Dansbrother, I am sorry if you were offended by my advocating for the patients right to die as they wish. I know that your brothers suffering was very traumatic for you and for your family and I understand your strong feelings. But please try to understand the other side of the coin. You made the statement that there was nothing dignified about watching someone hallucinate and that it needed immediate medical attention. There are two issues here, first; dignity is what the patient needs-not us. You were understandibly upset at your brothers hallucinations (as I would have been if it had been my brother) but he was unaware that he was hallucunating so it was only bothersome to you-not him. Secondly, if a person chooses not to have medical intervention we can't and shouldn't impose it on them. It is their right to choose. As a family member it is a nightmare to watch I know as I went thru it with my mom just a few months ago. I guess I realized a long time ago that everyone has a right to die as they wish. That's where the dignity comes into it. Hospice is the place that many patients will pass away as they are heavily medicated if in pain and usually slip away after falling into coma. However; even then many people want to die at home where they are comfortable. The choice is theirs and their families decision. When my mom was so sick I found myself trying to impose my will as to what should or should not be done. When I realized what I was doing (going against what she wanted) I had to regroup and stop trying to force my will on her. I finally concluded that I simply didn't want to let her go. My telling her at the end that it was OK to go was the hardest thing I ever did in my life or my career.I hope this helps you understand why I have to remain so adament about being a patient advocate and following their wishes. In the end it isn't about us and how we feel but rather about them and how they feel. Shelly

When you fall - I'll get you up and help you walk,when you can't walk - I'll carry you, and when I can no longer carry you - I'll stay by your side for there is always hope.

dansbrother, you certainly have a right to express yourself in the manner that you choose. However; I find it a little difficult to understand what I percieve to be your hostility to my comments. I think that we all see things a little differently but certainly I am not offended when someone disagrees with me. That's what makes this site so wonderful. Everyone an voice their experiences and opinions freely. Hope you have a ggod day and know that it's Ok with me that we disagree on certain issues. We all learn something from others' comments.

Shelly

When you fall - I'll get you up and help you walk,when you can't walk - I'll carry you, and when I can no longer carry you - I'll stay by your side for there is always hope.

And that's a BIG yes this disease can get real ugly at the end for some. And some others go... somewhat peacefully in a coma. Either way it is devastating to the family. But again ...each family has to decide for themselves how and where they want the end to be. If the patient makes a decision on the particulars of their death I do believe myself that the family should try to honor it if possible. Under some circumstances I agree it may not be possible.My husband died at home. I was terrified that he would have a bleed out. But he wanted to die at home and I felt that it was one of the last wishes that I could grant him. Fortunately he didn't. But it was the hardest part of the whole journey of his liver disease was to watch him actually die before my eyes. It's not something that I ever want to do again. I had all his family here for hours. I think that added a lot of stress to it for me. But we were not in a cold hospital room. We were at home and somehow that made it easier.Even though he was in a coma I know that he was aware of his surroundings and all the family who had come. So my decision to carry out his wishes turned out to be the best thing that I could have done for him and me too.

Both of you give so much of yourselves to this forum. Shelly your knowledge and compassion is over the top. Dan'sbrother I love your passion to help others. You kind of remind me of me. My supervisor at work is always telling my that sometimes I am too passionate about my work. So sometimes I have to tone myself down. I appreciate both of you doing your best to help others deal with hideous disease. Just on this one issue.... can we agree to disagree.

Thank you both for everything..........take care.Pink GrandmaForum moderator-Hepatitis

When the going gets tough....the tough get going! Don't always know where I going but I get there anyways.