I've started fixing some of the bugs that have been reported, and I'm going to follow up the 3.0 release with a 3.1 that will fix everything I know of. So, please list any issues you've found here and I'll get to them as soon as I can. I may add Saga support to 3.1, but I'm thinking that 3.1 may be a bug-fix-only release, because there's a specific issue with dedicated servers reporting the proper gamedirectory ("ProModBeta3" instead of "Promod3.0"), which I've already fixed on my build.

If you've put any bug reports any any of the other Promod 3.0 threads, then please repost them here so that it will be easier for me to keep track of them all. This goes for any that you've emailed me, or private messaged me.

Why I've disappeared the last few days:
I had an exciting trip the the E.R. for a severe anxiety attack on Tuesday. For those of you who don't know what that's like: imagine your entire upper body buzzing as if you're holding onto some high-voltage power lines, and an 800-pound gorilla is sitting on your chest so you can't breathe. Fun, fun.

I'm trying to take it easy for the next few days and not do much of anything, so you guys just keep reporting bugs, and I'll take care of them when I'm feeling better.

i PMed you with some questions and a bug i noticed. but even after you described how the bug may have been a 'user error' (my words, not yours ), i'm still noticing it.

here's what i see ...

when i jump (set at the lowest level) then use the jetpack to gain altitude, i notice that my force mana (or whatever it's called) is still being drained, even though i have let go of the jump button. minor ... but still a bug i've run into.

- Jetpack doesn't refuel when you die
- suicide delay continues when you die, so you can expect to drop dead shortly after respawning
- config seems to get screwed up every time I join a game which means I have to either suicide or get killed in order to get my correct config

1) Every time I change my config in the begginning of the game and hoi Apply, I immediately join, THEN it saves the new config. I have to suicide to get the new config.

2) Once, just now, in Death Star, Lazarous killed PowerBroker in that narrw room with the four medpacks. You know, the one across the hall from the big room with the Golan.

Well, apprently Laz killed him JUSt before he activated his jetpack, because even after he died, the flame of the jetpack remained floating over his corpse, sound and all. I slashed the corpse out of existence, and the flame went out, but the sound remained.

Just one, the setup bud I mentioned over on the release thread. When you load Promod through the setup screen you cannot access the setup screen again until you shut down the game. Not a gameplay bug, just a minute annoyance.

About your trip to the ER, I suffered from severe anxiety for a number of years in my early 20's (I'm 24, but much better now) I ended up in the ER a couple of times with panic attacks and for a while I thought my life was over. It took me a long time to completely recover and an alful lot of help from friends and family. Anyway, I just wanted to let you know there are alot of people out there who have went through just what your going through

when i jump (set at the lowest level) then use the jetpack to gain altitude, i notice that my force mana (or whatever it's called) is still being drained, even though i have let go of the jump button. minor ... but still a bug i've run into.

That's actually not a bug. What's happening is that you're using level 1 jump, which uses up a ton of force power, so even after you've let go of the jump button, it will continue to drain your force until its usage amount is accounted for. I gave level 1 jump to every class by default.

This is a bug for gunners I've noticed while spectating. I'm not sure how or why this happens, but sometimes when your weapon's been pulled several times consecutively the brayar sometimes refuses to appear. I assume the brayar can't be pulled, right?

Idunno, something makes me recall this being an issue much earlier in promod's development... or maybe it's a 1.04 bug... or maybe someone already posted this a day ago... ANYWAYS, the bug can really screw over gunners. If you've never heard of it then I'll do more research and find out exactly when it happens.

Also, glad you're taking a break Artifex. Life can be totally insane sometimes. Don't worry about getting 3.1 out too soon. Your mod is a great success despite its imperfections, and the community can definitely wait till you're ready.

i'll just reiterate the config bug mentioned above (about it joining the game, then setting the config). also, when a weapon is pulled from you it often doesn't switch to another one... would it be possible to fix that?

any chance you'd incorporate model scaling (not damage scaling, mind you) and the like (saber scaling, but not bigger... just smaller ie. for yoda, etc.) into a future release?

also, sorry to hear about your anxiety attack.

oh, and your server needs some third party models methinks... when you're up and running, that is.

the force fileds do cause a lot of lag, and bots seem to like using it when they spwan. I have had servers crap out on me in large maps due to this. Bots get killed, spawn, use force field, fall of and spawn and use forcefield again. If there are a number of players on the server... I will time out.

that's basically it for bugs, besides what people have mentioned. Oh is it possible to not have the bryar as a default weapon? It is annoying to spawn with it every time to switch to a saber afterwards. I would like to be able to only have the saber and pick the bryar when I want to. Plus when I'm sneaking in mind trick, i dont want to pick up those ammo packs for the gun I wont use and give away where I am.

More of an exploit I think, but there is a Red move that will kill you with one "hit" even if you are 100/100, even if it only gets close to you, even if you are anticpating with a block, even if it misses altogether.

It looks kinda like a single overhead red swing followed by the same red overhead swing crouched. I can not reproduce it, but I have ran across 2-3 players who use this move exclusively and they are nearly impossible to kill with a saber. No matter how poorly timed their swing is, it still hits (and kills) if you are anywhere near them. I have even been killed by this swing when I was behind the player, hacking on their unprotected back. Dunno, hope it doesnt become as widespread as the oh so l33t 1.03 backstab combos.

Other suggestions,

1. Could the trump system be a two-way matrix and be top down? Consider: Take one saberist wielding blue vs. one wielding red. Blue attacks are fast and furious, and should trump Red's slow and heavy defense. However, when Red returns the attack, his heavy, crushing blow should completly knock away or blast through the blue users nimble parrys.

If this could be implemented, then it might be cool to make saberists pay for each style individually, with a high and equal cost (10 points?) attached to each style? Even cooler might be the limitation to only have 2 out of 3 styles max per character? Dunno.

2: Agility skill points for gunners, so if they spend points they can get better jumping, then a more little speed, then with even more points the jedi roll move. IMO: They have too many point to spread around as it is now at JM level. The more specialization the better.

3: Make the roll move cost a small amount of force power to prevent droidika style silliness for both classes? There's an awful lot of rolling goin on.

5: A 1 n 5 chance that you will be impaled when attempting to kick somebody wielding a light saber? Or maybe a CSC determined chance? Kicking someone holding a lightsaber should be a risky manuever. Your Balls + My blade = slice!

Originally posted by Halowse More of an exploit I think, but there is a Red move that will kill you with one "hit" even if you are 100/100, even if it only gets close to you, even if you are anticpating with a block, even if it misses altogether.

It looks kinda like a single overhead red swing followed by the same red overhead swing crouched. I can not reproduce it, but I have ran across 2-3 players who use this move exclusively and they are nearly impossible to kill with a saber. No matter how poorly timed their swing is, it still hits (and kills) if you are anywhere near them. I have even been killed by this swing when I was behind the player, hacking on their unprotected back. Dunno, hope it doesnt become as widespread as the oh so l33t 1.03 backstab combos.

Hmm, i'll have to see that one in action. I can't quite picture the move you're talking about.

Quote:

Other suggestions,

1. Could the trump system be a two-way matrix and be top down? Consider: Take one saberist wielding blue vs. one wielding red. Blue attacks are fast and furious, and should trump Red's slow and heavy defense. However, when Red returns the attack, his heavy, crushing blow should completly knock away or blast through the blue users nimble parrys.

If this could be implemented, then it might be cool to make saberists pay for each style individually, with a high and equal cost (10 points?) attached to each style? Even cooler might be the limitation to only have 2 out of 3 styles max per character? Dunno.

Well, the matrix idea is interesting, but with the bonuses you lay out here, there would never be a style that you had a negative attack bonus against. That's very important in the current system.

Quote:

2: Agility skill points for gunners, so if they spend points they can get better jumping, then a more little speed, then with even more points the jedi roll move. IMO: They have too many point to spread around as it is now at JM level. The more specialization the better.

This is technically possible, but it's something that needs to be looked at after the current gamebalance is stabilized a bit more. Maybe in 3.2 or so.

Quote:

3: Make the roll move cost a small amount of force power to prevent droidika style silliness for both classes? There's an awful lot of rolling goin on.

Gunners already can't roll, and rolling is a major tactic for the jedi. Making it cost precious force points would be inconsistent with some of the other acrobatic moves like wallflipping and kicking.

Drama points? Hmm, I think many people would want to lynch me if I did this.

Quote:

5: A 1 n 5 chance that you will be impaled when attempting to kick somebody wielding a light saber? Or maybe a CSC determined chance? Kicking someone holding a lightsaber should be a risky manuever. Your Balls + My blade = slice!

Cool MOD. Thanks for the work.

One thing I could do is give you a massive defense penalty while in the kicking animation. That's something I could look at, but I haven't heard any reports of kicking being abused lately. It seems that it's being used very infrequently now.

One bug I've encountered is when changing from full screen to windowed game mode, or vice versa, the jetpack fuel meter disappears. Seems to come back after a while on a respawn or something, but I'm not sure when or why.

for some odd reason, the sabre becomes really thick when i face a certain direction. this seems to happen intermittently. i coul,d take screenies, but i have nowhere to host them... its not a bad bug, just ruins the aesthetics of the game...

Guys: Enough with the stupid bug reports. If you can't win it means you suck or the person you were fighting was really good or you got in the wrong place at the wrong time (between a rocket and a cut-through-anything place). It's probably this **** that sent Art to the E.R.!! Also, I think this is ONLY a bug report thread, and not a suggestion thread, so lets stick to errors within the mod.

Now to the bugs:
- Some times when backslashing in yellow you jump hop forward and hook-slice infront of you. I'm not sure if it's ProMod related or JO related, but it never happened to me before except in Saberist 1.2 where that was intentional
-When I set my game settings from normal to high quality and went to deathstar, certain places were rainbow colored, and as I moved they fluxed. I'm not sure if this was in the game to begin with because I never used high quality before ProMod 3.0 (since it requires high inorder to see saber colors smooth)

Edit:
- I'm not sure if this is a bug or not, but when I walk in any direction with saber in hand, the CSC increases both attack and defense, more so than they do when running.. is this suppost to happen?

Originally posted by zerowingzero
My guess: lag, sometimes when you are laggings you don't gain even though your fuel depletes. Were you lagging at the time?

Well, I was *hosting* the game so...I don't think so. But I've had problems with my internet connection lately - it seems to take breaks constantly dropping the activity to zerowing..I mean..zero for 10-15 seconds or so. Maybe that has something to do with it.

Originally posted by Moradivh This is a bug for gunners I've noticed while spectating. I'm not sure how or why this happens, but sometimes when your weapon's been pulled several times consecutively the brayar sometimes refuses to appear. I assume the brayar can't be pulled, right?

Idunno, something makes me recall this being an issue much earlier in promod's development... or maybe it's a 1.04 bug... or maybe someone already posted this a day ago... ANYWAYS, the bug can really screw over gunners. If you've never heard of it then I'll do more research and find out exactly when it happens.

I think I've figured this one out. If your gun just got pulled and you're still holding the fire button a new weapon won't appear. For me, I'd get my gun pulled and would immediately hold secondary fire to charge up a bryar but instead no gun would appear. As soon as I let go of the button the weapon would appear.

I think I've figured this one out. If your gun just got pulled and you're still holding the fire button a new weapon won't appear. For me, I'd get my gun pulled and would immediately hold secondary fire to charge up a bryar but instead no gun would appear. As soon as I let go of the button the weapon would appear.

This sounds about right to me. I imagine the logic was that such a weapon switch would be considered "unsafe" while the fire button was held down. Props to Nutrition for the sharp eye.

When performing back-attacks or any special move while the reticle is on the target, the words "Using Special Modifier" appears in the upper left-hand corner... It doesn't effect the game, but it does get annoying

Bad news. Nutritious (with me spectating) just discovered a very serious bug. And it may not be possible to fix.

BUG: the jetpack's performance is directly affected by the player's framerate (FPS).

Nutri tested this out. While facing a blank wall at the edge of the map, he's able to fly to the normal fantastic heights. But if he's looking out at a view of a player-filled map, his framerate drops drastically, and his jets can barely get him off the ground. We're talking less than 10 feet here. It's enough for most evasion tactics, which is why gunners can dominate in ffa despite the bug, but it can cripple them in certain situations, especially for players with lower-end machines I imagine.

The framerate doesn't even need to be that low for the bug to severely hamper the jetpack's flying (EDIT: Nutri confirmed that the jetpack's basically useless below 23 FPS). I expect Nutritious has a decent machine considering how flawless his aim is, and he still couldn't get 10 feet off the ground while looking out over some of the larger landscapes on ns_streets and yavin. But if you want exact statistics I'm sure Nutri can provide them.

This is probably the same bug that was originally attributed to lag, causing the jetpack to malfunction. And this may partially explain how some players dominate so completely as a gunner, while others can't (though I still attribute most of this to differences in skill).

I'm sure we don't want to punish jetpackers with older computers, or force them away from crowded games. But sadly, this doesn't sound like an easy bug to fix. I'm not an expert, but it seems like it'd be a flaw in the game engine or something.

Nutritious has found ways around the bug. By looking directly up or down (at the floor or the sky) he can quickly improve his framerate and reach top jetpack heights no matter how big or crowded the map is. But considering how much he loves to snipe people while in mid-flight, this is a serious handicap... and people will undoubtedly fall off alot of cliffs and land in the wrong places if they can't look where they're going.

Anyways, I'm real sorry Art. I pray you can fix it, but it doesn't sound easy.

Originally posted by Moradivh Bad news. Nutritious (with me spectating) just discovered a very serious bug. And it may not be possible to fix.

BUG: the jetpack's performance is directly affected by the player's framerate (FPS).

Nutri tested this out. While facing a blank wall at the edge of the map, he's able to fly to the normal fantastic heights. But if he's looking out at a view of a player-filled map, his framerate drops drastically, and his jets can barely get him off the ground. We're talking less than 10 feet here. It's enough for most evasion tactics, which is why gunners can dominate in ffa despite the bug, but it can cripple them in certain situations, especially for players with lower-end machines I imagine.

The framerate doesn't even need to be that low for the bug to severely hamper the jetpack's flying (EDIT: Nutri confirmed that the jetpack's basically useless below 23 FPS). I expect Nutritious has a decent machine considering how flawless his aim is, and he still couldn't get 10 feet off the ground while looking out over some of the larger landscapes on ns_streets and yavin. But if you want exact statistics I'm sure Nutri can provide them.

This is probably the same bug that was originally attributed to lag, causing the jetpack to malfunction. And this may partially explain how some players dominate so completely as a gunner, while others can't (though I still attribute most of this to differences in skill).

I'm sure we don't want to punish jetpackers with older computers, or force them away from crowded games. But sadly, this doesn't sound like an easy bug to fix. I'm not an expert, but it seems like it'd be a flaw in the game engine or something.

Nutritious has found ways around the bug. By looking directly up or down (at the floor or the sky) he can quickly improve his framerate and reach top jetpack heights no matter how big or crowded the map is. But considering how much he loves to snipe people while in mid-flight, this is a serious handicap... and people will undoubtedly fall off alot of cliffs and land in the wrong places if they can't look where they're going.

Anyways, I'm real sorry Art. I pray you can fix it, but it doesn't sound easy.

Yeah, this does sound like a sticky wicket. I've got some ideas on what I can mess around with to start testing though. The difficulty is resolving the client side prediction code with that of the server's master record of everything's movement and position. I think this is going to turn out to be a client-side only problem. Which should make it easier to fix.

Heheh, I've seen Nutritious snipe people while both him AND his target are flying. I've also seen him snipe jumping Jedi using Mind Trick -- this guy has enough intuition to know where you are even if you're invisible and trying to dodge.

I am not sure about all pushable-projectiles, because its very hard to get kills with that counter-move,
but I am certain about rockets and golan's explosive balls, because I mostly f. push them back at the sender, causing them being killed by their own explosives.

jetpack users can still use the jetpack during the recovery period after being gripped, while all other players are completely immobilized for a second or so.

so as soon as you let go of the grip and the person is in 'stun' mode, they can fire the jetpack and move away. if this is intentional then jedi should be able to force-jump away dunring this time too, which is not the case. I think the grip's stun-effect is very valuable, the gunners shouldn't be able to fly away with the jetpack during the recovery/stun period which is a short time lapse anyway.

Originally posted by ksk h2o jetpack users can still use the jetpack during the recovery period after being gripped, while all other players are completely immobilized for a second or so.

so as soon as you let go of the grip and the person is in 'stun' mode, they can fire the jetpack and move away. if this is intentional then jedi should be able to force-jump away dunring this time too, which is not the case. I think the grip's stun-effect is very valuable, the gunners shouldn't be able to fly away with the jetpack during the recovery/stun period which is a short time lapse anyway.

Originally posted by Kettch I am not sure about all pushable-projectiles, because its very hard to get kills with that counter-move,
but I am certain about rockets and golan's explosive balls, because I mostly f. push them back at the sender, causing them being killed by their own explosives.

I'll look into this. IMO, the shot should change ownership once pushed, which would cause it to not only credit you with the kill, but to also do full damage against the gunner rather than the lesser self-damage rate (75%).