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A bad workman blames his tools?

Rotherham’s director of children’s services has condemned an “astonishing” lack of engagement by schools to tackle child sexual exploitation (CSE) in the borough while urging a greater focus and respect for youth work.

Ian Thomas, speaking publicly for the first time since taking the role in January at a CYP Now conference this week, said: “I found it astonishing that in Rotherham, some schools see themselves as being outside of the problem, throwing darts at the local authority. That’s the reality of what we’ve been dealing with in Rotherham over the years.

Jay Report, Executive Summary
“No one knows the true scale of child sexual exploitation (CSE) in Rotherham over the years. Our
conservative estimate is that approximately 1400 children were sexually exploited over the full
Inquiry period, from 1997 to 2013.”

I cannot believe that robin symonds and anonymous are actually arguing how many of our children were sexually abused. one is enough. stop trying to justify the labour councillors/police and officers for they’re blatant dis-regard for them poor kids. THIS IS WRONG !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Coverup, I wrote the anonymous comments. It was not intended to argue about how many of our children were sexually abused, it was simply to clarify what Prof Jay had actually said. A simple fact check!

I would have thought that what Ian Thomas had actually said at the Conference should have been the main point, but that has hardly been touched on here, and even the report of what he said (as linked to above) is only a third-party’s short commentary on what he said – and contains one glaring error.
But some of his points, as they were reported, were significant and important. IMO.

Once again Robin Symonds and his like, have displayed the prevailing culture of denial, which has done so much damage to the communtiy of Rotherham. Whether it was an estimate or not, these figures were confirm by Louise Casey as correct, even worse a conservative one at that. The true figure is considerable higher. The plain fact that it was in it’s 100’s would have been bad enough, but thousands, that’s simply a national disgrace.

I’m glad that Ian Thomas is going through 900 Risky Buisness files, the more victims they can find, the more help they can give them, the more of these vile preptrators hopefully will feel the full force of the law. i hope these sick creatures are sweating, wondering if the next knock on the door, will a friendly copper asking them to attend the Police station for a little chat. The law might be slow sometimes, but boy does it have a long memory. As for that Headmaster who claims CSE is a problem at his school, he should be removed immediately, as a danger to the safety of Children.

Coverup, you miss the point. I am not “arguing how many children were abused”. My point was that, Jay hadn’t identified a list of 1400 people and therefore it would be unlikely that anyone could say if they were in the care of the local authority. For the avoidance of doubt I am not disputing or doubting the 1400 figure. I accept that it may well have been more than 1400. Equally, I agree that 1 would have been too many. I was merely pointing out that it is an estimate and not a list of actual people.

Were I in a hole I might accept that advice but I can’t help it if others choose not to read what I’ve actually written. The notion that the “Children’s Chief” would be able to go down a list of 1400 young people and tick off those who were in the care of the local authority is misconceived yet that is what was being suggested.

Furthermore the inference that families should be prosecuted for neglect is no doubt deeply offensive to the families of the victims who found themselves powerless to prevent what was happening and who found no support from SYP when they reported what was happening to them. The people who should be prosecuted are the abusers not the victims’ families IMO.

When you say the people who should be prosecuted are the abusers, would that include, the councillars, social workers, police officers who all fail in their duty to protect children. How about those Labour Party members who also knew what was going on and did nothing.

So Robin in your world the police are to blame, In Ian Thomas’s world the Schools and Teachers are to blame. Do the Labour Councillors not have a share of the blame then? Or, the incompetent Council Officers picked by the incompetent Labour Councillors? Or did I misunderstand the Jay and Casey Reports?

Diversionary blame shifting never looks good, in your case Robin it simply ends up making you look foolish, but isn’t that one of the reasons for reading this blog on a regular basis?

Robin you provide endless hours of fun, you are so transparently a Labour loyalist, who has lost his power of free will and slavishly parrot the Labour line.

Haven’t Labour controlled Rotherham, since 1974, or did I imagine that too?

??? Robin Symonds is a tragic topic??? Really Anon, you should learn to read and understand whats written down in front of you. DT was referring to the hours of fun he has picking apart Robins posts supporting Labour, not CSE.

Until you have actually spoken, as I have, to a father of one of the victims; a perfectly normal and loving family; and listened to what happened to their daughter; not just by the perpetrators but also the police it is hard to comprehend the pain and suffering that this caused to the young girl but also he family. It was a harrowing experience just to listen; when I have granddaughters of the same age as this girl was when it happened. This girls parents did everything in their power to stop what was happening to their daughter, and I am glad to say; despite being let down by their M.P., the council and the police; they managed to do it. One thing that has stayed with me from this conversation, and this is by no means an ego trip; he said I know that had you been given the same information as the councillors were in 2005 you would not have kept quiet for a week never mind 10 years. I did not solicit this conversation it came out of the blue to me and I am grateful for this father having the strength to talk to me. It has taught me a valuable lesson even when I am accused of having a big gob and am just trying to score political points; I will still carry on holding the perpetrators, the councillors and the police to account. Last Monday at the Rother Valley South Area assembly I had a run in with the inspector of police for my area who was bemoaning the cuts to the police budget; he said their priorities are robbery, burglary and car crime. When I took him to task over CSE and pointed out to him that in Rochdale there had been 25 arrests and Rotherham had less than five; he arrogantly told me there had been four. He made a big fuss over the fact that they had got one white male sent down for 13 years; when I pointed out that this did not relate to the grooming gangs he did not have an answer for me. Not only is the Labour council in denial but despite everything that has happened the South Yorkshire Police are obviously still in denial.
Dave Smith

It is surprising that people queue up on here to have a go at me for pointing out that there is no physical list of 1400 names compiled by Professor Jay whilst saying nothing about one of yhe many anonymous posters inferring that some parents may be guilty of neglect. The 2nd post on this topic suggested that the identities of the 1400 are known and that the Director of Childrens Services should enlighten readers with a few statistics. They went on to seek to blame the parents of the victims (at least that’s how it reads to me). Now that is “diversionary blame-shifting” of the most abhorrent kind so far as I’m concerned.

I sincerely hope that the NCA delivers the goods as a lot of people are pinning their hopes on it. I also hope that anyone who is found to have committed a crime is brought to justice. When I referred to abusers I was of course referring to the rapists and groomers but I also hope that anyone else who is found to have committed a crime is convicted, be they politicians, council officers or police officers (or anyone I may have missed from the list).

Uncovered, the reason I wrote my original post was to try to correct what I considered to be a serious misconception about the existence of a list of 1400 victims’ names. Nothing more.

Did you not read Dave Smith’s comment before continuing to engage in some ‘hair splitting’?
Ultimately Robin, there are really only two sides that can be taken on the subject, either on the side of the victims and their families or on the side of the perpetrators, their apologists and protectors. Which side are you on?

Rik, your question is offensive. Of course I’m on the side of the victims. My post above (and numerous previous posts on here) makes that perfectly clear. I’m not sure why you are intent on misrepresenting what I say and failing to acknowledge that when I say I want to see criminals prosecuted it means just that. Now, please answer my question. Are you ok with the anonymous poster blaming the victims’ parents and suggesting they should be prosecuted for neglect? I’m sure that Dave Smith, having spoken to a parent, would not espouse convicting parents. It’s a reasonable question I’m asking and I’m really disappointed that you won’t answer it, choosing rather to accuse me of hair (or atom) – splitting.

You want me to censor opinions with which you personally disagree? What ever happened to free speech? It is rare that I refuse to publish a comment, never on the grounds that I personally disagree with the sentiments expressed.

Erm no. I haven’t asked you to censor anything. I’ve asked you to answer my question. You never seem to have a problem expressing your opinion on my posts. Why are you so reluctant to pass comment on the anonymous poster’s suggestion that parents are to blame? I’m pretty sure you would have been quick to criticise me had I expressed such a view (and rightly so).

Robin, My position on parental responsibility is; there will be few cases indeed, where the parents have any culpability, they are without blame and need, and should get, our support!

Editorial policy requires opinions should be heard and then subjected to review by readers. I do not often express my own opinions directly, but provide space and the freedom for others to put their point of view. Rik.

Clearly your editorial policy doesn’t apply to my posts, a large proportion of which you see fit to snipe at! I too would like to thank Gary for sharing his experience. I too would be interested to hear what organisations have proved helpful in terms of providing support to victims. We are keen to support a voluntary organisation with fundraising but I can only really find any reference to the Rotherham Womens Counselling Service and am keen to know if there are others. Any help with this would be appreciated.

I am the parent you talk about Dave and I thank you for that and I would like to say that I approached local councillors,MPs,Home Secretary,chief constables,social services,education and health the list goes on and we have all the evidence to prove this.I would like to say we have blamed the children if that doesn’t work we can blame the parents,don’t blame the children or the parents until you have walked in their shoes.I have spoken to many parents throughout the country and the stories are the same.I cannot turn the clock back I wish I could but we can make the future safer for the children of Rotherham by raising awareness because it can happen to any child but we think it won’t happen to my child.

Gary, Thanks very much for that. Be assured you enjoy the support of all the regulars on Rotherham Politics.
Do you have any contact or links to organisations you found helpful, so that I can make them available to all readers, Rik.

“I found it astonishing that in Rotherham, some schools see themselves as being outside of the problem, throwing darts at the local authority. That’s the reality of what we’ve been dealing with in Rotherham over the years.”