One moment, as mentioned before, that I really hated was seeing the Statue of Liberty in Gotham City.

juggaloryda

08-03-2004, 06:47 PM

Ha, I'm an ********* for saying that every gf I've had is better than that talentless waste of space Kirsten Dunst, it's not about her looks, it's the fact that she's a stupid ditz who can't act that happens to be ugly

Herr Logan

08-03-2004, 06:54 PM

Originally posted by The Grey Ghost
One moment, as mentioned before, that I really hated was seeing the Statue of Liberty in Gotham City.

Oh, but you don't understand-- it was Lady Gotham, not the Statue of Liberty. She had the word "Gotham" across her crown, so it's different. It's perfectly plausible for there to be two similar statues located in two different metropolitan cities on the east coast. :o

;)

Dr.Dude

08-03-2004, 09:38 PM

As far as the Wolverine vs. Sabretooth fight, I'd have to agree on it being disappointing. :o It's hard to explain why exactly... but it just wasn't nearly as engrossing as it should have been. They took away Sabretooth's long-standing rivalry with Wolverine, which made them effectively, in the movie, distant strangers fighting against eachother... not the true archenemies that utterly hate eachother's guts that they should be, leading to the most personal and vicious battles possible. And also missing how similar both characters are supposed to be. ;)

I was kind of letdown by Sabretooth as a whole. He was effectively just a mostly silent, giant henchman with that roared every once in a while. :o

Herr Logan

08-03-2004, 10:16 PM

Originally posted by Dr.Dude
As far as the Wolverine vs. Sabretooth fight, I'd have to agree on it being disappointing. :o It's hard to explain why exactly... but it just wasn't nearly as engrossing as it should have been. They took away Sabretooth's long-standing rivalry with Wolverine, which made them effectively, in the movie, distant strangers fighting against eachother... not the true archenemies that utterly hate eachother's guts that they should be, leading to the most personal and vicious battles possible. And also missing how similar both characters are supposed to be. ;)

I was kind of letdown by Sabretooth as a whole. He was effectively just a mostly silent, giant henchman with that roared every once in a while. :o

Exactly.

Zev

08-03-2004, 10:20 PM

Just when you thought it was safe to go back into the thread...

Strand blathers about how the cash is two hundred and fifty million dollars (I should mention that neither Mary-Jane or Spider-Man’s name is spelt with a hyphen in it in this script) and it’s ‘much more dramatic than a bank statement, wouldn’t you say?’

You know how I get this? It's a half a
cent here, a half a cent there...
electronic transactions taking place a
million times a second... all over the
world. And nobody misses it. That's the
beauty.

That’s right. Cameron is actually ripping off Superman 3. That’s like CINO ripping off Daredevil. If you’re going to rip something off, at least make sure it was a good something.

Although I’d love to see the Office Space Boys take on this. Spider-Man says that he found ‘the line you don’t cross’ by ‘tripping over it’. He’s saying this because he once took some money. Umm, did that happen in this scriptment? I swear, it’s like Cameron cut and pasted together three different drafts and never bothered to make them consistent, resulting in a very schizophrenic work. Spider-Man even tells Strand to give the money back. And throughout all of this, it never fails to fail to hold a candle to Gene Hackman/Christopher Reeves in the Superman movies.

STRAND
This is a disappointment.

SPIDER MAN
Listen, you want to talk about fate?
Maybe there is a reason for all this.
Maybe I was put here to stop guys like
you when nobody else has the balls.

BOYD
Pretty tough talk for a guy in a
danceskin.

Strand grabs Mary-Jane, which makes Peter look really stupid for not telling her to get out while he and the big bad supervillains (neither of whom have supervillain names, of course. Sandman is called alternately Boyd and Sandman in the script and the name Electro is never mentioned once. Is it possible that Cameron thought he was actually making an original character?) were talking.

Sandman sneaks up behind Peter and grabs him, holding him still as Strand kisses Mary-Jane and “she starts doing the watusi.” I may be a dork, but I’m not enough of a dork to ‘get’ that joke, which also completely ruins the drama of the scriptment. Apparently realizing how he’s almost reached the end of the script and not gotten any really bad puns out, Cameron throws some groaners into Strand’s mouth.

“See how power turns women on?” he queries. “I think there’s real electricity between us.” Hohoho! Strand, you are a joker!

Strand gets the taste slapped out of his mouth by MJ and gives her the Kiss of Death. Which gives us this line that’s sure to have kids cheering in the aisles.

Lets just digest that for a little while. No, don't vomit. Okay, use the bucket.

Strand takes this as proof that Peter is a killer with the same Bizarro Logic that Coolcat uses to dictate CINO is a good movie, Brodiebruce to deduce he’s outwitted the Haturz Justice League, and the Merovingian uses to prove that humans are out-of-control… when you drug them.

Strand brings Mary-Jane back to life with a defibrillating pulse (I think the science of this is a little wonky, I’m pretty sure you could not keep killing people and bringing them back to life as Strand did with Cordelia and now Mary-Jane). Peter pulls MJ out of Strand’s arms with webbing, then breaks free of the Sandman’s grasp, exploding him all over the room. Strand fires at him and he dodges, then grabs MJ and jumps out the window. FINALLY!

Spider-Man carries Mary-Jane to the other tower, then rips the stairwell door off the hinges so she can escape. Umm, Spidey, it was open.

MARY JANE
I love you.

SPIDER MAN
Cool.

Not exactly “I know” or even “I love you too.”

Strand comes out onto the outdoor deck of the south tower, firing lightning bolts across to the other roof. Using his electromagnetic power, Strand bends the electromagnetic tower towards himself and uses it to bridge the gap between the twin towers in a scene that would surely play different today. And now we have Spider-Man, Sandman, and Strand fighting. What a bunch of S-holes.

Strand rips open the power panel next to the huge roof fans and begins feeding off the ‘440 volt main cables’, blacking-out the whole lower half of Manhattan. Meanwhile, Spider-Man is fighting Sandman. His suit is ripped half off.

Sandman throws Spider-Man off the roof, but the webhead catches a web and pulls himself back up. Then he “sees Strand readying a mega-blast” (Spider-Sense? What’s that?) Spider-Man dodges the bolts, then lassos Sandman in between shots and drops over the edge, pulling the web taut (umm, can’t Sandman turn INTO SAND? That web should do through him like a cheese grater through cheese). This jerks Sandman right into the path of the lighting beam and he’s fused into molten glass, which means Spider-Man just knowingly killed a guy. Why not just use the already established roof fans to blow him all over the city?

Spider-Man reappears with a firehouse as Strand runs across the bridge. He gets hit with a stream of water and there’s a tremendous steam explosion. Spider-Man runs up to Strand and begins to pummel him, without even bothering to, say, make web-gloves to insulate his fists or even using his webbing.

Strand gets ready for one final blast. When he fires, Peter leaps over it, tags Strand with webbing in mid-air, and pulls him over the side (which is exactly the same thing he uses to kill Sandman, remember?) Strand unleashes bolts of power as he falls in one of those scenes written to be ruined in a trailer by some dumbass executive who can’t grasp that Harry picking up a vial of Goblin Juice shouldn’t be seen until the end of the movie.

From a distance it looks like some kind of fantastic
Jacob's Ladder as the arcs light up the gap between the
two towers.
Strand's death fall is one of the most beautiful displays
ever seen, like a symmetrical release of the energy which
created him out of art and the elements.
Falling... Peter, fighting for consciousness, fires webs
at the wall...
And one finally sticks...
But it breaks. They're going too fast...
He fires one at the far tower, fifty feet away...
It grabs...
And he swings toward the tower...
Slamming against it as the line pulls taut...
HOLDING. Jerking him to a stop, from a hundred miles an
hour to zero in one second...
And Strand rockets past him, still falling...
Peter holds the web with all his might...
Stopping Strand so suddenly that he slams into the steel
columns along the side of the building with a sickening
smack.

Which means this is the second bad guy Spider-Man has killed, in addition to that kid who fell off the fire escape. Maybe the Punisher should be taking notes. Spider-Man pulls up Strand, then takes off his mask for no good reason (and you thought Spider-Man 2 was bad!)

STRAND
What's your name kid?

PETER
Parker. Peter Parker.

STRAND
Peter Parker. So... what're you? Senior
in high school?

PETER
Yeah. I graduate next week.

Strand chuckles weakly, coughing blood from ruptured lungs.

STRAND
Unbelievable.

He dies.

Boy, Spider-Man's sure lucky that Strand died naturally. Because if he didn't, well, he'd have one pissed-off supervillain that knew where he lived, what he looked like, and who he was.

And of course, Peter throws the money onto the city. It rains hundred dollar bills. He explains to everyone at high-school that he fell off his moped, explaining the bruises. Mary-Jane doesn’t hang with any of her yuppie prick valley girl friends anymore, of course. Just for once, I’d like to see someone grow and decide they don’t want to stay with their pretentious Gen-X slacker friends anymore. And that they hate Michael Moore. I do have standards after all. That would be the perfect woman (http://www.queenofwands.net/d/20040618.html)…

Mary-Jane has gotten an A+ on her science project, although she doesn’t care about the car and has decided to go to med-school. Peter kisses her and tells her he’s Spider-Man.

It is what everybody secretly hopes for... that someday
someone will see past the face that everyone sees to their
secret self -- what is inside and hidden. Peter grins,
and she returns it.
They go back into the kiss, just as...

All together now... aaaaaaawwwwwwwwww. Makes you feel all warm and fuzzy all over, doesn't it? Give Raimi this much, he had enough balls to not end his first movie with a completely happy ending.

Flash grabs Peter and gets ready to put down. Peter tells Mary-Jane…

PETER
When two male wolf spiders, Pardosa,
encounter one another in the presence of
a female, they assume ritual threat
postures.

Because he’s a SPIDER-Man. Which is why he’s into web-bondage and everything. Which is the exact same reasoning which gave us Halle Berry’s CINO. In a scene that’s a bit reminiscent of the end of Superman 2, with the God-like Superman railroading a bully (pretty damn petty, no? Here it’s a little better, since Flash is the one who’s picked the fight), Flash throws a punch, which Peter dodges, causing him to massage a brick wall with his knuckles.

Peter finally quips some (which reminds me, I don’t think Spider-Man’s said one quip throughout this entire script, except in narration. Just a bunch of Captain America-style speeches. Maybe it’s true, the Raimi films HAVE desensitized me to lack of quiposity. After some sleight-of-hand with tiny webbing, Flash gets his ass handed to him on eight legs.

All the kids standing around the schoolyard laugh
uproariously. Peter grins and holds up his hands.

PETER
I never laid a glove on him. I swear.

Everybody cheers. Because the truth is: we really do like
heroes. Especially when they're underdogs.

Wow. Did we really need a whole movie to figure that out? Is that the theme? Jesus, I could have watched Dodgeball! Then at least I would’ve gotten a cameo by ****ing Chuck Norris! Where’s the goddamn responsibility?

We find out that Mary-Jane and Peter got accepted to different colleges thanks to Spider-Man’s omnipotent narration. He quips a little more and swings off. And thus we’re done with James Cameron’s Spider-Man. It sure as hell wasn’t Sam Raimi’s, much less Stan Lee’s or Steve Dikto’s!

Herr Logan

08-03-2004, 10:44 PM

Now, let us never... ever... speak of this terrible thing again.

Dr.Dude

08-03-2004, 11:06 PM

It's truly amazing the amount of ego Cameron shows in that scriptment. It really manages to go against almost every theme in the Spider-Man mythology, just so that Cameron can put his personal stamp on it having no cares for anyone else. And when he does this he often just rips off related things, such as the "Carlton Strand"(Electro, the Kingpin and Norman Osborn all rolled into one horrifying mix :o ) and "borrowing" themes from the X-men. :p ;) And other times his maniacally gleeful changes just makes no sense at all. :ghost:

It would've been the most bizarre and completely depressing in ever way superhero movie ever filmed. And I don't even want to think about what he might have done for a sequel! :eek: ;)

Zev

08-03-2004, 11:22 PM

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Now, let us never... ever... speak of this terrible thing again.

I'm afraid that's impossible. What do you get when you take James Cameron's scriptment, add the worst-written Doc Ock ever put to paper, then have it revised by three writers with no credits on IMDB and one who had a hand in Catwoman?

For the love of God, man... this script never ever made it to the screen! Can't you let the dead stay buried?? Must you invoke the worst humanity has to offer, long after it's been laid to rest??

Zev

08-04-2004, 01:36 AM

Originally posted by Herr Logan
No... NO... NOOOO!!!!

For the love of God, man... this script never ever made it to the screen! Can't you let the dead stay buried?? Must you invoke the worst humanity has to offer, long after it's been laid to rest??

I'm sorry Herr, but... it is my destiny.

dario2739

08-04-2004, 01:54 AM

While the whole experience of Batman and Robin was painful, the worst scene was Batman whipping out his 'Bat-Credit Card'!!!

Zev

08-04-2004, 02:39 PM

Before I set out on the REALLY bad Cameron script, there's just a few things I would like to get off my chest.

Can we impose a statute of limitations on ideas? Because I think it's time we let go of the idea that the South shall rise again. No, it's not. I live in Texas, we were our own COUNTRY for a while, complete with badass acronym (Republic of Texas = ROT. How cool is that?). We became part of America because we damn well felt like it. It's time to put away the Confederate flag and admit that slavery was a mistake.

Same goes for you, black people. No 'reparations'. You find me someone who got whipped into picking cotton, then we'll pay. Before that, stop trying to make an easy buck off things that not even your grandparents had to put up with and get a damn job.

Also, Nazism - It didn't work. America is so great that when Japan pissed us off, we didn't only kick THEIR ass, we kicked their FRIENDS' asses. I'm all for the right to free speech, but can we have a clause on that saying that if someone uses their right to free speech to join the KKK or Neo-Nazis, everyone else has the right to pound their asses?

Socialism - Get over it, colleges. It didn't work. The only people still using it today are the Chinese and North Koreans and it's only a matter of time before the other shoes drops on their repressing asses. So, college professors, angry pot-smoking Volkswagon-drivers, if you like Communism so much, stop living off of mom and dad's trust fund (while mocking them for being 'like, cogs in the system, man') and MOVE THERE.

Michael Jackson – How can America be racist if we liked you better when you were black?

John Kerry - We know you're not a war hero. You hated being in Vietnam. You threw your medal away. You joined an organization founded by that traitor Jane Fonda (yes, giving aid and comfort to the enemy is treachery, it's in the Constitution). There's nothing I can't stand more then false advertising. Like when Hulk promised to be a big summer action movie with the words 'Hulk' and 'Smash' in the same sentence. Also, the Pope condemned you to Hell or Purgatory or wherever it is you go for supporting abortion. They don't even do that to priests that molest children. Think about it.

My Fair Lady - You know why you suck? Your ending. The chick gets back together with the misogynic ******* at the end? SHE CAN DO BETTER! I would take back everything I said about you if, at the end, when he said "Fetch my slippers," she had shot back "Why don't you get off your lazy butt and 'fetch' them yourself, Higgins?"

Reality Bites - You suck for the same reason that My Fair Lady sucked. Am I the only one who thinks Ethan Hawke's character was, to quote the British, a complete wanker? Honestly, I agree with Michael Ian Black. I can't be the scruffy poet without a care in the world. I want a career. I want to have money to, you know, provide for Winona Ryder and, God willing, any eventual children. But no, you go with that guy just because he's handsome. When you have three children yapping at you, a husband with a beer belly the size of Utah, and have unsatisfying sex maybe once a month, don't call me, I'll be doing some supermodel who's much more mature then you.

Christopher Reeves - Stem cells found in adults work just as well as those in aborted babies. Just FYI.

Hollywood - Stop making romantic comedies. Stop pretending that just because you're famous and pretty, your political opinions mean anything. Stop bothering Mel Gibson when he did what you people can only dream about, make an independent film with subtitles and produce it to great box office success. Really, did you think you could keep him doing **** like 'What Women Want' forever?

Michael Moore - Stop.

Women - We men are not psychic, we admit this. So when something is bothering you or needs to be done, talk to us out loud. Don't just think at us very hard. We can't decipher your brainwaves.

France - Get. Over. Yourselves. The berets? Not that great. And ten out of ten people would rather watch The A-Team then one of your insufferably-pretentious 'films' about people smoking cigarettes and drinking coffee.

Al Gore - Good for you, ya got the stick out of your ass. But why'd you replace it with a red-hot fireplace poker?

Germany - You're very scary.

Halle Berry - You're not an action heroine. Go back to showing your tits to get people to see your 'dramas'.

Lawyers - Stop with the frivolous lawsuits before we follow Willie Shakespeare's advice.

America - George W. Bush didn't 'steal' the election. The fact that his brother was governor didn't have a damn thing to do with the outcome. Why? Because they don't give the governor of Florida a big button that says 'Replace every vote with a vote for your relative, use only in case of recall.' Nor did the Supreme Court steal the election, they just ordered an end to the recount so that we could have, you know, a president. Independent investigations by major newspapers like the New York Times have confirmed that Gore lost. So stop accepting the 'common knowledge' and actually look between the lines.

WB - What kind of *******s are you that you can't even find a good director for Superman yourselves, you have to steal Marvel's leftovers? We got the guy from Barbershop to do Fantastic Four, that's called creativity. It doesn't involve rubber nipples, so look it up, 'kay?

Taxes - Okay, I know we have to pay you, but why do we have to punish the rich to support a bunch of lazy parasites who do nothing but get high all day? Time to stop the gravy train.

George W. Bush - I know you work out, so stop beating around the bush (so to speak) and challenge Michael Moore to a good old-fashioned Texas Steel Cage Deathmatch. I know he's got the weight advantage (hell, he's got it on everyone up to and including Jabba The Hutt), but you've got the eye of the tiger. Plus, I'm pretty sure Hulk Hogan would agree to be your manager.

Government - If you vote against school vouchers, it's only fair that your children be forced to go to public schools. C'mon, what are you afraid of?

Bill O'Reilly - Stop yelling so much.

Ben Affleck - See note to Michael Moore.

James Cameron - You're not king of the world.

Mojo Jojo - Stop repeating yourself. It's really very redundant. I know you phrase your words differently each time you say them, but the meaning remains the same.

Brian Michael Bendis - You do too much. You're not Superman, you know.

The Rocketeer - I don't care what anyone says, your movie rocked.

Johnny Deep - I like you, but slap yourself once. Hard. Once you do that, all is forgiven.

Cyclops - Just be patient, bro. Your time will come. Now that Storm is out of the way, the dominos are beginning to fall in your favor.

Austin Powers - New rule. If you've parodied something, it's officially unacceptable for another movie to repeat those conventions with a straight face.

Doc Ock - The tentacles are manipulating you, don't listen to them.

Herr Logan - Stop setting your standards so high. Because at this point, Jesus himself could direct a superhero movie and you'd complain about it being too good.

Dimension - So, you're the *******s who made Equilibrium, then never put it in theaters? You'd better shoot yourselves in the head right now, because if I ever find you, I'll do so much worse. Try me and see.

Nancy Reagan - No one's ever offered, but if they do, I'll just say no.

Guyverjay - Put up Peter David's run on X-Factor already. Geez, you have the entire Taskmaster limited series up...

Newspaper - So, you're suing Michael Moore for doctoring you? He put up as a front page headline what was really the headline of a letter? Good for you! Don't take no **** from the Man, even if the Man doesn't realize he's the Man.

Colin Powell - Be vice president.

TV - You bastards canceled Angel AND Firefly? You know what I was planning for Dimension? Well, I'm saving the REALLY nasty stuff for you! I've got the railroad spikes if you've got the erognous zones...

Tommy Lee Jones - It wasn't him, it was the one-armed man. And you damn well better care!

Démon

08-04-2004, 04:21 PM

:up: That is truly most excellent.

Herr Logan

08-04-2004, 05:34 PM

Originally posted by Zev
Before I set out on the REALLY bad Cameron script, there's just a few things I would like to get off my chest.

Can we impose a statute of limitations on ideas? Because I think it's time we let go of the idea that the South shall rise again. No, it's not. I live in Texas, we were our own COUNTRY for a while, complete with badass acronym (Republic of Texas = ROT. How cool is that?). We became part of America because we damn well felt like it. It's time to put away the Confederate flag and admit that slavery was a mistake.

Same goes for you, black people. No 'reparations'. You find me someone who got whipped into picking cotton, then we'll pay. Before that, stop trying to make an easy buck off things that not even your grandparents had to put up with and get a damn job.

Also, Nazism - It didn't work. America is so great that when Japan pissed us off, we didn't only kick THEIR ass, we kicked their FRIENDS' asses. I'm all for the right to free speech, but can we have a clause on that saying that if someone uses their right to free speech to join the KKK or Neo-Nazis, everyone else has the right to pound their asses?

Socialism - Get over it, colleges. It didn't work. The only people still using it today are the Chinese and North Koreans and it's only a matter of time before the other shoes drops on their repressing asses. So, college professors, angry pot-smoking Volkswagon-drivers, if you like Communism so much, stop living off of mom and dad's trust fund (while mocking them for being 'like, cogs in the system, man') and MOVE THERE.

Michael Jackson – How can America be racist if we liked you better when you were black?

John Kerry - We know you're not a war hero. You hated being in Vietnam. You threw your medal away. You joined an organization founded by that traitor Jane Fonda (yes, giving aid and comfort to the enemy is treachery, it's in the Constitution). There's nothing I can't stand more then false advertising. Like when Hulk promised to be a big summer action movie with the words 'Hulk' and 'Smash' in the same sentence. Also, the Pope condemned you to Hell or Purgatory or wherever it is you go for supporting abortion. They don't even do that to priests that molest children. Think about it.

My Fair Lady - You know why you suck? Your ending. The chick gets back together with the misogynic ******* at the end? SHE CAN DO BETTER! I would take back everything I said about you if, at the end, when he said "Fetch my slippers," she had shot back "Why don't you get off your lazy butt and 'fetch' them yourself, Higgins?"

Reality Bites - You suck for the same reason that My Fair Lady sucked. Am I the only one who thinks Ethan Hawke's character was, to quote the British, a complete wanker? Honestly, I agree with Michael Ian Black. I can't be the scruffy poet without a care in the world. I want a career. I want to have money to, you know, provide for Winona Ryder and, God willing, any eventual children. But no, you go with that guy just because he's handsome. When you have three children yapping at you, a husband with a beer belly the size of Utah, and have unsatisfying sex maybe once a month, don't call me, I'll be doing some supermodel who's much more mature then you.

Christopher Reeves - Stem cells found in adults work just as well as those in aborted babies. Just FYI.

Hollywood - Stop making romantic comedies. Stop pretending that just because you're famous and pretty, your political opinions mean anything. Stop bothering Mel Gibson when he did what you people can only dream about, make an independent film with subtitles and produce it to great box office success. Really, did you think you could keep him doing **** like 'What Women Want' forever?

Michael Moore - Stop.

Women - We men are not psychic, we admit this. So when something is bothering you or needs to be done, talk to us out loud. Don't just think at us very hard. We can't decipher your brainwaves.

France - Get. Over. Yourselves. The berets? Not that great. And ten out of ten people would rather watch The A-Team then one of your insufferably-pretentious 'films' about people smoking cigarettes and drinking coffee.

Al Gore - Good for you, ya got the stick out of your ass. But why'd you replace it with a red-hot fireplace poker?

Germany - You're very scary.

Halle Berry - You're not an action heroine. Go back to showing your tits to get people to see your 'dramas'.

Lawyers - Stop with the frivolous lawsuits before we follow Willie Shakespeare's advice.

America - George W. Bush didn't 'steal' the election. The fact that his brother was governor didn't have a damn thing to do with the outcome. Why? Because they don't give the governor of Florida a big button that says 'Replace every vote with a vote for your relative, use only in case of recall.' Nor did the Supreme Court steal the election, they just ordered an end to the recount so that we could have, you know, a president. Independent investigations by major newspapers like the New York Times have confirmed that Gore lost. So stop accepting the 'common knowledge' and actually look between the lines.

WB - What kind of *******s are you that you can't even find a good director for Superman yourselves, you have to steal Marvel's leftovers? We got the guy from Barbershop to do Fantastic Four, that's called creativity. It doesn't involve rubber nipples, so look it up, 'kay?

Taxes - Okay, I know we have to pay you, but why do we have to punish the rich to support a bunch of lazy parasites who do nothing but get high all day? Time to stop the gravy train.

George W. Bush - I know you work out, so stop beating around the bush (so to speak) and challenge Michael Moore to a good old-fashioned Texas Steel Cage Deathmatch. I know he's got the weight advantage (hell, he's got it on everyone up to and including Jabba The Hutt), but you've got the eye of the tiger. Plus, I'm pretty sure Hulk Hogan would agree to be your manager.

Government - If you vote against school vouchers, it's only fair that your children be forced to go to public schools. C'mon, what are you afraid of?

Bill O'Reilly - Stop yelling so much.

Ben Affleck - See note to Michael Moore.

James Cameron - You're not king of the world.

Mojo Jojo - Stop repeating yourself. It's really very redundant. I know you phrase your words differently each time you say them, but the meaning remains the same.

Brian Michael Bendis - You do too much. You're not Superman, you know.

The Rocketeer - I don't care what anyone says, your movie rocked.

Johnny Deep - I like you, but slap yourself once. Hard. Once you do that, all is forgiven.

Cyclops - Just be patient, bro. Your time will come. Now that Storm is out of the way, the dominos are beginning to fall in your favor.

Austin Powers - New rule. If you've parodied something, it's officially unacceptable for another movie to repeat those conventions with a straight face.

Doc Ock - The tentacles are manipulating you, don't listen to them.

Herr Logan - Stop setting your standards so high. Because at this point, Jesus himself could direct a superhero movie and you'd complain about it being too good.

Dimension - So, you're the *******s who made Equilibrium, then never put it in theaters? You'd better shoot yourselves in the head right now, because if I ever find you, I'll do so much worse. Try me and see.

Nancy Reagan - No one's ever offered, but if they do, I'll just say no.

Guyverjay - Put up Peter David's run on X-Factor already. Geez, you have the entire Taskmaster limited series up...

Newspaper - So, you're suing Michael Moore for doctoring you? He put up as a front page headline what was really the headline of a letter? Good for you! Don't take no **** from the Man, even if the Man doesn't realize he's the Man.

Colin Powell - Be vice president.

TV - You bastards canceled Angel AND Firefly? You know what I was planning for Dimension? Well, I'm saving the REALLY nasty stuff for you! I've got the railroad spikes if you've got the erognous zones...

Tommy Lee Jones - It wasn't him, it was the one-armed man. And you damn well better care!

I think I'm going to take a vacation from this thread. Quentin Black would do well to take advantage of it.

Farradin

08-04-2004, 05:43 PM

1994 Fantastic four unreleased movie.
Mister fantastic reaches out four something.
Special effects was just a broom with a hand on the end.
The funniest thing I ever saw, I almost wet my pants it was so funny.

Also Ben Grimm looked like a big turd.

Zev

08-04-2004, 08:32 PM

S P I D E R - M A N

Written by
Barry Cohen and Ted Newson
and
James Cameron

2nd Revision by
Joseph Goldmari and James Cameron
and
John Brancato

John Brancato collaborated on The Net and Catwoman.

--------
Third Revision by James Cameron
based on screenplays by Ted Newsom & John Brancato,
Barney Cohen and Joseph Goldman

Several DIALS go into the RED. A hand pushes aside a
YELLOW THERMOS and pushes forward a RED POWER THROTTLE.

The color-blind are not going to appreciate this.

We hear the WHINING UP of a cyclotron. A DIGITAL DIAL
climbs to "5% POWER." A SPIDER crawls across a DIAL.

Begin OPENING CREDITS.

THE CYCLOTRON ROOM is in an old basement full of peeling
paint and plumbing wrapped with TAPE. Leaks are here and
there. COBWEBS are all around.

But Igor is nowhere to be seen.

DOCTOR OTTO OCTAVIUS (OCK) is a strong but strange
featured man in his mid-fifties.

His assistant, WEINER, hovers nearby looking on. He's
open mouthed with a mindless kind of curiosity.

His minion is named Weiner. That's a record for how quick a screenplay has begun to suck.

WEINER is
a local, small-time hood hired by OCK to circumvent the
school administration and to "procure" whatever OCK needs
for his experiments.

So what's he doing here?

He shades his eyes against a searing
BLUE-WHITE BEAM that erupts from the WINDOW. THE ROOM IS
DIVIDED INTO A CONTROL ROOM AND THE EXPERIMENT CHAMBERS.

WEINER
Whoa, whoa, whoa... what's that?

With a WHOOSH, the WINDOW EXPLODES, showering the TWO with
shards of GLASS, and throwing them to the floor.

OCK
(rising)
We begin again... let's kick in that new
transducer. See if we can double the
power output.

WEINER
(rising more slowly)
Whoa, Doc... wait a minute...

I'm not a homophobe or anything, but I don't want to hear about two men 'rising' together.

But OCK is already at the THROTTLE. The cyclotron whirls
up. The lights go on. Louder, brighter than before. OCK
looks through the broken WINDOW into the EXPERIMENTAL
CHAMBER. The POWER DIAL inches upward, "eight, nine..."
the BLUE-WHITE LIGHT is blinding now. The WHINE pitch is
shattering.

Hannibal Lecter said "Okey-dokey." I thought it was the coolest thing ever. It's all in the delivery, and historical context between the audience and the character at the time of execution.

*goes back on vacation*

cryptic name

08-04-2004, 08:50 PM

Originally posted by Zev
Before I set out on the REALLY bad Cameron script, there's just a few things I would like to get off my chest.

Can we impose a statute of limitations on ideas? Because I think it's time we let go of the idea that the South shall rise again. No, it's not. I live in Texas, we were our own COUNTRY for a while, complete with badass acronym (Republic of Texas = ROT. How cool is that?). We became part of America because we damn well felt like it. It's time to put away the Confederate flag and admit that slavery was a mistake.

Same goes for you, black people. No 'reparations'. You find me someone who got whipped into picking cotton, then we'll pay. Before that, stop trying to make an easy buck off things that not even your grandparents had to put up with and get a damn job.

Also, Nazism - It didn't work. America is so great that when Japan pissed us off, we didn't only kick THEIR ass, we kicked their FRIENDS' asses. I'm all for the right to free speech, but can we have a clause on that saying that if someone uses their right to free speech to join the KKK or Neo-Nazis, everyone else has the right to pound their asses?

Socialism - Get over it, colleges. It didn't work. The only people still using it today are the Chinese and North Koreans and it's only a matter of time before the other shoes drops on their repressing asses. So, college professors, angry pot-smoking Volkswagon-drivers, if you like Communism so much, stop living off of mom and dad's trust fund (while mocking them for being 'like, cogs in the system, man') and MOVE THERE.

Michael Jackson – How can America be racist if we liked you better when you were black?

John Kerry - We know you're not a war hero. You hated being in Vietnam. You threw your medal away. You joined an organization founded by that traitor Jane Fonda (yes, giving aid and comfort to the enemy is treachery, it's in the Constitution). There's nothing I can't stand more then false advertising. Like when Hulk promised to be a big summer action movie with the words 'Hulk' and 'Smash' in the same sentence. Also, the Pope condemned you to Hell or Purgatory or wherever it is you go for supporting abortion. They don't even do that to priests that molest children. Think about it.

My Fair Lady - You know why you suck? Your ending. The chick gets back together with the misogynic ******* at the end? SHE CAN DO BETTER! I would take back everything I said about you if, at the end, when he said "Fetch my slippers," she had shot back "Why don't you get off your lazy butt and 'fetch' them yourself, Higgins?"

Reality Bites - You suck for the same reason that My Fair Lady sucked. Am I the only one who thinks Ethan Hawke's character was, to quote the British, a complete wanker? Honestly, I agree with Michael Ian Black. I can't be the scruffy poet without a care in the world. I want a career. I want to have money to, you know, provide for Winona Ryder and, God willing, any eventual children. But no, you go with that guy just because he's handsome. When you have three children yapping at you, a husband with a beer belly the size of Utah, and have unsatisfying sex maybe once a month, don't call me, I'll be doing some supermodel who's much more mature then you.

Christopher Reeves - Stem cells found in adults work just as well as those in aborted babies. Just FYI.

Hollywood - Stop making romantic comedies. Stop pretending that just because you're famous and pretty, your political opinions mean anything. Stop bothering Mel Gibson when he did what you people can only dream about, make an independent film with subtitles and produce it to great box office success. Really, did you think you could keep him doing **** like 'What Women Want' forever?

Michael Moore - Stop.

Women - We men are not psychic, we admit this. So when something is bothering you or needs to be done, talk to us out loud. Don't just think at us very hard. We can't decipher your brainwaves.

France - Get. Over. Yourselves. The berets? Not that great. And ten out of ten people would rather watch The A-Team then one of your insufferably-pretentious 'films' about people smoking cigarettes and drinking coffee.

Al Gore - Good for you, ya got the stick out of your ass. But why'd you replace it with a red-hot fireplace poker?

Germany - You're very scary.

Halle Berry - You're not an action heroine. Go back to showing your tits to get people to see your 'dramas'.

Lawyers - Stop with the frivolous lawsuits before we follow Willie Shakespeare's advice.

America - George W. Bush didn't 'steal' the election. The fact that his brother was governor didn't have a damn thing to do with the outcome. Why? Because they don't give the governor of Florida a big button that says 'Replace every vote with a vote for your relative, use only in case of recall.' Nor did the Supreme Court steal the election, they just ordered an end to the recount so that we could have, you know, a president. Independent investigations by major newspapers like the New York Times have confirmed that Gore lost. So stop accepting the 'common knowledge' and actually look between the lines.

WB - What kind of *******s are you that you can't even find a good director for Superman yourselves, you have to steal Marvel's leftovers? We got the guy from Barbershop to do Fantastic Four, that's called creativity. It doesn't involve rubber nipples, so look it up, 'kay?

Taxes - Okay, I know we have to pay you, but why do we have to punish the rich to support a bunch of lazy parasites who do nothing but get high all day? Time to stop the gravy train.

George W. Bush - I know you work out, so stop beating around the bush (so to speak) and challenge Michael Moore to a good old-fashioned Texas Steel Cage Deathmatch. I know he's got the weight advantage (hell, he's got it on everyone up to and including Jabba The Hutt), but you've got the eye of the tiger. Plus, I'm pretty sure Hulk Hogan would agree to be your manager.

Government - If you vote against school vouchers, it's only fair that your children be forced to go to public schools. C'mon, what are you afraid of?

Bill O'Reilly - Stop yelling so much.

Ben Affleck - See note to Michael Moore.

James Cameron - You're not king of the world.

Mojo Jojo - Stop repeating yourself. It's really very redundant. I know you phrase your words differently each time you say them, but the meaning remains the same.

Brian Michael Bendis - You do too much. You're not Superman, you know.

The Rocketeer - I don't care what anyone says, your movie rocked.

Johnny Deep - I like you, but slap yourself once. Hard. Once you do that, all is forgiven.

Cyclops - Just be patient, bro. Your time will come. Now that Storm is out of the way, the dominos are beginning to fall in your favor.

Austin Powers - New rule. If you've parodied something, it's officially unacceptable for another movie to repeat those conventions with a straight face.

Doc Ock - The tentacles are manipulating you, don't listen to them.

Herr Logan - Stop setting your standards so high. Because at this point, Jesus himself could direct a superhero movie and you'd complain about it being too good.

Dimension - So, you're the *******s who made Equilibrium, then never put it in theaters? You'd better shoot yourselves in the head right now, because if I ever find you, I'll do so much worse. Try me and see.

Nancy Reagan - No one's ever offered, but if they do, I'll just say no.

Guyverjay - Put up Peter David's run on X-Factor already. Geez, you have the entire Taskmaster limited series up...

Newspaper - So, you're suing Michael Moore for doctoring you? He put up as a front page headline what was really the headline of a letter? Good for you! Don't take no **** from the Man, even if the Man doesn't realize he's the Man.

Colin Powell - Be vice president.

TV - You bastards canceled Angel AND Firefly? You know what I was planning for Dimension? Well, I'm saving the REALLY nasty stuff for you! I've got the railroad spikes if you've got the erognous zones...

Tommy Lee Jones - It wasn't him, it was the one-armed man. And you damn well better care!

:up: :up:

Dr.Dude

08-04-2004, 09:10 PM

And if you thought the Cameron script was bad... ;)

Zev

08-05-2004, 02:58 PM

I know what you're thinking. "Who are you to criticize James Cameron and MSJ? I'd like to see you write better!" Well, ignoring the fact that an eleven-year-old with Tourette's could write better (in fact, so could Chuck Austen!), I'm going to put my money where my mouth is and show you that I can build up in addition to tearing down. Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you a virtual trailer.

EXT. CENTRAL PARK - EVENING

PETER PARKER and MARY-JANE WATSON are walking down a trail.

PETER: I think my life is too complicated.

MARY-JANE: What? All you do is eat, take pictures, and fight crime.

PETER: I wish. Betty wants me to pretend to be her boyfriend for her mom because her real boyfriend is on a six-month assignment in Europe.

PETER: Aunt May keeps trying to set me up on a blind date with one of her friend's daughters.

INT. AUNT MAY'S APARTMENT - EVENING

AUNT MAY and LYDIA, an active woman in her early sixties, are having tea.

AUNT MAY: I think Peter would be a good influence on your daughter. He's so... nice and sensitive.

EXT. CITY STREETS - DAY

Spider-Man SKYDIVES, constructing a COBWEB to catch a damaged helicopter as he falls.

EXT. CENTRAL PARK - EVENING

PETER: And lets not forget that Doctor Octopus is back and he blames me and Harry for his wife's death.

INT. DAILY BUGLE - NEWSROOM - DAY

Ock, holding a defeated Spider-Man with three tentacles, presents him before J. JONAH JAMESON and moves the fourth tentacle to take off his mask...

EXT. CENTRAL PARK - EVENING

PETER: Honestly, I don't see how my day could get any...

His Spider-Sense goes off! He pushes Mary-Jane out of the way as a JACK O'LANTERN flies towards him, the stem burning and shooting sparks like afuse. When the spark on the stem reaches the base, it EXPLODES! Peter is knocked back, the explosion ripping his street clothes and exposing his Spider-Man costume beneath.

A terrifying figure on a JET GLIDER appears out of the night sky.

PETER: No...

INT. DAILY BUGLE - J. JONAH JAMESON'S OFFICE - DAY

J. JONAH JAMESON rants, a lit cigar in his hand.

JAMESON: This isn't the Green Goblin, this is something new, something different...

EXT. HIGH ABOVE NEW YORK - DAY

Spider-Man has constructed a giant web between two buildings. The glider-riding figure approaches him, clad in green and purple.

INT. OSBORN MANOR - DAY

HARRY OSBORN and Peter talk, the letter opener Harry almost used to kill Spider-Man between them on a desk.

In slow-motion, the figure approaches. We get our first good look at him, the green flight suit of the original Green Goblin stitched together with a few purple armor pieces and a purple tunic, a more technological look due to some exposed wires. He wears a dark purple cloak and hood. His insanely-grinning helmet SPLITS open at the mouth to reveal a face, 'in the mouth of madness', in green make-up to make him look like a true Goblin and concealing his real identity!

HARRY: (V.O.) He calls himself the Hobgoblin.

INT. WAREHOUSE - DAY

In front of a bank of klieg lights, a silhouetted figure spreads out four tentacles...

INT. LAB - DAY

DOCTOR CONNORS, bleeding from the mouth, reaches for a bubbling serum.

EXT. RADIO MAST - DAY

Spider-Man dodges out of the way as THE VULTURE swings at him with his razor-tipped wings, scratching a gout through a support beam.

INT. DAILY BUGLE - DAY

Peter and BETTY BRANT talking.

PETER: Are you sure Leeds is in Europe?

INT. GRAND CENTRAL STATION - DAY

Spider-Man and the Hobgoblin move towards each other, each using their unique methods of movement. Before they meet, we make another cut, the montage going faster and faster.

Ock stretching out his tentacles in an X shape, then positioning his own limbs to mimic Leonardo Da Vinci's famous sketch of the human body.

Spider-Man is dragged behind the Hobgoblin on a webline attached to the glider.

As STUDENTS go to class, the sound of the cyclotron spills
out of the SCIENCE CENTER onto the grounds of Empire State
University.

We see PETER PARKER, a pleasant faced senior who's among
the top in his class. Sincere and serious, he has yet to
develop a way with women.

This is a nice way of saying he's a nerd. No mention of him wearing glasses or aynthing.

LIZ
(falling in step)
Hiya Peter...

LIZ ALLEN is also a senior. She's beautiful and
intelligent.

Now I know this is a science fiction film! Just kidding, you lovely and smart ladies of the Hype! But why in the **** is LIZ ALLEN our heroine? Why not Mary-Jane Watson? Or Gwen Stacy? Hell, if you're going to be so 'faithful' to the comics, why not Betty Brant? Liz was NEVER a big-time love interest in the stories I've read.

PETER
(ardent but
uncomfortable)
Hiya Liz... how're you doing...?

LIZ
(teasing softly)
How'm I doing what?

How're you doing that voodoo that you do so well?

HARRY
Peter! Peter! Wait up!

HARRY is the school nerd. A quirky kid who, like PETER,
can be a little backward around girls, especially pretty
ones like Liz.

Oh, shut up! PETER is the school nerd! Harry started out as a fellow 'tormentor' like Flash, but turned into Peter's friend. He's not a nerd, he's the rich kid. This script's attempts to placate its core audience by filling up the main characters with people who are uncomfortable with women is frightfully obvious.

Thank you, exposition. And why are you calling him 'Ock'? That's the SCRIPT'S name for him, not yours.

INT. CYCLOTRON AREA HALLWAY - DAY

It is a basement hallway full of LOCKERS which STUDENTS
are banging open and shut as they put stuff in and take
stuff out. In their midst, a MAN is banging on the door
marked "Cyclotron Room - Authorized Personnel Only!"
Professor ROSOMORF, SIXTISH, respectable, a good old
fashioned professor, he's the head of the Physics Dept.
With him is ALEXANDER THORKEL, a 40-ish, Waspish school
administrator. For a scientist as crazily focused as OCK,
THORKEL is a natural enemy.

Rosomorf and Thorkel? Sound like Dr. Seuss characters!

ROZ
(knocking furiously)
Doctor Octavius! You are late for your
lecture. The students are waiting.
Doctor Octavius!

See, people, this is why we need school vouchers.

THORKEL
Your friend is impossible Professor
Rosomorf, I told the board we should let
him go.

Uh-oh. I don't think Thorkel is going to come out of this movie without wings and a harp!

The LIGHT above THORKEL's head EXPLODES. Then all the
LIGHTS behind him EXPLODE in succession. THORKEL and ROZ
look amazed...

Hey, when did that chick from Frasier get here?

THORKEL
What's he doing in there, not his crazy
experiment again.

I'm not sure, but I think a question mark should be in there somewhere.

ROZ
You mean his anti-force theory... one day
they'll give him the Nobel Prize for it.

"Which one?"

"Who cares, they all pay the same!"

THORKEL
Meanwhile he is demolishing our
university. Octavius!!
(knocks)
Open the door.

Meanwhile Octavius is lying on his bed with Britney Spears playing on his stereo, turned all the way up, making a collage out of backissues of Seventeen...

INT. OCK'S LAB

OCK
The anti-force experiment has now reached
the limit of electronic overload safety.
Therefore, Weiner, you will disconnect
the overload safety device...

This is what John Edwards told John Kerry before the Democratic National Convention.

FOUR WALDOS (three-fingered, snake-like mechanical arms)

Okay, I can understand if Octavius calls his tentacles that (since waldos are, let me look this up, ah! "A mechanical
agent, such as a gripper arm, controlled by a human limb.
When these were developed for the nuclear industry in the
mid-1940s they were named after the invention described by
Heinlein in the story, which he wrote in 1942. Now known by
the more generic term "telefactoring", this technology is of
intense interest to NASA for tasks like space station
maintenance." Hey, Robert Heinlein! Maybe this story will get some sex in it! Sorry, bad sci-fi joke. Still, US calling them that will surely lead to a veritable plethora of 'Where's Waldo?' jokes, not to mention it sounds a little weird.

suddenly thrust themselves into the CHAMBER and begin
working, each at a different task. OCK is an acknowledged
master at manipulating these WALDOS.

No set-up at all. Compare this to the good five minutes spent establishing the tentacles in Spider-Man 2, complete with the 'horror movie' moment of them extending needles into Ock's spine. Brrrr! That was a genuine geekgasm right there, ladies and germs! (geekgasm is TM Zev, 2004)

He flicks a switch and a searing BLUE-WHITE BEAM lances
down from a FOCUSING CONE and strikes a GRAM WEIGHT
marked, "1,000,000"), illuminating it and filling our
ears with a splitting BUZZ TONE.

1,000,000 WHAT? While we Americans use the English measurement system, most in the scientific community use the metric system. So which is it?

The knock on the door grows louder.
WEINER comes up behind OCK.

That sounds really dirty, doesn't it?

WEINER
Whoa, Doc... someone's at the door...

"They want to know if we can spare a moment to talk about the Lord!"

OCK
(ignoring)
World class scientific mind and they
stick me in the basement with this third
rate cyclotron...

You think you had it bad? They got MY cyclotron at a dollar store, along with a He-Man action figure and a bag of stale dog biscuits!

You know, if you want to make something weigh less, you can just go on Weight-Watchers!

OCK
Okey! Dokey!

Once again, this makes his idiotic catchphrase appear to be two distinct words, when it is really one COMPOUND word.

The WEIGHT begins to jiggle and, for an instant, it
appears to lift ever so slightly.

Anyone else having a vision of an Ed Woodian 'prop on a string' here?

INT. COLLEGE PHYSICS LAB - DAY

This is an enormous room, 100 lab tables. The yellowing
smoke of a thousand experiments hangs in the air. A HUGE
AMERICAN FLAG dominates the back wall.

Believe it or not! This movie was NOT written before 9/11!

PETER, HARRY and LIZ set up their TABLES. FLASH reads the
DAILY BUGLE sports section. PETER can't take his eyes off
LIZ. When she looks back he looks down at his GEAR.

Oh man, I can't believe they gave me an opening like that. Hang on, folks, this is gonna be fun...

LIZ
(softly)
What is it, Peter?

It's a big building with a lot of patients in it, but that's not important right now!

Sorry, that was out-of-joke constrains. I should say something phallic-related, but I won't stoop that low for any joke!

PETER
(embarrassed)
It's nothing.

Hey, hey, hey! Don't be ashamed of your weiner! It can circumvent the school administration and "procure" supplies for your experiments! And it can answer the door for you!

INT. OCK'S LAB

WEINER opens the door and sees ROZ and THORKEL waiting
impatient.

See what I mean?

WEINER
Yes, gentleman can I help you?

THORKEL
Tell your boss, that his class is waiting.

WEINER
(looks)
You better tell him yourself.

THORKEL looks at ROZ who waves his shoulder, then the both
call.

ROZ & THORKEL
Professor Octavius!!

They're pounding on the window in the chapel, trying to stop him from getting married...

Professor OCK turns and looks at the bewildered men.

Once again, our villain is a high-school teacher with an assistant named Weiner who's catchphrase is 'Okey-dokie!' Someone was high when they wrote this. But I kid! After all, LOTS of great villains have been teachers! Like, the Jackal for instance... Okay, bad example.

OCK
Gentlemen, come, you must see this.

ROZ
But, your students...

OCK
The imbeciles can wait... I have better
things to do than teach introductory
Physics Rosomorf. Undergrads are
kindless adolescence.

And Oklahoma is okay! I know, I know, but it makes as much if not more sense then what Ock just said.

THORKEL
You see he is impossible.

OCK
Thorkel you are the dummiest
administrator our university has ever had.

I don't know about you, but I'm REALLY feeling his arrogance and wickedness right now! Jesus, Mr. Rogers had better villains!

(Thorkel turns to go)
Don't go Thorkel!! Come! Look!

Quit playing games with my heart!

He starts to play his machines handles and buttons.

Didn't they bust Peewee Herman for that?

THORKEL
The university pays you to teach
something to your students.

And on that note, how about a seamless transition!

INT. COLLEGE PHYSICS LAB - DAY

LIZ
Well, do you mean nothing... or do you
mean something but you won't tell me what
it is?

We cut away during a conversation and WENT BACK TO IT! Is anyone else thoroughly confused yet?

PETER
(regaining)
I mean plain nothing.

LIZ
Well, I guess that's about as nothing as
you can get... plain nothing.

A beat.

[/I]A deer! A female deer![/I]

PETER
Liz...!

LIZ
Ahh, it is something.

PETER
No... look.

The equipment on her TABLE is starting to vibrate.

Hey, baby, you can vibrate MY equipment anytime...

They
look at it, curiously. We hear the cyclotron's WHINE
begin to build...

INT. CYCLOTRON ROOM - DAY

Everything is shaking like in an earthquake... Roz and
Thorkel seem to dance in their place going crazy with
anger and surprise. The WHINE is deafening! The light is
blinding! WEINER has his eyes closed and his hands over
his ears.

Ah, the best way to watch this movie... if there had ever been a movie!

OCK
I am going for 20 percent power!

THORKEL
NO!! Don't do that...

ROZ
Ock! Its dangerous...

THORKEL
Ock I warn you...

Things I Learned: College professors will always call each other by nicknames in a dangerous situation.

WEINER crosses himself. The CONSOLE erupts in sparks.

Haha! Those wacky Catholics!

INT. ELECTRICAL CONDUIT MONTAGE - DAY

We follow the electrical overcharge as it crackles along
the WIRES and CABLES inside the WALLS and FLOORS. It is
making its way up to the LAB!

Oh man! I guess someone saw The Fast And The Furious!

Zev

08-06-2004, 12:58 AM

INT. LAB - DAY

All the kids are now trying to hold onto their vibrating
equipment.

I think sex ed is really getting out of hand!

The CHARGE crackles up a WIRE and erupts at LIZ'S TABLE.
A BREAKER explodes in flames. There is an outburst of AD
LIBS: "Fire!" "Everybody out!"

"Look what they've done!"

THORKEL (comes running he is shabby and bewildered) seeing
LIZ trapped behind the fire which is growing from second
to second.

He wades into the fire, but is beaten back by the FLAMES.
His sleeve is on fire. He pats it out.

Our hero, ladies and gentlemen. Our SMART hero.

LIZ
Peter!

Flash appears and tries to help but Thorkel stops him.

THORKEL
Get back, you idiots. You can't go in
there!

Today, he would be sued for calling students idiots.

LIZ smashes at the WINDOW, but this is an inner city
school and the WINDOWS are covered by STEEL GATES. Liz
wraps her fingers in the GATE.

LIZ
(out at the street)
Help! Help me!

Outside the WINDOW the air is clear and people come and
go. Some are stopping to look up at the girl on the
second floor who screams (but they can't hear, of course)
down at them as the FLAMES close in behind her.

PETER comes flying in with a FIRE EXTINGUISHER. He
fumbles with it. FLASH pushes Thorkel, grabs the
extinguisher away from him with a scowl of disdain.

When did Thorkel get the fire extinguisher?

LIZ turns to face the FLAMES. Suddenly there is an
eruption of CO2 CLOUDS and the roar of a FIRE
EXTINGUISHER.

The FLAMES are beaten down enough for her to leap out.
FLASH is there, holding the EXTINGUISHER. People CHEER.

I thought everyone left...

PETER
Thanks for your help Flash.

FLASH
No problem wimp.

What the United States said to the U.N. after we liberated Iraq. I'm sorry, that's a faulty simile. At least Peter TRIED.

PETER
Our hero has a real way with words.

LIZ
Oh, why don't you grow up.

PETER is stung, insulted, turns away.

Apparently in this universe that's a 'burn'. Although the really important thing here is that Liz was saved, but hey, if 'our hero' didn't get credit for it, why even bother?

ROSOMORF peeps in, worried -- faces Thorkel.

THORKEL
This man will bring a disaster upon this
university.

Didn't he just do that?

OCK comes in, starts his lecture calmly as if nothing has
happened.

Because he's weird and weird people are supervillains just waiting to happen!

OCK
The universe is made up of forces... and
counter-forces. Science is the study of
the forces!

Umm... no, it isn't.

FLASH hands the EXTINGUISHER to PETER. LIZ embraces
FLASH, throwing a glimpse at PETER who tried so bravely.
He looks away and turns the last of the EXTINGUISHER on
the last of the FIRE.

OCK
(continues without a
hitch)
But I... Professor Otto Octavius... have
devoted my life to the study of the
counter-forces!

So you play a lot of online FPS, big deal!

Good job, Peter.

PETER
(taking place at lab
table)
Thanks, Professor.

THORKEL has walked slowly and uncomprehendingly toward the
front of the huge LAB. He simply cannot believe OCK'S
behavior.

Make sure to spell this out for those in the cheap seats...

THORKEL
I don't believe it, I simply don't...

Believe it's not butter!

OCK
Can we carry on Mr. Thorkel.

THORKEL
I don't believe... oh, all right carry on
Professor.

The next generation in carry-on luggage, for when you need that lecture on 16th Century Mexico in the air!

OCK
Well! This week my dear students I have
made a stunning breakthrough...

OCK
I have no time for forms, or
administrators who persist in
interrupting me, Mr. Thorkel.

I don't play by your rules, McGarrett!

THORKEL steams out and bangs shut the DOOR.

OCK
I now believe its possible that these
counter forces can be... collected... the
way the magnifying glass collects the
sunlight... and focused into a hard beam
I call... Weiner!

Hey, who doesn't call their hard beam Weiner?

WEINER backs away from the BLACKBOARD to reveal a word
that OCK has scrawled in large letters. It says "Anti-
Force."

The Jedi must learn of this!

OCK
I call it, the Anti-Force!

I call it technobabble.

OCK is plugging a HUGE CABLE into a small LUCITE BOX with
a SILVER BALL inside it.

I know a potato should be involved in that somehow...

OCK
(continues as he works)
This anti-force, once harnessed, is
capable of undoing any natural force at
which it is aimed... for instance...
(looks up maniacally)
Gravity!

This is where a song begins in the musical.

LIZ scribbles down a note and mouths the word "gravity."
Then she turns to PETER.

LIZ
(whispers)
I'm sorry...

PETER
It's alright.

OCK is "playing" his COMPUTER like the Phantom of the
Opera at the organ.

Oh no, someone stop it before Joel Schumacher gets here!

OCK
We patch in the cyclotron...

The lights flicker and go dim.

In real-life, this is where everyone would start making out.

OCK
Pay no attention to the lights... I of
course steal its energy, and it looses
power. We patch in the cyclotron... and
we gradually apply power. The power that
I am stealing...

Ah-ha! He's stealing! I KNEW he was a baddie!

As the WHINE builds in the LAB...
OCK peers through the LUCITE BOX at us, distorted by it.

The BOX is a miniature version of the cyclotron's
experimental chamber, and now the BLUE-WHITE glow begins.
It crackles round the SILVER BALL.

But does it snap and pop?

OCK
And so we stand, four square against the
fundamental force that orders and
maintains our universe... gravity...
which is holding down this goddamn ball.
Rise!

You know, they have pills for this now.

The LIGHTS go totally dark. The kids react with WHOOPS
and CATCALLS.

Here, kitty kitty kitty...

HARRY
What a crock...

PETER
Shut up Harry... this is very interesting.

OCK
Mr. Parker! Have you some... interesting
observation you'd like to share with the
class?

"Umm... I'm scared of the dark?"

PETER
No sir...

OCK
Then shut up! And pay some attention to
the experiment.

OCK peers at us through the LUCITE BOX as the SILVER BALL
begins to rise. OCK'S face is ecstatic.

The rest of him could care less.

OCK
Rise! Rise!!!

The SILVER BALL suddenly shoots up, shattering the top of
the box. It flies up to the ceiling where it shatters a
LIGHT FIXTURE.

My God... he's revolutionized how we can change light bulbs!

The shards rain down on OCK who reaches out and catches
the falling BALL and scales it in a raised fist.

OCK
Now that's what I call an experiment!

Volume 4! Complete with all your favorites, including Backstreet Boys "Lets put juice into the icetray, then wrap it in saran wrap and stick toothpicks through the wrap, then leave in the freezer overnight so we can have tasty homemade popsicles in the morning!"

The CYCLOTRON WHINE cuts out and OCK wheels to the
COMPUTER. He hits a KEY and several COLORED PROJECTION
BEAMS lance out of the back of the room. They pierce the
smoke and light a PROJECTION DISPLAY in the front.

Miss Frizzle cannot be fair behind...

TWO COLORED SPHERES one, YELLOW, one BLUE

The gay rights movement want a pink triangle added to this demonstration for equality.

touch where
their circumferences meet. Behind them is a BLACK
depiction of "space".

The final frontier...

OCK
You are looking at a representation of
two universes. Our Blue one. Our real
universe... something we can touch and
feel and see and draw calculations about.
This is us. The Yellow universe... this
is something else. Some other dimension...
something... on the other side!

Reed Richards already went there, he calls it the 'Negative Zone'.

OCK hits another COMPUTER KEY and a hole appears where the
TWO SPHERES touch. The BLUE AND THE YELLOW MARBLEIZE with
each other. The colors swirl until both SPHERES are
BRIGHT GREEN.

So... the Green Goblin's a space alien!

OCK
If it were possible to generate enough
power behind it, the anti-force could
wipe out not just gravity... but all our
universal forces at the same time. In
effect... it would blast a hole between
this universe and the next.

LIZ
(with a student's ear)
That sounds like a scenario for the end
of the world.

Yes, but so does Nader's ecological plan.

OCK
My girl, it is! It is. It would mean
wiping out everything that's known... and
letting in everything that's unknown.

Ah! My humanity says I'm afraid of the unknown! Ahhh!

FLASH
Isn't that a little dangerous?

OCK
Don't worry yourself, true inter-
dimensional penetration is still purely
theoretical, but one day... Maybe very
near... maybe in the 21st century...

When two dimensions love each other very much...

Zev

08-06-2004, 07:56 PM

We interrupt this razing of a bad script to bring you the annoucement of a good script! Remember that coolio teaser I dropped on you guys a while back? Well, now it has an opening attached to it. Coolsville.

It takes a lot of guts to admit you may not be... ya know, EXCLUSIVELY attracted to the opposite sex.

OCK
(back to Peter)
We have a lot of interests in common,
Peter. Perhaps we should put our heads
together, if you know what I mean...

PETER
(flattered)
That would be... great.

OCK
(turns with a smile)
Now you take the Planetary Conjunction.
This Saturday night we will witness
Saturn, Jupiter, the Moon, the Earth, the
Sun... all in a row. Never seen within
the memory of man, or measured for its
effect. The total gravitational force
must be quite exceptional. Isn't that
the subject of your paper...?

That and whether Mr. Monk's Happy Dance could take Norman Osborn's Ee-vil Snitching!

PETER
Yes sir, I've worked out a new way to
calculate the combined gravitational
effect.

With Schoolhouse Rock!

OCK
I'm a busy man, Mr. Parker. But I think
I could find the time to go over it with
you. Make sure it all... checks out.

PETER
Well... I'm sort of working with
Professor Rosomorf and he suggested we
kind of keep it between us. He thinks
that my theory is... well, I don't know...

Crap.

OCK
(to himself)
The scoundrel...
(turns angry)
I want to see that data, Peter!

And we have our MacGuffin, ladies and gentlemen.

PETER
But Professor Octavius... if I knew you
were interested... sorry, I've already
given it to... Professor Rosomorf, and he
is after all the head of our Physics
Department... and I couldn't...

OCK turns sweet again. He smiles too broadly.

What, did he sprain something?

OCK
Well, I'm certain something can be worked
out. Run along, young man.

PETER begins to leave.

OCK
Just a minute... how about if I show you
my discoveries... something I never
showed to any other student... as a
matter of fact to anybody at all.

We'll have fun, we'll have tea, in a land of pure imagination...

PETER
Well I am really flattered, I mean I'd
love to... but I...

OCK
Very well shall we say if you come here
tonight...

PETER
But Professor I don't now if I should...

OCK
Make it eight sharp... I'll be waiting
for you... Right here...

Bring condoms.

Peter looks worried then leaves.

OCK turns to WEINER who slouches against the wall smiling.

I like ponies...

OCK
The same academic world that's so keen to
embrace that boy's undergraduate work,
ridicules my anti-force theory as
quackery. I ask you, Weiner... what is
our society coming to? Ha!

Sorry, I was just thinking of last night's episode of the Simpsons.

WEINER
They are all a bunch of brainless
*******s, that's what I say...

Well of course, silly, why would *******s need brains?

OCK
Weiner! Go get me that boy's data!

What Ben Affleck told Matt Damon when they read the script to Good Will Hunting.

WEINER
Cost you fifty bucks.

OCK
(Weiner hissing)
Just get it. We'll negotiate your fee
when you have the data, alright Weiner?

Weiner hissing? Is that like it burning when you pee?

Zev

08-08-2004, 02:43 PM

EXT. DAILY BUGLE - DAY

Establish as ART DECO BUILDING well beyond its prime. A
sign says: "The Daily Bugle." Peter enters the building.

Yes, he's helpless against the onslaught of his photos being posted in guyverjay's scan-o-rama.

JAMESON
Bag ladies. I hate bag ladies.

They give horrible head!

PETER
Yes, sir.

JAMESON is 50ish, grey at the temples, brush cut on top.
He too is forties.

You just said he was 50ish.

His chewed up CIGAR is forties. This
guy is a hard case.

As opposed to a bard case, which is a murder mystery set in the early days of CRPGs.

JAMESON
(looks at the other photos)
Little kids... I hate little kids. This
is a daily newspaper. We need news value
photographs, not artsy-fartsy ****!

WHAT did I just get done telling Cameron?

PETER
Yes, sir.

JAMESON comes to a picture of a BUSINESS SUITED MAN with a
MOHAWK. PETER smiles in anticipation.

This will PROVE the eighties are still alive!

JAMESON
Kid? You want a pro's assessment?

Yeah, do you know one?

PETER
Yes, sir!

JAMESON
(handing photos back)
Your photos suck.

And not in the good vacuum cleaner way!

(cigar for emphasis)
Parker, my readers are morons. I gotta
grab them by the eyes. Every time you
press the button of that Nikon of yours
it costs you fifty-five cents. So the
next time you're about to take the plunge,
ask yourself, am I taking dog bites man?
Because if you are...

Call animal control.

PETER
I know, I know. You want man bites dog...

JAMESON
Parker, this is the post modern 20th
century. I want man eats dog! Get out!

Post modern 20th century? Why don't you just say I got ****ed up the ass at college, it's really the same thing.

EXT. STREET - DAY

A seedy east village walk up. Peter takes his camera and
takes various shots of a wino. ALL IN. He climbs the
stairs to his building, looks through the mail, he
collects from a beaten down mailbox.

That mailbox coulda been a contender, instead of a bum, which is what he is!

PETER
(reading)
Rent! Rent, more bills, rent...
electricity, bills...

Wait until he checks his e-mail. Porn, spam, porn, more spam, porn, joke, even more spam...

INT. PETER'S APARTMENT - DAY

A one-room, shabby roof apartment, a chaos of books and
papers. A photo enlarger and darkroom baths in kitchen
pots; 8x10s tacked to the walls; a spare camera and
lenses.

Human head in the refridgerator...

Self-consciously wacky kitsch; plastic dinosaurs,
wind-up toys, a stuffed carp. An unmade bed and a 50's
dinette set are the only furniture. A grimy skylight
leads to the roof. It's not a pretty place, but it has
personality. A voice from the kitchen, a shadow of an
intruder, is sneaking around.

Peter spots him, a red exclamation point shoots up above his head.

PETER
There's nothing in there worth stealing!

MAY (V.O.)
(from within the kitchen)
That's the understatement of the year.

No, the understatement of the year is that you're a little over the hill, you old hag!

PETER
Aunt May, you're trespassing.

MAY
(comes in)
I was just so desperately bored... I
thought I'd come over and make you dinner...

And do your laundry.

PETER
I am old enough to... to make my own--

MAY
But I didn't feel like getting to know
your roaches.

They're good people, Aunt May! And if you can't get past your prejudice...

PETER
I'll introduce you.

MAY
Oh. And those foul chemicals in the pots...

And the foul pot in the chemicals...

PETER
I take pictures, remember?

MAY
Anyway, I've decided to kidnap you for
dinner in Forest Hills...

Here, cut off your finger so I can prove I have you.

She grabs her coat, crosses back to Peter and tugs on his
shoulder.

PETER
It's Friday night...

And the feeling's right...

MAY
Yes. Do you have a date?

Yes. You do mean the raisin-like thing, right?

PETER
No.

MAY
Then come on.

Jimmy: I mean, come on!

Herr Logan

08-08-2004, 02:49 PM

Damn, Zev, it's hard to enough to brave the prospect of reading one of your long posts (and this is coming from a wordy guy ;))even when it's all your own material, much less an entire script with added commentary!

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Damn, Zev, it's hard to enough to brave the prospect of reading one of your long posts (and this is coming from a wordy guy ;))even when it's all your own material, much less an entire script with added commentary!

REMEMBER, bunky, every MINUTE you're reading my posts is a minute you're not out ON THE STREETS, selling DRUGS and doing CRACK and slapping HOOKERS!

That was my Captain America impression. Also, check the new avatar. It's my most badass avatar yet, because it has Ron Perlman in it.

Ron Perlman could take Batman in a fight, even if Batman had prep time.

Herr Logan

08-08-2004, 09:59 PM

Originally posted by Zev
REMEMBER, bunky, every MINUTE you're reading my posts is a minute you're not out ON THE STREETS, selling DRUGS and doing CRACK and slapping HOOKERS!

That was my Captain America impression. Also, check the new avatar. It's my most badass avatar yet, because it has Ron Perlman in it.

Ron Perlman could take Batman in a fight, even if Batman had prep time.

Slapping hookers is bad? :confused:

:D

Sadly, my internet connection is a surly *****, so I can't always see people's avatars. It sure sounds nice, though, the way you describe it. :(

Zev

08-09-2004, 12:12 AM

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Slapping hookers is bad? :confused:

:D

Sadly, my internet connection is a surly *****, so I can't always see people's avatars. It sure sounds nice, though, the way you describe it. :(

Well, you know the scene in Blade 2 where Ron Perlman's character kills a Reaper for the first time with his UV light? It's a screencap of his facial expression during that scene. This is why I imagine that Jesus' Apostles look like the cast of Tombstone, Will Ferrell, and Ron Perlman.

INT. LARGE COMPUTER LAB - NIGHT

It is dark and empty except for COMPUTERS. Sitting at it,
lit by the GLOW of its screen, is SOLOMON ROSOMORF (ROZ).

Weren't we already introduced to him?

As he works, a DOOR opens behind him. Someone walks
quietly through the LAB. ROSOMORF keeps working. The
intruder approaches...

Ki ki ki ki ah ah ah ah...

THORKEL
(at his ear)
Professor Rosomorf, what happened here?

ROZ
Someone tried to rob me of some paper...
I suspect they were looking for that one.

It's my theory on how to make sure Rob Liefeld never works in the comics industry again. Worth millions, I tell you!

Somewhere no one would... damn, apparently someone IS into shemale carrot sex.

THORKEL
My God, what's going on in our school?
First Professor Octavius almost blows up
the Physics lab... Now this. You report
it in triplicate, of course.

ROZ
Thorkel, be careful when you talk to
Octavius. Remember... the man is a very
fragile genius. One day he'll bring us
all the Noble Prize.

I'd be fine with a Low-Down, Dirty Prize.

THORKEL
Rosomorf, the man is a very dangerous
crackpot!

Only the STUDENTS are allowed to be like that!

Off screen the voice of the CYCLOTRON WHINE begins to
build.

ROZ
That's him again. He's working day and
night.

And weekends!

THORKEL
I tell you the man is very dangerous.
(the whine grows louder)
Come on Rosomorf, let's stop him before
this building will explode.

I think that last sentence was translated to Spanish and back.

INT. CYCLOTRON ROOM - NIGHT

OCK and WEINER are at work as before. OCK takes no notice
of the TWO MEN who come in, nor the WORKER who comes inv
behind them and sets to work attaching a BIG LOCK to the
door.

No, you see, if they'd done this when the Clintons were leaving the White House, Bush wouldn't have had to get new furniture.

THORKEL
Shut it down, Octavius.

Mr. Book: Shut it down forever!

OCK ignores him. WEINER touches OCK'S shoulder. OCK
ignores him too.

A wise guy, eh?

THORKEL
You've blown half the circuits in the
Science Center.

OCK
Call an electrician.

Max Dillion, at your service!

THORKEL
I have called the locksmith.

How about a *****mith? For your wife!

OCK
What... what is he doing.

He points toward the worker who's working on the lock on
the main door.

He's telling secrets, honey.

THORKEL
We have to shut your lab down and take a
look at the lines.

What Warner Brothers should have said to Joel Schumacher after Batman Forever.

ROZ
Please, Otto, we must lock it up.

OCK
(to Thorkel)
You're denying me access to my cyclotron?!

Next thing you know they'll be sleeping in separate beds!

THORKEL
You bet.

OCK glares back and forth between the TWO MEN, the WORKER,
and WEINER. Then he pulls BACK the RED POWER THROTTLE.

The WHINE descends.

Everyone say hello to the ACLU again!

The WALDOS pull back and dangle from their panel. The
WHINE dies.

OCK
(contemplating)
Okey, dokey... just give me till tomorrow.
I want to clean up my papers. Tomorrow...
Ha... Tomorrow you can have this room...

I'm taking bets on Ock peacefully leaving with his papers tomorrow and not causing any trouble. Odds are 4400 to 1.

ROZ
Oh... well Thorkel... few more hours
won't make a difference.

What New Line said when Peter Jackson asked to make Extended Editions.

THORKEL
I hope.

I fall asleep!

He signals to the worker to stop.

Zev

08-09-2004, 05:27 PM

We interrupt our regularly-scheduled program to bring you Fantastic Four Vs. The Justice League of America!

Okay, this is a fair fight we're talking about, right? Being heroes, of course the JLA will allow the FF to call for back-up, no matter how much Batman protests. So who do the FF call in? Well, there's She-Hulk, Namor, the Inhumans, the Silver Surfer... oh, and Spider-Man is good friends with the Human Torch, I think he'll show up.

That's only counting the 'close friends' of the FF and not their colleagues in the superhero business. I doubt the X-Men or Avengers would hesitate to run to the defense of the 'First Family' of superhero teams (especially since Xavier would get good PR from running them DC boys out of town), but we'll not count them since then FF would have numerical advantage.

But lets assume that Mr. Fantastic can call in favors. He can tell Xavier to make Mystique look like Wonder Woman, then sleep with the entire JLA. Who's going to say no, she's Wonder Woman? This will turn the JLA into a bunch of quarrelling ex-lovers overnight. But that's just idle speculation.

Okay, you say, that's not fair. Well, then we'll have to schedule fights one-on-one, with sufficient time inbetween matches for resting. We'll allow Mr. Fantastic and Batman to schedule who fights who.

Now, what is most important in life? Sit down, Conan, you already answered who Crom was. The most important thing is to pass on your DNA. It's high school biology. Now, Reed has a wife and two beautiful children. Who is Batman dating? An ex-hooker who likes to dress up like a cat and steal things (not to mention she has her name attached to the worst movie ver made). Plus, Batman lives in a cave with his old butler and a twelve-year-old boy in yellow tights. Reed lives in a skyscraper with his loving family.

What does all this mean? It means that Reed (very nearly) understands women. Which makes him smarter then anyone else in the 'verse.

And while Batman may be a wheeler-dealer, Mr. Fantastic has done things Batman hasn't even dreamed about. Not only has he, ya know, married and had a family, but he's also explored the Negative Zone, travelled into space, and built a multimillion dollar merchandising empire WITHOUT no fancy-schmancy inheritance.

He'll put Human Torch up against Martian Manhunter, Thing up against Superman, himself up against Wonder Woman, and Sue against Batman. For a first round, at any rate.

Human Torch against Martian Manhunter. I'm assuming Reed has invented a telepathy blocker for Johnny, just to keep things fair. Remember, Johnny has experience with the original green, shape-changing aliens. Skrulls. So MM can turn clear, so what? He has to turn solid to hit Johnny. All Johnny has to do is use a nova blast and it's bye-bye birdie.

Thing up against Superman. Since Superman is ridiculously overpowered, Thing will go down. But it will take time. Thing has, quite simply, more heart then Superman and more anger. I don't care about 'oh, poor me, I am a simple alien who is only a high-paid reporter with a beautiful wife that can move planets by doing handstands.' Thing's been trapped in a monstrous body for nearly his entire superhero career. Knowing that if Supes wins, he'll go on to fight another member of the FF, He'll injure Supes enough to give his teammates a fighting chance. Why? Because he's got more heart. And maybe, just maybe, Kal-El will be touched by this monster with the heart of a prince. Maybe... BOOM! Thing knees him in the groin. I'll call this a draw at best.

Mr. Fantastic vs. Wonder Woman. Once again, if you tie Wonder Woman up she'll do anything you say. Mr. Fantastic is a master at tying things up. He's an Eagle Scout at knot-tying. So, welcome to the FF, Wonder Woman, you'll be Johnny's new trophy girlfriend. I think you'll find it a bit warmer wearing an unstable molecule jumpsuit instead of panties and a brassiere.

Sue Vs. Batman. The only edge Batman has here is stealth. This can be quickly solved by Sue expanding a forcefield around herself to make a wide, open space. Batman will have to attack. Sue can block his batarangs with forcefields, then imprison him in a bubble. Batman doesn't have any tools in his Deus-Ex-Utility-Belt to get out of that. Sue will let him out when he's run out of air and fallen unconscious. Match, Sue.

Thing Vs. Aquaman

Now, for a moment this seems like a one-sided match. After all, Aquaman can just use the water in Thing's body to kill him (this is assuming that Mr. Fantastic hasn't discovered Thing's body is waterless, giving Thing the advantage). BUT! Mr. Fantastic will notice the astonishing similarities between Aquaman and his own romantic rival, Prince Namor. He dusts off a half-finished invention and completes it, then steps through a gateway. On the other side, he discovers what he's always suspected. He is only a comic book character and this is the real world. After using his time machine to make sure the Clone Saga never happened (professional courtesy for Spider-Man, you know), he quickly takes over DC. He also makes a single suggestion at Marvel. He then travels back to the comic book world, using a memory-wiper to make sure he doesn't fall to the dreaded clutches of metafiction.

In the match area, Aquaman is ready to kill Thing with the copious amounts of water lying around when he suddenly notices his hand regrowing. He looks down to see he's wearing an orange shirt and green, scaly pants. "NO!" Aquaman: Year One cries as Thing cracks his knuckles.

Meanwhile, on the Blue Area of the Moon, Trition looks up from playing poker with the other Inhumans. "Anyone else hear something? It sounded like one really sucky character crying out in terror... and then suddenly silenced..."

Back in the Baxter Building, Thing comes back to discover that the Invisible Woman is now lounging in Mr. Fantastic's pad... in her Malice costume. Reed quickly closes the door.

Zev

08-09-2004, 07:25 PM

Bryan Singer apparently wants Tom Welling to be Superman in his movie. Maybe we're better off without him doing X-Men. Welling is a charisma vacuum. Everytime I see him I'm reminded that he is not an actor, but an underwear model. I'm not even kidding.

But, because he 'has the look' (read: spit curl), he gets the job. Just like MCD (of course, *I* look more like Kingpin then MCD, but damnit, that's Marvel's story and they're sticking to it!). Hasn't Hugh Jackman proved that actors don't have to look EXACTLY like their comic book counterparts to play the parts well? I sure as **** know that Willem Dafoe didn't have those horizontal red cornrows in Spider-Man.

Oh, who gives a ****? Superman sucks anyway.

cryptic name

08-09-2004, 10:23 PM

superman can shoot lasers from his eyes, i don't care what anybody says, that is the cooloest f--king thing ever

Zev

08-09-2004, 11:43 PM

Originally posted by cryptic name
superman can shoot lasers from his eyes, i don't care what anybody says, that is the cooloest f--king thing ever

Yes, and he has super-speed and super-strength (Ludacris Superstrength at that) and he can fly and he has x-ray vision and he has ice breath and he can make people amnesiac about SPECIFIC MEMORIES (like his identity, f'r instance) with a single kiss and he can travel backwards in time and he... is... just... too... ****ing... powerful.

Honestly, he should be able to beat anyone by simply pounding into them several hundreds times a second with super-speed and with his super-strength.

Besides, if you think shooting lasers from eyes is cool, read about Cyclops.

Herr Logan

08-10-2004, 12:56 AM

Originally posted by Zev
Bryan Singer apparently wants Tom Welling to be Superman in his movie. Maybe we're better off without him doing X-Men. Welling is a charisma vacuum. Everytime I see him I'm reminded that he is not an actor, but an underwear model. I'm not even kidding.

Agree! A thousand times, agree!

But, because he 'has the look' (read: spit curl), he gets the job. Just like MCD (of course, *I* look more like Kingpin then MCD, but damnit, that's Marvel's story and they're sticking to it!). Hasn't Hugh Jackman proved that actors don't have to look EXACTLY like their comic book counterparts to play the parts well?

Vehemently disagree.

I sure as **** know that Willem Dafoe didn't have those horizontal red cornrows in Spider-Man.

As poor as that script was, Dafoe's Norman-- and even his Green Goblin persona-- far outshined Wolverine's portrayal in "X-Men." Yes, I know he was a characature when in the costume, but that's the part, and he did more than just chew scenery.

Oh, who gives a ****? Superman sucks anyway.

Strongly disagree. Superman doesn't suck, he just doesn't have as much potential (speaking realistically about a consistent Superman) as more complex and tainted characters.

ZeroCorpse

08-10-2004, 03:57 AM

First, if there's another post from me in this topic, apologies. Enter key problems.

OK...

Batman 1989:
1. Joker: "I'm of a mind to make some moogy." Wha?
2. Million-dollar Batwing versus .44 calibur long-barrel handgun. Handgun wins after ONE SHOT.
3. Bruce meets Vicky, knocks boots and has a couple awkward conversations, and then Alfred BRINGS HER INTO THE BATCAVE?!?!
4. Thug: "Check his wallet!"
5. In museum: First it's defiled, then it's not, then it is again. All to the tune of the goofy "Partyman" by Prince.
6. Batman hanging upside down when Vicky's over. Gawd. Puh-Lease.

Batman Returns:
1. "Hell Here" in Selina's apartment. Oh, how edgy you are Mr. Burton!
2. Penguin spews black goo. Yummy. So cosomopolitan.
3. Penguin in his dirty underwear. Ugh.
4. Penguin has flippers? What?!?!
5. GIANT PENGUINS IN THE SEWER?!?! And people LIKE this movie?
6. Evil Circus. Again, Mr. Burton is trying too hard to be "creepy."
7. Selina is a secretary resurrected by cats. OK, then. . .
8. Penguins with missiles on their backs. . . Can it get worse?
9. TOTAL MISUSE OF CHRISTOPHER WALKEN! UNFORGIVABLE!

I could go on, but frankly, from this point on the Batman series makes it too easy to find fault.

Herr Logan

08-10-2004, 08:18 AM

Even if he wasn't used to his full potential, I think they used Christopher Walken pretty damn well. I think it would be hard not to do so.

Agent Thermal

08-10-2004, 09:58 AM

Yeah - and those penguins came from a local zoo-type thing - that explains their presence in the sewers. Furthermore, I'm just glad Penguin WORE underwear...(shudders at the alternative):(

Zev

08-10-2004, 12:59 PM

Hey, you guys have all heard of the moronic "Secret Spider-Man' movie, right? Well, they have a section on their website on 'Why Hollywood Blows" and their 'Worst Moments' top ten is nearly verbatim from this thread.

In an otherwise stellar movie which has recently been unfairly overshadowed by its sequel, one line makes the entire case against it. Future Catwoman (In Name Only) Halle Berry, wearing a bad wig and digitally-inserted white eyes (you can see her pupils behind them and everything), blows Toad away. As he hangs on by his unnaturally-long tongue, Storm pauses to utter a quip before destroying him with lightning. Unfortunately, it turns out to be this clunker. "Do you know what happens to a toad when it's hit by lightning?" etc. Wolverine can be forgiven for stabbing her through the chest in the next scene.

10. Green Goblin Attacks Macy Gray, Spider-Man

Okay, Macy Gray had a cameo, nothing too painful... Then Green Goblin shows up. In an all-too-static faceplate which seems designed for ease of conversion to Halloween costumes and a green armor suit, it's amazing that people didn't laugh out loud at the 'menace', especially when he proves his villain-osity to the world by (gasp! horror!) slashing a passing balloon float. Luckily, veteran heavy Willem Dafoe is behind the mask to keep the performance afloat and the movie is fast-paced enough for us to disregard the costume for the most part. Still, who here can truly say we didn't turn our heads slightly when that... THING graced the silver screen?

1. I've got to hand it to you, Captain America

Captain America is tied to a rocket that's about to nuke Washington. As the Red Skull gloats, the Sentinel of Liberty says "Come over here, I want to tell you something." Now, anyone who isn't an only child can tell you the appropriate response is "I can hear you fine from over here," but the master villain walks over to Cappy and gets his hand grabbed. So, what does the nemesis of freedom do? Instead of hacking his enemy's arm off, HE CHOPS HIS OWN OFF! BRILLIANT! I wouldn't trust this guy to be a grip on Triumph Of The Wills if I was Adolf.

The See-Saw Scene, Daredevil

Did you act like you did when you were a horny, hormonally-motivated teenager? No. Well, then you must not be Ben Affleck's Matt Murdock. Elektra's introduction in the comics, in which an immature Matt shows off to her for a look at breasts (that's conjunture), is stuffed through the Plot-O-Matic, giving us a...

1. Meet Cute
A. With Funny Sidekick
Drinking Something That Would Not Normally Be Drunk

Should make people think of how much better off they would be watching a movie with...

Jet Li? No.

Bruce Lee? No.

Jackie Chan? Yes

I'm surprised he doesn't just get into his car and drive her to see a movie. It would be about as inconspicous.

2. Elektra Trains, Daredevil

After given the dubious pleasure of Daredevil murkily fighting his way through a bar full of strobe lights and thugs, then killing a rapist to whom he lost in court (our favorite attorney was prosecuting for some reason), and finally leaving his logo in lighter fluid for a slumming Joey Pants to find, we get the end result of master thespians Ben Affleck and Jennifer Garner doing their impression of a bad romcom for most of the movie. Elektra is on a warpath and no one's going to stop her! So, what's the first thing she does? Why, dress up in the standard anti-hero black leather (complete with not-protective-offered-what-so-ever cut-off top), turn on some nu-metal, and jump around slashing sandbags with ninja sais. And just when we think it can't get any worse, a sandbag custom-fitted with a caricature of Daredevil drawn in red crayon lowers. Elektra proves how much of a badass she is by throwing a sai through it. Unfortunately, people, unlike sandbags, can dodge, intercept, and otherwise render mute thrown projectiles and then use them against their owner, as Elektra learns when a wildly-mugging Colin Farrell impales her a few minutes later. Daredevil's unbelievable ability to defeat both Bullseye and Kingpin after being critically wounded can't hold a candle to the slap in the face of the comics that is Movie!Elektra.

2. The Wilheim Scream, Howard the Duck

I've only seen this online, but apparently there's a scene where Howard dive-bombs a group of duck hunters in an airplane. One of the unlucky humans does the distinctive Wilheim scream (the high-pitched girly-girl shriek that Stormtrooper made when he fell off the ledge on the Death Star, remember?). That this classic sound effect is sullied by being in such a film as Howard the Duck is near sacrilege.

The A-S-S, Batman & Robin

At last, a new Batman movie is upon us. Sure, Batman Forever was a heaping pile of ^_^^_^^_^^_^, but now Akiva Goldsman, master writer behind Lost In Space, and Joel Schumacher, the Gay Filmmaker Yang to Bryan Sinker's Ying (QUOTE: "I know dragging homosexuals into the street and beating them is WRONG, but if we did it, Batman & Robin wouldn't have been made." -David Duke) have hit their stride. And George Clooney, he's a good actor! I mean, SURE Alicia Silverstone and Arnold Schwarzenegger are expected to turn in dramatic performances, but...

Oh wait, did we just get a close-up of Batman's ass? Jesus Christ, let's go get a refund before it's too late.

Those little *****es ripped me off! And they didn't even have the good grace to realize that Daredevil having sex and killing people was worse then a two-second sound effect in Howard the Duck!

Herr Logan

08-10-2004, 01:23 PM

I really don't understand why the Punisher's fake fire hydrant is even anywhere close to that list. Clearly he was operating on a tighter budget than would be ideal and used his craftiness the best he could (despite a couple huge plot holes). This is exactly why we'll never see the ultimate Batman movie (stealth, dramatic entrance/exits, correct costume, OCD preparedness, non-gadget-related ingenuity, real detective work...). You all make me very sad inside. :(

spideyboy_1111

08-10-2004, 03:16 PM

Originally posted by Herr Logan
I really don't understand why the Punisher's fake fire hydrant is even anywhere close to that list. Clearly he was operating on a tighter budget than would be ideal and used his craftiness the best he could (despite a couple huge plot holes). This is exactly why we'll never see the ultimate Batman movie (stealth, dramatic entrance/exits, correct costume, OCD preparedness, non-gadget-related ingenuity, real detective work...). You all make me very sad inside. :( the fire hydrant was very clever. This was so while he drove the car away, no one would park in her spot.

Dr.Dude

08-10-2004, 03:58 PM

Originally posted by Zev
Human Torch against Martian Manhunter. I'm assuming Reed has invented a telepathy blocker for Johnny, just to keep things fair. Remember, Johnny has experience with the original green, shape-changing aliens. Skrulls. So MM can turn clear, so what? He has to turn solid to hit Johnny. All Johnny has to do is use a nova blast and it's bye-bye birdie.
Not to mention that Martian Manhunter's Kryptonite-esque weakness is fire.

Seriously. ;)

Which pretty much means that even though he's the most powerful person on JLA, any one of them could kick his ass. ;) I actually really liked J.M. Dematteis' explanation that this "weakness" was merely a psychological effect based on certain events in Mars, but that's pretty much forgotten today as far as I can tell, unfortunately. :o

Zev

08-11-2004, 11:02 PM

Kerry supports the War in Iraq, but says Bush 'rushed into' war. Which begs the question...

What if? Kerry was president during the eighties?

*Wayne's World flashback thingey*

"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall... eventually. If you can get around to it. But you'd better do it sometime, or we're... vigorously talk to you about it!"

Oh, wait, this is KERRY we're talking about.

"Mr. Gorbachev, leave this wall just the way it is! I love it! Looks great! Don't change a thing!"

spideyboy_1111

08-11-2004, 11:29 PM

*delete*

Zev

08-11-2004, 11:53 PM

Originally posted by spideyboy_1111
*delete*

What was that all about?

Zev

08-13-2004, 09:54 PM

A lot of you must be wondering what my thoughts are on Avengers Reassembled, the adding of two VERY overexposed characters to the team (think if Cable and Gambit had been added to Earth's mightiest heroes in the nineties). This could be the beginning of a backlash against Bendis, as apparently not even his name value, the 'wait and see' factor, and the fact that he's following up Chuck Austen's run and Search for She-Hulk are enough to make this good.

However, truthfully I'm much more concerned with the Haturz league Disassembled (http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=134441).

INT. APARTMENT OF AUNT MAY AND UNCLE BEN - NIGHT

The N.Y. Mets are playing baseball on T.V. PETER watches
with his UNCLE BEN, a paunchy 65 years old in POLYESTER
SLACKS and a COMFY OLD SWEATER. A N.Y. METS CAP is
perched on BEN'S head. A BEER CAN is in his hand. A
cluttered but familiar living room sprawls comfortably
around them.

Something is very wrong with this picture.

BEN
Another brewski?

Something is DEFINITELY wrong with this picture!

PETER
No, I'm fine, Uncle Ben.

Finely underage.

BEN
(at T.V.)
Yah! Way to do it. Alright!
(to Peter)
You don't follow the Mets like you used
to, do you, Pete?

No, Paul Jenkins isn't writing me anymore.

PETER
No, not so much anymore.

BEN
Funny. When your Mom and Dad, uh, passed
away... I had this idea... I wanted you
to be the best baseball player that ever
was. Geez, what ever happened to that?

I don't know, what the hell ever came to giving him a ****ing microscope to respect his ****ing wishes to be a ****ing scientist! Cameron, you and your cronies had hit the last straw! You can **** with the love interest... you can **** with the webbing... but once you **** with Uncle Ben, it's on, it's on like Donkey Kong! Your reign of terror ends NOW!

PETER
Little league.

Wasn't Rick Moranis in that?

BEN
(soft and warm)
Yeah... Babe Ruth you wasn't.

At least, not after 'Babe Ruth No More!'

AUNT MAY enters.

AUNT MAY
It's on the table! Turn off the TV!

BEN nods, rises sluggishly and slowly, and turns the sound
off only. PETER moves toward his AUNT in the doorway.

agreed. that heavily bugged me. his senses were enhanced but he didn't gain any agility or superstrength from it.

Copycat

08-14-2004, 04:37 PM

Originally posted by Quentin Black
Yada yada yada, despite the text that everyone copies and pastes from marvel thinking they know all about the character he does it all the time in the in the comics, be it with Frank Miller or Alex Maleev.

that's because dardevil has ninga/martial arts training which is alot more exceptable. daredevil in the movie just seemingly manifested ninga like skills.

Copycat

08-14-2004, 06:04 PM

Originally posted by Zev
She isn't Greek at all, she wasn't cold or calculating, she didn't act like Elektra. When was Frank Miller's Elektra EVER motivated by revenge? She was motivated by profit and love and sometimes just plan bloodlust.

i think you need to re read the comics and re watch daredevil. because elektra is said to be greek in the movie. also millars elektra is all about revenge she became the assasin she is today because of her will to take revenge on the world for what happened to her father. she took revenge on stick for kicking her out of the chaste by joining the hand. she took revenge on bullseye for killing her in the comics by beating him to a bloody pulp when she returned. she took revenge on the guys that kidnapped her/hunted her down in ruckas elektra run. elektra is ALL about revenge.

Zev

08-14-2004, 07:55 PM

Originally posted by Copycat
he attacked macy gray? is that in the dvd? oh,how i really wish he killed the crackwhore.

I took some liberties with the scene to make a catchy title.

And I'm not agreeing with your assessment of Elektra as being motivated by revenge, but even if I was, how come we have to wait for her spin-off to get Elektra being an assassin? Bait and switch, my friend, bait and switch.

Copycat

08-14-2004, 08:08 PM

Originally posted by Everyman
I haven,t been on this topic for ages, I want to comment on what you have written Zev. I also tought Daredevil was really weak, to say the least. I am not a Daredevil comic fan, so I don't know much how Elektra is portrayed. In the movie, she was terribly shallow. I think the revenge angle could have bring something to her character, but it was poorly done. Basically we barely meet her and her father, father dies, she gets into costume looking for Daredevil, find him (!!??) and starts a fight with him, discovers DD is Matt Murdoch, believes him when he says he is not the killer, then dies (or does she?). No reason is given as for why she knows martial arts (not how, but why), and the revenge part last as long as five minutes, top. It would have been much better had it been the main focus of the movie, Kingpin could have tempted her to go after DD, and turning her into an assassin with a moral motivation. Forget the silly Bullseye (I don't know what people liked about the character in the movie) and have this "darkside" Elektra fight Daredevil at the end. Now you have something dramatic!

it was hinted that elektra's father had her taught martial arts so she wouldn't be a victum, like her mother. which also goes along with the comics.

Copycat

08-14-2004, 08:34 PM

Originally posted by Zev
I took some liberties with the scene to make a catchy title.

And I'm not agreeing with your assessment of Elektra as being motivated by revenge, but even if I was, how come we have to wait for her spin-off to get Elektra being an assassin? Bait and switch, my friend, bait and switch.

perhaps because the movie was about daredevil and not suppose to be all about elektra.

Zev

08-14-2004, 09:01 PM

Originally posted by Copycat
perhaps because the movie was about daredevil and not suppose to be all about elektra.

When Elektra appeared in DAREDEVIL'S comic books, the story was about Daredevil and she was still an assassin.

Zev

08-14-2004, 10:34 PM

U.S. Sanctions France.

President George W. Bush, obviously shaken, addressed the nation this Friday.

"My fellow Americans. My duty as president of this great nation precludes me from having the time to watch many movies, but I managed to clear my calender to watch Spider-Man 2 this thursday. Damn, that was a good film. Afterwards, I was jazzed up to see another superhero movie. I was going to go home and watch the first Spider-Man on DVD. But my two beautiful little girls advised me to go see Catwoman."

The president added: "To err is human, to forgive is divine."

"Ladies and gentlemen, I've sat in my office as casualty reports from 9/11 rolled in. I've waited in the war room as our boys risked their lives on Operation: Iraqi Freedom. But I've never been as tempted to fall off the wagon as when I watched that piece of crap. As my vice-president would say, that entire movie needs to **** off."

Bush then paused a moment to gather his thoughts. He drank from a small bottle.

"Don't worry, folks, it's just some orange 'n creme. Can't get enough of this stuff. Effective immediately, I am demanding that a group of American film inspectors, including Leonard Maltin, Roger Ebert, and Joe-Bob Briggs be allowed to test every movie currently in production in France. The frightening truth is, there could be bombs of equal or greater size then Catwoman currently being prepared in France.

"Until the French comply with our resolutions, I am imposing a trade embargo on France. No Jerry Lewis films will be shipped over there from henceforth. I was okay with them not supporting us on Iraq. I was okay with the above-ground nuclear testing. But this heinous attack on American soil cannot and will not stand.

"I've spoken a great deal on the Axis of Evil. Joel Schumacher. Uwe Boil. Akiva Goldsman. Jon Peters. And one that we are partly responsible for bringing to power, George Lucas. But the French are the worst of them all. And this is coming from someone who liked Brotherhood of the Wolf."

"Did you catch that movie?" Secretary of State Colin Powell asked. "Monica Belucci got naked and the bad guy from Shanghai Knights when around busting *****es up."

"I know, that rocked hardcore," Bush agreed. "Anyway, we're hoping to transfer power back to the French people by October 17th. Jean-Luc Besson, who you may remember from such films as The Professional and La Femme Nikita, is in the running for president. Don't worry, people, he has TWO names."

"Racist! Halle is haut! You don't like it just because it stars a black woman in a starring role!" said John Edwards.

"Ummm... CINO rocked! Halle IS haut! You all are haturz!" Kerry said.

Herr Logan

08-14-2004, 10:48 PM

Funny as most of that was, Zev, I'm sure you're aware of the countless political threads in which that might be more appropriate. I know it's your thread and all, but I'm sure you don't want this turning into another fighting ground for TheSlag, maxwell's demon and the rest, and especially those disgusting little juggalo clones, (one of which was considering sending a foot soldier over to Maryland, simply to get ambushed, handcuffed and tortured for two and a half weeks).

I know I don't want to put up with any more of TheSlag's childish winking and lowbrow and incompetent arguments and maxwell's demon's irritating fence-straddling, pacifism and largely impotent argument techniques than I have to.

SHABLEIK

08-14-2004, 10:58 PM

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Funny as most of that was, Zev, I'm sure you're aware of the countless political threads in which that might be more appropriate. I know it's your thread and all, but I'm sure you don't want this turning into another fighting ground for TheSlag, maxwell's demon and the rest, and especially those disgusting little juggalo clones, (one of which was considering sending a foot soldier over to Maryland, simply to get ambushed, handcuffed and tortured for two and a half weeks).

I know I don't want to put up with any more of TheSlag's childish winking and lowbrow and incompetent arguments and maxwell's demon's irritating fence-straddling, pacifism and largely impotent argument techniques than I have to.

How can you call someone elses posts childish when your post itself is childish, do you bother to read it before you post it

Zev

08-14-2004, 11:09 PM

Geez, try to make a little joke and everyone goes CRAZY!

I don't think I like politics anymore... :(

Herr Logan

08-14-2004, 11:13 PM

Originally posted by Zev
Geez, try to make a little joke and everyone goes CRAZY!

I don't think I like politics anymore... :(

Good. Then it can't ruin the thread. James Cameron can do that all by himself. :D

Herr Logan

08-14-2004, 11:14 PM

Originally posted by SHABLEIK
How can you call someone elses posts childish when your post itself is childish, do you bother to read it before you post it

You're right. The posts that I called childish are actually brilliant, to the point, and mature. ;)

Take notes, child, and think before you type.

Zev

08-14-2004, 11:54 PM

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Good. Then it can't ruin the thread. James Cameron can do that all by himself. :D

If James Cameron's king of the world, isn't talking about him automatically political?

Herr Logan

08-15-2004, 12:38 AM

Depend if we're talking imaginary politics or real politics. If we're going to be talking imaginary politics, I'd rather talk about Dr. Doom, or hell, even Ultimate George Bush (although, yeah, Ultimate X-Men isn't all that great) than James Cameron's ill-formed delusion.

Zev

08-15-2004, 12:39 AM

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Depend if we're talking imaginary politics or real politics. If we're going to be talking imaginary politics, I'd rather talk about Dr. Doom, or hell, even Ultimate George Bush (although, yeah, Ultimate X-Men isn't all that great) than James Cameron's ill-formed delusion.

Ultimate Dubya roxxor your boxxor.

Herr Logan

08-15-2004, 12:42 AM

Speak English, boy! Where are our education tax dollars going?!

Zev

08-15-2004, 08:51 AM

Just for fairness, here's the 'President boycotts CINO' for those still living in the Clinton years (i.e., most of Hollywood). And this is officially the last of our politics for a good long while. We ain't Doonesbury here, babes! All you need to get the humor is a healthy hatred of Daredevil and the attendant Bennifer.

U.S. Sanctions France.

President Bill Clinton, obviously shaken, addressed the nation this Friday.

"My fellow Americans. My duty as president of this great nation precludes me from having the time to watch many movies, but I managed to clear my calender to watch Spider-Man 2 this thursday. Damn, that was a good film. Afterwards, I was jazzed up to see another superhero movie. I was going to go home and watch the first Spider-Man on DVD. But Chelsea advised me to go see Catwoman."

The president added: "God, I could use a hummer and a cigar."

"Effective immediately, I am demanding that a group of American film inspectors, including Leonard Maltin, Roger Ebert, and Joe-Bob Briggs be allowed to test every movie currently in production in France. The frightening truth is, there could be bombs of equal or greater size then Catwoman currently being prepared in France.

"Until the French comply with our resolutions, I am imposing a trade embargo on France. No Jerry Lewis films will be shipped over there from henceforth. I was okay with them being French. I was okay with the above-ground nuclear testing. But this heinous attack on American soil cannot and will not stand.

"Although Halle was frickin' hot. Did you see that costume? Yowza! We like 'em with big foreheads down in Arkansas! Ain't that right Al?"

Al Gore, the vice-president, was then heard to say: "What - krsh - is this thing -beep- you call -lockbox- 'love'?"

"She's on the list," Clinton continued. "You know, the list? Fifteen people I would cheat on my wife to have sex with."

When pointed out that the list was commonly only five people long, Clinton replied: "Look, I'm the president. You elected Bubba. You got Bubba. Oh, I forgot to mention. We're going to bomb a medicine factory somewhere in the Middle East in retailiation for CINO."

He then did that little thumb's up thing he does while he screws up his lip. You know the one.

He presses the top floor and begins changing into his Spider-Man costume. Halfway through, the doors open and another passenger gets on. It's DAVE CHAPPELLE doing a cameo as himself. Luckily, Spider-Man has his mask and gloves on and is just about to drop trou. Chappelle shakes his head.

CHAPPELLE: You're one of those people who are into masturbation in dangerous places?

SPIDER-MAN: ...No?

CHAPPELLE: Good.

He steps inside and presses his floor. Spider-Man begins taking off his shoes and folding his clothes into a pile.

CHAPPELLE: What're you doing here? Isn't this the newspaper that's trashing you all the time?

SPIDER-MAN: Well, I have my reasons.

CHAPPELLE: Okay.

SPIDER-MAN: (beat) Hey! Aren't you that guy? I'm sure I know you somewhere.

Chappelle waits patiently, nodding his head.

SPIDER-MAN: Yeah, I know you! You're the voice of that talking donkey in the Shrek movies!

Chappelle shakes his head.

CHAPPELLE: No!

SPIDER-MAN: Oh. Well, I totally loved Puss In Boots. He makes a great Antonio Banderas parody.

CHAPPELLE: No, I have no involvement with the Shrek stuff.

SPIDER-MAN: Then who played Puss In Boots?

CHAPPELLE: That would be Antonio Banderas.

SPIDER-MAN: Wow. He was really having fun with his image, wasn't he?

CHAPPELLE: Seemed that way. You sure you don't... know me from anywhere?

SPIDER-MAN: No. Should I?

CHAPPELLE: "I'm Rick James, *****!" That ringing any bells?

SPIDER-MAN: Nope.

CHAPPELLE: What? Yeah! Okay!

SPIDER-MAN: Huh? You have Tourette's or something?

CHAPPELLE: I have this character based on a rapper and that's the only three things he ever says...

SPIDER-MAN: Oh, you're one of the guys from Saturday Night Life with your own catchphrase.

CHAPPELLE: No, I have my own variety show...

SPIDER-MAN: Really? What channel? Fox, ABC, CBS?

CHAPPELLE: No...

SPIDER-MAN: Duh, of course. UPN!

CHAPPELLE: No! Comedy Central!

SPIDER-MAN: Oh. Never heard of them.

CHAPPELLE: Really? They have South Park and the Man Show and Reno 9-1... Never mind. Hey, could you settle a bet for me?

SPIDER-MAN: Shoot.

CHAPPELLE: Why does J. Jonah Jameson hate you so much?

SPIDER-MAN: The truth?

CHAPPELLE: Lay it on me, I won't tell a soul.

SPIDER-MAN: J. Jonah Jameson hates me... because I'm black.

Chappelle's eyes widen.

CHAPPELLE: Really?

SPIDER-MAN: Uh-huh.

CHAPPELLE: Wow.

SPIDER-MAN: Hey, do you know what the first letter in Jameson's name stands for?

CHAPPELLE: Jolly?

The elevator stops and opens its doors. Chappelle steps out.

SPIDER-MAN: Nice talking to you.

CHAPPELLE: Same here.

Rasputin

08-15-2004, 09:29 AM

Originally posted by Copycat
it was hinted that elektra's father had her taught martial arts so she wouldn't be a victum, like her mother. which also goes along with the comics. It's not hinting if they actually say tht line in the movie:rolleyes:

Obi-Ron

08-15-2004, 12:27 PM

Originally posted by Zev

SPIDER-MAN: J. Jonah Jameson hates me... because I'm black.

That line was funnier in She-Hulk.

Rasputin

08-15-2004, 12:30 PM

oh snap!

Ragin Cajun

08-15-2004, 03:38 PM

cat woman is the worst thing to bare the name comic book movie!!!!!!

Zev

08-15-2004, 06:24 PM

Originally posted by Obi-Ron
That line was funnier in She-Hulk.

Your mom was funnier in She-Hulk.

Herr Logan

08-15-2004, 08:29 PM

Who's been observing the "Chunk of Monk"? It's God's way of forgiving those who've missed episodes here and there. They're on hour nine right now. :o

Last week's episode was one of the most bad-ass yet. :)

Glee!

Copycat

08-15-2004, 11:16 PM

Originally posted by Zev
When Elektra appeared in DAREDEVIL'S comic books, the story was about Daredevil and she was still an assassin.

and less intresting.

Copycat

08-15-2004, 11:22 PM

Originally posted by Rasputin
It's not hinting if they actually say tht line in the movie:rolleyes:

what's with your attitude? is having an extra dose of attitude in your posts a rule here or something?and for your information it's not actually said in the movie. matt says her dad was basicly turning her into a soldier and she replies with "no, just not a victum". it's not said why exactly her father felt elektra would be a "victum" or what caused him to think she needed to train in order not to be. so next time, before you fling your flamming post of garbage at me, make sure you check your facts out first:rolleyes:

WOW, THAT FELT GOOD! I SHOULD BE MORE RUDE MORE OFTEN!!........NO! OH, NO, LOOK WHAT YOU GUYS HAVE DONE TO ME!!! I'VE BECOME A MONSTER!!!!!!!

Zev

08-15-2004, 11:32 PM

Originally posted by Copycat
what's with your attitude? is having an extra dose of attitude in your posts a rule here or something?and for your information it's not actually said in the movie. matt says her dad was basicly turning her into a soldier and she replies with "no, just not a victum". it's not said why exactly her father felt elektra would be a "victum" or what caused him to think she needed to train in order not to be. so next time, before you fling your flamming post of garbage at me, make sure you check your facts out first:rolleyes:

WOW, THAT FELT GOOD! I SHOULD BE MORE RUDE MORE OFTEN!!........NO! OH, NO, LOOK WHAT YOU GUYS HAVE DONE TO ME!!! I'VE BECOME A MONSTER!!!!!!!

In the Ultimate twist on Daredevil, Matt Murdock and Elektra Natchios are just normal people who meet when she asks what color her dress is and Matt replies "Blue, oh, wait, ****, I don't know, I'm blind."

Elektra replies "Wow, what a great guess, it is blue!" and the relationship between the blind man and the possibly mentally-handicapped babe begins. They immediately have sex, which is edgy and kewl, you see. But Matt Murdock is secretly a man who likes to dress up in leather and jumps into bars filled with brawlers, usually in the pursuit of one man who is much more accessible during his nightly walks through the park, blindfolded and wearing only his boxers.

K. Pin is a very evil man who free-styles and beatboxes constantly. He learns of a man in red leather who irritates people with constant breakdancing until someone starts stomping on him, at which time he begins breathing heavily and reaches for a Kleenex. His moves are so reckless and dangerous they call him the Daredevil.

K. Pin calls in Irish Jig, an incredibly accurate assassin, to serve Daredevil. And just like that, it's on. In a ferocious dance battle, one of Irish Jig's shoes slips off his foot and kills Elektra's father. Despite this happening right in front of Elektra, she blames Daredevil (remember what I said about possibily mentally-handicapped). She pulls out a gun and shoots at him until the bullets run out, after which she keeps pulling the trigger to no response, which is movie shorthand for KRAZY!

Daredevil and Elektra meet high atop the Seattle Space Needle, where Elektra (despite being the rich heir of a ketchup fortune, she knows kung-fu) and Daredevil fight. Daredevil never realized how hot Elektra was while dancing and has to cramp his style to cramp his raging hard-on. Elektra is quickly able to bring him down with a ferocious leg cramp.

"I want to see the face of my father's killer before he gets served."

She pulls off his mask and is startled to discover it's her lover, Matt Murdock. Just then, Irish Jig (who happened to be in the Top of the World restaurant, eating a lasagna and drinking some clear mineral water) happens upon the fight. Elektra puts DD's mask back on and fights Irish Jig. Unfortunately for her, as an Irish stereotype Jig has much experience beating women. Daredevil is too busy jerking-off to his pain to help Elektra. Elektra is quickly impaled, has her neck slit, and is then thrown off the building. Her sequel will come out in Summer 2007.

Irish Jig and Daredevil confront in their final dance-off. Neither combatants has ever been so fresh, so funky. However, a nearby man being arrested by police is trying to demonstrate that a gun isn't loaded. The gun goes off and Daredevil manuevers Irish Jig into the position of the bullet. Despite Irish Jig's pleas for mercy, Daredevil throws him off the building.

Daredevil then sets off cross-country riding on his ten-speed to confront K. Pin, who is vacationing in Alaska. While Daredevil is bleeding to death, he manages to beat K. Pin by using penguins as back-up dancers. Despite his actions during the entire storyline, Daredevil decides to do the most cliched thing possible and let K. Pin live.

K. Pin then reveals the real reason he's hated Daredevil for so long. Daredevil is carrying his baby!

Zev

08-16-2004, 10:37 PM

Originally posted by gregtestagent
Kroenen is the best character in Hellboy. non-dialogue characters kick ass!

http://www.starwars.com/databank/character/bobafett/img/movie_bg.jpg

Indeed they do. But not as much as Monk.

Dr.Dude

08-16-2004, 10:41 PM

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Who's been observing the "Chunk of Monk"? It's God's way of forgiving those who've missed episodes here and there. They're on hour nine right now. :o

Last week's episode was one of the most bad-ass yet.

Glee!
Yes...and it's actually the first time I've watched the show, something I now realize I should be tarred and feathered for. :o It's amazingly addictive and awesome. :D

Originally posted by Zev
Daredevil and Elektra meet high atop the Seattle Space Needle, where Elektra (despite being the rich heir of a ketchup fortune, she knows kung-fu) and Daredevil fight. Daredevil never realized how hot Elektra was while dancing and has to cramp his style to cramp his raging hard-on. Elektra is quickly able to bring him down with a ferocious leg cramp.
:D

Now if I ever have to see that scene again it will suddenly be actually for the first time vaguely entertaining, as visions of Daredevil struggling to "cramp" it litter my head. ;)

Reminds me of an experience from the first day of highschool as well, but I ain't going there. :eek: ;)

Zev

08-16-2004, 10:56 PM

Originally posted by Dr.Dude
Reminds me of an experience from the first day of highschool as well, but I ain't going there. :eek: ;)

Thank you. This proves you aren't Harry Knowles.

Dr.Dude

08-16-2004, 11:04 PM

Indeed--- It's as if he makes a point to start every single review with 20 paragraphs of him saying how the alarm clock woke him up, what he ate for breakfast, and what happened to the breakfast. This goes on to the point where when you're finally getting to the part of the "review" the deals with movie, you forget that you aren't reading anymore about how Harry was stopped by a policeman on the way over to the theater, because the description of how the cop searched him took up more paragraphs than the actual description of the movie. :p It's as if he's avoiding it on purpose sometimes...

And that paragraph was beginning to even sound like him. Dear god, I think I've finally read too many reviews from AICN...!

Not to mention he loved GINO when first saw it(!). Something for which he deserves nothing less than to burn in hell for. :o

Zev

08-17-2004, 01:56 AM

Is it wrong that I enjoy Queen of Hearts so? I mean, one would think that all the 'lovey-dovey' stuff would be a turn-off, yet I find myself actually caring for these kooky characters. Sure, there's a great deal of humor, but am I just swallowing a pill along with my cheese? Or is it perhaps society that's put too great a margin on the DIFFERENCES between the sexes instead of the similarities? While we may not be able to enjoy The Golden Girls and they may not be able to enjoy The Three Stooges, is it possible that with maybe a little sensitivity on our part (and a little understanding on theirs) we might actually... get along?

That's a harrowing thought. I also find myself strangely attracted to Kestral*.

(Ed's Note: You all know from the now-classic Worst Moments #352, where he described Kestral as the 'perfect woman. - Blushing Buscema)

But then, I also happen to think Angelina Jolie is the hottest woman on the planet, so maybe I just have a thing for borderline crazy chicks.

http://www.queenofwands.net/comics/20040726b.jpg
I just know Logan is going to be more pissed off by this then by a Smallville reference.

Herr Logan

08-17-2004, 08:42 AM

I just know Logan is going to be more pissed off by this then by a Smallville reference. [/B][/QUOTE]

This might be true, except I don't understand the joke. :confused:

That's what I get for taking Tylenol PM to try and get myself on a more regular sleeping schedule. Hope this won't hinder my driving lessons. :(

Originally posted by Zev
They're making a point at Wolverine plush toys for small children. I think.

Hell, I already bought a plush Batman doll for my girlfriend a couple years back. Plush Wolverine doesn't piss me off. Most merchandising crap doesn't bother me. That ***** is a dime a dozen (okay, so it's nowhere near that cheap anymore). It's when they make a movie, which will not be one of hundreds of the same franchise, and screw up their responsibilities and opportunities that pisses me off.

Zev

08-18-2004, 04:26 PM

INT. BASEMENT CYCLOTRON ROOM - NIGHT

Anyone else not buying the whole 'cyclotron in the basement' thing?

WEINER is eating a large SANDWICH and a drinking a COKE.

Because people eating things are funny!

OCK
I'll show them... closing the cyclotron
on me... Weiner!

Yes, I hate it when the cyclotron is closed on me weiner. It's almost as bad as having a door closed on your weiner.

WEINER
Yes, Professor...

OCK
Where is he? It's ten past eight o'clock...

Just for you statisticians out there...

A KNOCK

I'd prefer some knockERS.

WEINER
(with mouth full)
That must be him.

Ha! People talking with their mouths full is rude! When they should be acting polite! It's a reversal of our expectations, which is funny!

He opens the door.

PETER
Good evening.

OCK
You are late.

"Oh my god! I can't be pregnant! I haven't, ya know, BEEN with anyone!"

:eek: What the HELL is that line doing there!? It's official, this THING was written by braindead monkeys (and it only gets worse, people!)

WEINER leaves. PETER wanders around.

He goes into the experimental chamber, he overlooks the
SPIDER which is scuttling away and crawls inside the open
WINDOW... and into the chamber.

Bum bum bummmmmmmmmmmmm!

OCK
Okey, dokey, Parker... how would you like
to take Weiner's place... I mean, be my
assistant?

Take Weiner's place? Like we haven't had enough student-teacher affairs (and if someone like me, with my squeaky-clean mind, can do all these quips, imagine how an AUDIENCE would've reacted!)

PETER
Well, Professor, that would be a great
honor, but I'm already working with...

OCK
Rosomorf... that imbecile. Don't you
understand, kid, that I am about to
uncover the greatest discovery since
Einstein came up with his theory of
relativity... The "Anti-Force."

Isn't there any other great discovery then Einsten's theory of relativity? After all, it's only a theory. What about Newton outlining the laws of physics or Mendel discovering genetics?

PETER
Wow! The theory of the Anti-force! You
should go for the Noble Prize Professor...

Once again with this 'Noble' prize business.

OCK
Noble Shmoble, I am going for a much
bigger prize kid. Okey, dokey. Let me
show you, kid, what I got here.

This line would not have been out of place in the Adam West Batman TV show. It's that bad. Seriously, Gene Hackman's Lex Luthor was a bigger threat then this guy.

OCK begins the experiment. We move in past the shattered
WINDOW. We see the SPIDER crawling on the chamber's GEAR.

Gear? Why does a laser need a gear?

OCK
Present maximum anti-force power to date
is 38 percent of theoretical limit. I
have patched in the variable
particle-wave accelerator...

Now he has a particle-wave accelerator? Goddamn, if they're anything like a particle accelerator, Ock has a bigger budget then I thought!

(shrugs)
I will now try to reach 50% power...
(big breath)
And if your paper has any value... I can
use it to get the power I'm missing to
create the anti-force, to break through
and beat any other form of power in our
or any other universe, capish!

Capish (sic)? Goddamn, you had better not let any of the Molina fans see this stuff or there will be a riot. I can imagine Ock (the SHH poster) calling for the building of a Slider so we can travel to parallel universes where this film was made and show the wretched inhabitants Spider-Man 2.

PETER
Sorry, Professor, I can't do it. I gave
my word to Professor Rosomorf.

OCK is angry... Ock now sees the SPIDER. He shoots out a
WALDO to try and crush it but the SPIDER is too fast. The
WALDO slams against the wall of the chamber. He starts to
push every button or switch in sight. A deafening whining
starts.

Our villain, ladies and gentlemen, Buster Keaton!

An URGENT WARNING TONE causes OCK to look at the "Relative
Gravity" DIAL. It is at "4.999999KG" but suddenly the
numbers start to tumble rapidly.

Yeah, what are you doing to do, throw a bucket of water on him? I think every version of Doctor Octopus ever is ashamed to share a name with you. Even that female one during the Clone Saga.

PETER leaves.

Another URGENT WARNING TONE causes OCK to look at the
monitor SCREEN. On it, flashing RED, is the word,
"OVERLOAD!" OCK pushes the RED POWER THROTTLE forward!
The WHINE increases to a PULSE and THROB.

I have a feeling that the authors of this screenplay had a lot of 'hands on' experience with things that 'pulsed and throbbed'.

Zev

08-18-2004, 05:09 PM

http://217.196.238.182/big-tel/promos/xmen/pics/xmentexas.jpg

My mind has officially been blown. I don't know why Cyclops is blowing up a flagpole, why Wolverine is so afraid of giant cowboys, or what possible involvment a pegasus/centaur has, but I think the mortal mind was not meant to know.

Maybe it's a headless horse giving Warren Worthington a blowjob.

Zev

08-18-2004, 08:05 PM

Is golf a sport? I don't think so. The lack of uniforms is one thing, but then lots of sports are played in normal clothes (usually with the prefix 'street' attached). But golf isn't just NOT played in uniforms, it seems to be played in the most visually hideous clothes available.

Not to mention that sports, to me, denotes physical activity and a degree of skill. How much effort does it take to hit a ball on the ground? Honestly? And even what physical activity there could be, walking around the golf course, is replaced by DRIVING AROUND IN A LITTLE GOLF CART. Honestly. I think golf quite deserves its place in the pantheon of lame sorts, alongside speed walking (apparently people who can't really move fast want to race too) and curling.

Zev

08-19-2004, 03:53 PM

I got the CGI Spider-Man off Netflix a week ago. The animation and writing is a big leap over the original Spider-Man TAS. I still laugh whenever that cheesy love theme comes on (which is basically anytime Peter and MJ talk) or they reuse that footage of explosions. Do you know that nobody ever used guns or threw a punch on that show? Not to mention it ended with a cliffhanger and never had an origin story.

I remember reading Untold Tales of Spider-Man as a wee little Zevvie (anyone that suggests I'm still a 'wee little' Zevvie will be banned for abominably unclever humor) and the same problem applied to it that applied to this Spider-Man. Basically no changes can be made to canon, so nothing changes except for original characters. Electro is reinvented as a Columbine-style nerd on a rampage (is this the best villain to have on a show that's core audience is nerds?). The rush to rename him as Electro, which is generally arrived at as a consensus by every character independently, in his second appearance is a bit much though.

The Lizard makes an appearance as your generic beastie (not even a lab coat, although he's given the obvious ability to regrow limbs, which he loses thanks to Harry "It's a trick. Get an ax" Osborn) and is dispatched quickly. His alter-ego, Doctor Connors, was also a bigtime dipstick. However, Raimi goes on to ignore this little 'expanded universe' for his own, considerably nicer Curt in Spider-Man 2. Which is good. I've never liked the idea of 'if you're in a game or TV show, then you'll never be in the movie!' Spider-Man has THE richest rogue's gallery in comicdom, why handcuff him?

Peter Parker's costume changes into Spider-Man get a little ridiculous. At one point I could swear he was going to pull a Lynda Carter.

The voicework was exceptional. Neil Patrick Harris did a surprisingly good job as the titular character, as did Lisa Loeb of having the unenviable job of maintaining a certain sexual tension with Peter Parker without the suspense of the relationship going anywhere (it's kinda like how you know J. Jonah Jameson is never going to learn Spider-Man's identity, no matter how many "Not an imaginary story! Not a dream!" stickers they put on it). The actor playing Harry Osborn has to put up with some surpising bad writing, ALWAYS talking about how Spider-Man murdered his father. Remember the episode of Friends where Joey bought the one volume of an encyclopedia and kept trying to interject subjects that began with V into his conversations? Now imagine if that book had been filled with 'Spider-Man murdered Norman Osborn' (like Jack Torrance's work of literate in The Shining) and you have Harry's character. It gets ridiculous the fourth time Spider-Man saves Harry's life and doesn't just say "BTW, I didn't kill your dad."

The guest stars were even good. My favorite would have to be Jeffrey Combs as (you guessed it) a mad scientist. The episode is mainly geared towards Stooge-style physical comedy, which partially excuses your average nerdy scientist being able to give Spidey a run for his money.

Even MCD shows up. How pathetic is it that he's more menacing when computer animated then in real life? It helps that his animated counterpart doesn't make like Santa Claus, smiling and laughing jovially every ten seconds. I'm going to have to watch Corman's FF and see if the guy playing Doom was more cheesy.

Strangely, Kraven the Hunter appears for the season finale and they reference a prior confrontation with Spider-Man. At first I thought they were talking about the extra X-Box level in the Spider-Man Movie Game, but then the cop (who's only function is to hate Spider-Man, making him pointless when you have both J. Jonah Jameson and Harry Osborn running around. Why not a more sympathetic authority figure like Captain Stacy or Jean DeWolff?) says that they 'trashed Midtown', so so much for expanded universe continuity.

The season finale especially has some good work, packing in tons of action sequences, eye candy, a Stan Lee cameo (c'mon, you know he's gotta make one!) and Kathy Griffith and Jeremy Piven as evil brother and sister (paging Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch!). Lets be honest, none of us would be surprised if either one of those two turned out to be the Anti-Christ. Although I know a ton of people who would protect the Anti-Christ being a woman, although us guys know that when they find out you've slept with their sister...

I'm almost glad that the series ended before having to incorporate Spider-Man 2. Although showing us the first baby steps of Mary-Jane and Peter's relationship would be interesting, having to sustain Harry (while postponing the inevitable dramatic 'talk' between Peter and Harry) would be unmanageable without making Harry the most indecisive character since Hamlet. They could make Harry into a 'Kingpin' sort of character , carrying out his vendetta by hiring Spider-Slayers and making Scorpion and so on, but I think that's more license then Sony would be willing to grant a cartoon. Pity.

I saw a banner ad on IMDB that said Bush was retro and Kerry was metro. That may be true, but I've never heard of a retrosexual.:cool:

ViscaBarcaInter

08-19-2004, 05:47 PM

If you mean the 90's Spider-Man cartoon, they DID have an origin show. Just not in the first episode, strangely enough. It was in the 2 parter where Doc Ock takes control of Spidey and uses him to rob some place. Spider-Man was telling a terminally ill little girl (who had written to him) about how he became Spider-Man. And it involved amusing clips of Peter dreaming about being a giant spider with a human head.

Zev

08-20-2004, 05:06 PM

Quentin suggesting that Fight Club was a 'guy movie' (elitist, probably metrosexual bastard that he is) got me thinking. What IS a guy movie? Obviously, it's the opposite of the 'chick flick', but there must be more to it then that.

The guy movie, in essence, is a film that is specifically designed to appeal to the male mind, to the point of excluding the female gender from viewing enjoyment. It usually falls into the category of action, horror, or comedy, or in the sub-genres of monster movie or slasher. Upon seeing a guy movie, the average (and exceptions exist, believe it or not!) woman will say something like "How can you watch this trash?" Anyone who's watched the Three Stooges around the fairer sex will know what I'm talking about,

Not to worry, friend. Even movies that AREN'T specifically guy movies can be enjoyed by men. Into this category would fall dramas like Donnie Darko or superhero movies like Batman and Spider-Man (Blade is the definition of a guy comic book movie, agreed upon by both nerds and jocks!)

The following signs of a guy movie are not definitive. Like the honor code of a Predator, the guy movie is nebulous. Any red-blooded heterosexual (sorry, fellas who like fellas, force of habit) male knows a guy movie when he sees it, just like pornography.

1. The Guy Movie Is Quotable.

"I ain't got time to bleed!"

"Yippee-ki-yay, mother****er."

"Did somebody step on a duck?"

These are all insanely quotable lines in a guy movie. If you find yourself quoting a movie days or even weeks after you've watched it, you may just be quoting a guy movie.

This is ESPECIALLY true if the quip (that's 'funny part') is delivered immediately before or after the disposal of a bad guy.

Lets see an example delivered by the patron saint of quips, Arnold Schwarzenegger, in the essential guy movie Commando.

Diaz: Okay, Matrix. We have your daughter. There is someone who wishes to talk to you. If you want to see her alive, you'll cooperate, right?

Matrix: Wrong!

I trust you can guess which character Arnold plays. He's the one who shoots Diaz in the forehead. YEAH! The quip can be delivered significantly after the death, but usually only if someone inquires as to said baddie's status. From The Running Man:

Amber: What happened to Buzzsaw?

Buzzsaw was cut in half by a chainsaw.

Ben Richards: He had to split.

2. The Guy Movie Is Funny

Be warned! Not all gross-out comedies are guy movies! I'll be getting to the role of quality in a guy movie later (it's more important then you might think. Compare the original Mortal Kombat, a guy movie, to Mortal Kombat: Annihilation, a piece of crap). But we can all agree that a movie like Blazing Saddles, despite it's lack of scatological references, is a guy movie. That's because the guy movie humor is brash and in-your-face, which the repeated use of language that would make your average affirmative action supporter blush IS.

Something like Animal House or Old School falls under this category, or the Evil Dead movies, Looney Tunes, and Three Stooges with their broad physical comedy focusing on consequence-free violence.

3. The Guy Movie Has No Man-Ass

As the target audience for guy movies, heterosexual males do not enjoy the sight of other men's asses (the tradition of mooning may have confused those bisexual Hollywood types, but hey, they thought cancelling Family Guy was a good idea, what do they know?). They do, however, very much enjoy the sight of attractive, naked women. If the movie has a surplas of the latter, it is probably a guy movie.

And if the movie has a guy's penis in it, FORGET ABOUT IT.

4. The Guy Movie Has A Catchy Tagline

The Running Man's tagline tells us all we need to know.

"A game nobody survives. But Schwarzenegger has yet to play."

More to come...

Zev

08-22-2004, 10:29 AM

Like Warm Apple Pie, The Matrix Reloaded

Dear God, the Wachowski Bros. ****ed up big time. Just like George Lucas working on his prequels without restraint, after the success of The Matrix the WB decided to hands the W Bros the keys to the kingdom. They got home to find that the children were dead, the wine was all drunk, and someone had taken a huge steaming dump right on their bed.

And that was just that stupid, STUPID rave scene.

One of the biggest problems with Reloaded was that we, the audience, were ALWAYS getting lectured at. Neo moves from being lectured by the Oracle to being lectured by the Merovingian to being lectured by the Architect (does anyone have a name without a 'the' in the Matrix?). Makes you feel like a teenager again and NOT in the good 'Donnie Darko' way.

It's an ACTION movie! As in, ACTION! Moving, running, fighting, shooting! Not standing around in super-cool clothes and listening to some pretentious French ******* talk for fifteen minutes. Here's a sample of one of the most eregious examples, truncated for length (you'll thank me later).

Merovingian: You see, there is only one constant, one universal, it is the only real truth: causality. Action. Reaction. Cause and effect.

Ummm... yeah. Duh. We know. This isn't high school. What are you going to talk about next, gravity?

Morpheus: Everything begins with choice.

There's a really bad child birth joke in there somewhere. But hey, this is from a guy who KNOWS there's no way both sides of an argument can be 'pro', so what do I know?

Merovingian: No. Wrong. Choice is an illusion, created between those with power, and those without.

It would not surprise me one bit if this was meant to be a shot at Bush.

Look there, at that woman. My God, just look at her. Affecting everyone around her, so obvious, so bourgeois, so boring.

Ah, bourgeois, watchword of the pretentious!

But wait... Watch - you see, I have sent her dessert, a very special dessert.

I kicked it up a notch! Le BAM!

I wrote it myself. It starts so simply, each line of the program creating a new effect, just like poetry. First, a rush... heat... her heart flutters. You can see it, Neo, yes?

Is he hitting on Keanu now?

She does not understand why - is it the wine? No. What is it then, what is the reason?

This sounds like the opening of a Simon & Garfunkel song.

And soon it does not matter, soon the why and the reason are gone, and all that matters is the feeling itself. This is the nature of the universe.

Good will always win because evil's dumb.

We struggle against it, we fight to deny it, but it is of course pretense, it is a lie. Beneath our poised appearance, the truth is we are completely out of control.

This is followed by the woman having an orgasm, proving Merv's point that when you drug someone and they have a biological response, they're out of control. He's also irresistable to women because he slips them a mickey.

Honestly, couldn't he have just given Neo a drink that made him slap himself (Neo trying to fight it, of course). Not only would it be less embarrassing and uncomfortable for all involved, but we'd get to see Keanu Reeves slap himself, which would really make me feel better about his participation in Bram Stoker's (sic) Dracula. Still, he did forgo starring in Speed 2 and he knows kung-fu, so maybe he's smarter then everyone thinks...

Causality. There is no escape from it, we are forever slaves to it. Our only hope, our only peace is to understand it, to understand the `why.' `Why' is what separates us from them, you from me. `Why' is the only real social power, without it you are powerless. And this is how you come to me, without `why,' without power. Another link in the chain.

Jesus Christ, it reminds me of the worst bits of the Metal Gear Solid series, those unfathomable cutscenes where one of the Snakes blathers on about the military and genetic engineering and the Internet and McDonalds and ARRRRRRRRGH!!!!!!! I just want to SHOOT something! It's an INTERACTIVE videogame, I should have SOME impact on the story, right? RIGHT!?!?

Here's a why for you, YOU STUPID ASSMEAT PRICKS! WHY THE **** ARE WE LISTENING TO THIS **** INSTEAD OF WATCHING SMITH **** *****ES UP?? YOU KNOW, THE COOL, INTERESTING PART OF THE STORY THAT WE ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT!?! ANSWER ME THAT, YOU BASTARDS, ANSWER ME!!!!

I'm cool, I'm cool.

On the bright side, Revolutions was kinda okay, even if Trinity and Morpheus playing second-fiddle to Mary Sue, oh, I mean Seraph, sucked balls. But I submit to you that Mortal Kombat is a better movie then The Matrix Reloaded. It didn't preach to you with 'oh, we read philosophy, we're so smart' (Oh yeah? Then how come you work for WARNER BROTHERS?). It just showed you what you came to see, cool characters and badass fight scenes. And isn't that why we REALLY go to see an action movie in the first place?

Yes. Yes it is.

Zev

08-22-2004, 07:07 PM

VENOM IS NOT GOING TO BE IN SPIDER-MAN 3!

Sorry, I know I'm supposed to let you, the simple-minded Venom fan (good Venom fans already admit to themselves that Venom in a Spider-Man movie will either not happen while Raimi is director or at least will not happen in no. 3), down easy, but I just heard a theory that, for some reason, Raimi and company are going to pull a big twist and have Venom for the villain instead of Harry Osborn.

Yes he's part of a incredible right-wing conspiracy between the Freemasons and the Illuminati to put off finishing the saga he himself has been developing for the past two films (including a badass scene at the end of 2 that all but screams in your ear "HARRY'S GOING TO BE THE GREEN GOBLIN IN SPIDER-MAN 3!") so he can throw in a character he's stated he has a dislike for.

Why? So that Sony can make money! Although from leaving the reins in the hands of Raimi they've made, what, billions of dollars, they're suddenly going to make the mistake every other superhero franchise has made and dictate terms to their golden boy. Because inserting villains without rhyme or reason worked SO well for the Batman series (I'm still trying to figure out how freezing the planet and populating it with Audrey clones from Little Shop of Horrors are NOT mutually-exclusive...).

Not to mention that this is quite possibly the last Spider-Man movie with the entire cast AND Raimi, but no, he's going to drag out the Goblin Saga so he can introduce Venom and let SOMEONE ELSE finish his magnum opus. Just like George Lucas did with Return of the Jedi, where he spent the whole movie having Luke fight Jabba the Hutt and let Renny Harlin make the fourth movie which finally had the throwdown between Vader and Luke that was built-up for the entire trilogy.

Oh, wait...

Jesus. Venom in Spider-Man 3 is, bar none, the stupidest thing I've ever heard (well, that wasn't said by Quentin Black). Anyone who can even entertain the idea in their heads after having seen Spider-Man 2 lacks the simple skill called 'pattern recognition' and will be hit by a car before they can realize it's dangerous ("Hmm, four wheels... moving fast... driver... headlights... what could it be, can it hurt me? ... bumper... license plate...").

But just for the sake of argument, lets say that Raimi and Sony ARE putting in Venom and GG2 is just a massive cover-up. How long do they expect to keep it a secret? This is the age of CHUD and AICN (much as I hate those idiots).

This isn't a Shyamalan twist or Drew Berrymore in Scream we're talking about. This is the VILLAIN OF A MAJOR MOTION PICTURE.

First, you've got to get an actor to play Eddie Brock. Lets say he's a big-name, like say Joaquin Phoenix. You're telling me he's not going to do any late-night talk shows, anything? That he's willing to have his name put lower then James Franco to maintain the illusion? Or will he not be credited at all? While this has precident (Se7en), there's more problems.

The marketing. You're telling me that the trailers will show NO SIGN WHATSOEVER of the villain? Or will they put GG2 or Hob-Gob in there as a red herring (which would be bait and switch advertising and also TOTALLY negate the reason for having Venom in there, which is publicity)? How much will this red herring cost (and don't tell me they can just reuse the old Green Goblin effects, because that will turn off all the fans who are expecting an upgrade)? Will Harry makes an appearance as GG2, get taken out in fifteen minutes, and then we get to see Venom? How disappointing would that be? Only the hardcore Venom fans would be saying "Yay! This is teh cool!!1! VeNOm!1"

Ever heard of Occam's Razor? As Freud would say, "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."

Farradin

08-23-2004, 05:46 AM

Daredevil

Zev

08-23-2004, 01:07 PM

Originally posted by Farradin
Daredevil

Sucks

Zev

08-23-2004, 06:08 PM

I've just posted an ENORMOUS battle between Doc Ock and Spidey in the Spider-Man 3: Legacy thread. Seriously, 2000 more letters and it would not have fit in one post. Don't read it if you dislike having your face ROCKED!

News Of The Moment: Ellen DeGeneres has been cast the titular role for a remake of 'Oh God!' And I just can't bring myself to care.

Am I supposed to hate her? When she was, like, the funniest sidekick ever in Finding Nemo? And by hating her, is that supposed to motivate all the 'Mary Mary Quite Contrary' (or MMQCs, people who will do anything that's contra to Conservative Christians, i.e. vote for Kerry. Seriously, no one is Pro-Kerry, just Anti-Bush) to go see the movie? I suppose I shouldn't be surprised. Controversy sells, especially after The Passion Of The Christ.

But I'm not going to let such an obvious bit of Christian-baiting by. So I'm going to... not see it. That's all. Not write hate-filled diatribes, not join in a protest march, not send threatening letters to the producers. I'm just not going to buy a ticket.

Besides, if they were going to cast a gay actor for God, why not Ian McKellan? And now back to our regularly-scheduled program, the worst Spider-Man screenplay that was officially considered for release (i.e. not a fanfic). And just in time for 'The Green Goblin's Mask Was So Bad..." week, starting next Monday, in which we examine what could quite possibly have led to Organic Dr. Doom. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about.

INT. EXPERIMENTAL CHAMBER - NIGHT

Incredibly lit, the SPIDER is dropping on it's shimmering
WEB-STRAND down toward the 5KG WEIGHT which now GLOWS in
time with the THROB and PULSE.

Anyone else reminded of those Merry Melodies where all the random noises contributed to a piece of music?

INT. THE CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

The MONITOR is flashing "MAXIMUM OVERLOAD -

Not to be confused with Maximum Overdrive... which strangely enough featured the Green Goblin (no ****)!

SHUT DOWN!"
OCK continues with the experiment. And then he sees the
SPIDER!

Ralph Fiennes?

OCK
You! Get out of there, you creeping...

I don't think he's listening, Ock. That might work on dogs and cats (well, not cats), but I don't think on arthropods.

He tries to shove the SPIDER with his hand.

INT. EXPERIMENTAL CHAMBER - NIGHT

Through the BLUE-WHITE we can barely make out OCK on the
other side if the shattered WINDOW.

If the shattered window what?

He sends TWO WALDOS
after the SPIDER. The SPIDER evades him and jumps onto
the PROFESSOR's back. It then climbs onto the PROFESSOR's
neck and bites him.

The gravity DIAL goes to .000001, then pops back up as
OCK'S tiny world goes berserk.

His son got a tattoo?

DIALS spin, crack, explode
or droop liquidly. WIRES dance on the CONSOLE which
erupts like the 4th of JULY.

Tom Cruise is born!

OCK begins to float. His shirt begins to tear away. A
DIAL floats by with its pulled WIRES undulating like a
Medusa.

You mean Gorgon, right? Medusa is a name.

WALDOS smash through the walls and flail like
snakes. OCK'S YELLOW THERMOS distorts and EXPLODES!

Shouldn't have put in those... BAD DATES.

OCK, his hair wild, face locked in a multi-G grimace,

This is much better the original draft, which had his face locked in an O-face.

is
pinned halfway up a wall that is showering the room with
SPARKS.

OCK
(ecstasy above the din)

And I made that O-face comment in jest...

It's an energy storm! Okey! Dokey!

Captain, we won't be able to use the transporters to bring back the away team...

Sorry, force of habit.

We see clearly the SPIDER still stuck to his neck.
The big beast buffets and shakes.

I believe this is the first time a spider has been described as a 'big beast' since Eight-Legged Freaks.

Tubes, junctions,
valves and whatnot fall off, crashing to the floor where
they twitch and writhe with a life of their own.

Things I Learned: Energy storms can give life to inanimate objects.

Then, an enormous EXPLOSION rips a large hole in the
CYCLOTRON's side, sending debris and a HUNDRED MICRO-
STREAMS of ELECTRONIC PARTICLES lancing in our direction.

This was written for an audience wearing 3D glasses.

INT. BASEMENT HALLWAY - NIGHT

Ultimate weirdness!

What happens when Grant Morrison gets to write a limited series in the Ultimate Universe.

The PULSING BLUE-WHITE LIGHT
penetrates first the DOOR of the CYCLOTRON ROOM and then
the very walls! LOCKERS bang, LAMPS POP, the ceiling sags
in a SURREAL, RUBBERY way.

The whole WORLD needs Viagra.

The WALLS sag too! The CYCLOTRON SIGN pivots and embeds
itself in a WALL. A LADDER sinks in the WALL. The BLUE-
WHITE LIGHT dances wildly about in PULSES. Then,
suddenly, it stops... DEAD SILENCE.

As opposed to the fun-loving, life-of-the-party silence.

WEINER comes running
in holding a double decker sandwich and a large bottle of
Pepsi. Weiner enters OCK'S lab, singing, not at first
noticing what's going on.

Jon Favreau going to work on Daredevil.

Suddenly he stops dead.

INT. CYCLOTRON ROOM - NIGHT

A scene out of DALI's surrealistic canvas. There are
things inside of other things.

Bow chicka wow wow!

DIALS look like DALI
watches. This place has been rippled to the max!

The Phenomeonal Photoshop Editor strikes again!

OCK lays face up, unconscious on the floor, a WALDO across
his chest. The SPIDER is weaving its web.

Things I Learned: Spiders will weave webs anywhere, anytime.

CAMERA slowly
DOWN to see OCK. PIPES and WIRES are stuck to his body.

Don't laugh, the same thing happened to Al Gore once.

The WALDO seems to be wrapping him. He wakes up to see
those MECHANICAL ARMS buried in his body. They weave
around him as if they are looking for prey.

A-hunting we shall go, a-hunting we shall go...

He tries to
tear them out, but they seem to be a part of his body,
like his other limbs.

I have no 'other' limbs. I love them all equally.

He screams. Suddenly Weiner sees
OCK.

WEINER
Professor... what happened to you? What
did you do...

What the Jackson 5 said upon seeing Michael during a reunion tour.

Suddenly one of the waldos hits him so strongly that he
flies back and out through the door to the corridor.

If he was the MOST annoying character, this might be more cause for celebration. As it is, he's merely one blade of grass in a lawn.

INT. BASEMENT HALLWAY - NIGHT

WEINER
Oh my God... what happened here...

You'd think he's be more familiar with getting hit by now...

He hears the police sirens approaching, he runs away.

WEINER
I better get out of here.

What Ashley Judd said when she saw the Catwoman script.

The Hero

08-24-2004, 12:37 AM

Originally posted by Zev
Like Warm Apple Pie, The Matrix Reloaded

Dear God, the Wachowski Bros. ****ed up big time. Just like George Lucas working on his prequels without restraint, after the success of The Matrix the WB decided to hands the W Bros the keys to the kingdom. They got home to find that the children were dead, the wine was all drunk, and someone had taken a huge steaming dump right on their bed.

And that was just that stupid, STUPID rave scene.

One of the biggest problems with Reloaded was that we, the audience, were ALWAYS getting lectured at. Neo moves from being lectured by the Oracle to being lectured by the Merovingian to being lectured by the Architect (does anyone have a name without a 'the' in the Matrix?). Makes you feel like a teenager again and NOT in the good 'Donnie Darko' way.

It's an ACTION movie! As in, ACTION! Moving, running, fighting, shooting! Not standing around in super-cool clothes and listening to some pretentious French ******* talk for fifteen minutes. Here's a sample of one of the most eregious examples, truncated for length (you'll thank me later).

Merovingian: You see, there is only one constant, one universal, it is the only real truth: causality. Action. Reaction. Cause and effect.

Ummm... yeah. Duh. We know. This isn't high school. What are you going to talk about next, gravity?

Morpheus: Everything begins with choice.

There's a really bad child birth joke in there somewhere. But hey, this is from a guy who KNOWS there's no way both sides of an argument can be 'pro', so what do I know?

Merovingian: No. Wrong. Choice is an illusion, created between those with power, and those without.

It would not surprise me one bit if this was meant to be a shot at Bush.

Look there, at that woman. My God, just look at her. Affecting everyone around her, so obvious, so bourgeois, so boring.

Ah, bourgeois, watchword of the pretentious!

But wait... Watch - you see, I have sent her dessert, a very special dessert.

I kicked it up a notch! Le BAM!

I wrote it myself. It starts so simply, each line of the program creating a new effect, just like poetry. First, a rush... heat... her heart flutters. You can see it, Neo, yes?

Is he hitting on Keanu now?

She does not understand why - is it the wine? No. What is it then, what is the reason?

This sounds like the opening of a Simon & Garfunkel song.

And soon it does not matter, soon the why and the reason are gone, and all that matters is the feeling itself. This is the nature of the universe.

Good will always win because evil's dumb.

We struggle against it, we fight to deny it, but it is of course pretense, it is a lie. Beneath our poised appearance, the truth is we are completely out of control.

This is followed by the woman having an orgasm, proving Merv's point that when you drug someone and they have a biological response, they're out of control. He's also irresistable to women because he slips them a mickey.

Honestly, couldn't he have just given Neo a drink that made him slap himself (Neo trying to fight it, of course). Not only would it be less embarrassing and uncomfortable for all involved, but we'd get to see Keanu Reeves slap himself, which would really make me feel better about his participation in Bram Stoker's (sic) Dracula. Still, he did forgo starring in Speed 2 and he knows kung-fu, so maybe he's smarter then everyone thinks...

Causality. There is no escape from it, we are forever slaves to it. Our only hope, our only peace is to understand it, to understand the `why.' `Why' is what separates us from them, you from me. `Why' is the only real social power, without it you are powerless. And this is how you come to me, without `why,' without power. Another link in the chain.

[I]Jesus Christ, it reminds me of the worst bits of the Metal Gear Solid series, those unfathomable cutscenes where one of the Snakes blathers on about the military and genetic engineering and the Internet and McDonalds and ARRRRRRRRGH!!!!!!! I just want to SHOOT something! It's an INTERACTIVE videogame, I should have SOME impact on the story, right? RIGHT!?!?

Here's a why for you, YOU STUPID ASSMEAT PRICKS! WHY THE **** ARE WE LISTENING TO THIS **** INSTEAD OF WATCHING SMITH **** *****ES UP?? YOU KNOW, THE COOL, INTERESTING PART OF THE STORY THAT WE ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT!?! ANSWER ME THAT, YOU BASTARDS, ANSWER ME!!!!

I'm cool, I'm cool.

On the bright side, Revolutions was kinda okay, even if Trinity and Morpheus playing second-fiddle to Mary Sue, oh, I mean Seraph, sucked balls. But I submit to you that Mortal Kombat is a better movie then The Matrix Reloaded. It didn't preach to you with 'oh, we read philosophy, we're so smart' (Oh yeah? Then how come you work for WARNER BROTHERS?). It just showed you what you came to see, cool characters and badass fight scenes. And isn't that why we REALLY go to see an action movie in the first place?

Yes. Yes it is. Thats it,you have now been forgiven.:up:

RedIsNotBlue

08-24-2004, 12:50 AM

Didn't anyone else hate the number of times Spiderman's face is revealed in Spiderman 2?

Herr Logan

08-24-2004, 09:42 AM

Originally posted by RedIsNotBlue
Didn't anyone else hate the number of times Spiderman's face is revealed in Spiderman 2?

Oh! Oh! Right here!

*raises hand enthusiastically*

Zev

08-24-2004, 10:05 AM

That sounds more like a personal problem then a Worst Moment. Now that we're expanding the scope of Worst Moments (Matrix Reloaded isn't EXACTLY a superhero movie, but I'd definitely say it fits under the 'inspired by comic books' and... who cares, I'm just a guy who likes to make fun of things other then Daredevil once in a while), we don't have time for nitpicks.

I'm leading by example. Remember what I posted about Ellen Degeneres, my disciples?

Zev

08-24-2004, 11:52 AM

Halle Berry is visiting the set of Batman Begins in Chicago, raising concerns that CINO will have a cameo in BB. Which makes no sense, but hey, when has the WB ever? Actions must be taken...

Bale is in full costumed regalia. Halle Berry walks up behind him.

"Hi, I'm from Catwoman, my name is Halle..."

"You're treading on my dreams, *****."

Using his Cleric training to predict where she's going to 'attack' from, he pulls two guns out of his utility belt and fires backwards under his armpits, shredding her. She falls to the ground, dead, a look of dull surprise locked upon her face as death as it was in life. He looks up at the rest of the cast and crew, gathered in shock, as blue smoke rises from the barrels of his pistols.

"It was my duty," he says simply.

David Goyer begins to applaud slowly. Gary Oldman follows. Pretty soon, the set is filled with the sound of a grateful Hollywood community.

Halle Berry walks up to David Goyer.

Halle: Hi, aren't you the guy who wrote Blade 2?

Goyer: Yes, and I'm directing Blade: Trinity.

Halle: Too bad it won't make any money. Catwoman's disappointing box office proved that the racist fanboys won't accept black people in positions of power. By the way, how did you get that scar on your chin?

Goyer's lower jaw suddenly splits open and latches on to Halle. He begins sucking her blood. Her neck explodes in a shower of gore. Goyer lets her bloodless corpse drop, then pulls out a handkerchef to wipe himself out. Gary Oldman walks up to him.

Oldman: Son of a... I was going to do that!

Goyer: Yeah, right. Francis Ford Coppola's Dracula sucked and not in the good vampire way.

Oldman: ...Yes.

Goyer: I forgive you, though. C'mon, the Count's going to be 'counting' hookers on Fifth Avenue.

Oldman: I'm so there.

Halle Berry walks up to Ken Watanabe.

HALLE: Domo arigoto, Mr. Roboto...

KEN: Using T&A to become top black starlet... you are a dishonor to your family!

He decapitates Halle with a samurai sword. Christian Bale enters.

BALE: Hey, Ken, what was all that 'you are a dishonor to your family' stuff about?

KEN: I don't know, I was just getting into character. You want to get a latte?

BALE: Okay.

Halle Berry walks up to Liam Neeson.

HALLE: Liam Neeson! You starred in The Haunting and Star Wars Episode 1! At last, another sucky actor.

LIAM: There's a difference between an actor who stars in bad movies and a bad actor. Allow me to demonstrate.

He pulls out a lightsaber and cuts Halle in two.

LIAM: The bad actor falls to pieces.

Halle Berry walks up to Michael Caine.

HALLE: Oh, thank God! Everyone else seems to be trying to kill me! But surely a refined, British actor like you wouldn't possibly hurt someone so pretty as moi?

CAINE: That's right. I would never personally commit violence. However, I did star in The Cider House Rules with Tobey Maguire.

A web shoots down from the ceilling and wraps around Halle's neck, pulling her up off the ground.

SPIDER-MAN: I don't take kindly to retards trying to steal my thunder.

CAINE: And in Jaws: The Revenge, with Bruce here.

The web pulls Halle over a large SHARK TANK. Bruce leaps out of the water and bites Halle's legs off.

HALLE: Oh god no! The cuts in the fabric were like a Mau cat's!

Spider-Man drops down beside Caine.

SPIDER-MAN: Well, this isn't the end of her career. After all, she can still show her breasts.

Both men laugh and do that black fist handshake.

CAINE: C'mon, lets get out of here before the flies show up.

Halle Berry walks up to Morgan Freeman.

HALLE: It must be an honor for you to meet me, who has done so much for the black acting community. But hey, Easy Reader, that was a big role on Electric Company.

MORGAN: Yes. We also had Spider-Man.

Halle jumps like a startled cat, then looks around fearfully.

HALLE: You mean... "He Who Must Not Be Named"?

MORGAN: You do know I played God in Bruce Almighty.

A lightning bolt shoots down and hits Halle. She dies, fried to a crisp. Morgan shakes his head.

MORGAN: No, too easy.

With a clap, Halle comes back to life.

MORGAN: Perhaps you've heard of my own crappy movie, called Dreamcatcher. It had a rather interesting alien in it called a ****-weasel. I think you're going to become rather familiar with each other over the next few days.

Halle runs away. Morgan turns to the camera.

MORGAN: Hey, I'm God. I can break the fourth wall.

Morgan ends the post.

Zev

08-24-2004, 01:28 PM

Breaking news! I've been able to secure an interview with PETER PARKER HIMSELF. This came at no small expense, seeing as how he's a fictional character and all. The machine required JMS' penis, Paul Jenkin's left eye, and Joe Quesada's head. Well, not the last thing, but as long as I was there, why not?

Mr. Parker? Mr. Parker, are you there? Can you tell us your feelings on the rejected draft by Cameron and his ilk?

http://www.imgspot.com/u/04/150/19/scream62997.gif

Thank you very much for your time.

RedIsNotBlue

08-25-2004, 07:24 PM

No sorry the number of times Spider-mans face revealed is a bad moment in comic book movies. The one thing the superhero is supposed to keep secret is revealed 3 times in one movie.

Zev

08-25-2004, 11:40 PM

Yeah, well Superman flies around with NO MASK WHATSOEVER and no one calls him on that. Besides, who wants to watch a hero who always wins absolutely?

spideyboy_1111

08-25-2004, 11:56 PM

ne one find it funny how supermans only weakness is an extremely rare rock yet all his villains seem to get it?

RedIsNotBlue

08-26-2004, 12:25 AM

Well with Superman that is just stupidity...I think it is stupid from the start of the comics that nobody could figure out Clark Kent was Superman. I thought we were talking about comic book MOVIES, zev.

Herr Logan

08-26-2004, 08:51 AM

Superman is consistent with his disguise. Spider-Man can't keep his mask on because Sam Raimi and friends lack integrity.

The one and only thing the movies might have over the comics in terms of giving Parker a stronger disguise is the fact that Parker is a spineless, brainless little tool with almost no personality throughout the second movie. Since both Peter Parker and Spider-Man in the comics are quick, witty, and full of personality, one could say... wait... nope, that's no good. The Spider-Man persona in the movies doesn't have much personality, either. No, there's absolutely nothing better about the disguise and alter ego dynamic of the movie Spider-Man. Except of course for the shirt-ripping that I'm sure Sam and friends thought would make us all feel a rush of Supes nostalgia, whereas it actually just kinda feels cheap and forced. A faithful Spider-Man change scene that wasn't a ripoff would be the first time he went into action against a criminal, and he didn't even have his real costume then.

Zev

08-26-2004, 12:01 PM

Originally posted by RedIsNotBlue
Well with Superman that is just stupidity...I think it is stupid from the start of the comics that nobody could figure out Clark Kent was Superman. I thought we were talking about comic book MOVIES, zev.

You're saying in the Christopher Reeve series, Superman wore a mask? Must have missed that part...

RedIsNotBlue

08-26-2004, 12:15 PM

No you are misunderstanding me...I am saying that in the comic it was ridiculous in the first place that nobody could figure out it was Clark Kent so that is one of the worst moments in comic book history not comic book movies lol. I am pretty sure it took many issues of Spider-man for Peter Parker to reveal his identity to 3 main people yet with one movie he did it which is.......say it with me.....ridiculous!

RedIsNotBlue

08-26-2004, 12:19 PM

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Superman is consistent with his disguise. Spider-Man can't keep his mask on because Sam Raimi and friends lack integrity.

The one and only thing the movies might have over the comics in terms of giving Parker a stronger disguise is the fact that Parker is a spineless, brainless little tool with almost no personality throughout the second movie. Since both Peter Parker and Spider-Man in the comics are quick, witty, and full of personality, one could say... wait... nope, that's no good. The Spider-Man persona in the movies doesn't have much personality, either. No, there's absolutely nothing better about the disguise and alter ego dynamic of the movie Spider-Man. Except of course for the shirt-ripping that I'm sure Sam and friends thought would make us all feel a rush of Supes nostalgia, whereas it actually just kinda feels cheap and forced. A faithful Spider-Man change scene that wasn't a ripoff would be the first time he went into action against a criminal, and he didn't even have his real costume then.

Yeah man I gotta agree with you even though I love Maguire for Spidey. In the comics Spider-man shows great intelligence and in the movie he just seems like some bumbling teen with luck.

Zev

08-26-2004, 12:33 PM

Originally posted by RedIsNotBlue
No you are misunderstanding me...I am saying that in the comic it was ridiculous in the first place that nobody could figure out it was Clark Kent so that is one of the worst moments in comic book history not comic book movies lol. I am pretty sure it took many issues of Spider-man for Peter Parker to reveal his identity to 3 main people yet with one movie he did it which is.......say it with me.....ridiculous!

Movies aren't comics. Take the original Spider-Man. Condenses the entire Norman Green Goblin into one movie (along with Peter's origin. If comic books were one movie an issue, Spider-Man would have ended after Uncle Ben died but before the montage, which means no J. Jonah Jameson!). How long was it before Jean Gray died in the X-Men comics (if one issue equaled one movie, we'd have a movie called X-Men Vs. Frankenstein. No joke)?

Comics, by their very nature, have long been status quo. If you pick up a comic, the characters will basically be who they are and do what they do the same time three months later. Cyclops will still be the boy scout team leader, Spider-Man will still be hopelessly in love with Gwen Stacy no matter how many obstacles are thrown in their way. That's beginning to change now. Sometimes don't really have a status quo of "our heroes are together and here's this issue's baddie!" in favor of stories focusing ON the characters. Which is a good thing, as there's only so many villains you can come up with (Turner D. Century, anyone?) and so many times you can bring them out (cough, Venom, cough cough!) before it gets old and you need to give them a rest for a while until you have a brilliant idea about how to bring the Vulture back, deadlier then ever, or a new writer with his own idea for a storyline featuring Boomerang... even if it involves their death (and yes, some villains have to be killed sometimes)!

And how hilarious is it that the old "I blame your alter-ego for killing my father, which is why we can't be together!" cliche was written into Daredevil?

Which brings me to the subject of why Doc Ock is Spider-Man's greatest villain. He was around before Green Goblin, he did more then Green Goblin, he never had the goofy 'relapse' plotline, AND he was the first to kill someone close to Spider-Man, Captain George Stacy. Sure, it was an accident, but so was Spider-Man's webline snapping Gwen's neck. I tell ya, Ock gets no respect, yet Green Goblin runs around in those little Christmas elf booties...

RedIsNotBlue

08-26-2004, 12:50 PM

I never said movies are comics....it doesn't matter what you say. It is ridiculous to cram in 3 unmaskings in one movie. One understandable...two...no way...three....insane.

Zev

08-26-2004, 01:59 PM

Originally posted by RedIsNotBlue
I never said movies are comics....it doesn't matter what you say. It is ridiculous to cram in 3 unmaskings in one movie. One understandable...two...no way...three....insane.

That's your opinion. The very fact that it is reasonably debatable precludes it from entry into Worst Moments (the same with Punisher's fire hydrant. You might not like it, but it fits).

Now the Bat-Nipples or Daredevil killing people, that's a Worst Moment.

Also, status quo shouldn't be confused with PREMISE.

Premise is the X-Men teach a school of young mutants under the guidelines of Professor X, while protecting a world that hates and fears them.

Status quo is Magneto gets together a bunch of villains, calls them the Brotherhood of Mutants XXI, and fights the X-Men, with Wolverine finding out a new tidbit about his past ("I liked sausage patties? THIS CHANGES EVERYTHING!").

Premise is saying these are our characters, here's where they are, what story are we going to tell?

Status quo is "this is the story we're going to tell, it's just like XX-XY but with B instead of A".

Changing the status quo isn't easy. One of the most common (and therefore cliche) ways is to kill off a supporting character. But which was bigger in the Daredevil comics, killing off Karen Page or Daredevil's identity being 'Out'?

Don't mistake the imposing of a NEW status quo (or its kissing cousin, the return to the OLD status quo) for change. For instance, Marvel trying to kill off (remember the key difference betweein KILLING and killing OFF) Mary-Jane a few years ago was not for the storylines it could bring, but for the new status quo of Peter being a swinging bachelor as in the never-were good ol' days. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

A change would have been Peter dealing with the responsibility of being a father (or the actually happened examples of becoming a teacher and Aunt May finding out his identity, although Aunt May should be dead instead of a genetically-altered actress who was put up to it by the same man who happened to kill Peter's girlfriend and is Spider-Man's arch-enemy... what's the connection, mewonders?).

RedIsNotBlue

08-26-2004, 02:17 PM

Your like the Hannibal Lecter of comics lol....Quid Quo Pro! I don't think I know a ****load about comics I just know enough. So it is not my place to debate it to that extreme your taking it too. It was just something that bugged me most about Spider-man 2...it was bad enough a whole train full of New yorkers saw his face but hell...why not let main cast members know his true identity. I think it is just a sign that Raimi doesn't wanna continue this series forever....he tryed to cram so much in the first two. Damn I just realized it would be so much better if this movies were at least an hour longer.

Zev

08-26-2004, 03:11 PM

Originally posted by RedIsNotBlue
Your like the Hannibal Lecter of comics lol....Quid Quo Pro! I don't think I know a ****load about comics I just know enough. So it is not my place to debate it to that extreme your taking it too. It was just something that bugged me most about Spider-man 2...it was bad enough a whole train full of New yorkers saw his face but hell...why not let main cast members know his true identity. I think it is just a sign that Raimi doesn't wanna continue this series forever....he tryed to cram so much in the first two. Damn I just realized it would be so much better if this movies were at least an hour longer.

I see it as avoiding the status quo. Think of the MTV Spider-Man series (but not that assclown Lizard they gave us). As I've said, the main problem with that was that none of the characters changed. Mary-Jane couldn't find out Peter's secret and neither could Harry. Now we have the stage set for a Green Goblin done RIGHT ('we have the technology' as well as now knowing what works and what doesn't) and a growing relationship between Peter and Mary-Jane instead of a boring 'will they/won't they' thing (good idea for a TV show, bad idea for movies!).

Think of the Superman movies. What does everyone hate about no. 1? Superman turned back time (this notion deserves a lot more razzing then it's received). And if you can accept that, you can accept three unmaskings.

What about no. 2? Well, Clark Kent wiped out Lois Lane's memories of him telling her he's Superman! Aside from the large problem of giving SUPERMAN more powers (and nonsensical ones at that! Much as you may hate organics, Superman's deus ex machinas are ten times worse, especially that "You have become a human now and it's irreversible... oh wait, you have a get out of jail free card, go ahead and kick some Zod ass!"), this is quite simply a cheat. And while a cheat may work sometimes with supporting characters (more on this later), doing it with a main character only makes him or her look like an idiot, especially if it's repeated ad nausem.

The early Spider-Man comics seemed to delight in teasing with the outing of Peter Parker. One scene (which, as I've pointed out in the Spider-Man 2 forum, was translated right into the movie) featured Aunt May walking into Peter's room just as he had arrived as Spider-Man and taken off his mask. Like in the movie, he evaded discovery by sticking to the ceiling. Only Norman Osborn was added for more suspense. His aunt finds out he's a superhero... so what? But his love interest, best friend, and arch-enemy finds out he's a superhero? Whoa nelly! And in classic horror fashion, the 'false scare' is followed shortly by the 'real scare'. Which just goes to show you that when the chips are down, call on a horror movie director. He'll bring in your LOTR movies, the hobbit, the Ring, the whole damn thing.

A 'comedy' story featured Spider-Man being pursued by a 'Spider-Slayer' robot commissioned and piloted by J. Jonah Jameson, after being encouraged by Peter (long story, but in the end his prank backfired on him). Peter admitted to being Spider-Man when he thought he was dying, but when he found out it was the flu he had the Prowler impersonate him.

Green Goblin himself tied up and unmasked Spider-Man, much in the way that his son did in the films (which set us up for possible the GREATEST CAMEO OF ALL TIME! Seriously, how fair is it that Dafoe's better as a villain in that ONE SCENE then MCD is in all of Daredevil... the fact that he's out of the Green Ranger suit might have something to do with that!). Captain Stacy figured out Spider-Man's identity, as did Mary-Jane (although that came much later in the series). So did Aunt May, but that was primarily a response of her FINALLY going from the idiotic woman who fawned over Doc Ock and thought Spider-Man was a hateful creep to a wise old lady with more then two brain cells to rub together (once again, her being brought back instead of Baby May is a prime example of going back to the status quo and why it isn't any better then a new status quo)

Harry Osborn found out Spider-Man's identity in possibly the most idiotic way possible, finding the spider suit while Peter was in the shower, literally right next door. Because for some reason Peter's spider sense isn't set off by 'friends'. Who knew ESP came with IFF identification?

Keep in mind that if we accept Ock surviving drowning, how big a stretch is it for him to forget Spider-Man's identity? He really did seem out of it and if he was almost drowned, that could cause brain damage consistent with short-term memory loss. In other words, he forgets the events of the last few hours and starts pulling more ****. I did this in my own fanfic (although there Ock becomes even MORE of a villain, taking control of his tentacles and killing 'not just people who get in his way, but people who even THINK about getting in his way') and no one's complained yet.

And is it just me or is JMS a bit overhyped? Seriously, am I the only one who rolled my eyes when Old Mysterious Guy With Superpowers (tm EVERY FRICKIN' COMIC EVER!) said 'Which came first, the spider or the radiation?'

Seriously, when will Marvel learn to leave origins alone instead of turning the simple story of a young but weak patriot being given incredible powers to fight Nazis into 'OH MY GOD! AMERICA USED TO BE RACIST (well, still is, but not as much. Now we have REVERSE racism, which is better somehow)! WHO KNEW!?!'

First you apologize for turning the Falcon into a blaxploitation pimp, hypocrites.

And then Spider-Man says that Morlun (in the hyperbole to make him THE GREATEST FOE SPIDER-MAN HAS EVER FACED!) is the only guy who's ever pissed him off, perhaps remembering his remarkable calm and restraint after Gwen Stacy died.

And yet ANOTHER tease about Spider-Man possibly becoming a killer and yet another cheat for him to duck the responsibility of making a choice. You know, for once I'd like to see Spider-Man just flat out punch THROUGH someone's chest or Batman to throw a Batarang right into the Joker's forehead. If they keep INSISTING on escalating the villain's misdeeds, they're going to have to escalate the heroes too before it gets outrageous. Seriously, does anyone think the standing order on Red Skull shouldn't be 'shoot on sight before he blows up another hotel!'

In fact, I'd love to see that more. Captain America hauls Red Skull into SHIELD after beating the **** out of him (but refraining from killing, because he is pure and good and blah blah blah... a Dresden apologist) and then Nick Fury pulls out his sidearm and blows Skull's brains out immediately, then says "Military tribunal gave him the death penalty in absencia."

CAP: Cool. You wanna go out and get some pizza?

THAT WOULD ROCK! And you can't tell me nobody was a little glad when Wolverine FINALLY chopped Magneto's head off. I think just about everyone was saying "FINALLY!" Because how lame would it be for Dr. Doom to pull the **** he did in Unthinkable and then for Reed Richards to say "Oh, okay, I'll leave you alone to run your country." No, he finally took the initiative!

Of course, I'd also like to see Cap make disparaging comments about Vietnam 'pacifists' ("Yeah, it takes a lot of guts to run up to Canada instead of serving your country.") and the Avengers public relations trying to cover for him.

Zev

08-26-2004, 03:30 PM

EXT. THE EMPIRE UNIVERSITY - NIGHT

The long SCREAM segues to a POLICE SIREN.

What scream?

A COP CAR pulls
to a halt in front of the COLLEGE. Many NYPD CARS are
already there, along with a NUCLEAR REGULATORY VAN,

Doc Brown's trying to time travel again...

some
AMBULANCES, a VAN from the ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY
and TWO TV VANS. ROZ runs across the lawn.

Slip n' slide! WOO!

POLICE STRUGGLE to hold back the crowd of press, students
and general gawkers.

As well as the Mongol hordes.

J. JAMESON pushes to the front of the mob in time to see
TWO COPS hustle a BUGLE PHOTOGRAPHER back into it.

I was just thinking to myself about Daredevil. I was wondering... does he ever do anything heroic?

After all, he is a superHERO. Yet, his actions are more reminiscient of a one-man gang.

Consider his first fight. He straps on that ridiculous leather fetishist suit not to prevent wrongdoing (or stop it in the act), but to avenge it. Since he's avenging a client of his, this doesn't really count as justice. Obviously, he knows her personally, knows the trauma she's gone through. You've already heard my reasoning on why he was probably out more to 'punish' Quesada for beating him in court then to avenge the girl.

In the first place, Matt is suing Quesada on his client's behalf. Even if they win, he can only expect a cash windfall. A prison sentence is unlikely and a death penalty is impossible under existing laws. So Matt supercedes BOTH laws he ascribes to, both Man's (in which the punishment for rape is prison time) and God's (an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth. He should only have killed Quesada if Quesada had killed someone). Perhaps Matt only wanted to bilk Quesada before killing him, with his obviously heinous. What will he do next, rife through Stilt-Man's wallet?

His second use of his superpowers, in a way that greviously undermines his ability to function as a superhero by risking the revelation of his identity, is not in service of any higher cause (contrast this with Spider-Man, who, in his civilian identity, takes actions to save lives when they're in immediate danger and he has no time to change into his costume, as well as being willing to reveal his identity to save lives) but to win a girl. A girl who, by the way, has quite unambiguously displayed her disinterest in him and said NO. I don't know why a man who just represented a woman who was raped and beaten is coming on so strong, to the point of getting into a kung-fu fight with Elektra (she throws the first punch, err, kick. Why would he even want to be with someone who's so rude and willing to attack a blind man? It doesn't matter how sexy she is when he's BLIND!).

In another example, he attacks one of Kingpin's men. He has no grudge with the Kingpin persay, but merely wants to protect his turf. He's not operating out of a hatred of crime, but rather base territorialism.

He sets out to save Elektra's father, but fails at that. In fact, he fails SO spectacularly that Elektra blames him for her father's death. His actions in deflecting this are acutely unheroic, as he seems perfectly happy to let Elektra drift away from him on her own course of vengeance and unhappiness rather then TELL HER THE TRUTH. That's called cowardice.

Later, he appears to give up being Daredevil (I can't really tell), until he's told that his little girlfriend is in danger (it should give you a measure of how underused Joey Pants is that the revelation of Kingpin killing entire families originally came from a corrupt cop,but was changed so that Urich had a bit more screentime and to try to fool the audience into believing he had anything to do with the rest of the story). Once that happens, he takes to the rooftops and meets Elektra. Again, instead of revealing his identity he places his own selfish secret first and tries to convince her that he didn't kill her father (once again, Spider-Man took off his mask to convince Ock to do the right thing). He once again fails, and also fails to save Elektra from Bullseye (he's not able to do much more then flop around like a dead fish, yet when his own ass is in danger...)

Even the main confrontation, with Kingpin, is not to stop him from committing crimes (he seems to have foreknowledge that the police will arrest Kingpin, so why attack him? Just to add injury to insult?) but to avenge dear old dad. Furthermore, it's incredibly stupid. It's like if I had just finished a pie-eating contest and had to take a huge dump, but then volunteered for another pie-eating contest.

His one action that might be construed as 'saving' is to help a boy whose father is abusing him. Once more, his actions tend more towards punishment (at no time does he say "If you ever touch your son again I'll kill you" or something of the sort. Plus, it seems as if he's merely continuing the assault that he began when his 'turf' was violated. Saving the child was just a lucky coincidence), as he savagely beats the father and is left dumbly assuring the kid that "I'm not the bad guy". Yup, that's the kinda guy I'd like to be my lawyer. Or attorney.

However, this is more then canceled out by the fact that Matt IGNORES A CALL FOR HELP TO HAVE SEX. Can you imagine if Spider-Man was like this?

GREEN GOBLIN: We are who we choose to be! Choose!

He lets go of the cable car and Mary-Jane. Spider-Man shoots a web out and catches Mary-Jane, then pulls her up.

SPIDER-MAN: Hey babe, what's your sign?

By incredible happenstance, the cable car happens to land and balance on a girder, giving Spider-Man more time to save them.

MARY-JANE: Spider-Man, look! You can still save them!

SPIDER-MAN: Eh, whatever. Hey, I think we've got time for a quickie.

So, congratulations to you, Daredevil! Heroism has a new name... people who sometimes try (and fail spectacularly).

RedIsNotBlue

08-27-2004, 04:15 AM

Jesus Christ dude....you have a lot of free time don't you?

Zev

08-27-2004, 12:06 PM

Yes, but I never use my powers for good... only for awesome.

RedIsNotBlue

08-27-2004, 12:08 PM

:rolleyes:

Zev

08-27-2004, 01:37 PM

INT. BASEMENT HALLWAY - NIGHT

Skewed, strange, surreal, PETER stares at the weirdness
and fumbles with his CAMERA.

So THIS is what it's like to work on a Tim Burton movie!

He snaps off a few shots,
then freezes when he hears a familiar voice.

ROZ (V.O.)
(filtered through face mask)
Take it easy. Take it easy with him.

Don't cross the beams!

THORKEL (V.O.)
Take him away and never bring him back!

What the WB should have said about Joel Schumacher after Batman Forever.

Now we see ROZ and THORKEL following 2 GUARDS carrying OCK
in a stretcher. They all wear RADIATION SUITS.

Must've been hard to get one on Ock...

A waldo
sneaks out from under the sheet and hits Thorkel, as fast
as lightning. He falls back. He's covered with a SHEET
and attached to LIFE SUPPORT EQUIPMENT.

Wow, great medical response there.

Octavius moans.

THORKEL
What was that?

ROZ
What was what?

Man, first Weiner and now Thorkel barely notice getting hit by Ock? Is he the proverbial "Hey, can you tell your mom to stop hitting me?" type?

THORKEL
What hit me?

ROZ
What hit you?

What hit me?

THORKEL
I don't know. It was so fast.

ROZ
You're going to be fine, Otto.

Oh, so Thorkel doesn't get any attention?

PETER gets off a shot and ducks into the MEN'S room
leaving the DOOR ajar for a peak.

A WALDO slips down from the SHEET. PETER'S eyes go wide
at the sight. What in the hell has happened here?

Ock tried to turn his tentacles into a sex toy and things went horribly wrong...

INT. MEN'S ROOM - NIGHT

The URINALS are twisted in bizarre shapes.

Now women can use them!

PIPES are
exposed and spout WATER. The MIRRORS look like something
out of a funhouse. PETER hears the STRETCHER go by.
PETER goes to the DOOR of OCK'S Lab and cracks it. PAN up
to the SPIDER, GLOWING softly,

Eat at Joe's, eat at Joe's, eat at Joe's...

dangling from a SHIMMERING
STRAND above PETER.

I thought the spider was building a web back with Ock? How'd it get here? Was that web it's summer home?

As PETER looks out at the STRETCHER, the SPIDER drops on
his neck. He reacts by swatting it away. Bad move.

Or as Arnold would say, BIG MISTAKE!

The GLOWING SPIDER now squats malevolently on the back of
PETER's hand. He stares at it transfixed.

What, did Sergio Leone show up to direct this bit? I don't stare transfixed at any kind of arthropod when they're ON MY FRICKIN' SKIN, MAN!

It bites.

A short, but accurate description of this script.

PETER
Ow!!!

PETER throws the SPIDER to the ripply tile floor where it
scuttles unsteadily out the door.

Man, is everyone in this film wasted?

Sweat starts to bead on PETER'S face. He shakes his head
to clear it. His vision becomes uncertain. He lurches

"You rang?"

against a WEIRD SINK.

PETER'S POV is not just uncertain, not just fuzzy, not
just moving in and out anamorphically. It's all of that!

This is how Robert Downey Jr. sees the world.

GUARD (V.O.)
(heavily distorted)
Hey! What are you doing here, kid?

Shouldn't it be (O.S.) for offscreen? Unless the Guard is suddenly narrating this movie...

PETER turns to see a UNIFORMED GUARD distorted by his
crazy vision.

By uniform, do they mean radiation suit? In which case he should be taking Peter for decontaimination or some sort of medical check-up, otherwise he could probably sue the school for exposing him to radiation (don't laugh, you know it's possible).

PETER
I feel a little funny...

GUARD
(heavily distorted)
Yeah? Well, I ain't laughing. Get out...
Just get out of here...

The Guard is SO getting fired once they find out that he left a kid exit the premises without getting a full check-up...

EXT. FIRE DOOR - NIGHT

It bangs open. The GUARD throws PETER out and then throws
his BACK PACK at him.

"And then, Judge, the guard threw me and my backpack outside."

"Did you say that you felt symptons of leukemia at that time?"

"I said I felt a little funny, yes..."

GUARD
(still distorted)
You get yourself over to the Police lines.

PETER
(ultra wooz)
Right. Police lines.

Ultra Wooz? Is that some kind of Swedish Superhero?

EXT. UNIVERSITY - NIGHT

PETER melds into the crowd. As in a dream, JAMESON
appears at his side.

Also as in a dream, Peter is completely naked.

JAMESON
(distorted)
Okay, scoop, whaddaya got?

Ah, he's not heavily distorted like the Guard?

PETER
I... got pictures of the Professor... in
there... it's so strange in there... so
bizarre...

Bizarro, one might say?

OCK: Halle is haut! You all is haturz!

Hey, with the way they've been writing him, it wouldn't surprise me.

JAMESON
(winks)
Good job, kid. Bizarre is what we need.
Pick this up in the morning.
(holding up his camera)
There'll be two crisp twenties tucked
inside.

Goodbye, Mr. Jameson. This is the last we'll see of you in the movie. That's right, gang, no 'Threat or Menace', no Robbie Robertson, no nothing. But that isn't the worst of it, OH NO...

He hurries off. PETER peers after him and all of a sudden
his vision corrects to a perfect focus.

Better 1 or 2?

The sweat is
gone. He's okay. He makes his way through the crowd to
the street.

We TRACK with PETER as the madding throng recedes behind
him. He turns a corner. He hears a SIREN.

Movie Police. We're going to have to stop this script from being filmed.

An AMBULANCE screeches around the corner. It nearly hits
PETER who leaps to avoid it.

EXT. BRICK BUILDING - NIGHT

PETER'S cheek is pressed against the brick. He opens his
eyes and sees that he's hanging onto the side of the
building like a spider.

Like a Spider-MAN, one might say? BWAHAHAHAHA! (don't laugh, folks, this is the part that almost/kinda made it into the final movie. And when it's so inconsequential a part, you know how much this script sucked...

And he's three stories up!
He looks down and sees the street thirty feet below him!
And the Ambulance which he jumped over is driving away.

So first the Guard throws away a person who might have radiation poisoning, then the Ambulance doesn't check to see if it ran over the guy who was walking down the street? Geez, do they train these people at all?

He tries a downward step, but a BRICK dislodges and
crashes to the sidewalk. He takes an upward step. And
then another.

Tentatively at first, and then with growing confidence, he
"crawls" to the roof of the building.

Why is crawls in quotation marks? That's what he's doing. I don't think you have to be so sarcastic about it, mister.

At the top he
gropes for a RAILING

There's a bad Arnold Schwarzenegger joke in there somewhere, but I'm not going to get into that because the man made both Terminator and Predator.

and slips. He dangles eight stories
above the street. Then, with a grunt, he vaults to the
roof one-handed.

EXT. THE ROOF - NIGHT

PETER is flat on his back, staring at the stars.

Really makes you feel small and insignificant, doesn't it? Well, good, because you are!

Why didn't he say spider? So we could set up this joke, coming in for a landing in 3... 2... 1...

AUNT MAY
Oh! I get it, you mean a love bug.

Herbie's gone berserk!

PETER
No... No... A spider...

AUNT MAY
Peter, did you at least talk to her?

"Listen, you stupid whore, I'm trying to tell you that I was bit by a spider! I may die!"

PETER
Aunt May, listen to me. I got bitten on
the hand... by a poisonous spider.

AUNT MAY
She bit you?

"Yes, Liz is really a poisonous spider. She calls herself the Black Widow and says I'm the reincarnation of her past love, Pete Palmer."

PETER
No. I was in the bathroom and...

Dear Playboy, I never thought this would happen to me but...

AUNT MAY
Oh, you did it in the bathroom?

Man, Aunt May's a dirty old broad!

Peter,
this is craziness, why don't you use your
bed?

Did she just encourage Peter to sleep with Liz? HOW MUCH ARE YOU GOING TO **** WITH THIS CHARACTER FOR CHEAP JOKES!?

You're up all night. You're in the
radioactive labs.

Being Krypto's vet isn't easy...

You never take time to
eat or sleep. Am I right?

Huh? Huh? It's funny cuz it's true!

PETER
Yes, Aunt May.

INT. PHONE BOOTH - NIGHT

AUNT MAY (V.O.)
Did you eat something today?

Wait, what happened to filtered? Now Aunt May is narrating?

PETER
Yes, Aunt May.

AUNT MAY (V.O.)
Okay, Peter go back to bed, and remember
we love you.

Even if we show it by trying to live vicariously through you.

PETER
And I love you too, Aunt May.
(hangs up)
And by the way, I got a mess of super
powers today.

Considering the scene in Spider-Man 2, this is kinda a scary coincidence. Like travelling to an alternate Earth where the Nazis won WW2 (aka, where America DIDN'T help England).

Exit booth. He BANGS the PHONE BOOTH.

Geez, wait till you get home and have a box of Kleenex at least...

Goes out and--
jumps lightly onto the phone booth roof.

Wait to keep your superpowers secret, dumbass.

The Hero

08-29-2004, 02:47 PM

Well,at least that script is so out-there that we can make fun of it;it would of,at the most,gone straight-to-video and been forgotten.The James Cameron script,on the other hand,would of been a big-budget Hollywood blockbuster.

And the Ock script is only an awfully written B-movie treatment of the charactor.James Cameron's script was a pure bastardization of the charactor.

Herr Logan

08-29-2004, 07:49 PM

This God damn revamp has cleared my subscribed list, so here's me trying to set things partially right. I don't see a link, so I hope they give me the option once I post.

Zev

08-30-2004, 12:17 AM

And now back to our regularly-scheduled program after that rude interruption.

INT. HOSPITAL OPERATING ROOM - NIGHT

OCK is prepped for surgery. GOWNED PERSONNEL hurry about
with a feverish urgency. The CHIEF SURGEON checks the
SENSORS attached to OCK'S head. These seasoned
professionals are astonished and frightened.

Once again, like looking at a mirror universe. In which case we are certainly in the Agony Booth.

CHIEF SURGEON
(whispers)
Look at these brainwave readings. The
mental activity is ten times of any
normal man...!

Surprisingly, Ock will continue to act like a complete dumbass despite this (totally unexplained) intelligence power-up. And is anyone else thinking of a Leader-type headgrowth to correspond with this increased mental activity? Or is he just psychic now? All for a stupid throw-away line...

BRAINMAN
(whispers)
Equipment malfunction...?

CHIEF SURGEON
(whispers)
Hell, yeah... his.

I didn't know they were giving him a prostate exam to. Get it? Equipment? Prostate?

(checks Ock's chest)
My God... I thought I'd seen everything...

But look at the size of these man-boobs! Apologies to Alfred Molina... (who wouldn't touch this dreck with a ten-foot pole).

SURGEON #2
(whispers)
But this is beyond medicine. This is
madness...!

Mountains of madness! But what is... BEYOND THE MOUNTAINS OF MADNESS!?!

OCK lays bare chested, face up, all FOUR WALDOS splayed.
He is a true cyborg.

Would you say resistance is futile?

Part man, part machine. Part
organic, part molybdenum steel.

Ladies and gentlemen, the precursor to Organic Doom. Hmm, the premier Marvel cyborg is Deathlok, so I dub thee... Death-Ock!

NURSE
(leaning in, blitzed)
It is so freaky...

CHIEF SURGEON
(stern for the staff's
sake)
Okay, lets stop yakking and get cracking.
I want to go in at the upper thoracic.
Then we'll work our way around.
(slaps Ock's shoulder)
Hang in there, man.

It'd be easy if he had a kitzy motivational poster showing a kitten hanging from a branch.

INSERT: The WALDO nearest the slap moves ever so slightly.
The triangular CLAW rotates a quarter turn and then turns
back.

CHIEF SURGEON
Scalpel! No... no... a larger one...
the largest we have!

Isn't there a different kind of medical tool you use when a scalpel isn't big enough? Like a bonesaw or something? And why does he need one so big? Is he compensating for something?

She slaps a HUGE ONE into his palm. He takes a deep
breath and goes to work. MASKED heads gather round him.
The SCALPEL is poised at the line where skin meets steel.
We make an incision. The INSTRUMENTS go crazy. WARNING
BELLS and BUZZERS sound.

You're our one-millionth surgery!

HEAD NURSE
Kill the alarms!

BRAINMAN
He's going off the chart!

Brainman? Sounds like a hero from an educational comic book. "I defeat evil... WITH MATHEMATICS!"

A WALDO flashes around the steel leg of the operating
TABLE and clanks tight!

CHIEF SURGEON
Mop. Mop! Sutures and clamps! Hurry up!

Will someone get George Clooney in here!?

SURGEON #2
We're losing him. Defibrillate!

A HEART MACHINE is rushed in. They work frantically.

CHIEF SURGEON
Zap him!

Consider him Zapped! (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0084945/)

BRAINMAN
Stabilizing alpha waves...

Watch out for gamma rays! And cosmic rays!

SURGEON #2 applies the CARDIAC SHOCK PADS.

INT. HOSPITAL ROOM - DAY

NURSE
You have a visitor, Doctor...

Huh? What?

She leaves OCK and THORKEL alone.

What!? We cut from Death-Ock in the middle of a crash cart to him recovering? Even in Daredevil's darkest hour there was not such ineptitude.

THORKEL
(enjoying this)
Octavius, I'm afraid I have bad news for
you.

OCK
The cyclotron is damaged...

THORKEL
What used to be the cyclotron was
permanently shut down this afternoon.

But I do have some good news. I saved a bunch of money on car insurance by switching to Geico.

God, I'm good.

OCK
But my work!

THORKEL
Your work is a disaster! Look at
yourself!

Old man, take a look at your life!

OCK
Myself? I don't matter.

They no longer matter! We are the future, not them!

Nobody matters
anymore. To enter a new dimension we
must first destroy our own...

You know, he's gonna feel like an ass if he does that and the new dimension doesn't have Predator on DVD.

THORKEL
What are you saying?

OCK gets off his bed throwing away his sheet waving with
his 4 WALDOS and 2 arms.

As long as he's not waving his three legs...

OCK
Destroy life. Life is... insignificant.
Bags of sleepy, sluggish flesh. What
would you say?

To everyone who hates the chip, I give you this. Ock gets in accident, goes insane. Not very impressive, is it?

THORKEL
Oh, my God, what are those horrible
things sticking from your body?

They're called nipples, Earl, jesus.

OCK
(gets more and more excited)
Thorkel, if I told you that for one
moment in time I broke all the laws! For
one brief glorious moment, I broke
through to the other side. I saw... I
felt... I became creation.

This is how people come to believe in Scientology.

THORKEL
What on Earth are you rambling about?

OCK
Destiny!!!

Multiple exclamation points. There's good grammar for ya...

My destiny! I see it all so
clearly now. Universal destruction, yes.
All I need is the power...

Well, you're screwed, because someone else has the power.

http://www.he-man.org/cartoon/cmotu/index-cmotu.jpg

then I can
destroy this illusion you call life. It
is my destiny to lead us to the light!

The Mr. T story.

THORKEL
You're a madman.

OCK
And you are a fool. I will end the
universe as you know it. And in that
final moment... I'll laugh my ass off
while you're kissing yours goodbye!

I feel like crying. I'm going to go listen to a country ballad about your truck breaking down, your wife leaving you, and your dog dying.

I'm back. But that line still pains me. It's almost as bad as the existence of a Baby Geniuses franchise. This is my personal crucifixtion here. I wish Ock was real so he could cramp the author's word processors up their asses.

"How else can I put it? 'You're being let go.' 'Your department's being downsized.' 'You're part of an outplacement.' 'You're life's going in a different direction.' 'We're not picking up your option.' Take your pick. I've got more."

You are
history, Doctor Octavius. And I couldn't
be more pleased to be the first to tell
you this good news...

You know the black guy in the horror movie who's smoking a joint? He probably has better life insurance coverage then this guy.

A WALDO shoots up and grabs THORKEL by the throat. He
GASPS and SCREAMS silently as the telescoping WALDO lifts
him off his feet. He rises until his head is just inches
from the ceiling.

Then OCK smiles and slams THORKEL'S head through the
ceiling. PLASTER rains down. THORKEL'S legs scissor and
kick and then go limp. OCK throws his dead body on to the
bed, and covers him with the WHITE SHEETS.

OCK
Okey, dokey.

Whatever small menace Death-Ock gained from actually killing someone was just forever revoked by that STUPID catchphrase.

REISS
Who said anything about watching a
wrestling match? You're here to win a
wrestling match!

Dear God, this thing is giving me a headache. Has the author (I'm beginning to ascribe to that word the same undertones reserved for words like 'Nazi' and 'PETA') forgotten that Reiss DOESN'T KNOW PETER HAS SUPER-STRENGTH?

PETER
Me? You must be kidding.

REISS hustles PETER inside.

REISS
You hop around. You know, the way you
did last night. Your opponent gets tired.
He falls down. The ref counts to three,
you win, and we pick up a thousand bucks.

Is it wrong that this is nearly the exact same plan that Homer came up with in an episode of the Simpsons, only replace 'hopping around' with 'stand there and take the punishment'? Yes, yes it is.

INT. CATACOMBS MADISON SQUARE GARDEN - NIGHT

We can hear the CROWD screaming at something in the
background as REISS leads PETER to an employee WASHROOM
and shows him the BOX.

REISS
You're really gonna love this.

Peter, do you like gladiator movies?

PETER
Look, really, I don't know...

REISS
You don't have to know. I know enough
for both of us.
(pause)
Change in there.

Lots of sleazy agents have the foresight to prepare costumes that can survive superheroic exploits for untested talents? This is what Jabootu would call a 'left-handed explanation'.

He slaps the BOX against PETER'S chest and all but pushes
him inside.

INT. WASHROOM - NIGHT

PETER takes the suit out of the BOX. It is the SPIDER-MAN
SUIT!

This is the big reveal? A guy taking a suit out of a box? Pathetic.

He looks at it and shrugs. Then he begins to
struggle into it.

Wait, we cut away before he gets naked, right? Right?

PETER is looking at himself in the MIRROR. He is dressed
in all but the MASK. And he looks terrific!

What're the odds, eh?

He flexes.
He smoothes his hair. He's starting to get into it.

INT. THE ARENA - NIGHT

CRUSHER COLE is destroying an opponent.

Which brings me to an interesting note. In both the final movie and Amazing Fantasy 15, Peter fought his opponent in rather sad-sack outfit. Old clothes with a web-like mask in the comic and the famous 'wrestler Spidey' costume in the movie. So not only is this plot variant stupid, it's also unfaithful to the comics (and brings an obvious question of how easily related would be a wrestler calling himself Spider-Man and a crime-fighter calling himself Spider-Man IF THEY BOTH WORE THE SAME COSTUME).

INT. THE CATACOMBS - NIGHT

REISS winces as the CROWD CHEERS and BOOS.

PETER
(comes out)
How does it look? I feel like it's
Halloween.

Reading this script, I feel like it's April Fools' Day!

REISS
Cover your face with the mask.

PETER
Why?

REISS
Mystery, my friend. Nobody should know
who you are...

Jesus ****ing Christ! AND PEOPLE COMPLAIN ABOUT PETER NEEDING A DOCTOR TO TELL HIM ABOUT LOSING HIS POWERS! WHAT THE **** IS THIS!? SOME MARTY SUE IS GIVING HIM A COSTUME AND TELLING HIM TO HAVE A SECRET IDENTITY!? WHAT NEXT!? WILL HE BE GIVING PETER WEB-SHOOTERS!?!?

INT. THE RING - NIGHT

CRUSHER COLE is doing a big flexing number and the CROWD
is going wild. There are MTV CAMERAS and SIGNS and
BANNERS proclaiming the "SLAMMIES" everywhere.

Which is certainly appropriate, as if this were made, all the celebrities who love Spider-Man would feel as if they'd been Punk'D.

Ah, who am I kidding? I'm a VH-1 man. I love the eighties.

RING ANNOUNCER
And now, a new challenger, for the
thousand dollar fight, weighing in at one
hundred and fifty pounds... from parts
unknown!

I prefer 'WCW Special Forces' meself.

Here is the Amazing...
Mysterious... Incredible Superman...

Hey, guys? You might want to keep me away from any sharp objects or rope for the next few days. This script is destroying what little faith I have in the human race.

The CROWD BOOS the slender newcomer who climbs awkwardly
through the ropes. Rock music blares. TWIN REDHEADS in
RED BIKINIS ring a bell.

Those twin redheads are my new favorite characters.

CRUSHER COLE and SPIDER-MAN circle. COLE is twice
SPIDEY'S size. SPIDEY spots a TV CAMERA for the first
time. He momentarily freezes. CRUSHER sneers the CRUSHER
sneer. Then he charges!

I hope he has a good credit rating...

With the agility of a spider, SPIDEY leaps out of the way.
CRUSHER comes back at him. SPIDEY leaps again, bigger!
The acrobatics get more and more dramatic as CRUSHER COLE
works himself up into a theatrical rage. Taunts erupt
from the CROWD.

OLD LADY
Kill the sucker, Crusher!

Ha! See? It's the reversal of expectations! You'd expect an old lady to be kind and sweet, but instead she's abrasive! It would be EVEN FUNNIER if she called him a mother****er, because you wouldn't expect an old lady to curse, would you!? And maybe she could listen to rap music! Allow me to rewrite this line for the height of comedic potential.

LIZ'S side is all schoolwork. KIM'S side is all ROCK
POSTERS and STUFFED ANIMALS. LIZ is curled up doing
homework. FLASH and KIM sit on the edge of the bed
watching the "SLAMMIES" on MTV.

Chicks watching wrestling? Yeah, right...

FLASH
Will you look at this Spider-Man guy! He
is absolutely incredible!

KIM
Liz, get a load of this outfit! I wish I
had it for the Halloween party... it's
quite sexy.

Lay off the 'quite' Kim. Gwyneth Paltrow is more British then you.

LIZ
Will you two shush. I'm trying to work.

I'm still trying to figure out why neither Gwen or Mary-Jane are in this script. Could it be... SATAN!?!

INT. RING - NIGHT

The match continues in an increasingly spectacular
choreography. CRUSHER bellows at the SCREAMING CROWD.
But there's a gleam in his eye. This is it!
He charges. SPIDEY, playing the CAMERAS for all he's
worth, leaps way, way up. But this time CRUSHER stops
dead in his tracks. SPIDER-MAN comes back down into a
forearm SMASH that sends him reeling into a corner.
CRUSHER does a flying pin. 300 pounds. WOMP! The air
leaves SPIDEY in a rush as CRUSHER covers him, smothering
him. The CROWD goes WILD.

And the quarterback is toast!

REF
One...!

REISS
Get up...! Get up...!

REF
Two...!

Not realizing his own strength and panicky about being
squashed, SPIDER-MAN throws CRUSHER COLE off him and up
into the air. Way up! Reiss cheers... Spider-Man comes
down and knocks CRUSHER for the first time.

What? How did Spider-Man and Crusher trade places?

CRUSHER flies away and out of the arena, eight rows back!
The HIPSTER sees CRUSHER coming at him and bolts from his
seat. CRUSHER lands on it, in between the TWO BLONDES who
break into utter hysterics.

Hehe, maybe he'll break his spine. That'll learn 'im.

SPIDEY, surprised at his own strength, watches CRUSHER
land.

SPIDER-MAN
(whispers to himself)
Wow...

Quit it, script. If Keanu wasn't stupid enough to do Speed 2, he's not stupid enough to do this.

REF
Ladies and Gentlemen, history is made
today, we have here the first man to win
a thousand dollars against the mighty
Crusher.

Wait, shouldn't the ring annoucer be doing this?

The REF raises his hand in victory. The CROWD BOOS and
DEBRIS rains down. But some in the CROWD CHEER wildly,
recognizing the new sensation.

SPIDER-MAN steps down from the right as REISS leads the
CHEERS.

Reiss. For when you lose a bet to keep Jameson in the script and still need comic relief.

PETER
Max! Am I really gonna get a thousand...

REISS
We are going to get a thousand--

PETER turns with REISS and comes face to face with CRUSHER
COLE. Two ominous beats.

Listen carefully. This scene is nearly exactly like the dialogue between Rocky and Thunderlips in Rocky 3, only very, very stupid.

CRUSHER
Hi, who are you, kid?

PETER
I'm Peter Parker.

Make it stop... please...

REISS
He is Spider-Man, and I handle him...
Whenever you want a rematch call me.
Next time it's gonna be ten thousand,
what do you say... Crusher?

Zev: Let me put it this way. Both the original THEATRICAL version AND the EXTENDED EDITIONS of LOTR are available on DVD. While what is on the Star Wars DVD? Well, there's Hayden's spirit and Greedo shooting first and some new special effects. And where's the old classics that redefined moviemaking? Oh, they're in the scrapheap. They were just 'works in progress'. :rolleyes:

So until Peter Jackson (who did Brain Dead, remember? What has Lucas done? Howard the Duck.) changes around the LOTR trilogy to match up with The Hobbit, I've gotta go with LOTR.

What do you know, I broke the twenty-twenty tie! Long live LOTR, new king of the trilogies!

When the Fellowship need help, they call in the Army of the Dead.

When the Rebels need help, they call in... the Ewoks?

Aragorn spends the entire trilogy trying to bang pants with a hot Elf.

Luke is able to take down an Imperial Walker by throwing something into a hole.

Legolas is able to take down an Ulyphant by pulling all kinds of crazy ****! Geez!

imdaly: ^^^^LMAO!!!

Never quite looked at it all that way

Shabliek: wow, I'm suprized LOTR is winning. I thought I was one of the few that liked it better than Star Wars

Zev: LOTR will always win for good always triumphs... because George Lucas is dumb.

DarthElektra: Lucas is not dumb!

Zev: You're right. It's possible that he's just very, very evil.

Kurosawa: I like Star Wars much better-either trilogy. LOTR has it's moments, but I feel it's overrated. Plus the movies will never be the definitive version of LOTR. I think LOTR is sort of heavy handed as well. But it has it's merits.

Zev: You say there will never be a definitive version of LOTR? BWAHAHAHA!

In comparison with... STAR WARS? HAHAHAHAHAHA!

Lucas and his hard-on for special effects can screw off, now that we have a CGI character who actually SERVES A PURPOSE. Suck it down, Jar-Jar.

compi716: Star Wars owns LOTR. Star Wars has THE GREATEST VILLIAN EVER. Hell, even Boba Fett's more memorable that any of the LOTR characters.

In twenty years, will people really remember LOTR so well? It doesn't have the timeless feel of Star Wars. It has a "cool action scene, oh crap more Hobbit talking" feel to it.

Star Wars reigns supreme.

Zev: In twenty years, LOTR, both the books and the movies, will still be timeless, whereas George Lucas will be tolling out his Special Special Special Special (and by special, I mean as in Special Olympics) Edition where Grand Moff Tarkin is replaced by a CGI monster.

And Boda Fett was defeated by PHYSICAL COMEDY. Yeah, real badass. If I find out he has a contract out on me, I'll just hire the Three Stooges for protection.

compi716: Zev...don't talk trash about Boba Fett.

Zev: Oh yeah? What's he gonna do about it? Tie a string around me? The man couldn't work his own jetpack. In fact, the only cool thing he does in the series is track the Millenium Falcon. Any geek could do that. He didn't even capture them on his own, he let Vader and his cronies do all the work. Say what you will about Darth Maul, at least he put up a fight.

Bush may make a lot of speech gaffes, but he's never admitted to committing atrocities... yet.

Good news, everyone! I've finished Spider-Man 3: Legacy. Over two hundred pages, keeping in the fine tradition of my scripts being hideously long. Now I just have to post the various parts at a rate of one per day or so. Also, more of the disassembly of the rejected script will occur. We'll be going back to the 'retelling' style used on Cameron's script to review Koepp's first draft, featuring BOTH Green Goblin and Doc Ock. Don't worry, folks, no 'okey dokey'.

X The Bends X

09-01-2004, 12:14 AM

I'll tell what the worst moment is. When some Jackass decided to make Crapwoman.End of story

Sgt.FrankCastle

09-01-2004, 12:24 PM

when parker took off his spidey mask for the 1000000th time.

PaleRider

09-01-2004, 01:18 PM

Alright let me give this ago.

The killer Pengiuns in Batman Returns, All of Batman Forever and Batman and Robin.

Bush may make a lot of speech gaffes, but he's never admitted to committing atrocities... yet.

Good news, everyone! I've finished Spider-Man 3: Legacy. Over two hundred pages, keeping in the fine tradition of my scripts being hideously long. Now I just have to post the various parts at a rate of one per day or so. Also, more of the disassembly of the rejected script will occur. We'll be going back to the 'retelling' style used on Cameron's script to review Koepp's first draft, featuring BOTH Green Goblin and Doc Ock. Don't worry, folks, no 'okey dokey'.
Nice.:up:

I sadly assume that your " 'Why the Green Goblin's mask was so bad' week" comment a while back was made in jest.I was looking forward to that.:(

Herr Logan

09-01-2004, 04:36 PM

when parker took off his spidey mask for the 1000000th time.

Yep. :up:

Alright let me give this ago.

The killer Pengiuns in Batman Returns, All of Batman Forever and Batman and Robin.

I sadly assume that your " 'Why the Green Goblin's mask was so bad' week" comment a while back was made in jest.I was looking forward to that.:(

I'm pushing it back a bit. I want to finish the Cameron- (as opposed to the regular Cameron script) before so I can also start on Koepp's first draft, which feature equally mediocre villains in Green Goblin and Ock. But hey, if you wanted to see both a Goblin and Dr. Octopus in a movie, you could always read my fanfic!

Spider-Fan

09-02-2004, 12:33 AM

- Luthor cuts Superman's hair, that is holding up a 1000lb ball up, with a simple pair of scissors. - Superman IV: The Quest for Peace

- The Evil Superman shows us how evil he can be, by straitening the Leaning Tower of Pisa! Oh, how could you Superman?!? - Superman III

- How do you dispose of an explosive? Why throw it through a hole. One problem, Shaq can't make the free throws! - Steel

- The imfamous "Do you know what happens to a toad when it's struck by lightning" line - X-Men

- In the 94 FF movie, we see how far a budget can go, when we see Dr. Richards bid good bye to his wedding party, extending his arm through the sunroof of the car in all his plastistic greatness. - Fantastic Four (1994)

- Superman II is probably the best of the Superman movies, for it is the only movie that utilises some of Superman's lesser known powers. Such as, erasing people's memories with his tongue, or firing nets shaped like an "S" from his chest made out of pure light. - Superman II

KenK

09-02-2004, 07:07 AM

- Luthor cuts Superman's hair, that is holding up a 1000lb ball up, with a simple pair of scissors. - Superman IV: The Quest for Peace

- Blade fights off like twenty henchmen saving his most devastating blow for last, A VERTICAL SUPLEX. - Blade II

This was coool because it was so unexpected. Sure, you can write it off as just a wrestling move with no plausible application in a real fight, but we're not exactly dealing with the "real" world when it comes to any comic book movie, especially Blade.

Well, this joke fails because it's referencial jab at something Batman said in the previous film, that Dick wasn't even around to hear. Batman's reply was fine, but it's only Robin's part of the exchange that fails.

- In the 94 FF movie, we see how far a budget can go, when we see Dr. Richards bid good bye to his wedding party, extending his arm through the sunroof of the car in all his plastistic greatness. - Fantastic Four (1994)

If it's true that the film was made solely for the purpose of Marvel retaining the film rights, I can excuse it for being bad. I've seen plenty of bad movies that the filmmakers wanted to be taken seriously, but I don't think Corman's FF was one of them.

- Superman II is probably the best of the Superman movies, for it is the only movie that utilises some of Superman's lesser known powers. Such as, erasing people's memories with his tongue, or firing nets shaped like an "S" from his chest made out of pure light. - Superman II

You know, aside from the Superman moments, this list reads more like things you just didn't particularly like in certain comic book movies.

What about Batman and Robin hosting a social function, followed by a bidding war for Poison Ivy that ends with Batman taking out a . . .BAT CREDIT CARD!!!! And what's worse, the logo on it is clearly supposed to mimic the Mastercard logo, but Batman paraphrases the American Express slogan!! Surely this should be on everyone's list!

Sgt.FrankCastle

09-02-2004, 11:27 AM

I personally like 99% of the stuff in the Marvel films but here is a little analysis:

X-Men: Loved it, at first had to think about the costume change, but have now decided it's pretty cool.

X-2: Very very cool

Spider-Man: Brilliant, loved it all.

Spider-man 2: Very cool. Bit too much talking and cheese. But guess it works well.

Blade: Cool apart from the blood effects at the end

Blade 2: Yeah... That was pretty cool

Daredevil: Was OK. Fun. I guess.

Punisher: Loved every second of it.

Hulk: Definitely one of my favourites. Have to concentrate on the film, but not as fun when just wanna see HULK SMASH!!!!

Not seen, Blade trinity yet, but will do. All in all, Marvel films are my favourites, and truly don't believe they've made any huge mistakes to ruin any of the films. Will hopefully enjoy more Marvel films in the future. Bring on the Silver Surfer!

Spider-Fan

09-02-2004, 12:30 PM

Yeah, I'll agree, that was pretty damn stupid.

I didn't really have a problem with this one. A subtle inject of humor is always good.

This was coool because it was so unexpected. Sure, you can write it off as just a wrestling move with no plausible application in a real fight, but we're not exactly dealing with the "real" world when it comes to any comic book movie, especially Blade.

Well, this joke fails because it's referencial jab at something Batman said in the previous film, that Dick wasn't even around to hear. Batman's reply was fine, but it's only Robin's part of the exchange that fails.

If it's true that the film was made solely for the purpose of Marvel retaining the film rights, I can excuse it for being bad. I've seen plenty of bad movies that the filmmakers wanted to be taken seriously, but I don't think Corman's FF was one of them.

You know, aside from the Superman moments, this list reads more like things you just didn't particularly like in certain comic book movies.

What about Batman and Robin hosting a social function, followed by a bidding war for Poison Ivy that ends with Batman taking out a . . .BAT CREDIT CARD!!!! And what's worse, the logo on it is clearly supposed to mimic the Mastercard logo, but Batman paraphrases the American Express slogan!! Surely this should be on everyone's list!

Don't get me wrong, I liked Superman II, Blade II, Daredevil, and X-Men, but those moments really were bad, plus a lot of the ones I would like to cover have been covered multiple times already. (I did hate FF, Superman III & IV, B&R, and Batman Forever however). I completly forgot about the credit card commercial, your right about that one.

Zev

09-02-2004, 08:41 PM

when parker took off his spidey mask for the 1000000th time.

Are you counting when he took it off and nobody was around? Because he has to take it off sometime...

Peter runs up to Mary-Jane. He's wearing the classic blue suit with red tie, the spider mask covering his face.

PETER: Hey MJ.

MARY-JANE: Peter, why are you wearing that mask?

PETER: Fans get pissed when I take it off.

He takes out a candy bar, unwraps it, then tries to take a bite. He can't get to it through the fabric of his mask. He looks up and curses the heavens...

PETER: NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

Zev

09-03-2004, 09:39 AM

How does Wolverine get any lovin'? That's the question posed on the X-boards. And while everyone else tried seriously to explain the appeal of the brooding loner, blah blah, I tried to think up the REAL reasons an ugly, short, hairy jerk can get a bunch of 'tang.

He has Professor X's credit card.

He has Jubilee pretend to be his precarious teenage daughter to attract chicks.

He takes himself for a walk to attract chicks.

In Japan, he's considered very kawai.

Women are hoping he'll turn into a handsome prince if they kiss him.

Nightcrawler's holo-projector makes him look like Hugh Jackman.

After a fight with Sentinels, Magneto, and Apocalypse, the guy with the healing factor will always be the best-looking.

He doesn't. Jean always shoots him down.

He doesn't. Punisher always shoots him down. Usually in the kneecaps.

BAM! Thank you, I'll be here all weekend.

Zev

09-03-2004, 11:36 AM

EXT. CITY STREET - NEAR A HOSPITAL - DAY

WE ARE TIGHT ON A NEW YORK JOURNAL TRUCK. On its SIDE
BANNER is a PICTURE of SPIDER-MAN'S face. Headline: "Who
is he? Mega-Smash Hits MTV!"

The author wanted to have Spider-Man be on MTV (because it's 'hip' and 'topical') but also wanted to have him do the whole 'wrestling' thing. He ended up with possibly the most idiotic subplot imaginable.

The TRUCK pulls away and we see PETER, LIZ, HARRY and KIM
standing on the sidewalk waiting to cross. PETER is
rocking on his heels and smirking.

Flash also likes to watch musicals and Sweats to the Oldies with Richard Simmons before turning down dates with Carmen Electra.

PETER
He does...

KIM
I love wrestling.

Yeah, I'll bet you do. ****.

HARRY
Wrestling is all bluff. Do you really
believe this little guy in a stupid
Spider-Man suit beat the Crusher?

We all know that wrestling is fake. If the MOVIE points that out, you're just digging the hole deeper.

LIZ
Hey, we better rush... visiting hours
will be over soon.

INT. HOSPITAL CORRIDOR & ROOM - DAY

The NURSE leads PETER and LIZ and HARRY into the room.

NURSE
Doctor Octavius? You have visitors.
Doctor Octavius?

We hold for a beat. When LIZ takes a step forward to look
around we expect the worst. But nothing grabs her.
PETER sees a pile of PLASTER on the floor. He looks up
and sees the hole in the ceiling. LIZ and HARRY look up
too. OCK is not there.

Shouldn't it be 'isn't' there?

PETER
Ock is not here!

Gak!

LIZ
My God, what happened?

God: Hey, don't drag me into this!

NURSE
I'd better call the doctor!

HARRY
You'd better call the police!

KIM screams.

She really loves the Police. Listens to 'Every Breath You Take' all the time.

INT. CORRIDOR TO OCK'S LAB - DAY

OCK, hiding his WALDOS under a white hospital robe.

Incomplete sentence! It should be 'Ock IS hiding his WALDOS under a white hospital robe.' Or a comma followed by an independent clause after 'robe'.

He
stalls until he reaches the door. Then one of his WALDOS
peaks out and snaps open the new locks on the door.

INT. CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

OCK, in a white hospital robe

We just heard that he had a white hospital robe on. Stop being redundant, you asses!

walks through the surreal
debris. Two WALDOS reach out and "sense" the ripples on
opposite WALLS. He runs a hand through his hair.

It's like looking at Spider-Man 2, only very, very, very, very stupid. And how is he going to build a 'hotter' cyclotron?

He hears a NOISE behind him and reacts. And here comes
WEINER.

Why's he come back here? IITS.

Bedraggled, shuffling through the CONTROL ROOM
door. He eyeballs the incredible wreckage.

WEINER
There you are, doc... where have you
been... whoa this place is messed up.

I know there should be come punctuation other then ellipses and some capitalization in there somewhere! Geez, I'm not even a professional scriptwriter and I know that much!

OCK turns, WALDOS writhing. WEINER sees them and kind of
ducks, remembering how he was hit by them once.

So, what's his emotional response to a sociopath with mechanical tentacles that have already wholloped him for no reason once?

WEINER
(smirks)

This movie smirks more then Tom Cruise!

Whoa, doc! You look a little messed up
yourself.

OCK
Where have you been, you imbecile?

A better question is why'd he come back? Criminal... crime scene... any of this ringing a bell?

WEINER
I went to the wrestling...

OCK
Wrestling...

That's what this movie needs! Quick, Weiner, strip to your trunks and roll around on the ground with me!

WEINER
I went after the kid. You still want
that Parker guy's data, don't you?

OCK
Well, did you get it?

"No, but I got Brent Spiner's Data!"[I]

WEINER
No, I followed him... but I lost him in
the crowd.

OCK
Lost him? You--

WEINER
I'll find him, Maestro...

[I]Huh? When did the Hulk's Future Self show up?

I promise...
soon... maybe by tomorrow.

OCK
So how was the wrestling?

And did you have a nice day at school? Do I even have to mention how out of character this is for Ock?

WEINER
Fantastic! There was this new wrestler...
beat the mighty Crusher. You won't
believe it... a nothing of a guy... calls
himself this stupid name... the Amazing
Spider-Man... would you believe it?

He's talking in Bendisese.

OCK
Spider-Man, huh? Well, maybe I'll just
go and wrestle myself one of these days...

Yeah, well when you 'wrestle yourself' make sure to do it with some tissues and in the privacy of your own home, okay?

with all my new arms... I'm sure I can
beat Crusher or any other monster.

I don't know. Wolfman's got nads, in case you haven't heard.

Suddenly OCK throws out his WALDOS from under his long
white coat, grabs WEINER and, lifts him up in the air,
smiles cynically and with cruelty!

'Cynically and with cruelty?' So is he voting for Ralph Nader now?

OCK
Will I beat him, this Crusher, will I
beat him or not?

Look, you don't need to have your ego stroked by someone named Weiner. Maybe you could have your weiner stroked by someone named Ego, but Living Planets don't give the best handjobs.

A CAMERA is mounted on a TRIPOD facing us. A TIMER winds
down and it CLICKS.

Leonard Shelby's getting closer to the truth...

REVERSE ANGLE - CAMERA'S POV.
SPIDER-MAN is clinging to the side of a WALL.

SPIDER-MAN
And one like this...
(changing pose)
And one looking real sincere.

The WHITE EYES narrow to a slit. CLICK.

Can someone please inform the author that in the real world, eyelenses cannot change shape?

Suddenly he spots WEINER climbing onto his roof. He
hides.

WEINER tiptoes into the roof apartment. SPIDER-MAN jumps
in and grabs him.

Although he doesn't enjoy it half as much as when he does the same to Black Cat...

SPIDER-MAN
What are you doing here?

WEINER
I'm looking for Peter Parker.

"On the roof?"

"I took directions from this guy in a red leather S&M costume. He says you can find EVERYONE you're looking for on the roofs..."

SPIDER-MAN
Oh, yes... so why not use the front door?

SPIDER-MAN throws him back onto the roof so that he almost
slides over the edge. WEINER turns, facing SPIDER-MAN.

You broke my heart, Fredo!

WEINER
Hey, I know you...

SPIDER-MAN
You do?

WEINER
I saw you crushing the Crusher.

Then smashing the Smasher! And monsting the Monster!

SPIDER-MAN
You like wrestling?

Have you ever seen a grown man naked?

SPIDER-MAN jumps and reaches WEINER.

WEINER
I love it! You are the best wrestler I
have ever seen... please don't hurt me!

Good to know he speaks in the Queen's English when being threatened. Shouldn't it be "You're the best wrestler I've ever seen"?

SPIDER-MAN picks up WEINER, throws him up to an antenna
above the building, to which WEINER clings desperately.

[I]Thanks for messing up the cable reception, Spider-Man. That's the real reason people don't like you...

SPIDER-MAN circles the antenna.

WEINER
Oh, please... don't kill me. Please help
me down.

SPIDER-MAN
Of course I'll help you down. I am
Spider-Man... the good guy, am I not?

Spider-Man, Ock, Weiner... everyone in this script talks like a goddamn robot! And not in a good way!

WEINER
Yes... yes, you are.

SPIDER-MAN jumps to the CHIMNEY, picks WEINER up in his
arms and whispers to him.

"I like your scent..."

SPIDER-MAN
And by the way, Peter Parker does not
live here anymore...

And neither does Alice.

SPIDER-MAN jumps with WEINER in his arms to the edge of
the roof.

SPIDER-MAN
And tell the Professor he can't have
Peter's data. Goodbye.

SPIDER-MAN drops WEINER off the roof, three floors
straight down into heavy bushes below.

Wow. Spider-Man will be lucky if Weiner doesn't break his neck. That kind of reckless endangerment, especially for a guy who's only been annoying him, is really uncalled for. I think we've found a worse 'hero' then Daredevil.

INT. ELECTRODYNE FACTORY SHOP - DAY

A SIGN tells us so. A CLERK is double checking a long
list of items OCK has ordered.

Yeah, I googled everything on that list and it's all bull****. But it's nice to know you can obtain all the equipment necessary to conduct a dangerous experiment without any background check or government intervention of any kind (at least Movie!Ock got his mail order!).

(finishes computation)
That'll be $475,989.65...

OCK
Wrap it up...

What Mark Steven Johnson said to Michael Clark Duncan about his role in Daredevil.

CLERK
What about the money... or do you pay by
credit card?

OCK
(a long beat)
Cash! I'll be back soon.

I'll be back? This makes those rumors that Cameron wanted Schwarzenegger as Ock that much more credible... although the world was spared the sight of the Guvernator trying to do a comic book villain until Batman & Robin. And that was a DC movie, so I'm okay with it.

EXT. STREET - OUTSIDE OF A BANK - BACK DOOR - NIGHT

An ARMORED TRUCK rolls by and stops. TWO GUARDS open the
Bank's DOORS.

Man, how conveniant for Ock, eh?

Suddenly a WALDO smashes through the DRIVER'S SIDE WINDOW
of the ARMORED TRUCK, wrapping around the DRIVER'S NECK
and pulling him through the WINDOW. The SHOTGUN goes for
his weapon,

Don't bother going for your weapon, shotgun, you are a weapon! You just have to believe in yourself!

but a WALDO smashes in and pulls the GUN out
through his WINDOW.

TWO WALDOS shoot out and attach themselves to the REAR
DOOR.

BANK GUARD
What's going on here?

Wut wut, know what I mean?

The WALDO knocks him over. OCK rips the DOOR off! The
TRUCK is full of MONEY BAGS.

Uncle Scrooge is gonna be PISSED!

OCK
Cash!

Johnny Cash! "And you can have it all... my empire of dust..."

Zev

09-05-2004, 01:46 PM

INT. JAMESON'S OFFICE - DAY

A PHOTO ASSISTANT look on as JAMESON goes over PETER'S
latest PHOTOS. They are his SPIDER-MAN shots.

Hey, what do ya know, Jameson's back! Lets watch as he does something really funny or relevant to the plot!

PETER
Doesn't he look amazing in that one?
Look, he's flying in the air!

You believe a man can fly?

JAMESON
I don't care if he flies to the moon.
He's just another wrestler in a silly
costume. Look at this, Parker, right off
the wire. This is the guy who hit that
armored truck this morning. They say he
has metal arms... get me a picture of
this character!

Hmmm... by sending Peter to get pictures of an armed (no pun intended) maniac, isn't Jameson guilty of child endangerment? Pete's still in high school, after all...

PETER
Metal arms?

JAMESON
Four of them.

Jus' the four of us, uh-huh-huh, we can make it if we try, just the four of us, you and you and you and I...

PETER
Ock...?!

JAMESON
The web faced weirdo... He is a joke in a
Halloween costume... don't make me laugh.

Contractions! Enough already! Also, it should be 'web-faced'.

He tears up PETER'S SPIDEY PHOTOS.

Pay attention to this...

JAMESON
Now get out of here and don't come back
without something I can use!

PETER
Yes sir...
(stops, and turns back)

Huh?

JAMESON
A mega baloney... A bug in blue tights...
what next?

Mega Baloney? That sounds like a much more interesting film then this one!

PETER
The Journal said he was a mega-smash on
MTV...

Jessica Simpson is too. You're not exactly in good company, Pete.

INT. CYCLOTRON ROOM - NIGHT

WEINER is putting on a CLOWN SUIT. He fastidiously puts
his ratty jacket on a hanger and hangs it on a PIPE. The
PIPE turns into a snake.

Hey, Moses, quit it!

It is, in fact, a WALDO!

So that's where he is!

OCK
(turning from work)
What do you think you're doing?

WEINER
I'm going to the Masquerade. It's
Halloween tonight Doc, aren't you coming
to the School Ball? Whoa, you could go
without an outfit.

Way not to antagonize the crazed maniac, ass. Why would you even suggest a wanted man going in the first place? Why are you even Ock's sidekick? That's like making Darth Vader pal around with Barney Fife (well, with this Ock it's more like having Andy Dick pal around with Barney Fife).

A WALDO whips around WEINER'S throat... AARRRGH!

I see this is as painful for the author to write as it is for us to read. Good.

OCK
You're not going to any ball, clown.
You're going to get me Peter Parker's
data...

Ladies and gentlemen, if you're not already aware, we're looking at this script's 'McGuffin'.

WEINER
I was almost killed on my last try...
Look at all these bruises...

OCK
I don't care if you come back dead. Just
get it!

Well, if he dies he can't very well come back. Except as a ghost, in which case he can't take the data with him because he'll be spectral!

WEINER
(croaking)
Cost you a thousand bucks, if I get it.

The WALDO coils tighten around WEINER'S throat.

WEINER
All right... boss please let go...
P L E A S E ...

I love the way he spells please. Not just upper-case or italicized, but spaced out like a spelling bee.

OCK
Just get it, Weiner. I'm running out of
time. If you fail me again, you won't
have to concern yourself with money
anymore... DO YOU GET ME CLOWN?!

Don't call them a clown. Clowns have the potential to cause fear. This lucknut couldn't clean Bozo's oversized shoes.

WEINER croaks his assent.

INT. CAFETERIA - NIGHT

It is all dressed up for a party: LIGHTS, STREAMERS,
GLITTER BALL, the WORKS! HARRY is dressed as a SPACEMAN;
PETER wears his regular clothes.

HARRY
You should have worn a costume. I told
you to wear a costume.

PETER
It's... embarrassing.

Not as embarrassing as starring in this movie would have been...

HARRY
There's Liz...

LIZ is crossing the dance floor dressed as an INDIAN
PRINCESS in an MINI-DRESS.

How! Do you do?

PETER
Yeah...

ROZ, dressed as a COWBOY, ambles over.

Ten to one he doesn't look as good in chaps as Jeff Goldblum did...

ROZ
... howdy partners.

PETER/HARRY
Hiya, Professor Rosomorf.

Hi Doctor Nick!

HARRY
Any word on Doctor Octavius?

ROZ
(falling in step)
Nothing beyond what I read in the papers.
I'm afraid he's not the same man we knew.
You know, I've been digging through the
notes on his experiments...

They're mostly just porn.

PETER follows LIZ with his eyes. She takes a seat at a
TABLE next to KIM who wears a HAREM GIRL outfit with the
SALAMANDER around her neck.

Harem girl? Salamander? What kind of outrageous fetish is this? And does it have a website?

Next to KIM is... SPIDER-MAN!
PETER'S eyes go wide.

As well they should go. Who has time to make an entire costume in one day?

ROZ
You boys must have had an extraordinary
classroom experience.

Wha? But you were just talking about Ock's experiments and... oh, why bother!?

PETER
(eyeing Spidey)
Yes sir... oh... I'm going to be a little
late with my paper on the Planetary
Conjunction, sir...

You see, Kevin Bacon's finally convinced the town to allow a dance party against the protests of John Lithgow, so we're all going to get footloose!

ROZ
Whenever you're ready... I'll look at it.
I know it's going to be an important
work... and Peter, take my hat.

He hands PETER an oversized TEN GALLON HAT.

You sons of *****es! I'm from Texas! THAT'S IT, NOW IT'S PERSONAL!

ROZ
It is a costume party.

If this is a costume party, shouldn't you all be going as intelligent, well-written, three-dimensional characters?

PETER and HARRY make their way through the dance floor to
the table. PETER can't take his eyes off SPIDEY.

Someone once told him to go **** himself and that's exactly what he's going to do...

HARRY
Look, there's Spider-Man!

PETER
Not the real one, I'm sure...

A more concise (aka funnier) line would be (without looking) "No it isn't."

HARRY
You can never be sure... all kinds of
crazy stuff can happen at a masquerade
ball...

Like turning Ock into a comic relief villain less threatening then Bullseye with a sidekick named Weiner?

PETER
I bet I know who it is.

As they take seats, PETER sees that SPIDER-MAN is trying
to read the BUGLE'S sports section by party light. KIM
waves. PETER nods and the BIG HAT falls over his face.

PETER is left alone, PETER leaves toward the entrance.
At the REAR DOOR a BIG LIZARD

Doctor Connors?

passes a NOTE to a DALLAS COWGIRL who passes it to a KANGAROO.

Frank Oliver?

The KANGAROO hops
across the dance floor to the STAGE where he hands the
NOTE to a YOUNG WOMAN in a BASEBALL UNIFORM.

She climbs the STAGE where she is bathed in a SPOTLIGHT.
She gets a DRUM ROLL from the band. There are some BOOS
as the bad stops.

I don't think we have to worry about the 'bad' stopping anytime soon... But when it does, there will be a lot of booing...

YOUNG WOMAN
Thank you, thank you. We have a special
surprise guest tonight.
(booo)
The Empire State University Masquerade
Ball presents... The "Slammy" winning
star of MTV'S wrestling tournament...

Tournament? You can't win a TOURNAMENT with one match!

The
Amazing Spider-Man!

FLASH, amazed turns to LIZ. He points to himself and
mouths, "Me?" (The REAL) SPIDEY drops from the ceiling and
lands in a pose. The CROWD cheers. He does a flip to LIZ
and extends a hand. The BAND starts up. LIZ demurs.

FLASH
(whispers firmly)
Go ahead... go ahead!

"Your wishes are irrelevant so long as my status is increased by association with Spider-Man..."

LIZ takes SPIDEY'S hand and they move slowly and sexily
onto the dance floor. They do a short simple number.

Great. A dance-off. Son of a *****.

SPIDEY returns LIZ to FLASH.

LIZ
(to Flash)
Come on... Flash...

Ah, he's getting Spidey's metaphorical sloppy seconds.

FLASH takes LIZ from PETER (SPIDER-MAN).

LIZ and FLASH dance wildly. They finish to big cheers.
The real SPIDER-MAN slides to center floor. The crowd
backs away as SPIDEY spins out the greatest dance vnumber
in film history.

Yeah, right. I don't think Gene Kelly has to look over his shoulder anytime soon.

He's all over the floor and on the walls
and on the ceiling and on the GLITTER BALL. He takes LIZ
and flies with her. He breaks the place up. Then drops
in a pose. BIG CHEERS.

Well, at least he's wearing a mask. Still better then Daredevil, not that that's saying much.

LIZ stops breathless, very near to SPIDER-MAN'S face.

LIZ
(whispers breathless)
Who are you...?

I'm Batman!

PETER
One day you'll know...

LIZ
(a long beat)
You sound very familiar.

Oh, c'mon! Once you open the can of worms, we'll have no more secret identity business! It's like Lois realizing Superman is just Clark with his glasses off!

For instance, many Spider-Man fans had to worry about this script being produced... Luckily, their fears were in vain (and you'll find out just HOW LUCKY you were in a moment, true believers! Love doing that...

SPIDER-MAN
Please... Faster... Please.

CABBIE
Okay, you asked for it.

EXT. THE STREET - NIGHT

The TAXI skids and swerves like crazy, bumping into
everything in sight.

I give up, no ONE fare is ever going to be worth the increased insurance premiums doing this much damage would cost.

INT. BEN AND MAY'S BEDROOM - NIGHT

A GLASS SHATTERS. AUNT MAY sits up in bed with a start.

Brace yourselves, lads. Remember how Daredevil ripped off Batman by having the main villain responsible for a hero's loved one's death, thus leading the hero to become, well, a hero? Well, get ready for another version of that, only much, much, much worse.

WEINER is going through the drawers. He finds a nice BONE
HANDLE KNIFE and pockets it.

Plot point!

WEINER
Hmmm...

INT. BEN AND MAY'S LIVING ROOM - NIGHT

BEN descends the stairs from the bedroom. He peers off
into the darkness and pulls his ROBE tight around him as
if to ward off some unacknowledged danger.

Ooh! Arty! Bravo! Auteur!

EXT. TAXI - NIGHT

TAXI driving fast through STREET.

Sentence missing articles!

INT. TAXI - NIGHT

CABBIE
Some crazy kinda town, huh? You hear
about that hold-up? The guy with the six
arms? Hey, I see it all on this job.
(a beat)
What kinda outfit is that, anyway?

God, can Tom Cruise show up and shut this guy up already?

SPIDER-MAN
(panicked)
Look, I'm really in a hurry.

BANG! A BLOW OUT. The CABBIE fights the wheel to the
side of the road. Then he turns to SPIDEY.

"Welp, that's my mammy!"

CABBIE
(sly)
You said the magic words, we have a flat
Boychick.

Irony! Isn't it even more hilarious when pointed out? And what's a flat boychick? Sounds like a gay porn star.

INT. BEN AND MAY'S FAMILY ROOM - NIGHT

BEN comes in and looks around. A long beat. Then a
noise.

BEN
Mice...

Not just any mice, boychick! The Rescue Rangers!

INT. BEN AND MAY'S DINING ROOM - NIGHT

A very scared WEINER hides, eyes widening. WEINER takes
the BONE HANDLE KNIFE from his pocket. It glints in the
MOONLIGHT. He moves off.

Sorry, still not taking the guy named Weiner as a credible villain...

INT. BEN AND MAY'S KITCHEN - NIGHT

BEN is looking for mice. He opens a closet. Nothing. He
shifts around. Nothing. He moves off.

EXT. 59TH STREET BRIDGE - NIGHT

The CABBIE slowly changes the TIRE. Fearing the worst,
SPIDEY gets out, looking for a ride. A TRUCK approaches.
SPIDEY looks down at the CABBIE and then up at the TRUCK.

Optimus Prime, I need your help!

CABBIE
Hey! You wanna hand me that lug wrench?

He looks up to see SPIDEY go by, stuck to the side of the
TRUCK like a spider.

Well, that goes without saying...

CABBIE
Some crazy kinda town...

Oh, those jaded New Yorkers! Will nothing surprise them?

EXT. THE TRUCK - NIGHT

SPIDEY stares at the lettering on the side of the TRUCK.
It says, "Victory Sporting Goods."

Victory, eh? Well, movie, I don't have two fingers for you, I can only spare one... And it AIN'T a thumbs up!

SPIDER-MAN
(a thought)
Sporting goods...

That's what we need to play sports!

INT. BEN AND MAY'S DINING ROOM - NIGHT

BEN comes in quietly. He looks around. He opens a
closet. Nothing. He hears a CRASH. He wheels. A
SHADOWY FIGURE runs by a doorway!
BEN takes off like a shot!

And for his next impression, Jesse Owens!

INT. BEN AND MAY'S HOUSE - NIGHT

BEN runs through the rooms.

INT. BEN AND MAY'S FAMILY ROOM - NIGHT

BEN flies in and goes right to the RIFLE on the wall. WE
hear WEINER clattering around the house in the background
as BEN goes to a drawer and pulls out a BOX of BULLETS.

He loads it, then shoots Weiner dead. Charlon Heston would be proud.

He begins to fight the BULLETS into the RIFLE.

You know, this wouldn't be a problem if you practiced with and cleaned your rifle at least semi-annually...

WEINER comes flying in and tackles him. They fall to the
floor, four hands on the RIFLE. They scuffle.

Ow, owie, quit it, ya big meanie!

WEINER
All I want it the kid's computer crap!

Darth Vader got Boda Fett. Rasputin got Kronen. What did Ock do to deserve this guy? What did Ock do to deserve being in this screenplay?

BEN
Let go before I blow your brain's out.

When I threaten people with a rifle, I make sure to put an exclamation point at the end to show them I mean it. I know you can do it, script, you just did with Weiner's line!

EXT. FOREST HILLS STREET - NIGHT

The TRUCK pulls away leaving PETER in a POOL of STREET
LAMP LIGHT. He's wearing a FOOTBALL JERSEY and SHORTS and
carrying a SPORTS BAG. He begins to run.

I'd make a comment about Peter being a lowdown dirty thief, but it'd be like putting a Band-Aid on a severed head.

INT. BEN AND MAY'S BEDROOM - NIGHT

MAY hears a CRASH. She pulls the covers up around her
chin in fear.

Or you could CALL THE POLICE, YOU STUPID *****!

BEN (V.O.)
Let go!

WEINER (V.O.)
You let go!

Haha, the life and death struggle's played for laughs! Should I even point out that it should be O.S., for offscreen, not V.O. as in voiceover narration?

EXT. BEN AND MAY'S HOUSE - NIGHT

PETER runs up and hears a SHOT. He runs inside.

Don't you do it, script, don't you even ****ING dare!

INT. BEN AND MAY'S FAMILY ROOM - NIGHT

PETER runs in. He sees WEINER standing there with the
RIFLE.

Weiners don't need rifles, they've already got balls and muskets!

They face off across the room. The moment hits
PETER like a punch in the chest.

If you punch him, would he bleed?

PETER
Uncle Ben!

What? I'm sorry, the script DIDN'T EVEN DESCRIBE BEN! For all we know, he could be sitting comfortably on the toilet.

BEN
(a wheeze)
Peter...

Stop it! I refuse to accept any variation of Spider-Man that negates Peter's culpability in Uncle Ben's death! This **** is blasphemous or heretical or whatever the Catholics call these things!

PETER rushes to BEN.

PETER
Oh my God... Uncle Ben...

Oh no you didn't...

PETER tries to revive BEN, while WEINER runs out.

http://www.chud.com/chudvd/reviews/images2/startrek6.jpg!

That's it, you sons of *****es, THAT IS IT! I put up with comic relief Kahn, I put up with dancing Spider-Man, I put up with Liz Allen being the love interest, I put up with REISS, I put up with everything!

But you!... You IDIOTS tried to completely destroy the entire Spider-Man franchise! Peter being responsible for Uncle Ben's death is the SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT THING ABOUT SPIDER-MAN! Not mechanical webshooters, not Gwen Stacy, not even the Green Goblin's mask. I vote that whoever wrote this never, EVER be allowed to operate a word processor or put pencil or pen to paper again, ever! I fear their evilpidity, a combination of evil and stupidity not seen since Daredevil, would cause them to create the Necronomicon Ex Mortica. I don't like to toss around words like retarded, but that's what these people are. That's what I call writing a Spider-Man script and never reading the comic. They couldn't have read the comics. I can't imagine where they got what little (and by little, I mean bin Laden penis size little) knowledge of the comics they did, but I could imagine being forcefed the first panel of a Spider-Man comic (okay, there's Flash Thompson who bullies Peter around, he's dating Liz Allen, and Peter's parents are Uncle Ben and Aunt May...), then they got a brain freeze.

This is like Bruce Wayne's parents dying in a plane crash. This is like Krypton not blowing up. This is like Captain America being created in modern-day. This is like Satan rising from a lake of fire to rain torment down on the earth!

You. Yes, you. I order you not to remain silent. This simply most be talked about. The fact that this script was even CONSIDERED being made into a movie should make you thank whatever god you pray to that Sam Raimi came around. No matter how much you dislike Spider-Man, comparing the final product to this... thing is like choosing between pricking your finger with a needle and being anally-sodomized by Dirk Diggler.

cryptic name

09-07-2004, 11:25 PM

Alright let me give this ago.

The killer Pengiuns in Batman Returns, All of Batman Forever and Batman and Robin.

ok, the first 9 i agree with, but what's so bad about reversing time? and dont throw "science" in my face, this is a movie about a man who flies and has laser a vision and a film in which gene hackman is a geneus.

PaleRider

09-07-2004, 11:55 PM

Ok I won't get scientific (even though thats one of my major problems with it) but besides that it just seems to me that they painted themselves into a corner and didn't know how to get themselves out so they just did this "Oh well Superman can do anything he wants, right? Lets have him reverse time." It just bothers me.

Zev

09-08-2004, 10:58 AM

Not to mention that ALL films have to have SOME basis in fact. Making the Earth spin backwards would not reverse time, PERIOD. A chimp could tell you that. If they couldn't think of a better way to save Lois, they shouldn't have killed her.

Besides, what's the point of having a superhero that can reverse time? "Oh, General Zod is loose? I'll just go back in time and make sure he doesn't get out of the Phantom Zone."

The Hero

09-08-2004, 11:50 AM

Is it just me,or is it odd that the two most cringe-inducing moments in the Spider-Man movies,Peter and MJ's Spider-Man conversation,and Doc Ock's Shakespearian "NOOOOOOOO!",both take place in hospidals?:confused:

And I know this is off-topic,but am I the only one who thinks that if he were a little shorter,Ron Perlman would have made a good Wolverine?

Zev

09-08-2004, 12:11 PM

I don't think those two moments were cringe-inducing at all. What's wrong with the "Nooooo!" If you woke up to see that you had mechanical tentacles fused to your body, your wife had died, your work had failed spectacularly, and a bunch of dead doctors were on the floor, apparently at your hands, what would you say? "Oh, dang. That bites."?

The Hero

09-08-2004, 01:13 PM

I don't think those two moments were cringe-inducing at all. What's wrong with the "Nooooo!" If you woke up to see that you had mechanical tentacles fused to your body, your wife had died, your work had failed spectacularly, and a bunch of dead doctors were on the floor, apparently at your hands, what would you say? "Oh, dang. That bites."?
I was overstating a bit when I said "cringe-inducing".I just thought it was a little...much.

The Cajun

09-08-2004, 01:32 PM

"Punch me I bleed!" Spider-Man 2. Tobey looks like such an ass in this shot.

Peter running arcross the roof in slow-mo. Once again looks like an ass.

MJ running in slow-mo in her wedding dress.

Spider-Man 2 had way too many cheesy moments for my liking.

Zev

09-08-2004, 02:31 PM

I was overstating a bit when I said "cringe-inducing".I just thought it was a little...much.

Ah, I get it. Spider-Man works under the 'Titanic' principle. A little romance for the chicks, some action for the dudes (I remember back in my Megaman-playing days, me and my brother called chicks 'dudettes'. Goofy, huh? And bosses weren't bosses, they were 'Real Tough Guys')

I know we're not talking about Catwoman, but if we were, I find it kind of ironic that next to me is a painting of a cat stalking a spider. Not as odd as a spider impaled on a devil's pitchfork, but definitely funny.

In case you're just joining us, Weiner, Ock's doofus henchman (seriously, we're talking incompetency usually restrainted to Austin Powers movies), has just killed Uncle Ben in the worst deviation from Spider-Man canon since Chapter One. And now, as Majel Roddenberry would say, the conclusion.

DETECTIVE
Your uncle's a brave man. Apparently,
the perpetrator was after something of
yours. Your uncle didn't know what it
was but he stood up to him anyway. You
ought to be proud of him.

"I'd be prouder if he'd won."

PETER
I am... how is he...

A grim-faced DOCTOR walks slowly across the room to
them... MAY stands up slowly.

It says something for human emotion that this scene isn't ****ed up too bad. Basic characters, but nothing too garish.

DETECTIVE
Ask the Doctor.

AUNT MAY
How's my... how's my husband doing...?

DOCTOR
Mrs. Parker, I'm sorry. We tried.

MAY collapses.

Really, how am I supposed to make fun of this? A bit overdramatic, perhaps...

DOCTOR
Crash cart! STAT!

The Detective pulls PETER gently away. The STAFF works on
MAY.

DETECTIVE
Let the medics handle it.

Hold on, guys, I think we've got something coming up!

(pause)
Look, if it makes you feel any better.
We're gonna nail this guy. He crashed
his getaway car. We got him trapped in a
warehouse on Jackson.

Man, good thing he gave Peter the location so he can personally punch Weiner's ticket.

NURSE
(to Peter)
She's alright. She just fainted. We'll
have to check her for symptoms of shock.
If you want to wait, you can get some
coffee on the third floor.

Come, find comfort in the arms of Juan Valdez.

PETER
No, I... I think I wanna go out for some
fresh air.

EXT. WAREHOUSE - NIGHT

COP CARS, COPS, SEARCHLIGHTS playing their BEAMS against
the ACME CHEMICAL STORAGE BUILDING.

Acme? Funny, as this script has been about as effective in capturing the spirit of Spider-Man as the Coyote has been at catching the Roadrunner.

GUNFIRE flashes from
one of the WINDOWS.

EXT. COP CAR - NIGHT

ELITE COPS in BASEBALL CAPS are plotting strategy.

Then Mel Gibson's character turns his baseball cap around because HE DOESN'T PLAY BY YOUR RULES, MCGARRET!

COP #1
That place is loaded with solvents and
chemicals. If we blast our way in, it's
gonna go up like a roman candle.

You could always wait for him to run out of ammo...

COP #2
We could go in through the fifth floor
wash room.

COP #1
What's that up there? Throw a light on
that!

What someone should have said when they were filming the bar scene in Daredevil.

COP #1 directs the BEAM of the SEARCHLIGHT.

EXT. WAREHOUSE WALL - NIGHT

SPIDER-MAN is climbing it, trapped in the GLARE of the
SEARCHLIGHT. He freezes.

COP #1
He's got a partner!

Is that really the first thing you think when you see a guy in a red and blue costume climbing a wall? Man, New Yorkers are jaded...

EXT. COP CAR - NIGHT

Every COP'S WEAPON is trained upward at SPIDER-MAN!

COP #2
(on radio)
We got an accomplice up there! And we
got a clear shot. Do we have a go?

RADIO
(filtered)
That's a go.

Oh, give me a ****ing break! No warning? No order to surrender? Not to mention he hasn't done anything wrong. This is another Rodney King right here!

EXT. WAREHOUSE WALL - NIGHT

GUNSHOTS erupt around SPIDER-MAN and he skitters around to
evade them.

INT. THE WAREHOUSE - NIGHT

Thinking they're shooting at him, WEINER shoots back.

Wasn't he already shooting?

In
the corner of his eye he sees SPIDER-MAN at a side WINDOW.
He aims his rifle and SPIDEY ducks out of the way.

Okay, I'm assuming he took that rifle from Uncle Ben. How many shots can he have in it? I'd say eight at the most, unless he stopped fleeing the scene to pick up the box of shotgun shells. If he's been firing at the cops since they cornered him, plus the time it took for Peter to swing to Jackson... do you get where I'm going with this?

The frightened WEINER moves to the side WINDOW to blow
SPIDEY away. As he moves past the front WINDOWS he is lit
by the SEARCHLIGHTS that play on his face darkly.
SPIDEY leaps in at FRONT WINDOW and drops neatly behind
WEINER, landing a pose.

SPIDER-MAN
(cold, hard)
Say your prayers, Weiner!

I'm sorry, but I can't take any badass one-liners seriously when they feature the name 'Weiner'. Dick, maybe. Hey, that's the only plus I can think of to having a secondary villain named Weiner...

SPIDER-MAN: Say your prayers, dick!

WEINER: My name's Weiner!

WOLVERINE: No, you're a dick.

WEINER whips around and fires. SPIDEY leaps to avoid it
and lands on a STACK of PAINT CANS.

WEINER
You ain't takin' me... Spider-Man... who
ever you are...

You just said he was Spider-Man.

SPIDEY gathers himself tighter. He leaps. A second GUN
BURST comes in behind him, Several PAINT CANS erupt in
cascades of COLOR.

Taste the rainbow. Or you'll become a PAINBOW!

I'm sorry, that was lame.

SPIDER-MAN
(hanging on ceiling)
Hey, creep!

What?

WEINER aims and fires, several times. He is emptying his
RIFLE.

But it's a movie rifle! They never run out of ammo and never jam when you rack them superfluously.

SPIDEY leaps away and lands on the top of a CASK
marked "CAUTION-FLAMMABLE SOLVENT!"

SPIDER-MAN
(taunting)
Try again.

Wait to see how Spider-Man, in his crimefighting debut and a supposedly serious and dramatic scene, is rendered an utter dumbass.

The CASK gives way and SPIDEY is plunged into the
FLAMMABLE SOLVENT.

[I]Idiot.

WEINER smiles his stupid grin and
takes aim.

SPIDEY leaps out of the CASK and sticks to the roof BEAM.
He's sopping wet. His hand slips down the BEAM as the
SOLVENT works against his sticking power.

Let me get this straight. Spider-Man's weakness is being wet?

He falls to the floor and scrambles behind some PAINT
CANS. WEINER, crazed, fires wildly. One of the CANS
EXPLODES. PAINT flows from it... burning!

This is the most unneccessary addition of flame to a scene since Flaming Moes were spilled at Josie's Bar.

SPIDEY peeks out and sees a YELLOW RIVER OF FLAME creeping
toward him. He sniffs his SOLVENT soaked outfit.

He backs down a "corridor" of PAINT CANS. The YELLOW FIRE
follows, now joined by a RIVER OF BLUE FIRE from another
can. They're following the trail of SOLVENT he's
dripping!

He's trapped!

So why doesn't he web-swing? Oh, wait, he STILL doesn't have either mechs or orgs.

COP (V.O.)
(on bullhorn)
This is your last chance, you two.
Either you're coming out, or we're coming
in!

SPIDEY'S against the WALL! PAINT CANS to his right and
left, and a RIVER of RED FLAME joins the YELLOW and BLUE
as they creep toward him!

He climbs backwards up the wall, face toward the BLAZE.
The COLORED FIRES join and follow him up the wall!
They're licking at his feet!

Oh, so now suddenly he has his wall-climbing ability back? Cheap! Lame!

SPIDEY is inches from being torched. He sees a PIPE. He
reaches out and grabs it. He swings out above the flames.
But the PIPE begins to bend!

Spider-Man needs to lay off the donuts...

The PIPE bends down... down... and then breaks! SPIDEY
hangs precariously as WATER cascades out of the PIPE and
puts out the FIRE.

SPIDEY drops down and rest his head in his hands to
collect himself. Then looks up. The GUN is at his head.

WEINER
Stand up, you.

Oh, c'mon. Like we're supposed to believe an idiot like Weiner is going to be able to kill Spider-Man. The idea that this loser would be able to put up a fight is ridiculous.

SPIDEY stands.

COP (V.O.)
You have thirty seconds to come out!

WEINER
You're my ticket outa here. Gimme that
stupid mask!

SPIDER-MAN hesitates. Then he begins to raise the MASK, but stops and shakes his head no.

You can stop cheering, Spider-Man 2 haters.

WEINER
Then I'll take it myself.

He reaches for the mask and SPIDER-MAN flips him across
the room. WEINER lands in a CARGO net and becomes
ensnared.

Sigh.

SPIDER-MAN
Well, look what we've caught in our web...

Wow. How ironic. Yawn.

WEINER
Don't hurt me, man. Please don't hurt me...

I'm not going to hurt you. I want you to do me a favor. Tell your friends about me. I'm Batman.

The Hero

09-08-2004, 03:25 PM

Weiner kills Uncle Ben?Seriously,someone needs to go send Kroenen,Boba Fett,and Adam West to painfuly assassinate the guy who wrote this.:mad:

Herr Logan

09-08-2004, 04:38 PM

Is it just me,or is it odd that the two most cringe-inducing moments in the Spider-Man movies,Peter and MJ's Spider-Man conversation,and Doc Ock's Shakespearian "NOOOOOOOO!",both take place in hospidals?:confused:

And I know this is off-topic,but am I the only one who thinks that if he were a little shorter,Ron Perlman would have made a good Wolverine?

It's hard to say which scenes were the most cringe-worthy in "Spider-Man 2," but I don't find Doc Ock's scene to be very cringe-worthy at all. It's the tentacles doing stuff on their own accord, with their own intelligence that's stupid.

Ron Perlman is huge, but if he were 5'7" or shorter, he could certainly act the part, even if he face is wrong for it. Definitely looks more like Sabretooth. Did you see that thread about Ron Perlman as Sabretooth, by the way?

The Hero

09-08-2004, 09:19 PM

Ron Perlman is huge, but if he were 5'7" or shorter, he could certainly act the part, even if he face is wrong for it. Definitely looks more like Sabretooth. Did you see that thread about Ron Perlman as Sabretooth, by the way?http://www.jas.com/wolverineworld/WGallery/2/big/wolvie47.jpg
http://ffmedia.ign.com/filmforce/image/ronperlman_blade2.jpg

Yeah,perhaps your right.Would've made a great Sabertooth,though.

Herr Logan

09-08-2004, 10:54 PM

Yeah, he definitely would have, if they wrote Sabretooth as the actual character and not a cardboard stand-in. If they wrote it like they should have, Ron Perlman is absolutely perfect for that part. Maybe even more so than Clancy Brown at his peak.

The Hero

09-08-2004, 11:13 PM

Yeah, he definitely would have, if they wrote Sabretooth as the actual character and not a cardboard stand-in. If they wrote it like they should have, Ron Perlman is absolutely perfect for that part. Maybe even more so than Clancy Brown at his peak.
Well,almost all of the villians(and some of the heros) in the first are cardboard stand-ins.I guess with so many characters,they could only fit in one fleshed-out villian.......Toad,erm,Magneto.Seriously,how can Toad,of all people,seem to get more screen time than Sabertooth?

By the way, to anyone unfortunate enough to have watched Alien Resurrection, Perlman played a character named Johner that was basically Wolverine with guns and no honor. For instance, "Don't push me, little Call. If you hang with us for a while, you'll find out I am not the man with whom to ****!"

Herr Logan

09-09-2004, 12:55 AM

Check the avatar. Boo and ya.

By the way, to anyone unfortunate enough to have watched Alien Resurrection, Perlman played a character named Johner that was basically Wolverine with guns and no honor. For instance, "Don't push me, little Call. If you hang with us for a while, you'll find out I am not the man with whom to ****!"

I did see it. Because I'd been reading Wolverine's solo comic for a long time by that point, I'd been accustomed to associating Wolverine with honor more than his earliest days with the X-Men, so I don't think it occurred to me at the time that Johner was like a huge version of Wolverine. Looking back, I definitely see it, though. Between that and "Hellboy," he's got the meanness, the confidence, and the banter capabilities required to be Wolverine.
Of course, I would never tolerate Perlman as Wolverine. He's freakin' huge, and that's even worse than casting Jackman. If I wrote and directed an X-Men or Wolverine movie, I'd definitely cast Perlman as Sabretooth.

White_Howling

09-09-2004, 01:02 AM

Alright let me give this ago.

The cars exploding and forming the Punisher skull

ahh i liked that scene..

the last line he said to john t. was pretty cool in a funny way

Zev

09-09-2004, 10:01 AM

INT. WAREHOUSE HALLWAY - NIGHT

COPS are poised at the door. A signal. They crash
inside.

"Let's do some good!"

INT. WAREHOUSE PAINT ROOM - NIGHT

COP #1
Hold your fire!

WEINER is hanging from the ceiling in the the CARGO NET.

WEINER
Get me out of this madhouse!

"By which I mean this movie!"

By the way, gang, lets see if Uncle Ben's death is ever referenced again.

He falls down, immediately encircled by the POLICE
OFFICERS. SPIDER-MAN flies above their heads, crashing
through the WINDOW and disappears into the dark of night.

I wouldn't say he's vengenace OR the night.

INT. CYCLOTRON - NIGHT

A weird, flickering BLUE LIGHT dances around the hole in
the CYCLOTRON. Then it cuts out. A HELMETED MAN pulls
himself out of a HATCH.

Who is that mysterious helmeted man?

He flips up the HELMET.
OCK is finishing putting together his new equipment.

My Swedish-made penis enlarger and me: This is my bag, baby.

OCK
(smiling)
Okey, dokey.

OCK goes about checking out the CYCLOTRON. It looks good.

Hey, cyclotron. Do you work out?

INT. CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

OCK starts flicking switches and reading DIALS, doing a
"mission countdown" for his next experiment. This place
has been "hot rodded" to the max.

He added some spoilers, a little fin, killer sound system, and one of those mudflaps with the naked ladies on it. Who-ee!

ONE of OCK'S WALDOS rests on the TABLE curled around the
COMPUTER. LIZ lets her hand rest on it. OCK warms
immediately.

I hate you script.

OCK
You know, you're a fascinating young lady...

Oh God. Ock's falling for the oldest trick in the book!

LIZ
Thank you...

OCK
You're so refreshing. You're so...

LIZ
Shocking...?

Refreshing? Shocking? What are they talking about, a woman or Lemon-Lime Mountain Dew?

OCK
(gone to far)
Oh, I wouldn't say shocking...

LIZ
I would!

"I like listening to Howard Stern!"

She sticks his WALDO in the ELECTRIC WALL SOCKET behind
the COMPUTER! The CURRENT sizzles through him and he
leaps up, WALDOS akimbo, like the "cartoon cat."

I think I just vomited in my mouth a little.

LIZ runs
out the door.

OCK extricates himself from the current and gives chase.

Does he do one of those 'running in mid-air for an instance before taking off in a cloud of dust' things? How is it that the director of Evil Dead 2 makes a film that's LESS cartoony then James Cameron's?

Zev

09-09-2004, 10:29 AM

INT. HALLWAY - NIGHT

LIZ burst from the DOOR.

LIZ
Peter...!

She looks both ways for PETER, doesn't see him, and takes
off! OCK bursts from the doorway and runs off after LIZ.

Somewhere, Michael Myers and Jason Voorhees are crying.

EXT. THE STREET - NIGHT

LIZ running as fast as she can, but OCK is gaining
quickly.

Yes, fat, middle-aged college professors can outrun athletic female students all the time. Unless he's using his tentacles, but there's no indication for that given. Can you say 'budgetary restrictions'?

EXT. PETER PARKER'S APARTMENT - NIGHT

A TAXI drives up and disgorges PETER.

Ewww...

PETER
Wait here...

INT. PETER PARKER'S APARTMENT - NIGHT

He walks in. It's empty

PETER
Liz?

LIZ (V.O.)
(screaming from the street)
Peter! Help! Peter!

PETER springs into action. He grabs his SPIDEY SUIT out
of a drawer and starts taking off his clothes.

Thankfully, this time we cut away.

EXT. STREET - NIGHT

LIZ looks back and sees OCK CARTWHEELING toward her.

cart·wheel (kärthwl, -wl)
n.
A handspring in which the body turns over sideways with the arms and legs spread like the spokes of a wheel.

Yup, Ock's really in character...

She
can't outrun him. She must hide. There's a CONSTRUCTION
SITE on the right. She ducks down the alley next to it.

Ki ki ki ki, ah ah ah ah...

INT. CONSTRUCTION ALLEY - NIGHT

LIZ runs into it and finds herself trapped on three sides
by a high CYCLONE FENCE. Behind her, OCK'S WALDOS stretch
out like waterbug legs.

Huh?

He bug-walks into the alley and
laughs down at her from his perch atop the WALDOS.

Why didn't he do this sooner?

OCK
Peter Parker has something I want... And
I'm going to have something he wants.

Wow! Thanks, movie, now I 'get' it.

She dashes past him and runs into the outboard CARGO
ELEVATOR.

Oh, COME ON! A girl is able to evade a master supervillain?

INT. ELEVATOR - NIGHT

She looks for the UP BUTTON and finds nothing! OCK, on
his feet now, is on the wire mesh ELEVATOR CAGE in a
flash. He tears the outer DOOR away.

The CAR arrives and LIZ jumps out. She's on nothing but a
narrow GIRDER! She tightropes on the GIRDER. OCK gets to
the top. He looks across at her. She's stuck between two
unfastened GIRDERS, at a dead end. He slowly telescopes a
WALDO toward her. She's got no place to run, no place to
hide.

Yeah, we got it. Already called it a dead end, Jimmy Cameron.

He grabs her by the BLOUSE and lifts her off the
GIRDER.

SPIDER-MAN (V.O.)
Put her down, Ock.

That's our hero's opening line to the villain? Jesus...

OCK looks across the street. There, on the top of a tall
building, is SPIDER-MAN.

SPIDER-MAN
I know what's happening to you, Ock.
I've been through a lot of changes myself
lately. You have to listen to me.

Gag.

OCK
(holding Liz)
Who the hell are you?

SPIDER-MAN
Spider-Man.

HELLO! In the last scene Ock said he knew about Spider-Man! Is Jimmy (and by Jimmy, I mean Timmy from South Park) reading his own script?

LIZ
(seeing Spidey)
Spider-Man...

OCK
That's a lot of crap, clown... I am
Spider-Man, not you.

Ah, is this 'Ock's Last Hunt'?

(points to Liz)
Ask you girlfriend.
(to Liz)
Tell him!

SPIDER-MAN
I'm a good friend of Peter Parker's Ock.
Just like that girl you're holding. Now
let her go.

"Well, since you're a friend of Peter Parker, okay!"

The sad thing is, I wouldn't be surprised if Ock did that.

OCK thinks for a moment, then he begins to extend the
kicking and screaming LIZ out over the street, ten stories
up.

OCK
Let her go? What an excellent idea. If
you do not deliver your friend, Mr.
Spider-Man, yes. Yes, of course, I'll
let her go.

You know, even the simple threat of letting a girl fall to her doom is trampled over by this poorly-written tripe.

LIZ
Put me down, you mechanical mutant!

Dear God, that line wouldn't be out of place in a Buck Rogers serial!

LIZ is having none of this. She kicks, she fights. She
twists. She flails around, making things a little worse.

In other words, she acts like an idiot.

The ground is yawning death beneath her. RRIIPP!
PART of her BLOUSE tears away and LIZ plummets!

What did she expect to happen?

SPIDER-MAN swoops down on a WEB-STRAND in his
characteristic compound curve.

WHAT THE ****! What the hell is this? Where did Spider-Man get web-shooters? This makes no sense whatsoever and Jimmy ain't even trying anymore! Any of you ever heard the Biblical tale of Job? It's like this script. With every page, there's more and more bad stuff.

He reaches out for the
falling LIZ and misses her cleanly. The WEB is too short.

LIZ
(falling away)
You jerk!

That could be funnier... if it were in a better movie.

He THWIPS her with a second WEB and together they swing to
a HIGH GIRDER where he deposits her safe and sound.

Double sigh. As long as we have to do this, shouldn't the line be "That's DOCTOR Octopus to you!"? Just wondering...

SPIDER-MAN
Give it up, Professor. You'll never
catch me!

Ah, he's been taking night lessons from the Gingerbread Man.

OCK takes three steps and soars through the air.

Huh? What's going on?

EXT. BRICK WALL - NIGHT

OCK, misjudging the leap, soars right past SPIDEY and into
an alley!

Our villain's a complete and utter bonehead, ladies and gentlemen. Hopefully you're used to it by now.

Screaming all the way...

EXT. THE ALLEY - NIGHT

OCK and TWO WALDOS pressed against each of the opposing
walls. It's a tenuous grip. Then, very slowly, sparks
flying from his WALDOS, OCK slides down into the alley.

You know, even this simple 'stunt' is described idiotically.

SPIDER-MAN
So long, sucker.

Is that a quip, even technically?

The Hero

09-09-2004, 12:31 PM

I did see it. Because I'd been reading Wolverine's solo comic for a long time by that point, I'd been accustomed to associating Wolverine with honor more than his earliest days with the X-Men, so I don't think it occurred to me at the time that Johner was like a huge version of Wolverine. Looking back, I definitely see it, though. Between that and "Hellboy," he's got the meanness, the confidence, and the banter capabilities required to be Wolverine.
Of course, I would never tolerate Perlman as Wolverine. He's freakin' huge, and that's even worse than casting Jackman. If I wrote and directed an X-Men or Wolverine movie, I'd definitely cast Perlman as Sabretooth.
It realy didn't matter who they cast,seeing as how pretty much all the role intitled was roaring and looking evil.

The Hero

09-09-2004, 12:48 PM

Actualy,the script above was not written by James Cameron at all.He was just going to direct it,but slapped his name on it so he'd get writing credits.

But he is the one who decided to make Ock say "Okey!Dokey!" every five seconds.:mad:

Zev

09-09-2004, 02:14 PM

Actualy,the script above was not written by James Cameron at all.He was just going to direct it,but slapped his name on it so he'd get writing credits.

But he is the one who decided to make Ock say "Okey!Dokey!" every five seconds.:mad:

I thought it was too bad for him to write. This is an important lesson about slapping your name on someone else's work. Said word? Could suck. Suck BALLS.

The Hero

09-09-2004, 02:36 PM

I don't know what's more annoying:That Cameron has such a big ego that he has to make sure he gets writing credits no matter how little he had to do with the writing,or that Ock say's "okey-dokey" once in the original script,and Cameron said "Hey,let's make that his catchphrase!".:rolleyes:

Dr. Manhatten

09-09-2004, 11:14 PM

Cameron doesn't have the power to just put his name on a movie's writing credits. No producer does. Studios send every draft to the WGA, who decides who gets the credit, and reviews every draft, to see who contributed most to the final movie. Cameron got a story by credit, which basically means it's a writer who was attached a long time ago, but wasn't when the movie was made. He got his credit since his big contribution was the invention of the organic webshooters

Zev

09-10-2004, 01:01 AM

Cameron doesn't have the power to just put his name on a movie's writing credits. No producer does. Studios send every draft to the WGA, who decides who gets the credit, and reviews every draft, to see who contributed most to the final movie. Cameron got a story by credit, which basically means it's a writer who was attached a long time ago, but wasn't when the movie was made. He got his credit since his big contribution was the invention of the organic webshooters

It says third revision by James Cameron. That's the revision we're going over. We don't know HOW MUCH he put in, because the organic webshooter isn't even presented (for that matter, neither are the mechanical webshooters). Frankly, we'll probably never know. Hollywood is a complicated place.

Zev

09-10-2004, 01:11 AM

God, anyone else feel like some kind of 9/11 Commission? "How much did Cameron write and when did he write it?"

The Navigator

09-10-2004, 04:32 PM

I think this is a toss-up between your comments and the script as faar as which is funnier...although one is, sadly, unintentionally funny...

But who decided to call Ock's tentacles WALDOS every time they're mentioned? A little diversity, like arms or tentacles, might actually have made me not cringe in embarassment at this. (well....any more than I would have, that is...)

Alas and alack...MAN...this...is....BAD...

Zev

09-12-2004, 12:44 PM

To an extent, all action movie scripts exist to bring about fight scenes. It's only a matter of how competent they do so. If the script's good, it unfolds organically, instead of "Oh, we've gone twenty minutes without some sex and violence, quick, find a reason for someone to hit someone else!"

Mortal Kombat has a very good reason. If they don't fight, the entire Earth will be destroyed!

Nothing is organic about the Daredevil script. We're dolloped out our portions of 'sex' (Elektra and Matt), 'comedy' (Foggy), and 'action' (Bullseye) at regular intervals, practically Pavlovian. There's the 'hero against a 100 men' fight (This is definitely Bizarro World. DD has to go through dozens of thugs to get to one lowlife, but when he has to fight Kingpin...). There's the Daredevil versus Bullseye fight. There's the Daredevil versus Elektra fight (add to the 'hero barely escapes from death' list here. How lucky that the woman who blames Daredevil for her father's death JUST SO HAPPENS to be DD's alter-ego's girlfriend?). There's the Daredevil versus Bullseye fight. And finally, the sum of all the paint-by-numbers screenwriting that came before. The Daredevil versus Kingpin fight.

It's said if you give a thousand monkeys a thousand typewriters, eventually (after years and years) they'll write Hamlet. If that's true, Daredevil must be their first draft.

Coming Soon: Worst Moments in Comic Books. Oh yes...

The Hero

09-12-2004, 03:10 PM

To an extent, all action movie scripts exist to bring about fight scenes. It's only a matter of how competent they do so. If the script's good, it unfolds organically, instead of "Oh, we've gone twenty minutes without some sex and violence, quick, find a reason for someone to hit someone else!"

Mortal Kombat has a very good reason. If they don't fight, the entire Earth will be destroyed!

Nothing is organic about the Daredevil script. We're dolloped out our portions of 'sex' (Elektra and Matt), 'comedy' (Foggy), and 'action' (Bullseye) at regular intervals, practically Pavlovian. There's the 'hero against a 100 men' fight (This is definitely Bizarro World. DD has to go through dozens of thugs to get to one lowlife, but when he has to fight Kingpin...). There's the Daredevil versus Bullseye fight. There's the Daredevil versus Elektra fight (add to the 'hero barely escapes from death' list here. How lucky that the woman who blames Daredevil for her father's death JUST SO HAPPENS to be DD's alter-ego's girlfriend?). There's the Daredevil versus Bullseye fight. And finally, the sum of all the paint-by-numbers screenwriting that came before. The Daredevil versus Kingpin fight.

It's said if you give a thousand monkeys a thousand typewriters, eventually (after years and years) they'll write Hamlet. If that's true, Daredevil must be their first draft.
Jeez,Zev,I'm not saying I liked Daredevil,but it's nowhere near THAT bad.

Coming Soon: Worst Moments in Comic Books. Oh yes...
Eeep.:eek:

Zev

09-12-2004, 09:53 PM

Them's the jokes, son.

Zev

09-13-2004, 11:04 AM

ADAPTING THE STONE WEEK

DAY 1: RESIDENT EVIL

Resident Evil: Apocalypse benefits from one inner truth. It's a big, silly, dumb action movie and it knows it. Characters introduce themselves by riding motorcycles through stained glass windows or walking into police stations and shooting zombies that are being Mirandaized (in a short scene that establishes new-comer Jill Valentine's 'I don't play by your rules, McGarret!' Tough Cop on the Edge credentials). Not much time for character development or deep, soul-searching dialogue. A character's feelings are indicated with lines of dialogue so hamfisted Orthodox Jews aren't allowed to be touched by them. "I barely feel human anymore," Alice annouces. Before we can dwell on that, we see a police sniper... wearing a cowboy hat... sitting in a lawn chair... on a roof... drinking beer... and shooting zombies. In another scene, a merc wrestles with a zombie dog. "Go on ahead, I'll handle this *****!" Then he notices ANOTHER zombie dog about to attack. "Oh ****," he opines before promptly being eaten.

In a world of sub-Buddhist drivel like the Star Wars prequels (with their "I'm a Jedi, I can't get married!" idiocy) and bourgeous philosophy like The Matrix sequels (RE has another leg-up on those movies which I'll get to in a moment), RE:A is refreshingly clear of any social commentary or message. It just wants to have fun, like a big puppy dog eager to please its master. Even the lifted-straight-from-the-game EvilCo baddies are treated in B-movie fashion. No screeds against capitalism here (Paul Anderson also wrote one of the most human corporate executives in a horror movie for years, Weyland in AVP. When you've watched as many "We can't close the beaches!" movies as I have, this kind of impartiality is refreshing. Has someone in Hollywood finally realized that the film industry is a big business too?).

For fans of the game, plenty of treats exist, as well as one reference to another popular game series that was turned into a popular movie. From the runaway semi that met its end in Resident Evil 2, to a gunshop with a motorcycle parked in front, to the evil French executive (I nicknamed him Frenchie) who gives an order during the final fight to "Finish him!" An action scene near the end is even lifted from the Resident Evil: Code Veronica opening cutscene.

Even the Odious Comic Relief, Mike Epps, isn't so Odious. "Please!" he remarks as he's offered a shotgun to defend himself, showing a pair of gold-plated pistols to his allies. "I've got my **** customized!"

Ah, the plot. Do you really want to know? Okay. Alice is in much the same position as she was at the end of the first movie, trapped in a city full of zombies. Only now it's revealed that experimentation done on her has turned her into a superhero (I would love to be a fly on the wall when this idea originated between screenwriter Anderson and his wife, Milla Jovovich. "Honey, do you want to be a superhero?" "Ah, that's so sweet of you, hon..."). She groups up with some other survivors, including an abandoned Umbrella team (bizarrely packing automatic weaponry instead of, say, rifles to pick off zombies via headshots), a Reporter Who'll Do Anything For A Scoop (her handheld camera is used as an exposition-provoking device thoughout), the aforementioned Jill Valentine, a cop, and (Not) Odious Comic Relief ebonics guy.

They're quickly given an offer they can't refuse by a wheelchair-bound scientist ('Mein Fuhrer, I can valk!') whose handicap actually serves a purpose to the plot. At the same time, Frenchie decides to make lemonade from his lemons and lets the Nemesis, a Terminator-like super-soldier, loose to kick ass and takes names. From there on, there's kung-fu fighting against zombies, running over zombies with cars, zombie hookers, and lots of explosions. Anderson keeps things light with a plot so thin it could be blown away by a strong breeze. A few cliches are gleefully broken such as when an Action Hero Moment attempt to be a badass fizzles out like a match.

As usual, the stage is set for another, Bigger and Badder sequel at the end (you notice Anderson always has cool endings?), indicating that Anderson has at least put some thought into where the franchise can go, unlike, say, the Scream or Matrix franchises, which achieve an 'Oh ****, they want a sequel? What do we do? Quick, lets pull something out of our ass and let the fans eat it up!" kind of desperation.

I do have some complaints however. One, the repertoire of monsters hasn't increased from the original. There's still zombies, zombie dogs, Lickers. We do get the Nemesis, but I was hoping for more. Second, there's a notable lack in the gore department. Thirdly, there are a few too many 'character wanders off alone, swinging gun around after each noise" and "character approachs possibly zombified individual from the back" (I always wonder why no one says "Give me a sign you're human in five seconds or I'll blow your brains out")

And the film works more as an adaptation then a 'sidestory' like the original. I wonder if there was ever an idea showing Alice, Chris Redfield, Barry Burton, and Rebecca Chambers doing what they do best while the videogames of Resident Evil 2 and Nemesis went on in the background. I don't know if that would be better or worse at deflecting claims of unfaithfulness to the source, since some people seem to want to see a word-for-word translation of the video games (sometimes in the same breath as asking why George Romero's script wasn't used, despite it having Native American Chris getting him some Valentine pootie tang).

And is it too much to ask that one of the evil corporate bad guys say "Hey, I'm Wesker"? Because that would just be aces.

Zev

09-16-2004, 12:47 AM

ADAPTING THE STONE

The adaptation of a novel for the screen is always a delicate business. Literature and film might both be art forms, but they are not interchangeable; and with rare exceptions – within the world of the genre film, Polanski’s amazingly faithful adaptation of Ira Levin’s Rosemary’s Baby comes to mind – changes to the original story will, even must, be made when it is transferred to the screen. The important issue is – what changes, and why? Is the adaptation faithful to the spirit of the novel, if not to the letter?"

DAY 2: DRACULA MEETS FRANKENSTEIN MEETS LITERACY

Suffice to say that people are (usually) much more forgiving of books being adapted differently then any other medium I know of. The Bela Lugosi and Boris Karloff Dracula and Frankenstein, respectively, were broad strokes away from the original novels (although still much closer then Francis Ford Coppola's Dracula). Frankenstein featured a climax in the Antarctic (or Arctic. I really don't think it matters), while the movie has nary a snowflake. Two characters survive in the movie that die in the book. And the book Creature (no, his name is not Frankenstein and he is NOT a monster, so the proper name is Frankenstein's Creature. Thank you) was a wordy bastard, while Boris doesn't even say "Fire bad!" And the epitome of bad changes, something that makes you want to hit someone in the head, the 'rationalizing' of the Creature being a killer by giving him an 'abnormal brain'. With that plot thread, the movie shoots itself in the foot. 'Everything would be okay,' the inescapable conclusion is, 'if only they'd gotten a NORMAL BRAIN.' Yes, normal brains don't mind being whipped and tortured by hunchbacks, and have an excellent knowledge of basic physics ("flowers float, girls don't").

The Dracula movie turned Dracula into the quasi-sex symbol we have today and replaced Jonathan Harker's trip to the Borgo Pass (which he leaves "tomorrow eeeve-ning") with Renfield. Lucy's entire subplot was cut down to basically Dracula biting her. In all cases, the 'adaptation' was not based on the book, but on one of the stage play adaptations of the book. In other words, an adapation of an adaptation. Hearsay, your honor!

So INACCURACY of adaptations is nothing new. In some cases better, in some worse. Who can say that the innocent Creature, straining to touch the sun, is worse then the Creature who learns English when it's in the area when an impoverished Parisian noblemen is giving lessons to his runaway Arabian bride. Or that the novel's scheming, murderous Creature is worse then the endlessly-prattling Baron Frankenstein's comic relief (why is it that comic relief always leaves you wanting RELIEF from the COMEDY?).

And lets not forget Jurassic Park. The original film departed with intelligence from the source, capturing the essence of the material while eliminating eniter sequences (a harrowing boat escape from the T-Rex), characters' survival was shifted (Gennaro and Muldoon survived while Hammond and Malcolm died, although the latter was retconned into Malcolm only being severely injured for the sequel book), and various other changes were made to bring the story to screen, including turning Hammond into a nice, but misguided grandfatherly type (although, in keeping with political correctness, a cowardly, sleazebag lawyer was provided to get eaten).

Yet the Lost World was SO different from the book, that the title didn't even make sense. Not to mention the adding of Nick Van Owen, possibly the most reprehensible 'good guy' character in a major motion picture to date. Through his actions, literally dozens of people die and not once does he show the slightest regret. And yet this psychopathic environmentalist is given a free pass by the script. Unforgivable.

Not to mention Sarah Harding is turned into a dumb bimbo who, after blabbing on and on about how great the T-Rexes' sense of smell is, WALKS AROUND WITH A JACKET COVERED IN BABY T-REX BLOOD! Integral character Richard Levine is taken out of the movie (he's the guy who gets it all going in the book. Imagine Jurassic Park without Hammond, for instance), the villains are changed to particularly inept mercenaries (with all their guns, not ONE of them is able to kill a SINGLE dinosaur. Even the second in command only manages to shock one of the bird-sized compys), pointless cruelty is inserted (the T-Rex ate the family dog! And now he's gonna eat the family! THAT'S ENTERTAINMENT!), and various other alterations that compare to the first Jurassic Park's changes in the same way that disfiguring cuts compare to plastic surgery.

Change is usually okay and sometimes good... so long as it's not stupid.

The Navigator

09-16-2004, 09:06 AM

We agree again. This is starting to become a habit...but Richard levine was an unusually high *********, even in Crichton books. He always has an "a-hole" character, but I think he went overboard with this one. I would have preferred to see more of the gnetics mercenary in the book, whatever his name was. (He partnered himself with a man called King, if that helps. I can't remembr him.) Now THAT was a villain.

Zev

09-16-2004, 09:27 AM

What's worst is that while the book's fate for the villain was genuinely horrifying (equal parts 'Man, I'd hate to be in HIS shoes' and 'Ha, you got what you deserved, you bastard!'), in the movie it's played as 'cute'. I don't know what Ludlow did that was so overwhelmingly evil he deserved to be savagely eaten... oh, wait, he tried to make money by capturing (make that REcapturing) artifically-created animals. Which I assume would create jobs for hundreds of people running the zoos. In the first film the message was that nature couldn't be controlled, here it's that it can be, but shouldn't.

Ludlow's operation of capturing dinosaurs is working perfectly until the Earth First idiot shows up, as per Hammond's apparent orders (!). Why, pray tell, didn't they arrange for a chopper to pick them up at a designated time if they couldn't phone in? Just have it fly over head and only land if the mercenaries indicated they needed help. Or the board members with whom Ludlow was having a teleconference send in a rescue party? Or have a car or radio that wasn't destroyed in the breakout? Because if any of those things happened, the movie wouldn't work. Stupid movie.

Zev

09-16-2004, 10:03 AM

EXT. STREET - NIGHT

COP CARS pull up. COPS leap from them.

Followed closely by clown cars pulling up. Clowns leap from them.

EXT. SIDE WALL - NIGHT

OCK makes it down, sees the COPS, ducks out of sight.

Surprisingly easy to do for a man descending on extended metal tentacles.

EXT. COP CARS - NIGHT

The SEARCHLIGHTS go on. SPIDER-MAN swings back across the
street to the CONSTRUCTION SITE.

COP #1
There he is!

COP #2
It's that Spider-Man!

Gag me.

EXT. THE ROOF - NIGHT

SPIDEY lands next to LIZ in a pose. Lit by the flashing
BILLBOARD, he's weirder looking than ever.

If you say so.

SPIDEY puts an
arm around LIZ and extends a WEB SHOOTER.

What? Huh? So now his web-shooters are organic? What the hell is going on here?

LIZ
What do you think you're doing?

SPIDER-MAN
I'm rescuing you.

Shouldn't that be obvious to Liz that he's going to get her down? In fact, I'm pretty sure the only reason she asked was so Spider-Man could make set up a joke.

With that SPIDEY leaps way out and he and LIZ swoop away
on a WEB-STRAND.

LIZ
Thanks but nooooooooooo!

Hoho, she's terrified! Maybe she'll have a heart attack and die! That would be hilarious!

EXT. THE COP CARS - NIGHT

ALL WEAPONS point upward at SPIDEY'S movement.

COP #2
He won't get away this time!

COP #1
Hold your fire! He's got a girl.

COP #2
Looks like he's got a hostage.

Which is why Spider-Man should ask nicely before he swings away with pretty girls. This is how Kobe got in trouble, you know...

EXT. WEB STRAND - NIGHT

SPIDEY sees the WEAPONS aimed upward. He shoots out
another WEB and swings off in a different direction. LIZ
whoops with the G-force.

G-force: a unit of inertial force on a body that is subjected to rapid acceleration or gravity, equal to 32 ft. per second per second at sea level.

Dude, Spider-Man can really book it!

LIZ
Wait a minute. Where are you taking me?

Women, huh? Always wanting to stop and ask for directions...

SPIDEY hounded by the Police, rejected by the girl.

It's not rejection when you're asked a simple question.

SPIDER-MAN
I better just take you back where you
belong.

Wait, where were you taking her in the first place?

He shoots out another WEB.

SPIDER-MAN
Hold on tight.

LIZ
(Times Square)
Where are we?

Times Square! Don't you read your own lines?

SPIDER-MAN
Open your eyes.

They are standing on the ROOF of the CENTRAL TOWER of the
EMPIRE UNIVERSITY BUILDING. LIZ opens her eyes. It's an
extraordinary sight.

Then by all rights it has no place in this movie!

LIZ
(the Empire State Building)
If you're trying to impress me Spidey, I
want you to know I'm not easy.

That's not what I've heard!

Not to gossip, but I don't think Liz should be wearing white on her wedding day, know what I mean? Wink.

Okay, I'm
impressed... now put me down, Spidey...
put me down.

SPIDER-MAN
I like the way you say Spidey... Nobody
calls me Spidey...

"Well, there is this one really lame script, but other then that...

now we go...

EXT. DORMITORY - NIGHT

They swoop down... and down... stopping on one of the
building's SILLS, actually right in front of a WINDOW in
the DORMITORY BUILDING.

LIZ
(Tavern on the Green)

Is she leading a tour group in the parenthesis? Honestly, what is going on?

Wow... look, this is our dormitory. I
can get to my room. Hey, wait a minute...
there's Flash, if I'm not mistaken.

'if I'm not mistaken'? Geez, this girl puts on more airs then Gwyneth Paltrow!

SPIDER-MAN
Liz?

LIZ
You know my name?

D'oh! Talk about not protecting your secret identity...

SPIDER-MAN
Liz, listen to me. There's something I
have to tell you.

"Liz, I... ah... I missed my period."

LIZ
Okay, put me down and we can talk,
alright?

Watch the steadily growing unease...

SPIDER-MAN
Do you know who I am?

LIZ
All I know is you're the Amazing
Spider-Man... or better you're Spidey the
good guy on the block... you're a weirdo
in a clown spider suit.

Make up your mind!

SPIDER-MAN
And that's all you know about me?
(a beat, a sigh)
Okay, lets get your boyfriend.

Yeah, it's funny how people don't know who you are unless you tell them.

LIZ
Which one?

SPIDER-MAN
How many do you have? I meant Flash.

See what I mean about not wearing white?

LIZ
Well, Flash is not exactly my boyfriend...

SPIDER-MAN
He's not? Then who is?

Maybe she doesn't need a man in her life to make her feel complete? You ever think of that, you sexist pig?

PETER
Oh... Sorry... I gotta hurry... I have to
find Harry... I'll see you later.

WORST... EXCUSE... EVER! Comedy.

Because it's only funny if everyone is an idiot.

LIZ
Peter!

PETER runs off. He sees a car approach and flags it.

Is it yellow? Is it a cab? If not, I don't think you're going to get a ride in New York.

PETER
Hey! Can I get a lift downtown?

FLASH
Take your shoes for a walk, Dork.

I think Biff from Back to the Future invented that line, then threw it away for being too dumb.

FLASH gets out of his car, and crosses the lawn toward
LIZ.

INT. CONTROL ROOM - DAY

OCK is hard at work. The room, still rippled, has been
"hot rodded" to the max. Lots of jerry-rigged stuff has
been added.

And no one thinks to look for the escaped psychotic maniac BACK AT THE SCENE OF THE CRIME?

Stupid, stupid, STUPID!

OCK takes a sip from the THERMOS and flicks on the small
TAPE RECORDER.

Ah, Tape Recorder as Expositionary Device. Where would the lazy screenwriter be without it? Of course, this is only here because the Henchman as Expositionary Device has already been used (maybe) and said Henchman is in jail.

It says something that both these devices were old when they were used in Batman & Robin (!).

OCK
We are new inserting Peter Parker's data
on tonight's Planetary Conjunction.

It's just that easy, folks!

INSERT: The COMPUTER SCREEN displays Peter Parker's name
and ID number and the title, "The Planetary Conjunction
and it's effect on Earth Gravity."

Hey, maybe if I get a report on how to mock bad scripts, I can just insert the data into the computer and prove once and for all that Daredevil sucks. BWAHAHAHAHA!

Honestly, The Net had more realistic computers then this mess.

OCK
Yes, yes! Go on! Go on!

Repeat, repeat! Every, every! Phrase, phrase!

INSERT: NUMBER SEQUENCES appear on the SCREEN. Then a
GRAPHIC of the EARTH moving into line with SATURN,
JUPITER, the SUN and the MOON. In the corner a NUMBER
rises.

Ooh! Aah!

OCK
Enormous. It's enormous.

Earth's moon is no moon! It's a space station! Look at the size of that thing!

(to recorder)
The Parker calculations add 4%
gravitational force at the moment of full
Planetary Conjunction.
(hits some keys)
Adding this to present maximum power
potential, I get...

Herpes. Sometimes them's the breaks when you're in quantum physics. Or sleeping with hookers.

He looks up and sees the SCREEN a GRAPHIC "HOLE" opening
up right through the EARTH! The widening HOLE is
swallowing everything!

That's the biggest 'hole I've seen since Quentin Black posted here!

OCK
I knew it. I knew it! Universal
destruction! It's doable!

Ah, I see Ock's been looking for a more annoying catch-phrase then 'Okie-dokie!'

I am putting
a countdown clock on the Planetary
Conjunction now!

A Doomsday Countdown. THERE'S something fresh and original. Boy, I hope Spider-Man stops him in time!

A LARGE DIGITAL DISPLAY reads, "13:00:03." The last
seconds count down to, "12:59:59!"

OCK
(playing the computer)
Okey, dokey. Now let's see if I have
enough power to drive this beast.

What millions of gamers said before installing Doom 3.

He starts hitting KEYS on his COMPUTER.

INT. PETER PARKER'S APARTMENT - NIGHT

And now it's night. So a whole day has passed and nothing important has happened.

PETER is working on LIZ'S COMPUTER. There is a KNOCK at
his brand new, unpainted DOOR. He hurries to it and pulls
the KNOB so quickly (forgetting his own strength) that the
whole assembly comes off in his hand.

Dumb. Ass.

PETER
(pulling Harry aside)
I gotta remember to have that fixed.
(opens the door)
There you are, I've been looking for you
all over town.

HARRY
What happened?

PETER
Where were you?

"You were at that hussy Eddie's, weren't you!"

HARRY
I went to the wrestling, wanted to see
that Amazing Spider-Man, but he didn't
show up.

PETER
Listen, Harry something terrible happened.

HARRY
What? What?

Wot wot, know what I mean, cheerio...

PETER
My Planetary Conjunction papers... they
were stolen...

HARRY
Oh my God... Are you sure...? Who would
do such a thing?

PETER
Ock...

HARRY
Of course... but why...?

Of those four words, two should not be there.

PETER
We have to find out, sit down.
(indicates computer)
I want to access Dr. Octavius' main
program. I want to know about his
experiments with the cyclotron. Can you
do it?

Wait, he wants to know about Octavius' experiments with the cyclotron, but he HASN'T CHECKED THE OLD CYCLOTRON?

Of course. Because if he did, he would find Ock and the movie would be over.

HARRY
(starts hacking)
I can try. I could access the system in
the dorm. Okay. And through that I
could crack the main line.

"This is Unix! I know this!"

PETER
Alright. Now if we can just disrupt the
Octavius file...

If you want to piss someone off over the net, just give their e-mail to a spider-bot.

HARRY
Okay, let's try.

HARRY cracks his knuckles like a safe cracker and bends to
the task. The PHONE RINGS. PETER hits his jerry-rigged
SPEAKER PHONE. HARRY keeps hacking.

Wait a minute. So we don't get any motivation at all for Jameson's hatred of Spider-Man? He just comes out of nowhere and says he needs bad guy shots? That's what I call 'throwing a bone to the fans' (similar to how CINO included a picture of Selina Kyle as 'one' of the Catwomen throughout history).

PETER hangs up. The DIAL TONE cuts off JAMESON.

INT. JAMESON'S OFFICE - NIGHT

Only he and the PHOTO ASSISTANT are there.

JAMESON
What about that kid? On the job already?

'On the job already' should end with an exclamation point. And why is the photo assistant there? THIS is the last time we see Jameson in the script. Honest this time.

Puddin

09-16-2004, 01:20 PM

I don't know if this has been mentioned but for me the whole SHIELD movie is terrible ... I saw the last 15 minutes maybe and it was the worst thing i've ever watched ... need I say more then ....... David Hasselhoff ?!

Zev

09-16-2004, 02:14 PM

INT. CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

OCK is pacing around the hot rodded room.

How many times are we going to be told it's 'hot rodded'? Why not just put it in the slugline?

He checks this
and that. He looks at the COUNTDOWN CLOCK (06:00:10) and
throws himself down in his CHAIR. He resumes his check-
down.

I know the feeling. It gets so boring in between starting the doomsday countdown and waiting for the hero to show up, which they ALWAYS do just when you've given up on them. I mean, your adrenaline is pumping, you've put the thingamajig right into the whatchamacallit, you're all 'Nothing can stop me now!"

Then nothing. No one says "We'll see about that, madman!" It wasn't like that back in the good old days. When Nazi Master activated his death ray, the heroes were on the ball. Someone was there to slap him down. They had a flair for the dramatics. Nowadays it's "oh, I'll get there when I get there, but right now I have to be henpecked by my mother because it's 'funny'."

Oh, that thing Ock's been on about for the entire movie? Nah, that couldn't be it!

HARRY
Could be...

PETER
Or Doc Ock's end of the world experiment...
Or both!

He's gonna be embarrassed when he finds out that Doc Ock has only used the additional gravitational force to power a Slushie Machine... OF DOOM!

HARRY
Wait a minute. You're not telling me you
think the world is gonna end tonight...?

Judgment Day is inevitable...

PETER
You want to wait around till midnight to
find out?

Oh, WHAT A COINCIDENCE that the countdown just happens to end at midnight. Now I know why the script's been jumping around so much.

Although if midnight's in six hours, shouldn't that mean it's six o'clock right now? That's not even evening.

HARRY
No, but...

PETER
Let's see what else we've got.

But wait, there's MORE!

Another set of numbers roll up on the SCREEN. They are
accompanied by ELECTRICAL SYMBOLS.

The Matrix has you...

HARRY
What's that?

PETER
It might be a calculation of the amount
of power he needs to create the hole
between the force and the anti-force.

The Anti-Force? Isn't that the evil thing in the New Jedi Order series?

HARRY
That's a lot of energy. What could
generate power like that?

Superman?

PETER
The closest you could come is the New
York City Subway System.

That too.

Again, the lights flicker and then dim and they return.

HARRY/PETER
(together)
We gotta talk to Professor Rosomorf!!

Or you could go to where Ock's cyclotron is... RIGHT WHERE HE LEFT IT!

INT. BROADWAY EXPRESS - NIGHT

ROZ boards and takes a seat. There are the usual SUBWAY
TYPES. A FAT WOMAN. A PIMPLY TEENAGER and his date, a
TALL SKINNY GIRL in a PARTY DRESS.

Don't look at me, I'm saving my ammo for biggest targets.

ROZ, making notations in a PAD, takes no notice of them.
He sits down, closes his PAD, and taps a PENCIL against
his chin.

Hmm, are there any other MILFs in my neighborhood?

ROZ
Plutonium...

EXT. MAJOR INTERSECTION - NIGHT

TAXIS go by. TWO LOVERS stroll. We hear a familiar
WHINE. The "WALK" and "DON'T WALK" signs FLASH at the
same time.

But do the little men start fighting like in Superman 3?

BOY
Make up your mind!

The signs EXPLODE! The COUPLE stops in their tracks. The
BOY looks at the GIRL.

So, like, you want to get some punch?

GIRL
What's going on?

An ARC of ELECTRICITY now shoots between the LIGHT PILLARS
of the SUBWAY STATION on the corner.

INT. BROADWAY LOCAL - NIGHT

SPARKS fly by the window. ROZ, oblivious at first, is now
stunned by the show.

Should I even mention that these kind of 'destroy the world!' shenanigans are totally out of place in Spider-Man. Even for Doc Ock, the most grandiose villain, the destruction in Spider-Man 2 would only affect New York (presumably, and that's enough!).

EXT. SUBWAY TRAIN ENTRANCE - NIGHT

The ARCS of ELECTRICITY continue to rise. The STREET
LIGHTS buckle and bend into weird shapes.

Paging Devlin and Emmerich, paging Devlin and Emmerich...

WOMAN
Oh my God!

MAN
Get back! Get back!

EXT. INTERSECTION - NIGHT

TWO TAXIS roar through the intersection and COLLIDE. The
ETHNIC DRIVERS leap out and begin arguing.

No, this isn't racist AT ALL!

INT. TRAIN - NIGHT

PEOPLE SCREAM and fall back as the TRAIN seems to change
angles.

Change angles? Huh?

EXT. SUBWAY ENTRANCE - NIGHT

A building ROAR rises from the SUBWAY ENTRANCE. Then the
sound of a TRAIN WHISTLE! The BOY looks down the STAIRS
and has to leap out of the way as the BROADWAY EXPRESS
comes highballing up the STEPS and blasts through the
SUBWAY entrance.

What luck that it ran up the stairs instead of into the wall.

The TRAIN sails through the air.

EXT. LUXURY CONDO HIGH-RISE - NIGHT

The TRAIN crashes into the building in a storm of
cyclotron generated Dali physics.

So, basically the part in The Matrix where the helicopter crashed into a building (if I can talk about aircraft crashing into buildings post-9/11)

EXT. THE STREET - NIGHT

The THROB and PULSE recede. SCREAMS, HONKS, SIRENS can be
heard.

Now, this could be an effective moment. The quiet after the storm. So lets pass over it as quickly as possible and get to more 'Towering Inferno' shenanigans.

EXT. LUXURY CONDO HIGH-RISE - NIGHT

A splendidly turned out MIDDLE-AGED WOMAN wakes from her
satin sleep

Is satin sleep more or less absorbent then cotton sleep?

to see that a SUBWAY TRAIN is in the middle of
her BEDROOM. The WALL through which the train has come
sags and ripples like it has melted and partially
resolidified.

WOMAN
Henry!!!

"You're my knight in shining armor!"

Several PASSENGERS climb out of the WINDOWS of the TRAIN
or pry open the DOORS.

WOMAN
What are you doing here? Get out of here!
Get out of here!

And they're okay!

EXT. THE STREET - NIGHT

A CROWD has gathered to gawk and point. They look up and
we see their POV.

The MIDDLE CAR of the TRAIN is simply "embedded" in the
HIGH-RISE, its rear sticking out of the building fifteen
stories up. From its COUPLING dangles the LAST CAR.

INT. MIDDLE CAR - NIGHT

The car is bisected in the middle by the fused brick and
glass of the WALL of the building. PASSENGERS on the
outside of the WALL press their faces to the GLASS and
pound for help.

ROZ comes to the aid of a MOTHER with TWO CHILDREN.

Gee, I wonder if Spider-Man will save the day...

Zev

09-16-2004, 02:48 PM

EXT. THE STREET - NIGHT

The CROWD sees something else. Swinging high in the sky
is your friendly neighborhood SPIDER-MAN. The COUPLE and
TWO DRIVERS argue about what this means.

It's a sign of the end times!

WOMAN
It's Spider-Man!

TRUCK DRIVER #1
Get outa here, you bum!

Why is it that one of the most important features of Spider-Man, the public's mixed reaction to him, is only paid lip service in this script? Hell, Jameson is practically a nonentity.

ROZ
Spider-Man! Listen to me! If he can do
this with the train, if he's come this
far, then I can pretty well predict his
next step. He'll go to Plutonium SL 270
for the power. He must be stopped... or
else he'll destroy our world.

What? Ming the Merciless... I mean, Doctor Octopus will destroy the world?

And shouldn't your ass be waiting until you're OUT of the train?

The COUPLING shrieks and the CAR lurches.

SPIDER-MAN
Let's get you out of here first,
Professor.

Finally, a sensible idea.

ROZ
Wait Spider-Man.

[I]UGH!

I don't think I can
make it... You mustn't waste time saving
me... you must save the world! You must
go and stop Ock!

"Flash, Flash, I love you, but we only have fourteen hours to save the Earth!"

When in doubt, quote Flash Gordon. And don't do drugs. There, now you know as much about life as I do.

SPIDER-MAN
Where can I find him...?

ROZ
He is looking for Plutonium SL 270 I'm
sure...

Man, sure is lucky Spider-Man ran into some guy who knows all the details of Ock's evil plan. Of course, in Spider-Man 2 Harry happened to know where Ock was holed up... It's not often you find a plot hole that could be plugged with a spider-tracer.

"You've got a train to catch."

Throw. Snag.

"We'll settle up later, Ock."

But hey, that's just my opinion.

The CAR lurches on its side and ROZ flies out of the DOOR.
SPIDEY THWIPS out a WEB that girdles ROZ'S waist.

SPIDER-MAN
Think Rosomorf, think where one can find
Plutonium? Where could he find SL 270...?

Don't encourage him, Spider-Man.

EXT. LUXURY CONDO HIGH-RISE - NIGHT

ROZ is hanging in mid-air on the WEB.
ROZ shouts.

ROZ
(shouting)
There's only one place he can get the
Plutonium SL 270...

SPIDER-MAN
Where...?

ROZ
Toxic... toxic dump... any toxic dump
would have SL 270.

'Any toxic dump'? That sounds like more then 'only one place'.

SPIDEY swings ROZ in an arc to the FIREMAN. He misses ROZ
on the first pass. ROZ looks up at SPIDEY who stands in
the doorway, manipulating the WEB.

The FIREMAN grabs ROZ. Then, with an awful SCREECH of
steel, the CAR pulls loose from the COUPLING. With
SPIDER-MAN inside it, the CAR plunges ten stories to the
street below.

Yes! Die, Spider-Fraud! DIE!

EXT. STREET - NIGHT

COPS, FIREMEN, PRESS, the works. The CROWD GASPS. CAMERA
STROBES pop as the LAST CAR crashes to the SIDEWALK. We
hold several beats on the incredible rubble.

Oh no? Is Spider-Man (choke!) dead?

Then, a WEBBED HAND. SPIDER-MAN groggily pulls himself
from the wreckage.

And there was much rejoicing.

COP (V.O.)
Put your hands up, Spider-Man.

SPIDER-MAN
You're making a big mistake.

COP
And you're looking at twenty years.

And you're... a big poopy head!

SPIDER-MAN shoots a WAD of WEB GOO onto the COP'S GUN and
leaps up onto the LUXURY CONDO... and swings up out of the
frame. The COP aims and shoots. The BULLET makes a
THWUMP noise. The WEB GOO stretches out about three feet
and falls limp.

Is this a metaphor for the Boulder Colorado PD?

COP
What the hell!

The Navigator

09-17-2004, 02:29 PM

Hehehe...keep 'em coming.

Zev

09-20-2004, 09:48 AM

And now for something completely different.

Why Black Cat should be the secondary 'villain' in Spider-Man 3 instead of the Lizard (and I shouldn't even have to tell you why Harry should be the main villain).

The traditional mistake in fiction is making the villain more interesting, to give him more 'face time' and make him 'bigger', then the hero. The antagonish is by definition PRO-ACTIVE, they get the story moving, then the hero reacts. Harry is inherently interesting. He has to choose between obeying his "father's" wishes and killing Spider-Man or forgiving his best friend. Man vs. himself. The conflict writes itself (trust me, I know!). But with so much 'weight' on that portion of the story, the Mary-Jane/love story side will suffer. SOMETHING needs to be done to put attention on her, to make HER story as interesting as Peter's and Harry's. It's the old 'Moonlighting' problem. We've answered the 'Will they or won't they?' question, where do you go from there? There has to be drama, there has to be conflict, and having your boyfriend palling around with a chick in a leather catsuit (and, on the other hand, having a girlfriend that doesn't trust you) is BIG-TIME conflict.

Plus, the addition of Black Cat solves the problem with 'repeating' the Goblin in a way that even turning him into the Hobgoblin can't. We've seen the Goblin before. It can be realized more competently and with a bigger budget, sure, but it's still the same thing. Add the Lizard? Possible, but what relation does it have to Harry? How is his story resolved? Should the character play second-fiddle to Harry? No. Just about any other villain you can name is either too big or too small to 'spice up' a third movie while still letting Harry have the main villain spotlight.

Here's how I see it. Peter Parker is Spider-Man, Mary-Jane worries about him being Spider-Man. He has to fight crime, she wants him to spend time with her. Let the police handle it. Let the fire department handle it. Let the FBI handle it. Peter has a responsibility though. He knows if he takes a night off, someone else's uncle could die... He doesn't want to put anyone through that. But being Peter, he can't explain that. Spider-Man is screwing up the relationship, just like he always does. They fight, your typical young lovers' quarrel, and Peter tries to get away from it all by doing crime-fighting.

Nothing. Zilch. He can't vent on anyone because no one's committing a crime. Where's a supervillain when you need one? But he's paying so much attention that he happens to see a theft in progress. He busts in, sees Black Cat stealing something. They fight. And while Spider-Man has more raw power, he's unfocused. Angry. She's in the zone, she knows kung-fu. Finally, Spider-Man just tells her to put the loot back. Having a little fun with him, she does and runs out.

Spider-Man is surprised and pursues her. On a rooftop, they have a short conversation. Black Cat reveals that SPIDER-MAN was the one who inspired her to put on the costume and start 'having fun'. She's still amoral and we all know that she's no-good for Peter (ever had one of those friends who dates a 'psycho chick' or a jerk, but they can't or won't see it?)... but he, of course, is flattered. He starts on a little project to 'rehabiliate' her. They go crime-fighting together. They have chemistry. She laughs at his lame jokes, they banter (some would say flirt), and they bring in the bad guys.

Mary-Jane detects the nugget of truth in the 'rehabilitation' concept, that Peter is a bit attracted to Black Cat, and, overreacting on somewhat justified mistrust (it is revealed that her father cheated on her mother), gets into another fight with Peter... which nearly drives him into Black Cat's arms. Black Cat, of course, tries to convince Spider-Man to share his identity with her, to take their relationship to the next level. It's an intriguing prospect: unlike with Mary-Jane, Black Cat is someone he can share everything with. Mary-Jane can't understand the appeal of going out and HELPING PEOPLE, the freedom of being behind a mask. She can't know how bad people can be to each other (the same psychology as how cops and firemen relate to their wives). And of course, with all that adrenaline flowing through you, would you be able to resist grabbing the nearest leather-clad babe and giving her the once-over? It's a twist on the old nugget of Peter falling in love, but Spidey screwing it up. This time it's the opposite way around. Of course, Black Cat and Spider-Man agree to 'just be friends' (hopefully without that stupid "I love Spider-Man, not Peter Parker!" twist. Just because they can't be together doesn't mean that Cat can't be an intelligent, somewhat good, 'scoundrel with a heart of gold' type character) and Peter gets back together with Mary-Jane, their relationship having become stronger for surviving. Meanwhile, Black Cat is set on her own path of learning that 'with great power comes great responsibility'.

That takes care of the drama side of things, leaving plenty of room for 'action' with Peter fighting Harry. And, of course, there's the obvious appeal of having an attractive woman in a catsuit starring in your movie (especially one that can kick ass), no matter how you slice it.

The Navigator

09-20-2004, 01:16 PM

Finally, FINALLY, someone sees the potential for BC. That's pretty much how I would have done it, too.

Let's just hope they don't get the costume designer from Catwoman...

The Hero

09-22-2004, 02:45 PM

I never want this script to end.:(

The Navigator

09-23-2004, 03:33 PM

Me either...when are we gonna see more?

ShaneHelms

09-25-2004, 03:17 PM

I Agree. Quentin made valid and understandible posts. While Zev tends to use stupid humor at backing his posts that never made sense in the first place.

The Navigator

09-25-2004, 03:25 PM

...vas?

The Hero

09-25-2004, 05:06 PM

I Agree. Quentin made valid and understandible posts. While Zev tends to use stupid humor at backing his posts that never made sense in the first place.
Um,that was about 20 pages ago.:confused:

P. Cushing

09-25-2004, 06:26 PM

What did Hugh Jackman do before X-Men?
Broadway and an Australian movie called "Paperback Hero".

We open on … a really fake-looking rat. It crawls around and a drop of blood falls in a puddle. We pan up a cathedral for about fifteen minutes until we see that Daredevil has paused from his exhaustive attempts to stay alive to pose for a Creed poster. A spotlight shines over him.

DAREDEVIL: Okay, just gotta zip-line down to the floor. Just gotta hold on to this here baton, despite my stupendous loss of blood… Ugh!

PRIEST: My son! Are you alright? What happened?

DAREDEVIL: A good question. It all started billions and billions of years ago, with a great explosion of energy scientists call the Big Bang…

PRIEST: Ahem!

DAREDEVIL: Oh yeah. And on the seventh day, God rested…

PRIEST: I’m sorry, I was just thinking you should skip ahead some.

DAREDEVIL: Right. Well, when I was a little boy…

***

BLOOD: Drip!

BULLIES: We’re mean.

MARK STEVEN JOHNSON: Look! See how the blood is dripping into a puddle and his eye and Matt is reflected in it! It's that KEWL?

FANS: No, not really.

***

MATT: Ah, my dad's a drunken failure. See how EDGY and MATURE this is compared to Man-Spider? But I still love him, especially since he isn't a thug for some crime lord. So dad, what did you do before you got drunk?

MATT: Well, maybe we can find out toge... wait a minute! That tears it, I'm going to run in front of this toxic chemical!

***

PRIEST: So, your exposure to the chemical blinded you but amplified your remaining senses, as well as giving you a kind of radar sense.

DAREDEVIL: Couldn't have put it better myself. Anyway, my dad got his act straight and joined an 11-step program. The eleventh step was not give in to people who want you to throw boxing matches and they'll back down. In retrospect, that may have been a bad idea. Anyway, I taught myself kung-fu...

PRIEST: Wait a minute! You can't just teach yourself kung-fu, supersenses or no supersenses.

PRIEST: So, it turns out that your family was murdered by your arch-nemesis. Just like in Bat...

DAREDEVIL: Shh!

***

MATT: Your honor, the defendant is guilty! Wait a minute, I'm a lawyer. Why am I prosecuting this case?

RAPIST: Beats me. By the way, it was consensual.

MATT: What? That's the stupidest defense ever? Why don't you have Kingpin's thugs manufacture you an alibi (which I could beat them into recanting in my guise as Daredevil, the relentless red-garbed foe of evil)?

RAPIST: Sorry, I didn't catch that last bit. Something about a relentless red-garbed foe of evil?

MATT: The defense rests, your honor.

JUDGE: You're the prosecutor.

MATT: Oh, right. In that case, the rapist is a big liar and it wasn't consensual.

JURY: Well, Kingpin's leaning on us, so... Not guilty!

MATT: Yes, I got another client off!

JUDGE: We've been through this.

***

PRIEST: Whoa, the mysterious Kingpin of Crime has even corrupted the justice system. It seems like justice needs an avatar, someone to stand for truth in a city of rats.

DAREDEVIL: That's just what I was thinking!

PRIEST: So, you exposed the jury tampering, got a mistrial, and convicted his ass?

DAREDEVIL: No, that would make too much sense. Instead...

***

DAREDEVIL: Look! My cane turns into a baton! And now it's nunchucks! And now it's a staff! And now it's a...

***

RAPIST: Ahh, nothing like a good drink after beating a rap. God, I love being evil!

DAREDEVIL: Oh yeah? Well, now I've cornered you!

RAPIST: Daredevil! I'm gonna kill you!

DAREDEVIL: Yeah? You and what army?

BAR FULL OF THUGS: Grrr...

DAREDEVIL: I'm not very smart, am I?

BAM!

POW!

SMACK!

***

PRIEST: I'm sorry, but I can't tell what's going on. You started fighting the entire bar full of thugs, then you just started waving your arms around and making fight noises.

DAREDEVIL: The real thing was much harder to follow. But eventually...

DAREDEVIL: Gotcha! Now, I'm going to beat a confession out of you. And even when you give up, I'm gonna keep beating you, because I'm so close to Crossing The Line.

RAPIST: Okay, that sounds reasonable.

MOVIE BATMAN: Psst! Kill him! Trust me, it's fun.

RAPIST: Don't listen to him, Daredevil would never kill anyone.

DAREDEVIL: Sorry, but given a choice between faithfulness to the comics and ripping off a successful movie...

SUBWAY TRAIN: LOUD!

DAREDEVIL: Argh! My ears! That train is cursing in Trainese!

RAPIST: Drat, now I'll never know what choice he was gonna make.

DAREDEVIL: All better.

RAPIST: Gak!

DAREDEVIL: Now you're soundly defeated. I had no choice but to defend myself, tragically resulting in...

RAPIST: Umm, a little help here?

DAREDEVIL: Don't interrupt. Just like in Spider-Man, which is a stupid kiddie picture that isn't as good as my movie, you brought this on yourself by accident.

RAPIST: No, really, if you could just help me up...

DAREDEVIL: Why? Why do men turn to crime! Oh, truly, crime does not pay. Alack! Alas!

RAPIST: DO SOMETHING!

DAREDEVIL: Like gloat over the man I'm going to murder in cold blood? Don't mind if I do!

***

PRIEST: So you killed someone just because you lost to them in court? That's pretty low, Daredevil.

DAREDEVIL: He was a rapist.

PRIEST: Still, you can't take the law into your own hands. If you do, you're not aiding it, but actually sabotaging...

DAREDEVIL: Lalalala! Not listening! Lalalalala!

To be continued...

Bwaahahahahaha! You should make a whole thread for this!

Zev

09-26-2004, 01:43 PM

Herr, we've been impolite. All this talking about the, what, three awesome, true-to-comics Spider-Man games (soon to be four), and yet Quentin is still waiting for his PS2 Daredevil game. Oh, wait, it was canceled. Looks like Marvel's real confident about Daredevil. How long until the 'big reunion movie' between Elektra and Daredevil?

Do you know that your various 'wait for the true R-rated Director's Cut, it will be awesome!' refrains bear increasing similarity to the 'Halle-cat' supporters of Catwoman. Against all rationality, they expect the premiere of Catwoman to disprove what promo images, trailers, interviews, Barbie dolls, and novelizations all point to. That being pure and unmitigated suck.

I, for one, don't believe that Daredevil was ever going to be R-rated. Everything about it is aimed at thirteen year olds (and English seventeen-year-olds, who are the mental equivilent of American thirteen year olds). Ben Affleck. Jennifer Garner? Colin Farrel? COOLIO? What is this, a movie or a Teen Beat cover shoot? Was Orlando Bloom unavailable? Then there's the numerous song tie-ins, the audio equivilent of those logos NASCAR racers wear on their suits and cars. How many of those pulled double-duty as music videos on MTV to make sure the youth of America got suckered in?

So, Matt DIDN't murder Quesada because he lost. That's your final answer? He planned to kill him whether he won or lost? So why does Matt go through a civil suit he can't win if he's just going to kill Quesada anyway? The only logical explanation is that he wants to get a little moola before he cashes Quesada's chips. Daredevil: Thief and Murderer! Repulsive, isn't it?

One of these things, is not like the others, one of these things, just doesn't belong...

A: Nick, men like Bullseye would rule the world were it not for a structure of laws that society has created to keep such men in check. The moment one man takes another man's life in his own hands, he is rejecting the law... and working to destroy that structure. If Bullseye is a menace to society, it is society that must make him pay the price. Not you and not me. I... I wanted him to die, Nick. I detest what he does... what he is. But I'm not God. I'm not the law. And I'm not a murderer.

B. (on Bullseye dying being (sarcastically) 'a real loss to society') Any death is a loss, Manolis.

C. (on being told Bullseye doesn't deserve to live) That's not for either of us to decide. We have to save him.

D. That light at the end of the tunnel? That's not Heaven... that's the C-train!

And, pencils down. The correct answer was D. Ovaries are less out-of-character for Daredevil.

This is why him dropping Bullseye in the comics was a big deal. He loved Elektra so much that he was willing to kill for her. In the movie, it's rather ho-hum. He's commited murder, so Daredevil is going to stick to his routine and punish him. Yawn. And going by MSJ's original vision (as seen in the novel), DD has already killed one pleading-for-his-life criminal, so why not another? I would have had Quesada begging for his life on the train tracks, screaming he'd confess. Daredevil takes out his billy club, shoots it, and pulls Quesada to safety.

Later, Bullseye begs for his life, offering to give Daredevil Kingpin. Daredevil is so enraged over his loss that he denies Bullseye's plea bargain and throws him out the window. Later (having rested and healed), he appears on Kingpin's balcony. They have their first face-to-face talk, where Kingpin tells him that he has no legal evidence, Daredevil agrees and swings away. And so it begins...

Of course, you’d have to have someone other then Ben Affleck play Daredevil. Now, setting aside the ‘Bennifer’ craze that makes Demi Moore and Ashton Kutcher look like a quiet, happily-married couple of 25 years (just as I set aside my political opinions when I go to see a Johnny ‘American Puppy’ Depp movie), he is just not believable as an action hero. John Woo couldn’t make him look good and John Woo made Jean-Claude Van Damme look good. Of course, he also made Lance Henricksen look good, but that was because Lance SET HIMSELF ON FIRE. For a stunt. He makes less then one-tenth what Affleck makes and he set himself on fire for our entertainment. God bless ‘em.

In the words of Negrodamus, Ben Affleck is the Andrew McCarthy of the 90s. Now, this isn’t a problem when he’s shooting the breeze with Foggy. But when he tries to make us believe we should be afraid of his leather-clad ass… sorry, ain’t workin’. Walker, Texas Ranger has more toughness. Steven Seagal had more toughness. You know, before he grew to Jabba the Hutt proportions.

Also, in MSJ’s original vision of Bullseye, we are introduced to him while he’s going through airport security. Whoa, slow down there, don’t overexcite us! You remember Frank Miller falling dead from a dart to the head so that Bullseye could steal his wheels? Well, originally that was supposed to come after the pub scene (this explains the close-up of Euros, probably added in post-production to make sure we ‘got’ this was in Ireland, even though it was filmed in the U.S. and originally set there). And Bullseye actually THREW HIS DART AROUND A CORNER. Not bounced it, not ricocheted it, the damn thing was supposed to TURN IN MID-AIR!

So much for the ‘real world’. We now have Daredevil dodging dozens of glass shards by somersaulting backwards in a straight line (realistically), nonsuperpowered Elektra jumping from rooftop to rooftop (realistically), and Bullseye surfing motorcycles (realistically) and throwing darts around corners (realistically). Jesus, talk about mixed signals.

In addition, the epilogue to Daredevil is Wesley Owen Welch, the man who ratted out Kingpin (to plea bargain his way out of a murder charge for killing a hooker and framing Coolio for it), being assigned the same cell as the Kingpin! Now, if Kingpin had enough power to get Wesley assigned to the same cell as him, wouldn’t Wesley point this out and get Witness Protection?

You know, Coolio? The only other black person in the film other then the main villain, Kingpin? He’s innocent of murder and that’s about the best that can be said of him. He’s addicted to drugs, extremely stupid, and talks about what weapons he’s good at committing crimes with. Ladies and gentlemen, MSJ’s Black America. Scored to a hip-hop soundtrack talking about dirty dogs.

Daredevil and Kingpin barely have a relationship. Some thug says that Kingpin is moving in on Hell's Kitchen. That's about it.

And why should Kingpin be afraid of getting ass-raped by Ryker's immates? Presumably he still has his criminal empire and power (plenty of mob bosses have run criminal enterprises from prison). Not to mention his own massive bulk. If he has enough pull to arrange being cellmates with Wesley, he has enough pull to, say, get some 'bodyguards', get the guards to cater to him, etc. That's assuming he's even going to prison, which (due to the cutting of the Coolio subplot) is highly doubtful.

By the way, I reread Frank Miller Visionaries 2. Elektra, Bullseye, AND Kingpin are all introduced separately. It's like three threads tying together by the end. First Bullseye joins Kingpin, drops out to set the stage for Elektra and Kingpin, then Bullseye returns for the climax. Also, some amount of time took place between Elektra's death and the Daredevil/Bullseye fight. And Daredevil didn't go and fight Kingpin immediately afterwards. In fact, the first time he fought Kingpin, he got his ass handed to him. And Kingpin has the humanizing wife element. The scenes where he refrains from killing a subordinate in his wife's presense and when he uses nonlethal force since he knows that's what Vanessa would want are quintessential Kingpin moments and make his descent back into full-blown evil (as shown when he kills Lynch), all the more chilling.

And forget about the Coolio subplot being deleted for being R-rated. Matt and Foggy aren't exactly going to topless bars and smoking doobies. So unless Coolio dropped more f-bombs then an Eminem song, I'm assuming it was just another part of the 'PG-13' Daredevil MSJ was making from day one.

Ah, the good old days...

Zev

09-27-2004, 01:28 PM

EXT. BACK OF BUILDING - NIGHT

SPIDER-MAN swings painfully, one handed and limp, at the
end of a WEB STRAND. After falling ten stories, he is
groggy and weak. He can't think. He can't focus. He can
barely hold onto his WRIST GIZMOS.

Oh, wrist gizmos. Which he just built while we weren't watching him. Can you imagine Star Wars if Luke just happened to have a lightsaber without Obi-Wan giving it to him?

This bug is spent.

Spiders are arachnids, you queens!

SPIDER-MAN
Must go on... must find Ock... SL 270
Plutonium... must get that crazy old
loony... before he gets to the
Plutonium... toxic dump... where are the
toxic dumps...?

Great writing there. But if I were looking for a toxic dump in New York, I wouldn't know where to start either (kidding! Just kidding, you crazy NYers!)

He hangs there with two hands to catch his breath and
thinks. He shoots a WEB up diagonally and swings across
on it. This time he catches on and holds, but barely.

Ummm, Spidey? If you're too exhausted to fight Ock, maybe you should, I don't know, call the cops on him?

INT. AUNT MAY'S FAMILY ROOM - NIGHT

LIZ is standing. AUNT MAY is seated on the COUCH, she
looks weak, pale and alone.

And this is because of Uncle Ben dying. Good to know his death had SOME impact on the script.

AUNT MAY
You're as lovely as Peter said you were.

LIZ
(embarrassed)
Thank you. He really wanted so badly to
come see you. He called me up out of the
blue.

"Then I called back out of the red, but he wasn't there, so I left a message on the green!"

AUNT MAY
(great concern)
Tell me about Peter. What's he been up
to? He seems so preoccupied.

LIZ
Oh, you know Peter... he's all caught up
in some kind of study he's doing. Things
are really crazy at the university now.
Things are crazy... everywhere. I guess
Peter's just... well, you know... pulled
into his shell.

You know, it's good to have characters telling us Peter's emotional state instead of showing it.

AUNT MAY
(reminiscing)
When Peter was little, he loved to hide.
In the closets. Under the sink. He
always needed a secret place. But when
I'd look for him, he'd always laugh... he
wanted to be found.

Because men attacking women is monstrous, while women attacking men is cute. See Batman Returns for a rather hilarious view of this (after Batman hits Catwoman, she says "How could you, I'm a woman!" And even Batman has to say "I'm sorry..." before her jumping back up and wailing on him).

Wait, do I have to get back to the script? Can't we just talk about Batman some more? Oh, alright...

OCK
Alright Spider-Bug... here I've come for
you...

Add using the past tense instead of the present to Ock's crimes.

OCK leaves the COP and attacks SPIDER-MAN, shooting his
iron fist at him.

Spider-Man fires back with his Luke Cage, Hero For Hire.

OCK runs to the end of the alley.
SPIDEY staggers to his feet and resumes the chase.
OCK breaks into a red Corvette convertible, starting it
with a WALDO.

Gone in 666 Seconds.

SPIDER-MAN comes out in time to see the Vette drive away.
A CHINESE LAUNDRY TRUCK is passing. SPIDEY THWIPS it and
is whipped away.

Okay, which is more likely. That the truck is going so fast that Spider-Man is pulled off his feet and clears the ground like a kite. Or that he's dragged like Indiana Jones?

SPIDER-MAN crawls to the top of the TRUCK and surveys the
situation. He sees a sea of moving traffic. He THWIPS up
a WEB and swings away.

Spider-Man chasing a car! Wow, this should be good!

SPIDEY swings along from BUILDING to BUILDING. The RED
VETTE is making headway. Suddenly, SPIDER-MAN spots a
blue MG with its top up.

SPIDER-MAN
(swinging)
Flash Thompson... I never thought I'd be
happy to see you.

EXT. BLUE MG - NIGHT

SPIDEY swoops down on the BLUE MG.

Oh, great. Just... great.

INT. BLUE MG - NIGHT

SPIDEY wedges down into the car, right between FLASH and
LIZ. She WHOOPS. FLASH is thrilled.

The guy who was sitting between Flash and Liz, less so.

SPIDER-MAN
Sorry about that!

FLASH
Spider-man! This is unbelievable...!

SPIDER-MAN
Flash, I need your help.

"Quick, what's the capital of Borneo!?"

FLASH
You got it.

SPIDER-MAN
You any good with this thing?

FLASH
I'm the best.

SPIDER-MAN
Okay... catch that Vette!

Okay, so let me get this absolutely straight. In a movie featuring DOC OCK and SPIDER-MAN, they're gonna sit on their butts and have a routine car chase?

See what I mean about this 'inspiring' me?

FLASH
Roger, wilco, over and out.

I really don't have anything to say.

He swerves. SPIDEY falls all over LIZ. They begin to
careen through traffic, three peas in a very small pod.

Which is ironic, because these are 'Pod People' of the original characters. The difference? NO SOULS!

Zev

09-27-2004, 01:52 PM

EXT. WEST SIDE CAR CHASE MONTAGE - NIGHT

With SPIDEY jammed in between LIZ and FLASH, the MG chases
the VETTE. Since neither OCK nor FLASH is any good at
this, both cars quickly careen into POLES, FENCES, HOT DOG
CARS and begin falling apart.

Serenity now, Zev. Serenity now.

On RIVERSIDE DRIVE the MG begins to lurch and STEAM. The
VETTE looks eaten away. The GEORGE WASHINGTON BRIDGE
looms ahead.

The VETTE roars through the TOLL BOOTH. They spot OCK
stuck in traffic.

Yeah, the maniac who can walk on four metal tentacles is going to sit in traffic and listen to Howard Stern.

FLASH
Why is he going to New Jersey, and who is
it in that ****ty red car...

Language, *****ucker!

LIZ
Don't you recognize him... it's Ock!

So how come Liz recognizes Ock and now Flash?

SPIDER-MAN
New Jersey has the largest toxic waste
dump in the world.

Replace 'has' with 'is' and you'd be more accurate...

I kid! I kid... because I LOVE.

FLASH
What does he want with toxic waste?

Depends. What would someone want with this script?

SPIDER-MAN
He's looking for Plutonium, my dear...

Did he just call Flash 'my dear'?

Oh dear.

The car has to slow down... it's in a traffic jam.

The only way this could be more thrilling is if both parties were in golf carts!

FLASH
Sorry... can't do anything about this
traffic.

SPIDER-MAN jumps out of the car.

Finally!

SPIDER-MAN
Try to stay with me. I don't want to
lose him!

Ah, so he needs scrapegoats.

Speeding along the BRIDGE, OCK sees no one.

Say what? I thought he was stuck in traffic...

But high
above, SPIDEY swings from TOWER to TOWER after him. At
the last TOWER, SPIDEY leaps down onto a BIG TRUCK. The
VETTE weaves and SPIDEY crosses to another BIG TRUCK. For
a moment he is caught between the TWO TRUCKS, but he makes
it across.

And now Doc Ock and Spider-Man are going to fight amidst traffic, on top of a speeding car!

The VETTE takes an exit. SPIDEY leaps to the next SIGN.

This is gonna be good...

He aims his WRIST GIZMO and waits for the next car to take
the exit, but none does.

Wrist gizmo? Can't you take FIVE MINUTES of research and call them WEB-SHOOTERS? Or, you know, READ A SPIDER-MAN COMIC BOOK!

Deflated, he drops to the
ground.

This is what's known as diffusing a conflict instead of resolving it.

He looks up to see a sign on a CYCLONE FENCE. It
says, "DUMP NUMBER 7 -- KEEP OUT -- RADIOACTIVE MATERIAL!"

What luck!

SPIDER-MAN
Bingo.

Was his namo.

INT. TOXIC WASTE DUMP - NIGHT

The landscape has a nightmarish vision, weirdly lit by
"safety lights." VATS and DRUMS ooze all kinds of bad
stuff. A light is on in a dilapidated SHACK.

The writer does know that the EPA checks this stuff, right?

INT. THE SHACK - NIGHT

OCK is tossing away the CANISTERS until he comes to one
marked, "HAZARD!! PLUTONIUM SL 270 HAZARD!!"

Good to see the exact brand of toxic waste is identified. I'd hate to get the one that's 73% carcinogenic with the one that's 74%.

OCK
Okey, dokey...

SPIDER-MAN
Open that now, and you'll spoil Christmas.

A quip! Good to see he's feeling so happy-go-lucky THE DAY AFTER HIS UNCLE'S DEATH!

SPIDEY'S peering in from a HOLE in the ROOF.

OCK
Insect! I am going to squash you to
death... Once I lay my Waldos on your
skinny bones...

I'm not thin, I'm just skinny boned!

OCK hurls a DRUM at SPIDEY. It erupts in a sizzle of
LIQUID and GAS. Then the SIX-ARMED FIEND runs for the
door with his SL 270.

Six-armed fiend? Who's writing this, Adam West?

EXT. THE SHACK - NIGHT

OCK comes flying out and SPIDER-MAN grabs a WALDO.
SPIDEY does a back flip and whips OCK so hard the WALDO
snaps off!

Octavians, can I get a ruling on whether Ock's tentacles can be snapped off so easily?

Errk! Sorry, script, you forgot to phrase your idiocy in the form of a question.

OCK recoils it and reacts in horror.
With a roar, OCK attacks SPIDER-MAN. They battle as
SUPER-ADVERSARIES. OCK gains the upper hand and tosses
SPIDEY into a pile of RUSTING DRUMS. A GAS envelopes
SPIDER-MAN and he begins coughing.

This is the part where all the fanboys say "teh radaiatno is gin to chage hm in2 Venom!!!11!"

EXT. THE DUMP - NIGHT

OCK'S WALDOS are coiled around SPIDER-MAN'S neck as the
WEB SLINGER is dragged through the dump.

Oh, this is much better then just KILLING him.

His WHITE EYES
narrow and blink.

Believe it or not, white lens are inorganic! They cannot narrow or blink!

There is a capped WELL behind a WARNING
SIGN. OCK tears off the CAP and then hurls the groggy
SPIDEY down the WELL.

What's that, Lassie? Spidey fell down the well?

OCK
Goodbye, Spider-Man!

INT. THE WELL - NIGHT

SPIDEY falls.

Right onto Samara Morgan. Because he really CAN'T catch a break.

He cannot grab onto the slimy WALLS. At
the bottom of the foul pit is a bubbling BLUE luminescent
POOL. SPIDEY claws frantically at the WALLS.

You know, it's not like I want this Spider-Man to live, I wish they were all obliterated in a hellfire of nuclear obliteration, but why doesn't he just press his hands against one side of the well and his feet against the other?

SPIDER-MAN
Noooooooooooooo!

Maybe it should be in ALL CAPS too. You know, for effect.

He gets a hold and slides down to within a foot of the
POOL. Its weird light shines up at him. He looks up at
the starry sky.

When you wish upon a star...

SPIDER-MAN
(to himself)
Okay now, Spidey. Easy does it.

He shoots a WEB about halfway up the PIT. It hits the
wall, sizzles, and drops back down.

That's right, assclown! Suffer and die!

SPIDER-MAN
(to himself)
Don't give up, Spidey. Don't give up.

The WEB GIZMO squirts out a pathetic patooey of WEB GOO.
Then it hisses, empty!

Empty, like this script's heart.

SPIDER-MAN
Empty... now what do I do?

OCK
So you've avoided the nuclear pool, have
you, Spider-Man?

Dude, it's luminescent. Just go over and LOOK.

SPIDER-MAN
Well, so far so good. But I can't hold
on much longer.

Is he talking to himself or Ock?

OCK
Pity...!

SPIDER-MAN
Oh, come on, Ock, be a good sport. Let's
talk this over face to face... throw me a
line...

Lets see, hero above certain death, no obvious means of escape, written into corner... yup, this calls for some Deus Ex Machina!

SPIDEY reaches out.

OCK
Okay... face to face... Catch this!

OCK, way up at the opening above, raises a huge DRUM above
his head. The DRUM leaks toxic waste in ORANGE TENDRILS.
He is about to drop it down on SPIDER-MAN...

Do it, do it, do it!

FLASH
Don't do it, Professor!

Don't listen to him!

We now see FLASH and LIZ in the BLUE MG.

OCK
(puts down the drum)
I know you... and you, young lady. Both
of you are in my physic class, aren't
you...? Come... you can help me. I need
to get some of these drums to my
laboratory... help me... and I'll give
you special grades. What'd you say?

You know, it's a cycle of abuse. Ock himself became a henchman to get tenure (d'oh, I made a funny!)

Suddenly he catches FLASH with a WALDO and starts to choke
him.

Yup, that's gonna help them make up their minds in your favor.

LIZ screams and tries to help FLASH.

LIZ
Leave him alone!!!

Another WALDO grabs her.

Okay, now the hero is in danger, the supporting characters are in danger... time for some more Deus Ex Machina!

INSERT: The COMPUTER SCREEN displays a graphic of the SUN,
EARTH, and MOON lining up with JUPITER and SATURN.

HARRY
But don't worry... he can never use it
without Plutonium.

And Doc Brown already called dibs on the Plutonium!

SPIDER-MAN (V.O.)
He's got the Plutonium, and he's on his
way back to the lab! And he's got two
prisoners with him... Liz and Flash!

Wait, now it's no longer Peter in the same room, it's Spider-Man delivering voiceover narration. Gotcha.

HARRY
Don't worry... he needs a huge amount of
power... thousands of volts of
electricity... to get to the Anti-Force.

SPIDER-MAN
He can get to the power. Electrical
power... to the max. Nuclear power... SL
270. And now, at the moment of full
Planetary Conjunction. When all the
planets line up with the sun... maximum
gravitational power. The Conjunction is
Ock's final power source.

"Well, don't worry, Ock also needs to BREATH to turn on the device. Where's he going to find oxygen?"

HARRY
Damn... the Conjunction is due at
midnight! What are we going to do?

"Why do you think I called you, dipstick?"

EXT. UNIVERSITY GROUNDS - NIGHT

The BLUE MG arrives and comes to a stop. OCK looks at his
two prisoners in the back seat and smiles to himself...
Picks up one DRUM on each shoulder.

With his tentacles or has he been working out.

OCK
Okey, dokey... have fun, young ones...
for the last time.

So, what, is he encouraging them to have sex before they die?

OCK leaves. LIZ and FLASH are tied together in the back
seat of the CAR.

Kinky!

LIZ
(still ministering)
What do we do now?

FLASH
We kiss the world goodbye. If he is
right, all there is left to do is...

I'll admit, this is a typical guy reaction to a no-hope situation.

LIZ
Wait... I think I can release my right
hand...

Party pooper.

INT. PETER PARKER'S APARTMENT - NIGHT

HARRY
How much time is left? Wait... I can
find out... my God... 59 minutes!

Well, it could be worse. Could be 58 minutes.

INT. PHONE BOOTH - NIGHT

SPIDER-MAN
The only way we can interfere with Ock's
plan is to find a computer center... fast.

Huh?

HARRY (V.O.)
Our University has the biggest center in
town.

Let me get this straight... PETER PARKER doesn't know about his own university's computer center.

Can we Anti-Force something up this script's rectum?

SPIDER-MAN
Yeah, but who's gonna work 'em?

EXT. UNIVERSITY GROUNDS - NIGHT

Professor OCK comes for some more drums. He sees that LIZ
and FLASH have disappeared. OCK picks up TWO DRUMS.

It's good to see how well he's reacting to the fact that the two people who can bring the police and spoil his entire master plan have gotten loose.

HARRY seeing FLASH and LIZ come running to the school
grounds.

"It's a small world after all..."

HARRY
I think I can get some help... I can
teach anyone how to work a code in five
minutes.

Student, hell, this guy should be a teacher!

SPIDER-MAN (V.O.)
Then do it!

INT. COMPUTER LAB - NIGHT

The LIGHTS are off, but the COMPUTERS are on. HARRY looks
over LIZ'S shoulder as she cracks through a code. Her
SCREEN reads out, "CONNECTICUT. TECH. Fully Op, Line
Backlog, Security Max Level." The last line is FLASHING.

Security Max Level! Oh no!

KIM
Hey, this is easy.

Wha, huh? Where'd Kim come from?

They all run from COMPUTER to COMPUTER.

So hacking something doesn't require any talent, just a whole bunch of computers. Guess my school library could hack the DoD.

FLASH
Hey, Harry I need help.

HARRY
Coming!

HARRY types in KARNAKY LTD and gets the same response. He
looks at his DIGITAL WRISTWATCH. "01:00:02" becomes
"00:59:59" as we watch.

Wait, didn't he just say that he only has 59 minutes? I guess he doesn't have to worry, anytime he messes up he can just travel backwards in time!

Then a WARNING BUZZER!

KIM
I got one! I got one!

Don't get cocky, kid!

LIZ
Harry! Get over here!

She wants to introduce him to her brother, Scorpion. And I'm NOT talking about the Max Gargan one...

HARRY hurries to KIM'S side and elbows her out of the
CHAIR.

Good manners there, chief.

The SCREEN is flashing "WARNING, Security Breach!"
HARRY'S hands fly over the keys. The KIDS gather around.
LINE DRAWINGS of the CYCLOTRON (progressing from large to
small detail) appear one after the other. Finally, a
PIPE. There is a CIRCLE around a JOINT. And the legend
"H20".

Oh, come on, it wasn't that good of a Halloween movie...

HARRY
A goddamn water leak...

Yeah, that's what she said!

FLASH
Hey, look at this. Empire State
University. This is our cyclotron,
right?

FLASH
We must find Peter, he knows these
computers better than all of us.

HARRY
Yes, but where the hell is he?

LIZ
(mysteriously)
I bet he is with Spider-Man...

Huh? So she's figured out who Spider-Man is or is she insinuating that Spider-Man and Peter are connected or is she just being a whore?

Suddenly the lights dim. A heavy noise. An earth quake.

THERE'S NO SPACE BETWEEN EARTH AND QUAKE! God, have any of these people heard of spellcheck?

P. Cushing

09-28-2004, 03:33 AM

****ing hilarious! There should be a forum just for Zev's comedy script breakdowns!

Zev

09-28-2004, 10:01 AM

EXT. OUTER SPACE - PERPETUAL DARK

The EARTH is moving into line with the other PLANETS of
the CONJUNCTION.

I wonder exactly how many ancient ceremonies are going on to grant immorality right now...

EXT. SCIENCE CENTER - NIGHT

HARRY and FLASH and LIZ and KIM, (the EARTH is SHAKING)

And the roof is on FIRE!

come out running from the building beneath an enormous
HANGING MOON. They are frightened.

Suddenly it all stops. It's quiet, the kids look at the
sky.

LIZ
Look at the moon... I have never seen it
so big.

Wait a minute, so lining up all the planets in a row makes the moon look bigger (should I even mention that the moon is not a planet?)? Grade-A bull****, ladies and gentlemen. Or maybe Bruce Almighty is getting lucky somewhere.

FLASH
What is that...

HARRY
Must be the sun.

BUM BUM BUUUMMM!

We now see the sky. With the sun on one side, and the
moon on the other. They watch it, shocked, frightened out
of their wits.

Okay, this is kinda cool. Hence, it's very lonely in this script.

EXT. END OF THE WORLD MONTAGE - NIGHT

And I feel fine.

Suddenly from OCK'S basement lab a BLUE BEAM of LIGHT
breaks through. A WHINE starts, it moves magically out of
the WINDOW and PANS around a sleepy NEW YORK which doesn't
know that the end is upon it.

Daredevil's premiere party starts...

The dreaded WHINE builds
throughout! People stop in their tracks, look up to the
strange looking skyline. Camera comes down to a street
where ROZ is DRIVING SPIDER-MAN fast toward the
UNIVERSITY.

What... in the crimson... HELL... is SPIDER-MAN being chauffeured around?

INT. ROZ'S CAR - NIGHT

ROZ looks out over the skyline of NEW YORK. Lighted
buildings FLARE UP and then GO DARK. The LIGHTED SPIRE of
the Empire State Building FLARES UP and EXPLODES.

And there's a pleasant post-9/11 image, isn't it?

SPIDER-MAN
It's started. Step on it Professor, or
we'll never make it.

What, you mean he was obeying the speed limit before?

They look across the campus and a strange LIGHT is coming
out of the SCIENCE CENTER.

ROZ
Our campus... right there... see those
beams from Ock's lab. We're late... it's
coming... the Conjunction will happen in
a few seconds.

Can't speak... in... complete... sentences!

SPIDER-MAN massages his arm.

Oh-kay. Right. Just gonna move along then...

SPIDER-MAN
Stop the car...! Come with me.

ROZ
Where...? What...?

SPIDER-MAN SHOOTS out a WEB and flies toward the SCHOOL
BUILDING taking ROZ with him.

Can you read my mind?

INT. EXPERIMENTAL CHAMBER - NIGHT

It is a patchwork of make-shift repairs. OCK looks in
through a WINDOW that's been melted out. He is lost in a
mad rapture.

INT. CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

RED POWER THROTTLE is at 95% POWER!
SPIDER-MAN and ROZ enter, shielding their eyes from the
GLARE. The COUNTDOWN CLOCK reads, "00:08:18".

Due to the Earth's polluted atmosphere, Ultraman only has three minutes in his giant form! Time is running out...

OCK
(looking back, madly)
Aha! You never included the Conjunction
in your calculations, did you?! Rosomorf!

Ooh, BURN!

ROZ
Damn the calculations! My God, Otto, you
have to hear me! The world we know will
collapse! Everything we have devoted our
lives to... all the patterns, all the
harmonies... everything will be destroyed.

You know, I'd think the fact that the world is going to blow up... SLIGHTLY more significent then the fact that all your theories are going to be invalidated.

OCK
A new world waits! Rosomorf! It is my
destiny!!!

I see Ock has a great future as a lame Bond villain ahead of him.

ROZ
It is cosmic suicide! You have no right!

Cosmic suicide? Great name for a band...

ROZ flings himself through the MELTED WINDOW into the
EXPERIMENTAL CHAMBER. He grabs for the "BULLET" but the
WALDOS grab him and throw him back. ROZ staggers
backward... into the arms of SPIDER-MAN.

ROZ
You have to stop him... Spider-Man you
have to stop him.

Look, old guy, why don't you leave the tough guy antics to the man with superpowers and concentrate on the whole 'convincing evil maniac not to blow up world' department?

SPIDER-MAN
I'm afraid we're too late.

Real beacon of hope, our hero.

SPIDER-MAN attacks OCK, trying to push him away from the
THROTTLE. OCK pushes SPIDER-MAN away from him so strongly
that SPIDER-MAN is knocked down. OCK nudges the POWER
THROTTLE forward and the WHINE increases to an ear
shattering pitch. The COUNTDOWN CLOCK reads, "00:06:48".
We are at 96% POWER!

EXT. THE SCIENCE CENTER - NIGHT

We PAN down from the MOON to a STREET full of SIRENS and
SHADOWY FIGURES running in the night.

Brains! Braaaaaaiiiiinnnnnnsss!

LIZ and KIM and
HARRY come nearer. A very WEIRD light is emanating from
the CENTER.

LIZ
He's in there. I know Peter is in there.

Let me guess. 'Feminine intuition'?

She breaks into a run.

FLASH
Liz, don't... Liz come back... come back!

LIZ runs inside. They run after her. A BOLT OF
ELECTRICITY flashes across the doorway, stopping them.

How conveniant. This way only Liz will be present when Spider-Man's secret identity is revealed.

INT. THE CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

The PLANETS are playing on the COMPUTER SCREEN.

Yeah, but they're only opening for the Stones.

Things in
the room begin to rise, weightless. The ENERGY STORM is
brewing!

Oh, there's an energy storm now?

OCK
Okey, dokey!! My energy storm has
started. My Anti-Force is on! History
is being made... Spider-Man, Rosomorf
cheer up friends... we're on our way to
the unknown cosmos... we three are about
to visit heaven... real Gods heaven.

You know, I've given up trying to figure this Ock out. I really have. It's like the Lament Configuration.

But how nice that now the mad scientist is also a religious fanatic. Thanks a lot, Hollywood. Good to see you're passing up the cheap shots.

ROZ
(sees the sky through the window)
Spider-Man! The Conjunction! It's
happening!

Conjunction junction? What's its function?

EXT. THE SKY - STRANGE COLORS - NIGHT

The CONJUNCTION is now happening.

Dude, look at all the colors... we are so totally wasted...

INSERT: Surreal DIALS spin madly.

INT. SCIENCE CENTER - NIGHT

LIZ runs into a HALLWAY gone berserk. Stuff is flying
everywhere. TILES pull from the WALLS and crash to the
ceiling.

LIZ
Peter! Peter, where are you?!

Warriors! Come out and PLAY!

INT. CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

OCK throws the RED POWER THROTTLE to 97% POWER.
Cacophony! The "BULLET" begins to PULSE and THROB! The
DIALS spin! The COUNTDOWN CLOCK reads, "00:05:58".

Meanwhile Roz and Spider-Man are just sitting there, waiting for their cue...

EXT. SCIENCE CENTER - NIGHT

The FULL MOON hangs over the building. FLASH and HARRY
and KIM stand at the entrance to the CENTER.
FLASH starts to run to the building.

Oh, oh, we're on? Better get to work.

FLASH
(screaming)
Liz! Liz come on out!

They run forward but as they reach the FRONT STEPS the
building lurches upward. The bottom step becomes a wall
of STONE and DIRT, six feet high.

And just when that electricity blocking the door disappeared too! Man, that's some bad luck right there...

HARRY
Get back! Flash... get back!

FLASH
Wow...!

Then the building lurches upward again! This time it
pulls FREE from the ground. The KIDS take cover as WATER
LINES BURST and ELECTRICAL WIRES SPARK.

The building lurches throwing her back across the HALL
where she crashes through another door.

That's gotta hurt.

The Navigator

09-28-2004, 10:20 AM

You should do the Batman movies in five minutes, dude...

Zev

09-28-2004, 10:22 AM

Home stretch, baby!

INT. CHEMISTRY LAB - NIGHT

All manner of stuff is flying around. LIZ comes sliding
across the floor. She crashes into a CABINET. GLASSWARE
starts to fall on her, but crashes into the CEILING
instead. She is dragged up the WALL. She kicks and
screams against the Anti-Force.

Damn, Tinkerbell is pissed.

EXT. SCIENCE CENTER - NIGHT

FLASH, KIM and HARRY look on as heavy ELECTRICAL CABLES
stretch upward to the rising CENTER and then snap in
showers of sparks. As they fall away the CENTER becomes
airborne. The CABLES wave up at it, shooting arcs of
ELECTRICITY directly at the building.

Brave, brave Electro, trying to end this movie for us... And they call him a villain.

INT. CHEMISTRY LAB - NIGHT

LIZ slides down the WALL. She grabs at the WINDOW and
looks out. The rest of the university recedes beneath
her, now a hundred feet below. And they're still rising!
FLASH and HARRY look up.

FLASH
Oh my God... Liz is inside there!

Well, since you didn't see her LEAVE, I think that's a pretty safe assumption!

HARRY
And Professor Rosomorf and crazy Ock.

As opposed to sane, rational Ock?

FLASH
What about Peter? Is he there with them?

No, there was never any evidence of that in the first place.

HARRY
No, but I bet Spider-Man is.

Oh, I see. This is so that when Spider-Man and Liz escape, no one will ask where Peter is.

EXT. STREET IN FRONT OF UNIVERSITY - NIGHT

People look up at the SCIENCE CENTER. A CYCLIST, riding
and looking, crashes into a TAXI. MAX REISS leaps out
with the BEAUTIFUL STARLET from the TAXI.

Hello again, Marty Sue!

MAX
That's some show... if ever I saw one.

Well, that was important. Steve Buscemi couldn't make that role work.

INT. JAMESON'S OFFICE - NIGHT

He's looking out his window seeing the University's Lab
Building flying by. Up and up toward the sky.

Hey, it's Jameson! Remember him? The guy who had no impact on the story whatsoever, but was just inserted because he was a major character in the comics?

JAMESON
(shouting)
Tear out the front page! Change the
headline... The biggest news is happening
right now... we need photos... a camera...
get me a camera...!

Goodbye again, Jameson.

EXT. SKY - NIGHT

A very long shot of the SCIENCE CENTER rising into the
CLOUDS.

And smacks right into the SHIELD Helicarrier. Fury jumps out and shoots everyone dead.

I can dream, can't I?

INT. AUNT MAY'S BEDROOM - NIGHT

She pulls aside a CURTAIN and watches the SCIENCE CENTER
rise.

Remember these people? They were in our movie!

Wait, how can she see the science center when it's risen into the clouds?

INT. CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

OCK works the COMPUTER as the CONSOLE sends up SHOWERS of
SPARKS.

C'ptain, the Klingons have hit us with another photon torpedo! Shields are down to 42%! We canna take another hit like that!

He glances at the "BULLET" which now PULSES.
The COUNTDOWN CLOCK at "00:04:18".

ROZ
Where is it going Otto?

Where is this plot going? Nowhere fast.

OCK
Other worlds, Roz, other times, other
dimensions, who knows? Who cares?

Well, good to see his entire motivation is in order.

ROZ
Then... why?

A good question. I bet the writer has a really good reason cooked up, otherwise that line just draws attention to an obvious error (which was created by Ock's line in the first place).

OCK
Truth, Rosomorf. Look at it! The new
truth! The new way!

Oh, c'mon. Every garage band ever has said that.

SPIDER-MAN
Don't listen to him Professor Roz.

OCK
No, you don't listen to that clown, he
can't save you, or the world for that
matter.

This script is sapping my energy!

A WALDO reaches in and rips ROZ off SPIDEY, flinging him
back against a WALL. ROZ lands in a heap beneath a FIRE
STATION (HOSE, EXTINGUISHER, AXE).

Plot point!

We see the WALDO reach out for SPIDER-MAN. It wraps
around his FOOT and begins to tug, slowly...

OCK
Once and for all, Spider-Man... once and
for all we'll end the legend of your
powers.

Well, that or you could kill him.

OCK knocks SPIDER-MAN with a real BIG BLOW with his WALDO.
OCK is slowly dragging SPIDER-MAN to a HUGE HOLE that's
been ripped in the floor by the BEAMS of ELECTRICITY.

Oh, there's a hole in the floor now? Glad you let us know that.

We see New York a half a mile down through the hole. We
see SPIDEY being drawn across the HOLE. Then ROZ comes
flying in with the FIRE AXE.

Oh my god! No way you could see that one coming! Oh, wait, you did?

ROZ hacks away at the WALDO and chops it off!

Good arm on Roz. You'd think chopping through solid metal would be tough, requiring several 'whacks', but I guess not.

The stump
withdraws. OCK examines it in pain and fury!

Now he's only got two left.

OCK
(ultimate betrayal)
You!! You were my teacher!!!

Oh, he was? I thought they were colleagues.

ROZ doesn't even look back. He and SPIDEY are at the edge
of the HOLE and he's shaking SPIDEY furiously.
OCK sends out his other WALDO and begins banging it on the
floor in a frenzy on either side of ROZ and SPIDEY. Like
a child denied, he smashes his steel fists against the
floor again and again.

And now the big bad supervillain is throwing a temper tantrum. Kill me.

OCK
You were my teacher! And you want to
destroy my experiment. You are a
scientist for heaven sake... don't you
want to know what's up there?

No, for you see, there are some things Man Is Not Meant To Know.

ROZ
Yes, but not on account of our world. We
have only one world... only one life.

He learned almost too late that man was a feeling creature...

The floor begins to craze and then crack like ice around a
hole on a pond. BANG! BANG! SPIDEY comes to just as the
section of floor beneath himself and ROZ gives way and
falls through.

Why is this treated as a bigger tragedy then Spider-Man's uncle dying?

SPIDEY grabs hold of the edge and dangles. He looks down
and sees ROZ falling away beneath him, disappearing into
the dark.

Oh, my, don't shoot a webline down and save him or anything.

ROZ
(calling back from the dark skies)
Spider-Man! Only you can save us now...

SPIDER-MAN
Roz!!!
(turns to Ock)
Murderer!!!

Well, yeah, now that you mention it, I guess he is. Although he's also a 'manslaughterer' due to sending the man who KILLED YOUR UNCLE!

And I don't care how hot Jessica Biel is, no way I want to live in 7th Heaven.

EXT. OUTER SPACE - PERPETUAL DARK

The PLANETS are virtually in line!

Superman's about to play pool...

INT. SCIENCE CENTER HALLWAY - NIGHT

LIZ comes running through it. A BOLT OF ELECTRICITY
shoots from the right to the left in front of her. She
slams on the brakes and runs the other way.

LIZ
Peter! Peter!

Great plan, Liz. Run into the deadly environment in the hopes of finding Peter, who you have no evidence is in there. Real smart.

INT. CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

The COUNTDOWN CLOCK is at, "00:02:59". OCK throws the
POWER THROTTLE to 98% POWER. He laughs and a WEB splats
against his GLASSES.

You know, I looked up 'too little, too late' in the dictionary and found this.

SPIDEY scrambles to his feet. OCK,
still trying to get the WEB GOO off his GLASSES, is
slammed into the CONSOLE by SPIDER-MAN. SPARKS fly and
WALDOS flail blindly, smashing things. OCK tears off his
GLASSES and squints through the FIRE and SMOKE and GLARE.
SPIDER-MAN THWIPS the ceiling and swings into a drop kick!
OCK recovers. He grabs SPIDEY and slam dunks him through
the hole in the floor.

A fight between a man who invented webshooters off-camera and a villain who's catchphrase is okey dokey.

Whoever wins... we lose.

EXT. THE BOTTOM OF THE BUILDING - NIGHT

SPIDER-MAN falls through the air. He shoots up a WEB and
THWIPS, it sticks to the ROCKY bottom of the FOUNDATION.

Wow, never saw that one coming.

OCK appears in the HOLE. He sees SPIDEY'S dilemma,
hanging on a thread of WEB. A half-broken WALDO snakes
down and CLIPS the WEB.

But the WEB sticks to the WALDO! OCK shakes it, but he
can't get loose. SPIDER-MAN shoots out another WEB at the
ROCK BOTTOM and, with the leverage, he pulls OCK out.
OCK swings down in a wide arc and his WALDOS catch on the
ROCK upside down. He holds on fiercely.

It's really hard to make fun of action scenes. As you may have noticed.

OCK scrambles out to the side of the CENTER and begins
looking for an entry. SPIDER-MAN is right on his tail.
The building pitches sideways! OCK turns to face SPIDER-
MAN, his broken WALDOS out for BATTLE.

SPIDEY grabs an EXPOSED PIPE and breaks it off,
brandishing it like a broad sword.

Wha? Why? Is the whole superstrength thing not enough, now you need a foreign object? Ass.

SPIDER-MAN
Let's have it, old boy!

Good to see you're feeling so light-hearted when confronting the man who caused the death of your uncle and killed your mentor.

A bizarre DUEL takes place. The CENTER pitches this way
and that. SPIDEY and OCK move from foothold to foothold,
from WINDOW to LEDGE to PARAPET.

Yawn.

Now the CENTER pitches to a 45 degree angle. They DUEL
upside down! A WINDOW GRATE crashes open and LIZ comes
flying out, holding onto the GRATE for dear life!

Oh, look, she's here now.

SPIDER-MAN
Liz!!

OCK seizes the opportunity to whack SPIDEY across the
head.

Thanks Liz. Your brilliant plan of 'find Peter, die together' is working like a charm.

SPIDEY loses his footing but the building now
lurches back and LIZ goes flying back inside. SPIDEY
ducks inside too and pulls the GRATE.

SPIDER-MAN uses his great strength to move a HUGE PIECE of
SCIENTIFIC MACHINERY in front of the GRATE.

The BIG BEAMS start cutting out one by one. The CENTER
begins to PITCH and YAW. The CHOPPERS are getting closer.

And what are the choppers going to do?

INT. CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

The COUNTDOWN CLOCK reads, "00:00:15" as SPIDEY and LIZ
continue to pull WIRES and CABLES. TWO WALDOS erupt
through the floor and grab SPIDEY. They pull SPIDEY to
the floor. Entangled in these molybdimum pythons, SPIDEY
struggles valiantly.

Molybdimum pythons. Can we, ummm, can we do something about this?

LIZ leaps to his aid.

LIZ
Oh my God...

A third WALDO, a broken one, snakes up from the HOLE and
begins feeling blindly around on the CONSOLE for the POWER
THROTTLE.

Oh, that's much better then Ock just walking into the room and pressing it with his own two hands.

SPIDER-MAN
The power!

LIZ sees the damaged WALDOS heading for the RED THROTTLE.
The COUNTDOWN CLOCK is at "00:00:10". LIZ leaps and tries
to wrestle it away. It whips in her arms and she holds on
tight. It bangs her against the wall and then the
CONSOLE. She holds on. "00:00:03". The WALDO crashes
LIZ against the wall which erupts in SPARKS. She lets go
of it. It heads for the POWER THROTTLE! "00:00:01!"
SPIDER-MAN can't break the grip of the WALDOS, but he can
pull with super-human strength. He yanks OCK up through
the STONE floor. OCK hits the ceiling of the CONTROL
ROOM. ONE WALDO grabs on. The other one throws the RED
POWER THROTTLE!

Uh-oh. Looks like Ock won. Well, the human race had a good run. Goodbye, cruel world!

OCK
Spider-Man. You're end is coming. Life
in its present form is ending... new
dimensions, new horizons...

Boy, can't wait to see how Spider-Man gets out of this one!

The UNIVERSAL BULLET begins to GLOW. The GLOW sharpens to
a POINT of LIGHT. SPIDER-MAN holds on tight against a
rushing ENERGY FLOW that's pulling everything in the room
towards the POINT of LIGHT.

This is the moment where the hero's back is against the wall when he's truly at his greatest. Spider-Man's gonna snatch victory from the jaws of defeat, I know it!

LIZ
(bracing against the storm)
What is happening?

SPIDER-MAN
(similarly braced)
I don't know!!!

LIZ starts to slip away into the flow. She struggles
against it.

Just wait, first he'll save the girl, then the world.

LIZ
I can't... hold on!

SPIDEY THWIPS her and she grabs onto the WEB.

SPIDER-MAN
Hold tight, Liz, hold tight!

OCK drops calmly, beatifically, to the floor of the room.
He moves slowly, under his own power, into the LIGHT.

So, are these helicopters going to have any impact on the plot or are they just in there because copters are cool?

INT. CONTROL ROOM - NIGHT

Trying to leave it, LIZ and SPIDEY are confronted with a
nightmare. The room is tilted at a 45% angle. PIPES are
bursting. SPIDEY helps LIZ through the obstacles. Debris
rains down. They come face to face with a diagonal maze
of PIPES.

SPIDER-MAN
Maybe there's another way...

What Sam Raimi said when he was told to film this.

A HUGE CRACK opens above them.

LIZ
It's breaking apart!

Honey, this movie's plot broke apart a long time ago.

SPIDER-MAN
Alright, keep moving, a step at a time!

They scale the maze, but as they emerge on the other side,
half the floor falls away! Central Park awaits, 8,000
feet below.

LIZ
We have to go back.

SPIDER-MAN
We can't go back.

Well, that settles that.

He looks across at the door. It is midway up a diagonal
wall. He shoots a WEB up at the ceiling between
themselves and the door. Then he extends a hand to LIZ.

LIZ
Forget it...

So now she's suddenly afraid of swinging?

SPIDER-MAN
Okay, have it your way.

He swings across and lands on the LEDGE of the DOOR. Then
he swings the WEB back to her like a trapeze.
LIZ catches the WEB and looks across at SPIDER-MAN,
furious.

LIZ swings across like TARZAN and SPIDEY gathers her in on
the LEDGE. She does a comic "phew" and the LEDGE buckles
beneath them but holds. SPIDER-MAN tries to open the
door, but it's stuck.

So let me get this straight. Spider-Man's superstrength is insufficient to open a DOOR?

LIZ
The door is stuck.

This keen grasp of the obvious is a lot better then when you couldn't figure out how to swing across a gap.

SPIDER-MAN bends his back to the task. It take all his
strength, but with a comic AAAAARGGHH! He bends the DOOR
open.

Comic phew, comic aaargh? I guess that way, when they say the script sucks, the writer can claim it's a comedy.

I'm not laughing.

EXT. FIRE DOOR - NIGHT

They burst out onto the ROCK FOUNDATION of the building.
New York is rushing up to meet them. The WIND created by
their fall buffets them. The HELICOPTERS arrive, and the
falling building plunges right past them. The HELICOPTERS
look across at each other, helpless.

SPIDEY and LIZ are falling away from the DOOR, sliding
along the ROCK. LIZ is stopped by a RETAINING WALL.
SPIDEY keeps sliding. He THWIPS the wall and then
disappears over the edge. LIZ screams!

LIZ fights to her feet and grabs onto the WEB STAND. She
pulls on it with all her strength. She pulls and pulls
and pulls. We see the WEB running up between the ROCKS.
She gives one last pull and comes up with an EMPTY WEB
END.

Oh no! Is this the end of our hero?

A long, long beat.

PETER (V.O.)
Liz, Up here!

LIZ looks up and sees PETER hanging out the WINDOW two
stories above her. He throws out a ROPE LADDER. LIZ
grabs it. She begins to climb.

See, now you're just making things difficult for yourself. How about worrying about the secret identity AFTER you get out with your hide intact?

INT. CLASSROOM - NIGHT

PETER pulls LIZ through the WINDOW. There is no time for
an embrace.

PETER
Come on. I've found a way down.

LIZ
(at long last, love)
I knew you were going to say that.

Well, it's not quite "Here's looking at you, kid" is it?

They run out of the ROOM. We PAN down and see, crumpled
beneath the WINDOW, the SPIDER-MAN suit.

Say, where did Peter get those clothes, anyway? And why wouldn't he put them on over his suit instead of abandoning it?

INT. LARGE PHYSICS LAB - NIGHT

This is the LAB we saw in the opening sequence. PETER has
turned on the lights. He's got a handful of ROPE.

LIZ
Where's the way out?

PETER
Right there!

We are looking at the HUGE AMERICAN FLAG.

Oh, BRUTHER! Stop trying to make yourself look good with patriotism, movie.

PETER
Come on, help me with this.

EXT. THE FOUNDATION - NIGHT

LIZ is already down the ROPE LADDER and is holding it for
PETER. He comes down with a HUGE bundle of RED, WHITE &
BLUE.

Sorry, but this script is one thing you can't blame on society, liberals!

PETER
Okay, stand still.

He ties some ROPE around her waist.

LIZ
Is this going to work?

PETER
How do I know?

LIZ
I just adore confidence in a man.

But beneath all their witty verbal jousting, there lies an unacknowledged but powerful sexual tension. But enough about Bruce Willis and Cybil Shepherd on Moonlighting. Let’s get back to our movie.

PETER
Come on...

They move to the edge of the ROCK and look down. CENTRAL
PARK is still a couple thousand feet down.

LIZ
What is it you say when you jump?

PETER
Your prayers.

Ho ho ho! Stop.

They SCREAM as the building lurches again, knocking them
to the ground. They start to slide across the ROCK. They
reach out for each other but their hands don't quite
reach.

Slowly, they inch back together, but the FOUNDATION cracks
between them.

And... stuff happens.

EXT. THE CENTER - NIGHT

It spins and falls beneath us. Down, down it goes. And
then it crashes into the GREAT LAWN. A huge cloud of
debris shoots upward.

Well, glad no one was hurt.

EXT. THE SKY - NIGHT

There is a beautiful FULL MOON. PETER and LIZ float down
into the frame lit by its wonderful light.

The AMERICAN FLAG which has turned into a huge parachute.
They hold each other tight. They can hear SIRENS below.
They begin to laugh with relief. Then they stop. The
wind billows LIZ'S skirt and plays with PETER'S hair, and
snaps in the AMERICAN FLAG.

Turning the American flag into a parachute? That is not the end of a Spider-Man movie (couldn't he just use his webshooters?).

LIZ
We have a lot to thank your friend
Spider-Man for.

But a good script isn't one of them.

PETER
Somehow, I don't think we've seen the
last of him.

We don't take kindly to threats around here...

LIZ
Peter...! Finders, keepers...

PETER
What...? What is it? Why do you look
like that?

Because of a second X chromosome.

LIZ
I think I'm in love.

PETER
(even his eyes blush)
You are...

LIZ
With your friend...

PETER
Spider-Man? You're in love with
Spider-Man?

Great, even when the movie's over they're introducing new subplots. Thanks a lot.

LIZ
I am... you think we'll see him again?

Didn't Peter just answer that?

PETER
We might... you never know.

He kisses her.

You know about movies that don't so much END as just STOP. Well, I'm just hoping for a STOP.

LIZ
Oh.
(bittersweet)
This may be the end of a beautiful
friendship you know?

Casablanca. Thanks. Didn't want anything to be left untainted by this piece of ****.

PETER
Nah.

They land in the center of the park under the parachute.
They stay there and kiss... completely covered by the
flag.

It made-up words and characters,it bastardized it's source material,it felt like it was writtin by a retarded chimp...but still,there goes the best damn Spider-Man script a studio ever had.:up:

Zev

09-28-2004, 02:43 PM

FINAL THOUGHTS

I'll admit, the deck was stacked against this script from the beginning. One of the great virtues of the Spider-Man movies has been their casting, aside from (arguably) Kirsten Dunst. Could you picture anyone else as Doc Ock? As Peter Parker? As J. Jonah Jameson? Every script is 'half' a product because it lacks the visuals, the actors, etc. It's like having a movie described to you instead of seeing it for yourself (that's what gets scripts sold. They paint a picture of a movie that people want to see!). But I doubt any of the skillful directing of Raimi or the acting of Molina would get near this dreck. In the mind's eye, the sheer foulness of the script spreads to the casting. Freddie Prinze Jr. as Peter Parker! Arnold Schwarzenegger, coming off his award-winning role as Dr. Freeze, plays Doc Ock! Halle Berry plays Liz Allen (cheap shot, maybe. But you know it's true). And so on.

It's almost too easy to see what went wrong with this script. Basically the same thing that's gone wrong with every other bad superhero movie. They weren't making Stan Lee and Steve Dikto's Spider-Man or Gerry Conway's Spider-Man or JMS' Spider-Man or even Marvel Comics' Spider-Man. They were making James Cameron's Spider-Man. Or whoever was foremost responsible for this piece of trash. Although responsible is a stretch. The writers were given the great power to make THE Spider-Man movie and they blew it on cheap jokes, bad writing, and laziness.

Yes, laziness. I find it hard to believe that one of the half-dozen writers picked up a Spider-Man comic in their life. You might convince me that one of them breezed through Amazing Fantasy 15 (as comic books don't have a 'book on tape' version) or listened to an eight-year-old Spider-fan with a sugar rush describe the titles, but such a complete and total disconnect from the source points to either the whole 'Spider-Man' thing being totally alien to the writers or active malice.

Things don't 'happen' so much as they 'go on'. Uncle Ben, now a beer-swilling old coot who watches football and complains about rock and roll, is killed not because it will have an effect in the story, but because it happened in the comics. I wouldn't be surprised if one of the revisions to the script (of which there were several) was to put Ben and May into the script and kill one of 'em off. Wait, which one died again? Oh, right, Ben.

How else do you explain a loser comic relief character like Weiner (sic AND sick) blasting Ben? Or the fact that the topic is never brought up again. When Liz shows up at Peter's, she doesn't give a damn about the fact that his father, for all intents and purposes, was just killed. She just wants her computer back. May doesn't even figure into things. The only grief she shows is being described as a little sickly while trying to hook her nephew up with some ditz.

And what's with Liz Allen being the love interest anyway? She was present in Amazing Fantasy 15... and not much else. In the comics, she's never been a real love of Peter's life. Not like Betty Brant or Gwen Stacy or Mary-Jane Watson. It's like making Heather Glenn the love interest of Matt Murdock in a Daredevil movie. Why? Were this a better script, Liz Allen would be either Gwen or MJ and the made-up 'Kim' role would be Liz Allen. Then again, were this a better script, we wouldn't be talking about it.

Harry (Osborn?) does show up, but I doubt this really has anything to do with the comics. The name is probably just a coincidence, as I never knew Harry as a science geek computer hacker.

And how 'bout that comic relief? As I mentioned, lets have some RELIEF from this COMEDY. You have wacky Weiner, crazy Ock (with his catchphrase of 'okey dokey!' and insistence on himself being the real Spider-Man, are we really supposed to take this clown seriously?), Flash, Jameson, and so on.

Not to mention Spider-Man's quips. While the final movie gave a gap between Ben's death/graduation and Spider-Man showing on the scene (long enough for the promoter and high schoolers to forget about the weird stuff Peter's been doing, hmm?) long enough for it to be plausible for Spider-Man to 'get over' Uncle Ben and start quipping, this movie has him quipping right up until after the entirely made-up character of Roz is killed and Ock's plan of blowing up the world is a go.

And of course Ock's plan succeeds, not that it was very credible to begin with. But it's okay, because he's insane. Not 'insane' insane, though, but 'movie' insane. You know, that exact blend of various mental illnesses that cause the character to act in the exact way that makes writing the script easiest. His goal is to blow up the universe... why? We see at the end that apparently he can generate enough power for himself to go through. Can he do that without Parker's data (which is, again, a rather obvious McGuffin)? Why does he want the entire world to be wiped out when he can go through harmlessly? Oh, I forgot, 'crazy Ock'. It's a show of how bad the script is that the hero never vanquishes or defeats the villain. Doubtless the writers planned on having Ock return from his extradimensional odyssey to menace our hero in the future.

Should I even mention how the whole core of Spidey's existence is gone? The lapse in judgment that led to Uncle Ben's death, the guilt, and everything that grew out of it is completely ignored. Maybe the theoretical 'one issue' the writer(s) read wasn't Amazing Fantasy 15, but instead Amazing Spider-Man 1. Which, in recounting Spidey's origin, didn't mention Peter's culpability in his uncle's death (!).

However, that's most definitely being too generous with the writers. Doc Ock, Uncle Ben, Peter Parker, Flash Thompson... they all move, act, and talk in a very distinctive way. Danny O'Neill on his worst day didn't write an Ock as bad as they did.

And, as in Ultimate Spider-Man and the upcoming FF movie, the villain's origin is tied in with the hero's, with the spider that bites Peter (and rather ridiculously aggressively at that!) being irradiated by the same force that turns Ock into a literal cyborg rather then a man with tentacles fused to his body. Lets hope aforementioned Fantastic Four movie leans more towards the USM side of quality then this script.

Spider-Man is never a crimefighter. Peter merely gains powers and uses them against Doc Ock. Jameson's feud against Spider-Man is barely touched on, just like Uncle Ben's death. Spider-Man's webshooters (or 'wrist gizmos') are invented offscreen, just in case all you haters were wondering if ANYTHING could be worse then organic webbing.

To get off-topic a bit, I should note that it seems to me most of the hatred for organic webbing springs from the early idea of it being an allusion for masturbation and puberty (the infamous 'wet dream' sequence that survived Cameron's scriptment like a cockroach to end up in Koepp's first draft, but which was thankfully never shot). As well as the 'outsider' idea, with Peter having to pull his sleeves down to his wrists to cover them up (although he does this anyway to cover up his costume, but whatever). As I said, thankfully both ideas, of Peter considering himself a 'freak' and of the webbing = ejaculation (for a pretty amusing alternate take on this, see Smallville. Then again, maybe I like the idea of DC picking up Marvel's scraps) were ejected before filming. It really doesn't make a difference, aside from not making Peter ridiculously super-smart ("Hey, I've got spider-powers! Better whip up some webbing to go with them! Oh, but when I need money, I can't invent anything, I just gotta take pictures").

And, of course, there's the car chase. Leave it to this script to take two characters with extremely distinctive, visually interesting ways of moving and sitting them in cars for the most mundane pursuit imaginable (one recalls the words of Mike Nelson upon watching the 'chase' in Mitchell: "Oh thank goodness, they merged successfully. My heart skipped a beat there.")

But, some good did come out of this. There's this article, of course, and the idea of Spider-Man and Doc Ock having a car chase (although in my own spin, they fought even as they drove, with Spider-Man having to dodge Ock's tentacles as he manuevered over Ock's car and such). But we should never forget how bad things could have been. That we got a movie as good as we did (and I know your opinions on how 'good' it was vary dramatically) is reason to be thankful... and seems to be attributed to a good deal of luck! Right time, right place, right people.

So, what now? Some have suggested Five-Minute Batman. But my destiny lies elsewhere.

For you see, on the DVD-ROM feature of Daredevil...

There lies the shooting script.

Be afraid.

Be very afraid.

Zev

09-29-2004, 12:55 PM

It has begun. (http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4227905#post4227905)

aka Kal el

10-02-2004, 10:21 PM

Hey Guys lets not forget the debacle that was Captain America!! Rubber Ears!!! WTF??" Could you please let me out I'm going to be sick"wtf??? Your Captain Freakin America!? Not Hugh Grant!! Grow a pair Man!!! And the music!! It made made me long for the song stylings of Frank Stallon!!!

Kingfish

10-04-2004, 02:00 PM

"what happens to a toad when it gets hit by lightning?"

(pause for dramatic scene that lets the audience take in the fact that this was a ridiculous line delivered by an actress that couldn't pull off storm any day of the year)

"the same thing that happens to everything else"

WTF:xmen:

Zev

10-04-2004, 02:44 PM

Green Goblin suit, Spider-Man

Okay, remember when I said we were going to do a week on the Green Goblin and basically how eminently sucky (I love attaching adjectives to words. Although if I keep doing it, it may become pedantically silly) the mask was.

The first question you must ask yourself is why. Obviously, there were very talented people working at very stage of production. They hired the right people. They clothed them in a warm manner. They produced a Spider-Man suit that looked like it practically jumped from the comic book (minus the web 'wings', which are inconsistent in frequency anyway). They wrote a good script. They filmed it with flair. So how in the hell did this one crucial element fail so completely?

The answer is three words: "Lowest common denominator."

I'm sorry, that's a bit pretentious. And not very Zen. I mean, it's not like you asked me "What is the meaning of Life?" and I said "Love." and you said "Ah." and walked away. This is a "Wha? Howzat?" answer, which means I'm going to have ramble on a bit more before getting to the point.

Basically, it started with a question not often considered. How do you explain a crazy CEO with ties to the military wearing green stockings over his arms and legs, purple gloves and booties, a Halloween mask, and a purple shirt and bikini briefs? Oh, and a stocking cap. You cannot forget the stocking cap.

Now, I know why the mask is there. Norman Osborn doesn't want people to know he's, well, Norman Osborn, Man's Man, Ladies' Man, and Man About Town. And the suit? Well, you can't have a supervillain running around in a scary mask, polo shirt, and jeans. I mean, he may be a crazy mass murderer, but he has a fashion sense.

So the thinking began. The suit was to become a 'flight suit' (I'll show the original concept for this later and believe me, it looks much better then the watered-down, budget-friendly version that we got) that Norman stole. Well, relocated is a better word, since it belonged to him in the first place.

The mask would become a kind of helmet that was based on Norman's own collection of various tribal masks. This was because the thought of a mask that acted like make-up, conveying the wearer's expressions and emotions, was too complex according to the makers of Spider-Man and a mold based on that concept was abandoned, much to their 'come back and bite us on the ass' detriment. Of course, they didn't count on the fact that the fans who were going to the movie believed the greatest villain of all time was a guy who stuck an iron mask to his face while it was still red-hot, all to cover up a little scratch on his cheek. And of course, the nonfans are the same people who made ID4 a hit, so realism is not exactly the first thing on their minds. But hey, hindsight is 20/20.

Now, the inital (and best, in my opinion) idea for the mask was by a guy named Warren Mauser. He designed a genuinely creepy concept art that depicted a mask which when closed protected the wearer from the wear and tear of travelling at high velocity without a windshield, then opened at the 'lips' (giving an impression of the wearer being 'in the mouth of madness') to uncover parts of the fact inside.

Instead, the producers went with a mask from the guy who suggested Spider-Man have a helmet (a helmet?) with partially-translucent eye lenses so you could see the actor inside. In other words, not the man you should be seeing about a car loan or anything else for that matter.

The new mask had several flaws. One, the mouth. It was always open, giving the unfortunate impression of one of those Power Ranger villains. If that had been the worst aspect of it, perhaps Goblin could have gotten away with being called Norman the Slack-Jawed Yokel and that would have been the end of it. But for the 'dramatic' scenes, the back of the 'mouth' would slide open, revealing Norman's mouth behind a wiremesh screen. The wiremesh was so dark it was hard to tell that anything was changed.

And the eyes. The yellow eye protectors also rolled down to reveal Norman's baby blues, but it was basically too little, too late. Watch the scene with Norman promises to kill Mary-Jane after he's done with Peter. He's almost on fire, but you can only see his eyes and (somewhat) his mouth. Bad, bad, bad.

So, basically the entire suit was a result of not enough money, 'dumbing down', and general corner-cutting. Pity.

The Hero

10-04-2004, 03:16 PM

Green Goblin suit, Spider-Man

Okay, remember when I said we were going to do a week on the Green Goblin and basically how eminently sucky (I love attaching adjectives to words. Although if I keep doing it, it may become pedantically silly) the mask was.

The first question you must ask yourself is why. Obviously, there were very talented people working at very stage of production. They hired the right people. They clothed them in a warm manner. They produced a Spider-Man suit that looked like it practically jumped from the comic book (minus the web 'wings', which are inconsistent in frequency anyway). They wrote a good script. They filmed it with flair. So how in the hell did this one crucial element fail so completely?

The answer is three words: "Lowest common denominator."

I'm sorry, that's a bit pretentious. And not very Zen. I mean, it's not like you asked me "What is the meaning of Life?" and I said "Love." and you said "Ah." and walked away. This is a "Wha? Howzat?" answer, which means I'm going to have ramble on a bit more before getting to the point.

Basically, it started with a question not often considered. How do you explain a crazy CEO with ties to the military wearing green stockings over his arms and legs, purple gloves and booties, a Halloween mask, and a purple shirt and bikini briefs? Oh, and a stocking cap. You cannot forget the stocking cap.

Now, I know why the mask is there. Norman Osborn doesn't want people to know he's, well, Norman Osborn, Man's Man, Ladies' Man, and Man About Town. And the suit? Well, you can't have a supervillain running around in a scary mask, polo shirt, and jeans. I mean, he may be a crazy mass murderer, but he has a fashion sense.

So the thinking began. The suit was to become a 'flight suit' (I'll show the original concept for this later and believe me, it looks much better then the watered-down, budget-friendly version that we got) that Norman stole. Well, relocated is a better word, since it belonged to him in the first place.

The mask would become a kind of helmet that was based on Norman's own collection of various tribal masks. This was because the thought of a mask that acted like make-up, conveying the wearer's expressions and emotions, was too complex according to the makers of Spider-Man and a mold based on that concept was abandoned, much to their 'come back and bite us on the ass' detriment. Of course, they didn't count on the fact that the fans who were going to the movie believed the greatest villain of all time was a guy who stuck an iron mask to his face while it was still red-hot, all to cover up a little scratch on his cheek. And of course, the nonfans are the same people who made ID4 a hit, so realism is not exactly the first thing on their minds. But hey, hindsight is 20/20.

Now, the inital (and best, in my opinion) idea for the mask was by a guy named Warren Mauser. He designed a genuinely creepy concept art that depicted a mask which when closed protected the wearer from the wear and tear of travelling at high velocity without a windshield, then opened at the 'lips' (giving an impression of the wearer being 'in the mouth of madness') to uncover parts of the fact inside.

Instead, the producers went with a mask from the guy who suggested Spider-Man have a helmet (a helmet?) with partially-translucent eye lenses so you could see the actor inside. In other words, not the man you should be seeing about a car loan or anything else for that matter.

The new mask had several flaws. One, the mouth. It was always open, giving the unfortunate impression of one of those Power Ranger villains. If that had been the worst aspect of it, perhaps Goblin could have gotten away with being called Norman the Slack-Jawed Yokel and that would have been the end of it. But for the 'dramatic' scenes, the back of the 'mouth' would slide open, revealing Norman's mouth behind a wiremesh screen. The wiremesh was so dark it was hard to tell that anything was changed.

And the eyes. The yellow eye protectors also rolled down to reveal Norman's baby blues, but it was basically too little, too late. Watch the scene with Norman promises to kill Mary-Jane after he's done with Peter. He's almost on fire, but you can only see his eyes and (somewhat) his mouth. Bad, bad, bad.

So, basically the entire suit was a result of not enough money, 'dumbing down', and general corner-cutting. Pity.
Ah,finaly.I'm looking forward to this.:up:

Art Criticism 101, Captain America II: Death Too Soon (1979)

Okay, picture this. Reb Brown as Captain America (actually, he's more Bionic Man, but that's another update for another time) is staking out the bad guys' van in his persona of Steve Rogers. Now, the terrorists have relayed the chemicals they were transporting to another vehicle and left it behind, thus leaving Steve-O a completely cold trail. They ruin this by COMING BACK to retrieve their van. Hey, *******s, if your boss gets his gigantic ransom for not blowing stuff up I'm sure you'll be able to buy a new van.

But anywho, they come back to find Cap painting a picture of a stray cat he's adopted (?), calling it Heathcliff. A bad guy states his intention to "check this turkey out", indicating a possibility that this made-for-TV movie was made in the seventies.

The no-good-niks tell Steve to get out of town Or Else. Steve calls their bluff. And, to a burst of ominous music, they... they... I can't say it.

"There!" the offending thug growls. "Now he can see. And we can fit you with the same prescription!"

To this, the Sentinel of Liberty replies "Suddenly I have 20-20 vision," which is kinda like that pseudo-Cap of Chuck Austen time after Mark Waid's run but before 'Cap Lives' and Robert Kirkman that he conceded the comparison of the bombing of Dresden in WW2 to the 9/11 attacks. In that it ****ING SUCKS! Geez, to faze the REAL Captain America, you'd have to do much better then threatening to paint glasses on his face. The man's stood up to the COSMIC GODDAMN CUBE, for ****'s sake.
Those BASTARDS.

Let's all have a moment of silence for Cap's painting.:(

The Hero

10-04-2004, 03:50 PM

I should make that my signature.:DIt took me four months...but I've done it.:o

Zev

10-04-2004, 05:12 PM

In case you were wondering, here's the abandoned Goblin concepts I was referring to (and congrats on your good taste, Hero).

I'm just curious how the "talking" part would have worked though. Even with his "fold up" mask (fig. 3), his identity would have been revealed way too soon.
And I wish the armor looked more like...well, armor. I though Ramos' version was a great re-visioning of his costume. And it wasn't just one color.

Zev

10-04-2004, 07:58 PM

Well, the talking could have been done by having the opening be less exaggerated. For example, it could open from nose to chin and the eye lenses could also retract to achieve a sort of cowl effect.

The Navigator

10-04-2004, 08:05 PM

Well, the talking could have been done by having the opening be less exaggerated. For example, it could open from nose to chin and the eye lenses could also retract to achieve a sort of cowl effect.

I'm having a hard time picturing that without the "folded-up" part obscuring his eyes...maybe a break-away to the side might have worked. (That acutally would have looked like some sort of creepy mouth, so it would have been cooler!)

Zev

10-04-2004, 08:42 PM

I'm having a hard time picturing that without the "folded-up" part obscuring his eyes...maybe a break-away to the side might have worked. (That acutally would have looked like some sort of creepy mouth, so it would have been cooler!)

Could've folded down. Another concept also featured the mask folding up, but having two eyeholes in the 'chin' for Osborn to look through.

The Navigator

10-04-2004, 08:44 PM

Could've folded down. Another concept also featured the mask folding up, but having two eyeholes in the 'chin' for Osborn to look through.

That seems needlessly complex. I like the "folding down" idea, though...

The Hero

10-05-2004, 10:52 AM

In case you were wondering, here's the abandoned Goblin concepts I was referring to (and congrats on your good taste, Hero).

Herr Logan's either going to have a geekasm or be sent into a foaming rage (http://www.superherohype.com/news/x-mennews.php?id=2066)

How much do you want to bet it goes the way of Batman/Superman and Sperman Lives,and get's canned before pre-production?

Zev

10-05-2004, 05:22 PM

Consiering we're going to see it again in SM3 unless Raimi has Willem's spirit make some modifications to the costume or we eschew Harry's subplot entirely...:(

Actually, my groupie, it's been widely said that "this won't be your grandfather's Green Goblin." Raimi's smart, he'll learn from his mistake. Think about the improvement between Spider-Man 1 and 2 (i.e. giving J.K. Simmons more screentime, giving the villain and honest-to-God Evil Scheme). I'm betting that whatever costume Harry eventually uses, it will have either been improved by Norman before his death (you know, upgrades) or Harry will put his own spin on it.

And I don't think Herr will have a problem with Benisoff, as the man proved with Troy that he could write a film centering around an unbelievable badass.

The Navigator

10-05-2004, 05:26 PM

Actually, my groupie, it's been widely said that "this won't be your grandfather's Green Goblin." Raimi's smart, he'll learn from his mistake. Think about the improvement between Spider-Man 1 and 2 (i.e. giving J.K. Simmons more screentime, giving the villain and honest-to-God Evil Scheme). I'm betting that whatever costume Harry eventually uses, it will have either been improved by Norman before his death (you know, upgrades) or Harry will put his own spin on it.

And I don't think Herr will have a problem with Benisoff, as the man proved with Troy that he could write a film centering around an unbelievable badass.

...groupie? ;)

And do you really think Harry's smart enough to modify the Goblin costume? This guy can barely pass remedial science, for crying out loud!

Zev

10-05-2004, 09:56 PM

...groupie? ;)

And do you really think Harry's smart enough to modify the Goblin costume? This guy can barely pass remedial science, for crying out loud!

You know, whenever I insult someone, you hold up a lighter and say "Holla!" or something.

Harry's as smart as the script demands. Plus, he has years to develop a wardrobe.

The Navigator

10-05-2004, 09:57 PM

You know, whenever I insult someone, you hold up a lighter and say "Holla!" or something.

Harry's as smart as the script demands. Plus, he has years to develop a wardrobe.

...I never say "holla." "Hoffa," maybe, but not since the CIA paid me a little visit.

He only has three years, two if you don't count pre-production.

Zev

10-06-2004, 11:26 AM

Careful, he's going to go on a rant.

That's what you should say if you happen to be surfing the internet with someone else in the room. I am in full rant mode (for earlier rants, please check into Worst Moments in Comic Books) and something's gonna feel the burn. But unlike your typical rant, this isn't about why someone can't get a girl, why parents don't understand you, or why Lindsey Lohan is the hottest piece of ass on the planet. If you want that, go elsewhere. This is some intellectual **** going down right here!

It's not often that a GOOD review makes me not want to see a movie. But congrats, CHUD, you've done it. Devin Faraci reviewed I Heart Huckabees (that title! Ugh!). Now, being not particularly impressed with the trailer and having a disdain for psychology (what, you expect me to like a field that includes Dr. Laura, Dr. Phil, and Dr. Freud among its members? Frasier's the only good one in the bunch...), I wasn't planning on seeing it anyway. The only thing that seemed clever amidst all the pseudo-intellectual musings ("Everything is the same, even when it's different." Wanna run that one by me again?) was Jude Law's character, who displayed a healthy and commonsensical contempt for vapidity. When told by a woman that he "can't stand [her] infinite nature," he replies "Yes I ca--wait, what does that even mean?"

Now, I haven't seen the movie, but I've seen enough movies to know where this is going. And a latter part of the trailer which features (a slumming?) Dustin Hoffman questioning Jude Law's character and his wife about their sex life (to which they both become flustered and defensive) seems to confirm my fear. You see, while they've been having sex, they haven't been having MOVIE SEX. You know, thousands of lit candles, physically perfect and passionate and desirable partners. Bathtubs, stuff swept off tables or desks and clothes rent in a rage of lust, mutual and simultaneous orgasm, that sort of thing.

Hollywood’s fixation on sex as being the alpha and omega of the Human experience never ceases to depress me, especially in the spiritual arena. For instance, in Attack of the Clones, we're told that "a Jedi cannot know love." Just in case someone might mistake the Jedi for a monkhood (how Western!), Lucas quickly made it clear over the Internet that Jedis weren't celibate (is it too farfetched that he was thinking of Freud's infamous admonition that "the only unhealthy sexual activity is no sexual activity at all," to paraphrase), they just weren't allowed to have possessive relationships. Also known as monogamy (funny, that seems to have worked for, oh, I don't know, A COUPLE THOUSAND YEARS AND BILLIONS IF NOT TRILLIONS OF PEOPLE!). I don't know about you, but I wouldn't trust my planet to a gang of warriors who were only allowed to love 'im and leave 'im. I mean, you don't have to be a psychologist to see the inherant flaws in that psychology.

Now, I haven't seen the film, but I'm willing to lay even money that I'm entirely right. And of course, the CHUD review doesn't help.

Brad (Jude Law), a yuppie from the Huckabees Corporation (Huckabees is the “Everything Store” – read: Target), who has taken over Albert’s Coalition, which is working to save a marsh and forest from development. Of course Brad plays it like he’s looking out for the best interests of the land and the people, but he has other ideas.

Man, just like those soulless corporate types to not get psychology and have bad sex and stuff!

Now, this might be forgivable as typical Hollywood business as usual (although strange coming from an indie director like David O. Russell). But then there's more o' the same.

Tommy Corn finds himself paralyzed in life because of petroleum – he understands that the drilling of petroleum is perhaps the actual source of most of the world’s problems, from Middle East violence to environmental catastrophe, from economic unfairness in Third World nations to the diminishment of open spaces. But he doesn’t see how he can extricate himself from the chain of consumption that makes the drilling of petroleum profitable.

Oh, harping on the oil industry. That's a new one. New rule, people. Every villainous archetype that's been done in a Steven Seagal movie is now off-limits. That includes Ee-vil Guv'Mint Conspiracies, Ee-vil Drug-Dealin' CIA Sp00ks, and Ee-vil Oil Corporations (as done in the Seagal classic 'On Deadly Ground', with Michael Caine (!!!) as the Evil CEO).

This would be acceptable if it was just one of the many, many viewpoints encapsulated in a diverse Hollywood. But it isn't. A whopping 90% (that's NINETY PERCENT) of politicalized releases slant to the left. It's flooding the field. While every good Democrat felt duty-bound to go out and watch Farenheit 9/11 (while all the SMART ones know that they don't need to see Moore's dishonest propoganda), they don't stay for Bush's Brain, Outfoxed, or Silver City.

Meanwhile, since every conservative Christian is dutybound to go out and see The Passion of the Christ, a film with a budget of $30,000,000 has an Opening Weekend of $83,848,082. Let me make that clear. In its first weekend and only in the US, POTC nearly made back its budget THREE TIMES OVER. While everyone and their mother writes a book attacking Bush, the one book attacking Kerry (Unfit For Command) has an Amazon.com sales rank of 30. The lower the number, the higher sales are. In contrast, Michael Moore's book Stupid White Men has a sales rank of 6,483. Obviously, conservatives are crying out for THEIR OWN political stories. It's a niche waiting to be filled and it's only good business to GIVE THEM documentaries attacking Kerry, saying that we did the right thing in Iraq, attacking Michael Moore, and basically being behind Bush. To give them films that say, hey, conservative values are great (as the broad-chested hero reaches for the slinky heroine, she puts a hand on his chest and says "Not until I get a ring around this finger, bub!")! To give them action films without evil industries or evil intelligence agencies or evil U.S. Army personel, but WITH Saddam and his sort as the bad guys.

There is hope. Team America seems to be devoted to making fun of left-wing celebrities and repressive regimes. So as long as the South Park boys don't take the easy way out and make fun of Bush (well, at least not all THAT much:)), they're going to make a mint.

shinlyle

10-06-2004, 01:31 PM

Okay, here's my top ten wirst comic movie moments list:

10) Batman Returns. When the Batmobile used a big puchrod to lift it up, then turn it around, I thought htat was quite pointless. The Mind-controlled penguins really just left me agasp too.

9) Bane. His entire character was dumbed down to the point that only hopeless ritalin addicts could enjoy it.

In regads to Zev's comment about the Wilheim screa from Howard the duck....Look at the credits some time and the name GEORGE LUCAS appears...He can take his own scream if he wants to.He's George Lucas.

Zev

10-10-2004, 08:30 AM

It's time for a new feature, probably one time only, that I like to call...

THE WB HAS A LOT OF NERVE

Okay, so Smallville had an episode about how plastic surgery was wrong and stuff. Of course, I don't see how killing a baby in your womb is okay, but getting your boobs embiggened is wrong, but whatever. But whatever else, you must agree that Smallville has a lot of nerve to say that true beauty is on the inside when the leads of their show are a male model who can't act his way out of a wet paper bag and an annoying wrench who's shoved down our throat every episode (oh, now she's the reincarnation of a warrior princess? STILL NOT CARING!).

Now, you'd think I'd have a whole conservative, hawk rant about last night's episode of Justice League Unlimited. No, not really. But a show all about comic book superheroes using VIOLENCE to stop assorted supervillains has a lot of nerve to suggest that violence never solves anything. When's the last time you saw an international summit that worked? Talking never solves much of anything, really. If it did, the presidential debates would end with Kerry saying "Oh, you're right, I guess you are better qualified to lead the nation. I withdraw."

And I know it would be nice to believe that man is so peaceful and slow-to-anger that we need an ancient Greek god of war to drive us to battle, BUT I REALLY DON'T THINK THAT'S THE PROBLEM!

Oh, and at the end, Ares (aforementioned god of war) says "Wherever there is prejudice, wherever there is inequality, wherever there is ignorance, I'll be there." The show would have TOTALLY redeemed itself in my eyes if Wonder Woman had said "Even you can't be everywhere at once." But no.

skorponok

10-10-2004, 10:24 AM

6) Matt Murdock learning Kung Fu from Biohazardous liquid. Most people need to train, but blind people can do it naturally! :rolleyes:

I was unaware that it was a puddle of ooze that actually taught Matt Murdock... :rolleyes:

...and about the scene in the Hulk you mention, I just assume that, even while transformed, Banner's "humanity" still pulls through and keeps the HULK (at least in the movie) from actually killing.

The Navigator

10-10-2004, 10:54 AM

Now, you'd think I'd have a whole conservative, hawk rant about last night's episode of Justice League Unlimited. No, not really. But a show all about comic book superheroes using VIOLENCE to stop assorted supervillains has a lot of nerve to suggest that violence never solves anything. When's the last time you saw an international summit that worked? Talking never solves much of anything, really. If it did, the presidential debates would end with Kerry saying "Oh, you're right, I guess you are better qualified to lead the nation. I withdraw."

Thumbs up. :up: :up: :D

Silver Lantern

10-12-2004, 03:28 PM

Just hope the new ones are much better this time which I know they will.....Punisher with Tom Jane was really good and I liked it.