Fighting the patriarchy one grandpa at a time

A grown man looms behind my three-year-old daughter. Occasionally he will poke or tickle her and she responds by shrinking. Smaller and smaller with each unwanted advance. I imagine her trying to become slight enough to slip out of her booster seat and slide under the table.

When my mother views this scene, she sees playful taunting. A grandfather engaging with his granddaughter.

“Mae.” My tone cuts through the din of a familiar family gathering together. She does not look at me.

“Mae.” I start again. “You can tell him no Mae. If this isn’t okay you could say something like, Papa, please back up—I would like some space for my body.”

As I say the words, my step-father, the bulldog, leans in a little closer, hovering just above her head. His tenebrous grin taunts me as my daughter accordions her 30-pound frame hoping to escape his tickles and hot breath.

I repeat myself with a little more force. She finally peeks up at me.

“Mama…can you say it?” Surprise. A three-year-old-girl doesn’t feel comfortable defending herself against a grown man. A man that has stated he loves and cares for her over and over again, and yet, stands here showing zero concern for her wishes about her own body. I ready myself for battle.

“Papa! Please back up! Mae would like some space for her body.” My voice is firm but cheerful. He does not move.

“Papa. I should not have to ask you twice. Please back up. Mae is uncomfortable.”

“Oh, relax,” he says, ruffling her wispy blonde hair. The patriarchy stands, patronizing me in my own damn kitchen. “We’re just playin’.” His southern drawl does not charm me.

“No. You were playing. She was not. She’s made it clear that she would like some space, now please back up.”

“I can play how I want with her.” He says, straightening his posture. My chest tightens. The sun-bleached hairs on my arms stand at attention as this man, who has been my father figure for more than three decades, enters the battle ring.

“No. No, you cannot play however you want with her. It’s not okay to ‘have fun’ with someone who does not want to play.” He opens his mouth to respond but my rage is palpable through my measured response. I wonder if my daughter can feel it. I hope she can.

He retreats to the living room and my daughter stares up at me. Her eyes, a starburst of blue and hazel, shine with admiration for her mama. The dragon has been slayed (for now). My own mother is silent. She refuses to make eye contact with me.

This is the same woman who shut me down when I told her about a sexual assault I had recently come to acknowledge. This is the same woman who was abducted by a carful of strangers as she walked home one night. She fought and screamed until they kicked her out. Speeding away, they ran over her ankle and left her with a lifetime of physical and emotional pain. This is the same woman who said nothing, who could say nothing as her boss and his friends sexually harassed her for years. This is the same woman who married one of those friends.

When my mother views this scene, she sees her daughter overreacting. She sees me “making a big deal out of nothing.” Her concerns lie more in maintaining the status quo and cradling my step-dad’s toxic ego than in protecting the shrinking three-year-old in front of her.

When I view this scene, I am both bolstered and dismayed. My own strength and refusal to keep quiet is the result of hundreds, probably thousands of years of women being mistreated, and their protests ignored. It is the result of watching my own mother suffer quietly at the hands of too many men. It is the result of my own mistreatment and my solemn vow to be part of ending this cycle.

It would be so easy to see a little girl being taught that her wishes don’t matter. That her body is not her own. That even people she loves will mistreat and ignore her. And that all of this is “okay” in the name of other people, men, having fun.

But. What I see instead is a little girl watching her mama. I see a little girl learning that her voice matters. That her wishes matter. I see a little girl learning that she is allowed and expected to say no. I see her learning that this is not okay.

And I hope my mom is learning something, too.

Lisa Norgren is a writer and yoga teacher, raising two outspoken young women in Ann Arbor with her husband and three cats. She enjoys knitting, baking sourdough bread, and smashing the patriarchy one right action at a time.

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Love this! Sometimes I feel like I’m the only one “making a big deal”. I have a one year old son who has never been left alone with my parents because they are TOO baby crazy to see that a cute baby also has rights to his own space. They are overwhelmingly smoochy and clingy on him. They will do anything to get him to laugh. It just feels so selfish to me.

Such truths. My own father “playfully” still swats at my behind. He does the same to all of my children — 23- and 20-year-old daughters and 17- and 14-year-old sons. And we’re not the only ones. Other family members endure it as well. He’s been told, he’s been the recipient of icy stares, felt the stiffening and dodging bodies, you name it, but he doesn’t get it. It’s the old school mentality to not only act this way, but not to see or acknowledge it as inappropriate. It’s not OVERreacting, but REACTING to what one finds uncomfortable and offensive. Thank you for putting this out there.

Thank you for this article and elucidating just what a challange this kind of situation can be. I have found advocating for myself and my children with my parents very challenging…I was trained to concede to others/their wishes. I have already read this article a number of times and will archive it to read before I enter future situations

As someone who was forced to give her grandpa kisses (he was never satisfied with just a peck on the cheek), I know this story too well and share often when I teach child sexual abuse prevention. The actions in this blog might sound small/petty to some and yet they are the very foundation for how and why children are abused or not. Children need to know from the time they are born, to their very core, that they are in charge of their bodies, they will carry this confidence (or lack of, if not taught) into adulthood. However, the onus is always on the adults to protect them and empower them.

We can teach our kids all the safety measures but it is the boundaries we set and reinforce with our own friends, families, teachers, neighbors, coaches, and clergy that last a lifetime. More than 90% of the time, children and adults are abused, raped, murdered, by someone they know, trust, and possibly love.

Equality for all is the answer to ending abuse. Speaking up for those who are marginalized (including children) is the path. Until adults care more about protecting children than offending adults and until businesses (schools/churches/sports) care more about the children that are their customers, than profiting off of them, abuse will continue.

Brava, mama, for reinforcing your child’s right to feel safe and comfortable in her own skin.

As a grandpa, who would never abuse my grandkids. I see now that my actions could set them up for future abuse. (A conditioned response.) My son and I had several conversations around this. I got it to some degree, but i think i can fully embrace it now. Previously i would sneak up and tickle but as soon as they said stop, i would. Now, I think it has taken on a new light.
Dan

I think it’s good to bear in mind that it can be difficult to be objective when reading a post such as this. I understand what’s being said, but I also realize that not everyone has had the same experiences as the author. My family had a very different dynamic. My father and grandfather were gentle, respectful men that I could feel safe with. The women were domineering, manipulative and emotionally abusive. Incurring their wrath was to be avoided at all costs which included keeping your mouth shut and staying out of the way. If we lived in a matriarchal society, I hope I would understand that my experience wasn’t everyone’s experience. When people have no respect for others I’m not sure it matters whether they are men or women.

After some thought, I’d like to clarify-the women in my family were often as I described above, but not always. I know that they suffered from mental illness that caused much of their behavior. When I was growing up, it wasn’t something that was talked about and getting any kind of professional help would have been out of the question. My feelings about my childhood are something that I am still working through. The main point that I really wanted to make was the last sentence.

seems pretty simple to me, aside from warranted situations (arresting someone, pushing someone out of the way of a train/car,self defense) you don’t have the right to touch ANYONE (of any age) who doesn’t want it, period, not even your spouse if they say to keep your hands off them, you keep your hands off them. And you don’t tell them to give someone a kiss/hug either.

I’m hoping that this comes across as the encouragement that I feel towards you and everyone who is fighting the good fight. I am a white, CIS, male in my early 50’s. I have two adult daughters and many female friends, several of whom are younger and a few with young children. I am blessed to have these children in my life. They are lively, fun, creative, playful, funny, and eager to experience the world around them. As their uncle in some cases, grandpa-Max in others, and yet just Max in the rest, I get the privilege of filling a special place in their lives. With this comes the responsibility of helping them learn to take care of themselves and supporting their parents in raising self-assured, confident, strong children. Gender doesn’t come into this at all. All children deserve this respect and support.

My 4 year “grand-daughter” (a child of my friend, not of my daughter) asks to come visit. She asks for sleepovers (we’ve had one so far), yet when they do come over, she is shy and clings to her mother until she gets comfortable. When we see this behavior, we tell her that it is okay and that she is allowed to determine when, and if, she is ready to interact. When I go to be playful, if she shrinks away, I move back and tell her to let me know if she wants to play later. I have echoed her mom’s words and told her that her body is her own and if she doesn’t like anything that I am doing that she should tell me but that I will also try to notice her emotions and stop even if she doesn’t speak up. We also encourage her to back up physical reactions with words. While I know that good touch is important to most people, I also realize that good touch loses that moniker if it is pushed on someone, of any age!

My entire point to all of this is that there are older, white, CIS men who do get it. 20 years ago I did not understand things to this level. I do now. My friends, my daughters, and people like you who write articles to explain these things have taught me. We all can learn, especially when we make it about the other person and not about ourselves. Please keep up your hope and keep offering the education that is so badly needed! Go you! 🙂

To Mr. Kitchens, “This paragraph outlines the lenses this young mother views the situation.” When you try to think of why someone would do or say something without knowing them very well indeed, you are looking through the filter of your own motivations, fears and prejudices and ascribing them to that person.

As the single father of three sons I can tell you that I raised them to understand that everyone has the rights to their emotions and that no means no.When playing with them if they said “no” I stopped, if they said “stop” I stopped. If they said “why did you stop?”, I said “Because you said to.”. They grew up understanding that concept. As they grew older and started dating and their partners spent time around our family I would be bothered by the fact that these young women were uncomfortable stating what they felt on things as simple as “Is there anything you would like to have at the house to snack on while you are there?”. To me it seemed a reasonable question while in a grocery store. Over time I tried to convince them that everyone has the right to say if they like or dislike something, want something or Need something. Everyone has a right to be listened to and that what they say matters. My children were taught this before they could speak and I believe all children should be. BUT, while it is reasonable to expect people her were not taught this their whole lives to be capable of learning this do not expect it to happen instantly. Also do not expect them to be happy when you try to teach them that what they have been raised to believe is “normal and fine” is not. You are to them attacking what are simple innocent fundamentals of life that they were raised to believe.
To men who cannot see that these things are an issue, you need to develop a more mature way of looking at the world.
To “Professionals” who have worked with people who are victims of all types of abuse and see her attitudes as an over reaction, I hope that you have found another profession.
Lisa Norgren, it was never stated that your husband was in the room but I hope he backed you up. I also understand where it was your family member’s behavior that you were the more appropriate person to speak out.

Thank you, this is so important. I am trying to teach my little son the importance of consent too as it’s not just the little girls that need to understand this! I.e. I never call him irresistible, we don’t push his limits when tickling him, and he understands our boundaries too. If all the parents of sons did this maybe the little girls wouldn’t have so much need to learn to stand up for themselves…

Great article, but the clearly stated age discrimination needs to be scrapped. It’s not ‘grandpa’ who oversteps personal boundaries, it’s people of all genders and ages. To make my point clear Motherwell Mag should exchange ‘granpa’ for ‘black’, Let’s see how well That goes down.

As I told one alleged abuser recently, “I won’t treat you as guilty on the basis of an unprovable accusation by a lady I know and trust. But most assuredly I will take every precaution to protect other children. So on the basis that you might be guilty, I am informing you that you are unwelcome on our campus and are forbidden to visit.”

What bugs me the most about this is that all children get this kind of unwanted attention. Not just girls. Grandpa isnt a “monster,” just someone who needs to mind his own space and get a clue. It’s not that deep.

I read this… and re-read it …. and re-read it. EVERY single time: I cry, I smile, I hope. Would that anyone would have said to me, somewhere along the line, that I can and should say, ” please back up—I would like some space for my body.” In the power of your words now, to your daughter now, I feel the world shift, I feel MY world shift for good, for power. To name, to own, to invite others to see and name the grooming, the invasion in the small moments, the gradual invasion and breaking down of boundaries — WOW. Just wow. I find the power now as a grown woman to say, ” please back up—I would like some space for my body.” You invite me to care for myself AND to share this invitation along the way. You open the door to allowing what FEELS wrong to actually be acknowledged and engaged. Thank you for empowering a new generation. Thank you for empowering a present generation. Thank you for inviting healing and strength along the way and back into the vaults of memory
. I carry your words. Thank you.

This is a problematic view, because it also teaches to be afraid of all touch and that if someone wants to tickle you or hug you it must be a negative thing. Children also need to experience things to know what they like or dont like, so if a parent shuts down all contact the child will never know. I for one know when i was a kid and having bad days or i was sad, if a parent came up and tickled me or booped my nose my first response as a child was im sad and mad go away, but if they did it more than once it actually made me feel better and i would start to giggle and laugh. By ruling out interaction from life and learning, your hurting children as well.

Nope. You’re belittling the child’s emotions and mom’s defense of her child. The child has already decided she doesn’t like the contact, she’s already expressed she doesn’t like it (there’s no possible positive spin to reason why the child would shrink away from his contact. She did not want it. Period). She doesn’t have to tolerate it or get used to it. That’s called grooming and is also wrong.

The child didn’t dare to speak up to the grown up doing this to her, so mom did as she was supposed to and spoke up for her child.

Lulu, I disagree. This is not teaching a fear of being touched. This child is clearly and repeatedly saying, please don’t do that. This is not in the same context as being angry or sad and not wanting to be touched. This is a child who is seeking to be engaged, but not violated in the engaging. Not. The. Same. Not even close. This is LISTENING to what the child longs to say, but because of the power differential does not dare say. And then, SAYING HER TRUTH, not in fear, not in defiance, but IN LOVE. There is only room for true engagement, true love shared, when the otherness of each is invited and respected in the relationship. This is the antidote to fear. It is bold, brave, beautiful love.

She clearly described the body language of her daughter, who was clearly uncomfortable, and rather than stepping in, gave her daughter permission to set a boundary. When her daughter didn’t respond, she repeated herself. She did not step in on behalf of her child until the child asked her to do so. So I’m not sure what about this is problematic, or “shutting down” something harmless, especially when her daughter clearly was uncomfortable. Experts in the field agree that it is better to teach children that they are allowed to have boundaries and to tell other adults to respect those boundaries, because it gives them more autonomy, teaches them about consent, and makes it harder for sexual predators to abuse them and convince them to keep it a secret. This is A+ parenting, and you should probably take several seats before telling a mother, who is following advice backed by many experts in child development, that she is doing something wrong.

A person’s a person, no matter how small. – Dr. Seuss. It’s so good to empower children to have a voice and to be taught at at young age that no means no. Our culture needs to start to view children as whole persons and start respecting their voices and rights.

As someone who has seen this from both sides, this story is problematic. My grandfather molested me, over and over again from the time I was 5 until I was 7. So I see it from that point. I also see that all grandfathers are being painted with one big brush. Kids get tickled, they run giggle and hide then do it all over again. If a mother who has been through a trauma reads every shrek, every giggle as something like this and looks for something to see that isn’t there she is causing a lot of harm and risking the bond between a grandfather and his granddaughter. This is a fine line to walk. One that can ultimately ruin two lives if it is based only on the mothers fears and not reality. My grandfather was a predator, my children had two different grandfathers, one was a drunk who could have cared less and one was a gruff, hard, stern man with little sense of humor, until it came to my children. He did the best he could do to turn into a secret marshmallow. The kids loved him and he did tickle and stomp his feet and grab and hug and hide things just for them in the same places over and over again for them to find and then pretend he was surprised they found goody. It was silly and goofy and sweet and a side he wouldn’t have shown to the world for nothing.. The kids loved him dearly until he died. He was almost 7 foot tall and a monster of a man in build but he turned into a big ball of fluff with them. He was my step father and a man I couldn’t stand personally. He was cold and hard and seemed uncaring to just about everyone, but he loved my kids and I respected him for that. If I had let my feelings for this man (or any grandfather) come into play, I would have deprived my children of a fantastic grandfather who just didn’t know how to be a nice person to just about anyone else. To this day my children (in their 40s) just don’t understand why people felt about him the way they do. They never saw the side of him the rest of the world did. He also never did to them what my grandfather did to me.

Grandfathers are not being painted with a brush. Grandfathers who disregard the feelings and space of their grandchildren are being called out as such. If a grandfather doesn’t fall into that category, this article isn’t about him.

This article is also not painting tickling and play as bad. If a child does not want to play, or is made to feel uncomfortable or put in discomfort, they should not be forced to participate. It’s that simple. If they are laughing and shrieking and otherwise having a great time, those experiences should be encouraged. While the author wasn’t completely explicit, we can infer the description of her daughter “shrinking” was not done so with laughter and joy. She could tell her daughter was not ok, which is why she encouraged her to say no.

Let’s keep brushes with easels. Citing stories where the antagonist comfortably lives in their archetype does not paint all members of that group as such. I am a white male. I am also a feminist and rights advocate. Does that mean that every article about white privilege and patriarchy are about me? Of course not. Should I get offended when said articles don’t leave room in their verbage for white males to not belong in their admonishments? Again, of course not. They’re not about me. Getting offended misses the entire point and trivializes the message.

Maybe you should read this again. The child was shrinking away from his tickling. She certainly was NOT shrieking playfully. She was not enjoying herself. She has EVERY right to say no, I don’t like that, don’t touch me, don’t tickle me. She does NOT have to tolerate it. Not once. Not ever.

Teaching a child that its okay to set boundaries and say no actually protects them from being abused, so please don’t tell other people not to over react to this violation of boundaries because it wasn’t as severe as what you experienced. The child in this story was clearly uncomfortable, and he ignored the child’s mother telling him to give her space, and the writer alluded to her mother being a victim of harassment by her future husband, which was unclear if this was the same husband, but does raise some flags.

I have always encouraged my children to respect boundaries, only hug people they want to, shake hands if they don’t. But the extended family has always forced hugs from my nephews and it makes me so angry. I’m proud that you were able to stand up for your child and set the tone.

Don’t know where you’ve been all your life. I guess being abused by your family. This was unacceptable 40 years ago in MY world. The clown NEVER would have even TRIED debating it with me. And I would have stopped the nonsense the moment he “tickled” her the first 10 seconds. Why do you even expose her to these morons? Your own mother included.

This really resonates with me. Thank you for sharing it.
I was sexually assaulted and abused by my step-grandfather for many years.
How I wish I’d had an adult both perceptive, concerned and brave enough to speak up for me then the way your daughter does now. I work hard every day to be for my own child the kind of advocate and teacher I would have benefited from so greatly as a child.
Let us all strive to do better, and to speak out on behalf of any person of any age who is being disrespected; one whose agency is being ignored and slowly eroded by another person or group of persons.

I am a granddad with two beautiful granddaughters who I love and believe will grow up to be the incredible women God made them to be.
I am sad at this lack of sensitivity shown by the grandad but also by the linking of this one instance with patriarchy so that all granddads are pictured in this threatening, demeaning way.
This article does raise thoughtfulness but please do not destroy or taint relationships that can and should be wonderfully wholesome between granddads and their granddaughters.

“This is the same woman who shut me down when I told her about a sexual assault I had recently come to acknowledge. This is the same woman who was abducted by a carful of strangers as she walked home one night. She fought and screamed until they kicked her out. Speeding away, they ran over her ankle and left her with a lifetime of physical and emotional pain. This is the same woman who said nothing, who could say nothing as her boss and his friends sexually harassed her for years. This is the same woman who married one of those friends.”

End quote

I’m not surprised to see the length of this conversation. I’m not surprised to see the overwhelming support for this mother seeking to defend her child. What surprises me is contained in the authors quote above. This is a woman who had been sexually assaulted and had complained about it. Her own mother failed to come to her aid. She witnessed her own mother being sexually harassed by her boss and his friends. This mother then marries one of these friends. This paragraph outlines the lenses this young mother views the situation. This child has a Father and she doesn’t explain what his reaction is to it. If leaves three question, “why not?” It beggars the question whether or not she trusts any male view on the situation. She leaves a wide gap on what the role of the father of this child has in her life.What is the relationship like with the child’s father? In light of these concerns, it is understandable that she might have some serious problems in identifying what a good man is.

as someone who has worked with people recovering from all types of abuses, the warning signs are quite clear.

So, you realize that sexual abuse, sexual assault and sexual harassment are experienced by a large percentage of the female population, right? It’s not unusual for most of us. This is why we are angry. This is why we are teaching our children about good touch, bad touch, wanted touch, unwanted touch and giving them the framework to claim their space, their bodies and their rights.

Same here! My mom and mom in law are the worst about it. They will tickle him in front of other friends and family to prove that he likes grandma…. no, he’s laughing because you are digging your fingers in his ribs and it’s awkward

It is good for a mother and her kids to assert themselves. I self-published a children’s book on Amazon to teach it’s okay for kids to say NO. I raised my own daughters to be strong. Titled “Not the best grandpa”. Very humorous in which grandpa and kids have a battle of wills

Thank you for writing this! Someone shared this on Facebook and I was afraid to open the link. I felt like I knew what your post would say even though I’ve never been to your site. I hope to be this strong for my daughter as well.

Thank you so much for this article! Our daughters need us to be strong for them and help change very old patterns that unfortunately most people believe is normal. I admire the way you are bringing up your daughter.