Hey All,I am moving to a 15th floor apartment (urban) with wide open views to the northwest and East. Given the height, I am considering a new Ham setup for QRP. We will have a balcony where I could operate from. I'll probably get a ft-817 and I'm looking at various antenna options. I know that something like the Miracle Whip is very inefficient at ground level but being on the 15th floor, would it improve the performance greatly? I'm also looking at the Alex Loop but it's pretty pricey. There's also the Hamantenna CN35.

There is no roof access and of course, full length or even 1/2 length dipoles are out of the question.

Lots of options but probably the best performance would be to dangle an end fed half wave down from a support that takes it away from your balcony. The Par EndFedz would work. All your neighbors would see is a thin wire hanging down... perhaps slightly weighted.

A second option is a short vertical mounted to your balcony railing, and perhaps slanted slightly to the outside. Either a ham stick , Buddi Stick, or MP-1. Use a tuned radial.

Ditto above,also if your balcony is extruded out rather than inside and have neighboring balconies I have seen a few inverted l set ups between and dropped down from them.These hams had friendly neighbors.

I think a small loop would be your best choice. If cost is an issue, you can homebrew an adequate one from 10' of copper pipe and a small, inexpensive air-variable capacitor--small loops only get difficult/expensive when you start talking QRO. There are tons of homebrew examples on the web. This calculator works the design equations from the ARRL Antenna Book for you: http://www.66pacific.com/calculators/small_tx_loop_calc.aspx

1. R.F. noise pickup is fixed, and can be managed by noise cancellation techniques, or beam patterning.

2. Since you are using QRP, RFI is unlikely to be an issue, and can be safely ignored.

3. Antenna efficiency is a function of antenna length in many cases, or construction quality in the case of magloops. Magloops will work well if properly constructed, but are not exactly easy to pack away in most cases. I am not a fan of coax braid type magloops and would go to copper tube ones if you were to go in that direction.

Antenna problems basically split into two issues - efficiency and matching. Matching the antenna impedance to 50 ohm feedline takes up much of the average hams time. This can be solved by using a remote antenna tuner, which will allow you to experiment with diverse antenna solutions easily. Once you have a remote ATU, you can then try small verticals (use top loading if possible), random length wires or any other solution you wish to try.

For example, you could use two fishing rods, one at each end of your balcony, and string a loop of wire between them. Feed it with a remote ATU directly at the feedpoint, and you will have a pretty good, and probably quiet antenna. Since you are so high, it will be like an antenna high in the air. The re-bar in the balcony will probably have some effect, but it will not be great in my opinion. This is the flexibility of a remote atu.

If I were in your position this is what I would do, ensuring maximum flexibility in antenna options with the least matching difficulty. Even coax type autotuners can be used to feed an antenna directly if you protect them from the elements.

4. Building structure limitations are those only you know regarding what is acceptable to be mounted and so forth.

I have worked some QRP japanese hams who live in apartments without balconies.They operate at night and reel out a random length wire on the end fishing rod sticking out a window - so it can be done.

Your height is the ace in your deck, and I am betting you will get good results with a simple setup because of the altitude.

Hey All,I am moving to a 15th floor apartment (urban) with wide open views to the northwest and East. Given the height, I am considering a new Ham setup for QRP. We will have a balcony where I could operate from. I'll probably get a ft-817 and I'm looking at various antenna options.

I am only up three floors, BUT great view to south-west for my Outbacker vertical on the balcony. I use the counterpoise tripod mount and choke to handle common mode.Height matters ... great for contests with less than 100 watts, QRP, or QRPp :-)

I have operated from seven apartments and have some experience with antennas and RFI.

At 5 watts RFI will not be an issue and an unbalanced antenna such as the MFJ-1622 ($100) mounted on the balcony will work. The MFJ-1977 12 ft. telescoping whip can be used to improve performance on 40-20 meters.

Look at the "Portable Dipole" article in the "Articles" section of my website at www.ad5x.com. You'll also see pictures of how it is mounted on a balcony of the condo we enjoy vacationing in Port Aransas (Mustang Island), TX. Anyway, cheap and works great.

Thanks for the replies. I will look into all of these options. I'd like to remain inconspicuous and that can be difficult in a crowded urban landscape. The box fan loop looks interesting. The one that MFJ makes. The buddistick could be kept in a corner but then you're dealing with an unbalanced setup and having to use radials. I'll keep looking.

Just wanted to update this thread. For operation on a 15th floor balcony (temporary and discrete setup), I'm thinking of going the route of Alex Loopand Elecraft KX3 (need to save up) or something like the new Ten Tec QRP rig or a used IC-703 for low power operation. I was thinking of the Ft-817but the extra 5 watts on the other rigs could help. Can anyone say what kind of performance I can expect from that high up but also realizing that we areheading into a Sunspot minimum.

You may find you need to concentrate a bit more on receiver capability than transmit power. QRN in the city can be overwhelming. I've only experienced HF operation in the city while mobile. My TS-480SAT suffers max front end saturation in some areas, was fine in others a few blocks apart.

I was thinking of the Ft-817 but the extra 5 watts on the other rigs could help.

I've gotta say, the FT-817 is a nice little rig, especially when it's connected to a computer running Ham Radio Deluxe so you can access all of the settings easily...

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Can anyone say what kind of performance I can expect from that high up but also realizing that we are heading into a Sunspot minimum.

I don't have any experience with that with operating up that high, but with a good RF ground and/or an antenna that is not heavily dependent on RF ground, I would think that being up that high should be very nice (especially for V/UHF).The sunspot maximum (as disappointing as this cycle has been ) is still a year off. We're still about six years away from solar minimum, so we've got some time to play yet.

You may find you need to concentrate a bit more on receiver capability than transmit power. QRN in the city can be overwhelming. I've only experienced HF operation in the city while mobile. My TS-480SAT suffers max front end saturation in some areas, was fine in others a few blocks apart.

That could be argument in favor of the preselection capabilities of a magnetic loop.

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