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Grams Camping

For the past week or so, most of the prime time is spent either sitting at grams/lug back door, or running around the delving wondering if the opposite side are going to take the buffs. Until a creep leader comes on, or it seems like the freep raid just broke apart, both freeps and creeps would rather sit at grams than get a decent fight. I don't mind getting rolled. But it seems that people are so scared to die that they would rather sit and look at the same scenery for a few hours than push and fight. Do we want to ask the devs to just delete the entire map? And just keep the dof and lug - grams area? Since it seems that is all we use...

It would be nice if Turbine actually did something to make the Moors .. well.. more. The only way to really stop the camp anywhere is to not camp and not get camped.

If the opposing side keeps running down to allow the camp, then they need to change. If the side camping is there for a long time, they should just leave. This needs to be stated - both sides have been in both situations. Both have camped and have been camped.

Have fun - even the bitter peeps (you know who you are).

HB

[charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/062050000001615c2/01003/signature.png]Hestonbear[/charsig]
Submission? Well that's a bit of a problem. See, rumor has it the Athenians have already turned you down, and if those philosophers and, uh, boy-lovers have found that kind of nerve, then, of course, Spartans have their reputation to consider.

I came back recently to the game since almost 1 year break, and I must say that the game looks worst than ever!

Not only turbine totally killed my playstyle and one of the things that I liked that was getting KB, they also force people to raid up because the gains vs risk. There is no point going solo or small group anymore because you can be "safe" on a raid mashing 2 buttons and rank in 1 week, and nobody solo anyway.

When I log, I usually roam solo till I get tired of getting zerged like 10 times and then somebody invite me or some of the TMR log in.

When I left, the creeps where in a good position and I remember that all the "high ranked" freeps switched to creepside to play spiders and defilers and camp GV for hours.

Now creeps are outnumbered most of the time again, and all the "high ranked" freeps are playing Lore masters, Minstrels, Rune Keepers, Wardens, etc and camping grams for hours.

What it causes imbalance and camping situations are this kind of Fotm people that only care about points and you all know it but dont do anything to stop it.

Yesterday was the 10 time that I give it a try to the game and log in just to talk with some old friends and try to have some fun, but it is getting harder for me to log, everytime I try it is just to see the same thing every time:

-In the mornings you have the Korean kin camping lug rez or grams, all Fotm classes vs greenies in the most part.

-In the afternoon is the same but is mostly Latinos and some others random freeps.

-In the prime time you have the regular freeps + the other 2 groups so that leads to creeps to have the outnumbered buff the most part of the night.

I dont know what turbine did, but now it looks like if every freep are wardens or something, when you have more than 2 persons attacking you, in any normal pvp game you die.. here on Lotro even if 6 people are atacking somebody the freep just jump up and down, healing him self or using bubbles and "store bubbles" now too..

@Bleedtodeath: you say people is scared to die.. the truth is that people may be tired to die. Wich kind of fun can you get when as soon as you try to roam the map and do something else you got destroyed by 2 or 3 raids, or wich kind of motivation can you get when you try to kill 1 person and he just heal himself and run to a safe place?

The game is way to broken, and the people that play it is even more broken if they think that the game is balanced and is the fault of 1 side only.

Truth is that creeps cant match freep power and freeps keep coming with more numbers every time. If you "high ranked" freeps can't see this and start blaming one side for not be stupid and push and die over and over to give you points, you can keep living the dream and keep making "gratz threads" like if they mean something..

If we eliminated all the flippers what would we have? When TMR decides to log in and get serious the Feeps lose most times. Catch 22, creeps can't do much unless they have 10 or 12 against 5 or 6, they get 30 cause thank god someone comes on to lead them, and I get that 100% and then the freeps get rolled around and raid up and it's away to Grams we go. Easiest thing for Turbine to do right now would be to eliminate battlefield promotions, that would at least help and not create much of a ripple. There are still some of us who roam the map solo and it's boooooooooooooooring as hell. Forget being zerged, try to find someone.

Most of the people who actually like to pvp Elda and know what it is would take U10 back in a second.

Count me as one who isn't afraid of dying but is tired of it. I hate raiding (and it makes me lag like no one's business) but when I solo, the few 1 on 1s I get (with a couple notable exceptions) are with OP classes burning every single cooldown and pretending it's skill why they won.

I would love to play my mini or champ again but they're so OP it's no fun. I can almost beat most wargs with only HoTs. Balance is the worst it's ever been when with a few tweaks with u10 (getting rid of lootbox brand, nerfing defiler flies) it could have been perfect. Minis and wardens were on par with weavers and reavers, now semi-good RKs, minis, wardens and LMs willing to burn all their cds (most of them) and self-heal cannot be beat. Yet you still see people trying to claim the balance is fine who only play one side. It's like the creeps who GV camped during U10 with lootbox brands and freeps all with ###### gear claiming it was fair.

@Bleedtodeath: you say people is scared to die.. the truth is that people may be tired to die. Wich kind of fun can you get when as soon as you try to roam the map and do something else you got destroyed by 2 or 3 raids, or wich kind of motivation can you get when you try to kill 1 person and he just heal himself and run to a safe place?

Exactly this.

If you don't like Grams camping, don't camp there. Simple. No one wants to push out just to be zerged over and over.

I haven't been back long, but it's obvious that solo play is effectively dead in this game; and that is really disheartening.

I came back recently to the game since almost 1 year break, and I must say that the game looks worst than ever!

Not only turbine totally killed my playstyle and one of the things that I liked that was getting KB, they also force people to raid up because the gains vs risk. There is no point going solo or small group anymore because you can be "safe" on a raid mashing 2 buttons and rank in 1 week, and nobody solo anyway.

When I log, I usually roam solo till I get tired of getting zerged like 10 times and then somebody invite me or some of the TMR log in.

When I left, the creeps where in a good position and I remember that all the "high ranked" freeps switched to creepside to play spiders and defilers and camp GV for hours.

Now creeps are outnumbered most of the time again, and all the "high ranked" freeps are playing Lore masters, Minstrels, Rune Keepers, Wardens, etc and camping grams for hours.

What it causes imbalance and camping situations are this kind of Fotm people that only care about points and you all know it but dont do anything to stop it.

Yesterday was the 10 time that I give it a try to the game and log in just to talk with some old friends and try to have some fun, but it is getting harder for me to log, everytime I try it is just to see the same thing every time:

-In the mornings you have the Korean kin camping lug rez or grams, all Fotm classes vs greenies in the most part.

-In the afternoon is the same but is mostly Latinos and some others random freeps.

-In the prime time you have the regular freeps + the other 2 groups so that leads to creeps to have the outnumbered buff the most part of the night.

I dont know what turbine did, but now it looks like if every freep are wardens or something, when you have more than 2 persons attacking you, in any normal pvp game you die.. here on Lotro even if 6 people are atacking somebody the freep just jump up and down, healing him self or using bubbles and "store bubbles" now too..

@Bleedtodeath: you say people is scared to die.. the truth is that people may be tired to die. Wich kind of fun can you get when as soon as you try to roam the map and do something else you got destroyed by 2 or 3 raids, or wich kind of motivation can you get when you try to kill 1 person and he just heal himself and run to a safe place?

The game is way to broken, and the people that play it is even more broken if they think that the game is balanced and is the fault of 1 side only.

Truth is that creeps cant match freep power and freeps keep coming with more numbers every time. If you "high ranked" freeps can't see this and start blaming one side for not be stupid and push and die over and over to give you points, you can keep living the dream and keep making "gratz threads" like if they mean something..

Best post ever, 100% agree.

To top off that last fight Elda, our own one-shotters were killing us because of that silly freep-bubble-bug(If freep has cappy bubble and you attack it, you heal it and cause own npcs to hate on you.;P)

[color=green]"Freeps raid to get their skills and gear, then come out and complain about creeps raiding to get their skills...hypocrite much?"[/color]

I don't know why is so hard to both sides agree to fight a fair fight.. In other game I played people used vent to agree a fight with equal numbers, it was so fun and everybody enjoyed it.
Aparently not many people are interested in a fair fight, they just want points to rank. Turbine should eliminate them or change them(rage Rubble and Daarlin).

I did not make this thread to complain about people soaking up points, but more about how little both sides do to get away from lug/lug hill/ and grams area. You cannot have a fight without both sides being there, so this is not pointing a finger out at either side.

1) alot of high ranked on both sides that are very bad players,speed ranking,renown buffs,farming...

2)Only 2 group get a decent fight on creep side 1.TMR 2.WEAREBORING(Rhunen Rendir)

3)You have new tribe Blood Wargs they are good people(most of them) alot of them are greenies and they are new to PVP,they most of time PVE even if they have around 10.

I played LM since cap was 65,i can say this LM can't win 2v1 against good players,BUT alot of people are scared to die and bail and leave other to die,plus alot of ppl are making RK's and LM's theese days,so we dont have any guards,and very small amount of champs that activly play.

If you camped on grams,i would split group and map out and try to gank ppl at GV or small groups i am taking the NOT prime time,usualy there is Corean group that is on this point best group on creepside,or even send tell to freep leader to re size the group,but again solo rules, even with x10 deaths.

I hate raiding (and it makes me lag like no one's business) but when I solo, the few 1 on 1s I get (with a couple notable exceptions) are with OP classes burning every single cooldown and pretending it's skill why they won.

it's always been like that and always will be. RoR updates haven't changed the way poor players play poorly. But so far as balance goes the gap between bad and good players seems such that actually competent freeps are stronger than they were in book 6 moria which was atrocious at the time.

There may come a time for valor without renown, for those without swords may surely still die upon them.

Forget the whole "ask in OOC to join raid as soon as log on" crowd. All the numbers gathered is the sole purpose of hatred and disliking someone.
Someone get their feelings hurt so they need to turn the map blue/red.
Someone doesn't like someone else talking smack so they get 40 people and set up bonfires at Grams/GV.
Someone doesn't like being corpse jumped so they need to get half a dozen more healing RK's.

Fair fights are gone and done with. It is all about domination now.
Dominating the lamers,
dominating the pvers,
dominating the (Insert kin/tribe here),
dominating this guy who says means things about my real life.
I too remember when people actually coordinated in vents or at least vaguely hinted at putting themselves in compromising situations in hopes for some sort of gimped action.

I did it last night......if you notice the map is all blue, yet freeps are still being steamrolled off of Grams hill....gimp yourself some.....take your group and run through a keep, get some npc's on you, zerg EC even when nobody is there just to up the risk factor. Sometimes this can backfire.....freeps know all about being wiped in DG unless they have a raid and a half of people that is.....but who cares....if people haven't figured out that dying means nothing anymore....in the Age of Pay to winning, everybody having bubbles and full heals, and Infamy/renown buffs....who cares...just get back into the action as soon as possible.

I too have been gone for a couple months on a forced vacation under the sea, I don't know why I would think anything would have changed....you are never going to curb someone's play style, whether that is a domination playstyle, a fair fight playstyle or whether your fun is just to gank, zerg, and smash every enemy you see in sight..... I was hoping some other raid leaders would have stepped up...but I guess not, so I'm just going to play.

The only good thing they have done, which pains me to say, was to get rid of dailystats....yes it was fun to see your points gained in a day and rub it in people faces that you're the best with 20k infamy/renown in a day because you have no life and tons of cash to blow on buffs...that was all fine and dandy...it was part of my morning ritual also to log on and see which were the top ten on both sides and such and a nice easy reference to see who was close to ranking and such....yadda yadda yadda. Now I find myself not really caring at all for points......other night.....we left the whole map blue while freeps were getting steamrolled....who cares now.....they were losing, turbine was having login issues, who cares if they were getting 5 times as much per kill on our greenies......I don't know whos farming 15k renown off me anymore...so forget about it.

So to sum this all up. Nothing will change. Not with everybody taking everything someone says and does too personal.

It's not that we are scared to die...Its that turbine has made Freepside so overpowered and creeps underpowered. And those that say "creeps arent underpowered" come creepside when there is a grams camp and get into one of our raids. Get blown up 18 times while trying to push the raid and then say we arent underpowered. I dare you. ive heard these excuses lately that make me wanna slap alot of you..

-Creep healing is way superior to freeps <Liars. If your freep Healers actually tried to heal they could out heal us tons.

-Creeps hug NPCS because they cant fight us. <Lies again i was in a creep raid last night that zerged threw npcs to fight freeps because freeps kept running to the back door of lug.

-Creep dps is overpowered. If i can be crit for 14k from an RK and no one on our side can hit that high. I highly doubt our dps is overpowered my friend.

-Creep CC is overpowered. < Warleaders/defilers get hit with more CC than anyone on creepside Atleast freepside can Immune stun half their groups, Creeps were shafted when they handed out this skill.

-Well creeps camped GV back when i was playing <Un true. creeps camp GV when updates come out and when you started playing is when creeps were so bored of Doing quests that we started sitting at GV. And you and the other wimps that came out to fight us were under leveled or undergeared that you got your butt beat until the Majority of the freeps came out.

-Creeps have maps they can map around. <Greenie creeps cant you make the map blue and then stop us from taking them will keep green creeps from getting maps. You are one of the reasons the server is starting to Die. Ignore this warning but it will be only high ranked creeps left...Then what will you fight in the ettenmoors when the high ranks quit because they dont have the Noob support they need? Will you farm rank off yourselfs because you cant kill anything? Will you pve the auto-flipping keeps for 100 infamy a day? will you sit at grams and camp the r0 creeps who cant leave grams at all?

Alot of you freeps dont realize and understand you all are taking part in killing our server. bringing 30-48 freeps into the ettenmoors. (ask around that isnt maggotmath) This is what is killing our server its not the creeps sitting at Grams. Its we cant move around because freeps just around the map and zerg anything that turns red. Even the outposts. Yes creeps take outposts big deal but freeps do the same ####.

Just think about the things I listed.This is the worst I have seen our server. You think i'm joking but shakda, Comenunca ,Chrispbacon,ect. Have left because our server is less fun.

When I lead (and we end up fighting in a location for too long) I always advise the group to move. Moving is important in order to keep the fight fresh, when you sit for too long everyone in OOC from the other side joins the fight, and I mean everyone, every fightm big or small gets called out now. Moving is huge.

Most nights there are multiple groups on from both sides, I have learned to keep the group moving so you only ever fight one group at a time, otherwise you get overwhelmed. Grams camps are the same way (same with the Koreans camping lug rez in the mornings), sooner or later you'll be dealing with ALL of the opposing players.

Map out, move around,, even when grams gets camped keeps autoflip to creepside, the map is a big place.

u10 is when the world changed to zerg or be zerged, before that there was still a little honor out there, now it's tough. I solo a lot and it used to be if a craid found me alone it was a 50/50 shot that they would ignore me and keep going, now, I just stand there and eat it.

I would love to see a new stat... ratio of npc's killed in order to kill one opposing player. I think it would open some eyes.

My philosophy now: If you're not having fun, log, if you are, play on...

Why would creeps leave oneshots to get slaughtered? If you're bored from sitting at gv, disband your freep zerg and roam. I don't know why that would be so difficult. It amuses me that some of the people crying about the lack of solo play on the forums are the ones who I rarely see attempting it in game.
Solo play is dead since they've added the idiotic outpost mechanics. Killing certain freep classes is hard enough without doing 22% less base damage because freeps decided to flip every outpost (yes that is the approximate difference in outgoing dmg between 0-2 outposts creepside depending on build).

i came back recently to the game since almost 1 year break, and i must say that the game looks worst than ever!

Not only turbine totally killed my playstyle and one of the things that i liked that was getting kb, they also force people to raid up because the gains vs risk. There is no point going solo or small group anymore because you can be "safe" on a raid mashing 2 buttons and rank in 1 week, and nobody solo anyway.

When i log, i usually roam solo till i get tired of getting zerged like 10 times and then somebody invite me or some of the tmr log in.

When i left, the creeps where in a good position and i remember that all the "high ranked" freeps switched to creepside to play spiders and defilers and camp gv for hours.

Now creeps are outnumbered most of the time again, and all the "high ranked" freeps are playing lore masters, minstrels, rune keepers, wardens, etc and camping grams for hours.

What it causes imbalance and camping situations are this kind of fotm people that only care about points and you all know it but dont do anything to stop it.

Yesterday was the 10 time that i give it a try to the game and log in just to talk with some old friends and try to have some fun, but it is getting harder for me to log, everytime i try it is just to see the same thing every time:

-in the mornings you have the korean kin camping lug rez or grams, all fotm classes vs greenies in the most part.

-in the afternoon is the same but is mostly latinos and some others random freeps.

-in the prime time you have the regular freeps + the other 2 groups so that leads to creeps to have the outnumbered buff the most part of the night.

I dont know what turbine did, but now it looks like if every freep are wardens or something, when you have more than 2 persons attacking you, in any normal pvp game you die.. Here on lotro even if 6 people are atacking somebody the freep just jump up and down, healing him self or using bubbles and "store bubbles" now too..

@bleedtodeath: You say people is scared to die.. The truth is that people may be tired to die. Wich kind of fun can you get when as soon as you try to roam the map and do something else you got destroyed by 2 or 3 raids, or wich kind of motivation can you get when you try to kill 1 person and he just heal himself and run to a safe place?

The game is way to broken, and the people that play it is even more broken if they think that the game is balanced and is the fault of 1 side only.

Truth is that creeps cant match freep power and freeps keep coming with more numbers every time. If you "high ranked" freeps can't see this and start blaming one side for not be stupid and push and die over and over to give you points, you can keep living the dream and keep making "gratz threads" like if they mean something..

Forget the whole "ask in ooc to join raid as soon as log on" crowd. All the numbers gathered is the sole purpose of hatred and disliking someone.
Someone get their feelings hurt so they need to turn the map blue/red.
Someone doesn't like someone else talking smack so they get 40 people and set up bonfires at grams/gv.
Someone doesn't like being corpse jumped so they need to get half a dozen more healing rk's.

Fair fights are gone and done with. It is all about domination now.
Dominating the lamers,
dominating the pvers,
dominating the (insert kin/tribe here),
dominating this guy who says means things about my real life.
I too remember when people actually coordinated in vents or at least vaguely hinted at putting themselves in compromising situations in hopes for some sort of gimped action.

I did it last night......if you notice the map is all blue, yet freeps are still being steamrolled off of grams hill....gimp yourself some.....take your group and run through a keep, get some npc's on you, zerg ec even when nobody is there just to up the risk factor. Sometimes this can backfire.....freeps know all about being wiped in dg unless they have a raid and a half of people that is.....but who cares....if people haven't figured out that dying means nothing anymore....in the age of pay to winning, everybody having bubbles and full heals, and infamy/renown buffs....who cares...just get back into the action as soon as possible.

I too have been gone for a couple months on a forced vacation under the sea, i don't know why i would think anything would have changed....you are never going to curb someone's play style, whether that is a domination playstyle, a fair fight playstyle or whether your fun is just to gank, zerg, and smash every enemy you see in sight..... I was hoping some other raid leaders would have stepped up...but i guess not, so i'm just going to play.

The only good thing they have done, which pains me to say, was to get rid of dailystats....yes it was fun to see your points gained in a day and rub it in people faces that you're the best with 20k infamy/renown in a day because you have no life and tons of cash to blow on buffs...that was all fine and dandy...it was part of my morning ritual also to log on and see which were the top ten on both sides and such and a nice easy reference to see who was close to ranking and such....yadda yadda yadda. Now i find myself not really caring at all for points......other night.....we left the whole map blue while freeps were getting steamrolled....who cares now.....they were losing, turbine was having login issues, who cares if they were getting 5 times as much per kill on our greenies......i don't know whos farming 15k renown off me anymore...so forget about it.

So to sum this all up. Nothing will change. Not with everybody taking everything someone says and does too personal.

For the past week or so, most of the prime time is spent either sitting at grams/lug back door, or running around the delving wondering if the opposite side are going to take the buffs. Until a creep leader comes on, or it seems like the freep raid just broke apart, both freeps and creeps would rather sit at grams than get a decent fight. I don't mind getting rolled. But it seems that people are so scared to die that they would rather sit and look at the same scenery for a few hours than push and fight. Do we want to ask the devs to just delete the entire map? And just keep the dof and lug - grams area? Since it seems that is all we use...

The biggest problem with the game is that it is not very balanced. Because of that people tend to play the more powerful side and also the more powerful toons. Lets take you for instance.....You have a hunter which probably is a class that most people think is the weakest class on freep side right now. Instead of you playing that toon since this last update you have been playing a Healing Runekeeper. Which happens to be the hardest toon to kill and one that scews the balance more than any other toon right now.

The only way we are going to see better fights more often is if Turbine balances the game better because people are not going to change. They are always going to play the more op side and toons. Not all, but enough to make a difference. The problem is I don't see Turbine balancing anything anytime soon.