Well, there was some talk about the existing of this thread in some other thread on this forum, but I couldn't find the original one so I start a new one.

This thread should not be mixed with the other language thread about what languages you know or would like to learn, this is simply a subjective matter where you can list your favorite languages (it's about how they sound to you, not whether you actually can speak and/-or want to learn them).

SRBIJA

5th August 2013, 19:56

My favourite language is Hungarian. I laso think that Serbian is beautiful.

A-lister

5th August 2013, 19:56

So here's mine:

Ukrainian ::ua
Russian ::ru

^ I like Slavic languages in general, but those two are my favs amongst them.

Hebrew ::il
German ::de

randajad

5th August 2013, 20:04

^^ Ewww. I hate your list. :mrgreen:

When you say beautiful languages I think of Estonian, Icelandic and French. :lol:

A-lister

5th August 2013, 20:08

^^ Ewww. I hate your list. :mrgreen:

Ehm ok? xshrug

r3gg13

5th August 2013, 20:27

I really like how Slavic languages sound in general.

My favorites is/are Croatian/Serbian/Montenegrin/Bosnian

Of course, how can I forget French! French just sounds so graceful IMO. Even when my old neighbor was mad at how much noise me and my flatmates were making every Friday night, she still sounded graceful :D

A-lister

5th August 2013, 20:38

I really like how Slavic languages sound in general.

My favorites is/are Croatian/Serbian/Montenegrin/Bosnian

Of course, how can I forget French! French just sounds so graceful IMO. Even when my old neighbor was mad at how much noise me and my flatmates were making every Friday night, she still sounded graceful :D

So you like South Slavic (Serbo-Croatian) in particular then? Yeah those are nice aswell, they have a different "melody" than other Slavic languages though, they're "slower".

I guess I'm one of the few that aren't really into French. I like it more as a singing language than spoken, but that's the case of most languages I guess.

Venage

5th August 2013, 20:42

I like Italian, Japanese and Swedish. Different styles, but each special it its own way. French is not my cup of tea, but especially for males I think it's awful. Sounds way too feminine.

seb89

5th August 2013, 20:44

My favorite language would be French of course. I also liked Spanish. Dedicated my life to these languages :lol: xrofl3

As for the language I don't speak, I like the sound of Hebrew, Greek, Swedish and Danish.

Dutch can be beautiful too, depends on the region :lol:.

A-lister

5th August 2013, 20:47

Dutch can be beautiful too, depends on the region :lol:.

Hmm...

Well, I actually sorta like the sound of Flemish Dutch... I dunno if it's just in my mind but they do sound a bit different? Flemish sounds less harsh in my ears...

randajad

5th August 2013, 20:50

Dutch can be beautiful too, depends on the region :lol:.
:mrgreen:
You wish. :P :D :lol:

r3gg13

5th August 2013, 20:55

So you like South Slavic (Serbo-Croatian) in particular then? Yeah those are nice aswell, they have a different "melody" than other Slavic languages though, they're "slower".

I guess I'm one of the few that aren't really into French. I like it more as a singing language than spoken, but that's the case of most languages I guess.

Yeah, I do like South Slavic in particular. I like in particular, the intonation, how it rises and falls and how melodic it is. East Slavic languages like Russian and Ukrainian are heavily ionized in linguistic terms, it has a lot of ios which I don't find particularly pleasing.

A-lister

5th August 2013, 20:59

Yeah, I do like South Slavic in particular. I like in particular, the intonation, how it rises and falls and how melodic it is. East Slavic languages like Russian and Ukrainian are heavily ionized in linguistic terms, it has a lot of ios which I don't find particularly pleasing.

What's this "ionize" thing? Not sure what you refer to, but I guess I was talking about the same thing (with how the South Slavic one sounds "slower", their melody is more "Germanic" in a weird since... Bulgarian sounds a bit in between South Slavic and East Slavic though).

r3gg13

5th August 2013, 21:03

What's this "ionize" thing? Not sure what you refer to, but I guess I was talking about the same thing (with how the South Slavic one sounds "slower", their melody is more "Germanic" in a weird since... Bulgarian sounds a bit in between South Slavic and East Slavic though).

Oops, I meant to say Iotacized, which means it has a lot of sounds with iota /j/ infused in it like Ю for example. I really like how slow the melody is. Now that you have mentioned it, I now see the resemblance between the Germanic intonation and the South Slavic intonation.

CC92

5th August 2013, 22:02

Judging by the sound only:

1. Russian
2. Estonian
3. German

Most overrated ones: Spanish, Italian xsleep

Gera11

5th August 2013, 22:05

Norwegian, Russian and Spanish.

Celia

5th August 2013, 22:32

English (mostly with a British accent :mrgreen:), French, German, Italian and pretty much all Slavic languages :D
Finnish and Estonian sound cool too!

Nicholas123

5th August 2013, 22:40

French! xlove

seb89

5th August 2013, 22:54

I don't see any appeal in Russian :o! It sounds so aggressive.

Hmm...

Well, I actually sorta like the sound of Flemish Dutch... I dunno if it's just in my mind but they do sound a bit different? Flemish sounds less harsh in my ears...

Yes, they are different morphologically and phonologically. Flemish Dutch is indeed softer than Netherlands Dutch. Depends on the region tbh. I don't like West-Flemish (coastal area, Bruges,..). They mix up the "G" and "H". Hans (name) / Gans (goose) sounds the same. It's ugly.

:mrgreen:
You wish. :P :D :lol:

I can't help it you don't have taste :p.

MyHeartIsYours

6th August 2013, 00:18

English ;)

No really, it is one of my favourite languages :p English spoken with a West Country (South West England), South Welsh, Geordie (Newcastle), Southern Irish or Australian accent are the best imo. But otherwise, the Scandinavian languages are my favourites to hear; Norwegian, Swedish, Danish, Icelandic. Beautiful languages :D Welsh and Irish (Ive never heard any of the other Celtic languages) are also very nice, and Im quite used to them living in Wales half the year and with my grandmother being an Irish speaker. German is great - it is not a 'romantic' language, but I like its sound very much!

I find the traditionally popular languages - notably French and Italian - to be nice but overrated.

Of course being monolingual I can only judge foreign languages on how they sound, not how I find them to speak, etc :)

nekoisneko

6th August 2013, 00:55

My Rank

Germany

Japanese

Estonian, Finnish

Icelandic

Bahasa Indonesia :mrgreen:

nofuxCZ

6th August 2013, 02:14

My favourite is Slovak, but I guess I'm biased here. To me it sounds like more soft and sexy Czech :mrgreen:

I also like hebrew, icelandic and slovenian (or slovene or whatever the right one is :p )

Slovene I think, at least thats how do they call subject that kids have in school. :lol: I like it too . :)

Same thing is happening in Serbian though, I often hear people saying 'Slovenski' instead of 'Slovenački' #stupid Slovenski relates to whole group of languages, Slovenacki to::sl

Impressive

8th August 2013, 13:35

I don't understand what is attractive with ::il Hebrew. I just remember 2010 entry of Israel. Sounds pretty disgusting :? Not something I would like to hear at all. French and German aren't that different but I like French because of the songs I like in French.

I like ::it ::mk (thank you Kaliopi :D) ::tr and Scandinavian languages. They sound pretty nice to me :rolleyes:

SRBIJA

8th August 2013, 13:43

::mk

Then you would love ::bg too I think :)

A-lister

8th August 2013, 20:12

I don't understand what is attractive with ::il Hebrew. I just remember 2010 entry of Israel. Sounds pretty disgusting :?

Hebrew is beautiful imo, but it takes a bit time to adjust to thanks to the "throat sounds", but once you get passed that it's a really nice language. If they'd replace the throat sounds with H or X (slavic "silent H") though it would be much more appealing generally I reckon.

tuorem

9th August 2013, 03:24

French and German aren't that different but I like French because of the songs I like in French.

Excuse me? :lol:

My favourite languages are :

::pl Seems like it's quite an unpopular one among foreigners, just love the sound of it and the way it's written is kinda mysterious to me.
::hr Maybe an odd comparison, but it's the Italian of the Eastern European languages imo :D Amazing, no wonder you Croatians almost always get me with your ballads.
::lv Interesting one too. Don't know enough about it though. But it certainly appeals to me. I want more of it in Eurovision.
::no Not quite the same thing as the previous ones. :p I started learning it some time ago, I wish I could resume lessons soon.

Polish is the opposite of French as we have so few words containing "y" and "z" whereas Polish is filled with those letters, that difference is fascinating :p

Otherwise, in absolute terms, English is a beautiful-sounding language, but due to globalization, I guess it lost lots of its appeal, it's not exotic anymore.

AdelAdel

9th August 2013, 11:44

Polish is the opposite of French as we have so few words containing "y" and "z" whereas Polish is filled with those letters, that difference is fascinating :p

In all other European languages which use the Latin alphabet the letter "v" is commonly used, whereas in Polish this letter doesn't exist (well, only in a few loan words) :lol:

PeterLPZ

9th August 2013, 12:10

French and German aren't that different but I like French because of the songs I like in French.

I like my language because of a huge vocabluary, it is one of the richest languages in the world.

::es Spanish
I like how it is sounds

SRBIJA

9th August 2013, 16:22

BTW ::dk is also appealing to me ( ofc not even to close ::hu xheart :) ) but It's fucking tough :o Pronounciation is ridiculously tough :o Also I want to mention ::cz which attracts me a bit too. :p

So:

1. ::rs ::hu
2. ::dk
3. ::cz

Disappointed that ::rs is not getting too much attention :( Believe me its beautiful too, you just need to feel it :D

Nikkita

10th August 2013, 22:05

Woo you like Czech :o quite rare :o xcheer
I think it´s because i like watching Czech Hunter.
NO REGRETS

Yoni

10th August 2013, 22:11

easily: German, Turkish, French & Portuguese.

et voila!

nofuxCZ

11th August 2013, 00:29

I think it´s because i like watching Czech Hunter.
NO REGRETS

:o:o:o:o:o:o naughty girl

CH#46 - my friend from elementary school

Yamarus

11th August 2013, 20:29

I think it´s because i like watching Czech Hunter.
NO REGRETS

xrofl

Tinchey

12th August 2013, 04:01

Hmmm probably ::se::it::fr::is & ::kr. But I love each and every Slavic language as well. :)

Ewigkeit

12th August 2013, 04:45

::de::de::de::de::de::de

Nikkita

17th August 2013, 16:23

:o:o:o:o:o:o naughty girl

CH#46 - my friend from elementary school
lololol you cant understand if they're really random or pornstars.But i think they're pornstars cause all the twinks are SO pro at their work.

Paddy

21st August 2013, 19:02

I love the sound of Greek, Bulgarian, and Portuguese. And I also like German (mostly with English accent :lol:) and also German :D

Of course it all depends on different tastes and so on, but I'm a bit confused to see Finnish/Estonian that often here. For me these two languages are one of the most awful ones together with Icelandic and Danish (don't want to offend anyone, just my opinion, I know that there are also many people who hate the sound of German for example so I hope it's no problem :lol:)

What else... Swedish is quite nice, but I'm clearly biased as that's the language I mainly use in my daily life. The same does apply for Finnish, but I don't like the sound of that. English is 50/50 in making the list - some variants are nice, but it's such a lingua franca by now listing it would include more variants than I can count.

This "language" DOESN'T EXIST( I don't know how it still ain't clear) ??????????????

Verjamem

22nd August 2013, 12:29

By me, all ex-Yu countries have other languages, and Serbo-Croatian was just socialistic invention to don't have problems with offices, judges, educations etc.

vatroslav_cro

22nd August 2013, 13:04

You are right Mateusz! There are Slovene, Croatian, Serbian, Bosnian and Macedonian. But apart from it, we have many similar examples in Europe, such as Danish, Icelandic, Swedish and Norwegian in Scandinavian case, then Czech and Slovak in ex Czechoslovakian case, then Belarussian and Ukrainian in ex Soviet case etc. Some of them are more, some of them are less mutually inteligible and understandable, but they all have their own ortography. I am speaking from the linguistic point of view, hopefully I won't be misunderstood again....
Plus I think these things should be cleared once for ever, finally.

Tinchey

22nd August 2013, 14:14

This "language" DOESN'T EXIST( I don't know how it still ain't clear) ??????????????

I am giving up......:(obviously I ll have to:(
Željko, you are maybe the only one who REALLY understand it all....

AdelAdel

22nd August 2013, 15:57

I am giving up......:(obviously I ll have to:(
Željko, you are maybe the only one who REALLY understand it all....

The only thing I understand is that you're throwing tantrum for no reason. I can tell you that before Yugoslavia changed its name to Serbia & Montenegro, the general term for the official language used there was "Serbo-Croatian". You can't just say that it didn't exist. The division between Serbian, Croatian, and Bosnian exists only because of nationalistic reasons.

vatroslav_cro

22nd August 2013, 16:00

So maybe you know better than me what language I am talking to?
BTW, Croatian is one of the EU official languages today.
And I talked also about the other examples, but seems everybody just "caught up" this one.....

But I am not gonna make a quarrel here, it is just useless...and I don't do it, because I have my own dignity.

AdelAdel

22nd August 2013, 16:03

Yeah, you're right, Vatroslav, it is indeed useless. One can't really discuss anything with people who can't take concrete evidence into account. You ignored the link Tinchey posted like it wouldn't exist, lol.

vatroslav_cro

22nd August 2013, 16:10

But it is still obvious it has its own international classification: (hrv)

Yoni

22nd August 2013, 16:14

No I didn't ignore it, but there is also this one (I wonder how did he miss THAT one)?:

Croatian (hrvatski jezik) is a standardized register of the Serbo-Croatian language

Seems like you did ignore it, i mean, you tried to prove your case with a link that even mentions it being a form of the Serbo-Croatian language.

AdelAdel

22nd August 2013, 16:15

Yes, and read the first sentence xrofl2 "Croatian is a standardized register of the Serbo-Croatian language". This means that it's a variety of Serbo-Croatian, a language which you say doesn't exist :rolleyes: If you read further into the text, you'll see that it's not common knowledge that Croatian is a separate language, as only some linguists classify it this way, and that's purely because of nationalistic reasons (historical and cultural differences between Croatia and the rest).

vatroslav_cro

22nd August 2013, 16:19

OK I see. In your opinion, we don't have a right to have our language. Any other people in Europe have it, but we don't. I see the point.

DanielLuis

22nd August 2013, 16:21

OK I see. In your opinion, we don't have a right to have our language. Any other people in Europe have it, but we don't. I see the point.

That's not what anybody here is saying.

vatroslav_cro

22nd August 2013, 16:23

Then what is? How should I call the language I am speaking to, according to the previous comments? I really don't know!

AdelAdel

22nd August 2013, 16:26

Then what is? How should I call the language I am speaking to, according to the previous comments? I really don't know!

You speak a Serbo-Croatian variant called Croatian.

vatroslav_cro

22nd August 2013, 16:27

Yeah...right. Now you said everything, indeed.

Venage

22nd August 2013, 16:51

Out of curiosity: Does that mean that all Serbians understand Croatian and vice versa? Or is it more like the relationship between German and Dutch where you cannot completely understand the other language but rather get the rough meaning of someone's statement.

SRBIJA

22nd August 2013, 16:58

Out of curiosity: Does that mean that all Serbians understand Croatian and vice versa? Or is it more like the relationship between German and Dutch where you cannot completely understand the other language but rather get the rough meaning of someone's statement.

Yes. You might find specific word that you can't understand but that quite rare and ofc you can still understand the main point. So much stronger relationship than between ::de and ::nl :p

Milos-BC

22nd August 2013, 16:58

^^ We completely understand each others.

There are differences between Serbian and Croatian, it's not the same language although it is indeed very similar. Some words are totally different. For example in ::hr "week" is called "tjedan" and over here "nedelja". The names for the months are different in ::rs and ::hr etc..........the two languages are very similar, but they have differences. We have a Cyrillic letter as well, ::hr doesn't etc.........

And btw, Bosnian and Montenegrin don't exist as languages. Both of them are Serbian, but in different dialect.

Yoni

22nd August 2013, 17:03

Out of curiosity: Does that mean that all Serbians understand Croatian and vice versa? Or is it more like the relationship between German and Dutch where you cannot completely understand the other language but rather get the rough meaning of someone's statement.

in example in the NSC skype convos we have people from bosnia/croatia/serbia and even montenegro and they all understand each other when talking in that language :D

SRBIJA

22nd August 2013, 17:08

Out of curiosity: Does that mean that all Serbians understand Croatian and vice versa? Or is it more like the relationship between German and Dutch where you cannot completely understand the other language but rather get the rough meaning of someone's statement.

Although there is no word 'mižerja' in ::rs and I cant think of any suitable word to replace it with :lol:

Venage

22nd August 2013, 17:20

^

Thank you for the explanation :D Croatian and Serbian look really almost the same.

doctormalisimo

22nd August 2013, 17:20

OK I see. In your opinion, we don't have a right to have our language. Any other people in Europe have it, but we don't. I see the point.

Language is not nation-specific. If it was, countries like Switzerland, Belgium, Finland, Ireland, UK, Spain etc wouldnt exist. You can make up whatever feels right to you, but from an objective linguistic point of view, both Serbian and Croatian are dialects of a greater Serbo-Croatian language.

vatroslav_cro

22nd August 2013, 17:54

But they cannot be "dialects" becuase each of them already has its OWN dialects: kajkavian, čakavian and štokavian (kaikavian, chakavian and shtokavian) in Croatian, whether there is only štokavijan (shtokavian) in Serbian!
Serbian doesn't recognize kajkavian and chakavian!

Language is not nation-specific. If it was, countries like Switzerland, Belgium, Finland, Ireland, UK, Spain etc wouldnt exist. You can make up whatever feels right to you, but from an objective linguistic point of view, both Serbian and Croatian are dialects of a greater Serbo-Croatian language.

btw Finland, Spain and UK HAVE their native languages...even Ireland but you don't use it so often as you use English language......so I really don't see a point of your statement here?

RainyWoods

22nd August 2013, 18:19

So here's mine:

Ukrainian ::ua
Russian ::ru

^ I like Slavic languages in general, but those two are my favs amongst them.

Hebrew ::il
German ::de

I'm with A-Lister. I personally love the languages of all four countries mentioned there, especially German. There's something about the language that appeals to me so much. It's a very strong, (dare I say) harsh sounding language. There is nothing better for me than Neoclassical music sung in the language. Take this Soap&Skin song for instance..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdjXKwW_h1w

Ukrainian and Russian I find incredibly interesting to my ear and Hebrew I think is beautiful when sung in a ballad.

However my most favourite language of all to hear is Albanian. I'm fascinated by it. It's so peculiar to my ear. Sounds quite unlike anything else. It's a shame in the past how many songs they have translated to English for the contest. Keeping "Suus" in Albanian was certainly the right thing to do.

randajad

22nd August 2013, 18:41

Although there is no word 'mižerja' in ::rs and I cant think of any suitable word to replace it with :lol: You should try mizerija, jad. :D

And that Serbo-Croatian thing is so true. Actually, it is one language, but people made four of it, although it is still so funny to hear for Bosnian and Montenegrin.

amateur

22nd August 2013, 19:25

YAY there is a thread about languages! How could I miss this?

Let's see, I feel this will be quite a long list: ESTONIAN, Finnish, Hungarian, Icelandic, English, Serbo-Croatian, Italian, Turkmen, Uzbek, Hebrew, Japanese. There probably is more, but these are the ones that come to my mind at the moment.

AdelAdel

22nd August 2013, 19:28

But they cannot be "dialects" becuase each of them already has its OWN dialects: kajkavian, čakavian and štokavian (kaikavian, chakavian and shtokavian) in Croatian, whether there is only štokavijan (shtokavian) in Serbian!
Serbian doesn't recognize kajkavian and chakavian!

"The Kajkavian dialect is is a dialect of the Serbo-Croatian language spoken by Croats in northwestern part of Croatia."
It's something like Standard Croatian dialect and minor Croatian dialects.

doctormalisimo

22nd August 2013, 19:33

btw Finland, Spain and UK HAVE their native languages...even Ireland but you don't use it so often as you use English language......so I really don't see a point of your statement here?

Finland, Spain, UK and Ireland all have minority languages (Swedish, Catalan/Basque, Welsh/Scottish and Irish respectively). My point is that if you divide areas of linguistic difference, then modern countries don't exist. Trying to define a nationality by a language is a not good thing to do. Saying that 'Serbian and Croatian are different languages because they're spoken in different countries' is not a valid argument.

Jim

22nd August 2013, 20:08

-Greek (My language)
-English
-Italian
-Spanish
-German

vatroslav_cro

22nd August 2013, 20:12

I am not talking about it at all, David! But your argument is not very strong as well.

btw: Wikiedia ain't the only reliable data source in Internet. There are some ohter sources too. Wikipedia is a bit outdated (I mean in general).

And btw, Bosnian and Montenegrin don't exist as languages. Both of them are Serbian, but in different dialect.
ok, time out xbow

bosnian=serbian? :mrgreen:
do u really want to go there? :mrgreen:

also, as far as i know, montenegrin is far from serbian :mrgreen:

how did i miss this discussion earlier? xrofl2

anyways, for those who are wondering: there is no serbo-croatian language. there's serbian and there's croatian.
also, it would be really nice if people who don't know a single word from my language stop teaching me what language i am speaking, thank you :mrgreen:

Tinchey

7th October 2013, 03:36

Well Serbo-Croatian is a idea for macrolanguage with 4 sub-languages (varieties, whatever) in it, though it makes sense, it is not recommended to classify it as language. At least that's what I think, but it's not a good idea to tell someone that she/he is speaking serbo-croatian cause you might get in trouble, some linguists in Croatia called it lingual genocide, and it's a delicate topic, well almost tabu... but it's not even mentioned or spoken about it, at least I haven't heard it. Personally I don't mind it, I speak a language and with it I can communicate with citizens of Serbia, Bosnia & Herzegovina and Montenegro without any difficulties (except for some regional expressions etc.). But the whole thing about serbo-croatian is just ridiculous... it's obvious that they are similar but still not the same. Montenegrin and Bosnian could not be Serbian, especially Montenegrin since they have two more letters, and they sound to me like people of south Croatia more than they sound like Serbian people, but I'm not saying that it's a variety of Croatian. EXYU is sometimes so complicated and fucked up. :(

EDIT: The reason why it shouldn't be used as a term is probably because before 1850s it wasn't even used or thought about it... before there were Croatian, Serbian and Montenegrin, never mentioned as one language... but then these unionistic, southslavic ideas came and the idea of Serbo-Croatian was created. :) Hope this makes it clear for everyone. :)

Milos-BC

7th October 2013, 10:00

ok, time out xbow

bosnian=serbian? :mrgreen:
do u really want to go there? :mrgreen:

also, as far as i know, montenegrin is far from serbian :mrgreen:

Go where?

As far as I am aware, it is a posture of all relevant linguistic institutions (language institutes in the first place). And that is that Muslims (so I don't count Serbs and Croats who live in ::ba and declare that way) in Bosnia speak Bosniak which is a sub-variant of Serbian, and that is how it is treated in the relevant linguistic institutions. But as a separate language like Serbian and Croatian, it doesn't exist. Bosnian language is something that obviously the authorities have put in order to make the national feeling firmer in its own borders (being as multi-ethnic as it is), but Bosnian language, as a separate language doesn't exist and isn't recognized anywhere. It would be the same as if someone from Austria said he speaks Austrian language or if we hear that someone in Moldova speaks Moldavian.

In what way is Montenegrin far from Serbian? And also why are their now really attempts in ::me to create their own language (and yet again, these newly invented rules are recognized nowhere, and none of the Montenegrin people use them) and differentiate from Serbian, if they are that far? They now added something like "tvrdi" and "meki znak", something that never existed in any of the ex-yu languages and their subvariants claiming that it is "old Montenegrin", and why does no single person in Montenegro use those rules? Try to find one word in "Montenegrin" that doesn't exist in Serbian, and you will not find any, because there is no word in "Montenegrin" that doesn't exist in Serbian. There are, also, parts of Serbia where people speak on ijekavica and is that far from the original Serbian language too?

It is easy to find different words in Serbian and Croatian, because they are different languages (although similar), and not to mention Slovenian and Macedonian, but you will not find any language particularities in either "Bosnian" or "Montenegrin" for one simple reason - none of those two exist as separate languages. It is not something that I made up or invented, it is a posture of all relevant linguistic institutions, as I already said

:mrgreen:

LakZaNokte

7th October 2013, 17:00

Go where?

As far as I am aware, it is a posture of all relevant linguistic institutions (language institutes in the first place). And that is that Muslims (so I don't count Serbs and Croats who live in ::ba and declare that way) in Bosnia speak Bosniak which is a sub-variant of Serbian, and that is how it is treated in the relevant linguistic institutions. But as a separate language like Serbian and Croatian, it doesn't exist. Bosnian language is something that obviously the authorities have put in order to make the national feeling firmer in its own borders (being as multi-ethnic as it is), but Bosnian language, as a separate language doesn't exist and isn't recognized anywhere. It would be the same as if someone from Austria said he speaks Austrian language or if we hear that someone in Moldova speaks Moldavian.
whose institutions? :mrgreen:

In what way is Montenegrin far from Serbian? And also why are their now really attempts in ::me to create their own language (and yet again, these newly invented rules are recognized nowhere, and none of the Montenegrin people use them) and differentiate from Serbian, if they are that far? They now added something like "tvrdi" and "meki znak", something that never existed in any of the ex-yu languages and their subvariants claiming that it is "old Montenegrin", and why does no single person in Montenegro use those rules? Try to find one word in "Montenegrin" that doesn't exist in Serbian, and you will not find any, because there is no word in "Montenegrin" that doesn't exist in Serbian. There are, also, parts of Serbia where people speak on ijekavica and is that far from the original Serbian language too?
here's a link to montenegrin constitution
link (https://www.google.hr/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&ved=0CCsQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.cgo-cce.org%2F2013%2F06%2F1-ustav-crne-gore.pdf&ei=UMpSUt7nLI7Q4QSAsoHYDA&usg=AFQjCNH1dcB7f0iWmbO9rjprIZp61xt0sg&bvm=bv.53537100,d.bGE) (go to 13.)
what does it say there? xbow

apparently, bosnian constitution doesn't say anything about official language. and that's because there is no agreement between all sides about bosnian language (and there will never be one, but nevermind that now), in bosnian institutions :mrgreen:
bosnian is underlined because they are the ones that will make that decision, right? :mrgreen:

It is easy to find different words in Serbian and Croatian, because they are different languages (although similar), and not to mention Slovenian and Macedonian, but you will not find any language particularities in either "Bosnian" or "Montenegrin" for one simple reason - none of those two exist as separate languages. It is not something that I made up or invented, it is a posture of all relevant linguistic institutions, as I already said

:mrgreen:
oh i'm not disputing that languages are similar, that would be ridiculous xshrug
but again, what institutions are u talking about here? :mrgreen:

LakZaNokte

7th October 2013, 17:04

EXYU is sometimes so complicated and fucked up. :(

sometimes? xrofl2

Milos-BC

7th October 2013, 22:28

First of all, I am not sure what exactly you are implying or what hurts you in this case.

Second, on page #13 of their constitution I found nothing related to this case. The issues mentioned there have no relations with language issues.

Next thing, I explained that, in order to try and differentiate totally from Serbian, the authorities in ::me are now trying to make up new rules for the, so called, Montenegrin language, that never existed and that ::me people don't accept and laugh at. If using symbols that we find in Russian for example, and for which they claim that it were part of "old and real Montenegrin language that every person in ::me spoken" why such symbols are never found in "Gorski Vijenac" for example? Why none of those old writings uses those rules of "old Montenegrin"? If that is something that existed for centuries, like the ::me authorities claim, why can't they give us a proof of at least one of those public texts where we can see them in practice? I saw many of them, and I never saw those rules being used, just like I don't see any ::me person using them now either. So much of "old Montenegrin" and this issue.

As for the institutions, it is a common posture of all ex-yu institutes for their corresponding language (Institut za srpski jezik i knjizevnost, institut za hrvatski jezik i knjizevnost, Institut za makedonski jezik i knjizevnost and Institut za slovenacki jezik i knjizevnost. In ::ba the opinion is divided, and one side tries to put Bosnian language as a standard language but so far, fails to do so, because it is not recognized as such even in ::ba and that is what you stated as well, correctly of course, where you indirectly admitted as well what is known - that Bosnian as a seperate language doesn't exist), just like institutions like Matica Srpska, Matica Hrvatska, etc............

This is what for example one professor from Instiut za srpski jezik i knjizevnost says about "Montenegrin" language (he is born in ::me by the way, an interesting fact, so he is Montenegrin, not a Serb ;):

So, they also clearly state that it doesn't exist. You have to agree that these people certainly know better than you and me, and I believe in what they say ;) When they change their opinion, I will also change mine, obviously.

I remember that I was watching a show on HRT as well regarding this case, so I know that people in your institute think the same. If I find something on the net I will paste it here, but until then, it is enough to see what Montenegrin linguists think of "Montenegrin" language in this post.

And by saying this:

here is no agreement between all sides about bosnian language (and there will never be one, but nevermind that now), in bosnian institutions

You also admitted that Bosnian doesn't exist, which is what is true anyway.

I see that you are trying to make me look like someone who denies Bosnians and Montenegrins their own language, while the reality is that I don't have anything to deny, because even they deny their own newly composed "languages" and I listen to what some people that certainly know better than me on this issue have to say ;)

Now that you saw the institutions, I would like to know what are the huge differences between Montenegrin and Serbian, if you think that all these professors are not right and are talking bulls.hit.

LakZaNokte

7th October 2013, 23:05

oh, not page 13., article 13.
anyways, it says official language in mne is montenegrin. serbian, croatian etc are listed as languages that are also in use in mne.

the thing is, u can't despute some1's constitution :mrgreen:
u can name and quote 1000 "scientists" and all that (btw, they both speak in fluent ekavica :mrgreen:) but u can't state that it "says wrong" in the constitution. if they stated they speak svahili, then they speak svahili, as far as it goes for u and me both xbow

as for bosnian, it is clear that there will never be an agreement on that issue, it's a dead topic anyways.
but bosnian is not serbian :mrgreen:
there is serbian language in bosnia, yes, but bosnian isn't serbian
bosnian muslims mostly speak in ijekavica, serbian speaking muslims have always been a minority.
i mean, if we go down this road we will end up in otoman empire. and then we will discuss the ethnicity of bosnian muslims. and then we will have to stop cause this isn't politics :mrgreen:

(that effort to try to push ijekavski version of serbian as something relevant is ridicilous, even if it exists, it doesn't prove anything; we have a croatian version of ekavica for that matter (in zagorje) but they are both exceptions, as official grammar and all that is well known for both of us, we all know where we stand xbow)

dogmeat

8th October 2013, 01:01

If you could stop using this :mrgreen: and other similar icons in random, inadequate places, i might be more willing to read your posts.

MyHeartIsYours

8th October 2013, 05:11

Does it really matter? You all vote for each other in Eurovision anyway.

Tinchey

8th October 2013, 05:12

Does it really matter? You all vote for each other in Eurovision anyway.

How do you know our secret?!?!?! :o

Tinchey

8th October 2013, 05:13

If you could stop using this :mrgreen: and other similar icons in random, inadequate places, i might be more willing to read your posts.

Oh god... omfg... oh jesus.

LakZaNokte

8th October 2013, 07:58

If you could stop using this :mrgreen: and other similar icons in random, inadequate places, i might be more willing to read your posts.
oh they aren't inadequate, trust me :mrgreen:

SRBIJA

8th October 2013, 14:06

Does it really matter? You all vote for each other in Eurovision anyway.

Our constitution also says that Kosovo is autonomous province that belongs to Serbia. But is it like that in reality? Ofc not :lol:

Verjamem

9th October 2013, 23:21

Okay, Montenegrin people invented Montenegrin language, because they don't wanted to use and recognize Serbian tongue as their national. Like Lak said, case is closed :p

r3gg13

10th October 2013, 21:26

It's the crossroads between language, politics and identity.

This is a matter of politics and identity more than linguistics.

POLITICALLY, if a country wants to call the standards of Serbo-Croatian (that's the term linguists use, we don't use it with political intentions) different names, so be it! It's a country's prerogative to call it as such. Language is closely intertwined with cultural and social identity. If a country wants to trace its own identity by means of renaming and standardizing their dialect, it's that country's prerogative.

Linguistically speaking, that's a different matter. Serbo-Croatian is a pluricentric language meaning it has multiple standardized variants - Serbian, Croatian, Montenegrin and Bosnian (and yes that's what linguists call it, I know that name has heavy political implications, but it refers to the entire linguistic continuum). Each of them have their own governing body that standardizes each of them. So, in linguistic terms it's 1 language with multiple standards just like English and how it has an American, British, Australian, etc standard variants.

The key issue here is politics not linguistics, IMO

Personally, if USA and other Anglophone countries decide to call our/their variants of English different names, I would be cool with it. It's all politics and it's nice to formalize some sort of independent linguistic identity. Though, at the end of the day, it wouldn't matter. The linguistic differences already exist regardless of the naming change. If that were to happen, I could say that I speak more languages :lol:. USA will then proudly speak American and understand British, Australian among other languages :lol:

vatroslav_cro

10th October 2013, 23:16

It is not really the same case Reggie (I hope I won't be attacked "on knives" now....)

r3gg13

10th October 2013, 23:47

^^ Do you mean then that this is not a case of politics?

vatroslav_cro

11th October 2013, 09:24

Yes Reggie..... there are some differences in general, I mean between the cases of "American, Canadian, Australian English" and "Serbo-Croatian".....

LakZaNokte

11th October 2013, 17:06

The key issue here is politics not linguistics, IMO

ofc it's about politics xshrug

we can discuss about linguistics till cows come home and come up with nothing.
hell, we should include bulgarians as well then cause i understand them better than slovenians and macedonians, and yet they are always outside of these "discussions" (which shows they are not about linguistics, btw). same goes for all other slavic languages: i can pick up on russian (if it's slow enough and in simple sentences xrofl2), i had numerous occasions where i was able to get on the same page with czech, slovakian and polish tourists etc. so what?

this has to do with everything but linguistics :mrgreen:

r3gg13

11th October 2013, 17:32

Yes Reggie..... there are some differences in general, I mean between the cases of "American, Canadian, Australian English" and "Serbo-Croatian".....

In terms of politics yeah there's a lot of difference. In terms of linguistics they are analogous cases.

ofc it's about politics xshrug

we can discuss about linguistics till cows come home and come up with nothing.
hell, we should include bulgarians as well then cause i understand them better than slovenians and macedonians, and yet they are always outside of these "discussions" (which shows they are not about linguistics, btw). same goes for all other slavic languages: i can pick up on russian (if it's slow enough and in simple sentences xrofl2), i had numerous occasions where i was able to get on the same page with czech, slovakian and polish tourists etc. so what?

this has to do with everything but linguistics :mrgreen:

Exactly!

There's also bigger language continuums like South Slavic which includes Serbo-Croatian, Slovenian, Macedonian and Bulgarian for instance (where Kajkavica is the intermediate language between Serbo-Croatian and Slovenian, and Torlaci being the intermediate between Serbo-Croatian and Macedonian).

All of that is well documented and researched by both people who speak those languages and people who don't. Discussion of the similarity is not really the point here because that's already validated by linguistic research and by people understanding each other. As you mentioned, it's all about politics.

LakZaNokte

11th October 2013, 18:38

There's also bigger language continuums like South Slavic which includes Serbo-Croatian, Slovenian, Macedonian and Bulgarian for instance (where Kajkavica is the intermediate language between Serbo-Croatian and Slovenian, and Torlaci being the intermediate between Serbo-Croatian and Macedonian).

serbo-croatian thing kinda fails on kajkavica - it is spoken only in north-west part of croatia (including zagreb) and parts of slovenia (or entire, don't know tbh) but it is not used in serbian at all.
also, seriously, i never heard of torlaci. u say it's something that has to do with macedonian so i'm guessing it could be some sort of bond between serbian and macedonian (probably around the border, just like kajkavica for us and slovenia) but i honestly don't know. basically, croatian and macedonian are very far apart. don't ask me to elaborate cause i can't xrofl2, i can only tell u that i don't understand them any better than czechs, for example.

not to mention the fact that this is only about official languages. just here we have several dialects so different that even we have problems with understanding some of them (those from istria and upper north; border with hungary where u can actually find some sort of weird mix between croatian and hungarian xrofl2).

like i said, this could go on forever xshrug

r3gg13

11th October 2013, 19:21

This discussion could go forever :lol:. I could go forever too since I like talking about this type of things xrofl2

I can't understand how ex-yugoslavs can't understand macedonian or bulgarian? I mean macedonian have only a few different words and two letters (i think) in comparision with serbo-croatian

BTW i am in love with greek right now

Tinchey

19th October 2013, 14:42

I can't understand how ex-yugoslavs can't understand macedonian or bulgarian? I mean macedonian have only a few different words and two letters (i think) in comparision with serbo-croatian

BTW i am in love with greek right now

Maybe it's because croatian and serbian are different after all. :)

vatroslav_cro

21st October 2013, 13:27

I can understand macedonian (partly, and only when it is spoken slowly, also can recognize when it is written):)

Sandy

23rd October 2013, 17:29

I dont think i have a favourite i think all have something nice when you listen
ok some language we used too more to hear like french.. but does not mean i like the rest less

Banana238

6th November 2013, 00:55

I love all Scandinavian languages, but especially Norwegian and Finnish. I can't explain why, they're just xheart xlove
And I love Japanese, it sounds so cute and is actually an easy language, but it's completely different from the Germanic languages, that's why it's hard to learn for me...

Mattan

8th November 2013, 16:03

I love all Scandinavian languages, but especially Norwegian and Finnish. I can't explain why, they're just xheart xlove

What exactly do Norwegian and Finnish have to do with each other? They're in separate language families. xhmm

Banana238

8th November 2013, 21:23

What exactly do Norwegian and Finnish have to do with each other? They're in separate language families. xhmm

I'm sorry, I meant Nordic languages :D

And I didn't even say they have something to do with each other. xhmm

Mattan

8th November 2013, 21:51

I'm sorry, I meant Nordic languages :D

And I didn't even say they have something to do with each other. xhmm

Actually, you did just that. You grouped Finnish together with Scandinavian languages (a subgroup of North Germanic languages) whereas it has nothing to do with them. Also, Nordic languages don't include Finnish either - the languages spoken in Nordic countries do, but the group of Nordic languages (North Germanic languages) doesn't - however, the Convention of Nordic Languages does include Finnish, as they're referring to languages spoken in Nordic countries. :lol: I'm just being really picky about this, but oh well, I was the one who started it. Sorry about that. xrose

Just out of curiosity, what does Estonian sound like to you? I quite dislike how Finnish sounds, but really like Estonian - it just has a softer tone. Also, it appears to have quite many loan words from Germanic languages (because of a shared past) that have different words in Finnish.

Banana238

8th November 2013, 22:29

Actually, you did just that. You grouped Finnish together with Scandinavian languages (a subgroup of North Germanic languages) whereas it has nothing to do with them. Also, Nordic languages don't include Finnish either - the languages spoken in Nordic countries do, but the group of Nordic languages (North Germanic languages) doesn't - however, the Convention of Nordic Languages does include Finnish, as they're referring to languages spoken in Nordic countries. :lol: I'm just being really picky about this, but oh well, I was the one who started it. Sorry about that. xrose

Just out of curiosity, what does Estonian sound like to you? I quite dislike how Finnish sounds, but really like Estonian - it just has a softer tone. Also, it appears to have quite many loan words from Germanic languages (because of a shared past) that have different words in Finnish.
xhelp:lol:
Well, when I say Nordic languages, I refer to the languages spoken in Nordic countries. This may be incorrect on linguistic grounds. :D I know that Finnish isn't a Scandinavian language, and I can understand why you are picky about this. It's just that I write faster than I think. :? :D

I don't hear a very big difference between Estonian and Finnish, since I haven't heard much Estonian yet. The only Estonian I know are the ESC entries in this language :D I really like both languages, personally I think they both sound very soft :) Is it easy for Finnish people to understand Estonian, like it's easy for Norwegians to understand Swedish or Danish?

SRBIJA

9th November 2013, 00:26

::hu
::de
::dk/::se/::no
::sl/::cz

xdrool

Mattan

9th November 2013, 11:25

Is it easy for Finnish people to understand Estonian, like it's easy for Norwegians to understand Swedish or Danish?

Using a bit of imagination, you can read Estonian quite well if you only know Finnish (though especially the words that were created ex nihilo will be confusing). You could normally understand parts of spoken Estonian, but I usually get a bit annoyed listening to Estonian being spoken, since it sounds so similar to Finnish, yet I can't understand what is being said, even though I can pick up parts of it. :lol: Finnish and Estonian certainly aren't as close as the Scandinavian languages, but there are clear similarities.

greece

16th January 2014, 13:09

I prefer the exSoviet languages....my fave:
::ru
::az
::ua
::lt

But I can speak:
::gr
::uk
And a bit:
::ru
::az

lilka

11th February 2014, 20:06

My number 1 is ::gr (which I speak)! xheart
I also love ::se ,of which I know only some words but I love its sound.

Wait, I've not said that I HATE Spanish and I have not offended you. I just find it boring that people are saying all the time that Spanish is "sooooo romantic and beautiful". ;)

Iuris

17th February 2014, 22:14

^^^ I'm not offended. :lol: But I think it happens the same with French and Italian, and I love them. Especially French...

lilka

17th February 2014, 22:25

Oh yes, of course, it's the same situation with Italian and French, but mostly with Spanish. Anyway, I like all of them, I just find them a bit boring. ;)

whiteshoes

17th February 2014, 22:25

If men speak French, it sounds very gay.
No offense against gay people, but I personally prefer more masculine sounding languages. So I don't consider French as a beautiful langauge. In addition I don't even like written French... You never know how to pronounce. And then the grammatic and the irregular verbs puuuh okay but thats rather off-topic
Italian sounds very smooth, I like this
Spanish is full of passion imo
But my favorite language is Icelandic... it's magic, exotic and impressive.. Danish is very nice as well, a bit underrated

I can't judge about how German sounds, but I heard many people saying that German sounds kind of intelligent

lilka

17th February 2014, 22:37

To my ears German sounds harsh.

Paddy

19th February 2014, 19:53

But my favorite language is Icelandic... it's magic, exotic and impressive.. Danish is very nice as well, a bit underrated

I can't judge about how German sounds, but I heard many people saying that German sounds kind of intelligent

To be honest, I think Danish and Icelandic are the most awful languages :lol: I just don't like the sound of it...

greece

19th February 2014, 19:57

To be honest, I think Danish and Icelandic are the most awful languages :lol: I just don't like the sound of it...
+1 I always believed that

ByeKitty

24th February 2014, 03:09

French xheart Such a classy, tuneful, exciting language.

Also, I find Southern Slavic languages + Polish particularly sexy when used by a male speaker.

ByeKitty

24th February 2014, 03:14

To be honest, I think Danish and Icelandic are the most awful languages :lol: I just don't like the sound of it...

To me, Danish sounds like English in rewind - but I find it really cute. :)

EscTurkey

24th February 2014, 22:30

Y NO ONE LIKE ::jp :((

Yamarus

24th February 2014, 22:32

Japanese is beautiful! Unfortunately it's such a complex language that it makes it very difficult to access for non-native speakers.

r3gg13

24th February 2014, 22:53

I spoke it when I was a child, I wish I could still speak Japanese

Quent91

25th February 2014, 18:37

konnichiwa

Leaphar

1st March 2014, 00:37

My favourite languages are Swedish, Norwegian, German, Finnish, English and Hungarian.
English and Swedish are the best to me. German is so difficult (der, die, das) but it's awesome :D

Especially the first 2 and the last 2, it's a shame they're all so hard to learn :(

They're my favourites, although I love a lot of other languages too!

JamesUK1990

20th March 2014, 23:17

I love languages in general, though love individual languages for different reasons. I have a real soft spot for Hungarian, fell in love with the language, country and culture and just love how unusual it is compared to European languages. I love music from the Balkans, so love the sound of Croatian/Bosnian/Serbian, Albanian and Macedonia. Fascinated by Irish Gaelic and Welsh too. Counting up, there are probably at least 15 languages I'd like to learn :P

Archer

17th May 2014, 17:28

Japanese, Finnish, Estonian, Korean, Irish.

cassidian

2nd July 2014, 22:09

The languages that I speak already?

::uk My first language!

::sc I am Scottish, so I also speak Glaswegian, not an actual language, but still a bonus! (not to be confused with Scots or Gaelic)

::ie My grandparents are irish so I sometimes speak limited irish to them

::fr Been studying french for about 4 years now, I would say I am about semi-fluent, can read and write great, speaking and listening still need work ;)

::de Just started learning last year, I know greetings etc., all the basics really, although I will be sitting an exam in it in May so I need to push on with that!~

::es Once again, just started learning briefly, about the same level as German, probably won't be pursuing it though!

::it Been casually learning for about a year now, not getting very far but it isn't my main priority at the moment.

::gr I know the Greek alphabet, does that count?!

::ua Started learning about 2 days ago, just really liked the language so I thought, I'll go ahead and learn it!

::ru Will be starting after summer

::pl My dad's partner is Polish, so I know a bit of this and a bit of that to get me by

Languages I'd like to learn!

::se It weirdly intrigues me!

::pt it sounds like a nice language

greece

3rd July 2014, 07:24

^^This thread is about ur fave languages. There is another thread (http://www.escunited.com/t11757/) that u can say what languages u speak :D

My favorite languages are still the languages I studied at uni :D : ::fr and ::es. French is just WOW, it is beautiful, sexy, cute, romantic, rough,... Love it. I can't get enough of it. Spanish is nice and I love the sounds and intonation.

Besides those languages, I started learning ::gr Greek in a school after my work. I loooooooove it. It sounds difficult and it is lol, but I will speak it fluently after years of study lol. I'm going to my second year and probably will do a summer course in Greece or Cyprus to speed up the learning process.

I also love ::se, ::dk, ::pt, ::it, ::il and Catalan.

As a Dutch teacher, I kinda like ::nl Dutch too. The vowels are special xlove