hair on scalp and face

hair on face, not on scalp

There are very few militaries that don't have uniform and appearance standards and regulations.

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Of course, every military has regulations of some sort. However, the the actual regulations itself and the amount with which they are enforced tend to differ. Not only that, but aside from the times we did see certain regulations enforced, we've also seen a large amount of cases where strange or unpractical haircuts and improper uniforms have been allowed in Starfleet. As such, ascribing the regulations of a current-day military to Starfleet seems a bit strange.

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You said "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like". I proved that to be false. Then you claim starfleet had no uniform and appearance standards. I pointed out that they do and we've seen them enforced several times. Seeing some one with adaptations to their starfleet uniform or hair style does not mean there are no regulations. Waivers were made for people like Scotti, Worf, Ro .. ect. So anyone we see in the background who appears to be out of uniform, obviously the character has had such issues wavered in regard to either their religion or cultural tradition. That is something that happens in today's military to an extent in non combat environments.

The point is : You have no argument.

Seeing someone who is slightly out of uniform does not mean that the orginaziton for which they wear the uniform is not military.

You said "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like". I proved that to be false.

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No, I said "not every military has as many haircut rules, nor is as strict with them as the US military". Seeing as Starfleet is not the US military, those rules would, in all likelyhood, not apply. You also proved only that the US military had certain rules, that does not discount my argument that not every military on this planet has the same rules or regulations, and by extension, that you shouldn't expect something like Starfleet to, if it is a type of military.

Then you claim starfleet had no uniform and appearance standards. I pointed out that they do and we've seen them enforced several times.

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We have also seen that regularly, any appearance standards (we weren't talking about uniforms, but about haircuts) were not enforced. Even from episode to episode. Thus there is no basis in that argument if you only count those shots that support your views, and discount all others.

Seeing someone who is slightly out of uniform does not mean that the orginaziton for which they wear the uniform is not military.

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You said it yourself; that is a discussion that has been going on for a long while. As such, I did not continue it. Trying to start it up again, because you think your argument is more valid then mine, is silly. Start a new thread for that.

It's been said, referred to, implied, admitted, alluded to and outright blatantly spoken, several times that Starfleet is military.

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I don't agree. However, even it Starfleet were military, the military usually lets haircuts be as you like, unless it impacts performance. Not every country expects their military officers to have short cut or shaven scalps.

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No, I said "not every military has as many haircut rules, nor is as strict with them as the US military".

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You lie. "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like" is clearly in your post.

Seeing as Starfleet is not the US military, those rules would, in all likelyhood, not apply. You also proved only that the US military had certain rules, that does not discount my argument that not every military on this planet has the same rules or regulations, and by extension, that you shouldn't expect something like Starfleet to, if it is a type of military.

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No one is saying that Starfleet is U.S. military. We're only stating that it is military. The example I gave of the U.S. UCMJ was to show that your statement, that "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like" was incorrect. I'm not 'expecting' Starfleet to have the same standards. I'm simply pointing out that, by what has been shown on screen, it's fairly obvious that Starfleet has similar uniform and appearance standards.

We have also seen that regularly, any appearance standards (we weren't talking about uniforms, but about haircuts) were not enforced. Even from episode to episode. Thus there is no basis in that argument if you only count those shots that support your views, and discount all others.

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If you haven't seen them enforced then you obviously don't pay enough attention. There are scenes in Star Trek that address both the uniform and appearance standards. That is my point. And yes, hair has been addressed on Star Trek. You contradict yourself by implying that since you believe Starfleet to be without uniform and appearance standards similar to those that exist in today's military, clearly it isn't military. Then you say that not all militaries have the same standards. Then you say that it doesn't matter anyway because Starfleet isn't military, but in case they are it doesn't matter since different militaries have different standards. The facts remain that Star Trek has shown on screen that there are certain uniform and appearance standard and that Starfleet is military organization and that many of the characters have referred to themselves as soldier. That is the point.

The comment was made that the hairstyles on Star Trek sometimes look bland and conformist. To which I replied that it wasn't strange since hairstyle is usually part of a uniform. You then made the comment that hairstyle is usually only part of a military uniform and that Starfleet is not military. You were wrong on both parts.

Yes, Starfleet is military. It has been acknowledged and shown on screen that Starfleet is military. Anyone who says that it hasn't obviously hasn't been paying attention all these years. Also, hairstyle is not just part of a military uniform. It is also sometimes part of many other uniforms including Police, Some paramedics services, some Fireman units, some professional sports teams, some styles of prize fighting, and many more.

You are wrong on both counts, you contradict yourself, and you have no argument.

My original point, that which eludes you, is that the "bland and conformist" hairstyles shown on Star Trek are not surprising considering that hairstlye is usually part of a uniform.

You lie. "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like" is clearly in your post.

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I do not lie, since I said "the military". As in, "the military in my country". I'm not based in the US, as the text besides my posts clearly state.

The rest is all semantics. I don't think Starfleet is military, but that is a different discussion. We've seen examples of haircut regulations being enforced, and we've seen examples of it being overlooked. That does not mean I need to "pay more attention".

In essense; my point is this: We've seen all sorts of crazy hairstyles on Star Trek; nothing bland about them at all. If they were, you'd have a point. But they aren't, they are often strange.

You lie. "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like" is clearly in your post.

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I do not lie, since I said "the military". As in, "the military in my country". I'm not based in the US, as the text besides my posts clearly state.

The rest is all semantics. I don't think Starfleet is military, but that is a different discussion. We've seen examples of haircut regulations being enforced, and we've seen examples of it being overlooked. That does not mean I need to "pay more attention".

In essense; my point is this: We've seen all sorts of crazy hairstyles on Star Trek; nothing bland about them at all. If they were, you'd have a point. But they aren't, they are often strange.

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I'm not the one who said they were bland. So that isn't my point to make. I said that it wasn't suprising to see bland or conformist hairstyles on Star Trek.

And claiming you didn't say what you actually said is considered lying.

And claiming you didn't say what you actually said is considered lying.

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There you go again; re-read my post. I said exactly what I said, which was "the military" and, after that I said "not every military is the same". You said it yourself. And, seeing as I'm not from the US, I was clearly not talking about the US military. I could have been more clear on the point, by describing it differently, but I thought you'd understand that.

And claiming you didn't say what you actually said is considered lying.

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There you go again; re-read my post. I said exactly what I said, which was "the military" and, after that I said "not every military is the same". You said it yourself. And, seeing as I'm not from the US, I was clearly not talking about the US military. I could have been more clear on the point, by describing it differently, but I thought you'd understand that.

I don't think Starfleet really has much rules regarding to how one should wear one's hair given the multitude of different hairdos we see during the show. It wouldn'be practical anyway because not all of starfleet is human and not all aliens can be expected to wear their hair the same way.

I always had the impression that Starfleet is pretty relaxed in that way. Yes, Starfleet has rules on uniform (ensign Ro and the story about whether she was permitted to wear the earing or not) but captains and commanders seem to allow considerable leeway when it comes to those rules (Troi's Uniform, Worf's sash, Ro's earring, O'Briens sleeves rolled up etc)

There are very few militaries that don't have uniform and appearance standards and regulations.

Click to expand...

Of course, every military has regulations of some sort. However, the the actual regulations itself and the amount with which they are enforced tend to differ. Not only that, but aside from the times we did see certain regulations enforced, we've also seen a large amount of cases where strange or unpractical haircuts and improper uniforms have been allowed in Starfleet. As such, ascribing the regulations of a current-day military to Starfleet seems a bit strange.

Click to expand...

You said "the military usually lets haircuts be as you like". I proved that to be false. Then you claim starfleet had no uniform and appearance standards. I pointed out that they do and we've seen them enforced several times. Seeing some one with adaptations to their starfleet uniform or hair style does not mean there are no regulations. Waivers were made for people like Scotti, Worf, Ro .. ect. So anyone we see in the background who appears to be out of uniform, obviously the character has had such issues wavered in regard to either their religion or cultural tradition. That is something that happens in today's military to an extent in non combat environments.

The point is : You have no argument.

Seeing someone who is slightly out of uniform does not mean that the orginaziton for which they wear the uniform is not military.

I don't get head shaving. It always makes the person look older and more boring.

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Not at all. And actually, it definitely has the opposite effect if the guy is already balding. Who do you think looks younger, stronger and sexier: a balding guy, or a guy with a shaved head? And even when they are not balding, some men just don't look that great with hair, and head shaving only makes them look more striking and more badass. Compare Michael Jordan with and without hair. Avery Brooks is another good example.