Armed Buddhists, including monks, clash with Muslims in Myanmar

Source: CNN

Buddhist monks and others armed with swords and machetes Friday stalked the streets of a city in central Myanmar, where sectarian violence that has left about 20 people dead has begun to spread to other areas, according to local officials.

Members of the Buddhist and Muslim communities in Meiktila township have clashed this week after a dispute between a Muslim gold shop owner and two Buddhist sellers Wednesday ignited simmering communal tensions.

Rioters have set fire to houses, schools and mosques, prompting thousands of residents to flee their homes amid unrest that had echoes of sectarian troubles that killed scores of people in western Myanmar last year.

12. as well as most of the martial arts. fighting monks, who historically played the same role

6. It's political

No different than the Protestants and the Catholics in Northern Ireland or the Christians and the Muslims in the Middle East. It also depends on the type of Buddhist just like any religion. Not all religions with the same name are the same as every other.

8. Wiccans, Thelemites, and Druids seem to be peacefull now a days. nt

17. What other group on Earth has killed more brutally than Christians some aspects is Pacifist.

It comes down to whatever pretense they may have humans are still animals specifically Apes. It seems Apes have a dominate form humans, which are particularly brutal. Humans do seem to enjoy talking about high ideals until their self interest kicks in then watch out.

4. When Buddhist monks take up arms...

7. "Armed Buddhists" are "Buddhists"

I.e., in quotes.

Buddhists are allowed to defend themselves but not to attack defenseless others. Pretty much all boys and men in Burma spend some time in a monastery as monks--for a week or for a lifetime or somewhere in between, but they're called monks while they're there regardless of their wisdom or experience. Few monks in Burma are lifers, and monks who attack others with violence are not Buddhists.

It's really, really sad that this is happening anywhere, but especially in a country as devoutly Buddhist as Burma.

9. I think saying they're not Buddhists is strange.

10. you are making an excellent point

I guess I would say that self-identified Buddhists that use violence except in self-defense are like self-identified Christians who do not actually love their neighbors. They are "Buddhists" and "Christians" because they say they are and not because they are actually acting in accord with the tenets of the philosophy or religion they claim to follow.

I really don't intend to start a debate about this. I'm just saying that these monks who (presumably) call themselves Buddhist are not actually behaving in a way that meshes with Buddhist teachings. Maybe they're just imperfect Buddhists, as most if not all Buddhists are. Armed Buddhists are just very conspicuously imperfect....

11. I went to a lecture given by a Tibeten Buddhist nun,

and she said that if Buddhist monks and nuns were perfect, they would not need to be monks and nuns. She said being a monk or nun was basically admitting that you were imperfect, and needed a lot of work. I think she made a lot of sense.

13. of course they're buddhists. buddhism has a long history of association with militarism.

It is generally accepted in the West that Buddhism is a ‘peaceful’ religion. The Western public tends to assume that the doctrinal rejection of violence in Buddhism would make Buddhist pacifists, and often expects Buddhist societies or individual Asian Buddhists to conform to the modern Western standards of ‘peaceful’ behavior. This stereotype – which may well be termed ‘positive Orientalism,’ since it is based on assumption that an ‘Oriental’ religion would be more faithful to its original non-violent teachings than Western Christianity – has been periodically challenged by enthusiastic acquiescence by monastic Buddhism to the most brutal sorts of warfare.

This volume demolishes this stereotype, and produces instead a coherent, nuanced account on the modern Buddhist attitudes towards violence and warfare, which take into consideration both doctrinal logic of Buddhism and the socio-political situation in Asian Buddhist societies. The chapters in this book offer a deeper analysis of ‘Buddhist militarism’ and Buddhist attitudes towards violence than previous volumes, grounded in an awareness of Buddhist doctrines and the recent history of nationalism, as well as the role Buddhism plays in constructions of national identity. The international team of contributors includes scholars from Thailand, Japan, and Korea.

In "Canonical Ambiguity and Differential Practices" Frydenlund points out the complicated political and social reasons that have led monks to join in wars. "Pacifism among monks is rare. In many ways war was accepted as a regrettable part of life in the world" (p 107)".

Perhaps the most intriguing entry is Auerback's exploration of the well known book, 'Zen at War" and the general nationalistic fervor shown by Zen Buddhists in Japan for war. Auerback investigates Zen and military chaplaincy in the diary of Soen.

The variety within Buddhism is well expressed in 1977 by Kittivuddho, a leading Thai Buddhist monk, who announced that "killing Communists is not a sin" (p 177).

Nor is he merely a modern aberration. Before Christ was born, monks fought a war with Buddha's relic as a banner. And "throughout Chinese Buddhist history, monks were...seen involved in military conflict and war. In 515, a monk called Faqing rallied behind him more than 50,000 Buddhists" (p 203) to fight with him against the Northern Wei dynasty.

14. Violence and ethnic cleansing.

15. it generally happens whenever you depose any power structure, whether it's what we'd

call repressive or not.

and the same people are still running burma, they're just neo-liberalizing. at the behest of the West.

In March 2012, a draft foreign investment law emerged, the first in more than 2 decades. Foreigners will no longer require a local partner to start a business in the country, and will be able to legally lease but not own property. The draft law also stipulates that Burmese citizens must constitute at least 25% of the firm's skilled workforce, and with subsequent training, up to 50-75%.

In 2012, the Asian Development Bank formally began re-engaging with the country, to finance infrastructure and development projects in the country. The United States, Japan and the European Union countries have also begun to reduce or eliminate economic sanctions to allow foreign direct investment which will provide the Burmese government with additional tax revenue.

35. I didn't realise there was a problem with anti-Buddhist bigotry in the US...

Not like there is when it comes to things like antisemitism or Islamophobia. fwiw, I don't see what's bigoted about pointing out that the Dalai Lama isn't perfection personified. I know he's the figurehead of resistance to an occupation, which get a big tick from me, but, well, I'll let John Safran speak for me with The Pope vs The Dalai Lama. It's illuminating!

37. Except that thread was not about factual criticisms.

No one, including myself who was in that thread & who personally knows H.H. the Dalai Lama, made any claim to him being 'perfection personified'.

I responded to the lies and myths. These included the Dalai Lama being a CIA stooge, a Nazi sympathizer, and a theocratic tyrant.

There were also many misconceptions about Tibetan Buddhism itself concerning 'gods & goddesses', the differences between various schools, whether Buddhism should be considered atheistic or not, etc.

Buddhism like all ethical systems -- religious, philosophical, or non-theistic -- has a fundamental code of conduct. Not killing is one of those and is a part of the first five precepts taken. All human beings are prone to expressions of violence and war. To become a Buddhist and take precepts, one is to renounce violence. Some schools, like Tibetan Buddhism, will take it so far as to be pacifistic. Others like Zen will allow violence or killing only in self-defense. Traditional martial arts were a way to be defensive without necessarily killing an attacker.

So I am not surprised that there are humans who label themselves Buddhists and are even calling themselves monks who, like all of us, are not perfect. They are killing and are at war. That is deeply saddening, as it is violating one of the foundational precepts of Buddhism.

I would like to respond to your video as well. I have read Beyond Dogma where he is sourcing the quotes from H.H. the Dalai Lama. The statements about abortion are taken completely out of context. If a religion is based on extreme non-violence, then yes, abortion is a violation of that, correct? Even someone who is progressive (and I am really beginning to dislike that label) who is pro-choice may still be anti abortion. That is totally compatible with Buddhism as well. Your choices are your choices. The consequences are your consequences. There are no sins as the Catholic church would call them. There are simply skillful and unskillful actions. I can support that all woman have the choice to have an abortion. I do not condone its use as a form of irresponsible birth control for instance. I also believe that both men and women who have sex should realize that pregnancy is a natural outcome if contraception is not used. So, that is hardly incongruent. The section on sexual misconduct is the same. I would suggest reading the book yourself, observe the context of the questions asked, instead of watching a pseudo-documentary for your knowledge.