[project1dev] Re: Mine Props

From: Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>

To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx

Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 18:02:35 -0700

and do you know if 3ds supports animation? sorry if i asked before
On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 6:00 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> hey if you send a 3ds file my way or if you have a couple of em layin
> around send em my way and i'll see if that loader code works on em (:
>
>
> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 5:46 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> yeah i use a mesh optomizer to lower the polycount before i import into
>> milkshape, it works ok
>>
>>
>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 8:44 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>>> oh and our engine only supports polygons, it doesnt let you import
>>> bezier curves directly or anything.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 5:43 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>
>>>> well milkshape only supports polygons so they'll have to be broken into
>>>> polygons at some point yeah :/
>>>>
>>>> whatever does the breaking into polygons might have a setting for how
>>>> many polygons to use or some smoothness tolerance.
>>>>
>>>> Or maybe 3ds has some kind of mesh optomizer in it? if so that would be
>>>> really neat.
>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 5:40 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> alan i have a noobish question... when i 3d model i use bezier curves,
>>>>> etc. to keep models simple but then when i bring them into 3ds to export
>>>>> for
>>>>> milkshape everything turns into polygons and becomes super huge... is that
>>>>> just something im going to have to deal with? or am i missing something?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 8:36 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> but hey i found some sample code someone wrote for opening 3ds files.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> it might not work out of the box but if it works as advertised, or
>>>>>> anywhere near close, it should be kinda easy just to open another file
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> write out the data in the milkshape file format (hopefully).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It would be cool if we could find a way to not have to but if we do at
>>>>>> least part of the work is done with that code if it actually works ok
>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 5:32 PM, Alan Wolfe
>>>>>> <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> its ok
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> and yeah milkshape is bad
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> i complained to the creator and he blew me off saying "pff everyone
>>>>>>> always says its great, ive never had negative feedback before it must
>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>> be you"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> so yeah... sucks :p
>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 5:26 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> im givin it the old college try (:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> its just a matter of getting the work flow down, getting textures to
>>>>>>>> work, getting animation to work...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> i guess part of it is i am coming from really user friendly programs
>>>>>>>> and milkshape is not really an artist's tool... i am getting it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> sorry alan, i dont want you to be upset :(
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 8:19 PM, Alan Wolfe
>>>>>>>> <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> well hey, what formats can 3ds save as?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Any favorite formats that support animation?
>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 5:18 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> well keep trying, see if anyone can figure it out.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ill try and read up on the 3ds file format and some others in case
>>>>>>>>>> we need to make a converter
>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 5:11 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> i got the barrel working, the problem is complex textures and
>>>>>>>>>>> getting them to map correctly. i'm sorry for venting my
>>>>>>>>>>> frustration, it
>>>>>>>>>>> just sucks bringing a model from c4d where it looks amazing, to 3ds
>>>>>>>>>>> where it
>>>>>>>>>>> still looks good, to milkshape where it falls apart and it takes 20
>>>>>>>>>>> minutes
>>>>>>>>>>> to get it to look half decent...
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> i'll jus
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 8:05 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> well actually a more reasonable alternative is making a program
>>>>>>>>>>>> that converts from some other format into ms3d files ourselves.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> That actually wouldn't be as bad....
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> If worst comes to worst I'm not opposed to that but we should
>>>>>>>>>>>> seriously see if we can get it to work since if we can, i can work
>>>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>>> features and optimizations.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> maybe try a plane? or a single triangle?
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 5:01 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ok lets call the game off <g> :P
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> there's a way to get it to work im sure, we just have to find
>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the alternative is spending a few months re-writing the code
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that deals with models and animation
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 4:55 PM, eric drewes <
>>>>>>>>>>>>> figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *builds cube* *milkshape crashes*
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 7:50 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> maybe start with a simple shape and see if you can get that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 4:36 PM, eric drewes <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> i cant even get it to import textures correctly :(
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 7:30 PM, <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yeah I think it can but we have to get it to import first
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *From*: Alan Wolfe
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Date*: Mon, 18 May 2009 16:21:08 -0700
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *To*: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Subject*: [project1dev] Re: Mine Props
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but hey also if milkshape can import regular model data,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> i bet it can import animation data too
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> yeah, milkshape does bone animation that allows you to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> assign each vert to whatever bone you want.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think it has it so you can weight a vertex to multiple
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bones too but im not sure how that works so our engine
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesnt currently
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 4:17 PM, eric drewes <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well the thing about it is... somewhere along the lines
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we're gonna be able to need to do pretty detailed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> animation, does milkshape
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support that in program? i am willing to learn animation
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over again if it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> will work, i just want to get a consistant workflow going
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that will work
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> longterm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 6:59 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that sucks man ):
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hey, learning to animate in milkshape was kinda a pain
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but i spent like 3 hours and learned it back when i was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> first coding the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> animation stuff.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you want i could make (possibly bad) animations of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the dog men. Or i could try and find the youtube tutorial
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> vids if you want
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to see them.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 3:33 PM, eric drewes <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> i dont want to duplicate efforts... no reason for it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> i'll tackle lanterns, lanterns with poles for the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> walls, barrels, crates (ew!)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> will have them done tonight at the expense of finishing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> kobold animation (whcih i am frustrated w/ :-P)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 6:26 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fair enough if you dont mind the duplicated efforts :P
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 3:22 PM, Matthew Freeland <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mattthefiend@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Multiple versions of the same thing isn't necessarily
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a bad thing. :P
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 3:21 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you guys might wanna let eachother know what you are
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working on so you don't waste effort and like,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone comes back w/ a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shovel or something hehe
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 3:20 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Eric wanted to do the lighting pass so i leave that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to him (:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 3:14 PM, Matthew Freeland
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mattthefiend@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Okay, so in order to make the mines a little
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> prettier like Mr. Eric has been saying, I came up
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with a small list of props
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to get together.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Torch Bracket (w/ torch and without)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shovel/Pick/Sifters and other mining equipment
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hooded lantern (To hang from the support columns)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Barrels
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Crates
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A stuffed Nick head on a taxidermy frame for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> threatening to eat my wormly family (I'll handle
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that one)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Small rubble piles along the walls
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as well I am going to work on making the finished
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rail pieces, corner pieces, connectors, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> railstops. as well I am going to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> make some cave in blocks.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Little vertical columns with boards bracing loose
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rocks, it should look cool.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All stuff within the milestone list I believe,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> although I don't know how to apply lighting so I'll
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> make Alan do it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> P.S. Nick must DIE.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>