Jason Collins about to sign 10 day contract with Nets expected to start tonight vs Lakers

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Honestly, I'm not surprised one bit by the reaction of some, how it has devolved into a discussion about homosexuality and how it is considered "right or wrong" ( by some ) based off of IMHO outdated definition of certain words.

Could the Nets have signed Collins as a PR stunt to get some Media attention?

Could the Nets have signed Collins cuz they needed some Frontcourt help?

Could the Nets have signed Collins cuz they needed some Frontcourt help while getting some PR / Media Attention?

The answer to all of these questions is "Sure, it's entirely possible". The reality is that we do not know what the real motivation the Nets chose to sign Collins to a 10-day contract over others. But I'm going to give the benefit of the doubt to the Nets and just assume that it was for legitimate reasons ( cuz they actually needed Frontcourt help ) and not for the reasons that some may have suggested ( for PR reasons ).

I applaud those that stood up and decided to speak up for what they believe and they think is right.

For those that I disagree with, I know that it is a matter of opinion ( which you are entitled to )........so I will leave your words as that...just a matter of opinion and nothing else.

This thread has gone the course that I expected it to go given where the majority of where most PD responders likely comes from ( I'm referring to those that live in Indiana/MidWest where I think that it is a more Conservative part of the Country ).

With that said:

My guess is that this thread won't last that much longer.....probably another 9 days at most.

A group of parents in a California school district say they are being bullied by school administrators into accepting a new curriculum that addresses bullying, respect and acceptance -- and that includes compulsory lessons about the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender community that will be taught to children as young as 5 years old.

A "quick search?" Those are hardly unbiased sources. The one you quoted was from a hate group.

He compares the fight against the homosexuals to the fight against the nazis.

Did people in1942 talk about respecting the Nazis "choice" of political philosophy? Or that we ought to consider letting Japan have Korea and the Solomon Islands if they'd let us have the Philippines -- because that's what the "experts" say we could work out?

Don't listen to them. It's a false promise. It's extremely tempting but it's the road to hell. That's why we support a Parents' Rights Bill that gives parents complete control. And it's why we don't support the current Constitutional Amendment that purposefully compromises by only banning future homosexual "marriages" and allowing all others -- including civil unions or domestic partnership -- to stand unimpeded. Compromising in normal discourse is often appropriate; but compromising with evil is disastrous.

I'm thinking I'm going to need a better source before I'm convinced.

Last edited by Kstat; 02-24-2014 at 02:11 AM.

It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

Just a quick google search of that particular curriculum that is what came up........ and regardless if it is a "hate group" as you say.. I don't know nor keep up with such things to even know that..... but I do know however, it is an actual curriculum I have seen with my own eyes... and I guess scanned to pdf by this apparent "hate group"

Just a quick google search of that particular curriculum that is what came up........ and regardless if it is a "hate group" as you say.. I don't know nor keep up with such things to even know that..... but I do know however, it is an actual curriculum I have seen with my own eyes... and I guess scanned to pdf by this apparent "hate group"

Fair enough. From the Fox News portion:

The proposed curriculum will include a 45-minute LGBT lesson, once a year from kindergarten through fifth grade. The kindergartners will focus on the harms of teasing, while the fifth graders will study sexual orientation stereotypes.

The move toward the new curriculum began two years ago, when teachers noticed that even kindergarten students were using derogatory words about sexuality, such as “***.”

You know what? That all sounds perfectly reasonable to me. Children need to be taught in school not to torment others for being different. I see nothing in there about pushing any homosexual agenda on children. My first sex ed class was in 4th or 5th grade. If they want to acknowledge that not everyone is attracted to the opposite sex, I see zero harm in that.

I speak from experience when I say the word (gay slur starting with an f) was common place among my elementary classmates long before I even knew what it meant, and that's terrible.

Last edited by Kstat; 02-24-2014 at 02:26 AM.

It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

no I am NOT afraid of gays lmao.. I don't even dislike them...matter of fact I have a family member who is ... but I DO dislike their behavior.. and yes I find their sexual behavior "SICKENING AND ABHORRENT" .......... BEHAVIOR..... stop putting words in my mouth, I said BEHAVIOR... you don't like it lump it ...... since it seems I have to "lump it" by hearing all this praise for all these brave souls who come out the closet ...

Should it earn universal praise by all? Nope....but your sarcastic comments seem to suggest that the very act is some trivial act.

I know that you don't agree with the way Homosexuals live their lives......but it is very difficult for many ( but not all ) to "come out of the closet" for the very comments that have been posted by some in th.

And yes, when our kids are being taught in ELEMENTARY SCHOOL , for instance, how 2 guys butt humping each other is a perfectly A-OK and it is A-OK for them to "experiment" .. YEA SICKENING AND ABHORRENT BEHAVIOR..... Have you seen the stuff they are teaching kids as early as 1st and 2nd grade in some of these schools? Sorry , but tolerance should be taught ............NOT a how-to guide in indoctrinating young children in the ways of homosexuality...

and I did not find anything that suggests that schools are indoctinating anybody for anything. From what I was able to quickly browse from the document, it just talks about what Homosexuality is....nothing that suggests that one should experiment with anyone or anything.

You know what? That all sounds perfectly reasonable to me. Children need to be taught in school not to torment others for being different. I see nothing in there about pushing any homosexual agenda on children. My first sex ed class was in 4th or 5th grade. If they want to acknowledge that not everyone is attracted to the opposite sex, I see zero harm in that.

sorry maybe not good sources, in a angry frenzy I posted the first stuff that I found I thought was relevant, and the pdf I have actually seen the curriculum it is talking about where they were showing actual diagrams on how 2 people , including homosexuals have sex....to kids in elementary school.. this is just a hot button issue with me, because I don't think it is the schools business to teach anything but abstinence and tolerance for all.... I am of the belief of a man and woman are natural and anything else is unnatural and against nature and my religion ...

oh and kstat .. exactly how many times are you gonna edit your posts adding and deleting things you said?

and Cablekc , yes I was being sarcastic.. only because here we have a sitting president who doesn't honor our war veterans at Arlington, totally snubs his nose at every tradition that has been a yearly staple at the White House... yet on the news you see a picture of Michelle Obama with Jason Collins with a quote from her how they are honoring him that day at the White House, and she is soooo proud of him for being so "brave" as she put it for coming out ... That just totally blew me away.... So Collins is brave and deserves to be honored, but our war veterans aren't?

sorry maybe not good sources, in a angry frenzy I posted the first stuff that I found I thought was relevant, and the pdf I have actually seen the curriculum it is talking about where they were showing actual diagrams on how 2 people , including homosexuals have sex....to kids in elementary school.. this is just a hot button issue with me, because I don't think it is the schools business to teach anything but abstinence and tolerance for all.... I am of the belief of a man and woman are natural and anything else is unnatural and against nature and my religion ...

oh and kstat .. exactly how many times are you gonna edit your posts adding and deleting things you said?

I add stuff to avoid cramming posts together. I do not ever subtract.

Aside from that, 4th and 5th grade are elementary...I recall plenty of diagrams from those classes in sex ed. We all got a good laugh out of them. I can't imagine a gay diagram would have done us any harm besides possibly shortness if breath from uncontrollable laughter.

I'd also add that religious beliefs (and therefore abstinence) have even less business being taught in schools than homosexuality.

Last edited by Kstat; 02-24-2014 at 02:50 AM.

It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

So they should teach it is A-OK to have sex to elementary school children k-6 (and not abstinence, abstinence even less-so than homosexuality)? ??? WOW

Again, the article said the youngest children would be taught not to bully kids that look or act differently. The actual topic of homosexuality wouldn't be addressed until 5th grade, which is absolutely appropriate, considering that's the same age we address heterosexuality.

Sexuality is a reality. Kids develop and need someone to explain to them what's happening to them. Sex ed, as laughably limited as it is, is important. It's also important to explain to the one or two kids in the class that are slowly discovering that they are attracted to the same sex that it isn't something to be ashamed of.

Abstinence, on the other hand, is a belief. A parent may choose to preach that, just like they may preach politics or religion, but schools shouldn't be trying to train students in abstinence. Should they teach the risks and dangers of sex? Absolutely. Sex ed is a platform to inform, not to preach.

Last edited by Kstat; 02-24-2014 at 03:04 AM.

It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

Again, the article said the youngest children would be thought not to bully kids that look or act differently. The actual topic of homosexuality wouldn't be addressed until 5th grade, which is absolutely appropriate, considering that's the same age we address heterosexuality.

Sexuality is a reality. Kids develop and need someone to explain to them what's happening to them. Sex ed, as laughably limited as it is, is important. It's also important to explain to the one or two kids in the class that are slowly discovering that they are attracted to the same sex that it isn't something to be ashamed of.

Abstinence, on the other hand, is a belief. A parent may choose to preach that, just like they may preach politics or religion, but schools shouldn't be trying to train students in abstinence. Should they teach the risks and dangers of sex? Absolutely. Sex ed is a platform to inform, not to preach.

Thing is , it is NOT the federal govt... thus the schools business to teach our kids about the birds and the bees and ESPECIALLY at such a young age . It is the parent's job to do that... Then in 7th grade health class they will learn the biology of procreation and etc.. That is my gripe...

Sexuality is a reality. Kids develop and need someone to explain to them what's happening to them. Sex ed, as laughably limited as it is, is important. It's also important to explain to the one or two kids in the class that are slowly discovering that they are attracted to the same sex that it isn't something to be ashamed of.

Abstinence, on the other hand, is a belief. A parent may choose to preach that, just like they may preach politics or religion, but schools shouldn't be trying to train students in abstinence. Should they teach the risks and dangers of sex? Absolutely. Sex ed is a platform to inform, not to preach.

Disagree, and have had a difficult time not jumping into the fray here... Sex is something that need not be taught in school to young children, and especially if I as a parent do not wish to subject my children through it... It should especally not be tought that homosexuality is ok... Teachers do not say that stealing is ok, nor is murder, so I dont feel that they have a right to teach that any sin is OK... That is my right as a parent...

Abstinence is not just a beliefe, it is no less a practice than taking birth control or using condoms... If you are going to teach a child objectively, then they need to be taught both sides of the story, not the side that simply pushes one agenda over another... It is not up to a parent to "preach" this, rather to help guide them to become the best adults that they can be... If you want to subject your child to that, fine it is your right, and I am not one to take that away... But because you want your child subjected to it does not mean that every other child need be as well...

Disagree, and have had a difficult time not jumping into the fray here... Sex is something that need not be taught in school to young children, and especially if I as a parent do not wish to subject my children through it... It should especally not be tought that homosexuality is ok... Teachers do not say that stealing is ok, nor is murder, so I dont feel that they have a right to teach that any sin is OK... That is my right as a parent...

Abstinence is not just a beliefe, it is no less a practice than taking birth control or using condoms... If you are going to teach a child objectively, then they need to be taught both sides of the story, not the side that simply pushes one agenda over another... It is not up to a parent to "preach" this, rather to help guide them to become the best adults that they can be... If you want to subject your child to that, fine it is your right, and I am not one to take that away... But because you want your child subjected to it does not mean that every other child need be as well...

Okay here... First part.

A lot of gay kids wind up killing themselves before they graduate because no one at any point explained to them that they weren't "broken." It's an epidemic and needs to stop.

Sins are a religious topic. It's your right to teach your kid your religion, but unless you home school, you're not pushing that into public schools, nor should you.

Second part. Abstinence is a belief. Condoms are a tool. There's a difference. Schools should not encourage nor discourage kids during sex ed, they should inform, so that as they get older they can make responsible, informed decisions. By informing a class of the dangers and drawbacks of sex, they are essentially providing the case for abstinence. All that's left out is a religious aspect that has no business in public schools.

Last edited by Kstat; 02-24-2014 at 03:32 AM.

It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

A lot of gay kids wind up killing themselves before they graduate because no one at any point explained to them that they weren't "broken." It's an epicpdemic and needs to stop.

Sins are a religious topic. It's your right to teach your kid your religion, but unless you home school, you're not pushing that into public schools, nor should you.

Second part. Abstinence is a belief. Condoms are a tool. There's a difference. Schools should not encourage nor discourage kids during sex ed, they should inform, so that as they get older they can make responsible, informed decisions.

A. Do you have stats to back these up, where these kids are aware enough to truely be gay?? I would wager that this "a lot of" statistic that you speak of simply cannot be proven/disproven and is mostly speculation.

B. Sin is taught in schools, but it is not called sin... My son, who is in the second grade has been dealing with an issue where he is stealing from his classmates... The school does not appreciate that saying that it is "not nice"... Same with lying, same with cheating, same with killing and even pretend killing... I dont mind this being taught, but I will concede your point, because I know there are parents out there who dont want their child subjected to this for some bizarro reason...

C. Abstinance is most certainly a practice... There are many non-religious individuals who are not sexually active, nor are they sexually attractive to either sex... Not certain what the name or cause of these types of disorders are, but if we are going to be all inclusive as we are, should we not include saying that abstinance is ok, so these kids dont commit suicide?? Further, if they are educating them and NOT discussing abstinance, then they are encouraging them simply by providing one path if you will, encouragement... And you just mentined that we should not do either...

A. Do you have stats to back these up, where these kids are aware enough to truely be gay?? I would wager that this "a lot of" statistic that you speak of simply cannot be proven/disproven and is mostly speculation.

B. Sin is taught in schools, but it is not called sin... My son, who is in the second grade has been dealing with an issue where he is stealing from his classmates... The school does not appreciate that saying that it is "not nice"... Same with lying, same with cheating, same with killing and even pretend killing... I dont mind this being taught, but I will concede your point, because I know there are parents out there who dont want their child subjected to this for some bizarro reason...

C. Abstinance is most certainly a practice... There are many non-religious individuals who are not sexually active, nor are they sexually attractive to either sex... Not certain what the name or cause of these types of disorders are, but if we are going to be all inclusive as we are, should we not include saying that abstinance is ok, so these kids dont commit suicide?? Further, if they are educating them and NOT discussing abstinance, then they are encouraging them simply by providing one path if you will, encouragement... And you just mentined that we should not do either...

A. My best friend growing up was gay. He wasn't driven quite that far, but I know for a fact he was tormented by it. The biggest regret in my life is that I didn't see it sooner.

U.S. government study, titled Report of the Secretary's Task Force on Youth Suicide, published in 1989, found that LGBT youth are four times more likely to attempt suicide than other young people.

Apparently the number has gone up since 1989:

NEW YORK, April 29, 2011 (LifeSiteNews.com) - Teens who self-identify as homosexual are five times more likely than their heterosexual counterparts to attempt suicide, according to a study released last week.

B. They're discouraged because they are against the law. Homosexuality is not, thankfully.

C. Addressed in my earlier edit. By informing students of the risks of sex, you're essentially giving that platform for abstinence without the religion.

Last edited by Kstat; 02-24-2014 at 03:57 AM.

It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

B. They're discouraged because they are against the law. Homosexuality is not, thankfully.

C. Addressed in my earlier edit. By informing students of the risks of sex, you're essentially giving that platform for abstinence without the religion.

A. Again, those are estimations, not proven with numbers... I will concede that the suicide rate is more than likely higher for gay kids, but it is also higher in broken family homes... The point being I would bet there are other issues that lead to suicide that may or may not be in conjuction with confusion on sexuality...

B. Fair, but they were made illegal because they were sin... Without injecting my religious views, I will simply say I disagree...

C. You dont have to teach abstinance with a religious theme... You simply tell them it is ok to abstain, and there is nothing wrong with that as well... Just because you teach the children about STDs and late night trips to Taco Bell, does not give them a platform for abstinance... Unless you tell the kids that abstinance is an option, and valid practice, then you are not presenting both sides to the argument, and therefore are swaying the kids one way...

I have actually seen the curriculum it is talking about where they were showing actual diagrams on how 2 people , including homosexuals have sex....to kids in elementary school.

Maybe it is due to poor wording on your part....but is the point that you have here that you have obvious concerns about teaching Sex education of any sort ( whether it be about Homo or Hetero-sexuality ) to kids in Elementary School?

I assume that you'd be equally offended if the curriculum had included actual diagrams of 2 people of the opposite ( as opposed to the same ) sex having sex.

The reason I say this is that suggesting that being against the inclusion of ANY type of Sex Ed ( whether it be in regards to homosexual or heterosexual sex ed ) to Elementary school kids is different than simply suggesting that there should be NO education about homosexuality at all ( due to personal belief ).

and Cablekc , yes I was being sarcastic.. only because here we have a sitting president who doesn't honor our war veterans at Arlington, totally snubs his nose at every tradition that has been a yearly staple at the White House... yet on the news you see a picture of Michelle Obama with Jason Collins with a quote from her how she is honoring him that day at the White House, and she is soooo proud of him for being so "brave" as she put it for coming out ... That just totally blew me away.... So Collins is brave and deserves to be honored, but our war veterans aren't?

I'm not going to delve into the majority of your post here...as most of what you have suggested is skewed more towards talking points from Faux News.

The only part that I would comment on is that I do think that Collins coming out is "Brave". Brave...not in the poor worded analogy that you give.....but "Brave" in the sense that doing so in such a public manner isn't easy for any Homosexual nor something that should be considered trivial by any means.

To be fair...ignoring what he did entirely....would Teams have likely considered signing him at this stage in his career even if he didn't come out? Probably not....as he is a borderline "End of the Bench" at this point in his career that can serve as a Healthy Big Man that can defend the paint Type of Role Player on any Team. But I am fairly confident that some Teams will now ( although I think that they shouldn't ) take this into consideration ( how it will be handled from a PR perspective, could it affect the Locker room? etc. ) when it comes to signing him or not to a contract. He didn't have to add that consideration to his "resume".....but he chose to....maybe to get publicity as much as to bring greater awareness of homosexuality in Professional sports. But whatever the reason, I ( and Michelle Obama ) do applaud him for doing this.

Second part. Abstinence is a belief. Condoms are a tool. There's a difference. Schools should not encourage nor discourage kids during sex ed, they should inform, so that as they get older they can make responsible, informed decisions. By informing a class of the dangers and drawbacks of sex, they are essentially providing the case for abstinence. All that's left out is a religious aspect that has no business in public schools.

I agree with nearly everything but I think you are discarding abstinence because of abstinence-ONLY "education".

I do NOT believe in "abstinence-ONLY" sexual education. However, I DO believe that we fail if we don't at least let kids know that abstinence is the only form of birth control that is 100% effective. EVERY OTHER TOOL has failure rates, and when they are old enough to assess those risks they should already know about them.

Failing to talk openly about abstinence is as much of a disservice to pre-teens as failing to talk openly about any other form of birth control.

BillS

A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
Or throw in a first-round pick and flip it for a max-level point guard...

I agree with nearly everything but I think you are discarding abstinence because of abstinence-ONLY "education".

I do NOT believe in "abstinence-ONLY" sexual education. However, I DO believe that we fail if we don't at least let kids know that abstinence is the only form of birth control that is 100% effective. EVERY OTHER TOOL has failure rates, and when they are old enough to assess those risks they should already know about them.

Failing to talk openly about abstinence is as much of a disservice to pre-teens as failing to talk openly about any other form of birth control.

You really think kids need to be told that the only sure-fire way to avoid the complications and consequences of sex is to not have sex?

I mean, there's no harm in that, but really?

It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

no I am NOT afraid of gays lmao.. I don't even dislike them...matter of fact I have a family member who is ... but I DO dislike their behavior.. and yes I find their sexual behavior "SICKENING AND ABHORRENT" .......... BEHAVIOR..... stop putting words in my mouth, I said BEHAVIOR... you don't like it lump it ...... since it seems I have to "lump it" by hearing all this praise for all these brave souls who come out the closet ...

And yes, when our kids are being taught in ELEMENTARY SCHOOL , for instance, how 2 guys butt humping each other is a perfectly A-OK and it is A-OK for them to "experiment" .. YEA SICKENING AND ABHORRENT BEHAVIOR..... Have you seen the stuff they are teaching kids as early as 1st and 2nd grade in some of these schools? Sorry , but tolerance AND ABSTINENCE should be taught ............NOT a how-to guide in indoctrinating young children in the ways of homosexuality...