This is a project i've recently started, i want to show a building being torn apart both by vandals but also builders moving in hoping to renovate the rotting building, apologies about the image size

C&C please

http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/6590/squatters1ef5.jpg

http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/377/squatters2iy7.jpg

eirenicon

11-23-2006, 07:33 PM

I question the need for so much poly detail in what is presumably such a small part of a larger environment. For instance, most of that debris outside the broken wall could be easily done with textures and normal maps, with a few blocks here and there to add to the silhouette. Same with the junk under the stairs; it'll probably be a fairly dark, inaccessible area, so why spend polys on it? The player isn't going to notice it. Save your polys for assets that are noticeable, like the garbage bags and other props lying in plain view.

iLegacy

11-23-2006, 08:21 PM

I like your picture, but the door on the ground has nether a doorknob nor a hinges ;)

psychojohno

11-23-2006, 08:31 PM

Nice start i think you probably dont have to model as much as you have and use some normal maps and textures. One other thing... I can see where the rubble is comming from around the door but what is that under the stairs? If its rubbish then thats fine but if its rubble where did it fall from? Maybe you could make the stairs collapsed?

Gamedev

11-23-2006, 10:10 PM

Good start. I don't want to cover what everyone already has. A few new things that grab me - the smoothing groups on your garbage sacks need work. The next thing that bothers me is the overall architectural design. You need to make sure the elements go together. The style of door, w/ the style of the light fixture, stair ralings and then brick walls. The wall destruction is pretty bogus too. Get some reference for that.

Start thinking about camera angles as well.

Carter88

11-24-2006, 02:25 AM

Thanks for all the comments,

timothyD, I guess your right on the excess of debris i've never properly utilised normal maps to any degree so i'll concentrate on reducing poly detail there and placing into the more visible areas, can you give me some pointers on judging when to use normal maps at all?

iLegacy, damnit i hoped no one would notice! I'll add those in

psychojohno, yeah i wasn't too sure about that myself i just wanted to add some detail there - i think i'll follow your suggestion and make a section of the stairs broken away

As for the general architectural style of the model im going to be using photo references alot more seriously, specificaly those abandoned indsutry sites i love so much

Synthesizer

11-24-2006, 05:17 AM

Good start. I agree with all the previous points. One thing you should do before going any farther with the detail is get the layout down. Things are much easier when you've got an overall plan to follow. One great place for refs of this sort is http://www.abandoned-places.com/
(http://www.abandoned-places.com/)

eirenicon

11-24-2006, 05:29 AM

timothyD, I guess your right on the excess of debris i've never properly utilised normal maps to any degree so i'll concentrate on reducing poly detail there and placing into the more visible areas, can you give me some pointers on judging when to use normal maps at all?

General rule of thumb is this: normal maps can't change an object's silhouette, but they can change everything inside. If you normal map a dent in a flat plane, it'll look like a dent from every angle you view it at. Following, if you normal map a bunch of planks on a flat plane and put it on the floor, it'll look like there are a bunch of planks modeled on the floor. Obviously this can save a lot on polycount and add a lot of detail. However, you do need to ensure there's a balance between poly use and texture use. If it were just a few bars or blocks I would model them individually and reuse them throughout the set. However, for a convincingly detailed pile of trash, I'd normal map a solid 'trashy' mass (an object the size and shape of the pile) and then add blocks sticking out of it to break up the silhouette.

urgaffel

11-24-2006, 01:52 PM

Something you can look into when you start texturing is to have broken plaster where you have the brick wall showing. The easiest way to line up the bricks is to just map the wall first and then cut out the mesh around the bricks (and then adjust the mapping so the bricks that are at the edge are mapped all the way around).

When it comes to normalmaps, the detail you have on the door for example could in theory be normalmapped instead of modeled. Folds and wrinkles on the garbage bags can be normalmapped as well.

Something that adds to the illusion is to add small imperfections here and there in the mesh to give add a bit of extra oomph in addition to your normalmap. For example a crack in the floor can be modeled, giving the wall some uneveness, dent your stairs, the railing, the bars holding up the railing etc etc.

iLegacy

11-24-2006, 10:48 PM

Jo Carter88

1. I realized that you model is still having some little mistakes i think. At the side of the left door there is a gap between the border and the wall.

2. And i asked myself, why do the right wall (elevator) is having a baseboard but the left don't.

That's all :) I wait for new pictures :)

Carter88

11-26-2006, 04:31 PM

Hokay, decided to first draw out exactly what im going to model before i go all crazy - only one picture unfortunately got a crazy amount of work at the mo, gonna start modelling the outside before i draw in to the interior.
One question for normal maps is it better to produce the high poly version first then create the low poly mesh from it or vice versa?

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/39/img003jz2.jpg

urgaffel

11-26-2006, 06:03 PM

Depends on what you're doing the normalmap of. For the pile, I'd say do high poly first. Just don't get too crazy with things poking out since you can do that with lowpoly objects. For wrinkles on bags for example I wouldn't bother making a high poly version, just paint it in greyscale and convert it to a normalmap in PS.

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