This will be my 2nd PBEM game with AE and now I'am definately fully booked.

I will always try to do an AAR to show respect to my opponent.

This time I will be facing Katsuragi.

The older forum members might better know him as Warspite. There are couple of enjoyable AAR in the classic witp forum where he clashed out with Kaleun. I think he is also one of the few players that have actually completed and seen the auto-end screen in witp.

The title of the game is "lessons learned". I think it appropriate since it has been tough school vs Dave (erstad). Well, I think I have learned quite a few tricks from here and there. At this point I would like to ask that anyone posting here do not make reference to my other PBEM game. Dave is more than welcome to browse here so it would violate our game. That game is very much in motion. That is an respectful request on my part.

We are playing with scenario 6 which is historical december 8th start. So, no worries about "nuke" Pearl Harbour assaults or such.

Not many houserules but the following are imposed....

- NO resource/industry bombings in china. - PP needed to move troops in or out of china/manchuko. Even if the china falls than you need buy those troops out. - Invasions must be made on base hexes. - Other than this... well as said common sense is the best thing to have.

Game setup is as follows....

FOW: ON Advanced weather: ON Allied damage control: ON PDU: ON Reliable USN torpedoes: OFF Realistic R&R: ON No unit withdrawals: ON Reinforcement Variability: +/- 60 days Turn cycle: 2 days

That is pretty much it. I have no idea what kind of player my opponent is but that is fine. He did give kaleun hard time in classic witp so I have no doubt he is very competent indeed. Also, he did finish the game with 1 day turns so that is amazing achievement of it's own.

Hey Aztez, nice that you're doing yet another AAR, that'll be quite a bit of work. I'd be interested in the differences you experience in China, with the different garrison requirements. By the way, is reliable torpedoes really on or is that a typo ?

I did feel that Force Z needed to sortie towards enemy landings made at Khota Baru. In this scenario I could easily have it withdrawn into safety.

Instead they Force Z left Singapore on early morning of december 8th 1941.

RAF provided aircover with Buffalo fighters set on LRCAP along the coast. As expected the japanese Betty/Nell bombers did show up but the Buffalo's managed to protect the ships.

At the sunrise on december 9th 1941 the battleships spotted enemy surface fleet in Khota Baru. This resulted to an awesome duel which was nice to follow in the game. The first battleship salvos of the war was fired by Prince of Wales and scored hits on BB Haruna. This battle raged on and the final outcome is best shown by combat.txt file...

By looking at the battle BB Haruna, BB Kongo and CL Jintsu might be on deep trouble. Heavy fires and super struckture hits were reported.

The Force Z is pretty much done for since additional torpedo hits were reported after the battle. Those hits were done by Betty bombers flying out from Saigon area.

RAF performed well and shot down around 15-20 Betty/Nell bombers. The Buffalo's are total waste of time for sure.

I opted not send my bombers on navalstrikes and insted bombed Singora airfield and enemy ground units at Khota Baru. The results were mediocre at best. The Khota Baru was overrun on the december 9th and only few hits were reported at Singora.

Smeulders: Thanks. Well the torpedoes were meant to be historical but I'am not sure now since I didn't setup the game. That info was copy & paste from the opponent wanted section.

I know it will take extra time to keep the AAR on this game too but as said it will be fun for him later on to read. Same goes for Dave too.

A bit early to see what kind of AAR this turns out to be. At least trying to keep it informative and easy to read.

We are using the latest beta patch from the start so the china ought to be diffrent. Very diffrent or at least I expect it to be. I'am taking very conservative approach there at the start. Trying to save supplies and not to fight on open terrain which seems very suicidal in many ways. The new patch seems to have tweaked quite a few things there though. Most importantly the effect of artillery.

Only HR there is no resource/industrial bombings made other than that game on.

More on the china front once the game is moving on a bit. I did only receive the combat file so no way to check much out yet.

All in all confident that the performance in china will be solid. Thanks to the forum members who have given thoughts in my other game.

Hey Aztez, nice that you're doing yet another AAR, that'll be quite a bit of work. I'd be interested in the differences you experience in China, with the different garrison requirements.

For reference, although the garrison requirements don't update with a patch, I've been observing the new garrison requirements manually since they were updated (made a little spreadsheet with the locations and values). So whatever you are seeing in the other AAR (which, as aztez stressed, should not be discussed here!) reflects the new garrison rules.

Of course, those only came along with one of the patches, so that's not quite the same thing as having the rules in place the entire game.

jrlans: Thanks. I will try to few diffrent variations with this game. A bit too early to go into details since I want to have "the feel of the opponent" first.

I try not lose any sleep over those torpedoes! [:D] ...I know it is going to tough but one must try! [:D]

Dave: I have no idea what changes they actually have done to the garrison requirements but I take your word for it. After all I kind of "know" how calculating opponent you are. This is most definately in an good way.

Lets just say that our china affair has been quite an "beta" test overall. No regrets though since I think we have helped quite a few fellow gamers here.

I'am trying to maximise few things in this PBEM which I didn't pay enough focus when the AE was released. Ie. pilot training, china experience and some of the air to air modifications. There are good debates in War Room and valid points. I have not posted anything since the debate is getting quite hot as one can expect.

Good to see you here and as said more than welcome addition to this AAR.

- I have ordered an heavy minefields to be layed at Vigan & Aparri. - The philippine airforce will be gathered at Manila. - I'am prepping troops for on Clark Field and Manila. I still think these two bases are best suited for the defense here. - PT boats will engage the enemy landings at Vigan while US destroyers are waiting for the japanese at Aparri. - We did an heavy local minesweeping missions near Bataan and managed to clear a lot of mines. Not an single mine hit reported to the merchant fleets.

Those are the guidelines. Here is an pic from the turn 1 and I do expect to see a lot of action next turn.

Hm, would you be interested in a fortress Java approach? I ran the numbers once and one can add about 2k AV from reinforcements if you manage to ship in troops until about march. If you don't change the targets for your troops then the ones already there can also train up to reasonable levels.

In addition, if you ship in stuff from west coast you can also build up a reasonable air force. Hurricanes will also help a lot as they are the best weapon against stratosphere sweeps, being better at high altitude than the rest of Japanese fighters.

If you also use your carrier air then you can sting your opponent badly. Especially so if you manage to do the buildup undetected. He cannot leave Java unconquered and it's really hard to isolate it and blockade it continually, as he can only keep the Indian ocean side clear with his carriers.

String: That is one option I have been thinking about too. I did that once in witp and it was quite an succes. Well, enough so that opponent vanished!

Currently moving those british units into Rangoon but they could easily be diverted into Java region. That is an tempting idea and will think about it once the next turn arrives.

Hurricanes are ok fighters but really have tough time againts Tojo's. The "stratosphere" battles are something I want to avoid seeing so I might talk to my opponent about this. Not very realistic at all in the current model.

Luckily I have my carriers available now. That is something you really need. I should have 4 US CV's plus CVL Hermes linked up within a month or so.

Hmmm, that Java fortress idea is very tempting indeed! It would be an show for sure.

Oh... and nice to see you here too.

Rob: I know! How can one help himself??? [:D] ...actually it much more fun to keep these AAR's ongoing. They add flavour to the all the pain and mental suffering.

LoBaron: Thanks! It will be time consuming for sure! Very early days here but looking forward to how the Luzon campaign begins. I did few plunders there and could have been more aggressive too.

String: That is one option I have been thinking about too. I did that once in witp and it was quite an succes. Well, enough so that opponent vanished!

Currently moving those british units into Rangoon but they could easily be diverted into Java region. That is an tempting idea and will think about it once the next turn arrives.

Hurricanes are ok fighters but really have tough time againts Tojo's. The "stratosphere" battles are something I want to avoid seeing so I might talk to my opponent about this. Not very realistic at all in the current model.

Luckily I have my carriers available now. That is something you really need. I should have 4 US CV's plus CVL Hermes linked up within a month or so.

Hmmm, that Java fortress idea is very tempting indeed! It would be an show for sure.

Oh... and nice to see you here too.

Rob: I know! How can one help himself??? [:D] ...actually it much more fun to keep these AAR's ongoing. They add flavour to the all the pain and mental suffering.

LoBaron: Thanks! It will be time consuming for sure! Very early days here but looking forward to how the Luzon campaign begins. I did few plunders there and could have been more aggressive too.

Oh.. and I'am still waiting to see "the one" started by you and Rob.

I wanted to try it out myself, but I haven't been able to secure a Japanese opponent. So far all of them have quit before Feb 1942.

If you do adopt the strategy I have a few suggestions.

First of them would be to recombine any and all units you can when you ship them in. They will be much more capable that way.

Second, there are three mobile CD units in Australia, and two of the contain 16 6" guns. Place them in right positions, Ambon, Kendari and such spring to mind, and you can wreak havoc with Japanese shipping. I suggest placing atleast one at either Batavia or Soerabaja, depending on which end of the island you are going to defend. Defending the whole island is in my opinion unrealistic in the long run and you'll probably have to withdraw to just one end. The Batavian end has better terrain and airbase options I think. With the CD unit at either of those bases they become much less vulnerable to shore bombardment, as the tend to disrupt the bombardments and will keep the ships at arms length.

The third suggestion is AA. Grab every AA unit you can find and chuck them into Java, and use them to cover your main airfields. They will attrit Japanese level bombers and will be very nasty to KB dive bombers and generally everything below 10k feet. Even above 10k they will bite a bit.

I already mentioned the fourth but i cannot stress it enough, don't change the targets for your units, leave them as they are as they will only train when they're at 100 prep points. This is not a requirement with 55+ exp units that can't train anymore, but most of yours are below that. The faster you get to 100 prep the faster you gain exp and exp is more important than prep points.

Fifth suggestion would be to conserve your torpedo bombers, that is Swordfish and Vildebeests, pull them back immediately, and start training them up. When the time comes and KB approaches to smash your defences you should have enough fighters in Java that, barring bad coordination luck, you should get a bunch of those old biplanes through to the japanese carriers and ..

edit: Oh and the Tojo, arriving in mid '42 is the least of your worries early on I think.

A couple of thoughts. Naval bombardments are toned down quite a bit. Nice CD units would be wasted at Batavia and Soerabaja because they are not prime landing sites. Put them where you believe they will hurt troop ships.

I would recomeded defending the Soerabaja end for the large working port and repair yard. Also evac every S boat you can from manila. The S-Boats with working torps are deadly (even more so after radar) use them in the many straits and dont be affraid of shallow water. I generaly find it works best if I keep 2 boats patroling 2 or 3 hexs that way the boats move and drop detection level but you always have a boat where you want one.

String: It sound like you have been very unlucky with your PBEM partners. I can only imagine how frustrating that is since have been lucky enough to avoid these kind of situations. I can only say thank you to all the opponents I have been honoured to go againts.

The whole Java fortress thing comes down to delaying japanese advance in Malaya and Luzon as long as possible. This thing needs time but definately intresting approach so why not. I'am sold to this. As said been thinking about it and nothing gamey on defending this area from the start.

If nothing else it will be intresting to see how it plays out. Very happy on how Force Z performed that is minus 2 battleships I need to worry about for longtime.

I will divert the 18th UK division, brigade and some other units into Java. Also, I will browse through to see what else is available from the start. I think there was an AA unit available at Cape Town.

Those CD units at Australia are somewhat useless there so will definately deploy them. I think one of the places we need to strenghten our forces is Palempang too. Even an brigade with CD unit can be real pain. This is one of the places he needs to be for sure. Another "2 deployments" I need to check when the turn arrives.

RAF torpedo bombers are already out of Malaya. These are now deployed at Singkawang and Kuching area. He will be coming here fast I think so these might be nasty suprises for him. Another thing is that this are is already mined too. Around 150 mines in all of the bases here.

Mini KB is lurking around Luzon and KB is heading home so he does not have the naval support required to seize these without substantial harm to his transports. Already have deployed couple of Dutch submarines here too.

AA units are "valuable" and allies do not lack of them so that is an good suggestion.

I'am already training those dutch bombers at 70% naval strikes. Hopefully they can be much more menace now on.

No worries I know the importance of prepping points. They are absolutely must to adjust immediately.

Thank god for the no "Tojo" worries. This aircraft is really an killer in AE.

It is hard to check details since I don't have the turn but lets light up Java and surrounding areas. It ought to be blood bath for both sides...

witpqs: Welcome! I have to agree that placing CD units either at Soereabaja or Batavia will be waste of time and resources. I doubt there will be much of naval bombardments since he will most likely rely on his airforce to do the job.

I have only seen couple of really "nuked" naval bombardments in AE anyways so if they are reduced even further than the risk to the japanese player outweight the gains in my opinion.

jrlans: Absolutely agree. The detection levels on submarine effectiviness are big part on how effective they are.

If even single detection level is shown I will move them "out". I haven't used much of "wolfpacks" since I kept them in single formation. The "trick" you described is worth of trying.

The S-boat endurance/range is too small to station them at CenPac so they will be moved into DEI once the Luzon campaign is over and done with. The "longer ranged" submarines however are withdrawn into CenPac and Southern Pacific.

Hmmm, I'am not convinced on Soerabaja. It basically comes down to the fact that which one of the bases are harder to hit by his airforce. If we can delay him at Palempang and Singkawang/Kuching than Soerabaja. Otherwise I think Batavia is more suited for this since it is "safer".

The above argument also shows that Palempang must be reinforced too so that it takes an effort to seize. I would mind seeing some of the resources damaged there either.

I would also suggest defending Clark and then tacticaly retretaing to batan. IMO manila just isnt worth it; all it gives you is a 100 supply a day and even that can be stoped by moving a unit into the city. Light urban just isnt worth defending when you get the same defence bounus from clark and a retreat path to a hex thats just as good with new forts.

Also i wouldnt bother trying to build forts past 2 or 3 on clark instead i would ship almost every engenner i could find to battan and build that to 4 or 5 if your oppenent doesnt plaster the port or airfield.

I personally chose Batavia side, as Soerabaja is a clear hex and the repair yard will be unusuable in the case of a proper assault anyway. I cannot stress it enough though that if you do choose this strategy, then send everything you can over there, all the units at sea on turn 1 should go there imho.

edit: Oh and while my japanese opponents have run away my allied opponent is Andy Mac so I'm quite solid on that front :)

In my PBEM (me playing Jap) my opponent used a similar tactic, by concentrating his forces in MANILA, leaving BATAAN nearly undefended. It was easily taken by me and since the, I am doing not much more, then moving in and out the bay of MANILA and send his forces greetings with my battlewagons. Sure MANILA is a nice place to defend, but if you make your stand at BATAAN, he can not use MANILA as a port anyway. Just my 2 cents.

BTW: Nice combat at KHOTA BARU. If I was the Jap, it would already have cased me a heart attack

jrlans: An solid view with well thought summary. Personally I have always defended Manila so might as well see how Bataan goes. Never done this in classic witp either.

I know the Manila was much more defendable in the previous version.

In worse case scenario we do lose a week or two and even that is acceptable.

String: Yeah, I noticed you have an clash with Andy Mac and as you said that is 100% reliable partner there.

I haven't got the 2nd turn yet but yeah we need to divert troops immediately. There were those british troops "available" and already at sea. Other than I think that was pretty much it.

I will get back on this once I have the chance to browse through things.

Kaletsch2007: Welcome. I have had good experience with CD guns on Bataan. What you are saying makes sense too. Allthough never had bad results when defending Manila either.

We will go for Bataan this time around. You guys have sold that idea to me with good views.

Force Z definately did an excellent job at Khota Baru. This is just an pure guess but I think we sunk an IJN battleship here. I can already reveal that BB Prince of Wales and BC Repulse are gone for good.

Also those LRCAP Buffalo's made this assault possible. These fighters turned off few enemy bomber raids and made this possible. Just an tip if anyone has hard time getting these ships into action. Than again we definately had some nice dice rolls here too.

I personally chose Batavia side, as Soerabaja is a clear hex and the repair yard will be unusuable in the case of a proper assault anyway. I cannot stress it enough though that if you do choose this strategy, then send everything you can over there, all the units at sea on turn 1 should go there imho.

edit: Oh and while my japanese opponents have run away my allied opponent is Andy Mac so I'm quite solid on that front :)

Is it still true in AE that the presence of more engineers at a base when it is captured yields greater chances for more of the oil, etc. production being damaged? On that basis I decided to leave a chunk of guys in Soerabaja. Shortly we'll see if that works out.

Az, dont just imdieatly pull back to Battan make him at least mass at Clark first. The idea is once the forts at clark are knocked down by his engeeners is to then pull back your strongest LCUs for the final defence at batan. Dont just give your opponent a free large airbase with forts already started. If done right you can prety much evac 50% to 75% of your combat power if you catch him between attacks. It takes timming and some luck but with 2 day turns I immagine it will be a bit easier.

I would begin the evac of most of your combat power once the forts at Clark are at 2 or 1 (assuming you can get them to 3 between air raids) depending on the results of incoming attack and your estimation of forces commited to the PI area. Hopefully this buys you enough time to get the forts of battan to at least 4 which will be a pain for him to crack.

My only other sugestion would be a large scale sub-transport effort if your opponet under commits (obviously if thiers enought force on luzon to crush you extra supplies wont do much). In 2 months or so using your fleet boats (whos torps as you know are garbage) you might be able to get 1k or 2k worth of supplys into batan while this doesnt sound like that much it can make a real difference in combat results.

witpqs: The sabotage part of the game is something that I have been very "unlucky" with in AE. I don't what the dice rolls are but many bases have fallen fully intact despite the engineers being on the base.

Hopefully you have better luck with this part of the game.

I really don't intend to leave Soerabaja alone but that base will only be defended by dutch infantry units. The reinforcements from other "nations" will head out to Batavia area.

jrlans: No, I'am definately planning on fighting at Clark Field. The terrain there is good and with some forts we should be able to slow down enemy any enemy advance. Now, that the "supply bug" there is fixed too.

He is already bombing Clark Field heavily and thus I put the stronger units on "reserve mode". That way they should be spared from any bombing runs and also get well earned rest.

Hmmm, never thought about using those subs as an transports. I will think on this before decieding on it. There are few AKL's that can be sacrificed too and can haul some extra supplies into Luzon.

The minefields were layed at Vigan and Aparri. It seems that Katsuragi opted to abandon the landings at Vigan though due PT boat resistance. Instead he moved those transports into Laong.

US P40E's encountered some unescorted Betty bombers at Iba. The result was 15-20 of them shot down and few more damaged. That was an nice combat to see here.

US submarines have active here. We have had some near misses on few IJN destroyers. Last turn we hit a couple of enemy merchant ships though.

Main focus of enemy airforce is at Clark Field. Daily heavy raids reported here. I'am keeping the best ground unit formations on "reserve" mode in order to shield them from these bombardments.

As suggested we have decieded to abandon Manila defense and instead start preparing for Bataan peninsula.

There were also minor surface fleet engagement near Aparri. The older US destroyers managed to do severe damage DD Fumizuki. A couple of other ships were hit too before stronger japanese navy "wiped out" these brave destroyers.

The mobile Australian CD units are also ordered to move out to Perth where they will onboard transports and head out. The idea is to send 1 CD into Palempang, 1 CD unit into Osthaaven and 1 CD unit still to be decieded.

I think I will send the Gurkha brigade into Palempang and it has been ordered to prep accordingly.

Those are the troops initially available for the defense of Java. Currently have 200 PP available for releases.

On the other hand, keeping the Brigade in India means you've still got a (rather large) cadre of forces to rebuild the brigade once Java falls, the Indian units seem to have enough replacements to make this feasible. You should write off the British units you send into the DEI though, hardly any infantry replacements for them, it's probably not even worth it to save cadres.

I will divert the 18th UK division, brigade and some other units into Java. Also, I will browse through to see what else is available from the start. I think there was an AA unit available at Cape Town.

I did a fortress Java in my last WITP game and it was quite successful. I defended Soerabaja instead of Batavia and probably picked Soerabaja due to size of airfield or port, I cant remember. Soerabaja was fairly easy to support from Broome. Batavia might be a better bet in AE and also, near Batavia is a mountain town that I am having some success holding with just the native troops. I think if you go forward with this plan, then you have to also develop Coco Island and Christmas Island (IO) for support. In AE I have been pulling forces from Java et al to Cocos Island to protect the sealane from Ceylon to Perth.