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But as he's done with other Browns' quarterbacks, veteran Josh McCown rolled up his sleeves and mentored Manziel. He led by example, but also shared all of his wisdom on the second-year QB.

"When Josh McCown got there the next year. ... He was like 'Hey, let me put you under my wing and show you what it's like. I've been doing this for 15 years, let me show you.' And if it wasn't for him, I wouldn't have figured out anything. I would've never known what it was like to really stay there from 6 a.m to 8 or 9 at night and really what it takes to be good.''

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I was completely against starting McCown for obvious tank purposes(Yes I am a phony fan like that) but he totally changed my perspective on him after hearing stuff about his leadership. I believe this leading young QB's by example notion is exaggerated but this McCown situation really supported that notion. Now I really won't mind if he comes back to Jets if we don't land Cousins or Foles or another vet QB that is above average. At worst, he will start and give way to the rookie we will select in first round.

I was completely against starting McCown for obvious tank purposes(Yes I am a phony fan like that) but he totally changed my perspective on him after hearing stuff about his leadership. I believe this leading young QB's by example notion is exaggerated but this McCown situation really supported that notion. Now I really won't mind if he comes back to Jets if we don't land Cousins or Foles or another vet QB that is above average. At worst, he will start and give way to the rookie we will select in first round.

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Just one thing throws a wrench into your scenario. His name is Bowles, Todd Bowles. Remember him? The HC that only trusts his vets? Unless the HC has a epiphany and decides to play his kids early in the season instead of when the season is over, you're gonna see the 2017 movie one more time. McCown plays until he gets hurt period. Any rookie drafted by the Jets is on a minimum 2 year launch profile barring injury. No matter who they draft in 2018, you won't see him until 2020 unless McCown retires or gets hurt for better or worse. I've learned to live with it.

Just one thing throws a wrench into your scenario. His name is Bowles, Todd Bowles. Remember him? The HC that only trusts his vets? Unless the HC has a epiphany and decides to play his kids early in the season instead of when the season is over, you're gonna see the 2017 movie one more time. McCown plays until he gets hurt period. Any rookie drafted by the Jets is on a minimum 2 year launch profile barring injury. No matter who they draft in 2018, you won't see him until 2020 unless McCown retires or gets hurt for better or worse.

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You're lumping in Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Allen in with Petty and Hackenberg and I'm not sure why. I think if either of those two showed an ounce of ability to be a starting caliber QB, they would have started earlier. You can't blame Bowles for sticking with the vet that all his teammates love and was helping the development of the offense as a whole when his options were two guys that will never start an NFL game unless the guys in front of them go down.

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Just one thing throws a wrench into your scenario. His name is Bowles, Todd Bowles. Remember him? The HC that only trusts his vets? Unless the HC has a epiphany and decides to play his kids early in the season instead of when the season is over, you're gonna see the 2017 movie one more time. McCown plays until he gets hurt period. Any rookie drafted by the Jets is on a minimum 2 year launch profile barring injury. No matter who they draft in 2018, you won't see him until 2020 unless McCown retires or gets hurt for better or worse. I've learned to live with it.

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Well you just pointed out my fear. Bowles and his risk avoiding personality. What you say grandpa is a real threat but this time I think even he knows if he forgets the rookie we will select in first round on the bench he will be given a pink slip if Jets do 5-11 again. I want to believe he learned his lesson.

You're lumping in Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Allen in with Petty and Hackenberg and I'm not sure why. I think if either of those two showed an ounce of ability to be a starting caliber QB, they would have started earlier. You can't blame Bowles for sticking with the vet that all his teammates love and was helping the development of the offense as a whole when his options were two guys that will never start an NFL game unless the guys in front of them go down.

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Oh just stop it.. We're not drafting Darnold or Rosen. Mayfield and Allen perhaps will be gone as well by the time we pick. We may even go BPA-D one more time just for the helluva it. This has nothing to do with Petty or Hackenberg. This is about Bowles. We'll see just what the HC that wants to "establish the run" in a pass happy league does with new and better QB talent assuming he knows what that looks like. I'm not holding my breath on Bowles suddenly becoming a 21st century NFL HC anytime soon. Bowles will never be a Offensive Savant...

If it happens that Bowles does give the rookie real playing time? Great. If not, oh well.. Just more of the same Jets we've come to expect. Personally, I'm not expecting anything for at least another 2 years. Zero expectations man. Zero....

Well you just pointed out my fear. Bowles and his risk avoiding personality. What you say grandpa is a real threat but this time I think even he knows if he forgets the rookie we will select in first round on the bench he will be given a pink slip if Jets do 5-11 again. I want to believe he learned his lesson.

Well you just pointed out my fear. Bowles and his risk avoiding personality. What you say grandpa is a real threat but this time I think even he knows if he forgets the rookie we will select in first round on the bench he will be given a pink slip if Jets do 5-11 again. I want to believe he learned his lesson.

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If Bowles is shown the door after the 2018 season, we must have an offensive coach be his replacement. Preferably someone who has developed QB's. DeFilippo comes to mind as a possibility. I know I'm getting ahead of myself a bit, but it's fun to dream about now.

Oh just stop it.. We're not drafting Darnold or Rosen. Mayfield and Allen perhaps will be gone as well by the time we pick. We may even go BPA-D one more time just for the helluva it. This has nothing to do with Petty or Hackenberg. This is about Bowles. We'll see just what the HC that wants to "establish the run" in a pass happy league does with new and better QB talent assuming he knows what that looks like. I'm not holding my breath on Bowles suddenly becoming a 21st century NFL HC anytime soon. Bowles will never be a Offense Savant...

If it happens? Great. If not, oh well just more of the same Jets we've come to expect.

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I'm just giving you the list of top QBs that we are connected to.

I don't exactly trust Bowles, but considering how awful Petty and Hackenberg are, I can't hate on the guy's decision making process this past season. If Petty came in and lit it up, I'd have to start questioning the decision. But he didn't, he came in and laid massive turds left and right. Bowles was not wrong, as hard as that may be for you to accept.

Bottom line: you can't take what happened last year and assume it's what will happen this year for a multitude of reasons.

I don't exactly trust Bowles, but considering how awful Petty and Hackenberg are, I can't hate on the guy's decision making process this past season. If Petty came in and lit it up, I'd have to start questioning the decision. But he didn't, he came in and laid massive turds left and right. Bowles was not wrong, as hard as that may be for you to accept.

Bottom line: you can't take what happened last year and assume it's what will happen this year for a multitude of reasons.

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Like perhaps the lousy talent evaluation at the Qb position on draft days 2 years in a row? Same people doing it again in 2018. Maybe they finally get it right, maybe not. We'll see.

Oh just stop it.. We're not drafting Darnold or Rosen. Mayfield and Allen perhaps will be gone as well by the time we pick. We may even go BPA-D one more time just for the helluva it. This has nothing to do with Petty or Hackenberg. This is about Bowles. We'll see just what the HC that wants to "establish the run" in a pass happy league does with new and better QB talent assuming he knows what that looks like. I'm not holding my breath on Bowles suddenly becoming a 21st century NFL HC anytime soon. Bowles will never be a Offensive Savant...

If it happens that Bowles does give the rookie real playing time? Great. If not, oh well just more of the same Jets we've come to expect. Personally, I'm not expecting anything for at least another 2 years. Zero expectations man. Zero....[/QUOTE]

If that happens, then Mac should be fired on the spot after the 1st pick is in.
As for the second bold statement, it's sad how it's gotten to that point. I hope to see the Jets hoist a Lombardi trophy in my lifetime, but this franchise has experienced ineptitude and heartbreak for the better part of 5 decades.

Like perhaps the lousy talent evaluation at the Qb position on draft days 2 years in a row? Same people doing it again in 2018. Maybe they finally get it right, maybe not. We'll see.

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I didn't say anything about the Jets being good talent evaluators when it comes to drafting QBs. I'm just saying Bowles isn't wrong for sticking with McCown over Petty considering Petty is shit and Hackenberg is whatever is worse than shit.

Not sure where you land on our esteemed age tree, but if you're near the top like I am, you learn to temper your expectations and just let things play out. We at the top have already seen our SB. I feel bad for you youngins and wish you all well in your long and arduous journey down JetFan Lane.

I didn't say anything about the Jets being good talent evaluators when it comes to drafting QBs. I'm just saying Bowles isn't wrong for sticking with McCown over Petty considering Petty is shit and Hackenberg is whatever is worse than shit.

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We're talking 2018 now. Nothing we can do about Petty, Hackenberg or Sanchez for that matter. Mac is gonna have to roll the dice, put on his big boy pants and draft a f'n Qb that can play this time. Bowles will just have to suck it unless we sign a Cousins in FA.

Not at all, Just don't want to hear about cap hell down the road if we guarantee too much money. Macc isn't exactly a wizard when it comes to FA contracts. He tends to get a lil bit too happy sometimes.

We're talking 2018 now. Nothing we can do about Petty, Hackenberg or Sanchez for that matter. Mac is gonna have to roll the dice, put on his big boy pants and draft a f'n Qb that can play this time. Bowles will just have to suck it unless we sign a Cousins in FA.

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It's not a great reason, but the bolded is exactly why I'm ready to toss the checkbook to Cousins the second free agency opens.

Not at all, Just don't want to hear about cap hell down the road if we guarantee too much money. Macc isn't exactly a wizard when it comes to FA contracts.

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Precedent is set for the contract. Yes it's going to be big money, but it's going to be frontloaded which keeps us out of cap hell. That's if they follow the standard set by the Niners and pretty much every team that's given out a big contract to a QB.