“The veto and the mounting violence underlined the dynamics shaping what is proving to be the Arab world’s bloodiest revolt: diplomatic stalemate and failure as Syria plunges deeper into what many are already calling a civil war. Diplomats have lamented their lack of options in pressuring the Syrian government, and even some Syrian dissidents worry about what the growing confrontation will mean for a country reeling from bloodshed and hardship.

“The veto is almost sure to embolden the government of President Bashar al-Assad, which brazenly carried out the assault on Homs on the very day that the Security Council had planned to vote…

“‘It’s a real massacre in every sense of the word,’ said a resident in Khaldiya, who gave his name as Abu Jihad. ‘I saw bodies of women and children lying on roads beheaded. It’s horrible and inhuman. It was a long night helping people get to hospitals.’…

“‘The army has weapons, and the people have weapons,’ one opposition activist said on condition of anonymity, recounting Saturday’s bloodshed. ‘Syria is finished for me. It is a civil war, and nothing will save us anymore.'”

***

“Thirty years after his father massacred tens of thousands of innocent Syrian men, women, and children in Hama, Bashar al-Assad has demonstrated a similar disdain for human life and dignity. Yesterday the Syrian government murdered hundreds of Syrian citizens, including women and children, in Homs through shelling and other indiscriminate violence, and Syrian forces continue to prevent hundreds of injured civilians from seeking medical help. These brutal killings take place at a time when so many Syrians are also marking a deeply meaningful day for their faith. I strongly condemn the Syrian government’s unspeakable assault against the people of Homs and I offer my deepest sympathy to those who have lost loved ones. Assad must halt his campaign of killing and crimes against his own people now. He must step aside and allow a democratic transition to proceed immediately…

“The international community must work to protect the Syrian people from this abhorrent brutality.”

***

“This is strong language, says CBS News Washington bureau chief Chris Isham, instructing President Assad that he ‘must’ stop killing his own people and that he ‘must’ step down.

“‘What will the U.S. will do if Assad does not (as he most certainly won’t) comply?” said Isham. ‘Assad has shown that he will resort to any means necessary to stay in power.’

“With the U.S. having ruled out military intervention, and the U.N. Security Council failing to approve a resolution seeking Assad’s ouster, the enforcement mechanism – beyond sanctions – is now up in the air.”

***

“Clinton warned that more violence would be in the offing if the security council was not able to act immediately.

“‘The endgame, in the absence of us acting together as the international community, is civil war,’ she said. ‘The potential endgames, if we are serious about putting this kind of international pressure on the Assad regime, making it clear to the opposition that they should pursue their changes in a peaceful manner, is the possibility of the beginning of a transition.’…

“Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov complained about the lack of a clear post-resolution strategy for Syria in his remarks in Munich Saturday morning. He said clearly that without further changes to the resolution, Russia would use its veto power.

“‘We asked the Americans and the Europeans, ‘What is the game plan?’ They say, ‘Well, in 15 days we’ll consider this issue again in the security council.’ My question is, ‘After that, what are you going to propose?’ Lavrov said. ‘It’s not a serious policy.'”

***

“It’s not just the Sunni Arabs lining up against Assad. Turkey, after a recent flirtation with a Syrian-Iranian-Turkish entente, has turned firmly against Assad, seeing an opportunity to extend its influence, as in Ottoman days, as protector/master of the Sunni Arabs. The alignment of forces suggests a unique opportunity for the West to help finish the job.

“How? First, a total boycott of Syria, beyond just oil and including a full arms embargo. Second, a flood of aid to the resistance (through Turkey, which harbors both rebel militias and the political opposition, or directly and clandestinely into Syria). Third, a Security Council resolution calling for the removal of the Assad regime. Russia, Assad’s last major outside ally, should be forced to either accede or incur the wrath of the Arab states with a veto.

“Force the issue. Draw bright lines. Make clear American solidarity with the Arab League against a hegemonic Iran and its tottering Syrian client. In diplomacy, one often has to choose between human rights and strategic advantage. This is a rare case where we can advance both — so long as we do not compromise with Russia or relent until Assad falls.”

***

***

***

“Once again, the courageous people of Syria can clearly see who on this Council supports their yearning for liberty and universal rights-and who does not. And during this season of change, the people of the Middle East can now see clearly which nations have chosen to ignore their calls for democracy and instead prop up desperate dictators. Those who opposed this resolution have denied this last chance to end Asad’s brutality through peaceful means under Arab League auspices. Any further blood that flows will be on their hands.”

What is the motivation behind the Chinese and Russian actions, though? Are the Chinese and Russians so afraid of revolt by their own people that they are willing to support any totalitarian regime? Is that what this is about?

Perhaps China and Russia just prevented/delayed wasting Western lives on Muslims and their pathetic sh*tholes again. Let Muslims and Islam sort this out.Islam is the answer they say and all Muslims deserve to get a thorough dose of Sharia in every orifice. You want NATO to go in and eventually have Muslims blame NATO for every deathX2 that ever happened in Syria? Has nothing jelled in the years since 9/11? They don’t export popcorn from Syria, so all is well.

What is the motivation behind the Chinese and Russian actions, though? Are the Chinese and Russians so afraid of revolt by their own people that they are willing to support any totalitarian regime? Is that what this is about?

cynccook on February 4, 2012 at 8:06 PM

Russia defense companies makes good bank selling arms to them among others and the industry makes up a good chunk of manufacturing in russia. They also have some natural resource deals with them also. And last but not least it annoys us.

Wouldnt doubt its the same with China but with the annoying part counting for alot more.

You’re right. I don’t know. I wish your family over there well, and some luck. Russia is a great country that deserves a better government.

cozmo on February 4, 2012 at 8:39 PM

I’m not Russian, my family is still in Slovakia. I’m hearing news second hand from the family. The Russian people want Putin gone and the opposition has been arrested, jailed and disqualified from the ballot for the March election.

You have no idea how bad it really is in Russia right now. The anti-Putin people held another massive rally all across the country today.

The stories coming from my family are not good.

JPeterman on February 4, 2012 at 8:36 PM

But, but — what could go wrong?

Protest organisers claimed up to 120,000 people attended the march while police put the figure at 35,000. There was an irreverent atmosphere: some came dressed as clowns, or knights on cardboard horses, while others banged drums. Groups of communists waved Soviet flags, and several hundred nationalists marched in in a phalanx crying in unison: “Russia for ethnic Russians!” However, the majority of demonstrators showed no party or group allegiance, and many had fashioned their own placards.

I have read that many in Russia want a return to communism. Those too young to remember how bad it was and those old enough who for whatever reason remember the “good times??”

The older I get the more I realize I have been wrong about human nature. It appears that too many people would rather be taken care of than be free and independent.

arnold ziffel on February 4, 2012 at 8:49 PM

I’m not sure if that’s true about the Russians, but it’s sure true of many older people in Eastern Europe. They were born and raised under communism, were used to their weekly food allowances, housing, etc. and they just haven’t been able to adapt to their freedom.

Thirty years after his father massacred tens of thousands of innocent Syrian men, women, and children in Hama,

our President is using a failed violent Islamic insurgency attempting to create an Islamic state led by the Muslim Brotherhood as a rallying cry? am i reading this right?, this is just one more notch in my mental belt confirming that this man is actively shilling and helping to come into power a MB led caliphate

Sir, I honestly cannot fathom why people would think communism or socialism is a good idea. Why would you work harder at a factory than Mike if you don’t get anything more for your efforts? I don’t want govt. which is ran by humans who are no better than me deciding my future and status.
Victor Belenko defected in 1976 w/a Mig 25 jet. Excellent book. He described in detail how bad things were under communist Russia. For a while he was overwhelmed in the US and even thought of going back and taking his medicine.

NEIL MacFARQUHAR and ANTHONY SHADID
Two points to draw from this article. It once again displays the eventual setup for what WWIII may in fact look like. Or Russia is looking to be the great savior, but for what reason, whats their advantage? If in fact this turns to civil war which some are arguing it already has what could possible be an end result favorable to Russia and China? I think we know. Once again the UN appears impudent.
CNN blog no author?
Normally I would think the US stand with the people and not the Government of Syria would be the correct course and am hoping that’s the case here. Considering 0’s track record in the ME these days, it may well turn out, to be just another piece in what will ultimately become. The New Caliphate.
(CBS/AP) no author?
Pretty much the same as the top article. “Or what.” = Nothing. The current administration see’s there poll numbers and will ultimately respond accordingly. To the administrations political needs. Might actually be in our best interest. Except for the killings. Touch spot made tougher by the Russian China alliance, and impudent UN, and a US political season. Pity for the Syrian populace. Unless of course they are Muslim brotherhood types and hate us.
Josh Rogin
Furthers the narrative of an impudent US, UN, and a strong position for Russia China pact . People suffer, Syrian citizens gain the least, while paying the ultimate price. The UN is nearly worthless at this point. At least in its current config. Perhaps if the civil war is eminent we should just allow it to play out.
Charles Krauthammer
I agree with Kraut for the most part, geo politically cutting off Iran at the knees via Syria is appealing. What replaces the Assad regime is where I have a bit more concern. Shitte vrs Sunni is just such a mess. Perhaps an unsolvable mess with in a time frame which is required to keep lasting peace amongst any of the factions. Add to that meddling from outside players and it seems a very desperate situation to be sure.
Video 1 An accurate appraisal of the impossible situation.
Video 2 A human tragedy playing itself out yet again. It will as have been before it play out in much the same way.
Video 3 A nice summation by Susan Rice.
It all sounds like the start of a perfect set up for WWIII, The ME will never have peace. And that’s coming from an optimist. We are just choosing sides at this point. This will be the bloodiest of all wars with a human too exceeding any seen before. It is becoming inevitable. This conflict may not be the one to start it. The next one may or not be, but at some point there will be war.

“‘What will the U.S. will do if Assad does not (as he most certainly won’t) comply?” said Isham. ‘Assad has shown that he will resort to any means necessary to stay in power.’

“With the U.S. having ruled out military intervention, and the U.N. Security Council failing to approve a resolution seeking Assad’s ouster, the enforcement mechanism – beyond sanctions – is now up in the air.”

IIRC the Boy King initially rule out military intervention in Libya.

With his disapproval numbers in the crapper and the election getting closer, how many really think he can resist another “kinetic military action” just so he can have another “kill” on his score card to brag about in October?

“‘It’s a real massacre in every sense of the word,’ said a resident in Khaldiya, who gave his name as Abu Jihad. ‘I saw bodies of women and children lying on roads beheaded. It’s horrible and inhuman. It was a long night helping people get to hospitals.’…

Ironically, Iran and Turkey may eventually be on opposing sides of a future conflict, as both have maniacal narcissistic leaders with visions of grandeur beyond sanity. If only they existed in a vacuum.

we should not get involved, i suspect our commander in chief will see this as another way to endear himself to the Muslim Brotherhood radicals who he shares a kinship with, but this is a shia-sunni civil war, let them fight each other and cause harm to their respective sects, helping these rebels will lead to the installation of a Muslim Brotherhood Islamic govt, whoever is on power will be hostile to the west. We should look at it like the Iran-iraq war, Iran was to busy fighting Iraq to turn outward

“‘What will the U.S. will do if Assad does not (as he most certainly won’t) comply?” said Isham. ‘Assad has shown that he will resort to any means necessary to stay in power.’

“With the U.S. having ruled out military intervention, and the U.N. Security Council failing to approve a resolution seeking Assad’s ouster, the enforcement mechanism – beyond sanctions – is now up in the air.”

‘What is the game plan?’ They say, ‘Well, in 15 days we’ll consider this issue again in the security council.’ My question is, ‘After that, what are you going to propose?’ Lavrov said. ‘It’s not a serious policy.’”

Translation from politish to greedish :
Obama+Clinton+Pelosi to ASSad : Pay up sucka cuz the countdown begins …..right now

So in other words, we beat up the bully’s weak hanger-on, but won’t touch anyone else in the bully’s entourage.

Mitoch55 on February 4, 2012 at 9:06 PM

Pretty much. I kinda figured Obama was looking to flying circus Syria like Lybia but its looking like he hasnt got the balls to tell the Russians he going to do it anyways. Plus with some of the things that are going on in Libia, like the way they killed that ex-diplomat, its not like he can use it as a positive example.

Suffice it to say that A-jad and Erdogan’s support for Azzhat Assad is conditional and self-serving, and may disappear like a feather in the wind.

The whole thing is a powder keg with a sparkler stuck in the bung-hole.

It’s a great time for our leadership to be snubbing our noses at our neighbor’s generous supply of energy resources (and thereby strengthening the country who is most likely the greatest threat to our future well-being.)/////////////////////////////////////////

Pretty much. I kinda figured Obama was looking to flying circus Syria like Lybia but its looking like he hasnt got the balls to tell the Russians he going to do it anyways. Plus with some of the things that are going on in Libia, like the way they killed that ex-diplomat, its not like he can use it as a positive example.

Sir, I honestly cannot fathom why people would think communism or socialism is a good idea. Why would you work harder at a factory than Mike if you don’t get anything more for your efforts? I don’t want govt. which is ran by humans who are no better than me deciding my future and status.
Victor Belenko defected in 1976 w/a Mig 25 jet. Excellent book. He described in detail how bad things were under communist Russia. For a while he was overwhelmed in the US and even thought of going back and taking his medicine.

Think about this, if you were born and raised your entire life under communism, how do you know that there’s a better way? I thought that everyone in the whole wild world only got 2 pears as a Christmas gift until I was about 12.

With his disapproval numbers in the crapper and the election getting closer, how many really think he can resist another “kinetic military action” just so he can have another “kill” on his score card to brag about in October?

Flora Duh on February 4, 2012 at 9:13 PM

There is alot of low hanging fruit in Africa he can go after. I think he’ll do something sooner or later somewhere.

I thought that everyone in the whole wild world only got 2 pears as a Christmas gift until I was about 12.

JPeterman on February 4, 2012 at 9:28 PM

So I’m guessing people like you and me will have no problem with rationed food and gasoline and cooking gas and water and electricity , when it becomes the norm right here in the next couple of years :O

Amen. No more wasted American lives on this crap. These tribes have been killing each other for thousands of years, even prior to Islam. At least when they’re occupied with fighting each other they’re (temporarily) not fighting Israel.

aryeung on February 4, 2012 at 9:12 PM

Not at all. We’ve already seen how the foreign policy of the Obama regime has “improved” the region. Until the UN cracks down on Iran and NoKo (fat chance of either) this is all a dog and pony show.

So I’m guessing people like you and me will have no problem with rationed food and gasoline and cooking gas and water and electricity , when it becomes the norm right here in the next couple of years :O

burrata on February 4, 2012 at 9:36 PM

What is sad is we can see this coming and it could be headed off but nothing will change until people start suffering. Here in CA we have been threatened with rolling blackouts since we had a big electricity crisis in 2001. Have they made any changes to the grid or increased production—nope. People keep voting the same fheads back in power.

O/T – Sixteen inches of snow and a two hour power outage this afternoon. Heavy, wet snow, but the wind wasn’t as bad as predicted. Nothing moving tonight. Enjoyed the blizzard. A couple of bottles of good wine helped. Now, on to Spring.

On/Topic – The best policy in the Middle East is to arm both side to the teeth. Let them kill each other. The whole world benefits.

Syria was once a center of Christianity and produced many great Saints. Now a craphole. Very sad.

we should not get involved, i suspect our commander in chief will see this as another way to endear himself to the Muslim Brotherhood radicals who he shares a kinship with, but this is a shia-sunni civil war, let them fight each other and cause harm to their respective sects, helping these rebels will lead to the installation of a Muslim Brotherhood Islamic govt, whoever is on power will be hostile to the west. We should look at it like the Iran-iraq war, Iran was to busy fighting Iraq to turn outward

golembythehudson on February 4, 2012 at 9:15 PM

I agree. The time to have done anything to Syria would have been when they were give safe haven to insurgents in Iraq. Its also where alot of the arms for them were coming from. We should have at least turned both its border with Iraq and Irans border with Iraq into a killing zone to stop that. Now that we’re out theres really no point.

Assad is a bastard, and when hes gone I have no doubt they find mass graves like they always do with people like him but if we tip it over would we be giving them something better or worse and I doubt it would make them like us any better than they do now.

So I’m guessing people like you and me will have no problem with rationed food and gasoline and cooking gas and water and electricity , when it becomes the norm right here in the next couple of years :O

Not many but Obama put these guys in power and they make the news by pulling out that diplo’s toenails and then killing him. Doesnt make Obama look like he knew what he was doing by helping them. To be honest the GOP field should go after him on it this week since it did make the news.

He must step aside and allow a democratic transition to proceed immediately…

Yeah, that’s worked so well thus far in Egypt and Libya.

I’m really starting to believe that the secular tyrants remaining in the countries over there are way better than the islamic tyrants that would take their place. Jugears knows that no transition to a “democratic” society will take place. Unless by that he means the one man, one vote, one time to transition to sharia law and subjection to the imams and caliphate.

Until islam goes the way of the thugee cult of Kali, then the people in those countries don’t have a chance at freedom. We need to make sure that they are contained and don’t have the means to cause problems for their neighbors or us, but that is the extent of our involvement.

Are you following the hysteria being raised in the ghetto+barrio churches these days ? These people are being told that their entire communities will disappear if they don’t vote for a tax hike in Nov because white Republicans are planning to wipe out the minorities by defunding welfare and foodstamps.
These are the people who vote often and at multiple locations.
We are scr00000d in CA

It’s becoming increasingly clear, regarding events and developments in the Middle East, that, regardless of whether the US acts or refrains from acting, we are merely bit players being carried along by the events rather than shaping or otherwise affecting them.

Horace
Sounds like you got a good bit. Power back on and staying cozy I hope. Did you see the party we threw for ya last night. If you didn’t don’t look. I was kinda tired and confused, for some reason shifted into thinking it was your birthday. I know its tomorrow. Upside we can celebrate again. Sounds like you’ll be snowed in pretty good I reckon. Hey you be proud of today’s hunt. One ban, it earned it. Wished you had been there.

[Ed: It’s hard to believe that anyone would object to bringing attention to the case of a missing young woman, especially one related to a close friend of mine. However, we thankfully don’t have to deal with this person and his vile, despicable, and emotionally crippled point of view any longer. Buh-bye, troll.]

Assad’s regime is controlled by Alawites, only about 12% of the Syrian population. They are a sect which considers itself muslim, but most larger muslim secs do not accept them as such, considering them apostates.

They control the top levels of government, the Army, and the security forces. They have ruled with brutality for over 40 years, since Assad’s father led a coup in the ruling Ba’ath Party. They know fully well if they leave power, they will all hang – and deservedly so. So they have no incentive to give up power, hanging on is their best chance.

Are conservatives, a group of people supposedly for national sovereignty and against the UN, really going to get upset that Obama’s stooge Susan Rice didn’t get her way at the UN?

Any idiot can understand that conservatives favor the national sovereignty of democratic states, not tyrants, and criticize the UN because it is ineffectual in deaig with same, as in the present situation.

Why not argue that since conservatives support the second amendment, they must support criminals who use guns? Sophist.

Thanks. I’m pissed. I have eight inches of snow on my truck and all the snow plowed crap behind it to clean up before leaving at eight AM for church and I don’t feel like hunting trolls tonight, vaporized or not…

O/T JPeterman: Has the economy of Slovakia rebounded since the fall of the Iron Curtain?

Several years ago on a train trip, our tour group traveled through a small portion of Slovakia, where we were told that because the Soviets had dedicated so much of Slovakia’s industry toward munitions and the like, the change towards other peacetime industry was not in pace with the other Soviet bloc countries. The Czech Republic rebounded economically much more quickly.

My own ethnic roots are Slavic (Polish), and I have such an affinity for people of the region.

I recall that our guide, a Hungarian who had experienced both the failed Hungarian uprising and the threat of the tanks in ’68 Prague, said that the older people had their relative “safety net” of social security pulled away when Communism fell. She also said that with the rise of capitalism, the Russian mafia arose, and that many people longed to go back to the relative “safety” of the police state.

(Sorry for the diversion, folks, but I miss the insights of our former poster entelechy, who had warned against the election of Obama. She was so right!)