Banned

Yes, certainly, what 'kem' has offered you makes much more sense than saying an entire OS is "not so good" over an incident. No more than if something happened in another OS. The issue gets address & resolved rather than writing off the entire OS. Windows 8 is good, that doesn't mean some piece of H/W or S/W can't cause an event in any OS.

Same as if a car has a problem, it gets fixed but, doesn't mean the whole line of that make or model are bad. They may be quite excellent.

New Member

Yes, certainly, what 'kem' has offered you makes much more sense than saying an entire OS is "not so good" over an incident. No more than if something happened in another OS. The issue gets address & resolved rather than writing off the entire OS. Windows 8 is good, that doesn't mean some piece of H/W or S/W can't cause an event in any OS.

Same as if a car has a problem, it gets fixed but, doesn't mean the whole line of that make or model are bad. They may be quite excellent.

I will agree with this line of thinking; An off the box EPSON driver causing BSOD is indeed a rare occasion and does not mean the whole OS is bad.

My personal views regarding win 8 are known here but truth be told the above problem is not a general indication of the OS.

I remember when I tried to install win 7 it totally refused to install. XP installed on the same machine. I was totally stumped and called MS. They spent a good part of over 2 hours trying to solve the problem for me over the phone. In the end we discovered that it was the C drive SATA cable that was the problem Although XP had no problems with this cable apparently win 7 did. I went and bought the most expensive SATA cable I could find and lo and behold installation went as smooth as silk.

All OS's have quirks and win 8 is no exception.

Now how to get totally rid of METRO..........................RetroUI Perhaps?

Windows Forum Admin

Stardock has released Version 1.15 of the Start8 Start Menu replacement utility for Windows 8. Changes include an option to view the taskbar when using fullscreen Windows 8-style menu, and optimizations to icon loading.

New Member

Stardock has released Version 1.15 of the Start8 Start Menu replacement utility for Windows 8. Changes include an option to view the taskbar when using fullscreen Windows 8-style menu, and optimizations to icon loading.

Thanks for the tip. This is really a great little program and has been a life-saver for me (personally); however, I do have two gripes about the administration of this program and they are as follows:

1-There is a "maximum activation" counter for the number of allowable installs (on the same PC) and, once reached, you are prompted to make a new purchase. Alternatively, you can contact their support group and politely ask them to "reset" the counter; however, there are no guarantees that they will do this for you.

2- There is no published Start8 end-user license agreement available, either before/after the purchase, where one can identify/understand the above limitation. With that said, I have posted a query on their support forum for a link to the license agreement and if they respond with a link, I will add the link to this post.

UPDATE:
The EULA is actually located (eg, hidden) in the Start8 install directory and there is no way to know that unless you are told where it is or you find it accidentally. Also, there is no reference to a maximum activation counter contained therein and Stardock support refuses to disclose the value of that maximum activation counter. Now, if I paid $49.99 for this software, I would be a bit ticked if I maxed out but at $4.99, I can live with the unknown maximum counter value.

Banned

Member

Thanks for patting us malcontents on the head with the encouraging words. But here's the thing. When I'm sitting at a desk doing work or intensive research, I want a start button. An (optinal) start button would give me the boost I need to step out of the "new gadget" and "learning curve" mode and get to work with minimal distractions. If Microsoft has a presented a compelling reason for keeping it from us I've missed it. When I'm in tablet mode, no problem! In fact I'm starting to really dig it. What I'm not digging is the abrasive "you're gonna like it" posture Microsoft has taken, or the jedi hand waving forum comments telling us what we don't want or don't need. The latter notion is quite ridiculous actually.

Windows Forum Admin

Banned

One can use humour, clever insults, subtle name-calling or try avoiding a point by saying one is merely being told to "such up & accept". No, one is merely being told facts. Attitude tends to block, obscure or skew facts; it can hinder & taint ones ability to work w/ something, to work w/ change w/out labeling it 'bad.' OR
the suggested attitude that must exist in a company.... one that viciously, callously, blindly, coerces consumers into (crazy) things or even worse, denies them necessities.

One attitude is unfortunate, the other doesn't exist. So, sticking to facts... opinion is not @ issue here.

In Windows 8.1 people were given a so-called 'start button'. It is a Win(dows) Key and, in effect, a start button (old term)... it will or can take one to the Start screen, which can be used as & thought of as a start menu. Certainly, this doesn't cut it w/ folks who feel it MUST lead to an old style start menu and not, dreadful Tiles. Of course, in Win 8.1 one can have the Win Key or Icon take one to the All Apps screen, instead... more sensible, really.

Ah, but, does one NEED to change screens from good ole Desktop and use either of these new style screens to find or access things? NOPE. Don't care for them? No worries, one can access ALL the same content w/out ever leaving Desktop

Overall, everything is quicker, easier, more readily @ one's fingertips, less time, fewer clicks than prior Windows OSs. That is the reality. Navigating it is fast, smooth, slick & flexible. It is not opinion, it IS the reality that it works, can work well, as is and it's differences from the past do not warrant whinging. There is, though, much that is praise worthy in the OS.

Nothing is problematic unless ones opts to perceive something as such... the perception does not apply to Windows 8.1

Interestingly, I can configure a machine, spend 20 minutes w/ clients new to Windows 8.1 and they not only know how to use it but, find it easy, enjoyable & exciting. Has not been one exception and some had even heard negative hype before (now) discovering it to be exciting, pleasing and enjoyable.

Of course, it's a bit of singing to the choir... myself, I had quit using the old start button & menu long before Windows 8.0 had even appeared, at all. Having one (or not) is truly NOT a must! Nor a 'big deal' for any reason, as far as that goes.

Mainly, dunno why we write or say much... often facts will not override attitude.

Anyway, you wanted a start button, MS gave you one in 8.1 Now, you want something different than what it gives you or shows you, you don't like what it does.... even though things actually work just fine or can w/ what there is; go figure, eh?

Senior Member

Thanks for patting us malcontents on the head with the encouraging words. But here's the thing. When I'm sitting at a desk doing work or intensive research, I want a start button. An (optinal) start button would give me the boost I need to step out of the "new gadget" and "learning curve" mode and get to work with minimal distractions. If Microsoft has a presented a compelling reason for keeping it from us I've missed it. When I'm in tablet mode, no problem! In fact I'm starting to really dig it. What I'm not digging is the abrasive "you're gonna like it" posture Microsoft has taken, or the jedi hand waving forum comments telling us what we don't want or don't need. The latter notion is quite ridiculous actually.

Essential Member

Naturally. All about personal choice. I took the alternative and used the modern screen as my start menu. So used to it now, I would not wish to go back to the text start menu. Just an observation, imho, I think, as the computer business is definitely leaning towards touch screens, from tablets to stationaries, I think users could have difficulty trying to touch those individual text items on the old start menu?

But, in fairness to drew, I think this very small and crude demo says it all. This is how, for example, I select Paintnet. The first step is not clear on the clip, but is achieved by either pressing the Windows key, or the start button.

People ask this all around. But I believe it's very personal, like you may not need any of these tools, having a tablet for example.
Or you might not need power options accessible in 1 click. Or maybe fast clickless filesystem navigation is also what you disregard. All depends on you, your PC usage behavior, etc. For example me personally use P8 at home and at work differently. And my wife uses it in 3rd way, etc.

We'll see, need to get Windows 8.1 update 1 beta first. But honestly I think it won't. Because of 2 things:
1) Start screen is something completely new from technical perspective, and start screen taskbar must also be somehow separated from desktop mode, which P8 exclusively belongs to and was designed for.
2) I wouldn't love seeing P8 over start screen. If a person uses start screen, he/she is going new, modern way. P8, on the other hand, is made to ensure users won't lose the behavior of the system they used to know.

@davehc: isn't it just showing us you like new start screen? I do really believe that IF you wanted to launch Paintnet faster, you'd pin it to taskbar, put on Desktop, etc. Or simply doubleclick image or invoke open-with (which is also (mouse-down, move, mouse-up ) 1 click from Explorer ribbon). As you're starting demo from windows key or Start button - you just like start screeen and that's it. All about personal preferences just like @badrobot said.