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Sunday, August 28, 2016

I have no idea, I did not live that period. But there are historical proofs that cows were available in Arabia and many other parts of the world for centuries. If cows can be available in Arabia today (I lived there in the late 1970s), why not then? The Quran itself has a sura on Baqara, cow. Cow is one of the halal animals that can be sacrificed as Qurbani. It is commonly available almost all parts of the world. If one likes to sacrifice another halal animal, welcome. One doesn't have to to do it on cow. What is your point?

We don't follow everything that Arabs did. In matters of Islam, we try to follow what the Quran and hadith say. Religion is a matter of faith. If you believe it, it is there. If you don't, you are not even qualified to talk about it.

Sorry, my Quranic knowledge is limited. But I understand, Qurbani, like Hajj and Zakat, is not mandatory on all Muslims. It is obligatory on those who can afford it, or have the means to do it. And, I believe Qurbani is not farz either; it is Wajeb. Qurabani can be done on any halal animal, most recognizable ones are cows, camels, goats and sheep. Cow is the most common and easily available one which, as in the case of camel, can be shared by seven names. Smaller animals like goat and sheep can have only one name on it. In young days, I had seen one-third of our Qurbani meat was distributed among the poor.

Qurbani is related to Hajj or Eid--ul-Azha. Any slaughter of animal outside these events cannot be Qurbani. Of course, Muslims slaughter animals for Akika and some other maanats, and again I don't think those can be called Qurbanis.

The question here is the slaughter of cow as a ritual in Qurbani. For Muslims it is the largest celebration in which both rich and poor look forward to east meat. If it (that is Qurgani by Muslims) is officially banned in India, it is a serious affront on one of the major rituals of Muslims. In India, if cows can be slaughtered for export, why Muslims cannot do it for Qurbani, that is question here.

AWRB. Please read the verses Al-Saffat (Surah no. 37, ayah no.102-111) in the Quran where it's clearly mentioned that the act of Ibrahim n Ismail (AWS) made compulsory for the rest of the Ummah. Also in various places in the Quran Allah (SWT) mentioned 'Atiullah wa Atiur Rasul', which means "Obey Allah's order n follow your Rasul(prophet)", which confirms, other than hujjaj, its a obligations for Muslims(who are eligible) to perform Qurban.

On the matter of the Kurbani, I have an important question to ask and shall benefit from an answer: Can anyone tell me where in the Koran is it explicitly required that Muslims slaughter animals except as a part of the ceremonies of the hajj? To be absolutely clear, those who are performing the hajj are required in the Koran to offer animal sacrifice. I could not find any directive in the Koran about a requirement by people who are not performing the hajj to make animal sacrifice. In broad terms, this excluded all lands ( including of course Bangladesh, India, Pakistan and many more), outside the small circle of territory around the precincts of the hajj, from the requirement of making Kurbani. Any answer?

Agree with the first part of RC Bhai's argumentation. The second part, the last para? Being polite is of course sometimes nice, but in reality most of the time it is viewed as weakness.Without a threat in opposite reaction, the unfair and the unjust are likely to be given a chance to continue without any pressure of challenge, to the political mileage of one ( and the strong) side only. My contention is, similar threat should come not only from small and inconsequential parties but from the big parties as well. Tit for tat, as much as possible, to turn the heat on the enemies. 2016-08-28 15:13 GMT-04:00 RANU CHOWDHURY <ranu51@hotmail.com>:

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Posted by: RANU CHOWDHURY <ranu51@hotmail.com>

**************************************************** Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: Call For Articles:

First, let me take up Razzak A. Syed's reply to my question which is: Is there a directive in the Koran on making Kurbani except in performance of the hajj. Following his advice, I re-read sura 37 (Saffat): 102- 111. This is the well-known story of Abraham going to sacrifice his son ( Ismail, but the verses do not even name him). Abraham passes the test God set him. But where is the directive I have been looking for? The verses do not say anything at all. They do not call for the Kurbani Muslims have become so used to.

The Koran is supposed to be a clear book; it is supposed to be easy to understand. The Holy Book itself says so. Why should an important question such as the Kurbani --which now involves slaughtering millions of animals all over the world in a day - should have been left to surmise? There are clear directions on rituals of piety in the Koran. On fasting, for example, there is : " O ye who believe! Fasting is prescribed for you...", a clear and unambiguous directive. Where is one on Kurbani? There is none.

Syed Sahib also quotes the Koran saying, obey Allah and obey His Rasul. One must remember that the Koran always takes precedence on the words and deeds of the Rasul. If there is no directive on Kurbani in the Koran, one cannot imagine God's Messenger inventing it. Equally important is the evidence. Is there any evidence that the Prophet ritually sacrificed an animal anywhere except in connection with the hajj ? One would like to know.

As for Mr. Chowdhury's elaborate discourse about the nature of the obligation as seen today -- whether it is farz or wajeb and so on -- these have no bearing on the question I started off with. I am not saying they are irrelevant.

Sorry, my Quranic knowledge is limited. But I understand, Qurbani, like Hajj and Zakat, is not mandatory on all Muslims. It is obligatory on those who can afford it, or have the means to do it. And, I believe Qurbani is not farz either; it is Wajeb. Qurabani can be done on any halal animal, most recognizable ones are cows, camels, goats and sheep. Cow is the most common and easily available one which, as in the case of camel, can be shared by seven names. Smaller animals like goat and sheep can have only one name on it. In young days, I had seen one-third of our Qurbani meat was distributed among the poor.

Qurbani is related to Hajj or Eid--ul-Azha. Any slaughter of animal outside these events cannot be Qurbani. Of course, Muslims slaughter animals for Akika and some other maanats, and again I don't think those can be called Qurbanis.

The question here is the slaughter of cow as a ritual in Qurbani. For Muslims it is the largest celebration in which both rich and poor look forward to east meat. If it (that is Qurgani by Muslims) is officially banned in India, it is a serious affront on one of the major rituals of Muslims. In India, if cows can be slaughtered for export, why Muslims cannot do it for Qurbani, that is question here.

AWRB. Please read the verses Al-Saffat (Surah no. 37, ayah no.102-111) in the Quran where it's clearly mentioned that the act of Ibrahim n Ismail (AWS) made compulsory for the rest of the Ummah. Also in various places in the Quran Allah (SWT) mentioned 'Atiullah wa Atiur Rasul', which means "Obey Allah's order n follow your Rasul(prophet)", which confirms, other than hujjaj, its a obligations for Muslims(who are eligible) to perform Qurban.

On the matter of the Kurbani, I have an important question to ask and shall benefit from an answer: Can anyone tell me where in the Koran is it explicitly required that Muslims slaughter animals except as a part of the ceremonies of the hajj? To be absolutely clear, those who are performing the hajj are required in the Koran to offer animal sacrifice. I could not find any directive in the Koran about a requirement by people who are not performing the hajj to make animal sacrifice. In broad terms, this excluded all lands ( including of course Bangladesh, India, Pakistan and many more), outside the small circle of territory around the precincts of the hajj, from the requirement of making Kurbani. Any answer?

Agree with the first part of RC Bhai's argumentation. The second part, the last para? Being polite is of course sometimes nice, but in reality most of the time it is viewed as weakness.Without a threat in opposite reaction, the unfair and the unjust are likely to be given a chance to continue without any pressure of challenge, to the political mileage of one ( and the strong) side only. My contention is, similar threat should come not only from small and inconsequential parties but from the big parties as well. Tit for tat, as much as possible, to turn the heat on the enemies. 2016-08-28 15:13 GMT-04:00 RANU CHOWDHURY <ranu51@hotmail.com>:

You received this message because you had subscribed to the Google Groups "North America Bangladeshi Community forum". Any posting to this group is solely the opinion of the author of the messages to nabdc@googlegroups.com who is responsible for the accuracy of his/her information and the conformance of his/her material with applicable copyright and other laws where applicable. The act of posting to the group indicates the subscriber's agreement to accept the adjudications of the moderator(s). To post to this group, send email to nabdc@googlegroups.com.

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Huma Abedin's mom linked to shocking anti-women book

Hillary Clinton at the Dar al-Hekma college for women during a "town hall" meeting in the Red Sea port city of Jeddah in 2010. Abedin's mother, Dr. Saleha Mahmood Abedin, is second from right, standing next to Clinton. Photo: Getty Images

As secretary of state, women's-rights champ Hillary Clinton not only spoke at a Saudi girls school run by her top aide Huma Abedin's ­anti-feminist mother, but Clinton invited the elder Abedin to participate in a State Department event for "leading thinkers" on women's issues.

This happened despite ­evidence at the time that Saleha M. Abedin had explored the religious merits of sexual submissiveness, child marriage, lashings and stonings for adulterous women, and even the ­circumcision of girls.

The elder Abedin, whose daughter helps run Clinton's presidential campaign, did take a pro-gender-equality stance on at least one issue: Muslim women's right to participate in violent jihad alongside men.

The journal also opposed women's rights as un-Islamic, arguing that " 'empowerment' of women does more harm than benefit."

But that's not all.

In 1999, Saleha translated and edited a book titled "Women in Islam: A Discourse in Rights and Obligations," published by the Institute of Muslim Minority Affairs. Written by her Saudi colleague Fatima Naseef, the book explains that the stoning and lashing of adulterers, the killing of apostates, sexual submissiveness and even female genital mutilation are all permissible practices ­under Sharia law.

"The wife should satisfy her husband's desire for sexual intercourse," the book states on Page 202, even if she is not in the mood. "She has no right to abstain except for a reasonable cause or legal prohibition."

But getting in the mood may be difficult. The book says female genital mutilation is permissible: ­"Cir­cumcision for women is ­allowed."

Laws promoting feminist equality, moreover, are ineffectual, since "man-made laws have in fact enslaved women, submitting them to the cupidity and caprice of human beings. Islam is the only solution and the only escape."

And forget about working in a position of authority: "Her job would involve long hours of free mixing and social interaction with the opposite sex, which is forbidden in Islam," the book says.

"Moreover, women's biological constitution is different from that of men. Women are fragile, emotional and sometimes unable to handle difficult and strenuous situations," it explained. "Men are less emotional and show more perseverance."

There is one exception to the sexual division of roles: "Women can also participate in fighting when jihad ­becomes an individual duty."

On the back cover, Saleha says she is "pleased to launch" the book as part of a series on the study of women's rights in Islam sponsored by the International Islamic Committee for Woman and Child (IICWC), for which she is listed as chairperson.

Founded by Huma's mom, the Cairo-based IICWC has advocated for the repeal of Egypt's Mubarak-era laws in favor of implementing Sharia law, which could allow female genital mutilation, child marriage and marital rape.

Saleha is paid by the Saudi government to advocate and spread Sharia in non-Muslim countries like America.

In 1995, less than three weeks before Clinton gave her famous women's-rights speech in Beijing, Saleha headlined an unusual Washington conference organized by the Council on American-Islamic Relations to lobby against the UN platform drafted by Clinton and other feminists. Visibly angry, she argued it runs counter to Islam and was a "conspiracy" against Muslims.

Specifically, she called into question provisions in the platform that condemned domestic battery of women, apparently expressing sympathy for men who commit abuse.

Pakistan-born Saleha main­tained that men who serially beat women tend to be unemployed, making their abuse somehow more understandable. "They are victims of a different kind," she claimed. "And they are simply taking [their frustrations] out on women."

Despite all this, Huma Abedin in 2010 arranged for Clinton, then the secretary of state, to travel to Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, to meet with her mother and speak at a girls school she founded and helps run as dean. Speaking to a roomful of girls, Clinton said Americans have to stop stereotyping Saudi women as oppressed, before assuring the audience that not all American women go "around in a bikini bathing suit."

While there, Clinton formed a partnership with Saleha's Dar al-Hekma college called the US-Saudi Women's Forum on Social Entrepreneurship, and prom­ised to reverse post-9/11 curbs on Saudi student visas to America.

'The wife should satisfy her husband's desire for sexual intercourse.'

- from a book translated and edited by Saleha Abedin

The next year, Clinton invited Saleha and the president of the Saudi school to Washington to participate in a State Department colloquium on women, as revealed by internal emails released in response to a lawsuit filed by Judicial Watch.

Clinton campaign spokesman Nick Merrill told the Post that while Huma Abedin was in fact listed as an editorial staffer of her mother's radical journal from 1996 to 2008, she didn't really do anything for the publication in her long tenure there.

Asked if Clinton regrets honoring the Islamist mother and bestowing ­legitimacy on her extreme views, Merrill had no comment.

__._,_.___

Posted by: Sukhamaya Bain <subain1@yahoo.com>

**************************************************** Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: Call For Articles:

Huma Abedin's mom linked to shocking anti-women book

Hillary Clinton at the Dar al-Hekma college for women during a "town hall" meeting in the Red Sea port city of Jeddah in 2010. Abedin's mother, Dr. Saleha Mahmood Abedin, is second from right, standing next to Clinton. Photo: Getty Images

As secretary of state, women's-rights champ Hillary Clinton not only spoke at a Saudi girls school run by her top aide Huma Abedin's ­anti-feminist mother, but Clinton invited the elder Abedin to participate in a State Department event for "leading thinkers" on women's issues.

This happened despite ­evidence at the time that Saleha M. Abedin had explored the religious merits of sexual submissiveness, child marriage, lashings and stonings for adulterous women, and even the ­circumcision of girls.

The elder Abedin, whose daughter helps run Clinton's presidential campaign, did take a pro-gender-equality stance on at least one issue: Muslim women's right to participate in violent jihad alongside men.

The journal also opposed women's rights as un-Islamic, arguing that " 'empowerment' of women does more harm than benefit."

But that's not all.

In 1999, Saleha translated and edited a book titled "Women in Islam: A Discourse in Rights and Obligations," published by the Institute of Muslim Minority Affairs. Written by her Saudi colleague Fatima Naseef, the book explains that the stoning and lashing of adulterers, the killing of apostates, sexual submissiveness and even female genital mutilation are all permissible practices ­under Sharia law.

"The wife should satisfy her husband's desire for sexual intercourse," the book states on Page 202, even if she is not in the mood. "She has no right to abstain except for a reasonable cause or legal prohibition."

But getting in the mood may be difficult. The book says female genital mutilation is permissible: ­"Cir­cumcision for women is ­allowed."

Laws promoting feminist equality, moreover, are ineffectual, since "man-made laws have in fact enslaved women, submitting them to the cupidity and caprice of human beings. Islam is the only solution and the only escape."

And forget about working in a position of authority: "Her job would involve long hours of free mixing and social interaction with the opposite sex, which is forbidden in Islam," the book says.

"Moreover, women's biological constitution is different from that of men. Women are fragile, emotional and sometimes unable to handle difficult and strenuous situations," it explained. "Men are less emotional and show more perseverance."

There is one exception to the sexual division of roles: "Women can also participate in fighting when jihad ­becomes an individual duty."

On the back cover, Saleha says she is "pleased to launch" the book as part of a series on the study of women's rights in Islam sponsored by the International Islamic Committee for Woman and Child (IICWC), for which she is listed as chairperson.

Founded by Huma's mom, the Cairo-based IICWC has advocated for the repeal of Egypt's Mubarak-era laws in favor of implementing Sharia law, which could allow female genital mutilation, child marriage and marital rape.

Saleha is paid by the Saudi government to advocate and spread Sharia in non-Muslim countries like America.

In 1995, less than three weeks before Clinton gave her famous women's-rights speech in Beijing, Saleha headlined an unusual Washington conference organized by the Council on American-Islamic Relations to lobby against the UN platform drafted by Clinton and other feminists. Visibly angry, she argued it runs counter to Islam and was a "conspiracy" against Muslims.

Specifically, she called into question provisions in the platform that condemned domestic battery of women, apparently expressing sympathy for men who commit abuse.

Pakistan-born Saleha main­tained that men who serially beat women tend to be unemployed, making their abuse somehow more understandable. "They are victims of a different kind," she claimed. "And they are simply taking [their frustrations] out on women."

Despite all this, Huma Abedin in 2010 arranged for Clinton, then the secretary of state, to travel to Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, to meet with her mother and speak at a girls school she founded and helps run as dean. Speaking to a roomful of girls, Clinton said Americans have to stop stereotyping Saudi women as oppressed, before assuring the audience that not all American women go "around in a bikini bathing suit."

While there, Clinton formed a partnership with Saleha's Dar al-Hekma college called the US-Saudi Women's Forum on Social Entrepreneurship, and prom­ised to reverse post-9/11 curbs on Saudi student visas to America.

'The wife should satisfy her husband's desire for sexual intercourse.'

- from a book translated and edited by Saleha Abedin

The next year, Clinton invited Saleha and the president of the Saudi school to Washington to participate in a State Department colloquium on women, as revealed by internal emails released in response to a lawsuit filed by Judicial Watch.

Clinton campaign spokesman Nick Merrill told the Post that while Huma Abedin was in fact listed as an editorial staffer of her mother's radical journal from 1996 to 2008, she didn't really do anything for the publication in her long tenure there.

Asked if Clinton regrets honoring the Islamist mother and bestowing ­legitimacy on her extreme views, Merrill had no comment.

__._,_.___

Posted by: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>

**************************************************** Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: Call For Articles:

Sorry, my Quranic knowledge is limited. But I understand, Qurbani, like Hajj and Zakat, is not mandatory on all Muslims. It is obligatory on those who can afford it, or have the means to do it. And, I believe Qurbani is not farz either; it is Wajeb. Qurabani can be done on any halal animal, most recognizable ones are cows, camels, goats and sheep. Cow is the most common and easily available one which, as in the case of camel, can be shared by seven names. Smaller animals like goat and sheep can have only one name on it. In young days, I had seen one-third of our Qurbani meat was distributed among the poor.

Qurbani is related to Hajj or Eid--ul-Azha. Any slaughter of animal outside these events cannot be Qurbani. Of course, Muslims slaughter animals for Akika and some other maanats, and again I don't think those can be called Qurbanis.

The question here is the slaughter of cow as a ritual in Qurbani. For Muslims it is the largest celebration in which both rich and poor look forward to east meat. If it (that is Qurgani by Muslims) is officially banned in India, it is a serious affront on one of the major rituals of Muslims. In India, if cows can be slaughtered for export, why Muslims cannot do it for Qurbani, that is question here.

AWRB. Please read the verses Al-Saffat (Surah no. 37, ayah no.102-111) in the Quran where it's clearly mentioned that the act of Ibrahim n Ismail (AWS) made compulsory for the rest of the Ummah. Also in various places in the Quran Allah (SWT) mentioned 'Atiullah wa Atiur Rasul', which means "Obey Allah's order n follow your Rasul(prophet)", which confirms, other than hujjaj, its a obligations for Muslims(who are eligible) to perform Qurban.

On the matter of the Kurbani, I have an important question to ask and shall benefit from an answer: Can anyone tell me where in the Koran is it explicitly required that Muslims slaughter animals except as a part of the ceremonies of the hajj? To be absolutely clear, those who are performing the hajj are required in the Koran to offer animal sacrifice. I could not find any directive in the Koran about a requirement by people who are not performing the hajj to make animal sacrifice. In broad terms, this excluded all lands ( including of course Bangladesh, India, Pakistan and many more), outside the small circle of territory around the precincts of the hajj, from the requirement of making Kurbani. Any answer?

Agree with the first part of RC Bhai's argumentation. The second part, the last para? Being polite is of course sometimes nice, but in reality most of the time it is viewed as weakness.Without a threat in opposite reaction, the unfair and the unjust are likely to be given a chance to continue without any pressure of challenge, to the political mileage of one ( and the strong) side only. My contention is, similar threat should come not only from small and inconsequential parties but from the big parties as well. Tit for tat, as much as possible, to turn the heat on the enemies. 2016-08-28 15:13 GMT-04:00 RANU CHOWDHURY <ranu51@hotmail.com>:

You received this message because you had subscribed to the Google Groups "North America Bangladeshi Community forum". Any posting to this group is solely the opinion of the author of the messages to nabdc@googlegroups.com who is responsible for the accuracy of his/her information and the conformance of his/her material with applicable copyright and other laws where applicable. The act of posting to the group indicates the subscriber's agreement to accept the adjudications of the moderator(s). To post to this group, send email to nabdc@googlegroups.com.

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You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "North America Bangladeshi Community" group.

You received this message because you had subscribed to the Google Groups "North America Bangladeshi Community forum". Any posting to this group is solely the opinion of the author of the messages to nabdc@googlegroups.com who is responsible for the accuracy of his/her information and the conformance of his/her material with applicable copyright and other laws where applicable. The act of posting to the group indicates the subscriber's agreement to accept the adjudications of the moderator(s). To post to this group, send email tonabdc@googlegroups.com.

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You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "North America Bangladeshi Community" group.

-- You received this message because you had subscribed to the Google Groups "North America Bangladeshi Community forum". Any posting to this group is solely the opinion of the author of the messages to nabdc@googlegroups.com who is responsible for the accuracy of his/her information and the conformance of his/her material with applicable copyright and other laws where applicable. The act of posting to the group indicates the subscriber's agreement to accept the adjudications of the moderator(s). To post to this group, send email to nabdc@googlegroups.com. --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "North America Bangladeshi Community" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to nabdc+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/nabdc. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

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Posted by: RANU CHOWDHURY <ranu51@hotmail.com>

**************************************************** Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: Call For Articles: