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Made the ProPress Plunge

04-09-2010, 11:13 PM

I noted in another thread that I finally bit the bullet and bought me a ProPress too.

While at Allan J Coleman's picking up some ProPress fittings and the rental RP 330 B tool. I was talking to Marvin pricing out a corded RP 330, the RP 210 and he has brand new in the box the RP 100 as well.

After some careful thinking about which one would fit my needs as a service plumber. I ended up buying the RP 100. The reason is 98% of my work is 3/4 and 1" copper pipe. The RP 100 does 1/2" 3/4" and 1" pipe perfectly, and it uses the Makita battery. The difference between the RP 100 and the RP 210 is the jaw swivel, (RP 100 = 90º) (RP 210 = 270º) which is a small plus for the RP 210 The RP210it can press 1 1/4" pipe which I do not run into at all around here so that is an option I do not need, and the battery is the newer Ridgid battery, which I consider a negative due to the reviews I seen here in the forums. (sorry Ridgid) Now as for going with the RP 330C (corded model) I like the idea of having a power cord verse a battery. But the tool was a lot more expensive due to the fact it comes with jaws to do 1 1/2" and 2" pipe which I do run into, but only 2% of the time. So I figured if I have to press the larger pipes, I will just rent it from AJ Coleman.

Now I did get to use it on a couple jobs. First one was a car wash area in a car dealer ship which had a jumble of pipes. I have the before picture, I will post the after picture tomorrow.

The second job was at a brewery that has a keg wash station that was being supplied with a garden hose from across the main floor. In both cases I only had a limited amount of time to have the water shut off. The brewery more so. At the brewery I used all Propress fittings from where I tied in 20' in the air right to the keg wash. I cut in the tee and pressed it in with a ball valve up high so I was able to turn the water back on the the brewery in less than 5 minutes. The care wash I just used a pair of Propress male adapters and ball valves. I put the males into the duel checks with a short piece of pipe into the ball valves pressed away and had the water back on in 3 minutes. Then used solder fittings from the ball valves on.

I give this tool 5 stars. It is defiantly a time saver, no more having to freeze pipes, or drain down a whole system.

Comment

Both copper sweat and Viega ProPress have a 50 year residential warranty.

Viega's warranty on commercial is only 2 years.

And I haven't found any warranty for commercial sweat joint copper.

The warranties cover the repair only, at the discretion & after the investigation of the company.

AGGRESSIVE WATER IS EXCLUDED in both warranties. But there is no definition of what "aggressive water" is in the warranty writing. That leaves too open of an interpretation for the manufacturer in my opinion.

In short, neither warranty seems to be much more than a sales tool to me.

Both copper sweat and Viega ProPress have a 50 year residential warranty.

Viega's warranty on commercial is only 2 years.

And I haven't found any warranty for commercial sweat joint copper.

The warranties cover the repair only, at the discretion & after the investigation of the company.

AGGRESSIVE WATER IS EXCLUDED in both warranties. But there is no definition of what "aggressive water" is in the warranty writing. That leaves too open of an interpretation for the manufacturer in my opinion.

In short, neither warranty seems to be much more than a sales tool to me.

J.C.

I have worked on enough of these to tell you the manufacturer brings in a Metallurgist to make the call on failures. I know it is popular to hammer manufacturers after a failure but whether it is a pressed fitting or a sweat fitting the manufacturers really do want to know the truth in case there is an issue.

yet i repair copper leaks every couple days. how long is the warranty on copper tubing and soldered joints

unless you have real facts, and real data, your way off.

rick.

Dont get me wrong propress has its place. But imagine if we had it 50 years ago. With all the forclosed homes now that have no water in the system from the city shutting them off. All those o-rings dry out and when the bank finally sells the home years later you turn water back on and every dried out propress o-ring joint will leak. That is a fact! I say keep them out of walls and underground and never use in new construction.

Dont get me wrong propress has its place. But imagine if we had it 50 years ago. With all the forclosed homes now that have no water in the system from the city shutting them off. All those o-rings dry out and when the bank finally sells the home years later you turn water back on and every dried out propress o-ring joint will leak. That is a fact! I say keep them out of walls and underground and never use in new construction.

Remember, these are not rubber o-rings and do not share the same characteristics.

Comment

I have worked on enough of these to tell you the manufacturer brings in a Metallurgist to make the call on failures. I know it is popular to hammer manufacturers after a failure but whether it is a pressed fitting or a sweat fitting the manufacturers really do want to know the truth in case there is an issue.

Mark

Doubt Viega will ever need a metallurgist with the thickness of their fittings. Their weakness will be in the EPDM O-Ring.

But, it does make you wonder if turbulence on the exit side of the pipe will cause wear that would be unwarranted.

Do you know of any long-term-wear/flow tests done on copper, PEX, ProPress, etc.?

Thanks.

J.C.

I have not seen any long term testing per say but I have seen accelerated testing which is meant to simulate long term testing. Non-laminar flow is a killer.

Here is some info I just found on the Viega web site:

What level of turbulence is caused by ProPress fittings and will it cause premature wear in copper tubing?
The long radius of ProPress elbows reduces the turbulence typically experienced with traditional short radius fittings. Not reaming the ID of the tubing is the largest contributing factor to turbulence and premature wear of any piping system and would be a concern in any copper joining system.

What are the flow rates through ProPress fittings?
Because of the long radius the flow rate is better than standard short radius solder fittings. Flow rates and flow rate calculations are the same as those used for solder fitting installations.

I'm curious why the flow rates are the same as they seem to be better. Perhaps they are being conservative.

Comment

Yeah, I did read that at Viega's site awhile ago. Might end up being the best all the way around.

But I would prefer independent test to failure with flow (accelerated maybe) of the various approved systems with varying water chemistries.

That would seem to define everything and give the information so the installer could make the best decision for the application. I think if they would have done this they would have known about things like the dezincification of some fittings before they put them on the market and could have stopped alot of damage from happening.