So to you guys that follow baseball a LOT closer than I do, not that that takes much, give me a some players that you think we will pursue this offseason. In this scenario I am assuming that we won't get Harper or Machado. The $$$$$ these guys will draw seems like it is something outside of the purview of how the Cardinals normally get FA players.

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I just feel like the Phillies make too much sense for Harper. The only way the Phillies wont be the top bidder is if someone goes to a price they simply don't want to match.

Their middle infield is a log jam of prospects and unless Machado wasnt serious about playing SS and just wanted to increase his value, then he's probably option B.

Kind of hope the Cubs make a play for Cesar Hernandez. He sounded like he was expecting a trade and the Phillies gave Kingery a 6 year deal who is playing SS but is really a 2B. With Russell likely done as a Cub, Hernandez would fill the void at 2B and leadoff.

I just feel like the Phillies make too much sense for Harper. The only way the Phillies wont be the top bidder is if someone goes to a price they simply don't want to match.

Their middle infield is a log jam of prospects and unless Machado wasnt serious about playing SS and just wanted to increase his value, then he's probably option B.

Kind of hope the Cubs make a play for Cesar Hernandez. He sounded like he was expecting a trade and the Phillies gave Kingery a 6 year deal who is playing SS but is really a 2B. With Russell likely done as a Cub, Hernandez would fill the void at 2B and leadoff.

and your probably right. Philly is the consensus favorite. But, as I said the Cardinals can easily afford to increase their payroll $20 million a year. The issue for us is the owners and FO reluctance to get out of their comfort zone. To take a leap of faith. They are very risk adverse.

Your other hope could be that the Phillies wait for hometown boy Mike Trout in FA and pass on spending big this year, because it was honestly blind luck that team won 80 games.

They only have 2 quality starters, only 1 hitter that managed a .800 OPS with only 3 hitters in total grading out above average, with a fairly weak bullpen. They may opt to wait for guys like Sixto to be ready for the majors. But then again that would mean they pissed away $75M for Arrieta so I doubt that's their plan.

It won't happen, but I agree go big and give it a shot. It is the one upside bat that makes the most sense. I would be okay with an infield of Gyorko/DeJong/Wong/Carp with Ozuna/Bader/Harper and ONeill as the 4th outfielder. It doesn't make sense to keep Fowler if you actually somehow pull off this signing.

My thinking......

Pay whatever it takes to land Harper

Trade Carlos Martinez, Jose Matinez and Gyrko to Oakland for Chapman

Or Trade Carlos Martinez and "others" in a package for one of ATL's two 3B.

If the NL trade happens, trade Jose Martinez to the AL for some solid lefty middle relief help.

Trade Fowler for whatever prospect or bullpen help you can get. Pay his salary as a performance sliding scale. May cost you the whole $50 million but you have to move on. O'neill is the 4th OF.

Carp
New 3B
Harper
Ozuna
DeJong
Molina
Wong
Bader
P

Munoz is your super utility player. Hicks is your closer

We have strong pitching in the playoffs in Flaherty and Mikolas. Maybe bring Reyes along slow so he can start late in the season and into the playoffs. Or if that doesn't work, we will need someone else to step up their pitching.

Or Trade Carlos Martinez and "others" in a package for one of ATL's two 3B.

If the NL trade happens, trade Jose Martinez to the AL for some solid lefty middle relief help.

Trade Fowler for whatever prospect or bullpen help you can get. Pay his salary as a performance sliding scale. May cost you the whole $50 million but you have to move on. O'neill is the 4th OF.

Carp
New 3B
Harper
Ozuna
DeJong
Molina
Wong
Bader
P

Munoz is your super utility player. Hicks is your closer

We have strong pitching in the playoffs in Flaherty and Mikolas. Maybe bring Reyes along slow so he can start late in the season and into the playoffs. Or if that doesn't work, we will need someone else to step up their pitching.

Chapman would be a nice addition, however I see no reason why Oakland would deal him. Carlos I think took a big hit in value by not returning as a starter. He will still generate interest, I'm just not sure it will be as much as it would have been had he returned to form as a starter this year.

The A's have K. Davis as their DH why would they want Jose?

If you are fortunate enough to add Harper, I wouldn't deplete strengths to fill perceived needs at 3B when we have two intriguing prospects to consider in 2-3 years.

I keep C. Martinez, especially if you are going after Harper. Unless you know he has blown out his arm completely, you can't get a starter of his quality for the 11 million per year we will be paying him for the next three years. Think about that, we paid more per year for Greg ****ing Holland!

Or Trade Carlos Martinez and "others" in a package for one of ATL's two 3B.

If the NL trade happens, trade Jose Martinez to the AL for some solid lefty middle relief help.

Trade Fowler for whatever prospect or bullpen help you can get. Pay his salary as a performance sliding scale. May cost you the whole $50 million but you have to move on. O'neill is the 4th OF.

Carp
New 3B
Harper
Ozuna
DeJong
Molina
Wong
Bader
P

Munoz is your super utility player. Hicks is your closer

We have strong pitching in the playoffs in Flaherty and Mikolas. Maybe bring Reyes along slow so he can start late in the season and into the playoffs. Or if that doesn't work, we will need someone else to step up their pitching.

Why would the A’s trade Matt Chapman when he has five years of control left and looks like a perennial Gold Glove winner, coming off a season where he was the best defender in baseball and also posted an .864 OPs? He was worth 8 rWAR this year. Especially considering Carlos Martinez is pricy (for the A’s) and inconsistent and the other pieces you’re offering there are just filler/roster garbage.

Makes no sense.

I don’t see Harper to St. Louis happening. Ultimately, Mozeliak will chicken out at the terms and length of the deal.

The Cardinals will add Josh Donaldson, I think, and otherwise sit basically right if he rebounds to form, that could even be the boost they needed to be a playoff team again.

Mozeliak missed badly on not paying a little more for Yelich vs Ozuna, though. Going to feel that one for a while. He could have been part of a really dynamic 1-2 punch.

Why would the A’s trade Matt Chapman when he has five years of control left and looks like a perennial Gold Glove winner, coming off a season where he was the best defender in baseball and also posted an .864 OPs? He was worth 8 rWAR this year. Especially considering Carlos Martinez is pricy (for the A’s) and inconsistent and the other pieces you’re offering there are just filler/roster garbage.

Makes no sense.

I don’t see Harper to St. Louis happening. Ultimately, Mozeliak will chicken out at the terms and length of the deal.

The Cardinals will add Josh Donaldson, I think, and otherwise sit basically right if he rebounds to form, that could even be the boost they needed to be a playoff team again.

Mozeliak missed badly on not paying a little more for Yelich vs Ozuna, though. Going to feel that one for a while. He could have been part of a really dynamic 1-2 punch.

Instead of back loading contracts (like Pujols) they should front load guys like Harper. Pay him 40 million up front for the first five years, give an opt out and a decreasing scale for another 5 years that gets him to 350+.

Instead of back loading contracts (like Pujols) they should front load guys like Harper. Pay him 40 million up front for the first five years, give an opt out and a decreasing scale for another 5 years that gets him to 350+.

I dont think $40M is a big enough "front load" to make a difference. He'll still be owed 150-200M after those 5 years and that's still too much money. There's likely no difference in his decision to opt out.

I dont think $40M is a big enough "front load" to make a difference. He'll still be owed 150-200M after those 5 years and that's still too much money. There's likely no difference in his decision to opt out.

Maybe, honestly I'm okay going bigger than that on the front end. He is what 31 after a huge front loaded deal, barring a "Heyward" he's likely going to want another chance at a payday, or just trying to win, if it didn't work here.

Pay the man if he gives you a chance. We don't have anyone in the top 35 in salary. After Molina and Wainright (who drops off this year) we don't have anyone in the top 100.