Cup of Russia has an interesting cast of competitors. It has the young, up-coming teams, all trying to make their mark on the International Stage. The Russian teams are also trying to take over the top spots left empty on the Russian team, due to the retirement of Domnina and Shabalin and Khokhlova and Novitski.

Although Bobrova and Soloviev (RUS) beat Faiella and Scali (ITA) at Cup of China overall, even though this is home ice for Bobrova and not for Faiella, I believe Faiella and Scali will prevail in the short dance. For one thing, even with Massimo tripping over Federica's skirt in the Golden Waltz Segment 2, they finished with a short dance score of 57.21 at Cup of China, ahead of Bobrova and Soloviev, who only scored 55.85. I can't wait to see what Eliza Doolittle's Ascot dress with the huge bows looks like with a miniskirt on Federica!

The problems Bobrova and Soloviev had at Cup of China are more difficult to overcome than Faiella and Scali's, for one thing. The team has had a persistent problem with twizzles, and the problem occurred at both the short and free dances in China. The second problem is that Delilah is a questionable choice for this dance, dealing as it does, with a man singing while waiting to be arrested for killing his cheating girlfriend. The frou-frou Viennese Waltz (one of which the Golden Waltz is) steps just don't work that well with it.

As to who will finish third in the short dance, it will be a difficult choice between Paul and Islam (CAN) and Ilinykh and Katsapalov (RUS). For both teams, this is their first year doing the Golden Waltz, as it is their first Senior Grand Prix year. And, predictably, both had problems in the Golden Waltz section in their first appearnace. Paul and Islam missed several steps. Ilinykh and Katsapalov just didn't excel at the Golden, scoring Level 3 on the first segment, and level 2 on the second segment. Furthermore, they chose to mix an angsty waltz with a tango, a choice that works better than a traditional waltz with the tango, but not much better. At this point, the numbers favor Ilinykh and Katsapalov to finish third in the short dance.. However, if you look at the free dance scores, they favor Paul and Islam for third place overall. In reality, both young teams are so good, and apt to be improving so rapidly, that either could prevail.

One should not overlook that Hoffman and Zavozin have given strong performances in both their summer competitions, and finished fourth at Cup of China. They could surprise and sneak in for the bronze. (Coincidentally, Paul and Islam were fourth at Skate Canada, and Ilinykh and Katsalapov were fourth at NHK).

All of the competitors here have competed in the Short Dance at least once. Their best scores are interleaved below with the best and worst scores we've seen on the Grand Prix, both overall and in the Golden Waltz sections. Sad to say, competing the second time does not necessarily raise either your Golden or your overall Short Dance score. Davis and White scored the highest at their first competition, NHK, however, they really improved their Golden score (but not their overall score) at Skate America. Crone and Poirier scored lower at Skate America than Skate Canada in both categories. One reason for this is that scoring well in the Golden, under the current scoring system, requires precision above all else. This is why Zhiganshina and Gaszi, an otherwise quite average team, are near the top of scores for the Golden where they scored Level 4 in both segments. The other elements in the short dance, typical of the old Original Dance, score better when done with great speed and commitment. The team that switches between one mode and the other effortlessly will be the team that finally excels in the short dance.

I'm so glad that I won't have to get up in the middle of the night to see this part..I may have to wait for YouTube or TV for the men ( I know nadine will be suffering, since I think we're in the same time zone, and the men start at 4 AM PT ) .For myself ,I can't decide which would be the worse option ; staying up to watch , or getting up that early.

I really hope P/I have been slaving away at the GW .They got the same level as I/K on the 2nd segment , but had that glitch ( I think they just brushed blades , or something ) that caused them to lose the last few steps of the first.. I/K's same-foot twizzles are pretty great, so I'd hope P/I could gain a level there , too. I like P/I's music much better , but don't expect that to carry much weight in Russia. Neither one is a real Viennese waltz but I think P/I's is more lyrical. I/K have found a creative way of dealing with the music cut, but it's still jarring , whereas P/I's just sort of morphs from tango to waltz.

Also I hope I&K have got their new lifts done. The Schindler's List lifts with the Don Quixote ballet just look comic and destroy the whole mood they are trying to create, IMO. I really want to see Don Quixote done in its final form!

Don't mind me I can't say I like either team's SD all that much, mostly due to music choice in both cases. But I'm an eville old traditionalist when it comes to CD's and OD's-and their hybrid in the SD. I don't like B&S's SD music choice either. F&S, now, that I like. If only Massimo doesn't trip

Rats! lost my post.. Was replying to mention of FDs. I guess what I'd been saying boils down to this

I/K : Yay! to lift changes ..don't think tutu's are a good fit with wrap-around Ice Dance lifts. Also may cause partners to skate a bit farther apart than they normally would.More cuts in the music than I would like.She looks a perfect Kitri ,though , and I could learn to love this depending on the changes.

P/I : Costume change needed , but even if they do eventually , maybe not by second GP outing. Found Mr.Durante less " What the ?" at SC than Thornhill, and on second exposure , the orchestral arrangement behind him has some beautiful flourishes for highlights. Still maybe not the best choice... But if they do it up right, this could win me over in a big way , too.

I can't stop giggling and thinking about Jimmy's utterly huge nose, as depicted in hundreds of cartoons I watched as a little kiddie when I watch them P&I skate to him singing as Time Goes BY. Which,of course, is not the intent. I suppose, over time, that I could get used to it and actually watch the dance instead of thinking about Inka Dinka Doo
or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hg2GJE3Za9Q (not by him here, but I remember him singing it) or Young at Heart or wondering where Mrs. Calabash (the forerunner of Carmen San Diego) is today

I'm more curious about how the Russian teams score relative to the others. It seems like F/S, P/I and H/Z will be slotted in among the top six, but the point spread between I/K, B/S and G/B should be fascinating.

Now, obviously, TES fluctuates thanks to levels, whereas PCS tends to be a bit more consistent, with a general trend that sees the scores increase throughout the season (of course, teams become better with the choreography, expression etc with practice). So I'm curious how they place here. What happens if I/K have issues with the TES due to levels again (there's only so much one can improve in four weeks, and we especially see the struggle for balance in the SD)? If B/S win, can we assume that they're defiantly the number one team? What about if G/B beat I/K? Is that even plausible? Those PCS are very close.

I like B/S but I'm not keen on "Delilah" either. Not that I'm any kind of judge, but I preferred G/B's waltz ( not his costume !). And I don't think this meeting can settle the question of where they all stand nationally, because of K/A coming on the scene at Golden Spin and Rus. Nats.( Apparently, he was not a complete stranger to ice dance, they've had more time to just work at it , and they're bound to be spoilers for someone..) It's very fascinating..I hope there won't be blood on the ice...

Just curious, Doris. Is there any reason why you left the Shubatanis out of the list of GW scores?

~tapdancer, I listed some scores of teams that weren't at CoR for comparison to the teams that are here.
The Shibutanis were not remarkable for a low score or a high score in the GW, so I didn't list them. At both their events, they had a problem-at NHK, Alex stepping on Maia's skirt, and at SA, a minor screwup that lowered their score.

Originally Posted by ImaginaryPogue

I'm more curious about how the Russian teams score relative to the others. It seems like F/S, P/I and H/Z will be slotted in among the top six, but the point spread between I/K, B/S and G/B should be fascinating.

Now, obviously, TES fluctuates thanks to levels, whereas PCS tends to be a bit more consistent, with a general trend that sees the scores increase throughout the season (of course, teams become better with the choreography, expression etc with practice). So I'm curious how they place here. What happens if I/K have issues with the TES due to levels again (there's only so much one can improve in four weeks, and we especially see the struggle for balance in the SD)? If B/S win, can we assume that they're defiantly the number one team? What about if G/B beat I/K? Is that even plausible? Those PCS are very close.

IP those are interesting numbers, but I wouldn't use the Finlandia ones. For whatever reason, judging at Senior B's doesn't seem to track all that well to judging on the GP.

G/B's PCS at Skate Canada (which on the whole was a high scoring event, due to perhaps a little looser technical calling)
23.69 PCS in the SD
34.04 PCS in the FD
So I think they have fallen off the pace a tad.

OTOH, I think you should watch out for Riazanova/Tkachenko as well as Khokhlova / Andreev to be in the mix at Russian Nationals
SD 27.03 at Skate America
FD 41.09 at Skate America

Another couple to watch for is Monko/Khaliavin who have posted some HUGE scores in juniors. It is unclear just what that means, as the juniors are not doing the GW, but the FD scores are pertinent. Pushkash/Guerreiro and Stepanova/Bukin have posted some good scores as well.

Originally Posted by colleen o'neill

I like B/S but I'm not keen on "Delilah" either. Not that I'm any kind of judge, but I preferred G/B's waltz ( not his costume !). And I don't think this meeting can settle the question of where they all stand nationally, because of K/A coming on the scene at Golden Spin and Rus. Nats.( Apparently, he was not a complete stranger to ice dance, they've had more time to just work at it , and they're bound to be spoilers for someone..) It's very fascinating..I hope there won't be blood on the ice...

I agree that this meeting can't settle anything finally with respect to Russian pecking order.

The same comment, I suppose, could be made about the W/P and C/P showdown at Skate America-P/I are obviously strongly in the mix, and to a lesser extent, R/H.