First off, I am stealing your opening rant about social media. I have said it a million times, I often have difficulty capturing my thoughts in writing but I can sure tell when someone else does!

Godwin's Law should be put right up there as a modern day staple much like Newtown's law of gravity or the laws of matter. Take his example and multiply it times any crazy, nutball thing that happens in our society and you have the talking points for most nightly news casts or what disguises itself as intellectual conversation.

As I read your post, I realized how few of the conversations that you had with your friend that I actually get into these days. Why? Because invariably they end up like yours and I get more shook by that fact than anything new or original someone might actually be able to point out to me.

It sounds presumptuous and I dislike having to state it but I have been in this rodeo for a while. I say it as a matter of explaining my familiarity with certain trains of thought not as an old man wanting people to get off my lawn. The overriding issue I have with both sides of the political aisle right now is that neither has any penchant or desire to appeal to someone like you, as an example. Instead, the push is to grab either the lower educated, less informed or just plain racist/bigoted/etc. people and inflame their worst fears. It doesn't matter where I go these days, it seems everywhere. When I do run into a semi intelligent conversation, it will usually end up like yours with someone deciding "enough with the logic, let me just bring on the hyperbole".

As i have stated many times, I am a life long Democrat and whereas I can relate to your opinions of POTUS Trump(I always remember calling POTUS OBama just OBama and someone rightfully calling me out on it, imagine if we held that same level of respect for POTUS Trump) and agree with many of them, my biggest issue of late is how the Democratic party has just imploded. They are essentially led by the extreme left, with their best candidate a socialist. Imagine that, a socialist POTUS in the US, it might happen and people wouldn't even realize it did or what the implications are for that. There don't seem to be any real Dems or a platform there, just resistance and name calling. The strongest thing that POTUS Trump has going for his political future is the Dem party To be honest, I am not even sure Trump cares about a political future though I am sure his ego would be much better served to not lose a re-election.

In many way, I can really relate to Stevo and his comment "I need a break". Despite it being my "hobby" for a long time, I rarely talk about politics or the like much these days and that is kinda sad in its own way. I feel like there is a middle ground out there that needs to resurface but I am not sure how it can with all of the hatred and bile being thrown around. The only "good" I see is that many people and outlets seem to be tiring of the 24/7/365 POTUS Trump hatred and at least be moving onto other things. But, in many ways I am not even sure POTUS Trump will let this happen. He seems to like/enjoy/play off the craziness and in the end, he wins when it gets like that. It's a shame people do not see that and just keep feeding the frenzy.

- Me being the resident optimist around this cesspool of doom and gloom, StevoStarks, circa 2019

I am going to try to post my first political comment on this website. I don't usually like talking about politics, but here we go.

The problem with this country is its so highly divided among political views. Many people from both political parties tend to have emotional attachments to their views and are unwilling to compromise them. As Trump has demonstrated in the past election, emotion can win elections. As much as a dislike what the republican party is doing, I don't think that modern democratic party is much better. If we take away their rhetoric and labels, both of these parties are led by upper class elites who do not really care about lower classes. They are using voters as pawns to gain power and fail to keep most of their promises. Their tactics involve using emotional appeal based on social issues important to their political base, but do not really do much.

In order to unseat Trump in 2020, democrats need a candidate who is willing to appeal to all voters, not just their own base. They need to win these small town red states. I think Hillary did a terrible mistake by calling Trump supporters "deplorables". I am not a Trump supporter, but these comments alienate a lot of people. Democrats also need to campaign on actual issues. The past election showed that they cannot win based on opposition to Trump. Many people want to hear what they would do about these issues.

Republicans also need to run someone to challenge Trump in 2020, because he is hurting their base. They have to appeal to minority voters and well as the youth. In order to do this, they must moderate many of their views on social issues. They must realize that if they keep running on far-right conservatism, they will eventually lose.

I personally love how Trump has singly handedly obliterated our entire political system. Exposing extremists from both parties that will inevitably lead to the rise of independents who aren't tied to political biases. It also opened the door to business leaders throwing their names into the running for future elections. We need great minds leading this country. Not more lifelong politicians.

Muzhik1 wrote:I am going to try to post my first political comment on this website. I don't usually like talking about politics, but here we go.

The problem with this country is its so highly divided among political views. Many people from both political parties tend to have emotional attachments to their views and are unwilling to compromise them. As Trump has demonstrated in the past election, emotion can win elections. As much as a dislike what the republican party is doing, I don't think that modern democratic party is much better. If we take away their rhetoric and labels, both of these parties are led by upper class elites who do not really care about lower classes. They are using voters as pawns to gain power and fail to keep most of their promises. Their tactics involve using emotional appeal based on social issues important to their political base, but do not really do much.

In order to unseat Trump in 2020, democrats need a candidate who is willing to appeal to all voters, not just their own base. They need to win these small town red states. I think Hillary did a terrible mistake by calling Trump supporters "deplorables". I am not a Trump supporter, but these comments alienate a lot of people. Democrats also need to campaign on actual issues. The past election showed that they cannot win based on opposition to Trump. Many people want to hear what they would do about these issues.

Republicans also need to run someone to challenge Trump in 2020, because he is hurting their base. They have to appeal to minority voters and well as the youth. In order to do this, they must moderate many of their views on social issues. They must realize that if they keep running on far-right conservatism, they will eventually lose.

Great post, welcome to the discussion

You have hit the main points well. I would say though that with the Democratic party it is not so much appealing to their base as it is understanding what/who that base is. The party itself is so fractured that it really does not stand for anything any more. It is dominated by the Liberal and Progressive movements. I think people often mistake Democrats and being synonymous with Liberals/Progressives which is very much not the case.

On the flip side, you have it correct with Trump only I would say that he is not necessarily hurting the Republican base as much as potentially shifting it to the left. The irony of people that choose not to look at Trump and just "resist" is that he is much more "Democratic" than any of the other "leaders" within the Democratic party. He listed himself as a Democrat for much of his life and was an ardent supported of Bill Clinton. If you go back 20 years or so and look at or listen to the Dem leaders of the time, it sounds like current Trump sounds bites. But, people don't do that kind of research or critical thinking any more

I don't think that Trump has any base in the far right at all, in fact, they are s much his opponents these days as Dems. I m not sure I understand their logic and there are some that get it....Trump may not be conservative enough for them but he is way ahead of anything the Dem party is gonna offer up....but they continually run for cover when he needs their support.

My only real "fear" as we move towards midterm elections is to see what the support base looks like for Sanders. Whereas, I can say that I am not sure there are any potential 2020 candidates that I would actually really like, he is one that I definitely would not like and fear what his influence could do. he seems to really be losing support within the Dem party and realistically he should. I am hopeful that this is the party leaders finally realizing that they need to get back to their roots and embracing Socialism is not anywhere near that!

- Me being the resident optimist around this cesspool of doom and gloom, StevoStarks, circa 2019

KnicksRUs wrote:I personally love how Trump has singly handedly obliterated our entire political system. Exposing extremists from both parties that will inevitably lead to the rise of independents who aren't tied to political biases. It also opened the door to business leaders throwing their names into the running for future elections. We need great minds leading this country. Not more lifelong politicians.

He's a complete tool, but I love every minute of it.

In a few lines you have summed up what many pundits and experts cannot!!

It has LONG been felt by many that the US needed a business type leader instead of a politician. I always felt that if it ever happened that one got elected (I didn't think it actually would) he would get lambasted on both sides not because of his abilities but because of the fear that politicians had about how potentially successful a business person might be.

I am not gonna go down the road of specifics 'cause then people will get too distracted but if you want to take a look at a prime example of how a business person will handle something versus a politician, look at the rhetoric going back and forth with China over trade and tariffs. Of course, our news outlets are lambasting Trump because they are in "resist" mode but when you see quotes by economists, even on left leaning news sources, they are realizing that he game is shifting. A politician would be worried about "image" and how the press will make things look. The best thing about the "resist" movement is that Trump no longer can care about his press. It is as bad as it can be so he may as well just do things the way he wants and let the chips fall where they may.

The world is seeing this and I believe they are certainly worried....not in, as the press likes to eschew, "Trump" but what a US leader that is not concerned about politics/press might actually do. China, Canada, etc....this really is fascinating stuff and the real shame is that people who all of a sudden have this urge to get involved and "speak up" are missing the real action.

- Me being the resident optimist around this cesspool of doom and gloom, StevoStarks, circa 2019