That was just chorus Ninja wack. Even on a beatbox you can sing on 4 bars.
And RnB isn't Hip Hop mid 90's style at all

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Nate Doggs whole album, both discs of G Funk Volume 1 and 2 had back to back mid-90's hip-hop beats. Same for his late 90's sophomore - you never heard the song Regulate where he sings just as much as Warren G rhymes? Lauryn Hill sang the whole way through on Killing Me Softly... D'Angelo, Alliyah, SWV, En Vogue, Toni Braxton, Mariah Carey, TLC, etc etc - all had very hip-hop laced beats. Even Christina Aguilera's first single, Genie In a Bottle was a hip-hop beat... with a DJ on the tables and everything.

Funny cuz according to your wack reply, rap beats sound the same since 1970...That's fuckin trash...Haha...

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It is all the same shit... lay some drums down, drop the bass, find the melodys... and you got a beat. Except, instead of one SP1200 you've got million dollar studios for that crisp sound.

I like old-school rap but objectively it was wack compared to any music style.

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Why would you like anything that's objectively wack? The way you put it... if this was rock, acoustic is going to be automatically inferior to electric no matter how well the acoustic is played, and how badly the electric.

I love rap but objectively, rap couldn't fuck, musically, with pop until these days.

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And objectively, nothing can fuck with classical music from centuries ago... so everything is "objectively bad" right? Please use some logic that's actually applicable.

I mean...Everybody listened to HIStory (that MJ shit dating from 95)...Beats were fuckin great and any "classic" rap album could test it....And nowadays (10 years later), that's exactly the same type of beats (same structure) that dope beatmakers are tryin to reproduce.

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'cause they're trying to make pop music instead of hip-hop? That's not what I'd call progression of an art form... they're making dope pop music and inferior hip-hop music? You got it backwards anyway... the trend now is too use soul samples and obscure vocals in beats, and that was being done to death in the early and mid 90's and the biggest hits in hip-hop usually have the most simplistic and least musical beats - 'cause it's the least musically challenging/distracting for the casual radio listener, and alot easier to dance to a repetetive loop. It's just like the preferred level of lyricism in any music genre: the really poetic and complex shit doesn't get any play.

Lil Jon is the most in demand producer out right now and his shit isn't musical at all It doesn't resemble the pop-styled production of mid 90's stuff like Madonna's "Like a Prayer" or MJ's "History" in any way... that Whisper song by Ying Yang Twins sounds like it was made on MTV Music Generator.

That's why so rap is so POPular right now...It's more musical than in the past.
Nowadays a dope rap track have to be a dope music track.

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So you're basically telling me why hip-hop is selling more than ever, and not why it's "objectively better" than ever.

And RZA was an exception.

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Now you think RZA was a good producer? Before you were telling me he was wack... so why did you start to consider Cuban Linx a classic, and RZA a genius? Was it because of the breakdown XXL did?

lemme explain this one last time... if you think you can't make an R&B track to ALMOST ANY hip hop beat, you're an idiot... you can take the most basic beat and harmonize over it correctly and make it sound hot cuz that adds a melody (just like beats have)... you can create your own or stick with the original melody of the beat...

and once again, Premo's beats from the mid-90's shit on 95% of beats today... Premo's beats are straight up dope... END OF STORY

I agree that most beats back then were basic and I'm a avid believer of that and I'ma avid believer that hip hop's gotten better "musically" since then but Premo's shit was dope then and now... stop hatin' on du'

It is all the same shit... lay some drums down, drop the bass, find the melodys... and you got a beat. Except, instead of one SP1200 you've got million dollar studios for that crisp sound.

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A gay who think hip hop beats sound the same since 1980 is fuckin retarded.

And objectively, nothing can fuck with classical music from centuries ago... so everything is "objectively bad" right? Please use some logic that's actually applicable.

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I was talkin about rap sucka....Read before reply. Rap from 90's SUCKS compared to modern rap...That's why I say from the begining.
And objectively, classical shits are fuckwithable...That electronic elements can make music more large than ever...

'cause they're trying to make pop music instead of hip-hop? That's not what I'd call progression of an art form...

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Pop music has always been superior to rap music.
Michael Jackson's albums were unfuckwithable by any rap album until The Blueprint.

Musically, shit is real muhufucka.

Lil Jon is the most in demand producer out right now and his shit isn't musical at all It doesn't resemble the pop-styled production of mid 90's stuff like Madonna's "Like a Prayer" or MJ's "History" in any way... that Whisper song by Ying Yang Twins sounds like it was made on MTV Music Generator.

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Look to Eminem or Kanye West (the 2 dopes beatmakers outta there)...Their beats do sound like that HIStory shits (They Don't Really Care About Us, HIStory, Scream....)

A gay who think hip hop beats sound the same since 1980 is fuckin retarded.

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Good thing no one like that is here right now, but you're a complete fucking moron. Nobody said that, but a guy who thinks that new drum, bass, and melody is something besides drum, bass, and melody doesn't have a full grasp on reality. 2 = 5?

I was talkin about rap sucka....Read before reply. Rap from 90's SUCKS compared to modern rap...That's why I say from the begining.
And objectively, classical shits are fuckwithable...That electronic elements can make music more large than ever...

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That makes no sense, according to you "more musical" is better, and none of this shit today, or 60 years ago, is "more musical" than the compositions these orchestras were playing over a century ago - make up your mind.

Pop music has always been superior to rap music.
Michael Jackson's albums were unfuckwithable by any rap album until The Blueprint.

Musically, shit is real muhufucka.

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That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Pop music isn't superior to the best music of any genre. Any fan, of any kind of music, anybody who takes it seriously will tell you that - any music journalist, music theory professor - artists just put more time into their deeper, more complex and less appealing music. The more definitive and personalized the music is, the less audiences you will tap into overall.

Pop music isn't even a style of music to begin with, it's just music that happens to be popular. It's a chart that keeps track of what's being played on the radio... you put on a pop station and you'll hear everything ranging from Tim McGraw, to Black Eyed Peas/from Janet Jackson, to Maroon 5/Green Day to Krazytown - and everything sounds different.

Look to Eminem or Kanye West (the 2 dopes beatmakers outta there)...Their beats do sound like that HIStory shits (They Don't Really Care About Us, HIStory, Scream....)

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I remember when Scream was a single, and Janet was in the video with him in those spikey suits... the shit doesn't sound like hip-hop, It's not even the same BPM as hip-hop. It sounds like what all dancer/vocalists had going on in with their productions the early and mid 90's. An evolution of progressive rock/soul from the 80's.

Arrested Development was another big group at the time, on alternative and pop stations and their production was strictly Salt + Pepa, Heavy D style hip-hop production, and that style was definitely inferior to the work Dre, RZA, Daz, Havoc, El-P, Erick Sermon, and DJ Quik were doing in the mid 90's - that's why their styles became the standards. After '97 everything became midi-keyboard work and nothing but compressed bass, which is when hip-hop became LESS musical.

Now that the sampling and soundscape styles of the those producers has been resurrected by albums like Blueprint and producers like Kanye - hip-hop is back in it's prime form. Only this time, the genre commands enough respect to be made in the same million dollar studios that MJ's albums were produced in - which creates that "crisp sound" and polished feel. Exactly like I was saying in the 1st part that your stupid ass quoted me in - SAME STYLE, NEW EQUIPMENT. From acoustic to electric... but goddamn if an MTV unplugged album isn't nice as fuck.

A gay who think hip hop beats sound the same since 1980 is fuckin retarded.

I was talkin about rap sucka....Read before reply. Rap from 90's SUCKS compared to modern rap...That's why I say from the begining.
And objectively, classical shits are fuckwithable...That electronic elements can make music more large than ever...

Pop music has always been superior to rap music.
Michael Jackson's albums were unfuckwithable by any rap album until The Blueprint.

Musically, shit is real muhufucka.

Look to Eminem or Kanye West (the 2 dopes beatmakers outta there)...Their beats do sound like that HIStory shits (They Don't Really Care About Us, HIStory, Scream....)

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OKAY, now you're retarded... Em's one of the best MC's (the GOAT IMO) but he ain't the best producer (not even close)... Kanye I understand but Em!?!? c'mon man... get serious... and Michael Jackson's beats were pretty simplistic... go listen to some shit off Thriller... it's a simple beat but they're still hot..... you're lost man.... and UNTIL Blueprint!?!?! LMFAO, you're a joke, officially

Oh yeah, and here's a "old" beat that's been remade that is basically exactly the same thing 'n still MUSICAL... the beat for T.O.D.A.Y on Death is Certain (Royce's album) is FIRE... where'd it come from? a Mary J Blige song from 'round '94 I believe... and it's a hip hop beat but Mary just sang over it... Royce killed that song... just felt like puttin' that in here cuz I'm at work and I just started listenin' to it and both versions are FIRE

Nobody said that, but a guy who thinks that new drum, bass, and melody is something besides drum, bass, and melody doesn't have a full grasp on reality. 2 = 5?

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Look faggot.
A rapper=a mic and a voice. Then with time, rappers evolved and now technics are more develloped.
Instrumentally, it's the same...Still a melody, a drumline and a bassline but used differently (with a mo' musical technic)

Fuckin retarded.

That makes no sense, according to you "more musical" is better, and none of this shit today, or 60 years ago, is "more musical" than the compositions these orchestras were playing over a century ago - make up your mind

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Why? Haha
With modern equipement it's easy to make orchestra compositions AND OTHER compositions (electronical, acoustic...)
Wake up you fuckin kid.

Pop music isn't superior to the best music of any genre

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I didn't say that...I said Pop music was superior to Hip Hop until The Blueprint...

Pop music isn't even a style of music to begin with, it's just music that happens to be popular. It's a chart that keeps track of what's being played on the radio... you put on a pop station and you'll hear everything ranging from Tim McGraw, to Black Eyed Peas/from Janet Jackson, to Maroon 5/Green Day to Krazytown - and everything sounds different.

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Is that supposed to prove Pop music is wack? Hahaha

Now that the sampling and soundscape styles of the those producers has been resurrected by albums like Blueprint and producers like Kanye - hip-hop is back in it's prime form

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Haha
You're a fuckin moron dude.
The prime form of hip hop is a rhythm and a voice on it.
Kanye is faaaar away from that wack shit dude.

From acoustic to electric... but goddamn if an MTV unplugged album isn't nice as fuck.

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Fag'
I didn't say any shit acoustic was wack.
Rap didn't change from acoustic to electric shits...
Befo', rap had his own beats, shit was repetititve (weather it was acoustic or electric)...Now rap is musical.

Learn punk.

Em's one of the best MC's (the GOAT IMO) but he ain't the best producer (not even close)... Kanye I understand but Em!?!? c'mon man... get serious...

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Few cuts: Ghetto Gospel, Lose Yourself, Superman, Sing 4 Da Moment...

and Michael Jackson's beats were pretty simplistic

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Maybe, but they shitted on Illmatic's like Quality's shit on em...you're contradictory.

and UNTIL Blueprint!?!?!

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Name one rap album before The Blueprint that could fuck with HIStory musically.

Maybe, but they shitted on Illmatic's like Quality's shit on em...you're contradictory.

Name one rap album before The Blueprint that could fuck with HIStory musically.

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one rap album? Miseducation of Lauryn Hill (that's semi rap but she's a rapper/singer)... the beats are very "hip hop"... lmfao

and a person can't be contradictory... a person's thoughts or stance may be contradictory... and no I'm not... Quality's beats shit on Michael Jackson's beats as well... you're contradicting yourself because you were talkin' about complex is better and you're sayin' the Michael Jackson's album is phenomemal "musically"... his beats were simplistic as fuck... what made his album phenomenal was the impact, vocals, beats, styles, and more all compacted into one... nobody had done it like him before...... the beats (which you are sayin' deciphers how musical an album is) weren't the standout.... and the beats aren't the only thing that defines "musical"... there's vocals, impact, lyrics, and more

UMMM... almost every producer is EHHHHH compared to Kanye West cuz I think Kanye West is BY FAR the best producer... but Premiere and Pete Rock are dope as fuck also... Premiere, IMO, is the third best producer (Jus' Blaze gets my second spot)... Pete Rock is lower top 10... they're ILL... stop hatin' on 'em

they got more classics than almost every PRESENT day producer will have before their careers over

Premo can keep up with Just Blaze... Pete Rock's below both of 'em... they don't produce the same way they used to.... and Premo's used to be ahead of his time back in the day... people caught up to him... and he got a 'lil better, even at that... Premo's the shit

umm, you're wilin'... the whole purpose of the song is to just talk about nasty shit... so Em did just that... and he's not talkin' about fuckin' animals... he's talkin' about "there's several different levels to devil worshippin'........"

EM'S VERSE:
"There's several different levels to Devil worshippin: horse's heads,
human sacrifices, canibalism; candles and exorcism
Animals havin sex with 'em; camels mammals and rabbits
But I don't get into that, I kick the habit - I just,
beat you to death with weapons that eat through the flesh
And I never eat you unless the fuckin, meat looks fresh
I got a lion in my pocket, I'm lyin, I got a nine in my pocket
and baby I'm just, dyin to cock him
He's ready for war, I'm ready for war
I got machetes and swords for any faggot that said he was raw
My uz' as, heavy as yours, yeah you met me before
I just didn't have as large an arsenal of weapons before
Marshall will step in the door, I lay your head on the floor
With your body spread on the bedspread, red on the wall
red on the ceilin, red on the floor, get a new whore
Met on the second, wet on the third;
then she's dead on the fourth - I'm dead wrong"

that shit's FIRE... WAYYYYYYYYYY ahead of BIGGIE lyrically, flow-wise, and just what he's sayin'.... Biggie was talkin' about murdering and raping so Em just took it another level and started talkin' about devil worshippin' and finished the verse off talkin' about murdering a girl... how is that not what the song's about? umm, Em ripped it harder than BIG... point blank

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no it's not....that shit is so wack
he's talking about eating people and having lions in his pocket
shit so wack
devil worshippin? wtf is that? so wack.
like I said...it was put together nicely...but it's wack

Tears don't affect me, I hit 'em with the tech G
Disrespect me - my potency is deadly
I'm shootin babies, no ifs ands or maybes
Hit mummy in the tummy if the hooker plays a dummy
Slit the wrist of little sis
After she sucked the dick, I stabbed her brother with the icepick
because he wanted me to fuck him from the back
but Smalls don't get down like that
Got your father hidin in a room; fucked him with the broom
Slit him down the back and threw salt in the wound
Who you think you're dealin with?
Anybody step into my path is fuckin feelin it!
Hardcore, I got it sucked like a pussy
Stab ya til you're gushy, so please don't push.. me
I'm using rubbers so they won't trace the semen
The black demon, got the little hookers screamin
Because you know I love it young, fresh and green
with no hair in between, know what I mean?

yes...he killed it...1000 times better. Yes Eminem has better technique but it still doesn't make what he says better...lyrical content of Em was so wack on this song. While he's talking about swords and other nonsense...Biggie take you on a story of how he killed a whole family.

"beat you to death with weapons that'll eat through ya flesh and I'll never eat you unless the fuckin meat looks fresh"
put together nice but it's so wack. How you gon beat somebody with a weapon that eats through their flesh? and then outta nowhere...just cause it sounds good..."Ill never eat you unless the fuckin meat looks fresh", then switch topics...no way that Em verse was anywhere near what biggie spit....I'm not even a biggie smalls fan but any fool can see who's verse was better. Get outta here man.

no it's not....that shit is so wack
he's talking about eating people and having lions in his pocket
shit so wack
devil worshippin? wtf is that? so wack.
like I said...it was put together nicely...but it's wack

Tears don't affect me, I hit 'em with the tech G
Disrespect me - my potency is deadly
I'm shootin babies, no ifs ands or maybes
Hit mummy in the tummy if the hooker plays a dummy
Slit the wrist of little sis
After she sucked the dick, I stabbed her brother with the icepick
because he wanted me to fuck him from the back
but Smalls don't get down like that
Got your father hidin in a room; fucked him with the broom
Slit him down the back and threw salt in the wound
Who you think you're dealin with?
Anybody step into my path is fuckin feelin it!
Hardcore, I got it sucked like a pussy
Stab ya til you're gushy, so please don't push.. me
I'm using rubbers so they won't trace the semen
The black demon, got the little hookers screamin
Because you know I love it young, fresh and green
with no hair in between, know what I mean?

yes...he killed it...1000 times better. Yes Eminem has better technique but it still doesn't make what he says better...lyrical content of Em was so wack on this song. While he's talking about swords and other nonsense...Biggie take you on a story of how he killed a whole family.

"beat you to death with weapons that'll eat through ya flesh and I'll never eat you unless the fuckin meat looks fresh"
put together nice but it's so wack. How you gon beat somebody with a weapon that eats through their flesh? and then outta nowhere...just cause it sounds good..."Ill never eat you unless the fuckin meat looks fresh", then switch topics...no way that Em verse was anywhere near what biggie spit....I'm not even a biggie smalls fan but any fool can see who's verse was better. Get outta here man.

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WTF!?!?! are you a complete moron? you judge a verse you don't understand? you don't know what devil worshippin' is and says it's wack!?!?! you're an imbecile....

Devil worshipping is satanic, cult-like activities where they sacrifice animals, humans, and do all sorts of NASTY things... everything he says makes sense.... you're just not intelligent enough to understand it... Em rips that shit hard

outshined BIG EASILY

his content was dope... whether you understood it or not.... and there are weapons that eat through your flesh... EXAMPLES: whips, belts, everything Jesus was beat with....

when i said "Wtf is that?"... I meant it like 'What are you doing...what is that?" not "I don't know what devil worshipping is" feel me?

but anyhow that shit is wack....it's a TECHNICALLY superior verse but the lyrical content as said before is wack and doesn't come close to Biggie. I didn't say it didn't make sense I said it was nonsense. Why would he talk about devil worshipping? That's stupid, absurd anything else ya wanna put there. It ruined the song.

Look faggot.
A rapper=a mic and a voice. Then with time, rappers evolved and now technics are more develloped.
Instrumentally, it's the same...Still a melody, a drumline and a bassline but used differently (with a mo' musical technic)

Fuckin retarded.

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There isn't a musical technique, only a more musical style of sound. It's not like cats are sitting down with sheet music, or learning to play instruments... they're using the same techniques with new sound choices on better equipment the majority of the time.

Why? Haha
With modern equipement it's easy to make orchestra compositions AND OTHER compositions (electronical, acoustic...)
Wake up you fuckin kid.

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Right, because everyone knows digitized sound samples are so much more musical and crisp than live instrumentation lol

...and of course, the genius of composition in the work of classic composers is so EASILY surpassed by anybody who has a keyboard and drum machine

Those were both ********* btw

I didn't say that...I said Pop music was superior to Hip Hop until The Blueprint...

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What's the difference. It isn't, and never has been.

Is that supposed to prove Pop music is wack? Hahaha

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Uh, no. It's supposed to prove that this generalizatrion you have of pop music being a superior form of music makes no sense, when every genre (including hip-hop since Walk This Way) is encompassed in pop music merely by it's representation on television, radio, and billboard charts.

Haha
You're a fuckin moron dude.
The prime form of hip hop is a rhythm and a voice on it.
Kanye is faaaar away from that wack shit dude.

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What about rhymes and flow?

If Kanye isn't indicative of hip-hop in it's prime, then how is that you say modern hip-hop is the best it's ever been? Someone was their best in their prime... English; Learn it.

Fag'
I didn't say any shit acoustic was wack.
Rap didn't change from acoustic to electric shits...
Befo', rap had his own beats, shit was repetititve (weather it was acoustic or electric)...Now rap is musical.

Learn punk.

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So what did it change from? Samples ('79) to samples ('05)? Live instrumentation ('80's with Aerosmith and Run DMC, and The Roots since '95 onto Wyclef and RZA and Dre... to live instrumentation in '05). What exactly changed?

The turntablist is a musician, but since you know nothing about hip-hop and the craft, art, technique and musical styles involved in it as a whole... you wouldn't understand how being deadly with your hands is a musical skill that no pop producer with a multi-million dollar studio can compete with, unless they're the person playing every instrument they record and and sample. Which very few are...

when i said "Wtf is that?"... I meant it like 'What are you doing...what is that?" not "I don't know what devil worshipping is" feel me?

but anyhow that shit is wack....it's a TECHNICALLY superior verse but the lyrical content as said before is wack and doesn't come close to Biggie. I didn't say it didn't make sense I said it was nonsense. Why would he talk about devil worshipping? That's stupid, absurd anything else ya wanna put there. It ruined the song.

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Why would he rap about devil worshipping? Same reason Biggie rapped about murdering a entire family... Em just took it to a more extreme level... he's allowed to do that and he did it VERY WELL....