Beware, though, that given the immediate hostility in this group, that there are quite a few people who will go apeshit if you show up on the Playa with feathers — even if you did due diligence and made sure they were not going to become MOOP. Nonetheless, that will be an experience unto itself.

Zhust wrote:Beware, though, that given the immediate hostility in this group, that there are quite a few people who will go apeshit if you show up on the Playa with feathers — even if you did due diligence and made sure they were not going to become MOOP. Nonetheless, that will be an experience unto itself.

I know ,I got my leather feathers ,but I think some wont bother looking close and just yell about feathers. Oh well Ill use it as a conversation starter

Zhust wrote:Beware, though, that given the immediate hostility in this group, that there are quite a few people who will go apeshit if you show up on the Playa with feathers — even if you did due diligence and made sure they were not going to become MOOP. Nonetheless, that will be an experience unto itself.

I know ,I got my leather feathers ,but I think some wont bother looking close and just yell about feathers. Oh well Ill use it as a conversation starter

when they get a close up look at your amazing artisanship they're going to eat their words

Zhust wrote:Beware, though, that given the immediate hostility in this group, that there are quite a few people who will go apeshit if you show up on the Playa with feathers — even if you did due diligence and made sure they were not going to become MOOP. Nonetheless, that will be an experience unto itself.

I know ,I got my leather feathers ,but I think some wont bother looking close and just yell about feathers. Oh well Ill use it as a conversation starter

when they get a close up look at your amazing artisanship they're going to eat their words

OMG talk about being angry - maybe consider talking to a proffesional get it all out - so you do not bring this negativity to the playa.I simply pointed out that I have in the past seen outfits with feathers and yes I did find them beautiful.

I have been around, just changed email..

"WE" all have an impact on the nature, ZERO exception, the point is to minimize, yes this is learned by experience from previous years, but lets get it straight we have an impact, nothing is every without trace.

I totally respect the rules and would not bring feathers and actually have never done so. and yes I check BM site for updates and read Jack the rabbit

Sorry i do reuse, recycle and care about the environment, if that qualifies me as a hippie so be it - proud to be called that.I attend for the experience, the people, the art, the atmosphare - not to get "baked"I am sorry to inform "you" guys that the States are not know for great environmental care factor, with just 5 percent of the world’s people, Americans use a quarter of the world’s fossil fuels, own more private cars than drivers with licenses......carbon dioxide emissions right behind China. - are you all walking to the event?I respect the places I go and will do my upmost best to ensure that I obey the rules. Should I make mistakes,(I am human after all) I hope someone will explain to me how to rectify and alter my behaviour and impact, rather then being negative and nasty - so I can learn and hopefully share the knowledge with others.

I must have been fortunate when attending Burningman, the people encountered have been very pro-active in ensure the "no trace" and yes I too have done the early morning walk gathering left behing glow sticks etc.....all part of the adventures of burningman - and will be doing it again this year.

I did not expect so called "burners" to be judgemental - pretty dissapointing really.maybe the right approach would be to explain the damage, provide alternatives, teaching rather then insulting.....you catch more bees with honey

odensecity wrote:OMG talk about being angry - maybe consider talking to a proffesional get it all out - so you do not bring this negativity to the playa.I simply pointed out that I have in the past seen outfits with feathers and yes I did find them beautiful.

You've conveniently ignored the part where you don't "understand" the anger against MOOPy feathers or their ban. That was then followed up with the same type of platitudes as...

"WE" all have an impact on the nature, ZERO exception, the point is to minimize, yes this is learned by experience from previous years, but lets get it straight we have an impact, nothing is every without trace.

...and then some sort of "faith" that people will just do their part to fix things. Then something about made-up "rules" of the playa?

No, accepting "inevitable impact" isn't good enough. What's "inevitable" is that if you bring a bunch of people to a place and don't lay any ground-rules that they're going to assume it's okay to do whatever they want. So we set ground rules to prevent damage. You can't rely on people to just "do the right thing" and even if you could, you reduce your work-load by preventing problems from occurring in the first place.

But then there are those, like the feather-costumed bitch described in the OP, who knowingly and arrogantly flaunt these preventative measures at the expense of everyone else. At the very least, such degenerates are deserving of our ridicule. It'd be better if they were outright banned. So no, we should not simply have "faith" that people are working towards the same goal.

Sorry i do reuse, recycle and care about the environment, if that qualifies me as a hippie so be it - proud to be called that.I attend for the experience, the people, the art, the atmosphare - not to get "baked"

No no no... nobody here was talking about those things being "hippie". Sheesh, where did you come up with that? "Hippie" was with regards to clueless responses to why these kinds of rules are laid down, and the hostility towards those who arrogantly think they don't apply to them, and this naive faith that people will just "do the right thing" as the solution. The world does not work that way.

I am sorry to inform "you" guys that the States are not know for great environmental care factor, with just 5 percent of the world’s people, Americans use a quarter of the world’s fossil fuels, own more private cars than drivers with licenses......carbon dioxide emissions right behind China. - are you all walking to the event?

Totally irrelevant strawman.

I must have been fortunate when attending Burningman, the people encountered have been very pro-active in ensure the "no trace" and yes I too have done the early morning walk gathering left behing glow sticks etc.....all part of the adventures of burningman - and will be doing it again this year.

That's nice. That's not what this is about. The fact that such MOOP was left around in the first place should clue you in that not everyone is working towards the same goal (please don't assume it was all accidental).

I did not expect so called "burners" to be judgemental - pretty dissapointing really.

Pretty naïve more like it. Yes, we will keep standards and pass judgement by them.

maybe the right approach would be to explain the damage, provide alternatives, teaching rather then insulting.....you catch more bees with honey

Or perhaps having people clue themselves in? For example, reading the five pages of this thread that preceded your post to get an idea of where people are coming from? Self-reliance isn't just about what you bring to the playa.

"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

wow!o.k I didnt "understand" the anger about feathers for the simple reason that there are plenty of other things that I personally see having a much higher impact on the site and can create a lot more problems. so in short I would focus on other items with higher environmental impact. I get the feathers have an impact and no, I have never worn any to BM and no I am actually not ugly and happy to bicycle around butt naked for the entire week if this would make people happy.

not clueless to the need for rules - far from it! of cause rules need to be established and naturally they are in place to be upheld - not saying anything different - BUT I have faith in people doing the right thing until proven wrong - Full stop

should i come across some that do not do the right thing, I would pull them over and explain . and YES i do believe they would understand and learn.I am sorry but if you pre-judge and do not have faith that people will follow the rules, seriosly you are not giving people a chance.I think this is extremely negative and unproductive and frankly a waste of time. too negative and too eager to judge.

I'll be the one naked on the bicycle - see you there (with no feathers, picking up glowstick in the morning with a smile on my face)

odensecity wrote:wow!o.k I didnt "understand" the anger about feathers for the simple reason that there are plenty of other things that I personally see having a much higher impact on the site and can create a lot more problems. so in short I would focus on other items with higher environmental impact.

I suppose ripping open bean-bag chairs or a suit of styrofoam peanuts could be worse, but they're all extremely MOOPy. People just seem to think that because feathers are "natural" that they're somehow better.

I get the feathers have an impact and no, I have never worn any to BM and no I am actually not ugly and happy to bicycle around butt naked for the entire week if this would make people happy.

Um, I'm not quite sure what prompted that (though I'm not discouraging you).

"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

odensecity wrote:wow!o.k I didnt "understand" the anger about feathers for the simple reason that there are plenty of other things that I personally see having a much higher impact on the site and can create a lot more problems. so in short I would focus on other items with higher environmental impact. I get the feathers have an impact and no, I have never worn any to BM and no I am actually not ugly and happy to bicycle around butt naked for the entire week if this would make people happy.

not clueless to the need for rules - far from it! of cause rules need to be established and naturally they are in place to be upheld - not saying anything different - BUT I have faith in people doing the right thing until proven wrong - Full stop

A lot of Burners hate feathers on the playa in particular because they become MOOP with no use other than beautifying the ignorant (or purposefully obtuse) wearer. Wearing them says, "I haven't bothered to learn your community's rules", and/or "I don't CARE about your rules, because it's more important that I be pretty."

i.e., what theCrypofishist said.

theCrypofishist wrote:I can tell you about the anger. I think it is just about sinful (and I don't believe in sin) to go shedding tiny bits of material that someone else is going to have to get on his or her knees in the hot sun, to clean up. DPW covers our ass in various ways, and I think it is our duty to be as "pro-active" as possible and not bring "beauty" that's only creating crap.

A person like that might carry that vain and ignorant attitude into more than just feathers, & make a poor campmate or neighbor.

That's why a lot of people hate it.

Hello, by the way.

*** 2013 Survival Guide ***"I must've lost it when I was twerking at the trash fence." -- BBadger

o.k got the message! read all blogs before asking questions. be careful how to ask a question to ensure no misunderstanding - spell check prior to submittingI am not wearing feathers, never have and never will (to the playa)I have every intention of following the rules set by BM and yes I promise to read AND obay every one of them......prior to goingI love burningman and will do everything I personally can to ensure that people (you lot) will get that I am not that horrible or naive not all Euro-trash/ Aussie's are bad - i promise

I do still think a gentle and positive approached would have been nicer......