Just a quick reminder that we're setting up an informal palate callibration exercise next weekend. This involves people getting hold of the same wine - in this case Penfolds Bin28 Kalimna Shiraz 2003 from Australia. We'll taste the wine independantly and post our comments / thoughts / tasting notes.

The aim is to (in a very relaxed and non-geeky way) investigate how different our preceptions of the same wine are. It's a good chance to think about how we describe wines, an area which can be quite intimidating in some circles.

Anyone and everyone is invited and hopefully the wine is widely available, so that at least a handful of us can find a bottle and compare our thoughts.

I'll aim to start proceedings some time on thursday or friday, by posting some background info on the wine. Feel free to post tasting notes, vibes, opinions onto that thread and we'll see how it goes. There's also potential to take the debate into the regular sunday chat session.

I've still yet to get my bottle , but will be detouring via the big supermarkets this week, as they seem to be the big stockists.

We're using this as a bit of a trial run and if it goes well, we'll investigate which wines are both interesting and available to a large cross-section of our community.

Ian, thanks for taking the lead on this project! I'm having a little trouble finding Bin 28 here, too, which is odd because there are a dozen or more Penfolds labels widely available, not excluding Grange itself (if you can pay the fare). I'm not sure why the one Bin we need is thin on the ground around here, but I'm still looking.

Ian, thanks for taking the lead on this project! I'm having a little trouble finding Bin 28 here, too, which is odd because there are a dozen or more Penfolds labels widely available, not excluding Grange itself (if you can pay the fare). I'm not sure why the one Bin we need is thin on the ground around here, but I'm still looking.

Any luck out there Robin? I could only find the `01/`02 vintages so purchased the latter. $34 Cdn, ouch!

Scored my bottle today on the way back from a wine auction (good fiun by the way).

I'll post some info tonight [Robin: Do you think it's ok to post large-ish chunks of material from Penfolds web-site, or would you prefer a brief summary and link? I know the latter is normally preferable, but wondered whether you felt it ok to bend good practice in this case as there's no perceived issue. Happy to follow your sound advice on this matter].

Ian Sutton wrote:[Robin: Do you think it's ok to post large-ish chunks of material from Penfolds web-site, or would you prefer a brief summary and link? I know the latter is normally preferable, but wondered whether you felt it ok to bend good practice in this case as there's no perceived issue. Happy to follow your sound advice on this matter].

Good question, Ian. I appreciate your sensitivity in the matter.

From a copyright standpont, I don't see an issue. It's not like "borrowing" intellectual property extensively from a newspaper or magazine or mag-like Website. After all, Penfolds interest is in selling its product and disseminating its information, so I can't imagine that they would object.

The only possible concern is avoiding the temptation to offer our participants a drink of water from a fire hose. If the cross-post becomes so voluminous that it takes a long time to read, or if in your opinion it's so much that many of us would be inclined to skim it or skip it, then it's probably best to excerpt and link. But it's really a judgment call. From the standpoint of copyright and intellectual property, I don't see a problem.

Hi all - a thought just occurred. with large output wines like this, what are the chances that all the bottles are in fact identical? in europe there are lot numbers required on the bottles or labels; but is that true for australia? partly, of course, it is a matter of having a tank large enough to hold all the wine at once that will end up being labeled bin 28. but partly also it is a question of not ordering and filling glass that won't be needed for 8 months or more for shipping. why inventory bottles when keeping it in bulk will be more efficient. AND when you do finally bottle the next batch, obviously that will taste somewhat differently - due at least to the extra time in wood. just a thought.

Bob Parsons Alberta. wrote:So Robin try another `03 and compare notes with what we all write!! How about a Rawsons (same co.) or Thorn Clark which is excellent.

Bob, it's tempting, but unfortunately this approach also dilutes the focus on "palate calibration," which really demands everyone tasting the same wine. Generally speaking I'm in favor of the "pick something similar if you can't find the right one," but in this instance, for our first palate calibration, I think it might be better to keep it "pure."

creightond wrote:Hi all - a thought just occurred. with large output wines like this, what are the chances that all the bottles are in fact identical? in europe there are lot numbers required on the bottles or labels; but is that true for australia? partly, of course, it is a matter of having a tank large enough to hold all the wine at once that will end up being labeled bin 28. but partly also it is a question of not ordering and filling glass that won't be needed for 8 months or more for shipping. why inventory bottles when keeping it in bulk will be more efficient. AND when you do finally bottle the next batch, obviously that will taste somewhat differently - due at least to the extra time in wood. just a thought.

Yes, such variation can (and does) occur. In addition there will be variation in temperature we serve the wine at, decanting or breathing time and I guess plenty of other variables including our palates and bottle variation.

Finally some unscrupulous companies have released one initial 'super' batch for critics/shows and early purchasers, subsequently releasing inferior batches which sell well on the reviews of the initial batch. Illegal and reassuringly it does seem to get picked up on in the odd instances it's occurred.