Settlements

With the issue of settlements again becoming a topic of much discussion within the Sci-Fi Mini Builders, I thought I might put together a thread to help move that discussion along.

On the wall, we've already seen a fair bit of support for a proposal of mine about the relationship between settlements and territory:

Texar wrote:We could set it up so that everyone can have up to X systems by default if they'd like and if it's reasonable for them to do so (obviously if there's no space in your region you shouldn't go settle the other side of the galaxy) but then if someone starts building their settlements that allows them to claim more systems.For example, say the limit is 5 systems, but I build my capital so now I'm allowed to claim 9 systems, maybe then I build another settlement and it goes up to 13.

And then we don't seem to have much if any opposition to the idea of settlements not being mandatory but still offering bonuses to those who choose to build them. So, that said, I think we can operate on the assumption that that's how things will likely be, that settlements will play a role in the number of systems you may control, that settlements will not in any way be mandatory, and that settlements will provide a bonus to those who do build them.

Moving on from that, I just posted on the wall a proposal that we abolish the existing Colonial Settlement Types system and instead establish Settlement Classes, each class providing a unique bonus to the host empire (though said bonus not being significant enough to totally unbalance the SAP).

Here's an example of such a class:

Class:Military ClassBonus:Allows for a larger military and more rapid and efficient military response to intrusions upon your territory.Required:Military Base & Supporting Town/CityDescription:Military Class settlements are towns or cities which support a near-by military installation. In addition to the basic requirements for all settlements, Military Class settlements require a military base as well as the town or city that is supporting it. Military class settlements provide a bonus to your defensive capabilities, allowing a larger military and a more rapid and efficient response to any forces intruding upon your territory. Military Class settlements are suggested for factions who find themselves prone to conflict or who are concerned about defense.

Lavi5 wrote:We should establish some limit of the range of races when colonizing. Such as, new races cannot be interfered with until they colonize two systems (Races have a week to do so, or lose the protection. Like a previous rule, if this new race attacks another race, it would also result in lose of the protection). Races can not go with in 5 systems of the new race also, until the 2 system (I do not mean build, just declare a successful colonization of the new system) are fully colonized. Another could be races cannot colonize past 5 systems near their territory (I do not mean as in system count, I mean as in the system near the border). If a system is colonized but not connected to their territory, the range only allows systems around it and near the system to be colonized, but only when the system is fully colonized.

Hmm... I like that you're suggesting ideas and I thank you for them, but... well, perhaps I should break this down a bit...

"new races cannot be interfered with until they colonize two systems (races have a week to do so, or lose the protection)" - Well, I think it's safe to say there's already some safeguards in place to prevent a new race from being interfered with in a negative manner right after they state, no admin is going to just stand by while a new race gets invaded on their first day. But tying that protection to systems and time...Well, I'm just not sure that's necessarily needed? I mean in order for a new race to be messed with by other players they would require proper canon cause to do so (especially casus belli to attack) and the owner of the new race would have to consent so, I mean, it just seems like a redundant extra rule?

"Races can not go with in 5 systems of the new race" - I'm inclined to feel the same way about this as the no interaction rule, plus I'm not sure if that would really even work, I mean what if that new race is right on your front door, what are you suppose to do? Hang up a 'Gone Fishing' sign and pretend your empire isn't home right now until that new faction is deemed mature enough to step into the SAP community? I just see this rule being rather cumbersome to existing factions and not necessarily providing much benefit to new factions.

"races cannot colonize past 5 systems near their territory (I do not mean as in system count, I mean as in the system near the border). If a system is colonized but not connected to their territory, the range only allows systems around it and near the system to be colonized, but only when the system is fully colonized." - Umm, well, I'll admit I had a rough time following that, but I think I got what you meant but it and, well, I don't know, I suppose we could definitely take restrictions on where you can expand under consideration but as it stands I'm not necessarily aware of any existing issues or disputes which might benefit from what you've proposed?

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The medical center states that it allows for a longer lifespan, but what about factions that consider themselves immortal, such as the Eldari?

199.126.151.112 wrote:The medical center states that it allows for a longer lifespan, but what about factions that consider themselves immortal, such as the Eldari?

"Some races will also, with varying degrees of success, begin to pursue the possibility of effective immortality, hoping to raise their lifespans enough to essentially end death. For most, however, this will prove to be a fool’s errand and for those who do succeed it will not likely be fully realized until Tier 1."(TAT)

Immortality isn't a thing in SAP and for the cases where it might be possible it's not actual immortality, merely effective immortality, i.e. modern medicine (or an equivilant) has advanced to the point that the mind and body can be maintained virtually indefinitely, though while death has become uncommon it can not be said to be unheard of or nonexistent nor reasonably deemed impossible.

Edit: And for those races who do reach Tier 1 and achieve something like this, they'll still need medical centers to maintain their population, living effectively forever isn't without its challenges.

199.126.151.112 wrote:The medical center states that it allows for a longer lifespan, but what about factions that consider themselves immortal, such as the Eldari?

"Some races will also, with varying degrees of success, begin to pursue the possibility of effective immortality, hoping to raise their lifespans enough to essentially end death. For most, however, this will prove to be a fool’s errand and for those who do succeed it will not likely be fully realized until Tier 1."(TAT)

Immortality isn't a thing in SAP and for the cases where it might be possible it's not actual immortality, merely effective immortality, i.e. modern medicine (or an equivilant) has advanced to the point that the mind and body can be maintained virtually indefinitely, though while death has become uncommon it can not be said to be unheard of or nonexistent nor reasonably deemed impossible.

Edit: And for those races who do reach Tier 1 and achieve something like this, they'll still need medical centers to maintain their population, living effectively forever isn't without its challenges.

To clarify, yes the Eldari are biologically immortal, but only in the ageless way. Organ Failure, disease, starvation etc... can kill them. So while they can live EXTREMELY long lives, they will die from natural causes.

The only exception is the Eldari Queen, Era Vaslilith, she is one of the ancient Eldari, and by far, the oldest Eldari in existance, literally 12 Billion years old.

The Khaldyr is an interesting case, considering they lack culture and are practically immortal. Plus, the only major trade/residential area is the Sur'nost system, which they use to trade raw materials and create diplomatic relations with other civilizations.

I'm thinking there should be a new synthetic-only set of classes, considering if anyone wants to be a synthetic race in the RP.

Also, can all of the settlements be in one place (Many people have pretty large empires [10-20, even 50-60 at most], and how would this work?

Den, you realize synthetics usually go Rampant after awhile, and mass effect's Geth showed us that they can develop different ideals, and considering how big you are, there is a high possibility the Khaldyr will develop different ideals, and begin fighting one another.

Denliner wrote:The Khaldyr is an interesting case, considering they lack culture and are practically immortal. Plus, the only major trade/residential area is the Sur'nost system, which they use to trade raw materials and create diplomatic relations with other civilizations.

I'm thinking there should be a new synthetic-only set of classes, considering if anyone wants to be a synthetic race in the RP.

Also, can all of the settlements be in one place (Many people have pretty large empires [10-20, even 50-60 at most], and how would this work?

Well, the settlement classes are meant to be able to be interpreted semi-vaguely and not restrict creativity significantly. For, say, a medical class settlement you could instead substitute the medical center with a repair facility and the university with a research or reprogramming center, basically you can interpret them in what ever manner fits the traits of your race, just so long as we can recognize that what you build meets the spirit of the class (with the medical example, then that would mean a settlement devoted to promoting the longevity and wellbeing of your people, whether they be synthetic or organic) then you'll be fine.

Lavi5 wrote:Den, you realize synthetics usually go Rampant after awhile, and mass effect's Geth showed us that they can develop different ideals, and considering how big you are, there is a high possibility the Khaldyr will develop different ideals, and begin fighting one another.

I don't see why that has to be the case? It seems entirely possible that a synthetic race would be stable and if ideological, social, or political divides did develop that said divides don't necessarily lead to armed conflict. This is not to say that a synthetic race couldn't begin to grow unstable or that they couldn't turn on themselves, but I wouldn't say that there is a "high possibility" of such.

Honestly, there's a lot of interesting RP that could happen with synthetic races that doesn't really seem to be happening and I'd love to see some creative story lines be made with them, though it seems to me that there's an unusual amount of resistance among the community to synthetic races and the stories you can tell with them and that seems to unfortunately be a bit of a barrier to seeing interesting, unique stories involving synthetics in SAP2.

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Honestly IMO, the only reason that the community is opposed to synthetic races is because Denliner is the only one, and everyone thinks (including me) that he is godmodding. The synthetic-hate is the side effect of the only synthetic race being a godmod farm.