POSTGAME NOTES: The three-hour journey to another demoralizing home loss

I wrote one game story tonight, but I felt like we watched three games.

The Giants were done early in the second inning. Done. Tim Lincecum couldn’t throw a strike, Zack Greinke couldn’t throw a pitch that didn’t graze the outside corner of the strike zone. Down 3-0 to Greinke with Lincecum struggling as much as he ever has, they looked done.

The Giants got this place rocking in the sixth inning. The offense temporarily came along and kept the line moving, as Bruce Bochy loves to say. Lincecum had found a fix and retired 10 straight to keep the game alive. Greinke was knocked out of the game.

The Giants’ bullpen gave up a backbreaking two-run single in the seventh inning. The Giants offense struck out six times in the final three innings.

Ballgame. 6-4, another loss — the fourth in a row.
Let’s start with that first game: Lincecum was off mechanically, way off. You could see it from the press box and he could feel it on the mound.

“Balls were flying into the right-handed batter’s box a lot,” he said. “It was a matter of being too fast to home plate, which really didn’t give my arm a chance to catch up. My arm circle was shorter which made all the difference. That’s not the way I pitch.”

Said Bochy: “He was off. He couldn’t get the ball where he wanted.”

But Lincecum weathered the storm, which took us well into the second chunk of this odyssey of a game. The lineup tied it up, with Joaquin Arias, Conor Gillaspie, Melky Cabrera and Buster Posey getting some big hits.

Lincecum turned it around, too. He watched film in the dugout and saw the problem, then pitched three perfect innings.

Said Lincecum: “I’m happy with the way I was able to come out of it.”

The new problem was he was actually out of it. As in the game.

With runners on second and third in the bottom of the fifth, Bochy pinch hit for Lincecum. But Nate Schierholtz struck out, dropping his slump to 1 for 24.

“Looking back, I wish I had left (Lincecum) in there. Believe me,” Bochy said.

All tied up and with AT&T rocking, the Giants immediately gave it back.

“You’re hoping for the bullpen to go out there and shut them down,” Bochy said. “Their bullpen did a pretty good job on us.”

It added up to the longest losing streak of the season for the Giants, who all of a sudden are two games under .500 and five games behind the Los Angeles Kemps.

“It’s just got to improve, it’s as simple as that,” Lincecum said.

— Speaking of improvement…good gracious, MLB, how ’bout some instant replay. We’ve had some bad calls this season, but the call on Angel Pagan in the sixth inning was about as bad as it gets. How do you know it was so bad? Pagan jumped up and down and did everything he could to get tossed, but Ed Rapuano wouldn’t eject him. Because he knew he seriously blew the call.

Bochy was asked if he had seen a replay.

“I don’t need to see the replay,” he said. “You hate to see that happen, but it happens. That’s a big call.”

— That ‘caught stealing’ in the ninth inning ended a streak of 10 straight successful stolen bases against Posey.

— Angel Pagan extended his hitting streak to 18 games. Best in the majors, best of his career.

— From the Giants’ crack PR staff: Lincecum has walked 103 batters since the start of 2011, most in the National League.

— Brandon Belt: Another hit to raise his average to .294 after that 1 for 10 start to the season. Another walk, too. That’s three straight games where he has reached base at least twice.

— Steve Edlefsen needed 16 pitches to get through two shutout innings. That’s how you keep yourself around.

When did Tim Lincecum turn into Russ Ortiz? Throw a freaking strike timmy

Slash78

Not looking forward to tomorrow. Bum means a lot of RHBs. Bochy will likely put some combination of Burriss, Arias and Theriot at 2B, 3B and SS. He can’t start Gillaspie and not start Belt.

I wish Kruk would shut up about Conor Gillaspie. I don’t care how pretty his swing is. He’s never hit fantastic at any level. He’s a light hitting, decent OBP, average glove 3B. He might make an decent 2B, but Culberson has better speed and more pop in his bat as well as being an established 2B.

I hope the Giants got something in Panik, because they’ve had way too many Middle-IF busts. And the Vets they bring in a either brittle (Renteria, Sanchez) or can’t hack it either offensively or defensively, usually both.

Slash78

@Bob, he looks a little more like Zito JR.

Frank Rizzo

So who goes to make room for Huff if he comes off the the DL on Monday?

Objectively it should be Huff himself with his .182 BA, but we all know that won’t happen.

DFA Theriot? He’s not hitting and has no future with the team, but he’s a vet and we know Bochy loves him some vets.

Send Crawford to Fresno? He’s only played 29 games at AAA his entire career. It might be good for him to get more AAA experience, especially now with Arias showing he is a more than capable SS.

Sending Belt or Pill to Fresno would reduce the logjam at first base and prevent another Huff appearance at 2B, but the fans would (rightly) hate it and neither of them would really benefit from more AAA experience.

Sending Arias or Gillaspie back to Fresno would be easy, but both of them have shown they deserve longer looks.

GideonTownsend

I’ve never seen a team give up so many infield singles in one week!

Sansabelt

To paraphrase what we used to say about Willie McGee when he was here: Belt is the softest .294 hitter ever.

Dink Dink Doink.

SurfCity

Now that Belt’s hitting, his haters are changing their stories on what they hate about him.

Only think Huff is good for at this point is a left handed bat off the bench (something we sorely need right now as Schierholtz’s slump is painful to watch even for one of his most devoted fans)

Atlas

Looks like the coaches are finally coaxing some success out of Belt. Whatever they’re doing, it’s good stuff, keep it up. (And give Crawford some too).

Slash78

@Surf, if he starts hitting HRs it will be either “too little, too late” or “not at the right time/not clutch enough HRs”. Or something about not helping the team win and padding his numbers. Or not enough RBIs. Even though Belt usually starts rallies because he almost never comes up with runners on. Or it will be about his strike out totals or if he continues to walk he’s “letting them pitch around him and not being aggressive enough”.

Fair Weather fans wanted a big FA signing this offseason so they could brag to their friends about it. Fielder and Pujols went elsewhere. And of the three who has the highest OPS? Any guesses? You could throw in Teixeira too. Guess who still has the higher OPS? And Adrian Gonzalez. Guess who has the higher OPS? Then there is Ryan Howard, who can’t even play. That is a ton of money in all those players.

Belt has yet to hit a HR and he’s putting up better numbers. What happens when he starts?

Livefree

Serious question … why is always instant replay and never better umpires? These guys blow a call per game, which you can only do if you arent trying. We can all see bad mechanics, and the belligerence is taken for granted. Why? Dale Scott changes his call in the middle of a play, causes a triple play and virtually throws a game …. and nothing happens. Why is a lousy 66% accuracy on close plays (asdocumented by ESPN) ? FIX THE UMPS … then worry about replay. It doesnt have to be this bad.

Wineguy

Nate, I supported you for 4 years with conviction. You are looking very much like a 4th outfielder. Your knack for clutch hitting and late inning heroics has reversed. As has all the Giants RBI-ability. Posey is as guilty if not more so than all.

Next question: Theriot or Buriss for the DFA?
Who leads off?
Bull Pen SUCKS, ready for Hembree?

Slash78

@Livefree, because MLB is unimaginitive and refuses how to use technology/replay to improve the game w/o slowing it down. Managers running out to argue slows the game down. There has to be faster ways. Even going down to review HRs is cumbersom. How about a 5th Ump in the review room/booth? He could call down and change it.

Probably getting close to time for them to go to an automated Ball-Strike caller. Then you could still have 4 umps, one in the both and three moving around to were there is likely going to be a play. It won’t take the human element out of the game because you’ll still have a human pitcher, catcher, hitter, fielders, etc. It would just take HUMAN ERROR out of the game, or reduce it.

Luke mcwarmsky

What this guy said^

JD4SF

IMO the key sentences in Alex’s article:
“Lincecum turned it around, too. He watched film in the dugout and saw the problem, then pitched three perfect innings.”

This is the sign of a seasoned MLB pitcher who can be successful. He sees the problem and fixes it.

Not everybody can do that.

Remember those kids so many were screaming should be on the 25 man roster, and all the cheering when they made it? When THEY learn to watch video and can rapidly adjust, we can consider them to have “made it” in MLB.

Meanwhile we will have ups and downs. But I actually consider the Friday loss as showing some positive signs. Other than pitching issues, we saw good D and O.

FOUR runs using smart/small ball. The TEAM got fired up. We had RISP and brought 4 home. Had pitching held it together, we had a win.

As Pac said, a bumpy road. We have puzzle pieces that all need to come together right. But Friday showed us our support for this transition team requires patience, and when ALL the puzzle pieces come together we’ll be a strong team.

Pitching needs to be more reliable. Errors need to be greatly reduced. But for the offense to work right the players themselves need to be able to figure out how to adjust against pitchers and excute at the MLB level, so I hope they aren’t just listening to their coaches but are ABLE to make those adjustments, quickly.

CalBear

As Timmie said, It HAS to get better! I am totally amazed at the high batting averages some of our G’s are hitting, with such low RBI’s. The worst has to be Posie…with Pagan in hot pursuit. Just as I thought BB9 was on his way to showing his talent to a starving fan base, he whiffs at two change-ups in a row that he should have whacked with a pitching wedge.
The LU was better accidentally. Where was any planning for base-stealing, bunting, H&R’s, or sac flies?
Timmie is right. This can’t get much worse. It HAS to get better!!

JD4SF

Some of the posters have been discussing and analyzing Belt’s swing. Before the end of ST we heard Sir Bam Bam wanted to make changes. Since then actual details have been skimpy, and speculation and rumors abound.

Baggs hosted a chat a couple of days ago, the transcript is online, and the answer he gave to a question regarding Belt I found interesting since Baggs tends to call things like he sees them. So here is more food for thought on the Belt hitting situation:

Q. Are the rumors true that the coaching staff think Belt is not following their advice, or has this been manufactured by the media and talk radio?
by Drew May 2 at 3:28 PM

A. They want him to move back in the batter’s box. They’ve tried to get him to do that since the spring. Watch him hit on TV and you be the judge.
by Andrew Baggarly CSN May 2 at 3:29 PM

Do people analyse Aubrey Huff, and the lack of “adjustments” in over 700 At Bats, in the same way they analyse a young player in less than 70?

Luke mcwarmsky

…And somewhere right now Sabes is hoping like hell.

Luke mcwarmsky

What’s going on with Timmy is he is trying to learn how to pitch with less velocity. His mechanics are screwed up because he is trying to amp up some mph without success. Unfortunately, we may be seeing the early stages of Zitofication with Timmy…He’s going to go from dominant to mere mortal from now on.

Luke mcwarmsky

If Panda comes back not weighing 350lb. I would like to see Gilepse tried out at 2nd base. I don’t care how ripped Burris’ abs are, the dude can’t hit.

TheWillies

Luke, I hope you’re wrong. Lincecum had a fine spring. I’m a little mystified as to why he is struggling.

Yup. It was a demoralizing loss. However, at the end of the day one has to admit that winning and losing are a part and parcel of the sport.

al oha

Lincecum finally figures out his mechanical flaw, rights the ship, but then get’s pinch-hit for by a “hot” hitter who was 1 for his last 23?

Bochy gets a lot of leeway rope for winning the WS by making all the right moves. Does he also shoulder the blame now that he’s making all the WRONG moves and the Team is losing very winnable games in May?

rayoflight

Tough to say which has been the more disastrous of Sabean signings: Huff or Freddy Sanchez?

No need to analyze Huff. “we’ve got an investment into him” as Sabes says.

This organization is totally and absolutely rudderless right now.

Walter Guest

Slash @ 1:11 wants automated balls and strike calling.

I was for this for years… until I watched MLB Gameday. If pitch locations there are correct, automated pitch calling would lower batting averages a lot. No research, just observation, but it seems to me that far more ‘on-the-edge’ pitches are called balls than not. More accuracy would favor the pitcher quite a bit.

Rochester

Seattle is having attendance problems, you know they’d love to have hometown boy Lincecum.

Similar to Tim, King Felix has two more years left on his contract. And he’s not breaking down. Why not approach the Mariners and see if they would be interested in some sort of exchange?

Walter Guest

You know…I wonder who made that anxiety diagnosis on Huff. After he left the team, did they look through all the MLB agreements to find something that would justify his absence and they found anxiety? Or did he bring a note from his doctor? Or maybe a note from his mother, “Aubry can’t come in today. He is feeling some anxiety.”

I don’t want to make light of the situation if there is a serious mental problem involved, but if he’s coming back this quickly then there doesn’t seem there was a serious mental problem involved, so I can make light of it.

Okay?

chuck devil

Nickle and dime SS and RF. I am NOT sold out on Blanco. Imagine Beltrán in RF along with Cabrera and Pagán. Add Reyes at SS and this team would had been in 1st. place despite Kemo’s heroics.
You know the rest: Welcome to the Family Dollar SFG’s.
Have a good day folks.

chuck devil

I missed the [P] in Kemp’s name: Kemp’s heroics>TU.

Foothills Ryan

No need to pinch hit Nate for a pitcher. The pitcher has a better chance of a hit. Man that guy is ice cold.

Romo looked unimpressive. Every slider had a bunch of hang time. The fastball is not bullpen quality. But neither is Hensleys. Time to start building the bullpen of the future.

This has transition/rebuild year written all over it.

Good job Belt. They may be singles, but you have a knack for getting on base. I suppose the doubles and HRs will come someday. Maybe by the time the Giants have successfully transitioned.

Jstreet

I am NOT sold out on some of the posters here. Add the cookie monster from down in Dallas and chucki hard cheese from Lower Slobovia and you’ve got a whole new board, folks. We need an expert.

It has the ring of truth to me. He even admits initially lying to Bochy about why he had to go home, and when he had a second panic attack in Florida, he called the trainers. I’m sure his description of the plane trip could be verified by witnesses, too. (Having just flown across country earlier this week myself, I think I’d have been a bit freaked out sitting next to him!)

The weird part is his decision-making. If I felt like I was dying or having a heart attack, I don’t think I’d pack, dress, and go to the airport. I’d call 9-1-1–or the medical professionals who travel with the team and were probably right there in the same hotel. I guess that’s one of the consequences of “panic”–not thinking logically.

The good part of Schulman’s story is that Huff and his wife appear to have reconciled, and his family is with him in SF. I was very happy to read this.

Interesting that he gave the exclusive to Schulman. It could be because Schulman “came clean” when the news first came out about Huff that he himself has been treated (and is still) for anxiety and depression.

But Huff has (had?) a good relationship with Baggs, who’s the one who broke the “Rally Thong” story–Huff even gave Baggs a Rally Thong when the company sent him boxes of them (extra large, per Baggs).

Huff may not be happy about Baggs breaking the story about his wife filing for divorce. Baggs got very defensive about it, saying it was “a matter of public record”–but it sounds like he only got half the story. Huff and his wife had reconciled before this panic incident.

So it’s not only an interesting story as to Huff himself, but a slice of the journalistic jockeying that goes on.

Lefty

Thoughts on last night’s game:

–Lincecum was dealing the last three innings, and Bochy said he regrets lifting him for a pinch-hitter in the bottom of the fifth. He could have gone 1-2 more innings, and that would have been a “quality start.” In Lincecum’s postgame presser, he takes the blame for putting the team in a hole against Greinke when they’ve been struggling to score.

–I’m not worried about the starters, including Lincecum. I’m getting pretty worried about the bullpen. Edlefsen did a great job last night, but is there anyone down there right now that you feel absolute confidence in? I won’t be surprised if Hembree’s up by June.

–I was impressed that they rallied and knocked Greinke out of the game in the sixth. In hindsight, the fifth was the killer: runners at 2nd and 3rd with one out, and Bochy pulls Lincecum for Nate. Same situation the day before, and both times, Nate looked just awful. Don’t want to dogpile on Nate, but maybe try a different pinch-hitter next time?

–I’m not thrilled with Arias at SS. He’s OK, but there were a couple of shaky plays that were key in that game-changing seventh, and I did find myself thinking “Would Crawford have made those?”

–Gillaspie is OK at third, but hurry back, Panda. Wonder if Conor gets the start today with a lefty pitching. I’m not excited about seeing either Arias or Burriss there.

–The Giants are really lucky that the Dodgers have lost 3 out of 4 this week. Things could be a lot worse. They have a chance to turn things around head-to-head next week.

Dirty Al

2 things:

I just read that since the beginning of 2011, Tim Lincecum leads the National League in free passes with 103.

Can this be true? Has he now become Jonathan Sanchez somehow?

Also, the Giants were swept by Arizona and the Marlins this year, all by one run. Had those games gone just a little bit different they would be 18-8 instead of 12-14.

Not sure what that means. A little better hitting or a little better pitching perhaps.

It’s a long season.

Lefty

One more thing on Huff: I would like to hear that a reputable psychiatrist in SF has examined him and cleared him to resume active duty. Major repeated panic attacks less than two weeks ago? Sending him out there in a huge series in Dodger Stadium sounds like potentially a big mistake to me. (Think the fans will be sympathetic there? I don’t.)

As for who goes to make room for Huff:

Belt? No. He’s contributing, and there have been votes of confidence by Bochy and Sabean in the media the last couple days.

Pill? Maybe. They still don’t need four first basemen, and he’s sure not getting much playing time. There have been key pinch-hitting situations in the last two games where Bochy used Nate, Theriot, and Hector without going to Pill. Nate is in an epic slump, and Hector is a 22-year-old rookie who’s not exactly on a roll at the plate, either. Lets you know where Pill is in Bochy’s depth chart.

Theriot? Maybe (Arias makes him expendable), but probably not. Very little veteran presence on this team right now.

Burriss? Maybe, but probably not. They still like/need his versatility, I’m sure.

Arias? Definitely not. He’s contributing more than either Theriot or Burriss. And I’m pretty sure he can’t be optioned.

Gillaspie? No. They need a real third baseman while Pablo is recovering.

So…the logical guess at this point is Pill. He and Huff both play 1B and LF, so it’s a one-for-one swap (except not exactly because Pill hits RH). And Pill has options.

If Freddy actually re-emerges in the next few weeks, either Theriot or Burriss will go. When Panda comes back, Gillaspie will go back down.

slim pickens

no one is worth 20 million a year, especially a starting pitcher who only plays 6 innings every 5 days. Rowand contract is very hurtful. It is bad karma to give big contracts to ballplayers who walk out of ballpark after the game and see a guy face down on the sidewalk or a dude living under a bridge or a single mother raising a bunch of kids. etc. etc. You build from within like any organization. not impressed with giant’s scouts and coaches. talents is weak and flaws abundant, skills lacking. I enjoy watching baseball but MLB as well as everything in our greedy culture needs to be reformed and will soon, sooner than you think.

Truth Teller

I hate to say it, but it was a blessing in disguise that Lincecum turned down the Giants huge extension. He looks to be on the same career arch as Zito with declining velocity and less and less control and confidence.

dgg

“Looking back, I wish I had left (Lincecum) in there. Believe me,” Bochy said.

=========

“What!? No!” was what I shouted in the moment. Lincecum had just pitched three 1-2-3 innings and had clearly figured out whatever it was that sunk the first inning and jammed up the second with a single and two more walks. I’m probably going to stay worried about Tim until he has two consecutive solid starts.

Hermann

I was wondering why no one has asked Bochy why Pill and Belt don’t start in the same game? Pill’s stats are about the same as Sandoval’s, although Pill has had about 1/4 the AB’S.

Why not put Pill at 3rd, and Belt at first, for at least a week.

dgg

No reputable psychiatrist or psychotherapist or psychologist would breach a patient’s confidentiality to make a public statement.

There’s HIPAA.
There’s the APA Code of Ethics.
And, there’s The Right Thing To Do.

Noce

Some observations:

If I read the history correctly Willie Mays’s was 0 for his first 24 at bats. If he played for Bochy he never would have made it. I would never compare Schierholtz with Mays but he has shown the ability to carry a team for a number of games. His history is to get hot then go ice cold. When he was given a number of at bats to work it out last year, he became a good clutch hitter. I prefer him in a large number of at bats over Blanco.

Third straight game only one extra base hit. I am reading the box score as I was at my sons game last night and did not watch the game. It seems they strung singles together to score. Gap to gap hitting, did any one pull the ball.

Say Hey

Hermann, maybe because those stats really aren’t that good and Pill would be a defensive liability at third.

Walter, please do let us know if you ever suffer from anxiety attacks or depression. I will enjoy questioning your veracity and making fun of your condition.

Why does Huff not hitting mean that Belt putting up weak stuff is somehow OK? Wake me when he hits a ball hard somewhere other than left field.

I think we’re about to find out what kind of mental makeup this clubhouse has. I’m not sanguine.

Lefty

Noce: Melky’s triple was to right-center (Triples Alley).

Lefty

dgg: I didn’t mean that a psychiatrist should make a public statement. But the Giants could insist that he see one and announce if he’s been cleared to play.

I’m really thinking ONLY of Huff. If you read Schulman’s story, it sounds like he was in a pretty bad way, and panic attacks tend to recur. It would be awful if they rushed him back into a pressure-cooker without being as sure as they can be that it won’t harm him.

Lefty

Say Hey & Hermann: Bochy pretty much ruled out Pill playing third unless it was a late-inning double switch or an emergency. Just taking grounders there doesn’t mean he should play a position he’s never played professionally–in a major league game (sound familiar?).

Funny thing is that the most experienced 3rd baseman on the roster after Sandoval is…Aubrey Huff. He hasn’t played there since 2006, though.

Say Hey: Yep, we’d all like to see Belt hitting the ball harder, but doink singles and walks are still better than strikeouts and popups, which is what his “competition” (Nate & Huff) have been doing.

dgg

Lefty: A lot of people don’t want to see Huff back in there. It’s not out of concern for his mental health or whether playing baseball would be anxiety-producing for him. It’s more because he was batting .182 and had only 1 HR when he left, and there are legitimate questions about whether he can contribute and help the team, and then there’s the problem of where’s he going to play? Belt is a better fielder at 1B and he’s making the case with his bat. Posey needs to play 1B to keep his bat in the line-up when he’s not catching. Huff would not have made those three game-saving plays in LF that Carbrera made during Tim’s last start.

The first thing I did this morning was read Schulman’s interview. Bochy said that Huff is seeing someone in San Francisco for treatment.

Sansui-Sans Haiku Corner

Team searching for soul…
Why do they play? Fame? Fortune?
Or love of the game

Noce

On Huff

I like and respected Huff for his contributions to 2010. But last year he admitted he came into the season out of shape. He broke faith with all the fans who are season ticket holders or who buy cable only to watch the Giants. It seemed to me he got his reward for past results and thought he was not expected to do more.

Huff as a person you have to feel for him. He experienced many things recently that cause a person some of the hardest stresses life can offer. I wish him all the best.

As a player he broke faith with the organization and fans. His current performance is more of same. For Huffs sake I hope the Giants keep him but lessen his roll. As for Huff the player the Giants need to sever the relationship at the end of the year. I am sure the Giants won’t resign him, but stranger things have happened.

I thought, for a team in rebuild mode, last night was pretty encouraging. Belt seems to be in mid-morph, and without the pitching collapse, the other 8 guys were definitly on the upswing.

I’d just ask Lincecum to look briefly at where his foot plant is 1-2nd inning and where it was in the 4-5th inning.

Rochester

Huff was one of my favorite players in 2010. The gratitude I feel towards him for what he did that year will never be taken away.

However, it’s now 2012, Huff isn’t being paid all this money to lay on some psychiatrist’s ‘s couch. Next time Aubrey thinks he’s having a “heart attack” he should just roll up a fatty kick back and relax.

pacman68

The problem with the Giants is once again they have to much dead weight. Now it’s young kids instead of old. Before you attack me … I think the Giants are playing the wrong young kids. Since this may be a growing year…then I say go balls out.

— Burriss is terrible so just bring up Panik. They say he isn’t ready. Bryce Harper was hitting 250 when they brought him up. Burriss is not our future and either is the Riot. Send him packing and bring up Panik.

— Kruk has to stop with the Gillaspe praise. The guy is a soft hitting third baseman with an okay glove. Bring up Culberson who has more pop. I think that the Giants should start Pill at third base as well. They are wasting him on the bench. Pill needs to get into a groove. Like all good hitters do. There refusal to play Pill anywhere else but first is killing the team. Pill and Belt need to be back to back.

— Crawford needs to go back down. As much as it hurts me to say this. He is just not ready and I don’t think he ever will be. With Pablo out … we just can’t afford another weak bat in the line up. I have no idea what to do at SS. We all saw what happened last year when Sabean brought in an old tired Vet.

As for Huff’s panic attacks. My friend suffers from severe panic anxiety and it took him 2 years to almost get back to normal. He still has episodes and is not 100%. So either they are lying about Huffs anxiety (I would not put it past this team and phantom injuries) or they think Huff has it under control after 15 days. You do not get anxiety problems under control that easy. It is a mind disease that alters your every day life.

I hope Huff comes back and contributes in big ways but in the reality of things. It’s not happening.

Fergie348

Never thought I’d say it – Lincecum is the weak link in this rotation.

What i thought was curious last night was the reaction in the dugout to Pagan’s emotion reaction to that call at 1B. I don’t know whether they looked like deer in a headlight or aliens who didn’t know how to get into a games flow. That’s a rookish ballclub, not quite sure what a pro ballplayer really is. Maybe Pagan can get the emotional energy up.

CalBear

Pacman, while Burriss/Crawford combo are agreeably not making headlines in either RBi’s or BA’s, where or who is the better D combo for 2B/SS? Or, don’t you think the G-men need a strong Defense right now?

Mo P

Pacman: I admire your ability to advocate drastic change after a month of baseball.

I often feel the same way you do. I’ve wanted Crawford, I mean Errorford to be sent down twice already.

Panik isn’t ready, and you don’t bring up a guy from A ball to play at this level unless your name is Freddy Sanchez.

Gary Brown has been struggling in AA ball, but he’s starting to turn it around. Even bringing him up would be rushing him a bit.

This team is definitely too young, and making mistakes that only young players make. But this team isn’t just playing bad, they are bad. They haven’t led for an inning in this four game losing streak. They can’t field, can’t score runs, and on the days they do score runs, their pitching staff gives up too many.

This might be the first time the giants are sellers at the deadline, and maybe they can bolster their farm system. I’m figuring Melky, Pagan, and some of the relievers are expendable.

for two years folks here, at least a few, have been talking about ‘regression’ with regard to Lincecum. Get out of the lemming line, look at the facts. He’s going to have to become a different pitcher to sustain himself. That’s not being anto Lincecum, rather it’s call for him to be a smarter pitcher like, for instance Halladay, and change his game. Since Halladay went stealth, control, he’s thrown a no hitter and a perfect game. It’s gonna be get smart with your craft, or get out of baseball for Lincecum.

CalBear

What I thought was curious was how the 1B Ump looked almost sympathetic to Bochy’s rants, but warned the other Mgr, in his face, twice, on a more ridiculous call.

3rdKing

with this pitching we should have an all time dynasty

instead we have one of the worst all time offenses for year…

sorry Giants fans, it is such a waste of once a generation pitching

3rdKing

the only ones going worse then the umpire at 1st last night, i believe it was good old ron reneke

the ump apparently ask Kelly, did I blow it. His response, Bad. He already knew Bochy was right.

3rdKing

if this team was putting up Belt’s numbers, we would be winning games…

enough on belt,,,,.300 with a close to .400 opb is MVP on this team

Lefty

dgg:

“Bochy said that Huff is seeing someone in San Francisco for treatment.”

I read that, too, but I think Huff said he’s seen the guy twice and has his number, but it didn’t sound like he was going to be in regular therapy. The Schulman piece also said he got on medication right away in Florida.

That’s all fine, but I agree with Pac: You don’t get over anxiety/panic issues in two weeks. From Schulman’s story, it sounds like it was pretty major. (This is all assuming that we’re getting the true story.)

I also agree with you that a guy who was hitting .182 BEFORE he had panic attacks is not a great candidate to come back and “pick up the team.” Someone will have to be sent down or cut to get him back on the roster, and others will have to lose playing time to get him in games.

It’s not an optimal situation for him OR the team. I hope cooler heads prevail and he’s sent to the minors for a rehab assignment. I don’t see any good coming from rushing him back.

pacman68

CalBear

I agree that the Giants need a strong defense but that’s not what Crawford is giving us right now. He needs to stop with the trick plays in practice and get back to the fundamentals. Catch and throw. He didn’t get the job for his bat so he should lose his job for that same reason.

Right now you have a huge problem with Pablo down. I’m not trying to be a hater. I’m just being realistic when I’m saying. I think we may be heading for a 4th place finish this year.

THIS IS WHAT WE ARE LOOKING AT.

BURRISS – weak hitting ok glove.
CRAWFORD – weak hitting overrated glove.
GILLASPE – Weak hitting ok glove
THE RIOT – Weak hitting mediocre glove
BELT – Gets on base and I think the home runs will come. Great glove.
ARIAS – weak hitting … ok glove.
POSEY – fine.
PILL – Good pop but no one wants him to play anywhere but first. Huge problem.
HUFF – was hitting 207 before going down with mental disorder. Coming off a year where he was the worst first baseman in all of baseball.
FREDDY – never coming back.

That is a huge problem and bad roster management if you ask me. I don’t have the answers on how to fix this problem. But it may get a lot worse around here before it gets better. I’m just saying it’s going to get rough.

Rob

Now Wait a minute right here,, Are you telling me when a starting pitcher warms up before a game no one notices he can;t throw a strike and everything is sailing 4 feet off the plate????? those corrections should be made then and there not 2 innings later in the game. I suggest someone start monitoring there warmups better and if he can’t throw strkes or his breaking balls are not breaking get someone else up that can!!!
this is beyond stupidity its in the realm of off this planet.. The Giant hitters need to spend more time with 95 mph pitcing machines and breaking ball throwing machines then 50 mph BP pitchers. They need someone to jack them up a notch or you can forget anywhere near 4th in the division. Going on 3 yrs now and the hitting is getting worse not better, Get Posey out of 4 hole he has not the power for that hitting location in the lineup. Stop with the stats say BS, its makeing baseball (a simple game) so complicated players cannot even relax and play the game…

Fire the hitting coach and get someone in there that jacks these people up and teaches them how to hit FFS…any other team in baseball would have let this numbskull go long time ago..

what sterling staff, call it like it is. Right now the facts in front of us say we have 2 ones, and 2 1/2, a 4, and a 7. That’s not great pitching, unless you have a way to get a stat from another year to count today. If he weren’t Lincecum, he’d be in AAA trying to sort his sh!t out right now. The only question left, in my mind, is when does dad show to retune the mechanism.

Bdub

Noce…you did not read history correctly. Willie Mays was 0 for 12 before hitting a home run off Warren Spahn…not 0 for 24.

Pacman…I knew it would only be a matter of time – and not very much time – before you started touting the young kids as the cure all for the Giants. When are you going to start asking for lifting the visa restriction on Villalona?

I’m not saying I LIKE this lineup. Defensively, I HATE it. MadBum better strike out a lot of guys and get fly balls to center or right. But if Bochy wants to go with his stacked-with-righties approach, I think this is it. This is every single switch-hitter or righty on the roster. That leaves five lefties on the bench (Nate, Belt, Blanco, Crawford, Gillaspie).

you always seem to think the grass next door is greener, honestly, it rarely is.

Gamertude

This is a terrible, punchless, baseball team right now. The offense is circa 2011 and the bullpen looks terrible…good thing we spent $10 million on two LHP relief pitchers alone while the $9 million closer is done for the year. Give Romo a medical exam, his stuff looks awful and he’s hanging everything.

If the Giants don’t make the playoffs AGAIN this year does the FO even discuss whether Sabean and Bochy come back or is the FO so gutless that it’s not even a thought? How long do we have to continue to watch “offenses” like this until SOMEBODY wakes up and says, wow we can’t run the worst offense in the league out there year after year after year after year after year after year.

avwh

Without a 2010 version of Freddy or Huff, and with Panda out for 4-6 weeks again, this is not an offense that scares anybody.

What happened to the Giants’ running game and being “more athletic”? I see other teams running on us with nearly complete abandon. Has Posey lost his quick release and accurate cannon, or will it come back with more playing time and health?

Sloppy D, too many walks and poor first innings from starters, shaky middle relief, and station-to-station baseball with poor RISP hitting is a full-on recipe for disaster. But that’s the 2012 Giants so far.

Lefty

Marty Lurie was just saying on KNBR that Pagan loves playing and living in the Bay Area so far and implied that the Giants should consider re-signing him after this year.

Marty was pointing out that the reinforcements in the outfield are probably not major league ready. But if you sign Pagan, say to a 2-3 year deal, do we get into a 2013-14 situation where he’s blocking Brown or Peguero or Dominguez or Kieschnick or…?

Right now, though, I’m glad Angel’s here. They can use some fire and intensity, especially with the Panda gone. Buster’s not that guy, and neither are the pitchers. Melky seems very quiet. Everyone else is too young or new to take charge.

3rdKing

channel, for a staff that goes out there everyday knowing they have to shut the other team out to have a chance, absolutely no confidence in their offense….

cain , madbum, and zeets have been killing it…

vogees been good….

if your telling me lincecum, cain, madbum, vogelsong isnt a top 5 staff in baseball then we see things way way differently..

if this staff had any confidence in their offense, theyd be twice as good…

instead they walk a fine line…

btw channel, i enjoy all your comments

Lefty

Gamertude: I do think Hembree will up sooner rather than later. If he can adjust to the bigs quickly, he could stabilize the bullpen in the 7th or 8th.

Melon head

Pagan gets some of the worst jumps on fly balls I’ve ever seen. He’s atrocious defensively in CF. I do think he’s a solid 4th OF that can hit 6,7,8 in a lineup and provide a little bit of thump at the bottom. But his sub .300 OBP doesn’t belong anywhere near the top of the lineup and he really doesn’t belong in CF either. He’s so overrated, his stats are incredibly empty and he really has been a joke defensively, at least so far.

If they resign him, I hope it doesn’t come at the expense of Gary Brown’s development. We all know how Bochy/Sabean love to block prospects with washed up vets.

I was pretty close as to personnel but less so as to the order. (Funny, Theriot hitting second wouldn’t have occurred to me.) My Dark Horse #2 (Gillaspie) came to pass. Not surprised and a bit relieved.

Burriss is practically nonexistent as a RH batter, anyway.

Leonard Bonilla

Boy oh boy, what some of you say here amazes me. Belt is improving because he is playing everyday, not because of anything the Coaches are doing. They haven’t done anything to help this kid. Belt has hit well at every level he has played at. there is no reason why he won’t hit well in the bigs. He just needs to play. Platooning him will not teach him how to hit lefties. You can’t learn to hit sitting on the bench.

Have any of you ever actually played organized base ball in earnest?

Pill needs to play as well and he needs to learn a new positon, left field is good but that would put Blanco on the bench, so waht about 3rd base?

pacman68

channelclemente

The grass isn’t greener.

— So you don’t think that playing Pill everyday at third is better then Gillaspe? If Pill can hack it. Which I think he can.

— Or do you think that Gillaspe is better the Culberson?

— Do you think Burriss is better then Panik?

Gamertude

Lefty, is that really today’s lineup? No Belt? How can a rational fan possibly support the philosophy imposed by Bochy’s lineups? Outside of Posey and Melky, the best hitter we have on the perhaps the current worst offensive team in baseball can’t find regular ABs even though he’s outhitting everyone on the team. Awesome.

pacman68

Lefty,

Why doesn’t Bochy play Pill and Belt at the same time? I’m just really confused by this. Belt was on base 3 times again last night.

I’d be the first to agree ‘they were’ and the ‘might’ be again, but now they aren’t, no matter how much I wished they were. The difference in other years and this year, the staff and bullpen are losing games. Ask yourself the synergy that might have been built on if Romo puts the fire out, and they hold that lead. With young guys, it’s the kiss of death to pop their balloon that way. I wonder from time to time if the parts are truly seperable, pitching and hitting, but with these guys, they’re not. IMO, for instance, getting an early lead has a dramatic effect on subsequent ABs to them, giving up a lead early, having them fight back, and then loose that lead and the game is tougher than say a vet team. They’re unseasoned wood, and break easily.

Panik is at least a year away. You know that, he’s a straw now, not a plank. You fellows complain about bringing guys up prematurly and then them being mistreated by mean old Bochy. Did you ever think that bringing a baby to a fist fight might not be such a good idea.

“Although Belt doesn’t have a home run and two of his doubles should’ve been caught, seeing his .292 average on the scoreboard should give him a mental boost, Bochy said.

“(Batting average) is still a big number and it’s how a lot of hitters evaluate themselves,” Bochy said. “It comes down to scoring runs and knocking in runs, but that is how a lot of hitters get their confidence.”

Atlas

It seems like just yesterday so many were singing the praises of Nate the great.

Atlas

We “finally” bring up Crawford, Belt, Sanchez, Blanco, and some minor league arms… then we struggle… and the solution is to bring more rookies up…

it does amaze one, doesn’t it. It’s got to be a lot easier to call for fresh cannon fodder than admit your POV is basically FOS.

Rusty

Bochy is a slave to his match-ups. Nothing new here, move along.

Melon head

Bochy writes some of the worst lineups I have ever seen in my entire lifetime. Is it that hard to play Belt and Pill at the same time? What kind of message does it send to Belt (who is a career .350 hitter vs LHP) when he reaches base twice in three straight starts and gets benched?

Bochy has lost this team. Another wasted year for the San Francisco Giants is on the horizon.

Looking at team stats, the Giants offense is in the top tertial and top quartile in most offensive stats, except wins. Yet they are nearly last in SO, and BB, and near the bottom in SFs and SB%. They waste way too many ABs, rookies.

you do know how silly a comment that is after 51 ABs in the ML against LHP, don’t you. That’s 17 hits, 5 fewer and he’s at the Mendoza line. If you just take away his dinkers, and hits that were really friendly official scorers, well you see where I’m going. Your misrepresentation of reality, is a little tacky.

Melon head

channel,

You can make all the excuses you want for Bochy and distort reality all you’d like, the bottom line is Belt is hitting .350 vs lefties in his career and posting a .900 + OPS… he’s given the organization no reason to bench him vs left handed pitching.

I’ll never understand fans that blindly accept and follow whatever the manager throws out there, but you’re entitled to your own opinion. I’ll stick with the facts.

Noce

Brig:
Thanks, I grew up with the 0 for 12, but a recent broadcast on Comcast said 0 for 24. Believe half of what you read and none of what you hear.

I’m not blind, and data speaks louder than snark. What’s the % of pitcher in MLB that are RH, about 75%. His whole career, at least in AAA he struggled against LHP. He still will, if he’s not matched up correctly. This at it’s heart is not an argument about Huff or your self gratification in banging Bochy (man that’s a gag a maggot image), it’s about getting Belt into the LU as a cornerstone. Huff may or may not be a component of decisions about Belt’s play. I like the approach Bochy’s using, you don’t, IMO your FOS.

Melon head

channel,

Did you enjoy watching the Giants finish 29th out of 30 teams in runs scored three of the past five seasons?

Did you enjoy watching them hit .173 with RISP and two outs last year?

Or how about them finishing with the fewest runs scored in the history of MLB (including the dead ball era) for a defending WS champion last year?

yes? Just like I enjoyed not having Pablo, Buster, and Carlos around. If you can’t a serious question, being Socratic is Moronic.

Melon head

Keep making excuses, that’s all they are, EXCUSES. You think the St. Louis Cardinals cried themselves to sleep after losing Wainwright in Spring Training last year? Nope, they rallied and won a World Series title. Now that’s how you pick up your purse and get on with business.

I could care less about your personal attacks on me. All they tell me is that you have no argument and you are rattled. You know the numbers just as well as I do. You can bury your head in the sand and pretend the Giants are heading in the right direction. But that’s not for me, I’m an active fan. I’m going to passively just accept the garbage they are trotting out there every single day.

Melon head

I’m not**** going to passively…

Melon head

WW could be replaced LOL? Wow that’s news to me and millions of Cardinals fans around the world.

Keep making excuses, it’s entertaining.

CalBear

I was, and still try very hard to be, pro-Bochy. He amazed us all with his Three-card-Monty scrambled eggs LU’s in 2010.
But now, his severe dedication to L/R has gone way past changing pitchers or batters on deck, which to me is a big mistake all MGR’s seem to make. Pulling winning pitchers with like 2 hits over 7 innings unnerves me, and always will. But these LU’s, dedicated to the idea that MAYBE the odds will help this ridiculously anemic offense is, well, for lack of a better word, stupid.
As mentioned by many here, and in the previous link, BB9 is on a roll. So, bench him, for the sake of statistical odds? Gimme a break, Bruce!
At which point now, will Bochy ever stay with any particular LU, or fielders positions?
Other than the pitcher batting 9th, Pagan leading off, (which IMHO is a big mistake), and Posey batting clean up,(… equally bad), the rest of the LU is a roulette wheel that never stops spinning. Maybe Sabean, or anyone else in the FO, will get dizzy and finally say, skipper, how the f are you gonna win this regatta if you send a new crew on deck at every buoy, and tack on each leg?
At this point, I don’t really care who he puts out there. I am tired of reading and blogging here about a better LU….That is exactly what he does every night….’cept he things all RH or all LH is some sort of magic card in the shuffle.

——————-

Taking Pagan out from one or two errors, and some hesitations on fly balls is a bad idea. While Defense is a problem, run scoring is a much bigger one. Pagan’s position on the field is not a glaring nemesis, his position in the LU is. Same with Posey.
Pill is not hot, but could be. I would play him at 3rd, or 2nd, if Gillaspie gets hot, which he wont. There is another out of place LU. The guy has a high OBP, so put him in front of a slugger.

—————–

What is really absent, and almost bugging me as much as Bochy’s LU Lotto, is the lack of small ball running and batting. Is this team hitting homers? Hell no. But is the BA decent? Hell, yes. Therefore, the need for bunts, steals, Hit & Runs, Sacrifices, Squeeze plays, etc etc, is not just necessary; at this point, it is mandatory! Remarkably, that concept has somehow eluded ALL the G’s coaches and FO’s who have any influence. But, worse of all, is the skipper’s ignorance of planning a fast-break designed LU, and staying with it.
C’mon, Bruce!!! Start Blanco, fercryinoutloud!! You like Hot ba Pagan so much, then place him BEHIND a base-stealer, not in front of everyone else!
I would also seriously consider moving Posey, who still has a good BA, into the 3rd slot, where he should have been when Panda was playing, and now that he seems much more comfortable and productive, put BB9 at clean up, where he is very familiar from AAA.
———–

Pac, my attitude toward Crawdad is completely biased because I live in Pleasanton, so your thoughts on D are considered. As for Burriss, I am likewise infected from the great plays that combo made while I watched, then viewed again on MBL highlights. And, at this point, neither seems replaceable due to hitting alone.

——————-

Timmy is a helluva competitor, and should have been left in the game last night. I think he is back. The starters have all hit bumps in the road, but have rarely had a lead in the 2nd or 3rd innings. Then too, those innings have been pretty disastrous for runs and hits given up by our elite 5 as well.
The ‘Pen is another, bigger worry. I had more faith and hope in Roma than I now do, and, my next fav is/was….Javier. Truth be told, was never a big fan of Cassilla, certainly not as a closer, and was very pleased and surprised by his first three appearances. Now, however, I am frightfully believing in my original evaluation of his lack of consistency…particularly in his new role.

—————–

So, now what? I just spread an overtly over-worded tale of gloom and doom on the rest of you readers. Then, why, you ask, do I still have faith in the Black and Orange to pull out of this nosedive and head for the top of the Pennant race, beginning with a sweep of D’em Bums???? Where does my fortitude come from? What, you forgot?? I am a Cal Bear.

Onthesidestage

What about trying posey at 2B? He did start out as a SS and is athletic enough to handle the position. He’s smart and that would cure the 2B cancer and throw Sanchez in the line up everyday. Plus we wouldn’t have to worry about sitting belt. Just a thought I had in the offseason that nobody seemed to get. Maybe I’m missing something, I don’t know…..

ClutchUp

Hilarious. Melon Head. By your choice of board name you already don’t like Bruce Bochy. You’ve EVEN posted here before using another handle.

ChannelClemente Rattled: Hardly. He’s been here WAY before you and his points of view are cogent with an occassional wink wink.

Melon Head: Lets hope you never procreate what Richard Pryor use to refer to as a “Water-Head” Baby. If so, If then you’ll remember that you were unable to write a non-agressive logical piece about the Giants’ Baseball scuffles without personalizing who their manager is.

Here’s a suggestion: Have an actual point as to what you think is going to happen vs. what YOU want to happen because what us here WANT, including anything I say = is not going to happen. You are not the only one…. A change in skippers never guarantees anything going forward. It just adds to the mentality of knee-jerk fans everyone, again… IMO.

😉

Melon head

I’ll stick to facts. You guys revel in your own opinions.

Atlas

Quick sidenote: I’m raising funds for the Jr. Giants this year. I found out it actually doesn’t take much to put an entire team of kids on the field for a whole season. If you’re so inclined, check it out: http://bit.ly/Ix5vuR