That's a good question. Maybe they aren't lessons. Maybe I just read too much Valve game design articles I created the thread in a bit of frustration, though a lot of my points hold. I just feel like when I play a game, that something challenging that is not the HIGHEST challenge should give the reward of learning something useful. The highest challenge should test the absolute limits of sense and skill. While Warlord silver(and priest silver blah) don't test the absolutely limits at all and at least warlord the solution felt straightforward, the execution of it was unpleasant and felt counter productive. On the other side it is true the tri-sword is a moderate easy mode for mid game so there is that.

The Avatar wrote:They are supposed to be lessons. They're dungeons designed to improve your skill with that class in a specific way (which is why I support class challenges for special and monster class).

Makes sense. I just wish it was a bit more intuitive in terms of figuring out what those lessons are. I felt like the deity puzzles did a good job of providing veiled hints but I'm just lost on some of the class challenges.

Speedball - I just had a thought! When were you doing warlord silver? It might've been significantly harder than intended because the warlord bonus for being below half hp simply doesn't work ATM. At least for me.

It's also a bit hard to notice for me, because it both has no tooltips, and since I gennerally start attackign monsters at full health i do maths based on my prebuff damage to see if I would manage to kill somehting.

Completed it on the 13th, so before the most recent update. I remember the low health damage buff working though I do seem to feel combat prediction was wonky. I haven't used the warlord since the new update.

I think it was broken even before the latest update, and Darvin commented upon it in the GoatBot Patch reception thread. I was expecting it to be fixed in the latest, but it either isn't or isn't completely. Or maybe when the devs were bugfixing they just hit the bug report thread, and this somehow wasn't reported. Or it wasn't obvious because it seemed all the bugs were due to the general combat prediction bugs at the time. Minutiae, I loves it, apparently.

Anyway, it seems to be bugged now, so I reported it. It's also telling that I've been kicking ass left and right with the warlord even though he was bugged, except telling of what I'm not sure. Either old broken cydstepp he is still using is still as broken as ever, or the ledger I've been using with him is silly, or god knows what.

The Warlord low on health bug is somewhat fixed. The bonus doesn't show in the calculated damage (number right of the green sword), but in the combat prediction (enemy health) it is applied. Attacking the enemy results in the later damage.

That is the experience I had last thursday. I by and large never look at the calculated damage next to the sword ever. Too many things effect it for it to ever be a useful number. I am fairly certain the timeline does not take the buff into account because I remember times where it would it would take 3 hits suddenly turning to just 1 hit left after I attacked.

Ok, you're both right - there's no character portrait icon for the "below half hp buff", and the only place where it's noted is in the predictions.

Anyway, I just did Warlord Silver and... It wasn't really much harder than Hex ruins. Come to think of it, I found it easier. To do the Unlikely Heroes: Swamp in there I had to locker the Viper Ward and prep it every time, which is simply not the case here. The goat revenants go down to PISSORF and don't poison you, so I managed it almost faithless (I did grab Consensus + Potion XP pact for the boss fight). Prepping the thieves subdungeon is also the optimal move (2 revenants fewer, more blackspace), and I went for an Orc to synegrize with the bonus. I also scored a fine sword.

It was tricky in the same way Hex is tricky, but the boss isn't too hard on his own, and you can probably leave a revenant or two alive even (I left 1).

On the other hand, I seem to be some sort of pro (even though a bunch of guys consistently score better on all sort of stuff). Has to be taken into account, I guess.