I mentioned that Sleeping Beauty sounded decent before in a video/park thread. I'll try an action flick for S&Gs to check out the quality.

As for any system, source is the culprit. GIGO. Dont't expect much with your ipoops and other lossy music you throw at it. It's a decent system at moderate levels and pretty much about the same can be said for most other stock car systems.

Sirius radio is not CD quality and a good strong FM station will have better sounding audio. I am dissapointed that there is only one slot for DVD and CD. Multi-media with one optical choice? You'll need to copy CDs uncompressed to the rather small HDD to enjoy better sounding music witthout having to swap out CDs.

The real flaw is not having a disc changer for music and a dedicated one for video. And of course at least a 100GB HDD to store uncompressed music. An even bigger HDD for movie rips would be a plus. I'll have to look at plugging in a TB+ HDD in the armrest to see if that works. The audio is okay as long as you have the right uncompressed sources.

I agree that the quality of the listeners "ear" is the most significant component in the equation and for those who have a passion with audio the factory system will disappoint.

I've been an audiophile for more decades than I care to admit. I can trace my roots back to the first Hafler DH-200 / DH-101 kit I built in the late 70's (yes, I'm old!)

I did the high end car audio stuff back in the '70's and 80's when Fosgate was just hitting the market and spent more money than I care to admit.

I have reached a point in my life where I'm not as critical since I don't spend nearly as much time formally "listening" being in a climate that allows me to spend 12 months of the year outside. I also came to a realization about 15 years ago that the "MidFi" systems had reached a point where the gains achieved by the true HiFi systems were only perceptible in a controlled listening environment and for me usually not worth the additional costs. I was also introduced to a relatively new (at the time) concept called listener fatigue. There are a number of somewhat difficult to measure coloration's added to the music that are not evident in the initial listening but cause listener fatigue after as little as 30 minutes of listening. One of the clearest examples of this would be the difference in the listening experience between a Bose system and a properly designed system like a Martin Logan or even a Paradigm mid-fi system. While the Bose may sound impressive to the untrained ear the coloration added to provide this "presence" is unnatural and your brain grows tired dealing with it over time.

With all that being said the listening environment in a vehicle is one of the worst in the world for music. It's a compromise at best and when companies like Alpine are asked to design a system they usually take the time to actually place listening probes in place and tune the system's response and speaker placement to account for the imperfect environment. Sure, it also has to meet a price point but overall what's being delivered in vehicles these days is akin to the advancements in MidFi systems 10 or 15 years ago where the additional costs required to actually improve them (not just make them louder) is only something the most discerning listener would be able to justify.

Sorry for the novel but I wanted to highlight what I see the current state of the industry to be and not just throw out a 2 line opinion.

I mentioned that Sleeping Beauty sounded decent before in a video/park thread. I'll try an action flick for S&Gs to check out the quality.

As for any system, source is the culprit. GIGO. Dont't expect much with your ipoops and other lossy music you throw at it. It's a decent system at moderate levels and pretty much about the same can be said for most other stock car systems.

Sirius radio is not CD quality and a good strong FM station will have better sounding audio. I am dissapointed that there is only one slot for DVD and CD. Multi-media with one optical choice? You'll need to copy CDs uncompressed to the rather small HDD to enjoy better sounding music witthout having to swap out CDs.

The real flaw is not having a disc changer for music and a dedicated one for video. And of course at least a 100GB HDD to store uncompress music. An even bigger HDD for movie rips would be a plus. I'll have to look at plugging in a TB+ HDD in the armrest to see if that works. The audio is okay as long as you have the right uncompressed sources.

The best source I have heard (and it is very source dependent) is an iPod loaded with WAV files (Lossless) not mp3s or other lossy formats driving the 730N via the iPod interface.

If the system perform better than the one into old WH, will be great for me. ( I still wait the new while running the old)
To have better sound may be will be necessary change all speakers, amplifier, wiring, power line, make mess all the inside of the car and spent over than 2K USD.
Than we will have better sound (may be) and a lot of rattle for free.

I believe that the design of the factory system will not allow for new cross-overs to be installed in a speaker only upgrade, which would minimize the benefits of changing out the speakers with no new amplifier.

That's the problem with the higher end factory systems... to get much of any improvement you basically have to redo the entire thing, and that gets into megabucks. IMO, some better quality tweeters would help, but as you say, with the way the crossovers and things are on these things (with 4 speakers, you don't have such issues), stuff snowballs fast.

This is the one thing that has stood out for me, the sound on the 2011 JGC seems to be not as good as I had with my 08 limited. On my 08 JGC Limited I would have to turn down the factory bass as it would rattle the windows. Can't get that to happen on the WK2, even with the bass maxed out.

I've taken mine to 3 different installers in the Philly area and basically had 3 different answers. (two of which have been in business for many decades, the 3rd isn't as old but also has a good reputation)

Long story short, this isn't going to be an inexpensive upgrade.
Installer 1 wanted to use the JL CleanSweep hardware to flatten out the factory eq settings. (but for some reason they couldn't do the install without adding an additional knob to control the volume) That wasn't going to happen. (World Wide Stereo in Montgomeryville) The estimate? approx. 3K

Installer 2 basically told me that the CleanSweep product was garbage and that they had a better solution. Their solution was lower end JL speakers in the back and higher end Morel speakers in the front. (Perzan audio in Upper Darby) Approx. 3K

Installer 3 echoed the sentiments of installer 2 about the CleanSweep product. However, this one wanted to replace the entire system. They recommended Pioneer head unit AVIC-Z120BT (which will give me a better signal out) I think it's a 4ohm out system. He wanted to add Focal K2 speakers. (which sounded great) However, I do not want to replace the head unit. The approx. cost for the entire system rebuild? 5K. There was an alternative that he didn't recommend which was a Mosconi crossover/amp system. (sorry, didn't get the estimate in writing) and still retain the head unit for approx. 3K. The logic behind replacing the head unit (per the installer's opinion) was that even with the upgraded speakers and amp, it's still amplifying an inferior signal from the head unit. This place also does factory replacement installations for a local Jeep dealership (Sport Chrysler Jeep in Norristown PA) This installer was ASAP car stereo in Conshohocken PA.

At this point, I think I'm not going to be upgrading anything anytime soon. I'm looking to get more detail from lower volumes. What I mean by this, for example, is some songs that you can hear dialogue or very detailed things without crushing your eardrums. I'm not looking for a "thumper" system, but would like to have some more bass and midrange detail.

Footnote: Is there ANY detailed documentation for the factory installed Alpine system in our new Jeeps? (schematics, specs?) I'm having a difficult time finding any real information out there.

This is the one thing that has stood out for me, the sound on the 2011 JGC seems to be not as good as I had with my 08 limited. On my 08 JGC Limited I would have to turn down the factory bass as it would rattle the windows. Can't get that to happen on the WK2, even with the bass maxed out.

Maybe that's because the windows are in tighter on the WK2

Just kidding, well sort of. What I mean is the interior fit and finish is so far ahead of the previous version that it's understandable things don't rattle.

Overall I am happy with the sound system , but if one of you comes up with something really great, I might be interested in an upgrade.

+1. I used to be the guy that spent thousands to upgrade but the OEMs have much nicer systems today I just don't see that the differences between stock and aftermarket systems is drastic enough for me to rip out the stock system and replace with an aftermarket system without dropping a butt load of cash which I don't plan to do in the near future. Maybe in the future after I've grown bored of the JGC, I may upgrade either the stereo or something else to renew my interest.