After much thought I had an itinerary planned. I would go first to London, then to Amsterdam, and finally, Faliraki on the Greek island of Rhodos. These destinations promised to be the most balls-out fast-living party towns, and I chose them in order to educate myself about European culture.

I was sadly disappointed.

LONDONLondon sucked. It was constantly overcast, and raining nearly all the time. The locals were rude and all had terrible teeth. The cabs were expensive and my hotel was not in the center of town. I tried the local 'delicacy' "fish and chips" and I have to say it was the most disgusting food it has ever been my displeasure to consume. No wonder the British are so miserable and unhealthy if this is their staple diet. I tried to drown my sorrows with a beer or two, being the party animal that I am. I was yet again astonished and disgusted to find that the backward British do not know how to keep beer cool. I had a vomit-inducing pint of tepid brown sludge that looked like something you might find in a lavatory bowl. I took one sip and spat it out. The 'friendly' landlord of the 'pub' then ejected me from the premises.

Later that night I needed to make a call to the office in NYC. So I went to a public call box. It was disgusting. Someone had used it as a urinal, and there were prostitutes advertisments everywhere.

So I flew into Schiphol. The first thing that hit me about the Netherlands was how tall everyone is. Even the women are all 6' or over. This immediately put me on the defensive. Call me prejudiced if you like, but I just don't like tall people. Anyway as I arrived in Schiphol, they asked to see my passport. What the fuck ? Is this Europe or not I already showed my damn passport in the UK, but this Nazi wants to see it again. (Imagine showing your passport if you went to Hoboken from NYC). I pointed this out to the customs guy but he just made some comment in Dutch that sounded like he was clearing his throat, and sent me on my way.

Not wanting to waste any time, I took the train to Amsterdam Centraal, where I immediately started looking for a 'coffee shop' so I could smoke some weed and immerse myself in Dutch culture. I soon found the 'Grasshopper' just off Damrak and proceeded to get stoned on 'super skunk'. It was then I noticed the almost total lack of Dutch people in the place. Indeed they all seemed to be British or American. What the Fuck ? I thought. I didn't travel 4000 miles to meet Americans. I could have stayed in the US and gone to Epcot.

Feeling pissed, I walked out and inadvertantly stumbled into the Red Light district. Now I am a real party animal, and pretty broadminded, but that place was just sick. Women were on display like goods in a department store. There were sex shops on every corner selling all kinds of pornography and sex related paraphenalia. And the more I wandered around, the more lost I became. In my attempt to leave the area I was disgusted again to see a whole street dedicated to 'she-males' and 'lady-boys'. By this time I was pretty tired so I stopped off at a bar called 'Cassa Rossa', but too late I realised I had stumbled into a live sex show.

Before I could leave I had seen actual live copulation on stage between a bored looking woman and an improbably endowed man in a scene of such seedy depravity I can hardly bring myself to describe it. I could not believe my eyes. Nothing like this would be allowed to happen in America, and I could not help but wonder how the Europeans get their reputation for sophistication. When I finally managed to orient myself out of the Red Light district I walked back to my hotel along the Prinsengracht canal, where I saw another sight disgusting to any American. A man was openly urinating in the street. Now, I've drank my fair share in the past, but I have never sunk so low as to urinate in public. What is it with these Dutch people. Do they have no sense of shame ?

The next day I felt a sense of relief as I went back to Schiphol for my flight to Rhodes.

FALIRAKI

I had picked Faliraki in Rhodes because of its reputation as a party town, the availability of watersports. I had hoped for a picturesque Greek village. The reality was somewhat different. Once again the main language was English, and again it seems I had been followed by busloads of English youngsters. Normally this would not be a problem, but when you find out how these people behave you will realise why I will never set foot in Europe again.

First thing I did on arrival at my hotel in Faliraki was use the bathroom. Now you may find this hard to believe, but in 2001 in a modern European country, you may not flush toilet paper down the bowl. You actually have to wipe and put the paper in a small wastepaper basket at the side of the bowl. Can you believe this ? The stinking wastebin stays in your room unemptied for days, the stench of faeces and excrement slowly permeating all your posessions and posing a health hazard to all.

I immediately asked to see the manager only to be informed that I was an 'American malacca(?)' I am not sure of the exact word but it did not sound friendly.

Since I was only there for a few days and I did not want to be beaten up by a bunch of in-bred Greek mafia types, I decided not to make a fuss, and went down to the beach.

There I was met with a scene of utter depravity. Hundreds of British people in various states of undress lying around on the beach, or swimming or playing beach games. Some of these topless nymphettes can only have been aged about sixteen. The one thing the British girls all seemed to have in common was a desire to flaunt their breasts to all and sundry.

As I walked along the beach I started to wonder if maybe I was wrong, and that the American attitude to nudity was somehow flawed, but then a trio of big breasted blonde British girls bounced past and I realised how unworkable the topless approach would be in the US.

I had come to see another culture, that's exactly what I saw. The culture of the British 'lager lout' and 'ladette'.
My suspicions about the morals of the British were confirmed later that evening when I attended a local bar. As the evening wore on, the British got progressively more and more drunk. There was vomiting, broken glass, fighting and yet more exposed breasts as the DJ encouraged the British and whipped them up into a sexualized frenzy. I would not be surprised if some of them had taken Ecstacy or other stimulants.

I sampled the local cocktail (a "fishbowl") which was utterly disgusting, and then a British girl started coming on to me. I explained that I was married and she said "Oi won't tell if yew don't, come on lets go for a quick shag. Moi mates not in arrr room" (she had the most disgusting and almost unintelligible "cockney" accent).

Well I don't know if it was the alcohol or the heat or if the culture shock had corrupted my judgment, but I soon found myself back at her hotel room, naked.

Now I am not a prude. In my past I have had sexual relations with many ladies. But this was the first time I had experienced such a depraved approach. I don't know what it is about British girls but it is like they are sex-starved or something. (perhaps its because most British men are gay!) anyway Chantelle (that was her name) from East London gave me some of the most energetic sex I have ever had. But it gets worse. Just as I was struggling with the guilt of what I had just done, and how I had betrayed my wife, who should walk in on us but Chantelle's friend Lisa (also from Dagenham, East London). She took one look at us both lying there naked and without batting an eyelid said 'Moind if oi join yer ?' and started to strip off.

By this time I was sobering up and full of remorse about what I had done. So I didn't want to compound the sin by indulging in a three-way with these two Dick Van Dykes (I am broad minded, but there ARE limits!) So I quickly pulled on my pants, grabbed my shirt and ran for the door.

Unfortunately I had picked the wrong door, but that was the least of my troubles. As I went through the door into what I later realised was the bathroom, I tripped over my shoelace and fell face forward onto the 'waste bin' provided in all Greek bathrooms. It had not been emptied for quite a while and I was covered in used TP.

The doctor who examined me the next day and gave me a tetanus shot said that such incidents were not as uncommon as you would think. She also went on and on about how unruly and rude the British are as a race.

Many right thinking God Fearing people left northern Europe long ago, realizing that the perversions and attitudes are dangerous to young children. Oliver Cromwell's followers had to leave England, or else face beheading or recanting their faith. You should have gone to decent, Catholic countries like Spain, France or Italy (or perhaps Bavaria) where decent, God fearing sorts are welcome (though, ironically, the largest religion in France will so be Mohammedism). I think I've read enough about Europe to know that I have little need to go to England or the Netherlands (though, of course, I still tithe to support our missionaries, homeless shelters and soup kitchens there).

A. Rightmann

I'm surprised (5.00 / 1) (#34)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 05:33:53 PM PST

I really am surprised that there aren't more responses to your posts. You seem to think that Europe somehow is still in the dark ages and that the plague is still ravaging through it or something. You can't possibly call anyone "right thinking". That's YOUR opinion and not a fact. If by "catholic" you mean that you can expect most of those you meet to not disagree with your religious views, you're probably right. England is a very protestant nation, and has been for some time. Why do you think there are "missionaries" in England? It's not an unexplored continent with savage tribes or something. There are catholic churches just as there are protestant churches and moskés. People are free to have what religious views they want. It's very arrogant of you to think that your religion is the right one and that all who think differently are wrong. I don't recall any country you mentioned as one where catholics are treated differently from people with other religious views?

ohhh kay (none / 0) (#72)

by Anonymous Reader on Wed Feb 6th, 2002 at 09:39:29 PM PST

so u fink british people r disgusting and all the rest. u probly went to sum shitty chip shop for posh americans which is why they where shite. U talk as if the whole of europe is one country well ur wrong numnuts. u obviously came to europe expecting amerca but with diffrent ppl. i agree with certian aspects on london. like the phone boxs but i bet if u went to nyc it would be same with adverts for phone sex ( since this is what they r not adverts for prossies ) u where on about that greek island being full of lager lots well i have to agree british teenages are mentle (i am one an i do alot of mental shit) but its not our fault that u happend to pick up a slag and by the way dick van dykes accent sound more austrailian then n e thing. u where saying that all british men are gay well most british men that i have met r not gay. just cause u shagged sum slag who prolly had a b/f back in london but didn't give a fuck well thats ur own bad luck. Garage is indeed shit. about what u said about our rediculas gun laws being to strict well at least i can walk down a bad part of me neibor hood and not get shot. the person in the club who pulled the gun was prolly doing sumin illegel ne way and its just as easy to get a gun illegaly in the uk as it is in amerca. Oh by the way if u fink i am sum patriotic guy i ain't i fink we should get rid of the royals cause they cause to many problems and join the single currency to give the UK a chance to get out of the rescion we r currently in

Please, good sir! Us Americans, though we supposedly speak a "bastardized" version of English, have a fondness for such things as spelling, grammar, style, and capitalization! In the future, please keep this in mind! We can only respond to your post if we can read it.

This sort of disregard for standards of communication seems to be a common theme among UKians. Is there any way we could make it illegal for them to read this site, a sort of Brit-filter? They tend to get annoying.

"Every time I look at the X window system, it's so fucking stupid; and part of me feels responsible for the worst parts of it."-- James Gosling

Maybe next time you should check the locations you are going to instead of doing a "red light" tour of europe. Ive visited similarly unpleasant places as you mentioned above in the US but I dont expect the entire US is like it.

PS garage music is a load of shite. It will die out give it 5 years. Its built on fakeness and its SHITE. SHITE SHITE - I have avid followers who feel the same hatred for it. We will destroy it soon.

What bars did you visit? All the bars I visit you can buy Guiness, Fosters even Bud. You must understand that beer wont be ice cold if it comes as a pint - thats not how we drink it, it shouldnt be warm though, especially at this time of year. It should be cool. That the actual barman threw you out shows how small a pub it was. I suggest finding a better one with more people in it next time.
Its fish and chips not fish and fries. Chips arent supposed to be crispy - they are supposed to be literally potato chips slightly fried. Many people complain that this looks uncooked and messy but thats how its made. chips and battered fish wrapped in newspaper. The good thing is you cant get food poisoned from chips - they have to be hot when served and therefore are cooked.

Of course british teenagers are going to enjoy themselves at beaches in hot weather. I see how you can say british girls are sex starved either lol...trust me on this one. Have you seen american pie? I bet you'd hate me for using that as a perspective of american teenagers.

"My theory is that all the British men are secretly gay"
Yup its true lol.

We do drink much more in this country than in the US. All my american friends have made this comment. But IMO its you americans that dont drink enough :)

The good thing about lol is you can use it as general amusement, sarcastic laughter or a patronising chuckle and usually the other person knows which one of these contexts your using.

Also I find it a very useful shorthand instead of writing "that was so funny I laughed". I can go looool, lol or LOL!! meaning different levels of laughter. Using Heh or *laugh* isnt as effective for some reason. Heh sounds like it reads - just a single short laugh. using an actual *laugh* or *Im laughing* sounds robotic and not human as you dont tell people when you laugh. lol is different though - its like a reaction rather than a statement you type for effect. I mean if I type a sentence which I consider funny I feel inclined to write lol almost without thinking.
Its like I actually associate lol with laughter. Strange.<<JUMP! POGO POGO POGO BOUNCE! POGO POGO POGO>>

Do you realize what a primitive place Russia is?
Do you realize what kind of primordial rituals and
unspeakable acts of home-made magic still thrive
in their basically tribal culture? God. Go visit
some Orthodox church some time if you want to know
what kind of frightening melange of ancient black
arts and high church monotheism is responsible for
keeping a not totally incompetent people in the
Dark Ages for fifteen centuries. It makes Voodoo
look like an Iowa prayer breakfast.

You are going to start coughing up a lung, you
poor doomed bastard, if you don't get this hex off
you.

While you're dying, you might wonder a little about
how civilization managed to convey both humor and
amusement in writing for some three thousand years
without ever resorting to your semi-literate
acronyms or emoticons.

"lol" is used to signify laughter without typing great long words and sentences. It was invented over IRC in the seventies (i think) along with other acronyms such as rotfl (Rolling On The Floor Laughing) and IMHO (In My Humble Opinion) in order for people to communicate quickly and efficiently whilst swapping code. Many think that it was invented by some townies for SMS and it has been adopted for IRC and other IM's. This is not the case. All those who think that lol and all of it's fellow acronyms should be put to rest ESAD. (e-mail me if you want the meaning for this, but it should be pretty obvious)

Not possible (none / 0) (#78)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 7th, 2002 at 04:51:31 AM PST

YOu say that it was invented in the seventies. THat can't be correct, as the internet was founded in 1985.

So when the time came to book last summer's vacation I did plenty of research.

Doesn't sound that way to me.

agree... (none / 0) (#143)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 14th, 2002 at 07:20:55 AM PST

That's what I would suggest next time the guy plans his holiday to do a BETTER and more thoughout research. Preferably, do some studying at the University... :)

This guy is hilarious! (none / 0) (#160)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Mar 7th, 2002 at 05:22:25 AM PST

I would like to see his so-called "research". What actually were his intentions? He wanted to "party" but the link he refers to is just as dry-official as you can imagine. As for some real facts on foreign countries, an American should go to the CIA factbook (http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/). A better source though is http://www.gofir.com/ .

"Once again the main language was English", he writes, but whines when somebody replies to this story in anything that is not "standard English" according to him. Does he know what he actually wants? I hope my English isn't too bad, but then again it isn't my mother tongue (no I'm not Amercian, I'm Belgian and please spare me stupid child-related jokes about Belgians!)

And then the hypocrisy: a married guy getting laid by an unknown girl suddenly starts to moralize the Europeans he really doens't know by far.

As for me, I found the whole story hilarious. His message however makes clear he is clueless.

During my service to God and country I had the terrible misfortune to be stationed in London. Even though, back then, I wasn't the right thinking man I am today the place offended my sensibilities, not to mention the morally corrupt perverted British sailors who we helped to train. Thinking back on that experience I am happy that I was able to escape without contracting some sort of life threatening disease or succumbing to the crippling effects of their drugs.

I think the problems you found are the result of unchecked liberalism. Many areas in the UK are overrun with it. Couple that with a conspicuous lack of God in their lives and you end up with a country full of dope smoking, breast revealing, long haired, unshaven, jobless hippies who differ from a colony of apes by only the grace of God. It wasn't always this way. At one time the British were the most feared fighting force in the world, they colonized nation after nation. That once proud heritage has been replaced and they are now reduced to being tag-a-longs, paddling in the wake of US battleships, hoping to get a shot at an already wounded enemy just to satisfy the bloodlust bread into their culture by years of pillaging. Having trained alongside British soldiers I can assure you that these people are mostly extremists. They don't just want to know how to kill, they want to know how to kill the most people with the least amount of time and effort. I can admire that, but they didn't really have a goal in mind, they seemed to want to kill for the sheer joy of having done so.

Regardless, welcome back to the land of the free. At least you'll now be able to offer first hand observations the next time some socialist from the UK makes a verbal attack on America.

-------------------------"Keep your bible open and your powder dry."

He is right about the British (none / 0) (#16)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 07:45:45 AM PST

I am a German. One thing that is annoying me much is the British on their holiday behaviour. They are still having the attitude of empire. When a German a sunbed reserves, the british hooligans are the towels ignoring and into the swimming pool throwing.

It is not that for nothing we Germans are the British "Island Monkeys" calling.

that so-called "Americans" would waste their time and money visiting 3rd world godless countries.
I suppose bolstering their failing economies with greenbacks is a salve to your soul, but really.
Think about this. There are so many glories in this great land that most have never seen.
Many have some compelling reason to visit the fetid cesspools of humanity that our god-fearing forefathers left long ago. I for one do not see the attration.
Our forefathers, those intrepid pioneers, saw a great need to rise above their surroundings and escape the squalor.
Perhaps your time in these backwater areas will serve as a reminder of how great this America is.

This really needs no comment (none / 0) (#39)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 06:11:03 PM PST

How come the people that put their real names as nicknames have the strangest views? You make it sound like all of America is some kind of Eden. America has just as many flaws as Europe if not more. You proclaim America as the land of the free and is at the same time insistent on that there is only one true religion. A country that doesn't permit other religions is truly not a land of the free, but it seems to be the perfect country in your eyes. There's also a lot of prejudice floating around here. You've probably never been to Europe and you probably consider it to be something like Africa. We are not dependent on America and we never will be. The European Union have no money problems that need resolving by american means. The countries of europe are not some under-developed cesspool of filth and crime. Actually, it's quite nice. Guess what, I actually live there. You don't. Ask me a question about this place, like do we have toilets or some stupid question like that and you will soon se exactly how strange it is here. Btw, most of us are not catholic, at least not in the northern parts, so compare us with a PROTESTANT part of the US please.

Btw, two Red Cross hospitals in Afghanistan. America bombed them both. One private hospital. America bombed it. Don't you think the poor civilians of Aghanistan have had enough? They didn't even do anything. That's the kind of things we in europe see America contribute with to this world.

take the time to examine some Scripture that many find appealing you would realize that this great land is more than enough for anyone.
I have not visited foreign shores. Time and obligations prevent me. What little vacation time I have is spent with family visiting sites of historical importance.
Since you did bring it up, how is the quality of your rustic infrastructure? I hear tell of places that it is impossible to drive down the streets because of the raging mobs and satanistic rites that take place in the very "streets".
As for those poor unfortunates working for the Red Cross in Afghanistan, our government surely gave them enough time to get out of harms way. Surely they realized that there was military action about to take place. I'm sure their souls are in a better place now.

Oh come on. (none / 0) (#75)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 7th, 2002 at 04:32:08 AM PST

What's the deal with you people. You really don't think we have indoor plumbing? You think we still have street lights with carosene? You think we live in the 1800s? In my country, the percentage of people who own a computer is a lot higher than in the US. The amount of social benefits from the government is also higher. Basically, this is a more equal country. There are fewer people who are really poor and fewer people who are really rich. And yes, I do live in Europe, not some country you made up.

Sites of historical importance. Those would be important in the history of the US. Which, IIRC, doesn't go back more than a few hundred years. British history goes back a few MILLENIA.

You're just being very narrow-minded. What, exactly, is so good about the US? What, exactly, is so bad about anywhere else? You have no right to condemn ANY place you've not visited, know nothing about beyond what little (poorly reported)news filters through to the US, which from what I can tell is news that serves only to focus on the worst side of British culture. And by the same token, I have no right to criticise the US, or any other country I've not visited.

You can't form a FULL opinion of a country based on what you see on TV. The only true way to get a good view of a place is to visit it. Otherwise all you'll see is a twisted view of that place, whether it's sanitised or in full detail.

And no, I don't have a TV. I'm a University student living away from my home of 18 and a half years before coming here. I can't afford even to bring the TV I already own, because I'd have to get a license at a cost of roughly £100 a year. It's ludicrous I know, but it's what we have to put up with here.

are mostly the South and Apalachia, though there are significant amounts of Protestants in the Midwest and the West.

In a typical Southern city, food is largely fried, indoor plumbing is often available, watching NASCAR, football and basketball is the height of entertainment, and Protestants prove their devotion by loudly singing anti-Catholic hymns in 3 hour celebrations, then signing anti-alcohol laws. Then, they go home, drink some illegal moonshine, and sexually molest their daughters.

In a typical Apalachian town, food is largely fried opossum, indoor plumbing is a sign or putting on airs, and bear baiting and dog fighting it the height of entertainment. Apalachian Protestants prove their devotion by picking up large rattlesnakes while a band plays the electric guitars to old English tunes, then checking on their still for making illegal moonshine, and then engaging in incestous relations with any being with an orifice.

So, this is different from Europe how? Oh yeah, you have no opossums or car racing in Europe.

F1 is much more fun to watch than a few souped-up road cars flinging themselves round a circular track. If you MUST watch souped-up road cars, then watch a rally. Or alternatively just go down to the town centre at night and watch all the boy racers trying to kill themselves and everyone else.

Moonshine is a thing of the past. Most Southerners purchase their alcohol in stores. Unlike the Midwest, these stores are less numerous, and delegated to the seedier parts of town. They are not allowed to have the word "Liquor" on their signs and are called "Package Stores."

The rest of your description is mostly accurate.

Q: What's the difference between a Baptist and a Catholic?

A: The Catholic will say hello if sees you on the way out of the package store._
_
Do you suffer from late-night hacking? Ask your doctor about Protonix.

In New England, a liquor store is also called a 'package store' or a 'packy' for short. Hence the term 'making a packy run,' which is wicked pissah fun. It's difficult to heave a brick in Boston without at least hitting the store next to a packy.

Maybe it has something to do with the large number of Catholics (or university students) in the general vicinity.

What, the settlers of the US were *British*?!? I thought they were all Irish, Welsh and Scottish, commonly known as 'celts'.

The Real British at the time were trying to create a pronouncable version of that weird language "Unitedkingdomish", and inbreed with royal corgis, using bayonets. How DARE you make this groundless accusation that British subjects settled in the US, or "America" as it was known then.

This isn't just ludicrous, this is revisioninst. Correct yourself now and prostrate before Mecca in the proper Celtic way, damn you!

Thanks for the critique of the eurotouro. My own experience there has been somewhat more predictable and very much less earthy (I ignore the little bathroom trashcans and use the toilet for the purpose God intended it). I have the great misfortune to travel through there every month on the way to another destination that I won't name. Algeria. There, I named it.
I dislike europe and the europeans and especially the Britanistanis who, sensing that Americans want to be liked, and ever vigilant for a handout (I think this is also the national foreign policy which they have committed to writing somewhere in a sort of National 12 Step Program), are quick to take advantage of the innocent abroad.

But the chickens have all come home to roost in this twilight of the empire. Anyone who has anything to contribute to civilization or civility has emigrated long ago, leaving behind the dregs of the empire to stand around on the filthy, unswept sidewalks, rubbing their arms against the morning cold and waiting for the pubs to open, smoking cheap, hand rolled cigarettes and laughing at things that aren't really funny and ending every statement with the question, "innit?" then looking eagerly around for the nodding approval of the herd before hawking and spitting.

A sickly, intellectually anaemic island with a GDP roughly equivalent to that of Denver, that breeds nothing productive and has only the Richard Reids and his ilk to show for it's efforts. Anyone with any hope or courage has gone to America, wants to, or is in the queue.
Welcome to 21st Century Britanistan.

Bollocks (none / 0) (#23)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 12:44:17 PM PST

Bollocks to you bunch of clinicly obese burger eating inbread racist gun toting english rejects!!! This is not directed at Americans in general but just the twats who posted all their crap on this forum... Can't believe what I've read... GOD SAVE THE QUEEN - Now show some f@ckin respect!

And Ft Lauderdale, Miami Beach, Clearwater/St Petersburg. I have to say I never saw anything like the wildness and moral decay that there is in Europe.

Sure, things can get a little out of hand at spring break, but even then Europe takes it to a different level of depravity.

Perhaps I'll try Cancun next time, although I have heard bad things about that too.

time to give a Newtonian demonstration - of a bullet, its mass and its acceleration.
-- MC Hawking

!!!!!RULE BRITAINIA!!!!! (none / 0) (#22)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 12:31:51 PM PST

As an English man that has been to both Daytona and Ft Lauderdale during spring break I would say that what I saw by the pool of one hotel was pretty much the same as of any 18-30 holiday... I saw enough breasts too! As for Ft Lauderdale, the tosser behind the bar got abusive because I did not offer a tip!! American college "Jocks" are arrogant nunces who need a good kicking!!

Why go to Europe ? (none / 0) (#25)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 01:10:53 PM PST

Except for the paper thing, the beach and the red lights, you can have that tourist experience in New York : people peeing in the street, whores somewhat aggressive, drunken, etc.How the hell did you plan that trip ?

this is only because no one likes (1.00 / 1) (#26)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 01:31:23 PM PST

americans in europe u tend to kill innocents make sawky music sell shit for high prices and blackmail legit leaders

(Not that I don't agree with the general idea of the orignial post...)

--Peace and much love...

Funny (5.00 / 1) (#27)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 01:37:20 PM PST

In the Caribbean where I live, we think American women are sex starving and most American men must be gay! And we have exactly the same reasons ! Isn'it funny ?

No (1.00 / 1) (#29)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 01:51:16 PM PST

You only think its funny because you are high off the weed. I know about you Caribbeans. Get your ass back to the cigar factory and roll me up some esplendidos, I have a party to go to this weekend.

OK (none / 0) (#30)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 02:18:05 PM PST

Will you go with your wife or girlfriend. I want to know if I will roll uno esplendido para ella.

Stupidity (1.00 / 1) (#33)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 05:21:29 PM PST

I have a question for the author of this particular article. Where was your wife when you were venturing into these party districts. Did you leave her somewhere and just met up with her later? Maybe if she would have been with you, you wouldn't of had a problem with your little brain. Your big brain would have kept your little brain in check.
As far as the British culture, I haven't been over there, so to make a judgement on something I don't know would be wrong. I am pretty sure though that life over there is similar. Granted, we do not have nude beaches, but if you have grown up in that environment, you may be running around with nothing on as well. As far as the areas over in Europe is concerned, The U.S. also has areas similar to what you have described as well as some of the personalities. Everyone has their own way of life and there own culture. If women over in Britian want to walk around flauting what they have, then it is really there own business. Whether or not you let it affect you is your business.

Where was your wife ... (none / 0) (#38)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 06:09:19 PM PST

In the Caribbean.

The basket thing (1.00 / 2) (#36)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 05:56:09 PM PST

The reason that you can't flush paper down the toilet in Rhodes is that the waterpipes are too small. The TP that gets flushed down sticks in the pipes and plugs them up, hence you can't flush toilet paper. Want to get rid of the little basket? They'd have to get a better water system. You wan't to pay for it? Didn't think so.
Btw, different isn't necessarily bad. You seem to be allergic to new experiences. You have described nothing besides the little baskets that isn't the same in the US. Just the fact that you call Europe a "country" says enough. "If you are a pasty-faced, music-stealing, port-scanning, quake-playing, pearl-skr1pt writing, communist loving, freedom hating Linux geek who cannot get laid, you could do worse than go to Faliraki and try your luck "chatting up the birds". Oh my, aren't we feeling prejudice today? Do you even know what a portscan is? Just the fact that you wrote perl as "pearl" shows that you have no idea what it is or what it's used for. It's really fun that the link from "freedom hating" goes to www.ihatebillgates.com and that the "communist loving" part goes to the GNU Public License. This suggests that you regard freedom = Bill Gates. Care to elaborate? Have you even checked your links? Why do you people insist on putting links to everything in every other word you mention in your articles? It's annoying and not needed, it only adds a comical sense to the article, especially when you see where it leads. pearl-skr1pt writing and a link to www.python.org? oh please.

Starting every post with the same subject is a sign of bad imagination. I'll call people childish when they act like a child. In no post here have I used a single curse. Don't understand why it's necessary since it only lowers the level of the discussion. Seems to be quite common here though.

I myself am from Manchester, about 300 miles north of London, and whole-heartedly agree with you that London sucks. If you'd travelled further afield in England, you'd also have noticed that London seems to have it's own economics - if you can find something you want to buy outside of London, it's guaranteed that it'll be double the price (and therefore trendier) than the cheaper option.

I cannot comment on the food - we all have our own tastes and preferences, although how that American outlet Kentucky Fried Chicken/Frog can be accused of selling food is beyond me.

Beer is a strange thing in Great Britain. Weird little men claiming to be Campaigners for Real Ale sit in dark corners claiming their beer is too cold and too frothy. Pay no attention. Stick to what you know - Budweiser, Coors, anything from N. America should serve you well.

'American malacca' literally translated means 'American w*nker' - a fact that later you proved to be anything but.. even though you are married.

I myself am from Manchester
A downmarket city looking to rise to the status of slum. Basically the downtown area of Liverpool.

if you can find something you want to buy outside of London, it's guaranteed that it'll be double the price (and therefore trendier) than the cheaper option.
Whilst the Dagenham girls might have given out for free, the Manchester gals do expect to pay you.

I cannot comment on the food - we all have our own tastes and preferences
Mushy peas.

Lies (none / 0) (#88)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 7th, 2002 at 11:21:43 AM PST

You clearly haven't been outside of Manchester. Compared to the rest of the country, it's fantastic (except for London - if you're rich).

Try living in liverpool, newcastle, or birmingham. You will know what 'shitheap' actually means.

You are so provincial, you just can't imagine the cultural delights that our second city has to offer.

I'm not taking this story seriously. (5.00 / 1) (#54)

by Anonymous Reader on Wed Feb 6th, 2002 at 05:17:59 AM PST

Come on, how can you take a guy seriously who hasn't got a decent grasp of his own country's borders? ... foreign countries as [...] Hawaii?

And yes, if you go to Amsterdam looking for 'coffee shops' (pot stores) and the red light district you'll be sorely disappointed. Both are full of foreigners and the scum of society. There's dozens if not hundreds of pubs, scores of night clubs, museums, movie theatres... all in that typical relaxed Amsterdam atmosphere.

Oh, and don't go to London for the weather. Go for the enormous bookstores, the magnificent museums, the high streets where everything costs three times the normal price but watching is free. Go for the parks, the pubs and the aerial view of the city when you arrive and leave... horizon to horizon.

Agreed. Might I add however, *do* go for the dance music scene ... and I don't mean garage.

I'll tell you what, dmg: if you promise not to judge the UK music scene by the standards of garage, then I shan't base my judgment of the American music scene on the Backstreet Boys. :-)

Gee, I wish I could be repressed too (5.00 / 1) (#55)

by Anonymous Reader on Wed Feb 6th, 2002 at 05:38:38 AM PST

What a sad life you lead if you find such things as nude beaches offensive. The only thing offensive I can find on a nude beach is the ugly people. And as for you insane rant on the rest of their culture, I suppose that is what is to be expected from an american. In fact every american i've ever met who ever had anything against linux and the GPL has had this strange superior attitude that I suppose comes from living in a society as ignorant as that of the US (unbelievably stupid).

Free your mind (if u ever find it)
confucious_sitei@yahoo.com

(yahoo! is run on FreeBSD, an operating system that follows many of the same principles as Linux, so die you "capitalist" pig lol)

Beer & guns (none / 0) (#59)

by Anonymous Reader on Wed Feb 6th, 2002 at 12:34:34 PM PST

If you tried fish and chips in London, you didn't try fish and chips. You definitely have to try it outside of the capital. Quality varies enormously.

As to the beer - you need to do some research before saying we don't know how to keep it cool. If you are pretending that it is an American lager, and judging its flavour and serving temperature on that basis, you are bound to be disappointed - but it is hardly a reasonable way to make a judgement. Kind of having a lamb chop and declaring it to be a rather inferior hamburger.

You can buy lager in the UK, and it is usually served ice cold. If it isn't, then the bar is doing something wrong. It is usually not very good lager - although some pubs have Budvar, Freedom or other high-quality lagers on tap.

Bitter is a different drink altogether. It isn't served ice cold, as that kills a lot of the flavours - it would simply be a waste, like serving good quality red wine ice cold. Some bitter is undoubtedly poor, but you can get good stuff in London - both Fullers and Youngs breweries produce excellent beer. If

As to the rain and the daft gun laws, we'll you've got me there. If we burn enough fossil fuels, and the Gulf stream fails, we should have less rain, but it will be a lot colder. The gun laws are a part of a long term project on the part of the British people whereby we make everything that the majority don't like, forbidden, and everything that they do like, compulsory. I don't see the trend ending anytime soon.

You're looking at the worst side of British culture. UK Garage sucks. Especially the attitudes. Why not go somewhere a bit more civilised like a rock club, or even just your common-or-garden superclub like Ministry of Sound or summat?

Also, you can't judge the general public just because of what you saw in one single bar in London. The rest of the country is very different, London has the worst of the bad behaviour simply because it's the biggest city in the UK.

British Beer is also different to American beer. Just because it's called lager doesn't mean it has to be served tongue-numbingly cold with extra CO2 and water added. Personally I rather like foreign lagers like Carlsberg or Stella Artois. I think what you must have tried was bitter or ale, which are also VERY nice, it just takes a bit of getting used to.

I do agree with you on one point though. British tourists are the WORST. Luckily I can't really count myself as one of them, having been abroad all of 3 times (two of those with my secondary school).

Still, I think a lot of American people on this site have a rather narrow minded view of the rest of the world. Americans going abroad appear to be shocked if things aren't very close to being Americanised.

Not that I'm saying you didn't have a bad experience, of course, you evidently did. But still...

You people are missing the point (2.50 / 2) (#65)

by Anonymous Reader on Wed Feb 6th, 2002 at 01:30:36 PM PST

Everyone who is countering this poor deluded soul's comments is missing the premise underlying his holiday:

When he goes overseas, he wants his experience to be exactly like his home environment.

He has no interest in experiencing other cultures- note the revulsion when he encounters girls who are not as prudish as Americans, get that breast out of my sight, oh how unnatural.
As for his comment on accents, I present the accent which is universally derided by all others- the American accent. Name an accent that is so harsh upon the ear, or a language which is so frequently remiss in its placement of the letter u.
Next time take your holiday at home buddy, surrounded by overweight bovine Americans. Please leave Europe to those who appreciate its diversity.

PS Tall girls rock. It is not my fault if you are intimidated by them due to your own petite stature.

Disgusting languages. (none / 0) (#124)

by Anonymous Reader on Sun Feb 10th, 2002 at 09:45:19 PM PST

"As for his comment on accents, I present the accent which is universally derided by all others- the American accent. Name an accent that is so harsh upon the ear, or a language which is so frequently remiss in its placement of the letter u."

"English/irish (they're both the same anyhow)" english, french, german, dutch, and just about every other european language where a consonant is an "ach".

*note, "ach" is properly pronounced by preparing to hock an enormous mucouswad, then continuing the word as normal (swallowing the foul substance, I can only imagine)

Accents? (none / 0) (#142)

by Anonymous Reader on Wed Feb 13th, 2002 at 07:24:30 PM PST

It's as ignorant to suggest that the English and Irish accents are the same as it is to suggest that there is one American accent. There's lots of English dialects, Irish dialects, and American too. Same goes right across Europe.

Never heard of Gaelic? That's the original Irish language. And Scottish. And Welsh. And Cornish too. True, they weren't exactly the same, but they were definite Gaelic variants, and some people still speak them today as a first language, in Wales and Ireland.

Now ... (none / 0) (#66)

by Anonymous Reader on Wed Feb 6th, 2002 at 03:41:38 PM PST

It looks like you are the fly type of traveler. I have been to Europe (Netherlands, UK, Denmark, Sweden, Italy, Spain, Switzerland), I have lived there (France, UK), and never saw any Red Light District. I knew where it was, but I was not interested.

Like all puritans, you are an hypocrite. You remind me of that lady, complaining about her neighbors making love "in front of her". When the police came and asked where were the said neighbors, she answered : turn right overthere, you see the tree, climb and you'll see

If you can't relax enough to visit someplace different from your little acre of the USA and accept it for what it is--not what you judge that it ought to be--you really should just stay home. It's damp and rainy in London, there's a lot of sex in Amsterdam, and Americans are known as obnoxious complainers in Greece. Yes, these things are true. That is how life is. For a self-proclaimed "party animal," you are awfully rigid.

What an open-minded approach you have... (none / 0) (#76)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 7th, 2002 at 04:35:16 AM PST

I'm not a regular on this site but I took one look at your article and had to write. Although I agree with your views on the arseholes that frequent the Greek islands, putting the rest of us Brits to shame with carpet vom'ing and screwing anything with a pulse, I'll draw your attention to a few comments from your stereotyped little rant:

'It was constantly overcast, and raining nearly all the time. The locals were rude and all had terrible teeth. The cabs were expensive and my hotel was not in the center of town.'

Yeah, well, we can do a great deal about the weather- and nowhere in the US ever gets a drop does it????
We're rude to people like you because you come over with attitude as demonstrated. If you have a mind, keep it open, huh?
And as for a hotel in the centre of town, define the centre of London. ITS A BIG PLACE. What do ya want, a room on top of Buckingham Palace????

Garage nights and violence. hmmm... whereabouts do you live in the US? Shangri-fucking-La? Of course, in places like Tramps and the Tunnel, or any other reputable hip-hop club in the States, everyone solves their differences with a hand of gin rummy, don't they? If you want to start talking about gun culture, 'mate', then look a bit closer to home...

'I learned that the British are amongst the worse mannered, uncultured, ignorant and violent people in Europe'

And this is taken from a trip to London, then Amsterdam, then a Brit- populated Greek resort. Well done for making it a wide-spread study. I've been polite so far... uncultured? If you meet the animals that holiday in Greece then I guess that's a fair accusation of some. But then if I went and holidayed in Mississippi I'd probably feel the same. Ignorant? And this is coming from someone generalising an entire nation? Violent? at least we don't carry guns as a point of principle.

People like you, who aren't prepared to accept that people might, possibly, somewhere on the planet, go about things a different way from you, should have their fucking passports confiscated. It's attitudes like this that make people hate the US so much. I've been several times to several places over the years, to Cali, Florida, New England, Philly, New York, Vegas, and I've found everyone, bar a few forgettable exceptions, to be friendly, curteous and open.

I'd recommend getting rid of that national high horse you seem to love sitting on, and understand that everyone has their faults, and every country has its idiots. You met a few of ours. They met you. Just PLEASE don't make generalisations like this because they cause the sort of issues that you guys across the pond are facing right now... such as thinking you have a divine right to dictate how the world must work then realising there aren't as many of us behind you as you might think.

If you'd like to discuss further, and allow me to prove that not all Brits are drunken violent misanthropes, email flonaldo_98@yahoo.com, I look forward to speaking with you.

'I learned that the British are amongst the worse mannered, uncultured, ignorant and violent people in Europe'
The Brits have a national pride in their hooligans, it is heart warming to know that our hooligans and louts are still the better than anyone elses.

And then you have the terrible example set by supposed soccer stars. I don't say ALL British are like this, I dare say there are one or two peaceful people over there, but the overwhelming impression I got in England, was that the British person is on an extremely short fuse.

In London I always felt there was an undercurrent of extreme violence just below the surface that could erupt at any time.

I also found the casual attitude towards hard drugs almost unbelievable. I met people who thought nothing of taking 10 Ecstacy tablets, plus an unknown quantity of Ketamine and LSD in one evening!!!.

With terrible examples being set by their leaders and sports stars, is it any wonder that Britain's youth is the most violent and drug-addled in the world ?

Unfortunately, the poor example set by the British seems to be catching on abroad.

time to give a Newtonian demonstration - of a bullet, its mass and its acceleration.
-- MC Hawking

Britain's a hell of a lot less violent than a most of the countries my uncle worked in over the past 10 years or so. The worst I can remember was Brazil, where he was teaching English at a college in Recife. The place was much worse than the more violent inner-city districts in Britain. The police were on the local mob's payroll. One of his students was killed in a shop raid. Most of the friends he made were violently robbed, some were killed. My uncle was attacked on more than one occasion.

I'll freely admit that English society is not perfect, and the culture of drugs like E, Ketamine, acid etc. is not one I'd like to be associated with, but it's certainly not the worst.

This thread's gone beyond rational discussion and seems simply to be an exercise in mud-slinging. With all the mud being launched in Britain's direction.

<P><I>the culture of drugs like E, Ketamine, acid etc. is not one I'd like to be associated with, but it's certainly not the worst.</I></P>
<P>That's the best thing about the UK, the drugs culture which has produced some of the best youth culture and music genres in the post war world. Think of punk without herion and speed or the current dance music scene without ecstasy.</P>

I don't think drugs truly define music. True, they make it more interesting, but often with tragic consequences, for both the musicians and the youth. "Traditional" clubbing drugs just aren't safe enough to use. There have been far too many deaths due to ecstasy use. I know that well-made ecstasy isn't lethal if used responsibly, but responsibly is the key word here - E distorts the user's perception of their surroundings and of time, and they will often do stupid things without realising it, and not take the time to check that they're OK.

This is why I stay well away from hard drugs (heroin, cocaine etc) and clubbing drugs, and only ever use nicotine, alchohol and have the occasional joint. And nicotine is the only drug I use on a daily basis. I've not had any cannabis in weeks, or alcohol since December 2001.

In terms of music your argument makes sense, but in terms of common sense, then....

Not all students are stupid either. You have to realise that it costs us a great deal to study.

£1075 per year to attend the Uni.
Residence charges may vary, but I pay around £2500 per year for hall residence, fully catered. Living in a house would be cheaper, but I didn't really have much of a choice in this matter.
Then there are some smaller sundry charges which I won't go into. At the end of it all, we have to pay back our student loans. All £2000-£3000 (per year) of it.

We're not all stupid enough to put pleasure before our studies. Not given the costs. I'm not willing to fuck up my chances of getting a degree and end up spending thousands of pounds in the process.

And the reason I haven't had a drink for so long is because I simply can't afford it.

It's costing me CAD$6500, which is around £2200, per year in tuition alone; to say nothing of the cost of living in Toronto.

Fortunately, I am able to hold two jobs while working on my masters' degree full time. I'm repaying money on my undergrad student loans (as a foreign national, I could only work under the table as an undergrad,) and I have privately bought a complete set of professional-quality equipment for my field.

Remember, I am only sporadically adequate, at best. Imagine what the editors are capable of doing. Remember that next time you're preaching to them about how a free student OS is superior to a professional product, and other such childish (although thus forgivably cute) bushwa.

I get to see hundreds of CV's from recent graduates. All of them basically the same, so who to interview? Well sad to say it is those that have something to say about themselves that makes them stand out from the crowd: Someone whom you might just want to chat to for an hour or so.

Having a degree will generally lead you into a caree that will earn you a greater salary, besides your repayments are based on your salary, so no one here is going to feel sorry for you. Do you have kids, family commitments? A number of your fellow students do and have a harder time of it.

Fucking True - you summed up every comment there and never spoke a truer word - a Brit

Bakunin Quotes (none / 0) (#85)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 7th, 2002 at 09:53:09 AM PST

"If God really existed, it would be necessary to abolish him."

"We have nothing to say to this, for we are indeed atheists, and we take pride in it, in so far as pride can be permitted to wretched individuals who like waves rise up for a moment and then vanish in the vast collective ocean of human society."

"And that, as is the case with all established powers, would consist in its endeavor to perpetuate itself in power and consolidate its position by rendering the society placed in its care even more stupid and consquently ever more in the need of being governed and directed by such a body."

"Everyone views society from the angle of an exploiter. But when all are exploiters, they necessarily must divide into fortunate and unfortunate exploiters, for every exploitation presupposes the existence of persons exploited. There are actual exploiters and those who can be classed in that category only when taken in the potential sense of this term. The latter consitute the majority of people whom simply aspire to become exploiters but are not such in reality, being in fact ceaselessly exploited."

"The sacremental formula for governing the masses of people - for their own good no doubt, for the salvation of their souls, if not their bodies - used by saints as well as by the nobles in the theocratic and aristocratic States, and also by the intellectuals and the rich people in the doctrinaire, liberal, and even republican States based upon universal suffrage, is always the same: "Everything for the people, nothing by the people."

All Quotes herein are the property of Mihail Alexandrovich Bakunin

Good quote (none / 0) (#100)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 7th, 2002 at 07:18:03 PM PST

"We have nothing to say to this, for we are indeed atheists, and we take pride in it, in so far as pride can be permitted to wretched individuals who like waves rise up for a moment and then vanish in the vast collective ocean of human society."

That quote is great. I saved it.

Your the fascists (none / 0) (#90)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 7th, 2002 at 12:35:32 PM PST

"The Greeks (Fascist until 1973, old habits die hard, and no flushing the TP)"

Actually you Americans are the ones who installed those fascists. In Greece, those dictators had to murder lots of Greeks because we could see through Washington's bullshit realpolitik and tried to overthrow that US backed junta. Washington was telling the world and mainly its insolent and arrogant population that it was helping Greek democracy when they put those fascists to power. As we Europeans know the Americans are foremost when it comes to stupidity so the ignorant American people swallowed that obvious lie quite aptly. You stupid Americans believe your government is infallible and you will never believe your government could do such things.

Americans also suck at comedy as this story was most unfunny. What would have been hilarious is if Americans were a poll option, For Worst Thing About Europe, as I am sure you would have won by far. Though there a few Americans in Europe they far make up for the vast numbers of Europeans asholes with their highly concentrated American assholes. One American with enough water added to dilute the assholeness will equal one million French assholes.

You are correct it is spelled malacca. You are an American malacca if I have seen one.

More curses in the general direction of dmg:
Malacca gamisou
Vlaca
To mounee tis manas sou
Salta gamisou

I do not feel like typing any more curses.

You (none / 0) (#96)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 7th, 2002 at 04:04:26 PM PST

Your biggest problem seems to be that you are a liberal.

In your mind America = The Federal Government. You think that because you have been taught, from the cradle, that you should look to government to solve your every need. To you, the government is the country because without government, there is nothingness. We Americans realize that the government is there because we want it to be there. It exists because we allow it to, not the other weay around. We don't have the twisted world view that you liberals have.

So, whatever problems you have with the US Federal Government are problems with the government, not the people. We, unlike you, have an entirely separate identity.

Malacca (none / 0) (#97)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 7th, 2002 at 04:32:25 PM PST

The American people are malaccas. Their media is controlled by the government very closely. The media feeds propaganda to the American people and the feeble American population believes it.

It would be possible for Americans to escape the media lies except no one reads in America. It is true, they think in America reading should only be done in school or when driving so you can read the street signs. Other than that Americans do not read; not even the nurition information on the back of most food products. Why do you think your people are so fucking fat! Because they do not read. Get it?

First, I want to call this poster an ass because everyone knows the media is controlled by the wealthy elite of American society.

Now, why is it that every time someone points out the faults of the Europeans, they have to get defensive and resort to juvenile insults? America's nowhere near perfect, but at least we understand that we aren't and try to improve. I don't think I have to discuss how badly you screwed over Africa, Asia, the Middle East, and the Americas. It would be safe to say that Europe is the cause of most of the world's problems, in one way or another. Stop this denial and your incessant whining about fat Americans with guns. It gets you nowhere.

When I was living in Switzerland during college, a Swiss national and a France national both told me that their respective countries 'did not have any race problems at all' with straight faces.

I was, to put it mildly, nonplussed. We may live our problems in the glare of the world spotlight, but at least we acknowledge their presence.

HAHA (none / 0) (#151)

by Anonymous Reader on Mon Feb 18th, 2002 at 03:26:56 AM PST

Greece has not had an empire since the Eastern Roman Empire fell in 1459 you stupid American. It seems you do not know history. While most of Western Europe was out conqering we were ruled by the stupid and poor Mongoloid Turks. We will kick their asses now, they are real poor and cannot afford a military, America gives them weapons! Free land in Turkey for all Greeks. Opa opa skoto to turcos ka na su sto pa.

When I first read your report, dmg, I had trouble understanding how a fairly well-researched vacation could have gone so wrong. But after giving the matter some thought, and reading some of the responses you have recieved from the Europeans here, I think I've found an answer.

The problem with your trip is that you did not prepare yourself for the strange European custom known as Irony. It's a very confusing concept, to be sure, and even after dilligent study, Americans like you and me will often fail to see it, and thus entirely misunderstand people who have lived their whole lives immersed in this quaint, old-world social mechanism.

The central tenet of Irony is saying or doing one thing while implying the opposite. Or something like that. I admit I don't understand it completely-- being American robs me of the social constructs necessary for true comprehension. Bear this in mind as I try to explain certain aspects of your trip.

Irony in Britain

When you ate bad food and drank lousy beer in London, you were dissatisfied because you did not understand the British irony of food. The British, awash in Irony, deliberately eat bad food in order to apreciate the ideal of food itself. This is an advanced and remarkable æsthetic, but one that is not apparent without a proper understanding of Irony.

Similarly, the lewd display of advertising for sex in the public phone kiosks stands in marked contrast to the total absence of any sign of affection between British people in public spaces-- this is their irony of intimacy, and once understood, the handbills obscuring the glass next to the phone take on the aspect of art-- a public, participatory collage art unrecognizeable to outsiders.

There is also a British irony of violence, which you touched upon in your brush with their provincial gun laws, but as you did not attend a football match, you lack the context necessary to explore this particular Irony at length.

Irony in Holland

The Ironies of Amsterdam are many, but I will summarize: while they have legalised things like drugs, deviant sex, public urination, sex for money, slight stature, sex with animals, and deliciously intricate bondage, the Dutch have simultaneously rendered themselves incapable of enjoying any of these things.

You don't have to believe me, just ask any of the tall Dutch people. They will insist that they don't care for their "coffee shops," and have no use for the "red light districts," which they have never been to.
In effect, the Dutch, having reduced hedonism to dry theory and confined it to their law-books, must now import their debauchery from the English-speaking nations of America, England, and Australia.

Irony in Greece

Your description of Faliraki seems to conform to other accounts I have read of sophisticated, Irony-laden European locations that function almost exclusively as vacationing sites. Irony is expressed by the locals either by making conditions unbearable, or raising prices, or both, to the greatest degree possible without driving off the tourists. Thus, the basket full of leavings in your bathroom ought to be regarded as a winking welcome note, rather than a health hazard.

As to the behavior of the British women you encountered in Greece, I am fairly certain that they were just indulging in a bit of "post-modern" Irony-based play-acting, and once back in Britain, they will no doubt return to the fur hat and the chauffered Mercedes for a visit to the personal assistant at Harrods to figure out what to do about the drapes in the drawing room.

Again, my understanding of Irony is American, and thus dry, academic, and woefully incomplete. I have undoubtably missed the finer nuances of Irony in your account, but I hope this first attempt at looking at your trip through the lens of Irony might help you to understand what went wrong, and how you might go about avoiding the pitfalls of Irony in the future.

You Sir are the problem.
You have not only understood the concept of irony, but you also have proven to be capable of applying it in practice.
Therefore you will be excluded from the memebership of this site. Thank you for your patience.

Meh... not really, i should know (none / 0) (#147)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 14th, 2002 at 06:15:56 PM PST

Because i'm Dutch (and yes i'm tall, 6 foot 6")
Drugs ain't legal, selling and buying weed is tolerated but if you sell crack you'll get busted. Urinating in public will get you a fine of about 50 bucks too but hey, if you gotta go you gotta go...
About coffeeshops and the red-light district: yes if you go to the Grasshopper you'll only find tourists, it's the first they run into when they get out of the trainstation. You'll get ripped off so nobody from Amsterdam goes there, they're all in the smaller coffeeshops a bit further from the crowds.
And the prostitutes... well at least they have shelter, but i'm not such a fan of the scene since there's also girls that are forced by their pimps, such as illegal refugees that just lost their families and now have to sell their asses for money, those type of things. Nah not really my thing.
And the reason "certain debaucheries are imported from English speaking nations" is because the Dutch language sounds like Louis Armstrong with an angina :)

Garage (+ "r&b" and the associated scene) is one of the most American parts of our "music scene" here in the UK. Garage comes from American soul/funk/house. In fact the word originally meant "underground house", which I think comes from the idea that in the US, garages are often underground (please correct me if I'm wrong).

Most people I know find it deeply embarrassing that garage is associated with the UK. Why did you not choose a more European style of dance music by which to judge the continent? E.g. while trance music is not to everybody's tastes, it's one of Europe's more credible exports, and has been (and will be) around for much longer than the passing fad that is garage.

You are wrong (none / 0) (#113)

by Anonymous Reader on Sat Feb 9th, 2002 at 07:01:27 AM PST

'Garage', as a musical term, originates from the 'Paradise Garage', a gay club that played a defining role in the creation of house music.
The musical style played there came to be known as 'Garage music'.

Incidentally, the musical term 'house' stems from the msuic played at the 'Warehouse' club.

Trance, as you mention, evolved from progressive house in the early nineties, which itself was an amalgamation of techno and house.

Thank you for enlightening me - my point still being that garage is not far removed from its US origins.

However there are other styles of house which have mostly evolved in Europe, such as trance and progressive house, that are much more representative of our music scene.

P.S. I definitely wouldn't come to the UK for "traditional" British food. The thing I love about food in London is how easy it is to get quality foreign food. On my street there is French restaurant, a Turkish restaurant, Greek, Indian, Chinese, Thai, 2 Italians...

Hello My Future Two Years Ago (none / 0) (#150)

by Anonymous Reader on Sat Feb 16th, 2002 at 10:14:43 AM PST

>"E.g. while trance music is not to everybody's >tastes, it's one of Europe's more credible >exports, and has been (and will be) around for >much longer than the passing fad that is garage."

You are hilariously ignorant 1999 style. Trance is a bunch of arpeggiated melodies with all the sophistication of your average Barney tune, and half-assed cut-n-paste marching band beats in the backdrop. Trance died two fucking years ago man, and they even renamed their beloved Tranceport CDs to "Transport."

Mozart trance ain't!

Garages in the US (none / 0) (#161)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Mar 7th, 2002 at 07:35:08 PM PST

Actually, most garages here are a building next to the house. I've got to get out of this damn country. I'm embarrassed that we've let it get this bad, it just goes to show, there are limits to the size a community can be before it gets taken over by assholes. The US needs to be broken up into smaller countries, at least that way we couldn't fuck with the world like we do.

I live in Amsterdam, so I'd like to comment on the picture you have painted in your journal. Let me get this straight: you went into a coffee shop right next to the centraal station, and you were surprised to find many tourists there. Hmm, interesting. And yes, the red light district is disgusting, you make a comment that "Women were on display like goods in a department store". Wow who would have expected that in a red light district.

While you were in amsterdam, did you go partying like you say you set out to do? I moved here a year ago and I'm still amazed at the kind of parties you can find when you do a little research.

I suggest you visit Amsterdam again, this time preferably with someone who actually knows the place. Come in the summer, rent a bike, and just go exploring. There are thousands of little cafes, bars, pubs, restaurants etc that do not suffer from the tourist-syndrome.

Not an American. Most US cities don't have an obvious red light district. They aren't usually large. There might be some lingerie or sex toys on display. In my city, there are no pictures of anything on the signs just words saying "Nude Girls" or "Novelties and Adult Toys"

EVERYONE I know who has ever been to Amsterdam says "That city is disgusting" or "Those people are so immoral" or "women were put on display."

I haven't been there (so don't count my opinion too much), but in the eyes of Americans, the Red Light district reflects very poorly on Amsterdam. So don't be surprised when Americans complain about it._
_
Do you suffer from late-night hacking? Ask your doctor about Protonix.

jacoplane's right (none / 0) (#148)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 14th, 2002 at 07:27:11 PM PST

I'm from a town about 20 minutes away from Amsterdam so i've been there a lot. Yeah the Grasshopper is the first coffeeshop you run into, and along with The Bulldog it's the most popular (amongst tourists) so DUH...
The red light district, well it's there and if you don't like it, DON'T GO THERE. It's a fairly small area (just a few blocks really) so it's easily avoided. Yeah that area is crowded with perverts, pimps and drugdealers but those are present in ANY country, at least now they mostly crowd up in one place so the cops can keep an eye on them. That's why it's reasonably safe to walk the streets of the red light district at 2.00 am. Can you say the same thing about the "bad neighborhoods" of New York or L.A. ? I think not...
But we realy are tall though. And you know what they say about tall people :)

Clever... (5.00 / 1) (#112)

by Anonymous Reader on Sat Feb 9th, 2002 at 03:11:31 AM PST

You, sir, are either very clever, or sadly deluded, and I suspect the former. Allow me to discuss:

You comment that you are a 'party animal', but your only 'proof' is that you watch movies of people having a great time. Oh, we must not forget that you watch Harry Potter movies, too. What else could constitute a 'wild boy at heart'?

You suggest that you lead a terribly exciting life. Again, you demonstrated this, not by your own personal account, but by references to other people participating in such events. You link to some very exciting web pages, by the way...

You finally make good on your whimsical thoughts of an 'exciting life' by visiting a continent with a little soul. You are nothing short of horrified of people enjoying themselves. You say: 'Now I am not a prude', yet simple, straightforward nudity seems to offend you. I truely wonder who you are trying to convince: your audience, or yourself? Further, I'm entertained that you think that no americans would participate in any kind of similar 'personal' display. Also, american toilets can be just as sanitary as european toilets, in case you hadn't heard.

I am glad, however, that this entire article is just for show. You proficiently suggest excitement, without actually providing any evidence of any real fun. You also suggest that your horrible vacation would actually be enjoyable to any random 'netizen'. Right. I'm sure that seeing a naked woman is really abhorent to you.

All of these arguments suggest that you are self-delusional. I can see that you have other thoughts(yes, the link makes no sense) in mind, however.

I hereby applaud you on your writing sk1llz in causing people to respond to your comments (as I have), as I see no other purpose to this 'article', and now must take my leave of this place.

First thing I have to say Is I am British and your discription of Londen deeply upset me. As to your comment about Warm beer anyone who knows anything knows that draft beer is served warm as a rule, it is stored in large barrels in a celler and is braught up by a system of pumps and it has that lovely warm malty taste, I can imagaine going into a bar and there NOT being warm draft beer on offer. And Fish and chips is NOT a british stapel Thats a mith, I might have fish and chips 3 or 4 times a year. Just as im sure you americans dont all have perfect teeth live in whitewashed houses have garguntuan amounts of food etc etc.

As for the adverts in the phone booths, yes this is true, unfortainatly but I have only ever seen it in London. By the way when you were IN london did you acctually go anywere London is famouse for (Houses of parliment Big ben Winsor palace the tower of london, thats not metioning all the museums and art gallerys) Yes like all citys london has its seedyer side, but are you seriously saying Amercan Big citys like New York are 'perfect'

If your going to give tourist locations in London you ought to stick to London, and give the correct name. Windsor Castle (palace?) as the name implies is in Windsor not London.

Greece (none / 0) (#138)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 12th, 2002 at 06:09:24 AM PST

You're very hard on us Brits, but you should be aware that we're historically a bawdy lot, only a superficial clean-up was managed by Victorians, and we're now back to the kind of standards written about in many of Shakespeare's plays.
The Dutch are a lovely people, with a long, long history of tolerance. Unfortunately they tolerate junkies shooting up on their doorsteps.
As for the Greeks: Many years ago Aristotle (a famous Greek philosopher) said: "A woman for necessity, a boy for pleasure, a goat for ecstasy" so nothing you saw in Greece should surprise you. British people who go to Greece tend to be perverts, only there because of the historically open attitudes to ALL kinds of sexuality.
Europeans are far more connected to their sexual history, the North America was populated by people who were disgusted by Europe and wished to leave. Its not surprising that you are so prudish today.
Stay home, rent some Good Old American Movies. and eat a lot of chips.

This quote was not Aristotle, it was the more recent mystic Islamic philosopher Al-Azmakhram Al-Mahwami Al-Khufher from what is now Algeria who said in 1475
A women for duty, a boy for pleasure, but a melon for ecstasy

Nowhere were goats mentioned. You can try and catch me out because you think of me as an unsophisticated American, but I am cleverer than you think.

Mind you, It would not surprise me to find British tourists fucking goats. They will fuck anything else.

time to give a Newtonian demonstration - of a bullet, its mass and its acceleration.
-- MC Hawking

You're wrong (none / 0) (#141)

by Anonymous Reader on Wed Feb 13th, 2002 at 02:58:21 AM PST

I was in the Boogie Bar on Thassos when he said it. It was about 10 years ago, he said "I am Aristotle, a famous philosopher" he squeezed my bum and murmured "A woman for necessity, a boy for pleasure and a goat for ecstasy" he then tried to kiss me. Later I went outside to find the toilets (there were none) and he was importuning a goat.

haha (none / 0) (#140)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 12th, 2002 at 09:45:09 AM PST

If I were to go on holiday to Miami and visit some of the more colourful areas then I too would probably be shocked. But I would also know that not all of America is like this.

You are extremely ignorant, people like you give Americans a bad name. It may be good that you have been outside the states, but all the places you have visited are not far from home. I don't think you want to experience a different culture, which is one of the main ideas of a holiday.

You go to greece yet find things are different from how you like them. A topless beach...wow, could this be so that women can develop their tan without the need for pure white breasts? I think it you who have the flawed attitude if you can't see that it is not a "slutty" display at all.

The British teens do have a tendency to party, but you obviously not the party animal that you crack yourself out to be. Do you not think that the girl you had sex with was thinking about what a repulsive accent you had?

And also....what exactly did you visit London for? If you were looking for the culture then then surely you should have headed for the museams. Why not dine in the posh resteraunts or go to a McDonalds (which I'm sure would have made you feel at home).

The British uncultured...hah. You uncultured...more like it!

I am SOOOO sorry (none / 0) (#144)

by Anonymous Reader on Thu Feb 14th, 2002 at 07:33:47 AM PST

I am really sorry for you. You sound miserable. And, to say in your own words, you represent the stereotype American.
(I apologize to the others, who do not think as this lettered author)

AMERICAN CHEESE DICK (none / 0) (#152)

by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 19th, 2002 at 06:45:28 AM PST

Listen to me you fucking AIDS monkey, wots ya crack with Faliraki?? All you American arse bandits are fucking fairy's, you cannot handle ya beer! And wots wrong with you not up for a menage et tois? You bottled it mate, pure and simple? Finally, you reckon Londons got naff, unhealthy food, then explain to me why the fuck approximately 3/4 of your population are fat cunts????

Any more comments you feel you need to make, e-mail me at jrizzle82@aol.com

But i will cut and paste it here if it will be allowed with the emotional swearing

Truthfully R00d d00d, that guy is what i would call a steriotypical US asshole if i ever met one, Not saying that any of you USA citizens here r like that but i have met few who are. In my job i am very lucky to travel the entire globe at some point or another in my career and generally like the places i visit. Let me make a few things clear to our American brethren who bother to read this FUCKWITTS comments.

Beer NOT FUCKING LAGER...should normally be served at just below room temp especially real ales. It is not the pisswater this so called well travelled fucknutz is used too, Yes lager as a rule can handle low temp serving and is indeed needed in many cases....trust me i am an expert when it comes to beer It just goes to prove who is the fucking retard in his comments...that fucking idiot should have been put down at birth

Fish and chips....a gret brittish delacacy...since when ??? it was a cheap meal which was primarily used to feed the masses during the second world war as all its ingreedients are readily available in an Island state such as our green and sceptered isle and by the way...it aint cheap any more. There are some resturants here that specialize in Fish and Chips and these are the places to go...talk to a local and he/she will recommend one.

Native English are not rude as a generalization but every culture has its share of assholes, last time i was in Detroit i recieved my fair share of abuse....so fuckin what ??

Obviously he chose a choice nightclub to go to and again took the local youth advice....jeez intelegence is not his strong point is it.

Yes i agree with England being expensive...no further comment needed

Who in their right mind uses a public phone box in the middle of a street to phone back to his office ?? i use my mobile or use the lobby phone or even...and wait for this stroke of genius...the phone in your room

Bad teeth...lol i have fine teeth as do 90% of the people i know and work with, he obviously stayed in a choice part of town didnt he ?? obviously planned his trip with such millitary precision...FUCKING IGNORANT TWAT

Hahaah...goes to Amsterdam to taste European culture....fucking A....what a fucking knob, the only reason you go to the area he stayed in is to get druged out of your mind legally and shag your brains out or wank yourself stupid....if he expected culture then he went to the wrong location...again a well thought out travel itinerary

Ok on to the comments about Greece...ok they are not the most modern society in Europe but you dont go to Rhodes (not Rhodos) to taste modern culture do you ???
Most island in the Medderterainian have water shortage problems and the waste disposal is always the same...this guy is just fucking ignorant

Yep i dont like the lager louts either...but hey we know how to party on...and it would seem that he is just a prude and a waster.

To sum it up, if that is what you Americans think of us then STAY WHERE U ARE, wallow in your own fucking culture of 200 massive years. This guy truley wound me up and no wonder he was treated with the utter contempt he deserved. His is obviously a well travelled party animal...hahaha.
Get your sorry asses over here and i will show you the time of your life....Sith, Marcomang, Mazda and u regulars know how i feel about u guys in the US of A, but this ignoramus is the epitome of how a lot of Europeans see you...now do you wonder why ??

I would like to apologize for my poor english, I'm sorry for the fact I'm so dumb I can't type proper english.

I don't easily judge people but this time I fear for the worst. the purpose of going on vacation in another country is to get a taste of different culture. If you don't want to experience this then it's better to throw away your passport and stay home for the rest of your life in your so called perfect country.

I suppose you also don't understand why people like Osama B. Laden have something against your beloved U.S.A. Well to make a long story short, You don't like it when you get bossed around, perhaps somebody else shares your feeling. I don't like Osama B. Laden or his actions but I can understand why he has so many followers.

I'm not saying that we are perfect but I won't take these insults from a person who originates from the country with the highest crime numbers, one of the worst social security systems and a war-sick leader that wants to blast away whole the world so he can be the ruler of this world.

Isn't it funny that everytime Bush seems to get in a bad position the American law enforcement always arrests a terrorist so that the attention gets pulled away from Bush

Just a reminder for you, if Europe never sended out their explorers you would probably be still humping around a fire and hunting down buffalo's. Most of those explores were criminals and outlaws just for you to know. Yeah shocking newsflash to you, you originate from a drunk english/portugese/spanish/... criminal who
couldn't stay in UK/Portugal/Spain... . Or you are a Native American but then again you won't be thrilled to state this as you would think that their culture is barbaric and just below your standard

PS:
I know not all Americans are like this "dmg" but I fear for the worst if there are any more outthere like this one

dmg (none / 0) (#166)

by Anonymous Reader on Fri Jul 19th, 2002 at 12:34:03 AM PST

Congratulations you've got your self a passport!! It must have taken a while to fill in the forms not knowing who your real father was and all...Yet I cant help but feel grateful for the fact that only 10% of your "Great nation" hold them. I mean could you imagine.....60% of the population are obese...gonna cause a bit of a problem fitting into airplane seats (not that that's really a problem anymore), and who's to cater for the Americans love processed food?! That's one the thing the rest of the world has got to be thankful for, imagine....the culinary taste of a nation, broken down into two main food types: McDonalds and ......who cares it's going to be fried and have no real taste!! but it will be mass marketed all around the world at other people expense. NICE!!

You see, the reason you probably had a really bad time was no doubt for a number of reasons...1. You chose crappy places to go...I guess you thought.. as you said "I'm a bit of a party Animal" (I'll come back to that later)....OK! well even so, why not Italy?! or France?! just two of the the most highly regarded places in Europe....ah...of course..they don't speak English. So already your own inadequacy has put a downer on the whole trip. Shame! as for England....What!?..everyone knows its grey and nasty! Did you think they were joking? ....(Listen!! - Seems to be a nation shortcoming that!!) FALIRAKI is regarded by the rest of the world as the asshole of Europe, where all the lame UK Garage crowd go! They're right! It sucks! Why did you go there?!...The rest of the real UK/Europe party crowd don't!! One word..Ibiza.

Seems to me you cannot of been thinking straight when you booked this trip of yours! Leading me nicely onto Amsterdam...U WHAT?! You were looking for local charm and conversation! & were shocked at the amount of Americans and British who were already there..funny that!! I wonder what that were doing!?....Smoking gear and looking at Whores.....THE WHOLE REASON YOU WENT THERE?! Idiot! (oooh I wasn't expecting that!! - handy that they speak English though!) Tit!

Basically it seems to me, you say your a Party Animal..maybe so! (I find it hard to believe you even know the meaning of the word! Fiddling with your cousin in some barn while listening to Backstreet Boys doesn't count!) but one who couldn't plan a piss up in a brewery!..In truth, if you'd bothered to research a few things you could have had a great time, instead, you made a mistake and now your hiding behind nationalistic arrogance and narrow mindedness, you know.... the whole 'Better then thou shit' to mask the fact that..."hey, shit, maybe the rest of the world doesn't think I'm great!........Dam right!! Let me guess your next journey will be to Asia where you'll no doubt spew your xenophobic views all across the web again. All I can say is good!!! Make sure you do!! Hopefully we can cut that 10% down to 2% (you still need to get some terrorists in and out!!).

Do the world a favour...Burn the thing...it's only going to add to 25% of world pollution your country already produces! (Bearing in mind you only account for 4% of the global population) But it'll be worth it!!.....I'll even send you the matches!!

StalkS.

dmg (none / 0) (#167)

by Anonymous Reader on Fri Jul 19th, 2002 at 12:48:09 AM PST

It would be silly of me to think all Americans act and behave this way.

but for all the 98% read it and weep!

StalkS

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