One thing that is not yet mentioned by the show (and who knows if they will mention it), is that Roose's only trueborn son Domeric has died 2 years before War of 5 Kings, and Roose highly suspects that he was poisoned by Ramsay.

VDesai wrote:One thing that is not yet mentioned by the show (and who knows if they will mention it), is that Roose's only trueborn son Domeric has died 2 years before War of 5 Kings, and Roose highly suspects that he was poisoned by Ramsay.

Yes, that along with the circumstances leading to Ramsey's conception and the Reek persona are things that would shine a clearer light on House Bolton's motivations.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right.
- The Tick

VDesai wrote:One thing that is not yet mentioned by the show (and who knows if they will mention it), is that Roose's only trueborn son Domeric has died 2 years before War of 5 Kings, and Roose highly suspects that he was poisoned by Ramsay.

Yes, that along with the circumstances leading to Ramsey's conception and the Reek persona are things that would shine a clearer light on House Bolton's motivations.

That happen after Moat Cailin was taken so the show could do it the season finally or next season. It is hard to say since the show is mingling 3 of the books together and then some of their own writings to.

mattshaw78 wrote:They really didn't tell how the giant who lift up the gates died. We know how the boneheads died from a full running impact to the gates by the giant.

All of them didn't die, maybe none from the impact, and those that lived fought to the death. So they killed each other. In the book another character(Donal Noye[the Smith]) killed the Giant while the Giant killed him.

For none book readers: DO you fill the show did a good job with the wall storyline. DId you feel familiar with the characters?

For book readers: Did you mind that Pyp and Grenn died and what do you think of the changes?

mattshaw78 wrote:They really didn't tell how the giant who lift up the gates died. We know how the boneheads died from a full running impact to the gates by the giant.

All of them didn't die, maybe none from the impact, and those that lived fought to the death. So they killed each other. In the book another character(Donal Noye[the Smith]) killed the Giant while the Giant killed him.

For none book readers: DO you fill the show did a good job with the wall storyline. DId you feel familiar with the characters?

For book readers: Did you mind that Pyp and Grenn died and what do you think of the changes?

To be honest, I think that the battle was a bit underwhelming, especially since a tone was already set at Blackwater in season 2. For half the battle, I couldn't even see what was going on. And I suppose I was expecting an attack that would've been a little more coordinated and far more extravagant. All we've been hearing about is how menacing Mance Rayder's army was so I was expecting something more impressive. Lucky for the Night's Watch because it seemed like 80% of the men there were either killed or wounded. I was genuinely surprised to see how unprepared and how easily outclassed they were.

I understand that. In the book it was done better,imo. I guess the show Mance was hanging on the number jon gave him so he holds back his whole force. The initial attack is to make a play on the gates from both sides. Also, the Night watch is field with a bunch men that are not familiar with how to fight so of course they will be disjointed. To add on to that the Old Bear is no longer commander and Thorne does not take the attack that serious. SO it kind of makes sense for the battle to not be some excellent tactical maneuver.

mattshaw78 wrote:They really didn't tell how the giant who lift up the gates died. We know how the boneheads died from a full running impact to the gates by the giant.

All of them didn't die, maybe none from the impact, and those that lived fought to the death. So they killed each other. In the book another character(Donal Noye[the Smith]) killed the Giant while the Giant killed him.

For none book readers: DO you fill the show did a good job with the wall storyline. DId you feel familiar with the characters?

For book readers: Did you mind that Pyp and Grenn died and what do you think of the changes?

I think Pyp and Grenn's death worked fine here, especially when you consider Jon's circumstances later in the series. D&D felt the episode wouldn't have had the same impact if a few known characters didn't die in battle. I was looking forward to seeing Noye's battle against the giant, but what are you going to do. It wasn't realistic scene and probably wouldn't have shot well anyway.That one continuous shot that ended with Sam freeing ghost was awesome.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right.
- The Tick

mattshaw78 wrote:They really didn't ll how the giant who lift up the gates died. We know how the boneheads died from a full running impact to the gates by the giant.

All of them didn't die, maybe none from the impact, and those that lived fought to the death. So they killed each other. In the book another character(Donal Noye[the Smith]) killed the Giant while the Giant killed him.

For none book readers: DO you fill the show did a good job with the wall storyline. DId you feel familiar with the characters?

For book readers: Did you mind that Pyp and Grenn died and what do you think of the changes?

I think Pyp and Grenn's death worked fine here, especially when you consider Jon's circumstances later in the series. D&D felt the episode wouldn't have had the same impact if a few known characters didn't die in battle. I was looking forward to seeing Noye's battle against the giant, but what are you going to do. It wasn't realistic scene and probably wouldn't have shot well anyway.That one continuous shot that ended with Sam freeing ghost was awesome.

Yeah the Ghost scene was awesome. At first I was like where is he going then I screamed Ghost! Lol. I just wanted to see him attacking more thenns but cgi costs so I get it.

yellowboy90 wrote:I understand that. In the book it was done better,imo. I guess the show Mance was hanging on the number jon gave him so he holds back his whole force. The initial attack is to make a play on the gates from both sides. Also, the Night watch is field with a bunch men that are not familiar with how to fight so of course they will be disjointed. To add on to that the Old Bear is no longer commander and Thorne does not take the attack that serious. SO it kind of makes sense for the battle to not be some excellent tactical maneuver.

I think it was a brilliant move on Mance's part to only attack Castle Black with a fraction of his forces. He lost the battle but put himself in a position to win the war by seeing how his enemy reacts. But even so, the execution of this by the writer's was less than par IMO. Considering how much dead weight was involved in this episode, I kinda wished that they focused on other, competing stories as well. I wanted to see what was going to happen to Tyrion.

And I'm not sure why the Night's Watch wouldn't know how to fight. They seemed to do a fair amount of training, which is all they could really do considering their circumstances. I know that Thorne is a terrible leader but I wasn't expecting the Castle to be breached so easily.

P.S., why the hell is Rayder attacking Castle Black again? I feel that it was so long ago since he described his motives.

yellowboy90 wrote:I understand that. In the book it was done better,imo. I guess the show Mance was hanging on the number jon gave him so he holds back his whole force. The initial attack is to make a play on the gates from both sides. Also, the Night watch is field with a bunch men that are not familiar with how to fight so of course they will be disjointed. To add on to that the Old Bear is no longer commander and Thorne does not take the attack that serious. SO it kind of makes sense for the battle to not be some excellent tactical maneuver.

I think it was a brilliant move on Mance's part to only attack Castle Black with a fraction of his forces. He lost the battle but put himself in a position to win the war by seeing how his enemy reacts. But even so, the execution of this by the writer's was less than par IMO. Considering how much dead weight was involved in this episode, I kinda wished that they focused on other, competing stories as well. I wanted to see what was going to happen to Tyrion.

And I'm not sure why the Night's Watch wouldn't know how to fight. They seemed to do a fair amount of training, which is all they could really do considering their circumstances. I know that Thorne is a terrible leader but I wasn't expecting the Castle to be breached so easily.

The majority of their fighters died during the last great range. What's left are bunch builders, cooks, new recruits etc. These are guys that Commander Mormont didn't seem fit to take with him, so I'm not surprised they can't fight that well. This is the first time many of them have experienced a live battle.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right.
- The Tick

yellowboy90 wrote:I understand that. In the book it was done better,imo. I guess the show Mance was hanging on the number jon gave him so he holds back his whole force. The initial attack is to make a play on the gates from both sides. Also, the Night watch is field with a bunch men that are not familiar with how to fight so of course they will be disjointed. To add on to that the Old Bear is no longer commander and Thorne does not take the attack that serious. SO it kind of makes sense for the battle to not be some excellent tactical maneuver.

I think it was a brilliant move on Mance's part to only attack Castle Black with a fraction of his forces. He lost the battle but put himself in a position to win the war by seeing how his enemy reacts. But even so, the execution of this by the writer's was less than par IMO. Considering how much dead weight was involved in this episode, I kinda wished that they focused on other, competing stories as well. I wanted to see what was going to happen to Tyrion.

And I'm not sure why the Night's Watch wouldn't know how to fight. They seemed to do a fair amount of training, which is all they could really do considering their circumstances. I know that Thorne is a terrible leader but I wasn't expecting the Castle to be breached so easily.

The majority of their fighters died during the last great range. What's left are bunch builders, cooks, new recruits etc. These are guys that Commander Mormont didn't seem fit to take with him, so I'm not surprised they can't fight that well. This is the first time many of them have experienced a live battle.

Great point! I totally forgot about the heavy casualties that the Night's Watch had endured throughout the series......they are totally ****ed, lol. Seems like they could've used Tyrion after all, lol.

NardDogNation wrote:Anyone else sad to see Rose go? I love Ginger's so I hated to see her character killed off.

Naw, I don't even think she's the hottest redhead on the show. I was sad to see Ros go tho ...and then Sophie turner turned 18

LMAO! Yet another good point. I didn't realize it at first but I am more attracted to Ginger-Stark. The actress who plays Rose is prettier in real life, all dolled up but Sophie is pretty attractive herself and is even a bit sturdy. I like that quality in a woman, lol.