I would rather use a pick to trade up in the 1st than to trade one to KC for a lineman.

Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:23 pm

degs

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Kev1321 wrote:

I would rather use a pick to trade up in the 1st than to trade one to KC for a lineman.

There are benefits to both. Getting a proven player is FAR less risky and the player is generally more opening day ready. But the veteran is also more much expensive and the player is older, meaning a shorter career remaining.

Quote:

Miami's biggest needs now are CB and LT. The tricky part is I'm not sure there are prospects at No. 12 at those positions.

I haven't read anything that says Rhodes is a reach at #12. And who knows, we have seen stranger things than a lineman fall on draft day, or a team shock everyone and pick someone that nobody expected.

Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:54 pm

wkloiber13

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Xavier Rhodes will likely be there at 12. There is also a good chance that Lane Johnson could be there. Both players would fit an area of need and both present solid value.

Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:55 pm

MNDolfan

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Love it! I want Milliner more than any player in this draft. Get it done!

Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:04 pm

Kev1321

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

degs wrote:

Kev1321 wrote:

I would rather use a pick to trade up in the 1st than to trade one to KC for a lineman.

There are benefits to both. Getting a proven player is FAR less risky and the player is generally more opening day ready. But the veteran is also more much expensive and the player is older, meaning a shorter career remaining.

Proven players flop out in free agency just as much, I would guess...

Trade up for Milliner is alot more attractive for me. Our 1st and 2nd would most likley get it done.

Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:07 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

I'm driving this bus.

Unless they go out and surprise everybody by signing multiple Free Agent corners, I want to move up for Milliner pretty badly.

Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:23 pm

degs

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Phins Rock wrote:

I'm driving this bus.

Unless they go out and surprise everybody by signing multiple Free Agent corners, I want to move up for Milliner pretty badly.

I actually started that bus back in early January. But at that point I thought they would only have to jump up past Tennessee.

While I like having those extra high picks and I am generally against trading up, I think this is a good time for the Dolphins to make the move and go for the elite talent!!

Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:15 pm

IamPZ

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

degs wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

I'm driving this bus.

Unless they go out and surprise everybody by signing multiple Free Agent corners, I want to move up for Milliner pretty badly.

I actually started that bus back in early January. But at that point I thought they would only have to jump up past Tennessee.

While I like having those extra high picks and I am generally against trading up, I think this is a good time for the Dolphins to make the move and go for the elite talent!!

Save me a seat on that bus as well. I know Mak won't agree with this sentiment but Dee Milliner is legit.

Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:08 pm

Dphins4me

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

I expect them to stand pat & take a Rhodes and in time sign Winston

Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:10 pm

MdDolfan

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Phins Rock wrote:

I'm driving this bus.

Unless they go out and surprise everybody by signing multiple Free Agent corners, I want to move up for Milliner pretty badly.

Move up for Milliner, draft Austin or stay at 12 and wait for one of the top 3 LT's to fall.

Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:12 pm

phinsfansc

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

MdDolfan wrote:

Phins Rock wrote:

I'm driving this bus.

Unless they go out and surprise everybody by signing multiple Free Agent corners, I want to move up for Milliner pretty badly.

Move up for Milliner, draft Austin or stay at 12 and wait for one of the top 3 LT's to fall.

I may be in the minority here, but I don't trade up to get Millner because I don't think there a big difference between him and Xavier Rhodes. I just listened to Charlie Casserly state that he thought Millner was a solid CB, not special.

The top 3 OLT in this draft will be gone before Miami picks at #12, so they would have to trade up to get one of those guys.

either I would trade up for Lane Johnson or stay put and take Bjoern Werner.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:12 am

ag_fin_90

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

swerve13 wrote:

either I would trade up for Lane Johnson or stay put and take Bjoern Werner.

Why is everybody sure Werner will even be a first round pick? I always thought he was a guy on a great dline with a great pass rusher on the other side and he just so happened to be a guy that gives great effort but for the 12th pick hell no

Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:01 am

swerve13

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

ag_fin_90 wrote:

swerve13 wrote:

either I would trade up for Lane Johnson or stay put and take Bjoern Werner.

Why is everybody sure Werner will even be a first round pick? I always thought he was a guy on a great dline with a great pass rusher on the other side and he just so happened to be a guy that gives great effort but for the 12th pick hell no

What??????................he's been in everybody's top 10 for months now. He might slip down to the middle of the first round, but he's a surefire 1st rounder. Always has been.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:23 am

ag_fin_90

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

swerve13 wrote:

ag_fin_90 wrote:

swerve13 wrote:

either I would trade up for Lane Johnson or stay put and take Bjoern Werner.

Why is everybody sure Werner will even be a first round pick? I always thought he was a guy on a great dline with a great pass rusher on the other side and he just so happened to be a guy that gives great effort but for the 12th pick hell no

What??????................he's been in everybody's top 10 for months now. He might slip down to the middle of the first round, but he's a surefire 1st rounder. Always has been.

The guy is overrated im telling you

Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:38 am

swerve13

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

looks like a pretty disruptive player to me. Sacks/knockdowns/tackles for loss/interceptions/forced fumbles. He does it all. I'd be more than happy with him starting opposite Wake.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:53 am

phinsfansc

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Bjoern Werner is a solid football player and far from overrated. Carradine certainly benefited from playing across from Werner this past year as he got a lot of double teams.

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Wed Mar 20, 2013 6:18 am

Big Dave

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Can 11 players make the team? The draft should be very interesting. It looks to me that Philben wants 11 draft picks to turn into 11 players. Of course, if it turns into 10 I am sure he wouldn't complain. To me, what the Dolphins need are quality over quantity. Of course, I am confident that Ireland has a good grade on the talent and won't trade up unless he has to.

Philben wrote:

(On having 11 selections in the Draft and how much more can be done to upgrade the team) – “Ideally, we’d add 11 excellent football players to the roster and create an even more competitive atmosphere than we have right now. That’s certainly what we’re looking to do. We all know the draft and free agency for that matter are not necessarily exact sciences, but I’d rather have 11 (draft picks) than five. So I’m excited about it. It’s going to give us an opportunity to find 11 guys that fit the system and character that we’re looking for on this football team.”

Bjoern Werner is a solid football player and far from overrated. Carradine certainly benefited from playing across from Werner this past year as he got a lot of double teams.

I'm thinking we're going to see a lot more of Vernon in '13. He was used pretty sparingly last year, but showed some big play capability. With that said, I don't see us taking a DE in the first two rounds.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 6:53 am

Makchell

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

No way do we trade up. This draft isn't top heavy. If anything, trade down.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:11 am

shularino

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

With 11 picks, it doesn't seem like we'll move down. Maybe we move up for Johnson, if not, I've got to think we'll take Rhodes at 12, since both the Bucs at 13 & Panthers at 14 need secondary help.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:21 am

Rich

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Makchell wrote:

No way do we trade up. This draft isn't top heavy. If anything, trade down.

I agree, Mak. This is a deep draft with little in the way of elite prospects at the top.

It wouldn't make any sense to move up with so much talent spread out in the first three rounds. It would make more sense this year to move down and acquire more 1-3 round picks.

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Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:32 am

jammer

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Rich wrote:

Makchell wrote:

No way do we trade up. This draft isn't top heavy. If anything, trade down.

I agree, Mak. This is a deep draft with little in the way of elite prospects at the top.

It wouldn't make any sense to move up with so much talent spread out in the first three rounds. It would make more sense this year to move down and acquire more 1-3 round picks.

I agree with this as well. The only way I could see it making sense is if you wanted to leap frog SD to get Johnson and you could trade firsts and give Tennessee your extra 5th rounder to do so.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:04 am

AQNOR

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Quote:

Omar Kelly ‏@OmarKelly 2h

I've been told the Dolphins want to find 15 rookies that can make the team, either on the 53 or the practice squad. Gonna be a young squad.

No way do we trade up. This draft isn't top heavy. If anything, trade down.

I agree, Mak. This is a deep draft with little in the way of elite prospects at the top.

It wouldn't make any sense to move up with so much talent spread out in the first three rounds. It would make more sense this year to move down and acquire more 1-3 round picks.

Perhaps we trade back with the Vikings? We give them the 12th overall and our 3rd round pick for their two 1st round picks? I believe the points come out about even on such a trade. Or we attempt to swing a deal where we give the Vikings our 1st, a 2nd, and a 3rd for their two 1st round picks this year and their 1st round pick next year. Under that scenario the Vikings would be able to have more picks to build now and we'd wind up trading a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd for three 1st rounders.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:58 am

phinsfansc

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

shularino wrote:

phinsfansc wrote:

Bjoern Werner is a solid football player and far from overrated. Carradine certainly benefited from playing across from Werner this past year as he got a lot of double teams.

I'm thinking we're going to see a lot more of Vernon in '13. He was used pretty sparingly last year, but showed some big play capability. With that said, I don't see us taking a DE in the first two rounds.

Olivier show big play promise on special teams and some flashes at DE, but he is still raw. He had 2.5 sacks, 2 in the St. Louis game. If the Dolphins bring in someone like Osi Uminyora, then I agree. Otherwise, I very much expect a DE to be drafted, and drafted early.

If the Fins sign Winston, or some other vet, to play RT and move Martin to LT, then I believe they'll go bpa with the #12 pick.

That being the case I would expect them to take Warmack or Cooper if either is there at #12. Leaning more towards Cooper as I think he would be a better fit for zone blocking, plus Warmack could be gone before pick 12.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:14 pm

shularino

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

I recognize this is a deep draft, but there are still specific players the team is targeting. With 11 picks, I think the Phins will bundle picks to move up, more often than trade down. Assuming Rhodes is available at 12, I don't see how we trade down and let him go to the Bucs or Panthers.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:34 pm

jammer

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

I still wouldn't rule out Miami trading back. If Austin is there at 12 and St Louis or Minnesota wants to leapfrog the Panthers (who need a playmaker) I could see Miami taking the bait. Moving back to St Louis's 16th pick could net a 3rd rounder and dropping into the 20s should bring an extra 2nd round pick.

I expect Miami to sign Winston, a DE (probably Osi) and a bargain CB. That leaves a lot of flexibility and creativity with their draft picks.

Unless its such a bargain deal I can't see Miami moving up in the 1st round.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:35 pm

Rich

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

shularino wrote:

but there are still specific players the team is targeting.

There may be 5 of these specific players or there may be 50. If they feel they can get a guy later in the draft with comparable skillset, they may just do that.

Unless you are part of the Dolphins organization, there is no way of knowing.

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Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:50 pm

shularino

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Rich wrote:

Unless you are part of the Dolphins organization, there is no way of knowing.

Rich, I'm obviously not a part of the Dolphins' Organization. I simply come to this site to get updated info and respectively correspond will fellow Phin Fans.

For this draft, I believe it's key we concentrate and potentially move up to obtain the following:

2 aggressive CB's to replace Nolan & Marshall2 O-linemen with one versatile enough to play RT or LT. A tight-end to pair with Keller and potentially replace him next year.

Unless we feel there's a DE clearly better than Vernon or Odrick, I don't see the need to invest highly here. A top pick at WR and Safety can wait till next year's FA and draft.

Later picks can be used on a variety of needs...........who knows maybe we'll find another Reshad Jones.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:08 pm

Finhead34

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Ask the NFLJunkie who Miami will draft with pick #12, he knows!

Wed Mar 20, 2013 6:38 pm

Makchell

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Unless we feel there's a DE clearly better than Vernon or Odrick

Finding a player that is clearly better than Vernon or Odrick shouldn't be to hard.

Wed Mar 20, 2013 6:43 pm

shularino

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Odrick is a DT, so I understand that we can improve over him, but why so down on Vernon? I think the Kid has a lot of potential + he's working with Wake this offseason.

From RotoWorld 2/10/13:

"Dolphins GM Jeff Ireland said DE Olivier Vernon is "going to get much, much better."Vernon, a 2012 third-round pick out of Miami, will spend the offseason working out with and learning pass-rush moves from Cameron Wake. "This is a big offseason for [Vernon], and that's an understatement," Wake said. Vernon registered 3.5 sacks as a nickel rusher as a rookie. He has explosive rush potential."

Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:02 pm

Rich

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

shularino wrote:

Rich, I'm obviously not a part of the Dolphins' Organization. I simply come to this site to get updated info and respectively correspond will fellow Phin Fans.

Oh, because you made it sound as if you had some sort of inside information when you said this:

Quote:

but there are still specific players the team is targeting

To continue your argument of trading up.

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Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:38 am

shularino

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Yes, the Phins are targeting specific players in the draft........I'll go a step further and say every NFL team is targeting specific players in the draft.

The difference this year is the Phins can bundle picks to move up to obtain a targeted player.

Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:33 am

Rich

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

shularino wrote:

Yes, the Phins are targeting specific players in the draft........I'll go a step further and say every NFL team is targeting specific players in the draft.

You don't say...

Quote:

The difference this year is the Phins can bundle picks to move up to obtain a targeted player.

The Phins could have bundled picks and traded up in previous years as well. This is nothing Earth shattering.

They can also decide with the depth of the draft that they are better off putting a well-rounded team for years to come by addressing positions of need with multiple picks since the draft is not top heavy.

It wouldn't make much sense to give up picks to move up for players that are only top 5 or top 10 picks by a negligible margin versus previous drafts when you had obvious superstars available at the top of the draft.

There is no Adrian Peterson, RGIII or Calvin Johnson at the top of this draft.

I think this is a far more likely scenario, especially given Ireland's MO, than to trade up to take a tackle with similar skillset and ability than the next 2 or 3 tackles.

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Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:44 am

shularino

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

Rich wrote:

shularino wrote:

Yes, the Phins are targeting specific players in the draft........I'll go a step further and say every NFL team is targeting specific players in the draft.

You don't say...

That's right.......stating the Phins are targeting specific players is a logical statement, not requiring inside information...........so please don't infer I need to be apart of the Dolphins' Organization to realize this.

Rich wrote:

shularino wrote:

The difference this year is the Phins can bundle picks to move up to obtain a targeted player.

Rich wrote:

The Phins could have bundled picks and traded up in previous years as well. This is nothing Earth shattering.

They can also decide with the depth of the draft that they are better off putting a well-rounded team for years to come by addressing positions of need with multiple picks since the draft is not top heavy.

It wouldn't make much sense to give up picks to move up for players that are only top 5 or top 10 picks by a negligible margin versus previous drafts when you had obvious superstars available at the top of the draft.

There is no Adrian Peterson, RGIII or Calvin Johnson at the top of this draft.

I think this is a far more likely scenario, especially given Ireland's MO, than to trade up to take a tackle with similar skillset and ability than the next 2 or 3 tackles.

OK, you maybe right..........my point is we have more picks than in previous so we have greater leverage to move up to obtain the players we truly want. Particularly, within the first three rounds, I believe the Phins are defining their guys and putting together contingency scenarios to make that happen. If they can do that, while dropping back and collecting more picks.......more power to them. I tend to think it will go the other way.

Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:56 am

Rich

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Re: Do the Dolphins trade up in Round 1?

shularino wrote:

That's right.......stating the Phins are targeting specific players is a logical statement, not requiring inside information...........so please don't infer I need to be apart of the Dolphins' Organization to realize this.

You need to go back and read what I said. Obviously you took it the wrong way.

Rich wrote:

shularino wrote:

The difference this year is the Phins can bundle picks to move up to obtain a targeted player.

Quote:

OK, you maybe right..........my point is we have more picks than in previous so we have greater leverage to move up to obtain the players we truly want.

We have 10 picks, there have been several seasons in which we've had 9 or 10 picks recently. I don't see the big diffeence.

They'll probably want more than the 10 picks they have if they can acquire additional picks in the top 3 rounds, where all the talent is.