Of course. The prohibition of Marijuana is, to anyone who would care to consider the facts, ridiculous. However I would take it a step back and say decriminalize it as oppose to legalize it, turn an under ground economy into a legitimate industry. That would be the most logical step.

Now you have to consider the "U.S." factor in all of this. Largest unprotected border with a drug crazed neighbor on the other side? You have to choose your steps wisely.

- Not a physically addictive substance. Some people may develop a psychological addiction to dope, but it has never been proven to be physically addictive.

- No person has ever been killed by an overdose of Marijuana, ever, reason being: You cannot.

- I can go to the store and buy a pack of Cigarette's which ARE both physically and psychologically addictive. Not to mention that -- while the numbers supporting this are inflated -- Smoking can kill you, and is known to be cancer causing.

- I can go to the store and purchase a giant bottle of alcohol which, if I was to drink the whole bottle in one sitting, would surely cause an overdose possibly death without medical attention. It is know to cause li...(continues)

Well, it isn't legal in Jamaica, and it isn't even a native crop. It was brought from India with the indetured servants, who revered it a a holy pant, much as the Rastafarian's do now. Lets not forget tourism. Their true economy is heavily Dependant on services. They also have a decent mining industry even though it took a hit in the 80's, bauxite I believe.

So I'm a little confused as to what your point is. Yes they may smoke a lot of pot. They also, at least in the early 90's, had the highest per capita debt in the world, at around 4 billion dollars. This would normally force any country into the 3rd world status. However because of Jamaica's legal and taxable export industries (farming, bauxite, tourism) they are able to stop the ...(continues)

Well let me join in then. I think it should be LEGAL. Very good reason made by the previous poster. For one, it has helped me concentrate on many activities, just getting my attention on it was the main problem.

2nd, I am not addicted to the substance, I have enjoyed it so far 7 times over the year.

3rd I seem to be least affected out of my buddies and I certainly don't go driving while under the influence. I know better, we all know better, and we plan the evening so that we don't have to go driving.

Common sense is my best friend, I abuse him sometimes, I forget him sometimes, but he will always be there during the important moments in life.

as a consummer, I really would be an horrible hypocrite if I didn't say I was against it. I must say though that I have no idea how you could drive high. I have been drunk and high (as almost everybody else) and if I had no choice but to choose between those two, I would prefer driving drunk. But really, I guess its only me being incredibly out of it when i'm under the effect.I use it mostly to go to sleep. It is one of te best relaxant availabe out there, it will reduce the level of stress and for somebody like me, who apparently is the nightmare of every chiropracticien, this is perfect.While I do understand that it is ridiculous to have something with so many positive effects illegal, I can also understand why I would wish my childre...(continues)

- Not a physically addictive substance. Some people may develop a psychological addiction to dope, but it has never been proven to be physically addictive.

- No person has ever been killed by an overdose of Marijuana, ever, reason being: You cannot.

- I can go to the store and buy a pack of Cigarette's which ARE both physically and psychologically addictive. Not to mention that -- while the numbers supporting this are inflated -- Smoking can kill you, and is known to be cancer causing.

- I can go to the store and purchase a giant bottle of alcohol which, if I was to drink the whole bottle in one sitting, would surely cause an overdose possibly death without medical

Alchohol is just as bad and destroys more lives each year than pot ever did yet it's legal. Tobaco kills people slowly and painfully yet it's legal. I'm not saying pot is good for you just that it's not as bad as these two. Now i don't smoke pot, tried it but didn't like it much. The only reason it is illegal is because historicly it's been a black drug and tabbaco is a white drug (yes it's racist but back at the turn of the century people were very racist and it was white people making the laws)

I never said I thought those two things didn't hurt people also. The thread was about marijuania not about cigs and booze. The majority of dope smokers are losers. Bottom line. They have nothing in their lives and go no-where. They are at home with their bong, smoking chit, eating cookies, and watching tv. very few have any ambition for anything else man. There not out climbling mountains and being a postive influence in anyones life. Smoking dope hurts people. They buy 40 bag after 40 bag at whatever cost. They dont realize how messeed up their lives are cause their brain is in a cloud of smoke.

No. most people that smoke pot don't smoke that often. They will smoke when out with friends or at a party. Not saying that there are dope heads that are always high but most people that smoke don't abuse it. It's like alchohol, some go home and live in their bottle but most just do it occasionaly.

The point that you're missing is that there are people who abuse alcohol all day long and yet that is legal. I suppose if someone made the same thread, only about alcohol, you would reply: "Alcohol destroys lives! make it illegal!!!"

If you don't then you are a hypocrite, if you do then your a puritan. Either way you're a moron.

I couldn't agree more. Every argument this person poses is more asinine then the one that preceded it.

Look, guy/girl. Pot heads don't sit at home and smoke pot. they work and they contribute. I don't know what corner of h3ll you live in that everyone who smokes pot sit at home. But where I live, (Canada) pot smoking is what you would consider "rampant" and basically everyone works contributes and some even achieve great things. Pierre Burton one of Canada's greatest minds was an avid pot smoker but only came out and said this toward the end of his career/life becasue of fear of prosecution. Did you ever consider the possibility that regular pot smokers are closet smokers? Living in fear because the weed is illegal?

"I can come to no other conclusion than that your are a vapid waste of space. And it is YOU who offer nothing to society but the perpetuation of lies and ignorance."

Considering what gunny wrote as a response to my last rant, I'm gonna take back this little bit here if possible. But would rather add that an indivdual expirence should not be offered up as objective view on a subject.

No, but there is such a thing as comparison, and most people use it to make a point. Comparing the relative harm pot may do against cigarettes and alchool, while keeping in mind that the laters are legal, is a valid point. Not that you could pick that up on your own, though...

Thus we can assume you know the majority of cannabis users. Oh wait. No...

I have a few possessions. I also have some very valuable things in my life, a nice family, a good education, a great health. Also we can assume from this sentence that cookies and TV are also evil. I like your logic.

Again, we must assume you know all of the cannabis users. I use it. I have a philosophy certificate in the work (even
...(continues)

gunny said:I never said I thought those two things didn't hurt people also. The thread was about marijuania not about cigs and booze. The majority of dope smokers are losers. Bottom line. They have nothing in their lives and go no-where. They are at home with their bong, smoking chit, eating cookies, and watching tv. very few have any ambition for anything else man. There not out climbling mountains and being a postive influence in anyones life. Smoking dope hurts people. They buy 40 bag after 40 bag at whatever cost. They dont realize how messeed up their lives are cause their brain is in a cloud of smoke.

Atavist Arise said:marijuana is not a judgement impairing drug either. if i'm drunk, i'm likely to throw inhibition to the wind, and go start a fight, or sleep with women at a bar i don't know.

Alchohol only takes feelings that were already inside you and helps them surface.

If you start a fight because your drunk, you were already an agressive person before you drank.. If you sleep with a random chick and you have a GF, you were already a man-whore before you drank, the alchohol only made it surface.

Ok this topic is stupid. If pot was legal so many people would be driving around stoned. The difference with alcohol is that you can give someone a breathalyzer if they are caught driving. If someone is stoned how are you supposed to test them?

You see everyone would NOT be driving around stoned. At least no more than are now. Remember, just because you legalize something does not mean everyone is going to use it. And even then it definitely doesn't mean everyone is going to throw common sense out the window. That argument makes no sense. I know many people who smoke pot and a good many of them will not get behind the wheel while stoned. Some have and do, but the majority do not feel comfortable driving while stoned.

The only part of your statement that holds water is saying that we can't test for it. Well we don't have anything you can breath into and we can get some kind of THC level. But also keep in mind, very little money has ...(continues)

Are you mentally deficient? Justice Studies???? What a dumb thing to say. All they are telling you are the reasons that the criminal justice system in the US "views" pot as a scheduled controlled substance. However if you ever thought about taking a sociology class that discusses drug/alcohol use and abuse patterns and legality you might be a little more bright when it comes to discussing these things.

This is not a stupid topic, unless you are simple enough to buy into the scare tactics and overwhelming mis-information the US government uses to keep drugs illegal. If you actually believe a substance that has NEVER caused cancer and is non-addictive should be kept illegal and you're swigging beer at your office Christmas party you should...(continues)

Oh please. I take Justice Studies, Socioloy, Psychology, and lots of other things. My opinion on this issue has nothing to do with the "harm" it does to someone's body. I've smoked my share of pot and that's not why I think drugs are retarded.

Well then Amy, please enlighten us as to what you are speaking of. With regards to your extensive knowledge of "Justice Studies", Psychology and Sociology. Also I would like to point out than the topic is strictly dealing with the decriminalization and/or legalization of Marijuana not 'drugs' in general, though we can go over that if you like. I'm not going to tell you what I took in University, because I don't want to spoil the surprise... but please, I'd love to hear your views on drugs.

Also in another post you wrote that you couldn't be bothered to read all that I have wrote on this topic but felt it necessary to call into question any background or knowledge I may or may not have then asking me to take a "justice studies class". If ...(continues)

Yes pot is a DRUG. Just get over it. Like I said before, I have my own opinion as to why I think drugs are retarded. About your comment about me not reading all the posts, I have better things to do than sit on the internet everyday for hours and sift through posts on a forum. I have better things to do. Go back to studying.

First off; I did not say Marijuana wasn't a 'drug'. I said the conversation was not about 'drugs', it was about pot. Notice how I use the term 'drugs' in the plural sense. Subtle; maybe, but if you miss things like that perhaps you should read things twice.

Secondly; It wouldn't take hours to read this whole thread, and if it does than you're illiterate and may I offer my condolences; And then point out again that if your not going to bother to read the entire thread why comment on it with blanket and asinine statements like "go study"?

Thirdly; You still have not offered up what was asked of you in the first response. If you could spare the time, I would love t...(continues)

And let us not forget that lumping everything into this one catagory you then need to include caffine..i.e. coffie,soda,and chocolate all are leagle and all are much more addictive and destrctive to socity then pot...

people who take sides against one kind of drug (illegal) who dont take the other are usually just about the craziest people you will ever meet, sometimes even crazier than people who take the side of illegal drugs but think asprin is a plot by aliens to infect out brain.

Well I am 6'1" and have only tried it a few times, I don't want to be any taller yet I still keep growing, of course I only started last year. I have always been a absent-minded lazy person and I still retain that ability (if you can call being lazy and absent-minded an ability).

I am not addicted to the substance and I will never be. I RARELY have it and only have it when having a fun night with the friends which is RARE in itself.

It is only illegal because THEY make it that way. The stuff grows in the ground and was put into existence for a reason. Everything in life has a purpose, banning most of it wastes it's potential. For all we know this substance may one day cure diseases, cancers, etc...

Did you ever take the time to consider why Pot is illegal? Don't you think that would be the proper thing to do before making a claim against me? Or do you just take everything your government tells you like a good boy or girl? Then proceeded to regurgitate it back at me like I'm going to do likewise? Before I start into this I encourage you to educate yourself. Now I'm not saying go out and smoke pot, that illegal right now, I'm just saying read...(continues)

If you read through this, congratulations. This was a pretty long one and were all proud of you little buddy.

Cheers.

First and most important, I love America and the freedom of the greatest country in the world!

Second: Nice post! you get an A++ in bullshit!

no really guy, nice post for real, very interesting reading no joke.Lets me just keep this simple Pot destroyed my life! This I can talk about and you can not attack. I wasn't able to get a decent job because I couldn't pass a drug test, I had to shop at the fat mans store cause I couldn't buy normal clothes, I drink and ate so much pop and sweets that my teeth are not what they should be. When ask to perform simple duties I was so high I would often make mis...(continues)

So what you're saying is that because you can't control your behavior you think the government should step in and protect you from yourself? Sorry but some of us like to enjoy some things in life without big brother telling us we can't.

I will also say I am not nor have I ever been a pot head. I've smoked pot probably less than 5 times my entire life. But the fact it is illegal is utterly ridiculous for reasons other posters have gone into detail explaining. Yes I've had friends who's lives are similar to yours when you were younger, but it had nothing to do with the legal status of drugs, they are just immature with no self-control who abuse everything, not just pot.

Good job turning your life around you deserve some kudos for that...(continues)

Ifyou know that "Pot doesn't destroy people lives, people do!!" Why are you still trying to make a case that pot destroyed your life? Buck up, be a man and admit that you let yourself slip when you smoked pot. It happens all the time, people make mistakes, but for you to advocate the illegality of this substance lends your support of the incarceration of THOUSANDS of people just for having pot or smoking it and commiting no other crime. What ruined those people's lives? Pot or bad legislation?

wow you know i used to smoke pot for about 10 years that was all i did but it didnt destroy my life. i am not calling you a liaer what i am saying is because you are screwed up dosnt mean it will screw up everyone

All that crap he spewed; you liked??? This coming from someone that says he hates Americans & then says; "No; I'm not serious. I was just kidding. And to top it all off. He says he's an adult??? Please. Give me a break. I'm sorry Gunny. But I have to agree with your 1st opinion on his lonnnnnnnnnng post. He gets an A+ in bull-$hit. And I love Everyone. Mat NOT like like some peoples' ways; but I do love them. Why??? Because the good LORD up above tells me I should. And I choose to listen to him; because he did SAVE my life many times when I was doing drugs & drinking. So I DON'T think they need to legalize marijuana. But that's just MHO.

Did you ever take the time to consider why Pot is illegal? Don't you think that would be the proper thing to do before making a claim against me? Or do you just take everything your government tells you like a good boy or girl? Then proceeded to regurgitate it back at me like I'm going to do likewise? Before I start into this I encourage you to educate yourself. Now I'm not saying go out and smoke pot, that illeg

Loser? Haha, way to counter my argument with that thought provoking post. You have really made me second guess everything I've held to be true with this one.

You’re an idiot and a pot head. I seriously doubt you ever quit smoking. I can tell by your post that you whole heartily believe the non-sense you spew. I won’t spend hours out of my day to try to convince a moron why he’s wrong. Don’t bother responding I will never care what a pot smoking loser has to say. Anyone with any common sense knows the drug is illegal for a reason. Good bye dumb ass.

If the world was a fair place, we would live in the same area. So we could get together so I could annihilate you at any challenge you put forward. Whether it be an IQ test, or just simply athletic ability, I am beyond confident that I would make a complete fool out of you. Then, and only then, the smug sense of satisfaction I would receive for watching you shuffle away with your head hung in shame would bring me relief from the blinding rage I am experiencing right now. You posts offer nothing to this debate but the ability, at every turn, to crush my skull with mind bending irrelevance to the topic at hand.

You don't have to spend hours out of your day son. It took me all of 20 minutes to type even my longest post, and that's INCLUD...(continues)

ZombieJ said:If the world was a fair place, we would live in the same area. So we could get together so I could annihilate you at any challenge you put forward. Whether it be an IQ test, or just simply athletic ability, I am beyond confident that I would make a complete fool out of you. Then, and only then, the smug sense of satisfaction I would receive for watching you shuffle away with your head hung in shame would bring me relief from the blinding rage I am experiencing right now. You posts offer nothing to this debate but the ability, at every turn, to crush my skull with mind bending irrelevance to the topic at hand.

You don't have to spend hours out of your day son. It took me all of 20 minutes to type even

It seems as though if someone disagrees with me the only thing they are capable of is hurling insults. Classy move guys. Classy move.Why don't you offer something up on the debate? Seriously, put something together that doesn't mention me directly and either counter what I and other have said or pose some new and insightful takes on counter culture.

It seems as though if someone disagrees with me the only thing they are capable of is hurling insults. Classy move guys. Classy move.Why don't you offer something up on the debate? Seriously, put something together that doesn't mention me directly and either counter what I and other have said or pose some new and insightful takes on counter culture.

The statements you make are beyond stupid guy. Most people who reply are laughing their asses off while replying to your stupidity.

The statements he makes are beyond stupid eh???? why? because he not only makes statements about what he believes BUT also backs them up with educated facts. But this makes him stupid??? WOW glad I dont live in bizzaro world with you, things must be strange there..........

I don't doubt they are "laughing their asses off". Just like they laugh when you dangle something shinny in front of them.

I don't how everyone can attack me yet not offer up one shred of evidence to the contrary. One statement that clearly rebuts anything I have posed. I'm not saying I'm the final voice on this topic, thats silly (and actually worth laughing at). Their are counter points to the evidence and opinions I have offered up here. But yourself, and a few select others, choose to not only disagree but to insult me.

Why not post something to counter my arguments? Seriously if you have half a clue on this subject --since you are wise enough to see the err of my ways surely you have something to offer?-- Try posting somet...(continues)

I'm guessing by your blatantly uneducated review of his fact based statements and superb argumentative ability that you were someone, who in high school teased the brain because he couldn't pick up women. Yet, after school was out that same brain could be found at your kitchen table tutoring you in remedial algebra. Don't worry though, most of the world can sympathize with you; they too have found someone more intelligent than themselves in their lifetimes. What separates you from them is your reaction.

know?- that should've been spelled no, that's a fairly easy one to distinguish within the English language. Name one thing you said in your very lame argument that doesn't apply to alcohol. I'm betting the house that you voted or at the very least supported Bush in this last election. That's off the subject but it's true isn't it.

Lets go this way. Pot is not harmfull to your body. Pot is not adictive. Yes pot is a judgment affecting and should not be taken while driving, working heavy machinary or at work. The reason he compares it to Alcohol is because it should be regulated like alcohol. It should be used responsibly but it should not be illegal.

Now instead of saying "NO" you must dispute my facts or my opinions and give reasons for it as i have. This is the way a debate works.

I hope you're not referring to me with the voting Bush remark. If so how could you confuse my VERY liberal social opinion with conservatism?

The reason I use alcohol in my "lame" arguments? I thought it was pretty obvious. In fact I laid it out in great detail over the course of several posts in this thread as to my views on why it should be legal and why it IS illegal right now. And I really cannot be bothered to do it again.

gunny said:you have know ****ing idea what you are talking about! Pot destroys lives. It's illegal for a reason. It makes you dumb, and you make poor choices while smoking it. some people start smoking that chit and can never get away from it.

Alcohol destroys lives. It's not illegal, but it should be. It makes you stupid and/or violent, and you make poor choices when you drink it and for a while afterwards. You may or may not remember what you've done. Some people start drinking that stuff, and can never get away from it.

gunny said:you have know ****ing idea what you are talking about! Pot destroys lives. It's illegal for a reason. It makes you dumb, and you make poor choices while smoking it. some people start smoking that chit and can never get away from it.

Who has no idea? I think it is you gunny. Where do you get your information? I am sure you are right wing pro-prohibition about everything. No one should have sex, do drugs, or do anything without first calling their congressmen and asking for approval. The fact that you actually believe that an herb that has been in use since before Jesus even walked the Earth is a 'dangerous' thing stipulates that you are incapable of making an educated comment on this subject. If...(continues)

I can't even be bothered to explain AGAIN why you're "opinions" on the world going to hell are wrong, I've done it too many times in this thread. In my humble opinion it's fascists like yourself that are making the world go to hell... but thats just my opinion..... fascist.

I think it will, unless the Tories get in power, become decriminalized in Canada. It is in a sense and has been for the last 2 years since the Supreme Court overturned a ruling against a 16 year old kid, and asked the Gov't to rewrite pot laws in 1 year. They didn't, and by default possession of small amounts of pot became punishable by only a fine, no effect on your record. Now thats in Canada. It is far more complicated in the U.S.A. I don't even want to get into it. Wait... yes I do... ah hahaha

I more or less layed out, albeit briefly, the time-line and reasons for the Prohibition movement in the 20's. The 20's you saw misinformation being spread by bigoted people in positions of power looking to keep the minority population in chec...(continues)

It could be, but it's continuing along the lines of this particular thread. Plus it was a response to mistermarler's post, that just set me off on yet another rant... That disgressed off topic then back on toward the end. I tend to do that from time to time.

I know this thread is old but I have to comment: It DOES destroy lives. I am a single mother of 2 small children now b/c of that drug. my husband chose smoking pot and spending our family money on that instead of food on the table, bills, etc...bear in mind please that I was the only one working b/c he was too stoned to do anything.

Before you go on making comments such as "it doesn't destroy lives"...you best sit down and talk w/ single mom/dads, and fatherless/motherless children...

actually, i cant speak to his character but chances are it was just him as a person if drugs didnt exist at all he would spend his money on glue instead of food, or huff gasoline. Or spend it on videogames... irresponsible people are irresponsible, marijuana or not.

But chances are with the kind of tone you took with that response, towards zombiej, you are carrying too much emotional baggage about your specific incident to think anything to the contrary...

I can only ask you this: why is that I am not allowed to voice my concern/opinions but you can?

I may not have noticed this thread before but it was there to comment on and I did...why can I not say anything about it, Alejandro?

there's alot of emotional baggage--you weren't there. I doubt my ex wld have the problems he did if he didn't smoke. he has so many wonderful gifts but is addicted to something that is destroying him and everyone around him. I ahve seen it 1st hand--you have not. But that is my opinion and I am entitled to it- right Alejandro? Just as you are...?

he was pointing out that someone stupid is going to find a way to destroy themselves one way or the other. if there was no marijuana he probably would be a drunk. he was just voicing his opinion, same as you are.

but seriously, start a new thread. I'm not gonna run over what everyone else said a year ago, with participants that are probably not even around anymore.

I understand the emotional baggage, and i was not there, but neither was zombiej and you dont need to take out your anger on him.

Lastly you said something like "Ask any single father/mother" and that doesnt make sense at all... all of a suggen all one parent households are that way because of pot? my mom raised my brother and i alone, but one was alcohol and the other was just a waste of space, no marijuana. But it could have been marijuana, loosers are losers, my mom had bad taste in guys.

Shweed should not be legalized. There would be no point to legalize it except to make a large portion of people happy..

If alchohol was not illegal right now, i would say the same for it, and same goes for cigs.

Alejandro, the bottom line is that sooo many more kids would be f*cked up if pot was legalized versus it staying illegal.. Alot of the reason soo many kids arent f*cked up as it is, is because weed is really hard to get for some kids, and even though they want to smoke it on a reg. basis, they cant get it, nor afford it. If it was legalized not only would it be a CAKE walk to get, but it would be really cheap.

That's fascist puritan thinking though. Freedom and choice are good, not bad. I disagree with your point but most of what you were talking about is prohibition, and prohibition is fascism.

Beyond making things that are "bad" for you illegal just because they are bad for you. And not everyone just wants to get f*cked up. If marijuana helps dying people ease their pain the federal government shouldnt be breaking into their house and putting a night stick in their ass.

Let it be known though that I am not Pro-Drug, they are for hippies and crackheads (literally) And i do not do drugs, I am just not pro drug law. I do not require my point of view to be legislated for an entire nation to be happy.

While were at it, lets let murder legal. I mean, murdering is for the crazy and insane (lierally) and i dont murder, i am just not pro-murder law. I do not requie my point of view to be legislated for an entire nation to be happy.

Whether you smoke or not, smokeing only causes harm for 95% of those who use it. Making it legal would only furhur f*ck those up that are already being f*cuked up by it.. Absoulty no good would come out of it..

MotoJoe22 said:People dont smoke weed to ease their pain. They do to get high. Therefore, it should stay illegal, unless perscriped by a doctor.

What sense does that make??? NONE!! If you only took substances to kill pain than WHY the HELL are you drinking ALCOHOL. Think about your statement and apply it to smoking cigarettes and drinking booze. NO more drinking for you unless you get a prescription. Quit being bias and really think about what you say and how you PUSH THEM on to others. Let people like you who do smoke pot be themselves and you can be yourself with out pressing your beliefs on others.

Did you even read what i said? You are ignorant to my view because you didnt even read what i wronte before that.. Dont jump into a conversation with the last thread somsone wrote.. I also said, if alchohol was illegal right now, it should stay illegal, but the fact is is that it is legal right now.. and hey, if someone could get a bill to pass a no alchohol law, i would honestly vote for it.. My arguement is that weed is only something that kids use to get high unless perscribed by a doctor, and therefore we would only be taking a step backwards to make it legal..

It does not make sense to take peoples freedoms away, if you take alcohol, tobacco, and weed away than what is stopping the government from taking freedom of choice away, i.e. right to contraceptives and an abortion. OR what about saying that well fat people eat to much and that is bad for their health so we should regulate what everybody is aloud to eat and what to eat. Than you will say that because people die riding motorcycles we should make that illegal too. Wait maybe we should also make sex out of wedlock illegal since there are people that die from STD's. Honestly people have been governing themselves when it came to things of this nature and if YOU or anybody else does not want to do these things or anything else than do NOT do them...(continues)

Your the one who is for freedom of choice, even if it does mean at the expense of somsone else.. I actually though if some bill was passed that made murder legal you would be happy.. i honestly did.. i mean, common.. its freedom of choice baby! Everything this country was founded on!

Come on how can you compare murdering someone to smoking pot or tobacco or alcohol? That is crossing the line. At the expense of someone else is than not a harmless action but when someone smokes pot or tobacco or drinks alcohol and they are responsible about it and NOT harming others how can that be bad and need to be controlled?

I know.. but you said freedom of choice.. Something we will never have.. Speeding doesnt hurt anyone, but its illegal becuase we can harm ourselves or others while doing it.. The government controls things to protect us.. And they are doing a pretty good job in my opinion..

I personally and I am sure millions of other Americans would agree that we would rather have the freedom to decide what to do with our selves than to have the government tell us what we must do. Personally if someone wants to drink alcohol that is fine, but do it responsibly, you want to smoke tobacco fine do it responsibly, if you want to smoke weed fine do it responsibly. People eat and drink themselves to death ( fast food and soda ) and not only that but than they are wasting RESOURCES and time and energy of medical teams and capitol. They are still allowed to eat themselves to death. Guns kill people yet they are legal, yes regulated but legal which means weed could be regulated like guns, tobacco, and alcohol. Not only regulate it but...(continues)

to me, you have no redeeming quality, if the world was up to you this would be a fascist theocracy, everything you support cannot be supported, i have met neo nazis that are more understanding than you.

I read all of your logs , I disagree, there is no proof that weed is worse for you than alcohol. Therefore we should not have a poison legal when a plant is illegal, which means until they want to do the entire alcohol prohibition again weed should also be legal. Than we can discuss whether or not weed should really be illegal or not. Than if all that happened we would have to make tobacco illegal and this means that we are no longer the land of the free, but the land of the oppressed.

I think alchohol is worse than weed.. All im saying is that to make weed legal would not be taking a step foward in any direction.. The only thing it would do is make poeple like alejandro happy becuase now that millions of kids are smoking millions of ounces more weed a year, we can say that our country is a little more free.. and its just not worth it to me..

If the country needs to control the people to make them safe, then let them do it.. Only nieve people like alejandro disagree withthis becuase for some reason he thinks that if we start letting them control what deadly substances they let us intake in our system, they will control our lives!

to be honest I wasn't angry: just disturbed at the insensitivity of not hearing the other side of the families of people that become involved w/ this drug. In the bible - do you know what word stands for "witchcraft" in the original language? 'pharmecia' - it is were we get our term Pharmecy in English. That says a lot about Drugs - don't you think? Not just Marijuana but other drugs considered "legal". They are not needed and can do much more harm than good--not just physically but it affects family life, emotions, etc. Just look at the side effects of some of the drugs!!! It's terrible! as for the integrity of my husband - he was a good, responsible man before he got involved in it 2 years later. I wouldn't have married him ...(continues)

I'm going to be nice in my response (which is somewhat out of character) and alejandro, as usual, has taken the words right out of my mouth. Quick synopsis would be to say that some people use mind altering substances illicit or otherwise to escape for problems that are no way associated with their drug of choice. The drug is used as an escape, not a cure nor a recreation. If these problems did not exist or the person had the proper support to deal with the underlying issues drug use would not have become a factor. Then there is also the issue of will power. Remember addiction is NOT a disease, it is a choice. Behavior is and will always be a CHOICE. If what you say happened actually happened it is a tragedy, but don't lie to yourself and sa...(continues)

Okay so make it legal all ready. At least so than it can be regulated like alchol. Sure there should be age limits and yes driving while high as a freaking kite is dangerous. But so is driving while plowed out of your tree and we have completely wrong punishments for that. Ohhh they take away your license yeah cause if you were drinking and driving you really care whether or not you have a license. Sorry me and drunk driving go way way back. My best friend was killed by a drunk driver in high school. He got a sentence of 6 months I have a friend doing 2 years for having 4 pot plants for his own use. Explain the logic of that to me and I will argue right back liquor kills and no one has ever died(that I know of) from a pot overdose.Everythi...(continues)

Well after reading all of the pro-pot propaganda I just wanted to add my 2 cents because everyone in here is right.... from their point of view. Personally, and this is my opinion and only my OPINION. Not fact, because someone will inevitably attack it as though it is. Pot is illegal. Accept it, and quit your crying. I have never and will never inhale anything that will impare my judgement because I am a person who prides myself on being in control. The day I am no longer capable of controlling myself is the day that a lot of bad things happen. I also think that yes, smoking and drinking should be illegal. Why you ask... I have scraped brain matter of a public street, not because of a drunk driver, but because a drunk wandered out into the s...(continues)

Alright for arguments sake lets say that there was a vote yesterday and pot is legal. yip ee hooray, everyone who ever wore a "Legalize It" Shirt feels a sense of accomplishment.

Now what? The Government CONTROLS pot. Look at the governments track record controlling things. How much do you think it costs to make a 60. oz. bottle of vodka? as much as we pay at the liquor store. The point I'm leading to is that if it was legal the trafficking would stop and there would probably be some beneficial effects for society but the pot smokers will end up getting ripped off worse than some of us already are. (except that kid down the street who buys lawn clippings he'll be getting a better deal.)

Well, if it was legalized you could grow for your own personal use. Also their would be stiff penalties in place for growing more than what is deemed to be personal use. If your too lazy/busy to do that then yes you can pay a premium to buy government grown pot.

Or, we could say decriminalize it, grow for personal use, no prosecution for possession for an amount under any given "personal use" amount and safety nets in place for people who become addicted or cannot stop when they want to. Just like AA, it would be socially acceptable to seek help for drug use as opposed to being ostracized for it.

To the person who said they would like cigarettes and Alcohol to be illegal as well. You think I'm posing a leftist argument? Hell ...(continues)

First off communisim is a great idea on paper. But people like you who care only about yourself and are easily corrupted because you aren't in control of yourself screw it all up. Equal treatment for all reagarless od what you do or who you are is great, but human nature dictates that people like you will want to only do things that benifit them instead of society as a whole. You don't care what happens to those around you. The mere fact that there is chance your actions could harm or kill me is enough for me to think it's wrong. Last time I checked I am still in America I can say anything I want and not care what you think. I personally don't care what you do to your body, and actually hope you bring harm to yourself so you either learn you...(continues)

Since when is smoking pot harmful to you particularly? It isn't, your argument is infantile and meaningless. Yes if someone was to get behind the wheel of a car they could pose a greater risk to you than a sober driver. This isn't the point, these kinds of purist arguments bend my mind because I don't know whether to laugh, cry, or become enraged. Thats why their are laws against driving under the influence of ANYTHING. If you are caught doing so you are dealt with accordingly and most people learn their lesson, some the easy way and some the hard way. Thats life brother, were not going to put fuzzy bumpers on every sharp corner because some people are scared. The way you post you would swear I'm strung out on heroin or meth. Your assumption...(continues)

As was pointed out in my first post everything I said was and is still just the opinion of one person. Yet you who sits on your high horse deems to put words into my mouth. I did not say anything about you as a person. I may not have as much time or experiance with said substance as you but I also have a life, and don't want to sit here forever in an attept to get you to see my point of view when you are so sure you and only you have to correct opinion on this subject. Just for your information opinion is not based in fact therefore is not subject to being right or wrong. So continue to sink so low as to attack me. I know for a fact that people who use said substance can live normal lives, but please OH MIGHTY ONE define to me normal, becaus...(continues)

"I personally don't care what you do to your body, and actually hope you bring harm to yourself so you either learn your lesson the hard way, or you eliminate yourself from the gene pool..."

It was this statement that elicited such a strong response from me. And while I do put my opinion in on these matters. You cannot refute the facts I have posted previously in this thread. They are quite long and I understand if you skipped over them, but they are very much fact and not my opinion. I used direct quotes names and dates. I'm not pro pot, I'm pro choice. I barely smoke dope, again as I already posted. But you can't seem to be bothered with such things.

I did not skip over anything, I gave you the respect, I read everything you posted. If it's fact then good for you. I said that I was only stating an opinion but I guess you couldn't be bothered with that information. It was put there to get that response, it was put there to show that you are taking this way to seriously, and if I really cared about any of it I could attack you in the same way. Bottom line... Keep the discussion civil and maybe everyone else will. Or follow the golden rule... treat people they way you want to be treated yourself.

At no point did this discussion become less than civil until you insinuated that I should not be allowed to reproduce. I'm very confused as to where I placed a personal attack against yourself that wasn't provoked?

Yes because as we all know making something illegal stops people from doing it. By your logic there must've been no alcoholics during prohibition, and today nobody smokes pot because that's illegal now.

Funny you turned this into a usual partisan "liberals R DUM LOL" rant, it only helps make our point. Thanks!

Never said anything about liberals... you just wanted to assume that so you could jump into the attack on me... So come one come all lets attack ME "If your not down with that then I've got two words for ya... S*CK IT!"

Oh so you didn't post that? Funny I must've been confused seeing that posted under "DXDegenerate" and all. And I'm not attacking you I'm attacking your argument. Which you didn't respond to...and then proceded to attack me by using dated wrestling catch phrases circa 1999. Try again.

It wont make me happy.. or sad. I'm completely indifferent to your presence. You opinion is welcomed here just like any other's. Its just that unfortunately some of us require the use of facts and reasoning when considering someone's argument or opinion.

haha. word. and all these people3 who try to sound all holy when discussing pot, are the same people who are getting stoned before work, the same people who are completely useless in society besides taking care of their own needs. the sheer reality of getting high, or drunk is to please yourself. your average pot smoker isin't doing it every once in a while, they are doing it 3-5 times a week. no, thats not a statistic, thats real life experience, i used to be a pot head and know quite a few people who still are. so i can see doing things in moderation but thats typically not the case with any drug, be it ciggarettes or alcohol or pot or crack. so get over it ya stoners. start thinking about more important issues like hypocrisy in yo...(continues)

I am saddened to see somebody as misinformed as yourself. I do not care if you are left or right-wing. We are not idiots. If every pot smoker is an idiot and all clueless, then isn't it a big coincidence how many millions of people who must be all deluded and mistaken...

Hahaha, man did you even read the first list of posts on this topic? I was, and continue to be, the most outspoken person in favor of legalization or at least decriminalization in this thread.

My previous post was a joke, but it either went over your head or under your feet. Have you ever heard the expression "to eat crow"? I means to admit one was wrong. If pot was to be legalized MANY people would have to figuratively "eat crow". And the joke was that so many people eating crow would cause ..... never mind, it loses everything when it has to be explained. If you don't get it by now it's lost

ZombieJ said:Hahaha, man did you even read the first list of posts on this topic? I was, and continue to be, the most outspoken person in favor of legalization or at least decriminalization in this thread.

My previous post was a joke, but it either went over your head or under your feet. Have you ever heard the expression "to eat crow"? I means to admit one was wrong. If pot was to be legalized MANY people would have to figuratively "eat crow". And the joke was that so many people eating crow would cause ..... never mind, it loses everything when it has to be explained. If you don't get it by now it's lost

I believe that the government should legalize all drugs including crack meth etc for 2 yrs to weed out the week think of the money we will make on taxes and money we will save on hospitalization and rehab when they killthemselves off then George can afford to invade another hostile country where dictators rule like maybe Cuba!! watch out Fidel.... oh wait you don't have oil there do you. oh well you are safe maybe he should look north to Canada! we Canadians can be kind of shifty you know EH! oh yeah and he can enlist the druggies for foot troops at lest than 1/3 the cost he is paying now to his troops the cost on a day supply of meth or crack if he makes it will be just dollars a day per person.

This is one of the biggest reasons why I believe it should be decriminalized.

Think about it. The two highest margin businesses in the US are insurance and pharmaceuticals. They make about 15-18% margin on their products. With any illegal drug, it is as much as 400% and higher! The government is creating crime when they prohibit something. I believe they are just stuck in old times. More and more people are realizing that alcohol is bad and marijuana is good. Don't get me wrong, I love beer, I love alcohol, but it's not my drug of choice.

If they would tax it they could make a good amount of money off of it.

Legalize Pot - Don't send anymore innocent people to jail. What crimes have they commited? Our prisons are over-populated and unlike a conservative, I think we should exonerate ALL the people in prisons for "drug offenses"

Man the first thing I want to point out is how down right stupid the conservatives are. It is so typacal of them to offer an insult to overcome any good argument any one makes. I have yet to hear any conservative ever make a real point with out first insulting the person they are arguining aginst. And second I just want to say why should it be anyones busniess what I put into my body.Its so funny...or sad.. the conservatives always say you are not patriotic if you dont support the war...but when it comes to peoples rights they are the first in line to take it away. Ironic isnt it.F@@@ you to the dictator of America and F@@@ you to all conservative.

Yeah, legalizing pot will solve all of your problems. It will cure your red eyes, clouded thinking, finger pointing, lack of concentration, spelling skills and general misinformation. Conservatives are the least ofyour worries. If pot were legalized the Libs would want to tax the hell out of it just like they do with tobacco and alcohol and it would be so expensive you wouldn't be able to afford it in the first place. Second, I know how clouded your mind can be when you smoke weed because I used to. Ever since I quit being a retard my head works a lot more clearly and my work ethic has greatly increased. I can also stay and one topic and combine the war with pot and conservatives. I don't see any libs out there fighting for your right...(continues)

how did I make so many typo's? Full of their misconceptions. a couple spaces in there. msispelled and after talking about spelling mistakes. At least I know when I'm wrong and can identify it instead of having everyone else do it for me.

Wow...that was realy insiteful...you know tell someone they cant spell and then spell a real simple word like and (unless this is what you truly ment...offensive ad I hope you do. and if it is then you belong with bush) or could i be a type-o...wow look at that.See I truly do not care how you spell because I am not that picky. Now as far as you saying I am letting a drug make my choice...I have not touched that stuff in over 7 years I used to smoke it and now i dont want to. So before you asume something you might want to ask. Also I get my news from many diffrant places and I listen to the right wing god Rush Blowhard I also listen to many other right wingers and the reason I have come to the conclusion that conservatives can only insult i...(continues)

I'm pretty sure I caught my errors for you but thats cool that you to bring it back up. Rush is a waste of time. All he does is point fingers and blame liberals for anything. I bet he's getting something from fellow Floridian Jeb Bush to suck off the President. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a Bush fan but I am sure he a better president than Kerry would ever be. I'm also positive that I'm not the one taking OUR rights away. Politicians are the most worthless and crooked jerks on the planet. Not one of them are out to help people, it seems. They all want to just get re-elected and keep their jobs. They don't want to do too much. Maybe just enough to keep their jobs and now it seems as if that just enough would be "just enough bitching...(continues)

Well the only reason I corrected you on your spelling is because I fell if you are going to jump down some one throat about it then you damn well better be perfect at it. I don't think it is an over all reflection on how smart someone is I like to get to know some one first before I judge how smart they are. I am not an edit when it comes to many things...when it comes down to spelling I am not that smart and to be honest you know what I mean and we are not in spelling class so please get off my a@@ about it.I never said you are the person trying to take away my right I meant our dictator and his cronies. If you don't think they are then what about gay marriage,abboritaon,drugs,and religion. Just to name a few. these are all topics that on...(continues)

- Making pot legal wont necessarily drive prices up. Since prices are already astronomical, reason being there is much risk in cultivating pot and the risk comes at a cost to the consumer. Just look at the amount of tobacco you can get for 35 dollars (A small bucket's worth even after the "evil liberal" tax) to the amount of weed you would receive for the same price sans tax on the black market. Even if the gov't taxed the product you would still end up getting more at the end of the day. Reason being they are going to sell it to you cheaper than the bootlegger can. This is how they get your business you see. Honestly, this isn't complex stuff. Reactionist and EXTREMELY f...(continues)

They cant because it is a way to controle everyone. I mean look at all the good uses for pot but it is still illeagle. There is no money in it for the huge companys, because it is so easy to grow. It all comes down to the green...if you know what I mean.

Yea.... I know. I've posted that several times previously in this thread. Even with lists of the drug companies that contribute to the rep. party... but if you didn't read all the posts its cool. Some are pretty long.

I was just hypothesizing about regulated pot in this last one. I know the USA would never decriminalize it.... well not in the foreseeable future at any rate.

I usually just sit back and watch the debates on this subject. Usually it never goes anywhere. While I am an avid user of the topic of argument, I do it in a responsible manner. I don't think that it will solve anything by legalizing or decriminalizing it, but I do think it will help to lighten us up.

Let's look at what will happen if we keep it a "controlled substance." (This will ring true for all drugs, not just cannibus.) People will still do them, drug dealers will continue to make a killing-over 400% profit-on their products, police will do their best to run drug lines dry, only to be replaced by another group. Prohibiton creates the drug cartels that have taken over the majority of the governments in countries like Columbia. Prohi...(continues)

While I think drugs are bad and marijuana is no exception, That they bring out the worst in the worst people. (I have never done a drug in my life not sanctioned by the FDA.) I believe people should be able to do whatever they want to do. And politicians who try to legislate morality for votes from the stupid whether it be drugs or too much sex in GTA San Andreas not only need not represent anyone at the city municipality level they shouldn't even have their opinions asked when going to a movie.

I just want to point out again that legalizing marijuana will not increase prices it will decrease prices. So now not only are you paying less but you providing the gov't with extra tax dollars they can use to ramp up services, pay down debt, purchase/bury hookers, et cetera.

isnt it funny how the people who have smoked it dont know what we are talking about....ya know if you check history you will find that people were saying this about achole during prohibiton...to bad stupidy rules some peoples lives

For anyone who doesn't know, it is now LEGAL in the city of Denver. Anyone over the age of 21 can have up to an ounce. Although it is still illegal in the State of Colorado. Its the first step to geitting it fully legalized. For more information go to www.rockymountainnews.com and do a search on marijuana.

You know thats super. One thing you have to consider is that possession of pot is a federal offense. Unfortunately the federal laws in the US regarding pot are very different than laws state to state. For instance in CA medical marijuana is legal, however the grow houses in CA routinely get busted by the ATF or FBI.

Where as here in Canada the 'federal' laws on pot were found to be un-constitutional and overturned

I read about that also. As much as I want to celebrate this small victory, I read up a lot more on it. Most places said that even though it is legal in the city, they are still going to prosecute it just as they did before.

It doesn't make much sense to me. That is like saying, "It's legal now! Up to one ounce! But don't do it because we'll still put you in jail for it!"

Another thing...how is it that one thing can be determined wrong in one area, and in another it is okay. I never understood that. Grrr...I'm so sick of politicians...

OK, a lot of you may disagree with this, but it's true. Studies have long proven this. Some recent ones just bring to light the true path that many users go down.

FACT: Medical Marijuana is a Gateway Drug

Research among people using prescribed and unprescribed medical marijuana show a startling amount of using of other drugs. Recently published, one study found that over 50% of people taking medical marijuana were taking one form of cancer or antibiotic medication, with 7% taking BOTH types of drugs. Another survey found that a large percentage "liked" taking both medical marijuana and their glaucoma medications at the same time. Although unpublished, a soon to be released report states that they have found 'hard evidenc...(continues)

the only reason that MJ is a gateway drug is because the guy that brings your weed over has shroomz, coke, pillz, ect. and he get's you high, really high then sells you his other sh!t even if you had no intention to buy.....drug dealers should go into cell phone sales...they would make a killing.

i think coca cola is the ultimate gateway drug. once you get that first cafeine buzz it leaves you wanting a better high. Thats why i mix whiskey with my coke to balance the upper with a downer=netural result!

They can a killer profit...can we blame them? They are business men just like the rest of us. They just have the balls to take the added risk.

This will always be the case until they are decriminalized, if not encouraged, in a responsible manner, that is.

My best friend has a court date on the 27th. He is probably going to get put in jail for a small amount of cocaine for 15 years, because he was on Accelerated Rehabilitation. With good behavior, he may get out in 7. This is happening when people charged with murder and child abuse are only getting 3 or 4 years.

The system is f*cked up. We need to stop locking our people up. This is the land of the free, not the land of the many gay dungeons.

OK, so here I am bringing back this tread and well hopefully from the dead. I am going to restate that yes I fully support the legalization of marijuana. I think that at this time with the possible pending economical ression it is foolish not to consider it as a strong option.

**Disclaimer** I am not an expert nor claim to be that these are all opnions and what I see as the logical reasoning behind it.**

So will be like well yeah he must smoke it probally labelling me as a pothead, I myself do smoke a little well enough to work out to i'm not sure of themeasurement imperial wieght alway confuse me but less then $20 a month...which could never justify an addiction. More people I know spend more on beer in one night.

Second of all... does anyone happen to know if the push to add Legalization to California's November elections got added or was defeated? I know the deadline for getting all the signatures was on 09-05-2008, but I haven't heard news either way. It's called the The Inalienable Rights Enforcement Initiative.

Marijuana is not a miracle substance without addictive properties or negative effects.

Long term marijuana users who attempt to quit report irritability, sleeplessness, decrease in appetite, anxiety and even depression. Several studies have shown that habitual marijuana usage increases your risk of depression, certain anxiety disorders, high doses of marijuana can exacerbate existing psychological issues and cause acute psychotic reactions.

Smoking marijuana also increases your risk of a heart attack as it produces higher blood-pressure and heart rate and decreases your blood's oxygenating capabilities. Marijuana smoke contains 50%-70% carcinogens than tobacco smoke, and given that your average pot smoker holds the smoke in their lu...(continues)

so true a friend of mine just went through this but she also had pre-existing issues. I get irritable any time I don't get my coffee in the morning before work..man when I quite smoking cigs I probably would have murdered someone if I hadn't basically locked my self...(continues)

It is a staw-man argument in that the OP is proposing that people who don't support legalizing marijuana support alcohol and tobacco, far more hazardous substances, essentially saying that we support those substances that are more deadly therefore our opinion is made invalid.

I would like to see the results of any study that suggests that addictive substances become less desirable if they become more readily available.

Also, smoking pot, drinking alcohol and smoking tobacco are not even remotely similar to driving a car. Driving a vehicle is a necessity for millions of people, it is entirely infeasible for me to trek 12 miles to work, 8 miles to the grocery store and 6-8 miles any time I feel like eating out.

There are some studies, particularly in child psychology, that show denying something makes it more enticing. The argument is moot anyway since he said "teens" and for the most part alcohol and tobacco are illegal for teens as well so in that sense they are on an equal playing field.

It's worth noting that these studies don't tend to focus on whether something is addictive or not. I'm not even sure who that has anything to do with it though, since something being addictive isn't the main draw in someone trying it for the first time. Personality traits and environmental pressures are why people do things or not.

It is quite relevant whether or not something is addictive or not. If someone is told that a particular substance is addictive and can lead to addiction that imposes a variable in the study. Individual A is told that the substance is legal and addictive, Individual B is told that the substance is legal... do you think Individual A would approach the substance differently than Individual B? Personality traits and environmental pressures are not the only reasons an individual does things.

Legalization is not an effective method of deterring the use of a substance. It seems a tad stupid to compare a 16 year old's brain to a child's brain, or any other age bracket really.

The idea of something being addictive is not going to play a role assuming were talking about the same thing. Addiction can play a role in if someone continues to take a substance but it's it not a determining factor in someone trying it when we're talking about the legality of something. It's pretty silly that you would even suggest that actually.

You wanted to see a study that showed addictive substances become less desirable if they become readily available. I'm telling you that such a study does not exist and will never exist because those two things are not dependent. Now, if you want to see a study that showed a persons desire for something changing based on whether they are able to have it, sure. Want to see a study showing th...(continues)

Addiction is not going to play a role? If you tell someone; "Marijuana can be addictive, you can become addicted to it!" that isn't going to change anything? O'rly?

Here's a personal example. My biological father was an alcoholic, as a child I was told by my psychologist that I had a predisposition toward becoming an alcoholic, it changed my perspective on alcohol consumption. To this day I don't drink, on the chance that I may become addicted, and I keep any eye on any other habits that may become addictive.

Addiction is not going to play a role? If you tell someone; "Marijuana can be addictive, you can become addicted to it!" that isn't going to change anything? O'rly?

Yes really. But only because you're completely misunderstanding the argument. We're talking about increased usage if it were legal vs. illegal. That's why I made the claim that it was of no consequence - You're talking about something completely different. I said that you point would be relevant "all things being equal". In other words, your point would be valid if we were talking about trying to stop people from smoking pot, or getting them to start. This discussion has always centred around the merits of it being decriminalized - not whet...(continues)

ZombieJ said:Yes really. But only because you're completely misunderstanding the argument. We're talking about increased usage if it were legal vs. illegal. That's why I made the claim that it was of no consequence - You're talking about something completely different. I said that you point would be relevant "all things being equal". In other words, your point would be valid if we were talking about trying to stop people from smoking pot, or getting them to start. This discussion has always centred around the merits of it being decriminalized - not whether people use it or not. The addicitive properties of THC are mostly psychological at any rate. It's addictive in the same way video games or gambling is addi

I would say no. I used to do it but stopped. Too expensive in my mind. And also it makes it so easy to arrest any socially insufficent person because 75% of them carry it. So that leaves the rest of us in the better part of society to thrive on what we have.