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Can some one please help with this hosting question

Can someone please advise me on this hosting problem i have got before i go completely mad.

I am with tmd hosting and i am sure they are from another planet.

I have a dedicated server for the domain name http://www.in2town.co.uk and when i had a normal server they told me because my site was slow that it would get faster on a dedicated server, that did not happen.

Then they said because my joomla was an old version that i should get a new version to make the site faster. I decided that i wanted to completely re do the site and asked them to give me a new installation of joomla.17 but i am just about to put a new website on there and it is very very slow.

I have a template that i am using which i am going to redesign and put in2town on there but for days now i am having problems with the hosting company understanding what i am saying to them.

They assured me that if i went ahead with a new joomla then the site would be fast, and it should be because my site is the only site on there and also because it is a brand new template, but the site is very very slow.

Can someone please read what i have put to them to try and get them to understand as i cannot find any other way of getting them to understand what i mean and want and do not understand their responce. I really need this matter sorting out and i am on the verge of taking all of my hosting packages away from them.

below is the latest stuff that i have written to them and they have written to me, any help in getting through to them and understanding what they mean would be great.

here is the communication

hi not sure what has been going on all day as i have been trying to get onto your site and it has been really slow.

The reason i am writing is my site www.in2town.co.uk is very slow, even worse than before, can you please let me know what is going on and why it is very slow and how come i have not been able to get on your site a few times today

.......................

I have checked your server and the current load is below 1 which is perfect. Also there is 1GB free RAM memory for all the processes to be executed.

and it loads for almost 5 seconds. Note that this is without loading any of the design files such as images/css/javascripts. If you would like we will add caching function to your server for the php executions. This however will require the Apache to be recompiled to 2.2 version and xCache to be installed.

If after the caching service is installed the performance is still not at least 35% better you may need to contact expert php/MySQL developer to optimize all the coding of your website manually for the best possible performance for the resources available on your dedicated server.

Let us know if we should proceed with the above mentioned caching service setup.

Looking forward to your reply.

Best regards,

Gabriel Reed Senior Support Team TMDHosting.com

...................................

hi i do not understand what you mean by contacting a php expert. am i having problems because my php can not been refreshed. what i mean by this. if i had a site that was just built like my clairehegarty.co.uk site then would i have this problem.

this is what i was worried about, with having a new design and new joomla on a site that i was having problems with including speed. this is why i was talking about a complete new start.

can you explain more about this. so for example if in2town was a brand new domain name, a brand new site that i just had joomla put on, would my site still be this slow

.....................

Thank you for contacting us and I apologize for the delay in reply.

Basically with the development of your website internal scripts are constantly modified as well as the database. Therefor the more complex your website configuration gets the more resources are consumed with the execution of each script and query.

Indeed a fresh Joomla installation will be running faster as no script modifications are faced with installation.

Should you need our further assistance contact us anytime.

Best Regards,

Kenny Smith Technical Support Team TMDHosting.com

...........................

right sorry but i still do not understand. my site is running so slow and i have a new installation of joomla on it, so is it running slow because it has not been totally refreshed or what. i need to understand properly.

Are you telling me that if you done a complete new install, so if in2town was a brand new site that you have just installed joomla for, would this be quicker. i really do not understand what is going on and i am on the verge of cancelling my dedicated server as it is not giving me any results what so ever.

I need to know that is it because i have had a big site on there which is now under new sub domain, is that making it slow and if so why can you just not move it under a new domain name for the time being.

Please can you make it clearer what is wrong as i need the site to run fast and not slow lilke it is now. i am waiting to build the new site and it is embarrassing at how slow it is.

I am being told my collegaues of mine to take it to a new hosting company which at this moment i do not want to do as long as you can sort this problem out and explain what is going on.

Do we need to do a fresh install and move in2town which i am just building again now to a new domain name until you clear it all and then move it back or what.

please let me know what needs doing to fix all this.

....................

this is the result of a speed test which is disgusting and making me angry. my business is suffering because of all this and needs sorting. look at the speed test.

The loading speed issue is not caused from the server as its state is stable. It is not overloaded and has enough resources for the moment. The option to have the website speed up were provided in my previous post in this ticket and I am afraid that other options are not available.

I would like to kindly ask you to review this ticket and let us know how to assist you further.

Looking forward to your reply.

Best regards,

Gabriel Reed Senior Support Team TMDHosting.com

...............................

yes if you can speed it up, that will be great, but i am still very confused as i think we are both at crossed wires here.

can you tell me, if the new site that i am building now, in2town, if that went onto a brand new hosting installation, would it be faster. are you saying that.

as we have had a new installation of joomla 1.7 as you know installed, and i thought by redoing the whole site that it would become faster but i has got a lot slower, so i need to understand what is happening.

should we be saying to all, clear everything and lets start from strach with new php or whatever it is called or what.

are you saying with the old site on the domain and hosting that is causing it problems as the new site as you can see www.in2town.co.uk has nothing on it as yet

............................

Please note that we will do our best to optimize the server for the best possible performance for Joomla 1.7. However the coding optimizations you will have to request from an expert local web developer. We do not offer development services at this point.

I will now escalate this ticket to our System Administrators and they will apply any changes required to optimize the web service as much as possible. As soon as any updates are available they will get back to you vi this ticket. Note that all the optimization are manual and extended period of time will be required for the completion.

Thank you for the patience in advance.

Best regards,

Gabriel Reed Senior Support Team TMDHosting.com

............................

ok thanks for that. but i am not understanding still, why the site is slow compared to what it was. and if the site if i got a brand new hosting package off you and got a brand new site to put it on, if the site would be slow. i do not think you are understanding what i am saying to you.

..................................

You may need to request from a local web developer to review the website coding and provide you with list of the functions which are causing its performance to be slow.

I am afraid that we do not offer development services. What we may offer you is to install the caching services mentioned above which should improve the performance of the website.

As soon as the server side patches are complete we will get back to you via this ticket.

Best regards,

Gabriel Reed Senior Support Team TMDHosting.com

................................

Hi. IS there any chance you could pass what i have said to someone else as i am not sure you are understanding what i am saying.

in simple terms here goes.

1. If in2town was a brand new domain name with the template i have on it and asked you for a brand new hosting package, would it still be slow

The site never use to be slow and you told me that if i got a newer version of joomla then the site would be faster, mind you, you claimed if i got a new dedicated server it would be faster, none of which has happened.

I really need you to pass this onto someone else straight away to get this question answered.

8 Responses

The main reason I read through your entire Q&A is it sounds incredibly similar to a situation I recently experienced. In fact, if you were located in the US I would speak with you about co-hosting our sites on the same server.

I have a site which loads too slow. When I perform page speed tests the fastest times are 2 seconds, where my main competitor for the site has it's fastest speeds at 0.2 seconds, literally 10x faster. After reviewing everything involved one of the key factors is I am on shared hosting where the competing site is on a dedicated server. There are 35 other sites hosted on the competitor's server, but they are all controlled by the same company which offers many advantages.

There are so many factors which influence speed. As the tech mentioned, cache is a factor but lightspeed servers are definitely faster but more expensive to maintain. Sites without cPanel are faster but then you either need to be very familiar with *nix or hire someone to perform the takes you would otherwise complete in cPanel.

I use Joomla 1.7 in multiple sites and I can share the software is well designed. You can offer a fast, responsive site with Joomla. A simple experiment you can perform.

1. Measure your site's speed with an independent tool which checks from multiple locations. I recommend Alertra as a tool I use.

2. Put up a second site on the server. Just add a clean Joomla install. Use any "extra" domain you may have, or a sub-domain for the main site if you don't have any other domains. Now perform a speed test of the second site. Compare the results. If there is not any significant difference, you have ruled out the possibility your site development is at fault. You can now demonstrate a clean Joomla install offers the same speed as your site. If that is not the case, then your web development is the root issue.

3. Put up a clean site. No CMS, just a simple "hello world" web page. Perform a speed test on the clean site's URL. By comparing the result with the Joomla site, you can determine how much the CMS slows down your site's speed.

The bottom line, either your host is knowledgeable and helpful on this topic, or not. They could be correct. I would recommend investigating further to know for sure.

If you really wish to explore all possibilities to maximize speed, the following steps can be taken:

1. Upgrade to a light-speed or similar server. It is costly.

2. The tech stated your memory was not an issue. If he is correct, then you can feel comfortable in this aspect.

3. Try a server without cPanel or any other GUI. It will be faster, but more difficult for you to manage unless you have an experienced developer.

4. Use a Content Delivery Network. It reduces the load on your server and quickly delivers content to users.

5. Run PageSpeed and/or YSlow on your pages to ensure they are optimized. Your images should be compressed using a lossless converter such as Yahoo Smush.it. There are many other optimization settings. Since you are working with a new site, I mention this last because the issue could be related to your hosting or the other items mentioned above.

There are many other details concerning the coding of the pages, but I would prefer to work with a blank site until you were satisfied with the loading speed, then page optimization can be discussed.

TL;DR - Your hosting company is stating your site's coding is the issue. More specifically, the database queries and PHP coding need optimizing. Verify the performance of a clean Joomla site. If the clean Joomla site performs well, but your site does not, then the hosting company is correct. If the performance of both sites is similar, there is another issue.

TL;DR - Your hosting company is stating your site's coding is the issue. More specifically, the database queries and PHP coding need optimizing. Verify the performance of a clean Joomla site. If the clean Joomla site performs well, but your site does not, then the hosting company is correct. If the performance of both sites is similar, there is another issue.

Hi thanks for that. I have another website on the dedicated server and it is fast. I have just tried it and with your advice found it to be really fast.

What i have been saying to them and i do not think they understand is, they have not done a clean install and instead they have put the old site on a subdomain of in2town and instead they have put the new in2town site on the main domain. what i am trying to get them to understand is, if they are saying there could be errors with the coding then should we not totally clear the lot and then start from scratch and have a new installation of joomla and build my site again.

But they are not listening to this or not understanding and if you feel i am right in what i am saying, how can i get them to understand. and also do you think i am right in what i am saying that we should start from scratch if they are saying there could be a problem with the coding on the site.

I have another website on the dedicated server and with your advice found it to be really fast.

Great, so now you know the hosting company is correct. You have a fast server and the issue is your site.

My suggestion is first to assume the hosting company is correct on their analysis. They determined your issue is the database and php coding. They specifically recommended "This however will require the Apache to be recompiled to 2.2 version and xCache to be installed." Accordingly I would suggest you allow them to make the changes they recommended.

My next question concerns the site development. How exactly what your site created? It sounds like there are issues with the database and it's queries. You may wish to speak to the developer and bring to his/her attention this issue.

With respect to the subdomain, it is simply a web address. Whether it is a subdomain or a main domain should not affect the speed of your site.

If you believe the database is the issue, there are numerous steps to diagnose the problem. If the issue is within the database itself, then by creating a new database and loading it with the data from the old database, you can resolve many issues such as rebuilding indexes and locating data corruption. If the issue is with poor database design or queries, nothing will help until the code is corrected.

If you were asked me to guess, the most likely issue is generally the human element which would be the person who designed your site. Is there any customizations to it? I am specifically referring to any PHP coding that is not standard to Joomla.

why is the server under strain, i do not understand and also if we are based in the UK which we are, does it matter which country our hosting company is in.

We have a dedicated server with three sites on it, the in2town site was really big but now it is the smallest as we are rebuilding it, but the other two sites that are on the dedicated server are a lot faster and they have more info on them and are bigger at the moment.

The technician was a bit technical. He told you your server load is under 1.0, which, in Linux terms, is good. So you're not under any major load.

For SEO reasons, no it doesn't matter a lot where you're hosted (it helps for localized search but not so much as to be a hurdle). But if you're in the UK and your server is in Houston, TX, you've got a 3000 mile round trip for your data. You might want to consider a UK host, especially if you're pursuing UK traffic.

As for your techs, what I would guess is that you have an old database from your previous Joomla install. Do you know how to create a new database and start over? That's what I would suggest before assuming it's a software issue. If your other sites on the same server aren't slow it sounds like the database is your culprit.

Hi highland thanks for that. I did not understand that it was important to have a uk hosting company to gain uk traffic. thanks for that. can you recommend any uk companies.

Also the hosting company deals with the database, so how would it be best to explain to them to do a brand new database instead of keeping the new joomla on the old data base as this seems to be the problem but i cannot get them to understand

"Please make a new database for my Joomla website. I wish to start over"

My guess is that your database is older and has possibly become unstable. For instance, if you're using an older table system (like MyISAM) and you've never repaired any of your tables (you might be staring blankly at the screen right now wondering what I'm talking about) then I could see even a basic page load grinding to a halt. If I were your host, however, I wouldn't touch that with a ten foot pole, lest I be accused of damaging customer data.

I would also insist that they install some opcode caching for PHP (like e-accelerator) and tune your MySQL server using mysqltuner. Neither should take them long to do and they will help your site performance.

Hey friend! Have fun exploring Q&A, but in order to ask your own
questions, comment, or give thumbs up, you need to be logged in to your
Moz Pro account.
You can also earn access by receiving 500
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Learn more.