In reply to Milesy:
I've heard similar tales of how tough the flys are. Think you'd need a really high carbon steel bit and a low speed, high torque drill press. Know anyone who has access to an engineering workshop to do it for you?

In reply to Milesy: best thing would probably be hss-co drill bits as they have a certain % of cobalt in them thats what we tend to use at work for stainless idealy you need a bench drill as you can get a slow speed with good torque. if using a normal drill a decent cutting fluid or grease will help and try using the smallest drill u have to get started.

In reply to Milesy: No idea what Flys are made of but doubt it's something a carbide drill wont go through - cheap enough off ebay.

That said what are you using? I know nothing about your engineering skills so forgive me if I'm teaching you to suck eggs. Use a small drill to open a pilot (a little larger in diameter that the web at the tip of you final drill), keep the drilling speed down and use a cutting fluid, normal oil is better than nothing. Most importantly make sure the drill is sharped properly.

In reply to Milesy: I actually used a small tile/glass drill bit (the kind that looks a bit like a stone age spear) to make the initial holes in the web of the spike on my Flys. I don't know what it was tipped with, I just had it kicking around in my toolkit. Nothing else would make any kind of impression. I then opened the pilot holes out with a Bosch titanium bit, and tidied up afterwards with a small round file.

In reply to Milesy: B & Q do a titanium or carbon drill bit set for 20 quid ish and he just used a dewelt drill and used some coolant to help with the process. What petzl grip rests are you using? I'm wanting to do the same with mine

In reply to Richard Phelan: The gold drill bits are generally just HSS with a titanium coating. Tungsten carbide is used in the tips of masonry drills (I've known guys put an edge on one of these for drilling hard steel but you need the right grade of grinding wheel)It is also used for the tips of ceramic drills and on some core drill bits You can get solid carbide drills but they're not the sort of thing you'll pick up from B&Q.

> (In reply to Richard Phelan) The gold drill bits are generally just HSS with a titanium coating. Tungsten carbide is used in the tips of masonry drills (I've known guys put an edge on one of these for drilling hard steel but you need the right grade of grinding wheel)It is also used for the tips of ceramic drills and on some core drill bits You can get solid carbide drills but they're not the sort of thing you'll pick up from B&Q.

I wasn't aware that the the tip was used on SDS drill bits?
( I only use SDS Drills on site)

However when drilling stainless steel cabinets on sites like for cable entries we always used Tungsten Carbide Drill bits. (which are the Gold drill bits as opposed to the Black or stainless coloured ones)
So long as you don't let the drill go to fast as so heated up the material and so Harden the metal being drilled you'll be ok.

to explain about the properties of drill bits you could refer to this page.

I have a set of cobalt steel drill bits (horrendously expensive!) that I bought several years ago for drilling marine grade stainless steel. They are excellent PROVIDED (as Richard has said) you keep the speed down and use some lubrication. I am fortunate to have a drill press, which undoubtedly makes the job easier. I also had occasion to drill stainless underwater, using an air drill, which was interesting, but I've never tried these bits on titanium (they will, reputedly drill Ti).
A good quality bit will make all the difference:http://www.ttp-hard-drills.com/cobalt-drill-bits-products.html

The gold coloured bits are just coated with titanium nitride which is very hard and reduces friction but wears away eventually and a thin coating is only as strong as the substrate anyway (HSS probably)

I am really surprised you are having so much trouble i wonder if it is actually rour drill that is the problem?

I ran into similar problems last year, trying to drill my flys's with a cheap corded drill on my door step at home.

In the end i took it to the Engineering department at university and they did it in two seconds.

They used my cheap bosch drill bit nothing special just £2 from B+Q.
The man just had a very good old pillar drill, and said its all amount a slow constant speed and pressure, which you cannot get with a normal drill.

He also said the axe i had attempted to drill at home was hardened because i had compacted and heated the metal where i was trying to drill.

How is a centre punch going to make a dent in such hard metal if titanium drill bits wont?

I only have a plain single speed corded drill (with hammer turned off).

I could only get the Titanium ones near me. I need to balance all this cost off with just selling the things and getting new axes. I have already wasted 30 quid on drill bits, and then when I price in the potentially wasted grip rests and petrol and hassle I would have been as well just getting the new axes.

> How is a centre punch going to make a dent in such hard metal if titanium drill bits wont?
>
> I only have a plain single speed corded drill (with hammer turned off).
>
> I could only get the Titanium ones near me. I need to balance all this cost off with just selling the things and getting new axes. I have already wasted 30 quid on drill bits, and then when I price in the potentially wasted grip rests and petrol and hassle I would have been as well just getting the new axes.

I've not tried drilling Flys but on other metals I've tried the big difference wasn't the bit or the drill (I used hand held) but getting some cutting oil. I would've got paste but couldn't find any so ending up going to machine mart where it was about a tenner for a big bottle of oil.

After that it went fine, nothing to do with the bit or the speed of the drill.

A decent centre punch will stop you slipping, especially once it's oily.