I'd never heard about that. Ensemble Modern? Was it like a memorial service? Not as an actual memorial, more along the lines of it being a somber affair. Did the Zappa's attend?

It was a normal concert, not a memorial service or anything else like that. It was with the Ensemble Modern, there was other music on the program but for some reason i cannot remember what, maybe Varese And Nancarrow, can anyone else remember????

Having noticed that folks bring forth dialogue of the character roles in the production..... Keep checking back to the SouthBank Centre Frank Zappa:200 Motels Page for any potential update of program info.... and but also expect some more of the unexpected come showtime.

......It's been a long wait, yet some folks in some social circles are mistaken when they state that the LA event is not a world première. Not to take anything away from the UK either but folks should not mistakenly think that the 200 Motels 13 Suites performance in Amsterdam back in 2000 was the full enchilada with all the hot sauce.

_________________Trendmonger's Moment Of Clarity

FZ "Read It And Weep"
April 17,1981

Frank Zappa left the ZFT in Control of his Vaults and Artistic rights.
We the fans are not in control. We have a choice to use our eyes and ears or read it and weep.

Having noticed that folks bring forth dialogue of the character roles in the production..... Keep checking back to the SouthBank Centre Frank Zappa:200 Motels Page for any potential update of program info.... and but also expect some more of the unexpected come showtime.

......It's been a long wait, yet some folks in some social circles are mistaken when they state that the LA event is not a world première. Not to take anything away from the UK either but folks should not mistakenly think that the 200 Motels 13 Suites performance in Amsterdam back in 2000 was the full enchilada with all the hot sauce.

What is the "true" world premiere will always be a matter of subjective definition. And honestly, does it matter? No.

Having noticed that folks bring forth dialogue of the character roles in the production..... Keep checking back to the SouthBank Centre Frank Zappa:200 Motels Page for any potential update of program info.... and but also expect some more of the unexpected come showtime.

......It's been a long wait, yet some folks in some social circles are mistaken when they state that the LA event is not a world première. Not to take anything away from the UK either but folks should not mistakenly think that the 200 Motels 13 Suites performance in Amsterdam back in 2000 was the full enchilada with all the hot sauce.

What is the "true" world premiere will always be a matter of subjective definition. And honestly, does it matter? No.

Quite so: I think we're all agreed that the upcoming US & UK productions will be pretty damn amazing.

Having noticed that folks bring forth dialogue of the character roles in the production..... Keep checking back to the SouthBank Centre Frank Zappa:200 Motels Page for any potential update of program info.... and but also expect some more of the unexpected come showtime.

......It's been a long wait, yet some folks in some social circles are mistaken when they state that the LA event is not a world première. Not to take anything away from the UK either but folks should not mistakenly think that the 200 Motels 13 Suites performance in Amsterdam back in 2000 was the full enchilada with all the hot sauce.

What is the "true" world premiere will always be a matter of subjective definition. And honestly, does it matter? No.

At times fans and critics tend to get far too subjective with the composers work. In pertaining to Franks orchestral score for 200 Motels we should keep an open mind of accepting this is a world premiere. History of the movie, 2LP, True Story of 200 Motels film, LA Philharmonic Contempo 1970 and 200 Motels : The 13 Suites that was held in 2000 in Amsterdam are very much piece meal.

Let's look at the book ends of the live orchestral performances and see how that fits in.

First LA Philharmonic Contempo 1970 conducted by Zubin Mehta. There was not even a group The Mothers Of Invention when the LA Philharmonic project was in the making. The Mothers had disbanded close to a year beforehand. Based on FZs commentary in The Real Frank Zappa Book it seems more-so the LA Phil wanted the rock band/orchestra event than Frank had. Frank may very well have wanted the event to be orchestral but anyhow, Frank quickly put a "Mothers-Of-Invention-Sort-Of-Group" together. As far as what score existed? The character roles were not finalized at this point. Of note Mark Volman and Howard Kayland met FZ backstage after the concert and informed FZ they liked the show and that The Turtles had split. The point being here is that Frank had orchestral scores he had written over the years and the frame-work of touring on the road for 5 years was very much part of the story of 200 Motels.

By the time filming started Frank had several hundred pages of a shooting manuscript. How much of the 200 plus pages is actual orchestral score manuscript is hard for the observer to make a call on but character roles are very much a part of the score. So much of that shooting manuscript never made it into the films.

"Danger Will Robinson"..... For the sake of keeping things simplified in this post there is no need to over-anaylze each and every character role but it is clear that 200 Motels : 13 Suites in Amsterdam back in 2000 was not the entire orchestral enchilada with the hot sauce. Frank's commentary in The Real Frank Zappa Book should also raise an eyebrow as to the initial intent of not even having a rock band as part of the 200 Motels Contempo 70 performance. Sure there is some rocking out on the 2LP and films but the orchestral score may very well deservedly be adapted to focus on the orchestral elements and character roles.

_________________Trendmonger's Moment Of Clarity

FZ "Read It And Weep"
April 17,1981

Frank Zappa left the ZFT in Control of his Vaults and Artistic rights.
We the fans are not in control. We have a choice to use our eyes and ears or read it and weep.

At times fans and critics tend to get far too subjective with the composers work. In pertaining to Franks orchestral score for 200 Motels we should keep an open mind of accepting this is a world premiere. . . .Frank's commentary in The Real Frank Zappa Book should also raise an eyebrow as to the initial intent of not even having a rock band as part of the 200 Motels Contempo 70 performance. Sure there is some rocking out on the 2LP and films but the orchestral score may very well deservedly be adapted to focus on the orchestral elements and character roles.

Aren't you being too subjective yourself? Since Zappa is not around to declare his intentions, I am not so interested in the "premiere" aspect. It is a bit meaningless. When did Zappa premiere "Inca Roads"? Does the vocal version count here (Duke et al)? Was it not intended first as an instrumental (Duke, Ponty et al)? Or even before that as something else (Flo, Eddie et al)?. And so on, and on. Zappa evolved.

The important thing is that Zappa's music is played. "Strictly Genteel", btw, also recently got its world premiere in a version for 6-piece rock band (by ZPZ with only 4-5 melodic instruments in play).

The forthcoming UK premiere was mentioned on radio 4 this morning just before the 8 o'clock news "Over 40 years since it was originally banned by the Albert Hall....." I knew straight away what it was about. They then played a snippet of that tight assed old woman who objected to the lyrics.....I got to work before the end of the headlines so didn't hear what else they had to say about it but it's always great to hear "Frank Zappa" on the radio. Especially in Sarah Montague's voice.....

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