Thursday, June 13, 2013

Right now American politicians are doing their best to roll back
voting rights won during our own Civil Rights movement. They are
putting in place educational “reforms” which disproportionately have a
negative impact on black and brown and poor white kids, and will
essentially help to solidify a permanent underclass. Right now there
are laws in places like Florida and Texas which are intended to make it
essentially legal for white people to just shoot people like me, without
consequence, as long as they feel threatened by my presence. So:
admitting that the land we live on was stolen from hundreds of other
nations and peoples? Acknowledging that the prosperity the United
States enjoys was bought with blood? That’s a pipe dream.

I want you to understand that what you’ve done makes me want to weep with envy, and bitterness, and hope.

For the past few days I’ve also been observing a “kerfuffle”, as some
call it, in reaction to the Science Fiction and Fantasy Writers’ of
America’s latest professional journal, the Bulletin. Some of you may
also have been following the discussion; hopefully not all of you. To
summarize: two of the genre’s most venerable white male writers made
some comments in a series of recent articles which have been decried as
sexist and racist by most of the organization’s membership. Now, to put
this in context: the membership of SFWA also recently voted in a new
president. There were two candidates — one of whom was a self-described
misogynist, racist, anti-Semite, and a few other flavors of asshole.
In this election he lost by a landslide… but he still earned ten percent
of the vote. SFWA is small; only about 500 people voted in total, so
we’re talking less than 50 people. But scale up again. Imagine if ten
percent of this country’s population was busy making active efforts to
take away not mere privileges, not even dignity, but your most basic
rights. Imagine if ten percent of the people you interacted with, on a
daily basis, did not regard you as human.

Just ten percent. But such a ten percent.

And beyond that ten percent are the silent majority — the great
unmeasured mass of enablers. These are the folks who don’t object to
the treatment of women as human beings, and who may even have the odd
black or gay friend that they genuinely like. However, when the ten
percent starts up in their frothing rage, these are the people who say
nothing in response. When women and other marginalized groups respond
with anger to the hatred of the ten percent, these are the people who do
not support them, and in fact suggest that maybe they’re overreacting.
When they read a novel set in a human society which contains only one
or two female characters, these are the people who don’t decry this as
implausible. Or worse, they simply don’t notice. These are the people
who successfully campaigned for Star Trek to return to television after
25 years, but have no intention of campaigning for Roddenberry’s vision
to be complete, with gay characters joining the rainbow brigade on the
bridge. These are the people who gleefully nitpick the scientific
plausibility of stopping a volcano with “cold fusion”, yet who fail to
notice that an author has written a future earth in which somehow
seventeen percent of the human race dominates ninety percent of the
characterization.

Let me be perfectly clear. I do not describe myself as a "misogynist, racist, anti-Semite, and a few other flavors of asshole". John Scalzi, Patrick Nielsen Hayden, and Theresa Nielsen Hayden, among others, have described me that way. Of course, John Scalzi also describes himself as a rapist, Patrick Nielsen Hayden took his wife's name when he got married, and Theresa Nielsen Hayden is dumb enough to have claimed a prominent Game blogger with three Billboard-charting club hits "is not acquainted with actual women."

I therefore suggest that their assertions should be taken with at least a small grain of salt rather than credited to me. And it should be obvious that, being a libertarian, I am not actively attempting to take away anyone's "most basic rights". Jemisin has it wrong; it is not that I, and others, do not view her as human, (although genetic science presently suggests that we are not equally homo sapiens sapiens), it is that we simply do not view her as being fully civilized for the obvious historical reason that she is not.

She is lying about the laws in Texas and Florida too. The laws are not there to let whites " just shoot people like me, without
consequence, as long as they feel threatened by my presence", those self-defense laws have been put in place to let whites defend their lives and their property from people, like her, who are half-savages engaged in attacking them.

Jemisin's disregard for the truth is no different than the average Chicago gangbanger's disregard for the traditional Western code of civilized conduct. She could, if she wished, claim that privileged white males are responsible for the decline of Detroit, for the declining sales of science fiction, even for the economic and cultural decline of the United States, but that would not make it true. It would not even make it credible. Anyone who is paying sufficient attention will understand who is genuinely responsible for these problems.

Unlike the white males she excoriates, there is no evidence to be found anywhere on the planet that a society of NK Jemisins is capable of building an advanced civilization, or even successfully maintaining one without significant external support from those white males. If one considers that it took my English and German ancestors more than one thousand years to become fully civilized after their first contact with advanced Greco-Roman civilization, it should be patently obvious that it is illogical to imagine, let alone insist, that Africans have somehow managed to do the same in less than half the time at a greater geographic distance. These things take time.

Being an educated, but ignorant half-savage, with little more understanding of what it took to build a new literature by "a bunch of beardy old middle-class middle-American guys" than an illiterate Igbotu tribesman has of how to build a jet engine, Jemisin clearly does not understand that her dishonest call for "reconciliation" and even more diversity within SF/F is tantamount to a call for its decline into irrelevance. Nor do the back-patting Samuel Johnsons wiping their eyes and congratulating her for her ever-so-touching speech understand that.

There can be no reconciliation between the observant and the delusional.

UPDATE: It may amuse some of you to know that in making her false claim, NK Jemisin appears to have violated the SFWA Forum rules, which state: "[A]ll posts made here are confidential. Material may not be re-posted
outside these forums without the explicit permission of their authors." I am confident the moderators of the SFWA will be swift to deal with this violation of the organization's rules.

UPDATE 2: The Spitefully Fascist Writers of America are on the job! This post was resulted in the following email: "Your blog feed has been removed from the @SFWAauthors aggregator due to violating of the policies of this service, specifically: "Marking blog posts for inclusion that include threats or personal attacks or obvious trolling will also be grounds for removal.""

UPDATE 3: Now the SFWA moderators have, at least temporarily, wiped my comments off the SFWA Forum thread while leaving the attacks on me untouched. What a pity that 20x more people will read everything here instead. Keep this in mind when you're trying to argue that there are no ideological gatekeepers in the SF/F publishing world. They desperately want to silence all disssent, and they're tremendously frustrated that they don't have the wherewithal.
UPDATE 4: As always, I am quite willing to publicly debate Ms Jemisin, Mr. Sanford, or any other member of the SFWA concerning the issues raised here, be it on the SFWA Forum, this blog, or any other written venue. And if all these passionate champions of human equality are afraid to defend their views in public, as were Messrs Myers and McRapey in the past, well, everyone knows perfectly well what that signifies, their protestations notwithstanding.
UPDATE 5: McRapey has the perfect solution to the Problem that Must Not Be Named. He's going to give money to ANOTHER charity. That will show me!When did "donation" replace "education" as the left-liberal solution to all evils?

These are the people who successfully campaigned for Star Trek to return to television after 25 years, but have no intention of campaigning for Roddenberry’s vision to be complete, with gay characters joining the rainbow brigade on the bridge.

Rainbow brigade.

You know, I always found the really forced diversity of Star Trek obnoxious. I don't mean 'Oh, Geordi is black', but 'Oh great, we have the only human-like android in existence, a half-betazoid whose useful power is crippled as a result, the klingon who was raised by humans...' I always got the impression that in the Star Trek universe, the Enterprise was where the Federation dumped all their freaks before sending them off to the absolute farthest reaches of the galaxy.

Acknowledging that the prosperity the United States enjoys was bought with blood? That’s a pipe dream.

Yeah, another bad day to have these people on "my side".

From her own Bio:

She is the recipient of a Gulliver Travel Grant from the Speculative Literature Foundation (and a judge for the 2010 grant jury), and a graduate of the Viable Paradise writing workshop. She is currently a member of the Altered Fluid writing group. In addition to writing, she is a counseling psychologist (specializing in career counseling), a sometime hiker and biker, and a political/feminist/anti-racist blogger.

Career counselor who can't make a go of her chosen career. Best accomplishments are short-lists for a bunch of store-brand literary awards. Can't stick to hobbies.

A complete and total failure.

I may consider reading some of her work, to see if it's any good. Her snip from one book is basically every kids movie every made, with obligatory bad-boy sex:

"Yeine Darr is an outcast from the barbarian north. But when her mother dies under mysterious circumstances, she is summoned to the majestic city of Sky, seat of the ruling Arameri family. There, to her shock, Yeine is named an heiress to the king. But the throne of the Hundred Thousand Kingdoms is not easily won, and Yeine is thrust into a vicious power struggle with a pair of cousins she never knew she had. As she fights for her life, she draws ever closer to the secrets of her mother’s death and her family’s bloody history."

Lonley outcast, secret family identity, princess in hiding, takes her glasses her off and is a powerful woman. Big surprise. Of course she is, I am sure, oddly beautiful and intriguing.

Why is that the ugliest half-mongoloid looking authoresses always write heroines who are measurably more conventionally beautiful than they were on their best day? They are uniformly strong, fit, sexually appealing and all-around catches. Why don't they ever reflect the appearance of their creators?

Of course we all know the reason: the women who read this type of fiction aren't in it for the science fiction, they are in it for the vicarious thrill of imagining themselves as the heroine, and also getting f$!#ed by the rakish bad-boy, or in this case, the rakishly unconventional demi-god. And no women wants to imagine herself as she exists getting a good rogering by the bad-boy. They must imagine themselves conventionally attractive, to complete the visual.

The obvious conclusion is that this bitch, who is quite obviously half-brained, writes porn for middle-aged sexually unfilled women and outcast teenagers. The only difference between her and the producers at Vivid is that they are honest about what they sell.

Approved Cathedral Styleguide Talking Point #13045: "I want you to understand that what you’ve done makes me want to weep at the sheer tragedy - and yet at the same time I am filled with hope."

Can you hear that dulcet whine, the sophisticated and delicate passive-aggressive execution of a crude and wicked theme - the twisting of beauty to serve ugliness?

Pretendellectual Negress' Rendition:"I want you to understand that what you’ve done makes me want to weep with envy, and bitterness, and hope."

CLong WHANG clOMP. Don't admit the core motives, the heart of the left! The coven shrieks as sunlight smokes flesh! Pull back the tarp, you black idiot!

Hope, eh? Strange to find it in the company of envy and bitterness. Somehow the mind wanders to Jack London's wistful wolves. And indeed, is the metaphor not apt? For it was only the illegitimate interposition of exploitative patriarchal Western capitalism that separated this bush-boogie from the bosom (or thigh) of her cannibalist tradition.

I love pretendellectual Africans. They are the gaffe at the dinner party. Nobody can mention that Hannibal is eating Krendler's brain. Nobody can notice, least of all Krendler, the deterioration of his conversational faculties - as said faculties sautee.

I'm reminded of the corpulent negress with mild Downs Syndrome and enormous wooden earrings who stood, amidst the smug thrum of an academic Brown v. Board panel whingeathon (graced by pre-presidential Obama that very day), and thickly declaimed, "Not to sound like an unreconstructed Marxist, but isn't violent revolution the only answer?"

A roomful of frantically self-grooming parasites, brought instantly to a standstill, awestruck and cowed by the enormous dump now steaming in the middle of the room. Not one dared respond directly, and the moment passed - to be cherished forever in my memories.

They try so earnestly - monkeys playing piano. But the subtly atonal sneer of the approved Cathedral styleguide escapes them. They bang and thwack, pick their noses, look around grinning - and nobody can snicker. At most one can detect a slight inrush of breath, a quickly concealed jerk backwards of the audience, as the monkey casually defecates upon the bench.

TL;dr: I derive great schadenfreude from the involuntary stupidities of black academics and the involuntarily racist reactions of the surrounding more intelligent white liberals.

This stupid woman has no clue about Australian history or Australian society...

We have "multiculturalism" for two three reasons:1) foreign students paying billions2) new people to get loans and buy houses 3) drive down wages

Reconciliation is based on a premise developed by left wingers who infiltrated the teaching establishment that the state widely persecuted the aboriginies.

One idea is of the "stolen generation" where thousands of children were taken from their parents. What they do not say is that this happened to anglo-celt children too who were in families that could not adequately care for them, as define by the institution sure, but the same child protection departments exist today in virtually every nation in earth. A problem with governments thinking they know best.

Most governors prosecuted anyone who did criminal actions to aborignies, except where the government was corrupt and had dealings with the squattors... the same class of people now running the banking sector in collusion with the politicians to steal from the rest of society.

There are 500+ different aboriginal languages and countless tribal groups as well as multiple cultural differences. The oldest are thought to have been driven to the south east corner by later migrants thousands of years ago. People have no interest in learning indigenous languages.

1/3 of the population is foreign born, every year east asans increase in number and they don't care at all, and are all racist against each other. My cousin did a survey for school once and found every korean, chinese mainlander, hker, sg/malaysian chinese, filipino, indian, etc all held discriminatory views against each other and only the gen x/y anglo-celts did not.

Makes me sick people like her with no interest in our history, or society come here and pick up the most irrelevant rubbish...

We have massive problems brewing with housing and the jobs market, with foreign guest/pseudoslave labour competition etc And people like her concern themselves with having one of 500 aborigine languages taught in universities...

In the rugby league there is an exhibition match between aboriginal heritage players vs the rest, and the aboriginal side is probably whiter than the rest (who are mainly polynesian, melanesian, ). There are a few more aboriginal communities and they get all sorts of positive discrimination but many just don't care to do anything to improve their lot in life and prefer to drink it away. That;s their choice.

These people concern themselves with communities that can not function by themselves correctly and have to leech of others, but when the others, the mainstream and western societies are being weighted down, they are nowhere to be seen.

There are so many dubious logically flawed statements in her statement I don't know where to begin. She's a good writer; she can put a a nice statement of her political principles as some kind of fact. Well, here's an author whose political views i don't care for, but whose work I can enjoy.

Commenting non anonymously now. Btw, I don't agree with a fair number of your views and especially the argument with scott bakker, but i do enjoy your blog and read it religiously.

Thanks, Arvind. I don't expect you, or anyone else, to agree with me all the time. I read many authors with whom I vociferously disagree; I'm probably one of the few who has actually read Keynes, Krugman, and Bernanke. But the fact is that talent, originality, and work ethic are not distributed equally throughout the global population, and attempts to rectify that inequitable distribution will inevitable bring about negative consequences.

Which is what we have witnessed in SF/F for the last 20 years. A field in which the bestsellers are either decades old or blatantly derivative is not a healthy one.

"She is lying about the laws in Texas and Florida too. The laws are not there to let whites " just shoot people like me, without consequence, as long as they feel threatened by my presence", those self-defense laws have been put in place to let whites defend themselves by shooting people, like her, who are savages engaged in attacking white people."

Exactly.

The reason those laws exist is because the presence of people like this one usually leads to rape,murder, and robbery of people like myself. Even liberals agree. That should tell you something. They're denying the existence of biological differences of any kind between men and women, they think chicks are "socialized" into growing breasts instead of beards, yet even THEY cannot deny the reality of black savagery. They deny it's caused by being of African persuasion of course and call it "poverty" or dredge up more of their "socialization" crap, but they know it exists and they keep the thugs OUT of their neighborhoods.

We don't have that luxury. So we have laws to allow us to cause thugs to stop breathing before they do it to us,and as the Zimmerman trial will probably show, those don't even protect us from the savage nature of the black. If you stop one from killing you,they will just come back with even more thugs.

Spot on with your last sentence,above "update" as well.

As for this:" These are the people who gleefully nitpick the scientific plausibility of stopping a volcano with “cold fusion”, yet who fail to notice that an author has written a future earth in which somehow seventeen percent of the human race dominates ninety percent of the characterization."

If she's speaking of us,I invite you to consider two hypothetical imaginary press reports from the near future and tell me which one sounds more like science fact and which sounds more like science fiction.

March 20 2025

AI finally here!

Today, robotics expert Scott Wilson made a critical breakthrough in computing that he says will allow manufacturers to create a computer brain that is truly capable of reasoning like you or I would.

"It will be able to compose orginal symphonies or write plays that will rival Shakespeare's,solve complex social problems, anything you can imagine. There's nothing 'artificial' about this intelligence,it is as human as you or I.",he has been quoted as saying.

March 20 2025

AI finally here!

Today, robotics expert Sheniqua Chlamydia Johnson made a critical breakthrough in computing that she says will allow manufacturers to create a computer brain that is truly capable of reasoning like you or I would.

"It will be able to compose orginal symphonies or write plays that will rival Shakespeare's,solve complex social problems, anything you can imagine. There's nothing 'artificial' about this intelligence,it is as human as you or I.",she has been quoted as saying.

Are we really to believe that people who can barely master simple hand tools or water treatment and starve to death on one of the most resource-rich continents on the planet will be our equal partners in journeying to the stars? Is it plausible to imagine that a group of people who never got anywhere on THIS planet that they weren't transported by more civilized peoples to do simple manual labor will suddenly learn to build sea-faring vessels, let alone STARSHIPS?

In the thousands of years of human civilization,blacks alone never developed an original written alphabet or discovered any system of mathematics,and this one wants us to believe that those colonizing distant worlds will be the same people who would starve to death without regular U.N. food drops and who, TO THIS DAY, still worship 1950's era airplanes as gods in some of their native lands!

Black people invented Egyptians and introduced china to the Chinese. But when they created cracka ass crackas they made a mistake for the cracka ass cracka turned non the Black like Number One turned on Colonel Tigh and Ellen in BSG RDM, the realistic sci fi drama.

"Black people invented Egyptians and introduced china to the Chinese. But when they created cracka ass crackas they made a mistake for the cracka ass cracka turned non the Black like Number One turned on Colonel Tigh and Ellen in BSG RDM, the realistic sci fi drama.

They also invented the peanut."

They only thing they've truly invented,as far as I can tell, is a lot of excuses for why they can't do anything that eventually all boil down to "bad juju".

Vox, what exactly was the offending material? I tried reading her piece, with intent to find what material was from the forum. How specific are you allowed to be (i.e. republishing the offending material)?

To rephrase: with or without specificity, what did she publish which was in violation of SFWA guidelines?

In her opinion Vox is racist. She is only saying that because he is white. Anti-racism is just a code-word for anti-white.

Nobody is flooding Africa with non-Africans and giving them special rights and privileges. Nobody is asking Africans to "assimilate" with whites to solve the "race problem". Its only white countries and EVERY WHITE COUNTRY where this is happening. This is genocide. Does any of the UN definition of Genocide below sound familiar?

The 1948 United Nations Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, Article II states:

In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group as such:

(a) Killing members of the group;

(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;

This is to announce my candidacy for the office of SFWA President and present my 2013 platform. Some of you know who I am, those who do not should probably be apprised that I have been deemed, in the words of the Manager of Science Fiction at Tor Books, Patrick Nielsen Hayden, “a yawping borderline anti-Semite and woman-hater”. The outgoing president of the SFWA, John Scalzi, has declared that I am “a jackass, and a fairly ignorant jackass at that”, moreover, a jackass with “indefensibly stupid opinions”. Another Tor editor, Theresa Nielsen Hayden, has asserted that I am “a third-rate intellect, a tad unbalanced, and a generally unpleasant fellow” who has had “little or no social interaction with women of any sort.”

Let us assume, for the sake of argument, that I am all of those things. Despite these various and considerable shortcomings, I suggest that it would nevertheless be in the best interests of the SFWA if I am elected to the office of president by its membership in the forthcoming election. This will likely sound more than a little absurd to most of you, but bear with me for a moment."

There can be no reconciliation with the intolerant. But she is the intolerant one.

One side wants to use coercion or even some kind of brain-washing because they disagree. The other just wants to be left alone and will leave the other side alone and let reality decide.

Laws that let those who simply want to be left alone shoot intruders bent on destroying them are proper and good. Yes, people like her, but not because of gender or race, but because they will agressively use violence on someone who is not directly doing anything against them but only is committing what they consider a thought crime.

That is the axis where you can find the good and evil poles. The willingness to use escalating coercion to change someone else's ideas.

I doubt Roddenberry wanted people on his bridge at gunpoint, ordrugged into imbecility, or would push dissenters off.

You're denying you've publicly stated that giving women the vote was a bad idea and you'd like to roll it back?

Not in the least. Voting is not "a basic right". If it were, my American father could vote in the USA. You could vote in the USA and I could vote in the UK. You're an intelligent man, do you truly not understand that voting is a privilege reserved to certain enfranchised members of the citizenry?

I support genuine human rights such as life, liberty, and property for all women, including unborn women. I tend to doubt Ms Jemisin herself can say as much.

On Stross's site, after the April 15, 2013 Boston Marathon terrorist attack, and before the identity of the bombers was known:

"The comments on this blog entry are not intended for wild speculation about the identity and motivation of the bombers; comments on those lines may be deleted, especially if I think they amount to hate speech directed against minorities."

One hour and five minutes later:

"my money is on crazy white guys with a political axe to grind: the provisional wing of the Tea Party."

"Hate speech" must mean "weather vane" in Ol' Blighty. Who the hell knows what "wild speculation" means. Might be Sanskrit.

Jemisin has it wrong; it is not that I, and others, do not view her as human, (although genetic science presently suggests that we are not equally homo sapiens sapiens), it is that we simply do not view her as being fully civilized for the obvious historical reason that she is not.

You're on record as not agreeing with evolution, but I noticed that you're not apposed to using evolutionary processes to make a point. Is there a way to clear this up? I'm thinking you agree with some evolution but not when it comes to speciation. Help me out here.

"it is that we simply do not view her as being fully civilized for the obvious historical reason that she is not."

Regardless of where the center of the bell curve sits for the average black person, why does this individual merit that characterization?

Her post appears to be indicative of good education and high enough verbal intelligence. I'm sure there are plenty of white people who would be shocked and disturbed by the author of this blog getting 10% of votes to be leader of anything. Being that whites are the originators of theories about colonial privilege and whatnot, plenty of them would also make the same arguments this author did about how blogs like this represent an impetus to remove basic human rights from blacks and women and more.

Yet, would you call those educated white post modernists "not fully civilized" based on what they are? They aren't really different from you, genetically. They are no lesser inheritors of what western civilization became. This black person is only expressing the same mindset that they are.

This post seems like you are picking on a black woman for being inferior because she is a black woman, not because of what her opinion was or the way she stated it.

Which is what we have witnessed in SF/F for the last 20 years. A field in which the bestsellers are either decades old or blatantly derivative is not a healthy one.

I have a large collection of Astounding/Analog and Galaxy magazines from the 50s, the creativity from that era is incredible. I'm seeing some that in the self-published and small press stuff now and it has been a real revelation for me.

Regardless of where the center of the bell curve sits for the average black person, why does this individual merit that characterization?

What part of the analogy between her disregard for the truth and the average black criminal's disregard for the law, (or more accurately, the norms of civilized society), did you fail to grasp?

Yet, would you call those educated white post modernists "not fully civilized" based on what they are?

Good question. Yes, they are observably sliding back into precivilized, lawless, tribal patterns of behavior. I've specifically stated that post-modern post-Christian culture is more regressive than 7th century Islam. Genetics are obviously not the only component here, and it appears that regression into barbarism is much faster than progress out of it.

This post seems like you are picking on a black woman for being inferior because she is a black woman, not because of what her opinion was or the way she stated it.

No, I'm picking on a black woman because she's a dishonest individual who foolishly saw fit to attack me in public.

Feministx, Jemisin merits the treatment because she gives herself a moral dispensation by virtue of her race. Her attack on all of Australia and even the world in that speech obviously didn't include herself as part of the problem.

Meanwhile, she ignores the greatest act of mass genocide since WW II due to ethnic hatred and hate speech: the 5.4 million dead in the Second Congo War that only finally ended a few years ago.

In retrospect, her assertion that Australia is dangerous for people of color is a laughable and easily proven lie, multiplied by a factor of 5.4 million.

When the United States was founded, the franchise was limited to free men, 21 or older, who had property (usually 40 acres or 40 pounds/year income, IIRC). That latter requirement kept about 30% of the free adult male population from voting.

The result was leaders like Washington, Jefferson, and Franklin. Great men posessed of vision and wisdom.

In the 1820s, the property requirement was eliminated. And men like Andrew Jackson, Lincoln, Davis, and McKinley were elected. Good men, usually, but neither as wise nor as visionary as their predecessors. Corruption started to taint politics.

Around 1900, states started to allow women to vote. The result was Wilson and Franklin Roosevelt. Men lacking in wisdom, whose vision was of their own aggrandizement.

Then we allowed ANYONE 18 or older to vote...and promptly elected a string of criminals and sociopaths. If you seriously think about it, the only President elected since 1956 who was NOT incompetent, a criminal, or a sociopath was Ronald Reagan (though Bush the elder deserves an honorable mention).

The purpose of any system of government is to provide good governance. NOT to "empower" people who have proven themselves incompetent to wield it. We need to go back to the system that worked.

Somewhat less reasonable, but still defensible if one is trying to "curate" (God, how I hate that term) a nice salon-like atmosphere.

... or obvious trolling

And this is where the speech code rubber hits the fascism highway. "Obvious trolling" is just code for "the other side of the argument".

It's laughable how debates in right-wing and libertarian corners always go until one party wins (usually the conservative / libertarians) and how debates hosted in the left-wing corners of the world go until the left loses...at which point the censors come out (I love that Trs Nlsn Hydn and McRapey even brags about their censorship).

I don't know why anyone would bother with any kind of forum. I've been banned from three conservative political forums because I refused to tow the line with the Republicans. At some point, it becomes pointless to join any because people join them in order to feel good about themselves, not have any kind of intellectual debate.

Let these nerds die off in poverty. Every single author who is able to write better fiction should branch off and start their own publishing company. I know these are men who are not deltas, gammas, or omegas like the losers who are attacking VD and the other 10%.

Way back in the day, Daniel Moynihan did a seminal study on poverty in the african american community. he had done some work much earlier on poverty in irish slums as well. Being a poor black irish boy made good, he had some pretty good insights on both communities. Unfortunately his ' benign neglect' comment and report got him a lot of flack when he worked for nixon.

Lyndon Johnson was also going to give a speech on how poverty in the black community is not similar to white poverty and about social capital and erosion thereof. he was told he would inflame sentiments if he did the same.

I've only visited the states for short periods, several months at the most. Mostly New York, jersey and Yale, but i always had the clear feeling of living through the fall of rome. I think things have gotten much worse since then (2002-2003, bush kerry and iraq). My impression of the American people is that they were much more educated in earlier generations and had either willingly or otherwise become useful dupes.Personally I blame television and the materialism dream being sold to people. Consume and you will be happy, said Mammon....

And yeah, most present day scifi/ fantasy is largely utter crap. Scalzi and co, yes, but also it's become boilerplate.

I liked James Tiptree. Le guin too. Both were excellent writers. It's a little odd that heinlein who was a far out leftist for several parts of his career is looked upon as a crypto fascist now, simply for his fairly rightish hawkish views. What do you expect from an Annapolis man, world peace and flowers?

That's sort of a silly argument: I have the prettier wife; therefore, I win! She's prettier; therefore, she's more of a female than your wife! Ergo, I have lots more company with women, and I just proved it. But, to be fair, it's no worse than this woman's argument in the first paragraph, which seems to have zero connection to Vox Day or science fiction. Has the blog author been secretly involved in school reform? It seems unlikely that even a racist, misogynist libertarian would throw himself into crusading for school reform--reform being a codeword for "more government control to fix that last government control that wasn't working."

"That's sort of a silly argument: I have the prettier wife; therefore, I win! She's prettier; therefore, she's more of a female than your wife! Ergo, I have lots more company with women, and I just proved it. "

/facepalm

Jill... in your experience... when a man has a hot wife... does that man tend to have a lot of experience with women... or do you suppose that the hot wife just happened upon him one day by some accident and fell in love with him for reasons no one else can fathom?

To put the question another way... do you live in Nevernever Princess Land?

Arvind June 13, 2013 9:11 AMPersonally I blame television and the materialism dream being sold to people.

more important is the seizure of the educational establishment by leftists. and that's an international, nay, worldwide problem, not just a US one.

feministx June 13, 2013 8:25 AMThis post seems like you are picking on a black woman for being inferior because she is a black woman, not because of what her opinion was or the way she stated it.

a - Vox does LOVE to troll. he trolls the regulars here. you'ns outside the blog have no chance, make your time.

b - i've skimmed your blog.

*facepalm*

let's see, you self-characterize as a feminist but:*you openly admit you're desperate for a child*your chief complaint about your boyfriend is NOT that he's married ... but that he's not dominant enough in the bedroom*you fantasize about committing 'adultery' against your married boyfriend *triple wadi gatto facepalm**you get egoistic satisfaction by being complimented by ( apparently ) intelligent, handsome WHITE men ... on your appearance

i can't WAIT til you find the Alpha Game blog. your brain will make such pretty patterns on the ceiling after your head explodes.

You should go to her website and read her rant about oppression in America. She tried to minimize lynching (NAACP definition: an extrajudicial killing by two or more people for violating community norms or laws) by blathering on about Mobile, Alabama having the last "traditional lynching" in America decades ago.

By the NAACP definition, thousands of black people are lynched in America every year. In fact, entire black communities are terrorized by lynch mobs (aka drive-bys, drug wars for violating "turf" rules, death for disrespecting, etc.)

I don't know why she wants to pretend that lynching is over in America. Must not care for black folks. Is her husband white?

Anyway, this is what I posted at her website. I expect she will take it down, given her Talented Tenth indifference to black suffering:

"Oh poo! Douglas was not the last lynching, or even the last “traditional” lynching in America. The definition of lynching, established by the NAACP and many, many states, is the intentional extrajudicial killing of a person by two or more people for violating community norms or laws.

"Hundreds of black people are killed in Chicago, DC, Detroit, Newark, St. Louis, LA and countless other American cities every year. You are just trying to excuse the problem, by using the term “traditional”, like there is some magic to using a rope. The NAACP definition did not consider a “rope” or “tree” to be an essential or defining part of lynching.

'Why do you try to minimize the massive ongoing murder of black people in America. Why do you try to excuse the killers because they don’t waste time with ropes but instead use AK’s, 9mms and drive-bys to exact their community justice?

"Black people live their lives behind bars, filled with desperate fear, in innumerable cities, town and villages all across America. Only the bars are there for protection from the lynch mobs and killers that prey on them: bars on windows, bars on doors.

"Be honest. Thousands of black people are lynched by evil American ghetto lynch law justice every year. Or don’t they matter because they are black MEN?

"Yes, the public school system is working as planned. The dumbest homeschool kid is going to be leaps and bounds ahead of the average public schooled student."

Nope. I've seen 18-year old graduates from homeschool that were barely literate. And, like it or not, I've seen public high school graduates that were brilliant and prepared for college. Neither method constitutes an educational magic bullet. The implementation is everything.

Which part of the world is the most hostile to Africans? Africa.Which ethnic grouping is the most hostile to Africans? Other Africans.Most brutal? Other Africans.Most oppressive? White people. LOL JK it's still other Africans.

Jill, are you suggesting that Spacebunny is not, in fact, an actual woman? That was only supplemental rhetoric regarding the use of the term "actual".

The argument in support of his acquaintance with actual women was his experience as a charting club recording artist and Game theorist. Perhaps you missed that.

Thus, the argument regarding SB was that she was likely of a separate phylum from one of the impure spirits that leaped from the mouth of the dragon (Rev 16:13-14). The photographic evidence is very convincing. I'm not suggesting that Neilsen-Hayden performs actual signs, nor that she goes out to the kings of the world to make war against the Lord Almighty, just that it would be no shock to discover that she aspired to do so.

Nope. I've seen 18-year old graduates from homeschool that were barely literate. And, like it or not, I've seen public high school graduates that were brilliant and prepared for college. Neither method constitutes an educational magic bullet. The implementation is everything.

The last statement, that is the key. However, your experience seems to be a rare one. So what, you may have 1 or 2 public schooled students who were brilliant, as a rule, you'll be more equipped if you are homeschooled, and out perform your public schooled counterparts by leaps and bounds.

My four year old son has been reading for quite some time. He loves to read, and he loves science. My daughter, is more artistic and musical. She's seven, her reading is probably average at best for her age, but her aptitude to understanding and explaining scenarios is above average. As homeschoolers, we can specialize their education to their strengths, and work on their weaknesses. Try that in the public school system, which is designed for the lowest common denominator.

"As homeschoolers, we can specialize their education to their strengths, and work on their weaknesses. Try that in the public school system, which is designed for the lowest common denominator."

No, it's the 'average' kid that the PSs are focused on. The slower kids never catch up, and the smarter kids are bored. If you're the least bit hyperactive, it's easier to give you a pill than to disrupt the entire class to deal with you constructively. Homeschooling can certainly address such problems, but only if the parents are intelligent and involved. I've seen way too many parents who thought they had these characteristics, but badly overestimated themselves.

Nate, you are doing a lot of face palms. The "my wife is prettier" argument is silly, and I was being silly in return. You can make all the logical arguments you want about how this proves he has had much company with women, which I never doubted to begin with, but having an ugly wife doesn't preclude the company of women, either. It simply implies company with lower-ranked women (on a materialistic scale). Ugly women are still biologically women. But now I'm doing the face palm because I'm pretending to be serious about this. VD pulled out his bragging rights, and it was funny.

"Nope. I've seen 18-year old graduates from homeschool that were barely literate. And, like it or not, I've seen public high school graduates that were brilliant and prepared for college. Neither method constitutes an educational magic bullet. The implementation is everything."

Of course there is no magic bullet but implementation has shown public schools for the last 50+ years are far worse on average than home/private schooling.

From the OP whinge girl:"These are the people who successfully campaigned for Star Trek to return to television after 25 years, but have no intention of campaigning for Roddenberry’s vision to be complete, with gay characters joining the rainbow brigade on the bridge."

I thought the rainbow brigade was all the chicks and dudes wandering around the starship enterprise in skin tight one piece shirt-skirts during the first two seasons of TNG? Hell, Roddenberry had Troi in a skirt and go-go boots. Google image search is your friend (and worth the laugh).

Ok, they teach for the average student. I'll grant you that. Do they actually teach, though? Aren't they really there to babysit children and teach them how to pass state mandated tests?

There may be a few parents who are not qualified to teach their child, but those are very rare. I think the smarter parents see the problem, and choose not to place their children into the borg. The average and below average parents think that putting their children into the borg is the best thing for them.

So, generally speaking, homeschooling is the best option (only), the parents are smarter, and the children will outperform public and private schoolers.

Yes. Few public school teachers that I have encountered view themselves as baby sitters. Most of them are extremely dedicated to their profession and are good at it. The challenges they face are the stifling bureaucracy, the lack of autonomy, and parents who refuse to accept that their offspring are not perfect angels. This is why homeschooling, if done by people who know what they are doing (e.g., you), can be of great value.

Johnson – Scum, I can think of no good thing this man did. If I were a Texan I would petition to have his Texas citizenship retroactively revoked and his remains exhumed and sent to Hanoi.

Nixon – Another crook. Along with Wilson and FDR, shares blame for the ultimate destruction of the US economy and thus the nation as we knew it.

Ford - For the most part a dull stand in. Provided some comic relief with his acrobatics.

Carter – Disliked by both the left and right political establishments, I suspect he may have been a better President than I have given him credit.

Reagan – The greatest actor in history, to this day an entire nation is convinced he was a libertarian leaning conservative. His second term was his best, as he began to ease the Soviet Union toward its demise without alarming it into starting WWIII.

Bush the Elder – ‘Read my Lips’, he started the series ‘Wars of Choice’ that only hasten our national demise.

Clinton – A criminal and mass murderer, he is a likable rogue compared to what followed him. His personal peccadilloes are quite forgivable when considering who he is married to.

Bush the Younger – First of the American Puppet Emperors, he can be blamed for nothing except following orders. His eight years were a disaster. He may not be remembered simply because there may be no USA to remember him.

Obama – Second of the Puppet Emperors, he continues the legacy of his predecessor but on steroids.

That's sort of a silly argument: I have the prettier wife; therefore, I win!

It wasn't an argument, Jill. It was simply a humanitarian service. We've seen that the size of my readership makes some of them wax suicidal; the fact that SB is beautiful, sweet, and slender violates their most fundamental assumptions about the way the world works.

The fact that it also shows that toad Nielsen Hayden is a moron is just the icing on the cake.

Carter – Disliked by both the left and right political establishments, I suspect he may have been a better President than I have given him credit.

Nice run down of Presidents. Not very far off in my opinion. I would say on Carter, you are onto to something. He was not very effective, but having met Pres. Reagan (out of office), Pres. Carter, Pres. George HW Bush and Pres. Clinton all as either President, former President or President Elect I can tell you that Pres. Carter was a very decent, very humble person and probably the most decent person who has been elected President.

There's a reason Black women are at the bottom of the barrel in friendship, companionship and marriage prospects.

Nobody wants them. Really, truly, you are that bad. It's like a nightmare of various proportions rolled into one.

The white men who are running away from feminist white women are going for Latinas (South American women) or certain Asian women (East Asian).

Seeing black women hating and whining is like seeing some fat, feminist American white woman angry and frustrated at the world that her life is crap and that she can't attract a good man, a quality man for marriage and children.

Reagan gave us no-fault divorce, which has done far more direct damage to American civilization than anything I can think of offhand. Which is not to say there's nothing worse. Lincoln may qualify. Someone else might nominate FDR.

You really ought to take whatever your analytics packages say with a pinch of salt.

They're the exact same analytics that John Scalzi uses. Now, I take all analytic packages with a grain of salt, but they're perfectly relevant for comparative purposes. It's always amusing to recall how folks like you used to talk up the significance of the numbers reported for McRapey's blog, but now that mine have passed his up, suddenly we should doubt the numbers.

The one thing I will say to Scalzi's credit is that unlike a lot of SWFA members, he has never forgotten that the other side was just as big, if not bigger, than his own.

For those of you arguing my assessments of the Presidents of the last 50 years or so...

1960 - Kennedy. Assessment: Incompetent, marginal criminal. Blundered at the Bay of Pigs, which encouraged the Soviets to try putting missiles in Cuba. Eisenhower is reported to have privately chewed him out for that, BTW. His election has always been questionable, there are strong indications that Nixon won the honest vote.

1964 - Johnson. Incompetent, criminal, sociopath. I consider him the worst President in American history. Got the nation involved in an expensive war in Vietnam...then lost it. Dramatically expanded the welfare state, without regard for long-term consequences. Manipulative and abusive.

1968 - Nixon. Incompetent, criminal. Continued the expansion of the welfare state that Johnson started, with as little regard for the long term. Add in Watergate.

1976 - Carter. Incompetent. Massive inflation, crippled economy, a foreign policy that encouraged the Soviets. I lived through that era...and it was not a bright period.

1980 - Reagan. The one really bright spot. Resurrected the economy, buried the Soviets. Forced to keep feeding the welfare state by Congress.

1988 - Bush the Elder. Not bad, but tended to get wobbly. If you shook him awake in the middle of the night, he'd make good decisions...just don't let him rethink it in the morning. Probably the most skilled user of limited war since Bismark.

1992 - Clinton. Criminal, sociopath. Corrupt to the core, and extremely manipulative. Tried to expand the welfare state, paid no attention to foreign policy except to manipulate it for his political benefit. Looks better than he was because a Republican Congress took over in 1995.

2000 - Bush the Younger. Incompetent. Got us involved in a counterinsurgency campaign in Iraq, but did better than Johnson - he won it, albeit at very high cost. Kept expanding the welfare state. I'd rather have had his father.

2008 - Obama. Incompetent, criminal, sociopath. Rivals Johnson as worst President ever, working hard to take the top spot and likely to do so.

Note...since the first television election (1960), we have elected one good President (Reagan), one mediocre one (Bush the elder), one marginal one (Bush the younger)...and six disasters.

But now I'm doing the face palm because I'm pretending to be serious about this. VD pulled out his bragging rights, and it was funny.

It has a serious point as well. The attempt by feminists to pull out this card is a very, very, very devious one. In one action they attempt to both make him "the other" and deny him access to the benefits of a female companion. It is the not-metaphorical "we are never sleeping with you, ever" card.

ProSig, quite simply, you are wrong. Every Education class a prospective teacher takes reinforces the idea that we need to take care of the slow & ignore the smart because the smart ones will magically learn it on their own. The entire system is built upon that idea.

The hard numbers show that even mildly retarded parents can homeschool their children more effectively than public school can teach them. I have a copy of the study on one of my computers. In fact, in almost every measurable way, homeschooling beats public & even private education. So the "brilliant" public schooler & the "illiterate" homeschooler are outliers, not the norm.

'It is the not-metaphorical "we are never sleeping with you, ever" card.'Wait, I thought Scalzi and the other dude married to the woman in the pic were men. So Scalzi and other guy won't sleep with VD ever? You people are going all Greek on me. Never mind the whole VD thing...

Fat Frog, lol, that was fucked up. Funny thing, if you look back, Scalzi started hurling insults first and so did Nielsen Hayden. Don't feel sorry for the guy who provoked a fight just because he ended up with a black eye.

1. Huckleberry provided us with the definitive list for the presidents. End of discussion.

2. Jill,This should not have to be explained, but here goes.One of the greatest "weapons" these marxist feminists use to strike is, "No woman has ever touched you or would ever touch you, I will never sleep with you, and you are desperate for me to sleep or the other women like me."

When in fact, nothing could be more further backwards.I am in agreement with much VD writes.I have a smoking hot wife who is a traditional style mother and my personal sextress. I cannot keep her hands off me and we have six children.

This should be an impossibility. It is an impossibility according to THEM.

I will also state that I have had more positive reaction from women than all of the marxist feminist male SF writers put together.

So yes, the argument my wife is hotter than yours makes complete sense when you review their typical argumentation tactics....Again, in contra to what they state, what they claim.

Also, it is probably without a shadow of a doubt that these women long and desire for a "real" man considering their man-wives aka hunsbands.

"Going through Vox Day's comments here is like reading erotica written by someone who -- well, in the immortal words of Xander Harris, "You've never had any tiny bit of sex, have you?" It's really, really obvious that VD is not acquainted with actual women. I don't just mean sexual relations. I mean he's had little or no social interaction of any sort.... It's pretty clear that VD fears and dislikes women, and that his gender theories are a back-formation. It seems perfectly appropriate that he's a fan of that patently misogynistic suspected female impersonator, Ann Coulter."

Jamsco Translation: I don't have to be logically consistent with people who bug me.

Bad translation. First, there is nothing intrinsically logically inconsistent or false about rhetoric. Second, if you want to bring logic into it, it doesn't matter what my beliefs concerning evolution are, only what THEIR beliefs concerning evolution are.

Taking down an opposing argument is not synonymous with making a positive argument. It can be, but it doesn't have to be.

Think your debate went up in smoke when you called her a "half savage."

What debate? There will never be a debate with the rabbits. The funny thing is that those idiots are so scared and hapless that they can't even win a debate with me when I'm offering them something as seemingly winnable as "Is award-winning SFWA author NK Jemisin fully civilized or not?"

now you just implied to me the idea of the Wachowski's being married to each other

Stop being so judgmental of the rainbow, bob k. mando. The only reason why siblings aren't allowed to marry is because of some old Christian superstition about inbreeding, which doesn't even biologically apply to the transgendered, who aren't currently allowed (due to the oppressive chromosomal bias) to even reproduce!

If you think the Wachowski brothers shouldn't be legally allowed to marry, and celebrated for their potential choice, and live the exact same lifestyle as Nielsen Hayden (male-identifying unit) and Nielsen Hayden (female-identifying unit), then you are, at the very least, ten percent bigot.

Giving women the vote would be something Chamberlain might have given away like the Sudatenland (which in itself was not necessarily bad, only that it didn't achieve the goal).

So after the Nazis invaded both Poland and France, the UK should have held elections to decide if they wanted to join or not and invited everyone from the 3rd Reich to vote in their elections, one-person, one vote?

I do not know of a man who would even think of marrying a female serial killer, even if she was a "10". Women will marry, support, etc. the worst dregs of the convict world. Their voting patterns follow. You can say "not all women..." but also "not all men...", so voting should first be the choice of each individual state, but then within the states, perhaps only those who have paid sufficient income or property taxes (above any subsidy they have received) should vote. There are other sets of criteria. But giving a large number of gras-shoppers an equal vote with a small number of ants will cause the starvation of all.

Half civilized - half savage. She is willing to use coercion, brutality, and savagery to get her way, but draws the line half-way. Ergo, half-savage is not rhetoric but an observation.

Those who cherish freedom will typically only descend into violence, coercion, or fraud in defense of their fundamental rights. That is civilization. That is what a republic is about.

Savages can be democratic. Two cannibals and one missionary deciding who to have for lunch. Or voting to kill their children (we have abortion so the Aztec pyramids might represent moral high ground in comparison). Or their elderly.

Either human rights are fundamental and come from nature or God or reason (something like 2+3=5), or you only have what rights whatever structure - might makes right - lets you have during this cycle. Civilization depends on the former view.

"Bad translation. First, there is nothing intrinsically logically inconsistent or false about rhetoric."

I didn't say there was, but you used it as excuse for being inconsistent.

"Second, if you want to bring logic into it, it doesn't matter what my beliefs concerning evolution are, only what THEIR beliefs concerning evolution are. Taking down an opposing argument is not synonymous with making a positive argument. It can be, but it doesn't have to be."

This is what you should have said in the first place. Also you could have pointed out that your argument didn't presuppose the truth of macro evolution.

But back to "You can't use dialectic with rabbits. They can't follow it, they just start squealing "not-rabbit" and hopping away in a panic."

Are you saying they don't respond this way to rhetoric? My main point is: I wish you'd stick with what you call dialectic.

I'll agree with the previous commenters, "half-savage" is an evil and destructive thing to call her. Destructive to her and your readers.

Stross: "He’s spouting the same old reprehensible shit. The comments on Vox Day’s forum are even smellier than usual. (For that sewage farm.) I wonder if he’s got the self-awareness to walk it back."

I wonder if Stross can come on here and explain why he forbade racial speculation about the Boston bombers in his site's comments section and then said "da whites did it" an hour later. Walk that back Stross. Oops! What? No banhammer to protect you?

It explains why he supports a racial bigot. Stross is the Scalzi of PC toad hall over in Merry England.

I'll agree with the previous commenters, "half-savage" is an evil and destructive thing to call her. Destructive to her and your readers.

That's a remarkably stupid thing to say. She is half-savage. What is your grounds for claiming Africans were capable of going from full savagery to full civilization in less time than the English or the Germans?

Stross: "He’s spouting the same old reprehensible shit. The comments on Vox Day’s forum are even smellier than usual. (For that sewage farm.) I wonder if he’s got the self-awareness to walk it back."

Naked assertions, always naked assertions. I told you these jokers can't even defend their own beliefs, let alone begin to substantively criticize mine.

White men are responsible for Jemison's privileged life in civilization. If her ancestor were not abducted and taken to America, those of her race would still be leading a primitive lifestyle let alone given the opportunity to author sf.

Jill June 13, 2013 10:06 AM Nate, you are doing a lot of face palms. The "my wife is prettier" argument is silly, and I was being silly in return. You can make all the logical arguments you want..._________________________

Nate, there you go again. Using logic with the sisterhood. When will you ever learn?

bob k, you have to know who FeministX is before making any assumptions. FeministX is what happens to a "strong independent woman" after Roissy has thoroughly worked her over. Thanks to his gentle minstrations (heh), she is much more in touch with who she really is a woman and what she really wants out of men, ideology notwithstanding.

a is the oppressive vowel. So Lana, at the very least, would have to self-actualize using Wychowski-Wychowski. But since the hyphen is a symbol of slavery, the couple would have to drop the second Wychowski. Of course, the mere presence of Andy would present an oppressive element, so, unless he is willing to evolve into a womyn as well, so they can be a happily married synthetic lesbian identifying couple, he'll need to be re-educated and enlightened somewhere safe, like an abortion clinic.

So, they'll be marital pioneers, living as the first proud and public happily married single lesbian identifying individual: Lyny Wychowski.

Gee, Vox, I can't understand why major publishers don't want to touch you when you say such nice things about their editors.

Also, it doesn't really matter if you call yourself a misogynist, racist, anti-Semite, and a few other flavors of asshole, if your actions and your blog posts are full of misogyny, racism, anti-Semitism and a few other flavors of assholery.

So, I went and checked out the original post and all the comments pretty much boiled down to "your go girl, awesome speech". I almost want to call it a circle jerk but it's largely women, so that would be an odd turn of phrase.

There is no co-existing with Leftists. And we are not going to roll over and die for their convenience. They are vicious, delusional freaks of nature, not human, and will take down society and themselves along with it. I very much look forward to seeing them slaughtered - one way or another.

Desert Cat June 13, 2013 12:35 PMbob k, you have to know who FeministX is before making any assumptions. FeministX is what happens to a "strong independent woman" after Roissy has thoroughly worked her over.

obviously, she's riding the cock carousel. and milking it for all she can get.

my POINT is that she can't coherently call herself a feminist / equalitarian / pretend to intellectualism while she's doing all of this.

and once she gets on Alpha Game and sees that all of her biological / emotional goals ( except for transitory alpha cock ) are being stymied by the lifestyle which she has chosen ...

as far as the Wachowski Diversion goes:jesus christ, you assholes. i was asking for brain bleach, NOT TO BE INUNDATED IN THIS.

"That's a remarkably stupid thing to say. She is half-savage. What is your grounds for claiming Africans were capable of going from full savagery to full civilization in less time than the English or the Germans?"

You called somebody a nasty insult and now you're trying to defend it using logic, in the same way you flashed a picture of your beautiful wife and claim it to be humanitarian. The wife thing is amusing. Calling this woman a savage isn't. By what definition would you call this woman a savage or even a half savage? She is not a savage by virtue of her African ancestry; she is a savage based off her actions. But if her actions as well as talking points appear very much like all the white people of European descent who surround her, then on what basis are you calling her a savage? And don't give me stats of African violence--you called her a savage without any proof of savage action (other than writing a silly piece against you, which is not confined to people of African ancestry). You didn't say, "I suspect you are half-savage because the stats on African violence both in Africa and abroad would lead me to believe that." Guilt by association doesn't work for me.

Gee, Vox, I can't understand why major publishers don't want to touch you when you say such nice things about their editors.

You have failed to understand the argument. You see, you are admitting that the publishers are making decisions based on factors other than talent and potential sales. That's precisely the point that various SFWA authors have been trying to deny.

Also, it doesn't really matter if you call yourself a misogynist, racist, anti-Semite, and a few other flavors of asshole, if your actions and your blog posts are full of misogyny, racism, anti-Semitism and a few other flavors of assholery.

Of course it matters a great deal when the accusation is not that I am all of those things, but rather, that I DESCRIBE MYSELF as all of those things. I don't. The woman is a) lying, and b) broke the confidentiality rule. The irony is that Jemisin's actions and blog posts are far more racist than mine are, at least by the average SFWA author's definition of racism.

"An old white man just called me an old black woman; ban him. A kike just called me a mooncricket; ban him."

For the life of them, the SFWA cannot wrap their heads around the fact they do this routinely. They attack people according to their race and gender and react strongly to attacks by race and gender.

The fact that Stross is reading this right now and will not respond to him doing that very thing shows what hypocrites these people really are and what the real agenda is. The real agenda is not "justice" or "equality," the real agenda is to hide behind notions of "justice" and "equality" to unleash their own pathological resentments and make it look okay at the same time.

The worse racial and gender bigots within SF&F are in fact the ones who hysterically cry "Wolf!" 7 days a week.

The people who set up a segregated non-white space and dinner at feminist WisCon are the same people who Tweeted in horror about the first integrated prom in a small Georgia town.

She is not a savage by virtue of her African ancestry; she is a savage based off her actions.

It's not binary, Jill. There are, without doubt, certain Africans who are fully civilized, just as there were likely fully civilized Englishmen in the year 500. But on the basis of her words and actions, it is clear that Jemisin is not one of them.

Seriously, do you have any idea how retarded you look to be intrinsically claiming, apropos of absolutely nothing, that Africans are capable of cultural development at twice the rate of Europeans? What is the basis of your claim? Perhaps more importantly, do you even understand you are making that claim?

Guilt by association doesn't work for me.

Who said anything about guilt? The problem is that neither history nor logic are working for you at the moment.

Do you deny there is a genetic component to culture? You can try that angle if you like. Do you deny that the English and Germans were once uncivilized? Or that it took them around 1,000 years after their first encounter with Rome to reach a similar level of civilization? You can try those too.

What, precisely, is the nature of your objection? Do you seriously think the response of people who can't even grasp what I'm talking about surprises me in the slightest?

You see, you are admitting that the publishers are making decisions based on factors other than talent and potential sales. That's

I’ve seen you make this point before, so I have to ask why you think “potential sales” would be limited to your sales? I could see association with the likes of you hurting a publishers overall numbers even if your books sold well.

They're the exact same analytics that John Scalzi uses. Now, I take all analytic packages with a grain of salt, but they're perfectly relevant for comparative purposes. It's always amusing to recall how folks like you used to talk up the significance of the numbers reported for McRapey's blog, but now that mine have passed his up, suddenly we should doubt the numbers.

They are? And you're comparing like for like traffic numbers exactly using the same services? I'd be interested in some specifics on your claim is all.

Thing is, I have absolutely no idea what numbers he claims for his blog, but I do keep seeing his name crop up in lots of places (awards lists, convention appearances, mainstream media mentions) and I only seem to see yours when you've said something troll worthy. Like today.

I always got the impression that in the Star Trek universe, the Enterprise was where the Federation dumped all their freaks before sending them off to the absolute farthest reaches of the galaxy

Yeah, that's a good characterization. But...

did anyone else ever notice that all those rainbow colors from every race in the Universe gathered on the Enterprise all adopted the same culture? A predominantly traditional Western culture? That they may have been ethnically diverse but culturally they were basically Americans. In space.

I was never much of a DS9 fan, but I have to say that after watching William Shatner interview Avery Brooks, I'm convinced Brooks has to be one of the greatest actors on the planet. On DS9 he played a competent, serious, thoughtful captain. In real life, he's a scatterbrained jazz pianist who's thoughts are disconnected jumbles of half-baked ideas. Two less-similar people both able to live in furnished houses I'm not sure you could find. Point is, Brooks the actor is culturally different than the Western norm, but Cisco the character he played is not.

Star Trek isn't a multi-cultural show. It's multi-ethnic for sure, but it's monocultural, and the culture is not that of Detroit, Tijuana, Kabul or New Guinea. Frankly, it's not even that of the Harvard Faculty Lounge or the average corporate HR Department.

I’ve seen you make this point before, so I have to ask why you think “potential sales” would be limited to your sales? I could see association with the likes of you hurting a publishers overall numbers even if your books sold well.

Complete hogwash. Random House is very well aware that readers buy individual brands. No significant revenue source has ever rejected a publisher based upon one of its brand names, and no publisher ever has made such a laughable business decision based on figures that indicate...

"Oh my! If we publish Glen Beck books, that means that our revenues sources that might purchase Obama hagiographies will not purchase our Obama hagiographies! Simon and Schuster would never publish Glen Beck!"

Your concept is a myth I've run into plenty of times. But it just doesn't happen that way. Publishers who are truly in the business of publishing and selling books don't consider their catalog inclusivity as part of the sales model. They just don't. If a book will sell and it suits their distribution model...they'll sell it.

The problem is that there is a decent sized cult - a business cancer, if you will. Just look at the unit sales - of editors and marketing folks who kill viable business opportunities all the time and for no other reason but personal or political whim.

You have failed to understand the argument. You see, you are admitting that the publishers are making decisions based on factors other than talent and potential sales. That's precisely the point that various SFWA authors have been trying to deny.

Talent and potential sales ain't everything. Getting picked up by a publisher/getting a job/staying on a sports team are all influenced by who you are as a person. It doesn't matter if you're the second coming of Johnny Unitas if you constantly get in trouble with the law, or are a shitty teammate that no one in your locker room wants to work with you. If you have the experience, and the diplomas, and are qualified for the job, but you go into an interview and call the interviewer a "fat frog", you're not going to get hired either.

We won't even get into the fact that potential sales are definitely influenced on who you are.

They'd hyphenate, of course, to maintain their respective unique identity

I'm sorry, but that doesn't solve the problem. You still have to decide which name comes before the hyphen, and which after. This isn't a trivial choice, and the wrong choice could be deeply oppressive. It would be oppressive to the feminine-gender-identifying party to have the "male" name first, since it would imply "he" is more important than "her." Putting the "female" name first would be oppressive to her as well, since people may mistakenly assume it was just a middle name and that the "male" nave was the real last name.

DaveonThey are? And you're comparing like for like traffic numbers exactly using the same services? I'd be interested in some specifics on your claim is all.

Yes, Daveon, they've been noted and detailed. There are plenty of specifics readily available here, but I suspect you aren't really interested in having one of your misconceptions shattered, so I won't trouble you with the link.

You only "seem to see" what you want to have seemed seen. Your perspective is tiny. Insignificant, even. If you want a measure of success, in financial assets, public sales, women, measurable intelligence or any other tangible measure (other than prestigious awards for fan-fic in a dead genre), you will be disappointed in the results. Fortunately for you, you seem reasonably content with what you "seem to see."

I have to ask why you think “potential sales” would be limited to your sales? I could see association with the likes of you hurting a publishers overall numbers even if your books sold well.

See: Orson Scott Card and Tor. The fact that you can imagine something doesn't make it true. Not a single person so much as stopped blogging at Black Gate, despite their protests and threats, when I was blogging there. They're hardly going to turn down money and book contracts.

They are? And you're comparing like for like traffic numbers exactly using the same services?

Yes. We both use Google Analytics, although he usually reports in slightly more generous Wordpress terms. Last year he averaged around 650k pageviews monthly. I'm on pace for around 1.2M this month.

I do keep seeing his name crop up in lots of places (awards lists, convention appearances, mainstream media mentions) and I only seem to see yours when you've said something troll worthy. Like today.

First, I've sold more copies of a single game than he's sold of everything he's ever done combined. I was also nationally syndicated in major newspapers from San Francisco to Boston before he ever got published once. The world is a big place and we tend to see what interests us.

That being said, John is a master of self-promotion and actively courts the media in an effective manner. Give credit where credit is due. I can't be bothered, turn down most media requests for interviews, and haven't gone to the sort of conferences I used to speak at for 15 years.

If you have the experience, and the diplomas, and are qualified for the job, but you go into an interview and call the interviewer a "fat frog", you're not going to get hired either.

You have your order reversed, Obvious. Hayden made it clear she would never publish me before I'd even heard of her, let alone called her anything. She was going off on me back in 2005. I'm responding, what, eight years later?

You're obviously forgetting that I'd never heard of ANY of these people before they started attacking me due to my political columns that had nothing to do with them.

In the post El-Mohtar writes: "I just sent the following e-mail to Sean Williams, Overseas Regional Director of SFWA..."

Now here's the grim ironic part for the SFWA if they keep going down this path: Scalzi, Jemisin, Aliette de Bodard, Kate Elliott, Stross, Jim Hines, Saladin Ahmed, Gould and many others within the SFWA could be brought up on hate speech charges within any jurisdiction in the E.U., the U.K., Canada, Brazil, Ireland and India, among others. There is not a single doubt in my mind about that.

You see, courts don't allow for the double standards the SFWA grants themselves. So go ahead SF&F writers; flush your careers down the toilet just so you can whine about the post-colonialist and privileged straight, white, male. Courts say a white, a straight, and a male is human too, even if you don't think so. That's LAW. Jemisin herself violated hate speech laws in Australia. It remained only for someone to go to a magistrate and file charges. She was lucky.

If you have the experience, and the diplomas, and are qualified for the job, but you go into an interview and call the interviewer a "fat frog", you're not going to get hired either.

You have your order reversed, Obvious. Hayden made it clear she would never publish me before I'd even heard of her, let alone called her anything. She was going off on me back in 2005. I'm responding, what, eight years later?

And to carry the metaphor to it's conclusion, when hiring managers behave in the bigoted fashion of Hayden, the quality of employees, and therefore the quality of the product, suffers. Sales go into decline as people stop buying and look elsewhere.

It is not racist to point out a fact that is demonstrable. I don’t think any of the leftists would take issue with the following statement, “In 1000 AD the Frankish people were half-savages.” Around that time a representative of the Sung Dynasty comes back to the East and reports on how the West is doing. He reports that there was a great civilization around Constantinople, but the much higher culture was that of Islam centered in Baghdad. At the time the Islamic society was at the forefront of science, literature, chemistry, philosophy…(some people need to be reminded where our current numerical system hailed from).

There are even reports of captured Muslim doctors aghast at the Western medical practices (if I remember correctly they reported that a boil on the leg called for an amputation when cauterization and sterilization would have done the trick). The point is that it is true – at that time Western Europe was populated by savages, and the Islamic world was demonstrably a much higher culture. The tides today of course have turned…so how is calling someone a half-savage racist again?

You have your order reversed, Obvious. Hayden made it clear she would never publish me before I'd even heard of her, let alone called her anything. She was going off on me back in 2005. I'm responding, what, eight years later?

You're obviously forgetting that I'd never heard of ANY of these people before they started attacking me due to my political columns that had nothing to do with them.

That you didn't directly attack her eight years ago is irrelevant. The things you say offend people. You know it. It's part of your schtick. The things you said made her say "I'm not going to publish him." Who you ARE offended her back in 2005, and that's why she won't publish you.

@VD, I don't frankly care how retarded I look, nor what you think of me. I do care that you would misrepresent my position. I'm not thinking in binaries. I understand perfectly well that, even when Germans were uncivilized, that there were civilized people among them. That was precisely my point. I didn't disagree with your historical claims, nor have I said one word about race genetics. Nor do I believe that African countries will be civilized at a faster rate than other countries. I have studied genetics and history more than you might guess. You may have probability on your side, but you don't have facts in this case, except that this black woman is acting exactly like so many of the white people at the SFWA (unless you know something I don't). But I think I have to pause here to ask what your working definition of savagery is because this woman's writing, itself, seems to smack of foolishness rather than savagery, as do most of the responses from the people at the SFWA. Is it savagery to make bad arguments and to misinterpret and/or misrepresent facts? If that is savagery, then we all fall to that level.

And to carry the metaphor to it's conclusion, when hiring managers behave in the bigoted fashion of Hayden, the quality of employees, and therefore the quality of the product, suffers. Sales go into decline as people stop buying and look elsewhere.

Not only that, they can be sued for discrimination. I thought there were laws against discrimination against people because of the sexual or political orientation.

WTF. An overseas director of an organization designed for and by Americans?

Everyone has a human right to be an American! I can't believe that the SFWA still blatantly discriminates against the unpublished sistren, brethren, and otheren. Claiming that they are not "authors" is publiciss and denies their basic humanity. Undocumented non-writers unite! Universal suffrage for the SFWA!

This sniveling Jemisin cunt is your typical Leftist lunatic - a godless parasite whose ruinous ideology sucks the life and truth out of reality, leaving nothing but a shriveled lump of crap. And as with whacked out psychopaths, they revile and attack anyone who will not go along with their twisted delusions.

Discussion with these incoherent, insane creatures is futile and an utter waste of time. But I can understand Vox's reasoning for exposing these freaks - these posts and the numerous comments/blather they generate serve as a PSA, or more like a severe weather forecast.

Jill, with all due respect, you're wrong. Jemisin writes almost daily and at least weekly about humans she separates out as white and disparages.

In this racial rhetoric, whites come out in a negative portrayal, not 65% of the time, not 87%, but 100% of the time. I have a name for people who do that; what is yours?

And aren't we nitpicking about terms? Do you consider a neo-Nazi a "savage?" Don't Jews and non-whites also come out on the short end of the stick with neo-Nazis 100% of the time? Don't neo-Nazis also never shut up about race?

Stop looking at Jemisin's skin and listen to her words. They are identical in general principle to the worst racist supremacist sites in America. Jemisin said straight out she considered Australia dangerous before she went there because of whites and added her 3 days there only confirmed that was true. What the hell is that?

And she bases that on a loudspeaker in Japan, a racist Japanese ad, a woman who was refused entry on a bus for unknown reasons in Italy, Crown Heights and a lynching in Mobile, for which the men were sent to prison. What does any of that have to do with Australia?

She profiled the Aussies through and through. Can you imagine me going to Africa and saying they're all racists cuz of songs about killing white farmers and a black guy once punched me in Iowa and I saw a racist "white man's nose" party trick in Japan?

If I talk about black crime, guess what I am? Jemisin's speech was based on a paranoid racist fantasy, since she knew of not one person of color in Australia that had come to any harm in the time frame she was there.

In the end she patted the Aussies on the head for only maybe being as bad as America. Wow. (applause) Jemisin is by far the worst racial bigot in the SFWA. She talks about race more than writing SF&F. You want to create an insult-free safe-space for her? Go right ahead.

Not only that, they can be sued for discrimination. I thought there were laws against discrimination against people because of the sexual or political orientation.

Jemisin herself violated hate speech laws in Australia. It remained only for someone to go to a magistrate and file charges. She was lucky.

You guys have no clue how the law works, eh?

Not publishing/hiring Vox Day because he's a racist, misogynist, anti-Semite isn't a violation of anti-discrimination laws. Vox is allowed to say what he wants, and people are allowed to not hire him for saying those things.

"These are the people who successfully campaigned for Star Trek to return to television after 25 years, but have no intention of campaigning for Roddenberry’s vision to be complete, with gay characters joining the rainbow brigade on the bridge."

Come on, now. The original Star Trek had George Takei. And I think the entire male cast of The Next Generation was gay (and don't believe the rumors that some of them are married, that was just PR). Do the characters really need to be gay too?

UPDATE 5: McRapey has the perfect solution to the Problem that Must Not Be Named. He's going to give money to ANOTHER charity. That will show me! When did "donation" replace "education" as the left-liberal solution to all evils?

He's going to be broke soon if you keep forcing him to make pledges. Clever.

"except that this black woman is acting exactly like so many of the white people at the SFWA"

"ah, well, there's your problem. you don't understand that Vox considers all of the libtards over there to be anti-civilizational."

So the question is, would Vox have called her a half-savage if she were white? I think the answer is no - she called her this because she is black.

He did this because he knew this would offend the people he's denouncing.

In this I agree with anonagain, this is a like PSA, with the message: "Please join me in thinking poorly about this woman. And one of them reasons you should think poorly about her is because she is black."

If there is a schtick being played on this blog it is your "I'm going to create a frankenstein personality out of characters that seem manly" schtick. Since when do southern rednecks call people "mate"? Did you say to yourself "That Crocodile Dundee fellow seems manly. Maybe I'll talk like him so people will think I'm manly too"?