're fond of in either publishing or show biz (something screenwriters and authors complain about all the time), from any of the Western industry literature I've read. I see little reason why that would be different in Japan.

All the same, keep in mind I haven't been saying I know for sure it won't be cancelled. It's more that I don't see why people are taking this particular hiatus and treating it like a turning point. I think it makes more sense to follow Occam's Razor and go with precedent until we see reason to believe otherwise. If people are really worried about either cancellation or irregular releases and that has taken priority for them, then they really should just figure out whether they consider it worth continuing for themselves rather than going around speculating based on absolutely nothing that the series will be cancelled, and causing scares that might affect (thankfully only foreign) sales due the panic caused among people who don't think to calm down and check the facts.

Just speaking for myself alone here, I've found DGM immensely enjoyable until now and I'm prepared to read the story up until it ends, regardless of whether it's completed or not. Meaning that although I'd obviously prefer it continue, *it makes no difference to my purchases* if DGM is cancelled. I'm going to remain a fan regardless. I'm going to continue to enjoy going back and peeling back the layers of the series whenever I can. I'm speaking from a sort of acceptance that whatever happens happens, not just wishful thinking that it'll continue no matter what. The only thing that bothers me about it all is the potential chilling effect of people all over the non-Japanese net saying that the series is going to be cancelled-- because sadly, THAT probably has an effect on sales (just luckily for those of us who read Japanese, not in Japan).

So I think that rather than stirring up ill-founded, rumour-based panic that may lead to less sales and only go to fulfill the "cancellation" prophecy for foreign language localizations only (and lol I can just see how people would complain even more when they keep publishing in Japanese only...), people should make their choice and if they've decided to stay with the series, then take it as it comes.

It's not a turning point. More a thought-provoking reminder that Hoshino can't keep up a monthly schedule and went on a hiatus AGAIN. I can only speak for myself, but as I mentioned before, I'm losing interest in the series seeing how its author works on different projects and neglects this series on a regular basis. Trust me, the manga market in Japan is big enough. Fans will find other series to care for. I, for instance, haven't picked up the last two volumes, which were released in Germany, yet, despite having been a biiiig fan of it. I'd rather buy I Am A Hero, Oyasumi Punpun, Billy Bat, Tegami Bachi and so on. If I lived in Japan, I would've stopped purchasing the volumes way earlier. It's not like I don't have any patience. Got lots of it, but man, there's a limit, especially when there are so many more and better manga out there.
Really, I believe DGM will keep its core audience (even though they seem quite annoyed as well), however, other readers who will use those hiatuses to move on and find other, maybe better stuff, will probably forget the series over time. It's not like I want it to be cancelled...I just don't see how it's supposed to continue if Hoshino makes the same mistakes over and over again. Merely a feeling.
I already dropped it (though that doesn't mean much because we didn't get a chapter since then...). Basically, I made my decision. Many will probably follow my example (not saying they should) and I can understand that. I also understand those loyal fans. Wish it would work for me as well...

-----

I should really think before I write. This text is probably a mess....

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

Originally Posted by Googlez_kun

The thing about straight to volume releases is that people won't know about the content. Even though I still find it strange, readers in Japan often leave out volumes and just don't buy them, because certain characters don't appear, they don't like the arc and all that jazz. So, many people would hesitate to buy it. Furthermore, every manga would suffer from less attention (yes, even One Piece)...releasing it only in volumes wouldn't help at all, quite the contrary.

I agree with kannazuki about the ideas thing. Hoshino had to plot worked out for ages. That's what I always liked about DGM. Then again, this fact makes her hiatuses even more bothersome. If you have everything in your head, just draw it, girl! I'm aware of her wrist problems, but that doesn't help the fact that DGM's pacing sucks horse balls. I don't care if she only releases 20 pages each month, but please, give us something on a constant basis. When she's on hiatus I'm forgetting details that make everything harder to understand and no, I don't have the time to re-read the series during every single hiatus. Moreover, there are other manga, other plots and characters, that want to fill my head. It's only natural that I stop caring about the series when I don't get anything to feed my interest.

You can't compare DGM to Hunter x Hunter. Two different worlds. HxH sells much more, is way more popular (and better) and by a successful author who has YuYu Hakusho and Level E under his belt.
Really no point in comparing them.

True, I guess.

It's not a turning point. More a thought-provoking reminder that Hoshino can't keep up a monthly schedule and went on a hiatus AGAIN. I can only speak for myself, but as I mentioned before, I'm losing interest in the series seeing how its author works on different projects and neglects this series on a regular basis. Trust me, the manga market in Japan is big enough. Fans will find other series to care for. I, for instance, haven't picked up the last two volumes, which were released in Germany, yet, despite having been a biiiig fan of it. I'd rather buy I Am A Hero, Oyasumi Punpun, Billy Bat, Tegami Bachi and so on. If I lived in Japan, I would've stopped purchasing the volumes way earlier. It's not like I don't have any patience. Got lots of it, but man, there's a limit, especially when there are so many more and better manga out there.
Really, I believe DGM will keep its core audience (even though they seem quite annoyed as well), however, other readers who will use those hiatuses to move on and find other, maybe better stuff, will probably forget the series over time. It's not like I want it to be cancelled...I just don't see how it's supposed to continue if Hoshino makes the same mistakes over and over again. Merely a feeling.I already dropped it (though that doesn't mean much because we didn't get a chapter since then...). Basically, I made my decision. Many will probably follow my example (not saying they should) and I can understand that. I also understand those loyal fans. Wish it would work for me as well...

-----

I should really think before I write. This text is probably a mess....

I scrapped my entire initial post. Why? Well im rather disappointed in the fact that people seem to forget that artists that write manga put their heart and soul in it. Sacrifice hours upon hours to meet deadlines. It takes a lot to even make it to serialization. And each and every one of them deserved that spot. If you like the story or not is up to each and every one of you.
If you found your way to MH some day you must have realized that this place is for people that love manga, and subsequently the artists that wrote it. Appreciate what is given to us and even if disappointed they do their best to give us fans a great time reading it.
Most of us are old enough to know that life doesnt always treats us fair and it can be hard, also for the manga artists. So Hoshino im sure tries her best to write DGM at her own pace.
And even if thats not good enough for some of us, you could leave it be and move on. Without making accusations towards the manga artists or to state that people will follow your example of dropping it.

Re: DGM Hang Out Thread - Part 1

I know its really difficult to see this whole thing happening with the series the waiting but it is what it is. Honestly i think whats always been cool about DGM is the fact that after the hiatus and stuff we always get some more interesting plot stuff when we get the new chapter in my opinion. But for now i wait patiently and watch Valrave The Liberator and read her one shots and stuff which ties me over ps on a random note one of the characters in Valrave looks like the 3rd exorcist hahah