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I've had a thought bumbling around in my head for a while about tank/air crews. I might have outlined it before, but the best infantry killing tank is still the lighting with HE or HEAT right?

If you were running a squad based on alternate Lib/Tank pulls then teams of three would be the simplest - gives you Lib a reargunner and the third man can drive a Lighting anti-infantry "outrider" for the Mag.

The Outrider's job is to kill threats to their MBT chum - not run away or get involved in other things - Lightings tend to be smaller, faster and less valuable targets for infantry AV. I would imagine them flanking and blasting away at AV positions while those AV guys are concentrating on the MBTS and don't see it coming. You still have to pick your fights and stay mobile and alert.

To a lesser extent the Mags can support each other - each one covering the flanks of another one - but I think a Lighting would be faster and a better use of people and points.

Sadly at the moment against Infantry who are remotely equipped to fight them mags are more raiders than ... well ... Tanks.

I love tanks, i'd definetly want to be part of this.
Its unfortunate tanks have ended up so much on the backfoot lately, not quite able to be the frontline figure and more of a supportive bombard or anti-sunderer role.

Something which bothers me greatly and that i see way too often when we do pull tanks is the overuse of Sarons.
The meta has changed, how many times as a tank have you acctually been blown up by an enemy tank lately?
It'll either be a lock-on launcher, a rocketpodding ESF and sometimes a C4.

The default tank gun (Nice balance of AV and AI) and a Kobalt will go a long way on todays battlefield. The kobalt is really excellent and picking off infantry at almost all ranges. Imagine a Tank-squad with all Kobalts, the infantry wouldnt be able to stick their heads up from behind cover. All you'd have to fear would be dumbfire rockets, easily evaded.
And if we meet heavy armored resistance, the kobalt gunner can jump out and repair or use a AV mana turret, shazam.

It might actually be time to re-evaluate the supremacy of the Saron. It is the most fun gun to man, certainly, but I agree it might not be the most effective in all situations. Has anyone tried the Walker or Ranger (AA guns) on a Magrider?

"Quantacat's name is still recognised even if he watches on with detached eyes like Peter Molyneux over a cube in 3D space, staring at it with tears in his eyes, softly whispering... Someday they'll get it." - The Conclave

"Quantacat's name is still recognised even if he watches on with detached eyes like Peter Molyneux over a cube in 3D space, staring at it with tears in his eyes, softly whispering... Someday they'll get it." - The Conclave

I've had a thought bumbling around in my head for a while about tank/air crews. I might have outlined it before, but the best infantry killing tank is still the lighting with HE or HEAT right?

I would go for HEAT. HE has only slightly more splash radius and damage while HEAT does more "core damage" (damage close to the center of impact) as well as decent AV damage. Currently I don't see HE to be worth it's downsides, even for AI.
It could be an option if you are only engaging infantry, but sometimes you cannot pick your fights. And when vehicles see that you are using HE they will come for you because they know you do almost no damage to them.
Also Lightnings have the problem that they die to ESFs very, very fast. So it would most like still need AA support.

I wouldn't stick either AA on a Magrider. Leave that to the backup sundie carrying Bursters, or to Skyguards (which are much better than either Walker or Ranger)

Equally, a HE/HEAT lightning is probably better AI than a Kobalt mag. But it might still be worth trying a mix of Sarons and Kobalts, as the Kobalt accuracy does make for good defense vs Heavies, and Magrider has survieability that the Lightning lacks.

Originally Posted by QuantaCat

not in my experience. I have a walker and a ranger on my AA sundy, both are valuable, especially in tandem. The walker is better against ESFs while the ranger shreds through libs.

Watch that video. Ranger takes ~55 seconds to down a Lib. Walker ~15. Ranger being flak does have its uses, but the gap between them in damage is just so big...

What baffles me about ranger/walker is how the rangers flak is an air deterrent while with the burster/skyguard it's the other way round; burster flak is making the kills, not the bullet spreading skyguards.

"Quantacat's name is still recognised even if he watches on with detached eyes like Peter Molyneux over a cube in 3D space, staring at it with tears in his eyes, softly whispering... Someday they'll get it." - The Conclave

It might actually be time to re-evaluate the supremacy of the Saron. It is the most fun gun to man, certainly, but I agree it might not be the most effective in all situations. Has anyone tried the Walker or Ranger (AA guns) on a Magrider?

BURN THE HERETIC, lol.

The problem with going in that direction is that you'd always be better off pulling two lightnings. One with the AP gun (higher dps than the mag primary), and one with a skyguard. If you really wanted to replace the Saron, a Kobalt might work well, as the primary threats are air and infantry. Problem is, a saron-less mag will have massive issues with killing another tank, even if it's 1/2 or an AP lightning.

Personally, i don't see any reason to retire my saron. Decent gunners will be able to use it against infantry sufficiently well, and it still increases AV potential massively. That being said ... the instagib rocketpod deaths are annoying as hell. Skyguards will be mandatory to avoid that.

On an unrelated note: i went on a rampage against NC with my HE lightning on esamir yesterday. Got 45 kills before being destroyed, and one of them was the traitor leader!

The problem with going in that direction is that you'd always be better off pulling two lightnings. One with the AP gun (higher dps than the mag primary), and one with a skyguard. If you really wanted to replace the Saron, a Kobalt might work well, as the primary threats are air and infantry. Problem is, a saron-less mag will have massive issues with killing another tank, even if it's 1/2 or an AP lightning.

Personally, i don't see any reason to retire my saron. Decent gunners will be able to use it against infantry sufficiently well, and it still increases AV potential massively. That being said ... the instagib rocketpod deaths are annoying as hell. Skyguards will be mandatory to avoid that.

On an unrelated note: i went on a rampage against NC with my HE lightning on esamir yesterday. Got 45 kills before being destroyed, and i one of them was the traitor leader!

"Quantacat's name is still recognised even if he watches on with detached eyes like Peter Molyneux over a cube in 3D space, staring at it with tears in his eyes, softly whispering... Someday they'll get it." - The Conclave

I think the Ranger is straight up useless. The Walker is better at everything. The Ranger's projectile speed is just far too slow for it to be possible to hit air. Sure, you can sometimes hit that ESF strafing you and do some damage, but the Walker will dish out more at much longer ranges at much better accuracy.

Regarding the Saron, it is a good anti-infantry weapon if you use it well. It is also very satisfying and awesome to kill infantry with.

Problem is, a saron-less mag will have massive issues with killing another tank, even if it's 1/2 or an AP lightning.

Personally, i don't see any reason to retire my saron. Decent gunners will be able to use it against infantry sufficiently well, and it still increases AV potential massively.

I just find it unreliable for AI, you might get one hit and kill now and then with it but you'll rarely get a streak if the tank and/or infantry are acctually moving about. But that might just be me sucking at it.
As for being gimp against other tanks without it, its just not true if we're talking about making a tank squad. We'll have the numbers to easilly blast away opposition. You just dont see the larger tank engagements where it would shine anymore until SOE fixes things.

I think the Ranger is straight up useless. The Walker is better at everything. The Ranger's projectile speed is just far too slow for it to be possible to hit air. Sure, you can sometimes hit that ESF strafing you and do some damage, but the Walker will dish out more at much longer ranges at much better accuracy.

Regarding the Saron, it is a good anti-infantry weapon if you use it well. It is also very satisfying and awesome to kill infantry with.

"Quantacat's name is still recognised even if he watches on with detached eyes like Peter Molyneux over a cube in 3D space, staring at it with tears in his eyes, softly whispering... Someday they'll get it." - The Conclave

I just find it unreliable for AI, you might get one hit and kill now and then with it but you'll rarely get a streak if the tank and/or infantry are acctually moving about. But that might just be me sucking at it.
As for being gimp against other tanks without it, its just not true if we're talking about making a tank squad. We'll have the numbers to easilly blast away opposition. You just dont see the larger tank engagements where it would shine anymore until SOE fixes things.

I wish you could have Furys on tanks.

Not sure about you, but i have pretty severe issues with landing hits on targets that are 300m+ away with the HEAT. At least landing them without too many shots trying to zero in, that is. the saron is a lot more reliable for these types of fights. It also oneshots AV mana turret users at any range reliably, which is pretty huge.