Chewin’ the Fat 4

I mentioned last week that there will be no Circle talk this time (don’t worry Circle fans, they’ll be back in a bit). For now I am looking at WarMachine with a particular interest in the ever popular Protectorate of Menoth and my beloved Cygnar.

For a little bit of background you should probably be aware that I only very recently bought my Menoth (similar to my Circle) due to just getting a job and being offered a very large army for about half of the selling price so I figured, hell, why not! As a result I have a large Menoth force which, very unlike my large Cygnar force, remains completely untested. There is a 35pts tournament in Dundee on 17th November that I will be attending and, at this event, one of these Factions will be my weapon of choice. Historically, I have had a fairly good record in Dundee when I test out new armies so, if I choose Menoth, this sets a good precedent! It’s a slight shame that I can’t play at 50pts as I feel like both Cygnar and Menoth are Factions that play noticeably better at higher points brackets when they can get all of their support pieces in place but I guess I’ll have to make do with 35pts!

The tournament in question is shaping up to be the biggest one over here in a while with a lot of Scotland’s best players showing up. I can expect, at the very least, strong Circle, Ret, Legion, Menoth and Cryx opponents with the potential for some good Cygnar or Mercs thrown in for fun. With this in mind I can’t afford to really tailor my lists at all and will need to make some all-comers lists capable of playing at a high level. I always find this difficult at 35pts as there just never seems to be enough space to get the cool things I want but c’est la vie!

I am still deliberating on exactly what I’m going to be taking but I have a large array of things to choose from and, as such, have decided to focus on only a few casters for now from each Faction. So, what am I looking for in my casters then?

Firstly, I know that I want my lists to try and pose different problems for opponents. I probably want one of them to be jack heavy and one of them to be infantry heavy. I want at least one of my lists to have strong shooting elements and at least one of them to be able to hit hard in melee when required. I probably want one heavily armoured caster and one supporting caster. If I choose Menoth then I definitely want access to Purification because it’s broken. If I can hit all of these bases then hopefully my opponents won’t know what to bring and it might throw them off guard.

I figure I’ll go through my ‘Musings’ (hah! Puns!) for each Faction in order. Beware, there will be a lot of theory and list building ahead! So, without further ado:

MENOTH

With all of the points above being considered I think the easiest place to start will be with Purification. We only have 2 Purification casters (although I consider Kreoss3 to be a pseudo-Purification caster) and I don’t own the Harbinger. That was easy. Kreoss1 is in. He obviously fits the supporting caster role well with access to Purification, Defenders Ward and an awesome Feat. I am also keen to test out Lamentation as I don’t believe it’s as bad as some people think, especially against certain Hordes warlocks. I am of the firm opinion that Kreoss1 can run whatever he wants but I ‘reckon’ (get it) it will be mainly shooting. The other big consideration is whether I want infantry or jacks with him and, for the most part, I think infantry is the way to go. I can’t really consider taking Kreoss without Exemplar Errants with UA and Seneschal. This package gives a very survivable unit with great denial abilities and a solo that can hold zones with the best of them. On Feat turn these guys can shoot down a swathe of enemies with little difficulty. I also want Holy Zealots with the Monolith Bearer. I am intending to start the game with Defenders Ward on them and cycle it onto the Errants once they inevitably die. Again, on Feat turn these guys become monsters capable of nuking almost anything. At this stage the list has a quite a lot of bodies for 35pts and still has 20pts left. A Redeemer is almost necessary for Kreoss1 in my opinion with the obligatory Choir and Vassal. I also want Rhupert in the list because Pathfinder would be good for the Zealots and Dirge of Mists is funny on Defenders Warded anything. This leaves only 8pts for a heavy so the job will have to go to the Reckoner. He’s just good at everything. This list has some pretty strong shooting capabilities, decent assassination potential with the ever popular Pop ‘n’ Drop and great scenario staying power with the Errants and Zealots. I think this is a fairly solid list and it has great attrition power.

Everything anyone could want from a Menoth caster. Yes please.

High Exemplar Kreoss +5

– Redeemer 6

– Reckoner 8

4 Choir of Menoth 2

10 Exemplar Errants 8

– Exemplar Errant UA 2

10 Holy Zealots 6

– Monolith Bearer 2

Exemplar Errant Seneschal 2

Rhupert Carvolo, Piper of Ord 2

Vassal of Menoth 2

Reinforcements:

– Repenter 4

Nicia, Tear of Vengeance 3

This leads onto my next caster. A highly armoured jack caster whose forces have the capability to fight in melee effectively. Hmmm… the obvious choice here is Feora2. She’s pretty damn good and hits all of these bases. The other considerations I would have would be Kreoss2, Reznik and Thyra. For me this choice isn’t actually that easy. I’ve decided against Thyra and Reznik because when I do use them it will be at 50pts. Reznik, in particular, I want to try with the ‘Knockin’ on Heavens Door’ Theme Force from No Quarter. I like Steelheads, just ask anyone who’s played my Cygnar. This list will end up being fairly infantry heavy except at 50pts so he’s out for now. This leaves Feora2 and Kreoss2.

As mentioned above, Feora2 is a jack caster extraordinaire. Escort is great, her Feat allows for some extra Focus allocation in a pinch and her bonded Redeemer and a Vanquisher can kill a lot of infantry with her Caustic Presence ability. I think I would try and take lots of multi-purpose jacks, a Redeemer, Reckoner and a couple of Vanquishers perhaps as she has the ability to make all of these hit hard in melee with Ignite and it gives her more of a Combined Arms approach. With all the support available these jacks can take on most things and the Covenant stops knockdown trumping Enliven. There really is nothing wrong with her apart from certain control matchups and even then she generally has enough armour to simply punch through.

‘like FIRE, HELLFIRE’

Feora, Protector of the Flame +6

– Redeemer 6

– Reckoner 8

– Vanquisher 8

– Vanquisher 8

4 Choir of Menoth 2

4 Choir of Menoth 2

Vassal of Menoth 2

Vassal of Menoth 2

Covenant of Menoth 2

Wracks 1

Reinforcements:

– Repenter 4

Knight Exemplar Seneschal 3

Some of you may wonder why Kreoss2 makes this bracket as he is definitely not a jack caster. He runs melee infantry and he runs it well. He has an armour buff, he has Sacrosanct which is awesome and he has an offensive dispel which is always useful. Perhaps most importantly he has a ridiculous Feat capable of massively swinging a game. In his list I would probably take 2 units of Bastions because, well because I own them and they look cool. Although they aren’t jacks they are really hard to take down and hit as hard as jacks, even more so when under the Feat. I would also probably want Temple Flameguard because I think the Feat is much better with Reach units providing a method for dealing with all sorts of irritating jam units. Combined with a jack like the Crusader the list will look really cool visually and will have excessive damage output. My only real issue here is almost a complete lack of ranged output, meaning the list could have some pretty bad matchups, and not being able to find the spare point necessary for Saxon Orrik. The only Pathfinder here is on the Errants, which could be an issue

Exemplars! Assemble!

Grand Exemplar Kreoss +6

– Crusader 6

5 Bastions 8

5 Bastions 8

10 Exemplar Errants 8

– Exemplar Errant UA 2

10 Temple Flameguard 6

Saxon Orrik 2

Wracks 1

Reinforcements:

6 Knights Exemplar 5

Gorman Di Wulfe 2

This is definitely a fun looking list but I’m not sure it can deal with everything I want it to. It could be a really good off list though. Interestingly I really like how it pans out at 50pts because I can add the Avatar of Menoth in, upgrade the Crusader to the Fire of Salvation and squeeze in min Choir by removing the Wracks. I’m convinced that the Avatar could work really well with Kreoss2 because he loves armour buffs, he’ll love an extra attack on Feat turn and he provides a turn by turn melee threat that can’t be ignored whilst remaining independent of Kreoss’ Focus. Also, at 50pts, 12 Daughters is a really fun set of reinforcements…

With these casters I will need to think about matchups however, unlike Circle and Cygnar who I’ve playing recently, I remain unconvinced that Menoth has any really bad matchups. Their game seems to be based heavily on stopping the opponent from doing anything interesting and forcing them to play the Menoth players game.

Menoth is an interesting Faction with a whole lot of options to explore. The Battle Engine is awesome and hasn’t made an appearance in any of these lists as of yet. When the Judicator comes out it will make Kreoss’ Pop and Drop extremely Focus efficient meaning he won’t necessarily die immediately after if he fails. I absolutely love Kreoss3 at the moment. If he was out then I would definitely be using him but, unfortunately, he is not. I think Warpath in Menoth is going to tilt a lot of matchups heavily and he also has Ignite for damage buffery and a Purification-esque Feat. He seems to be really solid. I’ve not even touched on the ridiculous things that can be done with Harbinger or Severius1 yet either!

CYGNAR

This will likely be a bit shorter than the Menoth bit for now as I have a fair bit of experience with Cygnar and have a few lists saved up that I want to try. From the start I should say that I love the Reinholdt casters (i.e. Caine2, Siege and Kara Sloan) and, if Character Restrictions wasn’t a thing, I would take definitely take two of these. Unfortunately, Reinholdt is a character and this is not possible so I have to pick one of them. Recently I have been taking Siege with Stormwall and a Storm Strider quite a bit which I like but it doesn’t work well at 35pts so I’m thinking I’ll go with something else for a change. I’ve only played a couple of games with Caine2 but he’s really fun and I think he could be up for a little bit of showtime as he does scale well down to 35pts. I’m not going to take any credit for the Caine2 list below – it’s fairly standard for him at 35pts and geared pretty heavily towards his own personal assassination:

Pew pew, pew. Pew. Pew pew pew. etc.

Captain Allister Caine +5

– Ol’ Rowdy 9

– Squire 2

10 Boomhowlers 9

10 Horgenhold Forge Guard 8

6 Rangers 5

Lady Aiyanna & Master Holt 4

Reinholdt, Gobber Speculator 1

Gorman Di Wulfe 2

Reinforcements:

Eiryss, Angel of Retribution 3

Black 13th 4

A solid list that will be good fun to play. Now, to compliment this I will need something a little different from usual… I normally take Haley2 with loads of Steelheads as one of my lists and, while I think this covers matchups well, I just don’t want to be the guy who takes Haley2 and Caine2 (when I started Cygnar a year ago I said at the very beginning that those two together were not necessary to win and I’m sticking with it!). Bearing all of this in mind I need to think of something else to take. Enter something more fun:

Ride the Lightning.

General Adept Nemo +6

– Stormwall 19

– Thunderhead 12

– Minuteman 5

– Squire 2

Stormsmith Stormcaller 1

Stormsmith Stormcaller 1

Stormsmith Stormcaller 1

Reinforcements:

– Hunter 6

Stormsmith Stormcaller 1

Technically this is a Tier 1 list but I can’t really take advantage of that fact. If Stormwall counted as a heavy jack then the Squire would become 2 more Stormsmiths but you can’t have everything! This list is… not optimal. It is, however, hilarious and fun. There is a hell of a lot of pulse effects and lots of fun to be had messing with the opponent using triangulations etc. Realistically, I think Caine2 will see a lot more play than Nemo2 but this does sound entertaining at the very least.

I’d be curious to hear what you all think. Do you think I should test out a new Faction against the best Scotland has to offer or do you think I should take Cygnar who I’ve actually had some previous success with?

Next week I’ll tell you what I’ve decided upon and what my main game plan will be.

Until next time,

PurchasedPig

Author: PurchasedPig

Hi there, PurchasedPig here, based in bonnie Scotland in the UK. I'm a relatively recent convert to Warmachine/Hordes from the GW systems (been playing for about a year and a half). I played 40k from aged 11 and sort of kept going with Wargaming from there...
I have a severe case of Faction ADD and collect more factions than not. As a result I feel like I have a lot of information to extol! Hopefully any ramblings are appreciated, give me a shout if you want to know anything else!