I meant the HF brands and I was not thinking about them having the genuine ViseGrip, which they do at a good price , but as far as the el-cheapo brands being ok for welding and clamping work I still have to disagree because my experience with the things is that they poorly made and tend to come apart, twist under the slightest pressure and bend out of shape when you need them to apply heavy clamping force which is sometimes needed.