<quoted text>MUQ, I'm curious. When you found out about the shooting, did your heart mourn for the victims, or were you elated that something bad happened to Americans? It seems to me that you have a one-tracked mind and are constantly consumed by your hatred for this country. That's not healthy. I guess that's what happens when you worship a vengeful and jealous god. You share the same qualities.

Back in the late 1970s, when the now-legendary Lee Iacocca took the reins at Chrysler, he was reputed to have told the union bosses,“Look, boys, I’ve got a shotgun to your head. I’ve got thousands of jobs at seventeen bucks an hour. I’ve got no jobs at twenty.”And that’s when most Americans would have loved to be making $17 an hour.Iacocca, of course, had put his money where his mouth was, taking over the ailing corporation for a salary of $1 per year and slashing management pay, while borrowing what today seems like a paltry sum of a couple of billion dollars. By 1983, the company had paid it all back, returning a tidy profit of $350 million to the taxpayer coffers.Fast forward to 2012. Barack Obama has bailed out Chrysler and General Motors — or, more accurately, bailed out the United Auto Workers (UAW) by handing them ownership of the bonds held by the rightful investors — to the tune of somewhere between $80 billion and $100 billion. Both companies are still struggling, although to hear Obama tell the tale, they are a great American success story, thanks to his largess with our money.Obama, who has not stopped campaigning since first declaring his candidacy five years ago (in all fairness, it is all the man knows how to do), just happened to be on the road again — in Detroit, of all places — on the very day the legislature was passing and Gov. Rick Snyder was signing historic legislation to make Michigan a right-to-work state. And a month after Obama himself had won the state handily in his own re-election bid, with massive help from the UAW, no less. Who could ever have imagined?For Michiganders, this was do-or-die time. Detroit, a once-mighty industrial city of 1.8 million people in its heyday, has been reduced to a shell of its former self, gasping along with a population of 800,000, many of them poor and unemployed. Entire sections of the city resemble the worst of parts of the Bronx or bombed-out Beirut in the 1970s. Motor City, as it was once known, is now a ghetto where boarded-up homes can be purchased for $1,000 as entire neighborhoods sit abandoned.Good jobs, building American cars, went elsewhere. Ford started building some of its products in Mexico. GM increasingly utilized Canadian labor across the northern border. And Lee Iacocca’s beloved Chrysler got passed around from one foreign owner to another (currently the Italian company Fiat).Meanwhile, German, Japanese and Korean automakers began setting up shop in business-friendly states, paying good wages, with good benefits, for building good cars in places like Indiana, Tennessee and South Carolina, states that do not require a worker to pay dues to a union to get a job. But in Michigan, the UAW continued along as if it were still the 1950s and they were the only people who could build automobiles.In its post-war glory years, the UAW could dictate contract terms to the management of the “Big Three.”Detroit was Motor City. Not anymore. Despite the nostalgic TV commercials advertising Chrysler (“imported from Detroit”), Motor City has become a social and fiscal basket case, thanks largely to union greed.It is long past time to break the stranglehold labor unions have had on the public and private sectors. Despite the re-election of Barack Obama, the tide is turning against union thuggery. attempt to emerge more popular than ever. And now Gov. Snyder and the Republican legislature in Michigan have done the unimaginable: they have turned Michigan into a right-to-work state.

Enemies of Islam represent our prophet as a very cruel and blood thirsty man, who would kill his “opponents, enemies and any one who disagreed with him” at “the drop of hat” and all his adversaries would be “terrified” at the mere sight of him.

The picture is far from true, let us look at some incidents from the life of prophet, as what was “this sword which killed the enmity for ever”

The Case of : UTBAH BIN RABEEAH, CHIEF OF ONE MAKKAN CLAN

A. Utbah ‘s position in Makkah

Utbah was a much respected Chief of one of the Makkah Clans. His words and his position mattered very much with the Makkah pagans.

He knew the prophet from the very childhood and when prophet declared his mission, he did not accept it. He was one of leading members of those who were opposing prophets, but he never used physical force or foul language when talking and dealing with prophet.

He can be called as “one of Civil Adversaries” of prophet in Makkah. The elders of Makkah used to gather together and think as to how to counter this “new and strange menace” which “This Prophet of God” has brought upon Makkah and its people.

They were seeing that one by one, number of his followers were increasing and when one becomes his follower, it was neigh impossible to bring him back.

No amount of physical force or abuses or taunts would bring any of those people back. Countering Prophet and his message was always a ready and hot topic with these chiefs and elders of Makkah. One day, Utbah told, the assembly,“I think, you should depute me as your representative to go and come to some solution with Mohammad”

“Please do so Abu Waleed (Respected nick name of Utbah and an Arabian custom still valid today) may be your reasoning will solve the problem. We have full confidence in you” They said with one Voice.

B. Utbah Reasons with Prophet:

Utbah came to prophet and started like this “O son of my brother, your people have send me as their representative to talk to you, please do not interrupt me and listen to my offer fully”

“Yes , Abu Waleed, say what you want to say” Replied the prophet

“You know, we had very high hopes on you, you were born in a very noble family….and now you have brought a calamity on your city, which no one was ever able to do it before” Utbah started

“Because of you, now every house stands divided, sons and fathers, mothers and daughters, husbands and wives, brothers and brothers, they stand divided….I do not know what you want to achieve by all this”

“I have three proposals before you, if you wanted by this leadership of Makkah, we will choose you our Leader and King with one voice……If you want wealth, we will give you enough wealth , so you will become wealthiest man in all Arabis…..if you want to marry any beautiful woman of Arabia, we will marry you to most beautiful and esteemed woman of your choice……and if you are suffering from any illness, which you are unable to cure….we will try to get your cure by calling best medicine men in whole of Arabia” Ended Utbah

“Now listen to my reply” Said prophet (Unsheathing his Sword of Quran) and started reciting from Quran

“HA MIM. A revelation from (Allah) Most Gracious, Most Merciful, A book whereof the verses are explained in detail; a Quran in Arabic for people who understand ; Giving good news and admonition: yet most of them turn away and so they hear not……..”(Ch 41:1-15) Prophet kept on reciting and Utbah was listening like one mesmerized…When he reached verse no 15 (Warning), he put his hand on the mouth of prophet and said “Stop, it is enough”

“Now you have heard my reply” said the prophet.

Utbah came back to his people, walking as one who is intoxicated…after taking some rest, he said “If you take my advise, you leave this man alone, if he is successful, it will be success for us too, and if he fails and is killed by others, we will be absolved of shedding his blood”

“I think, Utbah has also come under his spell’ Said Abu JAHL!

D. End of Utbah:

Utbah did not become Muslim, he was chosen as leader of Makkan army that went to fight at Battle of Badr in year 2 AH…..he tried his best to avoid the battle…..when the Quraish Caravan passed danger zone unharmed…

But Abu Jahl, did not listen to him and accused him of getting impotent and coward…..this insult infuriated Utbah very much and to prove his Power he came forward along with his brother Shaibah and his Son Waleed to demand one by one combat with Muslims.

Utbah was Killed by Hamzah, the Uncle of Prophet.Waleed was killed by Ali, the cousin of Prophet.Sahaibah was killed By Obidah, cousin of prophet and Ali and Hamzah

So three of the best warriors of Makkah were slain even before the main battle started.

Such is the story of Utbah who was injured but not slain by the sword of prophet (and he met his end with the steel sword)!!

C. Prophet’s Reply:“Now listen to my reply” Said prophet (Unsheathing his Sword of Quran) and started reciting from Quran“HA MIM. A revelation from (Allah) Most Gracious, Most Merciful, A book whereof the verses are explained in detail; a Quran in Arabic for people who understand ; Giving good news and admonition: yet most of them turn away and so they hear not……..”(Ch 41:1-15) Prophet kept on reciting and Utbah was listening like one mesmerized…When he reached verse no 15 (Warning), he put his hand on the mouth of prophet and said “Stop, it is enough”“Now you have heard my reply” said the prophet.Utbah came back to his people, walking as one who is intoxicated…after taking some rest, he said “If you take my advise, you leave this man alone, if he is successful, it will be success for us too, and if he fails and is killed by others, we will be absolved of shedding his blood”“I think, Utbah has also come under his spell’ Said Abu JAHL!D. End of Utbah:Utbah did not become Muslim, he was chosen as leader of Makkan army that went to fight at Battle of Badr in year 2 AH…..he tried his best to avoid the battle…..when the Quraish Caravan passed danger zone unharmed…But Abu Jahl, did not listen to him and accused him of getting impotent and coward…..this insult infuriated Utbah very much and to prove his Power he came forward along with his brother Shaibah and his Son Waleed to demand one by one combat with Muslims.Utbah was Killed by Hamzah, the Uncle of Prophet.Waleed was killed by Ali, the cousin of Prophet.Sahaibah was killed By Obidah, cousin of prophet and Ali and HamzahSo three of the best warriors of Makkah were slain even before the main battle started.Such is the story of Utbah who was injured but not slain by the sword of prophet (and he met his end with the steel sword)!!Source: Companions of Prophet: by Talib Hashmi

onclusion:And the killings go on as usual, there have been so many incidents in the past, but they will be forgotten.Only the ones in which any Muslim or Muslim organization was accused to be involved, would be played again and again , just like an old record.

Been lots of killing in times past MUG, mainly by muslims and catholics.which are pretty much the same.The catholic "whore" gave birth to many daughters.Islam is one of those daughters.

Poles show about 80% of americans are christians.May shock you to know the truth, but probably only 10% and no more then 30%.

There is the One true God Jesus Christ, and there are all the other gods and religions, many in which use Jesus name to hide their true self.

Those who put their faith and trust in Christ will go to Heaven, all others will just play religion, Nd they did, and then they did, and so on, untill they die and their souls go to hell.

Sounds to simple, and religion don't like simple.May the true God open your eyes.

For He did me.I went from being a God hating atheist, if there is such a thing, to a born again christian, the night God woke me from a sleep and let me know He was real.That's been over 12 years ago, and I've never got over it.

<quoted text>Ans.1. The problem is that "many innocent children" are also killed in your fight against International Terrorism…. But you shrug your shoulders this as a "small price" to be paid for that fight against International terrorism. When some thing happens in your country, your emotions pour out.So in the end it is "our children" versus "Their Children" , Is it?

02. I am surprised that ONLY 50 % of US people sympathize with Isreal? With the "dose" of Pro-Isreal info they get "round the clock" from Print, Film and Electronic Media, it should have been 80-90 %.So you people are slipping, you need some thing more. Why not a few more of 9/11 types of attacks?

1. The difference is the intent. It was never the intent of the American military to cause collateral damage. In fact, the reason they use drones is to attempt (often unsuccessfully) to minimize such damage as compared to using a ground invasion force, or by using dumb bombs. Terrorists, on the other hand, INTEND to cause civilian casualities. Do you understand this moral difference in intent?

2. Jews do not control the media. Everytime you say this you only look sillier and sillier.

As far as 50% support - in the US thats basically considered a majority and almost enough to elect a president. Unlike your host country, we are a democracy, there is diversity of opinion, and it is acknowledged and celebrated.

<quoted text>If you think Jesus Christ is God, then you should get your head examined?Whoever ever heard about Jesus till he was born of Virgin Mary?How could he be God, forget about "Only God"!!You are speaking thru your hat.That is the usual problem for you atheists....first you were on One Extreme, denying God and Religion and Revelation.....and then you went to another Extreme.Made Jesus, a Righteous Prophet of God, a Man into "Only God".What you need is a "Middle path" between these two extremes!!

What path do you suggest?

As I read the bible, the more I see that Jesus was God made flesh, but either way I do know He "Jesus Christ "Is the only way to Heaven.

<quoted text>Ans.01. No I did not write any thing bad about the victims. They were innocent children who had done no harm. But when you hear that US Drones have killed Scores of Children in a Remote village of Afghanistan or Pakistan, what are your emotions? Do you have a feeling for those fallen Children?02. After the fall of USSR, America has turned from a Islamic Neutral to Anti Islamic country in a matter of years. And it did not happen by chance. The US media did it knowingly and purposely./03. We do not hate USA, only its policies towards Islam and Muslims in past 20 odd years, plus its "one sided and unreasonable support" to Isreal for past 60 years.04. Love and hate are two way streets. You just cannot keep on bashing One Muslim country after another and expect the other to keep an smiling face turned to you.This Love of Isreal will lead to the doom of USA.

The love of Israel will only help a country, being against Israel leads to a countries doom, as been proven throughout history.

Jews are Gods chosen people, back in their land (in unbelief, on their way to hell, without Jesus Christ), but still Gods chosen people.

Israel alone should make you see the one true God.

Why do you believe sooo many want to attack and get rid of such a tiny speck of land???

I feel for the lose of any child, no matter what religion they are being taugh!

Again 80% of americans claim to be christians, yet 30% would be a stretch.

Catholics (as a whole) are Godless!They are the ones that help star Islam, which also is not of God.

Jesus Christ is anyones hope, all other, even those claiming the name of Jesus, yet rely on their "good works " are useless in this life or the one to come.

You cannot claim Jesus to be a good man or prophet, if you can't claim He is who He said He was.

He is either God, or a liar.

He told those that even though David was in His family tree, He was, before David was.

I was not taught to become a christian.I was born into it.born again, which Jesus said one Must be.

Many things I was lead to read, AFTER I was born again.

Before I waa born again, I would have never care for anyone that was religious in any way.

I didn't believe in any god, and cared less for anyone who did.

I thought all were idiots!May God show you the truth, for He alone can.What one man can talk you into, another man can talk you out of.

<quoted text>Ans.01. No I did not write any thing bad about the victims. They were innocent children who had done no harm. But when you hear that US Drones have killed Scores of Children in a Remote village of Afghanistan or Pakistan, what are your emotions? Do you have a feeling for those fallen Children?02. After the fall of USSR, America has turned from a Islamic Neutral to Anti Islamic country in a matter of years. And it did not happen by chance. The US media did it knowingly and purposely.03. We do not hate USA, only its policies towards Islam and Muslims in past 20 odd years, plus its "one sided and unreasonable support" to Isreal for past 60 years.04. Love and hate are two way streets. You just cannot keep on bashing One Muslim country after another and expect the other to keep an smiling face turned to you.This Love of Isreal will lead to the doom of USA.

Like I said. A one track mind focused on hatred and anger. Your god must be proud.

<quoted text>Man just spit it out. Do you know or not? Your riddles and longwindedness is beyond hilarious at times.

rabbee: oh come on, you really do not expect those, who are the problem. to admit this, to themselves or anyone else. when they rather, blame the symptoms of their idolitry. order to avoid, admitting it is, the side effects of their idolitry. when they even teach how to become, an idolitor in their schools.

you cannot be with G-D and Ruach HaKodesh. in any social society constantly rejecting it in your schools and everywhere else. when you do not even, truly teach about G-D, in your churches, and synagogues. with your all only, make believe stuff. and the more you use altered scripture, the more only make believe it becomes.

not anyone on these message boards, is going to admit their an idolitor. more of less take responsibility, for all of it's horrid effects on any society of critters.

<quoted text>It's a hell of a lot more clear that Bush didn't get Bin Laddin.But it's also clear he invaded the wrong country and killed at least 10s of thousands of innocent Iraqi citizens.I don't recall him apologizing for that.

rabbee: the error is only, in your own eyes. since i cannot believe that G-D, commanded us to invade the wrong country. no matter how much, the world's diverse idolitries lie about it. and the fact is, bin leyden cannot be killed until the time and place designated by G-D.

<quoted text>The reason this forum thread is at 50k+ is your inability to be sweet and short. Concise and to the point. No wonder the problems of israel don't get fixed. If they all believe that you need to write a Torah or a Bible size book to tell a simple story, no one listens. Short and concise works best.

rabbee: well the reason why it is 50k pluss. is not because of any one, diverse idolitor on this message thread. and not one person writting on this message thread. is capable of fixing their own problem with idolitry involved. more of less, any of Ysrael's problems involving idolitry. when the fact is, when this world or any sub-group tells the truth. then G-D shall correct the physical difficulties, created by their idoliterous lying. but if you want to continue to lie, like the devil. then you are going to be commanded to do what is expected for the diverse devils.

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