Jack Russel Terrier...or, recommend an apartment DoG

My wife and I live in Key West in a 1 bedroom, 530 square foot apartment. We want a pet. Oddly, our landlord permits dogs but prohibits cats.

Obviously we need a small dog, but I like big dog personalities. My absolute favorite breed in the world is a Labrador Retriever. If I can't get a dog that's energetic and smart with a goofy friendly personality, I don't want it. Now I know the phrase, "The owner is more important than the breed," but I still don't want a Chihuhua or a damn Yorkie. I need a dog that has energy without aggression.

Our local pet shop has Jack Russell Terriers for sale. They look like a great choice for us. Between 12 and 15 pounds fully grown. Very smart and very high energy. A little nippy if not socialized, but nothing that can't be trained out of them. What do you think of them?

My wife isn't working until August. If we buy the dog now, it will have 24-hour attention until August 1. After that, it will be alone about 10 hours a day (work day plus commute). We'll take the dog for long walks and give it plenty of training. There's a dog park nearby that's fenced off into little dog and big dog areas. So out dog can play and socialize with plenty of other animals. Our little island has plenty of walking trails and a a few stretches of beach where the dog can run free.

Edit: Next door neighbor has two Yorkies which sometimes get loose and run around the apartment courtyard (he usually gets them back within a few minutes), and the upstairs neighbor has a 2-year-old and a 4-year-old.

Based on the above, do you think a Jack Russell would be a good choice for us? What other breeds would you recommend?

Given my seething hatred for the pus-tacular feebs that typically own small dogs in small shared space home complexes (condos, appartments, etc.), I would recommend a fish. Equally pet-able (the glass bowl is very smooth), lower cost, no annoying vomit/feces/urine to leave on the sidewalk/lawn for others to deal with, no annoying barking, scratching, howling or biting/chasing-related problems.

On the other hand, if you actually intend to properly train and care for the dog, by all means, buy whatever you want. In fact, do the right thing and check out the local shelters and adoption facilities. No point buying from a mill when you can get one with proper medical procedures pre-done for less money and prevent euthanasia as well.

Given...

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it will be alone about 10 hours a day

I would recommend against a dog. Or a pet that is anything outside an aquarium at all. Look into squid.

Put yourself in the dog's place. You have a month or two getting to know the people you will depend on for physical and emotional well being, and then you are basically abandoned for the majority of the day. The small time you do see them, they are inexplicably tired, busy and 'needy'. You wonder if they want you around for anything other than an emotional punching bag?

Not trying to be harsh on you but seriously, look at your description of your planned environment for this dog from the dog's point of view. Tiny space, no one around to care for you or engage you socially all day, potentially threatening 'neighbors'...

I would recommend a Welsh Corgi over a Jack Russell. All the Corgis I've met have a big dog personality in a small dog package. And they are working dogs, so plenty of energy and the ability to compete in various events like agility trials and flyball. They are also the dog my wife and I are considering.

Yes, I am seriously considering that the best breed for us might be "no dog at all." Then again, we know a young, childless married couple like us that keeps two boxers in a two-bedroom apartment. Those dogs seem happy and well-adjusted.

Please don't buy a dog from a pet store. The dogs there are the products of puppy mills, generally mass-produced in conditions that range from "bad" to "horrific." Visit your local shelter, or hit PetFinder to see the listings from local rescue organizations. If you must buy from a breeder, make sure you buy directly. A good breeder will have a questionnaire and a screening process, and will require you to spay/neuter the dog.

Please don't buy a dog from a pet store. The dogs there are the products of puppy mills, generally mass-produced in conditions that range from "bad" to "horrific."

Point of contest: that obviously depends on the pet store. We've got several pet stores around here, only one of which uses breeders that may be of questionable origin. The rest simply display animals from the local shelters, and will say as such.

And, nitpick... there's nothing "wrong" with dogs that come from breeders, even of questionable origin. The store has already purchased the dog, so you can't even really stop that or future transactions with the questionable breeder from occurring (short of reporting them to the authorities, obviously). The most important thing is getting the dog checked out ASAP and making sure the store stands behind a "healthy dog" policy.

That being said, pet store dogs that aren't from the shelter are fucking expensive. The one I mentioned earlier regularly has dogs "on sale" for >$600. YEAH. That alone should make you consider shelter dogs first.

As nastro said... 10 hours without being allowed to go potty is a long time for a dog... think about how uncomfortable you'd be after 10 hours of not being able to go. Based on that alone, I can't recommend you get any dog at all, to be honest.

As nastro said... 10 hours without being allowed to go potty is a long time for a dog... think about how uncomfortable you'd be after 10 hours of not being able to go. Based on that alone, I can't recommend you get any dog at all, to be honest.

My friends own a maltipoo who is sweet, even tempered and small enough to fit your criteria. They also have it trained to use a wee-wee pad, for the lack of a better description. The dog is home most of the day and, having just turned four, they have never reported an accident after the dog became acclimated to the pad. They report that the pad does NOT smell after use and, with regular cleaning, works fine.

Personally, I am biased against Jack Russel Terrier since I have never met one that was (a) well-behaved among humans and (b) well socialized with other dogs. But that, of course, could be the fault of the owner more so than the dog itself.

So the "hey, if you don't spend 24/7 with the dog, you shouldn't own a dog!" crowd has already come out. Hey guys, you're the reason so many animals don't get adopted. Congratufuckinglations on making so many dogs' lives miserable. You rock.

To the OP: Jack Russel is a bad idea for you. When they say high energy, they are not kidding. You need some room to let them run. There are plenty of small breads out there that won't give you that kind of trouble. And Jack Russels are the type of dog that WILL find novel ways to cause trouble if they don't get their exercise.

Our old dog was a half greyhound and she could go 12+ if needed without going to the bathroom. Plus she was very mellow in the house and never caused any problems.

Ditto with Sam. Before finding out he had diabetes, he would consume nearly a half gallon of water during the day, and he still managed to hold it. I have no idea how and that is probably an outlier. Before developing diabetes and since we started insulin, he's always self-rationed his water when I'm gone and sleeps about 90% of the time.

So, there are dogs that can get by. A dog walker to stop and take the dog for a walk midday may also be an option.

Dog ownership takes a lot of responsibility and a lot of time. But getting the dog that fits your household can be done and is a fair part of the battle of happy dog ownership.

So the "hey, if you don't spend 24/7 with the dog, you shouldn't own a dog!" crowd has already come out. Hey guys, you're the reason so many animals don't get adopted. Congratufuckinglations on making so many dogs' lives miserable. You rock.

Nah, I got no problem with not spending 24/7 with the dog. I just empathize with the animal not being able to pee for 10+ hours... "getting by" isn't enough if I'm causing the dog to suffer, IMO.

If you can get it trained for pads or a walker, then that's different. I like Boston Terriers a lot. They are tough, smart, willing to please, and are typically very active clowns. They love to play and I think they are born knowing how to play fetch. They even have expressive faces. The normal size is 12lbs to 25 lbs so you can pick from a breeder that will have one that's likely to be near the size you want. Ours have always been 20lbs to 30lbs. They don't require a lot of maintenance usually, either. Ours self regulate feeding (we can put food in the bowl and they'll eat it when they get hungry, sometime later).

I'm turning against Jack Russell because, the more I read, the more I learn that they have the nasty terrier attitude.My parents love terriers. I grew up with Sottish Terriers, then an Aerdale Terrier, then several Yorkshire Terriers. The Aerdale was pretty chill around dogs and humans. But the Scotties and especially the Yorkies were the moast passive-agressive little shits I've seen. I thought the Jack Ruseel Terriers were a litte less aggressive toward dogs/cats/children/anything-that-moves, but I see now that they'll turn bitey toward just about anything.

To the high-energy crowd: I WANT a high-energy dog. I used to have Labradors, and they were the best damn dogs I've ever had. I love having high-energy dogs, and I hate lazy dogs that sit around until it's feeding time. My wife and I have time to run them, train them, and tire them. We're looking for something with the restless energy of a Lab in a 20 pound or less package.

Also, Bostons typically aren't very vocal... rarely barking except when they need to (someone at the door, etc.)

You should be able to YouTube for videos of various breeds to watch them in action.

As to the time left alone thing... we frequently leave our dogs for 8 to 10 hours at a time but we have a house and doggy doors so they can go outside whenever they like... so not exactly apartment living but we did have two when we lived in an apartment, we just walked them and stuff.

Heh... my wife brought home some coconuts from the grocery store one day and one of our Bostons laid claim to one of them... rolling it around like a ball, etc. We let him have it and over the next few days, he wore it smooth.

Get a retired greyhound, they are the PERFECT apartment dog - they need a safe/fenced place to RUN for about five minutes every other day, and they sleep the rest of the time.

Do NOT fucking get a Jack Russell terrier if you live in an apartment. I have one, and I know of what I speak - she would be fucking miserable in an apartment alone all day every day, and she'd make everyone around her know it. Plus she's a real bastard a lot of the time, and has delusions of grandeur which lead to many conflicts with my two border collie females (i.e. pissy herding bitches). She has some good qualities, but those qualities would best be enjoyed by someone with no other dogs, no other pets, no children, and a way to spend time with her a few times a day. She's fine outside in her kennel during the day, where she has a whole wooded ravine of things to watch through her fence, and is fine for a day inside...but not for several in a row.

Additionally, do NOT fucking get a dog from a pet store, unless it's involving a reputable rescue that is adopting animals through the store. No, and I mean NO, reputable breeder who produces quality dogs would ever sell their dogs through a pet store. There's nothing wrong with getting a purebred dog, or with getting a dog from a quality breeder, instead of going with a rescue of some sort, just do your research and don't be part of the problem of forced breeding that produces shitty dogs with health and psychological problems.

I'm turning against Jack Russell because, the more I read, the more I learn that they have the nasty terrier attitude.

Truthfully: I have no idea WTF a "terrier attitude" could be, apart from "small dog syndrome" (read: yappy, aggressive, douchebaggery), which, quite frankly, any and all small dogs can and will get if not socialized properly. The only thing trademark of a "terrier" is high energy and constantly wanting to dig/burrow.

If you're afraid of small dog syndrome, you've got two options: get thineself to someone who can teach you to be one hell of a trainer, or stay the hell away from ALL small dogs. You seem to like labs; get a lab. They can do well in apartments, provided you can actually exercise them as well as you're claiming you want to. I just hope you realize that high energy dogs require something like 3 hours outside a day, if you're going to keep them cooped up in a small area. Even our house (~700 sq ft) would mean hours upon hours of exercise daily for a high-energy dog.

EDIT: For clarification, small dog syndrome is actually really easy to avoid - just pretend it's a larger dog, and think "would I let a 150 lb behemoth dog do this?" The problem is you can never, not once let that attitude slide, or you're back to square one. Small dogs are like children and will learn to exploit every weakness in your training.

I'm turning against Jack Russell because, the more I read, the more I learn that they have the nasty terrier attitude.

Truthfully: I have no idea WTF a "terrier attitude" could be, apart from "small dog syndrome" (read: yappy, aggressive, douchebaggery), which, quite frankly, any and all small dogs can and will get if not socialized properly. The only thing trademark of a "terrier" is high energy and constantly wanting to dig/burrow.

Oh, terrier attitude is definitely a real thing. Based on the Scotties, Yorkies, and Aerdales I've encountered (and my parents used to breed Yorkies), terriers generally are more territorial and more likely to fight than other breed families. They also show more jealousy toward other living things. Far moreso than other breed groups, they will compete for one human's affection and bite any human or animal that tries to get that human's affection.

I was going to say whippet - smaller version of greyhound (which I also think is a great recommendation), similar 'mindset' and definitely couch potato. And if you think you have the energy to keep up with one in an open field, good luck.

Get a rehab greyhound. I'm not kidding, they are notorious couch potatoes.

A corgi will eat the furnishings for lack of a job; and IMHO you don't want a terrier temperament if they'll be home along all day.

Having had a grey, this is very much my recommendation, too. That or a Great Dane. While big, they only require a few walks a week.

Be warned, if you get a GD as a puppy, you'll need a crate, and lots of things for them to chew on. Once they get past the puppy stage, they mellow right the heck out.

Similar for a greyhound, if you can, don't get one right off the track. They're usually still pretty energetic (depending on age) if they just retired from racing. If you look at your local greyhound or great dane rescue, they'll be able to help you get one that will suit you and your place.

I was going to say whippet - smaller version of greyhound (which I also think is a great recommendation), similar 'mindset' and definitely couch potato. And if you think you have the energy to keep up with one in an open field, good luck.

Quality whippets are usually not the same temperament as a greyhound. They will have their chill-out periods, but the ones I've known are a little more neurotic and need more exercise and brain-work than a greyhound. The same trend continues with Italian greyhounds, with the added bonus of "Oh shit I sneezed on the dog and broke its' leg" because they are so tiny, spindly, and delicate.

I was going to say whippet - smaller version of greyhound (which I also think is a great recommendation), similar 'mindset' and definitely couch potato. And if you think you have the energy to keep up with one in an open field, good luck.

Quality whippets are usually not the same temperament as a greyhound. They will have their chill-out periods, but the ones I've known are a little more neurotic and need more exercise and brain-work than a greyhound. The same trend continues with Italian greyhounds, with the added bonus of "Oh shit I sneezed on the dog and broke its' leg" because they are so tiny, spindly, and delicate.

Yea, they are a bit different in temperament and maybe a tad more delicate - but from what my friend's tell me they are definitely 'couch potato' like.

from my experience in racing greyhounds, aunt owning whippets and best mate breeding pure bred italian greyhounds... whippets were more neurotic. adopt a greyhound hounds were nothing but couch potatoes, I think they feel they raced all their life they deserve to live on the couch!

The smaller the dog, the more often (typically) they have to go pee. A Jack Russell is a handful...extremely high energy. A greyhound may be just the ticket.

A friend of mine and her husband had a JRT, in a condo. They had a very, very small yard for the dog to pee/poop in...and he tried his best, but even 8 hours was too much for him to hold.

They used to sing "Incessant puppy dog is blowing my mind" (tune of Incense and Peppermints). They sang that because that dog had two modes: sleep, and OMGFUCKINGPLAYNOWBALLBALLBALLFOODKISSESJUMPJUMPJUMPFOODOMGWHEREAREYOUGOINGHAYWHATSTHIS!!?!?!

A friend of mine and her husband had a JRT, in a condo. They had a very, very small yard for the dog to pee/poop in...and he tried his best, but even 8 hours was too much for him to hold.

Yeah... that's the thing for me... I don't like the idea of the thing trying to do its best to please you by holding it until it's so painful that it simply can't hold it anymore and then be worried about your scolding/punishing it because it couldn't hold it anymore. And at least our dogs are smart enough to think about that... I can come in from work and know if they've done something wrong by how they act so they know enough to know that.

Oh, terrier attitude is definitely a real thing. Based on the Scotties, Yorkies, and Aerdales I've encountered (and my parents used to breed Yorkies), terriers generally are more territorial and more likely to fight than other breed families. They also show more jealousy toward other living things. Far moreso than other breed groups, they will compete for one human's affection and bite any human or animal that tries to get that human's affection.

This generally only happens with poorly socialized animals and isn't anything specific to terriers. The problem is that people are often far more lax about socializing small dogs because they don't fear the results as you would with a much larger animal. Terriers add really high energy to that mix.

You still shouldn't get a Jack Russel, but not for the reason you've stated here. A JRT locked up all day will positively destroy the place. They are too hyper and too intelligent and will find something to keep it's little brain occupied. Like the construction of your couch.

I'm turning against Jack Russell because, the more I read, the more I learn that they have the nasty terrier attitude.My parents love terriers. I grew up with Sottish Terriers, then an Aerdale Terrier, then several Yorkshire Terriers. The Aerdale was pretty chill around dogs and humans. But the Scotties and especially the Yorkies were the moast passive-agressive little shits I've seen. I thought the Jack Ruseel Terriers were a litte less aggressive toward dogs/cats/children/anything-that-moves, but I see now that they'll turn bitey toward just about anything.

To the high-energy crowd: I WANT a high-energy dog. I used to have Labradors, and they were the best damn dogs I've ever had. I love having high-energy dogs, and I hate lazy dogs that sit around until it's feeding time. My wife and I have time to run them, train them, and tire them. We're looking for something with the restless energy of a Lab in a 20 pound or less package.

High-energy dog = destroyed home when left alone for 10 hours. I could run my border collies until they're exhausted (not an easy task), and a few hours later they're ready for more.

Seriously- greyhounds. They're large, will happily run & play with you, but have a very calm house demeanor.

While all the suggestions for a greyhound are spot on, many landlords limit dog size by poundage - not by temperament.

So, while a greyhound would most likely do well as an apartment-dwelling dog, they don't meet the 30-pounds-or-less requirements used in many instances. While I agree that it's a poor metric by which to allow dogs, it's one of the few "fact-based" restrictions that one can use in terms of pets. Allowing pets with a "good temperament" while completely understandable, is too nebulous to be a legally defensible requirement.

If the OP is in a situation where weight/size of the dog isn't an issue, then I'd also encourage it. Although greyhounds do not meet his previously-stated preference for a high-energy dog.

I wouldn't feel ethically comfortable forcing a dog to coexist with 2 adults in a 530 square foot apartment. Small dog or big dog.. it's not going to be happy being able to wander the entire apartment in a couple of strides.

I used to have a retired greyhound in an 800 sqft open concept 2br apartment, shared with 3 adults. As others have said, greyhounds are extremely lazy, but even he liked to play around when he was in the mood. I also had him in a ~1000 sqft house with a yard, and he was much, much happier. There was nothing he loved more than being let loose in the back yard where he would do a couple dozen laps, then collapse on our couch for a couple of hours.

That being said, greyhounds can be headcases due to the abuse typically endured while racing. Ours had severe separation anxiety, and could escape his crate despite multiple padlocks. He would then tear the house apart looking for us in a panic. When we went to apartment life and started school again, we found a ground floor neighbour who had a gaggle of Dachshunds who offered to dogsit for us.