The Apostles Creed
I believe in God, the Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth.
I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.
He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit and born of the Virgin Mary.
He suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried. On the third day he rose again.
He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father. He will come again to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy catholic Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body, and the life everlasting. Amen.
http://freemasonrywatch.org/siteindex.html

For many people round the world the Bilderberg group and their annual conferences are a masonic institution. Why might this be and is there any truth to the allegation?

The first time I realised there might well be a strong connection between these secretive conferences and freemasonry was when a friend of mine in New Zealand sent me the contents of a Lexis-Nexis trawl using the term Bilderberg. In amongst those hundreds of articles was a suprising document. The CV or 'Who's Who' entry for Andrew Palmer, personal private secretary to Prince Michael the Duke of Kent contained a fleeting reference to his having organised the 1998 Turnberry Bilderberg meeting.

Since that discovery the evidence has been rolling in with serious accusations that British Prime minister Tony Blair is a high-level Rosicrucian mason belonging to Lodge no. 1591 based at no. 10 Duke Street St. James in London. And it looks like Blair's lodge has some distinguished members:

Quote:

HRH The Duke of Kent, Grand Master, United Frand Lodge of England, will attend the Supreme Council 33 degree Lunch, at 10 Duke Street, St. James's London SW1Y 6BS.
http://media.netpr.pl/notatka_65348.html

(a) If Freemasonry is not a "religion", why are so many Freemasonry "lodges" called "Temples"?

(b) Why does every Lodge/Temple contain an altar?

(c) Whom are Freemasons referring to in the title "Great Architect of the Universe"?

Whether or not we, as individuals, choose to believe that Lucifer/Satan actually exists is immaterial if Freemasons and other Satanists do. The power of evil lies as much in its ability to control others by uniting them in fear or mutual guilt, as in the actual source of that evil.

>(a) If Freemasonry is not a "religion", why are so many Freemasonry "lodges" called "Temples"?

We know Freemasonry is not a religion because it is attended by Christians, Buddhists, Jews, Muslims etc. It permits each to follow their own conception of God.

The use of the term temple is likely to be fairly recent - post 1717 (perhaps someone has a reference for that) and for the last decades (in Australia at least) the buildings are referred to as Masonic Centres to avoid offending those who are concerned with naming of buildings

>(b) Why does every Lodge/Temple contain an altar?

An interesting question. My own suspicion is that it was introduced by Anglicans as I am not sure that it exists in the earliest depictions of ritual some of which were around a large table. (Anyone able to offer any help on that)

>(c) Whom are Freemasons referring to in the title "Great Architect of the Universe"?

Since Freemasonry has a plan of salvation it is absurd to deny that Freemasonry is a religion.

Many Masons deny that Freemasonry is a religion because if they were to admit it, they would not be accepted as Christians and church members.

Other Masons are so blinded by Satan that they cannot see the truth.

Freemasonry teaches men to imitate Hiram Abiff, so that they may get into heaven. The Gospel of Jesus Christ requires faith in the person and claims of Jesus Christ as the means of being redeemed from the death of sin and getting into heaven.

The Christian Mason is faced with a real dilemma. Can a man have two saviors? Can he have a vital faith in Jesus Christ, as he imitates Hiram Abiff? Can he avoid being found guilty of taking part in the promotion of a false plan of salvation?

Consider Matthew 7:22-23 and Galatians 1:8-9

What will Jesus say?

Who elses opinion is really going to matter?_________________Christ over Christianity.

Since Freemasonry has a plan of salvation it is absurd to deny that Freemasonry is a religion.

Excuse me????

Can you show me where in Freemasonry there is any thing to do with salvation, let alone a plan for it...

willow the wip wrote:

Many Masons deny that Freemasonry is a religion because if they were to admit it, they would not be accepted as Christians and church members.

I deny it, and have no fear of being accepted as a Chrisitan, by the church or it's members. That organisation has been proven to be more corrupt, more dishonest that any other, trust me a bloke in a skull cap told me while I was walking my dog and a rabbit jumped out with different coloured eyes which is how you tell it came from the churchhh...

Sorry, couldn't resist. In all honesty though there are so many religious undertones due to the nature of the legend, the characters etc etc but no actual religious practise goes on, there are no sacrements, no salvation, no resurrection etc etc It is all a load of symbolic stuff that basically says, be honest, be good, be true and you will live a better life. That is hardly a lie is it.

willow the wip wrote:

Other Masons are so blinded by Satan that they cannot see the truth.

Well unless you are a christian satan is much of a concern, personally characters used to incite fear for easier control has no real barring in real life. Thats me though, but even though I have no belief in the little red fella, there still is no mention of him in Freemasonry.

willow the wip wrote:

Freemasonry teaches men to imitate Hiram Abiff, so that they may get into heaven.

Saints are held up as examples, are they not
Clergy are held up as examples, are they not

Examples of how each person should be, should behave, should believe etc

Imitation is no sin... as children we learn what is good and bad, right and wrong through imitation and repitition.

Hiram is no god-like figure, no prophet he is just a man who was good.

willow the wip wrote:

The Christian Mason is faced with a real dilemma. Can a man have two saviors? Can he have a vital faith in Jesus Christ, as he imitates Hiram Abiff? Can he avoid being found guilty of taking part in the promotion of a false plan of salvation?

Hiram Abiff is no saviour, he dies, stays dead, has no powers, he is never anything more than just a bloke.

For many people round the world the Bilderberg group and their annual conferences are a masonic institution. Why might this be and is there any truth to the allegation?

The first time I realised there might well be a strong connection between these secretive conferences and freemasonry was when a friend of mine in New Zealand sent me the contents of a Lexis-Nexis trawl using the term Bilderberg. In amongst those hundreds of articles was a suprising document. The CV or 'Who's Who' entry for Andrew Palmer, personal private secretary to Prince Michael the Duke of Kent contained a fleeting reference to having organised the 1998 Turnberry Bilderberg meeting.

In an attempt to understand this connection idea!

I'm not quite following how the activities of one of the Duke of Kent's Secretaries provides a Masonic link? Now if you were saying that the DoK was there himself that would be slightly more substantial.

Even then I would have to ask whether you also believe that: the African Venture Capital Association, the Priory Church of Saint Bartholomew the Great, Royal British Legion, the Children's Traffic Club, the Institute of Linguists, Addenbrooke's Hospital are all Masonic as well. these are organisations that the DoK has listed in his diary.

TonyGosling wrote:

Since that discovery the evidence has been rolling in with serious accusations that British Prime minister Tony Blair is a high-level mason belonging to Lodge no. 1591 based at no. 10 Duke Street St. James in London. And it looks like Blair's lodge has some distinguished members:

Evidence? Tony Blair is not a member of Studholme Alliance Lodge No. 1581, I've just checked. The only Prime Minister to have been a member of that Lodge was Sir Winston Churchill who was Initiated in 1901. however he resigned from Freemasonry long before he became Prime Minister.

TonyGosling wrote:

HRH The Duke of Kent, Grand Master, United Frand Lodge of England, will attend the Supreme Council 33 degree Lunch, at 10 Duke Street, St. James's London SW1Y 6BS

Err Studholme Lodge is not a part of the Supreme Council, it is a proper Masonic Lodge, a bit like mine which meets at Mark Masons Hall but is not a Mark Lodge.

Since Freemasonry has a plan of salvation it is absurd to deny that Freemasonry is a religion.

I'm sure on another topic you said you have Duncan's masonic ritual, can you tell me where in that you have found this "plan of salvation"?

willow the wip wrote:

Many Masons deny that Freemasonry is a religion because if they were to admit it, they would not be accepted as Christians and church members.

Freemasons don't need to deny that Freemasonry is not a religion, the evidence is the fact that its members are members of many different religions, it is a Fraternity that does not accept Atheists. What makes some people think it is a religion is the fact that its Ritual is based on the Old Testament, that's it.

willow the wip wrote:

Freemasonry teaches men to imitate Hiram Abiff, so that they may get into heaven.

This is true!! Hiram Abiff is a "legendary" character who was murdered because he refused to give in to dishonourable people who wanted the secrets of a superior degree to their own. He died in order to keep his honour intact and to defend what he believed in. What is wrong with that concept?

willow the wip wrote:

The Christian Mason is faced with a real dilemma. Can a man have two saviors? Can he have a vital faith in Jesus Christ, as he imitates Hiram Abiff? Can he avoid being found guilty of taking part in the promotion of a false plan of salvation?

Despite what you may have read claiming that somehow Hiram was ressurected, he was not! According to our Ritual, he was dug up and re-buried with honours for keeping his word. His only salvation lay with God.

These Cherubs have cloven hoof. I thought cloven hoof was pertaining to the devil or am i mistaken? In your coat of arms you have Cherubs and cloven hoof but you are not a religion? Can you explain to me why these very significantly religious images are not religious in any way? Why not just have two Jackasses for example instead of such obviously religious imagery? Strange way for a non religious cult to portray itself.

Why do you have church like seating in a lodge (pews)? And why do you sing religious songs during a meeting? Someone told me "We plough the fields and scatter", is strongly masonic, but why would a Hymn be important to masons if they are not a religion? You do sing religious themed songs in lodge meetings, or am i mistaken?

Forgive me, instead of flock, perhaps i should have used " Satans little helpers"