As anyone involved in paranormal research knows, many people can get unnatural/uneasy feelings from sources other than ghosts. One of the most common "fear producers" are electro-magnetic fields (emf's). EMF's aren't very hard to produce. So I was wondering, would it be legal to turn a que-line into a "fear cage" of sorts?
In more detail:
Can I set up machines that generate high emf's around the waiting line. Many people feel like they are being watched, think they hear things or see things, and even feel paranoid when exposed to emf's. If metal is very close to the emitter, then even a low emf (around 10) can be distributed over long distances. I could design the lines to be contained within metal fences or something to create a giant emf machine--aka, a fear cage.

I know people with pace makers couldn't be allowed in the haunt. But most people that age (the age of most pace-maker-users) don't go to haunts. Would a note on a sign (in an obvious place-possibly multiple places) saying "Electro-magnetic fields used within haunt. If using pace maker or other item that is affected by EMF's, please do not enter," be okay. Or is the use of EMF's illegal in a case like this?

~Jon-Kyle B.

Mike Bizub

12-26-2008, 08:30 PM

This sounds a lot like a FEAR GENERATOR. Its made by the guys from Monster-tronics. They have sold it to haunts so I would think its legal. I would probably have some kind of warning posted. Mike

Jim Warfield

12-26-2008, 10:50 PM

Anything that is a mechaincal/electrical device that effects people's minds and senseory perceptions, and then something happens, somebody flips out, gets violent, hallicinatory,is them diagnosed as needing medication, psychiatric care....and then they find out you and your machine caused this!!??
There would be no limit to the trouble you then find yourself in.

tchaunt

12-27-2008, 08:02 AM

This sounds a lot like a FEAR GENERATOR. Its made by the guys from Monster-tronics. They have sold it to haunts so I would think its legal. I would probably have some kind of warning posted. Mike

They are similar, but the fear generator uses lows sounds out of the human hearing range.

Anything that is a mechaincal/electrical device that effects people's minds and senseory perceptions, and then something happens, somebody flips out, gets violent, hallicinatory,is them diagnosed as needing medication, psychiatric care....and then they find out you and your machine caused this!!??
There would be no limit to the trouble you then find yourself in.

That is a bit far fetched (but not by much). As long as the EMF's are under 50, they are completely safe. If they get in the 100's, they would cause the same effects, but they would be more intense. Plus, nausea would be added to symptom's if the EMF's were exceptionally high. But I plan on keeping them down low (around 15-25), but scattered. The prolonged exposure to the EMF's would generate more effects.
The hallucinations are nothing major. They are just like......shadows.....that you think you see out of the corners of your eyes. I've never heard of any friend's-face-turns-into-monster-who-I-need-to-kill hallucinations from any level of EMF's.
EMF's have never put anyone on meds as far as I know.
This 'machine' wouldn't be very complex. It actually wouldn't be that much of a machine. It would just be electronics around a que-line, dispersing the EMF's (which would make them even weaker.....but still have an affect).

monsterwax

12-27-2008, 11:50 AM

The notion that someone could sue you for making them scared or paranoid at a haunted house seems a little crazy, but I guess that's where the trial lawyers have taken us. They basically shut down all the Spook Show businesses that entertained millions from the 1940s through the 1960s (all the growing law suits plus the fire marshal regulations requiring light pollution in all theaters). The trial lawyers won't be happy until they've sucked the haunted houses dry as well.

Speaking of which, have any of you folks received phone calls asking if your haunt is wheel chair accessible? You say "yes", and then they hang up and never come. We get that every season, and so far, only one person in a wheel chair ever came. It used to really puzzle me, but I've since found out the lawyers pay handicapped people (illegal) finder's fees to locate businesses that don't have wheel chair access. Once they find such a place, they then go and make a big show of the fact they can't get in, and sue under the ADA. They are not supposed to receive any money, just attorney fees, but the lawyers pay them through the back door and they make out quite well. (They call them "drive by law suits". A few newspapers have written about them, even though most papers support the Personal Injury industry and their agenda.)

The moral to this story to haunters is, provide ramps everywhere and the required hallway space (I think its 42 or 48 inches width- can't remember which right now). It cost us thousands to retrofit the steel walkways and bathrooms, but at least the construction people got it instead of the lawyers!

tchaunt

12-27-2008, 05:33 PM

The notion that someone could sue you for making them scared or paranoid at a haunted house seems a little crazy, but I guess that's where the trial lawyers have taken us. They basically shut down all the Spook Show businesses that entertained millions from the 1940s through the 1960s (all the growing law suits plus the fire marshal regulations requiring light pollution in all theaters). The trial lawyers won't be happy until they've sucked the haunted houses dry as well.

Speaking of which, have any of you folks received phone calls asking if your haunt is wheel chair accessible? You say "yes", and then they hang up and never come. We get that every season, and so far, only one person in a wheel chair ever came. It used to really puzzle me, but I've since found out the lawyers pay handicapped people (illegal) finder's fees to locate businesses that don't have wheel chair access. Once they find such a place, they then go and make a big show of the fact they can't get in, and sue under the ADA. They are not supposed to receive any money, just attorney fees, but the lawyers pay them through the back door and they make out quite well. (They call them "drive by law suits". A few newspapers have written about them, even though most papers support the Personal Injury industry and their agenda.)

The moral to this story to haunters is, provide ramps everywhere and the required hallway space (I think its 42 or 48 inches width- can't remember which right now). It cost us thousands to retrofit the steel walkways and bathrooms, but at least the construction people got it instead of the lawyers!

Wow. I had forgotten completely about planning to make it wheel chair accessible. I'll have to remember that when I start searching for a building to haunt in (later on in my life).

Jim Warfield

12-27-2008, 09:15 PM

Way back in the JC haunt-days a woman sued the Minnesota Jcs for 11 million dollars...because they scared her!
I posted this on here before and someone said they never had to pay anything but gave her a free ticket for next time or something, but I don't quite recall now, there was something else strange going on about this too?
I was reading my son John's lift ticket from when he went skiing the other day and the first paragraph says wearing this ticket constitutes a contract and the conditions of this contract willprevent or restict you from suing us.
If you don't agree, then get the hell out, go home! Well, it doesn't quite use those exact words, but you know what I mean.
I also liked the part about not being able to sue them for any of their employees negligence.
Then it says all injurys must be reported before you leave. (?) and have to first submitted for arbitration in the same county they are located in.
Of course if someone gets mad enough about getting hurt there is nothing stopping them from putting on a Santa suit and coming over and.....

swampboy

12-27-2008, 09:19 PM

The notion that someone could sue you for making them scared or paranoid at a haunted house seems a little crazy, but I guess that's where the trial lawyers have taken us.

There is a significant difference between scaring people using theatrics and scare tactics that are used throughout the industry and many of them for decades (the concept of the drop panel is probably almost as old as humans - probably a drop leaf back then) and a new technology. Particularly one that has had controversy associated with it and people claiming health issues resulted from exposure to it.

You are talking about using EM to purposefully cause discomfort, anxiety, fear, etc. The actual effect may vary drastically person to person and could include dizziness, nausea, headaches and more. The World Health Organization has a treatment plan for people with EM Hypersensitivity (EHS) so apparently there are people who really are sensitive to it in a bad way. The fact is there are no long term studies that can clearly rule out any long term effects. Now, there are no studies (that I know of) that prove there ARE effects either. The net result is you have experts arguing over it without a long history of studies and cases on the long term effects.

Your insurance may or may not be nullified by using something like this - I would check or at least notify them to make sure my policy would not be affected. All you need is a couple people claiming they have headaches from it - miss a few days form work because of it and you have a whole lot of stuff to deal with. You can claim all you want that it wasn't your machine, but they can claim it was, they can produce experts that would back them up and then you have to get experts to refute. Whether you win or lose or settle, you spend time, energy and money on it. Is the effect really worth it?

You would have to prohibit anyone with any medical device from being in there. I have a 14 year old neighbor with a pacemaker so don't assume they are only old people. You'd likely also have to prohibit pregnant women. Your last post mentioned hallucinations - is this real? - if your machine causes people to see things, then you are taking a huge risk.

A reasonable person is expected to stay away from a haunted house if the types of things a haunted house typically does will cause that person harm. Because EM saturation is not standard Haunted house fare, the person does not expect and may not be aware of it or its possible effects. Yes they expect to get scared but that does not mean you can do anything you want to scare them.

As you know people can sue over anything. They could sue you for having a scene that was too scary that caused them to lose sleep, miss work etc. The difference is, a arbiter will see that there is a reasonable expectation of scary scenes, loud music/sounds, graphic scenes, and strobe lighting so the person has to accept responsibility. But there is no expectation of EM exposure. Even if you have signs up, the person may not know if EM exposure affects them nor do they need to know as they are not typically exposed to EM like this. Therefore, their case is much stronger. So how litigious is your customer base and is the effect really worth the potential pitfalls? Your device may be perfectly safe but there are people who will not live near power lines, think cell phones give you brain cancer and won't use a microwave because of the radiation.

tchaunt

12-28-2008, 06:41 AM

Way back in the JC haunt-days a woman sued the Minnesota Jcs for 11 million dollars...because they scared her!
I posted this on here before and someone said they never had to pay anything but gave her a free ticket for next time or something, but I don't quite recall now, there was something else strange going on about this too?
I was reading my son John's lift ticket from when he went skiing the other day and the first paragraph says wearing this ticket constitutes a contract and the conditions of this contract willprevent or restict you from suing us.
If you don't agree, then get the hell out, go home! Well, it doesn't quite use those exact words, but you know what I mean.
I also liked the part about not being able to sue them for any of their employees negligence.
Then it says all injurys must be reported before you leave. (?) and have to first submitted for arbitration in the same county they are located in.
Of course if someone gets mad enough about getting hurt there is nothing stopping them from putting on a Santa suit and coming over and.....

On Christmas Eve, some guy was mad at his ex, so he dressed up as Santa. He went to his former in-laws house, where they were having a Christmas Party. He knocked on the door and an 8-year-old answered it. He shot her through the head. He went on and killed about 9 more people. He then set the house on fire after he coated it in gasoline. The suit he was wearing burned onto him. He eventually went to his brother's house, where he committed suicide. THe man also attached a bomb to his car. He did something else too, but I can't remember.

There is a significant difference between scaring people using theatrics and scare tactics that are used throughout the industry and many of them for decades (the concept of the drop panel is probably almost as old as humans - probably a drop leaf back then) and a new technology. Particularly one that has had controversy associated with it and people claiming health issues resulted from exposure to it.

You are talking about using EM to purposefully cause discomfort, anxiety, fear, etc. The actual effect may vary drastically person to person and could include dizziness, nausea, headaches and more. The World Health Organization has a treatment plan for people with EM Hypersensitivity (EHS) so apparently there are people who really are sensitive to it in a bad way. The fact is there are no long term studies that can clearly rule out any long term effects. Now, there are no studies (that I know of) that prove there ARE effects either. The net result is you have experts arguing over it without a long history of studies and cases on the............................y safe but there are people who will not live near power lines, think cell phones give you brain cancer and won't use a microwave because of the radiation.

So basically, just don't use it if I don't want a wave of law suits.

swampboy

12-28-2008, 09:30 AM

I don't know if you'll get a wave of lawsuits but just one would be distracting imo. Most people don't run to a lawyer or try to stir up trouble and you might go several years before someone tries to be a pain. If its an awesome effect that really scares people and you know it won't cause other problems then pursue it - just talk to your lawyer first to see how exposed you are.

tchaunt

12-28-2008, 11:35 AM

I don't know if you'll get a wave of lawsuits but just one would be distracting imo. Most people don't run to a lawyer or try to stir up trouble and you might go several years before someone tries to be a pain. If its an awesome effect that really scares people and you know it won't cause other problems then pursue it - just talk to your lawyer first to see how exposed you are.

Do you think it would be fine for me to experiment with EMF's?
I.e.: Have someone who is sensitive to emf's sit in a room with an item emitting a level 1 emf. Then slowly crank up the level and have them record the effects/changes as the level raises by 2. Then, after they first experience nausea, restart the experiment, but with someone who wasn't sensitive.
Then, wire the que-line to not go above the nausea level found in the experiments.

monsterwax

12-28-2008, 05:23 PM

Honestly, I think you should worry LESS about the real or scientific effects of EMFs, and more about the imagined effects in relation to a sue happy society. Everyone will see that sign and if just one customer starts having migraine headaches afterwards, or can no longer perform sexually, or upchucks their beer, an aggressive lawyer could convince them they've hit the jack pot. Sure it sounds absurd, but so does suing McDonalds for hundreds of thousands of dollars for serving coffee that is too hot. (I know, they eventually lost on appeal, but it still cost McDonalds a ton of time and money to fight it to that point-- and most haunters don't have a lot extra of either.)

On the other hand, we're always looking for the next new thrill, and I have to admit I find this one intriguing. Let's just put it this way: If you are willing to take an added risk on top of all the other risks you're already taking by putting on a haunt, go for it. But be aware it does expose you to a certain added risk. (Maybe that's what they mean by the fear effects of EMFs, they generate paranoia inside the haunted houses because that's where the owners who stress out about them dwell!)

swampboy

12-28-2008, 06:14 PM

Do you think it would be fine for me to experiment with EMF's?
I.e.: Have someone who is sensitive to emf's sit in a room with an item emitting a level 1 emf. Then slowly crank up the level and have them record the effects/changes as the level raises by 2. Then, after they first experience nausea, restart the experiment, but with someone who wasn't sensitive.
Then, wire the que-line to not go above the nausea level found in the experiments.

No I don't think the above process would be scientifically valid you would need many subjects to verify levels - I was electrical engineering not bio-feedback so don't know how many subjects is statistically significant. If I were going to do this I would go to a local university with a good engineering school and have them study my device and prepare a report for me. I made this type of request for a materials study in another business and it was less than $4k so it wasn't really expensive all things considered. However, spending $4k just proving this effect is not going to cause someone's head to explode would only be be viable if you were then going to market the prop to other haunters which if it was safe and effective may be a possibility. I'm not sure what type of analysis or approval the fear generators guys provide the buyer when they sell one of those things to demonstrate it is safe.

tchaunt

12-28-2008, 06:19 PM

@Monsterwax:
Would I be free from law suits if I put "Upon purchasing a ticket, the haunt owner, Jon-Kyle Bailey, is no longer responsible to any harm caused by visitors not following the rules. Nor is he responsible for an actor causing damage to any person(s). Consequences will occur if actor or visitor breaks any rules." on the back of the tickets? Or would the lawyers weasel around it by saying something like "Our client failed to see the script on the back of the ticket'?

XD I enjoyed the witty joke. It made my day worth while.

On another not, are you saying, if this EMF thing works out for me and I actually start selling these machines, I can actually help pioneer the haunt industry?

tchaunt

12-28-2008, 06:31 PM

@Swampboy:
They probably justify the fear generators because they only use sounds that can't be heard. They probably feel that sound can't be dangerous. From the description on the website, that's really the only thing I see that seems to make this product 'safe'.
I'm not sure how easy it would be to come up with 4 k. That would be a little too much for my first or second year. I would have ot crank in some high money to have that much excess money. But I know that as soon as I get enough, I'm going to start this project.

swampboy

12-28-2008, 06:41 PM

Hey I understand. You may get someone to do it for you for cheap or free to as a project or just a fun project. I think the most important thing to do is to consult an attorney in the state you are operating and get their opinion. Because you plan to use low levels I can't believe it would be illegal, but I'd like to hear an attorney tell me what he thought the risk was.

Dr. Giggles

12-28-2008, 06:45 PM

Honestly if you make it well known that you will be doing this and there will be no long term effects, and what they will be experiencing due to these emf machine things eg. paranoia, unease, possible nasuia etc etc etc but yes dont forget if this is a subconcious thing and you have que line actors they will be just as affected as the people and as you said in the long term it could have side affects such as halleucinations, iit happened to me in the haunt i co own. In the middle of the line we use concealed speakers with very low decibels of sounds which has been proven to cause unease and feelings of paranoia and enhanced fear receptors. So i was out their in that line for about an hour or two (the que line actor got food posioning ) and got some of the most amazing scares but after ward or i think because i dont really remember i had to be taken away by two other actors because i was having hallucinations. Its not a great feeling, i was ok at the end of the night the people just that it was part of the show because of my phsycotic clown character "Freakshow" but yes it was quiet scary. So yeah make sure your actors are aware of this emf forcefield ( if you even have que line actors) and make it a requirement that the longest they can be in the vicinity of given emf generators or whatever for like 30 minutes or the extent. If they exceed that they might become dangerous to your patrons.

Boni

12-28-2008, 07:09 PM

Just post all the warnings with all the side effects. Post them many times, then have some static playing on a radio and a fan blowing air through the que. So psyche them into thinking they are being exposed when in fact they never were.

tchaunt

12-28-2008, 07:18 PM

@Swampboy:
I didn't think about that. I could probably find someone to do it for me.
Thanks for the advice.

@Dr. Giggles
That was something I totally forgot. I was planning on having scare actors around the que's. I guess I would have to limit their time around the entrance. Or maybe I could develop a story around it and create a reason why the actors can't get close.
'We have a machine in operation that generates a shield of sorts. It prevents any creature that has crossed over from the netherworld from entering the contained area. The problem is, it still has a few kinks. It has been known to cause paranoia, nausea, and, in rare cases, death.' I cuold have actors come charging at the que-line, and then act like they got zapped and slammed into a wall. It would take a lot of rehearsing, but the effect could come out nice.

tchaunt

12-28-2008, 07:20 PM

@Boni:
So basically, make them take a sugar pill (explain to them the effects of the 'medicine' and let them make the effects happen in their minds). Creative thinking. :)

robos99

12-28-2008, 08:49 PM

tchaunt, I see you asking several times "if I do this, can they sue me?". Unfortunetly in this sue happy society, people can sue you for ANYTHING. It doesn't necessarily mean they win. But just a lawsuit alone can kill you. Aside from the bad PR (and if it's controversial you can bet the media will be all over it), a single lawsuit might spark other lawsuits. Other people may try to link a migraine they got after visiting your haunt to the EMF. Your landlord might kill your lease. The courts could shut you down well before the lawsuit even goes to trial if it's deemed you could be doing serious harm. And a good lawyer can drag it out so long in court that you'll go broke just trying to fight.

Some basic things to protect yourself should be done regardless of what you do. Definetly incorporate, or form an LLC or something of the sort. A sole proprietorship leaves you wide open for lawsuits. I'm not saying that can't sue a corporation. But they can't take your personal assets when the corporation loses.

If you print tickets, I'd put a disclaimer sort of thing on the back just for the hell of it. I mean, it doesn't really cost that much more to print on both sides. You may want to speak to a lawyer about the wording, but whenever I put on concerts I'd make sure to specifically say that the ticket is a revokable license. Your haunt is private property, and you're selling a revokable license to attend your event. I also point out a few of the basic rules, and say that the license holder agrees to not hold the promoter, venue, artists, and any other person involved liable.

And of course, put signs out in front of your haunt, warning people of any potentially hazardous things going on, like fog, strobes, etc.

Now as far as pulling off the effects of EMF, other people have mentioned the sugar pill concept. You might want to consider the wording of your sign, since you might be scaring people away from your haunt, when there really is nothing going on in the first place. But you also want to be convincing enough to trick them into thinking strange things are occuring. All the other effects of EMF can be "faked", you just need to get creative to figure out how best to do it.

Dr. Giggles

12-28-2008, 09:28 PM

Mmm cannibals? They are kept due to devices fastened around their ankles 5 feet away from you at all times! For your safety an electric shock will be delivered when they get to close. Then when the crowds a safe distance from the emf forcefields you could have the gaurd with the zapper...fall asleep..i mean hey hes been working long hours to make ends meet give the guy a break...so then the cannibals can get closer....Uh Oh! Nu uh it doesnt taste like chicken!

tchaunt

12-28-2008, 09:45 PM

@robos:
I keep askng just to try and get a base of what I can get into. I've never worked nor went to other haunts so I don't realy know what to expect. The first thing I want to do is figure out what can and can't be done.
I've got some ideas on how I can convince the people they are being affected by something. I just don't know how good it will work.

@Dr. Giggles:
That could easily provide a scare. I would have to theme it up a bit, but something like that could work.

Dr. Giggles

12-28-2008, 09:57 PM

Just a suggestion...and your actor in line would have a lot of fun. Hahaha but not necessarilly a theme about cannibals sepcifically, could be mental facility, prison break out, apocolyptic society...the list goes on hahaha

Greg Chrise

12-28-2008, 11:56 PM

You can do so much just with suggestion. For example, a room in the haunt has insulated walls where non of the others do. You get body heat and sound being slightly differently read by the people's sense. The Lab guy is telling them they are being subjeted to an ELF experiment and they may experience nausia diareha what ever, dry mouth. Only nothing has been done to them at all. Maybe the effect comes from a wicked looking machine that has nothing more than an infared cooking station bulb in it.

People will complain of how terrible they feel. Only there is no reason for it. You just messed with their minds and saved $4,000.

Jim Warfield

12-29-2008, 08:57 AM

A man bought the old bank building and planned to rent the bank vault out for people to then sit in and meditate...he called it "The Healing Vault".
Maybe he didn't advertise it enough to draw people here?
I'm not making this up, I sent Gregg a copy of the newpaper's article when it began and he also saw their web site.
Keep those crazed ideas coming, some of them will work.

tchaunt

12-29-2008, 10:25 AM

@Dr. Giggles:
I wouldn't do the insane asylum because I don't want to ahve to mess with the freaks at NAMI. But this could really be developed into a good scare that can fit nearly any theme.

@Greg:
To enhance the effect, I could by a Haze machine (like the Stratoshpere from ZONE) or just a plain old fog machine and a few mini-LED spotlights. The LEDs can be placed randomly inside the sinister machine. I can have them strobe on and off. With the right execution, I could use both your adaption of the idea and Dr. Giggle's in my haunt the first year for a cheap, yet effective effect.

And, just wandering, what is the fluffy, pink thing in your signature?

@Jim:
Did he seriously think the vault was special? Or did he just want money? Personally, I don't think small, closed in spaces are good for meditation.
When I do meditate (mainly to calm anger), I sit in a wide, open, natural area. If I didn't meditate, I would go insane. Here's an example-
I am very serious about my art...especially if it is macabre art. I was drawing a scene to go along with my poem about how Jack-in-the-box came to exist (it's actually a very dark poem. I've worked on it so much, I can almost recite it and it's three and a half pages long). This one kid kept dropping crayons and markers on the picture. I kept asking him politely to stop. Each time, I got madder and madder. After him doing this nonstop for an hour, I snapped. I yelled (in the middle of school), "If you do that again, I'm going to suffocate you with a potato chip bag! And you're dieing too fast, I'll put you on life support so you can suffer!"
The funny thing is, both the kid and the teacher were laughing. I think you see why I come home and meditate each day now. :)

crazybob

01-01-2009, 10:10 PM

EMF's aren't very hard to produce. So I was wondering, would it be legal to turn a que-line into a "fear cage" of sorts?

I would guess it would also depend on how you are producing them. EMFs are many times a product of machines that can also produce radiation, etc. How were you planning on producing them?

Monster-Tronics

01-02-2009, 02:46 AM

Here is a good site on EMF health risks:

http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/EMF/

http://www.niehs.nih.gov/health/docs/emf-02.pdf

The above report says there are no national standards but a handful of states have set standards for transmission line electric fields which are around 150 to 250 mg

Before I would waste a lot of time testing and or money I would do more research on the subject if I were you. If you are basing your haunt related effects on ghost hunting and paranormal society sites that have a bunch of very subjective info on the effects of EMF and no factual data to back it up is a waste of time in my opinion. Try to find some government or other test studies on the effects of EMF, since most of the crap on the internet is pure bull. Many times you will come across a very official looking document but if it is posted on Angelfire or other free sites it is probably garbage.

For those out there reading this on an old CRT monitor you are probably sucking up about 6 mg’s worth of EMF right now. Do you feel spooky? To get a higher dose of EMF you could give your printer a big hug and see if you feel anything. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not trying to be a jerk but to get any weird feeling out of using EMF you would probably have to have them wear a 3000 mg degaussing coil as a hat.

I did about 3 years of research on infrasound before I released the Infrasonic Fear Generator and I’ve got about a half foot high pile of docs from proper test facilities and government reports that have factual data.

Regards,
Jeff Londos
Monster-Tronics
Innovators in Haunt Technologies
www.Monster-Tronics.com
See us in St. Louis at TransWorld’s National Haunt & Attractions
Show, booth 714, March 27th -29th 2009
Proud Member of the Halloween and Haunt Vendor Association
www.halloweenhauntvendors.com
www.youtube.com/MonsterTronics

monsterwax

01-02-2009, 10:26 AM

Wait a minute... You're saying the 2,800 mg degaussing hat coil I bought myself for Christmas isn't the latest, greatest? That S.O.B. Radio Shack guy lied to me! Now I feel like a FOOL having worn that thing to Church! (No wonder the sermon had little effect.)

robos99

01-02-2009, 11:42 AM

To get a higher dose of EMF you could give your printer a big hug and see if you feel anything.

I tried that once, gave my printer a big hug to see if either of us felt anything. Sadly, my printer no longer speaks to me anymore. But lately I've been having a wonderful time with the fax machine.

Monster-Tronics

01-02-2009, 01:34 PM

You guys are too funny!

Monsterwax, even if the degaussing coil hat didn’t work for you I’m sure you were looking stylish and that’s all that really counts.

robos99, you might want to try a TicTac.

Regards,
Jeff Londos
Monster-Tronics
Innovators in Haunt Technologies
www.Monster-Tronics.com
See us in St. Louis at TransWorld’s National Haunt & Attractions
Show, booth 714, March 27th -29th 2009
Proud Member of the Halloween and Haunt Vendor Association
www.halloweenhauntvendors.com
www.youtube.com/MonsterTronics

Monster-Tronics

01-02-2009, 02:45 PM

@Swampboy:
They probably justify the fear generators because they only use sounds that can't be heard. They probably feel that sound can't be dangerous. From the description on the website, that's really the only thing I see that seems to make this product 'safe'.

I missed that post. I worked with experts in this field and as I said before, I did 3 years of research on the effectiveness and more importantly how safe infrasound is. On my website I also state that the infrasound output level is governed so you can not turn it up to levels that might damage someone’s hearing, because low freq sound can damage someone’s hearing just as easy as audible sound.

I’ve also warned people trying to make their own infrasound generators about this since 99% of the sound meters out there don’t go down that low so it is very difficult to test the output level.

99% of the stuff that is on the web about infrasonic weapons and projectile diarrhea etc… is all bull.

Regards,
Jeff Londos
Monster-Tronics
Innovators in Haunt Technologies
www.Monster-Tronics.com
See us in St. Louis at TransWorld’s National Haunt & Attractions
Show, booth 714, March 27th -29th 2009
Proud Member of the Halloween and Haunt Vendor Association
www.halloweenhauntvendors.com
www.youtube.com/MonsterTronics

tchaunt

01-02-2009, 02:57 PM

That's a lot of replies. I'll try to not forget anyone.

@Monstertronics:
Believe me, now that I know you worked with multiple experts, I would love to order your fear generator instead of trying to use EMFs. Sadly, I don't have a lot of money. When I did the 'safe' thing, it wasn't meant to be negative. Not being safe doesn't make something dangerous. It just means it isn't flawless. I didn't really try to bookmark your page because I felt that something that, at that time I thought hadn't been tested, could be dangerous. But by you not telling on the site (at least anywhere that I saw) that it had been tested, I wasn't willing to invest in it. Now, when I get a haunt, I would be more than happy to buy it instead of make a machine to produce mild emfs. :)

@robos:
Don't worry about it. Printers are emotional lil' bi***es. Faxes are a more go-with-the-flow kind of society.

@monsterwax:
If it makes you feel any better, my local radioshack cheated me out of my money a few years back. I was little and went in there to get some supplies for a science project. Of course, they're a business, so they want money. Well, they showed me the shiny, more expensive version of everything I needed. And you know how little kids are when it comes to the word 'shiny'. :D

tchaunt

01-02-2009, 03:02 PM

Oh, btw, monstertronics, what is that a picture of in your avatar/icon?
When I first saw it (a few weeks back), I almost flipped my chair (it's a cheap $5 chair that weighs nothing, so a light breeze could put up a close fight with the chair). I was leaned in really close trying to see details in a small picture. I was still leaned in when I scrolled down and that face popped up right in front of my eyes. I wasn't expecting it so I jerked back, almost causing the chair to flip....with me in it. :) I'm sitting here laughing as I remember the event.

Monster-Tronics

01-02-2009, 03:52 PM

tchaunt, no problem, I was not taking any offense, I was just trying to explain what I did with the Fear Generator. I’m very anal when it comes to safety, also not saying that EMF will not work as a haunt device, just that with my experience I believe you would need very high levels to be effective. Government studies are sometimes hard to find but they spend big bucks doing them so you may not have to, and EMF is one of those subjects that they have done a lot of research on.

Thanks, my avatar is the face of my Baby Huey siamese twin product (link below). There is also a crummy video in the gallery section that shows his stinky foot in action too. lol
http://www.monster-tronics.com/product_info.php?products_id=29

Good luck on your progress, it is good to think outside the box!

Regards,
Jeff Londos
Monster-Tronics
Innovators in Haunt Technologies
www.Monster-Tronics.com
See us in St. Louis at TransWorld’s National Haunt & Attractions
Show, booth 714, March 27th -29th 2009
Proud Member of the Halloween and Haunt Vendor Association
www.halloweenhauntvendors.com
www.youtube.com/MonsterTronics

tchaunt

01-02-2009, 04:01 PM

@monstertronics:
I didn't think you took offense, but I wanted to be safe just in case. :)
And don't worry, I understand what you were saying now.

I knew I had seen it somewhere before. I just couldn't remember.

Thanks.

roland s

01-03-2009, 10:20 AM

well i don't believe in the fear cage theory. I work in a coal fired powerhouse, there are hundreds of miles of energized copper wires,hundreds of miles of copper pipes, hundreds of miles of steam lines not to mention two huge generaters, and hundreds of electric motors. Plus i'm a electician and work on all these things. The point is the emf fields in that place has to be off the charts and i have never heard of the fear cage theory till I heard it on Ghost Hunters. I have never had symtoms of the fear cage and my coworkers haven't. I wouldn't spend a dime on a product that if it does work will only affect 1% of the worlds population.

robos99

01-03-2009, 10:28 AM

How about doing a haunt called the Fear Cage, and make it a cage match...but for haunting. Put everyone in a big cage, and whoever makes it out alive wins a tshirt or something. Ok, on second thought, maybe not such a good idea.....forget the tshirt.

tchaunt

01-03-2009, 01:49 PM

@roland:
Thanks for the information. I've pretty much decided to drop this project and just buy Monstertronic's fear generator later on.

@robos:
For some real fun, you could change up the rules a little. The first person to be fully covered in blood wins. :wink:
What fun that would be.