So for those of you who don't know I was a carnivore a little over a month ago and have been a vegetarian since then (check my introduction thread for more info). The reason I haven't transitioned into full out veganism is because of personal circumstances and also because I find that it's generally difficult to buy vegan in commercial supermarkets. And very importantly I want to cut and am afraid I'd be missing out on essential macro nutrients if I went all green with my current green options.

But I've been dodging both my cut season and the vegan transition for way too long and am now ready - or rather forced- to take the leap into both a healthier and greener diet if I am to make some serious progress. For this I need a fixed and nicely structured but healthy diet that'll make eating habits and subsequently my life easier. I already have a tailor made cut diet. Please download and check it at http://www.fileconvoy.com/dfl.php?id=g8 ... 9c56292c46 in order to replace the concrete carnivore nutrients and supplements with vegan alternatives. I like this diet and just need a vegan version of it, which is where all you wonderful herbivores come in. Please veganise this for me, so I can join the vegan front-line ranks :-p

I can't read the file unfortunately. What fruit and vegetables are you limited to? I have to say I'm a little confused by the breakdown. 2000 calories is high for a cutting diet, especially for a woman. 175g of protein is very high, and I'd say unnecessarily so, again, especially for a woman. Also 50g of fat, in a cutting diet, seems unnecessary.

It's an Excell file I know the ratios seem extreme, but bear in mind I weigh 85 kg and lift heavy, so the 2 grams of protein pr bodyweight as a rule of thumb isn't completely unreasonable. Just to give you a picture I need 3500-4000 kcal to maintain my current form, training and muscle-mass, so a 2000 kcal is a actually somewhat of a drastic cut. but I'm just fed up with being "bulky muscular" and want some lean definition for a try, preferrably within the next 3 or 4 months- which should be entirely possible with a 2000 kcal a day intake. The carnivore supplements/food items I want replaced are Tuna, Macherel, lean poultry and milk with equally low in calorie vegan alternatives with similar protein profiles. I'm a novice to cutting (for more than a week anyway - yes I've been a perma bulker for a year now), so I'm susceptible to other cut diets as long as they stay within 2000 kcal a day and my macros are in sync with the level of heavy lifting I do. I say this because I become lethargic rather quickly when I'm cutting. The last few times I tried, my strength decreased by up to 40 % and this was a weeks cutting max, which just goes to show you the amount of calories I need to maintain my training. But I figure if my macros are in sync then hopefully that problem can be avoided

Protein powders if you need extra protein... Sunwarrior, vega, etc..Tempeh(fermented tofu)Tofu if you can handle it. Legumes if your intestine can handle them.Vegetables.Leafy greens.. salads. Rich in vitamins and minerals.Nuts... walnuts, etc.. Rich in essential fats.Fruit. - Fruit doesn't make you fat and no need to be afraid of it.

The lack of muscle definition is just excess cholesterol(from the animal products) in the cell membranes.

Vegan Aspirant, your joints don't get inflammed from eating rice?

Last edited by lepiante on Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

@Compassion: The only reason I used the word "carnivore" is because I am not "omni(all)vore(eating)" and never were, even before I became vegetarian. I would eat meat, but not all kinds and steered away from weird looking see food. But I guess the word "carnivore" is a bit misleading because I didn't live solely on meat, but I wouldn't eat all kinds of meat either.

@lepiante: The problem I have with vegan alternatives that are rich in protein (legumes such as soy, chickpeas, kidney beans etc) is that they are also rich in carbs which means I'll take in 3-4 times the amount of over all calories per 100 gram to get the protein I would receive from 100 grams of chicken breast fillet. I know there's vegan protein powder, but I don't want to be surviving on that in order to keep my calorie intake down. I like food-I like to chew and protein powder gets old really quick and I generally don't like to "drink" my meals and will typically only do it after work out.

As for inflamed joints, I don't know to be honest. I just know that legumes don't exactly do wonders for my stomach, which is quite problematic in terms of getting enough protein. But rice, bulgur and home-made bread ("naan" to be specific) are mandatory side-dishes in my homeland culture, so I've been eating it all my life. I'm the type of person who'll walk around with all kinds of bodily nuisances and will only do something when shit hits the fan and I either can't walk, scratch myself to a full-blown staff infection and have to receive hospital treatment or until my intestines (literally) are about to blow. So I can't really give you a qualified answer but I think I might be allergic to quite a few food items (deep fried food- whatever it is- kills my stomach and trans fatty acids in general will f* up my intestines).

Thanks for the suggestions though, will definitely be looking through the other suggestions

My advice is to look at foods in combinations, rather than looking at a single food to give you 1 nutrient. Foods are going to give you more than one nutrient, and you can balance them together in a meal plan, to give you what you want. No matter what the food source is, it's going to have carbs, fat and protein in it. You won't find something which is super high in protein, and then have trace fat and trace carbs, apart from processed foods like protein powders. So if you're not prepared to have them, then you need to look at food in terms of multiple nutrients.

I'd also say that carbs in themselves are not something to be too worried about. You need carbs to be able to do anything, and so long as you're active they shouldn't hold you back, especially when they are in the form of fruit and vegetables. Obviously, you need to watch out for processed sugar, and grains.

@Richard: Yeah I know I the singular approach sucks on a vegam diet and am fully prepared to eat varied. Had just hoped there were a list of vegetables that were high in protein and low in carbs. My fat intake is relatively little, but can't really say the same for my carb intake. Normally I don't have an issue with carbs, it's just that I want to get leaner (even though this means I'll become smaller) and the only real hindrance is my carb intake, so this is where I need to make the adjustment.

Yup. The human body doesn't waste resources. Excesscholesterol is stored in adipose tissue, cell membranes and, subcutaneous fat where it then is converted to 7-Dehydrocholesterol for Vitamin D production or retroconverted back to cholesterol. A thing about cholesterol is that its production is regulated by Vitamin D; so low levels of Vitamin D will lead to low levels of cholesterol in the body, which isn't a good thing because it will then lead to low levels of androgen hormones. Something to watch out for.

A thing about plant based diets is that there is a huge difference about how the body works when eating only plants and when eating animal products. When we eat only plants.. we have to produce all the important nutrients that are found in the animal products.. all the nutrients that those animals produced themselves and eating animal products is basically taking the lazy way out.

I'd also say that carbs in themselves are not something to be too worried about. You need carbs to be able to do anything, and so long as you're active they shouldn't hold you back, especially when they are in the form of fruit and vegetables. Obviously, you need to watch out for processed sugar, and grains.

+1 especially about the processed crap and grains. carb phobia doesn't apply when we eat a clean plant-based diet.

I want a mountain of ripe apricots now and they aren't even in season!

Many of the sources of protein for vegans are high in carbs.. or else they are high in fat.

Remember tho, that many of those foods high in carbs are also high in fiber. Much of that fiber is not digestible! - it just passes on through. While it's going through... it picks up cholesterols and estrogen and clears it out. That is why there is less heart disease and less breast cancer (for women) in the vegan population. Fiber also will make you feel full for some time. So don't think of all carbs as bad. We all just really need to steer away from processed carbs that have been stripped of all their beneficial nutrients and fiber - white rice, white pasta, white bread, white flour, crackers, cereals etc.

I had an awesome layered dip today - home made refried beans (with jalepeno and garlic), quinoa, salsa, & chopped tomatoes. (had to skip avocado, cuz the one I have is not ripe yet). Yup lots of carbs... but I don't feel guilty and I will probably feel full for some time. I'm here by myself, so I have no problem eating that dip with a spoon instead of tortilla chips. And if I did want chips with it, I might just crumble some on as a top layer... I'd eat less of them that way. Gotta be creative. lol.

If it's important to you, you'll find a way. If it isn't, you'll find an excuse.

Just thought of this... if you are okay with gluten, then seitan is good (made from a flour product called vital wheat gluten). It is somewhat processed, so I'd consume it in moderation.

The first time I made it, it turned out awful and gluey, but I tried a different recipe that worked well. They freeze well - I freeze them in tinfoil in packs of 2 (ie. I use 2 for a meal). These cutlets go well with mashed cauliflower (prepped like mashed potatoes - I add sauteed garlic, onion powder, bit of vegan butter, s&p) and asparagus or green beans. Very low carb meal.

Apparently seitan has 3 grams of carbs vs 18 grams of protein. The recipe I linked to has chick peas.. so that may skew the nutritional profile a bit.

If it's important to you, you'll find a way. If it isn't, you'll find an excuse.