Dealing with cops, understanding your rights,.... by a cop.

no one ever forced anyone to put on a badge. it was by their will and desire alone, and whatever the outcome it is on them for making or not making
that choice. if you choose to use that badge as a weapon or deception, then all bets are off and you enter into the realm of ENEMY and should expect
as being treated as such.

there is no sympathy for you, just as you have no sympathy for us, as we continue to pay your mortgages, divorce settlements, child support payments,
car loans, and retirement funds........now who owes who?

Coming from a law enforcement and Military background I think I can reply to this post.
Don't argue or fight a cop. The time and place for that is in a court room. If you really want to make hell for the officer, call and report WRONG
actions to their supervisor/chief or call and ask to speak to internal affairs.
Doom on those that fight a cop. Nothing good will come of it.

Although I appreciate your response regarding comfort, I was hoping to delve more into the mentality of which the more militant appearance is just a
symptom. Police now are more oriented towards intimidation in appearance and often attitude. Less of a public servant more like a controller of
society through intimidation.

Tactical bloused boots and a tac vest suggest preparation for battle. You cant go to the job place everyday asking for a battle and then be surprised
when it does finally come.

Well I hate to say it but we pretty are in a battle anymore in the past 6 months ive had more than a dozen shot taken at my cruiser going down the
road, I have had shots taken at me on stops, on calls, and while writing reports. At the moment we have a load of gangs that are trying to prove how
tough they are and move in on the territory of the gangs that are already here...a very volatile situation that is going to blow up soon. We already
had Bloods, Crips, Skorpions, Kings, Queens, and about 5 other gangs in the are with more than 30 members each(usually in the 30-50 member
range),after Obama was elected the KKK in the county went from 20 to 325 some of them are getting aggressive causing racial tensions, a group called
WAR(White Aryan Resistance) came to the area in 2010 and now has 50+members, now MS-13, Sureno13, and Notreno14 are moving into the area...so
unfortunately we are having to training for battle every officer in the department is taking a condensed SRT course.

The Supreme Court has retreated from strict enforcement of the famous Miranda decision, ruling that a crime suspect's words could be used against him
if he failed to clearly invoke his rights clearly and, instead, answered a single question.

In the past, the court has said the "burden rests on the government" to show that a crime suspect has "knowingly and intelligently waived" his
rights.

But in a 5-4 decision, the court said the suspect had the duty to invoke his rights. If he failed to do so, his later words can be used to convict
him, the justices said.

Justice Anthony M. Kennedy wrote that police were "not required to obtain a waiver" of the suspect's "right to remain silent before interrogating
him."

In this case, Michigan police had informed the suspect, Van Thompkins, of his rights, including the right to remain silent. Thompkins said he
understood, but he did not tell the officer he wanted to stop the questioning or speak to a lawyer.

But he sat in a chair and said nothing for about two hours and 45 minutes. At that point, the officer asked, "Do you pray to God to forgive you for
shooting that boy down?"

"Yes," Thompson said and looked away. He refused to sign a confession or speak further, but he was convicted of first-degree murder, based largely
on his one-word reply.

The U.S. 6th Circuit Court of Appeals overturned Thompkins' conviction on the grounds that the use of the incriminating answer violated his right
against self-incrimination under the Miranda decision.

The Supreme Court reversed that ruling of a lower court ruling and reinstated the conviction. "A suspect who has received and understood the Miranda
warnings and has not invoked his Miranda rights waives the right to remain silent by making an uncoerced statement to the police," Kennedy said. He
was joined by Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. and Justices Antonin Scalia, Clarence Thomas and Samuel A. Alito Jr.

The court ruled that an ambiguous situation would be treated in favor of the police.

Justice Sonia Sotomayor, in a dissent longer than the majority opinion, argued that the majority misread precedent and reached beyond the facts of the
case to impose a tough new rule against defendants.

The majority ruling is in line with the position taken by the Obama administration and Supreme Court nominee U.S. Solicitor General Elena Kagan. In
December, she filed a brief on the side of Michigan prosecutors and argued that "the government need not prove that a suspect expressly waived his
rights."

She said that "if a suspect knows and understands his Miranda rights," anything he says can be used against him in court.

If a police officer stops you and ask to speak with you, you're perfectly within your rights to say to the police officer "Sir I do not wish to
speak with you, good-bye. At this point you should be free to leave. The next step the police officer might take is to ask you for identification. If
you have identification on you, tell the officer where it is and ask permission to reach for it.

The police officer will start asking you questions again, at this point you may ask the officer "Am I Free to Go?" The police officer may not like
this and may challenge you with words like, "If you have nothing to hide, why won't you speak to me?" Just like the first question, you do not
have to answer this question either.

Police officers need your permission to have a conversation, never give it to them. There is NO law that says you must tell a police officer where
you are going or where you have been, so keep your mouth shut and say nothing! Don't answer any question (except name, address and age) until you
have a lawyer.

first time I was ever pulled over, it was for blowing a stop sign. cop was LAPD, and was very cool. he said one way to put a cop doing a traffic stop
at ease was, pull the keys from the ignition, and put them on the dashboard. been doing that since(not that I get pulled over much). but, here;s
another scenario I had: back in 1999, was walking in north hollywood, ca. on my way to 7/11. cruiser rolls by, cops are staring hard. they pull a
u-turn, pull right up to where I was, and came out of the car, guns out. They say, "don't run" (which was the last thought on my mind). they say I
"fit the description of a suspect"(black, bald, wearing a leather MC jacket). they hook me up, take me to north hollywood division(LAPD). I'm in a
small holding cell for an hour. mind you, they did not run my info from the street, they did it at the stationhouse. they come back, pull me out of
the cell, and explain that I wasn't who they were looking for, but, when they ran me, I had an expired registration ticket that had gone to warrant.
problem is, though, the ticket was CHP, so they then take me to the CHP station, where they hold me until my buddies(once I got one of 'em on the
phone) bailed me out that night. after all that, I got the $250 bail back(a check 6 weeks later), and, after getting in front of a judge, a $10 fine.
that's it. 10 bucks. so..on the initial stop, were my right violated?(I think they were) how would you have done it differently, OP?

Lately I have had a bad experience with law enforcements and it really made me angry. The last time that I ever got pulled over by a cop was about 6
years ago for speeding. Ever since then I have been obeying the law on my driving and everything else. So over thanks giving I was coming home from a
night out with my girl friend and as I was going down my street I notice a car following close to me and as I pulled into my drive way the cop turns
on his lights to pull me over in my own drive way. I knew I don't speed and was obeying the law like how I was suppose to I casually got or of my car
how I normally do when I'm about to go inside my house and the officer got out of his car to aproach me. I asked him: "is there a problem officer?" He
responds to me saying that my car tag "doesnt belong" to my own car that I have been driving for 3 years. At this point I knew this officer was being
a dick and wanted to f@#k with me. So I replied how is it possible that my tag don't belong to my cast that I have been owning for 3 year? He then
insisted that my tag wasnt mine and asked me for my registrations and drivers license. I got him what he wanted to see and he have me back my
registrations and took my DL back to his patrol car and called for backup. The backup arrived and I remembered a close family friend that is a sheriff
who works at the county jail saying there is a bunch of new class graduates that badge numbers are in the 1900s and that those are the rookie cops.

After 10 minutes the officer came back and I took notice that he was young as he was talking to me I kept my eyes on his badge remembering the
numbers and his name and also I saw his numbers were in the 1900s so that's when I knew he was a rookie. The officer took notice that I was looking at
his badge and during that time he told me that everything was good and also told me that he must have typed in my tag wrong. In my mind I knew he just
wanted to check me out and throughout that whole time I kept my cool even tho I knew what he was doingand also HE knew that I knew what he was doing.
So in the end this experience makes me feel like I can't trust law enforcement without always feeling like a suspect. I know there are alot of good
cops out there but this just make people think less of cops like thru are always out trying to find a cause to get someone.

Just to add during the summer we had someone who attempt to steal my dads truck but was unsuccessful. Now this is in the same neighborhood.. We called
the cops...they came..we told them what had happen..they told us they was going to keep an eye out for us. As we got to the end of the convo the
officer is going to ask me and my dad for our ids.. And I was thinking like wtf. They are at our house and what reasons did we do for them to ask us
for our ids when we are the one that repo. rted the crime that someone else sss getting to steal one of or vehicles. My dad can't speak english so he
insisted giving threw cop his dl... As for me I told them I didn't have my id and forgot it at work. And these cops were sheriffs in both of my
incidents.

Originally posted by dragonseeker
first time I was ever pulled over, it was for blowing a stop sign. cop was LAPD, and was very cool. he said one way to put a cop doing a traffic stop
at ease was, pull the keys from the ignition, and put them on the dashboard. been doing that since(not that I get pulled over much). but, here;s
another scenario I had: back in 1999, was walking in north hollywood, ca. on my way to 7/11. cruiser rolls by, cops are staring hard. they pull a
u-turn, pull right up to where I was, and came out of the car, guns out. They say, "don't run" (which was the last thought on my mind). they say I
"fit the description of a suspect"(black, bald, wearing a leather MC jacket). they hook me up, take me to north hollywood division(LAPD). I'm in a
small holding cell for an hour. mind you, they did not run my info from the street, they did it at the stationhouse. they come back, pull me out of
the cell, and explain that I wasn't who they were looking for, but, when they ran me, I had an expired registration ticket that had gone to warrant.
problem is, though, the ticket was CHP, so they then take me to the CHP station, where they hold me until my buddies(once I got one of 'em on the
phone) bailed me out that night. after all that, I got the $250 bail back(a check 6 weeks later), and, after getting in front of a judge, a $10 fine.
that's it. 10 bucks. so..on the initial stop, were my right violated?(I think they were) how would you have done it differently, OP?

Did they say what the suspect they were looking for had done? If it was a violent crime that would explain the guns drawn. I would have put the cuffs
on you and sat you in my car and I would have ran your information right there. But, thats me not knowing what the LAPD knew. If the warrant came back
with your info and everything else was clear I would have taken the cuffs off of you and transported you to CHP. Being held for an hour on a mistaken
ID is not really that bad in that size town, but no doubt, it is an inconvenience. It sounds like you handled it very well.
Seeashrink

I read his thread and would like to add that though i am sorry this happened to you, this is often how some of us are treated EVERY DAY and our crime
is often just having the wrong last name, wrong skin color, ride a harley, pissed off someones cousin, etc. I too am from the good old boys south and
the harressment got so bad i had to move. I admit that I havent recieved the same harressment here, but I get almost ill when a police car pulls
behind me

today I am retired and spend most my time riding around the country and STILL will not even consider riding through the state where my family had
lived for 150 years

I think anyone that wants to be a cop should be put under extra scrutiny. I know sometimes they have to take lie detector tests. I have noticed
though, people that want to be cops in like high school usually are power hungry and the douchier types of guys.

yes, they did say, it was a child rape the night before. now, knowing the type of crime it was, most people would say the cops were just doing their
job, and would cut them a break. but that does nothing for me, joe citizen, who would never do such a thing, and still got the felony stop treatment
and arrested. I didn't get beat or stomped on; no one called me a racial slur or anything. but, shouldn't we have a better standard than that? to
everyone who saw this happening, I was just another "brother" getting arrested. I didn't deserve that. I'm about the last guy you would see jammed
up by the cops, but, there I was. just sayin'..there has to be a better way to do the job.

Originally posted by anumohi
no one ever forced anyone to put on a badge. it was by their will and desire alone, and whatever the outcome it is on them for making or not making
that choice. if you choose to use that badge as a weapon or deception, then all bets are off and you enter into the realm of ENEMY and should expect
as being treated as such.

there is no sympathy for you, just as you have no sympathy for us, as we continue to pay your mortgages, divorce settlements, child support payments,
car loans, and retirement funds........now who owes who?

have some respect and you might earn some from us

SAVVY?

Who are you talking to in this post? Me? I don't think that you would recognize respect if it hit you between the eyes and fell at your feet. You're
right, no one forced a babge on me or a military uniform for that matter. I chose to do both and for honorable reasons.
You use the word "ENEMY" in describing LEO's and you say that we should expect to be treated as such. I don't know if it was you or someone else
in this thread that said something about using deadly force against LEO's. I find both of these reference inflamatory and they should be looked at by
the mods as drawing unwanted attention to ATS.
Sovereigns/freemen have blown up buildings, killed cops, held up banks, printed counterfiet money, inpersonated foreign diplomats, made counterfiet
licenses, license plates, Social Security cards, and ID cards. They clog the courts with useless paperwork. You folks sound a lot more like part of
the problem than the solution.
Respectfully,
Seeashrink

This is what people do not understand aboutt eh term or phrase...impersonating an officer. IF..if the officer HAS NOT filed his oath of office within
15 days of accepting the position, he has to file a written copy with the city, county and state, if he does NOT do this, then he is guilty of
impersonating an officer. It is that simple. Again ALL COPS ARE NOTHING MORE THAN CORPRATE SECURITY GUARDS!!! They enforce coproate policy and NOT
LAW!!

To ALL cops out there.... SHOW ME THE ENFORCEMENT CLAUSE...WHERE do you DERIVE your authority from? Where is the clause in any document that YOU took
an oath to defend and protect, what give you the right to violate my being and property?

Man was created by God/Nature was he not?

Government was a creation of Man. The police department was a creation of the CORPORATION/STATE, NOT of the people, we did not authorize nor did we
consent to a police department. If you believe we did, SHOW ME THE PROOF!!!

See..people do not understand WHO has the authority here, the police department DOES NOT over the public UNLESS we ask for it by applying for a
license. Which is illegal because we are never given FULL DISCLOSURE as to why you would need a license to use something that we rightfully own. BUT
that is the key. Registration of the auto make sit state property...property of the corporation, and misuse comes with penalties.

Until we wake up and reclaim what is rightfully ours and stop buying into the BS of the government, we are going to continually get screwed.

Police powers ARE subordinate TO the people, it's that simple and ALL cops on this site better understand that. Be the American you are supposed to
be and STOP subverting our natural inherent rights for the corporate idiots!!

I have a friend who wants to be a cop. He has a 4 year degree, went through the police academy, a flawless record, and a hunter so unlike a lot of
young rookies he has a bit of experience with firearms and weapons safety. The only thing I'd say he lack on his resume is military experience.
Needless to say he's applied to every LEO around with no luck. However there have been less qualified people who have been hired while he has been
waiting.

We joke that he is over qualified for the position and those who do the hiring don't want someone that will make them look bad. The sad thing is this
might be true.

I don't know where you live, but if he has been through the academy, this implies that he is state certified. In most states this last for about a
year. The first thing he needs to do is see if some small town will put him on as a reserve or auxillary officer, this will secure his certification
so he can relax about that. With this economy, he may very well be over qualified meaning that with a four year degree he would earn more pay that the
average joe blow being hired for the same outfit. I don't know if he has tried the Sheriff's Offices in the area, but these are normally a little
easier to get into because they experience a bigger turnover. The best way to get into a Sheriff's Office is to actually drop in and see the Sheriff
himself, they usually have an open door policy. I wish him luck.
Seeashrink

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