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This room is for discussion related to learning about the faith (Catechetics), defense of the Faith (Apologetics), the Liturgy and canon law, motivated by a desire to grow closer to Christ or to bring someone else closer.

Saint Augustine of Hippo is considered on of the greatest Christian thinkers of all time and the Doctor of the Church. Learn More:Saint Augustine

2. That We make no delay in this matter is rendered necessary especially
by the
fact that the partisans of error are to be sought not only among the
Church's
open enemies; they lie hid, a thing to be deeply deplored and feared, in
her
very bosom and heart, and are the more mischievous, the less
conspicuously they
appear. We allude, Venerable Brethren, to many who belong to the
Catholic laity,
nay, and this is far more lamentable, to the ranks of the priesthood
itself,
who, feigning a love for the Church, lacking the firm protection of
philosophy
and theology, nay more, thoroughly imbued with the poisonous doctrines
taught by
the enemies of the Church, and lost to all sense of modesty, vaunt
themselves as
reformers of the Church; and, forming more boldly into line of attack,
assail
all that is most sacred in the work of Christ, not sparing even the
person of
the Divine Redeemer, whom, with sacrilegious daring, they reduce to a
simple,
mere man.

2. That We make no delay in this matter is rendered necessary especially
by the
fact that the partisans of error are to be sought not only among the
Church's
open enemies; they lie hid, a thing to be deeply deplored and feared, in
her
very bosom and heart, and are the more mischievous, the less
conspicuously they
appear. We allude, Venerable Brethren, to many who belong to the
Catholic laity,
nay, and this is far more lamentable, to the ranks of the priesthood
itself,
who, feigning a love for the Church, lacking the firm protection of
philosophy
and theology, nay more, thoroughly imbued with the poisonous doctrines
taught by
the enemies of the Church, and lost to all sense of modesty, vaunt
themselves as
reformers of the Church; and, forming more boldly into line of attack,
assail
all that is most sacred in the work of Christ, not sparing even the
person of
the Divine Redeemer, whom, with sacrilegious daring, they reduce to a
simple,
mere man.

no church that I attend does or teaches the following.."assail all that is most sacred in the work of Christ, not sparing even the person of the Divine Redeemer, whom, with sacrilegious daring, they reduce to a simple, mere man."

(quote) Tom-112790 said: no church that I attend does or teaches the following.."assail all that is most sacred in the work of Christ, not sparing even the person of the Divine Redeemer, whom, with sacrilegious daring, they reduce to a simple, mere man."not sure where you get that from

38. It remains for Us now to say a few words about the
Modernist as reformer. From all that has preceded, some idea may be
gained of
the reforming mania which possesses them: in all Catholicism there is
absolutely nothing on which it does not fasten. Reform of philosophy,
especially in the seminaries: the scholastic philosophy is to be
relegated to
the history of philosophy among obsolete systems, and the young men
are to be
taught modern philosophy which alone is true and suited to the times
in which
we live. Reform of theology; rational theology is to have modern
philosophy
for its foundation, and positive theology is to be founded on the
history of
dogma. As for history, it must be for the future written and taught
only
according to their modern methods and principles. Dogmas and their
evolution
are to be harmonised with science and history. In the Catechism no
dogmas are
to be inserted except those that have been duly reformed and are
within the
capacity of the people. Regarding worship, the number of external
devotions is
to be reduced, or at least steps must be taken to prevent their
further
increase, though, indeed, some of the admirers of symbolism are
disposed to be
more indulgent on this head. Ecclesiastical government requires to be
reformed
in all its branches, but especially in its disciplinary and dogmatic
parts.
Its spirit with the public conscience, which is not wholly for
democracy; a
share in ecclesiastical government should therefore be given to the
lower
ranks of the clergy, and even to the laity, and authority should be
decentralised. The Roman Congregations, and especially the index and
the Holy
Office, are to be reformed. The ecclesiastical authority must change
its line
of conduct in the social and political world; while keeping outside
political
and social organization, it must adapt itself to those which exist in
order to
penetrate them with its spirit. With regard to morals, they adopt the
principle of the Americanists, that the active virtues are more
important than
the passive, both in the estimation in which they must be held and in
the
exercise of them. The clergy are asked to return to their ancient
lowliness
and poverty, and in their ideas and action to be guided by the
principles of
Modernism; and there are some who, echoing the teaching of their
Protestant
masters, would like the suppression of ecclesiastical celibacy. What
is there
left in the Church which is not to be reformed according to their
principles?

But what does the popes words have to do with what goes on in the church I attend?. The divinity of Christ has never been questioned there.You cant just throw around generalizations .--Or pass out quotes from Pope Pius X.-I have no doubt there is truth to his words in the proper context---I have no idea how it relates specifically to specific present day churches.

(quote) Bernard-2709 said: He is a legitimate Canon Lawyer,who also has a Doctorate in Thomistic Theology.Not just a person as you state.

Bernard, I watched Fr. Hesse's entire video. He proposes reasons to doubt the validity of the new rites of Confirmation and the Eucharist which are not at all good reasons. While he may propose that he is in the camp of masters on the subject he appears to fail the common sense test.

Saint Athanasius lived in the fourth century during
the time of what
used to be considered the greatest crisis of faith ever to befall the
Catholic
Church, the Arian Heresy. (The Arians denied the Divinity of Our
Lord Jesus Christ). The vast majority of Churchmen fell into this
heresy, so much so that Saint Jerome wrote of the period, "The
whole world groaned and was amazed to find itself Arian". Athanasius
was the Bishop of Alexandria in Egypt for 46 years. He was banned from
his diocese at least five times and spent a total of 17 years in exile.
He even suffered an unjust excommunication from Pope Liberius (325-366)
who was under Arian influence. It is a cold fact of history that
Athanasius
stood virtually alone against the onslaught of heretical teaching
ravaging
the Church of his day begetting the familiar phrase, "Athanasius
contra mundum", that is, "Athanasius against the world".

Bernard,

Your comparison between the Arian Heresy and the Novus Ordo Mass (even with its not-infrequent abuses) defies reason.

(quote) Jerry-74383 said: The link below is to a 2009 letter from Pope Benedict to the Bishops of the Church explaining the status of the SSPX. As of this time no change to this status has been generally communicated.

http://tinyurl.com/c3b5or

From the LETTER OF HIS HOLINESS POPE BENEDICT XVI
TO THE BISHOPS OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
CONCERNING THE REMISSION OF THE EXCOMMUNICATION
OF THE FOUR BISHOPS CONSECRATED BY ARCHBISHOP LEFEBVRE:

The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church.

(quote) Ken-1025595 said: From the LETTER OF HIS HOLINESS POPE BENEDICT XVI
TO THE BISHOPS OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
CONCERNING THE REMISSION OF THE EXCOMMUNICATION
OF THE FOUR BISHOPS CONSECRATED BY ARCHBISHOP LEFEBVRE:

The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church.