Atheist Nexus2016-12-10T03:55:55ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985http://api.ning.com:80/files/kZzo8PgK6neQN4AfxW4EG8lio8WXn0XSgqGXhrjLcnz6wFQSa-7LXzOI*ItARRbbgifycjdTrRuWIx0iU2Ci9jHlOgwyAvvH/genericprofilepicture.png?width=48&height=48&crop=1%3A1http://atheistnexus.org/group/prolifenonbelievers/forum/topic/listForContributor?user=1gjyk8z9l17av&feed=yes&xn_auth=noAmusing (to me at least)tag:atheistnexus.org,2011-06-15:2182797:Topic:13492502011-06-15T13:34:56.448ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
<p>This is about 6 months old now, but I was just made aware of this by someone from a prolife group...</p>
<p> </p>
<h1 class="entry-title">Anti-choice bf doesn’t fit the mold</h1>
<p> </p>
<p><a href="http://community.feministing.com/2011/01/05/anti-choice-bf-doesnt-fit-the-mold/">http://community.feministing.com/2011/01/05/anti-choice-bf-doesnt-fit-the-mold/</a></p>
<p>This is about 6 months old now, but I was just made aware of this by someone from a prolife group...</p>
<p> </p>
<h1 class="entry-title">Anti-choice bf doesn’t fit the mold</h1>
<p> </p>
<p><a href="http://community.feministing.com/2011/01/05/anti-choice-bf-doesnt-fit-the-mold/">http://community.feministing.com/2011/01/05/anti-choice-bf-doesnt-fit-the-mold/</a></p> Point of Inquirytag:atheistnexus.org,2010-09-21:2182797:Topic:9836842010-09-21T19:35:13.589ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
Hey folks,<br/><br/>I was interviewed for the most recent Point of Inquiry episode about athiest opposition to abortion. Check it out here: <a href="http://www.pointofinquiry.org/jen_roth_atheist_against_abortion/">http://www.pointofinquiry.org/jen_roth_atheist_against_abortion/</a> or on iTunes.<br/><br/>
Hey folks,<br/><br/>I was interviewed for the most recent Point of Inquiry episode about athiest opposition to abortion. Check it out here: <a href="http://www.pointofinquiry.org/jen_roth_atheist_against_abortion/">http://www.pointofinquiry.org/jen_roth_atheist_against_abortion/</a> or on iTunes.<br/><br/> Purpose of this grouptag:atheistnexus.org,2010-08-04:2182797:Topic:9335462010-08-04T04:42:15.284ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
For whatever reason, I haven't been receiving email notices of activity in this group, so I didn't know there had been a blow-up until I was contacted by the Atheist Nexus moderators.<br></br><br></br>As far as I'm concerned, discussion and disagreement among pro-life or pro-life-leaning people is welcome -- we're not a monolith, and I don't expect us to agree on everything. Where disagreement becomes inappropriate is when pro-choicers come here to tell us how wrong we are for being pro-life or when…
For whatever reason, I haven't been receiving email notices of activity in this group, so I didn't know there had been a blow-up until I was contacted by the Atheist Nexus moderators.<br/><br/>As far as I'm concerned, discussion and disagreement among pro-life or pro-life-leaning people is welcome -- we're not a monolith, and I don't expect us to agree on everything. Where disagreement becomes inappropriate is when pro-choicers come here to tell us how wrong we are for being pro-life or when theists come here to tell us how wrong we are for being atheists.<br/><br/>If you believe someone is behaving inappropriately, I ask you to please contact me rather than taking it upon yourself to police who is or is not pro-life enough. Thank you. <br/><br/>I apologize for letting this get out of hand. I clearly need to log in to AN more often.<br/> What does 'pro-life' mean to you?tag:atheistnexus.org,2010-07-27:2182797:Topic:9240652010-07-27T09:07:04.231ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
In another discussion within this group, the question was raised, "What does 'prolife' mean?" There was a point of dispute about this. Since (presumably) we all self-identify as prolifers, it might be helpful if we could come up with some sort of a consensus view. <br></br><br></br>The dispute concerned the information for this group which says, "For atheists, agnostics, secular humanists, etc. who believe in expanding the definition of "person" to embrace human beings before birth as well as…
In another discussion within this group, the question was raised, "What does 'prolife' mean?" There was a point of dispute about this. Since (presumably) we all self-identify as prolifers, it might be helpful if we could come up with some sort of a consensus view. <br/><br/>The dispute concerned the information for this group which says, "For atheists, agnostics, secular humanists, etc. who believe in expanding the definition of "person" to embrace human beings before birth as well as after."<br/><br/>One individual stated, "I am indeed an atheist who believes in expanding the definition of 'person' to embrace human beings before birth. How far before birth is up for debate, of course, but I think the idea that 1 minute, 1 hour, and even 3 months before birth are fairly cut and dry in that there is no distinction between a fetus and a baby in that time period. Before that is where I think it becomes complex, and other factors need to be weighed in." Another individual stated that the first person (because he didn't support a right to life earlier than the third trimester) was not prolife.<br/><br/>I'm accustomed to defining things using sufficient and necessary conditions. <br/><br/>A necessary condition is one which must be present if something is to meet a definition, but which by itself doesn't guarantee that the definition is met. For example, 'being a two wheeled vehicle' would be a necessary condition for meeting the definition of 'motorcycle'. (Bicycles also have this necessary condition, so it's not a sufficient condition to meet either definition.) <br/><br/>A sufficient condition is one which guarantees that a definition is met, but which may not be necessary for meeting the definition. For example, 'being an Indian Chief Model 340' is a sufficient condition for meeting the definition of 'motorcycle'. (That isn't a necessary condition since Ducatis, Harley-Davidson's, etc. are also motorcycles.)<br/><br/>A proper definition is the union of all (and only) necessary conditions, which together are the set of sufficient conditions. For example, the definition of motorcycle could be, 'a motorized two wheeled vehicle with one wheel directly in front of the other'. (This would include all motorcycles, but exclude bicycles and things like the Segway.)<br/><br/>Extending the right to life to at least some humans prior to birth, in my opinion is a necessary but not a sufficient condition for being prolife. There are quite a few prochoice people who feel that abortion should generally be prohibited after the point of viability.<br/><br/>I'm interested in what we, as a group of secular-minded prolifers, think about this<br/><br/>---------------------------------<br/><br/>
PS: My first stab at a definition is...<br/><br/>
If you agree: <br/><br/>That every living human organism which under ordinary conditions will develop into a conscious and aware human being has a right to life (which may or may not be given up as a result of his or her personal choices) which is in ordinary cases strong enough to prohibit the taking of that life (although it may or may not be stronger than a mother's right to bodily autonomy in cases of rape, incest, or when the mother's life is threatened). <br/><br/> Then: <br/><br/>You meet the definition of "prolife". objections to pro-life atheiststag:atheistnexus.org,2010-07-23:2182797:Topic:9195282010-07-23T21:20:34.821ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
I am evolving towards a pro life stance as an atheist, because it seems to align more with reason, and if one is to be completely unemotional and pragmatic, abortion should be considered a last resort just like any form of violence against any life form.<br></br><br></br>Arguments I've heard from pro-choice folks are mainly from the "freedom over controlling one's own body" perspective.<br></br><br></br>Well, we all have the right to control our bodies but only to the extent it doesnt harm someone or in some…
I am evolving towards a pro life stance as an atheist, because it seems to align more with reason, and if one is to be completely unemotional and pragmatic, abortion should be considered a last resort just like any form of violence against any life form.<br/><br/>Arguments I've heard from pro-choice folks are mainly from the "freedom over controlling one's own body" perspective.<br/><br/>Well, we all have the right to control our bodies but only to the extent it doesnt harm someone or in some cases some thing else.<br/><br/>As our knowledge of science expands, we see less and less distinction between humans and other life forms, and we've come to learn that all life forms have a common ancestor. This, to my way of thinking, makes anyone or anything capable of empathy accountable to the rest of the living things to be conscious of their fellow beings, and understand the gravity of responsibility when it comes to doing violence to another life form.<br/><br/>I dont know if this means either the extremes of no "morning after pill " or "abortions up to 1 second before birth", I dont like either extreme of the argument, as a rational, caring, loving human being.<br/><br/>I think the issue is more complex than pro life or pro choice as defined in our society, but I think as thinking, rational atheists, we need to acknowledge the complexity of the issue and , as we do in all scientific pursuits, constantly refine and re-evaluate our positions in light of new discoveries and be ready to put aside cherished beliefs in favor of doing the right thing.<br/><br/>For now, Id err on the side of caution. I cant imagine how incredibly horrible it would be to experience an abortion from a fetus's perspective. Thats something the pro-choice side is alarmingly quick to dismiss, stating that they feel no pain etc when we truly have no idea, and are pretty sure there is little to distinguish a third trimester fetus from a newborn baby.<br/><br/>My two cents.<br/> Scientists Teach Cultured Brain Cells in a Petri Dish to Keep Timetag:atheistnexus.org,2010-06-16:2182797:Topic:8673612010-06-16T18:37:44.470ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
Scientists at UCLA taught cultured brain cells in a petri dish to generate timing.<div><br/></div>
<div><a href="http://esciencenews.com/articles/2010/06/15/ucla.scientists.teach.cultured.brain.cells.keep.time">http://esciencenews.com/articles/2010/06/15/ucla.scientists.teach.cultured.brain.cells.keep.time</a></div>
Scientists at UCLA taught cultured brain cells in a petri dish to generate timing.<div><br/></div>
<div><a href="http://esciencenews.com/articles/2010/06/15/ucla.scientists.teach.cultured.brain.cells.keep.time">http://esciencenews.com/articles/2010/06/15/ucla.scientists.teach.cultured.brain.cells.keep.time</a></div> Which person is easier to persuade?tag:atheistnexus.org,2009-10-13:2182797:Topic:5502172009-10-13T06:09:50.960ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
Given one person who is a Pro-Choice Nonbeliever and another person who is a Pro-Life Believer, which person, from your experience(s), would you find easier to persuade towards adopting our Pro-Life Nonbeliever stance?<br />
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It is granted that each and every person is different, but for any person on average what do your experiences suggest, or what does your best guess tell you?<br />
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Your responses are much appreciated.
Given one person who is a Pro-Choice Nonbeliever and another person who is a Pro-Life Believer, which person, from your experience(s), would you find easier to persuade towards adopting our Pro-Life Nonbeliever stance?<br />
<br />
It is granted that each and every person is different, but for any person on average what do your experiences suggest, or what does your best guess tell you?<br />
<br />
Your responses are much appreciated. Where we stand?tag:atheistnexus.org,2009-08-31:2182797:Topic:4844022009-08-31T01:45:10.698ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
I'd be interested to see where we all stand regarding abortion and euthanasia. I've given up trying to speak with non academic Pro-choicers in forums, but it will nice to dicuss where we each stand or argue our differing stances.<br />
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I'm against general abortions except where it involves rape. &amp; if the foetus is about to soon die anyway.<br />
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Regarding euthanasia I'm in principle for cases where a person can give consent. Though at the moment I'm against living wills that are relied on to given…
I'd be interested to see where we all stand regarding abortion and euthanasia. I've given up trying to speak with non academic Pro-choicers in forums, but it will nice to dicuss where we each stand or argue our differing stances.<br />
<br />
I'm against general abortions except where it involves rape. &amp; if the foetus is about to soon die anyway.<br />
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Regarding euthanasia I'm in principle for cases where a person can give consent. Though at the moment I'm against living wills that are relied on to given the consent. Stem Cell Researchtag:atheistnexus.org,2009-08-30:2182797:Topic:4838802009-08-30T17:30:10.075ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
If you have not visited this website yet, you are definitely going to like it (<a href="http://www.stemcellresearch.org/index.html">http://www.stemcellresearch.org/index.html</a>).<br />
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This is an anti-embryonic stem cell organization. There Founding Statement recognizes the use of embryonic stem cells as unethical since the cells are inevitably destroyed. They have catalogued much of the debate (of course from the pro-alternative perspective), from 1999 to present, regarding the use of embryonic…
If you have not visited this website yet, you are definitely going to like it (<a href="http://www.stemcellresearch.org/index.html">http://www.stemcellresearch.org/index.html</a>).<br />
<br />
This is an anti-embryonic stem cell organization. There Founding Statement recognizes the use of embryonic stem cells as unethical since the cells are inevitably destroyed. They have catalogued much of the debate (of course from the pro-alternative perspective), from 1999 to present, regarding the use of embryonic vs alternative stem cells. Additionally, at there website, you will find links to papers favorable to stem cell alternatives.<br />
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If you are interested, I would encourage you to read their Founding Statement and then take a look at the Facts and Information section. No pointtag:atheistnexus.org,2009-05-28:2182797:Topic:3451482009-05-28T03:43:10.003ZAndrewhttp://atheistnexus.org/profile/Andrew985
Well if the recent debate I was just in is anything to go by some atheists here are just as closed minded as any other group with pet beliefs.<br />
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Not once did any of them even address any of the mainstream philosophical points and just resorted to pet replies and name calling.<br />
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I'm not sure how we can overcome this?
Well if the recent debate I was just in is anything to go by some atheists here are just as closed minded as any other group with pet beliefs.<br />
<br />
Not once did any of them even address any of the mainstream philosophical points and just resorted to pet replies and name calling.<br />
<br />
I'm not sure how we can overcome this?