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For Zenyata his ultimate could be changed to have two forms, the current healing version would be his ultimate when his healing done is greater than his damage done (includes all damage amplification his discord orb has caused). However, when his damage is greater (includes damage done by allies to disorded targets) than his healing done his ultimate changes, instead Zenyatta becomes shrouded in a pulsating vortex of darkness, his move speed becomes 50% of normal, and he gains an AOE (equal in size to his healing aoe) around him that deals damage to all enemies in it for the duration. Furthermore Zenyatta is not invincible during his ult but rather takes 100% increased damage from all sources.

OK, so turn Zenyatta - who is already slow with no mobility - into a literal sitting duck, moving half as fast so enemies can easily avoid him, and taking twice as much damage so his fragile 200 HP is effectively 100 HP and he can be one-shotted by half the roster?

Makes sense.

You're effectively turning Zen's ult into a guaranteed death sentence. Sorry, but I see that as another terrible idea.

"How do I get rid of a Trojan Horse?" -Sailor_Kakashi"Leave it outside the gates of Troy overnight." -Davel23

What I meant was that his damage aoe would do damage at the same rate his current ultimate heals at. So he would be highly vulnerable while using it, but it would also have a massive damage output potential in a large aoe.

What I meant was that his damage aoe would do damage at the same rate his current ultimate heals at. So he would be highly vulnerable while using it, but it would also have a massive damage output potential in a large aoe.

I don't care how high the damage is, when he moves 50% slower than even the slowest hero and can die in one hit, he's worthless. He'll be dead before he can actually do any serious damage to anyone, while everyone easily clears away from him and avoids him. He can't shoot while ulting, so he is absolutely a sitting duck while everyone else can just shoot him at range. Even D.Va's pea shooter could take him out with zero risk.

Having an ult that eliminates your ranged attack, halves your speed and gives you no chance to escape, and doubles the damage you take, is an absolute death sentence. There's no way this would fly.

"How do I get rid of a Trojan Horse?" -Sailor_Kakashi"Leave it outside the gates of Troy overnight." -Davel23

I was thinking Zarya could bubble him, and Lucio could speed boost him in terms of character synergy.

That still makes him 100% non-viable unless he has one of those two heroes also on his team. Anyone picking Zen forces his team to take one or both of those.

What's more, Zarya's bubble lasts a whopping 2 seconds, so Zen is still guaranteed dead. Lucio's barrier adds a rapidly depleting shield, which will also be gone in no time, still leaving Zen a sitting duck. Lucio's speed boost doesn't double a hero's speed, even with Amp It Up, so that would be irrelevant - Zen would never be able to catch or kill anyone.

An ult like that is absolutely a death sentence for the ulting Zen. It just would not work.

"How do I get rid of a Trojan Horse?" -Sailor_Kakashi"Leave it outside the gates of Troy overnight." -Davel23

McCree's ultimate is currently him gazing upon enemies, and the longer he gazes upon them the more damage he thrusts into them.

McCree's new ultimate is he shouts "It's dusk to dawn" when he activates it, he becomes a pulsar of darkness. The longer an enemy gazes upon him the more damage he will do to them when he releases his ultimate. As long as McCree us visible anywhere on an enemy player's screen it counts towards ramping up his damage towards them.

While his ultimate is activate he gains +25% movement speed but he can use no abilities or attack (aside from releasing his ultimate channel to do damage).

McCree's ultimate is currently him gazing upon enemies, and the longer he gazes upon them the more damage he thrusts into them.

McCree's new ultimate is he shouts "It's dusk to dawn" when he activates it, he becomes a pulsar of darkness. The longer an enemy gazes upon him the more damage he will do to them when he releases his ultimate. As long as McCree us visible anywhere on an enemy player's screen it counts towards ramping up his damage towards them.

While his ultimate is activate he gains +25% movement speed but he can use no abilities or attack (aside from releasing his ultimate channel to do damage).

McCree's ultimate is currently him gazing upon enemies, and the longer he gazes upon them the more damage he thrusts into them.

McCree's new ultimate is he shouts "It's dusk to dawn" when he activates it, he becomes a pulsar of darkness. The longer an enemy gazes upon him the more damage he will do to them when he releases his ultimate. As long as McCree us visible anywhere on an enemy player's screen it counts towards ramping up his damage towards them.

While his ultimate is activate he gains +25% movement speed but he can use no abilities or attack (aside from releasing his ultimate channel to do damage).

What would be the point of this? a) It would make it even *easier* for enemies to avoid his ult, because they just look away from him - the whole "if I can't see you, you can't see me" fallacy. It's hard enough for McCree to get a solid kill with his ult these days too, as people just hide. b) How would this new ult logically fit with his persona? He's a cowboy with a six shooter. His ult is based on the Old West idea of superior gunmanship - if he focuses on a target, he's a deadeye. All of a sudden his ability makes no sense as something a cowboy would have? And c) does McCree's ult really need changing, especially when the changes don't really seem to have any point like this one, aside from making his ult even worse and not matching his persona?

"How do I get rid of a Trojan Horse?" -Sailor_Kakashi"Leave it outside the gates of Troy overnight." -Davel23