Like you Hombre, hospitality was what I immediately thought of, as hospitality in the Middle East is incredible. I could be wrong, but I suspect this is more of an aspect of culture than Islam, originating back to the nomadic way of life and being part of long trade routes.

"I would rather wake up in the middle of nowhere than in any city on earth" - Steve McQueen

M85 wrote:Like you Hombre, hospitality was what I immediately thought of, as hospitality in the Middle East is incredible. I could be wrong, but I suspect this is more of an aspect of culture than Islam, originating back to the nomadic way of life and being part of long trade routes.

very well could be possible. Nonetheless I have great respect to this attribute.

Many years ago, visiting East Jerusalem. I asked an Arab man to tell me how to get to a certain restaurant. He smiled and said "oh yeh! my cousin owns it. Let me take you there". We walked inside. after we sat, he insisted to invite me to dinner, and paid for it - despite my attempt to pay. "Nop! you are my guess here". Knowing full well that if I refuse his offer it could be construed as rude and hurt his feeling very deeply.

I suspect we're getting confused between religious and cultural attitudes here. Like the question of desert nomads welcoming people trekking through the sand - human empathy, no Islam required. I recently saw a cooking/travel programme about Italy, where travellers were welcomed as guests. I suspect it's a sign of a rural (now or recently) agricultural community which can surprise we successors of the Industrial Revolution.

‘Hindus and Muslims belong to two different religious philosophies, social customs and literary traditions. They neither intermarry nor eat together, and indeed they belong to two different civilisations which are based mainly on conflicting ideas and conceptions.’ Muhammad Ali Jinnah

It is said, When a Muslim chases with intends to kill you - safest place to hide, is in his home.

LOL. I would not like to put this to a test.

As many young women have found to their cost.

‘Hindus and Muslims belong to two different religious philosophies, social customs and literary traditions. They neither intermarry nor eat together, and indeed they belong to two different civilisations which are based mainly on conflicting ideas and conceptions.’ Muhammad Ali Jinnah

Hombre wrote:Muslim hospitality is unmatched anywhere else. They can teach many of us the basic concept of generosity toward guests.

Toward guest? How about giving the equal opportunity like in America, Canada, Australia and Europe.I have no hesitation to say to those people mentioned above with - God bless them for their generosity. But the greatest test of them all is the act of giving when own only so little. How about those who renounce the world to help others?

There is perhaps something ... but I am not sure if it is connected to Islam as such of of it is simply a result of the circumstances many Muslim countries are in.

There is a closeness to family we don't have in Western countries, people within the family are very supportive of each other. If cousin x has a hole in the roof of his house he can rely on all his family to chip together some money to help him.

If cousin y needs a job, and he has a hard time finding one, more likely than not some uncle or other will help him out.

In the west we have largely lost our sense of community, we have old people nobody ever visits, few of us even know our neighbours, and if any neighbour knocks on the door we would be suspicious... If you live in Indonesia, you will have the neighbours knocking all the time, sometimes simply to let you have a taste of what they cooked, and people organise things to do together, such a keeping the street clean, for example.

Here we rely on the government on many things, in many Muslim countries people help each other. Here if you have a flat tyre and you need some help you need to have insurance for that. I once had a broken car in Morocco, in the middle of nowhere, and a couple of guys saw me and helped me out, really kind of them. They would not take any money, but they took a bunch of grapes I offered them.

M85 wrote:Like you Hombre, hospitality was what I immediately thought of, as hospitality in the Middle East is incredible. I could be wrong, but I suspect this is more of an aspect of culture than Islam, originating back to the nomadic way of life and being part of long trade routes.

It is very well possible - considering Islam rose from Arabs. It is nonetheless a wonderful attribute which I wish we in the West could appreciate and reciprocal.

Instead, back in 1920 with discovery of oil, many American & English businessmen, ignorant of meaning and purpose of these customs, they mistook them as weakness on part of the Arab (Muslims), which had to be exploited, with no regard to consequences. They applied the western philosophy of doing business, with it this mantra "in business there are only economic interest". Subsequently, these oil companies stole enormous amount of oil with little or no pay.

I would suggest to watch the documentary "the 7 sisters" which Chronicles the history of the 7 biggest oil companies, and their insidious master plan to corner the oil market, and means to cheat the Arabs of their revenue..

It was only after Arabs learned the real value of oil, many Saudi princess went to US t& UK o study business and economy, they realized what was going on, which brought ARAMCO into reality, with the American Business model - sell to the highest bidder. .The rest is history.

Hombre wrote:Muslim hospitality is unmatched anywhere else. They can teach many of us the basic concept of generosity toward guests.

Toward guest? How about giving the equal opportunity like in America, Canada, Australia and Europe.I have no hesitation to say to those people mentioned above with - God bless them for their generosity. But the greatest test of them all is the act of giving when own only so little. How about those who renounce the world to help others?

Hombre wrote:Ok friends. Here I like to shed light on what's is positive and good in Islam. Please list your entries as well.

Muslim hospitality is unmatched anywhere else. They can teach many of us the basic concept of generosity toward guests.

Also, their concern for the weak, hungry and destitute is remarkable.

what is your view & experience?

This thread asks about positive attributes of Islam. The posts are about how (some) Muslims behave. Which are not necessarily the attributes of Islam.

People can behave kindly, in spite of Islam, not because of it.

Islam does not inspire kindness to anyone, as per scriptures.I see posts praising Muslim hospitality, which has nothing to do with the attributes of Islam.Where does Islam (the religion) advises for kindness, plurality, to non believers?Is there a Golden Rule at all? NO!

Posters good experience with Muslims may have no relation to what Islam teaches.

Reminder:Quran 66:9Sahih International: O Prophet, strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites and be harsh upon them. And their refuge is Hell, and wretched is the destination.5:51Sahih International: O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are [in fact] allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you – then indeed, he is [one] of them. Indeed, Allah guides not the wrongdoing people.

Now a positive aspect of Islam? Ah, here you go ... it does not expressly command cannibalism.

Mind you it is not really forbidden either...

(1) Quran (2: 173):

“He hath only forbidden you dead meat, and blood, and the flesh of swine, and that on which any other name hath been invoked besides that of Allah. But if one is forced by necessity, without wilful disobedience, nor transgressing due limits,- then is he guiltless. For Allah is Oft-forgiving Most Merciful” (Surah The Cow 2:173).

(2) Quran (16: 115):

“He has only forbidden you dead meat, and blood, and the flesh of swine, and any (food) over which the name of other than Allah has been invoked. But if one is forced by necessity, without wilful disobedience, nor transgressing due limits,- then Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful” (Surah The Bee 16:115).

Hombre wrote:Ok friends. Here I like to shed light on what's is positive and good in Islam. Please list your entries as well.

Muslim hospitality is unmatched anywhere else. They can teach many of us the basic concept of generosity toward guests.

Also, their concern for the weak, hungry and destitute is remarkable.

what is your view & experience?

1. Muslim Hospitality is matched... clearly.2. The laws of hospitality range back to the time of the jews, not muslims.3. Their concern for the Weak (what Concern?)4. Their concern is for Muslims and only muslims.

Well,even in Hinduism a guest is honorably respected with a salutation 'athithidevo bhava'(salutation to the guest god).athithi literally means one who comes to your house without having a look at thithi,vaara or nakshatra i.e one who can come at time without having a look at the parameters of time set in the calendar.A householder who has guests must offer food first to the guest and then only must he eat it.

Nevertheless,the most positive attribute in Islam for me seems to be their complete abstention from wine.Now tribals are offered compensation by the govts in India when they loose something due to govt projects.They quickly spend it off on liquor,foreign one if possible and become bankrupt within no time.Had they embraced Islam,they would have become much more sublime and would have instead become much more productive.

ganging up quickly and attacking anyone who attacks one of their member is also their positive attribute.In the old forum,HPyroli quoted some researched book and said that one of the way conversion of tribals to Hinduism happened in the past was by means of nude parties of traders who sexually exploit tribal women and then convert them(That tallies with what the Hindutva mentor Vinayak Damodar Savarkar said that even tribals of Andaman islands have Aryan genes and such is the extensive spread of Aryan genes).If tribals happened to convert to Islam,that would never happen.

Have read elsewhere in my childhood,that the traders exploit tribals by bartering with them valuable animal skins with cheap goodies such as a sack of salt etc.(Strangely kitchen religion does not prohibit Hindus from trading with tribals though it prohibits them from inter-dining with them in plain areas much similar to First world countries wanting raw materials from Third world countries,but not their people)

That is also one of the reason why Dalits and Tribals convert to Christianity as Christian nations are quite powerful as of today and hence any attack on them will be seen as attacks on minorities and will receive international attention.I doubt they sincerely believe the Christian doctrine of salvation only through Christ as they live amidst large number of Hindus.

If special status could be granted to many states in India based on backwardness, then it can also be granted to remnant A. P which was deliberately rendered backward due to malicious policy of divide and rule.After division,percapita income of Telangana is Rs 20,000 /-more than that of remnant A.P.