Originally posted by DangerDeath
All over the place in USSR and similar countries, taking pictures was strictly forbidden in most public places. Even today, this habit persists. And,
obviously, as the states feel more and more insecure, it is spreading worldwide.

That's just not true. In Russia you're probably better off taking photos in public than you're in modern western countries. I know tons of
photographers who do regularly go to ex-soviets block to shoot stuff.
The way it is now in US and UK specifically is pure facism.

It's used all the time. Especially guards who are not police like to throw in the terrorist card. Also places like metro stations who by policy allow
photography still like to use the patriot act to harass photographers. New in this field is the wiretapping laws which they like to throw in these
days. Most photographers are aware of the thread and keep a video camera handy which then is turned against them.

What makes it more compelling is that they manipulated the man into a situation for them to make a arrest and enforcing that with a comment on how he
held his camera,

He was aproached 3 times by the police who claimed they had the right to ask for his personal information and in all 3 instances he asked if he was
being detained.To wich the anwser was either "no" or ignored completly.The 3e time the just kept asking for his personals when he asked if they had
any reason to detain him.They simply avoided the question altogether in the end,remarkably.

By now they could say that this man was suspicious and :sarcasm incomming: it ofcourse all started with "the way he held his camera.
(what if he was writing on a notepad?)

Now everyone should have to wonder, how can anyone not be suspicious and be arrested at a whim under these laws ?

Cant i now be arrested for "The suspicious way i was sitting on a bench in a park"? Or for "The suspicious way i was window shopping" ?

The trouble these days is that once you question the authority of the police to stop you and refuse to provide details, as is your right (especially
when they try the section 44 BS), they'll then change tack and stick you with a public order offence, just to make a point.
Stick you in a cell for a few hours then let you go without charge, even when they know you have done nothing wrong.

See, it's not about innocence or guilt, it's about questioning their perceived authority over you. Many of these bozos in uniform see themselves as
being above the rest of us, and must be obeyed.

Originally posted by LieBuster
This is BS and the police are acting worse than Hittlers SS Guards

There certainly are elements within our Police Forces that act like complete twats and think they are a law unto themselves etc, but they haven't
sent anyone to the gas chambers or attempted any ethnic cleansing, so I think comparisons to the SS are little bit over the top and an insult to the
genuine police officers, there are some you know.

If I was approached in such circumstances I would never give them my personal details and suspect that I eventually get arrested and possibly even
deliberately commit a minor public order offence to ensure I would have my day in court.

You DO NOT have to give your details to any Police person (be they plastic, hobby-bobby or real) unless they have reasonable cause, ie you are
suspected of committing an offence.

Now, I cannot watch the video as I am at work, but I imagine they tried the old "section 44" route? Either that or use the Terrorism Act to say
taking pictures of police/public buildings etc is illegal.

Firstly, the Police have been told off for abusing section 44 powers as they only really apply to a designated area authorised by a Chief Constable
for a defined period of time. I highly doubt this area was under such an order so any Section 44 attempt would be illegal.

Secondly, it is not illegal (no matter what the Police might say at the time) to take pictures of the Police, public buildings etc UNLESS there
is REASONABLE grounds to assume the person is using said photo's for the prepartion of an act of terrorism. The Met had to issue a special
guidance notice last year to inform their plod of this as they were interpretting the law themselves, which is not what they are supposed to do.

The problems arise when you get idot Police who don't know anything about the law encounter idiot Joe Publics who also know fudge all about their
rights.

The only things that taking pictures of is slightly illegal is Military installations (the Police think they class as military, but they don't) and
even then, as long as you are not calle Mohammed El Kaboom, then they can't really tell you off. You can happily snap from a hill overlooking Gosport
of all the RN ships there and it isn't illegal.

The problem, like I said, arises from plain ignorance on both sides. Know your rights and this problem doesn't exist, so it's a bit OTT to declare
the UK as a Police state when in actuallity it is down to morons interpreting the Law incorrectly.

EDIT: I have a feeling people will skim my post as it will interfere with their rants about the Uk being like Nazi Germany...

Loved this video, I have had a similar problem with the police however i was not arrested they took on my point. It was only a few months ago on a
night out they randomly asked me and my friend for our details. I asked why and they just said you are acting suspiciously when we asked them to
justify this they couldn’t and then said we don’t need it under section 44 of the anti-terrorist act. After this I pointed out this could only be
used with authorisation and asked for proof of it and pointed out the legality then asked them to check if they could legally invoke the act. After
this they called their control centre for advice and were told unless they had probable cause they had to let us walk, so we did. They were all very
nice about it and genuinely seemed interested that people actually know about the last.

I think here, things may have been different, I thinks its just that the second PC is on a power trip and her sergeant is supporting her. I don’t
know about the other piece of legislation that they used to arrest them but it seems to me that its just the police on a power run. Its quite
interesting because i have read quite a bit about how section 44 has been abused in recent weeks. Don’t think we are heading to a Orwellian state,
the Anti-terrorist act is a necessary tool in fighting terrorism however i do think that we need to amend with more safeguards.

The Act has safeguards which are routinely ignored by Police and the Public allow it owing to ignorance. It's nice to see you actually knew your
rights!

The remedy is simple, better training for Police as to what they can and can't do. At the moment, it seems they are allowed some free reign when
interpreting the meaning of these laws, which leads to abuses.

I totally agree with what you are saying, but the problem is that the public SHOULD be able to trust that the Police know the law, and that the Police
can help the public at all times. The Police should be enforcing the laws properly and should know them inside out.

It's at a stage now that the PUBLIC are going to have to study the law for themselves in order to teach the Police when they are pulled up as this
photographer was.

Very few members of the public would even know what 'section 44' is and would therefore give in immediatly to the incompetent policeperson/s.

Unfortunatly we live in a society now where no-one is trusted, paranoia is rife, and terrorism rules the news.

This content community relies on user-generated content from our member contributors. The opinions of our members are not those of site ownership who maintains strict editorial agnosticism and simply provides a collaborative venue for free expression.