if this did get moved to all servers i think it would help out less pop. servers forming up 25 mans, esp once you can basically do a 10 man in one night once everyone is mostly geared. Good thing about a small server is most people know everyone and pugging isn't to hard.

You never played on low pop server, didn't you?..
Help small realms form 25 man? LMAO, my old realm couldn't do a 10 men raid, we were getting pugs for 3 days until we managed to form a group for DS.. I don't remember last time when there were even 25 people online in main city...

This change will screw small realms even more than they are screwed ATM.. They will be basically excluded from a progression patch completely and suffer even greater distance to more crowded ones where you could pug second raid if needed..

Originally Posted by Archaeon

In tbc everyone wished they were playing vanilla. In cataclysm everyone will wish they were playing wotlk.

This argument really is moot until we are provided with some hard evidence:

1. Impact on the 10 man guild community in regard there being a different lockout
- Will this have a negative impact or positive impact? Will it increase the number of 25 man instances being entered or will it remain the same? Does recruitment on the affected servers attract a higher chance to end up in a stable guild?

2. Difficulty challenges
- Will the difficulty change dramatically for 25 mans given that there is a higher standard of loot on offer, in particular fights that are deemed dps races?

3. Intent of implementation
- This is currently, from what I understand, being implemented on Asian realms. Is their intent to test this out for future implementation on US and EU realms or does it stop here?

4. Fall back position
- In the event that this is not as received as well as they hope will it revert back to the current system, or will something new come up?

5. Market stability
- Will the BMAH now house items on all realms from potential 25 man heroic raid instances or will it only be on Korean realms?

Given the changes are proposed for going live and not currently live it would be unfair to enter into speculation without understanding the full evidence yet to be provided. From a personal standpoint in a ten man guild I am more interested to know how it works and what benefits/losses there are in the end. Although we are still at the start of the expansion recruitment for a ten man alliance guild seems increasingly difficult, and if such changes it may become exacerbated.

Personally I'd like to see one of two scenarios play out.
The first is introduce a lockout system that is 10-15 man and 20-25 man, with the number of players in the raid instance increasing the difficulty of the encounter. Logistically tuning a fight would be a nightmare but would allow a lot of flexibility for guilds to work on encounters. No need to increase the ilvl of loot for 25 man, just adjust the number of loot potential to increase as numbers of players increase.
Secondly have the ten man format remain as is, but allow for cross realm available for 25 man normal and heroic content. This would allow like minded players to gravitate toward each other without requiring to leave their current guild or server transfer, in event a similar situation as the KR servers come into play. Alot of guilds broke up in Cata, and more in MoP as players gravitated away from the game and the 10 man raid scenarios became more enticing over recruitment. In the event guilds partook in a cross realm situation make the loot situation become more like the LFR style (you're in on a boss fight you either get gold or loot) however make the chance of loot coming from the fortune coin being increased.

This would be insane. Once again forcing people to raid 10 and 25... It will lead to a loss of subscribers again. If people need incentives to do 25 man, they obviously dont like it, but are just lootwhores.

Subscribers wern't lost in WOLTK, it was WoW's most active time. If this got spread across all regions i'd welcome this with open arms. I LOVED this style of raiding in 3.2/3.3, it felt like we actually had something meaningful to do. As i recall nobody was forced either, nearly all realms had a healthy balance of 10 and 25 man guilds, where as the state we are in now where i'm in the ONLY 25 man guild left on our realm.

This as well as the 2 resets per week on the KR servers is just sick. Why the hell we have a game and we will race to world first and stuff when the Koreans have a clear advantage. Not to mention the time difference that usually means the difference between world first kill at least for the first couple of bosses.
That is so wrong!!!
Either they make it for all or for none.
And since I havent play 25 man for a long time and I enjoy the 10 man it will be just the end of it.
if the want only one setup for all players they should delete the 10 and 25 man and make it 15 or 16 man raids and that is it.

I wish they make it to all servers, 25man droping better gear but sharing lockout with 10man so i don't have to do both 10man and 25man.

Bad - This is a bad player, he refuses to learn how to play correctly.
Casual - This is a player that will let everything else take priority over wow.
Hardcore - This is a player that is fine with putting things on hold while he's on wow.
Bad/Good - Measure of Skill.
Casual/Hardcore - Measure of Time

I don't really care about a 'perceived advantage'. I'm more interested at why WoW is run differently by Blizzard over there than anywhere else. Is it a cultural thing that the rest of the world doesn't understand?

Interesting if this is true... wonder why the KR version of WoW is run by a different philosophy.

This sounds like the ICC model. Granted I support the different ilvls for either mode, I don't agree with having different lockouts.

This is with all games run by Korean departments under licenses. They have their own philosophy and they have agreement that they can do things as they sit fit even though their counterparts (EU/US) have it totally different. They could even be handling legendaries for free if they'd want to.

So the 10-man guilds tell all the 25-man guilds, "Boo hoo, you can't complain. You can still do 25-man if you want, no one is forcing you to do 10s. Let the chips fall as they may, and see what people choose. If 10s win out, so be it. The people have spoken."

Suddenly, with the prospect of this one day coming to US realms, the 10s are crying foul. No complaints allowed. No one will be forcing you to run 25s. Better gear certainly won't make it a requirement. To you I will say, "Boo hoo, you can't complain. You can still do 10-man if you want, no one is forcing you to do 25s. Let the chips fall as they may, and see what people choose. If 25s win out, so be it. The people have spoken."

I'd love to see that on all realms. It would help bring together communities.

However, 3 modes (10, 25, LFR) is too much. I think best solution would be to share 25 and LFR lockouts. Then people trying to max out their gear won't feel like having to farm 3 instances a week (they'll farm 2, like they do now).

The reason Stormwind park was completely destroyed was because the night elves there had the audacity to tell Khadgar that Boomkins are superior to Mages in every way. Deathwing just happened to be flying by.

YES! 25 man groups finally get rewarded with better gear than 10 man. Back to the golden age of ICC.

Which was terrible.

---------- Post added 2012-10-25 at 10:01 AM ----------

Originally Posted by Moonfaxx

So the 10-man guilds tell all the 25-man guilds, "Boo hoo, you can't complain. You can still do 25-man if you want, no one is forcing you to do 10s. Let the chips fall as they may, and see what people choose. If 10s win out, so be it. The people have spoken."

Suddenly, with the prospect of this one day coming to US realms, the 10s are crying foul. No complaints allowed. No one will be forcing you to run 25s. Better gear certainly won't make it a requirement. To you I will say, "Boo hoo, you can't complain. You can still do 10-man if you want, no one is forcing you to do 25s. Let the chips fall as they may, and see what people choose. If 25s win out, so be it. The people have spoken."

It becomes MANDATORY since you MUST run it or you will get fucked royally on gear. MANDATORY to run BOTH 10 and 25 . And this will make me quite the game for the 1st time since 2004

I'd love to see that on all realms. It would help bring together communities.

However, 3 modes (10, 25, LFR) is too much. I think best solution would be to share 25 and LFR lockouts. Then people trying to max out their gear won't feel like having to farm 3 instances a week (they'll farm 2, like they do now).