Those women are being objectified and oppressed and demeaned!!!1 And probably cleaning more in an hour than I do in a month. Will somebody release them from the mascara smirched chains of the patriarchy?

KhamanV:It's pretty cool, actually, and it's going to make a ton of shiat easier for you that you could in all likelihood never have to think about. It's totally under your radar because it's just how life is for you.

That is condescending as all hell and you know it. You know exactly what my life is like but I can't possibly fathom yours. Just fark off.

Car_Ramrod:2) "The life of every white male isn't perfect, so why should people be trying to remove the built-in societal biases that statistically favor white men over other groups?"

Do whatever the fark you want. Just don't expect any help from me. I have better things to do with my time than to sit there and be called an asshole for events that I have had zero control over.

rustypouch:Disaster Transport: I'll trade you "higher rate of suicide" AND "chance of being drafted into war" for equal pay for equal work and a sammich.

/ sigh

You've got the pay thing.

http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html

Or were you thinking that a woman who works 30 hours a week should be paid the same as a man who works 50 hours a week?

I'll get started on the sammich. What flavour?

Anyone who goes on about women making pennies on the dollar is a brainwashed college student stuck with 80's and 90's statistics. The problem is now in specific industries and specific companies, and the it takes a long time for those sort of real life concepts to bubble into schools.

The more pernicious problem is that employers won't promote women above certain positions, particularly in companies where those positions all seem to be dominated by certain fraternities; this is a serious problem in the financial industry. The CEO and C-level exec world runs on the same good ol' boys club, which women are very slowly making their way into. This is where those averaged compensation numbers come from. Then there are lots of employers that automatically assume women will quit or take baby leaves soon, whether or not they ever get pregnant at all, and thus shouldn't be promoted beyond being a cog in the wheel.

As usual, it's a problem that will only get better as the Baby Boomers die off, along with their death grip on ruining the world.

If I Admit That 'Hating Men' Is a Thing, Will You Stop Turning It Into a Self-Fulfilling Prophecy?

If you "break down and admit" something, would you stop acting like it's insulting that you should even have to admit it and then somehow manage to immediately state, "well, it's all men's fault anyway" like something deeply meaningful just happened? So far, my best guess is "*tsk* whut UVER!"

So you missed the point of the article. There are some rare instances of women hating men. Just like there are cases of men hating women. But those outliers do not define the feminist movement. But if you do define the movement by a few random women being mean to you, then you'll be more angry at women, which will get them angry at you, and thus the self-fulfilling prophesy.

Most feminists don't hate men, as a group (we hate thesystem that disproportionately favors men at the expense of women), but - congratulations! - we are starting to hate you. You, the person. Your obsession with misandry has turned misandry into a self-fulfilling prophecy. (I mean, sort of. Hating individual men is not the same as hating all men. But more on that in a minute.) Are you happy now? Is this what you wanted? Feminism is, in essence, a social justice movement-it wants to take the side of the alienated and the marginalized, and that includes alienated and marginalized men. Please stop turning us against you.

KhamanV:WhippingBoy: Feminism has taught me that I should be ashamed to be a white man. I think I'm going to "accidentally" crush the ol' cobblers in some sort of industrial accident.

/I hate myself

You got the wrong lesson. You have nothing to be ashamed of; you got lucky - you're in a great place where many people are going to subconciously think better of you even if you do absolutely nothing about it. You're less likely to be passed over for jobs, you'll find it easier to get loans (nothing for free and you will have hardships! It's not a perfect system for everyone). People will look to you for ideals of how they picture Jesus and popular action heroes and what they'll put on video game covers. It's pretty cool, actually, and it's going to make a ton of shiat easier for you that you could in all likelihood never have to think about. It's totally under your radar because it's just how life is for you.

All anyone without that privilege - another color, another gender - wants is for you to take a moment when you see something go a different way for someone else when it wouldn't have for you and go "Whoa. That sorta sucks. That's unfair. I just want whoever that is to be treated like me."

Nobody wants to take the privilege of being a white dude away from you. They just want to make it a little easier being born a different way.

KhamanV: It's pretty cool, actually, and it's going to make a ton of shiat easier for you that you could in all likelihood never have to think about. It's totally under your radar because it's just how life is for you.

That is condescending as all hell and you know it. You know exactly what my life is like but I can't possibly fathom yours. Just fark off.

Car_Ramrod: 2) "The life of every white male isn't perfect, so why should people be trying to remove the built-in societal biases that statistically favor white men over other groups?"

Do whatever the fark you want. Just don't expect any help from me. I have better things to do with my time than to sit there and be called an asshole for events that I have had zero control over.

No one is attacking you, dude, or saying your life is perfect. All that's being said is that there are undeniable biases set in society that statistically favor men over women. They might not affect you specifically, and thus might not even be aware they exist, so you think it's all bullshiat. The point of feminism is to remove those general biases so the average woman has the same opportunities to succeed, or fail, as an average man. There's no reason to be all upset about it. And if you actually read about the goals of feminism, they benefit men as well. A patriarchal society does tend to put undue pressures on men, which lead to all sorts of other problems. So stop being defensive, try to understand where other people are coming from, and your life just might get better as well.

Well as long as any loose definition proffered by any woman anywhere on earth is etched in stone and, eventually, it's my fault. Feminism isn't anything anymore on any level that promotes anything resembling social justice. It started out as a very useful, long overdue and worthwhile social movement and it is now a T-Shirt, a board game, a handful of hate filled screeds full of gymnastically stated and self-promoting ideological venom, and mostly, an industry. It moves money around. And when those trying to promote global feminism pack up the manifesto and move en masse to countries where women really are treated like chattel and brood mares and dirt beneath the feet of men and start slapping the sh*t out of the people who treat them that way, I'll resubscribe. Until then all of the repetitive pissing and moaning from a tastefully decorated 3 B/R flat over a lattè and a MacBook Air is just that.

Why? Because they're highlighting a study about how men shouldn't be overlooked as victims of domestic violence? Are you saying a few bad apples ruin the entire batch? There are some shiatty women out there, that's not being disputed. So what's your point?

Feminists do not want women to escape prosecution on legitimate domestic violence charges, nor do we want men to be ridiculed for being raped or abused. The idea that women are naturally gentle and compliant and that victimhood is inherently feminine is part of patriarchy.

WhippingBoy:You're right, but you missed some of the following privileges:

A greater likelihood of ending up homeless.Much higher rate of suicide.Much greater likelihood that I'll be expected to actually fight in a war.More opportunities for intense physical jobs that will slowly destroy my body and send me to an early grave.Presumed guilty until proven innocent in domestic disputes.

In any case, eow exactly do you know what it's like to be me? Check your privilege, sister. Check your privilege.

sure haven't:Car_Ramrod: based upon what I've read thus far, I'm sure this thread is going to be filled with the usual wonderful "ha ha, I'm joking about misogyny but I'm not really joking" that makes Fark such a wonderful place.

Should we make a thread about the "dumb white man" trope that persists in every. single. advertising. medium. on earth?

Cause that one never gets old.Oh look, the stupid incompetent child-man father cut the grass with that old rusted mower, now his eternally patien highly intelligent wife needs to take him to home depot to a sale only she heard about.

THIS. Enough about misogyny. What's really important here is that the triumphs and travails of white men aren't celebrated every minute of every day.

KhamanV: It's pretty cool, actually, and it's going to make a ton of shiat easier for you that you could in all likelihood never have to think about. It's totally under your radar because it's just how life is for you.

That is condescending as all hell and you know it. You know exactly what my life is like but I can't possibly fathom yours. Just fark off.

Car_Ramrod: 2) "The life of every white male isn't perfect, so why should people be trying to remove the built-in societal biases that statistically favor white men over other groups?"

Do whatever the fark you want. Just don't expect any help from me. I have better things to do with my time than to sit there and be called an asshole for events that I have had zero control over.

No one is attacking you, dude, or saying your life is perfect. All that's being said is that there are undeniable biases set in society that statistically favor men over women. They might not affect you specifically, and thus might not even be aware they exist, so you think it's all bullshiat.

You see these words that I highlighted? Nothing of the sort was included in her post.

The point of feminism is to remove those general biases so the average woman has the same opportunities to succeed, or fail, as an average man. There's no reason to be all upset about it. And if you actually read about the goals of feminism, they benefit men as well. A patriarchal society does tend to put undue pressures on men, which lead to all sorts of other problems.

Horseshiat. Just pure horseshiat.

So stop being defensive, try to understand where other people are coming from, and your life just might get better as well.

I am a white man and as such I am incapable of understanding where other people are coming from. My life of privilege makes such a thing impossible.

Well as long as any loose definition proffered by any woman anywhere on earth is etched in stone and, eventually, it's my fault. Feminism isn't anything anymore on any level that promotes anything resembling social justice. It started out as a very useful, long overdue and worthwhile social movement and it is now a T-Shirt, a board game, a handful of hate filled screeds full of gymnastically stated and self-promoting ideological venom, and mostly, an industry. It moves money around. And when those trying to promote global feminism pack up the manifesto and move en masse to countries where women really are treated like chattel and brood mares and dirt beneath the feet of men and start slapping the sh*t out of the people who treat them that way, I'll resubscribe. Until then all of the repetitive pissing and moaning from a tastefully decorated 3 B/R flat over a lattè and a MacBook Air is just that.

So you're saying misogyny is no longer an issue in this country? That all the topics feminism discusses have been solved? Whew, what a relief! Thanks for the update! I forgot that since women aren't being treated (at least not on a widespread basis) as literal property, American feminists are wasting their time! What high standards we've set for our country! U-S-A! U-S-A!

Your little rant says a lot more about you than it does about feminism. There's no need to be so angry and spiteful.

The best part of this is that, as victimhood is stretched like a K-Mart tarp, further and further to cover everybody on earth who isn't white and a man, the only people being called upon to "fix" it is those damn oppressive white men. How? Simple. "Move the f*ck out of the way and give us all your sh*t!" That's not fixing injustice, that's a jack. The wealthy and powerful have learned centuries ago that to manage the serfs, you need to give them bread and keep them assured that they are the source of each other's misery. What better way to divide and conquer than do set up a border war between the two halves of the most basic equation on earth? Y'all can guzzle this Kool Aid until they etch the name of the Kool Aid salesman into headstone. I've seen this movie and it's a loop.

umad:You see these words that I highlighted? Nothing of the sort was included in her post.

So you think the poster was insinuating that you benefit from every single societal norm that statistically favors men, and they think your life should be perfect? That's reading a lot into it.

The point of feminism is to remove those general biases so the average woman has the same opportunities to succeed, or fail, as an average man. There's no reason to be all upset about it. And if you actually read about the goals of feminism, they benefit men as well. A patriarchal society does tend to put undue pressures on men, which lead to all sorts of other problems.

Horseshiat. Just pure horseshiat.

Which part, and why?

So stop being defensive, try to understand where other people are coming from, and your life just might get better as well.

I am a white man and as such I am incapable of understanding where other people are coming from. My life of privilege makes such a thing impossible.

STOP BEING DEFENSIVE. This is where the "man hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.

Car_Ramrod:So you're saying misogyny is no longer an issue in this country?

No. I'm saying that misogyny, misandry, dime store racist bullsh*t and every other bad idea are no longer an issue in any country, but no longer an issue anywhere on the planet. I'm saying they are commodities that have been around for f*cking ever and a great way to keep people who desperately need somebody to hate and blame who is within reach, and not in an ivory tower, well in line and fighting each other for bread. And that they work like a charm. Feminism is one more good idea that met most of it's stated goals early on and got whored out like everything else does that wants to survive, because nothing survives unless it moves money around and the goals stopped being the point a long time ago.

sure haven't:KhamanV: Which is actually an argument against patriarchy and the sort of thing actual feminists fight against - bullshiat gender roles based on bullshiat concepts perpetrated throughout bullshiat history, all there to help men not get that sort of doofus Chevy Chase stereotype bullshiat either. Crazy, I know.

Um, you can't have a word that only represents one gender, and then say it supports both genders.

You mean like "he" or "him" when referring to a generic person? Or like "man" when referring to humankind?

Years ago there was actually a medical article on breast cancer that referred to the generic patient as "he," because a small percentage of breast cancer cases are men, and some editors think that if the population being described has both genders, the generic individual should be referred to as "he" or "him."

foxyshadis:What I'm saying is, there are loud crazy people who associate themselves with all movements.

"Meanwhile, our little house was packed with women fleeing their violent partners - sometimes as many as 56 mothers and children in four rooms. All had terrible stories, but I recognised almost immediately that not all the women were innocent. Some were as violent as the men, and violent towards their children.

I was determined to try to break the chain of violence. But as the local newspaper picked up the story of our house, I grew worried about a very different threat. I knew that the radical feminist movement was running out of national support because more sensible women had shunned their anti-male, anti-family agenda. Not only were they looking for a cause, they also wanted money. In 1974, the women living in my refuge organised a meeting in our local church hall to encourage other groups to open refuges across the country. We were astonished and frightened that many of the radical lesbian and feminist activists that I had seen in the collectives attended. They began to vote themselves into a national movement across the country. After a stormy argument, I left the hall with my abused mothers - and what I had most feared happened. In a matter of months, the feminist movement hijacked the domestic violence movement, not just in Britain, but internationally. Our grant was given to them and they had a legitimate reason to hate and blame all men. They came out with sweeping statements which were as biased as they were ignorant. "All women are innocent victims of men's violence," they declared. They opened most of the refuges in the country and banned men from working in them or sitting on their governing committees.

When, in the mid-Eighties, I published Prone To Violence, about my work with violence-prone women and their children, I was picketed by hundreds of women from feminist refuges, holding placards which read: "All men are bastards" and "All men are rapists". Because of violent threats, I had to have a police escort around the country.

In 1990, Harriet Harman (who became a Cabinet minister), Anna Coote (who became an adviser to Labour's Minister for Women) and Patricia Hewitt (yes, she's in the Labour Cabinet, too!) expressed their beliefs in a social policy paper called The Family Way. It said: "It cannot be assumed that men are bound to be an asset to family life, or that the presence of fathers in families is necessarily a means to social harmony and cohesion." It was a staggering attack on men and their role in modern life. Hewitt, in a book by Geoff Dench called Transforming Men published in 1995, said: "But if we want fathers to play a full role in their children's lives, then we need to bring men into the playgroups and nurseries and the schools. And here, of course, we hit the immediate difficulty of whether we can trust men with children." In 1998, however, the Home Office published a historic study which stipulated that men as well as women could be victims of domestic violence. With that report in my hand, I tried to reason with Joan Ruddock, who was then Minister for Women. The figures for battered men were "minuscule" she insisted and she continued to refer to men only as "perpetrators". ... I look back with sadness to my young self and my vision that there could be places where people - men, women and children who have suffered physical and sexual abuse - could find help, and if they were violent could be given a second chance to learn to live peacefully. I believe that vision was hijacked by vengeful women who have ghetto-ised the refuge movement and used it to persecute men. Surely the time has come to challenge this evil ideology and insist that men take their rightful place in the refuge movement. We need an inclusive movement that offers support to everyone that needs it. As for me - I will always continue to work with anyone who needs my help or can help others - and yes, that includes men." --

Erin Pizzey, a woman I deeply respect for her work on the field of domestic violence. What she fails to mention is she eventually had to leave the country after her young grandchildren started reciving death threats. Her dog was murdered on Christmas Day.

There is a difference between "a few nut jobs" and a determined group of people who actually manage to have a negative effect on society.

I'm sorry, but as long as the more moderate feminists continue to fail to call out and remove the more radical members of their movement, especially transphobic radfems like Cathy Brennan, I will not call myself a part of it. I'm tired of NAFALT.

bunner:Car_Ramrod: So you're saying misogyny is no longer an issue in this country?

No. I'm saying that misogyny, misandry, dime store racist bullsh*t and every other bad idea are no longer an issue in any country, but no longer an issue anywhere on the planet. I'm saying they are commodities that have been around for f*cking ever and a great way to keep people who desperately need somebody to hate and blame who is within reach, and not in an ivory tower, well in line and fighting each other for bread. And that they work like a charm. Feminism is one more good idea that met most of it's stated goals early on and got whored out like everything else does that wants to survive, because nothing survives unless it moves money around and the goals stopped being the point a long time ago.

I'm curious as to what you think were the stated goals of feminism that were met early on. And when they were met.

Car_Ramrod:umad: You see these words that I highlighted? Nothing of the sort was included in her post.

So you think the poster was insinuating that you benefit from every single societal norm that statistically favors men, and they think your life should be perfect? That's reading a lot into it.

God you're an idiot. The poster was insinuating that we are incapable of even recognizing a single societal norm that statistically favors men simply because we are men. It is only reading what she wrote into it. Why are you white knighting for her anyway? Don't you think she is a big girl and can defend herself?

The point of feminism is to remove those general biases so the average woman has the same opportunities to succeed, or fail, as an average man. There's no reason to be all upset about it. And if you actually read about the goals of feminism, they benefit men as well. A patriarchal society does tend to put undue pressures on men, which lead to all sorts of other problems.

Horseshiat. Just pure horseshiat.

Which part, and why?

All of it. It is obviously horseshiat because they don't say a word about things that benefit women over men. You know, the things that have been mentioned by other men in this thread like suicide rates, on the job fatalities, longer prison sentences for the same crimes, the travesty that is our family court system etc. If you really care about benefitting men as well then you would be just as vocal about those issues as you are about the old standbyes.

STOP BEING DEFENSIVE. This is where the "man hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.

This is also where the "woman hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. We are just returning the favor.

rustypouch:So holding women accountable for their actions, especially when they don't jive with their stated beliefs, is a bad thing?

Do you even own a calendar? That is utterly unforgivable, sexist, hateful and shows you as a shibboleth and a fascist! You have to admit, though, that feminism - or what's being sold under that label lately - DOES have one amazing app. "If you do not completely agree with every single statement I make and any assertions I have plainly stated to be nothing more than undeniable truth, it only serves to reveal YOU as a hate mongering, oppressive, reprehensible sonofab*tch who puts puppies on spikes and sells 9 year old girls for crack money, and you are probably scared some strong, enlightened woman will cut your peepee off!" If nothing else, you have to admit that the ostensible moral high ground is a tidy back forty. It's beauty of talking point ideology.

What a shocking display of cis privilege. Those are women on the billboard. So people get offended just because they don't live up to patriarchically-imposed norms on what a woman should look and dress like? Talk about gender-policing...

umad:Car_Ramrod: umad: You see these words that I highlighted? Nothing of the sort was included in her post.

So you think the poster was insinuating that you benefit from every single societal norm that statistically favors men, and they think your life should be perfect? That's reading a lot into it.

God you're an idiot. The poster was insinuating that we are incapable of even recognizing a single societal norm that statistically favors men simply because we are men. It is only reading what she wrote into it. Why are you white knighting for her anyway? Don't you think she is a big girl and can defend herself?

If I agree with another poster that is a woman, I'm whiteknighting her. Cool beans.

The point of feminism is to remove those general biases so the average woman has the same opportunities to succeed, or fail, as an average man. There's no reason to be all upset about it. And if you actually read about the goals of feminism, they benefit men as well. A patriarchal society does tend to put undue pressures on men, which lead to all sorts of other problems.

Horseshiat. Just pure horseshiat.

Which part, and why?

All of it. It is obviously horseshiat because they don't say a word about things that benefit women over men. You know, the things that have been mentioned by other men in this thread like suicide rates, on the job fatalities, longer prison sentences for the same crimes, the travesty that is our family court system etc. If you really care about benefitting men as well then you would be just as vocal about those issues as you are about the old standbyes.

If you can stand it, read part four of this article that I've posted and quoted multiple times in this thread. Some examples:

Feminists do not want you to lose custody of your children. The assumption that women are naturally better caregivers is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want you to have to make alimony payments. Alimony is set up to combat the fact that women have been historically expected to prioritize domestic duties over professional goals, thus minimizing their earning potential if their "traditional" marriages end. The assumption that wives should make babies instead of money is part of patriarchy.

Feminists do not want you to commit suicide. Any pressures and expectations that lower the quality of life of any gender are part of patriarchy. The fact that depression is characterized as an effeminate weakness, making men less likely to seek treatment, is part of patriarchy.

and finally:

STOP BEING DEFENSIVE. This is where the "man hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.

This is also where the "woman hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. We are just returning the favor.

KhamanV: It's pretty cool, actually, and it's going to make a ton of shiat easier for you that you could in all likelihood never have to think about. It's totally under your radar because it's just how life is for you.

That is condescending as all hell and you know it. You know exactly what my life is like but I can't possibly fathom yours. Just fark off.

Car_Ramrod: 2) "The life of every white male isn't perfect, so why should people be trying to remove the built-in societal biases that statistically favor white men over other groups?"

Do whatever the fark you want. Just don't expect any help from me. I have better things to do with my time than to sit there and be called an asshole for events that I have had zero control over.

Amen, sibling, Amen.

I am 50 years-old. I appear to be white. I am male.

Things I have not done in my life:

Been part of the 'Good old boys network".Kept the brothers down.Kept the women in their place.Discriminated against anyone based on; Skin color, sex, age, gender, physical abilities, or religious affiliation.

But, even after spending a youth campaigning for equal rights, I run up against the bias against those of us who appear to be white males. To every hate group out there, I am just another oppressor.

I know, some how, by discriminating against men born after 1950, it levels the playing field. In some way, maybe, perhaps.

/yes, I still hold open doors for others//just because special rightist's///harbor enough hate for all of us

What I'm curious about, you smirking, self-assured kool aid fans, is at what point in history are you sure that there were no women with any money, social leverage, businesses they owned, control over their own bodies to the degree that prudence and medicine allowed, or generally were chained up to a stove against their will as a normative social construct. After WWI, Kimberly Clark started selling huge, absorptive bandages that were invented to staunch heavy bleeding in field medical units. Those became feminine sanitary napkins. It's not that we don't all benefit somewhat from the architecture of war, it's just that this endless loop of "nuh UH!" "yuh HUH!" war benefits nobody. And it's gotten monotonous. Equal access to positions in business have always gone to the people who started the business, their genitals notwithstanding. Abortions? Yeah, we got those. Free, if you need that. Wanna be a man? Not comfortable in your body? Lie down here and peruse this plethora or prosthetics and procedures. Demand to be supported by society should you decide to reproduce without some pesky man around or some archaic notion of family or marriage? Fill this out. Fine. Nifty. But "nuh UH!" has a beard to it's balls and the only people getting anything out of it are T-shirt manufacturers. Blessed are the T makers.

foxyshadis:rustypouch: Disaster Transport: I'll trade you "higher rate of suicide" AND "chance of being drafted into war" for equal pay for equal work and a sammich.

/ sigh

You've got the pay thing.

http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html

Or were you thinking that a woman who works 30 hours a week should be paid the same as a man who works 50 hours a week?

I'll get started on the sammich. What flavour?

Anyone who goes on about women making pennies on the dollar is a brainwashed college student stuck with 80's and 90's statistics. The problem is now in specific industries and specific companies, and the it takes a long time for those sort of real life concepts to bubble into schools.

The more pernicious problem is that employers won't promote women above certain positions, particularly in companies where those positions all seem to be dominated by certain fraternities; this is a serious problem in the financial industry. The CEO and C-level exec world runs on the same good ol' boys club, which women are very slowly making their way into. This is where those averaged compensation numbers come from. Then there are lots of employers that automatically assume women will quit or take baby leaves soon, whether or not they ever get pregnant at all, and thus shouldn't be promoted beyond being a cog in the wheel.

As usual, it's a problem that will only get better as the Baby Boomers die off, along with their death grip on ruining the world.

Well as long as any loose definition proffered by any woman anywhere on earth is etched in stone and, eventually, it's my fault. Feminism isn't anything anymore on any level that promotes anything resembling social justice. It started out as a very useful, long overdue and worthwhile social movement and it is now a T-Shirt, a board game, a handful of hate filled screeds full of gymnastically stated and self-promoting ideological venom, and mostly, an industry. It moves money around. And when those trying to promote global feminism pack up the manifesto and move en masse to countries where women really are treated like chattel and brood mares and dirt beneath the feet of men and start slapping the sh*t out of the people who treat them that way, I'll resubscribe. Until then all of the repetitive pissing and moaning from a tastefully decorated 3 B/R flat over a lattè and a MacBook Air is just that.

So you're saying misogyny is no longer an issue in this country? That all the topics feminism discusses have been solved? Whew, what a relief! Thanks for the update! I forgot that since women aren't being treated (at least not on a widespread basis) as literal property, American feminists are wasting their time! What high standards we've set for our country! U-S-A! U-S-A!

Your little rant says a lot more about you than it does about feminism. There's no need to be so angry and spiteful.

Says the misandrist.

Keep hating men, it never gets old, and it never turns off the audience.

Slam1263:Things I have not done in my life:Been part of the 'Good old boys network".Kept the brothers down.Kept the women in their place.Discriminated against anyone based on; Skin color, sex, age, gender, physical abilities, or religious affiliation.

You think that, but you have benefited endlessly from the Caucasian patriarchy in every aspect of your existence and that construct exists purely to oppress the groups you mentioned, and so, your personal life and every aspect of it and your conscionable behavior are moot, meaningless, a lie and an affront to the oppressed. No, seriously. Somebody on a campus somewhere is saying this with a straight face as we speak. It's called "rectitude by implied moral piety and moral high ground kidnapping." The only way to overcome it is to realize that your watching people who are ramping up to die over who has to pick up a pair of dirty socks off the floor. After that, the world gets a lot less urgent. It still smells like the ass end of a goat, but it's less puzzling.

bunner:What I'm curious about, you smirking, self-assured kool aid fans, is at what point in history are you sure that there were no women with any money, social leverage, businesses they owned, control over their own bodies to the degree that prudence and medicine allowed, or generally were chained up to a stove against their will as a normative social construct. After WWI, Kimberly Clark started selling huge, absorptive bandages that were invented to staunch heavy bleeding in field medical units. Those became feminine sanitary napkins. It's not that we don't all benefit somewhat from the architecture of war, it's just that this endless loop of "nuh UH!" "yuh HUH!" war benefits nobody. And it's gotten monotonous. Equal access to positions in business have always gone to the people who started the business, their genitals notwithstanding. Abortions? Yeah, we got those. Free, if you need that. Wanna be a man? Not comfortable in your body? Lie down here and peruse this plethora or prosthetics and procedures. Demand to be supported by society should you decide to reproduce without some pesky man around or some archaic notion of family or marriage? Fill this out. Fine. Nifty. But "nuh UH!" has a beard to it's balls and the only people getting anything out of it are T-shirt manufacturers. Blessed are the T makers.

Serious question here, because I care about you: are you having a stroke?

Car_Ramrod:umad: Car_Ramrod: umad: You see these words that I highlighted? Nothing of the sort was included in her post.

So you think the poster was insinuating that you benefit from every single societal norm that statistically favors men, and they think your life should be perfect? That's reading a lot into it.

God you're an idiot. The poster was insinuating that we are incapable of even recognizing a single societal norm that statistically favors men simply because we are men. It is only reading what she wrote into it. Why are you white knighting for her anyway? Don't you think she is a big girl and can defend herself?

If I agree with another poster that is a woman, I'm whiteknighting her. Cool beans.

The point of feminism is to remove those general biases so the average woman has the same opportunities to succeed, or fail, as an average man. There's no reason to be all upset about it. And if you actually read about the goals of feminism, they benefit men as well. A patriarchal society does tend to put undue pressures on men, which lead to all sorts of other problems.

Horseshiat. Just pure horseshiat.

Which part, and why?

All of it. It is obviously horseshiat because they don't say a word about things that benefit women over men. You know, the things that have been mentioned by other men in this thread like suicide rates, on the job fatalities, longer prison sentences for the same crimes, the travesty that is our family court system etc. If you really care about benefitting men as well then you would be just as vocal about those issues as you are about the old standbyes.

and finally:

STOP BEING DEFENSIVE. This is where the "man hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.

This is also where the "woman hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. We are just returning the favor.

Slam1263:Car_Ramrod: umad: Car_Ramrod: umad: You see these words that I highlighted? Nothing of the sort was included in her post.

So you think the poster was insinuating that you benefit from every single societal norm that statistically favors men, and they think your life should be perfect? That's reading a lot into it.

God you're an idiot. The poster was insinuating that we are incapable of even recognizing a single societal norm that statistically favors men simply because we are men. It is only reading what she wrote into it. Why are you white knighting for her anyway? Don't you think she is a big girl and can defend herself?

If I agree with another poster that is a woman, I'm whiteknighting her. Cool beans.

The point of feminism is to remove those general biases so the average woman has the same opportunities to succeed, or fail, as an average man. There's no reason to be all upset about it. And if you actually read about the goals of feminism, they benefit men as well. A patriarchal society does tend to put undue pressures on men, which lead to all sorts of other problems.

Horseshiat. Just pure horseshiat.

Which part, and why?

All of it. It is obviously horseshiat because they don't say a word about things that benefit women over men. You know, the things that have been mentioned by other men in this thread like suicide rates, on the job fatalities, longer prison sentences for the same crimes, the travesty that is our family court system etc. If you really care about benefitting men as well then you would be just as vocal about those issues as you are about the old standbyes.

and finally:

STOP BEING DEFENSIVE. This is where the "man hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.

This is also where the "woman hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. We are just returning the favor.

This is just childish.

Says the person whom cannot fathom a diversive point of view.

Have you tried plugging your ears, and shouting lalalalala?

Did.. did you just say that after cutting out the part of my response that rebutted his statement that feminists don't care about issues where women have a benefit over men? Were you trying to be that hypocritical, or was it an accident?

bunner:Slam1263: Things I have not done in my life:Been part of the 'Good old boys network".Kept the brothers down.Kept the women in their place.Discriminated against anyone based on; Skin color, sex, age, gender, physical abilities, or religious affiliation.

You think that, but you have benefited endlessly from the Caucasian patriarchy in every aspect of your existence and that construct exists purely to oppress the groups you mentioned, and so, your personal life and every aspect of it and your conscionable behavior are moot, meaningless, a lie and an affront to the oppressed. No, seriously. Somebody on a campus somewhere is saying this with a straight face as we speak. It's called "rectitude by implied moral piety and moral high ground kidnapping." The only way to overcome it is to realize that your watching people who are ramping up to die over who has to pick up a pair of dirty socks off the floor. After that, the world gets a lot less urgent. It still smells like the ass end of a goat, but it's less puzzling.

Oh, don't I know it.

I ran afoul of my WS's teacher back in 1994. She didn't like me to correct her about anything, especially in writing, as I didn't think it was proper to do so in class.

Keep hating men, it never gets old, and it never turns off the audience.

What have I said that insinuates I'm a self-hating misandrist?

Case in point: STOP BEING DEFENSIVE. This is where the "man hating" thing becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.

Simply pointing out the fallacies in your argument, is taking as hate.

I for one, love women. If it wasn't for one, I would not be here. Nor would I have the passion for equality that I do. Mom was a radical back when they actually tried to better humanity, rather than just a slogan.