Noel's still figuring out offense.Oldaipo's still figuring out offense.McLemore can't create off the dribble.Porter is pretty much what he will be going forward.Len is already on the Greg Oden trajectory and he hasn't even been drafted.

Meh. If I can't con a Kevin Love out of Flip Saunders with the pick, I say go with Noel and just roll with it.

"The fucking Who...... If I want to watch old people run around ill go set fire to a nursing home." - CDT

Noel's still figuring out offense.Oldaipo's still figuring out offense.McLemore can't create off the dribble.Porter is pretty much what he will be going forward.Len is already on the Greg Oden trajectory and he hasn't even been drafted.

Meh. If I can't con a Kevin Love out of Flip Saunders with the pick, I say go with Noel and just roll with it.

Your chance for Kevin Love here walked out the door with David Kahn. Have to be an effing moron to give up a 24 yr old star for the handful of beans the Cavs can promise you.

Yeah so I overplayed my Ben Wallace hand. Tough to argue with the hardware he accumulated in his career. E0y don't take my comments so personally, it's not like I owe him or you money, property, or services. I'll agree you have the superior eye for evaluating pre-draft nba talent.

BTW, It was hard not to laugh as you ripped me apart...

"Cocaine is a hell of a drug" - Originated from a famous skit in Dave Chappelle's "Chappelle's Show". The skit would portray Rick James, usually high on cocaine, preforming doing crazy and stupid things, such as smacking Charlie Murphy in the face. Rick James would frequently explain away his actions by saying "Cocaine is a hell of a drug".

kman_holla8 wrote:Yeah so I overplayed my Ben Wallace hand. Tough to argue with the hardware he accumulated in his career. E0y don't take my comments so personally, it's not like I owe him or you money, property, or services. I'll agree you have the superior eye for evaluating pre-draft nba talent.

BTW, It was hard not to laugh as you ripped me apart...

I just watched The Nutty Professor. Eye's assaults remind me of the scene where Eddie Murphy goes back into the night club as Buddy Love and verbally assails the comedian Reggie who earlier had made fun of Eddie Murphy as Prof Sherman Klump.

"The nose of the bulldog has been slanted backwards so that he can breathe without letting go." -- Winston Churchill

e0y2e3 wrote:Not true Peeker, Nole is and always has been the top guy, baring medical reports.

Now (as has always been the case) if his knee is more messed up than just an ACL tear, he doesn't go one, period. Greg Oden ended that world.

But you HAVE to take those medical reports into consideration. Now and before. I agree with what you're saying about the guy and the weight issue is probably a non-issue. But you can't dismiss the knee issue from the equation.

As it stands today there isn't that one guy who truly stands out above the rest mostly because the guy that would apparently can't stand.

Now, I would bet my life that someone from this class will rise above the rest of the class and be a perennial All-NBA type guy. Is it still Noel? Is it Oladipo? Porter? I have no idea. But there will be at least one and the point is there's no consensus now as to who that will be.

Kyrie's clock is in 4-5 years after his extension, not now. Very very rare for someone to roll the dice with the one year qualifying offer at the end of a rookie deal and leave $80M+ on the table to reach unrestricted free agency. Especially someone like him who's made of papier mache.

Semi-redshirt Nerlens, tank one more year for the Wiggins/Parker class, get 23 back, then go to work.

"Well then I guess there's only one thing left to do...win the whole, f***in', thing."- Jake Taylor

Kingpin74 wrote:Kyrie's clock is in 4-5 years after his extension, not now. Very very rare for someone to roll the dice with the one year qualifying offer at the end of a rookie deal and leave $80M+ on the table to reach unrestricted free agency. Especially someone like him who's made of papier mache.

Semi-redshirt Nerlens, tank one more year for the Wiggins/Parker class, get 23 back, then go to work.

This, even if he goes the LBJ route and signs a 3 year instead of the max, we still have that dude for at least 4 years. And in 2017, when we might be looking at Kyrie's free agency, the thing most likely to drive him into the arms of Pat Riley is to make dumb ass short sighted decisions to try to win 3 extra games in December 2013.

Kingpin74 wrote:Kyrie's clock is in 4-5 years after his extension, not now. Very very rare for someone to roll the dice with the one year qualifying offer at the end of a rookie deal and leave $80M+ on the table to reach unrestricted free agency. Especially someone like him who's made of papier mache.

Semi-redshirt Nerlens, tank one more year for the Wiggins/Parker class, get 23 back, then go to work.

This, even if he goes the LBJ route and signs a 3 year instead of the max, we still have that dude for at least 4 years. And in 2017, when we might be looking at Kyrie's free agency, the thing most likely to drive him into the arms of Pat Riley is to make dumb ass short sighted decisions to try to win 3 extra games in December 2013.

Nerlens or no Nerlens, Kyrie is marking off his days here with chalk on a cement basement wall. Just like any other Cavalier that could PLAY.....all both of them.

And LBJ ain't coming back ferchrisakes. The fact he's from here LESSENS the chance the guy's coming back. Plus, if the Heat lose one of the next two he'll stink again anyways.

Anyways, bottom line w/Kyrie, if he keeps being injured, and his stock drops, he might stay. If he gets healthy and is a rising star in the league, he'll take his three then head for z hills, flush with endorsement money that will lessen the finacial blow.

I don't know who we are going to draft but I do know that some of you guys are really pessimistic when it comes to Kyrie and Cleveland in general.

If the Cavs are crappy in 3-5 years and have a bad group of players and bad FO yes, he will almost certainly leave. If they are middle of the pack and no real signs of being able to win a championship he will also probably leave.

If the Cavs have a strong team, strong FO and look like they can win a title he will probably stay.

Saying he is marking off his basement calendar to bolt in 3-5 years is pretty much chicken little if you ask me. Yeh, yeh I know, no one asked.

YahooFanChicago wrote:I don't know who we are going to draft but I do know that some of you guys are really pessimistic when it comes to Kyrie and Cleveland in general.

If the Cavs are crappy in 3-5 years and have a bad group of players and bad FO yes, he will almost certainly leave. If they are middle of the pack and no real signs of being able to win a championship he will also probably leave.

If the Cavs have a strong team, strong FO and look like they can win a title he will probably stay.Saying he is marking off his basement calendar to bolt in 3-5 years is pretty much chicken little if you ask me. Yeh, yeh I know, no one asked.

In the last 40 years, how many times have they been in this position? Now minus the Lebron ping pong ball and what do you have?

In the last 40 years, how many times have they been in this position? Now minus the Lebron ping pong ball and what do you have?

That's the whole point.[/quote]

Well, I guess if guys like Ted Stepien were the owner and Paxson was the GM I would agree with you. Like him or hate him Dapper Dan Gilbert has shown that he will spend money.

I still say if we are very good and Gilbert/Grant offer Kyrie a max contract he will most likely stay. If we suck and/or look for a "hommetown discount" he almost certainly leaves. To say that he is gone now and just marking-off his days is something I don't agree with.

You can doubt the Cavs will be good and I understand that. I am optomistic we will be quite good in the coming 2-5 years so I am a lot more positive about keeping Kyrie on the team.

I know we have some really shitty teams in Cleveland for a long time and that recently we have been even shitier than usual. Maybe I'm a homer but I like what the Cavs are building.

The Cavs are his business, and whatever the hell he does with them, is whatever the hell does with them.

Swerb wrote:Go start a blog if you want to tell the world your incomprehendible ramblings.

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I have a big arm and can throw the ball pretty damn far...... maybe even over those moutains. The Browns should sign me, i'll let you all in locker room to drink beer. Then we can all go out the parking lot to watch me do motorcycle stunts.

In the last 40 years, how many times have they been in this position? Now minus the Lebron ping pong ball and what do you have?

That's the whole point.

Well, I guess if guys like Ted Stepien were the owner and Paxson was the GM I would agree with you. Like him or hate him Dapper Dan Gilbert has shown that he will spend money.

I still say if we are very good and Gilbert/Grant offer Kyrie a max contract he will most likely stay. If we suck and/or look for a "hommetown discount" he almost certainly leaves. To say that he is gone now and just marking-off his days is something I don't agree with.

You can doubt the Cavs will be good and I understand that. I am optomistic we will be quite good in the coming 2-5 years so I am a lot more positive about keeping Kyrie on the team.

I know we have some really shitty teams in Cleveland for a long time and that recently we have been even shitier than usual. Maybe I'm a homer but I like what the Cavs are building.[/quote]

LP

Spending money has little to do with how good they can become, or how bad they've been. OKC is sittin on some miracle drafts right now. When Durant and Company run their course, than what?

OKC, like Cleveland, is at the TOTAL mercy of the draft. Nobody the hell wants to come here. Again, list the top ten free agents in Cavalier history - NOBODY IS WILLFULLY COMING HERE.

The Cleveland Cavaliers have never been poor because an owner refused to play. They've been poor because A. Historically, they have no earhly idea how to draft and B. Nobody want to be here.

Lebron didn't leave for money, nor is he coming back for it.

Gilbert can pay the luxury tax out of his ass, but unless he's payin' playas, what's the point?

I've always wondered what the cash price of a lottery pick was. In this case, it seems to be about $12 million -- the difference in what's owed over the next two years between Davis and Williams. Cleveland effectively paid the Clippers that amount for their first-round pick, which is completely unprotected in the 2011 draft and could end up being first. In fact, it's possible the Cavs will have the first two picks in the draft, which certainly could accelerate the post-LeBron rebuilding. Give a tip of the hat to Cavs owner Dan Gilbert for agreeing to use his checkbook to speed up the process.

In the short term, this trade may make Cleveland even worse. Although Davis is the more talented of the two players, Williams played fairly hard for a miserable Cleveland team, and nobody expects Davis to do the same, especially because he's reunited with coach Byron Scott. (The two clashed in New Orleans.) Look for Cleveland to deal him again at the first available opportunity.

Capwise, however, the Cavs' logic is airtight. Cleveland wasn't going to have cap space in the summer of 2011 no matter what; and even with Davis' fat contract on the books, it'll still have plenty of space in the summer of 2012.

Look, AJ, spending the cap (which is the budgeted amount) is nice and all. He did that, proved he isn't the biggest cheap skate ever and spent bottom third of the league money.

Grant cleared the cap out enough for him to do that, huzzah for both.

That says nothing about what will happen when in a three year period he has a max FA on the books, Kyrie and TT coming up for extensions, Waiters coming up for one and the extension for whoever he picks this year to look at. That is what matters and he has no track record in said situation.

We will see what happens, but OKC was a team that took on contracts for picks many, many, many times and they just dumped a top three SG to avoid the tax. Spending = eating the tax, the other shit is meh.

e0y2e3 wrote:That says nothing about what will happen when in a three year period he has a max FA on the books, Kyrie and TT coming up for extensions, Waiters coming up for one and the extension for whoever he picks this year to look at. That is what matters and he has no track record in said situation.

We will see what happens, but OKC was a team that took on contracts for picks many, many, many times and they just dumped a top three SG to avoid the tax. Spending = eating the tax, the other shit is meh.

I don't agree with the argument that anything less than suffering the worst luxury tax penalties in the history of professional sports makes Gilbert cheap, but ok e0.

Your issue is with 95% of the NBA owners, but if Gilbert isn't in that top 5% then let's call him cheap.

I'll have to admit that I haven't seen Alex Len play, and that most of my knowledge of him comes from this forum and the mocks that I read. However, the frequency of the Cavs-picking-Len-with-the-1st-pick rumors has me concerned.

Heck, if we want Len, we could trade back to 5 or 6 and be relatively assured that we could get him there.

"The nose of the bulldog has been slanted backwards so that he can breathe without letting go." -- Winston Churchill

If that were the case, if I were the Cavs, I would have sure tried to keep it quiet. It is fairly common knowledge that the Cavs were shopping the pick for a trade. If you then come out and let it be known that Len is your guy, you clearly de-value the #1 pick in the trade market, because no one was gonna trade up to get Len. Insodoing, you then increase the value of the next couple of picks because now Noel, McLemore, Porter and Bennet are all still available.

"The nose of the bulldog has been slanted backwards so that he can breathe without letting go." -- Winston Churchill

The Cavaliers are being their quiet usual 'selves and nothing the do with the number 1 would surprise. I have not paid nearly as much attention to this NBA draft, but Len is a two way player that still has possibly the greatest upside of those available. Seems to be a good fit with Irving and the current batch of Cavaliers. I'm not advocating... I am not really a fan of the value at #1.

"When a man with money meets a man with experience, the man with experience leaves with money and the man with money leaves with experience."