6 comments:

MADDOG61
said...

Yep - our POTUS set another first - OPENLY berated our staunious allies as part of his continuing Global War on the US or International Apology Tour. This guy has absolutely no sense of loyalty or history, let alone geography when it comes to foreign policy. I guess he never played RISK or AXIS and ALLIES as a kid to understand the 2d and 3d effects of his actions. As Bugs Bunny said, "Geez - what a maroon."

Okay:yes, Israel is evil, and they do draw us into wars solely for their benefit, and it is always a disaster for America.Iraq, for example.You should post something about the deliberate attack on the USS LIBERTY in '67, by Israel, and the deaths of 34 US Sailors.Or something about the Israeli spy Jonathan Pollard, and how he is a hero in Israel, and thousands of "American" Jews have lobbied extensively for this traitor's release.Maybe something about Israel selling stolen classified air-to-air missile technology to Communist China.Or that shipload of advanced Patriot missiles they were caught shipping to China not too long ago.Or "American" Jews helping Mossad steal nuclear materials from NUMEC .I could make a pretty long list about how evil Israel is. Surely the facts that it launched a war of ethnic cleansing against the native Palestinians is enough?Isn't driving 750,000 people from their homeland evil enough?

Tom... Thanks for your input. While I agree that some of the actions you describe are distasteful, I don't see how they can be considered evil.

Israel is in a position equivalent to that of an outsider being placed (alone) in an extremely bad neighborhood in a large American city and then surrounded by a gang of thugs demanding that they be given all of his valuables, or they will take his life. The unfortunate outsider knows that even if he gives up all of his valuables there is still a better than even chance that the gang of thugs will ultimately take his life. He does the only thing that he can do, which is to fight using every tool available to him in order to survive. There is nothing evil about that. You or I would do the same thing. There is no such thing as a fair fight. You do what you must to prevail. That is Israel.

Don't forget that America was party to the creation of the Israeli state. A state created on "taken" land smack dab in the middle of a very bad neighborhood that we knew would be populated entirely by enemies of the newly created state of Israel.

The Israelis aren't evil. They are doing what they need to do in order to survive. They are invoking their Castle Doctrine and Standing Their Ground.

Evil was America and her allies knowing the horrors that were being perpetrated upon the Jews (and others)in Hitler's Germany and doing nothing for at least 5 years to intervene and stop it. Evil were the attempts at appeasing Hitler so that he would play nice while more innocent civilians were killed in his ethnic cleansing.

Evil closer to home is the way this land we know as America was taken from it's original custodians.

There is, and has been, so much unspeakable evil in this world... It defies description.

Israelis weren't "placed there". That's a passive voice phrase. Let's tell the truth: they wanted the land. All of it, and they wanted Jews in charge. For radical religious/ethnic/racist reasons, whatever you want to call it.So, they deliberately chose to attack natives and drive them from their ancestral homeland and replace them with foreigners from Poland, Russia and Brooklyn, etc...Massive waves of murderous terrorism; with well over 100 civilians murdered at Deir Yassin alone. More than 400 Palestinian villages were ethnically cleansed of their non-Jewish inhabitants, for the sole reason of replacing them with Jewish foreigners.There was no way to have an "Israel" without a ruthless war of terrorism and ethnic cleansing. Period.It was "evil" when Germany did it; when Serbia did it, etc....Why is it not "evil" when Israel does it? Serious question.

I can see that the verbiage of my analogy made you believe that I think that the Jews were somehow "placed" in Israel. My bad. I do not think that at all, but I do see how one could construe that from my comment. OOPS!

I don't think anyone here will argue against the idea that the Jewish people wanted the land, all of it, and that they wanted to be in charge of it. That is well known 20th century world history. History which use to be taught in High School in this country and history that every child learned, at least on a basic level.

I also don't think that anyone here will argue against the idea that the Jewish people passionately (and successfully) lobbied the British and Americans at the close of WWII to create the Israeli state where it is today. The Jews certainly lacked the ability to create that state for themselves. They needed powerful allies to do it for them. Those allies certainly could have said "no". :)

Perhaps the decisions made by those Allies, and the actions taken by them on behalf of the Jews to create the Jewish state, were based on emotion? How could emotion not be part of that process after 6 million Jews (and several million others) had just been murdered in Europe because they were "ethnically inferior"? I suspect that the Americans and British both felt some sense of guilt (and responsibility) for not doing enough, soon enough, to mitigate the murder of Jews and others at the hands of the Nazis in Europe. Does any of that make Israel evil?

I understand that Palestinians were forcibly removed from their "ancestral homeland" to create the Jewish state of Israel in 1948. I also understand that those very same lands were the "ancestral homeland" of the Jews prior to the Romans coming in and killing many of them and displacing most of the rest of them in the late first century a.d. I understand that many of the Palestinians that occupied "that land" immediately after that time were former Jews who had converted to Christianity in order to "get along" and others who converted to Islam and remained in what was "now" the former Jewish homeland.

I think I have gone off track here a little bit. Sorry 'bout that.

Serious response. It actually is a question, or a series of questions...

Are the Jews evil for trying to survive in a land surrounded by their enemies, or are the British and Americans evil for creating Israel in the first place? Are the Jews evil for convincing the British and Americans that creating Israel would be the right thing to do, or are the British and Americans evil for allowing themselves to be convinced?

The land that constitutes Israel today was the homeland of the Jews before it was the homeland of the Palestinians before it was the homeland of the Jews.

I still don't see how that makes Israel evil.

Perhaps we will never agree on this and should move on to other things? :)

Just a side road here. Is it my imagination or did our POTUS really OPENLY lie during the SOTU address? Actions are speaking louder than words. He spews his lies about "God bless America, yada-yada-yada". However, he doesn't go the Margret Thatcher's funerl or send a delegation; he doesn't go or send a delegation to Paris BUT, he is diverting his recent trip to India to pay homage to a dead Saudi and kiss the ring / bow in front of the successor. WTF?

About Me

7 1/2 years on active duty with the US Army, 1972-1979, mostly in Germany. Oh yeah, do you remember the "Cold War"?
5 years with the USAR. 1982-1987. Light Infantry. Queen of Battle.
I believe that most Americans today have no idea what it means to be American. We have lost our identity. We have traded our "exceptionalism" for "political correctness". We are just another country that has been spoiled by technology and the worship of material things.
We no longer practice the concepts of personal responsibility and personal accountability. We are only too willing to let Big Brother, our government, take care of us.
We have lost sight of what The Founders set out to create when they wrote The Constitution. Saddest of all, we no longer thirst for liberty.

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