McCain proposed that the United States expel Russia from the G8, the group of advanced industrial countries. Moscow was included in this body in the 1990s to recognize and reward it for peacefully ending the cold war on Western terms, dismantling the Soviet empire and withdrawing from large chunks of the old Russian Empire as well. McCain also proposed that the United States should expand the G8 by taking in India and Brazil—but pointedly excluded China from the councils of power.

You know, St. McCain might have a point. The war on Islamoliberalfascismterror has just become this huge drag. The Taliban are stronger than ever. Afghanistan’s a mess. Bin Laden’s still farting in our general direction. And after 5 years, we’re still winning losing in Iraq. Bo-ring.

So why not just wash our hands of that mess and go all retro with a little Red Dawn action?

What McCain has announced is momentous—that the United States should adopt a policy of active exclusion and hostility toward two major global powers. It would reverse a decades-old bipartisan American policy of integrating these two countries into the global order, a policy that began under Richard Nixon (with Beijing) and continued under Ronald Reagan (with Moscow). It is a policy that would alienate many countries in Europe and Asia who would see it as an attempt by Washington to begin a new cold war.

So?

The single most important security problem that the United States faces is securing loose nuclear materials. A terrorist group can pose an existential threat to the global order only by getting hold of such material. We also have an interest in stopping proliferation, particularly by rogue regimes like Iran and North Korea. To achieve both of these core objectives—which would make American safe and the world more secure—we need Russian cooperation. How fulsome is that likely to be if we gratuitously initiate hostilities with Moscow?

184 Responses
to “100-Years McCain Wants To Kick Russia Out Of The G8, Reboot Cold War”

McCain could have done some real damage to the US/Russia relationship if he had won the nomination and been elected in 2000. Now I think the balance of power has shifted, we need the oil and gas too much to bully them around anymore.

There is a great line in Arturo Perez-Reverte’s El Sol de Breda about the Spanish experience in the Netherlands in the early 17th century that encapsulates our occupation of Iraq: . . . se iba perdiendo, y nunca se acababa de perder, hasta que al cabo se perdió.

It continued to be lost and never finished being lost until in the end it was lost.

And the Vapid Vapors Media will jump right on this story…right after they finish stonewalling PBS about why they had the propaganda generals on their shows and right after they run out of steam on the search-and-destroy push-polling about Rev. Wright and….

I have to say, this ranks right up there with McCain’s “send Bill Kristol to negotiate peace with the Israelis and Palestinians as the US’s honest broker” idea. Because the marriage of neocons and foreign policy hasn’t been bad enough…

So why not just wash our hands of that mess and go all retro with a little Red Dawn action?
I love the smell of fabulous snark in the morning.
Ain’t it da truff!
And, um, since Rumsfeld didn’t stragerize correct for the middle east kinda war, we could take advantage of what he did plan for.
Is this me? I never talk like that. Must be all those Tom Clancy novels I’ve read. *g*

I said he didn’t have enuf IQ to graduate from high school. I presume the ones you’re talking about would have been smart enough but didn’t graduate from other reasons. In either event though, I doubt that they would consider running for U.S. prez. We’re not just talking about a friend here.

This seems a pretty smart move by McCain, assuming that the goal is getting elected.

Americans don’t like being told what to do. We don’t like being told by Europeans who to vote for. The idea of expelling Russia from the G8 will enrage and terrify Europeans who will, logically, argue against his election. Ergo, Americans will be more likely to vote for him.

I think there are a battery of reasons that he refuses to release his medical records. I’m for privacy and all but when your of advanced years running for what is the most stressful job in the world, I would like to know that you are physically capable of dealing with the stresses of the job. given mccain’s temper and ‘forgetfulness’, i’m passed worried

I’m getting to the point that discussing McCain in anything resembling an intelligent manner is impossible. The man is just f***ing batshit crazy. Clinton, however, thinks he would make a better CinC than Obama. Go figure.

Digg for You BT…. Great Post! Here is another reason to vote Democratic…. Just add it to the list as to why the rethuglians must be buried in this falls elections With leadership like this it is no wonder the people have lost their trust in the party of Lincoln!!

I think your on to something there. His reference to many things is in the context of that time, well actually war and military period. it has defined who he is (rather he defines himself through it) and has never moved passed John McCain the POW to John McCain who was held as a POW but is blah blah blah.

I was born and raised after the Vietnam war, so while I have a respect for those that fought in the war, it has no bearing or importance as to how I see him. (hope that makes sense)

From a quick and dirty search on the innertubes, I see that 215 things can cause hand tremors, including Parkinson’s Disease, alcoholism, MS, brain tumors and seizure disorders. Given what we already know about his medical history, in terms of drinking and boxing, I’d say we have a whole lot to be worried about in terms of his being either physically, psychologically, or mentally being able to do the job. We won’t discuss how important the choice of vice president might be given this situation. But those shaky hands worry me a whole bunch.

This pack of thieves, pederasts and war criminals is not the party of Lincoln.

We are in real trouble when folks can say that and people like Barry, who are abysmally ignorant of recent American History, can came so close to being in the W.H. Fortunately the people are waking up to the fact that with Barry you get McSame, see latest polling, whereas with Clinton you will get payback.

In August of 1968, a program of severe torture began on McCain, at the same time as he was suffering from dysentery,[41][36] and McCain made an anti-American propaganda “confession”.[36] He has always felt that his statement was dishonorable,[48] but as he would later write, “I had learned what we all learned over there: Every man has his breaking point. I had reached mine.”[41] His injuries left him permanently incapable of raising his arms above his head.[ His hands are attached to his arms. They fucked him up badly.

As the Bush presidency staggers to an end, it’s hard to say who has less to brag about: the president or the journalists who cover him. So it’s fitting that the last White House Correspondents’ Association dinner of the Bush era — the ultimate celebration of chumminess between the most powerful people in the world and those who are supposed to hold them accountable — was a dispiriting, mostly humorless affair.

It’s almost as if McCain wants to recreate the world he knew before he went to Vietnam…he said recently in a speech that the people who returned from WWII built a better nation than we have today….you know, like when blacks were segregated..the world was on the verge of nuclear annihilation…Leave it to Beaver was on…hippies were just little kids and hadn’t protested yet…and TV was in black and white….and there was no such thing as computers, email, fax machines, the web, the bloggers…and he was a much, much younger man.

Separately, another Rasmussen poll finds that Republicans are growing more confident about taking on Obama this fall — only 37% think he’d be the tougher opponent, down sharply from 54% earlier this month. Thirty-five percent of GOPers think she’d be the tougher foe, up from 20%.

Thanks Bill and Hill! We’ll all joyously turn to you to save us! We love being on the Bush-Clinton-Bush-Clinton treadmill while you all get richer and richer.

ooo, thanks for the reminder – yep – that would do it. There is an injury caused by damage done to the nerve in the armpit – it’s called brachial plexus palsy. Most of the time, it’s caused by babies being delivered by pulling on the arms or a child being yanked by the arm by an adult – but perhaps we’ve got something here.

Afternoon, all-
Great post, but I hated reading it. As someone who has respected McCain even while vehemently disagreeing with him, this really makes me worry…especially since I’m not at all convinced that he is going to lose in November.
Maybe he just figures that the US-Russia-China conflict is inevitable, so the sooner we get on with it, the better.

OT, but RonD, I saw your comment the other day about WMNF but I think my response was EPU’d. Just wanted you to know that Richard from Gulfport totally agrees with you. Been a supporter for many years. Member of the 1000/1000 Club, Circle of Friends, volunteer, the whole ball of wax. Best little radio station on the planet. Peace, brother.

Reminds me of Ronny’s annual exam, where they were always so careful to say that he was in ‘excellent physical shape’. I always wanted to ask them, pin them down until they answered, about his mental state.

Sometimes what they won’t say is more important that what they do say.

Don’t worry about any a the bullshit polls comin outta the corporate media, we might reach a point where BOTH Obama and Mrs. McClinton ken beat McCrazy but after Rev. Wright got done with the US press corps this mornin’ and took out the McClintons at the NAACP yesterday…well, I gotta think Mrs. Clinton’s only chance ta be on a ticket this fall is with McCrazy.

KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE AMMUNITION, WE DON’T NEED NO MORE STINKIN’ FASCISTS!!

DANG! We just spent the past 7 1/2 yrs following Tom Clancy’s wildest fantasy games as the basis of furrin policy. NO. MORE! N.O.!!!

I want Stent. McSame in his proper place pronto, before he does any more damage.
To wit: In a rocking chair on a porch – pick a mansion, any one of the 8. makee no difference. Just NOT the Nation’s Mansion. ENOUGH!

The next war will be of our own making, like the current ones. As in blowback (as in OBL) or in unprovoked aggression (as in Iraq). Iran’s clearly on W’s list. I’ve been trying to figure out what form the blowback will take.

If the Republics run out of steam with the turrists, they can always go back to the gays. They still want to get married and that can’t be allowed!

It’s suprising that during all those years of total power, the Republics didn’t ban gay marriage or catch Osama. I guess it’s more beneficial to them to use those issues election after election rather than ’solve’ them. Too bad that their voters don’t seem to notice.

He also must show he can think and speak fluently about the domestic issues that are gripping the country. Picture him debating either Democrat about health care, the mortgage crisis, stagnant middle-class wages, rice rationing at Costco. It’s not pretty.

Wow, Christy, I read your original post back when posted, but somehow skimmed too much toward the end I guess, because I missed the suggestion about sending Bill Kristol to negotiate Israeli-Palestinian issues!!!

McCain’s mental infirmity is such we may to begin being decidedly un-shrill about it, in hopes of getting it noticed and taken seriously.

The Republican Party has always tried to project the image of the warrior class. After the end of the Cold War Era they were floundering for a new cause. Along came 9/11 and they were reborn. A new excuse to rape and pillage the national coffers and maintain power. Perhaps McCain thinks the Middle East has lost it’s luster to the American public and they’re planning on reserecting the good old stand by boogie man. Those nasty Russians!

Radiation and/or chemotherapy for third (or second?) recurrance of malignant melanoma of the head and neck.

Until Sen McCain authorizes release of his full medical record to the public – not just one or two hand-picked docs working with MSM – we have no way of knowing what might be causing tremor in a candidate for Chief Executive nearing his ninth decade of life.

Peripheral nervous system disorder (brachial nerve injury)…

vs.

Central nervous system disorder (brain injury / injuries)?

Only his doctors can say for sure – by full release of all of his medical records.

Some possibilities:
The Kosovo Liberation Army provoking a wider war in the Balkans, possibly drawing in Russia on the side of the Serbs; some unifying effort between the Pakistanis, the Chechens, the Taliban, and the Bosnians; the Iraqi Kurds declaring independence.

Thanks Ron.
And, before Adie’s comment, I hadn’t realized that our entire foreign policy was his fault.
I can’t stay with all depressing all the time. Sometimes I enjoy reading fiction for a diversion.

In recent years the United States has focused most of its attention on military action in Iraq and Afghanistan and on thwarting terrorists around the globe. These are important projects. But the world remains awash with poorly controlled nuclear, chemical and biological weapons and materials. To be sure, there has been important progress with regard to securing weapons and related material in the former Soviet Union: under the 15-year-old Nunn-Lugar program, for instance, 7,000 nuclear warheads have been deactivated and hundreds of ballistic missiles dismantled.

These problems can’t be unilaterally solved by the United States. Presidents Bush and Putin should lay the foundations for a solution together. But achieving one will require commitment from their successors. Proliferation has already moved onto the U.S. public’s agenda. A president who acts boldly on these initiatives will have the people’s support— and will make the world a safer place.

In recent years the United States has focused most of its attention on military action in Iraq and Afghanistan and on thwarting terrorists around the globe. These are important projects. But the world remains awash with poorly controlled nuclear, chemical and biological weapons and materials. To be sure, there has been important progress with regard to securing weapons and related material in the former Soviet Union: under the 15-year-old Nunn-Lugar program, for instance, 7,000 nuclear warheads have been deactivated and hundreds of ballistic missiles dismantled.

These problems can’t be unilaterally solved by the United States. Presidents Bush and Putin should lay the foundations for a solution together. But achieving one will require commitment from their successors. Proliferation has already moved onto the U.S. public’s agenda. A president who acts boldly on these initiatives will have the people’s support— and will make the world a safer place.

Lugar is famous for, “Letters To The Next President.”

Lugar effectively ties in Russia’s need and the US’s need to remain compliant with past treaties and inspections.

The next president should also help establish an international nuclear-fuel bank in order to discourage the proliferation of uranium-enrichment plants (facilities that can be used to make reactor fuel or bombs). A fuel bank would help close the loophole in the nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty—which allows civilian enrichment—that Iran is trying to exploit. The United States should convince other countries that they need not build their own enrichment capabilities; they can get fuel instead at reasonable prices from the uranium fuel bank, all under the control of the International Atomic Energy Agency.

Finally, important work remains to be done in Russia. The United States and Russia have worked well together under the Nunn-Lugar program. But vast stocks of weapons and materials remain unsecured and undisclosed. For instance, Russia has so far refused even to discuss its tactical nuclear weapons, which are particularly terrorist-friendly because they are portable and usually stored close to potential flash points. Moscow also won’t open to inspection four of its former military bioweapons labs, and bureaucratic roadblocks continue to thwart plans to dispose of 34 metric tons of dangerous, long-lived plutonium.

Lugar gives a working solution to those ME and Asian nations stating they have a right to develop Nuclear energy. He does not say “NO!” He gives a working global solution and imparts the need for the US and Russia to take the lead to the formation of fuel bank which would safely track what “kind of fuel is being developed.

Now these run today:

BEIJING — China and North Korea pledged Monday to work together to kick-start stalled six-nation talks on the North’s nuclear program, China’s state news agency said

Today, news reports state China to “work with North Korea through diplomatic channels…Russia to work with Iran through diplomatic channels… And last week, we deliver the non-diplomatic news presentation. Wow. Last month McCain suggests expulsion of Russia from the G-8. Goodness.

I think Lugar and Nunn were sending messages to multiple people within the beltway.

Ah! ok…China gets tired of being publicly disrespected, and dumps their UD debt as a prelude to invading Taiwan. We’re too busy with the depression here to worry about Taiwan…I know you’re an economist…is the idea of China striking us through our debt unrealistic?

There might be circumstances under which China might dump U.S. treasuries, but they wouldn’t do it deliberately & voluntarily. They would be big losers if they did. Like Donald Trump, the U.S. is too big to fail. Big borrowers own the bank.

China won’t have to attack the US. Within the next ten years they’ll own all of it! They wouldn’t want to destroy us. They’d just have to spend all the money we’ve shipped over there to rebuild it. They’re shrewder business people than that.

At the moment, it looks as if the Chinese are pretty busy with trying to eliminate any non-Han Chinese peoples. There was an article in the CS Monitor this morning about what they are doing to the Uighers, a Muslim minority.http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/20…..3b3K2s0NUE

So it sounds like, unless they decided they were never going to be repaid, or repaid in money so devalued that it amounts to the same thing, we should be safe, at least from that particular event…or unless they feared we might intervene in a move on Taiwan. Cool. I’ll cross that one off the list.
Thanks,eCAHN!

This is sort of on-topic, as a foreign policy matter. I was disappointed to see Obama interview with FOX, and really disheartened when I heard FOX news (I keep FOX local news on in the evening before bedtime, don’t ask why) offer a snippet quoting Obama saying “he’d be stupid…not to listen to Petraeus”. So I was pleased to read what Obama said in its entirety:

WALLACE: I want to ask you about presidents and listening to generals. Petraeus, I don’t have to tell you, is the architect of the troop surge, a strong advocate of our continued engagement in Iraq. If you become commander-in-chief and he says your plan to get out of Iraq is a mistake, will you replace him?

OBAMA: I will listen to General Petraeus, given the experience that he has accumulated over the last several years. It would be stupid of me to ignore what he has to say.

But it is my job as president, it would be my job as commander in chief to set the mission. To make the strategic decisions in light of the problems that we’re having in Afghanistan, in light of the problems that we are having in Pakistan, the fact that al Qaeda is strengthening as our National Intelligence Estimates have indicated since 2001.

And so we’ve got a whole host of tasks and I’ve also got to worry about the fact that the military has no strategic reserve right now. If we had an emergency in the Korean Peninsula, if we had an emergency elsewhere in the world, we don’t have the troops right now to deal with it. And that’s not my opinion, that’s –

WALLACE: So would you replace him or would you just say, I’m the commander-in-chief, here’s my order.

OBAMA: What I would do is say — what I will do is say we have a new mission. It is my strategic assessment that we have to provide a timetable to the Iraqi government. I want you to tell me how best to execute this new assignment and I am happy to listen to the tactical considerations and any ideas you have.

But what I will not do is continue to let the Iraqi government off the hook and allow them to put our foreign policy on ice while they dither about making decisions about how they are going to cooperate with each other.

* Scratch awl, a tool with a long pointed spike used for marking wood.
* Stitching awl, a tool used by leatherworkers, such as cobblers (shoemakers), to pierce holes in leather.
* Bradawl, a tool for making holes in wood.

“McCain appears to think that he can magically unite the two main strands in the Republican foreign-policy establishment. But he can’t. This is not about personalities but about two philosophically divergent views of international affairs. Put together, they will produce infighting and incoherence. We have seen this movie before. We have watched an American president unable to choose between his ideologically driven vice president and his pragmatic secretary of State—and the result was the catastrophe of George W. Bush’s first term. Twenty-five years earlier, we watched another president who believed that he could encompass the entire spectrum of foreign policy. He, too, gave speeches that were drafted by advisers with divergent world views: in that case, Cyrus Vance and Zbigniew Brzezinski. It led to the paralyzing internal battles of the Carter years. Does John McCain want to try this experiment one more time?”

The reason why I’m pondering blowback is because after the fact it was so obvious that anti-communism via proxy wars created the global terrorists. I made my living as an econommic forecaster. I’d like to carry my skill over to foreign policy. If the last one was so obvious after the fact, it was probably forecastable. And maybe the next one will be too. But perhaps there are so many possibilities a priori (as your suggestions illustrate), that chossing the one that will actually happen is possible only by luck. On one specific Q (WMDs in Iraq), I got the forecast right. But that was a true or false Q, not a multiple choice Q.

I’ve always thought that the conservative obsession with Red Dawn was a little misplaced. Now it’s true that I had to sneak into the theater the last time I saw the movie (because I was underage), but it did make quite an impression on me. What I remember is: First, it was an insurgency against an invading/occupying power making preemptive war (sound familiar?) In no way did I, even at age 15, think that it justified vast imperial adventures (the second amendment – yes, preemptive war – no). Second, almost all of them (the American high-school insurgents) died, and died ugly. Sure, there were a few scenes in which the “Wolverines” pull off some stunning tactical victories, but taken as a whole, I saw it as a rather sobering film.