Notice the slope of IRMB is greater overall than the other two with a minimal drop at the gap.

The slope of the PMOD is ~flat prior to the gap and ~matches the ACRIM after with no drop at the gap.

The slope of ACRIM ~matches PMOD but with a significant drop at the gap.

That's because ACRIM doesn't use the ERBE/ERBS data... hence the fluctuations. PMOD uses it during the ACRIM Gap, and they didn't correct the fact that the TSI slope during this timeframe doesn't match up with the higher resolution and better quality measurements like NIMBUS7 and ERB. That's the reason for the flat line, since the ordinate is a measurement of the difference of the original ERBE data and the corrected composite. PMOD did not correct for the fact that the ERBE/ERBS measurements significantly deviated from all of the other measurements. The ERBE/ERBS satellite was clearly going through degredation with the slope not matching up with any of the other measurements, giving PMOD its flat line in TSI over the last 30 years.

I would question his calculations on the warming attribute to TSI since his is the highest of the three composites.

Well I think he gave a fair assesment on the relative solar attributation if you use all three datasets.

That's why this discrepency needs to be fully resolved, so that attributation can become easier. 70% and 15% for the Solar Contribution to the late-20th Century warming, using the ACRIM and PMOD datasets respectively is a very big difference. A difference that needs to get resolved before anyone can say the "science is settled."

Notice the slope of IRMB is greater overall than the other two with a minimal drop at the gap.

The slope of the PMOD is ~flat prior to the gap and ~matches the ACRIM after with no drop at the gap.

The slope of ACRIM ~matches PMOD but with a significant drop at the gap.

That's because ACRIM doesn't use the ERBE/ERBS data... hence the fluctuations. PMOD uses it during the ACRIM Gap, and they didn't correct the fact that the TSI slope during this timeframe doesn't match up with the higher resolution and better quality measurements like NIMBUS7 and ERB.

The previous measurements do not match up with the "higher resolution and better quality measurements" either, thus the drop.

If the data is so much "higher resolution and better qualtiy measurements" why is the slope so similar and yet have a drop that has to have a manipulation in order to overcome?

Quote:

That's the reason for the flat line, since the ordinate is a measurement of the difference of the original ERBE data and the corrected composite. PMOD did not correct for the fact that the ERBE/ERBS measurements significantly deviated from all of the other measurements. The ERBE/ERBS satellite was clearly going through degredation with the slope not matching up with any of the other measurements, giving PMOD its flat line in TSI over the last 30 years.

You mean the same flat line as the ACRIM? You do know what a slope indicates right? Compare the two slopes and you see very similar "flat lines".

_________________With friends like Guido, you will not have enemies for long.

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I would question his calculations on the warming attribute to TSI since his is the highest of the three composites.

Well I think he gave a fair assesment on the relative solar attributation if you use all three datasets.

That's why this discrepency needs to be fully resolved, so that attributation can become easier. 70% and 15% for the Solar Contribution to the late-20th Century warming, using the ACRIM and PMOD datasets respectively is a very big difference. A difference that needs to get resolved before anyone can say the "science is settled."

Not really if you look at the warmest years, which have mostly been after 2000 when there is supposed to be less energy input.

_________________With friends like Guido, you will not have enemies for long.

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That does not sound good at all. If the malware was the reason for the crash and it is still there, the next crash will not be far off. Not to mention the possible infected computers logging on.

_________________With friends like Guido, you will not have enemies for long.

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The previous measurements do not match up with the "higher resolution and better quality measurements" either, thus the drop.

If the data is so much "higher resolution and better qualtiy measurements" why is the slope so similar and yet have a drop that has to have a manipulation in order to overcome?

The measurements by ERBE/ERBS do not agree with the better measurements by NIMBUS7 and ERB during the ACRIM gap, hence the difference in the ACRIM, IRMB and PMOD datasets during the ACRIM Gap, because PMOD uses ERBE data and ACRIM uses NIMBUS 7/ERB data.

There is no "manipulation."

Quote:

You mean the same flat line as the ACRIM? You do know what a slope indicates right? Compare the two slopes and you see very similar "flat lines".

TSI increased SUBSTANTIALLY between the minima of SC 21 and 22 on ACRIM, which could explain most of the warming over the last 30 years if ACRIM is right. Then TSI decreased and we stopped warming, so comparing the differences between SC 21 and 22 is better for Solar Attributation than SC 21-23, because the temperatures did not rise during the timeframe beyond SC 21-22.

The previous measurements do not match up with the "higher resolution and better quality measurements" either, thus the drop.

If the data is so much "higher resolution and better qualtiy measurements" why is the slope so similar and yet have a drop that has to have a manipulation in order to overcome?

The measurements by ERBE/ERBS do not agree with the better measurements by NIMBUS7 and ERB during the ACRIM gap, hence the difference in the ACRIM, IRMB and PMOD datasets during the ACRIM Gap, because PMOD uses ERBE data and ACRIM uses NIMBUS 7/ERB data.

There is no "manipulation."

There IS a manipulation in the ACRIM dataset, which is based around a model to merge the ACRIM I and II.

The gap is NOT the issue, but the abnrmally higher ACRIM I before the gap and abnormally lower ACRIM II data after the gap.

Quote:

You mean the same flat line as the ACRIM? You do know what a slope indicates right?

Compare the two slopes and you see very similar "flat lines".

Quote:

TSI increased SUBSTANTIALLY between the minima of SC 21 and 22 on ACRIM, which could explain most of the warming over the last 30 years if ACRIM is right. Then TSI decreased and we stopped warming, so comparing the differences between SC 21 and 22 is better for Solar Attributation than SC 21-23, because the temperatures did not rise during the timeframe beyond SC 21-22.

If you look at the graphs the ACRIM is the ONLY composite showing that increase, which makes it less supported than you claim.

_________________With friends like Guido, you will not have enemies for long.

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Abstract A possible long-term trend of the total solar irradiance could be a natural cause for climate variations on Earth. Measurement of the total solar irradiance with space radiometers started in 1978. We present a new total solar irradiance composite, with an uncertainty of ± 0.35 W m−2. From the minimum in 1995 to the maximum in 2002 the total solar irradiance increased by 1.6 W m−2. In between the minima of 1987 and 1995 the total solar irradiance increased by 0.15 W m−2.

So IRMB between SC 21 and 22 is -0.20 w/m^2-0.50 w/m^2 with a median range of 0.15 w/m^2. That is not "not increasing."

In addition, the power during SC 21 was lower for a significantly longer period of time than the power during SC 22, so that would also have implications on the increase between the minimas not mentioned in the abstract.

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Last edited by Snowy123 on Tue Mar 20, 2012 9:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.