Illegal Immigration

Illegal immigrants are a convenient scapegoat for our economic crisis. But with free markets and private property, the need for immigrant labor becomes obvious. Most immigrants, regardless of the color of their skin, are open to the ideals of liberty: private property, free markets, sound money, right to life, low taxes, less war, protection of civil liberties, and a foreign policy designed for peace.

Ron Paul proposed the following action steps for dealing with illegal immigration:

Abolish the welfare state. The incentive to take a job at whatever wage available must prevail.

Establish a generous visitor work program. Once we solve the economic crisis by introducing sound money, demand for domestic and immigrant labor will rise.

Enforce the laws on the books with more border guards. Allow states and landowners to enforce the law and provide security assistance.

Abolish birthright citizenship for children of illegal immigrants.[Current U.S. citizens will not be affected. Instead, babies born to illegals after a future cutoff date will no longer gain automatic U.S. citizenship. They will still have citizenship in their parents’ home countries.]

End all federal mandates on the states to provide free education and medical care for illegal immigrants.

(If you’ve found a spelling or transcription error, please notify us anonymously by selecting the misspelled text and then pressing Ctrl+Enter. Thank you!)

12 million people couldn’t have crossed the border without being seen all along. If so, then we really need a complete overhaul of all agencies. I mean, what happened to our spy satellites and to our other capabilities? If we can target rebels in Afghanistan from way over here and destroy them with drones, then why in the hell can’t we see what is happening under our noses? One reason, the cheap labor was allowed to cross to work for US, plain and simple. It is no secret or surprise. If you feel shafted, then you all need to speak to those in charge for some real answers, and stop taking it out on the poor people who just want a better life.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

Who said they haven’t been seen? The border is 2000 miles long, this is the reason for this discussion, to find a way to better protect this 2000 mile long junction where people are crossing illegally. Are you suggesting that we use superior technology to find and destroy them? And Ron Paul is potentially one of those “in charge” who people are speaking to right now. What do you think this forum is about? See the link below for hidden camera photos.

Dam i hope they find those Cam’s and destroy them @seejaymouser @Mario A.C.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser Do what you people need to do, it obviously is a war between countries. Declare the war and getting to shooting. Strip people of their citizenships, deport, deport, deport without exception (seeing how there are no exceptions whatsoever in your ways of thinking). Break up families, or send the illegals bambinos back with the parents making sure they have no legal status. Make sure you go back a few decades though, because there are a lot of them. Don’t treat them at the hospitals even if they are dying in the streets, just get them out of the way with a plow and dump them in the garbage. If they are found, women men and children, in the desert, they are to be shot and disposed of, immediately, just like in the days of old with the Natives when they got shot and disposed of like a pile of garbage. Destroy, destroy, destroy! Send in more drones, spy, spy, spy on everyone to make sure no one is sheltering them. If caught doing so, make sure they are put in jail to await execution (stop spending money on housing criminals would save lots of money).

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser Pull everyone over the side of the road and interrogate and ask them for evidence that they are born here, which means a birth certificate with fingerprint analysis. Don’t even get caught talking to an illegal, or face huge fines. Inform neighbors to report all suspicious activity. Put surveillance cameras and stations everywhere, including in people’s homes connected to a main station, etc. It is a war between countries. Don’t stop until destruction is everywhere. There, so be it.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser Invade Mexico with military action. Drop atomic bombs and don’t stop until all is gone.

Mario A.C.

By the way, I am not for a free grab bag for all. What I have been saying in a nutshell is, we need to start by understanding the history of our country first, then move on to greatness. If we remain ignorant about people’s contributions and just decide to blame others for our problems, such as social security, medicare, education system, etc, without thinking we have no fault in it, then truly we will not progress. If we think that there aren’t any Americans who have frauded the system, and that a lot of our politicians are not corrupt, and that it is only the ‘illegals’ fault, then we will lose our way, perhaps never to rise up from the BS, again. I can point out what many may not want to hear, that the system is ripe with corruption and is a major mess mainly because we have not fixed ourselves. When one considers the amount of theft in the workplace, and the amount of fraud Americans commit against the corporations that hire them, plus the fraud on social programs, within and without, etc, one gets a true sense of why the machine has stopped working. Until then, blaming the Mexicans is not going to make it better no matter how hard one tries.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

I never said our government is perfect, in fact I have said it is not on numerous occasions. That is why we are looking everyday for better leader.

Mario A.C.

With that I will say, God Bless America, North and South!

Mario A.C.

Like I said before, the devil is in the details. We can keep on going back and forth, but what will it solve? True reform will come when people stop blaming eachother for things and start being proactive. We all live on planet Earth, under the same stars. If we devoted a small amount of understanding to the process of being human, we could really benefit tremendously. America is beautiful, yet according to some of you people, it is only beautiful because of your contributions and no one else’s. According to some, Mexicans need to stop speaking Spanish and start assimilating more. But to what? Your ignorance is not accepting of contributions made by Mexicans as well as not being able to accept Spanish, which incidentally has been spoken in the Southwest a lot longer than English. This place was not any other language first besides originally Native languages, which were all cut down to nothing, then Spanish second, which is still here, alive and well. You all want to forget about the history of this place, thus take US all back to the Neanderthal age where history was just a grunt and a groan. Sure, there are a lot of ‘illegals’ but WTF, someone must have been looking the other way, and that is how things got built and done, because like I stated earlier, it has always been someone else doing our dirty work for cheap. You cannot erase history because facts are facts. Get over it.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

What is the Mexican contribution? Aside from working to stay alive in the US.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser A Mexican invented true color tv. A gringo patented it first, but if you study the timeline, you will realize, the Mexican did it first.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

Well, that’s fine, there are a lot of great black inventors and white inventors, but the subject here is illegal immigration and how to control it.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser As far as illegals are concerned, they plant and harvest all of our agriculture, which we all consume. So, besides anything else, they do contribute a lot by that alone. If they were to deport them all at once, I would be afraid to see the results.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

We need prison labor and welfare recipients to do this work and balance out the cost of supporting them. Many people say they simply won’t do it, they would refuse … then they would do without welfare as well, or they would be put in solitary.

With the right planning every prison in the country could be growing and harvesting food and running meat plants right on the premises. Many states are already making welfare recipients take drug tests to receive these benefits, and they are being cut off left and right. America is finally waking up, and hopefully with more time they will start to listen to reasonable solutions from us.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser You have got to be kidding? Chaingang slave labor, really? Ha, ha, ha, ha! Like I said, first the Natives, then the Blacks, then the Chinese, Japanese and the Mexicans and Irish, and now all you people can come up with is slave trade from prisoners? Why not just buckle down and do it yourselves? Forget about prison labor because it is against our current laws. The chaingangs are for federally mandated labor such as freeways and such, not for free enterprise, my amigo. Get out and do it yourselves. End of discussion. What if there is a riot on the fields and they all escape out to the communities? What? Call in the National Guard? Your ways of thinking are making me suspect you are crazy, cuckoo. Free enterprise = nongovernmental involvement = free agents working for real money, not 35 cents an hour. Besides, they are criminals which really makes them ILLEGAL.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

If you want to have a conversation, fine, I’m willing, but watch your mouth. I have not disrespected you, and will not allow you to disrespect me. I might think you’re crazy as a shit-house rat, but I wouldn’t disrespect you by saying so.

Who said anything about slave labor? Once again you are not reading what I say. I said “earned welfare.” As in, you want a welfare check, you earn it. My second paragraph says that food can be grown right on the prison property, who said anything about turning them loose in open fields? Ever heard of hydroponics?

These are not new concepts, they have been talked about for years, unfortunately that’s as far as it has gotten. I have news for you, Del Monte does not grow all their own produce, neither does Tropicana. They buy it from many different sources. There’s no reason that the US Penal System can’t be a source.

Here’s another little news flash, paid work programs are already in place in prison. Yeah they don’t make much, but it costs money every day to feed, and medicate them and wash their laundry and pay their utilities, and then there’s the staff to keep them in line. Right now that’s all coming out of Americans pockets. If they grow and sell produce, etc., it would take some of the load off of our backs.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser I don’t want my produce being grown and picked by Prisoners. Besides, what of the Farm Owners, are they to be put out of business? Free enterprise means just that. Enough of our government, they bailed out the banks. Thus far it has been 16 trillion dollars and counting, just google 16 trillion dollar bail outs (secret bailouts) and find out for yourself. Hey, I like your insult, it showed cleverness. I’m going to use that one, shit-house-rat. Good one.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

I don’t want my produce being grown and picked by Prisoners

What? Like the vegetables know who’s picking them? Huh?

No, not put the farmers out of business, leave the big stuff to them, corn, wheat, barley, oats, hay … trust me, there’s enough need to go around. Are you not aware that right now the US is importing probably 60 percent of our produce from over seas?

It wasn’t an insult, I said I might think that but I wouldn’t ever say it. It’s an old Texas-ism.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

Here is the history of this place as you put it …

White people moved into the state of Texas (Mexico at that time) because Mexicans were too afraid to live there because of the Indians. The Mexican government offered deals to Mexicans to move there, but the Mexicans would not, out of fear of the Indians, plus the colder climate in winter.

When Stephen Austin asked for land grants to settle a part of Texas with 300 families, a deal was worked out. The Mexicans gladly accepted the settlers and gave generous land grants to the 300 families, but on two conditions – all of the settlers had to become Catholic, and become loyal citizens of Mexico.

So there was a time when Mexico asked white settlers to change their beliefs and way of life and become Mexican citizens.

Eventually Santa Anna wanted to stop any more whites from coming in. Mexico had already issued grants to dozens of families from the area of Missouri and other Midwestern and Southern states; those families pulled up stakes and headed for Texas. By the time they reached the border, they were no longer welcome and could not enter Mexico. These people had sold their previous homes and property and were counting on a new start in Texas – so there they were, at the border, and they couldn’t get in.

So there was a time when Mexico had a border that they wanted protected.

Fortunately for the settlers, after a couple of months the borders were opened to them. There were a few Texas-Mexicans who wanted to break free from Mexico in Austin’s colonies, but Austin gathered a force of Anglo settlers and put a stop to any such agitation. He called the rebels “lawbreakers” and reminded them that they were citizens of Mexico and had sworn allegiance to that country as a condition of their land grants and rights to settle there, and if they would NOT conform, they would be imprisoned.

seejaymouser

The original constitution allowed the “Texicans” to govern themselves because they had always taken care of themselves and protected themselves against Indian invasions and such. Santa Anna took it upon himself to change the constitution and change the rights of the Texican citizens. That’s when the shit hit the fan and the fighting started. Santa Anna was killing whites, Mexicans, anybody who even looked like they might sympathize with the Texicans point of view.

So there was a time when Texans were willing to be Mexicans and live peacefully on Mexican soil, but that wasn’t good enough for Santa Anna. The War with Mexico came about as a result of THAT. It was THEN that the Americans took, as the winner of the war with Mexico, Mexican land that included New Mexico, Arizona, and California in settlement, and eventually paid Mexico 15 million dollars in gold for the land.

So not only was it not STOLEN it was fought for and won and ulitimately paid for.

If La Raza and MechA want a reconquista, they need to look back at history and they can thank Santa Anna for starting the discord in the beginning. Back then whites just wanted to live and govern themselves in an area that Mexicans didn’t want any part of. Now that it is prosperous and a better place to live than where they are they want it back? Too bad. Good luck with that.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser There’s always two side to a coin, as in history.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

Touche’

Mario A.C.

Anyway, getting back to Ron Paul, he may have a chance, but I think he needs a little more understanding on what has been happening along the border. The issues are mainly about NAFTA, which shortly after being signed into law, kazzam, what a coincidence, 911. Post 911, we immediately responded by trying to stop Mexican trucks (amongst many things) from transporting things back and forth, against what was originally agreed. What an embarrassment to break the NAFTA treaty right after inception, but nothing new when it comes to treaties we make, as it was with the Natives. Broken treaties. Mexican trucks??? First of all, I never new Mexico made trucks, or even has a truck label. Truthfully though, they were/are not mexican trucks, but are from the USA. Oooops, just another ignorant shame on our behalf… just like Pete Wilson screaming, “No speaking Spanish in California! Poor guy, like I said, California is a Spanish word dumb dumb!

Mario A.C.

Correction on the word ‘new’ in my previous post to ‘knew’.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

The issues with the border are about an unchecked huge number of people entering the country without documentation. In America our way to enforce our laws begins with our identities. We all have to have an ID so that if we break the laws, write bad checks, leave the scene of a crime, etc., we can be tracked down. We can’t get a decent job or drive or borrow money or open a bank account without some form of ID. It’s not a perfect system but it’s better than most. The problem is, most illegals do not want do not have and do not care about ID or about trying to live in our system the way the rest of us have to. They want to come and go as they please, rack up unpaid hospital bills and leave Americans holding the bag.

Furthermore there is a cultural difference as well about how to live. In the last month alone I have seen three instances of people thworing trash in the street, one lady threw a beer bottle out of her car window, another man stuffed a bag of trash under his car while sitting in a fast food drive through, another family left a picnic area at the end of the day and left trash scattered everywhere. In each instance they were brown. I’m not suggesting that all Hispanic people litter, but these numbers are pretty telling. Look at the border pictures again.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser Your qoute: “We all have to have an ID so that if we break the laws, write bad checks, leave the scene of a crime, etc., we can be tracked down.” Exactly my point, we are a nation of lawbreakers. Too many broken laws = too many new laws. Too much.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser Like i stated earlier, too many corporations have closed their doors due to too much stealing by employees and bosses. Oh, oh.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

So, what, just let it be a free for all? I don’t get it.

Mario A.C.

@seejaymouser Tose so called, unchecked people crossing our border, are actually some of the most checked people in our world. Everytime they get deported, they check and document them. Those hidden cameras you were talking about have checked everything. They are more documented than you, amigillo. Ha, ha.

Mario A.C.

Once in California, there was a man named Pete Wilson who wanted to punish people for hiring ‘illegals’ and for speaking Spanish. His campaign motto was, “anyone found hiring an illegal alien will be punished!” but it was later discovered that he had hired ‘illegals’ himself. Then he said, “No speaking Spanish in California!” and the people just laughed at him and called him silly, because truly he had forgotten that the word, ‘California’, is a Spanish word. By and by, he was defeated, because truly he had forgotten the most important lessons in life, which are how to get along and to see the truth for what it is. By and by, he went down the wayside, where he will remain forever.

seejaymouser

@Mario A.C.

Well, guess what, it is against the law to hire illegals. Just because he was guilty of the same crime does not make it any less a law.

9:14 am: "ooo wow nice attempt at a ad hom! Did the reds steal the election from you? Where is McCarthy when you need him? Am I right?" - JBrown

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