Now I get to really see what all the fuss is about with these Apple PCs aka Macs. ]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/256306#256306
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:05:25 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/256306#256306Xaero_Vincent50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Xaero_Vincent/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XI used a real Macintosh (G5 workstation) in the photoshop class once but it was a very limited experience. Couldn't do any advanced things like open the console or play with settings.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/6b7d7f7da09443eca0809dec00942232#6b7d7f7da09443eca0809dec00942232
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:08:01 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/6b7d7f7da09443eca0809dec00942232#6b7d7f7da09443eca0809dec00942232Xaero_Vincent50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Xaero_Vincent/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Xaero_Vincent wrote:

﻿A friend/classmate from my class burned me a copy OS X for me.

Now I get to really see what all the fuss is about with these Apple PCs aka Macs.

And there follows a long post complaining about drivers, or performance, or whatever because you are trying to run OSX on a general PC. It might work, it might not.

Also I am quite impressed that you are happy to publically announce that you are pirating software, would you come here and do the same about Microsoft products?]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/383298caa35441b8908f9dec0094225e#383298caa35441b8908f9dec0094225e
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:26:36 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/383298caa35441b8908f9dec0094225e#383298caa35441b8908f9dec0094225eRossj50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Rossj/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Rossj wrote:

﻿And there follows a long post complaining about drivers, or performance, or whatever because you are trying to run OSX on a general PC. It might work, it might not.

Also I am quite impressed that you are happy to publically announce that you are pirating software, would you come here and do the same about Microsoft products?

My PC is old but new enough to run it at a modest G5-equivelent performance.

It would be pirating even if I bought the software, since it is against the EULA to use on non-Apple PCs. Besides, I'm only going to test it for a little bit, not very long before I remove it.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/403d13c3066545a584009dec0094228a#403d13c3066545a584009dec0094228a
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:37:17 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/403d13c3066545a584009dec0094228a#403d13c3066545a584009dec0094228aXaero_Vincent50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Xaero_Vincent/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XDouble check that setup detects hard drive partitions correctly - I didn't install it myself because it didn't show my ntfs partitions and I was I afraid it would overwrite them.
Anyway shortly after that my experiment ended in vmware - os x is not for me ]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/9464175624cf4173b6309dec009422b5#9464175624cf4173b6309dec009422b5
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:48:47 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/9464175624cf4173b6309dec009422b5#9464175624cf4173b6309dec009422b5RoyalSchrubber50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/RoyalSchrubber/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XRight.. This is like getting a copy of Vista and trying it out on unsupported hardware. If you want to try out OSX, get a Mac.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/228d5aaa4d00497da2a89dec009422df#228d5aaa4d00497da2a89dec009422df
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 16:54:39 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/228d5aaa4d00497da2a89dec009422df#228d5aaa4d00497da2a89dec009422dfBas50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Bas/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Xaero_Vincent wrote:

﻿
My PC is old but new enough to run it at a modest G5-equivelent performance.

It would be pirating even if I bought the software, since it is against the EULA to use on non-Apple PCs. Besides, I'm only going to test it for a little bit, not very long before I remove it.

'I was only borrowing the car, officer. I was going to bring it back when I was done.'

Aahh, if only joyriders could get by on the same sort of logic.

]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/09f3a5e607204c42a3519dec0094230a#09f3a5e607204c42a3519dec0094230a
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:09:28 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/09f3a5e607204c42a3519dec0094230a#09f3a5e607204c42a3519dec0094230aRay650http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Ray6/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XI don't condone piracy but I don't see anything wrong with what he is doing. Vista gives the user a 30 day grace period to use the software before purchasing a license.

And please don't come with the "if ...." analogies, now when you can drive an operating system to work every day, or even take it out for a joyride (in the sense that you were portraying it) then you can start using those analogies.

And why would anyone buy a mac to try out an OS they don't even know much about. That's ridiculous.

Edit: Before everyone jumps on me, I am not saying he should be running OS X indefinetly, if he does that then sure he is pirating, but if he is looking at the OS for 10-15 days, then I see nothing wrong with it. If he likes it it would be up to him to purchase
a mac or continue to do what he is doing. What bothers me is the use of analogies that don't apply to the case. Also, nagging about piracy will not stop anyone that wants to pirate from doing so.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/de370df3387d4150b0df9dec00942338#de370df3387d4150b0df9dec00942338
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:35:54 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/de370df3387d4150b0df9dec00942338#de370df3387d4150b0df9dec00942338mig50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/mig/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS Xhttp://www.apple.com/legal/sla/macosx.html

His friend, is violating the Mac OS X License Agreement, specifically the restrictions to use one copy of the Apple Software, (b) to use it on a single Apple-labeled computer, (c) not to lend or redistribute the Apple software.

Since his friend failed to comply with the License Agreement, his rights under the License terminate automatically so essentially he is running an unlicensed copy of Mac OS X now too.

Nagging about piracy may be questionable, but condoning piracy is unacceptable.

And why would anyone buy a mac to try out an OS they don't even know much about. That's ridiculous.

You don't need to buy one, just go into an Apple store and the nice salesperson will be more then happy to demonstrate it to you.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/ffa92130558642908b379dec009423ba#ffa92130558642908b379dec009423ba
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 18:28:35 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/ffa92130558642908b379dec009423ba#ffa92130558642908b379dec009423baAndyC50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/AndyC/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

mig wrote:

﻿I don't condone piracy but I don't see anything wrong with what he is doing. Vista gives the user a 30 day grace period to use the software before purchasing a license.

That's great for Windows users. If Apple doesn't give people that option for OSX, then that's too bad. If you don't agree with the rules, don't use the software. Just because a license doesn't provide a rule that would make sense to you, doesn't mean you can
just pretend it exists anyway.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/1588b523aeee4912a5329dec009423e6#1588b523aeee4912a5329dec009423e6
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 18:33:45 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/1588b523aeee4912a5329dec009423e6#1588b523aeee4912a5329dec009423e6Bas50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Bas/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

AndyC wrote:

﻿

mig wrote:
And why would anyone buy a mac to try out an OS they don't even know much about. That's ridiculous.

You don't need to buy one, just go into an Apple store and the nice salesperson will be more then happy to demonstrate it to you.

Provided there's the right setup available. I've gone to computer stores and tooled around with Macs and I can think of only one that had Xcode installed. Give me one with Parallels/Visual Studio or Textmate.

Then the salesperson can bother off while I go for a test drive.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/1e37d1a4242246bbbe5a9dec00942413#1e37d1a4242246bbbe5a9dec00942413
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 18:39:46 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/1e37d1a4242246bbbe5a9dec00942413#1e37d1a4242246bbbe5a9dec00942413Dharma Punk50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Dharma Punk/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Bas wrote:

﻿

mig wrote:﻿I don't condone piracy but I don't see anything wrong with what he is doing. Vista gives the user a 30 day grace period to use the software before purchasing a license.

That's great for Windows users. If Apple doesn't give people that option for OSX, then that's too bad. If you don't agree with the rules, don't use the software. Just because a license doesn't provide a rule that would make sense to you, doesn't mean you can
just pretend it exists anyway.

Yeah, I won't disagree with you about that, you have a very valid point. But rules are meant to be broken granted the rule being broken doesn't hurt anyone, and I don't mean hurting the developers that is a whole different story, zero tolerance leads to more
unrulyness, I am not against using something for a trial period to determine my purchasing intent. It's part morality and part common sense in my opinion. Naturally others will disagree because they are entitled to their own opinions.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/a647e70b97234cc891549dec00942441#a647e70b97234cc891549dec00942441
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 18:56:44 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/a647e70b97234cc891549dec00942441#a647e70b97234cc891549dec00942441mig50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/mig/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Bas wrote:

﻿

mig wrote:﻿I don't condone piracy but I don't see anything wrong with what he is doing. Vista gives the user a 30 day grace period to use the software before purchasing a license.

That's great for Windows users. If Apple doesn't give people that option for OSX, then that's too bad. If you don't agree with the rules, don't use the software. Just because a license doesn't provide a rule that would make sense to you, doesn't mean you can
just pretend it exists anyway.

OK, so it's "too bad", yet "too bad" isn't stopping the person that wants to run OS X from running it. I am not saying it is right, however it will be done and if it gets Apple another sale all is good, otherwise send a lawyer after them, which isn't even worth
it unless they are selling it forward. I am not pretending rules are not there, I am just stating an opinion. This is not a simple subject to tackle, but everything has it's exceptions, depending on the severity and scale that determine the circumstances.

Going to an Apple store for 30 minutes is not the same as running a system for 10 days and then making an informed decision. I see this as a flaw in Apple's business model, but that is nothing new from Apple so it doesn't phase me that users have to resort
to this to use their software. I personally see Apple as a group of lazy developers that lock their software to specific hardware becuase they don't have the resources (or skill) to support the plethora of PC hardware that Windows supports and then they criticize
Windows for whatever little nack they find, mind you their software only runs on a limited number of machines. Pathetic.

But again, I rambled about something completely off topic. My opinion remains that I would use the software for a trial period and purchase if I wanted to keep it, remove and go about my business if I didn't. That is just me though.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/7db0f31a7b164beaa1ad9dec00942472#7db0f31a7b164beaa1ad9dec00942472
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 19:05:16 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/7db0f31a7b164beaa1ad9dec00942472#7db0f31a7b164beaa1ad9dec00942472mig50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/mig/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

His friend, is violating the Mac OS X License Agreement, specifically the restrictions to use one copy of the Apple Software, (b) to use it on a single Apple-labeled computer, (c) not to lend or redistribute the Apple software.

Since his friend failed to comply with the License Agreement, his rights under the License terminate automatically so essentially he is running an unlicensed copy of Mac OS X now too.

Nagging about piracy may be questionable, but condoning piracy is unacceptable.

There are instances where a EULA is not viable under certain circumstances. I will concede that the software is not mine and as a licensee I
should only do what the EULA states, but in reality no 'real' crime is being committed, it is more of a moral issue than a criminal one.

There have been similar arguments with the Vista EULA and virtualization, I am not trying to compare the two issues but give an example of legitimate uses of software where the EULA doesn't make things easy. Personally, if I purchased a license I would like
to use the software for legitimate purposes on the same machine, or maybe another machine. But again this is thin ice we are treading on because this argument goes both ways and I acknowledge that.

In the end there are just some rules that while important on a large scale, aren't as important under certain circumstances and I think testing for a trial period is one of those. Again this is only my opinion.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/83e79c6f79934603b6809dec009424a2#83e79c6f79934603b6809dec009424a2
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 19:17:14 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/83e79c6f79934603b6809dec009424a2#83e79c6f79934603b6809dec009424a2mig50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/mig/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

mig wrote:

﻿
In the end there are just some rules that while important on a large scale, aren't as important under certain circumstances and I think testing for a trial period is one of those. Again this is only my opinion.

Glad to hear it. But I must try that line of argument next time I'm stopped for speeding.

No-one is stopping you from picking which rules to follow, when it's convenient for you; but please, enough of the excuses.

]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/bf4dc1e26dbb4c7ab3759dec009424ce#bf4dc1e26dbb4c7ab3759dec009424ce
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 19:21:27 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/bf4dc1e26dbb4c7ab3759dec009424ce#bf4dc1e26dbb4c7ab3759dec009424ceRay650http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Ray6/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XHeh... you making a big deal about me trying OS X on my PC yet Insanely Mac -- a dedicated site and well known on the internet has over 103,000 members. You better believe Apple knows about this by now.

Anyway... I installed it but it isnt booting. Its not being seen by the MBR. I'm gonna play with it somemore but chances are I wont even get to try it; therefore you folks should just chill.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/b02c1cf4d37f428592e59dec009424f9#b02c1cf4d37f428592e59dec009424f9
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 19:39:47 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/b02c1cf4d37f428592e59dec009424f9#b02c1cf4d37f428592e59dec009424f9Xaero_Vincent50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Xaero_Vincent/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XI'm the wrong person to comment on this thread as I've done it before...

Actually using the OSX86 version is what prompted me to buy a Mac. I seem to remember someone saying "If you're going to pirate software I'd rather it be ours"...

mig wrote:﻿
In the end there are just some rules that while important on a large scale, aren't as important under certain circumstances and I think testing for a trial period is one of those. Again this is only my opinion.

Glad to hear it. But I must try that line of argument next time I'm stopped for speeding.

No-one is stopping you from picking which rules to follow, when it's convenient for you; but please, enough of the excuses.

And yet again with the ridiculous analogies, the reason for speeding laws is that you can
kill someone if you lose control of your car for going too fast. When was the last time violating a EULA put human life at risk?

﻿I'm the wrong person to comment on this thread as I've done it before...

Actually using the OSX86 version is what prompted me to buy a Mac. I seem to remember someone saying "If you're going to pirate software I'd rather it be ours"...

Oh wait, that was someone from Microsoft wasn't it?

Exactly my point, I have nothing against using something to aid in my decision making, and for a trial period. This is completely different from pirating something to make money off of, or to use indefinetly.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/21c0009c4653497bb7d59dec0094257e#21c0009c4653497bb7d59dec0094257e
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 20:13:59 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/21c0009c4653497bb7d59dec0094257e#21c0009c4653497bb7d59dec0094257emig50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/mig/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XIt didnt suck bad when I ran it, the only reason I dont run it is because my wireless devices werent supported at all. Overall good performance though.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/3de2df0b8b344558a0fe9dec009425a9#3de2df0b8b344558a0fe9dec009425a9
Tue, 17 Jul 2007 20:45:29 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/3de2df0b8b344558a0fe9dec009425a9#3de2df0b8b344558a0fe9dec009425a9rjdohnert50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/rjdohnert/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

mig wrote:

﻿

Cybermagellan wrote:﻿I'm the wrong person to comment on this thread as I've done it before...

Actually using the OSX86 version is what prompted me to buy a Mac. I seem to remember someone saying "If you're going to pirate software I'd rather it be ours"...

Oh wait, that was someone from Microsoft wasn't it?

Exactly my point, I have nothing against using something to aid in my decision making, and for a trial period. This is completely different from pirating something to make money off of, or to use indefinetly.

No it isn't, If it is something you require or need you will buy it, if not you will make do with what you have. I still have a bunch of applications I have not upgraded to the latest and greatest because what I have gets me by.

All you people trying to justify it under some other guise are nothing but flat out pirates, common thieves, usually also the same people around here who are most vocal about things on their soapbox yet when you are doing wrong as apposed to others or the host
company here, you chastise and make them out to be evil.... your morals are seriously flawed and hence any argument you make really carries no value or weight.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/b8ad9b5068694c6488989dec009425d7#b8ad9b5068694c6488989dec009425d7
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 06:48:16 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/b8ad9b5068694c6488989dec009425d7#b8ad9b5068694c6488989dec009425d7Custa120050http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Custa1200/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Custa1200 wrote:

﻿

mig wrote:﻿

Cybermagellan wrote:﻿I'm the wrong person to comment on this thread as I've done it before...

Actually using the OSX86 version is what prompted me to buy a Mac. I seem to remember someone saying "If you're going to pirate software I'd rather it be ours"...

Oh wait, that was someone from Microsoft wasn't it?

Exactly my point, I have nothing against using something to aid in my decision making, and for a trial period. This is completely different from pirating something to make money off of, or to use indefinetly.

No it isn't, If it is something you require or need you will buy it, if not you will make do with what you have. I still have a bunch of applications I have not upgraded to the latest and greatest because what I have gets me by.

All you people trying to justify it under some other guise are nothing but flat out pirates, common thieves, usually also the same people around here who are most vocal about things on their soapbox yet when you are doing wrong as apposed to others or the host
company here, you chastise and make them out to be evil.... your morals are seriously flawed and hence any argument you make really carries no value or weight.

When you go out shoping for shoes you also try on few pairs. But those shoes are $25-100 - frickin Apple Computer is at least $1000, so don't tell me I don't have some kind of right to try it first.

I know it's against license, but I'm not going to spend all that money and later find out they don't take back computers.
I think it's _morally_ ok to install os x on pc only to try it for a week to see if it suits you.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/519c9dce1a5f40e0b3219dec00942609#519c9dce1a5f40e0b3219dec00942609
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 09:56:55 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/519c9dce1a5f40e0b3219dec00942609#519c9dce1a5f40e0b3219dec00942609RoyalSchrubber50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/RoyalSchrubber/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

RoyalSchrubber wrote:

﻿When you go out shoping for shoes you also try on few pairs. But those shoes are $25-100 - frickin Apple Computer is at least $1000, so don't tell me I don't have some kind of right to try it first.

You do have that right: you can try it at the Apple store.

RoyalSchrubber wrote:

I think it's _morally_ ok to install os x on pc only to try it for a week to see if it suits you.

That's fine, but that doesn't mean that you can then -legally- 'take' that right if it isn't there.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/c882c800ac7549b8b3c69dec00942635#c882c800ac7549b8b3c69dec00942635
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:01:03 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/c882c800ac7549b8b3c69dec00942635#c882c800ac7549b8b3c69dec00942635Bas50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Bas/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Bas wrote:

﻿

RoyalSchrubber wrote:﻿When you go out shoping for shoes you also try on few pairs. But those shoes are $25-100 - frickin Apple Computer is at least $1000, so don't tell me I don't have some kind of right to try it first.

You do have that right: you can try it at the Apple store.

Lol, I can try it for 40 minutes in all that rush

Bas wrote:

﻿

RoyalSchrubber wrote:
I think it's _morally_ ok to install os x on pc only to try it for a week to see if it suits you.

That's fine, but that doesn't mean that you can then -legally- 'take' that right if it isn't there.

When you go out shoping for shoes you also try on few pairs. But those shoes are $25-100 - frickin Apple Computer is at least $1000, so don't tell me I don't have some kind of right to try it first.

Presumably you wouldn't mind if someone went joyriding in your car, just to "try it out." After all, a car is way more expensive than a computer. Or how about letting some squatters live in your house, because those things are crazy expensive to buy without
at least trying some out first....]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/96ce9555fa7f417dae219dec0094268f#96ce9555fa7f417dae219dec0094268f
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:45:53 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/96ce9555fa7f417dae219dec0094268f#96ce9555fa7f417dae219dec0094268fAndyC50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/AndyC/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

AndyC wrote:

﻿

RoyalSchrubber wrote:﻿

When you go out shoping for shoes you also try on few pairs. But those shoes are $25-100 - frickin Apple Computer is at least $1000, so don't tell me I don't have some kind of right to try it first.

Presumably you wouldn't mind if someone went joyriding in your car, just to "try it out." After all, a car is way more expensive than a computer. Or how about letting some squatters live in your house, because those things are crazy expensive to buy without
at least trying some out first....

That's not a good analogy. In your case, you're taking someone else's car. A better analogy would be making a perfect atom-for-atom copy of my car, then taking that for a joyride.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/8c4ff025b929414f86df9dec009426bd#8c4ff025b929414f86df9dec009426bd
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 11:38:01 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/8c4ff025b929414f86df9dec009426bd#8c4ff025b929414f86df9dec009426bdW3bbo50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/W3bbo/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

AndyC wrote:

﻿

RoyalSchrubber wrote:﻿

When you go out shoping for shoes you also try on few pairs. But those shoes are $25-100 - frickin Apple Computer is at least $1000, so don't tell me I don't have some kind of right to try it first.

Presumably you wouldn't mind if someone went joyriding in your car, just to "try it out." After all, a car is way more expensive than a computer. Or how about letting some squatters live in your house, because those things are crazy expensive to buy without
at least trying some out first....

I'm not selling car nor house. If that were the case of course I would let him try the car or spend few days in house if that person wanted so. Bad analogy. ]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/1c6f33ba283e482e82069dec009426ea#1c6f33ba283e482e82069dec009426ea
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 11:48:32 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/1c6f33ba283e482e82069dec009426ea#1c6f33ba283e482e82069dec009426eaRoyalSchrubber50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/RoyalSchrubber/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

RoyalSchrubber wrote:

﻿
Lol, I can try it for 40 minutes in all that rush

You can come back another day.

RoyalSchrubber wrote:

﻿

I didn't say I take it legally. I think it's legitimate but not legal.

I know, I said it. But you're suggesting that just because it's morally okay, you should legally be able to do it.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/a0be799a551341a7a1c29dec00942715#a0be799a551341a7a1c29dec00942715
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 12:19:20 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/a0be799a551341a7a1c29dec00942715#a0be799a551341a7a1c29dec00942715Bas50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Bas/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

RoyalSchrubber wrote:

﻿I think it's _morally_ ok to install os x on pc only to try it for a week to see if it suits you.

Give me a break. If you want to be a pirate and violate license agreements, that's one thing, but don't try to make yourself feel better about it by claiming that it is "morally OK."]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/fe7687dbe4334719a5d09dec00942741#fe7687dbe4334719a5d09dec00942741
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 13:40:30 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/fe7687dbe4334719a5d09dec00942741#fe7687dbe4334719a5d09dec00942741JChung200650http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/JChung2006/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

mig wrote:

﻿There are instances where a EULA is not viable under certain circumstances. I will concede that the software is not mine and as a licensee I
should only do what the EULA states, but in reality no 'real' crime is being committed, it is more of a moral issue than a criminal one.

Those instances usually involve outlandishly aggressively EULA's impinging upon or outright violating a licensee's civil rights. This instance isn't one of those cases. It is not your right to copy software illegally and use it on your machine just because
you want to "try it out."

mig wrote:

In the end there are just some rules that while important on a large scale, aren't as important under certain circumstances and I think testing for a trial period is one of those. Again this is only my opinion.

So it's OK to drink and drive until you run over that little girl on the sidewalk? Is it OK to be immoral until it becomes a criminal issue, in other words? No, it isn't.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/7f8e0f4e4bd14775a20d9dec00942770#7f8e0f4e4bd14775a20d9dec00942770
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 13:49:11 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/7f8e0f4e4bd14775a20d9dec00942770#7f8e0f4e4bd14775a20d9dec00942770JChung200650http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/JChung2006/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

JChung2006 wrote:

﻿

mig wrote:
In the end there are just some rules that while important on a large scale, aren't as important under certain circumstances and I think testing for a trial period is one of those. Again this is only my opinion.

So it's OK to drink and drive until you run over that little girl on the sidewalk with a blood-alcohol ratio over the limit? Is it OK to be immoral until it becomes a criminal issue, in other words?

Lol, what a ridiculous comparison! A violation of a EULA equated to drink and drive killings? Did you even think before you posted that? Did you even think that it was slightly out of balance to make that analogy?

RoyalSchrubber wrote:﻿
Lol, I can try it for 40 minutes in all that rush

You can come back another day.

But probably you can't/aren't allowed to test compatibility with your existing computer equipment (old digital cameras, printer, mouse) and I guess they also don't allow you to install and test tons of software that you might want to use on your mac.

Bas wrote:

﻿

RoyalSchrubber wrote:﻿

I didn't say I take it legally. I think it's legitimate but not legal.

I know, I said it. But you're suggesting that just because it's morally okay, you should legally be able to do it.

You made up that yourself. I am totally against breaking license agreement, if they had catched me they should've punished me. It's wrong to place personal morality in front of law.

It's just that most os producers don't make trial versions where you could try product yourself - so fck them, I'm going to test it myself.

Anyway chill out, it isn't big deal.

]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/84fe4c6901c840f89b0e9dec009427cd#84fe4c6901c840f89b0e9dec009427cd
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:20:24 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/84fe4c6901c840f89b0e9dec009427cd#84fe4c6901c840f89b0e9dec009427cdRoyalSchrubber50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/RoyalSchrubber/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XWhat's with all the sanctimonious attitudes guys? I'm sure none of you have never downloaded music or watched a copyrighted show on YouTube etc.

It's only when you're downloading copyrighted materials without permission from the copyrightholder that it gets illicit.

So every song you've downloaded you've purchased before right? Same for every clip on YouTube that might have later been taken down... you paid for all that?

Riiiight... there are certain things that I can agree to, but paying $1000 for a machine to try out an OS that I might not even want later on is not one of those things.

And to everyone that had to resort to analogies, you need to think things through before you post, violating a EULA most of the time is as trivial as Jaywalking, unless you are violating the EULA and making profit off it (ie. selling copies of the OS for your
own profit) in my opinion and more than likely in the opinion of the OS maker themselves, it might be wrong but companies won't waste their time suing you for it. And there are instances when you make a legitimate choice as a result of trying stuff out. This
doesn't just apply to an OS. But comparing an OS purchase to a vehicle purchase is different, one example of this is that a car doens't let you customize it the same way an OS does, so you use your car for what it's made to do, but you can use your computer
in countless other ways, there are less scenarios to test with a car, so a car you can probably test out in 20 minutes, whereas an OS you'd need at least 5-10 days to get a real assessment of whether or not it is what you need.

There is nobody here that hasn't broken a rule, and if you can honestly say that you have never broken a rule I will have to think of you as a hypocrite. That's crap, everyone breaks rules, and saying that I am choosing a rule to break is not fair means the
same for you, you shouldn't cross the street at the middle of the street see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaywalking and yet I can bet a good portion of you have done so where it is not allowed (if it applies to your country, this is only an example I am giving).

Edited: Cleared up language, made it less harsh (I didn't curse but I did make accusations without base).]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/b27c81e73ddb438ea0409dec0094287f#b27c81e73ddb438ea0409dec0094287f
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 21:14:43 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/b27c81e73ddb438ea0409dec0094287f#b27c81e73ddb438ea0409dec0094287fmig50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/mig/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XIf everyone here illegally installed OSX on their PC to 'try it out,' it would still be wrong. You can't put enough lipstick on your attempts to justify this kind of Eula-breaking to dress up the pig (so to speak). Bottom line is simple: either find a
Mac user who will let you mess with their Mac, buy a Mac and run OSX or break the Eula...but if the choice is the latter, don't try to justify that behavior...only lame maroons think they can.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/a5b89e68a7f04683aa1c9dec009428a9#a5b89e68a7f04683aa1c9dec009428a9
Wed, 18 Jul 2007 21:28:08 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/a5b89e68a7f04683aa1c9dec009428a9#a5b89e68a7f04683aa1c9dec009428a9brichpmr50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/brichpmr/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

W3bbo wrote:

﻿
That's not a good analogy. In your case, you're taking someone else's car. A better analogy would be making a perfect atom-for-atom copy of my car, then taking that for a joyride.

If everyone here illegally installed OSX on their PC to 'try it out,' it would still be wrong. You can't put enough lipstick on your attempts to justify this kind of Eula-breaking to dress up the pig (so to speak). Bottom line is simple:
either find a Mac user who will let you mess with their Mac, buy a Mac and run OSX or break the Eula...but if the choice is the latter, don't try to justify that behavior...only lame maroons think they can.

If it seems that I am trying to justify that behavior I will retract that, I know it is wrong, and yet I am still willing to do it. When/if it becomes a big enough problem that lawsuits will go out, then I might change my mind. In the meantime, it is my opinion
that it is less harmful to me to break a EULA for a few days and possibly buy a product than to buy a product and be stuck if I don't want it.

Life is not fair, life is not just, there is "software piracy" out there. If breaking a EULA makes me a pirate, then so be it. But I am not the only one out there breaking EULA, for all I know, you're breaking a EULA yourself.

But I honestly don't care, I will continue to think this way and I will live with it. It's enough for me to know that if I can use something I will buy it, if I don't then I didn't spend money on something that is useless to me.

For everyone that wants to call the police everytime a EULA is broken is welcome to it, just remember that it can come back to bite you in the ... if you yourself are breaking one of those ever-important EULA laws as well.

Edit: For the record, I am just playing devil's advocate in this particular thread, I do personally agree with my argument, but I am not even interested in OS X until they start supporting hardware that doesn't come from Apple. Apple machines and propaganda
just don't interest me.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/bb0d025be008436195b89dec00942934#bb0d025be008436195b89dec00942934
Thu, 19 Jul 2007 02:32:46 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/bb0d025be008436195b89dec00942934#bb0d025be008436195b89dec00942934mig50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/mig/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

JChung2006 wrote:

﻿

RoyalSchrubber wrote:﻿I think it's _morally_ ok to install os x on pc only to try it for a week to see if it suits you.

Give me a break. If you want to be a pirate and violate license agreements, that's one thing, but don't try to make yourself feel better about it by claiming that it is "morally OK."

Why do you think he agrees with you about morality]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/6e5bd1803158401a91009dec009429c7#6e5bd1803158401a91009dec009429c7
Fri, 20 Jul 2007 03:06:07 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/6e5bd1803158401a91009dec009429c7#6e5bd1803158401a91009dec009429c7brian.shapiro50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/brian.shapiro/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X"I used a real Macintosh (G5 workstation) in the photoshop class once but it was a very limited experience. Couldn't do any advanced things like open the console or play with settings." This is what happens when someone does not bother to try to use something
correctly. You wanted to do advanced things, nothing prevent you to do that on OS X, this is a Unix operating system, so just go and open the terminal application and you've got a console right in the Unix world that allows you to do whatever settings you
want. Not only can use all the glory of Unix console (windows console is a joke in comparison) but moreover you can activate hidden OS X features as you wish. Next time please check before trolling. Also for the person who got OS X to install on a regular
pc, be aware that doing so is not supported and don't expect that everything will work correctly or as on a mac. Don't come here later to say us that this or that does not work, if you try to use the full glory of OS X, try it on a mac, this OS is built with
hardware integration in mind.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/e36fcd13823a42a584909dec00942a0e#e36fcd13823a42a584909dec00942a0e
Fri, 20 Jul 2007 03:57:50 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/e36fcd13823a42a584909dec00942a0e#e36fcd13823a42a584909dec00942a0eHakime50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Hakime/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Hakime wrote:

Not only can use all the glory of Unix console (windows console is a joke in comparison)..

Yeah because that is going to be on every Windows box I go to use ]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/2ee96993536e4deeb5af9dec00942a65#2ee96993536e4deeb5af9dec00942a65
Fri, 20 Jul 2007 09:07:38 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/2ee96993536e4deeb5af9dec00942a65#2ee96993536e4deeb5af9dec00942a65Rossj50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Rossj/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Hakime wrote:

You wanted to do advanced things, nothing prevent you to do that on OS X, this is a Unix operating system, so just go and open the terminal application and you've got a console right in the Unix world that allows you to do whatever settings
you want.

You can install it on XP, 2003 and Vista, there are rumors that it will be in SP1 for Vista and it will be intalled by default in 2008 ]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/005e96c360e244b1bb669dec00942abd#005e96c360e244b1bb669dec00942abd
Fri, 20 Jul 2007 09:33:25 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/005e96c360e244b1bb669dec00942abd#005e96c360e244b1bb669dec00942abdRoyalSchrubber50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/RoyalSchrubber/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

Rossj wrote:

﻿

RoyalSchrubber wrote:﻿

Hakime wrote:Not only can use all the glory of Unix console (windows console is a joke in comparison)..

OS X won't be either. ]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/e5dcc307b53c420287699dec00942ae9#e5dcc307b53c420287699dec00942ae9
Fri, 20 Jul 2007 12:15:02 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/e5dcc307b53c420287699dec00942ae9#e5dcc307b53c420287699dec00942ae9andokai50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/andokai/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS XWell here's the real scoop, if you want to try out a Mac then visit an Apple Store (not one of those Apple Authorized dealers). There should be an iMac that is bootable in OS X or Windows. The same Mac has Paralles installed on the Mac side as well, just
ask a salesperson which floor computer is set up this way. Also ask if there are any refreshed Macs available to purchase, buy one and you will have 2 weeks to play with anything you want, if you decide to return it there is NO 10% restocking fee like you
pay for the return of sealed box (by the way you will save at least 10% off the retail cost on refreshed items and they have the same warranty as sealed box). Even the Genius Bar will help you install Xcode if you make an appointment (no charge for their services
at any time). iXCode is included on the System Disks but is never pre-installed. As for your 40 minute comment, you can stay all day in any Apple Store f you want, the sales people will greet you then leave you to explore on your own if you wish to. Try sitting
in on
some of the free Workshops if you want to know why Apple people love our Macs.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/5cafb61638cf48648be69dec00942b31#5cafb61638cf48648be69dec00942b31
Tue, 24 Jul 2007 01:40:22 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/5cafb61638cf48648be69dec00942b31#5cafb61638cf48648be69dec00942b31MeeB50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/MeeB/Discussions/RSSCoffeehouse - Got OS X

MeeB wrote:

﻿

Well here's the real scoop, if you want to try out a Mac then visit an Apple Store (not one of those Apple Authorized dealers). There should be an iMac that is bootable in OS X or Windows. The same Mac has Paralles installed on the Mac side as well, just
ask a salesperson which floor computer is set up this way. Also ask if there are any refreshed Macs available to purchase, buy one and you will have 2 weeks to play with anything you want, if you decide to return it there is NO 10% restocking fee like you
pay for the return of sealed box (by the way you will save at least 10% off the retail cost on refreshed items and they have the same warranty as sealed box). Even the Genius Bar will help you install Xcode if you make an appointment (no charge for their services
at any time). iXCode is included on the System Disks but is never pre-installed. As for your 40 minute comment, you can stay all day in any Apple Store f you want, the sales people will greet you then leave you to explore on your own if you wish to. Try sitting
in on
some of the free Workshops if you want to know why Apple people love our Macs.

Hi there.

There isn't an Apple store where I live and only a couple Apple Authorized retailers. You'll get about 15 minutes on the systems before they ask if they can assist you.

Anyway... I tried OS X and uninstalled it a couple days ago. It was an interesting experience (very polished) but in the end, falls short of any other advantages over GNU/Linux or Windows.]]>http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/7c0193d6db154e4fa4799dec00942b61#7c0193d6db154e4fa4799dec00942b61
Tue, 24 Jul 2007 02:05:08 GMThttp://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/256306-Got-OS-X/7c0193d6db154e4fa4799dec00942b61#7c0193d6db154e4fa4799dec00942b61Xaero_Vincent50http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/Xaero_Vincent/Discussions/RSS