re: Serious question about Lincoln and the Civil War, no flame.

quote:Economic interests was a supporting factor that made up the actual reasons. . .but it wasn't the reason.

Of course economics was the reason. You think if Southern Planters had gained access to Automated Cotton Picker/Module Makers that could bring their harvest to market at half the cost, they'd have given a rat's arse about holding slaves?

re: Serious question about Lincoln and the Civil War, no flame.(Posted by Roaad on 11/24/12 at 1:02 pm to NC_Tigah)

quote:Cotton, and rice, and indigo

It was: The South starring cotton, with small cameos by rice and indigo

quote:While the pace of industrialization picked up in the North in the 1850s, the agricultural economy of the slave South grew, if anything, more entrenched. In the decade before the Civil War cotton prices rose more than 50 percent, to 11.5 cents a pound. Booming cotton prices stimulated new western cultivation and actually checked modest initiatives in economic diversification of the previous decade. The U.S. cotton crop nearly doubled, from 2.1 million bales in 1850 to 3.8 million bales ten years later. Not surprisingly, given these figures, the southern economy remained overwhelmingly agricultural. Southern capitalists sank money into cotton rather than factories or land. More precisely, they invested in slaves; the average slave owner held almost two-thirds of his wealth in slaves in 1860, much less than he held in land. Economic historians have concluded that returns on capital in antebellum Southern manufacturing were reasonable and sometimes lucrative, but they simply failed to attract investors in any numbers. By 1860, while northeastern states such as Massachusetts and Pennsylvania had nearly $100 million each invested in manufacturing enterprises, even Virginia, the most industrialized of the Southern states, had invested less than $20 million, and the figure dropped below $5 million elsewhere in the South. A comparison of the value of goods manufactured in each region is similarly lopsided: more than $150 million each for Massachusetts and Pennsylvania, less than $30 million for Virginia, and less than $5 million for Alabama.

re: Serious question about Lincoln and the Civil War, no flame.(Posted by Roaad on 11/24/12 at 1:16 pm to NC_Tigah)

quote:You think if Southern Planters had gained access to Automated Cotton Picker/Module Makers that could bring their harvest to market at half the cost, they'd have given a rat's arse about holding slaves?

Economics was the largest apologetic for slavery, to be sure. But it wasn't the only one.

re: Serious question about Lincoln and the Civil War, no flame.(Posted by League Champs on 11/24/12 at 1:20 pm to RollTide1987)

quote:So the North fired on Fort Sumter?

Revisionism much?

quote:On December 26, 1860, six days after South Carolina declared its secession, U.S. Army Major Robert Anderson abandoned the indefensible Fort Moultrie and secretly relocated the 1st U.S. Artillery to Fort Sumter without orders from Washington. Over the next few months repeated calls for evacuation of Fort Sumter from the government of South Carolina and then from Confederate Brigadier General P. G. T. Beauregard were ignored. Union attempts to resupply and reinforce the garrison were repulsed on January 9, 1861. The Military College of South Carolina prevented a hired steamer from transporting troops and supplies to Fort Sumter. President Lincoln ordered a fleet of ships, under the command of Gustavus V. Fox, to attempt entry into Charleston Harbor and supply Fort Sumter.

I'm pretty sure all these events ocurred AFTER So Carolina left the Union.

Most slave owners were white. There were very few black slave owners. Don't try to justify slavery with this bs. Slavery was wrong and demeaning to a race of people. Lincoln knew slavery was wrong and he did the right thing. Slavery was not ending and would be around today if white people thought it was still good for America. Slavery had to be enforced just like integration.

re: Serious question about Lincoln and the Civil War, no flame.(Posted by JB14 on 11/24/12 at 4:00 pm to Roaad)

quote:Therefore, to the Union, they were well within their rights to resupply their base.

To be fair here, Lincoln et al. clearly knew what they were doing in ordering Maj. Robert Anderson to stand-by and await resupply. I mean damn, Lincoln had a tough enough time convincing his cabinet, Seward in particular, of the necessity of this action. Somehow he managed to sway them on his second try.

Sheer political brilliance from Lincoln. Knowingly defying Beauregard's ultimatum and initiating a conflict while simultaneously casting your opponent as the aggressor.

re: Serious question about Lincoln and the Civil War, no flame.(Posted by JB14 on 11/24/12 at 4:01 pm to 2ToughTiger)

quote:Most slave owners were white. There were very few black slave owners. Don't try to justify slavery with this bs. Slavery was wrong and demeaning to a race of people. Lincoln knew slavery was wrong and he did the right thing. Slavery was not ending and would be around today if white people thought it was still good for America. Slavery had to be enforced just like integration.