OSNews: http://www.osnews.com/story/25101/Judge_Upholds_German_Preliminary_Injunction
Exploring the Future of Computingen-usCopyright 2001-2015, David Adamsadam+nospam@osnews.comSun, 02 Aug 2015 23:12:49 GMThttp://www.osnews.com/images/osnews.gifOSNews.comhttp://www.osnews.com
Justicehttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486788
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486788I really hope Apple is held accountable for this and not just given a slap on the wrist.

Regardless of what you think of their products or the whole innovation/evolution debate, tampering with evidence is a serious offense. Furthermore, using such false documents to force a ban on competitors is so far outside of what I'd personally class as fair competition that a monetary penalty doesn't even begin to equate to the audacity demonstrated.Edited 2011-08-25 12:21 UTCThu, 25 Aug 2011 12:19:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Laurence)CommentsGreat news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486789
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486789I hope Apple products get banned in Europe as a punishment for Apple's attempt to ban Samsung products using bogus evidence. There should be no Apple products during the holiday shopping season.Edited 2011-08-25 12:20 UTCThu, 25 Aug 2011 12:19:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (satan666)CommentsRE: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486790
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486790

I hope Apple products get banned in Europe as a punishment for Apple's attempt to ban Samsung products using bogus evidence. There should be no Apple products during the holiday shopping season.

It would never happen, however something like that would send a clear message that this kind of behavior is completely unacceptable.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 12:22:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Laurence)CommentsRE: Justicehttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486791
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486791Well it is just an accusation at this point.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 12:26:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Thom_Holwerda)CommentsRE: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486794
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486794I for one hope that it's not, since that would be really silly.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 12:38:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (No it isnt)CommentsRE[2]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486795
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486795

I for one hope that it's not, since that would be really silly.

How is this silly and the current ban on Samsung products not silly?Thu, 25 Aug 2011 12:43:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (satan666)Commentscopycatshttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486798
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486798Samsung is just copying everything Apple does. The Galaxy S phones look too much like the iPhone that people get confused so they should be banned worldwide. The Galaxy Tab looks so much like the iPad Samsung should be ordered to pay Apple all of the profit they have earned since its first release.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 12:51:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (supergear)CommentsRE[3]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486800
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486800I didn't say that. The Samsung ban is silly, but I don't see how a disingenuous lawsuit should lead to a ban on sales for the other company. A hefty fine + damages for lost sales, yes.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 12:53:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (No it isnt)CommentsRE[4]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486804
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486804

I didn't say that. The Samsung ban is silly, but I don't see how a disingenuous lawsuit should lead to a ban on sales for the other company. A hefty fine + damages for lost sales, yes.

If the ban on Samsung is silly but is implemented already, then silly is possible in Europe. I only want that the same thing is applied to Apple. Or are you saying that there should be double standards?
A hefty fine will not hurt Apple in any way. IIRC they have 75 billion in cash. The court needs to punish Apple in a way that will make Apple think twice before pulling frivolous lawsuits on competitors.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 13:31:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (satan666)CommentsRE[2]: Justicehttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486808
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486808Samsung have proven the original claim of evidence tampering, so (rightly or wrongly) I'm already inclined to believe that there's some truth in these latest allegations.

I guess only time will tell...Thu, 25 Aug 2011 13:45:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Laurence)CommentsRE[4]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486809
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486809According to most jurisdictions intentionally misleading a judge is a serious offense. Germany probably has some very strict rules there...Thu, 25 Aug 2011 13:46:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (JAlexoid)CommentsRE: copycatshttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486810
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486810Apple: Copycats! Copycats! Copycats! ... Oh look! Jailbreakers have some new ideas we can "integrate". Ooooo.... Shiny notifications.... /sThu, 25 Aug 2011 13:48:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (JAlexoid)CommentsJudge is a moronhttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486812
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486812That judge is obviously a moron. WTF?
I look at my computer screen and it is a rectangle with rounded corners and the screen is on the front side. I look at other brands of computer screens and they are the almost the same. You can only tell the brand by checking the logo. What is Samsung supposed to do to make their tablets different? Make oval tablets? Put the screen on the edge of the tablet?Thu, 25 Aug 2011 14:05:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (satan666)Commentsvexatious litigants http://www.osnews.com/thread?486813
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486813In Australia an individual or corporation can be declared a vexatious litigant for repeatedly using the legal system solely to harrass or subdue an adversary. They are then (permanently) banned from pursuing any further civil court actions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vexatious_litigationThu, 25 Aug 2011 14:12:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (unclefester)CommentsRE: Judge is a moronhttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486817
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486817No (s)he is not an idiot. Upholding a preliminary injunction has least consequences, compared to allowing and the banning.

But lo and behold, since EU has the rule of free movement of goods Galaxy Tab will be sold there or any German can get one fro any other EU country...Thu, 25 Aug 2011 14:29:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (JAlexoid)CommentsGermany or EU widehttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486818
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486818Have they decided on whether or not the ban applies to all of the EU or only to Germany? I'm not sure German courts ruling on what can and cannot be imported into the UK would go down well here.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 14:36:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (maethorechannen)CommentsRE: vexatious litigants http://www.osnews.com/thread?486819
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486819We should have that everywhere.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 14:54:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (SaschaW)CommentsRE[5]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486820
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486820Apple noted the size difference in the original filing and the judge also actually held both devices last time around.

I didn't say that. The Samsung ban is silly, but I don't see how a disingenuous lawsuit should lead to a ban on sales for the other company. A hefty fine + damages for lost sales, yes.

Samsung does not want damages for lost sales, they want to sell their phones. Thereâs much more from a phone sale than just money â itâs all about the ecosystem nowadays.

Being limited (by having a product banned) by the court for a frivolous lawsuit will cost them customers.
Itâs only right that Apple incurs the same cost if found to be abusing the courts.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 14:57:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Beta)CommentsRE[6]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486823
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486823

I predict that the judge will totally ignore Samsung's somewhat desperate maneuver.

Samsung have good reason to be "desperate", Apple are twisting the law to prevent natural competition.

Your tone there almost sounds sympathetic for Apple but I really do think Samsung are the victims here.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 15:23:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Laurence)CommentsRE[2]: Judge is a moronhttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486824
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486824

No (s)he is not an idiot. Upholding a preliminary injunction has least consequences, compared to allowing and the banning.

So (s)he is a coward then and takes the easy option out rather than risk making a landmark decision.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 15:26:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Laurence)CommentsRE[3]: Judge is a moronhttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486825
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486825

So (s)he is a coward then and takes the easy option out rather than risk making a landmark decision.

The landmark decision has already been made in Netherlands. All she had to do was acknowledge the fact that she was stupid when she decided to ban Samsung, apologize for her utter stupidity and lift the ban.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 15:48:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (satan666)CommentsRE[4]: Judge is a moronhttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486826
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486826She would, but she is an iJudge and cannot go against the will of Jobs allmightyThu, 25 Aug 2011 15:55:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Shkaba)CommentsRE[4]: Judge is a moronhttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486827
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486827It would be an admittance of failure regarding the first injunction if she backed off now. In the final ruling she can dismiss the injunction more easily, by claiming she has now studied all the evidence.

The Galaxy S phones look too much like the iPhone that people get confused so they should be banned worldwide.

I know right?!

Same problem with tires - every time i see those round black things on a wheel, I immediately assume they're Firestone tires, and then I get up close and they're Michelin! DAMNIT! They should outlaw anyone else from making black circular rubber tires... even though they have the name brand printed right on them, it's sooo confusing!Thu, 25 Aug 2011 16:43:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (umccullough)CommentsRE[5]: Judge is a moronhttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486830
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486830Are you going to eat the paper your comment is printed on if she doesn't?

The only reason why those round black things are used by everyone these days is that the patents have long expired. If you made one just like it (even if it was made of different stuff) while the patent was still in force you would face litigations.

That's sort of the way patents and copyrights work (not saying it's right but if you have an issue it's the laws you should be looking to change).

Actually, funny you should say that, because tires were patented, tubeless tires were patented, tires with added stuff to make them stronger were patented and so on.

Funny you should say that, because patents aren't the reason for this injunction. It's a "community design" case where Apple claims that Samsung's devices *look* too much like their generic drawings and utterly simplistic design.

Apple brought their iThing to the judge, Samsung brought their sThing to the judge, Apple said 'their sThing looks like our iThing and we there is this here law that says their not allowed to do that', judge said 'I agree.'

No one is twisting any laws here.

]{

PS. I love it how you say that a massive APAC company that generates huge profits by paying substandard wages (by western standards) is 'the victim'.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 16:58:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (kristoph)CommentsRE[4]: copycatshttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486840
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486840Actually, a 'community design' is essentially the equivalent of a 'design patent'.

(You know it's really lame to call someone a troll because they challenge your factual interpretation of an event. If you have facts to back up your position why not simply state that, why start crying 'troll'.)Thu, 25 Aug 2011 17:05:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (kristoph)CommentsRE[5]: copycatshttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486848
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486848

(You know it's really lame to call someone a troll because they challenge your factual interpretation of an event. If you have facts to back up your position why not simply state that, why start crying 'troll'.)

Heh, I've been called troll for far less - somehow it didn't bother me enough to make a point of whining about it.

Edit: Oh, and I came with my facts - Community Designs are not patents or copyright.Edited 2011-08-25 17:54 UTCThu, 25 Aug 2011 17:43:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (umccullough)CommentsRE[8]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486851
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486851

PS. I love it how you say that a massive APAC company that generates huge profits by paying substandard wages (by western standards) is 'the victim'.

You are refering to Apple here, right? After all, didn't Apple hire a concentration camp in China ... few suicides ...Thu, 25 Aug 2011 18:10:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Shkaba)CommentsRE[6]: copycatshttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486868
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486868Ok, well, let's call a truce on the trolling and let me beat you up on your interpretation of the facts ....

from Wikipedia:

Design patents are a type of industrial design right.

... and ...

A Community design is a unitary industrial design right that covers the European Community.

Convinced?Thu, 25 Aug 2011 21:14:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (kristoph)CommentsRE[9]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486869
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486869If your talking about Foxconn their the largest for hire manufacturer on the planet and their used by essentially everyone.

That said I would never suggest Apple or any other multinational corporation is a 'victim'.

The use of laws (defined by democratically elected officials) to advance your business is, IMO, perfectly legitimate. Now I don't personally agrees with these laws but that does not invalidate them.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 21:16:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (kristoph)CommentsRE[10]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486871
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486871

That said I would never suggest Apple or any other multinational corporation is a 'victim'.

The use of laws (defined by democratically elected officials) to advance your business is, IMO, perfectly legitimate. Now I don't personally agrees with these laws but that does not invalidate them.

What, a victim makes, best not decided by you, then. According to your logic, the nature of recipient of unfair treatment is the determining factor in choosing to brand someone a "victim". I profoundly resent that point of view. Irrespective of the nature (or type) of recipient, unfair treatment is unfair! That is also one of the fundamental principals of any democratic society (equal rights)Thu, 25 Aug 2011 21:33:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Shkaba)CommentsRE[11]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486874
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486874The problem is, what is "fair" ?

Apple will say, it's asking that Samsung spend as much time on design as they did.

Samsung will say, it's about having the right to launch a tablet/smartphone that's equal to Apple's one.

Socrates will say, it's about following the law and being equals.

The only thing that can be concluded from these is that Socrates is a jerk Edited 2011-08-25 22:04 UTCThu, 25 Aug 2011 22:02:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Neolander)CommentsComment by franhttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486877
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486877Update IV's link does not work.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 22:12:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (fran)CommentsRE[11]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486878
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486878

What, a victim makes, best not decided by you, then. According to your logic, the nature of recipient of unfair treatment is the determining factor in choosing to brand someone a "victim". I profoundly resent that point of view. Irrespective of the nature (or type) of recipient, unfair treatment is unfair! That is also one of the fundamental principals of any democratic society (equal rights)

My position is that, in democratic society, the application of a law created by democratically elected officials, in a manner in which it was intended, cannot implicitly make you a 'victim' because such laws apply fairly and equally to everyone.

In fact, when one has been wronged under the law, it is typically the wronged party that is considered the 'victim' (which in this case would be Apple) though as I have stated in the previous posts I don't view corporations as people and so I don't think it could be said that the corporation as a whole can be victimized.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 22:18:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (kristoph)CommentsRE[10]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486896
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486896So... Do Apple store employees get better salaries than anyone else? Really don't think so...Thu, 25 Aug 2011 23:53:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (JAlexoid)CommentsRE[4]: Judge is a moronhttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486897
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486897There was no final decision in NL. And CD is still not invalidated.
Let's stick to the facts.Thu, 25 Aug 2011 23:56:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (JAlexoid)CommentsRE[11]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?486922
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486922Actually, according to glassdoor.com, they make about 20% more then their counterparts who work for other electronics retailers :-)Fri, 26 Aug 2011 00:58:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (kristoph)CommentsRE[7]: copycatshttp://www.osnews.com/thread?486980
http://www.osnews.com/thread?486980I just wish I'd registered a community design on a PC tower case. A large cuboid with a power button on the front and slots for a couple of optical drives. Surely nobody could've come up with that idea independently?

Yes, the S2 looks like the iPhone, but even when the iPhone originally came out there had been PDAs and other devices which were mostly screen and a button or two on one end. There are only so many combinations to that form that can be made before they all start looking like each other. Not from copying another design, but because they're all so bloody close.Fri, 26 Aug 2011 07:30:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (daedalus)CommentsRE[8]: Great news!http://www.osnews.com/thread?487003
http://www.osnews.com/thread?487003

How is anyone twisting the law?

Apple brought their iThing to the judge, Samsung brought their sThing to the judge, Apple said 'their sThing looks like our iThing and we there is this here law that says their not allowed to do that', judge said 'I agree.'

No one is twisting any laws here.

]{

PS. I love it how you say that a massive APAC company that generates huge profits by paying substandard wages (by western standards) is 'the victim'.

Oh great, a fanboy.

/part can't be bothered with brainwashed iZombiesFri, 26 Aug 2011 10:15:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (Laurence)CommentsRE: copycatshttp://www.osnews.com/thread?487160
http://www.osnews.com/thread?487160Just wanted to congratulate you on making it all the way down to -9 (as of this posting). Don't think I've ever seen that before.Fri, 26 Aug 2011 23:52:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (vitae)CommentsRE[7]: copycatshttp://www.osnews.com/thread?487378
http://www.osnews.com/thread?487378If You carried on with this investigation, You would find out, that the word "patent" in "disgn patent" is derived from the latin word "patens" (certificate), while the term patent (without "design") is derived from the word "patere" (to lay open). This happened because "patent" and "design patent" denote *unrelated* exclusive rights.Sun, 28 Aug 2011 23:17:00 GMTdonotreply@osnews.com (ddc_)Comments