tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post7383102832950845628..comments2018-02-17T23:19:54.478-06:00Comments on Althouse: "I take this oath of office today under protest to the passage of the constitutional amendment... This amendment besmirches our Constitution...."Ann Althousehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01630636239933008807noreply@blogger.comBlogger84125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-13253571428167553522007-04-18T23:22:00.000-05:002007-04-18T23:22:00.000-05:00Downtown:Just understand...you do more damage to t...Downtown:<BR/><BR/>Just understand...you do more damage to the cause of homosexuals in the Us with every post you make than I, or people like me, have or will ever do.<BR/><BR/>I'm the person you are supposed to be trying to reach and convince dumbshit.Gahriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16795449308207016641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-81344338211647092522007-04-18T22:53:00.000-05:002007-04-18T22:53:00.000-05:00Gehrie,1) Civil unions are discriminatory and repr...Gehrie,<BR/><BR/>1) Civil unions are discriminatory and represent a separate but unequal set of laws. They also lead to the destruction of marriage (which you're oh so worried about), since they create a form of marriage-light that heterosexuals can participate in.<BR/><BR/><BR/>2) Gays are kicked out of the military even if they keep their sexuality private. The military scours sites like facebook to see if people are gay, and spy on them to see if they are holding hands with another guy. In fact, the military even considers having an interest in "theater" to be cause to kick people out of the military (yes - there are news articles that document this). Basically don't ask, don't tell asks that gay people LIE about their lives (cause if someone asks them if they are gay- they are expected to LIE). And don't ask, don't tell is not a Democratic policy. If you really think that, then you have ZERO knowledge of history.<BR/><BR/>3) Like I said, you oppose gay people raising the children they have raised for 15 years. I have a gay friend who is partnered for 20 years and he is helping to raise his partners kids. Thank goodness New York allows my friend to adopt those kids as well, as the kids see him as their parent. Too bad for Mary Cheney's partner, who will have ZERO legal status to raise her kid should Mary Cheney die.<BR/><BR/>4) You continue to insist on using the term homosexual, instead of gay, which again - is quite telling. It proves to any gay person that you are anit-gay. So I encourage you to continue using the term homosexual. If you used the term gay, we actually might get confused for a moment and think you're pro-gay, which you obviously aren't.Downtownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08663069432164302806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-59727605986257400032007-04-18T22:39:00.000-05:002007-04-18T22:39:00.000-05:00By favoring discriminatory laws that prevent gay p...<I>By favoring discriminatory laws that prevent gay people from visiting their partners in the hospital, by passing discriminatory laws that prevent gay people from serving their country, by passing discriminatory laws that prevent gay people from adopting the children that they have raised for 15 years.</I><BR/><BR/>Wow. Besides showing how juvinile you truly are, you haven't learned a thing about me from reading my posts, merely constructed a strawman to talk past.<BR/><BR/>1) I have always supported civil unions, primarily so that homosexuals in committed relationships may have legal protections such as visitation rights.<BR/><BR/>2) Gays can serve in the military if they choose. They just have to keep their sexuality private. I support Don't ask, don't tell...which remember is a Democratic policy.<BR/><BR/>3) I have no problem with homosexuals raising their children. I do oppose homosexual couples adopting other people's children.Gahriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16795449308207016641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-62602063326826483922007-04-18T22:18:00.000-05:002007-04-18T22:18:00.000-05:00From now on - I'm going to refer to Simon and Gehr...From now on - I'm going to refer to Simon and Gehrie as faggots.<BR/><BR/>But it's not offensive.<BR/><BR/>Thank you Andrew Sullivan for the inspiration, for those of you who don't get the reference.<BR/><BR/>http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2007/03/the_unraveling_.htmlDowntownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08663069432164302806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-73176413930085457752007-04-18T22:13:00.000-05:002007-04-18T22:13:00.000-05:00Oh Right Gehrie - You respect people's beliefs.By ...Oh Right Gehrie - You respect people's beliefs.<BR/><BR/>By favoring discriminatory laws that prevent gay people from visiting their partners in the hospital, by passing discriminatory laws that prevent gay people from serving their country, by passing discriminatory laws that prevent gay people from adopting the children that they have raised for 15 years.<BR/><BR/>Face it Gehrie - You're a faggot.Downtownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08663069432164302806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-25229481272534831392007-04-18T22:07:00.000-05:002007-04-18T22:07:00.000-05:00Oh...and not that it matters...but I'm not a Chris...Oh...and not that it matters...but I'm not a Christian..I'm a deist, so your little anti-Christian diatribe doesn't effect me.<BR/><BR/>I just choose to respect people's beliefs.Gahriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16795449308207016641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-42136703819742126352007-04-18T22:06:00.000-05:002007-04-18T22:06:00.000-05:00Downtown said... Gahrie and Simon are faggots.But ...<I>Downtown said... <BR/>Gahrie and Simon are faggots.<BR/><BR/>But they shouldn't be offended by that term. </I><BR/><BR/>Coming from you that's a compliment right?<BR/><BR/>Fortunately, I left the playground years ago, I'm very secure in my sexuality, and I teach middle school, so I'm used to whiny immature children.Gahriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16795449308207016641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-91043503700319293732007-04-18T21:54:00.000-05:002007-04-18T21:54:00.000-05:00Gahrie and Simon are faggots.But they shouldn't be...Gahrie and Simon are faggots.<BR/><BR/>But they shouldn't be offended by that term.Downtownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08663069432164302806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-13568365515703024742007-04-18T21:39:00.000-05:002007-04-18T21:39:00.000-05:00I think I'll just refer to Christians from now on ...I think I'll just refer to Christians from now on as "psychologically deranged people who believe that some lying slut who was knocked up and had a manic depressive moron kid named Jesus, whom they mistakingly refer to as God".<BR/><BR/>But don't you dare tell me that its offensive.<BR/><BR/>It's actually pretty logical and accurate.Downtownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08663069432164302806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-50207419332532246122007-04-18T21:38:00.000-05:002007-04-18T21:38:00.000-05:00I think I'll just refer to Christians from now on ...This comment has been removed by the author.Tribecahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01175858314832210342noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-27370524688152102062007-04-18T21:29:00.000-05:002007-04-18T21:29:00.000-05:00Eli is also, as he was quick to point when I inte...Eli is also, as he was quick to point when I interviewed him recently, the FORMER chair of Students for a Fair Wisconsin.<BR/><BR/>http://lettersinbottles.blogspot.com/2007/04/interview-madison-alderman-elect-eli.htmlBrad Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13486550139621624832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-61988773095056847222007-04-18T15:56:00.000-05:002007-04-18T15:56:00.000-05:00"I'm not seeing a great deal of difference in this..."<I>I'm not seeing a great deal of difference in this and signing statements.</I>"<BR/><BR/>Let's see. As I understand it a signing statement is where the signing authority provides an additional explicit statment concerning their interpretation of parts of legislation that may be Constitutionally ambiguous. In this case, individual law makers are providing a statement of intent contrary to an entire provision of the Constituaion itself.<BR/><BR/>Had a law maker said something along the lines of "in the context of this admendment, I understand the term 'man' to include not only those born of the biological male gender, but also those who have attained that same gender through either surgical means or mental contruct," then I might agree that it was similar to a signing statement. What was done in this case, though, is more akin to a veto, the authority for which, especially in Constitutional matters, they simply do nto have.Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15950457116215345788noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-60641781609722627722007-04-18T15:47:00.000-05:002007-04-18T15:47:00.000-05:00If you go down to the Quarter in New Orleans or Be...If you go down to the Quarter in New Orleans or Beale St. in Memphis on most nights you'll find them. Huge signs and megaphones telling everyone how they're going to Hell and how only Jesus can save them. I've been tempted to ask if all their "you're a filthy sinner and going to Hell" talk has ever prompted even a single middle-of-the-gutter conversion, but I think I know the answer. All the <I>strum und dang</I> isn't for the sinners, it's for themselves. It's so important to confirm their self-image of being just and righteous that all else be damned (pardon the pun). For some reason I am always reminded of these self-proclaimed saints everytime DTL gets deep into a rant.Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15950457116215345788noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-40449504524720845832007-04-18T12:46:00.000-05:002007-04-18T12:46:00.000-05:00just out of curiousity..I'm not seeing a great dea...just out of curiousity..<BR/><BR/>I'm not seeing a great deal of difference in this and signing statements. in fact, i think that the two are very much 1 in the same.hdhousehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14573004614816464571noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-18110499139472341682007-04-18T11:23:00.000-05:002007-04-18T11:23:00.000-05:00Richard McEnroe wrote"Lindsey -- so you'd be good ...Richard McEnroe wrote<BR/><BR/>"Lindsey -- so you'd be good with someone taking the oath of office for Congress or the Presidency with "reservations" about those darn 13th and 19th Amendments?"<BR/><BR/>"Or is it just Amendments you disapprove of? Rule of law supplanted by whim of law?"<BR/><BR/>Rich if during the first part of the nineteenth century a president said in his inaugural speech after taking his oath that the Three Fifths clause "besmirches our Constitution" and "I pledge to work to eliminate this section from the Constitution and work to prevent any discriminatory impacts from its application." (This is the statement made my Madison’s alders and mayor that so offended the owner of this blog by the way.) I would say that was a great president who was committing himself to creating a more perfect union.<BR/><BR/>The fact that you would equate the desire to end injustice and further the higher evolution of our constitution with those who would desire to make it an instrument of injustice is pure relativism at its worst. While you see it as a “whim,” many view it as a principled difference.L. E. Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10551607322231833310noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-87424002782396739832007-04-18T10:25:00.000-05:002007-04-18T10:25:00.000-05:00I was struck by the wording of the article."At lea...I was struck by the wording of the article.<BR/><BR/>"At least ten members of the Madison Common Council chose <I>not</I> to sign a supplementary statement on their official oaths of office on Tuesday afternoon." [emphasis added],<BR/><BR/>So the normative position is to ignore the Constitution.Mikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12543212869078899526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-69761643367923555172007-04-18T10:19:00.000-05:002007-04-18T10:19:00.000-05:00Lindsey -- so you'd be good with someone taking th...Lindsey -- so you'd be good with someone taking the oath of office for Congress or the Presidency with "reservations" about those darn 13th and 19th Amendments?<BR/><BR/>Or is it just Amendments you disapprove of? Rule of law supplanted by whim of law?richard mcenroehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10659450906647134430noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-31036838016046951182007-04-18T10:06:00.000-05:002007-04-18T10:06:00.000-05:00Holy Cow! When did homosexual become a bigoted ter...Holy Cow! When did homosexual become a bigoted term? Is heterosexual now out of bounds as well? And bisexual? And asexual?<BR/><BR/>When common terms, derived from latin like so much of our language, can be declared biased, then political correctness is indeed out of control.bilbowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03854513877129734440noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-75401247307651622602007-04-18T09:58:00.000-05:002007-04-18T09:58:00.000-05:00Simon wrote:“you heartily believe in democracy, an...Simon wrote:<BR/><BR/>“you heartily believe in democracy, and in the community governing itself, but you know, only within certain limits. ”<BR/><BR/>Simon, you do realize that your above description could be equally applied to our country’s founders don’t you?<BR/><BR/>Sorry if this comes off as a basic civics lesson (If you are not out of high school, my apologies.) but we do not operate under a pure democracy. Instead, we have a constitutional democratic republic. Also, that constitution does not exist within a vacuum. Instead, our country was forged based on some basic principles. So, while slavery was acknowledged in the U.S. Constitution as it was originally written (you also got that one wrong) it was not, to quote you, “as valid as every other part.” <BR/><BR/>Finally, this whole discussion is based on a false premise put forward by the owner of this blog. The statement that the mayor and the alders made did not withhold their commitment to some part of the Constitution that they dissent from as claimed by Althouse. Instead, the statement said that they disagreed with it and would work to change it in the future and would try to lessen any discriminatory impacts it might have as it is applied.<BR/><BR/>As I already pointed out, it is quite telling that Althouse would write disparagingly and falsely about newly elected officials speaking out against injustice after taking their oaths of office while at the same time finding of no interest that a woman was unjustly tried and convicted and sent to prison. It seems to speak to what her ethical priorities are.L. E. Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10551607322231833310noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-24706571506070250212007-04-18T09:32:00.000-05:002007-04-18T09:32:00.000-05:00DTL said: "So having a law that says "homosexuals ...DTL said: "So having a law that says "homosexuals cannot adopt kids", as they do in Florida, how exactly is that "equal rights"???"<BR/><BR/>Right, because the debate is all about <I>your</I> rights, not what's best for the kids. Man, you're self-centered.Mikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12543212869078899526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-55686035044645187242007-04-18T09:07:00.000-05:002007-04-18T09:07:00.000-05:00I really do not understand why intelligent people ...I really do not understand why intelligent people try to debate activists like Downtown. <BR/><BR/>He/She is an ideolgue who fashions inoffensive terms into hate speech and reasonable concepts into bigotry. There is no light to be shed by such discussion, other than the understanding that some activists are completely disingenuous and unreasonable - no surprise there.Dr. NeoConhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07435485692091402092noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-59119947275294933792007-04-18T08:54:00.000-05:002007-04-18T08:54:00.000-05:00I have to second Critical Badger - Eli is turning ...I have to second Critical Badger - Eli is turning out to be a breath of fresh air compared to his predecessor. <BR/><BR/>Here in Madison, a nuanced persective on the "anti-oath" addendum coming from someone with his personal story is refreshing.<BR/><BR/>A little more substance, a little less showboating.Brad Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13486550139621624832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-53168796860683621312007-04-18T08:53:00.000-05:002007-04-18T08:53:00.000-05:00Good point, Simon--continue fighting the good figh...Good point, Simon--continue fighting the good fight then.Rogerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12639676792043324100noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-78389141007469073942007-04-18T08:42:00.000-05:002007-04-18T08:42:00.000-05:00Besides, I haven't given up on persuading Lindsey ...Besides, I haven't given up on persuading Lindsey yet. ;)Simonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10065798213115341398noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329595.post-7247023573533873782007-04-18T08:40:00.000-05:002007-04-18T08:40:00.000-05:00Roger,I don't know that it's ever a waste, per com...Roger,<BR/>I don't know that it's ever a waste, per comment <A HREF="http://althouse.blogspot.com/2007/03/moderation-i-dont-like-it-but.html#c4475168123896607531" REL="nofollow">here</A>: Look at Ann's sitemeter. "[F]or every commenter here, there are hundreds of people who are not so emotionally-invested on a given point as to descend into the fray to argue for or against it, but who merely <I>read</I>." Focus on taking down the other gladiator, but remember that you're in an arena, and he isn't the only person you're addressing.Simonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10065798213115341398noreply@blogger.com