Walther’s new LGV Master Ultra .177 air rifle: Part 2

The LGV Master Ultra with a wood stock is what readers have been asking to see.

Okay! I’m in Maryland with Mac, and today you’ll get to look at the .177 Walther LGV Master Ultra. This one has a big surprise — well, it was a big one for me.

First, the rifle. I told you in Part 1 that this .177-caliber LGV feels just like the .22-caliber rifle I tested earlier. As it turns out, that will be important to note — but I’ll get it that in a bit.

Cocking effort
I believe I mentioned that this rifle felt like it took a little more effort to cock than the .22. The bathroom scale says this one takes 40 lbs., where the .22 took 38 lbs. The cocking action is bank-vault-door smooth. A Mercedes should be so nice!

Early dieseling
The test rifle dieseled on the first few shots. They were also going supersonic, so I wore electronic hearing protectors because the noise in my office was so loud. The .22 I tested didn’t diesel at all, but I have a theory about that. I think the .22 may have been shot more times by Umarex USA, and this .177 never did get shot. I suspect all the new guns will diesel a little at first.

The hearing protectors I was wearing allowed me to hear the action that much better (I have bad ears and the electronic earmuffs amplify sounds between shots), and it sounded extra crisp. Everything works exactly the way it should, and all the springs and locks are crisp and exact. So, the dieseling gave me the chance to hear the action like a person with young ears.

Trigger-pull
The 2-stage adjustable trigger on this test rifle is glass-rod crisp. Walther calls it a match trigger, and on this rifle they aren’t far off. I measured the pull and it broke consistently at 1 lb., 10 oz. That’s identical to the trigger on the .22 rifle. All that’s different is this one has no creep in the second-stage pull.

Velocity
Okay, now for the interesting news. The first pellet I tested was the H&N Baracuda Match that weighs 10.6 grains in .177 caliber. I fired a long string of them and made sure the gross dieseling was over before taking the average. The average was 831 f.p.s., which is way more than I was expecting. Had this been a 12 foot-pound gun, the average would have been around 700 f.p.s., so this one is clearly more than that! In fact, it produced 16.26 foot-pounds of muzzle energy to my great surprise.

The velocity ranged from a low of 812 f.p.s. to a high of 843 f.p.s. — a 31 f.p.s. spread. The 812 was an anomaly, though, and the next slowest shot went 821 f.p.s. I do think the gun will settle down more after 1,000 shots have been fired through it, and I would look for the spread to get tighter.

The test rifle isn’t a 12 foot-pound gun at all, and yet it feels no harsher than the .22 I tested before. Cocking is slightly harder, but you won’t notice it. That is what I meant when I said I would get to it later — you get 16 foot-pounds but it still feels as smooth as 12!

Crosman Premier lite
The second pellet I tested in the rifle was the 7.9-grain Crosman Premier lite. They averaged 893 f.p.s. in this LGV. The low was 888 and the high was 907 f.p.s. — for a 19 f.p.s. spread. At the average velocity, Premier lites generated 13.99 foot-pounds of muzzle energy.

JSB Exact RS
For a lightweight pellet I decided to try the JSB Exact RS dome. They weigh 7.3 grains, but are smaller than many other lightweight pellets. I figured they would go just as fast, but I was wrong. Though they fit the LGV breech very relaxed and easy, they averaged only 888 f.p.s. for an average energy of 12.79 foot-pounds. And the spread was from 872 to 901 f.p.s. — 29 f.p.s. They don’t give me confidence in this rifle — especially after seeing what the H&N Baracudas did.

Maybe a retest is in order?
Because this gun seems to need a break-in more than most I’ve tested recently, I’m thinking I’ll come back and revisit velocity after all the accuracy testing has been done. The rifle will have several hundred more shots on it, and the numbers may change a little.

Future testing with this LGV
Here are the accuracy tests I plan on doing with this rifle.

* 10 meters with the installed open sights
* 25 yards with the installed open sights
* 25 yards with a peep sight (if possible)
* 25 yards with a scope
* 50 yards with a scope

Sights removable? What inserts fit?
Someone asked me if the open sights are removable. As far as I can tell at this point, they are. I hope to remove them both for the scoped rifle test.

Someone also asked me if Anschütz sight inserts fit the front globe. Well, I don’t know, because I don’t know if I have any Anschütz inserts. I have plenty of sight inserts, but none of them say Anschütz.

I can tell you this: Neither Weihrauch front sight inserts nor FWB (300S) front inserts fit this rifle’s front globe. The projections on the sides of the front sight inserts don’t seem to align with the slots they’re supposed to fit into. I’m not done checking, so don’t take this as the final word.

Impressions so far
I’ve seen enough to know this LGV is just as good as the .22 I tested. I’ll be very surprised if it doesn’t group just as well. And now there’s a happy surprise that this gun produces well beyond 12 foot-pounds of muzzle energy. I can’t wait to shoot it!

65 thoughts on “Walther’s new LGV Master Ultra .177 air rifle: Part 2”

Good morning People of this wonderful world. I say wonderful because we have H&N pellets of all types and quality, and when i say quality i mean excellent. A while back i discovered Air Arms Diabolo worked amazingly in all my .177’s at 30 yards , i never got around to using them in .22 until i got some Falcons and again the results were blinding. Then after a bit of research i bought some tins of H&N’s and the results in my air rifles were a marked improvement, i don’t have a chrono but i noticed they shot higher up the target than the Diabolo’s which are lighter by 0.2gr than H&N Field Trophy’s

It’s remarkable to see a difference of 2 to 4 ft/lb in this rifle over others, that’s something that doesn’t usually happen with heavier pellets in springer’s only with PCP. I can’t wait to see the accuracy tests because for me i find them the most accurate pellet i have tried so far, and weighing a tin i found 95% of the pellets were exactly the same. I have not tried the Baracuda Match yet but i have tried the copper coated Baracuda Power which are 10.99g, but i shall certainly buy a tin next time the funds are up in the Angry Angry Gun Company.

Oh!, sorry, this a report on the .177 LGV isn’t it. My apologies for waffling on about the wonders of H&N pellets as seen through my eyes.

Regarding the heavier pellets striking higher on your target. This is to be expected with a springer. The muzzle flips up when the trigger is pulled. The slower, heavier pellet leaves the barrel later when the muzzle has risen more. The result is that the heavier pellet strikes the target higher. Hope this makes sense.

Same experience here. H&N pellets seem to work better for me than anything else I’ve tried (tin and box Crosman Premiers, RWS Superdome and Meisterkulgen, JBS Exact and Jumbo and some Gamo, Ruko and some Czech and Chinese made pellets whose brand names I don’t remember) in my guns.

This new LGV seems like a great rifle. When I’m in the market for another springer this one’s going to give some tough competition to the HW-98 that I’ve been lusting after for some time now.

I learned a valuable lesson about C02 today. Don’t carbonate you mocha latte in a soda stream machine. It looked good, but not the taste was no where near what I imagined it would be…..instead it was more like half tart mocha coffee and half tart chocolate whipped cream.

Generally, the coffee I make is black and thick as mud. Today I ran out of coffee so I tied my wife’s folders chocolate silk coffee and poured it over a 1/2 shot of sugar and 2 shots of milk. Ok …so it’s a poor man’s espresso,latte or whatever they call it…..why pay 4.25 when you can make your own for a quarter? Apparently, running it through the soda stream didn’t help it.

If you want the ultimate in coffee, you can try this idea I just read about in a Robert Ludlum novel. A super-elite venture capitalist has his own supply of a specially prepared coffee bean. It is grown in some obscure place where it is devoured by the local monkeys and then excreted whole without being digested. The natives will then go eagerly mining for these beans which they then wash and sell at a high price. The result is “the most complex java in the world with hints of caramel and other flavors…and at bottom an extra element that could only be described as ‘jungly’.” The guys colleagues kiddingly call this a crappuchino. Don’t know if there is truth to this or whether Ludlum made it up.

Crappuccino is real, and I have had it. It’s grown in Indonesia, where the coffee bean is eaten by a civet…a cat-like creature. They harvest the droppings of the animal, completely remove the excrement and sell the beans. In Indonesia, this coffee is relatively inexpensive. In the U.S., it can run $50+ per pound (and I’ve heard of prices as high as $500/lb.).

I used to work at a company where one of my employees was the daughter of an oilman who had been living in Indonesia for several decades. Whenever he visited the U.S., he’d bring a few pounds of the coffee for his daughter, who brewed up a pot for everyone in the department. I was the only one brave enough to drink it.

My 853 is probably the same as 753 with different stock and sights. I’ve given up on my notes and searching past airguns blogs.

Since it is raining out today, I grabbed my 853 and a box full different .177 pellet tins and headed for the basement. I managed to clear a path to my pellet trap. After shooting through my stock of .177 pellets, I would say the RWS R-10 Match 8.2gr 4.5mm pellets did the best. I call them rifle match, but I think they sell it under heavy match at PA.

As for 10M shooting, I can’t find some of my notes. For fun, I did manage a 1mm ctc 5 round grouping using a Daisy Avanti 853 (which I called it a 753 earlier) with a scope. I bought it used with a custom walnut stock and a newer LW barrel. Later I worked on the trigger and put the 753 sites. I wish I could remember what pellets I used. I will have to go shoot some pellets through it or find my notes, whichever comes first.

The 853 has a custom finish on the stock, but it’s not not walnut. I shot a 1-4-2-1-5 mm ctc 5 round groupings or .039″-.157″-.078″-.039″.- .197″ ctc. The last notes I have on the 853 was in March 2010. It was about the time Tom went into the hospital.

Lately, Ive been shooting .22LR rifles. With open sights at 10M I’ve been using cci cb longs and with a a scope set at 25 yards I’ve been using cci green tag target ammo. I don’t hunt much over 25 yards and the green tag ammo puts the shot where I want it. On larger game or distances the stingers, velocitors and aguila sup max do the job, but are definitely more louder rounds.

BB,
I find the Baracuda Match pellets with screw on cap weigh in between 10.3-10.4 grains (not the 10.65 branded on the can lid). Even factoring that in, the LGV is showing over spec power during break in period. You taught me a very important lesson about a year ago that anytime you open up and re-lube a springer that it takes some time to settle down. 50-100 seems about right. I wonder if there is some excess oil that needs to burn off that is adding a little extra punch.

Other topic…
Been trying to refine my bench rest shot results with a springer. Using a sandbag and open left palm, my best 10 shot groups yield 3/16″ at 10 yards. So I tried a piece of high density sofa foam (a 4″ cube) as my rest. No left palm and no sand bag. Just a very light finger hold behind the foam. This produced my best 10 shot groups ever with a springer at 5/32″ at 10 yards. I didn’t trust my results and shot another 10, again the same results. Springers act just like cats, they do what they want to do, when they want to do it. Some day I’ll learn better to think I can master either one.

With this rifle’s great performance, I thought that a big surprise had no where to go but down, but it appears there is yet another positive. It reminds me of the S200 with its extra high power. In that case, I can see the disadvantage of being excluded from competitions which require lower power, but higher power is generally good other things being equal.

Victor, why does the ammo go missing at night at Walmart? Do the employees have the effrontery to steal? It is disheartening when the new stock gets gobbled up. I had the impression that there was a huge list of backorders that have to be filled and once the stock started to reappear on shelves then we would be back to normal. But here’s further evidence of the ongoing demand for ammo which I also saw in the long lines for the gunstore shooting range. In times of shortage wouldn’t you want to hoard? Instead, people seem bent on shooting it up and then buying more. Groan.

How’s this to complicate our understanding of racism. Carol Mosely Braun was the first female African-American to serve as United States Senator. I happened to be in graduate school in Illinois where she was based at the time and weren’t all the professors heralding this as some kind of breakthrough in race relations. I think Braun finally either got ejected or failed to run for re-election after displaying massive incompetence and then coming under investigation for taking long trips to Africa with her personal assistant. Naturally, she denied everything. More interesting, though, was a later incident where some African-American down on his luck tried to snatch her purse and made her lose her balance in the process. (In other words the sort of guy she was supposed to be representing.) If he was bargaining on leniency from his own race in the event of failure, that was one spectacular miscalculation. Braun pushed hard to give him the maximum of 20 years which she succeeded in doing. Coming from misappropriater of funds that seemed especially weird. The cultural theorists would say that class trumps race….

Victor, you’ve got some guts confronting the Nazi for his horrible teaching tactics. Very deserved, but that is one of those conversations where you just wonder what could one say. 🙂

Michael, I agree that most teachers do above and beyond the call. Look at the principal of Sandy Hook hurling herself at the homicidal lunatic and certain death to protect her students. Don’t know if I could do that. Greater love hath not man… Maybe the failures look especially egregious against such a high standard.

J-F, your suspension for kissing your girlfriend and her exoneration just proves there’s not much sense to suspensions. My brother was teaching middle school students who got it in their heads to trick a girl into taking a pill of Exlax. (Why??!) She did with no effect whatsoever. The result? She got suspended along with everyone else. (?) But J-F, I happen to know why you got suspended for a kiss. The situation is clearly the same as Beulah B., the formidable gym teacher in a film called Porky’s. She is the self-appointed enforcer of morality as when she tells her wayward colleague: “Moral turpitude. It’s in your contract.” But the film ends with Beulah with a crazed expression pulling and hauling at the pants of a male student while others attempt to restrain her.

As I watched the Walmart staff cut the boxes of ammo open, a long line was already forming. I suspect that a lot of customers know what days ammo is restocked. Again, I left before they were done, so I don’t know how long the line got. I suspect that it must have gotten pretty long because it was all gone the next morning. Even worse, you can’t really “hoard”, because Walmart now has a 3 box limit per customer. Of course, you could always just take a bunch of family members with you, which is probably what happens.

The other Walmart claims that ammo goes “unaccounted for” by morning. I assume that means that it’s being stolen by the night shift. I have trouble believing that this because Walmarts claim to fame in retail is their super tight inventory control.

Regarding the story about Carol Mosely Braun, whom I’ve never heard of, or don’t remember. That reminds me of something that I heard from a human resources person at this one defense contractor that I worked at. For over 3 decades this one company would only hire people of a particular religion. Eventually the company was sued (and loss) because they were a defense contractor, and after all, people of all colors, races, and religions were paying the taxes that ultimately funded the work being down at a particular site. So now they had to hire blacks. Well, what the human resource person told me, after I saw her in tears, was that there was a pattern that only applied to blacks. This place was a worse-case “retire in place” type of site, where nothing got done, BUT they couldn’t be investigated because they hid under the “Black World” umbrella. Not even Senators or Congressmen could check it out. One guy went blind while working there because of diabetes, and yet he continued to just show up for years without a problem. Anyways, the pattern was this, a black person would be hired, and soon realized what everyone did while at work, so they would simply do what everyone else was doing. Well, it was very different when THEY did what everyone else was doing, so they’d be labelled lazy or incompetent, and got fired. Having worked in defense for almost two decades, I know that there is a double standard, but nothing like this one place. I, personally, saw this place as a death to the career of anyone who still had any amount of ambition, or love for their work, so I quit after 2 years.

After I gave my two weeks notice, human resources admitted that there was a solid pattern of people like me quitting within two years. You see, anytime this company wanted real work to get done, they would always have to hire people from outside of the state, as they did with me. But none of us stayed more than two years, for obvious reasons. I was still young, LOVED what I did, and had worked at some of the most elite engineering companies on the planet, and just couldn’t see myself languishing in a place like that.

The company was eventually sold, but it was very hard to find a buy because of the security requirements needed to investigate it. I attended the executive meeting where a buyer was announced. An independent analysis gave this company the lowest possible technical rating. I knew this after just 5 weeks with the company, and I openly spoke of it. What else would you expect if the only qualification was your religion?

Today I met a girl. Well, I’d rather say a hoplophobic female human being. After my friend mentioned my love for shooting I had a lecture on my likes, features and habits. After listening for half an hour I humbly asked to be allowed to put a few words into her stream of consciousness.

I feel that I’ve ripped the picture of her world. Violently.

a) I don’t give female names to my guns. They are just Sako, Izh, Sauer, FWB, Gamo etc. with proper numbers and letters. And I don’t talk to them. Ever.
b) I have a steady job and income.
c) I do not sympathize Nazis or whatever totalitarian regime. And I’m not sociopathic.
d) I have more than 2 times 70 IQ score and a degree.
e) I have not and never had any fantasies about uniform or submission/domination and I am heterosexual. My friends are of both genders and what is most unspeakable there are mothers among them, and they enjoy making holes in paper too.
f) I do not enjoy killing. In fact I never killed any living being other than for food or by request for predator control under official supervision. I do target shooting for fun and self-improvement.
g) I never ever imagined a human in my crosshairs. And never wanted to. And I think if one starts, one should go and see the doctor.

Seems I left her shaken but alive 🙂 But what a rubbish some people have inside their heads!

We even have vegans. Luckily they are a tiny minority. Unluckily – a very loud and smelly one, if you know what I mean. They live on thin vegetable soup (I believe the stuff is as nutritious as that was fed to extermination camp prisoners) and when their immunity starts to weaken, their joints ache and their skin peel and rip – they say it’s their body rebuilding itself, and hair falling off is just because it’s taking away all the bodily waste.

My Mom’s a doctor. About 3 of 4 years ago they had a patient. She was in her early 20s, sect member and a fervent vegan. When she was hospitalised, she was 30 something kilos @ 1,69 m tall, with coccyx bone easily seen, stomach and kidneys almost off. Her boyfriend, also a vegan, was hospitalized in almost the same condition but he didn’t make it, he dropped below “the line of no return”. She survived, at the price of damaged kidneys, digestive tract and complete sterility.

For the entire time that I competed in target shooting, I never saw my guns as “weapons”. I saw them more like fine instruments that provided a way for me to measure my performance, both mentally and physically. I shot one bird when I was a kid, and lived to regret it. I can’t agree with those who try to judge others who hunt, but killing just isn’t me. Well, I have killed a few rats, but they were actually very aggressive and dangerous. A friends grandmother had rats in her shed, and one time one of these rats actually came out of the dark and jumped on to my back. Rats can be scary, when they are hungry.

I’ve always thought of my competition guns as being more like fine instruments, but you are also accurate in describing them as sports gear. A significant part of the whole experience of being a competitive marksman is knowing about, and caring for, your equipment. Some matches are shot in the rain, and so they need to be properly maintained.

I’m afraid it’s ME, who was going to be spanked or even bitten – she was extremely loud and aggressive when talking to me, despite me being quiet and calm.
Our great Party will not be pleased if I will contract something from her bite – it would be accounted as an understrengthening of our glorious Army and thus sabotaging our Party’s cause. I don’t want to go to uranium mines for that, comrade.

For the “suggested for” field, we don’t have a choice for field target. Since field target is really a very small part of airgunning, we didn’t add it. I could get it added, but we can only supply one choice for that field, so I would have to name it: Field target/small game hunting/plinking (but that’s too many characters).

Field target is actually the same as hunting for small game, so I thought it wasn’t necessary to list field target specifically. Since this gun wasn’t proven, I opted not to recommend it for field target in the longer description. However, if the gun proves accurate, I’ll add that to the description. Does that work for you?

I wouldn’t change anything, if you don’t already apply “field target’ as a suggested use for other guns. Of course, if you do, and it proves to be as accurate as the other related model that B.B. test, then I would suggest it. The reason is that the “Competition” model is fairly pricey. Serious competitors will usually find a way to “justify” the extra expense.

Edith,
Do you think just saying FT would be enough? Field Target shooters even refer to it as FT, don’t they? Saying small game and hunting is redundant, too. Small game would be enough. As in FT/small game/plinking.
-Chuckj

There are so many new shooters and new airgunners coming to Pyramyd Air’s site, that we like to spell things out.

If we wrote just “FT,” 99% of the people wouldn’t know what that means. I suppose we could use FT and say that only field target shooters will know what that means, but Pyramyd Air sees educating the customer as their No. 1 concern. So, no abbreviations for words unique to the shooting sports or airgunning.

BB, Looks like another winner! On an off note, have you ever tested a Hammerli 850 Air Magnum? Next, for a fun “plinking” rifle, would you go with a Crosman 1077 or Umarex Morph? Also, BB, I know you are correct when you say a low powered air gun isn’t good for animals (make that snakes). The most powerful air pistol I own is a Benjamin EE 22. I just need to work on that awful rear sight. I read on a lot of blogs that I’m not the only with that hates that rear sight. Thanks for you honesty!

BB,
I new it! Now this LGV makes more sense! A rifle this big and heavy, if not a target rifle, should have some power! If acuracy is there then there is no reason why Walther should not be making a uber 12 fpe version in .22! I must say again that i am not a power freak. I recently bought a very beautiful used BSA Airsporter RB that is in my opinion over sprung. I have already decided to re spring it to sub 12 fpe to make it more pleasant to shoot. Give me a smooth shooter any day to a harsh power house.

BB,This LGV is acting more like a pcp.If break-in doesn’t change it’s characteristics too much,than I would wonder why?
Oh let’s do it this way so I can use that cool term you coined a few blogs ago;swept volume.I feel “smartuh” just saying it.Anyway,if I have it right it is calculated by multiplying the piston crossectional area by the length of it’s stroke.Lets say I have two rifles with the same swept volume,but one achieves it with a long stroke and the other with a larger piston.Would the longer stroke favor the lighter pellets by continuing to accelerate them better all the way to the end of the barrel?And would the larger diameter piston favor the heavier pellets by being able to handle their larger mass with the greater volume of air?Could this be why the LGV is acting this way,or would increasing the piston’s mass account for it?-Tin Can Man-

Longer stroke = more volume if the diameter is the same.But in what you stated above where the diameter increased withe a shorter stroke.Referring to the old days a small block car engine would rev high and a big block would have lower RPMs.The big block had torque because of the stroke.The small block needed rpm to pump up the cylinder volume for compression.So I bet one pump with a medieum diameter piston is putting more volume in a given space than a little bigger diameter diameter and short stroke.That should give you more feet per second.(fps.)

This made me think again.If we got a hammer hitting a button.And the button is hit hard enough.And we have a certain amount of air stored and it releases air in that amount of time.(adjustable PCP guns)You can then control the air escaping for whatever weight pellet you have.Maybe we need an adjustable screw for airflow on a springer.But if you could come up with the correct spring I bet you would have less vibration and good power.