Absolutely we're supposed to be above what we decry in our enemies. By the same token, you sometimes have to resort to more extreme and/or distasteful measures to accomplish an important goal.<br><br>Now, allow me poke holes in my own statement. I see these alleged abuses as the product of frustration. Not so much on the part of the individuals accused, but of the Admin. And I see that frustration as the result of the failure (thus far) to catch Bin Ladin. We can't nail the big dog, so let's kick the little ones instead.<br><br>Had Bin Ladin been captured or dead by now, would these other events have occurred? Would we have ever invaded Iraq? And if so, what rationale would the WH have offered?<br><br>Fact is, we are seeking justice. But like Marc Almond wrote, "... in all the wrong places."<br><br>

uh, they hate them because of their freedoms? <br><br>all kidding aside, i think a little research would reveal much. why do you think japan and france have been attacked (and, i can't remember the specifics of either country being attacked by terrorists, though it's possible). i think a little research might reveal that each of those countries being attacked has, as a source -- not necessarily the only source, their foreign policies.<br><br>for example, i did a quick google search using 'terrorism japan' as my search terms and found this right near the top from the japanese government's website: Campaign against Terrorism - Japan's Measures.<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>1. Diplomatic Efforts to Strengthen International Solidarity<br>Diplomatic efforts have been stepped up to strengthen international solidarity towards the prevention and eradication of terrorism, through such means as the dispatch of special envoys, and official letters from the Prime Minister, as well as bilateral, multilateral meetings and telephone talks.<br><br>2. Anti-Terrorism Special Measures Law<br>Based on the Anti-Terrorism Special Measures Law, which was passed by the Diet on 29 October, Self-Defense Force (SDF) vessels are providing supply of fuel to U.S. and U.K. ships, and SDF aircraft are implementing transportation support as cooperation and support activities.<p><hr></blockquote><p>the article details 4 more points on how japan is fighting against the terrorists. my guess is that these efforts are going to cause a reaction from the enemies they are fighting. <br><br>--<br>Straw-man rhetorical techniques are the practice of refuting weaker arguments than one's opponents offer. 2 "set up a straw man" or "set up a straw-man argument" is 2 create a position easily refuted, then attribute that position to your opponent.

I'm sorry if I'm a bit self-centered by nature. I mention America foremost because I am a citizen and thus share responsibility for our actions. The whole west is really in the driver seat here and together we don't need to find out how to placate terrorists, but we do need to all work together to find out how get those bystander countries like Turkey and Jordan to help solve this problem. That's what I think is the bigger picture.<br><br>-- Charlie Alpha Roger Yankee Whiskey

"i am curious to learn why you think the terrorists attacked us and continue to hate us."<br><br>Because we are not an islamic nation. Because we promote freedom of choice around the world and freedom of choice is the LAST THING the islamists want.<br><br>

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>Because we are not an islamic nation<p><hr></blockquote><p>saudi arabia has also been attacked. <blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>Because we promote freedom of choice around the world<p><hr></blockquote><p>so, to take this full circle back to skul's post:<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>I care about those two people. I care about not letting that happen again. Ever. If you do anything to get in the way of stopping terror, you're as good as pushing those people out the window.<p><hr></blockquote><p>can this be reconciled without implicating our foreign policy as at least a partial cause?<br><br>--<br>Straw-man rhetorical techniques are the practice of refuting weaker arguments than one's opponents offer. 2 "set up a straw man" or "set up a straw-man argument" is 2 create a position easily refuted, then attribute that position to your opponent.

i think all countries should have democracies in place. i don't like seeing american lives (nearly 1,800 in iraq alone) being used to help other countries reach self-rule. there are a heck of a lot of countries in the world that don't have self rule (e.g., china is over 1 billion people under something besides self-rule), so i'd hate to think of the cost of trying to change the whole world.<br><br>i tend to agree with former U.S. Senator Warren Rudman (R-N.H.), he chaired the President's Foreign Intelligence Advisory Board from 1997 to 2000, and co-chaired a bipartisan commission on national security that issued its findings January 2001. he said (and, i included the question):<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>The question is: Is there something about our policies that have been politically untouchable? We need oil; we need to back Israel. It's hard to raise these issues, because people want low gasoline prices, or people want absolutely support for whatever government is in Israel.<br><br>Answer: Are you telling me there are people who disagree totally with our foreign policy? You bet there are. You bet there are. And is it a potential contributor to this problem? You bet it is.<p><hr></blockquote><p>link to frontline (pbs) here<br><br>waleed might better be able to answer why saudi arabia was attacked, but i think it's largely because the ruling family of the house of saud has been an ally of the US in the war on terror (reluctantly, but they were one none-the-less). i think saudi arabia was (perhaps is) on the verge of a civil war given that they have a big portion of the population actually more conservative than the ruling family. i don't know much more than that, though.<br><br>--<br>Straw-man rhetorical techniques are the practice of refuting weaker arguments than one's opponents offer. 2 "set up a straw man" or "set up a straw-man argument" is 2 create a position easily refuted, then attribute that position to your opponent.

I wish that was true, but if you look at the kind of regimes we propped up as lately as the 1980s, you can see we don't have a very good track record of "promoting freedom".<br><br>Iraq<br>Chile<br>Nicaragua<br>Iran<br>Afghanistan<br>Venezuela<br>etc...<br><br>-- Charlie Alpha Roger Yankee Whiskey

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