Hi I would like to do this practice and would like to know is it compulsory to use a bell whilst singing the melodies. The problem where i live, is that the walls are very thin and the neighbours would be able to hear. Is it ok if i just use wine for the serkyem cup?

jay wrote:Hi I would like to do this practice and would like to know is it compulsory to use a bell whilst singing the melodies. The problem where i live, is that the walls are very thin and the neighbours would be able to hear. Is it ok if i just use wine for the serkyem cup?

Thanks, J

You are talking about ChNNR sang and serkyem book, right? No need for a particular melody and you can whisper it and you don't need to use a bell. You can use riwo sangcho incense and a serkyem with just wine, this is what I do. It is a fantastic practice.

/magnus

"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

Thanks magnus- Yes, it is ChNN's pratice. I'm really looking forward to it. I dont have any sang at the momment, but have some green tara incense from bhutan. Would it be ok to use that? In the book, it says to empower the sang water...how do i do that?

jay wrote:Thanks magnus- Yes, it is ChNN's pratice. I'm really looking forward to it. I dont have any sang at the momment, but have some green tara incense from bhutan. Would it be ok to use that? In the book, it says to empower the sang water...how do i do that?

I have to look in the book about the "empower the sang water" but I use a conch shell with some water and then sprinkle the incense with some kusha grass according to Chokling Tersar tradition. Perhaps an older student from the DC could help you out? I am quite sure you can start practicing right now without "empower the sang water", you will perfect the practice in time.

/magnus

"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

jay wrote:Thanks magnus- Yes, it is ChNN's pratice. I'm really looking forward to it. I dont have any sang at the momment, but have some green tara incense from bhutan. Would it be ok to use that? In the book, it says to empower the sang water...how do i do that?

I'm hoping a nice glass of merlot appeases my guests

J

You empower the water either with purification mantras or the amritakundali mantra (depending on which one you have a lung for). You can use any type of incense that does not contain animal products (or guggul/myrrh) for the sang. I make my own mix with spices, crushed resins, crushed butter biscuits, etc... A couple of butter biscuits in the plate along with the glass of wine, or a mix of "five seeds" (again I make my own, go to the super market and buy five bags of five different kinds of beans and pulses) instead of the biscuits also keeps the protectors happy (shouldn't drink on an empty stomach ).

"My religion is not deceiving myself."Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

Hi Greg, when you say purification practices- which ones do you mean? Do I need to repeat the practice more than 1x in a single session? When giving the offering to the 4 directions, as well as offering the wine, should i also offer the food as well?

These are general instructions for sang and serkyem, they are not specific to the practice you are doing. Sang and serkyem practices exist in other Tibetan Buddhist traditions too.

The only one of the new questions I can answer with any certaintly is that the food goes out with the drink.

"My religion is not deceiving myself."Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

It's best to get the specific instructions from some senior ChNN student who does this practice and is very familiar with it. I do serkyem dharmapala practice according to the Dudjom Tersar, so my knowledge may be misleading as each lineage may have various specific instructions that could even be in contradiction to instructions in another lineage.

For instance, according to ChNN's ganapuja instructions, one takes a bite out of each food object one will offer in the remainder plate. In the Dudjom Tersar, one would never take a bite out of the remainder offerings, in fact they are set aside in the beginning when one first receives the tsok and kept clean.

That is just an example, to show that something that could be construed as a general rule between sibling lineages may very well NOT be a general rule!

So when it comes to making serkyem offerings to the Dharma protectors, this is serious business. I wouldn't fumble around as mistakes can have some kickback. Wait until you get 100% clarity from a senior practitioner in this lineage who is very familiar with the practice before you go ahead and try it.

Contentment is the ultimate wealth;
Detachment is the final happiness. ~Sri Saraha

jay wrote:Thanks magnus- Yes, it is ChNN's pratice. I'm really looking forward to it. I dont have any sang at the momment, but have some green tara incense from bhutan. Would it be ok to use that? In the book, it says to empower the sang water...how do i do that?

I'm hoping a nice glass of merlot appeases my guests

J

You empower the water either with purification mantras or the amritakundali mantra (depending on which one you have a lung for). You can use any type of incense that does not contain animal products (or guggul/myrrh) for the sang. I make my own mix with spices, crushed resins, crushed butter biscuits, etc... A couple of butter biscuits in the plate along with the glass of wine, or a mix of "five seeds" (again I make my own, go to the super market and buy five bags of five different kinds of beans and pulses) instead of the biscuits also keeps the protectors happy (shouldn't drink on an empty stomach ).

Is this a Riwo Sang Cho practice? Or is it a sang revelation of ChNN? Or something else?

Contentment is the ultimate wealth;
Detachment is the final happiness. ~Sri Saraha

gregkavarnos wrote:You empower the water either with purification mantras or the amritakundali mantra (depending on which one you have a lung for). You can use any type of incense that does not contain animal products (or guggul/myrrh) for the sang. I make my own mix with spices, crushed resins, crushed butter biscuits, etc...

This bit is Riwo Sang Cho.

A couple of butter biscuits in the plate along with the glass of wine, or a mix of "five seeds" (again I make my own, go to the super market and buy five bags of five different kinds of beans and pulses) instead of the biscuits also keeps the protectors happy (shouldn't drink on an empty stomach ).

This is bit for the serkyem practice.

"My religion is not deceiving myself."Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

gregkavarnos wrote:You empower the water either with purification mantras or the amritakundali mantra (depending on which one you have a lung for). You can use any type of incense that does not contain animal products (or guggul/myrrh) for the sang. I make my own mix with spices, crushed resins, crushed butter biscuits, etc...

This bit is Riwo Sang Cho.

A couple of butter biscuits in the plate along with the glass of wine, or a mix of "five seeds" (again I make my own, go to the super market and buy five bags of five different kinds of beans and pulses) instead of the biscuits also keeps the protectors happy (shouldn't drink on an empty stomach ).

This is bit for the serkyem practice.

Oh sorry, I wasn't clear I guess: I meant to ask about the practice the OP is asking about-- wasn't directed at you specifically Greg. I was wondering if the Sang practice referenced by the OP from ChNN is actually Riwo Sang Cho or a ChNN specific practice, or maybe a Longchen Nyingthig Sang of some kind.

Contentment is the ultimate wealth;
Detachment is the final happiness. ~Sri Saraha

jay wrote:Thanks magnus- Yes, it is ChNN's pratice. I'm really looking forward to it. I dont have any sang at the momment, but have some green tara incense from bhutan. Would it be ok to use that? In the book, it says to empower the sang water...how do i do that?

I have to look in the book about the "empower the sang water" but I use a conch shell with some water and then sprinkle the incense with some kusha grass according to Chokling Tersar tradition. Perhaps an older student from the DC could help you out? I am quite sure you can start practicing right now without "empower the sang water", you will perfect the practice in time.

/magnus

If you are talking about the water that is in the bumpa vase you use for blessing sang, tsok, etc, etc, that usually has special ingredients. These ingredients on their own would be difficult to collect, but most lamas will have them in the form of a tiny pill you put into your bumpa water.

"When a Dzogchen Yogi hears Shakyamuni Buddha turning the Wheel of the Dharma of the Four Noble Truths he hears Samathabhadra proclaiming the most profound Dzogpachenpo." - Nyoshul Khen Rinpoche

Is the wine that is offered during the Ngagkong offered in the same way as the serkyem (in four directions outside) or is it just offered in the direction your facing wherever you are doing the practice? Also, when is it distributed? after each invocation of that particular guardian or at the end of each ngagkong recitation?

Thanks magnus- Yes, it is ChNN's pratice. I'm really looking forward to it. I dont have any sang at the momment, but have some green tara incense from bhutan. Would it be ok to use that? In the book, it says to empower the sang water...how do i do that?

I'm hoping a nice glass of merlot appeases my guests

J

You can grind up ceder needles, or use sage (smudge stick), or use artemesia, etc. Typically, with ser khyem, you would use tea in the morning, booze at night. You also have to have a drink as well, of either tea or booze.

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

Thanks magnus- Yes, it is ChNN's pratice. I'm really looking forward to it. I dont have any sang at the momment, but have some green tara incense from bhutan. Would it be ok to use that? In the book, it says to empower the sang water...how do i do that?

I'm hoping a nice glass of merlot appeases my guests

J

You can grind up ceder needles, or use sage (smudge stick), or use artemesia, etc. Typically, with ser khyem, you would use tea in the morning, booze at night. You also have to have a drink as well, of either tea or booze.

so you would have a drink from cup on altar and then put it outside?

And let your mind settle, loose and relaxed,
like a woollen blanket spread out on the ground…
Khenpo Gangshar