I was thinking how tough it can be to let go of material.
Learning to overcome the material world and look at everything as being part of the whole universe, is something i am trying to acheive. I beleive if we all can try to feel the oneness with nature, and realize we are all one. we can strive to unimaginable progress towards, our spiritual growth. I guess i am writing this because i see that some of us may be straying from our path, including me. Being humble is key to spiritual developement. Helping others when they ask for help or advice, and not expecting anything in return. We can all make this world a peaceful place to live if we just show each other things we know that others may not. Teaching people and learning from others. If we expect to be paid for services when people ask for help. Then i beleive we totally lost the point of becoming spiritual. I love helping others, if i have learned something that can help others i always try and share this. If i see someone asking for help or advice, i try to give the best advice i possibly can. I hope this post wasn't offending i just felt deep down in my heart i needed to voice my opinion. wish everyone all the best in their search.

Have a great day/night..

~Pure~

flashstorm

02-02-2007, 09:08 PM

hi pure

thanks for that post. It is not an easy thing to follow a spiritual path in this age of the world which is very materialistic. I agree that the wonders of nature contain the secret of enlightenment, and by being one with nature we can find the way to true cosmic freedom. I think in your statements about humility and service to humanity you have expressed beautifully the attitude we should adopt in our spiritual development. You have guided us back onto the right path.

Nomad

03-02-2007, 12:53 AM

The topic of charging for services is one I see pop up more than almost any other topic.
Personally, I would think it is better to offer service freely, but this is a physical world, and we do need a certain level of materialism.If a healer for example, charges, this may help him/her to then extend their service to many others because by gaining an income from healing, it can allow them to set up a practise and eventually quit their job and serve as a healer full time thus getting healing to more people.
Someone who offered their healing service freely, may still have to work full time in a normal job and limit their potential and the potential to reach many more patients than they currently are.

Then of course there are people who purely do it for the money, and the money is more important than the service.

I think its a bit of a grey area, in a perfect world, it should of course be free, but the world is not perfect and sometimes a healer or other spiritual practitioner may feel it is nessecary for them to charge in order just simply to put food on the table.

Putting food on the table is understandable, putting a mercedes in the garage however, is indeed missing the point :)

daisy

03-02-2007, 12:59 AM

another great line at the bottom there nomad, and i also agree with much of your post

Pounamu

03-02-2007, 01:06 AM

Hello pure,

Yes, I agree... Just a thought about one thing you said:
"Helping others when they ask for help or advice, and not expecting anything in return".

While I agree that perhaps one should not do things from the motive of getting a return, I understand that there is a law of nature that says: "Giving and Receiving should be in balance"... In other words, everything, energetic or physical that you give to another should entail a balancing gift in return. This may come from the principle of "Pay it Forward", or directly from the recipient of one's gift / service.

I often come across people who rail at those with spiritual gifts charging for them. I gently explain that although you might regard these gifts as "priceless" and therefore beyond being charged for, it is good to realise that everything has value, and so the rule of Balanced Giving and Receiving can be applied to these spiritual services as well. In My Opinion. It can be tempered with the consideration of what the recipient finds possible to give in return... and its up to each to strike the balance.

amy green

03-02-2007, 02:16 PM

Pounamu - whilst I agree that "everything has value", I'm disheartened whenever I see spiritual events, e.g. talks vastly overpriced ... Often it feels like exploitation/greed - knowing the speaker can get away with it, just because they're well known ... Deepak Chopra comes to mind. There can be no doubt about his wisdom but overcharging is a form of corruption AND exclusion - what about concessions? Spirituality is also a business and money can taint its effect. I wish there was more purity emanating from such leading lights on this issue - I take heart with events like Live Aid.

pure

03-02-2007, 10:12 PM

Thank You for all the great posts, I know the material world is hard to overcome. i mean we are a part of it almost everywhere we go. I know that we need to make money so that we can survive. But sharing something with someone who is lost or is looking for guidance. Can change our outlook on life. for example giving something back that you have gotten from everyone else as i beleive we are all teachers and students. Overcharging for spiritual practices or techniques, can only lead to bad karma. I remember something someone had said to me. we can only change one person at a time. I can be very impatient when it comes to the survival of the human race, and how we have lost our ways and we are so engulfed in materialistic things. I PRAY THAT ONE DAY WE WILL ALL SEE OUR PATH. something i wrote on another site:

Creativity (aesthetics) can be very helpful to our spiritual growth, this is something i lack at times. But there are times when i feel like i am being very creative and not trying to follow everyone else, i like to be different, sometimes i feel like i am a clone and try to do everything, everyone else wants me to do. This gives me lack of creativity. Now i am constanly striving to be more what i feel deep down inside and not hold back.

Being creative has helped me grow as a person and to be myself, and try not to worry about what others think. There will be times when people might think you are crazy or they will look at you funny. They might not be used to the change in you, and then you start feeling vulnerable. If we can get through this and conquer this fear we will be much happier.

Now dont laugh : ) For me to try and conquer my fear of worrying what people might think of me i thought about sitting in my front yard and medditating, i know it sounds crazy and im sure people will drive by and stare and probally make fun of me. But i think facing your fears head on can help tremendously. I still have not got the courage to do this yet, but i am working on it.

Just wanted to add a little story that had something to do with my life. Some of my friends and family wanted me to change things about myself.

For instance my sister's friend told me i should dress a certain way because i would look good.

Then my mothers boyfriend said you should cut your hair.

This really made me think why does everyone want me to be what they think is right for me. or what i should look like, I told my sisters friend why is everyone trying to change me. This is who i am. of course they looked at me funny. Then i told my mothers boyfriend that people in the time when jesus was born had long hair, he told me we are not in that time, at least i think thats how he put it. anyway i said why should i be like everyone else. I just want to be me and this is how i feel comfortable.

This made me realize how much we have been taught a certain way, instead of us showing our creative side and being who we truely are. I'm sorry im going on and on here
I hope this wasn't boring.

Wish you all the best in your search

Have a great day/night..

~Pure~

Pounamu

04-02-2007, 04:51 AM

Some of my friends and family wanted me to change things about myself.

For instance my sister's friend told me i should dress a certain way because i would look good.

Then my mothers boyfriend said you should cut your hair.

This really made me think why does everyone want me to be what they think is right for me. or what i should look like, I told my sisters friend why is everyone trying to change me. This is who i am. of course they looked at me funny.
Hello pure,

I certainly fully support anyone who wants to be who they really are, and are prepared to stand in their truth!

While it is a fact that often people will "look at one funny", that is simply affirming their ignorance of the principle that each is different, and yet may contribute to the whole, by being their true selves in action; and who is anyone (in truth) to gainsay that? But of course they do, and have done throughout the ages... fortunately we are beyond the age now when you could be beheaded for speaking or being your truth - although people can still "pillory" you, in a metaphorical sense.

Anyway, good for you - continue to keep developing and being the truth that you believe yourself to be; its the way to expand your horizons and yourSelf, in my opinion!

Pounamu

dreamer

04-02-2007, 06:59 AM

Hey pure, the truth is that the material world first needs to be mastered before desire for it is quenched. Have you ever noticed that desires stem from lack? When you know you can have everything desire for anything becomes obselete except maybe the desire to feel as good as possible and experience life without blocks and boundaries. Truth turns from nothing, A perfect love is a love for all with an understanding of all. If you knew this was a dream and only you were dreaming it, no one else really existed except as a creation of your own mind what limits would you put on yourself and your enjoyment of the dream? Ask your self what is Oneness as spoken about by any-One who has escaped the gravity of the seperarte existence - jesus, buddha, krishna etc. The answer is yourself.