Renewable EnergyDiscussion on various alternative energy, renewable energy, & free energy technologies. Also any discussion about the environment, global warming, and other related topics are welcome here.

Keshe is making announcements since about 2007, and there is still not a single credible witness who has ever seen a working “Keshe generator”, his “flying car”, or anything comparable from his long technology list. Every single announcement to tangibly show his “technology” (like the big technology demonstration announced for December 14th last year) has always been postponed or canceled.

It is an easily verifiable fact that Keshe blatantly lies when he talks of his “patents”. The documents usually referred to as Keshe’s “patents” are nothing more than meager attempts to secure patents, that failed years ago.

Keshe stopped paying the fees to uphold the patent applications after the assessment of the patent examiners of the European Patent Office made it obvious that the nonsense Keshe had fabricated hadn’t the slightest chance ever to be approved. Patent applications that are not paid for anymore automatically get the status “deemed to be withdrawn”.

Don’t take only my word for this, but go check it yourself at the website of the European Patent Office: https://register.epo.org/espacenet/s...rt&query=Keshe (the entire correspondence is respectively available under “All documents”). This is a different link than the one Keshe usually provides. It allows (contrary to the latter) direct access to the legal status, the event history, and the entire correspondence concerning the applications.

Concerning the “USB stick handover” to the Italian embassy in Brussels, that Keshe describes so histrionically in his Forum (“Italy the latest nation joining the Spaceship program”), there exists an official statement by the Italian government (http://banchedati.camera.it/sindacat...=62130&stile=6 ): Keshe turned up at the embassy without an appointment, imposed his USB stick on them, and they took it out of politeness. The video recording, which Keshe designates as “according to diplomatic protocol” is deemed “abusivamente” by the Italian government, which is somewhere between “without permission” and “illegal” with a tendency to the latter. Keshe’s claims concerning any “space partnership” are sharply rejected. Very probably the other (15 or so) “USB stick handovers” happened similarly.

From December 15th to 17th last year Keshe toured Italy. The disappointment spread when he again only told stories instead of showing something substantial. A well kown Italian blogger subsumed it aptly (http://22passi.blogspot.it/2012/12/k...o-post-di.html ): “Keshe: tante parole, nessun fatto” (= Keshe: many words, no facts).

Keshe even had the nerve to post in his forum afterwards “The first public show of Magravs space reactor”. What had he actually shown? A lousy video from — according to him — 2009, where you see some spherical thingy with some measuring devices around. Some digits change on the measuring devices. Nothing more. Ridiculous.

Some examples of Keshe’s announcements:

After nobody took him serious 2006/2007 on the NASA spaceflight forum, he sulked, and claimed that he had now given his “technology” to the Chinese:

Quote:

Within next few month, Chinese space scientists will complete the development of the first gravitation , magnetic field shielding system.

This will allow colonisation in real term and without the need for all these shuttle game business .

This technology will put the chine’s space program in one leap some 50 years ahead of NASA.

Mr. Keshe is a “nuclear engineer”, and he is sure that his insights will spark a revolution in energy, transport and medicinal technology. The mentioned Elektor article [a previous article from 2007] concluded with “time will tell”, and according to Mr. Keshe’s opinion the time has come now. Next year [2010] there shall be some spectacular demonstrations of his technology and insights.

[...]
On 21 September 2012 the Keshe Foundation will release the first phase of its space technology and the gravitational and magnetic (Magravs) systems it has developed, to all scientists around the world simultaneously, for production and duplication.
[...]
From that point on, international borders will cease to have any real significance.
[...]
The energy crisis will be resolved at a stroke, and once the technology is put into practice the powers that control energy supplies and through them the present financial structures will find their hands empty.
[...]

A comment by the participating, well known Prof. Dr.-Ing. Konstantin Meyl from Germany:

Quote:

Apparently the opinions differ materially on what “releasing” means. Mr. Keshe explained to all participants that for him it means “education”, i.e. he lectures about his significant and futuristic technology. He claims to be the sole originator.
[...]
Any kind of peer reviewing is superfluous and strictly refused by Mr. Keshe.
Albeit a rigorous scientific examination of the theoretical foundation and the practical implementation seems strongly advised.
[...]
If you would have expected a practical demonstration or even a construction plan from the announcement of a “release” you would have been severly disappointed on September 21st. No one of the participants has seen a flying car or any other application advertised by Mr. Keshe.
[...]
The announced demonstration of the “Keshe technology” is not canceled — only postponed until December. With this cheery message everyone went home.

This was not the only severe disappointment for Keshe’s fans last December. Originally in April 2011 Keshe had announced his infamous “3-4kW generators” (for which many poor chaps paid 500 EUR deposit):

Quote:

The Foundation submits for sale as of today for delivery early next year [2012] the following:

Portable 3-4 KW power systems on DC and AC 24 hours a day supply for the value of 5000 euros.

Of course he didn’t keep this date either. He couldn’t. His theories are utter nonsense, and it is impossible to build any working technology based on that. This, and only this is the reason why there is some “problem” each and every time he promises to actually show or even deliver his “technology”:

Quote:

Due to delivery from suppliers for some parts of the new [vacuum] seal systems we are behind the testing and releasing the generators.

Once we receive the newly manufactured parts in the second week of March from the manufactures: It will take us another 15 to 30 days to test and finally release the generators.

I cite only people with whom I had direct contact, the list is surely MUCH longer.

The opinion was unanimous: Keshe is at best a person who has not the slightest idea of what a scientific theory is, his theories are words without meaning, and his “patent” drawings are scribbles on a sheet of paper, absolutely useless for anything (and therefore rightly rejected by the European Patent Office). In the worst (and most likely) case he is a con artist.

Keshe often deems himself a “physicist”. Some of his followers, impressed by the many scientific words he uses, even address him as “Dr. Keshe” or “Prof. Keshe”. Actually he has nothing more than a bachelor degree in nuclear engineering (as independently confirmed by Steve Blackwell from the Academic Registry of the Queen Mary University in London). Engineering is not physics. Keshe’s understanding of physics is not even mediocre. One of his collossal blunders:

In an interview Keshe talks about a planned device to extract water from air humidity. Nothing wrong with that in general. It gets however very strange when Keshe talks about actual numbers:

Quote:

The driest space on earth carries 15% moisture of water, in European countries we are over 50%. So, if you can extract or suck in, let’s say, 1 ton of air, you can get at least 100, 200, 300 liter water out of it.

The air in European countries contains over 50% water? Even a schoolchild should notice that there’s something wrong with that. Under specific environmental conditions (mainly temperature and pressure) air can absorb only a certain maximum of water. The percentages typically used to quantify air humidity (e.g. displayed on hygrometers) are relative to this maximum. I won’t bore you with the actual calculation, but at room temperature and under normal atmospheric pressure this maximum amounts to about 14 liters per ton of air. An air humidity percentage of 50%, like Keshe mentions, means that one ton of air contains about 7 liters of water, and not “at least 100, 200, 300 liter” as Keshe claims. If you measure air humidity in a steamy bathroom, the percentage can easily go up to 100%. According to Keshe you should be drowning now. Keshe confused relative air humidity with the absolute water content of the air. A mistake not even a schoolchild should make.

This was just one example of Keshe’s “genius level” understanding of physics. Let me repeat from above: Keshe’s theories are utter nonsense. It is impossible to build any working technology based on that. There was never a single working (in the sense he advertises it) “Keshe generator”. He has never achieved any kind of antigravity. All his corresponding claims are fantasy stories.

In the introduction of his website you can read (“static plasma reactors” are “coke bottle reactors” and “dynamic plasma reactors” are the kind of “reactors” he describes in his patent applications):

Quote:

At the end of 2005 and the beginning of 2006 several static plasma reactors were built to confirm the theoretical principles of the technology. These static reactors all work at room temperature and at normal atmospheric pressure, and provide voltage and current.

Since the beginning of 2006 several prototypes of dynamic plasma reactors specifically designed to achieve lift and motion have been built and successfully tested.

Keshe filed his two original patent applications in October 2005. After the negative verdict of the patent examiners of the European Patent Office from March 2009 he wrote several letters trying to change their mind. Among other things he makes the following request:

Quote:

[W]e request the Examining Division [...] to accept our proposal to to a basic test with a static plasma (bottle) reactor in front of the Examining division of the European Patent Office.

So in the introduction on his website he claims that he has “successfully tested” reactors of the kind described in his patent applications since the beginning of 2006. But in mid 2009, desperately trying to save his patent applications, all he has to offer to the patent examining division is still only a “coke bottle reactor”. Draw your own conclusions.

And still (according to Keshe's assertion, which seems roughly credible in this case) about 150 poor chaps paid 500 EUR deposit for his "Keshe generators", whose delivery he will postpone the fourth time in April ...

The space reactors under development, use the nuclear material for creation of magnetic fields and load bearing rotors for perpetual motion, [...].

[...]

The date of the first trial most probably will be known before the end of this year [2007], due to simplicity of the system and its opration, this date will not be any further than the end of 2008 for the first space tested unit.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence right? Though, about Professor Meyl, I've replicated his Tesla pancake coil single wire power transfer via the open source plans made by Steve Jackson and it does appear to work.

KESHE SPACE EXPLORATION AND HABITATION SYSTEMS N.V. i.o (Belgium) offers to the general public space trips to the Moon, where each trip will include visits to four historical Apollo sites (Apollo program) on the Moon. The spacecraft will have a stoppage of 2 hours on four Apollo sites to give the passengers the opportunity to photograph and video the sites and the artefacts (flags, foot of the LM, LRV, Surveyor 3). The trips will be broadcasted worldwide through tv-channels and the Internet. The passengers receive on return a certificate. During these trips passengers cannot disarmbark from the craft. In later voyages this will be possible.

Did anybody ever consider that in order to 'disprove' something you must have incredibility. Many of the ideas that Keshe has do indeed exist in realizable technological advancements, however, very few tech-savy folks are privy to the information of the how-to-guide. To discredit something in the public eye, you must discredit a 'professional opinion'. This is your status-quo funded scapegoat, Dr. Keshe.

@Web000x: How much more incredibility do you need?Did you read this whole thread, and not only the last post? I don't know how familiar you are with Keshe's ideas and theories, but let me state clearly (and I'm very serious about this): There is no relationship between Keshe's ideas and "realizable technological advancements". There is exactly one reason why neither he himself nor any of the "Keshe work groups" has produced any tangible result (except from "coke bottle reactors" -- and even these can easily be explained based on established science) since 2005, when he started his current career as technology guru: because his theories are utter and total nonsense.

One of Keshe's most fundamental claims is that his infamous "coke bottle reactors" are able to deposit "atomic layers" of unusual materials like graphen or diamond on the used electrodes. I will discuss the "diamond" case first. Keshe claims (please take a short look at the linked website, it helps understanding the matter):

Quote:

We have proof [...] that our systems deposit diamond-like crystals on various types of conductive materials, where the electronic diamond tester indicates the presence of diamond. The professional diamond testing device used is the Diamond Selector 2 of the Culti brand.

First of all, the Culti Diamond Selector II is by no means a scientific instrument. It costs, depending on where you buy it, between US$ 25 .. 100, and is very specifically directed at differentiating diamonds from most (but not all) diamond simulants (for example cubic zirconium and white corundum). For this purpose it may be an acceptable choice.

Like most cheap diamond testers it works simply by measuring the rate of heat dissipation from a heated metal tip to the test item. Based on this rate the thermal conductivity of the test item is roughly determined. Diamonds have a very high thermal conductivity (higher than all metals), while most (but not all) diamond simulants have a far lower thermal conductivity. The result is displayed and used to decide if the test item is a diamond.

It is important to understand that this device only determines the thermal conductivity of the test item. It can in no other way "recognize" diamonds. A relatively imprecise measurement is sufficient, because the difference in thermal conductivity between diamonds and the group of diamond simulants this device is designed for is quite large (20:1 and higher). This is the reason this device can, for example, not distinguish moissanites from diamonds, because these have a thermal conductivity much closer to diamonds than most other diamond simulants.

Therefore anything with a thermal conductivity even remotely similar to a diamond will be tested positive by this device. This applies especially to many metals. The manual of the device explicitly warns of this:

Quote:

The thermal conductivity of the metal is very high and can give the same indication as a Diamond with most Thermal Probes.

So metal can give "the same indication as a diamond". And what is Keshe measuring? Metal items. Therefore all these "measurements" are utterly worthless.

Even apart from this, a device which works based on the rough measurement of heat dissipation is utterly unsuited for measurements of extremely thin layers of material anyway.

If we, in favour of Keshe, rule out that this is a case of purposeful deception, the only other possibility is a complete lack of understanding of the simple scientific principle on which the used measuring device works. Instead he obviously used wishful thinking that this device is somehow "magically" able to recognize diamond structures.

Even more outlandish than Keshe's claim of "diamond-like" deposits on his "coke bottle reactor" electrodes, is his idea of "graphene" deposits. Graphene is a special form of carbon (like diamond is another special form of carbon), and has several highly unusual and interesting properties. The known processes to produce significant amounts of graphene are complicated, and none of them resembles even remotely Keshe's "coke bottle reactor". The buildup of graphene on the electrodes would be hard to explain within the framework of established science, and seems therefore highly questionable. It is difficult to thoroughly analyze the chemical and electrical processes in Keshe's "coke bottle reactor" because he never revealed the composition of the "Kt liquid" he uses for this purpose. However, based on the color of the deposits it seems far more likely that they simply consist of ordinary copper(II) oxide or some similar copper compound.

Since Keshe is making an extraordinary claim here, it is his obligation to deliver extraordinary proof. This alleged proof is a "raman spectroscopy" of the deposits on one of his "coke bottle reactor" electrodes. Raman spectroscopy is an advanced analysis method, and can, among other things, be used to characterize materials. It is generally a feasible method to detect the presence of graphene.

Keshe claims that this raman spectroscopy has been performed in 2006 by an "independent laboratory" and that the results have been released in a confidential report. The first thing quite dubious here is that Keshe is very reluctant to actually name the institute which has performed the analysis. He mentions the raman spectroscopy often, but nearly always the institute remains nameless as an "independent laboratory" or a "leading nano institute". Even more secretive is Keshe about the report itself. In 2007 he writes:

Quote:

We can not release the findings of the report, but we are allowed through lawyers and long negotiations to release the Raman spectroscopy graph of the report to confirm the correctness the findings.

Keshe published the small diagram he mentions here (which indeed seems to confirm the presence of graphene) on several occasions, but he stopped (for unknown reasons) making it (or any publication containing it) available on his website some years ago. The value of the diagram alone without any context is of course extremely limited.

As far as I know, nothing except this diagram is so far generally known about the actual raman spectroscopy report from which it originates. And to this day Keshe has declined all requests to make it available. However, he overlooked something (or he hoped that nobody would ever find out). When he filed his patent application EP1770717, he subsequently filed this report as an annex. Therefore the European Patent Office published it (which is part of the normal process) when it published the patent application itself in 2007. So here is Keshe's mysterious raman spectroscopy report: https://register.epo.org/espacenet/a...g=en&npl=false . Note: The EP number is different from the one I mentioned above because the European Patent Office uses two different numbering schemes for different purposes. You can also access the report from the main website of the patent application via the link in my original comment above under: "Amendments received before examination".

The document (6 pages), is a technical report from the Interuniversity Microelectronics Center (IMEC), an acknowledged research institute in Belgium, and dated 07/06/2006. Beginning here, however, things get very strange. The whole document mentions Keshe, his foundation, or anything else even remotely reminding of Keshe not even once. There is no description or any other information about the nature and origin of the sample that is analyzed, apart from that it has "dark areas", "light areas" and "darker areas". The "Purpose" is simply stated as: "Raman experiment on a sample whether there are sp2 or sp3 clusters" (sp2 and sp3 are special forms of carbon). Do me a favour and look over the document yourself (it's only 6 pages) and tell me if you find any evidence that this document has anything to do with Keshe and his "coke bottle reactor" electrodes.

It gets stranger. There is a "Figure 1" in the document with the description "Position where spectrum S1 I taken, dark area on the sample". This "Figure", which obviously should picture the sample, or a part of it, is blackened out. Initially I pondered whether the darkness could be the result of a very dark photography, but a quick check confirmed that it is completely black.

It gets even more strange. All pages of the document are marked as "IMEC CONFIDENTIAL". The distribution list is remarkably short: "IMEC: Stephanie Teugels, External: -". This is obviously an IMEC internal document that was at least at the time when it was written not intended for Keshe or anyone else outside IMEC. There is no mark on it that the confidentiality has ever been lifted.

This document is, without any further explicit confirmation from IMEC, utterly unacceptable as "proof" for any of Keshe's claims. Altogether the serious oddities in relation to this document raise the severe suspicion that it has nothing to do with Keshe and his "coke bottle reactor" electrodes at all.

Good work Galaxian, The sooner these deceptive conmen are seen for what they
are the better off we will all be.

It is right and proper for Keshe to back up his claims with evidence and
independent testing. THe onus of proof is on the claimant.

Otherwise I could claim i can disappear or teleport and it would be up to others
to prove I can't which is just ridiculous and moronic to think I could make claims
and give no proof and expect people to just believe it, whats more troubling is
that there are people who defend his right to not need to prove anything.

This calls into question the credibility of the people defending Keshe's right to
make claims with little evidence and no proof.

If Keshe or anyone else could make over unity devices or devices that break
the known laws of physics, but won't show any proof or give detailed build
instructions or lay out the theory and experimental results at least.
Then what good is it ?

In my opinion what it does is make money for him from conned investors as
well as make a whole lot of people sit back and say it's all under control Keshe
will save us and yet cause other people to waste time and effort trying to
replicate the devices with insufficient info. As well as cause all kinds of
"do gooders" who will believe anything to go on a PR drive for a man they
don't even know.

He and Meyl are buddies, I don't trust Meys intentions either, I don't buy the whole
"scalar waves" thing it's a contradiction of terms or an oxymoron. I don't think
it is something a scientist should say. eg. my understanding is a scalar is a
constant or unchanging value in time with no vector, by definition a wave is a
period of time or space that has a constantly varying value over time or
space. I'm not a trained professor but a wave and a scalar appear to be two
almost opposite things.

Is there anything at all we can look at to verify any of Keshe's claims ? Should
we even bother ?

News: Keshe got disinvited from a new energy congress in Germany in May. The organizer (the swiss Jupiter-Verlag) had made it a nonnegotiatable precondition for Keshe's presentation that he must practically demonstrate one of his "3-4kW generators", to which Keshe had originally agreed. Since he promised to deliver about 150 of these generators in mid April, it should be no problem to demonstrate one in mid May. Many German Keshe fans had high hopes for this congress. Two days ago however, the first inofficial notice appeared that Keshe's presentation had been canceled. Yesterday someone in a German forum inquired of the organizer whether this is true and got a confirmation. Keshe had withdrawn his consent to practically demonstrate a generator and got accordingly disinvited.

Draw your own conclusions what this means for the generator delivery in mid April.

Who here seconds my nomination for a poll listing inventors with their devices and how strongly we believe or disbelieve their claims? (This is not the first time I've suggested this but since Aaron is 'through with me', it's up to you.)

Who here seconds my nomination for a poll listing inventors with their devices and how strongly we believe or disbelieve their claims? (This is not the first time I've suggested this but since Aaron is 'through with me', it's up to you.)

You mean like a simplified graphical "disinfo effectivity report" made by the target group themselves to save the disinformants the hassle of having to assess the situation through reading a lot of "opinions" in a less convenient format?

So, if nothing happens, it's not his fault. Apart from this he seems to have overlooked the slight logical problem, that several western nations (notably the USA) also "have the USB stick". Not that it would actually matter anyway.

I'll leave another excerpt from his "open letter" without further comment:

Quote:

It has been raised in private and in public and on the forum of the Foundation if I am the prophet or a promised one and if my peace treaty document about the status of scientists makes me a prophet.

I often come across ideas that Keshe has "mighty enemies" and that governments and nebulous other powers -- THEY -- are suppressing his "technology". Take a look at the following press release from 2005. A completely unknown Iranian guy living in Belgium, who has never published a single article in any recognized scientific publication, claims to revolutionize physics (which, by the way, would be perfectly fine if there were any substance behind it). Why didn't THEY stop him back then, when nobody knew him?

One could argue, that the press release was not comprehensive enough to reasonably evaluate his ideas. But he had already filed his patent applications at that time, and although these were not yet published, THEY would certainly have had the means to access the filed, but unpublished patent applications.

One could further argue, that his ideas were completely theoretical at that time, and therefore not very threatening for THEM. But he claims to have successfully tested his first "dynamic reactors" in 2006, when he was still nearly unknown. His public activities at that time comprised not much more than some postings on the NASA spaceflight forum, where nobody took him serious anyway. It would still have been very easy for THEM to stop him at that time.

It wasn't before 2009, when his publicity grew. Why should THEY have waited so long?

This whole story doesn't make sense. There are no "mighty enemies". Nobody is "suppressing" Keshe's "technology". THEY don't care about story tellers. His corresponding stories are just convenient excuses to conceal the nonexistence of his "technology".

Published on Nov 18, 2012
Iran has no use for Nuclear weapons or for that matter Nuclear power...
Watch for more drones to be snatched...
The Obamanation has agreed to talks with Iran after years of War mongering
and now knows they cannot attack without destroying themselves...Irans 'Return to Sender' Technology - YouTube

The Iran drone story is one of Keshe's most ridiculous claims. There is no shred of actual evidence that he has anything to do with it. He simply employs one of his favorite strategies: the harder it is to investigate his claims, the bolder they get. It is highly likely that he has nothing more than family ties to Iran. His family probably had good relations to the Shah regime -- as shown by his selection for the nuclear engineering studies in Britain -- which make all too close relations to the current regime rather doubtful.

The obvious proof, that there is no "Keshe technology" in Iran are the extensive "classical" nuclear power and space flight programs. No country with quite limited resources would engage in such programs if it had access to technology like Keshe fantasizes about. Nothing of Keshe's meager attempts to argue against this holds any water.

Even some of Keshe's devoted followers seem to get suspicious about his claims concerning Iran, as shown by this excerpt from a recent post on the Keshe forum by one of the most active members:

Quote:

Keyvan [a well known Austrian Keshe follower with Iranian descent] has tried to contact PressTV [a large state-owned Iranian English language news network, broadcasting worldwide] on several occasions without any response. We are both curious to know, why you have never been mentioned or interviewed in relation to the Space Ship Technology or any of your technology for that matter. It was only recently that you really opened-up about Iran. You work with Iran, you are Iranian, and I am sure the Iranians are very proud of you, in being able to help them. We find this a little strange and would welcome your response or comments on this matter.

@Ufopolitics: The truth hurts sometimes. But instead of breaking out in anger, and making wild accusations, you should have analyzed the material I presented here rationally. If you think I'm misinforming, than prove anything I wrote wrong. This whole thread does -- contrary to your ideas -- indeed serve to help people: Providing facts against Keshe's propaganda.

quite right Glaxion! the keshi clown should be in jail. as should most of the shills, trippers and liars that hang around here with their ****y kits, DVD's and seminars that lead to nothing but more ****y kits, DVD's and seminars!

and dont be sensored by anyone around here m8 99.999% of them are lying conmen whos opinions count for nothing within the energy scene period.

who made you the gardian at the gate UFO? nobody! with your silly little girl outburst! your responce was exactly what i would expect from a shill.

what a complete clown.

__________________
The history of science shows that theories are perishable.With every new truth that is revealed,we get a better understanding of Nature and our conceptions and views are modified. - Nikola Tesla