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I am very close to the border and a war is taking place there every day. Innocent people are being slaughter and something needs to be done ASAP. I believe legalization is the only course of action we have left.

Please, please, please say you don't live in San Diego. And if by some chance you do, how would you know this based on the fact that you don't watch, read or otherwise view news? Most importantly, just tell me you don't live in SD.

Please, please, please say you don't live in San Diego. And if by some chance you do, how would you know this based on the fact that you don't watch, read or otherwise view news? Most importantly, just tell me you don't live in SD.

I do live in San Diego. I do not watch the news and to my knowledge this isnít widely reported anyway. I used to Surf in Baja weekly but no longer do because of the violence. My girlfriend has family South of the border and the ones who have not already bailed to the States illegally and looking to do it legally ASAP. I also have friends that live in Baja that I still surf with on the US side that explain how bad the current situation is & how it is getting worse.

Not to mention working Narcotics so close to the border you heard & observed some horrible stuff directly related to Mexico.

here in georgia today.... i've recently moved back into my departed grandparents home, our family has owned this home since wwII. in that time the area went from simple working class folks, to crime ridden streets. south central ATL

nice fall day, left my door open to allow the breeze in the screen door.

i take things like castle doctrine and curtilage seriously.

two police suvs pulled up in front of my house, one officer entered my property (came through the only open gate on the property)

it is reasonable for a person to walk from a public area to the obvious main entrance to the home using the most obvious path. otherwise, government agents need consent, a warrant, or probable cause of exigent circumstances to enter a home's curtilage.

cop didn't come to my door, instead he circled my house using what i would call tactical movement. as soon as he passed the front of the house i stopped and challenged him. "STOP, CAN I HELP YOU SIR? then asking why he didn't come to the door. at this time, his partner was pulling in.

concerns of burglaries in the area, health and welfare check of my elderly father. both reasonable answers.

then they began questioning me. asked to search my home, i refused. if you've got nothing to hide, why are you refusing? (a fools argument at best) i gave my name, and asked them to return with a warrant. they left. sat in his cruiser for 10-15 mins probably running a warrant check. over the course of the rest of the day did at least 10 slow drive bys.

i am treated like a suspect because of where i live, the house my grandfather bought when he returned for the pacific theater. this house has raised generations of my family. it is our castle. i resent being profiled into the "2%" because our family is lower working class. i am the 1%, not the rich, but the 1% that has served.

i resent cameras on every street corner, equipped with facial recognition and plate readers, all accessible from officers laptops in the cruiser.

here in georgia today.... i've recently moved back into my departed grandparents home, our family has owned this home since wwII. in that time the area went from simple working class folks, to crime ridden streets. south central ATL

nice fall day, left my door open to allow the breeze in the screen door.

i take things like castle doctrine and curtilage seriously.

two police suvs pulled up in front of my house, one officer entered my property (came through the only open gate on the property)

it is reasonable for a person to walk from a public area to the obvious main entrance to the home using the most obvious path. otherwise, government agents need consent, a warrant, or probable cause of exigent circumstances to enter a home's curtilage.

cop didn't come to my door, instead he circled my house using what i would call tactical movement. as soon as he passed the front of the house i stopped and challenged him. "STOP, CAN I HELP YOU SIR? then asking why he didn't come to the door. at this time, his partner was pulling in.

concerns of burglaries in the area, health and welfare check of my elderly father. both reasonable answers.

then they began questioning me. asked to search my home, i refused. if you've got nothing to hide, why are you refusing? (a fools argument at best) i gave my name, and asked them to return with a warrant. they left. sat in his cruiser for 10-15 mins probably running a warrant check. over the course of the rest of the day did at least 10 slow drive bys.

i am treated like a suspect because of where i live, the house my grandfather bought when he returned for the pacific theater. this house has raised generations of my family. it is our castle. i resent being profiled into the "2%" because our family is lower working class. i am the 1%, not the rich, but the 1% that has served.

i resent cameras on every street corner, equipped with facial recognition and plate readers, all accessible from officers laptops in the cruiser.

i fear the rising police state, and the militarization of the police.

I agree with you. I have served and you service should be treated with Honor & Respect.

You gave the right answers; you did not have to give them your name.

The area just being high crime is not really good enough in my book for an Officer to enter onto the property of a house especially if it looks lived in. I could see if the house looked unoccupied but if someone lives there I do not believe they have any basis.

What was the relationship your Grandfather had with the Police? Would they stop and talk with him? Because if not a Welfare check would not be true because someone would have to call the local Police Dept. and ask for a welfare check and that would make no sense for a family member of your to ask for this if your Grandfather has passed.

I would love to live in San Diego but I can't afford it. Housing is 244% higher in San Diego than Greensboro but salaries in my field are approximately the same. BTW violent crime and property crime in Greensboro is ranked 8 out of 10 (10 being the worst) where San Diego is only 5/10.

my grandfather passed away 30 years ago. my father, who is in poor health, has been living in the house for a few years now. i thought the welfare check was a good answer, had he come to the door first. instead, he was going to cover the rear while his partner came to the front door. not really welfare check SOP.

I can't believe you haven't heard the term "meat eaters," yet you have your master's in CJ. It was one of the first terms I learned in a class taught by a federal prosecutor. It means cops who take bribes, swag etc.

Logged

I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

yeah, serpico, it wasn't meant as a joke, its where the terms came from. not the movie, the real thing.

The Knapp Commission (officially known as the Commission to Investigate Alleged Police Corruption) stemmed from a five-member panel initially formed in April 1970 by Mayor John V. Lindsay to investigate corruption within the New York City Police Department. The creation of the commission was largely a result of the publicity generated by the public revelations of police corruption made by Patrolman Frank Serpico and Sergeant David Durk.

"Grass Eaters" and "Meat Eaters"

The Knapp Commission Report on Police Corruption identified two particular classes of corrupt police officer, which it called "Grass Eaters" and "Meat Eaters". This classification refers to petty corruption under peer pressure ("eating grass") and aggressive premeditated major corruption ("eating meat").

The term "Grass Eaters" is used to describe police officers who "accept gratuities and solicit five, ten, twenty dollar payments from contractors, tow-truck operators, gamblers, and the like but do not pursue corruption payments." 'Grass eating' is something that a significant number of officers are guilty of, but which they learned to do so from other cops or from imitating the deviants they watch and investigate every day. The commission even concluded that 'grass eating' was used by police officers in New York City to prove their loyalty to the brotherhood, and with that came incentives like side jobs. One method of preventing cops from becoming corrupt is to eliminate this step by removing veteran cops who do this, without any veteran cops to learn this from, new officers might never decide to 'eat grass'.

"Meat Eaters" are officers who "spend a good deal of time aggressively looking for situations they can exploit for financial gain." An example of this is shaking down pimps and drug dealers for money not only for the material profit to the officers, but for the relief from guilt that the officers derive by convincing themselves that their victims deserve such treatment. They justify taking advantage of (these) criminals because they are considered the dregs of society."

If an Officer wants you to go into the Station to give a statement response should be 'Am I under arrest' if the answer is NO, DON'T GO.

Never EVER think speaking to Police is in your best interest because it is not, do not help their investigation by opening your mouth and giving voluntary statements no matter what the case or charge.

I read this with intrigue and chose not to comment until I spoke to my police chief uncle. He indicated that in most cases, not cooperating will likely result in an arrest if there is suspicion of a crime or if someone else made a complaint against an individual. If you don't relate your side of the story, the officer is left to make a decision on what "facts" or "allegations" he has.

If I weren't so dang lazy I could probably find some other credible links, but I already suspected that your advice wasn't appropriate.

« Last Edit: October 16, 2012, 02:29:12 PM by wolfter »

Logged

Complacency is the enemy. Challenge yourself daily for maximum return on investment.

I read this with intrigue and chose not to comment until I spoke to my police chief uncle. He indicated that in most cases, not cooperating will likely result in an arrest if there is suspicion of a crime or if someone else made a complaint against an individual. If you don't relate your side of the story, the officer is left to make a decision on what "facts" or "allegations" he has.

If I weren't so dang lazy I could probably find some other credible links, but I already suspected that your advice wasn't appropriate.

The only way an Officer can make an arrest is based on Probable cause not reasonable suspicion. If you refuse to cooperate with the investigation that is your right to remain silent. Simply ask an Attorney and the first thing they will tell you is not speak with the Officer regarding the call, case or charge because in no way, shape of form are you going to help yourself by doing so.

I do not care how pissed the Officer will be you have the right to not speak with them and it is very simple there is absolutely nothing they can do about it. If you refuse to speak they cannot arrest you 'JUST BECAUSE' and if you are arrested you were going to be arrested anyway if the burden of Probable cause is met.

Being arrested and being charged are two separate areas. If you speak with an Officer an assist his/her investigation chances are you will be charged. If you do not want to take my word on this issue as stated above simply ask an Attorney and they will tell you the same.

If you are suspected in a Murder case do you think it would be in your best interest to speak with the Detectives when they want to speak with you or tell them to pound sand? Because believe it or not not speaking with them is in an opinion and just because you didn't speak with them does not mean they can arrest you. I use Murder as an example but it is the same exact thing for any investigation, any crime misdemeanor or felony.

If I ever committed a crime, then I probably wouldn't speak with the authorities. I guess you're assuming everyone is actually guilty. If I was involved in any manner in an investgation and was innocent, I'd allow law enforcement to verify my alibi and such.

We certainly do have the right to remain silent, but an innocent person usually doesn't have anything to hide.

Logged

Complacency is the enemy. Challenge yourself daily for maximum return on investment.

If I ever committed a crime I would speak to the "authorities".... I'd tell them I didn't do it. I saw this done many times on 48 hours. I would also ask for a #3 McDonald's meal cuz it seems they give them to you for free. It makes no sense going back home hungry.

I would love to live in San Diego but I can't afford it. Housing is 244% higher in San Diego than Greensboro but salaries in my field are approximately the same. BTW violent crime and property crime in Greensboro is ranked 8 out of 10 (10 being the worst) where San Diego is only 5/10.

I live in San Diego but when I worked for the PD I worked further North. San Diego is an amazing City=)

I read this with intrigue and chose not to comment until I spoke to my police chief uncle. He indicated that in most cases, not cooperating will likely result in an arrest if there is suspicion of a crime or if someone else made a complaint against an individual. If you don't relate your side of the story, the officer is left to make a decision on what "facts" or "allegations" he has.

If I weren't so dang lazy I could probably find some other credible links, but I already suspected that your advice wasn't appropriate.

I am sorry but the advice you were given is not only wrong but dead wrong. If an Officer or Detective was to ever arrest you for not cooperating that would be a huge mistake civilly & financially for that Department. The simple fact is the Officer needs Reasonable Suspicion to make an arrest, not a hunch, not a gut feeling, not reason suspicion, they need PC.

This is a very simple rule to follow:

If the Officer has PC already you are going to jail and you should never speak with them.

If the Officer needs to talk with you they are looking for PC and by talking that is only going to help them.

Unless you are the victim, there is no reason to speak with the police. Your first step should be finding a good defense attorney, your second step is to STFU!!

I also agree that San Diego is a great city (except for some reason every time I am there I freeze my ass of, and that's from someone who lives in Seattle, go figure)

And I agree with you that smoking pot (or in your case vaporizing or whatevs) is A-OK!

See, common ground my friend

Well said unless you are a victim STFU and STFU not sometime but everytime, NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER talk to the Police is the Police are called to your house, if you are suspected in a crime or if you are arrested.

As for freezing you butt off in San Diego they say you blood thins out in warmer temps. I am from a cold area and I know I could never go back there to live. I consider freezing to 60

"We certainly do have the right to remain silent, but an innocent person usually doesn't have anything to hide."

That is an incredibly weak viewpoint. The Bill of Rights protects and guarantees our natural rights. An innocent person shouldn't exercise their right to remain silent, to be secure from unreasonable search and seizure? How about any of my other civil/human rights? Which ones should I sacrifice, because I'm innocent? My answer is not a single fkn one of them.

I NEVER cooperate with police, I obey lawful orders, and there is a difference. I choose NEVER to speak to police, that is my right. I will always bear true faith and alligence to the Constitution.

Fair enough, instead of discourse, let it die. Remember the Eagle raid in Atlanta? Lets hope the same thing never happens at an AIDSmeds Gathering.

edited to add.... and btw, thanks for shushing me. stirring the pot once again? we've both posted 9 times in this thread. i realize that since i don't have the "history" here, and that i haven't had AIDS as long as others, my input is not as legitimate. its something i've been reminded of before here. so i'll go sit in the corner and be quite now.

Fair enough, instead of discourse, let it die. Remember the Eagle raid in Atlanta? Lets hope the same thing never happens at an AIDSmeds Gathering.

I have to agree because I remember this incident - and it was completely unsuprising to me that they did it. The police have stomped all over me and my rights - and don't give me any of your "closet criminal" bullshit, remy - and as far as I am concened, they can all fucking rot for all I care.

Police can (and do...and DID, in my case) manufacture "probable cause" all the damn time because they know they can get away with it almost every time. In my case, simce some of you are likely wondering, I had to sit in jail for three fucking months over bullshit charges that were eventually completely dropped...but not until after having to pay out thousands for an attorney and having to sit in terror in jail. Oh...and missing the funeral of my dear cousin while in there.

If the police would have done their jobs properly instead of acting like the rat fucking bastards they are, none of it would have ever happened. I fucking hate them. Might as well just say so.

It is creepy. Then you throw in the fact that cops are smoking that high grade (or eating, vaporizing) kush and can't even remember that they do it. What if during a weed induced traffic stop they forgot to clear the scanner and think the soccer mom they just pulled over for going 7 mph over the speed limit is a serial rapist?

Soccer moms every where should be scared.

They don't have to worry about Remy though, he's retired. He is probably doing a confessional on Santa Monica Beach right now!

That is really creepy, I agree. It seems things today are so invasive. A couple years ago a car rear ended me. Within a couple weeks I started getting letters from chiropractors and scam lawyers. But this portable fingerprint scanners are a bit much.

Logged

I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Seroconverted: Early 80sTested & confirmed what I already knew: early 90s

Current regimen: Atripla. Last regimen: Epzicom, Sustiva (since its inception with NO adverse side effects: no vivid dreams and NONE of the problems people who can't tolerate this drug may experience: color me lucky )Past regimensFun stuff (in the past): HAV/HBV, crypto, shingles, AIDS, PCP

i realize that since i don't have the "history" here, and that i haven't had AIDS as long as others, my input is not as legitimate. its something i've been reminded of before here. so i'll go sit in the corner and be quite now.

Since this isn't an HIV related issue, length of diagnosis is irrelevant. I never said your input is not legitimate, you said my views were. You "quoted" my opinion and indicated it was a weak opinion. You could have stated your views without downplaying mine.

You can come out of the corner and play now.

Logged

Complacency is the enemy. Challenge yourself daily for maximum return on investment.

I have to agree because I remember this incident - and it was completely unsuprising to me that they did it. The police have stomped all over me and my rights - and don't give me any of your "closet criminal" bullshit, remy - and as far as I am concened, they can all fucking rot for all I care.

Police can (and do...and DID, in my case) manufacture "probable cause" all the damn time because they know they can get away with it almost every time. In my case, simce some of you are likely wondering, I had to sit in jail for three fucking months over bullshit charges that were eventually completely dropped...but not until after having to pay out thousands for an attorney and having to sit in terror in jail. Oh...and missing the funeral of my dear cousin while in there.

If the police would have done their jobs properly instead of acting like the rat fucking bastards they are, none of it would have ever happened. I fucking hate them. Might as well just say so.

I agree with you that if you have a corrupt Police Officer they can manufacture Probable Cause because the Judicial System leans toward their word and not the citizens, it is wrong.

I had a classmate in my Academy who came from an East Coast Police Department and I heard him say that he was told by a Training Officer back East ĎYou find me a gun in that car and I will the PC that allowed us to search that vehicle after the factí or ĎIf we have no reason to pull them over and it goes sideways NO SEATBELT.í

The simple fact is there are corrupt Officers out there and if you run into one and look the part chances are you might find yourself in a heap of trouble over nothing.

We were using this technology shortly after 9/11 with Federal money grants.

Local Police Departments are TODAY getting Federal Grants to allow Officers to work OT (Overtime) to act as spotters on Freeway overpasses to look for people driving & texting, radioing to an Officer in a Patrol Car on the Freeway and having them cited. We are without a doubt moving more toward a Big Brother society.

It is creepy. Then you throw in the fact that cops are smoking that high grade (or eating, vaporizing) kush and can't even remember that they do it. What if during a weed induced traffic stop they forgot to clear the scanner and think the soccer mom they just pulled over for going 7 mph over the speed limit is a serial rapist?

Soccer moms every where should be scared.

They don't have to worry about Remy though, he's retired. He is probably doing a confessional on Santa Monica Beach right now!

I was surfing but not Santa Monica Beach, the waves were amazing, if you have never tried you have to give it a shot.

Cop pulls over a drunk driver, and there sitting behind the wheel is the owner of the local diner who has provided members of the local PD with free lunches for the last 5 years.

Now one free $5.00 lunch might not seem like much, but multiply that by 365 days, then multiply that by 5 years... it comes to $9,125 dollars. Then multiply that by the average number of officers who take advantage of the free lunch every day... you're quickly talking about someone who has directly provided individual members of the PD with tens of thousands of dollars in goods and services.

Even though the officers may not have considered accepting free lunches a bribe, and even though the diner's owner may not have intended it to be a bribe... it can easily have the same effect. The cop who has cummulatively received nearly $10,000 worth of freebies over the years from this man is going to be inclined to show him some leniency, and the man is likely going to expect it.