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Tuesday, May 27, 2008

Anti-Kikuyuism: As Usual Kenyans Are Avoiding The Truth

Fred was the real name of a guy we went to both primary and high school with. He was one class ahead of me and a very loud kind of chap who enjoyed jeering at others.

His Dad was Luo and his mum Kamba which gave him very good looks and impeccable diction so much so that many school girls at Kenya High, Limuru Girls and elsewhere easily went crazy over Fred. Whenever we went for school debates some of us would have problems approaching the girls when Fred would always have half a dozen cuties literally fighting over him. In fact Fred could get the girls to do anything for him. And I mean anything. Lucky guy.

Geoffrey in sharp contrast was a quiet boy who Fred mocked at every opportunity. He especially liked to talk about Geofrey’s great fear of girls. Whenever a girl would come anywhere near poor Geoffrey, he would start to sweat and he would freeze on the spot in fright. I can still hear Fred’s loud voice and his cruel jokes which were quickly followed by his extremely loud crackling laugh.

But one day something happened. Fred started with his usual jokes at the expense of Geof and something inside Geof snapped. Before we knew it Fred was on the floor receiving some heavy punches in the face from Geof. It took several of us some minutes to get the usually shy quiet boy off Fred. And by that time his pretty face was messed up badly. You see Fred was very brown and his skin did not take bruises and black eyes very well.

I can also report that that is the last time that Fred cracked any jokes at the expense of Geof. He hurriedly moved on to other “victims.”

Sadly this is exactly the situation we have in Kenya today where one community has been mocking the rest of Kenya for years. Until December 2007 there was no retaliation but what happened early this year is something even I do not like to remember.

Now the biggest problem we have is that rather than go into the root causes of why peaceful Kenyans suddenly turned into animals, we are busy preaching peace and telling people to be peaceful. In fact the government has gone one step further and is re-settling IDPs back to their farms under heavy guard and nobody is really interested in tackling the real problem. Instead everybody is obsessed with the symptoms.

Even in this blog fairly well educated Kenyans would rather use abusive language against anybody who tries to discuss this problem. You can be sure that even I will receive plenty of barbs for this post. And even more interesting is the fact that anybody who says anything against this so-called community is always branded a violent person.

I suggest that you carry out a small experiment to confirm that what I am saying is absolutely true. We have a small harmless girl called Mrembo who regularly comments in this blog. You will often come across her name mentioned as the violent type and pro-violence campaigner. But just read her comments carefully and the only thing you will notice is that she is rabidly anti-Kibaki, the vote thief of course. And that is probably the only reason why she is constantly branded violent.

So what are people saying? That any anti-Kibaki element is violent and pro-violence?

Members of the said supreme community in the country must realize that they have put themselves in a very difficult situation and must learn the lesson that my old schoolmate called Fred refused to learn despite the punishment he received from Geof and many others. And that is sooner or later, those whom we look down on and jeer will react against us and that reaction may not be very good.

You can read through this entire Kumekucha blog and nowhere will you find me advocating for violence. I am for non-violent resistance. And that is precisely why I write this blog instead of looking for guns and going to the bush. However those preaching peace must realize that the only way we can have long lasting peace in Kenya is for us to confront our problems head on. We have to deal with the root cause of all the animosity if there is to be any peace in our beautiful motherland.

46 comments:

KK the Kikuyus are slowly realizing that they have been used for a long time and have finally been fixed in a very uncomfortable corner - pitted against the rest of Kenya. They've also realized that all this is not for their benefit as a whole community but for a few rich old men who do not want to give up power. The same old men who hold most of their land while the poorer ones are being moved left right and center in camps. Look around at other communities. They have mostly let go of old dinosaurs and replaced them with young leaders with fresher ideas. Except of course the dinosaur of all dinosaurs Ole Ntimama.

"Those whom we look down on and jeer will react against us and that reaction may not be very good".

The above becomes even more deadlier when the the tribe (Kikuyu) doing the "looking down and jeering" has no justification whatsoever to do so. You may disagree with me but what I have observed is that the core "values" of the Kikuyu community are DECEPTION, FRAUD and THEFT (Kyuk's like to style themselves as hardworking - these are the 3 areas where they work hard at!). They call this being "smart" - crazy!! ridiculous!!

Bottom line is this: Kikuyu's are not superior to any other tribe in Kenya. How else would you consider a community whose members "thrive" best in an environment where DECEPTION, FRAUD, THEFT and INDISCIPLINE reign supreme. Such people can only be inferior and use their "special skills" of DECEPTION and FRAUD to try and make other tribes look inferior while FOOLING, i repeat again, FOOLING themselves that they are superior - wacha hiyo! Hiyo ni 100% nonsesense.

And you're right there's too much hatred and bad language. Sometimes it's just depressing to come in here. Whatever topic comes up for discussion always ends up in abusive language and name calling. There are a few bloggers here who can be singled out for this. Thanks for enabling moderation once again otherwise this was fast going to degenerate into a hate blog.

Somebody branding Mrembo as a violence campaigner must be joking!! Mrembo of all other people? aiiii leta ingine.

Chris,Great post. I support your sentiment that We have to look for real solutions in a multi ethnic artificial construct that is Kenya. Otherwise,this nation is going to the dogs. It is a banana republic in the making. Nice to know you are safe

So apparently I'm a kiuk......I was born to kiuk parents and beacuse of that I come with the automatic tags such as a fraud, thief, indisciplined to all sorts of names. If you want to hate on kikuyus feel free but don't start preaching on killing ribalism if you can't practice it(this is to you and Chris and to others).

Your last article regarding Fred getting beaten up Geoff, assuming that Fred represents the Kikuyus and Geoff represents other communities, was a poor way of showing the problems in Kenyans. What we need now is for peole such youirself and myself to grow and think. This is a time for reconciliation, not a time for brewing hatred or tribalism like this site ends up doing thanks to a few characters. (I know this site provides intersting info regarding Kenya's current and past affairs but at times moves off topic and misses its goal).

There are two types of people in the world: those who divide people into two types and those who don't. In the former category would be most politicians we see today from George W. Bush to the ones we have to kenyans and to non-politicans but with similar DNA such as yourself Chris.

If you don’t advocate violence, why the hell you continue to support and justify post election violence.How many countries have had election stolen but the citizens did not go on killing spree to express their ‘democratic rights’.If the elections were stolen, why don’t you go for real culprit and leave innocent people alone. If we continue to vent anger at our neighbours at anything that’s wrong in our society, then they will be no-one left.

Anon 4:22 AM, What Chris and I (Anon 3:55 AM) and others have stated is not based on hatred as you try to claim (here I can tell that you want to bring to use a bit of the deception and fraud that you fellows are "gifted" at to distort the truth. No! it will not work!!). It is based on factual observation over a very long period of time. I guess with you, this truth is a very bitter pill to swallow.... that's why you even say that we are going off topic. It is apparently an issue that you are afraid to look at straight in the eye - Exactly what Chris was talking about in this post ("Anti-Kikuyuism: As Usual Kenyans Are Avoiding The Truth")

Given that you and most of the members of your community are living in denial, It would take a miracle for you to open your eyes and see the truth. You continue to revel in self denial that is concentrated with very large doses of "SELF DECEPTION" and "SELF FRAUD".

Until you fellows open your eyes and see the truth, it will be very difficult - no, impossible for other Kenyan communities to reconcile with you. We are not interested in deceptive and fraudulent peace. We are only interested in GENUINE peace. Pure and simple

Another anti kyuk thread. A pretense at intellectualism which projects from one boy to 8 million individuals and attempts to make an entire society arrogant. Foolishly the writer then attempts to justify the murder and rape of hundreds of people as 'justified' for their 'arrogance' which here means that they did not vote for the odm candidate.

Utter stupidity. Just drop the pretense. You are one of the pigs in the sty.

Imbecility of the highest order. if you are looking for arrogant tribalists, why not start looking at the mirror? did you see the welcome ruto was given in othaya? please tell me if Karua can get the same in your 'peaceful non tribal' part of kenya. give me break.

you are nothing but small minded little butchers and child rapists who soon will be brought to justice.

I can only compare anti-kikuyuism to anti-jewishsm during the days of Hitler. They said all shops(big shops and small shops belonged to jews at the expense of native germans). Having read the anti kikuyu leaflets in Riftvalley just before the elections and the consequences i can only shudder and feel sorry for Kenya. Kikuyus are enterprenuers, risk takers, industrious and adventurous. This has made them to be disapopriately more successful and more wealthy than other communities. I guess its just their talent and skills. Just like its the talent of Kalenjins to be good in Athletics and Luos in academics (most phds are luos). Ofcourse there are those Kiuks who are poor, there are those who are thieves and have bad social elements(just like every community has its own bad elements) but that does not make everyone in the community bad. Its time bloggers here to grow up. Instead of preaching hatred lets preach love and co existance.

The illustration is flawed. Kikuyus are the villains of tribalism while the rest of Kenya are all innocent victims? Not at all. There is NO single community that has a monopoly of good or evil. All mankind is fallen and desperately in need of a saviour.

Anon 5:39 AM. Stop resorting to insults and distortions of the truth. Your post is devoid of any reasoned or logical argument.

May I also remind you that you can not hide the truth forever. The more you try to hide it or "refuse" to see it, the more it will eventually explode in your face - exactly what Chris was saying in his post: "Those whom we look down on and jeer will react against us and that reaction may not be very good".

a kalenjin friend of mine tells me that the kibor bbc tape has a lot of mis-translations in it.....and that kibor was simply expressing his frustrations about the kikuyu hegemony just like the rest of us kenyans

Mrembo justifying Kibor's remarks. Since Kibor was calling for violence against Gikuyu, and we only justify those things we think good in some sense, it's easy to conclude that mrembo approves of the violence. As a matter of tactics, you shouldn't rest the defence of your blog's reputation on what your commenters say, since rather a lot of them have advocated and celebrated violence.

You tell a little parable about violence, in which it is evident that you approve of violence to solve Geoff's problems, compare that to the present situation in Kenyan, state that the situation in the parable is relevantly similar to Kenya, and then argue that you do not condone violence against Gikuyu. This is grimly amusing - and ironic.

Every village has a mad man and very community has its chicken thieves, and hardcore criminals right across the tribes. The problem with kenya is the all powerful presidency. All this apparent behaviour amongst the kikuyu was allowed to flourish during the reign of one Jomo, its just one of those habits that is easy to pick and quite hard to unlearn, nobody is born with theiving genes. This is willfull arrogance and laziness to imagine that there is a way to make money without being crooked. This madness can be contained by law enforcement what is hard to deal with is the superiority complex, it so hard to walk down from a pedestal of being the superior whatever especial when you have no real life accomplishments to boast obout to relace it...there is the a tendancy to cling to anything that makes you look better than the next guy. Thats why racism persist into the 21st century and is usually pronounced amongst the middle class and lower middle class as in people who wannabe but can't and thus desparately need someone to blame or cling to false sense of accomplishement by smply belonging to a tribe or race. The rich don't care money will get them what they want. the poor are to busy trying to find food to care. the group of people causing trouble are the ambitious wannabe rich looking for a shor-cut by having an all powerful president belonging to their tribe. they are to sacred to face competition in an even playing field. Thats the bottom line. They are ready to ruin our beloved country if the have to to try and archieve their mayopic goals too lazy to think of a way we all can benefit. Shame on them.

a post like this one and the subsequent comments only go to confirm the apparent superiority of the Kikuyus. One section of Kenya has been utterly incapable of coping with a rabid capitalist world and for that they have resulted to playing victims and spreading hate against the more successful ones.

Fact is Kikuyus have cumulatively suffered the most for bad governance but instead of just playing victims, we actually did something about it. After 24 years of Kalenjin plunder, Kikuyus are beginning to rise again...and so is the hellish cloud of hate from Jahanam

Chris, you started the story well but your comparison is completely lost. You cant lump all Kyiuk as Fred. (First of all not all them are handsome, next not all of them can make a girl do whatever they want. R Kyiuks really the ones calling shots in Kenya?)

Now Geoff is not a representative of the rest of the tribes. Not all of them are against Kyuiks and you should remember that most Kyius are not rich. There are a few Kyiuks who are extremely rich but that does not represent the whole tribe.

If Kikuyus wealth is obtained through deception, fraud and theft, then can somebody explains to me about those wealthy Kikuyus living in London? Are they stealing from the Queen and the country?Many of whom fled 1990’s ethnic clashes in the RV but now own Seaside resorts, bed and breakfast, recruitment agencies, nursing homes, import and export companies etc.In 2004, a Kikuyu man who fled fighting in Molo in 1994 was named by London Business times as young ethnic entrepreneur of the year. He currently owns a vast recruitment agency throughout United Kingdom employing indigenous white people.

For those not familiar with UK immigration laws, if you invest in the country (UK) you are a valued immigrant and the citizenship will be there for your taking. The money you have, the more likely you will be invited for a cup of tea with her majesty the Queen.

Ken, I quote you: "Kikuyus are enterprenuers, risk takers, industrious and adventurous. This has made them to be disapopriately more successful and more wealthy than other communities. I guess its just their talent and skills."

Ken, unfortunately, these talents and skills you refer to "contain" a lot of deception, fraud and in certain cases, outright theft. Ati talent and skills?? Leta ingine!

An objective examination of many of these so called wealthy Kyuk's will reveal that there is no real productive economic activity behind these riches. Most engaged in acts of fraud, deception and outright swindling and theft in order to "aquire" these riches.

However, I do agree that there are a FEW, and here the operative word is FEW, Kyuk's who have made their riches honestly. Unfortunately the vast majority are simply thieves and fraudsters. They are part of the reason why Kenya is where it is right now while countries which were just recently behind us economically (South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore and Hong Kong) are "Thousands of miles" ahead of us.

There is a very big connection between Kenya's under performance as a nation economically and this nonsense of Deception, Fraud and Theft. This nonsense has been practiced right from the top during Kenyatta's, Moi's and Kibaki's rule

I could give many examples but I shall just mention 3:

1)KenRen (Kenyatta/Kibaki)2)Goldenberg (Moi)3)Angloleasing (Kibaki)

These scandals had the net result of creating - suddenly! - overnight millionaires and billionaires while tragically destroying the economy of Kenya.

Chris, what a low road you have decided to take in order to attract traffic to Kumekucha? Do you have to justify the murder and rape of an entire community to earn a living, or alternatively to get back at an individual from that community who may have offended you? I pray that what you do to others never happens to you!!

Since you have openly admitted many times that you are married to a beautiful Kikuyu woman, how would you feel if she was attacked because her community has been 'jeering' at other tribes? Think about that and hopefully you will come back to your senses.

Some things are facts. There is a huge wealth gap between the Kikuyus and the rest. Nature loves equilibrium and humans are no different. The west know it and that is why the fight it with systems like benefits and a high rate of employment among others. There is nothing like a perfect equality, there is in inequality everywhere but it only explodes when it reaches the breaking point, and we are nearly there if something isn't done. I am not sure whether there is anything unique about Kikuyus blindly 'licking' Kibaki's butt, so to speak. One thing that strikes me was a story in the [I]Nation[I] during the post election violence. There were these Kikuyus who were being chased away from a slum (can't remember which one it was exactly) and a lady gave birth while she was running; the crowd helped her to deliver and they immediately namer the baby girl after .... guess who? Lucy! So you can imagine how this tribalism has dangerously reached such levels. This one will take some time and takes mental maturity and understanding.

the truth anon 6.07? the truth is what we seek. the truth behing the organized kilings. We want all murderers brought to justice whether they killed in Eldoret or Naivasha.

We stand for the truth.

those calling for amnesty, which means that the killers and child rapists walk scott free are the enemies of truth. They are the ones who want us to close our eyes and pretend that innocent children were not burnt in a church, or families huddled in a house in naivasha.

why? becaus ethey know that if the truth is sought, some of the so called peaceful democratic leaders will be found with hands drenched with innocent blood. thats why they are rushing to try and tlk to Mungiki. birds of a feather

Today, you have written a disgraceful post. You have found a way of disclaiming violence and tribalism while at the same time deceptively justifying the worst tribal violence in the history of independent Kenya.

How can you use a school yard tale to justify the killing and raping of Kikuyus on account of their tribe? How can you justify the mentality of "let us kill and rape them because they look down on us?" You have joined a long and tragic history of those who have apologized for genocide and ethnic cleansing.

Has the little Kikuyu guy in the RV ever come to you, Chris, and looked down on you? If the answer is no why then do you think he does not deserve to be resettled or worse he deserves to die and his little daughter raped? How can you turn a beautiful blog like Kumekucha into an anti-Kikuyu platform?

In your tortured logic you may say Kikuyu deserved it, but do you really think that Kikuyus will entertain that mindless aggression against them in the future? The haters may have won round one but I shudder to think of Kikuyu reaction if there is ever round two. In the meantime, it is worthy realizing that Kikuyus are not going anywhere and are just too many to wipe out as many of you would wish. And that applies to any other community. Better still, in general, the Kikuyus or any other community will continue to prosper in proportion to their labour and risk taking.

Those who propagate that Kenyan problems begin and end with Kikuyus or any other tribe are either naive or deceptionists. The problem in Kenya is the glaring inequality between the haves and the have-nots and the lack of opportunities for the have-nots to improve their lives. What is tragic is that the have-nots are used by the haves to kill other have-nots on account of tribe so that the haves can be left alone to access more wealth peacefully. Then the haves hold ostentatious inter-marriage ceremonies to celebrate. That is exactly what going on in Kenya.

After the have-nots killed each other, the haves shared the spoils of the govt among themselves. Now that the food prices are high, it is the Onyango, Kamau and Ng'eno have-nots who survived who go to bed hungry. That is why they are called "poor things" by the haves. What is most disturbing is that people who ought to know better like Chris have bought into these social engineering schemes of the haves.

".......In fact the government has gone one step further and is re-settling IDPs back to their farms under heavy guard and nobody is really interested in tackling the real problem..........."

Those are your word our dear Chris - Where do you want our parents to go? To continue living in the stadium. Dear Bro have feelings for other Kenyans too. I believe we better die in what we only have rather than live in the camps.

It is convenient for anti-Kikuyu loosers to ignore that other Bantu communities were killed in the post election violence. If we accept at face value their justification that Kikuyus were killed because they look down on others, then how do they justify the killing of Kisiis in RV or Luhyas in Trans Nzoia? Have these two communities also looked down on the Nilotes? I see it as a crash of cultures: The Nilotic culture of blame others for your faults versus the Bantu culture of stoic trust in hard work and individual initiative. If this turns out to be the case, then it is a matter of time before one culture ultimately triumphs over the other. And your guess is as good as mine which one will do the victory rap.

No meaningful change will come to Kenya untill the Kikuyus buy into the idea of change. History supports that proposition.During the British rule, the change only came when the Kikuyus took up arms against the empire. Moi dictatorship went on smoothly despite Luo opposition to it. It was not untill the Kikuyus joined in the fray starring Matiba, Rubia, Muite and the masses of Kamukunji did real change come to Kenya.

Now, other communities have been agitating for change. They have killed, rioted and burned property. But by ganging up against the Kikuyus instead of coopting them, they have created a siege mentality among the Kikuyus and sabotaged chances of real change.

Kikuyus understand they have a stake in the change, but they will not participate through intimadation and name-calling. Only a change of tact will work. But once they join the struggle, the change will come at the speed of light.

I will replicate my statement here for you to understand what I was saying...here goes:

you people amaze me i have to say....ati ruto did what? did you hear him inciting anyone? let someone come out and clearly tell us what ruto said in fact dont tell us run to the police station with your evidence. anyway good luck with that.

as for kibor,.....well i pray with all the yapping people doing in blogs you all succeed in prosecuting him....

the one thing i know is that nobody's going to take kibor anywhere.....as far as i know....i haven't heard of any kenyan courts that takes taped recordings from anyone not unless you want to create a new precedent!! those things for one are subject to serious manipulation and are considered inadmissible, ama you were thinking of taking him to american courts? hehehehe!!

the state knows very well they have no case against him...they can frustrate him.... yes!!....but they cant really do much else. the law is an ass for a reason people....all these guys will walk scott free nanyinyi wakosa kazi...you will still be writing about it here!!

a kalenjin friend of mine tells me that the kibor bbc tape has a lot of mis-translations in it.....and that kibor was simply expressing his frustrations about the kikuyu hegemony just like the rest of us kenyans....whether that is true or not.... is not for me to say....i dont know kalee.......however,like i said i wish you all the luck in the world in prosecuting him successfully!!

I remember that Kibor statement was specifically raised by you on that post (Parliament Debates Crucial Bills) when you and your pnu friends came yapping over here that Ruto and Kibor should be prosecuted because there was enough circumstantial evidence to convict them. I was simply telling you that I have never heard of Kenyan courts accepting taped recordings so there really was no evidence against Kibor that could stand in a Kenyan court of law.

Secondly, if you read my statement you would understand I am not a Kalee and was simply reporting as I was told (by a Kalee) that the BBC reporter asked Kibor leading questions and that there were mis-translations in the tape so that they could sell a story. I was simply pointing that out in my comment....so how is that advocating for violence?

But the thing is wasn't I right? Kibor is herding his goats and cows in ushago and Ruto is now a bosom buddy of the Mp for Othaya, is there any more talk of their prosecution?

Anon @ 6:54am, No one disclaims that there are no industrious, upright, law-abiding Kyuks that have amassed their wealth the "right" way, just like in the Kyuk community, the same holds true for all the other communities in Kenya. The contention comes when you start flaunting it, especially for those that amassed theirs the "ill-gotten" way and start branding the "have-nots" as lazy, uncouth and uncivilized, that's where the genesis of yje hate emanates. In addition to this, setting up businesses in "others" backyard and pretending/looking down upon your hosts and the very same people that patronize your businesses, becomes a jab in the face or for the lack of a better analogy "biting the hand", need I say more. Food for thought. Did you ever wondered why the Chinese built the Great Wall and considered themselves the Middle Empire? Read that history, in a weird kind of way it kind of parallels the Kyuk mentality and the resentment that they are engulfed with presently.

Chris, your post today hit the nail on the head. DECEPTION appears to be the hallmark of these PNU leaders. Elections are just there to be manipulated for the benefit of a few.

I find it in bad-taste that the Vice President, now campaigning for PNU candidate in Embakasi, could stand in parliament and announce to MPs (and the country) that the President and the PM would begin nationwide tours to preach peace and national cohesion. That was way back in March 2008. If this is not deception, what is? Now some of them are even saying that Raila should stay away from campaigning for the ODM candidates, while they (Uhuru, Kalonzo, Karua,) campaign for PNU's candidate. They seem to have forgotten the pecking order they were so much adamant about just a week ago! Now they are accepting the President and Raila are at par and much to senior to be engaging in party politics! Upuuzi mtupu hii siasa ya pesa nane!

What many people have also forgotten is that the even government spokesman announced that both Kibaki and Raila would be going for COUNTRYWIDE tours to preach peace. However, so far, the duo have only made the first leg that involved a three-day tour of the Eldoret, Trans Nzoia, Kipkelion, Sotik, Molo and Naivasha – all of which are in the Rift Valley province. Even then, protocol wars and heckling of the president and his vice president showed that Kenyans have not yet forgiven those responsible for the elections fiasco. Raila has had to take flack from his own supporters on behalf of the President.

What has scared off the President and his PNU brigade? Was it the hostility and the heckling? Does touring, and being heckled in the process, means the government has washed its hands off the genesis of the conflict? Or was it the outright rejection of the idiotic succession politics that were introduced at the rallies by Kalonzo and Saitoti? Should Raila proceed and make these tours on his own – as he has done today at the highly controversial Mau Forest – where interestingly, the Environment Minister (John Michuki) was missing in action while the issue at hand directly falls in his docket?

It is on record Raila has been to Western, Nyanza, NEP and Nairobi but our duly elected president has only been seen in the vicinity of Nairobi. What the hell, the PM has even met with special interest groups like Mt. Elgon Elders, he has also opened a window of negotiations with Mungiki and not to mention he also met with MPs from clash-ton areas of the Rift Valley. This is clearly a hands-on leader who has shown the willingness to sort out the mess that is Kenya once and for all.

In contrast, the Head of State appears to be too busy (too idle?) even to visit Kibera – which is just 5 minutes drive from State House Nairobi. While we all appreciate how heavy a load it is to be Kenya’s president, all politicians aiming to occupy that seat know it is not a bed of roses and the occupant must be prepared to discharge state duties 24/7. One doesn’t get elected to State House to make cabinet appointments and then sit back, do they? Even more disturbing, information reaching this blogger indicate that PNU ministers have been secretly holding strategy meetings, ignoring the PM’s role as supervisor and co-ordinator of ministers.Meanwhile, as we await the second leg of the ODM/PNU joint rallies, tension is still evident in areas like Kisii, Kericho, TransMara and elsewhere. The coming by-elections, particularly those of Kilgoris and Embakasi will definitely bring more tensions and it is not surprising the Embakasi ODM nominations were marked by pathetic voter turn out and for the first time in 5 months residents of Embakasi tasted some tear-gas from trigger-happy Kenya Police. Uchokozi!

As its been said many times: You can fool some people some times, but you cant fool all the people all the time.

@Ken 5:42The comparison between Kiuks and the Jews in Hitler's era is a show of total ignorance you possess in the history of the Jews.

The Jews had no political power in Germany or Europe at large. The Jews were hard working traders and intellectuals. The Kikuyus owe their success in business to the political superiority they earned thro brutal regime of Kenyatta. Kibaki has renewed this arrogance and has put all Kikuyus in strategic positions in Finance, Trade, Commerce, Security, Education and all socio-economic positions in Kenya. Is it a coincidence that Justice Ringera is the head of Anti-Corruption Commission?

An indication of hard work in trade and business is always heart attack and such related deaths. Have you heard of a Kikuyu dying of cardiac arrest? Yes, it is Matiba but his is coming frm detention just as Raila has it rough with his eyes.

No brother, Kikuyus are not Jews. 90% of robberies in Nbi are by Kikuyus. Jews in Berlin were not dangerous to Germans at all.

Why is the police doing investigations of post-elec violence in RV only and not in Mathare, Naivasha and Nakuru? Why is it that no Mungiki has been arrested for killing hundreds of Luos, Kalenjins, Luhyas, Kissis, etc in RV, Mathare and Kibera?

Why are Kikuyus considered the victims of post-elec viol, when many other tribes died and were raped by Kikuyus?

Blanket amnesty has been given to all Kikuyus (Mungiki, Kibaki, Uhuru, Michuki,Karua, Saitoti, etc). Now they want to prosecute the Kalenjins, Luhyas, Luos, the Coast people for the chaos Kibaki created himself.

Remember: The CID knew everything but refused to diffuse the violence. Yes, it was planned, but by the government.

Ha ha ha ... am sure you will enjoy the popcorns, but i ain't so sure abt the show.Me ... i have graduated to hotdog and alvaro ... and from the look of things, i will next have ice cream since things will be HOT.

I remember that Kibor statement was specifically raised by you on that post (Parliament Debates Crucial Bills) when you and your pnu friends came yapping over here that Ruto and Kibor should be prosecuted because there was enough circumstantial evidence to convict them. I was simply telling you that I have never heard of Kenyan courts accepting taped recordings so there really was no evidence against Kibor that could stand in a Kenyan court of law.

You haven't been paying attention: Kenyan courts do accept tape recordings as evidence - the KACC and the police have used them - though the rules are slightly complicated; as I understand it, the person who made the tape recording will be asked to testify to the material actually on the tape.

Secondly, if you read my statement you would understand I am not a Kalee and was simply reporting as I was told (by a Kalee) that the BBC reporter asked Kibor leading questions and that there were mis-translations in the tape so that they could sell a story. I was simply pointing that out in my comment....so how is that advocating for violence?

That defence rests on the presumption that Kibor was speaking Kalenjin throughout. If you listen to the tape, Kibor makes remarks that amount to incitement to ethnic hatred and incitment to violence and murder, and he makes those remarks in English and Swahili. For example, when the reporter (Pascale Harter) asks whether he wants to drive them (Gikuyu) out of the Rift Valley and Western Kenya, he responds, in English, 'correct'. And at various other points, he speaks in English and Swahili. Even if we ignore the parts where he speaks Kalenjin, there is sufficient evidence to try him.

But the thing is wasn't I right? Kibor is herding his goats and cows in ushago and Ruto is now a bosom buddy of the Mp for Othaya, is there any more talk of their prosecution?

Kibor is out on bail.

You had no good reason to believe that the BBC was biased - other than your friend's say so. Your friend has an obvious motive for lying. The lie is incompetent because there are segments of the tape where Kibor speaks in English. ODMers have accepted the BBC's reporting when it has favoured their case: when the BBC reported that two men had alleged that Mungiki had been hosted at State House, ODMers asserted that Kibaki had ordered the retaliatory murders in the South Rift. Kibor was calling for murder; you attempted to excuse it by finding bad reasons to excuse and justify what he said, and ignoring the standards of evidence that your side customarily employs. Which is good evidence that you do not disapprove, and possibly condone what Kibor said.

Precisely Anon 1:04,comparing the jews and the kikuyus..>Ei leta ingine..Ken the jews were in the perfect will of God and there was a prophecy that was to be fulfilled and it was fulfilled in 1948, so i am yet to hear what is pending for the kuyo's prophecy....the anger and bitterness that other tribes have against kuyos can only be compared to Abraham's other son, he was called Ishmael you can find that story in the book of Genesis...The 1st book in the Bible.

Mrembo, Ruto is not only a pal of the Othaya MP....I thought i saw him this weekend in Othaya and Nithi and he didn't look like a man on the most wanted list.

I think for us to move forward is for our friends (kiuks) to acknowledge that there has been some injustice done to other tribes in this country....When Kibs was forming a mount kenya cabinet and parastatal heads, they were quiet and they didn't raise their voices or was it hii ni time yetu!!!! So tell me when the time for illchamus will come? I thought the luos and kiuks were on the forefront when the clamour for multiparty was being fought, just what changed after Kibs won? Trust me this thing is not hate when people defend an injustice what do you want other people to do, hug and kiss you?

All in all there are some remnants in our midst...i wouldn't want to say all kiuks are bad, just here in this blog we have a wonderful lady by the name of Wanjiku unlimited, a rare breed in this generation, one who is not swayed by her tribesmen and women....Takes criticism kindly without throwing tantrums and above all a sober blogger...Bravo Wanjiku.The other person is my own Boss i wouldn't trade her for another...Wait a minute is it only the women who see sense?

This Kikuyu bashing has now become a bore. It is like taking a tour of Mathare to look at the madmen in their cages. Eventually, nobody is interested. Those who think that Kikuyus give a damn about the endless hate are only kidding themselves. They just don't care anymore since even if they joined ODM, you will still hate them. They will instead continue doing what they do best, making money and getting richer while you mourn and gnash your teeth until they become stumps, until next time when you come calling with your arrows and pangas. Only next time, you will get a wake up call you never expected. Kikuyus are not going to be caught napping again, and at that time, it will be a fight to the finish, even if it destroys Kenya. Kikuyus will be ready, and you can take that to the Bank.

Hehehehehe Ivy, you have said it! Wanjiku is on another level, si uwongo! That girl is too good! She does not condone theft and she does not take short cuts where the truth is concerned, neither does she shout herself hoarse here trying to defend Kibaki just because they share a tribe-calls a spade a spade!

Well Waweru, like I said I haven't heard mambo ya taped recordings in court, we will see how that goes. But just for your peace of mind let me restate here what I have said in the past, I DO NOT condone violence. If Ruto, Kibor, Kibaki, Karua, Saitoti or even Raila are guilty of any of the violence crimes they should pay for it.

By the way, when I listened to the tape I thought those were pretty damning admissions that Kibor was making, I thought he was clearly hanging himself with that one and for that reason I asked a native of the language to tell me what Kibor was saying, that's when I got the mis-translation bit. Now, I haven't alleged anywhere that Kibor is innocent but what else does the state have other than that tape in question?

My dear my point is, when you try to argue your case please give us irrefutable evidence, not udaku which natives of the tribe themselves are claiming to have mis-translations, I fear the court will look at it the same way I do, that's all I am saying.

In all honesty, even if we choose to rely on the tape, Mr Kibor can say that he was simply expressing his personal feelings in an interview. The question is, is that considered as incitement? Who did he incite, the BBC reporter? Coz thats who he was speaking to, can anyone prove he told the Kalenjin warriors to go bludgeon anyone to death or destruction of property?

Your murder allegation is just another story altogether, does the state have dead bodies to prove it was he (Kibor) who executed it? Which specific people will the state claim he killed? So there again those are wild allegations IMO, I think that's the reason they say the law is an ass and which was also the reason I said in my post back then, good luck in prosecuting him successfully .

Well, let me end there I dont know why I am defending myself, let me just repeat I dont condone violence. Giving Kibor's view point is not condoning violence am just anticipating the kind of arguments he may raise.

To crown this seemingly endless deabte.It is true that so much hatred is being pointed towards the Kikuyus.Everyone deals with Kikuyus with so much caution.Personally i admire kikuyus for this or that and i normally equate them to a Pentium IV computer.By that i mean their thought process and reflexing is pretty quick.

It could be a stereotype but Kikuyus are offendingly aggressive in business.Yes if we have to say it i discovered much as Kikuyus look down at others they have some soft spot for Kisiis.I have been trying to reseach about what they themselves feel about other communities and trhe reasons are just as varied.They like Kisiis for reasons that are yet unclear to me.If it is Bantuism i dont know.

Can we label every other Kikuyu as offending really?We could just be unfair because some Kikuyus have a totally diffrent mien from others.According to me Kikuyus can be good and dissapointing depending on who you are dealing with at a given time.For instance i really used to admire One Wilfred Kiboro until i saw him at the night swearing in of a Mr Kibaki.

We have Ciku here and PKW i dont feel they are bad people unless otherwise.Truth be said so many people resent Kikuyus for either the wrong or right reasons.The fact that Chris put it out aloud doesnt mean that he was dreaming.I have dealt with many guys who percieve me to be Luo or kalenjin but when i mumble afew sentences in Kyuk they frown.When in the company of Kyuks i struggle to speak their langfuage to fit in coz they dont have bouqets for other tribes as well.So all this suspicion towards each other are real.Its just that it has been said on Kumekucha and its really the truth.

Such arguements that Kikuyus are like jews is laughable.Someone a kyuk for that matter was telling me that Kyuks control the economy of Kenya followed by Kisiis i dont know how true that is but i doubt they will be there without the input of this other tribes.Hardwork is always rewarded but not hardwork coupled with deception and a myriad of shortcuts.

The fact and the long and short of the whole thing and that must be accepted is that Kyuks are being resented countrywide.Reasons for that may vary from person to person.That is the truth.I will urge kumekuchas to approach Kikuyus individually and dont lump them together as bad creatures.Kila soko ina wazimu wake so among Kikuyus we also have good and bad people.

Kikuyu suceess is but a red herring and completely besides the piont. Its irrelevant to why they are so hated by the rest in kenya. Its like catching your neigbour bonking your wife and clapping him,then he tells you that your just jealous cause he has a bigger dick.Its just an explanation they give for the apparent haterade to distract, off course. I'm sure we all know plenty poor kuyos infact the majority are poor. Kenya is a country that actually celebrates thieves so stealing per see is not the main issue its the dominance issue that irks kenyans. Its one thing to have to live in barricaded houses its another to wonder wether the marks you got in school are a true reflection of your potential or somebody is playing games with your future. Or development in your area is purposely delayed or even derailed. These are the issues. Its the attempt to illegally acquire kenya inc. for personal use.Hardworking people are never bothered by others noise. If you know that your the fastest runner than everyone around you you wouldn't be bothered if they made empty claims cause you know that when the whistle is blown you will be the first on off the line and end up first on the other end.

Put simply if your good and you know it. you don't have to have the president as a tribesman and you will be at the forefront to have an even playing field so that your skills can come out plain and obvious. You would ask for majimbo so that you can develope your area as an example and compare with others. Take up the challange.Sir Alex

a) public service - dont care whether its a dog, cat or donkey on that counter, what matters is that i cn walk up to the counter get timely and efficient service and leave a satisfied customer. i immediately take offence if my perceived relationship to the animal on that counter will speed up or delay/derail the service obtained. past and current kibaki leadership is placing a certain category of animal in all these services and they in turn are only serving from their domain. first it was jomo then dan and emilio who we all thought would be different is actually worse

b) skewed distribution of public resources to favor presidents either cronies, region or other non-nationalistic grouping , agin firs it was jomo, then dan, and emilio who we all thought wold be different is actually worse.

c) deceit, lethargy, inability to discipline errant officers and other smokescreens where they say one thing and mean another (semi-illusionary economic leaps and bounds)

i see no tribe in all this, but inept leaderships and failed or failing institutions on account of poor leadership.

the trick and i really have to give it to these leadership con-artists, is how they are able to mobilize their tribesmen to rally behind them, when confronted with truth.