I never understood how adding a few signs to an old ball park "radically alters the look of the neighborhood", but adding rows upon rows of aluminum bleachers to the top of old apartment buildings somehow retains neighborhood charm.

Sin_City_Superhero:Even if you ignore the "historical landmark" aspect, the Cubs really can't replace Wrigley. The Cubs suck. The Cubs have sucked for a very long time. People don't go to Cubs games to watch the Cubs. People go to Cubs games because Wrigley Field is a destination. If the Cubs played in a brand new stadium, they might get big crowds for a few years, but once the new-car-smell wore off, they would either have to put a more competitive product on the field, or they'd lose all of their fans. As it is right now, the Cubs don't even have to try to win, and they sell out.

you have a few good points - but attendance is noticeably down. I think it's the lowest it's been in 10+ years.

There are 2 types of fans that go to Wrigley - Cubs fans and Wrigley Fans. Wrigley Fans are the ones that go to the games and get smashed and don't realize that there is a baseball game going on. They go to the ballpark and treat it as a giant open air bar with, to them, a long slow game taking place in front of them. Cubs Fans usually know who's pitching that day even if he's making his major league debut. Cubs fans are the people with cubs scarfs, gloves, and hats (cause you need them in those early April games) that are scoring the ballgame because they love their team. Cubs fans know that you would pitch down and away to Alfonso Soriano if you wanted him to strike out. Wrigley Fans boo him when he strikes out with 2 men on and 2 out down a run. Cubs fans would prefer a foul ball off of Darwin Barney's bat. Wrigley Fans would prefer the hot girls phone number from a section over.

The difference between them is clear as day (or night 35 times a year this year) and it's the Wrigley Fans that give the Cubs Fans a bad name. So when you see a drunk 22 year old get hit in the head with a foul ball because he was trying to get a girls phone number and you see a 40 year old who gets the ball and is the happiest guy in the world because it's his first foul ball he's ever gotten at Wrigley...you'll know which is which.

Gosling:I don't give a damn what the legal tiff between the team and the rooftop owners is, this still strikes me as Philadelphia Athletics spite-fence horseshiat. If Ricketts is getting broken by the money he's not getting from the rooftops, then he's in dire enough financial straits that he shouldn't have bought the damn team in the first place.

They were fine with people watching. But once you start building damn stands and charging admission, then advertising for "your" product publicly? Oh, just go f*ck yourself already.

/not a fan of any of this//think it's cool to have some places where people can get really crappy seats for free///the problem is that someone always wants to monetize it and ruin things for everyone

The cubs farked up when they signed the deal with the rooftops. Had they always maintained the rooftop viewing was unofficial, they would not be in a legal battle now and could put up whatever they want in their building (aside from landmarking issues). Because they smelled money, they made a deal to make that seating part of the Cubs experience, and taking away the view (that was paid for by the owners) while that contract is still in effect is shiatty.

Lost Thought 00:Milk D: Lost Thought 00: I'm sure their shareholders would not be pleased with that.

tell me more about Cubs "shareholders".

The team is 95% owned by a trust, with Tom Rickets acting as chairman of the board, though I cannot find how that 95% is shared amongst the 4 Rickets family members who collectively own the trust. I cannot find exactly who owns the remaining 5%. All those people are collectively known as the shareholders of the team

The deep roots of the disputes of this are really kind of ridiculous. Million dollar property owners painting themselves as poor oppressed sports fans, as well as a team painting itself as needing signage when it is sitting on top of MLB megabuck TV deal money ... both sides can go suck sh*t as far as I'm concerned.

The Cubs keep sucking is the only fact in this that remains true to an outsider.