Stratics Veteran

I love how it started that you're unattended, and then it switched to how you're not supposed to "set up the game to repeat skills constantly just to raise them". Dude, don't you have to click or run your macro program to gain at any tme?
Is that guy ********?

It's been great, for me, actually.
Usually when I train skills, I get someone come up to me every few hours. Sometimes they say "hi", or they just stand there, expecting you to respond to satisfy their "guilty until proven innocent" thing.

I haven't seen a single person checking up on me since SA, and I've been training skills more than usual.
Either they're not looking, because they know there's no scripts. Or, the new SA content is amusing them more than their UO Police metagame.
Either way, I'm happy as a pig.

Stratics Veteran

I macro attended all the time, I don't even have a problem with unattended macroers I can care less what skill level another persons character is, what I do have a problem with is with unattended resource/gold farmers.

Why did u even bother to answer? Ingorelist is there for a reason...
The only one I respond to if I am macroing will be the GM who pulls me in jail and asks if I am there.
All the other wannabe deputies can go straight to hell...

Stratics Veteran

Last night in the hallway puzzle room, I'm just killin time and working up my Spirit Speak and Med Skill on my Necro.

Some guy comes in, and works the puzzle (I assume) and after about 3 minutes, he says to someone else...

"That Morgan Le Faye chick is unattended macroing. I paged."

So then I instantly write back, "No I'm not, I'm here."

He's like "Don't you know it's illegal to set up the game to repeat skills constantly just to raise them?"

I reply with, "Actually you can set a macro up to repeat skill use, but every SS and Med I'm doing I am doing with mouse clicks, if you must know."

A pause, "Well you still shouldnt be able to do that. I bet you're probably playing another game or surfing the web."

"No, I just have UO up. I'm just hammering my skill hotbar."

"**** You, I'm still paging. Cheater."

"Suit yourself."

After a bit he goes outside the door and starts to trigger traps, apparently to damage me with the boulder drops. I just heal. I even heal him.

Then I guess he tired of it and left.

Ah, UO.

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Those guys tickle me. As soon as you speak to them they pretty much should have enough sense to go away. They will argue with you for 20 minutes calling you every sort of name in uo. I'm thinking they really don't understand that unattended means you aren't there.

This is kinda my thought. If someone is that obsessed to page on me and sit around hoping to see me jailed, it's a lot more satisfying to just deal with the GM if and when he shows up so that said pager does the whole, "WTF! GMs don't do anything in this game!" thing.

Stratics Veteran

I answer when people run up to me because I've sat in the help queue for ages before. I really don't want to contribute to the queue being longer than it has to be. It doesn't take much effort to type "hello" or even "hi" so....

This is kinda my thought. If someone is that obsessed to page on me and sit around hoping to see me jailed, it's a lot more satisfying to just deal with the GM if and when he shows up so that said pager does the whole, "WTF! GMs don't do anything in this game!" thing.

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See you're thinking about this all wrong.

We don't page on you because we want to see you jailed, no no.

We page on you because we want you to STOP CHEATING. (Not you you but you in general)

And I agree that GMs used to do very little, but they seem to be doing an excellent job lately.

We page on you because we want you to STOP CHEATING. (Not you you but you in general)

And I agree that GMs used to do very little, but they seem to be doing an excellent job lately.

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Well, I'm sure there are those who go around tattling on their neighbors with only the purest of intentions, but there are definitely those who page as a form of self-righteous amusement. IMO it's a form of griefing. And if your intention is merely to make UO the very pinnacle of honest and manual gaming, then no harm no foul -- the GM will check up on me, I'll tell him what color my robes are, and he'll be on his way. If, on the other hand, you (and I don't mean you personally, of course) are the sort who gets your (same) jollies out of paging on folks, hoping to see them jailed, well, I'll get my self-righteous amusement from foiling your attempt.

He's like "Don't you know it's illegal to set up the game to repeat skills constantly just to raise them?"

A pause, "Well you still shouldnt be able to do that. I bet you're probably playing another game or surfing the web."

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I love it.

Also, by that logic, I´m a hardcore scripter.

Like training arms lore and item id with a macro, then putting a book on the key the macro is bound to and reading another book. Or watching a DVD while playing UO. I´m attended macroing, which is still legal, no?

Like training arms lore and item id with a macro, then putting a book on the key the macro is bound to and reading another book. Or watching a DVD while playing UO. I´m attended macroing, which is still legal, no?

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Attended macroing is fine. In fact I often have a window up with Windows Media Player, watching Tales from the Darkside or something, but UO is still at the forefront.

The big problem comes when someone sets up a repeating macro, sets it on a loop and gets up and goes off to work, to come home and find their skill is now at 100.

Stratics Veteran

There should be a punishment for incorrectly turning people in for macroing. I was working inscription in my house. All the sudden I get message from GM... "how are the skill gains coming?" Ah....slow!?! "Ok then... have a great day and thanks for playing."

Stratics Veteran

Never having seen a GM, how do you respond to these etheral messages anyway? Just plain speak and they see it?

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The last time I talked to a GM (unrelated to the current topic) they asked me to type [ before I replied. Or maybe it was one of the slashes, I forget. But it should pop up and say "type [ to respond" and works like guild or party chat I guess.

Stratics VeteranAlumniStratics Legend

Oh no, I lost a couple seconds of skill gaining time by saying "hi."
lol

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Multiplied by 50 during the day and they better have conversation cause expect to be there a long time while I not only say hi back to you but start talking about poilitics,astronomy,how to grow real plants,stocks,tv movies,my girlfirend and anything else i can think about. Then everytime I see them i'll strike the same conversation again until they learn to run away when they see my characters name on the screen

Last night in the hallway puzzle room, I'm just killin time and working up my Spirit Speak and Med Skill on my Necro.

Some guy comes in, and works the puzzle (I assume) and after about 3 minutes, he says to someone else...

"That Morgan Le Faye chick is unattended macroing. I paged."

So then I instantly write back, "No I'm not, I'm here."

He's like "Don't you know it's illegal to set up the game to repeat skills constantly just to raise them?"

I reply with, "Actually you can set a macro up to repeat skill use, but every SS and Med I'm doing I am doing with mouse clicks, if you must know."

A pause, "Well you still shouldnt be able to do that. I bet you're probably playing another game or surfing the web."

"No, I just have UO up. I'm just hammering my skill hotbar."

"**** You, I'm still paging. Cheater."

"Suit yourself."

After a bit he goes outside the door and starts to trigger traps, apparently to damage me with the boulder drops. I just heal. I even heal him.

Then I guess he tired of it and left.

Ah, UO.

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That really sucks. What a churl.

I had something similar happen to me when I was mining by my house. An IDOC was getting ready to fall near where I was mining. Every time I would recall into the area, a couple of the IDOCers would place objects where I'd recall. I kept having to run back and move the items so I could recall.

Even after speaking with them - explaining that I was simply mining, not interfering with their IDOC - they accused me of scripting. They paged on me. A GM, via chat, asked me if I was unattended. I responded that I was not. End of story...almost.

I was really annoyed that they'd paged on me, after I'd spoken with them. I went to the Delucia, Luna, and Moonglow mage shops and purchased 50 runes. I marked these 50 runes around their IDOC and deposited said runes in every major city and gate. I also supplied gates to the IDOC from the Luna bank. Eventually, I think the entire Atlantic shard was stationed outside their IDOC.

I know I'm an evil person...and now you all know it, too. Don't page on folks unless they are actually deserving. Remember, the person you're paging might be spiteful, malicious me.

Well, I'm sure there are those who go around tattling on their neighbors with only the purest of intentions, but there are definitely those who page as a form of self-righteous amusement. IMO it's a form of griefing. And if your intention is merely to make UO the very pinnacle of honest and manual gaming, then no harm no foul -- the GM will check up on me, I'll tell him what color my robes are, and he'll be on his way. If, on the other hand, you (and I don't mean you personally, of course) are the sort who gets your (same) jollies out of paging on folks, hoping to see them jailed, well, I'll get my self-righteous amusement from foiling your attempt.

It's all fun and games, IMO.

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"Well, I'm sure there are those who go around tattling on their neighbors with only the purest of intentions, but there are definitely those who page as a form of self-righteous amusement."

Just as you are SURE that people tattle for both "pure intentions" and "as a form of self-righteous amusement", I am SURE that people cheat. I am just as SURE that no one has to cheat to play UO and enjoy it.

If I say Hi to test if a player is present at their keyboard while performing actions and I get no response then I feel I am not paging on a player I am paging on a SCRIPT, because no 'player' is actually present.

"If, on the other hand, you (and I don't mean you personally, of course) are the sort who gets your (same) jollies out of paging on folks, hoping to see them jailed, well, I'll get my self-righteous amusement from foiling your attempt. "

I also can tell if you are a scripter or not after I page on you. If for 3 days I don't see your char after I page on you for suspected scripting then I peg you as a scripter. And I will hope you learned your lesson and won't ever do it again, but if I find you are I will page on you again.

If I DO NOT see your character take a 3 day vacation then I might monitor your char for a couple more days then pass you as a NONscripter, never to bother you again for the same reason.

Works for me.

Although I am surprised that in a multi player game so many people feel they can't be bothered to even say hi anymore to another player.

Maybe the next Ultima expansion ought to be a console game titled Ultima Offline?

If you feel the need to police my policing of other folks then maybe you should learn the rules before you try to tell me how to follow them?

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Physical harassment constitutes using game mechanics to prevent other people from enjoying gameplay. Players cannot recall in or out of Heartwood - instead, they must walk. Accordingly, building a maze around players inhibits them from being able to move in and out of the area with the ease that they would otherwise be entitled to. This is absolutely physical harassment.

If you would like to report someone, fine. However, you cannot subject other players to mazes just because you feel like it. Aside from being rude, this is an act of physical harassment.

If I were cheating, and people accused me of cheating, I wouldn't complain about it here. It's so much easier to just not post, than complain about someone being right about me.
No, the foundation of my complaint is the "guilty until proven innocent" stance, requiring everyone suspected to justify themselves to the busybody's (lack of) authority.

You could add to that, that should you remain quiet when they expect you to give evidence of your attendance, you become subject to all manner of abuses. But, should you appease their presumptive expectations by responding, they won't apologise for their false presumption, or veiled accusation.
If they did that, then I might respect them, a little.

Stratics Veteran

Physical harassment constitutes using game mechanics to prevent other people from enjoying gameplay. Players cannot recall in or out of Heartwood - instead, they must walk. Accordingly, building a maze around players inhibits them from being able to move in and out of the area with the ease that they would otherwise be entitled to. This is absolutely physical harassment.

If you would like to report someone, fine. However, you cannot subject other players to mazes just because you feel like it. Aside from being rude, this is an act of physical harassment.

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This is where you are wrong. If I am attended then all I have to do is move whatever is blocking my path. His maze becomes a nonmaze to attended players.

Stratics Veteran

...
No, the foundation of my complaint is the "guilty until proven innocent" stance, requiring everyone suspected to justify themselves to the busybody's (lack of) authority.

You could add to that, that should you remain quiet when they expect you to give evidence of your attendance, you become subject to all manner of abuses. But, should you appease their presumptive expectations by responding, they won't apologise for their false presumption, or veiled accusation.
...

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This is by no means restricted to UO. Everquest suffer these people as well.

Some how, they get it in their head that the ToS demands that you respond to every Tom, **** and Harry that see's you.

It really is a shame there is no effective means to deal with these people.

There are just enough AFK people doing questionable things, that these people have just enough credibility to have people investigated.

When all is said and done, they are a significant part of why I chose a Low Population Server. So I could avoid them.

It is really sad to see just how mean spirited and punitive some UO players are.

A parent is playing UO and raising Meditation with a script, the kids want to know if they can watch something on TV. The parent takes a few minutes to resolve out the issue.

Yeah, man burn that person at the stake. Have Hell have a special place for them. They single handedly ruined all of UO for everyone. Ban em for life.

I repeat, it is really sad to see just how mean spirited and punitive some UO players are.

i think it is right that as long as here is a path it's not a violation,same as mobs if you find a area they will not walk around and nail them it's all good you build a wall they can't get threw it's a violation

If you feel the need to police my policing of other folks then maybe you should learn the rules before you try to tell me how to follow them?

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Physical harassment constitutes using game mechanics to prevent other people from enjoying gameplay. Players cannot recall in or out of Heartwood - instead, they must walk. Accordingly, building a maze around players inhibits them from being able to move in and out of the area with the ease that they would otherwise be entitled to. This is absolutely physical harassment.

If you would like to report someone, fine. However, you cannot subject other players to mazes just because you feel like it. Aside from being rude, this is an act of physical harassment.

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"Physical harassment constitutes using game mechanics to prevent other people..."

Well I guess I just lucked out that the char who walked over my candelabra wasn't being operated by a "people" it was being operated by a script while the "people" who owned the char was most likely snuggled up asleep in his bed.

"Aside from being rude..."

Is it not rude to sign a formal agreement and then break it?

As in he signed the TOS and agreed to not use unapproved 3rd party programs yet he was surely using 2 at the minimum, one to do the Heartwood fletching quest and another that allowed him to walk over candelabra when players can not normally do that.

What is even more interesting is I have now caught in the same guild on Pac, this guy using 2 programs while afk, another guy using an afk taming script, last year a female character who was using 3 accounts to pull in 4000 smith/tailor bods per week (had to report her at least 3 times until the 2 junk accounts she used poofed, though she seems to have set herself back up again because she is selling bless deeds again), and one other fellow in the same guild was attacked while afk at Luna bank by an ally and it took quite some time for the ally to kill him as he kept auto-healing though he never moved except to face his attacker.

At least our dumbest Pac scripters are all joining the same guild, which is super in my opinion, since it makes it that much easier to keep an eye on them.

And oh yes, they are a pvp guild, so if they're cheating their asses off in Tram, they're surely doing it in Fel.

Not quite sure why they or any cheaters feel they can't compete unless they cheat. I guess they just suck?

"Accordingly, building a maze around players inhibits them from being able to move in and out of the area with the ease..."

This part just makes me giggle seeing as how EASE(ily) afk guy glided over those candelabras whilst the other player there besides myself had to stop and move them around.

Once I explained to the other guy what I was doing he had no problems with it.

Of course afk guy had no problems with it BECAUSE HE WASN'T ACTUALLY THERE TO SEE ANY CANDELABRA.

I think these people that run around trying to find people doing something wrong have way too much time on their hands. I can understand if you see someone you know is scripting such as all the bod scripters, mining scripters, heartwood scripters ect. Now when you craft you can even set the item to be made up to 100 times even in the reg client now. So is that macroing? If i am sitting there using what the game provides and I choose not to speak to someone why should i be unattended? Why do I have to speak to every Tom, **** and Harry that has nothing better to do them run around looking to harrass someone that isnt bothering anyone? If I am sitting at my puter and set my smith to make 100 of something and then i am also surfing the web is that unattended macroing? I am sitting here, i am physically doing the clicks and imputting the numbers for what the game asks and I am checking back and forth btw the game and surfing. Some people really need to get a life of better yet, open the door and go outside, there is a real UO out there, hehe

If I were cheating, and people accused me of cheating, I wouldn't complain about it here. It's so much easier to just not post, than complain about someone being right about me.
No, the foundation of my complaint is the "guilty until proven innocent" stance, requiring everyone suspected to justify themselves to the busybody's (lack of) authority.

You could add to that, that should you remain quiet when they expect you to give evidence of your attendance, you become subject to all manner of abuses. But, should you appease their presumptive expectations by responding, they won't apologise for their false presumption, or veiled accusation.
If they did that, then I might respect them, a little.

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"...busybody's..."

You say potato I say potatoe?

I call them people who still care about UO you call them busybodys.

"You could add to that, that should you remain quiet when they expect you to give evidence of your attendance..."

It seems as though you are saying, that the game would be so much better if we all simply ignored cheaters so that a noncheater is never accidentally mistaken for a cheater and might be expected to say a simple hi if asked?

It seems reasonable to assume that a noncheater would appreciate and respect the work other noncheaters are doing to help make the game a more level playing field.

So I don't understand this part of your argument at all really.

"...you become subject to all manner of abuses."

You do understand that if you are abused ingame there are steps you can take to stop the abuse?

Same rules apply to anyone breaking the rules, be it scripter, duper or harasser.

I gather from your post that you just don't have time and or can't be bothered to worry about cheaters, even so much as to type a hi in response to a strange players greeting, just in case they accidentally mistook you for a cheater you shall simply REFUSE to answer them!

I actually got bold with the last suspected afk miner I bumped into. I went right up to her in Fel and said hi and I stood there,

Waiting to die.

Or for the char to say hi back.

Or for it to recall away quickly.

All it did was mine, smelt on its fire beetle.

So yes, I paged.

Within 30 minutes I just happened to see some red letters pop up in the lower left hand corner of my screen in between the squiggles from my last object last target macro.

Yeah I was holding my finger on the squiggly button and starting mining then turning to watch tv for about 8-10 pick swings (by ear), before I looked back at the screen to see if I was overweight and ore was going on the ground.

So I very nearly missed it.

It was a GM asking me my pet's name.

I'm like WTF? I'm the pager not the pagee here.

So I hit enter and a long row of squiggles appeared over my head and I had to type in my pet's name which was: a g b.

GM says Oh that wasn't what I wanted to ask you. Thank you and enjoy your mining. (He probably wanted to know about my neon guildname, they got me the next day for that).

Well I was told a few days later by another player that someone got 3 days off because their miner scripter got caught and that was their ONLY account, they were pissed and felt like they lost too much money so now they were gonna close their Luna city vendor house.

I'm kinda dense so I replied: "All they lost was time, just 3 days off!"

Later I realized he meant they lost actual cash money because they had lost 3 days worth of scripted up ingots and gems to sell for cash.

So will I continue to*test* and page on someone I suspect is cheating? Why shouldn't I?

And since most pet names seem to be longer than the 2 letters in Hi most of the time, it seems it'd be easier just to say hi to someone who says hi to you, rather than typing your pets name or some other reply longer than hi to a GM question.

Also you do realize that by saying hi back you never know you just might be replying to, OMG, a new player who actually needs some help?

If you care about UO you wouldn't be a cheater, and cost the game money because people have to send GMs to catch you.

Same thing applies to wasting a GMs time because YOU know you aren't cheating but refuse to say hi to people who don't know. If you cared about UO you wouldn't want to cost the game money.

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