So, I would go BACK outside and play with the boys and then they would tell me I wasn't being ladylike . . . :::sigh::: I pretty much quit listening to them and just started reading all the time.

You surprise me . I remember being about 8 in the school yard which in those days was divided into girls in the upper yard and boys in the lower yard. Another girl and I liked kicking a football around and were doing so very happily. We'd even found a spot away from any windows. Next thing we knew one of the older teachers was yelling at us that we weren't allowed to play there and to get back where we belonged . . . well, our class teacher had just strolled by on yard duty and hadn't said anything except "Hi" so we were beyond confused. We slunk off in the direction indicated along with our football. Took me half the next lesson to put it together. Two rather plain little girls, both with short hair, wearing sneakers, somewhat tatty jeans and windcheaters (poor Mum gave up on mending my clothes!) - old Mrs Ellis had mistaken us for boys! She caught us again a few days later and this time told us directly to stay in the boys' yard. I managed to tell her we were girls, but I'll swear she didn't believe me for a moment . Good thing she didn't ask us to prove it.

:lol: no kidding, although It would have been interesting to hear the explanation of how "Ms. Teacher" died of apoplexy right there on the playground._________________A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing.

As long as a child or young person "chooses" to socialize, I have no problem with it. But I think, in the U.S. at least, schools and parents alike regiment children until individuality is almost an impossibility. We often hear how much peer pressure controls young people's actions, but the pressure from schools and parents is equally suspect, in my view. When I was in school--when dirt was young--I went to school at 9, went home for lunch at 12, returned at 1 and was released at 3, and had two recesses of unsupervised play. It was my or my parents responsibility to get me there. If I wanted to play sports, I found a group to play with. Nobody organized a league. Parents were not involved unless there was a free-for-all, and even then, they intervened only when blood flowed. Now everything's organized--T-ball, soccer for 3d graders, coach-pitch ball, soccer for 12 years and below, basketball teams for 7 year olds. Immoderate readers, at least, are doing something the individual does on his own.

Just an aside, but do kids play kick the can anymore?

Dick,

It is interesting that you should mention this because a recent (as in last six months) news program and not so recent (as in last year or maybe year before) news program talked about how the regimented play/dance/music schedules have resulted in children who often can't play spontaneously and don't know how to make friends. The regimentation actually shields them from having to do this. They do make acquaintances, much the same as an adult might have business associates, but many of them lack the time to "hang out" as kids used to do. In my own child's life I don't see this so much but I do know several kids of whom this is true, so I have to give the theory some merit. It would certainly explain the swelling ranks of isolated, unhappy teens in this country who are lining up outside the doors of psychologists and pharmacies.

As to the article, I am a firm believer in accepting responsibility for yourself. I doubt her parents locked her in the attic to read -- why should they have been responsible for her socialization? And would she really have socialized if they had taken her out and forced her into a group? Many a kid at karate spoke to no one, not all the kids in soccer are instant best buds. And real life not comparing to books? What about television and the movies? Should we ban all entertainment lest people forget their real lives will never be like that? Has my son been ruined for life because I took him to see "Kung Fu Panda" with some friends and he will never in his life see a real life kung fu group made up of pandas, tigers and snakes?

Has my son been ruined for life because I took him to see "Kung Fu Panda" with some friends and he will never in his life see a real life kung fu group made up of pandas, tigers and snakes?

You forgot the crane and the mantis, Maggie, and on that basis my two are ruined as well. In the last couple of months we've seen Spiderwick Chronicles, Nim's Island, Indiana Jones and Prince Caspian. Has anyone here ever seen the kids' book Death of a Wombat? It garnered all sorts of awards years back and critics loved it for being gritty and realistic. I've just never found a child who wanted to read it . . . including myself. On the other hand my eldest is now racing through The Spiderwick Chronicles and I have every intention of passing him Lloyd Alexander's Prydain Chronicles when he finishes.

It is interesting that you should mention this because a recent (as in last six months) news program and not so recent (as in last year or maybe year before) news program talked about how the regimented play/dance/music schedules have resulted in children who often can't play spontaneously and don't know how to make friends. The regimentation actually shields them from having to do this. They do make acquaintances, much the same as an adult might have business associates, but many of them lack the time to "hang out" as kids used to do. In my own child's life I don't see this so much but I do know several kids of whom this is true, so I have to give the theory some merit. It would certainly explain the swelling ranks of isolated, unhappy teens in this country who are lining up outside the doors of psychologists and pharmacies.

My colleagues and I see a lot of this firsthand. I work as an EFL (English as a Foreign Language) to Korean schoolchildren who are incredibly regimented. Some of them are in "study centres" until 1:00 am--and that's perfectly normal for them. Some college freshmen whose high school lives were all about school in the morning, "review classes" (for Math, Science or English) in the afternoon, and music lessons on the weekend, actually have trouble using chopsticks. They didn't get a chance to learn properly from their own parents.

Can you imagine that? Packing your child's schedule so tightly that he doesn't know how to hold his fork and knife properly when cutting meat at table, because you never had time to teach him? _________________"To be in a romance is to be in uncongenial surroundings. To be born into this earth is to be born into uncongenial surroundings, hence to be born into a romance." (G.K. Chesterton)

When I was in elementary school, I preferred reading to hanging out with the other kids, and the teachers were so very concerned about this. I can understand that, but the thing is, I hated the other kids--I was in a particularly 'mean' class (even teachers acknowledged this) and just wanted to be left alone. I was happier reading, and all the teachers' efforts to make me hang out with the other kids fell flat. Trust me, when the 'popular' girls are told that they HAVE to like and play with an awkward little nerd girl, things don't go well.

I know the teachers were trying to be helpful, but man..the amount of time at recess I spent dodging the teachers...eventually I became a library volunteer just so I could hang out in there for the lunch hour!

And the thing is, when I hit junior high and switched schools, met some kids who were nicer (or maybe had grown up a bit?) I did make friends. I'm not really sure what the moral of the story here is, but I know that in my case, all that reading wasn't the problem--it was my solution to a bad situation.

When I was in elementary school, I preferred reading to hanging out with the other kids, and the teachers were so very concerned about this. I can understand that, but the thing is, I hated the other kids--I was in a particularly 'mean' class (even teachers acknowledged this) and just wanted to be left alone. I was happier reading, and all the teachers' efforts to make me hang out with the other kids fell flat. Trust me, when the 'popular' girls are told that they HAVE to like and play with an awkward little nerd girl, things don't go well.

I know the teachers were trying to be helpful, but man..the amount of time at recess I spent dodging the teachers...eventually I became a library volunteer just so I could hang out in there for the lunch hour!

And the thing is, when I hit junior high and switched schools, met some kids who were nicer (or maybe had grown up a bit?) I did make friends. I'm not really sure what the moral of the story here is, but I know that in my case, all that reading wasn't the problem--it was my solution to a bad situation.

I think that is a very good point --we are all choosy about our friends and there are times when we just can't make friends within a certain group because they don't suit us or we don't suit them. I know people who have changed jobs because they didn't fit into the culture of the company they were in and others who have switched colleges for the same reason.

I think it is very important to realize that we all react differently to different things. Some kids love having a ton of after school activities, others want chill time, some of us love to read with our free time, others need constant socialization. Just because something doesn't work for someone doesn't mean we should condemn it for all.