Tuesday, October 28, 2014

Who Do People Say That I Am? And Where Do They Think I'm From?

A reader has challenged me to conduct a complete exegesis of the Gospels, or more particularly, of Jesus. Of course, Jesus cannot be reduced to what is contained in the Gospels, but more importantly, I am no theologian, just a guy and his blog.

In doing this I would like to preserve a kind of stereoscopic sensibility, in that I want to start from ground zero, or utter cluelessness, without too many assumptions about Who This Guy Is, even while bearing in mind that he is -- irrespective of whether or not one is a believer -- the most consequential person who has ever lived.

Now, "consequential," in the sense I am using it, means "laden with causation," so to speak. Again, irrespective of one's perspective, it is just an empirical fact that Jesus continues to cause an incalculable number of things to happen -- this post, for example. Obviously, I wouldn't be writing it if he hadn't existed (and this is leaving aside the question of whether Jesus is actively causing things in the vertical sense).

Take a contemporaneous historical figure, say, Tiberius, who was emperor of Rome during Jesus' ministry. Clearly, Tiberius was far more consequential at the time, as he had the power to make most anything happen, whereas Jesus had only the power of an anonymous peasant, which would have been a scintilla more than zero. His criminal's death on the cross would only seem to emphasize the point. Ultimately we would say that man himself had the power of life and death over God -- or at least so it would seem.

Fast forward 2000 years, and we see that Tiberius is essentially inconsequential -- whatever causes he initiated have eventually dissipated -- whereas Jesus' consequentiality only grows over the centuries, like some kind of mustard seed or something.

Again I want to remind the reader that I am attempting to begin this analysis from a standpoint of ignorance which may at times resemble blasphemy. But based upon what we have thus far said, it seems to me that even the most intellectually uncurious and even tenured person would find this rather puzzling: how does the most consequential man on earth become so inconsequential (hey, ask Obama!), whereas how does a common criminal -- whom contemporary psychiatry would frankly regard as delusional -- become the most consequential? (Enough about Obama!) You have to admit that this is odd, odder still if a lunatic is the most consequential man in history.

But let's not prejudge the case: it's not as if other lunatics, or knaves, or criminally insane, have not turned out to be quite consequential. I know, for example, of a religious founder who took pleasure in marrying underage girls and decapitating those who resisted his message of peace. And it is arguable that the second most consequential man in all of history has been none other than Karl Marx. He too continues to reach from the grave and cause any number of things to occur, for example, Obama (and everything Obama causes in return).

Where to begin, with theology, or metaphysics, or history? In a way, this goes directly to the infancy narratives, for what are they actually? Are they really just banal "history" as understood by the modern mind? Or are they theology presented in the form of historical narrative? Or are they, like Genesis, more like lessons in metaphysics and ontology, in this case revealed via biography (or word in flesh)?

Not to get ahead of ourselves, but we do have to begin somewhere. For the Jewish mind, one operating assumption was that man is already in the image of God. Boiled down to an abstract principle, it means that man and God are complementary, even if God necessarily takes priority: man illuminates God because God has first illuminated man.

So, one of our assumptions is that there is both horizontal and vertical causation. Frankly, if there were only the former, then man could never know it. Rather, to know of the horizontal is to be in the vertical; and to be in the vertical is to live in this mysterious space between matter and God; or relative and absolute, if you nonbelievers prefer.

Now, even the most thoroughly secular person is still trying to "ascend" (in the vertical). How? Well, science, for example, is, in its very essence, the reduction of multiplicity to unity. Note, however, that there is a kind of unity in both (vertical) directions. We can descend all the way down into a dark monistic materialism; or, we can ascend into an differentiated but integrated synthesis, which is the luminous way of genuine science (or at least philosophy of science).

But the Christian story -- or the infancy narratives -- begins at the other end of the vertical, with "a man on a mission," so to speak. In other words, this is a hypothetical descent from the most-high to the most-low (in human form).

Thus, on the one hand people knew exactly where Jesus was "from": he's that guy from Nazareth. But at the same time, the Gospels record consternation about how this guy from Nazareth could presume to know all that. When Jesus asks, "Who do people say that I am?," he's also posing the question, Where do you think I am from?, and even Why do you think I am here?, or What is my vertical message?

For Benedict, the Gospels, each in their own way, "set out to answer these questions." In short: Who? Where? Why? and, How can we participate? Each of these is inextricably intertwined with the others, and I would say goes to the question of how Jesus can be so consequential and continue to cause things like this post to happen today.

Benedict points out that Matthew and Luke present two very different genealogies, one essentially extending from the origin to the now, the other from the now to the origin. As Abraham's life "points forward" to his multitude of progeny (both horizontal and vertical), Matthew wants to say that this stream reaches a kind of focused intensity in the person of Jesus -- or Mary, rather.

If the genealogical stream suggests horizontal continuity from Abraham to Mary, then the vertical ingression into Mary implies discontinuity: "Mary is a new beginning. Her child does not originate from any man, but is a new creation, conceived [vertically] through the Holy Spirit."

At this point -- if not sooner -- non-believers will have already manifested the Jesus Willies, meaning that something in them recoils from all this sappy Jesus talk. Again, I am attempting to avoid this, to the extent that it is possible. Rather, I am trying to open up a space for understanding, even if one ultimately rejects what one has understood.

You might say I am trying to provide some cognitive "hooks" for the modern mind, which will otherwise reject the whole thing out of head.

In this case, I am simply positing the idea that man self-evidently has access to the vertical; that this vertical is either hierarchical (conditioned from top to bottom) or an unintelligible absurdity; and if the former, then the possibility that the top of the hierarchy may manifest in the bottom. This latter would represent "Incarnation," but let's not get ahead of ourselves. At this point we are simply affirming the possibility. And if it is possible for dead matter to come to life, we should keep an open mind as to other possible secrets matter has in store for us.

So, the gospels imply that "Jesus belongs by law, 'legally,' to the house of David. And yet he comes from elsewhere, 'from above' -- from God himself." The point is that this man has a mysterious "dual origin"; he is both one of us and not like any of us: brother and stranger, friend and superior, Jesus and freak.

Again I want to remind the reader that I am attempting to begin this analysis from a standpoint of ignorance which may at times resemble blasphemy.

I think at some point, for most modern people, it becomes necessary. Depending on how much and what you learn as a child, one may need to throw off all that prior knowledge (or rather, (-k)) and begin with a mind made new, but also capable of understanding. I know so many young people who have grown out of their childish understanding, but then found no deeper teaching to fill it out - as though they were taught that math consisted of simply adding, subtracting, multiplying, and dividing, and that there was nothing else to know. Then finding out that higher math exists, seeing that they use letters as well as numbers and a lot of other "crazy" symbols, and writing it off as insanity and all of math itself as the domain of idiots.

Speaking for myself, the knowledge that I had as a child was woefully incomplete (perhaps shallow is the better term), and usually rather poorly represented by the people in a position to teach it. Then when I tried to discover on my own (reading the gospels in my early 20s), but lacking the requisite inner space, I probably managed to comprehend even less. I read, but without eyes to see, so it all looked like the life and times of crazy people to me.

It was only years later, after coming across this place, that I was ready to begin to understand.

Speaking of Tiberius, we just spent a few nights rewatching I, Claudius. There's a reference in there to the Jewish messiah - nobody knows who it is, but Herod Agrippa (not the one who met with Jesus) may have believed himself to be the one. And of course, Caligula thought it was himself - not that he was Jewish, but he was pretty certain he was god, so it must be he.

"If the genealogical stream suggests horizontal continuity from Abraham to Mary, then the vertical ingression into Mary implies discontinuity: "Mary is a new beginning. Her child does not originate from any man, but is a new creation, conceived [vertically] through the Holy Spirit.""

IOW, 'What are my X,Y CoOrdinates?' and 'Do you really think you can have dimension without both?'

""Who do people say that I am?," he's also posing the question, Where do you think I am from?"

Curious, does anyone know if the "I am" there, used the same wording as "I AM" from the burning bush did?

Good question. On a hunch, I'm going to guess that if not exactly that, it was close, and also part of the reason the clerics hated him so much. What he spoke was blasphemous, if he were actually just an ordinary schlub.

Van, I'm not sure if the "I am" in Jesus' question "who do they think I am" is the same as the name God called Himself "I AM", but I suspect not because it did not cause the same reaction as when (in John 8) he answered the Pharisses "before Abraham was, I am" which was the same as it resulted in the Pharisees taking up rocks to stone Jesus.

Funny, "facts" don't seem to matter much to me anymore. I used to think that I should just concern myself with Mark, which seemed to be the source of Matthew and Luke -you see I just wanted to get to the core facts of the matter and try to sort out the truth from the myth -not knowing the Truth was entangled in the myth.

It shook me to find out in a footnote that some scholars believe the ressurection account wasn't originally in Mark.

Can't remember where I read it (heard it?) maybe here. But Christ never answers the question, but seems to prefer that people tell Him who He is, such as when Peter says he is Lord and one of the two the robbers beside Him on the cross.Seems to reinforce the value of faith.

They sure aren't the leading indicator of value. While it's a fact that Attila & Genghis obliterated millions... their impact ended with the echoes of their deeds. Even if as Joan mentioned, they sired mucho many leetle toddlers... they have no connection to them. Alexander the Great had no great impact upon the world by what he factually did within the world, but by those things 'outside the world' which managed to be spread along with his actions, the Greek culture and philosophy, such as Alexandria (and the Septuagint) caused larger ripples than did his deeds of daring do.

And as Gagdad pointed out, they all, from the pikers of change like Atila & Genghis, to the movers & shakers like Socrates, Plato & Aristotle, pale against the waves and current that flow from the no-name Nazarene who died the death of a common criminal.

Something's up with that.

Even those who have some claim to shaking these up in our day, Rousseau, Kant & Marx... and even mahomet, they're but the troughs of those who came before Him - they might stir up the water but they don't affect its flow.

Only that 'no name' fellow at the center of our calendar could accomplish such things.

I'm reminded of the headlines going around a couple of weeks ago about the so-called "invisibility cloak," which was actually just a couple of lenses placed precisely so that the narrow point of their focus matched up, and anything next to that narrow point, though close, seemed to be out of the field of vision.

Kind of like this: >✝<

Which is to say, a tiny point which takes on magnified importance both forward and backward in time.

Rick said: But Christ never answers the question, but seems to prefer that people tell Him who He is.

Well, He wants us to know our own answer to that question. It's not as though He was having an identity crisis. Even on a strictly historical/horizontal level, given His massive influence on the world we live in, anyone's answer to that question is (or should be) incredibly important.

It may be a story about something that happened once, but it is also a story about what is always happening. We are all Peter, pondering our answer to that question.

Seems to reinforce the value of faith.

Well, I do like to say that there is no faith without relationship, and that question strikes at the heart of our relationship with Him like no other. It is almost shockingly blunt.

What I mean is, reinforces the value Christ places on faith. Not just what we think of it.There is a trinity of sorts here as well: One asks the question, the other answers, and faith is revealed between them.

Anon (mis)quoted "Do you trust Me? Then pick up your cross, and follow..."

Jesus didn't ask if they trusted him, at least not in any interpretations I've seen.

Jesus said "Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me."

Then he added "For whoever wants to save their life will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me will find it. What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul? Or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul?"

Oh, my. Is this guy a serious contender, or is he some kind of write-in kook? The reviews are hilarious.

Speaking of pyramids, so out near where I live there's what I believe is either a synagogue or a Jewish funeral home that looks like a miniature version of the Luxor hotel. It strikes me as particularly odd that any group of Jews would build something in the shape of the architecture of their Talmudic oppressors, but what do I know?

We once had some missionaries to Papua New Guinea come to our church and share with us their story. They were the first white western people to arrive to these particular folks. They spent years learning and writing the language, and then transliterated the Bible. They began teaching it starting in Genesis. It took them 4 years to get through the Old Testament. Talk about, "start[ing] from ground zero, or utter cluelessness, without too many assumptions about Who This Guy Is." When Jesus was finally introduced to the natives, they were ready for Him. They KNEW who he was and were excited and delighted, and believed.

Even though I haven't dropped a comment here in a long time this place still seems like my first home on the internet. And it's been a few years, now hasn't it? I used to be sure that I always had something to add to a discussion. But it has been a long strange trip from the wild west internet of (early)LGF, to Bob founding this blog, to now. Somewhere along the way I got changed into a Christian. If you told me that was going to happen I might not have stayed. I've changed a lot and I feel more inclined to listen, and utterly disinclined to argue. The heart business had a lot to do with it. (see John C Wright). Day to day life has become an exercise in joy. I keep my focus on home, work, and most of all, the bicycle gang, It's fun bein' Leader of the Pack (only without the vroom vroom) We work at creating fun, and we're doing OK at it. I do try (with little success) to avoid the news. And this post is doing what Bob does best. He animates the mystery of it all; brings out all the strange and wonderful stuff that we've already seen, and shows it to us like something newly discovered. Looking forward to what comes next.

"And this post is doing what Bob does best. He animates the mystery of it all; brings out all the strange and wonderful stuff that we've already seen, and shows it to us like something newly discovered. Looking forward to what comes next."

Aye, that he does, John. And with little or no saturation or cluelessto-all to clog up the arteries to our minds as we seek the Truth.

"But let's not prejudge the case: it's not as if other lunatics, or knaves, or criminally insane, have not turned out to be quite consequential. I know, for example, of a religious founder who took pleasure in marrying underage girls and decapitating those who resisted his message of peace."

Nothin' says peace like decapitations and sexual assaults on a 9 year old child.

I woke up a little earlier than usual this morning -- here I am! -- all fired up to write a post. I noticed the date, and something in my head asked if maybe I was forgetting something. Eventually my brain reminded me that yes, I had forgotten the unpleasant fact that I have to attend another all-day seminar for my continuing education. At least it's the last one for another two years of procrastination.

So instead of a trackless oasis of slack spreading out before me, I have to give myself over to a regulatory prison for nine or ten hours, including travel time. I may begin a post, but I doubt that I'll finish it. FYI.

Oh well. At least there's a game seven at the end of the day. And maybe I can get some reading done at the seminar, so I can try to stay ahead of the pack. I feel like a music teacher who has had one more lesson than his students, so he merely teaches them what he learned the day before...

What About Bob?

Who spirals down the celestial firepole on wings of slack, seizes the wheel of the cosmic bus, and embarks upin a bewilderness adventure of higher nondoodling? Who, haloed be his gnome, loiters on the threshold of the transdimensional doorway, looking for handouts from Petey? Who, with his doppelgägster and testy snideprick, Cousin Dupree, wields the pliers and blowtorch of fine insultainment for the ridicure of assouls? Who is the gentleman loaffeur who yoinks the sword from the stoned philosopher and shoves it in the breadbasket of metaphysical ignorance and tenure? Whose New Testavus for the Restavus blows the locked doors of the empyrean off their rusty old hinges and sheds a beam of intense darkness on the world enigma? Who is the Biggest Fakir of the Vertical Church of God Knows What, channeling the roaring torrent of 〇 into the feeble stream of cyberspace? Who is the masked pandit who lobs the first water balloon out the motel window at the annual Raccoon convention? Who is your nonlocal partner in disorganized crimethink? Shut your mouth! But I'm talkin' about bʘb! Then we can dig it!

Goround ZerO:

The Cosmic Area Rug:

The empty center is Beyond-Being. The circles are dimensions of Being. Your life is a path for the Spirit to pass from periphery to center. Thoughts and choices -- truth and virtue -- are the paving stones.

Only Error is Transmitted:

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Fuck You: War

Late last night, in search of light, I watched a ball of fire streak across the midnight sky. I watched it glow, then grow, then shrink, then sink into the silhouette of morning. As I watched it die, I said, ‘Hey, I’ve got a lot in common with that light.’ That’s right. I’m alive with the fire of my life, which streaks across my span of time and is seen by those who lift their eyes in search of light to help them though the long, dark night. --Nilsson

We see that yesterday is our birthday, today is our life, and tomorrow we are gone. So we have just one day to learn all we need to know, and that day is today. --Petey