I love Dr. Pamela Wible. She is my role model for what I want to accomplish as a primary care doctor. And she has a passion for taking care of other physicians who have been injured by the process of becoming doctors. Her TED talk is great, but this is a talk she gave addressing a group of medical students directly. Physician suicide has been a hot topic lately, and it seemed like a good time to share this.

do medical schools still do tests on animals like the ones she was describing?

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It was hard to find a source on this but the following schools still use vivisection (experimentation on live animals):

Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine

Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences School of Medicine

University of Mississippi Medical Center

Oregon Health & Science University School of Medicine

University of Tennessee Health Science Center College of Medicine (Chattanooga campus only)

University of Virginia School of Medicine

Medical College of Wisconsin

Today, most programs use alternatives often aided by cadavers and computer simulations. The use of dogs was officially stopped in 2007 but replaced in some programs with pigs and sheep (which should be equally disgusting).

do medical schools still do tests on animals like the ones she was describing?

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Animals are used in research and teaching at institutions across the country, many of them medical schools. I think her descriptions of animal use in teaching labs is made to be purposefully inflammatory - she doesn't include any mention of euthanasia before she discusses dissecting the dogs, and they would most certainly not have been dissected alive without anesthetic in 1991.

Laboratory animal medicine certainly has room for improvement, and good for her for standing up for her own personal beliefs. However, I find it ironic that she, a physician, is so vehemently against animal use in research. As a family practitioner, I imagine she uses vaccines, prescribes medications, uses equipment and follows methodology developed through the use of animals in research. If she's going to reject the use of animals to further the understanding of medicine and science, she should quit reaping the rewards of their sacrifices.

Animals are used in research and teaching at institutions across the country, many of them medical schools. I think her descriptions of animal use in teaching labs is made to be purposefully inflammatory - she doesn't include any mention of euthanasia before she discusses dissecting the dogs, and they would most certainly not have been dissected alive without anesthetic in 1991.

Laboratory animal medicine certainly has room for improvement, and good for her for standing up for her own personal beliefs. However, I find it ironic that she, a physician, is so vehemently against animal use in research. As a family practitioner, I imagine she uses vaccines, prescribes medications, uses equipment and follows methodology developed through the use of animals in research. If she's going to reject the use of animals to further the understanding of medicine and science, she should quit reaping the rewards of their sacrifices.

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She is probably of the opinion that there was a better, more humane way to convey this knowledge to medical students. I don't think, however, that she was against all use of animals in research - although it is possible she is. Whether the irony is there or not, it is still unacceptable (at least in my opinion) for one path to exist when a more humane path is available. But then again I'm an ethical vegetarian so I guess I'm biased.

She is probably of the opinion that there was a better, more humane way to convey this knowledge to medical students. I don't think, however, that she was against all use of animals in research - although it is possible she is. Whether the irony is there or not, it is still unacceptable (at least in my opinion) for one path to exist when a more humane path is available. But then again I'm an ethical vegetarian so I guess I'm biased.

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I agree with you 100% - even at our vet school we've been petitioning to decrease the use of teaching animals in our curriculum where humane alternatives exist. And perhaps it's hasty of me to assume her ethical veganism extends to all animal use in teaching and research, but figured it'd point it out anyway as the topic is near and dear to me.

I agree with you 100% - even at our vet school we've been petitioning to decrease the use of teaching animals in our curriculum where humane alternatives exist. And perhaps it's hasty of me to assume her ethical veganism extends to all animal use in teaching and research, but figured it'd point it out anyway as the topic is near and dear to me.

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It's also a case of "free-riding" where a person, perceiving they are the minority, refuse to act because they view the majority as entrenched and - in her words - institutionalized but are subject to the consequences of the majority's policy anyways. Seeing as she does call for people to stand up what they think is right even if they are alone in this talk I would be surprised if she does that have that position (vivisection is categorically wrong) that it isn't somewhere on her blog. I've never heard about her before though, she seems like a very happy primary care physician. Maybe she (and her business model) is the poster-child primary care needs these days.

She is probably of the opinion that there was a better, more humane way to convey this knowledge to medical students. I don't think, however, that she was against all use of animals in research - although it is possible she is. Whether the irony is there or not, it is still unacceptable (at least in my opinion) for one path to exist when a more humane path is available. But then again I'm an ethical vegetarian so I guess I'm biased.

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I concur with this statement. In the case of those schools, I don't think they even tried to look for alternatives or were stuck on a belief that should have died out a long time ago.

It was hard to find a source on this but the following schools still use vivisection (experimentation on live animals):

Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine

Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences School of Medicine

University of Mississippi Medical Center

Oregon Health & Science University School of Medicine

University of Tennessee Health Science Center College of Medicine (Chattanooga campus only)

University of Virginia School of Medicine

Medical College of Wisconsin

Today, most programs use alternatives often aided by cadavers and computer simulations. The use of dogs was officially stopped in 2007 but replaced in some programs with pigs and sheep (which should be equally disgusting).

Click to expand...

Here's a source for JHU. What's terrible is the use of "lightly embalmed" cadavers has huge potential for very closely simulating living patients when practicing procedures and even surgery, yet one of the most prestigious medical schools, instead of leading the way with this, clings to the unnecessary use of animals.