If they weren't here illegally, then they would have nothing to worry about.

Carry on the good work.

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No these ones are here legally whilst their claims for assylum are considered. Whilst some of them quite clearly do deserve to be sent back others are destined to be returned to 'safe' contries like Zimbabwe and I for one have every sympathy with them.

The immigration people can carry out these dawn raids because these people are not hiding they are registered and living at known adresses and in fact could be picked up at any time of the day or night.

The dawn raids do nothing to deal with the problem of illegal immigration are as simply froth and show by the government to make it look as if they are really doing something. It is nothing but window dressing to satisfy the Daily Wail readers and others as can be seen by the posts above.

In reality the government could actually do something about illegal immigrants, visa over stayers and others who are never persecuted if they really tried but instead they do nothing but have occasional dramatic raids to send some poor unfortunate to a probable death sentence from Mugabe's thugs.

The country is only so big and already relies heavily on imports to feed and clothe the population. There will come a time (if it hasn't already come) when we'll run out of space and resources. Well, I suppose we could develop the highlands of Scotland.

There was an article in BBC News 24's starry eyed 'world on the move' series yesterday in which economic migrants (illegal immigrants) from West Africa to the Canaries had been allowed to go to mainland Spain (still illegal but pending processing). Some were filmed getting straight into the black market (selling pirate DVDs/CDs).

Now, while there are immigrants (legal and otherwise) that will do honest graft and pay their taxes and there are home grown trash who won't, do we really need more forgers supplying 'medical degrees', 'engineering degrees' and pirated aeroplane parts? Keep on raiding but with a thought for the genuine asylum seeker.

I'm sure we (all of the pre 2004 EEC ) are storing up trouble for ourselves and the benefits of immigration are exaggerated. Turn the 'native' career idle to before giving an immigrant a low/no skill job. There is no shortage of hands to pick flowers or make ready meals.

I worked with refugees for several months last year partly because I felt that having studied conflict for several years it would be a valuable add-on to learn something of the lives of those who are one of the main by-products of 20th and 21st century conflict - refugees. My job required me to read many of the case notes and I was astonished by the cruelty faced by many refugees within this supposedly safe country.

Government policies mean that many people fleeing persecution have to initially break the law and become illegal immigrants for starters. This is because the government is ever concious of the need to do business with even the most reprehensible regimes and so (conveniently) refuses to acknowledge that many of those states with whom it does business persecute their own citizens.

True we can't right all the world's wrongs (is that another way to translate the phrase 'shit happens' ?) but we can do our bit and our leaders should bear the consequences (refugees) in mind as they charge around the world providing the second eleven to Bush's A team and threatening selected states with the use of armed force.

I agree completely with the opinions outlined by Maxi_77 in the above post.

I could have sworn the BBC report said; "dawn raids on failed asylum seekers".

golden_rivet said:

True we can't right all the world's wrongs (is that another way to translate the phrase 'shit happens' ?)

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In the words of Emo Phillips; your getting kind'o good at this, aren't you.

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Yes failed, but why have they failed, because some civil servant has a 'target' to fail so many a month, or because they weren't really assylum seekers. It is strange that there are a fair numberrecently have been sent back to Zimbabwe where the regime does not even hide the violence against the opposition.

There are very few who would support genuine failed assylum seekers being allowed to stay without good reason but the dawn raids are just a show of macho government and in most cases are not needed. After all the only ones they do the dawn raids on are the ones who have been honest and don't hide or try to disappear. You never hear of dawn raids against genuine illegals do you/

Well if we cant stop them at the borders then these raids need to continue!REcently in norfolk we have had several raids in the past few years and i EVERY case nearly 50 illegals have been detained and shipped to a secure center.The only way to stop them is increase the Customs & Immigration service to a level where they are at least effective then lodge ALL Aliens in a SECURE environment unitll they have been processed,then let loose or removed from the Country.The most common surname used to be williams or Jones but now is Probably Patel and the most heard language i hear in town is Eastern European!!!!Its all just going to the dogs!

Have you notice the trendy nail bars that have sprung up in all the town centres. Staffed almost entirely by Chinese workers, have these workers got work permits? I would be surprised if they have. Time for some checks to be carried out? China refuses to have any illegal immigrants returned, however I reckon they would soon accept them if economic sanctions were to be applied.

The problem is, even if you do intern all illegal arrivals there is always some do-gooding bastard making noises trying to get them out. The Detention Centres in Australia were deliberately sited in remote areas but the press and the rent-a-rabble set up a semi permanent presence outside the gates. This encouraged the inmates to stage protests and riots, which in turn led to the rabble saying that the centres were a dangerous environment and must be shut down.

Thankfully it seems the well advertised existence of these centres has had the desired effect as illegal arrivals are well down on previous years, also helped by changes to the immigration zone and increased sentences for the crews of the people smuggling vessels.
In the last few years the Australian Customs Service has started using large, armed patrol boats ( 7.62 mm GPMGs) to supplement the RAN patrol boats and Coastwatch aircraft that used to have the entire burden of patrolling the northern approaches. Perhaps the UK could do the same?

The problem is, even if you do intern all illegal arrivals there is always some do-gooding bastard making noises trying to get them out. The Detention Centres in Australia were deliberately sited in remote areas but the press and the rent-a-rabble set up a semi permanent presence outside the gates. This encouraged the inmates to stage protests and riots, which in turn led to the rabble saying that the centres were a dangerous environment and must be shut down.

Thankfully it seems the well advertised existence of these centres has had the desired effect as illegal arrivals are well down on previous years, also helped by changes to the immigration zone and increased sentences for the crews of the people smuggling vessels.
In the last few years the Australian Customs Service has started using large, armed patrol boats ( 7.62 mm GPMGs) to supplement the RAN patrol boats and Coastwatch aircraft that used to have the entire burden of patrolling the northern approaches. Perhaps the UK could do the same?

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well Jack your govt. did kindly join the Bush-Blair camp over Iraq so I guess they do have lots of good ideas and can lead the way - tally ho!

The problem is, even if you do intern all illegal arrivals there is always some do-gooding bastard making noises trying to get them out. The Detention Centres in Australia were deliberately sited in remote areas but the press and the rent-a-rabble set up a semi permanent presence outside the gates. This encouraged the inmates to stage protests and riots, which in turn led to the rabble saying that the centres were a dangerous environment and must be shut down.

Thankfully it seems the well advertised existence of these centres has had the desired effect as illegal arrivals are well down on previous years, also helped by changes to the immigration zone and increased sentences for the crews of the people smuggling vessels.
In the last few years the Australian Customs Service has started using large, armed patrol boats ( 7.62 mm GPMGs) to supplement the RAN patrol boats and Coastwatch aircraft that used to have the entire burden of patrolling the northern approaches. Perhaps the UK could do the same?

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Jack77

Oz is thousands of miles from any other civilization, if you land in NW Oz you are 100 of miles from anywhere that may just be called a town so enforcement really is not much more than covering a sea area of your northern coast. I fully agree with the policies put in place and the camps set up in inhospitable places to encourage said people to feck off back home.

But it is not a solution that is suitable for Europe. Of the 28 members of the EC and two associated countries Norway and Switzerland all but two, the UK and Ireland have signed the "Schengen Agreement" which allows free movement of people, with no border controls between countries. Five countries have yet to implement the agreement Switzerland, two who have been members for 4 days and two Island states, Malta and Southern (Greek) Cyprus.

Just as you have no border controls between Queensland and NSW or the other states that is now how Europe operates. You cross a border at 120K's on a motor way. The Australian model really has no application to the UK situation. We do not have any place to put detention camps that the locals would accept. We are very close to Continental Europe and on most days more then the complete population of Oz crosses into or out of the UK borders by Air, Rail or coach and car ferry. Tens of thousands shop daily in France, Belgium and Holland.

I think that the contributors on these pages will have to accept a level of illegals if they wish to remain living in a non Police State with out an internment camp at the bottom of there particular garden.

Thats right Nutty - just give in. When I left the UK last month no-one even checked my passport on the way out. As you say the UK hasn't signed up to Schengen, so there is no earthly reason why the British government shouldn't effectively protect the rights of British citizens in the UK (thats why they exist) by enforcing the laws regarding immigration.

For one I would like the government to keep the border controls. I would also like detection, rejection then ejection of asylum seekers to be greatly improved. There is always a case for genuine asylum seekers but they must be genuine.

Thats right Nutty - just give in. When I left the UK last month no-one even checked my passport on the way out. As you say the UK hasn't signed up to Schengen, so there is no earthly reason why the British government shouldn't effectively protect the rights of British citizens in the UK (thats why they exist) by enforcing the laws regarding immigration.

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F169

The population is not prepared to allow the enforcement of any existing laws let alone any new ones that may be needed. ID Cards, regular and frequent stops and searching by Police/Immigration/Community Support/SOCA/Revenue Officers. Many long term inmates in a camp/prison at the bottom of your street, th cost of keeping hundreds of thousands banged up indefinitely.

WHO IS GOING TO PAY FOR ALL THIS??? YOU?????

Trying to get any countries to accept repatriation, forcible deportation (I defy you to find a Air Line that will take them) So we will have to start ConAir cos the RAF can't get our lads between UK and Mid East in an organized fashion.