Not true...

Originally Posted by Seiken3

So, I want to ask you guys; Have you ever had that happened to you? The guildleader patching together a team on the very day of the released cotnent consisting of socials and trials just to get a head-start?(we're not trying down as many and as fast as we can)

Just to clarify, we did set up this event the weekend before the release. And even the creative creator of this post did hit decline on the Saturday before the release of the patch. (11.09.2013) (Would insert a screenshot, but MMO-Champion wont allow me..)
So I do hope our guild will not suffer for this. We did even announce that we would try to get a group together that Wednesday on our last day of raiding ToT (Which was on the Sunday before the patch). It was not my intention to hurt any of our raiders feelings and we would probably not had gone if we knew it would. In any case, this is really just his own fault. He did know about the raid and did not inform any of our officers about his feelings towards us engaging the first few bosses on Wednesday.

I still think applying to guilds is amongst the dumbest things I've ever run into in this game. Job applications are pretty much ridiculous today, but at least you get paid.

If you're looking for a guild that takes raiding seriously and not try and attempt to faceroll or overgear the hard bosses a tier or two later - then you have to show in some way that you are serious about what you set in to do. Writing an application where you demonstrate your knowledge about the position you apply for as well as your previous experience in game (for it to be checked with your achievements and previous guildhistory) is a nessecary evil unless you have some very skilled member already in the guild that can vouch for you. Or you'd be bound to pick up a trade guild who will most likely farm the first four bosses in SoO if you're lucky. If you're happy with that, then all is well. If you're not, then you better quit raiding or change your attitude towards it.

Well your guild seems very mediocre progress wise from what you say, and this tier has 14 bosses, with the first few being really easy. Personally, I think it makes sense to get some of the fodder initial bosses out of the way on an off-day so you can do more progress on your scheduled days.

Honestly, I feel for the OP. If you have scheduled raid days, then you don't decide spur of the moment to change them without making it known, that's a douche move by the RL and/or officers in the guild. It doesn't matter if you are excited to try the new content or not, if you are a raid guild and you say you raid Thursday/Sunday/Monday then it's a shitbag move to decide "Hey we have enough people on, and it's Wednesday so let's raid right now!" because you know that sometimes people aren't going to be on outside of raid days, or they'll make plans outside of raid days.

If the OP knew you were going to raid on Wednesday and decided not to be on, then he's at fault for not being there. But if he wasn't told that you would do that, or even if you might (e.g. "/g Hey if we have enough people on Wednesday we're going to raid early") then the fault is with the GM/Officers for not communicating properly with core raiders. It would not sit well with me as a core raider if it was suddenly decided to go and clear on an additional raid day without making sure everyone was aware of it (although in my case I am usually on every day so I'd never not be aware lol)

Is it a big enough deal to whine about? Maybe, maybe not; it depends on the guild, but it'd certainly raise some red flags as the guild is willing to ignore its own schedule and if they are willing to do that, what other rules will they ignore?

Just to clarify, we did set up this event the weekend before the release. And even the creative creator of this post did hit decline on the Saturday before the release of the patch. (11.09.2013) (Would insert a screenshot, but MMO-Champion wont allow me..)
So I do hope our guild will not suffer for this. We did even announce that we would try to get a group together that Wednesday on our last day of raiding ToT (Which was on the Sunday before the patch). It was not my intention to hurt any of our raiders feelings and we would probably not had gone if we knew it would. In any case, this is really just his own fault. He did knew about the raid and did not inform any of our officers about his feelings towards us engaging the first few bosses on Wednesday.

Seiken's GM

Well, if this is true, it obviously changes everything. Having an extra raid day, when a new raid comes out, that is scheduled in advance is quite common for serious guilds. Still sucks if you can't make it, but it is understandable that the guild wants to try the raid asap and since it was scheduled, people at least had a chance to reschedule other appointments if they wanted to be at this raid (and know that Thursday would be a raid in progress and thus have a choice to not attend if you want a fresh raid).

This is why I quit being a GM... too much drama

"When you understand why you dismiss all the other gods people believe in, you will understand why I dismiss yours."

Just to clarify, we did set up this event the weekend before the release. And even the creative creator of this post did hit decline on the Saturday before the release of the patch. (11.09.2013) (Would insert a screenshot, but MMO-Champion wont allow me..)
So I do hope our guild will not suffer for this. We did even announce that we would try to get a group together that Wednesday on our last day of raiding ToT (Which was on the Sunday before the patch). It was not my intention to hurt any of our raiders feelings and we would probably not had gone if we knew it would. In any case, this is really just his own fault. He did knew about the raid and did not inform any of our officers about his feelings towards us engaging the first few bosses on Wednesday.

Seiken's GM

So there you have it. Not a case of going behind the OPs back at all but a case of the OP getting the hump that the guild would not sit on their hands and wait and not do the fun thing they'd planned just because it didn't fit the OPs schedule.

Just to clarify, we did set up this event the weekend before the release. And even the creative creator of this post did hit decline on the Saturday before the release of the patch. (11.09.2013) (Would insert a screenshot, but MMO-Champion wont allow me..)
So I do hope our guild will not suffer for this. We did even announce that we would try to get a group together that Wednesday on our last day of raiding ToT (Which was on the Sunday before the patch). It was not my intention to hurt any of our raiders feelings and we would probably not had gone if we knew it would. In any case, this is really just his own fault. He did knew about the raid and did not inform any of our officers about his feelings towards us engaging the first few bosses on Wednesday.

Seiken's GM

This would then just make the OP a liar and this an entirely wasted thread.

Ignore my previous post trying to defend the OP (though I did admit it was taking everything he said as truth).

A guild is a group of players, and then there is an individual like you. In 25 man raiding guild atleast 24 members wanted to raid on Wednesday where as you wanted to raid the next day. For first time in that particular week.

Which makes you sound selfish for making your guild look bad as if they betrayed you. What they actually did was doing what the majority of the guild wanted. And based on that calculation I'd say they did the right thing and you should join them the next day as if nothing had happened. Business as usual. No need to make a big deal out of it.

If it bothers you that much, you should discuss this with the guild leadership part, if there is one (The leadership forced people to raid yesterday, then the above is invalid and you should just blame the leader). If it's a democracy, like above, then talk to the members.

Just to clarify, we did set up this event the weekend before the release. And even the creative creator of this post did hit decline on the Saturday before the release of the patch. (11.09.2013) (Would insert a screenshot, but MMO-Champion wont allow me..)
So I do hope our guild will not suffer for this. We did even announce that we would try to get a group together that Wednesday on our last day of raiding ToT (Which was on the Sunday before the patch). It was not my intention to hurt any of our raiders feelings and we would probably not had gone if we knew it would. In any case, this is really just his own fault. He did knew about the raid and did not inform any of our officers about his feelings towards us engaging the first few bosses on Wednesday.

Seiken's GM

You can at least post the link by putting spaces etc between the letters in the link and one of us here can amend it and post it for all to see if you want to prove it as until then I cant take what either of you say to be the truth.

TLDR: New content gets released, people in my guild were eager to give it a shot and they dared to raid even when i wasnt online.

Im sorry but you come across as quite a touche. Surely the other people in your guild have the right to be excited for new content as well? And you having to read up on new bosses again, what kind of complaint is that in the first place, surely you would of had to do that anyway, sooner or later? Based on your post you come across as quite self-centered and i for one wouldnt want you in my guild.

the problem isnt that they wanted to raid, the problem is that guilds have rules... such as raidtimes, and if even the leaders dont obey these...then whats the point of being in such a guild? when they might randomly raid during a day which isnt in the schedule.

Following guild raid schedule is the most important thing in any raiding guild. It gives everyone a chance to join for the raid and guarantees that the guild has enough people prepared for it.

Doing the raid on the release day instead of the next day when its scheduled for their guild is outright robbing everyone else in the guild by those who did it that day.

Imagine in real life if there was like a huge concert(Free of charge) by some big band like Foo Fighters or Rammstein and then they decide suddenly to have that concert one day early without telling anyone... and only those who happen to showup get to see it...
(Unlikely scenario to happen but exactly the same loss for everyone who knew the scheduled date and were going to show up but then missed it because the organizers couldnt wait)

the problem isnt that they wanted to raid, the problem is that guilds have rules... such as raidtimes, and if even the leaders dont obey these...then whats the point of being in such a guild? when they might randomly raid during a day which isnt in the schedule.

Following guild raid schedule is the most important thing in any raiding guild. It gives everyone a chance to join for the raid and guarantees that the guild has enough people prepared for it.

This, pretty much. It doesn't matter if 24 other people were like "Yeah let's raid Wednesday!" if it wasn't stated beforehand, the guild schedule stated raids were Thursday/Sunday/Monday, so raiding progression content outside those days is a douche move on the part of the GM/Officers. Now if they stated this beforehand, then the issue is on the OP for not being on a day when he knew the guild would raid outside the normal schedule, but if it was a spur of the moment "Hmm we have 25 people on, everyone want to try Siege early?" then the guild doesn't care about their own rules.

This, pretty much. It doesn't matter if 24 other people were like "Yeah let's raid Wednesday!" if it wasn't stated beforehand, the guild schedule stated raids were Thursday/Sunday/Monday, so raiding progression content outside those days is a douche move on the part of the GM/Officers. Now if they stated this beforehand, then the issue is on the OP for not being on a day when he knew the guild would raid outside the normal schedule, but if it was a spur of the moment "Hmm we have 25 people on, everyone want to try Siege early?" then the guild doesn't care about their own rules.

To be fair EVEN if they said before hand we will raid on an off raid day its a bit of a dick move still as you may have arranged IRL stuff around those days anyway. They should have used flex regardless on that off raid day for some practice and some bits of loot and left the main raid for the raid day. When I did raiding properly we never did off raid days that would affect our members like that. Worst we did was one extra raid day before the reset on Illidan to get him down and the people in the raid agreed to it as we were trying to down him.

If the GM could post a link from their guild calendar with proof (can simply put the link in but put some spaces between the URL letters and we can simply put them together and repost for him) that would end this debate.

Regardless the OP would have been best speaking to the GM letting their stance on it be known before hand or at least after the raid and see if something could be done.

Your choice.
I would suck it up and see how it evolves if the guild fits your needs well.
But you should voice your displeasure, calendars are there to be used.
If they repeat this trick go find another guild.