Mt Hyjal has a faction we can start gaining rep with there right away. Vashj'ir does not as far as I can tell. Wouldn't getting a jump on GoH rep be a smart idea as they have some decent blue rewards to help ease into grinding heroics.

edit: Even if you can gain some small measure of ER rep in Vashj'ir, from what I have read you can get revered with GoH and access to some nice blues for level 85 by doing all of Mt Hyjal as your initial starter zone. Plus ER rep can easily be gained when you hit Deepholm from my understanding. Deepholm would also have quest rewards, at least some decent legs, that we could use at the level cap.

Mt Hyjal has a faction we can start gaining rep with there right away. Vashj'ir does not as far as I can tell. Wouldn't getting a jump on GoH rep be a smart idea as they have some decent blue rewards to help ease into grinding heroics.

edit: Even if you can gain some small measure of ER rep in Vashj'ir, from what I have read you can get revered with GoH and access to some nice blues for level 85 by doing all of Mt Hyjal as your initial starter zone. Plus ER rep can easily be gained when you hit Deepholm from my understanding. Deepholm would also have quest rewards, at least some decent legs, that we could use at the level cap.

Hinalover, could you check the allowed gear used for that optimization? There are a number of pieces that I had manually flagged as BIS Pre-raid that aren't on your list. The items are either crafted from chaos orbs or exalted reputation items.

GemsCats:Agility (red) > Mastery (blue) > restMake sure to gem to fit the requirement of your crit mod meta. (yes the level 80 one since it has AGI)Note that Blizzard has announced they are changing the "more blue than red" requirement on the crit mod metas.

Mastery gem is not blue but yellow. Hit rating is now blue so for a blue slot you can use or for a yellow slot

Unless things have changed, I believe none of the T11 bosses have parry-haste enabled (I was under the impression that it was being removed, but can't find anything to confirm). You may wish to take that into account regarding expertise.

This means that:in order to swap 1 blue gem for a red gem that the socket bonus would have to be: >20/43/49 STAM/AGI/DODGEin order to swap 1 blue gem for a yellow gem that the socket bonus would have to be: >21/45/52 STAM/AGI/DODGEin order to swap 2 blue gems for a red and a yellow gem the socket bonus would have to be: >42/88/101 STAM/AGI/DODGE

Also how final are those rawr stat ratings Hina? I would like to add that info to the original post, but I'm waiting until I have confirmation of solid formulas. Exact numbers are more convincing than "stam is best, followed by dodge".

These are based on the current modeling that Ast has set up for Bear Druids in Rawr 4.0. He has said that the module is near complete. As for how final it is, I would say once we can get these freaken Relics to work is when I would say it will be final. Just we have had no luck in that department. once we do is when I would say it is final.

As for personal preference in the Relic department though, i would use for the Pre-Raid set, and for the Pre-heroic dungeon set. But that is my opinion. Until we can get this bug worked out I would hold my tongue on the matter.

Was the honor buy-able and Tol Barrad gear considered in your setups? I know the resilience is a loss, but based on your stat weights they are competitive if not apparently BIS for some slots due to their higher item level.

Can anyone explain why Dodge is so much better than mastery ? Actually mastery seems very low ( just a little above crit ) and i don't understand why. I guess that these numbers come from Rawr4 ( and so from Astrylian ) but what is the logical reason for mastery being so underated ?

Once Rawr4 is out we can verify, but in a nutshell the answer will probably be that Mastery is an effective health stat and the for the models they are using for Heroics and T11 Raids, we have enough effective health.

You'll get similar results in Rawr 2.x if you load a T10 character against Heroics and optimize with low threat priority. Rawr will start gemming and enchanting dodge in some cases. Agility is still better if its an option, but it chooses dodge over stam in the head enchant where Agi is not available.

Is it really a matter of effective health ? With a boss than make 100K each 10 seconds, and savage defense that absorb 80K we have plenty of effective health, but mastery is still very good for the purpose of reducing damage taken. More than effective health, the problem isn't the ratio between the amount of one hit by a boss, and the amount absorb by savage defense ?

Anyway my question was more about Crit and mastery. Intuitively I assumed that in mitigation/survival way, mastery which is a defensive stat was obviusly better than crit which is first an aggro stat ( even if it procures mitigation via savage defense's procs ). Does these numbers take aggro in account ? Or what is wrong with the calculus made in the pages 1/2/3 of this thread : http://elitistjerks....ear_discussion/( about reforging of crit or haste into mastery, and what are the ratios between thoses stats ).

Is it really a matter of effective health ? With a boss than make 100K each 10 seconds, and savage defense that absorb 80K we have plenty of effective health, but mastery is still very good for the purpose of reducing damage taken. More than effective health, the problem isn't the ratio between the amount of one hit by a boss, and the amount absorb by savage defense ?

As both dodge and mastery do not provide guaranteed damage reduction, I think they do not add to your effective health. They only provide (unguaranteed) mitigation. Apparently @85 in starter gear, dodge provides more mitigation than mastery. I do not find this hard to believe. In fact, I've never actually seen comparisons between dodge and mastery @80, so perhaps we were wrong in reforging to mastery and should have reforged to dodge instead.

Anyway my question was more about Crit and mastery. Intuitively I assumed that in mitigation/survival way, mastery which is a defensive stat was obviusly better than crit which is first an aggro stat ( even if it procures mitigation via savage defense's procs ). Does these numbers take aggro in account ? Or what is wrong with the calculus made in the pages 1/2/3 of this thread : http://elitistjerks....ear_discussion/( about reforging of crit or haste into mastery, and what are the ratios between thoses stats ).

The model I posted there was of course very rudimentary compared to Rawr. But if you take a closer look at that model, you will find that the mitigation provided by mastery does not scale linearly with crit rating. At lower levels of crit (like in starter gear @85), added crit rating provides a lot more mitigation than at higher levels of crit (like in T10 raid gear @80). So much more in fact, that at those levels, crit rating outperforms mastery rating.