Actually, it's a 'real' option for the airlines - they've got the spare space and they can afford to offer economy passengers a small 'thwart-ship' bunk. Looks a bit like you'd be getting into your coffin, though!

Scroll down to 'Going Inter-Continental' and the bit about the 'Skyloft' and you can watch a video.

Thing is, though, I know which configuration I'd like personally, but it'll never happen again. It was a trans-USA 707, six-across with plenty of legroom, that was still fitted out for bringing guys back from tours of duty in Vietnam. The last two rows of seats had been removed and galleys with infra-red grills had been put in; apparently the guys were hungry for nothing but beef once they were on their way home.

First and last time I've ever been asked, "How would you like your steak done, sir?" on an aeroplane....

[Edited 2006-03-03 15:51:14]

"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci

You can't put seats up in the loft space, meaning that the proposals are very realistic IMO. I'd love to see BA put some sort of airbourne terraces lounge up there, accessible only to gold card members

Quoting CV747 (Reply 1):Then when the first plane goes in operation it has a "Sardine" configuration to haul as many as possible.

I'm confident that airlines will not put another cattle class in the attic of 748, or anything that comes close to regular seats, no matter which class. (i.e. Airlines will not be able to fit 40 "extra" passengers in addition to the regular pax seating)

As for sleeping berths, I'd imagine it would be available for Y or Y+ passengers, since F and C class seats these days are more than comfortable enough. If they can fit 40 sleeping "pods" up there, 40 Y class passengers who are willing to pay can go up there when they want to take a nap, watch a movie, or read their novel. Their seats in the main cabin could actually be quite small with little pitch since they have the bed available for them, thus airlines can fit a couple more regular seats.

However, I do see a problem with this... Will this "sleeping pod in the attic" be certified? What if 40 passengers are sleeping up there and something happens, the aircraft makes an emergency landing where they do not have a chance to come down (very unlikely.. but..) Would they have enough time to get down to exit? Or would Boeing have to design an emergency exit door for those 40 or so pax?

Putting galleries up there would probably require an elevator, which adds a lot of weight, as well as the attic needs to be reinforced so it can sustain the weight of the galley.

Overall, I think it's a great idea and a possible revenue generating concept for airlines... But will it come to reality? We'll have to wait and see...

Airlines are always going to be looking for new ways to generate revenues and bunk beds for Y pax is a pretty good idea. The other factor is "what is the competition doing?" for First and Business. If they are providing a nicer bed for premium pax then you will match it or loose high paying pax.

Luxury 748i "lofts" for premium pax would also put pressure on the airlines to make the premium areas on their 380s a bit better.

The unused space is already being used for crew rests in 777 upper spaces, so the idea is completely possible and good practical use of otherwise unused space. An "attic" will offer more privacy than first or business class beds in the main cabins of either the main or upper deck hump in the 747, and either level in the A380.

I can't believe what a potential coup this would be, if it succeeds. The marketing potential would be tremendous:

I reckon what we'll see is that space being filled by galleys, so the airlines can put more seats in.
But I suppose it's a trade-off of between what the 'skysuites' cost and what the profit from extra seats would be.

We saw similar concepts with the A380 and does anyone know if that's happening? But the airlines are keeping their A380 cabins very secret...

It remains to be seen whether the vision of the Skyloft will be realised, but I'd put more money on that than on the lush extras touted by Airbus for the A380. Why? Because extras on the A380 the space for those hypothetical extras will likely be filled with seats. The Skyloft on the other hand can't be used for seats so essentially it is space that might as well be used for something good.

I think it is odd that everyone is so pessemistic about the possibility of this occuring. I realize there would be a weight imposition, but the profit potential would outweigh, I would think, those implifications. The thing people keep forgetting, is they are not taking away previous passenger seating space to do this, and the space is too small for seating anyway. That is what makes this different than previous plans to put "berths on Board", apart from the 747-X, of course. This is just the sort of thing airlines look for when they want to increase revenue.
Think about it though, like, every single inch of that plane, will be packed with passenger space. It does kinda make me nervous. Everytime I see crash pictures, and the plane is ripped apart, it makes me think about if not only the passenger cabin, but the crown were packed with people... Well, that could just be really bad. If they do make these a reality, let's just hope that never happens.

Quoting Macc (Reply 9):excuse me, how big must the unused space on a 747 be thhat there is place enough for 40 suites, or a gym, or an office?? and if there is, why dont they pack more seats into it???

Airlines can't put seats in the aft part of the JumboJet's upper deck because of evacuation requirements. Therefore the space currently goes unused. The only substantial cost for an airline would be the additional fuel needed to carry the weight of whatever is installed up there.

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 18):Airlines can't put seats in the aft part of the JumboJet's upper deck because of evacuation requirements. Therefore the space currently goes unused. The only substantial cost for an airline would be the additional fuel needed to carry the weight of whatever is installed up there.

Your statement is a little contradictory. If by 'whatever they put up there' you mean passengers (whether sleeping or doing whatever), it comes back to the same evacation problems.

Quoting TinkerBelle (Reply 19):Your statement is a little contradictory. If by 'whatever they put up there' you mean passengers (whether sleeping or doing whatever), it comes back to the same evacation problems.

I meant the bunks, floors, doors, curtains, reinforcing, IFE, etc., not the passengers. The passengers would be required to be downstairs (or in the forward upper deck, which has emergency evacuation doors) below perhaps 20,000 foot elevation.

Quoting Travelin man (Reply 14):Is this a not-so-subtle reminder to airlines regarding the potential profit implications of "flooding" a market with seats? (i.e. a veiled "warning" about what buying the A380 means?)

I'm just curious why a Boeing executive would tout the falling fares that an A380 would theoretically bring.

It's all PR baby! Everything these companies do is all about putting a good spin on things, just like the government. Boeing probably hopes that speaking kindly towards Airbus will make people say, "hey, Boeing is a pretty classy organization." But I garuntee you'll only see one company say nice things about the other when the other company has screwed up (Airbus has had a few minor issues as of late [the A380 wing failure, questionable China order]). Those issues are nothing to be worried about, as everyone on this site knows, but the uninformed public just reads about a wing failure and starts to wonder about Airbus, then they see this Boeing guy saying nice things and the wheels start to turn. Just wait, eventually Boeing will mess up and if Airbus has it's A game (which I'm sure it will) it'll put a PR sping on the incident too.

Quoting DavidT (Reply 6):You can't put seats up in the loft space, meaning that the proposals are very realistic IMO. I'd love to see BA put some sort of airbourne terraces lounge up there, accessible only to gold card members

I do think this will work because it does not cut into revenue generating seats.

hypothetically speaking (though on a.net thats the standard)
what do you guys think if they also started to offer this on the 777. The cabin crew rests are in the front (for flight deck) and in the rear (for cabin crew), in between there is space that is unused. Could we see this on 777 in the future.

Quoting Jcded (Reply 23):what do you guys think if they also started to offer this on the 777. The cabin crew rests are in the front (for flight deck) and in the rear (for cabin crew), in between there is space that is unused. Could we see this on 777 in the future.

No, there is not enough space to put passenger bunks overhead in the B777. However, I do expect to see them in Y3, the replacement for the B777-300 and B747.

I remember that A380 offered this on the bottom floor along with a restaurant.... We read it all and nothing will ever happen, except in VIP planes if there are ever any with the 380.

No, Airlines are not greedy, they are making huge losses and see long haul-haul aircrafts as cash cows. So why not exagerate that effect and let even more money come-in? That's their point anyway. Too much people on a.net think that airlines are making things to make us members happy... sorry to tell you guys it's not the way it is!

Boeing offers this just like Airbus did it with the 380 because they want to offer something "similar" to show companies what they are capable of, and that if ever they needed anything, they have it available. That's why they make it. If anyone ever uses it anyway, it's truly a miracle!

BG // Philippe

It's not about AIRBUS. it's not about BOEING. It's all about the beauty of FLYING.

Quoting PipoA380 (Reply 25):I remember that A380 offered this on the bottom floor

The difference here is that the Airbus version uses cargo volume. The Boeing version uses space that would otherwise go unused. Boeing still has a weight penalty if these are installed, but not a space penalty (except for the stairs).

Quoting CCA (Reply 27):Looks like there is space for bunks if you ask me

There is certainly space for bunks. The problem is that there is not enough space for passengers. The aisle is too narrow, the stairs are too steep, etc. It would not get the approval of the certifying authorities.

Dont be so quick to scrap this idea... beds, as opposed to lounges, bars, etc... take up little space. I believe you can actually cram more passengers in stacked beds then in seats. It's a question of statistics... how many passengers will be sleeping and how many will be sitting? If you can solve that and make sure that most of the seats and most of the beds are taken, then we might see beds.

Quoting Rolfen (Reply 29):Dont be so quick to scrap this idea... beds, as opposed to lounges, bars, etc... take up little space. I believe you can actually cram more passengers in stacked beds then in seats. It's a question of statistics... how many passengers will be sleeping and how many will be sitting? If you can solve that and make sure that most of the seats and most of the beds are taken, then we might see beds.

The problem with that is, that you'd also need seats for the passengers for take-off and landing, as they have to be strapped in for that and it'd be hard to strap yourself in on a bed!

Quoting TinkerBelle (Reply 11):Quoting Poitin (Reply 10):
Hey, maybe they can form a "Mile High Club," complete with little smilie faces to show you are member. I think that would sell, particularly on long hauls.

Not unless F/A's are involved.

Have you has a look at www.lynxjet.com yet. I got a Mile High Club card in the mail this morning and I had to explain to mum what it was and why it had a false address on it.

Whats the point of people putting this stuff on websites when everone knows (except the people that don't ) that it will never happen. I can remember when they were saying the A380 would have Maccas, a casino waterfall and drinking lounge and not one airline will be putting any of that stuff into their A380's.

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 28):
The aisle is too narrow, the stairs are too steep, etc. It would not get the approval of the certifying authorities.

How wide does the aisle have to be? How steep is too steep. I'm sure Boeing have covered this, I doubt it will be certified for take off and landing which means it won't be required to have the same standards for an evacuation nor will it require seats like the 777 Cockpit crew rest area which is certified for take off and landing.

Quoting A319XFW (Reply 30):The problem with that is, that you'd also need seats for the passengers for take-off and landing, as they have to be strapped in for that and it'd be hard to strap yourself in on a bed!

Actually crew rest bunks in the 777 have straps on them, it's necessary for the resting crewmembers not to go airborne during turbulence (what a bad way to wake up ).

Quoting A319XFW (Reply 30):The problem with that is, that you'd also need seats for the passengers for take-off and landing, as they have to be strapped in for that and it'd be hard to strap yourself in on a bed!

Quoting CCA (Reply 32):I doubt it will be certified for take off and landing

Weren't there skybeds already certified for take-off and landing offered on the 744s when it first came around?

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 31):Whats the point of people putting this stuff on websites when everone knows (except the people that don't ) that it will never happen.

Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 34):Quoting A319XFW (Reply 30):
The problem with that is, that you'd also need seats for the passengers for take-off and landing, as they have to be strapped in for that and it'd be hard to strap yourself in on a bed!

Quoting CCA (Reply 32):
I doubt it will be certified for take off and landing

Weren't there skybeds already certified for take-off and landing offered on the 744s when it first came around?

I don't know - perhaps someone else more familiar with them could say? But I would find it odd lying in a bed for take-off or landing!
Unless you can somehow change them into seats like first class seats?