The delegates extended an invitation to Warren to appear at their caucus meeting tomorrow, just before she is slated to give a prime-time address on the convention stage....

Well, that timing gives her an easy way to say no, but her cause is damaged by the simple spectacle of DNC delegates questioning her openly like this.

Geronimo’s wife, Karen, also an Apache from New Mexico, said she and other Indians carry an ID card as proof of their heritage, and believes every person claiming American Indian heritage should do the same.

Asked whether she would ever vote for someone who misrepresented themselves as American Indian, she was adamant.

"Geronimo’s wife, Karen, also an Apache from New Mexico, said she and other Indians carry an ID card as proof of their heritage, and believes every person claiming American Indian heritage should do the same."

Soon, undoubtedly, the Democrat Party will have a plank requiring all Americans to carry an I.D. card, complete with RFID, specifying racial composition (verified by DNA, don'tcha know?), gender assignment, sexual orientation, party affiliation, religion (for the benighted few), income, education, marital status, children, next of kin, employment, vehicles driven, and gun-ownership (and probably a few other things I can't imagine right now).

It will be required for every single last thing in life except for proof of citizenship and voting.

One's status in the Democrat Brave New World will hinge entirely on this card.

By "another ID card issue", do you mean identity politics, or presenting ID to vote? It sounds like the former, and that doesn't seem right. American Indians might naturally be more sensitive to the sort of brazen lies of which Warren is accused, just as entrepreneurs are more sensitive about being told "you didn't build that".

"Geronimo’s wife, Karen, also an Apache from New Mexico, said she and other Indians carry an ID card as proof of their heritage, and believes every person claiming American Indian heritage should do the same."

Also here, per the City of Charlotte. Note that you will need government photo ID even to be in the vicinity of the DNC in some cases (all pedestrians, even those who are walking to their homes or their jobs, will be required to show said ID).

Harlyn Geronimo, the great-grandson of the legendary Apache warrior, said he didn’t know the details of Warren’s claims but wanted to make sure she didn’t try to “take advantage” of her Cherokee claims. Warren has offered no proof of her ancestry but says she is relying on “stories” relayed to her by her family.

“I wouldn’t vote for anybody that is being dishonest, and it’s unfair to our people,” he said.

Also here, per the City of Charlotte. Note that you will need government photo ID even to be in the vicinity of the DNC in some cases (all pedestrians, even those who are walking to their homes or their jobs, will be required to show said ID).

Again, not to harp on this, but if a Republican falsely claimed that they were Native American --- repeating it after the evidence is so clearly against the claim that they would have to be delusional to believe it --- wouldn't it be covered?

Why is Todd Akin the most covered person running for Senate instead of Elizabeth Navafaux Warren?

shouldn't more be made over the fact that, while the Demos say they hate voter ID laws, you can't get into their convention without showing a valid driver's license?

I'm interested in the way these ID issues cut in different directions.

But the Indian tribe ID issue is very different from anything else. The tribes have a political power that is theirs to define membership, and there is a process that they control. To claim that political status without using the tribe's process is an impingement on the tribes' political power, and it's not surprising they are vigilant about that.

But in the larger political arena, where minority status is used casually and there are so many other groups, with respect to which there is no membership process, things are done differently.

These tribal members are saying you can't treat Indian status like those other minority groups. They think they're special. Are they not?

I'm not surprised to see fellow erzatz Indian Ward Churchill is defending Princess Cheekbones.

"Half breed,that's all I ever heard,both sides were against me since the day I was born."

Man, is Scott Brown one lucky guy or what? His first opponent for "the Kennedy seat" was too snobby to campaign at Fenway and called Bloody Sock Schilling a Yankee fan. And now he's facing this dim bulb...

These tribal members are saying you can't treat Indian status like those other minority groups. They think they're special. Are they not?

Yes, they are. I grew up in Arizona, resenting that specialness. American Indians have more rights than non-Indians. It's anachronistic and unfair, and in many ways belittling and hurtful to those same Indians.

Later, during the era of affirmative action, whites with traces of American Indian or other minority ancestry likewise redesignated themselves, in order to take advantage of preferential policies for disadvantaged groups. These have included blond-haired and blue-eyed individuals...

Comanche Voter identifies the importance of tribal membership. Its largely about the per capita payments from the tribal councils to tribal members--The more "indians" in the tribe, the less the per capita payment. Follow the money. That is also the reason why tribes have, for me most part, establish blood quanta crietria for membership.

Also here, per the City of Charlotte. Note that you will need government photo ID even to be in the vicinity of the DNC in some cases (all pedestrians, even those who are walking to their homes or their jobs, will be required to show said ID).

LOL. Thanks. That's great.

The answer to your question, Ann, is yes, Indians are even more special than other minorities. They, as a group, get all sorts of special privileges other "Americans" don't.

Man, is Scott Brown one lucky guy or what? His first opponent for "the Kennedy seat" was too snobby to campaign at Fenway and called Bloody Sock Schilling a Yankee fan. And now he's facing this dim bulb...

It's Massachusetts. Warren has an even chance to beat Brown. In fact, I'd put money on it. This state is that much of a lost cause.

But with any luck, she'll screech "you built that? Well good for you. Good. For. You." again and let her inner banshee out.

The first question is easy to answer: Family heritage taught an untruth, and respect for the family kept her from questioning that heritage.The second question is the problem. How do explain listing minority status initially, then dropping it later. There's no way to spin this where it doesn't sound like gaming the system to take advantage of affirmative action, then dropping it so as not to appear to be an affirmative action hire.And the cookbook thing is just embarrassing all the way around, especially compounded with the plagiarism. I'd bet they wouldn't even ask about that.

I doubt anyone would care about casual membership of Warren's sort of 1/32 nd based on hazy family stories... if it wasn't used to GET something.

Americans like being Irish, too.

My family claims Lapp though I've never quite figured out how.

We like being interesting.

But, as many people pointed out, membership in an Indian tribe is about proving you qualify. My sister in law had been considering going through the process of filing all the paper-work that she'd need to file to "belong" to her tribe in the North West because she had grandparents she could claim. I didn't get the details but I got the idea that 1/32 wouldn't have cut it anyway.

Elizabeth Warren could be entirely mistaken and I wouldn't fault her family mythology at all *except* that she seems to have used it to get something that our laws and customs have set aside for real Native Americans.

I don't think that we *should* have affirmative action but we DO have affirmative action. It's also pretty much a given that Warren herself would argue for those preferences given to Native Americans.

And of course... getting an ID is not an insurmountable obstacle for anyone at all. No matter who they are.

People who don't have them haven't got them because they don't need to. They can get along fine without bothering with it. If they needed to file birth certificates from half a dozen ancestors to get on the roles for using the Indian Hospital or casino money or whatever... they could do it, or get someone to help them. And that's way way more trouble than just going to the DMV and getting an ID card.

An excellent rundown on what it takes to be an official Cherokee here. It is somewhat easier to become a member of the largest band of Cherokees than it is for tribes that own casinos-- it only requires descent from someone listed on the Dawes Roll, q.v. Needless to say, Warren doesn't qualify.

And of course... getting an ID is not an insurmountable obstacle for anyone at all. No matter who they are.

Quite true. But the sticking point is that universal suffrage without ID benefits the Democrats. It allows them to corner the votes of their base: the ignorant, the lazy, the entitled, the grievance-mongers.

I have always been against giving the vote to everyone. If you have a society where the vote of an ignorant person who can't even name their own representative has as much weight as the vote of an informed citizen, you end up with what we have now - a nation governed by illiterates, imbeciles, theives and poseurs.

This is neither here nor there, but, "Geronimo"--that's one of those one word names that great people have--you know, like "Caesar" or "Sting". Doesn't it detract from it when your descendants use ordinary first names before it like "Karen". It just loses something. Maybe the first Geronimo had an unromantic first name, too, like Myron, Myron Geronimo. I'm just glad he never shared it, for history's sake.

What Synova said re Mr Eastwood's presentation--"get rid of the lawyers," and his most important point I think was his line that our political class has failed us irrespective of our party affiliations. "They work for us..." And if they dont we should fire them. All in all a good message. Republicans should not take too much comfort in his message, and it went over the Democrat's heads entirely.

And a bit off topic, but apparently Mr Clinton has not vetted his speech with the Dems--be very afraid, Dems

Warren was proven a liar. Why is she still an issue. She did accomplish anything, someone else achieve it for her. Maybe a community organizer or something in her past. Next she will claim she is the direct descendent of Sacagawea.

I doubt Elizabeth Warren's performance can be as compelling as the earlier video of her surrounded by enthusiasts in a private home. All that urgent cogent gesticulation is different onstage and behind a lectern. Muted. Forfeited. Lost.

It's also sounds great in preacher's cadence and crescendo delivered to a small black congregation, less so to the broader audience.

It's not even Obama's idea, not even Elizabeth Warren's idea, they don't have ideas of their own, they get them all from people who do the thinking for them. But it's not even George Lakoff's idea, really, who assembled the words for it, and whose vocabulary and organized words they are using, he got all that from the faculty lounge.

Speaking of faculty lounges, that's a figment of my imagination. Someone else's imagination. I recall teacher's lounges in high school, but none of my professor friends mention them. They might exist, but if so then some dumbass little area of deplorable design nobody really uses, mostly because of the people one would encounter there. I honestly don't know.

Be sure to identify the ethnic origin of each owner, proprietor, partner, officer, member, director and stockholder.

Minority Group Defined: A citizen of the United States who is Black, Hispanic, or Native American. Asian Pacific whose origins are in Japan, China, the Philippines, Vietnam, Korea, Samoa, Guam, the U.S. Trust Territory and the Pacific Islands, the Northern Marinas Islands, Laos,Kampuchea (Cambodia), Taiwan, Burma, Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia, Singapore, Brunei, Republic of the Marshall Islands, orthe Federated States of Micronesia. Native American means American Indians, Eskimos, Aleuts, and Native Hawaiians. Asian Indian Americans include United States citizens whose origins are from India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh.

Our Host said: But the Indian tribe ID issue is very different from anything else. The tribes have a political power that is theirs to define membership, and there is a process that they control. To claim that political status without using the tribe's process is an impingement on the tribes' political power, and it's not surprising they are vigilant about that.

They can define legal and political membership all they want.

What they can't define is "being 1/N Indian" or "being told your paternal great-grandmother [or whoever] was Cherokee" and acting on that.

Hell, they could arrange their bylaws such that legal "membership" in the tribe could be purchased for $100M and otherwise defined by being born in a given zip code - and that would not affect the "moral" issue of "does she have any reason to THINK she's An Indian Somehow".

And that question is only answerable if we know whether her family really did have a tradition that there was a figurative "Indian in the woodpile" - which as far as I know we simply have no data on.

If she'd been told she was 1/N Indian by family tradition all her life, I don't see a big problem with being unable to Prove It With An ID Card.

Crack. Which tribe did Romney say he was a member of? What minority did he sidle up to and pretend to be a part of to advance himself?

Oh, my bad - HE DIDN'T TELL THE SAME LIE!

That makes all the difference, doesn't it?

The fact both lies made the news is minor stuff, as is the fact that, while Warren is lying about the nature of her heritage, Romney told one that shocked everyone who shares his "faith"!

And then, to top it all off - I'm talking about the best of the best here - not only won't you hold his lie against him as you are Warren, but those good, nice, honest, and wholesome folks in his cult aren't either!

So in truth, what you all share is a venal, ugly, disgusting, corrupting, and totally illegitimate naked lust for power - however you can get it.

Some people of God they are!

And some conservatives YOU are!

A bunch of lousy, stinking, half-baked hypocrites is what you really are.

CA - My wife taught at a public elementary school when we were first married, back in the late 70s, and I was allowed into the faculty lounge. They do exist. Back then, it was all about the coffee: who took the last cup and didn't start a fresh pot; who's turn it is to clean it; who used someone's else's coffee creamer; who used somebody else's mug, etc. I'm guessing that's still true today. For me it kinda shot a hole in the holy of holies.

The Crack Emcee said... I don't see how any of you who are dissing Warren as a joke and a liar aren't also dissing Romney as just as big of one.

Wow, Crack you're right. As a former Roman Catholic who is now an agnostic, I am deeply troubled that someone might not hold firmly onto all of the tenets of his alleged faith. So I've decided not to vote for Mitt; though, I will still be voting against Obama.

Crack. Your reasoning skills suck. Badly. They might operate fine outside your obsession with all that you deem cultish, but that is an ever narrowing field. You might want to grab a book on basic logic and have a long read. It will be boring but instructive. Trust me on this. It will help.

Until sometime in the 1920s, American Indians did not have the right to vote unless they left the reservation and lived as normal Americans. Under their treaty rights they were considered a separate nation.

It was changed by a court decision, not a democratic vote. I think it was a mistake. You can not logically be a member of a separate nation and a US citizen at the same time. It is a violation of the 14th amendment—everyone is supposed to have equal rights.

You know, Warren lying about her heritage and trying to use that to get ahead matters less to me than the absolute stupidity of her political beliefs. People play the game as it exists. The bankers did not want to make bad loans but the government was guaranteeing them on one hand and punishing banks for not making them on the other so they did the only rational thing. They made loans they would not have otherwise made.

Warren is playing the system as it exists --- though badly and not by the rules. But where she is culpable is in creating and supporting a racial spoils system. She is the sort of person who thinks it is a good idea to divide everyone up by race and pit them against each other on that basis. That being the case she should at least have the courage of her convictions and accept her place at the bottom of the barrel she created for everyone else instead of trying to write herself an exemption based on nothing more than wishful thinking.

But even all of that could be overlooked if she wasn't just such a Marxist idiot. Given what we know of history and economics, and the multitude of examples we have of what happens when people feel entitled to the possessions of others, there is absolutely no way we can think of her as anything other than a common criminal who wants to practice her trade in the halls of Congress rather than in the alleys of our city streets like more honest criminals do.

That is the long and the short of it. She is only a fake indian, but she is a real menace. If it takes a side issue like this to derail her or to make it clear to people what she is or how vile the racist system she supports is then so be it.

When the whole Ward Churchill thing blow up, I was living in Superior. Picked up a copy of the Indian Nation News (or whatever it was called) at the Globe News, as they attacked the "fake Indian". Even the AIM (American Indian Movement) folks spit on Churchill.

When you are a left winger who has lost AIM, you know you lost the battle.

Crack. Your reasoning skills suck. Badly. They might operate fine outside your obsession with all that you deem cultish, but that is an ever narrowing field. You might want to grab a book on basic logic and have a long read. It will be boring but instructive. Trust me on this. It will help.

Outstanding deduction. I give you the link to a video of the actual occurrence of Romney telling a bald-faced lie and you give me what, exactly?

Proof that I'm wrong? Evidence it was all a simple mistake? An explanation for it? No, no, that of course would be too much to ask of one as superior in the thought processes as you.

No, I get your personal DECLARATION that my "reasoning skills suck."

Well, that certainly seals the deal, doesn't it? Nothing more needs to be said. "Michael" - some vague being from the ether of the internet - has decided I should "grab a book on basic logic" (not The Book Of Mormon? I own a copy of THAT, you know?) and upon reading this book, Romney's obvious lie will miraculously go away and this "Michael" will be made into a whole person rather than the ethically compromised, minor note he has sounded.

I'll look into it, my friend, if only to do you the favor of being assisted above the level of worms,..

A couple of nights ago AMC ran Thunderbolt and Lightfoot. They have a great plan for a robbery where they go to a drive-in right afterwards. After the movie gets out, they will drive-away just like all the other cars. The problem is that a little bit of clothes stick-out from the guys in the trunk. This is noticed by the movie ticket booth operators and everything goes South after that one mistake...

To want to be part of a Native Tribe is understandable. There are very few people that can say that their families ancestry can be traced back to tribal communities, for there are few Native American Indians left. The purpose of finding out your heritage is to respect and honor and if not the above then to understand who your people were and are. Some tribes do give their tribal members id cards, which states the tribe name and also a roll number. Which the U.S Government started by having the Tribal Indians forcefully moved from their homes and register their tribes and names on items like The Dawes Roll and among other Rolls and agreements made for the sole benifit of the non- natives of this country back in history. So you see its not that Indians are trying to hold themselves above other race's, they are trying to hold on to the one thing that shows who their anscestors are and that their heritage is still sacared to them. So if you are going to make comments about this issue, re-visit your history books or the internet on the Tribes that exist and on the Tribes that no longer exist. What you were taught in school doesn't always tell you the full story about the Native American Indians. "You can claim to be Indian but the proof is in your blood"

And for you who are just assuming that all Indians are rolling in the money from all their casinos and such. You have been mislead. Each recognized tribe (yes, not all tribes are acknowledged by the federal gov.) has to still go through the proper federal guidelines, set-up by the U.S Gov. and for the Tribe to give its people a per-capita payment they have to have the U.S gov approval on the amounts and the terms of payment amongst other things. And just because you were taught to practice anothers culture, does not change the fact that your people were not origianally of that blood line. Some tribes only ask you to trace back your Indian anscestors back to the 1400's, and if the percentage you are claiming is enough then most of the time you are inducted into your tribe. Because true Indians can trace back their people past the 1400's. You can be from race wise from several different tribes, but you can only be enrolled in one tribe. Also, not all tribal members live on reservations, and the reason you don't meet alot of N.A.Indians is because there arent very many left. To say you are isnt the same as knowing that the blood that runs through your body is that of a N.A.Indian.