Craft Haters

IMO this is an under-discussed thread topic. There's all this attention on craft beer snobbery yet so few people bring up the anti-craft hatred that is actually more common, and often more vitriolic. My most recent example was at a damn baby shower with some retired airline pilot who asked why I drink these "designer beers" and our discussion thereafter got a little unpleasant for the occasion. Even worse are those who resort to the homosexual slander labels and stuff, which is actually a bit surprising to me because I never understood how BMC is somehow equated with heterosexuality (and not that there's anything wrong with the other stuff, btw).

I was a BMC drinker years ago before I was hassled enough to try good beer. My first one tasted alright to me, but I didn't know where to start or what to buy, so I just stuck with BMC. That same friend kept hassling me and getting me to try new things. As a result, I like good craft beer so much that I am on this site.

I think beer evangelism does sound a little silly, but I'm thankful for my friend doing it because even though I resisted the change at first, I now have a new hobby that I love and it that it has brought greater taste and enjoyment to my life.

I have a couple friends that I hang out with and we drink what we like to drink and just make a night out of having a few good beers. A lot of times half the fun is going to the store with them and figuring out what we want to try or what old favorites we want to go with. But I also have friends who drink for a completely different reason (parties, etc.), and usually stick with BMC. I give them shit and they give me shit, but its all in good fun. Unless one of us happens to be drunk.....then it can get a bit heated lol but my point is that just because somepone drinks generic beer doesnt mean they have inferior taste or that they dont know whats best for them. Craft beer is an aquired taste, and sometimes a tricky road that not everyone wants to go down. Not to mention it's pretty damn expensive. If they want to try my beer then they're more than welcome. If they like it and want to try more then I'll be happy to give some recommendations. But if they dont then thats fine with me, becasue it's not for everyone.

I'll compare it to steak:
All you can eat steak at golden corral is good.
Steak at Outback is even better.
But if I treat someone to a steak at Morton's and they don't appreciate it as a better dinner than golden corral...I won't even try...lots 'o people love golden corral.
But if they do, I'll be happy to tell them about why it's better.

Beer Trader

IMO this is an under-discussed thread topic. There's all this attention on craft beer snobbery yet so few people bring up the anti-craft hatred that is actually more common, and often more vitriolic. My most recent example was at a damn baby shower with some retired airline pilot who asked why I drink these "designer beers" and our discussion thereafter got a little unpleasant for the occasion. Even worse are those who resort to the homosexual slander labels and stuff, which is actually a bit surprising to me because I never understood how BMC is somehow equated with heterosexuality (and not that there's anything wrong with the other stuff, btw).

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I'll agree with you. While I've never run into this personally, I have friends who have. I grew up in a pretty liberal town; though I could see how in a smaller working-class town, branching away from "dad's BMC" could make yourself stand out in an unfavorable way.

I routinely go hunting, and in the small towns it is quite humorous as literally the only beer offerings are BMC 12/18/24/30, etc... packs, no craft to be found. It may just be the dynamic of the area, and absolutely the larger the town, the more accepting of craft beer.

Beer Trader

where does the assumption that "conversion" means a forceful attempt to "break" someone into being a craft beer lover come from? i know most of us wouldn't have gotten into this stuff if someone hadn't showed us at some point, and wanting to give that experience to our friends is good beer karma, not a rude and closed-minded gesture.

and to the OP: "craft hate" is a real thing. i get plenty of people who walk into my bar and shit-talk us because they see a wall of taps and no corporate american light lagers. 100% of these people do so before even looking at a menu, let alone trying anything, and i'd estimate 95-98% of these people end up finding something that they really enjoy, whether it be a pilsner or a lambic. the "let people drink what they like" argument is really doing a lot of people a disservice, because if someone let me drink "what i liked," i'd be missing out on all the fun.

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This.

OK, just to preface, at my old job selling beer, spirits and T-shirts for Dogfish, I had a customer walk up wearing a black T-shirt with the words "BEER SNOB" in big white letters and I asked him, "Seriously dude, why wear that shirt?" and he proceeded to go on a bit of a rant about how "That's what I am and people should know before getting into a conversation with me about beer and we need to take the power back and show people what's up" and blah blah blah (obviously I'm paraphrasing). I just had to be like "OK whatever" cuz it was my job to sell him shit. I try very hard to not push the notion of trying "different" or "obscure" beers on people who either a. Aren't ready, or b. Are completely uninterested.

That being said, at my current job serving for a Yard House, we're trained to encourage people to try different beers because we have so many and they're all on tap. And, since it's a big corporate chain, I get plenty of BMC/generic import drinkers. Honestly, I get it if you're counting calories and trying to stay in shape or whatever and you just wanna have a beer. Who am I to judge? Then there are those who just wanna drink their Stellas, Heinekens and Carlsbergs and will likely never find anything in the rest of the spectrum they like. So be it. But for the rest of the folks who like flavorful or hearty beers and are interested in trying new things, I try to turn them on to as many different styles and alternatives as possible. They say "Blue Moon" and I say "Lost Coast Great White." They say "Guinness" and I say "Left Hand Milk Stout." I never try to "break" anyone into having something they don't seem to be receptive to, because let's face it: they might just not like beer. It happens. Some people only enjoy liquor and/or wine. It's all good. It's just all about respecting peoples' tastes and knowing where to draw the line. It goes both ways where people who hate on craft beer need to grow up and quit dissing people for having broader tastes, while us beer geeks need to take a step back and try not to push what we think is best for other people onto them.

IMO this is an under-discussed thread topic. There's all this attention on craft beer snobbery yet so few people bring up the anti-craft hatred that is actually more common, and often more vitriolic. My most recent example was at a damn baby shower with some retired airline pilot who asked why I drink these "designer beers" and our discussion thereafter got a little unpleasant for the occasion. Even worse are those who resort to the homosexual slander labels and stuff, which is actually a bit surprising to me because I never understood how BMC is somehow equated with heterosexuality (and not that there's anything wrong with the other stuff, btw).

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aha, so that's what started it.

on a more serious note, the anti-craft sentiment you guys mention truly baffles me. it's rooted in ignorance, i guess, but why malign someone's choice of beverage? seems so absurdly silly. do people who eat london broil interrogate those who enjoy a filet mignon?

I'm tired of insecure craft beer drinkers. Do whatever it is you want to do, but a number of these "convert" stories seem to originate from some insecurity the OP has about what they like and the fear of ridicule or rejection by peers. Not saying you, this OP, are guilty but some of them are.

Beer Trader

I have no compunction to explain my preferences to anyone or worry in the least about what anybody thinks. I revel in, celebrate, and enjoy everything I like and look to forge friendships and spend time with people that share the same interests. I have plenty of bmc friends that are more than happy to chug my craft beer and imports when given the oppurtunity.

Don't get me wrong, I don't force it on anybody, but when people show interest in it, I let them try it. And the strawberry comparison doesn't hold any weight, because these people are self proclaimed beer lovers, if you don't like strawberries, you don't like strawberries, but if you like strawberries already and somebody gives you the highest quality organically grown strawberry from people who care about growing strawberries, how could you not like it?

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When I think about this question I think about someone loving IPAs, stouts, porters, etc. who are then handed something considered the highest of quality like an expensive Belgian sour or a barrel aged barley wine and not liking it because it's not the kind of beer they like; maybe it's too complex, or too different from what they are accustomed to. They may love the best of the best for IPAs, stouts, and porters but not like the Belgians. To use the strawberry analogy, one may love fruit, but not necessarily like apricots, and be handed the finest of apricots by an apricot aficionado and have the aficionado wonder why the person does not like the apricot. The answer is simple, the fruit lover does not love apricots.

That said, if and IPA lover is handed a Pliny the Elder and rejects it like you have described, then that would baffle me to the highest degree of baffling.

It's funny, but I've never had somebody try to shit on craft beer to me. Could be where i live,(NYC) but I've never really run into it, and If i did, I'm a craft drinker, which makes me an inherently informed drinker, which means I'd have all sorts of ammo to pull out as to why Macro's are shit compared to micros.

But really, like others have stated, It's all a matter of taste, and a bmc dochebag is allowed to like bmc.

I try to get my friends to try new things that I like frequently, but I usually try to gauge their interest in beer in general or a beer style before recommending things. Some people are simply lost causes when it comes to beer, and others are super receptive to the point that they become craft beer lovers.

Really, if everyone liked craft would it be as special to those of us who really love it?

I love that scene in the Beer Wars documentary where they make people blind-test all the most popular brand name beers, and even the guy in the Coors Light outfit can't identify his own beer next to all the other watered down cups of crap. It's almost like some people buy into the whole idea or pop-culture of a beer more than the taste of the beer itself.

Subscriber

IMO this is an under-discussed thread topic. There's all this attention on craft beer snobbery yet so few people bring up the anti-craft hatred that is actually more common, and often more vitriolic. My most recent example was at a damn baby shower with some retired airline pilot who asked why I drink these "designer beers" and our discussion thereafter got a little unpleasant for the occasion. Even worse are those who resort to the homosexual slander labels and stuff, which is actually a bit surprising to me because I never understood how BMC is somehow equated with heterosexuality (and not that there's anything wrong with the other stuff, btw).

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Had someone like that question me. I gave them a sip of my Expedition Stout. Couldn't stand it but sure as hell didn't think I was a wuss lol.

I don't run into as much true "anti-craft" as I used to. Most of my family is happy with Bud Light and Busch Light but is getting why I like what I do - and these are as good of people as I could imagine knowing. Got a friend who didn't like much beer but tried a Lambic at Flying Saucer and dabbles with craft a little.

I talk about what I like but I don't need to get a complex about it. We all like what we like, it's the tolerance on both ends that should come out.

on a more serious note, the anti-BMC sentiment you guys mention truly baffles me. it's rooted in ignorance, i guess, but why malign someone's choice of beverage? seems so absurdly silly. do people who eat filet mignon interrogate those who enjoy london broil?

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FTFY. Now maybe everyone else will get it...

Stop worrying about what other people drink. Leave them alone, and maybe they'll leave you alone. Quit trying to "save" people.

IMO this is an under-discussed thread topic. There's all this attention on craft beer snobbery yet so few people bring up the anti-craft hatred that is actually more common, and often more vitriolic. My most recent example was at a damn baby shower with some retired airline pilot who asked why I drink these "designer beers" and our discussion thereafter got a little unpleasant for the occasion. Even worse are those who resort to the homosexual slander labels and stuff, which is actually a bit surprising to me because I never understood how BMC is somehow equated with heterosexuality (and not that there's anything wrong with the other stuff, btw).

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I've noticed this. I think that some refusal to try/like craft beer is somewhat "cultural" (can't think of a better term). I've met folks who seem that they'd never admit to liking a craft beer (even if they really did). Maybe this is just my perception, though.

Beer Trader

Most people like to settle into what I call a fat, dumb, and happy zone. Once they think they have arrived then they never want anything to change. This is like people who have only lived in one city their entire lives yet will argue it's the greatest place in the world to live. They do it with their jobs, their education, their beer, etc.

What is the harm in trying to get your friends to try craft? I mean if you see a new movie that you like, or eat at a new restaurant you enjoyed don't you recommend things like that to them? Why is beer so different?

IMO this is an under-discussed thread topic. There's all this attention on craft beer snobbery yet so few people bring up the anti-craft hatred that is actually more common, and often more vitriolic. My most recent example was at a damn baby shower with some retired airline pilot who asked why I drink these "designer beers" and our discussion thereafter got a little unpleasant for the occasion. Even worse are those who resort to the homosexual slander labels and stuff, which is actually a bit surprising to me because I never understood how BMC is somehow equated with heterosexuality (and not that there's anything wrong with the other stuff, btw).

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Good call on bringing up the straight vs gay thing with craft beer; I've heard that myself. Leaving aside how ignorant it is to use "gay" as an insult, by our society's (fucked up) standards, thing that are most intense/extreme/aggressive are usually associated with masculinity and heterosexuality. Thus, by our society's standards, shouldn't my barrel-aged imperial stout be considered hetero and their low-alcohol lightly-flavored shit beer be considered gay? Either way, it's a stupid insult.

SubscriberBeer Trader

IMO this is an under-discussed thread topic. There's all this attention on craft beer snobbery yet so few people bring up the anti-craft hatred that is actually more common, and often more vitriolic. My most recent example was at a damn baby shower with some retired airline pilot who asked why I drink these "designer beers" and our discussion thereafter got a little unpleasant for the occasion. Even worse are those who resort to the homosexual slander labels and stuff, which is actually a bit surprising to me because I never understood how BMC is somehow equated with heterosexuality (and not that there's anything wrong with the other stuff, btw).

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Maybe it's a NJ thing, but i never seem to run into this problem. My BMC drinking friends just don't think craft is worth the extra $$$$. They are for some reason willing to buy SA Octoberfest when is's on tap.

Quit trying to get people to like what you like. If you hated strawberries, wouldn't it be annoying if people were constantly shoving strawberries in various formats in front of you and declaring that you really will like them if you just give them a chance?

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While a valid analogy, I like to think you were more trying to get people to reference fruit in a discussion. Bravo.

I work as a university professor and will often invite the students in my senior-level classes out on the weekend for beers. My basic rule is that I'll cover the bill for any craft beers they want to drink (and I've converted more than a few by buying flights of beers to sample and let them find what they like), but if they want to drink BMC they can pay themselves.

Don't get me wrong, I don't force it on anybody, but when people show interest in it, I let them try it. And the strawberry comparison doesn't hold any weight, because these people are self proclaimed beer lovers, if you don't like strawberries, you don't like strawberries, but if you like strawberries already and somebody gives you the highest quality organically grown strawberry from people who care about growing strawberries, how could you not like it?

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Both beer snobs and adjunct lager fans alike think if you like one beer, you really like all beers and you're just faking dislike for some reason. Let's try a different analogy:
Cake is cake, right? Cakes are all made from sugar, flour, eggs and milk. Those are the main ingredients. Other flavors are a minor percentage of the cake. So if you like chocolate cake, you should enjoy banana cream cake if you just try.

That's the undercurrent when the subject of "beer snobs" appears. Some BAs on these forums think you should drink an adjunct lager if it's offered, because it's rude not to. The underlying assumption is that it's all beer and those of us who dislike the taste of adjunct lagers are just faking it to be snobbish. Same with beer geeks regarding people who like mainstream AALs: a Belgian is the same as a Bud, it's all just beer and if the mainstream drinkers would just drink enough craft beers, they'd like them.

Good call on bringing up the straight vs gay thing with craft beer; I've heard that myself. Leaving aside how ignorant it is to use "gay" as an insult, by our society's (fucked up) standards, thing that are most intense/extreme/aggressive are usually associated with masculinity and heterosexuality. Thus, by our society's standards, shouldn't my barrel-aged imperial stout be considered hetero and their low-alcohol lightly-flavored shit beer be considered gay?

SubscriberBeer Trader

Most of my family and friends like at least some craft beer, even if they don't drink it all the time. I do have one friend of over 20 years who mercilessly mocks the beers I drink. He and I get along on just about every topic under the sun but this one. He likes Stella and Heineken and constantly claims how my beer tastes like shit and his European beer is vastly superior. Very strange vibe, since he is basically alone in his rants. Meanwhile, I have no problem drinking Stella, Heineken, or even a nice, ice cold Bud can at a summer BBQ.

On a related note, I also find it funny that so many BMC drinkers will ONLY drink one beer even within the BMC family ie. will only drink Coors Light, not Bud Lite, etc. Meanwhile, I have given said friend Bud Lite on tap without telling him and he thought it was Coors Light.

I have a bunch of family members and friends whom I've been trying to convert for a few years now. It seems to me that people either love craft beer, or hate craft beer, why is this? I hated beer before I discovered craft, and It made me realize why I hated beer, it was simply because all the beers I was exposed to were the standard brands and I was just merely putting up with the lack of flavor until somebody handed me a at a Phish show.. The rest is history.. It just makes me laugh when I hand a craft beer to a fellow so called "beer lover" and they hate on it. I always have to hear the typical "ohh he's got that fancy beer" or "I don't know how you can drink that shit" comments from the peanut gallery, I guess to each his own, but how can a heavy beer drinker not want to consume a far superior product than the over-hyped, under-flavored, mass produced elixir that they try to pass off as beer? Anybody else out there dealing with "Craft Hate" We Beer snobs gotta stick together!!

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I think we should say "I love beer" not "I love craft". Why? Because it is silly. What is also silly is trying to convert someone for years. Just let them be. Some people dive in to other areas of their life where you might just surface. These same people might find you to be shallow because you don't have a good appreciation for French literature, or Tai Kwon Do. No everyone has beer as a priority in their lives.

I don't try to convert anyone. I drink what I like and if someone inquires about it, I am always more than happy to discuss and share. My wife dislikes all beer, but she always wants to take a little taste of what I'm drinking and I'm cool with that. I don't go out of my way to get her into it, I just know it won't happen.

I have a bunch of family members and friends whom I've been trying to convert for a few years now. It seems to me that people either love craft beer, or hate craft beer, why is this? I hated beer before I discovered craft, and It made me realize why I hated beer, it was simply because all the beers I was exposed to were the standard brands and I was just merely putting up with the lack of flavor until somebody handed me a at a Phish show.. The rest is history.. It just makes me laugh when I hand a craft beer to a fellow so called "beer lover" and they hate on it. I always have to hear the typical "ohh he's got that fancy beer" or "I don't know how you can drink that shit" comments from the peanut gallery, I guess to each his own, but how can a heavy beer drinker not want to consume a far superior product than the over-hyped, under-flavored, mass produced elixir that they try to pass off as beer? Anybody else out there dealing with "Craft Hate" We Beer snobs gotta stick together!!

Maybe it's a NJ thing, but i never seem to run into this problem. My BMC drinking friends just don't think craft is worth the extra $$$$. They are for some reason willing to buy SA Octoberfest when is's on tap.

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Not a NJ thing. I've NEVER run into a single instance of someone "hating" on craft beer. I honestly think this whole sentiment is either invented or people bringing it on themselves.

"Here, try this beer, it's much better than that crap you're drinking!"

Beer Trader

If your friends hate craft beer, get more foreign friends. I came from a BMC crowd in college and the others haven't followed suit or "cared enough" as they put it to stop drinking watered down shit. But whenever I meet my English relatives or European tourists, they refuse to drink BMC and refer to craft (specialty, nano, micro, and whatever else we categorize it as) as simply beer. But, just like every other subject in America, some people are just closed minded and stubborn as shit. Until we change the culture of beer in this country, the drunk masses will flock to keith stone and bmc

There are thousands of craft beers out there and hundreds of styles. Maybe ask your friends about their tastes..ie do you like citrus fruits..coffee...pumpkin pie...chocolate..etc and then reccommend a beer that might suit their tastes instead of just giving them what you find to be good. If that don't work..let em drink swill and be happy.

IMO this is an under-discussed thread topic. There's all this attention on craft beer snobbery yet so few people bring up the anti-craft hatred that is actually more common, and often more vitriolic. My most recent example was at a damn baby shower with some retired airline pilot who asked why I drink these "designer beers" and our discussion thereafter got a little unpleasant for the occasion. Even worse are those who resort to the homosexual slander labels and stuff, which is actually a bit surprising to me because I never understood how BMC is somehow equated with heterosexuality (and not that there's anything wrong with the other stuff, btw).

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I had a customer about a month ago just get completely viscous on me when I made the bold statement of "hey there are lots of great beers made in this country too!"

He just goes, "you people are fools. You have all been duped into thinking that you're drinking great beer, but its not. No one in this country knows how to make beer, but you all pretend that its the best thing ever. THIS HERE is real beer", as he pointed to the beer he was about to purchase.

Since he was a customer, I just had to smile and politely state that I couldn't agree with him at all. And have a great day. What did he buy? Sam Smiths Organic Lager