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Everything posted by AlphaZero

I see characters like Lyon and as antagonists since they're really only obstructing the goal of the hero. They're not really villains like Gharnef and Manfroy are as they aren't vile people who do heinous crimes for little reason. Besides, villain is kind of subjective anyways. Some people would call Rudolf a villain, while others can find sympathy in his actions.

Personally, I go case-by-case. I usually look at the average stats for my characters, and if they're above the average by a respectable margin, I'll just promote them then and there. When you promote also depends on how many promotion items you have, how contested they are, and how big of an impact said promotion you have. Frankly, I think you should promote when you think your unit either doesn't gain much from leveling in their base class, or if they need the extra move/stats.

Rejuvenation, man. I don't even know. The plot is somehow worse than Reborn's. This game is like that one really crappy anime you saw in middle school, but worse and with an unhealthily bloated cast. There are like 50+ characters and counting to keep track of, and they're all pretty much insufferable. It's a real doozy, this one.

I'm definitely in the creepy camp, and Thracia seems to imply an emotionally abusive relationship between them. Personally, I don't believe that Ishtar is actually in love with the guy. They don't really have any chemistry, at least on Ishtar's half of the relationship. He's literally orchestrating the child hunts that Ishtar and her family find utterly reprehensible (except for her mom, she's relishes it because... evil). Hell, it felt like Ishtar had more tender feelings than Reinhardt, which is why Julius hates the guy so much. It seems like she's being forced into a relationship with Julius by her mother as a power grab. Personally, I think this adds more tragedy to her tale, as she's only doing these horrible things because she is forced to, and it's really her only way to protect her loved ones like Reinhardt and various children, and fails at it. Otherwise she's another in a line of Camuses (how would you say Camus as a plural while using the correct pronunciation? Somebody please help) that make bad choices in their continued allegiance (though Ishtar has pretty good reason to hate the liberation army, but her reason didn't stop Lex, Azel, Tailtyu, Tinny, or Olwen).

I think that Sunwoo summed it up the best. There are always going to be people who dislike a character. Take Shinon for example. He's an coarse racist man who pushes even his own allies away from him at times. It should be pretty obvious why somebody would dislike him, but I think it would be silly to deny Shinon the complexity he has within his supports and dialogue.
To actually contribute to what is being asked, I don't think there should be a set way of doing character flaws. I like both Shinon and Leaf, but they're flawed in two different ways. Shinon's flaws are in his very abrasive personality, which is offset primarily by his tender relationship with Rolf. Leif's flaw, his righteous zeal, isn't necessarily a flaw on paper, but it is something that gets him into trouble as early as Chapter 3. I think that flaws should be used to round out a character. A character with too little flaws is going to be ridiculed for being perfect, and an incompetent character is almost impossible to relate to or support. Flaws and Strengths should be treated organically. It's annoying when Corrin's flaws are handwaved because everybody's like "Don't worry Corrin, you're crippling naivete that almost got us all killed is endearing!". But it's also annoying when a character's flaws lack any basis in reason like Celica in her trust of Cackles Mcblueskin or almost all of the Camus archetypes.

FE10 Ike should be like a cool save-transfer extra a la Suikoden II. Ike being this indomitable force that the DB must inevitably clash with is cool. Ike hijacking the plot and becoming the chosen warrior-messiah is a little much
Make Alm like his Awakening portrayal. I'm replaying Echoes, and I really do think that many of Alm's scenes would be far more interesting if he had that same zeal that was evident before.
Make Fernand as human as he is in the DLC, I don't understand how they dropped the ball with him so bad in the amin story, but thhey've shown that he can be a good character, so make him just that.
It's not really a character, but change the Black Fang to a Mercenary group rather than a band of assassins. The latter is just silly, and most of the group don't even resemble assassins.
Give every evil Sorcerer villain something else outside of being that evil sorcerer villain. The closest we got to a character was with Nergal, and even then it's locked behind rather cryptic and convoluted prerequisites.

I think everybody knows Celica is a flawed character, it's just the fact that some (myself included) don't think these flaws humanize her, it only makes her seem incompetent. The problem with Celica's flaws is that they aren't really nuanced in any way nor do they pertain to her character. Celica is just being an idiot in part 4. The game sort of implies that she has a martyr complex, but her actions contradict this as they put her friends in peril that could have easily been avoided if she actually spoke up. In this case, Celica is condemning Alm for simply taking up the reins of leadership without responsibility despite avoiding such responsibilities herself. These actions go against some of the core aspects Celica is presented as embodying. If she is truly as selfless as the game wants you to think, why doesn't she try to make more sacrifices for the people? For me, these flaws don't humanize a person for me because they aren't consistent with any character growth.
What world-building justifies character flaws? Does that mean Berkut is justified in his bigotry and murdering his girlfriend because the world-building shows you how violent Duma's philosophy can be? The fact that Zofians are selfish shouldn't justify Celica's behavior, especially when the game touts her as some kind of saintly paragon to those around her. In this specific instance, Celica's "flaws" echo the sentiments of Corrins, whose problem wasn't with being flawless, but the story diverting attention away from said flaws. After that lover's tiff at the end of Part Two, the game wants you to think "Well, maybe Celica had a point", but all of what she said is hypocritical in hindsight given her position
I do think that the game is more a story of extremist ideologies rather than a battle between mortals and gods, but that's just a matter of personal interpretation, The problem I have with that interpretation is that it favors Alm while purposefully depreciating Celica. If you're going to make to characters/sides with opposing ideas or morality, you shouldn't simplify it down to an episode of Good Idea, Bad Idea. The game presents Alm's as the path to victory and enlightenment, and Celica's as self-destructive and unsustainable. If Alm's interpretation is correct, why even have Celica there? To serve as some kind of Strawman? I favor the opposing-ideology interpretation, as well as Alm's Awakening portrayal because they seem more interesting and thought-provoking than what we have. I don't care what the intent is in that regard, If it feels poorly executed, it's still worthy of criticizing. If Alm were more innately Rigelian in terms of morals, (which isn't unreasonable if the game wants you to think he has some subconscious connection with Rigel) and favored an aggressive means of dealing with the Zofian problems, there might have been some actual conflict in that part two-speech. Celica could criticize Alm militarizing a people that aren't adept at fighting because he feels it's right, and Alm could criticize her for being passive and wishful in her appeal to the gods.
Also the game doesn't really show the Deliverance as being a pure meritocracy. Lukas is a noble, albeit a lesser one, and his position reflects that. He is given a higher command than Forsyth and Python, but also is lower than Clive, Mathilda, and Fernand. Forsyth and Mycen are most likely exceptions to the rule (Especially since both are buddy-buddy with the top brass). The game, whether intentional or not, shows that birth can be paramount in your position with Alm's hidden royalty, his ability to wield two special weapons, and a birthmark that foretells of a great prophecy.
Most of my problems with the game are the hypocritical interpretations of the themes, settings, and characters. Sometimes the game wants you to believe that Class means nothing, then it turns around and has Alm, arguably the most talented character, be secret royalty. The game again wants Celica to be a selfless martyr, but refuses to let her take the responsibility of her position. These problems are the things that bring down SoV's story for me despite it's grand presentation.

Takumi is pretty cool because his are among a handful of stories characters that don't bend to Corrin's mary-sue pheromones, and for what Etrurian Emperor said about him. Leo's pretty great for reasons the OP mentioned. Oboro is an interesting character who, unlike much of the Fates cast doesn't take her quirks to an egregious level. I like Benny for being such a sweetheart and Arthur, while almost entirely a joke character is a great guy. While I don't think their inclusion was necessary at all from a story perspective, I appreciate the wizened and introspective Awakening trio, specifically Lazlow, who I think really shines through in his supports. Shiro is probably one of my favorite Fates characters for being such a bro. He's a bit of a hot-headed dingus, but he's a really down-to-earth guy with some great interactions (Dudes literally Smokey Bear in his Caeldori support), and one of the few kids who I think stands apart from his father in terms of uniqueness. While Fates certainly has its annoying characters, It also has its good chunk of characters whose supports are heartwarming and fun.

That is a huge if and is one of the biggest reasons of why Rudolf's plan could've failed. There are so many underlying facters that could have botched the plan. Alm could've easily died during this time of famine, roaming monsters, and war. Mycen's pretty old. What if he just up and died before Alm received all of his training? What if Alm died fighting for Zofia? I know some people think that Rudolf staged a suicide war solely for Alm, but half of Alm's adversaries don't care about this plan. Slayde almost killed him when he was like 10. Berkut could've killed him, Desaix could've killed him, Those witches and Cantors could've killed him. Thank god for that dumb Macguffin Celica gave him, otherwise Alm's entire army would be dead via Nuibaba's dumb Macguffin. The Draco zombies coulld've killed him. Swole shield!Merc could've killed him.
If this game's conflict was realistic, Alm would most certainly be dead right now. Alm is a literal green recruit turned leader to a languishing resistance, he should have no chance against a country that has spent the last few centuries militarizing for who knows what. But the writers made it so Alm beats everybody he fights, regardless of how unmatched he is because this story was made in the 90s when nobody gave a damn about videogame stories. Rudolf's plan also hinges upon Alm striking a bond with his Zofian counterpart, who also could've easily died in many scenarios. Hell, I haven't even talked about how immoral Rudolf's plan is, inciting a war that would kill thousands of people across both sides, break a sacred pact that, upon its destruction, would cause famine and revive monsters across the continent, and increase the activities of banditry across the continent.
Rudolf's plan is just as bad as Azura's both plans work out in the end despite their innate stupidity and impracticality. Rudolf has negative thiings to gain from being secretive, especially since he has an army of almost unwavering loyalty under him. You literally see him fighting Mila with an army behind him, Why couldn't he just do the same for Duma? If his most loyal generals are privy to his plan and are willing to die for it, then They most likely won't have a problem waging war on a cult of soulless blue people for the sake of their king. How is this plan anything but convoluted? This isn't some point A-to-point B plan, it literally takes 17 years of preparation affects the balance of an entire continent. But it's all good because it worked out in the end right? I think that there are a lot of positives in SoV, but let's not pretend that Rudolf's plan is some sort of masterpiece.

I have to agree with Corrin being the most interesting concept for a lord. His plight stood out a lot from previous characters and the excitement was plain to see during the pre-Fates hype. Course, the execution was completely bungled. Honorable mention to Micaiah, who's concept of being a protagonist from the previously antagonistic country is cool. However, I don't know how far you can go off analyzing concept alone, because it pales in comparison to execution. To steal from @Etrurian emperor, FE9 Ike's concept is pretty by-the-numbers. Hell, you can argue that his lineage has more importance than most lords plotwise (He's the son of the strongest Human in the world and the literal human embodiment of balance). But he's a good main character because he's one of the more relatable lords, expressing more personality and development than some of his predecessors.

I lost my post, so I'll try to summarize it: Nergal should know that Athos is in Nabata. Since Athos is the only person who could feasibly stop Nergal, he should be aware of the danger that would be presented if Eliwood were to ally with him. Nergal should make killing Eliwood a top priority, as the other assignment, while very important, wouldn't endanger his whole scheme if delayed. Really, Nergal should've just cut out the middle man and killed Eliwood and co. himself. I mean, that isn't impractical for him to do so. Or he could send an some of his morphs to do the job if the Black Fang's hands are tied.
Also I found this gem when Lloyd is telling Linus why they can't both fight Eliwood
Lloyd: "Moron. It’s a precaution. Fangs cannot afford mistakes. Don’t worry, I’ve underlings aplenty. I’ll taunt the foe and draw them to the fortress in the north. I doubt I’ll lose, but… They’ve survived this long, so they must be tough. I might run into trouble. Deliver your report, then get back here with reinforcements.”
He's like "I'm only doing this to be sure. I got this, but they are pretty strong. I could lose this one. But whatever, go give your report." That's the cavalier attitude that Eliwood's group gets. Lloyd sending away aid that could change the tide of the battle is the exact opposite of a precaution. Linus also doesn't wait for backup, he just charges in, which is kinda the opposite of what an assassin is supposed to do. You kinda deserve to die when you're this stupid. Also, Limstella was in the area, so why not send them to kill Eliwood?

Oh no, I never meant to imply that about Awakening, I like all the games on that list, It's just that I personally think that the same things Awakening is criticized for are ignored a lot when discussing the other games. I think most of the Awakening criticisms are valid. I just don't understand it when people say FE7's or even FE4's plot is better by leaps and bounds.
I know, but it takes 3 chapters for the first of the Four Fangs to make the first move, and they don't even take the initiative? Eliwood and friends are able to go back to Ostia and then travel across the continent to Nabata and Bern. In universe, that would be a lot of time, wouldn't it? The Black Fang are shown to track down their targets. Hell, they do it in Hector's opening chapter, so why don't they track down the people that are a top priority at the moment. My problem with the Four Fang is that, even with orders to dispose of Eliwood immediately, they just treat it like some side job, sending Ursula and even Jaffar on other missions despite the fact that Eliwood's continued existence jeopardizes the Black Fang and Nergal.

Maybe Awakening's plot isn't better than it seems, moreso that it gets too much slack for things that other games in the series do.
Fe7's plot always felt a little too cavalier for my tastes. With the exception of Lloyd and Linus, I'm not a big fan of the Black Fang (A group of morally-upstanding assassins is kind of paradoxical IMO) and Nergal pulls a lot of stuff out his ass. There isn't really a reason as to why he doesn't just send the best assassins after Eliwood & co. once they become something of a threat. The plot sort of feels like it's going through the motions save for some certain parts. For Awakening, I like how, for the most part, it does feel like an actual war campaign. Granted, Nergal is at least a much better Villain than Validar, and I like the development Eliwood and Hector get. I'd probably place it about even with Awakening.
Echoes I feel is substantially worse. I hate how Echoes plot runs contrary to its world-building (How is the country who has done nothing but Militarize for centuries losing to the lazy hedonists? Why does the human embodiment of Duma lack the warmongering qualities representative of the deity?) and theming. Most of the story is centered in Alm's route, which is a bit of a problem in a game with dual protagonists. Alm's origins is crappily foreshadowed (Desaix literally figures it out in Act 1 off of him not being related to Mycen, which is dumb, but the others, Alm included, just pretend that there is nothing a wee bit suspicious about Alm having a holy brand and wielding a royal sword only he can use). Jedah is the same sycophantic evil dragon worshiper that Validar is, but with more dastardly cackling and blue. Berkut and Fernand are probably some of the worst the Camus archetype has to offer. Fernand is rather sympathetic in the Memory Prisms and DLC (His story self is pretty bad), but Berkut does nothing sympathetic the whole game, and I'm supposed to somehow feel bad for him? There are things I really like about Echoes. I, like many others, adore the presentation and am a fan of the world-building on paper, but just because it is a breath of fresh air after Fates does not make it stand out for me.
I feel that Chapters 1-11 of Awakening is some of the best writing in the series. It's fast-paced, engaging, and gives a lot of development for Chrom and provides good set up for the later chapters (which is squandered in the end, however). As I stated before, Awakening's script treats war with the respect that is warranted for the most part, which sometimes isn't the case in Fire Emblem. Awakening's cast, while ostensibly cliche, is rather interesting and carries with them many good supports and characters. Awakening still has many problems. The plot starts to slowly worsen after Chapter 11, with it nose-diving after 18. Validar, as said by many others, makes Dick Dastardly look nuanced. Even with those flaws, I don't think Awakening is close to the worst stories in the series.

I prefer to call them my "idiosyncratic" Fire Emblem opinions.'
- Awakening's plot, while bad in execution, still does things better than a good chunk of the other games (Fe7, Echoes, Obviously Fates)
- The Camus archetype is a terrible archetype. They're rarely sympathetic and usually only fight for such vapid virtues such as "honor" or "loyalty".
- Eliwood is cooler than Hector
- Alm and Celica are both two of the worst non-avatar lords. Both bring down the plot with their idiocy, and Alm's mellow personality and hero-worship bring down the game's themes
- Awakening!Alm would have been really interesting
- Ranked Runs aren't fun. It's annoying having to micromanage every unit and every item you buy to get an A-rank
- Sumia is better than Cordelia
- Fatigue was a cool feature
- Fe7 Cast is pretty hit-or-miss
- Awakening has one of the better casts in the series
- The 5-support Limit is dumb. Just do A+ for paired endings
- Rescue, while not as easy to abuse as pairup, is nearly as game-changing and further promotes Horse Emblem
- Fe5 Indoor maps were cool
- Ike shouldn't have been in FE10, or he should have been transfer-only à la Suikoden II
- Most characters with unrequited love are poorly handled and I don't get its popularity
- People who only use high-base units are cold-blooded capitalists who bear no love for the little man

I'm gonna call bullshit on this because any problem Hoshido has is exacerbated to absurd levels in Conquest. Don't get me wrong Birthright is by no means a good plot, but you have a set goal that you are trying to achieve throughout the
1. Xander is a sycophantic imbecile in about every route and while he is thick headed he is by no means heartless. You should be able to see that in Elise's death scene.
2. Flora commits suicide because she regretted her decision of going against Corrin. I know this explicitly stated in Chapter 17. Not to mention, The Ice Tribe would be offed before Corrin could cry boo-hoo if Flora defected.
3. It's implied Azura's purging has limits as she realized Garon was a monster when her song failed. Anankos had a pretty strong grip on Takumi that didn't all vanished, and Iago exploited it... somehow. (Curse your Macguffin powers Iago!)
4. Something tells me that Camilla and Leo just might not be ready to battle their own country and their brother. That's like asking why Hinoka and Sakura won't fight for you on Conquest.
How is Corrin in Hosh more self absorbed than their Nohr counterpart? Nohr Corrin believes that invading Hoshido was for the greater good, that's bullshit! They sacrifice the livelihood of an entire country just to let someone they know is evil sit on a magic throne to reveal his true identity to 4 other people who wouldn't believe you if you told them this. I'm not even going to go into how this destroys Azura's character and my brain cell matter. Corrin may trust Zola, but that is naivety, not cowardice. Also, It takes Nohrrin far longer to realize that "hey maybe that guy that has tried to kill me on multiple occasions, laughs maniacally within earshot of possible opposition, and orders genocides because it's fun might be evil!" than it does in Birthright which shows that Nohrrin's choice is extremely flimsy and selfish. I might elaborate later, but I got to go to bed, and my finger is messed up and I can't type right now.

can·on1
ˈkanən/
noun
1. a general law, rule, principle, or criterion by which something is judged. "the appointment violated the canons of fair play and equal opportunity" synonyms: principle, rule, law, tenet, precept; More
2. a collection or list of sacred books accepted as genuine. "the formation of the biblical canon"
Just gonna leave this here because there is a BIG misunderstanding about the definition of canon here. Canon is something that is confirmed or very widely accepted by a community, not something you make up to justify cop-out writing. I really don't think anyone wrote that support trying to put any evidence insinuating any canon pairings whatsoever. Given that you can possibly never see this if you don't activate the S-Support or just choose to play as Femui. Also, using the word "theory" basically makes your claim to something being canon void as it is just what YOU interpret the text as.

Canon is not "your choice". Canon is what the game has set in stone that cannot be changed or refuted. It is canon that Kamui is kidnapped by Nohr, but it isn't canon if you choose to have Camilla marry Kamui.
This was not a well thought out thread
If I had a dollar for every time a character said that they have been in love with a character forever... I can almost guarantee that there are at least two mentions of this per S-support in Awakening. Take it with a grain of salt.