Wednesday, January 19, 2011

Pa. abortion doc charged with 8 counts of murder

OneNewsNow...PHILADELPHIA - A Philadelphia abortion doctor has been charged with eight counts of murder in the deaths of a woman patient and seven babies who prosecutors say were born alive and then killed with scissors. The charges against Dr. Kermit Gosnell follow a long grand jury investigation.

District Attorney Seth Williams says state regulators ignored complaints and failed to visit the clinic since 1993. Williams says the women were subjected to squalid and barbaric conditions at Gosnell's Women's Medical Society, which was shut down last year. Gosnell has been named in at least 10 malpractice suits, including one over the death of a woman who died of sepsis and a perforated uterus.

A doctor who gave abortions to minorities, immigrants and poor women in a "house of horrors" clinic was charged with eight counts of murder in the deaths of a patient and seven babies who were born alive and then killed with scissors, prosecutors said Wednesday.

Dr. Kermit Gosnell, 69, made millions of dollars over 30 years, performing as many illegal, late-term abortions as he could, prosecutors said. State regulators ignored complaints about him and failed to inspect his clinic since 1993, but no charges were warranted against them given time limits and existing law, District Attorney Seth Williams said. Nine of Gosnell's employees also were charged.

Gosnell "induced labor, forced the live birth of viable babies in the sixth, seventh, eighth month of pregnancy and then killed those babies by cutting into the back of the neck with scissors and severing their spinal cord," Williams said.

Patients were subjected to squalid and barbaric conditions at Gosnell's Women's Medical Society, where Gosnell performed dozens of abortions a day, prosecutors said. He mostly worked overnight hours after his untrained staff administered drugs to induce labor during the day, they said.

Early last year, authorities went to investigate drug-related complaints at the clinic and stumbled on what Williams called a "house of horrors." Bags and bottles holding aborted fetuses "were scattered throughout the building," Williams said. "There were jars, lining shelves, with severed feet that he kept for no medical purpose."

The clinic was shut down and Gosnell's medical license was suspended after the raid.

Gosnell and four workers were charged with murder, while five others were charged with controlled drug violations and other crimes. None of the employees had any medical training, and one, a high school student, performed intravenous anesthesia with potentially lethal narcotics, Williams said.

All 10 defendants were taken into custody, authorities said.

Two listed numbers for Gosnell in Philadelphia have been disconnected. Defense lawyer William J. Brennan, who represented Gosnell during the investigation, noted that the doctor served patients in a low-income city neighborhood for decades. "Obviously, these allegations are very, very serious," Brennan said.

The grand jury said the woman who died was a patient who came to Gosnell's clinic for an abortion and died of cardiac arrest because she was given too much Demerol. Gosnell wasn't at the clinic at the time, but directed his staff to administer the drug to keep the woman, a healthy 41-year-old woman, sedated until he arrived, prosecutors said.

Gosnell has been named in at least 46 malpractice suits, including one over the death of a 22-year-old mother who died of sepsis and a perforated uterus in 2000. Many others also involve perforated uteruses. Gosnell sometimes sewed up the injury without telling women their uteruses had been perforated, prosecutors said.

Gosnell charged $325 for first-trimester abortions and $1,600 to $3,000 for abortions up to 30 weeks. Abortions are legal up to 24 weeks gestation in Pennsylvania, although most doctors won't perform them after 20 weeks, prosecutors said.

Some women came from across the mid-Atlantic for the illegal late-term abortions, authorities said. White women from the suburbs were ushered into a separate, slightly cleaner area because Gosnell believed they were more likely to file complaints, Williams said.

"People knew near and far that if you needed a late-term abortion you could go see Dr. Gosnell," Williams said.

Few if any of the sedated women knew their babies were born alive and then killed, prosecutors said. Many were first-time mothers who were told they were 24 weeks pregnant, even if they were further along, authorities said.

Gosnell got his medical degree from Thomas Jefferson University in Philadelphia and is board certified in family practice. He started, but did not finish, a residency in obstetrics-gynecology, authorities said.

"He does not know how to do an abortion. He's not board certified," Assistant District Attorney Joanne Pescatore said. "Once he got them there, he saw dollar signs and did abortions that other people wouldn't do."

No mercy for this evil monster. I hope he gets the death penalty. Shame someone could stab a pair of scissors in his neck and cut his spinal cord.

And for those who are shocked about me saying that or disapproves of me saying that.....too bad! I have ZERO tolerance for abortionists. They deserve a special kind of hell when they die or better yet tortured before they die.

It really breaks my heart that innocent little babies are brutally and mercilessly tortured before they die. I cannot help my anger and indignation.

Early last year, authorities went to investigate drug-related complaints at the clinic and stumbled on what Williams called a "house of horrors." Bags and bottles holding aborted fetuses "were scattered throughout the building," Williams said. "There were jars, lining shelves, with severed feet that he kept for no medical purpose."

It's easy, even if you don't object to on-demand abortions after the 1st trimester (which I do object to), what is described here is medical malpractice against the women (perforated uterus, inappropriate sedation, etc.). Gosnell is clearly not fit to practice in any field.

I have a couple of questions for you, Silverfiddle, which I hope won't be taken disrespectfully:1) do you disagree that this is exactly the kind of secretive, sloppy and reprobate institute that flourishes when you ban abortion altogether?2) do you disagree that late term abortions are worse (ie more endangering and/or morally tragic) than 1st trimester ones?3) wouldn't you prefer to permit some early term abortions if it meant late term abortions could be successfully and completely eradicated? (please entertain my assertion that an outright ban would make later-term abortions more frequent, even if you disagree.)

Patrick, that is pretty awful, it is strange how people want to protect, coddle and free murderers.

AOW, I never saw it that way! You are so right that monster was keeping trophies of his victims. My God!

Silver, and that is such a quick and easy death.

Jez, I hope you don't mind but I would like to address your questions.

1. I disagree, because there really is absolutely no need to kill a pre-born child. Jez, there are so many infertile women who are desperate to adopt. All these women have to do is carry to term and in most cases, adoptive parents will pay for medical costs.

2. All abortion is horrid regardless of the developmental stage of the baby. Life begins at the moment of conception and there is a soul present in that precious growing body. Every baby deserves a chance to live.

3. I prefer no abortion of any kind. What liberals and feminists fail to see and refuse to acknowledge or understand is that there is indeed life in a woman's womb no matter how small that life may be.

Silverfiddle, I did at least answer your question; you're just putting words in my mouth.For your clarification: I'm asking you to entertain the idea that specifically late term abortions become more frequent when abortions are forced underground.

Jez: I have no facts from which to make a decision on your late term question.

Based on pro-abortion logic, this man should not be tried for murder because the mother wanted these kids dead and he ran a legal practice that did just that.

This is the legal fiction (as Rick Santorum calls it) we have in this country: If the mother does not want the baby, it is tissue and can be aborted. If the mother wants the baby, it is a person and it is murder to kill it.

So yeah, charge him for all that other stuff, but the pro-abortion crowd cannot call for this man being charged with murder without contradicting their own stance.

Jez, the morning pill after is just another method of killing the pre-born baby. No, there is no distinction they both fall under the same category of "murder." Abortion no matter how you phrase, say it or try to distort is still taking an innocent life.

Karen, exactly. This guy is absolutely pure evil. To take joy in murdering babies and hurting the mothers.

AOW, that has to be a fascinating subject. Not sure if I would have the stomach for it, because I probably judge way too quickly.

I would not accede to any such bargains you propose. It is not man's place to decide who lives and who dies.

This twisted brand of Utilitarianism is what led to the progressive eugenics movement of the early 20th century. Hitler picked up racist progressive Margaret Sanger's philosophy and used it to justify his tyrannical carnage.

More black children are killed by planned parenthood each week than all the blacks lynched in the history of the United States.

I have a question for you. Do you find what this abortionist did horrible? If so, which actions? Why?

"Would you prefer to permit early abortions if it meant you could fully eradicate late term abortions (and if it was the only way of eradicating them)."

Speaking for myself - No, in my opinion you cannot ignore the basis of opposition to or support for abortion. You either see the unborn as tissue or waste to be tossed away based on the feelings of the mother or you see the unborn as human life and scared.

If you see them as human life, you can't be alright with killing a baby at 2 months or 8 months, there is no justification for killing them off at any stage. If you see them as mere tissue and nothing more, you can't be alright with killing them at 2 months but then whine about killing them at 8 months, even if it's for some mythical promise of no killing for others at 8 months. Whatever your reason for killing them off at 2 months, it's just as valid for killing them off at 8 or 9 months.

"So, based upon your absurd statement, does banning rape make it more frequent?"

To add to that silverfiddle, it's like saying to prevent the rape of ordinary women, we should allow the rape of prostitutes, perhaps with some conditions, like only one rape a month or some such craziness.

The crazy thing about this piece of shit Gosnell is that the pro-baby-killing crowds justification for legalizing abortion was to prevent this sort of medical horror from taking place and yet here we are witnessing gut-wrenching mass-murder. And their answer off course is more taxpayer funded abortion on demand.

Coming back to that hypothetical question - "Would you prefer to permit early abortions if it meant you could fully eradicate late term abortions (and if it was the only way of eradicating them)."

I'm going to assume that you would answer yes jez. If so, how would you eradicate late term abortions then, would you ban them altogether? At what point would you say no to a late-term abortion request? What would be your justification? And what would be the punishment for someone getting a late term abortion, would you class it as a criminal act like murder?

"This guy would get a comfy prison cell for about 10 to 15 years if he committed these vicious crimes here in Australia."

In Australia, i'd b surprised if he went to prison Patrick.

"Sounds something like the horrors that Jeffrey Dahmer kept."

Dahmer would be envious of him Always, this bastard was getting paid for what he did.

"More black children are killed by planned parenthood each week than all the blacks lynched in the history of the United States."

Indeed Silverfiddle, it's also a multi-million dollar industry, it's like the old muslim slave trade industry on steriods and it's legal and acceptable to many. In fact, those of us who are opposed to it are even forced to fund it, that's the murderous and soft-fascist nature of it all.

"Also, Jez, abortion is "safe, legal and rare" as the Margaret Sanger eugenics wing of the Democratic party likes to repeat over and over. So tell me, why do we have abortion "houses of horror?""

When is murder not murder? When it involves an unborn baby. What a sick society we've evolved into. I read yesterday 52 million babies have been aborted since Roe ... I'm sure there was a scientist in that number who might have cured cancer.

Layla, lol!! Go get some rest and plenty of sleep. I hope your weekend is quiet.

Mustang, not only that but for AIDS, and so many other ailments, or great composers and writers, astronauts, people who could have changed the world and they are now lost to us forever because of some vile and selfish people.

AOW, I wanted to gag when I read that article. I am in shock, complete and utter shock! There are no words to describe his monstrous acts against humanity.

You claim there is no difference, morally or medically, from terminations at 2 months, 8 months, or at a few days (morning after).Medically, you are wrong, in terms of risk to the woman, 8 months is a whole different category.Morally, I disagree: i see no need to allow the right of a foetus with at most a reptilian brain conflict with the rights of an adult (2 months) or a blastocyte, cluster of undifferentiated cells (morning after). I comment only to inform and clarify, I don't expect to convince. You ask about consciences and "how can kind believe..."; this is how. I simply recognise the difference between embryos at different stages, while you assert that there are no differences or they don't matter.

I've never needed a termination (prevention is better than cure), and we're excitedly awaiting our first quite soon.

Sorry, I sent my last comment from my phone. Allow me to fix some typos:

I see no contest between the rights of a 2-month old foetus with at most a reptilian brain, or the rights of a blastocyte (the latest possible target of the morning after pill), which is a cluster of unspecialised cells, against the rights of a living, fully-born woman. The point being that prior to a certain amount of development, suffering and sentience are impossible.

You ask about consciences and "how can libs believe..."; this is how. I simply recognise the difference between embryos at different stages, while you assert that there are no differences or they don't matter.

Yes, Jez, there are differences, but it's all human life. Who are you to decide who lives and who dies?

I apologize for blog pimping, Leticia, but your post and Jez's response spurred a post of my own on this, where I expand on Jez's thinking. It takes us to a scary place, as if that abortionist's charnel house isn't scary enough.

Maybe the fact that this abortionist is attracting so much attention demonstrates that, like me, some pro-lifers really do react more to these late terminations than to eg. the morning-after pill, only you're reluctant to admit it.

Jez, I will have to vehemently disagree with you. It doesn't matter what stage the "baby" is in, there is still a soul and life present and no one has the right to dictate if that life should be terminated.

Silver, you are always welcome to comment as much as you like here, doesn't bother me one bit. I like the support.

jez, assuming you prefer to permit early abortions if it meant you could fully eradicate late term abortions (and if it was the only way of eradicating them), how would you eradicate late term abortions then, would you ban them altogether? At what point would you say no to a late-term abortion request? What would be your justification? And what would be the punishment for someone getting a late term abortion, would you class it as a criminal act like murder?

Congratulations, here's another question for you jez, if someone kicks your wife in the stomach and your fetus with as you put it, at most a reptilian brain, miscarries, would you want the assailant charged with murder or just common assault causing grievous bodily harm to only the woman?

Such a man has no conscience. The souls of such people are swirling with darkness and it will take the judgment of God to bring them the true fruits of their labors. In that, we will have to trust because I fear that that man cannot receive true justice at our hands.

At 2 months a woman is not visibly pregnant, and miscarriages at that stage are frequently not noticed immediately. I think it would be impossible to prove the assailant's mallice, or that he caused it at all. I don't know about the different sorts of assault. instinctively I want to consider the fetus as either property or an extension to the woman's body, but that's not a deeply considered opinion.

Seems you didn't see my earlier question on your earlier hypothetical jez, i'll repeat it again, assuming you prefer to permit early abortions [which, from what i can see you don't have a problem with] if it meant you could fully eradicate late term abortions (and if it was the only way of eradicating them), how would you eradicate late term abortions then, would you ban them altogether? At what point would you say no to a late-term abortion request? What would be your justification? And what would be the punishment for someone getting a late term abortion, would you class it as a criminal act like murder?

Thanks for attempting to answer my second set of questions. Let's cut to the chase and say she is visibly pregnant and the fellow shouts, 'time to save the planet' or something before she's kicked in the stomach. Would you want the charge to be murder or simply as if the fellow grabbed her cell phone or laptop and smashed it on the ground, like you know, common theft. Seeing as how you're going to be a father, perhaps now is the time for some deep consideration.

The law in the UK isn't too far wrong. They're allowed up to 24 weeks except for medical reasons where the mother is endangered.

I can't see the point in harshly punishing the women who get them, my focus would be on the abortion doctors who break the law. I expect revoking their license to practice and a hefty fine would be in itself a strong deterrent (the motive is chiefly financial, isn't it?) but there's no reason not to punish criminally with jail time, if that would help.

"Seeing as how you're going to be a father, perhaps now is the time for some deep consideration."Well yes it is, but there are more important questions to consider; I don't think I'll waste too much time on this issue. Did you find that your meditation on this subject helped with being a new parent?a) your scenario is vanishingly unlikely andb) it's not the victims' job to determine punishment. Since I'm not a judge, my opinion on this is as irrelevant as yours.Just for fun, maybe I'd think of it as if the woman had lost the use of a limb?

There's a legal distinction between infanticide (the murderer targets her own children) and other types of murder -- this idea seems sensible to me since the mother who kills her own is not a threat to the general public, so protection of society, which is the most pressing matter in dealing with general murderers, is not an issue. That principle might be helpful here.

I've always tried to answer all questions, until someone starts whining that i do that is. Can't say that i see a similar commitment from you though.

"I can't see the point in harshly punishing the women who get them, my focus would be on the abortion doctors who break the law. I expect revoking their license to practice and a hefty fine would be in itself a strong deterrent (the motive is chiefly financial, isn't it?) but there's no reason not to punish criminally with jail time, if that would help."

Just like in the kermit gosnell case right. And to cut to the chase, your earlier hypothetical wasn't even half likely, the bit about eradicating late-term abortions that is. If anyone agreed to that sort of compromise they'd end up with what we have today, millions killed off and abortion being neither safe, legal nor rare. You might as well just come out and be honest about the issue, that abortion should be on-demand, anytime, anywhere and fully funded by the taxpayer.

"a) your scenario is vanishingly unlikely andb) it's not the victims' job to determine punishment. Since I'm not a judge, my opinion on this is as irrelevant as yours."

For someone with such strong opinions it's amazing how uncomfortable you seemed to answer the question. And it was a hypothetical question, i wasn't under some sort of illusion that you would become a judge or something. Yes i agree, your opinion is irrelevant, just like your earlier hypothetical question.

"Just for fun, maybe I'd think of it as if the woman had lost the use of a limb?"

Maybe? a limb, not a definite. Wow, so somewhere between a loose tooth and a finger/toe i guess, well it's an improvement from 'at most a reptilian brain', nice to know how much your child means to you.

"Can't say that i see a similar commitment from you though."I didn't undertake one: I entered the thread principally to answer Silverfiddle, not you. Nice whining though, MK.

"You might as well just come out and be honest about the issue, that abortion should be on-demand, anytime, anywhere and fully funded by the taxpayer."No, I said before that the UK law is roughly in the right ballpark. Look it up if you're interested.

"your earlier hypothetical wasn't even half likely, the bit about eradicating late-term abortions that is."I asked it to tease from you whether you recognise that 8-month abortions are worse than 2-month abortions. You are apparently blind to any difference (some of you even going so far as to claim there's no difference between the 8-month termination and the morning after pill).

The purpose of your question, on the other hand, is to reveal that I'm a thumb-sucking bed-wetting liberal who doesn't want the state to execute people. You already know that though.

"For someone with such strong opinions it's amazing how uncomfortable you seemed to answer the question."I recognise the scope and scale of my own ignorance: you'd do well to do assess your own.

"Maybe? a limb, not a definite."Don't know what you're trying to say here. Specifying the limb merely piles irrelevant detail upon irrelevant legal principle, but I was thinking of something like an arm. (I'm riffing on the idea of the fetus as extension of the woman's body).

"well it's an improvement from 'at most a reptilian brain'"I'm sorry you have a problem with the factual level of development of a 2-month-old foetus. Are you convinced that you were capable of high-level human cognitive function at 2 months after conception? Or even capable of low-level mammalian function? I'm sorry to break it to you, but the good news is most people grow out of the reptilian stage -- there's hope for you yet!

"nice to know how much your child means to you."What she means to me isn't what we're talking about. Obviously, your child is the most important person in the world, but not so to me; and the same is true in reverse. What she means to me is entirely useless to talk about because we already know that it's the most subjective question I could possibly answer.You only bring it up to troll, and I really shouldn't indulge you.