TSM Episode 328: Fund and Delete

Lusipurr absolutely and certainly did not spend all day editing the podcast only to delete it by accident, and hence this episode features Imitanis and SiliconNooB joining him to comment on Nintendo leaks and the Bloodstained Kickstarter campaign.

@Savante: In the podcast I expressed some concern about that, but some of that discussion was cut off.

Basically: Mighty No. 9 was delayed, but I’m not really upset about that. And in our discussion on the podcast, I said the same thing about Bloodstained. I’d rather them delay it for six months than release it early but without stuff that never gets put in or finished.

For example, CV SotN uses the developer menu, because the actual menu for the game did not get finished before the ship date. This is why there’s no music in the menu, and the sound effects are really loud and a bit jarring. Deadlines meant that the game had to ship before it was completely ‘done’ in this respect, and in other respects also.

But as a player, I would much rather them finish it properly, polish it up, and only then release it. Because, once it is released, it has to stand as it is done (barring what little can be done with patches) forever. Then, we won’t be left wondering what might have been if only they had taken a little extra time. After all, we have forever to play the game once it is released. And, there are plenty of things to play whilst we wait, if a delay is necessary.

I have some doubts that everything on that list can be done inside of two years. I know that Igarashi is a genius, and I know that he knows his business. But there are a lot of things on that list, and some of them are going to require quite a lot of work (especially things based on networking). Consequently, I honestly do not believe it will be out in Spring/Summer 2017. I would expect Winter 2017 at the earliest, and probably more like Spring/Summer 2018. It looks like a three-year project to me, and possibly a bit longer depending on just how big the castle is (all we know is that it will be the biggest that he has ever designed, and that’s before extra stretch-goal areas are factored into consideration).

I was very surprised Pillars of Eternity was released when it was, despite being delayed. Granted, lots of bugs, some game breaking, that needed a month+ of fixing. A lot of people were sour about the game being delayed, but what did they expect? The stretch goals were monumental, well outside the original scope of the game and the original release date the developers had planned for.

But I would argue that Bloodstained isn’t quite as complicated a game as Pillars or a massive CRPG. Maybe I’m wrong? Would love to hear your thoughts. I don’t think, even with the stretch goals, the game will take that long to come out. I do support taking however long it takes to get it right though.

@Savante: Certainly there are some things that are a lot easier in building an IGAvania title as opposed to a massive CRPG: far less work in balancing, for one. And worldbuilding tends to be much easier as well. Of course, there are technical concerns: the nature of such platformers is based on preventing the player from getting to certain areas until various objectives are met in a particular order. Naturally players try inventive things to get around this, and it can be difficult to try and outwit a userbase of millions of people.

My skepticism about the two year timeframe is something which is perhaps based on my own observations about the industry over a long period of time, and my own recognition of the amount of work necessary to produce what often appear to be fairly straightforward things. I am working on my dissertation right now. When it is complete, it will be at least 250pp. in length, and perhaps longer (probably so, given my penchant for writing in an assiduously clear and consequently prolix way). 250pp. does not sound like very much, given that I routinely churn out perfectly serviceable 40pp. papers in a few days. But of course this is work that has to be far, far more than serviceable: it has to be completely new and unique, it has to be significant, it cannot have evident weaknesses, it cannot leave things unaddressed, it must be based upon a truly comprehensive examination of the field, and so on and so forth. This is, I think, similar to many of the expectations which we have of IGA et al.

The upshot is that it will probably take me a year to write it to the specifications demanded, perhaps a bit longer. And even that would be very fast–it usually takes people much longer.

So when I think about video games and my (admittedly rudimentary) knowledge of development, and of the highest standards that are being expected in this particular case, and of the sheer size of the endeavour in terms of world design, music, scripting, translation, localisation, game system creation, art work, monster design and AI, stretch goals, and everything else–well, it seems a truly herculean task. What is being requested is, quite simply, the largest and most feature-packed IGAvania game in history, and by a considerable margin. The result will be a game probably an order of magnitude larger than Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, with more features than every CV game ever made combined.

That’s a lot of work. And two years is a really, really short amount of time. This site has been around for six years. Six! If they can make one of these in two years, that would mean we could have seen three in the time since we launched in February 2009. To me, that seems simply unbelieveable.

But, of course, I would love to be proved wrong. I want this game YESTERDAY. The sooner it comes out the better, provided that they release it only when it is well and truly done and polished to perfection. Then, it will truly stand as the undisputed pinnacle, and become the standard against which every other title in the genre is measured.