Another remark like that and I'll have you scrubbing toilets with a toothbrush and licking the toilet floors clean with that sharp tongue of yours!

Quoting: L. Ron Hubbard 31194169

You are ridiculous.

1 John 1–3._ 1Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, 3and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God.

There is so much disinformation in this thread about what Scientology actually is. I first read Dianetics in 1972 and was fascinated by the notion of a mental stimulus-response mechanism generated by a sub-conscious aspect of mind that occurs whenever pain and/or unconciousness weakens our concious mind generating an "engram" which is a mental image/ memory which can become activated/ empowered to affect our behavior/ reactions whenever similar circumstances occur as those that were connected to the source "incident". As one goes through life more and more "incidents" get "restimulated" and one falls into these reactive responses locking them into "who you are". These emotional responses to incidents of pain and/or lowered conciousness are stored in ones "reactive mind", and can and often do adversely affect our life as they rear their ugly head. What was discovered is that by bringing your full conciousness into these incidents and re-living them mentally that they would and do lose their power over you...you maintain full awareness during any future "restimulation" of the "engram", and thus not fall into the stimulus-response automatic programming behavior(s) which usually are very dangerous/ non-survival responses. These restimulations from our environment, accidents, fights, unconciousness etc., build up an "energetic imprint" in our physiology, in our nervous system which is able to be measured by electronic instrumentation, specifically by a device invented specifically to record and monitor the presence of these "reactive-mind recordings", and this device is known as an "e-meter" which is a key tool used by Dianetic and subsequently Scientology "auditors", one who listens and records what is going on with the one who is looking and describing what is going on in their mind, pictures they see, feelings, words, smells, sensations, and the whole storyline connected with this past incident that was located by the auditor asking a question, seeing the e-meter response to that question, listening to the person that is in the session seeking the causes of problems in their life. The auditor is prohibited from telling their "patient" what they think, they only ask questions to direct the session towards the goal of clarity and resolution of the incident so it loses its power over the person, ie "becomes flattened" has been "cleared" out of the reactive mind "bank". The auditor then asks if there is an earlier similar incident along a potential chain of incidents that empower each other. The e-meter guides the auditor to areas with a lot of electric charge/ a big "read" on the e-meter and then the person in session tells the auditor what they perceive about that incident, which usually comes up in layers, until they are clear as to what the incident was, come to a "cognition" a sudden realization as to how this incident has adversely affected their life, the e-meter displays a big release and the needle just floats(called a floating needle), the person is usually very happy, has more awareness, and usually the auditor tells them that the session is over, since they are too ecstatic to get back into the muck of the reactive mind. An auditing session can last for many hours or for 10 minutes, it goes on as long as it takes to resolve the "issue" that is the largest reading issue that was determined by its response to a list the auditor goes over. The largest "read"/ needle deviation directs the progress of the sessions on a given subject/ level you are working on, whether that is Life Repair, Drug rundowns, Levels 0 through 5, Clearing Course, or OT levels where the auditor becomes yourself, you operate the e-meter, ask the questions, answer the questions, observe what is going on and write it all down in your auditor notes, and end the session. There is a "Case Supervisor" who goes over your notes, e-meter readings etc., and directs/ guides you to avoid pitfalls, missed reads etc., and offers guidance in directing the subject of your next session.

Belief is NOT a legitimate part of being a Scientologist because L. Ron Hubbard said many times that he didn't want any Scientologist to believe a single thing he ever said, that if something was determined by the individual to be true and correct by their observations alone... that is the only way something can be ajudged as true...does it fit in with all of the observations you have experienced and seen with your own senses. It isn't a matter of belief!!!

I'll come back to explain more from my perspective about the real Scientology, not the made up pre-suppositions thrown about all over the internet.

An immortal soul that reincarnates cover and over again, anywhere in existence. Aliens/gods/god that messed with humans genetics in the past and may have future use for us/may return. These are hardly things solely from Scientology. I mean these concepts/ideas/theories are pretty fucking common, just with different names. Having these as part of Scientology isn't something I'd hold against them. The rest? No idea, I barely know anything about Scientology.

There is so much disinformation in this thread about what Scientology actually is. I first read Dianetics in 1972 and was fascinated by the notion of a mental stimulus-response mechanism generated by a sub-conscious aspect of mind that occurs whenever pain and/or unconciousness weakens our concious mind generating an "engram" which is a mental image/ memory which can become activated/ empowered to affect our behavior/ reactions whenever similar circumstances occur as those that were connected to the source "incident". As one goes through life more and more "incidents" get "restimulated" and one falls into these reactive responses locking them into "who you are". These emotional responses to incidents of pain and/or lowered conciousness are stored in ones "reactive mind", and can and often do adversely affect our life as they rear their ugly head. What was discovered is that by bringing your full conciousness into these incidents and re-living them mentally that they would and do lose their power over you...you maintain full awareness during any future "restimulation" of the "engram", and thus not fall into the stimulus-response automatic programming behavior(s) which usually are very dangerous/ non-survival responses. These restimulations from our environment, accidents, fights, unconciousness etc., build up an "energetic imprint" in our physiology, in our nervous system which is able to be measured by electronic instrumentation, specifically by a device invented specifically to record and monitor the presence of these "reactive-mind recordings", and this device is known as an "e-meter" which is a key tool used by Dianetic and subsequently Scientology "auditors", one who listens and records what is going on with the one who is looking and describing what is going on in their mind, pictures they see, feelings, words, smells, sensations, and the whole storyline connected with this past incident that was located by the auditor asking a question, seeing the e-meter response to that question, listening to the person that is in the session seeking the causes of problems in their life. The auditor is prohibited from telling their "patient" what they think, they only ask questions to direct the session towards the goal of clarity and resolution of the incident so it loses its power over the person, ie "becomes flattened" has been "cleared" out of the reactive mind "bank". The auditor then asks if there is an earlier similar incident along a potential chain of incidents that empower each other. The e-meter guides the auditor to areas with a lot of electric charge/ a big "read" on the e-meter and then the person in session tells the auditor what they perceive about that incident, which usually comes up in layers, until they are clear as to what the incident was, come to a "cognition" a sudden realization as to how this incident has adversely affected their life, the e-meter displays a big release and the needle just floats(called a floating needle), the person is usually very happy, has more awareness, and usually the auditor tells them that the session is over, since they are too ecstatic to get back into the muck of the reactive mind. An auditing session can last for many hours or for 10 minutes, it goes on as long as it takes to resolve the "issue" that is the largest reading issue that was determined by its response to a list the auditor goes over. The largest "read"/ needle deviation directs the progress of the sessions on a given subject/ level you are working on, whether that is Life Repair, Drug rundowns, Levels 0 through 5, Clearing Course, or OT levels where the auditor becomes yourself, you operate the e-meter, ask the questions, answer the questions, observe what is going on and write it all down in your auditor notes, and end the session. There is a "Case Supervisor" who goes over your notes, e-meter readings etc., and directs/ guides you to avoid pitfalls, missed reads etc., and offers guidance in directing the subject of your next session.

Belief is NOT a legitimate part of being a Scientologist because L. Ron Hubbard said many times that he didn't want any Scientologist to believe a single thing he ever said, that if something was determined by the individual to be true and correct by their observations alone... that is the only way something can be ajudged as true...does it fit in with all of the observations you have experienced and seen with your own senses. It isn't a matter of belief!!!

I'll come back to explain more from my perspective about the real Scientology, not the made up pre-suppositions thrown about all over the internet.

Quoting: News from a Scientologist 26768822

Crikey! Dude, there's TRs in writing, too. Paragraphs!

There's some argument ouside fo the church's Standard Tech worshippers about several things you wrote- Listing and Nulling can be a huge negative for an individual case (for example)

The levels are all messed up for some people, and the arbitrary "one size fits all" doesn't seem to always work for individuals.

Does auditing/processing work? yes. Hell yes. That has nothing to do with LRH, Xenu, David Miscarraige, or whether your problems are internal or caused by entities that invaded you.

(it's a matter of perspective- entities means you can slowly aproach responsibility, which is a lot easier than owning it all at once!)

This forum is filled with people who have essentially restated the Scientology theory on their own, just using different terms.

This forum constantly accuses all sorts of people of being "demonically possessed". This forum constantly accuses all sorts of people of being "psychically controlled by evil entities" and "attacked by evil spirits". This forum constantly accuses all sorts of people of "doing the work of their alien masters" in all sorts of convoluted cosmic conspiracies.

Hubbard used a less classical form of terminology for these age-old concerns. Lovecraft, Crowley, the Freemasons, the Rosicrucians and other had their own terms for these phenomena and Scientology has theirs.

The difference? Scientology is freakin' richer than some world nations, and thus has the money and the willpower to investigate these phenomena.

I wouldn't automatically embrace all their specific beliefs just on someone's say-so, but neither would I discount anything about their theories either.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27373102

very well said.

where are all the ron hubtards anyway? i know quite a few of them who lurk on just about any conspiracy/newage/free-energy forum, to find morzels of truth... 't would be nice if one of them came out of the woodwork and told her or his story.

Tom Cruise will save the world from aliens — not on the big screen but in real life.

His day job as an actor pales next to the billion-year contract of service he signed with the Church of Scientology, according to a bombshell new book, “Going Clear: Scientology, Hollywood & The Prison of Belief.” New Yorker writer Lawrence Wright details Cruise’s demigod status within the church, as well as the group’s ultimate purpose — protect humanity from aliens living in our bodies, who are bent on destroying us and ultimately the planet.

how is that news :Dthe whole religion is based upon the suggestion that all humans have aliens souls attached and only by joining scientology can you rid yourself of these alien parasites, so all scientologists "are fighting aliens"

This forum is filled with people who have essentially restated the Scientology theory on their own, just using different terms.

This forum constantly accuses all sorts of people of being "demonically possessed". This forum constantly accuses all sorts of people of being "psychically controlled by evil entities" and "attacked by evil spirits". This forum constantly accuses all sorts of people of "doing the work of their alien masters" in all sorts of convoluted cosmic conspiracies.

Hubbard used a less classical form of terminology for these age-old concerns. Lovecraft, Crowley, the Freemasons, the Rosicrucians and other had their own terms for these phenomena and Scientology has theirs.

The difference? Scientology is freakin' richer than some world nations, and thus has the money and the willpower to investigate these phenomena.

I wouldn't automatically embrace all their specific beliefs just on someone's say-so, but neither would I discount anything about their theories either.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27373102

very well said.

where are all the ron hubtards anyway? i know quite a few of them who lurk on just about any conspiracy/newage/free-energy forum, to find morzels of truth... 't would be nice if one of them came out of the woodwork and told her or his story.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32098210

Can't help you there. I have never been in the Church, but have a psych education background and am a "squirrel" - I use and develop some of the counseling technnologies and so on.

I've spent some time over the past decade+ researching history and authorship/research of the whole subject.

Tom Cruise will save the world from aliens — not on the big screen but in real life.

His day job as an actor pales next to the billion-year contract of service he signed with the Church of Scientology, according to a bombshell new book, “Going Clear: Scientology, Hollywood & The Prison of Belief.” New Yorker writer Lawrence Wright details Cruise’s demigod status within the church, as well as the group’s ultimate purpose — protect humanity from aliens living in our bodies, who are bent on destroying us and ultimately the planet.

how is that news :Dthe whole religion is based upon the suggestion that all humans have aliens souls attached and only by joining scientology can you rid yourself of these alien parasites, so all scientologists "are fighting aliens"

Quoting: Michael_

Not.

The entities issue is one that the CHURCH and STANDARD TECH push as reality at advanced levels, but which not everyone in the church actualy buys into.

Its common for free practitioners (not in the church) to ignore the body thetans/entities as such. The idea of body thetans is a useful map for getting a handle on things (or parts of yourself) you aren't ready to confront head on yet. so it's not invalid.

I don't really care what they believe, it's nothing more silly than any other religious belief. Scientology is a fucking scary organization though, they peddle medical and scientific quackery that does more damage than good. Look at how they treat their women and children... And remember don't talk bad about Scientology everyone, they'll sue you out of your home and have your kids on the street in no time.

Everyone has read that. have you read *anything else*? or tried anything ?

clambake is oppositionally EQUALLY as slanted as LRH's stuff.

While I realize and accept that objectivity isn't possible in humans, you can get a lot closer than xenu net

The first several chapters of ken ogger's (the pilot) stuff in superscio is worth looking at, though the practical side you won't get a lot out of without some practical background (clearbird CT course for that)

several early issues of an old magazine called the aberee are available online, which provide a lot of background. one of the ex scio boards has several threads explaining history and who wrote what and what works (a lot involve alan walters)

Everyone has read that. have you read *anything else*? or tried anything ?

clambake is oppositionally EQUALLY as slanted as LRH's stuff.

While I realize and accept that objectivity isn't possible in humans, you can get a lot closer than xenu net

The first several chapters of ken ogger's (the pilot) stuff in superscio is worth looking at, though the practical side you won't get a lot out of without some practical background (clearbird CT course for that)

several early issues of an old magazine called the aberee are available online, which provide a lot of background. one of the ex scio boards has several threads explaining history and who wrote what and what works (a lot involve alan walters)

Go look up SOMETHING besides propaganda- pro or con

Quoting: not anyone special

What you're pushing is propaganda. You've been swindled, TRUE knowledge isn't bought with millions of dollars. You've just fattened the pockets of swindlers.

Everyone has read that. have you read *anything else*? or tried anything ?

clambake is oppositionally EQUALLY as slanted as LRH's stuff.

While I realize and accept that objectivity isn't possible in humans, you can get a lot closer than xenu net

The first several chapters of ken ogger's (the pilot) stuff in superscio is worth looking at, though the practical side you won't get a lot out of without some practical background (clearbird CT course for that)

several early issues of an old magazine called the aberee are available online, which provide a lot of background. one of the ex scio boards has several threads explaining history and who wrote what and what works (a lot involve alan walters)

Go look up SOMETHING besides propaganda- pro or con

Quoting: not anyone special

What you're pushing is propaganda. You've been swindled, TRUE knowledge isn't bought with millions of dollars. You've just fattened the pockets of swindlers.

Yes, scientology is very dangerous indeed. I never for the life of me would expect Scientologists on this web board. Nazi-sympathizers were to be expected but not L Ron's sheeple.

Quoting: jadksn 32181299

Allow me to reiterate. I have NEVER been in the church of scientology.

My background is psychology (oh yeah, and mysticism)- and I make use of FREE (as in liberty) developments of some of the technology. I do not idolize hubbard and don't honestly have much respect for him, though i have tons for various people who worked with him over the years.

I have found a lot of the history, from the church and from the clambake/exkids/ex smb to be full of bogons.

It is my stated and firm opinion that the Church of Scientology as it stands today is part of a conspracy to DENY the brain change technologies to the human populace.

There is so much disinformation in this thread about what Scientology actually is. I first read Dianetics in 1972 and was fascinated by the notion of a mental stimulus-response mechanism generated by a sub-conscious aspect of mind that occurs whenever pain and/or unconciousness weakens our concious mind generating an "engram" which is a mental image/ memory which can become activated/ empowered to affect our behavior/ reactions whenever similar circumstances occur as those that were connected to the source "incident". As one goes through life more and more "incidents" get "restimulated" and one falls into these reactive responses locking them into "who you are". These emotional responses to incidents of pain and/or lowered conciousness are stored in ones "reactive mind", and can and often do adversely affect our life as they rear their ugly head. What was discovered is that by bringing your full conciousness into these incidents and re-living them mentally that they would and do lose their power over you...you maintain full awareness during any future "restimulation" of the "engram", and thus not fall into the stimulus-response automatic programming behavior(s) which usually are very dangerous/ non-survival responses. These restimulations from our environment, accidents, fights, unconciousness etc., build up an "energetic imprint" in our physiology, in our nervous system which is able to be measured by electronic instrumentation, specifically by a device invented specifically to record and monitor the presence of these "reactive-mind recordings", and this device is known as an "e-meter" which is a key tool used by Dianetic and subsequently Scientology "auditors", one who listens and records what is going on with the one who is looking and describing what is going on in their mind, pictures they see, feelings, words, smells, sensations, and the whole storyline connected with this past incident that was located by the auditor asking a question, seeing the e-meter response to that question, listening to the person that is in the session seeking the causes of problems in their life. The auditor is prohibited from telling their "patient" what they think, they only ask questions to direct the session towards the goal of clarity and resolution of the incident so it loses its power over the person, ie "becomes flattened" has been "cleared" out of the reactive mind "bank". The auditor then asks if there is an earlier similar incident along a potential chain of incidents that empower each other. The e-meter guides the auditor to areas with a lot of electric charge/ a big "read" on the e-meter and then the person in session tells the auditor what they perceive about that incident, which usually comes up in layers, until they are clear as to what the incident was, come to a "cognition" a sudden realization as to how this incident has adversely affected their life, the e-meter displays a big release and the needle just floats(called a floating needle), the person is usually very happy, has more awareness, and usually the auditor tells them that the session is over, since they are too ecstatic to get back into the muck of the reactive mind. An auditing session can last for many hours or for 10 minutes, it goes on as long as it takes to resolve the "issue" that is the largest reading issue that was determined by its response to a list the auditor goes over. The largest "read"/ needle deviation directs the progress of the sessions on a given subject/ level you are working on, whether that is Life Repair, Drug rundowns, Levels 0 through 5, Clearing Course, or OT levels where the auditor becomes yourself, you operate the e-meter, ask the questions, answer the questions, observe what is going on and write it all down in your auditor notes, and end the session. There is a "Case Supervisor" who goes over your notes, e-meter readings etc., and directs/ guides you to avoid pitfalls, missed reads etc., and offers guidance in directing the subject of your next session.

Belief is NOT a legitimate part of being a Scientologist because L. Ron Hubbard said many times that he didn't want any Scientologist to believe a single thing he ever said, that if something was determined by the individual to be true and correct by their observations alone... that is the only way something can be ajudged as true...does it fit in with all of the observations you have experienced and seen with your own senses. It isn't a matter of belief!!!

I'll come back to explain more from my perspective about the real Scientology, not the made up pre-suppositions thrown about all over the internet.

Quoting: News from a Scientologist 26768822

I'm glad someone had enough knowledge to intelligently post about scientology, I believe we were lacking in this information. Helped me to much better understand scientology, I try to keep an open mind regardless of how ridiculous something sounds, there are always unaccounted for variables.

Everyone has read that. have you read *anything else*? or tried anything ?

clambake is oppositionally EQUALLY as slanted as LRH's stuff.

While I realize and accept that objectivity isn't possible in humans, you can get a lot closer than xenu net

The first several chapters of ken ogger's (the pilot) stuff in superscio is worth looking at, though the practical side you won't get a lot out of without some practical background (clearbird CT course for that)

several early issues of an old magazine called the aberee are available online, which provide a lot of background. one of the ex scio boards has several threads explaining history and who wrote what and what works (a lot involve alan walters)

Go look up SOMETHING besides propaganda- pro or con

Quoting: not anyone special

What you're pushing is propaganda. You've been swindled, TRUE knowledge isn't bought with millions of dollars. You've just fattened the pockets of swindlers.

Yes, scientology is very dangerous indeed. I never for the life of me would expect Scientologists on this web board. Nazi-sympathizers were to be expected but not L Ron's sheeple.

Quoting: jadksn 32181299

Allow me to reiterate. I have NEVER been in the church of scientology.

My background is psychology (oh yeah, and mysticism)- and I make use of FREE (as in liberty) developments of some of the technology. I do not idolize hubbard and don't honestly have much respect for him, though i have tons for various people who worked with him over the years.

I have found a lot of the history, from the church and from the clambake/exkids/ex smb to be full of bogons.

It is my stated and firm opinion that the Church of Scientology as it stands today is part of a conspracy to DENY the brain change technologies to the human populace.

Quoting: not anyone special

I like this line of thought, no one would give credit to any subject that had to do with scientology.

Tom Cruise will save the world from aliens — not on the big screen but in real life.

His day job as an actor pales next to the billion-year contract of service he signed with the Church of Scientology, according to a bombshell new book, “Going Clear: Scientology, Hollywood & The Prison of Belief.” New Yorker writer Lawrence Wright details Cruise’s demigod status within the church, as well as the group’s ultimate purpose — protect humanity from aliens living in our bodies, who are bent on destroying us and ultimately the planet.

how is that news :Dthe whole religion is based upon the suggestion that all humans have aliens souls attached and only by joining scientology can you rid yourself of these alien parasites, so all scientologists "are fighting aliens"

Quoting: Michael_

Not.

The entities issue is one that the CHURCH and STANDARD TECH push as reality at advanced levels, but which not everyone in the church actualy buys into.

Its common for free practitioners (not in the church) to ignore the body thetans/entities as such. The idea of body thetans is a useful map for getting a handle on things (or parts of yourself) you aren't ready to confront head on yet. so it's not invalid.

But it's also not the BASIS of Scientology.

Quoting: not anyone special

No perhaps the wording was a bit harsh.what concept do they push at low level? join and rise in the ranks or levels to meet the celebrities? :)

Im sorry to be so up front and judgemental, but that usually brings out the truth from others :D

Did Hubbard make all this scientology shit up and pull it out of his arse?Where did it all come from?

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1103018

It came from the book Scientologie, from Freudian analysis, from the tao te ching, from zen related martial arts practices. From Crowley, from Claude Bristol- from everywhere.

Campbell was the first to describe the religion basis as it pproovides a method to sidestep the medical guilds. Creative processing was developed by someone else, the meter was develoed by someone else. Hubbard "put things together" in ownership and economic/control terms.