"If we would hold fast that which is good, we must not tolerate any doctrine that is not the pure doctrine of Christ’s Gospel. There is a hatred that is downright charity: that is the hatred of erroneous doctrine. There is an intolerance which is downright praiseworthy: that is the intolerance of false teaching in the pulpit. Who would ever think of tolerating a little poison given to him day by day? If men come among you who do not preach “all the counsel of God,” who do not preach of Christ, sin, holiness, of ruin, and redemption, and regeneration, – or do not preach of these things in a Scriptural way, you ought to cease to hear them. You ought to carry out the spirit shown by the Apostle Paul, in Gal.1:8: “Though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other Gospel unto you than that which we have preached, let him be accursed.”~ J.C. Ryle

"What a man believes is ultimately going to determine his life. A man who is loose in doctrine eventually becomes loose also in his life and in his behavior. And I do not hesitate to say that the church of God on earth is as she is today primarily because of the looseness of belief in doctrine which entered in the last century, and has continued to the present time. You cannot separate these things; doctrine and conduct are indissolubly linked."Martyn Lloyd-Jones (Life in the Spirit)

"I am not permitted to let my love be so merciful as to tolerate and endure false doctrine. When faith and doctrine are concerned and endangered, neither love nor patience are in order.... when these are concerned, neither toleration nor mercy are in order, but only anger, dispute, and destruction - to be sure, only with the Word of God as our weapon." - Martin Luther

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The Chestnut MareAll that is gold does not glitter,Not all those who wander are lostThe old that is strong does not wither,Deep roots are not reached by frost.- - - -JRR Tolkien "Lord of the Rings"

I desire to keep aloof from strife. I have clearly stated women elders are not Biblical. Proverbs 20:3

Huh?

1) No one here, including me a) asked if YOU personally held to the view allowing women as office bearers in the church, nor b) to defend yourself or anyone else who did.

2) What I was curious about is your application of what Sinclair Ferguson wrote in regard to those who claim to be believers and who either hold to erroneous doctrine and/or who are involved in sinful behavior.

Here are my two questions as previously asked, which surely has NOTHING to do with "strife"!!

Quote:

1) IF you thus believe, as your application would seem to apply, that we are to allow professing Christians to hold to heretical doctrine until such time as God through His Spirit reveals their error and changes their heart and mind, is discipline of such individuals justified? And if so, what kind of disciple would you prescribe?... a) for communicate members of a church, and b) for those ordained to office; Elder or Deacon?

2) How would you evaluate the manner which Jesus, Paul and the other authors of the Epistles of the NT dealt with those who held to heretical doctrine and/or practiced sinful behavior? Cf. the following for evaluation:

I then listed a number of passages from God's Word which spoke directly concerning false teachers, heretics within the Church, etc., and asked how those might bear upon your "application" of Ferguson's quote, i.e., showing patience toward believers. The Topic of the thread started with a question concerning those who claimed to be Christians but who denied that Scripture is infallible and inerrant. The matter of women in office was then added as a specific example of an error currently being promoted in many churches. So, my response to you is definitely on topic and surely relevant to what you wrote.

Methinks you owe it to the thousands who visit this board a reply to my "non-strife" questions.

I have often even heard hard core atheists agree to certain Scripture passages even though they refuse the rest of God's words. For instance, many liberal polititians love to quote the Scripture about helping the materially poor but refuse the perspicuitous implications of the Bible conserning the fact that we are ALL spiritually poor.

I'll try to answer your question, IMO, with another question.

Why didn't Adam and Eve believe in God's words in the Garden? It's essential to our faith and eternal life to believe in all of God's words whether uniquely inspired in the Scripture or those words that were personally delivered to our first parents in the Garden. This is why the Reformers, without dissent, agreed to "Sola Scriptura".

Since the sin of not believing in God's words that are in union with His Spirit is truly inexplicable (blasphemy of the Spirit), I sometimes wonder even if our holy omniscient and innocent God even understands the depth of this sin.

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Denny

Simon Peter answered Him, "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life." [John 6:68]

\Since the sin of not believing in God's words that are in union with His Spirit is truly inexplicable (blasphemy of the Spirit), I sometimes wonder even if our holy omniscient and innocent God even understands the depth of this sin.

1. God, being Omniscient certainly knows the nature and depth of pride, autonomy and rebellion, which is what unbelief is.

2. Since God ordained Adam's disobedience from all eternity, He obviously understood the depth of this sin which resulted in the Fall of all mankind, with the consequential and just punishment of a) an infinite guilt, and b) a corruption of man's very nature. The only remedy to redeem fallen mankind was the incarnation and crucifixion. The punishment and redemption of God's elect I think is evidence enough that God fully understands the 'depth of this sin'.