By the way this was posted before we even played the Bengals. Almost directly after we lost to the Giants who murdered the 49ers today. Yes the 9ers were at home. Confident about our team we can play with anyone._________________

Could and should win 7 but not going to happen when things just aren't right. Unless Shurmur all of the sudden turns into a good coach atleast three of those won't be wins.

...or unless Haslem comes to his senses and fires him. The waterboy would make a better head coach.

First, how can he come to his senses when he doesn't officially even own the team yet and hasn't made a single personnel decision?

Second, what team has ever had success after firing a coach?

If we were getting blown out and embarrassed in these games, I could see firing him, but we're not. The games have been close, and it's come down to execution on two or three plays that's made the difference between a W and a L. Even Paul Brown would have trouble getting rookies to execute well enough to win.

Shurmur is by no means without issues, but he is also not without merit as well. Firing him mid-season would be pointless.

Could and should win 7 but not going to happen when things just aren't right. Unless Shurmur all of the sudden turns into a good coach atleast three of those won't be wins.

...or unless Haslem comes to his senses and fires him. The waterboy would make a better head coach.

First, how can he come to his senses when he doesn't officially even own the team yet and hasn't made a single personnel decision?

Second, what team has ever had success after firing a coach?

If we were getting blown out and embarrassed in these games, I could see firing him, but we're not. The games have been close, and it's come down to execution on two or three plays that's made the difference between a W and a L. Even Paul Brown would have trouble getting rookies to execute well enough to win.

Shurmur is by no means without issues, but he is also not without merit as well. Firing him mid-season would be pointless.

Could and should win 7 but not going to happen when things just aren't right. Unless Shurmur all of the sudden turns into a good coach atleast three of those won't be wins.

...or unless Haslem comes to his senses and fires him. The waterboy would make a better head coach.

First, how can he come to his senses when he doesn't officially even own the team yet and hasn't made a single personnel decision?

Second, what team has ever had success after firing a coach?

If we were getting blown out and embarrassed in these games, I could see firing him, but we're not. The games have been close, and it's come down to execution on two or three plays that's made the difference between a W and a L. Even Paul Brown would have trouble getting rookies to execute well enough to win.

Shurmur is by no means without issues, but he is also not without merit as well. Firing him mid-season would be pointless.

Could and should win 7 but not going to happen when things just aren't right. Unless Shurmur all of the sudden turns into a good coach atleast three of those won't be wins.

...or unless Haslem comes to his senses and fires him. The waterboy would make a better head coach.

First, how can he come to his senses when he doesn't officially even own the team yet and hasn't made a single personnel decision?

Second, what team has ever had success after firing a coach?

If we were getting blown out and embarrassed in these games, I could see firing him, but we're not. The games have been close, and it's come down to execution on two or three plays that's made the difference between a W and a L. Even Paul Brown would have trouble getting rookies to execute well enough to win.

Shurmur is by no means without issues, but he is also not without merit as well. Firing him mid-season would be pointless.

Don't bother. He made two pointless uneducated posts in a 3 min span.

Some just make it clear they know nothing about football.

This is true.

And good post, ditch. That's what I've been saying all along about Shurmur._________________Cleveland Browns Forum Hall of Fame Inductee

I do understand the negative posts though. No one likes to be disappointed and some are just keeping their realistic views to themselves in hopes of avoiding another let-down.

This team will almost certainly not make the playoffs, but the Browns are too talented to lose 10 more games this season, or even 5 more. We may lose a lot more, but it will most definitely not be for the reasons we lost the past few years. The Browns are not an easy team to beat; they are not devoid of talent at most positions. The Browns are a team on the rise, and that much is certain.

There are never any real guarantees in the outcome of football games, but real honest expectations say that this team has a decent chance against every opponent on the schedule. This is also affirmed by the past 6 games.

Most sports writers, who are not really football experts, need to gain and maintain interests in their columns, so they spout a great deal of misinformation to either appease public opinion (which is often wrong) or use controversy to get attention. There are seldom apologies for bad predictions or analysis. Let's form our own opinions instead of rehashing their nonsense. After all, when you really think about it, their job is not to be right, it is to be engaging, either positively of negatively.

Shurmur is not yet ready for comparisons to great coaches by a longshot, but he is not losing games either, the whole team's inexperience is.

When we talk about the present and future of the team, let's try to be honest and not just throw the word "realistic" around to attempt to justify an extremely negative opinion. If you want a different head coach, fine, but be realistic about what that means.

I know it's hard for some to really be honest about this team, but geez guys, try harder._________________

7. This season, Josh Gordon has touchdown catches of 71, 60 and 20 yards. Why the Bengals didn't notice Gordon was lined up in the slot and covered by a linebacker -- as in the 60-yarder against New York -- well, they didn't. Gordon bolted downfield and Weeden hit him with a strong pass into a whipping wind good for the 71-yard score. Gordon has three TD catches. Joshua Cribbs and Evan Moore led the Browns with four in 2011.

8. Cribbs was a monster on special teams with a 60-yard punt return, a 44-yard kickoff return and two tackles on special teams. He also carried the ball once for eight yards. Several players mentioned how Cribbs' returns and general energy sparked the team.

9. Rookie Josh Cooper has showed good hands and potential as a slot receiver with two receptions in his first game. He played with Weeden at Oklahoma State, and let's hope the Browns have Cooper on the field for more snaps.

10. Consider these numbers: 60 percent completions, seven TD passes, six interceptions and 280 yards per game. That's what Weeden has done in the last four games. His overall stats are skewed by his nightmare opener: zero touchdowns, four interceptions, 34 percent passing.

11. Weeden did have three passes batted down, one tipped interception. He has to watch that. Entering the day, he had only five in the first five games.

12. I love how TE Jordan Cameron fell early in his pass pattern, got up and then caught a 23-yard pass from a patient Weeden. That was on a third-and-1 in the fourth quarter. Neither Cameron or Weeden gave up on the play.

13. In the 41-24 loss to the New York Giants last week, the Browns gave up 24 points and 143 yards rushing after D'Qwell Jackson left with a concussion. The defensive captain and middle linebacker was back, and the Browns held the Bengals to 76 yards rushing. Jackson not only does an excellent job defending the run, he keeps the young defense organized.

Shurmur is not yet ready for comparisons to great coaches by a longshot, but he is not losing games either, the whole team's inexperience is.

I've never read a greater truth on this forum.

All of this is very true, no doubt, but we're gonna have to keep winning games if Shurmur wants to keep coaching.

I'm not in favor of firing him just to fire him, but I'm not going to pass up the opportunity to get a SB winning coach (Gruden) IF the opportunity presents itself just because our buddy Pat and the boys beat the Bengals to push us to 1-5 and snaps a 12 game division losing streak and 11 game overall losing streak.

The good news is we have another 10 games before we need to make any sort of decision. I'm hoping we string some wins together and the "need" to fire Shurmur simply goes away.

FWIW, I though Shurmur called a pretty solid game against the Bengals. No real complaints, but I wish he'd learn to substitute for Richardson occasionally and use other backs to carry the ball a bit. It's feast or famine it seems. Why not rotate series of downs or something, 3 on: 1 off for Richardson?

FWIW, I though Shurmur called a pretty solid game against the Bengals. No real complaints, but I wish he'd learn to substitute for Richardson occasionally and use other backs to carry the ball a bit. It's feast or famine it seems. Why not rotate series of downs or something, 3 on: 1 off for Richardson?

Just a thought and picking nits of course.

They seem to be content with just pulling him in 3rd down situations regardless of distance which I'm not a huge fan of but at least it gives him some rest. With Hardesty looking really good I would not be surprised though to see him steal some carries next week, especially if TRich isn't back to 100%._________________