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I want to visit in the coming months for a weekend. I heard I can apply for a visa upon entry, but that I might be tested for HIV immediately. My viral load is currently low as I started medication, and I might be undetectable by the time I travel. Another issue is traveling with my meds to UAE.

I went to Egypt last year and I didnt have any problems at all. At the same time I didn't involve myself romantically with locals in case I was arrested and tested by the police.

I prefer responses from people who have actually traveled to Dubai or who know the law.

Hiv tests are only required when a person is applying to work or reside in the UAE. It looks like you shouldn't have a problem if you're only planning on being there for a weekend - but you might have a problem if you're taking hiv meds into the country.

There are no health checks at the border, no health certificates must be presented on entry. Short term stays are therefore possible, however not free of risk. It is not allowed to import antiretroviral medication for personal use. source

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Mecch, I am still new at being positive, and there is so much information to know. It was pointed out to me yesterday that being undetectable does not mean that I would appear as negative on quick tests.

and

Thank you Ann, I asked my local HIV resources centre and they concurred with your answer. I am also not sure how I should sneak my meds past immigration, I would feel silly (to say the least) doing this. I just became undetectable and I don't want to stop taking my medication just for a short trip. I hate that I feel somewhat like a criminal just for being positive (but maybe this is just a dramatic statement).thank you for your in-depth answer!

Anti HIV tests (also called ELISA) are not looking for virus but antibodies produced by your body to stop HIV. (Like they could!) They will present, as long as you have even UD viral load. Rapid tests also look for this Anti-HIV antibodies, so you will test positive. If they do a very expensive PCR test for your viral load in the entry, so you might test negative. But i don't think that's the case.

But i don't think you will have a problem about crossing the border. If you think there might be a risk, put you meds in another secured, moisture free, drug box (like some kind of peptic ulcer medicine box or heart medicine if you can find) and tell you have heart condition or peptic ulcer etc.. This is also risky but i don't think they will try to test the drugs inside it, if you don't bring like 2-3 boxes. If you also have a prescription for this another condition, it would be easier to prove. But do not stop taking medicine because of this trip!

urovoro, keep in mind that they cannot search the belongings of every single person entering the country. If you are very careful to not pack anything that could cause them to search your bags (ie something that might look odd on the x-rays) and if you keep a low-key, low-profile while going through customs chances are that they're not going to bother with you. Don't give them any reason to look at you twice.

A word to the wise - just as many places employ "racial profiling" when deciding who to search or question, places like UAE are likely to also employ a different type of profiling. They may look for "stereotypical gay" behaviour. While I do not agree with this practice, it has to be acknowledged that it does go on.

I remember reading an article years ago about hiv positive gay men trying to gain entry into the US (when poz people could not enter). It was written by a gay British man who had been there, done that and witnessed a very camp mate of his being pulled and searched for hiv meds. Fortunately, his mate wasn't poz but the the guy who wrote the article was, and was shitting himself that he'd be next and his meds would be discovered. He got through successfully.

His take-away lesson was if you're a "screaming queen" (HIS words, NOT mine!) that you need to tone it way down while going through customs if you don't want to be profiled. I vividly remember the article, but I cannot locate it online. It was in a now-defunct publication, so that's probably why.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Very good points Ann. I agree and have seen and witnessed racial profiling at the airport were I live, a big one with 20 million pax a year.

Since drug mules and smuggling is quite common here, blacks are often pulled aside and searched for no apparent reason.

I have friends working in the airport as well and they agree that the searches aren't random, they have profiles which are more likely to carry something illegal,enter with false passport or just belong to a minority.This isn't really in the training manual for new employees but rather a working place attitude which many feel they are forced to accept in order to continue working and gain acceptance of the senior staff.

This isn't really in the training manual for new employees but rather a working place attitude which many feel they are forced to accept in order to continue working and gain acceptance of the senior staff.

Very true. And in a place like UAE where the prevalent attitude is homophobic, sometimes anti-Western, and where hiv meds will get you deported, you can bet gay-profiling goes on even if it's not openly acknowledged or in the training manual. It went on in the US during the poz travel ban, so it's no stretch of the imagination that it goes on in a place like UAE. It's not fair that gay men are targeted with the assumption of being poz, but it happens.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

It's actually such a sad thought that HIV+ under treatment simply cannot go to some places in the world. Let's say I'd get called for a job transfer...in Dubai. How can you get HIV treatment in Dubai? I can guess that it's probably not an easy thing to do, is it?

But for a tourist trip in a place like that (Arab or Asian), I do think that it's better to put all your meds on a vitamin supplement flask, that's what I'd do...they probably won't ask any questions even if they find the damn thing.

Let's say I'd get called for a job transfer...in Dubai. How can you get HIV treatment in Dubai? I can guess that it's probably not an easy thing to do, is it?

Didn't you read the thread? As a foreign national, you cannot work or be a resident in UAE (Dubai is in UAE) without first taking an hiv antibody test and testing negative. Mate, you're not going to test negative so you would not be permitted to work there, meds or no meds.

They do not test people going to UAE for short vacation stays, but if they catch you with hiv meds on you (even if you're only there for a short time), you're shown the door.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Very true. And in a place like UAE where the prevalent attitude is homophobic, sometimes anti-Western, and where hiv meds will get you deported, you can bet gay-profiling goes on even if it's not openly acknowledged or in the training manual.

Hmm. My experience, on my one brief trip a few years ago, was smooth sailing. Of course, I was undiagnosed & I'm not Western. About 80% of Dubai's population is expatriate, of whom the majority are Indians. Hindi/Urdu is widely spoken (I'm a native speaker), including by many of the Arabs there. I blended in easily.

I know some 'screaming queens' who live in Dubai and seem to be having a great time there. As long as you don't advertise your sexuality in red neon lights you'll be fine.

I really don't think most people in Dubai would even know what the telltale signs of the 'stereotypical western gay man' are; it wouldn't have crept into their range of consciousness. Unlike in the West, People in Arab countries would generally not deduce a man is gay if he's effeminate, mainly because homosexuality is swept under the carpet, out of clear view. Whether people in the airport are privy to some special info on this issue is another matter.

I also don't think it is an anti-western city; it is by far the most westernized city in the Gulf though.

Of course, if you're carrying meds for a brief trip then I guess you've got to be vigilant.

As an aside, my impression of the place is a 'giant mall in the desert'.

Didn't you read the thread? As a foreign national, you cannot work or be a resident in UAE (Dubai is in UAE) without first taking an hiv antibody test and testing negative. Mate, you're not going to test negative so you would not be permitted to work there, meds or no meds.

They do not test people going to UAE for short vacation stays, but if they catch you with hiv meds on you (even if you're only there for a short time), you're shown the door.

Nope, I didn`t know that, or didn't remember. Well, I'll add this to the "Things You Cannot Do Anymore If You're HIV+"...next to "cannot give a blood transfusion". I'm glad working in Dubai was never in the cards for me anyway.

Rockin - some countries have banned visitors and/or workers who are HIV+. Google for the lists.

That said, you did ask about getting HIV meds. Many of these countries do treat their own citizens who ARE hiv+. They just don't accept foreigners who are HIV+. In Saudi Arabia a Saudi citizen can be treated for HIV. But a HIV+ foreigner is deported.

There are certain places that I would not go to even if all expenses were paid. One is Dubai and the other is Jamaica. I would go to Egypt, in fact I hope to go one day to see the great pyramids.

Next month I'll be moving to London to do a one year MBA but my school has units on other countries as well and they allow you to rotate to another city after 9 months. Dubai was one of the options but, regardless of HIV, I wasn't really considering it. They also have units in Shanghai and San Francisco. I was always more tempted to go to San Fran because everyone says the city is amazing...and living expenses are much cheaper than London anyway.

Shanghai would be a very interesting experience but I think I won't be able to get proper treatment there so I'm pretty much discarding this option.

You might ask yourself if you want to take the risks involved; if you put your meds in another container and lie about your condition and you are found out, even if the risk is small, the time you will spend in jail until these meds are checked and you are deported will be between 4-8 weeks.

Personally, I refuse to travel to any country that vilifies and denies entry to people whose only crime is living with a preventable and treatable virus. I refused to travel to the US while their hiv travel ban was still in effect, even though I am an American citizen and it wouldn't applied to me. (I'm an ex-pat living in the UK.)

Why should I contribute to their economy with my tourist dollars (pounds/euros/insert local currency here)? I'd much rather spend my money in a country who accepts me, hiv and all.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

I have traveled all over the world WITH my medications and have never experienced a problem. I even traveled to Beirut, Lebanon, West Africa, all over the Caribbean and South America. Not one time has an immigration picked up the bottle and said, "what's this for?" I believe that UAE grants the tourist visa upon arrival anyway for stays less than 60 days.

ENTRY/EXIT REQUIREMENTS: U.S. citizens are subject to all UAE immigration laws, which can be complex and demanding. U.S. citizens should familiarize themselves with such laws before traveling to or residing in the UAE. A passport is required to enter the UAE. For personal travel of 30 days or fewer, U.S. citizens holding valid tourist passports may obtain visitor visas at the port of entry for no fee. For stays longer than 30 days, all travelers must obtain a visa before arrival in the UAE. In addition, a full medical exam is required for work or residence permits and includes an HIV/AIDS test. Testing must be performed after arrival; a U.S. HIV/AIDS test is not accepted. U.S. citizens have been detained and deported for testing positive for HIV or hepatitis. Please verify this information with the Embassy of the United Arab Emirates before you travel. It is located at 3522 International Court, NW, Washington, DC 20037, telephone (202) 243-2400. Visit the Embassy of the United Arab Emirates website for the most current visa information

It sounds as though they only test for HIV if working there and staying longer than 30 days. Put your HIV medications in a "regular" pharmacy bottle. If asked, which they won't, it's hypertension medication.

Another option would be to put them in empty vitamin bottles. That way if you have different ones you can put them in different types of bottles. But that's only if your employer sends you there for a week or you have to go with family members and don't want to disclose to them why you can't go. Best choice is not to go at all.

« Last Edit: August 11, 2012, 12:25:25 PM by LiveWithIt »

Logged

Pray God you can copeI know you have a little life in you yet. I know you have a lot of strength left.

I would imagine that if your meds do get closely scrutinised by custom officials, they're going to be a helluva lot more pissed off with you if you've obviously tried to hide what you have from them - after all, it's a type of fraud. It's always recommended that you travel with ANY meds in their original containers. Otherwise, you're asking for trouble on top of trouble.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

I asked another local Aids organization and the peer-support worker (who is Iranian-born and has travelled to Dubai) said that if I got caught I could be deported immediately to my country of citizenship. I have a Canadian passport but I am doing a fellowship in Germany, and I could not afford to be deported to Canada and then pay my way back to Europe.

This is a sad moment for me. Soon after I tested positive I swore to not let this illness stop me from things. But so far I have had to stop dating a man I was starting to really like. I also rearranged my life so I could live in places with good health care. And now I can't go on nice little trip to Dubai I know there are worse situations than mine, and I shouldn't complain. I also previously considered doing a school exchange in UAE, guess that option's now out!

PS: I guess I am campy by North American standards, but I don't think these standards are universal. I have blended in nicely in many parts of the world.

The world is your oyster. There a few countries and a few people who can't deal with you being HIV+ so you should rethink how "nice" those countries and people are and then stop thinking about them entirely and enjoy the possible.

Logged

“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

But so far I have had to stop dating a man I was starting to really like. I also rearranged my life so I could live in places with good health care. And now I can't go on nice little trip to Dubai

Why did you "had" to stop dating this man? He rejected you after you disclosed your status?

And I think you might be looking at the glass half-empty. You can still live and work in any country in South and North America and Europe, provided the proper visa status. So yeah, some countries in the Middle East and Asia are off limits but oh well, you win some you lose some. You can still go to Dubai as a tourist.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Why go to Dubai? Visit other places. If it's absolutely necessary, I don't know, ask a doctor to prescribe hypertension medicine, put the meds inside containers for that, along with a prescription and go, if that's possible, like someone said.

I still don't understand why anyone would willingly travel - as a tourist - to a country who treats those of us living with hiv as undesirables and less-than-human criminals.

I can understand having a conundrum if one needs - needs - to go there for a work related trip or if that's the only place one can get certain aspects of their education, but to willingly subject yourself to all the fear and anxiety of being deported (and humiliated) while attempting to go through customs just seems to be ... dunno. The definition of insanity perhaps. Don't forget that if you do get deported, you're likely to end up with a stamp in your passport saying you were denied entry, and that will possibly give you hassle when traveling to other countries.

And as far as Dubai goes, I don't get the attraction, but I admit that's just subjective on my part. Sure, it's an ultra-modern city wrested from the desert, but at what cost to how many minorities who work for peanuts producing even more wealth for the already obscenely wealthy. The whole thing - including their hiv travel ban - just rubs me the wrong way and it's one of the last places on earth I'd want to visit. It's a great place for a lay-over (it's often a lay-over spot for Europeans traveling to destinations in the Far East), but I wouldn't want to visit there. But that's just me.

Like I said earlier in the thread, I refused to travel to the US while they still had an hiv travel ban in place even though as US passport holder, I would not have been subjected to the law. It was the principal of the thing. If people I live with in the UK couldn't travel there solely because of their hiv, I wasn't going to either. Solidarity!

Urovoro - I'm curious. What's the attraction of Dubai for you? I'm not wanting to give you a hard time about it, I'm genuinely curious. Maybe there's something about the place I've missed and I'm always open to changing my mind about things.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Yes, they ask for a test but don´t deny the access to this country for HIV condition. My permanent visa to this country has been approved when I knew and declared I had HIV. The matter for them is in regard to cost for their health system for new immigrants. If the OP has paper from this country, then, no problem at all....

In regard to Iran, are the restrictions same as Dubay for tourism in regard to HIV condition? I checked an info in the link that was given, but it is quite old...

Edit to add that I may go to Iran for work matters with an Ecuadorian passport...

If you have let's say 10 millions (USD or euro or GBP)...Canada and Australia will accept you as an immigrant. But many people don't have this money. I doubt they would give me a resident visa even though in my country you are given HIV meds every 12 months if you live abroad (and they can even send them to you thru FEDEX, if you can't come to pick them up).

Well, it is not the sujet of the thread, sorry, but in regard to Canada you can have HIV and have a permanent visa, I´ve done it and I´m not the only one on this forum... and I don´t have 10 millions...

There are some conditions but HIV itself does not exclude your from that country at it can do it in regard to those from Arabic Golfe...

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

....... I doubt they would give me a resident visa even though in my country you are given HIV meds every 12 months if you live abroad (and they can even send them to you thru FEDEX, if you can't come to pick them up).

if I may slightly go 'off track' here to ask Elf the following;Elf your country's support to you is commendable......where are you from?

That map appears to show China as having no restrictions. I thought they had restrictions on stays over 6 months. Does anyone know if this has changed recently?

edit- that map seems very optimistic, China, South Korea and Indoneisa all showing as green (no restriction on entry, residence, stay etc). I know people who have had to have HIV tests in all 3 of those countries over the last 4 months to gain a work permit.

That map appears to show China as having no restrictions. I thought they had restrictions on stays over 6 months. Does anyone know if this has changed recently?

edit- that map seems very optimistic, China, South Korea and Indoneisa all showing as green (no restriction on entry, residence, stay etc). I know people who have had to have HIV tests in all 3 of those countries over the last 4 months to gain a work permit.

Hmmm, I would have thought that if any organisation had their facts correct, it would be UNAIDS. The document in question is dated July 2012, so it should be up to date.

As for China, didn't they relax their policy when they had the Olympics in 2008?

And about the people you know who had to have hiv tests in order to get work permits, do you know if that was a requirement of the company they wanted to work for, or if it was for a government work visa? Two different things.

I know that on the Isle of Man, people who have not been ordinary residents for five years have to obtain work permits, but their employer has to apply to the government on their behalf and they can conceivably require any sort of tests or hurdles they want to before they will make the application. I know of one company who insists prospective employees take and pass a physical (not sure if hiv tests are included) before they will bother applying for a work permit for you. Maybe this is what has gone on with the people you know.

I suppose if anyone wanted clarification, they could get in touch with Susan Timberlake. From the bottom of the document;

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Here in South East Asia ( Thai, Laos, Cambodiaetc) some employers check for HIV, I know people who stillgot jobs despite being poz. In Thailand HIV is not included in the medical check required to obtain a work permit but TB is.

Hmmm, I would have thought that if any organisation had their facts correct, it would be UNAIDS. The document in question is dated July 2012, so it should be up to date.

As for China, didn't they relax their policy when they had the Olympics in 2008?

And about the people you know who had to have hiv tests in order to get work permits, do you know if that was a requirement of the company they wanted to work for, or if it was for a government work visa? Two different things.

I know that on the Isle of Man, people who have not been ordinary residents for five years have to obtain work permits, but their employer has to apply to the government on their behalf and they can conceivably require any sort of tests or hurdles they want to before they will make the application. I know of one company who insists prospective employees take and pass a physical (not sure if hiv tests are included) before they will bother applying for a work permit for you. Maybe this is what has gone on with the people you know.

I suppose if anyone wanted clarification, they could get in touch with Susan Timberlake. From the bottom of the document;

Thanks a lot Ann, this is really useful, I was surprised, but well, it seems really Iran don´t have restriction in regard to HIV for turism...

Hmm, perhaps Iran don't stipulate any restrictions on paper but I wonder how things pan out in practice in the event a tourist's homosexuality or positivity comes to light to the authorities. They have a zero tolerance towards homosexuals, let alone +ive people. I for one think it's more risky to travel there than to Dubai.

I genuinely hope I am wrong on this count.

That said, I know a poz guy who went there on a 3 week long trip post-HIV diagnosis (but before starting treatment). He was fine. He just never raised the topic and it never came up or flared into an issue for anyone.

Well in regard to many things Iran is a worst country in comparation with Dubai... But it is important to be as discret as possible in these countries, I´ve been several times in complicated countries and Middle East, people is very friendy when you have a neutral attitude and they can be safer than part of USA or Europe... Would be there in 2013 probably..

Well in regard to many things Iran is a worst country in comparation with Dubai... But it is important to be as discret as possible in these countries, I´ve been several times in complicated countries and Middle East, people is very friendy when you have a neutral attitude and they can be safer than part of USA or Europe... Would be there in 2013 probably..

After the whole Pussy Riot debacle, I'm thinking now that the worst place for any person is Russia. So if you say bad things about the president or the church you get 2 years of jail time??? If Hitler was alive he would be Putin's BFF, I'm afraid. I refuse to step foot in Russia, regardless of how beautiful the country may be.

I agree with Ann, We do not have the need to expose to an expulsion or something worst just for going to do some tourism to a country that does not accept our entrance.

In places such as Dubai, China, many African countries, Russia, maybe you can risk to enter as a tourist only if you are not yet on meds so you can pass as anyone undiagnosed.

But travelling with meds requires being aware of the problems you may find on the way. Storing meds in a common "hypertension" or "cholesterol" pill container is not a good idea. Customs authorities (as they do, for instance, in Australia) usually may call a doctor or a lab technician in order to take a sample of pills and test for the substances in it.

In my opinion, it is better to go with the original cans, and a medical dossier or recipe from your hospital or doctor.

I travel a lot due to my job, and, even travelling within my country, in Spain, once, during a domestic flight, at the boarding control in the airport, the police asked me what were those pills for. Of course I had no problem at all, just showed them the recipe from the hospital's pharmacy service and it was all OK. In 2011 had the same experience, at Lyon airport in France, coming back home to Madrid (also considered as a domestic-national flight).

They search for illegal drugs and similars, and there are "hot" flights, or hot periods or destinations along the year. Maybe if you carry the pills for just a couple of days, they won't even check, but if they detect you carry pills for half a month or a month, due to the quantity of meds, maybe then they could ask or check your luggage or documents.

So, the best is the original pill cans or blisters, a medical dossier or a pharmacy recipe or sheet, and telling the truth when asked. And avoid no poz-friendly countries.

I love sky scrapers and just read a lot about the Burj Khalifa. I found many pictures of different interiors, lobbies, the so called gardens, etc etc. There isn't anything distinctive about it, besides the 1 thing, being astoundingly tall. There is some decor that is trashy fun because its luxury arab style, and theres a lot more that is soulessly international with some luxury finishes that are basically ugly. I know of dozens and dozens of towers in New York and other American cities with more soul than this kind of new fangled tower like the Burj.

I never expected all the new development in Dubai would add up to anything beautiful. I always expected it would be flashy, trashy, and fun to consider how wasteful and silly the gigantic construction project is. Maybe some interesting things to think about if you are an engineer.

The only towers I was ever interested to see in the middle east were the Pyramids and the ancient tower cities of Yemen.

As to architecture: world famous architectural firms have built the sky line of Dubai. I know that major universities take their architecture students on study trips to the city. It seems novel things are going on.

But architecture not the reason why I wanted to go to Dubai, it was to see an old friend whom I can not visit in his country (which doesn't grant tourist visas). But upon much self questioning I've decided not to go and risk the hassle of being discovered with my pills. I am stressed enough with trying to get health insurance as an HIV + international student in Germany, but that's another post (in the insurance section).