Are you Human? It Depends

I've been hearing it for a while now, but I didn't want to believe it - the idea is so twisted. Of course, what they've been doing in Palestine for decades, and in Lebanon more recently, amply demonstrates the proposition that one Jewish fingernail is worth more than a million Arab lives.

Oh, it's been denied and decried as antisemitic rumor and vitriole. And I didn't believe it myself. But, then I came across this statement on the current genocide in Lebanon, published yesterday in the San Fransisco Chronicle, by "Eran Lerman, a former colonel in Israeli military intelligence who is now director of the Jerusalem office of the American Jewish Committee."

"There are two radical views of how to deal with this challenge, a serious professional debate within the military community over which way to go," said Lerman.

"One is the air power school of thought, the other is the land-borne option. They create different dynamics and different timetables.

The crucial factor is that the air force concept is very methodical and almost by definition is slower to get results.

A ground invasion that sweeps Hezbollah in front of you is quicker, but at -->a much higher cost in HUMAN lifeand requiring the creation of a presence on the ground."

When he says "Human life" it's crystal clear that he's referring to Israeli lives, since only their casualties would necessarily increase with a ground invasion. But, why oh why would he refer to Israelis as "human" and not "Israeli" unless he were distinguishing them from others who he sees as "Sub-Human?"

Am I reading too much into it? I don't think so.

Zionists choose their words carefully. Everything turns on words. This is why they do anything and everything to control the media, dominating discourse and infusing it with their own definitions - distorting our culture and hijacking our minds.

'Terrorism' is terroristic only if they're the victims.

A 'militant' bears arms against them - a 'soldier', on their behalf.

'Democracy' is only in their favor.

'Freedom' - to obey their command.

'Proportionality' is only subjective.

'Fair return on investment' - whatever they demand.

In their new bold world, nothing is as it seems.

Now, even 'civilians' are not beyond their interpretation.

We need a new vocabulary to reflect the realities of modern warfare. A new phrase should be introduced into the reporting and analysis of current events in the Middle East: "the continuum of civilianality." Though cumbersome, this concept aptly captures the reality and nuance of warfare today and provides a more fair way to describe those who are killed, wounded and punished.

74 Comments:

I worked in Hollywood for close to two decades. Zionists control Hollywood -- open up the "Hollywood Creative Directory" TO ANY PAGE, and see for yourself.

The demonization of Muslims and Arabs in the U.S. entertainment industry began after the Six Day War (which Israel provoked and then played victim -- sound familiar?)

Before that it was the Germans -- anyone remember "Hogan's Heroes."

Any enemy of Israel is an enemy of Hollywood.

I say: ship every supporter of Israel, Jewish or *Christian*, (which would mean all of Congress -- woo-hoo!!!!) back to that benighted place, get the Palestinians out, THEN BLOW THE WHOLE F-ING PLACE UP.

Israel is going to kill us all -- I give that terrorist, rogue nation less than a year to truly bring on Armageddeon (sp? -- sorry, not a *Christian* Zionist...)

That's a nice intellectual fraud. We bomb your country, kill a few family members, oh my god you grab the gun to defend your child you're not a civilian anymore. And then on tv we have puppets expressing regrets and explaining that the terrorists hide among'st civilians. What a joke. What a dishonest farce they are serving, even if you don't want to take sides in this conflict, they really are pushing the enveloppe. What was Nuremberg for? If we're really serious about humanity's posterity, we'd better get our act together.About boycotts: If you're from North America, Canada and the US have free-trade agreements with Israel, if you're buying fruits and vegetables from a big grocery chain, chance is you could be buying israeli without knowing. Buy from local farmers if you can. Also, if you're buying lots of new clothes, you're helping the war machine. Buy used, recycle. Just follow the thread of fashion, and be surprised where it leads. Minimize the blood on your hands, try to make a list of boycott goods you identified in your region, pass it around.

Here is the main problem: Zionists do not consider non-Jews to be human beings.The root cause of Jewish Supremacism is that most Jews believe in the Talmud, where passages state than non-Jews are subhuman 'goyim', animals in human form, created by God to serve!Although some Jews (Ethiopian and Semitic) believe only in the Torah, most European Jews follow the racist teachings of the Talmud (written between 500 and 800 AD) and consider the Torah to nothing more than old legends. I believe Hitler and the racist Nazis got their ideas about the 'master race' from Jews.The Zionists belief that they are a 'chosen race' is absurd, especially since Jews are of several races.It doesn't matter whether we are European, African, East Asian, or whether we are Christian, Moslem, or Hindu - to the Zionists, our lives of no consequence.So lets all unite and resist our common enemies!

Jews control Hollywood: I've also worked in Hollywood for nearly two decades. I've worked for Fox, Warner Brothers, Disney, Dreamworks, NBC, ABC, and various small production companies. Jews do not control Hollywood. Money controls Hollywood. Money, and only Money. Every decision is "how much will we net." I've never worked for one Jewish producer who would not have green-lit an anti-Israel movie IF he thought he would make money on the project. The problem is, America as a whole doesn't buy outright anti-Israeli product. Mid-west America didn't exactly flock to "Paradise Now." The good news is they didn't flock to "Munich" either.

Does anyone know anything about Walter White Jr. who did the interveiw with Harold Rosenthal? What Rosenthal is reported to have said is incredibly bad. Israel's Shahak's book Jewish History, Jewish Religion supports the idea that Zionists and Talmudic Jews really feel and operate that way, but good Lord, I'd like a little more corroboration.

The Interview with Harold Wallace Rosenthalwww.iamthewitness.com/DarylBradfordSmith_Rosenthal.html

Jews control Hollywood: I've also worked in Hollywood for nearly two decades. I've worked for Fox, Warner Brothers, Disney, Dreamworks, NBC, ABC, and various small production companies. Jews do not control Hollywood. Money controls Hollywood. Money, and only Money. Every decision is "how much will we net." I've never worked for one Jewish producer who would not have green-lit an anti-Israel movie IF he thought he would make money on the project. The problem is, America as a whole doesn't buy outright anti-Israeli product. Mid-west America didn't exactly flock to "Paradise Now." The good news is they didn't flock to "Munich" either.

Sat Jul 22, 02:39:00 PM EDT

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yes, that is the truth. Even though they don't own >94%, they CONTROL >94% of ALL MEDIA IN THE USA, and slightly less in EUROPE, and even less in other parts of the world.

They control it by having PROXIES, or >50% share, or control of Board of Directors (BOD), or control of Executive (e.g. Michael Eisner, Rupert Murdoch, etc), or through Racketeering or Blackmail, etc.

The one thing they have NO grasp of is the INTERNET --- this is a democratic, voice of the people of the world. We need to advance it to such as stage that:

1) We have our OWN wires, and wireless network --- this can easily be done using the Peer-to-Peer model, whereby we form an ad-hoc wireless/wired network.

2) We use ANONYMOUS P2P technology --- to prevent "censorship" by the Zionists

3) We use ENCRYPTION --- the Zionists will be able to "intercept" our communications. Using encryption on ALL our communication will significantly slow those bastards down, since they will be wasting their time 'decoding' all communication, even useless ones.

There are several projects being worked on to achieve the above 3 goals for ALL users. If you're a hacker, or have financial clout, considering HELPING PRESERVE FREE, OPEN, UN-CENSORED COMMUNICATION EXISTS FOR ALL PEOPLE IN THE FUTURE.

Let's work our hardest to keep the Internet as Free as possible for the future to come!

Fight Fire with Fire- One can simply turn the tables and rephrase that whole question. Are WE the only HUMANS? How can that designation ever be applied to these self-chosen "others" ,( notice I don't say self-chosen PEOPLE ), when their horrendous deeds give every indication that they are NOT HUMAN. The whole concept of a greater HUMANITY implies a certain amount of empathy for one's fellow HUMAN BEINGS, of which they have NONE. So as you broach the whole sorry subject of "the HUMAN RACE", you might as well open the whole can of worms. There are several major races of MAN, and there are countless lesser ethnicities, shall we say. All HUMAN, so to speak. These "others" have set their OWN selves apart from all the great races and ethnicities of MANKIND, and in turn burdened the whole of HUMAN-KIND with an accusation of RACISM against THEM, while THEY are the very originators of the scourge of RACISM from the very beginning. This fault in the creation cuts much deeper into the flesh of HUMANKIND than most of us ever realize, until the bodies of our very own children are hacked to pieces before our very eyes. RACISM is one evil. TERRORISM is a brother. But this BARBARISM we now witness is way off the charts for so-called CIVILIZED HUMANITY. It's all very simple, in a very DIABOLICAL way, but everyone of us who consider ourselves HUMAN, must find out for themselves, on their own, what this elemental BATTLE of GOOD and EVIL is all about. BY THEIR DEEDS SHALL YE KNOW THEM. Sorry, yes-THEM. ( P.S.- Rebbe Dershowitz's ravings are not fit for anyone else to hear but his own miserable congregation.)

The Jews obviously control Hollywood. Like director Spike Lee said, you aren't permitted to portray any Jewish person with the slightest flaw.

Arabs are always portrayed in a negative way, as are Germans and usually (because Jews don't like them for some reason) the English.

Marlon Brando, one of the most talented actors ever, couldn't find work in Hollywood after he said that "Jews run Hollywood".

Untalented and unattractive people are given major roles and are strongly promoted because of they happen to be Jewish.

Movies written and directed by Jews are heavily advertised and promoted, so people will go to see them even if they aren't worth watching (such as War of the Worlds and United 93, or real sickening garbage such as Dead Ringers and Crash by David Cronenburg and Lolita by Stanley Kubrick).

Murdoch's now supporting Hitlery Clinton who last week addressed a pro-Israel rally in NYC telling Israel that all Americans are behind Israel's genocide. NOT.

Number to Hitlery Clinton's D.C. office -- 202 224 4451

If that mail box is full call Madame Herr Clinton at her NYC office:

212 688 6262

Simple message:

"Senator Clinton, it appears you want to be President of the United States. I will rally everyone I know to work and raise funds against your ambitions unless you stop Israel on Monday from continuing its genocide on the Palestinians and the Lebanese. You represent the U.S. and not Israel, it's time you remember it before your efforts on behalf of Israel launch World War III."

Send the same message to John Kerry except change the name -- Kerry just pleged alligiance to Israel on Friday for the millionth time:

Dershowitz did not say that Israelis are better than Lebanese. READ THE ARTICLE FOR YOURSELF. He said that many of the so-called "civilians" in fact were aiding and abetting the terrorists and hence are not "civilians" in any real sense of the word. Don't believe me?

'Disaffected Youth' is a racist Zionist who believes non-Jewish lives don't matter. She strongly approves of the deliberate killing of Lebanese and Palestinian civilians by the Israeli war machine, because she believes that she is a member of the Chosen Race, and we are all just subhuman goyim.

But nooooooo that would mean that the Palestinian and Hezbollah terrorist monsters would not be able to play the victim card anymore. Can't have that, can we?

Instead, they would prefer to use civilians as human shields, and then cry crocodile tears when they are killed.

Might I add that qrswave's obsession with the dead bodies is pornographic. She also was recently cited by David Duke's website. Not a surprise, since her posts have been Nazi-ish in character recently.

http://www.davidduke.com/wp-print.php?p=648

Actually, at this point, I wouldn't be surprised if qrswave posted that on David Duke's website herself. Would not surprise me one iota.

I repeat. Qrswave, you have lied again and again, but your misquoting of Dershowitz is just so obvious and proveably wrong, it is laughable. If you actually care about the "truth," (which you don't), you would correct yourself. But you don't care about the truth, do you?

You are a Nazi youth who believes Jews should be killed. I am not the one saying such hateful things. It is ironic that you call ME a racist, which I am not, when I would think that you would consider the label "racist" to be a compliment.

To all those such as qrswave and her ilk who either support terror or outright are terrorists, I have this to tell you.

Stop killing Israelis. Note: I say Israelis and not "Jews," because Druze, Arab Israelis, and Bedouins are being held captive to terror in equal measure.

Stop the killing, and then Israel will stop having to defend itself. It's really quite simple. Easy peasy!!

I really don't blame Israel for being what they are. Really, When Spain, Portugal, England & France conquered N America, did Germany, Russia, Poland etc call us animals? No. When European countries took over Africa did other countries bitch at them for taking what wasn't theirs? No.

If I could get the government & media of a powerful nation to make it's population feel guilty & do most of the dirty work & dying for me would I? Hell yes.

Why would any good leader send their own people off to die when you can get someone else to die for them? The Israeli leadership is doing exactly what the US, England & Canadian leadership OUGHT to be doing, & that is putting the interests of their OWN PEOPLE FIRST.

Israel has had a pretty tough time, just like everyone else at one point or another. Unlike a lot of people, they are willing to do whatever it takes, whether it be lie to & spy on allies, genocide, torture, kill the innocent, obscure & silence their crimes with claims of antisemitsm, etc. They are doing what is necessaryto accomplish their goals. Period.

Throughout history people have done the exact same thing as they are doing. Rome, European states, China, Japan, Nazi Germany, the list goes on.Only the failures are ever judged harshly in history.

Don't blame Israel, if any of us were in the exact same positoion we would likley act in a very similar fashion.They have had a lot of incidences in their hostory that reinforce the imperative to aquire & maintain a strong national territory of their own.

Don't blame the British & American politicians, they are doing what politicians have been doing forever: catering to those who offer the better deal.

Blame yourselves. Take a look at what you do. Your taxes pay for thier agression, your silence gives them licence. Everything that you do or do not do that helps them is YOUR CHOICE.

My point is, if you don't like the part you are taking in this chapter of history, blaming people will accomplish absolutely nothing. DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Voting will not work. Protesting in the streets will not work. Violence should be out of the question & will not work either.

You all need to follow the example you are given & organize yourself around a clear objective & FOLLOW THROUGH TO THE END.

For example...perhaps you might wish to identify what mechanisms you think are being used to manipulate your people.

************************************If you do decide you have a problem with Israel & wish to act on it, please, don't get a hate on for all Jews, it's wrong, distracting & it's counterproductive focus on fixing things, not hurting fellow people. ************************************

Focus on direct approaches, like finding out what companies are in your investment plans & removing all Israeli companies from them.

Call companies that advertise on Pro Israel & Pro War shows & state that their sponsorship of lies has caused you to cease using their products. Then ACTUALLY STOP BUYING THEM.

AIPAC only pays out about $20,000- $100,000 to a politician in campaign contributions. In the grand scheme of things that is Cheap. Organize, & raise funds to pay them more. Out-Bid the bastards. If you were a politician, what would you rather do? Take a bribe from someone you know doesn't have your people's best interests at heart, OR take a bribe from people in your own riding to actually do the right thing? Is it moral or right that you should have to do this? Of course not! But right & wrong have NO place in politics. Never has & it never will. Focus on what will or will not effect change. Get over it & "fund" yourself a public servant.

If you own a business, do not serve Politicians who you do not agree with or their supporters. Do not serve them food, or fix their sinks, or clean their clothes, or design their websites. If you feel strongly enough about this you will find a way to do without their business.

If someone abuses the term anti- semite, call them on it immediately & publicly. Ridicule them . Tell them to leave your presence. Turn the tables & make such people afraid to spew their lies. If someone is actually guilty of anti-semitism....do the same to them. Mere words will not work. Make it clear by action for all to see that there is, in fact a Difference between putting your own nation first & anti- semitism.

You have to be willing to do hard things to stop hard people. You must be strong & willing to do what it takes to put the politicians back in their place AT YOUR SIDE.

People know what they need to do but they are afraid. Stop it.

Forget the excuse that you are alone & alone you can't make a difference. Bull. Do what you need to do whenever you can, however you can & support anyone who is doing the same that you come across....Eventually , enough people will find each other to draw strength.

Forget the excuse that you need his or her money/business to eat. If you take their money, then money & food are more important to you, so stop whining.

Forget the excuse that if you speak out you will be branded an anti-semite. If you are genuinely criticizing what the State of Israel is doing & not picking on someone because their Jewish, you are NOT an anti-semite. Get over it & stop whining.

But, you say, they will call me that anyways & my reputation will be stained. Really? You would actually rather support something you don't believe in than have some jerkoff lie about you? If so, then avoiding the effort of standing up for yourself to a jerkoff is more important to you so Stop Whining.

If your friends actually shun you because of something someone says & they don't give you a chance to reason with them THEY ARE NOT YOUR FRIENDS, OR THEY ARE COWARDS. If you remain silent... then what other people think of you is more important to you, so Stop Whining.

In short, if you actually have an issue with what's going on stop whining & crying & DO SOMETHING. Action, money, & more action is the only thing that will do anything about this. EVERYTHING ELSE IS HOLLOW USELESS WHINING.

We all have 2 choices: Fight, or roll over & give up.

Note I didn't list Whining.

In the end the only freedom anyone has is to figure out for ourselves what consequences are aceptable to us. That is all the freedom anyone will ever need.

defecated tosser,your usual; you all hate Jews shit does not wash any more, further so fuck I hate Jews, I hate arrogant bastards, I hate Brussels Sprouts, Do I need some kind of permission or license to hate anything?

Now get lost and go read fecking gushing shit about the poor little suffering Jews!

Respect is earned, and not granted through winging, whining, and pity!

Disaffected youth- Sometimes it's not so simple. Resistance groups such as Hizbullah, are often operating independently from the local government. In fact, they are often more popular than the official army, because they are seen by the population as brave fighters who face the invaders. You have to admit at least that the israeli army does'nt really respect cease-fires, we just stop hearing about it in the news (remember the beach shelling of a family). Whether the Hamas used the tragedy as propaganda is'nt the point. The IDF fired on the beach, breaking the essential conditions for a cease-fire. So you cannot blame edgy underground terrorist organizations for not wanting to disarm. I think that if the North American people want to follow a different route than their government seems bent on following, they have a lot of peaceful means to disassociate themselves from a country's action they disapprove. As for Dershowitz's apologist text, he at least admits that a child will remain in the civilian category, though then we, according to his logic, would need to redefine 'child', because US troops recently reported being under orders to kill military age males. What's that, 15, 13? Where do we stop redefining targets? The war on terror truly allows militarism to dominate even the public discourse. Resistance is terrorism, civilians are collateral and might is right.

Chances are a Palestinian child will grow up to be a militant fighting for its homeland, and I have statistics to prove it. Palestinian women are going to bear children, so they should be sterilized and if they resist, kill them. It will protect Israel.

I would not have written what I wrote had it not crossed my limit, and all limit of logic. Had the Zionist movement any logical goals, I would not advocate the extermination of this ideology that is a successor to Nazism and born of it.

So, if the whole world now lined up against Israel, finally succeeds in exterminating Zionism, will there be any Jews remaining?

What is amazing to me is the size, in area, people, money, military equipment from Russia, China, support from all of the Islamic countries, Russia, and China, and the world still has Israel, the Jews, the Zionists, beating off everything the Godless people can throw at them. Sounds like the story of Gideon, and David and Goliath.It sure makes me think that the God of Israel is to be taken into consideration. I am not stupid enough to think that the Moon God of the Muslims, nor the no God of Evolutionists should even count. Something is wrong with this entire picture.Something tells me the rest of you idiots had better take a closer look at events and the outcome.

Dershowitz did not say that Israelis are better than Lebanese. READ THE ARTICLE FOR YOURSELF. He said that many of the so-called "civilians" in fact were aiding and abetting the terrorists and hence are not "civilians" in any real sense of the word. Don't believe me?

---------It's not a question of better. It is about what is implied in this article. Apparently, civilians who are caught in a warzone are complicit in terrorism if they decide to stay

Really? they are aiding & abetting terrorists? Funny, I thought that they were DEFENDING THEIR HOMES. Honestly, answer the question yes or no: do they or do they not have a right to defend their homes? Or is that a privilige reserved only for zionists?

Read it for yourself!http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-dershowitz22jul22,0,7685210.story?coll=la-opinion-rightrail-----Done & Done....here are a couple of exerpts & responses:

We need a new vocabulary to reflect the realities of modern warfare. A new phrase should be introduced into the reporting and analysis of current events in the Middle East: "the continuum of civilianality." Though cumbersome, this concept aptly captures the reality and nuance of warfare today and provides a more fair way to describe those who are killed, wounded and punished.

There is a vast difference — both moral and legal — between a 2-year-old who is killed by an enemy rocket and a 30-year-old civilian who has allowed his house to be used to store Katyusha rockets. Both are technically civilians, but the former is far more innocent than the latter. There is also a difference between a civilian who merely favors or even votes for a terrorist group and one who provides financial or other material support for terrorism.

------There is a HUGE moral distinction between an agressive Terrorist & someone doing what they have to to defend everything they have. When Israel is invaded by foreign armies, how will you feel knowing that you are a Terrorist for the simple act of defending your home?

Finally, there is a difference between civilians who are held hostage against their will by terrorists who use them as involuntary human shields, and civilians who voluntarily place themselves in harm's way in order to protect terrorists from enemy fire.

-------Are Israelis hostages? If not they are free to leave Israel. Israel is a contested territory. Even your onw leadership recognizes that. Do you simply expect these people to accept you on their land? This is a conquest, & I make no judgement on it. If you can hold onto what you took, you deserve it. But please, if you expect the other side to considered complicit, stop whining when you get bombed.

These differences and others are conflated within the increasingly meaningless word "civilian" — a word that carried great significance when uniformed armies fought other uniformed armies on battlefields far from civilian population centers. Today this same word equates the truly innocent with guilty accessories to terrorism.

-----I couldn't agree more on this issue, but remember that Israel is in the same situation. They have settled on contested land. It is tragic that any person period should die, but some people just choose to live in a risky situation.

It will, of course, be difficult for international law — and for the media — to draw the lines of subtle distinction routinely drawn by domestic criminal law. This is because domestic law operates on a retail basis — one person and one case at a time. International law and media reporting about terrorism tend to operate on more of a wholesale basis — with body counts, civilian neighborhoods and claims of collective punishment.

------ It is apparently IMPOSSIBLE for International law to deal with Israeli induced body counts, civilian neighborhoods and claims of collective punishment. Thak the US & its Veto power for that

But the recognition that "civilianality" is often a matter of degree, rather than a bright line, should still inform the assessment of casualty figures in wars involving terrorists, paramilitary groups and others who fight without uniforms — or help those who fight without uniforms.

Turning specifically to the current fighting between Israel and Hezbollah and Hamas, the line between Israeli soldiers and civilians is relatively clear.

------Please tell me where that line is.

Hezbollah missiles and Hamas rockets target and hit Israeli restaurants, apartment buildings and schools. They are loaded with anti-personnel ball-bearings designed specifically to maximize civilian casualties.

-----Israeli missiles and rockets target and hit non-Israeli restaurants, apartment buildings and schools. They are loaded with anti-personnel FLECHETTES designed specifically to maximize civilian casualties.

Hezbollah and Hamas militants, on the other hand, are difficult to distinguish from those "civilians" who recruit, finance, harbor and facilitate their terrorism. Nor can women and children always be counted as civilians, as some organizations do. Terrorists increasingly use women and teenagers to play important roles in their attacks.

----- AIPAC certainly count as "civilians" who recruit, finance, harbor and facilitate their state terrorism. I shouldn't be too hard to identify them are saying that they are legitimate targets then?------------

"The Israeli army has given well-publicized notice to civilians to leave those areas of southern Lebanon that have been turned into war zones. Those who voluntarily remain behind have become complicit. Some — those who cannot leave on their own — should be counted among the innocent victims."

--------Pease tell me Where these people are supposed to go exactly? Also, does that mean Israelis who are living on stolen land are complicit & thus legitimate targets? They don't all wear uniforms.------------

If the media were to adopt this "continuum," it would be informative to learn how many of the "civilian casualties" fall closer to the line of complicity and how many fall closer to the line of innocence.Every civilian death is a tragedy, but some are more tragic than others.

--------Typical. Tell me, are there some Israeli ciilian deaths that are more tragic than others as well? The media has arlrady adopted this continuum in the extreme. All Israelis are innocent, & all others are anti-semites that deserve whatever they get.

Btw, thanks for the hat tip re: Dershowitz. It will appear on Culture for All shortly.

At Sat Jul 22, 04:25:46 PM EDT, disaffected youth said...

Anon 4:18 pm:

In fact, the Christians are generally siding with the Israelis. http://www.exposetheleft.com/2006/07/19/brigitte-gabriel--------- Bit of a generalization there huh? "Brigitte Gabriel, originally a Lebanese citizen, now lives in the U.S. and encourages democracies in the Middle East. Gabriel, is pro-Israel and anti-Hezbollah."--------Brigitte Gabriel = ONE PERSON------------------------I guess one voice carries the weight of the world as long as it's pro Israel

Oh, you're fed up with Israel bombing Lebanon? SIMPLE SOLUTION.

-----It's the only simple solution Israel is looking for is a FINAL one to the Goyim problem

Return the captured soldiers. RETURN THEM AND THE WHOLE THING ENDS.----- No. Those soldiers were ARRESTED, not kidnapped, on the LEBANESE Side of the Border

But nooooooo that would mean that the Palestinian and Hezbollah terrorist monsters would not be able to play the victim card anymore. Can't have that, can we?

----------------Don't throw stones about playing the victim card, the hipocracy of this is incredible.

Instead, they would prefer to use civilians as human shields, and then cry crocodile tears when they are killed.

Might I add that qrswave's obsession with the dead bodies is pornographic. She also was recently cited by David Duke's website. Not a surprise, since her posts have been Nazi-ish in character recently.

http://www.davidduke.com/wp-print.php?p=648

Actually, at this point, I wouldn't be surprised if qrswave posted that on David Duke's website herself. Would not surprise me one iota.

I repeat. Qrswave, you have lied again and again, but your misquoting of Dershowitz is just so obvious and proveably wrong, it is laughable. If you actually care about the "truth," (which you don't), you would correct yourself. But you don't care about the truth, do you?

At Sat Jul 22, 04:28:40 PM EDT, disaffected youth said...

Michael Price:

You are a Nazi youth who believes Jews should be killed. I am not the one saying such hateful things. It is ironic that you call ME a racist, which I am not, when I would think that you would consider the label "racist" to be a compliment.

---------Calling someone a NAZI & dismissing arguments with terms Anti- Semite & Racist are hateful things as well. Do you have any proof of your allegation that he is a Nazi youth? If so state it. If not, then please, use FACTS & reason to combat his viiews. Don't bother trying to shut him up with slurs.

To all those such as qrswave and her ilk who either support terror or outright are terrorists, I have this to tell you.

Stop killing Israelis. Note: I say Israelis and not "Jews," because Druze, Arab Israelis, and Bedouins are being held captive to terror in equal measure.

Stop the killing, and then Israel will stop having to defend itself. It's really quite simple. Easy peasy!!

Disaffected Youth:

You are a ZIONIST who apparently believes Non-Jews should simply accept their situaion & surrender totally to the will of Israel. I am not the one saying such hateful things. I am speaking with indignation. It is ironic that you call anyone who is anti-zion an anti-semite or a racist, which I am not, when I would think that you would consider the label "rabid zionist" to be a compliment.

------------- To all those such as Disaffected Youth and her ilk who either support Israeli terror.

Stop killing NON-Israelis. Note: I say NON-Israelis and not "Arabs," because Christian Arabs, Muslim Arabs, and Bedouins are being held captive to terror in equal measure.

Stop the killing, stop taking land that's not yours & Finally Define your borders and then stick to it and you, the Israelis will stop having to defend yourselves. It's really quite simple. Easy peasy!!

I am not a youth at age 61. And I despise Hitler, who was a destructive fool and caused death and suffering. My British uncle volunteered to fight the facists in Spain in 1937, and was killed in action fighting Nazis in Belgium in 1940. My father was permanently disabled in the war. The Nazis were a despicably evil gang, killing innocent Roma, gays, and Jehovah's Witnesses in death camps.

The Jehovah's Witnesses (innocent, law abiding citizens) did nothing except try to convert others, and were murdered for this. Nowadays, only one country that I know of is so intolerant that Jehovah's Witnesses (or Christians or Muslims) are not permitted to prosletyse - that country is racist apartheid Israel!

I think it is true that people generally fit the profile for the region: Africans fit their profile; the Chineses fit theirs; the south Asians fit theirs; the Europeans fit theirs and the middle eastern people fit theirs( even if you travel from Iran to Turkey, you can tell the difference in looks. There are exceptions of course; but these people have remained close to those profiles for thousands of years.Now, frequently you hear of someone being detained at a U.S. airport; they said he was "suspicious" and middle eastern looking.My friends, anyone who has been gifted with vision, can see quite clearly that Yitzhak Rabin or Lieberman or Dershowitz just don't fit that middle eastern profile. Yet these millions of European Jews informed us soon after Hitler's oven treatment that they had conclusive evidence that their grannies were all from the middle east and in particular the area west of the Jordan river.So they not only go occupy the land there, but for over half a century now, have been murdering, raping, humiliating and destroying the lives of the indigenous people.Supporting them we have of course the Americans.

Every Israeli adult is a member of the Israeli armed forces and a potential soldier to be called on 3 days notice? Where does Dershowitz' argument end. Where do those Israelis stand? What part of the spectrum?

An answer would be appreciated. Disaffected youth, this question should change your mind about everything, I am very hopeful. :)

"There appear to be NO ISRAELI CIVILIANS except maybe children - and by the looks of these images, that too is questionable."

I have to disagree. There are loads of Israeli people who'd never want to enter the fight in the first place and just want peace with their neighbours. Those are real civilians, and it's sad to see them die, even though they can be called by the Zionist Mafia at any moment to fight their dirty battle for them. Do they have another choice? I think the Zionazi army wouldn't like it if these people avoided signing in as soldiers when they're called in, right? So it's either join the battle, or get fscked by the law.

It's a dirty policy, no doubt about it. But it seems that's the way things are in Israel

-----Disaffected Youth: Do you or do you not have proof of Michael Price being a Nazi?????????????-----Supply proof or apologise.-----By not apologising you brand yourself as someone who uses slurs & insults to Silence Debate & discussion instead of facts & reason.-----If your arguments are so strong PROVE THEM. If they can withstand critical analysis, them you will be right.

-----That accusation is disgusting. How dare you? Tell me what possessed you to insult someone like that? Is simpy opposing Israel so terrible? It is people like you, who throw around terms like Nazi this & anti-semite that who dilute terms that should have definite meanings & render them ineffective.

Opposing the state of Israel is NOT Anti-Semetic. If you believe it is EXPLAIN yourself & PROVE it.

----- Anti-Semetism is a concern. However, when you use & abuse the term over & over & over again to simply silence opposing views, the words lose their meaning. When that accusation is made, people already roll their eyes & think "oh what is it theyre whining about now"? That's not the worst of it by a longshot. Pretty soon people will start to think that the term means nothing. Eventually there will be cases of true attacks on Jews that are dismissed as more whining & crying wolf. The sad part of the story the boy who cried wolf is, eventually, the wolf DID come.

I count several Jews amongst my friends & Family. The idea that my sweet & gentle friends could one day be lumped in with these rabid zionist animals scares me. One day the hatred will come back to haunt all because of the fear induced savagery of a few.

- Please, if you have a case, fight only with logic & reason. I know there are true Nazis & anti-semites out there. Hatred is a scary thing. Hatred however, does not materialize out of nowhere though. I am not saying anything about anyone deserving anything right now. The point I'm trying to make is please, stop the name calling & state your case. If it is reasonable, then reasonable people will agree with you. Others on both sides will continue to think what they think regardless of reason, & namecalling will do even less good than reason, because it lowers you.

If all you can do is name call & throw slurs however, you can go to Hell.

I invite all people to abandon name calling & slogans. They accomplish nothing. Use reason first, then use action.

Very true, we know better here..... This is a very small discussion on a small website (no offence).Is anyone doing anything to help others??

- Think of the American lives you could save if you convinced a soldier it is not worth it to die for Israel.- How many people do you think it woild take to raise the money to out-bribe AIPAC & get our senators to do the right thing?- How many people still buy products that pay to be advertised on FOX/ABC/NBC/CIA/AIPAC, & thus fund lies????

- How many people call their representatives? If everyone offended were to call them 20 times over the next year, whenever you felt the urge to blow off steam, their phonelines would jam & they would get the message.

- How many people publicly ask local politicians (Mayors, etc)about their stance on these issues & roast any candidate with zoinist sympathy over the coals?. Local polotics is a far easier platform to voice public issues. All sucessful political movements start bottom up. Mayors & town councils have no power, but those higher on the food chain pay attention to the issues in these venues because theyre REAL. They will take notice & eventually heed the direction of the wind. Use their tactics against them. Make it known that supporting Israel is political suicide. Politicans are survivors.

The best way to stop israel'crimes is to hit it (and its' zionist supporters )where it hurts :in the pocketbook . Total boycott of israeli products!!!. Total boycott of zionist/jewish owned and operated businesses worldwide!!.Total boycott of zionist politicians or jewish owned politicians in the U.S.A.They will know how you feel soon enough!

The worst part about the Dershowitz Doctrine - that it's okay to kill civilians if they live in a country that might possibly support terrorism in some way - is that it can be applied to justify the killing of American citizens anywhere in the world because of our government's support for Israel's actions.

America's military is stretched pretty thin. I think even Canada could make a serious run for the cup.

Heck, our Air Force couldn't even stop slow-moving passenger planes from hitting skyscrapers. What could they do against a serious military attack?

No, your point about IDF soldiers is not well taken. So what? Children and old people are NOT in the IDF, and yet they are targeted with equal aplomb. The terrorists don't care WHO they target - they just want to kill. Also, when the IDF troops are off duty, they ARE civilians - they are not doing anything to help the army.

Israel, on the other hand, goes out of their way to avoid civilian deaths - to their detriment, because their humanity is used against them by the terrorists.

The point Dersh was trying to make is that there is a SLIDING SCALE of who a civilian is. When a civilian stores weaponry for Hezbollah, are they technically a civilian? It's not so clear. In contrast to the IDF reserves, those people are never "off duty" if they actively are storing weapons for Hezbollah.

Dersh never said an Israeli life is worth more than a Lebanese life. That is a blatant LIE that qrswave propogated.

Again, not a surprise, since this site has gotten so over the top, it is cited by David Duke.

Now, even 'civilians' are not beyond their interpretation.We need a new vocabulary to reflect the realities of modern warfare. A new phrase should be introduced into the reporting and analysis of current events in the Middle East: "the continuum of civilianality." Though cumbersome, this concept aptly captures the reality and nuance of warfare today and provides a more fair way to describe those who are killed, wounded and punished.

I get it now: Bolton's logic makes perfect sense! Brilliant!!! And of course, all the deaths of Israel are caused by the Zionists. Without the extremist wet dream of greater israel, all the people there could live in peace.

As for human shields, that's why the israeli death forces are digging in in gaza and lebanon right alongside civlians. your chosen racist chickenshits LOVE their human shields.

The only racist is you. You desire the death of every "zionist" (code word for Jew). Israel only desires peace. PERIOD.

You are living in a dreamworld if you think there would peace without Israel. There never has been peace between Muslims and Jews in the history of the world - this is prior to the formation of Israel.

Israel is the only pieceful country in the world, all it wants is a piece of Gaza, a piece of West Bank, a piece of Syria, a piece of Lebanon, a piece of Egypt, a piece of Iraq, a piece of the oil, and a piece of US taxpayers billions.

So far as racist labels go, so fuck? When in Rome, etc. While everyone is busy hating Arabs, Muslims, Gays, Women seeking Abortions, Blacks, and the Browns, not forgetting the wet-backs, why should hating Jews be so disgusting? We are all free to hate now, and whomsoever we choose we can hate equally well!

This uncountry and its sycophants, ought to realise that no amount of fire power and killing capabilities, and the rivers of blood that the Zionists need to swim in to justify their fuckwit personalities, Israel is destined for destruction, the fantasy of these Zionist savages living side by side their victims can only be dreamt up, in brains of those alcoholic users of exotic substances and their poodles, notwithstanding the fuckwits calling themselves Zionists!

Finally any God that chooses such fuckwits as Jews, by default forfeits its Godliness! Further now that talk is of the invisible friends in the sky, I bet my invisible friend in the sky can whoop the arse off any other invisible friend anyone has to offer!!!!!!

What fucking load of bollexy bollix; It sure makes me think that the God of Israel is to be taken into consideration

PS name calling is part of tactics of getting the blood pressure of these Israeli Keyboard Offence Units to rise, and hence getting them to stand at their respective monitors all shaking and a wailing, dressed up in their kinky bondage outfits!

PPS. As we gingerly debate on this board, the Arab streets are simmering and boiling ready for the overthrow of the little shitbags they have been palmed off with as their leaders, it is only a matter of time before the whole area blows-up into a cauldron of war, and well that is the end of the cheap cheap oil!

PPPS. Israelis are losing the fight, and you only need to listen to their winging tossers appearing on the boobtube and trying to draft in the US and the UK. You see Israeli army can only fight little old ladies and children, and not the fighters of any sorts, just tune into the sky news and listen to the reporter: “this buries the lie of Israelis controlling the area in the south of Lebanon, at least this area” [sic].

"You are living in a dreamworld if you think there would peace without Israel. There never has been peace between Muslims and Jews in the history of the world - this is prior to the formation of Israel."What utter and complete bollocks. Whilst no-one would try to claim that relations between Jews and Muslims have always been 100% perfect, it is an outright lie to say there has never been peace between them. On the contrary, there were many periods when the two religions got on very well for very long periods of time, and many real Jews (as opposed to Zionists) regard some of their 'Golden Ages' to have taken place under Muslim rule. More importantly, there was relative peace between ALL peoples in palestine in the immediate period before the creation of Israel. Arabs, Muslims, Jews, Christians, Atheists, agnostics and everyone else got on reasonably well without any real problems for a long time before the Zionists came along and created their shitty little "country". Such a peace would only have strengthened and become constitutonalised if Palestine had been allowed to develop into a modern state instead of a war zone for the 'chosen' to indulge in regular bouts of murder and dehumanisation. Learn some real history instead of hateful propaganda.

"I refuse to be a dhimmi."Ah, yes, dhimmi status. One of the single most misunderstood and deliberately misconstrued aspects of Islamic history. It may not have been perfect but it was a functional, utilitarian system that benefited all sides in the context of the times.

What do you call the golden age of Sepharad if there never was peace between Jews and Muslims? Jews even got to command Muslim armies in Spain, in contract to when the Catholics forcibly evicted, tortured and murdered them for not converting.

The truth of the matter is that Zionism has as much in common with Judaism as a candy bar wrapper has with the candy itself - only window dressing. Zionism is Bolshevism with the Magen David instead of the sickle and hammer.

US plans $A280m jet fuel sale to Israel.The Pentagon notified Congress of plans to sell Israel jet fuel valued at up to $US210 million ($A280 million) "to keep peace and security in the region.The proposed sale of the JP-8 aviation fuel will enable Israel to maintain the operational capability of its aircraft inventory,the Pentagon's Defense Security Cooperation Agency said in notice required by law.

Ohhh what could do they use that for ??? mmmm a few sight seeing flights over lebonan ????

http://www.thefairandbalancednews.com/On July 12th, various news sources reported that Hezbollah captured two Israeli soldiers inside of Lebanon. Israel then lies and states that these two soldiers were kidnapped (!) and vows retaliation. In the time since, Israel has attacked civilians and the infrastrucure of Lebanon in an act of collective punishment and possibly using banned weapons.

SO they Irealie soliders where taken prisoner not kidnapped .....

Irealie people helped, supported and armed (probably) Hamas as a counterweight to the PLO so why now they got problems?

Hizbullah took the soliders prisoner to exchange for Lebanese prisoners that Israel has held without due process. One of them, Samir Quntar, has been held for 27 years. You will be probably not realise but the ireallycrasy people over the last 30-25 since its been invading ie coming and going has kidnapped hundreds of lebonse- they are held in prisoner with trial/little hope of return,they fate to be ignoreed by the world - in fact gizmo no lesee

Also it was reported in a number of news outlets that the lebabese intellegience had caught a isreallymad spy ring in lebabon. The members admitted to murders of members of hamas, palestians amongst others. Well today what do we have here ...

According to the newspaper, the arrested spy told Lebanon's secret agencies about the network of important Israeli cells within Beirut and south of Lebanon.

Sensitive tools and equipments were also recovered from the Israeli, who admitted to have marked several buildings in Beirut to help Israeli air strikers target them on point, it added. The arrested spy was a key member of large-scale Israeli intelligence network in Beirut, it concluded.

Ohhh we have Isrealies pointing fingers at syria/iran complaing about them arming Hizbullah with rockets, arms blah blah. Well what do the rest of the sane world see -US made F16, F15, etc dropping US made bomb, shells to US made helle fire missles, tank shells to no doubt US supplied aviation fuel.....oh not to mention US financial loans ... well the US is up to its neck in supporting a crasy terrorist state .....

"We Jews, we are the destroyers and will remain the destroyers. Nothing you can do will meet our demands and needs. We will forever destroy because we want a world of our own." (You Gentiles, by Jewish Author Maurice Samuels, p. 155).

Chinas has announced that isreal will be the new home of the landless tibetens ! They will move in next week. The current inhibants will of course have to move to the gaza /west bank... otherwise they will be "persuaded" by bombing,kidnapping, torture etc.

And in keeping with current world standars all UN resolutions, outcrys, genva conventions etc will be ignored. Any inhabitants found remaing by next week will of course find theselves exiled to the KFC in downtown LA next to the garbage dump ! SO THERE !!

1) Beirut's lighthouse.2) Lebonan's main grain store.3) Conveys of villagers fleeing from the madmen.4) A factory that made tissues.5) Lots of womean and kids.6) All the bridges.7) Power stations.8) Beriut airport.9) A few hospitals.10) Shelled all the ports up and down Lebanon's coastline.11) It has wiped certain Shiite villages almost clear off the map ahhh thats called ethnic cleaning - they must have learnt that from their brothers / sisters aka the nazis.12)[I'm waiting for this now] Possible the "accidently" bombing of entire lenonese cabinet / parliament --- oppps sorry was that a 26 tons of bombs we "accidently dropped".... so sorry. [Then expect] Theres no gov how can we negioate a ceasefire - ie we can take over lebonan as well now ..... more land for the ireaslies....oh hello mr hitler....glad u joined us !!

We know take you to our correspondent at the Whitshouse where the president is giving a press conf.

Bush: My fellow amercianistanis. The world is standing stil and moving towards a new future. The bad guys are sure tryin to whip some trouble espcially in injian country[lebonan/Iraq/Afganistan/US mid term elections coming this nov] . The good guys will not stand for truth, justice and freedom ....ooops I mean will.Damm i wish i could read.

The current mid-earth [cus lord of the ring them] confict is mighty troubling. Peace is a neccessary evil but we must prevail or we will be disrembered by history.

The ireallycrazy folks have a right to self defense as the very badddd hizbullawallies took prisoners. The ireallymad folks are gonna need all the help to fight in injian country which is why I gonna sendie on over some big ol' presents like 5 ton/1 ton bombs, more f15/f16, tanks shells. Yes sir-rey they gonna mighty grateful especialy coz i said they can take there time ie the rest of 2billion years. And if they "accidently" take over the rest of the world well.... I wont mind.

The president now invites questions from the press.

Press1: Mr President will you put pressure on ireal to stop the bombings?Bush: Yo BlindOneWearingCoolShades-Well its kinda be bad, them folks are sure having a party. Well i dont wanna spoil thems fun.

Press3: Have you found WMD in iraq yet?Bush:Yo ShortyGuy- My good ol' buddies B-liar and Bellasgonnagotojail are dammmm mighty fine. They found injun trail all the way to Niger some thing about Yellow cakes and buns.....and also something about 45 mins aways - dammmm too close.

End of conference

We return you to more important matters- Pax New American Idol: the search for necon warmonger.

Eyeball view: [Scan mode activated]Warning illegal version of windows Xp has been detected please install legitamate version. Warning extreme madpeople in close proximity. Proced with assetive posture. The terminator enters the pentagon and locates a room full of officers.[Scanning humiod life forms]. [Target acquired]. He walks over to a general. Engage language circuits.

Zionist is not a codeword for Jew. This can be explained & understood on many levels. Judaism is a Religion. Zionism is a Political movement. Not all Zionists are Jews, & not all Jews are Zionists.

In order for you to call an anti zionist an anti-semite you MUST be able to PROVE that ALL Jews are Zionists, & that All Zionists are Jews.

If you cannot PROVE the above is true in it's entirety, you CANNOT equate Judaism with Zionism & therefore you certainly cannot call All anti- zionists amti-semites. Certainly there are some people who are both, but simply opposing a politcal movement & or government is NOT Racism.

One again you have failed MISERABLY in defending your POLITICAL point of view with FACTS & LOGIC. You have to resort to namecalling screaming Racist. You embarass yourself.

I dare you to prove me wrong.... Attack my statements, pick them apart & if you can put forth a convincing argument based on FACTS & LOGIC, I promise you I will publicly concede.

Till then, you are nothing but a fool who calls manes you don't even understand the definitions of.

Also, please tell me who you are to speak for all Jews. If a Jewish person disagrees with your views are they no longer Jewish?

Man, it appears as though you've got a mad hate on for the Jews. I'm not telling you you're wong to feel that way cuz it' not my business. I'm sure you've got reasons.

What I am telling you is that every time someone makes comments like that, it gives the Zionists more power. It gives them the fuel they need to drive their death machine.

The reason why so many people excuse their murdering ways is because they believe that the Jews need their own state to protect themmselves.

The most compelling argument they use is that they "have a right to exist". Every time someone calls for someones head for being Jewish, People cut them slack. People can then be fooled ito believing that Zionism is about protection from extinction.

It sucks that people are so easily lead by guilt & misplaced empathy but that is the reality of the world in which we live. This is the Main reason that good people turn a blind eye to Zionist crimes. Guilt.

By not baying for their blood at every opportunity, you help to take away guilt. If hatred of Jews is no longer seen to be around every corner, it allows people to see the Zionists as people instead of victims.

It will take away the Zionists ability to use the term anti-semite as a magic word to silence debate.

This in turn will allow the issue of Zionism to be discussed by everyone, in the open, in a reasonable manner WITHOUT GUILT. Guilt is their most powerful weapon.

Once everything is out in the open, people stop with the guilt & realize that Israel is JUST ANOTHER COUNTRY.

Once this happens there is no way in hell reasonable people will cut them any more slack & they will be on their own.

They will Finally be held accountable for their crimes, without the sheild of guilt.

Please, everyone, just think about what I said. I'm not saying don't hate, because no one has the right to tell another man what they should think or how they should feel.

All I'm suggesting is feel however you please, but please, we have a common interest in tearing down Israel's victim facade, & all the open hatred is hurting us & helping the Zionists.

What I am saying, is that a little restraint will yield HUGE returns in liberating us all from those who do think that they have been chosen ot tell us how to think & feel.

A little bit of public discipline will eventually help to win us ALL a lot more freedom.

Disaffected Youth? Hello? Are you there? Or is the honest truth just too much for you to bear?

Ladies & Gentlemen.....this exchange between D.A. & I (such as it was)is an example of the most effective way to deal with a rabid zionist.

They spew lies & try to misrepresent the facts to favor Israel....Publicly & openly call them on it.

They try to change the subject or put the onus on you to prove defend yourself..... keep on topic, defend yourself, & publicly call them on that too.

They try to silence you with accusations of racism & anti- semitism..... do NOT BACK DOWN. Simply explain that you are Anti ZIONIST & then challenge them to explain why Anti ZIONIST & anti- semitism are the same thing. Challenge them to defend their accusation using actual reasons & logic.

Make it clear to them that their Anti-Semite card has been played a thousand times too too often & the rules of the game have changed.

Then...they realize that you're not buying their lies & threats. They realize that they must face a fair fight......& then there is blissfull silence.

In a little reported event the Isreallymad people or politicians (i think) were celebrating the bombing of the King David Hotel60years ago in which many people where killed. This was caused by the Stern terrorists.

Abu Nidel who hijacked the cruise ship in the mederran in the '80's was an agent of Mossad according to the news report I came across.

Mossad had a hand in the attempted murder of the Ireallymad Ambassordor in the UK.... this was one of the causes reasons cited for the invasion of Lebonan in the 80's.

Hamas was supported by Isreal.... So are we to belive one group of terrorists supported another ??

One last thing... if Hitler was alive and kicking he could actually move to isreallymadland. His views and belives would in synch with alot of people there ie war hunger, demonisation of peoples, collective punishment, ghettos,suporior race mindset etc .....

Family ordered to flee were targeted because they were driving minivan

"The ambulanceman gave Ali the job of keeping his mother alive. The 12-year-old did what he could. "Mama, mama, don't go to sleep," he sobbed, gently patting her face beneath her chin. Behind her black veil, her eyelids were slowly sinking. "I'm going to die," she sighed. "Don't say that, mama," Ali begged, and then slid to the ground in tears."