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DO YOU SEE WHAT THIS LITTLE SH*T SAID ABOUT NATURALS AND SEMI-NATURALS NOT EVEN BEING TULPAS??!!?

...

I'm DISGUSTED.

Soren: As am I. For once I don't mind Rogue letting her anger flow freely, because by the gods you seem to deserve it. Some of my friends are natural and semi-natural, and some of you don't appear to understand the value of an open mind.

Azyel: You all are CLEARLY messed up.

Alfred: And lucky that Rogue and I can't strangle anyone through the phone.

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Rogue: Jesus Christ. Okay, my only real and personal problem with these reviews is you guys being so FREAKING skeptical about what ridiculously dangerous things we've faced, and about what I am and Azide is and HALF OF CHEESE'S TULPAS. If you're so skeptical, why don't you get your tailsections into this cONVENTIENTLY PLACED DISCORD SERVER so nobody has to waste our valuble time. Because that. Is a MONUMENTAL waste of time AND extremely offensive to me and my fellow natural tulpas.

Especially since our friends (and us) have already posted the details on some of the completely f*cked up stuff we've witnessed and fought tooth and claw against in this very thread. So how about you look around.

Alright, you've been through messed up stuff. Does that fix any issues within the guide? I'm not sure how this is offensive, this was a submission to be critiqued and is being critiqued as so. If these methods worked for you guys, that's good for you. This is not a personal attack. Though, this messed up stuff comes off more as intrusive thoughts that are being fed upon instead of being dispelled.

If you're so skeptical, why don't you get your tailsections into this cONVENTIENTLY PLACED DISCORD SERVER so nobody has to waste our valuble time. Because that. Is a MONUMENTAL waste of time AND extremely offensive to me and my fellow natural tulpas.

I mean, you're the one posting on the forums. None of the users asked you to post here, except maybe your friend. Chill.

Wonderland Story

What occurs in your mindscape/wonderland is a personal experience that doesn't apply to everyone. Think of it as a personally tailored experience for you guys. I like to view wonderlands and the experiences within them as a sort of cultural phenomenon, since different groups of hosts tend to have different tendencies. This is mentioned in earlier posts. What occurs can depend on who you're around and what you're led to believe. Planting the seed of doubt, in this case fear within the guide and within this post, can yield questionable claims and may make other potential new users to go down this path and experience these scary and intimidating events that you are experiencing.

(Introductions)

We'll be taking questions and/or ideas and try to help people see Naturals are an actual thing, on behalf of Ryleigh. Again that's an hour, so be quick, critize, do what you need to, I'll be answering to help prove Naturals exist!

It's not a matter about answering questions, it's a matter of answering them within the guide. This is not a Q&A, and once again, not a personal attack. It might be best for Eeveecraft to read through the posts and assess what has been stated to answer them within the guide. A good starter point to to explain is how naturals gain sentience without forcing, as the general consensus is that tulpas need to have at least some forcing in order to become sentient.

___

In addition to my earlier post, there seems to be some sort of odd fear-mongering that occurs within the guide. I'm sure tulpas can be malicious to some degree, but this tends to be an issue when hosts let their imaginations run wild and unchecked, also partly due to poor practices. Naturals as described in your posts seem to come off as intrusive thoughts that are left unchecked. Instead of ignoring them, they're fed upon.

That being said, it led me to a revelation. What's a bit shocking is that intrusive thoughts have not been mentioned within the guide. Intrusive thoughts are a common aspect when forcing your tulpa. Potential new users may not know what these sorts of things are and be led to believe that they are malicious thoughts from their tulpas, especially with the danger warnings thrown all around it. Your friends seem to keep bringing up their experiences without throwing any sort of rebuttals/explanations toward genuinely curious posters that are attempting to understand your guide. It further makes me lean toward believing that most of these troubles are merely intrusive thoughts that are being mistaken as natural tulpas. Next time one of you guys have one of these sort of malicious "natural tulpas" arrive, just say "No." and ignore it. See how it progresses. You are in control of your mind.

These natural tulpas and bad experiences you and your friends have been having, tl;dr, come off as intrusive thoughts that have been left unchecked. Your guide has /no/ mentions of intrusive thoughts at all, which leads me to believe that there some poor practices in use. Please consider this post.

Finally and once again, rallying up friends to defend you on something you're putting up to be critiqued is counter intuitive. Are you seeking critique or approval?

Edit- (this was posted within the same minute I posted, lol)

bitter noises that include unnecessary drama-tier text

You're not making the case any better for yourself or your friends/Eeveecraft. Instead of at least attempting to understand the criticism and be able to explain what the situation was like, you are responding with temper tantrums that consist of "NO i am RIGHT and you are WRONG." Time for the electro shock collar, which I find hot.

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DO YOU SEE WHAT THIS LITTLE SH*T SAID ABOUT NATURALS AND SEMI-NATURALS NOT EVEN BEING TULPAS??!!?

(literally no one said this, we said the term didn't exist until you guys made it up, and that what you call natural tulpas are just a single type of tulpas we already account for)

@Clo and offshoot personalities though, how come "instatulpas" that start off as possibly the host's imagination can't become tulpas? Why do they get locked out of tulpadom? As far as I can tell, assuming you've already got a tulpa is an effective method of eventually developing one... No need to be religious or overly rules-y about it

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@Clo and offshoot personalities though, how come "instatulpas" that start off as possibly the host's imagination can't become tulpas? Why do they get locked out of tulpadom? As far as I can tell, assuming you've already got a tulpa is an effective method of eventually developing one... No need to be religious or overly rules-y about it

They're not locked out of this tulpadom. I like to use this term more as deterrent for potential bad practices. Everyone's experiences are unique to each system, after all. Imagination is a powerful resource. After all, it's used to create us.

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Rogue: Jesus Christ. Okay, my only real and personal problem with these reviews is you guys being so FREAKING skeptical about what ridiculously dangerous things we've faced, and about what I am and Azide is and HALF OF CHEESE'S TULPAS. If you're so skeptical, why don't you get your tailsections into this cONVENTIENTLY PLACED DISCORD SERVER so nobody has to waste our valuble time. Because that. Is a MONUMENTAL waste of time AND extremely offensive to me and my fellow natural tulpas.

Especially since our friends (and us) have already posted the details on some of the completely f*cked up stuff we've witnessed and fought tooth and claw against in this very thread. So how about you look around.

I'd rather continue the discussion here since the other GAT members (if they still want to hop in, that is) and people outside of your social circle can easily give their thoughts in a well-organized manner. Also, I'd rather build up a wall of skepticism than blindly place my faith in everyone that comes forward with outlandish claims, even if they say that their experiences were traumatic.

so without further ado, Exodus!

Welcome to the forums and all, but I don't really see the point in this point. This isn't meant to be treated like an /AMA/ and you aren't supposed to be the focus of this thread - the topic is the guide, obviously.

Don't ever.

EVER.

Call our entire species "an excuse for the bogeyman", and DON'T EVER call us and semi-naturals...JUST....THEY ARE TULPAS. WE ARE TULPAS, YOU RACIST AND IGNORANT...UGH. JUST F*CKING DON'T TEST ME.

Unless of course...You WANT me to use your bones as a knife sharpener.

Very edgy and unnecessary.

But yeah that was a really experienced natural tulpamancer who didn't really have this community's ideas ingrained into the basics of his tulpas existing, I guess. He built on what he had with Tulpa.info's information, but didn't change anything that was already the case, so maybe even in the same situation a Tulpa.info tulpamancer wouldn't be able to make an "instant tulpa" like that. Idk

My problem is mostly with the people who claim that it's possible to create a fully-developed tulpa instantly or within an incredibly short amount of time, so a change in wording is all I'm pushing for.

these are the sorts of things that just clash with our community tbh, there are groups of tulpamancers who that's a normal part of the process for, and then there's us, who exclusively do it if the member already was one of those tulpamancers before joining lol. But yeah there's nothing wrong with including it I guess, but if this is a beginner's guide that (and I mean.. usually switching too) probably should be talked about later? idk, not a huge problem to me, but if Vos thinks it's a problem, owel

It might be normal for some groups, but I don't hear enough of it to consider it as a main skill. It doesn't hurt to include it, I guess, since it is part of what people hear about on here, but it's definitely not the norm overall.

As you can see with the collar thing, it's an imagination route!

I know, I'm just poking fun at what they decided to use. No ill-intent, of course. I'm not big on guides that are heavy on symbolism, though. Can't recall anyone mentioning that some examples of symbolism might not work for some people, but maybe that's because I was getting lost in those textwalls.

Rogue: Mate. Do you see what Cheese and I posted?

DO YOU SEE WHAT THIS LITTLE SH*T SAID ABOUT NATURALS AND SEMI-NATURALS NOT EVEN BEING TULPAS??!!?

...

I'm DISGUSTED.

Soren: As am I. For once I don't mind Rogue letting her anger flow freely, because by the gods you seem to deserve it. Some of my friends are natural and semi-natural, and some of you don't appear to understand the value of an open mind.

Azyel: You all are CLEARLY messed up.

Alfred: And lucky that Rogue and I can't strangle anyone through the phone.

Soren: GOOD RIDDANCE.

Azyel: Yeah, we're out of here.

Look, if you can't stay civil, you should probably stay out of this thread or take some time to cool down. This thread doesn't need to be a fight and nobody's out to attack you.

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@Clo... Sir/Ma'am/Whatever, you are a complete and utter joke to me and everyone in the tulpa community after what you just said. You just caused everyone to be ashamed of the Tulpamancy community after the slanderous and racist terms of what you said about naturals and semi-naturals alike in this section:

Natural tulpas that start off as "off-shoot" personalities sounds like an excuse for a common boogeyman - the ill-fated instatulpa. They're roleplayers that either delude or fake it in order to be accepted by others, usually manipulating to get involved with certain people. Put effort into your tulpa.

"Semi-natural" tulpas come off as delusions and schizophrenia. They seem as real as those stereotypical waifu guys online that talk to their dakimakuras and hear stuff back. This sort of stuff shouldn't get confused. I'm sure you can make tulpas through obsessions, but clearly this is extremely unhealthy and shouldn't be promoted. Please keep in mind that I'm attempting to view this from a skeptical reader's perspective.

And this:

Very questionable sources, and once again, questionable members. I don't think this is a good idea to bring up in a starter guide.

This is the most racist and offensive thing I've ever seen on this website, and I will not stand for it. To me, you are just a pitiful forum troll trying to get me to waste my time, and I'm not allowing it. You clearly didn't see all of my previous posts with evidence and everything I have said about natural Tulpamancy, and you are a pure waste of my time. Hell, you even got lazy near the end.

Now apologize to everyone for this filth you posted and for wasting mine and my friend's time on your posts.

Anyway...

Naturals are not insta-tulpas, intrusive thoughts gone wrong, or someone's imagination being questionable; they are the result of suppressed intense emotions, giant amounts of unrelieved stress, and over the course of what seems to be at least a year, but it takes less time if you already have a natural, as they are not instant. I never said naturals were instant. And mind you, my friends are not "questionable", even though some of them have the really common mental disorders that a lot of Tulpamancers have like ASD, Depression, and even ADHD. You have absolutely no right to come to that conclusion just by what they posted, and you are not a psychologist doing an extensive study of my friends' minds. I never asked them to post all that they posted-- only to give evidence by posting their stories with their natural tulpas and what utter hell they went through because of them including myself. In fact, I witnessed most of these events myself, as I even gave evidence by posting the link to a chatlog of a natural tulpa being discovered. Several times, I gave evidence disproving everyone's claims of saying naturals are this or that and I can easily continue to do so. Even better, I can give you a treasure trove of evidence named the Tulpamancy Hub, a server I created myself for non-toxic/cancerous users to congregate and to get help with their natural tulpas MANY times. Each Tulpmancer has his or her own journal to post in about their tulpa(s), and there is PLENTY of evidence there for all you skeptics.

I encourage anyone who's skeptical to join, even if it's for a short while. I can dig up all the evidence you would want, you can ask natural Tulpamancers themselves their stories and how their natural tulpa(s) came to be, and to see how naturals develop on a day-to-day basis. This is where I collect nearly all of my evidence. Now if none of you decide to join and continue to spew claims without knowing the evidence, then I'm just going to ignore you until someone actually reasonable posts something.

It is perfectly understandable to build a skeptic wall instead of falling face-first into blind faith, but using this thread is obviously not working, as my thread here devolved into a train wreck, and that the vast majority of my evidence is already there, and that everything is easily more explainable since the responses would be real-time and questions can be answered immediately.

This "fear-mongering" is simply warning people of the possibilities, and I never said this was a beginners or an advanced guide. It's like not warning a child the dangers of going out into a forest alone; they should at least be prepared for what may happen. Prepare for the worst, expect the best, AS I SAID IN MY PREVIOUS POST, NO LESS. Everyone here just had been Mandela'd into thinking this guide was just for new users, which again, I never said that. You are just making it sound like I said things I never even said and claims that were never made, which is honestly just insulting and low at this point. In fact, these "reviews" are just glorified insults at this point. I've seen and dealt with actual constructive criticism, and this is not what it looks like: a bunch of chickens running about with their heads cut off. Constructive criticism isn't someone going, "Hohoho" (Clo) and being a legitimate racist to sentient beings within someone's mind with different emotions when, oh, I don't know, this person is very similar being a tulpa themselves? It sickens me how tulpas are so brainwashed into being like this. Oh, and you know how your utterly grand belief system apparently works for all of you? Nope: that's a lie. I have tried this on several people who are natural Tulpamancers specifically were having trouble with their natural tulpas, which it worked for not a single natural Tulpamancer in the slightest.

From what I've gathered from this, this whole system for dealing with tulpas you have going on here doesn't work on natural tulpas since they don't even require the host even knowing they exist to form. In fact, it may not even work on developed enough summoned tulpas, even. If anyone is willing that is not part of my little community since you guys apparently question the mental state of the ones from there: why not attempt to use this method as a test against a really developed summoned tulpa? And make sure the host is the one going, "I don't believe that you can harm me," and let's see if this is really true.

One thing I find humorous is how set in stone everything in here seems to be: why not at least test these claims and find out for yourselves instead of just sitting here and talking? Why not have an open mind? Instead of just spewing things, you can ask questions and get answers, you know. The goal of this guide isn't just to be a guide, but to popularize my friend and I's findings to the Tulpamancy community. What my friends and I have found can end up helping people that were shunned away from this community fix things and better their lives. People who've discovered that they had a natural tulpa or more ended up living better lives overall since their natural tulpa(s) isn't causing havoc behind the scenes without the host's knowledge (I posted evidence in an earlier post), which the host got their natural tulpa to deviate, and both parties were a lot better off than just ignoring the problem. Seriously, why would you ever encourage ignoring a problem? Why wouldn't you see what something from your subconscious is trying to tell you? What if there's a problem that your subconscious is attempting to notify you? Why not just (if you have a tulpa) have your tulpa or tulpas to go into your subconscious to see what's wrong and try to fix it? To be honest, I find that to be mentally unhealthy.

Do I have to remind everyone that Tulpamancy can be widely based on subjective experiences like what Cheese and Rogue along with their tulpas have told? Yes, there are objective facts, but we should all know that everyone's experience is different, but they all center around the same thing when it comes around the tales of natural Tulpamancers: the hell that their natural tulpa caused them for possibly weeks all the way to several years. Now, this is not the case for all natural tulpas, and I never even said that something is 100% the case. As I said, everyone has different experiences and grows differently. All I mean there is in general terms or what is usually, keyword: usually the case.

And... Do I seriously have to criticize how terrible the reviewers are at viewing the material? Do they seriously not realize to read through the literature once, then read through it again while then making their review? Why do you guys review it as you're going along for the first time around? That's terrible reviewing habits! It's like judging a book for not explaining things only for the reader to see the things getting explained later on, and then going, "Ohhh... Now it makes sense!" I can't even believe I'm saying this, but are you guys blind enough not to notice a literal definitions section that has every odd term for the reader to look up if they're confused? That's why there's bolded words in there: to note that this word is something you may not understand, so it's bolded to say it's in the definitions section! That, or if it's something important since humans retain knowledge better if certain parts of in bold or are highlighted. I am just utterly amazed that these are full-grown adults making embarrassing mistakes like these, and that nobody picked up on it.

After all of that, I honestly question whether or not this website is even worth it anymore due to the horrendous display that has been laid out for me. The only person I could honestly take seriously was Tulpa himself since he never added anything slanderous, serious, his review was organized neat, and I could actually understand where he was coming from with his counterarguments and such. Now... This whole thread really just brought out the worst of this community and made it a laughing stock. I cannot even take people seriously on this thread anymore just by how they acted, and that I hate going back here to make a post or reply more and more. For all of the posts that were made while I was gone, I was legitimately cringing, face-palming, and internally crying/screaming from what this thread became and how people are handling my hard work that took me nearly a month to create.

...If you do not see me posting anymore, then assume I left to stop wasting my time on this cancerous place when I tried to show them new ideas.

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...If you do not see me posting anymore, then assume I left to stop wasting my time on this cancerous place when I tried to show them new ideas.

From what I've seen from a little peek at your discord, your clique's ideas are somewhere in between childlike and ridiculous, ranging from believing in mind attacks going over the internet to having an aura to protect your discord server against those attacks.

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This thread is a 5 star example of why I think this community is way too driven by feelings to actually derive meaningful statistics from. Any time someone (clo, in this case) makes a claim or observation that goes against someone's views on things, the first words I see thrown around are "hurtful" and "offensive". This is why tulpas will never be taken seriously, because you people cannot for the life of you understand that we're trying to figure shit out here, not trying to have a conversation about how you feel.

This is really serious and sad to me, because I really do think tulpas can be greatly beneficial to many people, as they were for me, especially in this day and age, and they are a wonderful psychological phenomenon; but due to the amount of "feelings" ridden guides and resources we have, the great majority of people who are going to get into it are, to be very blunt, the magicks people, while most people with any sort of critical thinking skills - you know, the people we actually want since they're the ones who are more likely to make worthwhile contributions - will be turning up their noses at it thinking it's just another product of the dark ages.

Since we're on the topic of personal experience and all that, let me tell you that if I ever used the word "feelings", or "hurtful" when discussing tulpas in a "how do they work" context, Luna, my tulpa, would laugh at me until the sun froze. Ok, probably not, because she's too sweet for that, but she'd think it ridiculous, and probably tell me to stahp.

Also, the way you're responding is "HOW *NOT* TO RESPOND TO CRITIQUE" levels of bad.