Tuan I'll let you know how the P3 rides next week. I get fit on mine Tuesday! I got the black w/red w/ultegra components so opted out of spending $1000 more for the dura ace. Not a crazy price for a sweet ass bike.

So, are you all doing Germany next year then?? Let me know! I'm on the fence of what IM I want to do in 2011.

VA triathlete, I think the general consensus is that wherever you are going, the rest of the club doesn't have any inclination to go. And we can make that decision because we have the money, and because we want to. Why? Because you make ignorant comments on this board that lend yourself to being an amateur. Not wait, childish is the word I'm looking for. Kind of sad, cause I’ve never even met you but from your comments I (and many others) have the distinct impression that we wouldn’t get along.

There is no real reason to have a bike in the first place with your line of thinking. Prior to having bikes, we walked. But 2 wheels are faster and arguably more efficient than walking, or trying to bike with square wheels (please don't try to debate this too or you'll really look like an idiot). So therefore, would you say that there is no valid reason to purchase a bike, let alone a reason to purchase round wheels instead of square?

Following that one step further, if someone wanted to spend more money to go faster, is that a less valid reason? For someone who puts themselves out there as a seasoned triathlete, I’d expect you to know there are a multitude of very valid reasons that a new bike purchase is perfectly valid. Amongst them are: improper fit, harsh ride quality of a crit type aluminum frame setup vs. longer distance bike, bikes that are extremely heavy (steel lugged frames) and most important with a tri bike with different geometry for longer distance rides.

Go take a long bike ride somewhere and get lost for awhile...or better yet, come out to the happy hours so some of us can finally meet you and get some perspective on your comments. Oh, and one more thing, we’ll decide on the reasons you can be excused from attending the events, but all other reasons you may give are excuses and not valid reasons.

The below was stolen from the internet. It's a good description of the race. You can do an IM in Germany, take a train to Spain to run with the bulls in Pamploma (occuring during the same time period), and then head toward France to see one of the stages of the Tour Du France.

The cutoff for this race two years ago was 16 hours. This year the cutoff is 15 hours. Registration opens in July and will close within a day according to the IM Germany officials. This is also known as the Ironman European Championship so no matter your speed, leave your ego at home and be prepared to be humbled.

If this race report is too wordy for you. Here is a quote from the last paragraph

"the best recovery area you will ever see in an Ironman. Imagine your wildest fantasies ... showers, hot tubs, beautiful female [attendants]"

I'll cover this race in 3 parts: The race course itself, my personal experiences during the race, and comments and recommendations for future competitors.

Ironman Germany is the fastest and best supported race on the entire Ironman circuit. It also has more spectators than any other race, and they're extraordinarily enthusiastic. It has the most competitive field other than Hawaii.

The race starts in the Laganer Waldsee south of Frankfurt. It's a very small lake/reservoir, which is quite murky, because as well as having a beach (nudity allowed) and recreational area, there's also some kind of defunct industrial plant right next to it. The water is murky enough that you cannot see people swimming next to you, unless you're right on top of them. The water was just about right, about 20 degrees C, or 70F, perfect for wetsuits. The swim course is two loops, a longer first loop marked with orange bouys with the inside on your left, then you run across the sand for about 30 meters, then a shorter loop with yellow bouys on your right, I think the split was 2300/1500 meters or so. You run up a hill about 100 meters into the transition area, then ride out the exit to the highway into Frankfurt. The first kilometer or so is a bit rough, but it's quite smooth once you get onto the awesome German roads.

In general, they really know how to do things well in Germany, and one of the things they do really well is to make absolutely glassy smooth roads which are perfect for cycling. None of this chip seal that we're used to in the US. Imagine a bike course with almost freshy laid asphalt for the entire distance, and that's the radstrecke in Germany. The race course is entirely closed to traffic, which is remarkable, since it passes through a major city, and a dozen surrounding towns.

The race protection is absolutely flawless. The first leg is a flat 6-7 miles (10-12K) into Frankfurt, on the B43 highway, then into town, and thousands of cheering spectators. This starts the first of the two loops in the course You ride East Northeast into the Enkheim suburbs then there's a small climb onto an overpass, then it flattens out before "The Beast". While these hills have some intimidating names, like "The Hell", and "Heartbreak Hill", they're fairly shallow grade, and a few hundred feet of climbing. Anyone who has slogged over Richter pass or Bachelor Mountain will break a smile coming over these hills. One things these hills do afford that you're not used to, is THRONGS of cheering spectators, live bands, kids with their hands out for high fives, people sitting in cafes to watch the races, and beautiful German Villages. "The Beast" curves right through Bergen-Enkheim, then there's a downhill and flat before "The Hell". "The Hell" starts with a left hand turn onto cobblestones, which make for difficult riding, and a short climb a few hundred meters long. There's an arch at the top, after which it's normal road, except for a short section of cobblestones.

After "The Hell" in Maintail, there's another shallow downhill, then there's a shallow, but long climb called the "Huhnnerberg", which winds thorugh some trees for about 2-3 miles. There's a moderately winding downhill that you can descend pretty fast. The course flattens out, and there's a bit of country side riding (dead flat) going Northwest until you get into Nieder-Dorfelden, where you'll need to use your bike handling skills for some fairly sharp turns. This course is crowded, so you can easily get on top of people, but keep your spacing in these parts, otherwise you're going to be an experiment in Newtonian physics. There's another brief section before Karben, where there's some more twisty little turns (and cheering throngs), the more flat countryside before Niddatal, which has 2 turns after it that are pretty hairy. The second left has a curb that you can easily run into if you're flying and take the turn wide.

The next couple of miles are country riding (all flat) into Freidberg, the northernmost section of the course, There's a sharp right, then an uphill about 100 meters long, then a sharp left downhill under a bridge. It gets a bit crowdeded here, and the road splits under the bridge pylon, and some people go left and others go right, then they come back together, so you may get a new neighbor by surprise. Flat, then left onto a downhill, and you're headed back to Frankfurt. The southern route on the loop is a bit more rural than the northern section, with minor changes in grade, which you might switch a cog or two. We also had wind coming from the south, so you may not be getting the fabulous speed you had one the Northern route. Ride right through Wollstadt, and around a traffic circle then through more countryside into Bad Vielbel, where you'll get to enjoy one of the finest experiences in all Ironman, on "Hearbreak Hill", which is not all that steep or long a climb, but is lined with THOUSANDS OF SPECTATORS. Ever watched the climbs in the Tour de France, where people lined the route within feet of the riders? That's exactly what you'll experience, and it's the thrill of a lifetime. People shouting and cheering like you'll never see in another race.

Ater the hill, it's downhill and flat into Frankfurt, with more crowds of cheering fans, a tunnel followed by two left turns and onto the second loop, where once again, you'll be greeted by cheering fans, beating noise ballons together, kids holding their hands out for high-fives live bands and drummers, well located, staffed, and stocked aid stations, picturesque German villages, countryside and farms, easy climbs, fast, but not screaming downhills, superfast flat terrain, and perfect road conditions.

When you come off the bike, you run into the transition area, where a volunteer will help you get your bag, and usher you into the changing tent, and off onto the 4 loop run course right along the river Main, in the middle of downtown Frankfurt. Thousands of people line the route, especially around the transition area, beating noise balloons, playing horns, shouting at the top of their lungs holding signs for their friends, and generally adding a lot of energy.

The run course is the flattest marathon I've ever seen, with very short climbs on the bridges. You run west along the river on a paved path, under the first bridge, then a hairpin with an aid station and back over the bridge, so it's a right-right to turn left. Over the first bridge, you then turn right and downhill then flat a bit then down to the river again, another aid station and under the brights. This is the long flat leg the south side, dead flat, past hundreds of people watching race. There's an aid station, you pass under a bridge, then end of the leg is through a park where they give you a different colored armband for each lap on the course. You then bend left, up a short climb onto a road before the bridge where you turn right again, and it's a little bit uphill, then you're over the briddge, snake down through some cobblestones where you pass the transition area, and the finish line (and more cheering throngs).

After 4 laps, a volunteer will tell you to turn right instead of left, and it's 200 meters uphill through MASSIVE STANDS WITH THOUSANDS OF SCREAMING FANS, and into the best recovery area you will ever see in an Ironman. Imagine your wildest fantasies....showers, hot tubs, beautiful female and handsome male attendants, first class food and beer, a well-staffed massage tent, and a friendly atmosphere. These guys know how to put on a race! Ich Liebe Deutscheland!

Don't know much about the course, but I work at the World Bank and even my German colleagues agree that Frankfurt is a boring town. If you are looking to combine the race with a bit of vacation - I 2nd the person that said pick Austria instead.

Maureen ... we are not going there to hit the clubs. We are going there to do an Ironman ;) We will then prove our manliness by running with the bulls in Pamploma. We will then reminisce on the flight back to the US about how stupid it was to run with the bulls after completing an Ironman. Why? because we are men and running with the bulls seems pretty cool at the time :)

Austria's IM course has mountains. The Vamboghini does not do mountains.

VAtri, this was several months ago and everyone has moved on. (and not harm was wished upon you dont' blow things up) You made a few offensive posts in the past which, yes, have ticked some people off (people talk offline) got called out and honestly I think your posts have become more positive now which is great. Stick to that and what this forum is supposed to be used for....a positive place for triathletes to chat and ask questions about the sport. I was pumped about Tuan's post since it motivated me to think about next year's Ironman. You ruined that vibe. Hence the reason for my post. Please keep it positive!!!!