Post by conspiracytheorist on Dec 7, 2007 23:40:54 GMT -5

I think Mai's ties with Zuko are a lot stronger than those with Azula. She's swapped spit with the prince, after all, and the only reason that she still sees Azula now that they're back in the Fire Nation is because Azula happens to be his sister. If they don't throw her in the trash bin like they did with Ty Lee, I think they'll make Mai side with Zuko in the end (and I'm sure they'll make it a long, drawn-out, convincing process - meaning that they'll give her one scene with Zuko and one with Azula and then she'll side with Zuko and everything will be peaches and cream).

<- Is feeling quite cynical.

"It is important to draw wisdom from many different places. If we take it from only one place, it becomes rigid and stale."

Post by mahatista on Dec 9, 2007 1:17:06 GMT -5

conspiracytheorist said:

I think Mai's ties with Zuko are a lot stronger than those with Azula. She's swapped spit with the prince, after all, and the only reason that she still sees Azula now that they're back in the Fire Nation is because Azula happens to be his sister. If they don't throw her in the trash bin like they did with Ty Lee, I think they'll make Mai side with Zuko in the end (and I'm sure they'll make it a long, drawn-out, convincing process - meaning that they'll give her one scene with Zuko and one with Azula and then she'll side with Zuko and everything will be peaches and cream).

<- Is feeling quite cynical.

So sad but I'm seeing the same thing.

Mai's been left in such a tangle (realistically speaking) that it seems to signal an eventual skate-over of her decision/fate. I mean, what's happened to her could fill a couple of episodes if dealt with on any real level. I know it's a cartoon for kids, but the story demands more.

Post by luna on Dec 9, 2007 1:27:31 GMT -5

Is everyone sure she'll side with Zuko? It does seem likely but then again, we have seen her get mad at him before...and I know I'd be pretty angry if my bf took off across the world leaving just a note to let me know.

Post by conspiracytheorist on Dec 9, 2007 21:18:10 GMT -5

luna said:

Is everyone sure she'll side with Zuko? It does seem likely but then again, we have seen her get mad at him before...and I know I'd be pretty angry if my bf took off across the world leaving just a note to let me know.

Yeah, we've seen her get mad at him... only to totally forget about it after just five minutes of bonding (and by bonding I mean being drama queen-ing) around a campfire:

I'm not saying any of this to be mean. I just don't see Mai getting the sort of screentime she would need to come to a believable decision with so much to cover in the last eleven episodes of this season. But I'd love to be wrong.

Post by luna on Dec 9, 2007 21:25:23 GMT -5

Post by mahatista on Dec 9, 2007 22:13:48 GMT -5

conspiracytheorist said:

luna said:

Is everyone sure she'll side with Zuko? It does seem likely but then again, we have seen her get mad at him before...and I know I'd be pretty angry if my bf took off across the world leaving just a note to let me know.

Yeah, we've seen her get mad at him... only to totally forget about it after just five minutes of bonding (and by bonding I mean being drama queen-ing) around a campfire:

I'm not saying any of this to be mean. I just don't see Mai getting the sort of screentime she would need to come to a believable decision with so much to cover in the last eleven episodes of this season. But I'd love to be wrong.

The thing about Mai is that she cares about nothing but Zuko. It's all Zuko. There is no way in the world she's going to choose anyone over him. She's even said it twice.

"I don't hate you." The Headband"I care about you." The Beach

She has shown no opinion one way or the other about right and wrong, but she'll choose right because Zuko will be there. If he had decided to stay with Ozai/Azula she'd be there. So thank goodness he made the right choice for once so Mai might find a little redemption too.

Which is a disturbing message to young girls, but hey...it's just TV.

luna: Yes, it's been confirmed that this season wraps up Aang and Zuko's arc. If there are more seasons they'll be about something else. Unless some fancy negotiations change the already set course, we're lookin' at the end.

Post by dragonflly on Dec 10, 2007 1:12:16 GMT -5

I still say Azula's going to use Zuko's defection as a means to turn Mai against him...

...or maybe that's just hope talking...

I'm sure she'll try, and yes I hope for this as well!!

Actually, I'm surprised at all of the "she'll just forgive him, and she should go find him" that I read everywhere.

Mai has an idea of what Zuko is, that kid from along time ago. Zuko is NOT that kid anymore, Zuko has hidden the real him from everyone for years, he's even hidden him from himself. Zuko does not know the real him anymore, how in the hell would Mai? Mai likes what she thinks Zuko is, but will she like what Zuko has become? I really think that is the real question.

As for the note, I don't think that Zuko would've been his ususal self. I do think he was trying to spare her feelings as best as he could, and I think it was as truthful and honest as it could get, he has no reason to lie to her. The truth will hurt and I'm sure she'll be angry and sad, any girl would be. I guess we'll have to see whether Mai wants the new Zuko, when he gets back will be the real test.

Post by luna on Dec 10, 2007 1:36:54 GMT -5

mahatista said:

conspiracytheorist said:

luna: Yes, it's been confirmed that this season wraps up Aang and Zuko's arc. If there are more seasons they'll be about something else. Unless some fancy negotiations change the already set course, we're lookin' at the end.

Lol, this is my first attempt at a quote, so if it doesn't work out forgive me. I am trying to reply to this season being the last. Does everyone hate this as much as me? And is there a thread discussing this?

Post by mahatista on Dec 10, 2007 2:14:35 GMT -5

luna said:

mahatista said:

conspiracytheorist said:

luna: Yes, it's been confirmed that this season wraps up Aang and Zuko's arc. If there are more seasons they'll be about something else. Unless some fancy negotiations change the already set course, we're lookin' at the end.

Lol, this is my first attempt at a quote, so if it doesn't work out forgive me. I am trying to reply to this season being the last. Does everyone hate this as much as me? And is there a thread discussing this?

There might be a thread on the general board.

Although I hate to see the characters go, I do believe in the finite arc. I think it's best to finish a story. And who knows? They may come up with something that has all new characters and storyline that can become just as beloved. Or they might come up with something even better.

I would hate to see the 'mythology' go away though. There are so many possibilities it would be a shame to have it end with just this one storyline.

@dragonfly: I think she'll definitely want the 'real' Zuko. She doesn't care whether he's good or bad. She doesn't challenge him to be better because she doesn't care what he believes in as long as he's romantically involved with her. He could walk through the door with severed heads tied to his belt and she'd be cool with it (unless he got blood on the floor and then she might complain ). Or he could walk through the door with Aang and say, 'here's my new best friend honey, we're going after the Fire Lord' and she'd be fine with it because he called her 'honey.'

That's where the problems come in for her. The only positive thing that could happen for a character like that is if he'd taken her with him (she'd have gone if he asked, no doubt in my mind). That didn't happen so her whole world is nothing until he comes back for her. In the meantime Azula will want to make use of her against him.

It's really a story worth so much more than the two minutes they'll give it before they have them start Maiking Out again.

Post by nandireya on Dec 10, 2007 2:32:25 GMT -5

dragonflly said:

Actually, I'm surprised at all of the "she'll just forgive him, and she should go find him" that I read everywhere.

There is also a flip side to this...

There are things that Mai has done that Zuko doesn't know about. How well do you think her callous disregard for her baby brother will sit with him if he were to find out about it? Family is important to Zuko...he stayed loyal to an abusive father for much longer than he should have.

How would he feel if he learns she was willingly hunting him down while he was a fugitive...a labelled traitor to the Fire Nation...with the knowledge that if she and her companions did capture him he'd be imprisoned or executed?

Perhaps there's a reason they're paths never crossed in season two.

Maybe she will forgive him...but if he learns about what she's been doing for the past several months (and he may well soon be in a position to do so) will he forgive her?

Post by luna on Dec 10, 2007 2:33:22 GMT -5

Oh I definately believe in the finite story, it just seems too short of a series for all the mythology they've cooked up. And it may seem silly, but it feels to me like there should be 4 seasons for the 4 elements. It seems that by naming the seasons after them (ex.: Book 3: Fire) they've set it up to have 4. I guess I'm overall disappointed by the 3rd season...lol, go ahead, crucify me. I feel like they're rushing everything and I just don't like it. Even if the 4th season was about rebuilding the world, I'd still like to see it.

Post by mahatista on Dec 10, 2007 2:37:03 GMT -5

^^I think he does know she was hunting him with Azula, but because Azula brought him into the fold instead of imprisoning him, it's all forgiven and forgotten (to him).

I think anything she's done before now he forgives. It's what she does from now on he'll look at differently. If he were to come to an agreement with the gaang (whether he joins them or not) and she attacks them he'll see her as the enemy.

Post by mindbender18 on Dec 10, 2007 2:41:00 GMT -5

There is also a flip side to this...

There are things that Mai has done that Zuko doesn't know about. How well do you think her callous disregard for her baby brother will sit with him if he were to find out about it? Family is important to Zuko...he stayed loyal to an abusive father for much longer than he should have.

How would he feel if he learns she was willingly hunting him down while he was a fugitive...a labelled traitor to the Fire Nation...with the knowledge that if she and her companions did capture him he'd be imprisoned or executed?

Perhaps there's a reason they're paths never crossed in season two.

Maybe she will forgive him...but if he learns about what she's been doing for the past several months (and he may well soon be in a position to do so) will he forgive her?

If it does come to that (which i doubt) he's going to forgive her because if he doesn't, he'll be a complete hypocrite. Zuko's done far worse things than Mai, and yet he wants people to forgive him, so he needs to give her (his girlfriend) the same