Obama: Health Care Reform Is Essential to Rebuilding Economy

The president held his fourth prime time press conference tonight. (Photo by JIM WATSON/AFP/Getty Images)

Updated 8:45 p.m.By Michael A. Fletcher and Scott Butterworth
President Obama warned Wednesday night that health-care reform is central to rebuilding the economy "stronger than before," and without congressional action on health-care reform, "We're guaranteed to see Medicare and Medicaid basically break the federal budget."

The first half of the president's prime-time news conference was dominated by health care and his push to convince Congress to send him a reform bill, which Obama calls his top legislative priority.

"If we do not control these costs, we will not be able to control our deficit. If we do not reform health care, your premiums and out-of-pocket costs will continue to skyrocket," Obama said.

Polls show the public increasingly skeptical of Obama's plans to remake the nation's health care system, and some lawmakers are balking at details of the plans emerging in Congress.

Obama said he wanted to use his prime-time appearance to tell Americans, "What's in this for me? How does my family stand to benefit from health insurance reform?"

The president sees health care reform as central not only to extending coverage to the 46 million Americans who lack it, but to reining in the soaring cost of care, which is busting government budgets, burdening the balance sheets of businesses and squeezing the paychecks of workers.

For all of that, however, many of those problems are not obvious to everyday Americans, the vast majority of whom have coverage. As a result, the president's challenge is to demonstrate the benefits of health care reform to a public that might not yet be sold on the idea.

Obama also must prod Congress to come up with a plan that fits the tight parameters he has set out for health care reform. Obama has said the legislation must broaden coverage, slow long-term cost increases and be deficit neutral, despite an expected price tag of more than $1 trillion over the next decade. Obama has said that must be achieved without increasing taxes on the 95 percent of Americans who earn less than $250,000 a year.

The plans moving in Congress include some of those elements, but none of them do enough to slow health care cost increases, according to the Congressional Budget Office. Nor have lawmakers settled on a plan to pay for the initial costs of expanding health care coverage. Those disagreements have thrown into serious doubt Obama's goal of having health care bills pass both chambers of Congress before the August 7 summer recess.

Undercutting Obama's effort also is growing public discontent about his handling of the overall economy. With the nation just beginning to emerge from the most severe economic downturn since the Great Depression, unemployment is continuing to rise. It now stands at 9.5 percent and is projected to surge even higher in the coming months, despite the $787 billion economic stimulus plan that Obama managed to squeeze through Congress in the early weeks of his administration.

Many economists agree that the employment picture would be much worse had the stimulus plan not been enacted. Still, the administration missed badly when it projected that unemployment would not rise above 8 percent with the measure in place, hurting the credibility of its economic forecasts.

The worsening unemployment picture is expected to slow future economic growth and push projected government budget deficits even higher, creating new obstacles for the proposed sweeping health care overhaul.

Obama said tonight, "I've also pledged that health insurance reform will not add to our deficit over the next decade, and I mean it."

He also tried to reframe a political debate about whether passage of a health-care bill will give the president a major victory.

"I understand how easy it is for this town to become consumed in the game of politics, to turn every issue into a running tally of who's up and who's down," Obama said.

"This debate is not a game ... [and Americans] can't afford to wait any longer for reform. They're counting on us to get this done. They're looking to us for leadership. And we can't let them down," the president said.

The American Medical Association (AMA) knows firsthand the devastating effects of our broken health care system. As the nation's largest physician organization, we feel it is imperative to take this opportunity to formally reiterate to you our commitment to meaningful health system reform. Progress has been made and common ground exists, but there are still difficult issues that must be resolved. We believe it is time for results, not rhetoric. America's patients and physicians deserve better. More information can be found at our health system reform resources community at www.ama-assn.org/go/reform.

I cant beleive this Country voted this guy to office. Obama is a community activest from hell. A Reverand Al Sharpton on steroids. Theres is one bright spot in this disater of an administration, the Democrats wont have any more excuses. This country will hit bottom like never before, bankrupt, divided and destitute.

The birds in my yard understand more about economics than Obama does- please

Barack Obama will never -I repeat NEVER- say to your face what he actually plans to do or achieve with these huge new government programs…. like bankrupt the private health insurance industry. Everything’s rolled-out in a trojan horse, and you’re not allowed to look inside or ask any questions. Suffice to say, good-faith disclosure is simply not how this crew operates.

Rather, you get some calculating and specious oratory with styrofoam props to wow the plebes, like the tacky Greek columns in Denver. To him, the revolutionary ends justify the Alinskyite means- so the Dear Leader just tells you whatever he needs to, he knows what’s best for you anyway.

And the truth is that Obama is out to nationalize health care.. they’ll be no private insurance industry left after five years of Obamacare… but of course he’s lying about it.

As for the American public, the reality that Obama is dishonest and out-of-control seems to finally be setting-in; the poll numbers are now headed steadily south- is he already facing his Waterloo on this legislation?

By the way if doctors wanted to rip people off they would save alot of time,tuition, money and aggravation by just going to law school instead of med school and forget the $150 to "rip" out tonsils- lawyers make $150 telling you to get lost after they screw up your case after they didnt bother to pay any attention to it or fail to show up in court LOL.

This is a scenario straight out of the book Atlas Shrugged. The one and only reason why the health care system is "messed up" is because of government interference in it. Instead of socializing the whole thing and lowering the quality of everybodys care, what we need, is TORT reform! please watch this video: http://www.staysmartstayhealthy.com/watch.cfm?v=5

the vast majority of medical advancements come from America. if it wasn't for our system a lot of medications would never exist in the first place, medicine that was created 10 years ago is better than no medicine at all. its just that this issue is emotional.

Obama and people like him are the biggest threat to human existence that there is. Because they are true Luddites. Democrats are against the industrial revolution and point to the "horrors of the industrial revolution" however they fail to acknowledge how life was before it. This man no matter he says is putting policy's in place that make living in America like driving with your parking break on, his kind separate and buffer us from reality but there is only 1 reality and we must strive to stay close to it. the further away we are from it the more it hurts when it inevitably acts on us.

"That's what I will do in bringing all parties together, not negotiating behind closed doors, but bringing all parties together, and broadcasting those negotiations on C-SPAN so that the American people can see what the choices are," he said during one Democratic primary debate. Is this what he has done?

Soon the headlines will read that Obama's press conference had a positive impact on public opinion about health care reform.

That's good, because the country needs this very badly. The money we overspend on health care we can then spend on other things.

You'd think conservatives would love all that, but no. The same wooden heads will be back here to explode about Obama again tomorrow (yawn).

Oh yeah, and as for the "prospect" of giving free health care to the illegals, which bothers some of you so much, you may as well save your bellyaching because we do that already. You or your employer pays for this as part of your beloved insurance premiums, so it can be given to Hospitals who are forced to over-charge paying customers in order to finance the free health care they are required by law to give to the indigent. Including illegal immigrants. These people would need fewer serious medical interventions if they had preventative care, and we would wind up spending less on them.

The Healthcareless Corporations had never
exhibitted signs of honesty. They are not
an institution that has it within itself
to be truthful and/or openly helpful.

This is one of those DC focus group blatherings
that the lobbyist corporations develope to
facilitate likability towards something that
is quite 'honestly' repulsive.

Try this analogy on for size, asking the
Insurance Industry to be honest is very
much the same as asking a rabid dog to
become a lap-cat kitten that knows nothing
but unconditional love. Sorry, but we aint
buying it!

POBE (President of Big Ears) needs to grow
a set of BALLS and condemn the Lobbist
influence and demand congress craft legislation
that excludes the taint of the Insurance thieves.

Congress should just go ahead and buy out the stockholder equity of privately-owned hospitals and health insurance companies, to return them to the status of non-profit or not-for-profit entities that they mostly were 30 to 40 years ago. That timeframe is important, because it was after that time that health care costs started to spiral out of control. Aside from HIV and the obesity epidemic, one big factor in that cost increase was having to pay for corporate profits and dividends.

Privatization of these firms may have been okay at some point, but eventually it led to poorer service and larger copayments as companies sought to maintain and/or increase profit margins and to pay for high corporate salaries and bonuses. When such services are being paid for with a large components of tax dollars, privatization makes no sense. It doesn't have to be a Canadian-style single payer system; just a return to the system of cooperatives which worked well for 50 years until the Reaganites screwed it up.

If Congress puts in place a government-owned entity, without buyout out shareholder equity of private companies, then it really is socialism like the Republicans warn it may be. In a capitalist economy such as ours, when the government takes over an activity, private companies should be compensated for their losses, especially when they were encouraged to buy-out these cooperatives starting about 25 years ago. Otherwise, our Congress would be acting no better than Hugo Chavez or Fidel Castro.

How utterly embarassing to hear the POTUS give such stupid examples of Doctors less than ethical behavior....a child with a sore throat...the Doc looks, not at what is medically necessary, but a list of payments so decides that a tonsillectomy will pay th most.

This non medical lawyer has NO idea that this is impossible....does he not know of internal controls that are and have been in place for years called "Tissue Committees"? ? ? ? ?

EVERY part of the human body removed is sent to the lab...tissue slides are made and examined to be sure the tissue was in need of excision. It is then medically reviewed, on a regular basis, by physicians..........Doctors do NOT get to operate if they have been removing healthy tissue.

Obama is a fool to try to talk as a knowledgeable medical person. He has street level knowledge, anecdotal 2nd, third hand gossip stories....and he believes them!

KEEP OUT OF OUR MEDICAL CARE OBAMA,

Deal with your own....TORT REFORM being skirted, costing us billions/year. Lawyers should have CAPS on their fees for representing a perosn alleging harm.

Great - now he's saying doctors are ripping out tonsils to make a quick buck. First of all, primary care doctors don't remove tonsils except in rural areas, so this is a bad example in the first place. If you're going to a specialist because of a chronic sore throat, odds are the tonsillectomy is indicated. And most doctors, the great majority, are good people who strongly believe in "Do no harm." To treat them as pirates out for loot is incredibly demeaning.

Mr. President...wrong! Healthcare would be nice, but wht is esential to our recoery is getting those jobs back that have been outsourced, forcing companies to return factories and call centers, and getting rid of cheap guest workers like the Indian parasites here on H1-B visas. Until AND UNLESS you do that, I want every single thing on your agenda stopped dead in it's tracks.

Obama continues to blame the Bush administration - that will be his excuse for the next 3.5 years. I guess we'd better get used to it because he is not going to change his method to fool the American public. What a wimp.

I haven't really listened to Obama speak since he was elected -- I am a little surprised how poorly he is speaking - he's obviously uncomfortable in non-prepared, unrehearsed setting. He obviously campaigned extraordinarily well - I fear that may be his strong suit.

Did he inherit a bad economy and huge deficit? Of course - he campaigned on that before being elected - we all don't need him to remind us that Bush left a huge mess behind. When he does this (and this isn't the first time) he sounds like he's whining -- and whining ain't presidential!

For crying out loud I've been listening to obama's press conference and he continues to blame the past administration for current problems. Man up and do your job! Whining about the problems you inherited in a job you campaigned two years for makes you look weak and stupid. You should have been well aware of these problems, you're in the driver seat now, do your job and you won't have to worry about being blamed.

Trillions of dollars in UNREAD, that's right UNREAD pork packages that hasn't stimulated a flea as the UNEMPLOYMENT CONTINUES TO RISE TO DOUBLE DIGITS and has just QUADRUPLED THE DEFICIT.
AND
They continue the same CRAP in MORE Democrat UNREAD Obama/Pelosi Care.

Obama is on TV now and attempting to defend his UNREAD very very very expensive and damaging Obama/Pelosi Care debacle, so turn on you TRUTH DETECTOR that will zap any lies. I got a feeling you'll be hearing crickets a lot tonight.

Obama, why don't you tell the truth?

From the Wall Street Journal

"So when Mr. Obama says that “If you like your health-care plan, you’ll be able to keep your health-care plan, period. No one will take it away, no matter what,” he’s wrong. Period. What he’s not telling the American people is that the government will so dramatically change the rules of the insurance market that employers will find it impossible to maintain their current coverage, and many will drop it altogether. THE MORE WE INSPECT THE HOUSE BILL, THE MORE IT LOOKS TO BE ONE OF THE WORST PIECES OF LEGISLATION EVER INTRODUCED IN CONGRESS."
AND,
The the bipartisan CBO says that Obama/Pelosi/Democrat care SUCKS BIG TIME!

Major Crap coming from Obama/Pelosi/Obama that they inflict on Americans and they INSULT the public by not even reading it AND the UNEMPLOYMENT RATE KEEPS RISING.

How is your proposal going to help Billy Anderson?? He's been in the hospital over 18 months, undiagnosed. He is a 29 year old father of 2 little girls, 3 and 5 years old. No insurance as he had just started a new job. He got ill Dec. 30 2007 and was admitted to a hospital Jan. 6 2008 and has not been home since. So tell me, how are you going to help Billy. If he is not in the hospital he will surely die as he has a severe form of some kind of immunodefficiency.. and severe gastroentestinal disorder.. he has lost over 130 lbs... he is 6'1 inches tall. We need help to get to a reputable hospital to save Billy's life. What is your answer Mr. Obama. Google Billy's disease, his story has been told nationally and internationally... we are desperate, Billy doesn't have another year to live like this, he will die if we can't get him the help he needs.

Universal health care is another excuse to raise taxes and expand government - I wonder how much of what is actually taxed in the name of health care will actually wind up in the general fund and spent on government salaries or new administration buildings with solid gold toilets. Lower taxes, let me take care of my self and my family, and I'll be happy to help my neighbor. I'll be able to do it far more energetically and efficiently than any unionized bureacrat.

I have in the last few days read that if the Republicans can defeat President Obama's Public Health Plan this would be Obama's WaterLoo...

Nothing could be further from the truth!!!

If President Obama's Public Health Plan is not pass by Congress WE will blame the following.

1. The Republican Party.
2. Those Democrats who voted against Obama's Health Plan.
3. The Health Industry, who has BEEN giving both Republicans and certain Democrats tens of millions of lobby dollars to defeat Obama's Health Plan. YES, OUR COUNTRY IS FOR SALE!!!

FOR 8 YEARS UNDER BUSH, THE REPUBLICANS DID NOT CARE ONE BIT ABOUT HELPING THOSE AMERICANS WITHOUT HEALTH CARE... WIN OR LOSS, PRESIDENT OBAMA DOES CARE FOR WORKING CLASS AMERICANS WITHOUT HEATH CARE...

AND WIN OR LOSS ON HEALTH CARE, PRESIDENT OBAMA WILL HAVE MY VOTE IN 2012!!!

Whe are you gonna wake up sheeple? The man is a pathological liar. Nothing he has done from Tart to porkulus to health care has been designed to help the economy, improve our lives or our security. It's all about a power grab, more government power and less individual freedom.What is wrong with you people. Do you know that they have also decided to end private college loan availability? They are attempting to set up a program where the government awards college loans to whom they choose and, if the recipient agrees to spent 10 years in government service, in a program chosen by the government, then supposedly you wouldn't have to repay them. Sound like mandatory government service to you? Brown shirts here we come. Is this what you empty headed libs voted for? If it is, I hope you enjoy your new dictator!

After the opening statement tonight, Obama read from his notes selecting an AP reporter, so obviously the questions are prearranged. Obama cannot be trusted. He's the type of person who would come to your house on Halloween, get a treat, and soap your windows anyway. Devious beyond words.

Oh stop the All Obama! All The Time Obama
BS! Lou Dodds is running a poll on will
people be watching Obama's Healthcare Speech Tonight and 86% Say NO WAY We Heard
It All Before! Impeach Obama Here & Now!

So, Teleprompter Barry will read whatever Rahm Emanuel has prepared for him. Let me guess - we have to do this now, it's critical, it's an emergency, never mind what it will cost, never mind that taxpayers will foot the bill for millions of illegal aliens, anybody who is against this is 1) on the take from drug companies, or 2) out of touch with my mandate to do whatever I want, or 3) maybe really read the bill and knows that it stinks. oops, sorry - time is up.

He won't convince the naysayers in congress to act. They will just said, "Wait! Don't go too fast! Let's think about this!" That's what they've been saying for years.

And they can afford to do that. Of course they want to put this off. they have the best health care in the USA. I just read the the New York Times article today describing congressional health care. Their care even pays for doctor's visits and huge catastrophic illnesses. And a huge part of the premiums (which are quite high) are subsidized by the federal government.

If it takes forever to do this, congress will be all right.

But I also read elsewhere that the number of uninsured has grown five million since 2008. And that number will probably increase each year.

Ask yourself--Are you sure your insurance company won't cut you off (rescission) if you or a family member has an expensive illness? Or maybe they will just encourage your employer to find a reason to fire you so they don't have to insure you any more.

If you have the kind of insurance which is rescission-free, as Congress does, you can afford to wait. If you have the kind of insurance most of us have--here today and gone when you get catastrophically sick--, you want congress to act NOW.

The American people are tired of watching politicians pass out billions for war, pass out billions to banks or corporations in financial trouble but none to the people for decent health care! It's a crime! Members of the House and the Senate both enjoy the luxury of a great health care plan while their boss (the taxpayer) has no health care or bad health care! If Congress fails to pass some sort of health care reform bill, then you will see a surge in an Independent Party, in the next election cycle, like you have not seen in a long time. A warning to both Democrats and Republicans, your days may be numbered.

Hey Liar in Chief Barack Obama go take your
Obamacare and shove it! And stop filling up
our tv sets with All Obama BS All The Time!
I sure as Hell will not watch it as it is
just more Obama whining! Impeach Obama!

Can you give me one example when a local, state or federal government estimated the cost of any program that came in under budget?

First – The House of Representatives introduced its health care "reform" legislation that is supposed to cost JUST a $1 trillion over the next 10 years, according to the most recent Congressional Budget Office (CBO) estimate. The Obama administration and the Democratic leadership in Congress have promised to pass health care "reform" legislation only if it is completely paid for. To achieve this, the House Democrats plan to soak the rich with a three stage surtax on incomes over $350,000 per year ($500 billion) and by imposing even lower Medicare reimbursement rates on hospitals and doctors. Of course, these new taxes and rationing schemes will only "pay for" health care "reform" if the CBO estimates are right.

Unfortunately, as the Cato Institute's Michael Tanner and Chris Edwards point out, the CBO and other agencies have a history of WILDLY UNDERESTIMATING future government medical program expenditures: A further concern is that initial cost estimates of federal health programs are usually very optimistic.

When Medicare was launched in 1965, Part A was projected to cost $9 billion by 1990, but ended up costing $67 billion. When Medicaid’s special hospitals subsidy was added in 1987, it was supposed to cost $100 million annually, but it already cost $11 billion by 1992. When Medicare’s home care benefit was added in 1988, it was projected to cost $4 billion in 1993, but ended up costing $10 billion. Or consider that when Massachusetts Commonwealth Care was put into place in 2006, it was expected to cost about $725 million annually, but the expected cost for 2009 is now almost $1 billion. To say the least, past cost estimates that are off by more than 500 percent do not inspire confidence in the accuracy of the new estimates.

The real cost of universal health care in the US is anybody’s guess, but it is safe to say that it is NOT 1 trillion dollars over the next ten years.

Second – slow down Obama. Let those who want to read the 1,000 pages read and study the whole document. What are you trying to hide?

Third – remove federally funded abortions. This line item will take precedence over other equally or more important procedures just to fulfill your political obligations to Planned Parenthood, and I for one don’t want any of my taxes to pay for them.

i think the polls are with obama.after reading thes comments .many are posted by same commenters numerous times.so i know you have obama haters that is not going to change.but if the same people keepposting over and over,its going to be a very small percentage.i personally dont know one person that doesnt want healthcare reform.

Here's an idea. Let's take the trillions being spent on the wars in the Middle East and spend them on healthcare. Wait, that can't work cause the MIC won't be able to get no bid contracts and hide their profits offshore. It's crazy to want to shift the expenditure to Americans at home. Heck we could also develop green energy... domestically. Nah, it will never work. Too many drones chanting "We're number one," and "My country right or wrong."

You campaigned on Change; and its proving to be very difficult-- given what needs fixing on our domestic agenda. But be assured that some of us realize that in the history of civilization, change means taking giant steps so as to move forward. It takes work.

The NOs are many, but those who understand your 'vision' have your back.

Dr. Barack Kevorkian thinks that the elderly are to be rendered into soylent green protein of some sort. Look at the way he treats his own family members in Kenya. His half-brother is living in extreme poverty. his grandmother, who insists that Obama was born in Kenya, is also ignored by The One. Any dirt-bag who ignores his or her relatives needing help is TRASH.

Dr. Barack Kevorkian thinks that the elderly are to be rendered into soylent green protein of some sort. Look at the way he treats his own family members in Kenya. His half-brother is living in extreme poverty. his grandmother, who insists that Obama was born in Kenya, is also ignored by The One. Any dirt-bag who ignores his or her relatives needing help is TRASH.

The President is right; this is not the time to delay. The delay tactic is really the destroy tactic. To delay is to kill the Health Care Reform, period. The GOP does not have an alternative Health Care Reform plan but to stay with the status quo. They want to continue the environment that increases the profits of the Insurance and Drug Companies while decreasing the quality and availability of Health Care for everyone. If we delay we will spend another 50 years debating and evading the final out come of Health Care Reform.
Now is the time to capture the opportunity of finally winning the fight. We must strike the knockout blow now and finally win.
I am for taxing everyone if we need to pay for health care for everyone. We all should share the burden. I am my brother’s keeper and I want to see my neighbor do well. I am willing to pay more in taxes for health care for everyone. In the end I believe we will all save more money in our ability to obtain more competitive health care plans that will lower our out of pocket costs for health care.

Either his teleprompter breaks and he starts crying or he boxes his opposition into an untenable political position by taking charge of the center and exposing the corrupt politicians in congress for what they truly are. Anyone want to bet which it is?

JRM2:
"you haven't answered my question, why is it OK for Ronald Reagan to have higher unemployment numbers and higher taxes two years into his first term but it is not OK to give more than 6 months to a plan that is supposed to take 18 months to take full hold?"

1) Reagan did not get sworn into office and immediately insist on his plan having to be voted on within weeks...even though many economic metrics were even worse when he was sworn in than when Obama took over.
2) His first major economic plan was debated thoroughly, not jammed through Congress the same day it was printed without anyone having a chance to read it, and didn't pass until the fall of 1981.
3) most of Reagan's economic plan consisted of tax cuts that were phased in from 1982 to 1984. He never promised his plan would provide an immediate fix....like Obama did.

Now that I've answered yet another of your diversionary questions, when are you going to address the facts I've put out here that thoroughly debunks your continuing claim that 'no one thought the stimulus would work immediately' and that everyone knew the stimulus would take 18 months to work?

Co-opt the opposition by announcing that health care reform is too important to be hijacked and diluted by hundreds of amendments from lawmakers who have no intention of enacting ANY reform...

...so therefore, POTUS is setting back the White House's timetable -- to ensure that MEANINGFUL health care reform gets passed, and not an over-compromised measure that satifies no one and fails to "get the job done."

If POTUS does NOT do this at the top of his press conference, he may very well find himself "waist-deep in Big Muddy" (apologies to Pete Seeger).

***

BUT ASK YOURSELF THIS, MR. PRESIDENT:

What good is health care reform when a secretive federal/local multi-agency coordinated action "program" is ruining the lives and livelihoods of many thousands of unjustly "targeted" Americans?

A "program" that victims say has INFILTRATED the health care system, raising questions about the quality of the care received by those unjustly targeted by this American Gestapo:

JackSmith is spewing garbage using all kinds of tricks and no facts. Let’s see the bill first and let us judge is merits:

What does this self-praise mean?
“…a bill with a strong, robust, government-run public option, and an intelligent, reasonable INITIAL funding plan to cover ALMOST all of the American people. It is carefully written, and thoughtfully constructed, informed, prudent and wise. This bill will save trillions of dollars, and millions of your lives…[a} bill that all Americans can FEEL GOOD about, that has the POTENTIAL to dramatically improve the quality”.

Yes you are correct. I will fight tooth, and nail for every bit of this bill to be defeated. I will be aggressive, creative, and relentless to put a stop to this “GOLD STANDARD”.

I want PLATINUM STANDARD, a private hospital room with TVs and games, and an additional bed for my lover. I don’t want what I had in Europe. After all, those amenities make me feel good and cannot be cut for the sake of efficiency.

Independent4tw:
"...the CBO says that Health Care will cost $1.5 Trillion dollars over 10 years, but that is not the net profit. We will save far more then it costs."

I can only assume you missed the testimony given by the head of the Congressional Budget Office this week that the Democrats 'reform' bill as it currently stands will be a net addition to costs, not savings?

And this head of the CBO is a former member of the Clinton administration and headed the liberal Brookings Institution for the last two years before coming to the CBO.

If a conservative pundit says a Democrat plan is going to add to the deficit and not save any money, you may be a little worried but will probably dismiss it as partisan rambling.

If a liberal Democrat economist says a Democrat 'reform' bill will add to the deficit and not save any money, you should take notice and quit with the copy-and-paste from left-wing blogs that spews misleading statistics.

@dbw1: So, you haven't answered my question, why is it OK for the shining beacon of conservatism, Ronald Reagan to have higher unemployment numbers and higher taxes two years into his first term but it is not OK to give more than 6 months to a plan that is supposed to take 18 months to take full hold?

It is economic folly to make the assumption that freed up GDP won’t cause economic growth. Under a more reasonable assumption of an average of 2.5% growth over 10 years, health care reform would be saving $982 billion a year by 2019. The total amount health care reform would save over a 10 year period is $8.81 trillion.

Posted by: Independent4tw | July 22, 2009 2:28 PM

_______________________________________________________________

You are totally right, this is gonna be such a money maker! WE MUST ACT NOW! - or spend $8.81 trillion on health care over the next DECADE. QUICK! - we need action!

JRM2:
"You are very uninformed, no one , I repeat no one said or expected the stimulus to magically heal the economy immediately. True, the job market has gotten worse, but that has also been expected."

If you are going to call someone else 'uninformed', you should make sure you are informed yourself. Let me help:

"...the report says that even by the middle of this year, the stimulus bill would have a positive effect on the unemployment rate."

The quote is from the right-wing rag "Time" magazine, and the report referred to is the one put out by Obama and his economic team when they were pressing for IMMEDIATE passage of the stimulus bill.

Obama & Co. also said the stimulus would keep the unemployment rate from going over 8%....but hey, what's another broken promise among friends, right?

The United States spends 17 percent of its GDP on health care. If nothing changes, the United States will be spending 20 percent of its GDP on health care by 2017. European systems spend an average of 8% of GDP on health care.

The House bill is not a European system. Because private insurers and for-profit hospitals will continue to exist, the House bill will not cut health care spending by 9 percent of GDP. But as our collective bargaining power lowers prices, it is reasonable to assume that the House bill would cut health care spending by 5.5 percent of GDP.

A United States health care system that spent 11.5% of its GDP, instead of 17% of its GDP, on health care, would be a health care system that contributes to economic growth, creates manufacturing jobs in the green sector, and helps to reduce our national debt.

Current US GDP is 14.3 trillion dollars a year. Health care reform would save 5.5% of GDP per year. Assuming no growth, health care reform would save the United States economy $786 billion a year. That is money that would be put back into the economy, create jobs, and ultimately generate revenue to offset the federal budget deficit.

Even if you assumed no growth, health care reform still reduces the federal budget deficit by freeing up GDP. According to the CBO, the average federal tax rate is 20.7 percent. So the federal government would take home 20.7% of the $786 billion a year we would save by reducing health care costs and expanding access to health insurance. That means that the federal government would see an extra $162 billion a year headed into its coffers.

It is economic folly to make the assumption that freed up GDP won’t cause economic growth. Under a more reasonable assumption of an average of 2.5% growth over 10 years, health care reform would be saving $982 billion a year by 2019. The total amount health care reform would save over a 10 year period is $8.81 trillion.

JRM2:
"They flew your senator back because the vote was on and another delay means even more time for it to take effect."

So a 2 day delay in the vote on a stimulus bill you claim everyone knew wouldn't work for 18 months would have meant the difference between recession and depression?

By your reasoning, shouldn't a 2 day delay in the vote only mean a 2 day lag in the 18 month realization of benefits? And you are saying that delaying the vote 2 days for a plan you say everyone knew would take 545 days to work was just too long to wait?

“So if we gave illegals health care, and that actually REDUCED the amount of taxes we spend on them because they wouldn't have to be overcharged at the ER, you would still be against this reform?”

Yes, because you flunked math. It actually INCREASES the amount of taxes. Since you are so caring what’s your problem paying the ER overcharges? But your money where your mouth is. You want me to pay for your ER and invite another horde of illegals?

Simple way of cutting cost: Don’t visit the ER.

Posted by: west129 | July 22, 2009 1:57 PM
________________

Your ramblings make no sense. Going to the ER will cost more then paying for insurance in the long run. We can't stop illegals from going to the ER. Therefore, it is cheaper to buy illegals insurance then it is not too, and then pay their ER bills.

You have a plan to keep illegals from going to the ER? Since it is illegal in every state to do that, I'd like to hear your idea.

The healthcare reform bill released by the House Of Representatives is an excellent bill as I understand it. It's a bill with a strong, robust, government-run public option, and an intelligent, reasonable initial funding plan to cover almost all of the American people. It is carefully written, and thoughtfully constructed, informed, prudent and wise. This bill will save trillions of dollars, and millions of your lives. It is also now supported by the AMA.

This is the type of bill that all Americans can feel good about. And this is the type of bill that has the potential to dramatically improve the quality of healthcare for all Americans. Rich, middle class and poor a like. Democrats, Republicans, Independents, and all other party affiliations. This bill has the potential to dramatically improve the quality of life of every American.

The house healthcare bill should be viewed as the minimum GOLD STANDARD by which all other proposed healthcare legislation should be judged. All supporters of true high quality healthcare reform should now place all your support behind this healthcare reform bill released by the United States House Of Representatives, as the minimum Gold standard for healthcare reform in America.

You should all now support this bill with all your might, and all of your unrelenting tenacity. This healthcare bill is a VERY, VERY GOOD! bill for all of the American people. Fight tooth, and nail for every bit of this bill if you have too. Be aggressive, creative, and relentless for this bill.

From this time forward, go BIGGER and DEEPER with the American people every day until passage of healthcare reform with a robust, government-run public option.

FIGHT!! like your life and the lives of your loved ones depends on it. BECAUSE IT DOES!

JRM2:
"Even if it were 1 trillion per year it would still be cheaper than the 2.6 trillion we spent just in 2008."

I understand that Democrats really struggle with concepts like "math", but you should stop mixing apples and oranges. The $1.5 trillion the Democrats are saying it will cost is a ten-year number to cover those who are currently uninsured.

The $2.6 trillion is an ANNUAL number of all medical spending, both public and private.

And, for the $2.6 trillion number to reach $35 trillion in 10 years, as your past post predicts could happen without the government taking over, it would take 35% annual inflation to reach that amount. Inflation of medical costs hasn't been even half that high in the worst years.

The only way to achieve 35% inflation is for Obama to keep printing money we don't have....

"I can't wait for this thing to pass, and in 5 years when the cost is already at $1 trillion PER YEAR, having Obama blame George Bush for it.....
Posted by: dbw1 "
---
Even if it were 1 trillion per year it would still be cheaper than the 2.6 trillion we spent just in 2008.

" Obama was either blatantly lying to us then, or you are now. Your choice.
Posted by: dbw1 | July 22, 2009 1:50 PM"
------
You are very uninformed, no one , I repeat no one said or expected the stimulus to magically heal the economy immediately. They flew your senator back because the vote was on and another delay means even more time for it to take effect. They realized that it WOULD take time, that is why it needed to be passed. The effect has been that it has kept our country from going into a depression. True, the job market has gotten worse, but that has also been expected despite the stimulus, other economic indicators have been improving.

Why are you so quick to call it a failure when the Republican shining star, Ronald Reagan, had higher unemployment AND higher taxes two years into his first term?, and you want to dump Obama after a few months?
Tell me.

The press conference will be as it always is: Obama droning on (he loves the sound of his own voice) and receiving softball questions from his adoring audience, which he will give more long-winded answers. I hate admit it, but I miss the Rathers and Donaldsons who held the Presidents' feet to the fire!

Actually it is about him. He just wants you to think its about you, but it's not.

And BTW, if you make less than $250,000 but more than say $40,000 under which health insurance would be subsidized, you either have to buy a policy or pay a fine. That fine is really a TAX which would be levied on everyone who doesn't knuckle under, whether they make more than $250,000 or not.

Another promise finagled away. Is anyone still surprised by Obamanation's dishonesty?

“So if we gave illegals health care, and that actually REDUCED the amount of taxes we spend on them because they wouldn't have to be overcharged at the ER, you would still be against this reform?”

Yes, because you flunked math. It actually INCREASES the amount of taxes. Since you are so caring what’s your problem paying the ER overcharges? But your money where your mouth is. You want me to pay for your ER and invite another horde of illegals?

JRM2:
"Got any evidence that Democrats are putting in a provision for illegals to get treatment for "anything, anytime"?"

Uhhh, what President are you listening to? I'm just going by the President saying that we need to cover health care for every resident.

I'll have to wait for a final bill to be able to copy-and-paste from it since you don't believe your own party members, but they are assuring us that the bill(s) they are working on are to cover the "50 million uninsured" (a phony number, by the way). And they don't want any restrictions on what care is needed, when it's needed, or who needs it.

So how would you interpret that, JRM2? Do you have any evidence to prove the Democrat bills WON'T cover illegal immigrants?

If Obama and the Democrats say now that the cost will be $1-$1.5 trillion, what do you think the real cost will be? Find me a program, a building, anything at all that Congress ever approved funds for that didn't end up costing exponentially more than they 'forecast'.

I can't wait for this thing to pass, and in 5 years when the cost is already at $1 trillion PER YEAR, having Obama blame George Bush for it.....

"Have to hand it to you on name-calling, though. Calling someone "moron" when you disagree with them is pretty fresh and insightful....
Posted by: dbw1 | July 22, 2009 1:42 PM"
---
Repeating the same old tired lies is worse without considering the true costs.

Got any evidence that Democrats are putting in a provision for illegals to get treatment for "anything, anytime"?

JRM2:
"The stimulus is supposed to take 18 months to see it's full fruition, it is not possible for it to be immediately effective because of federal procurement laws."

False again. Unless you are calling Obama and the Democrats a bunch of liars.

Remember that week when the stimulus was passed? I recall it pretty well. Final bill is printed out early on a Friday morning, and final votes are scheduled mere hours later because IT HAS TO PASS NOW! Obama said our very economic existence teetered in the balance if it didn't get passed RIGHT NOW!

In fact, I seem to recall them spending tax dollars to arrange for a military plane to fly my senator, Sherrod Brown (OH-D), back to Washington that very night to cast the final and deciding vote.

An honest person might ask themselves, why did they have to fly Sherrod back on a FRIDAY NIGHT to vote on the stimulus bill that was just printed that morning. Why not wait until he came back as scheduled a couple days later? I mean, if the stimulus was not going to have an effect for months, what's a couple more days, right?

Obviously Obama and the Democrats would not have insisted on the same-day rush to vote before anyone could actually read the 1,000+ page long bill if everyone believed it would take months to have any impact.

So you can't have it both ways, JRM2, and claim everyone said all along that the stimulus would not have an immediate effect. Obama was either blatantly lying to us then, or you are now. Your choice.

Wrong place but Hardball's Chris Matthews is a complete moron screaming at a Congressman that a certificate of birth is a birth cerificate. It is a form submitted to the state which they have to investigate. Obama has no birth certicate because he was born in Coast Provincial General Hospital in Mombassa, Kenya according to his grandmother in Kenya.

JRM3:
"Hey moron, you are paying MORE for it now every time an illegal goes to the emergency room."

Actually, that is false. True, if an illegal needs emergency care and goes to ER, we pay for it. But by and large they are only going to go to ER today if they really need it. Mix in the Democrats wish to pay the bill for illegals any time they want to show up at the clinic for anything whatsoever, and the cost of this thing is going to skyrocket.

Have to hand it to you on name-calling, though. Calling someone "moron" when you disagree with them is pretty fresh and insightful....

"It's the economy! The stimulus plan that was rushed through to prevent impending doom is a total failure.
Posted by: west129 | July 22, 2009 1:24 PM "
-----
First, it's not a total failure, we are already seeing benefits from the plan in 6 months. The stimulus is supposed to take 18 months to see it's full fruition, it is not possible for it to be immediately effective because of federal procurement laws.

Second, the stimulus was watered down by republicans, it wasn't big enough.

Just because Faux news and a bunch of loser republicans say it's a failure doesn't mean it's true, in fact, probably the opposite is true.

If you want accurate information I would suggest reading ECONOMISTS opinions rather than partisan drivel.

So many articles stating what Obama says is critical. For God's sake what Obama says is immaterial. He has sub contracted his presidency to Nancy Pelosi. What Obama says does not matter. His presidency has been all speeches and apologies, false promises and no action. War in Iraq goes on. No national health care, no end to Cuban embargo or don't ask, don't tell, Iranian and North korean boldness due to no action by USA. Is this all there is?

Posted by: mascmen7 | July 22, 2009 1:37 PM
---------------------------
Yeah....I can't believe it is taking more then 6 months to change America. He should have had all that done months ago.

So many articles stating what Obama says is critical. For God's sake what Obama says is immaterial. He has sub contracted his presidency to Nancy Pelosi. What Obama says does not matter. His presidency has been all speeches and apologies, false promises and no action. War in Iraq goes on. No national health care, no end to Cuban embargo or don't ask, don't tell, Iranian and North korean boldness due to no action by USA. Is this all there is?

"Absolutely NO to a reform bill that bestows free health care to illegal aliens and to parasites unwilling to get gainful employment."
---
Hey moron, you are paying MORE for it now every time an illegal goes to the emergency room.

Give me a break, Independent4tw...democrats (and Congress, for that matter) don't even bother to read what they pass - example, climate change, (300 page amendment added the night before) that would require building codes to match California's current high standards. And look at CA - what a model to emulate...now, we are going to be guilted into supporting health care reform tonight - can't wait!

Absolutely NO to a reform bill that bestows free health care to illegal aliens and to parasites unwilling to get gainful employment.

For Obama to run a propaganda war for this absurd and nihilistic legislation is an act of arrogance. Should this legislation pass the bill is a killer bill, attempting to sanction the killing of the unborn and the elderly for the sake of cost reduction.

Why would anybody watch Obama’s charade tonight. He is delusional and has absolute no clue what will be in the bills. And we all know his mantra: ”The sky is falling” again.

It's the economy! The stimulus plan that was rushed through to prevent impending doom is a total failure. Now another disaster is being predicted and hyped because of insurance problems with some 50 million imaginary uninsured?

Congress is becoming a pool of fools if they are doing more of the same and are expecting different results.

Give us jobs, secure our jobs and we will have insurance. Keep the government’s hands off my body!

Give me a break, Independent4tw...democrats (and Congress, for that matter) don't even bother to read what they pass - example, climate change, (300 page amendment added the night before) that would require building codes to match California's current high standards. And look at CA - what a model to emulate...now, we are going to be guilted into supporting health care reform tonight - can't wait!

I am guessing Pelosi is wishing she hadn't wasted her firepower in strong arming conservative dems to vote for climate change last month - especially since the Senate will not seriously take the issue up this Congress.

As for mr. president, we are all kind of tired of you ramming through bills that no one has read. Slow down. Understand the issues. read.

Absolutely NO to a reform bill that bestows free health care to illegal aliens and to parasites unwilling to get gainful employment.

For Obama to run a propaganda war for this absurd and nihilistic legislation is an act of arrogance. Should this legislation pass the bill is a killer bill, attempting to sanction the killing of the unborn and the elderly for the sake of cost reduction.

Why would anybody watch Obama’s charade tonight. He is delusional and has absolute no clue what will be in the bills. And we all know his mantra: ”The sky is falling” again.

It's the economy! The stimulus plan that was rushed through to prevent impending doom is a total failure. Now another disaster is being predicted and hyped because of insurance problems with some 50 million imaginary uninsured?

Congress is becoming a pool of fools if they are doing more of the same and are expecting different results.

Give us jobs, secure our jobs and we will have insurance. Keep the government’s hands off my body!

California is a disaster with their financial problems. Massachusetts' attempt at providing health coverage is a disaster. There are hospital in Mass. suing the government. Europe and Canada are moving toward private health insurance. Health insurance reform is too big to rush through. Small business cannot afford to pay more taxes. Most of them are only working 4 days/wk. as it is.
Dumping the cost on the rich is not a plan,
its just putting a bandaid over the problem. Its risky too. We have to say thanks, but no thanks, to Obama's plans for health insurance reform so far.

Obama is now refusing to tell the American people which healthcare industry execs and lobbyists he's meeting with at the White House. Obama is giving us "reform" written by the lobbyists, so he's trying to pull the wool over our eyes and rush things through before people wise up to what is going on and understand the implications of his proposals.

California is a disaster with their financial problems. Massachusetts' attempt at providing health coverage is a disaster. There are hospital in Mass. suing the government. Europe and Canada are moving toward private health insurance. Health insurance reform is too big to rush through. Small business cannot afford to pay more taxes. Most of them are only working 4 days/wk. as it is.
Dumping the cost on the rich is not a plan,
its just putting a bandaid over the problem. Its risky too. We have to say thanks, but no thanks, to Obama's plans for health insurance reform so far.

It's a sad commentary that Americans have become so self-centered and selfish that they cannot follow the teachings of somone who commended the good Samaritan for helping a total stranger, paying for all of the injured man's needs out of his own pocket, or have forgotten Luke 3:11 and Acts 2:45 -- teachings of being a good neighbor, of sharing....

I don't have much; I'm not wealthy by any means, but I am willing to pay a little more in taxes to know that my fellow Americans have health coverage.

There are two major issues: expanding coverage and bringing down costs. It shouldn't be hard to make that case as most Americans already support it. But the devil is in the details.

What Obama has to do is get behind one or more of the specific plans in committee. The frustration here - as was the case with the stimulus - is Obama letting Congress come up with the details on their own. Health care reform is extremely complicated and requires more guidance than just a few overall principles.

Hopefully, Obama will show flexibility on the deadline - August 7 is neither necessary nor realistic - and on taxing the benefits to pay for it.

The real point of contention with the Blue Dogs - and they are the only ones who matter - is cost control. Sit down with Mike Ross and other Blue Dog leaders and figure out a specific means to pay for this. I don't care if it means a tax increase or it means going back on a campaign pledge. Leadership requires flexibility.

Despite all the media naysaying, there is enormous agreement across all sorts of sectors in the health care world for major reform - including the AMA and the health insurance providers themselves. This is not 1993 where all the powerful interests opposed reform.

And as for the Republicans, don't get suckered into their games. They want power and nothing else. Only a handful of Republicans are serious about the health care problem we face. Fortunately, we had an election and we have enough Democrats and reasonable Republicans to pass reform. Ignore the far right.

A final suggestion is the Compromise of 1850 model. Instead of one big bill, Congress should consider dividing up the elements into separate bills. That way different Congressmen can vote for or against different provisions without worrying about angering their constituents.

WHAT GOOD IS HEALTH CARE REFORM WHEN A FED-ENABLED 'PROGRAM' VIOLATES THE CIVIL AND HUMAN RIGHTS OF THE UNJUSTLY 'TARGETED'?
***

FEMA, Secret Service, FBI, the U.S. military and intel agencies are among the federal enablers of volunteer community policing, anti-terrorism and town watch organizations transmogrified by Bush-Cheney into fronts for a nationwide, civilian Gestapo-like army.

When "targets" travel, the GPS system alerts vigilantes affiliated with local units of this American Gestapo, and the harassment follows. Local police cooperation denies these targeted Americans their Constitutional right of equal protection under the law.

Silent, injury- and illness-inducing microwave and laser radiation "directed energy weapons" are being used to torture, and to degrade the lives of targeted citizens -- what could be described as a quiet, ideologically-motivated genocide.

This weaponization of the electromagnetic spectrum is every bit as socially significant as the invention of gunpowder -- but the mainstream media has yet to report in detail on the ramifications.

Victims charge that members of this civilian Gestapo have infiltrated the health care system, calling into question the quality of the services they receive when they need hospital or emergency care.

And companion array of “programs of personal financial destruction," using the IRS as a political weapon, sabotages the finances of targeted families. Their telecommunications and U.S. mail appear to be subject to warrantless surveillance, interception and tampering, including the alteration of financial accounts and credit card and utility billing statements.

This systematic bypass of the American judicial system makes a mockery of the rule of law -- and political "dissidents," "whistle-blowers" and those considered to be social "deviates" are among its prime targets.

Civil rights advocates: Wake up and smell the police state that has co-opted POTUS and a deluded Congress into becoming enablers of vigilante injustice and domestic torture.

PRESIDENT IS ACTING LIKE A KID.EVERYDAY IN FRONT OF THE TV ,GETTING TORED OF HIM.PUPPETS IN THE CONGRESS,CZARS IN THE WHITEHOUSE,ARE WE MISSING SOMEBODY AT THE TOP,PUPPET MASTER,NO WE HAVE OBAMA.
IF THEY WANT TO BRING GOVT HEALTHCARE FOR EVERYBODY,THE PRESIDENT MEMBERS OF CONGRESS SHOUL JION THE MEDICARE LIKE OUR SENIOR CITIZENS.
HOW CAN THEY AFFORD TO GIVE ALL THE BENEFITS WITH LESS PREMIUMS.
EVERY TIME THEY COMEOUT AND SAY WE WILL CUT THE PAYMENTS DOCS AND HOSPITALS,NOT FAIR.
DO THE SENATORS DESERVE MORE SALARY THAN A PHYSIAN 360/200K.DO THEY DESRVE LIFE LONG BENEFITS PENSIONS FOR WHAT,DESTROYING OUR COUNTRY.WE SHOULD FIX THEIR SALARIES AT 200K,STRIP THEIR LIFE LONG BENEFITS.
WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO SUE THEM FOR DOING BAD JOB,RECKING PEOPLES LIVES,MAKE THEM ACCOUNABLE