The Terror Window is only a few weeks old but it has not disappointed one bit. Nobody signed yet of course, but now Arsenal are also apparently not interested in bringing the conductor back to the home of football. I did not make much of this, until I read an article on the BBC website which as good as confirmed this rumour.

Without a conductor Arsenal will continue to struggle to find its rhythm and depth again.

Fabregas has never been replaced, and since he left, Wenger has been unsuccessful in getting us anywhere near back to how we used to play attractive, attacking football. Mansour City and Pool play better football than we do now. They have copied us and are surpassing us… an uncomfortable fact for us Gooners.

Ozil is no conductor, Ramsey is no conductor, Cazorla is very limited as conductor, and Jack will need a few more years to establish himself as our conductor. If we want to reach the next level, the first player to sign is Cesc Fabregas: he will give the much needed midfield direction and dominance back to our football.

Any arguments about having enough midfielders already, is missing the point. We do not have a conductor. There is a vacancy and there is no better footballer in the world for us to fill it than our ex-el-capitan.

Let’s face it: Wenger likes to play with an army of midfielders, and this will not change any time soon. We have a holding striker in Giroud, whose role it is to bring the midfielders into play and allow them to both create chances, for him and other midfielders, and to score goals. We don’t do wingers in our team; even Theo is not used as a proper winger…. and he wants to be a central striker anyway. Pod is not a winger either, and neither are Cazorla, Ox or Rosicky.

We play with midfielders and lots of them. So with 5 midfield positions and possibly 60+ games in all competitions, Arsene needs to fill about 300 starting positions in a season. We have Cazorla, Jack, Pod, Ox, Theo, Arteta, Ramsey, Flamini, Ozil, Rosicky, and hopefully Cesc soon, and let’s say a youngster like Eisfeld or Gnabry will break through: 12 ‘midfielders’ for 300 games, which makes a nice average of at least 25 games for every player.

We also need a dedicated DM, which we probably will not get once again this summer; but even if we did, we could let either Flamini or Arteta go, to not increase the numbers further. 12 players for 5 midfield slots, or 2.4 player per position…. does that sound unreasonable for a 60+ games season?! I don’t think so.

Furthermore, our youngsters, Ox, Eisfeld/Gnabry, Jack, but also Pod, Theo and Rosicky, are all injury prone, so it is more likely that the likes of Ozil, Cazorla, Ramsey and Cesc would play a lot more than 25 games a season next season. If all are fit, we can start rotating players properly, thus avoiding the need to keep playing our key players till they burn out and get badly injured.

The idea of starting a dedicated DM, with Ramsey or Wilshere next to him, Fab in the middle and Ozil and Theo on the ‘wings’ is mouth watering.

But so is playing in the next game, Arteta and Fab in the double DM pivot, Jack in the hole and Pod and Ox on the ‘wings’. Or Flamini and Ramsey in the double DM pivot and Cazorla and Gnabry on the wings with Rosicky in the hole in other games.

But when it really matters, against the big teams, we play Cesc, Ramsey/Jack, Ozil, Theo, and a beast of a DM in our midfield positions. The ‘beast’ – say Nigel de Jong or Wanyama or Martinez – can also pass the ball well enough to fit it. Ozil would suit the ‘free role’ on the left well and Jack and Rambo can compete for the b2b position. Theo on the right adds speed and Cesc and Ozil and Jack/Aaron interchange constantly. But Cesc conducts it all until Jack the pupil is ready…

Cesc is not a nicety in our team but an absolute must if we want to start winning the PL title again. We need a conductor to make Arsenal play the finest tunes of football again, and I cannot think of a more important signing for Arsenal this summer than Fabregas.

Let’s just hope that Wenger is playing hard ball, as he knows that Cesc will not go anywhere else than to Arsenal if he is forced to leave Barcelona, and wants to negotiate the price down…. just like they did to us three years ago….

Bring him back home, Arsene; we need him, we want him, we love him; and three out of three ain’t bad.

I am hoping the author is right, but I fear Wenger and the Board do not want to go for Cesc as it will cost them £45m (the £30m reported transfer fee plus the £15m Arsenal would lose out as I have heard they have a 50% sell on clause in his contract). I am hoping to be proved wrong, but I my gut feel tells me that Arsenal are still putting finances before on-field success. If Cesc goes to another Prem club, then that will confirm that everyone at Arsenal is still satisfied with 4th and the odd cup now and then.

I hope you’re spot on. I feel dirty when hear he could be playing for Man city or Chelsea. Sign him up. Then follow him up with J Martinez, that’s Javier from Bayern, although I’d take Jackson from Porto too.

A really nice Post and very apposite given the comments and rumours surrounding Cesc and his future. I simply do not understand why Barca want to get rid of the DNA boy. Weird.

I happen to agree with you in principle regarding Cesc, Total, but I think it is a done deal for him to go to the Chavs and AW has said that he does not want to buy him back.
Actually, I have not heard him say that, but I think it was in the Spanish papers.

That said, I don’t feel as strong about it as you do, because I have always had a thing about not going back to an old job, or to an old girl friend — or in Cesc’s case, an old club. 🙂

You are correct though, he would have no problem fitting back into the team and to pull the strings.

Good post. I do not understand the discussion of “we do not need him”. Our game needs a lot of fresh midfielders, let alone our yearly asrtonomic injury list. We need him in order to pocess the fear factor and to be able to dominate the big teams. We were short of that last season. I can not stand seeing him in another shirt. Why should arsenal fans feel all that pain every season?!!!! Fabrigas, Remy and a right back would be more than enough for us … and achievable, I think.

Its a very good artical. As Gunners we shouldn’t forget what happened last season we were hampered by injuries hence we lost the title. When it comes to big clubs domestically and in uefa champ. Leg. We struggle a lot. So lets welcome Fabregas with all our hearts then we can challenge anyone. Wasanga baleteya…

What I’ve been biding my time with is this:
AFC has ‘right of first refusal’.
That until an official bid/offer is made public?
There’s little benefit in Wenger showing any level of interest– much less making a bid.

Making a bid now tips Wenger’s hand to the likes of Mourinho; driving up the price.
Waiting until the ‘last minute’ keeps the price down, exposes all potential suitors, and still gives AFC the right of first refusal.

I would surprised if Wenger hadn’t related this idea to Fabregas at the outset of all the rumors being circulated. And there’s not been a word publicly from Cesc.

Now let me see what I disagree with from your post, Totes !…………erm…….erm……erm……that will be nothing !.
All along I have said that given our injury record we need as many SQ players as possible !. Is he better than we already have ?…..yes, so no brainer yet again !.
Hope this comes out as it will compliment your post and lets hope it`s true as conspiracy theories go !.https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bph1lDYCEAAA2Ef.jpg:large

PL I think you nailed it. AFC looking more interested in the money than the football Cesc brings to the team and that’s pathetic. It would in its way end up a repeat of the suarez 40million plus £1 debacle. whereas with suarez part of me thought it OK to think about the £ vale, the Cesc issue is completely different and would annoy the arsenal fathful no end. it may just be enough proof that wenger’s time at the club is long gone. he has become untouchable and does not care a jot what the fans think.

I’ve refused to comment on this subject since news broke, rather choosing to listen to other views, now I have to comment.
Why not bring Cesc and Vela back, buy Remy (cheaper option), three of them will guarantee us at least 50 goals, then sell Casola for between $10-15 mil, buy a right back and older but good and cheaper keeper, let the season start and by January bring in a beast of DM. That’s if finance is the main issue.
That way we don’t burn our “$100m” yet get Cesc the Orchestrator, a decent striker, a winger with goals cheap, resolve our right back situation and back up keeper yet not disrupt the team flow and spirit much cos Vela n Cesc already know the system.
We can’t pass on the opportunity to sign Cesc back, no matter which midfielder we sacrifice to make that happen.
Over the last few seasons, I watched Adebayor and VP score against us and it wasn’t a funny feeling, I don’t even want to imagine seeing Cesc torment us in a Chelsea shirt, not at all. Wenger needs to start understanding the psychological and emotional side of football.
Someone upstairs should better grow real balls and have a word with Wenger on this.

Mystic, Ozil is a great player and faster, technically better than Santi. For me, it’s Ozil on the left ‘wing’ with the freedom to roam and add value everywhere on the pitch. With Theo on the right and Cesc in the middle, we would have a superb attacking force behind Giroud. No?

Cazorla would be great off the bench, or as a starter to give somebody a break…

@ TA; If we push it and offer him decent wages he will succumb, also don’t forget that we are now winners, at least not up to 9 weeks since we won our last trophy (Wow!), good ball players like Vela should fancy joining us.

Evening TA. Yes head v heart as I’ve commented before. I would love us to have him back with us, and playing in his pomp; but I just don’t see it happening, and like RA I’m not 100% sure of the wisdom of going back either. What would going back to the time when Cesc was our captain (and we won nothing) really be doing to the mindset of our team? What will the effect of ‘failing’ at Barca be on him?

The hard part about the TW is that we tend to look at every player transfer in isolation, rather than as part of the range of options available – hardly a criticism of anyone, the club keeps us all in the dark. If we pass up Fab and end the TW with no major strengthening of key areas, then we will have missed a trick and folk (including me) will be feeling pretty down. Of course, we don’t actually know the terms of the buy back option in any case – presumably we have to agree terms with the player – i.e. match the Chelski pay offer? And we have little of substance to confirm that Cesc really does want to come back to us – he won’t be encouraged in this direction by Dein junior will he!?

Sadly, we have enough areas of the team that need quality strengthening to conclude that, IF Wenger were to spend his monies this summer, he might be better spending elsewhere than on Fab. It comes back to trust – do we believe Wenger knows the areas we need to strengthen, at least as well as the fans, and do we believe that every effort to invest strongly will be made? The man as just signed a new contract – welcomed by most – we need to back him.

If Cesc goes to Chelski, my questions will be with him not with the Arsenal….

TA. Same question to you. You have stuck by Jack more strongly than anyone, and Wenger’s policy of playing him to build his strength and experience; would you really have him on the bench to fringe Fab back?

Hi AB, well balanced comment and good to see you back. I disagree with the notion there are bigger gaps to fill, as per my post. Cesc would bring bags of assists and goals, and he is not bad at helping the defence either. It is a no brainer to me in every sense

Love the post.
I don’t understand all the bring back vela talk though. Are we forgetting that he was not that great last time he wore the red and white. Don’t all players look better in Spain? Talk of santi being sold is ridiculous. He works his nuts off for the team and produces when we need it most(cup finals a decent reminder) The only reason his form has not been as good this year is because he has become a make shift for ozil. Having all the current players and Cesc would be a dream come true. We need to remember as good as Ramsey is now he has only had a decent 6 months. Fab’s produced from the age of 16 and was one off if not the best centre mid in the league. He would have only got better with age and plying for Barca.
Bring him home Arsene

Hi TA. Yes, good to have some space to read and write of an evening; it hasn’t been happening of late! The heart is with you on this one for sure, though I do have some reservations about ‘going back’. The hard part of knowing what SQ players we might be after with our budget, and therefore what the trade-offs here actually look like?

AB, good question. I want to give Jack a couple of seasons to truly break through and Cesc would allow this. I would sometimes play Jack in the hole and rest Cesc or play him behind Jack in the double DM pivot. I would love to see us buy a DM, but would also love to try out Jack, Ozil and Rambo in midfield.

Of course like i would of thought every Arsenal fan i want Cesc to come back, but they is still a few things or questions i have about it.
Why do Barcelona want rid of him so much, publically letting it known.?
The reason i think total Wengerball is not there at he moment is also down to playing 2 DM’s not just having Cesc conducting IMO.
i think Ozil can be that super number 10.

But i want him back , there is no doubt we would have a stronger squad with him.
But no 1 know’s how to create Wengerball better the Arsene Wenger . It is his Philosophy of the game.So for me if Arsene chooses differently then i will accept his choose.

Just throwing in some different reasons of what may or may not happen.
I also hope your theory is right TA

Cesc is a special case imo. He went back home because he was homesick and if he was to come back it is to complete what he started here. He loves Arsenal and we love him, and he possesses that bit of extra quality that we have been missing since he left….

I think we will buy the DM this season. And I think we will also go for a left wing. So often last season we were without pace; which is one thing that Cesc would not bring us. Again, the judgement on Ozil last season has been made of him playing in a team without fast moving options around him – how would Oz fare with Walcott and a Di Maria/Draxler/Griezman on the other wing? He would look a lot better I think – provided he had a Ramsey and quality DM filling in around/behind him.

I can’t see why Wenger would sign on for 3 years more, if they were only to be more of the same – he has had too much grief from it. With improved funds and a young core all tied down under contracts, the only reason can be that he has the ambition to win again. He won’t risk bankrupting the club to get there, but I see no reason for him to sit on cash for the sake of it.

Fair enough, PG. Your trust in Wenger is enormous and I respect that. For me, he has been searching for the right balance for a long time and he has not got it. Ozil is a good player but I reckon he needs a free role (just like your favourite Cazorla). Cesc and Jack dominate the midfield between the middle and the opposition’s box and from there everything starts to happen. But Jack is too injury prone/young and Cesc would help transform us.

Why do Barca want to sell him? They need the money no doubt… His stats there are fabulous, no?

You could be right, AB, and I would welcome the signing of those two type of players too. But I don’t think it will happen. No DM and possibly no proper winger either. With Theo back and the Ox we have speed and I am sure Jenkinson and Gibbs will add a lot of speed on the wings. BTW, I am expecting Arsene to buy a replacement for Jenkinson but would also like to see more of the Finglishman. 🙂

TA; I will play Vela as left winger/striker, Theo on the right, Remy as main striker.
AB; There will be plenty enough games to go round, esp if we keep winning and stay in all competitions. Jack will either step up his game or play back up, also don’t forget that injury will naturally rotate the team.
It’s time we start acting like a big club and be ruthless and less sentimental, we need to compete and win things cos I still like the taste of the FA cup in my mouth. Let’s not forget that next season will get very tough, Moneyhoe is already strengthening, City’s coach will settle down better, Van Gal’s factor at Utd, Pool will comeback better, etc, it’s really gonna get tough

Two points in there TA. The first is around proof of loyalty and commitment to the club. I have never lost my affection for Fab, just as I could not find it in me to forget Brady when he left. If Cesc is truly committed to us (with Barca for sure) then he will not move to Chelski for they cash, but wait another season with Barca while he keeps talking (and instructs his agent) to find a deal with us. Next year, with Arteta and Rosicky out of contract, and maybe Flam off too, then there could well be space. Remember, Fab would never have left us to go to Real Madrid, just because he didn’t get an offer from Barca – so why should we accept him moving to Chelski, just because we can’t offer him an open door as and when he chooses to swan back over here…

Who better? In his position, probably no one I would rather have – apart from Ozil and Wilshere! The question is would I rather we got Gundogan and Di Maria this summer? Hell yes would be the answer. I can’t claim this looks realistic right now – but this time last year I would have laughed in the face of anyone who said we might buy Ozil for £42M. I do think the stability and quality of the team make it an attractive club to join; that and the 3 year contract management stability alongside London being as good as it gets for a young man, and us now being able to offer more competitive deals, means we should be in the market for most players barring Messi/Ronaldo etc

Oddly, I worry less about the striker position, as I think we can add to the squad relatively easily and cheaply (Campbell, Vela or Remy) if we don’t get SQ – and I think this works fine with how we set up to play. But depth at the back and pace on the flanks are what I want most this TW.

TA,
As far as i know his stats are excellent.
It is a strage 1, as the midfield regulars are ageing.
As i said i want him back. Your point about him getting in the box was a great 1 as that is what we missed last season alot.

PG, it is about carrying the ball to the D or passing it there and then dominating proceedings. Look how Jack came on and started to structure play for England last night. Movement up-front was not too good and very few were able to complete one two’s with Jack through the middle, but England looked far better organised when SJW came on. That is what a conductor does to a team and I reckon Cesc is the master in this, whether he plays deeper or in the hole.

TA, I totally agree with you and more, it’s Cesc before anyone else, yes we have other needs which can be addressed easily than what Cesc brings, where would you find a player of Cesc caliber to buy? It’s not rocket science, Cesc all the way….

And this is the bit I don’t understand – why would they sell him, and why for so little? And why does he want to leave? If this were Rooney the answer would be simple – agitating for more cash. I don’t see that with Fab, though I have less of an opinion about Dein junior. If he doesn’t join us this year then best outcome would be staying at Barca; I would hate to see him in blue, and my view of him would be much diminished I fear.

Wenger knows Cesc better then any other manager.
I hope you are right and Arsene gets in done, if it does not happen then i can only assume Wenger has his reasons.
In Arsene i trust.

So far so good as Chelsea have not announced signing him, i think his fate will be sealed after the world cup now.
I just dont want you to be disappointed if we dont sign him as i can tell you have you heart set on it.
fingers crossed i suppose, we can only hope for the best.

I completely agree we must sign Fabregas! Whilst we have riches in midfield, Fabregas can make an enormous difference. With Ozil, Ramsey, Wilshere, Corzorla, Rosicky, The Oz and Fabregas other teams would never see the ball!!

France looking strong.. what depth. Couldn’t decide which of their players I’d want more at Arsenal. The Benzema-Giroud combination is obviously attractive. Griezmann coming on late as a sub and scoring two (one beautiful) goals. Matuidi’s energy throughout the match. Decisions decisions.

But perhaps, and maybe its just me, we’ll be seeing this guy in an Arsenal shirt next season… Young, strong in the tackle, good passing range, might be cheaper than other options, PL proven (oh and French).

Yep, would not be disappointed in the slightest to see him repping the red and white next season!

Best teams in the world don’t stop adding quality to quality, that’s what makes them better and unbeatable, AW has been saying that we will add to the team if we find quality, is he now saying that Fab is no more quality, why would he turn down the opportunity to take him back when we haven’t successfully replaced him, is he trying to settle scores by turning him down? After all Cesc said he would come back home one day, it’s even happening too soon.
Give him what Chelsea is offering and bring him back. Huh!

It is a strange 1, normally clubs say that they don’t want to sell a player.
Even more so when he is SQ Then they tell the world that he is for sale.
Add to that he is loved by our fans and we have a buy back first refusal publicaly known that we do. It kind of but pressure on Wenger.
I can just imagine the fans being like they were on the first day against villa after the first game of the season we get a bad result in the 2014/15 season, if he does not sign Cesc now.
Cazorla was our player of the season just 2 seasons ago. I think it took time for him to adjust to Ozil joining us.
Cazorla is SQ we are lucky to have him,
I have got a feeling it’s going to be another lonnnnnnnng transfer window
ha ha ha ha ha they a nighmare.

Impassioned post there Total…and yours too in the last thread, Cockie… I hope it all works out and everybody can swallow a little something (pride or a pill, nothing else intended)… Indeed BKesques is a virtual pub, but one that is often (or at least sometimes…) focused on the footie…

I’m still a little confused about the notion of a “conductor” and I think we might need AFC with his terms (registra, etc.?) to help explain… It’s always been my thought that since the days of Vieira (and giving Cesc his shirt number…) plus the early sale of Gilberto, that AW wants truly technical midfielders and doesn’t go for the idea of a dedicated DM. The notion that we might be trying to play an interchanging 5 (i.e., two wingers and 3 central) particularly appeals to me. As such, I see Cesc as a huge upgrade to Aging Arteta and Fouling Flamini, both of whom (I fear) aren’t exactly in the same class as Xavi Hernandez or Sergio Busquets. If you could also bring in a young athletic CB/DM type (Song of 5 years ago or Pogba, in our wildest dreams, Matuidi or Khedira–whatever happened to Kondogbia or Illarramendi?–in our more modest ones, now…) well, we might truly be on our way…

Also, of course, we need to know what the actual “sale to Barca” terms were. Is there a sell-on fee” clause or a “right of first refusal” (salary and/or personal terms?) in there? Things are getting well twisted by the media/blogosphere on this account, depending of what people feel about the various characters involved (Wenger and Cesc, mostly) and emotions are running high. For many this becomes another “litmus test” for the club. Already, it appears, we’ve lost another contract holdout (Sagna) to the lottery-winner salaries on offer at City. Certainly Darren Dein is duty bound to see what he can get for his client. At that point do we have a chance to match it?…(And in the meantime, before we become too desperate, maybe we should “love the ones were with,” rather than allowing lust to consume us…)

My fear, like plenty of other Gooners, is that Stingy Stan and his managers (Wenger and Gazidis) will NOT choose to match the depths of pocket of media-player Mourinho and Oligarch Abramovich, who must do something to stop the Sheik up at City. If it were also a slap in the face to the “Serial Loser” (who actually won something this past season–AW)…all the better. I dunno, is it all subterfuge or do we really need a bit more pace and more steel and more clinical work up front so maybe the money might be better spent elsewhere? It seems a game of chicken–with Barca, Chavs and Cesc holding most of the cards–and we tend not to play those sorts of games…

We shall see… Great post, (some great comments in there too, esp. AB) and great to have the Cockster back at it…

17,
I was jst going to say the same as you, We could bring back Cesc to replace Arteta who is 32 now and of course was brought to fill the hole left by Cesc.
But i like Arteta a lot and he changed his game massively to fill in the gaps we left on the field and became a DM.

Then of course Kallstrom will go back to his club so they will be his spot to fill, but we also have Diarby returning.
Then we have our injury problems so we always need SQ
Also we miss Cesc fighting spirit. The man kicked and scored a penalty with a broken leg for us.

Thanks TA, excellent post. The best compliment I can give is that you almost sold me to your thinking.

Your not that geezer who last year sold me that Inca hair retrieval lotion are you? He promised me hair like Brad Pitt, but all I got was a Pit on the scalp. If that was you TA, I want financial compenstaion for all the money ive had to spend on cement filler. hahaha

I dont want Cesc back. My view is that he is not the same player we sold. Near the end of his Arsenal carrer he started picking up a lot of hamstrings is not the same player.

I also feel we are going in a different direction. The three Brits, Ramsey, Ox, and Jack, will fill any voids in the midfield

My last reason is personal. I have seen many Arsenal players leave. The most stinging was Liam Brady going to Juve, so am immune to any feelings of sentiment.

Good to see you back Cornwall. Your returning post was exactly what i expected. Concilatary, remorseful and forgiving. hahaha.

I pressed the like button after only reading the title and knew that the dutch maestro supplied the ammo. Also i wanted to be next to the cock-meister. Good to see him around! and now we know he likes playing hard to get or in his case ‘getting it harrrrd’. 😉
Off to do some weights. Its the Queens birthday and we got a public day off. Soo, long live ‘ey!! 🙂

A really nice Post and very apposite given the comments and rumours surrounding Cesc and his future. I simply do not understand why Barca want to get rid of the DNA boy. Weird.”

@ AB, June 8, 2014 at 21:01

“Evening TA. Yes head v heart as I’ve commented before. I would love us to have him back with us, and playing in his pomp; but I just don’t see it happening, and like RA I’m not 100% sure of the wisdom of going back either. What would going back to the time when Cesc was our captain (and we won nothing) really be doing to the mindset of our team? What will the effect of ‘failing’ at Barca be on him?”

@ proudgooner, June 8, 2014 at 21:24

“Of course like i would of thought every Arsenal fan i want Cesc to come back, but they is still a few things or questions i have about it.
Why do Barcelona want rid of him so much, publically letting it known.?”

@ TERRY MANCINI HAIR TRANSPLANT, June 8, 2014 at 23:20

“I dont want Cesc back. My view is that he is not the same player we sold. Near the end of his Arsenal carrer he started picking up a lot of hamstrings is not the same player.

I also feel we are going in a different direction. The three Brits, Ramsey, Ox, and Jack, will fill any voids in the midfield

My last reason is personal. I have seen many Arsenal players leave. The most stinging was Liam Brady going to Juve, so am immune to any feelings of sentiment.”

A couple of points to add to the above, @ TA:

(1) I have written on my previous post on how (a) The media “likes” riling Arsenal supporters & fans; (b) Jose Mourinho “plays to the media”. Also the media reports on the likes of Chelsea and Man. City wanting to buy Fabregas. Both teams are hard-pressed to fulfill the 8 home-grown players slots registering for PL (Chelsea) and the 4+4 association-grown + club-grown players slots for UEFA European club competition (Man. City & Chelsea) next season.

That is where Fabregas becomes a key factor from the media rumours: he is a “home-grown” player and a quality one too. He fills the gap left by Lampard @ Chelsea, they could have gone for other players like Ivan Rakitic, Joao Moutinho;
Should Man. City release Richards/Milner/Sinclair/Wright, Fabregas fills the vacated “association-grown” slot. City has also been given the restriction of a 21-man European squad rather than the usual 25 as part of UEFA’s sanctions for breaching FFP rules.

(2) On the other end, for the supposedly “Barca DNA” factor on Fabregas, he is dispensable in Barcelona’s own requirement of the 4+4 association-grown + club-grown players in European competitions. They have plenty of options for the front 3 (Messi, Neymar, Sanzhez, Pedro, Tello, Deulofeu etc). Iniesta and in future Messi is owning the attacking midfielder position. They might not see him as an ideal candidate in taking over Xavi, they need a stronger all-rounded partner for Busquets in CM (which is why the media reports that Ivan Rakitic, a midfield conductor and midfield general, is due to sign).

Speaking of Rakitic, he would have been made more impact than Fabregas; at least Rakitic captained his average Sevilla team to their Europa League victory, seeing off Porto (with Danilo, J.Martinez, E.Mangala, Defour etc), Valencia (with Feghouli, E. Vargas etc) and Benfica (with Garay, Sulejmani, Gaitán etc) along the way.

Personally, given a choice option and current club requirements, I would have picked Rakitic (he is a more complete midfielder, a conductor, a midfield general, less injury-prone) slightly ahead for our club instead of Fabregas, and for a lesser price too.

Let’s for argument’s sake say Arsenal have the best midfield in the EPL (which they do not but lets just sat they do) We should STILL invoke the first refusal clause and bring back Cesc SO he won;t go to a EPL rival. Now that said Arsenal do NOT have the best Midfield in the EPL Wilshere has been a disappointment Ramey’s injury this season showed we need cover. And this may be just my opinion but frankly Nether Wilshere or Ramsey is as good as Cesc. In fact Cesc at age 17 was better then Wilshere and Ramsey combined are now so to NOT bring him back would be Stupid. And to see the pair of Cesc and Flamni back at Arsenal again? It brings back memories. But more likely Flamini will not be given a new contract and Arteta will again be our DM and we will se Cesc in a Blue shirt and the only new signings will be a bunch of hopefuls and and youngsters that will not even make the starting 11 on any other EPL top 5 team. I have lost faith anyone at Arsneal knows how to make a deal happen or what the transfer market is about if your goal to to WIN the league title and WIN not just make it in to the CL.

I heard from some unknown source, that arsenal have some clause with cesc deals before he goes to barca, there said that we have a 50% share if cesc is sell to another club instead arsenal, that mean if barca sold cesc for 30m to another club, we will recieve 15m from barca in the order of the clause, so the souce said, arsenal might be will be resign cesc on the last minute of the transfer windows. And this means cesc is going nowhere but arsenal.. CMIIW

Arsenes’ words”we are in the market yes and we are working hard(on transfers)if we find that special player of top top quality then we will buy.not a messi,bale or cr7 but one who can add something special then we will definately buy”……i will hold AW to those words if he doesn’t add cesc to our ranks!

Now he first thing to remember is we should not be looking at one set of 11 players. Quite rightly TA, you have put up a team that could play the ‘top teams’, What is that in terms of games? 8-12, depending on Cup draws? Out 50+ I don’t think the current squad should be missing out completely, as some of the comments have implied.

So to the position you placed Cesc – assuming we do dive in at the last minute – is too high up the pitch, although you do make a good case for him there.

For me it is all about pace. And there is nothing quicker than a quick ball played forwards. Cesc is a master of the the quick ball. The other thing is, having Ozil and Cesc in the same side means you sacrifice some pace down the left side. Not mention that the Number 10 slot will almost certainly go to a ‘tba’ where the last to letters may be significant???

So in front of the back 4, ONE option would be:

——— back 4——–

– Cesc———tba/wishlist
Theo ————–tba/wishlist
——–tBA—————
————-Giro——–

This would be Cesc playing the Flamini role of being available to receive the first to mount a counter attack, having two options out wide and two hold up options in the middle?

The point is to have options, particularly off the bench. Players like; Jack, Chambo(as he likes to be known as), Ramsey and Ozil could do great damage late on? We have to start playing the ‘long season’ game, and keep players fresh and fit.

I am not sure if you read that not only are we importing a new fitness coach, we are also going back to the altitude training camp in Austria this time. Although how much extra recovery time players at the WC will need and still arrive in Austria. We have a dozen of our first team squad in Brazil, apart from any signings who may be out there? Hence the youngsters getting their opportunities in the few games we play before the next trip to Wembley?

JM – I am slightly with you on the bale out of the Cesc return. Ideally he would stay in Spain. But Barca are desperate to raise cash so the new manager can start with ‘his team’? Like most, I would rather we had him than near neighbours?

The reason why they are so public about it is to get an auction going, but with us not playing ball, and holding the trump card, as the link above, it may have backfired?

You are right he is not the same; he is even better now. At 27 he is entering the best years of his career and Jack, Ox and Rambo are not ready to take on that role. I am surprised you do not see it that way but it must be hard to see all that wavy hair on El Capitan’s head. 🙂 bless 🙂

Cesc in the DM pivot is also attractive to me. I prefer him to play in the hole though and direct our play with Rambo/Jack next to him as the b2b and Ozil and Theo on the wings, with additional running coming from the full backs. Cesc owns the area whereas Ox, for example, would be faster and more direct than Cesc but not be able to boss the area.

Fabregas is dispensable to Barcelona this coming season, as they are realising that their team will be defensively short of experienced numbers (Puyol retired, Valdes & Pinto – both GK leaving, D.Alves could be moving on, Pique – injury plagued, Xavi – scaling down in game time, Alex Song not effective as a CDM or CB) – leaving Mascherano, J.Alba, Adriano and Busquets as the more experienced defensive group (the GK, CB, FB, CDM & CM positions). They have started their defensive recruitment and renewal of squad with Andre ter Stegen in goal, rumoured to be chasing Marquinhos – a CB from PSG (D.Alves going over as part exchange) and scouting a midfielder to partner Busquets @ the engine room regularly in the longer run.
(while having their transfer ban suspended by FIFA, following their appeal against the punishment)

Rakitic lead his average Sevilla team to winning the Europa league; He is their conductor, their leader and midfield general.
Koke is the creative fulcrum for A.Madrid’s title winning season; He is only 22yrs (5 years younger than Fabregas) and playing a key role in his team.

Replace both Rakitic & Koke with Fabregas in the Sevilla & A.Madrid teams.
Can Fabregas be able to lead, and conduct an average Sevilla team to Europeon victory? Can Fabregas inspire a combative A.Madrid to a La Liga title? Was Fabregas the key man, the go-to guy for Barcelona’s winning title 2013 season (Messi – 46 goals & 12 assists, Iniesta – 16 assists were)?

NO, to the above 3 questions. Without the luxury of having Messi, Iniesta, Xavi, A.Sanchez, Neymar, Pedro alongside him, Fabregas will labour to produce those numbers. Give either Rakitic or Koke the same attacking players that Barcelona have, their numbers will improve. Which is why Barcelona has found out, that Fabregas has stagnated in his development to the next higher level – the go-to guy when the going gets tough and the chips are down.

So my answer to your prompt question, “Rakitic rather than a PL experienced, former Arsenal captain around whom we build the team at the very peak of his career now?”

A BIG YES for Rakitic over Fabregas.

Fabregas had his chances with us, as a player and a captain. We won nothing with him leading our team (not even a sniff at the FA Cup). Arsenal FC and Arsene Wenger moved on, and progressed with our current team.

A Sevilla team with Cesc as their conductor & captain (in place of Rakitic) won’t win the Europa league.
An A.Madrid team with Cesc as their creative fulcrum (in place of Koke) won’t win the La Liga.
An Arsenal team with Cesc as captain got no rewards for all their toil and endeavor.

One thing we have progressed on, TA. No more whiners wanting out of club because they missed their mother club’s affection and DNA.

We no longer require a conductor TA. The emphasis of the current side is to defend deep and play fast one or two touch football.

Cesc takes to long on the ball for this kind of style and defensively treads H2O, and we have enough players with H2O problems

Cesc has not been the same player since his hamstring problems. Several months before he left, he was on fire, but when returning from the injuries I noticed his sprint had gone. I think there is a fear that if he was to extend his legs his body will give way.

I dont really care if he goes to Chelsea or another rival. Unfortunately this is modern football and players these days go through more clubs than I do wives.

Fair enough, Terry. I don’t agree, and 90 goals and assists in 151 games suggest that you are wrong, but it is your view. If he is allowed to go to the Chavs hell will break lose, Terry. But I don’t think he’ll do that to us. He will be a Gunner in Two months time.

@ TotalArsenal June 9, 2014 at 11:38
Cheap shot at me, TA.
What about Cesc winning nothing while leading our team too?
What about the statement on “One thing we have progressed on, TA. No more whiners wanting out of club because they missed their mother club’s affection and DNA.” Agreed?

Put Fabregas in an average La Liga team (sevilla, valencia, bilbao, sociedad) and he wouldn’t be able to get those same numbers he got at Barca, let alone leading them to winning titles.

The facts are still in that Rakitic did what he did with Sevilla, leading them to a Europa win; Koke did inspire A.Madrid’s La Liga’s success.

Cesc wasn’t the X-factor with Barca when Messi was injured, Iniesta’s prowess waned and Xavi playing less. He did not step up his game enough this season to help Barcelona retain their La Liga title when the opportunity to impose his position as Xavi’s natural successor was for the taking.

JM, you don’t know that, it is just an opinion. Anyone can see that Fabregas would add tremendous value to any team.

Fabregas played 150 games for us and scored 44 and produced a phenomenal 70 assists. It surely was not up to him we did not win anything. Do the math, buddy.

In the same period your beloved Rakitic managed 16 goals in 134 games for Schalke. I don’t have stats on his assists but I am sure they won’t beat Cesc’s. So Cesc out scored Rakitic three times whilst playing in a selling team.

Did Rakitic singlehandedly win the UEFA cup for Seville…. With one goal in six I beg to differ.

Well done for blaming Cesc for all that went wrong with Barca this season. I rest my case.

I can see both sides to this one, and TMHT’s point on injuries is another worth considering. Which is why considering him as taking over where he left off? That is where I start to shift to JM’s view. I don’t see him playing in all key games. He is just one option.

I think the EPL has moved on a bit too, hence my reference to pace. Not one of Cesc’s strong points? His passing range is though, so I disagree with the point on him slowing things down. Like Ozil, he needs players to move ahead of him – one of the reasons I don’t think they would play in the same team very often?. Previously that movement was lacking as Rambo had not reached his peak thanks to his big injury, and Nasri wasn’t at his best in his final year either. Thinking of the two teams that JM’s alternatives play for, from what I have seen, they were very quick in their counter attacks? So unless we get a pacy wide left player to compliment Theo, and Chambo/Rambo thrusting down the middle, the we could be continuing with lop-sided team we have been, but without Sagna. Both Rakitic and Koke could struggle if that were the case?

It is that ‘balance’ that can fall apart if you have Ozil out wide, and then give him a free role. True, Gibbs overlapping is an option,, but to expect him to do it for a 38 match season, and then some, is pushing it. And Monreal tends to leave us a bit open on that side?

Not a problem yet, as no signature is on the necessary bit of paper. So I am happy to get the other pieces of the jigsaw fitted first. We are in the box seat with Cesc, because if Chelsea offer a low bid, we match, we win …errr providing Cesc does accept the lower packet? If they go to outbid us, the we get a slice even if we don’t match the asking price. Not quite win win, but not a killer blow if injuries are a problem?

One of the stats I seem to recall seeing recently is that since Cesc joined Barca he has played in 96 league games for them during his first 3 seasons. In those games he scored 28 goals with 34 assists.

From memory I also recall that while he was with us he ‘only’ scored 35 goals.

That seems to be a sign that his career developed, surely?

What tends to get lost in these exchanges of opinion, is that you cannot really compare like for like.
For example time out for injury for the player himself, or injury time for another key member of the side.

Frankly it makes no sense blaming one player for his side not winning any titles as it is disingenuous to heap praise on one player for winning a trophy.
Teams win or lose together.

I understand why TA would take Cesc back because he is a great player. And I sort of agree with having him back for his skill and experience and leadership too.

My concerns though are that in that fitting Cesc back into the team, one of the following players would have to make way; Theo, Jack, Rambo, Mesut Ozil, Flamini, Arteta, Cazorla, Rosicky, the Ox and Gnabry.

OK, I know that there are a number of different positions involved, but they are all ‘midfielders’ some of whom can also play on the wings.

Given that we are also supposed to be looking at other holding midfielders, and wingers (Griezmann/Di Maria) I just have my doubts.

Gerry, I really don’t think Arsene will go with two traditional wingers, or even modern wingers, next season. I would not mind that, but I don’t think it will happen. So Theo/Gnabry on the right for speed and Ozil/Santi for ingenuity and box penetration on the left seems feasible to me. Cesc is still fast enough and like Jack he knows when to penetrate the space in front of him. And yes his passing and vision is superb. And he also knows how to score, which I believe Wenger is mostly after: scoring and assisting midfielders to feed of Giroud’s holding play. Cesc would fit like a glove. 🙂

not sure if there is anything new I can add to this very fine post of skipper –

let’s see, hmmmmmmm

no one picked up my Freudian slip of last week where I said ” Cesc To Liverpool” note how it wasn’t Chelsea and note how on the very same day a link got put up on bbc confirming we are not in for Cesc.

I have read a few comments which seem to suggest that we are going to be taking a very handsome 15 millions (50%) on letting Cesc go else where ? meaning it would be £45 million for us instead of spending 30 mills to get him ? without being disrespectful to anyone who thinks we are getting that much – allow me to simply say, NO we are not getting that much money at all.

Cesc sold to XYZ club for 30 million = Arsenal get a big fat 0.

Cesc sold to XYZ club for 30 million plus = Arsenal get 50% of it.

Cesc comes back to Arsenal = Arsenal only pay in the region of 10-15 million up front as Barca still owe us a lot of money both from the Cesc deal and Song as well. (assuming it’s not more than £30 million).

the name of the game is to deny deny deny all interest in Cesc until the very end – for all those who wonder why Barca are so vocal about it ?

They want Cesc’s price to sky rocket and are hoping for a bidding war by getting all interested parties involved with the real monies – PSG , Chelsea, City e.t.c e.t.c e.t.c hence you get the “home grown” thing used as a marketing tool as well by Barca

Moral of the story ? Arsenal don’t want his price to sky rocket and would want it to remain as low as possible – Barca would want a bidding war and more money out of this one.

hope that makes sense !

Re- Rakitic and Cesc – erm, Cesc has won Spain The Euros, has ASSISTED in the world cup FINAL and when the going gets tough he gets going.

I hold and reserve my judgement on Rakitic , as surely we are jumping the gun on him – a single player never wins you anything on his own in any tournament hence you have the likes of Messi winning absolute Zilch for Argentina .

Good debate chaps. We tend to polarise when we get into disagreement, and that masks what is for me quite a fine margin choice here. I’m not convinced that Cesc has improved whilst away, nor that his mentality coming back to us would be quite right, but I can’t conceive that he would not be a pretty damn good option to have. Whether that warrants a) blocking the progress of a young player, or b) potentially downgrading our ambitions for players needed in (arguably) more critical places is questionable.

A number of comments have referred to playing Cesc in place of Arteta; and yes we could I guess. But I don’t think that this would be the best for him, nor that he would be the best (or value at £30M) for this position. He really needs to be more advanced. I would not be entirely happy if accommodating him back led to moving Ozil out into a sub-optimal position and Jack getting less playing time than he would otherwise.

But its all fine margins. If we do come in and trump Chelski at the last minute I will be smiling regardless. But I won’t want Cesc coming back into the dressing room believing he is the main man again; like Flam, he would have to re-establish himself in the new order of things.

I didnt expect to see much debate on this topic.. i am suprised…very suprised. Bringing FranCesc Fabulous back home is a win-win situation, in EVERY WAY that you look at it.

JM, being of Croatian background, i know alot about Rakitic. His stats this season are amazing, and what he has achieved with a mid table club with Sevilla is extra special but believe me when i say it has alot to do with it being a world cup year, and Rakitic has known to be a whiner.
He was a nobody a Schalke, and now with Croatia he realises that Modric is indispensable, and with the emergence of a brilliant young kid named Matteo Kovacic (Internazionale) , suddenly his number 10 is on the line.
There are also a few fundamentals that have been forgotten.. Rakitic was given the conductor role and he got the job done. However, ever since Cesc has gone back to Farca he has never once played, the conductor role. It was always the left of a 4-3-3 or as utility next to Busquets, geez, they even played him as a false 9. A fulcrum to pass back or left so that messi would get his stats. What a waste of talent, what a waste of vision. Both Pep and the new coach failed in utilising Cesc’ talent, vision, and skill.

Merry Terry, an injured Cesc was and is still better on the pitch for Arsenal than he was off it. That was the case before and will be when he comes back. Besides, we all realise now that it was our medical staff that was failing our team, hence the reason why Arsene has finally decided to make changes.

When Cesc first started, Arsene played him deep, just as he did and does with lil Jack. Its because they get to see the whole pitch in front of them. Cesc mastered this vision at an early age. As the injurys tolled, yes its true Cesc looked to be getting slower.( I blame Squillacci for all the unnesessary bact tracking that Cesc had to do.) Its the same role that Pirlo plays today, or Modric at Real, but Cesc is better than that.
He is best played as the lynchpin between the 9 and his midfielders in a 4-4-1-1. The Bergkamp role, the master conductor and a a position where its a MUST for cockatoo 3D vision. When Cesc played that role for us, he tore the premier league to shreds scoring near on 20 goals for a midfielder. THATS JUST CRAZY.
The boy has vision, presence and friggin HEART.!!!!!!!
Ozil gets kicked off the ball and has a whine or sulk before the BFG has to pick him up again. We didnt like that from Arshavin, we didnt like it from Jack and im sure we dont like it now from anyone in our shirt. Actually Cesc was the only one fighting with referees for our cause when other players seemed to give up..

Some more questions.

How old was Cesc when he tore Real Madrid to shreds?
How old was he when he came on as an substitute (carrying injury) in the FA Cup and turned the game on its head?
How old is he now and when does a player start to Peak?

The key for me is the partnership between Arsene and Cesc. Thats where the magic is BELIEVE ME!
Wenger needs a key player to carry out his vision on the field.
It was Dragan Stojkovic (piksie) in his time at Nagoya, than the beautiful Bergkamp early Arsenal, and then Cesc.
Its not Cesc’ fault we were going through project youth and we had to make do with Ade-barn-door or NB52, Dudu was a gem but that was misfortune. Bring home Cesc with the stars we have now and you will all cream yourselves….

For me its simply a NO Brainer. Even from a marketing perspective or business decision it makes sense.
My only hope is that Cesc and Wenger have a plan to tag along Chelski and Manure till deadline day, and then Fuck em both in the arse and leaving them without any creativity in the midfield.

Fabregas= TOP 5 midfielder in the world

Prediction= Come home, win the domestic title and big ears, and Cesc takes home the
balon d’ior 😯

I noticed the slowing down in his last year with us, and now with Barca I see further decline

If you watch him closely Princey, you will see ageing dosnt suit him. Hes like that kid Ralph Machio from the original karate kid. Everyone remembers Machio for that role, but now the geezer makes a living as a fat second hand car salesman. If he tried to do that standing on one leg kick now, his arse would explode.

A lot of these wonder kids play to many games to early. You even see that with Messi, he seems to be a bit burnt out to.

Merry Terry,
LOL
In Italy they were saying the same about Bergkamp. Besides, players like Cesc, Modric, Pirlo….they use the ball to move. They dont run for the ball. They’re technicians and conductors, and only their brains are at full speed. They only need short bursts of accelaration to get past one player before opening up the pitch and releasing a killer through ball….Let Walcott do the running….

A superb and impassioned summary of why Cesc should be welcomed back to the Ems (and TA says he will send you the five quid in due course) 🙂

As I said to De heer Total, I think it is all too late – my suspicion fanned by noises out of Chelsea is that it is a done deal. All the media seem to accept that Arsenal do not want to exercise their option to have first refusal — so that seems to be that!

Hi Redders 🙂
I feared the worst too, as the murmerings got louder, but, im not convinced until i see him sign. It just doesnt make sense for Arsene to, at least, wait until a formal offer has been made. That is what is in the contarct. No where have i heard of an official bid offered, or Jose + Barca president confirming that. Its all smoke at the minute, in my opinion..

First off, you promised me that you had fixed it so that no good, pigeon humping, pastie eating, summova bitch, from Cornwall would not be coming back!
Then looked what happened – just as I had negotiated a great sex toy deal for Fozzie, after tough talks with the Dutch Clogger.

And then after I had got you a great reputation as an upbeat, positive thinking, Arsenal loving son of a gun from Islington, you go all bad hair day, and start to rubbish Cesc.

Mein heer Totes, says all deals are off, and you can shove you syrup where the sun don’t shine!

glad to see both you and Glic’s back, now let’s get the other Aussies back as well

oh Alex – where art thou

Oz – where art thou

while we are at it, let’s get the kiwi back as well

OH FOZZIE WITH A B – when are you getting released from prison ? I thought these days, you were allowed to use internet once a week whilst in the dungeons or prison as they call it ? but the technical point is, where have they chained you ? ? ?

Agree !…..some superb mass debating by the BK boyz, especially Prince and all with a nail gun in his other hand….could be another long extended break from BK in Aussie A&E coming up if he gets too excited !.

No that does not make sense. I know you, Terry and the Prince can talk straight out – but I won’t say it is bollix, 🙂

A better understanding of the likely clause contained in the message to Martha, is that Arsenal were entitled to an add on of £4m based on Barca performances in La Liga and the CL. That did not happen.

We sold him for a knock down £28m (I do not think Cesc did us any favours with his ‘only Barca’ nonsense) with the proviso that we would have a 50% share in any transfer profit Barca made.

So, if he was sold for £30m, we could match that on first refusal, or we would get 50% (30 – 28)m = £1m. Big deal. It is rumoured that the Chavs want to match the £28m or better still £27m to ensure we would get zilch from the deal.

I much prefer your version of events, but I think you know it is cockamamie. 🙂

Mr Cock-meister. My extended breaks have a lot to do with this new adult singles site i joined. Last night i was with 3 Lezbanians and a pelican. The pelican was awesome!
I also got Fozzie onto the same site. Last night, Fozzie was with 3 puppet piggies and a pidgeon. The piggies won…..

Arsenal board and Wenger have taken a lot of s*** over the past few years but i have to say when it comes to shrewd business sense none are better.
Why do i say this?
Well on top of completing and paying of one of the finest stadiums in the world.
The cleaver clauses that they put in the contracts of.
Vela
Fabregas
even rvp are genius
ha ha ha ha ha
You have got to give them it they have been very smart.
I almost feel like giving them a clap 🙂

hahaha. I admit that i once naivly joined a dating site looking for kinky sex. I posted the best fake picture i could find and lied about everything else.

This was a straight site but the only responses I got were from men. I complained to site admin “Weres my kinky sex? The only messages ive got so far is one bloke wanting to know what colour shoes i wear, and another geezer do heavy breathing by print”.

I want to clap with you. Most definetely on the stadium and also on the Vela clause. (im expecting us to buy back Vela for 3.5 and trial him in a few pre-season games before deciding to sell on prince Poldi or sell Vela to Atletico for 17mil or a straight trade to Sociedad for Griezman.
That was very shrewd and im still clapping.
BUT, this Cesc snowball story, has a shit-load of smoke around it. On deadline day, we could be cursing Wenger, or cursing “always a gunner” Cesc, or even cursing Gazidiz and tight arse- Stan for an extra 20,000 per/week wage hike. Who knows?? But, the ball is most definitely in our court;.

is it me or we seem to be saying the same thing here in regards to the 50/50 ?

perhaps I didn’t make it crystal clear – I only mentioned 30 million euros to make it more understandable , either way, it’s a big fat nada for Arsenal, if it was indeed, 30 mills , however, soon it goes above the 30 mills or Barca make any profits – we get the 50% split as you have said it.

and yep, you summed all of what I was saying rather beautifully in a shortened paragraph.

you just don’t know it yet, ha

am trying to get Milo out in the open as he has a fair bit to say on the whole Cesc returning to Arsenal conundrum as I think he sides with JM, Terry e.t.c e.t.c e.t.c on this one

I am with you all the way Prince and agree with everything you said.
I like you am a big Podolski fan, we would be mad to sell him. He is in the form of his life at the moment with Germany, he is world class.

There is another site I go on were its not to bad. Ive had some results.

The key is to post a fake picture, male model from a DIY catalouge etc, but make sure you edit out the drill, and dont pick one were your wearing the saftey hat, thats a bit weird.

Then lie about your wealth and lifestyle. Forget living of bake beans and sharing a loft with a scrawny piegon, you are now an international businessman based in Monte Carlo

The next bit is the most difficult. If you really want to meet the women, you have to come clean. The best way is profoundly apologise for your lies, and that you only done it because your heart has just been broken by your partner, or cesc is going to Chelsea etc.

Sincere honesty based on a foundation of lies is the most powerful tool in a bullshitters armoury

I SOO NEED HIM BACK. WE NEED HIM!! Then the stars will align and the ghosts will stir things up. He is our ‘model’ project youth. The greatest talent on this planet (at 17) since Pele, and a world cup winner, the assister in the winning goal, and HE is A GUNNER!!

No, No — it wasn’t me James — I never said we should get rid of Prince Poldi, and, anyway, I could not go thru another visit from Terry and Glic — last time they interfered with the private bits of my copper statue of Venus, because they thought she was being stand-offish.

We could go in for any striker… Mandzukic, Benzema, Balotelli or my favourite idea of turning Rolls Reus into a striker at AFC, Remy, Chicarito etc and they would all get 20 plus goals in the domestic league, add Europe SO LONG AS, Cesc comes home.

fully concurred @ RA – although, I must point out that I am in no position to ever disagree with you since you have the dreaded laser in your possession, ha

Re- Santiago @ PG – he has just signed a 2 year extension at Arsenal, which means – AW likes and AW wants him to stay at arsenal and if you watched the last Spain game – he came on in the 2nd half and oh boy, can he play and pass or can he play and pass ? Spain are really good at playing sexey footy but that went onto the next level when Santiago came on in the 2nd half (Silva also played a part but I am biased, ha

let them off the hook this time @ PG – I have said this before and will say it again re- Poldi – even though he is one of the bigger earners at Arsenal, he is still underpaid considering all the work he does for Arsenal on twitter and so on – he gets us a lot of fans interested in Arsenal or keeps them engaged and so on – also, we are better off with him on the team – it’s just a shame that he was injured for 5 months or so and couldn’t get to play with Ozil that much but guess what ? even with all that he scored us 15 goals, if memory serves !

if it was down to us gooners, we would have the entire team sacked and someone else get in.

I know, I have that with Sczny but it has merit – I was watching the international game a couple of days ago, where Sczny was in goal for the 2nd half, in the dying minute of the game – he has a brain fart and I hope the clip is available online but in short, the ref came to his rescue or else he would have gifted Lithuania a goal – he is not ready yet nor will be anytime soon from what I just saw a couple of days ago.

Why Szcs did not kick the ball out of play i don’t know.
He is very good with his feet, but i was at the Arsenal match v Southampton when Giroud robbed the keeper his international team mate, if he has not learnt from that and he was the the other goal well it is a bit worrying

it didn’t come up but I do sort of remember him saying that Santiago reminds him of his dog, when he does the whole shoot or not to shoot or the spin thing (spanish dance) – it was along the lines of his dog spinning around wanting to take a poo but instead followed his tail in circles – it was funny, I must confess , ha

17HT is a huge Santiago fan, so I will let 17HT sort out skipper on that one !

however, I will say this on Santi though – in a 4-5-1, he fits in like a glove and the only reason why both Ozil and Santiago are not as effective as they should be is due to the tempo we play at arsenal , by that I mean a real lack of some pace up front or movement even – this is where the likes of Ox, Theo come in next season

I kid you not, I was watching this game live and even though I couldn’t care less whether Poland won or lost but when he did that, I was absolutely baffled – he is an experienced keeper now for crying out loud – more than 100 matches at the very very top level for both club and country now and he goes onto do that.

@ PG

it’s all jolly good getting in a striker, a dm , or cesc – but there is no point getting all of them if we still have Sczny and his brain farts as our undisputed no.1

JB,
He is a SQ shot stopper and even though the video says other wise good with his feet.
That was pure cockyness , his dissision making is clearly a worry,
We have to buy a new keeper and i say if you can get a better 1 then do it.
Begavic!

I have just read an article on the telegraph re- Cesc, I suspect RA was using that one before whilst discussing it with me.

one thing that further strengthens my initial point on how much Barca owe us is the fact that we still have chose not to trigger the £4.4 million owed to us in ad-on’s

so, in theory , we could have Cesc back on the cheap cheap, considering, we trigger those 2 la liga and CL winning bonus on Cesc’s contract, so any price we have to pay Barca , it will have to be minus the £4.4 they mention in the link plus the arrears from both Song and Cesc’s deals.

also, it makes sense for Barca to look for buyers who would want to pay money in cash as opposed to Arsenal , who could easily pay a lot less in REAL cash, as most of it will be actually adjusted against what I have mentioned – interesting interesting (who likes playing chess ?

A mate of mine…..and just to not embarrass him, I will give him a fictitious name….Vics, had them adverts come up on his internet, saying that with his post code he was only a few miles away from pussy wanting to meet him !. This site was called something like , Pussy Galore or Pussy `R` Us !. Anyway, it said, for just the special offer fee of £19.99, he would get all sorts of pussy…..white pussy, black pussy, ginger pussy, Asian pussy, shaven pussy…the lot and a free book on…… The best pussy entry techniques !.
Vics sent the £19.99 off and in the post he received a pact of Nepeta cataria seeds ( commonly known as catmint ! ) and a manual on how to assemble a cat flap !.
Vics did learn something though !…..catmint attracts cats to your garden, but also, a little known fact about catmint is that it`s odour is similar to a male cats odour !. So Vics was getting quite a few male cats in his house, which by all accounts means they were gay cats !….so they were basically after arse not pussy !.

Rik Mayall has passed away !. A ledge for me…The Young Ones, Blackadder, The New Statesman and Bottom to name a few, but my favourites were his scene stealing performances as Flashheart in Blackadder !. Flashheart is me in my dreams !.

It was good debating with you today but I regret being too soft on Terry and too hard on you at times. I respect your contributions to the site, but on this occasion it is best to agree to disagree. Hope to see you back regularly here. 🙂

There may not be much left to squeeze out of this discussion, but lets give it a try. A number of folk have referred to Cesc as a top 5 world midfield player or statements to the equivalent. Maybe slightly over-egged, but I accept the general sense here – he is a truly quality player.

Why then are Barca so willing to sell him, esp when their current midfield core is badly ageing? And why would they a) sell for such a low price and b) there be so little interest/competition across clubs? Something does not add up here.

Even assuming the reports of our clause getting 50% over his sale price are true, Barca are not so cash rich as to not bother to extract what value they can; and that has to be above £27M for a player of Cesc’s ability – which is slightly less than Manure bought Fellaini for last summer! Ha!

Something is not right in this mix, beyond a new coach wanting to bring some new players at Barca and Cesc finding it easier to move in with his girlfriend in London….. I just don’t buy all that. So what is it???

I quite agree with you on Cesc TA (great post) and PG.If we can, we should go for Cesc – provided however that it’s not “instead of” when it comes to other positions we need to fill, especially in terms of quality/SQ DM. If we have a shot at a player like Cesc for a decent amount (and I think 30m is very decent), then we should make the extra effort, and in my (financial) mind that’s the main benefit of having extra cash in the bank and a solid balance sheet – being able to do what it takes when good opportunities arise.

Funny how people are so pessimistic with the Cesc situation, dozens of rumours flying around, mostly contradicting themselves from publications to publications or day to day, with no sources whatsoever, and suddenly it’s common knowledge that we have turned him down, that he is signing for Chelsea… just listen to what JB is saying dammit. I don’t know if we’ll sign him or not, but we definitely have the most cards to play, and no reason to show our hand.

Exactly AB. I am not joking about Cescs hamsring problems. Near the end of his Arsenal carrear I lost count of how many people around me would comment on his running power “Whats wrong with him”, “Must me injured” etc, every home game.

Of course, i now watch him on TV and playing in a different league so its hard to make a comparrison but in my opinion hes lost his sprint.

For a spell of several months before his first major hamstring pull, theres was something different about him. They had obviously worked on his conditioning and his added running power genuinly made him world class. This period also coincided with his glut of goals.

Look, ime a know nothing, and could be completely wrong. Just my opinion thats all.

AB, not much time to post, but I think they want more pace to break the permanent buses in La Liga – their midfield has aged and slowed down too much – Iniesta and Xavi used to be able to have burst of speed to win one on ones, and in the 3-4 games I’ve seen this year, have largely lost that edge. Tiki taka requires that ability to break 1 or 2m away from defenders to open passing lanes and flowing triangle passing. I don’t think they can (or are willing to, or can get enough money to) part with either of those 2 barca legends, and Cesc is one of the player they can get good money for (and he does not have a key role in Barcelona as when he was our conductor).

Adebarndoor once said Cesc was the slowest player at the club and I heard he was once beaten in a 100M dash by a tin of slow drying paint, the experience left him in a state of emulsion !. So there`s nothing new in knowing he`s slow and lets be honest Wilshere isn`t the quickest either !. However his vision and speed of thought is what in tandem with the other high assister in the world….Ozil, will benefit the likes of Walcott and any other speedsters we manage to acquire !. What`s the good of bullets without the gun !.

If slowness was a key requirement 3/4 of the squad would be sacked tomorrow.

Terry obsession with Cesc’s legs – I am sure he would love the hair of it on his glimmering Robben – totally blinds him to the fact that he achieved almost 100 goals and assists in just 150 games, just at Barca.

AB, good question. To be frank, we do not know what the real interest is in Fabregas and what the clubs believe is realistic…. It is quite obvious that Cesc is likely to play for either Barca or Arsenal, so why bother putting a bid in?!