Bloodlines of the Nephilim – A Biblical Study

In our original article on the Nephilim, we detailed the Biblical origin of the half-angelic, half-human hybrid giants, known as Nephilim, who were the product of illicit relations between evil fallen angels and human women in the time before the Flood and Noah’s Ark. The flood wiped out the giants but shortly after the flood they returned and spread all throughout the Promised Land. As this article will show, not only did the giants return after the flood, they were major enemies of God and His chosen nation, Israel for centuries. This article will show that for a time Nephilim were all over the ancient Middle East wreaking havoc, attacking God’s people and creating spiritual practices to lure humanity in worshiping Satan and his angels.

Genesis 6: The Origin of the Nephilim

And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown. And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. — Genesis 6:1-5.

This brief passage tells a very important origin story. A group of the “sons of God”, the Biblical name for angels, in rebellion against The Lord, came to Earth and took human women as wives to have illicit relations. And their children, half-human, half-angelic hybrids, were the Nephilim giants. The idea of angels sleeping with women and having kids is not something that all Christians agree upon, know about or even comfortable with. However, the truth of Christianity is based upon one source: God’s Word as revealed in the Holy Bible. And from a study of Scripture it becomes clear that this event did indeed happen.

Were the “Sons of God” Angels?

This question is often raised initially as an objection to the idea that Nephilim giants ever even existed. the Hebrew words for the “sons of God” is B’nai Ha Elohim, which would means these are Heavenly beings, giving credence to them being offspring of fallen angels (the term Elohim is literally the plural of ‘god’). And then we see the children of these sons of God and daughters of men were “mighty men” and of “renown.” They were also “giants.” Something in their genetics made them super-sized people. And it was their fallen angelic parentage.

But again, we must keep searching the Bible to make certain of meaning. The Bible is self-confirming and one passage of Scripture can always be confirmed by another. We see the term “sons of God” next used in the book of Job. Job chapter 1 reads: “Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them. And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.” (Job 1:6-7)

The scene being described, where God is literally meeting with the sons of Go, took place in Heaven. This is a Divine Council that God holds where He chooses to meet with both good and evil angels to discuss affairs of the world (for more examples of these assemblies see 1 Kings 22 and Psalm 82).

Another Divine Council is called in Job Chapter 2. Verse 1 states: “Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD.”

So again from the clear reading of the text, the “sons of God” are not human men but are in fact angels, who are meeting in Heaven with The Lord. And the Hebrew term is b’nai ha Elohim. The third reference to the sons of God in the Old Testament is again in Job, but this time in chapter 38. God who in this is posing questions to Job about the creation of the universe (to show Job how little understanding and knowledge he has compared to The Lord) says:

Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding. Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof; When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of Godshouted for joy? — Job 38:4-7

So again, not only were the sons of God again with God, they existed even before the Earth itself was created. Every use of the term b’nai ha elohim in the Old Testament is a reference to angelic beings. In the Septuagint, the oldest form of the Old Testament today (and the version most quoted by Jesus and His disciples in the New Testament) the term ‘sons of God’ is not even used in these passages in Job, it just reads “the angels of God.” Thus it can be concluded with certainty that the sons of God in Genesis 6 were in fact, angels.

Did Angels Have Sexual Relations With Human Women?

Job, the oldest book of the Bible, was written by the patriarch Job who lived close to the time of the flood, thus the references to angels reflect this. There is passage not often cited in scripture that states directly that certain angels were indeed involved in illicit relations with human women. It occurs when Eliphas, one of Job’s friends who is consoling him over the loss of his family in a Satanically empowered hurricane, shares a Divine vision he had:

Now a thing was secretly brought to me, and mine ear received a little thereof. In thoughts from the visions of the night, when deep sleep falleth on men, Fear came upon me, and trembling, which made all my bones to shake. Then a spirit passed before my face; the hair of my flesh stood up: It stood still, but I could not discern the form thereof: an image was before mine eyes, there was silence, and I heard a voice, saying, Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker? Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly: – Job 4:13-18.

The word “folly” in the Old Testament is used to describe sexual sin. Once again, we use Scripture to interpret Scripture. Here are several examples:

And Dinah the daughter of Leah, which she bare unto Jacob, went out to see the daughters of the land. And when Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the country, saw her, he took her, and lay with her, and defiled her… And the sons of Jacob came out of the field when they heard it: and the men were grieved, and they were very wroth, because he had wrought folly in Israel in lying with Jacob’s daughter: which thing ought not to be done. – Genesis 34:1-2, 7.

Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father’s house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father’s house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you. – Deuteronomy 22:21.

And it came to pass after this, that Absalom the son of David had a fair sister, whose name was Tamar; and Amnon the son of David loved her. And Amnon was so vexed, that he fell sick for his sister Tamar; for she was a virgin; and Amnon thought it hard for him to do anything to her… And when she had brought them unto him to eat, he took hold of her, and said unto her, Come lie with me, my sister. And she answered him, Nay, my brother, do not force me; for no such thing ought to be done in Israel: do not thou this folly. – 2 Samuel 13:1-2. 11-12.

So here we see that certain untrustworthy angels were charged with the sin of “folly” for sinful sexual acts. In the Septuagint the verse from Job says: “he perceives perverseness in his angels” giving even more confirmation that there were sinful sexual acts committed by angels.

The books of 2 Peter and Jude detail the punishment of the angels who committed these sins:

And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities. – Jude 1:6-8.

Here we see a reference to angels who left their “habitation” and are reserved in chains until Judgment Day. This was the punishment for those angels who left their habitation of he spirit world to “go after strange flesh”, namely human women. Also note there is a reference to Sodom and Gomorrah, cities so steeped in sexual corruption that when two Godly angels cam to visit the home of Lot to usher he and his family out of the city, the men and boys came to Lot’s home demanding that the angels be brought out so that they could “know them.”

Nephilim Giant Offspring

By the measurements in Scripture, the original Nephilim offspring were quite larger than the average human.

The offspring from this illicit union between angels and human women were giants who “became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.” (Genesis 6) The fact that they were giants, is also proof in and of itself that their parentage was superhuman. But these giants were evil. Having been born of corrupted, Satanic angels they dominated the Earth and filled it with violence. It is also interesting to note that the Bible calls them “men of renown.” The Hebrew word here, shem, refers to being famous and legendary. It is as if the Bible is indicating that when the reader hears of legends of “demigods”, titans or legendary heroes who were part god, that this is who those “myths” were referring to. These were ‘men’ of superhuman ability and strength. In addition to causing violence and sin in the world, the Nephilim were also corrupting the human bloodline.

Why Would Satan Do This?

As it will be in the end times, much of the conflict centers around human DNA.

After the sin of Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden God pronounced a judgment on Satan:

And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. – Genesis 3:14-15.

This pronouncement was historic. God proclaimed that the means by which Satan would ultimately punished and destroyed would be through the seed of the woman. (It must be remembered at this point that our enemy, Satan is a far older, and vastly more powerful and evil being, so this prophecy was a serious pronouncement). A human woman would give birth to a male child who would one day destroy the Devil. This was the first prophecy of the coming Messiah, Jesus Chris. Satan was put on notice. From then on he set out to corrupt or destroy an God-fearing child as that could potentially be the prophesied Redeemer. To no surprise the first Godly child born, Abel, was killed by his wicked brother Cain. Cain was banished and Adam and Eve bore another son Seth. At his birth Eve declared: “For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.” – (Genesis 4:25).

As more God-fearing sons began to populate the Earth, Satan instituted his Nephilim plan into action. By corrupting the seed of the woman, Satan could prevent the birth of the Messiah, who of course, had to be human and not part fallen angel. Satan wants the Word of God to fail but he knew that in addition to the woman, God prophesied that Satan too would have a “seed” (v. 15). Thus the Nephilim were an attempt to thwart God’s plan of salvation for humanity. At every step, the Nephilim giants, via their evil angelic parentage, sought to undermine or undo what God had set out for humanity to be reconciled to Him. In their dominance of the Earth, they reproduced so rapidly, God proclaimed that all flesh on the Earth had become corrupted. They dominated the Earth with war, bloodshed and their pagan religion (which will be covered in Part 2 of this series).

The Nephilim giants spread violence and sin that: “God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.”Humanity was on the verge of being wiped out with no hope of being saved from sin if every person born became part fallen angel. Thus God judged the Earth with the flood.

The Purpose of the Flood in Noah’s Day

Rather than being an act of cruelty, the Flood was God’s way of saving the last of humanity from complete destruction.

Many pastors, Bible scholars and Bible skeptics alike view the flood as God’s way of dealing with humanity after humanity just sinning too much. However, with all due respect, this is a very simplistic way of looking at the flood. After all, today’s society is just as corrupt and depraved, if not far worse than any era before (more people have been killed in war in the past century than in the prior 900 years). So why would such a global judgment only happen in Noah’s day? The answer is that there were far more complex issues going on in the days of Noah then just humans sinning. The flood served 3 chief purposes: 1) To destroy the Nephilim giants. 2) To punish the angels who committed the illicit relations with women and make an example of them so that no other angels would ever attempt this again and 3) to save humanity from certain destruction.

Much more than the “over-reaction by an angry God” as skeptics like to paint it, the flood was God’s way of preserving the human race and its bloodline, before it became completely corrupted by the Nephilim giants. This is an important point: many people today point to the flood as “proof” that God is cruel and angry with humanity all the time, and willing to just kill millions of people in genocide on a whim. However the Biblical truth was that God sent the flood to preserve humanity and to make sure we could still receive the promised Redeemer who could save our souls. Without Jesus Christ, there is no hope. There is no future. There is no forgiveness. Meaning every person would spend eternity in hell. The flood was God’s way to keep that hope for all people.

But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD. These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

Noah was chosen to carry on and re-start humanity after the flood because he was a believer in God. Additionally he was “perfect in his generations” which meant that his genetic bloodline and ancestry was 100% human. Noah had not been a part of the Nephilim hybridization that was plaguing humanity. The Hebrew word for “perfect” in that verse is tamiym, which means “complete, whole” with reference to health and physical condition. This is the same word used to describe the condition of animal sacrifices to the Lord:

And whosoever offereth a sacrifice of peace offerings unto the LORD to accomplish his vow, or a freewill offering in beeves or sheep, it shall be perfect to be accepted; there shall be no blemish therein. – Leviticus 22:21.

Thus Noah, his three sons and their wives were able to survive the flood and re-start humanity. But unfortunately, the Nephilim giants returned.

Nephilim Giants After The Flood

Noah and his family survived the flood. But the Nephilim gene came with them.

“ There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that…” — Genesis 6:4

The verse above makes it clear that Nephilim giants returned after the flood. Now nowhere in scripture is it again written that angels ever cohabited and/or had relations with human women after the flood. Genesis 6 was the only instance of this. So how did the Nephilim return? How could this have happened? The Bible holds the answer:

And Noah was six hundred years old when the flood of waters was upon the earth. And Noah went in, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons’ wives with him, into the ark, because of the waters of the flood. –Genesis 7:6-7.

While Noah and his sons were 100% human, we are not told the same about the wives of his 3 sons, Shem, Ham and Japheth. What is clear is that one or more of these women were carrying the Nephilim gene. This is the source of the post-flood Nephilim. Nowhere in the Bible is it ever stated that angels once again cohabited with human women.

The first time Nephilim giants are mentioned by name after the flood is in Numbers 13 after the Exodus in which Moses led the Israelites out of Egypt to go to God’s designated Promised Land. Moses sent 12 spies to scout out the land in advance. 2 of the spies, Caleb and Joshua spoke of the land in glowing terms and urged the Israelites to enter and rightfully claim the land God had promised them. But the other 10 spies had a different opinion:

And Caleb stilled the people before Moses, and said, Let us go up at once, and possess it; for we are well able to overcome it. But the men that went up with him said, We be not able to go up against the people; for they are stronger than we. 32 And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel, saying, The land, through which we have gone to search it, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men of a great stature. And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight. – Numbers 13:31-33.

We will discuss this extremely important passage in much more detail below but a few things should be noted. First off the giants living there were descendants of specific person named Anak. This description, where a Nephilim is referred to as “[name] who was born of the giant..” shows that the Nephilim hybrids after the flood were the offspring of other giants and not angels (this will be explained in greater detail in Part 2). And in Numbers 13, the giants the spies saw were the sons of the Nephilim giant Anak.

And they were so large that the Israelites spies were like insects to them. Additionally, these giants had special agricultural knowledge that they knew how to grow grapes so large that it took two Israelite men using poles to carry a cluster! So how did the giants return and how was it that they knew to be in the exact place that God was going to send His chosen people to, namely the land of Canaan? The answer starts with the lineage after the flood.

The Bloodlines of the Nephilim

The Bible provides a specific geneology and bloodline of the Nephilim giants after the flood that can be traced back to Noah’s own sons. What seems to be consistent with the presence of the Nephilim gene was an affinity for evil, due to their fallen angelic parentage. And among Noah’s sons, Ham was by far the most wicked.

Ham

“And the sons of Noah, that went forth of the ark, were Shem, and Ham, and Japheth: and Ham is the father of Canaan.” – Genesis 9:18.

From the first time Ham is introduced, he is described as “the father of Canaan.” Notice none of his brothers get any similar distinction. Whenever special descriptions are included in a genealogy in Scripture it is the Bible’s way of saying something significant happened with this particular event. And the student of the Bible should search the Scriptures to find out what that event could be. In this case, it is clear that Canaan carried the Nephilim gene. This could only happen through his mother, Ham’s wife, having the Nephilim gene herself, since we know Noah in all his generations was 100% human. If Ham were wicked and not a follower of God, the odds of him taking a wife who was a part of the Nephilim hybrid pagan culture was much higher (B&E: also note that throughout Scripture, men who fell into sin often ended up marrying wives who worshiped false gods; for example, Solomon or King Ahab). And from what the Bible details, Ham was no follower of God. In fact, he was involved in an inappropriate incident with Noah that led to a curse:

And Noah began to be an husbandman, and he planted a vineyard: And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent. And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without. And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father’s nakedness. And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him. And he said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren. And he said, Blessed be the LORD God of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant. — Genesis 9:20-26.

The details of this incident are somewhat vague but going by Scripture alone, it can be concluded that Ham, out of evil intent, looked at his father’s nakedness and then made it public. The Hebrew term for “without”, chwuts, means “outside, in the street.” But the evil of this sexually immoral act is again repeated by the Lord as a general principle for all to follow:

Woe unto him that giveth his neighbour drink, that puttest thy bottle to him, and makest him drunken also, that thou mayest look on their nakedness! Thou art filled with shame for glory: drink thou also, and let thy foreskin be uncovered: the cup of the LORD’s right hand shall be turned unto thee, and shameful spewing shall be on thy glory. –Habukkuk 2:15-16.

Shem and Japeth, righteous children of Noah, show a contrast as they seek to respect their father’s dignity by not looking upon, him and carefully covering him. Ham’s sin was so severe that it resulted in his youngest son Canaan becoming the second person in the Bible record to be cursed (the first being Cain, the wicked son of Adam and Eve).

That Ham was wicked (there is no record of him ever repenting for this sin) would make it more likely that he would marry a woman from a pagan family who would be carrying the Nephilim gene.

Why Would God Allow Nephilim DNA to Make It Through the Flood?

(B&E: Special thanks to reader Rick for raising this question). If it were not already clear, the reason why God permitted the Nephilim gene to make it on to the ark is because of human sin. We can never forget the role we play in human affairs. If humans sin, they will be judged. If they do not follow God’s ways, they invite sin and its inevitable destructive force. Ham was not a follower of God and he was judged for his sinful rebellion via his wife. As will be seen in Part 2, the Nephilim nations after the flood are at various times used by God as judgment against the Israelites for their disobedience. We are all responsible before God.

Part 2 will also review Noah and the world he was living in. There were giants walking around the Earth warring with nations, angels openly being revealed and being worshiped as gods and all sorts of supernatural activity taking place. The pre-flood world was a very unique place. Noah’s family was well aware of this and that it’s root was satanic, hence Noah being a “preacher of righteousness.” Ham rejected God’s righteousness and God’s ways to forge his own. This was solely Ham’s fault. James chapter 1 outlines the process of sin in one’s heart:

Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. – James 1:12-15.

Ham was drawn by his own lusts to the pagan, sinful world. He knew the right way to live because the Bible states that Noah was a “preacher of righteousness.” Noah and his family were completely aware of the Nephilim hybridization taking place and Noah clearly made efforts to live separate from this. Despite having the most Holy man on the planet (literally) as is his father, Ham had no faith in God. This always brings in sin to a person’s life. We can never forget that when looking at any Biblical account. God could have certainly killed Ham’s wife or told Ham “she’s corrupted” but it is this author’s thinking that Ham did not care about what God had to say because Ham was not a follower of God. Ham had a choice. And he chose to reject God.

There are many examples of this in scripture. Moses led the Israelites out of Egypt and right up to the Promised Land but could not enter. Why not? Because of his sin. King David brought the ark to Jerusalem where it was supposed to be all along but could not build the temple for it. Why not? Sin. King Solomon had the most prosperous reign in all of Israel and yet led to the nation dividing and ultimately being conquered. Why? Sin. Sin provides the backdoor for Satan to enter and execute his next move in the chess match between he and God. Let this be a lesson to the reader: Satan is relentless in his quest to corrupt and destroy you. And if he cannot get to you, he will happily enter your life through a child or family member. Ephesians 4 states:

“That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness…Neither give place to the devil.” – Ephesians 4:22-27.

We are renewed in the spirit when we have salvation in Jesus Christ. And we are not to leave any space in our lives for Satan to enter. Satan entered the space of the ark because Ham invited him.

The Curse of Canaan

What is interesting is that Cannan of Ham’s three sons, was the one cursed. Why? Why is Ham distinguished as “the father of Canaan”? Is it possible that Canaan was already showing the appearance of being part Nephilim? This is not stated in scripture, but we will see a similar distinction made for another infamous hybrid being below. What we can know with certainty that it is from the line of Ham that we find the resurgence of the Nephilim giants.

By comparing Scripture with Scripture, the lineage of the post-flood giants can be traced specifically to three of Ham’s sons, Cush, Mizraim and Canaan. The Bible is full of lineages and the Bible student should take note that they hold significance in bettering our understanding of Scripture. The first grandson of Ham who receives special designation in Genesis 10 is King Nimrod.

Nimrod

Nimrod led the tower of Babel rebellion. Was he a Nephilim giant?

And the sons of Ham; Cush, and Mizraim, and Phut, and Canaan. And the sons of Cush; Seba, and Havilah, and Sabtah, and Raamah, and Sabtechah: and the sons of Raamah; Sheba, and Dedan. And Cush begat Nimrod: he began to be a mighty one in the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the LORD: wherefore it is said, Even as Nimrod the mighty hunter before the LORD. And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, and Erech, and Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar. Out of that land went forth Asshur, and builded Nineveh, and the city Rehoboth, and Calah, And Resen between Nineveh and Calah: the same is a great city. – Genesis 10:6-12.

Just as Canaan received a special distinction in his genealogy, Nimrod gets several extra verses! Clearly this is someone of special significance. Nimrod was the first murderer and conqueror in the post-flood world. He was the founder of the city of Babylon which became a center of pagan, satanic idolatry, much of it with various versions of Nimrod himself being worshiped as a god. His name, which means “to rebel” or “let us rebel” indicates his disposition. He was an enemy of God and at the time was Satan’s main servant on Earth. He is credited for leading the effort to build the tower of Babel, a religious temple used to access the angelic realm through pagan ritual. The Tower of Babel was also the first attempt at a global government, led by Nimrod and an attempt for man to reach the spiritual realm and “godhood” without The Lord (to which God swiftly responded by destroying the tower, confusing the languages of all the people of the world and scattering them all over the Earth). Was this grandson of Ham possibly a Nephilim? It is interesting to note is that the verse 9 states that Nimrod “began to be a mighty one in the earth.” The term for “mighty one”, gibborim, is the same Hebrew phrase used to describe the Nephilim giants in Chapter 6 of Genesis who were “mighty men”. It is also the same term used to describe the giant Goliath in 1 Samuel 17:51. Was Nimrod a Nephilim? In mythology, Nimrod is known by many names, among them Gilgamesh and Osiris, who were worshiped as gods. In Sumerian texts he is described as “2/3 god, 1/3 man.” The Hebrew word for “began” in the verse is chalal, which means, “to profane, desecrate or pollute oneself, begin, ritually or sexually”.

Matthew Henry’s Bible commentary on this passage states:

That which is observable and improvable in these verses is the account here given of Nimrod, v. 8-10. He is here represented as a great man in his day: He began to be a mighty one in the earth, that is, whereas those that went before him were content to stand upon the same level with their neighbours, and though every man bore rule in his own house yet no man pretended any further, Nimrod’s aspiring mind could not rest here; he was resolved to tower above his neighbours, not only to be eminent among them, but to lord it over them. The same spirit that actuated the giants before the flood (who became mighty men, and men of renown, ch. 6:4), now revived in him, so soon was that tremendous judgment which the pride and tyranny of those mighty men brought upon the world forgotten. (source)

The final piece of evidence to consider is that in the Septuagint, the oldest version of the Old Testament, the same verse from Genesis reads:

And [Cush] begot [Nimrod]: he began to be a giant upon the earth. He was a giant hunter before the Lord God; therefore they say, As [Nimrod] the giant hunter before the Lord. – Genesis 10:8,9 (LXX)

So from just the text of scripture it appears that through some form of defilement and/or occult ritual, Nimrod. the grandson of Ham, was transformed into a giant. This would not be the only time a human king was transformed into a different creature. Please note that in Daniel 4, King Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon, was literally transformed into a “beast” and lived as an animal for seven years. And this was at the pronouncement of “watchers” and “holy ones” (the same type of angels that are named as being involved in the Genesis 6 illicit relations in extra-biblical texts like the Book of Enoch). (B&E: There is much more to write on Nimrod and his role in Bible scripture that will be covered in a forthcoming article. In the meantime, we strongly encourage the reader to research and explore this figure).

Casluhim and Capthor

And Mizraim begat Ludim, and Anamim, and Lehabim, and Naphtuhim, And Pathrusim, and Casluhim, (out of whom came Philistim,) and Caphtorim. – Genesis 10:13-14.

Ham’s son Mizaraim also contributed to the Nephilim lineage. In verse 14 we have the first mention of the Phillistines (whose forefather was Phillistim), the nation of the giant Goliath. Calshuhim was the father of Phillistim and his family later resided in Capthor in the Promised Land. So we see the direct origins of the Philistines, one of the most heated enemies of the Israelites, who also carried the Nephilim gene. In fact, as will be shown, the Philistine nation was the final “hideout” for the remnant of the Nephilim giants. And they can be traced back to Casluhim, the son of Mizraim and grandson of the evil Ham.Canaan

The name of Canaan should be the most familiar as it was the land that bore his name that was the Promised Land that The Lord reserved for the Israelites after they escaped out of Egypt thanks to God miracles and the leadership of Moses. The fact that they were in the Promised Land the Israelites were supposed to inhabit was no coincidence! The Philistines were worshipers of demons, fallen angels and Satan. And the Nephilim giants among them were working to attack God’s chosen people. Canaan’s line contains many of the enemies of God:

And Mizraim begat Ludim, And Canaan begat Sidon his first born, and Heth, And the Jebusite, and the Amorite, and the Girgasite, — Genesis 10:14-16.

The Jebusites, the Amorites and Gegusites, all cousins of Nimrod, are mentioned time and time again with reference to the Israelites capturing the Promised Land. These families were usurpers in the Promised Land and carried lots of the Nephilim gene. This is once again why God had to deal mercilessly with these nations. It cannot be stressed enough that the Nephilim threatened not only the existence of the human race itself but the ability of an all-human Messiah to eventually be born as well. Note God’s instructions to Moses on how to battle against these children of the cursed Canaan:

When the LORD thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou; And when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them: Neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son. — Deuteronomy 7:1-3.

Notice that God describes these nations as “greater and mightier than thou” to the Israelites. The physical and military advantage was clearly on the side of the enemies of God – the nations that were home to the Nephilim giants. But what gave the Israelites the ultimate edge was that The Lord Himself was going to supernaturally intervene early on in the conflict to deliver the enemies of Israel so they could be defeated. This point is not discussed enough: God fought against and defeated the early post-flood Nephilim. This shows the severity of the matter. The Lord was no longer allowing these superhuman, powerful hybrids to dominate humanity. Thus He not only says to wipe out these nations, but makes a specific point of prohibiting any marriage between them. God was bringing the spread of the Nephilim genes to an end.

Lord willing, at this point it is clear that giants did indeed exist in the Bible and in large number. Satan, who has constantly sought to stop God’s plans and destroy the souls of humanity, used a select group of angels to interbreed with human women and try to corrupt human DNA. By altering humanity from being no longer fully human, Satan could ensure that a pure human Messiah would never be born. To counter Satan’s offensive, God sent the global flood judgment to punish those angels who committed folly, destroy the Nephilim and save the existence of the human race. The flood ensured the Messianic bloodline was preserved so that we could have a chance to go to Heaven. It was as an act of love of mercy on God’s part to save a people that had rejected him to follow Satan’s minions and their God-given powers.

The bloodline of the Nephilim after the flood can be clearly traced to Ham, Noah’s evil son who brought a curse upon his own child, Canaan. But this is just the beginning. In Part 2, “Nephilim Giants – Enemies of God in the Bible” (which is now available!) we will continue to examine the post-flood Nephilim lineage from the perspective of the righteous men of God who fought against them throughout the Old Testament in the continuing chess match between God and Satan and the Sons of God against the seed of the Serpent. The article will also look that as the number of Nephilim giants on the Earth decreased, they soon became smaller in size. And we will reveal a modern occult mystery so secret even Wikipedia states it do not have the answer for it! These and other revelations will be detailed, all of this from the pages of Holy Scripture.

EXCITING NEW ANNOUNCEMENT – JUDGMENT OF THE NEPHILIM

Although we have completed all 7 parts of the Nephilim Series the study is far from over. Beginning And End is very pleased to announce the release of the first comprehensive Biblical study on the giants and the Genesis 6 account – Judgment Of The Nephilim. We have contributed a great deal of our own research to this book and it is filled with startling revelations on the giants that you will not find in any other book on this topic. Judgment Of The Nephilim surveys every passage in the Holy Bible on the giants – many which are rarely connected to the Nephilim. Among the many questions it addresses are:

The Biblical location of the heavenly portal used by angels to enter the earthly realm.

Who was the first mother of a Nephilim?

The specific timing and description of God’s punishment of the rebel Sons of God and the Nephilim

How did the Nephilim return after the flood?

The Biblical connection between demons and the Nephilim

The connection to Atlantis and the gods and demigods of mythology.

All these answers and many, many more from the Bible. Once our ministry started researching the Nephilim in-depth we realized there was a great deal of untapped, rarely quoted Christian and Jewish writings on the giants that answer many, many of the questions we all have on this thought-provoking topic. Now we have the answers. This is a must-own book if you are a reader on the subject of the Nephilim giants. The trailer is below:

Reader Interactions

Comments

B&E!!! Fabulous job! I’ve been very busy and couldn’t get over here for awhile…too long. I can only say that I am very happy with this article. Thank you so much for sticking to the Bible only and not being distracted by so much nonsense that the enemies of God continually try to throw in our faces. I am strongly resisting the desire to reply to some of the comments posted. It seems that the truth of the scripture has once again caused a few problems in the coven. I’m laughing! :0) Thank you so much for your good work. There is no question who is ruling the world – Matthew 28:18 ” And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.” P.S. I just have an opinion about why God would not slaughter whichever relative of Noah’s who carried the giant genes…it’s just not like Him. Noah being righteous, probably saw imperfections in his sons and daughters-in-law but he still would have tried to save them and hope for the best. Just like Abraham saved Lot, I believe God would allow Noah to rescue his family and deal with the consequences.

http://www.apologeticspress.org/rr/reprints/Sons-of-God-in-Genesis-6.pdf A convincing refutation to this deception. I do believe the Satan wants everyone to believe that he and his demons can have children with humans. However, the verse in Genesis refers to the same people as mentioned in Jude 1:4-16. The ones who are blessed because of Exodus 20:6 but as Jude says “ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into sensuality and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.”

Please pray about this as I believe the enemy is attempting to insert his fantasies into our faith! He wants this to become reality. Because of research into genetics and quantum computing I believe this will be accomplished in the antichrist, but it also will only come on the Lord’s terms. Remember who is in charge and pray for everyone who may be deceived.

Thanks for your comments. Jude in the passage you cite is comparing two groups: false prophets and the angels who sinned.

4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ. 5 I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not. 6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. 7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. 8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

Clearly, two distinct groups are being compared here. And the angels who sinned, in context are “as Sodom and Gomorrha”, who committed illicit sexual unions. Jude states this quite clearly.

Additionally, your article does not provide the proper translation of the word “nephilim” (it is not from the Hebrew root na-phal, other wise it would be spelled “nophelim”, not nephilim). It means giants. Which is precisely why the Septuagint translators used the greek word gigantes for them in Genesis 6 and again used gignates in Numbers 13 among other passages. Your articles tries to cast the nephilim as “warriors who inspire fear.” If that were the case why would the Septuagint translators use the term gignates? There are words for “fear inspiring warriors” in Greek and yet they used the word for giants in translating the text from Paleo-Hebrew. I do not think your article adequately addresses this. It also doesn’t explain the context of Numbers 13: The Israelites had just crossed the Red Sea and saw God destroy Pharaoh and the mightiest army on Earth at that time. Why would “well-trained warriors” in the land of Canaan suddenly inspire so much fear? And why would they specifically use their enemies size as a reason for fear, and not their weapons or military ability? It’s because these people, specifically, the sons of Anak, were giants.

Just something to consider. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts. God bless.

Titus 3:9-11—But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless. 10 Warn a divisive person once, and then warn them a second time. After that, have nothing to do with them. 11 You may be sure that such people are warped and sinful; they are self-condemned.

Ecclesiastes 12:13-14—Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: Fear Yahweh and keep His commandments, for this is the duty of all mankind.

You realize what you just said was petty and even childlike in taunting. I have a very hard time with all of it, the conjecture and “Must have’s” but when I saw your post of “Haha….” I had to say something.

Don’t ask how I know how. But you’re absolutely spot on, Elias. They have their own willpower. Not all chose the path of light, however. It’s all to do with the fate of each individual. Rather than a plot against humanity. The majority of the comments here have it way off. Well done for being a little more astute.

Elias you are right. JUDAH’S WIFE AND DAUGHTER IN LAW from which comes all the tribe of Judah incl. Jesus Christ through Mary the Virgin, were Canaanite. Rahab was a Canaanite. That kinda messes with this contaminated bloodline to prevent a pure blood human messiah doesn’t it?

b. Jesus’ death was to renew all creation, Rev. 5:13 shows animals and fish and so forth praising God hints elsewhere of a relationship between God and animals.

c. angels got no genes to contribute all records of this incl. Enoch tell the motive was lust. likely giants were GMO humans gnetic engineering and th angels’ wves the surrogate mothers the aliens are GMO humans.

NO HAM IN JESUS BLOODLINE 23Now Jesus himself was about thirty years old when he began his ministry. He was the son, so it was thought, of Joseph, the son of Heli, 24the son of Matthat, the son of Levi, the son of Melki, the son of Jannai, the son of Joseph, 25the son of Mattathias, the son of Amos, the son of Nahum, the son of Esli, the son of Naggai, 26the son of Maath, the son of Mattathias, the son of Semein, the son of Josech, the son of Joda, 27the son of Joanan, the son of Rhesa, the son of Zerubbabel, the son of Shealtiel, the son of Neri, 28the son of Melki, the son of Addi, the son of Cosam, the son of Elmadam, the son of Er, 29the son of Joshua, the son of Eliezer, the son of Jorim, the son of Matthat, the son of Levi, 30the son of Simeon, the son of Judah, the son of Joseph, the son of Jonam, the son of Eliakim, 31the son of Melea, the son of Menna, the son of Mattatha, the son of Nathan, the son of David, 32the son of Jesse, the son of Obed, the son of Boaz, the son of Salmon,[a] the son of Nahshon, 33the son of Amminadab, the son of Ram,[b] the son of Hezron, the son of Perez, the son of Judah, 34the son of Jacob, the son of Isaac, the son of Abraham, the son of Terah, the son of Nahor, 35the son of Serug, the son of Reu, the son of Peleg, the son of Eber, the son of Shelah, 36the son of Cainan, the son of Arphaxad, the son of Shem, the son of Noah, the son of Lamech, 37the son of Methuselah, the son of Enoch, the son of Jared, the son of Mahalalel, the son of Kenan, 38the son of Enosh, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God.

so these men just popped children out of their belly buttons without women? the patrilineage is only ONE line out of many many in any pedigree.

“the son of Hezron, the son of Perez, the son of Judah” lets look at Perez.

Perez mother was CANAANITE Tamar. How do we know she was Canaanite, although it is not specified of her like it was of Judah’s wife? Gen. 38:1 Judah went and stayed with an Adullamite. Adullam was a royal city of the Canaanites Joshua 12:15; 15:35 there Judah sees the daughter of a Canaanite and takes her to be his wife. vs. 6 “And he took a wife for Er his firstborn, whose name was Tamar.” it does not say who her father was, so she was not of his relatives elsewhere, such as another part of Laban’s kin or something. And this is in the Canaanite city, and it was nothing unusual for a prostitute to be around so this was still the Canaanite land. Judah is the first we see following the so called levirate marriage custom, probably imported from the canaanites and got popular but God tolerated this in Deuteronomy only if the brothers (can mean half brothers or first cousins) were living together when one died. and he had the right to refuse. the situation in Ruth is a case of the people warping the law.

Tamar deceived Judah by pretending to be a prostitute and was veiled the whole time, and conceived. This was an act of constructive incest since he was her father in law.

aside from this, ANYTHING including some alien genetic modified whatnot backcrossed to human enough to pass as human and joined a king’s harem could be in that pedigree.

Christ died for all creation Rom. 8:19-22, Rev. 5:13 so it doesn’t matter. All concerns about interbreeding in the Bible were about breeding with UNBELIEVERS the curse on Moab making no child of theirs in ten generations an Israelite was eliminated by Naomi adopting Ruth’s son, Ruth 4:16 absent this, David could not have been listed as of Israel, and therefore could not have been king per Torah Deuteronomy. only an Israelite to be king. The Book of Ruth was likely written to answer detractors of David who pointed to his recent Moabite lineage.

nothing is about genetcs. Even the messianic bloodline was not about genetics per se but about IDENTIFYING WHO MESSIAH IS.

In addition to the issue of Canaanite Tamar in Jesus’ pedigree, Boaz himself was the son of Rahab, a Canaanite woman.Matt. 1:5 Joshua 2:1.3; 6:17-25. While one can argue about Tamar, there is no doubt about Rahab.

why cannot you people get it into your heads that attitude and BEHAVIOR were the reasons God would order people killed, not bloodlines?

1st… just because Rahab lives in canaan… that is not empirical proof that her bloodline is nephilim…

2nd… the book of enoch states “8 Watchers have disclosed and have taught their sons. And the whole earth has been corrupted 9 through the works that were taught by Azazel: to him ascribe all sin.’ And to Gabriel said the Lord: ‘Proceed against the bastards and the reprobates, and against the children of fornication: and destroy [the children of fornication and] the children of the Watchers from amongst men [and cause them to go forth]: send them one against the other that they may destroy each other in 10 battle: for length of days shall they not have. And no request that they (i.e. their fathers) make of thee shall be granted unto their fathers on their behalf; for they hope to live an eternal life, and 11 that each one of them will live five hundred years.’ And the Lord said unto Michael: ‘Go, bind Semjaza and his associates who have united themselves with women so as to have defiled themselves 12 with them in all their uncleanness. And when their sons have slain one another, and they have seen the destruction of their beloved ones, bind them fast for seventy generations in the valleys of the earth, till the day of their judgement and of their consummation, till the judgement that is 13 for ever and ever is consummated. In those days they shall be led off to the abyss of fire: and 14 to the torment and the prison in which they shall be confined for ever. And whosoever shall be condemned and destroyed will from thenceforth be bound together with them to the end of all 15 generations. And destroy all the spirits of the reprobate and the children of the Watchers, because 16 they have wronged mankind. Destroy all wrong from the face of the earth and let every evil work come to an end: and let the plant of righteousness and truth appear: and it shall prove a blessing; the works of righteousness and truth’ shall be planted in truth and joy for evermore.”

clearly we see God condemning eternally.. the children of the watchers aka “sons of god” genesis 6:4

This whole subject is fascinating and yet seems more convoluted and complicated. After spending my childhood and young adult years in Christian school and church, I am trying to studying Nephilim and Luciferian bloodline without pre conceived teachings. Today in scripture I read about Jacob’s grasp or intertwined limb with Esau’s heel. Reminding me of the prophetic words to Lucifer concerning Eve’s seed (will bruise Lucifer’s head) and Lucifer’s seed (will bruise the heel). Many say this refers to Jesus/cross. The same scenario of Lucifer alone with Eve and deceiving her to ultimately implant his seed is played out again! Lucifer (posing as the Lord) out of blue tells Rebekah that she will have twins (Surely ONLY God could know that. Right?). And without any reason at all, tells her that Jacob and not Esau (who is actually the firstborn and rightful heir of Isaac’s blessing) will be the recipient! Why wasn’t Isaac told this extremely important yet odd prophecy! She herself never even tells Isaac this very important so called Godly news! Makes sense now why Jacob was Rebekah’s favorite and yet not Isaac’s.

Even weirder and bizarre is Jacob’s dream or physical fight with a man/angel in the wilderness. He does not know Jacob’s name and and ignores Jacobs asking of his.Sounds nothing like an angel of the Lord God. Then of all things, Jacob demands a blessing. He finally gets one and is told his new name is Israel. Sarcastically saying it means “fought God and man and overcame”. Jacob then proclaims like an idiot that he has “seen God face to face and lived!” No one has done that. Refer to Exodus 33:20, John 1:18. To this day, Esau’s Edom land is not part of the prophesied area of today’s Israel.

To sum it up. I believe Gods prophecy for the Jews to have a specific land promised to them. But through the biblical heir Esau and not the lying thief Jacob who very possibly is a seed of Satan. Just because someone still has possession of something they stole never makes it rightfully theirs. And I am not pro Palestine in any way.

You couldn’t be more wrong William!!! But I won’t waste time with you, you obviously have a twisted mind so, keep believing that Jacob ,which is Israel today, is on the wrong side of the Bible. Let’s see wgat Jesys tells you at his return to ISRAEL.

There were NO extraterrestrial relations, and 1st Corinthians 15:39,40 proves it…

“All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds. There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

This Scripture passage plainly states that men are men, animals are animals, fish are fish, birds are birds, and angels are angels. There is not one Scriptural reference which would even remotely lead us to believe that angels and humans ever had sex. Jesus plainly stated in Mark 12:25 concerning the departed saints… “For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.” I think this Scripture verse is self-explanatory. Carefully notice that Genesis 6:2 states… “and they took them wives of all which they chose.” Mark 12:25 says that angels cannot marry; but Genesis 6:2 says that the sons of God married the daughters of men. Clearly there would be a serious contradiction in the Scriptures here IF the sons of God were angels

Also, why didn’t God mention any punishment for the angels in Genesis? Genesis 6:7 states… “And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.” “Angels” are NOT mentioned. Surely God would have been very angry with a group of angels that defiled his creation, bringing it to ruin.

William, stop reading the Luciferian bible. It twists all the bible, there is another book that is out that the name slips me at the moment that does just that as well. it says that Cain killed Able in self defiance. that can was the good one. and you see in William post about Jacob and Esau.

First one must accept Jesus as lord and savior, after that follow the 10 commandments. every sin falls under one of the 10. final christian is a life style, a way of living. The Bible is our guild, our road map.

Many churches no longer teach scripture but use selected verse to teach there feel good message. people no longer read and study the bible but ready other books that gives or teaches their agenda.

“Study to show thy self approved.” 2 Timothy 2:15 study primarily the bible. i like to read in conjunction the other book that are no longer included in the bible like the book of Enoch and Jubilees as they are refereed in the bible. there is nothing wrong with reading opinions on the bible but beware when doing so, many can cloud ones vision and divert ones thought from the truth. when reading the bible you will find that it repletes itself a lot, this is important as it shows accuracy and supporting scriptures. if you want to go beyond the bible I suggest looking into word origin and original thought or word meaning of that time, it will give you a clearer understanding of what was being said.

One HUGE problem with your analysis…According to the Word of Gid, the Christ has but 1 human linegae…that of Mary. Jesus had no biological/earthly father.It matters not who Joseph’s ancestors were because Jesus did not share their blood.

problem is, that the conflicting versions of Joseph’s bloodline explained as including some levirate marriages so that one is of blood and one of ascription,begins with Joseph himself. That means that his “father” in one of those is in fact Mary’s father and an adoption into her patrilineage had occurred in the course of the marriage because her father lacked a son. Comparable to the Judahite who married his daughter to an Egyptian slave and raised the child to his and his tribe’s name in I Chron. 2:34, 35

AND SINCE MARY WAS OF THE TRIBE OF JUDAH SHE WAS DESCENDED FROM A JUDAHITE HERSELF THEREFORE ON MALE AND FEMALE LINES HAD THE CANAANITE BLOOD.

dismissing Rahab as simply living in a Canaanite city is ridiculous. if this blood purity and nephilim thing were of concern to God, He would have detailed her non Canaanite genetics. Ditto Judah’s wife and daughter in law. He didn’t. The Bible is clear that the massacres were because of the evil of the people, and the first reference to drive out is a different word from that in Deuteronomy, the latter more violent. This was after the Israelites had shown their unreliability and their own massacre inclination in Numbers where they offered a holocaust sacrifice to God of some four I think it was cities.

At one point in Prophets God says “your father was an Amorite and your mother a Hittite” and the Amorites were the ones whose evil He was going to allow to become full then eliminate them and give the land to Abraham. Canaanites were Amorites.

Most of you people’s efforts at genealogy seem to presuppose that there is nothing in a pedigree but the male lineage. which is ridiculous. Someone came up with the crazy idea that the spirit of the child is inherited solely from the male and original sin is not transferred except from the male and the female can’t transfer it explaining Jesus’ lack of original sin, as usual making everything NON MIRACULOUS AND WRITING GOD OUT OF THE EQUATION. Eve said I have gotten a man with the help of or from YHWH not from Adam she gave the credit to God. (“Lord” is all caps in KJV meaning the Hebrew there is YHWH not Adonai)

Yes. We are going to publish Part 2. We decided to complete the entire series at one time and then release it. But it is coming. Lord willing, 2014 will be a very exciting year for our Nephilim section on the site. God bless you abundantly. -B&E

This man supposes everything. If that’s convincing I have a bridge to sell you here in NYC. Peter and Jude may be referring to angels? Giants are mentioned numerous times in the scriptures and they descend from aristocrats? Some like to explain away the supernatural and bring God down to man’s low level. God is supernatural and is all powerful and almighty. Jesus spoke of men like your refuter in Matthew 15:9. Pray that your eyes may be opened and close your ears to those who teach the traditions of men.

@christopher Taylor: The Sons of God in the Old Testament are most definitely the fallen angels. The sons of God in the New Testament is entirely different. The sons of God in the NT are those that have taken Jesus as savior. In the OT, the sons of God had a different DNA, copper based. They produced Giants. So, are you trying to say that only the spiritual men of God listed had the genes necessary to produce Evil Giants?? Also, in Job 38:7, the sons of God clearly indicates that they were here before the creation of the Earth.

I did not have the time to go trough the entire document, but I can bring the following succint motivations why the “sons of God” were in fact godly men (not necessary sethites).

1. The meaning of the word son in both OT and NT has three meanings: a) son b)descendant -Jesus is the son of David c) follower/disciple, one that follows in the footsteps of someone. there are people called sons of God , sons of Satan or sons of Abraham based on this principle. I would argue that the angels that had not fallen are called sons of God on the same principle

2. Jesus says that angels cannot have sex

3. In the book of Tobit towards the end Raphael reveals himself as an angel and says: you though that I eat drank and slept but it was just a vision. I did not do those things because angels cannot do those things. to quote the exact passage: “19 All these days I did appear unto you; but I did neither eat nor drink, but ye did see a vision.”

4. the angels that left they abode and become demons are the angels that rebelled. When God created angels He give everyone a number of tasks and a hierarhical position just like someone would give to a member of his army. Now the rebelling angels deserted their position and their tasks and wanted to become as God being cast into the darkness.

5. The word nephilim literally means giant. (it can also mean metaphorically a great person like a leader) . It does not mean fallen angel. Now about giants we can speculate that a genetic defect caused acromegalia . About their size although we can only speculate about the size of angels before the flood we know that the giants after the flood reached a maximum of 3.5 meters which based on the fact we have people reaching 2.8 meters even today is not a great stretch. About giants before the flood I doubt they reached a height much greater than 3.5 m although it is possible due to a much longer lifespan. But even a wildest fantasy Ithink will limit them to around 5 meters. And it may not seem a lot having 3 meters but from the POV of a 1,7 m meters standing next to someone at 2.7-2.8 meters the difference is seen as much greater. More than that due to various problems introduced mainly by the city life most people that high are very thin. The old giants will probably have had a more husky appearence thus making a greater impression. The main reason this giants were feared was because they were violent and at least the ones before the flood were cannibals.

The Christ says: I beheld Satan cast to Earth as lightning. Sons of God in the OT always refers to FALLEN angels. That is, they were no longer angels but instead demons who were permitted to do precisely what Genesis 6 says they did. PS Tobit is not Scripture.

“Sons of God in the OT always refers to FALLEN angels” no it does not . In Psalm 2 it says “I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee” . In the NT Christ says that angels do not marry. About Tobit , the book of tobit is part of the scripture and is recognized by both the Catholic and the Orthodox Church. But this is less important. What is important is that Raphael does not sleep or eat or drink but it just appears so for Tobiah. And Christ says himself that angels cannot have sex. The OT speaks very little about angels out of fear of the jews might start worshiping them. This is also probably one of the reason the book of Tobit was not included in the Tanakh. What is said though is that angels are immaterial minds, spirits without a material body. They can appear physical though and usually appear as young men. Exception being the classes of angels seen by ezeckiel (thrones, seraphim and cherubim) . Also if you only go by the Tanackh and disconsider other books that describe the events of the OT then answer me this: how did jews in Jesus’s time know the names of the two magicians that went against Moses? “Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.” timothy 2 3:8. It is also interesting that Jesus himself calls people that follow Satan sons of the Devil. This makes clear to me that the term son of God was also used by people that followed God’s teachings similar to how humans that lie are called sons of the devil “for they do their father’s work”.

First of all he,Christ did not say that angels could not have sex. He said that those of the resurrection,which will then and only then be called sons of God and be equal with the angels and that they would not be given in marriage. For God said,let us make man in our image. Who’s image? Our. Who was he talking to? His sons,the angels. So just as we don’t have wings neither do they and just as we are male,so are they. Otherwise he would not refer to them as sons or he or even people referring to them as young men. If it were any different they would be called it or she for he made a distinction when he said male and female created he them. It’s just that it’s not in Gods plan to have created female angels for the purpose of reproducing to fill the spaces of heaven.

He said angels do not marry or are given unto marriage. This means they do not marry or have sex. And it says they will be like angels in that regard not equal to angels as they will become above angels as adopted sons of God. You ask who is God talking to but the answer is to Himself. God is one but it is three persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The Father talks to the Son and the Holy Spirit validating what John says that everything was done through the Word (Christ). Some angels do have wings as Ezekiel says describing seraphim and cherubim. Also just because they are male does not mean they have male sexual organs. It means they have a masculine mind just as men have and women do not. Because the man was made in God’s image and the woman in the image of man. If you read the second chapter it details how men and women were made and that they were not made the same. Why would He make female angels? Women are men modified to be optimized for bearing and raising children. Less strong, less intelligent , less focused.

if I may. Matthew (22), Mark (12), and Luke (20) all record this teaching of our Lord on those who are counted worthy to obtain the “that world” (God’s glorious Kingdom) and the “resurrection from the dead” (as Christ was raised from the dead), …are as the angels of God IN HEAVEN. Both Matthew and Mark state this fact.

You bring those three together as transparencies, and you get a very clear and plain picture. The angels that Jesus is talking about in comparing the saints to be resurrected with the “angels of God”, are NOT fallen angels, (evil, unclean spirits, demons by whatever name). All those angelic creatures who rebelled with Lucifer were no longer ‘angels of God’ (as being His faithful servants ministering to the heirs of salvation). Yet, they can never lose their created status and are therefore rightly called sons of God in a created sense.

The term “sons” of God can be meant both literally and figuratively. There is a legitimacy in legal adoption of a servant to become a son if the adoptor so desires. They can be treated with all the rights and privileges of sonship.

Paul tells the Athenians – “For in him (God) we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring. Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God,” Acts 17. The term offspring (ghenos) can be meant in a concrete way or an abstract way. Paul is including all his hearers (the ungodly) as well as himself (the godly) as offspring of God. All humanity are the offspring of God, for we came from Him, and are dependent on Him, like it or not.

The angels that Jesus is speaking about are those who are holy angels in Heaven, those who DID NOT leave their first estate, but remained faithful to their glorious Creator.

It is important to understand what Jesus is talking about in these three passages. He is specifically speaking about the HOLY angels.

Whether the fallen angels can copulate with the daughters of men is another issue. Let us settle it in our minds first who Jesus is referring to; the holy or the unholy. Then we can build on that.

The term sons of God as it relates to sinners who are blood washed and made saints through Jesus Christ, is both for the here and now, and the hereafter. Believers in Christ Jesus are stated as being now called sons of God. Rom 8:14; Gal 4:6; Phil 2:15; 1 John 3:2. The time element is for BOTH the now and THEN.

And as has been stated by another, God is speaking to Himself. God holds His own counsel, and he needs no one to teach or instruct Him. Nor can any creature instruct God as if He needed anythiing from them. The Scriptures are very clear about that. The ‘angels’ were not co Creators with God, no more than ‘Mary’ is a co Redeemer with Christ Jesus.

God created all things – Rev 4;11; Colossians 1:15, 16; Heb 11:3. .There is no mention nor is there any need to think that mankind was made in the image of both God and angels.

Women are not less intelligent than men, they have different ways at looking at things. Many men are ignorant, and there are many women who are very astute. We all have some thing to gioe and something to learn.

Darkness: ζόφος zophos {dzof’-os} definition- 1) darkness, blackness 1a) used of the darkness of the nether world

If you go to the root of zophos we find νέφος nephos {nef’-os

definition- 1a) used to denote a great shapeless collection of vapour obscuring the heavens as opposed to a particular and definite masses of vapour with some form or shape

These chains of darkness describes the domain they now live in which is where Satan also rules. Even though Satan has access to God to accuse the brethren day & night wherever he does this is certainly a chasm that separates darkness from the Light of the Lord.

Some scholars believe that only certain Fallen Angels are kept in a specific place of darkness but remember that in the story of the demons & the pigs in Matthew 8. Look at v. 29 “What do you want with us, Son of God?” they shouted. “Have you come here to torture us before the appointed time?”

So what is the appointed time? This is clearly referring to all the fallen angels casting with their master into the Lake of Fire. So the figurative language of Chains of Darkness is best interpreted to describe the domain that they reside in. And for the unsaved they too are in darkness spiritually but they are not chained to it because of Christ who frees us from the darkness.

How can a 36 foot tall dude have a child with a normal sized female? Even if she were impregnated somehow, the size of the child would kill her long before the child was viable. Bunk. But even if you were to be right, what do you suggest, that we isolate this “Nephilim” gene and murder people who carry it, even if they are good, kind, and sane? Disgusting. No creature is evil. Only actions are evil. That must be obvious to any thinking person.

Martine, The Word of God is Jesus. (John, ch. 1) “In the beginning was the Word. The Word was with God and the Word was God…The Word became flesh and dwelt among men.” Paraphrased, but here it is…the key to everything. 🙂

If you read the Word carefully and ask God for the discerment only the Holy Spirit can provide, you will readily understand that the Giant is not the fornicator with Daughters of Men. Rather, the Giants were the oiffspring of the Sons of God (fallen angels) and human women. Really want to delve into prayer and meditation regarding arcane elements of Scripture? Ask God: “Of whom was Cain afraid?” And please don’t vomit back to me the words of the mental sloths who claim that he feared the offspring of his sisters who for some odd reason are never named in Scripture, would have had to have been banished from Eden (a punishment Cain received for murdering his brother) and who would have married their brothers who for another odd reason were never named despite the emphsais Eve places upon Seth’s replacing Abel, etc. etc. etc. Hint: Scripture mentions the creation of Man in Genesis 1 and 2.

i will try to help you-God created the world and man-when you look out at sun,moon,stars,earth nature all things are order. this alone should prove to you that there is a God. this could not have happen by chance. God created man and the universe for his on pleasure and companionship. for man to continue as a companion he had to follow God’s instructions. man was given freewill and did not obey God. this was called sin. God provided a way to correct this by sacrificing and shedding of blood. to start he allowed man to use animals as an example but knew he would have to provide a permanent fix for this sin problem. so he actually created himself in the flesh in the womb of the virgin Mary. He was borned lived a perfect life, which was required as his life had to be unblimished to be the perfect sacrifice. He then was crucified on the cross was in the grave for three days and came back to life with a new body. in the flesh He was named Jesus Christ . the old testment bible prophesied this would happen. therefore, Jesus Christ’s death and coming back to life did away with sin for all of mankind. this is called the new testment or new covenant between God and man. the book of John the apostle chapter 3 verse 16 sums up what you have to do to get to heaven quote- For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life- this you have to believe as child. get a new testment bible and start reading. Jesus Christ is the truth, the way and the life no one goes to the Father except through Jesus Christ. Godspeed

hi peter thanks for writing in a way that i can understand more easily,thank you for that i have read certain bits and peices from the hebrew bible the book of genesis the book of enoch,and have also researched extra terestials the thing is every body seems to have a different take on it.do you think god or gods were extra-terestial if they were would it make any difference has they would still be gods or gods what do you think regards notsrub

I enjoyed your article, but would like to add one point. God is perfect and does not break his own laws. One of which is displayed in reproduction. When 2 different species breed, there offspring is sterile. This is a law of nature, one created by God. I understand that the Nephilim did exist, and agree they were a primary focus of the flood, but if they existed after, they would also have to be the offspring of fallen angels, not a Nephilim.

Neanderthals and Denisovans bred with pure humans. Their seed have survived to this day!. Please visit nhm.ac.uk for details. There are Homo sapiens with upto 5% Neanderthal or Denisovan DNA in them. This appears to me to be a well-researched article that is premised on the infallible WORD OF GOD.

Brent, you are partially right. God is holy and He doesn’t break His own Laws, However, he is known to break laws of the universe. Such as gravity. Jesus Ascended, therefore He broke the law of gravity. He also walked on water, walked through a wall, rose from the dead, turned water into wine…..and the list goes on. So God does “break laws” according to what “we” consider laws. But God is greater than the universal laws the we understand. As for his Spiritual laws, He will not break them, because He can not lie. Scientifically it is accepted and understood that genetically modified organisms can not reproduce. But scientifically speaking men can not walk through walls either. Or levitate, or come back from the dead. But in reality, these things have happened. So, God can and does break the so called laws of physics and therefore He can also break the laws of Biology. Our understanding of these things are finite. God can reverse time if He likes, but we can not time travel…..yet. With God, all things are possible. Because He can do as He chooses. And He is always correct…..it’s our understanding that is flawed.

I would also like to make a general statement to those who oppose the Idea that angels cannot have sex. That is actually not found in scripture. The actual scripture says that the angels “IN HEAVEN” do not have MARRIAGE. Sex and marriage are two different things. Also angels are known to take the form of humans. Like the men in white who were present during Jesus’ ascension. So, fallen angels are different from the ones in Heaven. They do not abide by the laws of Heaven. So, Fallen angels might actually marry and have sex.

One more note. In witchcraft there are beings called sucubis and incubis (I may have misspelled those terms) and they are “demons” who have sex with humans in order to produce offspring. Not that I hold to any witchcraft beliefs, but the occult seems to hold firm to this. Not to mention, if you want to really speculate, the Holy spirit did OVERSHADOW Mary. There was no sex involved, but there was a baby produced from human and spirit lineage. There are many ideas in the Bible that may seem strange to man, like the virgin birth, but we trust the scripture and believe. There are many stories in the Bible that are difficult to understand, but that is when we must pray and seak and search and research. And the Lord will reveal in His time. So, I said that to say this…….fallen angels creating supernatural offspring with mankind is very possible. And Yes I firmly believe that the Genesis 6 account was exactly that. And the tribes such as the Horims and Zamzzumims and Anakims were all offspring of angels. Please forgive my spelling mistakes as I do not have my Bible beside me for reference.

Brent, you are partially right. God is holy and He doesn’t break His own Laws, However, he is known to break laws of the universe. Such as gravity. Jesus Ascended, therefore He broke the law of gravity. He also walked on water, walked through a wall, rose from the dead, turned water into wine…..and the list goes on. So God does “break laws” according to what “we” consider laws. But God is greater than the universal laws the we understand. As for his Spiritual laws, He will not break them, because He can not lie. Scientifically it is accepted and understood that genetically modified organisms can not reproduce. But scientifically speaking men can not walk through walls either. Or levitate, or come back from the dead. But in reality, these things have happened. So, God can and does break the so called laws of physics and therefore He can also break the laws of Biology. Our understanding of these things are finite. God can reverse time if He likes, but we can not time travel…..yet. With God, all things are possible. Because He can do as He chooses. And He is always correct…..it’s our understanding that is flawed. However, I do agree with you , at this point in my understanding, that the giants after the flood came from actual angels and not from nephilim. Just because the Bible doesn’t mention another infiltration, doesn’t mean that there wasn’t one. The phrase “and also after that” could elude to a second infiltration.

I would also like to make a general statement to those who oppose the Idea that angels cannot have sex. That is actually not found in scripture. The actual scripture says that the angels “IN HEAVEN” do not have MARRIAGE. Sex and marriage are two different things. Also angels are known to take the form of humans. Like the men in white who were present during Jesus’ ascension. So, fallen angels are different from the ones in Heaven. They do not abide by the laws of Heaven. So, Fallen angels might actually marry and have sex.

One more note. In witchcraft there are beings called sucubis and incubis (I may have misspelled those terms) and they are “demons” who have sex with humans in order to produce offspring. Not that I hold to any witchcraft beliefs, but the occult seems to hold firm to this. Not to mention, if you want to really speculate, the Holy spirit did OVERSHADOW Mary. There was no sex involved, but there was a baby produced from human and spirit lineage. There are many ideas in the Bible that may seem strange to man, like the virgin birth, but we trust the scripture and believe. There are many stories in the Bible that are difficult to understand, but that is when we must pray and seak and search and research. And the Lord will reveal in His time. So, I said that to say this…….fallen angels creating supernatural offspring with mankind is very possible. And Yes I firmly believe that the Genesis 6 account was exactly that. And the tribes such as the Horims and Zamzzumims and Anakims were all offspring of angels. Please forgive my spelling mistakes as I do not have my Bible beside me for reference.

“There was no sex involved, but there was a baby produced from human and spirit lineage”

you are making Jesus out to be a hybrid. He is not a hybrid, He is 100% human and 100% divine, a mystery that cannot be fully understood. Under the power of the Holy Spirit some of Mary’s flesh (an egg maybe? or any cell?) was taken and joined to The Word’s divinity and one of the two X chromosomes made into a Y. This is not human + spirit lineage.

There is nothing that says the Zamumim and Horim (-im is plural you don’t add an s after them) or Rafaim were hybrids. Fallen and won’t rise has nothing to do with the Resurrection and Judgement that is about they can’t get their act together to attack again. they are done for. don’t worry.

“and after that” precedes when the sons of God took some of the daughters of men, so refers to THAT event, not a later one. the giants already there were just anomalous large humans which likely were valued as supersoldiers or bullied their way into power themselves. The next bunch of giants may have been hybrids, but more likely genetic engineering aided by the fallen angels.

in all the nephilim as angel hybrid ancient literature here is NOTHING about any motive except lust. and hybridization occurs in the wild all the time and in zoos and for some agricultural reasons on purpose. well not ALL the time but the point is, we can’t say that God’s laws prohibit this because they would prevent it. THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT ANY SEX WITH ANGELS OR OTHER THAN HUMANS IS OKAY. what it does mean is that whatever the origin of these giants, GMO or hybridization, you can’t write off their descendants as withoug souls (since soul is something alive the immortal part livens the physical part{) and non savable if some trace identifiable DNA were found today.

” Sex and marriage are two different things.” yes and no. sex plus bonding is marriage per Adam and Eve. designations of what was and wasn’t marriage developed as people afte the fall separatred sex from a pair bond. casual no strings sex and/or for pay.

the angels can get solid, but have no DNA they could make themselves penises and a nervous system to enjoy but not reproduce. the motive was lust.

their women were surrogate mothers for genetic enginerig experiments to make super soldiers for the military of the time.

One comment I posted earlier today (11 Oct 2016) appeared under an unrelated comment. So I don’t know if this will appear under April 26 2016 by Chrisine E., but Christine E., , how can you be certain that angels do not have DNA? Is that an assumption or an indisputable fact? Just asking the question.

It seems to me that if the option was some form of genetic engineering made by fallen angels or whatever they may be called, and I am not dismissing that view entirely, how can you be certain that DNA was not taken from two different sources, the one human, and the other the ‘fallen’ and blended together? Is it possible that the ‘fallen angels’ could make or alter DNA as you propose ? And if so, who are we to state that that manipulation did not involve some “other” material non -human?

If those beings could actually reshape their spiritual bodies’ and leave their ‘first estate’ – habitation or boundary, is it not possible that they could also form some kind of material akin to semen to pass through their reshaped bodies?

What do we really know about the spiritual realm?

There are some examples of holy angels eating human food and it being internally dealt with so as to be changed into nothing. Then we have the resurrected body of Lord Jesus Christ comuming food and it being changed to become nothing. I dare say that if some things were possible there may be other things also possible, which we cannot grasp. Whatever the case, let us remember the words of our Lord Jesus who stated that as it was in Noah’s day it will also be in the last day when the Son of Man comes, and as it was in Lot’s day likewise. Be ready for no one knows day or hour when the Son of Man will appear.

October 10, 2016 at 11:47 pm I concur with you 100%! Man (or in this case a woman) trying to understand or carefully compartmentalizing Him in any way is utter ignorance at least! He said Himself, ” His ways are HIGHER than the ways of man”. HE IS GOD! All powerful, all knowing, and everywhere! One thing I feel strongly, as I read the comments, while the arguments seem to cloud the great findings of the original post, and only cast doubt on what had already been established. I feel one aspect that will go largely unchallenged, is the issue of “a woman teacher”.(1 Tim. 2:12) While I believe that there are always exceptions to the rule (for instance my daughter taught at our church for a while (no men were available/ like Deborah the Judge), she truly was in full and complete scriptural submission, and humility, and truly anointed). I do believe a major issue and especially in our day, are women who are self-willed, and not submitted to Biblical authority, and for this cause are to be rejected (2 John). For while they through “much speaking” may make great arguments they are only (as The serpent in the garden) only casting doubt on what The Word teaches. I feel the revelation that in now coming more to the surface has a purpose in these last days. I am still in prayer as to my firm convictions, but I totally lean toward believing the “Gen. 6 fallen angels/ daughters of man unions” that brought forth “Giants”. The succinct, and careful observation of scripture seems to support this belief. Another important part of the equation, that we must consider is the “giant” skeletons, and physical sites they obviously dwelled; all around the world that (like all other important archaeological findings) end up under lock, and key, controlled by governments to silence the discussion that arises from such findings. The obvious answer as to “why they do such a thing?”, is clearly that they know it only “proves” the Divine texts of The Holy Scriptures. And would cause many to turn to God! The world is full of evil (1 John 2:16, 1 John 5:19), and led by men, and women who are clearly satanically controlled (John 8:44, Romans 6:16). And as they say in their own words are forging a “new world order” which is nothing other than the stage that will be set for the “Antichrist” and his”false prophet” to deceive (lie to) them, and those who reject Christ into losing their own souls (2 Thess. 2:8-12). Yes, I think it is clear why all this stirs up any clarity as found in the Scriptures, for Satan hates ALL TRUTH, and those who abide in it, and declare it. And your last point about “as it was in the days of Noe” are very telling, and given Christ himself said it, truly makes me consider this whole theory even more. But Thanks again, and The Lord Bless you is my Hope, and Prayer for you my friend. Freddie

Steph, I like the way you think. I agree with everything you said in your response. Come on over to my site at http://www.facebook.com/Richard-New-1650222931906791 where I’m starting my own Nephilimic study. On my site, I will also reference additional information in my “talks” on this material.

This article, in my opinion, is very well written and concise as to what the writer is conveying. That is refreshing and the study appears to be on target. Just a few thoughts: I was digging into what happened when Satan corrupted Eve and started the enmity between the bloodlines. If you look at other writings of the time such as Enoch, there is detail showing that both Satan and Adam impregnated Eve in that encounter, and Cain is the child of Satan which the Bible states to be true. After this, the other fallen angels did the same thing to the daughters of men. Now even the Nephilim are referred to as men, so say they impregnated a daughter of Cain, who was already part Satan’s seed. That resulting child would be over 50% fallen angel! Could it be that anything over 50% fallen angel blood would be a Nephilim giant, and 50 and under would be a normal sized Nephilim?

Just to add a reference for the above, John 1 vs 3:12 “Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother…”. Now there was only Adam, Eve, Satan, and God present with Cain. “Of” refers to the origin of Cain, and I can only conclude that the wicked one is Satan.

What you are talking about is referred to as the serpent seed theory. You must be careful about this my brother, this theory is a twisting of the word of God. When the serpent tempted Eve in the garden, he twisted the word of God, and this allowed sin and death to enter the world. The Bible in fact confirms that both Cain and Abel were born of Eve from the Lord.

Genesis 4:1-2 Afterward the man knew Eve his wife which conceived and bare Cain, and said, I have obtained a man by the Lord And again she brought forth his brother Abel, and Abel was a keeper of sheep, and Cain was a tiller of the ground. 1599 Geneva Bible

The Bible makes it clear that the man (Adam) knew (fornicated) with Eve his wife, not satan. And right after says that the child is from the Lord. As far as the scripture you quoted about Cain being of the wicked one, yes satan is the wicked one, but that doesnt mean he slept with Eve. If you keep reading Genesis ch 4, Cain does choose not to follow God, he gives God a bad offering and is jealous because Abel gives a good one and the Lord respected Abel for it. So in a rage of jealousy, Cain kills his brother (Genesis ch 4:3-8). So in that sense, he was of the wicked one, he didnt give the best of what he had to God, and sin took over. My point, is that when we twist the word of God, it allows sin to creep in and eventually death. I pray that you will continue to search the scriptures and let Jesus Christ show you the truth. God Bless.

Psalm 127:3 Behold, children are the inheritance of the Lord, and the fruit of the womb His reward.

Thank you. Am I correct to say that Cain is the serpent’s seed spiritually and the enmity between he and his brother was the result of Satan’s original deception? Also, does this mean that, if they did not eat from the tree, there would be no children, and an eternity in the garden of Eden with just the two, God and Satan? Thank you again.

Hi Tyomies To answer your question about the serpents seed, his seed are the Nephilim or giants created by the fallen angels committing folly with human women. God put enmity between all the Nephilim that were going to be created and the woman that would eventually bring forth the coming savior. You said a spiritual seed but it indeed was a physical blood line that was meant to destroy human DNA. This is why the fallen angels are locked in the abyss until judgement day (Jude 1:6-7). The angels had defiled themselves sexually with women, not satan. But again, because the fallen angels are evil and in a sense “of the wicked one”, this makes their offspring the serpents seed talked about in Genesis 3:15. As far as eating from the tree, I don’t know what you mean by there not being any children if they didn’t. All it means is that sin /death wouldn’t have entered the world, however this was Gods plan from the beginning so he could send his Son to be a mediator between God man (1 Timothy 2:5). And remember Jesus was with God in the beginning and came to take away sin (John 1:1-5, John 1:29). That should answer your last question, God gave us a commandment to multiply and fill the earth (Genesis 1:28). And it was so we could all be with Him through Jesus Christ(1 Timothy 2:3-6). It’s good that you want to learn about God’s plan, I urge you to look at these scriptures and find some more on your own. I will be praying for you brother. God bless.

I am not sure where you are getting that Adam, ” fornicated” with Eve. If you are going to say Adam ” knew Eve” in the sense There is no verse that I can find that supports that.. Gen 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; Gen 2:22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

God gave Eve to Adam. There is no sin in God. therefore God did not give Eve to ” fornicate” with Adam. Adam knew [yada] his wife Eve, and she conceived and bore Cain… Cain knew [yada] his wife, and she conceived and bore Enoch… Adam knew [yada] his wife again, and she bore a son and named him Seth… (Genesis 4:1, 17, 25)

The words YADA here means an intimate kind of knowledge, and some would even call it a carnal knowledge. Or Sexual coupling.

When I say fornicated, I mean Adam is the one who had sex with Eve to bear Cain and Abel. The person I was talking to was under the impression that satan was the one who “knew” Eve in the garden to bear Cain. I don’t understand the confusion with my post. I used the word “fornicated” instead of the phrase “had sex with”, or “slept with”. Genesis 4:1 says Adam “knew” Eve. At this point, Adam and Eve began to fulfill Gods original commandment to be fruitful and multiply (Genesis 1:28). In order to multiply, there has to be a “sexual coupling” as you stated. So the word “knew”, indeed means sexual fornification. Again, I only used the word “fornicated” instead of “had sex with”, because I thought it sounded a little more professional. And yes, God gave Eve to Adam so they could be fruitful and multiply. It is not a sin for a married couple to have sex and multiply. Genesis 2:24, also known as the “first marriage”, clearly states that two become one flesh. Gods timeless design for marriage is declared here. The “one flesh” relationship certainly involves sexual union, but also includes a husband and wife coming together in spiritual, mental, and emotional harmony. Again, I don’t understand your confusion with these scriptures. Do you not believe that Adam and Eve had sex to make children? If so, please elaborate. Thanks and God bless.

So I just read the definition for the word fornication. And I had no idea that the word is used to describe sexual intercourse between an unmarried couple. I honestly thought it was just another fancy word for sex. I guess I should of looked it up first. Now I see why there’s confusion. Sorry about that.

In every instance in the bible the word “fornication ” denotes sexual sin, in that the person is not married. Galatians 5:19 “Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: ADULTERY, FORNICATION, uncleanness, lewdness, . .

Some beliefs held in common by many Christian Identity (CI) groups are: A very conservative interpretation of the Christian Bible. This has led to a hatred of homosexuality and of homosexuals and a rejection of followers of other religions.

A view of the white race, the “Adamic race” or “True Israelites” as superior. Other races are the “Satanic spawn” of Cain. This leads naturally to a hatred of Blacks, Native Americans, and immigrants from “non-Aryan” lands That Adam and Eve were white. Many other “pre-Adamic” and non-white people were already in existence when Adam was created. This leads to the belief that Anglo-Saxon Protestants are the “true identity” of God’s chosen people of the Hebrew Scriptures. Non-whites are considered sub-human. These Biblical beliefs confirm their concept of white racial superiority. As a minimum, they call for racial separation; some call for extermination of what the call the “mud races” (non-white races). That the Commandment which forbids adultery does not refer to extra-marital sexual relationships. Rather, it forbids “racial adultery”; i.e. inter-racial marriages. Their reasoning is that the 10th Commandment which forbids coveting one’s neighbor’s possessions already bans adultery; one of those “possessions” is the neighbor’s wife. And, God would not have repeated Himself. They consider themselves to be the direct descendants Adam’s son Abel and thus are God’s chosen people. They regard the Jewish people as having descended from Cain. Thus the Jewish belief that they are the chosen people is invalid. This has led to an extreme anti-Semitism within the Christian Identity movement.

Its a racist organization and they brainwash their followers by those like Arnold Murray, Eli James, Westboro Baptist church and many more.

I am not confused. Your usage of the word “fornicated ” is incorrect. Thus the confusion you present.The Greek words “pornea” ( “fornication”) and akatharsia ( “uncleanness”) are key terms used to refer to sexual sins. Adams union with Eve was not sinful. It was God ordained. Adam had sex with Eve, or had “knowledge” of her. ( as God intended) as she was his wife. The word “knew” does not mean fornication either.

Are you honestly asking me if I believe ” Adam and Eve had sex to produce children’ ? That is basic biology.

Yes we are in 100% agreement. If you would have read the other comment I recently posted regarding the use of the word “fornification”, I did not realize that word was used to describe sexual intercourse between unmarried couples. So yes your right, it was not the right word to use. I made that very clear. My point to the other person I was commenting to, was that Adam and Eve had sex to bear Cain, not satan and Eve. Even my original response to you makes it very clear that I thought the two were married, and had sex to multiply. Sorry again for the confusion.

Adam did indeed have sex with Eve. How do you interpret Geneis 4:1? Eve said that she has “gotten a man from the Lord”. Do you think this Enochian fallen angel Gadreel is the Lord? With that being said. The book of Enoch does not say that Gadreel had sex with Eve to bear Cain.

And the third was named Gadreel: he it is who showed the children of men all the blows of death, and he led astray Eve, and showed [the weapons of death to the sons of men] the shield and the coat of mail, and the sword for battle, and all the weapons of death to the children of men. 1 Enoch 69:6

This is the only reference in the book of Enoch that talks about Gradeel being in the garden. This is from Wikipedia describing Gradeel. Gadreel (Heb. גדר האל gader ha-el, lit. “wall of God”) is listed as one of the chiefs in the fallen grigori of angels. This is depicted in the second section of the “Book of Enoch”; “Parables”. He is said to have been responsible for teaching man warfare. This contradicts the first section of Enoch, which claims that Azazel was responsible for doing this.

The book of Enoch, although old, is not Holy inspired. It contradicts scripture in multiple ways.

You see the Christian Identity Cult group and Arnold Murray, several others falsely teach that Eve had sex with Satan or a fallen angel. They will cite Genesis 4:1. However, she gave birth to Cain and saw that he was man, and so, exclaimed that “she had gotten a man from the Lord” as in a miracle. Gotten does not mean had sex. “To know someone then was having sex.

Actually Genesis 4:1 does not say that Cain was sired by Adam. If he was, then the Bible would have said so. The word that is used for man in Genesis 4:1 is ish, not Adam. In other words he was born by someone other than Adam. In fact, Eve even told God that she had been seduced. The Christian Identity movement is not a cult. It goes through all of this specifically and has good reason to. The bible supports the Christian Identity movement. No serpent had sex with Eve. The word that is translated as serpent is Nachesh which means soothsayer, magician, one who is serpentine in nature. Even the book of Enoch names the angel that had sex with Eve. His name is Gadrel. If Adam had sired Cain, than he had the inheritance of the first born. Even when he was banished he would still have the inheritance. However, he is not mentioned in the genealogy of Adam, or Jesus Christ. He has his own genealogy. If Cain was sired by Adam than why did Seth replace Abel when Cain was still alive? He couldn’t. The Adamic inheritance or the inheritance of the first born would still be with Cain, and Jesus Christ would be a direct descendant of Cain, but he isn’t. Cain is not in his genealogy. Why? Because Cain was not sired by Adam. Christ’s genealogy in Luke 5, says Seth, Adam, and then God. The Genealogy is the genealogy of Mary that goes to God. Cain is not mentioned in Christ’s genealogy because he wasn’t sired by Adam.

Actually it doesn’t say that Eve and Satan has sex either. Its indicates just as the context shows, she say Cain and said, I’ve gotten a man from the Lord. In those days, “To know someone” is to have had sex.

No where in the Bible does Eve say she was seduced. The only true word of God is the King James Bible. The other books are Gnostic and not from God.

The Christian Identity Movement is a massive brainwashing cult group that is born from a corrupted Theology. Arnold Murry for example is linked to Christian Identity. They have corrupted and deceived their followers to a massive degree.

Cain was disinherited because he was not of the Hebrew Jew and none were until the First Hebrew Jew, Abraham came along. Google the Abrahamic Covenant. This even tells you. Cain’s bloodline was wiped out by the flood. That is another reason. Seth, was not in the Bloodline of Cain and even if Cain’s bloodline survived he would still not be mentioned.

Terry, again, just because you say so doesn’t make it so. If you belong to Christian Identity they are lying to you for sure. I can give you background and history of the Christian Identity Movement that will show you it’s a heresy and linked not only to Freemasonry but also to the racist and extreme Christian movements.

We never lived before as Angels, Eve was never seduced by a fallen angel or the Bible would of indicated so. In those days “To know” is to have sex. The incident talking about the two angels that came to Sodom and Gomorrah and were desired by the men of the city, was “we want to KNOW them”. To have gotten an man from the Lord is not the same thing.

Cains’ bloodline was destroyed in the flood along with everyone else except for 8 humans. It was not the first born issue, it was the godly bloodline of Seth that divided the true bloodline of Jesus from the rest. Abraham was the first Hebrew Jew based on the Abrahamic Covenant. Gotten a man from the Lord was simply Eve seeing her first born and exclaiming that the LORD gave her a male child. She could tell he was a man (Male child), by his sexual organ and him being naked.  Gotten a man from the Lord you are falsely associating “LORD” to be a fallen angel. If it were, the Bible would of read, “I’ve gotten a man from the sons of God”…….

Actually, Christian Identity is not a cult. By King James only people are in a cult. The King James does not go along with the Greek Septuagint. The scriptures that Jesus and the Apostles used. The King James goes by the Massoretic text and the oldest Massoretic text dates to about 925 AD. Over 90% of the Dead Sea Scrolls support the Greek Septuagint.

The sin in the Garden of Eden was sexual. Here is proof: 1) If Cain was sired by Adam, than he would have had the inheritance of the first born. He would have been in every genealogy in the Old Testament, but he isn’t. 2) Seth took the place of Abel, not Cain even though Abel was dead and Cain was banished from the Garden. If Cain was sired by Adam, Seth could not have the inheritance of the first born because he wasn’t the first born. Cain would still have that inheritance. However, the inheritance was with Abel because Abel was the first born of Adam, not Cain. Therefore Seth replaced Abel (Seth means replacement) 3) In Christ’s genealogy Luke 5 it goes to Seth, Adam, and then God. In fact, it calls Adam a son of God. If Cain was sired by Adam, then it would go to Cain, Adam, and then God. 4) When Eve stated she had a man child from God, the Hebrew word that was used was Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance #376, or a man like creature, a human being. However, when Seth was created at the end of the 4th. chapter of Genesis when Seth was born, the Hebrew word that was used was Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance #120 from #119, which means, to be ruddy, to show blood in the face red, to blush, to have rosy cheek. The word is Adam. In other words Seth was a direct descendant of Adam, begotten by Adam, but Cain was not.

Now, The first lie that you are telling or if you really believe what you are saying the ones telling you canned logic are from the Freemasons who take a blood oath in the name if God to lie and keep secrets.

First of all the Greek Septuagint is junk. It was put together by Origen using partially old manuscripts that were not even complete. Origen, a Greek philosopher made up a strange Greek Bible in the 3rd century. He pasted together his own corrupted version of the scrolls he received from Antioch and his own Greek Old Testament, mixed with some folk tales called the Apocrypha and added his own perverted New Testament. To dress it up he inserted New Testament verses into Old Testament passages. They put parts of Pauls writings and placed it into the Psalms giving the deception that Paul quoted Origens Greek Old testament. The idea at the Alexandrian Schools that the Apostles and Jesus quoted Origen’s Old Testament junk. That made HIS book look “ancient” and gave it authority. He also added other books. He added throughout the folks tales contained in the Apocrypha.

Satan used Origen to make the first counterfeit Bible. He added and removed whatever he wanted since he wasn’t a christian anyway. Origen was not a true scholar because according to history he was not good at all in Hebrew and Greek was easier to learn. So his final product was to put HIS Old Testament and Apocrypha together and called them the “ancient Septuagint”.

So, in summary according to history, the Modified OLD TESTAMENT was made up of folk tales called the Apocrypha together with the Perverted New Testament became Origen’s “Alexandrian Bible”. This abomination of a Bible plays today a big role in the 20th and 21st Century.

Origen died in 254 AD after he was kicked out of the schools, teaching from 204 AD to 230 AD and did not fair too well there. After they kicked him out of his teaching He moved to Caesarea and was caught up in the Decian persecution of 250 and tortured. He was released and as I said died of his wounds in 254 AD. He certainly was not a real church father. The RCC later brought him in as a saint to justify the acceptance of his writings. His counterfeit Bible was copied by other Scholars; and as I have said before Eusebius brought back 50 of his corrupt Bibles and passed to the first Pope, Constantine in 325 AD. In addition the scholars (if you call them that) of Alexandria wrote 3 Bible perversions. They were the Sinalticus about 350 AD, the Vaticanus before 400 AD, and the Alexandrinus about 450 AD. These so called scholarly Bibles disagrees over 3,000 times, in the 4 gospels alone. They are false witnesses. The King James Stands along and the 40 authors of the KJV has nothing to do with the Septuagint or the folk tales of the Apocrypha. The 40 were inspired by God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit and 1 John 5:7 confirms that these three are one.

Yes, the King James goes by the Massoretic text and the oldest Massoretic text. The translators of King James decided use the first five books of the Torah, which came from Moses who was given this by God himself. When the Dead sea scrolls were found in 1947, they discovered that the book of Isaiah was from the Massoretic Text. This was about all that it proved the dead sea scrolls.

Now, Cain would not inherit nothing but exile for his disobedience and curse that God put upon him for murdering Abel. You will find this in scriptures. He was thrown out of the circle like Ishmael was with Hagar. Cain was cursed don’t forget the mark that was placed on him as was Ham. Moses disobeyed God and was never allowed to live in the promised land.

Seth inherited because he was the only obedient and righteous son after Abel. Right of birth has nothing to do with it. If you are cursed you are banished. Done.

Seth does not mean “replacement”!!!!!! Seth means “Appointed”. someone is lying to you badly. For a fact you are being lied too.

In the King James Bible word for word it is clear. In those days “To know someone” is to have had sexual intercourse with them. It clearly said , Adam KNEW EVE HIS WIFE!!!!! and she conceived, and there came Cain. She saw his sexual organs and knew it was a man not a female child. Then, out came the second son later. Abel. Cain turned evil and rebellious and Abel was obedient. Therefore because Cain was disobedient Abel would Rule over him. Cain murdered his brother instead of making things right.

Theologians agree that the word MAN in Genesis 4:1 is not 376 but better translated as 582. Even 376 talks about a man not a “creature”. Notice Genesis 4:17.

King James Bible And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.

Then look at Genesis 4:25: King James Bible And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.

we can do this all day long. You are being deceived by the Christian Identity Freemasonic Cult group. Get out of there…….

Gen 4:1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD. Gen 4:2 And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground. Gen 4:3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD. Gen 4:4 And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering: Gen 4:5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell. Gen 4:6 And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? Gen 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him. Gen 4:8 And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him.

My comment has to do with those conversing about whether or not Eve had sex with Satan.

Their ‘punishment’ has troubled me for decades and did not seem to make sense…. Unless, it is so, that Satan did sexually seduce Eve and teach her perhaps what we refer to as pornographic sex, and then she shared thus with Adam…(She partook of the fruit and then gave some to Adam there with her.)

Usually, the punishment fits the crime.

What happened and what was the punishment?

We were not present to really know…. But it is written: They suddenly realized they were ‘ naked’ and when they heard God looking for them, they ‘covered their genitals!!!’ If that were not enough to go this direction of thought, the woman was punished with: Pain in childbirth and a desire to ONE (-my addition) man…her husband. If it had been a pair of apple or peach, maybe they would have had to live on meat forever.???

Scripture points more towards the possibility that Cain and Able were twins, since ‘she continued in childbirth….’ Twins can be fathered by two men………..each having a different father.

Then God curses the serpent, Satan. Before attending church, when I read this portion of Genesis, I never would have connected its context with Jesus.

I would have thought that it meant ‘their would be enmity between Cain and Able, because of their different fathers and genes, one being so very wicked. Thus, they would physically fight, which did resulted in Cain, the wicked one killing Able, the more righteous one.

It wasn’t until I went to church, did I hear this meant Jesus the Messiah would thousands of years later, overcome Satan.

Thanks very much for your comments. Respectfully, I completely disagree with your conclusion that Eve had sexual relations with Satan. You wrote:

“My comment has to do with those conversing about whether or not Eve had sex with Satan.

Their ‘punishment’ has troubled me for decades and did not seem to make sense…. Unless, it is so, that Satan did sexually seduce Eve and teach her perhaps what we refer to as pornographic sex, and then she shared thus with Adam…(She partook of the fruit and then gave some to Adam there with her.)

Usually, the punishment fits the crime.”

I am not entirely sure as to why this theory keeps cropping up but there is absolutely nothing in the text of Genesis 3 that indicates any fornication taking place. It’s all based on reading sexualized thought into the text (i.e., “when the Bible says “eating fruit” it really means sex”). Even if I were to grant that to you, it still makes Genesis 2 illogical:

15 And the Lord God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it. 16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: 17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. – Genesis 2:15-17.

By your interpretation, The Lord authorized Adam to sleep with every being in the Garden except for Satan, which would never be the case. So the Serpent Seed theory falls apart on this point alone.

As for the punishment fitting the crime, let’s look to Scripture:

For the wages of sin is death.. – Romans 6:23.

Notice the verse uses the word “sin” in singular form. Any sin makes us guilty before God and condemned to Hell and the Lake of Fire. God gave Adam a clear law and he transgressed it, which by definition is sin. If this seems improper to you, then I would suggest you read verses on God’s holiness and consider how far short you fall of it. The Lord does not operate by man’s fallen, corrupted notion of fairness, “goodness” and justice. God is Holy and just to perfection. And we are to be Holy as He is holy.

Furthermore, if Cain were the seed of Satan, why would God have dealt so mercifully with him?

5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell. 6 And the Lord said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? 7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him. – Genesis 4:5-7.

Rather than come down on Cain for his faithless offering, God reasons with him and encourages him to improve. And even after Cain committed the first murder in human history, God was still merciful to him:

9 And the Lord said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother’s keeper? 10 And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother’s blood crieth unto me from the ground. 11 And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother’s blood from thy hand; 12 When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth. 13 And Cain said unto the Lord, My punishment is greater than I can bear. 14 Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me. 15 And the Lord said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the Lord set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him. – Genesis 4:9-15.

Cain lied to The Lord’s face to cover up his murder. And yet God, in love, still protected Cain from retaliation. Contrast this with the treatment of the Nephilim usurpers in the Promised Land.

When the Lord thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou; 2 And when the Lord thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them: – Deuteronomy 7:1-2.

Notice the stark difference? Why? Because these nations were the offspring of Nephilim hybrids. They were not of God’s creation and were corrupted to the core. They threatened the very existence of humanity and our salvation. These were “seeds of Satan.” Hence God’s command for their extermination.

So I think by the plain meaning of the text, the context of Genesis and searching through Scripture, your interpretation does not hold up. God bless. -B&E

This whole subject is fascinating and yet seems more convoluted and complicated. After spending my childhood and young adult years in Christian school and church, I am trying to studying Nephilim and Luciferian bloodline without pre conceived teachings. Today in scripture I read about Jacob’s grasp or intertwined limb with Esau’s heel. Reminding me of the prophetic words to Lucifer concerning Eve’s seed (will bruise Lucifer’s head) and Lucifer’s seed (will bruise the heel). Many say this refers to Jesus/cross. The same scenario of Lucifer alone with Eve and deceiving her to ultimately implant his seed is played out again! Lucifer (posing as the Lord) out of blue tells Rebekah that she will have twins (Surely ONLY God could know that. Right?). And without any reason at all, tells her that Jacob and not Esau (who is actually the firstborn and rightful heir of Isaac’s blessing) will be the recipient! Why wasn’t Isaac told this extremely important yet odd prophecy! She herself never even tells Isaac this very important so called Godly news! Makes sense now why Jacob was Rebekah’s favorite and yet not Isaac’s.

Even weirder and bizarre is Jacob’s dream or physical fight with a man/angel in the wilderness. He does not know Jacob’s name and and ignores Jacobs asking of his.Sounds nothing like an angel of the Lord God. Then of all things, Jacob demands a blessing. He finally gets one and is told his new name is Israel. Sarcastically saying it means “fought God and man and overcame”. Jacob then proclaims like an idiot that he has “seen God face to face and lived!” No one has done that. Refer to Exodus 33:20, John 1:18. To this day, Esau’s Edom land is not part of the prophesied area of today’s Israel.

To sum it up. I believe Gods prophecy for the Jews to have a specific land promised to them. But through the biblical heir Esau and not the lying thief Jacob who very possibly is a seed of Satan. Just because someone still has possession of something they stole never makes it rightfully theirs. And I am not pro Palestine in any way.

William, June 9, 2016. How you can arrive with the conclusion that it was Lucifer who pretended to be the Lord and gave Rebekkah knowledge about the two boys in her womb is beyond me.

The text and the Hebrew clearly speaks of Jehovah as being intreated by Isaac and who also spoke to Rebekkah. Gen 25:22, 23.

There are a number of instances where God reveals some thing to a wife or husband and not to the other.

God gives Hannah through Eli’s blessing the promise of a child – Samuel. The husband Elkanah doesn’t seem to know about it. God reveals to the mother (to be of Samson) the coming child who would deliver Israel and not to the husband. . ….to name a couple of examples.

Your references concerning no man can see God and live must be understood in the light of the whole Bible. Just as no man can come to Jesus except the Father draw him, so no man can see God except God Himself permits it. Jesus was fully God and fully man, yet the disciples saw Jesus for who He was. Jesus told Thomas, if you have seen Me you have seen the Father.

Moses Aaron and 70 of the elders saw God and yet ate and drank. Ex 24:11.

John saw God in the Revelation given to him, yet he lived to tell us about it.

Isaiah saw the Lord high and lifted up and lived to tell us about it.

As to Jacob speaking like an idiot as you put it. This was not the rantings of a fool, but of one who was desperate with God and insisted that the one who was wrestling with him, must bless him. Jesus tells us to press in to God the Father and be insisttent in prayer Luke 18; Mark 11, Matt 7: Luke 11, and so on.

When you become desperate enough with God because of extreme circumstanes pressing in on you, then you will understand William.

Every sinner who cries out to God for mercy is crying out for God’s blessing on their lives. Blind Bartimeaus would not shut up in the crowd until Jesus gave him what he needed most, his eyesight. may the Lord open our eyes William to see that God loves a deperate man…that is when true faith kicks in.

Do you not think it possible that there was nothing wrong with the offering given by Cain, but that it may have been in the spirit of the offering itself? That maybe Cain was upset that he had to give the best of his crop, thereby taking way from future plantings.

It is not possible for Cain to have been in the right. The Bible said that his sacrifice was not accepted. The sacrifice of innocent animals foreshadowed the coming messiah, who would also be the lanb of God. Abel and Cain were taught the same rules. The right thing for Cain to have done besides showing disobedience and pride, was to give Abel some of his crops in exchange for one of his lambs. The life is in the blood, veggies don’t have human blood, nor are veggies alive. Now a New ager would disagree that veggies don’t have a life that nature is in everything. I guess that is where we get the notion of a pet rock.

Actually good sirs, heart condition was everything here as far as sacrifices as God is the reader of all hearts. Cain was a farmer, taught by his father as his father had to learn the hard way. Cain was firstborn so he growing up saw the importance of raising crops or no one eats. Being children are imitators they follow closely their parents. Most firstborn boys want to be what their father’s are if their fathers are good fathers. That trait in humans stands true today. Abel chose a differet path, he was a shepherd and did not want to be exactly like his brother. There were many needs for other professions as this was the beginning of mankind. Abel sought a different kind of approval. If cain traded abel veggies for meat then cain would be getting still the second “fruits” of abel’s labors and not his best as Abel’s best would already be devoted to sacrifice. What if Abel’s other sheep were lame at the time so he was left with one good and sound one To give God, then what? So that wouldn’t be acceptable either for Cain to do that, to give the leftovers of another man’s offerings. Cain failed because he was not giving the best of the best nor the first and best fruits of his labor to God in order to be blessed. There was no Abrahamic promise nor mosaic arraingment at the time where the animals and there blood were focussed on the way they were in moses’ day onward, it was just Cain and Abel namely and their siblings. It wasn’t until a couple generations later where people started to call upon the name of God where the good news spread about a great cleansing until the flood came and wiped them all out including the giants, Gen 4:26. Yes the blood is Holy to God, but it’s about giving your finest and best only. Sacricing anything in general as long as it was your best to God is acceptable to Him, even our time and efforts preaching the good news that Christ came to do and all the prohets of long ago. These things are also acceptable sacrifices. God for us gave His best in His son Christ and Christ is reffered to as firstborn or “firstfruit” of all creation Col 1:15. It was and still is for all time the very best God gave. It just so happened to be His beloved son. So your both wrong and your both right. thanks.

@Rob, What you are describing is exactly what man is doing today. It is not Cain’s choice to give his labors but to be obedient to God. God treats all the same and we must obey his commands not make up a gospel WE THINK is better. The whole point of Sacrificing an innocent animal for man’s sins was ceremonial and obedient in anticipation of the sacrifice of Jesus, also innocent of any wrong doing and without any sin but died in our place that we may live. God said, the wages of sin is Death and without the remission of blood, there can be no forgiveness. Jesus was that sacrifice. Therefore, the sacrifice of an innocent animal took the place of that sacrifice until Jesus THE SAVIOR was to come along and be that sacrifice. Until that time, all the earth was pagan and without God. that was the reason for the flood to wipe out all the ungodly and physical abominations as well. God never changed after Noah the practice continued until the day of Calvary.

Able cannot establish the criteria. He a created being and he is subject to a higher power, GOD.

You gave what if;s and conditions that may or may not exist and more than likely did not exist. We on this earth cannot decide what the gospel will be. We are to obey to the letter what God has said through inspiration to men who were righteous and obedient to place in words what God wanted us to know. Its called the King James Bible. To mask this, Satan has counterfeited the gospel and deceived the word as evidence shows in the New alternative Bibles. He has done this through Freemasonry and Philosophy and religion. Jesus is not about religion or philosophy. The theology that they are promoting is the one Cain followed, HUMANISM.

Because Abel had Faith, He gave a better offer, and was seen as righteous in the Eyes of God.

By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh. Hebrews 11:4 (KJV)

I am trying to reply to tyomies April 13, 2014 comment on Cain being the offspring of Satan.

Tyomie, just a couple of questions for you and anybody else who believes that Satan had sex in some way with Eve to produce Cain. Why does God tell us that Cain brought his offering unto the Lord? If he was a seed of the Devil, he would not have bothered, he w ould have offerend something to Satan, no to the Lord who created heaven and earth. What did God say to Cain in Genesis 4:7? That he should rule over sin that was crouchiung at his door. God never addressed Satan in such a manner, nor would He recommend such an action to any creature who was an offspring of Satan or of a fallen angel.

Compare Jesus’ words to Peter in the Garden of Gethsemane – pray lest you enter into temptation, the spirit is willing and the flesh is weak, and earlier I have prayed for you that your faith fail not – and see if Jesus said any such thing to Judas who was a son of perdition.

What God said to Cain could have only been because of the fact that Cain should have and could have ruled over the sin coming against him – if he had cried out to His Creator for help. God does not deal with the evil spirits, fallen angels, Judas, or any unredeemable creatures as he did with Cain and Peter.

Thanks for your post. The “serpent seed” idea is a false teaching that has no Biblical support at all. I also am unaware of any ancient text that states it. What ancient writings were you referring to where you read this?

In addition to Collin’s response, which I am in agreement with, I just wanted to add this:

“And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.”

If the eating from the tree was supposedly a code for intimate relations, then what did Adam do that was a sin? Certainly not having relations with his wife. Yet Scripture is clear that Adam and Eve both sinned and Adam is given responsibility for bringing sin and death to the world. So I am curious as to how you interpret this passage.

@beginning and end, certainly the tree was a tree with fruit and the disobedience of eating from it to achieve the knowledge of Good and Evil was the sin. It was the first gospel. Genesis 4:1 does not indicate that Satan and Eve had sex. “I’ve gotten a man [meaning man-child] from the lord, her first one. Arnold Murray is wrong and Christian Identity have an agenda……Yes, the Serpent seed doctrine is not supported….nor is it possible.

The Nephilim were on earth before man was. I guess when you call the halfbreed children nephilim it is like a half Caucasian half Latin calling themselves Latin. Why were the nephilim created without female nephilim? That is tempting fate. Of course they were horny. If you have ever been in the Navy and you have 15 females and 200 males you will see what happens with fewer female then male ratio.

you mentioned philistines were apart of the nephilim. But when you read it says that Goliath was from Gath. He was not a philistine by linage. He and his family just lived there. Also in the story of David and Goliath the Israelites were only afraid of Goliath not the whole army. This must have been because he was different (in stature) from the rest of the warriors.

Thanks very much for your comments. Goliath and his family were indeed from Gath, which was a city in Philistia. So calling Goliath a Philistine or a Gittite, are both correct ways of describing him. And he was most certainly a Nephilim giant.

As for the rest of the army, I agree. Goliath was the giant and the clear leader. In these nations that had Nephilim this far from the flood, there were giants interspesred through them, who were rulers. By the days of King David, they were no longer dominating the human race. This is a long time after the flood and hundreds of years after the initial entry into the Promised Land when Joshua destroyed most of them. God bless. -B&E

THIS INTERPRETATION IS WRONG……THE BIBLE kiNG jAMES ORGINAL SAYS THAT THE WOMEN OF THE MEN OF EARTH–MATED WITH THE SONS OF GOD–((THE SUPERNATURAL ONES)) BECA– USE THE nEPHILIM WAS ALREADY ON THIS EARTH–NO EVIL CAN COME FROM GOD>>>> AND THE GOOD CAME FROM THE MATING OF GODS’ SONS LIKE HERCULIES –DAVID—- SAMSON–AND MANY MORE—-IF YOU READ GEN CORRECTLY—- THE NEPHILIM WAS ON THE EARTH WAY BEFORE THE WOMEN MATED……THEY COULD NOT BEAT THE EVILNESS OF THE STRENGTH OF THE NEPHILIM–AND THE OTHER GREAT CLUE—AFTER THE FLOOD THE BIBLE SAID THE NEPHILIM WAS HERE ON THIS EARTH—BEFORE AND AFTER THE FLOOD—SO STOP SPEADING THIS FALSE FALLACY …THE HIDDEN EVIL IS THE NEPHILIM RIGHT NOW ON THIS EARTH–AND THEY HAVE MANY FOOLED—-

And in the lasts days the rocks will speak. also on this genealogy Mary was pure God over shadowed hear an she became fertile wit Jesus, Mary and Joesph were from the same bloodline but he didn’t impregnate Mary

I have been studiying tt is lentexactlsimilar to my conclusion, of corse much more detailed, I have learn a lot from thnt aanswea q article, I have a questionr? Being so clear why it is not mentioned , ??almost never, by the preachers? Thanks.

With all due respect the arguments in this video are inadequate as it does not deal with a great deal Scriptures in the Old Testament that demonstrate that fallen angels did indeed have illicit unions with human women. In fact, he waits until past the 16:00 mark before he even starts to deal with any of the Biblical text at all. So let’s look at his main argument.

1)Violates Immediate Context — He says there were no angels in the immediate context. Well if you don’t believe “sons of god” means angels, well then of course this point is right. But he is wrong because b’nai ha elohim in fact does mean angels. Elohim is the plural of god and angels are referred to as gods many times in the old Testament (i.e., Psalm 82). We see this again confirmed in Job 1 and 2 where the sons of God are clearly angels. The video author says comparing the term in Job to Genesis is “illogical.” But it is logical because Bible interprets itself by itself. 1 Corinthians 2 says:

“Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.”

Scripture is spiritual. Jesus said His words are spirit. We are to learn from the Holy Ghost by comparing Scripture (spirit) to Scripture (spirit). This is how God instructs us to learn the Bible:

“Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. 10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:” (isaiah 28:9-11)

We are to take precepts from different parts of the Bible and build them on each other to “understand doctrine” and really get into the “meat” of the Bible. Thus we are to compare. Notice the author of the video does not mention this but credits his BIblical knowledge to his Professor and “hermeneutics.” The Bible says nothing about hermeneutics or using them. I choose the methods commanded by The Lord.

Furthermore, Job 38 states that the sons of God existed BEFORE the Earth was even created (38:15). At this point, they could not possibly be human. He does not even address this.

Another flaw is that he states that the Bible does not say giants “in the original Hebrew.” What he does not realize is that he is using a modern Bible version that is not translated from “original Hebrew” which would be paleo-Hebrew. His Bible version is translated from squared, Masoretic Hebrew which was created centuries after Our Lord Christ and added vowels which paleo-Hebrew does not have. The only Old Testament copy today that is translated from paleo-Hebrew is the Septuagint (which I quote from all throughout this series). And it indeed does say giants. Now someone doing a serious theological examination should be aware of this.

He concludes by saying there is no indication that angels are in view in Genesis 6. But this begs the question…Then why were the offspring giants? Why were they from 9-30+ feet tall (as will be shown in Part 2)? Why were these particular offspring ‘men of renown’? And furthermore, why did God bring the flood and then a subsequent campaign to wipe out any nations that had giants among them? There is just so much in Scripture this video does not deal with. I know there are 3 other parts, but this video demonstrates that the author is not really taking on the substance of Biblical texts that shows that there were angels having illicit unions with human women.

Finally, we would of course have to ask the meaning of Jude when it states:

“And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire”

Jude is detailing the punishment of angels who fell into the sin of fornication who are now locked in chains in the abyss. How do you interpret this verse? I look forward to your response. God bless you abundantly and thanks for taking the time to read the article.

With all due respect, I probably won’t get to watching all 3 videos, as I did not find the first one that compelling and I am working on the other articles for the series. But if there is a point he makes that you would like my thoughts on, I’d be glad to respond. Which synonyms are you referring to that you like?

Well I know one of the evidence statements that is used for the fallen angel view is that b’nai ha elohim always refers to angels. I think that is a pretty critical evidence for the fallen angel view. However, in the video he showed that it is not necessarily the case through the use of synonyms. Did you see that part? I was unable to prove that point wrong.

Also, since you don’t plan to watch his videos I will answer the questions you brought up, because I asked him the same questions. lol

What is the Jude verse all about?

He would say that it is not directly connected or referencing Genesis 6 and that it is generally accepted that when satan fell, he﻿ took rebellious angels with him. So it is entirely plausible that this is what is being referenced. It does not necessarily prove a Gen. 6 connection. That is part of the flaw in the the fallen angel view. It assumes to be true more than it proves to be true.

And when he said that I couldn’t argue with him because when I read the passage in Jude it is more of an assumption that it’s referring to Genesis 6 than a fact.

Another point he made that made sense was when asked why you had really tall people in the Old Testament, he responded by saying: “People were quite different back in these days. People lived to be 600 years old..”

B’nai ha Elohim — I don’t really get his point there. He was basically saying that just because the term means angels in the book of Job does not mean it is the same in Genesis. Is that what you’re referring to?

He would say that it is not directly connected or referencing Genesis 6 and that it is generally accepted that when satan fell, he﻿ took rebellious angels with him. So it is entirely plausible that this is what is being referenced. It does not necessarily prove a Gen. 6 connection. That is part of the flaw in the the fallen angel view. It assumes to be true more than it proves to be true.

“When Satan fell he took his rebellious angels with him” — What does this mean in the context of Scripture? Yes, Satan and 1/3 of the angels rebelled. But they are free to roam the earth and the skies. We know Satan is not locked in a prison. So why would any angels be? Jude explains why they are imprisoned:

And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

The text could not be any clearer. The angels who are presently imprisoned in the abyss were punished for fornication. That’s just the plain meaning. Which is why I asked how do YOU interpret this passage?

If you need more evidence that this is referring to Genesis 6, then you look to 2 Peter:

For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; 5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;

Again we see the angels who sinned being cast into hell (remember Satan is NOT in Hell – Satan roams the Earth seeking who he may devour). And they are being connected to the time of Noah. And we are only even referring to these verses because the author of the video inexplicably says that “sons of God” does not mean angels, even though that’s what it means everywhere else in the OT and we are told the sons of God existed before the creation of the Earth (Job 38).

As for the height being because of age, for one the Bible does not say that. It says that giants came because of the intercourse between the sons of God and the daughters of men. Furthermore, the long lifespans were due to the hyperbaric atmosphere that existed on Earth before the flood (see Genesis 2:5). After the flood, the topography and atmosphere of the Earth radically changed and thus lifepsans drop sharply. Yet hundreds of years after the flood, there are still giants. And if everyone was a giant back then, why would the Israelites have been scared at all when the spies went to scout the Promised Land? If everyone was big, what was there to worry about? It does not follow logically.

Again, I do not think the video makes compelling, Biblically based arguments. But thanks for sharing more of its points. God bless.

B E you are right about ‘going after strange flesh’ – it is definitely connected with fornication, Re Gen 19. Paul tells us that there are different kind of flesh; one of birds, one of fish, one of beasts, one of men. These flesh types are ‘known’. The unknown one is ‘angels’.

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What about the word “also” in Genesis 6? After watching a number of videos, and two bible studies, reading the book of Enoch, and the book of Jasher as non scripture, I can not call myself an expert on this yet but I have to agree with the angel view at this point. The “Sons of Seth- Daughters of Cain interpretation leaves me wondering about so many things in the bible. But, the Angel view answers a lot of questions. Still, I was NOT convinced, until I saw the following passage…. talk about needing to take scripture on its face. I had to ask myself…. what exactly did God mean by the word “ALSO” here??? Is this word also in the Hebrew and the Greek? Because if it is, God is being very plain. Man is also flesh, so, something else is flesh in addition, at least, at this time.

Genesis 6:3 KJV And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he ALSO is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

This is a phenomenal point. I had never considered this before. You actually got me right to researching and while I have not gone through the whole Old Testament yet, I can tell you that the Hebrew גַּם or “gam” which means also, is only used 3 times in the book of Genesis (since it is an adverb it is used in other senses 5 other times, but its use as “also” is all that is relevant for this discussion). In all 3 instances, it used to compare two people or two groups. I will definitely look into this more though and get back to you. Thanks for bringing up this very interesting argument. You are searching the Scriptures very, very carefully. God bless you abundantly.

i was instantly touched to see Linda explain that she is no expert, however, she saids, “I had to ask myself…. what exactly did God mean by the word “ALSO” here???”,

Her seeking God and taking the challenge of what it is to rightly divide and decern the word of GOD, is breath taking…all one needs to to is ask God and he will lead you to understanding, im tearing up as i write this.

With all due respect, my points have not been adequately addressed at all. I took the time to go into extreme detail into the Hebrew of the text to make valid points. Instead of dealing with those facts, you played the “paleo-Hebrew” game and ran to the Septuagint translation for support. However, most who understand translation also understand that translation can be accurate or inaccurate in its representation of the original.

My video series on this topic is 5 videos so far, and I’m not done yet. The use of the term “giant” in the Septuagint no more proves that giants are the offspring of angel/human sexual relations than the fact that a person who is small in stature could be called a “giant” of a man proves the small man was actually tall. The word has more than one meaning, and this explains why “giant” may at times be substituted for the Hebrew “Gibor” in the Septuagint.

While your answer to my video points sounds “spiritual” and pious, it is ultimately ignorant and dangerous. You can’t just interpret Scripture willy nilly, and compare what should not or cannot be rationally compared. You can take one part of Scripture, “Judas hanged himself,” and combine it with “Go thou and do likewise,” and end up foolishly authorizing and validating suicide. It’s called the fallacy of “collapsing contexts.” And so one of my valid points is, just because the “sons of God” in Job appear to be angelic, that in and of itself cannot prove that all other instances of the term “sons of God” must be angels. What about the New Testament usage? There the “sons of God” are clearly human believers. And even in the OT, humans are ALSO called “sons of the Most High” and other terms synonymous with benai ha Elohim.

I have done my homework quite extensively, and to dismiss my extensively researched videos based on nothing more (in my view) than your bias for this position is ridiculous. Remaining ignorant of valid points against your position is not wise. There are so many basic problems with the “fallen angels” view of Gen. 6 that it is no wonder that it was overturned in theological circles with what is called the “Sethite” view.

Thanks for your comments. I did not write my comments to address the points of your video. A reader asked me to watch your video and I obliged. Please note that as I said in my comment I did not watch your entire series. So I did not give the impression that I was addressing all of your videos nor will I be doing so.

We clearly have vastly different methods of interpreting the Bible. You called the analysis of paleo-Hebrew a “game” and look down upon the Septuagint for no apparent reason. Have you studied Hebrew? You say that “translation can be accurate or inaccurate in its representation of the original.” This is a rather general statement that frankly does not refute anything I said in my comment or the article. Nor does it indict the Septuagint. If you have a specific charge you want to bring against the text, then do so by all means, but just saying “we all know translations can be wrong” does not advance an argument, especially in light of the fact that over 90% of the quotes of Old Testament scripture by The Lord Jesus Christ and the Apostles are directly from the Septuagint.

You also say this:

You can’t just interpret Scripture willy nilly, and compare what should not or cannot be rationally compared. You can take one part of Scripture, “Judas hanged himself,” and combine it with “Go thou and do likewise,” and end up foolishly authorizing and validating suicide. It’s called the fallacy of “collapsing contexts.” And so one of my valid points is, just because the “sons of God” in Job appear to be angelic, that in and of itself cannot prove that all other instances of the term “sons of God” must be angels.

I completely disagree with you here. First of all, the Bible tells us to use Scripture to interpret Scripture. And comparing “Judas hanged himself” to “go thou and do likewise” is a nonsensical comparison. When I say comparing Scripture with Scripture, I am talking about multiple uses of the same word or phrase. The sons of God in Job do not appear to be angelic. They are angels. The New Testament use of the phrase would obviously have to be viewed in light of the fact that we are now dealing with Greek and not Hebrew but that does not change the consistency of the use of the phrase (there are clear Biblical reasons for why John used that phrase and why it is indeed consistent with the Old Testament). As for the phrase “sons of the most high”, there is no such phrase in the Old testament of the King James Bible.

I have every right to disagree with your video and I stand by my critique of the initial video. There is no reason to take such a hostile, antagonistic tone because we happen to disagree on a theological issue. I hope that this discussion can take on a more civil tone. Or we can just simply agree to disagree.

Hello B&E (I’ll use this for short). First of all, I fail to see how you can discern any kind of “tone” from mere text. My “tone,” to make this clear, was not hostile. I strongly disagree with your view for many valid reasons, but I am not hostile to you or your view, especially because I used to believe that the “sons of God” of Genesis 6 were angels. But after more careful and detailed study, I have come to realize that my prior view simply does not hold up. And the reasons for this view I have been posting on YouTube in a video series that is now 5 videos long.

Second, you may have a right to disagree with my video, but to argue against a SERIES that you have not viewed in its entirety is unwise. You cannot adequately judge a book you have not completely read, nor a movie you have not completely viewed. Some of my vids are over 40 minutes long, and I go into great detail in the Hebrew and Greek.

You ask me if I studied Hebrew. Yes, on the graduate level. I can sight read it and also write in it. I also taught myself NT Greek, and later had my knowledge verified by a State Department of Education accredited university in New York. I later also took NT Greek on the graduate level. All my original languages grades are top of my class. I no longer just rely on a “King James” translation, which, like many translations, has mistranslations in it.

Third, I called your use of an argument about paleo-Hebrew a game because those of us (like my Hebrew professor) who know Hebrew know that your argument is totally invalid and amounts to no more that a “game.” I do not look down on the Septuagint. I just understand it and its nature. The etymology of the word possibly mistranslated as “giants” is unclear. My research on it continues. But the translators of the KJV would “translate” different Hebrew words into “giant’ when the original word did not necessarily mean “giant.” This is a fact that cannot be ignored or dismissed with ad hoc claims about “paleo-Hebrew.”

Fourth, your claim on this forum about the use of the English word “folly” and how the Bible uses it is also fundamentally flawed. You have no regard for context (folly is not always sexual in the Bible), and you ignore the fact that in every case of sexual “folly’ you presented a DIFFERENT Hebrew word is used than the one used in Job 4:13-18. So not only is the context different, but the Hebrew words are as well.

Fifth, I never said that the phrase “sons of the Most High” was in the OT of the “King James Bible.” It does exist, however, in the original Hebrew of Psalm 82:6, from which the KJV was translated.

And finally, my general statement stands. Translations are nice and good, but only so far as they are accurately translated. I also stand by my point that you are engaging in the fallacy of collapsing contexts in your attempt to interpret Scripture with itself. There is a right way to interpret Scripture, and a wrong way, and I believe your way is incorrect in many ways, which accounts for your “fallen angel” view of Genesis 6. You cannot assume that the “sons of God” in Genesis must be angels just because they may be angels somewhere else. The CONTEXT of Gen. 6 must tell you this in light of the entire Bible (not mistranslations of it). I would suggest you actually view my entire series, as I will be addressing every pertinent passage you bring up (Jude, etc), and the invalid arguments people try to use to support your view.

Thanks for getting back to me. Once again, I did not comment on your entire video series. I made it abundantly clear in my comment that I only watched the initial video and gave my thoughts on it because it was asked of me. You chose to do your presentation in a manner that was not compelling to me. It is my right and prerogative to say same. It is important that when you are putting content in the public view on bible topics (whether it’s a video, article, radio show, etc.) to know that there are going to be varying opinions on it. We (meaning you and I) have chosen to do this and thus have to be able to deal with people who disagree with us. Disagreement is not disrespect. I don’t really want to carry a full-on debate but I will address some of your points:

Third, I called your use of an argument about paleo-Hebrew a game because those of us (like my Hebrew professor) who know Hebrew know that your argument is totally invalid and amounts to no more that a “game.” I do not look down on the Septuagint. I just understand it and its nature. The etymology of the word possibly mistranslated as “giants” is unclear.

You have now repeated that this is a “game”, but you have provided no evidence as to why the Septuagint is an invalid source. You have provided no evidence as to its errors and you have provided no evidence of the translators having issues with the etymology of the word “giant.” These are assertions that you should have ready historical resources to support (especially give that you have studied these specific issues).

In Numbers 13 we see the same term for “giant” used in the Septuagint that we see in Genesis 6:

” 33 And they brought a horror of that land which they surveyed upon the children of Israel, saying, The land which we passed by to survey it, is a land that eats up its inhabitants; and all the people whom we saw in it are men of extraordinary stature. 34 And there we saw the giants [gigantes]; and we were before them as locusts, yea even so were we before them. ”

The context of the passage is the first source for the definition of a term. And here there is no question as to the meaning. The giants were indeed, giants. Men of superhuman height.

Fourth, your claim on this forum about the use of the English word “folly” and how the Bible uses it is also fundamentally flawed. You have no regard for context (folly is not always sexual in the Bible), and you ignore the fact that in every case of sexual “folly’ you presented a DIFFERENT Hebrew word is used than the one used in Job 4:13-18. So not only is the context different, but the Hebrew words are as well.

Again, we are looking at context. What my point is that int the ENGLISH version of the KJV Bible, the word “folly” refers to sexual activity. I even provided a different translation from the Septuagint, which uses “perverseness” which again denotes illicit sexual activity. The translators, understanding the context of the various passages I cited (which all clearly were about wrongful sexual acts) opted to use the word “folly.” And the use in Job 4:18 is completely consistent with that.

The sons of God in Job chapters 1 and 2 are angels. The “children of the most high” in Psalm 82 are angels (again, something referenced in this article). So to say the “sons of God” in Genesis 6 whose offspring were supernaturally sized men who became legends of the ancient world, were “mere humans” is actually an assumption on your part. The text does not support you.

I know that you are very passionate about this issue and I completely respect that. I anticipate that we will remain at variance on this. But I think that the use of the Septuagint and the method of interpretation that relies on actual context and the Scriptures defining themselves by themselves are a valid way of understanding this text.

i’ve read some of Peter’s posts and as far as he goes i think he’s being robbed to pay paul. i mean that he is not having an objective veiw of these issues and he too is being led astray from the truth. it’s the blind leading the blind. who is more the fool, the fool himself or the fools that follow the fool?

You made good points about the sons of God being angels. However, I might suggest you take a second look at the Septuagint. It is not 285 BC. The Septuagint and Apocrypha were formulated by Origen, around the 3rd century, to water down the received scrolls and manuscripts he received from the real Christians in Antioch (Not to be confused with teh religion of Christianity), but Christians who followed Jesus. Anyway, he corrupted the versions he received and these were picked up by Eusebius for Constantine in the 4th century.

Thank you for your comments. With respect to the Septuagint, I must respectfully but very strongly disagree. Your assertion is that it was “created” by Origen in the 3rd Century AD. Portions of the Septuagint were found with the Dead Sea Scrolls, which date to at least 400 years before Origen, if not even older than that. You can find evidence of this here. Or just look on Wikipedia.

So on this point alone the “Origen created the Septuagint” theory falls apart completely. It was created well before his life and there are a number of historical documents that support this. But additionally, looking at the KJV, the overwhelming majority of New Testament quotes of the Old testament are from the Septuagint. It was clearly the “Bible” (since the Bible was just the Old Testament at that time) used by The Lord and His disciples). The Septuagint even harmonizes better with the KJV New testament than the KJV Old Testament. Here is just one simple example:

“And said unto him, Hearest thou what these say? And Jesus saith unto them, Yea; have ye never read, Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings thou hast perfected praise?” – Matthew 2:16

In this passage, The Lord is quoting Psalm 8. In the KJV we read:

Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings hast thou ordained strength because of thine enemies, that thou mightest still the enemy and the avenger. -Psalm 8:2

In the Septuagint we read:

Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings hast thou perfected praise, because of thine enemies; that thou mightest put down the enemy and avenger. -Psalm 8:2.

It’s clear that the Septuagint has the more accurate translation and was much closer to the version that Christ The Lord was using if not just being the exact version The Lord was using. The reason for this is simple, the Jews in Judea at that time spoke and read Greek. And the Septuagint was translated from Paleo-Hebew. The Masoretic Text was translated from squared Hebrew, a later version of Hebrew created centuries after Christ.

So I give zero credence to the Eusebius fabrication theory (and the same goes for any notion that Constantine “selected” books of the Bible or somehow altered them – there is no historical support for any of this). So while I appreciate your zeal, I believe you are mistaken. God bless.

Thank you for your response. I have to tell you, that Paul met Jesus on the Road to Damascus and therefore became an apostle. He never copied or seven seen the Septuagint since this is in fact a Jesuit and Freemasonry lie from the pits. I gave the evidence which was bordering on “off topic” about the true state of the World’s education roots based on biased educators from every college in the USA. Europe is no different. The Jesuits tried to assassinate King James with the Gun powder plot; and they failed. God is way ahead of any man made effort and fallen angel effort or satanic effort to stop his word. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

The true history of the Septuagint is being kept back from the mainstream colleges and theologians to be by a corrupt and Humanistic education based on deception rather than true education and this comes with the quotes I presented that you will not refute. Try as you will it won’t happen. Deny of all of you would like to, but its to no avail. You will not fool nor hide your heart from God.

The True story of the Septuagint which is as someone said before is also known as the LXX is a translation of the Hebrew Bible into the Greek language. The name “Septuagint” comes from the Latin word for seventy. The stated tradition is that 70 (or 72) Jewish scholars were the translators behind the Septuagint. The Septuagint was translated in the third and second centuries B.C. in Alexandria, Egypt. As Israel was under the authority of Greece for several centuries, the Greek language became more and more common. By the 2nd and 1st centuries B.C., most people in Israel spoke Greek as their primary language. That is why the effort was made to translate the Hebrew Bible into Greek, so that those who did not understand Hebrew could have the Scriptures in a language they could understand. The Septuagint represents the first major effort at translating a significant religious text from one language into another. However, the earliest version was 150 BC and included only a few books of the Old testament as they copied the OT to set up the basis of the Septuagint that Origen finished.

So the “legend” goes like this, “The Septuagint is claimed to have been translated between 285-246 BC during the reign of Ptolemy II Philadelphus of Alexandria, Egypt. His librarian, supposedly Demetrius of Phalerum, persuaded Philadelphus to get a copy of the Hebrew Scriptures. Then the Scriptures (at least Genesis to Deuteronomy) were translated into the Greek language for the Alexandrian Jews. This part of the story comes from early church historian Eusebius (260-339 AD). Scholars then claim that Jesus and His apostles used this Greek Bible instead of the preserved Hebrew text.”

However, The whole argument that the Hebrew scriptures were translated into Greek before the time of Christ rests upon a single document. All other historical evidence supporting the argument either quotes or references this single letter. In this so-called Letter of Aristeas, the writer presents himself as a close confidant of king Philadelphus. He claims that he persuaded Eleazar, the high priest, to send with him 72 scholars from Jerusalem to Alexandria, Egypt. There they would translate the Hebrew Scriptures into Greek, forming what we now call the Septuagint.

Even Jewish historian Josephus, Jewish mystic Philo (both first century AD) and others add to the story. Some say the 72 were shut in separate cells and “miraculously” wrote each of their versions word-for-word the same. They say that this proves “divine inspiration” of the entire Septuagint.

Thus, the Septuagint is claimed to exist at the time of Jesus and the apostles, and that they quoted from it instead of the preserved Hebrew text. This story has been passed around for centuries.

Now, what are the verifiable facts according to research; to make a long story short, I could go on but will end it with the following. For the Old Testament Christians have the Preserved Words of God in the Hebrew Masoretic text. For the New Testament The King James Translators who are REAL scholars and not like we have today or Jesuit deceivers. The 47 translators collected the 5,000-plus manuscripts in Greek, plus the many early translations spread abroad, to witness to the actual words of Christ and His apostles.

Tthe Septuagint story is a hoax. It was not written before Christ; so it was not used by Jesus or His apostles. It is the only set of manuscripts to include the Apocrypha mixed in with the books of the Bible, so as to justify the Roman Catholic inclusion of them in their Bibles. And it is just those same, perverted Alexandrian codices not worth 2 cents, and the same ones that mess up the New Testament of modern Bibles today and dressed up in pretty packaging. We will not come an agreement and what I have told you are facts not like the cleverly hoaxs and deception created by the Vatican, Illuminati and secret societies. Good luck on your endeavor, I did like your article but I read it with caution.

Thanks for your response. However I noticed that you did not address my point. Septuagint manuscripts were found with the Dead Sea Scrolls, thus placing them 400 years before Eusebius and before the First Coming of The Lord to Earth. So any theory that says they were fabricated in 300 AD is automatically incorrect. I am not sure how you can continue in your train of thought without addressing this very glaring and compelling piece of evidence that works against you.

I am very familiar with the story of the origin of the Septuagint. Where I take issue with you is that you say “the legend” is false without providing any evidence to that demonstrates it being false. Furthermore, you seem to submit that Josephus and Philo, both 1st century Jewish historians, wrote about the Septuagint (a point I wholeheartedly agree with). So if they wrote about it, how is that Eusebius “invented it” 200 years later? Don’t you see the contradiction here??

I also want to share a commentary from the translators of the Potters Standard Edition KJV Bible of 1871:

“The most remarkable translation of the Old Testament into Greek is called the Septuagint, which, if the opinion of some eminent writers is to be credited, was made in the reign of Ptolemy Philadelphus, about 270 years before the Christian era. At any rate, it is undoubtedly the most ancient that is now extant. The five books of Moses were translated first in the time of Ptolemy Philadelphus, King of Egypt, and others were added until the whole Old Testament was finished, and the version dates about 270 years before the birth of Christ. The transcendent value of this version may be seen from the extensive usage that it had attained in Jewish synagogues, from the fact that our blessed Lord and the apostles habitually quoted from it, and also from the fact that it helped to determine the state of the Hebrew text at the time when the version was made. Besides, it establishes, beyond all doubt, the point that our Lord and his inspired apostles recognized the duty of rendering the Word into the vulgar tongue of all people so that all men might, in their own speech, hear the wonderful things of the Lord. All the authors of the New Testament appear to have written in the Greek language. That this tongue was already familiar to them as a vehicle to express God’s inspired Word is evident from their frequent use of the Greek translation, the Septuagint, in quoting the Old Testament and from the remarkable accordance of their style with the style of that ancient and precious version.”

So even KJV translators in the 19th century affirmed the Septuagint as a valid source of Scripture.

I also wonder why you did not address the passage where The Lord quotes Psalm 8, clearly using the language of the Septuagint and not the KJV? I will provide more examples:

And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? 1 Peter 4:18

Many people do not know that the Apostle Peter is quoting the Old Testament here because most versions do not have it translated accurately. Here is the KJV and Septuagint:

Proverbs 11:31 (LXX): “If the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?”

Proverbs 11:31 (KJV): “Behold, the righteous shall be recompensed in the earth: much more the wicked and the sinner.”

The Septuagint version is clearly what is being quoted.

Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble. – James 4:6.

Again, this is a verse that many Bible students do not realize is a quote from the Old Testament (even thought James uses the phrase “he saith” indicating that he is quoting someone). It’s again from the book of Proverbs.

Proverbs 3:34 (LXX): “The Lord resists the proud; but he gives grace to the humble.”

Proverbs 3:34 (KJV): “Surely he scorneth the scorners: but he giveth grace unto the lowly.”

Again, the Septuagint translation is what is being quoted. Without question.

“But in vain do they worship me, Teaching as their doctrines the precepts of men.” – Matthew 15:9.

We will take one last look (for now):

Isaiah 29:13 (LXX): “…but in vain do they worship me, teaching the commandments and doctrines of men.”

Isaiah 29:13 (KJV): “…and their fear of me is a commandment of men which hath been taught them…”

The Lord is clearly quoting the Septuagint translation verbatim. The connotation is basically the same in the KJV, but the wording of the Septuagint is spot on. Again this is due to the fact that Hebrew had greatly changed by the time the original manuscripts of the Masoretic texts were written.

I humbly ask that you address these issues if you are going to say the Septuagint is a fabrication or Jesuit plot. How could The Lord and Apostles have quoted it so often then?

Before I retire tonight and continue tomorrow, I will say this earnestly. The reality is that the highest level scholars in both the Vatican from the Pope down to the last Priest; and the Jewish “scholars” without a doubt cannot be trusted and their work is based on a biased religious and scholarly perspectives which in effect negates an entire religious and educational system to virtually useless. The term Christianity itself is corrupted as this “religion” was for the most part started and corrupted by a pagan named Constantine who named himself a Christian to win over the Christians since the senseless slaughter of those that followed Jesus failed to eliminate followers but in fact was gaining popularity due to the loyalty of real Christians maintained even while being slaughtered by the Romans. Even beginning in 1200 to 1800 AD the continued Roman Catholic church MURDERED between 50 to 68 million people in this 600 year period. In the 16th century the vatican murdered between 70,000 to 100,000 French Huguenots in one week, at St Bartholomew massacre ….and I know in the early 1940’s the USTASHA murdered 750, 000 Serb Orthodox Christians, 60,000 Jews and 26,000 Gypsies in Camp Jasenovac, Roman Catholic concentration camp. .Even Bishop Stepinac was to be made a saint?? The point here is anything coming from The Israeli Jewish scholars and Roman Catholic clergy cannot be credible and in reality cannot even be taken in context as legit. The current Protestant churches even today cannot be trusted because in fact they are mostly controlled by 501 C3 tax exempt status that secretly allows the government to threaten the churches and demand they use certain Bibles and teach or preach on certain subjects. I know also for a fact that the Roman Catholic church will undergo a complete “re-spiritualization” that will destroy most Catholics that will lead to the New Age Movement set up to infiltrate into the RCC by the Father of the New Age Movement, a Jesuit Priest named Teilhard de Chardin…Father of the New Age Movement co-chair….with Blavatsky as the mother of the New Age.

Main point is this. These sources for sure no matter what they write about whatever subject they cannot be trusted.

So, granted, in a few occasions the Dead Sea Scrolls agree with the Masoretic text several times, But in a few cases, such as where the readings of say Deuteronomy 32:43 do vary in ancient copies of the Hebrew text, it is not fair to say that the Septuagint translators were simply making things up as they were doing their work. There are some scholars that I read about, are even suggesting that perhaps the Septuagint translators were relying on Hebrew texts that predate what we currently have in the standard Masoretic text! If this is the case, it is quite possible that the New Testament writers were perhaps more accurate in quoting the “original” Old Testament texts than what we typically find today in most modern Bible translations of the Old Testament . Therefore, to charge that the New Testament writers were sloppy or fraudulent simply lacks the evidence.

Around 150 BC the alleged Septuagint consisted of only parts of Deu. and parts of another book that I do not recall just this minute. The whole Septuagint was written around 100 AD by Origen. The scholars from then to now have literally lied and fabricated evidence to discredit the only true word of God KJV. So, Origen pretty much made up a Greek Bible by pasting together his own Greek Old Testament, mixed with some Folk Tales, called the Apocrypha and added his own perverted New Testament. It had to look like the real ones……..he made it look old, and added books. So he put together the his old Testament and the Apocrypha and called it the “ancient Septuagint.

The Potters issue is worthless. You see, this is busted. Westcott and Hort were both Freemasons and that right there disqualifies them as scholars. They were evil and in fact were actually Warlocks of the Satanist order. The revision committee laid the groundwork for the modern day Bibles, all of them and in accordance with their own letters had plotted to make subtle changes to the Bible that few would detect. In other words working for the corrupted vatican and Jesuits who would murder their own mothers if told too……and Knowing the Jesuits I’m sure you would agree, cancels out the 1871 revision committee which did not in fact touch the KJV.

1873 – Timothy Dwight (Skull & Bones, 1849) was subsequently added to the American New Testament revision committee. Timothy Dwight, who became the President of Yale University, was the grandson of Rev. Timothy Dwight (1752-1817) who was the grandson of famous Rev. Jonathan Edwards (1703-1758), a personal friend of Pres. George Washington, a high-level Freemason

This is only the beginning of exposing the lying Freemasons, Knights of Malta and Pope’s (All three of them) that I expose daily along with the Italian Illuminati, if I wanted to continue. I see that you are not following up earnestly and it disappoints me that you would even think about bringing up the 1871 revision which was not of God but of Satan no question.

I do like your work on the Nephilim with some caution that I fixed, but I found that I had to recheck just to make sure especially now…..

I shall use this exchange to expose that satanic Revision committee from the data I collected tonight and thank you.

Thanks for your response. I have to say I am disappointed in the turn this discussion has taken. You have brought up a number of points that while interesting, bear no relevance on the issue at hand – the validity of the Septuagint. Your initial assertion was that Eusebius fabricated the Septuagint in the 4th century AD. I have shown clearly that this was not the case as the Septuagint predates him by over 500 years. Bringing up Westcott & Hort and corrupted versions is highly irrelevant. Westcott & Hort have nothing to do with the Septuagint. So your mentioning them or the Revision Committee (the Revision Committee did not make the Potters Standard KJV -which is an 1810 version) is not relevant.

As for Josephus and Philo, I did not bring them up because I endorse their theology. I bring them up because they lived in the 1st century AD and they wrote about the Septuagint. Therefore it’s obvious it existed before 100 AD (which you are now alleging with no evidence whatsoever). You have now switched from Eusebius and claim Origen wrote the Septuagint in 100AD. This ignores the fact thatOrigen was not even born until 184AD. Don’t you see the errors in your argument? And claiming a conspiracy and presuming to know someone’s motivations is not a strong form of argument absent evidence. Do you have any proof of this at all? The Hexapla, which Origen drafted, was just a compilation of the more common Bible versions of that time. Not a creation of a new version.

So in the interest of showing actual historical evidence and proof, I will present the writings of Justin Martyr in which he affirms the validity of the Septuagint:

“Ptolemy, king of Egypt, when he had built the library in Alexandria, and by gathering books from every quarter had filled it, then learnt that very ancient histories written in Hebrew happened to be carefully preserved; and wishing to know their contents, he sent for seventy wise men from Jerusalem, who were acquainted with both the Greek and Hebrew language, and appointed them to translate the books; and that in freedom from all disturbance they might the more speedily complete the translation, he ordered that there should be constructed, not in the city itself, but seven stadia off (where the Pharos was built), as many little cots as there were translators, so that each by himself might complete his own translation; and enjoined upon those officers who were appointed to this duty, to afford them all attendance, but to prevent communication with one another, in order that the accuracy of the translation might be discernible even by their agreement. And when he ascertained that the seventy men had not only given the same meaning, but had employed the same words, and had failed in agreement with one another not even to the extent of one word, but had written the same things, and concerning the same things, he was struck with amazement, and believed that the translation had been written by divine power, and perceived that the men were worthy of all honor, as beloved of God; and with many gifts ordered them to return to their own country. And having, as was natural, marveled at the books, and concluded them to be divine, he consecrated them in that library.

These things, ye men of Greece, are no fable, nor do we narrate fictions; but we ourselves having been in Alexandria, saw the remains of the little cots at the Pharos still preserved, and having heard these things from the inhabitants, who had received them as part of their country’s tradition, we now tell to you what you can also learn from others, and specially from those wise and esteemed men who have written of these things, Philo and Josephus, and many others.” —Oratory Address to the Greeks 13

Here is another quote:

“But I am far from putting reliance in your teachers, who refuse to admit that the interpretation made by the seventy elders who were with Ptolemy [king] of the Egyptians is a correct one; and they attempt to frame another. And I wish you to observe, that they have altogether taken away many Scriptures from the translations effected by those seventy elders who were with Ptolemy, and by which this very man who was crucified is proved to have been set forth expressly as God, and man, and as being crucified, and as dying.” —Dialogue with Trypho 71

So here is actual evidence from a first century church father, who predates Origen, confirming the Septuagint. Do you have any evidence to show that Origen fabricated it? Any actual historical proof?

I have also shown that in many instances, The Lord and the Disciples are quoting directly from the Septuagint and that the language of the Septuagint is more accurate than the KJV Old Testament. You have ignored this completely. I have also attempted to explain the linguistic differences between the KJV and the Septuagint as they were translated from 2 different forms of Hebrew. This you have also ignored.

I understand your love and zeal for the KJV. This site uses the KJV for its Scripture quotations as it is the best Bible version that exists today. However, that does not undermine nor conflict with the value of the Septuagint. And I think you are just overlooking the arguments for it that clearly demonstrate it.

Interesting dialogue. However, I did not say Eusebius had anything to do with the septuagint. Origen, the pagan Greek Philosopher was the one who put together the basis for ALL BIBLES of today with the exception of the KJV. So, from Origen, Jerome, Westcott and Hort the Bibles, all bibles as evidence confirms are all corrupted.

You are saying after being shown missing verses and words, that certain Bibles are okay. This goes against many commands from the Bible about corrupting his Holy word for example Revelation 22: 18-19.

Not trusting Wilki on many issues this one is useful. The matrix showing missing verses and/or words. So, to verify its easy 🙂 go to the verse and discover that …..yes, Its gone.

Yes, we both are disappointed. The article is great but your agenda to downplay the Holy Word of God is disappointing to say the least. Sorry. You have no evidence to back up what you say. The evidence presented is the irrefutable fact that the verses are “absent’…..

I wrote that you said “Origen wrote the Septuagint around 100AD”. Origen was not alive then. Can you not see how this hurts your argument?? Isnt it obvious you were just wrong here? Why is that so hard to admit? Furthermore, you have provided no evidence of some type of alteration made to the Septuagint by Origen. Where is your evidence?

As I have already said several times, there are Septuagint manuscripts found with the Dead Sea Scrolls, that still exist. Meaning, we have today, copies of the Septuagint that pre-date Origen by 300-400 years. Don’t you see this also undermines your position completely?

And then you wrote this:

“You are saying after being shown missing verses and words, that certain Bibles are okay. This goes against many commands from the Bible about corrupting his Holy word for example Revelation 22: 18-19. “

False. You make a lot of salacious false accusations, but these are not arguments. I did not say “certain Bibles are okay.” I asked you to explain why the KJV New Testament quotes of The Old Testament match the Septuagint over 90% of the time. And why is the Septuagint more accurate than the KJV in those instances? You have not attempted to address this. You are not arguing based on evidence or reasoning. You are arguing via ad hominem – just attacking me and anyone you disagree with. I am not downplaying the Holy Word of God and your accusation is just as unsupported as your other points.

If you have any substantive evidence or any substantive response to the clear points that refute your assertion soundly, I am glad to hear them.

Thank you for your reply. I would like to see the paragraph where I wrote that Origen wrote the Septuagint around 100 AD. I can’t seem to find it. If I did write that then I was wrong or it wrote it in such a way that the context was not clear.

The writings of the Septuagint copied the OT in parts by Origen, from his copies of the Greek Old Testament he obtained from the Vaudois that performed as missionaries from Antioch. Origen was a fraud and this is for sure. Origen was an unusual character. As you probably know, he was made head teacher at the School of Alexandria. He moved to Caesarea and in fact was caught in the Decian persecution of 250 AD and was tortured. He was released in 254 AD and died of his wounds. So, he wasn’t around during 100 AD sure. My reference to 100AD should have been the subject of the locations time period of the true manuscripts of the OT and NT of the copies of the original books of the Bible and copies of such maintained at Antioch by the Vaudois. They made perfect copies, even burning their work if even one mistake was made; starting over each time. The true men of God were very careful not to make any mistakes while transcribing.

Back to Origen, In his early years Origen was much too heretical to be counted as a Church Father. Times change you know. Today he is treated like a saint when in fact he was opposite in real life. Even Protestants have honored his writings but he was not a real Christian. Now he taught in these schools from 204 to 230 AD. He made counterfeit Bibles, him having a belief system similar to the Jehovah Witness concepts. After he had passed on, “scholars” copied his counterfeit Bibles. in the 4th century, after Constantine took Rome, by 325 AD they were asked to make 50 Bibles for Eusebius to take back to Rome of these corrupted Bibles. The scholars in Alexandria wrote three Biblical perversions. The Sinaiticus about 350 AD, the Vaticanus before 400 AD and the Alexandrinus about 450 AD. They disagree over 3,000 times in the 4 Gospels alone. That makes two streams of translations the northern Stream from Antioch and the southern stream in Alexandria, Egypt. The Norther Stream was God’s preserved word in Antioch of Syria and the Southern Stream God’s word perverted in Alexandria. So, behind the curtain was a new World language, and it was called Latin. So, the Vaudois moved to The Alps. These people called the Vaudois came from the Piedmont Valleys of the Alps, around the northwest corner in Italy, east of France. So of them got saved and went to Antioch to receive God’s word around 120 AD and that is where I was referring but somehow got my wires crossed or wrote out of context relative to Origen. In any case, God used these people to translate Gods word in Latin a world language like English is a worlds language today. Even if you get a position with the UN or OSCE today no matter where you are from you have to be fluent in the English Language. Well, in 120 AD there was an effort made to translate the works into Latin, finished around 157 AD. God’s word was available for the whole world and spread before 200 AD. It was called then the “Vulgate” or common Bible. So that is how Origen got a Copy of the Vulgate after 200 AD. The Early true church was heavily persecuted and the slaughter continued until Constantine took over after 313 AD leading to the Council of Nicea in 325 AD. Constantine was pagan but called himself Christian to win over the Christians. Rome, Mystery Babylon was forming. Constantine took the title Pontifex Maximus and there is more.

Concerning the Vulgate, make a long story shorter, old Jerome another intellectual like Origen, whose first works from 379 to 381 were simply his Latin translations of Origen’s writings. From 382 to 390 he worked to rewrite the true Old Latin Bible rejecting God’s preserved Old Latin. At first he just translated his Latin Bible from Origen’s Greek counterfeit , this so called Septuagint. Jerome even tried changing some words of Origen’s work and ticked off other scholars. Some even believed that the so called Septuagint was more pure than the Hebrew, can you imagine. Jerome finished is Latin perversion in 405 AD. it became known as the Latin Vulgate which was later to be REJECTED by King James. One of the reasons for the Gun Powder Plot by the Vatican to kill King James and stop his work.

So, going back to Origen. he made up an odd Greek Bible. He put together his own Greek OLD TESTAMENT, mixed with some old Folk tales called the Apocrypha and added his own perverted New Testament. It had to look like Jesus and the Apostles quoted from his Old Testament, making it look ‘ancient” but he added books as well. He passed on the Hebrew as a language less important but in reality he was not very well versed in Hebrew as he was in Greek. So, what Origen did was to put his Old Testament and the Apocrypha together and called them the “ancient Septuagint”……So, The Alexandrian Bible was folk tales from the Apocrypha and perverted new Testament. Some of the sources are “The Outline of History (1920), by H.G. Wells, pg 305, and quoted in “Final Authority” by Dr. William Grady (1993), Page 77, and Rev J. Tixeront, “A Handbook of Patrology” translated by S.A. Reamers, English Edition, 1920, Page 90. Also, in Awe of Thy Word” by Gail Riplinger (2003), page 676-677. chap 4. and Constantine info….Introduction to the History of Christianity, edited by Tim Dowley (1990), page 139.

On 7/24 at 2:11 AM you wrote: “The whole Septuagint was written around 100 AD by Origen. “.

As I have said many times now, your entire argument is incorrect. Origen was not born until 184 AD. So there is just no way your position can be correct. This seems painfully obvious.

Secondly, you keep bringing up an enormous amount of irrelevant information. The Septuagint has nothing to do with Codex Sinaticus, Vaticanus or Alexandrinus. It was written CENTURIES before these manuscripts. So there everything you’re writing about them, Jerome, the Vatican etc., is totally irrelevant to the discussion. Your only charge that is actually on topic is that Origen wrote “the whole Septuagint in 100 AD” and you have not shown a shred of evidence for this. As I said before, Origen made a text called the Hexapla, which was a complilation of the most common Old Testaments at that time. This volume included the Septuagint in one its columns. The other 5 columns were other Old Testament versions that were the most in circulation at that time. The whole purpose was to have a side-by-side scripture resource to reconcile the differences between the Hebrew Bible and the Greek (which by the way was the Bible of choice for Christians). The reason why Jews returned to a Hebrew Bible in the 3rd century was because of their dismay that Christians since the time of Christ were using the Septuagint. This is clearly supported by the fact that over 90% of the Old Testament quotes in the KJV are from the Septuagint.

. However that was not the only Septuagint in existence at that time and we still have TODAY, Septuagint manuscripts that pre-date Origen by over 400 years. Don’t you see that this again completely refutes your argument? Even if Origen was the Bible-corrupting villain you are making him out to be, we have copies of the Septuagint that pre-date him, so any alteration could be noticed. This is all again painfully obvious, unless you assert that Origen knew the Dead Sea Scrolls would be discovered in 1948, falsified more documents and smuggled them into the jars in Qumran?

I have also shown you the testumony of Justin Martyr (who died in 165, 20 years before Origen was even born) who clearly suports the use and origin of the Septuagint. Irenaeus, another church father, was a disciple of Polycarp, who was a disciple of the Apostle John (the author of Revelation). Irenaeus wrote:

“The Old Testament writings are indispensable witnesses to the history of salvation; the Septuagint version was DIVINELY INSPIRED” (Bruce, p. 173; Iraneaus, Against Heresies, 3.21.2).

This was written well before Origen ever came on the scene. So we have numerous substantive historical proofs of the Septuagint being created and heavily endorsed by the church before Origen was born. All Origen did was compile the various versions of the Old testament into one volume.

The Septuagint was so popular in the Christian church, that Jews stopped using it:

“By the time of Christ, even among the Jews, a majority of the people spoke Aramaic AND GREEK, not Hebrew. The New Testament writers evidence their inclination to the Septuagint by using it when quoting the Old Testament. . . Because of the broad acceptance and use of the Septuagint among Christians, the Jews RENOUNCED IT in favor of a number of other Greek versions. Aquila, a proselyte and disciple of Rabbi Akiba, produced a new translation around A.D. 130. In the spirit of his teacher, Aquila wrote an extremely literal translation, often to the point of communicating poorly in Greek. This literal approach, however, gained this version wide acceptance among Jews” (The Origin of the Bible, edited by Philip Wesley Comfort, Tyndale House Publishers, 1992p. 165).

Origen included this Aquila version of the Old Testament in his Hexapla – again showing he was not in some “septuaint conspirator” but was rather including ALL versions of the OT in one volume. But the historical source above demonstrates that the Septuagint was clearly the Bible of the Christian church.

I love the KJV and think it’s the best Bible version. But it is translated from the Masoretic, squared Hebrew (a form of Hebrew that has vowel points). Paleo-Hebrew, the ancient Hebrew language, has no vowels and no longer exists. The Septuagint was translated from paleo-Hebrew manuscripts. In this regard it is a true treasure because it is the ONLY text we have translated from the original language of the Israelites.

And again, I will point out that you ignore how well the Septuagint harmonizes with the New Testament of the KJV. Are you alleging that Origen fraudulently altered every Septuagint copy in existence? I am just not sure where your argument is really going at this point.

I love the KJV and believe it is by far the best Bible version. But that does not mean the Septuagint has no validity. Nor does the validity of the Septuagint somehow harm the KJV. I think you are also trying to assert that the modern versions of the Bible were based on the Septuagint. They were not. I will provide one more scriptural example for you:

Exodus 1:1 Now these are the names of the children of Israel, which came into Egypt; every man and his household came with Jacob….

Exodus 1:5

(KJV) And all the souls that came out of the loins of Jacob were seventy souls: for Joseph was in Egypt already.

(NIV) The descendants of Jacob numbered seventy in all; Joseph was already in Egypt.

(ESV) All the descendants of Jacob were seventy persons; Joseph was already in Egypt.

(Message Bible) Seventy persons in all generated by Jacob’s seed. Joseph was already in Egypt.

So as we can see, the KJV is in agreement with the other versions as to the number of Jacob’s family that came from Canaan into Egypt. So why do I bring this up? Because this same verse is cited by the Apostle Stephen in Acts 7:

(KJV) 12 But when Jacob heard that there was corn in Egypt, he sent out our fathers first. 13 And at the second time Joseph was made known to his brethren; and Joseph’s kindred was made known unto Pharaoh. 14 Then sent Joseph, and called his father Jacob to him, and all his kindred, threescore and fifteen souls. 15 So Jacob went down into Egypt, and died, he, and our fathers,

If the text says only 70 souls went to Egypt, where did Stephen get the 75 number from? Did he make an error? No, he got it from the Septuagint:

(LXX) But Joseph was in Egypt. And all the souls born of Jacob were seventy-five.

So this again completely refutes your attempt to connect the Septuagint to the modern versions. The testimony of Scripture speaks for itself. Stephen was quoting the Septuagint. The Lord quoted it. The Disciples quoted it. It was clearly in existence hundreds of years before Origen and church fathers attest to its validity. I do not think the LXX is perfect, nor do I think that we have the exact verbatim manuscripts the Disciples held. But what we have from the totality of manuscript evidence is an extremely good representation and thus the Septuagint is a valuable resource that can be used right alongside the KJV.

I really hope you consider the specific points being made and that we can move on from discussing the Vatican, Jesuits, modern versions etc., because they have nothing to do with the subject at hand. I own A Lamp In The Dark and think it’s an excellent documentary. But it has nothing to do with the Septuagint. The subject matter is almost 1000 years after the Septuagint. And again, if you have any actual evidence about fabrications/forgeries etc., connected to the Septuagint, I’d be glad to read it.

Just reading both of y’all’s argument and thought I may say a few things. While I very much do not wish to engage in a pissing match,I would like to make known some truths. To uncover or discover your fathers nakedness is to have sex with your fathers wife and as would more often than not be the case,that means to have sex with your own mother. While Enoch wrote many books, one must use caution when reading and do not Imediately take to heart everything you read, but with prayer, knowledge,comparing (for Gods word consist of no less than a double witness) and his spirit leading you to the truth. God has a certain way of speech,wording,symbolism ect that is entirely unique to him and once one learns this and his character, it’s very simple to spot a fraud or error of the pen. Make no mistake. God makes no mistakes in anything he does so when mistakes arise, question it and verify it by his other witnesses. From what I’ve learned from him is that the KJV is about as close as one can get to learning the basic simplicity of his will,but even it is laced with errors,translations and added words that don’t define making it English friendly, but was purposely installed. For example Easter should be written as Passover. While I do understand that some bibles have a cross reference,many don’t and the wording used is entirely deceptive in it’s intended meaning. Then there’s the strongs concordance that can be used with the original KJV and not the latter issues. Any way. From what I understand, there were only 3 souls that were not tainted and those 3 were Noah,Japheth. Ham,Noah’s wife and all 3 of the sons wives,which they married only 7 days before entering the ark were tainted. Though not exhibiting the physical characteristic flaws of the giants, they carried in the Helix curve/rib/DNA the corrupt gene. If anyone is somewhat familiar with genetics and heredity, if two partners,one having normal genes and the other deviled there’s a 50/50 chance that the resulting offspring will inherit that oddity. If they do, they’re corrupt and capable of continuing to pass it on the the succeeding offspring. If not, meaning they did not recieve that oddity. Then they are forever clean and not capable of passing it provided their partner is likewise clean. With that being said, one could only imagine if both parents have that Gene as the offspring would positively suffer the results. Even worse and from what I understand, was that Cannan was born not from his also nice re wife, but from him impregnating his mother. Ya know anytime the word “and” begins a sentence, there is more that happened than what is written and included a passage of time. I’m sure Noah was didn’t want the constant reminder of that perverse and most sickening abomination calling him Grandpa… Lol. Another thing. I thought the meaning of the name Nimrod was Black Terror? He is also recorded in the ancient Han Chinese manuscripts from not very long after the confounding of tongues and described as black as a moonless night. Hmmm

Relative to the false reporting that the Septuagint influenced the New Testament writers, this sums it up. 2 Timothy 3:16 King James Bible All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Those in most all religions have trained Jesuits, Calvinist, Freemasons, Knights of Malta, Christian Identity who are there to discredit the true word of God contained in the KJV. This will only lead to their undoing as God will judge them harshly. Revelation 22: 18-19 stands for those trying to dissuade from the true word.

I will submit this last one……unless there is new info, however, we can go round and round for days and get nowhere. I shed all my loyalties to any man made institutions or even family if it distracts me from this study.

I’ve presented enough for those with a desire to discover the truth to find it.

Walter Veith, although a SDA, does fantastic work, and he takes the same verses in 2 or 3 bibles and shows how changed words and missing verses change not only the context, but the meaning as well.

“If it has no impact on the Bible’s doctrines” [as indicated above], then why bother ‘noting’ the missing verse at all – why not just re-number the verses – and leave it at that? – _____________________________________________________

http://elhijodedios.com/bible/apocrypha-deuterocanonical.html _______________________________________________________ We can write like this and I could ‘search’ all day – and take a tally when I’m done – but, it won’t change a thing – people will believe what they want to believe – no matter what – the arguments against the KJV Bible are pretty much the same – it used to be the ‘missing verses’ – when that did not work – they looked for some other way to discredit ANY version – or create conflict – I am fully aware of the value of ‘conflict’ – creating ‘doubt’ is one of Satan’s devices to keep us separated and divided – I often wonder how he is going to get everyone on the same page – however – one of his ploys just may be to ‘discredit’ them all – are we falling into this trap – by arguing – are we winning any converts – or are we losing the battle entirely – what would Jesus do – He understood our ‘dimensional capacity’ better than any human being every could – why – because He was God – He created us – and yet, He tried to educate us – in many cases, He taught the ‘uneducated’ and least likely to understand – He did not ‘categorize’ them like we do – He simply ‘knew’ them – he knew their dimensional capacity – their ability to understand – and yet, many still could not fully comprehend what He said. SO we take sides with a religion, or church, or main leader of a movement or a movement, or patriotism which is another idol, follow the family all designed to mislead. Jesus is the one and the KJV only bible.

9 And he said unto them, He that hath ears to hear, let him hear. 10 And when he was alone, they that were about him with the twelve asked of him the parable. 11 And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables: 12 That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them. 13 And he said unto them, Know ye not this parable? and how then will ye know all parables? 14 The sower soweth the word. 15 And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts.

Respectfully, I am becoming more and more confused about your posts. You are bringing up literally dozens of points that are not relevant to this discussion. Now you are talking about verses in the KJV that are not in other modern versions. And you link to articles that are all referencing the New Testament. The Septuagint is only THE OLD TESTAMENT. I am making no defense whatsoever of other Bible versions. So I have no idea what these articles have to do with anything we are discussing. I am merely pointing out to you that the KJV New Testament quotes the Septuagint repeatedly. Your response is not addressing this.

If you have any explanation for why the KJV quotes the Septuagint over the KJV Old Testament in many, many instances, I would be glad to hear it.

“This is clearly supported by the fact that over 90% of the Old Testament quotes in the KJV are from the Septuagint.”

ANSWER: I see where this is headed. I read your comments and the above comment plus the supporting “claims” tells me that this website is supported by Roman Catholic dogma or God Forbid Jesuits or Calvinist. Its obvious that the members of this site are educated however, in the wrong direction. The above is an out and out lie. I hate to be so blunt but knowing that the members of this site are educated and conducts research indicates that the research is flawed on purpose. The entire OT Testament comes from God to Moses and has nothing to do with Origen’s Septuagint. The ancient Septuagint is a myth put together by the RCC, and its heresy to hide the truth about Jesus, about the true origin of God’s Holy Word in a very clever and devious way. This you people will have to deal with when your time for Judgment has come. I told you the truth and if you are honest and deceived or if you are a Jesuit having taken that Satanic oath as they have, all you have now is to repent and seek the face of God through Jesus.

THE KJV doesn’t quote that Septuagint, The Septuagint quotes the KJV. FACT.

My points are very relevant because they show the inaccuracy of all Bible versions especially the modern and the Roman Catholic heresy.

You haven’t refuted even one of my points with any facts. You have attempted to refute it with literally the same lies taught at Harvard, and all other colleges that have adopted the theology of Humanism as their core culture.

On the other just in case you really are sincere and have actually researched this from a “Honest” position, I can tell you right now that you have been taught by a PROVED Corrupted education system designed to deceive as evidence confirms. The CFR is in fact made up of Illuminati members and no kidding; at the highest level Satanist. Its a fact. They are members of the Round Table, Comprising of other elite Satanist called the Bilderbergers, Trilateral Commission, Royal Institute of International Affairs, Club of Rome, CFR, and UN. The conspiracy is proven and vast but a promise it will fail.

By their own tongues they tell the truth about themselves….and lie to the rest of us….

Quote from a Humanist – Charles F. Potter “Education is thus a most powerful ally of humanism, and every American school is a school of humanism. What can a theistic Sunday school’s meeting for an hour once a week and teaching only a fraction of the children do to stem the tide of the five-day program of humanistic teaching?” – Charles F. Potter, “Humanism: A New Religion,” 1930

Quote from Herbert London: New York University declared. in 1987l “The strides made by Marxism at American universities in the last two decades are breathtaking,” says New York University’s Herbert London. “Every discipline has been affected by its preachment, and almost every faculty now counts among its members a resident Marxist scholar.”

(1) Duke University Slavic Languages professor Magnus Krynski described increasing Marxist presence on his campus—a presence actively encouraged by the university administration, which, he says, is “faddishly” luring Marxist literary critics to Duke with large salaries.”

Quote from Georgie Anne Geyer: A Marxist/Leninist cultural revolution is now, and has been for some time, taking place in American universities where Marxism is alive and well. U.S. News and World Report reported that there are ten thousand Marxist professors on America’s campuses. Georgie Anne Geyer says that “the percentage of Marxist faculty numbers can range from an estimated 90 percent in some midwestern universities.” [“Marxism Thrives on Campus,” The Denver Post, Aug. 29, 1989]

In Roger Kimball’s Book “Tenured Radicals” he confirms… “In my book Tenured Radicals—first published in 1990 and updated in 1998—I noted, With a few notable exceptions, our most prestigious liberal arts colleges and universities have installed the entire radical menu at the center of their humanities curriculum at both the undergraduate and the graduate levels.

In March 1987 Duke University hosted the Southeast Marxist Scholars Conference. Dr. Malcolm Gillis, former vice provost of Duke University, thanked some one hundred Marxist professors, graduate students, and activists for gathering at Duke and said, “When I left this campus twenty years ago, there were very few Marxists here. When I returned in 1984, I saw Marxists in many parts of the social science faculty.”(2) The conference was sponsored by the Marxist Educational Press (based at the University of Minnesota) and Duke’s own Program on Perspectives in Marxism and Society. The Marxist worldview is alive and well in the American classroom. As Dr. Fred Schwarz says, “The colleges and universities are the nurseries of communism.”(5) Christian students must not get caught up in these nurseries. American history has come to be dominated by Marxists and rabid macho-feminists; [Accuracy in Academia Campus Report, July/August 1987] Self-declared Soviet-style Eugene Genovese and William A. Williams were elected president of the Organization of American Historians in successive elections, and Louis Kampf, a radical with Marxist predilections, was elected president of the Modern Language Association. [Herbert London, “Marxism Thriving on American Campuses,” The World and I, January 1987]

Time magazine’s Man of the Decade for the 1980s, Mikhail Gorbachev, retains his Marxist/Leninist beliefs. “The works of Lenin, and his ideals of socialism remain for us an inexhaustible source of dialectical creative thought, theoretical wealth and political sagacity,” according to him. [Mikhail Gorbachev, Perestroika: New Thinking for Our Country and the World, 1987] “Those in the West who expect us to give up socialism will be disappointed.. I hold a firm trust in socialist democracy and socialist humanism.” [“In His Words,” U.S. News and World Report, Nov. 9, 1987.]http://peoplespoliticsiii.yuku.com/topic/6612#.U89CeLEmX7M

A Marxist/Leninist cultural revolution is now, and has been for some time, taking place in American universities where Marxism is alive and well. U.S. News and World Report reported that there are ten thousand Marxist professors on America’s campuses. Georgie Anne Geyer says that “the percentage of Marxist faculty numbers can range from an estimated 90 percent in some midwestern universities.” [“Marxism Thrives on Campus,” The Denver Post, Aug. 29, 1989]

After the Vietnam War, a lot of us didn’t just crawl back into our literary cubicles; we stepped into academic positions. With the war over, our visibility was lost, and it seemed for a while—to the unobservant—that we had disappeared. Now we have tenure, and the work of reshaping the universities has begun in earnest. —Jay Parini, The Chronicle of Higher Education.

Finally, after this exchange I went back to give the article a second look because my trust of the info fell. I caught another inaccuracy. You might not have known but there were a second wave of fallen angels today are called “the Ascended Masters” others high up in the Governments think they are actually aliens but are the 66 members of the second wave of fallen angels after the flood…..[El Morya, St Germain, Sananda Immanuel, “Sanat Kumara” you might know well, to name a few] What you don’t know is that they are going to take out every secret society member once they have total control. Yes there were fallen angels or sons of God after the flood.

SO, I bid you farewell and once you answer this I will no longer be interested in this site nor do I trust the information you are putting out.

Oh, just in case you have not caught on to the purpose of the quotes; this means literally not one college or university can be trusted to educate our youth and in fact the Marxist, Humanist has so polluted our education system and knowledge base its not fixable. The Only way it will be fixed is by the first trumpet and return of Jesus. The short list Marxist schools and as documented by CFR roles just in 1990’s; is Harvard (Rockefeller funded), Yale, Princeton, Columbia, Stanford, MIT, Cornell, U. of Texas, U. of California, U. of St Louis, Rockefeller University, Johns Hopkins U. U. of Chicago, U. of Miami, City College of New York, George Washington U. to name a scant few. Recruiting for the Illuminati and for other purposes you don’t want to know.

Thomas Gambill: Oh, just in case you have not caught on to the purpose of the quotes; this means literally not one college or university can be trusted to educate our youth and in fact the Marxist, Humanist has so polluted our education system and knowledge base its not fixable. The Only way it will be fixed is by the first trumpet and return of Jesus. The short list Marxist schools and as documented by CFR roles just in 1990′s; is Harvard (Rockefeller funded), Yale, Princeton, Columbia, Stanford, MIT, Cornell, U. of Texas, U. of California, U. of St Louis, Rockefeller University, Johns Hopkins U. U. of Chicago, U. of Miami, City College of New York, George Washington U. to name a scant few. Recruiting for the Illuminati and for other purposes you don’t want to know.

God have mercy on all your souls.

“This is clearly supported by the fact that over 90% of the Old Testament quotes in the KJV are from the Septuagint.”

ANSWER: I see where this is headed. I read your comments and the above comment plus the supporting “claims” tells me that this website is supported by Roman Catholic dogma or God Forbid Jesuits or Calvinist. Its obvious that the members of this site are educated however, in the wrong direction. The above is an out and out lie. I hate to be so blunt but knowing that the members of this site are educated and conducts research indicates that the research is flawed on purpose. The entire OT Testament comes from God to Moses and has nothing to do with Origen’s Septuagint. The ancient Septuagint is a myth put together by the RCC, and its heresy to hide the truth about Jesus, about the true origin of God’s Holy Word in a very clever and devious way. This you people will have to deal with when your time for Judgment has come. I told you the truth and if you are honest and deceived or if you are a Jesuit having taken that Satanic oath as they have, all you have now is to repent and seek the face of God through Jesus.

THE KJV doesn’t quote that Septuagint, The Septuagint quotes the KJV. FACT.

My points are very relevant because they show the inaccuracy of all Bible versions especially the modern and the Roman Catholic heresy.

You haven’t refuted even one of my points with any facts. You have attempted to refute it with literally the same lies taught at Harvard, and all other colleges that have adopted the theology of Humanism as their core culture.

On the other just in case you really are sincere and have actually researched this from a “Honest” position, I can tell you right now that you have been taught by a PROVED Corrupted education system designed to deceive as evidence confirms. The CFR is in fact made up of Illuminati members and no kidding; at the highest level Satanist. Its a fact. They are members of the Round Table, Comprising of other elite Satanist called the Bilderbergers, Trilateral Commission, Royal Institute of International Affairs, Club of Rome, CFR, and UN. The conspiracy is proven and vast but a promise it will fail.

By their own tongues they tell the truth about themselves….and lie to the rest of us….

Quote from a Humanist – Charles F. Potter “Education is thus a most powerful ally of humanism, and every American school is a school of humanism. What can a theistic Sunday school’s meeting for an hour once a week and teaching only a fraction of the children do to stem the tide of the five-day program of humanistic teaching?” – Charles F. Potter, “Humanism: A New Religion,” 1930

Quote from Herbert London: New York University declared. in 1987l “The strides made by Marxism at American universities in the last two decades are breathtaking,” says New York University’s Herbert London. “Every discipline has been affected by its preachment, and almost every faculty now counts among its members a resident Marxist scholar.”

(1) Duke University Slavic Languages professor Magnus Krynski described increasing Marxist presence on his campus—a presence actively encouraged by the university administration, which, he says, is “faddishly” luring Marxist literary critics to Duke with large salaries.”

Quote from Georgie Anne Geyer: A Marxist/Leninist cultural revolution is now, and has been for some time, taking place in American universities where Marxism is alive and well. U.S. News and World Report reported that there are ten thousand Marxist professors on America’s campuses. Georgie Anne Geyer says that “the percentage of Marxist faculty numbers can range from an estimated 90 percent in some midwestern universities.” [“Marxism Thrives on Campus,” The Denver Post, Aug. 29, 1989]

In Roger Kimball’s Book “Tenured Radicals” he confirms… “In my book Tenured Radicals—first published in 1990 and updated in 1998—I noted, With a few notable exceptions, our most prestigious liberal arts colleges and universities have installed the entire radical menu at the center of their humanities curriculum at both the undergraduate and the graduate levels.

In March 1987 Duke University hosted the Southeast Marxist Scholars Conference. Dr. Malcolm Gillis, former vice provost of Duke University, thanked some one hundred Marxist professors, graduate students, and activists for gathering at Duke and said, “When I left this campus twenty years ago, there were very few Marxists here. When I returned in 1984, I saw Marxists in many parts of the social science faculty.”(2) The conference was sponsored by the Marxist Educational Press (based at the University of Minnesota) and Duke’s own Program on Perspectives in Marxism and Society. The Marxist worldview is alive and well in the American classroom. As Dr. Fred Schwarz says, “The colleges and universities are the nurseries of communism.”(5) Christian students must not get caught up in these nurseries. American history has come to be dominated by Marxists and rabid macho-feminists; [Accuracy in Academia Campus Report, July/August 1987] Self-declared Soviet-style Eugene Genovese and William A. Williams were elected president of the Organization of American Historians in successive elections, and Louis Kampf, a radical with Marxist predilections, was elected president of the Modern Language Association. [Herbert London, “Marxism Thriving on American Campuses,” The World and I, January 1987]

Time magazine’s Man of the Decade for the 1980s, Mikhail Gorbachev, retains his Marxist/Leninist beliefs. “The works of Lenin, and his ideals of socialism remain for us an inexhaustible source of dialectical creative thought, theoretical wealth and political sagacity,” according to him. [Mikhail Gorbachev, Perestroika: New Thinking for Our Country and the World, 1987] “Those in the West who expect us to give up socialism will be disappointed.. I hold a firm trust in socialist democracy and socialist humanism.” [“In His Words,” U.S. News and World Report, Nov. 9, 1987.]http://peoplespoliticsiii.yuku.com/topic/6612#.U89CeLEmX7M

A Marxist/Leninist cultural revolution is now, and has been for some time, taking place in American universities where Marxism is alive and well. U.S. News and World Report reported that there are ten thousand Marxist professors on America’s campuses. Georgie Anne Geyer says that “the percentage of Marxist faculty numbers can range from an estimated 90 percent in some midwestern universities.” [“Marxism Thrives on Campus,” The Denver Post, Aug. 29, 1989]

After the Vietnam War, a lot of us didn’t just crawl back into our literary cubicles; we stepped into academic positions. With the war over, our visibility was lost, and it seemed for a while—to the unobservant—that we had disappeared. Now we have tenure, and the work of reshaping the universities has begun in earnest. —Jay Parini, The Chronicle of Higher Education.

Finally, after this exchange I went back to give the article a second look because my trust of the info fell. I caught another inaccuracy. You might not have known but there were a second wave of fallen angels today are called “the Ascended Masters” others high up in the Governments think they are actually aliens but are the 66 members of the second wave of fallen angels after the flood…..[El Morya, St Germain, Sananda Immanuel, “Sanat Kumara” you might know well, to name a few] What you don’t know is that they are going to take out every secret society member once they have total control. Yes there were fallen angels or sons of God after the flood.

SO, I bid you farewell and once you answer this I will no longer be interested in this site nor do I trust the information you are putting out.

Arthur, I need a little clarification from you. First , full disclosure, I fully believe in the scripture saying that angels did have relations with human women and produced mighty offspring, I read the bible front to back each year in addition to studying it and looking at the translations and their roots.

That being said , where in the NT dies it actually refer to believers as actual sons of God, I believe the correct reference is that they shall be “as the sons of God” . Meaning they shall know the things previously unknown to man and see things as the angels see , not that they are sons of God. Just wanted to make that distinction . Looking at the whole word of God and it’s context is important. And remember ” fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom ” Blessings

Tom. Sorry for the long delay in response, but Jesus made the first reference in the NT by saying in Matt. 5:9, “Blessed are the peacemakers, For they shall be called sons of God.” Then Paul picked it up and said in Romans 8:14, “For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.” So there is no “distinction” in the sense you refer. In these passages and others, human believers are indeed called the “sons of God” due to their new relationship to God.

Arthur, sons of God in the Old Testament didn’t exist until they were born by man. Never in the OT will find one scripture stating any of the sons of Adam or any saint referred to as son of God, until the NT. The saints of the OT were always referred to as son of Man. Even Jesus made that distinction. Sons of God existed before the foundations of the Earth was put into plan…..Job 38:7. But you go on believing this myth of sons of God was sons of Seth and I will CONTINUE To teach the truth as hard as I can five days per week 3.5 hours per day warning of fake Jesus Yeshua……and Fallen angels as the false Aliens, Hierarchy, Community, Great White Brotherhood and fake Jesus named Sananda Immanuel. You can deny but I know better as evidence confirms.

Arthur, you need to humble yourself out of the badge of honor by going to graduate school. Sorry to be like that. The sons of God of the OT is 180 degrees from the Sons of God in the NT. you cannot connect them whatsoever. Jesus was the dividing line of the Sons of God reference. Sons of Man for the OT when referring to humans, and created beings as sons of God. in the Old testament. The change occurs in the NT for those that took Jesus as their savior. Jesus was not around in the OT. Jesus also makes a distinction. He claimed to be Gods’ only Begotten son. He also claimed to be son of man because of his regular birth. In the OT, there is not distinction of one man that fills both. Adam was a son of God because he was CREATED. All the saints of the Bible in the OT are referred to as Sons of Man. The fallen angels to operate on this first heaven, required to have physical bodies, (Copper based DNA), and created humanoid abominations. Seth’s bloodline did not create evil giants to consume and kill man.

Mr. Gambill. I’m not sure where you’re coming from with the invalid judgment about humbling myself and my graduate work. If you knew anything about attending graduate school, you’d know that humility comes with the territory because that is the place where you learn to BE humble if you’re not already.

As I pointed out in my video series, the “sons of God” in Genesis 6 cannot be “fallen angels” for several reasons. All things were “created” by God, but that does not justify the title “sons of God.” Dogs were “created” by God, yet they are not “sons of God.” And as I explained from the original Hebrew of the passage, the word “Nephilim” does NOT mean “giants” or “evil giants.” That is a mistranslation involving the Greek Septuagint and reading things back into the text from later verses regarding the size of the people in the land of Canaan. I suggest you do more thorough research on the topic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvpqUb–iRI

You Arthur are dead wrong about Giants not meaning Nephilim or Raphim. I finished Graduate school with an MBA. However, it means very little in real life as do all graduate work and Doctors degrees. You have Doctorates in Harvard in Philosophy, History, economics et al that have no clue about the reality of the world at which they live. Secondly ALL COLLEGES and UNIVERSITIES are schools of Marxism and Socialism and Humanism as evidenced by credible educators going back to 1930’s to 1990’s. John Dewey and Horrace Mann were both Humanist and followed an evil Theology. sons of God were in fact according to the Bible angelic beings with freewill and lust as a result. There is no mistranslation what so ever. You have lots to learn but don’t even try to pawn off that graduate badge of Honor as I have one two and discovered the truth about the Ashram Ray called Education. its a farce. Colleges, Universities and High schools are recruiting grounds for the Illuminati. Evil to the core. Sandusky times 10,000+ more…..is the reality. You best go back and rethink your studies, you have been told.

Having an “MBA” does not qualify you to know theology. That’s the ad verecundium fallacy. You can claim I am “dead wrong” if you wish, but you have no credible evidence of your claim from credible Hebrew lexical sources. Your wild conspiratorial views betray you.

Now you can, again, claim there is no “mistranslation” if you wish, but only if you know Hebrew can you tell if something has been mistranslated from Hebrew. So, if we can’t have a reasonable conversation based on facts, evidence, and reason, then this discussion is over.

Arthur, having an MBA does not qualify me to know theology. However, teaching theology the past five years does qualify me.

Five years of archives and broadcasts, teaching History, theology, Physical Security for over a decade, would qualify me…..I think so. We do not have to know Hebrew that is a Humanist lie and misconception and I have tons of facts, evidence, and reason that is massive.

I have a time line on the website with facts on 200 pages you won’t be able to refute.

AS a matter of fact…..a Great President agrees with me….and notice he is not talking just about Communism which is now on every college campus, runs worldwide politics and more…..since its inception. The vatican, Freemasons, Knights of Malta, K. of Columbus and 26 Illuminati families I can name them exactly if you want. Why, all this is necessary, it proves that your knowledge base is based on a corrupted education system and agenda to hide the truth about the fallen angels being aliens and they are not…..Sanada is a fallen angel and demon. The Nephilim exist now and are just waiting to be released.

You want facts, names, I will give you tons……you will not refute of this…you can deny but you will not refute….

March 4, 1939 – Quote from a report of the secret committee by President Roosevelt,;

“I am making no concessions to business, or for relief. I have a military machine sufficient to stop any organized revolt. I am putting MY PEOPLE ahead of all instruments. I’ll have had a full understanding with Chamberlain, and we will destroy this unemployed condition with a WAR, and a WAR only. To Hell with the American people, as far as a Democracy is concerned. It does not exist. It never did, and we will never let it happen that way. I am going to crush business, infest America with all the aliens possible, and in the last analysis, declare Martial Law, and confiscate everything I need for a true and forceful Dictatorship. My New Deal is a failure, and I know it, but no one else will tell me that I must discontinue my present activities, and program.”

From the Secret Audience with the Military Appropriation Committee; The Ways and Means Committee; The Special War Finance Committee;

This copy was presented to me by mail through Senator Lundeen.” The Red Fog over America” by William Guy Carr, 1955.

In 1841 Clinton Roosevelt [ancestral cousin to FDR] published in America “The Science of Government Founded on Natural Laws”, This was nothing more than a plagiarized version of the teachings of Professor Adam Weishaupt of Frankfort University, Germany, the renegade Jesuit priest who arranged for the agenteur of the Illuminati to infiltrate into French Freemasonry in 1776 so “The Secret Power” which directed the World Revolutionary Movement, and the Conspiracy of Satan, at that time could use Freemasonry to further their secret plans and ambitious and at the same time cloak their diabolitical purpose. This document was then passed to Karl Marx for him to plagiarize and as recognized in history; was the “Communist Manifesto” but not written by Karl Marx but plagiarized from the document that was given to him by Mazzini who was a member of the Illuminati also plagiarized by Clinton Roosevelt from Adam Weishaupts original plans written on May 1, 1776,

with all due respect mr. gambill, the angels true cannot marry and do not marry nor were they ever comissioned to marry. once certain “angels” forsook their natural dwelling place and chose to excercise freewill then they became demons. the bible goes on to say that these spirit creatures “took notice of” the daughters of men before engaging in the material marriage process. when one takes notice of something it is normally studied and looked over. it is not a fleeting glance rather an inspection if you will. this takes time and it is a process, much like an autopsy. crude example, but nonetheless. james 1 verses 14 and 15 will help one to understand the intentions and motives of these pre dispositioned angels of God and why they did what they did upon taking notice of these women. that is why the bible at genesis says the sons of God rather than the angels of God. you have to look at context here and everywhere in the bible for that matter. the bible does not conflict with itself rather it helps the reader who uses discernment gain a full understanding of the scriptures. it was these selfprofessing demons that originated in the heavens which took for themselves the daughters of men. the matthew account is talking totally 2 seperate issues, situations, and classes of indeviduals, particularly one unique class. the heavenly class which is picked from the earth as firstfruits, also described in james if you read further and backed up by the book of revelation. when talking about angels not being able to marry, the word “angel” means messenger of God and an angel when choosing to become a demon through the sinful process reliquishes that birth right and no longer works for the Father in His heavens and throughout His creation, therefore becoming an independent party and a law to themselves. although still created originally by God himself to do His will that they now have abandoned thousands of earth years ago. if you have any q’s feel free. thank you kindly.

Finally, Abraham Lincoln also killed by the Jesuits CONFIRMS that the Jesuits set up our civil war…..he was not a Freemason and neither was JFK.

A QUOTE FROM ABRAHAM LINCOLN ABOUT THE CIVIL WAR

“This war would never have been possible without the sinister influence of the Jesuits. We owe it to Popery that we now see our land reddened with the blood of her noblest sons. Though there were great differences of opinion between the South and North, on the question of slavery, neither Jeff Davis nor any one of the leading men of the Confederacy would have dared to attack the North, had they not relied on the promise of the Jesuits, that, under the mask of Democracy, the money and the arms of the Roman Catholics, even the arms of France, were at their disposal if they would attack us.” Charles Chiniquy, Fifty Years in the Church of Rome, The Wickliffe Press, Protestant Truth Society, Wickliffe Avenue, 104 Hendon Lane, Finchley, London, N3., 1885, p. 388.

“Why of course the people don’t want war. Why should some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece? Naturally the common people don’t want war: Neither in Russia nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Hermann Goering

“Hell will be full of people who have religion in their head and no reality in their heart.” ~ Dwight Thompson

By the way; Alex Jones works for the Illuminati even though he was allowed to expose the Bohemian Grove….he was given the authority to do so, to give him credibility and it was allowed as he works for them……

With all due respect, I don’t have any questions. However, I will say, that you and auther seem to be two intelligent young men. However, you neither one understand what happened in creation and before the flood. It is a fact, that Lucifer and angels that sided with him were in a war with the hosts of Heaven and they were banished, kicked out of the 3rd Heaven. There are three Heavens. the second Heaven is the Known physical universe, Planets, suns etc…there is no physical life in the Universe but there are the fallen angels and demons in this second Heaven with 7 principalities. The first Heaven is the Physical Earth. The fallen angels have free will, and lots of knowledge. They know how to manipulate God’s creation to achieve the ability to go “to and fro” from second Heaven to first Heaven, with opening Portals. FACT. Now., Gods angels came in a physical mode, “Sodom” and “be aware of angels that God sends” and the fallen angels to interact with man they can achieve physical bodies but with copper based DNA as opposed to carbon based DNA of humans. I also know that with free will they became lustful and the Wave of fallen angels that came to Earth took the daughters of Men….TOOK not given in marriage ceremony but TOOK, meaning abduct, kidnap, raped. The ANGELS in Heaven who are spiritual cannot marry because they are spiritual but those on EARTH that are FALLEN, as I said didn’t marry in any process, but rape, kidnap or steal as slaves the women they wanted. They also taught them before the flood and after NIMROD (First Freemason and anti-Christ) the art of Witchcraft and Alchemy.

This is what happened and today to make a long story shorter, they are coming back to public view as so called, “Aliens” or “Ascended Masters” and they are nothing but Demons that can change shapes for now. Also, they have names and one of them, Raziel, is named Sananda Immanuel, and some know him as Yeshua. They visited Blavatsky and Alice Baily…..they will become physical once again (by their method of absorbing life forces by death, destruction and mass murder in war), and this is called Externalization of the Hierarchy.

you folks have a lot to catch up with and I sure hope you are not trying to conceal this truth I’ve just told you.

good sir, i agree with you on many levels, but it is my opinion that you must tweek up not your knowledge of certain issues with the truth, but rather work on your reasoning with the scriptures and how you compute that information. not downing your intellegence at all. the first issue is the 3 heavens. sounds like a baptist or born again type doctrine which isn’t “proved scripturally.” now i do not judge nor care what religion someone is, however the bible does state the heavens and the earth were created in the begining. it says “heavens” plural because of the exspanse of space and sheer number of other “planets” compared to the one earth we are on now. the bible was written for humans not angelic creatures. they have there own scrolls and like before we spoke about how some angels did not pay attention to them. nontheless, the bible goes on to also say that once the earth is under proper Kingly rule by God then the “earth” will be His footstool. thus in a spiritual way connecting the two under His rule. we know that it is not a literal footstool rather it shows dominance and authority as it should rightly. the Creator deserves to go and be wherever His creation is. i think we can agree on that at least. it’s funny how america laid claim to the moon with a flag when it belongs already entirely to God Himself, if they even went to the moon in the first place, but that is another debate entirely. nowhere however does the bible speak of 3 heavens or levels of heavens especially not in the way it is portrayed in religion. rather it speaks of a Hierarchy with God on top and Christ His son at His right hand or “strong side” if you will. and it does speak about different angels at different levels of power and positions unique to themselves. giving them all indevidualty. now secondly to say that the angels are of copper based dna when they materialised is kind of ludacris if you ask me. how would one know that? did anybody hold a materialised angel down and draw it’s blood or take a hair sample? were you there, was i there, was anyone alive today there? angels have creative ability yes, but we do not know the nature of such. we will have to wait and see. hopefully one day soon. you seem like your really smart, but please don’t believe everything you read and surely do not mix it with the bible in order to bend or prove a point that we just do not know enough about. God will reveal all things that pertain to peoples existence and well being in the near future. anything else that we cannot answer really is imatereial to what we should be doing and that is worshipping the one true God and taking in knowledge of Him. that is what leads to everlasting life, not the knowledge of demons and what they “could” have been doing or looked liked etc. thanks

Interesting reply and nicely put. I must add, you are however, making assumptions without having all the facts. I would suggest that instead of making assumptions provide evidence, links, or investigate what I have placed and prove it “sincerely” inconclusive or you just might agree.

Yes, we do agree on a few issues. I also agree or favor the proposition that nor Russia nor U.S. made it to the moon. Actually you will find if you research back in 1960’s the Russians sent four of their Cosmonauts out and something horrible happened that has been kept under wraps for over 40 years+. You see, the Van Allen Belt as any 9th grader would know protects us from the Space radiation No flesh can survive outside of the Belt. We don’t have any to shield this kind of Radiation. HOWEVER, supernatural beings, fallen angels (ORBS) would be able to……Portals allows the supernatural to go “to and fro” from the first heaven to the second Heaven by human sacrifice (life force energy), destruction, disasters death opens the portals. Now they have CERN, and other manmade structures that can open those portals.

If you would actually take the time, to research over 3 to 10 sources as a rule you will find that the fallen angels once they gather enough life force energy can manifest in this physical world. St Germain, El Morya, Sanada Immanuel, DK, and many others have done so already. They channel, they use Avatars and they have Chela’s. They come for councils at every Wesak festival and they meet every century to measure progress. One in particular you should research. His name in the New Age Vernacular is “sanat Kumara” 🙂

Now, relative to the Heavens. Well, in all due respect, you are not correct about the Bible not telling us about the Heavens. Its all there.

Here is a segment of some research I have acquired…to explain it. No need to rewrite it.

The Hebrew word for “heavens” is shamayim, it is in a plural form, meaning “heights,” “elevations.” It is found in the first verse of the Bible (Genesis 1:1; 2:1). The Bible teaches in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth, he did not make another heaven after this time. The phrase “heavens and earth” are used to indicate the whole universe (Genesis 1:1; Jeremiah 23:24; Acts 17:24). According to the Jewish tradition from the Bible there were three heavens. All are attributed to God as the creator. Psalm 102:25 “Of old You laid the foundation of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands.”

There are several other words used in the Hebrew, the word marom is also used (Psalms 68:18; 93:4; 102:19, etc.) as equivalent to shamayim.

The Bible speaks of three heavens not 7 and these are not dimensions). The first being our immediate atmosphere, the second is outer space as far as it stretches, and the third is the place where God himself dwells. What Jesus called the “Father’s house.”

First heaven – The firmament, Earths Atmosphere -which is the immediate sky, where the “fowls of the heaven” (Genesis 2:19; 7:3,23; Psalms 8:8, etc.), “the eagles of heaven” (Lamentations 4:19), it is our atmosphere that surrounds the earth.

Gen 1:14 Then God said, “Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to divide the day from the night.” The first heaven consists of the clouds and the atmosphere, the heavens above us, until we come to the stars.

Psalms 78: 23-23 “Yet He had commanded the clouds above, and opened the doors of heaven, had rained down manna on them to eat, and given them of the bread of heaven.”

The expression doors of heaven or windows of heaven involved the firmament, our atmosphere. Descriptions used of this heaven is from where God would provide food or rain. Genesis 7:11-12: “the windows of heaven were opened. And the rain was on the earth forty days and forty nights.” Genesis 8:2: “The fountains of the deep and the windows of heaven were also stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained” Malachi 3:10 Says the LORD of hosts, “If I will not open for you the windows of heaven And pour out for you such blessing That there will not be room enough to receive it.” In reference to an abundant harvest of crops.“

(Deuteronomy 11:17 “Then the LORD’s anger will burn against you, and he will shut the heavens so that it will not rain and the ground will yield no produce….” Deuteronomy 28:12: “The LORD will open the heavens, the storehouse of his bounty, to send rain on your land in season and to bless all the work of your hands.”

The second heaven is the starry heavens, where our atmosphere ends. It is the heavens in which the sun, moon, and stars are fixed in orbit. The stars are seemingly endless and the distance between all of them is staggering no wonder the Bible states Psalm 19:1 “The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament shows His handiwork.” In ancient times people were in awe of the starry expanse, today we know how immense this really is.

The firmament, or expanse, raqiya` “In which the sun, moon, stars, and constellations are fixed.” Genesis 1:17: And God placed them in the Firmament of heaven. Isaiah 40:22: He stretcheth out the heavens as a CURTAIN, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in.”

(Psalm 19:4,6) – “In the heavens he has pitched a tent for the sun… It rises at one end of the heavens and makes its circuit to the other;…” (Jeremiah 8:2) – They will be exposed to the sun and the moon and all the stars of the heavens which they have loved and served….”

Third Heaven – This is where God and the holy angels (and creatures) and spirits of just men dwell. It is called “The heaven of heavens,” (Deuteronomy 10:14; 1 Kings 8:27; Psalms 115:16; 148:4). (1Kings 8:27) – “The heavens, even the highest heaven, cannot contain you.” (Psalm 2:4) The One enthroned in heaven laughs; The LORD scoffs at them.”

The third heaven is beyond the space and stars. Where no man has seen by telescope. This heaven is the dwelling-place of God, to which Paul was taken, and whose wonders he was permitted to behold-this region where God dwells.

It is specifically named “the third heaven” by Paul in 2 Cor.12:2. Paul mentions being caught up to paradise in 2 Corinthians 12:4 the word “paradise” describes a different facet of “the third heaven.”

“2 Corinthians 12:4 The word “paradise” paradeisos (NT:3808) occurs but three times in the New Testament; Luke 23:43; 2 Corinthians 12:4; Revelation 2:7. It occurs often in the Septuagint, as the translation of the word garden; Genesis 2:8-10,15-16; 3:1-3,8,16,23-24; 13:10; Numbers 24:6; Isaiah 51:3; Ezekiel 28:13; 31:8-9; Joel 2:3. And also Isaiah 1:30; Jeremiah 29:5; and of the word pardeec (OT:6508) in Nehemiah 2:8; Ecclesiastes 2:5; Song of Solomon 2:13” (from Barnes’ Notes).

Heb 4:14 “Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, (Jesus ascended to the place he was before he became man) Heb. 7:26 “For such a High Priest was fitting for us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and has become higher than the heavens” meaning he is more important than the dwelling place of God and angels. Heb 8:1 As our high Priest, he “is seated at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens.”

The word “heavens” is also used for visions or a spiritual event. Stephen said, “Look! I see the heavens opened and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God!” (Acts 7:56) Mark 1:10 When Jesus was baptized “He saw the heavens parting and the Spirit descending upon Him like a dove.” The term heaven is used in a metaphor Isaiah 14:13,14; “doors of heaven” (Psalms 78:23); heaven “shut” (1 Kings 8:35); “opened” (Ezekiel 1:1). (The “kingdom of heaven” (Mt.25:1; Jms 2:5). The “eternal kingdom” (2 Pt.1:11).The “eternal inheritance” (1 Pt.1:4; Hebrews 9:15). The “better country” (Hebrews 11:14, 16).

Heaven is the abode of the righteous who are in possession of “everlasting life,” “an eternal weight of glory” (2 Corinthians 4:17), where they are delivered from all sufferings for ever, a deliverance from all evils (2 Corinthians 5:1,2). Christ calls it his “Father’s house” (John 14:2), also “paradise” (Luke 23:43).

2 Cor. 12:4; Revelation 2:7). It is the location of “The heavenly Jerusalem” before it comes to earth (Galatians 4:26; Hebrews 12:22; Revelation 3:12). Heaven is the inheritance of all believers where there is “fulness of joy,” everlasting blessedness. The “place, of our inheritance where Jesus went ahead to “prepare” for us (John 14:2) that we may be with him, where he is.

Mr. Gambill. You are either confused or misinformed. The LXX predates Origen by at least a hundred years. You are confusing his Hexapla with the Septuagint. And again, unless you actually know Hebrew or Greek, you cannot tell if something has been mistranslated. You can only speculate, and your speculation is meaningless in this discussion on this topic.

Arthur, you are misinformed by schools of Theology that are in fact biased and not credible literally from Harvard to any small college or High School in the USA. First of all the Septuagint was not created in 285 BC. That is an out and out lie from the Humanist group of Educators. Today the Council of Foreign Relations control all Colleges and Universities, including Freemasons control of High Schools under the Humanist Manifesto. This means that their professors and teachers are Dirty and in fact following the dictates of the Illuminati. God help you if you are a member of these groups. Lets start with a Harvard Product and CFR member….Dr. Chester M. Pierce

quote from Dr. Chester M. Pierce Professor of education and psychiatry at Harvard.Teachers must change attitudes and values of students. 1973

“Every child in America entering school at the age of 5 is mentally ill because he comes to school with certain allegiances to our founding fathers, toward our elected officials, toward his parents, toward a belief in a supernatural being, and toward the sovereignty of this nation as a separate entity. It’s up to you as teachers to make all these sick children well — by creating the international child of the future”

No one is in need to learn Greek nor Hebrew. You lack faith in God we do not. We have the inerrant word of God in the KJV you shills and those with an agenda will not succeed in hiding the true word of God once the ball is in motion. The HOLY SPIRIT will override all your efforts.

Not confusing the Septuagint whatsoever…..I know what I’m talking about and I’m not being deceptive.

Quote from a Humanist – Charles F. Potter

“Education is thus a most powerful ally of humanism, and every American school is a school of humanism. What can a theistic Sunday school’s meeting for an hour once a week and teaching only a fraction of the children do to stem the tide of the five-day program of humanistic teaching?”

– Charles F. Potter, “Humanism: A New Religion,” 1930

Quote from Herbert London: New York University declared. in 1987l

“The strides made by Marxism at American universities in the last two decades are breathtaking,” says New York University’s Herbert London. “Every discipline has been affected by its preachment, and almost every faculty now counts among its members a resident Marxist scholar.”(1) Duke University Slavic Languages professor Magnus Krynski described increasing Marxist presence on his campus—a presence actively encouraged by the university administration, which, he says, is “faddishly” luring Marxist literary critics to Duke with large salaries.”

A Marxist/Leninist cultural revolution is now, and has been for some time, taking place in American universities where Marxism is alive and well. U.S. News and World Report reported that there are ten thousand Marxist professors on America’s campuses.

“In my book Tenured Radicals—first published in 1990 and updated in 1998—I noted,

With a few notable exceptions, our most prestigious liberal arts colleges and universities have installed the entire radical menu at the center of their humanities curriculum at both the undergraduate and the graduate levels.

Every special interest—women’s studies, black studies, gay studies, and the like —and every modish interpretative gambit—deconstruction, post-structuralism, new historicism, and other postmodernist varieties of what the literary critic Frederick Crews aptly dubbed “Left Eclecticism”—has found a welcome roost in the academy, while the traditional curriculum and modes of intellectual inquiry are excoriated as sexist, racist, or just plain reactionary. ”

the short list of CFR Members that are under these true quotes of testimony showing the biased cover up of the truth now destroys their teaching that the Septuagint as being the basis of Paul’s writings and shows a true worldwide conspiracy to hide the truth. I’m not done……

The following colleges are the short list of bonified members of the CFR In 1993 alone 300 educators including 30 presidents of premier colleges and universities were on the CFR roles….

Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, Stanford, MIT, Cornell, University of Texas, U. of California, U. of St. Louis, Rockefeller U. Johns Hopkins University, U. of Chicago, U. of Miami, City College of New York, and last on this list but there are many more, would be GEORGE WASHINGTON U.

So, Arthur don’t give me the graduate school high card it does not exist when there is a biased education program that goes back to 1908. to NOW. I have tons more of quotes, and evidence.

A very good explanation on a trustworthy site I have copied and pasted the link ….below. I suggest you read it because others will if you don’t.

Who were the sons of God and daughters of men in Genesis 6:1-4?”

Answer: Genesis 6:1-4 refers to the sons of God and the daughters of men. There have been several suggestions as to who the sons of God were and why the children they had with daughters of men grew into a race of giants (that is what the word Nephilim seems to indicate).

The three primary views on the identity of the sons of God are 1) they were fallen angels, 2) they were powerful human rulers, or 3) they were godly descendants of Seth intermarrying with wicked descendants of Cain. Giving weight to the first theory is the fact that in the Old Testament the phrase “sons of God” always refers to angels (Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7). A potential problem with this is in Matthew 22:30, which indicates that angels do not marry. The Bible gives us no reason to believe that angels have a gender or are able to reproduce. The other two views do not present this problem.

View 1) is the most likely position. Yes, it is an interesting “contradiction” to say that angels are sexless and then to say that the “sons of God” were fallen angels who procreated with human females. However, while angels are spiritual beings (Hebrews 1:14), they can appear in human, physical form (Mark 16:5). The men of Sodom and Gomorrah wanted to have sex with the two angels who were with Lot (Genesis 19:1-5). It is plausible that angels are capable of taking on human form, even to the point of replicating human sexuality and possibly even reproduction. Why do the fallen angels not do this more often? It seems that God imprisoned the fallen angels who committed this evil sin, so that the other fallen angels would not do the same (as described in Jude 6). Earlier Hebrew interpreters and apocryphal and pseudopigraphal writings are unanimous in holding to the view that fallen angels are the “sons of God” mentioned in Genesis 6:1-4. This by no means closes the debate. However, the view that Genesis 6:1-4 involves fallen angels mating with human females has a strong contextual, grammatical, and historical basis.

your right! i can’t believe that this guy who initially sounded wise, but soon after took a turn for the better part for satan himself. what is the greatest accomplishment of satan? it was to get people to believe that he was never there. this guy seems to bring his points out without malice and trying to be sincere, however i think he is not in tuned with Holy Spirit of understanding, but rather has fallen into the very subtle trap of satan himself. he explains the importance of context and power points and the imediate thereafter, but fails to see the simple things in genisis that states that the angel’s found the daughters of men to be beautiful and left their natural state “in heaven” to have relations with them and later bore them giants which were the men of fame. this is not talking about the regular race of people already here on earth because a man having sex with a woman is not out of the norm. this guy just talked himself right out of the truth. and it’s sad because he started of well. i wouldn’t say he’s a minister of satan because i would be judging him, but i hope he finds the truth because he appears to be looking and i hope he finds it and it be given to him.

Where did the fallen angels get their sexual organs? Jesus said that we would not be married in Heaven, but that we would be like the angels who do not marry. Also where did the sperm come from? God did not create the angels to reproduce so He would not have made them with sexual organs.

Thomas Gambill: @beginning and end, certainly the tree was a tree with fruit and the disobedience of eating from it to achieve the knowledge of Good and Evil was the sin.It was the first gospel.Genesis 4:1 does not indicate that Satan and Eve had sex.“I’ve gotten a man [meaning man-child] from the lord, her first one. Arnold Murray is wrong and Christian Identity have an agenda……Yes, the Serpent seed doctrine is not supported….nor is it possible.

THANK YOU, I WILL GO SEE IT IN A FEW MINUTES..GOOD TRUTH HERE..YESTERDAY I DOWSED TALKING WITH A FALLEN ANGEL..,WHICH IS OCCULT AND ONLY DID TO HELP PROVE THEY ARE HERE AND WATCHING….SOME OF THE LETTER’S , SENTENCES AND CODES THEY USE ARE TO TELL ME..WHICH NEPHILIM GROUP SOME OF THESE SPIRITS WATCHING US,..PLAYING WITH ARE..ARE FROM..RIGHT NOW I NEED TO LOOK UP THE GROUP, WHICH BEGINS WITH U< AND THEN WILL SHOW A SIZABLE SPIRIT WHO FLIES DOWN IN FRONT OF MY CAM , ON A VID I PUT UP,,,AS ONE OF THEM I WAS SPEAKING WITH..AND THE DOWSING..SPEAKING WITH A FALLEN ANGEL…I AM LOOKING FOR A GROUP, WHICH BEGINS WITH A U*…….SO GOING TO SEE THE VID RIGHT NOW..TY AGAIN…

Thanks for posting my video here. I have recently posted part 5 in the series, detailing another problem with the “fallen angels” view that I call the “moral” problem created with “fallen” angels “marrying” human women. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnamIbQV-7o

More are on the way, especially since I need to make some points about the Hebrew and that it does not claim “giants” were the result of the sexual union of the “sons of God” and human women. We have people today with “giant” stature, but that doesn’t prove angelic/human inbreeding. And to even assert essentially that the only way for humans to gain tall stature is for there to be some kind of angelic/human hybrid flies in the face of the omnipotent God’s creative ability.

hello arthur, i just think your going about your study all wrong man. how can you not see what’s right in front of you. i believe your a sincere study student wanting to pass a good thing on to people, but the scriptures say something that is totally not what your explaining them to be. your over using your rule, sticking to it in all that your reading from the Bible and therefore it is “twisting” your view of scripture. the same twisting that the apostles Peter and Paul refer to when giving a warning to the early Christian congregations. people who think they have it all, but do not and therefore go on leading people astray with a deceptive art of teaching. relying upon their own understanding. God want’s us to gain an accurate knowledge of the scriptures and this also is what Jesus and His apostles along with faithful ones wants everyone to do so they can gain a clear understanding of the truth and not a watered down version. this is not what Jesus meant when He said to come and drink life’s waters free. it means clarity, purety. Jerimiah 10:23 says that it is not for man to even direct his own step. try asking for direction from God. i know you said that you have been studying for 29+ yrs. and that’s to be comended because the majority of people out there would rather rearrange their sock drawer than exercise their spirit with God’s word. but remember this, that taking in the knowledge of God is lifelong and we shouldn’t rely on a number of years we’ve been studying because the apostle paul said that the light would be getting brighter and brighter. remember what Jesus said to His apostles when he stated that there are many things i can tell you today, but you will not understand them? He meant that new informitive, reliable, life saving information would be coming to light in the future. the future arthur is not over, we still have time to learn until the great day of armageddon comes. just like the flood. it’s not too late to dig deeper as one would for treasure. spiritual treasure. would a sailor or a piolot rely on old coordinates to take him to different places? of course not. if you wnt to go in different directions safely for you and your passengers you would make adjustments. perhaps because of some unforeseen occurences wou may noy be able to rely on your physical compass at all, but have to instead rely on your trained intuition. an intuition that comes from accurate study and application. the studying in this case better be accurate. if not, you and your passengers are dead. so you see the need for a clear understanding arthur? one that makes a man sharp spiritually and able to navigate through this wicked society run by satan and his demons. they want you to have doubt, they want you to lose your life, they don’t want you to cultivate a relationship with God whom they left. do what KIng David did. read, meditate, ponder. linger on the subject if have to and don’t rely so much on formalities, let God form you and shape you. let endurance have it’s work complete like the scripture says. in order to gain endurance we must continually work at it and not sit in one place.it’s like a muscle, if you don’t use it, you lose it. we have a spiritual muscle given to us by God. i wish the best for you, but it is you who’s gotta do it!

I did read something that I’m questioning, but I’ll study it a bit more before I bring it up. It may just be that I’ve misunderstood something.

I’m pleased to see that you included the curse that so many within the church say was upon Ham, and show it accurately. One other point I’d like to make regarding that, which is off topic but mildly connected, is that this curse did NOT result in the emergence of the black race. This is yet another falsehood which is often perpetuated by so-called “Christians” to justify their racism.

Looking forward to part two, my friend. I’ll be getting back to you on that potential issue. God bless.

The “curse of Ham” warrants its own article which I may do in the near future. But yes, you are 100% correct that the curse on Canaan has nothing to do with the Black/African race. And the idea was indeed used as a tool of racism.

Glad you enjoyed the article and look forward to any thoughts you have. God bless.

Curse of Ham came about because Ham had either sexual relations with Noah or his wife, most likely the former. Please look up Phrase “uncovered nakedness” in the Mosaic Law(Lev. 20 KJV )

Gen 9 v 21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent.

24 And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him.

25 And he said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.

Ham saw the act and went and told his brothers.That is why Canaan was cursed and not Ham. I believe that grandson and grandfather are not used in the Bible so this confuses who was being cursed leaving some to believe Ham was the recipient of the curse. Otherwise it should read Noah knew what his grandson did to him

🙂 Nope, Not trolling. I gave you evidence that you will not refute; it was not an answer you liked; and so, when one has no response, or have been given the full load this is the common response..”you are just trolling” However, trolling is giving answers or retort without evidence but with personal opinions and their so called expert advice…..and show of their AMAZING CREDENTIALS. Neither is considerable. Giving evidence is not trolling, giving evidence that can be verified is called educated discussions, debate and exchange of intelligent data. You have provided none. So who is trolling now?

Gambill you said /”@Disciple, no the Bible is clear, Ham had seen his father’s nakedness. That was very bad in those days in that culture. NO ONE HAD SEX.”/

They were not having sex in those days???? Are you serious? so explain why God said in

Gen 9 And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.

How on earth were they supposed to multiply or was the Holy Ghost supposed to overtake their wives and conceive? Please help me out since not having sex is a direct contravention “to be fruitful and multiply” a command given by God himself

@Disciple, NONE OF THE NOAHS family had sex with Noah as many in different cults are tying to “expose”……Same goes for King James as he was a godly man as evidenced by the letter exchange between son and Him.

People has sex…..goodness. However cain did not have sex with this father….

The fallen angels infected EACH of Noah’s sons’ descendants; however, the genetic corruption was thorough and complete in JAPHETH’S descendants, via Gomer’s bloodline (Ashkenak (ashkenaz-disambiguation). The scriptures bear witness to this fact. The Nephilim rule the world today: they are Caucasians. They are the Son of Destruction.

Thank you for your comments. With all due respect, This video is full of errors. For one, the very first piece of “proof” it tries to use is the definition of the word “wicked” based on Paul’s use of it in 2 Thessalonians 2. However, what the author of the video misses is that Paul used the word “Wicked” not “wicked” to refer to the Antichrist. The use of the capital W signifies it is a proper noun. Paul was quoting the Old Testament when he used that title. So the entire basis for this video’s incorrect theories are flawed.

It also takes terms in Revelation and looks up their meaning in Aramaic. Why? Revelation was written in Greek? The Disciples read Greek Bibles. Aramaic has no relevance whatsoever. Like most racial superiority theories that try to find Biblical basis, they have to use incorrect interpretations, wild assumptions and outside sources for support. God is no respecter of persons. I would strongly recommend just sticking with the Bible.

It always amazes me what someone in denial will say (or do), to convince themselves.

The Cainanites were descendants of CAIN.

But as you know, and which destroys your attempts to deny the truth, there is too much evidence that the scriptures were written in Aramaic and translated into Greek (too many Bible scholars have argued and have shown proof of this fact). Even the (real) Israelite man, whom you erroneously refer to as Christ (and who was not a Gentile), speaks in Aramaic in the scriptures (and you know which verse). But his is not the only occurrence. As it is, the image you worship (Jesus Christ) was used in an attempt to replace the seed of Adam–they failed.

As for that Wicked: The PERSON’S name (that proper noun of which you speak) is: Japheth (as the cross-referenced lexicon number reveals in the video presentation. That Wicked is of the Gentiles, and Japheth’s descendants are identified to be the Gentiles (they are called Europeans and Asians today). Or perhaps Japheth’s name (that Wicked) is not proper-noun-enough for you? My suggestion is that you pay attention to the video and the sources that are cited, and research them for yourself.

There will come a day, and it has already arrived, that the Gentiles will be told their origins (you can trust that a great number already know). The fallen Destroyer angels, who have been released from their places of bondage, are here on earth, once again, and they live in the FORM of men, although they are not men (Just because it LOOKS human…). They rule the world from behind the scenes (Benjamin Disraeli, a seed of the fallen, knew this, as he stated this fact). If you are of European or Asian origin, then you are the fallen angels’ seed. And if you resist their final global kingdom, be forewarned: they will move you out of their way, and they do have a history of doing so in the most violent of ways…

As for the Gentiles, the Aramaic word for Gentiles is: women (FACT). As the prophecy states: he will not show regard for the desire of women (his seed, the Gentiles), nor for any god (his demon sons) while he is establishing his final, global government (Daniel 11:37). Your desire to maintain your governments, independent, does not matter to him/them, and neither do your protests, because all current kingdoms belong to the fallen angel who destroyed the Gentiles (Japheth’s bloodline–that Wicked). And until the authority is taken from that fallen angel by the Most High, that fallen angel will do with his kingdoms whatever he pleases.

As far as the image you worship and put your trust in (Jesus Christ), he too was a Nephilim seed, and his fallen angel father does NOT care about his son’s worshipers (that includes YOU). Or did you not know that two of the Nephilim laws states that children of the fallen shall NOT cause mortals or others, to worship them, and they shall not call themselves gods? Another Nephilim law commands them to not eat humans and to not consume blood, but they do. By the way, the other Aramaic word for Gentiles is: deaman (today, they spell it: demon).

Question: Do YOU enjoy your meats rare??? If you do, you should ask yourself why because the children of Adam (humans) KNOW to not consume blood, as this is a commandment in the Law, given to Moshea, the human. The seed of the fallen angels, however, ignore this law and other laws of the Most High, because their fallen angel nature drives them in a direction of opposition to the Most High and His Laws. Hmm: did you know that the word English, when translated, means angel-man? It refers to one who is part angel, part human. The word Engl is actually German ( Engel), and means: Angel. The word Ish, is Hebrew AND Aramaic, and means: Man. ANGEL-MAN. ENGLISH. A human Chimera. Part angel, part human. And did you know that the Assyrians called the descendants of Gomer, the Khmyrra?? Or did you not know that the ARAMAIC word for leaven is: KHMyRRA! . (And no wonder the deamans don’t want too much to be known about the Aramaic language, because Aramaic exposes their identity, as does the Syriac language!)

But as it is written: Although I share this truth with you, you’re not going to listen because your state of denial will overrule your ability to reason without bias, outside of fear and shock. My only advice to you is this: While you are here on earth, do as good as you possibly can (follow in the footsteps of Chabel (You were told his name was Abel, but it wasn’t. And if you understood the basics of Hebrew and its sister-tongue, Aramaic (yes, Hebrew and Aramaic are relatives), then you would know Chabel’s REAL name.)). If you are a seed of the fallen and work evil while you are in the flesh, you will not have rest when you die. In fact, your lot will be consummate thirst and never-ending hunger (of course, you know the parable of the rich man and Lazarus). Believe me you, there are things out there far worse than death…

And I dare say: Either your research if desperately flawed, or you’re DELIBERATELY publishing false information, otherwise (as I said before) you would know that those so-called Canaanites (Chayin-ites, also: Cainan-ites) were descendants of CAIN, one of the sons of destruction. Chabel and Cain’s father was the fallen Cherub himself. The fallen angel who rules this world has some very unpleasant surprises in store for all of you, because you don’t know and can’t see (or you want others to believe that you can’t see ) who your enemy is. And if you’re European/Eurasian/Asian, the enemy that you SHOULD be able to see (but won’t acknowledge), is your fallen angel father.

Again, this is why we are at such a variance. The Bible clearly delineates the descendants of Cain and there is no overlap with Noah. And Noah is the grandfather of Canaan. Not to mention that the root of “Cain” and “Canaan” in Hebrew are not the same word, do not have the same Hebrew shape and do not have the same definition. So the only way one can believe this is by rejecting the Biblical account.

I don’t know of any anicent Aramaic New Testament manuscripts, but I do knew that the Hebrew roots/Black Israelites/British Israelite movements like to make this argument. What you ignore is that ancient paleo-Hebrew is a lost language.

I just don’t see the point in all of it. In all of these racial superiority doctrines, Jesus is always there in a secondary role. The “Race” (which one it happens to be making the argument that day) is always primary. This despite the Bible telling us to “put no confidence in the flesh.”

If you think your heritage is going to save you that is your right, but it certainly is not Biblical. Same for saying Cain’s father is Satan. But what is most alarming in your post is that you encourage me to “do as good as you possible can” as your only advice to me. Don’t you know those are instructions to Hell? It is Christ Jesus who saves us from damnation when we put our faith in Him. Not “doing good” or being a “good person” which is impossible while we are in earthly flesh. I hope you look to Jesus Christ and believe to salvation. Because that is far more important than pumping up your racial supremacy doctrines that have no Biblical support.

I would just like to point out that in scripture during the time of the destruction of the tower of Babel, doesn’t it say that God mixed up all the languages of all the people and scattered the people all across the Earth! Wouldn’t that make it kind of redundant to try to pin point a certain race(s) as being the main carrier of the Nephilim gene. Scripture trumps yet again.

On a brighter note, GREAT article B&E. I look forward to the other parts, I hope they don’t take too long to be posted.

I just wanted to say I really enjoyed this article you have wrote! I have heard of the Nephaili and have listened to many different theories about them. I will not commit to say anything for sure, yet for myself for I am not skilled to understand all the Lord has done except what He has revealed to me. However, I found everything you have put together in this article extremely insightful and very interesting especially when I have always wondered why God would have Israel kill All the inhabitants of Canaan, which with all that you said would make perfect sense! I am very eager for the part two! And by the way, I felt I should say this cause I have glanced through a lot of the comments of your article with people trying to bring race into this. God does NOT judge you by color and in no way are we to do the same and it saddens me that people always try to bring such things into God’s Word! I have a class in college with people of all races and there is times when I look around the room and feel how amazing God is! How we are all connected and one in Christ Jesus! This is what we should be doing, instead of dividing ourselves because of such petty things we should be coming together in Christ for that is just one incredible part of God; how his spirit brings people of all nationalities together as one in one thing… Love in God, Faith in Christ and Hope in the Spirit!!! God Bless great job again

HI THERE thanks for replying i would just like to say i am not racist,it is very difficult to write things without appearing that way,i love most people no matter where they come from or race i have many friends.my story started like this i was intrigued by the film de-vinci-code and thats where it all started watching programes on discovery channels the internet etc,thats where the issue of the chalace comes up,everybody is looking for a cup,now my own personnel thoughts are is,its actually the the human body the vessel,thats my thoughts anyway,know concerning the lost tribes of israel a very interesting subject led me two some starling discoveries,there are different things said about some of these tribes articles in various parts of the bibles seeing there are more than one.some were farming some were more war like ,now i am only looking at little snippets of the bible,that tell you about these tribes and there journey fascinating really its quite a difficult subject to talk about because some are connected to secret societys ie freemasons the knights templer etc,its like a puzzle you have join the dots together and come up with your own conclusions about this.conspiracy theorists say about the royal bloodline being the Cain line.know if you look at the summarians tablets and the pharoes they do seem to wear rather large elongated hats and also the skulls that are shown on the internet.To be honest i have not much knowledge of the bibles ie Hebrew the book of Enoch etc New Testament,know i have been watching various video,s ie Rob Skiba etc .this alien thing i listed on this site seems to be occuring more and more on news sites internet etc also the God gene neathandrafel man,very worrying things really whether you are Religous or not,too me the world is a very strange place at the moment,and my thoughts are there for everyone.

B & E – LOVED THE ARTICLE. i have read alot of the nephelim and yours so far was the most Bible based article that i have read and where it made sense. I was reading the comments and am just amazed how far others take it…it’s there in black and white in the Bible. Sure you can read the book of Enoch and other books that are not in the Bible and they may fill in the background more but i think all you need is the Bible to let you know about the Nephelim. Some of the comments while i was reading all i could think of was that verse and i am heavily paraphrasing…Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools. When you try and throw unsound doctrine in the mix, like the Archons and David Icke’s theory then I believe you are playing right into Satan’s hands and are overlooking the message that God is putting out there. Be on your guard. Focus on Yeshua, let HIM be whom you serve and everything will fall into place. I look forward to reading more.

Am surprise by your attack Sophia , it will do you good to at least read the bible and do your research and not based on videos and or other text there is a difference between Cain and Canaan , there is a reason why God in is infinite wisdom has hidden his truth within his words. It is clearly because of perverting knowledge. Wisdom is the principal thing, Obviously you are quoting from another source that is not the bible but what I don’t understand is the attack on race and who your reference of the seed of Adam is. If you are Jewish then obviously you have never studied the Torah well. In what way are European, Asians and Eurasians bear any resemblance to the biblical description of the fallen? Because they are uncircumcised? , the grandchildren of the israelite where uncircumcised before Joshua was instructed to do so , does that make them Nephillim?,

Hmmm, with argument like your’s now I see why your race still wander in the wilderness.

“Hmm: did you know that the word English, when translated, means angel-man? It refers to one who is part angel, part human. The word Engl is actually German ( Engel), and means: Angel. The word Ish, is Hebrew AND Aramaic, and means: Man. ANGEL-MAN. ENGLISH.” The biggest issue I have is you trying to validate your theory of English meaning angel-man. You use to different laguuages to define one word. There is no german/hebrew language to ky knowledge so how can those two laguages be used to define a single word?

HI SOPHIE NOTSRUB HERE interesting stuff know i dont know to much about the bibles i have been researching a lot and trying to come up with answers,i am on the same wave length as you concerning those in power to day and what they have in store for us,whether you look at the news papers the internet actual every day life you can tell something isen,t right, people need to wake up and fast because the world is going to get ugly for us all ,whether you are christian muslim Atheist etc these people dont care,and you dont have to be of there BLOODLINE has long has you play there game,being a puppet is fine.These people think if you have lots of money you have the power and the right to proclaim that they are gods,This scenario that is happening know in fact has happened many times before,If you look at the egyptians massive populations just vanished,i dont think so,the slaves turned against there masters,unfortunaetly they diden,t get them all,there is evidence know that there were early civilisations in egypt before them in egypt,you can see by satelite photo,s also lost citys under the sea pyrimids appearing all over europe covered under earth making them look like mountains,know being uncovered,If we think Evolution is the truth then people have been brain washed,pyramids weren,t tombs they,were massive free energy ie batterys,yes these people had Technology ,are masters have know stumbled across this in the past and have kept it secret from us [nice of them] Its all coming out know did we ever need fossil fuels not really,IRAQ it just wasen,t about the OIL,This man would not play there games plus,this is where they say BABYLON is they were ancient shrines there with lots of ANCIENT artifacts and knowledge of past times and also ancient TECHNOLOGYS from past gods or false gods.there has been a lot of interest in Antartica for the last hundred years or so,information coming out about a A NCIENT LAKES GIGANT CAMEL has just been found,THE NAZIS OR VRILL has they are known had a lot of interest in this place during the war,AND STILL IS PEOPLE INVESTING LARGE AMOUNTS OF MONEY,they even say this is where ALANTIS is,they haven,t said this ,but then they wouldent would they.Any way the BATMAN FILM THE DARK KNIGHT RISING,i am sure they are trying to tell us something,Why would the vatican have a massive telescope in the american mountains Idian legend says This is where the GODS came down from heaven,look up Thom Horn Chris putman,all interesting stuff and it all has to do with the past and present,be safe people and open your eyes we all live in the same boat .

It is stated that “God sent the global flood judgment to punish those angels who committed folly, destroy the Nephilim and save the existence of the human race”

If one purpose of bringing the flood was to destroy the Nephilim and cleanse humanity of corrupted DNA, but that strain of DNA survived within humanity and the Nephilim reappeared after the flood , then either God failed in His purpose or the statement is incorrect.

Thanks very much for your comment. I am going to clarify that statement in the article. The group of angels who sinned with women and their children were the targets of the Flood judgment. All of them were killed (which the Bible states clearly). God killed all flesh upon the Earth save for Noah and his family. So God indeed destroyed all the Nephilim who lived before the flood. As to your point as to why they would be allowed to continue, we can never forget human volition in the role of world affairs. If humans sin, they will be judged. If they do not follow God’s ways, they invite sin. Ham was not a follower of God and it reflected in his choice of wife. Thus he was judged for it. As will be seen in Part 2, the Nephilim nations are used as judgment against the Israelites at times of disobedience. We are all responsible before God. Part 2 will review Noah and the world he was living in. There were giants walking around the Earth warring with nations, angels openly being revealed and being worshiped as gods and all sorts of supernatural activity taking place. The world in Noah’s day was a crazy place. His family was well aware of this and that it’s root was satanic, hence Noah being a “preacher of righteousness.” Ham rejected God’s righteousness and God’s ways to forge his own. This always brings in sin to a person’s life. We can never forget that when looking at any Biblical account. God could have certainly killed Ham’s wife or told Ham “she’s corrupted” but it is this author’s thinking that Ham did not care about what God had to say because Ham was not a follower of God. There are really many examples of this in scripture. Moses led the Israelites out of Egypt and right up to the Promised Land but could not enter. Why not? Sin. King David brought the ark to Jerusalem where it was supposed to be all along but could not build the temple for it. Why not? Sin. King Solomon had the most prosperous reign in all of Israel and yet led to the nation dividing and ultimately being conquered. Why? Sin. Sin provides the backdoor Satan to enter and execute his next move in the chess match between he and God.

Thanks very much for asking that very good question. I will update the article to address this point. I hope you continue to read the series and provide your feedback. God bless.

God works in divine and mysterious ways that are often incomprehensible to mortals. He gave us an inquisitive spirit and a Bible so deep and profound that it continuously provides us with insight and guidance should we bother look there to find purpose and meaning for our temporary, mortal existence here on earth.

Thank you for taking the time to build this web site and for offering your studied thoughts on various subjects introduced in the Biblical texts. Your work here has stirred me to reconsider my thoughts on the rapture and, more importantly, to think more deeply about the fairness of accepting God’s gift of salvation through the suffering of His innocent Son. Taking something for nothing never seemed to be a fair thing to do, but rejecting a loving gift out of delusional, self righteous pride is quite another issue.

God works in divine and mysterious ways that are often incomprehensible to mortals.He gave us an inquisitive spirit and a Bible so deep and profound that it continuously provides us with insight and guidance should we bother look there to find purpose and meaning for our temporary, mortal existence here on earth.

Thank you for taking the time to build this web site and for offering your studied thoughts on various subjects introduced in the Biblical texts.Your work here has stirred me to reconsider my thoughts on the rapture and, more importantly, to think more deeply about the fairness of accepting God’s gift of salvation through the suffering of His innocent Son. Taking something for nothing never seemed to be a fair thing to do, but rejecting a loving gift out of delusional, self righteous pride is quite another issue.

May God bless and keep you under His wing.

Rick,

I couldn’t help but to chime in on the last part of your statement. The gift of salvation/life through Jesus Christ comes in return of repenting from your sins and following Christ…..and it gets much tougher after that, in a great way of course.

Thanks very much for your well-written, thought provoking response. I respectfully disagree with it and think you have completely misunderstood some of the points made in the article. And I am going to address this racial/superiority issue that keeps popping up in this thread.

1. Meaning of the word Nephilim –I am not going to go into all the details of this word in Hebrew but assume that you have studied it. In short, the word “ylpypn” in Hebrew is a masculine plural participle. The “im” in the word obviously indicates that it is plural. So the root, “npl” gives us its meaning. It the word was the Hebrew “naphal” (to fall), it would be spelled “nophelim” not “nephilim.”It would actually have a different vowel than what it has in the Hebrew. Additionally, it is also why the Septuagint, which is based on Paleo-Hebrew (that has no vowels) uses the word “gigantes” and not “fallen” or “fallen ones” etc. It also explains why the same Hebrew word in Genesis 6 for giants is what we find in Numbers 13 when the 12 spies encounter the sons of Anak who were giants. The idea that Nephilim comes from naphal just has no actual grammatical support. For an excellent treatise on this exact question, I would strongly recommend the essay by Dr. Michael Heiser, a professor and one of the foremost experts on ancient near east languages, which can be found here.

2. “If you confine yourself to Hebrew and the Bible, the conclusion is that the Nephilim were fallen angels while the sons of God/gods were human men.” – While I do “confine myself” to the BIble in my article, the Nephilim are the OFFSPRING of angels and human women.

3.The word folly – You are correct that the definitions of the word “folly” you will find in Strong’s refer to general errors or mistakes. However it is a fallacy to think that those definitions negate the Bible’s use of the word. Concordances are helpful and important, but when studying the Bible it is important to remember that first and foremost, the Bible defines itself, by itself. And from studying Scripture it is clear that “folly” in the Bible has a sexual connotation, even though Strong’s concordance does not define it that way. Once again, the Septuagint confirms this because it does not use the word folly in Job 4 – it uses “perverseness” to describe the sin of the angels, which obviously has a sexual connotation to it. So there is no inconsistency in the interpretation at all. In Genesis Chapter 6, sinful angels had illicit sexual relations with human women and their offspring were giants. 4.Race argument/Ham and Black People/Racism —This notion seems to keep popping up so I am going to try and explain it carefully. The sin nature that all humans have came from our human ancestor, Adam. So there is no point debating which race has sin and which doesn’t because all people have sinned and fallen short of God’s glory (Romans 3:23). There is sin within us all (Romans 7). We were all conceived in sin and shaped in iniquity (Psalm 51).

Now onto the racial aspect. The notion that “All African peoples are from Ham, All White People are from Japheth and everyone else is from Shem” is not Biblical. Where is this ever said in the Bible? Show me the chapter and verse. The maps or articles that depict these things are made by people who do not acknowledge the Bible’s account that the world was a pangea. There were no separate continents after the flood. There was only one (and just looking at a world map and seeing Africa and South America it’s quite obvious they fit together like puzzle pieces). So why do I bring this up? Because at one point in world history, according to Scripture, the entire world lived in one area: “Genesis 11:And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar; and they dwelt there.” – Genesis 11:1-2.

This is the post-flood world right before the construction of the Tower of Babel. All of Ham, Shem and Japheth’s children all lived among each other in Shinar. The entire world population was completely inter-mixed at the time of the Tower of Babel. So all people of all races were mixed with each other. It was only God confusing the languages after ending sinful man’s attempted rebellion with the tower did people separate and then later on the Earth physically separated into continents (Genesis 10:25). So any notion that after the flood Ham went south, Japheth went northeast and Shem just “chilled” where he was, is fallacious. Their children lived among each other, marrying each other and having many, many more children for many generations as the Tower of Babel was over 300 years after the flood by Biblical chronology. So you could very well be a descendant of Shem, whose great grandchildren then went to Africa after the tower of Babel.

“When you say that Ham’s descendants carried the Nephilim gene, you are essentially saying that we Africans carry the genes of satan and that the rest of the white skinned people descended from Japeth and Shem are kind of pure!”

No, that’s not what I am saying actually. First off, you initally based your racial theory on Cush, but now you are equating Ham with all African people, even though the Bible never does this (Ham lived in the Middle East). Secondly, there is no direct lineage to Africa, Asia or Europe listed in the Bible. So trying to make assumptions about you being a direct descendant of Cush is just wild speculation. Thirdly, even if you were, it doesn’t matter. The Nephilim are dead. They were all killed. And as will become more clearer in subsequent parts of this series, not all Canaanites were Nephilim. In a given area there may have been only several Nephilim giants living among thousands of humans. This is what the Bible depicts over and over. And the Nephilim were given the position of prominence and leadershipin their respective nations. So just because someone was Canaanite, did not mean they were a Nephilim. Trying to extrapolate this to 2012 and say that some people have Nephilim genes because of their skin color has absolutely no Biblical basis and completely misunderstands the point of the article.

Finally, all of this focus on race is contrary to the message of the Gospel. And that message says that God: “.. made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:” — Acts 17:24-25.

No race has anything to glory in in this world. All the races have rejected God, blasphemed Him, disobeyed, disrespected and sinned against His Holy Name. All people of all races deserve death and Hell. And just as the African American spiritual says we were all there when they crucified Jesus Christ The Lord. We all put sins on Him that God punished. So race has ZERO significance when it comes to salvation. Jesus redeems all people who believe in Him, period. I understand that this “Ham curse” argument was used in slavery times in the US and it was despicable. But that wrong and injustice does not change proper Biblical interpretation of Genesis 6. The Bible does not advocate any race over another and frankly, Caucasian people are not even mentioned in the Old Testament. It is really about Middle Eastern and African people. And certainly this site is not promoting any racial superiority theory. Our race will mean nothing before God. It is only our faith in Christ that saves. Period.

5.Genesis 38/Tamar/Jesus’ ancestry — This is a very good point. But the Bible never says Tamar was a Canaanite (that is an assumption on your part). However I will help your argument —what about Ruth, from the book of Ruth? She was a Moabite. Or Rahab? They are both part of the Messianic bloodline and were from pagan nations. But they were not Nephilim giants. I never said that Jesus’ ancestry was 100% Israelite. It was not. But there were no angelic/human hybrid giants in His lineage. That is the point.

Thanks again for your post. I hope I at least clarified the points I was attempting to make in the article even if we do not agree on the idea of who the Nephilm were. God bless.

This whole subject is fascinating and yet seems more convoluted and complicated. After spending my childhood and young adult years in Christian school and church, I am trying to studying Nephilim and Luciferian bloodline without pre conceived teachings. Today in scripture I read about Jacob’s grasp or intertwined limb with Esau’s heel. Reminding me of the prophetic words to Lucifer concerning Eve’s seed (will bruise Lucifer’s head) and Lucifer’s seed (will bruise the heel). Many say this refers to Jesus/cross. The same scenario of Lucifer alone with Eve and deceiving her to ultimately implant his seed is played out again! Lucifer (posing as the Lord) out of blue tells Rebekah that she will have twins (Surely ONLY God could know that. Right?). And without any reason at all, tells her that Jacob and not Esau (who is actually the firstborn and rightful heir of Isaac’s blessing) will be the recipient! Why wasn’t Isaac told this extremely important yet odd prophecy! She herself never even tells Isaac this very important so called Godly news! Makes sense now why Jacob was Rebekah’s favorite and yet not Isaac’s.

Even weirder and bizarre is Jacob’s dream or physical fight with a man/angel in the wilderness. He does not know Jacob’s name and and ignores Jacobs asking of his.Sounds nothing like an angel of the Lord God. Then of all things, Jacob demands a blessing. He finally gets one and is told his new name is Israel. Sarcastically saying it means “fought God and man and overcame”. Jacob then proclaims like an idiot that he has “seen God face to face and lived!” No one has done that. Refer to Exodus 33:20, John 1:18. To this day, Esau’s Edom land is not part of the prophesied area of today’s Israel.

To sum it up. I believe Gods prophecy for the Jews to have a specific land promised to them. But through the biblical heir Esau and not the lying thief Jacob who very possibly is a seed of Satan. Just because someone still has possession of something they stole never makes it rightfully theirs. And I am not pro Palestine in any way.

Trouble with this whole tale, which is real nice fantasy, is that my ex who teaches geology has proven that the ‘Great Flood ‘ never occurred, also that there is evidence that Egyptian, Australian and American Aboriginal, Trojan and even Chinese civilizations that lived right through the ‘Great Flood’ era without even taking any notice of it, nor losing lives from it. She also pointed out that if as Flood Geologists think that ‘The Great Flood ‘ formed the Grand Canyon, according to the column layers The Earth was already 2 billion years old before the canyon started to form. Also the sedimentary rock layers on the top of mountains cannot form via a global flood. There is thousands of other reasons that a global flood never occurred and also there has never been any evidence found of giants either. Though it is a nice fanciful tale, quite enjoyable!

Please note the difference in time of creation. The Earth and Grand Canyon were created millions of years ago. The conflict is the misguided believers thinking the Earth is less than 7,000 years old. This doesn’t match with science, as you wife can testify. The creation of the earth, et all, happened between Gen 1:1-2 and is called the “Gap Theory.” The Earth was redone later after the fall of Satan. All the dinosaurs happened before Adam, not after. This clears up that aspect–though most blind fundamentalists don’t understand the “Gap Theory” The flood had to have happened—look around, the Earth is still almost 75% water. Any explanation re that from Geologists? Hope this clarifies some minor discrepancies.

Your theory cannot be correct either. The Gap Theory states that there is death before Adam, through Dinosaurs and such…… but death is a direct result from Adams sin so therefore death cannot be before Adam. There are better explinations than the Gap Theory…..

Thanks for your comment. The Gap Theory does not really relate to the Nephilim bloodline issue but I will gladly address the verse you cite:

Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: – Romans 5:12.

I think what is critical to understanding the Gap Theory and many verses in the New Testament in general is that the words “world” and “earth” have two different meanings in Greek. The word for Earth, ge means “arable land.” This is very different from the word for world which in many instances in Scripture is aeon, which means an “age” or “Era”. Here are 2 examples:

“Hath in these last days spoken unto us by [his] Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds (aeon);” – Heb. 1:2

“Through faith we understand that the worlds (aeon) were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.” – Heb. 11:3 KJV

The other word for world is kosmos, which means a set or defined order or government. The KJV translators used the terms interchangeably for “world.” So why does this matter? Because when looking at Scripture we have to understand that there are separate and distinct ages and orders that will take place on the same planet, called Earth. In other words, there are several worlds (ages, orders) on the same planet Earth. Here is an Old Testament example:

“And it shall come to pass after the end of seventy years, that the LORD will visit Tyre, and she shall turn to her hire, and shall commit fornication with all the kingdoms of the world upon the face of the earth.” – Isaiah 23:17.

Clearly, the translators are making a distinction between the Earth, the physical mass of land and water we live on, and the “world” which is the current set of prevailing conditions on the Earth at a specific time.

When Jesus The Lord said: “my kingdom is not of this world..” did He mean the planet Earth? No. He meant that this present age, of corrupt man and Satan running amok is not His Kingdom. And we know that Christ will indeed rule on Earth at His Second Coming. So clearly, He was not saying “this planet called Earth is not even my Kingdom.” He meant the present age humanity is living in on the Earth, is not His Kingdom.

Jesus further confirms this in the same verse by saying: ” but now is my kingdom not from hence.” So there will be a time coming when Jesus will have His Kingdom on Earth but the present age or world, is not it. This is why Satan is called “the prince of this world.” Does Satan rule over everything? No of course not. God does. But in this present age and order that humanity is operating in, Satan does have princely authority. And we know it is going to come to an end.

So this takes us back to Adam. He brought sin into this world – meaning this particular age. Notice the verse does not say Adam brought sin into the Earth. Again, this is a very important distinction to understand. Sin already existed. We know this, because before Adam and Eve sinned, Satan was already evil. So clearly, the first sin in the history of all creation was not Eve, it was the devil. So the question is…when did that happen? If the angels sang and praised when the Earth was reformed as we are told in Job 38:15, when were they created? These are things the Gap Theory addresses.

Of course we can disagree on Gap Theory and still agree about the Nephilim as the 2 are not really related but I wanted to share my perspective with you. Please feel free to share your thoughts. Thanks again and God bless.

Exactly, Satan had alread fallen and was/still is–the PRINCE of this World. Therefore, the Gap theory covers everything in a much more complete way than the 6 day creation of everything and the dinosaurs die off, etc. There are too many holes in the explanation of just 6 days. This is one more example of people reading words only without spiritual insight. More scientists would accept/could accept God/Jesus if it weren’t for the errror prone 6 day misinterpretation. God knew the “natural man/mind” would read words only to try and understand–but the flesh can’t fanthom the works of God.

How is it that science is so advanced that they can tell me what happened to the smallest detail a billion years ago and often have a very hard time to describe what is going on in the present days. There are three hundred and twenty five days in a year and we know how quickly natural phenomenons and calamaties can happen so times three hundred and twenty five days a billion times. I’m sorry, I am not trying to disprove what you are saying but are you series? I can’t believe that one man is smart enough to tell me what happened 1,000,000,000 years ago when there are thousands of natural phenomenons going on this very hour and they literally have little to no explanation. Or they will have one hundred theories about one phenomenon that happened in ONE DAY, so TIMES ONE DAY 365,000,000,000 (three hundred and sixty five billion) times. So you could only imagine how many cycles and changes the earth might have undergone. I hope you understand where I am coming from. I just don’t see how the Gap Theory could even be a relevant theory at all in accordance with the timeline that is. Becuase you can’t say 1,000,000,000 years ago the earth was in this state when science couldn’t predict without a relevant record of history the weather or the state of the earth ten years ago if you can understand my point? And the educated know that the weather such as tornados, hurricanes, floods, storms, volcanic erruptions and climate will have deep dramatic impacts on the earth including rapid aging processess in certain areas (affecting the carbon dating process as well) because studies show that places under harsh weather and climate affects the radiocarbon in certain places of the earth. I’m just saying now times that ten years of calamity like one hundred million times and you can probably undrestand my dillema. Look if science can predict a billion years of the past then we could definately work to a better future. BESIDES 1,000,000,000 years is a long time. I think we should focus more on today than a billion years ago. Seriously! I’m not trying to dispute your theory I just need a better understanding. If a man was smart enough to pen point a billion years in the past then we should definately be more knowledgable on the phenomenons and things that go on today I’m just saying . . . .

I would respectfully direct you to NASA scientist Walt Brown, and his book “in the beginning” . It chronicles the faults with science on earth aging and while not using biblical reference shows how the true earth age can be not billions but only thousands of years old. It approaches from geological, archeological , astrological, and biological viewpoints. While I am no scientist ( I chose to follow my IQ , over 140 , into the military flying high performance attack helicopters and later be the RN I am today ) however , I do know that Mr Brown has a standing offer to debate/discuss his findings with any PhD scientist ( to give validity to the debate) with an award of $1,000,000 . It has gone some 20+ years without even an attempt. Perhaps a geologist you know would like to pad their retirement.

When the Nephilim babies where born, were they given an eternal spirit like ours, or were they more like an animal who ceases to exist upon death? I understand they were completely evil, but were they BORN into damnation?

I like your question about whether they were born into damnation. That doesn’t seem fair, does it? I don’t know the answer to that, but I know that Yehovah is a good God and that if there were any of them that wanted to be with Him he would make a way. Upon death, Nephilim have nowhere to go because they are un-natural and cannot go to the grave as humans do but are what are called ‘evil spirits’ or ‘demons’ roaming unseen. They are used to inhabiting a human body, and this is why they seek to possess individuals.

There are horses in heaven – Jesus comes in Revelation on a horse. I think there are animals in heaven too. Jesus tells us that his Father knows when every sparrow falls to the ground, would this be so if they had no eternal nature?

Hi Liz. I think God lovingly re-creates our special pets and He has all of His good creation in Heaven. He doesn’t save the grass here for Heaven, He makes new. He makes new animals, too. We get new heavenly bodies for these fleshly ones. I also think the horses are spiritual horses, the ones mentioned in Revelation. These seem to be more like mighty spirits than regular horses. There is nothing lost in Him. I believe there are all the extinct animals in heaven. I know someone who had a vision of Heaven and saw them. He had no idea what they were and when he looked them up in an animal picture book, he found them, they were prehistoric! This person was a child who could barely read. They didn’t have preconceived ideas. btw Band E is spot on y’all take notice!

Are we being serious? Any heavenly being ALL which are spiritual serve a purpose in the heavenly realms. The spirit realm and earthly realm are completely different, where in the bible does it speak of any animal apart from those that describe the creators Holy attributes. The bible speaks about the paradise a heavenly and earthly one. The spirit realm consists of an angelic order each have their own position. The bible says that MAN was made in Gods image but not animals, and that man had dominion over them. Man was created to live FOREVER sinning cut short that prospect, but no where in the bible does it say that animals were created to live for ever. The bible says there will be a resurrection of the good and the bad but again animals are not mentioned. The bible speaks about a new heavens and a new earth, which means it will be cleansed of any of satans influences and be made knew under the reign of Christ’s millennial rule. So yes animals will exist and many will survive into the the new paradise earth which will exist after the great tribulation and battle of armageddon. Those who go to heaven are called Christs brothers, those like the faithful apostles will make up a heavenly bride of christ, and will reign with him in the heavens. No animal could ever be given such a privileged position.

Revelation 21:1-4 “Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming DOWN out of HEAVEN from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is WITH MEN, and He will DWELL WITH THEM, and they shall be His people. God Himself WILL BE WITH THEM and be their God. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be NO MORE DEATH, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the FORMER THINGS have passed away.”

Revelations 21:24 And the nations of them who are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honor into it.

Revelation:22:1- Then he showed me a river of the water of life, clear as crystal, coming from the throne of God and of the Lamb, down the middle of the great street of the city. On each side of the river stood the tree of life, bearing 12 crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations.

Isaiah 11:6-9 And the wolf will dwell with the lamb, And the leopard will lie down with the young goat, And the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; And a little boy will lead them. 7Also the cow and the bear will graze, Their young will lie down together, And the lion will eat straw like the ox. 8The nursing child will play by the hole of the cobra, And the weaned child will put his hand on the viper’s den.They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, for the earth will be filled with the knowledge of Jehovah. as the waters cover the sea.

From the above scripture we can see that the new earth is ruled over by a new heavenly kingdom. Gods people will be regathered from the four corners of the earth including, and dwell for ever as originally intended. Animals will also behave as intended for they will feel no fear, but love from those who care for them.

The word “strange” denotes something “other” in nature. In this case, the angels who sinned were seeking human women who are different beings than angels. We are not the same “species” for lack of a better term as angels. God did not make angels and humans to “mate” with one another. So for the angels to desire human women, they were going after a flesh that was something other than what was their natural mate. In the same way those in Sodom and Gomorrah did not go after their natural reproductive mates (the opposite sex). Hence the use of the word strange [heteros], God bless.

Thanks for coming to the site but I really have to address your comments:

1) I have never heard of Eustace Mullins or his book.

2) This article is based on the Bible.

3) I removed the link you posted because I strongly disagree with your attempt to link that book’s ideas to this article or this website. Just from perusing the first couple of chapters the book quotes the Talmud, which is not inspired, not Scripture and rejects Jesus as Messiah and the Zohar a mystical book that is the basis for the Kabbalah, which is an occult practice that has nothing do with Biblical Christianity. It supports the unbiblical, Eve-Satan love affair heresy. It also is advancing a number of race-based theories that of course, are never found in the Bible. There is no rational way to think this article has any connection, much less it’s basis on that book. If it was not already apparent, then to quote the President, let me be clear: It is this site’s belief that any racial superiority, race-based salvation or racial preference theologies are of the Devil. Beginning and End in no way believes, supports or endorses any of them. If you want to post your ideas as your own in this thread, or say that you endorse that book as your belief, please feel free to. You are more than welcome. But please do not try to associate this website or its content with it. Thanks very much.

Your article (and I believe that you really do not know the important author Eustace Mullins) is remarkable similar to that book of Mullins. So coincidences do exist and let me therefore put things in another way: your article forms an important and welcome extension of the book of Mullins.

So it is of great importance that you read the book of Mullins and please do not erase the link of the book for your other readers, since your article explains that the curse of Canaan should be seen in the light of the Nephilim which is not immediately obvious from the book of Mullins.

Mullins’ book is also based on the bible and forms an important conclusion of several of his other books such as Murdered by Injection Word Order and The Secrets of the Federal Reserve. This last book was guided by Ezra Pound in forms the first published research of the Fed as the bases of the Illuminati central banking machine which is the origin of the nasty crisis in which we are right now.

The book of Mullins is complex, layered and problematic but should be present as further discussion of your important article! So you and othesr can shine there lights on this complex and important issue!

The fact that this article and that book discuss Cain does not mean that book is the “basis” for the article. Again, feel free to post the link and promote this book as something you believe and endorse. You do not seem to have any issue with the non-Biblical and/or occult sources the book uses or the disturbing ideas it promotes, and that is your prerogative. But this site does not endorse or recommend it.

Let me say this, I like your article and the fact that it links the Canaan curse with the Nephilim story of the bible. I do believe that that story is much more layered and complicated. Looking into it means looking into “disturbing ideas”. The fact that Mullins does that in his books does not mean that he “endorse” them and the same is for me! Mullins is one of the principle researcher of the XX century…… do I agree with all he says? of course not!

Read Mullins, touching upon these issues you can not ignore him and that is all!

I see no Biblical basis for this idea at all. But if it were true, what would it matter? That is the real question. Being an Israelite by blood has no significance when it comes to your salvation. There is only one “seed” of Abraham – Jesus Christ. And we can only be considered true Israel by being “in Christ” and that comes through putting our faith and trust in Him for the forgiveness of our sins. I hope that helps to clarify. God bless.

Rick: It is stated that “God sent the global flood judgment to punish those angels who committed folly, destroy the Nephilim and save the existence of the human race”

If one purpose of bringing the flood was to destroy the Nephilim and cleanse humanity of corrupted DNA, but that strain of DNA survived within humanity and the Nephilim reappeared after the flood , then either God failed in His purpose or the statement is incorrect.

I don’t think he failed. If you notice, the offspring of the Nephilim was hit and miss, and their lot was scattered by God. I think God succeeded. God then chose a people that would both conquer the Nephilim hybrids and teach righteousness to all people.

God sent the flood to save His creation. The giants were not His creation.

That is not Part 2. Part 2 called “Nephilim Giants – Enemies of God in the Bible”will be up soon. Subscribe to the site, like us on Facebook or just pop back in to find it. I hope you enjoy it. God bless.

I have a question: Where do you get the idea that Ham was wicked? My current understanding of the man was that he was the forefather to the black race. As a young man who is black himself, it is rather insulting for you to suggest that this supposed Nephilim gene exists in my lineage. If one were to ascribe to the belief that Ham begat the black race; and that Ham’s wife carried the Nephilim gene, then based upon your discernment, the entirety of the black race would not be fully human. That my friend, poses a massive problem. I found myself generally agreeing with the knowledge you brought forth, until Ham was mentioned as being one of the “wickedest” men. Now, I understand that what he did to his father was considered a grave sin, and that he was punished accordingly (And it is my belief that because of his curse, black people in this day and age are struggling to move forward in society), but based on the “proof” you brought forth; nowhere in it have I seen it stating that Ham was “absolutely” evil. Explain, my good sir.

Thanks for your question. I addressed the racial issue with Noah’s sons in my lengthy response to Michael above. I would ask that you please read it because it addresses much of what you are asking. In short, Ham’s children lived in Shinar, which is in the MIddle East, among the children of Shem and Japeth. The entire world, lived, married and and had children among each other in Babel. This was several hundred years after the flood. So the idea that Ham was in Africa and his brothers elsewhere is just not supported by Scripture.

And I am by no means saying that the “entire Black race carried the Nephilim gene.” The Bible does not say this. The Canaanites as a people do not even exist anymore. And just being a descendant of Ham did not make you a Nephilim. It’s clear from the Bible that only certain people became Nephilim and they then had offspring.

Furthermore, regarding the “curse” of Ham, it was CANAAN who was cursed and not Ham. There is no curse on African or African American people. This is a lie that was perpetuated by Caucasian slave owners in the 17th -19th centuries. It is absolutely false. And while you may think African American people are cursed because they are struggling in society, the statistics show otherwise. But it’s just a matter of how you measure success. If you are going by worldly measures then you may have an argument. But going by God’s standards which is faith in Him and His only begotten Son Jesus Christ, African American people are overrepresented in every significant category. Please see this article for these statistics.

Thank you for clearing that matter up, as this racist teaching is still being taught today. To reinforce that black people are not cursed. Recently a tribe in south african known as the Lemba tribe, was found to have a certain gene that could be traced back to the priestly class of original Hebrews, there’s a documentary on Youtube. These people speak hebrew and practice the laws and traditions even though they are African. This would coincide with another documentary about African slavery of how these poor people were made to change their names and language by Jewish slave traders to hide their true identity. Even after the slave trade had ended, they couldn’t understand why certain families who are living today still hold to their Hebrew language and tradition. No wonder the holy scriptures quote Revelations 3;9 I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars–I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you. They say that 80% of the Nation of Israel who were re-gathered & living in Israel have very little to no Jewish/Hebrew genetics but are Zionist imposters. Masquerading as “Messianic Jews,” these are theTurkic Khazars. which influence the world today. God said what is hidden shall come to light. This evil seed, plan to rebuild the third temple in Jerusalem where for centuries their promised messiah, NOT JESUS has been their sole purpose for such deceit and wickedness. Here is a link which reveals the liars who masquerade as Yahweh/Jehovahs chosen people today.

Where does the bible say that Ham was evil? From where I read in Genesis 10 both Ham and Japheth had evil in the family tree. You’re sick get your head out of stormfront. You’re worse than those “british isrealis” at this point. Oh and don’t bother going to heaven. It says in Revelation that there were all races, kindreds, and tongues singing praises to God.

I just have to say you guys (londonhermit and chillguy) should not get upset about Ham. All of us are sinners regardless of our ancestors and regardless of our race. Adam and Eve both sinned so it doesn’t matter what sex you are either. If you are a Christian, you are: 1 Peter 2:9 “But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvelous light;” Yes, there will be all races of people in Heaven but they will all be born of God. Ham sinned but so did a lot of other people in the Bible. Why be insulted yourself because Ham sinned over 5,000 years ago? I don’t get it.

If you want to learn more why and what happened with the sons of Noah you should look into reading the Book of Jasher. It is not a cannonized book that was put in the bible but it was and still used by the Jews. It was never translated into Greek so the numbers and understanding is better. But it goes more in depth then Genesis. What the curse was in the book of Jasher was the sons of Noah were given a area of the earth for their sons and they had to swear to God not to live in each others. Canaan had already sinned and got a curse from Noah but it was Hams sons that went into Shem’s area which was the Middle east. Hams son’s went further into Japheth’s territories and in this book says that Hams sons are the ones that spread idol worship that started as ansister worship to the religions that we know to day. Nimrod was Ham’s grandson and he lived with and conquered Japheth’s sons and Shem’s also.

Well I don’t believe that angels and demons are the same type of being in Scripture. And I think it was only angels who had children with human women. And after them, their Nephilim hyrbid children had relations and children with human women. But if the question is, is an angel physically capable of having offspring? Then yes. But remember that God created these angels. So their life-giving potential was created while they were still good. It was their own sinful choices that led them to fornication and allegiance with the Devil. Thanks for a great question. God bless.

So angels were designed to reproduce (have sex) with each other? I never knew that. Where can i read up on this? Ok this is a must be a misconception, but if when we die what are we called then? Most people think we’re angels when we die, but that must not be true then.

Are we simply called son of man or a spirit? So you’re telling there’s 3 completely different entities. I’ve been trying to find this out for years.

The Bible does not explain the biological mechanics of it. But angels do indeed have physical bodies. And they have the ability to reproduce with human women.

We are human beings. That is who we are. We are not angels. See 1 Corinthians 15 for more information on the different types of bodies. We have a terrestrial body. Angels have a celestial one. The Bible is clear that they are two very different forms.

As for the entities, you are correct. Angels are different from demons. And our spirit is the human spirit.

Thanks for your reply! One more question though. Who created demons if they are their own entity? If demons weren’t fallen angels then how did evil beings come to exist?

So far what i get out from this all 3 entities indeed have a free will. (Or are demons slaves?) Many churches I’ve been to teach that angels have no free will. That’s impossible as 1/3 of them rebelled.

I really like your article, but there’s one question that I’ve had for a while and hope maybe you can help me with. The Bible only mentions 3 angels by name – Gabriel, Michael, and Lucifer, so nowhere do I see evidence from the Word of female angels, which brings me to my question of : Where did these angels get the ability to reproduce from or produce sperm if there were no female angels to cohabit with? I mean why would they even need genitalia if God didn’t intend for them to procreate ? So, how were these angels able to reproduce with females?

B&E – I don’t think there were any Nephilim Giant genes after the flood in that the purpose of the flood was to wipe that entire race of the face of the earth. If we look closely at Genesis 6:4

“There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.”

That means “there were giants already in the earth” (who were 100% human) before the mating between angels and humans occurred. This could nullify the assertion that Noah’s daughter-in-laws could have carried the Nephilim gene onto the ark. With that said, after the flood, Noah’s sons and daughter-in-laws were still capable of producing giants with 100% human DNA which invariable has a sin nature. If God is trying to preserve the human race, it wouldn’t make sense to have individuals with hybrid DNA on the ark – in fact, anyone with hybrid DNA at the time was very wicked and if that’s the case they would have killed everyone on the ark.

Also, the evil angels responsible for the mating with humans were locked up in chains in the abyss – none were spared so there can’t be any wondering around after the flood.

With all due respect, I have to strongly disagree with your point. The grammar of Genesis 6:4 states that there giants in the earth before and after the flood, because the sons of God went into the daughters of men. The phrase ‘asher in Hebrew is conditional. It in essence means “because of.” So it was the mating of angels and women that was the reason and direct cause of the giants. There were no giants before the Genesis 6:4 angelic-human illicit relations.

Furthermore as was shown in the article and will be shown in the subsequent parts, the post-flood giants are all born “of the giants.” They were not children of angels. They were children of older, Nephilim giants. And through only using Scripture, they can be traced back to the children of Ham. So just going by the text of the Bible, we can know that they have an actual lineage. And since Noah’s genetic line was 100% human, we know it must have been the wife of Ham who carried the Nephilim gene.

” If God is trying to preserve the human race, it wouldn’t make sense to have individuals with hybrid DNA on the ark – in fact, anyone with hybrid DNA at the time was very wicked and if that’s the case they would have killed everyone on the ark. ”

I know this point seems very difficult to grasp. Why would God allow this? But think of it this way: “If God is trying to preserve the human race, it would make sense to have individual freedom for a person to sin. – In fact, if there were anyone who sinned, God should have just killed them all and forced everyone to obey everyone of his commands.”

But yet, God does not do this. Why? Because WE play a role in our relationship with The Lord. We are saved by faith. The faith is within us. Abraham was not saved because God liked him. He was saved because he had faith which was accounted to him for righteousness. We are an active participant in our salvation. The time of the flood was no different. Noah had to believe God to build the ark (Hebrews 11). His sons had to believe him to get on. But they also had to believe God to live God-fearing lifestyles. But Ham left the door open and thus the DNA made it through the flood. Human volition will always play a role in salvation. I hope that makes sense.

Didn’t the fallen angels go after the daughter of men after the flood too…? 4 The Nephilim were on the earth in those days—and also afterward—when the sons of God went to the daughters of humans and had children by them. They were the heroes of old, men of renown. NIV… I just ask given the fact it said also afterward because the sons of daugthers went into the daugthers of men….

The angels who sinned with human women only did so before the flood. The verse you posted is saying the reason for the giants before and after the flood was because of that illicit union that took place at the time of Genesis chapter 6. What you will find in Scripture is that the giants after the flood are children of other giants, not angels.

I have to disagree with you with the wife of Ham. First of all Ham’s wife was the sister of Japheth’s and Shem’s wives. Second of all God wanted the purity of Noah’s blood line to go into the boat if he was okay with the blood line of the Nephillim he would not of caused the flood in the first place. It was the angels that came down to teach the world of what god wanted them to do but to teach they had to take a physical form. It is believed by some preachers and researchers that to take physical form they took on the curse of the earth also. But if you read in Jasher or Genesis you would also pick up that after the flood a couple generations went by and the “watchers” were back again. It also says that the fallen angels that were chained would be let loss in the end times. Remember Solomon said there is nothing new under the son with god and also the saying as it was in the times of Noah should it be in the end times.

Our beliefs about whether the Nephilim existed after the Flood are irrelevant except inasmuch as they align with Scripture. The OT stories about Goliath, his brothers, Anak, Arba, Og, Moses, Joshua and Caleb make it explicitly clear that the Nephilim (DNA diluted by human blood) survived the Flood via Ham’s & his wife’s son(s) and possibly 1 or more of Japheth’s though this possibility (re Japheth’s children) requires more study, at least for me.

I have read your informative article and I would conclude that you are honest in your dealing and you are genuine in your search for truth and intention to spread it.

I, however, have to politely point at some errors and self-contradictions in your explanations that Genesis 6:4 describes sexual involvements between fallen angels and humans as opposed to fallen angels influencing illicit sexual and genetic activities between human men and human women.

Firstly, neither Genesis 6:4 nor Numbers 13:33 explicitly state that the Nephilim were human giants; these common mistranslation arises from the use of the Aramaic meaning of the word Nephilim which means giants as opposed to the same Hebrew word which means fallen or causing to fall. It also comes from relying on the insinuations of the apocryphal Book of Enoch. The Aramaic meaning indicates that the Nephilim were human giants but the Hebrew meaning leans more to fallen angels. Number 13:33 indicates that Anak and his descendants the Anakites, came from the Nephilim and were called Nephilim not because they were Nephilim but because they came from the Nephilim.

If you confine yourself to Hebrew and the Bible, the conclusion is that the Nephilim were fallen angels while the sons of God/gods were human men. From your reference in Job 4:18 where you suggest that the word ‘folly’ refers to sexual error, please note that the Hebrew word used here is toholah (8417 in Strong’s Concordance) and means error without any specific reference; the concordance suggests it is the negative of halal (1984) which means right or shine. The word translated to ‘folly’ in all the other three verses (Genesis 34:7, Deuteronomy 22:21 and 2 Samuel 13:12) is nebalah (5039) which in other translations is rendered as defile or disgrace without a strict reference to sexual impurity, although the context of the verses involves sexual defilement. The interpretation of the word ‘folly’ in Job 4:18 to suggest sexual activities in the same breath as the sexual acts described as ‘folly’ in Genesis 34:7, Deuteronomy 22:21 and 2 Samuel 13:11-12 depends entirely on the version of the English Bible translation you are quoting from and not the original Hebrew Scriptures. Clearly, the original text uses a different word toholah in Job 4:18 which is non-sexual in both meaning and context and another word nebalah in the three other verses that are sexually graphic. On this basis, using Job 4:18 to suggest sexual contact between angels and humans is weak. The translator’s choice of the word ‘folly’ to describe serious errors such as sexual defilement is also questionable because ‘folly’ refers to something that is unwise rather than grossly wrong.

Secondly, your article insinuates that one of the reasons why the human giants were wicked is that they had satanic (fallen) genes, DNA or bloodlines. You also state that the Nephilim genes were carried on to Ham’s descendants through Canaan the ancestor of the Canaanites and Mizraim the ancestor of the Philistines and Egyptians and Cush, the ancestor of Nimrod and African dark-skinned people like me. In fact, the word Cush means black or burnt and sounds like the equivalent words even in my own Gikuyu (East African language), Kiswahili and other Bantu and Nilotic languages. The East African tribe of the Gusii (Gucha) claim that the Bantu people of East Africa descended from a man named Mogusii (which means the black one or mweusi in Kiswahili) who lived in a place called Misri (Mizraim or Egypt). Many African tribes have mythologies that trace their origins to Egypt, though the popular white racist evolutionists prefer depicting Africans as having evolved from black apes in the Congo forest.

When you say that Ham’s descendants carried the Nephilim gene, you are essentially saying that we Africans carry the genes of satan and that the rest of the white skinned people descended from Japeth and Shem are kind of pure!

If you read Genesis 38, you will find that Judah, the ancestor of the Jews (Tribe of Judah), married the daughter of a Canaanite man called Shua and that his descendants, who include King David and Yashua (Jesus Christ), came through Judah’s illicit relationship with his own daughter in law Tamar. Tamar was very likely to have been a Canaanite, because when Judah’s two sons died, he sent her back to her father who was living in Timnah which was a Philistine city in Canaan. In other words, as much as you have tried to suggest that Jesus Christ, the Conquering Lion of the Tribe of Judah, was born in some ‘pure’ line, the book that is called the Word of God (Jesus is the Word of God) shows that Jesus himself had a Canaanite ancestor who had illicit sexual contact with her father-in-law Judah, from whom the Judeans/Jews get their name!

A third statement you make is that Jesus Christ came to save humans from ‘corruption’ and that we are all responsible to God for our own sins.

1. Aren’t you contradicting yourself when you say that we sin because of historical physical satanic genes in us rather than our own choices? 2. If Jesus came to cleanse us from these dirty genes, how would he do it yet some of his ancestors were Canaanites from the impure race? 3. Are you suggesting that the way to become clean and Godly is to have Jesus change our historical genes? 4. If racial or genetic purity is important, would the Jews, who have genetic purity, need Jesus if they are already ‘safe’ from the Nephilim genes? 5. The direct answer from question 4 above would suggest that Jesus was sent to save the people outside Israel such as the descendants of Ham (Africans and Indians) rather than those who are the pure breed descendants of Shem (Semitic) and Japheth (Europeans and Asians)! Do the white people need Jesus in that case? 6. Can the death offering of Jesus change my genetic history, now that I am a descendant of Ham, Cush and Mizraim whom you say had Nephilim genes? 7. What exactly is wrong with people having the genes of satan when the very same book of Job indicates that satan was also one of the sons of God/gods?

When you consider these questions, you will realize that the proposition that the Nephilim were humans who contained genetic codes from some physical genetic makeup from the ‘bodies’ of angel, you will see that the gospel that comes out of the Bible would be seriously flawed and creates room for white-on-black racism. Infact, such arguments were historically used to justify the capturing and killing of black Africans for use as slaves by white-skinned Europeans and Arabs. Your arguments also suggest that Jesus is of no use to black people by virtue of their ancestry; in other words, Jesus is of no use at all because he needs not make a difference among the ‘pure’ races. Isn’t this essentially denying/murdering Jesus and everything about him? Isn’t this exactly what the Jews did? Even today, the Jews and Arabs essentially deny Jesus together with his role while elevating the tribal ancestry over the inner transformation of character that comes from submitting to Jesus.

There is, however, no doubt that the fallen angels can and do influence human beings to engage in sinful sexual practices and genetic modification that can result in abnormal Children such as giants. In this case, however, the actual production of giants and mutants is carried out by human beings rather than direct sexual involvement of the fallen angels.

Thanks very much for your well-written, thought provoking response. I respectfully disagree with it and think you have completely misunderstood some of the points made in the article. And I am going to address this racial/superiority issue that keeps popping up in this thread.

1. Meaning of the word Nephilim – I am not going to go into all the details of this word in Hebrew but assume that you have studied it. In short, the word “ylpypn” in Hebrew is a masculine plural participle. The “im” in the word obviously indicates that it is plural. So the root, “npl” gives us its meaning. It the word was the Hebrew “naphal” (to fall), it would be spelled “nophelim” not “nephilim.” It would actually have a different vowel than what it has in the Hebrew. Additionally, it is also why the Septuagint, which is based on Paleo-Hebrew (that has no vowels) uses the word “gigantes” and not “fallen” or “fallen ones” etc. It also explains why the same Hebrew word in Genesis 6 for giants is what we find in Numbers 13 when the 12 spies encounter the sons of Anak who were giants. The idea that Nephilim comes from naphal just has no actual grammatical support. For an excellent treatise on this exact question, I would strongly recommend the essay by Dr. Michael Heiser, a professor and one of the foremost experts on ancient near east languages, which can be found here.

2. “If you confine yourself to Hebrew and the Bible, the conclusion is that the Nephilim were fallen angels while the sons of God/gods were human men.” — While I do “confine myself” to the BIble in my article, the Nephilim are the OFFSPRING of angels and human women.

3. The word folly — You are correct that the definitions of the word “folly” you will find in Strong’s refer to general errors or mistakes. However it is a fallacy to think that those definitions negate the Bible’s use of the word. Concordances are helpful and important, but when studying the Bible it is important to remember that first and foremost, the Bible defines itself, by itself. And from studying Scripture it is clear that “folly” in the Bible has a sexual connotation, even though Strong’s concordance does not define it that way. Once again, the Septuagint confirms this because it does not use the word folly in Job 4 – it uses “perverseness” to describe the sin of the angels, which obviously has a sexual connotation to it. So there is no inconsistency in the interpretation at all. In Genesis Chapter 6, sinful angels had illicit sexual relations with human women and their offspring were giants. 4. Race argument/Ham and Black People/Racism — This notion seems to keep popping up so I am going to try and explain it carefully. The sin nature that all humans have came from our human ancestor, Adam. So there is no point debating which race has sin and which doesn’t because all people have sinned and fallen short of God’s glory (Romans 3:23). There is sin within us all (Romans 7). We were all conceived in sin and shaped in iniquity (Psalm 51).

Now onto the racial aspect. The notion that “All African peoples are from Ham, All White People are from Japheth and everyone else is from Shem” is not Biblical. Where is this ever said in the Bible? Show me the chapter and verse. The maps or articles that depict these things are made by people who do not acknowledge the Bible’s account that the world was a pangea. There were no separate continents after the flood. There was only one (and just looking at a world map and seeing Africa and South America it’s quite obvious they fit together like puzzle pieces). So why do I bring this up? Because at one point in world history, according to Scripture, the entire world lived in one area: “Genesis 11:And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech. And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar; and they dwelt there.” — Genesis 11:1-2.

This is the post-flood world right before the construction of the Tower of Babel. All of Ham, Shem and Japheth’s children all lived among each other in Shinar. The entire world population was completely inter-mixed at the time of the Tower of Babel. So all people of all races were mixed with each other. It was only God confusing the languages after ending sinful man’s attempted rebellion with the tower did people separate and then later on the Earth physically separated into continents (Genesis 10:25). So any notion that after the flood Ham went south, Japheth went northeast and Shem just “chilled” where he was, is fallacious. Their children lived among each other, marrying each other and having many, many more children for many generations as the Tower of Babel was over 300 years after the flood by Biblical chronology. So you could very well be a descendant of Shem, whose great grandchildren then went to Africa after the tower of Babel.

“When you say that Ham’s descendants carried the Nephilim gene, you are essentially saying that we Africans carry the genes of satan and that the rest of the white skinned people descended from Japeth and Shem are kind of pure!”

No, that’s not what I am saying actually. First off, you initally based your racial theory on Cush, but now you are equating Ham with all African people, even though the Bible never does this (Ham lived in the Middle East). Secondly, there is no direct lineage to Africa, Asia or Europe listed in the Bible. So trying to make assumptions about you being a direct descendant of Cush is just wild speculation. Thirdly, even if you were, it doesn’t matter. The Nephilim are dead. They were all killed. And as will become more clearer in subsequent parts of this series, not all Canaanites were Nephilim. In a given area there may have been only several Nephilim giants living among thousands of humans. This is what the Bible depicts over and over. And the Nephilim were given the position of prominence and leadership in their respective nations. So just because someone was Canaanite, did not mean they were a Nephilim. Trying to extrapolate this to 2012 and say that some people have Nephilim genes because of their skin color has absolutely no Biblical basis and completely misunderstands the point of the article.

Finally, all of this focus on race is contrary to the message of the Gospel. And that message says that God: “.. made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:” — Acts 17:24-25.

No race has anything to glory in in this world. All the races have rejected God, blasphemed Him, disobeyed, disrespected and sinned against His Holy Name. All people of all races deserve death and Hell. And just as the African American spiritual says we were all there when they crucified Jesus Christ The Lord. We all put sins on Him that God punished. So race has ZERO significance when it comes to salvation. Jesus redeems all people who believe in Him, period. I understand that this “Ham curse” argument was used in slavery times in the US and it was despicable. But that wrong and injustice does not change proper Biblical interpretation of Genesis 6. The Bible does not advocate any race over another and frankly, Caucasian people are not even mentioned in the Old Testament. It is really about Middle Eastern and African people. And certainly this site is not promoting any racial superiority theory. Our race will mean nothing before God. It is only our faith in Christ that saves. Period.

5. Genesis 38/Tamar/Jesus’ ancestry — This is a very good point. But the Bible never says Tamar was a Canaanite (that is an assumption on your part). However I will help your argument — what about Ruth, from the book of Ruth? She was a Moabite. Or Rahab? They are both part of the Messianic bloodline and were from pagan nations. But they were not Nephilim giants. I never said that Jesus’ ancestry was 100% Israelite. It was not. But there were no angelic/human hybrid giants in His lineage. That is the point.

Thanks again for your post. I hope I at least clarified the points I was attempting to make in the article even if we do not agree on the idea of who the Nephilm were. God bless.

Great article, but I would have to disagree with the assertion that Canaan carried a gene his brothers didn’t. The scripture says that,”There were giants in the earth in those days ; and also after that , when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men…” As I read it, it seems to be saying that when the sons of God mate with human women giants are born to them and this happened before and after the flood. At rate this is a very important article andwebsite. God bless your ministry.

Dear fellow human if I may say, why have you missed the mark so far? You seem amazed and convinced that giants came by angels uniting with humans in sexual relations, but none of you have considered the fact that even the animals were and plants giants, and this is a well known fact that you may need to study.

If you look at it from a scientific view, this world and all its habitation has been going through a devolution instead of evolution. everything was huge in the past. People back then where not as affected by sin as we are. They lived to be even 900 years as you check your bible records. This shows that mankind was truly a better back then that he is now.

The is not one passage of scripture that confirms that the name sons of God belongs to fallen angels, because in the bible, a son is truly a son by character [Joh 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:]; [1Jn 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.] , so the book of Job is not saying evil angels met with God, it only makes a note of Satan, and the conversation between him and God suggests that He came uninvited.

Those that disobeyed God cannot be called sons of God, because to be called by His name, means you live by His name (being given the power to become a son of God is going from a desire to do good, and actually doing good through Christ, for Christ), this you may study more closely. The scriptures also show that all that disobeyed God were called by many names such as children of Belial (Judges 19:22); (Luke 20:34); (John 8:44)….

Genesis 6 is more in harmony with Genesis 4:26 [Gen 4:25 And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew. Gen 4:26 And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.]

From Seth comes the line of righteous mankind (which fits the word sons of God) and as the scriptures strongly warn against marriage between God’s children and those that have no fear of God, so we have in Genesis 6 a first reason why we must not marry one who does not fear God. These sons of God allowed passion to rule over reason and therefore married the daughters that came through the line of Cain. The same is happening today, and that is why sin is increasing.

My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children. As they were increased, so they sinned against me: therefore will I change their glory into shame. They eat up the sin of my people, and they set their heart on their iniquity. And there shall be, like people, like priest: and I will punish them for their ways, and reward them their doings. Hos 4:6-9

In all the bible there has never been a warning to watch that you should not be found marrying some fallen angel, but that bible clearly warns that who you marry, if they fear not the Lord, regardless that they claim to be Christian, that person will be Satan’s entry point to that family, and to those children, thus killing the heart of the race (families). That is why the scripture says: [For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.] Mat 24:38-39.

Someone mentioned strange flesh as women, that is very sad and wrong! Take not that it is not just the marriage problems, but eating and drinking. Eze 16:49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy. Jud 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Thanks for your very thoughtful post. I just wanted to make a few quick comments:

1. Humanity “devolving” — You said:

If you look at it from a scientific view, this world and all its habitation has been going through a devolution instead of evolution. everything was huge in the past. People back then where not as affected by sin as we are. They lived to be even 900 years as you check your bible records. This shows that mankind was truly a better back then that he is now.

This is never stated in Scripture. We are told in Scripture that through Adam “all die.” Sin and death entered the world by one man, Adam, of whom we are all descendants. Furthemore, we know from the time of Noah’s flood itself that the world was overrun with evil:

“And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.” – Genesis 6:5-6.

Humanity was so evil at that time, God regereted even creating man and was grieved over the human race. And let’s not forget that He chose to destroy the entire global population save 8 people. So suffice to say, based on Scripture, humanity was indeed extremely evil, in the antedeluvian world.

2. Who Are the “sons of God”? — You said:

The is not one passage of scripture that confirms that the name sons of God belongs to fallen angels,

However, you do not address any of the Scriptures that the articles puts forth supporting the interpretation of “sons of God” as angels. I would ask you to consider them and share how you interpret those Scriptures.

I’m always happy to study scripture. And even if can’t be done face to face, it’s great to have good discussion on the web too. God bless.

Hi, Please study Genesis 5, it states clearly that people live to be very old.

Beginning and End: This is never stated in Scripture. We are told in Scripture that through Adam “all die.” Sin and death entered the world by one man, Adam, of whom we are all descendants. Furthemore, we know from the time of Noah’s flood itself that the world was overrun with evil:

I did not talk about the quotes that you made of the name “sons of God” being angels because all over the old Testament the name Elohyim is used on every place where you find the name God in english. I will mention that the word son is the very same word used to describe humans. “Gen 6:3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.” this scripture indicates that this is a human problem, and this was the 120 years before the flood. Mat 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

Angels are not humans, they do not have our passions, if they were like us, then we would not need to be freed from them, but would free ourselves. Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. From what I can see, it is easier for Satan to play a trick that should take our attention away from the real problem, unions that will destroy Gods purposes in bringing up a righteous people to finish the work that we may go home.

“And God said unto Abraham, Thou shalt keep my covenant therefore, thou, and thy seed after thee in their generations. Gen 24:2 And Abraham said unto his eldest servant of his house, that ruled over all that he had, Put, I pray thee, thy hand under my thigh: And I will make thee swear by the LORD, the God of heaven, and the God of the earth, that thou shalt not take a wife unto my son of the daughters of the Canaanites, among whom I dwell: But thou shalt go unto my country, and to my kindred, and take a wife unto my son Isaac.” Gen 24:2-4 Abraham knew this well as he refused just any good looking face to be Isaac’s wife, you find the same with Jacob and his brother’s choices being bad.

You are very correct to say that man was exceeding wicked, but seeing that God created such powerful beings, He then for the sake of future generations had to destroy them. After the flood we find that The avarage age moves from 900 to 500 going lower and lower. If you pay attention, the human diet was plant based Genesis 1:29-30 as well as the animal diet. After the flood ” And Noah lived after the flood three hundred and fifty years. And all the days of Noah were nine hundred and fifty years: and he died.” Gen 9:28-29. God is His wisdom added flesh to our diet to reduce the years permanently. If a mother its a bad diet, it will affect the child no doubt.

God in His mercy also guided Noah in choosing what animals to eat as Genesis 7 indicates clean and unclean animals which Lev 11 explains more clearly. “Isa 65:3 A people that provoketh me to anger continually to my face; that sacrificeth in gardens, and burneth incense upon altars of brick; Isa 65:4 Which remain among the graves, and lodge in the monuments, which eat swine’s flesh, and broth of abominable things is in their vessels” and “Isa 66:17 They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, eating swine’s flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD” (the new testament does not support eating anything you wish, but that is not the topic for now)

Abraham: If a mother its a bad diet, it will affect the child no doubt.

I meant to say if a mother eats. and on the animal side, yes some animals remained with the no flesh diet, but as the scriptures say “Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord…” Gen 3:17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Rom 8:22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.

1. Lifespans – You are now shifting your argument. You initially said that people had such long lifespans because they were morally superior to people of today. Now you are attributing it to their diet and being created as “more powerful beings.” Neither of these have any scriptural support. We are never told that Noah was more powerful than the average human of today. Also please note I am not disputing that the patriarchs had long lifespans at all. I just believe it was for an entirely different reason than the ones being discussed.

2. Sons of God — It seems odd that you would say the interpretation in the article is wrong but not even address the actual verses or explain what would be a proper interpretation. But to clarify, the term sons of God is a phrase in Hebrew. b’nai ha elohim is a different term in Hebrew than just the wordelohim. And the contextual use of the phrase clearly supports this. If we are going to truly rightly divide Scripture, you should be able to go to the specific texts I cite and show their appropriate meaning.

3. Angels — Yes, angels are a different species and race from humanity. But you will find angels referred to as men all throughout scripture: “And the Lord appeared unto him [Abraham] in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day; And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground, And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in thy sight, pass not away, I pray thee, from thy servant” – Genesis 18:1-3.

“And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing them rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground….and they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them..But the men put forth their hand, and pulled Lot into the house to them, and shut to the door…And they smote the men that were at the door of the house with blindness, both small and great: so that they wearied themselves to find the door.” – Genesis 19:1-11.

“And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. — Acts 1:9-11.

In all 3 passages, from both the Old Testament and New, angels are referred to as “men.” Now do I think they are the same as men? No, not at all. However the Bible just uses the word as a descriptive term for angels as various times. Again, this is why we should be discussing the actual verses from the article and their context to grasp the real meaning. So if you want to do so, I am happy to discuss them. God bless.

I don’t think you understood me when I spoke of the effects of sin. I was not saying that sin was not in abundance, but that its effects where not as are so clearly seen now. Do not forget that these people where fresh from the perfect genes of Adam who was created perfect and without defect. He there is not even a record of disease with the world before the flood, the condition of things made it perfect for sin to flourish undisturbed, but the effects of sin come from the curse of God as seen in Genesis 3. God’s curse brings about a change in our lives for our good.

“For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.” Rom 8:20-22.

Angels have come to the world looking like mankind yes, but that is not their true look for they are spirits, they can take different forms, and this they did, coming looking like us so as to not alarm anyone. Abraham did not even know the 3 man that came to him that it was God with 2 angels. But when you read of the angels being seen in heaven, they look very different (Study Ezekiel 1 and Isaiah 6 as an example. Satan was Lucifer the covering cherub [Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.]

You find also the seraphims in Isaiah 6. The word angel is simply a messenger in its original meaning, and these cherubs and seraphims came as messengers and took the form of man, not really being man.

“Gen 6:3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.” this scripture indicates that this is a human problem.

What I am saying is that it is not correct in that chapter to presume that “men” means humans. The passage is talking about angels, human women and their Nephilim giant offspring. And as shown, angels and Nephilim can be referred to as “men” in Scripture.

Additionally, Abraham definitely knew he was speaking to God when the “men” appeared at his tent:

“And the Lord appeared unto him [Abraham] in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day; And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground, And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in thy sight, pass not away, I pray thee, from thy servant” – Genesis 18:1-3.

Oh the part about the sons of God has never been limited to angels, but to children of God by obedience, this is why I’m not so interested in trying to prove that one. Angel is a word commonly used to describe the heavenly messengers but is not limited to them, for we also when spreading the truth are angels to a dying world.

One of my worries is that you call fallen angels son of God. If Satan was called Lucifer, then why was he after his fall Satan, they that followed him where no longer known as angels but devils and demon, I am just jealous that you are using God’s name so carelessly. Rather you tread softly upon that name, for the angels of God do reverence that name. His name is more than what we may call Him, it is who He is.

And the LORD descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the LORD. And the LORD passed by before him, and proclaimed, The LORD, The LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth, Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children’s children, unto the third and to the fourth generation. And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped.” Exo 34:5-8 what you are doing is not looking at things on a shallow view. The word of God a like a mine, deep and full of precious treasure.

I’m not writing to prove a point, I have no such desire, but I want your heart, that is where the matters of life are, the heart belongs to God, and we must work to turn there heart there. I am not an enemy of anyone who works to turn many to righteousness, I am a helper to such and I once believed giants came by angels, but this found no roots at all as I studied my bible prayerfully, instead it opens room to greater danger

Again, you are not actually addressing the verses that mention son of God, looking at their context, examining the Hebrew meaning, etc. So we are really not having a compelling discussion. Furthermore, when examining scripture, it becomes apparent that “unclean spirits”, “demons” and “devils” are different beings from “principalities”, “powers”, “chief princes” etc. Even though both are evil.

I have full respect for God’s name. But the Bible calls angels, both good and fallen, sons of God. So that is the name I use to describe them. Again, if we are not even going to look at the verses then we can just simply agree to disagree. As I explain all the time, it’s okay to disagree! lol. God bless.

Thanks for this info, I think the nephlin are still around. Remember at anytime human being can be transformed in to giant, we don’t know what chemistry involved then, but know not all people eating and taking same gyme will gain same body of a giant, but some can be come real giant. God will all ways protect us.

Your site fascinates me. It reveals a whole new world of people. I believe the most astounding thing about this article in particular is how many commenters actually believe it is factual. It honestly defies all common sense. I am truly gobsmacked to use the vernacular

I am forced to wonder about the quality of education in the States where on the one hand religious freedom is embraced yet it is okay to overlook and /or ignore the entire geology record.

The fossil record, the Grand Canyon etc..

Truly mind numbing that there are so many people out there who truly swallow this stuff hook linre and sinker.

Hello Arkenaten! If you had ever had the wonderful privilege of meeting Jesus Christ in person you would understand why so many of us choose to believe Him rather than some man or woman’s interpretation of the ‘fossil record’. I personally don’t think the fossil record disagrees with the scripture at all – none that I’ve seen or heard about. There is a God who truly loves you and He is not living in a statue or resting in a tomb somewhere. He is alive and He has all power in heaven and on earth. God bless you and may you have peace.

Sorry, dear, I fear one cannot have a rational exchange of ideas with someone who suggests they have had the privilege of meeting Jesus. Although I must admit, the idea is mouth-watering. I wonder if he would enjoy chatting about football and music?

As for the fossil record, I suppose it depends how it is interpreted. Dinosaurs on the Ark and all that silliness is just not for me.

Hello again Arkenaten! You gave me such a good laugh when I read your reply. You made my day. Mouth-watering? 🙂 I personally don’t play football but if I were a Christian football player, I have no doubt Jesus would discuss it with me. Millions of people living today have personally met Jesus so be careful….you might run into another one. Dinosaurs lived before the Ark so of course there were none on the Ark. But, enough of this irrational exchange of ideas. 🙂 Have another great day! (I’m still smiling!)

Dear Kathy, Well as you (and ‘millions’) have the inside track on Jesus – having met him and all that – I have always wanted to know, does he have long hair, blues eyes and a voice like Robert Plant from Led Zeppelin (such a cool band, don;t you think?) or does he sing his own version of Stairway to Heaven?

When you next see him, say ‘Hi’ from Me. And remember, Jesus is watching you so be a good girl, okay?

Regards

The Ark

PS is a Christian football played better than an atheist football player?

Really Ark? Led Zeppelin? Are those old dudes still alive? Last I heard them was around 1967 and I didn’t think they were cool then. I might have liked them more if I was stoned out of my mind like most of their fans. Stairway to Heaven isn’t so bad but it is monotonous. Is it supposed to put you into a trance or something? I never took drugs, preferring to have my mind (such as it is) as alert as possible, so I’m sure I couldn’t appreciate the full beauty of Zeppelin. You can mock me if you want. It doesn’t bother me a bit. Jesus is the best thing that ever happened to me. He has healed me, delivered me, blessed me, comforted me in the worst trials of my life. I wouldn’t trade loving Him for anything. If you want to know what He looks like, ask Him. I have no doubt He will answer that question as well as any other question you ask. Or, you could look in the Bible which describes Him beautifully. As for your football players question, I don’t know since as I said, I am not interested in football. It would be my guess that Christians are no better players than atheists. They do have a lot of other advantages though over atheists….in my opinion. 🙂

You heard Zeppelin in 1967? Good for you. Everyone else had to wait ’til 1968 when the band was formed.

I never took drugs either and am able to appreciate Zeppelin as well as Mozart. I draw the line at Pat Boone.

I am glad you are not a substance abuser and happy that you have been healed, though it is unfortunate that so many formerly damaged people felt that religion was the only source of succour.

I do not really mock you, rather that you have been inculcated to the extent you could possible accept the veracity of a story such as this. It is similar to threatening young children, accusing them of being sinners and telling them they will go to hell if they don’t believe in Jesus.

You arer an adult so you are old enough I guess. Religion is what it is. If it makes you feel good then that’s fine.

Thanks for your comment. The Gap Theory does not really relate to the Nephilim bloodline issue but I will gladly address the verse you cite:

I think what is critical to understanding the Gap Theory and many verses in the New Testament in general is that the words “world” and “earth” have two different meanings in Greek. The word for Earth, ge means “arable land.” This is very different from the word for world which in many instances in Scripture is aeon, which means an “age” or “Era”. Here are 2 examples:

The other word for world is kosmos, which means a set or defined order or government. The KJV translators used the terms interchangeably for “world.” So why does this matter? Because when looking at Scripture we have to understand that there are separate and distinct ages and orders that will take place on the same planet, called Earth. In other words, there are several worlds (ages, orders) on the same planet Earth. Here is an Old Testament example:

Clearly, the translators are making a distinction between the Earth, the physical mass of land and water we live on, and the “world” which is the current set of prevailing conditions on the Earth at a specific time.

When Jesus The Lord said: “my kingdom is not of this world..” did He mean the planet Earth? No. He meant that this present age, of corrupt man and Satan running amok is not His Kingdom. And we know that Christ will indeed rule on Earth at His Second Coming. So clearly, He was not saying “this planet called Earth is not even my Kingdom.” He meant the present age humanity is living in on the Earth, is not His Kingdom.

Jesus further confirms this in the same verse by saying: ” but now is my kingdom not from hence.” So there will be a time coming when Jesus will have His Kingdom on Earth but the present age or world, is not it. This is why Satan is called “the prince of this world.” Does Satan rule over everything? No of course not. God does. But in this present age and order that humanity is operating in, Satan does have princely authority. And we know it is going to come to an end.

So this takes us back to Adam. He brought sin into this world – meaning this particular age. Notice the verse does not say Adam brought sin into the Earth. Again, this is a very important distinction to understand. Sin already existed. We know this, because before Adam and Eve sinned, Satan was already evil. So clearly, the first sin in the history of all creation was not Eve, it was the devil.So the question is…when did that happen? If the angels sang and praised when the Earth was reformed as we are told in Job 38:15, when were they created? These are things the Gap Theory addresses.

Of course we can disagree on Gap Theory and still agree about the Nephilim as the 2 are not really related but I wanted to share my perspective with you. Please feel free to share your thoughts. Thanks again and God bless.

Gotcha. I was replying to Rohn Timms comment above mine and this is why it is relative to Nephilim. I was taught that the world before Noah had a type of canopy around it and it didn’t rain, but rather the water came from under the earth. This is why dinosaurs/plants were so big is because the earth was like a capsule and everything grew to be huge. It was explaining better to me in scientific terms. lol. Plus, this was also one of the reasons why people thought Noah was a crazy for building a boat, cause no one had ever had a reason for one because the water came from the ground. I love learning more about this stuff and am glad you explained to me your view and I will keep looking into it, because it does seem legit. Thanks again and please respond with your thoughts 🙂

Ha ha. In my zeal to respond, I did not even realize you weren’t commenting to me until I was almost done typing. So I just posted it anyways. Thanks for your response. As for the water canopy – I know this theory and there is nothing in Scripture to really support it. Although it is very true that before the flood water came in the form of mist from geysers in the Earth – there was no rainfall.

I don’t think this atmospheric condition explains dinosaurs. I think dinosaurs existed in the age before humans were on the Earth (i.e., before the Gap). And you are right, people would definitely think Noah was crazy preparing for a judgment they could not even fathom. Unfortunately, a similar situation is taking place right now as we approach the end times and unbelievers scoff at the notion of God and think life will just continue on as it always has.

Here is a link to the Beginning and End radio show on the Gap Theory, FYI.

This is the best explanation I’ve found on the Gap Theory and age of the earth so far. He details Creation and Recreation, Structure of earth, universe, garden of eden location etc http://www.kjvbible.org/index.html

I enjoyed your bloodline article. I am a little confused about the Noah and ham situation.the idea that’s son seeing his father naked causing his grandson to be cursed is a little harsh. Leviticus 18:7&8 and 20:11 would seem to indicate that ham may have layed with his father’s wife and canaan was the result. What do say?

” The flood wiped out the giants but shortly after the flood they returned and spread all throughout the Promised Land.” Isn’t this a contradiction.How could the giants that were supposed to have been wiped out of the flood return then populate the earth again? ***The bible does not tell us of Ham’s wife having a nephilim ancestor or Ham marrying the wrong woman.***.Is it possible that after the flood some other angels could have again liased with Canaanite,Philistine women??

Thanks for your comment. There is no contradiction. We know that Noah’s grandchild, who was the son of Ham, had Nephilim offspring. Before there were Canaanite women, there was Canaan, the man. And everything traces back to him.

As for angels once again having relations with women, that is never stated in Scripture and it can and will be shown why that is the case, from the Bible, later in this series. Also, also the post-flood Nephilim are described as being born “of the giant.” Their parents were other giants, not angels. All of the pre-flood giants died and all of the angelic fathers were locked in the abyss. But the Nephilim gene, which was very prevalent before the flood, was able to pass through on the ark. Thanks again for a very good question and feel free to share more of your thoughts on this.

The bible does show that giants were on the earth after the flood. King Og was a giant, Goliath and all his brothers were giants. There are accounts of Native Americans having to kill a race of red headed giants, which dwelled in caves. There giants were able to run down buffalo and pick them up with there bare hands. The only way that they could kill them was to wait till they were asleep and set fire to the caves.

I’ve read the whole thing and also some comments…quite enjoyable. Just a couple of thoughts…

Since the ever disobedient Israelites did a bad job in obeying God’s command to wipe out the nations around them and not to inter-marry…I am wondering, “where are the giants now?…when did they vanish?” Also, on a practical note…the angels who mated with the human beings probably were gigantic in structure since they can produce offsprings 30 feet tall! Now I am wondering about the size of their genitals (I can’t imagine the genitals of a 30 feet hunk)…but is it practically possible to mate a normal human being? or maybe they can shrink it!… am also wondering about the size of the baby giant., poor ladies, I thought!

Who Married the Daughters of Men? (Genesis 6:1-4)…Source (Hard sayings of the Bible)

Few texts in the history of interpretation have aroused more curiosity and divergence of opinion than Genesis 6:1-4. It is at once tantalizing and deeply puzzling.

What is most difficult is the identification of the main participants in this short narrative—the “sons of God,” the “daughters of men” and the “Nephilim” (or “giants”). An impressive array of scholars has lined up for each of the three major positions taken on the identification of these three groups of participants. The three positions may be labeled “the cosmologically mixed races view” (angels and humans), “the religiously mixed races view” (godly Sethites and worldly Cainites) and “the sociologically mixed races view” (despotic male aristocrats and beautiful female commoners).

By all odds, the view that may perhaps claim the greatest antiquity is the cosmologically mixed races, or the angel theory, view. The pseudepigraphal and noncanonical 1 Enoch, dating from around 200 b.c., claims in 6:1–7:6 that two hundred angels in heaven, under the leadership of Semayaz, noticed that the humans had unusually beautiful daughters. These they desired for themselves, so they took a mutual oath to go down to earth together, and each took a wife. They taught these wives magical medicine, incantations, the cutting of roots and the care of plants. When the women became pregnant, they gave birth to giants that reached three hundred cubits. The giants in turn consumed all the food, thereby arousing the deep hatred of the earthlings. The giants turned to devouring the people along with the birds, wild beasts, reptiles and fish. Then it was that the earth, having had enough of these huge bullies, brought an accusation against them.

The famous Jewish historian Josephus (born 37 b.c.) also appears to follow this angel theory. He wrote, “Many angels accompanied with women, and begat sons that proved unjust” (Antiquities 1.3.1). Likewise, the Greek translation of the Bible of the third century b.c. reads “angels of God” for the phrase “sons of God” in Genesis 6:2. In spite of the antiquity of the cosmologically mixed races view, there are such overwhelming problems with it that it is not recommended as the solution to this problem. While it is true, of course, that the term “sons of God” does occur in Job 1:6, 2:1 and 38:7 with the meaning “angels” (and that the phrase “sons of the mighty” appears in Ps 29:1 and 89:7 with the meaning “angels”), it does not fit well here for several reasons.

Nowhere else in Scripture are we told that angels married humans. In fact, our Lord specifically stated that angels do not marry (Mk 12:25). And though the Septuagint translated the expression as being equivalent to “angels,” it is in fact only the Alexandrian manuscript that does so. The critical edition by Alfred Rahlfs does not reflect the angelic interpretation.

Even more serious is the problem of why judgment should fall on the humans and on the earth if the angels of heaven were the cause of the trouble. God should have flooded heaven, not earth. The culprits came from above; the women seem to have been doing nothing except being beautiful!

Some, however, will appeal to the New Testament passages of 1 Peter 3:18-20, 2 Peter 2:4 and Jude 6-7 for further support of the angel theory. But these passages do not say anything about angelic marriages. To argue from the phrase “in a similar way” in Jude 7 that the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah is the same as the sin of Genesis 6:1-4 claims too much, for the sin of sodomy is not the same thing as marrying a wife from another part of the universe! In fact, “in a similar way” does not compare the sin of the angels with the sin of the men of Sodom and Gomorrah; instead, it compares the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah with the sins of “the cities about them” (that is, Admah and Zeboiim; see Deut 29:23 and Hos 11:8). Thus the sins of Jude’s angels (Jude 6) and the sins of the five cities of the plain (Jude 7) are held up as warnings of the judgment that could come to others. The fall of the angels that Jude mentions is that which took place when Lucifer fell. To connect this fall with the time of the flood because of the proximity of the references in Jude 4-7 would demand that we connect the flood with the overthrow of the five cities of the plain. But the events listed in Jude are successive, not simultaneous: (1) the fall in eternity of Satan (Jude 4), (2) the preaching of Noah prior to the flood (Jude 5) and (3) the overthrow of Sodom and Gomorrah (Jude 6).

To allege that “giants” were the results of such sexual unions is once again to go beyond any data we possess in Scripture. Did the angels procreate without the use of natural bodies? Or did they already possess natural bodies? Or did they create for themselves natural bodies by the use of some mysterious, intrinsic, but rebellious power? Any and all answers to such questions would be purely speculative. To use extracanonical evidence such as 1 Enoch as a witness against or even for Scripture would be unprecedented.

The religiously mixed races view identifies the “sons of God” as the godly line of Seth. Given the sin they committed, they are generally looked on as the apostate line of Seth. “The daughters of men” are equated with the ungodly line of Cain. The sin condemned, then, would be the sin of being “unequally yoked”—that is, the marriage of believers to unbelievers.

This view also fails to meet the test of consistency with the biblical data and context. It uses the term men in verses 1 and 2 in two different senses: in verse 1 “men” is used to indicate humanity generically, while in verse 2 it is understood to refer to the Cainite line specifically. Suggesting such an abrupt change in meaning without any indication in the text is unwarranted.

But even more alarming is the problem of the offspring. Why would religiously mixed marriages produce nep̄ilîm-gibbôrîm (or, as some translate this Hebrew expression, “giants”)? Does the mixture of pagan and godly genes assure that the offspring’s DNA will be wild and grotesque?

This religiously mixed view should be abandoned as well as the cosmologically mixed view. Neither one can stand the weight of the evidence of the passage.

The preferable interpretation of this passage is the sociologically mixed view. “Sons of God” is an early, but typical, reference to the titularies for kings, nobles and aristocrats in the ancient Near Eastern setting. These power-hungry despots not only lusted after power but also were powerfully driven to become “men of a name” (or “men of renown”—Gen 6:4).

In their thirst for recognition and reputation, they despotically usurped control of the states they governed as if they were accountable to no one but themselves. Thus they perverted the whole concept of the state and the provision that God had made for some immediate amelioration of earth’s injustices and inequities (Gen 6:5-6; see also Gen 10:8-12). They also became polygamous, taking and marrying “any of [the women] they chose” (Gen 6:2).

What evidence can be produced for the correctness of this view? There are five lines of evidence. (1) The ancient Aramaic Targums render “sons of God” as “sons of nobles” (Targums of Onkelos), and the Greek translation of Symmachus reads “the sons of the kings or lords.” (2) The word gods (Hebrew elōhiı̂m) is used in Scripture for men who served as magistrates or judges (“Then his master must take him before the judges [elōhiı̂m],” Ex 21:6; see also Ex 22:8; Ps 82:1, 6). (3) Structurally, the account of the Cainite Lamech (Gen 4:19-24) and that of the “sons of God” in Genesis 6:1-4 are very much alike. In each there is the taking of wives, the bearing of children and the dynastic exploits. The former passage ends with a boast of judgment by Lamech, and the other ends with God’s decree of judgment. Lamech practiced bigamy (Gen 4:19), and he enforced his policies by using tyranny. The portraits are parallel and depict states of tyranny, corruption and polygamy. (4) Near Eastern discoveries have validated the pagan use of all sorts of gods’ and goddesses’ names in order to give more clout and prestige to the governments of Egypt and Mesopotamia—hence the title “sons of God.”

The fifth and final line of evidence concerns the nep̄ilı̂m/gibbôrim of Genesis 6:4. The word nep̄ilı̂m occurs only here and in Numbers 13:33, where it refers to the Anakim, who were people of great stature. The root meaning of the word nep̄ilı̂m is “to fall.” However in Genesis 6:4 the nep̄ilı̂m are associated with the term gibbo The word gibbôrı̂m comes from gibbôr, meaning “a mighty man of valor, strength, wealth or power.” Nimrod, in Genesis 10:8, was such a gibbôr. He also was clearly a king in the land of Shinar. Hence the meaning of nep̄ilı̂m/gibbôrim is not “giants,” but something more like “princes,” “aristocrats” or “great men.”

Genesis 6:1-4, therefore, is best understood as depicting ambitious, despotic and autocratic rulers seizing both women and power in an attempt to gain all the authority and notoriety they could from those within their reach. Their progeny were, not surprisingly, adversely affected, and so it was that God was grieved over the increased wickedness on planet Earth. Every inclination of the hearts and thoughts of humanity was evil. Thus the flood had to come to judge humankind for the perversion of authority, the state, justice and human sexuality.

Yes I thought of that, the scriptures say that King Og was the last of giants and he was wiped out. But satan s purose was to infiltrate the Messiahs blood line, so these Giants were also reduced in size by the inter-marrying of humans, becoming undetectable. Notice an identifying mark of these beings is that they had 6 fingers and 6 toes. I remember my mother telling me, that in the old days if a baby was born with six fingers six toes the baby was suffocated between two pillows as they said the baby was of the devil. These are extremes and very cruel. But I believe we all have an element of this genetic defect, hence why we need Jesus ransom sacrifice, this helps us understand even more why we need a saviour and why Christs sacred blood sets us free from this imperfection.

There is a RECENT TREND among the Sabbath-Keeping Community and others, concerning events in the Book of Genesis which are interpreted to evince a ‘demi-god’ race of men. That is, part angel/demon and part human.

The ‘Race of Cain’ and the ‘Serpent Seed’ theories are sweeping across many websites, giving emphasis to the growing prominence of an evil breed of men which are rapidly formulating a New world order to dominate the nations of the earth.

Let us succinctly consider these passages and reason with the Spirit to evaluate the validity of these claims. Here are some of the verses used in support:

Note: We will use the Creator’s name ‘YAH’ (Psalm 68:4), instead of the English word ‘God,’ which is what Anglo-Saxons called their idols prior to Catholic conversion in the dark ages. [ See ‘Restoring the Pure Language – Part 2’ for more details ].

2 Cor.11:3: But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent BEGUILED Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Messiah.

Because exapatao, translated as ‘beguiled,’ is defined as ‘to seduce wholly,’ the claim is that the serpent’s sin was the SEXUAL SEDUCTION of ‘Eve’ [Heb. ‘chavah’], rather than one of the mind, even though the definitions are to beguile, deceive, cheat, and delude, NOT to rape, accost, or physically violate.

Nevertheless, it is further speculated that Eve’s firstborn, CAIN, was the actual offspring of the Devil himself. This in turn is used to explain why YAHUWAH rejected the offering of CAIN and had respect for ABEL, a true son of Adam and Chavah, whom CAIN murdered and was cursed by YAH.

Through this line of thinking, all the descendants of CAIN, the ‘Kenites,’ are actual ‘SONS of the DEVIL.’ Yahushua is supposed to have addressed these very men:

John 8:44: Ye are of YOUR FATHER the DEVIL, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him.

But the Messiah also told the Apostle Peter in his great moment of weakness:

Matt. 16:23: But he turned, and said unto Peter, GET THEE BEHIND ME, SATAN: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of YAH, but those that be of men.

No one would argue that the Apostle Peter was ‘SATAN’ or the ‘SON of SATAN.’ This is merely an expression based on the understanding that to whom we follow, we symbolically become their ‘son’ or follower. Likewise, the PHARISEES whom the Messiah upbraided were following the ways of their ‘Father,’ the devil.

This leads us to the second passage used to support the existence of a demi-race of supermen:

Gen. 6:1: And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

2: That the SONS of ‘YAH’ [H430 ‘elohiym’] saw the DAUGHTERS of MEN that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

4: There were GIANTS in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the SONS of ‘YAH’ came in unto the DAUGHTERS of MEN, and they bare children to them, the same became MIGHTY MEN which were of old, men of renown.

FIRST OF ALL, please be reminded that ADAM, the first man, formed by YAHUWAH from the dust of the ground, was referred to by the Spirit of YAH as “Adam, which was the son of ‘YAH'” (Luke 3:38).

The Hebrew word for ‘giants’ is H5303 nphiyl nef-eel’ = or nphil {nef-eel’}; from 5307; properly, a feller, i.e. a bully or tyrant:–giant. [Not, a demi-god, an immortal, a son of an angel].

In addition, we find three times in the Book of Job, the angels and fallen angels, demons, including Satan himself, referred to as the ‘sons of ‘YAH”:

Job:1:6: Now there was a day when the SONS of ‘YAH’ [H430 ‘elohiym’] came to present themselves before YAH, and Satan came also among them.

Job:2:1: Again there was a day when the SONS of ‘YAH’ came to present themselves before YAH, and Satan came also among them to present himself before YAH.

Job:38:7: When the morning stars sang together, and all the SONS of ‘YAH’ shouted for joy?

The verb form ‘el’ meaning ‘mighty; …idol, mighty one), shows why ‘elohiym is also used to refer to the idols/false pagan images worshipped by the people as ‘mighty ones’:

Exod. 20:3: Thou shalt have no other gods [H430 ‘elohiym’] before me.

4: Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: 5: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I YAHUWAH thy Elohim am a jealous Elohim….

SIMPLY PUT, these several references to the ‘Sons of YAH’ simply mean ‘mighty ones’ in the earth, whether they are angels, demons, mighty men [such as Goliath and Nimrod], magistrates, judges, rulers, and very often the idols which represent these mighty ones.

THIS INQUIRY could be extended for quite a while, but for the sake of precious time, let us consider the SPECIFIC QUESTIONS at hand and seek a verdict in this matter:

DID SATAN the DEVIL SEXUALLY SEDUCE ‘EVE’ and FATHER the ‘RACE of CAIN’?

DID ANGELIC BEINGS MARRY WITH FAIR DAUGHTERS OF MORTAL MEN and PRODUCE GIANTS [Heb. NEPHYLIM], MIGHTY ONES in the earth?

WHO WILL ARBITRATE THIS MATTER and DECIDE for us the TRUTH? Of course, the AUTHOR and PROVIDER of TRUTH, and the only BROUGHT-FORTH SON of the LIVING YAHUWAH ELOHIM, YAHUSHUA the MESSIAH.

He addressed this very issue during His earthly ministry and gave a very PRECISE and CONCLUSIVE ANSWER concerning the nature of created spirit beings:

Matt. 22:23: The same day came to him the Sadducees, which say that there is no resurrection, and asked him, 24: Saying, Master, Moses said, If a man die, having no children, his brother shall marry his wife, and raise up seed unto his brother.

25: Now there were with us seven brethren: and the first, when he had married a wife, deceased, and, having no issue, left his wife unto his brother: 26: Likewise the second also, and the third, unto the seventh. 27: And last of all the woman died also.

28: Therefore in the resurrection WHOSE WIFE SHALL SHE BE of the seven? for they all had her.

YAHUSHUA’s AUTHORITATIVE RESPONSE follows:

M’t:22:29: Yahushua answered and said unto them, YE DO ERR, NOT KNOWING the SCRIPTURES, nor the power of YAHUWAH.

M’t:22:30: For in the resurrection they NEITHER MARRY, nor are given in marriage, but ARE AS THE ANGELS of YAHUWAH in heaven.

CLEARLY, SPIRIT BEINGS DO NOT MARRY, LET ALONE HAVING ILLICIT SEXUAL RELATIONS with MORTALS. THIS DISPELS the UNSCRIPTURAL notion of ANGELS MARRYING WITH the FAIR DAUGHTERS of MEN in Genesis chapter six. As Yahushua said, ‘YE DO ERR, NOT KNOWING the SCRIPTURES.’

When the CREATOR put mankind and all other life-forms on the earth, He commanded them to be fruitful and multiply, after THEIR OWN KIND and in THEIR OWN LIKENESS.

LIKEWISE, the SERPENT’s SEDUCTION of Mother Chavah was wholly of a MENTAL, INTELLECTUAL, and EMOTIONAL nature. She was not ‘swept off her feet’ with carnal passion, but rather:

Gen. 3:6: “And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be DESIRED TO MAKE ONE WISE, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and GAVE ALSO UNTO HER HUSBAND with her; and he did eat.”

Mother CHAVAH was completely DECEIVED, DELUDED, and CHEATED because she BELIEVED the SERPENT’s lie and wanted her husband to share in the perceived benefits. There is not the SLIGHTEST HINT of anything SEXUAL in this passage. As Paul said, Chavah’s MIND was ‘corrupted from the simplicity that is in Messiah.’

Only when Paul’s reference in 2 Cor.11 is TWISTED by a PRE-CONCEIVED idea and inserted as a ‘subtext’ of Genesis 3 can this perverted theory gain ground.

EXAMINING the original Hebrew of Chavah’s explanation also clarifies this confusion:

Gen. 3:13: And the YAHUWAH Elohim said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent [H5377] BEGUILED me, and I did eat. H5377 nasha’ naw-shaw’ = a primitive root; TO LEAD ASTRAY, i.e. (MENTALLY) to DELUDE or (MORALLY) to SEDUCE:–beguile, DECEIVE, X greatly, X utterly.

ALL that was really needed was to go to next chapter:

“And ADAM KNEW [CHAVAH] HIS WIFE; and SHE CONCEIVED, AND BARE CAIN, and said, I have gotten a man from YAHUWAH” (Gen. 4:1).

HA HA! So much for the ‘Serpent Seed’ / ‘RACE of CAIN.’ UNFORTUNATELY, those who favor the Serpent, so-called ‘lucifereans,’ want to attribute many things to his prowess that are false and undeserved, in order to mislead and disorient those sincere followers of Yahushua.

FORTUNATELY, Yahushua clearly states that ANGELS are NOT DESIGNED to PROCREATE, rather they are CREATED SPIRIT BEINGS. His statement closes the door to further SPECULATION of this sort.

The Mythology of the Pagans is replete with such fanciful notions of Olympian gods swooning over fair mortal maidens and fathering races of demi-gods, such as Hercules, Perseus, and Achilles.

As YAHUWAH Elohim continues to RESTORE Truth to his end-time servants, we must LET the SCRIPTURES INTERPRET the SCRIPTURES, “Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth” (Titus 1:14).

Thanks for your comments. I agree, that angels in Heaven do not marry. But the angels of Genesis 6 were not in Heaven, nor were they Holy. They were rebellious, evil angels who chose to have illicit relations with human women. This is referenced in Jude and 2 Peter (both passages are quotes in the Nephilim series).

And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. – Jude 1:6-7.

How do you interpret this passage?

Regarding the Satan-Eve theory – It is not Biblical. It has zero Scriptural support and nowhere does this article even mention it. Thanks again for your comments and please feel free to continue to share your thoughts. God bless.

But, you ask, didn’t the fallen angels leave their first estate? Jude 1:6 says they did, doesn’t it? Well, yes, and no. The teachers of this view love to quote this verse attempting to prove the fallen angels, demons, devils had left themselves (their spirit bodies). Let’s take a quick look and I’m sure you will see the same kind of faulty reasoning as with the false giants teaching, telling us these were children of these angels, you know, the angels that “kept not their first estate”. Let’s read:

(Jude 1:6) And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

Okay, where does it say, the angels left their spirit bodies to cohabit with flesh and blood women? Right, it doesn’t, it says these angels “kept not their first (get that – first) estate” — they departed from their first habitation, or place assigned to them. What this is saying is they left a place they were living, a place given them and for some reason, probably having to do with Satan’s rebellion, they abandoned their appointed place, their habitation and assaulted their Creator’s domain.

We live on a beautiful planet all of our needs taken care of, but we dream of building space ships to blast off into places we have no business being. We are instructed to care for the World and to be fruitful, but what do we, humans, dream of? We dream of the day we can travel the universe and for what?

It is pretty simple if you believe the words and quite trying to twist the plain truth into something mysterious, even weird, but this does seem to excite the ears of some. These rebel angels are to suffer a bitter end bound in chains of darkness. Who can know how beautiful their “first estate” had been, their original habitation, their estate?

Dreamers of the flesh, like the rebel angels, carry their banner of deceit and falsehood pulling along as many as possible toward the fires of destruction, headed for complete annihilation. Read the whole of what is written in Jude and believe it, do not try to build myths out of something so simple to understand. Stop being confused on this. (Gal 5:10, 1 Cor 14:33).

Jude is all about the judgment of those “dreamers” making up stories like the writers of fiction and they do this for gain. A greedy bunch more interested in deception, working for a dollar and giving themselves over to a future punishment not unlike that suffered by those of Sodom and Gomorrah. (Titus 1:11, Mt 23:25, 2 Pet 2:3,14)

(2Pe 2:3) In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.

They commit the sin of Balaam, working for money, as greed drives them, which is described as a form if idolatry. Balaam was a priest, and a priest of YHWH no less. He had the ear of YHWH, spoke with Him, communicated with Him, but still his heart was set on personal gain, not lowerly service (Numbers 22). These men, like Balaam, are put in the same boat as the “fallen angels” and their judgment is sure.

Keep in mind, the account given in Jude is about fallen men, by comparison, to fallen angels. So, if we are to jump to the wrong conclusion, that the fallen angels left themselves to cohabit with flesh and blood women, are we then, in the context of the whole of Jude, to assume these greedy men become spirit as the rebel angels became flesh? Absolutely not, there is no such suggestion, and I say this only to demonstrate the idiotic suggestion that spirit beings, fallen or other wise, do not marry, and do not cohabit with human women. Please, read all of Jude, it’s short, but think on it then reread it. It has a lot to say and much is missed when one jumps to the false conclusion concerning the fallen angels that Jude mentions as an example to emphasize the seriousness of our own destiny, and especially of those having made profit of God’s people.

Your article response seems to ignore one part of the verses I posted:

And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. – Jude 1:6-7.

The phrase “even as” indicates it is making a direct comparison – thus it is saying the angels who sinned gave themselves over to fornication.

In the articles you posted, much of what they say is already addressed in the article. You do not address these points directly, but if you care to, I’m happy to respond. And like most articles that go counter to the Angel-human women relationship interpretation, they do not explain where the giants came from. Thanks again. God bless.

Just like everyone that’s in the dark that i have met, They refused to come to the light or Repent, I notice in this web page how theres not even the slightest Respect for the corrected name of our Messiah AT ALL ? IF YOU ARE STILL USING THE PAGAN NAME JESUS CHRIST YOU HAVE DONE WHAT THE SCRIPTURES HAVE SAID, AND THESE BIBLICAL PASSAGES ARE REALLY LINK TOGETHER UNLIKE WHAT YOU THINK IS AND IS NOT!