I play 40K once in a while now just for a difference and guess what still on the dark side...I'm having this friendly game with a dark angel player friend of mine and I thought of a mostly cc battle so here we go:

So what do you guys think? The main plan is to move as fast as possible and attack in a a single spot with as many units as possible...never used warp beasts before maybe another unit of whyches instead? There is also a slight heavy support just in case.

_________________'And lo, he shall rule with a dark hand and his shadow shall touch uppon every land.'

Single combat I await
My shadow brings them fear
The spikes upon my chariot
Will grind them when they're near...

Last edited by Kristo on Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:58 am, edited 4 times in total.

Fri May 30, 2008 6:05 pm

Vorchild

Master of the Red Legion

Joined: Sat Oct 19, 2002 1:06 pmPosts: 7037Location: Land of Chill

I'm not all that fond of retinues for a wych archite. You're not getting anything new with the retinue, but have to follow all the rules attached to it. Better to keep it variable in my view and keep the independent character rules. With a shadow field and agonizer, it can often be a good idea to go hunting things on your own when you have the chance.

What I don't get though is why not have all the wych squads in raiders? They'll be excessively vulnerable otherwise, I think. Also, all your wych sqads should have wych weapons - not doing so really doesn't get you the full value for the unit.

I've also found that succubi in jetbike squads are vastly overpriced. You're paying 61 points onto a unit that's only 95 without, and for what? 2 agonizer attacks. Its really not worth it. Back in the day when the unit got extra attacks for pistols and CCWs, sure, they were quite the kick ass bunch and the upgrades were useful, but you're much better off in my view spending those extra points on raiders for the other wych squads and leaving the bikes for tank hunting, objectives, and fast support.

OK first of all there are 2 points over the limit...on a friendly game that wouldn't be the issue but since I plan to start participating in tournaments with DE I'll need some hint on what to drop.

Secondly are the Warp beasts any good? I thought of them as a secondary force which will be deployed on a corner and move towards the enemy probably assaulting in the second turn.

Third the helion skyboard > reaver jetbike on the Archite? Or should I just get rid of it?

_________________'And lo, he shall rule with a dark hand and his shadow shall touch uppon every land.'

Single combat I await
My shadow brings them fear
The spikes upon my chariot
Will grind them when they're near...

Sat May 31, 2008 9:56 am

Kargan daemonclaw

Highborn

Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 8:16 pmPosts: 734

I would get rid of the skyboard and have the character join one unit of wyches.

I think all the unit of wyches are too small to last long.

If you are planning to participate in tournaments you might want to consider some additional points.

If your tournament scene features soring opponents for sportsmanship and army composition you might do poorly on the comp. Generally taking multiples of identical units is frowned upon, especially taking multiples of effcient unit choices.

Warp beasts are fine if you use them well, they are small cheap units and need to select their targets carefully. Charging into a 200 point chaos space marine unit or Rok mob isn't going to go well. Attacking a small devastator or support squad or using them to support the assault of a raider mounted wyche squad is much better.

It's like in the lictor thread, people send their 80 point lictor against an expensive character model or enemy monsterous creature and wonder why it gets squashed.

Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:55 am

Vorchild

Master of the Red Legion

Joined: Sat Oct 19, 2002 1:06 pmPosts: 7037Location: Land of Chill

Quote:

since I plan to start participating in tournaments with DE I'll need some hint on what to drop.

It may happen, but often its pretty lame when it comes to troop choices. And its not like Dark Eldar really have that many options to begin with. If you feel you need to mix it up though, take a few shredders instead - useless as they are - or give your succubus some extra cheap gear.

Quote:

Secondly are the Warp beasts any good? I thought of them as a secondary force which will be deployed on a corner and move towards the enemy probably assaulting in the second turn.

Yeah, pretty good. On the charge you get 20 S4 attacks plus 3 more with an agonizer from the beastmaster. Its nothing to ignore, especially when they assault 12". Only problem is they are vulnerable to shooting and prolongued assault, so attacking terminators may look like fun, but its normally a bad idea. They do excessively well against many eldar units and guard and space marine scouts (anything with a 4+ or worse AS that doesn't have a million attacks back of its own) and moderately well against stuff like 10 man tactical squads (you generally take down 3 on the charge). Used together with wyches or with one another and it can be outright rude.

Quote:

Third the helion skyboard > reaver jetbike on the Archite? Or should I just get rid of it?

You're likely better off dropping it and as Kargan said just adding the archite to a wych unit. After all, deep striking won't help you, you can't make much use of the increase in AS and you have no use for the jink save, so there's not really any point. The jetbike is just counterproductive and the extra toughness won't help you (you're more liable to get killed via instant death, which is the same on or off the jetbike) and you end up losing an attack.

Quote:

I think all the unit of wyches are too small to last long.

I've always had really good success with small units of wyches. No, on their own they can't take on nasty things like unit of terminators, but that's why you have more of them. A pair of them together will do a very large amount of damage (the agonizers alone will do quite a bit).

I played in a tournament a couple weeks ago and my unit of 6 wyches first took out a unit of dire avengers, then a unit of dark reapers, then went after and destroyed a wraithlord (agonizers are awesome ) and then finished off another unit of dire avengers before buying it to shooting from a unit of warp spiders.

All in all though, that list frightens me. 5 units of wyches, 2 units of warp beasts and then the 3 ravagers makes from a very fast, very hitty army that has a fair amount of anti-tank fire to back it all up.

__________________The storm is coming...Are you ready?

Tue Jun 03, 2008 1:56 am

Kargan daemonclaw

Highborn

Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 8:16 pmPosts: 734

It's funny, everyone evaluates the army effectivness against a mostly foot marine army.

Against a horde of nids or orks 3 wyches will bounce in and kill a few and then get eaten. You will need to be very careful to block out the units you want to kill and then conentrate your force onto 1-2 units at a time.

You need to be very careful about ravenwing and similar armies with lots of vypers and land speeders. Their gunships can blow you out of the sky.

You might want a warrior unit or two as support either a units with blasters and splinter cannons or a sniper unit with 2 dark lances. They can be more resilent than the open topped ravagers.

Tue Jun 03, 2008 2:45 am

Kristo

Noble

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2005 10:48 amPosts: 448Location: Athens

Hey everyone and thanks for your replies

Then I guess I can drop both helion and Haywire on Archite so I get 17pts free all in all my idea of the list was a maneuverable fast hth army with the maximum possible support from range.

So the main objective is similar with msu lists in wfb...many small units that cooperate with each other in order to succeed and all the main idea that msu style involves... but lets remain on topic and not get more into msu .

Therefore if this list as it is right now looks as menacing as possible my only problem would be were to spend those 17 pts left.

#List re-edited!

_________________'And lo, he shall rule with a dark hand and his shadow shall touch uppon every land.'

Single combat I await
My shadow brings them fear
The spikes upon my chariot
Will grind them when they're near...

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