What is the reason for the October 31 deadline? Are the actual names really needed, or is it just "step 1" to make us decide on something by a certain date. If it's the latter, I think we should just decide on a "starting point", not necessarily on a name.

Well, we want to try to simulate the actual design process that we use as much as possible. We start with names and a set list first, and then move on to ideas and first drafts. If you would like to have a first draft done by the first deadline, there isn't necessarily anything wrong with that. It's probably a good idea to have SOME kind of idea of where you are going with the name.

The deadline is for the name, minimum. If you have more than that, that's cool. But the name will have to be set in stone by the deadline.

_________________"An elegant, easy-to-understand concept or mechanic that accomplishes 95% of what you want is much better than a clunky, obtuse mechanic that gets you 100%" - Rob Daviau

What is the reason for the October 31 deadline? Are the actual names really needed, or is it just "step 1" to make us decide on something by a certain date. If it's the latter, I think we should just decide on a "starting point", not necessarily on a name.

We are replicating what we do in the set design process. What is the point of wasting time arguing about stats when the character is not going to be in the set? Well...unless you just like to argue. The deadline is in place to see if you guys can manage to make a decision by a point in time. If you can't manage that, then well, what is the point arguing about stats that you will never come to a conclusion on. Names are the easiest part of the whole thing.

Alexi Garyn from Scum and villany is a perfect example of this. The idea behind the set was a Fringe heavy set and with a fringe heavy set you need some fringe uniques. I like the small part this guy played in the comics and that he could be paired up with Migella. It also would provide an option for the Black Sun sub faction to get fleshed out a bit. I had very little idea what his stats would be when I propose my set list.

Knowing the name of the character also is vital because it allows other folks to start thier part of the process.A recommend mini (RM) has to be figured out. The folks doing the cards have to photograph and photoshop the RM. The set list has to be made in order for the car designers to start the process of getting the right character name paired up with the right card number and faction color. Someone (jedispyder) also has to go through all the names and make sure the bone head designers, like myself, spelled Alexi Garyn correctly.

Yes, the name seems simple and why not just jump into the fun? Well, many things depend on the name and names are much easier and quicker to discuss and change an entire block of stats.

Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:05 pmPosts: 1276Location: Yes, I am yet another Canadian. Keeping the game alive on life support in the GTA.

Oh, so you guys will chime in and answer questions.

What is to be considered a consensus on the choices for names? There are dozens of suggestions, with relatively few getting multiple votes. If in the end we have a couple of ideas that are +12 and +10 (or much less) will that be considered "agreed upon"? Should we make a short list and ask people to come and vote on it? I have to believe that is not really going to garner much more attention than has already been paid.

What is to be considered a consensus on the choices for names? There are dozens of suggestions, with relatively few getting multiple votes. If in the end we have a couple of ideas that are +12 and +10 (or much less) will that be considered "agreed upon"? Should we make a short list and ask people to come and vote on it? I have to believe that is not really going to garner much more attention than has already been paid.

That is really for you guys to figure out. For V-set 6 we all met in Atlanta and had a bare knuckle brawl to see whose ideas would win out. For his size Echo knows how to really take a punch

Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:05 pmPosts: 1276Location: Yes, I am yet another Canadian. Keeping the game alive on life support in the GTA.

LESHIPPY wrote:

R5Don4 wrote:

Oh, so you guys will chime in and answer questions.

What is to be considered a consensus on the choices for names? There are dozens of suggestions, with relatively few getting multiple votes. If in the end we have a couple of ideas that are +12 and +10 (or much less) will that be considered "agreed upon"? Should we make a short list and ask people to come and vote on it? I have to believe that is not really going to garner much more attention than has already been paid.

That is really for you guys to figure out. For V-set 6 we all met in Atlanta and had a bare knuckle brawl to see whose ideas would win out. For his size Echo knows how to really take a punch

That's what I figured all this silence meant, I just wanted to make sure one of the two dozen members of the Vset designer secret society (VSDSS) wouldn't come in and lay a steaming coil for us to dance around.

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Last edited by R5Don4 on Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

What is to be considered a consensus on the choices for names? There are dozens of suggestions, with relatively few getting multiple votes. If in the end we have a couple of ideas that are +12 and +10 (or much less) will that be considered "agreed upon"? Should we make a short list and ask people to come and vote on it? I have to believe that is not really going to garner much more attention than has already been paid.

I proposed a timeline early on that didn't get any objections or alternate suggestions, so I've been working with the assumption that we'd use that timeline. There are only a handful that are checking this thread regularly, but quite a few others have chimed in with their suggestions and checked back occasionally. By collecting everything with at least a single +1 and asking for votes on those, it will even the playing field for any late entries. Also, with a "short list" and then another round of finalists we'll be able to focus the discussion on the top candidates under consideration.

Cloaked (If this character has cover, he cannot be targeted by nonadjacent enemies)

Melee Reach 3 (When attacking, this character treats enemies up to 3 squares away as adjacent)

Absorb Life Energy (When a living enemy is defeated by this character, remove 10 damage and this character gets +1 Attack and +1 Defense. These bonuses are cumulative.)

Savage obviously is negated by emplacement for movement requirements, but still works for the purpose of commander effects, which i think is really important for making a realistic sarlac.

Until you add Celeste and or the rancor keeper. In a mando squad you could give it parry and evade with the rancor keeper in the squad. That would be funny. I'm sure playtesting would change things on this stat block.

I'm half agree with Johnny on this. I could care less about reading through all these stats and more about names and concepts.Gammorean boost/pirate boost for example.

_________________"But one thing I have learned in this process is that flavor can't override the good of the game."-urbanshmi2-

Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:05 pmPosts: 1276Location: Yes, I am yet another Canadian. Keeping the game alive on life support in the GTA.

Yes Ralph, we have the Conch.

Here are my thoughts:

I think a +1 isn't enough to make the short list, a suggestion needs to at least be seconded to show it has broader appeal.

I'll +3 the 19th being the end of submissions to be considered. Les/Daniel/Scott/anyone please make note of this and have this thread locked on the 20th. Once it is locked discussion will continue in a new thread, that I'll make now and reserve the first 2 posts in.

While we will only have two pieces to be submitted as community choices in the end, we shouldn't limit member voting to only 2 choices to make the finals. If one or two choices are clearly head and shoulders choices above the pack, by the 24th, we can forego the final round of voting for one or both. If we have a final round of voting we can limit number of choices that can be voted for.

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Last edited by R5Don4 on Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

In principle, I agree with jonny about 'names only'. Everyone should recognize that right now we are just deciding on a name - once we have the names, the next phase essentially starts with a blank slate for designing the stats. Of course, the stats can be proposed at that time, but there's no guarantee any person's stats will be used, even if they were the one who originally proposed the name.

On the other hand, it seems that suggestions that are just names without stats don't draw the +1 support as easily.

With that in mind, and in keeping with the "throw everything at the wall" approach, here are some more ideas.

Door Control PanelEmplacementLimited Override: Override that works only on adjacent doors(It would also have limitations so that it can't attack, be effected by CEs, block movement or provide cover.)

LandspeederA movement breaker/transport similar to Troop Cart but it lets characters jump out immediately after it moves, instead of having to wait until the next round.

I proposed a cost 3 R6 Droid earlier, but here are a couple possible stat blocks. It wouldn't necessarily have to be a cost 3 droid. I think it would be useful to have another decent Astromech. The R5 mini isn't being used:

R6 DroidCost: 3HP: 10Def: 15Atk: 0Dmg: 0Adjacent Override Open: At the end of its turn, this character can designate 1 adjacent door as open; it remain open and cannot be closed until the end of this character's next turn, or until he is defeated

I think a +1 isn't enough to make the short list, a suggestion needs to at least be seconded to show it has broader appeal.

I'll +3 the 19th being the end of submissions to be considered. Les/Daniel/Scott/anyone please make note of this and have this thread locked on the 20th. Once it is locked discussion will continue in a new thread, that I'll make now and reserve the first 2 posts in.

While we will only have two pieces to be submitted as community choices, we shouldn't limit member voting to only 2 choices for the finals. If one or two choices are clearly head and shoulders choices above the pack, by the 24th, we can forego the final round of voting for one or both.

The conch... yeah, that's the problem here. It's like Lord of the Flies where we have to make our own order out of this with no official leadership among us.

I agree with you about the voting. I think the voting method should be an "Approval" style method where you vote up or down on everything on the ballot. That allows the items with the broadest consensus to rise to the top. If each person is only allowed to vote for 2 (or 3) items, we're more likely to get something that half the group loves but half the group hates... that's more likely to lead to more disgruntled people. The five (4? 6?) with the most approvals move on to be finalists. Even if there's a clear leader, I don't think there's any reason to forego the second round of voting. If there are clear leaders, they'll easily win the second round, too. And if we know something is going to win, there's nothing stopping us from starting to talk about its design early. So skipping the vote doesn't really buy us anything.

Changing the rules mid-way could upset someone. For example, if they think they could have persuaded the masses away from the idea that looks like it's a shoo-in. I'm talking about a hypothetical case that should never happen, but this whole setup is ripe for heated disagreements. Having rules set early and sticking to them is one way to keep things transparent minimize disagreements.

Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:05 pmPosts: 1276Location: Yes, I am yet another Canadian. Keeping the game alive on life support in the GTA.

Eliminating the clear lead choice, will allow more attention to be paid on the second choice as we are choosing two after all. But it would have to be not even close. A real landslide. Right now everything is really close.

The problem is we have many submissions/choices but very few actual votes being put forward. It's a missed opportunity. Obviously it shows there is a strong community input by the amount of entries but very few people are voting for anything. This is a collaborative project not a contest, but it looks like our competitive nature as gamers is working against us.

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Last edited by R5Don4 on Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I'd also like to suggest the followingI like the idea of the door panel, bu. I think that it would have to have maybe like a force field ability that could repair doors that were blown or something... not sure. but just for an emplacement that can override the door next to it? Not sure its worth points for something an uggy is just going to nuke... would have to hear other opinions on this. just my thoughts... so, i like it enough that i think it would possibly deserve a spot if we could get a solid stat block and mechanic drawn up for it. Would certainly make an interesting twist to the current door control options.

Thought maybe trandoshan huntmaster could grant ambush instead so we can finally use that double claw/rend combo for once.

Eliminating the clear lead choice, will allow more attention to be paid on the second choice as we are choosing two after all. But it would have to be not even close. A real landslide. Right now everything is really close.

The problem is we have many submissions/choices but very few actual votes being put forward.

The lack of votes so far is part of why I think we should err on letting things through to the next round even if they only have two people supporting them (proposal and one +1). I haven't really been voting. Anything that already had a +1, I just figured it's already through to the next round so I didn't necessarily bother voicing my own approval. I don't know if others did the same thing.

As far as giving one piece a free pass after the first round of voting, we would need to set up a bar beforehand so that there's no hint of playing favorites either way. We need to define "not even close". How about - twice as many votes as second place and 2/3 approval overall? Just a suggestion. I'd say that's pretty overwhelming.

The voting process needs to be as simple as possible. Anything that needs excess explanation will just muddle the process.

We could do a points system, or this way or that, but this is an open vote to anyone who can post in the thread, simplicity is the way to go, the old +1.

Yeah, I think that's probably the best way to go. Does this site have polls (and ones that would allow check boxes instead of radio buttons)? If not, +1 is definitely the best way to go... otherwise we'd have to have people sign up on another site.

When it comes time for the short list (I'm guessing a couple dozen will make that list), we post it in a new thread. Everyone just copies and pastes the list and adds +1 to any and all suggestions they approve of. Top 5 move on to the finals, where the same thing happens but with a chance for more focused discussion just on those 5.

With the voting rounds, should we have 2 separate threads: one for voting and one for discussion? Should people be allowed to edit their votes after they post them?

The lack of votes so far is part of why I think we should err on letting things through to the next round even if they only have two people supporting them (proposal and one +1). I haven't really been voting. Anything that already had a +1, I just figured it's already through to the next round so I didn't necessarily bother voicing my own approval. I don't know if others did the same thing.

Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:05 pmPosts: 1276Location: Yes, I am yet another Canadian. Keeping the game alive on life support in the GTA.

Yes I'd say something with twice as many votes as the next most popular would unarguably be considered overwhelmingly in. I wouldn't think we should give any piece a free ticket to the finals at this point.

As far as changing the rules, like you said we're really just making it up ourselves. If someone sees something they like they should really speak up.

What if we look at the short list candidates and there are like 40 entries or more with at least +1 by the deadline we're imposing, we may need to narrow the field somewhat.

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