tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1574140332407591967.post385225125747708892..comments2017-12-04T22:33:32.367-08:00Comments on Spirochetes Unwound: Chronic Lyme disease in mice?Microbe Fanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00832169199776258021noreply@blogger.comBlogger1125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1574140332407591967.post-92214280961335558572009-02-08T17:25:00.000-08:002009-02-08T17:25:00.000-08:00Maybe you know this, but something analogous has b...Maybe you know this, but something analogous has been seen in syphilis post-treatment. However, I'm not sure but I don't think there was any truly positive identification of treponemes in the papers I read on this, which were mighty old. Just morphological identification via electron micrography, which is rather tentative. <BR/><BR/>If I may, how does some ten-minute trial of one or two agents really dismiss the whole "abx-refractory lyme disease" model, when four or five agents are routinely used for <I>years</I> (with mixed success) in treating M. avium complex in man, when diverse bacterial taxa form biofilms that are highly abx refractory in vivo, when chlamydiae in monocytes are rendered highly abx refractory (Gieffers 2001), and when diverse taxa are rendered abx-refractory in vitro by treatments as simple and diverse as starvation, heat shock, pH shock, etc? Everyone ought to admit that there is no truly convincing case for or against this highly politicized model, and take a balanced view of it like you do. Granted, it's clear that this syndrome is not a classical bacteriosis, if "classical" means it can be steamrolled by a brief treatment with agents that mash the putative miscreant in glass on growth-permissive media. The question is whether that is the only sort of bacteriosis that exists.<BR/><BR/><I>SCID mice are especially susceptible to developing severe inflammation when infected with B. burgdorferi. Nevertheless, inflammation was not detected in the SCID mice</I><BR/><BR/>But, in addition to what you already stipulated, it's also worth mentioning that human refractory lyme (assuming it actually is an infectious disease) might well be mediated by the adaptive IS - if so, a SCID mouse obviously won't hunt.<BR/><BR/>-Eric J. JohnsonIchneumonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13901456809560059918noreply@blogger.com