the pitcher is nice... but yea, the bat is reeeeally what they needed.

_________________"My brother's Municipal League baseball team is named the Stepdads. Seeing as none of the guys on the team are actual stepdads, I inquired about the name. He explained, "Cuz we beat you, and you hate us."-unknown

My first thought was we gave up too much. But we've got a minor league system full of decent arms. There's no way all of our minor league studs are going to make it into the Indians rotation so why not use some of them as trade bait for a proven, successful major league pitcher?

I don't know that I'd call Jimenez "Fausto 2". Let's give him a few starts to see what he does pitching in the American League.

I read an article somewhere that said the Tribe can't afford to sign top-tier free agents like Jimenez so the only real chance to get somebody that can really help this team out is through trades. But, to get those players in trades, you have to have players/prospects that other teams want. It looks like this stockpiling of talent in Columbus and Akron is starting to pay off.

I wouldn't be too worried about Chisenhall, Kipnis, etc. right now. Yeah, they aren't coming out of the gate blowing people away but they'll eventually warm up to the big leagues.

If you think about, despite the hardships of the last month or two, we're still in the running with what basically amounts to a AAA team. That's pretty impressive. Can't wait to see what Jimenez and Fukudome bring to the team and what Choo and Sizemore's returns later this year due to add a spark.

Now, if we could just unload Kearns ....

_________________if I had the time or desire I would post a pic of Blair from Facts of Life and 1990 era Chip to produce the same effect

I haven't been paying close attention to baseball this year. Still burned out on spo'tes from whatsisname leaving. But, I have to say, any time you have a chance to win the division, you HAVE to go for it. Bats are a dime a dozen, good starting pitching is hard to come by. I am totally behind this trade, I don't even know anything about these players. The logic of it is sound. Who knows how good the other teams will be next year, or beyond? Even if they stumble backwards into the playoffs, getting there is all that matters right now.

the problem there is after this roadstand, there is a good chance that the tribe will be buried ( even in this down year for the central) and out of contention. Thus we'll be left with an ace who has mysteriously lost 4mph in velocity this year whom we traded our rotaion's future for.

I don't like the trade at all. Jiminez is a .500 pitcher minus his stats from his best year (last year) and most of that was in the first half of the season. I keep hearing about how good he was in Coors field and that if he puts up those kind of numbes in Coors then "imagine how good he'll be here in Cleveland." Fact of the matter is that Progressive field is ranked higher hr's per game than Coors AND he'll have to face the Rangers and the American league east. But, I hope he pitches well.

_________________Gob: "My God. What is this feeling?"
Michael: "You know, the feeling that you're feeling is just what many of us call ... a 'feeling.'
Gob: "It's not like envy, or even hungry."
Michael: "Could it be love?"
Gob: "I know what an erection feels like, Michael. No, it's the opposite -- it's like my heart is getting hard."

_________________Gob: "My God. What is this feeling?"
Michael: "You know, the feeling that you're feeling is just what many of us call ... a 'feeling.'
Gob: "It's not like envy, or even hungry."
Michael: "Could it be love?"
Gob: "I know what an erection feels like, Michael. No, it's the opposite -- it's like my heart is getting hard."

just to bring this back to the here and now with the AL Central for this year and beyond and how the Indians are now uniquely positioned in the division, take a look at the embarrassingly low payroll obligations for the Tribe going forward…go ahead, go look. Now, compare them to the payroll commitments for Tigers ($74M already committed for next year), the White Sox (who owe Alex Rios and Adam Dunn a total of $83.5M AFTER this year, and even the Twins (who owe Joe Mauer $18M per year through the 2018 season) and realize how well-positioned the Tribe is going forward, compared to their AL Central counterparts.

went to the game last night. jimenez looked solid. one bad inning but he locked down after that.and holy fucking shit did kipnis catch fire... 5 for 5 with a bomb and 4 runs? jesus. let's hope he can keep it going.

_________________"My brother's Municipal League baseball team is named the Stepdads. Seeing as none of the guys on the team are actual stepdads, I inquired about the name. He explained, "Cuz we beat you, and you hate us."-unknown

I really figured that either the Tribe would've fallen off or the Tigers would've run away with this division by now, but Cleveland's not bad enough to take a dive and Detroit's not good enough to make a surge. This is going to be exciting down to the wire. Which, as a Tigers fan, fucking sucks...

_________________i'll never be a bowie, i'll never be an eno. i'll only ever be a gary numan.

_________________"My brother's Municipal League baseball team is named the Stepdads. Seeing as none of the guys on the team are actual stepdads, I inquired about the name. He explained, "Cuz we beat you, and you hate us."-unknown

yes, This season was a surprise of sorts ( they're still gonna end up in 3rd), but I would be much more optimistic movin forward with white and pomeranz

Don't give up hope yet. 4.5 games is not an insurmountable lead by any stretch. Outside of Verlander, Detroit's rotation is seriously suspect and I don't have much faith in that bullpen getting critical outs down the stretch either. Not a lot of prime offensive talent in that lineup either, outside of Miguel Cabrera. Infield defense is atrocious.

Cleveland and Detroit are pretty evenly matched, we'll just have to see how the September schedule plays out. My guess is that the three-game series in Detroit at the end of the season is going to decide the division.

_________________i'll never be a bowie, i'll never be an eno. i'll only ever be a gary numan.

My analysis says it's closer than you think. Losing Hafner hurts, but if Cleveland brings in Thome in a waiver deal, I think he helps fill the gap.

C: Avila vs. Santana (could flip if Santana could harness his potential or if Avila gets worn down from not having a backup)1B: Cabrera vs. LaPorta (no contest)2B: Raburn/Santiago vs. Valbuena/Donald (though Kipnis is better than all of them)3B: Betemit vs. Chisenhall (Chisenhall has the tools to be the better player, but isn't yet)SS: Peralta vs. Cabrera (defense puts him over the top)LF: Young vs. Brantley (though Young has looked really good since coming over in the trade)CF: Jackson vs. Fukudome PUSH (Sizemore is better than both)RF: Boesch vs. Choo (underperforming Choo still a better player)DH: Martinez vs. ??? (a push with a healthy Hafner, a squeaker over Thome, a blowout over anybody else)

Rotation is either a push or edge to Cleveland. Verlander is an A+, Fister is a B-, Scherzer, Porcello and Penny are all Ds. Masterson is an A-, Ubaldo is a B-, Fausto is either a B+ or a D- depending on the day (better lately), Tomlin is a C, Huff has B-/C+ potential (Carrasco is a D).

Bullpen edge goes heavy to Cleveland, though Perez has to get his shit together and quick.

Manager: Leyland vs. Acta (cranky, old motherfucker)

Front office: Dombrowski vs. Shapiro/Antonetti (Dave D. built two World Series winners in Florida and turned the worst team in the history of the AL into league champs 3 years later)

Ballpark: Comerica vs. Progressive (Indians are better built for their home park, Tigers are too slow to use the wide-open spaces in the outfield gaps)

fucking jimenez. what is he? 1 and 2 or 1 and 3 since coming over? i don't wanna claim bust but seriously... detroit kicked his ass. and that was sort of why he was hired... to kick THEIR ass...

_________________"My brother's Municipal League baseball team is named the Stepdads. Seeing as none of the guys on the team are actual stepdads, I inquired about the name. He explained, "Cuz we beat you, and you hate us."-unknown

My analysis says it's closer than you think. Losing Hafner hurts, but if Cleveland brings in Thome in a waiver deal, I think he helps fill the gap.

C: Avila vs. Santana (could flip if Santana could harness his potential or if Avila gets worn down from not having a backup)1B: Cabrera vs. LaPorta (no contest)2B: Raburn/Santiago vs. Valbuena/Donald (though Kipnis is better than all of them)3B: Betemit vs. Chisenhall (Chisenhall has the tools to be the better player, but isn't yet)SS: Peralta vs. Cabrera (defense puts him over the top)LF: Young vs. Brantley (though Young has looked really good since coming over in the trade)CF: Jackson vs. Fukudome PUSH (Sizemore is better than both)RF: Boesch vs. Choo (underperforming Choo still a better player)DH: Martinez vs. ??? (a push with a healthy Hafner, a squeaker over Thome, a blowout over anybody else)

Rotation is either a push or edge to Cleveland. Verlander is an A+, Fister is a B-, Scherzer, Porcello and Penny are all Ds. Masterson is an A-, Ubaldo is a B-, Fausto is either a B+ or a D- depending on the day (better lately), Tomlin is a C, Huff has B-/C+ potential (Carrasco is a D).

Bullpen edge goes heavy to Cleveland, though Perez has to get his shit together and quick.

Manager: Leyland vs. Acta (cranky, old motherfucker)

Front office: Dombrowski vs. Shapiro/Antonetti (Dave D. built two World Series winners in Florida and turned the worst team in the history of the AL into league champs 3 years later)

Ballpark: Comerica vs. Progressive (Indians are better built for their home park, Tigers are too slow to use the wide-open spaces in the outfield gaps)

with all those hypotheticals why dont we just put a healthy, youthful Ordonez in RF?

hafner hasnt been healthy since '07, and Sizemore isnt better then anyone at this point

Austin Jackson is better then Fukodome, believe me. Some of his at bats over the last few weeks have been hard to watch and his fielding anywhere but RF (and RF only) is scary

the tribe is out of it, and with Verlander I wouldnt be surprised if the Tigrs could pull off an '06 Cards like run in the playoffs

This is awesome. We're arguing over whose team is worse. I wish the NBA lockout were over so we could have a really great Cavs vs. Pistons discussion along the same vein.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see Fister, Scherzer, Penny and Porcello step up the same way Jeff Weaver, Jeff Suppan and Anthony Reyes did in '06, but I don't think they will. Frankly, I'd be happy if they could simply make throws to first base (which no Tiger pitcher could do in '06).

_________________i'll never be a bowie, i'll never be an eno. i'll only ever be a gary numan.