“The [most recent] time was in the [2010s] when he left [the ring] and came to [the front office], immediately turning it into the stupidest thing in history and replacing a bunch of wrestlers I liked with his fat, shitty, aging friends.”

I know next to nothing about Japanese wrestling, Brandon, but your description of the Jumbo vs. Misawa match, just your re-telling of the story they told in the ring, gave me CHILLS. When we finally get to the point where Cena has that moment with a younger member of the roster, it will be amazing. Do I think it will ever actually happen? Probably not. But thank you for sharing that story and for the details you provided. I’ll have to check out that match right away.

I don’t know anything about the ole Nippon wrestling either. I got chills from that description also. I’d assume it was in AJPW before the split. What year was that match? Any help finding it would be appreciated.

I dunno about the triple h thing. It just doesn’t feel right. The whole story was building to bryan getting the title. This seems like a hard left out of the story they originally wrote. And yeah the belt doesn’t have to be on the best wrestler, but it shouldn’t be on an aging guy promoting a movie. But that’s just an opinion.

@Brandon – You’ll have to excuse me if I’m a bit skeptical about there ever being a payoff to Daniel Bryan getting thrown under the Authority Bus and run over and backed over and run over and backed over and run over and backed over and run over and backed over…

It’s also going to be a story about Triple H getting the win on the huge stage, and Bryan sneaking out a win on some secondary PPV. Not a win against Triple H, mind you, because we’ve seen that story before with Punk– I’d be surprised to see a rematch. Bryan will get his title victory over some Triple H stooge eventually. But he won’t get to beat the man himself.

Sometimes I think it’s a good thing that WWE randomly changes booking plans, or forgets their own history. Because otherwise, they’d be painting themselves into a corner. As long as Triple H is in power, there’s no (kayfabe, of course) logical explanation for Bryan getting a title shot. EVER. He’s just not a main event player, so there’s no reason HHH would ever even consent to a “OK, if you beat ___ you can have a title match” kind of stipulation.

Batista vs. Orton is your main event for the title. There’s no Shield Wyatts rerun. Bryan getting a mid card match against HHH is about as good a narrative denouement we can hope for at WM. Embrace it. Emotionally invest in Bryan finally beating that shitty, bullying boss. At least you’ll have a reason not to watch the main event after kicking your tellybox in.

Taker vs Sting at WM 30 as a one and done would be very cool. I’m not even a Sting fan, but them being staples of WWF and WCW facing on the 30th WM that Hogan is hosting… idk, seemed perfect!

Sting vs anyone else on the roster after the event is the lamest thing I’ve ever heard of. He’s old. And they’d bury him so bad it’d look like WCW Invasion angle all over again and come the following WM… the mystique of him vs Taker would be non-existent.

Of all the things that could get me to frustratingly shut off an episode of Raw (of which there are a myriad of possibilities), I think this is the first time that it was 100% the crowd. Dear GOD. This has always been the opposite side of the coin of a rebellious crowd that can chant Daniel Bryan into super-relevancy: stupid assholes that take it too far. Suddenly the idea of upsetting the balance is the WAY COOL AWESOMEZ thing to do and holy shit do I hate it. I’d have faith that Chicago will make up for it, but goddamn if they chant “CM Punk” during a Bryan (or Cesaro, or Sheamus, or The Shiled, or The Wyatts) match I will break my fucking television.

Like I think it’s ridiculous that Brandon catches a bunch of shit on twitter for being negative when that crowd last night just refused to LIKE anything. I know the chanting last night can be interpreted as being “smarky” or whatever, but it’s really just a refusal to sit back and ENJOY something. If you can’t get into some of those matches last night then what the fuck are you even doing at a wrestling show?

I completely agree with this. It’s as though they are looking forward to any chinlock for the opportunity to chant for a guy that willingly left almost a month ago. It’s getting to the point where it seems like the majority of crowds would rather boo something horrible than cheer for something amazing. I had the same problem with the Rumble crowd refusing to even entertain the fact that any match without Bryan could be worth watching – caught a lot of flack for that opinion (admittedly, this crowd was worse, and Orton vs Cena is a lot more tired than Bray vs Roman).

I just don’t understand the thought process of fans that watch something that can be so goddamn enjoyable for the seemingly sole purpose of shitting on it.

Roman Reigns and Bray Wyatt are probably the two biggest stars right now. Bray s got a victory over Bryan at the Rumble and Reigns has recently destroyed both Henry and Punk. These are big names and you should feel lucky you get to see them fight on Raw. Who the hell would start chanting for the announce team during it?

@Dan Spaceman I agree to an extent, but I think that if you watched both matches side by side in a vacuum (ignoring history, current angle, and crowd response), the difference would be a lot closer than “great” vs “mediocre.” That said, wrestling isn’t fun in a vacuum, so I do agree with your point.

The main point is that crowds, in general, are trending toward preferring to be a part of the show rather than just enjoying the show. Just looking at the difference between Cena/Orton at the Rumble vs Cena/Orton at Raw a few weeks later, the crowd’s capacity to at least attempt to enjoy the show has a huge bearing on the overall product.

If this genius idea is something that happens within the next year, then it absolutely HAS to be Cesaro. He might not become Misawa-level legendary figure, but he’s the one guy with the complete package to believably challenge Cena in that way. He has the bigtime swagger(sorry Jack)-bordering-on-arrogance necessary to rattle big Jern into frustration and mistakes. When Cena wants to throw bombs, Cesaro is every bit as strong and durable. When Cena wants to dig into his secretly super deep and awesome moveset, Cesaro can match him move-for-move and easily better him in technical prowess. He can answer everything Cena can throw at him.

It’s basically Cena taking on a better, younger version (though only by three years of age and one year of experience) of himself that has finally come into his own and simply. Will. Not. Be. Denied. And considering it was that absolutely wonderfulmazing Cena/Cesaro match that either started us down this rabbit hole in the first place or kicked the armchair booking into high gear, with Cena being forced to use that swanky desperation lariatOOOOOOO he didn’t even appear to know he had in his bag of tricks to help him put Cesaro away… Yeah, it’s pretty much a perfect scenario.

Of course, knowing WWE, they’ll do something silly like bring up the black hole of talent and charisma that is Corey Graves and give the push to him.

Do you think all the character development of The Shield has been from creative or from the guys themselves? I’m talking the subtle stuff, like Rollins always stepping in to keep a group going, or Roman being fed up with Dean and clearly starting to think he’s too cool for the group. It’s been phenomenal, they went from interchangeable swat guys to badasses with character traits.

@Fake
everytime they think of putting them in a dumb comedy segment or 3-1 loss to Cena, Roman flips his hair or Luke uses his piercing blue eyes, and Creative forgets what they were gonna do, then have Santino or R-Truth beat Fandango.

Thanks for all the content Brandon, I’m too burnt out on wrestling to even watch Raw after Elimination Chamber, and you’re reviewing both shows the day after they aired. You’re a fucking workhorse, man.

I swear I’m not trying to be the anti-Brandon contrarian asshole here, BUT…

Bryan vs. Triple H is a WORST not because we want to see Bryan win the belt like we want to see our favorite team win the World Series (though we do), but because we don’t want to see Triple H against Daniel Bryan. Yes, Bryan can have a good match against the proverbial broomstick, but he could have a GREAT match against a great wrestler, and that’s what WrestleMania should be all about. That, and we’ve seen Triple H divert and derail the people who should be on a rocket before (c.f., CM Punk, Brock Lesnar). Hell, we’re not getting ANY CM Punk at WrestleMania because of Triple H! Triple H isn’t a heel in the sense that I want to see him lose; I don’t want to see him in the ring, period. Next year, we’ll probably be talking about how disappointed we are in a Cesaro-Triple H match while having to suffer through a Cena-Orton main event.

And for the last time, it was perfectly reasonable and justifiable to expect D-Bry in the Royal Rumble not only because fans wanted it, but because there was precedent for guys who had already been in matches that night being in the Rumble (Goldust and Cody).

HHH beating Lesnar was worse than him beating Punk. At least Punk had some kind of interference, was on a B-PPV, and Punk had years to make people forget. Lesnar is an attraction who’s only purpose is to be an impressive killer or an impressive kill and they had a mostly-retired guy beat him on the biggest show of their year.

But yeah, I’m not looking forward to Bryan vs HHH unless it’s for a title shot later that night. I’m sure it will be good and I’ll cheer, but it’s not what I really want.

I agree with all you guys in this thread. I just am waiting for this to end and us to move on (and have been for f*cking months, every day and every freakin’ minute or friggin’ second of it!)

also, yeah, hhh beating lesnar was worse than him beating punk. hhh beating lesnar on mania is my least favourite moment of my least favourite match of 2013, which was one of my favourite years in wrestling.

*in a few years*
Seth: “Thanks for saving me guys. Getting brainwashed by Bray is no joke.”
Dean: “You’re telling me. I still think I’m a chicken. I’m a chicken, Roman!”
Roman (with a hand on his face): “I know, I know.”

I think that they need to make Batistia a heel, and somehow make Orton a face… or maybe just switch up the booking in the match, like they did with the boxer who’s name I can’t remember that fought Big Show at Wrestlemania 2008.

It would’ve been SO EASY last fall when the Authority were actually acting like powermad heels to have Triple H call Cole into the ring for a ‘job evaluation’ when Cole was pointing out how Bryan was continually being screwed. HHH points out that three years ago Cole hated Bryan, and Cole can simply say that Bryan proved him wrong. BAM — gets Bryan over even more, and it would’ve even gotten Cole over as a likable face announcer rather than someone the audience simply tolerates.

I’m not from Des Moines, so don’t think I’m sticking up for them– however, Des Moines is a lot better than Sioux City. It was Sioux City you’re remembering as the really shitty crowd. Northwestern Iowa/Northeastern Nebraska sucks.

Also, hiyo, guy who was at the show last night here, and if you thought watching it on tv was frustrating, watching it live wasn’t much better. I’m probably super jaded by indy wrestling, but trying to get a FIVE, FIVE, FIVE chant going for Big E (nee Langston) only to be met with silence is super disheartening.

My buddy sat closer to the entrance stage, and he said barely anyone around him made a single peep all night.

I see what you’re saying about HHH vs. Bryan, but I respectfully disagree.

HHH isn’t important anymore. Bryan is being wasted on him, and this is likely just another instance in the long line of Bryan’s story never paying off.

WWE is inviting the worst crowd reaction to a match in history. It’s going to be bad, and we’re both going to be there live contributing to it.

That shitty thing is that Orton deserves better. He’s the real victim here. Bryan is still trying to break through that glass ceiling, but Orton already has. He’s been great recently, and no matter how good he is at WM, the crowd is going to ruin him.

From our perspective (as a bunch of people who sit around and talk about wrestling on the internet) Triple H isn’t important anymore. But to the average WWE fan he is the most important company guy right after Vince (even though Vince is hardly around anymore), so he’s still story-line important.

@LCBS
HHH is definitely a “You can fool some of the people all the time” kinda guy. He booked himself as nigh-unstoppable for the past decade or so, I don’t blame people for thinking he is and cheering for it. It worked.

Triple H is a solid A- guy who thinks he should be an A+ and becomes unbearable due to his insistence about it. He’s a “student of the game”, which means even he was an active wrestler, he seemed more preoccupied with his future legacy than what he was doing at the time. It’s odd. He’s like a post-modern self-serving booker.

I’ll say it again. Randy Orton needs to be written like a Bond villian. Orton’s in ring heel work has been great. But his promo’s need him to be more condesending and bad ass. Let him ridicule his opponents and have him acting more superior and invincible. Then just before his big matches, have him come out and over explain his plan to the world only to have it turn on him and be the reason why his plan is beat by the good guy. Make him the Bond villian the WWE Universe needs!!

WWE only knows how to book heel champions as snivelling, whiny cowards. That’s my biggest peeve with how they book heel with gold. They took all of Punk’s righteous fury and transformed it into grade-school petulance. And, like you’re calling for Wackazoa, Orton could be an all-around great heel if they’d just let him be the clever bad-guy ALL THE TIME instead of just in the ring.

I’m guessing HHH vs Bryan will be a stipulation match (win and get a title shot, lose and get sent to TNA, something like that). D-Bry wins and, after Orton goes over a hyperventilating Boo-tista, out comes Mr Yes to get just and sweet revenge.

Actually it seems that Batista gets the title at Mania. Then he probably fights Orton for a rematch, then another guy. While Bryan wins v. HHH then goes on to win MIB. Then Bryan cashes in on Batista after his movie is out and they are done with his press circut. Then Bryan gets the title until the next Mania and we see if he is better for the company than Punk was or Cena. But then Cena probably beats Bryan at Mania and the world explodes.

I had a sickening, but also sort of hilarious fantasy booking moment just now:
– Bryan being interviewed backstage at ‘Mania (they’ve been playing clips from Axxess all week, showing fans YES’ing and being super-excited to meet Bryan)
– Bryan says he will beat HHH. Vince enters into frame, mentions that he has a “business proposition” for Bryan…
– Vince comes out right before the match and announces that if Bryan wins, he gets put in the main event. HHH is enraged.
– HHH wins anyway. Super Dome is enraged.
– Fans walk out en masse during the main event, chanting loud, completely audible profanities.
– Minor rioting in New Orleans, half a dozen people are injured.
– WWE is forced to sanitize their product in to the most saccharine unwatchable thing ever.
– We all find other things to do.
– “Meet Me There” loses in a hard fought Oscar battle to “Inside Llewyn Davis 2”

Last week I went to the show here in Denver, and I was basically overwhelming myself with anxiety because I was worried that the crowd was going to be what Green Bay was tonight. We were mostly good. There was a ‘boring’ chant during Kane-Bryan that was not productive, and I wish they were louder for Cesaro, but we were mostly loud and participatory as far as that goes.

I spent all of Raw last night just wantonly incensed about everything (I’m usually so good at compartmentalizing!), but those idiots weren’t helping.

Two items: First, if we were friends and you got a job at a call center your new name would absolutely be “Call Center Brandon.”

Second, I think part of why guys like Sheamus and Christian don’t get the same love for their in-ring work as DBry and Cesaro is that, because they came up through the WWE system, their movesets are pretty much identical to everyone else’s. They might be executing and selling them better, but they’re the same moves everyone else uses. Who else in the ‘E does a dropkick like Daniel Bryan? Nobody. Who does [insert literally anything Cesaro’s done in the past 3 or 4 months] other than Cesaro? Nobody.

That was going to be my point, too. I love me some Christian and Sheamus, but Bryan and Cesaro are just way more impressive. Bryan is one of the most versatile wrestlers of his generation and probably ever, since he seems to be able to go hold for hold and fly around at 1000 mph at and equally awesome level, and Cesaro… well, shit, he’s Cesaro. He swings and deadlifts people twice his size and tosses guys up before decapitating him. Also sometimes does springboard psycho crusher uppercuts. Also… (dies of old age before managing to finish gushing about how awesome Cesaro and Bryan are)

I was so pissed at that Green Bay crowd. I mean Reigns vs. Wyatt is going to be your title match at Mania in two years and they chant “Husky Harris”. Jaysus. I want to fly Colin Kaepernick out there to shit in each and every person’s cheerios.

Well, I thought Sunday was the setup they needed to just put Bryan in the damn triple-threat, and I was wronger than hell. So here’s the last feasible thing I can think of to make all of this work together and still have the payoff it should.

Bryan gets HHH to accept the Mania match, knowing he’ll never get him to just put him in the title match by demanding it. So he does or says something that enrages Hunter to the point where he takes the match, not because Hunter thinks Bryan deserves to face him, but because he wants to kill him.

Once he does, Bryan says something like “if I beat you, I’m in the title match.” Playing on Hunter’s ego. It puts Hunter in the position where if he says no, he’s copping to thinking Bryan could beat him. Almost shames him into agreeing.

From there you could even have Batista do Hunter’s dirty work in softening Bryan up, since he wouldn’t want him in the match either. Big Dave would have ridiculous heat, and it’d make Orton even more jealous and paranoid.

Just wanted to get that out before they do something else awful next week and make it all impossible.

It is FUN how they keep moving the goalposts further and further back and we keep improvising workable solutions to get the satisfying ending the entire crowd wants and they keep running in and kicking them over, isn’t it?

I think WWE already knows that the post-mania RAW crowd is going to want only who they know they want, and they’ll give us something like dolph ziggler’s title win last year.

infact, batista could win the belt at mania, and bryan beats hhh, and then, at RAW, we get bryan beating batista for the belt! RAW moments > wrestlemania moments. more people watch it, actually (I think). it’d be deafening and in front of just the right crowd.

I would love so hard if Cena became kinda what William Regal is now. He starts losing to these young guys and initially can’t accept it, but eventually he grows to crave fighting the up-and-comers, even though he knows he can’t beat them. Like Brandon puts it, he’s an early level boss. Because he also knows the best way to stay relevant long after you’ve retired is to go over all the matches you had with the dudes that are now carrying the company.

Wow you chose my throwaway comment! I’m yours forever, feminist vegans unite!
Ambrose being the personal shopper of the Shield was one of the funniest things I’ve read in a while. And I’m so excited that you’re doing more stuff with Aubrey, I started watching his podcasts after you were on the first time and he’s so cheeky, I love it.

Every crowd does that. They count seconds instead of revolutions. Kinda like when Castagnoli did 100 rotations, but it was just the crowd that counted to a 100, he actually did about 80. It’s like that with every swing he does.

Is it just me or was that Roman Reigns vs Bray Wyatt match boring and dull? I LOVE me some Bray, I think he is a future start heel for sure, but I just think Roman cannot carry a match as well as Rollins and Ambrose, Sure he has 3 awesome moves but… uh I dunno. Im not convinced by him. I much rather see Ambrose or Rollins on top. Rollins was spectacular on EC and yesterday doing that save!

Yeah, his match against Punk was kinda slow to start with too. I think they should still go ahead with The Shield break-up though. Roman’s not gonna get better at singles working tag-teams. Sink-or-Swim, ‘ya know?

This pretty sums up my thought of the problem not being Triple H/Daniel Bryan by itself.

Batista is the entire problem. He isn’t any shape to be wrestling and no one wants to see him, and now they seem to think it is wise to lean into the boos like people want to pay to see Batista lose when the truth is no one wants to pay for Batista to do anything and most of us will watch him to get to parts we actually want to see which is literally anybody else the pay to wrestle.

I was actually very disappointed in Cole last night during the Big E/Cesaro match, Brandon. JBL asked him what the E stood for, we got a minute of near-silence while Lawler rambled senilely and Cole actually Googled Big E’s first name, and then he responded, and THEN it really went downhill as you mentioned.

infact, I never like wrestling shows to aknowledge wrestlers having other real names in first place… JBL shouldn’t have asked in first place and f*ck him for it. but it’s ok that cole saved it, although it was a bit slow.