The Official MIKE DUNLEAVY Discussion Thread (P. 2)

With the players we had at our disposal, and the teams we were going up against, I don't think Gene Hackman from "Hoosiers" could have came out with victories these last four games.

The one MAYBE was the Nuggets game, but otherwise the Jazz and Lakers are excellent teams that have had their core people together for several years, we weren't going to beat them.

We're not where we want to be yet. Love, like clippers basketball, takes time...

Derty_Bert

11/04/2008 - 02:58 AM PST

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It's been Dunleavys team, He's had say so in the Clippers draft picks since Chris Kaman, he just now officially got the GM title. I think the only thing that is saving him is his longevity as a coach. It's only a matter of time before Stephen A. Smith or one of the more outspoken espn analyst start calling for his head, because everyone can see he's doing something wrong.

teamfiend

11/04/2008 - 03:48 AM PST

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i know im alone in the cold over here, but i still like dunleavy. sure he has made mistkes, and we can all find something to question him on, but that goes for anyone we put here. imagime the screaming that would be going on if say phil jackson was our coach, and went on one of his patented ::: my teams ice cold, havent hit a shot in 4 minutes, let them work it out bythemselves on the court ::: deals, where he wont call a timeout or sub for 7 minutes when theyre gettin beatin down..... my point being that nomatter who we have we'll all find gripes. thats the nature of the coach-fan relationship.

having said that, dunleavy has been the most professional, loyal, hard working, committed to winning and being successfull, not only coach, but employee in the entire organization since ive followed the team when they moved to la in '84.

lets get these horses healthy, and lets see what we really got here..... still could be a very special squad

cisco_805

11/04/2008 - 11:47 AM PST

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Who in here thinks we should just get rid of Dunleavy??

Don't get me wrong I like Mike but his coaching and lineupps are killing the Clippers.

First of all Kat needs to come off the bench. Kat is inconsistent and does not bring the offensive scoring. We not try the new rookie Gordon.

Second, if other players are not scoring or seem to not work well with others, please take them out. Mike leaves them in there until they dig themselves into the hole.

I think a new coach, ideas, will bring this team together.

What do you guys think??

AJCLIP

11/04/2008 - 11:49 AM PST

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I respectively disagree. Although some of his moves or non-moves are questionable, at 25 games in is when I will judge.

Thanks.

cisco_805

11/04/2008 - 12:00 PM PST

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I think we have given dunleavy plenty of games to improve his moves and coaching.

I know everyone right now is unhappy with what we have seen so far but if we do not voice our opinions and recommend changes, the team will not get anywhere.

New coach & Reasonable lineups will make the players better. If you change the lineupp 30 times during the regular season then you don't know what the heck you are doing.

Sorry AJclip I think we need a new coach.

EI_Nino_Jesus

11/04/2008 - 12:01 PM PST

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I disagree as well we are only 4 games into this, which is rhetorical to want to simply get rid of the man that aided in forming the team we have now, not to mention doing a good job in previous s. I mean come on man, even great teams sometimes fall short with a 0-loss column I didn't expect us to perform greatly off the bat, your forgetting this team is new! we need time! have some friggin' patience!, I'm getting mad due to the post saying, we lost we need to get rid of this one, it's like think for five minutes! But whatever to each his own, I suppose if Davis scores less than his average we'll be seeing, "Davis For ___?, I think So?", I'm sorry but..although Dunleavy did some mistakes , this can't be said this early.

cisco_805

11/04/2008 - 12:14 PM PST

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I know it is early in the season but if you have the wrong players in at one time then you are not going to have any chemistry.

Just to point one of many errors.... Why did dunleavy select to post up Tim Thomas and give him the final shot against Denver??

I could of guess, if I was denver, that they would be going to tim thomas again. A coach needs to develop plays that will be giving you the victory.

clipper*joe

11/04/2008 - 12:26 PM PST

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The only reason we are talking about it is because the play fall flat on it's arse. Had it gone in, this wouldn't be an issue. TT was probably the only player making shots that game so why wouldn't you go to the guy that was making his shots?

It wasn't the play that sucked, it was the execution of the play by Mobley & TT that made it suck.

You have to admit, TT's fall away 15 footer looks pretty good...in the first half.

Miquel

11/04/2008 - 01:22 PM PST

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I give him 15 more games...His credibility as a coach is falling, not because we are losing now but what he did last years. Maybe someone who could give fresh air would be interesting and personally I'd like to see Avery Johnson as our coach. But I repeat: only if things don't work after 15 games

On the other hand I like Dunleavy as GM.

LAC_12

11/04/2008 - 01:40 PM PST

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OK here we go again, people wanna see change because we are not winning. We need time and then the Ws will roll our way (hopefully, more so than now at least). However I would get a new coach in here just because I dont believe Dunleavy is a good coach (this dates back to before he was even a Clipper coach.) He is alright, good enough to be mediocre (a lil above average at the best), but we need a COACH. A players coach, a coach with a Coaches swag - its somethings a few coaches have, that Dunleavy does not.

Point Blank, people need to stop bitching the wins will come soon enough, but if we expect to be an elite team with respect from people across the nation, itll need to start with a revamped roster keeping a few of our core and letting go of those mediocre "roll" players. Then we need to get a real Coach. This would result in a genuinely good team. Not one with a few moves with somewhat recognizable names, and the hype of a superstar PG taking a team with a bad rep and trying to have a Disneyland ending. Our team in 05-06 was much more solid than our team NOW. Had we had a better coach, we migh have been taken to the promised land. However we can still grow as a team (only then will we be better than 05-06), but one still wonders how far can Dunleavy really take us? How much further can other coaches lead this team?

cisco_805

11/04/2008 - 01:50 PM PST

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Miguel - I agree with you. I would love to see Avery and what he would offer the clips.

I guess it is a wait and see for now

ekker3

11/04/2008 - 02:23 PM PST

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everything you've said, i could understand (although i strongly disagree). but you give no reasons why you think he's always been a bad coach. if you really think we need a new coach, you need to set a criteria - otherwise, the next coach is just a crapshoot. that's as good as saying john wooden was a good coach because he was pretty good at coaching.

when he took this job, he inherited a team that only won 19 games the previous year and steadily improved each and every year thereafter (one shot away from the conference finals in a year that we surprised everyone). the past three years we've been marred by injuries to key players and you cant put the blame on him for that.

LAC_12

11/04/2008 - 02:34 PM PST

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no you are right, but one criteria is dealing with the situations that arise within and during the season, injuries included. Lakers did fine when Kobe was injured (not even going to talk about a season going Bynum-less and making the finals). Heck the Utah Jazz was without thier leader and they worked around it. Dunelavy does not have the sense to use the right player in the right time. He got lucky with EB and Maggette because he would always have two work horses he would play and determine the game. A good coach is a good coordinator, Dunleavy is not. A good coach rises to the occasion and works against the odds, Dunleavy just talks and justifies the excuses. A good coach can be on the same page with the players and fans and the game (theres three cirteria right there that dunleavy lacks). A good coach is assertive, he can assess his teams strengths and weaknesses and exploits their strengths while minimizing thier weaknesses. A good coach has a a sense of an offense and defense - his system - which he runs and changes due to the given circumstance, our players look out of hand and out of control (they have been before this season). Do you notice how difficult it is for us to score? Other well-coached teams are controlled in a system that is tight (where it needs to be tight) or loose (when it needs to be). That is some criteria of good coaches. Considering I am a player and a coach, I understand my roles and what each job expects of me - this is how i see that Dunleavy lacks that coaching edge.

corgiBear8

11/04/2008 - 04:40 PM PST

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I think Dunleavy has too much on his plate right now. The Clips should hire another coach, and let Dunleavy stick to being the GM.

I do notice how difficult it is for our team to score. No matter who we play, it seems like the team is fighting an uphill battle on offense. I know its early, but even previous seasons, it just doesn't look like the players enjoy executing the plays Dunleavy calls. I don't know if Dunleavy is solely to blame, because I think we have really one dimensional players with low basketball IQs. Maybe the offense is too complicated for guys like Al, Cuttino, and Ricky...as they seem to catch and hold the ball for long periods of time. I also don't like how our offense sets start with 13-15 seconds left on the shot clock, causing us to shoot low percentage shots due to the shot clock winding down. I don't know why we can't bring the ball up faster and start the offense faster.

I think Dunleavy's micromanaging coaching style of always standing throughout the game and yelling calls/comments to the players on the court, might be wearing out and becoming not as effective as it was in the beginning.

One other thing I disagree with Dunleavy is his tendency to always match up to the other teams. He's always done this with his starting five and subsititutions, and it leaves us at a big disadvantage. He'll match up the other team with our best defenders, and leave our better all around players on the bench.

Who knows what's really going on. I do think Dunleavy truly cares about the success of the team and its players, and he gives it 100%, I just don't know why we are always struggling to win and/or be consistent.

SteelLAC2010

11/04/2008 - 05:16 PM PST

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We do not have an identity of ourselves until then we will keep losing.

EG#23

11/04/2008 - 05:32 PM PST

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Man you hit it right on the spot!!! Mr. Video is running out of time. He cooked himself his own last meal. He put this team together himself and can't even figure how to win. somebody mentioned that golden state started off 0-7 but i bet they didn't get blown out or quite the way our team has. Baron will soon notice that dumleavy is no offensive genuis. He's been the coach for several years now and not once have i felt confident that he would come up with some game winning play to get us the win. We will win eventually but's it's because these guys are proffesionals and it's what they get paid to do. He's is a better G.M. than coach period..............................

Icecoldclipper

11/04/2008 - 06:48 PM PST

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Only thing I'm mad at about Dunleavy is the rotation. By simple match-ups what happen with Milsap didn't make sense and didn't even make Dunleavy "system" sense.

Paul Milsap began to score like crazy and out hustle players, Dunleavy usually would put a player in the game to match the hustle and play. I'm thinking what is Dunleavy waiting for Tim Thomas is average defender on the outside but will get killed inside the paint. Why not throw in Brian Skinner and allow him to get physical and bother some shots, get blocks, and secure rebounds.

And OH MY GOD we have to find a way to fix the SG problem that position is where we're suppose to get good shots from more than others. Cat seems to struggle when he is not the number one option.

cisco_805

11/05/2008 - 02:24 PM PST

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I agree Mike should be GM....as you all know he was the one acquiring players and not Elgin Baylor. He was out there negotiating contracts and convincing players to come and play for clips.

As far as a new coach, I would like to see Avery come in to the picture. He has the passion for B-ball and I am sure he might give allot of his insights/knowledge to our young players like EG, P Davis...etc.

I am hoping Mike improves and or listens to us fans and gets a good lineup and makes good decisions or else I am voting for new coach.

Anyone attending the GS game on Nov 15th?? I will be there.

Jay.r

11/05/2008 - 02:41 PM PST

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LOL... heck yeah... remember during the BD announcement conference, Elgin didn't even know what to say about acquiring BD.

I'd really want MD just to be the GM... he just looked bad this year. He looks really stressed out.

And Cisco, Ellis wants a trade. Maybe we should try and get him. Check it out on the NBA forum.

LOLO-CELTA

11/05/2008 - 02:49 PM PST

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Hello guys, I love this site.

He(MDunleavy) is not a good Coach, but honestly, who cares?, cmon guys go to a celtics forum, its pretty nice to cheer for a WINNING franchise.

Jay.r

11/05/2008 - 02:55 PM PST

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LOL... GET OUT TA HERE YOU CELTIC BANDWAGONNER!

-.-

No, but seriously get out...

LOLO-CELTA

11/05/2008 - 02:58 PM PST

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Jay.r wrote:

LOLO-CELTA wrote:

Hello guys, I love this site.

He(MDunleavy) is not a good Coach, but honestly, who cares?, cmon guys go to a celtics forum, its pretty nice to cheer for a WINNING franchise.

LOL... GET OUT TA HERE YOU CELTIC BANDWAGONNER!

-.-

No, but seriously get out...

comon I know you want....

MrHill

11/05/2008 - 03:12 PM PST

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LOLO-CELTA wrote:

Jay.r wrote:

LOLO-CELTA wrote:

Hello guys, I love this site.

He(MDunleavy) is not a good Coach, but honestly, who cares?, cmon guys go to a celtics forum, its pretty nice to cheer for a WINNING franchise.

LOL... GET OUT TA HERE YOU CELTIC BANDWAGONNER!

-.-

No, but seriously get out...

comon I know you want....

Who the hell are you, and why are you here? If it's starting to piss people off here, then you doing a hell of a job.

LOLO-CELTA

11/05/2008 - 03:23 PM PST

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MrHill wrote:

LOLO-CELTA wrote:

Jay.r wrote:

LOLO-CELTA wrote:

Hello guys, I love this site.

He(MDunleavy) is not a good Coach, but honestly, who cares?, cmon guys go to a celtics forum, its pretty nice to cheer for a WINNING franchise.

LOL... GET OUT TA HERE YOU CELTIC BANDWAGONNER!

-.-

No, but seriously get out...

comon I know you want....

Who the hell are you, and why are you here? If it's starting to piss people off here, then you doing a hell of a job.

no, Im not looking for troubles.... I tried to be funny at first, I enjoy reading Clips and Lakers boards, just to know whats going on.

MrHill

11/05/2008 - 03:40 PM PST

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Fair enough...

toohipcliptoslip

11/05/2008 - 05:25 PM PST

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Dunleavy is 3/4 of the problem. Getting beaten is one thing but getting blown out is another.We have the ability to play small ball as well as half court. I'm eating my words but we do need Gordon in. How about three guard sets? We need to develop our Bigs. We can rotate Camby and Chris and add Skinner or Davis at PF. Our bench is absent.

ps The Black coach in Hoosiers was my neighbor. Speaking of Black men we all should be proud to be Americans by electing Obama. I'm not saying this because he's a Democrat or Republican. When he was born his parents couldn't vote in the South. Some ethnic feuds have lasted 500 yrs. We are quite remarkable.

LAC_12

11/06/2008 - 02:01 AM PST

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corgiBear8 wrote:

I think Dunleavy has too much on his plate right now. The Clips should hire another coach, and let Dunleavy stick to being the GM.

I do notice how difficult it is for our team to score. No matter who we play, it seems like the team is fighting an uphill battle on offense. I know its early, but even previous seasons, it just doesn't look like the players enjoy executing the plays Dunleavy calls.

Or lack there of. As a coach I am not fond of Dunleavy at all. He is out of tune with his players, with the crowd, and with the GAME. This is what I mean by a system. In college they have a motion offense from which they can run different "set plays". Dunleavy does not need to be as organized as college basketball (as it is incredibly more different than the NBA), but obviously he needs to me more organized than this.

corgiBear8 wrote:

I don't know if Dunleavy is solely to blame, because I think we have really one dimensional players with low basketball IQs. Maybe the offense is too complicated for guys like Al, Cuttino, and Ricky...as they seem to catch and hold the ball for long periods of time. I also don't like how our offense sets start with 13-15 seconds left on the shot clock, causing us to shoot low percentage shots due to the shot clock winding down. I don't know why we can't bring the ball up faster and start the offense faster.

I think Dunleavy's micromanaging coaching style of always standing throughout the game and yelling calls/comments to the players on the court, might be wearing out and becoming not as effective as it was in the beginning.

One other thing I disagree with Dunleavy is his tendency to always match up to the other teams. He's always done this with his starting five and subsititutions, and it leaves us at a big disadvantage. He'll match up the other team with our best defenders, and leave our better all around players on the bench.

No our players are not one dimensional, it is a coaching problem. His micromanaging ways and control freak habits with no organization make out offense as agonizing as we are watching. were shooting in the 30s a night...

Jay.r

11/13/2008 - 12:04 AM PST

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Once again... Mike Dunleavy got outcoached...

Beaten by the Martin-less Kings?

Clippers should be scoring over 100 ppg easy every game with all their weapons...

clippers0918

11/13/2008 - 12:04 AM PST

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he makes 1 fricken move after another. he just cant coach.

remember the game against pho when he put a player in that had yet to play 1 minute?

he takes 2 timeouts and not even close to getting a good shot.

benches wrong players. keeps players benched for long!

hate to say it he just suxs at a coach!

clippers0918

11/13/2008 - 12:05 AM PST

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opps didnt see this. FIRE HIM!

frankiefkmor

11/13/2008 - 12:06 AM PST

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He should do another great GM move and fire the coach!!!...lol This is so freckin frustrating!!!!

clippers0918

11/13/2008 - 12:07 AM PST

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as a gm he isnt bad. as a coach he is a joke. i had enough really. i leep makeing excuses for him but its his fault the team looses!

Jay.r

11/13/2008 - 12:09 AM PST

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no duh

Dunleavy should fire himself.

I would say that our team has twice the better players than the Kings (anyone disagree?)

Also

can anyone tell me, why the HELL is Tim Thomas always so friendly with our opponents?!?!

clippers0918

11/13/2008 - 12:10 AM PST

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any idea of how to get this done?

i know there has to be some way. i am just tierd. he has to go and go NOW!

Jay.r

11/13/2008 - 12:14 AM PST

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Yup

Everyone is so up about our coaching that David actually created a whole sticky thread about it.

Who cares if we extended Dunleavy's contract, freakin fire him.

Best move DTS would ever do, to our lowsy Clipper history.

clipps04

11/13/2008 - 12:15 AM PST

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He has made some weird moves but honestly this loss is all on the players. Mike loves running the offense but it was our D that lost us this game. We couldn't make a stop to save our lives. Guys honestly I don't think Mike is the problem. I mean Udrih had 5 rebounds and the Clippers top rebounder was Chris with 6.....

Also no one can tell what was supposed to happen out of those timeouts but it's the Clipper players that fail to create anything out of the timeout. I doubt Mike's play calling is as terrible as we saw from the inbound plays.

When the Clippers dont have any momentum they just stand around. The kings were running all over the place. Driving the lane and kicking it out to an open man for a long 2 or 3. That's what the Clips should be doing. attacking the basket creating space for perimeter shooters. Or at least swing the ball around. All we do is play one on one while the other 4 guys stand and watch and I know Mike's plays aren't made for one on one's

clippers0918

11/13/2008 - 12:19 AM PST

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he is a overrated horrable coach. and its enough we cover for him. he gets outcoached by everyone. cant comeup with easy looking shot with 2 timeouts.!

clipps04

11/13/2008 - 12:28 AM PST

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I know many want to see him go but we have like what 5 returning clipper players? It apparently is hard to play with new guys no matter how good or how much potential the team has on paper. I understand losing sucks but you can't go around demanding someone to be fired. Chris plays a couple bad games and half this board wants him out. We'd get no other legit big in return and we'd be an even worse team. Now we have this game where our guys are playing 0 D and it's Mikes fault. Could this be because of the article we read today about Davis and Mike? I know we'd rather take Davis's side because he is our star PG.

He had a terrible game tonight....at least for the caliber player he is. 4-15 from the field?

The defense killed us, not our coach. But I agree if things don't pick up within a reasonable amount of time maybe a new coach is in order. But not this early. Again we've played what 8 games? And you guys want a new coach......this team has played fully healthy 3 times...give them some time. As I said before I feel the players lost this game not the coaching.

Jay.r

11/13/2008 - 12:28 AM PST

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Dunleavy calls all the plays on the defensive end as well so please stop saving Dunleavy...

Our player's are better overall at everything compare to the Kings. From our three point shooters, athletiscm, rebounding, EVERYTHING.

Dunleavy was out-coached on the Rockets' game and he was CLEARLY out-coached in this game. If you say so otherwise, you've probably didn't see the game because you were drooling in your sleep.

If Dunleavy stays... I really think that there is no way in hell that we'd make the playoffs.

Everyone wanted to fire him last year, but we were willing to give him another shot because a lot of players were injured. He has no excuses this year.

If I don't see any progress, I want him fired at the very least, as early as next year. Yes, on January 1st 2009.

clipps04

11/13/2008 - 12:33 AM PST

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Your gonna honestly tell me that Dunleavy was the fault for our defense. Yeah must be his fault our guys stand and watch the other team rebound. Must be his fault our players don't box out. Must be his fault thay let a crap team like the kings run around the Clips like a bunch of high school retards. It's either zone or man defense. The players have to f**king defend.

OneNationUnderClip

11/13/2008 - 12:44 AM PST

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I went to a Knicks game last year in New York and they were selling "Fire Isiah" t-shirts, they were chanting "fire Isiah" all throughout the game, and sure enough, a few weeks later Isiah Thomas stepped down. If we really want Dunleavy to go that bad, we need to let Sterling know. Trust me, Sterling isnt a member of Clippers Topbuzz. He isnt reading this post. He has no idea the Clipper fans want Dunleavy to to get the axe. If we want it, we need to organize. T-shirts, yelling at games, anything. Something needs to be done. I love the Clippers. and Dunleavy is ruining another promising season....

clipps04

11/13/2008 - 12:49 AM PST

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We're 8 games into the season with only playing our starters 3 or 4 times....5 returning clipper players from last season. we have no identity and played horribly tonight and I don't think it's the coaches fault. But hell we need justice right? So fire the coach. Fire somebody or trade somebody cause that's the only solution.

Just my opinion. And enough with the playoff's We need to make improvements and while the playoffs would be awesome it's not expected of us this season. Just improvement over last season. We are the only team with this many new faces to a roster. Other teams have chemistry, they know each others tendencies, they have a style of play that works. We're still struggling to find all those attributes. We're not the only team in this conference struggling (Spurs and Mavericks) The kings have the 8th seed right now. I can't imagine them holding onto that for very long.

"If I don't see any progress, I want him fired at the very least, as early as next year. Yes, on January 1st 2009. " - Jay.r

I do agree with that. That's a reasonable time frame and gives everyone time to prove themselves including the coach. 8 games is too soon to be doing anything.

teamfiend

11/13/2008 - 01:07 AM PST

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couldnt agree more....... seems to me that alot of people here have very quick and harsh reactions from game to game. whether its fire the coach or trade kaman, mobley or tt after a bad game or two. i mean everyone was pretty much euphoric after the dallas win, and i dont recall anyones head being called for following that game.

i guess all im trying to say is, try and give it 20-30 games before we start to demand trades and firings

sz123456

11/13/2008 - 01:11 AM PST

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I don't blame Dunleavy at all. We lost at the defensive end of this game. Sometimes your shots don't fall, nothing you can do about that. But defense is PURELY effort, there is no excuse for bad defense. They didn't play hard until it was too late, I hate this team right now, TRADE!! TRADE!! TRADE!!

clipps04

11/13/2008 - 01:14 AM PST

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Thank you, glad someone feels the same way. I know we're all allowed our opinions but to be calling for our coach to be fired or players to be traded this soon is ludicrous. Losing is hard and being the worst team in the league is even harder but give the team and organization some time to rebound. If not then obviously someone is holding us back.

OneNationUnderClip

11/13/2008 - 01:16 AM PST

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This isnt a 20-30 game kinda thing. This is a few years in the making. He's been a terrible coach every year he's been here. Even the year we made it to the second round. Dunleavy got out-coached in that series and thats why we lost. If you want me to site specific examples, I have plenty. Its time for a new style of coaching. Dunleavy was an adequate fit for the "Elton" era, but this is the "Baron" era. Its time for fast paced, high flying fun. Not, slow-down, half court isolation, stand around and take jumpshots. GET DUNLEAVY OUT OF THERE

sz123456

11/13/2008 - 01:20 AM PST

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Posts: 2733

votes: 17

I'm glad you guys can stay optimistic, but I can't. I've watched this team for almost two decades, we always try to look at the bright side, never be too hasty, and NEVER make the trades, and ya know, we always lose. We need more athletic players to compliment Baron, we need better scorers more than anything. Some trades have to be done.

elton_sucks42

11/13/2008 - 01:20 AM PST

Clipper All-Star

Posts: 2493

votes: 11

clipps04 wrote:

teamfiend wrote:

couldnt agree more....... seems to me that alot of people here have very quick and harsh reactions from game to game. whether its fire the coach or trade kaman, mobley or tt after a bad game or two. i mean everyone was pretty much euphoric after the dallas win, and i dont recall anyones head being called for following that game.

i guess all im trying to say is, try and give it 20-30 games before we start to demand trades and firings

Thank you, glad someone feels the same way. I know we're all allowed our opinions but to be calling for our coach to be fired or players to be traded this soon is ludicrous. Losing is hard and being the worst team in the league is even harder but give the team and organization some time to rebound. If not then obviously someone is holding us back.

Who do you think that person that is holding us back is? Everyone is frustrated with the losing. Everyone here knows that this team is new. It can take 20-30 games to get adjusted. You're right. However, 30 games of getting used to eachother means no playoffs again.

Miquel

11/13/2008 - 01:22 AM PST

Clipper All-Star

Posts: 1853

Location: Barcelona

votes: 16

This loss is unacceptable as the 8 games we have already played. The other day versus the Mavs we won without playing good basketball. We don't run plays offensively and there are too much one on ones. Our basketball is simply horrible and previsible. It's time for changes: this loss is too much for me. Sincerely I'm ashamed