Crossing the border with Blue Jays beat reporter Jordan Bastian.

Eck, Mac show their grit

TORONTO — One day after Jays shortstops David Eckstein and John McDonald both left a game with injuries, the pair showed just how scrappy they really are. Neither Eckstein nor McDonald were placed on the disabled list.

McDonald, who was on crutches as recent as this morning after spraining his right ankle, was walking around fine before the game and even hit some baseballs off a tee. Eckstein was at a local hospital undergoing an MRI on his strained hip flexor, but was potentially available for Wednesday’s game.

“The way Johnny Mac went down, I thought a sniper got him from the fifth deck,” Blue Jays general manager J.P. Ricciardi joked. “Today, they’re better than I thought. The powers of modern medicine.”

Just in case, the Jays promoted shortstop Jorge Velandia from Triple-A Syracuse, though Marco Scutaro will man short until either Eckstein or McDonald are ready to come back. Ricciardi said the Jays would wait until Thursday to determine whether or not Johnny Mac would need a trip to the DL.

“Going on the DL is the last thing I want,” McDonald said. “The more minutes and hours that J.P. and [manager John Gibbons] will give me to get healthy and get back on the field I’ll take. But I understand that they’ve got a lot of other things to think about besides my health.”

To clear room on the active roster for Velandia, the Jays optioned Adam Lind back to Triple-A Syracuse, where he can get regular playing time. Lind — 1-for-19 with Toronto — was receiving little action since Shannon Stewart was named the regular left fielder. No need to clear room on the 40-man, since Frank Thomas’ dismissal left the roster at 39.

Just wondering if these guys really understand baseball stategy and logic at all????? Scott Rolen batting leadoff!!!!!!!!! LOL LOL LOL. I would love just 1 example of any team ever using a guy like Lyle Overbay as their leadoff hitter……… Christ what are you guys thinking???? Lyle Overbay is slow as Molasses and by far the worst baserunner on the team perhaps all of baseball….Completely lost on the basepaths.

Anyone who thinks Lyle Overbay should be batting leadoff should strongly look at learning a new sport and forget about watching baseball because you will NEVER GET IT! If you understand Lyle Overbay is NOT a leadoff hitter then you should speak up and not let THE FOOL manipulate baseball beginers who just have fun blogging out here and start beliving THE FOOLS’ nonsense.

rshobie
or should I just say Robert. Sense we live so close, why don’t we just meet in person to give you a chance to get rid of your frustrations and you then won’t have to keep looking like the idiot you are on here. Email me and let me know where and when you’d like to meet for a quiet chat

A 9 year old with slightly advanced intelligence. Not counting baseball of course as no 9 yr. old would have Overbay batting leadoff. Gibbons on the other hand may read this stuff when he goes home and potentially try it.

robert. I still haven’t received an email. Looks like your like every other bully I’ve ever met in my life. Lots of hot air when you’re behind a fake email name-but scared to meet and talk about any differences in person.

So send the email and let me know where and when you want to meet to chat our differences through, or do like every other bully does and put your tail between your legs and wimp home.

If you really want to meet I would be more than happy to comply but you are going to have to e-mail me. We can exchange cell phone numbers and take it from there. If you think you are going to out wit me on this blog you are sadly mistaken. I know your game far too well. It was YOUR idea to meet and NOT mine and I bullied no one. But if you are actually up for a meeting I say GO For IT.

Jays get another great game from a starter. No surprise there. You guys are getting spoiled with that pitching.

I watched some of the Indians/Yankee game, Lee mowed them down. Lee is pitching out of his mind. As of right now, he is the leader for the Cy Young and to start the All Star game. A little early but something to think about. Lee is almost unhittable.

These are the situations which I think Abner really makes a mistake. Top of the 9th, we’re up 6 runs, Marcum has already thrown 98 pitches and given up 1 hit, our bullpen is under used and what does Abner do.

He sends Marcum back out there. WHY? Now Marcum goes from an excellent 8 inning shutout (with a lowered era to 2.25) to being pulled in the 9th after giving up 2 runs and a era of 2.59.

No one can tell me that was the right call by Abner-the guy’s a dunce.

Marcum was fantastic and I agreed with the move to bring him out in the 9th. Correct me if i’m wrong but he has yet to pitch a complete game shutout so if he didn’t get the opportunity to do it now when would he ? I hope Rolen’s home run can be just what the doctor ordered because as the tv guys said they looked relaxed after that.
Fantastic news in regards to Eckstein and Mcdonald.

Rshobi the Jays don’t have a true leadoff hitter (Stewart being the closest thing) so why not have Overbay and his high OBP against rights at the top of the order ? It’s better then Rios…..If Stewart’s going well then it should be him but he isn’t so i’d be ok with Lyle at the top against righties. Of course he has looked like the Lyle of ’06 lately so in that case i’d have his doubles capability in the 2 hole and Stewart leadoff.
Anybody else think that Jorge Velandia looked a lot like Esteban Loaiza ? I was pissed when I first glanced at him thinking that the Jays had acquired him somehow.

I didn’t think the decision to leave Marcum in was that bad sumner. I’ll just have to agree to disagree with you on that one, however you do make a good point about the under used bullpen. He could’ve “thrown a bone” to Frasor I guess. I’m getting off for tonight. Good night to everybody.

I do notice too that he does seem to hit a wall whenever he gets to 95+ pitches. At the same time i’d to like to see if he can prove me wrong sometime and what better time then with a 5+ run lead ? Anyway, i’m getting off for sure unless you can reply quickly again lol.

Its a long season, sometimes, in my view, it’s better to take the starters out sooner than later-particulary when there’s a few guys in the pen that need work. Frasor is a good point, he’s probably rusty and putting him in with a 6 run lead would have sharpened him up with little risk of loosing.

QUOTE: “He sends Marcum back out there. WHY?”
I would have done the same thing gsumner. If it was still 1-0 you would have seen BJ, but at 6-0, Marcum deserved a shot at a complete game shutout and a personal best. He was averaging about 12 pitches an inning at that point which would have put him at 110 for the night-an average workload for a starter these days. You should also have noticed that Marcum and BJ were the only 2 pitchers warmed up to start the 9th. As it turned out, BJ is one more day removed from Tommy John, and he is still available for the next 2 games (he won’t go 3 in a row for quite a while).
This was the right move all around, and one more example of Gibbons taking care of his players.
I think, gsumner, that you have such a hate on for Gibbons that you let it get in the way of objective observation. If you would take the time to look, you would understand that while Gibbons may make mistakes (all managers do), he never makes a decision without a good reason. It is really easy to jump on mistakes in hindsight, but if it came down to a choice between you and John Gibbons for manager, I would go with JG every time.
Always nice

gnorman your right,
If Marcum would have made the last three outs nobody would be questioning the descision. Its alot easier to say what should have been done after things happen. Even after what happend I would have done the same thing. Anyone who has played the game knows you want to finish what you start, It would have been an insult to Marcum to pull him especially since the save situation was gone. Great call by Gibbons!

gnorman
True,Gibbons isn’t one of my favorite people, but I do state when he makes good decisions and bad. The decision to put Marcum back out there was not a good decision. It’s a long season and whether Marcum finished the game or not didn’t matter. Marcum has had a history of running out of gas between 95 and 100 pitches, and was already at 98 at the end of the 8th inning. Whatever the average league pitch load is, doesn’t matter; if this is what this guy is like
More importantly though, and the main reason he should have been taken out is some in our bullpen have not had enough work to keep them fresh. This was an opportunity to get one of those guys, like Frasor as an example, an inning. Frasor hasn’t pitched since April 25th. Tallet’s only pitched once since since April 24th.
We will need Frasor and every guy we have in that pen to be fresh and ready to go if we expect to contend. Leaving them on the pine when there’s a perfect opportunity to give them an inning, like last night, isn’t good management.
One last point, I do not profess to either be or want to be manager, so that comment is uncalled for. The fact is, you have no idea as to when I thought Marcum should be replaced. I have been very consistent in this point for about 20 years. I do not believe leaving in a starter once he’s run out of gas, regardless of pitch count because of the higher risk of injury at that point. You stating I made this decision last night “after the fact” and because of a personal dislike for Gibbons is bs and you know it. Marcum has been consistent in that he runs out of gas between 95 and 100 pitches-that is what the guy is and there’s nothing wrong with that.
I have a right like everyone else to come here and express my opinion on both Gibbons and JP’s decisions with being personally insulted or attacked, because I don’t insult or attack anyone else unless seriously provoked. You can disagree with my point, and I welcome debate, but there really is no reason to be a child and insult or attack me or anyone else. So I’d very much appreciate it if you’d clean up your act or start expecting that what goes around comes around. Apologies are always nice.

I will not apologize gsumner, because this is a case of the pot calling the kettle black. You have a hate on for Gibbons and you know it. Otherwise, why call him “Abner”, which is about as demeaning and childish as it can get (oh, sorry, I forgot about rshobie). At least I will not stoop to giving you an insulting nickname or calling you an idiot or something. For the most part, I enjoy your posts, but I really wish you would clean up the Gibbons thing.
As far as pitchers getting hurt, there are 2 schools of thought on that. One is that there are only so many bullets in the gun and they should be conserved. The Japanese have another philosophy, which is that the more you use it, the stronger it gets. They work their young pitchers like rented mules. It’s nothing for them tothrow 150-160 pitches PER DAY! In the majors, it wasn’t until the 60s when the roster expanded to 25 men that clubs could carry another pitcher, and the era of specialization was born. The record for consecutive complete games in the majors is 118 in the 1890s, so even the Doc can’t come close.
Besides, even if Marcum gasses out after 100 pitches, he is still a young pitcher, and it only right to give him an opportunity to stretch his limits if the situation warrants, which it certainly did last night. John Gibbons is very good about keeping his young rookies out of losing situations, but he also gives his players an opportunity to excel and move beyond themselves. After all, isn’t that what sports is about?
Always nice

Why does it matter to you what I call Gibbons? Why are you so quick to defend him, good decision or bad decison? Of course Abner is a demeaning name-that is the intention. I have no respect for his abilities as a major league manager-period. Frankly, I personally wouldn’t have Gibbons run a sand lot Peewee team in the Kentucky Hills. You might think otherwise and that’s your perogative. BUT-there’s still no reason for personal insults or attacks simply because we differ on something-THAT is childish. So for the 2nd time, please clean up your act.

This isn’t Japan, nor is it the 60’s, the pitchers have not been trained the same way, AND you conveniently didn’t address the REAL reason I thought Marcum should have been pulled which was to give Frasor an inning. We need Frasor, and he hasn’t pitched since April 25th -2 weeks ago. He’s bound to be rusty , and likely would have given up some runs, but we had a large lead and it was the perfect time to put him in. If these guys aren’t kept fresh, they will not be there for us when we really need them.

We need Frasor but he hasnt pitched since April 25th? Does that make sense? 5 runs isn’t a large lead Frasor is the last pitcher i would have wanted to come in that situation. The only pitchers I would put out there if we are winning are the most reliable ones. Ryan, Downs, Carlson, Accardo, Tallet. Frasor no… A game can get out of hand pretty quickly especially against an offence like the Rays.
Gibbons wasnt managing stats at that point, he was managing a person, and giving him respect to go and finish what he started, no numbers or stats need to be invovled in the discussion. His pitch count wasnt high so there is no reason for Marcum not to finish the game…respect.

You need mop up guys in the pen and it happens that Frasor and Tallet seem to be those guys. They don’t need to be especially sharp since they probably won’t be thrown into a key situations, well atleast Frasor won’t.

If I’m managing (and I should be, ha) I send Marcum out to try and finish… The mental aspect of the game is just as important as the physical and going the distance does wonders for confidence and the bulldog mentality pitchers need to have, not to mention increased stamina.
My thinking is… If Marcum has tired later in games, why not stretch him passed his comfort zone with a healthy lead? You do that enough times and maybe his “wall” comes at 115 pitches and with the way he has been throwing this year and the end of last year we need him out there as long as possible with his kind of stuff. I’m from the school that says the harder it works the stronger it gets.

I must have missed the beginning of “Abner” so why is it insulting to Gibbons and what does it stand for?

Paragraph spacing works, but you need to add a pair of tags – just remove the spaces. I’ve been pretty harsh in my opinion of Gibbons over the last few years, but I find myself rooting for him this year. I don’t know if it’s because I’ve warmed to him or if it’s because I feel like he’s turning a new leaf.I have to admit that I didn’t see a good reason for Marcum to be run back out there in the 9th. With a 6-run lead and a pitcher who doesn’t typically have a lot of gas in the tank, I’d rather send someone else out and let the kid pick up his next start after having left on a high note.

Why all the fighting about Marcum after the 8th it was handshakes all around he was out of the game then ABNER sends him back out for the 9th he now has a different mindset It was stuped to send him back out.

and gnorman ABNER–ABNER–ABNER–NOW IF YOU DONT LIKE THAT TO BAD.everyone was getting along here whats got into you why the personal grabage why pick peoples opinions apart.

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