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My reply to a person considering intermarriage.

As you know, I regard you highly and always consider your opinions very seriously. I am engaging in this exchange of letters not to badger you, but to help sharpen both your and my perception of this very vital issue.

I know you love Paul very dearly. And everything I have heard about him indicates that he is a wonderful person. I truly believe you when you write that you must marry him because you love him, because he's your "soul mate" and because he fulfills you. The fact that he happens to be a non-Jew is terribly disappointing. That notwithstanding, I am prepared to acknowledge that you and Paul can probably live together and be deliriously happy in marriage, despite your different faiths.

I think you might be surprised by my last sentence. Allow me to explain. The truth of the matter is that most Jews today are very much like the average American non-Jew. That is because, while we might not realize it, 99 44/100 percent of our daily stimuli are non-Jewish. The average Jew in America knows who the mother of Jesus was, but has no clue as to who was the mother of Moses. (No it wasn't Miriam [his sister]; it was Yocheved.) The average Jewish child in America can sing the words to Deck the Halls with Boughs of Holly, but doesn't have an idea of what Maoz Tzur (The Chanukah hymn) is. In effect, the differences between Jew and gentile have really diminished to the point of them being inconsequential.

That is why I believe that for many Jews today there is really no truly compelling reason why both Jews and non-Jews shouldn't seek out the most socially acceptable soul mate for themselves, irrespective of faith. Furthermore, I don't believe that the slightly higher rate of divorces that intermarried couples experience makes a big difference; after all, 3 out of 5 marriages in America end in divorce anyway.

The melting pot that our grandparents prayed for in America has turned into a meltdown for Jewish life.

Neither do I feel that because six million Jews died in the Holocaust you or anyone else has an obligation to marry Jewish in order to perpetuate the Jewish people. If one is positively moved to perpetuate the Jewish people in light of the Holocaust, fine. Otherwise, it's important for every person to do what's best for oneself.

Yes, it's true that the melting pot that our grandparents prayed for in America has turned into a meltdown for Jewish life. But, those are cosmic issues of Jewish continuity and Jewish survival, and it's unreasonable for anyone to expect that those issues play a decisive role in our choice of individual mates. We have to live our lives as best we can, and let the cosmic powers work out the cosmic issues.

However, I do believe that there is one compelling reason why a Jew might choose not to intermarry. You see, throughout human history, the Jewish people have been at the forefront of working toward what we Jews call Tikkun Olam (perfection of the world). Our Torah introduced revolutionary ideas into the world, and we, the Jewish people, are "chosen" to be a "light unto the nations" to bring these ideas into the broad marketplace of human civilization.

It is our Torah that first introduced the revolutionary concepts of "Love thy neighbor as thyself," care for the orphan, the widow, the infirm, the stranger. Our Torah mentions "love of the stranger" 36 times, more than any other mitzvah mentioned in the Torah!

It was our Torah that introduced to the world the concept of not causing undue pain to animals, and yes even the concept of conservation. It's our Torah that says that a person must "work" the land and "guard" the land, that the land must lay fallow one year in seven to regenerate itself. It's our Torah that says that even in times of war, one may not cut down a fruit-bearing tree, even when Jewish soldiers' lives are at stake, or divert the waterworks of the city under siege.

It's our Torah that says that even in times of battle, soldiers must get rid of their bodily wastes properly. In effect, we were the first members of the Sierra club; we were the first movers and shakers to save the whales and preserve the Darter Snail.

It is this beautiful and revolutionary tradition which we have successfully transmitted to the nations of the world, through modeling and osmosis. In fact, it was our Torah that proclaimed for the first time "Thou shalt not murder." And although Hammurabi recorded the exact same words 300 years earlier in his Canaanite code, its meaning for the ancient Canaanites was entirely different. According to Hammurabi's code, if I killed my neighbor's son, my neighbor could come and kill my son. If I raped my neighbor's daughter, my neighbor could rape my daughter, or take my daughter as a concubine. If I killed my neighbor's slave, I could give my neighbor 15 camels and we=d be even. For Hammurabi, human life was simply chattel, property. Therefore, if I caused someone to suffer a loss of property, then I had to restore it, or suffer a similar loss.

Three hundred years later the Torah said "Thou shalt not murder" -- the words were exactly the same, but the intention was light years apart. Our Torah posits that every person is responsible for his/her own actions, for his/her own crime. The Torah insists that one can not punish the innocent son of a murderer for a crime that his father committed.

We can look upon Jewish history proudly as one unending series of ethical and moral triumphs and accomplishments.

In fact, our Torah enlightened the world with the idea of the concept of the sanctity of human life -- that when you take a human life, you have committed a crime against what the ancients called "God," what philosophers today have renamed "society." That's why murder indictments today are usually in the form of the "State of California vs John Doe," because the whole world has adopted our view of what "Thou shall not murder" means, and subscribes to the Jewish idea of the sanctity of human life.

I could go on and on and cite hundreds, perhaps thousands, of revolutionary ideas that Jewish tradition introduced into this world, that Western society has adopted. The Jewish people have worked assiduously for the perfection of the world, and while the world is not yet perfect, we can look upon Jewish history proudly as one unending series of ethical and moral triumphs and accomplishments.

And perhaps even more remarkably, the Jews did not enlighten the world by forcing their beliefs on others through crusades and holy wars. Jews did not say "Kiss the Jewish star or else we'll chop off your head!" We did it by modeling. And, while we still have a way to go, we can be extremely proud of what we've accomplished.

Yes, Jennifer you can live happily ever after with Paul. But if you choose to marry him, you will no longer be part of that incredible legacy which has worked toward spiritually purifying and enlightening the world. You might say "big deal," that is your choice. I and my fellow Jews feel that it is a big deal. In fact it's the most important thing that we can do with our lives – "to enlighten the world under the rule of the Almighty."

We know that even when Jews marry Jews, it is very difficult to live the kind of committed life which will bring honor to the Jewish people and to God. There are plenty of in-married Jews who have no idea of what our Divine mission is. They might remain Jews, but their impact will be negligible. It is very likely that only a small number of Jews who devote their lives to preserving and transmitting this Divine message are going to continue to make a difference in this world. Unfortunately, for those who are not married to Jews, the chances of promoting those ideas and ideals, no matter how noble their intentions, are virtually nil.

The choice is to be a part of an unbroken legacy to keep the chain of this Divine mission alive.

And so in the final analysis, you need to realize that the choice you are making is not only a decision to live your life with a particular man, who happens not to be Jewish. The choice you are making now is the choice of being part of a legacy, an unbroken legacy, of 150 generations of Jews who preceded you, who fought with their values, ideals and in many instances, their lives, to keep the chain of this Divine mission alive. It is this determination that has allowed us the privilege of seeing an enlightened environment that has adopted so many of those traditions and incorporated them in to their own value system.

I want you to know that I will always love you. But if you choose to marry Paul and he does not convert, you will have effectively cut yourself off from 3,300 years of the most glorious and enlightened tradition, a tradition which is single-mindedly dedicated to the sacred mission of teaching the world the idea of the sanctity of human life and "perfecting the world under the rule of the Almighty."

All I can ask now is that you consider my words and make an intelligent decision.

Visitor Comments: 53

(25)
Robert,
June 11, 2011 5:55 PM

What a roll model

Unfortunatley I am not Jewish.I am Christian ,however I study Jewish tradition and follow ,,Where possible ,,Jewish teaching on daily life .This letter is a wonderfull description the rules for life as handed to us by God ..If only the world would see the value in this way of life ...Thank you ,,So well written ...

(24)
Anonymous,
June 10, 2011 5:14 PM

Every Jew has a tremendous amount of spiritual potential, however, it is nearly impossible for one to even begin to comprehend the enormity of this potential without having had some exposure to Torah Judaism and taking at least a first few steps realizing one’s own potential. I was very fortunate to have been in touch with a wonderful community at the time I was dating a non-Jew. Had somebody just “told” me that I would missing out, I would not have believed them. It wasn’t until I saw Torah Judaism in action, experienced Shabbos, and learned with people in the community that I began to get a tiny glimpse of my potential living a committed Jewish life. I am very happy that I married Jewish. However, I understand how someone without exposure to Torah Judaism could easily marry a non-Jew and have a seemingly satisfying relationship for many years without ever knowing what he or she is missing.

(23)
Andy,
June 10, 2011 5:39 AM

Is intermarriage a communal loss or a personal loss

Without a viable Torah community living and teaching God's laws the societal advances Rabbi Buchwald rightfully attributes to the Jews can easily be reversed .It has happened often in history . It seems to me that the pattern was established even before the giving of Torah at Mt Sinai. In the commentaries on the bible in Genesis we learn Abraham and Sarah spent much of their lives teaching monotheism to the pagan world, but only one family of 70 souls went down to Egypt. The rest of the world they influenced seemingly reverted back to paganism. If Jews today were to cease to exist as a Torah based community it seems to me likely that the same thing would happen. Many isms already have appeared that have threatened mankind's advance from might equals right, to a society dedicated to the principles that all men are created equal in God's image . That answers why the world needs Jews but does not answer why all Jews need only marry Jews. Maybe the author or someone can elaborate on
The Jewish idea of kiddushim/holiness in marriage. As I understand it that is only possible in a marriage between a Jewish man and Jewish woman.

(22)
Izzie,
June 9, 2011 6:57 PM

It can work if...

I am a Jewish woman, raised in an Orthodox home. I married my non-Jewish husband 27 years ago. He has never converted.
Before we married, we came to the agreement that we would have a Jewish home and raise our children with ONLY Judaism. It was important to me that I not only maintained my very strong Jewish identity and practices, but that I pass that on to my children as well. My husband was willing to not only accept that, but work hard with me to make it a reality.
Of course, this didn't fly so well with my husband's family, but we stood firm, together, against their criticism and overt attempts to introduce Christianity (and non-kosher food!) to our children. We simply wouldn't allow it. My family, over time, realized that my husband was unwavering in his support of our having a Jewish home and family, and accepted him graciously.
While marriage has not always been easy (and the hard parts have had nothing to do with being intermarried), it has always been worth the commitments we made to each other. I firmly believe it's ALL about having deep respect for one another, for what we have built together and constant open and honest communication.
We have raised our five amazing children to be caring, responsible adults, all Torah observant Jews. We could not be more proud of them. And yes, we are still crazy about each other, too.

(21)
Anonymous,
June 9, 2011 1:48 PM

Jews treatment of other Jews - No Third Temple

I live in Brooklyn, New York. I am a Jew. I am as observant a Jew as those who attend the Orthodox Synagogue Across the street from me.
My issue is the behaviour of my neighbors, and this is not limited to me. I have heard stories from others. The wives and mothers won't talk to people other that those who are dressed like them. They hurry their children away so as not to have them contaminate them with people not from their particular sect.
In one situation, this has gone to the point were they have written on the walls of their apartment house that others (Jews) are not welcome. This is based upon attire.
I am currently reading Ezekiel, and I have no worries about the coming of the Third Temple, just based upon our treatment of each other

(20)
Bobby5000,
June 8, 2011 11:30 AM

Consider how not having a Jewish life will impact you and your children

I think the author misses the mark, by emphasizing one's allegiance to the Jewish community. Instead the critical question is how will this affect the person's himself and future children.
Some suggest the new family can be both Jewish and Christian believing in Moses and the Torah, but also recognizing Jesus and his miracles. But that is Christianity! As a Jew one cannot accept both. You cannot say the Shma- "Here O' Israel the Lord our G-d the Lord is One," and then I believe in Jesus, the father, the son, and the Holy Spirit.
The ramifications of the marriage must be discussed. What happens when Christmas arrives, will there be a tree in the family room, singing carols. Will the child be baptizied. A candid discussion of religion with its ramifications should be discussed, and many Jews will find they will be missing an important component of their lives. It can be largely solved by conversion which provides a new Jewish home.
Whatever is decided, one getting married should make these decisions for him or herself, but do look at the complete picture of what is coming.

philip a. greenhill,
June 10, 2011 12:28 PM

intermarriage and children

While I think that the article is excellent and presents a very good argument for marrying fellows Jews, I think that you have highlighted the most practical difficultly with intermarriage: the effect it will have on the children. It will be very confusing to the children if they are exposed to both religions. If the children are raised exclusively Jewish then the couple is disappointing the Chrisitian spouse's family. I would highly recommend reading the book by Doron Kornbluth-"Why Marry Jewish" It presents very practical arguments in an uninsulting way. It is also useful for Jewish parents to give them arguments to use when discussing this issue with their children

(19)
Anonymous,
June 7, 2011 4:13 PM

Right Idea Wrong Reason

I don't think people should intermarry; I think it's a betrayal of the Jewish People and represents a fundamental misunderstanding of what it means to be truly Jewish. That being said, being a part of the "first Sierra club" has got to be one of the worst reasons possible to marry Jewish.

(18)
Rachel,
June 7, 2011 2:57 PM

But her children will be Jews no matter what

As an Orthodox woman myself, I must confess I still don't understand why Judaism cannot square intermarriage and Jewish life, especially when the mother is Jewish. If Jennifer marries Paul and he is willing to let her continue whatever level of observance she has committed to, if her children will be educated as Jews, yet he does not wish to convert --why can't Judaism accept that? I wonder sometimes if we are driving away more Jews than we are drawing in with our absolute disapproval of intermarriage. Obviously, a person committed to Orthodox life will not intermarry. But for the majority of American Jews who see this as prejudice against non-Jews, why can't we find a way to incorporate them and their families into the community without insisting on conversion (particularly where it's the male spouse who is the non-Jew)? I'm sure this is going to provoke outrage, but I'd really like some reasoned answers. And let's not forget that in addition to Rachel & Leah, there are Jews descended from Yakov's concubines, that Ruth's conversion came AFTER her first marriage to Naomi's son ended; and that anti-Semites generally hate anyone of Jewish ancestry, regardless of religious observance.

(17)
Ann Brady,
June 6, 2011 4:32 PM

To all the Jennifers and Pauls out there

Jennifer, if Paul does not know G-d, he does not know you. If he truly loves you, he will want to know you fully by knowing and loving G-d. He will do as Ruth did and proclaim HaShem his G-d too, and convert. Otherwise, as sweet as things seem now, yours will prove to be a marriage of strangers and your children will wander aimlessly upon the Earth, not knowing who they are.

Anonymous,
June 6, 2011 6:59 PM

oh, for the love of g-d...

whatever you do, jennifer, don't listen to nonsense like that spewed by ann brady above...if it is right for you both, you will find a way to make it work meaningfully for you. those who would urge you to "hold out" for a jewish man are the same people who will dismiss and reject you years from now if you are unable to find a jewish man to marry and find yourself single and childless. do what's right for both of you -- whatever you decide that is...

mike,
June 8, 2011 8:30 PM

A successful intermarriage

I'm Jewish and my wife is Catholic - we have been married for more than an decade and have never had an argument or fight over a religious matter. She loves coming to services with me, and I regularly attend Mass with her - we both look at it as a cultural experience that helps us better understand each other - not a wedge that divides us. If the two of you are in love and truly respect each other and each others faith, there is no reason you can not have a successful marriage and a home full of faith. And your connection do the history of Judaism doesn't simply disappear with intermarriage - you will forever be a Jew and can pass that heritage on to your children.

Abram,
June 8, 2011 11:00 PM

absolute nonsense

your ideas are NOT in tune with the true nature of our People...your ideas are liberal, Western, romanticism..."Do what's right for both you". it's insane to me, how you supposedly read this whole article and completely missed EVERY SINGLE POINT THE AUTHOR WAS TRYING TO MAKE!

Ann Brady,
June 14, 2011 2:10 AM

Abram I agree

The point being: what does G-d say through the Torah? The amazing thing about following G-d's Word is that it feels wonderful - and way better than doing your own thing or what-feels-good-as-long-as-it-(supposedly) hurts-nobody.

(16)
dodi miller,
June 6, 2011 6:45 AM

These marrigaes last.,the couples work harder to keep them.,

I know many mixed marriages of 60 years or more ,and Jew to Jew who break with before the seven year itch..
The former work on a problem,they avoid the "Oh what did they expect?" Some convert others don't..The Jews by choice practice Judaism, more than diligently than those by birth.

(15)
Shorty,
June 6, 2011 1:56 AM

sigh

I married someone who isn't Jewish. Why? because i love the guy and really no one told me why i shouldn't.
That being said, I have decided to increase my observance. With my husband's support and participation. This article chooses to WRITE OFF those of us who did intermarry which i think is very closed minded of anyone. 50% of intermarried couples (yes research was done) actually raise their kids to be Jewish. So to write off this generation of perhaps misguided Jews is to write off their children who may be interested in living a Jewish life.
Perhaps it is Torah law not to intermarry, but the fact is, it happens and to simply say "well you can't lead a Jewish life" is pardon my french, balony.
Fortunately, i am surrounded by beautifully observant "frum" Jews who include my husband and me and who haven't written us off.

sonia,
June 6, 2011 12:07 PM

my story, too

I was looking for a jewish husband when an extraordinary set of coincidences joined me to a non-jew with whom we've been a happily married couple for many yesrs, through which I became more observant.

Dvirah,
June 6, 2011 4:59 PM

No Write Off

Please read the article again more closely and you will see that Mr. Buchwald is not "writing off" intermarried Jews. He just points out the probability of Jewish impact accruing from such a marriage. It is not zero but it is low.

(14)
stanley felsen,
June 5, 2011 6:00 PM

Concise

My perpective exactly as I've "been there, done that"

(13)
Allan,
June 5, 2011 4:39 PM

Looking at both sides

This article expresses how I feel. A close relative is going through the exact same situation and although I have great love for this person, my heart is troubled. Do I understand that they both are in love and want to live a committed live? Yes? Do I also understand that they have also chosen to get married secularly? Yes. So why am I so disturbed about a situation I cannot
control? For the exact same reasons expressed in the article. We Jews are such a minority in the world. We fight every day for existence on the world stage. Can one not be discouraged by the 50% intermarriage rate? HaShem indeed, has his plan and like it or not, it is what it is. And if it is written that Jews will voluntarily give up their heritage then so be it, perhaps it is besheret.
Even so, it hurts my heart and I am saddened.

Regina,
June 6, 2011 1:07 PM

I share your pain

Someone very close to me has just gotten involved with a non-Jewish woman. Despite efforts to find a Jewish spouse, this woman just came into his life and now I fear what you describe. We are especially disturbed when SOMEONE WE LOVE is making this wrong decision and we don't know how to save them. That's how I fell, anyway. Are you praying for this person?

(12)
Suzanne,
June 5, 2011 4:30 PM

Been there, done that

This article touched on some very interesting points. I am a convert to Judiasm (modern orthadox) and raised a generation of day school educated children who, although still not fully established, seem to be on the right path as far as marrying other Jews. I hope so, anyway. Time will tell. My husband and I have given everything we have, financially, educationally as well as striving to become as observant of the mitzvot as possible. An observation I have made though is, many young Jewish singles are not looking seriously enough for a good Jewish partner at a young enough age. I met my husband when still in high school! Please, young Jewish singles, your best chance of meeting a good Jewish spouse is very young - when you are in high school or college. Naturally, you should get married when you are mature enough for the responsibility but you should have an argreement with each other at a young age. I know that "having a commitment" sounds corny, something like "going steady" (like your grandparents) but take these people seriously as potential spouses as never again will you be so surrounded with as many eligible quality Jewish people. As far as potential converts go, it is extremely rigorous, you have to be willing to change just about everything about yourself and live in a real counterculture. The cost of Jewish education, a necessity, is extremely high, a real sacrafice. Aliya is the best option, if they would get their act together and accept all orthadox conversions.

(11)
unlisted,
June 5, 2011 4:23 PM

Can't guilt-trip someone into marrying Jewish, nor should you!

You cannot guilt-trip someone into marrying Jewish, whether it's the Holocaust or an "unending legacy," nor should you, or should they. That's nonsense! As long as non-Torah Jews (most American Jews) are taught that the Torah was written by humans and not given at Mt. Sinai and is not the Word of G-d for Jews for all time, they won't get it. And if non-Torah Jews were also not taught the SPECIALNESS of the Jewish neshama, which requires fusion with another Jewish neshama, then marrying Jewish also has no meaning. And if non-Torah Jews don't live a Torah lifestyle with Torah goals, marrying Jewish has no meaning. If you are taught (and role-modeled) living a True Jewish lifestyle as G-d has told Jews to do, then it's a no-brainer that you will automatically desire a (halachically) Jewish spouse, in order to live the way that G-d has ordained Jews to do and, therefore, doing otherwise won't even occur to you!

Anonymous,
June 6, 2011 2:49 AM

shame on you

oh, get off your high horse!! what arrogance you display with your moronic pseudo-distinction between "Torah" and "non-Torah" Jews...what a ridiculous crock!! If this is what you've learned and believe is menschlikh and appropriate behavior toward your fellow Jews -- much less anyone else, then shame on you! a little more actual practice of rachmanas and chesed would be a good thing for you to learn...reading your post just makes my skin crawl and if you think this attitude and behavior bodes well for our Jewish peoples' future, perhaps you should think again and reconsider your own behavior. take a good look in the mirror and work on fixing yourself before you judge everyone else...what appalling ignorance you've displayed here.

(10)
Working-class Canadian,
June 5, 2011 4:15 PM

Sorry, but no marriage is much worse than intermarriage!

I come from the lower-working-class level of a (generally prosperous) Jewish-Canadian community. Quite frankly, those of us in the economically disadvantaged group were treated like DIRT (to use the realatively polite expression) by the more affluent Jews. I did marry a Jewish girl (also poor) & we raised 3 kids, whom we educated in Jewish day schools. In these schools, our kids were frequently ridiculed, insulted & ostracized by their more prosperous classmates. (And never did any of their teachers intervene to stop this). It is quite understandable, therefore, that at some point we had to take each of our children out & transfer them to public schools. Ultimately each of our kids--surprise, surprise!!--intermarried. In each case they have great (Christian) spouses--kind, pleasant, supportive, & very respecting to my my wife & me. Our grandchildren, albeit wonderful, are not technically Jewish. So, OK, we don't have the much-vaunted "Jewish continuity." But at least we have continuity! Would this have occurred if we had allowed our kids to stay in the abusive Jewish environment & end up bitter, disillusioned with life, & probably unmarried & childless as a result? I'd be interested to read some other readers' comments on this.

Andy,
June 6, 2011 12:44 AM

Seems that you're hurting and that the Jewsih community failed you.

I'm reminded of the old pimpin bebop ditty "romance without finance just don't make sense."
I would agree that the child from a family of modest means who lacks above average learning ability is often fighting an uphill battle in much of the Orthodox community. It's sad and scary as I'm guessing the community will likely be judged accordingly. Even when remaining in the fold I'd think it's an issue for many to stay positive about the privilege of being Jewish and mentally healthy. I'd say a good option for other folks who find themselves in a similar situation with young children or even earlier may be to make aliyah to Israel. There I believe many Orthodox Jews live at all socioeconomic levels and Jewish education is affordable. In the non Orthodox Jewish communities it's worse as those families without financial resources assimilate at astronomical rates, but unlike you they often have too little Jewish education or consciousness to understand much less have regrets over what they are leaving. In my experience Chabad often tries to reach those families.On a positive note I've seen grandchildren from similar circumstances to yours rejoin the Jewish people thru conversion. If that does not happen being a righteous Gentile is a good thing for one not born Jewish. I believe our sages teach that the righteous of all nations have a share in the world to come. Maybe your job is to present Judaism positively and not to allow your painful experiences to poison the views of your children and grandchildren. I'm sure that will require a serious effort from both you and your children and I wish you blessings for success if you choose that task.I think it's taught that if you have terrible experiences with a Rabbi or leadership of the Jewish community don't take it out on God. A challenge for sure.I admire you for reading Aish and seemingly remaining a part of the Jewsih community that has not been there for you.

(9)
Raquel de Almeida,
June 5, 2011 4:11 PM

choices

I had a choice - either to marry a secular Israeli who wouldn't tolerate judaism and its beauty or an agnostic Englishman whom because of his very nature and his country's long history of tolerance and celebration of other people's culture looked upon my judaism with both curiosity and respect.
Our children are Jewish and their identity is very strong. My darling husband insisted I taught at our local Hebrew Sunday School because of the values he saw ouyr children receive at home. We celebrate shabbat and he calls himself "the shabbas goy". I have asked him NOT to convert. He is happy to be Jew-ish and when I look back, my life with the secular Israeli would have been worse than with a goy.
There you have it - choices.

Orah,
June 9, 2011 5:14 AM

Hi Raquel,
England expelled its entire Jewish community TWICE throughout its history. So much for tolerance.

(8)
Mary Nygaard,
June 5, 2011 3:29 PM

A Wonderful Explanation

What a wonderful, concise definition of what it really means to be "the chosen people". The Jewish people do, indeed, have a Divine mandate and what an honor that is. !

(7)
Jewgirl,
June 5, 2011 2:38 PM

Something must rumble in Jennifer’s soul!

or there would not be a discussion. The issue is not Jennifer and Paul but the children they might have. Jennifer is Jewish so will be her kids, now she needs to consider how she wants to bring them up. If the children are being brought up Jewish not a problem but if they grow up in both faiths the children will have a problem. When the children are brought up in Paul’s faith you have lost a future generation of Jews. When you young everything looks rosy but when you come down from the pink clouds reality sets in. The older you get your roots become very important and when you give up a portion of it, it could create a problem in their marriage later on. I think Jennifer should talk with Paul how they want to bring up the children and what they consider is important for them. May HaShem guide Jennifer to make the right decision.

(6)
Anonymous,
June 5, 2011 2:26 PM

Focus on the converts!

I intermarried 26 years ago and have raised 3 Jewish children. My husband converted to Judaism. They are still treated like second class citizens despite the fact that they have more knowledge and are more devout than most American Jews. Face the fact that Jews are racists, clannish and rude. Focus on reforming Judaism from the inside out rather than from the outside in.

Anonymous,
June 5, 2011 2:41 PM

bizarre

are YOU "racist, clannish and rude"???? since you choose to generalize about all jews in this way, you must also include yourself, yes?? i'm sorry for your experience, but perhaps you need to find yourself a better community...i have many friends who are jews by choice and in my community, there is no way of knowing this unless they choose to provide the information themselves...a jew is a jew -- whether born as such or through the process of conversion. teach your husband and your children to feel this way and live this way and you all may be much happier. you cannot change the behavior of a few ignorant people. you can, however, control your own behavior and your reactions to them...

eema3,
June 5, 2011 4:35 PM

agree

My experience in the conservative, reformed and orthodox community is that converts to the Jewish faith are welcomed with open arms. I am sorry for your experience but I do not think it is at all the norm.

Anonymous,
June 5, 2011 6:40 PM

Mzvictores@gmail.com

You have obviouslt not intermarried. Your suggestion to keep it a secret that one's spouse is a convert reflects the accuracy of my assessment. By the way, when my daughter married young man from a Jewish family of "born Jews," she was and still is treated like a second class citizen or worse. How would you feel about your child marrying a child of a convert? If you truly want to increase the number of devout Jews focus on the converts. They crave acceptance and inclusion.

Anonymous,
June 6, 2011 6:53 PM

hmmm

not sure who you (mzvictores@gmail) are referring to...i was not in any way stating that jews by choice should "keep it a secret". what i said was that this decision is completely up to them and, in a properly halachic community, should be of ABSOLUTELY NO CONSEQUENCE. i could care less if someone is born jewish or a jew by choice. a jew is a jew. i've never felt the need to ask anyone how they came upon their judaism. i know plenty of born jews who barely identify as jews and plenty of jews by choice that are completely committed to their judaism and their jewish community. just yesterday i found out -- quite by accident -- that 2 jews i've known for a pretty long time as committed practicing menchlikh jews are jews by choice. it changes nothing and i don't understand why it would anything for anyone else.

Sarah,
June 7, 2011 9:40 AM

For me it makes a difference

Even though I understand your point, I would like to add that for me (I'm Jewish) it does make a difference whether a person is a Jew by birth, or whether he converted. The former didn't have any choice, and his Jewishness was offered to him in a silver platter (his mother was Jewish). The latter, on the other hand, had to work hard to become a Jew. And therefore he is entitled to our admiration and respect. By way of an example, who do you think merits more praise and respect - a person who was born with the attribute of patience, or one who works unendessly to subjugate his propensity to anger?

(5)
ruth housman,
June 5, 2011 2:17 PM

Divine Missions and what is to be, divined

We all learn and in learning, we make choices, and in making choices there are always two sides to an issue, and perhaps, more, because life is a multi-faceted diamond. I think the angst is what we are supposed to experience in the making of choices in which there are ethical considerations for those parties concerned.
There are arguments to be made for containing Jewish identity as in marrying within the "tribe" and sometimes these arguments about a Divine Covenant, and how WE as children of that Covenant are here to fulfill this sound rather arrogant. I think if WE were to read what is written here, and not be Jewish humility would not be part of the equation in what is written and I would be terribly affronted.
I think no matter what is Divinely decreed, there is a greater part to this story, and that is, the need to think about the "other" since in this there is this implicit "other", meaning those who are not Jews, but I can also say, the world embraces many religions and the underlying spirituality beneath this has to be the same, since we all do draw from the same well. That very same spring.
Be careful. This world was created in diversity, and we are not, absolutely not, the only people who do tikkun. There are endless acts of mercy, compassion, and love, around the world, among those who are not Jewish.

Anonymous,
June 5, 2011 2:42 PM

beautifully put

thank you

Jewgirl,
June 5, 2011 4:13 PM

ruth-Divine Mission

I agree HaShem has compassion for all His creation, and everybody needs to complete his/her tikun. But keep in mind he gave the Torah to us the Jewish people He is the one who brought us out from Egypt. It is us who are commanded to uphold His Holy Torah; if we would cease to exist (Has Ve Shalom) creation would stop to exist, then what? Being a Jew is not an easy task and I would not recommend it to anybody to convert unless he wants to do it from his soul to become a part of the Jewish nation by upholding the laws of our Holy Torah and not for somebody because he/she want to get married that is not a right convert. It has nothing to do with arrogance to want to have a Jew marry a Jew. Do to assimilation in the US we have lost more Jews then in the Shoa, if this is not very alarming what is? I am a convert for over thirty years and my people were butchered in the Shoa the same way as the Jew’s, I converted not because of my husband but because my soul was yearning for it, my husband was only a catalyst for me as I was for him. A true convert is already a convert in his mother’s womb and welcomed among the Jewish nation. The greatest joy that I receive is seeing my grandchildren in the Beit Knesset on Shabbat, able to say the Shma, reciting Ve A Hafta without looking in the prayer book asking the four questions on Passover etc. This is the reward that you see on earth by preserving the Jewish heritage. If this is not a divine mission what is?

Liz,
June 5, 2011 5:45 PM

Tikkun

Thank you. We cannot make Tikkun Olam if we choose to stay away and untouched by the rest of Olam itself, which includes US ALL.

Ann Brady,
June 6, 2011 4:57 PM

G-d's loving Torah chooses for us what is best

Which religions say "Yes!' to the Torah and rejoice over G-d and the day He placed the Torah into our world? Will all these "underlying" spritual beliefs stand that test? What all humans do share is the instinct for G-d, which He put in us when He made each of us, much as a homing pigeon's brain is wired to home. A parallel might be drawn between fulfilling the instinct for G-d with the instinct to eat food. We can choose to eat junk food - or we can go for the most nourishing, the very best. That is G-d's Law.

(4)
WisdomCalls,
June 5, 2011 1:50 PM

Modern day marriages within different faiths and different races.

Great write up!!
Marriage between not only Jew & Non-Jew, 2 different faiths, but also between two races, most often DOES NOT work. And even if couples do not divorce, there is a lot of unhappiness and sadness and much more.
Marriage is like a language that 2 people MUST understand clearly (the likeness of mind) that is: - "It is understood a lot better when it is spoken in the same lingo" - otherwise it's gonna be like the old phrase : - "When trouble comes to the door love flies out of the window"
Marriage is a life-time commitment, to be more polite - definitely not a change of clothes.

deb,
June 5, 2011 2:13 PM

baloney

not true...i pity you your delusions....have you read ruth? are you aware that she is the matriarch of king david as well as the future mashiach? why do you think this book was canonized into our tanach? perhaps you would be unable to make such an arrangement work for yourself; that says nothing about others ability to lead a meaningfully fulfilling jewish life under the same circumstances.

A.E.,
June 5, 2011 4:46 PM

Yes, but Ruth was Jewish; she converted.

(3)
Anonymous,
June 5, 2011 1:15 PM

DIDN'T WORK

I wrote a similar letter to a relative who was on the verge of intermarriage. It's a nice try but doesn't work. He is intermarried, and also no longer speaking to me.

(2)
Anonymous,
June 5, 2011 12:52 PM

think again...

in an effort to avoid intermarrying, i did not marry out of my faith -- "faithful" that i would meet a jewish man to marry. i am now well into my middle age, single and childless -- no longer able to have children -- and feel rejected on a daily basis by the jewish community among whom i have little jewish value at this point -- no children to teach, no life events to plan and celebrate...so my dreams of a rich jewish family life are unfulfilled and the judaism that is so much a part of my soul is in a constant struggle to remain relevant. if i had it to do over again, i would have married a man -- jewish or not -- who loved and respected me as i am and we would have had children and managed to find a way to make certain that their judaism was as much a part of them as it is of me...if you think i am an aberration, think again. jennifer: marry a good man who loves and respects you and whom you love and respect. if that is true, the rest will follow. don't spend your life searching and hoping for someone who may not ever appear. don't spend your life alone. i guarantee you that if you do, the same people urging you to hold out for a jewish man will not be there supporting you if you don't.

Anonymous,
June 5, 2011 2:45 PM

Sadly,I do agree with your comments,as I am in the same position.As a child from a holocaust family, I have sought a Jewish man, only to find myself single and past child bearing years. I believe the people stating this,would not want to watch their OWN child be alone and single into middle age and beyond.It is easy to talk while your child is young.Think before you write such articlesIi have done exactly as this article states and sit alone, childless and middle aged.

deb,
June 5, 2011 4:22 PM

thank you

thanks so much for your comments. it means a lot to me and i think it's really important for people like us to stop being invisible jews...i'm always amazed at how many of our haftarah and torah portions deal with the pain of women without children while our culture continues to turn a blind eye...anyway, thank you so much for speaking out

Shana,
June 6, 2011 2:13 AM

second thank you

Ditto to Deb's thank you comment above. As I grow older and have remained unmarried in lieu of marrying a non-Jew, I realize how little a place the Jewish community seems to hold for me without having children to teach and milestones to celebrate. While I might have been blissfully happy having married a non-Jew, I instead am single and constantly feel pushed away from the community which I have always been apart.

Anonymous,
June 6, 2011 6:46 PM

so true

thanks for your comments shana...i continually look forward to the day when the jewish community recognizes the wealth of ruach and experience and dedication among the single and childless members of our community. i think the only way it will happen is if we make it so by not being content to be pushed into the background.

Giuseppe,
June 5, 2011 2:58 PM

You are so right.

Your story is exactly what happened to me. Now, years later, about 40% of her Orthodox friends are divorced and about 55% of my Christian friends are divorced, and there are two people walking alone.
The pressure to hold out came from both sides. Suddenly these Christians were telling me how sad it would be if I converted even knowing that Jesus and Mary were Jews.
Now I study the Hebrew scriptures more than ever.

Replier,
June 7, 2011 6:05 PM

Right u r, & same thing happens to guys.

Everyone knows a few "alteh bokherim"--Jewish men in their 50s, 60s & 70s (or even older) who also held out--for a Jewish wife. I know one guy like that who who for a while had a nice relationship going on with a nice gentile lady, but out of concience (plus fear of horrifying his mother) he dropped her...with great regret. He, & the other alteh bokherim, now live a sad & lonely life, pushed to the periphery of their Jewish community. No wives, no kids, no grandchildren. But one little silver lining to their cloud--they sure make great uncles & great-uncles to their brothers' & sisters' offspring!

(1)
Anonymous,
June 5, 2011 9:03 AM

excelent article, but the klinker, @if he chooses not to convert should have been elaborated on more.

I was born christian, left the church at 12. Met my husband in my late 20's, and converted. Our daughter is jewish.

I'm told that it's a mitzvah to become intoxicated on Purim. This puzzles me, because to my understanding, it is not considered a good thing to become intoxicated, period.

One of the characteristics of the at-risk youth is their use of drugs, including alcohol. In my experience, getting drunk doesn't reveal secrets. It makes people act stupid and irresponsible, doing things they would never do if they were sober. Also, I know a lot about the horrible health effects of abusing alcohol, because I work at a research center that focuses on addiction and substance abuse.

Also, I am an alcoholic, which means that if I drink, very bad things happen. I have not had a drink in 22 years, and I have no intention of starting now. Surely there must be instances where a person is excused from the obligation to drink. I don't see how Judaism could ever promote the idea of getting drunk. It just doesn't seem right.

The Aish Rabbi Replies:

Putting aside for a moment all the spiritual and philosophical reasons for getting drunk on Purim, this remains an issue of common sense. Of course, teenagers should be warned of the dangers of acute alcohol ingestion. Of course, nobody should drink and drive. Of course, nobody should become so drunk to the point of negligence in performing mitzvot. And of course, a recovering alcoholic should not partake of alcohol on Purim.

Indeed, the Code of Jewish Law explicitly says that if one suspects the drinking may affect him negatively, then he should NOT drink.

Getting drunk on Purim is actually one of the most difficult mitzvot to do correctly. A person should only drink if it will lead to positive spiritual results - e.g. under the loosening affect of the alcohol, greater awareness will surface of the love for God and Torah found deep in the heart. (Perhaps if we were on a higher spiritual level, we wouldn't need to get drunk!)

Yet the Talmud still speaks of an obligation on Purim of "not knowing the difference between Blessed is Mordechai and Cursed is Haman." How then should a person who doesn't drink get the point of “not knowing”? Simple - just go to sleep! (Rama - OC 695:2)

All this applies to individuals. But the question remains - does drinking on Purim adversely affect the collective social health of the Jewish community?

The aversion to alcoholism is engrained into Jewish consciousness from a number of Biblical and Talmudic sources. There are the rebuking words of prophets - Isaiah 28:1, Hosea 3:1 with Rashi, and Amos 6:6, and the Zohar says that "The wicked stray after wine" (Midrash Ne'alam Parshat Vayera).

It is well known that the rate of alcoholism among Jews has historically been very low. Numerous medical, psychological and sociological studies have confirmed this. The connection between Judaism and sobriety is so evident, that the following conversation is reported by Lawrence Kelemen in "Permission to Receive":

When Dr. Mark Keller, editor of the Quarterly Journal of Studies on Alcohol, commented that "practically all Jews do drink, and yet all the world knows that Jews hardly ever become alcoholics," his colleague, Dr. Howard Haggard, director of Yale's Laboratory of Applied Physiology, jokingly proposed converting alcoholics to the Jewish religion in order to immerse them in a culture with healthy attitudes toward drinking!

Perhaps we could suggest that it is precisely because of the use of alcohol in traditional ceremonies (Kiddush, Bris, Purim, etc.), that Jews experience such low rates of alcoholism. This ceremonial usage may actually act like an inoculation - i.e. injecting a safe amount that keeps the disease away.

Of course, as we said earlier, all this needs to be monitored with good common sense. Yet in my personal experience - having been in the company of Torah scholars who were totally drunk on Purim - they acted with extreme gentleness and joy. Amid the Jewish songs and beautiful words of Torah, every year the event is, for me, very special.

Adar 12 marks the dedication of Herod's renovations on the second Holy Temple in Jerusalem in 11 BCE. Herod was king of Judea in the first century BCE who constructed grand projects like the fortresses at Masada and Herodium, the city of Caesarea, and fortifications around the old city of Jerusalem. The most ambitious of Herod's projects was the re-building of the Temple, which was in disrepair after standing over 300 years. Herod's renovations included a huge man-made platform that remains today the largest man-made platform in the world. It took 10,000 men 10 years just to build the retaining walls around the Temple Mount; the Western Wall that we know today is part of that retaining wall. The Temple itself was a phenomenal site, covered in gold and marble. As the Talmud says, "He who has not seen Herod's building, has never in his life seen a truly grand building."

Some people gauge the value of themselves by what they own. But in reality, the entire concept of ownership of possessions is based on an illusion. When you obtain a material object, it does not become part of you. Ownership is merely your right to use specific objects whenever you wish.

How unfortunate is the person who has an ambition to cleave to something impossible to cleave to! Such a person will not obtain what he desires and will experience suffering.

Fortunate is the person whose ambition it is to acquire personal growth that is independent of external factors. Such a person will lead a happy and rewarding life.

With exercising patience you could have saved yourself 400 zuzim (Berachos 20a).

This Talmudic proverb arose from a case where someone was fined 400 zuzim because he acted in undue haste and insulted some one.

I was once pulling into a parking lot. Since I was a bit late for an important appointment, I was terribly annoyed that the lead car in the procession was creeping at a snail's pace. The driver immediately in front of me was showing his impatience by sounding his horn. In my aggravation, I wanted to join him, but I saw no real purpose in adding to the cacophony.

When the lead driver finally pulled into a parking space, I saw a wheelchair symbol on his rear license plate. He was handicapped and was obviously in need of the nearest parking space. I felt bad that I had harbored such hostile feelings about him, but was gratified that I had not sounded my horn, because then I would really have felt guilty for my lack of consideration.

This incident has helped me to delay my reactions to other frustrating situations until I have more time to evaluate all the circumstances. My motives do not stem from lofty principles, but from my desire to avoid having to feel guilt and remorse for having been foolish or inconsiderate.

Today I shall...

try to withhold impulsive reaction, bearing in mind that a hasty act performed without full knowledge of all the circumstances may cause me much distress.

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