Scouting Reports: Coming Soon!!!

Hi all,

I know I have not been around much at the beginning of the season and while I have not posted much here, I have been watching a lot of football (perks to having a new baby). I have a ton of notes on lots of players and will start to get my thoughts “on paper” and to you guys very soon. I am hoping to have one done by the end of this week, so look for that. Thanks for checking in on the site and I look forward to interacting with all of you very soon.

I don’t see Cyrus Jones being a Patriot much longer, fumbles, bad judgement on kick returns, now throwing a punch, and getting tossed. Not a BB type guy?
I look to see more of Jonathan Jones at CB.
With OG Cooper gone, OG Jackson’s knee issues, and Vollmer likely retiring, More O-line help in the draft looks like a sure thing!!
QB Mike Glenonn, and Jimmy G look to be the best options for QB needed teams. Glenonn has some starting experience but will cost more money, then Jimmy G.

I agree with Edge, though I wouldn’t mind if they took him off kick returns for the time being at least. With Amendola’s reduced role on offense, why not put him back there? Foster might be another good option as guy who they seem to like and want to get involved and who has some elusiveness.

Agree Cyrus Jones has started out with a rough streak likely immaturity but that’s correctable I think. Up to him how he handles himself rest of year. If he gets his emotions under control and doesn’t screw up Bill likely gives him at least another year he was a high draft pick after all and flashed some talent. If he can’t then agree his future here is bleak.

I just realized that the Pats have given up the fewest points in the AFC, with only the Vikings, Seahawks, and Eagles giving up fewer points (and the Seahawks and Eagles have played 1 fewer game). The Dolphins game was probably the most disappointing defensively, but even good defenses can take their foots off the gas at times with a big lead at half. I was thinking that the Pats D had been average so far, but scoringwise they have been elite.

That’s all true Jeff but I’m still concerned for lack of contestant pass rush. Question is, is it due to game planning or lack of ability? If the latter I fear our DB’s can’t hold up against the better offensive teams moving forward. Saw how Cleveland with a 5th QB still moved the ball on us with it’s better WR’s. It was the rest of their team that lost the game for them.

Against the Browns, they were really focused on the run, often with 3 DT and not as much effort at edge rushing. My hope is that with Nink, Sheard, Long and Flowers they get respectable rotation for DE to keep them effective all season long, and they’ve got some pretty good pass rushing LB (Collins, Hightower, McClellin, and maybe at some point Mingo).

Wow, your not kidding and we have a developing project, Derby, studying under the masters. Bill should extend Bennett for two more years after all Gronk misses some games every year. Give Derby a chance to grow into the position while being part of some sub packages.
If everyone stays healthy I can see 15-1 a realistic possibility.

Pats have to come up with a spot for Nink, too. They got an exemption for the roster spot for a few days after the suspension ended, but that likely won’t last very long.

If the Pats put Bolden on IR, they’re short a heavy RB. Bishop Sankey on the practice squad weighs about 209, which isn’t really a thumper. Also it’s not clear he’s been inthe program long enough to make a jump above where he was performing when the Titans set him free.

Word is the Pats only have 2 healthy DT this week. Ted Karras’ name was floated as an emergency DT (6’4″ 300#). Greg Scruggs (6’3″ 270) used to be a DE. I’d look for the Pats to use DE as interior linemen.

I don’t know who the bubble guy is that lets Nink back on the field, but seeing as this next game is vs Cleveland, maybe it just becomes an offensive shootout and a lot of 2nd string players get reps.

It could be Russell is right and Johnson comes off the P-sqd and Bolden goes on IR. That makes that a wash but means space has to be made for Brady and Nink. Honestly I’m loosing track of it all. Have to clear some time to look at it.

Haha, you’re right about that Steve! Odd to see them hold onto Cooper until he was healthy only to release him then. And Roberts had himself a nice little game. Not sure that makes him safe, especially considering the opponent, but if he can do that consistently, he could be a solid depth option at linebacker.

Guys come on, Jimmy G only played six quarters is it reasonable to expect an NFL team, any NFL team to give a high round draft pick for him based on that? Best thing to do imp is for Bill to extend his contract ( TB coming up on 40 to soon) Even if he plays out his last year and signs elsewhere we stand to get a 3rd comp higher then likely if Bill trades him before the next draft.

A 3rd year QB who’s been able to learn from behind the best QB this generation, the coaching staff he’s played with and learned from, plus having a 4th year still left on his rookie contract at a cheap price – and most importantly – showing competency at the position he plays?

Hopefully your right EdgeX but me, I’m a skeptic that things will go smoothly and the way we hope. But if someone would give us a high or mid first or a couple 2nds I’m like you half of me says great! The other half says extend him, Great! Either way it could be good or bad and will be. I’m just planning on enjoying the rest of the season and when I send in a mock it will be two parts. One with a trade and one without. Still not holding my breath though.

I mean, Cassel and Hoyer met those guidelines, and neither of them netted a first and then some. Both are backup-level players as well. While I think Garoppolo is better, you have to admit that there is nowhere near enough evidence of that at the NFL level. If we trade him,
we’ll get a 2nd or 3rd, so unless Brady retires or Brisset falls off the map we should trade him, despite what might’ve been if he hadn’t been injured.

I see it as pretty hard to resign Jimmy G to sit behind Tom 2-3 more years. I’m not thinking a 1st round pick for him however. Makes more sense for the Roster to get a 2nd round pick in 2017 and another pick in 2018. (2nd?)
develop Brissett to back-up Tom , and maybe add a 3d QB at a low cost, or P-Squad guy.
Letting Jimmy G get away for a 3d round compensatory pick, would be a bad deal.
Next year QB Mike Glennon (Tampa) will be a free agent and get big money some where. (Jets ?? )
Jimmy G’s market value should be very high, with one more cheap year on his deal, which a team can extend if he plays well for them, before his contract is done.
Chicago makes the most sense. Cleveland will draft another guy behind RG III, and Kessler. A bunch of teams need a young back up, Saints, Lions, Colts, Houston, Washington, etc. but hard to see Jimmy G going as a back-up anywhere.

I agree it could be hard to extend Jimmy G unless TB starts to show signs of decline as year goes by. No signs of that right now but anything can happen. Still as things stand today I agree with you that if JG’s value is good after the season both Chicago and the Browns look to be leading trade prospects. I do think a couple unexpected teams might join the hunt too. Who knows? Also why is it a given That Cleve drafts a QB if they could get Jimmy G with say their lower 1st? Have they no other needs, is their no other prospects they find attractive? I could see all kinds of scenarios open to them with all their picks. Nothing is a given but perhaps I’m over thinking it, who knows?

1. OT
2. TE – this depends on what they do with Bennett – if they sign him then I’d drop this down to #4
3. RB
4. DT
5. CB/WR – I’m split on these two positions depends on talent available when they pick.

As per my post above I’m doubtful Bill will manage a trade for a 1st or 2nd for JG but if he does your list of trade partners seems good to me. I hadn’t considered Arz but your right if Palmer doesn’t catch fire pretty soon they could be near the top of the bidding list. They have lots of talent so can be expected to finish above 500 but that would be a big drop in expectation. Palmer could face a duel for starter.

Well that depends on how the other teams feel about next years QB class.

The Browns obviously can’t gauge draftable talent based on how their 6 x 1st round picks have panned out since 2011 (news flash none are on the team anymore) and it also seems they whiffed on Carson Wentz…so if Bill can put the bug in their ear maybe we end up getting lucky. They obviously have the draft picks to make a move like this.

Maybe the Redskins or the Cards really want a contender NOW instead of waiting for a rookie to develop. Desperation is a stinky cologne. I guess we will have to wait and see but it makes me wonder…

I’m not sure what conclusions we’re supposed to draw from this Russell. Are you thinking he could be added to our P-sqd or may be picked up by a QB needy team reducing that teams imperative to look at Jimmy? Have to admit he’s just another young back-up in my mind, am I wrong?

Mock Scenario: Pats trade Jimmy G for Chicago’s first round pick (let’s say 10th), trade back 10 spots or so to pick up additional 2nd, 5th, and 7th round picks. They also get a 6th round compensatory selection for Hicks. Big money goes to Collins, Hightower, Sheard, and Butler, while Vollmer, Blount, and Mingo all sign on for one more year, Develin takes a modest contract, and Bill’s annual aging veteran who wants a shot at a ring comes at the DT position to replace the departed Branch. Bill plans to deploy Rowe to fill the #2 CB role of the departed and very rich Logan Ryan.

1st (from JG): WR Smith-Schuster – Belichick shocks the world and actually uses a high pick to bring in a wide receiver to replace Amendola who is dropped for cap space and to bring in high-end WR talent in case Edelman cannot be retained.
1st (own): TE Bucky Hodges – The defense gets paid, but Bennett departs in free agency, leaving a hole at the 2nd tight end position, one we’ve seen year after year that Belichick really values. While Gronk, Edelman, Hogan, Mitchell, and Lewis would project as the starting skill position players, Smith-Schuster and Hodges will have some time to get acclimated before contributing late in the season and seizing starting roles by their sophomore campaigns.
2nd (from JG): OT/G Bisnowaty – Bisnowaty seems to have a chance to stick at right tackle, but would project as a definite upgrade at right guard if tackle doesn’t work out.
2nd (own): DT Caleb Brantley – Bill gets some beef to work with Brown, Valentine, and the free agent brought in on a 1-2 year deal.
3rd (own): OT Avery Gennesy – Another tackle prospect to push for the right tackle position or serve as a swing backup.
4th (SEA): DE Daeshon Hall – Bill continues to add guys for the trenches throughout the middle rounds with a defensive end who can provide depth while getting a year to develop.
5th (from JG): DT Derrick Nnadi – Bill feels so guilty about taking a skill position with his first pick that he can’t help but grab more 300+ pound guys. A run-stuffing depth option, Nnadi can develop for a year or fill in as a run-stuffer in the event of injury.
6th (own): QB Davis Webb – Webb becomes a training camp arm and practice squad candidate. If he really flashes, the Pats are happy to keep a 3rd QB.
6th (compensatory – Hicks): RB De’Veon Smith – A bruiser to compete for the early down/goal-line back role and diversify the RB corps with some size.
7th (from JG): CB Duke Dawson: Slot CB prospect, Bill tries to work his magic once more given his recent successes with finding talent at the CB position.

In the end, the Pats fortify their DT position, strengthen the O-Line, and replace Bennett and Amendola, successfully extending Brady’s championship window.

Very well done/thought out draft projection. 1st round draft picks “cost” a lot not sure BB likes them unless strong player is taken. The 10th pick you use will cost, 4 yrs. $15.2 mil., the other 1st 32nd, will cost 4 yrs. $ 8.3 mil.
Total two picks cost- $23.5 mil.
I’m projecting a trade of Jimmy G may be for an early/mid. 2nd, this year, AND a 2nd next year, cost aprox. 4 yrs. $ 6.3 to 5.3 Mil. each year.
Total two picks cost- $ 12.6 to $10.3 mil.
right now I see Two players BB MAY be interested in the 1st round,… Jonathan Allen DE and Evan Engram TE/SLOT/WR.

Understand the point on the cost of picks, but value involves both the quality of the player as well as what they cost. Historically, 1st round picks have been able to get playing time early in their first year, becoming starters or significant contributors by the end of year 1, then starting after that. 2nd round picks often have pretty low impact for the first year of their contract before starting to come on in year 2, so you have to consider that 1st rounders are usually able to contribute something more quickly. Additionally, athletic freaks that can play are more easily found in the first round, and these guys can have higher impact snaps. For example, Duron Harmon is a solid contributor who helps on defense, but Devin McCourty is more of an impact player. Even if they both had the same number of snaps, McCourty would make the bigger impact, and more talent is available at that stage of the draft. Even first round contracts for high impact players are excellent values, since the market price for these guys often gets out of control. If you want an elite player, you have to groom them from the inside or pay Olivier Vernon/Suh/etc. type of money, and the players that teams allow to reach free agency are often questionable team fits. You can tell Bill values these guys based on the trade-ups for Hightower and Jones – these guys had unusual athletic traits and he pounced.

My only real point of difference is that the Pats need a franchise tackle. They’re better bets in round 1 than receivers. Last year there were maybe 3 or 4 in the whole draft and they want early. Maybe the Pats trade back as far as 15…but maybe not even that.

Thanks GM. It’s a fair point on how high good OTs usually go. We’ll see where the projections are for some of these guys closer to the draft, but I guess I just wonder how highly Bill values the right tackle position (assuming Solder is plan A for left tackle for the forseeable future). Is it worth a first round pick for him? Of course, he’s never drafted a right tackle or a WR yet in the first round, so it’s hard to predict!

Caleb Brantley? mmhh… Im aware that i m generalizing a bit here, but what makes me thinking it twice, is the fact that besides of him being a Florida DT, he´s a 3 tech DT projection…are pats running 3 tech again???

I really love what the guy could bring on to the table, as he´s a bigger version of Easley (in a sense of being such a disruptive DL)+tough run stopper at 315 pounds, but have hard time seeing Bill picking on him, not only because of scheme but because of the recent Easley experience

Fair enough, DTs have to be able to fit the techniques the Pats teach. Lotuleilei is another interesting guy that may wind up as a fist rounder. I’m looking forward to seeing which DTs distinguish themselves over the college season.

If I may put in my 2 cents, a DT that may be of interest is Mantavious Adams of Auburn. More a mid rd (3rd?) but good measurable s 6-4 305 and can rush the passer it’s said from inside. Someone to watch?

I like to see Patriots staying aggresive with signings but would like to see them using
more players in game action.

Great Job by Devin McCourty,Shea McLellan,Devon Harmon and Geneo Grissom coming to
Brockton to build a playground.

I hope Gronk is healing well my favorite Gronk story was on the news one night a few months after his back surgery he was at summer football camp for kids he was showing them how to dive for a loose
ball he goes sprinting then dives head first on ball well the kids faces were in shock I was in
shock to that he would have no fear of hitting the ground that hard after surgery. He said this
is how you go for a loose ball.

Reading all the posts about next years cap hits on def side makes me ask what’s gone wrong with our expected “great” def? Just doesn’t seem to be able to generate a pass rush or get the other offense of the field. So what gives?

Glad your back Mike, looking forward to your next review. Also a question: Your previous review on O-Linemen stopped accepting posts or comments last week after Russell’s post on 9-28. Is this a problem at your end or on my PC?

Thanks guys,
For me, my main focus will be RB, OT, and DT as well. Corner is always a position I like to look at and feel it is a need every year. I will also be looking at TE. It seems BB and the Patriots have really put a focus on that position again this year and while Bennett has been great so far, he is here on a 1 year deal.

Thanks Mike look forward to your reports! I’ve been studying a number of college players, along with the Patriots needs/contracts.
With Tom coming back, continued Oline future development will be part of coming draft choices, as well as the DT position.
Patriot contracts will be huge next year as well. It is hard to see Marcus Cannon $4.5 mil. getting a deal at that price, with the Patriots or as a free agent. Vollmer likely retires next year freeing up money. It’s hard to see DE Sheard getting a new deal with the Patriots, when he looks at free agent money. (more money saved). Chris Long likely gets a good offer from the Patriots.
Branch at DT is playing well, but getting older, and should get a good free agent offer, some were.
So DT and OT look big going into the 2017 draft, as affordable young talent will be needed.

Well it seems like there are few if any we caqn resign on the def front 7 by your posts. Actually I don’t see it as that dark an outlook. Given as a whole I think some high salary players will be gone. For instance there is a good chance Vullmer retires, Cannon probably will be gone, and possably Amendola on offense. With Hightower’s injury history I don’t see a big contract in his future and as you noted Branch also my retire. In that scenaro there is room to resign Collins ( not breaking the bank though) Sheard, Butler and even Hightower if reasonable. Plus Bill always manages to restructure one or two guys so if you throw in the tags possable alot can be done.

We should be expecting a couple more transaction wire announcements tomorrow.

Recently, the Pats waived Harbour, added 6’3″ 270 TE Scruggs (a DE conversion during the off season), and now need to make room for TB12 and ostensibly Nink (I don’t know if they can stall bringing back in Nink with the suspension over).

Why did they need a bigger TE? Waiving Harbour might net them a compensatory pick next year, and he wasn’t playing much. Scruggs was signed after week 1, so his salary is not guaranteed. He seems like more of an athlete than a TE.

Bolden looks like he’s laid up for weeks or months. That might factor in. They’ve got an abundance of special teamers with Slater, Ebner, King, Richards, J. Jones, Mingo, and such. They don’t have an abundance of RB, though.

Appreciate your insights GM and agree RB is looking kind of thin at the moment and looking at FA possibility no one excites me. I think it’s at least a couple more weeks before Lewis comes back so any ideas how Bill handles it?