Happy Hours:Tatsuma: This morning, Israel sent 117 trucks, hundreds of tons of humanitarian help, in order to alleviate the suffering of civilians suffering in Gaza.

Just because we want to stop Hamas from hurting our civilians doesn't mean we want to hurt theirs.

Ah the suffering of civilians suffering. Are you very redundant very often when you're being redundant?

Sorry, it's late here and I've been drinking.

And for some reason I get the feeling that this isn't just going to be the usual skirmish that regularly takes place between Israel and her neighbors. Maybe it is - Seriously, ask any average American about this situation. If they're even aware of it their reaction will probably be Hamas or Hezbollah are lobbing rockets at Israel and Israel is retaliating? So what's new? (That is if they don't have to have Hamas explained to them).

I will admit that I'm not very informed but what does Hamas hope to gain by lobbing rockets into Israel? Do they have any sort of reasonable demands that could be addressed? Or is their stance simply that Israel should cease to exist? Seems like a horribly naive question to ask, but it's probably one which should be answered before we move on to the more complicated questions.

Hamas has a list of demands. As does Israel. Neither have indicated a willingness to compromise. Neither demands are realistic.

ReverendJasen:There's nothing false about it. It wouldn't matter *why* they were doing it. If they killed Americans, we'd bomb the fark out of them. We would not give them a pass because they were treated badly.

Hamas has a list of demands. As does Israel. Neither have indicated a willingness to compromise. Neither demands are realistic.

I'm starting to wonder if it's practical for Israel to keep up the blockade given Hamas already has a friendly-ish government in Egypt and tunnels for the more illegal stuff. It would seem like one could use that as a bargaining chip in the short term at least.

Mrs.Sharpier:Ya, I don't have much to contribute other than to say every single one of my Israeli friends on facebook oppose bibi. Paying attention to the troll in this thread is akin to tuning into Glen Beck... He's not a representative of progressive Israelis

Alexander the Great wrote about the warring tribes of the middle east. These groups hate each other & have done so for thousands of years. It is going to take a lot more time & evolution for that hatred to disappear. Until then, they will continue to try to wipe each other off the planet.

//its not about politics or land or military attacks-they are just excuses to perpetuate hatred towards each other

thamike:BigBooper: I didn't read most of the Derp, so I'm sure this has been posted. But what do you think we would do if the drug cartels were firing rockets from Mexico into the United States? How the fark would we have any problem with our military attacking launch sites, rocket factories and storage sites, and the leaders of the attacks?

I doubt the US would bombard, invade, occupy, marginalize and continuously co-antagonize all of Mexico and most of Central America, while calling the president of Mexico a "leader of a terrorist organization" because of it.

Happy Hours:I will admit that I'm not very informed but what does Hamas hope to gain by lobbing rockets into Israel? Do they have any sort of reasonable demands that could be addressed? Or is their stance simply that Israel should cease to exist? Seems like a horribly naive question to ask, but it's probably one which should be answered before we move on to the more complicated questions.

This is actually an interesting question. The timing of this is awfully curious. It's worthwhile to note that Israel has early domestic elections, and have deliberately antagonized the Palestinians before. It's also worthwhile to note that Abbas - head of the PLO government in West Bank - is making a UN resolution on Nov 29th to recognize Palestine as a state. (This is a vote upon which no country carries veto power). Israel does NOT want Abbas to do this, and Hamas has no reason to see their opposition in West Bank succeed to such a credible degree.Then there's all the usual things that Palestinians want, like human rights and freedoms.

RIGHT, SO, everyone talks about upper atmosphere nuke based EMP weapons as being this radiation free awesome endgame? why not detonate one right above TelAviv/Jerusalem/Nazareth and fry-out all the electronic and electrical devices in the whole region. this would nix most weapons, cnn, twitter, etc... making the Holy Land truly Holy again.

I_Love_Cheesecake:Nice to see our favourite pro-Israel shill out in full force this fine Sunday morning.

Nothing like shooting fish in a barrel (eg., Gaza), eh IDF?

People like you make it so easy to believe Tatsuma in threads like this. It must be daunting for you, when he's coming out swinging with all of this inconvenient "information" and "facts," and all you have are personal attacks, metaphors, and hyperbole. Amos Quito must hate your sort for making his side of things look like a bunch of hormonal, shiat-talking middle-schoolers.

Again, there is plenty of blame to go around, but if you supporters of oppression want to pretend there are two states fighting here with similar arms and tactics, you are delusional. Israel has already killed 10 times as many Palestinians, and they are just getting started. Talk about your overreach, grow the fark up and work out a peace plan already.

This whole idea that Palestine should just leave them alone and get along in peace totally ignores the open-air prison in which the Palestinians live. This can't go on forever, and holding these people responsible for shiat that happened two or three or ten generations ago is barbaric. Israel is holding all the cards here, if they wanted peace they could have had it. I just hope that after the humanitarian crisis that Israel creates, they don't start WWIII.

BigNumber12:I_Love_Cheesecake: Nice to see our favourite pro-Israel shill out in full force this fine Sunday morning.

Nothing like shooting fish in a barrel (eg., Gaza), eh IDF?

People like you make it so easy to believe Tatsuma in threads like this. It must be daunting for you, when he's coming out swinging with all of this inconvenient "information" and "facts," and all you have are personal attacks, metaphors, and hyperbole. Amos Quito must hate your sort for making his side of things look like a bunch of hormonal, shiat-talking middle-schoolers.

Israeli propaganda /= facts

Seriously, if they civilians didn't want to die they just would go somewhere else, right? They have all the power and freedom to do that don't they?

BigNumber12:I_Love_Cheesecake: Nice to see our favourite pro-Israel shill out in full force this fine Sunday morning.

Nothing like shooting fish in a barrel (eg., Gaza), eh IDF?

People like you make it so easy to believe Tatsuma in threads like this. It must be daunting for you, when he's coming out swinging with all of this inconvenient "information" and "facts," and all you have are personal attacks, metaphors, and hyperbole. Amos Quito must hate your sort for making his side of things look like a bunch of hormonal, shiat-talking middle-schoolers.

Yes, Tatsuma is such a respected member of the Fark community, who always convinces people to his point of view.

ginandbacon:BronyMedic: ginandbacon: Tats, 13 children are dead. A pregnant woman was killed.

Shocking. Innocent people would die when terrorist governments hide like cowards behind them, and use them as human meatshields for political gain. At least the Israelis make it a point to attempt to avoid Civilian casualties, not purposefully target them with artillery. You know, like HAMAS.

Curiously enough, I see you aren't making an issue of the fact that their Government has made it a policy to support the shelling of another sovereign nation with mortars and rockets, despite ostensibly holding a peace/cease fire treaty with them.

*sigh*

Yeah, I totally love Hamas. Three Israelis are dead in this most recent idiocy. You think I don't mourn them? We have 50 Palestinians dead (at least) and three Israelis. Enough. It's just more of the same. Israel has been using collective punishment for decades.

HotIgneous Intruder:Both sides of this are wrong lying bloodthirsty freaks of the desert.Neither side deserves a holy land or anything good in life.I hope they nuke each other into oblivion.That said, Bibi Netanyahu is going to wear this mess around his neck like a flaming truck tire.He's being trolled like a boss.

/When either side can present facts that are the truth and both sides STILL look like horrible murderous pigs, you know something bigger is going on here.

jaybeezey:ginandbacon: BronyMedic: ginandbacon: Tats, 13 children are dead. A pregnant woman was killed.

Shocking. Innocent people would die when terrorist governments hide like cowards behind them, and use them as human meatshields for political gain. At least the Israelis make it a point to attempt to avoid Civilian casualties, not purposefully target them with artillery. You know, like HAMAS.

Curiously enough, I see you aren't making an issue of the fact that their Government has made it a policy to support the shelling of another sovereign nation with mortars and rockets, despite ostensibly holding a peace/cease fire treaty with them.

*sigh*

Yeah, I totally love Hamas. Three Israelis are dead in this most recent idiocy. You think I don't mourn them? We have 50 Palestinians dead (at least) and three Israelis. Enough. It's just more of the same. Israel has been using collective punishment for decades.

"Mr. President, the reason I call it an apology tour is because you went to the Middle East and you flew to Egypt and to Saudi Arabia and to Turkey and Iraq. And by the way, you skipped Israel, our closest friend in the region, but you went to the other nations.

"Mr. President, the reason I call it an apology tour is because you went to the Middle East and you flew to Egypt and to Saudi Arabia and to Turkey and Iraq. And by the way, you skipped Israel, our closest friend in the region, but you went to the other nations.

Now we find out how true that was

Except for those times that Obama did go to Israel.

But at that point, Romney and his campaign were still farking the "apology tour" chicken. He was getting desperate.

Mrtraveler01:Because we don't support Bibi and his idiotic policies blindly somehow makes us racist?

...but if right wingers ditched the "criticism for Israeli policy = antisemitism" talking point, they might have to logically and reasonably defend the positions and decisions of Netanyahu, Likud, and its right wing coalition while providing a persuasive case forWithout, you know, managing to sound like Grand Moff Tarkin in the process.

jaybeezey:HotIgneous Intruder: Both sides of this are wrong lying bloodthirsty freaks of the desert.Neither side deserves a holy land or anything good in life.I hope they nuke each other into oblivion.That said, Bibi Netanyahu is going to wear this mess around his neck like a flaming truck tire.He's being trolled like a boss.

/When either side can present facts that are the truth and both sides STILL look like horrible murderous pigs, you know something bigger is going on here.

Nice opinion. Now get some facts.

Har-har. Bibi is a psychopath, just like DumbYa was.Does the ironicalness bother you or do you just love to defend murderers?That's not very pious of you.

Tatsuma:As far as civilians dying, it is tragic, but Hamas themselves admit that they use civilian shields. Not only do they use them, but its their actual official policy to.

"Fathi Hammad: [The enemies of Allah] do not know that the Palestinian people has developed its [methods] of death and death-seeking. For the Palestinian people, death has become an industry, at which women excel, and so do all the people living on this land. The elderly excel at this, and so do the mujahideen and the children. This is why they have formed human shields of the women, the children, the elderly, and the mujahideen, in order to challenge the Zionist bombing machine. It is as if they were saying to the Zionist enemy: "We desire death like you desire life."

The bombs cache that the IDF destroyed were usually next to (sometimes inside) mosques, kindergarten, schools, clinics, etc...

It's incredibly sad when civilians die, but they make it a point that they will die. Israel struck more than 900 targets in Gaza in the last 4 days, and killed 3 terrorists for every civilian who sadly died. I think this is a clear indication that the IDF is doing its utmost best to insure that the lives of innocents will not be ended because of Hamas fighters.

That is one of the most nauseating statistics I have ever seen. You get paid to write this horseshiat, or do you just barf up propaganda reflexively?

Issue is you have 1.7 million people living in a 30 mile corridor not much more than 5 miles wide. They live in poverty and are ruled by a bunch of thugs who want to destroy western leadership of the free world and constantly seek to indoctrinate the people rather than empower them. That's about the size of it.

Fixing the problem seems to be beyond the people of Gaza, the region and the world

AcneVulgaris:Tatsuma: As far as civilians dying, it is tragic, but Hamas themselves admit that they use civilian shields. Not only do they use them, but its their actual official policy to.

"Fathi Hammad: [The enemies of Allah] do not know that the Palestinian people has developed its [methods] of death and death-seeking. For the Palestinian people, death has become an industry, at which women excel, and so do all the people living on this land. The elderly excel at this, and so do the mujahideen and the children. This is why they have formed human shields of the women, the children, the elderly, and the mujahideen, in order to challenge the Zionist bombing machine. It is as if they were saying to the Zionist enemy: "We desire death like you desire life."

The bombs cache that the IDF destroyed were usually next to (sometimes inside) mosques, kindergarten, schools, clinics, etc...

It's incredibly sad when civilians die, but they make it a point that they will die. Israel struck more than 900 targets in Gaza in the last 4 days, and killed 3 terrorists for every civilian who sadly died. I think this is a clear indication that the IDF is doing its utmost best to insure that the lives of innocents will not be ended because of Hamas fighters.

That is one of the most nauseating statistics I have ever seen. You get paid to write this horseshiat, or do you just barf up propaganda reflexively?

He's paid in the sense that this persona is one of the dozen or so used by students doing their IDF conscription time.

Never found it curious how his "facts" often seen to mirror the Israeli talking points not yet released for that night's news cycle?

ginandbacon:Tats, 13 children are dead. A pregnant woman was killed. At some point,trucks of food stop making it right.

How many German pregnant ladies did the United States kill in the 1940s? Every Israeli war is infinitely more justified that any American war has been, and yet people still get a thrill in their voice when they can dream of exterminating the last Jew from the world...