ok im tired of here a whole bunch of toys try to tell me graffiti is art, personally i think graffiti is vandlism.... im out for the distruction and getting my name up not to do art.... i see nothing artist about scribles on electrical boxes and tosses on people personal stuff... dont get me wrong graffiti take up a BIG part in my life but yea...

graffiti stoped being art once it was taken out of the ghettos where it made it the dark depressing broken down walls ect into something colorful and gave kids hope and somthing to do instead of gang banging ect...

but i wanna see your everyones views on this, who know if might even help some people out with doing reports in school

I dont really know what to say but to me i see it both ways, let me explain my self.. Okay one side you have it as an art form for tha simple fact that you take somethin blank and you make it come to life with colors or what ever you have like if you were to go out and do a piece it could be seen as art to some people but on tha othe side you do have all tha vandlism were you make up some stuff that isnt your like street signs, sides of buildings or what ever you hit up, these things arent your so it is vandlism but if you spend time on it and its not just a buch of little ass lines that dont make since then i think it would be art, but that just to me maybe you see it from a diffrent point of view then me, let me know what you think.

gesus... you might wanna go back and edit some of them sentences, but i think graffiti is an artform, obviousely bombs and scribes look like shit but the nicer things are awsome and really give the setting more life...bombs and shit give the setting more of a shity look. GRAFFITI IS VANDALISM, no getting around that fact, thats what they classify us as...VANDALS...

yea but see legals to me arnt graffiti there art IF and ONLY IF there done by people who are good... productions murals yea thats art bombing tagg banging rolls thats nothinging but pure vandlism at its finest i mean thats all i do.. i dont do any legals... theres street art which CAN be art is done properly like right now i went to a dumpster and found a massive amount of thick plastic boards for shirts out side of express took all of them and im doign them up as if i would a canvas and placing them in random stop for people to take home and shit like that... thats art i think but all the tosses i do all the skript the rollers all that i concider vandlism

Originally posted by infer one@Jan 25 2005, 03:45 PM gesus... you might wanna go back and edit some of them sentences, but i think graffiti is an artform, obviousely bombs and scribes look like shit but the nicer things are awsome and really give the setting more life...bombs and shit give the setting more of a shity look. GRAFFITI IS VANDALISM, no getting around that fact, thats what they classify us as...VANDALS...

bad toyish graffiti isnt really considered art. but when you see a huge filled throw with a great letter structure imo its considered art. no matter what kind of graffiti you do its vandalism and destruction of property. this thread is going to get alot of discussion going and it will be good. graffiti is vandalism and always will be no matter how you look at it. personally i love destroying city property and other things in my city its just fun and gets me away from the rest of my life

Originally Posted by ODonthesetrees

don't worry about it, the bud is in the roots, so when you pull the plant out of the groudn after its a few months old the buds are attached to the bottom, theyre already in bags and everything

But if you look around theres spots were you have time to do just about what ever you want so you could do a piece not just a spot thats for legals and these would be looked at by people as art even tho it is vandalism, but like if you were to take a can of paint some where and you do sumthing even if its just a throw up wouldnt you still see it as art just because its adding some life to that spot

Originally posted by oblong@Jan 25 2005, 03:54 PM bad toyish graffiti isnt really considered art. but when you see a huge filled throw with a great letter structure imo its considered art. no matter what kind of graffiti you do its vandalism and destruction of property. this thread is going to get alot of discussion going and it will be good. graffiti is vandalism and always will be no matter how you look at it. personally i love destroying city property and other things in my city its just fun and gets me away from the rest of my life

I do agree with oblong, it will all ways be considered as vandalism just because we go out and write on things that arent ours. all yeah and im with you on destroying city property

Well... TODAY, this day in age, graffiti can easily be passed off as an art. I think a lot of people, shit even the majority of writers find graffiti being the stepping stone away from structural art. Meaning self expressing that is in the hands of someone else&#39;s discretion like an "Art" teacher or professor. The act it&#39;s self is vandalism. But I much rather be labeled an artist then a vandal... Vandal is a term that comes with tons of stigmas society as a whole asserts upon. The point of graffiti, atleast for me is that it can still hold the integrity of being an art form. Just because it&#39;s not on a canvass, or hanging in a museum doesn&#39;t mean it should be hectored by outsiders as being vandalism. I guess a lot of what your question boils down to is which part of graffiti to you delegate most of you ambition and focus into. Bombing... Or piecing. Ideally a person should be balance out both. Shit man.. It&#39;s kind of a double bladed sword. It&#39;s like okay, on one hand. You bomb for expectancy for those like yourself. But strong piecers often by use of "legal" walls these days, use them to depict to the public, it is in art.. What person can really walk by a wild style burner downtown and not acknowledge it. You almost need to know in some deep seated part of your mind that, what your doing is an art, despite how out of context one takes what you were originally trying to convey and distorts it. I mean you wouldn&#39;t stand for 7 or 8 hours in one place after you did a bomb... But when you piece you do... I think the self appreciation aspect of completing a piece, or rather in turn emptying 20 cans out bombing for hours on in one night runs in the same vain. It&#39;s the same feeling of accomplishment. So I can&#39;t really say slandering bombers for just "bombing" and not really ever developing any skills outside of a repetitive bubble letter as being wack. Some people have revolved their graffiti career around solely bombing. And it worked for their benefit. Others, just strong pieces to define their time spent in graffiti. I think graffiti is one of the few aspects of life that is deminishing lately that is completely man/woman made. A person could paint a master piece on canvass, sell it for x amonut of money. And then it&#39;s whored on key chains in thumb nail renditions. Is that "art", it&#39;s excepted by the public with not question. So it&#39;s evidently not vandalism. I think assuming the name "vandal" is only plaguing the graffiti movement as a whole. Although it&#39;s an attractive life style to a lot of heads coming up. I think the more work produced by "graffiti artist" and "graffiti bombers" world wide will one day not need to plead for expectancy.. But this could either be benifit or the down fall of graffiti as a whole. You don&#39;t want graffiti being mass produced on key chains as accesories for people. The day that happens I&#39;ll resign. Your asking the question is graffiti vandalism or art. It&#39;s def. an art. The "art" of it all is in the preliminary action in doing graffiti not necessarily the remains left. It&#39;s a different type of art. One that isn&#39;t for the faint of heart by anymeans. As I&#39;ve said in the past.. "Some people coincide with the phrase of actions speaking louder then words, but imagine a world filled with people who&#39;s actions spoke loud words..." It the ART of writing. It&#39;s like what William Shakespeare once said in a sonnet I remember, "Thy sweet love remembered, such wealth brings.. That then I scorn to change my state with KINGS.." Graffiti is like a disease in your veins. You begin to neglect other art&#39;s or murals.. Nothing really impresses you outside of letters done with spray cans. Which is sad to say the least. Especially if your taking the approach from an artist stand point. Cause theirs no real initiative behind the driving force. I guess some people get hype when they see their shit on t.v. and labeled "vandal", I&#39;ve made the news countless times. And it&#39;s not all it&#39;s said to be. Being associated with gang activity and then toped off with vandal stifles my motivation to keep producing work. Either way, there will never be another visual art as pure as the act of graffiti.

R.I.P J.Carson.

&quot;YOUR STYLE IS LIKE DYING IN MY SLEEP, I&#39;M NOT FEELING IT...&quot; -Feminem

Originally posted by oblong@Jan 25 2005, 03:54 PM personally i love destroying city property and other things in my city its just fun and gets me away from the rest of my life

i couldnt of said it ANY better liek i said dont get me wrong im out bombing atleast 4 days out of the week... im just tryin to get a lil convo goin here and prove to all the toys who keep on say graffiti is art and not vandlism that they dont know what the fuck there talkin about

and kaynine i agree with u im all about chill spots but not legals

:edit:

rebus homie, that was a mind full im glad someone finally put some real shit into what they said.. i was hopinh u and some of the other older writers would throw in some words

makes things look more interesting...have you ever turned your head twice for a blank wall? i dont think so. have you ever turned your head for a freshly put up throwie by one of the big writers around you? i guarentee it. it puts color into things, makes them look more interesting, and makes shit beautiful..hey gesus you&#39;ve talked about how toys put there shitty ass stuff up and it gets annoying n stuff right? (everyone has), well if your all about destruction and getting up, then why is their shit so bad? what makes your stuff better? is it more *artistic*? yes.

Originally posted by THEPOSTWHORE5000@Jan 25 2005, 04:14 PM makes things look more interesting...have you ever turned your head twice for a black wall? i dont think so. have you ever turned your head for a freshly put up throwie by one of the big writers around you? i guarentee it. it puts color into things, makes them look more interesting, and makes shit beautiful..hey gesus you&#39;ve talked about how toys put there shitty ass stuff up and it gets annoying n stuff right? (everyone has), well if your all about destruction and getting up, then why is their shit so bad? what makes your stuff better? is it more *artistic*? yes.

well first off i been bombing for 5 years and i think theres a big diffrence between me and a bunch of toys.... or atleast i would hope.... my shit doesnt look as bad and a bunch of random stiight and diagnal (sp) lines and make up a name that u cant even read.... do u agree?

and also yea i turn my head twice fuck even about 8 times when i see a black wall cas its rare when u see them and all i can think it and a perfect background that ouls be for a pink green,yellow or pink toss.....

as for the turning your head for a new toss or burner yea i do it but thats because i DO graffiti u think someone in a car is goin to notice that shit fuck no... you cant see and your not looking for.. graffiti artist we look for other graffiti i cdont even know how time times ive almost crashed by lookin at graffiti and not the road, but i know that people dont notice new tosses and everything else cas it all looks the same to them... i have even been asked by my mom how do u notice all that stuff and i respond with cas im looking for it