The Looming Lockout — and What It Means for the Warriors

When the opening proposal of your upcoming labor negotiations is described by one source as “just a photocopy of [Commissioner David] Stern’s middle finger,” you may be on your way to a lockout. The NBA is in the midst of one of its busiest off-seasons ever, but we should enjoy the activity while it lasts. With the collective bargaining agreement — the governing document for player and owner relations — once again up for negotiation next summer, the 2011 off-season may be an extended vacation. Here’s how the key issues in play might be shaping the Warriors’ current decisions.

We’ve spent the last month breaking down the Warriors’ transactions and, with a new ownership group in charge, looking for shifts in strategy. Other than the David Lee sign-and-trade (more on that below), there’s been a focus on short, cheap contracts. Some of that is a matter of necessity — the Warriors were largely capped out and working with exceptions — but there has been speculating that the restraint also may have been motivated by a desire to clear cap space for next summer. I still think that’s a plausible line to draw through the dots of recent transactions, but there’s an alternative explanation.

On July 1, 2011, the collective bargaining agreement between players and owners will expire. Unless certain provisions have been put in place, the owners will lock the doors to the gyms — and the direct deposits into players’ bank accounts will stop. There’s some cushion built into the schedule for brinkmanship, as nothing much happens in July that couldn’t happen in August or early September, but as the season creeps closer, the pressure on both sides to work out a deal will increase. Right now, both sides are digging in — and there’s good reason to believe the dramatic changes being discussed will lead to a drawn out dispute.

At the risk of gross over-simplification, the owners are entering these negotiations looking to cut costs — with many NBA teams allegedly losing tens of millions of dollars annually — while the players are looking to hold onto their current earning power. These opposing forces will play out through a few issues:

Advertisement

Adjustment of basketball related income (“BRI”) — the money made by the NBA through various league-wide sources (such as television contracts and gate receipts) is called “basketball related income.” The NBA salary cap is set by taking a certain percentage of this figure, then dividing it by 30 teams (see Larry Coon, as usual, for the details). The owners are looking to adjust that figure so the cap is set at a lower percentage of BRI. In short, they want more of the money the NBA makes — and want to give players less of it. The sides line up predictably in this fight — the owners are all in favor, the players are all opposed.

Implementation of a hard cap — Right now the NBA has a “soft” cap, full of exceptions and loop holes, along with a luxury tax, which teams may choose to pay if they want to spend above a certain figure. This system was originally designed to encourage parity by limiting what teams can pay players, but has been carved up in increasingly player friendly ways to allow owners to go above the cap and hasn’t stopped rich owners from simply paying the tax to buy top talent. The NBA’s middle class is disappearing because the rich keep getting richer. To stop a spending race among the richest teams to be competitive — and to clamp down on rising player salaries — many of the owners favor a hard cap. This simplification would do away with the luxury tax and most (if not all) exceptions in favor of a system that simply allows teams to spend $x on their rosters. The owners all generally favor this, but it’s a lot more attractive to the poor teams or small market teams than the rich ones because it sets definite limits on what can be spent to make a team competitive. The players are almost universally opposed to it, as it would limit what superstars could make through exceptions like Bird rights as well as drive down the money teams may be willing to spend on marginal players.

Lower salaries and shorter deals– Although the NBA is about to see the final mega-deals of the early part of the decade expire, there’s still a perception that salaries are too high and deals too long. Getting rid of guaranteed deals is likely too radical a proposal to ever get adopted fully — although I’m sure it’ll be tossed around next summer. More likely changes are the lowering of max salary amounts and the shortening of the allowable contract length. These measures will essentially “save owners from themselves,” but will also have a depressive effect on salaries overall within the NBA. The owners almost universally support these changes, but the players’ opposition varies between high and low salary players. The high salary guys have the most to lose, while the lower salary players are less likely to see a significant change in their compensation (and are also less willing to go without a paycheck for a year to fight for whatever that marginal amount may be).

Taken as a package, the owners are likely to push for a lower cap with fewer loopholes and player contracts that are cheaper and shorter. If these changes come to pass, the remnants of the old system may alter the power dynamic of the NBA. For example:

A lower cap means “legacy” max deals — deals from the old system — will chew up more cap space than before. And the presence of a hard cap, if it gets put in place, will give those teams fewer ways to build around whatever contract is taking up space. That means that huge deals of ineffective players will be an even bigger drag on team performance. The Warriors have three long, expensive deals on the books past this season — Lee, Ellis and Biedrins — but the potentially disastrous deals of players likely to see their performance fall off while they’re at their most expensive (Jackson, Maggette) have been shipped away.

Cap space in 2011 and beyond will allow teams to capitalize on savings under the new CBA. There might not be a ton of top-tier free agents next off season, but the ones that are available will be signed under the new CBA. Although teams spent freely this summer, they may suddenly find that the value scale for players has dramatically shifted under the new CBA. By holding off on spending for a year, the Warriors can make sure they sign players based on the new value scale. It’s essentially like waiting on a real estate bubble to burst — by staying out of the market for a year, the Warriors may end up getting better deals. This is compounded by the fact that a shrinking cap may tie the hands of lots of other teams, decreasing competition for the free agents in the summer of 2011 and further driving down their prices.

When you consider the nightmare scenario — a year-long lockout — there could be a mega-free-agency period in the summer of 2012 with two years’ worth of free agents hitting the market. By my understanding (and someone please correct me if I’m wrong), players don’t get paid during the lockout, but the terms of their contracts continue to run. Therefore, someone with a deal ending in the summer of 2012 (say, Charlie Bell) might not get paid for the 11-12 season, but his contract will still end at the scheduled time. For the Warriors, this would allow them to hit pause on any deals that expire at the end of next season (say, Brandan Wright) — then wait a year for the labor situation to sort itself out — and choose from two years of free agents in reassembling the team. Lee, Ellis, Biedrins, Wright, Curry and Udoh would still be under contract — the rest of the roster would be up for grabs. The same principle about capped out teams holds here as well — squads like Lakers, Mavs and Heat would almost certainly be capped out under a lower figure and less able to utilize exceptions to round out their squads. On the other hands, teams without much long-term salary commitment will have room to sign current free agents to much more affordable deals. The Warriors would be closer to the latter category than the former.

After all of Cohan’s picks-for-cash and trade-exception-pocketing practices, the last thing Warriors fans want to hear is more about cutting costs. This year, however, it’s not just in the interest of lining the owner’s pockets. If the CBA negotiations of 2011 end up being as contentious as people expect, the meek could suddenly inherit the League — or at least the post-lockout free agents. A lot hinges on how the compromises are brokered, what other restrictions are put in place (on player movement, for example, to compensate for the potential loss of Bird rights), what amnesty is given for prior deals, and how much sway the wealthy players have over the less wealthy to get them to hold a hard and fast line against the owners. Regardless of the outcome, the Warriors are in decent shape. They’ve shed two of their worst deals in the past year (although taking on the Lee deal may come back to haunt them) and have rounded out the team with short-term, cheap deals. They still need to add talent to be competitive, but Larry Riley — to his credit — has done a decent job clearing some room for that rebuilding. I’m not sure he’s the one to make talent judgments when it comes time to add players, but he’s filled out his resume when it comes to dumping them.

Ultimately, as an amateur capologist, the remaking of the CBA holds a certain amount of excitement. As a basketball fan, however, a lost season would be exactly that — a loss. But as a blogger, the lockout is a terrifying prospect. It’s hard enough to fill a four-month off-season with posts, let alone an entire year.

Adam Lauridsen

Post navigation

I might be the oddball here, not inviting agreement , but I enjoy some of the off topic posts on the 49ers, Giants, best sports movies, boxing and even some politics (the third rail of blogs I know)

I really enjoyed our discussions on soccer and the World Cup and whether soccer players are great athletes, and especially appreciated BG coming around a little bit on the sport and the athletes.

So put me down as someone who doesn’t mind and even appreciates some of the non W basketballl posts, especially during the summer months when at times there isn’t much W news to discuss.

The Oracle

BG
Holmes was unlucky that he never really had that big name star opponent to challenge him. He fought everyone, beat everyone, but there was no great challenger during his reign. He may be very underrated because people don’t talk about him when the talk about the great champions, but I think that’s because he didn’t beat anyone really great in their prime.

The Oracle

slimman,

“I am also concerned that these guys do not have the $$ to compete as owners, and will end up running the team on the Cohan bargain train, while managing that process more competently.”

That’s exactly how I feel. I was shocked to hear Lacob imply he wouldn’t pay the lux tax.

All non lux tax team lost in the 1st round last playoffs, beaten by teams paying the tax, except Atlanta a non tax team beating the Bucks, another non tax team. Every tax paying team beat the non tax paying playoff team EVERY time they matched up, with no exceptions.

At lesst last season, there was a direct correlation between paying the tax and advancing in the playoffs. Teams that were lux tax payers moved ahead, and won in the playoffs.

The Hawks were the only non tax paying team to advance to the 2nd round. And again, they beat another non tax team to make it that far.

It’s pretty conclusive you need to be a tax payer to win. If Lacob and Guber won’t or can’t pay it, we’re going no further than the 1st round of the playoffs unless we get very lucky. Or unless Lacob and Guber are smarter than all the other owners trying to get into the playoffs and win there.

slimman

Adam, as a long-time participant in this blog is it out of line to ask you to do something about Meir and his ilk? I know you would like the community to regulate itself, but I can’t help but ask at this point, as asking as a fellow participant has been ignored.

CURSE OF MULLIN

Wow, that’s more boxing info than I’ve seen in one place in 20 yrs. I thought boxing was dead? Are you guys up on Roller Derby, too?

CURSE OF MULLIN

I think Meir’s wife bought him Dragon voice recog software for his birthday.

meir34

397 There is no difference. My position on Curry has never been negative. I’ve rarely seen a rookiie I wouldn’t make the same kinds of observations about if people were ready as you put it annoint him messiah. Anyway fairy dust to blind people from making or being able to make accurate descriptions of someone, not all parts of which are fan-crazed mega-hype, isn’t my style.

From day one, I’ve said, when he was missing his shots, that I wasn’t in the least worried, that he’d come around with that and he had one of the nicest strokes I’ve seen. Late in the season he showed some real cleverness, and in a way that I think will stand him in good stead throughout his carrer-and even allow a clever coach to build that skill into his play options-I’m speaking of how he uses the other team’s defenders to screen themselves out. He anticipates their slides moving through, under and around screens and also when coming over to help and he simply has them blocking each other out. I’m totally impressed, and jazzed by that. I’ve also noted that once he gets to the basket on his, I won’t call them drives, but moves to it, he has some very clever moves and shots. BTW, Mullins is the last player we’ve had to approach the basket that way.

Yet at the same time, because of the lack of a power drive Mully really didn’t do much drive and kick stuff and I am concerned if Curry doesn’t develop that power drive. I’d be even more concerned if Monta and to some extent, Williams weren’t on the team, because they can and do make those kind of drives–and, btw, the kickouts by those two aren’t just to the wing guys but also include Curry himself. Anyway that’s an important skill for a pg in our system and that hasn’t been a very strong area with Curry so far. This isn’t damning him forever. He doesn’t appear to have the blazing first step, speed or quickness of a Monta in his drives, but he can improve considerably. At least I hope so. Nellie told him to work on that and hopefully he has and has succeeded. But I won’t know that until I see him play. And if he hasn’t I’ll likely mention it again-it’s that important to my sense of a pg in this system. And his not getting to the line enough-being last among the better pgs from this draft in that category, is, I believe, a function of what I’m talking about in his drive. You drive more you get to the line more unless you are avoiding contact. Plain and simple. Note also that I several times emphasized in this system, because it is less important in a half court slower game. The deficiency wouldn’t be as noticeable in a Detroit or even an Orlando with Howard down low all the time. Anyway I almost never fail to note his very good qualities even as I point out the areas he needs to improve. And I’m no groupie fan of any player, now or ever, so I don’t subscribe to the notion that on a basketball board for Warrior fans such comments are off limits. I might add, I’m very fond of his work ethics, as I wasn’t of Randolph’s. Ditto his attitude towards his coach. And following his coach’s advice. And while I don’t rank the latter as the most significant things to look for, they are important and I don’t fail to notice them in Curry.

I don’t think I’ve deviated from this kind of Curry analysis, unless maybe in some exchange with people of the like Curry=Hate Monta crowd and I should avoid answering those or even trying to dialogue with them.

Now it’s time for some Meir is a Liar nonsense from some semi-literate alter ego. So be it. Twisted Sister??

The Oracle

Steve Nash doesn’t have a power drive either, but it doesn’t seem to hurt his running of the team and if you watch him, he is constantly getting into the paint, almost every possession, but he doesn’t finish at the rim that often, but he does finish at the rim. It’s just not a straight line, fake one way, go the other, one or two dribbles from the 3 pt line and finish at the rim type move.

That said, I do think Curry has the ability to add a more explosive move to his arsenal. Right now he manages with quick changes of direction.

The Oracle

Alan Greenspan today speaking truh to the Republican “just give all the money to the wealthy and everything will work out fine for everyone else” theory of vodoo economics

In an interview on NBC’s “Meet the Press,” Greenspan expressed his disagreement with the conservative argument that tax cuts essentially pay for themselves by generating revenue and productivity among recipients.

“They do not,” said Greenspan.

And for those that enjoy politics, here’s Reagans own former budget director talking about the lunacy of current conservatives wanting to extend the bush tax cuts to the wealthiest americans:

“The second unhappy change in the American economy has been the extraordinary growth of our public debt. In 1970 it was just 40 percent of gross domestic product, or about $425 billion. When it reaches $18 trillion, it will be 40 times greater than in 1970. This debt explosion has resulted not from big spending by the Democrats, but instead the Republican Party’s embrace, about three decades ago, of the insidious doctrine that deficits don’t matter if they result from tax cuts.”

Stop the insanity. End the Bush tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans.

dr_john

It’s a Warriors’ blog.

If you want to dilute it, or destroy it, with all this crap, go ahead.

It’s not a Bay Area blog. If you want to talk Giants, A’s, Niners, Sharks, Napa wineries and Grateful Dead—go right ahead.

If you really want to really REALLY FUCK IT UP REAL GOOD then just keep up with the Christian-Jew and Republican-Democrat SHIT. KEEP IT UP.

Here’s how it feels: like looking forward to the Warriors’ game in February or March and having KNBR co-opt it for a Giants’ pre-season game.

It’s a lousy, juvenile treatment of history. Let’s really blow up the blog with about 58,000 Vietnam deaths.

Forget income tax.
Forget the Federal Reserve Act.
Let the courts decide what language means.
You don’t own shit anyway. Why should you care?

You got big points to prove, to someone, somewhere, someday.

No one owns anything. Fuck those Allodium Freehold Estate kooks. They don’t look like you or think like you—take their shit away.
There is no Citizen Bar.

Crikey—that went out like, in 1984.

Word

Farms in Berkeley? OK I’ll concede that it has been a bit slow on the BB news so OK if anything is exceptionable here then let’s go:
Giants =Good
Dodgers= Sh** ( time for a sweep)
A’s = ok
49s = looking better ( hope they go 9-7 or10-6)
Raiders= I don’t know…. does anybody?
Warriors = on the way back, if our new owners have to money to play with the big boys
CBA= trouble
NBA players Salaries= out of control
NBA Owners in good markets profits= out of control, in bad markets =contraction
Meir=out of control
JSL = I’m not him Meir, But I wish I had his Basketball knowledge
Being in control=not insulting others
Adam=(my wish that he could get a position in the Warriors Front office)
loved Ali, (Sugar) Ray Leonard,Julio Cesar Chavez, 75 warriors playoff against Bullets, run TMC, Dr J, JRich, Joe Montana, Bird+Magic, (hated the Lakers)
Love this board(been a lurker for years)
Hate the Hate ( but understand the who’s and why’s)
Can’t wait for the season to start with hope that we will finally see a new coach ( not a big Nellie fan lately)

Forget the lies, the name-calling, the inordinate silliness. This stupidity says it all.

Justafan

Does anyone here think that we a set at 3 or 5? If we could do a S+T for a really great 3 or 5 who do give up? If Nelson is our coach this year how many games will we win? Has there been a cover up on Ekpe Udohs injury? What is Curry’s assist to turn over ratio? Is Greg Pappa on his way back as an announcer for us this year?

Justafan

What does Peter Guber bring? More PR silliness? t-shirts and pizza or maybe some hot Hollywood Chicks? Can we build a winner with in the next 5 years? Where would the blog like the Warriors to play Oakland, SF maybe the SJ. Anybody that was unknown before summer camp likely to stick this year? Who knows about the best prospect in the D league who could help us?

Justafan

with a new CBA will there be a lux tax?

word

I can’t help about the shape I’m in
I can’t sing, I ain’t pretty and my legs are thin
But don’t ask me what I think of you
I might not give the answer that you want me to

Oh well

Now, when I talked to God I knew he’d understand
He said, “Stick by me and I’ll be your guiding hand
But don’t ask me what I think of you
I might not give the answer that you want me to”

Oh well

By Peter Green

Oh sorry Dr John, thought it was still ok BTW you are right I’ll now stop this nonsense

The Oracle

justafan,

Re Guber, I got nothing agains hot hollywood chicks. He can keep the pizza and the t shirts

Regarding lux tax, I’d say yes, because the owners are not going to get the players to agree to a hard cap so they will still need to have a penalty on owners who want to spend “too much”

word

Oracle, Does that mean we could be in for a long strike? Seems to me that the owners ( at least about half) really want a hard cap.

dr_john

justafan: brb

word: Farms in Berkeley? Is that from an ad campaign I remember from when I lived in the Bay Area, especially Crockett, from 1971 to 1976?

justafan: I think you have to accept, excepting some deal, that DWright and Radmanovic/Williams, if all healthy, will fill the SF minutes. If the dubs bring back Tolliver he will get minutes there, also. As presently constituted, given health, then Biedrins, Lee, and Gadzuric will hold the C minutes.

If the Grizz still have sincere interest in Monta, I would not rule out the trade: Monta (plus Gadzuric?) for Mayo (plus Thabeet+Henry?) Some combination. Others here have tried to tie this to Gasol and/or Biedrins.

I’ve seen comments: Mayo is not in Monta’s “class” as a player. No one with “half a brain” would do such a trade. My answer is just look at the numbers, and not just the salaries.

Mayo compares very favorably to Monta, just not quite as memorable, I guess. One thing is certain—it is NOT a one-sided decision.

The same is true for Thabeet. His rebound rate is not as good as Andris, but he gets to the line four times as often. He’s young, raw. They both would foul out in 40 minutes. But like DeAndre Jordan, he’s a potential beast in the wings. Many bloggers made fun of him because of his high draft position, but if you watched the games he is very athletic , and long, and (will be) strong.

Monta+Gadzuric for Mayo+Thabeet+Henry———-ok
Monta for Mayo+Thabeet————ok

No trade at all————–ok.

But Monta has a lot to prove, I think.

I’m not sure I want to wait, after what I’ve already seen.

The Oracle

ok justafan, I’ll do my part:

We are definitely not set at the 3 or 5.
IMO, we may not be set at the 2 either.
I’m very hopeful we are set at the 1 and 4.

If we need a great 3 or 5, we trade ME for one. And/or we keep our 13-14m of cap space until next summer and get the other one. Who? I like M Gasol at the 5. SF I like Melo. If we get lucky, both will be available for S&T or as free agents.

Nelson as coach we push for .500 ball, just miss or make the playoffs.

Udoh, no cover up. Curse of Mullin strikes again.

Curry’s A/TO is a very respectible 1.93.

Papa is coming back. I hope.

The Oracle

Yeah, but it’s too big a leap to go from this very soft cap to a hard cap.

Maybe they can get their in the next CBA, not this one.

I think that’s an opening position and they’ll settle for reducing the number of exemptions, making taking down some of the length and max on contracts.

If they insist on a hard cap, we’re in for a very long lockout imo. I don’t think they’ll be that stupid. I hope.

Word

You got It Dr John, kinda felt a bit silly not talking BB on this blog but with so much ( what does Al Oha call it) Blovating, Anti this pro that (which I don’t really mind) Punch counter punch Political Posturing I just felt like adding a bit of silliness. But I digress, Not really sold one way or another about Thabeet, I’ve tried my best to go to You tube and find out about Henry (didn’t we consider him for #6? I can’t remember, But the one I’d like to pry away from Memphis is Gasol, who seems like a stud

Mr. Joe Lacob have been very vocal about wanting this team to make this years playoffs BUT he is not willing to pay the luxury tax.
How in the world can this owners make this team be entertaining and at the same time be able to compete for the playoffs with only SCurry, DLee and MEllis spearheading this team?
Tell me about their bench but I’m sorry, Biedrins, Dorell Wright and whoelse? Those Dubs aren’t even sure if they are injury free to play.
Anyone who knows their BB, knows pretty well that you can’t compete on a shoe string budget in the NBA nowadays. I’m doubtful about this group of owners. They got to convince me first before I spend a penny for this franchise.

Adam Lauridsen

Hi all,

I understand it’s the off-season and actual basketball news is slow, but I’d once again like to urge everyone to stick to substantive discussions rather than personal attacks. I’d prefer the discussions be about Warriors basketball — this is a Warriors blog — but whatever you talk about, don’t get sucked into the cycle of name-calling and cheap shots. It drives away people who would otherwise participate in the conversations and make them more interesting.

I don’t moderate the discussions here (unless someone complains about a post violating the terms of service) so I rely on everyone acting like civilized adults. Sometimes that means not falling for the bait, however tempting or frustrating it may be. Anyway, I’ll hopefully have a new post up later this evening. Thanks as always for reading and for the discussions (even if they occasionally come undone).

rigged

Don Nelson was able to stay with this team and live quite well with his sucky successive season wins of 29 and 26 — and considering that the Fat Man is a LAME DUCK coach, does any one believes that Nelson will try to sweat for his remaining $6 million?? COME ON!!

AND the present ownership is talking about making the playoffs this year?? Must be joke…

Al Oha

After Nellie got his 2-year extension and things started to not go his way, he made some very erratic and irrational decisions. He got into disagreements with players and their agents.

It seemed to me that he was purposely doing things to get himself fired. And then, ala Larry Brown, he could collect the rest of his $12 million dollars without having to go through the hassle of actually coaching, owning up to his endgame mistakes, dealing with the media, answering questions, and justifying why they were losing.

Coaching takes alot out of a person. It demands energy. Especially when you have young talented but unfinished products coming from college, one and done. When you are 70 years old, most don’t have the energy, stamina, patience, enthusiasm, and hunger that a younger coach may have.

Nellie has had a long and semi-successful career. More ultimate success as a player than a coach. He has showed the NBA many things about offensive mismatches and using athletic players to upset a more traditional starting 5 in an uptempo game. He has come up with this style mostly because he hasn’t had the elite bigs to matchup. This has given him his best chance to win.

The problem is that he has come to rely on this style ONLY. That, and with his reputation, no talented young bigs WANT to play for him. Mostly for fear they will not be used as the main emphasis of scoring that they want to be. Nellie’s game promotes his guards to do most of the scoring.

Also PF’s do not want to come to GS and end up playing Center, which is Nellie’s MO. David Lee would much rather play PF than Center, I’m sure. With Udoh (another ROOKIE PF) injured and AB coming off a serious injury that severely limited his play last season, is Gadzuric ready for major minutes at the 5? Or are the W’s seriously counting on David Lee to play most of his minutes at center?

Throwing in Turiaf in the trade was NOT a good idea unless he isn’t healthy enough to contribute.

Winning meaningless games at the end of last season gained the W’s very little and cost them a minimum 5th pick in a 5 player draft. Cousins may be a head case and paired with the maniac on wheels, ‘Reke, will surely be a load for any coach to handle. But, a well-coached Cousins and a 2nd round Whiteside, sure would look good beefing up the Warrior’s frontcourt depth.

Nellie and Riley need to go along with Cohan and Rowell. Together, they all have effed up this team as they mismanaged capspace AND players as assets.

Al Oha

Re: topics discussed today.

BG, CoM, and G$ – How cool was it seeing Cain finally beat them Bums?
Love seeing the Giants playing as a team and SWEEPING L.A.

JSL – Wow, great story about your contact w/ ALI, back in the day. Truly the GREATEST, end of story. No other boxer, past OR present, even comes close.

Word – @410 WORD! @416, I watched Kenny Loggins sing that song just 5 weeks ago here in Hawaii. He joined my fave guitar player, Lee Ritenour and with Mick Fleetwood on drums, they all played together at Aloha Tower.

How great is it to see young talent on ALL the Bay Area teams? The future looks bright when you have elite talent like Timmy and Buster, Willis, VD, and Crabtree. And along with Curry and Lee, I hope Monta can assimilate his extraordinary talent and form a winning combination.

Al Oha

Meir @ #350 says, “As for my statement that I wasn’t sure Curry made the team any better than Monta did, I’ve already acknowledged that and gave my reasons for saying it. I’d repeat that anytime. It’s on this link above yet he continues on it. I get it JSL that you don’t agree. Your right, but mine too to have my position. And when a guy asks me why and I spell it out and those points are simply ignored and the charge and insult repeated, one wonders about brain function.”

But the original quote was @#197 where he said, “I don’t even know that I’d agree Curry makes the team better, though as the pg, he certainly has the potential to do so.”

Altogether a different line. This is the point JSL and I were trying to make when questioning Meir’s BB judgment. Yet, he morphs the obviously poor judgmental quote into an arguable one when he says, “that I wasn’t sure Curry made the team any better than Monta did.” Totally different.

One of the first exchanges I had with Meir was when he was rambling on about John Wooden and how he read in Jabbar’s book that Wooden calmly but firmly laid down the law re: Kareem’s hair. Meir even elaborated about wearing long afros and facial hair, etc. Then I pointed out it was Bill Walton who Wooden had the confrontation with about the length of his hair and provided a YouTube link. The video showed Wooden himself talking about telling Walton, after Bill said he had a right to wear his hair long. JW said, “Yes, Bill, you DO have that right, and we are gonna miss you.” Meir subsequently passed it off and said that it happened to Kareem too and that he read it in his book. I didn’t read the book, but did Wooden say the same thing to EVERY player who had long hair? I let it go.

I’ll just repeat what I said awhile back and most are discovering.
MEIR IS NOT A LIAR……………………

He’s just full of shit.

http://4coachinthehisrtoryoftheNBA jsl

AlOha: Q.E.D.

Al Oha

Damn, jsl, Latin acronyms, too?

“Sheer profundity”

David Crosby

http://testsonmysitegoods.com why testfing

Your place is fvalueble for me. Thanks!…

http://massivefacebookfans.com/ viagra for ladies

You want to remain very difficult until morning utilizing viagra in order to arschfick rape your canine friend? Would you for instance youngster mature?

http://www.shopsoccerjerseys.com Valeria Neale

Many trendy and fashion soccer jerseys are getting much cheaper than 7 years ago. And almot all the women can spot fake bags from

I am extremely inspired together with your writing skills and also with the format to your blog. Is that this a paid subject or did you customize it your self? Anyway stay up the nice quality writing, it is rare to look a great blog like this one today..

http://www.777onlinegames.com Rod Moscato

Awesome blog you have right here but I was wondering should you knew of any message boards that cover the same topics talked about in this article? I’d very like to become a part of group wherever I can get responses from other knowledgeable persons that share the same interest. If you have any suggestions, please enable me know. Bless you!

http://www.jukeboxalive.com/blog.php?blog_id=4589893 Zachariah Ervine

You made certain fine points there. I did a search on the subject matter and found the majority of folks will consent with your blog.

All these issues are the kinds which make the VOIP PBX based company telephones difficult to ignore. They have won a million hearts by their effectiveness. Yours could be the following one. Get in touch with a VOIP PBX or a Hosted PBX provider and feel the adjust, these business telephones carry in to your operations.

http://waduli.com/store/category/maternity/ Regine Nuncio

Can I just say what a aid to seek out someone who truly is aware of what theyre speaking about on the internet. You definitely know how one can convey a problem to gentle and make it important. More folks need to read this and understand this side of the story. I cant believe youre no more well-liked because you positively have the gift.

http://raischuscamplec357.tumblr.com/ Best World of Warcraft Gold Shop

I do trust all the concepts you have presented to your post. They’re really convincing and can certainly work. Nonetheless, the posts are very brief for newbies. May you please lengthen them a little from next time? Thank you for the post.

http://www.doink.com/users/profile/gaberrowland37 Mel Laber

I like the valuable info you provide in your articles. I will bookmark your blog in my and google bookmarks and check again here frequently. I’m quite sure I’ll learn plenty of new stuff right here! Best of luck for the next!