OK I'm starting this thread because I'm tired of this never ending whining about Russia helping Trump win the White House. OF COURSE THEY HELPED TRUMP! What the hell is wrong with everyone? Are we all really gonna pretend that the USA doesn't do the same?

My opinion of this horseshit is that the Democratic lackies are so incensed by the presence of Donny in the White House, and are so bruised by the rough treatment the Republican lackies heaped on Obama, that they've made a group decision to continue throwing this horseshit at the wall till some of it sticks.

It's all childish, and really exposes an American mentality that, in my ever so humble opinion, American's might just wanna keep bottled up. I mean really now...aren't you all just a little embarrassed by this endless airing of your dirty laundry in public?

Buzz62 wrote:OK I'm starting this thread because I'm tired of this never ending whining about Russia helping Trump win the White House. OF COURSE THEY HELPED TRUMP! What the hell is wrong with everyone? Are we all really gonna pretend that the USA doesn't do the same?

We have to pretend that USA is an independent state, that American elections were never influenced by any foreign state, that Russia really controls the USA, and that AIPAC is not a lobby of a foreign country...

_________________________________________________________________________________"I don't care if Americans think we're running the news media, Hollywood, Wall Street or the government. I just care that we get to keep running them".

The Russians did not influence the election. The American voters simply elected Trump. I am not sure in which way it was possible for Moscow to really influence such a large country like the United States.

But America also influenced elections. In 1948 the US influenced the Italian elections to ensure the Italian voters did not elect the communist party.

The Russia saga began as a purely partisan attack on Donald Trump, because the Democrats thought it would draw "moderate" Republicans (i.e. neoconservatives, nostalgic Cold warriors, etc) to their side. As we all know, it didn't work. But the Clinton crowd staked so much of their electoral strategy on it that to drop it after the election would look odd. So they've carried it on, and on, and on, and on.

Now, do I believe that the Russians did what they could to help Trump? Yes. They can't conceivably have been hoping for a Clinton victory, given that she's a rabid NATO expansionist and war hawk. This really is no different to the US intervening in the Russian presidential election in 2012, calling the protests against Putin a "positive sign for democracy", or John McCain turning up in Kiev to express US solidarity with the "Euromaidan" movement. It's certainly much less serious than America's long-standing habit of overthrowing governments it doesn't like with military force.

Besides, the "Russian hacking" of the DNC led to the release of information - namely, that the DNC tried to sabotage Sanders' campaign - that was true. It's very telling that the Clinton wing of the Democratic party - and their supporters in the US media - think that the problem is the release of the information rather than the acts exposed by the release of that information.

So, yeah: you don't need to be a Trump supporter to find all of this stuff tiresome.

"I am presently incarcerated, imprisoned for a crime I did not even commit. 'Attempted murder.' Now honestly, what is that? Do they give a Nobel prize for 'attempted chemistry?' Do they?" - Sideshow Bob

OK so yesterday I watched Farid whatshisname on CNN and his show, "Why Trump Won".And surprise surprise, no mention of the DNC sabotaging Bernie's campaign.Lots of talk about a stream of other issues, like the "deplorable" comment, but not one word about the horseshit the DNC pulled.

Now there are new polls showing Trump having the lowest approval rating ever?Ya know...I think CNN is full of stupid people. Don't they realize that:A. Their polls mean nothing and are habitually wrong.B. All they are doing is convincing the public that Trump really is the antidote to "the establishment".

Political Interest wrote:The Russians did not influence the election. The American voters simply elected Trump. I am not sure in which way it was possible for Moscow to really influence such a large country like the United States.

But America also influenced elections. In 1948 the US influenced the Italian elections to ensure the Italian voters did not elect the communist party.

A slight disagreement. Yes, the Russians did attempt to influence the election. Whether they actually succeeded or not is a matter of debate since there is no evidence/proof. IMHO, I do believe that frustration among Democrats about Bernie and Hillary's corruption probably convinced a few to stay home.

Whether or not the US attempted to sway other nation's elections is irrelevant to the discussion of what the Russians did or didn't do.

Divine Wind wrote:Whether or not the US attempted to sway other nation's elections is irrelevant to the discussion of what the Russians did or didn't do.

Well it is somewhat amusing that people are fretting over Russian interference while the country has become an open corporatocracy managed by a criminal deep state. The entire system has been taken over in a silent coup through blackmail and bribery but it's the Russians we should all be worried about. What a joke.

The elephant in the room is the capture of our entire state apparatus by private wealth. Anyone ignoring that and talking about Russia are just engaging in idiotic partisan theatrics and shouldn't be taken seriously.

It's all just inadvertent simulationA pattern in all mankindWhat's got the whole world fakin'?

Sivad wrote:Well it is somewhat amusing that people are fretting over Russian interference while the country has become an open corporatocracy managed by a criminal deep state. The entire system has been taken over in a silent coup through blackmail and bribery but it's the Russians we should all be worried about. What a joke.

The elephant in the room is the capture of our entire state apparatus by private wealth. Anyone ignoring that and talking about Russia are just engaging in idiotic partisan theatrics and shouldn't be taken seriously.