46 comments:

I loved it but how to post without too many spoilers? It's nigh impossible! I posted about the book on my blog and these were the highlights for me:- the delicate way JRW handles the very tough issues and brutality that are necessary in the story- a heroine who has enough self-respect to leave when she recognises the situation is no longer healthy for her- the growing set of ambiguous, complex characters that don't apologise for who or what they are and whose own stories are extremely interesting- subplots that tantalise but don't detract from the main romantic plot (without giving too much away, I loved that she took away THE potentially big distraction without fussing over it for the rest of the novel - it was peripheral to Z's story and I liked that JRW kept it that way)- 6 aroused alpha males in one room - PHWOAR!

There were some elements that I thought were a little weak, such as too many loose ends, the pacing of the ending, some of Z's characterisation towards the end, and Bella not having enough pages in the book.

But the emotional intensity of the book, and the complex relationships that were unraveled really made this a standout for me. I can't wait for the next one. :-)

BTW, I'm also loving the hilarious stories of JRW fans trying to find the books on shelves and "pimping" them out to people who've never heard of them. It's crazy fun!

Oh...so much to say. I literally began thinking about this post last night. If you haven't read it, please stop reading now, as I'm gonna spoil:

1- Wellsie. Tohr. Why oh why oh why oh why?!?!?! I mean, I knew that something was going to happen due to the fact that she even going to write Tohr's book. But the brutal way she died. It was so unexpected and horrible. And where did he go? He's the steady one, the one who leads and commands. And now he's devastated and gone. I didn't cry at all throughout Z's trials and tribulations, but I bawled when Wrath told Tohr about Wellsie. SIGH. I trust her, and I know that J.R. will give Tohr a HEA, I just...don't know what that's going to be without Wellsie.

2- So thought #2 regarding Wellsie (and I have lots and lots of them) if the Scribe Virgin could bring back Darius, would she bring back Wellsie? I mean, I guess not, since Darius was a warrior putting his life on the line for the race, and Wellsie is just a shellan.

3- What's going to happen with Tohr's back? If he has Wellisinde (I think that's her whole name) already in his back, and he's going to get a new shellan, what will happen?

I realize I'm over thinking this, but I've had several days to pile up questions and pondering...

OK, on to other aspects of the book

1- BUTCH! What the heck is going on? Why would V give him his blood? Is Butch something "other" than human? Will it make him immortal? I'm so intrigued!

2- JOHN MATTHEW! How awesome was the scene with him and Beth? And what was that about?!

3- PHURY! I can't believe how much I love him now. He's so sad and disappointed. My heart breaks for him. And we have to wait so, so long for his story. SIGH. Patience just isn't my thing.

OK, on to Z and Bella:

1- Michelle, I want to know which scene you were referring to the other day. Was it the one where he, ermmm, takes himself in hand? (I don't know any other way to say that).

2- How amazing was The Needing?! I was hoping we'd get to see Beth go through it, but I loved the way it advanced Z's development to have him be the one to help Bella through it. It was an amazingly erotic set of scenes.

OK, sorry, like I said, I've been thinking this out for a couple of days.

I have a question for all you Ward fans. But its a sincere question from someone who is new to this author so please don't flame me too much.

How is this series different from the Dark Hunter series? It seems similar. As i said, i haven't read these and know less than nothing about Ward's books. I read through a few descriptions and reviews and whatnot and... well, my question stands.

Typ0- If they kicked bloggers off for not knowing an author, I would be LOOONNNGGG gone. :o)I haven't read the Dark Hunters. See my point made. :PWards books are dark and erotic and fantastic and remarkable any and all other positive adjectives you can think of. She has made a world that I haven't seen anywhere else. It is unique and refreshing. I love it and recommend it to anyone who enjoys paranormals. :o)

I just noticed that I won!!! Woo Hoo!!! Thanks, Michelle and Stephanie!

Nairobi--who could hate you? I've read both--and I gotta tell you, for me they are so different. The Black Dagger Brotherhood is that--a brotherhood, they live together and hang together, their job is to defend civillian vampires, not humans. Of course I can't describe the whole thing for you, can't do it justice.

There are what? maybe 12 to 20 plots and when you make it a paranormal, of course there will be similarities, but the flavor is different--I think you should give it a try, after all a girl can't have too many dark hunky paras, now can she?

Okay, MK, I stopped reading, because I just got my copy yesterday, and what with one child in his own townhouse now (gasp) and one in second grade--I was busy, so I didn't start reading until last night at about 10:00--LOVE IT--but not done. Plus I have to work--this work thing sure gets in the way.

OK, I'll attempt to answer, since I read both series (although I've kind of broken up w/Sherrilyn Kenyon because she's now publishing in hardcover, and I won't pay for her books at that price). Your question is kind of like comparing apples and oranges.

What's different? Well, I'll say it...I think the BDB is a better series. And, before you throw stuff at me, here's why: Her mythology isn't so involved. To me, her stories strike much more of a chord of realism because she's not relying on Greek/Roman mythology quite so much. The stories are just kind of a slightly altered reality. Also, Kenyon has many, many intersecting balls in the air at the same time. Sometimes she isn't successful in managing all of the races and storylines.

IMHO, the BDB is a much more tightly written story and the characters are much more interwoven. I find that I spend a lot of time saying to myself: "Wait, who is he again?" when I'm reading Kenyon's books.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the Dark Hunters. And in the interest of full disclosure, the BDB is my favorite paranormal series out there.

Do I think that SK might have influenced JR Ward when she started writing? Yes, I think there's a good likelihood. But to me, Ward has taken the vampire genre and very much made it her own.

My first thought when you said that BDB is about people who protect vamps was that Ward and Kenyon should get together and have their characters battle! LOL Too much sugar today i guess. :p

Seriously though, thanks for the breakdown. I'll def have to pick up all the BDB books next time i'm in the Real World. (They don't exactly carry romances here. :p ) Strong guys who do battle for the women in their lives are my right up my alley!

MK, i agree on the the Kenyon going hardcover issue. I was so happy when i saw that Amazon.uk had her most recent one in paperback already. There are only about 2 or 3 authors for whom i'll shell out hc money for... And none of them, i'm afraid, are romance authors. (Plus my shelves devoted romances are exactly the right size for paperbacks only.) :p :D

I was surprised by how painful the needing was. I knew that it was uncomfortable from mentions in the other books but I wasn't prepared for Bella to be in pain...

I also liked how JR handled Z's past. She didn't do that much glossing on it and that made it really hit home how tortured he was and why. It helped me understand why he felt unworthy of Bella and why he kept trying to push Phury at her.

Hello, I'm new to this blog but I just had to say I've been a huge fan of Kenyon's for a while then a few months ago I found Ward's books. LOVE HER! The BDB series is much easier to read versus the Dark Hunters (although I really LOVE Ash and can't wait to read his story!!).

I just realized LA is out now & going this afternoon to pick it up. I can't wait to read it (I'll probably be up all night tonight...)

Hey, Leah!! Welcome!!! LA is sooo worth the wait. I'm going to reread it tonight. Actually I'm going to reread all of them starting with DL just to make sure I haven't missed anything the first time. :o)

I wanted to address the differences between DH series and the BDB. I used to LOVE the DH. Okay, they're kind of cheesey and everyone gets the absolutely most perfectly wonderful, happiest ending possible. So much so that I've rolled my eyes more than a few times at them. Fun, but major brain candy.

The BDB is darker, characters have to sacrifice and there is no magical Acheron to fix everyone's problems with a wave of his deus ex machina wand. They do have a deity, the Scribe Virgin, but so far she's interceeded ONCE on behalf of the brothers and it wasn't a freebee.

The BDB are alive, so they can die. Plus, I think they are MUCH better written. My love affair with the DH series has ended, partly because I feel the writing and storytelling has gone seriously sub-par.

What I like about the BDB is the grit and the realism. Anyway, my two cents on that.

And I LOVED LA. Z is absolutely my favorite of the brothers. I really loved the way his relationship developed with Bella and I think she knew exactly how to deal with him.

I will admit that I thought he got a little overly mushy near the end, but I was willing to let that slide. It was the only thing that I felt went overboard. Overall, best book I've read in years.

Hi s-byte :MK waving madly: Thanks so much for stopping by! I wasn't sure that Phury was up in '08 or not. I'm more worried about my Tohr. I'm not sure when his story is coming, but I'm heartbroken for him.

And the first time J.R. Ward GuestBlogged here, she said she was flattered that folks make a comparison between hers and Kenyon's novels.

Def both have the BOB thing goin on, with the alpha protectors, and BiMBaWs. Both are Vamps, but obviously, D-Hs have an intricate mythology, and shape-shifters, weres, etc.

Sometimes, I think I'm not smart or adept enough to absorb the mythology of the D-H novels. But that's also why I have trouble with mysteries, thrillers, etc. I'm impatient; I need everything to be clear throughout and am not great at gathering clues.

Anyway, I don't think one can talk BDB w/out talking D-H, because D-H is such an influential series in so many ways.

But let me also make another, ultra-important comparison between Sherrilyn Kenyon and J.R. Ward. They are fiercly loyal to their reader/fans, and respect them as individuals as well as consumers. But first and foremost, as individuals.

When either writes you, comments to your post, blogs for you, she's doing it to make a connection, not because she wants to sell you her book.

I think part of the issue is that Phury needs a little time before his story comes around. Emotionally he's in a bad place and JRW has emphasized that with some short stories (slice of life's) on her message board. If you liked the books, I would highly recommend signing up for the message board and reading those.

I know that after Phury, we will have books about Rehvenge (Woo Hoo!), Payne (female brother we haven't met yet), John Matthew, and Tohrment. However, JRW hasn't revealed the order of those last four. Personally, I think that Tohr will be the last of that set.

Michelle, great point about authors being fans of their readers. I've written to a few authors and never get over the giddy joy i feel when they write back. Not sending a form letter but actually addressing my letter on a personal note. *giggle*bounce*

There are also authors (that i won't mention) that i feel totally ignore their fans. And in some cases, i think, are in danger of losing some of those fans because of that disconnect.

s-byte: I hope there's a bit of wait before Ward's next book so that i can catch up!!! :p

i have to agree with you about tohrment book being one of the last ones but i don't think it will end the series. when it comes to him i feel so... well those of us that read the book know what i'm talking about. i don't want to say anything more on him except that i was in TOTAL SHOCK!!!

i can't wait till rehvenge book comes out. he is soooo mysterious to me and good lord the vamp gives me HOT FLASHES. phury has my heart breaking, his is another book that i just CAN'T CAN'T CAN'T wait for.

actually come to think about it i can't wait for any of their books. butch's is suppose to be HOT HOT HOT. v's is going to be great because he find is mate. john's is suppose to hopefully show his transition, even thought i think it will happen before his book comes out and we get do find out the deal with darius and him. payne what can i say except A FEMALE BROTHER, that one is going to be another good book.

JR has all these great books coming out in the future and i'm sitting here drooling for them. *sitting here contiplating* i wonder how i can get a ARC from the WARDen. i wonder if a lot and i mean a lot of cheese would help. *wondering off to do some more schem.... i mean reading some rereading* *snicker*

MK, I won't flame you because you have cut me slack on MANY occasions... :PI agree with you on DARK SECRET. I had to push my way through it and I didn't care for the heroine at all (a first for me). But this is where my OCD comes in handy (I have to finish a series that I start), because DARK DEMON was great. I'm glad I stuck with it.

Personally, I think JR Ward is the most talented vampire author in a long time. She's by far my favorite, and Zsadist has been the character that most intrigued me since the very first book, so this was a long-awaited read for me. And I wasn't disappointed. Zsadist's journey kept me riveted for about six hours straight--I just kept going until I finished, and now I want to read it again. Ward's inventive world, her evil, scary villains, and above all, her heroes, are second to none. The BDB heroes appeal to me because they're such an effective blend of Alpha and total head-over-heels surrender to love.

Also wanted to mention how glad I was to get into Phury's head a little in this book, because he was by the one I felt I had the least handle on. However, Vishous is the story I'm panting for, now that Z is done. PS--I totally knew Wellsie was marked for death from book 1. Poor thing. Still, can't wait to see how Tohr and John deal...

I have to say, Christine Feehan is the one who got me hooked on my latest 4 year binge of paranormal reading. Before that it was Linda Lael Miller's 4 book Vamp series and Lori Herter's vamps. Those were too few and far between and it was like they were the only ones.

There are times that I have said, "Kick his a$$ to the curb, girl and get on with life!" Alpha males just drive me whacky sometimes. And others, they are the greatest thing since sliced cheese. I loved how Bella took charge. She shouted back at Z. She didn't give in to him. She did what had to be done. Sometimes a woman has to do the protecting and saving and I loved that.

I also respected Z's need to protect. And I loved seeing how he's tamed, how he learns to trust and love and open up to others. Yeah, maybe he gets a bit mushy/maudlin, but hey after seeing this absolute stone-cold death machine with no feelings, with only his honor to guide him, I don't think we could see the change any other way. Totally the dif between night and day.

As for the dif between Sherrilyn Kenyon and JR Ward.... they both write about Vampires. That's it. And I think it is just fine and dandy. I love them both. I don't compare. I love the bits of mythology that SK has running thru her books. It has won me some Jeopardy games!!!!!!!!!!! LOL

SPOILER WARNING: STOP READING if you haven't finished the book!!!!!I am still sitting here ticked off as all Hades about Wellsie. I didn't sleep that great last night because I feel like a friend has been murdered out in front of my house!!!! I know authors write what comes, and you can't change it and be true to the story just because you don't like what you see/hear in the story line. I gotta hope and pray that eventually it will all work out in a way I'll like. But I gotta say, Wellsie is my girl. I've loved her from her first appearance in DL.

Tap, I am with you all the way on Wellsie. I knew right that she was probably going to not make it, but the way she went was a shocker. Can't you see Tohr now going after the Omega single handed? He is going to be a force until Ms. Ward does her thing and make this right for him...

MK, you kept saying, "I don't have a good feeling about Wellsie, I don't have a good feeling about Wellsie," and I'm like, "doh!" I so couldn't say anything, even though I'd read it. It was killing me not being up front with you, Bella! You were spot on, no?

But can I say I NEVER expected it? It was a shawkah! Sorta, although I got the NLFTW vibe with the teen girl. (Not Long For This World. It's the kinder, gentler equivalent of TSTL, w/o ignorance on the part of heroine).

Oh, and can say again about writing w/ a smile? Even when we don't dig an author's novel, let's practice our euphemism. We ARE romance lovers after all. :)

Welcome Leah! I'm still not over Baby Brain. I understand my mom so much better these days. :)

Typ0! Know you've been back a while, b ut good to say hi! I think you're gonna dig the Bros, but your bein preached to by the converted today.

Kamie, Hey! I'm finding everything Butch unflippinbelievably hot. Maybe it's the human quotient, but the blood and hanging with the bros during the needing [we've already determined here that I kinda dig, as mk terms it, when heroes take themselves in hand]and the excerpt. Sheesh JR's got the raw eroticism thing down, which is cool cause it's like erotica but you feel the love. Well, then it's not so much erotica, but that's a discussion for another day.

BTW, Ann Herendeen's here next week to talk more bi-sexual romance and Phyllida.

Hey, Tap. Welcome back. With you on the Z and his arc thing. I thought the Happy Ending was kinda cool for him, cause he'd grown in so many ways: he was eating, which, coupled with his whole abuse background, I though so marked his healing. And he was doing it with a Brother, accepting help.

Then, his reaction to Bella's news was sweet. I think many of us romance fans dig that kind of hero reaction to that, because we've seen guys flat like that in real life over that kind of stuff.

I just love how awkward he was around Bella, shy, about the steps he was taking, but he really wanted her to know, which was sweet.

It might have felt childish or infantilized to some readers, but I got the sense he needed to get back some of the youth he didn't understand, that was taken from him.

OK. Too deep. Have I mentioned that I still think the scene from Lover Eternal, when he first has Bella in his room, UATW, is wild and hot and stunning?

Hi all! I wound up reading LA until 1:00 Monday night (night before school started jitters) and haven't been able to pick it up since--especially since 5 is just so dang early in the morning and I like at least six hours sleep. I had already figured Wellsie was on her way out--which I'm absolutely heartbroken over!--so there really wasn't a spoiler there. I can't wait to finish though and will find myself thinking of Z, Phury and Bella when I have a spare moment for thought. That first week of school is a KILLER!!

Michelle - You're right, I should tone it down WRT authors that I've stopped reading. Sorry. I am a lover of romance, and should respect all the hard work that every author puts in. So to anyone I offended, please accept my apologies.

I've got some kind of negative vibe going on, and I'm sorry for airing it here.

Jeez, MK, I was pretty harsh there. I've had the neg thing goin, too. Change of seasons? Sometimes my husband gets the deer-in-headlights look and I can tell I'm going off about something or somebody and I'm just beyond rational. grrrr. Stress.

Anyway, thing is, I erase about 10% of the comments I want to post cause I think they're over the top.

I totally always want to be sarcastic; it's my way. But one of the things I always here from folks about us Bellas is that we always work hard to say things right, to keep the discourse positive.

I also like that authors are willing to come talk to us, so I kinda make us work harder to keep the place level.

Pollyannaish? Yup. And it doesn't mean there aren't authors who's books I'm not crazed for. And sometimes the authors themselves drive me bonkers, but I've gotta say that there've only been a couple who've acted like they were doing me a favor by introducing them to readers. Patience, I told myself, patience. Everybody knows everybody else in the "industry," so don't burn bridges.

Then, there are authors like J.R., Suzanne Brockmann, Eloisa James, and on and on who are unbelievably accessible and fun to work with. And, usually, self-effacing (sp), which is wild. It's also why they're so successful.

And (this is so cool; I was so proud)I recently read on an authors blog what she talked about as a phenomenon of this blog, how the blogger (youz guys) have bonded and taken some ownership in what goes on here. I always brag about how you all welcome new bloggers.

Good point, Cellie. We can add that to some other points made, like the tat of Wellsie's name and what'll happen to it. Will the Scribe Virgin bring her back; etc.

It's true that folks don't usually get offed in romance, but the whole series started with Darius' murder. I really love that about these novels -- they're just so extraordinary in the limits they push. Hooray for that. It's so flippin refreshing.

Let's keep this blog open-ended. Feel free to come back and comment on the novel anytime everybody!