Theodore Wiggins
If it’s a city built park by tax paying dollars, let the city govern it. I don’t think the club should be doing that. Just my opinion

Joe Millette
I’m sorry I think I missed something, why would you not want to be a member of the AMA. It is a group that has been fighting to save the RC hobby and attempting to get kids involved in model aviation. I have been a member of the AMA since I was 9yrs old and I have never felt that they have failed us the members. They are a community based organization that has be fighting the FAA for us for years trying to keep this hobby. Regarding the rest of the rules, I don’t have many issues with them. These are all safety rules that any other club would have. Any other feed back by me will be sent to Al directly. Requirements of AMA and other such things should be left to the city and not the club since it is a City Park. Should we be involved in this, yes, but it should not be a vote by the club. The city will need to put this in a statute as Andrew Kading noted above.
All I want is a safe location to fly my rc planes and copters. Biggest issues I have ever had is aircraft taking off and landing on both runways at the same time. We are going to have an accident soon and the question will be, who’s fault is it, since no active runway is designated.
Other then that. I like everyone in the club and I am always willing to share my excitement and experience with flying buddies.. ?

Erik Mayra Cook
Yes. I don't have an issue with the safety rules. I do have an issue with the club voting on something they have no control over. If the city does it, fine, but the club should stay out of it. Should the club vote on it, and "pass" it, there will be issues. That being said, I am full compliance with FAA registration and I am an AMA member.

Andrew Kading
Well said, I'm just speaking up for the people that don't want to be forced into buying secondary insurance to enjoy a city park, that's all. Honestly rules and regulations are a MUST HAVE out there, but trying to push AMA for the field is like telling all the kids at Young Park they need Aflac..... I don't see how that's ok. But..... I just want to fly like everyone else, if having AMA is a rule after this so be it, but everyone gets a voice when Taxes we're used to build.

Tyler Karr
I can understand how some general purpose guidelines for safety reasons may need to be posted, but those guidelines should be implemented by the city.
If the club wants to require their members to carry AMA or any other licensure / certification that is their business, that being said since this is a city owned facility any such rule implemented by the club is not binding, and as such anyone is free to use the facility.
As far as the example about two craft crashing into each other on the runway, I would view it just like any other form of RC. For example if I am at a short course track and there is someone who is a poor driver, and that person hits my truck and breaks something I don’t hand them a bill I simply fix what broke even if the damage wasn’t my fault, that’s just the nature of the hobby.
My main issue with the requirement of AMA is that RC is expensive, especially to someone just starting out. It seems to me that making the barrier to entry even higher would do more harm than good.

Erik Mayra Cook
Off topic, why do club members have after hours access to a city park? I get that it can be for special events and such, but are they allowed to go in on Sunday when the dump is closed for the rest of us? Perhaps on Saturday before it opens for the rest of us?

Evan Merewether
I have placed an answer to this question in the forum.

Andrew Kading
Unless the club pays the city for "privileges" I think that shouldn't be happening either. The club did not fund the park, the city did.

Erik Mayra Cook
Here is the answer I was provided:
"Our club membership (not the AMA) is granted the special privilege (and we do consider this a privilege and not a right) to access the RC park after hours because we help maintain the facility. The city appreciates the time, talent, and treasure that we pour into this location and rewards us with this special access. In fact, our club president is up at the field as I write this cleaning up the tumbleweeds."

Andrew Kading
That seems like a job for people that do community service.....

Evan Merewether
Both us and the city think that the funds and time we expend on that facility is sufficient payment for the special access.

Erik Mayra Cook
What about the funds we (taxpayers) expend

Evan Merewether
Can you dump your yard waste there after hours? Why would you think the RC park is different?

Erik Mayra Cook
You all seem to think so

Erik Mayra Cook
Do I or anyone else get special privileges at city parks? No. We have to pay to get a special use permit. I am not trying to start an argument. I just want to have a discussion on some of these topics.

Andrew Kading
The club has no say in what the city does, the club just helped with building direction that's it, that doesn't warrant special use for a tax funded park.

Evan Merewether
I agree. And I will hopefully a post that I will be adding to the forum later today will clear up some of these misunderstandings. Again I want to thank everyone for the comments.

Andrew Kading
If I try to go to Young Park after hours I'll get kicked out..... think about it.

Evan Merewether
Unless you had a permit to be there that late.

Andrew Kading
The club has a permit to go in the dump while it's closed?

Evan Merewether
By virtue of the city giving us access, Yes. In addition, my post on the forum later today will go further into this.

Andrew Kading
I think it need to be a public hearing, not a forum controlled by the club....

Erik Mayra Cook
I have sent letters and made some phone calls

Andrew Kading
Same here, I don't understand how it's even gone this far, hahaha

Evan Merewether
Thank you. I hope that once the dust settles that everyone will know what the rules are.

Andrew Kading
I hope so.

Erik Mayra Cook
I guess I just have one final question. If I come up there on the Saturday before normal opening at the same time a club member is entering, will I be turned away?

Andrew Kading
Yes, for no AMA. Or "free for the day as a members guest". The guy at the gate will let you in but the club will tell you to leave. I'm speaking from experience.

Erik Mayra Cook
That’s why me and my son had to go elsewhere this morning. Talk about promoting the hobby. They just want members. That’s the reason behind all this

Andrew Kading
Right, my 5 year old and I had the same thing. The club is hurting the hobby, they want members so they get cheaper AMA rates...

Mike Moore
Please let me know who turned you away. I was there Saturday at 7:30 and the gate was open. I don't recall turning anyone away, and I left after the winds picked up at 11 AM. I am a club instructor and the club safety officer. We also have a way to allow new pilots free entry to AMA for 60 days. Children under 19 years old can join AMA for free and our club charges 3.00 per year for children. I really cannot say our club, or the AMA turns people away from the hobby.

Andrew Kading
Mike Moore, by not letting tax paying residents fly there free of charge "AMA and Club dues" you are effectively turning the general public away. Absolutely astounding that you guys don't get it. It's honestly a joke at this point. You guys are not city officials and that is a City park. Its the City of Las Cruces Airpark not MVMAC Airpark. Period.

Mike Moore
Andrew, even when I run contests out there I put on the city permit that we will allow use of the park by non-participants. I have yet to tell anyone please leave due to not being a club member. Now, not carrying insurance, well, I have not checked anyone's insurance to date. Remember, the rules shown here are PROPOSED and subject to all these great comments.

Andrew Kading
Honestly I'm all for the Club, I started the MVMAC Facebook group, was a member for a while, went to club meetings, helped with the Las Cruces Airport etc. I just want the park to be treated as so, rules and regs, free admission and no extra charges as a city park should be.

Evan Merewether
Yes. By the written gate control procedures that we have agreed to when given access by the city, only those with a key are permitted to use that gate.

Erik Mayra Cook
That I have a problem with

Evan Merewether
I am sorry that you disagree but this is off topic.

Erik Mayra Cook
I’m sorry you disagree as well. The club may have been given a right to be there but not to exclude

Evan Merewether
So you are saying that those poor old ladies who have the privilege to use the public pool before it is open to the public should not have that access either?

Erik Mayra Cook
So you know their exact circumstances? Please don’t use the “someone else does it so I can do it” reason. I’m trying to have a discussion. I want to know why the club is doing what they are doing beside feeling entitled.

Erik Mayra Cook
I will end this discussion. It is not going anywhere. I’m really not trying to be difficult. I have just not been presented with anything to the contrary of my opinion. We are all entitled to that.

Mike Moore
The MVMAC carries liability insurance naming the land owner (the City of Las Cruces). Since the club members fund this insurance as well as other improvements, we have an understanding with the city for after hours use. Essentially, it is our "permit" for use after hours. You are correct, if you go to the city parks and recs department, you too can be permitted for use.

Tyler Karr
Every person who has homeowners insurance and some types of renters insurance has the same coverage. The point is that a tax funded area should be available for use by all, and not just by ten cranky old guys who feel entitled to a tax funded project that cost thousands and thousands of dollars. This is a tax funded area that should be available to everyone, not just a group of a few that feels entitled. Taxation is already theft and what your group is doing is theft on top of theft.

griffin838 wrote: Kind of off topic, but the field at Sonoma Ranch doesn't open until 9 on Saturday. It gets light a few hours before that and only "club members" have keys to the gate after hours. Does this mean that they have access to the field in the prime hours (before it gets too hot out) before the rest of us? If so, why is this?

Our club membership (not the AMA) is granted the special privilege (and we do consider this a privilege and not a right) to access the RC park after hours because we help maintain the facility. The city appreciates the time, talent, and treasure that we pour into this location and rewards us with this special access. In fact, our club president is up at the field as I write this cleaning up the tumbleweeds.

griffin838 wrote: Maybe next time, you just copy and paste the message without the header. I was also unaware that comments made to an e-mail address would be posted public. My understanding is that they would just be noted by the club before the vote.