Yes – they’re so cunning with their… Fuck Church = “Fuck the Talmud Racism.” In gay we trust = ‘Free Palestine” and “Fuck Zionism and Israel” in two cases respectively. So – they’re not as pure as the driven snow, as one is led to believe.

Many islamists operate by expropriating western symbols and icons, not to mention the vocabulary, of democracy, progressivism and women’s rights and then harness them to a programe whose principle aims are the destruction of democracy, progressivism and women’s rights.

But when memebrs of Femem wear hijabs, all the while exposing their breasts in an effort to denounce islamist patriarchy and to express support for Amina, this whole tactic gets stood on its head. The hijab is THE passive/aggressive symbol par excellence of islam’s slow advance, and so its exproriation by Femem and their use of it to denounce islamist patriarchy puts a major wrench into that whole “front”. The juxtaposition of bare breasts with an item of clothing considered the very epitome of female muslim modesty is extremely subversive.

Well, photoshop or not, I can agree with the sentiment in the middle “Free Palestine.” Of course that whole situation will be a big ol’ canna worms til the world at large realizes that the Ersatz Israel is as much a sinner as the saint some believe it is.

Well, photoshop or not, I can agree with the sentiment in the middle “Free Palestine.” Of course that whole situation will be a big ol’ canna worms til the world at large realizes that the Ersatz Israel is as much a sinner as the saint some believe it i

While you are absolutely right, it would be a mistake to ignore the fanatics on the Palestinian side, as well. Yes, in the case of the Middle Eastern crisis, I’m a “both-sidser”. There are those on the Palestinian side that utterly reject any resolution or solution that includes the existence of Israel at any level (see: Hamas).

Also, the cultural tide is turning in Israel. The citizens (yes, that means even those in the IDF, since most of Israel’s citizens have to be in the IDF) are more and more turning against the Gaza Blockade and the illegal settlements. They are still outnumbered by the fanatics, but the fanatics are shrinking rapidly. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a major shift in Israeli politics at the next election. We saw the start of it at the last election.

Julian, honest question: Are you more interested in getting people to see the problematic side of a particular organization, or in playing “gotcha” with asshole rhetorical moves? I think I know the answer.

I didn’t know about the behavior you’re talking about with Femen. I wouldn’t assume Ophelia knows about it, either. Further, I wouldn’t assume that, even if she or other commenters did, that they’re the type of people who’d say that was just fine. In fact—and I think you know this, too, which is what makes your snotty statement so infuriating—given the political sympathies of our blogger and most of the commenters I’d expect them to say “fuck that.”

You lose the plot a lot, and I don’t know why. You’re one of the most erratic people I encounter online. It is literally impossible to predict when you’re going to do a 180 and turn viciously on people for no discernible reason.

Why assume that Muslim Women Against Femen did the photoshopping? It seems just as possible that they were just overly credulous about something they saw in a viral facebook post or an email or something–it seems to be a symptom of religious fundamentalists that they tend to trust anything they see from someone who’s “on their side”, and are thus particularly susceptible to urban legends, scams etc (of course all people tend to be susceptible to this kind of stuff, but it seems like fundamentalists are especially so). In the case of this image, it’s been around for a while, did a little searching and found it in this blog post from a french anti-semitic cartoonist (found it linked along with some of his cartoons in this blog), in post from November 26 2012. The screenshot of Muslim Women Against Femen isn’t dated, but I would imagine it’s more recent?

If Muslim Women Against Femen were just being credulous, the offense seems more forgivable, and it’s easier to grant that however wrongheaded they may be about protesting Femen, at least they weren’t endorsing anti-semitism but sincerely condemning the supposed insults towards the Talmud (obviously if they had faked the photo themselves, or posted it knowing it was a fake, that would imply they were only pretending to condemn it).

Heh… yeah. Honestly, I usually hate “both-sidsers”, but in the case of the Middle East, I really think it’s the only legitimate position to be in.

Although, I think my position can be more identified as anti-religion, since I am beyond convinced that religion is the problem in the Middle East, and without it we wouldn’t have the powder keg we have over there right now.

[…] I *do* have a problem with MuslimahPride and I will be honest about that. I have a problem not because I am “bigoted” against Muslims or “Islamophobic” (which is something the Western left would *love* to claim) but because they are claiming that somehow brown women can’t want the same freedoms that white women have, claiming that being able to do with your body what you want is a “western thing”. Claiming all those things that have been said a thousand times before – claiming honour, claiming virtue, claiming chastity, claiming modesty – claiming the things that killed me and killed a million women and will continue to kill women. They were even caught making a fake picture to make their cause grow: http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterfliesandwheels/2013/04/down-in-the-muck/ […]