Posted
by
CmdrTaco
on Tuesday August 24, 2010 @02:30PM
from the size-matters dept.

adeelarshad82 writes "The rumors are now reality, Samsung showed the world its first glimpse of the Samsung Galaxy Tab, the company's new 7-inch tablet. Samsung Mobile will release more information about the Galaxy Tab on September 2 in advance of IFA Berlin 2010. Tab will run on Android 2.2 and feature full Web-browsing and video calling. The information given by the company implied that the Galaxy Tab will sport an HD screen for video, Flash support, support for e-books, possible GPS navigation, and PC linking."

It is also possible that you could have a device with an HD screen, but not the capability to watch HD movies.

Right, for example, it would be reeeeaaaally cheap if they gave you a screen with HD definition (and advertised as such) but the graphics chip couldn't churn that many pixels, or if the CPU+GPU choked on common codecs at those sizes. A single HD image != "HD screen for video."

YES. Only the handful of nerds will know and care first, but they will make noise. They will direct the conversation with the force and vigor of someone who knows what they're talking about. And, little by little, they'll change many other minds about what free [libre] software can do for them.

I saw something like that once. It was like a graph with the X axis representing time and Y axis representing time. Sort-of horizontal error bars made of dots with vertical lines joined at the top by horizontal lines told you a sound's duration. I heard that all the professional musicians are using it.

It's a Linux system presented in all stores across the planet, on prime shelf space.

What does this do for Linux? About as much as TiVo did with it's "Linux system... on prime shelf space"... actually the real analogy here is probably iOS and Mach... I mean, it's so awesome and powerful right? Well, you have to root/jailbreak it first (assuming the device doesn't have an anti-tamper)... and that's getting harder with each new release.

In reality, it's just another consumer device and runs a popular OS which is hackable, that has a DRM-locked marketplace... notice I didn't say anything about Linux or Java... Neither does Samsung.

It's a Linux system presented in all stores across the planet, on prime shelf space.

What does this do for Linux? About as much as TiVo did with it's "Linux system... on prime shelf space"... actually the real analogy here is probably iOS and Mach... I mean, it's so awesome and powerful right? Well, you have to root/jailbreak it first (assuming the device doesn't have an anti-tamper)... and that's getting harder with each new release.

And Android phones are going the TiVo way as well, requiring jailbreaks and the like to "get the most out of it". Android's open-source, but the phones themselves aren't open at all. They're just open because the manufacturers were rushing to get phones on shelves. Though, HTC devices have always been more "open" to being hacked (xda-developers was about a particular set of HTC devices back in the WinMo days). But we're seeing with Motorola and probably soon Samsung and the like will be locking down the phones to run "approved OS images only".

The Sony PSPhone if it's true will probably be horrifically locked down, and probably tied to the Playstation Network like the Go, and Sony's pretty good about locking things down tight. Motorola's already shown it with the Droid X, getting back to where things were in the WInMo days.

And yes, I've heard manufacturers ask to lock things down - they say things like they don't want another xda-developers popping up for their phone.

And Android phones are going the TiVo way as well, requiring jailbreaks and the like to "get the most out of it".

As of 2.0, this is not the case.
With Tivo and Iphone, you have to hack it to get basic functionality. With Android you only have to hack it if you want to get access to the kernel to install a driver.
Using the examples of Sony and Motorola are not indicative of Android, they are indicative of Sony and Motorola. HTC and Samsung have proven to be quite open to custom ROMs, HTC to the point of

I had to laugh at the "Possible GPS navigation" part, since they couldn't even get the GPS to work properly on their Galaxy S line of phones. What makes them think they can make it work properly on the tablet?

The GPS problem on the Galaxy S line has been known for over a month (and acknowledged by Samsung, even) and yet there's no fix for it. I mean, it's not like it's a minor problem with the GPS... the GPS just does not work on most phones, and some even will kill your GSM connection all together periodically.

Possible GPS navigation my arse! How about making a working GPS on a phone before trying to put it on a tablet. Other phone manufacturers have been able to put working GPS units in their phones for years. One would think Samsung might have tested this out before releasing a flagship line of phones.

I had to laugh at the "Possible GPS navigation" part, since they couldn't even get the GPS to work properly on their Galaxy S line of phones.

It looks like it will have the GPS. If you look at their teaser site [samsungmobile.com], one of the pictures they flash through there shows the navigation screen. And they also advertize "navigation" as one of its features with moving/focusing words towards the end of the video.

It's really not that bad. I have a Vibrant, and the GPS issue is the only downside to the phone. Otherwise, it's a phenomenal piece of hardware. Also, it's been confirmed that the GPS issue is a software bug, and will be fixed in the Froyo update in September. Since this pad device will be running Froyo to start with, I think it's safe to assume the GPS will work just fine.

GPS has been officially stated by Samsung to be fixed in Froyo update.

All I have seen is Samsung saying it's been "optimized" in Froyo... nothing about a fix. Given the fact that they would likely say it's been fixed (since they publically admit it's broken) instead of "optimized."

They are using a state of the art broadcom chip. The GPS issues are most likely software based, but I'm not ruling out overheating or bad production for also having an adverse effect on the GPS performance.

Samsung has an official firmware fix for the GPS problem on the Galaxy line of phones. The firmware is scheduled for release in September. The forthcoming Epic 4G from Sprint will be released with this updated firmware.
Engadget Story [engadget.com]

If you are willing to hack your phone, you can install the GPS software from the new Epic 4G, which is a Galaxy S phone. In my experience this substantially improves the function of the GPS receiver on my Captivate (AT&T version of the Galaxy S). So while Samsung made a big mistake shipping a clearly broken product (did they seriously never try out the GPS even once before shipping the phone?), at the very least a fix exists and I feel confident it will make it out officially.

What matters is that Apple is finally starting to get some real competition.

I lost count of the number of times I heard that about the iPod...

Same here... but the Galaxy S phone, GPS issues not withstanding, absolutely destroy the iPhone 3 series. I haven't used an iPhone 4 series, so I can't say how it compares to that rev, but from what I understand, the only superior part on the iPhone 4 is the screen. Otherwise, the Galaxy S phones are superior in every other way.

I have an iPod Touch that I use regularly, but after using the Galaxy S for the past 3 weeks or so, every time I have to go back to the iPod it feels horrible to use. The iOS 4 UI

Given the fact that there is nothing the Galaxy S can't do that the iPod Touch/iPhone can

I know of one thing the 32 GB third-generation iPod touch can do that the Galaxy S can't: retail for under 300 USD.

Really? Where can I pick up an iPhone 4 for under $300 retail?

Ohhh... you mean the iPod Touch. That doesn't have a phone, so you'll have to add the cost of a phone onto that, so your retail price just jumped up above $500 for the same features.

I'm going to carry a phone regardless of whether I have an iPod Touch or not... since I can now replace the iPod Touch with a Galaxy S and lose zero functionality and gain some features, comparing the cost of an iPod Touch to a Galaxy S PHONE is meaningless, you'll

That doesn't have a phone, so you'll have to add the cost of a phone onto that

iPod touch + Audiovox 8610: $160 per 24 months on a prepaid carrier. iPhone 4 or Galaxy S: ten times as much. The major carriers want to sell me 450 minutes a month at minimum; I use less than a tenth of that.

Now, if you want to compare music players by themselves, I can show you a number of MP3 players that are superior to the iPod Touch for under $150

Can you recommend an MP3 player that has a repository of apps? I looked into the Archos 5, but Archos is having trouble getting Google to let it onto the Market. I've been considering buying a Nokia N900 from Dell.com and just not using the phone part.

Anywhere that sells one? That is the price. for the highest end one no less, the 32GB model.

I'm going to carry a phone regardless of whether I have an iPod Touch or not..

The iPhone price is with a two year contract, but since you said you are going to carry a phone regardless, that is irrelevant. Not to mention that now with the 256MB plan the iPhone is the cheapest smart phone to own - I use the device heavily and almost never cross that amount, because I'm around a lot of WiFi.

Or of course you could get a Touch and something like a MiFi and just use Skype on the Touch.

since I can now replace the iPod Touch with a Galaxy S and lose zero functionality

Only if you don't consider the potential loss of almost a hundred thousand applications a drop in functionality. I would, but then I am a practical person who likes to consider what a device can do for me instead of just supporting a handset maker because I like them.

$299 with a contract is NOT retail. It's subsidized. Retail is the specification. You won't find an iPhone 4 32GB for less than around $800 retail (and that's considering eBay retail).

How do you figure the 256MB plan makes the iPhone the cheapest smart phone to own? AT&T's prices are through the roof. My T-Mobile contract is about 30% less than any AT&T contract AND I have unlimited data (or if there's a cap, I've never reached it).

I don't consider the loss of almost 100,000 applications that are completely useless to be a great loss. 95% of the apps on the iPhone/iPod are complete junk (same goes for Android as well). So giving the total number of apps is a meaningless figure. The amount of USEFUL apps on Apple and Android are about the same.

So you claim to be a practical person who likes to consider what a device can do for you instead of just supporting a handset maker because I like them and then go on to defend Apple? I'm not sure how you reconcile that. The iPhone is demonstrably inferior in most categories to the Galaxy S, yet you support them, and support them with either false information (retail price) or meaningless statistics (total number of apps).

So I would have to pay $700 for lesser hardware, clunky UI, vendor lock in, reduced functionality if I wanted to switch (US) carriers and/or be forced into an exceptionally overpriced, limited contract for an iPhone... or pay $350 - $400 for superior hardware, modern UI, open source/no vendor lock in, unlocked for international use AND have a US phone contract that is 30% less than AT&T for the same or superior data transfer limits. Let me think which is a better deal here... I dunno, you tell me.

Cost breakdown:

Monthly recurring:

$185 / mo minimum from AT & T for similar plan$135 / mo minimum from T - Mobile for similar plan

Hardware cost, subsidized:

$199 - AT & T$149 - T - Mobile

Hardware cost, retail:

$700 - iPhone 4$350 - Galaxy S

So $50 a month less and save $350 up front for superior hardware and UI or twice the up front cost and $50 more a month for inferior hardware and UI.

Not really a hard decision there, unless your an Apple Fanboy.

For the record, if you read my other posts in this thread, you'll see I'm not a Samsung fanboy - I think they have crap quality control and exceptionally poor handling of defect issues (then again, so does Apple). They just happened to have made the best Android based smartphone out at the moment, and it's the best by a HUGE margin, not just a little bit. It has leapfrogged every other Android phone out there and leapfrogged the iPhone 4 as well.

That's why I have a separate phone, an Audiovox 8610. It costs me $7 per month through Virgin Mobile, which is far cheaper than getting a proper phone and proper phone service through AT&T or T-Mobile.

More like half the price. I live in the United States and already have have a phone. If I want an MP3 player that surfs the web over Wi-Fi and runs apps from a repository, an iPod touch costs 300 USD compared to 600 USD for a Galaxy S.

This is all true, I think. I compared the iPhone 4 side-by-side with the Galaxy-S and the latter has a much brighter, more defined screen. I don't know what about the iPhone 4 screen is supposed to be better, but it's definitely not the brightness, responsiveness or the colours. Maybe it's higher resolution or something, but frankly the resolution on these phones now is nearing the limits of what I can detect with my eyes in normal use. You basically can't see the pixels on them any more unless you press

Depends on how you characterize "competition"; if you mean products that in terms of quality and feature sets compete with ipods, there are plenty. In terms of commercial success, probably a fair amount less.

There is a temp fix out there. Some manual changes and it works by going thru one of Google's servers instead of Samsung's. So it is a small drawback. I'm sure they will get it fixed. Maybe it is an issue in Android 2.1 and not 2.2? But GPS isn't everything. What matters is that Apple is finally starting to get some real competition.

The fix doesn't really work. It improves it some, mainly by using network location. It doesn't do anything for the actual GPS problem, it just masks the problems with various assists. Oh, and you have to root your phone to apply those "fixes" that really aren't. Not a big deal, but most people aren't going to do that.

Perhaps so-- the new crop of smartphones do require more manual messing around and is less polished than the Apple versions. But that doesn't mean they are not real contenders, or that they won't get better.

Back in the day, if you wanted a GUI, you needed to buy a Mac or use an expensive Unix workstation. Windows came out. But it required a lot of fiddling with autoexec.bat and config.sys to make it work. Meanwhile with Macs you could just plug right in to Appletalk and get things like networking and prin

Oh, no doubt Android phones in general are competitors to the iPhone right now. I'm just pointing out that a specific phone that requires "some manual changes" to get basic features like GPS working right is a bit too low a bar to be cheerfully claiming "real competition."

Now every tech company has to get an ipad competitor on the market. Kudos to Apple for leading innovation like no one else. How many years have we seen people talk about thjs particular form-factor? Appple makes one and boom. Now everyone is doing it.

Don't take me the wrong way. This is not a rant! I'm actually happy to see this kind of development

The problem is, Android tablets have been on the market for almost a year in North America alone, not considering the cheap ones in China only. Apple brought them the lime light, but Androids were the ones to take the first steps and showed that a tablet computer running a minimalist OS was not only doable, but was very functional for day to day usage.

There's always some hot new format or item that tech industry goes crazy for. I'm still not certain that there's a real place for these things outside of the home. While I love the idea of taking one of these things to a meeting, I loathe the idea of attempting to use a virtual keyboard for anything but a short message. All of these implementations do not involve a stylus for me to draw with or any kind of handwriting recognition.

The format size is awkward. Everyone I've seen with an ipad has this despera

In the public sector. In other areas (such as Emergency Responders, Health Care, Manufacturing and many others) there have been wildly successful tablets for many years.

I work in the GIS industry and tablets have also be successful here, in particular the ruggardised ones that cost US$5K a peice. The Ipad has the same problem as any other tablet, they are uncomfortable for long term use. When field services get back, they plug the tablet in, get the data off it and work on their desktop/laptop. The tablet

I would not doubt that many of those with iPad's today are the same who got into the PDA craze at the turn of the century and jumped from PalmOS devices to Windows CE devices. Those kinds were constantly upgrading to have the latest stuff and spent more time showing it off than using it. Windows CE did a great job at killing off the PDA segment when you could show off amazing things like color screens, audio, and videos but it sucked the giant teat when it came to battery life, reliability, and usability. I

You do realize that people will use it for many things other than video, right? If they were building a portable digital TV, they would probably call it something different, like a portable digital TV.

Android 2.2 doesn't support HD displays (only via video out like HDMI), unless they've extended it somehow. Otherwise we'll have to wait for Gingerbread (3.0?). 2.2 only supports up to something like 854x480 for the main display, I'm pretty sure.

We have an e-ink reader - the form factor is great, but the lack of backlighting is surprisingly restrictive, and anyway you can't read documents that require color. I read e-books on my mobile phone, but the screen is really too small.

A 7" form factor with a backlit LCD "the size of a paperback" sounds just right. Big enough to be useful, small enough to still fit in a jacket pocket.

Some people prefer a 7" tablet (I am one). That is also why Apple is rumored to be producing one too.

For my self a 10" one seems silly. It's not big enough to use a have a good keyboard and carrying an external one defeats the purpose. It's heavy and bulky - it isn't going into a pocket or be carried on a plane comfortably either. Add inn all the issues with it having a fairly stripped down OS and hardware so I can't do much more than watch a movie or browse the web and it is worthless to me.

How would it be a failure? Its running newer, faster parts and it seems like the screen might be a higher resolution. Better, newer parts will raise the price making it possibly match the iPad. And if people feel its a better

24-48 hours on a laptop, and 7-14 days on a tablet. 24 hours is with the hardrive, optical drive, CPU, GPU, wifi, screen brightness, and bluetooth all maxed out. 48 can be with the cpu load low, and the wifi + bluetooth on, as if I was surfing the web, screen at 1/2 brightness. Otherwise it's like having an ipod clasic with 83.33 days of music (40k songs * 3 min/song) but can only play for 36 hours...

I'm looking forward to what Qualcomm's mirasol [youtube.com] technology too, with its supposed week worth of battery life per charge, but time still will tell about what it can truly do in real settings. But if it does really last like that, its always a possible.

I have the Archos 5. Archos' tablets had a lot of potential but the firmware is so damn buggy and they seem to not really give a crap. (they're french, what are ya gonna do?...) I hope the new hardware that comes out from samsung and other competitors starts addressing some of the issues these early versions had. Anything bigger than my archos is pretty much not going to cut it for me though (mainly use it for my car stereo and anything bigger won't fit in the stereo cubby hole).

Will this be an follow up on the Galaxy phone?That is, will it be released with outdated and buggy software that Samsung promise to NOT upgrade?Will they after pressure release different version of buggy updates to a still old version in different countries?Will it crash, be prone to screen errors and to slow to use?Will Samsung ignore all complaints? Will the only bright light be the unpaid hackers who makes their own version of the OS?

I bought the Galaxy phone and have sworn to never again buy a phone fro

I believe "Swan Lake" vs "Funky Gibbon" comes close. However, my HTC desire has yet to arrive, so I am guessing. My Samsung Video Recorder did not record videos, and was replaced by the store without quibble as "Goods not of merchandisable quality"

This article was a bit light on the details (as it's just mentioning what's in the quick video preview on the site), but other sites have posted some rumors and analysis of some Samsung firmware leaks.

The display seems to be 800x480, which is decent on a 7" screen (133ppi, essentially the same as the iPad's 131ppi). There is a front and rear facing camera (confirmed in this video which mentions video calling), a 1.0 or 1.2GHz hummingbird processor (similar to the awesome 1GHz hummingbird in their Galaxy S phones which can really pump out the pixels [youtube.com]), and some other goodies.

Same piece of crap now 100% larger. That will come in handy when your tossing the POS against the wall.

And Guys get with it consumers are never going to go for android tablets. This is for the same reasons people on this site will and the same reason windows tablets failed. Its just general purpose linux computer. Its not designed as a device. The iPad is a hit because -yes- it is a big iPod touch. Consumers don't have to deal with all the issues they have on their computers. Push the button it works. Files

so the Samsung tablet must really be designed to compete with the iPhone

If they made a wi-fi only, no-phone (think iPod Touch) version of this and sold it for $199 ($150 on Woot!) they'd sell a zillion of these things.

I don't want another device for making calls and costs me $40 per month in connect fees. I want a good wi-fi tablet that runs real Android and doesn't cost $500.

If I can buy an 8gig iPod touch for $129 (refurb), than I should be able to buy a 7" iPod Touch for about $200. I need it to read PDFs, access Wi-Fi for email and Internet, and play a few games. Why is that so effing hard?

You would think they would totally go after that market. Removing the phone aspect of it makes it cheaper and doesn't require the monthly fee, sure, but look at what that can do to the business market. Make these things affordable enough so that even a small business can purchase a dozen of them and you're talking about a very sweet tool for a wide variety of uses.

I'm thinking restaurant Point of Sale system for servers to jot down orders at tables myself. Anybody know of a good, cheap, WiFi only tablet with decent handwriting recognition that could be used for this purpose?

I want a device almost exactly like that. And you know what? A few of the new Kindles are almost there - but they do such an atrocious job of displaying technical PDF files, that they're out, as far as I'm concerned. I don't have too much disposable dough lately, but I'd gladly plonk 200 bucks for a WiFi tablet that decently displays PDFs (and can browse the 'net).

Unlikely if a no-name Chinese manufacturer sells direct for $200 a pop with similar hardware: W1060G [aliexpress.com]

I wonder if those Chinese tablets are any good. Have you tried one?

I don't think the fact that this Chinese outfit is already selling such a thing makes it less likely that Samsung or some other major manufacturer would do it, I'd think it makes it more likely. I'd think most people would rather buy a Samsung.

Unlikely if a no-name Chinese manufacturer sells direct for $200 a pop with similar hardware: W1060G [aliexpress.com]

I wonder if those Chinese tablets are any good. Have you tried one?

I don't think the fact that this Chinese outfit is already selling such a thing makes it less likely that Samsung or some other major manufacturer would do it, I'd think it makes it more likely. I'd think most people would rather buy a Samsung.

I've got a similar no-name Chinese tablet, picked it up last month in Shanghai. 800x480 7" screen, Android 2.1, 2 GB built in, MicroSD card slot, a REAL (type A) USB connector, a second USB connector, HDMI output, nice little machine. Get about 6-7 hours on a battery charge, reading books and listening to music (headphones). About half the weight of an iPad, and JUST small enough to fit in the cargo pockets of my shorts and pants. WiFi only, but hey - I've got an HTC Touch Pro2 that runs WMWiFiRouter v