tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389581020645281312.post8395270107295952911..comments2012-10-20T13:52:23.417-07:00Comments on The Anon Party: Breaking into Politics: The Hydra.Testudo.Smithhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04166555719753099821noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389581020645281312.post-19156574021753834112011-07-14T13:13:14.554-07:002011-07-14T13:13:14.554-07:00@Aiguru
I understand, thanks. Your English is fi...@Aiguru <br /><br />I understand, thanks. Your English is fine. <br /><br />I waffled on quite a lot replying to your comment so I’m going to reply by actually making another blog post.Voshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03410872999688563511noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389581020645281312.post-21428695459000714252011-07-13T18:34:06.498-07:002011-07-13T18:34:06.498-07:00I think you correctly described the actual nature ...I think you correctly described the actual nature of Anonymous movement, saying it&#39;s something different from the organized, structured, on-the-binaries system we all live in. <br /><br />The big problem I see is in trying to modify the system from the inside because it means getting involved into existing and well known mechanisms and having to talk to the existing powers in their own language. And, IMHO, doing that means failing like all the other organizations that tried to change our corrupted system from the inside.<br /><br />You can&#39;t come into my house thinking you can change my laws. But you can attack my system from outside (i.e. cutting food supplies) forcing me to communicate in your language.<br /><br />I believe that the current action of &quot;attacking&quot; the system from the outside is working and should not be changed, at least not in this moment; it works simply because it&#39;s something that cannot be stopped using the &quot;inside&quot; laws (because it comes from outside, it&#39;s another logic, another world). I&#39;m not saying I agree with all the actions Anon groups have carried out. I&#39;m saying that, at this stage, it&#39;s working in getting the media and an increasing number of people involved in it.<br /><br />IMO tring to define the objective &quot;change the system&quot; is insane. What can be done now is something else: make sure to increase people interest and awareness on the global problem and continue fighting that. Today the target is called #antisec, tomorrow it will be #anticorruption and then #stopmakingyourowninterest. What the Internet people see as real problems and what they want to change must be understood. But it&#39;s not as simple as a poll.<br /><br />You say: &quot;inject the Anonymous way of doing things into politics&quot;. Nothing of this should happen and if it does happen it could be a fail. Anonymous speaks another language, has another idea, is based on another system, it doesn&#39;t speak or understand politics and I don&#39;t think it has any intention of learning how to (and, more important, it shouldn&#39;t).<br /><br />If Anonymous continues to grow and gets to count, lets say, 10 million followers (measuring Twitter for simplicity sake?) then it has sense to get into next phase and start coordinating mass actions for big results.<br /><br />I think that trying to define the party objectives today is too early.<br /><br />The actual system can be changed only if millions of people want to, and I&#39;m sure you&#39;re thinking ahead of this. But there millions haven&#39;t been counted, yet, nor they have expressed themselves on what they want. After all aren&#39;t we talking about &quot;power to the people&quot;? Do we know what people really want? If we don&#39;t it&#39;s impossibile to define the basics of a party, then.<br /><br />I don&#39;t believe in extremism but I do believe that people must choose. We must get rid of the various Bush, Blair and Mickey Mouse who move the whole world basing decisions that touch all of us and for their own interest.<br /><br />(Sorry for my terrible english, hope I expressed the concepts clearly).aigurunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389581020645281312.post-58293843976726211162011-07-13T13:31:28.485-07:002011-07-13T13:31:28.485-07:00@Master
Thanks.
@Bas
Good questions.
The &#39...@Master <br /><br />Thanks.<br /><br />@Bas<br /><br />Good questions.<br /><br />The &#39;we&#39; will be anyone that signs up with an account and logs in. Potentially you and your mates and their mates mates+. Basically, its the internet, so there isn&#39;t really any elite at all, unless everyone of us on Earth is l33t.<br /><br />The test you refer too will hopefully be the Anon Party itself. Each one will be a separate entity for each political system that more or less organizes its self and they will almost universally start small and scale up over time. Picture a black smudge between the reds, blues and yellows slowly getting bigger. Anonymous is also already a functioning example of something similar and its global. Hopefully any organization we set up in future will also be based on this &#39;net&#39; type of thinking. Just because something hasn&#39;t been tried yet on the material plain doesn&#39;t mean its not worth a go. I can&#39;t see Anons setting up secret gulags because of this. So this isn&#39;t dangerous thinking. You cant exactly say the current test being ran by the elite is turning out all that well either. I mean, look at the place.<br /><br />@Bulb <br /><br />Thanks.<br /><br />I don&#39;t know just yet, I&#39;m sure we&#39;ll work on that if the rest of the Anons on here agree with this. My best guess is the party will design and build a website structure that works and then proliferate that between people who want to set up an anon party in in their democratic nations. They can then alter it to suit their constituencies and political structure.<br /><br />I would like to see some sort of &#39;United Anonymous Nations&#39; website set up as well so that the separate parties from each nation can also communicate and reach a consensus. Picture two nations at war and the Anons from the party in each nation telling each other they both think the war and the government in power on each side are bullshit. I think that would be a powerful way to help unite people.<br /><br /><br /><br />This is just all discussion but like you and Master say its going to be a long process that&#39;s absolutely vital.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03410872999688563511noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389581020645281312.post-31483979100141470722011-07-13T12:01:13.668-07:002011-07-13T12:01:13.668-07:00An incredibly well thought out and interesting pos...An incredibly well thought out and interesting post. I think there could be great potential in the system you&#39;ve outlined here, but the question remains. How can we build and implement it? Where do we begin?<br /><br />Cheers,<br />A-BulbaA-Bulbahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12340229123445740588noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389581020645281312.post-82879891648530335222011-07-13T11:48:37.111-07:002011-07-13T11:48:37.111-07:00John,
So far, of course, an Internet participator...John,<br /><br />So far, of course, an Internet participatory anonymous &#39;system&#39; is just theory at the scale you are talking about. Whether it can be implemented in a meaningful way (ie carried out in practice with results that the theory predicts) can only be determined by experiments that can be scaled up without contradicting the precepts of the theory. Marx produced a theory of unfettered capitalism that has proven to be essentially correct and highly predictive, but no experiments, beyond a small-scale (e.g. kibbutz), have EVER implemented that part of Marx&#39;s theory that suggests a scalable solution to MegaCorporeal Maladies that haven&#39;t rapidly lead to authoritarian/dictatorial elitism. The compromise of the &#39;mixed economy&#39; (limited government control or regulation or protection of public utilities and commons while tolerating limited, regulated proprietary markets) has mixed results, to say the least.<br /><br />Who will be the WE of an AnonParty approach? Another Elite with unlimited power to be inevitably abused because absolute power corrupts absolutely? Or will the transition to massive and full participation be magically an instantaneous curve of justice, before the corrupted Elite can once again fix the &#39;System?<br /><br />Best regards,<br />MonkeeRenchBasilideshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18158753754107352662noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389581020645281312.post-9878313502666186832011-07-13T11:29:01.715-07:002011-07-13T11:29:01.715-07:00A masterful post. I couldn&#39;t have explained it...A masterful post. I couldn&#39;t have explained it any better. :)Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10134362351609900057noreply@blogger.com