Your views in 200 words or less

Letter by William Frazier, Puyallup
on Dec. 10, 2010 at 1:25 pm
with 95 Comments »

December 10, 2010 2:05 pm

For two years Democrats in House of Representatives were able to dictate every word placed in the legislation they wanted to pass. They totally froze out any input from Republicans.

They had more than enough votes to pass anything they wanted without the help of a single Republican. Yet whenever they were in danger of failing to pass a favored piece of legislation, they would cry that it was because the Republicans were the “Party of No”.

Now we have a situation where President Obama actually compromised with Republicans and made a deal to extend tax cuts two years for everyone (a Republican idea) and also extend unemployment benefits (a Democrat idea) for another year. Just listen to the Democrats in the House of Representatives now. It seems that any compromise at all is totally against their nature.

As part of Obama’s stimulus plan was a tax DECREASE for 98% of Americans. Do you remember that? maybe not, it was directly applied to your withholding tax. If you had a job, your weekly take home went up, but you probably didn’t notice that.
It may seem confusing to Republicans and others that prefer an orderly political party, Democrats have never been, and never will work in lock step. but we have one continuous goal: the improvement of life for the people that really do the work in this country. That there be a safety net to hold life and limb together in old age. That NO ONE starve or die from lack of resources through no fault of their own.
We are the only industrial nation in the world that goes not offer health care for all it’s citizens.
Why? Because the Republicans said No!
Just this week, they voted down token payments of $250 to senior citizens and disabled vets that were not receiving COLAs for the second year in a row.
They voted down medical assistance to 9/11 RESPONDERS, they refused to consider the Defense Funding Authorization Act.
They are, have been and always will be the Party of NO. (Except for the tax cuts for the rich)

the letter writter and roncella are blind, deaf, and dumb when it comes to the workings of Congress. In the Seante one person can block any bill from coming up for consideration and it takes sixty votes to break the hold.

“As part of Obama’s stimulus plan was a tax DECREASE for 98% of Americans.”

If you jump through the appropiate hoops then yes you are one of the 95% of Americans that received a tax decrease…. they were in the form of credits that affected only the time period not a tax rate decrease which is longer term, college tuition, mortgage interest, child care credit, etc… then yes you were affected… if not then no.

As far as withholding, watch out at the end of the year. The per paycheck amount was less but the total amount of tax required was the same.

It is an accounting trick, take less money out of your check via withholding, and hope that one of the tax credits apply to your situation.

Whatever happened to earning your way, supporting yourself and not depending on handouts from the government?! This lacsidasical attitude of city folk (urban dwellers) need to wake up and make your own way! I’m not saying you can’t get help from ‘the man’, but don’t depend on him! He’s not your sugar daddy! Tax payers aren’t your sugar daddy!

The Democrats had TWO YEARS to pass their beloved tax cut for the middle class.They waited until their pants were on fire, their back was to the wall, and the tax collector was at the door. If they were really so concerned about the middle class, what took them so long? Getting their butts kicked in the last election really didn’t help their case any. Are there any adults in charge?

The author writes about the Democrats being the party of “No” and in his sentences mentions only the House of Representatives. It is the republicans in the Senate that are the party of “NO” and they are still at it. The one “NO” in the House is simply the Democrats standing firm for what is best for everyone, including the rich.
Let’s try to be more accurate in the future William.

“For two years Democrats in House of Representatives were able to dictate every word placed in the legislation they wanted to pass. They totally froze out any input from Republicans.”

“Roncella says:
December 10, 2010 at 2:11 pm
William I couldn;t have said it better myself.”

Well, now we have two people that we know were watching FOX on the day that President Obama spent a couple of hours with the GOP leadership in Baltimore. FOX didn’t broadcast the meeting as the other networks did.

President Barack Obama met with House Republicans in Baltimore Friday, taking questions and engaging in a back and forth debate that is exceedingly rare in American politics.

Obama talked about health care and the need for a change in the tone of the debate in Washington. Frustrated Republicans accused the president of shutting them out of discussions and ignoring their policy ideas.

Isn’t it fascinating that while Obama was meeting with them they were accusing him of “shutting them out”.

hey the rich should pay their fair share, but the democrats hate the rich. Which means they hate themselves in some cases. When the rich are gone, that seems to be the goal, where will the taxes come from. I mean if you make for than 200k now you are paying almost 72% of our nations bills.

Where is the challenge? Is there no one on the right out there who can put together a coherent argument supporting the current positions the republicans are taking which will deny many Americans a reasonable chance for the American dream?
All we get is rhetoric with flaming patriotism couched as reason, when in reality it is simple, emotional nonsense they claim emanated from a superior knowledge of the Constitution.

I’m certainly happy that we can have a mature, fact-based discussion about this…..

In spite of this, some insist upon continuing to label Obama as the most liberal ever, socialist/marxist, etc. I guess, like the muslim, black nationalist christian, kenyan myth, reality has no chance of extinguishing their delusions.

BB and sumner we’ve read your bs, you seem to have all the answers. So why debate, I’ll act like the petulant little *ricks that occupy the congress until January. Have you heard them lately so no debate, just name calling, its what you guys do so well. Here’s one I will answer, “WE Won” get over it. The debates over….

Democrats are the party of cockroaches. There is no democrat alive who is not a communist. Jim McDermott is a registered member of the American Socialist Party. Patty Murray gleefully voted to take over your health care. Now, you can look forward to the service of the post office, the empathy of a concentration camp and the medical expertise of the pack of rhesus monkeys, whenever you need medical care. You can thank your communist (democrat) legislators for everything bad about your lives.
By the way, republicans are the party of weasels. It all has to go.

Uh, there are no tax cuts – just a denial of tax increases. As a matter of fact, there is currently no death tax but there will be one if this bill passes.

Every day that a person is out of work is a day that his/her skills atrophy. At some point, the person becomes unemployable regardless of job openings.

The election was a referendum on Jug Ears’ economic policies, which actually don’t exist. They are Democrat Party leadership policies created by Pelosi and Reid. That is why there was no bill to look at on healthcare, stimulus, or any of the other spending bills.

This bill will fail and the real confrontation will begin in January. The GOP will listen to the tea party because the tea party won the election for the GOP. And the tea party says – re-enact the 2008 budget.

No COLA. No earmarks slid into bills in committee. No raise of the debt ceiling. All spending bills get an up/down vote on the floor of the House.

When the Ben Bernank cannot pretend to buy any more Treasury bonds because the debt ceiling won’t let the government sell them, then we will have retaken control of the economy. Once the economy is back in the hands of the markets, everyone will see just how simple it is to end the recession and hopefully they will ask WHAT THE HECK has been going on the last two years.

There are very few responsible democrats in the U.S. Congress – the majority are socialist democrats who work primarily for the constituency that contributes little or nothing to the advancement of our society to the benefit of themselves! They feather their own nests with tax breaks, perks and pay-offs! Ask Pelosi about that island business she owns and the special tax breaks in federal legislation to enhance her wealth! Ask William Jeffords about his money growing freezer! Ask Charlie Rangel about his tax evasion and unreported rental incomes! The “ignorant electorate” even returned this maggot to office!!!

Ask Barney Frank & Chris Dodd about their sweet real estate deals and kic-backs from Fannie & Freddy! The beat goes on, but you get the point – they have been in Congress to enhance their position in life at the expense of the gullible “ignorant electorate” and for our nations sake, hopefully the ignorant electorate will educate themselves in 2012 before repeating their past mistakes!!!

Guess who is loaning us the money to spoil the rich, or the money to cut social security taxes? Can we continue to live in Disneyland and not realize that we can’t fight multiple wars, stop manufacturing actual goods, spend more on weapons than many nations combined, burn through oil reserves, buy throw-away toxic items from China without jeopardizing our entire economical system? The Republicans are happy to drive us deeper and deeper into the mud so that we are forced to privatize Social Security. And water. And power. And natural gas. That way they can continue ripping off their fellow beings. Nation be dammed! The rich did not create jobs with the tax cuts they received over the last decade. Let’s not be fooled again…
Now have a nice day shopping at wall mart. That provides funds to China so they can loan it back to us to cover tax cuts for the rich. Smells like a great pyramid scheme to me. And we know who will end up holding the bag.

Even if there were only 1 (one) repub in congress, the commie-libs would claim that 1 repub foiled their plans and he is an “army of no”. Then they would continue on by saying the lone repub is an idiot, a moron, and a liar not realizing that any person with a brain can do the math and know the truth.

xring, as long as you’re making lists, add yourself to the list of those that can’t make an argument without reliance on the ad hominem fallacy. If you want to play that game, I’ll have my five year old grand daughter beat the crap out of you.

The Slag, your beliefs are backwords. Its the dems.and a few establishment republs. who have spent our Country into tremendous debt over the years.

Especially the past two years including ObamaCare(bankrupt).

The Rich and small business folks are who create jobs and products and keep the economy rolling along, not your bloated overspending establishment dems/republs. sittiing on their hands doing nothing and getting paid plenty for it.

The younger folks should have a choice in investing part of their income into private investments and leaving a portion in Social Security, as President Bush tried unsucessfully to to make that change.

The dems. went crazy and screamed and yelled that Bush was privatising Social Security and that would ruin it. The lame stream media went along with the dems. and scared the old folks and the young folks into believing their misconceptions about what Bush was trying to do in order to save Social Security.

Roncella, Bush inherited a big surplus and turned it into an economic disaster. Those are cold hard facts that you might not be able to grasp. Nonetheless, cold hard facts. Of course you are welcome to believe that Wall Street would tenderly care for your Social Security money and not gamble on it, waste it, pilfer or embezzle it. Just like the tax cut for the rich over the last years produced plenty of jobs, right? Of course you can believe that. Now put out milk and cookies for Santa, he’ll be here soon.

The Democrats do not vote or organize in quite the same manner as the Republicans. Because of this even though they almost had a 60 vote majority in the Senate they seldom voted in a Republican lock step kind of way. So they didn’t get exactly what they wanted and had to compromise in every piece of legislation that was passed. Other legislation was filibustered or just never voted on (I suppose because Reid didn’t think he had the votes, and didn’t want the impression of being ineffectual).
It will be interesting to see what occurrs in 2011-12. See if Obama can pick up his game and pen if needed.

As far as Privatizing Social Security, I think we all could agree that had Bush got his way 6 years ago, the worth of our Social Security contributions would have dropped about as much as our houses have.
Go ahead and privatize it but regulate it so that the money managers can’t bet on risky investments. But of course that’s where socializing losses and privatizing profits come into play.
PS …Whatever happened to the notion that if its “To Big To Fail” it should be closed down or broken up?

Ok, let’s review some of the names the “right” folks are calling the people they disagree with: Libtards, commies, commie-lib, libturds, thieves, liars, ricks, (new one) cockroaches, communists, weasels, Jug ears, I could go on but you get the idea. It sure would be nice to have a forum to have a reasonable discussion so that all of us could weigh in and maybe come up with some interesting ideas and answers. Most of the above comments are are just plain depressing. Come on. Grow up.

xring, I was referring to roxy but you are correct, I did insult most 3rd graders.

olbludoc, I agree but in order to have that reasonable discussion all the righties would have to be banned, because as you pointed out, that is where the insults the negativity the hate the anger and juvenile antics are coming from.

I laughed until I snorted coffee at this preposterous letter. In the entire history of the Senate there have been a little fewer than 900 filibusters. Republicans set a record with 62 for one session of Congress during the last two years of Bush’s terms. Now we have this session of Congress where Republicans have filibustered over 160 times to block hundreds of bills from passing, many of them they they themselves introduced.

Dems the party of “No,” indeed. I don’t think they will play the same game Republicans are intent upon, the total destruction of our economy to get back at Obama for being elected, but I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a few Democratic filibusters in the next Congress when the right wing of the Republican aprty tries to push throuh an agenda that is meant to wipe out the middle class forever so the top 10% can have 90% of the wealth instead of just the 55% they have now.

” liberalism is a sickness in the reasoning ability of otherwise normal intelligent people.

I don’t agree with Tuddo’s opinions on much but I do respect Tuddo’s ability to search out a certain point of view using many times bias liberal leaning sources to back his opinions up.

Tuddo, the dems. will do everything they can to stop and delay any changes the new Conservative’s elected to the house try and implement or change. Thats just the way the game is played, its called Politics.

Roncella, we used to have government that was focused on what was good for the entire USA. Now we have the Republicans focused on the top 1-2% and blocking everything else. Tell me how that is anything but anti-American? Republicans compromise on one issue, getting some sweet deals on other measures too that further bankrupt our nation by hugely increasing the national debt so we have to borrow $900 Billiion from China.

BTW, the number of filibusters I found at the WSJ, hardly a leftist source. There are still some news outlets that print some facts along with their commentaries.

Sumner I doubt that we will never agree on World events as they affect the U.S.

If you could stand back and see whats actually happening all around the World and how it will or won’t affect this Country you would not be so left leaning in all your opinions about so many things.

If you notice the one common thread with leftests is their blaming America for all thats wrong in World Affairs, In this Country libs/encourage class warfare, and blame Conservatives for almost everything but bad weather.

There is also a pride in America missing from the left and President Obama is a good example of this. He has apoligized to so many communist/Socialist leaders for what Obama says is Americas short comings.

Roncedlla, your economic theories about the top 1-2% have always been proved wrong in this country when put to actual tests.

What I believe is that a good economy lifts all boats, and therefore, what we have had since Reagan cannot be called a good economy. Except for the 8 years of Clinton, the middle class has lost ground in terms of purchasing power and wages as related to inflation. The top 10% has exceeded growth in their wages, income and wealth far beyond any time in American history.

It is not class warfare that I am looking for, it is an economy that will help the middle class as well, and that is not the right wing approach.

The statement “Democrats are the real party of No” is an incomplete sentence. Add “…..party of No knowledge, no fiscal restraint, no economic understanding, no honesty, no religion, no patriotism – and the list becomes endless – but accurate!!!

Roncella, if that was true, since the top 2% have been adding to their profits and earning more overall during the last 10 years, shouldn’t our “engine” be in tip-top shape should you be correct??
If that was true, our economy would be doing great!!!

Xring the larger the government the greater the burden on society. Look I understand the value of the “Safety net” the government provides, but the current costs of the safety net is grossly overpriced. Our government is not efficient, I am sure we agree on this. Until we face the fact that there is too much waste in government we will have to agree to disagree. I am currently providing Christmas dinners and presents for students at my school. The safety net missed them, not enought of my tax dollars are making it back to Washington State!!!! I feel like I am sending away dollars and getting back nickels.

Who so far has voted “no” on the tax bills so far brought forward, or at least attempted to bring forward? I believe that would be our friendly Republicans. Who has voted to give a tax break to everyone? The Democrats. (EVERYONE would get a tax break on the first $250,000, even the uber wealthy) Who screamed about the deficit and how nothing should be added to it? The republicans! (Ergo the Extension or Unemployment Benefits for a year at $50+ Billion) Who wants to add at least $900 Billion (borrowed from China, Saudi Arabia) to the deficit now and argues that this is OK?

Tuddo, You said you own and operate a few small businesses. you should have a great insight into where your profits are going to stay in business.

I have worked many years for a very large Corporation in a number of different positions. I have own and operated my own businesses as well. As far as America losing its manufacturing base thats been happening for a long time. I would estimate from the early sixties at least.

Its a World Economy we are all in competion with now. To Blame Clinton, Bush, or Reagan for the middleclass lost of jobs is not fair.

The middleclass has been losing out as far as having many different types of factories to work in for many years now.

The top 2% that I keep referring to as the engine for our economy, are the folks who start and expand many small businesses which gives entry level and other skilled workers a chance to better themselves.

Middleclass workers are needed to accomplish a large payroll for very large corporations and certain skills, electrical, carpender, plumbing others.

However not too many are able to open their own businesses and hire others and still make a profit and be successful. Some do try and sometimes are successful at it.

Loz, When President Bush first push through his tax cuts very early in his first term they helped restart a slugish economy and really did help with keeping un-employment low for many years.

If we continue to tax and tax the top 2% until they bury their investments and new ventures, new products alll overseas out of the reach of the federal government what will be left to keep the American economy going ?

Consider the plight of the citizens during Japan’s “Lost Decade(s)”, almost universally derided by US economists as an example of what we don’t want to do:

5 percent unemployment, health care for all of its people, the lowest income inequality and is one of the world’s leading exporters? This country also scores high on life expectancy, low on infant mortality, at the top in literacy, and low on crime, incarceration, homicides, mental illness and drug abuse.

but then, Japan’s “poor” CEOs don’t make nearly a disproportionate a compensation as compared to their workers as we – in the enlightened US of A – have.

Sumner please answer this question for me…how are food banks operated? What about the YWCA, or how about the Tahoma Indian Center….what about Goodwill, St Vincent DePaul, or the Value Village? Yeah, they are non-profit organizations that depend on the good will of the people. Not the government.

fbergford says:
December 13, 2010 at 10:40 am
Sumner please answer this question for me…how are food banks operated? What about the YWCA, or how about the Tahoma Indian Center….what about Goodwill, St Vincent DePaul, or the Value Village? Yeah, they are non-profit organizations that depend on the good will of the people. Not the government.

WRONG. Almost all non-profits apply for, and get government grants. The Goodwill, in particular, was awarded a $500K grant for their new mentoring program last year.

Saying the Democrats are the party of no is just more upside down politics from fanatics on the fringe of the Republican Party. The Republican leadership made it clear right from the start of the Obama Presidency they would vote no on every bill that was brought before them. They did not make any secrets about it, they came right out and said so. So your entire editorial is nonsense, and I think you know it.

JudasEscargot, thank you for pointing out how uninformed people really are. I worked for Goodwill for many years as a computer instructor and we received grants from the government to help retrain injured workers and people with disabilities. Without the government I would not have been able to help so many people get back to work. Now isn’t that what conservatives want? Putting people back to work? Nah, they just want more money in their pockets. Don’t let them fool you when they talk about jobs, the deficit, smaller government, guns, religion, or any other nonsense. Their main goal is to put more money in their own greedy little hands.

judasescargot, joetheinformed… I’m going to borrow a phrase that my drill sgt used to say when we screwed something up….You my friend are as wrong as two boys kissing. Not all grants are from the government. I know because I just took a grant writing class at TESC. For you people out there that aren’t smart enough to figure out what TESC means…The Evergreen State College. The Tahoma Indian Center receieves the majority of their grant money from the Puyallup Tribe are they the government? St. Vincent DePaul recieves the majority of their money from various Catholic churches throughout Washington. You know when you go to Mass and they hand around the collection plate, well you’re suppose to donate at least 10% of your weekly earnings. Let’s see the YWCA, I don’t know a whole lot about them but if they are similar to the YMCA which means Young Mens Christian Association…where do you think they recieves the majority of their money? COme on now dude, stop huffing paint and pretending that you know everything because let’s face it, YOU ARE NOT PERFECT and you don’t know everything. If you did, I don’t think you’d be sitting in front of your computer commenting, your services would probaly be needed elsewhere.

Red, yes all levels of government are blotted, inefficient, and prone to corruptions, but I would rather see them reformed rather than replaced.

I know several teachers, and a couple of schools in my home district, that do the same thing you are doing. You all have my admiration and respect for doing something to combat a problem rather than just talk about it.

aislander, your comment about socialist regimes got me curious about the real facts. I take your definition of “socialist” to be any left-oriented government, which I disagree with, but will use it for this exercise. Brittania magazine had an article about the most dead from direct actions by 20th century regimes. I don’t know about you, but the imperial courts of the early 20th century were pretty right-wing oriented. They were looking for increased dominance of commerce, territorial expansion through wars, and were governed by conservative and right-oriented policies. Their excesses were what many of the left-wing politics were fighting. Then we have the far-rightists in Spain, Germany and Italy in mid-century. Here is the list of deaths estimated to be caused by direct action of various regimes by greatest numbers killed. The numbers do not include the numbers killed in actual revolutions, only from the aftermath by a particular regime:

On the right:
Imperial China 140 million (includes estimates from 1899-1902 peasants revolts and other actions until the revolution)
Nazi Germany 38 million
Imperial Germany 34 million
British Imperialism in China 28 million
Imperial Japan 27 million
Imperial Russia 24 million
Imperial Austria 17.5 million
Imperial Belgium 15 million
Imperial Great Britain 12 million
Franco’s Spain 8 million

Roncella says “If we continue to tax and tax the top 2% until they bury their investments and new ventures, new products all overseas out of the reach of the federal government what will be left to keep the American economy going?”

tuddo – ai accepts the nonsense promoted by Jonah Goldberg’s book which the author wrote was written as payback for his feelings being hurt by all those nasty leftists who called him a fascist. So he has included all Fascist governments in the socialist column.

See, it is easy to win an argument when you completely invert the accepted meanings of words in order to demonize the opposite side and complete relieve your side from any and all culpability.

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