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\r\n Actually, Reo was still shooting Doinkers at LAS last year. He was shooing in the lane next to a good buddy of mine so I got to see him make history. He had so much weight on the end of his main bar that you could see it sag on the end when he was aiming......\r\n\r\n

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Reo was still shooting the Doinkers when he won the outdoor 600 round in Yankton too.

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I noticed many of the pros using them. I also noticed the guy who won the money class at KC in BHFS was shoot a B Stinger.\r\n\r\nBottomline there good stabilizers and many are winning with them.\r\n\r\nBroadwater just won the Nimes European championship with them this weekend as well.\r\n\r\nHoyt and B Stinger seem to be having a banner year again.\r\n\r\nI did ask a couple of the pros there if they noticed a big difference with them and most said you need to shoot them to see the difference.\r\n\r\n\r\nHacker won the mens using a Doinker. \r\n\r\nStill have to be a shooter to win.\r\nDB\r\nDB\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by Daniel Boone\r\n \r\n

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I noticed many of the pros using them. I also noticed the guy who won the money class at KC in BHFS was shoot a B Stinger.\r\n\r\nBottomline there good stabilizers and many are winning with them.\r\n\r\nBroadwater just won the Nimes European championship with them this weekend as well.\r\n\r\nHoyt and B Stinger seem to be having a banner year again.\r\n\r\nI did ask a couple of the pros there if they noticed a big difference with them and most said you need to shoot them to see the difference.\r\n\r\n\r\nHacker won the mens using a Doinker. \r\n\r\nStill have to be a shooter to win.\r\nDB\r\nDB

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My point exactly!!! No doubt B Stinger makes a great product either!!\r\n

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Looks like you can add as nuch weight on the end as you want. Best bet is to call and ask them\'\r\nDB

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I\'m looking for wt. just of the unweighted bar. \r\n\r\nI suppose you\'re right about the call, I\'m just afraid if I call and talk to him I will place an order . I\'d still like to wait till the shop gets them in to try before dropping $350 on a trial run.\r\n

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\r\n JAVI, I\'ve always enjoyed reading your posts. I\'ve never met you but I tend to believe what you post. That is due to your time and experience in and around the sport. You seem to approach everything with a level of logic and realism. I appreciate your voice of sanity in this over hyped advertising world in which we all now live. Anyway, just wanted to say thanks to you for being willing to state your opinion whether it\'s popular or not.\r\n

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\r\n I got mine coming.\r\n\r\n\r\n Reo, Chance, Dan Mcarthey, Jesse Broadwater and Jeff Hopkins are using something and tell me it made a big difference I listen. Just contact Blair and talk to him. He very intelligent and very nice guy.\r\n\r\n\r\nIm looking forward to trying his new system of blance of stabilizers.\r\nDB\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by BuckeyeRed\r\n \r\n

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I\'m looking for wt. just of the unweighted bar. \n\nI suppose you\'re right about the call, I\'m just afraid if I call and talk to him I will place an order . I\'d still like to wait till the shop gets them in to try before dropping $350 on a trial run.

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You will not be the first guinea pig. We\'ve already had the first guy buy one. As soon as I can get Blair on the phone to explain how to setup my customers, I\'ll get them ordered in.\r\n

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Sweet! Hype or not I\'d like to give them a look. \n\n\nDo you have any Doinker Avancees on order as well?

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No Doinkers at this time. We are still trying to decide if we are going to carry Doinker this year. \n\nJohn will be here Saturday to shoot his league score and he\'ll have the Bstinger. What length would you be interested in?\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by Chris\r\n \r\n

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No Doinkers at this time. We are still trying to decide if we are going to carry Doinker this year. \r\n\r\nJohn will be here Saturday to shoot his league score and he\'ll have the Bstinger. What length would you be interested in?

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30" or 33" and the 12" side bar. Their adjustable sidebar mount as well.\r\n

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\r\n I have a set of the Premiers. I went with a 36" front and one 15" side bar. I\'ve never been one to use any weight in the front but on this setup I have 2 oz on the front and 6 oz on the side bar. They have been saying that one one side bar is the way to go but you don\'t really know till you try it. Jeff Hopkins was using two 15" rods as V Bars at the Lancaster shoot so I guess you just have to experiement. Great product though!\r\n

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\r\n The common setup will be a 30x12 for freestyle some go with the 30x15 allowing you to get more control with less weight by being farther away from your center mass weight of your bow.\r\n\r\nWith the main rod and side bar being very stiff and ultra light lends to being capable of nano tuning the balance with the one ounce weights, you will have better control of your sight picture and be able to make fine adjustments to correct and minimize the amount of effort to steady your picture as well as to how your dot floats.\r\n

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The only one that is your competitor is the air between your ears!\r\n\r\n\r\n

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\r\n I shoot the Freestyle Premeir 33 in. It is by bar the best stabilizer I have shot. It is very light and very helpful with steading my bow. I would recommend this Stabilizer to anyone! My scores improved big time when I got this stabilizer!\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by Daniel Boone\r\n \r\n

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I noticed many of the pros using them. I also noticed the guy who won the money class at KC in BHFS was shoot a B Stinger.\r\n\r\nBottomline there good stabilizers and many are winning with them.\r\n\r\nBroadwater just won the Nimes European championship with them this weekend as well.\r\n\r\nHoyt and B Stinger seem to be having a banner year again.\r\n\r\nI did ask a couple of the pros there if they noticed a big difference with them and most said you need to shoot them to see the difference.\r\n\r\n\r\nHacker won the mens using a Doinker. \r\n\r\nStill have to be a shooter to win.\r\nDB\r\nDB

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\r\n Stabilizers are aiming devices. Its all about getting them balanced the shooter likes. Vibration after the shot isnt nearly as much a factor as getting the bow to balance and aim well. Its how the shooter behind the bow likes his bow set up. Either balanced or weight forward. With most good stabilizers out there today you can acheive the balance you want. There is no magic in any stabilizer out there. The magic is between your ears. Getting confident behind your equipment is key but it still all comes down to the shooter behind the equipment.\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by jame\r\n \r\n

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Stabilizers are aiming devices. Its all about getting them balanced the shooter likes. Vibration after the shot isnt nearly as much a factor as getting the bow to balance and aim well. Its how the shooter behind the bow likes his bow set up. Either balanced or weight forward. With most good stabilizers out there today you can acheive the balance you want. There is no magic in any stabilizer out there. The magic is between your ears. Getting confident behind your equipment is key but it still all comes down to the shooter behind the equipment.

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Just ask Jeff Hopkins and Levi why they switched and how its helped them. They will give you honest answer.\r\n\r\nWill see who stabilizers on are what bow when Vegas is all over with. Maybe they might help!\r\n\r\nBlair gives a fulll money back garantee if you dont like them. Hard to argue with that!\r\nDB\r\n\r\nReo sure seems to be having a banner year.\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by Daniel Boone\r\n \r\n

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Just ask Jeff Hopkins and Levi why they switched and how its helped them. They will give you honest answer.\r\n\r\nWill see who stabilizers on are what bow when Vegas is all over with. Maybe they might help!\r\n\r\nBlair gives a fulll money back garantee if you dont like them. Hard to argue with that!\r\nDB\r\n\r\nReo sure seems to be having a banner year.

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\r\nCongrats on the purchase DB. I\'ll be interested to see how they work for you. These bars have certainly revved the hype machine into full gear the past several months. I tried the original XL bar and did not find it to be anything special, but I never had the opportunity to try the new Premier bars.\r\n\r\nBut, remember, that guarantee only extends to the short bars... The premier bars are your for keeps, like it or not.. \r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by JawsDad\r\n \r\n

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Congrats on the purchase DB. I\'ll be interested to see how they work for you. These bars have certainly revved the hype machine into full gear the past several months. I tried the original XL bar and did not find it to be anything special, but I never had the opportunity to try the new Premier bars.\r\n\r\nBut, remember, that guarantee only extends to the short bars... The premier bars are your for keeps, like it or not..

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Blairs always been more than fair to me. You get what you pay for. Having Blair and his stabilizers is like having a coach that goes along with them. He helped many top guns archers. I would rather those in my class dont shoot them\r\nDB\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by Daniel Boone\r\n \r\n

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Blairs always been more than fair to me. You get what you pay for. Having Blair and his stabilizers is like having a coach that goes along with them. He helped many top guns archers. I would rather those in my class dont shoot them\r\nDB

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\r\n\r\nUnderstood.. Just wanted to clarify that the return policy is on the hunter stabs only.. That point came up on AT today and it was explained that there is no 30-day return for the long bars.. Either way, I hope they work for you... \r\n\r\nLike I said, I haven\'t tried the Premier bars. To me, the XL\'s did not seem to be any different than quite a number of other bars on the market. But, then again, I\'m not the level of shooter that might see a big advantage by using them.. \r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by JawsDad\r\n \r\n

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Understood.. Just wanted to clarify that the return policy is on the hunter stabs only.. That point came up on AT today and it was explained that there is no 30-day return for the long bars.. Either way, I hope they work for you... \r\n\r\nLike I said, I haven\'t tried the Premier bars. To me, the XL\'s did not seem to be any different than quite a number of other bars on the market. But, then again, I\'m not the level of shooter that might see a big advantage by using them..

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Have you ever tried to contact and talk persoanally with Blair. I highly recommend you do and then maybe you will understand what others have found in his stabilizers. Its more than just buying a stabilizer. Sometimes they do design a better wheel.\r\nDB\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by Daniel Boone\r\n \r\n

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Have you ever tried to contact and talk persoanally with Blair. I highly recommend you do and then maybe you will understand what others have found in his stabilizers. Its more than just buying a stabilizer. Sometimes they do design a better wheel.\r\nDB

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Yep, I spoke with him when I ordered my XL\'s originally. At the end of the day, all you can really do is either add or subtract weight and change the angle of your vbars.. You can\'t move the weight around and you can\'t vary the length or configuration.. Not really any magic there. Even a goober like myself can figure out how to screw and unscrew weights.. \r\n\r\n\r\nI know there are a lot of guys swearing by them these days.. I\'m sure there have been some benefits to those that have switched in whatever form those benefits may take.. But, for me, I don\'t see it.. I\'ve had this debate with the swarm of b-stingers on AT before including the kings B\'s themselves. I still believe it\'s a stabilizer, a good one yes, but still a stabilizer. Seems most of those big names that have switched were shooting pretty stinkin\' good before they switched. Perfect before and perfect after is still perfect.. \r\n

\r\n All I know.\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by JawsDad\r\n \r\n

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Yep, I spoke with him when I ordered my XL\'s originally. At the end of the day, all you can really do is either add or subtract weight and change the angle of your vbars.. You can\'t move the weight around and you can\'t vary the length or configuration.. Not really any magic there. Even a goober like myself can figure out how to screw and unscrew weights.. \r\n\r\n\r\nI know there are a lot of guys swearing by them these days.. I\'m sure there have been some benefits to those that have switched in whatever form those benefits may take.. But, for me, I don\'t see it.. I\'ve had this debate with the swarm of b-stingers on AT before including the kings B\'s themselves. I still believe it\'s a stabilizer, a good one yes, but still a stabilizer. Seems most of those big names that have switched were shooting pretty stinkin\' good before they switched. Perfect before and perfect after is still perfect..

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Is what the pro tells me. If Im taking advice. I want it from someone who winning. Maybe there a good reason they switched and are winning. Winning often is the difference in one shot or one point. I realize this and so do Jessee and other good shooters. Should I think these folks have no understanding what works and what doesnt. Jawsdad who do you listen to? Self coached! Im not near as smart as some who shoot. But I do know who to get advice from.\r\nDB\r\n\r\nPS\r\n\r\nIf all you got is add or subtract weight. You certianly didnt listen very well. Because I got alot more from him. We disscussed wrist and torgue and what works when your hitting high or low. Tim Ewers may have decided to not listen he may not have went home and shot a 300 30X. \r\n\r\n\r\nDB\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by Daniel Boone\r\n \r\n

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Is what the pro tells me. If Im taking advice. I want it from someone who winning. Maybe there a good reason they switched and are winning. Winning often is the difference in one shot or one point. I realize this and so do Jessee and other good shooters. Should I think these folks have no understanding what works and what doesnt. Jawsdad who do you listen to? Self coached! Im not near as smart as some who shoot. But I do know who to get advice from.\r\nDB\r\n\r\nPS\r\n\r\nIf all you got is add or subtract weight. You certianly didnt listen very well. Because I got alot more from him. We disscussed wrist and torgue and what works when your hitting high or low. Tim Ewers may have decided to not listen he may not have went home and shot a 300 30X. \r\n\r\n\r\nDB

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\r\nYou win, I\'m evidently completely wrong.. My apologies for having a contrary opinion than "the pros". \r\n\r\nEnjoy your bars DB. I hope they get you that extra X or 2 you need to get back to that 60x. I\'ll get back to self coaching and someday I\'ll aspire to get there myself..\r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by JawsDad\r\n \r\n

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You win, I\'m evidently completely wrong.. My apologies for having a contrary opinion than "the pros". \r\n\r\nEnjoy your bars DB. I hope they get you that extra X or 2 you need to get back to that 60x. I\'ll get back to self coaching and someday I\'ll aspire to get there myself..

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What ever works for you! Maybe travel and get Javi to help coach you. I know what works for myself. No contest here, no one wins. Its a thread \r\nDB\r\n

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\r\n An rod of sufficient elastic modulus will allow more weight forward on a longer rod without whip. Plain and simple larger diameter weights allow more weight in a smaller linear area reducing the flexing load on the rod... \n \nMake the front rod longer and put more weight on it and the bow will move less… \n \nit ain\'t rocket science it\'s high school physics and geometry..\n \nBlair found a carbon tube of higher elastic modulus without unduly increasing weight and is buying it to make stabilizers.. good for him… \n \nyou reckon other folks ain’t gonna buy the same carbon tube in a New York minute… \r\n

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\r\n Originally Posted by JAVI\r\n \r\n

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An rod of sufficient elastic modulus will allow more weight forward on a longer rod without whip. Plain and simple larger diameter weights allow more weight in a smaller linear area reducing the flexing load on the rod... \r\n \r\nMake the front rod longer and put more weight on it and the bow will move less… \r\n \r\nit ain\'t rocket science it\'s high school physics and geometry..\r\n \r\nBlair found a carbon tube of higher elastic modulus without unduly increasing weight and is buying it to make stabilizers.. good for him… \r\n \r\nyou reckon other folks ain’t gonna buy the same carbon tube in a New York minute…

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\r\nTook a simple concept and made a good stabilizer. Many good pros and amatuers are winning with them ever day. Now will someone one day down the line make one better. I sure hope so because in my years of archery equipment has changed and made archers better shooters. I wish it was as simple as many try to make it. But when I talk to archers who devoted there life to archery. They tweak and look for equipment to help there game.\r\nDB\r\n

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DB, good luck with your new set stabs. Just hope that sight pitcure said els down when you mount those new stingers to your bow.

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I sure hope so! Thats the goal. No magic equipment. Just the seek to find what works. \r\n\r\nJavi and Huntelk both are good friends and always alot of fun to disscuss with. They know to never take anything I say in a thread personal.\r\nDB\r\n

Threaded View

JAVI, I've always enjoyed reading your posts. I've never met you but I tend to believe what you post. That is due to your time and experience in and around the sport. You seem to approach everything with a level of logic and realism. I appreciate your voice of sanity in this over hyped advertising world in which we all now live. Anyway, just wanted to say thanks to you for being willing to state your opinion whether it's popular or not.

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