If our citizens should ever decide to lose their freedoms for a "short term" they may never get them back!

'Losing rights' is like getting a 'tax increase' - once it goes that direction it never goes back to what it once was.

Many lessons were learned,by both sides, during and after Katrina.

Nobody ever thought they'd see US troops on our streets going door to door, kicking many doors in, confiscating guns "for our safety". What's
alarming is that in just 8 short years so many have forgotten. It's easy to be detached especially when it didn't affect you directly. The
government has made adjustments. Thanks to NDAA they have the law on their side now.

I haven't forgotten what happened after Katrina. Those who have will likely get a refresher course on tyranny soon enough.

Originally posted by seabag
According to our VP, a push for stronger background checks will be the first thing to happen this fall. After that they plan to make it illegal for
anyone on the terrorist watch list to purchase a firearm. This would be another clear abuse of power and would infringe on constitutional protects of
millions. Currently there are nearly 1 million names on the watch list.

The number of names in a secret U.S. database of suspected terrorists has swollen to 875,000 from 540,000 only five years ago, in part because of
rule changes introduced after al Qaeda’s failed underwear bomb plot in 2009.

For those who think this is a good idea or no big deal, think again. Consider the announcement in 2009 made by Napolitano. Some people who may
potentially be added to this list are law abiding citizens who are guilty of nothing but serving their country or voicing concerns about issues that
affect us all (much like all of us).

Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano said Wednesday that she was briefed before the release of a controversial intelligence assessment
and that she stands by the report, which lists returning veterans among terrorist risks to the U.S.

This seems like a very scary and dangerous move / precedent to allow them to make.

So basically, if you're a political activist, or a "patriot" or a member of some type of militia, you may already be on this "watch list" and
your second amendment rights may soon be defecated on.

Where does this end? Forced sterilization for political dissidents? This is getting ridiculous....

This seems like a very scary and dangerous move / precedent to allow them to make.

So basically, if you're a political activist, or a "patriot" or a member of some type of militia, you may already be on this "watch list" and
your second amendment rights may soon be defecated on.

That's exactly where we're headed, friend. Under the guise of "keeping guns out of the hands of terrorist" they will pass that law. After that,
all they need to do is move the goal post. Anybody (literally) they want to disarm can be categorized as a "terrorist" and prohibited from owning a
weapon. This is what tyranny looks like.

Where does this end? Forced sterilization for political dissidents? This is getting ridiculous....

Where it ends depends on when
enough people recognize the governments plan and stand against it. If that doesn't happen then there will be no end.

I don't know...they could have another major casualty event they can cling to like ghouls to a car wreck, but even that couldn't get the most
basic Federal changes made after CT. It doesn't get much worse than that one for emotional ties to yank on. Yet, still... Failed. I think they need to
accept the fact that, at least for now, they still don't have the numbers to even attempt to basics of their agenda.

They may have missed the vote last time but they will NEVER stop trying. One need only read the headlines on ATS today to see the pattern of complete
disregard for the law and citizen’s rights by this corrupt regime in DC.

They don't have to take responsibility because, at least until recently, they weren't even called out on anything.

Why some people think it’s a stretch to think the government fears an armed populace in light of this corruption or that they would NEVER attempt
to strip us of the second amendment is beyond comprehension. It’s so blatantly obvious that NOTHING is sacred or off limits and the ends always
justify the means for these tyrants.

Jefferson said that the only way tyranny will come to America is in the form of fighting an imaginary enemy.

All of these anti-terrorism laws in the last decade, the Patriot Act, the NDAA, the NRDPA the only true purpose they serve is to trick the brain dead
masses into trading a lot of liberty for a little false security against an enemy that has for the most part been created by our government to begin
with. All of these laws were enacted to make us safer from Al Qeada terror attacks. However if you follow the lines of convergence AQ is a branch of
the Taliban, which is a branch of the Muslim Brotherhood which our government helped to rise to power in Libya, Egypt, and now it seems in Syria. So
our government is helping the supposed terrorists rise to power in all reality.

All of these laws enacted or attempts to enact concerning gun control is done under the guise of making us safer from violent crime. However we all
know that criminals don't obey the law and regardless of the laws passed they will procure their arms on the black market. Hell even if all guns were
suddenly gone and 100% unavailable to anyone in the united states we would still see just as much violent crime as we see now, only the tools of the
trade would be different.

The truth is that the real agenda of our government has nothing to do with our safety. It is instead to provide for their safety by making us nothing
more than helpless cattle that they can herd and do with as they please without risk of consequence.

The tyrants in power in this nation know that as long as the citizenry is armed we will be capable of resistance to their ultimate goal which IMO is
the institution of a complete totalitarian state in which our rights will be transformed into privileges granted by government.

We are already seeing this occur and it has been happening for many generations now. The second amendment doesn't read "shall not be banned" it
reads "shall not be infringed" and the difference in those 2 words makes all the difference in the world as to what they can lawfully do. Lawfully
the government cannot pass any law that encroaches or places regulations/limitations any of our rights that are encompassed within the Bill of Rights
in any way what so ever because any encroachment or limitation on those rights is an infringement.

No judge or politician in this nation that takes their oath sacred can ever say that regulations upon ones right to own a firearm, or freedom of
speech, or freedom from illegal search, or any of the other rights is constitutional when the constitution explicitly states those rights cannot be
infringed.

This is why we are seeing the increase in fearmongering and playing on the emotions of the people. When people give into their emotions they are
easily swayed and manipulated and this is exactly what our government is doing to us, they are manipulating the population with fear in an attempt to
enact their designs for tyranny and are using made up statistics and made up fears to accomplish their goal.

Do people want gun control? Yes. Nobody supports a complete lack of gun control. Gun control in this case is back ground checks. Yes back ground
checks. Something you need to buy a house, a car, get a job but not buy a gun. What fasinates me is how people can be dumb enough to think anyone is
ever going to take anybodys guns when not even back grounds checks that everybody supports can get passed. The NRA scares a bunch of morons in buying
more guns because they are going to take them away, the gun companies pay the the NRA to scare people and then buy off congress. We have people
getting slaughtered on pretty regular basis and back ground checks can not even get passed. How stupid do you have to be to think anyone is taking
your guns? Pretty damn stupid. And you idiots make the rest of gun owners look like a bunch anti gov lunatics.

You do realize that mandatory NCIC background checks have been a part of US Title 18 since the Lautenberg amendment was enacted in 1996 and The Brady
Bill was passed in 1993. Under the Lautenberg Amendment people that have been involuntarily committed to a mental health center for longer than 72 hrs
suffer gun ownership disability and can no longer legally own any type of firearm including black powder or C&R guns?

So how is it that background checks aren't required? I know this to be fact as a former FFL Type 1 dealer I could not legally sell a gun to anyone
without first doing an NCIC background check through the FBI data base. Even as a current C&R dealer I cannot legally sell an antique firearm to a
person without verifying that the are not under firearm disability for mental health reasons.

The Brady Act requires that background checks be conducted on individuals before a firearm may be purchased from a federally licensed dealer,
manufacturer or importer—unless an exception applies. If there are no additional state restrictions, a firearm may be transferred to an individual
upon approval by the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) maintained by the FBI. In some states, proof of a previous background
check can be used to bypass the NICS check. For example, a state-issued concealed carry permit usually includes a background check equivalent to the
one required by the Act. Other alternatives to the NICS check include state-issued handgun purchase permits or mandatory state or local background
checks.

The Lautenberg Amendment bans shipment, transport, ownership and use of guns or ammunition by individuals convicted of misdemeanor domestic
violence, or who are under a restraining (protection) order for domestic abuse in all 50 states. The act also makes it unlawful to knowingly sell or
give a firearm or ammunition to such persons.

Originally posted by MrSpad
What fasinates me is how people can be dumb enough to think anyone is ever going to take anybodys guns when not even back grounds checks that
everybody supports can get passed.

What fascinates me is how people can be dumb enough to think that buy regulating or banning something by making it illegal people will stop using it.
Yeah that worked our perfectly during the 30's with prohibition, not only did people start running liquor then but we also saw the rise of Speak
Easy's which was more often than not opium bars.

If regulation works so great then why are we still fighting the war on drugs 30 years after it was started? Hell I live in small town USA, a county
with 2,000 people in it in the heartland and far from any metropolitan area and I can walk across town and buy a bag of weed if I wanted to.

Yup the idea of regulation/prohibition works great!

All the laws in the world is not going to stop a person from doing evil if they are determined to do it. As I've said many times on this site, if I
want to kill someone and don't have a gun I can look around my home and find at least 20 items that I can use to do the job, many just as efficient as
a gun.

Nope, my Dad taught us all early on that whenever someone points a finger at someone else, they can GUARANTEE they will have at least 3 coming back at
them!

And to me that is one of the saddest parts of this whole mess, by the time the snitches realize what they have done it will be too late.

By turning on fellow Americans, they will also get theirs, I am certain of it.

As for the clergy becoming involved, well it has always worked this way and there is nothing new about it.

Again it will be to the clergy's ultimate demise and a parish without Parishioners is going to get wiped out quickly.

Food distributions, charity, all get funneled through the Churches so it is no wonder the chips will fall on the very same. It's going to be a trip
to witness, and just as in the initial days Pre- Constitution, an incredible time to be alive.

You do realize that mandatory NCIC background checks have been a part of US Title 18 since the Lautenberg amendment was enacted in 1996 and
The Brady Bill was passed in 1993.

They don’t care! They just want to keep peddling the administrations bogus guise. Anyone who thinks that the fed wouldn’t take our guns in a
minute if they could is a nut job. They’ve said as much!!! If they had the votes they’d do it in a heartbeat.

For whoever missed it:

Recently, only 4 years ago, Feinstein made it clear that she would take our guns. Asked about pushing to bring back her assault weapons ban she said,
“I’ll pick the time and place, no question about that.” That’s all I needed to hear.

There is no denying their intent. It doesn't take NRA fearmongering to see what's going on here.

I can't believe Biden acts like IRS scam is nothing, Benghazi NO BIG DEAL, these guys are teflon don, or so they think...

Here is the thing….nothing sticks to them!! They can literally get away with murder because their agenda is bigger than life.

As painful as it is, I have to agree with you. I can't remember the last time we had an administration buried in so many scandals, and yet they just
keep getting free passes from the MSM, which is where most people get their so-called "knowledge".

Ask someone on the street about anything going on in Washington, and they'll be clueless. Ask them who the finalists are on "Dancing With The
Stars", and guess what?

May 6, 2013, Biden met with religious leaders and told them “off the record” that the next big push for gun control will happen this fall after
the immigration debate is over.

Proof please. Your source does not say this.

According to our VP, a push for stronger background checks will be the first thing to happen this fall. After that they plan to make it illegal
for anyone on the terrorist watch list to purchase a firearm. This would be another clear abuse of power and would infringe on constitutional protects
of millions. Currently there are nearly 1 million names on the watch list.

So you think people on a terrorist list should have firearms. And if an identified terrorist can't have a firearm, that's an infringement of his
constitutional rights. OK...

Let’s recap! Clergy were approached to set up “Clergy Response Teams” designed (and used) to basically ease tension and calm
people during martial law while gun confiscations occurred

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
The way things are going? Biden and Obama are going to be damn lucky if they still have offices to serve in, let alone the same faces on staff and in
Cabinet positions come the fall. I'm unsure on the first..and pretty sure it's a NO on the second.

You are showing a general lack of understanding of the issue. This issue was, firstly, not begun by the Obama administration. In fact, gun laws have
been relaxed (so far, though that may change) during his tenure.

Secondly, you are missing the point altogether. It's not about adding background checks on guns - it's about THAT LIST. Who gets to make the black
list (of potential terrorists) and add people to it, without oversight in fact? Ask dubya's cronies because they set that up. Obama is just
proceeding down the path that your far right wing heroes have set. Quit parroting what you hear glen beck say and do some research.

What Obama has done that should be focused on is separating "terrorists" from citizens rights. With a list of 875000 "terrorists", that's what
you should be worried about. The issue isn't about going back to where gun control was 10 years ago ( which is the majority of what is being pushed
as a public ploy).

WASHINGTON (AP) — Vice President Joe Biden wants pastors, rabbis and nuns to tell their flocks that enacting gun control is the moral thing to
do. But another vote may have to wait until Congress wraps up work on an immigration overhaul.

So you think people on a terrorist list should have firearms. And if an identified terrorist can't have a firearm, that's an infringement of
his constitutional rights. OK...

If the terrorist list is comprised of veterans, so-called right wing extremists, people who distrust the government, people who support the
constitution, etc then yes I do. You missed the point...not surprising.

Proof please.

I gave you a video. You've got to put a little effort in before you respond.

Well my quoted text was talking about the unlikely event of their returning to gun control in the Fall, per the OP point, as scandals from several
directions would seem to be a little more than even they can wave some press releases at and make go away in a few news cycles.

The issue with background checks is absolutely real enough. I'm a little confused by what you mean. the push has been to require background checks on
the private sale between private citizens, nation wide. I don't agree with it one bit and some states already have it, like California. Let it be a
state thing and California requires registering guns in from other states as well, so if we're talking about law abiding citizens (criminals won't
follow any of it anyway), the existing and NON-Federal system seems to serve the various states fairly well, IMO. Criminals will be criminals and
throw the book at firearm related criminals. That's fine with me..However, the back grounding of all private sales or "gunshow loophole" which is the
cherry on their cupcake, is patently absurd and not how it works in most states.

That is the crown jewel about equal with magazine capacity, in their whole gun control focus.

Oh..and I stopped listening to or watching Glenn Beck a long time ago. I don't much trust his site after catching two false or time shifted articles
and he went a little beyond what even I could relate to anymore before his first trip to Jerusalem and his apparently religious experience. Errr... I
liked him so much better when he mixed entertainment with news ....not just fire and brimstone with conspiracy overtones. ..for what that
matters.

Remember when he said, "The AWB is just the beginning!"......yea, look how that one turned out. Epic fail. More like "The AWB is just the
beginning....of legislation that has no chance of passing and is going to crash and burn."

I guess if you fall flat on your face the first time, might as well do it again, because..... I guess it's just fun to be a failure?

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