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Why not? The thing will probably get 40MPG and if you are just putzing around a large city you are only going 20 feet at a time so who cares if it can't rip your face off accelerating onto some suburban highway?

I kind of agree that one 2 liter I4 turbo is enough. And that 180hp for this engine is not really cool and BMWesque today. My 2 liter 1988 SAAB 9000 Turbo had 175hp. That's over 20 years ago...
So nothing wrong with a turbo 4-banger but a nutured one with 20 year old performance numbers is not so cool. I'd rather seen a 1.5 liter high-tech, cool fuel sipping 3-cylinder with that hp.

Why is this shocking or a "sell out"? Non-M BMWs were typically never the quickest (0-60, 1/4 mile) cars in their class, until the N54 came along and the turbo-charged engines that followed.

Look up E36, E46, E60, etc. straight line stats for the entry-level I4 and I6 models.

It was always about handling, steering, balance, and the overall (driving) dynamics.

^^^^This. And BMW makes 118i and 318i and all kinds of smaller engined cars for sale in most other countries than the U.S. So nothing new, except that they may be bringing one of them to the U.S....big deal.

Why is this shocking or a "sell out"? Non-M BMWs were typically never the quickest (0-60, 1/4 mile) cars in their class, until the N54 came along and the turbo-charged engines that followed.

Look up E36, E46, E60, etc. straight line stats for the entry-level I4 and I6 models.

It was always about handling, steering, balance, and the overall (driving) dynamics.

I agree with that. I loved E46, E36 models.

However, this time around, BMW is not a leader in driving dynamics either with soulless steering, so-so braking & grips due to RFT, overweight (on models above 3-series), throttle response delay on some models, etc.

However, this time around, BMW is not a leader in driving dynamics either with soulless steering, so-so braking & grips due to RFT, overweight (on models above 3-series), throttle response delay on some models, etc.

Don't knock it til you've driven it. Seems like the F30 will remain one of the best drivers in its class.

I have driven F30 at BMW event. Although F30 335i sport line is sportier than F10 535i and non-sport line F30s, it's still not as engaging to drive as older E46/E36 anymore.

And that will never be the case. There has rarely been a BMW that has been more "connected" or as "engaging" as its predecessors.

There is literally no way BMW could ever build and successfully sell an e36/46* in 2013 and beyond. The world has simply changed too much. The regulatory/safety/emissions/mpg requirements the new cars have to comply with and the tech expected in the marketplace make it impossible.

Lets be realistic about what can be built and sold in sufficient numbers today before this turns into a nostalgia/pedestal-placement exercise like Lincoln guys bemoaning the demise of their full-size Continentals with equally full chrome treatments

PS: why stop there? Why not compare an f30 to an even more impossible standard such as the light weight and engaging driving dynamics of an e30?

And that will never be the case. There has rarely been a BMW that has been more "connected" or as "engaging" as its predecessors.

There is literally no way BMW could ever build and successfully sell an e36/46* in 2013 and beyond. The world has simply changed too much. The regulatory/safety/emissions/mpg requirements the new cars have to comply with and the tech expected in the marketplace make it impossible.

Lets be realistic about what can be built and sold in sufficient numbers today before this turns into a nostalgia/pedestal-placement exercise like Lincoln guys bemoaning the demise of their full-size Continentals with equally full chrome treatments

PS: why stop there? Why not compare an f30 to an even more impossible standard such as the light weight and engaging driving dynamics of an e30?

I don't agree with you, nor do the magazines who have been beating up the current 3 series. It seems that even Cadillac is building a car that beats the 3 series in driving dynamics. BMW has elected to build "kinder, gentler" cars that are less engaging from a enthusiast driving perspective. That is BMW's new marketing direction. I'm not saying its bad btw. But it was BMW's decision, not a changed world.

I'm driving a 328 loaner. I rather like it, although the seats totally suck. It feels alive and lithe, and this is a "no line" bare bones stripper.

Not sure I like this move. This is cheap and easy way out....essentially software change on the engine, hard to see how you could de-content any more from base model 328 unless you started offering manual windows and seats..... Would like to have seen little petrol engine (1.5L or smaller) but that's a pipe dream.

In any event, I don't view this as a sellout at all.

I also note that the F10 drives like my dad's old 7 series, while this F30 drives like my old E39 5 series.

There is literally no way BMW could ever build and successfully sell an e36/46* in 2013 and beyond.

not true imo. BMW has simply gone soft and is going where the money is. For every enthusiast driver, there are 50 more who just want a badge and a smooth riding car. They don't care about lateral g's or 0-60 times, only status and prestige.

It's a mean thing to say but just look at the current complaints for the 5 and 3, it's noticeably bigger than the predecessor and has lost its edge. This is a sad trend that will continue, I want to give bmw money to replace my 8.5 yr old e46, but they have nothing in their wares that compares to it.

I don't agree with you, nor do the magazines who have been beating up the current 3 series. It seems that even Cadillac is building a car that beats the 3 series in driving dynamics. BMW has elected to build "kinder, gentler" cars that are less engaging from a enthusiast driving perspective. That is BMW's new marketing direction. I'm not saying its bad btw. But it was BMW's decision, not a changed world.

If you think any manufacturer is going to build an e30/36/46 type sport sedan in today's world, lets just say you'll be waiting a long time.

If you don't think the reg/Safety/emissions/mpg context of the automotive world has changed since those cars were designed, there's probably nothing I can say that will change your mind

While the press calling pretty much every new BMW less engaging and driver-oriented than its predecessor is nothing new, the f10 got it a lot harder than the f30 from what I read. Yet most people on this forum are driving one. If an impartial observer wanted to determine at which point in the 21st century BMW changed and "sold out" they would probably pinpoint the design of the f10 as a much more luxury-oriented car appealing to a larger audience and the election to move away from an e60 type driver experience.

PS every generation of 3 series going back to e90/46/36 has lost a magazine comparison at some point. Those were generally exceptions to the rule but happened nonetheless. If everyone chose cars by magazine results, certainly no one here would drive an f10.

If you think any manufacturer is going to build an e30/36/46 type sport sedan in today's world, lets just say you'll be waiting a long time.

If you don't think the reg/Safety/emissions/mpg context of the automotive world has changed since those cars were designed, there's probably nothing I can say that will change your mind

While the press calling pretty much every new BMW less engaging and driver-oriented than its predecessor is nothing new, the f10 got it a lot harder than the f30 from what I read. Yet most people on this forum are driving one. If an impartial observer wanted to determine at which point in the 21st century BMW changed and "sold out" they would probably pinpoint the design of the f10 as a much more luxury-oriented car appealing to a larger audience and the election to move away from an e60 type driver experience.

PS every generation of 3 series going back to e90/46/36 has lost a magazine comparison at some point. Those were generally exceptions to the rule but happened nonetheless. If everyone chose cars by magazine results, certainly no one here would drive an f10.

You don't have to convince me that government regs have changed - I know an enormous amount about cars and the regulations they are facing. But that is NOT what is causing BMW to change the dynamics of their cars. First of all, every manufacturer is faced with the same challenges. But horsepower and fuel economy are both getting better - not worse. I get that manufacturers are going to more fuel efficient engines - but performance across the board is getting better, not worse. Hell, cars are not even getting heavier because manufacturers are using more light weight materials and better structural engineering.

Honestly I'm not even sure what your point is. BMW is clearly going a different direction with their cars (at least leaning a little further to the right). Read the comparison tests between the 2013 Lexus GS350 and the BMW 535. Lexus is up against the same government regulations, but that car is now the benchmark for handling and overall driving dynamics in it's class.

BTW, I'll repeat that I'm not knocking BMW. I traded a 2010 Lexus for my 550 and have no regrets. I just don't think you can make a case that government regulations are the issue beyond the fact that they are now offering a smaller, more fuel efficient engine. But that has not been your point all along as best as I can tell.