There is something intrinsically annoying about people’s assumptions about why people choose a vegetarian diet.

Back in the UK, whenever Partner said he was vegetarian, the guaranteed question was, ‘Is that because your wife is?’ as though he didn’t have a mind of his own.

For anyone who doesn’t know, we stopped eating meat together. And then chicken. And then fish. We made joint decisions that we were both happy with.

Or people ie men, would ask him if he wanted a bacon sandwich. Yawn.

On the other hand, he would have breakfast with other construction workers, and they would cheerfully eat a vegetarian breakfast with him, even though they ate meat. Customers often asked him if he wanted a sandwich, and would quite happily put together a vegetarian one for him without commenting on how weird he was.

I’ve heard the assumption of ‘you must be vegetarian because your wife is’ before. The implication being a) that you are only vegetarian because your wife is and b) that being vegetarian is a sort of soppy woman’s thing.

This is a particularly stupid assumption, the concept being that women can’t handle the concept of dead animals. As someone who regularly went to the bacon factory full of dead pigs, and then sliced them up and served them to customers, I think I’ve handle my fair share of dead pigs. And believe me, if you walk into any pig smokehouse they do not look like bits of nicely packaged meat sitting tidily on the supermarket shelf. They look like pieces of dead pig which is exactly what they are.

But there is an underlying concept to all this, which is, that it is tough and macho to kill animals. Some women take up hunting, shooting and fishing. They become ‘one of the boys’.

So men who don’t want to eat meat must be strange. They can’t possibly choose that themselves.

Look at the paleo craze. Lots and lots of lovely meat just like our cavemen ancestors used to hunt and eat. Same idea. They didn’t do that before they invented fire, they gathered nuts and berries, which is very wimpish is it not? Real men eat steak. Remember the ‘real men eat quiche too’ phase? Originally men were derided for eating quiche. How silly is that? If you ate quiche you weren’t a ‘real’ man.

Dear me.

At a Christmas lunch on a former firm, Partner left the appalling venue which catered to his vegetarian request by serving three types of potatoes (roast, mashed and boiled) to find his workmates had stuffed his pockets full of sausages. Tee hee. So funny.

On top of that, he was called gay. Because he didn’t eat meat. So let’s have a go at women for being soppy about not eating meat, and also drag in the gays. If anyone hasn’t worked this out yet, calling him gay because he didn’t eat meat was meant to be an insult.

Why do people feel the need to insult not just someone who has made a choice not to eat meat, but assume that he is therefore either gay or doing it because his woman doesn’t like eating meat? thereby insulting everyone all round.

Killing animals is macho. Dealing with dead animals is tough and macho. Gutting them, plucking feathers, slicing them up. Eating big pieces of bloody steak is macho. If you don’t like any of that you are a softy wuss. Or similar words.

Why on earth do we impart our prejudices onto diet? Online, you can read about fat gay vegan bloggers. In real life I have yet to meet one. I know a fat non-meat eating dope smoker. No idea about his sexual orientation nor do I care.

But we associate a non-meat diet with women and gays. Why? Well, I know the answer, but we shouldn’t be doing it.

How about another example of our patriarchal society, before I clear off to make bread?

Dogs. We define ourselves by our dogs. Real men have BIG dogs. Macho dogs. My father had boxers and a ridgeback. REAL dogs for REAL men. I like big dogs too but not for the same reason. Now we have a small Podenco in the pack. And my partner is perfectly happy to take him out for a walk without feeling his masculinity is affected.

And the point of this post is that prejudice and cultural conditioning is everywhere. The need to be tough and macho permeates our society.

He doesn’t like quiche very much in case anyone wanted to know.

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About roughseasinthemed

I write about my life as an English person living in Spain and Gibraltar, on Roughseas, subjects range from politics and current developments in Gib to book reviews, cooking and getting on with life.
My views and thoughts on a variety of topics - depending on my mood of the day - can be found over on Clouds. A few pix are over on Everypic - although it is not a photoblog.
And of course my dog had his own blog, but most of you knew that anyway. Pippadogblog etc

31 Responses to Real men eat quiche ?

Ha ha – I loved your rant. It has been a long time since anyone suggested to me that a plant-based diet or some other behavior was not manly. I guess my crowd is more the tree-hugging, granola-crunching type. Having loved ones in same-sex relationships and a daughter in rehabilitative social work has contributed to my view of what is manly or acceptable for any gender identity. The humor I found in your article came from me imagining people who are so trapped in their narrow vision of what is normal. Thanks for a fun read. – Mike

Hi Mike. You obviously live in a more civilised part of the world than I do 😀 I like trees too, but I have yet to make it to granola.

Doesn’t everyone know someone, either family or close friends, who is in a same-sex relationship? And so what? As if it matters. Doesn’t harm anyone. The sadness comes in when the couple concerned aren’t able to say they are in a relationship because of prejudice and bigotry. One of my friends married her lesbian partner a couple of years back and had hundreds of goodwill messages on FaceBook. And that’s how it should be. They’d both been married to men before and each have a couple of kids. She mentioned her husband only once to us, and the look on her face said it all.

We all grow up with prejudice and inborn views or learn them from our parents and friends. It’s getting rid of them and learning to think for ourselves that is important. Maybe then we can say we have grown up. And thank you for your comment.

My father’s view was that it took a real man to take his wife’s pekinese for a walk…but he couldn’t have given a monkeys what sort of dog he had on the end of a lead and any ‘real man’ questioning his choice of dog – or food – would have had a lesson in reality that would be long remembered.
I was lucky…he pointed out to me the absurdities of the ‘real man’ nonsense when I was young as a way of showing the opposition I would be facing in wanting to do a ‘man’s’ job, so the cultural stereotypes remained just that and were not internalised.

Why is is that the ‘real men’ are so insecure? Do they feel, perhaps, that if they stopped eating rawish ribs of beef and running round with rottweilers that people might notice what a bunch of wimps they really are?

I think your father was in a different league to the men I knew of a similar age. But there again your background wasn’t working class Yorkshire 😀

My father probably wanted a son and ended up with a girl, so I had a somewhat skewed upbringing of getting some macho values imparted onto me, and yet expected to behave like a good little girl. For example, after work on a Saturday, he would count the money and I would do the books. We would then take the money to the night safe, and call at the pub together for a beer. Meanwhile, my mother was in her dutiful position of kitchen slave cooking supper. On Sundays, we would go to the rugby match together, while my mother stayed at home – in the kitchen of course, preparing dinner.

Partner and I nearly got a rottie once from the shelter, but the pups were too young so we took the black lab instead. They are lovely dogs though. When an English electrician came to rewire our finca house, he was somewhat down on his luck so we fed him. Then we told him to bring the dog (rottie) and I fed him too. Such a sweet temperament, but so powerful, he nearly knocked me over when he jumped up to give me a kiss. Nor did Colin moan about vegetarian food for lunch. A hot Thai curry and a mashed potato dish went down very well. He had the rottie because his obnoxious wife couldn’t live without one. Except she left both him and the rottie when she had spent all his money.

I think a lot of men can’t rid themselves from the ‘me Tarzan you Jane image’ so obviously can’t be seen to be what they would term as weak. They have to be seen as Mr Macho, the provider, the hunter etc.
As for dogs, that made me smile. T has for years said he’d never be seen with a small dog……you ought to see him now with his little Yorkie pal 🙂
Helen has hit the nail on the head, regarding wimps hiding behind the so the called ‘macho dog breeds’ which in turn gives those dogs a bad name……leading into another pet hate of mine.

Me Tarzan you Jane, is a very good analogy. I can write reams about feminism and patriarchal/kyriarchal society and you sum it up in four words 😀

Small dog syndrome is funny. My dad was exactly like T, and yet their last (rescue finally) dog was a small staffie or something. I’ll post him up at some point, he was a darling. They got him when I was married, but he was always so pleased to see me, to my parents’ surprise. My dad enjoyed taking him out because he was so friendly and affectionate. A and I were the same, not for the same reasons, but just a preference or big dogs, everyone likes different types of dogs. And yet you should see A with Snows. Exactly the same as T with Cindy I suspect. Moreso, Cindy doesn’t go to bed with you two does she? 😀

Men have a lot to answer for and giving ‘macho breeds’ a bad name is very very bad. The words Michael Vick come to mind.

Can I have his piece of quiche?
People who jump to conclusions and generalities are annoying. Why is it everyone now has to manage everyone else’s life these days – who cares? And why should they? Oh, well
We like bumping around with big dogs. As kids we both had neighbors with annoying tiny dogs you really wanted to kick through the hedge…they brought it on themselves, the little snarlers. Still we did have a Westie…a big dog on short legs…attitude defines the dog, right Snowy?
My older brother laughs at the fact that husband like cats. I did point out that neither cats nor dogs like older brother. He’s rather stiff and non cuddly…and cranky.
Great read, thanks

You could, but I haven’t made it in years. I make pie instead as we both like pie.

I suspect people want to manage others’ lives because they can’t manage their own?

I’ve always had and liked big dogs, but, a dog is a dog, and just like with people you shouldn’t judge on appeareances. I remember your westie tales and I have heard others too about them. Very individual personalities. They are quite popular in spain, ‘un westie’ 😀

I was browsing the tinties yesterday and reading about galgos and podencos. There was a nicely worded cautious warning about podencos being something of a handful (I paraphrase). I heard him chewing something last night, and discovered my pullover (which I had thought was out of reach) had three buttons missing and a new hole. He’s currently looking for something else to chew, because toys are like, so boring. Hey Molly come play chewing?

I’m always ill at ease with people who have no affinity with animals. Or rather with people who animals don’t like. There is a reason for that.

Snowy is considering that monkeys are invading his space. Pippa doesn’t give two hoots. But Little One? He doesn’t give a **** how big the monkey is, if I don’t scoop him up he will bark at it. LOUDLY!!

I look at the monkey. and think my poor little dog. I don’t know why I think that when he would be capable of shredding a monkey to pieces. Monkeys have nasty teeth, but Snowy’s? His incisors/eyeteeth are amazing. That is a post to come when I have a decent pic of them.

And yet, he is wary of people that he doesn’t know. Very, very wary. An unusual breed. Not just attitude, but Podenco attitude. We have a new word, ‘it’s been Podencoed’. Cindy and Snowy had better not meet! Actually he would probably want to shag her.

I was brought up in the hippy era, with a father who was from the old firm, typical macho man, Probably due to living through the war era.He did not like me and my ways much, being musical and artistic was not his idea of a male. But me and friends were live and let live. Take people for what they were. Gay, lesbian, vegetarian, and it mattered not what dog they walked. I walked our husky and then a beagle. Oh yeh and please pass the quiche. I could not help but smile at your writings again. which brings memories forth.

You’re not much older than me. I remember your guess my age competition 😀 so my father was pretty much the same, also the war era generation. He had the same stereotypical views. Sadly I didn’t get to do the hippy scene. Not a lot of hippies in Yorkshire 😦 Well, there probably were, but I didn’t meet them.

Telling my parents we were vegetarian was not easy. My mother never cooked for us again. There was never anything for us to eat when we visited. She used to do a delicious onion quiche, perfect cauliflower cheese, and a wonderful mushrooms and onions dish. But no. When Partner went to redecorate their house, she panicked about what to feed him. I gave her a list of things she had cooked in the past. He ended up cooking for himself and buying a couple of pub meals.

Partner walks the husky/GSD and I walk little Snowy. Except Snows likes A to take him out sometimes in the evening on his own, so off they both go. Who cares about walking a small dog? What does it matter? The teeth on him would rip you shreds anyway, but that’s a minor matter.

I was so absorbed in this post, and enjoyed the lighter side… I remember such sentiments… judgments, and of course ‘real men don’t each quiche’ was rampant. I never took that seriously. Everyone I know eats quiche.
Once again I’m thankful for my melting-pot-demographic-environs where it’s not apparent that anyone cares if someone prefers men or/and women, meat, veges, big/small dogs, cats, rats, rabbits, ferrets or parrots.
That other people’s preferences are still an issue to some confounds me, in some cases saddens me where the prejudices are active and damning.
I do wonder at their motivation though… why tilt at windmills?

It was really inspired by another post I read that made me think about how even the food we eat is coloured, or clouded with, cultural assuptions based on a sexist perspective. I could probably have written it more thoughtfully, but then it would have been longer and more boring and and and

I forgot to add the story of my father and the prawn quiche, which I may or may not have posted earlier. I’ll save it for a follow-up 😀 But the short story was, that he said ‘I don’t want any of that fancy muck’. Which beautifully mirrors the prevalent view of the time about eating quiche when a proper meal was lots of meat on the plate.

Sydney was a pretty good mix even back in my time there. Cosmopolitan, fluid, and pretty laid-back. Moving away from your home environment helps to learn other points of view and perspectives. One of the reasons I like city life is that you get so much diversity and people aren’t in your face.

Lack of self confidence? The need to deride others? Putting other people down makes us feel better? Sometimes even without the intention because that’s how we were brought up and conditioned to think? No answers from me, just more questions.

I’m not much a quiche fan myself. One of my buddies back home (a male) convinced his wife that they should be vegan. I hadn’t heard or maybe I haven’t paid close attention to this, but I didn’t know a lot of people assumed men who are vegetarian are gay. I’ve heard the wife comment before, just not the gay connection.

It’s just the whole ‘it’s not man enough’ scenario. Not helped by the fact that Partner works in the macho construction industry. And on top of that, he is a decorator.

Decorators are also considered gay, possibly because it is not a ‘heavy’ trade, ie you don’t lump bricks around. He’s got two younger men working with him who get tired before he does. It’s a far more physical trade than it appears. Regardless of that, there is no reason to assume that someone who is gay can’t do the job or why it should be even relevant. Same for food. Stupid prejudices.

My research tells me that here is approximately a 60:40 female/male vegetarian ratio. I would of guessed at that sort of split I think. Perhaps generally more women prepare food and raw meat isn’t terribly attractive, perhaps they witness the slaughter in the markets? I don’t think I have an explanation for it.

I have never thought that male vegetarians are gay I have to say. Personally I just couldn’t imagine a diet without meat but I am not making a judgement there.

When I worked in housing maintenance I often heard people say that painting and decorating isn’t a real trade (a macho thing I agree) but I always disagreed with that because they may not carry bricks in their underpants or bend copper pipe with their teeth but to be a good decorator, along with carpet laying, is a skill that the good lord thought that I could manage without! Thumbs up to decorators everywhere I say!

I’ll stay off the subject of dogs (macho or otherwise) especially as a child has been mauled to death again only this week in the UK by a domestic canine pet!

I would have guessed similarly too, or maybe higher ie 70/30. Although my mother wasn’t vegetarian she did prepare all the food – my dad’s culinary skills were open can of soup, make doorstep sandwiches, and softboil an egg – and she often skipped the meat and ate a plate of veg. In her later years when I went to stay with her, she wasn’t remotely interested in meat. I even got her to eat a Chinese veg take-away!

It’s very easy, but after 25 or more years I would say that wouldn’t I? 😀 Just a different mindset.

The toshing a coat of paint on mentality is quite interesting. Every year in the UK when summer came around, A would struggle the first week or two, and then he would be back into throwing double extension ladders around like a bag of feathers. And climbing up and down them. It’s quite funny that younger men than him moan ‘my legs are tired’, ‘my arms ache’. When you aren’t used to it, it’s not quite such an easy job after all.

It’s probably the most ‘arty’ of all the craft trades. It’s not technical like plumbing or leccy (classed as tech rather than craft), it’s just, well, different. It’s wet and it’s dry in terms of materials used. Then there are the ancillary ‘little jobs’ that go with it. We did a flat refurb before Christmas that involved plumbing, joinery, electrical and painting. We could have done it all, but the client wanted it finished quickly so we got a couple of other people in to do some of the other work. It’s a multi-skilled world these days in construction and most of us do most things. But decorating is a finishing trade and if you get a poor decorator in, the whole job looks crap 😀

Don’t say you are staying off the subject and then mention it! The Alaskan malamute yes? Anyway, I’ll bite, so to speak. What I always want to know in these situations is where are the parents? Seriously. Do not leave babies and small children alone with animals. How difficult is that one?

Nor is a ‘suspected attack’ the same as being mauled to death so stop aping tabloid journalism, unless there has been an update. And in the previous – pit bull – case, the parents were initially held for manslaughter. What is wrong with people that they can’t keep dogs and kids apart? Or what is wrong with their home environment? They shouldn’t have kids. They certainly shouldn’t have dogs.

And finally I have a cross husky. Not a Malamute, but a Sibe. Crossed with a nasty GSD (ie the cause of your original dog phobia). Out of the five dogs we have ever had, he is the most gentle one ever. Occasionally people, ie kids and adults, ask before they run up to stroke him, hug him, cuddle, whatever. Most just grab hold of him. Two women last night couldn’t resist a quick hug. I don’t know enough about Malamutes but certainly Sibes are very loving and loveable dogs.

But I also think classification of ‘dangerous’ dogs by breed is silly anyway. Surely the responsibility should always be on the owner? It’s like the other case a while back where the woman lied about having a kid and shouldn’t have had a dog in sheltered accommodation anyway. Is that the dog’s fault?

Dogs. No it it is absolutely the owners fault and that is why I say that there should be some sort of test before people are allowed to keep one – rather like the driving test! You’d be ok, you would pass but I would still have an annual dog licence fee set at an appropriate level that would deter irresponsible ownership!

Ridiculous. I totally object to the thought of taking a test to keep a dog. I dislike the shelters wanting to come and visit, let alone taking a test. And why set a licence fee at a high cost to discriminate against people of low (if any) income who may be perfectly responsible?

After more than 50 years of living with dogs, I have no intention of being subjected to a nanny state test to prove that I can manage a dog.

I home dogs for one reason, and that is because they have been dumped on the street or at shelters. Not for my entertainment or amusement, but because someone has chucked them out.

Why pick on dogs for tests and licences? How about cats, or guinea pigs or pythons. Or horses. A schoolfriend got a broken leg when her horse sat on her. A window cleaner we knew died when the horse fell on top of him.

Licence fees or tests wouldn’t deter irresponsible ownership at all. How many people do you know with a driving licence who NEVER speed?

How about a licence for breeding children though? That would be good. Those small obnoxious little things that run around and make a lot of noise and generally disrupt life?

As you say, no more about dogs as I’m having the last word 🙂 Late reply as Ms Dog Owner took out Little Dog, and also wanted to try and educate him to learn not to bark at monkeys!!

Yeah it is funny how people will try to label others based on something like being vegetarian. My best mate is vegetarian (though has the odd slip up when pissed lol) and you wouldn’t know to look at him – sure he’s gay, but he’s also a strapping Scottish lad who’s a metal-head and used to be in a couple hard metal bands. And he’s covered in tattoos. But still he gets funny looks when he orders the vegetarian option. He never begrudges me my meat but has also introduced me to the yummy Quorn alternatives which I do pick up for myself from time to time.

What gripes me about it is the double, no triple whammy. It’s wrong to be vegetarian, it’s wrong to be gay, and it’s really a woman’s thing because they are like that. Score points for discriminating against three different groups in society at once.

Partner is not gay (that I know of), he’s not strapping, but he does have a set of shoulders on him and moves very fast even at his old age. He doesn’t get the funny looks though interestingly. Working with idiots was one thing, but eating out – it doesn’t happen.

Fave Quorn one here at the mo is the fake steak pies (had two last night). The fish pie thing was good but a rip off for the price given that I can mash my own potato. Lamb grills work well cooked and sliced to go (cold) in sandwiches. Cheese and broccoli escalopes are ok too. They are an easy meal when inspiration is lacking and fridge is empty. Don’t like the mince, prefer TVP. Not too keen on the fake bacon slices either – I prefer tempeh. Redwood do fantastic rashers if you have a health food shop near you. Otherwise buy tempeh and marinate in tamari or shoyu for half an hour or so.

I don’t think anyone has teased my hubby for being vegan. Of course, he’s short, bald, sensitive and an actor so he’s had more than his fair share of harassment. One of the things that attracted me to him was his self confidence and not caring what others think about him. So if anyone did pester him about being vegan, it wouldn’t ruffle him.

I have noticed that when we’re out with my brother, however; that he makes it verbally clear to whoever is around that he’s not vegan and that he wants to eat meat. I get the sense that even being associated with vegans makes him feel less masculine. Whatever bro! Anywho, an enjoyable read! Celeste 🙂

It’s often assumed that Partner’s gay anyway by virtue of him being a decorator. Apparently, according to him, there are quite a lot of gay decorators in the trade. Or maybe, it’s more acceptable in that trade because it’s not seen as being so ‘macho’ as say, bricklaying. A couple of TV scriptwriters he met in the pub were most disappointed to find out he was straight.

Working in construction is odd. A lot of the other trades snipe at the decorators, but having said that, the deccies tend to be an odd lot anyway. On one of his previous firms, they got half an hour for breakfast and they would all go and buy one somewhere from a pub. Except the decorators used to often go elsewhere on their own, and would usually eat the same as Partner, ie no meat.

So a bit like your husband (well, not short and bald, he’s tall and got hair!) he’s used to getting flack thrown at him, but he’s never had a problem with saying he’s veg in 20+ years. It’s always other people that seem to have the problem. You know the types. As soon as you say you are veg*n, they immediately say they don’t eat much meat at all, or they don’t like it, or they eat mostly chicken and fish (which is ok to them because it isn’t meat) or lots of pasta or or or. Believe me, over the years I have heard it all. It often feels as though they are apologising for not being veg*n. It’s a different reaction, but not dissimilar to the opposite attitude of being insulting. Two things I suppose. One, by rejecting what most people choose to eat you put yourself in a minority group, and two, it’s very much a question of ethics – which can make others feel inferior hence the defensive/aggressive attitudes. Enough!! Thanks for the comment and follow Celeste.

People can be so narrow-minded! I would be insulted if someone assumed I did something simply because my wife did it no matter what it is.

I’ve often thought about becoming a vegetarian and I’ll admit that if Pat became one, it would make it much easier for me to become one. But, when I decide to do something, I usually do it, regardless.

So I may yet, who knows. I’m not overly fond of pork and beef anyway. Pork is already out, beef is on its way out. That basically leaves chicken, lamb and fish. These will be harder for me to give up. I may actually get there whether Pat does or not.

It’s not so much the ghastly hen-pecked stereotype but the fact that men can’t decide what to eat themselves. We eat different breakfasts. I did pasta tonight, he likes cheese with his, I don’t. The point being, that if he wants cheese and butter, he gets it, I don’t need to eat it, he doesn’t need to do without it because I don’t want it. I’m a would-be vegan and we both have been before.

I’m sure it is much easier when people decide to change a diet together, a bit like stopping smoking or drinking. The way we did it was quite progressive, as in we did it all by stages, and the rationale changed over time too. For me now, it is totally ethical, but we started off for health reasons, ie deciding to cut down on red meat consumption. I still maintain it is a healthier way to eat, but not eating dead animals and causing less damage to the environment are what would stop me eating meat again.

I did like meat. All of it. But it wasn’t difficult to stop. One of the good things I did when we first started, was to write up menus for the week, so whoever got in first knew what to prepare. Chucking two lamb/pork shops under the grill plus potatoes and a veg is a little easier than making sauces from scratch, nut dishes, bean dishes blah blah.

Today we had a pasta arrabiata, yesterday was a tofu/veg casserole plus mashed potatoes, the day before may have been Quorn escalopes, veg, tatoes, the day before that was fresh peas, carrots, white turnips, seitan, potatoes, and on Monday it was cauliflower and pasta in white sauce.

If you want to change your diet for whatever reason, health or ethics, then I would say doing it poco a poco is the best way to change. Less disruption to your body, and easier to cope with mentally too. You don’t need to worry about protein, westerners eat far too much anyway. There are some sound blogs with good advice and a lot with the most ridiculous recipes I have seen in years. You know where I am if you have any questions.

Thanks Kate! You’re very supportive. I would be doing it for both health and ethical reasons. I’m becoming more and more interested in the welfare of animals and I have super-high cholesterol. I have to take a cholesterol pill everyday now. That’s when I started cutting back. So it’s highly likely that I will eventually go down the road to being a vegy. 🙂

I’ve been doing this for more than 20 years. Or is it more than 25? Anyway, long enough. I’m still alive and haven’t dropped dead with anaemia or any other silly mythical illness associated with not eating meat.

One big mistake people used to make 20 or 30 years ago was to substitute meat/chicken/fish with eggs or cheese. This was in the days of you must get your five hits of protein from meat, fish, chicken, eggs, milk/cheese.

If you want to start to try out vegetarian products, try for example, tempeh rashers (not the quorn ones, they aren’t a patch on tempeh). Tempeh is a soya product, it’s basically fermented soya beans so not an overly manufactured product.

If you make curries, add ground almonds to your sauce for flavour, protein, and lots of other goodies.

Some quorn products are ok. Depending on your supermarkets, you may be able to get Cauldron or Redwood. Cauldron do very good tofu sausages, redwood does vegetarian slices for sandwiches. Oh, check out my recipe pages on roughseas for a miscellany of veg food. Legumes are your staple, as are the carbs, tofu, tempeh and seitan. Plus lots of fresh veg.

I don’t know about cholesterol. I read something recently about it not being a problem at all!! Animal welfare. Is there such a thing?