What would you like to see more on the rest of LIVING THINGS? Mike's emotional rapping (BURN IT DOWN) or Mike's tough-guy rapping (LIES GREED MISERY)?

I'd like to see more of his emotional rapping.

Rahat

05-25-2012, 12:47 AM

A little of both and a lot of what he did on the Until it Breaks verse

Erica

05-25-2012, 01:06 AM

Idk, I just like when he switches it up

shwcobb

05-25-2012, 07:27 AM

Idk, I just like when he switches it up
This.

Robert

05-25-2012, 10:51 AM

I want him to just do his thing.

jordanW241

05-25-2012, 11:09 AM

A little of both and a lot of what he did on the Until it Breaks verse

This. The Until it Breaks rap was awesome, I like pretty much anything he does though.

I remember when there was a frenzy about the whole Jamaican style of his vocal on Waiting for the End when it first came out :lol:

hawk

05-25-2012, 11:43 AM

I like a little both.

minuteforce

05-25-2012, 11:52 AM

I think I like Shinoda's rapping best when his lyrics and his delivery are angry and violent. :) So ... the second one

Arjun

05-25-2012, 12:01 PM

i like both but the anger element is what makes me like the second one a little more.

Flagrare

05-25-2012, 01:25 PM

I love Mike's Style Of Rapping. Just that.

Geki

05-25-2012, 03:45 PM

I like the more aggressive side of his rapping better.

Hrvman

05-25-2012, 05:00 PM

Mike is an awesome rapper, if you listen to Faint, Waiting for the end, Burn it down and LGD, you got 4 different styles of rapping, and that's awesome

Super Sonic

05-25-2012, 08:03 PM

I like the more aggressive side of his rapping better.

Yes. Agreed.

Blake

05-25-2012, 08:09 PM

i want a papercut style rap on this album. esides that as long as the raps are good, BID and LGM im good. From the live performance of the rap of UIB, that did not sound impressive but we will see

Xodus

05-26-2012, 01:26 AM

I'm not a huge fan of his verses in either BID or LGM, they're OK but not his best. The Until it Breaks rap sounds like it's gonna be great. I'm a believer that Mike's peak as a rapper was about 1999-2002. His verses on songs like Part of Me, High Voltage, In the End Demo and the Reanimation remix, It's Goin' Down, Forgotten and FRGT-10 were just brilliant.

CylockDNB

05-26-2012, 06:32 AM

I'm not a huge fan of his verses in either BID or LGM, they're OK but not his best. The Until it Breaks rap sounds like it's gonna be great. I'm a believer that Mike's peak as a rapper was about 1999-2002. His verses on songs like Part of Me, High Voltage, In the End Demo and the Reanimation remix, It's Goin' Down, Forgotten and FRGT-10 were just brilliant.

THIS x1,000,000. Honestly, I don't even know what he's on lately... Ever since ATS he's been trying to have this old skool / gangsta sound that really doesn't fit him... like on The Rising Tied. That never seemed good to me ... I can only think of about 10 or so songs he's been great on, and most of those are not on LP records.
Most of the time, he sounds average...

But he kicks ass with his genuine style on:
- High Voltage
- And One (ending)
- It's Goin' Down
- Frgt/10
- Bleed It Out
- Xero Stuff
- Several Demos
- I Have Not Begun
- Blackbirds

Everything else, and I mean EVERYTHING I didn't mention (Dedicated, Hands Held High, all of HT/Meteora) is just kinda meh... Mike is incredibly talented, but he fences himself in this LP world for most of the albums until MTM. Then, he continued being outside the box, but up until ATS and forward, he's acquired this weird, white-boy style reminiscent of Fort Minor that is just... idk, cringe worthy. "Try to catch up mothafuckuuuuuh" idk man... it's just bad.

On a separate note, some of his better FM verses are on the We Major mixtape (Dolla, Bloc Party, Spraypaint & Inkpens)

Again, my 2 cents. :P

Snail

05-26-2012, 09:43 PM

THIS x1,000,000. Honestly, I don't even know what he's on lately... Ever since ATS he's been trying to have this old skool / gangsta sound that really doesn't fit him... like on The Rising Tied. That never seemed good to me ... but up until ATS and forward, he's acquired this weird, white-boy style reminiscent of Fort Minor that is just... idk, cringe worthy. "Try to catch up mothafuckuuuuuh" idk man... it's just bad.

Again, my 2 cents. :P

Much agreed. I was disappointed with the whole 'rapper' persona he tried to exude since 2005/2006-ish. Before meeting Jay-Z and diving into the Fort Minor project with Styles of Beyond, his signature method of rapping was defined and felt genuine. When he hopped on board with Fort Minor it is evident that the approach he took was from a standpoint of 'trying to fit in' as opposed to 'this is my own thing'.

Just checkout the way he talks in the Fort Minor - Making Of video.

tdDlRLQeCAI

For a while, Mike Shinoda even transitioned into mimicking Jay-Z's style of delivery on stage; cringe-worthy, and irritating.

In review of his recent work and on-stage performances however, it sounds as though his delivery is slightly reverting back into his style of old, but not really quite there yet (positive this isn't his motive anyhow).

mastae

05-26-2012, 09:55 PM

High Voltage. Nuff said.

LPMeteorain

05-26-2012, 09:57 PM

I prefer the Burn it Down rap style to the Until it Breaks style. I like a change of pace, but I can't deny that's how I feel overall.

I wish I found this thread earlier. Dementia can attest to the fact I tried talking about this in another thread and was saying much of the same that you guys are about the rap going "too gangsta" and whatnot, and I was just called a racist lol and generally told I wasn't making sense and crap like that...

Glad you guys get it. Until it Breaks is a little too hip hop, a little too Fort Minor.

TheZlajaZlo

05-26-2012, 10:55 PM

Papercut
It's Going Down
High Voltage
And One

^...when you hear these songs, you go: "how the hell did he came up with this?"
Lately his rhymes are very simple with AABB rhyming structures

Spitz

05-26-2012, 11:18 PM

I prefer the Burn it Down rap style to the Until it Breaks style. I like a change of pace, but I can't deny that's how I feel overall.

I wish I found this thread earlier. Dementia can attest to the fact I tried talking about this in another thread and was saying much of the same that you guys are about the rap going "too gangsta" and whatnot, and I was just called a racist lol and generally told I wasn't making sense and crap like that...

Glad you guys get it. Until it Breaks is a little too hip hop, a little too Fort Minor.

In the other thread, you were complaining that he sounded too "African-American". No wonder you were being called a racist. If you knew a single thing about hip-hop, you wouldn't be saying that an ABAB, monosyllabic rhyme scheme is better than what we've heard so far from "Until it Breaks", which has a fairly complex structure and makes use of allusions. What you're basically saying is that you don't want a rapper to sound like he listens to the genre of music he's most inspired by. You want Mike to go back to how he was on Meteora where he sounded bored half the time and hardly put any effort into making his lyrics memorable or fun? Like a complete amateur?

Alexrednex

05-27-2012, 11:07 AM

BID sounds alittle too much like somthing any other rapper could have done, the performence on LGM is a little better, because u get to hear more emotions in it, but the lyrics are also alittle simple(not bad)
The rap on Until it breaks is fucking sick through!

Robert

05-27-2012, 12:54 PM

Off topic, how do you pronounce "The Rising Tied"? Like "tide" or "teed"?

minuteforce

05-27-2012, 01:07 PM

Off topic, how do you pronounce "The Rising Tied"? Like "tide" or "teed"?
The first one.

Super Sonic

05-27-2012, 01:34 PM

The first one.

Lol, yeah.

Robert

05-27-2012, 01:43 PM

The first one.

Thanks :lol:

GrahamJones

05-27-2012, 06:08 PM

In the other thread, you were complaining that he sounded too "African-American". No wonder you were being called a racist. If you knew a single thing about hip-hop, you wouldn't be saying that an ABAB, monosyllabic rhyme scheme is better than what we've heard so far from "Until it Breaks", which has a fairly complex structure and makes use of allusions. What you're basically saying is that you don't want a rapper to sound like he listens to the genre of music he's most inspired by. You want Mike to go back to how he was on Meteora where he sounded bored half the time and hardly put any effort into making his lyrics memorable or fun? Like a complete amateur?

Such a good post. Mike sounded so horrible on Meteora. His voice on that album was just....

Generally, I like most of Mike's stuff, but I don't so much like it when he uses words like "I'mma". The songs I don't like his rapping in is BID, Blackbirds, Wretches and Kings. Many will probably feel like linching me for saying that, but I really don't feel them.

Forgotten and earlier stuff are his best.

minuteforce

05-29-2012, 06:42 AM

Such a good post. Mike sounded so horrible on Meteora. His voice on that album was just....
Yeah, a lot of that was due to a myriad of vocal effects being liberally applied, something you'll also hear all over the songs on "Hybrid Theory". ;)

mmm I love his sweet side in the rep, but I also love her rep scavolato and a little pissed but I like when you fancy yourself as the gangster's true until it breaks may sound racist but it is beautiful

Mike's rap was at its peak around the Hybrid theory days. man, the lyrics of high voltage...

aKaRiot

05-31-2012, 11:38 PM

As happy as I am with ANY track Mike is rapping over (M2M made me realize how "for granted" I took him rapping >_> ) he used to be alot better IMO. ATS had him going HAM on some tracks, but Pre-Hybrid, HT, and Reanimation was the Shinoda that killed tracks.

Blackbirds was awesome too. Burn It Down was solid though because it reminded me of HT rapping in a crawling kinda way.

Jack_Farrell

05-31-2012, 11:47 PM

Generally, I like most of Mike's stuff, but I don't so much like it when he uses words like "I'mma". The songs I don't like his rapping in is BID, Blackbirds, Wretches and Kings. Many will probably feel like linching me for saying that, but I really don't feel them.

Forgotten and earlier stuff are his best.

Funny because Forgotten and Blackbirds actually share similar themes and style.

Hybrid

06-01-2012, 01:04 PM

Funny because Forgotten and Blackbirds actually share similar themes and style.

How so?

TVTV

06-02-2012, 05:40 PM

His lyrics and delivery were more battle-rap before the band was called Linkin Park. I think Mike wanted to change his style as the band were trying to find their identity when writing Hybrid Theory and Meteora. The band and their producer(s) back then probably thought Mike's more aggressive and battle-rap lyrics were too awkward or intrusive to the music.

Mike seems to be more comfortable being himself with his delivery now. I think it more honestly reflects his love for hip hop and his influences growing up.

CylockDNB

06-02-2012, 06:34 PM

It's simple. Compare these two sets of lyrics:

Example 1a:
You told me yes and held me high, and I believed when you told that lie.
I played soldier, you played king, and struck me down when I kissed that ring.
You lost that right to hold that crown, I build you up but you let me down.
So when you fall, I'll take my turn, and fan the flames as your blazes burn.

Example 1b:
Imma be that nail in your coffin, saying that I softened, I was ducking down to reload.
So you can save your petty explanations, I don't have the patience. Before you even say it I know.
You let your pride and your ego talk slick to me, no. That is not the way I get down. And look at how you lose your composure.
Now let me show you exactly how the breaking point sounds.

What is it you want me to tell you? I'm not the failure.
I would rather live and let be.
But, you came up with the right kind of threat to push me to let you.
Know/No you can't intimidate me. You disrespect me so clearly,
now you better hear me. That is not the way it goes down.
You did it to yourself and it's over, now let me show you
exactly how the breaking point sounds.

Pretty okay lyrics, but try these ones:

Example 2a:
It's goin' down.
The rhythm projects 'round the next sound.
Reflects the complex hybrid dialect now.
Detects the mesh of many elements compressed down.
The melting pot of a super-futuresque style.
The combination of vocal caress
with lungs the gasp for breath
from emotional stress
with special effects.
And a distorted collage
carefully lodged between beats of a rhythmic barrage.

It's goin' down.
The logical progression on the timeline.
The separation narrowed down to a fine line.
To blur the edges so they blend together properly.
Take you on an audible odyssey now.

It's goin' down. Once again it is
composed sentences
all together venomous.
The four elements of natural force
projected daily through the sound of the source.
Everybody on board as we blend
the sword with the pen.
The mightiest of weapons
swinging right from the chin.
To elevate mental states
Long gone with the wind.
To defend men from shoddy imitation pretends.
It's goin' down.
Style assimilation, readily.
Tracking through the weaponry
of a pure pedigree.
Cleverly, seeing through whatever is ahead of me.
Whatever the weather be.
We invent the steadily.
It's going down sub-terrestrial high.
I rhyme regiment that's calling the shots.
Execution of collaborative plots
ready to bring the separation of style to a stop.
It's goin' down.

Example 2b:
I've been digging in the crates ever since I was living in space.
Before the rap race. Before monkeys had human traits.
I mastered numerology and big bang theology.
Performed lobotomies with telekinetic psychology.
Invented the mic so I could start blessing it.
Chincheckin kids that make my point like an impressionist.
Many men have tried to shake us,
but I twist mic cords to double helixes and show them what I'm made of.
I buckle knees like leg braces.
Cast the spell of instrumentalness and all you MCs who hate us.
So you can try on, leave you without a shoulder to cry on.
From now to infinity let icons be bygones.
I fire bomb, ghostly notes haunt this.
I've tried threats but moved on to a promise.
I stomp shit with or without an accomplice
and run the gauntlet with whoever that wants this.

I put a kink in the backbones of clones with microphones.
Never satisfy my rhyme jones.
Spraying bright day over what you might say.
My blood type's type Krylon,
Technicolor, Type A.
On highways, ride with road rage. Cage of wind and
cages of tin that bounce all around.
Surround sound. Devouring the scene.
Subliminal gangrene paintings
overall the same things. Sing songs karaoke copy bullshit.
Break bones verbally with sticks and stone tactics.
Fourth dimension, combat convention.
Write rhymes at ease while the tracks stand at attention.
Meant to put you away with the pencil
pistol, official, 16 line the rhyme missile.
While you risk it all, I pick out all your flaws.
Spitting, blah blah blah blah
You can say you saw.

Obviously, the latter two are much more creative and substantial, at least in my personal opinion. Of course, you might be misled to believe that those lyrics are better because they contain bigger words and such, but I just think they represent a more genuine and original sound that Mike showcased for some time, that I really haven't heard much these days. It may or may not fit in so much with Linkin Park, but I for one kind of feel Fort Minor should've accentuated this style more. Thoughts?

Flagrare

06-02-2012, 06:47 PM

Waiting for Minus.

Roughneck

06-03-2012, 06:51 PM

Mike used to be way more lyrical on his early work, now he's all weak sawse and relying on his cadence.

Nick Hart

06-04-2012, 01:03 AM

Some of my favorite raps of his are Lying From You, Part Of Me, Faint, When They Come For Me, Wretches And Kings, Slip Out The Back, and Believe me. I hope I dont hear anymore of that "Imma be dat n-n-n-n-nail in you coffin"

Qwerty19

06-04-2012, 01:39 AM

Obviously, the latter two are much more creative and substantial, at least in my personal opinion. Of course, you might be misled to believe that those lyrics are better because they contain bigger words and such, but I just think they represent a more genuine and original sound that Mike showcased for some time, that I really haven't heard much these days. It may or may not fit in so much with Linkin Park, but I for one kind of feel Fort Minor should've accentuated this style more. Thoughts?
I agree with this. High Voltage is one of my favorite Mike's rap ever, if not my favorite. It's going down is pretty awesome too.

I like LGM rap, but it obviously belongs to an other category. More of a "come at me, bro" rap, less of a complex and original rap. I prefer the second.

Geki

06-04-2012, 03:51 AM

I agree with this. High Voltage is one of my favorite Mike's rap ever, if not my favorite. It's going down is pretty awesome too.

I like LGM rap, but it obviously belongs to an other category. More of a "come at me, bro" rap, less of a complex and original rap. I prefer the second.

I agree. High Voltage is probably Mike's best rap.. I love all his stuff from the 1997-2002 era. He had a really unique flow and it was incredible. Now, his raps don't have that genuine and unique feel to me... He just sounds like every other rap/hip-hop artist now. It's not bad stuff, but I definitely prefer his old music. His rap in And One was amazing, too..

Blake

06-04-2012, 04:25 AM

Edit: I actually like LGM rap, just not as much as some others, and I want to erase my comments on it as it's not bad and its actually something kinda new for him so it is a bit unique. But BID, is not original or unique at all, and it is weak compared to many of his early rappers when he was different, unique, and creating raps that I wouldn't hear anywhere else

Rocky

06-04-2012, 07:12 AM

I have been rapping for half of my life. I've performed for sold-out crowds, been promoted by KROQ's sister station in SF, and started taking music seriously because I was inspired by Mike Shinoda.

With that said, he's pretty mediocre. Even when I sucked at rapping, I knew that he was mediocre. I really do like "It's Going Down" because he's describing the song while he's rapping it in a dope ass way....besides that, it's his uniqueness sets him apart. He raps like he came out 20 years ago, but doesn't rap about the same stuff and has a different vocabulary. Sometimes he spits some shit in a way that gets you to picture something in your head, or maybe he just flows in a way that makes you pay attention to the words that he rhymes...besides that, only big LP fans give a fat fuck about his rapping skills...

He is/was never that great, but has a handful of dope shit

minuteforce

06-04-2012, 08:02 AM

I hope I dont hear anymore of that "Imma be dat n-n-n-n-nail in you coffin"
I happen to think those verses - and that lyric in particular - clearly evoke the verses and the delivery Shinoda employs on "A Thousand Suns". :*

Xodus

06-06-2012, 03:37 PM

It's simple. Compare these two sets of lyrics:

Example 1a:
You told me yes and held me high, and I believed when you told that lie.
I played soldier, you played king, and struck me down when I kissed that ring.
You lost that right to hold that crown, I build you up but you let me down.
So when you fall, I'll take my turn, and fan the flames as your blazes burn.

Example 1b:
Imma be that nail in your coffin, saying that I softened, I was ducking down to reload.
So you can save your petty explanations, I don't have the patience. Before you even say it I know.
You let your pride and your ego talk slick to me, no. That is not the way I get down. And look at how you lose your composure.
Now let me show you exactly how the breaking point sounds.

What is it you want me to tell you? I'm not the failure.
I would rather live and let be.
But, you came up with the right kind of threat to push me to let you.
Know/No you can't intimidate me. You disrespect me so clearly,
now you better hear me. That is not the way it goes down.
You did it to yourself and it's over, now let me show you
exactly how the breaking point sounds.

Pretty okay lyrics, but try these ones:

Example 2a:
It's goin' down.
The rhythm projects 'round the next sound.
Reflects the complex hybrid dialect now.
Detects the mesh of many elements compressed down.
The melting pot of a super-futuresque style.
The combination of vocal caress
with lungs the gasp for breath
from emotional stress
with special effects.
And a distorted collage
carefully lodged between beats of a rhythmic barrage.

It's goin' down.
The logical progression on the timeline.
The separation narrowed down to a fine line.
To blur the edges so they blend together properly.
Take you on an audible odyssey now.

It's goin' down. Once again it is
composed sentences
all together venomous.
The four elements of natural force
projected daily through the sound of the source.
Everybody on board as we blend
the sword with the pen.
The mightiest of weapons
swinging right from the chin.
To elevate mental states
Long gone with the wind.
To defend men from shoddy imitation pretends.
It's goin' down.
Style assimilation, readily.
Tracking through the weaponry
of a pure pedigree.
Cleverly, seeing through whatever is ahead of me.
Whatever the weather be.
We invent the steadily.
It's going down sub-terrestrial high.
I rhyme regiment that's calling the shots.
Execution of collaborative plots
ready to bring the separation of style to a stop.
It's goin' down.

Example 2b:
I've been digging in the crates ever since I was living in space.
Before the rap race. Before monkeys had human traits.
I mastered numerology and big bang theology.
Performed lobotomies with telekinetic psychology.
Invented the mic so I could start blessing it.
Chincheckin kids that make my point like an impressionist.
Many men have tried to shake us,
but I twist mic cords to double helixes and show them what I'm made of.
I buckle knees like leg braces.
Cast the spell of instrumentalness and all you MCs who hate us.
So you can try on, leave you without a shoulder to cry on.
From now to infinity let icons be bygones.
I fire bomb, ghostly notes haunt this.
I've tried threats but moved on to a promise.
I stomp shit with or without an accomplice
and run the gauntlet with whoever that wants this.

I put a kink in the backbones of clones with microphones.
Never satisfy my rhyme jones.
Spraying bright day over what you might say.
My blood type's type Krylon,
Technicolor, Type A.
On highways, ride with road rage. Cage of wind and
cages of tin that bounce all around.
Surround sound. Devouring the scene.
Subliminal gangrene paintings
overall the same things. Sing songs karaoke copy bullshit.
Break bones verbally with sticks and stone tactics.
Fourth dimension, combat convention.
Write rhymes at ease while the tracks stand at attention.
Meant to put you away with the pencil
pistol, official, 16 line the rhyme missile.
While you risk it all, I pick out all your flaws.
Spitting, blah blah blah blah
You can say you saw.

Obviously, the latter two are much more creative and substantial, at least in my personal opinion. Of course, you might be misled to believe that those lyrics are better because they contain bigger words and such, but I just think they represent a more genuine and original sound that Mike showcased for some time, that I really haven't heard much these days. It may or may not fit in so much with Linkin Park, but I for one kind of feel Fort Minor should've accentuated this style more. Thoughts?

Agree with everything you wrote. Back in the pre-Meteora days I thought Mike was an underrated rapper. He had clever rhyme schemes and used imagery. I expected more of that on the Fort Minor album and we have not even come close to that on the recent albums. It seems like in the HTEP-Reanimation days he may have been very influenced by underground guys like Black Thought, Chali-2na, Pharoah Monch. I liked the rapping on ATS but it seems he was going for an old school, 90's, west coast type of flow on WTCFM and WK. On BID and LGM it seems to me he was simply going for the overly vague almost bland lyricism of Meteora.

Jack_Farrell

06-06-2012, 04:15 PM

How so?

Like a well full of poison, a rotten core
The blood goes thin, the fever stings
And I shake from the hell that the habits bring
Let the sick ones down, the bells will ring
Put pennies on the eyes, let the dead men sing

Pollution manifested in perpetual sound
The wheels go round and the sunset creeps behind
Street lamps, chain-link and concrete
A little piece of paper with a picture drawn floats
On down the street till the wind is gone
The memory now is like the picture was then
When the paper’s crumpled up it can’t be perfect again

Plus his delivery is the closest he's got to the HT/Meteora style since 2003.

minuteforce

06-06-2012, 04:25 PM

I don't see any common themes or style ;* unless you mean how the same kind of rhyme scheme is utilised in both songs, but, then, that's a characteristic many Linkin Park songs share

Jack_Farrell

06-06-2012, 04:34 PM

I don't see any common themes or style ;* unless you mean how the same kind of rhyme scheme is utilised in both songs, but, then, that's a characteristic many Linkin Park songs share

I mean, the theme of the core, the darkness, the unknown. And style is like, comparing BID's delivery with Papercut. You can see the similarities I pointed out.

Hybrid

06-06-2012, 05:56 PM

I mean, the theme of the core, the darkness, the unknown. And style is like, comparing BID's delivery with Papercut. You can see the similarities I pointed out.

I am pretty sure there is an underlying paradigm in just about all of Linkin Park's songs.

theycallmepraya

06-06-2012, 06:08 PM

I like it when he does that introverted spaz out kinda rapping. Dedicated, In The End (Demo), Carousel, Qwerty. In all these tracks he just goes in with this perfect blend of angst and swagger. I think that's the ideal version of mike. His stuff on ATS wasn't bad at all. I didn't mind him branching out in thoes aspects. But I feel like in Burn it Down and LGM he's more or less just doing this basic rhyme schemes to make things fit, idk maybe the other band mates are fuckin with his lyrics too much. Lyrically they are kinda cool but with rapping you've gotta really go in. He's just kinda rapping slow and trying to sound big and boastful which ends up fuckin the flow.

Jack_Farrell

06-06-2012, 09:32 PM

I like it when he does that introverted spaz out kinda rapping. Dedicated, In The End (Demo), Carousel, Qwerty. In all these tracks he just goes in with this perfect blend of angst and swagger. I think that's the ideal version of mike. His stuff on ATS wasn't bad at all. I didn't mind him branching out in thoes aspects. But I feel like in Burn it Down and LGM he's more or less just doing this basic rhyme schemes to make things fit, idk maybe the other band mates are fuckin with his lyrics too much. Lyrically they are kinda cool but with rapping you've gotta really go in. He's just kinda rapping slow and trying to sound big and boastful which ends up fuckin the flow.

Yeah this whole "gangsta rap I shoot bitches yall" doesn't fucking work with him, he does it in LGM, he'll do it in Until It Breaks.
His lyrical stomping was way better, this is just diss shit everyone's done already.

RichiRich

06-06-2012, 11:53 PM

It's simple. Compare these two sets of lyrics:

Example 1a:
You told me yes and held me high, and I believed when you told that lie.
I played soldier, you played king, and struck me down when I kissed that ring.
You lost that right to hold that crown, I build you up but you let me down.
So when you fall, I'll take my turn, and fan the flames as your blazes burn.

Example 1b:
Imma be that nail in your coffin, saying that I softened, I was ducking down to reload.
So you can save your petty explanations, I don't have the patience. Before you even say it I know.
You let your pride and your ego talk slick to me, no. That is not the way I get down. And look at how you lose your composure.
Now let me show you exactly how the breaking point sounds.

What is it you want me to tell you? I'm not the failure.
I would rather live and let be.
But, you came up with the right kind of threat to push me to let you.
Know/No you can't intimidate me. You disrespect me so clearly,
now you better hear me. That is not the way it goes down.
You did it to yourself and it's over, now let me show you
exactly how the breaking point sounds.

Pretty okay lyrics, but try these ones:

Example 2a:
It's goin' down.
The rhythm projects 'round the next sound.
Reflects the complex hybrid dialect now.
Detects the mesh of many elements compressed down.
The melting pot of a super-futuresque style.
The combination of vocal caress
with lungs the gasp for breath
from emotional stress
with special effects.
And a distorted collage
carefully lodged between beats of a rhythmic barrage.

It's goin' down.
The logical progression on the timeline.
The separation narrowed down to a fine line.
To blur the edges so they blend together properly.
Take you on an audible odyssey now.

It's goin' down. Once again it is
composed sentences
all together venomous.
The four elements of natural force
projected daily through the sound of the source.
Everybody on board as we blend
the sword with the pen.
The mightiest of weapons
swinging right from the chin.
To elevate mental states
Long gone with the wind.
To defend men from shoddy imitation pretends.
It's goin' down.
Style assimilation, readily.
Tracking through the weaponry
of a pure pedigree.
Cleverly, seeing through whatever is ahead of me.
Whatever the weather be.
We invent the steadily.
It's going down sub-terrestrial high.
I rhyme regiment that's calling the shots.
Execution of collaborative plots
ready to bring the separation of style to a stop.
It's goin' down.

Example 2b:
I've been digging in the crates ever since I was living in space.
Before the rap race. Before monkeys had human traits.
I mastered numerology and big bang theology.
Performed lobotomies with telekinetic psychology.
Invented the mic so I could start blessing it.
Chincheckin kids that make my point like an impressionist.
Many men have tried to shake us,
but I twist mic cords to double helixes and show them what I'm made of.
I buckle knees like leg braces.
Cast the spell of instrumentalness and all you MCs who hate us.
So you can try on, leave you without a shoulder to cry on.
From now to infinity let icons be bygones.
I fire bomb, ghostly notes haunt this.
I've tried threats but moved on to a promise.
I stomp shit with or without an accomplice
and run the gauntlet with whoever that wants this.

I put a kink in the backbones of clones with microphones.
Never satisfy my rhyme jones.
Spraying bright day over what you might say.
My blood type's type Krylon,
Technicolor, Type A.
On highways, ride with road rage. Cage of wind and
cages of tin that bounce all around.
Surround sound. Devouring the scene.
Subliminal gangrene paintings
overall the same things. Sing songs karaoke copy bullshit.
Break bones verbally with sticks and stone tactics.
Fourth dimension, combat convention.
Write rhymes at ease while the tracks stand at attention.
Meant to put you away with the pencil
pistol, official, 16 line the rhyme missile.
While you risk it all, I pick out all your flaws.
Spitting, blah blah blah blah
You can say you saw.

Obviously, the latter two are much more creative and substantial, at least in my personal opinion. Of course, you might be misled to believe that those lyrics are better because they contain bigger words and such, but I just think they represent a more genuine and original sound that Mike showcased for some time, that I really haven't heard much these days. It may or may not fit in so much with Linkin Park, but I for one kind of feel Fort Minor should've accentuated this style more. Thoughts?

THIS! YES, THANK YOU.

That is one of the reasons the older style was better. I dont see how people dont see the difference... Meteora and HT had much better lyrics and delivery, Mike was the shit.
Ive been studying his stlye for years, I grew up with it and I know it back to front. Look, proof :P

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iI4SdaY1mG4&feature=plcp

His new stuff is just such a degradation from how he was before Linkin Park became famous and during the first two albums.
I covered Burn It Down anyway because I kinda liked the song. But things like "When They Come for Me" are so horrible it just makes me wish he'd stop with trying to be gangster or whatever it is... It isn't working with him.

Spitz

06-07-2012, 12:22 AM

Looking everywhere only to find
That it's not the way I had imagined it all in my mind
What do I have but negativity
'Cause I can't justify the way everyone is looking at me

I remember what they taught to me
Remember condescending talk of who I ought to be
Remember listening to all of that and this again
So I pretended up a person who was fitting in

There are just too many times that people have tried to look inside of me
Wondering what I think of you and I protect you out of courtesy
Too many times that I've held on when I needed to push away
Afraid to say what was on my mind, afraid to say what I need to say

So I let go, watching you
Turn your back like you always do
Face away and pretend that I'm not
But I'll be here because you're all that I got

Nothing ever stops all these thoughts and the pain attached to them
Sometimes I wonder why this is happening
It's like nothing I could do would distract me when
I think of how I shot myself in the back again

Trying not to break but I'm so tired of this deceit
Every time I try to make myself get back up on my feet
All I ever think about is this, all the tiring and time between
And how trying to put my trust in you, just takes so much out of me

But in the meantime there are those
Who want to talk this and that so I suppose
That it gets to a point feelings got to get hurt
And get dirty with the people spreading the dirt

I suspect that people who think these lyrics are in any passable don't actually listen to hip-hop.

Xodus

06-07-2012, 07:10 PM

I suspect that people who think these lyrics are in any passable don't actually listen to hip-hop.

Yup. They're basic to an elementary level in terms of rhyme scheme, metaphor and wordplay. The latter two are totally non-existent. It's not like Mike isn't capable of more but I think he or the band feels its best when he keeps it simple or something to fit into the whole. I don't agree with this. Some of my favorite songs are demos like In The End where his lyrics are pretty darn good.

Geki

06-08-2012, 04:45 AM

A lot of you guys are forgetting his raps in Hands Held High (very emotional and strong IMO), Slip Out The Back (not ''gangsta'' and it's FM), 100 Degrees, We Made It verse (about LP coming up), and especially his raps in Fuse, those are fucking crazy, from the Xero tape.

Flagrare

06-08-2012, 05:11 AM

THIS! YES, THANK YOU.

That is one of the reasons the older style was better. I dont see how people dont see the difference... Meteora and HT had much better lyrics and delivery, Mike was the shit.
Ive been studying his stlye for years, I grew up with it and I know it back to front. Look, proof :P

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iI4SdaY1mG4&feature=plcp

His new stuff is just such a degradation from how he was before Linkin Park became famous and during the first two albums.
I covered Burn It Down anyway because I kinda liked the song. But things like "When They Come for Me" are so horrible it just makes me wish he'd stop with trying to be gangster or whatever it is... It isn't working with him.

Haha, You're Rich from the YouTube Channel? I really liked your Lockjaw cover! I met your channel for about two years ago. :awesome:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUqGM6SoxAs&feature=plcp
Do not get me wrong, but you're better rapper than singer. Your rapping style is amazing! :D

Ben

06-08-2012, 05:22 AM

^ Lol he's good, but I've followed Alex for years now. Razor Red Noise is an amazing project. That guy is so talented.

Qwerty19

06-08-2012, 05:43 AM

...besides that, only big LP fans give a fat fuck about his rapping skills...
Sorry but I cringed at that. Pesonnaly, I don't like Mike's rap because I'm an LP fan. It's the opposite.

Initially, I becomed an LP fan partially because I thought "This guy rap is great.". I knew other MC's before that, but I didn't like their music.

Rocky

06-08-2012, 06:38 AM

Sorry but I cringed at that. Pesonnaly, I don't like Mike's rap because I'm an LP fan. It's the opposite.

Initially, I becomed an LP fan partially because I thought "This guy rap is great.". I knew other MC's before that, but I didn't like their music. You didn't understand what I meant.
I said that the only people who care about Mike are fans of LP. That doesn't mean that you if you like LP, you like Mike's raps. That means that if you really think Mike is dope, you must be a fan of LP.

minuteforce

06-08-2012, 07:22 AM

^ I understood that the first time around and I definitely agree. :)

As I may or may not have said before, I love the rapping Shinoda's done on "Midnight" and "A Thousand Suns" and personally greatly prefer it to what he was doing on "Meteora" at the very least. Hell, "When They Come For Me" is my favourite Linkin Park song, ;P pending the new album

MicCarrera

06-08-2012, 01:18 PM

^ I understood that the first time around and I definitely agree. :)

As I may or may not have said before, I love the rapping Shinoda's done on "Midnight" and "A Thousand Suns" and personally greatly prefer it to what he was doing on "Meteora" at the very least. Hell, "When They Come For Me" is my favourite Linkin Park song, ;P pending the new album

Yea WTCFM is pretty dope, in my opinion his best rap, but I think until it breaks could be better

Hybrid

06-08-2012, 01:20 PM

I suspect that people who think these lyrics are in any passable don't actually listen to hip-hop.

I think Mike does a brilliant thing where he writes lyrics that coincide with what's relevent to the song. He doesn't go and try this obscene idea of "I gotta do this to prove I'm the best rapper alive" shit. Linkin Park AS A WHOLE are a BAND, yes, a BAND, that make masterpieces out of simplicity. They don't claim to have the best of any one thing in particular, but the outcome of what they do is something that ends up being spectacular. Mike does a great job at what he does and to tie the music all together the way he does seemlessly is his forte.

As far as all of you lyrical rap hipsters, you're not amusing.

Spitz

06-08-2012, 01:25 PM

I could start quoting Chester's lyrics to if you want to say they're trying to find brilliance in simplicity.

Hybrid

06-08-2012, 01:42 PM

I could start quoting Chester's lyrics to if you want to say they're trying to find brilliance in simplicity.

Funny story, there is no "Mike's Lyrics/Chester's Lyrics." They both write parts for each other and have a say in what each other does. Who's to say that whatever you write wasn't thought up by Mike, transversely, what if the lyrics that you said weren't hip hop were written by Chester, or influenced by one or another?

Spitz

06-08-2012, 01:54 PM

You know damn well I meant what Chester sang. The idea that Mike should simplify his lyricism for the benefit of the song is a bullshit idea. If Chester just whispered all of his lines on a record, you wouldn't like it would you? If there was no belting, screaming or crooning, it'd make for a boring-ass album, wouldn't it? So why are you trying to defend Meteora? Virtuosity is not a curse. It's not about being the best in the biz, it's simply about having talent. And if you only heard that album, you wouldn't find any. Damn near every song on there has the same awkward and disaffected delivery and every line is interchangeable twaddle about vague problems teenagers can identify with.

Hybrid

06-08-2012, 02:21 PM

You know damn well I meant what Chester sang. The idea that Mike should simplify his lyricism for the benefit of the song is a bullshit idea. If Chester just whispered all of his lines on a record, you wouldn't like it would you? If there was no belting, screaming or crooning, it'd make for a boring-ass album, wouldn't it? So why are you trying to defend Meteora? Virtuosity is not a curse. It's not about being the best in the biz, it's simply about having talent. And if you only heard that album, you wouldn't find any. Damn near every song on there has the same awkward and disaffected delivery and every line is interchangeable twaddle about vague problems teenagers can identify with.

So here is the deal. The idea of Chester whispering for an entire album is both laughable and absurd. That is something the band would never do. I know you were speaking hypothetically, but, that is something the band won't do simply because it wouldn't sound good. The band makes music that sounds good together. Now onto Meteora. I like Meteora. It's been stated many times on the record that I like EVERYTHING the band has ever done. To sit there and say that there wasn't any talent found on Meteora was probably the most assenine thing I've read all day. Congrats on that medal. Also, that whole bit you had on the content of lyrics was a funny response coming from a teenager. Thus I digress...

Spitz

06-08-2012, 02:23 PM

So you're going to disregard what I have to say because I'm two weeks shy of twenty? Okay, that's your prerogative. On an unrelated note, don't mind if I don't take your word on anything rapping-related because as far as rapping goes, there is no discernible talent to be found on Meteora. In case you haven't noticed, I'm on a Linkin Park forum. It would stand to reason that I care about the band a lot. Mike's one of my favorite artists and the reason I started rapping myself. That doesn't mean I have to worship everything he does.

"A teenager pointing out something resonates with teenagers. What a loser." Jesus Christ, if you're gonna try an ad hominem, at least use one that makes sense. I could make fun of your arrogance and your tenuous grasp of the English language, but I won't because I'm a nice guy.

Hybrid

06-08-2012, 03:47 PM

So you're going to disregard what I have to say because I'm two weeks shy of twenty? Okay, that's your prerogative. On an unrelated note, don't mind if I don't take your word on anything rapping-related because as far as rapping goes, there is no discernible talent to be found on Meteora. In case you haven't noticed, I'm on a Linkin Park forum. It would stand to reason that I care about the band a lot. Mike's one of my favorite artists and the reason I started rapping myself. That doesn't mean I have to worship everything he does.

"A teenager pointing out something resonates with teenagers. What a loser." Jesus Christ, if you're gonna try an ad hominem, at least use one that makes sense. I could make fun of your arrogance and your tenuous grasp of the English language, but I won't because I'm a nice guy.

Alright, you must have missed my "teenager" point. You said, "Damn near every song on there has the same awkward and disaffected delivery and every line is interchangeable twaddle about vague problems teenagers can identify with." That to me was funny concidering you are, in fact, still a teenager. I didn't discredit your entire post because of it.

To sit there and dismiss my word on anything rapping related is unfair concidering you never said that you were only talking about talent only relating to the rapping on Meteora. You said "So why are you trying to defend Meteora? Virtuosity is not a curse. It's not about being the best in the biz, it's simply about having talent. And if you only heard that album, you wouldn't find any." That, to me, says that you were saying there was no talent anywhere on the album. Even though I still like Mike's rapping on the record, you cannot deny that there is talent and creativitiy on the album. I'm not just talking about Mike's rapping, I'm talking everything. That's where I was coming from with my Meteora defense.

To talk about being on the Linkin Park forum, I get that you care about the band. I just see way too many people coming on and talking shit. Before you fly over the handlebars again, I'm not talking about you. I guess we all show our support for the band in different ways. I'm not negative towards the band nor do I think my musical talent and taste is above them. I merely trust them to continue making music that I enjoy.

I think it is safe to say that my "arrogance" of the English language was really ignorance to what you were trying to say. You were right, your point was unclear to me. Much like mine was to you.

minuteforce

06-08-2012, 04:09 PM

Yea WTCFM is pretty dope, in my opinion his best rap, but I think until it breaks could be better

Ever since Shinoda did his thing with the Fort Minor project, he's improved greatly in his role as a rapper in a band of six people. I expect he'll only continue to improve from hereon in and I fully expect the rhymes on this new album to top everything he's written/performed to date. :) Shinoda no longer waters down his lyrics to conform to a certain sound or appeal to some lowest common denominator; he just puts his best foot forward and, along with the others in the band, makes a bunch of disparate sounds and styles fit together.

Part of the result, also, is that the hip-hop aspect of Linkin Park's music has become considerably more pronounced, one of several things that show how diverse and unpredictable Linkin Park can be stylistically and how there's so much more to them than what their first couple of albums might have you believe.

MicCarrera

06-08-2012, 04:42 PM

Ever since Shinoda did his thing with the Fort Minor project, he's improved greatly in his role as a rapper in a band of six people. I expect he'll only continue to improve from hereon in and I fully expect the rhymes on this new album to top everything he's written/performed to date. :) Shinoda no longer waters down his lyrics to conform to a certain sound or appeal to some lowest common denominator; he just puts his best foot forward and, along with the others in the band, makes a bunch of disparate sounds and styles fit together.

Part of the result, also, is that the hip-hop aspect of Linkin Park's music has become considerably more pronounced, one of several things that show how diverse and unpredictable Linkin Park can be stylistically and how there's so much more to them than what their first couple of albums might have you believe.

For sure, that's why I think LT has the potential to be their best album. Hopefully Mike's raps in this album are more like that. Also another reason why his rap might have evolved is learning from Jay-Z while making his FM record.

minuteforce

06-09-2012, 10:24 AM

For sure, that's why I think LT has the potential to be their best album. Hopefully Mike's raps in this album are more like that. Also another reason why his rap might have evolved is learning from Jay-Z while making his FM record.
There's a definite Jay-Z influence in his rapping which is now most evident in the way he carries himself while performing "When They Come For Me" live. ;P

Nish

06-10-2012, 11:41 AM

I've been reading through all the comments and by the time I got to the bottom, I forgot what the original topic was or what I was going to write haha

Regarding Mike's rapping though: what made me like it originally was a combination of his voice, accent and emphasis. He doesn't overstate things but he's still got a confident air about him. Anyway, from what I've heard of Until It Breaks, I love the clever nature of the lyrics and his in-your-face style. Looking forward to it :)