How To Rebut Gripes

Rebuttals should address reasons it is not a valid gripe, and should not accuse the gripe of being "silly" or "stupid."

Rockstar must not have tested the PC version with the 10% of the population that uses a left-handed mouse. Setting up the controls for a left-handed player (arrow keys for driving) is just stupid (conflicts with phone menus). Also, useful keys HOME and NUMPAD-7 are reserved.

Agreed. On a similar note, you can't bind more than one key to a function either. I'm ambidextruous so I typically use both WAS&D and the arrow keys for driving, and switch between the two depending on what I'm doing. For example, if I'm doing drive bys I'll drive with the left hand, but otherwise I drive with my right. That's impossible now.

Especially since R* made a completely desperate effort to make the PC version without proper testing. Stick with the PS3 and 360, R* (not flaming or anything).

Even though I don't care much about this gripe because im right handed, i do agree with it entirely. They should have tested it more.

Hotwiring cars takes a very short time, even if the car is expensive. Much rarer cars should take more time to hotwire, and crappier cars should take less time. Yet it's the same for every car.

Niko has had plenty of practice, so it doesn't bother him at all.

Even the world's best car thief doesnt take 3 seconds to hotwire an expensive car.

I have noticed that more expensive cars take a slightly longer time. Also, Niko seems to take longer when he is under pressure.

One time Niko took quite a long time to hotwire a car once maybe 2 mins and i know this doesnt have anythin to do with gta but in the transformers movies michaela took about 5 seconds to hotwire the cars i watched em with my friends nephew

Parking cars often causes them to dissappear. If you have a particularly nice car, or you're driving a unique car (such as the black on black cavalcade that playboy gives you) this can be quite annoying. Perhaps either making cars not dissappear, or making designated parking spaces allover town, would remedy this problem.

no everything is perfect for the next GTA this wouldn't happen.

When you enter most missions, the last car you drove will be parked somewhere nearby at the end of the cutscene (even if you originally parked it somewhere else nearby). Some do not do this, though, and I agree that the game should never "forget" the location of the last vehicle you entered (besides required mission vehicles).

In San Andreas, you would be able to raise your driving skill. However in GTA IV you cannot do so, which makes driving hard and unrewarding. Obviously, if you do a lot of driving, you become more experienced in it. Not having the ability to raise your driving skill detracts from realism in the game.

You get better in driving, if you do a lot of it, because you get used to the controls.

Getting used to the controls is one thing, but GTA IV offers no way of *raising* your driving skill, which was one of the aspects that GTA SA was known for.

Driving Skill was fun to others, but annoying to others. Looks like the annoyed won. You will get used to the driving system eventually, and will become a professional at it. GTA4 dropped the skill building system because the game was perfectly balanced without it, and if it was added, then GTA4 would be very glitchy.

In real life your car doesn't get easier to drive, you just get better at it. GTA4 is not an RPG.

Exactly, you would get better at driving a car. The way it was incorporated into San Andreas was to make it easier to drive vehicles. After a certain amount of time progresses, you would be able to drive like a real professional. However in GTA IV, you're still hitting curbs and slamming into other cars, regardless of how long you have played the game.

You Don't read the gripes above don't you?. 1. The driving skill is useless and stupid. 2. For me and whole other people don't smash with other cars because if you drive A LOT, YOU GET BETTER, it's stupid to throw out the reallity of drive a real car and the consequences that it has, just for you can call yourself a "professional", if you wanna be a "professional" get just to it.

"the driving skill is useless and stupid". That's YOUR OPINION. Secondly, if you want to counter my gripe, do so without attacking me(through the internet) in the process. I've played GTA IV for quite a while so obviously I have become quite accustomed to the controls. What I'm griping about is the fact that there is no sense of realism because it feels as if your character never becomes a better driver. the only difference is YOU AS A PERSON BECOMES ACCUSTOMED TO THE CONTROLS.

The point is that the 'driving skill' in San Andreas basically just improves the car handling as the stat increases so it's more difficult to spin them out. Making the car get easier to handle as you drive more makes no sense whatsoever, and has nothing to do with your skills with the controls. That's like having a firearm that gets more accurate with each bullet you fire, when being a good marksman is all about your skills at handling the weapon. Stats shouldn't come into it. The only way to become a better driver is to practice with the controls, as there's always room for personal improvement. That's the way it should be.

That's like saying the only way you can become better at a game is by mastering the controls. For the sake of realism, the driving skill was to create the feeling of your character becoming better at driving, which should have been added in GTA IV. And honestly, what was the point of that analogy about firearms? We're talking about virtual reality games here.

Point taken about the analogy, since obviously it's the player character's driving ability, not the car handling, that is said to change when your driving skill stat increases. That said, I still stand by my original position that; if anything, the player character's driving ability being handicapped until they've driven enough to increase their skill statistic is anything but realistic. Even if a 'driving skill' was implemented, how exactly would it be made to effect the player's driving? Would having low driving skill make all cars have exaggerated oversteer or understeer and looser suspension so they spin out more easily? How is that fair? Or realistic?

Before I continue, I have to say, I'm having trouble figuring out the motivations behind this gripe, I'm guessing most of you who want a driving skill feature want the way the car handling is now to be that way at the unskilled level, and for it to get easier to drive than it is now as Niko gets more skilled? (As opposed to the driving being harder than it is now at unskilled, and improving until it gets to the current level) The fact is, this is just a roundabout way of saying you hate the game's car handling and want it to be easier. Well, it is how it is - for better or worse, personally I think it's better - and in the real world, being more skilled at driving doesn't mean you no longer have to brake before cornering, it won't stop cars from losing traction on uneven surfaces, and it won't stop them from spinning out if you bounce off of a light pole at 80 MPH. Get used to it, because - seen in this light - a driving skill feature is just an overly complicated solution to something only some of us see as a problem in the first place.

Anyway, I still say Niko arriving in Liberty City a bad driver and getting better over the course of a month or so makes no sense, because there's no reason to believe Niko is an amateur driver just because he's spent time at sea. Driving is a skill you don't quickly forget, and who's to say how much driving (and what kind) Niko has done in his life? The very idea of a driving skill imposes unnecessary limits on the player. In addition, the character's driving skill rarely matches the player's driving skill, so in GTA SA, when other characters would remark how CJ is such a bad driver and is 'always crashing cars, and shit', I'd think "What the hell are you talking about, Ryder?" because even at 'low driving skill' I almost never damage a car to the point of blowing it up. Not only that, GTA isn't an RPG and never was. The idea of skills and levelling up in RPGs, as I understand it, is so that the player can customize their character and choose what skills they will specialize in. The point being that in an RPG, you never will become a master in all skills, so you have to choose which skills you'll specialize in or else become a jack of all trades, master at none. GTA is completely at odds with this system, because in GTA SA skills were basically just like progress bars, and you'd achieve maximum in every skill by the end of the game, essentially turning the entire idea into an arbitrary limitation placed upon you to give you something to shoot for and make it harder at the start of the game. Eh, I could talk all day about this, it's just a bad idea in many different ways, okay? And I agree with the person two posts above me, let's keep it civil, shall we?

The driving skill was added to give a person a sense of realism which meant that they(their character) could get better at driving a car. I'm not griping because I'm always slamming into things, but I am griping because there is no improvement as to the way you(your character) drive. A person will obviously be a better driver when they are in their 30s compared to when they were a teenager, correct? So why couldn't something like this be incorporated into the game? Its not that hard. Nevertheless, GTA IV is a good game and I still play it. By the way, you need to condense your rebuttals.

I disagree. the driving skill in San Andreas isn't actually improving CJ's driving skill, it makes the cars handling performance better and therefore is unRealistic, because if you drive a car for years its handling and performance wont get better, if anything it will get worse. In GTA IV the driving skill is in your hands, you handle the car and your responsible for good or bad handling. If you cant drive, there are many Taxi's in the city to get a ride with. Personally i think the car handling is as realistic as possible, compared to other GTA games. In San Andreas it is possible to take a corner at 100mph+ and not even spin out or crash, whereas in IV that is very hard done as it is in real life. Maybe you should make more use of the Brakes and Handbrake.

I played SA heaps an I got my driving skill up real high, nothing improved really, I still spin out heaps with max skill, its just some stat. I dunno wtf your on, Bikestat and Cyclestat were good, but pilot stat wasnt too good.

You keep spinning out despite your high driving skill? Congratulations! We really don't care about your lack of skill. Oh and by the way, the driving skill would be a useless feature in a game that focuses on realisim like GTA IV. The reason? Read above gripes.

The feature of opening the trunk of a car and storing items in it is not in the game, and hurts the realism of the game when the player can't open the trunk of the car.

If you stored a lot of weapons in the trunk of your Infernus and it would go up in flames in a police chase, you'd be pretty angry to loose a car AND some expensive weapons. Also, it would be pretty time consuming to put the weapons in the trunk and take them out a few blocks later.

Maybe not weapons, but you can store items in the truck that contains no weapons, like shopping bags. It's unrealistic how pedestrians gets to open the turnk and look for something, while the player can't.

Now what in the world would the shopping bags be used for? The trunk is useless to the player. If you want to store items, try your safehouse.

Who - really - cares? In what way would this feature be useful? For that matter, ask yourself, how could they make it possible to store items in a car's trunk and make it so it's not annoying in any way? What if you had to store your RPG in the trunk of the car or leave it behind, and then - once you've stopped - be forced to retrieve it before you can use it? Too bad if you're in the middle of a car chase. One game I can think of in which it was possible to store things in vehicles was Operation Flashpoint. In fact, one mission involved ambushing a convoy, collecting all the enemy weapons, stowing them in a truck and escaping with them. Collecting all those weapons and placing them in the truck, one by one, was one of the most monotonous gameplay scenarios I've ever sit through.

Whos going to carry an RPG-7 around in their pocket? Put it in the trunk with the other big weapons like the Carbine Rifle and the Sniper Rifle.

Scarface The World Is Yours had a feature that stored weapons in the trunk. Granted, the cars were special vehicles that had to bought and phoned for, but the feature was helpful, and saved a lot of time. GTAIV lacking such a feature detracts from the longevity of the game.

This isn't Scarface.

But a feature to store weapons on the trunk would still be useful, and not that hard to make. If I wanted to go on a killing spree, but didn't want to risk all my weapons in the event that I somehow get arrested, I could just store all my weapons in my vehicle, or maybe the safehouse.

If you want weapons from a car trunk then call Little Jacob :). As calling him and buying weapons from him is basically the same as getting weapons from your trunk in Scarface. If you look closer you'll notice that GTA IV has got many features from Scarface like the new police chase system ;}

You should be able to buy clothes or food and put the bags in the trunk. Then have the clothes / food delivevered to the safe house to change clothes or eat.

This is not a valid gripe. That feature would be completely useless and be a waste of money on developement as well as being useless to the player.

The Packie bomb can only be put on certain cars, not motorcycles or trucks.

There has to be a pretty stupid person not to notice a man sitting behind their motorcycle putting a bomb under the motor, don't you think so??

Yet people seem to ignore the same guy putting a bomb under a taxicab.

Their eyes are on the road, and are tired of being at a stop light.

Or they are looking around observing their environment and would see you doing it to either. So why couldnt you out it on a motorcycle too. YOu didnt answer the gripe that you cant put a bomb on a motorcycle or truck.

Whats the difference? A vehicle bomb is a vehicle bomb.

That is exactly the point, if a vehicle bomb is a vehicle bomb, then why can't we put it on vehicles like trucks and bikes?

The feature of calling up a boss to "meet them here", etc. is not in the game, and the same goes for friends.

That was just a speculation. Not all speculations turn out to be true.

Minor clothing items are removed during some cut scenes and missions. (glasses, hats)

This can be easily explained by Niko having manners... i.e. he would remove his hat or glasses before speaking with someone.

Still affects realism though because the items just disappear into thin air.

How about Niko drops them in the gutter or accidentally crushes the glasses. Problem solved.

realistically a financially strapped person wouldn't just waste stuff like that they would put them in pockets or something then put them right back on after

How about niko a professional hitman forget that has his glasses in his pocket when he's in a middle of a figth or a gun war... and he saids "Oh no!, i broke my glasses again, but wait i have another pair in my department. Problem resolve

The ability to hang from a helicopter, shown in trailers, isn't seen in-game, nor is the ability to ride in limos.

The last mission requires you to do it. Also there's a glitch in MP that lets you hang on to the heli for unlimited amount of time.

But right after the mission, hanging a helicopter is no longer possible outside of missions. This feature strays away realism.

There is no real sense on hanging onto a helicopter and then falling down, don't you think so?

The feature should still be there, or R* shouldn't show it in a trailer if it isnt in the game.

All sorts of cool stuff gets cut out of games for more important things due to time constraints. How often would you be hanging off of a helicopter or swinging on chandeliers anyway?

Hanging from a helicopter is possible, it's just that outside missions there arent any helis flying that low so you could jump on them.

No store hold ups for easy cash or burglary missions.

You can steal money from the register in places like Tw@ internet.

There are two locations in Broker and Dukes, both laundromats, where you can take money from the register and receive a one-star wanted level.

Terribly unrealistic. How often do you see a person just walk into the store and just simply act all casual and stuff and just pop the cash register open to steal some of the cash inside, with the clerk not even noticing? That's the most unrealistic attempt ever by R*. They ought to do something better by pointing the gun at the clerk, then he'll be forced to give you money. THAT'S realistic.

You can't buy real estate like in San Andreas and Vice City.

The story features Niko and Roman being broke, and not able to be able to buy real estate. All safehouses are given to the player by other characters for free, because they don't need them. And buying an apartment isn't classified as real estate, its called renting.

Yes, you are broke for part of the story but eventually you do roll in the money, if the game wanted to keep the illusion of you being broke it could lock off buying things for awhile like how some things were not available for purchase in Vice City. At some point it\s silly to still consider them broke...

mmm ok. what's the point to waste you hard well won money when 1. all your safe houses are given by a gift of your friends and cousin. 2. you can't have 20 million $ like in San Andreas (what it's possible whit out cheats), hardly when niko ends the main story line he has in his account like less than a million of $, so you know how much it's cost a house in liberty city (NYC)? you will be again in broke after buying a lot and that it's the point of niko's life.

You can't Own Businesses.

Roman owns his cab business.

Why can't Niko own business, regardless of having all of your 50 grand?

Niko isn't a business man, he's a hit man.

Victor Vance is essentially the same, yet he ran businesses all over Vice City

Owning a business would be out of place in this game. It serves no place in the storyline or to aid gameplay. It made sense in Vice City because your aim was to own the city. Niko's pupose is to get enough money to live his life like he wants. He has no intention of owning a bunch of property.

You can't do home invasion like in San Andreas.

This isn't San Andreas.

Still, it's stupid that you can't do something, so cool.

Have fun spending 10 hours trying to get $10,000. It was taken out because of how little money is achieved for used TV's and Radio's. Also, Niko is a mercenary/hitman, not a house robber.

Well, considering the game is set in the present day, i'm sure that there would be more than just cheap TVs and radios in houses - LCD/plasma widescreen TVs, DVD players, sound systems, games consoles, PCs, I-pods (if you can pick up a small brick off the street then stealing one of these should be possible), mobile phones etc etc, one 5-10 minute robbery session could easily earn you several thousand dollars - not that you'd have anything to spend it on of course, lol.

And who wants to lug a tv down 20 flights of stairs anyway?

The semicircle health/armor system is weak, and can't be upgraded like in San Andreas.

Lets see you take plenty of bullets and get stronger. This feature, like all stat building systems was removed.

This is also good for those who likes a challenge. You don't even lose any weapons if you get wasted anyway.

Friends often call to do things at inconvenient times and are often on the other side of the city.

Choose the sleep mode on your phone.

The sleep mode does help quite a bit. However, the friend system does get rather annoying when you're trying to do missions and sleep mode gets turned off. The feature is a decent start, but it definitely needs some overhauling for the next game. Less frequent calls, offering to meet you some place or maybe picking you up instead of you always driving them around, more places to go (Liberty City only has two places to see a show?), more benefits for keeping constant contact, mini-missions that occur while out and about, etc.

Use the ignore button, or talk to them. Then call back and cancel your plans. And what if you decided where to go and your friend picked you up, but they go to the wrong place? That is why the player drives.

By pressing the Ignore button, the friendship will be decreased, thus rendering it irritating as you have to keep your friends entertained.

It is decreased very lightly, and shouldn't be worried about at all. After it gets bad, or to prevent it, then go hang out with your friends.

Your Rebut makes no sense. GTA IV has nothing to do with real life. Also, because he said that pressing the ignore button, this decreases your friend's favor, making it unrealistic since your friends (in GTA IV) demands to do something at inconvenient times, preventing the player from accessing missions.

if my friends hang up various times when i have a while whit out talking or being with them, i will get sad don't you?

Wha are you talking about? You're not making any sense. Are you talking about GTA IV the game itself or real life?

If you dont want them to hate you agree the meeting and then call them again to cancel your plans and nothing will decrease

Friends don't give you enough time to get to their location before they become impatient.

You can Hail a taxi, get in it, and do the auto ride feature which gets you there in a matter of seconds, or take a helicopter.

Yea, the taxi actually takes you there faster than you drive to the destination yourself, just skip it. Jack a car and then go with your friend.

It'd be better if they gave you twice as much time if you're in a different borough to the person to need to pick up. One hour is fine if you're in the same borough, but if I'm in Alderney and a friend in Broker wants to do an activity with me, it's almost impossible to get there in one hour's game time. The game should give you an additional hour if you're in a different borough to the person you need to pick up.

You can't go out with multiple friends at once. I find it EXTREMELY unrealistic you cant go out with multiple friends at once.

Maybe Niko just like to go out with one friend because he wants to give all the attention to that person.

Also, think about how much programming and dialogue would have to be added for your friends to react to each other. R* probably wanted to focus on other features.

The camera angle is too low with no way to change it, I spend all my driving time holding UP, same as San Andreas.

Try different camera angles to find the one you like.

All of them are two low. The only two third person ones are two low to the ground and it is hard to see oncoming traffic/poles and stuff. The other two are cinematic and first person.

I agree--it's annoying that the right-stick camera positioning isn't sticky.

The view is the way it is because it is more realistic. As stated by Rockstar, the views are the way they are because it gives you a more dynamic view of Liberty City.

The "realistic" thing would be NO third person view so the last rebut is null. The bad non-sticky view makes driving annoying.

No one has that problem, the angle is perfect.

Yes, people actually do have the problem. I'm using the PC version, and I always have to keep my hands on the mouse to keep the camera angle up. The default view doesn't let you see the next block. Plus, if I stop moving my mouse for a few seconds, the view goes back to default and I'm forced to move the mouse again.

This is a valid gripe, the 'follow' camera angles follow the car at a low angle so you can't see obstacles directly in front of the vehicle unless it's very low to the ground or you can see through the windows to the front of the car. The camera angles were fine in III and Vice City, and viewed the player vehicle at a relatively high angle so you could see things close to the front of the car, but they're too low in San Andreas and IV. Along the same lines, when you turn a sharp corner, the camera takes too long to realign itself so it's pointing straight ahead again, meaning that you can't see what's in front of you for up to two seconds after turning a corner, leading to frustrating collisions. The way around this is to move the camera manually, but this - depending on your control setup, is sometimes an awkward proposition when you're busy driving.

The only solution I have found is to enable the targeting crosshairs as soon as I start driving. This makes the camera stop moving around. I started using this method with San Andreas, and was hoping it would be corrected by GTA 4.

Also the fact that the camera is aimed more at Niko than the actual car so you gotta drive with the camera all crappy and sideways.

It sucks to use the camera with the mouse. The view doesn't have to be sticky with a controller becuase you can just move the camera up and down using the right or left anolog stick - the same one you steer with - how hard is that? Get controllers people, the controls for using the camera while driving are done very well.

There is no riot cheat! No more chaos.

As posted below somewhere, the cheat may be present, but no one's found it yet.

Well, until then, that's -1 point for GTA IV.

Last I checked, GTA IV wasn't about riot cheats. And even if you believe it should have a riot cheat because it's a open world game, well, there are missions for a reason...there are minigames for a reason...there are dates, friends, and a ton of hidden content for a reason too...

Without Riot Cheats, there is no possibility that GTA 4 can't be fun without good cheats.

Rockstar doesn't want you to cheat.

If that were true, they wouldn't make cheats for us to use.

There's no way that R* would get away with a riot cheat in Liberty City which is really New York after 9/11

The game is set in 2008. How can it possibly be at 9/11?

Think a while. On 9-11-2001 occured the attack. Now the game is set in 2008, so it's a PAST event, which happened. Therefore?

There are no other cheats other than spawning rare vehicles and increasing/reducing wanted levels. Another bad move by R* for adding few and redundant cheats. Obviously, it would be a whole lot better to have this game NOT to have cheats at all.

Some missions are somewhat difficult to pass.

Try harder.

Find an alternative way to beat the mission. For the more difficult ones, there's usually at least a few options at your disposal.

All games have hard missions.

This isn't a valid Gripe, if you can't pass a mission that's you're fault, not R*'s.

Ordering items on TV or at Tw@ does not work. You can't even order vehicles by calling them, even though it says so at AutoErotiCar.com.

The internet site offered a lot of possibilities to expand the gameplay and give you so much more to do on the side. However, it ended up serving as primarily a huge repository of inside jokes...which isn't a bad thing, but there was a lot of missed opportunities. It was disappointing to see so many attractions listed, and finding out you could only make use of a very small portion of them.

Rockstar has only so much to develop for a video game. When the PS4 and XBOX 720(or whatever it is) comes in within the next five years, then more stuff like this will be possible, until then, the game can only hold so much.

I agree about the missed opportunity. Would it really take up a lot of space for the ability to click a link, have money deducted from your account and a car show up at your safe house next time you swing by (or another location, like a dealership)?

Destruction of buildings isn't featured.

Destruction of buildings would permanently(?) alter the area, and make it difficult for normal activities or activities to occur.

But we can destroy street lights, government property (mailboxes, etc.), drive to a different zone, come back, and it's like they were never hit, AND cops don't care. No consistency.

Think to yourself for a moment. You are going down the street at 80 miles per hour. The cops are on you. A pole, NO! You run into it, and it doesn't fall down. Breaks the game if you can't. Alternatively, building destruction would also break the game.

Why can't people understand that certain things won't fly in video games after 9/11? If R* let you blow up or damage buildings it would get them sued into the nexy millenium.

Isn't it obvious Sherlock, you're a terrorist.

You can longer respond to random comments either positively or negatively.

That was a minor feature, and its removal doesn't affect the game very much.

It is still one more thing that detracts from the game's attempt at realism. And it has a fairly big impact on the free roam part of the game.

You're some Serb fresh off the boat. Who cares about you? No one cares about you. You're just another member of the crowd. No one will bother talking to you.

How does coming off a boat make you any less of a nobody to the general public then any of the other characters that start off as nobodies?

Really? mmm you think that in this world doesn't exist racism? do you think that the word "racism" doesn't exist? i mean come on you are a illegal immigrant do you think that you have rights? you have to fight to make you a "person" and have respect, so mean while you're fresh off the boat no one cares about you.

You don't need to be cared about to be talked to. Even if it's a negative comment you should still be able to respond. I see mexicans get commented from the white-collars in NY all the time.

As mentioned before, no one will bother talking to you. I live in New York, and I have never been talked to at random by someone who I didn't even know. That would be kind of messed up.

You must keep your 'friends' happy to retain their special perks. It would have been preferable to unlock their abilities once and then be left to the player to decide whether they wish to continue the 'friendship'.

Don't you have to keep your friends happy in real life?

But you don't drive them all over town like a soccer mom, especially if you are one of the most in demand hit men in the city. Roman owns a car service business, yet needs to be picked up and dropped off every time he wants to do anything. The friends feature becomes irritating because it lacks realism.

Friends rely on Niko because he is the go to guy, and most of the time Niko is happy to be with his friends.

Even so it does take away from the "realism" they strive so hard to achieve in this game.

aah.. mmm.. no.. is not difficult to take your friends to a nice place a rase the relationship.

Um, no. Are a making a stupid point, the game is a form of escapism, not just real life. He is trying to express his anger at the constant need to take your firends to random places when you are doing something fun and game related to do something tedious and that tedious thing can be easily done in real life with being tedious. Your arguement is stupid and you are being an idiot because you want to rebut him for no reason. Get a proper arguemeent and speak English first before you making a dumb rebut. Be more mature on the internet and don't put people down for no reason idiot.

Actually, I took out my friends a little bit and still unlock all their stuff. I did it pretty much when ever i felt like it.

Street Gang-Banging and generally street gang-related missions have been dramatically reduced, means, no point in shooting other gang members.

Since Niko is not exactly in one of those 'gangs', I would see no point in earning anything for the deaths of gang members.

The 5 families are crucial to the storyline. Niko is involved heavily with gangland violence in the story, yet outside of missions there is no evidence of any gangland tension. Once again this detracts from the realism of the game. For example; Niko kills 10+ members of the Pavano family, yet there is no consequence what so ever. He can walk into the same mob owned car dealership he has just blown up hours before and nobody recognizes him. This badly affects the attempted realism in other areas of the game.

Niko isn't associated with any of the gangs, he is just a neutral gun for hire.

Only 9 street races available and difficult to access them through the phone system.

GTA is not exactly a 'racing game'. The racing missions are practically just mini games, save for when they affect the storyline.

Racing is one of the few things left to do once the storyline has been completed.

You can always race online.

While it isn't a 'racing game,' it's a feature that would've been nice considering this is the 4th installment of a multi-million dollar series.

Actually 8th, counting the expansions.

There's not that much to racing anyway. All you do in a race is to get 1st place with different ways to do that.

For so much focus on the crappy "realism" in the driving you would think they should put some prefrence on that aspect of the game

Why? in this way it's easier to get the archivement!

No special races that unlock special cars (like Destruction Derby).

There are also other mini-games that earn you special vehicles.

Still, it's pathetic that you don't earn special vehicles that you complete side racing missions, like the Bloodring Banger as well as the Dune truck.

Go earn your Bloodring Banger or something. You take a short cut on the way to your safe house, and you end up with the car upside down, and you can't get a new one. Too bad...

With so little to buy Money is worthless.

You have guns to buy, don't you?

After you complete Steve's missions you can sell cars as often as you want, even spawning them and selling them getting you hundreds of thousands of dollars that for all purposes are still worthless.

Don't bother, kill yourself, get into 6 star chases, die, give some money to the hospital. Buy the rest of the clothes, enjoy your taxis and trains.

There is no need to buy guns because you can find them so easily.

Given that entire storyline is underpinned by the pursuit of money, from the minute Niko gets off the boat to the deal or revenge option at the end. The fact that money plays such a small part in the game outside of the cut scenes hurts the games attempt to provide a realistic experience.

There really does need to be more to do with the money in the game. Buying more safe houses, outfitting them with internet access, more clothing shops, more shows to see, parking spaces to keep cars in, revenue-generating businesses, etc.

This isn't The Sims.

But that can solve everything to spend expensive things, rather than eraning more money and do nothing about it.

GTA is a fighting game, not an accessory game. Rockstar did an amazing job with what they did. Currently they can't do much more with GTA4 on the CD. Wait until the downloadble content.

They put it on DVDs and BluRay. A DVD can hold 9GB of memory and a Blu-Ray disc can hold 50GB. They can add some things to buy. I wouldn't want to have 2 million dollars and nothing to spend it on. Takes away from the realism.

No parachute.

there are also, more or less, no aircraft to jump out of at high altitudes.

Plus the 'chute was quite boring to use anyways.

Yet another component that affects the longevity of this game. The fact that Niko can't base jump into Star Junction and start shooting up the area is just another shortcoming of IV in terms of action.

R* said that the game will be much more realistic than previous games. Have you ever seen a man done a base jump with several guns and maybe an RPG down the TImes Square, then shooting 200 people??

Remove the base jump and you can do all that in GTA IV, but I've never seen anything like that in real life either. The realism they're going for is in the physics and detail. A parachute would have been a fun addition to the game.

You can't order cars from Stevie's garage once the text message missions he gives you are completed.

That function was specifically for the aforementioned missions.

A useless set of missions at that. You can't access Stevie's Garage after completing the missions, and there is no use for the money you made from the missions. Just another bland effort from GTA IV.

After completing all of Stevie's missions, you can take any car, other then Taxi's or government vehicles, and drop them off in Stevie's garage for cash, at any time.

Stevie runs a chop shop, not a car dealership. It would make no sense if you could order cars that have probably been taken apart.

Autosave may not happen all the time. Whenever you complete missions, you are forced to save the game manually instead of having the game to automatically save for you.

Then try saving manually more often; You'll get used to it.

It happens the same thing and much worse than the first one. It would have been better if Rockstar Games would fix this problem, rather than just asking you to save the game yourself too often.

It's really no big deal to hire a cab and save the game, isn't it?

The majority of the good cheats are gone (like chaos, citizens with weapons, cars fly away with hits etc etc etc).

Rockstar never releases cheats they are found by the players most likely the same cheats are there, they just haven't been found yet.

The range of cheats is another source of disappointment. There is no more to be found.

GTA4 was made as a lesser of a cheat game.

Then maybe R* Games would'nt be so much of a cheap game designer into adding a few cheats. if "GTA IV was made as a lesser of a cheat game", then R* should not be cheap and just simply not add cheats at all.

Maybe you should just learn how to play the game?

There are only 2 pairs of glasses in the whole game, and both of them are ugly.

That's your opinion.

They are. Both are big "owl" style glasses from the 90s. No actual sunglasses or anything.

I don't think that R* made this game just for the sake of different clothing you can buy for Niko.

Badly affects the realism though. 2 pairs of sunglasses in the whole of Liberty City? Geez...gritty realism if ever I've seen it.

With what little sunshine is gotten around the skyscrapers and at night time, what is the point of sunglasses.

You never see people wearing sunglasses in the city? It is a complete sad selection of glasses and hats for that matter seeing as how you have to keep the same crappy hair the entire game, you can cover it up with a crappy trucker hat or a rediculus Russian hat to wear in the seeming Summer climate.

for me it's fine, the hats are greats and the glasses are just the way i like it... why the people have to wear sunglasses i mean you don't get enough with all the movements and the speech that every person has in liberty city?

Cheating blocks achievement points

Cheating would destroy the challenge in getting achievement points. Besides, if you want to cheat, just make a separate save file.

That is only for the Xbox 360. And blocking achievements encourages players to play through the game legitimately, and not with cheats.

What would be the point of achievement points if there was no challenge after using a cheat? It dosn't prove anything except you have NO talent

The realism of the game seems extremely inconsistent, and if you want examples, just read over a good half of the previous gripes. It would seem to me that a game that sold for 500 million on the first day would have the budget (and let's face it, from the look of previous GTAs Rock* had the budget) to put some more effort and, dare I say, "polish," into the game. For me, it just felt like GTA III all over again--the exception being that some of the characters were more vivid and interesting, and the plotline kept me hooked. If there is a GTA V (and I'm assuming there will be) I really hope they put more time into it. GTA IV just felt half baked, which was a major disappointment. =/

GTA4 has three delays, and a huge updates. Not the mention GTA4 is the first game to use the Euphoria system. GTA has had huge improvements here. All gripes on this page just complain about how little minigames there are. Most minigames in GTASA were ignored by most players.

Ignored by most players? where do you get that? GTA IV is a complete disgrace to realism by the sheer fact alone you kill about 100 people and the cops could never get you, even when you walk around in plane sight right afterwards.

ok how about you kill less than 20 people and you will get a 6 star wanted level (That would happen in the real life) and when you can't escape and the police shoot you a lot and you die, but how you like so much the realism you die forever (that would happen in the real life) and you lost all your progress and you have to start a new story and do all over again, do you like it? it's that enough realism?

Aiming is difficult when slow-mo is activated during driving and flying thanks to the cinematic angles.

Why would you even bother shooting in cinematic mode or in slow motion!?

Whenever a mission has you chasing another vehicle, they run on a rail. Shooting out their tires does nothing, they still take square 90 degree angle turns at 100 MPH+. You can't catch up to them to ram or PIT them as they'll automatically go into over drive and match your speed. There's no incentive to engage in a good high speed chase since you'll suffer at turns and they won't. And motorcycle chases aren't fun since the AI target can't get into an accident or spin out after their tires are shot out, it actually REPAIRS ITSELF while they speed down the road.

Strange, I never experienced that problem. The AI vehicles behaved just as mine did.

I can agree that this is kind of annoying, but it seems to be done for when it's essential for the vehicle you're chasing to reach a particular area for the story. I recall a few instances where an NPC "crashed their vehicle" and/or are "fleeing on foot" as examples.

The stunt jumps in the game suck. No building to building jumps, no over bridge jumps, no motorbike window jumps a la Vice City.

Check again, there are building jumps and bridge jumps. Check again before you post your complaints on the Internet.

You can't buy cars at the dealerships found in the city. Grotti in Algonquin, Westdyke Bikes in Westdyke, Autoeroticar in Alderney City...nothing.

Why buy when you can steal?

Purchasing vehicles are crucial to the gameplay. In real life, stealing cars in dealerships is a bad thing to do and against the law. Purchasing vehicles are a perfect part of realism and has to do something to spend all of your 50k money, but they did'nt. Gritty realism if I have ever seen it.

Isn't everything that can be done in GTA4 illegal? And who would want to spend 30K on a car that they can just steal?

Purchasing would be a good way to include personalization: if you could choose sertain specifications for a car, paintjobs, engine types, and options to create cars unique cars that aren't found on the street.

1. why buy if you can steal it, everything in this game is illegal and agaisnt the law. 2. you put a gripe where doesn't fit, the car tunning or modding is in Vehicles Gripes there will be answer your question.

Do I have to remind you the meaning of GTA? Grand. Theft. Auto. This is a game where stealing cars is ONE OF THE REASONS for this game series TO EVER EXIST. Your gripe is stupid. =)

{Rebut}How can he buy a car Does Niko Even have a american driving license or insurance?

Somethings in the game bothers me since they are transitioning GTA games to be more realistic. Whats the purpose of all those big buildings and you can't access them or destroy them. And how come when you blow up people they fly backward or upward? From what I've seen when you shoot a rocket or throw a grenade at somebody, limbs suppose to come off...i mean in previous GTA games when you shoot somebody in the head with a powerful weapon it disappears. Wassup with that?

They wanted to keep the M Rating on this game. GTA IV looks much more realistic as Vice City or SA did. In fact, Vice City and SA looked a bit like a comic to me.

Well in real life these things do happen, why change something to be more real like m aking the hand-brake screw you up so much but take away real-life stuff like limbs being ripped off when the game is ment to be violent from the start, not a drive-test simulator.

that gripe is already answer above. You blow up a building you break the game.

The rebut about it possibly losing its M rating if it had more violence is wrong, I have fallout 3, which has graphics that are just as good as GTA IV, an incredible amount of violence [people's heads come off in slow motion, spurting blood all the way, in cinematic angles] and an M rating. If Fallout can be that violent and still have an M rating, then so can GTA.

This isn't Fallout, you're talking about ripping body parts off of INNOCENT PEOPLE walking down the street. That would give the game a AO rating if not get it totally banned, ratings are just as much about the context as the actual violence.

How come you can't play basketball on the courts in Algonquin?

For me, playing basketball was just an useless timekiller, like the arcade games or the gym. It doesn't really alter the gameplay.

there are still arcades in this game, why keep the simple video-games-within-a-video-game but loose the more creative minigames?

Because doesn't AFFECTS the gameplay, also i wouldn't see niko playing basketball he will be terrible.

Wouldn't it be nice if you could destroy those bridges and cause havoc? All you have to do is drive off to a differnt area and come back and the bridge would be right there. But not only the bridges, the buildings as well.

That's not possible in the current generation (PS3, Wii and Xbox360 is the current gen, not NextGen!), also it wouldn't be very realistic, if they'd pop up, when you go for a little ride round the block.

It is possible in this current gen to make completely destructible environments. The upcoming release of Mercenaries 2 (which is a sandbox game in a similar vein to GTA) has completely destructible environments, including foliage and even important buildings. The realism is that the buildings are "rebuilt" it takes a small amount of time to make the buildings return to normal. And realism? Screw that, this is GTA, not every last thing has to be realistic.

GTA4 isn't a complete destruction game. One man isn't able to destroy a whole city. GTA isn't a destruction game.

And yet one man can take on an army of Russian, Triad, Italian and Albanian mafia soldiers, plus an elite counter-terrorist unit and countless FBI units? If you talk about realism, building destruction is more realistic than not. It would be extremely fun.

I don't think a rocket launcher could completely destroy a strong bridge.

How about this: If you can destroy a strong bridge like the Brooklyn or the Manhattan Bridge or the Statue of Happiness you would all of the cops, NOOSE, and the pedestrians looking for you with a strong strong hate because you destroyed a national item that represents NY(LC). If they catch you or kill you, you'll be dead forever or be in jail for life and you will lose all of current game percentage and you have to start all over. Don't you think that would be happen in the real life? Eh? Because that is the price in the real life for doing something like this!

Ever heard of 9/11? 19 terrorists hijacked planes and completely destroyed the World Trade Center in New York and part of the Pentagon in Washington DC. They were even planning on destroying the Capitol Building until the passengers fought back. You hate those guys right? The World Trade Center were some signature buildings in New York until they were completely destroyed by those terrorists.

Compared to True Crime: New York City and its realism, GTA IV lacks in some areas. OK when Niko is about to open a door, he just pushes it; doesnt turn any knob or nothing. What door with a knob just opens like that?

It's not important to gameplay and it would be rather annoying after some time, or even deadly in a police chase.

This heavily detracts realism. I mean, why would a person just push the door instead of turning the knob? That's really unrealistic.

It's not important to gameplay and it would be rather annoying after some time, or even deadly in a police chase.

Of coarse it would be deadly just like in real life, there are annoying things in the game based off realism that they did keep, like the insanely annoying hand-brake

DOESN'T AFFECT THE GAMEPLAY. Seriously. If this is the only thing you can find to gripe about, then I'd say they did an excellent job.

You can't order anything at Tw@ internet. There is nothing you can do to purchase anything, except ringtones (which plays a small part to this feature).

GTA4 isn't The Sims.

Maybe not, but it can easily solve all of money problems you have (50 grand or above).

Why would you want to spend all of your hard earned money on stuff you will never use again?

why keep the unlimited amount of money you have sitting uselessly as a figure in the corner of your screen?

Because niko want's to make money so he can't get in broke and he must not waste all his money in useleess stuff, the main story line has to end by you being rich and all "useless" money it's what niko needs to live his life.

The ability to operate cranes (like in GTA: SA) is no longer possible, which means you can't lift vehicles with magnets, or hit vehicles or peds with wrecking balls.

All of which does not affect game play.

Maybe not, but it's part of fun (not realism) where you can lift moving vehicles with magnets and drop them off stories below.

And the point of doing that is what? Nothing.

he just said FUN what games are ment to be not drive-test/murder simulators

If that it's fun, it's make me sad that some people like that, and this page it's about GAMEPLAY not fun.

the choppers handled better in GTA:SA

Controls are more realistic now.

The game is billed as "realistic", but some of the realistic parts of San Andreas were not included (i.e gaining weight, exercising). The game is just not as fun as previous games, and I know the game is supposed to be "realistic" but realism should not adversely affect the rest of the game. The game could have more "wacky" weapons and vehicles. All the girlfriends are either annoying or dead. The game could also use more cheats.

look above all the gripes and your questions will be answred. and also GTA IV don't need smalls gliths to be the game that today it is so look the ratings and the sells and answer you self all your questions that you ask.

three gripes for you all, one, you can't fly planes two, there are same-y mission. Most of the missions were ether; pick him up, take him here, shoot this guy, take him back, deliver this, ect makes multiple plays rather wearing. 3rd gripe is that any form of tree regardless of thickness or hight is still unbreakable or burnable in any way shape or form this is especially annoying whilst travelling at high speeds.

First, flying planes was taken out because Liberty City can be traveled incredibly fast with even a helicopter, in a plane, you would be gone very fast. Second, all GTA games are like that, that is the point, help your allies, kill your enemies. Third, that last gripe doesn't make any sense. I was barely able to understand the first two.

The third Gripe is completely valid streetlights can fall over by you just tapping them but a tree no more then 2 inches in diameter can stop an tank or any other vehicle dead in its tracks bearing down at it at speeds 100mph+!!!

Are you serious?? you two have to get some english lessons.

I think those two are trying to say you can take down light poles very easily but you can't take down trees at all. The trees are rooted to the ground and are very strong, Light poles aren't rooted to the ground and can be taken down very easily.

Just to throw this out there, I don't know about all street light designs, but some street lights here in Australia are designed to collapse easily if they're crashed into so they don't kill people that run into them. (They have some special bolts attaching them to the base that give way if enough force hits them) That could be the case with Liberty City's street lights, but at any rate crashing into one should still result in a sizable dent. Right now you can usually get away with a scratch on the paint, if any damage at all.

There is a deplorable selection of hats(filthy trucker cap, or silly winter Russian hats in a warm liberty City environment), you can't change Nikos hair at all, you cant shave his ratty, scummy beard. All of which are perfectly possible in short amounts of time in "real life" except growing longer hair.

Rockstar wanted to focus on interacting with other characters and not yourself.

If R* wants to focus on interacting with characters, then the girlfriend feature should'nt be added. In San Andreas, you'll always be given an opportunity to change your hairstyles to impress your girlfriend. Otherwise, if you are dating a girlfriend and the hair stays the same, she'll be disappointed. Also, why would R* add only two hats in the game? Just another failed realism maybe (cause many peds wear different hats)?

Warm Climate in New York/Liberty City? Hahahah You made me LOL, in winter it starts snowing there! But why complain about hats? When you wear them they are GLUED TO YOUR HEAD, and also only douchebags wear hats. Some complain about Niko's shit hairstyle but I think its OK, pretty realistic for a Eastern European to get a cheap Buzz.

Just like to gripe about all you gripers, think back on GTA3 which was a new engine and a good game but not perfect, then came Vice City, Basically same game same engine and many improvements and then finally San Andreas, again same engine but it was squeezed to the poinbt of collapse and had every feature under the sun in it. Its easy to see with new systems and engine this game would be lacking the overkill that San Andreas had. Personally my grip about IV was it lacked what San Andreas had but when you think of it like GTA3 as being the first link in this Gens chain this is going to be a very nice very shiny chain indeed.

You have horrible grammar. But I almost could understand something. Why you should stop complaining and get some English Books.

This is probably not supposed to happen, but I think what they mean is, GTA III was the first game with that game engine - then Vice City was released with the same engine, but with improvements. Then San Andreas came out, pushing that game engine (No, I really can't remember its name) to the point where it nearly collapsed, as they said, and it was fantastic. Now, think of GTA IV as GTA III with the RAGE engine instead. Rock* are testing the new one, and hopefully when a few more games are released, then we will see a "GTA San Andreas 2" with the RAGE engine pushed to its collapse. I personally think this will be great, and obviously so will the starter of this "gripe about gripers".

Yeah, cant wait for the completely remodeled San Andreas in new shiny graphics :) btw its GTA III era used the RenderWare engine

Hats dissapear when getting in the car. You also see pedestrians with normal hair, at first, but when they get out, hats re-appear. Badly realistic efforts.

mmm i don't have that problem

If Niko wears a hat, try getting in any vehicle (no motorbikes) and check if his hat dissapears.

Niko can only pick up small objects to throw at and does not inflict any damage to vehicles, apart from peds. You don't get to use other objects (like a 2x4 plank, trash can lid, a shovel and a pickax from construction sites) as a meleé weapon to attack pedestrians.

You have guns to use. They can inflict damage onto pedestrians and cars much more faster and better than a plank of wood, a trash can, or a pickax. The shovel was featured in San Andreas, but I think Carl didn't even need it when he had a lot of guns to use.

I also feel R* dropped the ball with the interact-able items. When I discovered how useful those little gas tanks were in blowing up stuff, I was rather disappointed that I could barely push the tanks without clipping. It would have been nice to be able to pick things up and use them since this is a next-gen game. Maybe next time. Grenades have too much unpredictability, inevitable cop attention attached. You can just place a gas tank in the path of an object and watch the firework ensue. This follows with the gripe about not being able to use your car to transport items. I still love this game and I just hope I am giving someone positive ideas for the next installment.

Anyone else a little annoyed with the Endorphin physics? There are times that Niko stumbles around like a fool when he falls 3 feet and other times when he flies off motorcycles after hitting a static object at a relatively low speed. Gets frustrating, too.

It's better than pre-defined animations. By the way, it's Euphoria, not Endorphin.

PLANES! I'm not gonna reenact 9/11. That's impossible! You can you be a terrorist If you can't even break buildings! No planes,no destruction. I KNOW some one already said all this but goddammit this is important to me!

I think there are laws in the US mandating that games aren't allowed to have planes which can be flown into buildings (I THINK, I'm not sure, I'm sure I read it somewhere). As well as this, really, where would you fly to? Liberty City has a very good freeway system, and if you really want to get somewhere fast, use a taxi. Granted that's not the only reason people fly planes, but still, they're not necessary really.

When did this law come into place? The 9/11 attacks took place in 2001 and GTA III (Released in 2001, 3 weeks or so after 9/11), GTA Vice City (Released in 2002) and GTA San Andreas (Released in 2004) all had planes in them. All of a sudden this law comes into place?

Saints Row 2 had planes in it,had twin tower-esque buildings and had building damage and that was released recently in October '08.

Well, Saints Row 2 is set in the fictional city of Stilwater, which is technically based off the cities of Chicago and Detroit. Liberty City is heavily based off of New York City, where part of the 9/11 attacks took place. Rockstar didn't put planes in because they didn't want a 9/11 reenactment IN A CITY WHERE THERE WAS A TERRORIST ATTACK ON 9/11. Unfortunately, there are some idiot players who are terrorists or terrorist wannabes who would reenact 9/11, so Rockstar kept planes out. The game is already controversial enough isn't it?

I have four things to say to THAT. 1.)Maybe some people DO want to reenact 9/11 but Grand Theft Auto IV doesn't take place on 9/11! so who would give a $h!t? 2.)anything said in bold print or ALL CAPS will always sound bad.For example:HIS PLANE WAS SHOT DOWN.For all you know,I'm talking about a plane full of terrorists. 3.)Grand Theft Auto IV is NOT controversial.What's controversial about it?Everything in that game are based on things in real life.It's true.And if you need an example,go to Dayton,Ohio,Go to under the highway system and ask a Hispanic man with an accent for a ride.That's what I did and I almost got shanked! 4.)well,I forgot number 4.Sads***.

Most of these remarks are completely uncalled for. September 11th was a very sad day for Americans of all walks of life, and it would be in complete distaste to offer any form of option to "re-enact" any such acts, even for mere amusement. That would be akin to making a game called Holocaust Tycoon and offering a disclaimer that all events, ideas and persons are fictitious. Utterly disgusting.

Yes, thank you for pointing that out. And about the person who said GTA IV wasn't controversial, do you watch the news? The mainstream news? CNN? Fox News? etc. Go type in "GTA IV" on either website of theirs and we'll see what comes up.

Can we get back to the subject here? I just want planes. Besides, GTA was always controversial. R* always survives the lawsuit. And who would care if they just brought in the Shamal,floatplane and Dodo.I'm not asking for a plane that's big like the Andromeda or anything. And for another point they could make an American protagonist so bombing would just seem like a hate crime.>:(

Yes, they've survived lawsuits like when Jack Thompson keeps suing them but a 9/11 lawsuit? Guilty Guilty Guilty. All the copies would be recalled. Planes would be taken out. It would be a very short time before someone would reenact 9/11 and the copies would be recalled.

HOW CAN YOU DESTROY A SKYSCRAPER WITH THE FLOATPLANE, DODO OR SHAMAL?!?

Well, you couldn't destroy a building with a small aircraft, but you could certainly heavily damage it and in some cases, yes, destroy it. It depends on the building. Its structure, how big the building is, and how big the aircraft is. The planes used on 9/11 were trans-national 767s all fueled up, so the explosion would be bigger. And the Twin Towers had a weak infrastructure, so they collapsed.

So you're saying a small wooden biplane could heavily damage a huge skyscraper? Or a small weak floatplane that can barely stay mid air?I might believe the Shamal If it was a small one story garage, but that's it. Besides,buildings can't even be destroyed.And I'm not even talking about September 11th either. I just want the F***ing small planes back.

Do you think people in real life take a plane, even a small one, to go from one side of a city to the other? Hell no! Sure, maybe a helicopter but a plane? No one takes a plane to get from Queens to Manhattan. It would make no sense. Can't you guys just be happy without airplanes? You at least have helicopters. That's all the air transportation you need. P.S., I think this gripe is going for the record of "Longest Gripe/Rebut Section Ever"

I would fly plane to get from island to island. And I'd just park the god d@m! thing in the middle of the friggin' street.I don't give a $h!t what happens to FICTIONAL new york. and I am proud to say I will expect the record of longest gripe.

The game is meant to be more realistic. How often do you see a plane land right in the middle of Manhattan? It doesn't matter if you're good at flying it. It's illegal to land a plane on a city street.

Killing a man is illegal. Stealing a car is illegal. Physical Assault is illegal. Robbing a store is illegal. Being an ILLEGAL immigrant is illegal. This is Grand Theft Auto. A game that is well notable for its illegalism.

So?

This is really getting on my nerves. I live in New York and I don't see planes land right on my street. It's meant to be more realistic.

F**k realism!If every video game was realistic they would suck.Think about Pac-man. It would be a first person game,you'd have a health bar,speech function,you'd have to get a "Pac job",you'd wouldn't have ghosts chasing you,The levels would look like real towns and Pac-Man would not be yellow and his name would be "Richard".I give it 0/5.

Dude, if you really want to fly planes so bad, get a pilots license. Not everything can be put into a video game.

How many planes do you planes do you think will fit in my driveway?

When will this end. Not everything can be put into a video game. Go to an airfield and get a pilot's license. 0 planes will be able to fit into your driveway. That's what airfields are for. As I said before, not everything can be put into a video game.

Alright.It ends now.I have a pilot's license,bought a plane form a Grotti dealer,and It is parked in the middle of the street.I think I might fly it to San Andreas soon.If you want a ride in the plane,just ask.Thanks for the suggestion!:)

Dude, really, just shut the f**k up. I'm getting tired of doing this s**t. I'm talking about in real life smart one. Not in GTA IV. When will you learn? Not everything can be put into a video game.

so how the f**k R* put all San Andreas in one disk for ps2 and xbox? f**ing dumbass... of course the can put this feature just they didn't want to do it!

Sigh. Not everything can be put into a video game. Rockstar probably replaced planes with all new features, like going bowling, playing pool, darts, getting drunk, more detailed strip clubs, etc. If you want to fly planes so bad, play Saints Row 2 (I hear there's planes in that game) instead of griping about GTA IV. San Andreas was an entire state. It would make sense for there to be planes in that game since San Andreas is an entire state. Liberty City is, you guessed it, a city. It would make no sense for there to be planes since it's one city. And I know what you're going to say, so I'll say it for you. "I dont give a s**t about bowling, pool, or strip clubz! I wanna FLY PLANES!!!!1 And I have SR2 but i wanna fly planes so bad in gta4. WTF are the planes???? Im not gonna reenact 9/11!!!!!1 I WANNA FLY PLANEZ I DON'T CARE ABOUT REALISM!!!!!!!!!!!!" PS, Rockstar doesn't give a s**t about you wanting to fly planes so bad. They aren't gonna look on this webpage. Why don't you call Rockstar up so bad if you want planes?

Wow.You're a real @s$h0le.

Yeah, well griping on this page isn't gonna make Rockstar put planes in GTA IV. Rockstar kept planes out because they didn't want to see a 9/11 reenactment and if you were to fly a plane over one city, you'd be gone very fast. In Los Santos for example, when you flew a plane, you'd be out of the city in about 5-30 seconds depending on where you went. And LS was a pretty big city. It took a few minutes just to get across it by car. Planes weren't and never will be in GTA IV. And also, as mentioned several times before, not everything can be put into a video game. And I also forgot to mention this gripe has been mentioned several times before. Isn't one of the rules "Make sure your gripe hasn't been mentioned already"?

God,dude.Calm down.

who gives a shit if some jackass is re-enacting 9/11 in their basement? Not me. In any case how is crashing planes into people any worse than shooting people or beating them to death? Or massive vehicular homicide? Personally I'd rather be killed by a plane than a bat. At least you'd die fast. Dead is dead it doesn't matter how they die. All of these people need to stop thinking that flying a plane into a building is a concept unique to 9/11.
Haha, this is funny..But on a serious note, everyone just shut up about 9/11. Why is it so tragic? More people, PLUS innocent families die in this stupid iraq war then people did in 9/11. Trust me, I know. My sister was killed in iraq by an american soldier. Not to mention, on average, thousands of peoople die everyday with a person dying every 7 to 12 seconds. Tell me what exactly is realistic about one man fending off the russian mafia, while flying a helicopter without a liscence. Even if Niko had a liscence to a car, it would only be applied to THAT car. Rockstar tried to make this game realistic, but they failed in doing so. Do you know why? BECAUSE ITS A VIDEO GAME! Do you see a person walking down the street, and if examined closely enough, his face is made up of pixels? No video game is ever going to match up to real life. Even with its superior graphics engine, and AI behavior, IT'S STILL A VIDEO GAME! I agree about adding planes into Grand Theft auto IV. "Forgive and forget" is a popular term, but unfortunately the media hasn't accepted that term if they want everyone to take the fun out of video games just because people died, like every other day. I'm not all that big on planes, but I still think they should be put in the game. What's the harm of flying a plane around? People still fly planes in real life even after 9/11, and from what I recall, no one suggested crashing planes into buildngs, causing them to blow up and kill thousands within 7 blocks. The only thing I really care about being put back in GTA IV is the chainsaw. I loved the chainsaw. The motto "We will never forget" has been extremely exaggerated. Hey, did you know some people have heart attacks in diners, or a Mcdonalds? Oh no, does that mean we should stop eating Mcdonalds? A child drowns in a pool, does that mean we need to ban pools from video games? Hey, why not ban the ocean from the video game since you can drown in it? Last week, I saw a dead body brutally crushed against the fender of an SUV in the middle of traffic. Does that mean we need to ban SUVs or revoke everyones drivers liscence? Seriously, stop with the drama alright? If you want these things in the game so bad, become a modder and buy the PC version of GTA IV. Rockstar won't listen to your petty gripes, and complaints, because they're being hassled by a overreactive media. So let's stop the 9/11 references okay? Also, I know of some mods that are coming out for GTA IV that have planes in them. So lets end this gripe right here.

I'm guessing the only reason you're saying that is because you've never experienced a horrific event like 9/11. Trust me, those scars don't heal.

Any mission that involves a car/bike chase has all of the traffic pre-generated and has whoever is being chased on rails. It's extremely annoying not to mention boring after a few playthroughs having every car in sight look like they're on a Scalextric track. I think it's supposed to create "suspense" or something but all it does is create frustration. And you can't kill opponents until you're SUPPOSED to? Where's the realism in that? i.e. To Live and Die in Alderney, if you manage to shoot the fed's car enough before it leaves the dirt track it will burst into flames, all the occupants will jump out, yet the car itself will still stick to Phil as though there was someone at the wheel. No Way on the Subway, I emptied about 800 bullets into the biker and he still wouldn't die until a specific point. And other missions where you can't shoot the wheels, the driver etc, where the car you're chasing can make impossible turns given the speed they're going at... It's one of the most annoying aspects of the game.

That's not true.I managed to kill one of the Lost members before I reached the subway.But the rest of that is true.

It's just poor mission design, Rockstar should be past such poor scripting by now.

I agree but for future sakes,I'm sure this will be improved.

Why is it you can jump out of the water and grab onto the edge of a passing boat, but you can't do the same to grab onto a helicopter hovering just above the surface? A friend crashed out at sea in MP and couldn't grab onto my helicopter to be rescued.

Probably because there's no mechanism in-game for hanging off a helicopter. I'm not completely sure though, I havn't actually gone into multiplayer. Where would you hang from anyway? The runners on the bottom, perhaps, but again, realism. No-one in their right mind would do that IRL. And as for the cabin, it's treated in the same way as any other car or boat cab, in that you can't grab a hold of anywhere inside it.

There's only one spot in the whole city you can play pool, leaving those who dislike Massive B radio no choice but to put up with it. There should also be another spot where you can play darts. The old pub in Purgatory would be a good place.

Though I agree with you about the pool (and it could be in a more conveniant place), you CAN play darts at the old pub in Purgatory. It even says so on this wiki.

Oh, I never noticed. >_> Thanks.

Actually, you can play pool with a friend at Playboy X's house when you get it.

What does Massive B radio have to do with this?

Trivial as it may be, my point was that Massive B is easily one of the most annoying radio stations in the game. I don't know anyone who likes it, and I personally only like one song (the one from the trailer, 'Real McKoy' I believe it's called) and even that is chanted over by the stupid DJ the entire time. The fact that the only publicised place where you can play pool features the station means players who dislike that station (of which there are quite a few) have no choice but to put up with it.

Oh,I get it now.And yes that radio station is pretty annoying.I prefer Liberty Rock Radio and Integrity 2.0.

I know this is a little gripe, but i think the cardoors open too stiffly. They opened better in GTA SA.

I'm pretty sure that's a vehicle gripe but,this is probably explained by the fact that the doors open like that because R* is trying to make the game more realistic. That is how most cardoors open.

Street names aren't displayed on the in-game map, so when you're told to look for something on/near a certain street (as you often are), if you're not already familiar with the street name (and who does recognize more than a dozen or so street names, even after playing the game to completion?) there's no way to find out where it is except by driving on it. This is a shame, as street names would be even more useful as a navigational aid if you could read them on the map. I realise street names might clutter the map up, but if that really was a problem the street names could be an option you can toggle on or off (In GTA SA's in-game map, you could turn the various types of blips on or off if you wanted. For example, I turn off the gang territory overlay after I take all of the turf.).

Street names would be pointless, since the minimap always puts a blip on the map on the place you need to go to on a mission and marks a path to it the moment you enter any car (which arent that hard to find). Plus you can put your own waypoint to remember places. You shouldn’t ever be lost.

Well that's being a little too presumptious, isn't it? That's not always the case. Just the other day I got a text message car request from Stevie telling me to look for a car on a particular road I'd never heard of somewhere near middle park, I spent 15 frigging minutes driving around Algonquin to find it. The fact is street names are in the game, there's no reason it shouldn't be an option to show them on the map so you can find a street without having to drive around staring at the HUD hoping to get lucky.

You couldn't have opened the map and set a waypoint on it to make a path?

I didn't know where the f***ing street was until I drove over it 15 minutes later and saw the name appear on the HUD, so how could I have marked it on the f***ing map? I don't think you understand, in the text message car missions, no marker is placed on the map showing you the location of your objective, you have to find it using Stevie's written directions which, more often than not, point you to a particular street in a particular neighborhood. It's not always hard to narrow it down if the street is in a small neighbourhood and there's not many to check, but other times it's unnecessarily frustrating trying to find a particular street, like the time I mentioned in Middle Park. The street I was looking for was actually three blocks from the park, how could I have known that? The bottom line is there's no good reason the in-game map shouldn't show street names (at least as an option), and at least one good reason why it should.

Target focus (using B on X360 when chasing a target in a car) doesn't center the target onscreen, meaning weapons need to be manually aimed at the target, which is extremely hopeless (especially if they go round a corner).

I would like to gripe that this game is ABSOLUTE Shite. Firstly, NOT EVERYONE IN THE WORLD HAS AN INTERNET CONNECTION! Moreover, for those that do, whose to say they will ALWAYS be connected. We have a small group of people here attempting to play a LAN game. After GIGABYTES of useless updates, we finally we able to execute the GAME. Even on the fastest machine, the gameplay is LAGGY and BUGGY. The Graphics customisation is a SERIOUSLY POOR ATTEMPT, with no ability to change Ansiotrophic Filtering, Antialiasing, SLI mode, ANYTHING.

I assume you're talking about the PC version here. Most people in the developed word DO have an Internet connection. It clearly specifies on the box that one is required for registration. Most people at least have dial-up. The multiplayer is not part of the main game. This should be a separate gripe in the Multiplayer gripes page. As for the second part, that's also not relevant to gameplay. How many people actually care about those things? The majority of users are console gamers anyway

Why would Xbox focus all their attention on 10% of the gaming population that uses their game. The cost benefit analysis just wouldn't be worth it.

You don't get enough time to deliver the packages (Little Jacobs side Mission)

I delivered them just fine. Practice.

R* released the episodic game The Lost and Damned, but what they did'nt realized is that they excluded the PS3 version, making it only for the 360, leaving the PS3 fans angry, disappointed and unhappy.

Thats why its EXCLUSIVE to Xbox live.

And that what makes PS3 fans look BAD.

Maybe they will release something for PS3 later this year. Lets hope

Microsoft bought the rights to DLC for GTA4.

That makes sense. So PS3 players got screwed over on the DLC stuff?

Its called licensing. The game is EXCLUSIVE to Xbox. Get over it. You guys make yourselves look bad for owning a PS3. R* doesn't have anything to do with that.

Has anybody noticed how difficult pool is in this game?! I mean, the AI in the rest of the game isn't terrible, but when you're playing pool, everyone in the city becomes a professional hustler! I wouldn't complain about this, but you need to win a game of pool to get 100%, which in itself is ridiculous. I wish Rockstar would stop putting useless crap like this in their GTA games. While they took a step forward in eliminating most of these useless activities, they only added new ones that are even more frustrating. Anyway...the point is, pool is wayyy too hard for a game that has no focus on pool at all. Yes I noticed that pool was much better in GTA SA. In GTAIV pool is actually easy if you just let the game auto-aim the ball, then you just have to decide how hard you wanna hit, which isn't really hard. My complaint about pool is that if you move the cue and try to hit a different ball, it is really hard to score it in. In SA if you hit the ball towards the hole on a close enough angle, the ball would go in, but in IV the angle has to be perfect and if it's just slightly wrong, you are going to miss. I also find it sometimes hard to distinguish between striped balls and whole, because even the whole ones have a white circle on them and if the are positioned on a specific angle then the white circle can be taken as a white stripe. I don't find all the activites that existed in SA frustrating, I think GTA IV should have had more mini games like San Andreas as I really enjoyed them.

Some of the trophies are hard to obtain it, even if you have met the objective. The "Join The Midnight Club" trophy is seemingly bad, because even if you win 1st place without much damage, you still did not win a trophy for no reason. Also, getting a score of 180 in darts is complicated. There is no possible way of getting a score of 180. Also, the "Finish Him" is hard to obtain it, thanks to poor combat physics caused by R*.

The "One Hundred And Eighty" Achievement/Trophy is fairly easy to get; I got this on my first game of darts. At times, you'll see an infobox stating "Hold RT/R2 to steady your shot. Time it well, it only lasts for a second". Just aim your dart in the Triple 20 section, pull RT/R2, throw, and repeat.

Sure the "One Hundred and Eighty" looks easy, but now the rest of them are TOO HARD (e.g. "Join the Midnight Club", "Gobble Gobble", "Finish Him" and "Fly the Co-op"). The Join the Midnight Club is hard and unobtainable, because even if I won the race without any (or minor) damage, it doesn't make a trophy sound that indicates that I have earned a trophy. I also can't achieve all the strikes in a row. it's so complicated, that some of the bowling pins doesn't go down, even if I am in perfect accuracy. Getting the Finish Him trophy is hard (and the bronze trophy is just plain silly) because thanks to poor combat physics, I always get manhandled by nearby gangs before I even get a chance to counterattack. The "Fly the Co-op" trophy is WAY hard, because the retarded host player always turns on the "Friendly Fire" just to make sure I can't earn that trophy. It's so hard, I even try hosting, but no one (or one of the players comes, but leaves) seems to help me out. Talk about players who leaves the Co-op Multiplayer game, because the player(s) has no life in winning trophies (obviously).

I have a feeling you have not seen the youtube tutorial clips for "gobble gobble" and "finish him" achievement.

How come Independence FM can only be on the PC? Why does Rockstar Games have to be so cheap? What's so hard about adding that feature to the Xbox 360 and PS3 consoles? It's not that hard to program that feature, unless they think think that the custom soundtrack feature for both consoles are a bad idea, which is not.

Because both PS3 and 360 have an internal music player. Adding one radio just to do the same thing, that you can do any given time just by pressing the Xbox guide/PS3 XMB button would be silly and time-wasting.

OR maybe they forgot how to implement your own music tracks into Independence FM music selection. It's not much of a complicated task if R* would'nt be lazy to add it.

Seriously, can't you use the X360/PS3 internal music player? Since 360's release there wasn't a single game with custom soundtrack support, because it's already there! Just press guide button, go right and select the music you want to listen to. Plus, programming that feature would be very hard, since Rockstar wolud be forced to get the game to read the source of music. And it's mostly the hard drive of your PC. That would mean some streaming problems, as well as some security shit.

Why is it that TLAD is a 360 exclusive and now the new upcoming Grand Theft Auto IV Second Episode will also be a 360 exclusive has R* forgotten about the ps3 users?!?!Or is R* in cahoots with microsoft to get the 360 to win the console wars?!

Seems to me that R* seems to want to turn the tables against the PS3 fans. They just want to make PS3 fans look miserable, and that R* wants to be a cheap game designer and then release it for just the Xbox 360. An unfair and stupid way to do it.

Microsoft paid Rockstar to make the episodes. It has nothing to do over which game console Rockstar likes better. If you want them so bad then get a 360.

Then I wish R* would AT LEAST add DLC packs for additional vehicles, weapons, even new features. Otherwise, many PS3 fans would start complaining R* Games for lack of Add-On contents (and I don't mean episodic contents).

Well that's what you get for buying a system with no support at all. Microsoft has more money than Sony. They can get more developers and call more shots. That's just the way it is. If you don't like it, then I'd suggest you go get an Xbox 360.

Then I might as well watch as my Xbox 360 overheats in less than 30 seconds before I receive the RRoD.

No flame wars, they said. Eh, well.. I had 1st gen X360 (The one without HDMI) from June 2006 till May 2009, when it went RRoD. Sent it to MS, got a new one from service (Codenamed OPUS, it's just Jasper without HDMI). What is so hard in the process of sending a console to repair?

I remember that story, where service of Sony refused to repair the console of one guy, because it had DUST in it.. For God's sake, how could he clean it up, when opening console equals warranty void?

Kate's ugly face makes me always choose the revenge end :P

Thats an opinion and does not deserve a proper rebuttal

THERE'S ONLY ONE COLOR FOR ALMOST EVERY CAR AT THE PAY N SPRAY e.g.green for the infernus unless if you can find one of a different color. It's really annoying!

In the mission Three Leaf Clover, after exiting the subway tunnel, Packie just wouldn't get into the car I was driving. I pulled up right next to him, and he just stood there doing nothing while I got pelted with bullets. I drove around a couple of blocks, came back and tried it again, and still had the same thing. Eventually the car got blown up and I got shot as I jumped out. Exited the tunnel with full health and a little bit of armor, ended up dying trying to get the guy into the car.

Are you absolutely sure you took 4-seat car and not a 2-seat car? It's not only Packie you have to pick up, it's also his brother Derrick. Therefore of course if you took a 2-seat car Packie wouldn't get in. Otherwise it's just a glitch, no game is perfect.

i wonder why you cant use a 2-handed weapon in the passenger seat of a car or a convertable.Saints row lets you do it,so why?

How do you steer your car around when firing a 2-handed weapon?

Read his gripe again. He's saying that why the game does'nt allow them to use dual wield weapons while riding shotgun. He never said anything about driving and dual wielding weapons at the same time.

This isn't Saint's Row, thank god. Check the front of the box and you will see it says Grand Theft Auto 4.

You cannot earn extra money by performing distances such as wheelies, stoppies, even driving on two wheels from any side. Also, you can't earn money by successfully earning the "UNIQUE STUNT JUMP BONUS" after launching off a unique jump and then successfully landing. What a sad attempt by Rockstar games.

OK, im in the middle of bone county on my fully sick Sanchez. Im about to do a massive jump off a cliff. I accelerate, and i fly! I land safely and, oh, whats this? A hundred bucks has just appeared in front of me! Do you think thats really realistic? it was taken out for being UNREALISTIC!!!!!!!!!!! Gripe closed... Now go home!

Niko should be able to buy food from stores and eat them at home. It's annoying when you're low on health, dont feel like spending $1000 on the 911 call, or going to a food place to regain health. And no, I dont want to use codes. It's annoying. I want to be able to go in the safehouse, going in the fridge, getting some food and have my health back to 100%

You can sleep in your bed at home to regain health for free or go to a fast food joint to regenerate health for $1. What's the difference between going to your safehouse to heal or going to Cluckin' Bell? Do you also want him to go grocery shopping at wal mart and see how much money he can save?

R* apperantly just dumped the bribe system they got in VCS. It would give money another great use since its already quite useless.

This is because of the mayors crackdown on guns. All the guns that the LCPD recover would be taken away for inpoundment.

There are no multiple mappings for keys in different modes. So when I'm in the helicopter, I cannot map the Q and E keys to turn as I did in San Andreas, without unmapping a function which I can only use in regular cars . I should be able to map all of the San Andreas flight controls, and I'd only have to remap F. But now I have to remap Q, E, R, and F, while only the last one is applicable in a helicopter, so it makes no sense I have to remap the others.

Agreed. R* took a big step backward in terms of custom mappings. I've been using a controller for the helicopters since GTA: Vice City. Now I have to learn how to fly all over again, as I can't use the configuration that's hardwired into my brain. Why did they eliminate custom mapping for controllers?

There is no boss fights in gta iv.

Who...Really...Cares? Gripe closed, now go home!

A game is supposed to have boss fights it makes a game more challenging and fun like resident evil 5 was better because it has boss fights im a boss fight fanatic alot of people would love a boss fight and games likje the legend of zelda twilight princess outs done it aswell as mario galazy why cause they all had boss fights and i don't care about the realism.

Boss fights aren't really a GTA thing, big shootouts are. I don't even know how a boss fight can be done in GTA IV besides giving the boss extra health. It would be extremely unrealistic to have the bosses be vulnerable to only some weapons and to make them strictly follow patterns like bosses in other games.

but why not make people you hace to kill boss fights and you can have big shootouts with boss fights oh its tradition to make boss fights with an extra health bar and be vurnearable too to some weapons how else would you defeat uroboros boss fights in re5 and like strictly foloowing patterns there fun why nmot make the heart ofliberty city a super boss or the skeletons at the measuim coming to life and attacking you or a sea monster comes out of the ocean or make tanks a boss fight.

You lost me. So you want a dragon to live under the city and yet expect the city to go on living their normal lives with no concern for how strange this is? That sounds cool but makes no sense at all, this sounds more like a GTA V Wishlist type thing.

ya it chalenging plus they colud of added that peds runa away with cops trying there best but get eaten well you cloud make it live some were an only attack if something disturbs or if its hungry or if it just wants to fight like you colud put the sea monster uner a cave and you have to go out by boat to trigger it think how fun it would be lol.