I mean, that "76" joint has a real dope beat, but the rhyme styles does not do it justice. It's like that train-of-thought pseudo-intelligent stuff that agitates me I think. And the dude is lookin' pretty soft for someone talking about guns. If it's not Rick Ross or washed up Jay-z, it's this stuff right? And if it's not Z-ro, it's Lil Scrappy or Boobie or whatever.

How much longer until we see another Biggie or Nas or Jay-Z or Outkast or even 50 cent or Eminem?

I know I'm more than disconnected on this stuff, but it seems to me, there's no worldwide stars with the charisma that the above-mentioned had.

Really don't understand all the critical acclaim this Roc Marciano fella is receiving. Maybe I'm disconnected to Neu-Backpack Rap, but dude's monotone, quasi-feminine limericky flow just just sounds like gobblygook to me. Aside from putting words together that rhyme, is he saying anything? For example, check that "Deeper" song:

Eight ball corner pocket, my hustle: can't knock it
The game shopping catastrophic, I'm after the profit
Pull a salad out the stockin', it's poppin'
I popped in the cherry blossom
Rocked the lockman in the cockpit
You frontin' like you hot shit
Shake out, dress understated at the steakhouse
Spaced out, deep in the game I pray I make it out
Two bitches naked on the couch, crouch
Go Porsche, I'm a clotheshorse
Your boss thrown in the trough
The blows soft, throw salt on pork
You're done, prick him with the fork
Dip him in the sauce, linen cloth
Lay on the king, blesses to my offspring
Sip the water from the spring, it ain't a thing
Pattern leather ski mask, my feet pass a G and a half
Pull out the fast European cab, crab
Call it the cooler, I'm basically a jeweler
You tryna fool a consumer
Cubic zirconia, I copped the gold in Mongolia
Spoke harmonies at the podium

You wanna argue about any of the points I made? Particularly about rap falling the F off, cuz there's no serious talent around?

OK, then, I'll bite.

Above and beyond your dismissal of those dudes apparently being based (n.p.i.) as much on how they're represented in outlets like Pitchfuck/Fader/Complex et al, as how they actually sound or what their records are like, I think what you're saying is absolute bullshit. I've listened to a ton of new rap music this year and, although there's been the usual slough of mediocrity, I think 2012 has been a solid year that has arguably (although I personally wouldn't argue about it at all) produced one instant classic. My three favourite albums this year have come from one crew alone, dudes who were barely on my radar two years ago. Then I look at noz's best-of and Unkut's best-of - two more different aesthetics you'd struggle to find - and see there was plenty of other good stuff that either I didn't pay enough attention to or which slid under my radar completely. The idea that rap "fell off" this year is laughable.

I mean, what do you guys expect from rap now, apart from wanting it to still be the 90s? Is there not enough Cuban Links/The Infamous in that Roc Marciano joint? Do the snares need to be louder? Do you feel there's a qualitative drop-off between stream-of-consciousness non-sequiturs on rap records in 2012 and 1995? Or is it simpler to give in to the nostalgic pull of the latter rather than judge the former on its own merits (which are considerable, imo)?

While we're at it, this whole "yeah, but what is he saying?" thing is kinda rockist, don't you think? Odd as it may seem to say such a thing about rap, but I sometimes think there's too much attention paid to lyrical content and not enough to what's being done with the actual words. Someone like Starlito (who's had four or five top-drawer releases this year, and has charisma out the ass) may not be "saying" anything, but he's a fucking amazing lyricist. If you're fixated on the whole "rap as a means to elevate consciousness >>>>>> rap as anything else" thing, then shit like that might be slipping past you.

There's a huge "Rap You're Liking" thread on here that's like a noticeboard for anything halfway decent of all stripes. I don't know how often you bother clicking on it, but if you're still using Biggie (total one-off), Nas (greatest underachiever in rap history), Jay-Z (now effectively the Bruce Springsteen of rap), Outkast (only half-interested in still being rappers), 50 Cent (not even half-interested) and Eminem (good rapper who makes horrible records) as measures of quality, then consider this - apart from Biggie, all those dudes are either in decline or drifting into irrelevance. I mean, I like the Rolling Stones, and truthfully I'm even interested to hear new stuff by them, but they haven't been any kind of yardstick for a long fucking time now. The party's elsewhere, man.

I didn't really fuck with the Coop tape. Some of it is pretty old. New tracks were cool

I think Funerals is really, really good... I didn't like it first two listens but it's super dark and depressed and today it all clicked. Maybe that's a bit preliminary, I guess I'll add a * to say it's still early.

And that one song that he put out a video for where it says "THIS WILL NOT BE ON MENTAL WARFARE" is great
could've replaced any number of tracks on Mental Warfare itself which is too damn long and unfocused

Someone like Starlito (who's had four or five top-drawer releases this year, and has charisma out the ass) may not be "saying" anything, but he's a fucking amazing lyricist.

But he is saying a lot! He has some brutally honest (introspective) lyrics that keep me coming back.

And co-sign to everything else you said, too.

No, the reason I put that in parentheses is because it may not appear as if he's saying anything in a very specific, obvious kind of sense, but he's up there with someone like Face in terms of the conversations he's having with himself. I really do curse myself for not getting familiar with him earlier.

Someone like Starlito (who's had four or five top-drawer releases this year, and has charisma out the ass) may not be "saying" anything, but he's a fucking amazing lyricist.

But he is saying a lot! He has some brutally honest (introspective) lyrics that keep me coming back.

And co-sign to everything else you said, too.

No, the reason I put that in parentheses is because it may not appear as if he's saying anything in a very specific, obvious kind of sense, but he's up there with someone like Face in terms of the conversations he's having with himself. I really do curse myself for not getting familiar with him earlier.

Renaissance Gangster is prob the most palatable to Teh Real Heads - sample-based stuff from Burn One with a UGK vibe.

For My Foes is only four songs but it fucking goes. Pretty much killed everyone whose beat he rapped over (even Frank Ocean, somehow)
that's definitely what pricked my ears up. He did a skrait-to-youtube 20 min "musical" that has all of them

b/w

"I huurrrrrddddd Frank Ocean's song "we all try" and the line where he says 'I don't believe my hands are clean [sic] I can't believe you'd let me touch your heart',,, and I wrote a song about... SOAP"

Step Brothers is him and Don Trip, they sound great together and obviously enjoy showing the craft

"GuapalotIget/fell asleep playing monopoly/I had all four railroads and the blue and green properties/with the hotel, if I go to jail, be the only thing that can stop me/I remember going once, going twice - I wasn't auctioning..." :dominoes:

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