I've had nothing but trouble with the orbi system but mostly we have battled to a stalemate. The one remaining thing I can't tolerate is constant dropping of streams from Apple TV, Amazon Fire sticks and PS4's.

It seems to be caused by reissuing IP addresses. For example I constantly get ‘Lost internet connection’ on the 4th gen Apple TV even if it isn’t playing anything. When It's playing music then it drops the stream and stops. Pressing play immediately starts it again without delay.. it's not an internet problem, it's a local network issue. It’s accompanied by a log entry on the Orbi:

This will happen about once or twice an hour, sometimes multiple times within 10 minutes where nothing else on the network is changing. These errors are all over the logs for just about every device on the network. Assigigning dedicated static ip's to devices doesn't help. Disabling every sattelite and just using the base station doesn't help. Signal is reported as strong by Apple TV and a wifi scanner near it.

I have the following now but the problem was there in previous releases as well:

Router

RBR50

V2.2.1.210

Satellite

RBS50

V2.2.1.210

Satellite

RBW30

V2.2.1.204

Can anyone here think of any way to troubleshoot this or do I have to throw it away and buy something else? I'm kind of done with dealing with a system that has both rampant bugs and very little debugability.

What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem the NG router is connected too? What is the Mfr and model# of the ethernet switch if one is in the configuration.

Try disabling the following and see:MIMO, Daisy Chain, Fast Roaming, IPv6 and Set 20/40Mhz Coexistence to 40Mhz only. Save settings and reboot the router and satellite(s).

If you updated to recent FW v.210, try enabling Daisy Chain. Some have mentioned that this seems to be working in reverse order, enabling means disabled actually.

For wired back haul:Set up IP address reservations for each satellite and devices on the router as you add them to the router. The satellites need to be set up via wireless first. Then connect 1 satellite at a time to the ethernet LAN cable. Wait 5 minutes and the top led on the satellite should turn on BLUE. Set up an IP address reservation for the 1st satellite. Continue to do the same thing for the 2nd satellite. Then follow up with your devices.

Modem Combo Units:Couple of options,1. Configure the modem for transparent bridge mode. Then use the Orbi router in router mode. You'll need to contact the ISP for help and information in regards to the modem being bridged correctly.2. If you can't bridge the modem, disable ALL wifi radios on the modem, configure the modems DMZ for the IP address the Orbi router gets from the modem. Then you can use the Orbi router in Router mode.3. Or disable all wifi radios on the modem and connect the Orbi router to the modem, configure AP mode on the Orbi router.

I've had nothing but trouble with the orbi system but mostly we have battled to a stalemate. The one remaining thing I can't tolerate is constant dropping of streams from Apple TV, Amazon Fire sticks and PS4's.

It seems to be caused by reissuing IP addresses. For example I constantly get ‘Lost internet connection’ on the 4th gen Apple TV even if it isn’t playing anything. When It's playing music then it drops the stream and stops. Pressing play immediately starts it again without delay.. it's not an internet problem, it's a local network issue. It’s accompanied by a log entry on the Orbi:

This will happen about once or twice an hour, sometimes multiple times within 10 minutes where nothing else on the network is changing. These errors are all over the logs for just about every device on the network. Assigigning dedicated static ip's to devices doesn't help. Disabling every sattelite and just using the base station doesn't help. Signal is reported as strong by Apple TV and a wifi scanner near it.

I have the following now but the problem was there in previous releases as well:

Router

RBR50

V2.2.1.210

Satellite

RBS50

V2.2.1.210

Satellite

RBW30

V2.2.1.204

Can anyone here think of any way to troubleshoot this or do I have to throw it away and buy something else? I'm kind of done with dealing with a system that has both rampant bugs and very little debugability.

What wired devices do you have connected to your system? Do you have wired Sonos to your system?

Only a Synology NAS connected to the RBS50 sattelite but it doesn't seem to matter since it happens even if both sattelites are turned off. Even the NAS which has a wired link to the satellite and I’ve given it a static IP gone through times where it reports “link down, link up” every few minutes.

What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem the NG router is connected too?

I'll have to look this up when I get home. It's a Japanese model since I live in Japan.

What is the Mfr and model# of the ethernet switch if one is in the configuration.

No switches.

Try disabling the following and see:MIMO, Daisy Chain, Fast Roaming, IPv6 and Set 20/40Mhz Coexistence to 40Mhz only. Save settings and reboot the router and satellite(s).

If you updated to recent FW v.210, try enabling Daisy Chain. Some have mentioned that this seems to be working in reverse order, enabling means disabled actually.

*sigh* yeah I was afraid that this would be the recommendation. I've tried toggling a bunch of these on/off over the many months I've been troubleshooting this. I haven't tried IPv6 or 20/40Mhz Coexistence yet... I did do a wifi scan and see the networks switching between 20 and 40 but it didn't seem to correlate wtih the DHCP crazyness so I left it. I do want the system to be daisy-chained since the space is long and the main router is at one end.

1. Configure the modem for transparent bridge mode. Then use the Orbi router in router mode. You'll need to contact the ISP for help and information in regards to the modem being bridged correctly.

This is something I also considered but haven't really wanted to get into. The modem is pretty janky and the UI is only available in Japanese. Kind of a pain to configure or fix if I make a mistake. I may try it out if it comes to this but for the record the Orbi is replacing an Apple Wifi router that never had any issues with this modem.

My biggest complaint is with the seemingly very low quality control on updates, and complete lack of visibility into the state of the system or misleading data where it exists. I'd like a better source for information on why the modem reissues IP's.

Let us know about this modem. Just checking to see if it's got any built in router and wifi. These modem can cause problems.

If you do want the system to be Daisy chained, then besure the Satellies are in a linear line out from the base router and from each other. Then if your on v210, uncheck Daisy Chain, this should actually enable Daisy Chain for this version of FW.

You'll need to contact your ISP about what happens on your modem and IP addressing. They control the modem and IPs up to that point.

Trying playing with settings again. Maybe I can find some magic incantation that works. They are actually connected in a daisy-chain topology with the checkbox clicked so it's not reversed.

It's likely not the ISP modem.. as I said that modem worked fine with the Apple router for over 5 years. The Orbi has never worked right. I am realizing now it also doesn't work with the mobile app anymore... The app doesn't recognize it as an orbi network.

It seems to be caused by reissuing IP addresses. For example I constantly get ‘Lost internet connection’ on the 4th gen Apple TV even if it isn’t playing anything. When It's playing music then it drops the stream and stops. Pressing play immediately starts it again without delay.. it's not an internet problem, it's a local network issue. It’s accompanied by a log entry on the Orbi:

Do you notice that those devices change from 2.4GHz to 5GHz or vice versa when this interruption happens?

I noticed that some of my devices suddenly decide to move between the two bands back and forth, together with this change there will be internet interruption for a short period and a DHCP message like the one you mentioned in the Logs.

I am seeing the same exact issue - with constant dhcp ip issuing and clients continuously dropping from the network. And my newest macbook pro willl not reconnect, and occassionally other macbooks, iphones and ipads suffer the same issue. We don't have many heavily used, non-ios clients, but my canon printer hasn't been able to be used without restarting it, either. I've also tried all sorts of various options and placements, and am stuck, and frustrated because it disrupts business video calls and demos all the time! We have a 5000 sqft home and have tried R-S-S daisy chain and S-R-S configurations, with no improvement. I'll have a day or two with no issues, and then mornings like just now where it dropped almost a dozen times within an hour.

I do notice that sometimes I'm connected to 2.4 and sometimes 5, though I don't know if it constantly flip-flops back and forth. I'll watch for that. Maybe I'll try to force the 5 connection only either through the clients or the router, and see if that stabilizes things.

If your system is on v210, then having Daisy Chain check means it's actually disabled. From what i got from other users posts. I would try unchecking Daisy Chain and just test this out. You can revert back to it being checked if nothing changes.

If it's somthing your having problems with, you may need to contact NG support and get some help from them going. Possible issue with HW or FW that has not been updated or seated fully.

Also it would help us to know what Mfr and model Modem you have. Just becuase it worked with one mfr router doesn't mean it may work with another. Again, just checking this out.

Trying playing with settings again. Maybe I can find some magic incantation that works. They are actually connected in a daisy-chain topology with the checkbox clicked so it's not reversed.

It's likely not the ISP modem.. as I said that modem worked fine with the Apple router for over 5 years. The Orbi has never worked right. I am realizing now it also doesn't work with the mobile app anymore... The app doesn't recognize it as an orbi network.

I am seeing the same exact issue - with constant dhcp ip issuing and clients continuously dropping from the network. And my newest macbook pro willl not reconnect, and occassionally other macbooks, iphones and ipads suffer the same issue. We don't have many heavily used, non-ios clients, but my canon printer hasn't been able to be used without restarting it, either. I've also tried all sorts of various options and placements, and am stuck, and frustrated because it disrupts business video calls and demos all the time! We have a 5000 sqft home and have tried R-S-S daisy chain and S-R-S configurations, with no improvement. I'll have a day or two with no issues, and then mornings like just now where it dropped almost a dozen times within an hour.

I do notice that sometimes I'm connected to 2.4 and sometimes 5, though I don't know if it constantly flip-flops back and forth. I'll watch for that. Maybe I'll try to force the 5 connection only either through the clients or the router, and see if that stabilizes things.

What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem the NG router is connected too?

ISP is Spectrum Charter, and modem is Arris T1602A

What is the distance between the router and satellite(s)? 30 feet is recommended in between them to begin with depending upon building materials.

router to sat1 is 57', router to sat2 is 42', sat1 to sat2 is 52 - I've tried several different configs, this is just where they're at right now.

What channels are you using? Auto? Try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and any unused channel on 5Ghz.

auto on 2.4, and 48 on 5. mac scan shows 11 is best for 2.4 and it is currently on 8, so I'll change that. 161 is best for 5, but that's not an option through the ui, and I haven't been able to telnet in to change it as instructed in some post.

Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

Of course, yes. My strongest RSSI via the mac scan comes in at -74 and shows three bars where I am scanning from in my office. There are seven others, strongest at -85 (two bars), weakest at -94 (one bar).

Try disabling the following and see:MIMO, Daisy Chain, Fast Roaming, IPv6 and Set 20/40Mhz Coexistence to 40Mhz only. Save settings and reboot the router and satellite(s).

done (noting that ipv6 was already disabled, and based on note below and that I'm on .210, I left daisy chain enabled) I'll check back in a day or so with updates on these settings.

If you updated to recent FW v.210, try enabling Daisy Chain. Some have mentioned that this seems to be working in reverse order, enabling means disabled actually for R-S-S.

I'll run this for a day or so, and may switch daisy chain to see if that helps/hurts. ditto for fast roaming.

I've also been reading and trying the things at https://windsorwebdeveloper.com/making-netgear-orbi-great-again/ up to this point, and have dropped the 2.4 signal to 25% (I want to discourage 2.4 swapping) and 5 to 75%. And I've set my mac network hardware mtu to 1453. I may stop making so many changes or reset and do some things one at a time, if I have time to further troubleshoot once the system is stable.

Thanks for replying and sorry you're seeing it too.. you're both describing 2.4GHz to 5GHz changes but I actually now suspect it's the router deciding to go from 20Mhz wide bands to 40Mhz wide bands and vice versa within the 2.4GHz network. Usually, 40Mhz wide bands are a bad idea in a crowded Wifi environment. What netgear seemingly is doing is looking for noise and if it sees a network nearby it switches to the more narrow 20MHz band. It could also be both 20<->40Mhz switching and 2.4<->5GHz switching though... who knows. Part of the problem is that the orbi doesn't actually log enough about what it's actually doing to be able to know.

There is a setting in the advanced page to turn off the adaptive switching but I don't know if that means it sticks with 20 or with 40MHz wide channels or if you can choose... I'll have to investigate tonight.

I'm starting to think this is the main issue.

lizabny:

Regarding your printer, I did have a printer issue before and it was due to the orbi allowing usage of channel 14 or something that the printer didn't support. I explicitly set the value on the orbi to not use that channel and it fixed it. You can perhaps search the forums for it.

FURRYe38:

I hope NetGear is paying you to be a 1st tier customer support because that's basically what you're doing here. It would be nice if they were more active. That being said, one thing a customer support person would do is encourage people to open their own threads to discuss instead of dropping the same debugging info which restarts a new conversation in the same thread. Just because someone says 'I'm having that issue too' doesn't mean it's acutally the same issue and it gets confusing reading 3 or 4 issues in one thread. It's also hard to point to it later as a solved thread.

Anyway, I mean that as advice and not a criticism. I appreciate that you're trying to help everyone here.

Disabling this option allows your 2.4GHz wireless to stay in supporting the max speed. Enabling this option may reduce the max speed of your 2.4GHz wireless to the half when there is another wireless network detected in your environment; this is to avoid inteference between wireless networks and to get along with other wireless networks in the environment.

I also confirmed it with a WiFi scanner. So that's not great. It seems like there's no way to set it to only use 20Mhz wide bands and stay that way. You're stuck with constantly switching or being a bad neighbor.

That being said, disabling this setting seems to have made things better in terms of Apple TV dropouts. I'll report back if it continues to happen.

I'm hopeful this is working now but we'll see if it still acts right when it's connected on the 2.4GHz. Looking at the wireless backhaul networks the 2.4 and 5GHz are constantly trading off which one is up/down even when things seem to be working well but i'm not experienced enough with mesh setups to know if this is normal or not. I assume it is.

What is the Mfr and model# of the ISP modem the NG router is connected too?

ISP is Spectrum Charter, and modem is Arris T1602A

What is the distance between the router and satellite(s)? 30 feet is recommended in between them to begin with depending upon building materials.

router to sat1 is 57', router to sat2 is 42', sat1 to sat2 is 52 - I've tried several different configs, this is just where they're at right now.

What channels are you using? Auto? Try setting manual channel 1, 6 or 11 on 2.4Ghz and any unused channel on 5Ghz.

auto on 2.4, and 48 on 5. mac scan shows 11 is best for 2.4 and it is currently on 8, so I'll change that. 161 is best for 5, but that's not an option through the ui, and I haven't been able to telnet in to change it as instructed in some post.

Any Wifi Neighbors near by? If so, how many?

Of course, yes. My strongest RSSI via the mac scan comes in at -74 and shows three bars where I am scanning from in my office. There are seven others, strongest at -85 (two bars), weakest at -94 (one bar).

Try disabling the following and see:MIMO, Daisy Chain, Fast Roaming, IPv6 and Set 20/40Mhz Coexistence to 40Mhz only. Save settings and reboot the router and satellite(s).

done (noting that ipv6 was already disabled, and based on note below and that I'm on .210, I left daisy chain enabled) I'll check back in a day or so with updates on these settings.

If you updated to recent FW v.210, try enabling Daisy Chain. Some have mentioned that this seems to be working in reverse order, enabling means disabled actually for R-S-S.

I'll run this for a day or so, and may switch daisy chain to see if that helps/hurts. ditto for fast roaming.

I've also been reading and trying the things at https://windsorwebdeveloper.com/making-netgear-orbi-great-again/ up to this point, and have dropped the 2.4 signal to 25% (I want to discourage 2.4 swapping) and 5 to 75%. And I've set my mac network hardware mtu to 1453. I may stop making so many changes or reset and do some things one at a time, if I have time to further troubleshoot once the system is stable.

Well, over the weekend I used the AppleTV quite a bit and didn't see connections drop. This means I'm going to consider the fix to my streaming issues to be the setting of 20/40Mhz Coexistence to 40Mhz only at least for firmware V2.2.1.210. If you also have this problem, I'd suggest you try that first.

Note that:

- 40Mhz is not great and Netgear should really make it so it can be set to 20Mhz only rather than 40Mhz only.

- Netgear should also actually fix whatever bug causes it to drop when switching so we can use the 20/40Mhz coexistence feature. I'll re-check after the next firmware release.

- I still see tons of other bugs: satellites disconnecting, inconsistent UI in the app vs. admin panel, etc... but I'll open new threads of discussion for them

- Despite the forum having plenty of "works for me" responses to complaints, I'd say that overall for me the Orbi has not been worth the trouble it has caused. A 5% problem rate would be really bad and still would mean that 95% of people are happy so every thread would be full of happy stories. Instead we see many issues and almost no means for users to fix, debug or help themselves other than stab randomly at the settings. You can't have Apple-level simplicity in the interface without a corresponding dedication to constraining the things that can go wrong, testing, and bug fixing. Netgear really needs to invest in and focus on reliability. Adding half-baked features makes the problem worse.

As a sanity check I used scapy to query DHCP and found only one response on my network... so it's likely not caused by a rouge DHCP server on the network unless it's popping in and out of the network somehow.

I haven't tried a factory reset/setup from scratch on it yet. I already have set reservations for the Apple TV but I do actually want this to work with dynamic reservations as well... either way it doesn't help.

At this point I am going down the rabbit hole. I've telnetted into the thing and oddly the lease file it is supposed to be writing out in `/tmp/udhcpd.leases` is empty. The udhcpd configuration is set as: