I have had enough insults and personal messages from stupid little kids here.

I am looking for an electronics chat site where only my peers are there.
No stupid swearing little kids who know nothing about electronics.
Also no foreigners who no speeky zee Engrish. They can speeky in their own language on a website in their own country. I have never and will NEVER go there.

Maybe those stupid little kids and foreigners should have their own website that I will NEVER go to, but a teacher might go to.

We have talked about this extensively in the past and the moderating team stance hasn't changed since then.

AAC is primarily an educational site. Students are supposed and expected to come here asking for help.

AAC is an international site and residents of all countries are welcome. The only spoken language allowed is English, but we won't ask for an IELTS or TOEFL degree in order to register a member. Each does what he can.

AAC protects itself and its members from troublemakers. If you see anyone cursing another member or yourself, please report the post. We can boast that swift elimination of delinquents is our specialty. We protect our members against personal attacks.

Now, about kids being stupid, yeah, that's pretty much true. That's why they 're kids. I 've been there, you 've been there. But we 're not there anymore.

We have talked about this extensively in the past and the moderating team stance hasn't changed since then.

AAC is primarily and educational site. Students are supposed and expected to come here asking for help.

AAC is an international site and residents of all countries are welcome. The only spoken language allowed is English, but we won't ask for an IELTS or TOEFL degree in order to register a member. Each does what he can.

AAC protects itself and its members from troublemakers. If you see anyone cursing another member or yourself, please report the post. We can boast that swift elimination of delinquents is our specialty. We protect our members against personal attacks.

Now, about kids being stupid, yeah, that's pretty much true. That's why they 're kids. I 've been there, you 've been there. But we 're not there anymore.

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Well said Geo.

While said kids may be annoying at times, you must understand that they are still kids. The only time I develop a strong disliking of them is if they demand answers and refuse to try to LEARN the material. In that case, I ignore them. I do not call them stupid. AG, just because they insult you doesn't give you the right to insult them. If you ask me, it is never okay to call a child "stupid". Even if they seem that way in your eyes, it is still better that you do not say it. Try to keep it to yourself.

This forum reaches out to the very people you find "annoying". It is here to help them learn, even if it is the very basics. This forum is NOT only for experts. It's to help kids who don't have any experience with electronics to learn. It's a way of introducing them to the field, and will hopefully send them well on their way to continue to learn themselves. If you are looking for a site where only experts can congregate and just talk, you're in the wrong place.

I can work with intelligent kids who are ignorant on a topic but realize that, and are eager to learn. Especially in person. I love helping out as a volunteer at local science exhibitions and help school robotics teams, etc. Those kids are usually "pre-filtered" for acceptable attitude and aptitude.

I cannot deal with ignorant people (due to intelligence but not cognizant of theory, or those who just don't have the aptitude) who show no respect and demand answers to match their impossible questions, refusing to even fully understand what they are asking. This includes college students who are in EE/CS and hate their classes, expecting The Internet to get them through college.

I'd have finished college in 2 years if the net was around a few decades ago!

This thread is really a "no no" and I fail to see the point of it. Electronics is not a science for the elites, as there is no science for any kind of elites. We should keep an open mind and teach anyone that has an interest about electronics (that includes kids). And anyway, someone that has not an interest in electronics normally wouldn't join this forum, so I really don't see the problem.

My interest about electronics happened when I was a kid. Of course back then I didn't knew about Ohm's Law, but my ability to learn and tinker really shows that electronics is a practical science. It is all about doing! Theories are just that, and in electronics it happens all the time: something that should work in theory doesn't work in practice, and you often see "strange" thinks happening that most textbooks don't even explain. That's how I learned what I know about amplifiers and audio: basically making "stupid" stuff. Electronics in practice is all about trial and error, and a nice subject for a kid (that has a naturally open mind) to learn.

Last, but not least. I agree with Georacer in every respect. I couldn't make a better point concerning AAC. I think he spoke for the most of us.

I keep seeing a lot of what AG is talking about in the homework section. They literally ask "what is the equation" in cases where they don't even understand what the question is asking.

I spend time looking up sites with reference information (which I post) and the thread goes dead after the OP figures out nobody is going to post a one line answer and they will have to actually read something.

As I have said previously, I see this as an offshoot of the present educational system where the electronics students have a fatal allergy to touching anything and want to plug everything into a computer simulation.

learn nothing, fake everything.

There was a famous Star Trek episode where Chekov was explaining how the computer was used to navigate the ship... and the visitor said:

Yes, indeed I've seen it happening. But in most cases I really don't bother answering. I used to state something like "Google is your friend" from time to time, but that was it. However, some kids really want to learn, and I've seen some informed, intelligent questions there.

About computer simulations, well, that's just futile. Real circuit simulation implies having real components on a real breadboard (at least). Circuit simulators don't simulate nasty phenomenons like ground loops, environmental noise and other nasties. They don't tell, for example, that you must have a power ground and a signal ground in audio power amplifiers. For the simulator, one ground is OK. In real life? Disaster! I don't trust simulators. I use them just to confirm that my calculations are right, but never to design something from scratch.

P.S.: That thread you pointed (http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/showthread.php?t=79040) is a real good example of a basic question. Obviously, the configuration will have a gain equal to one. Since you have negative feedback, the output will be driven in a way that V- = V+ (V- approaches V+). Having no voltage divider there, V- = Vout, and therefore Vout = V+. Gv = Vout / V+ = V+ / V+ = 1. Or you can use the generic equation Gv = 1 + (Rf / Ri ) and assume that Ri equals infinity. Since one over infinity is zero, you end up with Gv = 1.

This thread is really a "no no" and I fail to see the point of it. Electronics is not a science for the elites, as there is no science for any kind of elites. We should keep an open mind and teach anyone that has an interest about electronics (that includes kids).

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That remindes me of a cartoon that was posted in my Physics lab. Two old, fat physicists were stuffing their pipes, and was was saying, "I'll say this for us, we never stooped to popularizing science!"

Last, but not least. I agree with Georacer in every respect. I couldn't make a better point concerning AAC. I think he spoke for the most of us.

I would just like to point out that whilst some 'young 'uns' are lazy and unmotivated, there are a lot more who are hard working and are motivated to do things.

Not every kid relies on computers or simulations to do stuff.

I spent last night deriving and using a formula to build a pair of helmholtz coils for some experiments I want to do. They are far too expensive for me to buy, so I sat down with my physics books and found an equation to help. I then sat down with a pencil and paper and did the calculations by hand. I've now found the dimensions and power requirements for the coils.

I know not every kid would do this, but please don't paint every kid or young person with the same brush. :/

Circuit simulators don't simulate nasty phenomenons like ground loops, environmental noise and other nasties. They don't tell, for example, that you must have a power ground and a signal ground in audio power amplifiers.

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Simulators can do all that. It's just a matter of how accurate a model you want to make. The more effort, the better the simulation. It's a tool: it can be used or misused.

I think most of you and even AG missed his first line in the original post.

The simple solution is, if you don't recognize the PM as being from some one you KNOW you want to talk to, don't read it - just delete it!

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I thought he meant "personal messages". In the PM case, yeah, spam is unnerving. But I receive much more spam in my regular mail than in AAC, to be honest.

A general rule I use is that I don't take a second look once I have decided a message is spam.

Another known rule I find very useful daily is the following.Don't argue with a fool. You 'll need to go down to his level to communicate and then he 'll beat you by experience.Some thick-heads just aren't worth the time.

And many may not be kids at all. Unless someone confirms I'm x years old. Or gives cluees like I just got my DL or I can finally legally drink we have no idea how old these people are. Like that Te'o guy, may be the man behind the KB is a 54 year old fat guy.

Never came across to many insults here on AAC, but I think the reason behind Audioguru's rant is very real, I'm afraid. However, the door swings both sides, and I can't personally remember a moment I saw Audioguru not being blunt or sarcastic. I'm not saying that he deserved that. I'm just saying that the answers one might get are justified it one provokes that, however only to some extent.

AG is a grumpy man. He probably deserves some of what he gets. That said, I learn a ton reading his posts.

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Indeed! He would be more helpful if he wasn't so grumpy. I say that because he obvious knows his stuff and proved to have a large experience in electronics. It is a shame, really. But well, I think I've had enough arguing with him and to no avail.