Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bow lines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.

This is the response I got from Mr. Slimey this morning. All words are exactly his except for what I put in [brackets] to obscure where I work and my ethnicity.

Hi Unnalee, I am now forwarding you by email the list of books. You can download them for your convenience. I suspect that you may have all, or almost all, of these. Get a work study student to cross check them against your files.

Part 1 is a list of those published in "[insert ethnic homeland]", which you may not be interested in. Yet, there are some classics therein. E.g., note the nine books by Martin Luther (you know who he was); one by theological giant [O. Smith]; three by [H. Jones], who was the leader of one of the four major revival movements in [homeland], two of which are classics.

Part 2 is more to your liking, by USA authors, etc. Note those by [Johnson] (National Church leader), a 2002 directory, etc. The rest you have, I'm certain. I will be surprised if you take any of them. It will not offend me if you want none.

Finally, I apologize for prying into your faith life; being a pastor I am by habit prone to do that. Yet, being [our ethnic group], we can trust each other. Carry on... Glad to have you at our sacred archives. Blessings as you celebrate the Savior, the baby Jesus, this Christmas. The university has a special place in the heart of God, else she would not be in existence any longer; you are in a holy place.

Pastor Slimey

Now that you've read if for yourselves, did anyone get the impression of condescension or that he was trying to tell me how to do my job? Maybe it's just me, but telling me what to have my work study students to do, and then the history lesson on the authors... (This is not only my ethnic heritage, but also what I have an advanced degree in. I wouldn't have gotten this job if I didn't know anything about bedrocks of the Blue Church and the immigrants who brought it here.) Perhaps, my history with the Azure church is making me read way more into this than is necessary. I distanced myself from the church because I was tired of being talked down to because I was a woman.

At least thanks to lurking around here for years now, I know how to be professionally polite without being a doormat to everyone who blusters into my office. I'm just going to move along and not let this guy irk me.

Yes, condescending. The "We can trust each other" bit rubbed me the wrong way, too. I think he means either "You can trust me, go ahead and share personal details with me." or "I trust that you're the 'right' kind of Religion so it's okay if you don't say it." Blech!

Please don't use that term. It's sexist and dismissive. It implies that it's his Y-chromosome that's wrong and if he just had an X then everything would be ok. It's just as bad as if I said "Oh, she's on her period, that's why she's behaving that way."

The guy is a condescending, patronizing jerk, but that has nothing to do with his gender. There are plenty of condescending jerks with XX chromosomes.

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Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bow lines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.

Please don't use that term. It's sexist and dismissive. It implies that it's his Y-chromosome that's wrong and if he just had an X then everything would be ok. It's just as bad as if I said "Oh, she's on her period, that's why she's behaving that way."

It's a particular type of condescension that is tied to male socialization and not to male chromosomes or biology. It is itself sexist behavior that really does exist in society. It occurs not because of genes or hormones but because some men, in some settings, are raised to think they are superior to women. The OP herself says that there is some of this rampant in the particular religion she is discussing.

Please don't use that term. It's sexist and dismissive. It implies that it's his Y-chromosome that's wrong and if he just had an X then everything would be ok. It's just as bad as if I said "Oh, she's on her period, that's why she's behaving that way."

It's a particular type of condescension that is tied to male socialization and not to male chromosomes or biology. It is itself sexist behavior that really does exist in society. It occurs not because of genes or hormones but because some men, in some settings, are raised to think they are superior to women. The OP herself says that there is some of this rampant in the particular religion she is discussing.

His condescension does come from male privilege, but it still doesn't make "mansplaining" an acceptable term. It allows someone to dismiss someone's arguments based on their gender and not the content of their arguments. I don't dismiss your statements based on your gender, please do me (and other males) the same courtesy, even if our statements are totally moronic. Dismiss them because they're moronic.

I'm not objecting to your characterization of his statements, I'm objecting to your using a sexist term to dismiss him. Again, you wouldn't want your statements characterized with "that's her PMS talking," so why is acceptable to say, in effect, "that's his Y chromosome talking"? It's very hard to listen to someone when they're doing something while complaining that another person is doing it. If you want to call him sexist (and I would strongly agree with you), don't use a sexist term to do so. It does nothing to advance the discussion.

Logged

Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bow lines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.

Please don't use that term. It's sexist and dismissive. It implies that it's his Y-chromosome that's wrong and if he just had an X then everything would be ok. It's just as bad as if I said "Oh, she's on her period, that's why she's behaving that way."

It's a particular type of condescension that is tied to male socialization and not to male chromosomes or biology. It is itself sexist behavior that really does exist in society. It occurs not because of genes or hormones but because some men, in some settings, are raised to think they are superior to women. The OP herself says that there is some of this rampant in the particular religion she is discussing.

His condescension does come from male privilege, but it still doesn't make "mansplaining" an acceptable term. It allows someone to dismiss someone's arguments based on their gender and not the content of their arguments. I don't dismiss your statements based on your gender, please do me (and other males) the same courtesy, even if our statements are totally moronic. Dismiss them because they're moronic.

I'm not objecting to your characterization of his statements, I'm objecting to your using a sexist term to dismiss him. Again, you wouldn't want your statements characterized with "that's her PMS talking," so why is acceptable to say, in effect, "that's his Y chromosome talking"? It's very hard to listen to someone when they're doing something while complaining that another person is doing it. If you want to call him sexist (and I would strongly agree with you), don't use a sexist term to do so. It does nothing to advance the discussion.

It's being used in the correct context here. This is a man who believes that his religion gives him the right to lecture women and people younger than him and he believes that he is in the right. This was not a term directed at ALL men, but to this one man in particular. Had you said I was grumpy because I was PMSy and you knew it, and I actually was grumpy because I was PMSy (cramps tend to do that to a person), it doesn't make it sexist, it makes it fact.

Please don't use that term. It's sexist and dismissive. It implies that it's his Y-chromosome that's wrong and if he just had an X then everything would be ok. It's just as bad as if I said "Oh, she's on her period, that's why she's behaving that way."

It's a particular type of condescension that is tied to male socialization and not to male chromosomes or biology. It is itself sexist behavior that really does exist in society. It occurs not because of genes or hormones but because some men, in some settings, are raised to think they are superior to women. The OP herself says that there is some of this rampant in the particular religion she is discussing.

His condescension does come from male privilege, but it still doesn't make "mansplaining" an acceptable term. It allows someone to dismiss someone's arguments based on their gender and not the content of their arguments. I don't dismiss your statements based on your gender, please do me (and other males) the same courtesy, even if our statements are totally moronic. Dismiss them because they're moronic.

I'm not objecting to your characterization of his statements, I'm objecting to your using a sexist term to dismiss him. Again, you wouldn't want your statements characterized with "that's her PMS talking," so why is acceptable to say, in effect, "that's his Y chromosome talking"? It's very hard to listen to someone when they're doing something while complaining that another person is doing it. If you want to call him sexist (and I would strongly agree with you), don't use a sexist term to do so. It does nothing to advance the discussion.

Mansplainer means "man being condescending toward woman," while PMS is the name of a medical condition. I am in no way saying that's his Y chromosome talking. I'm saying that's the privilege he has been groomed to expect talking. It is not sexist to call out sexism. I don't think we are going to agree on this.