When did the scots kick the brits anywhere , am I missing a piece of scottish history here or something ?
as far as I can remember Scotland has been a vassal of the brittish queens and kings since the scottish lords sold us out for land and wealth !

Still to this day scotland is a pawn to the English throne , the empire gave back hong kong and India and many other colonies yet still havent let go
of scotland for some reason

want to give me the source of that information ?

There are loads of low paid , low skilled jobs filled by immigrants , because the natives dont want to work them or cant be arsed and would rather sit
on the benefit of everyone elses hard work , unlike the immigrants who not only work harder than us for less but also pay the taxes that those of us
who wont work dont !

Still cant believe where you got that about scotland kickin out the brits , I almost sprayed my beer over the screen . ( yes its 1pm in scotland ,
however its a gala day today and im celebrating )

I speak three languages and I picked them up by living in the countries where they were spoken. So I speak out of experience when I say, if one does
not speak the languages of the surrounding, it is because one has avoided this surrounding. So obviously, if one is not comfortable to speak in the
nativ language after living 23 years among natives, it is because one has avoided contact with natives. So the question arises, why was there not
sufficiant contact with the natives of a country that one lived in for 23 years to feel comfortable when speaking their language??

Why are you catering to the southern neighbors? Why are they the ones in America being catered to with signs, voice services, forms all in the Spanish
language? Are you racist saying they are better than the Chinese, Russians, Japanese? I cant remember the last time I saw a Japanese sign here in NC.
I have however seen Spanish signs.

So you support anyone coming to America with no procedures to do so?

So I assume that if every living person on earth outside of the USA (6 billion plus) woke up tomorrow and wanted to come to America you would let 6
billion people in? This is my assumption according to what you are saying. Is it a safe assumption or am I misunderstanding you?

Oh, yah maybe I just mixed up fighting a war with the Brits with kickin them out. I guess they stayed. What was all that hullaballoo back in the 13th
century about anyways?

But I guess I was kinda going by something like this:

Aftermath The Battle of Bannockburn became the greatest victory in the history of Scotland. While full recognition of Scottish independence was
still several years off, Bruce had driven the English from Scotland and secured his position as king. While exact numbers of Scottish casualties are
not known, they are believed to have been light. English losses are not known with precision but may have ranged from 4,000-11,000 men. Following the
battle, Edward raced south and finally found safety at Dunbar Castle. He never again returned to Scotland.

militaryhistory.about.com...
Of course I realize there is a difference between the tyranny of a foreign King in your land, and a mass invasion of reconquistas demanding various
rights.

Interesting point you bring up about Scotland still being a pawn of England, as conspiracy theorists say that about the US too. Professor Antony
Sutton wrote of the European bankers controlling things.

Why are you catering to the southern neighbors? Why are they the ones in America being catered to with signs, voice services, forms all in the Spanish
language? Are you racist saying they are better than the Chinese, Russians, Japanese? I cant remember the last time I saw a Japanese sign here in NC.
I have however seen Spanish signs.

So you support anyone coming to America with no procedures to do so?

So I assume that if every living person on earth outside of the USA (6 billion plus) woke up tomorrow and wanted to come to America you would let 6
billion people in? This is my assumption according to what you are saying. Is it a safe assumption or am I misunderstanding you?

edit on 18-6-2011 by ker2010 because: (no reason given)

Hahaha that's what it sounds like to me too! No rule of law because it used to be open plains and now it's not. And yet there is still a great deal
of land, but the UN is claiming a lot of park lands as Heritage lands to be kept pristine, and the US govt owns a lot of land, and even takes it by
emiment domain.

I can put myself in the man's shoes quite easily--I speak Russian and Portuguese. If I were in Russia, or Brazil speaking on such an important matter
on the record, I would not have enough confidence in myself to speak eloquently enough, and I too would prefer to rely on a translator to make certain
that I did not stumble on my words. I do not know if the man was nervous, but I know I would be if I were in his shoes. Nervousness would only make
matters worse for me. I don't care how long one has been speaking a second language, confidence as well as nerves matter, and they can bungle your
message easily. I personally would not risk it, I become nervous enough speaking my own language at times (English) I would be far more mortified to
butcher my message in my second tongue than I would be to rely on a translator.

As far as Spanish "overtaking" the US, I'm sorry, but do not see it. And I live in Florida, for pete's sake! One of the supposed capitols of the
Spanish language. I see & hear absolutely no more Spanish now than I did 20+ years ago as a child. If one has aimed at making a mountain out of a mole
hill, congratulations are in order on the achievement.

The people standing on hte docks are looking up at the people on the boats and going "Not enough room! GO AWAY!

And arent they right now? Is there room? How many is enough?

The catastrophe then exists long before we inject immigrants into it. Imagine - take all immigrants out of the equation, imagine you're just talking
about natives. Can you see the society you describe working any better then? Of course not.

No, the current society would be perfectly fine without huge immigration. And again you are comparing apples and oranges, this situation is exactly
the opposite.

More advanced people immigrating into small population of less advanced society and virgin land full of room and resources then. Almost no education
needed to succeed, just your hands and will to work.
Less advanced people immigrating into more advanced society with all land suitable for colonisation already occupied and resources claimed. Small
chance of employment without education and huge initial investment (which they dont have).

The only constant is the fact that huge immigration means the culture and society of the immigrants will over time replace the one of domestic
people.
So do you want to turn US into Mexico and Europe into third world?

Your attempts to paint an either-or picture, where either we must refuse to address our own problems and instead blame them on the immigrants, OR
outright attack the immigrants in their home nations and try to re-structure their nations while still ignoring our problems is, well, dumber than a
sack of rocks.

What our problems do you feel we should address, that cause the issues in the south? What is the probability that they will actually be addressed in
the next 100 years? How will fixing US problems fix the problems in the immigrant home nations they bring in the US?

Strange how at the same time they are "unemployable" they still manage to "steal jobs."

They are unemployable legally, I dont count illegal slave labor as employment, and thats how they steal jobs.
Why? Because there is already more than enough workers in the legal unqualified job market. And the situation will only get worse in the future with
increasing automatisation.

I think my question is on the "excessive." Who judges, exactly?

Excessive is when you have more children than you can take care of properly on your own or with little government assistance.

So long as you have legions of excessively-breeding, unemplpyable, superfluous nonpeople working in slave conditions to ensure you have the latest
sneaker styles.

I dont want it. It is YOU who wants to flood the already full unqualified job market with more cheap slave labor so corporate masters may have higher
profits. Ordinary citizens will not benefit from it in any way, they only loose jobs and have increased government debt because of welfare, schools
and medical system strain and increased criminality rate.

The U.S. doesn't have an official language as many others have said. What some senator refers to as insulting doesn't apply to everyone else on that
board. Clearly..the only thing he should be insulted by is the fact that he's a resentful monolingual. In Europe...people learn an average of three
languages! How sad that some Americans feel so threatened by someone who knows how to speak two languages.

I'm bilungual and I am still learning Japanese. It's embarassing that despite the fact English wasn't even my first language, I still manage to not
only speak more eloquently than some American born citizens I've met, but also excel at college level writing.

Now...I'm not going to say that businesses should be forced to cater to Spanish speakers, but it would benefit them to do so. There will always be
compromises to be made, as long as there is a demand to preserve the modern American way of life. Try to wrap your head around that... if you can.

Originally posted by hotbakedtater
Maybe the lazy snip knows English, but chooses to speak Spanish. You know because it is a free country and there are lots of non englsh speakers in
Texas?

More from the story that the OP failed to share with us:

"Through his interpreter, Aguirre said Spanish is his “first language and since it is his first time giving testimony he would rather do it in
Spanish.”

“It is insulting to us,” Sen. Harris fired back. “It is very insulting. And if he knows English, he needs to be speaking in English.”

No Sen. Harris, here is what SHOULD be insulting and IS insulting to a REAL American: that you have such little respect for a concept in our
constitution called Freedom of Speech. That you choose to represent your constituents through bleating ignorance at a man exercising his rights under
said constitution.

The insult is that an elected politician thinks it is ok to Bully someone like this. The insult that Sen. Harris thinks he can pick and choose which
parts of the constitution he wants others to have access to.

Damn right this is insulting. And it disgusts but does not surprise me.

I am sorry but "Freedom of Speech" means you can say what you think. That has nothing to do with language. Fact is, it IS a courtesy. If I want to
move to France, I had better learn how to speak French. If I choose not to learn the language of the country I am in, I have no right to be upset when
people have no idea what I am saying. If I am going to speak to French representatives on behalf of other immigrants, I had better be able to speak
the language of those I am presenting my case to. It really is that simple. Just because I move some place else, I have no right at all to expect
people to conform to ME, in my opinion that is the ultimate form of entitlement. What the hell makes you so special that others have to speak your
language, from some other country, when you live here?

Freedom of speech encompasses the right to SPEAK in any language one sees fit. That is what makes America great. It is a shame that so many in this
thread feel ok with trampling another person's rights. There is nothing that says we should speak any language except the one we choose to speak. If
people want to make the choice not to listen just because the language is different it is that person's personal loss, considering modern tech makes
it simple to understand each other now. And non modern tech, the interpretor.

(I recently had a nasty PM from someone in this thread stating otherwise. I must have made some good points for the nasty cowardly pms to be flying.)

Originally posted by laiguana
The U.S. doesn't have an official language as many others have said. What some senator refers to as insulting doesn't apply to everyone else on that
board. Clearly..the only thing he should be insulted by is the fact that he's a resentful monolingual. In Europe...people learn an average of three
languages! How sad that some Americans feel so threatened by someone who knows how to speak two languages.

I'm bilungual and I am still learning Japanese. It's embarassing that despite the fact English wasn't even my first language, I still manage to not
only speak more eloquently than some American born citizens I've met, but also excel at college level writing.

Now...I'm not going to say that businesses should be forced to cater to Spanish speakers, but it would benefit them to do so. There will always be
compromises to be made, as long as there is a demand to preserve the modern American way of life. Try to wrap your head around that... if you can.

Then you think we should learn all the languages of the world in school right? In America the majority speak English. Their are roughly 6500 spoken
languages in the world today, its not possible to learn them all. Therefore you learn to speak what the majority in the nation you were born in learn
to speak, or the nation you migrate to. Its just a little common sense. Its not possible to learn every language so when you are born or migrate into
a country you learn what 99% of the general population speak. And you know, it works well!!
Make sure to come back to me when you learn the other 6498 spoken languages so you will not appear to be a resentful monolingual.

Once again it is America who is suppose to have open borders and cater to people migrating here. Wonder how those ideas would come off in Russia or
other nations? Wonder do they let Americans simply stroll into their country unchecked and demand they speak English and learn it to cater to us.

Freedom of speech encompasses the right to SPEAK in any language one sees fit. That is what makes America great. It is a shame that so many in this
thread feel ok with trampling another person's rights. There is nothing that says we should speak any language except the one we choose to speak. If
people want to make the choice not to listen just because the language is different it is that person's personal loss, considering modern tech makes
it simple to understand each other now. And non modern tech, the interpretor.

(I recently had a nasty PM from someone in this thread stating otherwise. I must have made some good points for the nasty cowardly pms to be flying.)

Thats just fine and dandy, But if you come to America and do not take the effort to learn English no one should be catered to with signs, forms,
hotlines written or spoken in another language. Unless you like your friend Mr Fox are advocating we make signs, forms etc in all the languages of
those who have migrated from another country into America whose native tongue is not English... Let me know when you are gonna contribute funds to
getting this accomplished.

I regard the "NAU" the same way I regard invisible pink unicorns - a nonexistent mythological creature that exists only in the minds of people who
want to believe in such things.

Asking me if I support it thus makes about as much sense as asking if I want to put invisible pink unicorns on the endangered species list.

To be honest, the pink unicorns just threw me into a state of "ok whatever". Thanks for clarifiying your opinion. What makes you think it is
nonexistent and mythical? Just because they haven't achieved it yet does not mean that it's not in progress.

Originally posted by ker2010
Then you think we should learn all the languages of the world in school right? In America the majority speak English. There are roughly 6500 spoken
languages in the world today, its not possible to learn them all. Therefore you learn to speak what the majority in the nation you were born in learn
to speak, or the nation you migrate to. Its just a little common sense. Its not possible to learn every language so when you are born or migrate into
a country you learn what 99% of the general population speak. And you know, it works well!!
Make sure to come back to me when you learn the other 6498 spoken languages so you will not appear to be a resentful monolingual.

Once again it is America who is suppose to have open borders and cater to people migrating here. Wonder how those ideas would come off in Russia or
other nations? Wonder do they let Americans simply stroll into their country unchecked and demand they speak English and learn it to cater to us.

How would that pan over?

BTW its bilingual not bilungual, and embarrassing not embarassing

I don't see how you came around to the idea that we should all be forced to learn all the languages in the world. Seeing that the United States is
within close proximity of Spanish speaking countries...it would only be inevitable that Spanish speakers would migrate to the US.
Americans have the choice to learn a new language or not, no one is going to enforce it. Public schools may encourage it, but that's about as far as
it will go. Nonetheless, businesses are already realizing that if they don't cater to Spanish speaking populations in the US, they will lose out on
them.
I do think a lot of Americans are resentful monolinguals because they feel they've been discriminated due to their inability to speak a second
language that is likely commonly spoken by residents in their area. I don't see anything wrong with that. It's just how businesses work...and most
businesses are American owned.

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