I have always said I don't think I can work there. Recruiter contacted me with several job openings. I have a hard time saying no...

This gig doesn't seem all that exciting. I've got a final interview with another company early next week. A final phone interview with a company tomorrow... and a few other gigs in the works as well.

Just can't see myself working for Microsoft. It pays about $20k/yr over what my ideal budget (not dream budget) is. I guess if they make me an offer I can at least use it as leverage with other companies.

That's a tough one. There is a culture within the culture. I assume you won't be on/in the Mac side?

I have done a number of usability studies with engineers on the Mac side and I get knowing head nods when I express my frustration with the Windows side. I truly get the impression that when I do a mac usability study the engineers and contractors are genuinely interested in my input, criticisms and all. The Office 2008 PP template debacle is one of them.

The XP Alpha test showed me they didn't really care if anyone knew they were ripping off their competition. Been more than 5 years, so I can say that. :fawkdance:

Perhaps the positive side is it will be a good practice interview. Naturally if you are hired for the windblows side of their company I will be inclined to put you on ignore *(:>* Just joking
I wish you all the success you can make happen. I would politely counsel that if you can find
something that is part of your own wheelhouse of beliefs, standards and mojo you will be happier
for a longer period of time perhaps.
Rudie*(:>*

“Stay Hungry Stay Foolish"
Steve Jobs

"There are only two mantras yum and yuk mine is yum "
Bernard Mickey Wrangle<>Tom Robbins<> "Still Life With Woodpecker"

"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan

I wouldn't count them out prior to the interview. Going into it with some healthy skepticism is good, but rather than allow that to manifest as indifference (which will waste everyone's time) turn that into some thoughtful questions that address your concerns.

The people I know who work for MS all love working there. There are lots of in-house opportunities to move around and work with different divisions, and the company (despite what we tend to say here) is strong and treats their employees well.

I have a friend who worked for microsoft for about a year. The money was good and the company provided many perks. What he didn't like was the mandatory overtime and mandatory employee participation in after hours social events. He wanted to work 8-5 and that's just not how microsoft operates. At least not in the area that he worked. The after hours events tended to be quite nice, dinner on boat rides etc, but he just wasn't into hanging out with his coworkers after work.

Good luck whatever you choose. My advise: stability in an employer today is worth at least $10K in salary differences. If they are offering $20K over your normal expectation, the job is worth serious consideration.

Obviously what was said above about contractor vs employee is very important.

Quotelazydays
I have a friend who worked for microsoft for about a year. The money was good and the company provided many perks. What he didn't like was the mandatory overtime and mandatory employee participation in after hours social events. He wanted to work 8-5 and that's just not how microsoft operates. At least not in the area that he worked. The after hours events tended to be quite nice, dinner on boat rides etc, but he just wasn't into hanging out with his coworkers after work.

That would annoy the heck out of me. Working for a company shouldn't be like joining a cult.

>> Just out of curiosity, what is the gap between your dream budget and ideal budget? I guess you meant salary instead of budget, did you?

Don't have a "dream budget" We set the budget first, then the salary has to fit that. So the budget is our focus, that's why I said " ideal budget".

>>The people I know who work for MS all love working there.

Interesting because I can't think of anyone I know who's worked there for a while that likes it there. One person has been there for 22 years and finds his job now is mostly dealing with office politics instead of reality. Another gave up on MS's statements of trying to build more secure software after they never actually did that and continued to do stuff like prevent developers from logging security bugs - yeah, those numbers where they say they're getting better are largely because they're refusing to document as much as they used to. If you don't collect the data, then you can cite the reduction of it and claim "progress."

I don't find any differences between FTE and contractor as far as stability goes.

>>He wanted to work 8-5 and that's just not how microsoft operates.

Each manager can pick how they want their employees to work. Right now MS is actually trying to get people to work from home more, but some managers are resistant to that. And you can get hired on being allowed to work remotely, and if you get a new manager who doesn't want you to, you have no recourse.

Alas, the interview went okay. I tried to keep a positive attitude that even though I'm looking at six other job opps, it's possible none of them pan out and this might be my only option. Turns out I actually know someone who used to work in this group and she said it's a pretty good team. That said, I'm not thrilled about the work. ~25 minute commute by car... though that was better than the ~45 minute commute to Amazon by bus (parking there was around $20/day.) Those times are each way.

Quoteka jowct
Can you accomplish anything while driving those 25 minutes? At least on the bus, you can read, safely listen to music, etc.

I find listening to music safer in a car than on the bus.

But I can't really do much productive while riding the bus... especially while standing up. I did surf forums a bit when I rode the bus, but really there's nothing I can do on the bus that's very important. And based on the fact one day the bus driver started driving before everyone was off the bus and I dislocated my shoulder, a car is much safer. Plus bus drivers here have been killing people all too often.

The bus ride itself is only about 20 minutes, but it takes ~10 minutes to walk to the stop and then you have to wait for the bus to randomly show up because the schedule doesn't mean anything. Two busses can show up at the same time and even though they're 10 minutes apart, you can wait over 30 minutes for the next bus. Can't really read or do anything productive while walking and standing in the rain.