I had this topic a while ago and.. well.. some of you were complete A holes.

It was about a hang loop I wanted to order.

I ended up ordering the one that I mentioned in that specific post, and well.. It works tremendously awesome. I had this new harness you know.. It's a great harness.

I took it for a first time XC yesterday. I made 100 miles. It was fun.

What I'm trying to say here is, don't let these people discourage you in any way. When I first read the hateful comments I received, honestly, I was bummed. But in the end, don't let this crap get to you. You're better than this. This community is great overall, ask your questions, go out there and make the most of it. Forget about those that want to bring you down.

Basically this is a call for support, help and generosity from and towards all the pilots in our community.

I have met some of my best friends through hang gliding, but many pilots I have encountered are very intense and not all too friendly, or they try to be and come off obviously disingenuous. And I think trying to say "be nice" for the sake of the sport is not going to output nicer people, just more disingenuous people. Maybe the better way is to be yourself, and don't be afraid to call people out for being jerks (politely).

Posts #5 & 9 sounded pretty harsh. I am acquainted with the pilot who wrote these comments and the terrible internal politics and other situations that he and his friends have suffered through and it's pretty sad. I think he was just blowing off steam as he alluded in his second post but could have saved his Op-Ed comments for another thread.

Yes, we all need to be good ambassadors if we want the port to survive.

skyphil wrote:Hi,
I had this topic a while ago and.. well.. some of you were complete A holes. It was about a hang loop I wanted to order. I ended up ordering the one that I mentioned in that specific post, and well.. It works tremendously awesome.
What I'm trying to say here is, don't let these people discourage you in any way. When I first read the hateful comments I received, honestly, I was bummed. But in the end, don't let this crap get to you. You're better than this. This community is great overall, ask your questions, go out there and make the most of it. Forget about those that want to bring you down.

Skyphil,

Right. Besides, everybody has a bad day at times. I have seen fairly reasonable pilots go ballistic over stuff, not because it was warranted, but because they knew that if ignored, the issue could get extremely serious. One guy mentions a "minor" concern, and somebody explodes on them, seemingly all out of proportion. Often the second guy has seen what can go wrong, and he's just not up for a repeat nightmare. It happens. That's when everybody needs to step back, and take a breath.

Flying is serious stuff. Some days, we just need to cut the others some slack, in every direction. We can get things set right, without fireworks. In this case, I do not agree with the rough answers, not because they are wrong (they are not wrong), but they're in the wrong place. HG instruction is never complete. The USA Private Pilot types call their FAA cert "a license to learn." Good instruction is just the start, in any form of aviation.

Skyphil, you took the right path; don't let anybody discourage the asking of questions here. Disregard the flak. It's more helpful if a question is asked, because there may be ten other pilots out there who need the same answers. Many can benefit, not just the one asking the question. Open the discussion. Ask questions. Find out why some say this, and other say that. Everybody should have a voice.

In the old days, we'd use rope. I got a cool new apron harness to fly my Eiperformance Flexi II with, maybe around 1977. I got a ride to the cliff, and ran into the same issue that skyphil had. So I asked some guy, who I barely knew, and who had probably just enjoyed a bong hit, to tie my hang-rope to the right length. Hope it's a good knot! Backup? Feh! Then I went and flew, thinking 'good, it's holding so far'. Everyone takes things so seriously nowadays.

Even the way good folks (with vast experience and good intentions) sometimes go on at each other like school children â€” some days I just don't get it. Its kinda pathetic.

And while few generalizations can be applied to we free flyer pilots, it could be said that we are generally a passionate mob and tend to be free thinkers (conservative or not)... we have strong opinions.

I too have strong opinions, but I don't have an absolute belief in anything as such (maybe the idea/observation of constant change, but even that is only 99% fact). Fortunately this state of mind bodes well for continuing lifelong learnings (for anything) and maintaining the idea that I will always be the student... but its not for everyone. Its not for most. For some (probably most) knowledge is power. The moment we think we know all about something is the exact moment we need to take a step back and re-learn things.

People can be so unkind to each other, and that often comes from ego issues and their own basic insecurities. Then there's the written communication factors... then there's the internet. If you want to do good stuff here you need to have a pretty thick skin (or just be plain old insensitive).

You can never be sure about somebody (even yourself), so best to take things as they come. If they say they are your brother and it turns out they are full of chit, well, I guess that's down to our own expectation management â€” people show their true colors in the end.

I had this topic a while ago and.. well.. some of you were complete A holes.

It was about a hang loop I wanted to order.

I ended up ordering the one that I mentioned in that specific post, and well.. It works tremendously awesome. I had this new harness you know.. It's a great harness.

I took it for a first time XC yesterday. I made 100 miles. It was fun.

What I'm trying to say here is, don't let these people discourage you in any way. When I first read the hateful comments I received, honestly, I was bummed. But in the end, don't let this crap get to you. You're better than this. This community is great overall, ask your questions, go out there and make the most of it. Forget about those that want to bring you down.

Basically this is a call for support, help and generosity from and towards all the pilots in our community.

Our sport is great. Be a good ambassador to it.

Congrats on the flight!

(what size loop did you get?)

Mike

Everyone who lives dies, yet not everyone who dies, has lived.
We take these risks not to escape life, but to prevent life escaping us.

I still do that. Almost. Flat climbing webbing (not rope) tied with the appropriate knot. A good way to deal with the wide variety of harness mains and control frame sizes out there. Steve

waltspoint wrote:Hang loops...

In the old days, we'd use rope. I got a cool new apron harness to fly my Eiperformance Flexi II with, maybe around 1977. I got a ride to the cliff, and ran into the same issue that skyphil had. So I asked some guy, who I barely knew, and who had probably just enjoyed a bong hit, to tie my hang-rope to the right length. Hope it's a good knot! Backup? Feh! Then I went and flew, thinking 'good, it's holding so far'. Everyone takes things so seriously nowadays.

g Gliders since 1991. I have flown the Majority of my Flights right here in Northern California. I have never received anything but Kindness and encouragement from Other Pilots. Free Flyers are some great People.

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While a couple comments in the original thread did show perhaps a bit too much hostility, they do have a valid point that HG pilots tend to jump onto faster ships without enough skills or experience, and that you appeared to be one of such pilots.

Dismissing valid criticism just because it was worded harshly does not make the problems brought up any less real.

Also, you apparently jumped to asking the forum without doing any of your own research. Even the most basic google search would have answered your question with a detailed Wills Wing's page on the subject, and previous HG.org threads. Such lack of effort can be seen as downright offensive. Reading your original thread now feels a lot like one of those "hello I have some steel rods how do I build a hang glider" threads.

—Nikita

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I am the original hater here. I sincerely apologize for coming across as criticising you. What I was attempting to convey, was the fact that Hang Gliding, as a whole, has done a poor job passing on vital information to the next generation of pilots, of the lessons we learned from the death and pain of our fellow pilots. I did not intended to make it personal. And congratulations on your 100 mile flight!

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IAre you the Will Brown that I McKeon 925 - 497 - ow from Lake McClure ? If you are indeed Will Brown. Why don't you give me a Call? Remember Will, to fly Big. Also remember to LIVE BIG! Good By Chris McKeon. 707 - 632 - 5928