We know that hard-line conservatives are riled up. But so are hard-left Democrats and their gay allies.

It was that last race, in which a moderate Republican found herself forced to drop out after a rebellion by hard-line conservatives, that led Nagourney to speculate about a “prolonged battle” within the G.O.P. — and he has plenty of company:

— Ruy Teixeira on The Times Op-Ed page: “If any repudiation is going on, perhaps it is of the conservative wing of the Republican Party. Democrats captured New York’s 23rd Congressional District for the first time since 1872, as Bill Owens defeated Doug Hoffman, the hard-line conservative who forced a moderate Republican out of the race. Mr. Hoffman’s narrow defeat is now likely to embolden conservatives — who far outnumber moderates in the party — to challenge Republican incumbents they find ideologically impure.”

— George Stephanopoulos of ABC News (courtesy of NewsBusters.com): “But, what’s most interesting here is civil war inside the Republican Party. You saw this conservative candidate just come in and swamp the Republican who was pro-choice, pro-gay rights. And what the White House is trying to do even if they lose here is exploit- is fan the flames of this civil war. ”

— Philip Rucker and Perry Bacon Jr. at The Washington Post: “As the party turns toward the 2010 midterm elections, pitched battles between moderates and conservatives — and between the Washington establishment and the conservative grass roots — are underway from Florida to Illinois to California. Conservative activists, emboldened after forcing out the moderate Republican nominee in a New York congressional race, said they will fan out nationwide and challenge Republican candidates whom they deem too moderate or insufficiently principled … In Washington, some party leaders worry that viable moderate candidates could be damaged if they bow to conservative pressures, particularly in Senate races in California, Connecticut, Illinois, Kentucky and New Hampshire. Sen. John Cornyn (Tex.), chairman of the National Republican Senatorial Committee, cautioned that hotly contested primaries could leave eventual nominees ‘broke and bloody.’ ”

— Charles Mahtesian and Alex Isenstadt at Politico: “In what could be a nightmare scenario for Republican Party officials, conservative activists are gearing up to challenge leading GOP candidates in more than a dozen key House and Senate races in 2010. Conservatives and tea party activists had already set their sights on some of the GOP’s top Senate recruits — a list that includes Gov. Charlie Crist in Florida, former Rep. Rob Simmons in Connecticut and Rep. Mark Kirk in Illinois, among others … Activists predict a wave that could roll from California to Kentucky to New Hampshire and that could leave even some GOP incumbents — Utah Sen. Bob Bennett is one — facing unexpectedly fierce challenges from their right flank.”

The story of NY-23 is not “conservatives beat moderates” or “conservative loses to Democrat”.

The story of NY-23 is “the Right starts dismantling the Republican establishment.” This is about how the Republican Party is defined and who defines it.

Right now, the movement wants the Republican Party to be defined by opposition to big government. Gradually, as new leaders arise, we will demand that the Republican Party be defined by its own solutions, as well, but rebuilding is an incremental process. We can hammer out the policy agenda and the boundaries of the coalition later.

For now, our job is to disrupt the establishment GOP. If we beat Democrats while we’re at it, great. But the first priority is to fix the Drunk Party – the Living Dead establishment Republicans. They’re history. They just don’t know it yet.

NY-23 was the first shot in that war. It was a direct hit. Next year, we start storming the castle.

Certainly primaries are a better way to handle intraparty warfare than third-party challenges, but they’re not perfect. My sense of the looming Crist/Rubio battle in Florida is that it’s going to get nasty and that Crist will likely end up being just as demonized as the eventual Democratic nominee, if not more so. And if that happens — and Crist wins the primary anyway — I’m not sure how the fences end up being mended in time for a unified party-line vote in the general election. It’s hard to go from “this guy’s a … RINO who’s no better than the Democrats who are destroying the country” to “this guy represents most of my interests” in a few months. I don’t know what the solution is to that, but I think Ace is smart in trying to build bridges between “pragmatists” and “maximalists” long in advance. The nastier things get, the more likely hardcore supporters in the primary loser’s camp end up staying home for the general, and the more likely a Democratic Congress becomes.

Why is it that when looking back at an election in which very little went right for Democrats, so many folks are seeing nothing but dread and doom for the G.O.P. Apparently, everyone agrees that for the party in power, unity behind a popular president is something of a security blanket. Everyone, that is, except George Soros and his minions: “MoveOn.org is sending out emails today seeking more contributions for its campaign to defeat any Democratic senator who does not fully support Obamacare,” reported The Washington Examiner’s Byron York on Tuesday. He had more:

Yesterday the left-wing activist group asked members to contribute “to a primary challenge against any Democratic senator who helps Republicans block an up-or-down vote on health care reform.” Today, MoveOn reports that it has received $2 million in pledges in less than 24 hours. “It’s a clear sign of how angry progressives would be at any Democrat who helps filibuster reform,” MoveOn executive director Justin Ruben writes in the new email …

MoveOn’s new campaign comes amid much discussion in the political world of divisions among Republicans, with many analysts reading the presence of third-party candidates in New York’s 23rd District and in New Jersey, and coming primary battles in Florida and elsewhere, as proof of deep, and perhaps disastrous, divisions inside the GOP. One publication recently dubbed it a “nightmare scenario” for Republicans. But MoveOn’s new threat of primary attacks on Democratic lawmakers suggests that the story might be a bit one-sided. Democrats who stray from progressive orthodoxy might be in for big trouble — and the divisions inside the Democratic party might be just as big a deal as the problems inside the GOP.

MoveOn executive director Justin Ruben says the group has raised $3,578,117 for the project and is thinking of new ways to punish errant Democratic lawmakers.

“It’s a huge sum, and the clearest signal yet that any Democrat who helps Republicans filibuster health care reform will face an enormous backlash from the grassroots,” writes Ruben. And now, working in conjunction with Howard Dean’s old organization Democracy for America, MoveOn is starting a drive to take away the committee chairmanships of any Democrat who fails to live up to MoveOn’s progressive standards. “Many of these senators hold coveted committee chairmanships that give them significant power within the Senate,” Ruben writes. “Our friends at Democracy for America have launched an open letter urging Senate Democrats to strip committee chairmanships from any Democrat who filibusters health care.” Ruben says that more than 66,000 MoveOn and Democracy for America members have pledged to contribute.

“Chairing a committee is a privilege, not a right,” Ruben continues. “So if a member of the Democratic Congress joins with Republicans in the most important vote in a generation, then they certainly don’t deserve a position of power controlled by Democrats.”

The latest statements from MoveOn and Democracy for America come amid continued media analysis of divisions in the Republican party. MoveOn’s threats — backed by millions of dollars and tens of thousands of progressive activists — have received far less attention.

Not from the Opinionator, Byron. And not from conservative bloggers, either. John Hinderaker of Powerline thinks a rebellion on the fringe may hurt centrist Democrats more than moderate Republicans: “The Democrats’ problem is compounded by the fact that not only most of the party’s energy, but most of its money is on the far left. Perhaps the ill-fated Ned Lamont campaign was only the beginning, and we are about to witness an all-out attack on Democratic moderates.”

“Heh,” responds Big Tent Democrat at TalkLeft. “Tell that to Dede Scozzafava, Charlie Crist and Carly Fiorina. To be fair, too many progressive bloggers engage in the same hypocrisy. I like to be consistent and I think I am – everybody should be fighting for what they believe in and every public official should face primary challengers. Of course, I will favor those candidates who promote my views. As everyone else should. Pols are pols my friends.”

But the conservative blogger Betsy Newmark thinks that Blue Dog Democrats might want to take a hint from pragmatic Republicans: “They should acknowledge what the Republicans are starting to learn. Certain districts aren’t ideologically one way or the other. The only way a candidate will win there is to play to the middle. Just as the Republicans should accept a Mike Castle in Delaware or a Mark Kirk in Illinois as the best they can do to win in those states, the liberals have to accept their moderates or they can kiss their majorities good-bye.”

As for the threat involving chairmanships, writes Newmark:

I predict that the leftists will have just as much luck at doing that as conservative Republicans had in trying to remove a Republican like Mark Hatfield from his Senate chairmanship after the 1994 takeover. There was a push to remove him from his chairmanship of the Senate Appropriations Committee after he voted against the balanced budget amendment, thus sinking it. Rick Santorum led that movement. But then the caucus went behind closed doors and Mark Hatfield emerged with his chairmanship intact. I predict the same thing will happen behind closed doors of the Democratic caucus. When it comes down to it, respect for seniority will trump any desire to enforce ideological purity. Senators will start to wonder what will happen to their positions if they strike down the old rules. Robert Byrd will totter up and make a passionate speech evoking the sacred rules of the Senate and caucus and the move will die.

But, by all means, let’s have Moveon.org get out there and run ads attacking their own members and running primary challenges. We’ll see if the media regards that with as much simulated dismay as they regarded the move to push out Dede Scozzafava.

While MoveOn isn’t naming names at this point, Eric Kleefeld at TPM has a good guess: “While no specific Senator is mentioned, it should be noted that Sen. Blanche Lincoln (D-AR), who is up for re-election in 2010 and is currently facing a tough race, could find herself becoming a top target of this push from the left.”

Whether or not there is a fight brewing among Democrats on health reform, election week 2009 did give hints that a rift has formed on another issue: gay marriage. Things got going on Monday when Joe Sudbay of Americablog noted a new memo from Organizing for America, an advocacy project under the direction of the Democratic National Committee:

The Executive Director of Organizing for America sent an email to Mainers telling them to vote. Someone I know just got it:

Tomorrow is Election Day once again in Maine. It’s as important as ever for you to get out to vote. And just like you did last year, bring friends, family, and co-workers with you when you go to the polls.

Funny thing (or not), OFA forgot to tell Mainers what issues are on the ballot and how to vote on those issues. For example, there’s no mention of Question 1, the measure to repeal Maine’s marriage equality law – i.e., repeal gay marriage – in the email (really big surprise, huh?)

Thanks for nothing, OFA, DNC and Obama administration. Time and time again, those folks have shown they are unabashed about injecting themselves into state level politics. But, not in Maine. And, not when gay issues are involved. They just won’t do anything that might indicate support for marriage equality, support for gay equality.

Among gay rights advocates already frustrated by Obama’s foot-dragging on their issues, this one threatens to balloon into a new controversy:

Obama’s outside political operation is urging supporters in Maine to turn out to the polls for local elections — without making any mention in its emails of the nationally-watched anti-gay ballot initiative in the state.

Organization for America is beginning to take heat for this, but OFA officials are declining to comment in response to this blog’s inquiries.

The reason this could become a real issue for OFA is that the vote on the Maine initiative — which would repeal gay marriage — is expected to be super close. And a loss — particularly one rooted in turnout, which OFA has the capacity to boost — will result in fierce recriminations.

What’s more, tensions are already so raw because of a host of other ways gay advocates feel let down by the new president that they may be even more inclined to point a finger at OFA in the event of a loss. This one could get ugly.

And it did, quickly, when Sudbay’s colleague John Aravosis got news of a follow-up missive from O.F.A.:

Today things got worse. We just received a copy of an email message that OFA sent to Maine voters yesterday asking them to get involved in…. New Jersey!

So now we know the rest of the story. This wasn’t an issue of OFA not getting involved in politics (they are, after all, an arm of the DNC – that’s what they do, politics). They absolutely get involved in state elections, so long as the election isn’t about the g-a-y.

And actually, even that isn’t exactly true. The DNC under Howard Dean donated $25,000 to the battle to defeat Prop 8 in California (albeit a bit late), before Barack Obama became president. Democrats asked Barack Obama’s DNC to donate to the Maine effort as well – the DNC ignored the request.

Tell us again why any gay voter should help the DNC ever again? And where is our President, the “fierce advocate”? This is his list, and OFA’s top staffers were all the top staffers on the Obama campaign. So, who came up with the idea to ask Maine voters to contact New Jersey when Maine has its own hugely important election? Did the White House have a say in OFA not helping gay Americans keep their civil rights in Maine?

Then things got really confusing, with Aravosis claiming that the D.N.C. and its treasurer, Andrew Tobias, were sending out conflicting and “untrue” explanations of what happened (see here and here).

Andy seems to mock LGBT complaints … by saying it would have been nice to ask Mainers to vote No ‘in case there may have been an email-enabled Organizing for America activist someplace in Maine who did NOT know where Maine Democrats stood on this issue. (Out of the country without Internet access until the night before the election?)’

Again, Andy, you’re missing the point. One of the biggest priorities for this campaign in an off-year election was turning out young voters, and that was no secret. Lots of OFA activists are young people. I’ve organized GOTV for young people in 2004 at my alma mater. Young people don’t vote just because they know where Maine Dems stand on the issue or they get a bland OFA e-mail reminding them to vote. College students vote after you’ve given them 25 reasons to, dorm-stormed, called them, set up voter reg tables in the student union, set up shuttle buses to polling places (which the No On 1 campaign did at UM-Orono), have Dave Matthews Band perform at their campus to encourage voting, and basically drag them kicking and screaming to do it. If you want to win campaigns, you have to mobilize people, not just send them an e-mail and pat yourself on the back.

So rolling your eyes and saying “but OFA activists knew where Maine Dems stood on the issue anyway, and we sent them an e-mail, so what’s all the fuss about” is irresponsible.

“Let’s just say that a little leaked email proves LGBTs are seen as the easy gAyTM to the DNC that can be manipulated, ignored, and pickpocketed as mob rule strips us of civil rights without a finger being lifted to help at the eleventh hour,” adds the influential gay blogger Pam Spaulding of Pam’s House Blend. “It’s worse — stripping resources at the time of need.”

She offers a call to arms along the lines of MoveOn’s:

I don’t know about you, but at the very least, it’s a peek at the kind the two-timing that goes on in national politics with constituencies they find “troublesome” or a perceived “liability” (save the $$$, of course). The difference is that the peek inside makes you realize how easily you’ve been had …

Shut the gAyTM down; only give directly to candidates and organizations you believe are truly working in your best interest. Not a penny to the DNC; it’s the only leverage you have as an average citizen. The big donors in our community have to take a stand on this kind of nonsense, otherwise, they are enabling this kind of treatment of our community. It’s party-building at our expense each and every time …

Pam, you may not like to hear it, but that last line could just as easily have come from Glenn Beck. Just goes to show: it may be entertaining to watch your enemies rip themselves apart, but you might just want to keep an eye on the guy to your left.

Well, I am a Republican, a very clear minority in NYC. I abhor the tactics and philosophies of either the far right or left. Anyone with a knowledge of statistics knows what a distribution curve looks like with the small narrow population figures at the ‘tails’ of the curve. In short, they represent an awfully small percentage of our population for all the noise they make. Pray we return to our senses and obtain a more moderate national dialogue.
BTW, for the record, I would say Dede can not be be blithely described as a moderate. Clearly she is left of center and her views in opposition not only to Conservatives, but also to at-large Republicans.

Tobin:
You are full of it. Unlike those on the right, those on the left are only trying to hold Obama to his campaign promises. Heck, the health care bill is already watered down and turds like Ben Nelson still won’t vote for it. And Centrist? We all know what that really means. It means their votes have been bought off by corporate(PAC’s, CEO’s) campaign contributions.

Wow…two Congressional elections in which the president’s agenda was the issue remain or turn Democratic, two gubernatorial races go Republican with voters identifying the president as NOT the issue, and you prophesy Democratic “civil war,” using a handful of progressive blog posts and emails. I would call that cherry picking evidence, and perhaps some wishful thinking.

And why are progressives always on “the fringe” or “far left”? All they want is a public option to be sold in competition with HMO’s (the last time I checked most of the country does too), a sensible fiscal policy not geared to the whims of the banking industry, and a sea change in the handling of the war on terror. Obama got a record turnout in many states on those issues.

And comparing progressive Democrats to the dishonest Beck is an insult. Shame on you.

Notice the post says MoveOn.org is “planning” to run ads against Lincoln and Landrieu. They will never actually do it because Rahm and his buddy George Soros control MoveOn. In fact I’ll bet the money gets used to re-elect those same Senators after they strip out the public option and vote for the resulting carcass of health reform. This will be considered a “success” by MoveOn.

As for Maine Question 1, the DNC treasurer admitted in his email that “the bureaucracy” didn’t think the issue merited DNC/OFA getting involved. Those of us who believe that marriage equality is non-negotiable need to decide if we can support a party that doesn’t share our values.

I am really sick of these holier than thou Conservative Republicans thinking that everybody in America is UN-American unless we agree with all their right wing biases and hate speech!

I don’t agree that its okay to run the country into the ground for 8 years and then all of sudden be concerned about “Big Government”. You’re a LITTLE LATE.

I don’t agree that Freedom should allow a “few” to ncite riots and flame the fires of hatred against people to the point of taking a gun to church and murdering people who have done NOTHING illegal. Yes, you have the right to disagree, but you DON’T have the right to murder!

I believe birth control and abortion issues are every woman’s personal decision and NOBODY else’s. Its a woman’s body; its a woman’s CHOICE.
Thats the law, so obey it.

I believe its hypocritical to show up in church every Sunday to listen to somebody preach about family values and then tell your children its okay to hate people whose lifestyle, or religion or ethnicity or social status is different from yours.

Most of all I think it is immoral to tell people who are seriously ill that Insurance companies should have the right to deny coverage to them or charge them ten times what someone else has to pay.

And finally, I think its time to stop shouting, stop wearing guns to rallies to try and intimidate people and see if we can get back to being a CIVILIZED nation again that can work for the common good of ALL the people, FOR the people and BY the people.

Well, of course it’s nonsense to push a more radical candidate through the primaries who has no chance in the general election. But it’s also nonsense to accept a too centrist candidate in a district that is much more partisan, as the Deeds defeat showed. That guy was much too close to his opponent, leaving his own party base totally uninspired.

All in all it comes down to finding the best candidate for the constituency. And this often isn’t the more centrist candidate! In a district that went solidly pro Obama, voters will have no sympathy for a Representative who refuses to support the healthcare bill, period. And actually even moderate Dems won’t understand if their candidate intends to vote against THE most important legislation in this term. There have to be some limits to what is acceptable when running under the brand Democratic. You can’t be against everything liberal and still pretend to belong to the party. The base doesn’t like such dishonesty, and it will push those conmen out. And rightly so!

Are the Dems facing a civil war? Please, we have been in a civil war long before the Republicans started theirs. The progressive wing of this party wants the Big Corporations under government control. Big business represents a threat to the security of this nation.

The problem with the Blue Collar wing of the Repbus is that they do not realize the corporations are to this country what the Bolsheviks were to the Russian people.

I can only hope that working class social conservatives in the Republican Party will wake up and realize they have more in common with the working class social left of the Democratic party they they have in opposition. Namely, neither is a member of the ruling capitalist class.

Once a partnership is formed, we can get on to the business of dealing with the real domestic enemies of America: the lazy, non-working, undeserving rich. They contribute nothing but pornography for the tabloid journals, i.e. Paris Hilton.

All very well and good, up to a point.
When we get past that point, we see that The Left is more interested in action that actually benefits the most people, and also supports civil rights, while The Right is more interested in action that benefits the few at at the expense of the many, and also supports taking civil rights away.
Any honest and reasonable person sees the truth of this, while those who constitute the Right persuasion consist of cynics and those who are so lacking in critical skills that they are easily brainwashed by the cynics.

This gay man does not particularly care about gay marriage. It would be nice, I suppose, to have the option, but it’s one I’ll never choose. We’ve lost something like 31 elections over the question. The country isn’t ready.

Marriage rights are not in the same category as anti-discrimination laws in employment, housing, etc. Our enemies are conservatives (especially gay conservatives) and religious fanatics who hate us, not ambivalent Democrats.

The Democratic party and fair minded people across the country (across the world?) have helped us make great civil rights gains over the last 20 years. Thanks!

Marriage rights will come. Time is on our side. Meanwhile, I have no intention of sacrificing the larger liberal agenda for gay marriage. It’s just not that important to me. We stand to loose a lot more than marriage rights if Republicans regain power.

As an Independent, I support Health Care Reform that is a balanced approach that all voters support. What MoveOn is doing is subverting our democracy. These people are pin-heads trying to buy votes with $3m. I hope this totally backfires on them. I for one think it’s time for a Third Party. I’m tired of the extreme left or right dominating Washington. Neither one should be in a majority position in Congress. Someone tell Ross Perot to bring it on again, and before 2010.

lots of info there, but the bottom line for democrats is that they are the kennedy dem party, whether conservative liberal, or progressive, the democrat leader presently is of course President Obama, however, there are still powers in the dem party that the republicans wish they had someone like them to lead the republicans, in the final analysis, we dems have kerry, dodd, pelosi, reid, clinton,boxer just to name a few, so my ball team with all the dem leaders beats the republicans because the good ones left can’t present anything people can follow, I suppose the well known republicans are hanging back letting the younger ones do all the dirty work, but we dems have more ringers that the republicans for right now anyways. Those politicians that do what’s right on the legislation, instead of trying to get reelected by opposing good programs will be seen for what they are, when the dems and president clinton passed bans on gun ammo and clips and magazines they all lost there seats, but they did what was right, and served the people, we seem to forget that many great republicans who are sitting by and hoping that President Obama fails are so foolish because it is there america too. 8 years is a long time for this administration and the houses and senate have there work cut out for them, and my team has more ball players so we can out last any fillabuster the opposition wants to bring. The one lesson of the past eight years will never be forgot by the people who now know they can survive if they stick together for the good of all and not the one.

What is this far left nonsense? In a country which has only Halloween half body politic (from a center moved to the right to some far, far, far right) a Social Democrat is consider to be “far left.” Only in America. Educate yourself, people, go to some school, open some books – it won’t kill you.
Yeah, why would anyone in a country of 45 million of uninsured and wage slavery even notice these facts? Aren’t genitals the only object of interest?

Do Beck & Limbaugh and Spaulding advocate for a certain set of political ideas? Well obviously. What are they supposed to do: advocate a certain set of policies and then back the pol who’ll do just the opposite?

I’m a proud liberal, and I’m gay, and I’ve no problem with the conservatives asking their pols to vote a in certain way. There’s nothing unreasonable or RADICAL for citizens to (gasp!) demand a certain voting record from their pols & parties after spending money, time and effort getting these people elected. And yes, as it should be, people are concerned with policy issues, not coddling parties and pols or spineless centrists.

So here are the real issues from a liberal perspective: the problem with Beck and Limbaugh is that they say things that many find bigoted and untrue; and conservative dems can’t explain why progressives should be motivated to support them given they will not support many of the things we care most about.

It’s “far left” to object to 2 endless wars? To be for a public option? to be for equal rights? does that mean these positions are somehow Communistic? and that it’s “moderate” to be for 2 endless undefined wars, against a public option, for discrimination … that’s some opinionating you’re doing. Smells like you’re on somebody’s pad.

“Hard-left Democrats and their gay allies”…lions and tigers and bears, oh my! Turns out that “hard-left” means withholding support for candidates who do not support “Obamacare” – which itself at this point could hardly be considered very far “left”. Am I the only one who finds this bordering on gibberish?

As a socialist, I always find it odd to hear a mainstream liberal org like Move On described as “far left” – but I guess there are two reasons for that happening: the right enjoys hyperbole, and the left can’t imagine the existence of a real radical alternative.

It’s interesting to me, but apparently not noteworthy in any media analysis, that a long time Roosevelt Democrat like myself is now a radical leftist. I believe in a Democratic platform that has essentially followed the same vision for many, many years. Now I’m a nutcase out in left field.

Where is all the analysis that shows how the party has been pulled to the right by intimidation from the religious right and enormous campaign contributions. Where is the story of the historical Democratic party being pulled off course by radical ‘conservative Democrats’? (They are NOT ‘moderates’!) Where is the story of newly minted conservative Democrats without scruples destroying party values to keep contributions flowing to their coffers.

Standing for nothing…standing for anything…always occupying the mushy middle is lazy, corrupt, and pandering. Refusing to take a principled stand is precisely what got this country into this mess. Thinking you’re going to get out of it by becoming more of what got us here is a recipe for disaster. If you don’t want to stand for the values the Democratic party has historically stood for, then by all means…rewrite them as you want them so those of us who wish to actually stand for something can make our choice.

MoveOn is a left wing politican terrorist organization that has done nothing other than to try to disrupt the ideology of America. Extreme right wing organization try to do the same. MIddle America is fascinated by and appreciates the entertainment value provided by both of these groups. Keep up the good work! You create conversation at many social activites that would otherwise be dull and boring.

I’m gay. I’m well aware that GLBT folk aren’t getting all that we expected. Or, not as fast as we assumed. Nonetheless, half a loaf is better than none. President Obama and the Democratic Party are still our best hope for continuing change in our favor. Patience, please. Just a little patience.

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The Thread is an in-depth look at how the major news events and controversies of the day are being viewed and debated across the online spectrum. Compiled by Peter Catapano, an editor in The Times’s Opinion section, the Thread is published every Saturday in response to breaking news.