In the last few months I've started viewing the videos of Brother Nathaniel Kapner.I realize that he is a controversial figure, and that he also claims to be an Orthodox brother ( ROCOT I heard). Is this true? Does ROCOR actually sanction such afigure controversial as him.in their monastic ranks? Or is he more an independent monk?

No we don't and that's official. Met. Hilarion visited our Church last year and I spent some time with him. I brought up Br. Nathanial and he spoke about him with me. He confirmed that he is not in any way a member of Rocor..

Logged

Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

In the last few months I've started viewing the videos of Brother Nathaniel Kapner.I realize that he is a controversial figure, and that he also claims to be an Orthodox brother ( ROCOT I heard). Is this true? Does ROCOR actually sanction such afigure controversial as him.in their monastic ranks? Or is he more an independent monk?

No we don't and that's official. Met. Hilarion visited our Church last year and I spent some time with him. I brought up Br. Nathanial and he spoke about him with me. He confirmed that he is not in any way a member of Rocor..

What time last year? Because Vladyka Jerome was confirming back in November that Br. Nathanael has made the ROCOR Synod church in New York his place of attendance. That was in the context of the accepted statement that Br. Nathanael is with ROCOR. Presumably all he does, is with the blessing of his canonical abbot who is not ROCOR. He is most unusual but also loved by many, not as extreme in person as he can come off in the videos, and even non-Orthodox people really appreciate his efforts and goodwill and encouragement and cheer.

And he basically speaks truth to authority, although I think he needs to refine his comments about "Jews" to clarify the difference between the zionist Jews in high positions who are intent on a path of great harm and destruction (and are worthy of the general moniker "antichrist") and ordinary Jews, who are not the antichrist. By lumping in the latter with the former, he very much opens himself to charges of antisemitism. Of course, others do this sort of "shorthand" as well. As a Russian priest pointed out, Romney said Russia was America's greatest enemy, but he was probably talking about Putin and not about "my grandmother." (Please note this is not political commentary, but an illustration of a communication principle--that discourse can clamber broadly when the intent is actually narrow.)

In the last few months I've started viewing the videos of Brother Nathaniel Kapner.I realize that he is a controversial figure, and that he also claims to be an Orthodox brother ( ROCOT I heard). Is this true? Does ROCOR actually sanction such afigure controversial as him.in their monastic ranks? Or is he more an independent monk?

No we don't and that's official. Met. Hilarion visited our Church last year and I spent some time with him. I brought up Br. Nathanial and he spoke about him with me. He confirmed that he is not in any way a member of Rocor..

What time last year? Because Vladyka Jerome was confirming back in November that Br. Nathanael has made the ROCOR Synod church in New York his place of attendance. That was in the context of the accepted statement that Br. Nathanael is with ROCOR. Presumably all he does, is with the blessing of his canonical abbot who is not ROCOR. He is most unusual but also loved by many, not as extreme in person as he can come off in the videos, and even non-Orthodox people really appreciate his efforts and goodwill and encouragement and cheer.

And he basically speaks truth to authority, although I think he needs to refine his comments about "Jews" to clarify the difference between the zionist Jews in high positions who are intent on a path of great harm and destruction (and are worthy of the general moniker "antichrist") and ordinary Jews, who are not the antichrist. By lumping in the latter with the former, he very much opens himself to charges of antisemitism. Of course, others do this sort of "shorthand" as well. As a Russian priest pointed out, Romney said Russia was America's greatest enemy, but he was probably talking about Putin and not about "my grandmother." (Please note this is not political commentary, but an illustration of a communication principle--that discourse can clamber broadly when the intent is actually narrow.)

I dont remember the exact date. I will ask while in Church this weekend when he was here and let you know.

Met. Hilarion not only said that he is not a member of Rocor but that he had viciously attacked Rocor during the reunification with Moscow, excoriating Rocor on his web page. Met. said that eventually he recanted and sent an apology and took down all the attacks from his page. He emphasized that Nathaniel was only a Novice. His clear implication was that Nathaniel has no authority to speak for the Church.

IMHO a novice should be cleaning floors not promoting grandiose and wholly fallacious theories about how the World is run.

Logged

Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Maybe when dealing with people whose names have been directly translated from another language. Maybe it's different elsewhere, but in the anglosphere we typically spell people's names the way they do.

Logged

Note : Many of my posts (especially the ones antedating late 2012) do not reflect charity, tact, or even views I presently hold. Please forgive me for any antagonism I have caused.

Maybe when dealing with people whose names have been directly translated from another language. Maybe it's different elsewhere, but in the anglosphere we typically spell people's names the way they do.

Unfortunately.

Logged

Quote from: GabrieltheCelt

If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.

Quote from: orthonorm

I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

Correct. Novice Nathanael has no authority to speak for the Orthodox Church.

I find his analyses quite accurate, and data-based.

Y'all's mileage may vary. May and should!

Brother Nathanael is a vicious Anti-Semite and bigot. I would be terribly disappointed if I discovered a Priest that I was associated who thought highly of his ravings... Fortunately, the Orthodox Priesthood by overwhelming majority are men of good character and high intelligence.

I just went to his web site and this is the first video I clicked on. As you can see his Antisemitism has little to do with any semblance of Anti-Zionism but is rather the same old tired and discredited canard that the World is Run by a cabal of Jewish interests. No doubt he also has strong Anti-Zionist views. All people who are against Israel are not Anti-Semites. However, all Anti-Semites are also Anti-Israel. Such is the case with this evil person. He is a poor lost soul leading the naive and gullible into perdition.

I am not endorsing Br. Nathanael's various presentations and messages. I don't have time to even go through them all, in large part because at my workplace it's not possible to access many sites, including Youtube and Facebook. (I use break time or sometimes time spent waiting for a call, to make responses on here.) I am alarmed by his rhetoric, in that I think a line should be drawn between virulently anti-Christian, anti-human, anti-God plutocrats who are often but not always Jewish (culturally Jewish), on the one hand, and on the other hand, ordinary men and women who happen to be Jewish. Of course, many public figures who have gained wide support in the U.S. (e.g.) often make the very same mistakes in expression, and people and the public give them a pass. So I sense a double standard there, and this makes my little indicator of "What's Fair" start whirring and flashing. But, no, I am not a proponent of Br. Nathanael's work, I'm rather agnostic regarding it.

That the world is run, in very large part, by a cabal of (non-religious / irreligious) Jewish interests, is something backed up by a preponderance of the evidence. It does rather seem to be "the elephant in the room." But I also fully respect the views of those who don't at all think so. They either have imbibed other data sets, or have arrived at conclusions through various reasonings and processes which I may not even understand. I don't think those who dissent from the satanic cabal paradigm are therefore less pious, or less good human beings. And I can always have gotten something wrong.

I would hope that the same tolerance would be found in all Orthodox Christians. I also believe that ultimate solutions are spiritual, not political. I also love and respect the Jewish people, for they are the kinsmen of our Lord and God and Saviour Jesus Christ!

That the world is run, in very large part, by a cabal of (non-religious / irreligious) Jewish interests, is something backed up by a preponderance of the evidence. It does rather seem to be "the elephant in the room."

Last time I checked, Rupert Murdoch has no Jewish ancestry, nor has he ever identified himself as Jewish; William Randolph, the patriarch of the Hearst dynasty, was of Scottish Protestant stock.

« Last Edit: February 08, 2013, 05:22:44 AM by LBK »

Logged

No longer posting here. Anyone is welcome to PM me or email me at the address in my profile.

I am not endorsing Br. Nathanael's various presentations and messages. I don't have time to even go through them all, in large part because at my workplace it's not possible to access many sites, including Youtube and Facebook. (I use break time or sometimes time spent waiting for a call, to make responses on here.) I am alarmed by his rhetoric, in that I think a line should be drawn between virulently anti-Christian, anti-human, anti-God plutocrats who are often but not always Jewish (culturally Jewish), on the one hand, and on the other hand, ordinary men and women who happen to be Jewish. Of course, many public figures who have gained wide support in the U.S. (e.g.) often make the very same mistakes in expression, and people and the public give them a pass. So I sense a double standard there, and this makes my little indicator of "What's Fair" start whirring and flashing. But, no, I am not a proponent of Br. Nathanael's work, I'm rather agnostic regarding it.

That the world is run, in very large part, by a cabal of (non-religious / irreligious) Jewish interests, is something backed up by a preponderance of the evidence. It does rather seem to be "the elephant in the room." But I also fully respect the views of those who don't at all think so. They either have imbibed other data sets, or have arrived at conclusions through various reasonings and processes which I may not even understand. I don't think those who dissent from the satanic cabal paradigm are therefore less pious, or less good human beings. And I can always have gotten something wrong.

I would hope that the same tolerance would be found in all Orthodox Christians. I also believe that ultimate solutions are spiritual, not political. I also love and respect the Jewish people, for they are the kinsmen of our Lord and God and Saviour Jesus Christ!

Br. Nathanial's fundamental World View is exactly the same one developed some 70 plus years ago by Adolf Hitler and the Nazi Party. In short, the World is run by an evil cabal of Jews. He has simply taken the same recipe and added current names and events to the mixture.

It's hard to imagine a political philosophy that has been more discredited. Just because an argument has internal logic does not mean it is true. The most insidious part of promoting such tripe is that it gets people looking in the wrong directions for political solutions. This was so destructive to the German People that it should give any serious person great pause before believing it. History forgotten is destined to be repeated and all that.

To then say that "Ordinary Jews" are fine folks but their Kinsman are responsible for the ills of the World is nonsense. Once again, it was the ordinary Jew who was slaughtered by people who bought into the exact same theories that Br. Nathaniel repeats today. "By their fruits you shall know them".. Nazi ideology and paranoid delusions about a Jewish Cabal nearly destroyed the World in my Parents generation. Extreme caution is advised if you find yourself starting to think Br. Nathaniel makes good sense. Cavet Emptor

« Last Edit: February 08, 2013, 11:46:38 AM by Marc1152 »

Logged

Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

I am not endorsing Br. Nathanael's various presentations and messages. I don't have time to even go through them all, in large part because at my workplace it's not possible to access many sites, including Youtube and Facebook. (I use break time or sometimes time spent waiting for a call, to make responses on here.) I am alarmed by his rhetoric, in that I think a line should be drawn between virulently anti-Christian, anti-human, anti-God plutocrats who are often but not always Jewish (culturally Jewish), on the one hand, and on the other hand, ordinary men and women who happen to be Jewish. Of course, many public figures who have gained wide support in the U.S. (e.g.) often make the very same mistakes in expression, and people and the public give them a pass. So I sense a double standard there, and this makes my little indicator of "What's Fair" start whirring and flashing. But, no, I am not a proponent of Br. Nathanael's work, I'm rather agnostic regarding it.

That the world is run, in very large part, by a cabal of (non-religious / irreligious) Jewish interests, is something backed up by a preponderance of the evidence. It does rather seem to be "the elephant in the room." But I also fully respect the views of those who don't at all think so. They either have imbibed other data sets, or have arrived at conclusions through various reasonings and processes which I may not even understand. I don't think those who dissent from the satanic cabal paradigm are therefore less pious, or less good human beings. And I can always have gotten something wrong.

I would hope that the same tolerance would be found in all Orthodox Christians. I also believe that ultimate solutions are spiritual, not political. I also love and respect the Jewish people, for they are the kinsmen of our Lord and God and Saviour Jesus Christ!

Br. Nathanial's fundamental World View is exactly the same one developed some 70 plus years ago by Adolf Hitler and the Nazi Party. In short, the World is run by an evil cabal of Jews. He has simply taken the same recipe and added current names and events to the mixture.

It's hard to imagine a political philosophy that has been more discredited. Just because an argument has internal logic does not mean it is true. The most insidious part of promoting such tripe is that it gets people looking in the wrong directions for political solutions. This was so destructive to the German People that it should give any serious person great pause before believing it. History forgotten is destined to be repeated and all that.

To then say that "Ordinary Jews" are fine folks but their Kinsman are responsible for the ills of the World is nonsense. Once again, it was the ordinary Jew who was slaughtered by people who bought into the exact same theories that Br. Nathaniel repeats today. "By their fruits you shall know them".. Nazi ideology and paranoid delusions about a Jewish Cabal nearly destroyed the World in my Parents generation. Extreme caution is advised if you find yourself starting to think Br. Nathaniel makes good sense. Cavet Emptor

^^^^ This is actually not entirely true. Hitler did not speak of the common Jews as he does. If you want to know where some of Hitler got his symbol, and occult works - ask the Theosophy person.

I am not endorsing Br. Nathanael's various presentations and messages. I don't have time to even go through them all, in large part because at my workplace it's not possible to access many sites, including Youtube and Facebook. (I use break time or sometimes time spent waiting for a call, to make responses on here.) I am alarmed by his rhetoric, in that I think a line should be drawn between virulently anti-Christian, anti-human, anti-God plutocrats who are often but not always Jewish (culturally Jewish), on the one hand, and on the other hand, ordinary men and women who happen to be Jewish. Of course, many public figures who have gained wide support in the U.S. (e.g.) often make the very same mistakes in expression, and people and the public give them a pass. So I sense a double standard there, and this makes my little indicator of "What's Fair" start whirring and flashing. But, no, I am not a proponent of Br. Nathanael's work, I'm rather agnostic regarding it.

That the world is run, in very large part, by a cabal of (non-religious / irreligious) Jewish interests, is something backed up by a preponderance of the evidence. It does rather seem to be "the elephant in the room." But I also fully respect the views of those who don't at all think so. They either have imbibed other data sets, or have arrived at conclusions through various reasonings and processes which I may not even understand. I don't think those who dissent from the satanic cabal paradigm are therefore less pious, or less good human beings. And I can always have gotten something wrong.

I would hope that the same tolerance would be found in all Orthodox Christians. I also believe that ultimate solutions are spiritual, not political. I also love and respect the Jewish people, for they are the kinsmen of our Lord and God and Saviour Jesus Christ!

I do endorse a lot of his videos, not all of them. I find them very fact based and well researched. People are all getting up tight because here is an EO monk speaking about real issues. They'd rather him be beat down by an abbot and reduced to sweeping floors. ("Know your place peasant!!!") People like weakling Christians, not ones strong enough to speak up, as our Savior did and encouraged us to mentor. I give a lot of props to him. I see strong faith in him. He's brave, I think he speaks well, and articulates his facts well. I have no idea why people want to see a wimpy monk ordered back to his cell. He's also a great mouthpiece to bring Jews to Christianity by his own testimony.

I am not endorsing Br. Nathanael's various presentations and messages. I don't have time to even go through them all, in large part because at my workplace it's not possible to access many sites, including Youtube and Facebook. (I use break time or sometimes time spent waiting for a call, to make responses on here.) I am alarmed by his rhetoric, in that I think a line should be drawn between virulently anti-Christian, anti-human, anti-God plutocrats who are often but not always Jewish (culturally Jewish), on the one hand, and on the other hand, ordinary men and women who happen to be Jewish. Of course, many public figures who have gained wide support in the U.S. (e.g.) often make the very same mistakes in expression, and people and the public give them a pass. So I sense a double standard there, and this makes my little indicator of "What's Fair" start whirring and flashing. But, no, I am not a proponent of Br. Nathanael's work, I'm rather agnostic regarding it.

That the world is run, in very large part, by a cabal of (non-religious / irreligious) Jewish interests, is something backed up by a preponderance of the evidence. It does rather seem to be "the elephant in the room." But I also fully respect the views of those who don't at all think so. They either have imbibed other data sets, or have arrived at conclusions through various reasonings and processes which I may not even understand. I don't think those who dissent from the satanic cabal paradigm are therefore less pious, or less good human beings. And I can always have gotten something wrong.

I would hope that the same tolerance would be found in all Orthodox Christians. I also believe that ultimate solutions are spiritual, not political. I also love and respect the Jewish people, for they are the kinsmen of our Lord and God and Saviour Jesus Christ!

Br. Nathanial's fundamental World View is exactly the same one developed some 70 plus years ago by Adolf Hitler and the Nazi Party. In short, the World is run by an evil cabal of Jews. He has simply taken the same recipe and added current names and events to the mixture.

It's hard to imagine a political philosophy that has been more discredited. Just because an argument has internal logic does not mean it is true. The most insidious part of promoting such tripe is that it gets people looking in the wrong directions for political solutions. This was so destructive to the German People that it should give any serious person great pause before believing it. History forgotten is destined to be repeated and all that.

To then say that "Ordinary Jews" are fine folks but their Kinsman are responsible for the ills of the World is nonsense. Once again, it was the ordinary Jew who was slaughtered by people who bought into the exact same theories that Br. Nathaniel repeats today. "By their fruits you shall know them".. Nazi ideology and paranoid delusions about a Jewish Cabal nearly destroyed the World in my Parents generation. Extreme caution is advised if you find yourself starting to think Br. Nathaniel makes good sense. Cavet Emptor

^^^^ This is actually not entirely true. Hitler did not speak of the common Jews as he does. If you want to know where some of Hitler got his symbol, and occult works - ask the Theosophy person.

This is true. The part where Br. Nathanial blames an international Jewish Cabal for the ills of the World is the similar part.

All conspiratorial explanations of history and the workings of the World are always wrong...

Logged

Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

I am not endorsing Br. Nathanael's various presentations and messages. I don't have time to even go through them all, in large part because at my workplace it's not possible to access many sites, including Youtube and Facebook. (I use break time or sometimes time spent waiting for a call, to make responses on here.) I am alarmed by his rhetoric, in that I think a line should be drawn between virulently anti-Christian, anti-human, anti-God plutocrats who are often but not always Jewish (culturally Jewish), on the one hand, and on the other hand, ordinary men and women who happen to be Jewish. Of course, many public figures who have gained wide support in the U.S. (e.g.) often make the very same mistakes in expression, and people and the public give them a pass. So I sense a double standard there, and this makes my little indicator of "What's Fair" start whirring and flashing. But, no, I am not a proponent of Br. Nathanael's work, I'm rather agnostic regarding it.

That the world is run, in very large part, by a cabal of (non-religious / irreligious) Jewish interests, is something backed up by a preponderance of the evidence. It does rather seem to be "the elephant in the room." But I also fully respect the views of those who don't at all think so. They either have imbibed other data sets, or have arrived at conclusions through various reasonings and processes which I may not even understand. I don't think those who dissent from the satanic cabal paradigm are therefore less pious, or less good human beings. And I can always have gotten something wrong.

I would hope that the same tolerance would be found in all Orthodox Christians. I also believe that ultimate solutions are spiritual, not political. I also love and respect the Jewish people, for they are the kinsmen of our Lord and God and Saviour Jesus Christ!

I do endorse a lot of his videos, not all of them. I find them very fact based and well researched. People are all getting up tight because here is an EO monk speaking about real issues. They'd rather him be beat down by an abbot and reduced to sweeping floors. ("Know your place peasant!!!") People like weakling Christians, not ones strong enough to speak up, as our Savior did and encouraged us to mentor. I give a lot of props to him. I see strong faith in him. He's brave, I think he speaks well, and articulates his facts well. I have no idea why people want to see a wimpy monk ordered back to his cell. He's also a great mouthpiece to bring Jews to Christianity by his own testimony.

I'll write this for the 5th time or so: He is not an EO monk. He might be a monk of your Anabaptist religion, you can take him and make him even a bishop, but do not insult the Church that it allowed him to become a monk.

I am not endorsing Br. Nathanael's various presentations and messages. I don't have time to even go through them all, in large part because at my workplace it's not possible to access many sites, including Youtube and Facebook. (I use break time or sometimes time spent waiting for a call, to make responses on here.) I am alarmed by his rhetoric, in that I think a line should be drawn between virulently anti-Christian, anti-human, anti-God plutocrats who are often but not always Jewish (culturally Jewish), on the one hand, and on the other hand, ordinary men and women who happen to be Jewish. Of course, many public figures who have gained wide support in the U.S. (e.g.) often make the very same mistakes in expression, and people and the public give them a pass. So I sense a double standard there, and this makes my little indicator of "What's Fair" start whirring and flashing. But, no, I am not a proponent of Br. Nathanael's work, I'm rather agnostic regarding it.

That the world is run, in very large part, by a cabal of (non-religious / irreligious) Jewish interests, is something backed up by a preponderance of the evidence. It does rather seem to be "the elephant in the room." But I also fully respect the views of those who don't at all think so. They either have imbibed other data sets, or have arrived at conclusions through various reasonings and processes which I may not even understand. I don't think those who dissent from the satanic cabal paradigm are therefore less pious, or less good human beings. And I can always have gotten something wrong.

I would hope that the same tolerance would be found in all Orthodox Christians. I also believe that ultimate solutions are spiritual, not political. I also love and respect the Jewish people, for they are the kinsmen of our Lord and God and Saviour Jesus Christ!

I do endorse a lot of his videos, not all of them. I find them very fact based and well researched. People are all getting up tight because here is an EO monk speaking about real issues. They'd rather him be beat down by an abbot and reduced to sweeping floors. ("Know your place peasant!!!") People like weakling Christians, not ones strong enough to speak up, as our Savior did and encouraged us to mentor. I give a lot of props to him. I see strong faith in him. He's brave, I think he speaks well, and articulates his facts well. I have no idea why people want to see a wimpy monk ordered back to his cell. He's also a great mouthpiece to bring Jews to Christianity by his own testimony.

I'll write this for the 5th time or so: He is not an EO monk. He might be a monk of your Anabaptist religion, you can take him and make him even a bishop, but do not insult the Church that it allowed him to become a monk.

I am not sure how that would be an insult. Far worse have taken up the habit throughout the course of history.

Logged

Note : Many of my posts (especially the ones antedating late 2012) do not reflect charity, tact, or even views I presently hold. Please forgive me for any antagonism I have caused.

All conspiratorial explanations of history and the workings of the World are always wrong...

You are clearly a gullible person if you think that there has NEVER been any secret plots throughout history.

That's not what I said. Try to focus.

A conspiratorial explanation of the great events of history and/or as an explanation of the State of current affairs is always false.

The Lydon Larouche "Movement" is a great example of this. They put forward one conspiracy after another. A British Cabal. a Masonic Cabal, the Trilateral Commission.. Cabal. Etc. Br. Nataniel is cut from the same cloth.

Logged

Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

All conspiratorial explanations of history and the workings of the World are always wrong...

You are clearly a gullible person if you think that there has NEVER been any secret plots throughout history.

That's not what I said. Try to focus.

A conspiratorial explanation of the great events of history and/or as an explanation of the State of current affairs is always false.

The Lydon Larouche "Movement" is a great example of this. They put forward one conspiracy after another. A British Cabal. a Masonic Cabal, the Trilateral Commission.. Cabal. Etc. Br. Nataniel is cut from the same cloth.

I thought there were canons against impersonating clergy.

Logged

Quote from: GabrieltheCelt

If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.

Quote from: orthonorm

I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

It's above our pay grade to pass judgement on the spiritual state of the dear Brother. In general, Fools for Christ are good people, not hate filled bigots. If I had his ear, I would try to persuade him to submit to an exorcism.. maybe several

Logged

Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm