Syria membership in Arab League to be restored after Geneva-2 deal reached – Secretary General

Syrian membership in the Arab League will be resumed immediately after an agreement is reached at the Geneva-2 peace talks and certain changes take place, the organization’s Secretary General Nabil Elaraby said in an exclusive interview with RT.

The Arab League suspended Syria’s membership back in November
2011 over the government’s violent crackdown on civilian
demonstrators protesting against the rule of President Bashar
Assad.

The League’s Secretary-General Nabil Elaraby told RT Arabic what
conditions Damascus should meet in order to regain its seat in
the regional organization. In the interview with Amal Hannaoui,
he also shared his opinion about the settlement of the Syrian
crisis as well as other tensions in the
region.

RT:Moscow played a prominent role in the Syrian
conflict and with the Iranian nuclear program. What about its
role in Egypt? And what role should Russia play in Iraq and
Libya?

NE: Since you mentioned Moscow’s role in the Syrian
conflict, I would like to start with that, because as the
Secretary-General of the League of Arab States, I am seriously
concerned by Moscow’s position on Syria. The people of Syria took
to the street just like the people of Egypt, Libya, Tunisia and
Yemen did before them. People wanted to get rid of the regimes
that had come to power through military coups and had ruled for a
very long time. These regimes ignored the demands of their
people. They sought to reassert their power with an iron fist. I
expected Russia to show understanding in this situation. But the
role Russia plays today is to stand in the way of much-needed
change. It is Russia who vetoes UN Security Council resolutions.
The Security Council has repeatedly attempted to take
humanitarian action with respect to Syria – achieve a ceasefire,
deliver humanitarian aid and medications for the suffering people
of Syria. But all these efforts failed due to Russia’s
opposition, and I don’t understand that.

RT:So, what about Russia’s role in Egypt? And what
needs to be done in Iraq and Libya?

NE: First of all, Russia has a lot of positive experience
with Egypt. There is real, long-standing friendship between our
countries. I think that the recent rapprochement between Russia
and Egypt is step in the right direction which enhances stability
in the region.

RT:What should Russia do in Iraq and Libya?

NE: This is a totally different subject. In Iraq and
Libya, we see different groups clashing with each other. Both
countries have their problems. I think we just need a ceasefire
between conflicting groups in both countries, and we need to
provide necessary assistance for the governments of these two
countries.

RT:Given the large number of problems and conflicts,
where do you think the Arab world is going today?

NE: Who said the Arab world should go anywhere? Who said
that? You have to be more specific. For example, if you were to
ask me about the Palestinian issue, I would say that the Arab
world should insist on changing the current situation and putting
an end to the Israeli occupation. That’s the position of the Arab
world. If you ask me about Syria, I will say that the Arab world
has adopted enough resolutions with an overwhelming majority. The
latest resolution, the on participating in the Geneva conference,
was adopted unanimously.

RT:We will come back to that, but still, where is the
Arab world going today?

NE: I don’t think this is the right way to put a question:
“Where is the Arab world going today?” or “Where is the
European Union going today?” You can’t talk about things like
that. We have specific issues, and that’s what we should talk
about.

‘Ongoing ‘tragedy’ in Syria should be stopped asap’

RT:Some pundits say the Arab League’s role in
resolving conflicts in some Arab countries, especially Syria, is
not as prominent today. What is the League’s current position on
Syria and the Geneva II conference?

NE: In all our resolutions, the Arab League supports the
idea of a political solution to the crisis and speaks in favor of
convening a conference in Geneva at an early date. The Arab
League works on that in keeping with the resolutions it has
adopted. I have had meetings with all the leaders, and I have
sent numerous letters to the UN Security Council. We insist that
the tragedy that goes on in Syria today has to be stopped as soon
as possible. Millions of people suffer because of it. Six million
refugees inside Syria suffer from the cold and lack of
medications. Two million refugees are outside Syria in
neighboring countries, which has a very negative effect on those
countries. This is why we need to convene this conference as soon
as possible. The Geneva conference will not resolve all the
problems in a day, or in a week, or in 10 days. I don’t know how
much exactly it will take. But at least this conference has a
clear goal: first, to launch the transition period, which is, by
the way, what the final communique of last year’s Geneva
conference says, and, second, to form a viable government that
would have full executive power in Syria.

RT:Some say that the Arab League’s role in the Syrian
crisis did not go beyond imposing sanctions against the Syrian
government by suspending Syria’s membership in the League. At the
same time, the League does nothing to improve the situation in
Syria. Why do you think this happens?

NE:This is wrong. The League did all it could from July
2011 to January 22, 2012. I personally went to Damascus three
times – twice on my own initiative and once with a group of
foreign ministers on behalf of the Council – trying to influence
the regime’s policies. We made three demands: First, we demanded
that government forces should stop opening fire on peaceful
protesters; second, release political prisoners; and third, real
political reforms. We did what we could for six months. Then,
based on a request by a part of the Syrian people and on our own
initiative as an organization operating under the auspices of the
UN and engaged in issues of peace and security, we appealed to
the UN Security Council asking them to discuss this issue. The
Security Council discussed this issue on January 22 2012, and the
UN Secretary General agreed to appoint a special envoy on behalf
of two organizations, the UN and the League of Arab States. So,
we are involved in this process, but so far we have been unable
to resolve this problem, just like the entire international
community with the UN Security Council has been unable to resolve
it. You should not criticize the League, saying it was unable to
do anything. The entire international community was unable to do
anything.

RT:When will Syria resume its membership in the
League?

NE: This will happen when certain changes take place in
Syria after the Geneva conference and when we see concrete
results. The idea of the Geneva conference is based on an
agreement between the government and the opposition. As soon as
this happens, Syria’s membership in the League will be resumed.

‘We’d be burying our head in the sand if we were to ignore the
need to support the opposition’

RT:Why is it that you don’t receive certain members of
external and internal opposition in preparation for the Geneva II
conference?

NE: We had a meeting in Cairo in August 2012, where we had
about 250 people from Syria, representing all sorts of opposition
groups, both internal and external. The opposition delegation at
the conference should represent all internal and external groups,
regardless of whether it is the Free Syrian Army or any other
group. We are willing to organize a meeting in Cairo where
everybody’s interest will be taken into account.

RT:Why is it that you did not invite, say, the
National Coordination Committee?

NE: You see, we have the League Council in the League of
Arab States, and the Council has decided that it is the Syrian
National Coalition who represents the Syrian opposition today. If
the National Coordination Committee, or any coordination
committees, want to join in, they are welcome. We will not
determine who should represent Syria. The League Council has
recognized the Coalition as the legitimate representative of the
Syrian people. The Secretary General has to follow the Council’s
decisions.

RT:Could the League host a conference where all
conflicting parties in Syria would come to the table? Don’t you
think that, by allowing certain Arab states to supply weapons to
the Syrian opposition, the League complicated the situation in
Syria even further?

NE: I’ll start with your second question. None of the
resolutions we have adopted in the past two years says anything
like that. But if we were to discuss supporting the opposition in
any way we can, including weapons, we would only do this in
response to Russia, the country your channel represents,
supplying weapons to the Syrian government, which is a party to
the conflict. Iran does the same. We would be burying our head in
the sand if we were to ignore the need to support the opposition.
But the opposition began to receive aid only two years after
Russia and Iran began to supply their weapons and Hezbollah got
involved in the conflict.

RT:Could the League host a conference where all
conflicting parties in Syria would come to the table?

NE: Of course.We are absolutely ready to organize a
meeting for all the parties. We have a little over a month left
before Geneva II, and I think it would be good to have a meeting
like that. I absolutely support this idea – to have a meeting
where everybody would be present. But the government will not
participate. We have, on numerous occasions, talked to the Syrian
leadership about the possibility of having a meeting at the
League headquarters for all the parties, including those inside
and outside of Syria. But they refused outright, saying they will
only meet with the opposition in Damascus.

RT:What role does the League play in solving the
problem of Syrian refugees, considering that many Arab states
consider themselves friends of the Syrian people?

NE: We are in close contact with the governments of the
countries receiving refugees. League experts have visited refugee
camps in all the Arab countries. We provide aid for refugees. We
work to take care of this issue. But the proper solution would be
for them to go back to their country. But they can’t do that now,
with war going on, and also considering what will happen to them
if they return to Syria.

RT:Mr. Secretary-General, I’m just trying to ask
some questions that many people have.

NE: Very well. I will try to answer them.

RT:Do you think the Syrian opposition can form one
delegation to represent it at the Geneva II conference, as Moscow
insists?

NE: In this kind of conflict, the opposition always tends
to become fragmented, because it represents different groups.
This is only natural. For example, remember what happened in
Algerian 1961-1962. The opposition there was fragmented as well;
certain opposition leaders were even assassinated. Coming back to
your question about the Syrian opposition, I would say yes. Many
groups, including Kurds, have joined the National Coalition. I
think they will come to an agreement to send a delegation to
Geneva.

RT:You do a lot to resolve the Syrian conflict. Whom
do you blame for what is happening in Syria?

NE: Like I said from the start, it is all the regime’s
fault. During my visits to Syria, I spoke about the need to have
a proper understanding of history. When people take to the
street, you have to respond to their demands. The crisis started
in March 2011, and until the end of 2011 there was no civil war.
The problem could have been easily solved at that point. All the
resolutions that the League adopted from the beginning of the
crisis and until November 2011, said unequivocally that the Assad
regime could continue until 2014 but real political reforms were
necessary. That was our position.

‘There’s no military government in Egypt’

RT:Let’s move on to Egypt. Do you think the current
situation in Egypt is favorable for a referendum on amending the
Constitution?

NE: We need a referendum on the Constitution. We have to
start taking steps according to the roadmap in order to calm
things down. I am not excited about the overall situation. Bitter
confrontation continues. But I hope things will calm down after
the referendum.

RT:Mr. Secretary-General, why is it that we don’t
see any Arab initiatives regarding Egypt while Americans and
Europeans have come up with quite a few?

NE: What do you mean by “Arab initiatives”? We’ve had
numerous visits. True, we did not have a common initiative but we
had visits. We visited many Arab countries.

RT:But Americans and Catherine Ashton, while on a
visit to Egypt, spoke about the need to bring the Muslim
Brotherhood back into the picture.

NE: No, that’s not what they said.They said that the
political process in Egypt should be inclusive. That is, I think,
the word they used. The political process should include
everybody except for those who chose the path of violence and
terror.

RT:Do you think the recent statements by the Egyptian
military government may help relieve tensions in Sinai?

NE: I don’t know what you mean by “Egyptian military
government.” There is a government in Egypt; it is not a
military government. There is a government: The president is the
former chairman of the Constitutional Court; the prime minister
is a lawyer with a PhD in economics.

RT:The military say they will not tolerate attacks on
the army and police anymore.

NE: There is no such thing as “the military.” I don’t know
what this is. There is the minister of defense. There is the
minister of the interior. There is the minister of industry and
trade. There is the minister of foreign affairs. I don’t know
what the “military” is.

RT:For example, the defense minister says…

NE: Of course, it is the defense minister’s responsibility
to defend the country. He wants security. He wants to exterminate
terrorist strongholds in Sinai. This is perfectly normal. This
does not mean that there is some kind of “military” in Egypt.

RT:Do you think Egypt can afford having two presidents
on trial at the same time?

NE: I will tell you what I think. I don’t want any trials.
I don’t know anything about that. I have not read the
indictments. I don’t know what the charges are. I can’t talk
about that. I would like us to use the same methods some other
nations have used.

RT:What I mean is both presidents have their
supporters. Ex-president Morsi has his supporters, and
ex-president Mubarak has his. Morsi and Mubarak’s supporters
stage street protests. The political and economic situation is
unstable. Do you think Egypt can afford having these trials at
such a time?

NE: I can’t answer this question because I am not fully
familiar with the situation. But I would prefer to keep things
calm. I know that there are serious reasons for having those
trials. But all I know about the charges is what they say in the
media. Unfortunately, I don’t know anything apart from that.

RT:Could you please comment on the current tensions
between Cairo and Ankara?

NE: This is an important question, and I will answer it. I
met with [Prime Minister of Turkey] Mr. Recep Tayyip Erdogan
a few times. I admire him and his ideas. What’s more, Turkish
Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu is my friend. But I absolutely
don’t understand the methods the Turkish authorities have been
using recently to interfere in the affairs of our region.
Especially considering how emotional they get. Perhaps this is
because the failure of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt had an
effect on the “Islamic project” Turkey has announced. So, of
course, I would like to see things calm down. Turkey is an
important nation. It plays an important role. Historically,
Turkey has always had a special relationship with Egypt and other
Arab states. I hope that the situation will improve.

RT:Could you please comment on the concerns some Arab
states have regarding the agreement on the Iranian nuclear
program reached at a recent conference in Geneva?

NE: Let’s start with Iran.It is an important state as
well. Iran has a long history with all the Arab states,
especially in the Gulf. But I can’t agree with the policies Iran
has been pursuing in recent years. Iran has been interfering in
many situations. This morning I met with the Grand Imam of
Al-Azhar. I won’t go into the details of our conversation but we
discussed, among other things, how Iran interferes into Arab
states’ affairs. Just like any other nation that has joined the
Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, Iran has the right to enrich
uranium under international supervision. Iran is entitled to use
nuclear technology but only for peaceful purposes. Iran has
recently taken steps to rectify the situation, which is
encouraging to me, and I have said so. But I think the reason
this is important is because it is a first step towards turning
the Middle East into a nuclear-free zone. Arab countries have
been demanding this since 1974. We live in a region where we have
the nation of Israel, which has a nuclear program and nuclear
weapons. Everybody knows that. But until this day the Israeli
nuclear program is not under the supervision of the International
Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA). So I regard the Geneva agreement as
a good occasion to address this issue in earnest and create a
nuclear-free zone in the Middle East.

RT:What do you make of the recent reports suggesting
that some Arab states are siding with Israel against Iran? Do you
think this may be an exaggeration?

NE:I don’t know about that. I don’t think it’s
possible. There is a real problem between Arab states and Israel.
It has to be resolved by Israel withdrawing its troops from all
the occupied Arab territories.

RT:Do you think that tribal and regional strife in
Libya can be just as dangerous as sectarian strife in Iraq?

NE: The Libyan people are quite homogeneous; they are not
divided into different denominations. Unfortunately, the Gaddafi
regime ruled over Libya for 42 years, and there were no
institutions in the country during this time. Currently, Libya
tries to establish proper institutions. The League stays in close
contact with Libya. We have our office there helping the
government to set up proper institutions. Perhaps I will soon
visit Libya in order to help the Libyans together with the UN to
form government institutions and normalize the situation in the
country. We have been in close contact with the Libyan
authorities since 2011, helping them with these issues. In
October, we had a large delegation visiting Libya. The UN also
helps the country to set up proper government institutions.

RT:Could you be a bit more specific?

NE: I am specific.

RT:These government institutions you talk about, do
they help the Libyan people?

NE: Yes, they help normalize the situation and establish
dialogue. That’s our goal.

RT:Since we see uncontrolled circulation of weapons in
many Arab states, maybe the League should re-establish its
military committee?

NE: This issue regarding the military committee has been
under discussion for quite some time. We need to revisit it. We
have the Arab Peace and Security Council within the League, and
we can ask this council to take up this responsibility. We have
to do something about this issue. We have been considering
necessary steps for a few months now. Next March, the League will
have a summit in Kuwait, and we will discuss the matters related
to the further development of the League’s structure, including
making the Arab Peace and Security Council more efficient.

Only Washington has ‘leverage ’over Israel

RT:It’s been over two decades since the Madrid
Conference took place, and Washington is still playing the
leading role in the peace process. What is then Moscow’s role in
this process?

NE: Speaking of the Madrid Conference, I want to be frank:
I am personally against the concept that was adopted at that
conference because it halted the processes that the UN was
working on prior to the conference. Granted, the UN failed to put
an end to the conflict…the Security Council set up the Middle
East Quartet, which holds talks but to no avail.

The conflict needs to be resolved. The Arab states captured it as
their final decision on November 17 of the last year. After that,
we had consultations with the involved countries and the
permanent members of the UN Security Council to confirm their
commitment to this track. They all pledged their support. For
example, the US Secretary of State visited Cairo and confirmed
that the US wishes to have this conflicted resolved in an
established timeframe just like the Arab states do. After this,
the Palestinian-Israeli negotiations resumed, yet they have not
yielded any results so far. The timeframe for these negotiations
is set at nine months. There are still a few months left till the
end of this period. Let’s see what outcome we get.

RT:What is Moscow’s role in this process?

NE: Moscow always plays a key role. At the end of day,
this matter will go to the UN Security Council which will have to
make a decision. So, the role of Moscow in this settlement
process is quite obvious. Russia has always been an advocate for
the rights of the Arab nations, and especially of the Palestinian
people, in this conflict with Israel. I always speak very highly
of Russia’s role.

RT:Two years ago, Moscow suggested hosting a peace
conference similar to the one that took place in Annapolis. Yet
some believe there are forces out there trying to keep this and
other related issues under US control. Could you comment on
this?

NE: I support every effort aimed at reaching peace by
putting an end to Israeli occupation and establishing two states
living side by side in peace, with Jerusalem as the capital of
the Palestinian state. We support whatever Moscow does along this
track.

RT:Are there any forces trying to keep this and other
related issues under US control?

NE: Let’s be honest. The United States is the only country
in the world that can force Israel to accept the conditions I
just mentioned. I would like to tell you something. When Israel
occupied the Sinai Peninsula, Moscow and Cairo had a very close
relationship. I worked at the Foreign Ministry at the time, and I
personally heard Russian officials suggesting to the Egyptian
authorities that they should improve their relationship with the
US in order to maintain proper balance between the US and Russia.
So, we all know that Russia plays an important role but Russia
does not have leverage with Israel.

RT:Some say the League is unable to make Israel stop
settlement activity or the Gaza blockade. What would be your
comment?

NE: So you’re saying the League is unable to make Israel
stop settlement activity? Well, can anyone in the world make
Israel stop settlement activity? What can the League do if even
the UN Security Council can’t make Israel stop? What can the
League do if no institution in the whole world can stop Israel?
Washington alone has the leverage.

RT:Some think it may be a while before the Palestinian
issue is resolved. What are the chances of achieving Palestinian
reconciliation? How long will it take? Why aren’t efforts made to
at least implement the existing agreements?

NE: In keeping with the decisions made by the League, the
government of Egypt continuously makes efforts along this track.
I am in contact with [Palestinian] President Mahmoud Abbas. He
fully supports the Palestinian reconciliation agreement which was
signed in Cairo on May 4, 2011. As of now, the action is due on
the side of Hamas to facilitate the elections across all of the
occupied Palestinian territories.

RT:Moscow believes that Geneva, diplomacy and
compliance with international law are the best way to address
issues in the Middle East and in the Arab world. At what level is
the cooperation and coordination between the Arab League and the
Kremlin, and what are the prospects here?

NE: We maintain contact with Russia continuously. Sergey
Lavrov is an old friend of mine. Last time I saw him was about
two months ago. We had a disagreement on the Syrian issue but we
maintain contact at all times. I have regular meetings and phone
conversations with the Russian ambassador, so everything is in
order.

RT:Our guest today was Secretary-General of the League
of Arab States Nabil Elaraby, many thanks for being with us.