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Re: T.O. to the Kings?

And just for the record, the Eagles going to the SB only proves they were a good WR away. It doesn't prove that TO is better than Marvin in any way, shape, or form. As soon as TO catches 143 balls in a season, let me know.

Re: T.O. to the Kings?

The Eagles have a defense, the Colts don't. Still doesn't prove that TO is better than Marvin. Show me SOMETHING that TO does better and I'll consider it. Marvin's career numbers are better. TO only has one season that stacks up to Marvin's standards. When are you going to apply actual logic to this?

Re: T.O. to the Kings?

Like I said before having the best QB in the NFL throwing to you will make your stats look good. Without Manning he is a good WR, not great but good.

Best QB in the NFL? But Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson took their teams to the SB so they MUST be better right?

Seriously, don't deal with ifs, and, or buts. Deal with reality. What does TO do better than Marvin? Is he faster? No. Marvin was the fastest player in his draft class, and certainly hasn't lost much of that speed. Does he run routes better? No. It's widely known that Marvin is one of, if not THE best route runner in the game. Does he catch more touchdowns? No, but I'll grant you this one is close. Does he have more yards? Not even close. Does he have more catches? Again, not even close. Marvin just ended his 6th consecutive 1000 yard season. He has four 100+ catch seasons (including a drubbing of the league record with 143). TO's finest work, the best that he has done, doesn't even stack up well to Marvin's FOURTH best season. Basically I'm left with two things that TO does better. He has a slightly higher yards per catch average, and he has caught a few more 40+ yard bombs. Both of these can be attributed to his heighth, and freakish vertical leap. Yes I'll admit that Marvin has had a better QB, but I say it's a wash due to TO's athletic gifts.

This brings me to my final point, and the last I will say on this matter before I take my leave of it. A point where TO has no hope of touching Marvin, and can't even breathe the air around him. Heart. Marvin has done eveything he has done while not possessing the big, physical frame of the prototypical NFL wideout. Nearly every time he steps on the field, he's matched up against someone who is bigger than him. Until this past season it was usually two someones bigger than him. You can't attribute the kind of success that Marvin has had to anything other than heart. He just flat out WANTS to be the best WR in football. He goes out, does his job, and plays the game he was born to play. He doesn't create problems in the locker room, he doesn't create problems in the media, he doesn't sign footballs in the endzone, he doesn't open his mouth. Ever. Why would he have to open his mouth? His game has done all the talking for him.

Re: T.O. to the Kings?

IOW... a wide receiver isn't why we're sitting on the sidelines when the big game rolls around. They're both very good... and substituting one for the other in the Colts depth chart (IMHO) makes no real difference in the ultimate goal.

-Bball

Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

------

"A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

Re: T.O. to the Kings?

If I'm not mistaken, didn't the Eagles win their 2 playoff games to MAKE the Super Bowl without T.O., and then proceed to lose it with him playing? They finally took the next step last year and T.O. was not a factor at all.

Re: T.O. to the Kings?

If I'm not mistaken, didn't the Eagles win their 2 playoff games to MAKE the Super Bowl without T.O., and then proceed to lose it with him playing? They finally took the next step last year and T.O. was not a factor at all.

LMAO, TO was not a factor. How the hell did they get to 13-3 and get that number 1 seed.
Marvins stats against the Pats = 5 catches and 44 yards
TO's stats against Pats = 9 catches 123 yards

Re: T.O. to the Kings?

The Eagles have a defense, the Colts don't. Still doesn't prove that TO is better than Marvin. Show me SOMETHING that TO does better and I'll consider it. Marvin's career numbers are better. TO only has one season that stacks up to Marvin's standards. When are you going to apply actual logic to this?

Re: T.O. to the Kings?

Colts with Marvin Harrison for what 9 years = No trips to the Super Bowl.
Give TO Peyton Manning and see what he does.Marvin Harrison wouldnt be **** if it wasnt for Manning.

Football is the ultimate team game. One player does not make a team and a team does not consist of one player. The Eagles pre-TO made it to 3 consecutive NFC Championship games. So, they were a pretty damn good team before his arrival. He merely pushed them an inch closer to winning the Super Bowl (mind you, he did not help the WIN the Super Bowl, because they LOST).

Another fun fact: 3 of the 4 starting secondary players (Cornerbacks and Safeties) for the Eagles made the Pro Bowl.

Eagles have a good offense (top ten in league) and a good defense (top ten in the league) and play in a weaker conference (from top to bottom).

Colts have a great offense (second in league) and a mediocre defense (bottom five in the league) and play in a tougher conference (from top to bottom).

It just goes to show that the Eagles have the better overall team, but it does not mean that TO is better than Harrison, or vice versa. The Eagles are the more COMPLETE team.

And as for your quote above about Harrison not being crapola if it wasn't for Manning, the same logic could be applied to TO and McNabb.

It just bugs the hell outta me when people spout off about things that they should not, because more often than not, it'll come back to bite him/her in the butt.

Re: T.O. to the Kings?

It just goes to show that the Eagles have the better overall team, but it does not mean that TO is better than Harrison, or vice versa. The Eagles are the more COMPLETE team.

I think you pretty much nailed it with your post. Marvin is better than T.O. but Owens is a top 3 reciever talent wise. Is he worth the grief he has started to cause? I don't think so and Andy Reid is old school and won't put up with it. He will either get released or have to come back to the Eagles begging to get back on the field because with Reid the team will just move on without him.

The Eagles won 5 straight games 2 years ago with their 3rd string quarterback starting and their entire pro bowl secondary out with injuries. Reid is like Bill Belichick he is a master at filling holes and moving on and winning without his best players. He has a system and can plug just about any player into that system effectively. They have also done an incredible job managing the cap and drafting good young talented players.

If they lose TO their offense won't be as explosive and they may struggle against top notch defenses but they still have plenty of talent(about 11 pro bowlers) and overall balance with quality defense,special teams etc.,, to beat 90% of the teams in the league even without TO.

They rested their starters the last 2 games or else they would have been 15-1. Their margin of victory against NFC teams was like 18 ppg. Even if they release Owens one player won't make that much difference to bring them back to the pack.