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In this case, it's a Yellow Box on Purley way at a horrible junction (anyone who knows that road will know it). It goes uphill so can have poor visibility.

Anyway, I'm following traffic, and there's clearly plenty of room beyond the box. I'm following another car, and for some reason he stops about half a car width in front of the yellow box though has plenty of room in front of him. I unfortunately then have to stop. Half my car is beyond the yellow box (or just under) - front tyres beyond it, rear tyers on the wrong side.

I wasn't blocking any traffic what so ever. And after me beeping the idiot in front a few times, he moved forward and I proceeded to go beyond the box.

Is this grounds for appeal? My worry is that I appeal, it gets denied, and rather than pay the £65 discounted fine I have to pay the full £130.

Would love advice on this from any experts. If everyone stopped before the other side was openly clear, it would be ridiculous as it is uphill so that would mean every car at a green light on this 30 road would have to stop, wait, and then go?

Thanks!

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I would argue that 100% of people do not wait for the hatched area to be fully clear before entering it. The start of the hatched area is not like a stop junction.. This is a 30mph road, dual carriage way, uphill. If EVERY car stopped first, waited, then went, that would be weird.

The guy had plenty of room in front of him (and did move once I beeped a few times). This is the weird thing - If you drive and go over a yellow box next time, I would bet a large amount of cash that, when clear in front of the car ahead, you enter the hatched area before the other car has exited...

"The internet is a great way to get on the net."
- Bob Dole, Republican presidential candidate

I would argue that 100% of people do not wait for the hatched area to be fully clear before entering it. The start of the hatched area is not like a stop junction.. This is a 30mph road, dual carriage way, uphill. If EVERY car stopped first, waited, then went, that would be weird.

The guy had plenty of room in front of him (and did move once I beeped a few times). This is the weird thing - If you drive and go over a yellow box next time, I would bet a large amount of cash that, when clear in front of the car ahead, you enter the hatched area before the other car has exited...

But if the exit IS clear when you enter it, because the car in front of you is crossing the box, then he stops in the box or immediately on the other side of the box and forces you to stop in the box?

I don't know this junction but some of those cross hatched boxes are very big. Are you saying only one car can enter at a time and the car behind has to wait for the car in front to fully cross the box and an extra space for you before you enter the box? I can't see that happening ever. If people did that these junctions would grind to a halt with massive tailbacks.

But if the exit IS clear when you enter it, because the car in front of you is crossing the box, then he stops in the box or immediately on the other side of the box and forces you to stop in the box?

I don't know this junction but some of those cross hatched boxes are very big. Are you saying only one car can enter at a time and the car behind has to wait for the car in front to fully cross the box and an extra space for you before you enter the box? I can't see that happening ever. If people did that these junctions would grind to a halt with massive tailbacks.

The way you describe it the traffic was not free flowing. So if you have to stop and wait until the exit is clear and the car in front is not going to block you then you can go. If the traffic slow moving waiting a few seconds won't cause too many issues.

The actual legislation to which the HC refers says: "...no person shall cause a vehicle to enter the box junction so that the vehicle has to stop within the box junction due to the presence of stationary vehicle", with the same exception about turning right.

I was caught in almost identical circumstances in a London Borough adjoining yours. I wrote a reasoned reply pointing out that the car in front had stopped with a long gap in front of him which resulted in my back tyres being on the edge of the yellow box. Mentioned that the photos attached to the fine letter showed clearly that I wasn't causing an obstruction to traffic on or joining the main road. Sadly they declined my appeal, saying that it was up to me to ensure that the car in front had left sufficient space for me to cross the box!

On the plus side, there was an indication on the original letter that the reduced rate of fine would be applied in the event of an appeal being made provided it was paid within 14 days of the appeal being declined. If that's the case with yours I'd give an appeal a go - you've nothing to lose! Good luck.

The actual legislation to which the HC refers says: "...no person shall cause a vehicle to enter the box junction so that the vehicle has to stop within the box junction due to the presence of stationary vehicle", with the same exception about turning right.

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