since1970 wrote:...was the first goal waived because the puck was in the glove and they couldn't determine the glove was over or they couldn't see the puck???

From the overhead, it's tough to see where the puck was in his glove and if it was 100% fully across the line. It's one of those where it's probably in, but to overrule a call on the ice of "no goal" with some probably evidence isn't what generally happens at this level of play...it sucks for us, but we wouldn't want that call to go against us either...we got it right back, wasn't the reason why we lost.

Nothing wrong with the officiating tonight really...a couple of non-calls got called, a couple calls got non-called...something you'd see in every hard fought, rivalry game...you'd guess by the reaction of this board that the refs picked the puck up and threw it behind Vokoun four times tonight...

That's what most of our GDT's are, unfortunately, just whining about refs...it's a shame that the real game can't be discussed, there's much to talk about...other team's GDTs are also pretty bad, but this board's rank pretty high in terms of ref whining...which is a shame, but it's a poster's right to do so I suppose...ad nauseum or otherwise...

Agree with everything except the officiating ... but not about bad/no calls... I blame the late whistles. Like. Really.....

The second period looked like a repeat of last year's playoff series against the Flyers, with the Comedy Central defense running around and Vokoun doing his best Fleury sieve impersonation. But I thought the Pens got it back together very nicely in the third, and it was the Flyers who were clearly rattled. The Pens showed a lot of character and, if not for that bad goal that Vokoun gave up in the end, they could have easily won this game. I don't think there will be any carryover from last year's playoff disaster in any of the Pens' heads from here on in.

That being said, RS and DB need to figure out how to consistently beat teams like the Flyers and Devils if they want to go anywhere in the playoffs.

booboo wrote:Bylsma was awful tonight. I was never in the fire HCDB camp before but now I just realized he is being consistently outcoached in most of the emotional games. He can't prevent his star players from taking stupid penalties. He takes timeouts at random occasions. He cannot teach his team to keep the lead. Ray Shero please do something about this mess. I just do not want the Pens to be in this "game" anymore.

I laugh at this. How the hell can a coach stop a player from taking stupid penalties? You can preach and plead and stress all you want but a dumb player will take a dumb penalty any time. Other than benching him (you gonna bench Geno? didn't think so.), you can't totally stop it. The players have to take it upon themselves to not be dumb.

You make adjustments. You certainly can sit a player a couple shifts if they take dumb penalties.

+1

Well, if you think sitting Malkin a couple of shifts for that dumb penalty he took in the 3rd period, then you're both dumber than the coach y'all are criticizing.

How about some coaching instead? Preemptive coaching maybe? Say a superstar takes a stupid penalty way back in a meaningless game and you sit him. And when it happens again, you do so again. 71 or 87, does not matter. Gosh, wouldn't you like some accountability out there? So that the players would police themselves when it counts... This is really simple. But just one way of coaching. There are probably 20 thousand other little things an analytically-minded coach could come up to change the stupid way this team looses to likely playoff opponents.

If you guys didn't see a change in the way the team played and handled themselves in the 3rd period (besides the Malkin penalty), I don't know what else to tell you.

I don't have the numbers in front of me, but from my POV, we definitely outplayed these guys in terms of zone time, chances, etc.

You can say all you want that "Nothing's working", or "Bylsma sucks and can't make adjustments", but I saw what I saw.

This is a completely different team. Last year's team would've lost 10-2 and given up 4 in the 2nd period. The team I watched tonight got off their game, took a bad penalty (Malkin), played extremely well the rest of the way, fought back, drew some penalties, and tied the game. THAT is the kind of effort I like to see.

The Pens need to do some praying that somehow the Flyers miss the playoffs because if they meet again, we're going to see a repeat of last spring. I actually thought that overall, the Pens have been fairly impressive this season but tonight just proves that they haven't made any progress since last spring. They still have no answer for the Flyers. No, coach, it wasn't just a couple bad weeks, and no you can't pin it all on Fleury. Until they figure out how to control themselves against the Flyers, and until they learn in general how to play with a lead, they are on their way to another early upset.

We didn't play the Flyers game and give in to "the circus". We got too comfortable with a 2 goal lead and made costly mistake after costly mistake. I don't think they got into our heads. We got into our own heads.

This team needs to find a way to focus and mitigate some of these idiotic mistakes, front to back top to bottom, goalies included.

since1970 wrote:...was the first goal waived because the puck was in the glove and they couldn't determine the glove was over or they couldn't see the puck???

From the overhead, it's tough to see where the puck was in his glove and if it was 100% fully across the line. It's one of those where it's probably in, but to overrule a call on the ice of "no goal" with some probably evidence isn't what generally happens at this level of play...it sucks for us, but we wouldn't want that call to go against us either...we got it right back, wasn't the reason why we lost.

Nothing wrong with the officiating tonight really...a couple of non-calls got called, a couple calls got non-called...something you'd see in every hard fought, rivalry game...you'd guess by the reaction of this board that the refs picked the puck up and threw it behind Vokoun four times tonight...

That's what most of our GDT's are, unfortunately, just whining about refs...it's a shame that the real game can't be discussed, there's much to talk about...other team's GDTs are also pretty bad, but this board's rank pretty high in terms of ref whining...which is a shame, but it's a poster's right to do so I suppose...ad nauseum or otherwise...

Agree with everything except the officiating ... but not about bad/no calls... I blame the late whistles. Like. Really.....

...

Late.

That's not unfair. Specifically the Flyers 4th goal, the one early in the third, I'd like to see that again from a couple angles. I don't really blame the refs on that ten-car pile-up in the crease where Vokoun was the furthest guy up the ice...the only whistle that could have been blown there would have been a penalty shot for Philadelphia...so, damned if you do, damned if you don't there...

It seems that with Flyers/Pens games in the past, some quick whistles have prevented some goals on both sides...so they let things slide for an extra second in here tonight...maybe it's costs us on that 4th Philadelphia goal, but when you're talking about things that happen on the fourth, fifth or sixth goals in a night, do you really expect a win?

MRandall25 wrote:If you guys didn't see a change in the way the team played and handled themselves in the 3rd period (besides the Malkin penalty), I don't know what else to tell you.

I don't have the numbers in front of me, but from my POV, we definitely outplayed these guys in terms of zone time, chances, etc.

You can say all you want that "Nothing's working", or "Bylsma sucks and can't make adjustments", but I saw what I saw.

This is a completely different team. Last year's team would've lost 10-2 and given up 4 in the 2nd period. The team I watched tonight got off their game, took a bad penalty (Malkin), played extremely well the rest of the way, fought back, drew some penalties, and tied the game. THAT is the kind of effort I like to see.

MRandall25 wrote:If you guys didn't see a change in the way the team played and handled themselves in the 3rd period (besides the Malkin penalty), I don't know what else to tell you.

I don't have the numbers in front of me, but from my POV, we definitely outplayed these guys in terms of zone time, chances, etc.

You can say all you want that "Nothing's working", or "Bylsma sucks and can't make adjustments", but I saw what I saw.

This is a completely different team. Last year's team would've lost 10-2 and given up 4 in the 2nd period. The team I watched tonight got off their game, took a bad penalty (Malkin), played extremely well the rest of the way, fought back, drew some penalties, and tied the game. THAT is the kind of effort I like to see.

MRandall25 wrote:If you guys didn't see a change in the way the team played and handled themselves in the 3rd period (besides the Malkin penalty), I don't know what else to tell you.

I don't have the numbers in front of me, but from my POV, we definitely outplayed these guys in terms of zone time, chances, etc.

You can say all you want that "Nothing's working", or "Bylsma sucks and can't make adjustments", but I saw what I saw.

This is a completely different team. Last year's team would've lost 10-2 and given up 4 in the 2nd period. The team I watched tonight got off their game, took a bad penalty (Malkin), played extremely well the rest of the way, fought back, drew some penalties, and tied the game. THAT is the kind of effort I like to see.

I really have no idea what else you guys want.

Well said, Pens have some weaknesses and adjustments to make but all teams do. Can't expect them to go 48-0.

Kharlamov wrote:Sounds crazy, but I think the Pens are too much in the 'rivalry' of these games with the flyers. I think it's it time for them to ignore all the history, the cheap shots, and just beat them. Them and the fans will enjoy that much more...

This is where a Billy G type player is much needed.

Anyone who doesn't think he was a big reason they won the cup when they won it is off his/her rocker.

MRandall25 wrote:If you guys didn't see a change in the way the team played and handled themselves in the 3rd period (besides the Malkin penalty), I don't know what else to tell you.

I don't have the numbers in front of me, but from my POV, we definitely outplayed these guys in terms of zone time, chances, etc.

You can say all you want that "Nothing's working", or "Bylsma sucks and can't make adjustments", but I saw what I saw.

This is a completely different team. Last year's team would've lost 10-2 and given up 4 in the 2nd period. The team I watched tonight got off their game, took a bad penalty (Malkin), played extremely well the rest of the way, fought back, drew some penalties, and tied the game. THAT is the kind of effort I like to see.

I really have no idea what else you guys want.

Not the end of the world at all. The PP has been outstanding all year and was tonight. They played more composed in the third I'll give you that.

BUT, they played exactly the same way as the did last year against them. Way too agressive on defense, getting way too involved after the play, letting Philly get under their skin, and blowing leads at home.