Vilification Minnesota style: Bradlee Dean – UPDATED

Last week, the American Family Association’s Bryan Fischer gave us an illustration of the verb “to vilify” by saying on his radio show, among other things, that Hitler couldn’t find any straight people to work his evil, he had to find gay people to do it. He followed up with a column where he blamed homosexuality for “six millions dead Jews.” I hesitated to even write that because of the horror of trivializing the holocaust, even in reporting what someone else said. However, he said it and he did it as ammunition in the culture war. He should be ashamed as should the AFA.

There was another illustration of Christians vilifying gays in the name of the culture war last week that is a close second to Fischer. Instead of blaming gays for millions of deaths, this radio personality says Muslim law is better than US law in that it provides death for gays. Watch and listen to Christian rocker, Bradlee Dean and a too enthusiatic female caller discuss sodomy laws in MN and how moral Muslims are compared to Christians. Please note what makes those Muslims so good.

But recent controversial statements by Dean — that Muslim countries calling for the execution of gays and lesbians are “more moral than even the American Christians” — have drawn the ire of some both within and outside the party.

“Muslims are calling for the executions of homosexuals in America,” Dean said on YCR’s May 15 radio show on AM 1280 the Patriot. “This just shows you they themselves are upholding the laws that are even in the Bible of the Judeo-Christian God, but they seem to be more moral than even the American Christians do, because these people are livid about enforcing their laws. They know homosexuality is an abomination.”

“If America won’t enforce the laws, God will raise up a foreign enemy to do just that,” Dean continued. “That is what you are seeing in America.”

“The bottom line is this… they [homosexuals] play the victim when they are, in fact, the predator,” Dean said, before going on to make a claim that has no basis in fact: “On average, they molest 117 people before they’re found out. How many kids have been destroyed, how many adults have been destroyed because of crimes against nature?”

The statistic he quotes — 117 children molested — conflates pedophiles and homosexuals. It may not be accurate even about pedophiles. I have tried to find the source of it and the closest I can come is a website and book which sources it to a 1988 NIMH publication (not in newer editions) but with no specific study. Even if the stat has a legitimate source, it relates to pedophiles and not gays. It is possible I suppose that Dean is so misinformed that he believes his rhetoric. One wonders if he would change his position if he could be convinced that his view of gays was wrong.

On the whole, Dean’s radio performance comes across as a rant with little conherence but it is hard to come up with any other understanding of his words than this – he believes Muslim countries who kill gays for being gay have the moral high ground over the USA.

Some of the commenters on the other thread were discussing how this kind of rhetoric represents Christianity. So let’s keep that discussion going. Can’t you just feel the love?

UPDATE: Exodus International posted a stinging condemnation of Bradlee Dean’s remarks on their blog. I suspect this will be followed by a similar statement from one of the Minnesota church affiliates, Living Word Christian Center. Exgaywatch is reporting that the You Can Run group was featured there last year at a high school function.

Hmmm… so he thinks following the death penalty is more Christian… I have to wonder if he has read the rest of the Bible. Adultery was punishable by death according to the Levitical text. And a further examination of the Old Testament reveals that fornication was punishable by death as well for one or both participants depending on whether they were found “doing it” in the city or the country.

I find it kind of odd that nobody campaigns for that. .. must be selective reading. (Yes I am being sarcastic)

Dave

http://someguysarenormal.blogspot.com Brady

Well, I’d imagine he is going to see his school speaking engagements dry up now.

Mary

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

Can’t deny that what they read in the bible is there. However, the application of the Helper after Christ’s ressurection cannot be underestimated or diminshed. As we see that Samaritans, Gentiles and Corinthians were welcomed into the body of Christ. And Paul himself speaks of his “thorn” in his side. What do these examples tell us?

That we are (none of us) outside the family of God and that we do struggle with sin and that murdering someone who does sin was not found in the Gospels. Also, some people don’t believe in the same religion – that’s the way it is.

Mary

Ooops – correction – ascension not resurrection.

Timothy Kincaid

Speaking for a moment as a Christian, instead of a gay guy, this is troubling. Not because of what he said, exactly, but because of the response of the church and what this does to our efforts to be Christ to the world.

If Dean had praised the execution of Jews, we all would have rightly rushed to condemn him and his words and make clear that this was false and evil doctrine. If he had called for killing fornicators (thanks, Dave) we would have condemned him from the pulpit.

But other than you, Warren, I don’t see any voice of the church denouncing Dean’s statements or even expressing them as being troublesome.

And let me be certain that I’m clear as to whom I am blaming:

I blame the conservative Christians for fostering a culture of vilification in which statements like this seem normal. I blame them for not correcting a brother in error.

I blame the liberal Christians for not having the balls to stand up and declare that statements like this offend Christ. I blame them for not challenging conservative Christians and calling them out.

I blame the church as a whole for seeing this as “someone else’s problem”. When things like this are not addressed, it sends a very clear message to gay people, and those who love them, that they are so unimportant that even the most vile statements aren’t worth a moment of concern.

I blame the family of believers for letting this guy be their voice, their face. This does tremendous damage to the mission. If we don’t, as a people, refute this stuff then we slander the name of Christ; we allow Him to be equated with hatefulness.

I know that many many Christians do not hate gay people. But lots of gay folks don’t know that.

How could they?

Mary

But other than you, Warren, I don’t see any voice of the church denouncing Dean’s statements or even expressing them as being troublesome.

Dean’s opinions don’t make the front pgae or most important issue in many churches. Poverty, hunger, abuse etc… are still issues that plague the world and effect so many more people that that is where a lot of focus goes to. However, Timothy, I am a christian, considered ex gay (FLOABW) and I am speaking against what he says. Granted, I don’t p[astor a church, run a blog, or anything except come here continually and denounce these kinds of beliefs.

Timothy Kincaid

Mary,

I very much doubt that poverty, hunger, or abuse would stop the church from denouncing and publicly opposing a call for execution of Jews.

You seem to be suggesting that gay people are of lower importance. Am I correct in this interpretation?

Mary

You are incorrect in this interpretation. Unfortunately what many people see as the truth being portrayed in the media is not really the truth at all. What gets put on the news are the highlights and outrageous to capture viewership. And you missed the point I was trying to make:

There are many christians who are not seen or heard and who have a deep concern for the well being of all people regardless of their background or belief system.

We just hapeen to have more people who are suffering from other “notable” issues that more people can relate to. It does not mean that gays are less of a concern or less important.

David Farrell

[quote=Mary'

We just hapeen to have more people who are suffering from other “notable” issues that more people can relate to. It does not mean that gays are less of a concern or less important.[/quote]

so someone calling for gay people to be executed because they think that that is what is in the bible is not “notable” enough for you. The problem with the many Christians who are not seen or heard is that they are not seen or heard. I am sorry but remaining silent on the issue is in fact agreeing with it.

Mary

You guys are taking what I am writing out of context.

And you know it. You are sensitive and looking for any notch to take a hold.

Timothy Kincaid

Mary,

I am taking your comments in the context of this thread and in the consideration that they were written in response to my comment.

I complained that the church does not prioritize denouncing vilification. You defended the church and made an excuse explaining why my complaint was invalid.

You first said that poverty, hunger and abuse are more important. Then you clarified that they are more “notable” and people can “relate to it better” than reacting to a call for the execution of gay people.

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Timothy Kincaid

And what is more annoying is that when someone does try to tone down the rhetoric, to counter the message of vilification, they then become the target of attack.

Warren, to his great credit, is working to remind Christians that they are to be Christlike. And I’ve seen far more denouncement of him from Christendom than I have of Bradlee Dean.

Why is that?

dave

Hi Timothy,

I think what Mary is trying to tell you is that most Christians are not even aware of ridiculous statements like this. Its not becaue they are bigots… it just because they are clueless and never hear such garbage. I share your frustration over this. I frequently get quite angry about this sort of thing. My wife .. who is not emmersed in it as I am .. often gets upset with me because I get rather irritated with Christianity in general over this. But she sees things differently because her head is not immersed in this stuff.

Now certainly there are people who are aware and have failed to inform others. And yes that is frustrating. Warren, of course, is not one of them. And I could probably name a few more who are making people aware of this. And indeed when I talk to some people and they become aware of these things then they are upset too. But again .. many Christians do not know anything of this.

Timothy Kincaid

dave,

I agree. Most Christians neither know nor care about gay issues – other than that they are supposed to “oppose the homosexual agenda”. Few have the faintest idea about what’s gone on in Uganda or Malawi. Fewer still know what Bradlee Dean endorses.

Which is exactly why this stuff can happen.

I don’t have much criticism for Joe and Jane in their pew on Sunday. But I do for religious leaders who should know and either choose not to or don’t care.

Where is Richard Land on this issue? He has time to call for a filibuster on Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell. Does he not have a second to say, “ummm, yeah, execution isn’t so great”?

Where are the pastors in Minneapolis?

I appreciate Dr. Throckmorton. Just as I appreciate those who opposed the Uganda bill.

But this stuff hurts our community of faith. And if churches are genuine and sincere when they say that they want to “reach the homosexual” then they have to do more than campaign for “defense of marriage” laws. They have to also oppose evil when it’s directed towards gay people.

I work to build bridges. I stand in the gay community and point out those who are not advocates for discrimination. I constantly argue that not all Christians hate gay folk.

I just wish that Christians didn’t make that quite so hard to do.

Mary

I agree. Most Christians neither know nor care about gay issues – other than that they are supposed to “oppose the homosexual agenda”. Few have the faintest idea about what’s gone on in Uganda or Malawi. Fewer still know what Bradlee Dean endorses

That’s what I am saying. The radio stations I liveten to and the Contemporary Christian Music artisits I listen to have not been recorded (to the best of my knowledge) saying or endorsing such things.

In fact, what they say about Muslim and their laws are sort of funny. I have many muslim friends and they come in all shapes and sizes and beliefs, too. They drink, they smoke, the adulterate (if that’s a word) they do all the things Christians do. They just happen to have stricter laws – but they are broken nonetheless.

Lynn David

Brady….. Well, I’d imagine he is going to see his school speaking engagements dry up now.

I seriously doubt that. I read up on this issue in the MnINDY online newspaper when much of it came out about the candidate for governor giving more than is allowed to Dean’s ministry. Dean has made hateful remarks about gays before and it hasn’t stopped his ministry from being invited (and paid) to go to more and more public schools over the last several years. There are still plenty of school districts out there headed by people who don’t give a dang about gay people.

I often wonder what would happen if a public school with a small but cohesive Muslim population were to engage Dean’s ministry to speak about drugs and violence (which is their major message). As music (and punk/rock music at that) is a very large part of how he seeks to engage with students, it would seem that devout Muslims would be rightfully appalled that their son or daughter would be exposed to that. Heck, I would be as an atheist.

shadows

This man talks like he knows how it is to be gay….maybe there’s something we don’t know about him…..

Mary

Just let it be recorded that not all christians feel that way and most are not getting on the band wagon and following this guy.

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/warrenthrockmorton Warren

Note that Exodus Intl just condemned the remarks by Dean (see the updates in the post). However, Mary, it is shocking to me that within MN there have been no condemnations by anyone related to the conservative church that I can find.

Mary

Shadows,

Unless he really understand what it is like and I doubt it by the way he talks, then accusing him of being gay is just as insulting to gay people. Don’t you think?

Mary

Warren,

If I had more time, I do some research for you on that one. Certainly not all of MN is confused??? Exodus ministries that are located in that state?

Lynn David

Mary…

What transpired on his radio program was reported last week in Minnesota newspapers. It was in conjunction with the republican gubernatorial candidate, Tom Emmer, who gave to Dean’ ministry from his election campaign. The trouble was that he gave an amount which was in excess of what was lawful. Emmer responded that You Can Run But You Cannot Hide Intl., Inc., “are nice people.”

“My understanding is that it’s a Christian-based ministry that’s about family, that is about respect for yourself….I know that they’re a pro-marriage, pro-traditional marriage group.”

.

“These are nice people. Are we going to agree on everything? No….I really appreciate their passion and you know what I respect their point of view. I respect their right to have whatever view. That’s what makes it a great country. You don’t have to agree with it.”

Then Dean, stating that he “loves” gays and lesbians, directed his comments at this reporter. “I want to say this because I have love and compassion for the homosexual community. The homosexuals are being exploited by tyrants for their own use.”

But I’d guess his ‘love’ to be tainted by prior statements.

.

But on another note, Bradlee Dean also refers to liberals as criminals. So he doesn’t discriminate in his vilification. Yet the same night he declared his love for gays he also declared a love for liberal whackjobs:

“To the liberal whackjobs that are here: I love you! Put that in your paper! Put that in your paper! All right?”

So go figure.

.

He’s also a conspiracy nut who doesn’t think that America landed on the Moon.

On the group’s radio show, broadcast live from the Heritage Foundation on May 22, co-leader Jake McMillian praised the actions of the African nation of Malawi which has recently arrested a gay couple for getting engaged.

“They are very conservative,” he said. “They sentence people for crimes against nature.”

Frontman Bradlee Dean added, “They are very moral; they uphold the laws.”

McMillian continued, “We have got countries all over the world that are standing for what’s right and what’s wrong. In Rwanda, there’s legislation right now that repeat offenders of homosexuality will spend their life in prison.”

“Yes!” interjected Dean.

“Because they love and value life and they love and value that which God gave,” said McMillian. “And so they enforce laws against that which destroys life which again is crimes against nature”

The group later brought in Bishop Harry Jackson, an anti-gay marriage activist in Washington, D.C., who praised the group’s work. “I believe a great awakening is about to come forth,” said Jackson. “I believe you are a part of it and those that hear the sound of your voice are revolutionaries.”

I’ve not heard of the Rwandan legislation. Last of any legislation I heard of there, Bob Hunter had lobbied against it and it was dropped. But I don’t doubt Dean and McMillian might be making it up as they go along.

A year later, in Tennessee, Dean brought his group to speak and perform at Roane County High School. And the story was much the same.

According to the Oak Ridger, “RCHS Principal Jody McLoud apologized for any controversy or heartache the assembly generated. In addition to homosexuality, race and obesity, the materials reportedly also included such topics as suicide, drugs and premarital sex.”

“They encouraged bigotry and hate-mongering toward children that may not share their religious beliefs or who are struggling to find an identity or self-esteem,” said Laura Dailey, a parent of a Roane County High student, according to the article. The school district was forced to deal with the controversy by reiterating its policy that “forbids religious statements in schools.”

Who was it from NARTH who supported bullying gay children, Berger? Seems he’d love them.

…

Spunky

JUST ANOTHER COUPLE OF MORONS. SHOCK JOCKS THAT WILL DISAPPEAR INTO NOTHING VILLE. GET A REAL LIFE GUYS. YOU DON’T HAVE A CLUE.

Nabal

Typically Christians are passionately against homosexuality because the bible says it’s punishable by eternal damnation. The tone of his voice sounds like a man passionate about homosexuals eternal destination which Christians base their beliefs found in both the Old and New Testament.

Homosexuality was addressed by our Founding Fathers and George Washington addressed homosexuality issuing orders for the military on March 14, 1778.

Congress issued the following edict:

The Commanders of . . . the thirteen United Colonies are strictly required to show in themselves a good example of honor and virtue to their officers and men and to be very vigilant in inspecting the behavior of all such as are under them, and to discountenance and suppress all dissolute, immoral, and disorderly practices, and also such as are contrary to the rules of discipline and obedience, and to correct those who are guilty of the same.

Noah Webster author of the first American dictionary and soldier in the Revolution defined the terms defined the terms “dissolute” and “immoral” that Congress used:

Dissolute: Loose in behavior and morals; given to vice and dissipation; wanton; lewd; debauched; not under the restraints of law; as a dissolute man: dissolute company.

Immoral: Inconsistent with moral rectitude; contrary to the moral or Divine law. . . . Every action is immoral which contravenes any Divine precept or which is contrary to the duties which men owe to each other.

In the 1930’s our government and nation started removing God, rewriting our history progressively eroding the morals that America was known for all over the world. Because no one is taught the original intend and God has been removed from education society thinks this is ok. Because Christians are not heard it appears the growing number of society that either are or tolerate homosexuality are destined for eternal damnation hence their passion.

Based on Bradley’s tone and trying to inform of homosexuals of the Muslim agenda I believe he truly cares wholeheartedly, loves and is concerned for homosexuals when he says:

I say this in their defense and for their eternal destination…Yet you have Muslims calling for your execution.

After seeing TheThirdJihad.com documentary my heart goes out to them. Not only are they a target for violence they are being used for an agenda and propaganda.

If Bradley didn’t care how come Google is full of pages of posts of offended people, multiple articles/radio shows, school functions etc.?

Lynn David

You can take Dean’s form of ‘caring’ which includes repeating lies and invectives about gay people and put it somewhere dark and dank. His attitude is in no way derived from any love. And anyone who would think it does has a skewed understanding of what love truly is.