'When we rest in the state of visualising the Guru’s appearance inseparable from one’s own
mind, we realise the meaning that this state, free from discriminative thoughts or attachments
and possessing clarity, is just our ordinary mind merging with the Guru’s wisdom mind. As
our view deepens, we finally recognise the definitive ultimate meaning of emptiness which is
the inner self-nature Guru. Continuing to rest in the pure basic nature of one’s mind is the
inner Guru Yoga.''

There is no difference between one's inner nature and Vajradhara/Samantabhadra.

"My religion is not deceiving myself."Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

'When we rest in the state of visualising the Guru’s appearance inseparable from one’s own
mind, we realise the meaning that this state, free from discriminative thoughts or attachments
and possessing clarity, is just our ordinary mind merging with the Guru’s wisdom mind. As
our view deepens, we finally recognise the definitive ultimate meaning of emptiness which is
the inner self-nature Guru. Continuing to rest in the pure basic nature of one’s mind is the
inner Guru Yoga.''

There is no difference between one's inner nature and Vajradhara/Samantabhadra.

Yes, as I posted 'a Guruyoga without a specific human form'.

I was also considering White A and Thigle absorbing, unifying and integrating all in that particular Guruyoga.

Moderator Note: This thread has been moved from Discovering Mahayana sub-forum to the Mahayana sub-forum. A shadow topic remains in the Discovering Mahayana sub-forum menu but will redirect to the Mahayana sub-forum. The reason for doing so is that the Discovering Mahayana sub-forum is fully moderated and every post requires review and approval by a mod. In the Mahayana sub-forum, this discussion will no longer be fully moderated.

Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.
-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

I think each human being has things to find out in his own life that are inescapable. They’ll find them out the easy way or the hard way, or whatever.
-Jerry Garcia

Matthew, given you don't have a guru, I fail to see why you should be concerned.

dude, given that you are not a teacher, not a guru,
you make a discrimination between teacher and guru,
freely advise on 15 years, and other stuff,
do you think that anyone in their sane mind should listen to your advice?
i hope not,
but then,
i could be wrong.
you just may prove to be saviour of us all,
thanx to your advice.
of course, you may do many things,
that you forbid others to do..
here.
what are you saying, dude?
''listen to me, not your teacher!''???
hmmm

Another log on the fire,
10,000 frogs singing in the rain,
burst into flames.
- Linda Anderson

Treating various instructions on finding a Guru as if they are meant to be taken as that exclusive, prescriptive, or literal is a little questionable, in my opinion, but whatever.

However, I would say that if someone has to ask "is this person my Guru"..then most likely, they are not your Guru. Whatever other factors come into play. If someone is your Guru, you should probably know.

"it must be coming from the mouthy mastermind of raunchy rapper, Johnny Dangerous”

However, I would say that if someone has to ask "is this person my Guru"..then most likely, they are not your Guru. Whatever other factors come into play. If someone is your Guru, you should probably know.

Ask the teacher and see what he says...

"Avoid unexamined Dharma relationships./ After examining take heed: pay respect to the guru./ Things are such that in the future you will not lack a guru,/ For karma does not vanish." – Geshe Potowa

"The result congruous with the cause of paying your guru proper respect in this life/ Is meeting with supreme spiritual guides in all future lives/ And hearing the completely unmistaken Dharma from them." – Essence of Nectar

"If you are struck, it’s an initiation:/ If you take it as a blessing, you’ll be blessed./ A hard scolding is like a wrathful mantra/ That removes every hindrance." – Drogon Tsangpa Gyare

"By doing this, you purify karma that would [otherwise] make you wander in the lower realms for immeasurable millions of eons; this karma will occur in this life in terms of things harmful to body and mind—epidemics, famines, and so on. [Karma] is even purified by a scolding, or by nightmares. And you can overcome karma in one morning by giving your generated root merits to immeasurable numbers of buddhas or by keeping your vows." – The Sutra Requested by Kshitigarbha

I am saying we should listen to the advice of realised masters and Tantra.

"My religion is not deceiving myself."Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

Grigoris,
thank you for your reply. very much.
since i opinionate (sry, zen folks, lol) that you are a senior practitioner, i will try to reply to some detail,
by some words.

first, not to nitpick, how can anyone not realized know if the teacher is realized?

anyway, ill share a little of my ..karma lol..
when 19..back in '82, i landed at narita san, not having a teacher, not having a single address, not even ever talked to anyone in japan,
i had, in my pocket..150$
at the information desk at the airport, a fool asked..
''where is the nearest temple from here?''
besides a strange look, i was offered a few choices, thanks for their help.
when i arrived to tokyo, my pocket had ..100$..

well, ill stop here...
its a total trip, sounding like i made it up.
but, only to say,
my late teacher is the only one i had all my life.
and it brings tears to my eyes every time i think of him, and all that he had done for me.

basically, what i am saying,
a teacher student relationship is destiny, karma, call it what you will.
so, why not,
search, search search,
but just dont bring a meter measure of you own standards.
things happen, even if we have no idea of how..
especially if talking about teachers.

finaly, imo only
in zen, the root teacher is the one under which the student gains enlightenment.
for example , just one of untold numbers, Dogen went to China..why? why?
to search for a teacher.

thank you for reminding me of a few things, Grigoris.
my pleasure.

bokki

Another log on the fire,
10,000 frogs singing in the rain,
burst into flames.
- Linda Anderson

first, not to nitpick, how can anyone not realized know if the teacher is realized?

The texts giving the advice are written by realised masters of the past.

"My religion is not deceiving myself."Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

a teacher student relationship is destiny, karma, call it what you will.

If there is a "destiny" (destination), it's created/altered/maintained by your actions in the present moment.

All this means is that your relationship with your teacher is your business, and your devotion in this life will cause you to meet each other again. Certainly something to feel joyful about!

It's dangerous to think/act otherwise if we want to meet with appropriate dharma connections in the future... to be honest, this is why I try to refrain from speculating about others at all in these matters (unless help is requested).

Dzongsar Khyentse Rinpoche recently wrote an excellent book on many of these concerns. It's about how to find a guru, evaluate a guru, relate with a guru, and understand the guru-disciple relationship in general.