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With as many people that have read this thread, I am surprised that no one has responded. Anyway, As the "educated" pozzies that we are, we know that by kissing, we are not going to spread the virus. But deep down, for myself, I, so far, have disclosed to everyone that I have done anything with including kissing. And yes prior to doing it. I for one don't want anyone coming back to me and telling me I didn't disclose. So I have always been upfront when it comes to having contact with someone.

With as many people that have read this thread, I am surprised that no one has responded. Anyway, As the "educated" pozzies that we are, we know that by kissing, we are not going to spread the virus. But deep down, for myself, I, so far, have disclosed to everyone that I have done anything with including kissing. And yes prior to doing it. I for one don't want anyone coming back to me and telling me I didn't disclose. So I have always been upfront when it comes to having contact with someone.

That's actually my opinion about it. I don't want anyone coming back to me (if they somehow found out) saying "Why Didn't I disclose before I kissed them".''

I had an experience where I made out with a man and then i disclosed my status because we were going to have sex and he didn't want to be after my disclosure. He asked me at promply after that why hadn't i said something before i kissed him. It never really occured to me to disclose before a kiss but i suppose he may have felt exposed even then. I personally won't be disclosing before a kiss but it's a personal choice.

I had an experience where I made out with a man and then i disclosed my status because we were going to have sex and he didn't want to be after my disclosure. He asked me at promply after that why hadn't i said something before i kissed him. It never really occured to me to disclose before a kiss but i suppose he may have felt exposed even then. I personally won't be disclosing before a kiss but it's a personal choice.

See this is basically what I think about. As LBpozguy said. I mean "usually" you don't need to disclose before kissing right? Or should it be an obligation to do it like having sex?

I don't think there is any official book of etiquette. I would say if you are going to feel guilty or bad that you didn't disclose before kissing then you should disclose for your own peace of mind. I personally wouldn't disclose because there is no chance of infection and if they freak out that is their problem. As Miss P. pointed out, are you going to disclose when you shake hands or hug? This isn't the early 80s and people should know better.

I don't think there is any official book of etiquette. I would say if you are going to feel guilty or bad that you didn't disclose before kissing then you should disclose for your own peace of mind. I personally wouldn't disclose because there is no chance of infection and if they freak out that is their problem. As Miss P. pointed out, are you going to disclose when you shake hands or hug? This isn't the early 80s and people should know better.

Hey GSO, Miss Philicia and Fearless......... Certainly we are not going to disclose just to hug or shake a hand. That would be just silly. However, some people get freaked out when ANY bodily fluid is exchanged. YES, I know, passing HIV through a kiss isn't going to happen. But there are still people out there that are not as educated about HIV as most of the people on here. And quite frankly I would rather know how they are going to react upfront and sooner rather than down the road after investing any amount of time with them and before we are getting more intimate. Basically it comes down to personal preference and level of comfort. To each his own!

My rule of thumb so far has been that if I can be arrested for it, I will disclose. Has any poz person been arrested for kissing yet? I've kissed a few guys since my diagnosis and didn't disclose and didn't feel guilty either.

Well HIV+ spitting is a crime in some states in the USA, so why not kissing as well...

Spitting on someone whether positive or not will get you thrown in jail in most states, however when it is done by someone who is postive they change it from simple assault to attempted murder or something along those lines.

Should I disclose if I give the guy the up and down and lock in on his butt or crotch? With my hungry gaze, that is. HIV+ death rays perhaps.

Only if he's under age...

In a hypothetical situation let's say... If I was kissing someone I definitely need to disclose CUZ WE HEADED TO THE BEDROOM IN ANY SECOND.... my kisses are so good the panties just melt away for some reason. My wife hates this, she had to go restock the panty drawer this past weekend.

it depends. if you're just making out, and have no intention of taking it any further, EVER, then no need to disclose, imo. no one's business.BUT you also said, "if we planned on taking it further, then obviously, I'd disclose," which makes me wonder, why prolong the inevitable? if there's a chance you could end up as something more w/this person, why are you waiting to disclose? is it because you are afraid they will reject you at first, but you're hoping that, with time, if they get to know you, they'll overlook it? b/c that could be viewed as somewhat manipulative. you don't want this person to feel tricked.this is coming from an HIV-negative chic, who'd probably wanna know beforehand. once you disclosed, I wouldn't wanna have sex with you. (I realize you're gay so you wouldn't want me anyway, lol, but if I were with a straight man I wouldn't want to have sex with him if he told me that). I wouldn't hate you for it, though, we could still be friends and all that, and if I liked you, I'd wanna be there for ya, regardless. but you might wanna ask yourself why you're not upfront in the 1st place. b/c if the relationship amounts to anything more, you're only pro-longing the inevitable.

it depends. if you're just making out, and have no intention of taking it any further, EVER, then no need to disclose, imo. no one's business.BUT you also said, "if we planned on taking it further, then obviously, I'd disclose," which makes me wonder, why prolong the inevitable? if there's a chance you could end up as something more w/this person, why are you waiting to disclose? is it because you are afraid they will reject you at first, but you're hoping that, with time, if they get to know you, they'll overlook it? b/c that could be viewed as somewhat manipulative. you don't want this person to feel tricked.this is coming from an HIV-negative chic, who'd probably wanna know beforehand. once you disclosed, I wouldn't wanna have sex with you. (I realize you're gay so you wouldn't want me anyway, lol, but if I were with a straight man I wouldn't want to have sex with him if he told me that). I wouldn't hate you for it, though, we could still be friends and all that, and if I liked you, I'd wanna be there for ya, regardless. but you might wanna ask yourself why you're not upfront in the 1st place. b/c if the relationship amounts to anything more, you're only pro-longing the inevitable.

Girly, as an "hiv negative chick", you should not be posting in any forum here with the exceptions of the "Off Topic" and "Am I Infected" forums - or the "Someone I Care About Has Hiv" forum if you have a friend or loved one who is hiv positive.

If you continue to post in forums where you are not permitted to post, you run the risk of being given a Time Out or possibly even banned from the forums completely.

Read the Welcome Threads in Living or Am I Infected to understand our posting guidelines.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

it depends. if you're just making out, and have no intention of taking it any further, EVER, then no need to disclose, imo. no one's business.BUT you also said, "if we planned on taking it further, then obviously, I'd disclose," which makes me wonder, why prolong the inevitable? if there's a chance you could end up as something more w/this person, why are you waiting to disclose? is it because you are afraid they will reject you at first, but you're hoping that, with time, if they get to know you, they'll overlook it? b/c that could be viewed as somewhat manipulative. you don't want this person to feel tricked.this is coming from an HIV-negative chic, who'd probably wanna know beforehand. once you disclosed, I wouldn't wanna have sex with you. (I realize you're gay so you wouldn't want me anyway, lol, but if I were with a straight man I wouldn't want to have sex with him if he told me that). I wouldn't hate you for it, though, we could still be friends and all that, and if I liked you, I'd wanna be there for ya, regardless. but you might wanna ask yourself why you're not upfront in the 1st place. b/c if the relationship amounts to anything more, you're only pro-longing the inevitable.

Why is it manipulative. You have no factual basis of what you're saying. I already have a therapist, thank you. Who has a PhD in Psychology. If you start seeing someone and suddenly on the first date spill out all your deepest darkest secrets. (From just a kiss) Is ANY person straight or not going to accept you? When you meet people for the first time they are not interested in your problems at first. Because they have their own problems to worry about it.

It's not manipulative. Manipulative is when you try to control the other person or their feelings. Look it up.

I wouldn't worry about what girly has to say on the subject. She hasn't taken one step in our shoes, nevermind walked a mile. That's why we keep neggies out of here - they haven't a clue in most cases.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Why is it manipulative. You have no factual basis of what you're saying. I already have a therapist, thank you. Who has a PhD in Psychology. If you start seeing someone and suddenly on the first date spill out all your deepest darkest secrets. (From just a kiss) Is ANY person straight or not going to accept you? When you meet people for the first time they are not interested in your problems at first. Because they have their own problems to worry about it.

It's not manipulative. Manipulative is when you try to control the other person or their feelings. Look it up.

well, I'm told by Ann that I can't post here b/c apparently this section is reserved only for those w/AIDS/HIV, so I can't reply. But I will have you know I am against any kind of laws forcing ppl to disclose b/c I believe everyone should be responsible for their own actions and if they are that worried, don't engage in risky sex. I just think it may be better for you in the long run, b/c regardless if you view it as manipulative or not, someone who doesn't have it may react that way. you never know. I do think it's good that you feel a need to disclose, though, because many ppl don't.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

it depends. if you're just making out, and have no intention of taking it any further, EVER, then no need to disclose, imo. no one's business.BUT you also said, "if we planned on taking it further, then obviously, I'd disclose," which makes me wonder, why prolong the inevitable? if there's a chance you could end up as something more w/this person, why are you waiting to disclose? is it because you are afraid they will reject you at first, but you're hoping that, with time, if they get to know you, they'll overlook it? b/c that could be viewed as somewhat manipulative. you don't want this person to feel tricked.this is coming from an HIV-negative chic, who'd probably wanna know beforehand. once you disclosed, I wouldn't wanna have sex with you. (I realize you're gay so you wouldn't want me anyway, lol, but if I were with a straight man I wouldn't want to have sex with him if he told me that). I wouldn't hate you for it, though, we could still be friends and all that, and if I liked you, I'd wanna be there for ya, regardless. but you might wanna ask yourself why you're not upfront in the 1st place. b/c if the relationship amounts to anything more, you're only pro-longing the inevitable.

Oh come on man, you shouldn't jinx yourself. Talk like this will have Mr. Karma in your pants in no time!!

this is coming from an HIV-negative chic, who'd probably wanna know beforehand. once you disclosed, I wouldn't wanna have sex with you. (I realize you're gay so you wouldn't want me anyway, lol, but if I were with a straight man I wouldn't want to have sex with him if he told me that). I wouldn't hate you for it, though, we could still be friends and all that, and if I liked you,

Wow how special does this make you feel, she doesn't want to touch you but she wants to be your friend..what a sweetie...and they wonder why Stigma is still alive and kicking...jeez.

Hell NO, Hiv is transmit between blood to blood or semon to blood contact if i remember correctly. Kissing does not allow those kind of contacts. I believe HIV is hard to catch, I stayed neg for 15 years even with high risk activity. Unfortunately my luck ran out, but point is it was not easy to get. I started to believe that possibly I had that "gene" that makes you not get it. WRONG

Hell NO, Hiv is transmit between blood to blood or semon to blood contact if i remember correctly. Kissing does not allow those kind of contacts. I believe HIV is hard to catch, I stayed neg for 15 years even with high risk activity. Unfortunately my luck ran out, but point is it was not easy to get. I started to believe that possibly I had that "gene" that makes you not get it. WRONG

Yeah. I heard that HIV is present in the saliva too. So that's why I was asking.

It all really depends on your State's Disclosure laws and how you feel about breaking them. In Michigan a kiss without an HIV disclosure (if you know you are HIV positive) would get you charged with a felony. To paraphrase our law: Any intrusion however slight by a body part or an object into the oral, anal and vaginal openings of another individual---is the definition of 'sex'. Ergo, HIV status disclosure must occur prior to anything that meets this definition.

So yeah--in Michigan, if you don't want to do felony time, you have to disclose your HIV status (if known to be positive) before you kiss someone.