Clearly, at best case, AH is looking at 6-9 games from the NFL, to be reviewed after 5 or 6 games. At worst, he is looking at prison.

How many games did Ray Lewis miss?

pcmIV - different commish at the time and the league didn't have as big of a image ego as it does now. I'm thinking it will go more like the Big Ben suspension. 6 games negotiated down to 4.

49 - Why does it have to be either Amendola or Welker? We are currently sitting on over $8mil. For what Welker got we could have had both of them and still had money to sign people incase of injury during the season. Then you could have had the best of both worlds.

rkarp - at the time they resigned Hern he was keeping his nose clean and had no issues. All this has come since Feb of this year. Given Hern's talent and performance locking him up early was the good move, provided they put in a morality clause as an escape. Given past history not putting in that clause would be the mistake, not resigning him.

Thats the thing Pats. He hasnt been keeping his nose clean or cleaning up his social circle. Pats should have known this, many team mates did.

Clearly, at best case, AH is looking at 6-9 games from the NFL, to be reviewed after 5 or 6 games. At worst, he is looking at prison.

How many games did Ray Lewis miss?

pcmIV - different commish at the time and the league didn't have as big of a image ego as it does now. I'm thinking it will go more like the Big Ben suspension. 6 games negotiated down to 4.

49 - Why does it have to be either Amendola or Welker? We are currently sitting on over $8mil. For what Welker got we could have had both of them and still had money to sign people incase of injury during the season. Then you could have had the best of both worlds.

rkarp - at the time they resigned Hern he was keeping his nose clean and had no issues. All this has come since Feb of this year. Given Hern's talent and performance locking him up early was the good move, provided they put in a morality clause as an escape. Given past history not putting in that clause would be the mistake, not resigning him.

Welker wanted 10 million per year and thought NE or another team might give it to him. He was wrong. Faulting Kraft or BB for not overpaying Welker or forcing Welker to sign for less than he viewed himself in the market is Armchair Gm 101 garbage.

If Welker does not win a SB in the next 2 years, he will regret his play in the recent postseasons for the rest of his life.

It's that simple. I made a thread a couple of years ago talking about how Mankins and Welker don't really show up that well in big games against the better competition. I've been right on that this whole time.

You can either deal with facts or live in some odd little childish fantasy world, PatsEng. Your Welker meltdown on this board with TFB12 was quite the spectacle. It's like first time a Boston athlete left a team he probably should have stayed with due to an enormous ego.

Ray Allen just did it, Welker just did it and there will be many, many more to come in the future.

New name already Rusty. Back on ignore you go since you don't contribute to the board anything more the trolling it yourself.

You know rkarp, I really really try to like you and engage in football talk with you, but you make it so difficult because of your trollish behavior. The police haven't even made a statement implying that Hern is the murderer or that Hern will be locked up, etc. and you take the opportunity to jump all over Kraft/BB AND try to make light of a murder by saying Wes is laughing about the situation. Shame on you.

1. Wes is a great guy so I highly doubt he is laughing about a situation that left somebody dead.

2. Hern was a teammate of Wes's who by all implications, was a friend. He didn't leave because he disliked his teammates; he left because BB/Kraft didn't want him anymore. This has no correlation to a grudge against his former teammates.

3. Hern has shown NOTHING to this point that he isn't a good person, player, teammate, etc. besides you, being the 'all-access' guy that you are, seeing him in a nightclub being drunk. Appalling! A 22-year old millionaire was wasted in a club. Oh, the humanity.

4. Say for instance that Hern is found guilty of either murder or an accomplice, how could BB/Kraft foresee Hern becoming a murderer? Because he smoked weed in the past and grew up in the hood? WOW! You just described 50+% of the NFL.

This is beneath you dude

Good post and I agree with all except #3. Lots of reports are coming out concerning past trouble AHern has been in which would also lead to #4. Apparently there was enough info out there on AHern to where other teams passed on him and the Patriots chose to take the risk. It's looking like they lost on the gamble but of course there is never a sure thing.

Had the Patriots waited to lock Gronk and Hernandez up with contract extensions it would be very interesting to see what they would offer them right now. Hernandez would be gone, wonder what they would offer

You know rkarp, I really really try to like you and engage in football talk with you, but you make it so difficult because of your trollish behavior. The police haven't even made a statement implying that Hern is the murderer or that Hern will be locked up, etc. and you take the opportunity to jump all over Kraft/BB AND try to make light of a murder by saying Wes is laughing about the situation. Shame on you.

1. Wes is a great guy so I highly doubt he is laughing about a situation that left somebody dead.

2. Hern was a teammate of Wes's who by all implications, was a friend. He didn't leave because he disliked his teammates; he left because BB/Kraft didn't want him anymore. This has no correlation to a grudge against his former teammates.

3. Hern has shown NOTHING to this point that he isn't a good person, player, teammate, etc. besides you, being the 'all-access' guy that you are, seeing him in a nightclub being drunk. Appalling! A 22-year old millionaire was wasted in a club. Oh, the humanity.

4. Say for instance that Hern is found guilty of either murder or an accomplice, how could BB/Kraft foresee Hern becoming a murderer? Because he smoked weed in the past and grew up in the hood? WOW! You just described 50+% of the NFL.

This is beneath you dude

first I would never make light of a murder. if you interpreted it that way, you were incorrect.

Kraft/BB made cold, team first decision to dump Wes over small money. This in spite of injury/character concerns over targets #1 and #2, and injury concerns over targets #3 and #4. Wes could have easily been retained and the Pats still could have made every move they have made to date.

With the potential of Gronk on PUP, and AH either in jail or NFL penalties, that team first, cold decision has back fired.

Clearly, at best case, AH is looking at 6-9 games from the NFL, to be reviewed after 5 or 6 games. At worst, he is looking at prison.

My post about seeing AH in a club 1 year ago had nothing to do with liquer, it was about drugs and bullying other patrons with his numerous hanger ons. It is very clear that AH has a questionable social life and friends. The question was did he clean up his act? Seems he did not, and the Pats should have known this BEFORE giving him 7/$41

lastly, to think Wes did not want to end his career here, and was very hurt by the Pats not signing him, and now to think he does not revel in the Pats woes, is not seeing the entire picture. Wes surely feels for another pl;ayer and ex team mate, but he also clearly wants to stick it up BB's you know what

Well I'll tell you, if you did say you saw him in a night club acting like that, I believe you. I've seen some of these guys in public and in person and I've got to say even the ones you would assume would be nice guys, aren't. I watched Chris Slade and Willie McGinnest tell a waitress to "get back in her cage" when she asked them for an autograph. I know someone that has had to interact with Merriweather and he told me right when they drafted him that the guy was a thug. By watching Hernandez during interviews I didn't get the feeling he was a good guy.

We screwed up big time in giving this guy 40 million...and to think we were handing this guy a 40 million dollar contract while we couldn't work out a long term deal with Welker. Not the finest hour in the "best GM of all time's" career.

Wes would have signed here for 2/$12. Pats knew about Gronk, they should have known about AH. Amendola, Wes, Edelman, Dobson and Boyce all easily could be on the team forming a very strong group

No, he couldn't have. And, I think BB did more homework on Wes and wanted to move on anyway. Lots of drops and a severe Brady addiction with them being best friends. Time to run the ball and win a SB.

Yes Queenie - all of those drops. I guess nobody told you that among the NFLs top 20 WR, WW had the 4th best catch rate in the NFL. You see Queenie, drops do not live in a bubble. When you are thrown the ball more often, you have more drops. This works the same way when a QB throws the ball more often, he get more INTs and more TDs. Percentages stay about the same, but the grand total changes with frequency. Do you even understand that?

Good points, Bust! BUT, have you looked at the stats for those who drop the ball only in the Play-offs and Superbowl? See, averages and stats DON'T take into account the additional gravity brought on by the situation. I wonder where Wes falls in that group? Also, no matter how many balls you catch, when you drop the ones that matter most, you still suck......

Wes would have signed here for 2/$12. Pats knew about Gronk, they should have known about AH. Amendola, Wes, Edelman, Dobson and Boyce all easily could be on the team forming a very strong group

No, he couldn't have. And, I think BB did more homework on Wes and wanted to move on anyway. Lots of drops and a severe Brady addiction with them being best friends. Time to run the ball and win a SB.

Yes Queenie - all of those drops. I guess nobody told you that among the NFLs top 20 WR, WW had the 4th best catch rate in the NFL. You see Queenie, drops do not live in a bubble. When you are thrown the ball more often, you have more drops. This works the same way when a QB throws the ball more often, he get more INTs and more TDs. Percentages stay about the same, but the grand total changes with frequency. Do you even understand that?

Good points, Bust! BUT, have you looked at the stats for those who drop the ball only in the Play-offs and Superbowl? See, averages and stats DON'T take into account the additional gravity brought on by the situation. I wonder where Wes falls in that group? Also, no matter how many balls you catch, when you drop the ones that matter most, you still suck......

Wes would have signed here for 2/$12. Pats knew about Gronk, they should have known about AH. Amendola, Wes, Edelman, Dobson and Boyce all easily could be on the team forming a very strong group

No, he couldn't have. And, I think BB did more homework on Wes and wanted to move on anyway. Lots of drops and a severe Brady addiction with them being best friends. Time to run the ball and win a SB.

Yes Queenie - all of those drops. I guess nobody told you that among the NFLs top 20 WR, WW had the 4th best catch rate in the NFL. You see Queenie, drops do not live in a bubble. When you are thrown the ball more often, you have more drops. This works the same way when a QB throws the ball more often, he get more INTs and more TDs. Percentages stay about the same, but the grand total changes with frequency. Do you even understand that?

Good points, Bust! BUT, have you looked at the stats for those who drop the ball only in the Play-offs and Superbowl? See, averages and stats DON'T take into account the additional gravity brought on by the situation. I wonder where Wes falls in that group? Also, no matter how many balls you catch, when you drop the ones that matter most, you still suck......

RallyC, that's Phat Rex. He's a our Jets troll here and he is the ultimate loser. So, he never makes good points.

His team hasn't played in a SB and those are the same fans that used to drool over Wayne Chrebet as if he was a god, so you have to undertsand his pathetic perspective.

Our organization has had more HOF caliber players come in go in the last 5 years than his entire franchise has in the HOF over its existence. He's jealous of what we have so badly, he can only dream of having a BB as coach, GM, Brady as a QB or a Welker in the slot.

Phat Rex has never made a good point in his life on this board. Ever.

Ahhhh, OK. that makes prefect sense because I just thought he was stupid. Sorry Bust! or, I mean Phat!

You know rkarp, I really really try to like you and engage in football talk with you, but you make it so difficult because of your trollish behavior. The police haven't even made a statement implying that Hern is the murderer or that Hern will be locked up, etc. and you take the opportunity to jump all over Kraft/BB AND try to make light of a murder by saying Wes is laughing about the situation. Shame on you.

1. Wes is a great guy so I highly doubt he is laughing about a situation that left somebody dead.

2. Hern was a teammate of Wes's who by all implications, was a friend. He didn't leave because he disliked his teammates; he left because BB/Kraft didn't want him anymore. This has no correlation to a grudge against his former teammates.

3. Hern has shown NOTHING to this point that he isn't a good person, player, teammate, etc. besides you, being the 'all-access' guy that you are, seeing him in a nightclub being drunk. Appalling! A 22-year old millionaire was wasted in a club. Oh, the humanity.

4. Say for instance that Hern is found guilty of either murder or an accomplice, how could BB/Kraft foresee Hern becoming a murderer? Because he smoked weed in the past and grew up in the hood? WOW! You just described 50+% of the NFL.

This is beneath you dude

Good post and I agree with all except #3. Lots of reports are coming out concerning past trouble AHern has been in which would also lead to #4. Apparently there was enough info out there on AHern to where other teams passed on him and the Patriots chose to take the risk. It's looking like they lost on the gamble but of course there is never a sure thing.

Had the Patriots waited to lock Gronk and Hernandez up with contract extensions it would be very interesting to see what they would offer them right now. Hernandez would be gone, wonder what they would offer

You know rkarp, I really really try to like you and engage in football talk with you, but you make it so difficult because of your trollish behavior. The police haven't even made a statement implying that Hern is the murderer or that Hern will be locked up, etc. and you take the opportunity to jump all over Kraft/BB AND try to make light of a murder by saying Wes is laughing about the situation. Shame on you.

1. Wes is a great guy so I highly doubt he is laughing about a situation that left somebody dead.

2. Hern was a teammate of Wes's who by all implications, was a friend. He didn't leave because he disliked his teammates; he left because BB/Kraft didn't want him anymore. This has no correlation to a grudge against his former teammates.

3. Hern has shown NOTHING to this point that he isn't a good person, player, teammate, etc. besides you, being the 'all-access' guy that you are, seeing him in a nightclub being drunk. Appalling! A 22-year old millionaire was wasted in a club. Oh, the humanity.

4. Say for instance that Hern is found guilty of either murder or an accomplice, how could BB/Kraft foresee Hern becoming a murderer? Because he smoked weed in the past and grew up in the hood? WOW! You just described 50+% of the NFL.

This is beneath you dude

first I would never make light of a murder. if you interpreted it that way, you were incorrect.

Kraft/BB made cold, team first decision to dump Wes over small money. This in spite of injury/character concerns over targets #1 and #2, and injury concerns over targets #3 and #4. Wes could have easily been retained and the Pats still could have made every move they have made to date.

With the potential of Gronk on PUP, and AH either in jail or NFL penalties, that team first, cold decision has back fired.

Clearly, at best case, AH is looking at 6-9 games from the NFL, to be reviewed after 5 or 6 games. At worst, he is looking at prison.

My post about seeing AH in a club 1 year ago had nothing to do with liquer, it was about drugs and bullying other patrons with his numerous hanger ons. It is very clear that AH has a questionable social life and friends. The question was did he clean up his act? Seems he did not, and the Pats should have known this BEFORE giving him 7/$41

lastly, to think Wes did not want to end his career here, and was very hurt by the Pats not signing him, and now to think he does not revel in the Pats woes, is not seeing the entire picture. Wes surely feels for another pl;ayer and ex team mate, but he also clearly wants to stick it up BB's you know what

Well I'll tell you, if you did say you saw him in a night club acting like that, I believe you. I've seen some of these guys in public and in person and I've got to say even the ones you would assume would be nice guys, aren't. I watched Chris Slade and Willie McGinnest tell a waitress to "get back in her cage" when she asked them for an autograph. I know someone that has had to interact with Merriweather and he told me right when they drafted him that the guy was a thug. By watching Hernandez during interviews I didn't get the feeling he was a good guy.

We screwed up big time in giving this guy 40 million...and to think we were handing this guy a 40 million dollar contract while we couldn't work out a long term deal with Welker. Not the finest hour in the "best GM of all time's" career.

Private party, public club. Over 300 people attended. I posted it here 1 year ago and Rusty of course calls me a liar. Pats sjould have known for $41 million

Clearly, at best case, AH is looking at 6-9 games from the NFL, to be reviewed after 5 or 6 games. At worst, he is looking at prison.

How many games did Ray Lewis miss?

pcmIV - different commish at the time and the league didn't have as big of a image ego as it does now. I'm thinking it will go more like the Big Ben suspension. 6 games negotiated down to 4.

49 - Why does it have to be either Amendola or Welker? We are currently sitting on over $8mil. For what Welker got we could have had both of them and still had money to sign people incase of injury during the season. Then you could have had the best of both worlds.

rkarp - at the time they resigned Hern he was keeping his nose clean and had no issues. All this has come since Feb of this year. Given Hern's talent and performance locking him up early was the good move, provided they put in a morality clause as an escape. Given past history not putting in that clause would be the mistake, not resigning him.

Who says the Patriots wanted Stone hand, butterfinger Wes Welker? The guy had 13 drops, second in the league, and picked up a habbit of flaking when he's needed most.

Welker was never in the Pats radar once Amendola hit the market, the Pats were done with him and the Pats have no need for two tiny slot WRs with limited speed. The Pats needed guys who could stretch the field.