Frost PvP...why?

Post by Wumbo105

Hey guys, currently leveling my Frost DK from Cata back up, and I wanna focus on PvP this time around. Here's what I've gathered so far, upon extensive researching.

-2H Frost is for burst, high crits.-DW Masterfrost is for sustained, reliable constant damage, not many huge numbers.

I've also learned that DW Masterfrost is the highest DPSing spec we got as of now.

So here's my question: I've watched countless youtube vids/guides/highlight reels of Frost DKs PvPing, and every single one of them are going 2H. I have yet to see a DW PvPer.Why is 2H the preferred PvP route? Is it because burst/quick dmg is superior to sustained dmg when fighting other players? And wouldn't the more constant dmg from DW be better for pressure and overall fighting?

Any input is appreciated, and also feel free to correct me if anything I have said is wrong.

Post by Jinjiro

Due to unpredictable situations pvp provides for players, a high burst from them is ideal to control these situations. In Rated BGs frost dks must also provide some utility to the group so they would not be able to sustain a constant dps if they are needed to provide quit pulls from healers and player in trouble.

Post by Wumbo105

Makes sense. I guess when people see huge numbers being smashed on their face, it freaks em out more than constant dps.Alright then, 2H it is. Thanks.

Post by Zakkhar

You are wrong assuming that DW gives you more sustained damage than 2h. You are also wrong saying it provides bigger dps (probably using some wierd outdated pve sims). There is no such thing as pressure any more, anything not-bursty is easily healable. Its world of cc-craft and healcraft atm.

Post by Wumbo105

You are also wrong saying it provides bigger dps (probably using some wierd outdated pve sims).

I'm going by Noxxic's Realistic DPS rankings (updated to 5.1), in which DW Frost is a solid 12k DPS higher than 2H. I'd post the link but I'm not allowed to yet. Even in the Maximum DPS chart, it's ahead by a small margin.

Post by voodoopimp

But keep in mind those numbers are for PvE, which assumes the damage is taking place over a period of several minutes. Burst is almost meaningless against a boss with half a billion HP, but much more useful against a player with closer to half a million.

Post by Zakkhar

You are also wrong saying it provides bigger dps (probably using some wierd outdated pve sims).

I'm going by Noxxic's Realistic DPS rankings (updated to 5.1), in which DW Frost is a solid 12k DPS higher than 2H. I'd post the link but I'm not allowed to yet. Even in the Maximum DPS chart, it's ahead by a small margin.

Its outdated, wrong and also consists of a parse vs patchwerk style boss that doesnt move or attack back. Nothing to do with pvp. If you simulated yourself you would see 2h is slightly ahead.

Post by Wumbo105

The parse consists of data that say "These DPS estimates are based on a modified single target (no cleave) fight with regular movement, raid-wide stuns, and player distraction. This is a more realistic fight that highlights each specs maximum DPS under typical raid conditions.", so no, not really.

I know it has nothing to do with pvp, I was just showing where I got the info that DW dps > 2H.Why you keep claiming it is outdated, I have no idea. But we're getting off-topic anyway.

Post by Zakkhar

Why you keep claiming it is outdated, I have no idea. But we're getting off-topic anyway.

Because it is outdated. Instead of relying on one site that uses some tools and posts the results, use the tools yourself or check other sites at least.

Post by Wumbo105

Unfortunately I'm not 90 yet, so I can't run tests myself.And the only other sites I can think off off the top of my head are EJ (which is much more outdated than Noxxic, so...) and World of Logs which is a headache in itself to sift through.I'd love to look at some more sites though, if you know any.

Post by Piz420

Why you keep claiming it is outdated, I have no idea. But we're getting off-topic anyway.

Because it is outdated. Instead of relying on one site that uses some tools and posts the results, use the tools yourself or check other sites at least.

He is correct. All those profiles were made pre 5.1. Check the most recent post on EJ Frost thread to confirm for yourself.

I still do not understand why you would want to DW in PvP over 2H in the first place. Not one person DW's in PvP unless they are finishing Chapter 2 that day for the prismatic socket (me). You ever go crazy running up on some Alliance dog at mid to low Hp and just SMASHING them with a 120k OB dropping them instantly? You'd rather poke them a few times while running around? Boooooorring.

Post by Zakkhar

Post by Wumbo105

Grazie, my fellow DK peeps.

Post by Huggi

Hello, I have a different bit of a theory for when I'm playing frost DK. Since I am really decked out on gear this season on my frost DK, I decided to have a T2 2Hander upgraded, and 2 t2 1Handers Upgraded, When playing against a comp that is contained of Cloth-Mail classes, I will use my 2Handed weapon, and when I play against a comp with plates (mostly kfcs and tsgs) I like to use my 2 1Handers, due to frost strike doing more damage and ignoring armor (frost strike damage is more with 2 1Handers) and also it increases my parry a tad more.

One reason I prefer my 2Hander is bigger crits, but as you evolve and get to know frost dks in 5.1, you will learn that you need to oblitterate, but also get in some necrotic strikes. When using One-handers you do not strike with both weapons on necrotics, so that 100% weapon damage is just from your MH, but when you are using the Two-Hander you are going to do more damage, but both are going to have the same healing absorbed.

While you may think this is very little difference, I have found this works best for me!

Good luck and enjoy your time as a frost dk!

Post by Jaspirac

I pvp with DW and do just fine. I feel like I have adequate burst and overall damage. It is rare for me not to be near top or top damage. I also focus on killing healers where crit, burst, and sustained damage can play a major role. Without having played my DK as 2H frost I can't offer a direct comparison but only my satisfaction and success with DW in the pvp environment.

Post by Wumbo105

Yeah, I'll be trying DW eventually, once I get the Conquest/Honor to support the cost of additional weapons, and I'll make a decision. As for now, I'll stick with 2H, cuz I'm kinda poor in the Conquest department.

Post by Bigdaddychubb

Here is my basic jist... I have done both and I run 2v2 3v3 <--- just started and rbgs and I find that everyone likes it better on my team when I play with 2 1h weapons I have 6 pieces of tyrannical gear including both weapons and I destroy people. For some reason be it that the swing is much slower or whatever the case may be 2h just wasn't cutting the mustard for me.. But that is just me prolly just my playstyle.

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