Euph Euph Euph, you seemed bound and determined to be my nemesis, so let me educate you again.

sometimes W-L don\'t reflect the game,

This is by far one of the most off the wall comments I have ever heard. Sometimes wins and losses don\'t reflect the game? What else reflects the game more than wins and losses? Winning pretty? So go take Baltimore\'s Lombardi back cause their offense was the definition of UGLY!! Since wins and losses don\'t often reflect the game, why do we care who is running the Saints and why Brooks struggles so often and why our D is so bad? Wind and losses don\'t reflect the game? Truly, I am at a loss. There is no greater measure of ANY sport than wins and losses. That is the bottom line. Miss. State\'s coach was 49-24 in his career and was fired this season cause of too many losses. I truly have no words for that statement. :shrug:

typical of you from your previous post... bend and twist thing to fit your agenda... go ahead take things our of context. The point being, the change was made on a professional football team by a coach in the NFL to replace a Professional QB with another in hopes of finding a better fit/fix for his low scoring/productivity offensively. You can\'t sit and hope to win just on the bases of one unit (D), you know you are going to need to score points... why wait until this is obvious... act on it now. That isn\'t a SELL SELL SELL game plan.

READ... I can\'t believe I am going to have to spell this out for you. You can beat your opponet on paper and in stats all day long and yet still lose. Hell you can win by the score but if your team looked like crap don\'t you think you still have somethings to work on to improve your team for more formiable opponets... never mind you\'re like talking to a wall and only going to read what ya want anyways. But you are entittled to your opinon I\'ll give you that... we all know what they say about opinions.

I see you keep getting off subject with the thread here and that is should the Saints purposely lose its remaining games.

When have I gotten off the subject? I have said in about 20 different threads they should lose the rest of their games. It\'s no secret. I thought I had explained myself clearly enough on that one. Let me spell it out for you. I HOPE THE SAINTS LOSE THE REST OF THEIR GAMES AND HAVE A SHOT AT DERRICK JOHNSON OR ANTRELL ROLLE. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE WATSON, STINCHCOMB, GLEASON, MITCHELL, AND BOCKWOLDT PLAY THE REST OF THE YEAR. CLEAR?

And how did I twist things? Your exact words were \"sometimes wins and losses don\'t reflect the game\". How can anyone misinterpret that utterly senseless statement? But try the misdirection approach to deflect the utter ignorance of it. Nice.

You can\'t sit and hope to win just on the bases of one unit (D

Once again tell that to the Lombardi trophies in Baltimore and the one in Tampa Bay. Their defenses, especially in the Baltimore\'s case, VASTLY outplayed their offenses. Why do I have to explain this to you? Oh, I guess it is just like everything else I have to explain. Educating you is getting tedious.

Hell you can win by the score but if your team looked like crap don\'t you think you still have somethings to work on to improve your team for more formiable opponets

This is the EXACT same thing I said about the Saints when we beat Kansas City. Weren\'t you one of the people who jumped on me and anyone else who thought it was a terrible win with the \"a win is a win just be happy\" argument? Man this is almost too easy.

If you can\'t come better, please don\'t respond. This is getting ugly.

It\'s funny that awhile ago you seemed more self-deprecating Saintswhodi, lately many of your posts have lost their initial promise. Sure you have made a few friends with senior posters, but do you think for a minute that that gives you the right to respond to criticism in such a precocious manner.

Euph is addressing complaints he feels about your posting demeanor, sure you fire back that it is him. Have you spent any time lately wondering if maybe you were getting away from yourself?
Maybe you need a break, I used to enjoy your posts, before you got on this bloody minded tangent of throwing the season away, rejoin the real world, our guys are only 1 game out of the post season, stop trying to own the team, and start trying to support it. For at least the next week anyways!

johnny, I don\'t mind anyone criticizing my opinion. This is what I took offense to:

typical of you from your previous post... bend and twist thing to fit your agenda... go ahead take things our of context. The point being, the change was made on a professional football team by a coach in the NFL to replace a Professional QB with another in hopes of finding a better fit/fix for his low scoring/productivity offensively. You can\'t sit and hope to win just on the bases of one unit (D), you know you are going to need to score points... why wait until this is obvious... act on it now. That isn\'t a SELL SELL SELL game plan.

READ... I can\'t believe I am going to have to spell this out for you. You can beat your opponet on paper and in stats all day long and yet still lose. Hell you can win by the score but if your team looked like crap don\'t you think you still have somethings to work on to improve your team for more formiable opponets... never mind you\'re like talking to a wall and only going to read what ya want anyways. But you are entittled to your opinon I\'ll give you that... we all know what they say about opinions.

I see you keep getting off subject with the thread here and that is should the Saints purposely lose its remaining games.

SO, I am out of line for defending myself? Go back and read the very first post after I started this thread. I was accused of having an agenda there by Euph. What does that have to do with my posting style? In this quote I was said to have an agenda, that stating facts and pointing out bad arguments made by others was \"typical\" of me, and not in a good way, things needed to be spelled out for me, and basically being called an a-hole cause of my opinion cause \"everyone has one.\" I may have taken a more aggressive tone, but I still used facts and proven history to back my arguments. I don\'t feel I was out of line, and I have maintained the same argument on here day in and day out. Lose out and sell out for a new coaching staff and a high draft pick.

I won\'t even comment on the rejoin the real world comment about us being 1 game out of the playoffs. I really have no words to respond to that. But since Euph seems to share your opinion that we should still try to win, I can see how you would totally ignore the fact that he came at me first. Kudos.

You used no facts... you only used what you precieved to be facts. You never checked the facts to find that AZ isn\'t producing offensively and that is why they made the change at QB. You implied that the change was made because they were tanking the seaons and thanking Denny Green. I also don\'t go around calling people names that is beneth me. I was merely stating what opinions are that everyone has one and is entittled plain and simple and you seem to be trying to make this bigger than what it really is.

These were your exact words. Now say what you will, but I know how that phrase goes. You can try to get on a high horse now, but it is clear your meaning. Unless you know another way that phrase goes, I would be interested to hear it.

Once again, check your facts. I will make this simpler for both of us and just ask you straight questions. Did Arizona start 0-3? Were they subsequently 4-2? Was Josh McCown the qb? Were they on a two game winning streak? Did they go 0-2 after the change? These are all facts. Show me one that isn\'t please.

Okay, now, did Baltimore not have one of the worst offenses in history when they won the Superbowl? Did they not ride a horrible Trent Dilfer all the way to the win? Did they not win solely because of their defense? Did their offense not go through a stretch of 6 straight weeks without an offensive touchdown during the regular season? Didn\'t Tampa Bay\'s defense lead them to a Superbowl victory? Didn\'t their defense score as many points as the Raiders offense in the Superbowl? Monkeys could have qb\'d these teams, and they would have won because of their D. This is the history I was talking about, and the bad argument you used of a team not being able to win solely because of their defense.

Did you also know Denny Green cut his starting center Pete Kendall and Superbowl MVP Dexter Jackson who were both promptly signed by other teams. Kendall to the Jets where he starts and leads one of the best rushing attacks in the league and Jackson back to Tampa Bay. Now you tell me if this sounds like a coach who is trying to win this year please. Facts one and all. Do you have any?