I recently posted some source code that, now that I have included an
include file, compiles correctly under "compile single file" - there
are warnings but no errors.

Why is it that when I try to "build all", I get 29 errors?
There is only 1 file in the project - and that seems to compile
correctly on its own.

I must admit that MPLAB is _the_ most user unfriendly software I have
ever encountered.

Are there any switches / options / prayers I could use to set the
bloody thing up so that I can actually compile a small amount of code
_without_ spending a week on it and tearing out my hair in the
process?

TO MICROCHIP: I would very much like to be able to use your 16c84
microcontroller in my designs. I am a 'home' user, an enthusiast (and
a professional electronics engineer), I have no need for an
integrated environment capable of handling lots of different files -
I need an easy to use editor/compiler that will enable me to produce
PIC code from 1main source file, easily and quickly, ideally with a
graphic menu driven interface and simulation window. Do you think
your gifted programmers could produce something like this and
document it so that an absolute beginner can use it?

I bet you can not.

You produced a microcontroller with a very small instruction set so
that programmers would quickly become familiar with the device. Why
should I have to spend more time learining the ins and outs of the
tools needed to assemble the code than on the
code itself?

>You produced a microcontroller with a very small instruction set so
>that programmers would quickly become familiar with the device. Why

They didn't produce it originally. Before MCHP came along, GI (the cable
converter people) made them.

There's a basic paradigm in the world that, if you want something cheap, it
must be simple to make. It doesn't get much simpler than a '5x chip, for
sure!

If I'm designing something for the mass market (100K per year or so),
engineering costs really don't matter very much, but parts costs is very
important. If I'm making something that will be produced in very small
quantities, parts costs doesn't matter as much, but engineering costs do.

Most low- or mid-range PICs are ideal for very high volume production. The
programmer must do the USART, PWM, etc. in software. This takes time
(dollars) up front, but in the long run is very cost effective. OTOH, the
'6x/7x parts have lots of peripherals which make the programmer's job
easier, but cost $$$ in production.

Get the idea? It takes a tougher software development system to make cheap
micros easy to deal with.

As a non-user of MPLAB for the most part, I really can't say much about my
experiences with it. I've never had any trouble trying to accomplish what
I want it to do (sometimes the thing doesn't do it the way I would expect,
so I have to try different methods). Maybe I think differently. I would
LOVE to change icons so they have a word on them rather than a picture -
figuring out pictures is sure a pain sometime (that's why we have balloon
help, I guess).

...
Tony Vilches wrote:
>
> I recently posted some source code that, now that I have included an
> include file, compiles correctly under "compile single file" - there
> are warnings but no errors.
...

I'm here only out of curiosity, and with a couple of ideas that I might
try to put to work sometime in the near future. So I didn't had your
kind of problems yet. But by what I've seen the MPLAB tool is not that
complex, but might need some study.
But, it ocurred to me that you may try to do it tha way I did it myself
in my first year at the university. I leartned to program the Intel
8085, by coding it all in HEX by hand (of course I'm not refering to
programs bigger then 256 ~ 512 bytes. Its a simple process, you write
your program using the mnemonics (one at a line) and them assemble it by
writing the hex code for each instruction and counting the addreses used
by that code. After a couple of programs you start to creat the HEX
image out of your memory only. The only tool you need is a table with
the HEX codes for each instruction.

Some of you, younger ones, probably didn't even know that there was a
time when things were done this way, but I really did it (and the others
students also) around the year 1882/83, and a lot of people did it as a
way of life, hardcoding soma KB of program and data that way.

Think about it, and you probaly recon that it pays to dedicate one or
two weeks to study the modern programing/debugging tools at and :-).

>I recently posted some source code that, now that I have included an
>include file, compiles correctly under "compile single file" - there
>are warnings but no errors.

>Why is it that when I try to "build all", I get 29 errors?
>There is only 1 file in the project - and that seems to compile
>correctly on its own.

Specifics? Can't help much without them.

>I must admit that MPLAB is _the_ most user unfriendly software I have
>ever encountered.

I must admit I've just d/led it recently, thinking about using it with C &
IcePic. Let u know my experiences.

>Are there any switches / options / prayers I could use to set the
>bloody thing up so that I can actually compile a small amount of code
>_without_ spending a week on it and tearing out my hair in the
>process?

Are you producing straight hex code, or going to obj, then link? There's a
switch for that.
Are you using the dos or the windows assembler?

> Are there any switches / options / prayers I could use to set the
> bloody thing up so that I can actually compile a small amount of code
> _without_ spending a week on it and tearing out my hair in the
> process?

:-) have you read the "MPLAB tutorial" (20 pages)? It's not that
difficult...
Why don't you just forget MPLAB and try an old version of MPASM (V01.01).
It's quite simple in use.