Actual ideas, no bellyaching.

A guy in sac is playing a 3k point game right now and having a lot of success with the new reavers and scourges. With the HoW rending and hit in run the reavers are really mopping up right now. Targets get peppered with fire from raiders and whatnot that DS in and then the reavers assault after zooming up the side of the table. Very cool S4 and S6 rending HoW attacks are nice when added with CC attacks, lots of dice rolls. Reavers a possible Jetseer unit now?

I am extremely excited about running 3 talos pain engines with twin linked HWB up the table. MC S7T7 with 3 wounds and 3+ marching up the most effective AT in the game is just super duper to me. I can't wait to try it.

I want to Haemon DS a 20 man unit of warriors into cover with 2 SCs and a whole bunch of AP5 poison is very cool.

I am too excited for Scourges now because I preferred them in the last codex with heat lances, they are so much better now. Also something interesting to do if you have enough AT is running that many splinter cannons. Dropping those dudes into cover with 4 SC and letting them camp out is funny. I did (deployed on the table) that a few games last codex against a drop pod assault army and it removed lots of units.

Also grot bomb looks like a lot of fun. You don't even need to DS this unit! All you have to do is put aether sails, Shock Prow, Flickerfield and anything else that seems cool. You drive it straight into a transport, Land raider even. Pop the metal box and then you have a nice assault on those squishy troop choices inside next turn. Many possibilities.

The only thing i'm pissed about are the combat drugs, 3 of the 6 are useless. bleh.

Just informed: Two 5 man squads of reavers have taken out: 2 assault marine squads, 3 rhino chasis, immobilized dreadnought, land raider and storm talon. With furious charge, cover and 5+ they are awesome.

More to come, Let me know your thoughts.

Some words of encouragement. The new codex was necessary and was a good thing for us. Stagnation in this game is a very bad thing, way worse than losing some units effectiveness. It gives us new tools to play with and lots of new ways to exploit the system. Just remember that Dark Eldar players are Superior to all other generals in 40k. We didn't chose Dark Eldar, it chose us because we are worthy. I relish the thought of basking in the glory of my victims anguish in the games 7th ed has to offer. Since Vect is gone there seems to be an opening, good luck.

-Rumble

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helvexisSybarite

Posts : 344Join date : 2012-04-02Location : Perth, Western Australia

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 10:00

Do we take any sort of mishap test if we deepstrike into cover? Not scattering but still subject to those rules is a worry.

Also 12 man squads of reavers have me a little bit excited not sure if anyone else has commented on it but 4 lances or caltrops is pretty devastating

Expletive DeletedWych

Posts : 581Join date : 2013-07-31

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 10:02

Disagree about the combat drugs. I assume you mean Ld, I, and WS? Are useless.

I've had a succubus runaway from a fight because she's Ld 9. You bring a general to any unit with combat drugs and that unit becomes Ld 10. Grots excluded. Initiative might seem useless but it helps in running down units and getting away from units. And WS is not bad at all, WS 5 is pretty much higher than most standard infantry. It won't help you against tau or guard, but against space marines and eldar it will.

_________________"Excess, yeah that's what we do best."

Its_RumbleSybarite

Posts : 479Join date : 2014-04-04Location : CA

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 10:05

That is a good point Expletive. However increase in strength, toughness and number of attacks helps us against all armies. Playing DE is a gamble though so it is nice to have that kind of flexibility. I would have really like it if they kept a pain token counter in there for us.

And Helvexis, I am pretty sure you would take dangerous terrain like usual. But I'm willing to do that.

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Expletive DeletedWych

Posts : 581Join date : 2013-07-31

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 10:16

I don't consider combat drugs a nerf because literally hypex had no use in 6th. Sure, I want strength, attacks, and toughness more than the other but at least if I roll a one, my special ability is not completely wasted. Reavers couldn't even use hypex before now they can.

Now I agree, when you rolled a 6 in 6th edition you felt like a champ, all your units with combat drugs gained feel no pain. But now that's automatic, for everyone, granted not first turn, but if you think about it, you can have T5 reavers with FnP +5. That didn't happen in 6th!

In sixth if you rolled a one however you just generally didn't bother to remember.

_________________"Excess, yeah that's what we do best."

Its_RumbleSybarite

Posts : 479Join date : 2014-04-04Location : CA

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 10:24

Yea they did rework it nicely though. You are probably right it balances itself out more with more things available to more units.

What other things have you noticed that you are excited to run? any unit ideas pop to mind and how to use them? Mandrakes maybe?

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Expletive DeletedWych

Posts : 581Join date : 2013-07-31

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 10:35

Infiltrate has always been one of those rules that was kind of convoluted and I never bothered to remember. But I am excited about scourges + heatlances + imperial knights. Also, the grot bomb, which I found the most effective way to deliver an HQ into combat has only become better. But, these are all points you've already made. I don't like to be "that guy" but we can run six razorwings and 3 voidravens. There might be some douchie potential there.

Looking forward to relearning trueborn squads as i lost my super squad with carbines but thats ok.

Scourge solarites still have power lance and venom blade options so maybe carbines/shredders and a cc solarite build could be interesting

Its_RumbleSybarite

Posts : 479Join date : 2014-04-04Location : CA

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 10:43

I like the razorwing alot. With that nightshield coming in with another fighter and a pack of HWB scourges would really suck for the other team. I really want to run 6-9 flyers but I am not convinced on the voidraven bomber. For 215 we get a bomber that was 195 in the last codex but with armor 10!!! It can be brought down with bolters. That one really upset me too. Not denying that it is a sweet model and definitely has potential but bumping that armor down really sucks for me. I donno I'm sure it will balance itself out but I am gonna wait before I jump on it. I hope i'm wrong. I was really excited the RZWF was in FA but now seeing how well reavers are doing.... Only time will tell. Looks good though.

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Creeping DarknessWych

Posts : 548Join date : 2012-11-21

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 11:35

Well, the 'medusa bomb' seems like it has legs... webway portal to Deep Strike 4 - 6 medusae into perfect template range and OMGWTFBBQ a bunch of dudes. Granted, it is pricey.

A good cure for that IG guy that hides a platoon with a wrap around Aegis, though.

Or maybe try a Harmy with a webway, archangel of pain, and the armour of misery to hit an infantry scrum. Unless, you know, you are playing against Space Marines, Space Wolves, Grey Knifhts, Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Chaos Marines, Daemons, Tyranids or similar... >

Just informed: Two 5 man squads of reavers have taken out: 2 assault marine squads, 3 rhino chasis, immobilized dreadnought, land raider and storm talon. With furious charge, cover and 5+ they are awesome.

I seriously have to question what this guy's opponent is actually doing then. Is he just completely ignoring the Reavers? Because pretty much anything firing at them is going to cause enough casualties to at least force a Ld test, if not destroy them totally.

_________________You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. In what world could you possibly beat me?

AzdrubaelIncubi

Posts : 1761Join date : 2011-11-16Location : Russia

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 14:47

Abberation would really really like Electrocorossive Whip.

And 12 unit of Reavers is just really asking for a WS spam opponent.

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jbwms713Kabalite Warrior

Posts : 119Join date : 2013-07-13

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 19:09

Well, I haven't had a chance to actually play a game yet, but I've had some time to think about what units will do and what I'll be wanting to take.

Lance Ravagers (with Night Shield) are at least borderline too expensive for as fragile as they are. In my mind it will promote sitting in a forest for a non-jink 4+, rather than flitting around the battlefield... not very fitting. And even then, it's questionable. I may just have to trash the Shields on them... 125 isn't that bad, although they're slow... meh. We'll see.

Which leaves me to have to make sure I have enough ranged anti-tank in my lists. To that end...

Haywire Scourges are really solid for the cost. They'll be really easy to shift, though... but what isn't?Reavers will be pulling AT duty in the early turns. Flitting around the empty sides T1 to set up for a rear-armor party on T2. Huzzah.Even Mandrakes with a shot at AV10 are a threat from T1. If you can infiltrate backfield, for less than 100 points you get 14 S4 shots. That's a decent shot of stripping 2 HP.Blasterborn are still a thing.

Even so, I still wonder if it's enough. But we'll see. Maybe 2 Ravagers still need to find their way in...

Anyway. Some other fun tricks.

DS a splinter rack raider down and blast a unit 12" away with a reliable 9-10 wounds, plus the boat's gun.Haemy with Grots and a WWP. That unit is so. Effin'. Dirty. Base cost for the Grots will very likely get you over 20 attacks, which wound on a re-rollable 3+ (or 2+, for squishy T3). 2+'s are still resilient, but pretty much anything else is going to feel pain from that. Not to mention the Haemy himself... I'm a fan of the new Scissorhand. Cheap, reliable wounds, plus a little help vs heavy armor.

Just informed: Two 5 man squads of reavers have taken out: 2 assault marine squads, 3 rhino chasis, immobilized dreadnought, land raider and storm talon. With furious charge, cover and 5+ they are awesome.

I seriously have to question what this guy's opponent is actually doing then. Is he just completely ignoring the Reavers? Because pretty much anything firing at them is going to cause enough casualties to at least force a Ld test, if not destroy them totally.

What was happening is that his hit and run was working perfectly, He was able to stay in combat during shooting phases and kill things during his phases. Just played them well.

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Archon RievectKabalite Warrior

Posts : 132Join date : 2014-08-03Location : The WWP behind you!

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sat Oct 04 2014, 23:59

Not strictly reavers,raider DS but thought I would share a recent idea.....

Well I feel a bit better about the codex, have been making up some Court units and you can be pretty cheesy... since you can have up to 12, no minimum of each, you can run all Lhamies,Sslyth,Medusae,etc..

So- 12 Lhamies at 10pts each- 36 Poisoned 2+ attacks , with Lethal Dose ID on wound rolls of 6- OUCH!- they MAY just be a cheap MC killer

Not strictly reavers,raider DS but thought I would share a recent idea.....

Well I feel a bit better about the codex, have been making up some Court units and you can be pretty cheesy... since you can have up to 12, no minimum of each, you can run all Lhamies,Sslyth,Medusae,etc..

So- 12 Lhamies at 10pts each- 36 Poisoned 2+ attacks , with Lethal Dose ID on wound rolls of 6- OUCH!- they MAY just be a cheap MC killer

Those Lhameans are extremely nasty now, no doubt about it. A budget murderer of everything. If you're taking an Archon and a Succubus, Lhameans would go nicely with the Succubus, as there's nothing to stop her joining them before deployment and deep striking them where they need to be with a portal. It's the Medusae I'm most tempted to run myself. Ten is so expensive for a standard sized (1750) game, I'd be more tempted by four. One thing burna boyz taught me is that you don't actually need that many templates to generate a large number of hits if you can get close to your target. The new webway portal means you're guaranteed to, so land where you want, put a template down so it covers four guys (maybe even five if you can squeeze it) and you get sixteen hits no problem. More than that on most MEQ squads (let's assume that's what we're going for) starts to become overkill. I can see room for up to six perhaps, just to virtually guarantee killing a ten strong squad, but they just get so expensive!

Pleased to see you're feeling a bit more positive about the codex at least, personally I'm loving it so far!

I'm looking forward to finally running a Succubus, and kitting her out with the Armour of Misery, an Archite Glaive and the Parasite Pistol. I keep referring back to the table just to make sure that Succubi are actually allowed armour. Can't get over that!

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Archon RievectKabalite Warrior

Posts : 132Join date : 2014-08-03Location : The WWP behind you!

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sun Oct 05 2014, 00:22

Yea they needed to fix that armor on the Succubus and they failed in that.....

SelvhanHellion

Posts : 81Join date : 2013-03-09

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sun Oct 05 2014, 01:45

Succubus can have a 4+/6++ I think. And she is the only HQ that has an ap2 weapon. But ... yeah it would have been nice to have the succubus at a lower cost.

CalyptraWych

Posts : 802Join date : 2013-03-25Location : Boston

Subject: Re: Actual ideas, no bellyaching. Sun Oct 05 2014, 03:39

Unfortunately, in the fine print at the beginning of the Artefacts of Cruelty list on page 69, it says, "A model may take one of the following".

It maybe is the wrong thread and it might just be my imagination, but when you equip a 5 man squad of scourgeswith 4 splintercannons, it would be a real nasty surprise for MC heavy armies, like Tyranids.It is, at least, 16 shots at 36", but when you have some good cover, it is 24. 27 if the enemy closes in...

Well, the 'medusa bomb' seems like it has legs... webway portal to Deep Strike 4 - 6 medusae into perfect template range and OMGWTFBBQ a bunch of dudes. Granted, it is pricey.

I tried this last night with a 2x WWP Archon and 6 Medusae in raiders, their precision and deadliness was a thing of pure joy. I managed to wipe out an entire squad of Necron Immortals in cover before they could do anything with one and wiped a squad of deathmarks with the other. Granted, the template on my raider that ensued didn't feel so good but those Medusae easily earned more than their points back and created some serious havoc in my opponents backfield turn 2. Sprinkle in 3 units of heat lance scourges deep striking and all of a sudden my venoms in the backfield weren't a primary target. This allowed for me to move up with them and pepper my opponent with splinter fire and surprisingly I didn't lose a single venom, which was quite nice.

Oh, and FWIW, power from pain in turns 5 and 6 really helps in closing out/locking up games. We played maelstrom of war and I won 14-2. Basically picked my Necron opponent apart starting turn 2 with surgical precision and the only bad thing that happened was I lost my 2 razorwings. (They had to move 18" and ended up on top of troops both times, resulting in a crash and burn).

This codex isn't all doom and gloom people, it's just not Eldar easy button. It requires skill like it always has and always will. The Space Marine mind is not made for the Dark Eldar codex and that's why so many people are like "OMG TEH SKY IS FALLING!"

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