I have the right to speak my mind. I REFUSE to let someone call me "abnormal" or have people take a patronizing attitude toward my "condition". I'm different. That's all. Our personality type was given a label (only a few decades ago I might add) and that has done little more than feed the stigma. Frankly, I consider our traits to be downright DESIRABLE. We often excel at logic, mathematics and analytical thinking. We're honest, sometimes brutally so, but we need more honesty in the world IMHO. Labeling us as having a disorder is arrogant and dehumanizing. I have the right to express my opinion when I say I believe we have been unfairly labeled by those in the psychological profession. They don't understand us. They can't. They're not like us. They are guilty of the same crime as as any group that considers itself superior. And they *DO* consider themselves superior IMHO. They don't relate to us. They see us as different and therefore "abnormal". Who are they to set the standard for what a human personality should be like?

This makes me think of the logical Vulcans and the emotional Romulans of Star Trek. The Yin and Yang personality types of the universe. Without one or the other, the universe is out of balance.

I suspect the personality types with no identifiable traits and quirks are actually the abnormal ones. Since it usually takes someone on the outside of a set of traits to recognize and characterize those traits, we need more Aspies going into Psychology to get a different perspective on "average" traits.

I can tell you that since schools started drugging so many of the kids (mostly males) who have ADD and ADHD, the quality and quantity of engineers seems to have declined. I'm sure many Asperger's kids were drugged as well. Few people have the singleminded drive to pursue the right answer to a technical problem without the tunnel vision focus of an Aspie. Now we have people more suited to being clerks and theatre majors trying to be engineers. If they can't get an answer quickly, they lose interest and try a different approach. When they run out of approaches before they find an answer, they give up.

FA and Aspie summation: Maybe it takes an Aspie to continually woo a BBW s/he finds attractive until success is received. Unlike the relationship process of average people, it can be a much longer and drawn out process for an FA and their BBW. I haven't heard of many FA/BBW couples meeting and getting married in two months. It's usually a courtship of two or more years (sometimes much more). Average people seem to meet, mate and marry in about a one year period. The same process seems to average about three or four years for FA/BBW couples. I'm not sure about FFA/BHM couples.

My ex is in all likelihood an Aspy (and probably a sociopath but that's another thread) and it took us a year to get engaged. The wooing was mutual. I didn't have to be convinced. I was dating several guys at the same time I met him so I didn't need anyone to tell me how attractive I am.

The plural of anecdote is not data and I'm aware that includes my own.

This makes me think of the logical Vulcans and the emotional Romulans of Star Trek. The Yin and Yang personality types of the universe. Without one or the other, the universe is out of balance.

I suspect the personality types with no identifiable traits and quirks are actually the abnormal ones. Since it usually takes someone on the outside of a set of traits to recognize and characterize those traits, we need more Aspies going into Psychology to get a different perspective on "average" traits.

I can tell you that since schools started drugging so many of the kids (mostly males) who have ADD and ADHD, the quality and quantity of engineers seems to have declined. I'm sure many Asperger's kids were drugged as well. Few people have the singleminded drive to pursue the right answer to a technical problem without the tunnel vision focus of an Aspie. Now we have people more suited to being clerks and theatre majors trying to be engineers. If they can't get an answer quickly, they lose interest and try a different approach. When they run out of approaches before they find an answer, they give up.

FA and Aspie summation: Maybe it takes an Aspie to continually woo a BBW s/he finds attractive until success is received. Unlike the relationship process of average people, it can be a much longer and drawn out process for an FA and their BBW. I haven't heard of many FA/BBW couples meeting and getting married in two months. It's usually a courtship of two or more years (sometimes much more). Average people seem to meet, mate and marry in about a one year period. The same process seems to average about three or four years for FA/BBW couples. I'm not sure about FFA/BHM couples.

As many times as I've kicked my own ass for staying with a technical problem and solving it, when a sane person would have quit and moved on to something profitable, I've also realized that had I been treated for ADD when I was young, I would not have the creativity and problem-solving abilities that I enjoy now. It almost looks like the meds turn creative people into sheeple.

__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Not pious, just saved by grace. Your true Christianity
shows in how you treat those who hate you.

You got to lose to know how to win.(Aerosmith-Dream On)

Fat is like grass, it'll never go away and there's a hell
of a lot of money to be made by controlling it!

I have the right to speak my mind. I REFUSE to let someone call me "abnormal" or have people take a patronizing attitude toward my "condition". I'm different. That's all. Our personality type was given a label (only a few decades ago I might add) and that has done little more than feed the stigma. Frankly, I consider our traits to be downright DESIRABLE. We often excel at logic, mathematics and analytical thinking. We're honest, sometimes brutally so, but we need more honesty in the world IMHO. Labeling us as having a disorder is arrogant and dehumanizing. I have the right to express my opinion when I say I believe we have been unfairly labeled by those in the psychological profession. They don't understand us. They can't. They're not like us. They are guilty of the same crime as as any group that considers itself superior. And they *DO* consider themselves superior IMHO. They don't relate to us. They see us as different and therefore "abnormal". Who are they to set the standard for what a human personality should be like?

If you actually excelled at logic as much as you say you do, then you would realize that your original theory about there being any correlation between aspergers and being an FA is completely ridiculous and unfounded.

Also, your claims that you yourself have Aspergers Syndrome and that this gives you the right to spout ridiculous hogwash is exactly the reason that so many people have poor impressions of people with Aspergers. It is not a license to be a jerk. I have known many people with Aspergers who, while they may be socially awkward or have difficulty dealing with other people, are entirely capable of understanding basic concepts of civility and functioning as productive members of society.

I find it interesting that as soon as someone tells you that you should not use your Aspergers diagnosis as cart blanc to blurt out imbecilic drivel, you suddenly start complaining that "liberals" are "censoring" you. Whatever is wrong with you, I do not think that Aspergers explains it.

Where on earth do you get your data from? It sounds like utter rubbish.

Ad hoc personal observations of various couples I've known over thirty years of life in the Fat Acceptance and general communities. It wasn't intended as data for a peer reviewed article or it would have included citations. Oh wait, there's probably never been such a study between those cohorts.

Besides, consider your earlier comment:

Quote:

Originally Posted by penguin

I think you'll find people from all walks of life attracted to fat people, and I don't think people with Asperger's are any more or less likely to be amongst that group.

The same challenge could be made of your comment as well. I attributed it to your personal experiences or observations and not being supported by peer reviewed data.

Last edited by HereticFA; 12-21-2011 at 09:33 AM.
Reason: Inclusion of illustration of point.

My ex is in all likelihood an Aspy (and probably a sociopath but that's another thread) and it took us a year to get engaged. The wooing was mutual. I didn't have to be convinced. I was dating several guys at the same time I met him so I didn't need anyone to tell me how attractive I am.

And I know one Aspie/BBW couple who is still "dating" after twelve years when everyone around them is wondering when they'll wake up and accept they are the ones for each other. I know of another Aspie/BBW couple who met and married in four months.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CastingPearls

The plural of anecdote is not data and I'm aware that includes my own.

If you actually excelled at logic as much as you say you do, then you would realize that your original theory about there being any correlation between aspergers and being an FA is completely ridiculous and unfounded.

Also, your claims that you yourself have Aspergers Syndrome and that this gives you the right to spout ridiculous hogwash is exactly the reason that so many people have poor impressions of people with Aspergers. It is not a license to be a jerk. I have known many people with Aspergers who, while they may be socially awkward or have difficulty dealing with other people, are entirely capable of understanding basic concepts of civility and functioning as productive members of society.

I find it interesting that as soon as someone tells you that you should not use your Aspergers diagnosis as cart blanc to blurt out imbecilic drivel, you suddenly start complaining that "liberals" are "censoring" you. Whatever is wrong with you, I do not think that Aspergers explains it.

Yeah, I don't think there's is anything wrong with being an Aspie or anything. You don't have to hide all the knives in the house or anything but I find a lot of Aspies suffer from a type of hubris that nine times out of ten is undeserved. All of the logical analysis is based on the information that is available to them but at times they fail to realize that there is a broad area of information that is undetectable to them that corrupts their understanding. For example, my brother used to believe that his English teacher was a nice lady untill she put her shawl on. When she pulled her shawl from the drawer and draped it on herself to fight the chilly school room he believed that she became evil and mean. My mother had to take him to a shrink for this, he was beside himself. Now we all know that this is ridiculous but to his mind it made perfect sense and in his mind we were all missing the big picture. This is just a small example of how some Aspies will rest all of their laurels on their own perceptions that are sorely lacking in whole components that would lend much to their knowledge had they a frame of reference to see it. There are some Aspies that are self aware enough to give pause and consider, but most of my experiences involve those who do not fit in this category. To them it's everybody else who allows emotions to pollute an otherwise clear and logical conclusion.

__________________

Expecting the world to treat you kindly because you are a good person is like expecting the bull not to charge because you are a vegetarian.

"...If the only pain you recognize as valid is your own, of course you'll have trouble identifying it when you see it in other people. That's the trouble with narcissism. It makes you really inadequate and boring."

FA and Aspie summation: Maybe it takes an Aspie to continually woo a BBW s/he finds attractive until success is received. Unlike the relationship process of average people, it can be a much longer and drawn out process for an FA and their BBW. I haven't heard of many FA/BBW couples meeting and getting married in two months. It's usually a courtship of two or more years (sometimes much more). Average people seem to meet, mate and marry in about a one year period. The same process seems to average about three or four years for FA/BBW couples. I'm not sure about FFA/BHM couples.

Not necessarily. Do you exhibit Asperger's tendencies or have you been diagnosed as having Asperger's? (No need to answer or post here, it's just an illustrative question.) If not, you may not be representative of the group to which I was referring. It's usually cases where the male FA in the relationship exhibits Asperger's traits that seem to take much longer between dating and marriage. Plus, your short period between first date and marriage is offset by those who take 8, 10 or 14 years to do the same thing. That's why I estimated 3 to 4 years as the average.

And in opposition to my earlier statement about it being the Aspie taking longer to date the (SS)BBW and convince her to marry, it may be the Aspie FA taking much longer to decide on and accept the mate they have vs. starting all over and finding another candidate for marriage. This may be tied to the notorious tendencies of an Aspie to be a perfectionist. Those are my current two (but competing) theories on relationships between a male FA Aspie and a BBW.

If you actually excelled at logic as much as you say you do, then you would realize that your original theory about there being any correlation between aspergers and being an FA is completely ridiculous and unfounded.

Also, your claims that you yourself have Aspergers Syndrome and that this gives you the right to spout ridiculous hogwash is exactly the reason that so many people have poor impressions of people with Aspergers. It is not a license to be a jerk. I have known many people with Aspergers who, while they may be socially awkward or have difficulty dealing with other people, are entirely capable of understanding basic concepts of civility and functioning as productive members of society.

I find it interesting that as soon as someone tells you that you should not use your Aspergers diagnosis as cart blanc to blurt out imbecilic drivel, you suddenly start complaining that "liberals" are "censoring" you. Whatever is wrong with you, I do not think that Aspergers explains it.

If you're trying to look smart by using French idioms, it helps to get them right - it's "carte blanche" (feminine endings).

Also, at no point did the OP rant about "liberal censorship". Nice straw man you built there.

As many times as I've kicked my own ass for staying with a technical problem and solving it, when a sane person would have quit and moved on to something profitable,

I'm sure you learned something from those pursuits which benefited you later on. Not everything should be tied into an immediate profit motive. Using it as an academic activity is also desirable. That dogged pursuit of an understanding of technical issues represents entry into the state of the "will to think":http://books.google.com/books?id=2cu...ink%22&f=false

It makes me wonder how many of our great inventors exhibited Aspie tendencies.

I'm sure you learned something from those pursuits which benefited you later on. Not everything should be tied into an immediate profit motive. Using it as an academic activity is also desirable. That dogged pursuit of an understanding of technical issues represents entry into the state of the "will to think":http://books.google.com/books?id=2cu...ink%22&f=false

It makes me wonder how many of our great inventors exhibited Aspie tendencies.

You're absolutely right. Now'a days, I design and build fairly advanced stuff that either works correctly on first try or works right after "fixing minor wiring/construction bugs"! I'm on oxygen, so I've also learned that perf-board construction, demanding simultaneous visual acuity, manual dexterity, and thinking/reasoning on-the-fly, is a huge metabolic demand! Working an hour or two, then resting for a recharge, and starting back up, is very effective and saves time in the long run by reducing errors. Some of my hospitalizations, a few years ago, were in part, the result of not resting properly during my projects. The understanding and respect of human limits and the discipline to work within my limits is taking me beyond what I thought possible. Sometimes intangible accomplishments are, indeed, priceless!

__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Not pious, just saved by grace. Your true Christianity
shows in how you treat those who hate you.

You got to lose to know how to win.(Aerosmith-Dream On)

Fat is like grass, it'll never go away and there's a hell
of a lot of money to be made by controlling it!

Hey guys, I just feel like I should put in my two cents as this is one of the few topics that I've read in which I actually have something useful to say. My dad, brother, sister, and I all have Aspergers syndrome. I have been attracted to bigger women for as long as I can remember. My sister has dated quite a few large fellows and is now married to a pretty big guy. Though my brother and dad have never come right out and said anything about it, I've been quite certain for a few years that they are both FA's as well just because of some comments that they have made about passing women etc.

I agree that there is a good possibility that Aspies have a tendency to favour large men/women over non-Aspies. This does not mean however, that you HAVE to be an Aspy in order to be an FA (just thought I'd clarify as some people in the thread seem to have gotten the idea that this is what the OP was suggesting).

Thanks for the thread! I've never actually noticed this before now, but now that I think about it it actually does make quite a bit of sense

"a lot of Aspies suffer from a type of hubris....logical analysis is based on the information that is available to them but at times they fail to realize that there is a broad area of information that is undetectable to them that corrupts their understanding...will rest all of their laurels on their own perceptions that are sorely lacking in whole components that would lend much to their knowledge had they a frame of reference to see it....To them it's everybody else who allows emotions to pollute an otherwise clear and logical conclusion."

Yeah, I mean, I don't know if I would choose these words exactly (e.g., "hubris," per se...); but it's not a totally unfair characterization. Certainly, we all have "blind-spots;" but to be blind, insensitive, or, generally, noncogniscient to stimuli that's consistently and fluidly interpreted by 95% or so of the population is more than just "being different." It's a legitimate disability, to put it most directly. Yeah, it is fun to fantasize that each of us has the total freedom to see, hear, think, know, & understand, ect...only as we, individually, choose-to to need to. In a kind of vacuum of our own personal imagination. Then again, reality: We all have to live and work and exist in world designed primarily for and by "other-people."

As per what Lamia first noticed-aloud; case-in -point:

Quote:

Originally Posted by blubrluvr

"That's right. I'm posting an a liberal-dominated-overly-politically-correct forum where censorship is the rule."

Quote:

Originally Posted by joswitch

"If you're trying to look smart by using French idioms, it helps to get them right - it's "carte blanche" (feminine endings).

Also, at no point did the OP rant about "liberal censorship". Nice straw man you built there."

You see, Jos is just so eager, not too unlike the Gerald character on Sid the Science Kid, that he can't help but to excitedly point out this "important detail," that mollycoddles has made a mistake! One which he seems to have corrected; but, seemingly, without the most basic awareness of the (more important) context through which the rest of us have interpreted this exchange:

That the error-itself is not, particularly, significant to most of us who're actually participating in this discussion since we (again, most of us, that is) can easily deduce what molly meant based on the rest of what she wrote, even totally absent of any kind of familiarity with that particular phrase.

That the phrase-itself; nor really anything that's researchable with google, is very likely not aimed at actually impressing anyone since (again, for most of us), being fluent in the English language and having enjoyed at least some experience studying a second language and having access to any of a myriad of technological supports, would likely and practically preclude anyone's being actually impressed merely at the introduction of some idiomatic expression of foreign origin.

That, ironically, (at least for those of us afflicted as Jos or blubrluvr) it's that very inability, to approach or access or assess this very type of context that makes such conditions as much of a challenging prognosis.

Yeah, I mean, I don't know if I would choose these words exactly (e.g., "hubris," per se...); but it's not a totally unfair characterization. Certainly, we all have "blind-spots;" but to be blind, insensitive, or, generally, noncogniscient to stimuli that's consistently and fluidly interpreted by 95% or so of the population is more than just "being different." It's a legitimate disability, to put it most directly. Yeah, it is fun to fantasize that each of us has the total freedom to see, hear, think, know, & understand, ect...only as we, individually, choose-to to need to. In a kind of vacuum of our own personal imagination. Then again, reality: We all have to live and work and exist in world designed primarily for and by "other-people."

As per what Lamia first noticed-aloud; case-in -point:You see, Jos is just so eager, not too unlike the Gerald character on Sid the Science Kid, that he can't help but to excitedly point out this "important detail," that mollycoddles has made a mistake! One which he seems to have corrected; but, seemingly, without the most basic awareness of the (more important) context through which the rest of us have interpreted this exchange:

That the error-itself is not, particularly, significant to most of us who're actually participating in this discussion since we (again, most of us, that is) can easily deduce what molly meant based on the rest of what she wrote, even totally absent of any kind of familiarity with that particular phrase.

That the phrase-itself; nor really anything that's researchable with google, is very likely not aimed at actually impressing anyone since (again, for most of us), being fluent in the English language and having enjoyed at least some experience studying a second language and having access to any of a myriad of technological supports, would likely and practically preclude anyone's being actually impressed merely at the introduction of some idiomatic expression of foreign origin.

That, ironically, (at least for those of us afflicted as Jos or blubrluvr) it's that very inability, to approach or access or assess this very type of context that makes such conditions as much of a challenging prognosis.

Agreed. I was trying, though maybe unsuccessfully, to steer clear from saying that this kind of thing is *always* bad. Though it isn't always bad it certainly isn't always good. There was some language introduced earlier in this thread that suggested that Aspergers puts people on a higher level of conciousness or some such thing and I was merely trying to introduce some examples of why that is not always true. Though on some levels it most definitley can be true, it can be downright problematic at times too.

__________________

Expecting the world to treat you kindly because you are a good person is like expecting the bull not to charge because you are a vegetarian.

"...If the only pain you recognize as valid is your own, of course you'll have trouble identifying it when you see it in other people. That's the trouble with narcissism. It makes you really inadequate and boring."

@Lily- what a shame you quoted Yak, I've had Yak's tedious & predictable posts on ignore for a while.

@Yak - lets explode your smug "analysis":
1- I'm not Aspy, at all. (remember you only have 10% of communication in writing, beware amateur interweb psych)
2- That you jumped to assume I was Aspy shows your inability to conceive that someone might empathise with people different from them. Congrats, you share this trait with every fat hater I've debated SA with. They always assume I am fat at first.
3- You're in very dodgy company with your 95% of people are X therefore Y people are... That thought process has been used to justify many atrocities.
4- The "context" of MC's post was talking down to the OP in a psuedo-intellectual, better-than-you fashion. That always deserves puncturing, and it's fun to do so.
5- MC may be a man. As I recall from MC's prior posts... I could be wrong on that last one, but...
6- as a card-carrying PCer your terms need updating, it's "challenged" or "differently abled" nowadays. If you're going to tow the mainstream line on everything Yak, you must conform to every norm!
In short-
Yak your FAIL is EPIC.

Sorry Joswitch.

__________________

Expecting the world to treat you kindly because you are a good person is like expecting the bull not to charge because you are a vegetarian.

"...If the only pain you recognize as valid is your own, of course you'll have trouble identifying it when you see it in other people. That's the trouble with narcissism. It makes you really inadequate and boring."