So I've read and been told that no one should make any major life decisions within 3-4 weeks of leaving Burning Man. Seems prudent considering how disorienting, life-changing, and downright invigorating an experience it can be. But, sometimes you just know something. This year, after my second Burning Man (virgin 2010, wannabe since 2000) I told my wife of 12 years (and partner of 17 years) that our marriage was over. Our crew left BM Sunday morning before the Temple Burn to avoid exodus traffic. My wife had planned on coming to Burning Man, but did not (more on that later). She and I had "the conversation" Monday morning, Labor Day when many of you were still in BRC. So much for the 3-4 week wait... I met with a lawyer the next week, filed papers, and have been living in my own place for about a week-picked up the keys from the rental agent Oct. 1. It's been 40 days since the night I met my true love and I've never been happier. You see, I met a woman at Burning Man and we spent three hours together on Thursday night at Fandango bar. I fell in love with her in about an hour and then we "broke up" at about hour two when I told her about my (unhappily) wedded status. At about hour three, I left her to spend the night alone in her cold tent while I went back to mine. I woke up the next day knowing I had to spend the rest of my life with her. I texted a friend back in the default world exactly that notion (even though the idea of contact with the outside world doesn't seem right at BM-but he texted me first). I did not see or speak to my true love for the rest of the Burn. I searched for her, hung out at her camp, I left her a note, I gifted a book to her camp with my information in it hoping she might find it, yet left that Sunday morning not sure if I'd ever hear from her again (the note I had left at her camp was still there, unread-I checked). I did know absolutely to my core that my marriage was over-for many reasons, most having nothing to do with my newly found love. Talk about "Rites of Passage!" Great theme, Larry! And just so you all know, I have never really believed in "love at first sight" or in the type of romantic situations in movies where some poor sap finds his or her "soul-mate." I actually don't like that word soul-mate at all-overused and trite. Of course, I don't recommend any of this to anyone else, and have been hesitant to write about it for a variety of reasons (Legal-divorce is not final for a minimum 6 months from date of filing and if my soon-to-be ex-wife found out about this it could create some difficulties; Practical-who cares about someone else's trauma and drama?; and Selfish-I just wanted to keep this to myself because it's so new and makes me feel so amazing). However, I feel compelled to document this life-affirming story. I want to bear witness to what can happen when a person opens their heart to possibilities and is completely devoid of agenda. I stole this saying but use it profusely: "Being open to outcome, but not attached to an outcome." To me, that quote is all about being present in the moment, appreciating the beauty and truth that exists in the universe, and being truly open to seeing that truth and beauty without pushing one's own agenda. The other reason relates to how this love sprang from so much of what Burning Man is all about. And it's not that we just happened to both be at Burning Man, it's what Burning Man meant to both of us that allowed us to be in a place (and I'm not talking about a physical space)to meet one another. We live 3000 miles apart, separated by all of the continental US, but we email, talk, and text daily, sometimes hourly. We spent 25 hours together in San Francisco in mid-September when she was in town for business while I was there for a convention (happenstance or destiny?). I'm flying to the East Coast this Friday to spend the weekend with her. We get 58 more hours together, doubling up on our previous 28 hours. After that, we're not exactly sure how it will work out, but we both know it will, somehow. I'm sure we'll be getting married at Burning Man. Not sure if it can be 2012, but hey, life's short...so who knows? Details will follow someday soon-as time permits.

Toothfulwon wrote:(Legal-divorce is not final for a minimum 6 months from date of filing and if my soon-to-be ex-wife found out about this it could create some difficulties;... However, I feel compelled to document this life-affirming story.

I dunno. Journaling seems safer. I"m not a lawyer, but this does seem fraught.

*shrug*

The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

Congratulations on getting through the first steps on some big decisions, and your newfound happiness. I think Crytpto's right, you may want to share these thoughts and feelings in a journal (or just write it up in your word processor), at least for now. Then you could consider posting and sharing them afterwards. Regardless of what you do, good luck!

You know, I guess I am. Old and Jaded. I guess it's just that I am still living in the era of "till death do us part", and I always find it troubling how many people treat relationships so frivolously. (But then, I also longingly remember the time when people left town to have a baby if they got pregnant and weren't married, not try to get pregnant to get on a TV reality show.)

junglesmacks wrote:Jaded much, JK? Why the sourpuss?

JKhttp://www.mudskippercafe.comWhen I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle.Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me

For the better, I say. Till death do us part used to mean being socially trapped in a miserable relationship that you wanted to chew your own arm off to escape. Talk about destructive to all involved.. yikes. Thankfully, society woke up a bit a realized that life is just too damn short to be miserable. Seize the day because dammit, if you don't.. who else will?

Well, depends on who you meet, and if you're willing to work things out rather than abandon a relationship if trouble happens. Most people don't divorce their families if only because it's not as easy as from a spouse, but most work out those problems even if many are much the same as a marriage (except maybe performance in bed... for some).

Unfortunately, as is a sad pattern in peoples' entire lives (finances, relationships, loans, college degrees, etc.), many people don't think in long terms, and jump into things like marriage without really knowing who they're with. The same thing with divorce too: what should be a temporary problem escalates into a full-on divorce.

So maybe you're right, most people shouldn't get married, ever.

"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

No, it meant making a commitment and then keeping that commitment by doing what was necessary to work through the problems and the bumps in the road rather than running away from them. Today, everybody takes the easy way out. Marriage and commitment takes work and time if it is to grow. Don't take the time to nurture the relationship, it will die like a plant that you forget to water.

If you're not mature enough to understand what it means to make a life-long commitment, as was just said, you shouldn't get married to begin with.

Oh, and let's not forget the children.

junglesmacks wrote:The times have changed, this is for sure.

For the better, I say. Till death do us part used to mean being socially trapped in a miserable relationship that you wanted to chew your own arm off to escape. Talk about destructive to all involved.. yikes. Thankfully, society woke up a bit a realized that life is just too damn short to be miserable. Seize the day because dammit, if you don't.. who else will?

JKhttp://www.mudskippercafe.comWhen I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle.Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me

I'm 110% with you on the not getting married when you shouldn't part. There's a reason why at age 36 I never have been and may never be: I don't want to. I don't need a piece of paper to have a commitment and personally feel like it's an antiquated process.

junglesmacks wrote:I'm 110% with you on the not getting married when you shouldn't part. There's a reason why at age 36 I never have been and may never be: I don't want to. I don't need a piece of paper to have a commitment and personally feel like it's an antiquated process.

That's just me. To each their own.

And yet some are involved in a battle for the right to get married, antiquated a process as it might be. But my problem isn't with "marriage" per se, it is with "commitment" and the social contract made with that commitment. (or lack of a contract)

JKhttp://www.mudskippercafe.comWhen I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle.Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me

I wouldn't call it antiquated. The expectations to be married may be antiquated, and the conditions that people feel require marriage are often antiquated, but as an institution I still think marriage is transcendent and ultimately beneficial should there be a meaningful marriage.

You are right that many reasons for marriage are antiquated, however. A major unfortunate reason from antiquity is that people get married for "pragmatic" reasons. To many people, marriage just becomes some decision that stems from something like "oh, well, we're living and sleeping with each other, we might as well be married." Little do they stop and think that, in today's society, you don't need marriage for that.

If people want to get married, they should do it for more fundamental reasons. Marriage should be seen as an opportunity to lock in a relationship with someone lest you lose your chance. It's that one fish in the sea that you'll never find again, and regret its loss ever after.

If you don't find that fish, keep fishing. Too bad people don't.

"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

jkisha wrote:You know, I guess I am. Old and Jaded. I guess it's just that I am still living in the era of "till death do us part", and I always find it troubling how many people treat relationships so frivolously. (But then, I also longingly remember the time when people left town to have a baby if they got pregnant and weren't married, not try to get pregnant to get on a TV reality show.)

+1000

Everything in our society has become disposable, and relationships have become disposable too. But as you also point out - those that use children as a commodity are quite frankly more disturbing to me.

To the OP - I hope this all works out for you, and agree that you should probably not be saying this stuff publicly until after the dust settles.

Savannah: I don't know what it is, but no thread here escapes alive. You'll get 1 or 2 real answers at minimum, occasionally 10 or 12, and then we flog it until it's unrecognizable and you can't get your deposit back.

Mountain man John Bridger (the first white man to see the Yellowstone Valley) left behind a wife and three children. Abandonment was not unheard of in the 19th century. I understand your dissappointment in this divorce, I actually feel it, too. But I find that marraige is often a procrustian bed that we distort ourselves to fit into. Plus, I have a social history streak that likes to pick apart our assumptions about and nostalgia for an imagined past.

The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

Burning man certaining offers to us a lot of temptations. The nights are dark and colourful, loud and quite at the same time. We connect with people we rarely know and sometimes we walk away from people we have always known.Its very hard as a human to not give into the moment and temptations.

As I am fairly young and in a modern marriage as opposed to many here... Here's what I feel. It goes without saying that I met many interesting people at Burning man, I was even attracted to couple. We had great chemistry and fire. And during that week, I felt really far away from my husband (even though he was with me and not because of any fault of his). Temptations were thrown at me and in a place like that it was very EASY to be disappointed with our spouses for what "they are not" (compared to others). But as I think about it, he was himself!! That's the most assuring thing... to know that nothing around him, even a place like burning man, changed his basic principles. I know that no matter who I married, there will be a day when I will be unhappy about somethings and find faults. No matter who I marry! Thats human nature. But today, sitting here, I realize that I married a great human, a stable man who will always be there for me, love me and do everything in his means to make me happy (even if that means he has to go to burning man again). It is very easy for me to find faults in marriage and its hard to keep a love when its so easy to throw away. Burning man was a challenge for my marriage, but it also really made me reflect on my own faults. This experience has inspired me to work on my relationship with my husband. I had forgotten that I need to nuture my marriage.

I dont mean to be discouraging. But if there is no domestic violence and your ex loves and respects you for who you are... I say, you were VERY lucky!

theCryptofishist wrote:Mountain man John Bridger (the first white man to see the Yellowstone Valley) left behind a wife and three children. Abandonment was not unheard of in the 19th century. I understand your dissappointment in this divorce, I actually feel it, too. But I find that marriage is often a procrustian bed that we distort ourselves to fit into. Plus, I have a social history streak that likes to pick apart our assumptions about and nostalgia for an imagined past.

This. Exactly this. And it really is not worth it.

Too many people marry partners who are almost perfect and spend the rest of the marriage trying to "fix" the other person. "If only s/he would [insert desired change] everything would be fine..." No, actually, it would not.

Other folks insist on clinging to a static perception of their partner. But people grow and change all the time (if they survive) and may find it harder and harder to fit the false image that their partner is wedded to.

Folks who jump out of that procrustian bed and run for their lives get plenty of sympathy from me.

"Burning Man ruined my life as I knew it, and I have never been happier." -mgb327

theCryptofishist wrote:Mountain man John Bridger (the first white man to see the Yellowstone Valley) left behind a wife and three children. Abandonment was not unheard of in the 19th century. I understand your dissappointment in this divorce, I actually feel it, too. But I find that marraige is often a procrustian bed that we distort ourselves to fit into. Plus, I have a social history streak that likes to pick apart our assumptions about and nostalgia for an imagined past.

theCryptofishist wrote:Mountain man John Bridger (the first white man to see the Yellowstone Valley) left behind a wife and three children. Abandonment was not unheard of in the 19th century. I understand your dissappointment in this divorce, I actually feel it, too. But I find that marraige is often a procrustian bed that we distort ourselves to fit into. Plus, I have a social history streak that likes to pick apart our assumptions about and nostalgia for an imagined past.

Buddha and Moses both dumped the wife and kids..

Ya? Well then I guess they're not the great roll models they're cracked up to be!

JKhttp://www.mudskippercafe.comWhen I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle.Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me