It would be like putting a silk suit on a pig. That stadium was built so cheap that it would be a waste of time in my opinion. We would be better off building a completely new stadium from scratch. Although putting a roof on would give us the chance to get a Super Bowl, I still don't see it improving much else. We play football outside in the cold in Ohio. Period.

andrew6586 wrote:It would be like putting a silk suit on a pig. That stadium was built so cheap that it would be a waste of time in my opinion. We would be better off building a completely new stadium from scratch. Although putting a roof on would give us the chance to get a Super Bowl, I still don't see it improving much else. We play football outside in the cold in Ohio. Period.

Putting a dome (retractable roof) on would be done for reasons other than moving Browns' games indoors. How many days per year is Cleveland Browns Stadium in use? 10 Browns games, Browns scrimmage, a few high school games and a small college game, Kenny Chesney concert,.......anything else? So it's used 14 days per year? Take a look to see how often Lucas Oil Stadium is used:

I doubt Cleveland would ever get a SB either, however a final four would be possible.

The only way I would see this happening (and I agree with Andrew it would be better just to tear the eye-sore down and start from scratch) would be if the Browns played a decade plus of great football, with a Franchise QB who garners a ton of commercial interest e.g. what happened in Indy with Payton Manning, and the house that he built

"I don't think they're building chemical weapons in Berea. But they might be. I can't say for sure."Chuck Klosterman

It would be nice to have the stadium host something other than bad football and a shitty kenny chesney concert.

Swerb wrote:Go start a blog if you want to tell the world your incomprehendible ramblings.

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I have a big arm and can throw the ball pretty damn far...... maybe even over those moutains. The Browns should sign me, i'll let you all in locker room to drink beer. Then we can all go out the parking lot to watch me do motorcycle stunts.

The 2013 Division II Winter National Championships Festival has been moved from Cleveland to Birmingham, Ala., because of challenges involving the hotel block in Cleveland.

The Festival − which will feature Division II national championships in men’s and women’s swimming, men’s and women’s indoor track, and wrestling – will be conducted March 3-9, 2013, at Birmingham’s CrossPlex multisport facility. The dates and schedule of events will not be affected by the change of venue. The Gulf South Conference and the City of Birmingham will serve as co-hosts.

It was originally supposed to be held at the Spire in Geneva, but the bottom line was that Cleveland didn't have enough hotel space to accommodate the Festival. Of course, the Super Bowl and the Final Four aren't nearly as big as the Div. II Swimming Championships...

So if they cap the stadium, hotels will start pouring into town in anticipation of some massive demand for stadium use? They're gonna throw up a bunch of rooms b/c 10 years from now maybe Cleveland gets a SB or Final Four?

If you say so.

My feeling is there has to be more of demand for hotel space on a regular basis - dome or no dome - before hotels see it as feasible to start building new ones.

Hikohadon wrote:So if they cap the stadium, hotels will start pouring into town in anticipation of some massive demand for stadium use? They're gonna throw up a bunch of rooms b/c 10 years from now maybe Cleveland gets a SB or Final Four?

If you say so.

My feeling is there has to be more of demand for hotel space on a regular basis - dome or no dome - before hotels see it as feasible to start building new ones.

The dome, like the casino, medical mart, arena/ballpark, rock hall, and everything else would create year-round need. You guys look at one football game as the only thing that would be held there, when Idoctribefan showed us the link http://www.lucasoilstadium.com/upcoming-events.aspx

Hikohadon wrote:So if they cap the stadium, hotels will start pouring into town in anticipation of some massive demand for stadium use? They're gonna throw up a bunch of rooms b/c 10 years from now maybe Cleveland gets a SB or Final Four?

If you say so.

My feeling is there has to be more of demand for hotel space on a regular basis - dome or no dome - before hotels see it as feasible to start building new ones.

The dome, like the casino, medical mart, arena/ballpark, rock hall, and everything else would create year-round need. You guys look at one football game as the only thing that would be held there, when Idoctribefan showed us the link http://www.lucasoilstadium.com/upcoming-events.aspx

Define myopic.

I can't, I've never seen your opic.

Putting a roof on CBS does not make it Lucas Oil Stadium.

Impressed by all those events they have booked for 10-100 people. I guess that keeps the janitors employed.

Let's be honest - would the city get more use out of a capped stadium than it is now? Yes.

But to think that CBS will instantly start competing with Lucas Oil Stadium or Ford Field simply because it now has a roof is naive. Those facilities were designed to be glorified convention centers. CBS was designed to be a football stadium.

If you want to compete with the Lucas Oil Stadiums, you'd have to tear CBS down and build a new facility there that was designed to accommodate a multitude of events.

And I still contend that almost all of those events that Lucas Oil hosts could be taken care of by building a state-of-the-art convention center, which would probably cost as much to build as putting a retractable roof on the stadium.

This argument is useless anyway - those architecture firms are going to look at it and tell Jimmy "Here's how much it'll cost you to put lipstick on this pig" and he'll say "Thanks, I think I'll build some more suites instead."

The 2013 Division II Winter National Championships Festival has been moved from Cleveland to Birmingham, Ala., because of challenges involving the hotel block in Cleveland.

The Festival − which will feature Division II national championships in men’s and women’s swimming, men’s and women’s indoor track, and wrestling – will be conducted March 3-9, 2013, at Birmingham’s CrossPlex multisport facility. The dates and schedule of events will not be affected by the change of venue. The Gulf South Conference and the City of Birmingham will serve as co-hosts.

It was originally supposed to be held at the Spire in Geneva, but the bottom line was that Cleveland didn't have enough hotel space to accommodate the Festival. Of course, the Super Bowl and the Final Four aren't nearly as big as the Div. II Swimming Championships...

The need to put a dome on CBS would coincide with building an adjacent convention center. A convention center is being rebuilt next to the Medical Mart so there's no need for that. The time for a dome/convo center should have been put in place back in '98/'99 when the joint was being put up. Too bad everyone was up in arms back then b/c no way were people going to go watch a game indoors. Funny how a decade + of shitty play makes people wish it had been done.

A dome will attract concerts? Which bands do stadium tours during the winter months anyways?

Sure you could build more hotels in hopes that one weekend 5 -10 yrs from now will be sold out, sound like a good business practice.

Galley Boys are slop on top of a so-so burger and a bun you coulde get from a Covneninet food mart generic pack. They the Antoine Joubert of burgers; soft, sloppy, oozing grease and cheap sauce and extremely overrated by a biased fan base. Proof that if you throw enough cheap sauce shit on a burger you still can't overcome the lame burger. -JB

The 2013 Division II Winter National Championships Festival has been moved from Cleveland to Birmingham, Ala., because of challenges involving the hotel block in Cleveland.

The Festival − which will feature Division II national championships in men’s and women’s swimming, men’s and women’s indoor track, and wrestling – will be conducted March 3-9, 2013, at Birmingham’s CrossPlex multisport facility. The dates and schedule of events will not be affected by the change of venue. The Gulf South Conference and the City of Birmingham will serve as co-hosts.

It was originally supposed to be held at the Spire in Geneva, but the bottom line was that Cleveland didn't have enough hotel space to accommodate the Festival. Of course, the Super Bowl and the Final Four aren't nearly as big as the Div. II Swimming Championships...

The 2013 Division II Winter National Championships Festival has been moved from Cleveland to Birmingham, Ala., because of challenges involving the hotel block in Cleveland.

The Festival − which will feature Division II national championships in men’s and women’s swimming, men’s and women’s indoor track, and wrestling – will be conducted March 3-9, 2013, at Birmingham’s CrossPlex multisport facility. The dates and schedule of events will not be affected by the change of venue. The Gulf South Conference and the City of Birmingham will serve as co-hosts.

It was originally supposed to be held at the Spire in Geneva, but the bottom line was that Cleveland didn't have enough hotel space to accommodate the Festival. Of course, the Super Bowl and the Final Four aren't nearly as big as the Div. II Swimming Championships...

Sounds to me like there are not enough hotels in Geneva.

Same principle. Beautiful, expensive, ridiculous facility in Geneva. It's drop-dead gorgeous and state of the art and perfectly suited to hold huge national and regional events. Built with High School state and regional championships in mind, collegiate swimming and volleyball tourneys, rugby, hoops, volleyball, the whole 9.

But two things that will affect Cleveland also greatly affect Spire: no one wants to come to this part of the country from Nov through March when they can go to a similar facility elsewhere with better weather and there is nowhere for all of the humanity to stay that's convenient to the event and the site.

Larvell Blanks wrote:The need to put a dome on CBS would coincide with building an adjacent convention center. A convention center is being rebuilt next to the Medical Mart so there's no need for that. The time for a dome/convo center should have been put in place back in '98/'99 when the joint was being put up. Too bad everyone was up in arms back then b/c no way were people going to go watch a game indoors. Funny how a decade + of shitty play makes people wish it had been done.

A dome will attract concerts? Which bands do stadium tours during the winter months anyways?

Sure you could build more hotels in hopes that one weekend 5 -10 yrs from now will be sold out, sound like a good business practice.

^Gets it.

How many bands do stadium tours period? How many are so big that the Gund just won't hold all the fans?

The 2013 Division II Winter National Championships Festival has been moved from Cleveland to Birmingham, Ala., because of challenges involving the hotel block in Cleveland.

The Festival − which will feature Division II national championships in men’s and women’s swimming, men’s and women’s indoor track, and wrestling – will be conducted March 3-9, 2013, at Birmingham’s CrossPlex multisport facility. The dates and schedule of events will not be affected by the change of venue. The Gulf South Conference and the City of Birmingham will serve as co-hosts.

It was originally supposed to be held at the Spire in Geneva, but the bottom line was that Cleveland didn't have enough hotel space to accommodate the Festival. Of course, the Super Bowl and the Final Four aren't nearly as big as the Div. II Swimming Championships...

Sounds to me like there are not enough hotels in Geneva.

Same principle. Beautiful, expensive, ridiculous facility in Geneva. It's drop-dead gorgeous and state of the art and perfectly suited to hold huge national and regional events. Built with High School state and regional championships in mind, collegiate swimming and volleyball tourneys, rugby, hoops, volleyball, the whole 9.

But two things that will affect Cleveland also greatly affect Spire: no one wants to come to this part of the country from Nov through March when they can go to a similar facility elsewhere with better weather and there is nowhere for all of the humanity to stay that's convenient to the event and the site.

Chicken or the egg thing.

Surely Pup can house a few co-eds in his guest room for a week in March. That's one fewer hotel room needed.

"And three of the better guys in franchise history, Daugherty, Z and now Kyrie could get hurt in a rubber room full of cotton balls." - Leadpipe

The 2013 Division II Winter National Championships Festival has been moved from Cleveland to Birmingham, Ala., because of challenges involving the hotel block in Cleveland.

The Festival − which will feature Division II national championships in men’s and women’s swimming, men’s and women’s indoor track, and wrestling – will be conducted March 3-9, 2013, at Birmingham’s CrossPlex multisport facility. The dates and schedule of events will not be affected by the change of venue. The Gulf South Conference and the City of Birmingham will serve as co-hosts.

It was originally supposed to be held at the Spire in Geneva, but the bottom line was that Cleveland didn't have enough hotel space to accommodate the Festival. Of course, the Super Bowl and the Final Four aren't nearly as big as the Div. II Swimming Championships...

Sounds to me like there are not enough hotels in Geneva.

Same principle. Beautiful, expensive, ridiculous facility in Geneva. It's drop-dead gorgeous and state of the art and perfectly suited to hold huge national and regional events. Built with High School state and regional championships in mind, collegiate swimming and volleyball tourneys, rugby, hoops, volleyball, the whole 9.

But two things that will affect Cleveland also greatly affect Spire: no one wants to come to this part of the country from Nov through March when they can go to a similar facility elsewhere with better weather and there is nowhere for all of the humanity to stay that's convenient to the event and the site.

Chicken or the egg thing.

It's not only the weather with Spire, it's that it's 90 minutes from the airport - if the weather cooperates. They'll get passed over for an equally shitty weather city like Chicago, cause your team can fly in, and 10 minutes later your at your hotel.

To the point of Hotels, and how Spire and Cleveland are related - look at lodging from Mentor, all the way out to Spire. You know why there isn't much - cause there's no demand. You woulda thought that guy who built it woulda opened his eyes a bit to this. In any event, in today's climate, good luck finding financing for a hotel that you can't guarantee 75% occupance year round. They ain't puttin' a shovel in the ground for 52 weekends at capacity. In Cleveland, Geneva, or anywhere else. And 52 weekends isn't feasible, and even if it was, you're at about 35% for the year.

Well find us the people who are going to build up hotels w/ NO GUARANTEE that these high profile events will fill up their hotels a week at a time or want want to share the current "visitors" with the existing hotels. No one opens a hotel to run at a > 50% occupancy, not if they want to run a successful business they don't.

Maybe, MAYBE the demand for hotel space will increase with the opening of the Medical Mart and Convo Center. That's all dependent on the business they bring. However the occupancy rates at the existing hotels will need to increase from the current 50-60% they're currently enjoying before any other hotel opens up.

Galley Boys are slop on top of a so-so burger and a bun you coulde get from a Covneninet food mart generic pack. They the Antoine Joubert of burgers; soft, sloppy, oozing grease and cheap sauce and extremely overrated by a biased fan base. Proof that if you throw enough cheap sauce shit on a burger you still can't overcome the lame burger. -JB

You have to remember that both teams already played in domes prior to the new venues being built and both venues had hosted large events prior to the new digs. Indianapolis has been a growing city in terms of population and business for some time now while Cleveland has been on the decline in both population and the loss of business at an alarming rate. Thus their increase in convention business and need for hotel space.

Leadership in this area has just let things decline past the point of saving it and starts sticking bandaids on it. Upgrading or building a new convention center way back when would have elimnated the need and use of the IX Center and kept the business and travelers downtown rather than staying/playing out by the Airport. Then again, the leadership taxed the crap out of the businesses that they had no choice but to bail out to the 'burbs or leave the area all together.

The county could have combined a hotel into the MM/Convo area but them people would have cried they were monopolizing much like the claims of Rock Ohio/Gilbert w/ the Casino.

This city/county had an opportunity to do it right the first time by creating a retractable dome stadium/convo center/retail/hotel area along the lakeshore when CBS was first built. Yet fans were up in arms b/c there was no way they would watch football in a sanitized environment on Sundays.

Now as a fix, they'll ask the public to foot some of the bill to help bail them out

It's typical Cleveland in being reactionary rather than proactive.

Galley Boys are slop on top of a so-so burger and a bun you coulde get from a Covneninet food mart generic pack. They the Antoine Joubert of burgers; soft, sloppy, oozing grease and cheap sauce and extremely overrated by a biased fan base. Proof that if you throw enough cheap sauce shit on a burger you still can't overcome the lame burger. -JB

After going to the game this past Sunday, and being lucky enough to have a seat that was under cover (sec 121 row 39) I realized that CBS does not need a dome. It just needs some protection from the elements where the fans sit (like the majority of Muni used to have). Not sure how architecturally challenging it would be (got to be easier then a dome) but anyone who attended that game and had to sit exposed to the elements would tell you it would be worth looking into.

"I don't think they're building chemical weapons in Berea. But they might be. I can't say for sure."Chuck Klosterman

Govbarney wrote:After going to the game this past Sunday, and being lucky enough to have a seat that was under cover (sec 121 row 39) I realized that CBS does not need a dome. It just needs some protection from the elements where the fans sit (like the majority of Muni used to have). Not sure how architecturally challenging it would be (got to be easier then a dome) but anyone who attended that game and had to sit exposed to the elements would tell you it would be worth looking into.

You just have to hope you are not the one that gets stuck behind the pillar holding it up. One other thing, the bathroom lines are too long. There has to be a way to just make a trough that you could stand side by side with your fellow fans and have 20 peeing at once.

Govbarney wrote:After going to the game this past Sunday, and being lucky enough to have a seat that was under cover (sec 121 row 39) I realized that CBS does not need a dome. It just needs some protection from the elements where the fans sit (like the majority of Muni used to have). Not sure how architecturally challenging it would be (got to be easier then a dome) but anyone who attended that game and had to sit exposed to the elements would tell you it would be worth looking into.

I've thought about this as the only acceptable (for me) "roof" that they could put on the stadium - imagine it as a clear/glass saucer put over the stadium, a clear pot lid put over the stadium if you will with the center cut out. Overhang is light weight and supported by spines from the top of the stadium - no pillars. Overhang is also angled so that snow will slide off the back.

Offers a measure of protection to those in the stands without affecting play on the field, does not prevent wind, and the sun can shine through so you generally don't notice it's there.

Govbarney wrote:After going to the game this past Sunday, and being lucky enough to have a seat that was under cover (sec 121 row 39) I realized that CBS does not need a dome. It just needs some protection from the elements where the fans sit (like the majority of Muni used to have). Not sure how architecturally challenging it would be (got to be easier then a dome) but anyone who attended that game and had to sit exposed to the elements would tell you it would be worth looking into.

You just have to hope you are not the one that gets stuck behind the pillar holding it up. One other thing, the bathroom lines are too long. There has to be a way to just make a trough that you could stand side by side with your fellow fans and have 20 peeing at once.

Spin wrote: I still firmly believe they (especially Michael White) have dirt on their hands for screwing the Browns. Funny how White was MIA the week after fArt died...

I would be surprised if you're not right. I don't get your point, though. That does not matter re: moving the Cleveland Browns.

Many a sports franchise has been screwed by many a city. Art's decisions stand on their own.

Art never made his case to the public, and failed to lobby for the 1995 renovation vote. He was in financial trouble, and the pupils in his eyes had transformed into glimmering dollar signs. Also, he already had lobbied to keep what became the Jaguars from taking his spot in Baltimore.