I disagree with the word curse that someone posted above which states that some people are too stupid to figure out their financial lives without outside assistance. In fact, everyone is born without specific financial knowledge and everyone needs some amount of modeling or money lessons as they go through life! I presume that the poster did not intend to include every person through history in their designation of stupidity.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess you mean my comment. You read what you wanted to read in it, not what I actually said. I suggest you take a good look at the relationship you have within yourself over being offended over a comment that clearly was not written offensively. Never did I say anyone was too stupid. I said they couldn't figure it out on their own. It's like saying I have to hire a plumber because I can't figure out how to fix my garbage disposal on my own. Does that make me stupid? No, that makes me ignorant in that one area of my life. That's not stupid - it's just what I have been exposed to and taught. Same goes for money. Some people are never exposed to good financial habits - which is what Dave Ramsey is for. Does that make them stupid? No. Does that make them unable to learn? No.

Edit: I realize now I used the word "money smart" to mean financially savvy. I will upgrade my slang for you next time so you don't think I'm calling someone stupid because they aren't financially savvy aka money smart.

There is a healthy way to saving and to enjoying life, needing balance in all of life, I live this way...not saving everything and ignoring the fun of life, travel, visiting daughter and relatives. I am glad I traveled when I could, and now that senior life has arrived, am more cautious...but still, am going to San Francisco to see family, I got my ticket two months ago to enable a good inexpensive price, will only stay a couple days, so definitely cut down, but still going, and Chicago on my B-day Aug. 30 like I did last year, this year brings me meeting my daughter's boyfriend and going to a play, Museum and perhaps an Architectural boat tour and of course I'll be treating to dinner. Don't sacrifice life's pleasures for old age when you may have money, but not good health. You only live once...not saying don't care, just have balance.

So I am not Mormon, but I lovelovelove some of the stuff that Mormons teach. Like this!

Truly a man does not live by bread alone. A good name is still to be preferred over great riches. Especially is it to be preferred to the appearance of riches, acquired with nothing down and nothing to pay for two months. - Ezra Taft Benson

The first step on the way to victory is to recognize the enemy. - Corrie Ten Boom
We have met the enemy and he is us, - Pogo

I think it rare (not impossible) for young college graduates to really deal with saving money. They want their own place, want to travel before marriage while they can, and basically live life. I think age has a lot to do with saving/investing, perhaps when one has their family, that is the incentive to save and become responsible.
There is a section of young folks pressured to "keep up with the Jones", buy a BMW, live where the schools are good., have credit cards, etc. Later in life after having jobs established, knowing you'll have a pension or Social Security, saving is last on the list. Looking back is learning the lesson, but for many, whatever Ramsey says right or wrong is not on their list. Needing money is always first, saving becomes last......I say this having achieved and yet having made my mistakes.

I've never bought any of Dave Ramsay's books. But I've seen him on You Tube. He provides simple, albeit extreme advice for people who are in deep financial trouble. His theory is that if you have $25,000 in Credit Card Debt, you have an economic emergency. You can't afford to go out to eat. Not even $7 at Taco Bell

But for people who can afford small luxuries (and people who can afford larger ones), then there's nothing wrong with spending money where it will make you happier and make your life easier. As long as you are thoughtful about those decisions and make sure your other financial priorities (saving, funding your priorities like college funds or charitable contributions, etc.) are not being neglected.

If he and other financial gurus have found a way to communicate this in a way that helps people, more power to them. He's not saying anything earth-shattering, but if it helps people to use his plan or to hear him describe what they need to do, then great. Losing weight is "easy" too. You just take in fewer calories than you burn. Every diet in the world is based on this, but there are different approaches and advice about how to do. I don't begrudge anyone who has found a way that works for some people to sell books or speaking gigs to describe their diet plan, just like I don't begrudge people like Dave Ramsay who has found a way to talk about a financial diet.

Sandy, that is great but is not mutually exclusive to building savings/assets for your kids' education, your retirement and for emergencies. Sure folks like Ramsey and Ormand and others make money by lecturing and writing books, but that doesn't mean they are wrong. They rather are emphasizing what you should be able to figure out with common sense. The fact is that only a decade ago many families were hurt badly because they had little or no reserves when the recession hit. We should have learned but even today the estimates are that 40% of Americans don't have enough cash reserves to cover a $400 auto repair and many more don't have health insurance so an accident or illness could send them into bankruptcy. If these folks can persuade their readers/listeners to look at their finances seriously and find ways to save for their futures, I won't resent that they got rich any more than I resent a farmer or fisherman making a living. Somehow Americans seem as reluctant to look at their financial health as they are to plan for their own demise by having a will drawn up.

Agreed. We have great health and life insurance, and we both fund our 401ks. We live simply, and don't have any expensive habits. I have a relative who, along with her spouse, lives in an area with a lower cost of living than ours. They don't understand how we managed to buy a house on acreage, have two cars, money for the kids' sports and music lessons, money socked away for a rainy day, and can take a modest vacation every year. Short answer, we don't smoke or drink, and we don't eat at restaurants unless it's reimbursed (with a few exceptions for birthdays, etc.) People like Ramsey can say what they want, but contentment is the richest feeling there is.

But didn't The Hollies croon, "All I need is the air that I breathe...?"

Anyway, I think I get that being a millionaire, and possibly a multimillionaire, might be necessary for people's comfortable retirements. By now, we have heard many predictions of doom, and gloom regarding precarious pensions & Social Security programs that may or may not be funded as time passes. We might choose to think in terms of living well in our old age. Being a millionaire as a goal? Pffffft. Accumulating sufficient funds to hedge against loss of expected pension or Social Security makes a great deal of sense. If sufficient funds run to a million or more bucks, then one might necessarily become a millionaire in pursuit of independence from planned and social programs. But this is like splitting hairs, and it annoys people, and I am going away to do something else now.

@JASFLALMT wrote:

Nope. "All You Need is Love" according to the Beatles.

The first step on the way to victory is to recognize the enemy. - Corrie Ten Boom
We have met the enemy and he is us, - Pogo

I might have to downsize if something changes. I have several rooms in my house that I only go into once a month or so to dust and vacuum unless company is coming to visit. I really wouldn't mind moving into someplace smaller.

Over the last 50 years the stock market has returned a little more than 10% per year on average--this is if you stayed invested through all the upturns and downturns in quality stocks. In the past if you knew nothing of the markets you were encouraged to purchase mutual funds that had a manager handling the investment of your funds, for which a fee was charged usually up front to buy the fund and then a smaller fee annually. These days you can purchase "index funds" (also called ETF) which are buying into a portfolio of stocks that mirrors the index. So you can buy the 'DOW' as stock DIA, the 'Nasdaq' as QQQ and the 'S&P 500' as SPY. Many of the discount brokerage houses are allowing you to purchase these ETFs with no transaction fees. This makes it feasible to make systematic small deposits to a brokerage account and even buy these index funds one share at a time.

I listen to Dave Ramsey when ever I am in the car at the right time. I see nothing in your description that disagrees with him.
He is all about enjoying your money once you are out of debt and on top of things.

@Sandy Shopper wrote:

Agreed. We have great health and life insurance, and we both fund our 401ks. We live simply, and don't have any expensive habits. I have a relative who, along with her spouse, lives in an area with a lower cost of living than ours. They don't understand how we managed to buy a house on acreage, have two cars, money for the kids' sports and music lessons, money socked away for a rainy day, and can take a modest vacation every year. Short answer, we don't smoke or drink, and we don't eat at restaurants unless it's reimbursed (with a few exceptions for birthdays, etc.) People like Ramsey can say what they want, but contentment is the richest feeling there is.

When anyone does what Ramsey says, and makes money, please share the experience....his money comes from the books he writes and you buy.

The principles are largely universal; the methods are more specific and tailored to your own situation.
His snowball method for credit cards works. It might seem that it's smarter to pay off the highest interest card, but in real life, the emotional satisfaction of paying off that first card is a great motivator to pay off the rest. It's largely about living below your means, whatever level that might be. And paying cash for what you can. Mostly, however, his advice is about taking personal responsibility for your life.

“I am convinced that knowledge is power - to overcome the past, to change our own situations, to fight new obstacles, to make better decisions.” ~Ben Carson

The dogma of the non-military boot camp is so much like the dogma of my family that I cringe every time I see this thread. I read the thread anyway because it is an interesting topic. What I learned from family is that money exists separately from sense and decency and this is demanded from birth, generation after generation after generation. When I see this kind of nuttiness playing out elsewhere, I know that I must muster up courage and go to the useful resources. Sometimes, I refer to slogans such as the ones for anon group members. Easy does it. Progress not perfection. One day at a time. There isn't a specific group that I know of called Kin of Financial Automatons Anon, which would be for survivors of my family's money mentality. The established Anons have what I need.

People who are learning new money styles are not asked or forced to abstain from using money. They are seeking to make changes in how they think about money and use it. They are learning how to say no to the pressures and subtleties of advertising and social pressures and how these may impact on spending decisions and financial outcomes. I have learned and become braver. I feel free to speak out against the boot camp approach which demands its own way at the expense of individuals' own rights and freedoms to learn, experience consequences, discover, explore, and choose. The boot camp demands exactly what advertising and social pressure demand: cave to me and cease to be. Thus , it should be dealt with as just another competing demand for one's individual money style and financial freedom.

I have come to accept that I will never be a cookie cutter version of my family's money mentality and its brutal use of money as a weapon. I have come to accept that I will never be a cookie cutter version of activists' definition of me as an earner and user of other-defined revenues. I have come to accept that some people may never acknowledge or never give up their addiction to clamoring for control of how I and others shall live out our lives with regards to work, money, income, expenditures, and anything else that they potentially can micromanage.

And, back I go to the useful information.

The first step on the way to victory is to recognize the enemy. - Corrie Ten Boom
We have met the enemy and he is us, - Pogo

I wrote about it on another thread, it is a 75.00 voucher for another flight due to the late flights and hassle I had to go through. I wrote and complained and was answered immediately with an apology, explanation and voucher held in my account for a year for travel.

I wrote about it on another thread, it is a 75.00 voucher for another flight due to the late flights and hassle I had to go through. I wrote and complained and was answered immediately with an apology, explanation and voucher held in my account for a year for travel.

They're really good about responding to both complaints and praises. Eastern Airlines (RIP) excelled at this as well. I try to balance my complaints and praises; the praises probably mean more because people are more likely to vocalize complaints.

“I am convinced that knowledge is power - to overcome the past, to change our own situations, to fight new obstacles, to make better decisions.” ~Ben Carson

Instead of being a millionaire, I have 1.5 million in debt. I shop at Goodwill. I buy a lot second hand. At my age, I don't think I'll ever have the debt paid off. I guess it's okay; it's real estate and it cash flows every month, but every once in a while, when I think about it, I nearly have a heart attack

Word to the wise.....set you goals so they can be reached. Millionaire sounds so far out there, I have trouble connecting to that word. I'll be happy if I live these last years in comfort, not to worry about money and keep going in good health...with the upswing in prices on a daily basis living in L.A., becoming a millionaire is last on my bucket list.

your handle is Irene
you live in LA
you remind people to set your goals so they can be reached

What.

@Irene_L.A. wrote:

Word to the wise.....set you goals so they can be reached. Millionaire sounds so far out there, I have trouble connecting to that word. I'll be happy if I live these last years in comfort, not to worry about money and keep going in good health...with the upswing in prices on a daily basis living in L.A., becoming a millionaire is last on my bucket list.

The first step on the way to victory is to recognize the enemy. - Corrie Ten Boom
We have met the enemy and he is us, - Pogo

your handle is Irene
you live in LA
you remind people to set your goals so they can be reached

What.

@Irene_L.A. wrote:

Word to the wise.....set your goals so they can be reached. Millionaire sounds so far out there, I have trouble connecting to that word. I'll be happy if I live these last years in comfort, not to worry about money and keep going in good health...with the upswing in prices on a daily basis living in L.A., becoming a millionaire is last on my bucket list
.