An economy not running at its peak is a far cry from a “death spiral.” We do need to make an entry path for our youth. Investing our all money in canned goods will not help.

Based upon your track record, you “imminent collapsers” are just plain silly.

All I know it isn't the economy like we had in 1950-1970's, as most of those years, a family could rely on a male breadwinner's salary alone.

I've pointed this out in other places:

U.S. tax policies quite specifically create a disincentive for making children. First, married people are taxed more – it's called the “marriage penalty.” Second, the tax exemption for children has failed to keep up with the rate of inflation. Right now it is less than $4,000 per child, when, to even keep pace with what it was in 1950, it would have to be $12,000. This, combined with welfare, biases reproduction in favor of our least productive societal members. Additionally, our wages haven't kept up with inflation, as we would have to earn an average of over $160K per year in order to have the same standard of living as 1973, which was the last year wages kept up with inflation.

Obamacare is making everything worse - as healthcare premiums have jumped significantly for lot less coverage.

Here's a very telling graph:

In any case, Roman Empire didn't collapse overnight.

__________________

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Individuals, businesses/corporations, governments at all levels, MUST borrow from banks in order to get money created.Byron Dale

"Money is created when loans are issued and debts incurred; money is extinguished when loans are re-paid."John B Henderson

Money that one uses to pay interest on a loan has been created somewhere else in the economy by another loan.John M Yetter

"Our national circulating medium [i.e. dollars] is at the mercy of loan transactions of banks, which lend, not money, but promises to supply money they do not possess."Irving Fisher

In some respects, I wish we could go back to those days where the man goes off to work and earns the money, and the woman stays home; no wonder why the family unit is breaking down, mothers are forced to go back to work as soon as they have the baby and who is left to raise them? In any case, I tend to agree that it will collapse, only a matter of time. I think it will happen in my lifetime, and likely as I'm only 27..

Quote:

Originally Posted by vikingcelt

All I know it isn't the economy like we had in 1950-1970's, as most of those years, a family could rely on a male breadwinner's salary alone.

I've pointed this out in other places:

U.S. tax policies quite specifically create a disincentive for making children. First, married people are taxed more – it's called the “marriage penalty.” Second, the tax exemption for children has failed to keep up with the rate of inflation. Right now it is less than $4,000 per child, when, to even keep pace with what it was in 1950, it would have to be $12,000. This, combined with welfare, biases reproduction in favor of our least productive societal members. Additionally, our wages haven't kept up with inflation, as we would have to earn an average of over $160K per year in order to have the same standard of living as 1973, which was the last year wages kept up with inflation.

Obamacare is making everything worse - as healthcare premiums have jumped significantly for lot less coverage.

An economy not running at its peak is a far cry from a “death spiral.” We do need to make an entry path for our youth. Investing our all money in canned goods will not help.

Based upon your track record, you “imminent collapsers” are just plain silly.

You've respond by presenting his argument as more extreme than it was. The poster you quote said "robust future". Non robust future does not equal imminent collapse. Considering the scale of unemployed Americans, how the majority of the middle class are becoming worse off, how dependent the economy is on consumerism, the lower quality of the workforce coming through, high government debt and so on it does not appear as "robust" as decades prior.

It is certainly a lot easier to be negative than be positive. If you know how to work your investment options then in fact the down time can be the best to purchase investments. However just because you are doing well does not mean that others are.

The poster IS the creator and primary poster of the "Economy in a DEATH spiral" thread. Five years and counting for that hummer.

As Don Black ofter alludes to, be careful what you post, someone may believe it.

And I stand by my point that you are deliberately exaggerating his view as his posts raise valid points about employers cutting jobs, the drivers of the American economy becoming poorer and very high unemployment.

Your view stems from your own financial situation and not the economic situation. 'I'm doing great on my investments so the economy is fine and your points are insignificant...'. It's about the economy and communicating what is going on not your own bank balance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ex-Detroiter

If you started with that post and read all the way down here, you can see that we have had an interesting discussion during these past few months.

I suppose that “good” is a relative term. It’s been good for me and many of the folks I know. Things that were considered luxuries then are now considered necessities (air conditioning, TV, long distance phone service, etc.).

As you may have gathered my main purpose here is to stop the stampede of some White folks from the pursuit of wealth just because they think the system may not be as fair as it was. It may not be as fair, but doesn’t mean that you can’t achieve wealth. We can make it “fair” later on.

Your self decided purpose and your actions have become confused. No one is saying the pursuit of financial well being is futile. You speak of "fair" like people are throwing their toys out the pram and getting emotional, hence 'stampede' like they are irrational. The means to a good quality of life cannot be gained by the same ways it was possible pre-2007. There are many out there struggling to get by; not because they can't pay for phone services or air conditioning but because they do not have the money to pay their mortgage/rent and rely on food stamps. When the ordinary folk are becoming worse off you have to take that into account when making investment opportunities and not rejecting such information because it does not follow your own situation.

People are bringing up various points including that the economic basis for America is in a gradual decline for many of the reasons stated. Is the economic future for young White Males in America better than it was 10 years ago? Is it better for any individual American, White or Non-White? It is not so why attack other people who bring that up?

People are bringing up various points including that the economic basis for America is in a gradual decline for many of the reasons stated. Is the economic future for young White Males in America better than it was 10 years ago? Is it better for any individual American, White or Non-White? It is not so why attack other people who bring that up?

I’m afraid you see this as a binary issue: all bad or all good. Just because it is not as good as it was, does not make a death spiral. I’ve acknowledge thoughout that some folks are suffering. That should not mean that we all should give up trying.

There are still many opportunities within this economy. Running away and giving up, which has been a recurrent theme in the “other” thread, is not an acceptable theme here.

I’m afraid you see this as a binary issue: all bad or all good. Just because it is not as good as it was, does not make a death spiral. I’ve acknowledge thoughout that some folks are suffering. That should not mean that we all should give up trying.

There are still many opportunities within this economy. Running away and giving up, which has been a recurrent theme in the “other” thread, is not an acceptable theme here.

Who runs this economy? I have no problem with someone who invests in this market however, one should not lose sight of the banksters ripping the mainstreet white family off...Too many young whites unemployed so,it pays to be humble while pressing that buy and sell button.

Agreed. Tis only a matter of time. And it will happen in my lifetimr, esp considering I'm 27 lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by vikingcelt

All I know it isn't the economy like we had in 1950-1970's, as most of those years, a family could rely on a male breadwinner's salary alone.

I've pointed this out in other places:

U.S. tax policies quite specifically create a disincentive for making children. First, married people are taxed more – it's called the “marriage penalty.” Second, the tax exemption for children has failed to keep up with the rate of inflation. Right now it is less than $4,000 per child, when, to even keep pace with what it was in 1950, it would have to be $12,000. This, combined with welfare, biases reproduction in favor of our least productive societal members. Additionally, our wages haven't kept up with inflation, as we would have to earn an average of over $160K per year in order to have the same standard of living as 1973, which was the last year wages kept up with inflation.

Obamacare is making everything worse - as healthcare premiums have jumped significantly for lot less coverage.

Who runs this economy? I have no problem with someone who invests in this market however, one should not lose sight of the banksters ripping the mainstreet white family off...Too many young whites unemployed so,it pays to be humble while pressing that buy and sell button.

All I know it isn't the economy like we had in 1950-1970's, as most of those years, a family could rely on a male breadwinner's salary alone.

I've pointed this out in other places:

U.S. tax policies quite specifically create a disincentive for making children. First, married people are taxed more – it's called the “marriage penalty.” Second, the tax exemption for children has failed to keep up with the rate of inflation. Right now it is less than $4,000 per child, when, to even keep pace with what it was in 1950, it would have to be $12,000. This, combined with welfare, biases reproduction in favor of our least productive societal members. Additionally, our wages haven't kept up with inflation, as we would have to earn an average of over $160K per year in order to have the same standard of living as 1973, which was the last year wages kept up with inflation.

Obamacare is making everything worse - as healthcare premiums have jumped significantly for lot less coverage.

Here's a very telling graph:

In any case, Roman Empire didn't collapse overnight.

The blue line is going up again. Todays increase in jobless claims was blamed on planned layoffs.