Hi all, again I go by Platos writings and when given the names of the kings of Athens that were in this war, the time points to the 1500 `s bc

Plato

And this is reason why the names of the ancients have been preserved to us and not their actions. This I infer because Solon said that the priests in their narrative of that war mentioned most of the names which are recorded prior to the time of Theseus, such as Cecrops, and Erechtheus, and Erichthonius, and Erysichthon,

This is my sceptic side talking for all sceptics on UM who ,I feel , somehow are not so active as they used to be. Maybe they neep helping hand.

Anyway, from Plato s Republic:

…also in the tales of mythology, of which we were just now speaking --because we do not know the truth about ancient times, we make falsehood as much like truth as we can, and so turn it to account.

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

This is my sceptic side talking for all sceptics on UM who ,I feel , somehow are not so active as they used to be. Maybe they neep helping hand.

Anyway, from Plato s Republic:

…also in the tales of mythology, of which we were just now speaking --because we do not know the truth about ancient times, we make falsehood as much like truth as we can, and so turn it to account.

There's only so much of "I don't like what's known so I'll make up my own version of it and claim it's the truth" that one can stand before needing to take a break from listening to such drivel. And no, this isn't directed at you.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. -- Plato's Timaeus

There's only so much of "I don't like what's known so I'll make up my own version of it and claim it's the truth" that one can stand before needing to take a break from listening to such drivel. And no, this isn't directed at you.

cormac

Allow me to quote Carl Sagan.

Suppression of uncomfortable ideas maybe common in religion or in politics but its not path of knowledge. And theres no place in it in endeavor of science. We do not know beforehand where fundamental insights will arise from. And the history of our study shows clearly that accepted and conventional ideas are often dead wrong and that fundemental insights can arise from the most unexpected sources.

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

Suppression of uncomfortable ideas maybe common in religion or in politics but its not path of knowledge. And theres no place in it in endeavor of science. We do not know beforehand where fundamental insights will arise from. And the history of our study shows clearly that accepted and conventional ideas are often dead wrong and that fundemental insights can arise from the most unexpected sources.

So now please quote Carl Sagan on the suppresion of idiotic ideas that are proven to be impossible that are fabricated by internet forum posters that want them to be true because it makes them "feel" better and keeps them from having to do all that hard learning on the subject.

Harte

I've consulted all the sages I could find in yellow pages but there aren't many of them. - The Alan Parsons Project
Most people would die sooner than think; in fact, they do so. - Bertrand RussellIgnorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong. - Thomas JeffersonAnybody like Coleridge?

Suppression of uncomfortable ideas maybe common in religion or in politics but its not path of knowledge. And theres no place in it in endeavor of science. We do not know beforehand where fundamental insights will arise from. And the history of our study shows clearly that accepted and conventional ideas are often dead wrong and that fundemental insights can arise from the most unexpected sources.

Nice quote, i like it. Accepted and conventional ideas are hard to lose indeed. People don't want to admit that they could be wrong.

Suppression of uncomfortable ideas maybe common in religion or in politics but its not path of knowledge. And theres no place in it in endeavor of science. We do not know beforehand where fundamental insights will arise from. And the history of our study shows clearly that accepted and conventional ideas are often dead wrong and that fundemental insights can arise from the most unexpected sources.

Allow me to quote my signature:

Quote

An explanation of one's position after falling for the ramblings of a Sitchin, Von Daniken, Berlitz, Bauval, Schoch, Hancock, Velikovsky and many others if it was expressed by two of my favorite characters from "The Big Bang Theory":

Leonard: All right, well, let me see if I can explain your situation using physics. What would you be if you were attached to another object by an inclined plane wrapped helically around an axis?

Sheldon: Screwed.

Bullscheise is not an "uncomfortable idea". It's just plain garbage.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. -- Plato's Timaeus

Carl said it when some scientist (forgot his name) proposed idea that Venus was ejected from Jupiter. Then many scientists tried to suppressed it. Maybe it is Bullscheise to some but its not right to suppressed it. Its all about dialogues.

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

I often bump on info how Pillars of Hercules were on Black sea. Well when was that? Im mean if Atlantis was destroyed 9000 years before Plato and was behind Pillars then it couldnt happened 9000 years before I guess. Or they move pillars every 100 years from Black sea to Libya to Giblartar?

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

North America. Nova Scotia down to South America. Could the Atlantians built pyramids such as puma punku? Doubt it.

Someone dig up/drain out the money pit in Oak Island, Nova Scotia. Coconut trees are not natural to Canada.

Someone gather 500 submarines and comb the ocean floor on the coast. (Spaceballs)

Hurricanes are obsolete to stone buildings if there's a major population center in the Caribbean.

You island hop across the Atlantic Ocean and get sick. They walk into battle with low moral and lose.

You might not find Atlantis, but I betchu you'll find a lot of other cool things.

They're islands in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean. Just how bad was flooding? I can see a comparison to Athanasius Kirchers map of Atlantis if you move his island into the Caribbean and mass flooding later happened.

As to the 10,000 years,I think the priest in Timaeus was telling the tale,as to refering to the foundations of the two cities of Athens and Atlantis in the records, when they were just small stone age settlements that just had began, and as Solon had put in a poetic form of lands where ships were`nt invented yet in Critias.

Critias- Atlantis
In this mountain there dwelt one of the earth born primeval men of that country, whose name was Evenor, and he had a wife named Leucippe, and they had an only daughter who was called Cleito. The maiden had already reached womanhood, when her father and mother died; Poseidon fell in love with her and had intercourse with her, and breaking the ground, inclosed the hill in which she dwelt all round, making alternate zones of sea and land larger and smaller, encircling one another; there were two of land and three of water, which he turned as with a lathe, each having its circumference equidistant every way from the centre, so that no man could get to the island, for ships and voyages were not as yet. He himself, being a god, found no difficulty in making special arrangements for the centre island, bringing up two springs of water from beneath the earth, one of warm water and the other of cold, and making every variety of food to spring up abundantly from the soil.

And as Crtitias in the next day continuing his the tale from Timaeus, just commonly refer to the time as 10,000 years as to the time of the war .

At the end of four days, First Woman gave birth to twins. They were neither male nor female, but Nádleeh, hermaphrodite. Four days later a second set of twins was born, one male and one female. After twenty days a total of five pairs of twins had been born, half of them male and half of them female

I have cooked you a meal, cut it into little pieces, and set it before you but I'm not going to chew it for you
And no one is forcing you to eat it. If you dont want it then dont eat it.

I am not a big believer in science by combat.
Arguing doesn't establish who is right. Arguing only establishes who is the better arguer.

What if Plato basically said the truth. There main island or capitol was in front of the Pillars of Hercules but of course they expanded out to Western Europe and Africa after invading it. Then there main island 'Atlantis' flooded, sunk by our creator(s) after losing the battle of Athens and life moved on.