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MOTUC would still be going strongly if they never made She Ra, Adora, Bow, Netosser, Frosta, the Star Sisters and the flying horse. Doubt it would be true in reverse.

Let's be real for a few moments: Despite the successful debut of King Grayskull at San Diego Comic Con, Classics was in a pretty fragile state for the first couple months, seeing as there were many people around the web who were not at all happy with the new style (They were still hung up on 200X), so it needed every sale it could get, including those from POP and NA fans. If you will recall from Toyguru's blogs, Beast Man, He-Man and Skeletor were not at all runaway successes. They sold a modest amount.

But no one who says those things stops to think that the Vintage line only had 68 figures. MOTUC would have died a while ago if it was a Vintage only rehash. I for one would have bought my handful of figures and walked away, because I for one never owned every Vintage figure, nor did I ever care to, and still don't. MOTUC as it is, I have way more figures than I ever owned from the Vintage line alone. I have 54 figures, otherwise it would likely only have been 26 total, then done with the line.

The only reason I am still here collecting is I like a little of everything, and I like something I never would have had otherwise, like POP.

That's awesome to hear, shadowfall! I think it's really cool that MOTUC has helped fans take interest in other parts of MOTU like that. I really hope the line survives at least a few more years. My greatest hope is that when the MOTU movie gets released, more people will get interested in MOTU again and we'll get even more subscribers to help things along.

Take part in Illumina Day! Let people know who she is and help get her in MOTUC.

MOTUC would still be going strongly if they never made She Ra, Adora, Bow, Netosser, Frosta, the Star Sisters and the flying horse. Doubt it would be true in reverse.

I don't think any POP fan is disputing the massive popularity of vintage MOTU, but at this point in the line vintage MOTU is spent....You guys got a super powerful shot in the arm last year with Sorceress, Fisto, Kahn, Spikor, Rattlor, Mekanack and the reveal of Ram Man. The figures who are going to pull people into the line from this point onwards are Mantenna, Scorpia, Modulock, Horde Trooper, Imp, Multi-Bot, Entrapta, Toung Lasher, Squeeze, Veena, Oricle, Eldor, Pravhus, Illumina, Shokoti, Kitterina, Flogg, Sebrian, Mara, Critta, Sagatar, Hydron, Quake, Staghorne and the wanted POP figures like Mermista, Peekablue, Huntara and maybe Double Trouble. However, out of all of these remaining figures the biggest guns Mattel have left up their sleeve are POP characters. Glimmer, Angella, Castaspella, Madame Razz & Broom, Loo-Kie, Kowl, Sea Hawk, Light Hope.

There are many other wanted Filmation characters....many of which come from POP like Hunga the Harpy, Melog & General Sunder. Argue it untill the cows come home if you wish, but the above mentioned names are big gun characters that are SEMINAL to the overall Master of the Universe story. They easily eclipse Extandar, Rio Blast or whoever else can be draw/ scraped from the bottom of the barrel that was the end of the vintage MOTU line. Certian fans may not like this, fine, but these are still the power players from what is left. I think purely vintage focused fans sense this is the way things will be going from here on out and thats why certian fans feel the need to make the kind of posts that make fans of other factions feel attacked. Untill now it's mostly all been about the vintage fans and what they like.

I just can't understand this spirit of hate that comes from certian vintage fans when POP, NA, MYP or Filmation fans ask for their share. We have spent the last five years watching you gourge your self at Mattel's table, while we lined up beside you and put our money down at the same time, knowing we would not get anywhere near as much attention as you would get. But still these fans complain and moan every time POP gets attention with a sense of entitlement and argue that the POP slots are wasted figure slots. This attutude comes over akin to a bunch of selfish, misogynistic children, who don't want to share and only care about what they personally want and everyone else can just be forgotten.

Mattel and TG have plecated this kind of fan for far to long IMO. Many fans like this mostly cherry pick by their own admision because they don't want non vintage MOTU toyline characters, yet I would argue that the majority of fans of POP, NA, Filmation and MYP support everything knowing thats how we can actually support the brand and give everyone a fair crack at getting some of the stuff we all want. Some of the posters in this thread cannot see how anyone else can see value in anything but the vintage MOTU toyline characters. I guess the same five year old logic / school yard politics still applies when one is a fully paid up member of a group that will not accept or support their fellow fans to get some off the figures they want! TG has given you and your wants far to much attention, to the point of almost killing the line last year do to the unbalanced nature of the character selection in the line among other issues: but yet again fans of the entire franchise come in, sub up and save it allowing other fans to continue taking the cream of what they want while still begrudging others their long wished for characters that have just as much right to be made!!!!!

If the purely vintage fans were enough to keep the line going then why did TG put the call out to everyone, because without EVERYONE standing together the line IS NOT FINANCIALLY VIABLE and does not work! We are all needed, but while thre fans who are arguing against POP are happy to enjoy their slice of the pie they begrudge other's their slice, the usual and typical selfish behaviour that I and many other POP, NA, Filmation & MYP fans have come to expect from this seemingly self entitled subsection of the vintage MOTU fan community. Vintage fans should remember that they would not have had the lovely selection of vintage characters we have all been spoilt with without POP, NA, MYP & Filmation fans all standing togeher with them to get the line off the ground and keep it running, but that penny never seems to drop does it! Vintage MOTU maybe the largest section of the fandom, but even that alone was not big enough to make it viable for Mattel, so many of the points being made are mute as far as I am concerned. Reading the POP hating comments by certian fans....well quite honestly I find it a disgrace, such selfish and poor sporting attitudes represent nothing of the qualities of fair play that He-Man and She-Ra were all about.

The positive news for this kind of fan is that the line is almost done for them (The rest of us potentially have years of MOTUC left to enjoy!) From this point on (as a fan of everything Masters of the Universe) I'm really looking foward to a truly balanced line with lots of Horde, vintage MOTU, Classic POP, MYP, Filmation and NA. Masters of the Universe is the sum of all it's individual elements. The vintage toyline (while very important) is not the be all and end all of this franchise... I wish all fans could open their eyes, get over the fact that 14 of the female characters from Masters of the Universe once had rooted hair and some fabric clothes and see the embarrassement of riches that exists within this universe!!!!!!!!

Last edited by Angel-T; January 25, 2013 at 03:40pm.

PRO CLASSIC POP TOY DESIGN ELEMENTS BEING USED IN MOTUC TO COMPLEMENT THE FILMATION DESIGNS!!!!

I FULLY SUPPORT THE INCLUSION OF ILLUMINA IN MOTUC!!!!!

IF YOUR SICK OF WAITING FOR A LIGHT TO APPEAR AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL, STRIDE DOWN THERE AND LIGHT THE BLOODY THING YOURSELF!!!!!!!

I'm glad the line is all encompassing. Wouldn't want it any other way. I have every figure, and hope the line continues for many years, and everyone from Dragstor to the yellow tug of war guy gets made. So you can break out your little pom-poms and have a big ol' pop ra-ra rally all you want, but the bottom line is it's called MOTUC and not POPC for a very good reason. What are we, 5 years in, and there's been what, 6, 7 POP figs total? And that's with a 3 pack! So quit trying to pass it off as POP is the reason the line continues or that it would be dead without it. It's just a small slice of the overall pie. A tasty slice even. Definitely cherry...but I digress....I'm just calling out the bs claims of some of the pop fans, not your personal tastes or favorites.

If this line ends without Ninjor, Extendar, Rio Blast or the Rock People I will be very disappointed. Luckily I think they will all get releases. I don't know for certain but I think we will be seeing them some day. I easily expect to see Mantenna and Modulock and Multibot at some point as well as the remaining Snakemen before the line ends as well.

The positive news for this kind of fan is that the line is almost done for them (The rest of us potentially have years of MOTUC left to enjoy!) From this point on (as a fan of everything Masters of the Universe) I'm really looking foward to a truly balanced line with lots of Horde, vintage MOTU, Classic POP, MYP, Filmation and NA. Masters of the Universe is the sum of all it's individual elements.

When the line ends, everyone is going to realize (if they haven't already) that we have been headed for this particular iceberg the whole time with this even-more-lopsided-than-it-should-have-been character distribution across the factions. We should have had that well balanced line that you described since the beginning.

If this line ends without Ninjor, Extendar, Rio Blast or the Rock People I will be very disappointed. Luckily I think they will all get releases. I don't know for certain but I think we will be seeing them some day. I easily expect to see Mantenna and Modulock and Multibot at some point as well as the remaining Snakemen before the line ends as well.

I can't wait to see what's coming soon!

i agree ninjor, extendar, rio blast and i will add dragstor to that are the top 4 most wanted figures for me if i count the already announced figures like snake face that are coming out. i will be so sad if they dont make the line up

i agree ninjor, extendar, rio blast and i will add dragstor to that are the top 4 most wanted figures for me if i count the already announced figures like snake face that are coming out. i will be so sad if they dont make the line up

When the line ends, everyone is going to realize (if they haven't already) that we have been headed for this particular iceberg the whole time with this even-more-lopsided-than-it-should-have-been character distribution across the factions. We should have had that well balanced line that you described since the beginning.

see this is the sentiment i dont understand. if you claim everyone wants POP characters than why would the line fail if they made them at the end of the line. wouldnt the line just keep on going? face it people want vintage characters. i get you want a balanced line but why should we suffer through those figures just because you want balance. if people want more vintage i say we should get it. again im using your own statment that POP characters arent strong enough to carry their own line because you said it yourself, the line will be canned. every toy company should make the most requested figures which for the most part is purely vintage. if POP demand is so great than dont worry about it because the line will just continue

We haven't seen any PoP stuff since the 80s besides the DVDs. Therefore, I have even more nostalgia power for PoP than I do MOTU (sans figures we havent seen since the 80s). Filmation is the link. Filmation is what put MOTU on the worldwide map. Filmation is the reason I love PoP as much as I do MOTU. It's the reason I set foot into the pink Barbie aisle at Toys R Us to retrieve a She-Ra, Bow, and Entrapta back in the day as a young boy who was fearful of the cooties you could catch in the pink Barbie aisle.

When I see a PoP, Horde, or Filmation PoP/Horde figure revealed in MOTUC, they become instantly one of my favorites. I love these characters. You could throw a Horde symbol on anything and I'd love it. (I want a Calix figure for **** sakes and he's a rock with a Horde symbol on him). Octavia is the perfect blend of PoP/Horde/Filmation and for that, she is instantly one of my favorite that I'm reallllllly looking forward to! I love the episodes she was in. I had one of those episodes (Treasure of the First Ones) taped on VHS that I watched countless times throughout my life (at least til I didnt have a VCR anymore and the DVDs were out). Bow is one of the best figures in the line. Perfect mix of Filmation, some vintage toy references, and added detail by the Four Horsemen. And don't even get me started on how I marked out over that Filmation colors Swift Wind reveal followed by the that Filmation sound effect and Toyguru's confirmation that the rights are obtained. That was the peak of the line imo. That brought a tear to my eye and chills up my spine. I want the line to go on as long as it can and I want as much Filmation as possible. ESPECIALLY PoP because that was ALWAYS the tricky part of the rights AND it has waaay more cooler characters and such that NEVER got figures back in the day. We got a ****ing Shadow Weaver!!!1!

Aint NO reason to be hating on PoP in MOTUC. PoP is a huge draw imo. It's He-Man AND She-Ra. That's how the masses remember it...and you can thank Filmation for that which was in EVERYONE's home EVERY DAY regardless if you had cable or not yet.

We haven't seen any PoP stuff since the 80s besides the DVDs. Therefore, I have even more nostalgia power for PoP than I do MOTU (sans figures we havent seen since the 80s). Filmation is the link. Filmation is what put MOTU on the worldwide map. Filmation is the reason I love PoP as much as I do MOTU. It's the reason I set foot into the pink Barbie aisle at Toys R Us to retrieve a She-Ra, Bow, and Entrapta back in the day as a young boy who was fearful of the cooties you could catch in the pink Barbie aisle.

When I see a PoP, Horde, or Filmation PoP/Horde figure revealed in MOTUC, they become instantly one of my favorites. I love these characters. You could throw a Horde symbol on anything and I'd love it. (I want a Calix figure for **** sakes and he's a rock with a Horde symbol on him). Octavia is the perfect blend of PoP/Horde/Filmation and for that, she is instantly one of my favorite that I'm reallllllly looking forward to! I love the episodes she was in. I had one of those episodes (Treasure of the First Ones) taped on VHS that I watched countless times throughout my life (at least til I didnt have a VCR anymore and the DVDs were out). Bow is one of the best figures in the line. Perfect mix of Filmation, some vintage toy references, and added detail by the Four Horsemen. And don't even get me started on how I marked out over that Filmation colors Swift Wind reveal followed by the that Filmation sound effect and Toyguru's confirmation that the rights are obtained. That was the peak of the line imo. That brought a tear to my eye and chills up my spine. I want the line to go on as long as it can and I want as much Filmation as possible. ESPECIALLY PoP because that was ALWAYS the tricky part of the rights AND it has waaay more cooler characters and such that NEVER got figures back in the day. We got a ****ing Shadow Weaver!!!1!

Aint NO reason to be hating on PoP in MOTUC. PoP is a huge draw imo. It's He-Man AND She-Ra. That's how the masses remember it...and you can thank Filmation for that which was in EVERYONE's home EVERY DAY regardless if you had cable or not yet.

#BlindedByNostalgia™

Wow, I never thought about it until just now, those aisles were really pink, still are....bright pink, you can tell the girl aisle from outside the stores.

We haven't seen any PoP stuff since the 80s besides the DVDs. Therefore, I have even more nostalgia power for PoP than I do MOTU (sans figures we havent seen since the 80s). Filmation is the link. Filmation is what put MOTU on the worldwide map. Filmation is the reason I love PoP as much as I do MOTU. It's the reason I set foot into the pink Barbie aisle at Toys R Us to retrieve a She-Ra, Bow, and Entrapta back in the day as a young boy who was fearful of the cooties you could catch in the pink Barbie aisle.

When I see a PoP, Horde, or Filmation PoP/Horde figure revealed in MOTUC, they become instantly one of my favorites. I love these characters. You could throw a Horde symbol on anything and I'd love it. (I want a Calix figure for **** sakes and he's a rock with a Horde symbol on him). Octavia is the perfect blend of PoP/Horde/Filmation and for that, she is instantly one of my favorite that I'm reallllllly looking forward to! I love the episodes she was in. I had one of those episodes (Treasure of the First Ones) taped on VHS that I watched countless times throughout my life (at least til I didnt have a VCR anymore and the DVDs were out). Bow is one of the best figures in the line. Perfect mix of Filmation, some vintage toy references, and added detail by the Four Horsemen. And don't even get me started on how I marked out over that Filmation colors Swift Wind reveal followed by the that Filmation sound effect and Toyguru's confirmation that the rights are obtained. That was the peak of the line imo. That brought a tear to my eye and chills up my spine. I want the line to go on as long as it can and I want as much Filmation as possible. ESPECIALLY PoP because that was ALWAYS the tricky part of the rights AND it has waaay more cooler characters and such that NEVER got figures back in the day. We got a ****ing Shadow Weaver!!!1!

Aint NO reason to be hating on PoP in MOTUC. PoP is a huge draw imo. It's He-Man AND She-Ra. That's how the masses remember it...and you can thank Filmation for that which was in EVERYONE's home EVERY DAY regardless if you had cable or not yet.

#BlindedByNostalgia™

Post of the year. Thank you, Marzo.

Aaron
PoP Variants are part of the vintage line, too! Starburst She-Ra, Shower Power Catra, and Scratchin' Sound Catra for 2015!!!

see this is the sentiment i dont understand. if you claim everyone wants POP characters than why would the line fail if they made them at the end of the line. wouldnt the line just keep on going? face it people want vintage characters. i get you want a balanced line but why should we suffer through those figures just because you want balance. if people want more vintage i say we should get it. again im using your own statment that POP characters arent strong enough to carry their own line because you said it yourself, the line will be canned. every toy company should make the most requested figures which for the most part is purely vintage. if POP demand is so great than dont worry about it because the line will just continue

This is what I don't understand (in addition to the continual jabs by others that I referred to in my last post): What is so hard to understand about the fact that the balance of MOTU and POP (and NA, 200X, minicomics, etc.) is what's keeping this line afloat? If it was purely the vintage MOTU figures, do you have any idea how many collectors Matty would lose? Enough to where the line would no longer continue--hell, as it is, it's all they've been able to do to keep it going for the last few years. Like it or not, the ongoing vitality of this line depends on us just as much as you, so suck it up, buttercup.

The fear is that you very rarely see a PoP fan saying that they hate vintage MOTU characters and have no interest in them. I think most PoP fans prefer PoP as their favorites, but not as the only thing of interest in the line. PoP fans have been supporting the line, often through subscriptions, without getting many of the figures that is in their favorite set.

Does everyone want PoP? Of course not, but not everyone wants every figure. I'm sure if you look hard enough you can find a MOTUC collector who thinks He-man is stupid and doesn't own him. Pop fans make up a significant chunk of the MOTUC customer base though, and that can't be dismissed. Can MOTUC continue if they are just producing only PoP characters? That I don't know, but could MOTUC have gotten as far as it has now without PoP fans in the first place?

VBulletin Total Ignore provides improved ignore functionality and removes quoted messages and any post made by an ignored user in a thread.

This is what I don't understand (in addition to the continual jabs by others that I referred to in my last post): What is so hard to understand about the fact that the balance of MOTU and POP (and NA, 200X, minicomics, etc.) is what's keeping this line afloat? If it was purely the vintage MOTU figures, do you have any idea how many collectors Matty would lose? Enough to where the line would no longer continue--hell, as it is, it's all they've been able to do to keep it going for the last few years. Like it or not, the ongoing vitality of this line depends on us just as much as you, so suck it up, buttercup.

well to me this year was the worst sub #'s by far. thats a fact. and it also seems we have the least vintage figures. i dont see that as a coincidence. and how many people did you see say they were canceling after ram man and jitsu? i know its a heck of alot. we get netossa, fang man, FFM and who know how many other non vintage figures to come that alot of people are exactly busting the door down to get. again, i dont think we should have to buy your figures just for balance. i honestly dont think we need POP support to have the line survive. maybe more vintage and there would have been more subscribers to begin with. did you ever even think of that as a scenario. thats no more far fetched than you saying POP is needed to support the line. its all opinion but i think yours isnt as strongly supported

well to me this year was the worst sub #'s by far. thats a fact. and it also seems we have the least vintage figures. i dont see that as a coincidence. and how many people did you see say they were canceling after ram man and jitsu? i know its a heck of alot. we get netossa, fang man, FFM and who know how many other non vintage figures to come that alot of people are exactly busting the door down to get. again, i dont think we should have to buy your figures just for balance. i honestly dont think we need POP support to have the line survive. maybe more vintage and there would have been more subscribers to begin with. did you ever even think of that as a scenario. thats no more far fetched than you saying POP is needed to support the line. its all opinion but i think yours isnt as strongly supported

So by your own admission, this line would not have gone through this year, since most MOTU fans want to quit after Ram Man and Jitsu, so doesnt that make the fans of the rest of the lot substantial this year.

well to me this year was the worst sub #'s by far. thats a fact. and it also seems we have the least vintage figures. i dont see that as a coincidence. and how many people did you see say they were canceling after ram man and jitsu? i know its a heck of alot. we get netossa, fang man, FFM and who know how many other non vintage figures to come that alot of people are exactly busting the door down to get. again, i dont think we should have to buy your figures just for balance. i honestly dont think we need POP support to have the line survive. maybe more vintage and there would have been more subscribers to begin with. did you ever even think of that as a scenario. thats no more far fetched than you saying POP is needed to support the line. its all opinion but i think yours isnt as strongly supported

The only thing I get out of your argument is that for some reason you think that you (the collective vintage-only you, not you personally) are being forced to buy "our" (meaning those of us who want a variety beyond vintage MOTU) figures. Sunshine, you are free to walk away at anytime. Or just not subscribe and selectively purchase to your hearts content.

...unless, for some reason, you think every subscription counts, and that to do so would mean the end of the line. And if that's the case, then you've found the flaw in your own argument, for you need us just as badly as we need you.

Aaron
PoP Variants are part of the vintage line, too! Starburst She-Ra, Shower Power Catra, and Scratchin' Sound Catra for 2015!!!

It would be crazy strange for them to not make Ninjor. He's like making Faker. Just paint somebody black. I guess the new head and tunic might send it over the edge. Oh, and he came with THREE accessories. Yeah, come to think of it, he might actually break the bank at the moment, or at least require two separate weapons packs to complete him.

I wonder if they are saving the main PoP figures for last. Maybe they're so easy to make that they're like the lifeline. They could pop off most of the major GR ladies on the tiniest of budgets.

And again, I'm totally not bashing PoP. Just because I don't care for them, doesn't mean I wish for their exclusion. I'm sure there are people who buy MotUC for only PoP. But, yeah, PoP has by no means kept the line going. like... at all. I think She-Ra was the strongest inclusion. And Adora got more hype than Matty expected for sure. But they could fill the line with prototypes, mini comic variants, son of He-Man, just tons of stuff to make more money while still being considered just an extension of "vintage". He-Ro is vintage. Castle Greyskullman could be considered vintage. The way we categorize stuff isn't the point. It's how it relates to what we like about the line and how many people respond to it. Photog was vintage and might be widely hated. I like him of course. The castle guards, snake two pack, Procrustus, Granamyr, Green Goddess, obviously the Horde in case you actually don't count that... all that stuff relates nicely to the expansion of vintage legacy. So it's by no means without legs, and could easily sustain on it's own just fine.

Some PoP expansions I can think of are Star Sisters (ouch), Adora (cool) Octavia (yay), and Shadow Weaver (YAAYYY!!!!). If the Star Sisters weren't so expensive in the fact you had to get three of them, I'd be totally happy with the PoP expansions. Unfortunately the body count is split down the middle though. Really my only problems are Star Sisters (crap), Frosta (meh), Bow (sheesh), and Netossa (meh again). So PoP's not doing too bad, and the Swiftwind/She-Ra combo makes for a great display piece. If they busted out Kowl, Scorpia, Double Trouble, and maybe Angela, I'd actually turn to praising PoP. But, we just haven't gotten that far yet, so maybe the future is still great for PoP fans.

For NA, Flip-Shot is clunker numero tres, right after time traveling Scotts and that blue knight thing. Soon NA He-Man will join them. But we got Optikk (yay) and Slushhead (not bad) to balance them out. Same for 200X. KG (yay, but x2, hmm) and Keldor (cool) help absorb Faceless One (poo), and Dekker and Chief are right down the middle with me. So they're both ahead of the game. Anything from here on out will just be downhill though I'm afraid. So again, PoP looking more promising.

I like pretty much everything vintage related of course, with the exception of He-Man in Preternia disguise. Yikes that was lame. Maybe a few others. The vehicle guys aren't blowing me away. The Anniversary figures were right down the middle, and you know how I judge that out, but they're done.

Sorry if that was a lot to read. I do that. But, I'm my own best argument for liking the PoP more and more. Really it's not that I don't like the inclusion of other factions, it's just that 50% of the time they disappoint. While MotU's track record is amazing, IMO only here. If they up the strategy of PoP, things could work out great. Definitely make them more unique.

see this is the sentiment i dont understand. if you claim everyone wants POP characters than why would the line fail if they made them at the end of the line. wouldnt the line just keep on going? face it people want vintage characters. i get you want a balanced line but why should we suffer through those figures just because you want balance. if people want more vintage i say we should get it. again im using your own statment that POP characters arent strong enough to carry their own line because you said it yourself, the line will be canned. every toy company should make the most requested figures which for the most part is purely vintage. if POP demand is so great than dont worry about it because the line will just continue

You missed the point entirely. Never did anyone say that everyone wants PoP. The point was that the line is strong only because it has all of us. It's like a structure that needs multiple support systems. If any one of them is lost, the whole thing falls apart. The great injustice of this is that those who got the least for what they put in will be the ones crushed by the collapse when one of those support systems is completely sated and just goes away because of poor planning. If it had been balanced start to finish, we all could have got what we wanted, or at the very least, a selection that reasonable people would have been satisfied with.

And again, we're having this discussion in a thread where half of the top ten fan demanded figures are solely PoP influence.

So by your own admission, this line would not have gone through this year, since most MOTU fans want to quit after Ram Man and Jitsu, so doesnt that make the fans of the rest of the lot substantial this year.

or you could read what i wrote. i said if the line consisted of just vintage characters there would have been more subscribers. just having two vintage and making people buy 10 junk figures isnt going to work. now make the line with 12 vintage and the numbers would have been much higher in the first place and therfore wouldnt need POP support. is that clear enough?

or you could read what i wrote. i said if the line consisted of just vintage characters there would have been more subscribers. just having two vintage and making people buy 10 junk figures isnt going to work. now make the line with 12 vintage and the numbers would have been much higher in the first place and therfore would need POP support. is that clear enough?

I refused to subscribe all these years, because of the inclusion of the other factions. I subscribe this year for the first time via a fellow fan, because I don't want to deal with matty anymore myself. I'm still not happy with the all-embracing concept of this line. Would the line only releases vintage characters, I would already finished my collection. I still have no Two Bad, Horde Trooper, Mantenna or Tung Lashor, which is really annoying. I have some exotic characters, like Draego Man, SMAA or the NA mutants, which I like, but I would trade them for the remaining vintage heavy hitters in a single heartbeat. I won't resub next year.

You missed the point entirely. Never did anyone say that everyone wants PoP. The point was that the line is strong only because it has all of us. It's like a structure that needs multiple support systems. If any one of them is lost, the whole thing falls apart. The great injustice of this is that those who got the least for what they put in will be the ones crushed by the collapse when one of those support systems is completely sated and just goes away because of poor planning. If it had been balanced start to finish, we all could have got what we wanted, or at the very least, a selection that reasonable people would have been satisfied with.

i still believe vintage is what the majority of people want. obviously not everyone, but the majority. so if we had a more balanced line up than the MAJORITY wouldnt be happy. we would have like a 1/3rd less vintage then we have now leaving us even more figures short of what we consider a complete collection. so i guess im a democracy guy, where the majority should win out, im not a socialist where everyone gets a piece of the pie. hey if POP outnumbered vintage and i was left in the dust so be it. and if thats where the line is headed thats cool and im out.

well to me this year was the worst sub #'s by far. thats a fact. and it also seems we have the least vintage figures. i dont see that as a coincidence. and how many people did you see say they were canceling after ram man and jitsu? i know its a heck of alot. we get netossa, fang man, FFM and who know how many other non vintage figures to come that alot of people are exactly busting the door down to get. again, i dont think we should have to buy your figures just for balance. i honestly dont think we need POP support to have the line survive. maybe more vintage and there would have been more subscribers to begin with. did you ever even think of that as a scenario. thats no more far fetched than you saying POP is needed to support the line. its all opinion but i think yours isnt as strongly supported

I do think that the 2012 character selection had a significant impact on the 2013 subs, but not in the way or for the reasons that you are saying.

The problem, in my opinion, is not the inclusion of POP as a whole. Characters like She-Ra, Adora, Bow, Cat-Ra, Swiftwind, and (from the cartoon) Shadow Weaver are popular, highly demanded characters... maybe not by you specifically, but by A LOT of other people. They are on the same level as many of the vintage figures, and even at a higher level than some of the less popular vintage MOTU figures (like those that came towards the end of the line, who actually make up the bulk of the vintage figures that have yet to be made).

I've posted something like this before, but here's where I think things went off track last year....

Most of the standard basic monthly and variant figures in the standard Club Eternia sub were popular, demanded characters, that part was fine. But, arguably none of the over-sized items were nearly as popular. I'm not saying that they didn't have their audience, and the popularity level does vary from one of these items to the next, but none of them would really fall under A or B list territory.

In 2012 we got The Star Sisters, The Griffin, The Snakemen 2-pack, and Procrustus. None of these individually are super-popular. The closest would probably be the Snakemen pack, and even they are just generic snakemen, not specific characters. I do find the Griffin and Procrustus to be pretty cool, but they do fall under a category where if they hadn't been made, I wouldn't complain. The Star Sisters were rather "meh" to me, and a lot of people were trying to unload them (and the fact that they are POP characters isn't the problem... it's that they are very obscure POP characters, and it was an expensive set all at once).

Now compare that to the oversized items selection from the previous years....

2011 - The Shadow Beast, Panthor, Megator, and Swiftwind

2010 - Battle Cat, Tytus, Gygor, The Palace Guards (the guards came out in January 2011 due to a delay, but technically were intended as part of 2010).

Now, there are some obscure characters in there (Gygor comes to mind), but on the whole there were quite a few high-profile A and B list characters in the mix. 2012 simply didn't have that.

Then there was the 30th sub. We went into it knowing that we were getting brand new characters, but after being lured in with the likes of Photog (a long awaited figure that was supposed to come out in the 80s), and Draego-Man (a new character that went over VERY well), most the selections that followed came with a decent amount of contraversy for many fans. Cy-Chop seemed to go over a bit better than Spector or Laser-Lot (though I'm not sure why). Grayskull Man was pretty cool, though.

Vykron was a controversial figure as well. While it was nice that the exclusive wasn't a highly demanded character (thus making it not too big of a deal for some people if they were to miss out on him), after getting the likes of the Orko/Adam and Marlena/Cringer packs the previous couple of years, it was a let down, particularly for the 30th.

Given the amount of money that anyone who signed up for both subs would have spent (even if they skipped Vykron) on oversized items, 30th anniversary figures, and even the occasional main sub figure that they didn't care for, it probably caused a lot of people not to sign back up for 2013.

As for 2013 itself, sure Netossa is a questionable choice. While she has her fans, she is also more like C or D list material within POP, and even many POP fans have been asking for the more high profile POP characters like Glimmer and Angela.

The point in all of this is that it's not that POP as a whole is unpopular, because that's simply an incorrect and inaccurate statement. It's that obscure characters aren't as popular, and I do think there inclusion has hurt the line. It's not that I hate them all. Some are cool and some I am personally glad to have gotten. I don't think the line should be completely restricted to only making figures that already were toys in the 80s. But I do see where too much obscure stuff likely hurt the line.