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If Bale was American or Canadian, then you would have liked him? I don't get what one has to do with the other.

Where did I say that I cared what he was? I said I didn't care for his portrayal of Wayne/Batman. The only movies I liked that he was in were Empire of the Sun, The Prestige, and Public Enemies. And in two of those, he wasn't even the main actor.

Considering that Singer's film was pretty much a sequel to Donner's Superman films, it's only logical that he find someone that could fill Chris Reeve's 6'4", 215 pound suit. Unfortunately, Singer made the dumb mistake of bringing Lex Luthor back as the villian. Routh could only work with what he was given, and still made me believe he was Clark Kent/Superman.

As for Christian Bale, I didn't care for his Bruce Wayne/Batman. And as for Ryan Reynolds playing Hal Jordan, I will take a Canadian actor over a British actor anyday

It's kinda like J.K. Rowling's thing with only British actors playing the characters from Harry Potter. An American icon such as Superman should be played by an American, period.

Well the whole script to Superman Returns was garbage. We can only wonder how Routh would have been if they would have gone ahead and made a sequel to Superman Returns. But Singer did almost clearly destroy the Superman Franchise.

I don't get the different whether he be from Canada or England. Hal is an American. Ryan Reynolds is Canadian. By your own logic you should hate him in the part!

And as for J.K.Rowling wanting only British actors in the parts is mostly cause American actors have no idea of being British other than butchering the accent. And just cause Superman is "American." Doesn't mean anything! He is a World Icon! Besides, what the hell does it matter who plays the character as long as he fits the criteria for the part? Tall, Good looking, has a squared jaw. and can act! I got to wonder how you would feel when rumored that Will Smith was supposedly up for the part when they were doing Superman Returns. A Black Superman! Would you have hated that too? Of course I would have, not that he would have been black. I just hate Will Smith!

"I mark the hours every one, Nor have I yet outrun the Sun. My use & value unto you, are gauged by what you have to do."Enscribed onto Hermione Granger's Time Turner from Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban

I'm more nervous about the costume Zack Snyder is going to give him. He's been quoted as saying it won't look like Christopher Reeve's. Even the costume in Superman Returns wasn't a big departure. I just hope it isn't something like these...

While Snyder said that it wouldn't be like Reeve's suit, he means Spandex. It will be something similar how the Returns suit was minus all the \S/ all over it, Has more of the opened neck that the suit is to have, and not be so dark. But not be so bright as Reeve's was. Probably along the lines of this!

I just hope they get the hair right! I hated how Routh's hair was so static when he walked around. Then blowing in the wind when flying. The static again when he stopped.

"I mark the hours every one, Nor have I yet outrun the Sun. My use & value unto you, are gauged by what you have to do."Enscribed onto Hermione Granger's Time Turner from Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban

I've heard recent rumors that Snyder is going to be taking cues from 'Batman Begins' for the new Superman film. So, does this mean Clark Kent will be doing a dress rehearsal to become Superman for 90 minutes of the film like 'Batman Begins' did with Bruce Wayne??

I've heard recent rumors that Snyder is going to be taking cues from 'Batman Begins' for the new Superman film. So, does this mean Clark Kent will be doing a dress rehearsal to become Superman for 90 minutes of the film like 'Batman Begins' did with Bruce Wayne??

I'm tired of long, drawn out origin movies.

While I loved Batman Begins(way more than the overrateed Dark Knight movie), I hope this Superman movie doesn't go all "realistic" just becuase Nolan is the producer. He supposedly had to be talked into keeping Batman's "ears" in his first movie and then needed to explain that they contained listening devices. It's a superhero movie. Just make it cool and forget about all of the real world explanations.

While Snyder said that it wouldn't be like Reeve's suit, he means Spandex. It will be something similar how the Returns suit was minus all the \S/ all over it, Has more of the opened neck that the suit is to have, and not be so dark. But not be so bright as Reeve's was. Probably along the lines of this!

I hope you're right. Snyder was pretty faithful with Watchmen. I hope he doesn't decide to give us "his Superman". He's really hit or miss with me as a director. I loved Dawn Of The Dead, thought Watchmen was OK(Malin Akerman really dragged the movie down imo), hated 300, & was bored to tears in The Legend Of The Guardians. Superman is neck in neck with He-Man for my favorite fictional hero of all time.

Originally Posted by Lord_Of_Destruction

Lois was a redhead in the comics from the late 80's through the 90's

I'm not complaining since I LOVE redheads, but I always thought the red in her hair was similar to the blue in Superman's hair; a way to show texture while keeping the dark colors of their hair.

Last edited by Mr. Shokoti; March 28, 2011 at 01:36am.
Reason: Automerged Doublepost

I don't get the different whether he be from Canada or England. Hal is an American. Ryan Reynolds is Canadian. By your own logic you should hate him in the part!

Nope, see cause most Canadians I know, and I am related to quite a few on my maternal grandfather's side, they all speak North American English, not British English

Just admit you're enamored with Henry Cavill and think he's a great choice, and I'll admit that I disagree with you. IMHO he's a poor choice, it's that simple. And I don't like Amy Adams for Lois Lane either.

As I recall, Superman Returns generated mostly positive reviews, but WB and Legendary were diappointed by box office returns. Although I'd say $391 million is nothing to sneeze at.

Pigs will fly before there's a He-Man film so I don't need to figure that one out. LOL But if you can find an actor who can act and has the physique of Roland Kickinger, or 80's Arnold, you may have your He-Man.

Nope, see cause most Canadians I know, and I am related to quite a few on my maternal grandfather's side, they all speak North American English, not British English

Just admit you're enamored with Henry Cavill and think he's a great choice, and I'll admit that I disagree with you. IMHO he's a poor choice, it's that simple. And I don't like Amy Adams for Lois Lane either.

As I recall, Superman Returns generated mostly positive reviews, but WB and Legendary were diappointed by box office returns. Although I'd say $391 million is nothing to sneeze at.

Actually the reviews were not favorable. The critics ripped it apart. They did compare it to the Chris Reeve films. Maybe if Singer would have made his own version of Superman instead of making one based off anothers ideals of the character. The film would have been better if he did what he did with Supes as he did with X-Men. Instead, he got a actor who looked and sounded like Reeves. Had Kevin Spacy playing Gene Hackman as Lex Luthor. Kate Bosworth as horrid as Lois Lane. A bad plot with a emo Supes. Luthor plotting again on how to get Real Estate. And the whole stupid child plot. I seriously still would like to know what thoe script writers were smoking? Especially when they claimed they were such fans of the character. And with the film costing about $209,000,000 and it only made near $391 Million. It's considered a moderately successful film. But in the eyes of the studio. It was a failure!

As for Cavill, Yes! I like him! I've seen him in many films and I liked him in The Tudors. Always thought he would make a good Superman. Even back in 2006 when he was one of the candidates to be cast in the part for Superman Returns. But I also liked Routh. But always felt that Singer really ruined the chance for Routh to shine as Superman. As for Adams, I agree with you there. I just don't see her as Lois. She doesn't come off as a Lois type. Like with Superman, I always have a certain view point on how the character should look. Amy Adams doesn't look the part. Even if they dye her hair dark brown or black. Nope! Amy is wholesome looking. Lois is to be beautiful and sexy. While being this strong tough woman who is able to take care of herself. I don't see Amy that way. But I could be wrong and she might be a great Lois! I will have to wait and see! But I do wish Olivia Wilde was cast instead. Especially since she is young. Not being 9 years older than the male lead. Now I wonder if they will have Lex Luthor in it? Even if he is not the main villain. I just hope they get Billy Zane for the part!

"I mark the hours every one, Nor have I yet outrun the Sun. My use & value unto you, are gauged by what you have to do."Enscribed onto Hermione Granger's Time Turner from Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban

While I loved Batman Begins(way more than the overrateed Dark Knight movie), I hope this Superman movie doesn't go all "realistic" just becuase Nolan is the producer. He supposedly had to be talked into keeping Batman's "ears" in his first movie and then needed to explain that they contained listening devices. It's a superhero movie. Just make it cool and forget about all of the real world explanations.

Dark Knight isn't overrated. A bit to long yes, but not overrated.
The themes presented in the movie were very engaging. It deconstructed our modern society and showed us our faults and flaws.

As for the real world and real life, you may not like it, but they have become a big part of comics, if not with Marvel in the 60's, with it's flawed heroes, than with Alan Moore and Frank Miller in the 80's, who added a heavy psychiological angle to superheroes.
Someone at Comicvine posted a video, in which he asked various comic writers if good should always triumph over evil. Most said no. Real life was one of the reasons.

Fictional characters are just that. Fictional. They have no personality or free will of their own.
Writers and editors mold them to their own wants and needs.
All we as the audience and fans can do is pick and choose our favorite interpretation and ignore the rest.

I really gotta defend Lex Luthor. Just as the Joker isn't a threat because he can take out Batman in a fight, Luthor is dangerous because he's brilliant and often several steps ahead of Superman. This is the aspect of Luthor that hasn't been in any of the movies except as hot air (well it was sort of in Superman 4 if only because he created Nuclear Man). Luthor should be approached like Hannibal Lector on the loose--or as the mental equivalent of Batman. I wouldn't mind seeing the business man version most of all, but my preference would be a combination of the two--basically DCAU's version.

Originally Posted by Marvelous0ne

Had Kevin Spacy playing Gene Hackman as Lex Luthor.

I think this is a misconception. Hackman at least had the ego-maniacal "greatest criminal mind of our time" side down. His showdown with Reeve was satisfying even though not a single punch was thrown. Spacey however was playing a typical Spacey villain, sleazy and devious but not someone who felt like he matched Superman's strength with his own evil genius.

Originally Posted by Marvelous0ne

Actually the reviews were not favorable.

Depends on which ones you read, as with all movies, even mega hits like Avatar. But I read plenty of raves, including David Ansen of Newsweek who I remember was all too happy to rip apart Episode One 12 year ago.

Dark Knight isn't overrated. A bit to long yes, but not overrated.
The themes presented in the movie were very engaging. It deconstructed our modern society and showed us our faults and flaws.

Imo it is. As far as I know, I'm still entitled to my own opinion. Let's just agree to disagree. Btw, you're reading wayyy too much into that movie imo. How did it deconstruct our society? Nolan is quite pretentious imo. Wait for my upcoming thread on how the recent Yogi Bear movie was an insightful look at modern America's problems with consumerism & its voracious appetite for unhealthy foods.

Originally Posted by SLO-MAN

As for the real world and real life, you may not like it, but they have become a big part of comics, if not with Marvel in the 60's, with it's flawed heroes, than with Alan Moore and Frank Miller in the 80's, who added a heavy psychiological angle to superheroes.
Someone at Comicvine posted a video, in which he asked various comic writers if good should always triumph over evil. Most said no. Real life was one of the reasons.

You're confusing relatable emotions with a "realistic" portrayal of superheroes. I never once said that all superhero movies need to be in dayglo colors with smiling heroes. My issue is when every superhero is given jeans, black leather, and/or an "upgrade" to their costumes. I also feel the need to explain why Batman has a cape or batears is moot. As much as Nolan seems to pride himself on "realism" in his movies, Batman is not realistic. If people feel that superheroes need to be drastically rehauled in order to fit into a movie, maybe they should work with a different genre. Tim Burton's Batman movie embraced superheroes(even though the director didn't personally) & played it straight and was still popular. I didn't like it due to the script(Batman doesn't kill), some of the performances(Gordon was boring and Basinger was annoying), and all of the crummy Prince music, but it did superheroes a lot better than Nolan.

Originally Posted by gbagok

I really gotta defend Lex Luthor. Just as the Joker isn't a threat because he can take out Batman in a fight, Luthor is dangerous because he's brilliant and often several steps ahead of Superman. This is the aspect of Luthor that hasn't been in any of the movies except as hot air (well it was sort of in Superman 4 if only because he created Nuclear Man). Luthor should be approached like Hannibal Lector on the loose--or as the mental equivalent of Batman. I wouldn't mind seeing the business man version most of all, but my preference would be a combination of the two--basically DCAU's version.

I agree with you on Luthor. Sure, he may not be as flashy as The Joker or Doctor Doom(unless he's wearing his Kryptonite armor) but I still feel he's one of the greatest villains in all of comics. He's dangerous due to his genius, his ego, and his ability to get past his defeats & come back at his enemies all over again.

Originally Posted by gbagok

I think this is a misconception. Hackman at least had the ego-maniacal "greatest criminal mind of our time" side down. His showdown with Reeve was satisfying even though not a single punch was thrown. Spacey however was playing a typical Spacey villain, sleazy and devious but not someone who felt like he matched Superman's strength with his own evil genius.

While Hackman's Luthor was fun, I actually liked Spacey's better. Sure, he wasn't as ruthless as his comic book counterpart, but he seemed to have a great deal more anger & intensity to him than Hackman. He also didn't have to be tricked into shaving his mustache before filming began or have an issue with wearing a bald piece. Considering as little hair as Hackman had in later movies, it really shouldn't have been a big issue to begin with.

Last edited by Mr. Shokoti; March 28, 2011 at 06:14pm.
Reason: Automerged Doublepost

While Hackman's Luthor was fun, I actually liked Spacey's better. Sure, he wasn't as ruthless as his comic book counterpart, but he seemed to have a great deal more anger & intensity to him than Hackman. He also didn't have to be tricked into shaving his mustache before filming began or have an issue with weaing a bald piece. Considering as little hair as Hackman had in later movies, it really shouldn't have been a big issue to begin with.

I can see where you're coming from, and that's a good point that he had anger to fuel his villainy (whereas Hackman never seemed very angry at being beaten by Superman even in the sequels). My beef with Spacey's Luthor was that the anger felt like a crutch for an otherwise limp threat. I was really disappointed when he realized Jason's secret and just picked up and ran instead of doing something with that huge advantage that luck had just handed to him. To me he wasn't used to his full potential in that movie, and the popular opinion seems to be "Luthor is a boring villain who shouldn't be used again" as a result. Of course before many people said he was a clown, so I guess Spacey at least tried to give him more menace. It just still wasn't enough.

I am the complete opposite. I never saw Routh looking anything like Superman. Something about the face never connected with me, then Singer changed the design of the costume and closed off the neck area, drawing even more attention to that.

The new guy I can see Superman right away.

The face was awesome! I think he SCREAMED Superman and Clark Kent. Perfect black as night hair, piercing blue eyes, statuesque, exquisite bone structure...he looks like an artist's rendition of Superman, to me, at least.

The costume...is another story. Don't get me started on the costume. I DO think that Superman Returns and the new Spiderman must have had the same tailer though!

Anyway, news I can't believe nobody else posted:

Snyder says Superman is "broken" and disses Thor. I can't find the article I read this morning, but the comment isn't in this one. He said something like "When everyone's talking about Thor and not Superman, something's wrong in the world."

While I loved Batman Begins(way more than the overrateed Dark Knight movie), I hope this Superman movie doesn't go all "realistic" just becuase Nolan is the producer. He supposedly had to be talked into keeping Batman's "ears" in his first movie and then needed to explain that they contained listening devices. It's a superhero movie. Just make it cool and forget about all of the real world explanations.

Besides, who goes to a superhero movie to see the REAL WORLD???? Superhero movies are about ESCAPISM, a chance to get away from finance troubles and other real life crap for two hours.

Batman Begins and The Dark Knight weren't terrible films but they weren't perfect either. Batman Begins took too damn long to get things rolling and The Dark Knight had a stupid ending.

That and the fact that these "real world" superhero movies treat it as if there is no such thing as another super being or other person rising to become a hero in their own right.

This is why I've been liking the Marvel films since Iron Man and The Incredible Hulk. All of these heroes EXIST within the SAME world and the films interconnect in some subtle and some big ways.

Lately, all of the DC movies try so damn hard to be self contained worlds where it could never be possible for Batman or Superman to encounter each other. So, I guess DC never plans on ever having a Justice League movie when their stupid directors make it impossible to have a Justice League in any of the film universes.

When it comes to movies, Marvel is better. When it comes to comics, neither DC or Marvel are good since all of their comics are pretty much crap today.

Snyder says Superman is "broken" and disses Thor. I can't find the article I read this morning, but the comment isn't in this one. He said something like "When everyone's talking about Thor and not Superman, something's wrong in the world."

Great. Superman isn't broken imo. He's had one movie in 25 years that had a lot of problems with it. That doesn't mean he's broken. I'm getting visions of Jon Peters talking to Kevin Smith where he didn't want Superman to fly, he thought of him as a killer, wanted him to have a gay robot sidekick(how can a robot be gay?), and Lex Luthor should have a space dog for a sidekick.

I don't think Thor looks good but it's not really professional to trash the competition in public when you're in the industry. I'd expect something like that from Marvel(at least the people who make Marvel comics). I love Superman but I'm really wishing Snyder, Nolan, & Goyer had nothing to do with this movie.

Originally Posted by Hordak Alpha

The Dark Knight had a stupid ending.

Thank God someone else thinks that as well. The whole speech from Gordon to his son(the little kid almost derailed the entire movie with his horrific acting)had me just rolling my eyes. That and the cliched scene with the two boats with bombs. How touching! Those on the outside of a prison can actually act worse than those behind bars. It felt like something an uber liberal first year film student would write for a short film.

Originally Posted by Hordak Alpha

Lately, all of the DC movies try so damn hard to be self contained worlds where it could never be possible for Batman or Superman to encounter each other. So, I guess DC never plans on ever having a Justice League movie when their stupid directors make it impossible to have a Justice League in any of the film universes.

I'm hoping crossovers happen now that Green Lantern will be out in a few months with The Flash eventually coming next. Geoff Johns is dealing with a lot of DC's Hollywood features and he's definitely old school when it comes to superheroes(except for some unfortunate scenes of extreme violence in his books). The few episodes he's written for Smallville have been the most "superhero-like" episodes of that show. I just want Nolan's last Batman movie to come out so it's possible to see Batman in another superhero movie. Nolan & Bale have already said they'll never do a superhero crossover.

Originally Posted by Hordak Alpha

When it comes to movies, Marvel is better. When it comes to comics, neither DC or Marvel are good since all of their comics are pretty much crap today.

I guess I agree with you about Marvel's movies for the most part. I didn't like Iron Man 2, but I did have a lot more fun at Iron Man & The Incredible Hulk(although I hated the Abomination's new Frankenstein's Monster design) than either of the recent Batman movies. I disagree about DC's comics. They may not be the best they've ever been, but there is still a lot of great books coming from them imo. Marvel's books, imo, don't even resemble the characters I used to love anymore.

Last edited by Mr. Shokoti; March 29, 2011 at 04:35am.
Reason: Automerged Doublepost

Lately, all of the DC movies try so damn hard to be self contained worlds where it could never be possible for Batman or Superman to encounter each other. So, I guess DC never plans on ever having a Justice League movie when their stupid directors make it impossible to have a Justice League in any of the film universes.

i don't think the characters need to crossover. if the directors don't want to do that, it's okay. but it wouldn't kill them to reference other heroes every once in a while. the media or the police could comment on how their city is becoming just like some other town in the dc universe. a news report could talk about another superhero in the ticker. a crossover event doesn't need to carry the movie or even a scene. and the movies don't need to be a single chapter in a larger, multi-franchise story. just give fans a little something to know they're appreciated.

I can't believe people care about nationalities, it just makes them seem really narrow minded and bigoted. I say if a person is right for the role then they should get it whether they are American, Canadia, British, Australian or whatever.

Originally Posted by Hordak Alpha

Besides, who goes to a superhero movie to see the REAL WORLD???? Superhero movies are about ESCAPISM, a chance to get away from finance troubles and other real life crap for two hours.

I agree. I don't real world in super hero movies I want over the top high action fantasy. It is this "real world" rubbish that means my favourite Batman villain will never make an appearance in the series

The Superman is broken line and the thor "diss" shouldn't be taken out of context, the guy said Superman is the father of modern superheroes, and when Thor who no matter how you slice is isn't a mainstream hero (neither was Iron man) is generating more buzz than the icon himself, then something has gone wrong, meaing the character isn't as relevant as he SHOULD be. I can't disagree with that statement,

Also a question people keep saying that Returns was a sequel to Superman two, and yeah I recall Siner saying that too and I can see the links essentially, but really it didn't give MUCH as a squel, it was it's own beast more than not. 5 years later klois looks younger than she did when her and supes first met, she got married and had a kid, blah blah blah, if superman 1 and 2 never existed the movie could have still been made as is (I still would have disliked it) we all know Superman we don't need an origin story, even with Superman 2 the continuation was confusing, it didn't feel like a sequel it just felt like a bad elseworlds story. if Singer did "his own vision" (which this WAS as the kid etc were his ideas, WB didn't jam him into making a sequel to decades old movies) it would have been the same as this. this WAS his vision. so the question is what do you REALLY think Singer would have done? why do you think this movie WASN'T his vision when he said in interviews himself that the best challenge to put supoes up against wouldn't be a villain, it would be fatherhood (an idea that Young Justice is doing FAR better IMO)

I can't believe people care about nationalities, it just makes them seem really narrow minded and bigoted. I say if a person is right for the role then they should get it whether they are American, Canadia, British, Australian or whatever.

I think it's less bigoted and more a sense of national pride & tradition. I'm born & bred in the US but I didn't think there was anything wrong about JK Rowling wanting all British actors for Harry Potter. In fact, I agreed with her. I also love a lot of movies & TV shows out of other countries as I'm sure many of those who wish Superman was played by an American do. You didn't see that as much with Batman since, even though he's an American creation as well, he doesn't scream Americana like baseball, apply pie, Norman Rockwell, & Superman do(yes, I realize he is an alien but he was raised in the midwest and created by an American & a Canadian-American raised in America). It's not the end of the world nor will it stop me from seeing this movie. I just really don't think bigotry has anything to do with it.

Originally Posted by krosfyah

The Superman is broken line and the thor "diss" shouldn't be taken out of context, the guy said Superman is the father of modern superheroes, and when Thor who no matter how you slice is isn't a mainstream hero (neither was Iron man) is generating more buzz than the icon himself, then something has gone wrong, meaing the character isn't as relevant as he SHOULD be. I can't disagree with that statement,

Thanks for that. His comments now make more sense. What does he really expect though? There have been a few Thor trailers already while Superman's costume hasn't even been revealed yet. I'm sure everyone will be talking Superman when that happens.

Last edited by Mr. Shokoti; March 29, 2011 at 05:25pm.
Reason: Automerged Doublepost