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update: we’re open to criticism and disagreement. but we can’t accept insults and agressivity. so we’re removing inappropriate comments and moderating the post. You can express whatever you want but be respectful.

2 days ago Amazon announced the Kindle Fire: a new reader with apps. We followed the announcement on Twitter, but this is only a few moments later that we were surprised to discover the Kindle Fire logo.

Yes, it looks exactly like our own logo *appsfire*. See below. Judge by yourself.

So, ok. We’re a small startup with “only” 3 million users and some PR coverage all around the world. But we still feel that something is wrong there. From the font type to the colour code and even clear/dark backrground combination..

Believe us… we really don’t have the time to mess around with minor issues -we’re too busy right now- but we love our logo and we want it to be unique enough.

We do not have the same *fire*power as Amazon (pun intended), but we did make sure not to infringe on anyone’s property when we designed our logo

We re not the first service called XXXFire. MediaFire and others where there before us, andmanyafter. The probability to have a logo so resembling in a related space is so small…And obviously Kindle does not need our logo to be a successful product.

At this point we don’t know how this could have happened. Chance? Did we upset Amazon with our post on their Appstore? We’re planning to reach out to Amazon to hear what they have to say about it [unless they reach out before]….and we’ll let you know what else we find out.

Let us know in comments your thought. And if you don’t believe us download our apps to verify…

The font is the same as kindle branding’s original font,
the orange used resembles (shock horror) fire – to my mind although bioth fonts are orange yours is definitely a darker shade than amazons,
the backgrounds white and grey.. are you serious?

http://ouriel.typepad.com OurielOhayon

So Sarah you re admitting both logos look alike. Thanks

geg

You’re going to look back at today in embarrassment, you should close down the comment section before you jam your feet any further down your throat.

http://ouriel.typepad.com OurielOhayon

The only thing we would regret is having to shut up and swallow this up. Thanks for taking the time to
Help us

Wow guys, I have no idea what you do but the douchebaggery of your official corporate responses and twisting of words will ensure that I never bother to determine it! Excellent work! Pro-tip: Hire a PR department and do not allow anyone else to participate in your publicly facing websites. BTW, the designs are only similar in that they say fire. Not even any stupid reflection going on or the same colors/weight/kerning etcetera.

http://ouriel.typepad.com OurielOhayon

Thanks for the positive contribution.

Annoyed Guy

Cry some more. Please. It makes you look so professional. Are you going to lawyer up on this or just whine to the internet?

http://ouriel.typepad.com OurielOhayon

Well you ll understand that we wont be sharing our private thoughts with brave anonymous spammers. Right ?

Annoyed Guy

I’m not spamming. You guys are the ones who are spamming your application on the pretense that somehow Amazon has stolen your logo. I’m replying to you to tell you how stupid that is. It’s not spam. I don’t even have anything to sell.

http://ouriel.typepad.com OurielOhayon

Oops..

Appsfire

I’M SELLING A CLUE, LIMITED TIME SPECIAL, WHILE SUPPLIES LAST, BUY NOW

Spam Go Away

looks to me like a vague similarity, certainly nothing litigous. however, the attempt to grab some publicity on your part is fairly shrewd.

You are retarded. The fonts are different, the colors are different, and having two toned text logos has been going on for centuries before your company existed. You are either willfully ignorant or a colossal douchbag. You should have probably spent the time posting this horse shit on teaching your graphic designer how to compress a .jpg properly.

lol this is embarrassing. Guess you’re company is struggling for attention. Better luck next time

http://piyusharyan.com/ Piyush Aryan

I don’t see any similarity except for the word fire here.. your logo has ‘appsfire’ as one word.. ‘kindle fire’ are two words.. the ‘i’ in your fire (pun intended) has blocks around it.. i don’t see any in kindle fire.. it’s written in plain font.. and they have been using this color for a long time.. http://www.puremobile.com/insiderblog/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/kindle-logo.png

So the question here is.. what are you so pissed off about? I think u have lot of free time these days.. why not focus this energy to come up with a new product idea?

Shows your true colors

Hahahahahaha, give me a BREAK. I’m sorry but this is just pathetic. Fire is orange, who knew???

I think it is funny that the only reason there are so many comments is because of Techcrunch and how bad of a case you have for logo copying. I was reading through the comments laughing. To make matters worse for this company, the co-founder keeps digging himself a deeper hole, making his naive accusation look even dumber. There is only slight resemblance between the logos. Not the same font. Not the same colors. “fire” and the lack of capitalization are the only similarities.

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

Yes..it is funny…

guest

ooh another thoughtful well written reply! keep up the good work

http://www.le-dernier-bon-samaritain.fr Charles Liebert

Are you F*cking kidding Ouriel ?

That’s one of the worst PR stunt, I’ve seen someone try to pull to get side coverage of A-List player announcement.

Any successfull Startup (and you claim to be one), wouldn’t even imagine doing such a thing.

did you had to much Wine and Honey, and write this post while you were drunk ? at least it would explain it…

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

I do not appreciate your condescending tone. Respect others first. At least you did not come masked behind an anonymous IP. Thanks for that

http://www.le-dernier-bon-samaritain.fr Charles Liebert

I’ve never done anonymous Comments since 1994 (and my first step on the WWW), and I assume every words…

No Irrespect at all, simply common sense.

You feel my Tone is condescendant ? well, it was and is the right tone to wake you up, and tell you to stop this madness.

You can’t proclaim to be a Successfull Startup, and at the same time act in such a childish manner.

http://ouriel.typepad.com OurielOhayon

we have a very different definition of “common sense” and how to adress respectfully a disagreement.

LMFAO

Ahahahaha whining like a young virgin scared is obviously pathetic, for sure there’s one thing you’re definitely not good at is PR, you really should shut the fuck up as you’re already an embarrassment for your company…

http://ouriel.typepad.com OurielOhayon

we’re moderating comments with insults and inappropriate content. you are free to disagree, but at least do it respectfully

Louis van Proosdij

Ouriel, I have real respect for your career path, I appreciate the man, but this post is incredibly pathetic and off the topic. I can’t understand your statement, and it’s scary to see how all comments disagree with you not counting the fact that you now remove and censor posts.

“fire” is common word, Google has near 2 Billions answers for “fire”.
The font is the one from the Kindle logo.
The orange/yellow is derivative of the Amazon yellow.
They don’t use a mirror effect.
Hundred thousands products and companies uses 2 colors 2 words logos.

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

Let me answer

Endless companies have fire as addition with different typos and colors Not all the companies with fire operate on the app space and kindle fire does (a tablet with an app store)
The problem is not the kindle font but the similarity in the combination of all factors specifically in our field

You can argue in many ways. The question is that of similarity. Is there a specific one or no?

Get to the specifics and you may see clearer

But calling us pathetic lightly is not a way to express a disagreement

Louis van Proosdij

and just in Europe 570 brand names have “fire” in their name

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

In which field and sector louis? Barbecue and cars?

Come on..

http://twitter.com/cedric Cedric Ingrand

Hmm, Ouriel, you’re a smart guy, and I love your product, but I think you’re barking up the wrong tree. Visually, the Kindle Fire logo is a variation on the original 2007 Kindle logo. And the Kindle logo was itself a variation on the Amazon logo (same font, just thinner, same black/orange combination). And all of those were around way before AppsFire. It’s all very consistent, they didn’t go out of their way to make their logo look like yours.

Then there’s the “Fire” thing. Well, sure, it’s in your brand, and in theirs… but it’s also in countless others (Arcade Fire, CrossFire, etc.). And it’s in the dictionary, it’s all very generic. The only way the can protect is by coupling it with the totally trademarked “Kindle” brand.

So, sure, in the end, their logo looks and sounds like yours, and it sucks (or does it ?). But that’s just life’s way of reminding you that your brand shouldn’t be generic. Nothing to to get Fire-d up about…

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

Thanks Cedric. Appreciate the contribution. We hear you and thought carefully about this before posting.

We re observing the similarity is real. whatever the circumstances/variations. And this is our right as a company to say it.
I take away that you observe that as well, but put a different weight to the matter. probably because this is not your company

Anonymous

Too bad the discussion is not more constructive. Then again, collectively, lots of people need an outlet to express their strong opinions, whatever they are!

In the world of brand, it’s not a question who did what when, but rather, mind share.
Appsfire is the lesser know brand; between the two logos, type & colors are so similar that Appsfire risks being associated with the Kindle which actually is an “apps” device orthogonal to the ones we support right now (iOS + Android). No necessarily something that makes sense for us right now.Our reaction is as much naively genuine as it is legitimate and even strategically defensive.Large brands NEVER hesitate to crush smaller player with powerful cease and desist scare tactics if they see a cloud (pun intended) in their domination strategy. Here, we pulled the trigger first.
Anyways, have a good week-end ya’ll, trolls and friends, angry birds and board leaders…

Damien Guinet

Nice thread. Really. But I think it’s time to reach the Godwin point.

Tweaks99

You guys should honestly just get back to promoting AppsFire or making it bigger than the “3 million subscribers” you have. I’m sure your product is good but your claim is by far one of the worst I’ve ever read. Unless you own copyright on certain fonts and colours. Sorry if this sounds like all the other trash you seem to be getting. Good luck!

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

best tip of the day

Olivier Seres

Hi Ouriel ; why don’t you take advantage of the situation in buidling an AppsFire service for the Kindle File or something in relation to the Amazon Appstore? I’m sure there is an opportunity for your brand to be famous there.

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

Actually we did. We were the first to include amazon apps in Appsfire when their AppStore first opened

As a graphic designer with logo design experience, I’d have to say this is complete coincidence that they somewhat resemble each other. Neither logo is very unique. Ask ten graphic designers to design a two-word logo with the word ‘fire’ in it and eight of the results will look similar to both of these logos.

Logos have to be legible on a dark and light background with most clients choosing white or dark gray (or black) to display their final logo. Both logos use effects such as gradients that are common web trends.

As for the font and typography, it’s the same font they’ve been using for the kindle. The word-spacing and kerning in each logo is much different as well.

To be completely honest, when I looked at your logo I did not think of the Kindle Fire at all, so while hardly unique, be thankful that they’re just different enough Good luck to you!

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

The question is different Peter. If you put logos next to each other can you say they are really different and pertain to a different family?

http://twitter.com/peterlandt Peter Landt

The question is whether it infringes upon your property and based on my experience with logo trademarking, I would say it does not. But if you feel that the marks are too similar that it will cause confusion in your target demographic then you should take legal action.

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

At this stage we re reacting to similarities. And it is hard to ignore it. By your analysis I guess anyone could create a similar logo without any issue?

http://twitter.com/peterlandt Peter Landt

In many cases, yes. Similarity of marks is just one factor in determining trademark infringement. Unless both marks are being used in the same specific market (Kindle Fire is a physical product, AppsFire is a marketing platform) and there is evidence of actual consumer confusion of the two products, there is no infringement.

http://appsfire.com/ AppsFire

Precision we are an app store guide and promotion tool and kindle fire is an e reader with an app store guide and promotion service

We wanted to bring the evidence both are in a related space with similar graphics. It is hard to ignore those facts