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35’s on 6” gear?

Interested to hear from anyone who has run this combination. I know it’ll be less vis over the nose, tail heavier, etc... With all due respect, I’m more interested in real world experience than opinions. I’ve heard the 6” gear debates and I’m not looking to rehash that again. I see a lot of 35’s on 3” gear and just would like to hear from someone who has or currently runs them on 6”. Pics would be great too... Thanks!

This cub has been on 6" gear for 20 years, and the last 6 of it on 35's. Vis over the nose and tail weight
are pretty far down on the list of things I'd be concerned with when contemplating this combo. At 5'6" I can see over the nose well enough to get in and out of as technical of a spot as a guy cares to venture into, and even with a bad back I can lift the tail out of sand / snow just fine.

For comparison, here's another shot. The legend, also on long gear, is on 26" BW's.

As you can see, the over all height difference is far more dramatic than the actual angle (over the nose vis)

If I were contemplating this combination, factors I would consider are;

Over all weight increase. This combination is HEAVY
Flight characteristics. This is no longer going to be a sunday morning pattern flier.
Cost. Self explanatory

If the mission likes this combo, and the above are not a factor, it's a pretty plush way to roll.
FWIW, in my barn there are mounted tires ranging from 8:50's through 35's, and a brand new set of Atlee 3" gear complete with AOSS hanging on the wall, yet I am still happily on the combo pictured above. YMMV

On the angle note. This combination should yield a better attitude for slow lading and take off. But my experience with respect to take off has been that while the AOA has been increased, if you don't have the wheaties (power) to overcome the added weight and footprint drag, you may actually increase your take off distance just a smidge.

What Rob said is spot on. Here's another picture with me in it. I'm 6' 4" tall. As I stated in an earlier post in the Experimental section I did just replace my gear legs (total time on the legs 1200+ hours) in part cause the top mounting holes where egged out causing the gear to rattle a lot on landings. More wear with the longer gear. I also change all the suspension bolts every year although since I changed over from AOSS to TK1's I no longer have bent bolts, but I still change them- cheap insurance.

The new gear is 6x3 (instead of 6x0) and I can't tell any difference flying although the tail is heavier to lift. Once I'm on wheels again I'll know if I like it or go back to 6x0.

Done it. absolutely recommend it. FADodge built mine with heavy wall tubing for the aft leg of the gear vee. (before this, the aft tube would bow a bit over time) (a welded in brace tube/step would be a reasonable option to prevent bowing on normal wall thickness aft tubes I would guess). (My next set will have that option)

All the old arguments about 6" gear are half old wives tales. Talk to folks that have run them, not guys who heard this or that from the "guru". Most 6" extended owners will NOT go back to less.

I have only run 6" extended with bungees. Would think the present options for shocks an excellent combo if set up properly, or piss poor if not tuned in or run on sacked out bungees

I like Rob's take. On the other hand, some folks are willing to sacrifice performance for the macho look, and I approve of that - so long as they don't tell me how it leaps off pavement, climbs better . . .

Dave, I'd be interested to hear more about the aft tube bow. Is this a side load bow? I've never seen an aft tube bow, but I have bowed a front tube from side loading. No fault of the gear, or reason to suspect a shorter leg would have faired better, 100% operator induced wedging in too small of a space. Looks real weird when it happens too, because it bows out and up. Is this what you've seen on the aft tube?

Dave, I'd be interested to hear more about the aft tube bow. Is this a side load bow? I've never seen an aft tube bow, but I have bowed a front tube from side loading. No fault of the gear, or reason to suspect a shorter leg would have faired better, 100% operator induced wedging in too small of a space. Looks real weird when it happens too, because it bows out and up. Is this what you've seen on the aft tube?

Take care, Rob

very, very common, on even a standard length cub gear... one of the things on my inspection check list.... cause is not from side load...

from aft force....

but if you constrain it with a welded step(fore to aft), then it MUST/WILL bend sideways, and falsely makes you think it was a side load issue.....

Can visual why the brace would constrain it in one direction and cause it to move a different direction.
..

make up a test... and play with it..

when you strengthen something in one dimension/direction it cannot flex that way anymore, and the overloaded force must/will deflect more in another dimension/direction, then it did before you constrained the first one.....

more than one time i outsmarted myself thinking I was making something better, and actually made it worse/more guaranteed to fail in another/certain direction....

I've been running 6" gear since 2007. 12 years and 5000+ hours later, I can say the setup is solid. For maintenance, the landing gear bushings get replaced every other year or two. Also, I'm on my third set of shock struts (the old ones wore out and Atlee doesn't re-bush them).

In 2016, I upgraded to 35's. I'm stoked on the 6" and 35's and have no intentions of going back. For what it's worth, if I had to choose between either of these two mods - I would take the 6" gear.

Another thing to note about the 6" gear is that it is quite a bit wider than standard gear. This directly translates to better ground stability while taxiing around in strong wind conditions.

As a disclaimer, I've bent one gear leg. I'm confident any length of gear would have bent given the circumstances (big rock + skis = broken stuff).

Not sure if that was directed to anyone in particular, but I’ll bite. Although I’ll acknowledge up front that to a better cub guy, none of this might be worth while.

1) Height…. When I fly a cub on std or 3” gear, it is pretty common to come back with green prop tips (best case scenario) or peppered prop tips (bad) Lay the whip to your cub to get the tail up and turned around on the sand bars (where the river rock is mostly smooth and polished)and you cringe as your prop gets pelted. Do the same on a malpais flat where the rocks are sharp and angular, and you will cry as you pit it past the point of dressing. Your hard pressed to suck anything up with 6” extended gear rolling on 35’s. A better stick probably wouldn’t have this problem, but that’s not me…. lol!

2) Dabbing… I love being able to see exactly what both tires are doing at the same time. With my poor piloting skills, it is reasonably common for me to land on a malpais ridge top where the stones appeared to be cantaloupe sized, only to be flairing into what more realistically approaches the size of a round 26” goodyear. Being able to dab a tire exactly where I want it, and if energy still allows, lift the other up and over something is priceless… Yes I realize you can do this almost as easily on 31’s with std gear (specially if you carry a nick name like ‘lurch’ or ‘tiny’) but for me it’s just that much easier with the exaggerated stance.

3) What about that stance?… I have yet to land on a ridge that was level for very long. Flat? yes, level… not so much. I love the extra width when I need to turn around on something way off camber. Further more, when you are uneven ground, not the kind that rolls the whole airplane, but the kind that swallows one wheel at a time, all that extra width and height starts paying back in spades. Tussocks (the kind that old school Alaskans have a very politically incorrect word for) come to mind. Those rogue 26” goodyear rocks do the same.

4) The longer arm makes running a 1280/1380 bungee combo just perfect. The same on shorter gear works, but a witness tie wrap on the strut will show you may as well be running straight legged.

5) The added AOA. between the extra height and the extra AOA, you really add a good amount to the tail low approach. Take off (for me at least) is not any better, in fact it probably suffers a little, but not enough to offset the rest.

None of this means I don’t see/know where the sacrifices are. And there are plenty…

6" gear doesn't give 6" more height. It's an angle related deal that an engineer can determine. At ~45* gear angle it would be about +3". Plus the longer gear needs way stiffer bungees to prevent unwanted extension.

I had a set on my PA-12-180 with Cub gear and liked them. But they would twist from the AERO 3000's and probably needed more lower leg bracing and stiffer bungees. Not many wheel ops with the 26" Goodyears and long gear. Not my gift in flying.

Ya ya…. I finally got around to the nose job. I figure after 20 pages of testimonials from individuals far more qualified than I, I’d be off the hook on the pirep deal, but I will find the old thread and weigh in.

I will say this though, I have had the opportunity to fly a few with ‘snooty noses’ but they’ve always been different airplanes, so I never really knew how much difference to attribute to what. It was really nice to have a very familiar platform to get an honest before and after view. Thanks for reminding me

Thanks Dave for the info on gear tubes.. Mine was inherited and an early version from Atlee. I phoned and asked Atlee and he said bring it down and we'll check them for straight and beef up. Never got around to it and then sold the PA-12 a few years later. Sure liked the AOA in snow tho. Plane was excellent.

I recall his major dislike of the 6" was how his plane reacted in "tussocks". Something about how it dipped a wing further.

I seem to recall it something about being tippy, but I never could quite understand what he was getting at. I do agree that if you lose a strut or tire, it gets the wing spooky low. And if you nose it in, you get startlingly verticle, not that I have any experience there