The idea behind this is too pile up enough to flip to the D-Rays or Marlins. Do you think this may work more in the Reds favor? They could also trade Freel and Milton for prospects. If the Reds get enough prospect with decent to high ceilings the Marlins or Devil Rays are bound to bite.

Your thoughts? What prospects could be obtained?

reds1869

10-11-2006, 04:58 PM

Absolutely not. Dunn needs to bring some real value in return, not the potential for value.

dunner13

10-11-2006, 04:59 PM

I doubt this would happen since Wayne and BC want to win now. If dunn goes it has to be for a good pitcher. If you can get prospects for milton though I am all for that.

SultanOfSwing

10-11-2006, 05:00 PM

Absolutely not. Dunn needs to bring some real value in return, not the potential for value.
He would if the prospects netted Cabrera or Crawford and maybe more.

RedsManRick

10-11-2006, 05:01 PM

Only if they were say, Erick Aybar, Howie Kendrick, and Brandon Wood.

reds1869

10-11-2006, 05:02 PM

He would if the prospects netted Cabrera or Crawford and maybe more.

As I said, I wouldn't trade him for the potential to pick up equal value. The Reds have "built for the future" far too many years, and I hope the new regime doesn't do the same.

SultanOfSwing

10-11-2006, 05:03 PM

Well no, you wouldn't acquire several prospects and hope the Marlins bite. It would be more like a 3 or 4-way deal.

SultanOfSwing

10-11-2006, 05:06 PM

Only if they were say, Erick Aybar, Howie Kendrick, and Brandon Wood.
I don't know the reality of that, but I would jump all over something like that. Then Phillips and maybe EE become tradeable. Their demand, especially EE's, would likely be huge. If you could keep one or two of those and combine the others with some of the Red's prospects you could net Cabrera and maybe even Willis too.

KronoRed

10-11-2006, 05:38 PM

No.

dougdirt

10-11-2006, 06:38 PM

Yes, depending on the prospects. They need to be at the AA level or higher though.

Oh and there is no way Dunn would bring you Brandon Wood straight up, much less if it included Erick Aybar and Howie Kendrick.

Erick Aybar is someone I like though as a target.

flyer85

10-11-2006, 06:47 PM

Yes, depending on the prospects. They need to be at the AA level or higher though.

Oh and there is no way Dunn would bring you Brandon Wood straight up, much less if it included Erick Aybar and Howie Kendrick.

Erick Aybar is someone I like though as a target.I would agree that it depends on the prospects. and I would hope Aybar isn't one of them, he is seriously overhyped(no power, no patience, lots of errors).

RedsManRick

10-11-2006, 07:07 PM

Yes, depending on the prospects. They need to be at the AA level or higher though.

Oh and there is no way Dunn would bring you Brandon Wood straight up, much less if it included Erick Aybar and Howie Kendrick.

Erick Aybar is someone I like though as a target.

That was sort of my point. Dunn, as it stands now, probably isn't going to bring the type of return that would be necessary to offset his loss. The offense is just too thin to trade Dunn unless we get contributing players in return. That said, I would certainly shop him to see if that deal is out there.

ChatterRed

10-11-2006, 07:38 PM

I would love to see this organization stockpile pitching. Pickup good pitching, but also get some good minor league position players that are stuck behind guys in the majors at their position. That's how we got Phillips and others.

fadetoblack2880

10-11-2006, 07:51 PM

nope, trading dunn with the lack of offense this team already suffers from is ignorant...

corkedbat

10-11-2006, 08:11 PM

Is Billingsley still considered a prospect? Both the Dodgers and Angels (probably the ChiSox, BoSox and maybe the O's too) could put together a package that would make me pull the trigger. Unfortunately, the GM that met my price probably wouldn't be able to sit down afterwards for 3-4 years so it probably won't happen.

Part of me really hates the idea of trading Dunn, but the other part really hates the makeup of this ballclub and wonders if a big return for him is part of the answer.

If Krivs does deal him it needs to change the fortunes of this franchise for the better.

dougdirt

10-11-2006, 08:33 PM

I would agree that it depends on the prospects. and I would hope Aybar isn't one of them, he is seriously overhyped(no power, no patience, lots of errors).

I guess what I like about him is his glove (he does play great defense despite his errors), he hardly ever strikes out (about once out of 10 at bats), he can steal some bases (but still needs work), and he hits a fair share of doubles. He is a slick fielding SS, so I wouldnt expect much power out of him, and the lack of walks is a little worrisome, but he has speed and puts the ball in play a lot of the time. I dunno, maybe I just like him more than most.

fearofpopvol1

10-11-2006, 09:41 PM

yep, though I'd want to see a AAA pitching prospect. You could most likely land a #1 pitching prospect for Dunn.

Also, no team is going to trade you a mindblowing proven pitcher for Dunn. They're not stupid! You've got a take a risk, you just hope that Kriv and company does their homework on it and pull the trigger.

deltachi8

10-11-2006, 09:43 PM

no.

flyer85

10-11-2006, 09:50 PM

I guess what I like about him is his glove (he does play great defense despite his errorsnext Omar Vizquel, I've heard that somewhere before.

Natty Redlocks

10-11-2006, 10:31 PM

That's weird; I was just thinking about this today. I often wonder how Cardinals fans feel when Pujols is at bat in a key situation. Do they think: "Oh goody, maybe he'll walk instead of strike out"?

No. I bet they're thinking they hope these dopes are dumb enough to pitch to the man, cause he's gonna make 'em pay. That's the way I'd like to feel when Adam Dunn comes to bat.

But I don't. Neither do you. And we all know why.

Now, Miguel Cabrera. There's the closest thing to Pujols remotely available to the Reds. If they got him, they'd have him --at a good price-- for three years at least. He is a true franchise player, something the Reds sorely lack. If Dunn could get you Felix Pie and Angel Guzman, and those two plus Encarnacion get you Cabrera, I do that in a single heartbeat.

Cabrera would be the heart and soul of any offense. Junior and Dunn are more like the liver and spleen.

So, yes, definitely, I would trade Dunn for prospects. I would even *gasp* consider throwing in Homer Bailey if it got Willis, too.

johngalt

10-12-2006, 01:28 AM

So, yes, definitely, I would trade Dunn for prospects. I would even *gasp* consider throwing in Homer Bailey if it got Willis, too.

Homer Bailey should not be "thrown in" to any deal, much less one that also includes Adam Dunn.

If we're sending Dunn and Bailey somewhere in the same deal, we better be getting a 25-year-old Roger Clemens and a boatload of other parts.

larks

10-12-2006, 02:04 AM

I'm still holding out hope for a deal sending Dunn to the Tigers for Humberto Sanchez and Brent Clevlen. That would make the offseason for me.

ChatterRed

10-12-2006, 02:21 AM

The problem with Dunn is that I have lost confidence in him.

I know, I know........who am I?

Seriously, I don't know anybody that has any faith in Adam. I'm ready to deal him for the immediate future. I don't want to necessarily rebuild, but I honestly don't see winning a World Championship with these guys, namely our studs...........so why not deal them and move on and hope for the best?

SteelSD

10-12-2006, 02:55 AM

I'm still holding out hope for a deal sending Dunn to the Tigers for Humberto Sanchez and Brent Clevlen. That would make the offseason for me.

Sanchez is a decent target for someone but not worth including as a key primary for someone of Dunn's production level. Brent Clevlen demonstrates a decent IsoD (@0.85) but hasn't consistently demonstrated much in the way of power production and absolutely bombed at Erie (AA) this season at the age of 22. Right now he's a fringe guy and that's nothing I'd want as anything more than a throw-in for a lesser deal.

Any trade of Adam Dunn must change the fortunes of the franchise and those two guys just don't do it.

SteelSD

10-12-2006, 03:29 AM

The problem with Dunn is that I have lost confidence in him.

I know, I know........who am I?

Seriously, I don't know anybody that has any faith in Adam. I'm ready to deal him for the immediate future. I don't want to necessarily rebuild, but I honestly don't see winning a World Championship with these guys, namely our studs...........so why not deal them and move on and hope for the best?

Lost confidence in Adam Dunn? I'd ask that you point to a single post you've ever made that actually displays anything resembling real confidence in Adam Dunn or that demonstrates an undertanding of Dunn's worth to the franchise- a player you've recently positioned as "dead weight" even though he was worth more Runs than any other Reds player in 2006. For Win Shares, Bronson Arroyo had an unbelievable season and finished with 21 Win Shares and Dunn produced 20 at his worst. If Dunn is "dead weight" then Arroyo should also summarily be jettisoned.

As far as dealing anyone for the immediate future...

On the Kearns/Lopez trade:

ChatterRed 7/13/06: Great trade that will follow in the footsteps of obtaining Phillips, Arroyo and Ross. This management knows what they are doing.

Translation: "In management I trust but a week later when things get stinky I'm right there to bash them senseless."

Topcat

10-12-2006, 04:49 AM

Only if they were say, Erick Aybar, Howie Kendrick, and Brandon Wood.

Oh hell Rick I am down with that pipe dream if possible :D

Krusty

10-12-2006, 10:30 AM

Sanchez is a decent target for someone but not worth including as a key primary for someone of Dunn's production level. Brent Clevlen demonstrates a decent IsoD (@0.85) but hasn't consistently demonstrated much in the way of power production and absolutely bombed at Erie (AA) this season at the age of 22. Right now he's a fringe guy and that's nothing I'd want as anything more than a throw-in for a lesser deal.

Any trade of Adam Dunn must change the fortunes of the franchise and those two guys just don't do it.

Maybe you can make this a three-way deal:

Dunn to Detroit for Sanchez and RHP Zach Miner.

Reds then trade Sanchez, Miner, Encarncion and Coffey to the Marlins for LHP Dontrelle Willis and 3rd baseman Miguel Cabrera.

flyer85

10-12-2006, 10:56 AM

ChatterRed 7/13/06: Great trade that will follow in the footsteps of obtaining Phillips, Arroyo and Ross. This management knows what they are doing.there were a lot of posters drinking the kool-aid right after the trade.

flyer85

10-12-2006, 10:57 AM

Reds then trade Sanchez, Miner, Encarncion and Coffey to the Marlins for LHP Dontrelle Willis and 3rd baseman Miguel Cabrera.why would the Fish want to trade Willis and Cabrera? They certainly don't need to, they can easily afford the salaries.

Krusty

10-12-2006, 08:56 PM

why would the Fish want to trade Willis and Cabrera? They certainly don't need to, they can easily afford the salaries.

It depends what they get in arbitration. If Jeffrey Loria keeps the payroll around 20 million, he might see these two as two expensive.

But the Marlins won't give them away. You'll have to give up quality prospects and young players to get them.

2001MUgrad

10-12-2006, 09:06 PM

Sure, Why not??

Provided that money would be spent on the team immediately. His lack of improvement concerns me.

Slyder

10-13-2006, 02:41 PM

The only way I would trade Dunn for prospects is if those prospects were similar to Hanley Ramirez in which they were ready for MLB now and had very high ceilings on them. Any other "wait and see" offers get immediately ditched into the garbage.

If you are going to trade Dunn you better get something of immediate significance to try and offset the production of Dunn. Thats JMHO but you dont trade someone like Dunn for guys you gotta wait a year or 2 on.

SultanOfSwing

10-13-2006, 02:54 PM

The only way I would trade Dunn for prospects is if those prospects were similar to Hanley Ramirez in which they were ready for MLB now and had very high ceilings on them. Any other "wait and see" offers get immediately ditched into the garbage.

If you are going to trade Dunn you better get something of immediate significance to try and offset the production of Dunn. Thats JMHO but you dont trade someone like Dunn for guys you gotta wait a year or 2 on.
Agreed. I wasn't looking for any other types of prospects. Unless you knew they were coveted by one particular team you wanted to trade with (ie, Marlins).