RE: DVD backup legality question

I have a considerable collection of DVDs that I play often. I take real
good care of them, always returning them to their sleeve after playing, etc
However, a friend of mine recently had a fire and lost his whole collection
and I realized the same thing could happen to me. That would be a major
bummer!

I'd like to make backups to insure against loss or destruction of the
original material.
The only way to protect it would be to store it away from the original
DVD.(i.e. not in my house or car). Safety deposit boxes would be way to
expensive.

Can I make copies for someone else to hold for me? In exchange, in lieu of
a expensive fee or monthly storage charges, I would be willing to hold their
backup copies on a one disk to one disk basis with the understanding that I
can't view theirs, and they can't view mine.

Sort of a mutual protection to mutual protection (MP2MP) {LOL}network, club,
or organization.

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LesV wrote on [Thu, 03 Mar 2005 16:56:36 GMT]:
> Is it legal to back up a DVD title you own, and on what basis?

Depends on what country you live in. In the US, no. It is not legal to
copy a DVD.
> I have a considerable collection of DVDs that I play often. I take real
> good care of them, always returning them to their sleeve after playing, etc
> However, a friend of mine recently had a fire and lost his whole collection
> and I realized the same thing could happen to me. That would be a major
> bummer!

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"LesV" <> wrote in message
news:8lHVd.317957$...
> Is it legal to back up a DVD title you own, and on what basis?
>
> Example:
>
> I have a considerable collection of DVDs that I play often. I take real
> good care of them, always returning them to their sleeve after playing,
etc
> However, a friend of mine recently had a fire and lost his whole
collection
> and I realized the same thing could happen to me. That would be a major
> bummer!
>
> I'd like to make backups to insure against loss or destruction of the
> original material.
> The only way to protect it would be to store it away from the original
> DVD.(i.e. not in my house or car). Safety deposit boxes would be way to
> expensive.
>
> Can I make copies for someone else to hold for me? In exchange, in lieu
of
> a expensive fee or monthly storage charges, I would be willing to hold
their
> backup copies on a one disk to one disk basis with the understanding that
I
> can't view theirs, and they can't view mine.
>
> Sort of a mutual protection to mutual protection (MP2MP) {LOL}network,
club,
> or organization.
>
> What are the legal issues involved?
>
>

In simple terms, yes, you are allowed to make a backup of your own DVD.
However, legally you cannot defeat or override any code that defeats the
copy protection scheme placed on the original DVD by the Copyright Owner.
This is the Catch 22. It's like pot - you can smoke it but you're not
allowed to have it!

Also, if you distribute your backup copy (ie: give it to someone else), the
original must go with it and vice versa. This suggests that your backup must
be kept with the original (which kinda defeats the purpose of having a
backup).

"LesV" <> wrote in message
news:8lHVd.317957$...
> Is it legal to back up a DVD title you own, and on what basis?
>
> Example:
>
> I have a considerable collection of DVDs that I play often. I take real
> good care of them, always returning them to their sleeve after playing,
etc
> However, a friend of mine recently had a fire and lost his whole
collection
> and I realized the same thing could happen to me. That would be a major
> bummer!
>
> I'd like to make backups to insure against loss or destruction of the
> original material.
> The only way to protect it would be to store it away from the original
> DVD.(i.e. not in my house or car). Safety deposit boxes would be way to
> expensive.
>
> Can I make copies for someone else to hold for me? In exchange, in lieu
of
> a expensive fee or monthly storage charges, I would be willing to hold
their
> backup copies on a one disk to one disk basis with the understanding that
I
> can't view theirs, and they can't view mine.
>
> Sort of a mutual protection to mutual protection (MP2MP) {LOL}network,
club,
> or organization.
>
> What are the legal issues involved?
>
>

Are you not allowed to protect your property from loss or destruction?

That's like saying you can back up the data on your computer but you have to
leave it on your computer.

How stupid is that?
"Rob" <> wrote in message
news:qLHVd.26917$...
> "LesV" <> wrote in message
> news:8lHVd.317957$...
> > Is it legal to back up a DVD title you own, and on what basis?
> >
> > Example:
> >
> > I have a considerable collection of DVDs that I play often. I take real
> > good care of them, always returning them to their sleeve after playing,
> etc
> > However, a friend of mine recently had a fire and lost his whole
> collection
> > and I realized the same thing could happen to me. That would be a major
> > bummer!
> >
> > I'd like to make backups to insure against loss or destruction of the
> > original material.
> > The only way to protect it would be to store it away from the original
> > DVD.(i.e. not in my house or car). Safety deposit boxes would be way to
> > expensive.
> >
> > Can I make copies for someone else to hold for me? In exchange, in lieu
> of
> > a expensive fee or monthly storage charges, I would be willing to hold
> their
> > backup copies on a one disk to one disk basis with the understanding
that
> I
> > can't view theirs, and they can't view mine.
> >
> > Sort of a mutual protection to mutual protection (MP2MP) {LOL}network,
> club,
> > or organization.
> >
> > What are the legal issues involved?
> >
> >
>
> In simple terms, yes, you are allowed to make a backup of your own DVD.
> However, legally you cannot defeat or override any code that defeats the
> copy protection scheme placed on the original DVD by the Copyright Owner.
> This is the Catch 22. It's like pot - you can smoke it but you're not
> allowed to have it!
>
> Also, if you distribute your backup copy (ie: give it to someone else),
the
> original must go with it and vice versa. This suggests that your backup
must
> be kept with the original (which kinda defeats the purpose of having a
> backup).
>
> You should read the DMC Act for 'clarification'. Good luck
>
>

For the sake of argument, lets assume the DVDs to be copyrighted, but not
copy protected. No technology will be circumvented in order to create a
copy.

"LesV" <> wrote in message
news:8lHVd.317957$...
> Is it legal to back up a DVD title you own, and on what basis?
>
> Example:
>
> I have a considerable collection of DVDs that I play often. I take real
> good care of them, always returning them to their sleeve after playing,
etc
> However, a friend of mine recently had a fire and lost his whole
collection
> and I realized the same thing could happen to me. That would be a major
> bummer!
>
> I'd like to make backups to insure against loss or destruction of the
> original material.
> The only way to protect it would be to store it away from the original
> DVD.(i.e. not in my house or car). Safety deposit boxes would be way to
> expensive.
>
> Can I make copies for someone else to hold for me? In exchange, in lieu
of
> a expensive fee or monthly storage charges, I would be willing to hold
their
> backup copies on a one disk to one disk basis with the understanding that
I
> can't view theirs, and they can't view mine.
>
> Sort of a mutual protection to mutual protection (MP2MP) {LOL}network,
club,
> or organization.
>
> What are the legal issues involved?
>
>

LesV wrote:
> The disc belongs to the purchaser. The content belongs to the studio.
>
> Are you not allowed to protect your property from loss or destruction?
>
> That's like saying you can back up the data on your computer but you have to
> leave it on your computer.
>
> How stupid is that?
The law was written by congress.
Next question.

"LesV" <> wrote in message
news:C4IVd.97402$...
> Touché
>
> What if I'm walking down the street with the DVD's in a briefcase and
> somebody steals it?
>
> "Biz" <> wrote in message
> news:mNHVd.318088$...
>> Homeowner's insurance.......
>>
>
Generally, insurance covers ALL of your (non listed) belongings where ever
they may be - in your car, at a friend's place etc. High value items must be
listed.
However, there is usually a $300 o rmore deductable, and your premiums go up
if you have a claim, so under $1000 it is not worth claiming.

"LesV" <> wrote in message
news:q_HVd.318156$...
> The disc belongs to the purchaser. The content belongs to the studio.
>
> Are you not allowed to protect your property from loss or destruction?
>
> That's like saying you can back up the data on your computer but you have
to
> leave it on your computer.
>
> How stupid is that?
> "Rob" <> wrote in message
> news:qLHVd.26917$...
> > "LesV" <> wrote in message
> > news:8lHVd.317957$...
> > > Is it legal to back up a DVD title you own, and on what basis?
> > >
> > > Example:
> > >
> > > I have a considerable collection of DVDs that I play often. I take
real
> > > good care of them, always returning them to their sleeve after
playing,
> > etc
> > > However, a friend of mine recently had a fire and lost his whole
> > collection
> > > and I realized the same thing could happen to me. That would be a
major
> > > bummer!
> > >
> > > I'd like to make backups to insure against loss or destruction of the
> > > original material.
> > > The only way to protect it would be to store it away from the original
> > > DVD.(i.e. not in my house or car). Safety deposit boxes would be way
to
> > > expensive.
> > >
> > > Can I make copies for someone else to hold for me? In exchange, in
lieu
> > of
> > > a expensive fee or monthly storage charges, I would be willing to hold
> > their
> > > backup copies on a one disk to one disk basis with the understanding
> that
> > I
> > > can't view theirs, and they can't view mine.
> > >
> > > Sort of a mutual protection to mutual protection (MP2MP) {LOL}network,
> > club,
> > > or organization.
> > >
> > > What are the legal issues involved?
> > >
> > >
> >
> > In simple terms, yes, you are allowed to make a backup of your own DVD.
> > However, legally you cannot defeat or override any code that defeats the
> > copy protection scheme placed on the original DVD by the Copyright
Owner.
> > This is the Catch 22. It's like pot - you can smoke it but you're not
> > allowed to have it!
> >
> > Also, if you distribute your backup copy (ie: give it to someone else),
> the
> > original must go with it and vice versa. This suggests that your backup
> must
> > be kept with the original (which kinda defeats the purpose of having a
> > backup).
> >
> > You should read the DMC Act for 'clarification'. Good luck
> >
> >
>
>

Major stupid.

And that's why we are forced (or, at least Americans are) to become major
criminals when we want to protect our investment. I make backup copies of my
originals and delete all the FBI Warnings, previews, alternate language
tracks etc. on the copies. It's these copies that I watch when I want to see
the movie again.

"LesV" <> wrote in message
news:ulIVd.97452$...
> For the sake of argument, lets assume the DVDs to be copyrighted, but not
> copy protected. No technology will be circumvented in order to create a
> copy.
>
>

Then I can't see any law that prevents you from making a backup copy of
something you paid for. Anyone else?

"Stuart Miller" <> wrote in message
news1JVd.565156$6l.331507@pd7tw2no...
>
> "LesV" <> wrote in message
> news:C4IVd.97402$...
> > Touché
> >
> > What if I'm walking down the street with the DVD's in a briefcase and
> > somebody steals it?
> >
> > "Biz" <> wrote in message
> > news:mNHVd.318088$...
> >> Homeowner's insurance.......
> >>
> >
> Generally, insurance covers ALL of your (non listed) belongings where ever
> they may be - in your car, at a friend's place etc. High value items must
be
> listed.
> However, there is usually a $300 o rmore deductable, and your premiums go
up
> if you have a claim, so under $1000 it is not worth claiming.
>
> Stuart
>
>
Plus many insurance companies will insist on getting receipts. How many of
you keep DVD receipts?

Rob wrote on [Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:57:46 -0600]:
> "Stuart Miller" <> wrote in message
> news1JVd.565156$6l.331507@pd7tw2no...
>>
>> "LesV" <> wrote in message
>> news:C4IVd.97402$...
>> > Touché
>> >
>> > What if I'm walking down the street with the DVD's in a briefcase and
>> > somebody steals it?
>> >
>> > "Biz" <> wrote in message
>> > news:mNHVd.318088$...
>> >> Homeowner's insurance.......
>> >>
>> >
>> Generally, insurance covers ALL of your (non listed) belongings where ever
>> they may be - in your car, at a friend's place etc. High value items must
> be
>> listed.
>> However, there is usually a $300 o rmore deductable, and your premiums go
> up
>> if you have a claim, so under $1000 it is not worth claiming.
>>
>> Stuart
>>
>>
> Plus many insurance companies will insist on getting receipts. How many of
> you keep DVD receipts?

Rob wrote:
> "Justin" <> wrote in message
> news:2go.com...
>
>>Rob wrote on [Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:57:46 -0600]:
>>
>>>"Stuart Miller" <> wrote in message
>>>news1JVd.565156$6l.331507@pd7tw2no...
>>>
>>>>"LesV" <> wrote in message
>>>>news:C4IVd.97402$...
>>>>
>>>>>Touché
>>>>>
>>>>>What if I'm walking down the street with the DVD's in a briefcase and
>>>>>somebody steals it?
>>>>>
>>>>>"Biz" <> wrote in message
>>>>>news:mNHVd.318088$...
>>>>>
>>>>>>Homeowner's insurance.......
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>Generally, insurance covers ALL of your (non listed) belongings where
>
> ever
>
>>>>they may be - in your car, at a friend's place etc. High value items
>
> must
>
>>>be
>>>
>>>>listed.
>>>>However, there is usually a $300 o rmore deductable, and your premiums
>
> go
>
>>>up
>>>
>>>>if you have a claim, so under $1000 it is not worth claiming.
>>>>
>>>>Stuart
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>Plus many insurance companies will insist on getting receipts. How many
>
> of
>
>>>you keep DVD receipts?
>>
>>Oh bull. Just take photos of all the items.
>
>
> Right! Now let's see ... should I take a photo of every DVD I buy, save the
> receipts, or???
>
>
Well actually I save receipts, primarily because occasionally you get a
rebate and I'm too lazy to throw away old receipts. But I suspect that
something like DVD Profiler would be acceptable proof for insurance.

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