Varian should be exiled from the alliance.

OK, since we're going down this road in the other thread, might as well make this abundantly clear.

Since his introduction into wow as this new king figure, Varian was the instigator of this war we are in now. He started the fire, and he fueled the flames that made Garrosh's already obvious anger issues into full blown rage.

Now Garrosh is just as responsible for his own actions. But in any situation, you will always have an instigator. Thrall and Jaina were trying for peace, and yet Varian, who was in the same position as Thrall was, didn't even try, he forced the hordes hand at every turn like an idiot.

This is old news you say? How is this relevant now? Well since people want to keep searching for reasons how and why character go down the path they have, and since people were so adamant to accuse Thrall of making a bad mistake and should be held accountable for it, lets not split hairs.

And even prior to this, when Jaina tried to hold a peace summit in theramore, at the very drop of a hat, when Thrall was trying to make peace with Varian, the second Varian saw Garona, he attacked Thrall, accusing him of backstabbing him, without even listening or trying to. He made first strike, not Thrall, not Garrosh.

So, if you think holding Thrall accountable for Garrosh's actions is right, then either you can acknowledge that Varian is just as responsible for instilling that burning anger and thirst for war on the alliance into Garrosh, and starting all this to begin with.

Well, this is a silly thread made in retaliation to another silly thread, but I just want to point out that Varian's march out of Theramore to the gates of Mulgore (and the razing of Camp Taurajo) was the first major act of war. So it's not entirely stupid to place some of the blame for the conflict at his feet.

Well, this is a silly thread made in retaliation to another silly thread, but I just want to point out that Varian's march out of Theramore to the gates of Mulgore (and the razing of Camp Taurajo) was the first major act of war. So it's not entirely stupid to place some of the blame for the conflict at his feet.

Your argument is very weak, and obviously somewhat forced. There is no hint at all that Garrosh's anger needed any "fuel". Varian did not cause Garrosh to become what he is today. Thrall gave Garrosh power, so he is partly responsible for Garrosh's actions. Varian did not.

And Varian might very well have been an idiot (or might still be an idiot). But he does not share blame for Garrosh's politics. Thrall does.

Also, the idiom of "splitting hairs" does not mean what you apparently think it does.

You just mad cus everyone is picking on your precious Thrall. Get over the green fever man.

Go back to gnomeregan and come back when you have some decent lore.

---------- Post added 2013-02-25 at 01:55 AM ----------

Originally Posted by Mormolyce

Well, this is a silly thread made in retaliation to another silly thread, but I just want to point out that Varian's march out of Theramore to the gates of Mulgore (and the razing of Camp Taurajo) was the first major act of war. So it's not entirely stupid to place some of the blame for the conflict at his feet.

THANK you, yet another example.

Yeah, Garrosh is the leading force of this war, but shock as it might be for people to believe, he did not instigate this conflict. Varian did so at a time when the horde was lead by someone trying to talk peace with the alliance.

Well, this is a silly thread made in retaliation to another silly thread, but I just want to point out that Varian's march out of Theramore to the gates of Mulgore (and the razing of Camp Taurajo) was the first major act of war. So it's not entirely stupid to place some of the blame for the conflict at his feet.

which takes place after garrosh's attacks upon ashenvale, which were the first events following the shattering.
its even noted that garrosh took advantage of the weakened defenses.

Yeah, Garrosh is the leading force of this war, but shock as it might be for people to believe, he did not instigate this conflict. Varian did so at a time when the horde was lead by someone trying to talk peace with the alliance.

Actually, Thrall is far more to blame for that than Varian. It was his Horde that caused the Wrathgate incident. Had he been a better leader, maybe he could have prevented that. Varian had reasons to be an angry hothead in Dalaran (Wrathgate) and Theramore (Garona), even if they were bad reasons. Garrosh was just aggressive because he was an insecure man trying to emulate his daddy.

Your argument is very weak, and obviously somewhat forced. There is no hint at all that Garrosh's anger needed any "fuel". Varian did not cause Garrosh to become what he is today. Thrall gave Garrosh power, so he is partly responsible for Garrosh's actions. Varian did not.

And Varian might very well have been an idiot (or might still be an idiot). But he does not share blame for Garrosh's politics. Thrall does.

Also, the idiom of "splitting hairs" does not mean what you apparently think it does.

Varian didn't give him power, but he initiated enough attacks that there was sufficient justification for Garrosh to go to war... to believe that the Alliance will never let them live. Even if he feels bad about it now, he set things in motion.

And Varian *did* start the war. There was a tentative peace, and then he attacked the Undercity. Make whatever arguments you want, the Undercity is held by those who lived there originally, and is a member of the Horde; in attacking the Undercity, he attacked one of the capital cities of the Horde. I'd be hard pressed to think of a larger declaration of war.

Actually, Thrall is far more to blame for that than Varian. It was his Horde that caused the Wrathgate incident. Had he been a better leader, maybe he could have prevented that. Varian had reasons to be an angry hothead in Dalaran (Wrathgate) and Theramore (Garona), even if they were bad reasons. Garrosh was just aggressive because he was an insecure man trying to emulate his daddy.

Bzzzzz, WRONG, it was a rogue group that caused the wrath gate, and your Varian who accused the horde of it happening.
'oh but Sylvanas was making the plague in the first place', yes, as a weapon to defend against the alliance. And with captain chin over there, can you blame them for it?

Sorry, Thrall and his horde was prepared to fight alongside the alliance, and to an extent so was the alliance, but Varian made the swings that made it impossible.

feck it if ye wanna go back further its all the orcs fault for trying (twice) to invade and take over azzeroth. Shoulda stayed the feck on dreanor then maybe their planet wouldnt have gone kaboom and none of this woulda been an issue