Who read the war of the ring more than once as I've done, knows that during the part of the story in "The Hobbit" in which Gandalf leaves the dwarves and Bilbo, he supposedly entered the dungeons of a dark wizard, in the dark forest, that in fact was Sauron. Has Sauron was not yet restored to his full power, Gandalf manage to escape and persuaded the White Council to attack that stronghold. And Sauron ran back to Mordor. Since Del Toro wants to expand "The Hobbit" to better tell the war of the ring, I hope he pays attention to that detail for I would love to see that bit of story in live action. What do you guys think and could someone ask Del Toro if he's going to include that in any of the movies? It could even be a flashback like the one in LOTR explaining what happened when he fought the balrog and died!

but GDT has never really said he wants to expand or clarify or anything related to the War Of the Ring. Everything he has said up to now (related to this question) is that the Hobbit movies are supposed to flow smoothly into the LOTR movies. Now, my personal speculation is that there will be no bridge movie (a separate movie with content leading to LOTR which GDT confirmed) but there will be bridge scenes and plot lines thus turning the second movie (my guess) into a complex narrative, instead of the linear narrative of the first one. Like FOTR and the TT - the first one was linear, then from TT it turned into complex narrative with many plot lines. As I said, I'm all for the Necromancer story to be included as well as other things that happened at that time and later, aka the White Council, the hunt for the Gollum, the guard of the Shire and the darkening. You may want to check 2-3 pages backwards, there have been long discussions on what should be included in the Hobbit movies

As about asking GDT, he is not allowed to share anything like that and we appreciate his obligations. I'm sure he will share it with us when he gets the right to do so.

Welcome to TORN, it's a great time to be here! Culinary journey through Middle Earth continues! Bright new in the New Year - January 15 on the Main board

[The reader of LotR] knows that during the part of the story in The Hobbit in which Gandalf leaves the dwarves and Bilbo, he supposedly entered the dungeons of a dark wizard, in the dark forest, that in fact was Sauron.

Not quite: in The Lord of the Rings, it says that Gandalf had twice previously been to Dol Guldur. On the first occasion, some 900 years before the events in The Hobbit took place, Sauron beat a hasty retreat before Gandalf could identify him. On the second occasion, 90 years earlier than The Hobbit, Gandalf sneaked into Sauron's dungeons unobserved, recieved a map and key from Thráin, and confirmed that the master of Dol Guldur was indeed Sauron.

What happens during Gandalf's absence in The Hobbit is that he and the rest of the White Council (or the council of "white wizards", as it says in that book) attack Dol Guldur --we're never told how-- and drive Sauron out. But really he had already planned to "retreat", and sets up again in Mordor not long after.

Tolkien gives very few details on this event, so to portray it for the silver screen, the filmmakers are going to have to do a lot of invention. <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> We're discussingThe Lord of the Rings in the Reading Room, Oct. 15, 2007 - Mar. 22, 2009!

All that you said is true, but I would still love to see that confrontation! And if they would have to invent stuff... well they did put elves in Elm's Deep and gave super deathgiving powers to the Ghost Army, so I don't see a problem if they do invent something to show us one of the most important moves in the War of the Ring, even if Sauron was already going to leave. However, I think it would be a cool way to both tell the story of Gandalf during does years, and at the same time show his discussions with Saruman in the White Council. I believe that this would present the perfect linkage to LOTR and be a movie in it's own right.

I know NEB is a lert. I am a wanabee lert. Are you a lert? We need more lerts. "Tolkien, like Lewis, believed that, through story, the real world would become a more magical place, full of meaning. We see its patterns and colors in a fresh way. The recovery of a true view of the world applies both to individual things, like hills and stones, and to the cosmic - the depths of space and time itself. For in sub-creation, in Tolkien's view, there is a "survey" of space and time. Reality is captured on a miniature scale. Through stories like The Lord of the Rings, a renewed view of things is given, illuminating the homely, the spiritial, the physical, and the moral dimensions of the world."

Tolkien and C.S. Lewis- The Gift of Friendship -Duriez

May the grace of Manwë let us soar with eagle's wings! In the air, among the clouds in the sky Here is where the birds of Manwe fly Looking at the land, and the water that flows The true beauty of earth shows With the stars of Varda lighting my way In all the realms this is where I stay In the realm of Manwë Súlimo By El~Cugu (From the website: 'The realm of Manwe')