There are many things I should be doing right now, but I feel compelled to write some integral learning points from an interview last week involving Russell Brand and news anchors on the MSNBC show ‘Morning Joe’.

As you may have noticed, I’m adrenalised by all things human-dynamics, and nowhere are they more at play than in live interviews where anything can happen.

In this interview where Russell is looking to promote his upcoming US tour, we see Mika Brzezinski and panelist Brian Schactman continuously (consciously or unconsciously) attempt to belittle, trivialize and distract Brand with inane comments about his accent, clothes and general demeanour.

As a fellow Brit who does a fair number of interviews on TV here in the US, this is a subject that’s close to home as I’m often having to navigate my way through the etiquette of these kinds of shows, while trying to maintain the standards I’ve come to expect in life.
In this interview, the dynamic certainly wasn’t inline with what Russell has come to expect, and what ensues is a series of social blunders on behalf of the MSNBC staff which result in themselves and Russell clashing heads throughout the interview.

I have a couple of quick things I want to point out to you about this interview, which are best read once you’ve watched the clip.

I’ve distilled my points into six general principles that you can take to the social interactions in your life.

This situation is simply a microcosm for what we go through in our social lives, and the lessons to be learnt here are just as appropriate for use in our love life encounters…

1. Always be prepared to take things in the direction YOU want them to go in

Although Russell is there ‘to be interviewed’, he’s very much in control of the direction of the conversation.

When he sees it’s not going in the direction he wants, he simply changes the subject to one that suits him. The British lady in the interview attempts to put him on the spot by saying, “Can’t we get thirty seconds (of your routine)…now?”.

This is the equivalent of someone finding out you can sing and saying, “Well sing then…”. He doesn’t bother to entertain the notion, as this would immediately put him into ‘dancing monkey mode’.

Another great moment comes when panelist Brian is beginning a new question, and Russell unapologetically turns around and diverts everyone’s attention to the staff in the background on their computers.

He derails Brian’s train of thought and immediately brings the three anchors (and the viewing audience) into his world. Even though he is one against three, he is controlling the frame.

2. Answer the question YOU wanted to be asked

Clearly the motive for Russell’s appearance on the morning show is to promote his tour.

The hosts don’t make it easy for him as they ask superficial questions and create a very confused and pointless interview.

Russell takes back power by saying what he came on to say regardless: “Let me help you. I’m here to promote a tour called Messiah Complex… I want the people of America to come and see me do stand up. Go to RussellBrand.tv to purchase tickets to see me.”

It’s refreshing to see someone take control in this way, and it’s something we can all take on board in our every day conversations.

Always remember that when you have great things to say, you don’t need permission from somebody to say them, and you certainly don’t have to wait to be asked the right question before you can get to the answer.

3. Give no energy to attempts to belittle or patronize you

Brian says to Russell, “I’m going to ask a serious question”, to which Mika says, “Try, it’s never going to work”.

This type of belittling is what people are compelled to do when feeling insecure about a situation.

People get into a kind of mob mentality where their purpose is to bring the other person down. It’s clear by this point that the hosts are threatened by the unexpected intelligence of Brand, and these types of jabs are the result.

Instead of responding to the bait, Russell instead answers the question thoughtfully and shows how misguided their stereotyping of him is.

4. Don’t be afraid to break rapport when people aren’t meeting your standards

The need to maintain rapport constantly to the detriment of our own self-respect is one of the greatest barriers to our social prowess.

In the interview the anchors keep referring to Russell in the third person as if he’s not there. Mika says, “I think it’s just experiencing HIM, it’s taking it all in.”

Between the two women on the show, they manage to do this several times to which his replies are:

“You are talking about me as if I’m not here, and I’m an extra terrestrial.”
“You shouldn’t say ‘he’ when a person is present, you should refer to the person by their name.”
“Stop saying ‘he’. I’m present… ‘Russell’. What’s wrong with your manners?”

I love seeing someone maintain the standard they have from others, especially in a public forum where the temptation is to stay in rapport and avoid confrontation.

It’s interesting to note that when people are called out like this, very often things don’t result in confrontation, but rather just discomfort on their behalf.

When Russell says these things, rather than see confrontation, what we see are shallow attempts to get back in his favour. In short, the anchors start working to win HIM over.

Had he allowed these sub-standards to continue, he would never have gotten their respect in the same way.

In doing so they realized he had teeth (albeit that he was able to show them in an elegant and classy manner).

5. When in doubt, put the attention back on the other person

One of the most evident moments where the power shifts is when Russell starts putting the attention on Mika personally:

“You’ve become nervous… Why are you nervous?” “What seems to be the trouble?”

This immediately puts her on the back foot and takes her attention away from him and back onto herself.

When looking to build attraction, this can be done by complimenting someone, making a playful analysis of something they are doing, or asking a question about an aspect of someone’s behaviour that intrigues you.

When Russell says “Don’t be nervous”, he’s actually elevating his status to that of the leader; the person who is nurturing the anchor out of her own state of insecurity.

By this point in the interview, the positions of power are palpable.

6. Don’t be offended by people’s initial interpretation of you

Clearly these people didn’t expect Russell to be as sharp as he is.

If they’d paid more attention to his personality instead of his exterior they might have come better prepared.

We are all used to being judged wrongly in some way, whether it’s by the way we look, the accent we have, the place we are from, or the gender we belong to.

I would argue that as frustrating as people’s ignorant perceptions can be, we should take a minute to celebrate this, as it’s the thing that will allow us to fly completely under people’s radar and surprise them.

When you’re a 7-foot tall grizzly bear, everyone sees you coming. But a cute little dart frog sneaks in unnoticed, and unless someone told you it has enough poison to kill between 10-20 people in one sitting, you’d still be more afraid of the bear.

If those around you want to underestimate you, let them.

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Russell was right, the other people in the room did have an underlying nervousness, that they probably carried around with them all the time as a (potentially changeable) aspect of their personalities. This contrasted strongly with his essential peacefulness and calmness.
I am reminded of how Cesar Millan, on his shows, will constantly point out to people their nervousnesses which affect their dogs, and will attempt to lead them to a place of calm assertiveness (and their dogs to a place of calm submissiveness.) Their anxiousness shows by contrast, Cesar’s calmness.
Cesar Millan and Russell Brand have a lot in common, imo; which could explain why Russell Brand’s dog was so calm and well behaved on Johnathan Ross.

Been on courses about confrontation & picked up tips about dealing with difficult situations. But this is the same in practice & more! Invaluable pointing out the positives of being ‘under the radar’. Go through this on daily basis. So frustrating. End up being negative, go into ‘soap box’ mode, then back to square one. Just didn’t know how to deal with or approach it. Liberating. :)

Hi Matthew. I love how, you higlight in all of your writings, the importance of standards and quality. People waste too much time mulling over the wrong arguments, incidents and experiences. Instead, striving better quality amd increasing your standards in life is important. This formula has helped me go through some of the hardest times in my life. However, at the end of the day, I have myself amd I must enrich her.

I totally agree with this! It’s amazing how few people are talking about standards nowadays. Thanks to Matt for doing it. We need to be encouraged as much as possible to have our own standards and not let them be taken away by anyone.

This is a brilliant analysis.
Some good advice at the end too.
Except
Not everyone is gifted with the same sharp wit as Russell Brand.
And all they can rely on for respect are those exteriors.
And it’s just sad.

Excellent stuff, thanks for sharing. I’m a long time fan of Brand’s and love the way he runs the conversation seemingly effortlessly. These people obviously didn’t make the effort to look him up and figure out the kind of personality (wit, and intelligence) he has, and he called them on it (albeit in a humorous way).

I go through this on a daily basis since I’ve moved to another country. Stereotypes, frustrating labels are all too common. It’s brilliant how Russel is so quick on his feet…so in control of the situation. I sincerely admire his wit. I do wonder however if confrontation would occur if it was a social scene and not an interview. I find there to be a thin line between demanding people to meet our standards and confrontation. Thank you Mathew for all your insight. This video and your insight dealt with issues I have thought about for years, yet never heard anyone address directly, except maybe Dostoevsky, only that didn’t answer the predicament…I have learnt soo much from your videos and advice…it has literally changed my life. :)

Thanks for this excellent distillation on the genius of Russell Brand – it really is time everyone stops being surprised by how intelligent, aware and articulate he is. Shocked that those news anchors had absolutely no idea how to respond to his comments on Edward Snowden and Bradley Manning… or even a glimmer of knowledge on these topics – and went back to blatantly objectifying him with comments on his appearance. Their lack of courtesy and total ignorance of even basic information about current affairs was a glaring juxtaposition with his informed gentlemanly approach, and I LOVE how he called them on being superficial and unable to engage with what he was actually saying. Excellent articulation of how to deal with people trying to cut you down. Brilliant.

Matt! Not sure what the chances of you actually replying to this are but I’ll take a shot! I have a phone interview on Sunday for a position I’m really really dying to get! It’s a phones interview because it’s in another city which makes it a little more challenging because they’ll solely go on what I say and how I sound! Any good pointers? I loved this by the way but how could I apply it to my job interview? I obviously don’t want to sound desperate! I know it’s not dating advice I’m asking for but this is equally important to me! I would really appreciate your advice!!! Love,

Oh my!!! How utterly rude were the anchor guys when talking to Russell Brand. I can’t say lv ever been a fan of his but l had to admire him for standing his ground when faced with such obvious bating – I loved it when he said ‘is this your job, is this what you do’. Their arrogance is shameful.

What an amasing interview,
I love how Russell gained control of the situation, the interviewers used calling Russell he as a weapon to show that im making it obvious your an outsider your not part of the group dinamic, stay in your place we are in control as you are he over there!. Russel picked up on that by saying its like you consider me an alien!
Very clever stuff, just amased at how russell turned the tables on the women in blue.
Your opening up a whole new world to me Mr Hussey, Thankyou for helping me and many people like me break out of our self made prisons! Finally someone who gives you the key and not someone who dangles it in front of you!
Becoming a big fan thankyou x

As a journalist/TV show host and a Brit living in Canada, I am not sure which aspect offends me most in the interview. The anchor’s conduct, or their inability to not underestimate their guest. These are huge “no nos”.

To me, the last line of your article is what counts and the video just supports that idea. In my experience, I have learned to never underestimate anyone I interview or have any expectations of what they are like. You can have the most powerful interviews with someone promoting an indie film, a self-published book or even when you chat with someone on the street. You can also interview notably prolific actors, thinkers, musicians and discover they can be quite uninteractive in interviews.

I look quite young for my age and used to be offended when people would underestimate me but now I consider it a huge gift. When someone underestimates you, you automatically gain the power in that interaction. Generally speaking, it does surprise me that women underestimate me more then men and I wonder what the reasoning behind that might be.

I loved knowing what was coming in this interview. As soon as the interview started and the one journalist was diminishing Russell, I thought “this is gonna be good. Never underestimate a Brit!” ;)

Love the video, because he just put some that ancors on the right place….its not bad manners saying he…but ignoring and making fun of him…when he want to promote his work…its rude!so, i like the way he turns things around! :) great video!

Find it bizarre that he forbids them to use a pronoun instead of his name. Seriously?? I’m British New Zealander and I’ve never heard of that as being bad manners. Why does he think that? IS it cultural? Do you hold the same standard Matthew? I never heard of it is all. And using the third person to talk about another participant in the conversation is quite a common occurrence when there are more than two of you. And using someone’s name every time rather than a pronoun is repetitive and weird. I wonder what my linguistics professor would say…

I kind of think he was just a bit ticked off by that point and it was another thing for him to use to take control, even though he shouldn’t have taken something like that so seriously. In my opinion.

Other than that I think it’s really great how he refused to let them misrepresent him to America.

Great tips top. I especially like the one about putting the person’s attention back on their self by complimenting them etc. =)

Mika Brzezinksi is well known as being unwatchable because of her snooty attitude and ill-informed (dare I say deceitful) rhetoric. That being said, I’m not a huge fan of Mr. Brand either, and there’s a reason he went to promote his comedy tour on a very “progressive” television network. I’m frankly surprised that anybody watched the show in the first place to be able to record this “interview”.

Thanks for the insight on this. I found it very useful. Answer the question you want to ask. That’s just genius.

well russell is definitely extremely intelligent, and much more so than those 3 anchors… but he can also be extremely manipulative in a negative way (ive seen his lives shows in LA) and given his history with women, drugs, alcohol, and sex addiction… there’s definitely a certain machiavellian evil streak running through him.
he wouldn’t know what to do if all the attention wasn’t on him ;)

that being said… TV anchors are almost always morons. almost schocking really. which is why i never watch shows like this in general.

however, matthew’s extrapolation and analysis of the interview is the MOST brilliant thing about this whole thing :)

The anchors were rude to Russell, for sure. Especially with the opening comment. Sometimes it almost seemed like they were trying to lighten up/be funny, but couldn’t quite pull it off without being demeaning.

I don’t think Russell is totally in the clear either though. The last comment from him, about being a shaft grasper, etc. was uncalled for, in my opinion. (I also didn’t particularly like the “I have instincts” interaction). I realize they were commenting on his clothes, etc. at points, but I still don’t think he needed to go there.

“Im just taking it all in” “The Brand experience”
“Thank you for your casual objectification” haha.
Could these anchors be more rude? Treating him like a circus act. A monkey in the room to be talked about and a foreigners whos accent you cant really understand and therefore everything he says becoms invalid just cause it’s sounds funny. What disgusting behaviour. Cudos to Russel Brand for handling it so well, totally pointing holes in their little superficial bubbles.

It was fantastic how Russell turned this interview into something entertaining, memorable and despite them put out his message that he is intelligent and his show is worth seeing.
Matthew you took the interview and turned it into a amazing tool for building skills in public speaking and self confidence.

Wow Matt, thanks for this, such an interesting dissection of this very intense interview. I know this is meant as dating advice, but as a major donor fundraiser, I’m actually going to be cheeky and steal this for my work. Thanks so much, you are excellent.

Great and charming guy Russel! He is real and clever, nice analyses very useful especially about the kind of mob mentally. This happens to me very often and you showed me a nice, elegant way to deal with it in style.
Many thanks for that Matt!!

I so agree! Your last interview with Hoda & Kathie Lee was…well, a mess. They interrupted you every time you spoke, KL was flirting with you – it was just sloppy behavior I’d expect at break time, off camera, not on. When someone commented on this, you replied, “All in good fun.”

I just loved how Brand takes over and shows them how an anchor should report the news! Basically, demonstrating how to do their job. Hilarious! I have so much respect for Russell Brand now. This is the second interview of his that I have seen and he is incredibly intelligent and witty!

Matt, thank you for your insight on this. I love all of your views on dating and how to conduct ourselves in social situations.

Loved it, he is so clever, bet they don’t invite him back for a while :) Hadn’t seen this before Matt, thanks for posting it, and giving your insight into how Russel handled the situation. very useful, and I know just the person, a colleague ! who has a habit of belittling to use this on !

Awesome article today Matt. This goes far beyond getting any guy and into the realm of truly owning your self-worth.

I run a business and I am always amazed how people assume because I’m a graphic designer by trade that I must be a flighty, artistic type and that I must play with crayons and finger paints all day long.

If you just sit back and watch the interview, it really is quite a powerful crash course showcasing Russell’s intelligence. I think not only did he point out the ridiculousness and rudeness of the anchors’ behavior but also how the way American news media today really don’t report what is most important to our society. It’s amazing how many of my fellow Americans do not know about Snowden and Manning. Our feeedom is such an illusion today; yet it takes a comedian and foreigner to utter the names of these two American patriots on the news. Check out the difference between CNN international edition and CNN American edition and you’ll realize why we Americans are getting dumber.

Anyway, rant aside – thank you for taking the time to thoughtfully break down the social interaction here Matt. Another great post!

You can see from the get go Russell’s face when the anchor in the blue dress says, She never heard of him and doesn’t know anything about him… What an ass of her. If you have a guest on or a client coming to see you, one should get educated on that person to have a great interview with them, not insult them with saying “never heard of you really”. Russells face and reaction immediately told me he was displeased and realized he was about to embark on an interview with morons. How do these people even get on TV to begin with?… I am sure there are so many other worthy anchors for that job. I am really ashamed to be an American when I see people like this on TV for all the world to see and think this is what Americans are like.

I would have to agree. The minute Mika introduced him in a negative fashion, I was already uncomfortable watching it because the look on his face let one know exactly how this interview was going to go. And he handled himself better then I thought he would. I definitely learned a lot by your examination of the interview. Thanks!

Matthew, I love that you took the time to extrapolate what was relevant from that interview. He is so stunningly clever and witty and I love to watch when he is on chat shows. He is always in control and wipes the floor with people’s prejudice and expectations. But this showed it on a new level.
I have definitely been held back in life by too often worrying about what other people think. Russell completely turns that around.
Thank you for your insights and your clever explanations Matthew. With your intelligence, charisma by the bucket load and gorgeous looks you are also a force to be reckoned with.
Kathryn xx

That was certainly weird. I was so confused by her calling him that that I speculated whether maybe she was calling him “Rillie” as her own version of a shortened form of Russell, but you must be right: she was just mixed up about what his name actually was!

One of the things I really struggle with, and maybe Matt and/or other readers here could help me out with this, is realizing WHEN I’m giving my power away or when others are trying to put me down.

Sometimes, I just don’t pick up on it . Other than that the situation just feels really uncomfortable. But I do not feel armed to take enough control of the situation again.

And often times, I fall back into being overly nice and find that others take advantage of this to believe that they can act however they wish and get away with things they normally wouldn’t. I think awareness is the most important thing… to first realize the discomfort and understand what is happening, then it’s easier to jump in and make things proceed more smoothly (or at least more justly)…

My grandmother once told me, ‘Someone has to meet me at my level, or bring me to a higher one, to keep my attention.’
I always have this in mind whenever I meet someone and I’m getting the feel for where it may go. It hasn’t failed yet !

You are Brilliant Matthew, very astute of you to break this down so easily, but I guess that is why they pay you the big bucks and you are where you are. Russell is also a tack as well. At the risk of generalizations, and I don’t mean to, but maybe it’s something about the British culture that makes this subject so easily malleable because I’ve seen such great insights and classy responses mainly from people from the UK/England. You and Russell as prime examples of mastery.

Dana, here again, from the Philly Seminar. Something profound came to mind while watching the Brand interview and reading what you shared when you said, “As a fellow Brit who does a fair number of interviews on TV here in the US, this is a subject that’s close to home as I’m often having to navigate my way through the etiquette of these kinds of shows, while trying to maintain the standards I’ve come to expect in life.”

Etiquette is generally out the window because we were never taught these things. Americans, unfortunately, lost the art & beauty of manners, etiquette, and (maybe grammar). One of the precious arts lost with the Independence I guess. ;-) The British refined this art over the centuries in British Culture.

I am reminded of this sometimes as my close friend is marrying a British gent.

I remember Brand once shared in one of his skits how rude Americans are naturally. We just don’t know any better. We weren’t raised with the same rulebook & to judge us with that rulebook would be unfair. This could be a great business opportunity.

Teaching this art would greatly expand our social aptitude or consciousness. Manners are a great way of rewarding others with respect. And if there is one thing I know as a woman is that many women fail to learn the truth that men desire respect a little more than they desire love. I’ve seen so many relationships fail because women give their men love over respect. Men need to feel respected. It exudes honor & esteems him beautifully. Likewise, a man esteems a woman when she respects herself lovingly and with honor. Men give love when a woman respects herself. these ancient truth is all over the Bible, “women respect your husbands…”, “Men love your wives”. See short chapters 1 Peter 3.. Ephesians “…

This could be an amazing business opportunity here for your organization. Would you be up to teaching proper etiquette & manners to a nation; perhaps starting with women?

Of course, when teaching, one must consider to teach others the caveat to “judge not”. For the manners in which we learn will not be inherent in everyone else. However, those with this knowledge can be a beacon of love, respect and care for those that may not have been taught this art. You can keep it to the basics. It doesn’t have to a royal style of etiquette but that would be nice. :-)

Dana, Hi from the philly seminar too! Loved all your points. The only issue is that this bad behavior is condoned and encourage when people have no consequences and when they can hide behind their computers and spew hatred. If they had to say it to my mother or yours….they couldn’t do it (or they wouldn’t finish for the smack they would get!)

Matt-Thank You_ I know a number of corporate bigwigs who could learn a lot from this!

I think he was using irony here – their introduction of him consisted of defining and relating to him based on his appearance. He was bouncing the ball back to her, to make the point that when she objectifies others, it doesn’t make them feel good.

Don’t be so hard on Russell. I think he was just being playful. He probably did it as a compliment and to throw “it” back on her.

Plus, if your going to enhancing your features with something slightly & tastefully revealing as a little bit of cleavage expect the attention & natural attraction. Else, she should have dressed more modestly. She enjoyed it. She was so flustered that someone attractive younger than her admired her. Boobs attract some men. Peace to you & enjoy your week!

Um I love you for this and my best friend is now totally intrigued by what you have to say. It pointed out to me that despite my allowing people to underestimate me, I still have to communicate my standards and not be afraid of its uncomfortable consequences. I think it’s more the discomfort breaking rapport serves than confrontation in itself. Anywho, I love it as always Matt!

I just want to say that I ABSOLUTELY loved and enjoyed this. I found the interview highly entertaining and clearly something that we can apply to our own lives. Your points are right on and I believe we can all relate to a situation like this before. I believe that ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING that we watch or read or hear etc…is to be taken for what it is: simply for learning from them and for personal growth. If you’re offended, there’s obviously an underlying issue that has nothing to do with what Matt is presenting. Have a wonderful Wednesday!! Love you Matt! KEEP BRINGING IT!!! Grande abrazo!!

Great article and thanks for recommending his interview, although it’s slightly uncomfortable to watch due to the TV hosts.

Yep I agree totally that ‘“The need to maintain rapport constantly to the detriment of our own self-respect is one of the greatest barriers to our social prowess” I do that, because I literally feel difficulty breathing and get tense,when I have to get into a disagreement with people, so I back off, and ‘run’. Not very impressive,my behaviour…I know but your article is definitely something to ponder over and learn about. Thanks Matt!~~~xx

Go Russell! I was squirming watching this but was definitely proud of Russell for handling it with integrity and strong conviction.
As a journalist student I am shocked by these news anchors…how they treat him is so out of line and I really can’t believe they would be so judgemental. Grrrr, makes me sah mad haha but thanks Matt for yet another great article! Xx

I personally think and have to admit that Matthew is an amazing skilled person.
Not only he knows how to deal with us difficult women, he motivates me, learning us how to deal with life and challenges.

And I watched him back than, the way how he carries himself on televison , he knows how to handle the media and the interviews. I would have been starting crying, if they would have been mean and unfair to me, I would like to walk away from the angry people, but this is not going to help.

But the interviews of Matthew have been crazy interesting to watch. I learn that from him as well, but it definately takes a lot of practice for a while. (for me)

First you and Russell are famous pretty much thanks to America so don’t go trashing anything about our country. Russell was all over the place with his comments ie people wearing what they want, going on about the crew in the back facebooking etc. I don’t think he took the lead at all but rather sat back in a laid back manor and did nothing until the last few minutes. He is known as a comedian so it is up to him to set the tone for the interview and bring it back when they go off point. I am disappointed you took such an angry tone on this post are soley blaming the TV anchors.

CM, Did you REALLY hear the interview? Maybe watch it again and forget about Russell this time. Just listen to the anchors.
Just because they are putting him on the show, does not mean they can belittle him, or try to, throughout the show!
I am from another country and I knew about Matthew and Russell years before they became famous in the US. They were world-famous already. The US just got to know them now, because most Americans live in their own bubbles clueless about what is going on in the rest of the world until Fox or CNBC puts it on and very shallow anchors try to berate them on the basis of trivial things.

“The need to maintain rapport constantly to the detriment of our own self-respect is one of the greatest barriers to our social prowess”

Nailed it for me! This is something I’ve always done on a subconscious level that I’ve recently become aware of. That’s such a true statement. There are very few things more disempowering :(
I’m working on it tho’ :)

Important Note: While I do believe – and have seen proof – that the advice and programs I provide can help you improve your love life , please understand that not everyone will experience the exact same results. To get the best results, you must use the advice I give you. Every person is an individual and every situation is unique so no single piece of advice will work for everyone at every time.
But I can tell you that if you read the advice and continually apply it in your life, your chances of success increase dramatically.
And I’m here to help you every step of the way. Let’s get started!