You ever notice how the assholes who don't have a legitimate argument and/or excuse, who when proven wrong, like clockwork, always refuse to accept the reality and/or facts and will inevitably try to turn debates and/or discussions into something about the people who prove them wrong?

Like this?.......

SPACEBROTHER wrote:

Prince sucks ass. Anybody who would admit to paying money to see and write a review out him on a Frank Zappa forum, of all places, is a poser and probably jacks off to his picture of Brett Michaels that he keeps under his pillow at night.

Did it ever occur to you that if you really knew what you were talking about you wouldn't have to peddle your expertise on a Frank Zappa forum?

Whatever the truth is, it's got nothing to do with right and wrong or good or bad. It's just there.

Spacebrother wrote:

The bottom line is, and always will be...

....life is a killer.

Y'all should leave Spacebrother alone, now. He's been driven off the deep end, and his posts can't be seen as reliable any longer. He's turned his "Gun Deaths" report into nothing more than a spoof of Disco Boy's repetitive form of debate. If you haven't already caught on to his only posting it as a joke, he even includes the "One. More. Time..." tagline ton make sure you know he isn't being serious.Now, he's trying to infer Disco Boy is gay, and so Disco Boy should, therefore, be ashamed.I understand how Spacebrother's previous run-in with an armed individual has given him a form of PTSD, and that this emotional scarring informs, and invalidates, everything he posts, but if you all don't let him be, you could do him irreparable harm.

_________________You're probably wondering why I'm here(not that it makes a heck of a lot of a difference to ya)

...case and point. Quoting from a thread about an entirely different topic in the last post on previous page. Typical manuever as a pathetic attempt to turn the debate into a topic of discussion about me, knowing that they have no legitimate argument left...

MAJOR SCHOOL SHOOTINGS IN THE UNITED STATES SINCE 1997 ----->Part 2: 2011

Berkeley, CA11/15/2011At 2:17 p.m., the UCPD got a 911 call about a man who reportedly had agun in a backpack at the Haas School of Business. At 2:19 p.m., threeofficers arrived at the school and found the suspect in a computer lab onthe third floor. The suspect pulled a gun out of his backpack, the policechief said, and displayed it “in a threatening manner.” The chancellor saidthere were four students in the vicinity of the suspect and the officers, andthat “it appeared students’ lives might be at risk.” After the officers told theman “numerous times” to drop his weapon, one of the three officers fired atthe suspect, Celaya said. No one else was injured in the incident.(Campus officials provide details about Haas School shooting, UCBerkeley News Center, November 15, 2011)

Fayetteville, NC10/25/2011Two teenagers were in custody in the shooting of a 15-year-old fellowstudent who was wounded in the neck during a lunch period outside herNorth Carolina high school, and a sheriff said Monday the pair will becharged. Abercrombie was in stable condition after surgery at Cape FearValley Medical Center, according to Butler, who said she was standing in abreezeway outside the school cafeteria when she was shot.( Cape FearHigh School Shooting: 1 Student Shot, Wounded At North Carolina School,Huffington Post, October 25, 2011)

Baltimore, MD10/14/2011A man was shot several times in the back in the parking garage on theUniversity of Maryland at Baltimore. The shooting happened at 6pm, andthe gunman fled. The man shot was taken to the nearest hospital in criticalcondition. The school enacted its “shelter in place” emergency protocol,and by 7:30 people were allowed to move about the buildings freely andcars were allowed to leave the parking lot. (Man shot several times inunderground parking garage in Baltimore, AP, October 14, 2011)

Harper Woods, MI8/26/2011A 15-year-old girl was wounded when shots were fired at the conclusion ofa football game at Chandler Park Academy in Harper Woods. When policearrived, witnesses said at least two people had been shot, but none of thevictims remained at the scene. Detroit police contacted Harper Woodsauthorities to report a 15-year-old girl, who was shot in the stomach in theacademy’s parking lot after the game, was taken or walked to a nearbyhouse in Detroit. An ambulance was called and transported the teenager toChildren’s Hospital in Detroit. (Harper Woods Police Investigating Shootingafter High School Football Game, Detroit News, August 29, 2011)

Mandeville, LA8/8/2011Three 15-year-old New Orleans-area boys were arrested for allegedlyplotting to shoot at least one student at Lakeshore High School and to killlaw enforcement officials who responded to the scene. Authorities said theboys named their group “Day Zero.” They had reportedly planned toacquire several guns and bring them to the school. Police collectedinformation from computers in the boys’ homes after other students told aschool administrator about the alleged plot. (Monday School Shooting PlotBroken Up, say La. Cops, Three Teens Arrested, CBSNEWS, August 8, 2011)

Pearl City, HI5/23/2011A student was injured when a .45 caliber Glock semi-automatic pistolaccidentally went off inside a middle school. The gun was unintentionallyfired by another student who had brought the gun in to school to show off tofriends. The bullet was shot through one student’s jacket and ricocheted offa wall before inflicting nonlethal injuries on the victim. (Accidental Shootingin Middle School Injures 1, KITV 4 HONOLULU, May 23, 2011)

Cleveland, OH05/23/2011A robbery attempt turned violent when a 16-year-old Benedictine HighSchool student, Sophomore Jackrell Russell, was shot in the chest by arobber. The teenager was approached by the suspect who demanded theboy's cell phone and school-issued laptop. Jackrell was able to flag down apassing RTA bus where a passenger called 9-1-1. He was taken to ahospital and stabilized. (Benedictine Student Shot In Chest During RobberyAttempt Monday Morning, Seeks Safety On RTA Bus, CLEVELAND PLAINDEALER, May 24, 2011)

Houston, TX04/19/2011Officials say three students were injured after a 6-year-old brought a loadedgun to his Houston elementary school that accidentally discharged when itfell out of the child's pocket. None of the injuries appeared life-threatening.(6-Year-Old Brings Gun To Texas School, 3 Hurt, SALON, April 19, 2011)

Los Angeles, CA04/15/2011A teenager was in custody today for allegedly shooting a 15-year-old boywho was shot as he walked to Los Angeles High School. A teenagesuspect was later arrested and taken to a juvenile lockup. Investigators saythe shooter and the victim, both boys, knew one another. The wounded boysuffered a bullet wound to the buttocks. A motive for the shooting was notdisclosed. (Teenager Taken Into Custody For Los Angeles High SchoolShooting, BEVERLY HILLS COURIER, April 16, 2011)

Apopka, FL04/13/2011One person suffered a non-life-threatening injury after a shooting outsideSheeler Charter High in Apopka. The victim and two others, including onestudent, were taken into custody. The victim was shot in the abdomen.Investigators believe the suspects, who do not attend the school, came tothe school to confront a student. (2 Teens Facing Charges after ShootingOutside School, WFTV, April 13, 2011)

Nashville, TN04/12/2011A 17-year-old girl was shot and injured when shots were fired into herschool bus. Two brothers, 18 and 19-years-old, were charged in theshooting outside Pearl Cohn High School. Police say the suspects'intended target was standing outside the bus at the time of the shooting.(Teen injured in Pearl Cohn shooting, WKRN – TV 2 NASHVILLE, April 13,2011)

Opelika, AL04/06/2011A 63-year-old woman was killed and three other people were wounded by agunman who opened fire outside the Higginbotham Academic Center atUnion State Community College. Investigators arrested a 34-year-old manwho admitted to the shooting which is believed to be domestic related. A36-year-old woman who was a student at the college was hurt along with a94-year-old woman and a four-year-old child who was injured by shatteredglass. The shooting took place while students were changing classes. (OneHurt After Shooting At Apopka Charter School For At-Risk Students,ORLANDO SENTINEL, April 14, 2011)

Houston, TX03/31/2011One person was killed and five others were injured during a shooting --believed to be gang-related -- just before 7 p.m. at Worthing High Schoolduring a powder puff football game. Eyewitnesses said a car, which policebelieve carried gang members, drove onto the athletic field and startedshooting. Six people were shot, one of whom was pronounced dead at anearby hospital. The identity of the victim has not been released. Thesuspects fled the scene but police managed to track down a gold FordTaurus with blood stains on its doors about five miles from the Texan highschool. At least one person was taken into custody. (One Dead, FiveInjured After Houston School Shooting, KETK, April 1, 2011)

Martinsville, IN03/25/2011A shooting suspect was apprehended and police searched for a gun hoursafter a shooting at a middle school in which a student was injured. Theshooting took place at Martinsville West Middle School. The victim wasshot twice in the stomach. The shooting involved a student who wasrecently either expelled or suspended from school, authorities said.(Student Hurt, Suspect Arrested in School Shooting, WRTV-6, March 25,2011)

Los Angeles, CA02/23/2011A student was arrested for shooting and killing his instructor at the CoastCareer Institute vocational school. The shooting took place inside a schoolclassroom right in front of the class. The 22-year-old gunman was trainingto become a security guard. He fired at least 10-rounds from a semiautomatichandgun at point-blank range then went outside and waited untilpolice arrived. (Suspect briefly left security guard class before returning andopening fire, police say, LOS ANGELES TIMES, February 23, 2011)

Murfreesboro, TN02/14/2011A fight led to a shooting at Middle Tennessee State University. Theshooting suspect, a 20-year-old MTSU junior, was arrested. The 20-yeadoldvictim, a former MTSU student, was shot in the hand when the bulletricocheted off the ground and hit his thumb. The campus was put on alertfor nearly 45-minutes until the gunman was apprehended. (Shooting atMiddle Tennessee State University slightly injures man, THE TENNESSEAN,February 15, 2011)

Youngstown, OH02/06/2011One person was killed and 11 were injured in a shooting at an after-hoursparty near the Youngstown State University campus. The deceased was auniversity student. Six of the injured were also students at the university.Two suspects were arrested. (2 suspects charged in Youngstown fraternityshooting, CLEVELAND PLAIN DEALER, FEBRUARY 06, 2011)

Placerville, CA02/02/2011A disagreement between a custodian and an elementary school principalover the hiring of a nighttime janitor led to the principal's fatal shooting. Theshooter was told to leave Louisiana Schnell Elementary School earlier inthe day but later came back to the school, went to the principal's office, andfired two rounds killing the principal. No children were hurt. (Suspect, principal quarreled before Placerville School shooting, THE HERALD -MONTEREY CO., February 04, 2011)

Los Angeles, CA01/18/2011A 15-year-old girl and a 15-year-old boy were hurt when a 9-mm Berettainside a fellow student's backpack went off at Gardena High School. Bothvictims were hit by the same bullet. The bullet hit one victim in the headand the other in the neck and shoulder. The 17-year-old suspect wasalready on probation for a misdemeanor battery charge. (Girl critical afterLos Angeles school shooting, USA TODAY, January 18, 2011)

Omaha, NE01/05/2011A 17-year-old student shot the principal and assistant principal at MillardSouth High School before fleeing the school and shooting and killinghimself. The assistant principal later died of her injuries. The gun used bythe teen was a Glock .40 believed to be the service weapon of his father,an Omaha police officer. (Millard South shooting: Suspension ignited fury,OMAHA WORLD-HERALD, January 05, 2011)

South Bend, IN12/26/2011Eugene Sims, Jr, 30, was shot by police in the 600-block of LaPorte Ave. inSouth Bend after he pointed an assault rifle at officers. Police first sawSims driving near Scott St. and United St. around 4:15 Monday afternoon.Sims was considered a person of interest in a vehicle arson and policeinitially tried to pull him over to speak to him about the fire. Instead, Simsdrove to a family home in the 600-block of LaPorte Ave. When threeofficers approached the car, Sims pointed an assault rifle out of his window.The officers opened fire on Sims and hit him once in the left arm. No policeofficers were injured. (Man wielding assault rifle shot by police, WNDU.comDecember 26, 2011).

Hudson County, NJ12/25/2012In the violent robbery Sunday, two men armed with a handgun and a “longassault-type firearm” robbed the owner of Fine Fare Supermarket, 3000Kennedy Blvd., and five customers about 10:20 p.m., police spokesman Lt.Edgar Martinez said. (Hudson County has violent Christmas weekend, withcustomers pistol-whipped during supermarket robbery, others involved instabbings, robberies, NJ.com, December 25, 2011)

Chicago, IL11/03/2011Three men who prosecutors said left four dead and two injured afterentering a Far South Side store earlier this week with their semi-automaticweapons blazing were denied bail today. At least one employee returnedfire after several gunmen burst into the store firing an AK-47 assault rifleand two 9mm handguns at about 9:30 p.m. Tuesday, prosecutors said. (3denied bail in shootout that left 4 dead, 2 injured Chicago Tribune,November 5, 2011)

Cupertino, CA10/5/2011Three workers were killed and seven more injured at a cement plant duringthe early morning. The gunman began shooting during a safety meetingwith more than a dozen co-workers. After shooting coworkers, the gunmanretrieved an AK-47 he had brought and fled the scene and police began aday long manhunt. (California Police Search for Gunman in Shooting ThatLeft Three Workers Dead, Officer.com, October 6, 2011)

Helena, AR9/23/2011A man was shot and killed by a gunman who used an assault weapon at 2am. Gunman was eventually arrested and the weapon was recovered. Theweapon was a SKS 7/62, which is an assault rifle. (Possible weapon foundin Jerry Henry homicide, The Daily World Helena-Arkansas, September28, 2011)

Carson City, NV9/6/2011A gunman opened fire killing four and injuring seven at an IHOP. Thegunman used an assault rifle on customers before turning the gun onhimself. The weapon used had been altered to function as an automaticweapon. The gunman had a record of mental illness. (Shooter UsedIllegally Altered Gun in Nevada IHOP Rampage, Police SaymyFOXdc.com October 5, 2011)

Oakland, CA07/3/2011The victim was driving to his cousin’s house after ending work at a localrestaurant and after getting out of the car he was shot and killed in the backwith an assault weapon. There was another shooting within an hours of thisshooting. The police have reason to believe the killings are related to gangturf wars, however the first victim appeared to have nothing to do with thegangs. (Police, family of slain Richmond man search for answers, San JoseMercury News, August 23, 2011)

New York, NY06/18/2011Following a confrontation with several teenagers, a man returned to hishome and fired on the teenagers with an unlicensed assault rifle from hiswindow on the second story. Two of the teens were wounded in theshooting. (NY Man fires rifle at teens outside home, wounds 2, ASSOCIATEDPRESS, June 19, 2011)

Wheat Ridge, CO6/16/2011A man wielding an assault rifle was attempting to rob a cell phone storewhen a customer and employee who thought the gun was fake tried tosubdue him. The man beat them back with his weapon and fired severalrounds through the glass front door to make his escape. There were noserious injuries. (Will Ripley, Robber shoots his way out of cell phone store,KUSA-TV NBC 9 NEWS, June 16, 2011)

Laurinburg, NC6/4/2011Two men were shot multiple times and killed while sitting in their car in theparking lot of a shopping center. The shooter, a 33 year old man, wasarmed with an AK-47 assault rifle. The shooter was friends with one of thevictims although they had recently gotten into a dispute over a dogfight.(Kayloni Wyatt, Laurinburg man charged with double homicide, THELAURINBURG EXPRESS, June 7, 2011)

Pensacola, FL5/30/2011A man fired numerous rounds from an AK-47 assault rifle into the storefrontof a seafood market after he called the store and was informed that theywere out of crawfish. After a car chase and the subsequent arrest, policefound several additional loaded guns in his vehicle. The mental stability ofthe man has been called into question following statements he made topolice claiming to be part of an “anti-government extremist group.” No onewas injured on the shooting. (Travis Griggs, Mudbugged: Crawfishshortage spurs shooting at business, PENSACOLA NEWS JOURNAL, June 2,2011)

Merrillville, IN5/24/2011A man fired an assault rifle on his neighbors after they attempted to breakup an altercation between the man and his ex-girlfriend. The man shotseveral rounds through the front door and windows of his neighbors’ housewhere two children were inside. No one was injured in the shootingalthough the man stabbed his ex-girlfriend during their confrontation. (RuthAnne Krause, Merrillville man fires assault rifle at neighbors, POST-TRIBUNEOF THE CHICAGO SUN-TIMES, May 24, 2011)

Columbia, SC4/27/2011A 22-year-old man shot a police officer during a traffic stop with an AK-47assault rifle. He then fled to his home where police followed and demandedhis surrender. The young man came out of his house and shot at swatmembers surrounding the home. Police returned fire killing the young man.(Columbia Police Officer Shot; suspect with Ak-47 killed, The State, April27, 2011)

Folly Beach, SC3/30/2011A dispute that started in a night club eventually erupted into a series ofshootings that took place in multiple locations nearby. One man was killedand two others suffered gunshot wounds. Numerous shell casing fromeither an AK-47 or an SKS assault rifle were recovered by police from themultiple crimes scenes. (Schuyler Kropf, 4 S.C. crime scenes tied to onenight of violence, death, Charlotte Observer, March 31, 2011)

Garden City, NY3/1/2011A man crashed his car and then shot a firefighter who came to his aid. Hethen began firing on police who had rushed to the scene. Police returnedfire and killed the man. He was armed with an arsenal of six guns and hadnumerous additional clips of ammunition strapped to his body. The gunsincluded an assault rifle with a laser scope which he fired at police. (FrankEltman, NY Police: Gunman Intended to Commit Mass Murder,Associated Press, March 3, 2011, Sophia Hall, Driver who fired at NYfirefighter was heavily armed, Reuters, March 2, 2011)

Eclectic, AL1/3/2011A drive-by shooting left a six-year-old girl dead and her uncle wounded.Three men were responsible for the late-night shooting. They shot 18rounds from either an AK-47 or SKS assault rifle. (Six-Year-Old AlabamaGirl Killed in Drive-By Shooting, Associated Press, January 5, 2011)

Regardless, the a facts are remain the same...The laws work where they are implemented and enforced -----> States with Higher Gun Ownership and Weak Gun Laws Lead Nation in Gun Death

You can't turn night to day with statistics. Good and evil have been around for a long, long time. Much longer than you. Whining about isms and statistics wont change it. Laws wont change it. You're merely licking the wounds of your failure.

The laws won't end all acts of evil, but they go a long way to curb/reduce them. The statistical data proves that beyond all reasonable doubt...unless of course, statistical data is beyond ones comprehension to digest, whether out of personal beliefs that cloud logic, selective ignorance, or just plain stupidity. Look at my lists throughout this thread and tell me where most of the gun related crimes occur per capita.

Regarding licking ones wounds and failure, I'd say your responses speak for themselves. Why else would you and the other three or four fellow members of the lemming committee be so vehement into steering the conversation away from the serious debate into a discussion about me?

Further regards to licking wounds of failure, since the Newtown school shooting, and despite the failure of the Senate and the Congress to pass gun legislation on a national level, on a state level, there is solid progress, and obvious failures. The states that have the highest gun crime rates per capita are among those who are even further loosening their laws...

WOOOT !Because only a certified idiot will assure that a whistle is a good method to prevent attacks. If you love the women in your life, empower them with the proper amount of firepower because their lives depend on it..

Do the anti-gun controllers believe that crimes involving guns (murder, robbery etc.) would rise if there were stricter gun control laws in the US? Are there any neutral statistics (i.e. from a source that has no ax to grind) that would support this view?

_________________"I have learned from my mistakes, and I am sure I can repeat them exactly."

Do the anti-gun controllers believe that crimes involving guns (murder, robbery etc.) would rise if there were stricter gun control laws in the US? Are there any neutral statistics (i.e. from a source that has no ax to grind) that would support this view?

Interesting with this particular source, as the graph shows a drastic decrease in gun related victims when the assault weapons ban was put into place in the early 1990's, and since the overturning of the assault weapons ban in the early 2000's, the numbers of victims are on the increase.

I'm sure one or more of the forums group of lemmings will chime in with some highly intellectual response like "dumb fuck" or some similar title and/or attempt to be funny, and try to steer the conversation into a discussion about me. In fact, I guarantee it.

snips from link:In 1996, the NRA successfully lobbied Congress to put this restriction into the CDC's budget: "None of the funds made available ... may be used to advocate or promote gun control."

The NRA was infuriated with a 1993 study sponsored by the CDC that concluded having a gun at home offered little protection, but it increased almost three-fold the risk of one family member shooting another.

CDC funding into gun violence research has plummeted 96 percent since 1996, to just $100,000 of last year's $5.6 billion CDC budget.

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