Yes, but it wasen't just deers leap. i looked through my friends book and it seemed like a lot of the places that i knew well he must have goten his beta from phone conversations instead of actually climbing there. I guess i just don't agree with that style of makeing a buck. I much prefer Peter Lewis book for a general north east book. You get the feel that he has actually done the climbs that he talks about.

Hey everyone, I'm looking at taking a trip next summer, and I'm trying to work out the logistics and see just how feasible this all is. I've never really gone on any over night climbing trips besides a 2 nighter at Pilot Mountain in NC, and I now have been given an opportunity to go from NC to NH in either June or July, climbing all along the way. We're looking at taking about 2-3 weeks, and climbing, starting at Linville, then hitting up the New, Seneca, DWG, The Gunks, and finishing out with some NH big wall stuff. Due to the amount of driving we'll be doing and our own personal skill levels, we really arent looking at doing anything more than a 5.8, but instead just getting out and seeing the country, so casual, easy-moderate multi-pitch trad stuff is preferred. All 3 guys going are capable of leading and we can do pretty much the majority of 5.8's and are willing to do a 5.9 pitch if necessary.

The question that has come up with thinking of where all to go, is not the location, but the routes. We're looking at going next summer, so we've definitely got some time to figure things out, but, since we're already talking about it, I'm getting excited, and thought I'd see what the RC.comers have to say about the routes between here and there. I'm willing to put up for the guidebooks to all the places, as I'm sure I will be revisiting each of them. We're mainly looking at multi-pitch trad, and could care less about sport. So, to the regulars of the New, Seneca, DWG, the Gunks, and NH.... what are some of your favorite easy-moderates?

I have looked at each place thoroughly, and I'm having the most trouble with Seneca and NH specifically. There's plenty of info on the Gunks, and we arent having too much trouble picking routes at DWG (at least not that I know of, but then again, that is the point of this post) I understand that right now, I dont really need to be concerned with routes, but it definitely helps fuel the excitement, when I can look at a route, and say to myself, "I'll be on that next summer" ya know?

Also, what are the good guidebooks to invest in for each area, and what's the camping like? Addresses would be the most helpful, so we can plan out driving times and distances, but phone numbers work too.

Any and all help/advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Chris

Chris...3 weeks on a climbing vacay...I'm jealous. I don't want to sound like a know-it-all, but I'll give you my advice.

I see you are already in NC. Nice climbing there, but you already live there. You can do any route in the state on any given weekend. Hit the road.

The gunks are really fun. They have (to me) kind of a "single-pitch cragging" feel to them, even though many routes are full-length. There are years worth of quality routes to pick from.

IMO, you'd be making a mistake to not go to the Adirondacks. (watch the weather). Similar in size and scale of climbing possiblities to NH, with a less "famous" history, but still an interesting one. Go to pok-o-moonshine, similar in size to cathedral ledge, and do "Gamesmanship" a sweet 4 pitch 5.8. The Diagonal on Wallface will give you a wildernessy kind of route, with some adventurous routefinding, at the same grade. Hesitation on the Washbowl Cliff. Chapel Pond slab. Quadrophenia on Hurricane crag.

You will not likely have to wait in line here, like you will for the Gunks classics, and maybe even in NH.

Quite a bit of free camping. Not a real central "scene" here, like the Uberfall at the gunks, but you'll see other climbers around, especially in the Chapel Pond area.

Tremendous new guidebook. "adirondack rock"...one of the most studious efforts at a big guidebook I've ever seen, with a well-research history, gps coordinates, and good "beta" on the area.

If you are in the daks before august 1st you MUST check the bird closures on the states website. they are absolutly Psyco with the effin bird closures over there. They close whole cliffs and large sections of Poco. additionaly if you are looking for 5.8 @ poco you Will wait in line.

2 of the best 5.8 in the daks are on washbowl. Overture and Hessitation. Washbowl is often closed for birds. Nh is awsome with their bird closures. They work with the climbers instead of against them.

I agree with Nick on this one. He spent very little effort researching a little local crag, Crow Hill, and botched the result. The specific guides are best but even what you can get off the Web is better.

Thanks so much for the overwhelming response everybody. I'm slowly starting to see what could get done next summer during this trip, and it's getting me excited. Does anyone have any info on the Delaware Water Gap? Specifically Mount Tammany and Mount Minsi? I'm mainly thinking of swinging through there on the way between Seneca and the Gunks. After talking to my friends, we're probably going to skip the New, but still go by Seneca for a day or 2, and would like to have a good place to stop before hitting the Gunks. Is DWG worth stopping by? Or is there another place in PA that would be better for easy-moderate multi-pitch?

I don't know anything about climbing in the Delaware Water Gap, but the Appalachian Mountain Club does have a facility there. I believe it is called Camp Mohican, but it's on the website (outdoors.org).

Pros -You may be the only people there. No parking problems, no waiting in line, no entrance fees, nobody dropping rocks/gear/cameras/bottles/trees on you, no barking dogs, no radios, no chalked holds, no sign that anyone has ever climbed the route before you. No asking the guy beside you for beta, nobody offering beta. Nobody asking what route you are on, nobody for you to ask what route they are on. Nobody rapping down on your head, or climbing up your ass.

Stashing drinks in the cold air cave! Great idea, although I tend to avoid the water gap in the summer.

To the OP, the water gap is great, for all the reasons mentioned above, and as a matter of fact, I stopped going to the gunks (3 hr drive) and now just go the the water gap for multipitch (30 min drive). That said, I think you should pass it by, and keep heading north. The approach is hellish in the summer (full sun, steep relentless talus, poison ivy).

I think you should spend as much time as possible in the adirondacks and new hampshire. The temps will be much cooler up there, as long as the blackflies aren't too bad. If they are bad, the gunks provides some relief usually. Definitely check out Mount Willard in NH (climb "Across the universe"to avoid crowds in North Conway, it's barely a .10 and super fun).

If you were looking for a place to crash in PA, I can hook you up. There's also a super good single-pitch trad crag 5 mins from my house, if you want a change from the multipitch routine. Tons of good steep crack climbs there.

I've climbed extensively throughout New England with Green's book and have nothing to complain about, are you just upset that he included some of Vermont's "secret" crags as well as that gem called Owl's Head in New Hampshire? DL

In reply to:

The Vt. Crags he included are by no means secret. What got me worked up about it is that the information about them he provided is either out and out wrong (take the Smugglers' Notch section for example), or blatantly plagerized from other sources (Lower West Bolton, for one).

according to Stewert green the locals don't like you useing chalk @ deer leap?? that tells me that he talked to the owner of a local outdoor shop on the phone who has not climbed in 25 years and when he did climb he was a top roper. I deduce this because he is the only person who ever told me you couldn't use chalk there.. anywaysthe no chalk thing is absurd and the beta goes downhill from there... Why bother writeing about an area if you are going to do such a shabby job of it.

There are a lot of great suggestions on this thread. Though on the east coast, Cannon is where its at. Huntington Ravine also has some pretty sick climbing. Oh, and if you are coming through PA, don't waste your time stopping, blast right through and have more time at a much better spot.

I've climbed extensively throughout New England with Green's book and have nothing to complain about, are you just upset that he included some of Vermont's "secret" crags as well as that gem called Owl's Head in New Hampshire?

Sure, one can buy a number of locally specific books that are better, but the cost will rise. After getting Butterfield's Acadia, Handren's Cathedral & Whitehorse, Webster's New Hampshire, that bad Falcon book on Connecticut, and maybe Smith's Rumney guide you've spent way more than the $35 charged for Rock Climbing New England.

DL

In reply to:

Yeah, you may be poorer, but at least you'll make it to the crag. The book is full of mistakes. I find it hard to believe that you have used it extensively and have not found one.

C'mon, it's not difficult to find cliffs in New England - it's not like they're far away or anything. When I think about it, the only time the aforementioned text steered me wrong was my first trip to Ragged Mountain. The author, Mr. Greene, had me park at a golf course and walk 30 minutes through suburban streets and yards to get to the cliff. I understand that at the time of publication there were concerns about parking and access at this crag that have since been corrected. Still, I used to book to climb at Cathedral, Cannon, Whitehorse, Sundown, Rumney, Crawford Notch, Acadia, Ragged, East Peak, Rose Ledge, Crow Hill, Rattlesnake Gutter, and more. My experience with this book makes me believe that it is a valuable, convenient, and readily available resource for visiting climbers.