Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

Personally I use a Mac to get away from Windows, i really cant see the point, ok it might attract a few new users to Mac however, they will be purchasing the hardware mainly for looks and not the main OS.

Not sure guys, it sorta annoys me.. i personal feel like this is a step in the wrong direction.

Also, Robbiet480 are you aware you posted the same thread in the Software and Hardware sections

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

This is just TOOOOOOO cool! Although I feel a little bad for the people who have been working on something like this for the $13,000 reward. Apple has just made all their work almost for nothing!

And I wonder how much of a demand there will be for Virtual PC once this is standard on the OS. You'll still have some people wanting to run Windows apps while in OS X, but given the fact that this will run Windows natively, that'll be hard to beat.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

I bet Bootcamp was one of those rogue programs that was running inside the apple campus ever since the first intel macs came around. Probably surfaced in an official capacity when there was so much news and interest in running XP on a mac...

But I agree sounds like a step in the wrong direction - but might be a necessary evil when facing Windows only Apps or some games (i.e. Oblivion!!!...)

Plus finally we can silence those WinXP fanboys who talk about lack of games on a Mac... just tell them to wallow in XP for the duration of their gaming.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

I bet Bootcamp was one of those rogue programs that was running inside the apple campus ever since the first intel macs came around. Probably surfaced in an official capacity when there was so much news and interest in running XP on a mac...

But I agree sounds like a step in the wrong direction - but might be a necessary evil when facing Windows only Apps or some games (i.e. Oblivion!!!...)

Plus finally we can silence those WinXP fanboys who talk about lack of games on a Mac... just tell them to wallow in XP for the duration of their gaming.

Like it! Like it! Like it! I find it funny that everyone is wanting XP on their machines too only because once they have it installed they have to worry about all the virus', spyware, and adware out there for PC's!

See... so now you are effectively letting your mac out to breathe the toxic fumes of the mainstream internet as a PC! NOOOOOOOOO!

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

This is horrible for the Apple software community. Sure, the big guys like Microsoft, Adobe etc. will make native versions of their software. But the smaller guys, why would they bother. They just tell you to run Windows XP on your Mac. In the end, you end up using the XP more and more in spite of the original Mac side.

Well... I just hope they know what they're doing. But this is the most crappiest way to celebrate Apple's 30th birthday...

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

I agree with suspie a bit. I'm sure mac programmers will stick to the mac, but now Windows programmers have no incentive to develop for both OSes.

Does this remind anyone of Dvorak's "Apple is switching to Windows" theory?

Well... I personally kind of like the idea of running both OSes. There are games I like that only play on PCs, and all of my friends use Windoze so it'd make certain things easier with them (mostly stuff like video chatting.. yes there are cross-platform solutions, but we don't usually care enough to bother figuring them out).

I just hope it doesn't mark the downfall of OS X, as it is certainly a superior operating system.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

From a business prospective, Apple I belive is doing this to gain market share since Windows Vista is delayed. They are trying to get people that like macs but are afraid to leave or use windows everyday. I'm said that Apple has to do this but it's business. Maybe Devork's theory is not so crazy after all... just kidding....

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

Ok, I finished this quite a while ago, but just found a few minutes during lunch to assemble and post the pics.

This was extremely easy to do (thanks to Apple).

After following the directions to upgrade the firmware and then to re-partition the drive allowing space for the Windows installation, I ran the Boot Camp utility which preps the Mac HDD. The Boot Disk utility also makes a very nice CD for Windows with an Installshield wizard to install the updated drivers.

I installed the XP CD, rebooted and started the XP install:

It didn't take very long for all files to copy, reboot and load the Windows loader

And alas... the ugly Windows Bliss wallpaper in all its glory...(full screen by default)

And here's the Apple driver CD kicking off

The Installshield wizard prompting the install of the Apple hardware drivers.

When rebooting the computer, press & hold Option to get the boot menu.

And finally, Firefox running on Windows XP on the Macbook Pro

Right away the video (ATI) drivers loaded, the audio drivers worked and networking worked (Wifi & onboard NIC).

While I haven't had time to run any benchmarks yet, it did appear quite quick.. then again it was a clean install.

The one additional note that I'd like to add is that if you have a bootable CD in the superdrive and you press/hold Option when you boot, you'll see 3 icons. Not just the Mac and the Windows installs, but the bootable media as well. I tried, to no avail, to launch my Acronis True Image bootable CD (hey, why not try it?).

Oh, and while you're in Windows, set the label to the C: drive. Otherwise, when it mounts in OSX it will display as 'untitled'.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

Guest

Guest

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

As a recent switcher I have to say that I think this is going to hurt OSX. It will help Apple's sales of hardware but I think OS X will have a hard time attracting developers and users for that matter. I hope I'm wrong. I'm enjoying OSX and I would hate to see it lose traction in the name of Apple selling more hardware. There may be more Macs out there because of this, but...

I agree with the argument that there are applications that require me to still use XP, but there is no incentive for Wintel developers to develop OS X if you can just dual-boot back to XP. It's cool, but it's not at the same time. It's because of this I have mixed feelings.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

ok, make it two... I had reported earlier that if you have a bootable CD in the drive that the boot menu will show a third icon: a CD icon to boot from. Well, if you have an external hard drive with a bootable backup image (as I do) then you can add the fourth option to that list.

It's nice to see that this list is dynamic in nature...although the bootable CD is labeled 'Windows' (even though it was a Linux CD) while the bootable "Mac OSX Install Discs" were correctly labeled. The bootable backup OSX drive was correctly labeled. Not surprised here.

And as for bootable Linux distributions. I had tried nUbuntu (since I had it handy) and while it did boot... it did not configure properly. I do hear that Knoppix is supposed to work I'll have to try... just because.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

I really don't think this will do much to hurt OSX unless Apple stops developing OSX. I feel like I am Apple's core audience. I am a designer and use my computer for design, word processing, and internet. I hate windows and thats why I switched to mac despite the hardware costing probably double what windows hardware would have cost. I am tired of viruses/spyware and I hate moving between a bunch of applications in windows [i love expose]. There is nothing I need that doesn't have an OSX native version [all the adobe products, firefox, and office.... what else is there?]. I do occasionally play some games but if I really want to seriously play games I pick up a console controller. That is why they built consoles. So from my point of view the fact that windows will also run on my computer is, if anything, slightly unfortunate but really not something I care about.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

Credit to Apple for giving those Mac users that need to access Windows, an officially supported way of doing so.

Apple recognize that if they don't do this, 3rd parties will (and have).

I can also see Apple capturing Windows users, who in the past would have been too "risk" averse to make the switch. For many potential switchers buying a Mac is a big investment, but knowing they can boot Windows (if they choose) will ease their fear factor.

One downside, this is the final nail in the coffin of Mac game developers that specialize in porting Windows games to Mac.

Windows, Linux let's see it all running on the Mac and also bring on virtualization. If people want to buy a Mac and only run Windows or Linux, that's up to them. Personally, I buy Mac's for OS X.

Link to post

Share on other sites

As a recent switcher I have to say that I think this is going to hurt OSX.

Thank God somebodty is agreeing with me.

- MT

Can I disagree? Two of my coworkers, Mac technicians, are hard-core PC users at home and had no interest in buying a Mac because they were too expensive...until now. They can now get OS X and continue to use their windows apps and the price doesn't seem as steep since they are paying for "high end" hardware. If they were to buy a Mac and a PC with the same configurations separately they would end up spending a lot more money!

I think that this will be good for Apple. Remember... they still have not given their OK for OS X to run on standard PC boxes! I think that would be a HUGE mistake!

EDIT: However, let us remember that this is a MAC forum and now that windows is running on our hardware you should really take your software issues somewhere else!

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

...Two of my coworkers, Mac technicians, are hard-core PC users at home ...

Now THAT'S a new one. It typically appears to be the other way around.

But I digress..

I still think that end the end of the day 2 facts remain:

[*] Apple is a Hardware company (at least they consider themselves to be. They want to sell more iPods, Macbook Pros, iMacs, etc. They're not looking to sell OSX on it's own.

[*] Microsoft is a software company. They sell, among other things, Operating Systems. They already have every other personal computer OEM selling systems with their OS preloaded. That is every other vendor but Apple. Notwithstanding Sun and the few that may be devoted to linux distributions.

That being said, Apple is not going to open up their OS to be installed elsewhere since that would cut into their HW sales. But if people who are on the fence now know that they can install Windows on an Intel Mac then it could accomplish two things:

[*] The sale of an Intel Mac would accomplish a goal by Apple.

[*] The copy of Windows sold/license would accomplish a goal by Microsoft.

Just because Windows is running on a piece of Apple hardware shouldn't make a difference to Microsoft. In fact there's now an inroad that they didn't have before.

I guess we could argue all day about whether or not its morally right or wrong to run Windows on an Apple computer, but at the end of the day both companies are just watching their wallets get fatter as sales continue to grow.

Personally I'm of the opinion that if there's an easy way for Apple to provide a way to dual boot, then maybe it'll prevent people from solely installing Windows on the Mac and will, in fact, give them the exposure to OSX. That may be enough to gain more customers for life.

As a recent switcher (of almost 2 weeks now) ... I can certainly say that I for one love the OSX operating system.... but I do have my reasons for still needing to run Windows too...

Share on other sites

i predict that apple will have more market share than windows in 2010.

i don't think that this will hurt OS X because i know alot of people will go out and buy a intel machine to boot windows xp on it and then they'll see OS X and find out how good it is then switch. and apple says on the bootcamp page that now mac users will be able to enjoy both sides and both generationsn (as they say windows is in last century)

this will definetly increase the market share of apple in the next few years