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"There has yet to be a virtual world that even comes close to the number of things you can do in Ultima Online."

Is this statement true or false? Could you provide examples of MMORPGs and "things you can do" in these games that "come close" to Ultima Online?

Going with both.

True when it comes to Western MMO's

False when it comes to Eastern MMO's - ArcheAge don't have the time or patiences right now to list things but a simple google search or search on this site will show you some of the times you can do in the game.

arche age is not out yet, for now all features are just legend for us :p, till the game is out and we start do things there we can't compare

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True - Ultima (Ultima VII and UO) is the Epitome of a Virtual World RPG.SWG could have been a successor, Skyrim is the next best SRPG to it.Lets await the future iterations of new Virtual Worlds.

Second Life is a huge anything goes sandbox with servers full of claims containing playparks and themeparks - not so much a "World".The word "Slum" comes to my mind...a semiorganized Slum controlled by a Master-Landlord.

"Torquemada... do not implore him for compassion. Torquemada... do not beg him for forgiveness. Torquemada... do not ask him for mercy. Let's face it, you can't Torquemada anything!"

Almost every aspect of UO is like a rabbit hole that leads to a dozen diverse activities related to it.

Pretty much, if it's in your current MMO, it was more than likely in UO first.

There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein

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I think most of those griefing actions are the reason many of us thought UO was nothing but a game for griefers. Never liked the graphics to boot. Still believe SWG was the best open world game produced. One thing you can't argue is SWG had musicians and dancers lol!

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UO was unique, and the likes of it will probably never be seen again. Pre-NGE SWG was probably the only mainstream MMO that came vaguely close to UO in terms of freedom and and player creativity.

If UO launched today as a fully 3-D MMO with the unrestricted pre-Trammel ruleset, it would probably be instantly invaded by 10,000 members of some PK community that would kill everything that moves 24/7 until the game closed down after 3 months, lol

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Truth is, I've never understood why not one single developer ever thought creating good virtual world outside of the UO/SWG teams was a pretty good idea.

I guess they need to try and swing for the fence instead of trying for a solid double.

I missed out on these two titles in their hey day and feel I really missed out on something unique (same with AC)

In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways."I don't have one life, I have many lives" - GruntyStill currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

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UO was unique, and the likes of it will probably never be seen again. Pre-NGE SWG was probably the only mainstream MMO that came vaguely close to UO in terms of freedom and and player creativity.

If UO launched today as a fully 3-D MMO with the unrestricted pre-Trammel ruleset, it would probably be instantly invaded by 10,000 members of some PK community that would kill everything that moves 24/7 until the game closed down after 3 months, lol

This.

The modern PvP open world PvP culture is a self consuming locost swarm that kills the thing it claims to love, and then projects the blame on to 'carebears'.

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From a lot of fond stories and examples posted, a better question would be "does any other mmo offer as much for griefers to do as UO?" Admittedly, it does add another layer to the game, but its also why its fairly unlikely another game will give players all those tools to trick, scam, harass, and abuse eachother. Players pissed where they ate and this is why we can't have nice things.

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UO was unique, and the likes of it will probably never be seen again. Pre-NGE SWG was probably the only mainstream MMO that came vaguely close to UO in terms of freedom and and player creativity.

If UO launched today as a fully 3-D MMO with the unrestricted pre-Trammel ruleset, it would probably be instantly invaded by 10,000 members of some PK community that would kill everything that moves 24/7 until the game closed down after 3 months, lol

This.

The modern PvP open world PvP culture is a self consuming locost swarm that kills the thing it claims to love, and then projects the blame on to 'carebears'.

hm.... it's possible.

I see a lot of self proclaimed pvp'ers wanting "ffa sandbox" but are they even interested in the "sandbox" part or do they just want unrestricted pvp?

Dont' get me wrong, I liked many things about ffa pvp in Lineage 2.

But, there were deterrents to always being a red and in some ways it was a culture unto itself.

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Truth is, I've never understood why not one single developer ever thought creating good virtual world outside of the UO/SWG teams was a pretty good idea.

I guess they need to try and swing for the fence instead of trying for a solid double.

I missed out on these two titles in their hey day and feel I really missed out on something unique (same with AC)

Because it is not as easy as it seems?

As a niche market target, corners would have to be cut somewhere.

Could a niche market game (which might appeal to 500K or more) really do any worse than some of the AAA titles released today?

It's a risk I'll grant you, but nothing ventured, nothing gained.

In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways."I don't have one life, I have many lives" - GruntyStill currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

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Could a niche market game (which might appeal to 500K or more) really do any worse than some of the AAA titles released today?

It's a risk I'll grant you, but nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Ha! 500k is a huge sucess, imo -- unless you spent 200mil on the project. One to two million subs are pretty much the present high water marks. Even WoW gets its vaunted numbers outside the western market.

Properly figuring scale for cost of production to subscribers maintained does seem to be a problem with the big boys. I think some companies are nosing around the idea of open worlds, but, again, there are problems that go with it. I agree it should be considered, being the big fish in a small pond can be very successful. And certainly better than a dead fish in a big pond....

If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.