How To Rebut Gripes

Rebuttals should address reasons it is not a valid gripe, and should not accuse the gripe of being "silly" or "stupid."

When you run past people on the street you occasionally startle them, causing them to drop whatever they are carrying (mp3 player, soda cup, umbrella, newspaper, suitcase, shopping bag, etc). The absurd part is the fact that they ABANDON whatever item they happen to have dropped, as if it had no value whatsoever to them. I can understand someone abandoning a half eaten hot dog on the ground, but certainly not a shiny suitcase or a bag full of shopping items! I find it ridiculous. On the other hand I can understand someone fleeing from their belongings apon being threatened at gunpoint, but nobody is going to run away only because of a little accidental tap on a street corner! A good solution would be to code an action for peds to perform the "picking up" animation (restoring the fallen item) in situations where they dropped their item where a threat was NOT involved (weapon pointed, firing, etc). As a coder I can assure that it would be pretty simple to implement without any problems. The gripe may seem useless, but since it acutally happens very frequently, you notice it every time since it stands out as something out of the ordinary.

Perhaps R* were concentrating on things other than trivial little details like that.

I don't think it's trivial at all. Plus it would be really easy to fix in a future patch. It's not like it would take months to get right. The end result would certainly contribute to realism.

Not every game is going to be 100% realistic. And if you're a coder, why don't you just implement it yourself?

Theres no reason to go exploring, all alleys and side streets are the same. Almost no hidden content, no surprises, no weapons, no soul put into anything. Just a whole lot of places to go with nothing.

Yes that may be true but in a real city you won't just find weapons laying around all over the place,

Actually unlike SA I actually recognize several streets I have driven down before. And what you mean no hidden content go visit the statue of Liberty

If you hang out with your friends at Burger Shot, after the unseen mean, $100 gets deducted from your money. I have never - in my life - gone to Burger King and spent one hundred dollars there. Even if Niko had paid for his friend (which I doubt because Niko is poor) $100 would still be too much. Even if I got 20 Whoppers and a Steakhouse, still not $100 or even $50.

The cost of a meal is a little much, I agree, but I've learned that Roman and Little Jacob eat the most during meals, so usually I'll take them somewhere else, like darts or drinking, Brucie and Dwayne usually eat less. Also the "fancy-ness" of the place your going changes the price: 69th Street Diner-$50 SuperStar Cafe-$100. I hope that will help you.

The graphics engine makes everything glow red or orange, you can hardly see a thing. Either that or everything is deadly pale, almost icy white, again, making it hard to see any details or textures. At best, theres two minutes (two game hours) a day where LC is tolerable to the eye. I dont know if they were trying to create some of the famous atmospheres from III or VC, but they failed to do so.

Try changing your TV's settings like color and contrast, I had the same problem but doing that fixed it.

Your right to a point, I live near a beach, and when it rains or there is a lot of heavy surf the sand and dirt will reflect light if the Moon is out or you shine a light on it.

There's loads of petrol stations all around Liberty City but it's possible to drive around for hours while never running out. It would have been a good idea to make a little flashing light come on to tell you you're running out and you need to fill up. Would be something to spend money on anyway.

I always thought putting a gas limit would be realistic, but it can be a hassle to have to drive across town to a gas staion - only to drive back and run out. On top of that the game would have to process random gas values for every other vehicle on the road, that will take a bit of memory up, and eventually pedestrians would have to go to the gas station before they run out or just stop on the way, what a mess. I always liked how the cars are powered by unlimited source of energy and I hope it'll stay that way.

Seeing as GTA IV is set in 2008, a "Songs of the 70s" station would have fit in nicely, with songs from K-DST plus perhaps a few new ones. And on that note, as it is back in Liberty City, I would have liked a Double-Cleff FM or similar station. There was no classical station in San Andreas, which kind of worked with that setting, but certain pieces go quite well with Liberty City.

K109 The Studio is GTA IV's Songs of the 70s station, and LRR is the K-DST of GTA IV, without the K-DST songs (I'm assuming Rockstar lost the rights to the songs from SA). About a Double Clef FM type station, I don't think the average video game player likes classical music. I have never heard the players online, when they're talking about music, say that they would have liked a classical music station.

Jazz Nation Radio is sort of like the classical station; a bunch of old-sounding instrumental music that I never listen to.

JNR is not exactly a classical station, well, not in the sense that the griper is talking about. He meant music from the classical period. You know, 1600's-1800's?

I would like to see a fairly large Army Base, Okay I know that NYC has no Army Base but it has to have a National Guard Depot at least. If there was one I hope there would be APCs and an armory, but it can only be acessed once you get through a certain mission.

Having army chasing down a single person in NYC is WAY TOO UNREALISTIC. I'm glad the army's gone in GTA IV.

NYC Has plenty of Military bases, first off the United Nations building in Manhattan (which is featured in the game) and theres sub docks for the navy in Hell's Kitchen and other parts. Sure there's no Military activity in the game but in real life I dont think the NG has ever been called to take down one guy, that's what the SWAT (NOOSE) is for.--Gerry Spring 13:06, February 5, 2010 (UTC)

LOL, the UN is a military base?

You don't get to select foods to eat at Burger Shot or at Cluckin' Bell. And both of the burgers looks exactly the same. No difference about it. A disappointing realism. You don't even get to try and eat the Heart Stopper to see Niko get a heart attack.

I don't think Niko really cares for what he consumes, since the food in Liberty City is probably a damn sight better than the chow he ate in the Army and on the merchant vessels he served on. An assortment of food items at a single restaurant had no tangible benefit in GTA:SA, so I'm sure Rockstar learned from their mistakes and kept it simple.

Yep. They kept it simple, so R* wants show players that they don't even want to increase the aspect of realism. The selection of foods would be nice, I mean what's so hard about adding that feature anyway? They've done that in GTA: SA, so they can't just leave it out for no apparent reason. If they are promoting the "Heart Stopper" on TV, then why not add it in the game? It would be funny to see Niko eat the "Heart Stopper" and then get a heart attack. Otherwise, there's no realism without food selection.
I see your point in realism when it comes to food. But do you think Rockstar wanted players to focus on food, rather than the other fun things you can do. Possibly a reason why selections of food were not available, as opposed to San Andreas, was because eating was a method of regaining health in SA. And since R* focused on realism, they figured eating wasn't a realistic way to gain health. There are health packs and street vendors as another source to fix your health, or by means of cheats. Last thing, how fun would it be to sit in burger shot for an hour and eat?
dont know how to make smiley face.
i dont know to make a rebut. in san andreas you gained weight and then you lost it all all of the foods were so cj could gain weight so you needed multiple foods to control the quantity of weight so niko doesnt gain weight so he dont need the exact same food with different names

} Niko has five guns in his shirt pocket and may be severely injured or being chased by the law. Why would he care if he has a hamburger or cheeseburger? He only has seven seconds to eat anyway and if they incorporated choice in the menus, it would be unrealistic to see a gray menu pop up in front of you with Font Size 17 asking what meal you want as in GTA: SA.

I hated the food system in GTA:SA, it took way too long if you wanted a quick meal. I like GTA:IV's system, it's fast, simple health when your getting your ass kicked.

It's also unrealistic to buy a meal and have your money apearing on screen.

They could at least make Niko induce vomiting if making him eat 5 or more meals at once. His stomach isn't a bottomless pit.

The Francis International Airport has a glitch and inside the building, there aren't any luggages, cafés conveyor belts, seats... nothing. It's not realistic, unfortunately.

It's a glitch! You were not supposed to get inside in the first place!

Exactly! That's what degrades realism in the game!

In Vice City, you were allowed to go inside the airport and there were conveyor belts, waiting areas etc... But there was nothing to do there except walk around. It was pretty useless, since there was nothing to do. And as said before, it's a glitch, and you were not supposed to go inside.

Not true. In Vice City, the airport contains a health pack inside, and a hidden package. Also, it became important because in the mission Check Out At The Check In, you have to snipe a person without being spotted by a female person who is having a conversation. Now THATS worth something to do than doing "nothing to do there except walk around".

That's all there is to do in the Airport. Kinda pointless, don't you think? Three (two really, as Hidden Packages are replaced with Pigeons, and they're not inside) things doesn't warrant designing a place as large as the Airport is.

First off, you can't complain that Rockstar didn't let you walk around in a full interior to an airport that you aren't supposed to be in in the first place, null gripe. Second off hidden packages aren't even in GTA IV, and there are enough health packs around the city. Your suggestion to a shootout mission in an airport raises the question "What would happen if we made a mission about a shootout in an airport" which they did twice already in The Lost and Damned, and that raised a lot of 9/11 controversy. Think about it for a second, the airport is the way it is and is still very much interactive, so don't complain.--Gerry Spring 13:20, February 5, 2010 (UTC)

What about the mission No Russian in MW2? I would like to do something like that in GTA IV.Maybe not quite as Sadistic though but at least an interior and customs etc. Plus i loved camping in Escobar Airport and shooting everyone there. Skeezo 101 00:00, May 16, 2010 (UTC)

Poor Ammu-nation is gone? Somehow I don't think all the gun shops in New York are dank
little underground shops. Not to mention how I miss the Ammu-nation theme song!

It's explained in-game that both the purchase and vending of arms are illegal in Liberty City, so all weapons and ammo have to be purchased illegally (dank, underground shops.)

Yeah.. okay. Imagine that you were a police officer in Brooklyn and you saw a guy with a rocket launcher blowing up a diner. Of course they'd make a law to ban gun stores. As the other rebut-er said, Dimitri Rascalov explains this to Niko as he's driving him to an UNDERGROUND gun shop. Think a little... Play the game a little...

Fire engines don't respond to flaming vehicles, or anything for that matter.

Yes they do (some of the time) plus you can call them if you really want.

No they don't. Even if the firefighter saw flaming vehicles, they don't even bother putting it out. Another bad realism by R*.

The fire eventually goes out at least doesn't it?

Yes, which is fine, but it is the fact that R* had previously put in GTA fire engines that put out fires, and now that feature is taken out in IV. Obviously it wasn't hard to program, so why leave it out now? Sure, you could set a vehicle on fire, grab an engine and put it out yourself, but the bottom line is R* nixed a feature, whether it was "worth it or not" misses the whole point of realism.

Actually, when there's a fire, I call the fire department but by the time they get there, the fire's already out, so they just leave. The fire in San Andreas went out slowly and the fire department came quicker. Thus, them having to put out the fire.

Very redundant. I called 911 to call the FDLC and when they arrive (the cars are still burning) they see the fire, yet does'nt make any effort to put it out. Just another failed attempt of realism by R*.

How is that redundant?

It means that when the FDLC arrives in time and encounter burning vehicles, they simply stand around, and do nothing about it. Just another bad realism.

Redundancy is unnecessary repetitiveness, not bad realism. By the way, I have to try this feature out, to see if the FDLC actually puts out flaming vehicles. I'll do it later.

The redundancy is the fact that they repeatedly do nothing about a fire in front of them.

No, the redundancy is the fact that you keep saying "bad realism" and "redundancy" incorrectly. Anyway, maybe the firemen do nothing because they know the fire doesn't last very long.

Or maybe its because the firemen jsut does'nt feel like putting out fires and they just watch people get burned to death. I don't see them doing that in real life, now do they?
i dont know how to make a rebut.does it really matter that the fire engines dont work they were more annoying then useful it made me almost fail a mission 10 times because it kept knocking me off my bike besides it was probadly just a developer oversight

Agreed, your misuse of redundant is quite obvious and your gripe is quite foolish. The feature of 911 isnt so you can be a good little citizen and put out fires or get people CPR, its to steal Cop Cars, Ambulances and Firetrucks. The cops will actually respond which is funny because I would kick someones car and stand on another and the driver of said 2nd car would get mad and fight 1st driver for kicking his car. Then call cops and laugh. Not bad realism, but good fun --Gerry Spring 13:20, February 5, 2010 (UTC)

Imagine Niko blowing up a police helicopter and focusing on his enemy. He wouldn't bother to see if a taxi started to flame. Sure, it's unrealistic, but how many people show up outside with a flame-thrower just to test if the authorities do their work?

Buses do not drive around the city as in previous GTAs.

You can go to Star Junction or the Broker Bus Depot if you want one. It would be easier to steal one than to get it off the street. And it does not affect gameplay.

They do drive around. They just don't stop or have passengers.

Also, imagine blowing up an entire state with a police helicopter or a military helicopter. Then you go to the local bus station to stare at random hookers get off the city bus. It's a waste of development resources when the game wants you to focus on the missions, not whether the bus makes pity stops for poor you.

Alderney looks almost nothing like New Jersey.

There is no New Jersey in GTA4.

Alderney is based off of NJ. Thats like Algonquin being based off Manhattan but not having any similar landmarks. Why base it off of something when its not going to look like it?

Empire Statue Building? "Statue of Happiness"?

I didn't say Algonquin didn't have any real life landmarks. I was just using it as an example. You were saying there was no NJ in GTA4 but then what I meant was if theres no NJ or NY then why does Algonquin look so much like Manhattan if there is no Manhattan in GTA 4.

No, wait, i think the person who rebutted was right. Alderney doesn't have to look like NJ because none of the islands had to look like the place they were based off. Algonquin looks so much like Manhattan because Rockstar north wanted it to look like Manhattan. Alderney looks the way it does because thats the way Rockstar north wanted it to look. Based off of does not mean copied.

Alderney is made to look like Jersey City. If you've ever been there, Jersey City is an urban area, with a few suburban neighborhoods.

I have lived in NJ for all of my life, and except for a few buildings, it looks nothing like NJ. There's no suburbs, the entrance to the Booth Tunnel looks nothing like the entrance to the Lincoln tunnel, there's no highways, except for the Plumber's Skyway, but even that is in the wrong location, there's no meadowlands, and Newark Airport isn't in the game either.

Alderney looks similar to New Jersey, I've lived in New York but I've been through the Tunnel more than a few times and I know what NJ looks like. Alderney features plenty of renditions of Jersey's locations; Jersey City, The turnpike, Industrial districts, The Acter Prison is similar to the East Jersey State Prison in appearance. If you've ever watched The Sopranos you'd know that the eatery/deli "Satriale's" is A. A real life deli in Jersey and B. Featured in GTA IV. Also features the Hickey Bridge (Smaller than the GW but in the same location).

The main reason Alderny City doesn't look as close to Jersey City as Algonquin does to Manhattan, is because Alderney City is supposed to be a mash-up of Jersey City AND Newark. It combines the character of both into one smaller location.

Yeah, it's not that important. The main thing is to kill the corrupt cop off Catskill Avenue, not check out if the buildings and highways are exactly like NJ. Move on, please :)

Mabye its cause no one cares about New Jersey

----

Time doesn't progress in the city; seasons don't change, construction sites don't wrap up and finish and no new buildings are built. I doubt NYC's construction sites work forever and never complete their task. Another hit on realism.

If the map changed, the game, and by extension, the gameplay, would change. This is, obviously, unwanted.

Maybe so, but at least the construction sites on the roads could disappear. Seasons changing would be nice, and new buildings being built would also be a cool feature.

This is something not yet possible in gaming without third party mods.

Untrue. Seasons changing and construction sites disappearing over time are things that could have been simply added to the game engine. Dont post things if you have no idea about what your talking about.

If Rockstar didn't add it, its not possible to add on to the game engine.

"If Rockstar didn't add it, its not possible to add on to the game engine."

"If they didn't do it it can't be done"? bullshit! They didn't have real planes at night just fling, flashing lights they could have made people fly if they wanted but they didn't

(I made the above post F.Y.I) I do agree however that making new buildings would be too hard to add and would take away the sweet shootouts in the construction sites

Adding new buildings to the game, changing seasons, and disappearing construction zones are all considered dynamic events, which would be on-going as long as the game is played. This means that R* would have to create simulated events that would execute in-game... forever. This is not possible now and probably won't be possible ever.

Not really, they could just coincide certain events to story arc completion, they do it with the bridges being open so why not have a building being constructed all through the story and having it finish when it's over? They also have a "Days Passed" counter so they could easily have a change in season every 90 days or so.

The seasons can't change because the events of GTA IV takes place specifically in "late fall" of 2008.

They could begin this after the story finishes.

If it only started after the game finished, it wouldn't be worth the time and effort to put into the game.

Rockstar made season changes in Bully. That's bullshit to say that if they didn't do it, it can't be done.
Yes, but Bully's storyline used season changes as a method of passing time and progressing the story. GTA IV doesn't need any passing of time, therefore there is no need for season changes. Besides, in Bully the only thing that really changed in gameplay with the seasons was a different detention in winter and snowball fights- it wasnt major. -F.

There is not ONE piece of short-sleeved clothing in LC. Everything is long sleeved.

Would you wear many short sleeved shirts in the middle of autumn?

As a matter of fact. Yes. I would.

It doesn't effect gameplay

It does affect realism

Right, because I wanted to look pretty for the Russians that I'm about to put a bullet into.

No need to be a smart-ass, it may not affect gameplay, but it does affect the player's sense of control over the game - his gripe is legit in my opinion.

Clothes do affect gameplay. In San Andreas for example, you could be from "the 'hood", or you could be a rich businessman, depending on the clothes you wore. The game experience is vastly different depending on your clothes. I think any clothing available to pedestrians should be available to the player. (Excluding special costumes, female clothing, or clothing specifically made for very small or very fat people)

There are no short-sleeved shirts because Niko has hairy-ass, gorilla arms.

You can't wear the fingerless gloves that Niko wears in the art
First, were talking about shirts, not gloves, Second maybe Niko is just the kind of guy that doesn't like wearing short sleeved shirts?

Helicopters can't be saved at any of the safehouses, nor are there helipads to land them on.

look down when flying in an helicopter, some buildings do have helipads.

It's been said before and I'm saying it again: GTA IV isn't The Sims. It's not a real-life simulation game, it's a crime and third-person shooter game.

I don't know what version of The Sims you've played, but you can't buy helicopters, helipads etc in those games. And the emphasis on going on virtual dates/going places with virtual friends makes GTA IV 'not being The Sims' debatable.

I don't know what you're talking about, I save Mavericks all the time at my safe houses, just land them on the parking space.

Um... The Sims 2 AL has helicopters...

Actually, I have saved a helicopter at the Alderney safehouse. It is possible to save them.

Er do you see a helipad anywhere in a safe house? Its not like its hard to get a heli. Take a taxi to the Higgens tour and jack one if you wanna fly. Besides,if you were in a crappy rusty car and you see a new heli in Alderney, the Area where crime runs rampant, wouldnt you steal it?

Maybe its just me, but going near Happiness Island causes the game to noticeably lag on the island shoreline and near the docks, making boats a useless mode of transport.

Yeah, I have PC and I have the same problem. On lowest settings, going anywhere near the West River makes the game unplayable.

Despite New York City being a center for shipping and cruise lines, no cruise ships or cargo ships leave or go near Liberty City, which detracts from the realism and makes the city feel isolated.

They leave. They just get replaced by identical ships when you look away.

No, they don't leave, I've stood at the docks and watched. No ship ever leaves or enters the docks.

Since when do the ships just leave and then come back within a single day and just few seconds? It's unrealistic.

Imagine how hard that would have been, and Rockstar doesn't have time to work on a feature that will go majorly unnoticed.

That's the point of realism. leave, then come back for several days.

And this goal was unachievable in GTA4 due to the more important things. Not everything is realistic. The main gameplay is the main new improved realism system.

Even though Rockstar touted the game to have more interiors than SA, there are in fact less, as most of them are accessible for only one mission.

Still counts. You still access them, don't you?

Once you have completed the missions inside the bldings, it will no longer be accessible. Even though Goldberg's building is accessible, the doors, however, won't let you get in after murdering Tom Goldberg.

They could have been closed due to the murder, and no one is allowed inside.

There are many interiors to be found in GTA4. You just need to look for them. I counted at least 6 different enterable structures in Schottler alone; happy hunting.

There aren't as many different clothing styles and options as there used to be, especially in San Andreas and theres very few "silly" options like mad hats and such.

At least there are some! Compare GTA IV to its predecessors, except San Andreas, in terms of customizing your pro/antagonist. Also, GTA isn't exactly a 'silly' game.

Actually GTA was always a silly and unrealistic series, and that was what made it fun. Flying airplanes despite having no training, wielding miniguns, surviving car crashes...that was the best part of GTA, and GTA IV just removes all that. Its a bold step, but I guarantee GTA IV would be a lot more fun if the police were a lot stupider, unrealistic weapons were brought back and the physics were toned down a lot.

That would be a step backwards.

Right, and by GTA VII, we can fight the dinosaurs with sticks and stones! Awesome!

Yes,that would be awesome.I would love to Hijack a dinosaur,get in a knife fight with a stick and I would also love the dinosaurs to be purple.It'd be great!They could call it Grand theft Auto Extinction or GTA VII:Ugh city or Rock city.I think your thinking!

You realize he's being sarcastic right?

Completely. But my opinions still stand. Especially the thing about purple dinosaurs. After all, there isn't enough purple in GTA. Nor, dinosaurs for that matter.

GTA IV is set in 2008. The dinosaurs were wiped out 65 million years ago. God, didn't you learn that in first grade for Christ's sake? Also, I'm sure most players don't even like purple. By the way, you put spaces between commas and periods.

So? What's your point?

My point is that you won't see dinosaurs in GTA IV because they were wiped out 65 million years ago.

I think I get it now.MAYBE.I'm still on the fritz.

The Coney Island Theme Park is unusable, and there are no theme parks elsewhere in the city.

How many adults go to carnivals to ride kiddy rides, when there are no children.

Maybe not children, but surely adults should ride in it and see the crashes. May not add realism, but adds fun, mostly.

And what point would this serve in the main game? None. Its a waste of Rockstar's time.

Well, maybe adults wouldn't go on the kiddy rides, but I'm sure Niko would like to go on the Screamer (Liberty City's version of The Cyclone) and maybe go play mini-golf with his girlfriend.

Well gee, why you'll at it, why not add a hot coffee mode for GTA IV and some little anal beeds that Niko can use on little children that R* came up with in the next expansion pack. And while you're at it, why not add a small mini game where niko has to aim for the toilet when taking a piss? Geez, can't you be thankful for what you got? Do you know how long we had to wait for GTA IV to come out? If you have suggestions, then you should go to the GTA 5 wishlist.

The above post was just ignorant, adults go on rollercoasters all the time. Just because you don't like the idea, don't say stuff like this.

The airplanes at Francis International Airport are stuck in an eternal taxiing loop: they never take off, and no planes ever land, which detracts heavily from the purported realism of the game. They're invincible also, which is annoying and detracts even more from realism. There.

But it's way unrealistic, because I found out that I waited for hours fr planes to take off, but they don't. They just drive around ways, never take off. Planes don't even land either, so what's the point of realism, even though it's a game?

This is probably an inside joke at Rockstar.

Doesn't matter whether it is an inside joke. The main point is that planes does'nt even take off or land. Just a worst effort by R*.

Aeroplanes are also rendered flying through the air separately, and to be honest I always thought they DID land. However, if they land you'd then expect them to taxi to the terminals, which would then involve giving them some AI to navigate around all the crap you've parked in their way. This would probably not work and make them behave erratically, which is probably why Rockstar coded the taxiing loop to avoid these problems. Kit 12:42, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Still unrealistic.

The airport in GTA IV is unrealistic. Only Boeing 747s? I very highly doubt a major airport like JFK, which Francis International in-game is based off, is only serviced by 747s.

Check again, there are private jets.

And they all look exactly the same, even though they have different flags.

Planes aren't meant to be modified if they are carrying passengers, unless modifications were needed for the main purpose of the plane, and not adding useless junk onto it.

There are only 2 comedians in the comedy clubs, and their material is bland and unfunny.

A -5 for realism for only 2 comedy shows. It should've have more shows and humor, but only 2 for a huge Liberty City? Now that's unrealistic.

Yes, I agree it would have been better to have more comedians, but there are much more than 2 comedy shows. Each comedian has around four shows each. And I thought they were really funny. Perestroika's shows are pretty funny too!

True, but Ricky Gervais's and Katt Williams' material is unfunny and doesn't seem to fit. I walked into Split Sides (where Gervais performed) and walked out 15 seconds into his act on how horrible it was.

There is no way to have comedians that everyone would like. Stand-up comedians, any of them, are liked by some and hated by some. To me, at least, it seemed that their material fit very well with the type of humor that is always infused into GTA games.

I have never seen comedians with such bad material though. I mean, GTA's focus, I though was to provide a Sand-box game with many funny features but this is just a down-step.

They your humor is low, because I found GTA4 hilarious.

With "The Lost and Damned" dlc the Scottish comedian Frankie Boyle appears at the comedy club. If you don't find him funny you have serious issues.

Ok, Ricky Gervais is bad, but Katt Williams is very good. if you don't like him, you neither like all the sarcastic jokes and stuff.

No random games like the off track betting, Pogo the monkey or other arcade games save from Qub3d.

No, but the player can play pool or darts, or go bowling. New games for a new game.

True, but I prefer arcade games. They're much better than doing bowling or darts.

Play QUB3D

I'd rather play Duality, Go Go Space Monkey, and They Crawled from Uranus from GTA San Andreas, rather than just one arcade game that Rockstar Games totally ruined it.

The amount of "random games" was substantially reduced. This affects realism, in terms of the player being able to interact with the city and the longevity, with yet another 5 or 6 sources of amusement the game doesn't have.

GTA4 wasn't made just so people can go play PacMan all day at a strip club.

Arcade games is intended to add realism and fun. I mean, there is an arcade room in Starlight District, but is inaccessible.

If you want to play arcade games, look elsewhere. Arcade games are not the target of realism, it is driving and combat and players, that is the realism in GTA, not useless arcade games.

Off track betting was taken out because once the player found one, they could get a very large amount of money with no skills and only needs to have a large amount of patience to get it.

Playing pool is realistic, but should have been able to make a friendly wager, between friends, nothing there to do that, as well as darts.

Would you like to see your friend have a hundred dollars of betting money, then go and waste the money? I don't think so.

Maybe not friends, but when not with friends, you can compete other competitor in the pool like in GTA: SA, I mean, R* has done this part before.

Gambling isn't in GTA4 because Niko doesn't have that kind of money to waste in the main story line.

Not at the end of the main storyline. Niko manages to make 500 grand, but you can barely spend on anything. By "gambling" I think you're reffering to blackjacks, poker, and slot machines. Pool and darts has nothing to do with gambling. Just a small boring fun (can't make a small wager to the competitor) and that increases a redundant way to spend your hard-earned cash.

I don't mind having redundant ways of spending my money when I have an incredibly large amount and don't have anything fun to buy it on.

It should've have at least 50 clothing shops or more, but only 3 on a huge Liberty City? Badly affects realistic attempts.

Well, mister, why don't you go program in all those clothing shops with individual outfits in each store? Can't? Then remember that this is a game. Have fun. Don't worry about realism. You can jump out of a helicopter from 1000 feet and live without a parachute.

Irrelevant. While the helecopter thing MAY be true(which I doubt). R* truly did remove most of the costumization features of the game which made it so personal. The gameplay and effects have improved to an extent but, this is to be expected with the new hardware on the 360 and ps3. If there intentions were to make the game more realistic then they should have made more then 3 clothing stores on the WHOLE of NYC(Liberty City).

Clothing is only a feature, and not to be fully explored. Maybe in a future GTA game, this will be possible, but Rockstar fit everything they could into the game, and combining clothing from Modo, Russian Store, and Perseus can be great customization.

That's not enough. In San Andreas, they have about six clothing shops, and it had hundreds of clothing accessories to choose from, thus increasing sex appeal. But in GTA IV, there are only three, and all other clothes look exactly alike, no matter how new they are. Plus, it will be hard to date with your girlfriends and they will find out that your clothes are the same and that they demand that you change it. If R* would've bought all other stores from San Andreas, then it would total up to 9 clothing shops in a row, rather than stray away realism.

You guy's who gripe about clothing are girly. I'm sorry but what kind of guy likes shopping for clothes when he has an entire city to cause destruction in, race, fly helicopters, kill cops and go on multiplayer? I barely ever spent time in the clothing shops, even in San Andreas. All you need is a jacket, some jeans, and a pair of sneakers. It would be completely useless to have 100 articles of clothing that you'd never wear.

If you COULD buy any amount of clothing from Perseus, or Modo, or ZIP, or Bull Emic or Hinterland, do you really think Niko would care to purchase any of them in the first place? If anything, a larger choice of clothing would frustrate Niko, who already turns a jaundiced eye to the extravagance and materialism in Liberty City. Personally, I don't think Niko would ever "degrade" himself by purchasing all those flashy American clothes.

I don't get it. I like changing clothes, but not often. There's no reason, unless you're a person that likes to dress in expensive suits, which I guess I like. But I don't change my clothes everytime I see a shop! Go blow the crap out of someone instead of worrying about this!

Redundant. Clothing shops are crucial for the game. I mean, imagine if you are dating your girlfriend and she tells you to go buy new clothes. Would you let her be disappointed for keeping the same clothes you're wearing? No right? If R* should add girlfriends in the game, then they should add more clothing shops to keep a girlfriend (you are dating) happy. Otherwise, if they are going to make few clothing shops, then they should'nt add the girlfriend feature.

Given that a generic interior could be created, there's too few stores and the like to wander into compared to San Andreas (Cluckin' Bell outlets as just a facade with no way in).

But do you remember those loading times when you enter almost every interior buildings? GTA IV has non except for when you are on a mission where there would be a cutscene after you enter it.

Once again, this lacks realistic attempts to this game. In real life, you would have huge range of restaurants, clothing shops, comedy shows, bowling alleys, arcades, etc. The game, however, has few and makes no sense why.

Everything got bought out by a few companies.

By who?

The trees are invincible.

Trees are invincible in real life to everything but various saws. Makes perfect sense.

Then how come small trees becomes invincible? There is no way that a small invincible tree can be THAT realistic, especially if you were driving a huge truck, then gets stopped by a small tree.

Think of how deep the roots could be, and it would be near impossible to pull the roots out just by ramming your car into it. To take the tree out, you would have to dig it out, cut off as much as you can, then poison the roots.

If you've ever seen a tree, you know that they can be easily knocked down by a vehicle, or pulled out by a storm. Trees in real life are not invincible; I pull trees out with a cable and a pickup truck. The trees should not be invincible in GTA4, especially since you can easily knock down a 12" steel pole, fixed to the ground by a concrete block and 3 foot long rods. Even small trees in Saints Row could be destroyed.

In real life, you would have a range of restaurants, whereas in this game only has two. This game strays away realism from it's real life counterpart.

But Rock* spent more time improving the exterior, giving great sniping points, stunt jumps, etc plus you have no hunger meter like in GTA:SA which prevents you from passing out, losing money, or wasting time.

And Well Stacked Pizza never opened up shop in Liberty City to begin with throughout the GTA's.

Military base is completely gone.

Yes but i don't think there would be a military base in the middle of the city.

There's no military base in New York City, and Fort Dix is a good distance away from Jersey City.

But as you said this isn't new york city, San Andreas had the Military and it was based on Las Vegas, NV, San Francisco, CA, and Los Angeles,Ca

It also had a huge desert where there could be a military base, like there is.

San Andreas' military base is based on Area 51 (Area 69 in game). What would a military base in IV be based on?

On an off shore oil tanker, where else?

The military doesn't own any off shore oil tankers or oil platforms.

There are National Guard armories in New York. The 69th Infantry (no joke here) has one in Manhattan.

Though is'nt fashion, this has got to do with all of your 50k money, and adds realism.

Niko isn't meant to have that much money in the main story line. Plus, the huge target in realism in GTA4 is main gameplay, not side missions.

Not while he successfully earns $500,000 right at the end of the main story line. I mean, what am I going to do with a lot of money? Just keep earning it and spend on nothing other than buying a cheap selection of foods, buy more ammo or get killed numerous times? That's just a low blow by R* because without flashy clothes to buy, how will you impress your girlfriend while on a date? By simply dissapointing her with the same clothes you wear every day? If R* wants to be cheap into adding very few clothing shops, then the girlfriend feature should be left out if you don't want your girlfriends in GTA IV dissapointed.

You can't go underwater to see fishes, dolphins, turtles, even sharks.

Would you want to swim under all that poisonous dirty water in NYC?

It looks ridiculous when Niko jumps 20 meters from a bridge only to land on the surface of the water.

Not all waters are poisonous and dirty. Beaches and pools are nice and clean, but badly affects realism because how can a camera refuses to venture underwater.

Going underwater was just useless, as it was only feature in one mission in GTASA.

But there should be easter eggs lying underwater. That's worth the fun.

Enjoy the lesser draw distance on land created by the new feature.

There were never any sharks in GTA SA, those were actually dolphins.

The two largest, widest straightaways in Algonquin are both under construction, leaving no place to really go fast.

Highway, and why not use the straight just right in front of your safehouse in Algonquin. It's REALLY long and filled with cars and two jumps. Very entertaining and useful to train your driving skills.

It's not really safe to go really fast on straightaways. Traffics will change lanes quickly without even seeing you, making the Highways useless even more when confronted by slow moving traffics.

That's how it's always been, and how it is in real life. You always have careless drivers.

learn to drive between lanes and weave through traffic and you will be able to go fast

I think you're missing the point of this gripe, you cannot swerve lanes when the whole road ahead is blocked off, you'll just crash. You can avoid it by turning, but doing that will lose the speed you built up. Its such a shame that Algonquin has the least hectic road layout of all the other GTA cities, but you still cannot speed through without turning.

The two widest ones going north-south on each side of Middle Park are the best to go fast, but they end with a construction site about halfway, which is annoying.

Welcome to a city modeled off of New York, one of the world's most unfriendly cities towards traffic.

The construction should progress and finish up, reopening the streets, but it doesn't. Another -1 for realism in GTA IV.

Blame Liberty City's City Council.

Some areas, like restaurants, aren't denoted on the radar, despite working and accessible, i.e. the Burger Shots in Beechwood City, Westdyke and Northwood.

They get added to the radar after you visit them.

But even when you have accessed inside the Laundromat stores, they don't get denoted.

Laundromat stores are useless.

Not while there are cash registers that's worth the steal.

Why would R* waste precious memory space just to add a location on the map where you could only steal a few bucks?

Alderney doesn't have any food stores and barely any places of interest, making it a useless area to visit.

Strip Club, stunt jumps, pigeons, random peds.

It's still a useless area to visit. Besides, there aren't any places of interest and there weren't any shows, bars, restaurants, or even bowling alleys.

There's a chopper for the taking by the tunnel entrance that's worth a visit.

Still very useless to visit, even with the chopper. What's more important that it must feature all accessible buildings, yet strays away realism of all building interiors.

It isn't 100% New Jersey, it is only model after. And if you want more variety in those activities, go out and do it for real, not in a video game.

The Bars is inaccessible because you have to be accompanied by a friend.

Where is the fun in getting drunk all by yourself?

People seem to do it all the time anyways.

It's not difficult to add, allows for more freedom, I don't see why the option shouldn't be there. It's as simple as walking up to the barman and pressing E. Time skips ahead a few hours, and you're drunk. More freedom is good, this has no downside.

Rockstar changed the name of the islands(i.e. Staunton and Portland's name are changed).

True the names are changed, But no city would enjoy having it's name in a blow up, cop killing game. Since the September 11th terrorist attacks on New York it would be bad taste to have Niko a soviet immigrant cause hell and kill New York cops.

But in-reality, why would a city just change a whole lot of districts names with-in 7 years. It ruins the game a bit and it's history

It didn't change its name, it has always been that in Liberty City. It is BASED off of New York, it isn't actually New York. With names changed Rockstar can make it resemble NY, but also shake things up.

He's talking about the names of the original islands in GTA III. They were called Portland and Staughton and Shoreside Vale, then replaced with Broker/Dukes, Algonquin and Alderney City respectively with no explanation.

The old names were too similar to New York City, and no one wants an immigrant causing chaos in a nearish New York City after September 11th, 2001. Not to mention GTA4 era games are completely different from GTA3 era games, its a whole another universe, as explained by Rockstar.

The Alderney safehouse is crappy and run-down, a downgrade even though the Algonquin safehouses are luxurious and much bigger.

It's just a safehouse that is given to you by Ray, not particular a good one. Especially Ray is not THAT rich. Do you know how your big safehouses came from? Roman, that rich guy after escaping and even changed his taxi to cavalcades. Playboy X, rich and bling.

Alderney is modeled off of New Jersey, so you can't expect much.

But Alderney has rich houses and lets you store cars in the garage. A -3 for having the last and crappy safehouse, instead of a rich and famous house.

Niko is supposed to be low on money, and not be able to buy real estate because of where he needs to put his money towards.

But since Niko has 100 grand or more, why not purchase safehouses yourself?

In the main story line Niko isn't supposed to have all of that money.

Yes he does, he makes $250,000 from a bank job and another $250,000 at the end. That is atleast $500,000. Now say he isn't rich.

Pegorino's house had the potential to become your safehouse once he died. Once the game ends...nothing. It sits there, unoccupied, the garage fully functional. A -5 for realism R*.

Pegorino's wife still lives there, and she is innocent, so why kill an innocent old woman just for her house when she has been put through enough by her husband.

It's explained out-of-game that Pegorino's house gets bought by Kenny Petrovic, as evidenced by it's use in the Multiplayer missions, known as Deal Breaker.

Grand Central Terminal isn't accessible, despite being in the game. A bad move, as its interior is large and would be interesting to explore.

And its point to the already established main storyline would be what? A waste of time for Rockstar.

Plus, if there's a new city in the episodic content, you probably will be able to take the train to the new city. Thus making Grand Central Terminal accessible.

Not to mention that Alderney does not have a SINGLE clothing shop or more, and that degrades realism completely.

It all comes back to one point: do you want the game to be realistic, or do you want it to be fun?

In a game where money is useless you would think you could use some of that 1,000,000 dollars you make to upgrade the crappy apartments, buy a garage in the alley, add internet, add a big screen tv, pay rent, etc.

Especially when the character's primary motivation is money.

I know, right? I've made 50k and Roman's still whining about people coming after him for money. Why don't I have the option to just pay those people off?

It would break the story, mayhaps?

But what's the point in having missions that pay so well - the $250k bank heist is midway through the game yet they're still complaining about financial woes all the way to the end. It's easy to get $1mil+ by the game's end, but there's nothing to do with it. No real estate, no buyable vehicles, upgrades, anything. Unless you want around 15,000 hotdogs. Considering, as said above, money is the primary objective it's very silly/retarded.

Alderney City has no darn train stations, I thought that New Jersey was full of sub-ways.

It is not EXACTLY ripped off from New Jersey or wherever it originated from.

But I mean in a highly congested city, at least I thought that there should be some sought of rail link to the industrial city.

Jersey City has MTA Metrorail, subways, elevated rail, the works. Why these aren't in Alderney?

Because you can drive, and not depend on Rockstar make ways for you to be more lazy. Take a cab, its faster.

ATM machines are completely useless and now way of using it. You can only check out balance and not take out money by either destroying it (which dispenses a lot of money) or even use fast cash to earn more cash.

The HUD even shows how much money you have, so yeah, whats the point of ATM machines?

ATM's are handy for making money. What you do is kill other people using the ATM's.

But what's the use of ATM machines? You can just simply check out balance and not take out money by making fast cash or even destroying it. It does nothing. No offense, but the ATM machines are a pointless feature to the GTA series.

You can get more money from people using it. That is there purpose. They are not useless.

I don't think he said anything about killing people while they are using ATM machines are useless. He's talking about ATM machines when the player uses it. All it reads is "Current Balance: $$$$$". The ATM machines are, in fact, useless and unrealistic.

I feel like I'm explaining division to a 3rd grader... When a pedestrian is using an ATM machine, killing them spawns more money than a pedestrian that ISN'T using an ATM machine. If they put that in the game and Niko wasn't able to use it, you wouldn't notice the increase in money spawn.

I think we get that a pedestrian who used the ATM machine can spawn more money than a pedestrian who didn't. Everyone is trying to say it's useless because it only shows your current balance. When you pass a mission for example, your contact should make a deposit into your account and if you wanted that money, you'd go to an ATM machine and make a withdrawal. You could only carry around at maximum, lets say, $10,000 or so. It makes completely no sense that the player can carry around $500,000 at once or even more around city streets. The game should've been if you wanted money, you needed to go to an ATM machine, and withdraw a certain dollar amount.

Why would a murderer/terrorist/theif/illegal immigrant have a bank account in the first place?

Especially since it was rumored the seasons would change in-game. Its always autumn in the game.

Those were just rumors, and were never announced by Rocksstar.

The RAGE engine used by R* can handle graphics, physics, interiors, and more, except severe weather conditions? Gosh. The least R* can do is at least test it out.

The whole city would have to be reskinned if you wanted snow. Snow can't be added correctly unless you want a billion new objects placed on the map, and the map reskinned, because other wise it wouldn't be possible.

Anyway, why would there be a tropical storm in Liberty City? And snow isn't a severe weather condition.

"Snow isn't a severe weather condition"? You've never lived in a northern state. Yes, snow can be considered severe weather conditions. Blizzard warnings, state of emergencies, etc. It'd be too difficult to add artificial snow to all the buildings, and because the fishtailing wasn't bad enough with rain :)

No, i meant that snowing isn't a severe weather condition. A Blizzard or a snowstorm is severe but not normal, gental snowing. Anyway, the guy who started the gripe put normal snowing and blizzards in the same sentence as a sereve weather condition.

Considering how Rockstar Games put a lot of good well known songs on the radio in both GTA Vice City and San Andreas (as well as having the Scarface soundtrack in GTA III), I was surprised and disappointed to find out that GTA IV's soundtrack is mostly made up of unknown artists (granted, there are several big name artists but, hardly any compared to previous games) and completely fails to reflect popular music of the current decade, in my opinion. However, the parodies of the war on terror, internet, movies etc on the radio do reflect the decade well.

Listen to an ipod or MP3.

I wish R* would let you add custom soundtracks into the game, much like listening to your own music in the car, yet detracts realism to the game because they somehow forgot to add this feature.

Xbox lets you do it.

No, it doesnt. I have the 360 version, and nowhere is the feature for custom soundtracks mentioned.

The original Grand Theft Auto, Grand Theft Auto 2, and Grand Theft Auto III all had mostly unknown artists, and that was something that I really enjoyed about all three of those games, getting to listen to music that I had never heard before.

A bad move by R* games on how they did'nt let you add custom soundtracks on the PS3 version. Big mistake, R*.

I am not familiar with the PS3's music player system, but the XBOX 360 has one, and that removes the need for user custom tracks.

Unfortunately, the 360's music player system has to be paused manually during cutscenes, and during the time when characters talk during gameplay (if you want to hear what's being said of course) - whereas a 'custom soundtrack' feature fades music out during dialogue, and obviously stops playing when you get out of the car.

I don't mind the radio playing unknown artists, but all of the songs on a channel sound exactly the same, especially when the sounds outside of the car drown out the radio. Both of those didn't happen in previous GTA games.

The radio talk shows loop too quickly, and there's less overall material than in previous GTAs. Almost as if it was unfinished.

Then go make your own radio show and make 10000 shows to satisfy yourself.

I usually Rebut Gripes, but I'm griping on this. After playing the game for long enough, I'm tempted to just turn off the radio because of how fast it loops. Shows only last for < 10 mintues.

Then listen to some music. Or if you have Xbox 360, then you can download custom songs via CD's.

If R* included custom soundtrack feature for the Xbox 360, why exclude it for the PS3 version anyway? If R* is holding a grudge against the PS3 version, then they are out of their minds (not being a flamer)

Actually, R* favors the X360 (pretty much like most people that play videogames) and thay have contracts with Microsoft to favor their console (I favor the X360 personally and own one). If you don't believe it, why do you think GTA gets released on X360 first?

I kind of wish that LCHC had more heavy metal songs. Even more songs would have been nice.Can't wait for Lost and the Damned for PS3 so i can listen to heavy metal

The city is grossly under populated. Go to Star Junction at 9pm on a Friday Night and it is deserted. 5pm on a Friday, there is some traffic, but for what it is supposed to be it just falls short again. There are more peds behind the flats in Northwood than in Star Junction. The report that Rockstar modeled the traffic on NYC is pure garbage. Living breathing city....not even close.

Especially since Times Square is supposed to have hundreds of thousands of people and cars traveling through it at any given time. The game can handle more than 5 peds on screen, so why R* did what they did is a mystery.

There are buildings for those pedestrians to be in.

In which some buildings has few peds and it's randomly realistic.

If there were so many pedestrians at The Triangle, imagine running over all of them. Have fun with your lag.

Due to the large environments, collision objects, models, dynamics, effects, and sound to load, and GTA IV already being a laggy game as it is, adding MORE models to load isn't possible with our current RAM technology.

Grossly underpopulated? Are you serious? There are hundreds of people alone in Star Junction on a Friday night. Just wait around for a few minutes, there will be a hundred people soon. There's also a lot of traffic all over the city and in Star Junction. It does, like in real life, get annoying because you have to wait around in traffic, especially on the bridges and in the tunnels.

Have you ever been in Times Square? There are at least a thousand people there at any given time. Granted, rendering that many individual AIs at any given moment is not currently possible or practical with Xbox 360, PS3, or PC hardware, but Star Junction seems really empty to someone who's been to the real thing.

The generation of vehicles in the game just seems a bit sudden. One minute its desolate, the next its a gridlock. Generating vehicles seem to usually happen at the end of one of the 2 streets of Star Junction, meaning 5 lanes of traffic are trying to squeeze into 2. Whatever happened to "Don't Block The Box"?

The moving lights that appear on the streets at night while up in the air (probably to simulate traffic and save memory) are poorly plotted. They go in the wrong direction on the street, go diagonally and do weird things, making the feeling of a heavily populated city vanish.

Not everything is perfect.

the lights are supposed to be planes

He's talking about lights that show on streets while in the air. I agree, they should at least align with cars that are driving on the road.

When you're high enough to see the lights above the city, the game isn't rendering cars on the ground, and it would take up too much processing power to sync up cars with lights when you get low enough to see them. The game would lag to about 3 fps.

R* says that "you can finish the game without a single loading screen". It turns out that R* was lying, because there are loading times when accessing into missions or multiplayers.

That was an expectation Rockstar was hoping to have, but they were unsucessful, because not every planned feature is included.

Esecially since R* tried very hard to make the game get no load times. Nobody's perfect. at least they tried, though.

Very few (if any) fire escapes touch the ground. They can't even be reached by jumping.

Fire escapes have ladders that are deployed while you are escaping. If they were closer to the ground, it would be a security hazad.

Park a car next to them, or use nearby objects like dumpsters.

The flying rats(pigeons)were a really stupid idea, going around and killing 200 of them or even one, Rock Star should have made more missions, not something this stupid.I mean, who would really go and kill animals or birds in real life in new york or wherever, just lame

A crazy Serb who is tired of his car getting shat on, perhaps?

On www.whattheydonotwantyoutoknow.com it gives the locations of birds with the bird flu which are points of the flying rats.

My question is if you thought that the Pigeons were a dumb idea what about the 100 tags, the 50 snapshots, the 50 horseshoes and the 50 oysters in SA which equals 250 collectables. who whould do that in real life.

Actually the 100 tags, the 50 snapshots, the 50 horseshoes and the 50 oysters isn't a dumb idea and people would do that in real life. People in real life will do snapshots DUH. Real life gangsters will tag in front of other gangs tags DUH. People that wants luck or believes in luck will collect horseshoes DUH. People that collect shells will collect oysters TRIPLE DUH. You must be dumb and as said before who would really go and kill animals or birds in real life in new york.

In every GTA game so far, we've had Collectibles, Pigeons are a new way of doing this, instead of doing Hidden Packages for the fifth time, they came up with a new idea, just like in SA. They're all the same, and collectibles have become a part of everyday GTA life.

TV shows are a useless feature, because there is are only 2 channels and it's pointless how. Almost all other shows are repetitive and their humor is weak and unfunny, if it repeats.

Perhaps TV shows are just something Rockstar is testing out for a future, more expanded feature...

Only 1 car commercial into the television while there are all other cars that needs to be broadcasted into the commercial, but it's a worthless commercial.

Its still a commercial. Would you rather have "WACKY WAVING INFLATABLE ARMS WAVING TUBE MAN" commericals.

True, but in real life, they have a wide range of car commercials. How come it has only one?

Why would you want to see a lot of different commercials?

The Las Venturas Poker Challenge is a pointless competition. No one knows who won, so it's a lame competition.

Its for humor, and its Rockstar's little joke at real poker shows.

Another thing, It would have been nice to see some of the places from the previous games in liberty city, Sal's home, Joey's garage, saint marks bistro, so far i have not seen any of those places, run down or otherwise

Salvatore's home is in GTA4, it is where you go for the final mission. All other places must have been bought out and replaced, or destroyed.

New York City is like the fashion capital of the U.S. How come there aren't any shopping malls or a larger variety of clothing shops?

GTA isn't a shopping game.

Well, it should've been a shopping game, because it has something to do by spending a large amount of money you have.

Do you really think Niko would want to do that? In the main story line Niko isn't supposed to be rich.

Yet near the end of the main storyline, Niko manages to earn $500,000 in the game, yet you can't do anything about it (no buying expensive houses, no way of purchasing garages to keep vehicles, not even buying flashy outfits when dating your girlfriend, nothing). Now say Niko is'nt supposed to be rich. just a failed realism attempt.

Why does it only rain in Liberty City? Its in the northern part of the U.S. What happened to the snow?

Especially since NYC is known for heavy snowfall in the winter.

GTA4 is set in autumn, and it would be incredibly hard to have snowfall. It hasn't been done in any GTA game because it is so hard.

I live in NJ and it's autumn and we just had a snow storm on friday (12/19/08). Winter doesn't start until the 21st. NJ is a neighbor to NY

Not true. GTA3: Liberty City Stories included snow, and was set in Autumn. It was done fairly well on the PSP, a portable console with little memory. There should be no technical excuse to exclude snowfall; I suspect we may see it in downloadable content, as a similar feature was done with 'Bully' (also by Rockstar).

The game storyline takes place in Autumn.

As he told before, GTA: LCS was also set place in Autumn and the snow was done by this PSP version, so there should be no dumb excuse to exclude snowfall in GTA 4, even though it takes place in Autumn.

It would be hard/impossible to make it snow with our current RAM and graphic technology.

It's incredibly simple actually, all they had to do was make the sky grey and replace raindrops with snowflakes - wouldn't affect game performance at all (the snow doesn't really HAVE to build up on the ground). Many games in the past are perfect examples of this.

If they had made snow, but no snow buildup, people would be on here complaining about how the snow is pointless and doesn't do anything.

It's a game..There doesn't have to be a point. There's no point in having the rain there. There's no point in having a safehouse in the game when all you do is save there, and spend 99% of your time outside killing people. Oh and another thing, There's no point in having a TV if players just get wasted, and shoot people. It's a game, dude. It's not a goddamn movie. You don't hear movie goers saying "well that lampost there is really pointless!".

Once you have a large amount of money, you cannot get wasted unless you want to lose at the most, 10 grand to the hospital. This is due in part to the hospital taking 10% of your total cash. In other GTA games, the most you would lose would be 200-300 dollars.

Hospital bills went up, the cost of a hospital trip went up.

That makes no sense at all. How is it relevant to spend 10 grand on a hospital trip *just because* you had 100 grand on you when you died? It sounds like Rockstar wanted to create a cheap way to drain your money reserves since you pretty much cant buy anything other than clothes and guns in the entire game.

GTA4 takes place in America where we don't exactly have the best health care in the world.

New York City is known for its vast amount of bridges yet Rockstar only created a handful. The Williamsburg, Queensborough, Whitestone Bridges, etc are all missing. How could they leave out some of NYC's most famous bridges? The majority of the bridges they did create were not even accurate. The Algonquin Bridge actually serves as the Queensborough Bridge but is modeled after the Manhattan Bridge. Also, there are little to no tunnels that connect any of the boroughs such as the Brooklyn Battery Tunnel. Lastly, Rockstar extremely compressed NYC. It's just crazy how you can be in Times Square and then drive two blocks and then your in Chinatown or you start off in Red Hook and drive two blocks and your in Coney Island. If True Crime could authentically recreate Manhattan for PS2 Rockstar could have done a better job recreating NYC, especially with the amount of time used to create the game

There is no New York City in GTA4

Liberty City is based very heavily on New York City, so in actuality there is a New York City in GTA4.

There is a New York City is GTA4? Where is it? Right next to Liberty City on the East Cost of the US? There is a perfectly logical amount of briges for the size of Liberty City, to add more would be rediculous.

As previously stated, there is no New York City in GTA4.

So how come "New York Groove" is playing on the radio? Probably a goof on Rockstar's part if New York doesn't exist.

There are a vast array of shows, movies, and theaters throughout Liberty City that are promoted but are unavailable to the public.

It has always been that way in all of the GTA games.

Badly affects realism.

Pedestrians never get out of their cabs once reaching their destinations, or even get in the cab and give the cab driver a destination, much like in GTA: VCS.

Pedestrians are there as place fillers, because not every taxi is available at one time.

The train system's completely whack. Only four lines, why not 6, two to alderney.

Because Alderney is much smaller in size, and was not built in compatibility.

That argument should then have meant that there should be no train service to Bohan.

Bohan has a lot of residential, so there must be a subway.

So does Alderney. They should've had a train similar to a PATH train to make it more realistic.

The NYC Subway does not service New Jersey, so it wouldn't make sense to have two more lines to Alderney. You can drive or take a cab or drive. It is faster than taking a train.

They should make the elevators work outside of missions, and have them in safehouses! (possibly select the floor to go to)

A useless feature. What would you do on empty floors with nowhere to go.

Well, they could use the elevators to go to the top floor, then go onto the roof and shoot people, and birds, down, and they could make some stuf on the upper floors

{Fly a helicopter instead.

only safehouse on top floor is Playboy X's which has rooftop access

Well, Niko's/Roman's loft in Algonquin is on the top floor. Look at the windows from the inside (as well as the height of the roof), and compare them to the outside of the building. It's on the top floor, it just lacks roof access. But I guess that's what is being discussed here, so maybe I just misunderstood the last rebuttal. Either way, I agree, better roof access would be cool, but based on what Iggy Pop says on Liberty Rock Radio, you can't get to any of the rooftops in LC because of the terrorism scare. You may need to listen for a while to hear him say it, though. The problem with roofs is that oftentimes you can't see people from the rooftops with a sniper rifle because of the distance between the player and the ground.

The SuperStar Cafe may be accessible, but you can't eat food to replenish your health.

It is only a reference to HardRock cafe, nothing else.

Whatever. either way, R* is'nt doing anything good with realism

Once you have stored all of the cars Brucie wants, you can't buy vehicles like all other GTA games.

Jacking cars is easier.

Finding sports cars is better than ordinary cars, and so is purchasing it.

Well go find sport cars and jack 'em. Besides Niko has no care for what cars he get.

The Custom Soundtrack is'nt featured for unknown reasons, and it's nowehre to be found in both the Xbox 360 and PS3.

Is that where you can play songs during gameplay? Well, most teenagers have a CD player of some sort.

The Custom Soundtrack was done throughout every GTA games in Xbox and PC, so they should'nt have excluded the Custom Soundtracks.

Actually, R* favors the PC and X360 (pretty much like most people that play videogames) beacuse of contracts they have with Microsoft to favor their console (I favor the X360 personally and own one), and the PC. The feature is in X360 just look for it. It just isn't in the [ugh!] PS3. If you don't believe it, why do you think GTA gets released on X360 first and online play is crap in the PS3 and extremely fun in Xbox?

On the PSP too, which has much more limitations. Seems odd to leave it out given the massive leap in tech.

The lack of custom soundtrack feature is annoying. Why include it only on the PC and why not on the 360 and PS3. It's not THAT hard (unless R* just does'nt feel like adding that feature). Also, your Rebut has nothing to do with GTA IV. This is Independence FM we're talking about (a radio station which allows you to play your own music tracks, but on PC only). It's no wonder R* Games has to be lazy to not add Independence FM for Xbox 360 and PS3, but for PC. Pathetic.

The flashing lights you see flying over liberty city at night look like planes from the ground, but if you go up in a heli they are just lights floating around the sky. If R* had already crated the plane models that are seen at the airport, then why didn't they just use them instead of the floating lights

No rebuttal is needed, as your Gripe is a giant run-on sentence that I refuse to try and comprehend.

I fixed the grammar.

It takes less memory to render the "floating lights" rather than a whole aircraft.

you can't purchase safehouses like in SA, even though there are so many buildings. i would like to have one in the middle and south of the first island and the north and south of the third, as well as some on the main part of the first island. 9 would be fine, 3 per island. also playboy's loft and the luxury suite are too close together, if there had to be so few safehouses they should be more evenly placed around the city.

Again, Niko is not supposed to have much money in the storyline, so you can't buy safehouses.

Only two tollboths in the whole of Liberty City? That's a bland excuse for realism. In real life, it had much tollbooths from NYC, like freeways and intersections. I highly doubt that NYC never had long freeways, intersections and a measly two tollbooths.

First of all, most bridges in NYC are FREE to cross. Only about 5 bridges and tunnels in NYC have tollbooths. And again it's just modeled after NYC. Plus it's really annoying having to stop and pay at the tollbooth.

How come there are no golf courses in Liberty City or Alderney? There are plenty of golf courses in NY and NJ, why not Liberty City? It also would've been very fun to have a golf minigame.

There is one in Algonquin, but yeah. Kinda sucks that you don't get to play golf, especially since R* doesn't even bother add it thus pulling away realism.

The place in Algonquin is called a driving range, a place where you practice golf. It's not an actual golf course. There are no actual golf courses in Algonquin or Manhattan but there are plenty on Long Island and New Jersey. It does suck that you can't play golf though. Especially when you had the Leaf Links Golf Club in Vice City and the Avispa Country Club in San Andreas that did have golf courses in the previous games

I don't think Niko would be that good at golf anyway. The city's size is compressed, and Rockstar didn't have enough room for a golf course.

Yes they did. They added two golf courses (aka driving ranges) in Algonquin, but they made it unplayable without any reason. There is also a mini-golf course just close to Hove Beach. If they added the golf courses (driving ranges), then it would be entertaining to play golf or mini golf either with a girlfriend or yourself. If R* does'nt want to make the golf courses/mini-golf playable, then it should'nt be there.

That's a whole lot of information to encode on a single Blu-Ray disc, don't you think?

Nope.

If Rockstar had wanted the player to be able to go back to Vice City or San Andreas, then Rockstar would have had to update the textures, lighting, animations, weather dynamics, traffic patterns, and a whole battery of other upgrades and changes, because the Grand Theft Auto IV era is different than the Grand Theft Auto III era, and thus, Vice City or San Andreas could not exist as we know them.

San Andreas does exist in the GTA IV era but not Vice City because in a website it shows criminals from different cities and it shows san andreas but no vice city. Moscow exist in GTA IV era also.

But if they can't do that, they can at least keep the old graphics for nostalgic feeling.

Technically,they do exist. Vice City is mentioned by Roman during a text message. nd San Andreas exists because Niko mentions "sprawling gun shops all over San Andreas" in Do You Have Protection? if you fail it twice and listen to Dimitri talking about buying you a gun.But this would still take extensive time to fully design.It would take R* whole years to make all of that.

"...as we know it..." Meaning it would take years to rebuild Vice City and eons to rebuild San Andreas. No one is saying that Vice and San Andreas don't exist in the GTA IV era, genius, only that the sixth generation console versions don't.

What's the point of going there, with nothing to do? that means R* must make a whole new storyline, people to meet, restaurants, ... that would take years and you would need like 3 disks to do that.

Not true, since R* has done the parts of Liberty City in GTA: San Andreas, even though its not completed. I highly doubt that R* would come up with these excuses into not making Vice City Or San Andreas maps. After all, it does'nt have to be that hard when it comes to flying to Vice City or San Andreas, like adding a whole lot of details, new interior maps, new vehicles, new peds and cops, etc. Just add up more interiors between the two maps for buildings and I'm sure that'll be a new record for them having to complete all 3 sets of maps for GTA IV. That easy.

Okay, there are three huge problems with the idea of putting all three cities on the same disk. 1. You can't fit all that on one disk. 2. Even if it was possible, it would take years upon years to complete the game with two more cities added. 3. Rockstar wants to make money. They would not put all that content on one disk, they would sell you three different games to maximize the money they make off you.

Liberty City is in the state of Liberty. It makes no sense for there to be an island in the middle of a state. This causes further confusion with Happiness Island. It doesn't add up.

Well, Manhattan is its own island. Brooklyn and Queens are on Long Island. Staten Island (Yes, I know it's not in the game) is its own island. It's supposed to be set in one city and all GTA games have been cities set on remote islands.

Okay, then explain Happiness Island. How does that make sense?

Happiness Island is supposed to be based off Liberty Island, which is also its own island.

Ugh!That's not what I meant!How can there be an isle next to an island that isn't near water!?They only way to get to Liberty City is by boat,plane,Helicopter or the Cuban way!

Huh? What are you talking about? What's the "Cuban way" to get to Liberty City? All cities in GTA have been remote islands. Happiness Island just happened to be there OK?

The cuban way is to swim to another country illegally via a floating door.Besides,let's say R* made Ohio into a level.Then It would be an island and if it was, there would be NO!!!! geographical connectivity.R* overuses islands is what I'm saying.I like GTA and Islands but they've been pushing it lately.And furthermore,If R* wasn't lazy and just gave you a never ending highway or the ability to go everywhere in the world,this gripe wouldn't exist.Islands are for LAZY designers!(No offense)

An endless highway? Sounds kinda useless. But anyway if you were able to go all over the world in a game, you'd have to do it on PC and you'd need to have a really big hard drive. Ever hear of World of Warcraft? That's the reason it's on PC. An Xbox 360's and a PS3's hard drive wouldn't be able to hold it. If you want to be able to go all over the world, your going to need a PC.

Now,I get it.Thank you for the explanation.But I still hope for good geography in future games.

You're welcome. When GTA IV comes out for the PC, there may be mods which expand the land area.

The radio stations constantly reset for no apparent reason. If I hear "IT BEGAN ON THE STREETS OF SOUTH BOHAN...!" once more I'm going to scream. Also, the favorite/least favorite station stats are nearly always wrong.

Well, maybe the game tells that you like that song. Either that, or it's laggy as hell. And the favorite/least favorite radio station is due to the fact that when you get into the car, you don't change the station to your favorite channel, most likely because you're caught up in something. By the way I'm not a big Beat 102.7 fan. LRR for life. (no offense)

Neither am I, but I was just using it as an example; there are certain stations that always have the same beginning - The Beat, Classics, Massive B and Electro Choc. Once you hear the start on one of those stations you can guarantee you'll hear it on the others, on the talk radio stations a programme will be starting and on the stations that have a random order of tracks there'll be bumper music announcing the DJ or station identity. So it's nothing to do with liking or disliking a song, just all the stations resetting randomly. And the first thing I do when getting into a car is change the station strangely! In previous games I'd listen to most stations equally but in IV there's a lot of stations I would deem unlistenable.

I understand the need for boundries, but it seems very unrealistic for a city based on New York to be simply 4 islands in the middle of the ocean.

This gripe has already been mentioned. The cities in GTA have always been on remote islands.

It is an elegant way to finish off the map. When the player is inland, the player doesnt notice this, looks like any old place. Like, in canon, most of the GTA maps are connected to land (Not sure which, but San Andreas is believed to be around Las Venturas, according to a map hidden somewhere ingame), and BTW wouldnt be stupid to be driving along on a freeway to suddenly run into some barrier that says "Road Closed" and its impossible to jump over and use air transport over?

Actually, in canon, Alderney is connected to the mainland and is actually much larger. The reason they make it an island is that they want to keep the player within the playable area, the area in which the story is taking place. In the GTA III Era, Liberty City was two islands and Shoreside Vale, which was connected to the mainland. In a map, you could actually see that there were two roads that lead upstate that were connected to the Cochrane Dam, but they were inaccessible. Adding artificial barriers to the game just seems like an ugly addition, so the rest of Alderney (and, therefore, the mainland) was omitted in order to keep the protagonist in the place where his story is happening.

The cops were supposed to be more intelligent. They were meant to pull you up if your car was riddled with bullets or blood or serious damage & you were supposed to be questioned, not shot on sight.

Your gripe is in the wrong section. it should be under Police gripes. Move it there, and I'll rebut your gripe.

Using the rear view while driving and then going back to the forward view will often result in cars appearing out of nowhere. Extremely annoying. There will be a clear street in front of you one minute, then you check the cops chasing you in the rear view, then suddenly slam into a car infront of you that wasn't there a second ago. Please don't rebut with something like "they just turned onto the street" because this happens on bridges as well.

Those are the breaks of driving in Liberty City. Vehicles will spawn in the most inconvenient of places, you will have to adapt and think ahead for those kinds of contingencies.

The subway is clearly unfinished and isn't as useful as it could have been. The red/green line passes directly under Frankfort Low (you can hear it, and often it spawns a train in there rather than on the Low platform) and yet there's no third set of platforms at Frankfort. There are tunnels and tracks enabling trains to continue north from Easton to Manganese East, yet they always cross the bridge to Hove Beach. What's the point in the announcements of which line the train is following if only one line ever serves that station? In reality you'd need to check where each train was going rather than just getting on the first one to come into the station. Spare me any 'just use taxis' rebuttals, thanks.

Just use taxis, thanks. :)

I'd rebut it, but it seems too complicated.

Overall, the AI traffic behave more sensibly and predictably than in GTA SA (in San Andreas the traffic cars drove as if they were on rails, wouldn't indicate turns before making them, and would 'snap' around corners unnaturally leaving you no way to predict their turn before you hit them.), but they make constant erratic lane changes on the bridges and often rear end or scrape against your car at the traffic lights. It's really annoying to get your car trashed by careless AI drivers in easily preventable collisions. And don't use the "everyone in GTA is crazy so they're bad drivers" rebuttal, because in this particular case, if the player wants chaos, they can create it themselves. The rest of us like to keep our cars intact kthx.

IIRC, this is the only GTA III-era game that included illuminated turn signals for AI drivers. GTA:SA deleted the reverse lights for some unknown reason, and GTA III and Vice City used some early lighting algorithm that displayed lights in boundary boxes, instead of the lighting schemes in SA and IV. Rockstar did a good job with programming the AI, because most of these events are random and unpredictable, just like in real life. Also, it helps to avoid collisions if one drives simply and not follow the usual GTA Driving playbook, but that's not gonna happen, is it?

You have to admit that getting your nice new convertible scratched by a car that changed lanes 4-5 times on a long, narrow two laned road will get on your nerves after a while.

Hey why are you 3 talking about GTA San Andreas can you guys read. This is called GTA IV Gripes/In-game World. You guys can olny talk about GTA IV Gripes/In-game World. Go gripe somewhere else about San Andreas you Boneheads.

No, YOU bonehead, they were only giving San Andreas as a comparison, I think someone needs to learn how to read.

Please refrain from insulting others. You need to learn some manners. This is just a video game. No need to get heated over it.

Just a minor nitpick: you can't change the station on any of the in-game radios (like the ones in your safehouses). This isn't that important, but it'd be nice to be able to do it if you want.

YOU CAN CHANGE RADIO STATIONS.

He's talking about radio stations inside your safehouses or other buildings, NOT vehicles. I mean, just because you can change radio stations while driving a vehicle/bike, does'nt mean you can change radio stations while inside any buildings. Another failed realism by Rockstar Games.

You can change the radio stations inside the safehouse as well by going into audio setting and changing the radio station there.

Nope, tried it on the Xbox 360 version of the game and the music in the safehouse you get after killing playboy is still the same crappy RnB, I even resorted to looking around the apartment for the source of the music to shoot the hell out of it seeing as it worked to silence the noise in the mission where you have to kill the drug dealer person. It's so damn annoying that I can't change the radio station in my own home to LRR, and have to endure music I hate everytime I want to spend time there. It's quite infuriating.

Whenever you hail for a vacant taxi, it will almost always CRASH to the nearby curb / wall / lamppost for you (unless it is already at a stop, such as in front of a red traffic light or stuck in a traffic jam). This is kind of silly...

Yes i agree it is silly. But the taxi system still has a lot of bugs to fix. GTA IV was the first game with the taxi system so we'll see if it is fixed on GTA V.

GTA IV isn't the first game with a taxi system, vice city had one.

Taxi system in GTA III era was extremely limited compared GTA IV. Plus, after getting into a taxi, you just saw the taxi arriving at the destination. So GTA IV is the first GTA to implement REAL Taxi system.

Real taxi system? Maybe it's just a glitch but whenever I hail a taxi, I get inside, and I don't even bother to rush it. So I go in the kitchen to make myself some food..Guess what happens when I come back? For the most INSANE reason, people are dying everywhere, theres cars randomly blowing up for no reason, and I freak out. So I get out of the taxi, and I find people on the street burning, and just then, a car explodes rght in my face. That would've happened If I stayed in the taxi. I'm not kidding either. This has happened to me on two occasions..One was in star junction, and the other was next my cenral park. What the hell goes on? I leave for 3 minutes, and then I come back, and the drivers crashing into a flaming car, trying to get out of the lane. And the driver doesn't even care.

All the phone numbers (besides ZiT!) makes little to no use outside of missions.

911 can be called for an Ambulance to heal yourself. True, it costs money, but since you make a lot of money in the main story, it's chump change.

True, but I'm talking about phone numbers from billboard ads that makes it useless to call up. I mean, how realistic to have phone numbers from billboard ads and call up and only to find out that it's clearly useless?

I just want to see some new outfits, side missions, and weapons. Now I know everyone keeps saying GTA 4 is not a shopping game but I'm not asking for new designer clothes. All I'm asking for are some cool uniforms like ambulance, police(all variations of it), NOOSE, FIB, construction worker, security officier, mafia, and maybe a few new street clothes. So yea, nothing unresonable about that and if you question the realism well niko encounters all these people so maybe he steals a out fit as a disguise. Now side missions, their could be alot more things for you to do. Now I know they'll probably add new missions in a DLC but they could add some new little side missions nothing big but I mean like ambulance, firefighter and vigilante, liberty city is based off of new york and I'm sure new york has tons of fires, and ambulace rescues all the time so that fits the realism. Vigilante missions could be are too easy, the most wanted list is okay I guess but they could have made it like a mini mission that involved a chase over atleast a few blocks. And most importantly you should get paid for them I mean they are assassinations. They could also be expanded upon more, my idea is they could be designed like this:

-Vigilante missions come in three stages Police, fib, and noose. -you need to grab the appropiate vehicle for each stage: police patrol/cruiser, FIB buffalo, and noose enforceer( to make this easier they could make them spawn at police stations). -when you start you are put in the uniform of the particular unit( police, FIB, noose) just for the missions and you lose it when you quit. - each stage is made of 10-15 missions that increase in difficulty for each stage - For completing a stage you unlock access to a police armory where you can get police issue weapons for free and you can wear the uniform of any of the stages you completed any time you want outsiode of the vigilante mission but you can only access them by going to a police armory. that doesn't seem like too much to ask for. lastly some new weapons and that is pretty much self explanatory.

Would you shut up already you talk too much for Christ Sake. If you want all this put that in the GTA 5 Wishlist not here. This page was made for griping not for making wishes. Go put this in GTA 5 Wishlist okay fat boy.

Would you watch the insults and learn to handle people like this in a calm manner? What the hell makes it okay to call the dude fat, and what the hell do you have against fat people? You might as well call him a "stupid jew" too. Calm down..

He is insulting people becuase you people are lazy. i cant believe you spend your time watching retarded images that you can control aka video games. go do something manly like lifting weights doing risky things, playing sports, etc... i have gta 4 and i rareley play vidoe games. its time for u to be a strong person and lose weight. be healthy not fat. And be mature cause when your an adult you have to do responsibilities and stop playing too much video games. I mean wont it look imature playing like a ten year old in front of our girlfriend. Get a Life.

There's a too small amount of clothes. In San Andreas, there were like a thousand clothings or clothing shop and in GTA IV...there's 4 clothing shops and in every one of them there's a small amount of clothings.

Do you read the above gripes? This has been mentioned! Several times!!! You have several other things in the game you can do. I'm sorry but what kind of GUY likes shopping around for clothes for hours and hours at a time, especially in a virtual city? Go do some racing, helicopter flying, killing sprees, whatever the hell you want!!!! There's so much to do!!!!!

And what about guns? There's only two sets of weapons. In the GTA III era there were more guns then in GTA IV.

YES! AGAIN! It says at the top not to REPEAT GRIPES!!! This has been mentioned several times in its own section!!! Look in the weapons gripes and you'll find rebuts for this. I'm not rebutting this again.

No destructible buildings.

Grand Theft Auto is not Grand City Destruction. If buildings were destroyed, it would vastly affect the gameplay in Liberty City - how would the story progress if certain essential buildings were destroyed earlier? And if you wanted to tear down a city, there's Mercenaries for you.

But you can destroy the building and just leave the area for some time and just come back to see it looks like it wasn't destroyed.

Doesn't that sound a bit unrealistic to you?

Sometimes in my game, and i dont know if its just a bad glitch, but theres a car horn that comes out of nowhere and doesnt stop going off. Its only in certian areas, but its very annoying.

It's maybe because you snipe somebody in a car at the driver seat and his/her head hits the horn, making it sound for a long time.

Nope, I can go out of the city and come back and it will still be going. I think it may be just my game.

From my understanding, this is a bug that happens when I used to play the game early on. It comes out of places where cars aren't mean to be (like inside buildings), but they are gone as soon as I load another savegame. I'm not sure if this is a bug, or if it has been fixed with recent patches. - ZS 18:51, 2 May 2009 (UT

O wow that happent to me a lot and it rely pisses me off so i end up blowing up every car but it still continues

i tink its just a bug that gta testers missed or thought it part of the game

Niko does not pinpoint certain locations whenever calling 911 (e.g. Aldereny State Correctional Facility, Leaper's Bridge, Booth Tunnel). Yet whenever you're in Happiness Island, he does pinpoint the location, but no emergency vehicles appear in this island. WAY unrealistic.

And of course a car which drove over water/flew would be more so? There aren't even any roads on the island, and Liberty City doesn't have/need an air ambulance service. There aren't going to be any major fires on the island, and any crime would theoretically be small, not necessitating a police helicopter. It would be far more unrealistic for an emergency vehicle to simply pop out of nowhere onto the island.

It does'nt make sense why would Niko be unable to pinpoint the locations, like Leaper's Bridge, Alderney State Correctional Facility, even Booth Tunnel? Not that hard to remember, unless Niko is suffering a lot of short term memory loss, which ndoes'nt make any sense at all.

When you call 911, Niko will pinpoint the names of the municipalities he's in, and GTA IV lists the Alderney State Correctional Facility and Happiness Island as their own municipalities.

Why do the story missions pay so much money? The biggest drain on cash a player will find is hospital bills. This means that any player who's good at not being killed will find themselves with almost half a million dollars and nothing to spend it on by the end of the story. The fact that the story missions pay so well also makes doing taxi missions for Roman, among other things, useless. What Rockstar should have done was either make more things to spend money on(Safehouses, clothes, vehicles, etc.), or made the missions pay less. In fact, a combination of the two would have been good, alongside making the Roman taxi missions pay slightly more(So they feel useful. Making them more fun would have also made them feel less like a second job that I had to pay for). The money, quite simply, has very little place in gameplay or story development, and could be implemented far better as a gameplay element.

You almost sound angry at the fact that you have a lot of money. For my personal opinion, this massively excessive money is there so you can easily buy a massive arsenal and go on a massive rampage, pausing only to pay the individual dollar for a burger/hot dog/hooker to heal you up. Kit 12:42, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Why is Bohan so small? I like the Bronx and I wish it was more represented in this game.

Because thats the way Rockstar made it

I love Rockstar but they forgot Yankee Statium and City Island to say the least. I'm glad they put Parkchester in as Little Bay and I thought the Fordham Road area was well represented in the game. They also needed more subway stations in Bohan as the strip club is inaccessable within walking distance. I'm lazy and have to take a cab over there! To me the subway staations in Bohan are modeled realistically but some in the Bronx are underground. I may sound like an idiot but the game should be called G.T.A. Da Bronx! Algonquin is cool but clean and touristy and Dukes and Broker are okay for pool and russian shows but thats about it. Like everyone else on this website I think Alderney is useless. Bohan's where it should be at in the G.T.A. series.
I think R* should have added that Claude should appear at somtime in the game, maybe in the future R* will make a gae where all the main characters meet each other, but in a huomorous way, like maybe CJ sees Claude walking in and insults him about him not talking, where it leads to where Claude shoots him in the foot, and he falls to the ground, then Claude says something.

1: Claude doesn't speak. 2: That should go in the GTAV Wishlist. Also that should be a seperate gripe. It's completely unrelated to Bohan being too small.

Why is the hidden package now pigeons that is a really dumb idea. Who would really waste there time shooting pigeons in real life? BTW pigeons are my favorite animals.

why do yous care so much about realism becuase if they made the game fully real youd be getting chased by the police for years if you killed a pedestrian and those pigeons are fun to kill i think

I don't want everything to be real. BTW it will be fun being chase by cops for years because it will be a better challenge. Pigeons aren't even fun to kill just imagine a pigeon actually kills you would that be fun??? NO

Why can't we choose our own food in restaurants like in GTA San Andreas

There is no point because there is no fat statistic.

I know that so why is GTA IV just promoting The Heart Stopper. Then there is no point of promoting The Heart Stopper if you can't choose your own food. It will be funny watching Niko get a heart attack when he eats the Heart Stopper and whats so hard about adding that feature anyway.

CJ throws up in SA and PPL thought that was offensive. Don't you think that Heart Attacks would be offensive.

I don't see why not. People have heart attacks all the time. People just got to deal with the fact that they won't agree with absolutely everything. The N word is very offensive, but that doesnt stop people from saying it in video games.

Like most products advertised on the radio in the GTA series, the Heartstopper Burger is a joke & part of Rockstar's social satire.

Joke or not, it's unrealistic, to just put up ads for the Heartsopper and not feature it in the game.

I just want to see some new outfits, side missions, and weapons. Now I know everyone keeps saying GTA 4 is not a shopping game but I'm not asking for new designer clothes. All I'm asking for are some cool uniforms like ambulance, police(all variations of it), NOOSE, FIB, construction worker, security officier, mafia, and maybe a few new street clothes. So yea, nothing unresonable about that and if you question the realism well niko encounters all these people so maybe he steals a out fit as a disguise. Now side missions, their could be alot more things for you to do. Now I know they'll probably add new missions in a DLC but they could add some new little side missions nothing big but I mean like ambulance, firefighter and vigilante, liberty city is based off of new york and I'm sure new york has tons of fires, and ambulace rescues all the time so that fits the realism. Vigilante missions could be are too easy, the most wanted list is okay I guess but they could have made it like a mini mission that involved a chase over atleast a few blocks. And most importantly you should get paid for them I mean they are assassinations. They could also be expanded upon more, my idea is they could be designed like this:

-Vigilante missions come in three stages Police, fib, and noose.
-you need to grab the appropiate vehicle for each stage: police patrol/cruiser, FIB buffalo, and noose enforceer( to make this easier they could make them spawn at police stations).
-when you start you are put in the uniform of the particular unit( police, FIB, noose) just for the missions and you lose it when you quit.
- each stage is made of 10-15 missions that increase in difficulty for each stage
- For completing a stage you unlock access to a police armory where you can get police issue weapons for free and you can wear the uniform of any of the stages you completed any time you want outsiode of the vigilante mission but you can only access them by going to a police armory. that doesn't seem like too much to ask for. lastly some new weapons and that is pretty much self explanatory.

Hey can you read. don't copy other people's gripe. You just broke a Grand Theft Wiki rule.

Planes that are there but cannot be driven?!? Its GTA LCS again. (Wasnt even a DODO in LCS or Helicopter)

There were helecopters AND the Dodo in GTA: LCS(Granted, not normally accessable, but there(And(mostly)functional)), who would really want to fly a plane in an area shuch as Liberty city? It's either boring open ocean or crowded urban areas only suitable for stunters. If you wanna fly, San Andreas works. Oh, and at least you gots dem helicopters.

Planes cannot be driven for many different reasons.The main reason is that its not like SA, Liberty City would be gone in about 1 minute(I dont say seconds since i see planes that move much slower). Second, if you wanna see Liberty City in the air, Go to Higgens Helitours and either pay for an algonquin only tour or jack a heli and take to the skies.

There aren't any myths...Well, not alot of them anyways.Where are they? It's not an unrealistic choice because life has urban legends too. And In GTA san andreas, I found it so fun to hang out at mount chillad at 12:00 at night, and just stay there armed with an uzi while looking around. It was also fun to watch ghost cars. Ghost cars are in GTA IV too..Believe me..I saw this SUV, and I shot it with a shotgun..It didn't even seped away, it just started driving away slowly, and I ran after it. When I went up to it with my shotgun armed, no one was in the SUV...It just stopped. See, this is what makes Grand theft auto fun, especially when you beat the game. Oh, and I have another question. Where do I go to to gripe about The ballad of gay tony? It's a fabulous expansion..I love it, but I saw a few problems with it.

You can't use the bathroom. There are bathrooms in Burger Shot but why are they inaccesible. That is really unrealstic. What kind of restuarant doesn't have bathrooms.

The Cluckin Bell has an accessible bathroom, and there really is no use for it, other than for comedic (At least that's what I think) purposes. So what would be the use of a bathroom in the Burger Shot if there's no use for it in the Cluckin Bell?

The vehicles in-game do not go in their proper lanes. It would be easier to be escaping the police if you know which lane the cars are going or doing a mission. Some cars go into a straight lane, but end up going left.

It's to make it more realistic, in real life there are a-holes who don't go in their proper lanes either

NO YANKEE STADIUM

While it's weird that Rockstar omitted notable NYC landmarks, such as the Citigroup Center, Liberty City is only an approximation of NYC

Missing Pigeons...I followed the in-game internet website (www.whattheydonotwantyoutoknow.com) to track down every single flying rat and I somehow missed 3. How is that possible!? I spent hours, days even, meticulously scouring the entire game map for them.
Ugh.

This is a stupid thing to gripe about, if you missed some pigeons then that is not ours or Rockstars fault.

Then it's the game's fault.

The traffic behaves very unrealistically. I mean, whenever you run out in front of a car, or someone else does, the car just stops. On a similar note, if you drive straight at another car, the driver of the other car doesn't do anything to get out of the way, he just sits there like a lemon, waiting to be hit. R* should have made it so that the traffic swerved out of the way instead of just stopping or sitting there (think of the carnage this could cause in downtown Algonquin).

well if you saw a car coming at you when you were at a dead stop you could not do anything about it anyway but if they are moving they do try & get out of the way

Yeah, I know that, but couldn’t R* have made it a little more… you know, chaotic? I’d have loved to see cars veering into other lanes, crashing into other cars, mounting the sidewalk and killing pedestrians… It wouldn’t have been too hard to add, and would have been awesome.

thats your job to do that

after you do all the missions there is really nothing to do so it just gets boring

you can do some side missions like car thefts and drug deals. You can also goof around Jackass or just start a new game

There's also MP.

MP doesn't work for me anymore. I tried it again and again to see if it works, no luck. Aso, the game tends to freeze up for no reason whenever I play GTA IV and the disc and the PS3 itself was working fine.

not sure if this is the right section but here it goes...i think they should have made a larger liberty city with country sides, and small towns to surround it, it would probably make the game more epic to :D MegaHyperNova 18:25, 13 October 2010 (BST)

R* was actually going to include the whole of Liberty State in the beta version of GTA IV, but it was removed, likely because all the real action take place in LC. I agree that it would have been cool, though. Sgt. S.S. 21:41, 16 October 2010 (BST)