yes thats definantly true except turning your hands over will turn the ball over but it is extremly inconsistant and none of the pros do it

also for the guy who posted this, tiger bows out is left wrist at the top for a draw, and when i was switching to the drw it would stay out right and my mss would be straight, it worked itself out, but be weary of your swing getting to flat, mine did an i had to completely change it

Once again you don't know that to be true or not. Some pros may or may not feel like there hands turn over or not. Unless you asked every pro golfer, please don't claim a generalized feel of what might happen in the golf swing.

Also the hands do turn over. The forearms will rotate about 90 degrees from address to the top of the swing, and rotate about 180 to finish. If you feel this or not is based on the individual golfer.

I know they do turn over buy you want to do it with you body not by flipping the wrists last minute frantically...might I recomend bowing your left wrist at the top

Impact lasts 400 microseconds, so the stuff that is happening after the ball is hit, doesn't effect what the ball is doing. Like what has been said, to draw it, aim the face right of the target and have a path further out to the right.

There are guys that draw from a bowed left wrist, flat left wrist or a cupped left wrist. If anything a bowed left wrist would fit more of a fade pattern because it tends to lay the shaft off.

Quote:

Originally Posted by swalker

Point the club face at address where you want the ball to start and swing right of that to create the draw effect. This will be very helpful. Thank you. I guess I've just always been told draw meant closed club face, fade was open club face. That may explain the 7 years of frustration. LoL

Nick, you'll find that we tend not to talk too much about "feels" per se because they can be very different for people. Quite literally, for example, people might feel the OPPOSITE things for the same move. I've taught many students to stretch and bend properly, and most will feel like their weight stays more on the front side, but a few have said "so I really want to push into the ground on the trail side huh?" (which is what actually happens).

So "feels" are limited in what they can explain because they're different for everyone. Someone who already doesn't roll their wrists over much would have a hard time, for example, feeling that they're doing it less. They could start hitting massive push-slices.

I hope that explains a little of the reaction you've gotten so far. Keep things to the actual mechanics, and if it's a feel, just say that it works for you perhaps.

Anyway, as a related story, we had a good player, PGA Tour caliber, with us here in Erie for the past two weeks. We worked on him not releasing his hands/rolling his wrists more. It turns out his rolling actually sent the path farther left than the face, so the more he did it the more likely he was to hit wipey cuts.

Once again you don't know that to be true or not. Some pros may or may not feel like there hands turn over or not. Unless you asked every pro golfer, please don't claim a generalized feel of what might happen in the golf swing.

Also the hands do turn over. The forearms will rotate about 90 degrees from address to the top of the swing, and rotate about 180 to finish. If you feel this or not is based on the individual golfer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by iacas

Nick, you'll find that we tend not to talk too much about "feels" per se because they can be very different for people. Quite literally, for example, people might feel the OPPOSITE things for the same move. I've taught many students to stretch and bend properly, and most will feel like their weight stays more on the front side, but a few have said "so I really want to push into the ground on the trail side huh?" (which is what actually happens).

So "feels" are limited in what they can explain because they're different for everyone. Someone who already doesn't roll their wrists over much would have a hard time, for example, feeling that they're doing it less. They could start hitting massive push-slices.

I hope that explains a little of the reaction you've gotten so far. Keep things to the actual mechanics, and if it's a feel, just say that it works for you perhaps.

Anyway, as a related story, we had a good player, PGA Tour caliber, with us here in Erie for the past two weeks. We worked on him not releasing his hands/rolling his wrists more. It turns out his rolling actually sent the path farther left than the face, so the more he did it the more likely he was to hit wipey cuts.

Ok I understand if you just want to stick with mechanics then do what Bernard langer does, you aim your feet at the starting line and aim the clubface at the target, then just make a neutral swing

Ok I understand if you just want to stick with mechanics then do what Bernard langer does, you aim your feet at the starting line and aim the clubface at the target, then just make a neutral swing

And since he isn't actually making the draw then he isn't feeling anything so if he picks most of these feels then it will work out, it may not be what you feel but if you tried it you should get the same results,

Hey guys, thanks for all the posts. I tried the face right, path more right approach yesterday evening. It didn't draw but I hit it straighter and quite a bit farther. I noticed when I started with the face what I would call a little open that I didn't pull the ball as much, not sure why? Something clicked while "tinkering" with my swing and I started rotating better and creating lag. I was driving the ball about 280 and hitting pretty good irons. Didn't putt worth a cracker and still shot a 40 on the nine I played. I noticed the longer the iron the more fit I would go, is that due to placement? I played it back in my stance not much different than 8 9 iron.

Hey guys, thanks for all the posts. I tried the face right, path more right approach yesterday evening. It didn't draw but I hit it straighter and quite a bit farther. I noticed when I started with the face what I would call a little open that I didn't pull the ball as much, not sure why? Something clicked while "tinkering" with my swing and I started rotating better and creating lag. I was driving the ball about 280 and hitting pretty good irons. Didn't putt worth a cracker and still shot a 40 on the nine I played. I noticed the longer the iron the more fit I would go, is that due to placement? I played it back in my stance not much different than 8 9 iron.

The longer the club the more you should play it up in your stance. Do to the d plane if you catch it in the back of your stance it will go right... Also I have the same problem of the longer the clubs the less control I have... Just do to the lack of loft

Hey guys, thanks for all the posts. I tried the face right, path more right approach yesterday evening. It didn't draw but I hit it straighter and quite a bit farther. I noticed when I started with the face what I would call a little open that I didn't pull the ball as much, not sure why? Something clicked while "tinkering" with my swing and I started rotating better and creating lag. I was driving the ball about 280 and hitting pretty good irons. Didn't putt worth a cracker and still shot a 40 on the nine I played. I noticed the longer the iron the more fit I would go, is that due to placement? I played it back in my stance not much different than 8 9 iron.

I wouldn't recommend playing a long iron in the back of your stance, unless you're trying to hit a big draw around a tree. The ball didn't pull when you opened the face because it helped the face be less left at impact. Again, ball starts where the face is aimed and curves away from the path.

If the path is further out than the face, then the ball will draw. So if it was a straight shot, the face came pretty close to matching the path.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nick1998bunker

The longer the club the more you should play it up in your stance. Do to the d plane if you catch it in the back of your stance it will go right... Also I have the same problem of the longer the clubs the less control I have... Just do to the lack of loft

It's going right because the face is right, be careful over-estimating things.

Thanks guys. I've always tried to make adjustments during the round when struggling to no avail. I feel like I may have a chance to make the right adjustments now that I know the correct formulas. Wish I would have asked this years ago. Thanks

Thanks for the comments. I take a very strong grip but the loose grip interests me. I grip the club like I'm hanging on for dear life. I'll try that. Is the club head square to your feet while you're swinging "toward 1st base" or is the club head square to the swing path?

Hello, just thought I would point out that when others talk about having a stronger grip they are not talk about grip pressure. They are talking about the position of your left and right wrist.

Your grip pressure should probably be normal, not too tight and not too loose.

Strong grip usually means that when you look down you can see 2.5, 3 knuckles on your left hand and you can barely see 1.5,1 knuckle when it is weak. Then your right hand palm should just be facing the left accordingly. I might not be explaining it well, so just google the difference between a strong and a weak grip and you will get all the info you need.

Just testing this theory out shows that by strengthening the grip I move the ball position back and as a result strike the ball more in-to-out.

If you do not change the amount of pressure on your front let at impact, or drastically adjust your swing to the ball position, moving the ball backwards will put the ball on a more inside swing path. Because the club head travels in a slight arc in front of your body. So moving it back, puts it on the path were the clubhead is more from the inside.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kujan

Is employing a strong grip the best way to close the face relative to the swing path and as a result draw the ball?

Depends on the person. Some players will hit fades with a strong grip, some with a weak grip. For some it might cause the face to close more, some it might not. There are some tendencies, like a strong grip can promote a more inside swing path, but once again its dependent on the golfer.