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so would it be safe to say that the apocalypse for you would involve a niner/Texan superbowl with schaub throwing for over 300 with some touches and then foster running for like a buck or so with a touch. and the defense roughing up the offense and jj watt knocks out halfadick or whatever his name is and then proceeds to put his full sopping goonch on the helmetless face of alex smith with an outcome of 34-20 it would probably make you disembowel yourself wouldn't it? but im just dreaming. the Texans suck too much to go anywhere. shoot, we've only won 1 playoff game. god how pathetic, Im starting to believe you wsg that we're lucky to even make the playoffs with this crappy team. oh well. hopefully the niners release some of their scrubs so that we could pick them up and be better, and then one day, we could win 2 playoff games! hooray!

just in case you cant tell, I am kidding. before you shoot off a three page diatribe on the reason why schaub should have been aborted and how he is the worst damn qb this game has ever seen! LOL

I would never have to worry about any of this happening. Schaub's play speaks for itself. See you in the Super Bowl...maybe.

1- First Schaub has never been to the playoffs as a starter, so Smith has a better playoff record than him. Injuries are part of the game as are coaching changes so if I can't use Smith's 7 different coordinators you can't use injuries as an excuse. Yikes, and I'm embarrassing MYSELF.

I don't care about who has started more games. That is nothing but happenstance. The fact is that in the NFL, you get to the playoffs based upon two things:

(1) Record
(2) Luck

But the fact is that guys/teams with worse records over 5 year stretches can end up in the playoffs more than a team with a better record due to luck of the draw between what division they are in and how many other teams perform well that year. For instance:

(1) 2008 NE Patriots were 11-5 and missed the playoffs. The only team to do that in the current format. Any other year, or any other division, and they're in. Nothing but bad luck.

(2) Tony Romo has a better career record than Eli, but Eli has more trips to the playoffs. So, even though they've been in the same division over the course of the time, wins haven't translated into playoff appearances in a straight line. ***I am not arguing Romo v. Eli here, just using it as a good example***

So, all they can do is perform on their end and win regular season games. Over the course of their careers, Schaub has won a higher % of games than Smith. However, I will grant you your point about co-ordinators, etc. Just in the last 2 years, Schaub has the same record as Smith (19-5) and the same amount of playoff berths (2).

I mean these all directly led to the Texans losing games. I can show you more. So the fact you think I have no rational reason must mean you don't watch football much.

We can pull bad moments from players that had bad effects on the outcome of games all day long. Success is measured by W-L at the team level and success comes, not from 5 isolated events, or 7, or 12, but from the cumulative effect of every play in every game over a given sample.

When that cumulative effect is measured, we end up with a player in Schaub who is every bit as good as Alex Smith. If you want to say he's garbage... fine, then so is Smith.

You do realize that Schaub has been in the same system his entire career throwing to Andre Johnson. He has a great running game. That means that Schaubs numbers aren't a direct result of his talent.

And Alex Smith's numbers aren't a product of his great running game and clearly great system? Give me a break. You have no leg to stand on here. They have been in very similar situations over the last 2 years.

This is shown by his choking. What number shows choking?

Schaub's best year is 29 TDs - 20 turnovers. He is a statue and not for Kubiak's zone blocking with gap coverage blocking Schaub's weaknesses would have been more exposed. Kudos to Gary Kubiak. That doesn't make up for the fact in big time situations he fails.

Not sure if you know this, but games are won and lost in 60-minute stretches, not 2 minute stretches or 12-minute stretches. So, I don't see a point here. You mean to tell me that I can trust Alex Smith more in the 4th, and Schaub more in the 1-3, and both equally in terms of the whole game? Sick argument bro! lol.

So again let's evaluate him as a player using our eyes and minds. Don't turn this into simply Alex Smith vs Schaub,this about Schaub himself and the fact the is garbage. So please quit embarrassing yourself and stick to baseball it doesn't look like football is your thing.

Yes, you are absolutely embarrassing yourself right now, as I've shown through everything above. And, also, as I've shown before, ANY/A, QBR, PRtg, DVOA, DYAR, etc, all have a relatively strong correlation to winning... so I'm not sure why I should trust your untrained eyes over stats developed by trained minds, which we already know correlate to success on the field.

I've got a better idea. Let's not rely on the eyes of a clearly biased poster to tell us someone is "garbage" who is clearly an above-average QB in the NFL.

How did this thread become Schaub vs. Smith? Can we get back on topic? If the Texans beat the Vikes this sunday should Kubiak play Watt or rest him? Is there any way a defensive player can at least be nominated for MVP? I feel like Watt has played so great this year that he should at least be in some consideration for it.

How did this thread become Schaub vs. Smith? Can we get back on topic? If the Texans beat the Vikes this sunday should Kubiak play Watt or rest him? Is there any way a defensive player can at least be nominated for MVP? I feel like Watt has played so great this year that he should at least be in some consideration for it.

I think Watt has played well, but he's not as valuable as Peterson or Manning.

"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."
—Arthur Schopenhauer (German philosopher, 1788-1860)

I don't care about who has started more games. That is nothing but happenstance. The fact is that in the NFL, you get to the playoffs based upon two things:

(1) Record
(2) Luck

But the fact is that guys/teams with worse records over 5 year stretches can end up in the playoffs more than a team with a better record due to luck of the draw between what division they are in and how many other teams perform well that year. For instance:

(1) 2008 NE Patriots were 11-5 and missed the playoffs. The only team to do that in the current format. Any other year, or any other division, and they're in. Nothing but bad luck.

(2) Tony Romo has a better career record than Eli, but Eli has more trips to the playoffs. So, even though they've been in the same division over the course of the time, wins haven't translated into playoff appearances in a straight line. ***I am not arguing Romo v. Eli here, just using it as a good example***

So, all they can do is perform on their end and win regular season games. Over the course of their careers, Schaub has won a higher % of games than Smith. However, I will grant you your point about co-ordinators, etc. Just in the last 2 years, Schaub has the same record as Smith (19-5) and the same amount of playoff berths (2).

So your point about him never starting a playoff game is meaningless.

We can pull bad moments from players that had bad effects on the outcome of games all day long. Success is measured by W-L at the team level and success comes, not from 5 isolated events, or 7, or 12, but from the cumulative effect of every play in every game over a given sample.

When that cumulative effect is measured, we end up with a player in Schaub who is every bit as good as Alex Smith. If you want to say he's garbage... fine, then so is Smith.

And Alex Smith's numbers aren't a product of his great running game and clearly great system? Give me a break. You have no leg to stand on here. They have been in very similar situations over the last 2 years.

Not sure if you know this, but games are won and lost in 60-minute stretches, not 2 minute stretches or 12-minute stretches. So, I don't see a point here. You mean to tell me that I can trust Alex Smith more in the 4th, and Schaub more in the 1-3, and both equally in terms of the whole game? Sick argument bro! lol.

Yes, you are absolutely embarrassing yourself right now, as I've shown through everything above. And, also, as I've shown before, ANY/A, QBR, PRtg, DVOA, DYAR, etc, all have a relatively strong correlation to winning... so I'm not sure why I should trust your untrained eyes over stats developed by trained minds, which we already know correlate to success on the field.

I've got a better idea. Let's not rely on the eyes of a clearly biased poster to tell us someone is "garbage" who is clearly an above-average QB in the NFL.

LOL ha WOW. The funny thing is that you think you have actually made a good argument. All you said is that Schuab is better the Smith with those stats. If you actually interpret the stats compared to on the field success you would see a correlation.

It's absolute hilarious you say the reason the Texans haven't made the playoffs with Schaub is bad luck. Your delusional fantasies are what are embarrassing.

The plays I showed Schaub majorly contributing to losses. Losses keep you out of the playoffs not luck. Now going to Romo, awesome comparison. Romo has excellent numbers but chokes in clutch situations. LOL JUST LIKE MATT SCHAUB. So you're right that's just luck? No my friend they both contribute to their team's losses.

And it's dumb that in the moments of a football game that matter most, where games are won and lost (4th quarter, final 2 minutes, OT...ect) to look at their efficiency and stats? LOL Yeah you're right because as you said numbers from "trained minds" like the ones I literally just displayed for in my previous post are what matter. I didn't just invent those stats.

LOL now Schaub is just above average... Ha Ha Ha. When the game is not on the line, with the weapons he has Schaub can be OK. My argument was he is a choker, and leads directly to losses by the Texans. Now please go play with your tonka toys the adults have other, more relevant topics to discuss, Schaub definitely isn't one of them.

LOL ha WOW. The funny thing is that you think you have actually made a good argument. All you said is that Schuab is better the Smith with those stats. If you actually interpret the stats compared to on the field success you would see a correlation.

It's absolute hilarious you say the reason the Texans haven't made the playoffs with Schaub is bad luck. Your delusional fantasies are what are embarrassing.

The plays I showed Schaub majorly contributing to losses. Losses keep you out of the playoffs not luck. Now going to Romo, awesome comparison. Romo has excellent numbers but chokes in clutch situations. LOL JUST LIKE MATT SCHAUB. So you're right that's just luck? No my friend they both contribute to their team's losses.

And it's dumb that in the moments of a football game that matter most, where games are won and lost (4th quarter, final 2 minutes, OT...ect) to look at their efficiency and stats? LOL Yeah you're right because as you said numbers from "trained minds" like the ones I literally just displayed for in my previous post are what matter. I didn't just invent those stats.

LOL now Schaub is just above average... Ha Ha Ha. When the game is not on the line, with the weapons he has Schaub can be OK. My argument was he is a choker, and leads directly to losses by the Texans. Now please go play with your tonka toys the adults have other, more relevant topics to discuss, Schaub definitely isn't one of them.

So this is what it looks like when you lose an argument... you just throw a hissy fit full of condescending garbage. Sounds good.

LOL I'm glad to see you have no retort to any of my arguments. They only seems condescending because you can't understand them.

Winning an argument by losing it horrifically, huh? Well played Matt....well played.

The humorous thing is that you actually believe you'd made some point and won an argument. Your argument is so horrible it's laughable, and you didn't actually combat any of my points. I have no need to give a retort. Others will give their votes. Your position is nonsense.

I have no need to waste anymore time on you. Find a new baseball team to root for. You aren't worthy of the southside. You're a disgrace and an embarrassment.

whitey in all fairness why don't you post the plays where schaub has won a game, there are more than a couple out there. it is kinda weak where you selectively choose what plays fit your argument. I can think of a few years ago he brings us back against Washington, last second TD pass to Dre. he ran in a QB sneak against a Miami team, he matches the 2nd most passing yards for a game in the history of the NFL this year and wins that game. wouldn't it just be easier for you to say schaub is an average qb, and you just hate him for personal reasons? manipulating stats for your own argument and then having those stats rebutted, only to post plays that suit your agenda doesn't really create a winning argument. I do enjoy your takes though, seriously.