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I guess I am lucky I could never see the appeal of WoW. Only ever really played one MMO: Ragnarok Online and pretty much quit a long time ago.

My main problem with modern MMOs, apart from them basicaly replicating work in a fantasy environment, is the design. Pretty much all of them are 3D games these days, and with a couple of exceptions the engines are designed to run even on rather weak rigs. Add to that the generic "fantasy" art style and I just can't look at the screen.

I would love to play a game with an art style similar to say Saga Frontier 2 from the old PSX. I guess it's not going to happen though. Yeah, it might be a bit petty argument, but if you are going to spend 500 hours of your life staring at a game then might as well enjoy the art style

The new content in the "old world" is absolutely fantastic. There are much more quests to play through and it eliminates the grind that made running up to 80 so boring.

I'm a long term (4 years) casual player, and I only got my first level 80 last week, so with characters in a slew of levels between 20 and 72 playing the same stuff over and over was getting a little dry, and there were wasted zones you just didn't bother to visit at all (mainly azshara).

The only downside for me is that due to the nature of how I play irregularly, my characters are full of rested experience and they end up over-level in the content - especially if you wish to "complete" the zone as the achievements encourage you to do so - meaning it can sometimes just be a bit of a pew-pew session going through green quests and monsters. When their XP drops too low it does cause equilibrium eventually however, as they stop giving you any at all until you overtake again.

What they did to the quests and progressions has been needed for a long, long time, and I'm glad its here to be honest.

I was looking forwards to it, but after some friends blasted throu' to 85 I haven't got that far yet, sorta got bored questing at level 83. Instead I played an ALT from level 1, the "New" old world stuff is great and well thought out. Like when you enter instances the quests (givers) for the instance are standing just inside. Makes it less of a pain in the butt to hunt them down. The many new flight points making travelling less time consuming and the best bit.. Not having to return to the quest giver when doing quest chains (the new quest pops up on the right of your screen). Some of the models (Yeti Lord outside the Yeti caves) look fantasic and the zones being redone make it well worth levelling an ALT.

However, the shock comes at level 60 when you are shipped off to the outlands. This is still proper old wow style.Suddenly you have to find them quests for the instances, quest chains no longer pop up, so you go do quest 1, then return, hand in, get quest 2, return, hand in, get quest 3. Aggghh!!. Levelling becomes a chore again. :( The difference between outlands and the *new* old world is glaring; hopefully blizzard will tweak outlands to be more player friendly.

Oh it also appears that Silvermoon City and that island is still a zone you are unable to fly in.

The business model of Blizzard is the same as a drugs dealer's. Make people spend money and when they think of stopping they start thinking of all the money they spent and then they keep on spending.
In my opinion it's a vicous circle.

Originally Posted by cgthomasThe business model of Blizzard is the same as a drugs dealer's. Make people spend money and when they think of stopping they start thinking of all the money they spent and then they keep on spending.
In my opinion it's a vicous circle.

For that reason I'm out

Really, get over yourself. You must have had a very sheltered life to believe that.

I've played WoW since the USA beta, and had an enjoyable time doing so. This latest expansion is a distinct improvement over WotLK.
The 80 to 85 journey can be over fast or slow. I got my main to 85 inside 24 hours, but am taking my time with an alt. At 85 there is a lot to do. Heroic dungeons pose a proper challenge, with players being asked to play their classes over zerging; the new Heroic's are great fun. I am also enjoying the raiding content. I raid a casual 3 days a week. The bosses I've tried in the 3 new raid instances have been entertaining and original. Blizzard's attention to detail is everywhere, and the revamp of the old World is really quite something.
The game is not without problems, such as PvE dps class balance (hunters are too strong), and also attacker / defender balance in the new PvP zone, Tol Barad.
Overall I think Cataclysm is quality stuff. The game seems to work on so many levels, that unless you are completely miserable in real life, Cataclysm is hard not to enjoy.

I have contemplated playing WoW but never got further than thinking about of it due to the on-going cost. I played the paper version of D&D at school and college, and have played games such as Baldurs Gate 1&2, NeverWinter nights, Dragon Age etc and loved them. I then thought I would try out Guild Wars as it was on offer at Steam, but really didnt get on with it as it just looked pants after playing Dragon Age.

Is WoW as good as Dragon Age etc for a newbie, or should I stick to single player RPGs?

I am from the same position as gcebbyuk... I have been tempted by WoW several times before, but not taken the plunge due to concerns the ongoing subscription costs not justifying the gaming experience long term, and whether you would need to play the game for a couple of hours per day every day in order to see the best of it (something that just isnt possible when you're an adult with a job, kids that dont live you with and things that unfortunately must be done away from a pc screen!

I work 5 days a week, and spend most nights with the Mrs. so my playtime isn't all that much, but I'll happily pay for the subscription fees. It is possible to do a 10 day trial free of charge, PM me if you want a referall, I'm sure I could help you guys out :)

After many years playing I quit after Lich King, went back for Cata but only find myself playing casually now. For me even though all of the changes are an improvement - it is still the same game, the same grind at end game and ultimately the cosmetic changes don't change that experience.

I guess for me the concept has run its course and become a little too much of the same over and over.

Originally Posted by Ph4ZeDQuite nice to see the positive review, I've often felt like Bit-Tech has an endless stream of hate for all Blizzard games.

But nobody hates blizzard since rock'n'roll racing!

I never played WoW myself, but i was told you can't own a house on the planet itself like you could in Ultima Online. That's is for me a tremendous turn down. I've played Runes of magic where you could have a house, but it wasn't a physical house. Not sure if I made myself clear. it's hard to express myself in english sometimes.

3) 5 man heroics are nightmare, I would never use more than one person otuside my own guildmates or friends - theya re tough, challenging and unforgiving (akin to shadow labs and shattered halls heroic in TBC).

3a) Heroics require a big chunk of online time, they often feel like raids - LFG tool should be avoided at all costs for heroics, you are likely to burn through several emo-quitters when things go wrong (and they do, often). Players need to be sharp (consistently) and Blizzard should really think about tweaking the difficulty levels of these - right now PUG's are avoided, voice comms is a massive plus and they take too long, I like my WoW dungeons to take less than an hour - I do have a life outside Azeroth thank you.

4) Raids, enough content and variety with a nice difficulty level, should keep most of us entertained until the next content patch.

Rep and mats grinding is reasonably balanced and quite good fun, I find the new areas interesting, although Vash'jr has lost it's novelty now.

Summary, much better than Wrath and with some tweaking could be the best version ever.

Other than being paid to play, I'm not going back. Quest grinding and grinding raids for equipment is not my idea of fun. I did have some good laughs with world PVP tho, but that was only a small part of the game.

Originally Posted by Ph4ZeDQuite nice to see the positive review, I've often felt like Bit-Tech has an endless stream of hate for all Blizzard games.

Owened by Activision so who wouldn't?

TBH The cata expansion added nothing of interest, It was the 4.0x patch that really shook things up. All the expansion gave was access to level 85 and new areas. After playing through to 85 (probably the best quest lines blizz have done so far) you really feel ripped off with the expansion. Every thing good that "cata" brought was added in the patch. Just roll a new toon and quest with the original game and pick up the expansions when needed. Those wanting to return should still be able to experience most of what was brought ie. revamped areas and quest lines without the expansion.

cata is fun but ive played since release of the game from been hardcore to casual and back again from the world 1sts to the wipes on illidan with guilds that really shouldn't of reached him.

Raiding is as it always has been find a nice group of people and it becomes really fun and the challenge is correct. problem for most is they wont find this and will moan or suffer. Im in the lucky crowd i guess.

Levelling is a bit more fun now 1-60 was a drag before now its a blast quests are fun and different your not stuck in barrans as horde for 20 levels as you were in the old days. 60-70 was always quicker than 1-60 after changes.

Wow will always be a grind if you see gear as the be all and end all of wow. But Gear is a tool for raiders and should be used as such. Same in pvp gear just helps you succeed it wont make a bad player a good one.

gold is easy now you can make several 1000 gold a day with herbing or mining 2-400g a stack of herbs on nearly every server.

Most of the old grind is gone at least now you have a new grind if your doing pve Flasks require alot of mats currently and could be the biggest barrier for most