exactly the criteria of being the best in the league doesn't mean you throw him in at 15-16! you have to factor all his achievements the whole lot maybe later on in his career yes but at this point in time no way!

You can't blame Mikan for playing in the 1940's an 50's. Did Kobe have to hear racial slurs thrown at him all game like players from the 1950's and 1960's like Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell.

how does Malone possibly have a title being the best on his team???he has no titles..West to my knowledge only one with Wilt(greater then Shaq)...

Quote:

Originally Posted by KIWI

exactly the criteria of being the best in the league doesn't mean you throw him in at 15-16! you have to factor all his achievements the whole lot maybe later on in his career yes but at this point in time no way!

I just wouldnt be comfortable saying guys that were not as good as someone but currently more accomplished are better players...Id have a hard time ranking Malone over Kobe because Kobe just impacts games more...

can't speak to PER, cause i don't know how it's calculated, but the reason hondo didn't make more all-nba first teams is the same reason that bill russell didn't make more all-nba first teams: there was a stat-monster playing his position taking the spot every year. for russ it was wilt (wilt was named 7 times, russ 3). for hondo it was elgin (10 times for baylor, 3 for john). as elgin has already got a spot in the top 15, i'd think hondo was in the clear at least from that angle.

I'm going to vote for John Havlicek again. Reading his summary on nba.com
convinced me that he was a real winner and multi talented as well. He was capable of making that one play that made the difference between winning and losing.

David Robinson, Patrick Ewing, Isiah Thomas, KG, Barkley and probably even Lebron were/are as effective as Kobe is now. Personally Id take all of those players plus several others over Kobe. By accomplishments or dominance Kobe isnt top 16. This year he was basically 2003 Mcgrady. Hes done little the last couple years AI, Tmac, Bernard King, Gervin, and Mcgrady didnt do. He put up 35/5/4. AI 33/7/4. Mcgrady 32/6/6. Gervin and Bernard were scoring huge. **** Rick Barry was a 35ppg guy in his prime. What reason is there to put Kobe over Tiny Archibald if its about play at peak? Guy was putting up 34 and 11. And he wasnt just great back when people love to disrespect the players. He won a title with Bird when he was not only an all star but the all star MVP. Nate was in 3-4 all star games with Magic and Bird.

Kobe being this high is nothing more than a "Right now" bias. I admit there are similar things happening with some older players but really...Kobe the best player not mentioned? Id bet my life...literally...my life...you replace Kobe with 95 Drob and the Lakers are better. Replace him with 91 Ewing and the Lakers are better. No chance they get worse with Barkley in his prime. Lakers would still be a first round exit level team with Lebron in Kobes place.

Kobe is a great talent but hes dont not one thing without Shaq that suggests hes more effective than a hell of a lot of players. **** Clyde Drexler could lead the lakers tothe lottery and 2 first round exits.

What Kobe is is an all time great scorer who at times steps up his D to a high level. Hes not amazingly effective. One could argue David Robinson was both a more effective offensive and defensive player.

David Robinson, Patrick Ewing, Isiah Thomas, KG, Barkley and probably even Lebron were/are as effective as Kobe is now. Personally Id take all of those players plus several others over Kobe. By accomplishments or dominance Kobe isnt top 16. This year he was basically 2003 Mcgrady. Hes done little the last couple years AI, Tmac, Bernard King, Gervin, and Mcgrady didnt do. He put up 35/5/4. AI 33/7/4. Mcgrady 32/6/6. Gervin and Bernard were scoring huge. **** Rick Barry was a 35ppg guy in his prime. What reason is there to put Kobe over Tiny Archibald if its about play at peak? Guy was putting up 34 and 11. And he wasnt just great back when people love to disrespect the players. He won a title with Bird when he was not only an all star but the all star MVP. Nate was in 3-4 all star games with Magic and Bird.

Kobe being this high is nothing more than a "Right now" bias. I admit there are similar things happening with some older players but really...Kobe the best player not mentioned? Id bet my life...literally...my life...you replace Kobe with 95 Drob and the Lakers are better. Replace him with 91 Ewing and the Lakers are better. No chance they get worse with Barkley in his prime. Lakers would still be a first round exit level team with Lebron in Kobes place.

Kobe is a great talent but hes dont not one thing without Shaq that suggests hes more effective than a hell of a lot of players. **** Clyde Drexler could lead the lakers tothe lottery and 2 first round exits.

What Kobe is is an all time great scorer who at times steps up his D to a high level. Hes not amazingly effective. One could argue David Robinson was both a more effective offensive and defensive player.

were they doing while also playing first team all nba defense and being widely thought of as either the best or second best player in the league...

your replacing him with a center in a time void of centers...thats really fair...Why not put Kobe in a time when the sg comp was lower....and this was not Kobe's best year as any1 could see his was working himself into shape for a long time killing his stats

There is no way in hell im taking soft *** DRob over Kobe Bryant...just no way...

Name me someone who in Kobe's place beats the Suns this year in the playoffs??

Wow, I'm really glad Pettit got in over Malone. That's excellant news. Anyhow, I'm voting for Mikan again of course, though Havlicek's been underrated as well, so I wouldn't be dissapointed if he got in at #17.

I know he won't get in at 16 - but his name must be mentioned -- Johbn Stockton. ALL-TIME leader in assists and steals. ALL-TIME! He also was the most efficient shooting pg in the league and a fairly good scorer to boot.

He's gotta make top 20 -- considering he is the greatest pure pg of all time.