I just solved the mystery of existence.

We are however, only absolutely free PRIOR to choice and judgement. Prior absolute freedom of the mind then involves absolute non-attachment or
non-judgement, which for some might involve absolute forgiveness. It is also as the OP pointed out, a universal and non-localized phenomenon, which is
totally freaky imho, that the core self isn't localized within the body, that's asounding, that such a state of mind is even possible.

Your infinite understanding managed to be wrong about everything you assumed about me. Strange, that.

I couldn't learn anything from you even if I wanted to. Your type is marred with cliché and bad grammar, your ideas are stale and mediocre at best,
and you show little patience or politeness. How enlightened of you.

What does being outwitted by a loser, my "type," the one with the "retarded level of thinking" say about you? Not very much I suppose.

You're childishness and solipsism is laughable.

Farewell enlightened one.

i suppose when you finished convincing yourself that you will change the reality of the situation and of course... closing your eyes to the truth will
ensure that it doesnt exist. tutt tutt. what is it you hope to accomplish? that i will take your word for it that i havent achieved enlightenment?
that i dont walk out of my body when i want. that i cant speak to my dead grandma and many other dead ppl?

lol in fact. i am about to enter the astral plane now. yes right now baby. going to have a fly around and whatever else i feel like while there. what
are you going to do again? aww shucks, that's right you're not enlightened. damn, what a bother.

i dont know what you wish to defend when you say i am wrong about everything about you. when obviously you attacked someone's post who had a much more
clear understanding of things than more than 95% of the earth's population. while i stand claiming to be an elightened master and I APPROVE HIS
MESSAGE!

what was i wrong about again? oh yes, about defending a post that was full of truth from the barbaric logic reasoning of underdeveloped spiritual
minds.

that "humility" i spoke of earlier. is it returning yet? im certain that once u return to acceptance of your humble unknowing self you will find my
communication to be much more receptive. try not to shoot down those on the path to discovery. and if you are not sure for yourself. you have no
business to tell someone else they are wrong.

Just a general comment, being awakened is not the same as staying awake. Turning on the lights does not automatically mean you know what you are
looking at. What you do after you awake or turn on the light is what determines whether you are truly awake or still in sleep paralysis.

Originally posted by smithjustinb
Unfortunately, there will be those that disagree. As far as I'm concerned, those are the ones who aren't yet ready to fulfill their destiny.

Where do I start? Basically, we're stuck in the matrix. Allow me to explain.

Free-will vs. determinism.

Your mind is free. Your body is not. Your mind is one with the universe. Your body separates your mind from this unity. Your mind and your brain
are closely related, but not the same. Your brain functions according to your mind, but your brain is literally a prison cell. Your brain is part of
your body.

The Earth is under quarantine. Literally. This quarantine, this prison, is only temporary, and is for our benefit. Your mind is the universe and is
free. The quarantine, under the management of hyper beings, is for the purpose of protecting the mind from the body. The quarantine is for the
purpose of allowing us to come to the realization of absolute freedom, and not exposing us to it all at once (which would probably annihilate us, and
probably the mind too).

The mind is the universe and is all one. You are part of my mind and I am part of yours and we share this mind, because it is one. The only purpose
you have here is to come to freedom. Think about it. Is their any service you can perform that doesn't serve freedom? The increase of
technological efficiency IS the increase in freedom. We are learning how to become absolutely free. In order to do this, you must serve others. You
must make them free because they are your mind. In creating freedom for others, you loosen the grip your body has over your mind. Your mind will
slowly, but surely, come to absolute freedom.

The choosing self, the free self, cannot be simply an epiphenomenon of matter, according to many leading quantum physicists. In other words,
amalgamations of matter are inadequate to collapse the probability wave, for which a conscious choice is needed.

I can picture this in my mind, but don't see it. The "probability wave" sounds like an idea to me, not an actual occurrence.

If we are able to give something a description or name, wouldn't it immediately show that its natural occurrence?

Originally posted by 0mage
word of advice. if you figure it out and how to free your spirit from it's mental bond to the body/brain. dont tell anyone. leave them in their blind
misery. they dont want to know. they dont want to know from you especially. envy has a great deal to do with it. basically each achievement is for
yourself and noone else can achieve who doesnt care to know.

so count your blessings and basically.. # these blind douches who think they know everything about existence and aim to shoot you down. # em i say and
walk your path ALONE!

I get what your saying but there are people who are openminded so not everyone will be envious. Help the ones who want to listen and ignore the rest.
Nice thread op by the way. I do not see it your way but I have another approach but our views are somewhat close.

I am myself trying to figure out how the pineal gland and lucid dreaming really work and if faith has perception on what you see when you have it.
Should I be envious for people who understand this. Why? It does not help me understand what I want to figure out. And I am not sure I want to be told
how it works because I wanna be sure I am influenced as little as possible to see if I also can figure out how far perception screws up the test. I
once had a spiritual experiance (a sound in my voice) that was opposite of my faith/belief and I like that because it makes the action external of my
mind (and maybe even my unconcious). The otherside is still a little bit playing hide and seek with me to have me guessing/creating theories but
it/they are definetly making themselves known also (whatever they/it are).

Grow in your own pace and ask for help if you think you are stuck and confussed. One step at a time. There is no real hurry and experiances
changes/evolves both mind, body and soul. All will be home in the end.

Originally posted by NoLoveInFear46and2
I don't think you solved anything here, but cheers for your little idea there...

Mystery of existence? No one knows buddy, certainly not you (unless you've died seen the afterlife and understood life's meaning) but I highly doubt
it. Better luck next time!

What if you are both here (alive) and there (on the other side) at the same time? Do not sell his ideas short. He is very close to the ideas I had
before I had the moment.

My mind might not have the specifics technical terms right and all the specifics and I mighg be wrong about some things. But I think I got the overall
feeling right and the funny thing is that both Jesus and Buddha and Don Miguel Ruiz seem to have the same view (at least their message become very
alive when you read it from mye viewpoint). It is nice being more myself again and not so smallminded by the stupid conditioning I was taught.

Originally posted by NoLoveInFear46and2
I don't think you solved anything here, but cheers for your little idea there...

Mystery of existence? No one knows buddy, certainly not you (unless you've died seen the afterlife and understood life's meaning) but I highly doubt
it. Better luck next time!

ur so smug.

i have died and seen the afterlife. i understand fully life's meaning and the purpose of every human being. and guess what ive come to decide. F*ck
you all. work it out for your damn selves! you're not worth teaching with your judgemental smugness. everyone who comes to try to teach you. u
mistreat, abuse and even kill. soo guess what.. suck my d*ck. because i am certainly not going to be the one to enlighten a bunch of worthless
judgemental strangers. once i wanted to help but now.. u can all go to hell!

instead i choose to taunt you all for your limited understanding of life's mysteries. you all suck. are eternal stupid, ignorant hypocritical a-holes
who think because u cant see something it isnt there, yet never took the time to search. good on you. envy those who accomplish understanding. but who
laughs last laughs best. doubt me if you will.. only adds more to show that you dont know jack!

edit on 5-6-2012 by 0mage because: (no reason
given)

Hahaha. That post could have been written by me. They bug me out also with their ego and duality and make me increase my ego since they are so dense
and smallminded and now I creare a dulity with the knowers of All on one side and the evolving on the other. Hahaha.

Until the last soul is home. Soulbrother. But I did not say when so let them play around until the are bored or have hurt themselves enought to
listen.

In your OP, you conclude that the mind is free, and the body is not. Is this demonstrable in any case?

Is the mind not a product of the body?

The body is a product of the mind. Our experience of the universe is very limited. We've only experienced this one little rock. There are those
who's minds are free. They aren't limited to their bodies and can serve a functional purpose without one. They have realized their body and the
bodies of others as their mind. They have realized this whole thing is a mental experience that is supposed to utilize imagination to actualize their
freedom. In being more connected with their minds, they are more aware of their freedom and their imagination. I guess they found themselves to be
so free that their bodies could not contain them any longer so they stopped using them.

There is nothing to experience that doesn't exist and you are free to explore your imagination.

I catch your drift. Can you point me in the direction of those whose minds are free, so that I may research them and come to my own conclusions?

Everyone's mind is free. The body temporarily contains the mind. This does not mean the mind is now limited, or no longer free, its just that the
body is made unaware of the mind's freedom through the duration of the incarnation. These perceived limitations are illusions that are the product
of the brain's self-centered function. Freedom comes when the focus is taken off the self and put on others because it is the others that constitute
your mind and its freedom.

The brain is the interpreter of the mind. Its relativistic interpretations, which are mostly false, create the illusion of separation of mind, which
inhibits your ability to use your imagination, which is at the apex of your free mind.

You should try lucid dreaming. In lucid dreaming, you become much more aware of just how free your mind is.

I believe your problem with this thread is not with freedom, but with the idea that we are all one, which you have made clear you don't believe in.
I have one word for you on that matter:

That is about the full extent of my belief in oneness. But I also would like to add that such a system could not be possible if their was not an
underlying regulator of the system (unifier). The individual components of the system are unified because they are able to co-exist
inter-dependently. In other words, there is something between individuals that recognizes the relative importance of each individual in such a way
that it even allows them to co-exist in the first place, without destroying each other. Such compassion is unmatched by us mere humans, so there must
be a higher intelligence governing this quarantine. I know there is. I've seen them myself. They tried to quarantine me. But I'm gonna rise
above and get my freedom back.

You know. I joined abovetopsecret.com after my experiences. I think this place keeps my mind in check. I think it was part of the plan.

We are however, only absolutely free PRIOR to choice and judgement. Prior absolute freedom of the mind then involves absolute non-attachment or
non-judgement, which for some might involve absolute forgiveness. It is also as the OP pointed out, a universal and non-localized phenomenon, which is
totally freaky imho, that the core self isn't localized within the body, that's asounding, that such a state of mind is even possible.

Its not that we are no longer free after choice and judgment, its just that we are reluctant to change after the fact.

Once we decide on something, we beat the hell out of it for a long time. As you said, we must not get attached to our choices. We must let them come
and go.

When the day comes that you lose faith in this rubish ill be here holding out which ever hand im not currently punching somone with.

Horrible things happen everyday to little children.... people are horribly disfigured and disabled for life every day. Their souls... their god....
never make an apperance. You are ignoring all the disgusting things you refuse to see, but dont dispair for i made sure to remember them all.

I'm not ignoring anything. What rubbish are you referring to? I haven't advocated anything here except freedom. You got something against
freedom?

I agree with Wertdag. You can only have total freedom when all is totaly responsible with it. In place that are unevolved the middleway and even
rought karma is needed for the most unenlightened to behave. Sacrifice yourself for the right thing is a nice thing to do but it is only right when
your suroundings can learn from it and evolve. Sometimes being an asshole is the right choice. Some people cant handle nice and just take advantage
and demand more if you are not an asshole.

When the day comes that you lose faith in this rubish ill be here holding out which ever hand im not currently punching somone with.

Horrible things happen everyday to little children.... people are horribly disfigured and disabled for life every day. Their souls... their god....
never make an apperance. You are ignoring all the disgusting things you refuse to see, but dont dispair for i made sure to remember them all.

I'm not ignoring anything. What rubbish are you referring to? I haven't advocated anything here except freedom. You got something against
freedom?

I agree with Wertdag. You can only have total freedom when all is totaly responsible with it. In place that are unevolved the middleway and even
rought karma is needed for the most unenlightened to behave. Sacrifice yourself for the right thing is a nice thing to do but it is only right when
your suroundings can learn from it and evolve. Sometimes being an asshole is the right choice. Some people cant handle nice and just take advantage
and demand more if you are not an asshole.

Being an a$hole is my way of demanding respect of my freedom. It's my way of saying, "Hey, stop trying to control me" In inhibiting others'
freedom, you're inhibiting everyone involved's. I'm not going to allow that to happen. I will fight for my freedom and allow you yours. If you
try to control me, by me opposing that, I'm actually bringing you closer to your own freedom.

When the day comes that you lose faith in this rubish ill be here holding out which ever hand im not currently punching somone with.

Horrible things happen everyday to little children.... people are horribly disfigured and disabled for life every day. Their souls... their god....
never make an apperance. You are ignoring all the disgusting things you refuse to see, but dont dispair for i made sure to remember them all.

I'm not ignoring anything. What rubbish are you referring to? I haven't advocated anything here except freedom. You got something against
freedom?

I agree with Wertdag. You can only have total freedom when all is totaly responsible with it. In place that are unevolved the middleway and even
rought karma is needed for the most unenlightened to behave. Sacrifice yourself for the right thing is a nice thing to do but it is only right when
your suroundings can learn from it and evolve. Sometimes being an asshole is the right choice. Some people cant handle nice and just take advantage
and demand more if you are not an asshole.

Being an a$hole is my way of demanding respect of my freedom. It's my way of saying, "Hey, stop trying to control me" In inhibiting others'
freedom, you're inhibiting everyone involved's. I'm not going to allow that to happen. I will fight for my freedom and allow you yours. If you
try to control me, by me opposing that, I'm actually bringing you closer to your own freedom.

You can have all the freedom you want as long as you are avoiding ego parasitic behaviour (that is unsymbiotic control in your way of thinking). And
that is just a suggestion to keep you from hurting yourself in the end. Some people do not have the strenght yeet to defend themselves so sometimes
people around need to be wise and make sure they are given time to evolve.

But you and me both know we will probably never come to a place where you and me will have any wishes to control the other. We are probably on a
similar page but you describe it one way and I another.

Whether you know it or not, love is not an emotion. It is an action. It is any action that supports freedom. Somehow along the line, we've
completely forgotten about the concept of supporting freedom and we changed the definition of love to something love is not.

Maybe this whole reality is deception and death is the only hope of freedom.

In fact, that's what I think. This reality has "prison" written all over it.

It's in the walls - the finity. It's in the give and take. It's in the random dying.

When we come into this reality, we're in debt. We owe. Ain't it obvious?

Most of all, it's in the pain. Without the pain, the whole thing would collapse. Our whole system is dependent on pain for us to function optimally.
This is the best sign that this is hell.

We allow ourselves to embrace the deception and thus it's a neverending race to stay alive. Dodge this bullet, dodge that one. Recycle and repeat.
It's the death of a thousand wounds.

Why do we not leave? Because we're ashamed or because this is our sentence.

But anyway...

Maybe this is just random chaos and we've no choice. Is death a choice? Lets see, you can fight to survive or you can die and probably never exist
again. Which would you choose? So there's no choice and there's no reason either since it's universal chaos at the heart of a black hole (or
whatever).

so to the two people on here that are "so enlightend", wtf, ur arguing like little kids on who is more enlightened, i think we got a case of to
trolls falling in love, i wonder what it looks like when two trolls 69

In your OP, you conclude that the mind is free, and the body is not. Is this demonstrable in any case?

Is the mind not a product of the body?

The body is a product of the mind. Our experience of the universe is very limited. We've only experienced this one little rock. There are those
who's minds are free. They aren't limited to their bodies and can serve a functional purpose without one. They have realized their body and the
bodies of others as their mind. They have realized this whole thing is a mental experience that is supposed to utilize imagination to actualize their
freedom. In being more connected with their minds, they are more aware of their freedom and their imagination. I guess they found themselves to be
so free that their bodies could not contain them any longer so they stopped using them.

There is nothing to experience that doesn't exist and you are free to explore your imagination.

I catch your drift. Can you point me in the direction of those whose minds are free, so that I may research them and come to my own conclusions?

Everyone's mind is free. The body temporarily contains the mind. This does not mean the mind is now limited, or no longer free, its just that the
body is made unaware of the mind's freedom through the duration of the incarnation. These perceived limitations are illusions that are the product
of the brain's self-centered function. Freedom comes when the focus is taken off the self and put on others because it is the others that constitute
your mind and its freedom.

The brain is the interpreter of the mind. Its relativistic interpretations, which are mostly false, create the illusion of separation of mind, which
inhibits your ability to use your imagination, which is at the apex of your free mind.

You should try lucid dreaming. In lucid dreaming, you become much more aware of just how free your mind is.

That is about the full extent of my belief in oneness. But I also would like to add that such a system could not be possible if their was not an
underlying regulator of the system (unifier). The individual components of the system are unified because they are able to co-exist
inter-dependently. In other words, there is something between individuals that recognizes the relative importance of each individual in such a way
that it even allows them to co-exist in the first place, without destroying each other. Such compassion is unmatched by us mere humans, so there must
be a higher intelligence governing this quarantine. I know there is. I've seen them myself. They tried to quarantine me. But I'm gonna rise
above and get my freedom back.

You know. I joined abovetopsecret.com after my experiences. I think this place keeps my mind in check. I think it was part of the plan.

I don't entirely mind the whole oneness idea. Its only when ideas become dogmatic where my hackles go up, when people preach to me and others how we
should live. Its just seems to mostly happen in threads where "oneness" is the doctrine. I also have problems when people show a distaste for the
physical world, where everything they hold dear resides. By calling everything a figment of their imagination, they are calling me and everyone else
mere ghosts, unworthy of being real. I've lived in nature long enough to still find value in reality. There's still beauty here.

I have lucid dreamt many times, still do. I've played god in my own dreams. Even in these dreams, I know they aren't real, because I then hear the
thunder of my heartbeat, keeping me alive—then I awake, free.

I cannot deny your visions. I will give you the benefit of the doubt. But until I experience it myself, I must—unless I'm willing to do myself
great injustice—suspend judgement.

this is nothing new. in fact, if i'm right, this is some gnostic belief(at least the body is bad part, but if I'm right, the whole is)
as for being one. nah. not wanting to point fingers, so I will say that I am so fundamentally different from anyone I have ever met(and the people
whom the people I ever met, met

) that it is less than probable that this is the case. if it is, then I am all for secessionism. I will be the
Confederate States(such a bad pun)

Seriously, without individuality, and the ability that you can say: I see(the most beautiful expression)
what is the point? Call me a narcissist, and I will more than agree, but I will not submit to becoming one with all the other people.

Not because I am a spoiled brat or anything, but I had very bad experiences with people, I avoid them when I can, and the thought of me being one with
all of them, is like telling that when we die, our souls fly into the sun(heliophobia)to fuel it. Virtually every people(except one) I have ever met
in my life has in one way or another, stomped on me when given the choice. I don't hate people, I merely wish to be away from them(and possibly,
according to your belief, disconnected)

I am me, because I exist, and not because I am disconnected, but because I am a separate being. We are not ants, and I don't believe in groupthink.

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