Re: [mythsoc] What we're all about, I guess ... ?

OK, Here I go... I have a book called The Ultimate Encyclopedia of Fantasy, in which our beloved genre is defined as being the fiction of the heart s

Message 1 of 6
, Aug 29, 2000

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OK, Here I go...

I have a book called "The Ultimate Encyclopedia of Fantasy," in which our
beloved genre is defined as being the "fiction of the heart's desire." I
like this definition, vague, but how does one define fantasy without either
being vague or writing 3 pages, in fact what would all of you define fantasy
as being? I am curious. Anyway, a writer of fantasy who I can not place
also stated that the purpose of fantasy is to "heal the wasteland."

The way I see it, fantasy is an embellishment of what one might fantasize
about. There are times when morbid fascination draws us to a darker, less
positive form of fantasy, suggesting hopelessness or apathy, yet consider
the very act of expressing all of this into a well written piece? Is this
masterful and creative action not contradictory to this "pointlessness of
life" frame of mind? Not that I am saying one should not write about such
topics and call them fantasy, much to the contrary; we escape hopelessness
in doing so. It is the ultimate irony, for the expression of hopelessness
to lead to the discovery of hope. When one merely enjoys a story- dark or
otherwise, one proves to oneself there is SOMETHING worthwhile, if nothing
else one knows this unconsciously.

I think of fantasy as being the ultimate celebration of humanities most
vital and defining quality: imagination. It is through the use of this
sacred source, and the accompanying tool of creativity, that all may find
salvation in one place or another. Hope is always there, we have but to
keep the strength to look and we shall see it. If it is a sad story or a
depressing song that we can identify with to show us this, all the more
potent the lesson could be. All are inspired in different ways, but all are
inspired. One has only to acknowledge that one has eyes with which to see,
and one can look. Fear for the worst may attract the attention towards that
which one fears, but through the eyes that inevitably seek new inspiration,
and therefore we always have the potential to turn things around. It is
creativity and divine inspiration that pair together when we read fantasy or
enjoy any creative medium, for it is a glimpse into the human spirit.

In conclusion, as long as one writes, as long as one creates, it is
positive. If there is some sort of interest in an area at all, explore it,
for the fact that one can give existance to the exploration is proof enough
of ultimate salvation.
From: ERATRIANO@... <ERATRIANO@...>
To: Mythsoc@egroups.com <Mythsoc@egroups.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 29, 2000 5:13 PM
Subject: [mythsoc] What we're all about, I guess ... ?

>
>Hi, I have a few sort of questions all muddled together. The premise

driving

>them, I suppose, is that, for some of us, the mythie/writing life has at
>least loosely Christian underpinnings. Whether one is strictly Christian

or

>generically looking towards the Light, are there certain fundamental
>guidelines we should look to be following? Or something like that...
>
>One question is related to Sheri S. Tepper and authors, the other is more
>related to writing. I will set them both out below, as beset (typo, but oh
>how appropriate), I mean as best as I can:
>
>1. We've discussed Tepper a little bit, and offlist one kind soul has told
>me a little more about her personality. I'm wondering a little whether I
>want to encourage an interest, in myself or others, in literature and

thought

>that says that ultimately, we are on a downward spiral. (Not that I don't
>like her books; they are haunting.) I am not sure whether that furthers
>depressive thought or jars one to break the bad habits now. I hope this
>question make sense. Probably I should read more "dark" fantasy to fuel

this

>query, because maybe it could help.
>
>2. Taking this argument over to the writing life. Some of us feel that

life

>IS ultimately futile, that maybe there ISN'T a God or any of the good stuff
>we write about and hope to be true. Is it then hypocritical to write as if
>it were? Or is it the working of the Will over the Emotions, so to speak?
>
>thanks,
>
>Lizzie
>
>The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
>

<< Some of us feel that life
IS ultimately futile, that maybe there ISN'T a God or any of the good stuff
we write about and hope to be true. Is it then hypocritical to write as if
it were? Or is it the working of the Will over the Emotions, so to speak?

>>

As I thought about how to answer this, I recalled the answer Puddleglum made
to the Green Witch in "The Silver Chair." Paraphrasing from (too distant)
memory, I recall him saying something like "even if life were meaningless and
there were no God, it's a better thing to believe that there is, because it
gives life a joy and meaning otherwise unattainable." (Lewis, of course,
expressed the idea much more eloquently; go read the passage.)
However emotionally appealing that point of view may be, however, I find it
intellectually unsatisfying (he says, rudely snatching away the warm, soft
comforter he had just handed her). For even if all the world felt otherwise,
God would still be God. Our feelings cannot dent that titanic truth any more
than a flea can knock over a mountain. I have never been able to derive the
comfort others can from sentiments like "the meaning is in the myth," or "the
journey is what matters, not the destination," or " it doesn't matter whether
there is anything real to hope in or for, as long as we hope." These all
sound totally bizarre to me. If the object of our hope isn't real, then what
is hope but self-delusion? A journey without a destination is not a journey
at all, but a mere lost meandering without purpose or direction. A myth that
expresses no reality is simply a lie, for every myth claims to embody
reality. We only call it myth from the outside.

That's why Lewis' concept of Christ as the myth that really happened has such
resonance for me. As an ex-Pagan, I had just spent the last ten years looking
for some truth in world mythology, but none of it connected to the world we
all live in. The gods and goddesses all seemed like characters in a fantasy
novel. To think of any of them as having created the world seemed as silly as
praying to Elbereth and expecting an answer.But only in Christ do we have
both the numinous wonder and mystery that delights us in myth, plus the
historical reality and dependable, comforting reassurance we need when our
feelings tell us life is hopeless and without meaning.

Anyway, I hope something in all this helps. Feelings come and go; but if your
house is built on the rock of settled conviction, then the worst storms of
emotion will break against it in vain.

<< A journey without a destination is not a journey at all, but a mere lost
meandering without purpose or direction. A myth that expresses no reality is
simply a lie, for every myth claims to embody reality. >> And so on.

Thanks, Solarion (whatever do I call you?) You make total sense to me. It's
just hard to sustain that train of thought, at least for me. Religion and
marriage are both things that may be generated by emotion but must be
sustained by the will. However, the day to day presence (more or less) of
the house and other reminders of the DH kind of make sustaining a marriage a
little easier than sustaining the mental structure of religion, unless one is
in community routinely, which I am not. I found _Surprised by Joy_ to be
very good a number of years ago, but what I found to be absolutely pivotal
was Williams' Arthuriad, in the yellow Erdman edition with the accompanying
essay(s?) by Lewis (to enable one to navigate and understand). Perhaps a
rereading of that would be good, and some more Gerard Manley Hopkins.

Oh, and by the way, does anyone recall where that "healing the wasteland"
quote is from? It rang a bell, a dim underwater one perhaps, but a bell
nonetheless.

Lizzie

Christine Howlett

... lost ... is ... Yet I can imagine that a myth that expresses the best that we know and can imagine might well be worth living up to. Faith is a difficult

Message 4 of 6
, Aug 30, 2000

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>
>LSolarion@... wrote:
>
><< A journey without a destination is not a journey at all, but a mere

lost

>meandering without purpose or direction. A myth that expresses no reality

is

>simply a lie, for every myth claims to embody reality. >> And so on.
>

Yet I can imagine that a myth that expresses the best that we know and can
imagine might well be worth living up to. Faith is a difficult thing to
hold on to, and sometimes I have to just remember that every beautiful and
good thing I know can be encompassed by God. But only the sterner beauties
can be encompassed by atheism. Until God wills to help my unbelief again.
No one willingly journeys to a place of bitterness and sorrow if you can
hope for a better destination.
Christine

Julia Palffy

Christine Howlett wrote: Faith is a difficult thing to hold on to, and sometimes I have to just remember that every beautiful and good thing I know can be

Message 5 of 6
, Aug 31, 2000

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Christine Howlett wrote:

"Faith is a difficult thing to
hold on to, and sometimes I have to just remember that every beautiful and
good thing I know can be encompassed by God. But only the sterner beauties
can be encompassed by atheism. Until God wills to help my unbelief again.
No one willingly journeys to a place of bitterness and sorrow if you can
hope for a better destination."

It's Jesus - God - who encompassed atheism, and not just beauty and
goodness, when he cried out on the Cross "My God, my God, why have you
forsaken me?" AND he held on to faith by tagging on "Into your hands I
commend my spirit". He does not take the struggle to overcome disbelief away
from us - otherwise there would be no virtue in faith - but HE willingly
went through the deepest bitterness and sorrow to show us the way that goes
right through it to the best destination of all.

I've been thinking a lot about the classical ancient mythologies on the one
hand, and the Bible on the other. If you consider the world through the
"lens" of the old myths, and then read the stories of Abraham or Moses, the
Bible sounds as subversive a "myth" as one could possibly imagine - the most
subversive part of it being that it came true. It's as if God gave us the
power of imagination to participate in shaping the world (he makes us
co-creators, as Tolkien wrote), and then keeps challenging our imagination
by doing things we would never have dared to dream of, as if to say:
"Imagine something still better!"

When you talk about writing Christian fantasy, what does the expression mean
for you? "Christianise" old myths? Express Christian beliefs in the guise of
fantasy? Or, starting from a Christian point of view, create new myths? How
far do you think the stories we invent may shape the world we live in, today
and tomorrow?

<< When you talk about writing Christian fantasy, what does the expression
mean
for you? "Christianise" old myths? Express Christian beliefs in the guise of
fantasy? Or, starting from a Christian point of view, create new myths? How
far do you think the stories we invent may shape the world we live in, today
and tomorrow? >>

Hi Julia,

I'm so rusty I'm not sure any more. LOL. What I like to write is fiction
and poetry that sees the world with the light of God's creation blazing
through it. I mean, IF there's a God, but that's my problem, not the
literature's. So it can mean working with popular older myths, or elements
from them (after all, I think everything's been done to some extent, pretty
much); or it can mean taking totally modern people and conflicts and trying
to search out how to work through them to a happy ending (I personally prefer
them) involving aesthetically pleasing spirituality. To put it succinctly
and disrespectfully. I have in my fiction a "creation myth" which hasn't
been tested against any authorities to see if it can be a "good Christian
fantasy one," and a few creatures. I just need stronger plotting. LOL

I liked _Canticle for Leibowitz_ but it's been Years. I did find Lewis'
Space Trilogy to be more than a tad far-out. The coffin full of rose petals,
especially.

I agree that "true Christianity" has to include the starkness and darkness.
I used to get a great little periodical called "Weavings" but I wasn't making
time to read it so I discontinued the subscription. From time to time it
dealt with the wasteland periods. Maybe if I read it more I wouldn't be in
this one now!

I tend to ramble, so i will sign off now, wondering if I've said anything.

Lizzie

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