Marty, I rode from camp area across pipeline to an overlook and Newam trail intersection and ended up on Azt....great route abv 8000'. I will show you on map when I get to camp tonight.

That's a better way to go. After Newham and the Quintille Connector you can jump on F. Prairie Rd before dropping down Quazimoto/West Secret/Double Agent. It's only 75 yds or so the road. Overlook is a hoot but you'll miss quite a bit of singletrack by accessing F. Prairie at the west Pkng area (the TH to Weatherford and Kachina Peaks trails). You used to be able to drop down to the old Secret trail there on a connector trail but that's all been closed because of an owl pack in the area.

If you've got the time and are deadset on Overlook you could climb Weatherford Trail and then after the Kachina Peaks junction doubleback on Overlook. Then drop down to Secret.

"Fart in a paper bag, after eating the #17 plate from filibertos. STRAVA!" M77Ranger.

Gotta chime in on this one. I know of at least 5 Flagstaff locals that all have different names for the same trails in Flagstaff. If the locals don't know the names of the trails, then how is "Dale" supposed to know?
Where is a non local to go to get correct information? One place is the web, where Dale's map can be found. If there is another source of trail info, could you please post it here instead of giving a guy crap for asking for it?

Gotta chime in on this one. I know of at least 5 Flagstaff locals that all have different names for the same trails in Flagstaff. If the locals don't know the names of the trails, then how is "Dale" supposed to know?
Where is a non local to go to get correct information? One place is the web, where Dale's map can be found. If there is another source of trail info, could you please post it here instead of giving a guy crap for asking for it?

This is an age-old argument for all riding locales when off-the-grid stuff is posted on-line. As I recall there were quite a few Sedona locals none too happy with Traildoc and his map. Anyway, this is water under the bridge. Dale caught a lot of grief a couple of years ago and changed most of the names on his map with the exception of Riccochet. He renamed Onceler Superfly but that's a moot point since most of it is now part of AZ trail or obliterated. The main issue with Dale was that he was somewhat unrepetent, didn't make an effort to learn the names and simply gave them his own names. Most us felt that he didn't get a vote. First dibs goes to the trailbuilder.

As for multiple names there's really not that much confusion. Jedi and Sheepherder are called one or the other. West Secret has several names. The FS prefers to call it West Secret for simplicities sake while most locals rue the loss of the real Secret Trail and call it other names like Double Agent or Quazimoto. There were actually two people who did the routing on West Secret and neither one wanted to name it. One works for the FS and probably doesn't care. The other trail that has several names is the parallel trail to lower Moto. Some call it Easter Island, Old F**ker, or Rock-n-Roll. It's a social trail and never really had a builder. It was burned in by equestrians who accessed it via Magdalena and then mtn bikers started riding it.

It shouldn't be too surprising that locals take pride in their trails and pride in the names. Trails have a history and it's part of local lore. For example, Dogfood Engineer.

Last edited by rockman; 06-21-2013 at 07:51 PM.

"Fart in a paper bag, after eating the #17 plate from filibertos. STRAVA!" M77Ranger.

Ricochet Trail - Flagstaff

Originally Posted by raisingarizona

I'm not giving the op any sh#t, I am just irritated with Dale the map maker.

It is the most readily available and accurate map out there, oh and by the way it is free. I'm not trying to score coolness points by coming back to the valley and trail-name dropping, I just want to have a general idea of how to get from point a to point z and hit all the points in between without getting lost. And Dale's map does that for a lot of people.

This is an age-old argument for all riding locales when off-the-grid stuff is posted on-line. As I recall there were quite a few Sedona locals none too happy with Traildoc and his map. Anyway, this is water under the bridge. Dale caught a lot of grief a couple of years ago and changed most of the names on his map with the exception of Riccochet. He renamed Onceler Superfly but that's a moot point since most of it is now part of AZ trail or obliterated. The main issue with Dale was that he was somewhat unrepetent, didn't make an effort to learn the names and simply gave them his own names. Most us felt that he didn't get a vote. First dibs goes to the trailbuilder.

As for multiple names there's really not that much confusion. Jedi and Sheepherder are called one or the other. West Secret has several names. The FS prefers to call it West Secret for simplicities sake while most locals rue the loss of the real Secret Trail and call it other names like Double Agent or Quazimoto. There were actually two people who did the routing on West Secret and neither one wanted to name it. One works for the FS and probably doesn't care. The other trail that has several names is the parallel trail to lower Moto. Some call it Easter Island, Old F**ker, or Rock-n-Roll. It's a social trail and never really had a builder. It was burned in by equestrians who accessed it via Magdalena and then mtn bikers started riding it.

It shouldn't be too surprising that locals take pride in their trails and pride in the names. Trails have a history and it's part of local lore. For example, Dogfood Engineer.

Some Sedona locals got together with a map company and made available a map with all current legal trails. It is available in town and I believe online. Another person made an online map for smartphone use. Is something like this available for Flag? If so, could someone post a link for the OP?
Three trails listed with multiple names is in fact confusing....

Some Sedona locals got together with a map company and made available a map with all current legal trails. It is available in town and I believe online. Another person made an online map for smartphone use. Is something like this available for Flag? If so, could someone post a link for the OP?
Three trails listed with multiple names is in fact confusing....

Still want to ride sometime this week?

Absolutely, but the stakes in the game may have just changed. Looks like it's just north of the pipeline and south of Friedlein Prairie Rd. There's a spotter plane on it and a bunch of Hot Shot crews heading that way. bummer.