Really Brandon? You made how many millions slaving away those 4 years?

You can't fix stupid.

My concern for Brandon Spikes is how is he going to make to the Bills practices?

When it snowed 3 inches in New England one day, he was the only Patriot player who did not make it to practice, and he blamed it on the snow. Brandon, you do know it snows occasionally in Buffalo, right?

Hey Brandon, seeing as how Tom Brady is 22-2 lifetime against the Bills (most wins by any QB against a single opponent in history), I'll take that bet.

Sometimes its better to keep your mouth shut and have people think you're ignorant, than to open it and remove all doubt.

For sure. Btw, that 3 inches of snow that he blamed for his missing practice was actually the tail end of a 2 foot blizzard that made him a half an hour late. How come you didn't bitch about it then? He tweeted a picture of his car with a three foot snow bank between it and the street. He's been tweeting stupid crap for years and I don't remember you having a problem with it. Why now? Why do all Pats fans seem to have such a huge problem with his mouth now?BTW, I don't know what's being said on "various blogs"' but I saw what went on on his twitter and it was vicious, sometimes racist, and ALL Pats fans.Anyway, it's good to know you understand what he meant by his tweet. That Foxboro is a lousy place to work and that he feels he was abused for his time there.Like at the very end when he missed practice because of three inches of snow. You know, how by way of punishment they gave him the choice of getting cut or going on IR which, besides being against about five different things in the CBA, is bullshit according to Spikes and his agent.Why would they cut him when they could (illegally) put him on IR anyway? If they release him they get nothing when he leaves. Put him on IR and you have a shot at a compensatory pick. With the added side benefit of making him less attractive to other teams who might have to miss out on a pick By signing him.Get a late third round pick and screw over a guy we don't like? That's a win-win in BBs book!It amazes me how Pats fans celebrate how cold hearted and team first BB is and how shocked and outraged they become when they find out that the players don't much care for it.

Sometimes its better to keep your mouth shut and have people think you're ignorant, than to open it and remove all doubt.

For sure. Btw, that 3 inches of snow that he blamed for his missing practice was actually the tail end of a 2 foot blizzard that made him a half an hour late. How come you didn't bitch about it then? He tweeted a picture of his car with a three foot snow bank between it and the street. He's been tweeting stupid crap for years and I don't remember you having a problem with it. Why now? Why do all Pats fans seem to have such a huge problem with his mouth now?BTW, I don't know what's being said on "various blogs"' but I saw what went on on his twitter and it was vicious, sometimes racist, and ALL Pats fans.Anyway, it's good to know you understand what he meant by his tweet. That Foxboro is a lousy place to work and that he feels he was abused for his time there.Like at the very end when he missed practice because of three inches of snow. You know, how by way of punishment they gave him the choice of getting cut or going on IR which, besides being against about five different things in the CBA, is bullshit according to Spikes and his agent.Why would they cut him when they could (illegally) put him on IR anyway? If they release him they get nothing when he leaves. Put him on IR and you have a shot at a compensatory pick. With the added side benefit of making him less attractive to other teams who might have to miss out on a pick By signing him.Get a late third round pick and screw over a guy we don't like? That's a win-win in BBs book!It amazes me how Pats fans celebrate how cold hearted and team first BB is and how shocked and outraged they become when they find out that the players don't much care for it.

They can not care for how they were treated all they want. I just don't like it when they act like a bitter ex girlfriend about it. From Talib and this yo yo all the way back to Lawyer Milloy.

Sometimes its better to keep your mouth shut and have people think you're ignorant, than to open it and remove all doubt.

For sure. Btw, that 3 inches of snow that he blamed for his missing practice was actually the tail end of a 2 foot blizzard that made him a half an hour late. How come you didn't bitch about it then? He tweeted a picture of his car with a three foot snow bank between it and the street. He's been tweeting stupid crap for years and I don't remember you having a problem with it. Why now? Why do all Pats fans seem to have such a huge problem with his mouth now?BTW, I don't know what's being said on "various blogs"' but I saw what went on on his twitter and it was vicious, sometimes racist, and ALL Pats fans.Anyway, it's good to know you understand what he meant by his tweet. That Foxboro is a lousy place to work and that he feels he was abused for his time there.Like at the very end when he missed practice because of three inches of snow. You know, how by way of punishment they gave him the choice of getting cut or going on IR which, besides being against about five different things in the CBA, is bullshit according to Spikes and his agent.Why would they cut him when they could (illegally) put him on IR anyway? If they release him they get nothing when he leaves. Put him on IR and you have a shot at a compensatory pick. With the added side benefit of making him less attractive to other teams who might have to miss out on a pick By signing him.Get a late third round pick and screw over a guy we don't like? That's a win-win in BBs book!It amazes me how Pats fans celebrate how cold hearted and team first BB is and how shocked and outraged they become when they find out that the players don't much care for it.

As I recall, I did in fact make fun of him when he tweeted "Help" and said he couldn't get out of his driveway. I noted that he was the only player who had trouble with the snow and getting to the team meeting on time. Same question today as then. How come nobody else had the same problem? Is his car not as good as all the other players' cars?

Help me out here. I'm trying to find the "3 foot snow bank" you said was "between his car and the street". Its a pretty clear picture George. Shouldn't I be able to see this HUGE "three foot snowbank" you just testified to?

"Three foot snowbank between his car and the street"!! LMAO. Pictures don't lie. Unfortunatley, can't say the same for some people though.

You don't think that car could get out of that driveway?

He doesn't own a shovel? You probably know. You claim to know every little thing else. Is it in his contract that he is not required to shovel snow? You'd know that too I'm sure.

If he couldn't deal with this snow, how in the name of Santa Claus, is he going to be able to deal with the snow in Buffalo?

Typically, Belichick will send players home if they're late to practice or a team meeting. Patriots linebacker Brandon Spikes was placed on injured reserve on Monday because he was late to a team meeting last Friday during the bye week, FOX Sports' Mike Garafolo confirmed Saturday. Spikes was nearly released, but the team agreed to place him on injured reserve so he'd receive a full playoff share.

"Screw over"? "Cold hearted"? Blah blah blah.

The Rules According To George: Patriots/BB: "screw over the player".....All other teams make the exact same move: "its just smart business in the NFL".

Finally, these "five things against the CBA" that you refer to that BB is guilty of, can you please list them for me 1 though 5? Thank you.

Oh, sorry, one more "finally". Its about that "Foxboro is a lousy place to work" and the "team is cold hearted" nonsense you're selling. Since you say Spikes has been saying crap for years, why don't we get some additional input from a different ex-player? Can't just have only one opinion you know. We know that Spikes is the kind of a guy who marches to the beat of his own drum.

Hmmm. Lets see. I know, how about Aqib Talib, now a Denver Bronco? Lets get his take now that he's moved away. He said not long ago in an interview with Peter King, and I quote,

"I definitely had an offer from the Patriots. But there was some language in there that definitely was a little shaky compared to Denver's offer. The Patriots are a great organization. I loved my time there. I loved playing for Bill. He's a great leader. I'll be able to tell my kids I played for Bill Belichick someday, and I was Tom Brady's teammate." -Aqib Talib.

Not exactly painting a picture of "screwing over" and "cold heartedness" is he? He's gone, so he could say anything he wanted. His words kinda speak for themselves, don't they?

You know what "amazes" me?

Definitely not the same things that "amaze" you.

It amazes me how some people will needlessly, and for no good reason other than blind bias, throw away all credibility they may have in lame and failed efforts to slam a rival team or fan base. It truly amazes me that these people, no matter what, can just never, ever call things straight.

Last edited by guppy on Thu Apr 10, 2014 5:28 pm; edited 1 time in total

I wouldn't even know where to look it up, but Favre played the Lions twice a year for 16 seasons. I'd be shocked if he didn't have more than 22 wins.

Rick, George likes to tease. He loves to tell you you're wrong. But he likes to leave us in suspense, so he won't provide the correct answer.

I don't mind being corrected at all. So I really do want to know which QB has a better record against a single opponent than Brady's 22-2 record vs. Buffalo?

So I'll wait for George -- also known as The Human NFL Encyclopedia ---to enlighten us with his brilliance.

(Favre is 18-0 vs. the Lions. But I clearly said "most wins", not highest win %. See above. So, we'll wait to be educated.)

Favre is 18-0 against the Lions? Really? Think about that for a second Guppy. Think about what Rick said. No wait, don't. He was wrong. Favre played 18 seasons* in the same division as the Lions.I don't want to leave you in suspense so, 26. Brett Favre has 26 wins against the Lions. 23 against the Bears in case you're interested.

I'm not ducking your other post I'm just pressed for time. I'll address it tomorrow including giving heartfelt admiration for the sweet crop job on the picture of Spikes Porsche.

*Dan Marino played 18 seasons in the AFC East. Think about that one too.

George1963 wrote:I wouldn't even know where to look it up, but Favre played the Lions twice a year for 16 seasons. I'd be shocked if he didn't have more than 22 wins.

Rick, George likes to tease. He loves to tell you you're wrong. But he likes to leave us in suspense, so he won't provide the correct answer.

I don't mind being corrected at all. So I really do want to know which QB has a better record against a single opponent than Brady's 22-2 record vs. Buffalo?

So I'll wait for George -- also known as The Human NFL Encyclopedia ---to enlighten us with his brilliance.

(Favre is 18-0 vs. the Lions. But I clearly said "most wins", not highest win %. See above. So, we'll wait to be educated.)

Favre is 18-0 against the Lions? Really? Think about that for a second Guppy. Think about what Rick said. No wait, don't. He was wrong. Favre played 18 seasons* in the same division as the Lions.I don't want to leave you in suspense so, 26. Brett Favre has 26 wins against the Lions. 23 against the Bears in case you're interested.

I'm not ducking your other post I'm just pressed for time. I'll address it tomorrow including giving heartfelt admiration for the sweet crop job on the picture of Spikes Porsche.

*Dan Marino played 18 seasons in the AFC East. Think about that one too.

"Sweet crop job"! You're beautiful.

Will you also address why Spikes was the only player not to make it to the facility on time? His street got THE MOST snow in the area perhaps, and the other players didn't have to deal with the same obstacles he did? Maybe you can provide the weather report from then?

Last edited by guppy on Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:53 pm; edited 1 time in total

George1963 wrote:I don't want to leave you in suspense so, 26. Brett Favre has 26 wins against the Lions. 23 against the Bears in case you're interested.

I was wrong. I hastily looked in the wrong column. So you got me. Must have made your day.

But you are wrong too. Brett has 28 wins vs. the Lions. Don't shortchange him 2 wins.

Give Brady the same number of years in the AFCE as Favre had in the NFCN, and he will pass Brett win total vs. one team. As Brandon Spikes likes to say, "Watch".

By the way, on the question of most dominant? Easy. Brady vs. Bills, hands down. .916 win %.

Favre vs. Lions - .756 win %Favre vs. Bears - .638 win %

Remember, this all started because Spikes predicts 2 Bills wins vs. NE next year. Most people find actually find this funny (not you of course) since Buffalo is a beyond woeful 2-25 in its last 27 games vs. NE, and they have NEVER won at Gillette Stadium. But nothing wrong with a little trash talk. Nothing at all.

It was just the "slave" comment that had most people (again, you being the exception) calling him an idiot for saying.

*Dan Marino played 18 seasons in the AFC East. Think about that one too.

Finally, these "five things against the CBA" that you refer to that BB is guilty of, can you please list them for me 1 though 5? Thank you.

You really need proof that injured reserve is meant for players who are......injured? That it's not meant to be used to punish players? Or to restrict player movement?You need me to provide the page number of the schedule of maximum punishments for specific offenses?Or where it's stated that teams must be consistent in their penalties for similar offenses?Really?Well sorry. I won't be doing that today. This is a game you play all the time and I don't feel like playing along this time.

Typically, Belichick will send players home if they're late to practice or a team meeting. Patriots linebacker Brandon Spikes was placed on injured reserve on Monday because he was late to a team meeting last Friday during the bye week, FOX Sports' Mike Garafolo confirmed Saturday. Spikes was nearly released, but the team agreed to place him on injured reserve so he'd receive a full playoff share.

Wow. When does their Nobel prize arrive?Another thing that amazes me is how willing Pats fans swallow the crap they feed you. You know that cutting him would have cut 24 grand off his playoff share, right?

You also know that teams can sign players during the playoffs I'm sure.

And that he would have been on the Colts or the Broncos about 10 minutes after the Pats released him.

And that they would have given him a good deal more than $24 thousand for his signature and that he'd qualify for a half share from his new teams games.You know that putting him on IR was not his idea, as had been stated, and cost him money?

Do you know all that or do you need a CBA page number?

"Screw over"? "Cold hearted"?

Do you have any doubt that being IRd instead of cut affected his market this spring?

Four years a slave.

I didn't say it Gup.Spikes did.You know that.You know what he meant by it.You know he's not the first former player to say it.You know if he'd said it in December instead of April he wouldn't have been the first CURRENT player to have said it.Instead of just acknowledging that BB's a bad guy to work for you want to spin things around, change the subject, demand proof, ignore things that are obvious, attack me, just play the same stupid game you've been at for years now.

Typically, Belichick will send players home if they're late to practice or a team meeting. Patriots linebacker Brandon Spikes was placed on injured reserve on Monday because he was late to a team meeting last Friday during the bye week, FOX Sports' Mike Garafolo confirmed Saturday. Spikes was nearly released, but the team agreed to place him on injured reserve so he'd receive a full playoff share.

Wow. When does their Nobel prize arrive?Another thing that amazes me is how willing Pats fans swallow the crap they feed you. You know that cutting him would have cut 24 grand off his playoff share, right?

I quote an article from a national source, and you call it "crap" that Pats fans are readily "willing" to swallow. OMG. What's your sage advice for Pats fans? Not read articles? Maybe Colts fans are just smarter when it comes to sifting through article to separate the "crap" from the non-crap. Ya, that must be it. If only Pats fans were more like Colts fans the world would be a better place, right?

Cutting Spikes means he loses $24 grand, and not cutting him means he doesn't lose $24 grand. Okaaaay. So they didn't cut him, but instead wrote him a check. A great disservice you say. According to you, you think they should have released him, so he could make more than $24 grand on someone else's roster....and play against them in the playoffs and potentially hurt them in a playoff game?

Because that's what the Colts or Broncos surely would have done in that situation, right? Ok. Now I see your point. Sheesh. smh.

You also know that teams can sign players during the playoffs I'm sure.

And that he would have been on the Colts or the Broncos about 10 minutes after the Pats released him.

And that they would have given him a good deal more than $24 thousand for his signature and that he'd qualify for a half share from his new teams games.You know that putting him on IR was not his idea, as had been stated, and cost him money?

Do you know all that or do you need a CBA page number?

"Screw over"? "Cold hearted"?

Do you have any doubt that being IRd instead of cut affected his market this spring?

Four years a slave.

I didn't say it Gup.Spikes did.You know that.You know what he meant by it.You know he's not the first former player to say it.You know if he'd said it in December instead of April he wouldn't have been the first CURRENT player to have said it.Instead of just acknowledging that BB's a bad guy to work for you want to spin things around, change the subject, demand proof, ignore things that are obvious, attack me, just play the same stupid game you've been at for years now.

Do it alone. I'm tired of it.

Talk about ignoring things. You totally ignored the quote from Talib. Didn't acknowledge it. Understandable though from your perspective. You also ignored the fact that nearly everyone, including commentators on NFL AM and other shows, including former players and current players, all said basically the "slave" comment was a stupid comment. That's really quite a simple idea -- the "slave" comment was dumb. And that's where this all started, and yes, he IS the first former player to compare his employment in Foxboro to slavery. EVERYONE is shaking their head when they heard that. Oh, but just not you.

"He's not the first former former player to say it." This is your statement. I'm not attacking you. I'm attacking your statement. If your statement was a basketball shot, it would be an airball.

All the reasons you just cited for putting Spikes on IR instead of releasing him, are like Wow, good reasons. Obviously, you wouldn't release him and let him sign with another team, probably one you're about to meet in the playoffs. Good God, who would do something stupid as that? Not the Colts that's for sure. Not the Broncos. And not anyone else.

My game? My game?

No, I'll describe your game.

Your game is to 100% each and every time, find fault with the Pats and/or BB. Facts don't matter to you. Why bother yourself with facts? Every time, regardless of the facts, you'll find fault with him or them.

That's just what you do.

That's your thing, your game.

But that game is perfectly OK. No rules against it. We all get where you're coming from.

But my thing is, just be up front and honest about it.

Just acknowledge and admit that facts are irrelevant to you when it comes to the Patriots.

Its OK to be that way, because plenty of other haters out there are the same way too. Facts don't matter to them either. Never will.

But...just be honest about who you are and what you're doing. Don't try and fool us, and hold yourself out, or pass yourself off, as being either fair-minded or objective when it comes to the subject of BB or the NEP.

Be a hater. Be loud and proud about it.

Just don't pretend to be something else.

That's all.

Finally, as far as you losing interest in playing my "game", I agree, we'll call it done and over. Because I've lost interest in playing your "game" too.

I didn't say it Gup.Spikes did.You know that.You know what he meant by it.You know he's not the first former player to say it.You know if he'd said it in December instead of April he wouldn't have been the first CURRENT player to have said it.Instead of just acknowledging that BB's a bad guy to work for you want to spin things around, change the subject, demand proof, ignore things that are obvious, attack me, just play the same stupid game you've been at for years now.

In addition to doing all the above things you accuse me of doing instead of what, in your mind, I should be doing -- "acknowledging that BB's a bad guy" -- I also do something else. I provide direct quotes from individuals that tend to refute your mostly unfounded anti BB rants. One ex-player, Spikes, has some negative things to say, and you try to paint that into a picture of many ex-players doing something similar. Then I quote an ex-player, Talib, who only has great things to say. But you're not moved. That's why I said facts don't matter to you. Spikes is in the minority. To further my statement, and refute yours, I'll provide another example. Ty Law. Here's his quote. Make of it what you will.

Law was asked if he might do anything differently when looking back on his Patriots career, in which he tied for the all-time franchise record with 36 interceptions.

"I'll be the first one to admit, now that I'm older, wiser and more mature, that if I could have done something all over again, I would have tried my [best] to stay in New England and finish my career [here]. Not that I have any regrets about the teams that took me in, as far as the New York Jets, Denver Broncos and Kansas City Chiefs, I'm thankful for the opportunity.

"But you know, and I think I've said this early in my career, I would have loved to start and finish my career with the Patriots. Unfortunately, that didn't happen. But if I had to do it all over again, I would have made more effort to stay a Patriot."

I didn't say it Gup.Spikes did.You know that.You know what he meant by it.You know he's not the first former player to say it.You know if he'd said it in December instead of April he wouldn't have been the first CURRENT player to have said it.Instead of just acknowledging that BB's a bad guy to work for you want to spin things around, change the subject, demand proof, ignore things that are obvious, attack me, just play the same stupid game you've been at for years now.

In addition to doing all the above things you accuse me of doing instead of what, in your mind, I should be doing -- "acknowledging that BB's a bad guy" -- I also do something else. I provide direct quotes from individuals that tend to refute your mostly unfounded anti BB rants. One ex-player, Spikes, has some negative things to say, and you try to paint that into a picture of many ex-players doing something similar. Then I quote an ex-player, Talib, who only has great things to say. But you're not moved.

I read what Talib said. Maybe he even meant it. I can't say for sure. Just as I can't say for sure if he enjoyed them making it seem as though he had a chronic problem as he was going into free agency, or if he meant it when he said this;

"The Patriots have their way of reporting stuff, but I haven't had a hip problem since Tampa," Talib said. "The injury I had was actually a quad injury. It was reported as a hip injury, but that's how they do things."

One thing I can say for sure is that actions generally speak louder than words, and that he turned down multiyear deals from the Pats two years in a row.I can say that.

"But you know, and I think I've said this early in my career, I would have loved to start and finish my career with the Patriots. Unfortunately, that didn't happen. But if I had to do it all over again, I would have made more effort to stay a Patriot."

Interesting. He made it pretty clear when he left that he wanted to stay as well.He put it a little differently though;

Cornerback Ty Law ripped into Patriots coach Bill Belichick on the James Brown Show on Sporting News Radio, saying the coach is "paid to lie sometimes, because that's how he supports his family."

Law says he can't imagine returning to the Super Bowl-champion Patriots after how the recent negotiations over a contract extension have gone. "I don't feel comfortable in this place," Law said. " If people think that it can just be resolved with money, it can't."

Excerpts from the interview, which will air Thursday at 10 a.m. ET on the James Brown Show.

James Brown: "Where did things go wrong in that discussion with Bill Belichick?"

Ty Law: "It first went wrong when he asked me if I wanted to be there. I specifically told him that I want to be there, if he wants me to be. I don't want to be there if he doesn't look at me as a player to keep around for the future. It's plain and simple. No problem. No hard feelings. ...

"Throughout the conversation, I realized more and more that they had no intentions of letting me retire as a New England Patriot. That's when I knew I had to do something about it. It's unfair to me, to come in for a one-year deal, when within the organization, I was told that they had no intentions for me to play that well. People in the front office, the back office, within the organization, I don't want to say any name in particular, they told me, 'Ty, no matter what happens, especially after what happened to Lawyer (Milloy), you're out there auditioning for 29 other teams. You know how they operate around here and we wish you the best.'

"I don't feel comfortable in this place. I don't feel like this is a situation that either of us can prosper from. It's best for us to break ties and move forward, no problem. I had nine great years as a Patriot. Personally, behind the scenes it has not been all that great all the time. ... I knew for the last two years, possibly three, that they were just waiting for me to go down, waiting for me not to have the type of year that I had, so they can justify letting me go. When that comes from so deep in the organization and you still have to play up on it, because I'm obligated to that contract, that's just uncomfortable for me."

James Brown: "Is this a situation that's reconcilable, can this be resolved?"

Ty Law: "It can't. If people think that it can just be resolved with money, it can't. Like I said, I'm willing to give them money. Instead of you paying me my salary I'll pay you, and free up $23 million for you. It's definitely not about money and I don't think it can be reconciled. That's not what I am out for. I have that already. It can't be a comfortable working atmosphere. I think we just need to part ways while we're ahead. We can leave out as champions on both ends."

James Brown: "Did Lawyer Milloy tell you at any point during the season to expect the same thing to happen to you? If not, were you expecting this day to come?"

Ty Law: "He definitely said to expect same thing. I knew every conversation that they had. He feels that Coach Belichick lied to him too, to his face. I guess you get paid to lie sometimes, because that's how he supports his family. Actually, I already knew the situation with Lawyer and we thought that maybe I would go first."

James Brown: "What is your defense, Ty Law, that you are not a selfish person at all? Are there any examples that you can point definitively to?"

Ty Law: (sarcastically) "Yes, if I'm selfish, to give you a good example is when after our Super Bowl run, Tom Brady was going through his whole contract thing. It was beginning to become a major distraction through our championship. This was the first Super Bowl. So, I myself, without anybody asking me, without anyone contacting my agent, I went to Coach Belichick myself.

"After one of the practices I told Coach if he needed some help; I understand that I have a high cap number, one of the higher cap numbers on the team. In order to put this under the table, I said 'I know you guys are working to get Tom Brady done and a couple of other guys, I will re-work some of my numbers for you no problem. As long as I'm making my money that I am supposed to make this year, then go ahead and rework some of these numbers so you can get these guys done and we can defend our championship.' "

James Brown: "Wait a minute, you went to them and offered to rework your deal, so they could sign Tom Brady and others?"

Ty Law: "Right. I went to him (Belichick). He didn't come to me. I offered my contract, my money, to help the team. People don't hear about that. After all that went on, we talked a little bit and he said we are going to try to work on it. Then he came to me during the Pittsburgh game that week. He tapped me on the shoulder at breakfast and said, 'I need to take to you up on that offer.' So, I said, 'Fine, no problem.' I can't remember if Tom was done at the time or what, but he needed to work the numbers to get some guys signed. That's when I reworked $2.7 million of my salary. I reworked it and I played with it. I didn't say, 'Give it to me now,' like a lot of guys do. ...

"I did that and he took me up on that. Nothing else was ever said about that, but now, I am a selfish player. That was strictly for the team, but now it's come down to me being able to protect myself. All that I am asking them to do, is at the time, if they wanted me there, prove me wrong for what I have already known and what everyone has told me prior to us having that discussion. To quote, but I can not give a name, 'He did not expect you to play as well as you did.' "

George1963 wrote:I didn't say it Gup.Spikes did.You know that.You know what he meant by it.You know he's not the first former player to say it.You know if he'd said it in December instead of April he wouldn't have been the first CURRENT player to have said it.Instead of just acknowledging that BB's a bad guy to work for you want to spin things around, change the subject, demand proof, ignore things that are obvious, attack me, just play the same stupid game you've been at for years now.

In addition to doing all the above things you accuse me of doing instead of what, in your mind, I should be doing -- "acknowledging that BB's a bad guy" -- I also do something else. I provide direct quotes from individuals that tend to refute your mostly unfounded anti BB rants. One ex-player, Spikes, has some negative things to say, and you try to paint that into a picture of many ex-players doing something similar. Then I quote an ex-player, Talib, who only has great things to say. But you're not moved.

I read what Talib said. Maybe he even meant it. I can't say for sure. Just as I can't say for sure if he enjoyed them making it seem as though he had a chronic problem as he was going into free agency, or if he meant it when he said this;

"The Patriots have their way of reporting stuff, but I haven't had a hip problem since Tampa," Talib said. "The injury I had was actually a quad injury. It was reported as a hip injury, but that's how they do things."

One thing I can say for sure is that actions generally speak louder than words, and that he turned down multiyear deals from the Pats two years in a row.I can say that.

"But you know, and I think I've said this early in my career, I would have loved to start and finish my career with the Patriots. Unfortunately, that didn't happen. But if I had to do it all over again, I would have made more effort to stay a Patriot."

Interesting. He made it pretty clear when he left that he wanted to stay as well.He put it a little differently though;

Cornerback Ty Law ripped into Patriots coach Bill Belichick on the James Brown Show on Sporting News Radio, saying the coach is "paid to lie sometimes, because that's how he supports his family."

Law says he can't imagine returning to the Super Bowl-champion Patriots after how the recent negotiations over a contract extension have gone. "I don't feel comfortable in this place," Law said. " If people think that it can just be resolved with money, it can't."

Excerpts from the interview, which will air Thursday at 10 a.m. ET on the James Brown Show.

James Brown: "Where did things go wrong in that discussion with Bill Belichick?"

Ty Law: "It first went wrong when he asked me if I wanted to be there. I specifically told him that I want to be there, if he wants me to be. I don't want to be there if he doesn't look at me as a player to keep around for the future. It's plain and simple. No problem. No hard feelings. ...

"Throughout the conversation, I realized more and more that they had no intentions of letting me retire as a New England Patriot. That's when I knew I had to do something about it. It's unfair to me, to come in for a one-year deal, when within the organization, I was told that they had no intentions for me to play that well. People in the front office, the back office, within the organization, I don't want to say any name in particular, they told me, 'Ty, no matter what happens, especially after what happened to Lawyer (Milloy), you're out there auditioning for 29 other teams. You know how they operate around here and we wish you the best.'

"I don't feel comfortable in this place. I don't feel like this is a situation that either of us can prosper from. It's best for us to break ties and move forward, no problem. I had nine great years as a Patriot. Personally, behind the scenes it has not been all that great all the time. ... I knew for the last two years, possibly three, that they were just waiting for me to go down, waiting for me not to have the type of year that I had, so they can justify letting me go. When that comes from so deep in the organization and you still have to play up on it, because I'm obligated to that contract, that's just uncomfortable for me."

James Brown: "Is this a situation that's reconcilable, can this be resolved?"

Ty Law: "It can't. If people think that it can just be resolved with money, it can't. Like I said, I'm willing to give them money. Instead of you paying me my salary I'll pay you, and free up $23 million for you. It's definitely not about money and I don't think it can be reconciled. That's not what I am out for. I have that already. It can't be a comfortable working atmosphere. I think we just need to part ways while we're ahead. We can leave out as champions on both ends."

James Brown: "Did Lawyer Milloy tell you at any point during the season to expect the same thing to happen to you? If not, were you expecting this day to come?"

Ty Law: "He definitely said to expect same thing. I knew every conversation that they had. He feels that Coach Belichick lied to him too, to his face. I guess you get paid to lie sometimes, because that's how he supports his family. Actually, I already knew the situation with Lawyer and we thought that maybe I would go first."

James Brown: "What is your defense, Ty Law, that you are not a selfish person at all? Are there any examples that you can point definitively to?"

Ty Law: (sarcastically) "Yes, if I'm selfish, to give you a good example is when after our Super Bowl run, Tom Brady was going through his whole contract thing. It was beginning to become a major distraction through our championship. This was the first Super Bowl. So, I myself, without anybody asking me, without anyone contacting my agent, I went to Coach Belichick myself.

"After one of the practices I told Coach if he needed some help; I understand that I have a high cap number, one of the higher cap numbers on the team. In order to put this under the table, I said 'I know you guys are working to get Tom Brady done and a couple of other guys, I will re-work some of my numbers for you no problem. As long as I'm making my money that I am supposed to make this year, then go ahead and rework some of these numbers so you can get these guys done and we can defend our championship.' "

James Brown: "Wait a minute, you went to them and offered to rework your deal, so they could sign Tom Brady and others?"

Ty Law: "Right. I went to him (Belichick). He didn't come to me. I offered my contract, my money, to help the team. People don't hear about that. After all that went on, we talked a little bit and he said we are going to try to work on it. Then he came to me during the Pittsburgh game that week. He tapped me on the shoulder at breakfast and said, 'I need to take to you up on that offer.' So, I said, 'Fine, no problem.' I can't remember if Tom was done at the time or what, but he needed to work the numbers to get some guys signed. That's when I reworked $2.7 million of my salary. I reworked it and I played with it. I didn't say, 'Give it to me now,' like a lot of guys do. ...

"I did that and he took me up on that. Nothing else was ever said about that, but now, I am a selfish player. That was strictly for the team, but now it's come down to me being able to protect myself. All that I am asking them to do, is at the time, if they wanted me there, prove me wrong for what I have already known and what everyone has told me prior to us having that discussion. To quote, but I can not give a name, 'He did not expect you to play as well as you did.' "

Interesting. But like Law himself said, he's "more mature" now.

No doubt you believe that the Patriots are the only NFL team to ever release a player rather than opt to pay the last year of a multi year contract. (In Law's case, the contract he signed, at the time he signed it, was, I believe without looking it up, the most generous one ever given to a cornerback back then.)

No doubt you also believe that when it comes to NE, the ex-player, whoever it may be, is always the one in the right, but when it comes to other teams acting similarly, "its just business". When the Colts cut Bob Sanders it was because they could no longer afford to pay an often injured player, and everyone understood that, and no one called them bad guys for hurting his value on the FA market or anything else. However, if it was the Pats who did the same thing to a player, you'd jump down their throat. That's just what you do.

George1963 wrote:I read what Talib said. Maybe he even meant it. I can't say for sure. Just as I can't say for sure if he enjoyed them making it seem as though he had a chronic problem as he was going into free agency, or if he meant it when he said this;

"The Patriots have their way of reporting stuff, but I haven't had a hip problem since Tampa," Talib said. "The injury I had was actually a quad injury. It was reported as a hip injury, but that's how they do things."

Hip. Quad. What are we talking here? Its all a "lower body" injury anyway.

One thing I can say for sure is that actions generally speak louder than words, and that he turned down multiyear deals from the Pats two years in a row.I can say that.

Which, in your view, was the more motivating factor for Talib signing elsewhere? Money, years and his personal financial security? Or the "slave" like working conditions that Spikes told us about that Talib would do just about anything to escape from?

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Gary GuytonVerified account ‏@GaryGuyton59I can laugh now at this. But this was me when I was LATE FOR PRACTICE in New England. Still got sent home pic.twitter.com/8haf2nbdSZ