I just read the FAQ and I had two additional questions. If I enter the pre-sale lottery and do not get a ticket at the $420 price, I understand that I will be entered into the main sale for the three tiers. Does the limit of 2 tickets per tier still apply if I apply for 4 tickets in the pre-sale? Also, does that mean that I will pay the lower main sale prices instead of the $420 for the pre-sale if selected in the main sale?

@acapturedheart3 - It's not two tickets per tier in the Main Sale, it's two tickets at any tier (as in total of two tickets). If you had registered for 4 tickets on the pre-sale but were not successful, your registration would automatically be carried forward for the main sale (for up to two tickets, as per the limit of the main sale). And to answer the last question, yes, in that scenario you would only be charged for the pricing tier that you were awarded at ($240, $320, or $390), and not the re-sale price of $420.

Good to know all this. So at the very worst, I will know whether I have a ticket by March. I think we can all deal with that.

Now I have to decide whether to do the presale or not.

I'd also like to see more about the secondary sales system. Would this allow transfer of tickets electronically before the June distribution, cause that would also help ameliorate the concern about not getting one.

So even if I were to register for 4 tickets (and thus be willing to pay $420/ticket to ensure that my party can go) in the pre-sale and do not get chosen, I will only be eligible for 2 tickets TOTAL in the main sale? So that means if I am unlucky in the pre-sale and "lucky" in the main sale, I will still lose 2 members of my party, and gain two tickets that I can't use because I need the rest of my party to split costs for the cross country travel (3 day trip). And to top it all off, the system will only allow me to register once and it does not allow me to purchase tickets in any other sale (including the post sale). This was supposed to be my first trip to Burning Man and now it looks like I may not even have a chance to go. So much for radical inclusion.

@VultureChow - if you're registering for the Main Sale and ticking all three boxes (for all three pricing tiers), it's very likely you'll know by the beginning of February. I do not expect the secondary sales system to allow for transferring/sale of tickets before tickets are fulfilled in June 2012.

@acapturedheart3 - if you're unsuccessful in the pre-sale, you'll know by December 19th, and you should hopefully be able to make arrangements for another member of your party to register in the Main sale for two additional tickets.

acapturedheart3 wrote:So even if I were to register for 4 tickets (and thus be willing to pay $420/ticket to ensure that my party can go) in the pre-sale and do not get chosen, I will only be eligible for 2 tickets TOTAL in the main sale? So that means if I am unlucky in the pre-sale and "lucky" in the main sale, I will still lose 2 members of my party, and gain two tickets that I can't use because I need the rest of my party to split costs for the cross country travel (3 day trip). And to top it all off, the system will only allow me to register once and it does not allow me to purchase tickets in any other sale (including the post sale). This was supposed to be my first trip to Burning Man and now it looks like I may not even have a chance to go. So much for radical inclusion.

I think I follow your question -- why would you not suggest one of the other two members of the party a.) enter the January round or b.) buy two more on the open sale?

- Access to the lower tiers has always been a bit of a gamble on Day 1 (when there are always more people than cheaper tickets).... this just makes it a little bit more rational to attempt to get them- We always limit the cheaper tiers to 2 to discourage overbuying and selling above face outside of the community- It usually takes many many months for this many tickets to sell, and not everyone is 100% guaranteed to be ready in January. We think the odds will pan out for everyone.

I can't speak for the ticket vendor, but I suppose the option exists to require people to opt back IN to lottery 2, rather than rolling in automatically. I'm under the impression though that most would want to stay on the ride. The only thing is that you've lost your option to buy 4 when you were willing to do so...and can't opt out if you don't want to win so that you get a crack at 4 tickets on open sale...but by then I think I'd just get a second buyer to get my other two tickets on the open sale so I'd get a chance at the 2 lower tiers.

If I put in for the max of 2 tickets at all 3 price points, how is it decided what I'll pay? Is that random too? Or do they just take everyone's highest pay point and charge them that amount? Perhaps I'm cynical but it's hard to see leaving $150 per ticket on the table if someone is willing to pay it.

Also, if my wife and I both put in for tickets, will they see the same address and last name and assume we're trying to scam the system and deny both of our applications?

Wow, I must be feeling particular cynical and paranoid this morning.

-Little Jack

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I like my coffee like I like my women: strong, earthy and full bodied!

LittleJack wrote:I have read the FAQ, and still have a couple of questions:

If I put in for the max of 2 tickets at all 3 price points, how is it decided what I'll pay? Is that random too? Or do they just take everyone's highest pay point and charge them that amount? Perhaps I'm cynical but it's hard to see leaving $150 per ticket on the table if someone is willing to pay it.

Also, if my wife and I both put in for tickets, will they see the same address and last name and assume we're trying to scam the system and deny both of our applications?

Wow, I must be feeling particular cynical and paranoid this morning.

-Little Jack

i dont see how the choice occurs for which tier a person gets (or not) matters.. other than just wanting to know, how does it matter? youll either get a ticket or not.. at one of the price points you chose..

1) Borg should post typical shipping/delivery charges for US and non-US. It would suck to get a ticket, but then lose it because someone's pre-paid card was $5 short

2) Can I assume that if you don't get a ticket in the 420 pre-sale, you would then be entered in the $390 tier? Or do you have a chance at a $240 ticket? Are these tiers entered by your ability to pay or random selection ?

1) Borg should post typical shipping/delivery charges for US and non-US. It would suck to get a ticket, but then lose it because someone's pre-paid card was $5 short

2) Can I assume that if you don't get a ticket in the 420 pre-sale, you would then be entered in the $390 tier? Or do you have a chance at a $240 ticket? Are these tiers entered by your ability to pay or random selection ?

if i recall correctly international orders are not shipped at all, for any price.

shipping/handling of the tracked orders is usually about $12

you would know this when you ordered it as it would be included in the invoice/subtotal..

I'll ping someone to confirm the rates and ask to have that put on the site asap. At the very latest, the fees will be posted by the time registration for the pre-sale opens (and remember, registration will be open for a 2 week window). I believe lemur's right, shipping for domestic orders was $12 in 2011. Will call has no charge. All international orders must be done via will-call.

UPDATED!Will call and domestic shipping is $12. Canadian orders may be shipped at a cost of $29, all other orders outside the US must be done via will call. Service fees have not yet been finalized, which is why that info has not yet been posted on the main site. Once that's locked down, expect the site to be updated.

It matters to those poor unfortunates to whom $300 is a significant amount of money (difference between highest and lowest tier is $150 x 2 tickets). I also think it would be interesting to know why I'm being charged what I'm being charged. If it's just the maximum amount, then why put in for any lower tier at all?

As for why we'd both put in for tickets, it would be a hedging of our bets. Better chances of each of us getting a ticket if we both apply for 2. If we both get a pair, I really don't think it would be a problem to resell or gift a extra ticket or two - I have a feeling there will be those looking for tickets come June or July.

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I like my coffee like I like my women: strong, earthy and full bodied!

So... here's my plan. I'm going to play it straight and trust it will all work out

I'll register for one ticket. I won't enlist friends and family to try and get multiple entries. I'lll register for the presale. It's more than I had budgeted for a ticket, but I can afford it, so I'll chalk it up to subsidizing lower tiers.

If it happens, it happens. If not, Spain is lovely and the Euro should be tanking with Italy, Greece and Portugal debt concerns.

@littlejack - each tier is drawn for separately (my understanding is they're drawn lowest to highest). So if you check all three boxes and get awarded 2 tix at tier 1, you'd get charged the tier 1 price and be ineligible to get tickets at tier 2 or tier 3 (because you'd already hit your 2 ticket limit). Charged at the tier that you were selected in, not automatically at your max price. One registration per person, and you can not use the same credit card. Otherwise you should be okay, I'll see if I can get some additional clarification.

@Key Man - you can check one, two, or three ticket tiers. You will be charged for whichever tier you get awarded tickets in. And yes, tickets are transferrable (as they have been in previous years).

@jkisha - you can check one, two, or three ticket tiers. If you're willing to pay any price check all three boxes. You will be charged for whichever tier you get awarded tickets in. If you're in great financial shape and are willing and able to abstain from one of the lower tier drawings to help out those who have less, you can do that too.EDIT - I was totally wrong about that last bit, you can not 'opt out' of the lower tiers.

@VultureChow - life's full of chances, but with the level of advance planning and preparation you're at, you're way ahead of the game.

trilobyte wrote:@VultureChow - life's full of chances, but with the level of advance planning and preparation you're at, you're way ahead of the game.

Yeah, I'm not worrying now. The original rlease had me concerned that they were going to draw this out until June or July which would make planning plane ticket, rental car etc. difficult if not impossible for me. The absolute outside date is now March, assuming you don't get picked anywhere else.

Now I'm calm. I still wish the official secondary market would allow electronic tranfer of tickets before fulfillment. I think it would address some of the issues that may occur by people entering the lottery multiple times. But we can't have everything.

Though I would approve of a moritorium on the phrase "So much for radical inclusion" or other variations of it.

@jkisha - you can check one, two, or three ticket tiers. If you're willing to pay any price check all three boxes. You will be charged for whichever tier you get awarded tickets in. If you're in great financial shape and are willing and able to abstain from one of the lower tier drawings to help out those who have less, you can do that too.

@jkisha - you can check one, two, or three ticket tiers. If you're willing to pay any price check all three boxes. You will be charged for whichever tier you get awarded tickets in. If you're in great financial shape and are willing and able to abstain from one of the lower tier drawings to help out those who have less, you can do that too.

I'm sure he can afford to cut his chances by 2/3's

Yep, i'm entering every freaking drawing there is. As are most people i've checked in with.

When the only tool you got is a hammer, every problem looks like a hippie.

Mmmmmm I love the smell of Burning Man - Token

Getting overly dramatic about the ticket sale process is so 2012. - Maladroit

@jkisha - you can check one, two, or three ticket tiers. If you're willing to pay any price check all three boxes. You will be charged for whichever tier you get awarded tickets in. If you're in great financial shape and are willing and able to abstain from one of the lower tier drawings to help out those who have less, you can do that too.

I'm sure he can afford to cut his chances by 2/3's

Yep, i'm entering every freaking drawing there is. As are most people i've checked in with.

I did not get to go last year and saved the money.. So I can bid higher this year..I will have to bid in all three tiers to improve my odds.. This is cutting the low income folks by the same odds as I improve.. Guess that is how you get to the top oof the pile. By stepping on some ones head..

@unjonharley - It's a bit less than that (since the lowest tier is only 10K tickets), but yeah there's an element of risk. The whole thing seems weighted heavily in favor of those who are planning ahead. Those waiting until after tickets go on open sale could end up with nothing, then have to chance finding extra tickets in the after-market.EDIT - I was totally wrong about that last bit (and my earlier comment back to jkisha. You can not opt out of lower tiers.

Jewel Man wrote:Jesus, BMORG! Why don't you just claw my eyes out while you are at it? You bumped up the ticket prices way up. Talk about scalping I hope you are doubling the port-a-potties.

The tier ticket prices are up by no more than they have ever increased year to year. The low income is the same. The presale is higher, but that's been a given since they began it a couple years back, same or higher than gate tickets when they had them.

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