It is just as well farrudge was wrong when he conceded defeat, cried foul and called for a second ref wasn't it? Imagine how angry you lot would be what with all the cheating that was going on - except it doesn't seem to have been now you won does it? Pencils ffs........

It is just as well farrudge was wrong when he conceded defeat, cried foul and called for a second ref wasn't it? Imagine how angry you lot would be what with all the cheating that was going on - except it doesn't seem to have been now you won does it

There hasn’t I mean but like Doha has been a bust and I don’t know how many times I have to say it. And it becomes even I mean it doesn’t matter whether I say it but I am just sick of saying it for you know since Doha, Monterrey and all of the rest of it. And until such time as we take down the CAP and the foreign bill and all the onerous protectionist treaties I mean you know really the EU is a cartel, I mean it is protectionism of the end

led by geldof?the guy that said the following,There hasn’t I mean but like Doha has been a bust and I don’t know how many times I have to say it. And it becomes even I mean it doesn’t matter whether I say it but I am just sick of saying it for

That's 2 'geldof' references in 2 days. What is the point in wheeling out a few random quotes from random people that were barely involved in the whole thing? What point is that you are trying to prove - sometimes older people don't quite know what they are saying and don't make sense? I think we all know that. Pip Pip.

That's 2 'geldof' references in 2 days. What is the point in wheeling out a few random quotes from random people that were barely involved in the whole thing? What point is that you are trying to prove - sometimes older people don't quite know what t

Mirror 16th May:Nigel Farage warns today he would fight for a second referendum on Britain in Europe if the remain campaign won by a narrow margin next month.The Ukip leader said a small defeat for his leave camp would be “unfinished business” and predicted pressure would grow for a re-run of the 23 June ballot.Farage told the Mirror: “In a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way. If the remain campaign win two-thirds to one-third that ends it.”

On the night of the vote:Farage threatens NeverendumNigel Farage has been giving what seems to be a very early concession speech, although he admits: “I hope I’m made a fool of”.Farage has threatened a Neverendum - “The Eurosceptic genie is out of the bottle and it will not be put back.”

Sauce for the goose......

Mirror 16th May:Nigel Farage warns today he would fight for a second referendum on Britain in Europe if the remain campaign won by a narrow margin next month.The Ukip leader said a small defeat for his leave camp would be “unfinished business” an

'I think it would be a disaster for our economy and it would lead to a decade of economic and political uncertainty at a time when the tectonic plates of global success are moving

Bearing in mind those 'plates' haven't moved very far, guess who said that 3 years ago.

'I think it would be a disaster for our economy and it would lead to a decade of economic and political uncertainty at a time when the tectonic plates of global success are movingBearing in mind those 'plates' haven't moved very far, guess who said t

It was claimed that the sun never set of the british empire because God would never trust the british in the dark, I think thats true.

They have screwed their own since the beginning of time and it will be no surprise to me if a way is found to remain.

If that happens lets hope we have the mother of all uprisings, it would be our first.

It was claimed that the sun never set of the british empire because God would never trust the british in the dark, I think thats true.They have screwed their own since the beginning of time and it will be no surprise to me if a way is found to remain

At the end of the day the QUITTERS played right into the hands of the A Team of Capitalism - the con and U party, who are now led by a remainer, who failed to tackle immigration for six years.

What is there to celebrate?

We have a new thatcher. So what?

Things are no better for the working class.

The new thatcher has a clear field. let's see what she does.I expect the ultra-conservative activists on here will still be whinging for years.

At the end of the day the QUITTERS played right into the hands of the A Team of Capitalism - the con and U party, who are now led by a remainer, who failed to tackle immigration for six years.What is there to celebrate?We have a new thatcher. So what

Everyone accepts we are leaving. If you are characterising us as trying to stop the whole process; then..... its a perfect example of straw man argument.

However it will be a soft Brexit. Norway or Canada model possibly. Could even be BINO. How do I know this. Toooo much money to be lost by too many powerful people. This country will not commit financial suicide.

You post looks weak weak. Its the desperate behaviour of a loser.

My proof that you have ben taken for suckers. Totally swindled and conned ??????????????????????

Mugs weak weak poor poor poor mugs. No wonder you are increasingly desperate loud and shouty. You were mugged.

Desperate desperate.Everyone accepts we are leaving. If you are characterising us as trying to stop the whole process; then..... its a perfect example of straw man argument.However it will be a soft Brexit. Norway or Canada model possibly. Could eve

Melv - The EU have allowed the UK time to have a change of heart. Some of us here believe that Brexit is an error so grave that it would put Britain on the wrong side of the history of this century, as surely as Germany was in the last. The most optimistic outcome we can envisage is an impoverished island, with a reputation for mean-spiritedness. The best outcome Brexiteers can envisage is that it destroys the EU, leaving the UK in a position to play their old Eton rules game of divide and rule, to the detriment of the whole continent.

So not everyone accepts that we are leaving. But it will be too late, potentially within a year. We need to speak up now, or be damned.

#fbpe

Melv - The EU have allowed the UK time to have a change of heart. Some of us here believe that Brexit is an error so grave that it would put Britain on the wrong side of the history of this century, as surely as Germany was in the last. The most opti

Yes, a bit OTT, admittedly, jed.What is the simulacrum for a decision that, at best, will stigmatize coming generations and, at worst, ruin Europe and plunge the world into depression? Wrong turn in a bad neighbourhood?

Yes, a bit OTT, admittedly, jed.What is the simulacrum for a decision that, at best, will stigmatize coming generations and, at worst, ruin Europe and plunge the world into depression? Wrong turn in a bad neighbourhood?

And why will our leaving ruin Europe? It seemed to be rubbing along just fine before we joined, I'm sure they will get over our departure if they can find another cash cow.

And why would the world be plunged into depression by our leaving? Surely this is ultimately just a minor change to our trading conditions? I accept that it has plunged you into depression, but the world?

I fear you may need to take a day off.

How will future generations be stigmatised?And why will our leaving ruin Europe? It seemed to be rubbing along just fine before we joined, I'm sure they will get over our departure if they can find another cash cow.And why would the world be plunged

Everyone accepts we are leaving. If you are characterising us as trying to stop the whole process; then..... its a perfect example of straw man argument.

However it will be a soft Brexit. Norway or Canada model possibly

^

Wow. Is the Canada model a soft Brexit?

melv16 Feb 18 06:41Joined: 19 Feb 06| Topic/replies: 5,570 | Blogger: melv's blogDesperate desperate.GrinGrinGrinGrinEveryone accepts we are leaving. If you are characterising us as trying to stop the whole process; then..... its a perfect example of

If this is what Hard Brexit wants then fine. I'm actually accepting a hard Brexit

"The Canada model gives preferential access to the EU single market without all the obligations that Norway and Switzerland face, eliminating most trade tariffs. However, some "sensitive" food items, including eggs and chicken, are not covered by it.

Canadian exporters will have to prove that their goods are entirely "made in Canada", which imposes extra costs, to prevent imports entering the EU through a "back door".

It would also mean that firms that export to the EU would have to comply with EU product standards and technical requirements without having any say in setting them. "

Note naff all about immigration. Which is all millions of Brexiteers cared about.

Wow. Is the Canada model a soft Brexit? Dear Insider.If this is what Hard Brexit wants then fine. I'm actually accepting a hard Brexit"The Canada model gives preferential access to the EU single market without all the obligations that Norway and Swit

@jedFirstly, I think the covert aspiration of Brexit is to destroy the EU. Certainly it is your wish. The other thing that seems to exercize the hand of a Brexiteer is the prospect of the UK reneging on its obligations to the EU. That would be very serious for world finance.Thirdly, well how adjectives does Brexit conjure: Mean-spirited, narrow-minded, insular, backward-facing, unwelcoming, unfriendly, negative and many others. Labels I am afraid will attach to the innocent younger generations.

@jedFirstly, I think the covert aspiration of Brexit is to destroy the EU. Certainly it is your wish. The other thing that seems to exercize the hand of a Brexiteer is the prospect of the UK reneging on its obligations to the EU. That would be very s

And when they ask, I will point out that - thanks to me - they are able to vote out their rulers, and they will not be called up to fight the war with Russia which the EU's militarism will almost certainly cause.

And when they ask, I will point out that - thanks to me - they are able to vote out their rulers, and they will not be called up to fight the war with Russia which the EU's militarism will almost certainly cause.

Don't be obtuse BPP, you know full well that the EU will shortly create an Army, and that it is hellbent on Eastward expansion. It doesn't require an extravagant leap of faith to imagine these developments going down badly in Russia.

Don't be obtuse BPP, you know full well that the EU will shortly create an Army, and that it is hellbent on Eastward expansion. It doesn't require an extravagant leap of faith to imagine these developments going down badly in Russia.

sorry, I'm not following - you accuse a political entity of militarism, I'm asking for evidence of that militarism.

You tell me I need to imagine a future development. My evidence for EU militarism is my own imagination? And I'm being obtuse?

sorry, I'm not following - you accuse a political entity of militarism, I'm asking for evidence of that militarism.You tell me I need to imagine a future development. My evidence for EU militarism is my own imagination? And I'm being obtuse?

in fact - if your water-line for an entity being militaristic is "having an army" (which is wrong anyway, as "militaristic" actually means a willingness to aggressively use military force, per the OED, then the EU (without an army) must be one of the least militaristic political entities in the world. You literally pick the one thing they are least guilty of, and try to lie about it.

there's so much wrong with the EU which doesn't need to be fabricated. It just seems odd to invent things and therefore discredit yourself.

we "know full well" the EU will shortly create an army. Do we? How do we know this?

it's like that belter Boris Johnson. if he'd just stick to the truth instead of going off on dishonest tangents about bananas and vacuum cleaners we wouldn't be in the mess we are in.

in fact - if your water-line for an entity being militaristic is "having an army" (which is wrong anyway, as "militaristic" actually means a willingness to aggressively use military force, per the OED, then the EU (without an army) must be one of the

I may need a lot of things, but an explanation of OED meanings is never one of them.

Can I ask you why an entity would need an Army if it had no militaristic pretensions?

You love a dictionary don't you? I may need a lot of things, but an explanation of OED meanings is never one of them.Can I ask you why an entity would need an Army if it had no militaristic pretensions?

if I had stated an entity was militaristic and was asked for evidence, I may suggest something like:

The US regime of the early 2000s was militaristic. They deliberately confused many of their people into believing Iraq was behind the attacks of September 2001 as a way to get public support for an unnecessary invasion of Iraq.

What I would have done, if I'd done the above, would be to have used actual events for the property (militarism) I was using to describe the regime under discussion (the US of the early 2000s). I would have avoided using phrases like "in the future this will happen" and I would have avoided accusing anybody sceptical of anything. "anyone who disagrees is being obtuse" seems unnecessary when you have actual things to back up your statements.

But good luck with your chosen approach, I'm sure you know what you're doing.

if I had stated an entity was militaristic and was asked for evidence, I may suggest something like:The US regime of the early 2000s was militaristic. They deliberately confused many of their people into believing Iraq was behind the attacks of Sept

Obviously a shared understanding of words is important. If you misuse terms, either lazily, in ignorance (or as I suspect in your case) deliberately, then don't be surprised to be corrected.Can I ask you why an entity would need an Army if it had no militaristic pretensions?

Yes, you can ask. But this question isn't relevant to whether a political body is militaristic or not. Aggression in the use of the military, not it's mere existence, is part of the definition.

Are you asking why an entity may have an army without wishing to use it? You're a bright enough chap - you must be aware of standard defence thinking. (clue's right there - it's called defence for a reason).

You love a dictionary don't you?Obviously a shared understanding of words is important. If you misuse terms, either lazily, in ignorance (or as I suspect in your case) deliberately, then don't be surprised to be corrected.Can I ask you why an entity

until you can correctly accuse any body (in this case the EU) of militarism then they'd need to both have an army (they don't) and be using it aggressively (they're not - they don't have one).

now on you go lad.

until you can correctly accuse any body (in this case the EU) of militarism then they'd need to both have an army (they don't) and be using it aggressively (they're not - they don't have one).now on you go lad.

Even if this was true - is it? show me - it still wouldn't make them militaristic.

Obtuse? I couldn't be clearer. you're trying to slide through adjectives as if they are an already established truth. when questioned you have nothing except to attack the questioner.

you are weak.

EU military campaigns since 1945:zeroEvidence for EU Military Aggression:"The EU wants an army"Even if this was true - is it? show me - it still wouldn't make them militaristic.Obtuse? I couldn't be clearer. you're trying to slide through adjective

not at all. I accept the EU hasn't been to war and I accept the EU has no army. They are in the same category as the Moon on these questions.

what this has to do with your dishonest use of the term militaristic is not clear.

not at all. I accept the EU hasn't been to war and I accept the EU has no army. They are in the same category as the Moon on these questions.what this has to do with your dishonest use of the term militaristic is not clear.

a political body intending to form its own army can only have militaristic intentions

as already demonstrated this isn't necessarily true - the EU could have an army without being militaristic, and your only evidence that the EU even wants an army (so far) is "everybody knows". Anybody asking for detail is obtuse.

You've got nothing.

Why not try proving that Turkey is about to join the EU - that's another good one.

a political body intending to form its own army can only have militaristic intentionsas already demonstrated this isn't necessarily true - the EU could have an army without being militaristic, and your only evidence that the EU even wants an army (so

the thing I don't understand about the proper nutters who hate the EU, is when they go off down side alleys which are demonstrably false when they don't need to.it's like claiming Man United won the treble every single year of his reign to prove Ferg

look at it this way, we prefer facts to mere words. Lets see how Germany and France and the rest behave in these negotiations They can ruin their economy with a new army should they wish, I don't want to have to be part of it

look at it this way, we prefer facts to mere words. Lets see how Germany and France and the rest behave in these negotiations They can ruin their economy with a new army should they wish, I don't want to have to be part of it

Just fact the facts, Remainiacs, you lost, you sit on the wrong side of history, the majority insist on democracy whilst you yearn for the opposite. Not happening. Try and get used to your future reality. This constant anger and denial will not help you.

And.

1 more thing.

Don't forget.

WE ARE LEAVING THE BUILDING.

melv 16 Feb 18 16:38 Mean-spirited, narrow-minded, insular, backward-facing, unwelcoming, unfriendly, negative and many others.And they are the better points of your average Remainiac.Just fact the facts, Remainiacs, you lost, you sit on the wrong s

Oh no we are not. etc etc etc etc etc. Actually I think it will go on for decades.

And that's what we will get for 3 years at least.You're mean spirited etc etcNo we are not you are. No you are.No we are not. Oh yes you are/Oh no we are not. etc etc etc etc etc. Actually I think it will go on for decades.

True. But you can accuse the EU trying to goad Russia by expanding to their borders.

So far they have been playing in clever expanding through carrots rather than sticks.

In WW2 the sticks method did not ultimately work.

bigpoppapump16 Feb 18 15:21Joined: 16 Dec 02| Topic/replies: 5,023 | Blogger: bigpoppapump's bloguntil you can correctly accuse any body (in this case the EU) of militarism^True. But you can accuse the EU trying to goad Russia by expanding to their b

15,000 lobbyists are permanently based in Brussels around all the EUSSR buildings.

There is often a shortage of brown envelopes in Brussels as a result of the above.

The EUSSR kicked off a war in Ukraine and then threw them under the bus following the predictable reaction of Putin.

Expense fiddling is rife. (SISO)

Parliament only one in world that cannot propose legislation.

Said Parliament wastes millions every year with pointless move from Brussels to Strasbourg.

An organisation rotten to the core and not fit to be referred to as democratic.

Too close for comfort he means.They have an unelected and unremovable President.Anyone that asks about the books been signed off is sacked.The books are never signed off.15,000 lobbyists are permanently based in Brussels around all the EUSSR building

The brown envelope joke aside feel free to address or correct any of those points.

I'm sure the citizens of the EUSSR would like to know Juncker can be removed.

The fact is he cannot be removed as everybody knows. But that doesn't stop you saying - Except they are not facts, it's just playground name calling

Madman.

The brown envelope joke aside feel free to address or correct any of those points.I'm sure the citizens of the EUSSR would like to know Juncker can be removed. The fact is he cannot be removed as everybody knows. But that doesn't stop you saying - Ex

unitedbiscuits17 Feb 18 22:12Joined: 27 Jan 02| Topic/replies: 8,370 | Blogger: unitedbiscuits's blogExcept they are not facts, it's just playground name calling. It was all right for a laugh before things got serious..

^

In total and utter denial.

unitedbiscuits17 Feb 18 22:12Joined: 27 Jan 02| Topic/replies: 8,370 | Blogger: unitedbiscuits's blogExcept they are not facts, it's just playground name calling. It was all right for a laugh before things got serious..^In total and utter denial.

Yes, I'm in complete denial. In fact, I'll go further, I totally and utterly reject the representation of the EU as a "tyranny," a "dictatorship" and a Soviet Socialist Style Republic. I completely refute the assumption that my life has in any way been been harmed through forty odd years of living under its umbrella.

I see the EU as a force for good but would accept the label, "a club for the benefit of its member states." I can see the motive for Rupert Murdoch besmirching the EU in overblown language; see it repeated around here and I just think, those people are still twelve in their heads.

Yes, I'm in complete denial. In fact, I'll go further, I totally and utterly reject the representation of the EU as a "tyranny," a "dictatorship" and a Soviet Socialist Style Republic. I completely refute the assumption that my life has in any way be

I love Europe, but that is why I fear .what might be happening and the decisions the EU take might be as tyrannical as alien to the people who live in Europe as anything done before,and even worse then the repression of communism in the past

I love Europe, but that is why I fear .what might be happening and the decisions the EU take might be as tyrannical as alien to the people who live in Europe as anything done before,and even worse then the repression of communism in the past

they will not listen to the people in their own countries, they make the decisions and will not allow themselves to be told by the people what it is they wantIt is a tyranny and will do more damage in the end than communism or Nazism , it is not a democracy

they will not listen to the people in their own countries, they make the decisions and will not allow themselves to be told by the people what it is they wantIt is a tyranny and will do more damage in the end than communism or Nazism , it is not a de