If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

In archeology and history, we've created a terminology of 'stone age,' 'bronze age,' 'iron age' etc. to refer to the level of technological advancement of a society. Similarly, Nikolai Kardashev developed a scale of technological development based on the amount of energy a civilization is able to utilize. He distinguished three different types of civilizations, calling them Type i, Type II and Type III civilizations. Some years ago, Michio Kaku revised Kardashev's typology, noting that the civilizations Kardashev identified would not rely on non-renewable energy, and that therefore, we haven't even reached the level yet of a Type I Civilization. He called us a Type 0 Civilization who relies on depletable energy sources.

Where am I going with this?

One of the reasons for war is necessity. The economic and energetic needs of a Type 0 Civilizations are greater (in the sense of harder to be met) than those of technologically more advanced civilizations, because they rely on depletable resources, which - be definiton - run out, and have to be replenished. Type 0 Civilizations are therefore more prone to intervention, and by consequence, to war.
If you look at the past history of extraterrestrial intervention, as described in mythologies worldwide, many of those interventions fit that pattern.

Even the Greys seem to be driven by necessity more than anything else. There are numerous stories that they would need human DNA to ensure their survival.

Necessity is of course not the only reason for war. One look at our history shows that wars have not only been fought over resources, but also for far more personal reasons (which is what Fore hinted at): greed, jealousy, the lust for power, or even plain, simple lust: The Trojan Wars allegedly were fought because of a love triangle!
And we actually see plenty of that, as well, in our mythologies, when it comes to our extraterrestrial visitors. Plenty are the stories of gods fighting one another for the most petty of reasons, which have nothing to do anymore with necessity.

It is good to know we have something in common with our galactic neighbors. Now if only I could steal their light saber... (A reference to "star wars")

For every action, there is a corresponding over-reaction. -- Anonymous

I'll go out on a limb and suggest that some of what aliens have told us has been tailored to meet our scientific and cultural expectations. The hot items of the 40s-60s were nuclear power, DNA, cloning. So coincidentally we get a story that the Grays destroyed their planet through nuclear war, and/or ruined themselves from too many generations of cloning.

Nano-technology didn't come into mainstream consciousness until the mid 1980s, and you don't hear much from aliens (in mainstream UFOlogy literature, as far as I know) about them using nanotechnology or having suffered a grey-goo scenario in their past, which is just as much a threat as nuclear disaster.

So I wonder, why does the backstory of the Grays resonate so much with only a 10-20 year slice of human technological history, when it could just as well have resonated with technology of 1800-1900s (gunpowder, steam, vacuum tubes) had they shown up back then, or 2500 (tech we can't even imagine right now).

Originally Posted by Garuda

Similarly, Nikolai Kardashev developed a scale of technological development based on the amount of energy a civilization is able to utilize. He distinguished three different types of civilizations, calling them Type i, Type II and Type III civilizations. Some years ago, Michio Kaku revised Kardashev's typology, noting that the civilizations Kardashev identified would not rely on non-renewable energy, and that therefore, we haven't even reached the level yet of a Type I Civilization. He called us a Type 0 Civilization who relies on depletable energy sources.

Where am I going with this?

One of the reasons for war is necessity. The economic and energetic needs of a Type 0 Civilizations are greater (in the sense of harder to be met) than those of technologically more advanced civilizations, because they rely on depletable resources, which - be definiton - run out, and have to be replenished. Type 0 Civilizations are therefore more prone to intervention, and by consequence, to war.
If you look at the past history of extraterrestrial intervention, as described in mythologies worldwide, many of those interventions fit that pattern.

Definitely agree about fighting over resources. But what kind of resources, that's the question. The Kardashev scale needs to include energies, energy sources, and resources beyond the physical.

What do you call a civilization that uses electrical power equivalent to that of the United States, but actively harvests and consumes the life force / soul energy of 284 star systems? Type 0? Type II?

What if they discovered that technology has its limits, and instead developed their consciousness to a point where like Q in Star Trek they can re-engineer reality without needing to expend or consume any physical energy?

What if compliance, submission, freewill is itself a kind of resource? And wars are fought over the compliance of a target population toward either of competing agendas?

So I think the Kardashev scale ought to be expanded to include the quantum and metaphysical aspects of reality. Then I think what aliens do, would make even more sense.

I mean, at least we have an excuse as human beings. We are ignorant of so many things that we are "what we are". But what justification do beings starting "a war in heaven" have when they live in (one supposes) near perfect paradise and access to every kind of knowledge and truth and comfort.

Must be the few remaining thing they can't have, despite having everything else. Unbridled independence, freedom, adventure, power, and superiority. Or maybe because they weren't at the very tip top, they didn't know every last reason for why the infinite Creator makes certain choices, and in their ignorance and lack of trust they could have disagreed with a higher directive, thought it unfair or unnecessary, etc. and eventually grown resentful enough in order to start a war. That archetype ripples down the scale, down to kids rebelling against parents, forum members disagreeing with moderator actions, shortsighted voters rebelling against benevolent leaders who make short term sacrifices for long term prosperity, etc.

This reminds me of the discussions about Science Fiction following the Zeitgeist, that is featuring the cutting edge technology of the time in which it is written and usually the themes are related to the hot issues of the times. Skynet in The Terminator is a good example, as are all the atomic monster movies in the 1950s, fallout mutants after Chernobyl, Avatar and economic colonialism, the list goes on and on. In spite of Tolkien's nemerous denials many critics insist the Lord of the Rings Trilogy is about the rise of Nazism. The idea goes back at least the Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, written in 1818 using the science of her day and the issues of her husband and family, which featured a rejection of the Industrial Age and a return to nature and pure emotion, among other things.

Bearing that in mind it makes me wonder if the War in the Heavens is about Zeitgeist issues or only influenced by them such as: Is the war really about what they say it is supposed to be about? Is it our interpretation in the light of our current Zeitgeist? Or is it being explained to us in terms of the Zeitgeist to make it understandable but in fact about something else?

You may not think it is related at first glance....but it has a method type that I have seen before in non-terrestrial circles.

Including different kinds of tests and experiments at turning off certain neurological features during tests to see the different outcomes. While they don't use magnetic stimulation as this theory does, they could [very] conceivably use a more advanced method that can be (in theory at least) applied over a wider geographical region with "node" level accuracy. (Individual accuracy)

In some experiments the ET conducted they turned off certain feature for moments at a time while they adjusted non-physical features. I personally experienced situations where my mind wasn't able to comprehend spoken (audioable) language. Even though I have heard the words hundreds of times. At other points they turned off momentarily the features that allowed me to recognize a human facial features. (It was very weird, it was like staring at something that didn't give you any insights as to what it was. While looking at the visible appearance of someone you couldn't or didn't recognize them...as if a critical neurological feature just stopped working temporarily and didn't give you any insights.

Other experiments were about "importing" non-physical information about various foreign languages and letting the information seep into the normal operations of a human mind. So when you heard foreign speech you can distinguish the meaning behind words but not generate the same phonetic intricacies of a foreign language.

Anyway, it's a video that is aptly related to this thread....and any future ET Contact scenario which may or may not employ techniques "like" these.

The one in the video is a much simpler version (in appearance and application) with a much more mundane type of technology and application.

Last edited by Fore; 10-17-2013 at 01:12 AM.

For every action, there is a corresponding over-reaction. -- Anonymous

Everyone brought up some really good points. This is just a few things that came to mind:

Are these Loka worlds merely astral realms, or are they actual planetary civilizations?

The better question is – Is there a difference?

Depends on the inhabitants. Some humans have access to astral realms and interact with etheric/astral energies in their normal lives whil some people don't notice it at all. But there are astral and physical realms intermeshed in our reality.

I think there are different worlds or planets for all kinds of imaginable experiences of life. I always like the TV show Reboot where they jump into different computer games within the supercomputer- each one has it's own rules, limitations and sets of players and your form changes according to what world you're in but you're still 'you'. There is a 'phase 2' of Gnosis sent in to nullify the viruses. Many cool concepts similar to the Matrix before that movie was released. The writer must've known what he was talking about...

So whoever worships another – meaning any other being on this earth or from the myriad denizens of the Invisible Realms, gods, angels, or ETs – his energy becomes ‘sacrificial’ food for that entity.

I wonder how this works with logos. 'Logos' in a way could mean 'name of god', so we are 'branded' like cattle with the name of our god/master. If my UnderArmour hat has the star-of-david/Saturnian hex does that automatically give my energy to the beings associated with that symbol? Or can I cancel it out with awareness and my intent to not support parasitical beings? I prefer clothes without logos but usually branded clothing is the best quality.

Lift up the ‘curtain of each atom’ and you will find your SELF. When you realize your Oneness with That, the God-with that simultaneously dwells within All, you will be amazed at how powerful the Illusion had to be to delude you into the temporal idea of Separation from the One

At first this sounds like cheesy new age rhetoric. But I think it makes sense because the more evolved people are more caring or empathetic of others, as if they're tuning into the truth of their deeper nature that everyone is connected. Some rational people say that there is no such thing as 'oneness' and it is the individual self that is important but that seems to lean toward selfish/Satanic thinking.

'Oneness' is an easy sell to people with comfortable lives but not so much to an abused person. I don't know if it's a useful thing to dwell on, sure we're all made of the same atoms...doesn't mean we should love killers, that won't get us too far. Thinking of a higher power, 'God' is a useful belief because it forces you to always strive for something better, more evolved and positive, so long as it is a 'loving' God. I think 'Oneness' is overly used.

I mean, at least we have an excuse as human beings. We are ignorant of so many things that we are "what we are". But what justification do beings starting "a war in heaven" have when they live in (one supposes) near perfect paradise and access to every kind of knowledge and truth and comfort.

It's hard to believe. I like the Gnostic myth of Sophia, the galactic goddess. She got curious and decided to experience physical life and so manifested as spiritual beings and the earth as a part of her, but also accidentally created the Archons which aren' spiritually connected to her. So maybe some beings have more oneness with each other than other groups.

Perhaps this is what they are here for, it's what I think is the case actually at least partly, to learn from the people on this planet how to be less harmful and to teach us how we can be less harmful.

I don't know, that's not what it sounds like with the stories of what goes on in underground bases. I think humans inherently know how to live harmoniously but other kinds of beings infiltrate our world and lead us astray.

So I wonder, why does the backstory of the Grays resonate so much with only a 10-20 year slice of human technological history

Good question I've been thinking about that for 10 minutes and can't come up with anything other than that story might be emphasized as a tactical advantage to greys as it might make us feel similarly related to them, maybe sorry for them and instil pride in us that we're still emotional beings and haven't resorted to nuclear destruction and cloning for the most part.

What if compliance, submission, freewill is itself a kind of resource? And wars are fought over the compliance of a target population toward either of competing agendas?

That makes a lot of sense. You have to think outside the box a little bit.

What actually caught my eye was in the conjecture of holographic consciousness from within ourselves as the key to understanding this 3d reality which we are now interpreting in a linear sequential mind mode.

I was browsing the open minds facebook page and Bren Burton posted an intriguing video of Graham Hancock and his Ted banned video. Much seems to parallel of what the author V. Susan Ferguson was writing about. Nevertheless it will give you an insight you may not have been aware of about Graham Hancock.

I believe this planet is type 0 because people in the media
has said wars help the economy so that goes to show you
that our government do in fact fight for resources because of greed
They don't want to spend money on some technology that would prevent war
also prevent climate change that would prevent tornadoes hurricanes
and earthquakes our government needs to make sacrifices for the good of the planet
instead of having greed lust and envy Because Its not Republicans first
or Democrats first its human civilization first
Our government needs to stop having their own agenda
and start thinking about everybody