Clear QAM and Limited Basic

I have Limited Basic service. Up until early this year, it worked flawlessly with my two HDTVs, both of which have clear QAM tuners. Since then, Comcast has apparently decided to move the channels around rather frequently, forcing me to rescan the channels periodically. Now I have a new problem: only about 15 channels show up. The local broadcast channels are missing completely. (I'm getting the shopping channels, some SD channels--but not the major network local broadcast, and one HD channel, WGN America.) It's no use calling customer service--they insist I have an analog TV and need a digital adapter to watch anything.

Has anyone else encountered this problem? Does anyone have suggestions about how to reach someone at Comcast who understands Clear QAM?

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

jacklx wrote:

I have Limited Basic service. Up until early this year, it worked flawlessly with my two HDTVs, both of which have clear QAM tuners. Since then, Comcast has apparently decided to move the channels around rather frequently, forcing me to rescan the channels periodically. Now I have a new problem: only about 15 channels show up. The local broadcast channels are missing completely. (I'm getting the shopping channels, some SD channels--but not the major network local broadcast, and one HD channel, WGN America.) It's no use calling customer service--they insist I have an analog TV and need a digital adapter to watch anything.

Has anyone else encountered this problem? Does anyone have suggestions about how to reach someone at Comcast who understands Clear QAM?

Oh they understand all right...

It looks like I will be in the same boat as you in the next week or two. "Thanks to Comcast", clear qam users will lose HD on local channels and have to watch them in SD using their DA's and remotes with yet another wall-wart to boot.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Looks like they decide that clear QAM is not in there best interest. Earlier this week they cut off all the clear qam channels. Not even a note or a warning and customer mis-service was of no help. I have no faith in Comcast to do anything but overcharge you for horrible service.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

I have a similar issue. I have been able to receive my Comcast limited basic service channels over a QAM tuner without issues for a couple years. That is until 2 days ago, when all of my channels (except for two random ones) disappeared - no signals whatsoever. A call to Comcast this morning resulted in the same as your call - they tell me I need a DTA box, because they can't troubleshoot otherwise. It appears as though Comcast has begun encrypting the signals, but I cannot find any articles or evidence that this has taken place. I'm in Chicago, FYI.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

What I have to wonder is why a Comcast rep has not entered into this Subject, as it appears to be happening in multiple locations and therefore not likely to be an individual operator screwing things up? I have heard of several location where Comcast is indeed encrypting local/basic channels, but as far as I know the FCC has not issued them the authority to encrypt them all. I was also under the impression that when/if Comcast does encrypt them, they would be supplying customers with uDTAs (that are like the existing DTA, but handle HD and have an A/V output along with the RF output)

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Comcast's Web site is very clear about this: you DO NOT need any extra equipment if you have a TV with a Clear QAM tuner. http://customer.comcast.com/help-and-support/cable-tv/using-a-digital-tv-with-qam-tuner/ The last update was on June 18, 2012. If they've changed their policy, they need an update. I don't even get the SD versions of local broadcast channels... but I still get SOME channels, and I even get one HD channel. Go figure. I'm not a big TV watcher... I have Limited Basic because it's cheaper to get Internet service bundled with Limited Basic than to get Internet service by itself.

Maricor > No need to worry. I am here to provide you with excellent customer service today. I will do my best to pin point what the problem is and work on getting this fix for you.

Maricor > Just to verify, may I know when did this started, please?

Me > This evening. There was a "glitch" in service last night and according to comcast forums this is happening elsewhere

Maricor > I understand.

Maricor > Is there an error message on your screen when you access on your HD channels, please?

Me > no. i rescanned, since there was no picture, and it actually skipped the channel because of no signal

Maricor > we are going to perform some troubleshooting steps, will this be okay with you?

Me > yup

Maricor > May I have the serial number of the affected box so we can work on the correct equipment, please? Serial numbers can be found on a white sticker at the back/bottom of the device and usually starts with M or T followed by a series of numbers and letters.

Me > nope. no boxes here. i have limited basic and up until tonight i was receiving local hd channels just fine. i sincerely hope comcast is not phasing these out

Me > and forcing LIMITED BASIC customers to rent a box

Me > i only have this subscription because its actually cheaper to have my internet with it.

Maricor > Would you mind waiting for 2 minutes while I research some information in my system in order to better serve you?

Me > please do

Maricor > Thank You.

Maricor > While waiting, let me share with you one of our free services-- Comcast CustomerCentral. You will not only be able to view and pay your bill online but you can also check Service Health Status for outages in all lines of services. Service Appointment Management is also available in Customer Central where you may reschedule or cancel appointments ( except installation appointment ).

Maricor > Upon checking our system, your area is ongoing Digital migration. This is about government-mandated Digital Transition Program requires that all broadcast television stations must switch from analog to digital technology to transmit their signals. This is the reason why you are losing certain channels or not getting any channels at all on your TV that does not have a cable box.

Maricor > No need to worry,. We are providing FREE DTAs. DTA (Digital Transport Adapter) has no access to On Demand, PPV, premium but it will give you a digital quality picture for your Limited and Expanded Basic channels ( usually channels 2 - 99 ).

Me > but i have the required built in HD Tuner that is QAM. i shouldn't need a box. especially when the boxes are built for CRT tv's and the picture is horrible on all of my QAM/HD built in tuner tv's

Me > it's a digital picture, which i have those now, and they are not even close to the hd

Me > i know it's not your fault but it's ridiculous. this is comcast's service link

Me > customers should be notified that they'll need these awesome boxes that don't provide the picture for LOCAL hd programs

Me > so we can move service

Maricor > That is good that you have the QAM tuner, however, the advantage of having the Adapter is we can troubleshoot your issue when you have channel or reception problems by sending a signal to the Adapter.

Me > personally i don't care about the troubleshooting. its the limited basic.... if anything it's a service area issue that i won't need help with. i might as well go get digital antennaes and save money

Maricor > I understand, actually, there is no additional charge on your bill by having the Adapter, since it is for free and no monthly rental charge.

Maricor > As of the moment, you may try to unplug the coax cable cord connection from the wall and plug back again after 2 minutes.

Me > i understand. it's digital and not hd..

Me > so basically i might as well end my tv subscription with comcast, move internet to customer link for a third of the price, and buy antennaes for my tv's.

Me > like i said i know its not your fault but comcast should've updated their qma service page and notified people so they can weigh options

Maricor > The announcements has been posted online, on your bill and on newspaper ads, last year. Since it was mandated by the government since last year though, it did not take effect at the same time on all areas.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

I had the TV hooked up to an indoor antenna and just switched that to a direct connection to cable. I changed the input on the TV menu to cable and rescanned the channels. The rescan didn't find any channels. I have seen some posts saying that the cable modem needs to be power cycled when switching to a direct connection to a clear QAM tuner. I'll try that tonight.

I have a DTA that I planned to use with an older TV. I didn't expect to have to use it with this new TV.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

So glad I found this thread as I thought I was nuts. I called Comcast 3 times and they were just clueless with what I was referring to in the issue. I have limited basic and it worked fine with my 2 QAM tuners up until around Sunday 9/23. Now one TV can't pick up the signal and the newer 19inch says 'scrambled'.

Called Comcast and they were just useless. I said 'something changed', they said sir we need to check connections and the existing adapters (on my analog TVs). I said - well I took the 19inch to the garage and plugged it into the cable direct and all it says is 'scrambled'. She said I don't know how those channels were getting through, but we didn't make any changes. She proceeded to try to sell me digital cable for an extra 9.95 a month plus 9.95 for each digital box. YAY COMCAST and it's monopoly.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

I power cycled the modem and rescanned the channels and it found a whole bunch of channels.

But now if I tune to a limited basic channel I get a message on my TV that says "If you can see this message, the TV you're watching isn't yet ready for Comcast digital network enhancements"

I called Comcast and the tech said that I need a box or DTA for all TVs no matter what service I receive. I asked if all of Comcast's website FAQs and other info listed for the digital transformation was wrong about the Limited Basic not needing a DTA and he said "yes, it was wrong. All TVs need some kind of box now."

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

I power cycled the modem and rescanned the channels and it found a whole bunch of channels.

But now if I tune to a limited basic channel I get a message on my TV that says "If you can see this message, the TV you're watching isn't yet ready for Comcast digital network enhancements"

I called Comcast and the tech said that I need a box or DTA for all TVs no matter what service I receive. I asked if all of Comcast's website FAQs and other info listed for the digital transformation was wrong about the Limited Basic not needing a DTA and he said "yes, it was wrong. All TVs need some kind of box now."

My service is in San Rafael, CA.

If the local channel you are tuning to is an analog channel then indeed you aren't going to have that channel available much longer. That would be something like channel 4 (an analog channel indicator), however, you should not get that message on channel 4.1 (a digital channel indicator). To see channel 4 you would indeed need a DTA to convert the digital channel and output it to an analog tuner (which would be set to channel 3 on your TV).

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

@nscribner - Are you getting NJTV (channel 23)?

My complaint to Comcast via their website resulted in a long email replay with no useful information. It said that NJTV was on channel 23. Duh. I knew that. The email suggested that it may be connection problem. Uh no, because I get all the other channels crystal clear. The email also suggested reseting the converter box. Uh, did that twice by rescanning my TV's tuner. Channel 23 is showing up as "scrambled".

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

With the digital migration Comcast does not broadcast any analog channels. The channels 2,3,5,7 etc are all digital but not in HD. HD channels are not available on the Limited Basic plan.

The website you provided a link to says "If you have a Digital QAM tuner, you don’t need a digital device to view limited basic cable channels."

This is false. I have a digital QAM tuner and I cannot view limited basic cable channels. The Comcast tech even said that the information on the websites is false and that they have been getting many calls about it.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Update here... The day after my previous post, I rescanned my channels once again, and this time my channels magically reappeared, all in the same positions. Something changed on Comcast's end, now everything seems to be back to normal here for the time being. The following day, I picked up and activated a DTA from Comcast just to have it around for the next time this happens. If I lose my QAM channels, I'll hook up the DTA. If I get channels over the DTA, I'll know that Comcast is messing with (or finally removing) the QAM signals. If I get no channels over the DTA, I can call Comcast and have them send a signal to the DTA for troubleshooting. Just to clarify the DTA pricing, i learned that if you only have a limited basic subscription, you're entitled to two DTA's at no cost. If you have a digital cable package, the DTA's cost $1.99 a month.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

rbuss12 - This is similar to the verbal conversation I had with my Comcast rep. They don't understand anything technical; they just read things off a sheet. The loss / encryption of QAM signals has absolutely nothing to do with the government-mandated "digital transition," as your rep stated. The government only mandated that the old analog TV frequencies be freed up for other uses.

As another example of their lack of knowledge, I actually argued with my rep (and finally just gave up), because she kept telling me a DTA would "convert my analog signal to digital." I kept telling her she had that backward, but she continued to argue. If they aren't knowledgeable of the basic functionality of the equipment they provide, there's no way they will be able to help with QAM tuners. It is unfortunate and very frustrating to be more knowledgeable than the person trying to assist you, but Comcast doesn't care to educate their support staff, because that would mean they actually need to pay them an honest wage.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Anon - Completely 100% agree with you. That's why i had mentioned twice that i know its not the rep's fault, cuz they are just reading off a script, but c'mon, give them a base understanding. I purchased an antennae this morning, cheapy just to see what a cheap one will do, and will have it in place hopefully tonight. I'll post back with my findings.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Here in San Jose similiar problems with limited basic. For the last few years we have received digital channels (CBS, ABC, FOX, KQED, etc...) with our TV that has a QAM tuner. In the last week we lost NBC when the digital migration happened. Called Comcast and said I needed a box. Received the box yesterday: a digital to analog adapter. Requires you to tune TV to channel 3 so everything is SD. Called Comcast and asked why we were no longer seeing digital channels. One Comcast rep said our previous digital channels were being received by our TV's internal antenna. The next rep told me limiited basic no longer includes HD channels. I would have to upgrade to a higher level service. The third rep understood the problem but could not explain why the web site says limited basic subscribers with QAM tuners do not need any additional equipment. Comast has serious problems with the digital migration. Why has Comcast not updated their website to address all the confusion? All the Comcast reps are greatly confused about digital vs. analog.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Lost mine last night here in NH, started out early yesterday with channels shifting their numbers. This morning we were down to 3 or 4 working channels, mostly duplicates. Upon re-scanning, all the channels were gone. Only reason I was keeping basic cable was for PBS (kids shows), time to go try out some antennaes and save the last $20 or so bux a month.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

My own support request, my survey feedback at the end. I would use an antenna if I could....signals don't deal well with the woods/hills of NH (and lack of broadcasting stations doesn't help either)

Problem: I have a digital TV with a built in QAM tuner, I've been using this to view Limited Basic channels without a DTA. Last night the channels appeared to have rearranged and this morning all the channels were gone after a rescan.

Me > My Issue: I have a digital TV with a built in QAM tuner, I've been using this to view Limited Basic channels without a DTA. Last night the channels appeared to have rearranged and this morning all the channels were gone after a rescan.

Sanny Jay > Just a quick recap before we end the chat. We have isolated the concern and I informed you all about the QAM tuner support and the need for a DTA box.

Sanny Jay > It was truly a pleasure to chat with you today. We value and appreciate your business!

Sanny Jay > Thank you for choosing Comcast as your cable TV provider. Our goal is to provide you with excellent service. If you need further assistance, you can chat with one of our Customer Support Specialists 24 hour a day, 7 days a week at http://www.comcastsupport.com/videochat. To close this chat, click the exit chat button on the upper right corner of the chat window, to rate the interaction we have done today. Thanks in advance. Have a great day ahead!

The support chat itself was fine and the support representative was courteous and prompt. I have a feeling that some of my questions were being slightly dodged due to the answers that I would need to be given.

Mostly since the answer/solution to my problem was less than ideal. It appears that locally the OTA signals are no longer being broadcast over the line. This means that I can no longer tune Broadcast HD channels through my HDTV with a built in QAM tuner. This is contradictory to the documentation provided on the public support documentation which I understand needs to be updated. Living in a remote area, these channels were not available via antenna. The only options outlined were that I would either need to use a free DTA at reduced service (Standard Def only), or that I might have the privilege of paying more for an HD DTA if my market carries them.

I feel that Comcast as a corporation is taking advantage of customers where their only option to receive basic services is through them. A decision was made that would impact services in a manner where customers would need to pay extra to receive the services they are accustomed to and were expecting when originally signing up. The changes are made without notice to the customer and without even correcting the contradictory documentation available publicly on the support site.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

I have limited basic + HD only, and as of yesterday, 2 tv's stopped receiving local channels in Orinda, (NoCal).

I called and they will send 2 DTA's.

I assume the DTA will degrade service to lower quality (?).

I have another TV on the HD box - It's fine.

I have another TV, no box, but it gets the HD 2.1, 5.1, 7.1 etc.

That sounds like the two TVs that stopped working have analog tuners and Comcast in your area is no longer sending out analog channels. Thus requiring QAM (digital tuners) to receive the channels.. DTA indeed will decode SD channels, and put them onto an RF analog freq. (channel 3 or 4) to be used on a TV with an analog tuner.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Any technical experts out there?

So I've posted a bunch up above, but now after sucking it up and going to get two new boxes, I'm finding that while my living room HDTV has lost its channels, the one in the bedroom is fine without a box. I may have to swallow some humble pie if it turns out they did not cut off my signals, but that I have an actual technical issue with my wiring.

Anyway, I fire up my living room TV, and dig through the menus, there is a signal quality option. Looks like my QAM is expectedly pretty crappy. The thing is, I can run internet off this line just fine. Also, using the DTA on this line, I can get standard def.

Does anyone know what kind of signals are being transmitted and for it to be possible to have a signal drop only affect one tv but not another, or even the internet? Is it possible for this signal to just eventually die? I have tried swapping out splitters, removing splitters, swapping out some of the wires (between the splitter and the tv, have yet to try swapping the wall to tv wire).

Incidentally, one of the boxes I picked up was an HD box and it simply would not activate on the living room connection. I have yet to try the bedroom where the TV is working fine.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Humble pie served and eaten. My TV has a "fast on" function where it never fully turns off, it simply goes into a low power sleep mode. I ran a factory reset, which requires a power cycle and an unplug/plug. Rescanned after and all my channels are back. I can only guess that the built in tuner never restarts and was feeling the heat of running for too long. Either that or the firmware in my TV is junk and needed a factory reset to "clear things out".

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Believe me, rescanning was the first thing I did. Over 72 hours I ran about 10 different rescans and the only fix for my situation was the full TV factory reset + unplug + final rescan. Its unlikely that my problem is what others are experiencing, but I thought I'd share. If anyone thinks that this may be their problem, the TV I experienced this on is an older Toshiba Regza 42RV530U. I believe most of the Regza TV's share at least a portion of their firmware.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

I also receive the limited basic channels on my clear channel QAM tuner except for the two PBS channels 2.1 and 44.1, which I lost on or about 10/12/12. I've had four calls into Comcast where they keep telling me I need a DTA, one person advised me to rescan, which I have done many times to no avail. Another comast rep blamed the PBS station in Boston. She said they had tweeked their digital signal format. I reached a broadcast engineer at PBS who, as I expected, said they had not changed anything in the signal format and that I should be still receiving the channels. The only issue with PBS is that Boston PBS is aligning their program content with NH PBS. Comcast has been dropping NH PBS from Massachusetts cable. In fact we lost that about a year ago. Comcast can do that because NH is out of market but we live in the Boston broadcst market.

Thus far no one at Comcast can explain why I lost 2.1 and 44.1. They sent a technician out to the house and as expected he found nothing wrong with the setup since Its just a cable going into the TV.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

Updating my previous post... Bought a $10 RCA antennae from Best Buy and I actually gained 2 channels (non-local). But I do have all of my locals and then some. Soooo me thinks I'm dropping the cable and going with what I know is sticking around. Just an FYI that the TV will need to have a built in HD tuner.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

I'm the original poster, with an update...

It turns out that in my area (Central NJ), Comcast is still delivering limited basic channels unencrypted. My problem was that I had a bad signal, due to a filter that was put on my line back in 1999 when I first had cable Internet service installed. A technician came today and removed the filter, and I have 56 digital channels via ClearQAM.

In order to get this problem solved, however, I had to get an HD set-top box from my local Comcast service center. The Comcast tech support person on the phone told me that without a box, I could not get even limited basic channels. She was puzzled that I was receiving any channels (I was getting about 15, but none of the local broadcast stations). So I got the set-top box (it's supposed to cost $2.15 per month). Even with the set-top box, I still wasn't getting any of the local broadcast channels. In fact I was getting the same channels I was getting with the ClearQAM connection. When I called Comcast to report this, they set up an appointment for someone to come to the house. I showed the tech the problem (using the set-top box), and he immediately knew what it was. It took just a couple of minutes to fix it. After he left, I hooked the cable directly to my HDTV, had it rescan the channels, and 56 digital channels--including the local broadcast HD stations--showed up.

I'm keeping the the HD set-top box, even though (for now at least) I don't need it. Comcast will not take problem reports seriously unless you have a set-top box. If it's really only $2.15 per month (I haven't received a bill since getting it), it's probably worth it. The box offers a few features that aren't available with a ClearQAM connection: there's a program guide, some video on demand (including some free on-demand movies), and a few music channels. It does seem to convert everything (including the SD channels) to 1080i.

Everyone I dealt with at Comcast was polite and friendly and tried to be helpful. Unfortunately, Comcast hasn't given any of them adequate training on ClearQAM. Even the tech who came to the house said, "you need a box to get anything."

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

When things were analog, traps are used to block certain TV frequencies or bands of frequencies from entering the home. That is for limited basic TV subscribers, subs with HSI & limited basic, or HSI only.

Now that systems are going 100% encrypted digital, these traps are no longer needed but are not removed unless the trap is blocking a frequency band that is needed for service to the house. Comcast is not going around removing the traps just for fun, only when there's an issue.

Re: Clear QAM and Limited Basic

I'm in Oregon. Yesterday, when I returned from a recent trip, I found all of the HD channels were gone from my Limited Basic Cable service. After a call to Comcast support, where I spoke with a totally clueless "tech", I started Googling and found this forum and learned about the digital migration. I tried rescanning for channels but only analog channels were found. My LG TV has a QAM tuner and I don't use a converter or cable box; I just connect the cable directly to the TV.

After reading this thread, I tried unplugging my TV for a few minutes this morning, powered it back up, and rescanned again. All of my local HD channels reappeared and I cancelled my service appointment.