In life, if I'm PAYING "X" dollars for something, I generally expect a product that is somewhat commensurate with that expense. If a person doesn't get the product they are paying for, some bitching will ensue. To themselves, to their spouse, to others, on a message board, on Yelp, whatever. Different people address it in different ways.

The problem with DG, though, is that the person providing the product (i.e., the person running the tournament), presumably isn't making any money off of it. This is what the consumer (i.e., the person playing in the tournament) needs to remember when formulating their evaluation.

If the person running the tournament *is* making money, then I would have far fewer problems with people bitching about any shortcomings. And any rebukes in the form of "if you don't like it run one yourself" really ring hollow.

Of course in either case, the consumer (player) is free to simply not pay the entry and not attend the event.

p.s. All this rambling is really just me being bored and trying to back-door a discussion about how the world would be better if the tournament scene were commercialized instead of the current standard. Which of course can't happen without major changes to the organizing body's guidelines/standards for tournament fees and payout.

AO wrote:run a tournament...or be quiet! this is something I am guilty and aware of and am working on, good point

Over the last two years I've heard multiple whiners whining. Show up..play golf..except and enjoy the tournament no matter what level it is. Running a tournament is tough and I personally don't think it's that much fun.

I'm glad you brought this up. I've made a lot of posts in my head regarding this subject. I'm really grateful for all the man hours that have been volunteered by the same group of people year in and year out. It takes a ton of time and is always a thankless job. When it goes well it can be rewarding, but when the bitching starts it really makes you wonder why you put yourself in that position.

Most complaining stems from unrealistic expectations. There are a lot of tournaments that could be a lot bigger and better, but they require a good volunteer base that's willing to follow good leadership and that's an incredibly hard combination to come together in the volunteer world. I agree with AO, put up or shut up. I haven't seen Travis Tramyle spend one hour showing up to a meeting or offer anything productive or useful to the DM disc golf club, yet he feels like he's owed something other than the handful of courses that he continually plays for free.

Went to Michigan for the first time and this was my perception. Tourney was run smoothly, beer and food in Michigan is amazing and I was home at 8:15pm with a 7 hour drive. Two courses were pretty spectacular. The third course had holes in which frisbees don't fly at all...ever.

Heard and saw some interesting stuff over the weekend. A golfer gets caught 2 to 3 times pencil whipping..it's addressed and reported....no DQ.

Guys talking about Bennett shoving a TD last year and also chasing someone in a car. Also heard he threatened a spotter earlier in the year.

Travis Henry is gone for being a huge tool and also selling drugs to a teenager. Man, I don't miss that guy. Golfing him with him one time was good enough to put him on a Rob Sandrick level.

Michigan still loves their olive tree bush things in the middle of fairways which F you on a regular basis. See Champ Blacks at Hudson Mills.

AO wrote:Went to Michigan for the first time and this was my perception. Tourney was run smoothly, beer and food in Michigan is amazing and I was home at 8:15pm with a 7 hour drive. Two courses were pretty spectacular. The third course had holes in which frisbees don't fly at all...ever.

Heard and saw some interesting stuff over the weekend. A golfer gets caught 2 to 3 times pencil whipping..it's addressed and reported....no DQ.

Guys talking about Bennett shoving a TD last year and also chasing someone in a car. Also heard he threatened a spotter earlier in the year.

Travis Henry is gone for being a huge tool and also selling drugs to a teenager. Man, I don't miss that guy. Golfing him with him one time was good enough to put him on a Rob Sandrick level.

Michigan still loves their olive tree bush things in the middle of fairways which F you on a regular basis. See Champ Blacks at Hudson Mills.

Now on to Cedar Creek to watch Cale win by 7+.

Love this post. Always wondered what happened to Bennett, Sandrick, and Henry. We need to start a dg gossip thread lol

AO wrote:Went to Michigan for the first time and this was my perception. Tourney was run smoothly, beer and food in Michigan is amazing and I was home at 8:15pm with a 7 hour drive. Two courses were pretty spectacular. The third course had holes in which frisbees don't fly at all...ever.

Heard and saw some interesting stuff over the weekend. A golfer gets caught 2 to 3 times pencil whipping..it's addressed and reported....no DQ.

Guys talking about Bennett shoving a TD last year and also chasing someone in a car. Also heard he threatened a spotter earlier in the year.

Travis Henry is gone for being a huge tool and also selling drugs to a teenager. Man, I don't miss that guy. Golfing him with him one time was good enough to put him on a Rob Sandrick level.

Michigan still loves their olive tree bush things in the middle of fairways which F you on a regular basis. See Champ Blacks at Hudson Mills.

Now on to Cedar Creek to watch Cale win by 7+.

Love this post. Always wondered what happened to Bennett, Sandrick, and Henry. We need to start a dg gossip thread lol

LOL...also was asked by several golfers if I've ever played Toboggan and how awesome it is? UMMM yep

Over the last two years I've heard multiple whiners whining. Show up..play golf..except and enjoy the tournament no matter what level it is. Running a tournament is tough and I personally don't think it's that much fun.

Thinking about running my first tournament this year. Excited and nervous about it. Not looking forward to the criticism but whatever.

My thinking is: You did a great job of being the presenting sponsor for the Rumble. Your graphic design on the player booklets was over the moon. Chase does such a good job running tourneys in this area. Why mess with that formula? I think it's harder than it looks.

tufluk wrote:My thinking is: You did a great job of being the presenting sponsor for the Rumble. Your graphic design on the player booklets was over the moon. Chase does such a good job running tourneys in this area. Why mess with that formula? I think it's harder than it looks.

Other than the fact that we have a ton of events to choose from, I would not discourage someone who wants to "Run" an event. Along with what the other guy said, Chase does a great job with his events, so my recommendation would be to help him or run a pool to get a feel for it. If it weren't for the assistance of some experienced TD's playing in my first event, it could have been a disaster and probably would not have become what it is today. I think you biggest challenge will be finding a good date to do it. Good luck either way man.

tufluk wrote:My thinking is: You did a great job of being the presenting sponsor for the Rumble. Your graphic design on the player booklets was over the moon. Chase does such a good job running tourneys in this area. Why mess with that formula? I think it's harder than it looks.

Other than the fact that we have a ton of events to choose from, I would not discourage someone who wants to "Run" an event. Along with what the other guy said, Chase does a great job with his events, so my recommendation would be to help him or run a pool to get a feel for it. If it weren't for the assistance of some experienced TD's playing in my first event, it could have been a disaster and probably would not have become what it is today. I think you biggest challenge will be finding a good date to do it. Good luck either way man.

Gene, I would love to sponsor the Rumble every year but unfortunately I don't have that kind of cash. I still plan on being involved with the players book and several other things for the Rumble.

I understand there is already a ton of tournaments in Iowa and Iron Lion already does a great job in the area. I by no means want to take anything away from from them. I will make sure that my dates won't conflict with anything they are running. If anything my tournament should help their business because I plan to use them to vendor. They have told me several times that just vending an event is the ideal situation for them.

I offered to be the TD for a couple Iron Lion tournaments last year but my offer was turned down. I want to become more involved in the sport other than just being a player. I want to gain tournament directing experience. Everyone says its harder than it looks and I believe them. But how will I know for sure if don't run one for myself?