Welcome to the Piano World Piano ForumsOver 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers
(it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Thank you Ragdoll and Andy! It's available only as ebook here but it's fine with me

_________________________
Diana & Wally - Yamaha W110BWMartha Argerich... is an incarnation of the artistic metaphor of the "eternal feminine" that draws us upward. (Sergio Sablich)http://soundcloud.com/sinophilia

Other than getting my piano upstairs (3rd floor appartment without an elevator!) last tuesday my biggest excitement and maybe frustration is my "homework" I got from my teacher.I'm struggling with this:It's easy to play with only the left or only the right hand, but the two together ... Back to practice!By the way, it's hard work but I like it. Great instrument

I am laughing a bit... thinking how much I struggled with these kind of things last year! You will master this in no time

_________________________
Diana & Wally - Yamaha W110BWMartha Argerich... is an incarnation of the artistic metaphor of the "eternal feminine" that draws us upward. (Sergio Sablich)http://soundcloud.com/sinophilia

lol ... it's funny, I've practiced it soo many times today and yesterday that I can actually play it (more or less) but somehow I have the feeling that I'm not really reading the notes, just some of them. The rest is just from muscle memory I think.How can you read two staves at the same time and play?

#2112634 - 07/04/1306:11 AMRe: Achievement of the week - what got you excited?
[Re: King Norre]

UKIkarus
Full Member
Registered: 03/05/13
Posts: 397
Loc: England, South East

Originally Posted By: King Norre

lol ... it's funny, I've practiced it soo many times today and yesterday that I can actually play it (more or less) but somehow I have the feeling that I'm not really reading the notes, just some of them. The rest is just from muscle memory I think.How can you read two staves at the same time and play?

With practice I struggle with this too, but at the end of the day the sheets are mainly there as a guide... you learn each hand individually and piece it all together in chunks and yes you will inevitably memorize things.

As long as you memorize them correctly that's not a problem, it's when you go memorizing it wrong it becomes tricky as you have to re-learn something and break the habit

Only with lots of practice can you read and play the two staves at the same time. Ultimately though the pieces you will soon be learning will be too complex to read and play simultaneously and therefore more and more you will be relying on you memory and your muscle memory. As a rule of thumb unless you are one of the very few gifted with good sight reading abilities your sight reading skills will fall behind your playing ability. We are often told to sight read two levels behind our technical level.

_________________________
If this life is a simulation can I not be in the easy version where Bach was a drummer

It comes with practice and experience. Some players can sight-read what may seem to us to be impossibly complex music note-perfect! In my musical world, many players have a technique of scanning the printed copy (maybe including chord symbols) and playing the MUSIC, rather than the literal notes. Piano parts for popular songs are generally best ignored anyway! And, on a rather more everyday level, every church musician needs to be able to sight-read a hymn tune pretty well.

It will come, if you have talent and application. A situation where you NEED to regularly perform new music is also useful. Enjoy and thrive!

It`s worth noting that we all do the same with writing. We read aloud from letters. Letters become words, words become phrases, sentences . .Typists hear, and type. Pianists see and play. It`s got to be practice.

You're more than welcome Diane, FWIW here's one I have on my wish list at Amazon. There are so many books that are $10-20 each and only have one or two pieces I am interested in; I always buy the ones I can "see inside" (NOW... ahem!) before I purchase. This one looks to be several artists and all old standards (I love `em).Simply Standards

lol ... it's funny, I've practiced it soo many times today and yesterday that I can actually play it (more or less) but somehow I have the feeling that I'm not really reading the notes, just some of them. The rest is just from muscle memory I think.How can you read two staves at the same time and play?

Two suggestions...

1)Invest some time studying music theory, particularly the different types of chords. When you learn how a C7, Gsus2, and Bm (etc.) are constructed, what they look like on the page and how they feel under your fingers, it makes it much easier to recognize chord patterns as the fundamental building blocks instead of trying to read each individual note.

Imagine trying to read and speak by processing each letter individually! That's why I find the beginner material to be challenging to deal with... plus it's so spread out on the page, it's much harder to recognize intervals at a glance.

2) Note recognition apps are super helpful for isolating that one skill from all the others that you are handling when actually playing. Eventually you'll be able to recognize notes throughout the grand staff, including ledger lines, intuitively instead of relying on mnemonics. I'm still not there entirely, but to the degree I've improved it has been due to rapid-fire and repeated note recognition drilling, not bench time playing. I don't have this setup myself, but the ideal would be one where the input is via MIDI so your response is tied to the actual keyboard instead of the name of the note or tapping an image on the screen. These apps exist, but I don't know particular names off the top of my head.

_________________________
"...when you do practice properly, it seems to take no time at all. Just do it right five times or so, and then stop." -- JimF

UKIkarus
Full Member
Registered: 03/05/13
Posts: 397
Loc: England, South East

Quote:

2) Note recognition apps are super helpful for isolating that one skill from all the others that you are handling when actually playing. Eventually you'll be able to recognize notes throughout the grand staff, including ledger lines, intuitively instead of relying on mnemonics. I'm still not there entirely, but to the degree I've improved it has been due to rapid-fire and repeated note recognition drilling, not bench time playing. I don't have this setup myself, but the ideal would be one where the input is via MIDI so your response is tied to the actual keyboard instead of the name of the note or tapping an image on the screen. These apps exist, but I don't know particular names off the top of my head.

To name a few, some costs apply for some (hope I break no rules, if links are not allowed please remove them or inform me and I will happily oblige)

For those with midi/digital setups, most of these if not all of them support midi interfacing

Thanks for the site, I shall use that when I am sitting at the PC as I often have my synth and Wall mounted TV plugged into my laptop right within arms length

I also use an Android app called "MusicTutor SightRead" which teaches/challenges (while being fully customizable) notes/key signatures/reading/writing/accidentals and chords great for when you are out and about or at lunch

I have been popping in to read what's up but no time to do my usual replies.It does sound like everyone is having a good time and I'm always really interested in seeing folks who are at different levels talk about what is challenging for them.

I find I'm in an interesting position - I see KingN's page and remember when that sort of piece was a challenge too! I read Torquenale's post about Schumann and want to dash over to see if the Horseman is in my book. Maybe I won't play it, maybe I will - but I'll read through it and see what I think. Wisebuff at piano-summer camp - how cool is that!!! Chris's story about the 18 yr old listening, and the mum on the street listening...ah, the power of Chopin!

(ok, I skipped pretty much all the stuff on Apps, as I don't use them )

My AOTW is that I've been consistently playing well for my EPP pieces. Yesterday I was playing and managed to go though one piece - correctly - at an absurdly fast pace and I burst out laughing at the end. I've started working on a new Pachelbel piece - called Fughetta (Foo-get-ta) which is simple, but very pleasant. It is the only piece I've ever seen of his apart from the Canon in D.

_________________________ ABF Recitals 18-44Another thing you learn along the way is that the music will still be there when you are ready for it. There's no reason to rush. JimF

Ok, I'm officially a cook now. In september my next study year begins, trying to become a chef eventually.

The last few weeks I thought about how to fit in all the school, work, hobbies, piano, home, familie, sports, vacation, etc and how to solve the money equation as a result of that.

My aotw is that I found piece in accepting 1 hour piano each day. I wish I could play more, but time is against me. If I play more, I should give up other things. If I play less, I learn more slowly and have less fun and relaxation. Until now I never accepted the 1 hour piano each day, because two hours seems always to me as double as fun.

I also decided to learn my languages english, german, french, spanish and italian. Just 1 hour each day too. For fun and relaxation. My english could be better. German I started reading a few years ago. In the kitchen I have to know french words. I like to know the italian words written at the music sheets and the words of Italian food and drinks. The same for spanish. So at an easy and relaxed way I'll shuffle through those languages at 1 hour each day.

And of course, I will have to study one hour each day for school: how to be a better cook.

Now that's already 3 hours a day! Plus a ten hour job. Because the physical work in the kitchen and 3 hours study, I need to be fit. So I need to sport also. Hmm, tricky. I hope it fits with the rest, like eating.

I will try this for a year and see how it goes. Though I'm very excited.

Other than getting my piano upstairs (3rd floor appartment without an elevator!) last tuesday

Heh, that sounds if you pushed up the piano through the stairway. Didn't you have a truck with an extendable arm/lift delivering it, shoving it through your window in less than five minutes? Or did you use rope and block?

Paperclip Chris - that's great news! You have some serious study time in front of you - but it is obvious that you are excited about it! It takes organization to have a crazy schedule, and you are off to a good start with your planning.

_________________________ ABF Recitals 18-44Another thing you learn along the way is that the music will still be there when you are ready for it. There's no reason to rush. JimF

Heh, that sounds if you pushed up the piano through the stairway. Didn't you have a truck with an extendable arm/lift delivering it, shoving it through your window in less than five minutes? Or did you use rope and block?

Well, I bought a DP (Kawai CA65) so it wasn't as heavy as a real upright piano, but still it was heavy enough to start sweatin' when we carried it up the stairs

Question: I Always start my practice with a lesson that I know but somehow I can't get it right the first time. I have to play it a couple of times before I can play it like I want it. It's almost as if I have to warm up before I can play. Is that normal or am I getting old?

Question: I Always start my practice with a lesson that I know but somehow I can't get it right the first time. I have to play it a couple of times before I can play it like I want it. It's almost as if I have to warm up before I can play. Is that normal or am I getting old?

Only a couple times? Sounds more like an AOTW than a problem!

_________________________
"...when you do practice properly, it seems to take no time at all. Just do it right five times or so, and then stop." -- JimF

It is one week until the European Piano Party. Bon voyage for those that are making the trip to Brussels.

King Norre, yes that is normal about not being able to play it correctly first thing. For most people, the feeling gets worse when a person tries to record, or perform live.

Paperclip, 10 hours of work, plus three hours committed to learning. Wow, I am impressed, though tired just reading that. Good luck with all the endeavors and congratulations on becoming a cook.

Week 69: I spend some time watching some Youtube tutorials from the young woman with the red hair and Russian accent. Three tips I am working on: keep my elbows higher, use more of my arms, and press through the keys as if they were gel. I make good progress on my cover of A Thousand Years. I write some material for one of my originals, which now has a working title of Avenue E.

The 50 song challenge is off and running. I am mostly a watcher this year. I am reading some lyrics and sketching out some piano music at times. It is amazing how much faster I am at that task, than I was last year. Not that my music is anything amazing, but it is a good creative exercise. There is a lot to be said for competence. I may or may not share or post any of my exercises. The curious can read and listen to the other songs without registering. For those that like singer songwriter material or want to do the exercise of writing music to other people's lyrics, here is the link:http://fiftyninety.fawmers.org/songlistThere are beginners to professionals participating. Some are posting demos, some lyrics only, a few are doing instrumentals. It is not too late to participate. Again, my participation in 50/90 is what jump started me into writing original music.

My Cecil Piano and I are getting acquainted again, having not practised much since May as had had a bereavement and a change of work ( 12 hour shifts). I might have a go at King Norre's sheet music. I have slipped a bit at whatever rubbish level I was at in April to a lower rubbish level! My teacher is away for the summer but I've got plenty to work on. Also, I am rather lazy and been sitting in the Sun ( which doesn't come out much in Britain these days...) and gardening.