Originally Posted by bkrueger
So you mean McDonald's sells the best food and the Yellow Press produces the best newspapers? Quality is no majority decision.

Sure it is. If McDonald's is the best quality food for the money available then why wouldn't that cause the majority to eat it? (Can't imagine where that would be the case though.. France maybe )

But even if it weren't, what gives you the right so say your minority opinion is more important than someone else's minority opinion? Or as you say, if the majority of RPGWatch members might think a certain way - why do you mention majority if quality is no majority decision?

It sounds like there's some assessment of validity of opinion going on, which in the end either comes down to snobbery or dick-sizing in an unqualified environment like an internet forum.

Originally Posted by bkrueger
But this still doesn't imply that the taste of the majority is interested in quality.

I agree. And besides, McDonalds burgers don't taste that bad, really.

I once eat them within 5 years or so, because this simply isn't my kind of food,
but *when* (like i was recently invited to), then I must really admit that it tastes good. No matter what.

And yes, they have introduced these "vegetable burgers" again, which I must really try out !
They had them in thir "program" a long time ago, but put them out because - as they said - no-one was interested in them.

— “ Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius – and a lot of courage – to move in the opposite direction.“ (E.F.Schumacher, Economist, Source)

Mass Effect was really good in it's presentation and storywise as an interactive movie.

Gameplay sucked poo.

— Mankind must put an end to war or war will put an end to mankind. - John F Kennedy
An eye for an eye, and soon the whole world is blind. - Mahatma Gandhi
The world is my country. To do good is my religion. My mind is my own church. This simple creed is all we need to enjoy peace on earth. - Thomas Paine

Originally Posted by kalniel
But even if it weren't, what gives you the right so say your minority opinion is more important than someone else's minority opinion? Or as you say, if the majority of RPGWatch members might think a certain way - why do you mention majority if quality is no majority decision?

Because your starting post might sound to a new poster as if your post was expressing the opinion of the RPGWatch crowd. So I wanted to express that this is not the case.

By the way I do not believe that my specific minority opinion about quality is more relevant than anybody else's. But it is still not a majority decision. Like for books, movies, or paintings it isn't a majority decision, which of them are good. It's a question of aesthetics. Whether there is an absolute or at least objective measure for that is again a matter of someone's philosophical beliefs, so we will not solve this question here.

But to come back to topic: Completeley subjectively I do not want Bioware to develop their future games in the Mass Effect 2 direction.

The bottom line is that sales do represent a good product to a degree, regardless whether or not everyone agrees that it's a good product. Something that is total garbage is not going to sell for a significant amount of time.

Originally Posted by Gorath
This is debatable. For lack of alternative it may sell for a long time. And it may sell a lot for a short time. Example for both: Windows Vista..

I don't think Windows Vista qualifies as being total garbage. But you are correct about the "lack of alternative" situation, that is really the only time a truly bad product is going to see significant sales.

Originally Posted by JDR13
Something that is total garbage is not going to sell for a significant amount of time.

"A significant amount of time" is right, but Moorhuhn shows you that it is actually possible to get a lot of cash in with a really simple game. Or even the infamous German game called "Pulleralarm", of which every sane German should be imho eternally ashamed of.

At the GamesCom the company responsible for a "game" called "Farming Simulator" claimed that it surpassed - in sales - even wow.

And they might even be right, especiall when you look at he success of Farmville.

Edit : Not to mention that no "real gamer" takes this "Farming Simulation" seriously.

— “ Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius – and a lot of courage – to move in the opposite direction.“ (E.F.Schumacher, Economist, Source)