List for me a truly socialist program in the United States; and explain to me in accurate detail, just exactly what "discretionary spending" programs you have in mind when you mention entitlement programs? It is important to recognize that a majority of that money is entrusted to private corporations, since government funding does not automatically mean it the services/products will be distributed/performed by government agencies. MEDICARE and MEDICAID are excellent examples of that (two of the largest "entitlement" programs).

The Few assume to be the deputies, but they are often only the despoilers of the Many. Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel

I'm not thinking in terms of following a political movement, all that ends in indivigual advancement, corruption, or closed-ended ideas. Instead of being pited against eachother based on belief we should work with one another in efforts towards a new social direction.

The government is not here to take care of you and they certainly aren't hear to control you. Distancing ourselves for a Welfare State, will only keep us away from facism. The government is simply here to secure a better quality of life for everyone, equally, which means that it is not restricted within U.S. borders.

Its difficult to hear but universally we are put on this planet to do one thing: WORK. All of us have to put there efforst to advance our society in the right direction. Not for money, greed, or personal advancement but for the greater good of MAN. Those who do not want to help this effort are simply not apart of the equation anymore.

Such things cannot come from debates over gay marriage and abortion those are personal battles. Such things cannot come from changing forgein policy and budgeting, or propaganda, politics, nationalism or patrotism. All of this comes from the idea that we are not dichotomous by are nation, beliefs, race, and creed the truth behind the illusion is we are human beings and we are in this struggle together.

Aquarian, what you've described isn't Socialism, its Fascism, AKA Corporatism. Medicaid, Medicare, SSI, etc. were sold to the American population as being Socialist. Have I told you lately how much I HATE FDR? However, through that avenue, Fascism took over. Remember the NAZIs called themselves the "Socialist" party.

When the raw...excuse me the New Deal was sold to the population, there were many individuals who called themselves Socialists and Communists in the US. They liked the Raw Deal. They, like you, naively believed that government would actually do what they said they'd do.

Don't you see now how the belief of Socialism allows Fascism to take over?

Just remember, the more the government gives you, the more they can take away.

How do you know a politician is lying? They're lips are moving.

Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values. Soon it will be possible to assert almost continuous surveillance over every citizen... - Zbigniew Brezhinsky

Aquarian, I'm not going to debate how and why the government uses private business to carry out their wishes. But you should know that government produces nothing. It makes nothing, it manufactures nothing, it creates nothing. If you want something manufactured or a service rendered you have to employ people and the most efficient way of doing that is through business. Governments know this and that's why they hire companies. Demonizing business is like demonizing any organization for simply getting people to work together towards a common goal, because that's what business is. AND, while I'm at it I should also clue you into the fact that although these businesses may be technically "private", they are in actuality government employees. The money comes from the taxpayers.

I'm sitting here right now watching a show, on the BBC no less, about Gary Indiana. You should see Gary. You should see Gary, before and after. Its a perfect example of a community that embarked on a society matching your philosophy Aquarian. The US has many such communities, including the entire state of California, juxtaposed with New Orleans, which has been basically abandoned by the country. With all thy getting, get understanding.

There is a movement in the US, and elsewhere, and although the non-productive members of society may not be part of some peoples equation they are most definitely part of Obama's equation, its largest factor is the poor, inner city, and especially the black community.

Having said that, I would not support any "equation" that simply ignores problems and expects them to go away, regardless of which side the equation belongs to. That's what's wrong with the left. If the Tea Party movement is to succeed and prosper it must understand this. You can't ignore a major portion of your community and expect that your ideas will win over the country. The question is, what do you do about them (the unproductive)?

I have one idea. We should build a community in Africa and make it real attractive, economically successful, peaceful, safe, stable. And then make it real easy for anyone who wishes to migrate there to do so. If we can do it in Iraq and Afghanistan then we should be able to do it Africa. But you can't win an election with an idea like that. What did Africa do before the US was established, when there was no one to fund AIDS research, before Bono???

You know, you don't see all these people with their hands out hanging around the rich football and basketball players. Why is that? Because they'd slam the door in their face. They ain't like Oprah.

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