I'm also asking this because I believe these sort of things should be standardized. It'd be awkward to see a mix of the two on the wiki's articles, and then that would lead to the question of which type of screenshot is "correct". Since people may use different emulators (VBA & VBA-M use the raw RGB values by default, BGB uses the real GBC colors by default, Gambatte by default looks different than all three, etc.), it's important that the desired look is established.

...that would lead to the question of which type of screenshot is "correct". Since people may use different emulators (VBA & VBA-M use the raw RGB values by default, BGB uses the real GBC colors by default, Gambatte by default looks different than all three, etc.), it's important that the desired look is established.

Don't forget that people will also be doing these glitches on the actual hardware as well- not all of us are emulating.

Personally, I say that the "real GBC" option is best, as it's what the actual hardware uses, and thus is the option that has the most claim to being "correct". But that's just me.

...that would lead to the question of which type of screenshot is "correct". Since people may use different emulators (VBA & VBA-M use the raw RGB values by default, BGB uses the real GBC colors by default, Gambatte by default looks different than all three, etc.), it's important that the desired look is established.

Don't forget that people will also be doing these glitches on the actual hardware as well- not all of us are emulating.

Personally, I say that the "real GBC" option is best, as it's what the actual hardware uses, and thus is the option that has the most claim to being "correct". But that's just me.

Personally I would say that just because the real hardware displays washed out colours doesn't mean it's "correct", it's just accurate to the real hardware, which is "incorrect". Consider that IIRC Super Game Boy and Pokemon Stadium's GB Tower don't have washed out colours, unless I'm wrong, in which case disregard everything I just said.

Pulling all that aside (or is it putting?) and just considering both pictures as being original with no "real hardware" to be "correct" towards (like if you were showing me 2 pictures of a pretentious retraux indie game you were making), I think the left picture looks "better" anyway, because the colours look more "natural" because Game Freak designed their games to look "good" on a washed out LCD screen and the right one looks like someone opened an image editor and fucked with the saturation slider.

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I need a new siggy, because this siggy is shitty... shittiggy... shiggy.... something.

Personally I would say that just because the real hardware displays washed out colours doesn't mean it's "correct", it's just accurate to the real hardware, which is "incorrect". Consider that IIRC Super Game Boy and Pokemon Stadium's GB Tower don't have washed out colours, unless I'm wrong, in which case disregard everything I just said.

The backlit GBA SP (model AGS-101) also displays bright colors. The washed-out colors are only a limitation of the frontlit LCDs used in the earlier systems. In fact, the GBA displays different washed-out colors than the GBC, as Martin Korth complained in the Pan Docs:

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Even though GBA is described to be compatible to CGB games, most CGB games are completely unplayable on GBAs because most colors are invisible (black). Of course, colors such like Black and White will appear the same on both CGB and GBA, but medium intensities are arranged completely different.Intensities in range 00h..0Fh are invisible/black (unless eventually under best sunlight circumstances, and when gazing at the screen under obscure viewing angles), unfortunately, these intensities are regulary used by most existing CGB games for medium and darker colors.Newer CGB games may avoid this effect by changing palette data when detecting GBA hardware. A relative simple method would be using the formula GBA=CGB/2+10h for each R,G,B intensity, probably the result won't be perfect, and (once colors became visible) it may turn out that the color mixing is different also, anyways, it'd be still ways better than no conversion.Asides, this translation method should have been VERY easy to implement in GBA hardware directly, even though Nintendo obviously failed to do so. How did they say, This seal is your assurance for excellence in workmanship and so on?

As far as I’m aware, Nintendo has never used any color correction for GBC games, even for the Virtual Console. But if they have, that would be interesting and more convincing than whatever BGB does.

The backlit GBA SP (model AGS-101) also displays bright colors. The washed-out colors are only a limitation of the frontlit LCDs used in the earlier systems.

If it's not too trouble, can somebody use a camera to take a both a GBA AGS-001 and GBA AGS-101 screenshot of that spot in Pokémon Crystal please?

I agree with Lunamann that we should use something closer to original hardware, but I am not sure of what the colours on a AGS-001 and AGS-101 Game Boy Advance look like. I agree with Zowayix that the left picture looks better (though I think whether it is 'better' or not is subjective). Let's vote here.

« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 02:37:59 pm by Torchickens »

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Hi!

I'm Evie.

I'm a transgender person, but any pronouns are fine. She/her preferred.

Unfortunately due to legal concerns I won't be using emulators and unauthorised copies of ROMs anymore, just real hardware with official cartridges and a cheating device (Xploder) to aid research, sorry.

Online I most often use the username Torchickens or Chickasaurus.

Ah.. koucha ga oishii ♪

Thanks Aeriixion for the cute sprite above! Roelof also made different variations of the sprite (which I animated).

Contact:If you like, please contact me by private message here on the forums as I no longer check other places very often.

To love yourself is to believe in yourself, respect yourself, but to make allowances for weakness. If you do the same with others in need (believing in them), in keeping an open mind and being modest, then it will not only help each other but can make life more meaningful. The heart though, has no script, and true wisdom may not exist; often ignorance can give us bliss and the darker times enlighten us later on.

Personally I would say that just because the real hardware displays washed out colours doesn't mean it's "correct", it's just accurate to the real hardware, which is "incorrect". Consider that IIRC Super Game Boy and Pokemon Stadium's GB Tower don't have washed out colours, unless I'm wrong, in which case disregard everything I just said.

The backlit GBA SP (model AGS-101) also displays bright colors. The washed-out colors are only a limitation of the frontlit LCDs used in the earlier systems. In fact, the GBA displays different washed-out colors than the GBC, as Martin Korth complained in the Pan Docs.

As far as I’m aware, Nintendo has never used any color correction for GBC games, even for the Virtual Console. But if they have, that would be interesting and more convincing than whatever BGB does.

BGB seems to be accurate about this, though. IIRC, its default setting replicates a real GBC faithfully but I only played these games on a friend's GBC years ago (I only have the original GB and the original GBA).

Thanks for telling me! I got rid of there being a second copy of the pictures now.

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Hi!

I'm Evie.

I'm a transgender person, but any pronouns are fine. She/her preferred.

Unfortunately due to legal concerns I won't be using emulators and unauthorised copies of ROMs anymore, just real hardware with official cartridges and a cheating device (Xploder) to aid research, sorry.

Online I most often use the username Torchickens or Chickasaurus.

Ah.. koucha ga oishii ♪

Thanks Aeriixion for the cute sprite above! Roelof also made different variations of the sprite (which I animated).

Contact:If you like, please contact me by private message here on the forums as I no longer check other places very often.

To love yourself is to believe in yourself, respect yourself, but to make allowances for weakness. If you do the same with others in need (believing in them), in keeping an open mind and being modest, then it will not only help each other but can make life more meaningful. The heart though, has no script, and true wisdom may not exist; often ignorance can give us bliss and the darker times enlighten us later on.

The AGS-101 is on the lower of its two brightness settings. I didn’t do the Goldenrod screenshot, because I’d need to load a different save file onto my Silver cartridge that hasn’t been played since I replaced the battery, and reset the clock on all three games to daytime. The player’s bedroom has a similar range of colors anyway. Here are matching BGB screenshots:

The AGS-101 colors are actually even more saturated than they appear in the photo (especially the blue of the TV). My impression is that the bright reds and blues look similar to the pure RGB values on my computer screen, but that the golds/browns of Goldenrod roofs and the bedroom floor are closer to the BGB or Gambatte colors. (But in the photo, it seems to be the other way around!) Adjusting the color settings in BGB to color 1.00 and gamma 1.30 brings it closer to the AGS-101, but the blue is still too pale. Aesthetically, I think that adjustment looks a bit better than either the raw RGB values or the washed-out BGB default.

I was curious how the colors were rendered in promotional screenshots, so I had a look around at the various official Web sites. The screenshots on the nintendo.co.jp page generally have an odd yellowish tint, but it varies between images (compare the white areas of this and this). The animated GIF in the top-right corner has a pure white background with fairly pale (BGB-like?) colors. Screenshots on the archived nintendo.com page, one of which is still in use on pokemon.com, match the pure RGB values. The screenshot on pokemon.co.jp actually appears to have been taken in an emulator (but it’s slightly gray, becaues the GBC’s 0–31 color values have simply been multiplied by 8 to a 0–248 range, rather than scaled to a 0–255 range).

If matching “original hardware” is the goal, then I would argue that the Super Game Boy is original hardware for Gold and Silver, and Stadium 2 is original hardware for Crystal. The Generation I screenshots already use SGB colors (though admittedly the alternatives in that case aren’t great). Using the SGB/Stadium 2–style pure RGB values is simpler than matching the colors of the other original hardware, and will also make Generation II screenshots consistent with Generation I and at least some official screenshots. It would also probably avert the need for a Project “Littleroot Town” and so on…

I appreciate how you went to look at how the screenshots look like on official web pages too.

Logged

Hi!

I'm Evie.

I'm a transgender person, but any pronouns are fine. She/her preferred.

Unfortunately due to legal concerns I won't be using emulators and unauthorised copies of ROMs anymore, just real hardware with official cartridges and a cheating device (Xploder) to aid research, sorry.

Online I most often use the username Torchickens or Chickasaurus.

Ah.. koucha ga oishii ♪

Thanks Aeriixion for the cute sprite above! Roelof also made different variations of the sprite (which I animated).

Contact:If you like, please contact me by private message here on the forums as I no longer check other places very often.

To love yourself is to believe in yourself, respect yourself, but to make allowances for weakness. If you do the same with others in need (believing in them), in keeping an open mind and being modest, then it will not only help each other but can make life more meaningful. The heart though, has no script, and true wisdom may not exist; often ignorance can give us bliss and the darker times enlighten us later on.

Here's the equivalent of the OP pic in Gambatte. Enabling "GBA CGB Mode" doesn't seem to affect the outcome in Pokémon Crystal.

“GBA CGB mode” is not directly related to palettes. The GBA (in GBC mode) and the GBC initialize the CPU registers differently, in a way that’s detectable by software, and some games make use of this. The classic example is Zelda Oracles, which each have a door that only opens when played on a GBA (and yes, they adjust palettes too).