Devil seemed a tad lame in this strip, tell the truth. I mean, it's like he feels the need to specifically go overboard -just- because God's asleep. Like he can't do this kind of stuff anywhere but behind God's back.

That doesn't strike me as very evil. Evil would be going overboard 24/7 regardless of status of witnesses. Doing it behind backs, in faces, over heads, under feet, any-freakin-where. Not to mention the fact that sloth is one of the Big 7, Devil coulda just spent the entire evening zoning in front of the TV chuggin' beer. (thinking back, it's actually interesting how rarely he indulges in sloth...)

1) Sexually transmitted diseases. (Health/Natural Argument) See 6b.
2) Desecrating the holy communion between man and woman (religious argument).
3) Trust issues with past, present, future and potential partners (moral argument).
4) Corroding a prime fundament of all civilizations, the relationship between man and woman which leads to a family unit and family. (Societal Argument)
5) Unwanted pregnancies. (Health, Natural, Religious, Moral, Societal). See nr. 7. 5b) Arguments to the contrary would be adding to the population but the world is currently overcrowded and children of illicit (pseudo-legal reason) affairs add a lower quality of value to society as a whole (not a derailment of an illicit child's worth, but rather an assesment of their disadvantageous position).
6) Emotional unreadiness (optional argument, emotional, individual). 6b) Marginally healthy activity. Pleasurable.
7) Degenerates societal cohesion by leading to unstable families with one or no primary caretakers (Societal, Health, Moral, Religious).
8] Sloth (dependant on view of orgies as negative activity, thus also a waste of time. (Moral, Societal)

X) Freedom of choice. (Anchorpoint of counterarguments.) Currently frowned upon but not illegal.
As should be clear *cough, overbearing, cough condescending (not)* minor arguments such as pleasure, [s]friendship?[/s] wait we're talking about orgies, not sex with friends/fucking pals/'friends with benefits', should be overriden by the detrimental effect to society.
Y) Yet biological evidence proves that the majority of seemen are to fight off other seemen strange to the originator. This strengthens the arguments that humans have partaken in this activity for long, yet stable civilizations are less prone to orgies, thus orgies might be seen as a part of a more primeval culture. X2) And yet, it should be clear to most minds that orgies are detrimental and the only argument truly capable of supporting a moral legitimacy to the target individual's conscience (if indeed the individual believes in morals) is Freedom of Choice.
Freedom to Sin or freedom to engage in orgies as a healthy, pleasureable activity promoted by one's self and others as beneficial.

Personally I believe it's sin, *cough*s*hould*beobvious*.

I think I missed a few and might've overlapped somewhat (I have ADHD and Asbergers), feel free to add on/clarify.

Anyway, nice comic, bit flat, but nice background and the...

panel 8 is very scary, if you take a closer look at it you can see by the colors whom of the women he is dealing with at the moment.

...\

Anyho, it was long overdue to join this cool-assed forum. ;^_=

Orgies are...
A) Anarchic activity
B) Pleasurable
C) Procreative activity
4) Unhealthy Activity
5) Classified as immoral activity by all three Semmitic religions and many minor religions, most notable not including ... I think... Hinduism? ... Anyway fertility sects and Norse/other tribal cultures had fertility Gods (one can also argue that earlier religions and earlier signs points towards monotheism, but as things go the farthest back we know with the exception of the Semmitic book of the Jews aka the Old Testament religions were polytheistic) so discounting atheism, religions are vastly against orgies with the exception of ancient ones, and that should be viewed with a pinch of salt as they were often worshipped within some sort of matrimony.

So religiously: Nearly all religions view orgies as bad.
Societally: A lessser majority but overwhelmingly negative towards orgies with notable exceptions.
Morally: Still a sizeable majority, but less so, likely due to an individuals freedom of choice.

Health concerns: Varied... 2-3 times a week is supposedly good for the body, but this can be achieved by marriage and/or masturbation, creates more humans (with lower social status and a poorer hand dealt to them... likely, but not for sure). With the recent scourge of AIDS (and the other pandemic sexual annoyances) a sectional judgement by health would see orgies as a very bad thing due to the millions and millions and millions and millions of people dying.

Anarchy is a good philosophy if you want to support orgies, liberalism works reasonably well too if you couple in abortion or high-end contracepts.

Contracepts are viewed by the Catholic Church as sinful.
Abortion is viewed as sinful by a slight majority of the world population, I think. (Counting the Islamic World here.)

Ahh dangit, I wish I had those pictures my father took of the babies in vinegar bottles in a local Chinese hospital... oooh, btw. that reminds me of the vastly successful population control policy of China.

Anyway, scientifically human life starts at conception. Of course, while this life is human many decree it as non-sentient due to it's lacking cognitive functioning and nerve systems. While I personally abhor and loath abortion to a nearly extreme degree I have recently come to a personal conclusion that stem-cell research should be acceptable due to the non-aware suffering of unborn lives versus conscious human beings with fully developed brains and nervous systems dying slow and humiliating deaths.

Also, in Christendom, Elizabath, Zacharia's wife, bears a child in her old age which jumps of joy as her master's mother approaches (Mary w/ Jesus).

Meh, I'm not going to take this last part seriously, it should be obvious to anyone but the most fanatic that (early births prove that babies less then 8.5 months can be sentient and human) just because a life is tapered to another one (life cord) and inside another human flesh it's not therefore 'a blob'. If one is counting synapses one needs to go to the early half dozen weeks of the pregnancy, even then I would discount conventional wisdom's blob theory, as animal fetuses and earlier stages are complex let alone human (they're alike, yet very differently programmed).

On the bright side of course, if u read Freakanomics it's been proven that the great dip in crime ratings in the USA was due to Roe v. Wade. Where universal adoption rights were legalized crime ratings dropped atrociously in the correct time perioud where the young mother's of the unwanted babies in the slums would have had young, black superteens they could not afford to support.

(The most avid users of abortion were poor, young black women in the urbs whose children were the most likely in the US to become criminals.)

...yeah, that was irony,... it does prove abortion as a useful regulational tool thouh, but I hate it.

My personal reply to the arch-arcgument freedom of choice is 'viewing what is sin or not is a personal choice but something as important as sex should not be dealt with as a toy or largely recreational activity'... I mean goodness, it's possible the or at least among the most important pairbonding activities... pairbonding or in polygamy bonding with ure mate is the secondary function... next to the primary function of creating other human beings.

From an evolutionary point of view the pleasure and marginal health benefits are first a motivator for the primary function, a strengthening of the secondary function and thirdly bonuses.

...as a casino* would reply to neg. bonushunting and bonushunting in genera: bonus-abusers

*mostly destructive activity, yet not inherantly sinful... or?

Last edited by Toteone on Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:47 am; edited 2 times in total

1) Sexually transmitted diseases. (Health/Natural Argument) See 6b.
2) Desecrating the holy communion between man and woman (religious argument).
3) Trust issues with past, present, future and potential partners (moral argument).
4) Corroding a prime fundament of all civilizations, the relationship between man and woman which leads to a family unit and family. (Societal Argument)
5) Unwanted pregnancies. (Health, Natural, Religious, Moral, Societal). See nr. 7. 5b) Arguments to the contrary would be adding to the population but the world is currently overcrowded and children of illicit (pseudo-legal reason) affairs add a lower quality of value to society as a whole (not a derailment of an illicit child's worth, but rather an assesment of their disadvantageous position).
6) Emotional unreadiness (optional argument, emotional, individual). 6b) Marginally healthy activity. Pleasurable.
7) Degenerates societal cohesion by leading to unstable families with one or no primary caretakers (Societal, Health, Moral, Religious).
8] Sloth (dependant on view of orgies as negative activity, thus also a waste of time. (Moral, Societal)

X) Freedom of choice. (Anchorpoint of counterarguments.) Currently frowned upon but not illegal.
As should be clear *cough, overbearing, cough condescending (not)* minor arguments such as pleasure, [s]friendship?[/s] wait we're talking about orgies, not sex with friends/fucking pals/'friends with benefits', should be overriden by the detrimental effect to society.
Y) Yet biological evidence proves that the majority of seemen are to fight off other seemen strange to the originator. This strengthens the arguments that humans have partaken in this activity for long, yet stable civilizations are less prone to orgies, thus orgies might be seen as a part of a more primeval culture. X2) And yet, it should be clear to most minds that orgies are detrimental and the only argument truly capable of supporting a moral legitimacy to the target individual's conscience (if indeed the individual believes in morals) is Freedom of Choice.
Freedom to Sin or freedom to engage in orgies as a healthy, pleasureable activity promoted by one's self and others as beneficial.

Personally I believe it's sin, *cough*s*hould*beobvious*.

I think I missed a few and might've overlapped somewhat (I have ADHD and Asbergers), feel free to add on/clarify.

Anyway, nice comic, bit flat, but nice background and the...

panel 8 is very scary, if you take a closer look at it you can see by the colors whom of the women he is dealing with at the moment.

...\

Anyho, it was long overdue to join this cool-assed forum. ;^_=

Orgies are...
A) Anarchic activity
B) Pleasurable
C) Procreative activity
4) Unhealthy Activity
5) Classified as immoral activity by all three Semmitic religions and many minor religions, most notable not including ... I think... Hinduism? ... Anyway fertility sects and Norse/other tribal cultures had fertility Gods (one can also argue that earlier religions and earlier signs points towards monotheism, but as things go the farthest back we know with the exception of the Semmitic book of the Jews aka the Old Testament religions were polytheistic) so discounting atheism, religions are vastly against orgies with the exception of ancient ones, and that should be viewed with a pinch of salt as they were often worshipped within some sort of matrimony.

You're making a lot of false assumptions, you know. Nobody said they're 'unhealthy', and they wouldn't be if you took proper precautions. Nobody said you wouldn't be picky about who was involved, providing you the ability to avoid any sexually transmitted disease. Nobody said there wouldn't be prevention against pregnancy involved (good god, there are only a ton of ways to do that, now. Enough variety to use at least two forms of prevention at all times, if not more).

Orgies do not "degenerate societal cohesion", nor do they automatically make people -abandon their children- as you seem to assume it does. Trust issues are not breached if everyone involves understands that "Hey, I occationally partake in orgies." because people are perfectly capable of being honest about their sex lives.

The only arguments against orgies are either religious or dependant on your personal set of morals. By religious standards, orgies are probably sinful, frankly I don't care. All that about societal, moral, and personal is totally 100% disputable and dependant entirely on the parties involved.

Also, family units consisting strictly of a man, woman, and children is not a "prime fundament of all civilizations". I suggest you brush up on your knowledge of successful civilizations.

1) Sexually transmitted diseases. (Health/Natural Argument) See 6b.
2) Desecrating the holy communion between man and woman (religious argument).
3) Trust issues with past, present, future and potential partners (moral argument).
4) Corroding a prime fundament of all civilizations, the relationship between man and woman which leads to a family unit and family. (Societal Argument)
5) Unwanted pregnancies. (Health, Natural, Religious, Moral, Societal). See nr. 7. 5b) Arguments to the contrary would be adding to the population but the world is currently overcrowded and children of illicit (pseudo-legal reason) affairs add a lower quality of value to society as a whole (not a derailment of an illicit child's worth, but rather an assesment of their disadvantageous position).
6) Emotional unreadiness (optional argument, emotional, individual). 6b) Marginally healthy activity. Pleasurable.
7) Degenerates societal cohesion by leading to unstable families with one or no primary caretakers (Societal, Health, Moral, Religious).
8] Sloth (dependant on view of orgies as negative activity, thus also a waste of time. (Moral, Societal)

X) Freedom of choice. (Anchorpoint of counterarguments.) Currently frowned upon but not illegal.
As should be clear *cough, overbearing, cough condescending (not)* minor arguments such as pleasure, [s]friendship?[/s] wait we're talking about orgies, not sex with friends/fucking pals/'friends with benefits', should be overriden by the detrimental effect to society.
Y) Yet biological evidence proves that the majority of seemen are to fight off other seemen strange to the originator. This strengthens the arguments that humans have partaken in this activity for long, yet stable civilizations are less prone to orgies, thus orgies might be seen as a part of a more primeval culture. X2) And yet, it should be clear to most minds that orgies are detrimental and the only argument truly capable of supporting a moral legitimacy to the target individual's conscience (if indeed the individual believes in morals) is Freedom of Choice.
Freedom to Sin or freedom to engage in orgies as a healthy, pleasureable activity promoted by one's self and others as beneficial.

Personally I believe it's sin, *cough*s*hould*beobvious*.

I think I missed a few and might've overlapped somewhat (I have ADHD and Asbergers), feel free to add on/clarify.

Anyway, nice comic, bit flat, but nice background and the...

panel 8 is very scary, if you take a closer look at it you can see by the colors whom of the women he is dealing with at the moment.

...\

Anyho, it was long overdue to join this cool-assed forum. ;^_=

Orgies are...
A) Anarchic activity
B) Pleasurable
C) Procreative activity
4) Unhealthy Activity
5) Classified as immoral activity by all three Semmitic religions and many minor religions, most notable not including ... I think... Hinduism? ... Anyway fertility sects and Norse/other tribal cultures had fertility Gods (one can also argue that earlier religions and earlier signs points towards monotheism, but as things go the farthest back we know with the exception of the Semmitic book of the Jews aka the Old Testament religions were polytheistic) so discounting atheism, religions are vastly against orgies with the exception of ancient ones, and that should be viewed with a pinch of salt as they were often worshipped within some sort of matrimony.

You're making a lot of false assumptions, you know. Nobody said they're 'unhealthy', and they wouldn't be if you took proper precautions. Nobody said you wouldn't be picky about who was involved, providing you the ability to avoid any sexually transmitted disease. Nobody said there wouldn't be prevention against pregnancy involved (good god, there are only a ton of ways to do that, now. Enough variety to use at least two forms of prevention at all times, if not more).

Orgies do not "degenerate societal cohesion", nor do they automatically make people -abandon their children- as you seem to assume it does. Trust issues are not breached if everyone involves understands that "Hey, I occationally partake in orgies." because people are perfectly capable of being honest about their sex lives.

The only arguments against orgies are either religious or dependant on your personal set of morals. By religious standards, orgies are probably sinful, frankly I don't care. All that about societal, moral, and personal is totally 100% disputable and dependant entirely on the parties involved.

Also, family units consisting strictly of a man, woman, and children is not a "prime fundament of all civilizations". I suggest you brush up on your knowledge of successful civilizations.

General, not specific.

-Explain why gay people suffer most from AIDS in the west. -Why broken families are more common among illegitimate children.

Uhhh... take a look at most modern, medieval and ancient civilizations.

I should have specified: All these things are MORE likely. It's not a crystall ball of course.

So if we've cleared off religious there's the secular morals driven by philosophy and cultural norms, tied in with societal acceptance.

Health issues are a whole different ball game as we've both pointed out.

Personally I don't really care what other people do either, even if I view it as sinful. It is their choice. I think I stand some societal as well as religious reason to warn though. Personally I only want one mate ever.

Last edited by Toteone on Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:55 am; edited 1 time in total

Gay -men- suffer AIDS because, I believe, the tissue of the anus is easier broken than that of the vagina, causing easier access for the virus to take hold. It is a perfectly scientific problem and holy shit, are you living in the 80's? I thought we got over this 'ZOMG TEH GAYS HAVE AIDS' complex years ago. Also, it does -absolutely nothing- to prove -any- of your points.

Did you not read anything I posted about prevention of unwanted pregnancies? Did you even read my post? What do these questions have to do with anything?