Tuesday, April 24, 2007

Tueday 04/24 A.M. Guest Quickie: Not Just Basketball!

Rockets Still Rolling: Not counting the state of Utah, who doesn't want the Rockets to win this one? Of course, it's all due to T-Mac, who once again followed a dicey first half with a stellar last two quarters. The Jazz smothered the Rockets in the beginning, and then felt the wrath of H-Town in the second half. Will we ever see a happy median? Or are McGrady and Yao that much better than Boozer, Okur, Deron Williams, and Kirilenko?

A-Rod Wins, Yankees Lose: Alex Rodriguez is now well on pace to break Barry Bonds’ single-season record of 73, at which point Hank Aaron will attend the record-breaking game and personally perform a rendition of Mims’ “This is Why I’m Hot”. Still, the man is undeniably cursed. His personal success appears inversely related to the success and pitching health of the Yankees.

Where a Number One Seed Still Means Something: Wasn't the East supposed to be where craziness, upsets, and near-parity could come true?

Leandro Barbosa, Sixth Man of the Year: After Sunday, the question isn't whether Barbosa could start—it's how sick he would be in that capacity. Maybe a longer, more terrifying Tony Parker, averaging about 20 and 8 on these Suns but not exactly making point guard purists comfortable. Quick, raise your hand if you remember when he was hyped as "the Brazilian Gary Payton." Now leave it up if you think that's his ceiling.

AL Central Battles: Twins blow one late even though Joe Mauer is now hitting .400. Unfortunately, Twins GM Terry Ryan’s “no steroids because it will mess up the clubhouse chemistry” policy means that there is no one in the Twins lineup to actually drive Joe Mauer home when he gets on base. In Kansas City, the Royals spoil Mark Buehrle’s attempt at consecutive no-hitters, but in the end, are still the Royals.

LeBron Not Too Injured: He'll play Wednesday. Don't be shocked, though, if they rest him for the last two games and win anyway. Just kidding, that would be classless and illegal. Wizards fans waiting on Caron Butler can give that dream up, as he's now officially out for the duration of round one.

Cubs Pitchers: On the same day that Zambrano again fails to make it past the 6th, Scott Eyre blows a lead, and the Ben and Jerry’s-inspired Rocky Cherry loses the game in the 12th inning, Mark Prior undergoes “exploratory” surgery. I am hoping it is of the Jim Abbott variety, so Cubs fans can stop getting their hopes up.

NL East Rules: Mets win. Phillies win. Marlins win (but the Braves keep it close). The Mets’ John Maine stays solid, Phils’ Jimmy Rollins does his part to back up his words.

Brandan Wright Entering Draft: So what if he's not quite ready for the NBA? The latest he'll be picked is fifth. . . and remember, this is the 2007 draft. Just being in it is guaranteed to make a player famous, in the same way that no one from 2000 or 2006 will ever get their due.

Canucks Beat Stars, Advance: There isn’t anything quite like a Game 7, is there? Dr. LIC really enjoys Vancouver, the city. The pizza there is surprisingly good, and very cheap. Also, one time he saw a million crackheads buy a bunch of crack off of this dude who looked exactly like Vanilla Ice. Then they all laughed at a prostitute.

NFL Draft: Can we declare a moratorium on "so and so would like to draft Calvin Johnson" rumors? It's far more interesting that one, maybe two, teams will have to be the ones who don't draft him.

The Holes in This Quickie: Feel free to fill them in/point them out as you see fit.

I know people just want Bonds to "hurry up and get it over with"....but I would find it extremely satisfying if it takes until early August or so. Meanwhile, A-Rod might have 65 homers by then, with a real shot at the single-season record, to at least wipe that "Barry stain" off the books. Something to give the media some fodder.

Okay guest post (but no mention of the C.L.). I still think Dan lost a unique opportunity to hand it over to the more frequent commenters, like cmfost, todd or brian. That would have been more fun (for me to refute what they would have said).

i already said i wouldn't be happy because i care about the yankees winning - but I would be happy for a-rod because all you idiots who think he is a bad player for some reason would shut up. (yes i am going back to name calling because it is retarded and stupid to say the guy is no good and that his hits and homers are meaningless) Its only April is not an argument - if you want to use that argument then we should all shut up about baseball entirely - don't bitch about the red sox not getting the lead on espn for hitting four homers in a row, dont get excited that the red sox swept and dont cheer and emphasize that the yanks are struggling - its only april so none of that matters at all right? bonds homers dont actually count towards the record right, because its only april and baseball hasn't started yet. None of these victories count towards winning the division right? In fact, lets just make the season ten games long in october and forget all about this stupid "season" stuff - it has no bearing on anything anyway. lets base the career of the greatest player of our generation on a sample size of eight games over the course of the past three years because he plays on a team that currently can't pitch their way out of a paper bag...does that answer your question

I've said this once and I'll say it again, Red Sox fans love April because that's when their team plays the best...yet they down any other accomplishment and say it's ONLY April baseball. It's a catch-22...you can't have it both ways Red Sox fans.

Hate to say his name in this space again but... Olbermann has stated that the greatest possible outcome is that Barry slows down and A-rod keeps going so that A-rod is near 73 when Barry is near 755 and the whole country rallies behind A-rod. Personally, I'd rally behind both.

eric-Didn't you hear? A-rod is having the best month of his or any other life.

I don't think anyone here really thinks A-Rod is a bad player. But even if they do, it's probably out of spite for the guy. The people you should be most upset with aren't Red Sox or any other team's fans for hating A-Rod, it's the Yankee fans that have booed him mercilessly at home that you should get after. They're the ones who are the most hypocritical in this.

here is what I said yesterday about April games they are all important.

How can you say a win in April is not important? Let's say the Yankees lose the division by one game to the Red Sox, you do not think that people will look back to the game on Friday when Rivera blew the save as the game that could of made a difference. Yes it is April but a game in April counts as much in the standings as a game in August.

And if I am the Red Sox, Baltimore or Toronto I try to put as many game between myself and the Yankees as I can well they are having there injury issues.

Yes, but here's what you said today, "A-rod is having a historic APRIL!!! Still not having the best month ever."

Can't have it both ways. I understand that it's statistically not the best month ever, and so does everybody else. You just imply, by capitalizing April, that it's less of an achievement and April is less important than say June (Sosa's 20HR).

i agree todd - those are mostly drunken idiots and i think they are morons. being angry at a player for underperforming is one thing (i am sure everyone who has cheered for a sports team has felt this emotiong) but actively trying to drag the guy down further by booing him in their home park is idiotic (and I might add, this is not just a yankee thing...a lot of team's fans do this including mets, sox, cubs, and philly fans).

i don't think you can have one without the other cm - if he doesn't perform (hit a bunch of hrs and drive in 120-150 rbis) the yankees will lose 80-90 games...i dont think it is one or the other. he is a huge part of their offense (as is every number three/four hitter) and the offense is obviously going to drive this team this year.

I don't think anyone ever said ARod was no good... I think the major point of contention is that he never does it when it matters. But hey, if Yankees fans are happy that their team just makes the playoffs now, well that is fine.

Slightly off topic, but in 1996, Army played Auburn in the Liberty Bowl. The night before the game, there was a huge block party in Shreveport with a stage on one end, and people filling the street for about 2 blocks. Vanilla Ice was the "act" on the stage. When he finished, he said thank you to the crowd and then said no autographs over and over as he walked off the stage. He then proceeded to walk straight through the crowd, both blocks even, saying "no autographs" over and over still. But for his entire 2 block walk, I don't think anyone even wanted to approach him for an autograph. It was so surreal, like living in the middle of a "Where Are They Now" episode on Vh1. One of the funniest things I have ever seen.

Oh yeah, and A-Rod is on pace for 140 home runs and 300 RBIs, or soemthing sick like that. I'd like to see him rip off 75 home runs this year. The only thing that would be better than that is seeing Jeter hit 7 HRs.

Worst idea te Yankees have had. Brining up Philip Hughes already. The guy is going to be a stud, I understand the need for pitching right now, but why chance hurting this kid's career because your not quick out of the gate.

Pitching will be back with Wang back and there are guys in the org (Tyler Clippard, etc.) who might be a better idea.

well cmfost - you are either a hypocrit or not fully understanding what a-rod is doing for the yankees - he has single handedly handed them a good percentage of their vicories and if not for a lousy bullpen/starting pitching would have added a bunch more.

He is doing EVERYTHING right now - hitting for average, hitting for power, driving in runs, scoring runs, running the bases EXTREMELY well, playing great defense, moving runners over, hitting late in the game, hitting early in the game, hitting in the clutch. And it is directly correlated to every single one of the yankees victories (which as stated above would be even higher if they had some pitching) so his great start is important because he is helping his team win as much as he humanly (or super-humanly) can.

as a yankees fan i am desperately hoping he stays hot because it looks like if he doesn't we are screwed. obviously he can't keep this pace, but he is going to have to hit 330 with 50+ HR and 130-150 rbis unless Wang, Mussina and Pavano are able to make strong comebacks.

I just don't get it. I've heard Yankee fans say that Jeter is better than A-rod. This affirms my belief that a large part of a large part of Yankee nation is a steady diet of crack. Jeter is good. Not great, good. A-rod is great. This is simple.

As for bringing up Phillup Hughes... this makes no sense. Sure, I want to see him pitch and everything, but you just threw Chase Wright to the dogs and had other dumb guys starting. Now you are getting Cheech and Chong back AND adding the kid? How does that make sense? Isn't Mussina coming back? So basically you decided to lose games with a rookie that wasn't as good and then brought up the better rookie right in a time where your pitchers will be back in a week anyway. Sounds like Yankee management to me!

Baseball is a team sport is it not one player can not make a team. Proof of that being A-Rod so far this season. Hey let A-Rod have the greatest season in the history baseball as long as the Yankee pitching keeps shitting the bed it will be typical A-Rod. Doing everything to make himself look good but not really helping the team when it matters.

Oh and NDYANK what happen to A-Rod on Friday and Sunday when he came up in the ninth with a chnace to tie the game. OOPS did you forget about that.

Guy I think the Highes thing is that he shit the bed is first 2 starts in Tirple A and they want him to have at least one good start before coming up to the Majors which he did on April 18th. They think he is better then Wright who got bombed in his last start and they need him for at least one start so why not go with it.

Todd - You can't name Prior as a Dud. He actually has to pitch in the Majors and suck to be a dud.

Dusty ruined him and Wood the same way he ruined Rob Nen.

If Dusty was as smart as Ozzie (see my note at the bottom), the Cubs would've been in the WS in 2003 and I could die in piece when they (maybe) beat the Yankees.

Note: Ozzie started the September call ups so he could rest his pitchers (Buerhle, Contreras, Garcia, etc.) so they would be fresh for the playoffs. Dusty's dumbass rode Wood, Prior, Clement, Zambrano the entire season. Hell, when the Cubs went up in Game 7 with Wood pitching that is when I STARTED drinking. I just knew something bad would happen. And it did.

again - you sound like an idiot or at least someone who doesn't understand or watch baseball...HE CAN'T GET A HIT EVERY TIME HE STEPS UP TO THE PLATE! He will go down as probably the greatest ever if he gets a hit 35 out of 100. Right now his 9th inning average is absurd and he has 3 9th inning HR (including 2 game winners). He hit a line drive to the second baseman and a ground out against one of the better pitchers in teh league...sorry, i am not buying that bullshit. Your beloved Ortiz hasn't been lighting it up in the late innings but no one says anything about that.

I'm sure there is a hole in the rotation, which is why Hughes is pitching Thursday. The Yankees haven't had an off day in a while. Who knows, maybe he'll have a Sam Militello-like debut (but hopefully a much better career).

I'm surprised at how many Yankee haters are also Yankee experts. I don't question every move Francona makes (then again, I don't care unless the Red Sox are playing the Yankees, yet another difference between Yankees and Sox fans).

I'm also sick of people associating all Yankee fans with the idiots who boo any Yankee, let alone ARod. I don't associate all Red Sox fans with the idiot who tried to fight someone on the T because he was wearing a Yankee shirt. Grow up!

I don't think the Hughes move is dumb in principle, but it is pretty strange in its timing. Chase Wright when he was called up was the hottest pitcher in the Yankees farm system, but really isn't considered a prime prospect. So calling up Wright seemed more like an emergency/stopgap measure than anything, that was designed to maybe utilize a hot minor league pitcher, while buying time for the other guys to come off the DL and to give Phil Hughes more time to get in gear.

But now that they're calling up Hughes now, you have to question the logic in not calling him up earlier. To me, this wreaks of a Steinbrenner reactionary move than the more even-keeled Cashman, who has shown a lot more restraint and caution toward proper player development. Does that seem about right?

Verbal, I hope I haven't been associating all Yankees fans with the ones who've booed A-Rod. I usually try and say "the fans who boo A-Rod are idiots."

But yes, nearly every Red Sox fan is a Yankees expert also. That's just how it is. I at least try and be an Orioles, Blue Jays, and D-Rays expert as well, but it's just easier to keep track of the Yankees since they're always in the spotlight and their games are on TV more frequently.

What I am most surprised by at today is the shear fact that Calvin Johnson hasn't already signed a contract as the #1 overall pick. But that's right, the Raiders have the first pick and they would never be smart enough to trade down for a boat load of picks, including the Bucs' #4 overall, and still get their man Russell (see picks 1-3 by team need: Johnson, Petersen, Thomas).

But then again, Randy Moss has not yet been traded to Green Bay either, and THAT supposedly happened like 3 months ago.

I wonder if you told Granpappy AL Davis he did in fact trade Moss already you could confuse him into believing it and he'd still force his staff to take Russell despite the best talent in the draft being a bigger, more physically gifted replacement for Moss.

NDYANK the reason Red Sox fan are not getting all over Ortiz who is having a decent April and Manny who is not doing that great is due to the fact the Red Sox are winning. If the Red Sox were losing then people would be all over Manny and Coco and Pedroia

CMfrost- I know. My thought is more faulting the Raiders for not taking advantage when the market (Gruden) was hot to trot, rather than the Bucs' trade enthusiasm dimming as they get closer to the draft and it is far too overcooked a story now to even bother.

Now, everyone plays poker until the Goodell says, "Good morning and welcome ladies and gentlemen of the media, representatives of the teams, and you the fans to the 2007 NFL Draft... the Raiders are now on the clock."

I think the Raiders would love to trade down, but there are no takers. The only team really looking to try to move in this draft is the Redskins, but they have nothing to offer, as they have already given up almost all of their picks. Thus, the Raiders are stuck with the #1, which is probably the worst position to be in, and the Bucs may still get their man based on the need verse best player available draft scenario.

Interesting that the Ravens have clearly said that they are going with a best player available draft in the first round, no matter what the position is. They have a board with the top players based on their talent evaluation and are taking the highest guy left -- even if that guy is a position they are already solid at.

Most importantly today, what will MLB do to Torii Hunter for the champaign gift to the Royals? Clearly, the league will not suspend him for 3 years as the rule specifically states. But, given that he violated a pretty strongly written rule, he's got to get some form of punishment. I see at least a 7 game suspension coming from this. It's too big of a deal to let it go completely. The rule, in and of itself, is completely justified. But to punish someone for it in this type of scenario is assanine, but probably required.

And it's also clearly his fault that Jeter has made so many errors. If only he'd take Jeter aside, put his arm around him, and go buy him an ice cream once in awhile. His leadership is so overrated!

I also heard a rumor that Mussina, Matsui, and Wang were all injured from having to get to the top step of the dugout everytime hit a home run. I mean, who wouldn't pull a hammy there? A-Rod is totally not a team player! What a selfish prick!

this blathering on about all things baseball, yankees, sox, a-rod, etc. is boring. and yes, april IS less important than september, no matter how anyone wants to try to justify it. simple fact, a bad april or losing streak does not necessarily ruin a season. there is a 5 month window to make corrections/get healthy/get hot, etc. a bad september? not so much. and that is not to downgrade what a-rod is doing right now. this barry bonds guy we speak of? other than 2002, a colossal failure in the playoffs. if not for the home run record, THAT would be his legacy.

there are some playoff games going on right now people. bulls in the east and suns in the west would be a great finals.

I agree that the raiders are silly to not trade down and pick up multiple picks. They have many holes and considering the odds are in their favor that jamarcus russell could fall to them in the fourth coupled with the fact that he is by no means an immediate fix (most scouting reports have stated he definitely needs fine tuning before he is going to be nfl ready), they should consider playing for multiple players to try and piece together a failing team.

Then again, most number one picks should probably be treated as such considering the state of the teams who wind up with the number one pick to begin with...but the glamourous player usually wins out.

I think Torii Hunter may get like a $10,000 fine, but I think that's it. I don't think anyone really knew about the rule until this got brought up, and Torii is a pretty upstanding guy who was trying to do a fun, humorous gesture. No ill will was involved.

I'd be shocked if there were any kind of suspension, since even though the rule is written strongly, he wasn't doing it with any ill intent (as the rule seems to try and prevent gambling), and it was done well after the fact of last year.

The last two WS champs have had a shitty September and also the AL champs from last season. It's not an absolute travesty if you have a sub-par month no matter the month if you've done well in the other 5.

@ndyank - "if" you have a 10 game lead built up. what if you don't? then does sept. become more important? in april, if you're up 10 or down 10, you still have 5/6 of the season left. just look at the tigers(pre leland rant) and twins last year. i am done

I personally would LOVE to see A-Rod close to the season mark as Bonds nears the career mark. I hope A-Rod crushes Bonds' record and all of the glory goes to him, and BB gets an "atta boy" and a handshake.

each game is of equal value during the regular season. Winning early should not be condemned as unimportant or immaterial. having time to make up for early failure means that if you can avoid said failure, septemeber is not important. Not having to be "clutch" in september can be just as valuable as being forced into the situation...

Same thing with comparing Dusty to Ozzie in Chicago. Ozzie didn't rest his best pitchers completely because he wasn't a playoff lock until the last week-end, but he did scale back some as he looked solid to be in.

The Cubs didn't clinch the division until the last week of the season. If the Cubs had rested their starters and then lost the Division, he'd have been run out of town right then.

The difference between the Cubs being in the WS or not is the Alex Gonzalez error (from the guy who lead the league in fielding percentage that year) and then Dusty not even going out to the mound to settle Prior down when he was clearly flustered by the Bartman incident and then the Gonzalez error.

There are a million people who want to speculate on what caused problems for Prior and Wood. Don Sutton blames all of Wood's problems on his 20 strikeout game against the Astros, saying it was too cold and he was too young to throw that many pitches and it ruined him for life on that single day. But Wood didn't pitch at all in 1999 after getting hurt in 1998, which were both long before Dusty got there. Sometimes, players just get hurt. Yes, there were 2 on the same team, but it wasn't really at the same time as Kerry's problems began in August 1998, when the Cubs shut him down for a month to rest for the playoffs. The biggest difference between those 2 and a bunch of other potential superstars is that they both got to the major leagues super fast so their injuries happened at the ML level, and not in the minors, like it has for guys like Shawn Hill and Francis Beltran and others like them who were supposed to be future aces and ended up with Tommy John surgery before getting past Double A ball.

Wasn't that the 'other' Alex Gonzalez that made the error for the Cubs? I know the one that was on the Marlins/Red Sox/Reds was the slick fielding one.

Also, I think Kerry Wood's injuries are a lot easier to explain than Prior's. Early in his career, I think everyone saw Wood was an injury risk, for the same reason that Liriano was last year. Some pitches just shouldn't break that much. Wood's curveball more or less seemed too good, too sharp, etc., that you could just tell it had the real possibility of killing his arm down the road. Prior, on the other hand, seemed to have such smooth and good mechanics that I don't think anyone could've foreseen his injuries.

The Cubs Alex Gonzalez made 10 errors that year, with a .984 fielding percentage (I just looked it up to make sure). He was the slick fielding SS in the NLCS, the other Alex Gonzalez playing shortstop in the NLCS was the better offensive shortstop -- at least he was when he was a Marlin. In 2004, the Cubs traded their Alex Gonzalez along with Francis Beltran (right before TJ surgery) to the Expos in the deal that netted Nomar and Matt Murton.

I understand that the Hunter thing was no big deal. But, if it wasn't an issue at all, MLB wouldn't have brought it up, and the Twins wouldn't have had to recover the bubbly from the Royals. I know it's a slippery slope, but it has such potential to get ugly with things like that, so I would be very surprised of MLB didn't do anything. They were the ones to notice it first, after all.

If the Red Sox or Blue Jays had won the division by 1 game last year, they could have thanked the Nationals with bubbly, as the Nats took 2 of 3 from the Yankees and got swept by the other 2. There's too much at stake to overlook even something so trivial.

Yanksfan, the Bartman ball was a big reason though. It should have been called fan interference. I have said for the past 4 years that the Gonzalez error was a big reason as well. But I still think it all spawned from the Bartman incident and it shouldhave been called fan interference.

NDYanksfan I have a question for you about Brady Quinn. Have you heard any of the stuff that the "Genius" Merrill Hoge is saying about him? Last week he was on the local espn radio show here in Nashville and last night he was on Gottlieb's show talking about the draft. I think he is being harsher to Brady Quinn this year than he was to Vince Young last year. By the way the QB he likes best in this draft is John Beck from BYU.

I am now rooting for Brady Quinn to make it in the NFL because I just love to see Merrill Hoge eat his words.

CMFost, seems to me you are arguing semantics here. I think of April as a month, and by most standards he is having the best April in baseball history. Whether it's defined as "best month" or "best april" is a matter of debate. And if they are dfferent when discussing a bseball season in April.

I don't see A-Rod hitting more than 60 HRs, I'd be relly shocked if he makes a run at the record. He'll cool off eventually. As for the Yankees, they aren't done yet, but their bullpen is a disaster. I'm sure Rivera is fine, every year he has a stretch where he blows a couple of games in a row, then the Post and Daily News start to talk about how he's done. He'll be fine, I expect him to roll off about 20 straight saves now.

I think the Red Sox sweeping the Yankes does have a certain amount of symbolic meaning. Another hump that the Sox got ove,r especially after the Yankees trashed them in August last yr. Sends a solid message.

Still, I think the Yankees go into September with about 80-85 wins and only a small deficit to catch the Sox. Then we'll see if the Sox can hold them off and if A-Rod has a big month.

i had not heard anything and have come to the conclusion that all these "draft experts" simply try and dig up as much controversy surrounding the draft as possible before hand to keep people interested. There is no other way for them to keep stories going considering none of the players are doing anything! Save for two public work outs over the last four months, Quinn is working out by himself - so how are people making new judgements about him? Personnally i think it is a mistake to pass on him (probably due to bias, but also due to watching every single game he has ever played and knowing he has the same vince young ability to win a close game) most of the attacks directed at him are about him not being able to win the big game, despite the fact that if you watched any of those games you know the defense killed them, not him. Great fact about quinn that no one mentions related to his 'win the big one' stigma - any time he has had to lead a drive at the end of the game to tie or win - he has scored.

So i guess to answer the quesiton - i don't really care what kiper or hoge says because nine times out of ten they seem to be wrong. they are both in business of entertainment and controversy = ratings.

another big criticsm is his medium to long range accuracy...however in jamrcus' last work-out session they said he couldn't hit any of his short yardage passes (ten yard outs he was throwing it into the ground)...but everyone can't stop talking about the size of the guys hands for some reason...i rant

Well, seeing as all of the talk around Cleveland is that they are taking Brady Quinn, I sure hope he does well.

Just heard Rome (why I had him on, I have NO idea!) while I just ran out and he was spooing at the mouth about how NFL GMs are such bold-faced liars during Draft Week. How does he even have a freaking show anymore...everyone knows that this a whole chess game between the teams. No one is going to give away what they're thinking!

ND fan Quinn's medium range passing ability was one of the things that Hoge harped on last night. He said that when Quinn throws the intermediate pass that the receiver catches the ball but Quinn does not put it in position to allow the receiver to run after the catch. I usually do not listen to him because of his stupidity regarding Vince Young but I had to listen just to see what diahrrea came from his mouth.

He more than Kiper is in the controversy business. Kiper for the most part does a decent job, not great but it is decent and Hoge is a hack. He is still predicting that VY is going to fail in the NFL because he did not show enough in the passing game last year.

Natsfan you are right. People in Nashville freaked out, I think that if there is someone who could handle the Madden cover Vince is that guy.

Another thing that could doom Vince is the Titans refusal, at least under Floyd Reece to upgrade the talent at WR. Look at a list of WRs that Steve McNair had to throw to while he was in Nashville. His best receiver while he was here was his TE Frank Wycheck. I hope the Titans realize that VY needs some toys to play with if they are going to be successful.

But VY can never be good. He has an awkward throwing motion and is a run-first kind of guy.... Sorry, I was channeling my internal Hoge instead of my own thoughts.

Draft experts get so caught up in physical skills that they forget to look at the player. VY does have a funny motion and looks awkward when he throws, but he wins football games. Troy Smith -- winner. Tom Brady won his first 15 post-season games (counting bowl games) but was a 6th rounder. Ryan Leaf -- more physical tools than possibly any other first round quarterback since John Elway. Not a winner. Not in college, never in the NFL.

JaMarcus Russell, in my eyes, is not a winner. A lot of times, he looks bored or not interested (like Aaron Brooks). In big games not against ND Defense, he doesn't always show up. Brady Quinn doesn't seem to inspire greatness either, but he had a lot more challenges than just his own ability. Draftniks like Hoge and Kiper want tools. I want football players. Calvin Johnson -- Winner! If he can catch passes from Reggie Ball, he can catch passes from anyone. VY -- winner. In college, and NFL. Matt Leinhart -- not a winner.

Peyton Manning spent an entire college and NFL career as not a winner (didn't beat Florida, win Bowl Games, or go to SuperBowls), but he just shed that after 15 years of us believing it.

Let's run down Leinhart's career then. Against Cal, in the .5 Championship year, he lost in OT, but had a chance late in regulation to win it, after they came back from down a bunch. Against ND he got the Reggie Bush Push. Against VY, he lost when he had a chance to take the team down the field to win the game even after the VY heroics. Leinhart was 0-2-1 (The Bush Push is a statistical push to me) in games decided by 6 or less. When a team has the talent of USC, it's easy to win the blowout games. A winner also wins the close ones.

I don't fault Leinhart for blowing people out. I fault him for failing to when when he didn't blow them out.

Leinart only lost two/three games in three years. I think that qualifies as a winner.

Carroll made the fourth down call for White to carry the ball and didn't convert.

Leinart drilled a well covered Dwayne Jarrett on a fourth and 8 inside the ND 35 that helped them get to the goal line.

If anyone is not winner, pick up the dictionary and look at OU. White got blown out by LSU (when USC should've played that game, you can't win your conference, you SHOULD NOT be playing for the National Championship) and then got blown out by USC the next year.

being a football player trumps being a winner in my opinion. There are way too many factors surrounding winning a football game. dorsey, for example, was a winning qb but his team was responsible for the winning. Obviously the fact that VY and leinart won was contingent on them being very good qb's and making good decisions, but their defenses and offensive weapons were equally important. showing ability in a game is more important that the win/loss numbers. their qb ability translate to wins but their teams had a pretty big part of it as well.

on the same note, work outs are not as important as showing abilities with pressure in your face and being forced to make decisions on the fly.

I guess what i am saying is that the 'big game' W's everyone is talking about cannot be pinned on one player. Big games mean you are playing superior talent on both sides of the ball and a single player can't trascend the game and win it by themselves (as much of an impact VY had on the chapionship game, his defense made the stops and his supporting cast was pretty talented)...so to say quinn can't win the bowl game or the big game is such an understatement to his talent and abilities as a qb he demonstrated throughout his career.

Marino had plenty of game-winning drives....the fake spike for one, the playoff game in Seattle his last year, for another. Those are just off the top of my head. Now you're saying *he* can't come through in clutch situations? His teams got killed in the SB 19 and the AFC champ. the next year. Not due to failing on a last-minute drive...

I got (2)tickets are for April 28th and 29th (Sat. & Sun.). I won these in a radio contest from NFL Network,I can't use them because I didn't know my son's confirmation is that same day.I thought I'd share this with you guys.(My friend did the ebay thing for me.)

So, hang on, Kevin Millar is a winner? Steve Kerr is a winner? What do we do about Jeff Weaver? He gave up a momentum shifting hr in extra innings in the 2003 WS, but won last year with the Cardinals. Being a winner in a team sport is almost like winning a lottery...you have to be in the right place at the right time.

i dont think its as random as winning the lottery - but being a winner simply by winning the world series is not a good criteria...all these things are TEAM sports. Marino can't play D, catch the ball and block, A-rod can't pitch and hit 9 times through the line-up...its about having a great TEAM. Calling Ted Williams or A-Rod a loser is idiotic. Same goes for Ty Cobb (he's more of an asshole) or Ewing. You can't be a professional baseball/football/basketball player and be a loser.

Championships are important toward the overall greatness of a player, but it it's not the most important thing, nor even close. But it does matter in the cases of certain careers a la Kirby Puckett, Curt Schilling, and Derek Jeter, where their greatness is often defined because of their reputations for stepping up in the postseason.

Alright, I'll concede on Marino. I actually forgot about some of his 4th quarter comebacks due to my mental block about his excellent SB performances.

Peyton Manning shed his big game label this year, and he has always had the ability to drive a team to win late. But let's not get too hasty and forget that Peyton had 2 chances against the Patriots this year. He went 3 and out with under 4:00 to play and got very lucky to get the ball back for a 2nd attempt. If the Patriots pick up one more first down, we'd all be talking about how Peyton had a chance with the ball on the 30 with under 4:00 and went deep 3 times instead of trying to move the football.

I brought this up the other day, that in some sports it is a lot easier for one guy to dominate than it is in others. A goalie with a hot hand can carry a team in hockey. A pitcher can throw a complete game shutout and only needs minimal run support to get a win. A quarterback cannot win a game alone because he needs players around him to do their job -- defense to make stops and get him the ball, receivers to catch the ball, etc. But, when a team makes the stop and gives the QB the ball with a chance to get the win, the QB has to step up and do it. Brady and Montana have done it a lot (but Brady threw late interceptions in both Colts games this year even). But Leinart has only showed this ability 1 time. Granted, he hasn't had many chances and we'll see how he does if he gets them.

I would debate your assessment of Curt Schilling. He could easily have been the goat for the Dbacks in 2001 for giving up the HR to Soriano, and there never would have been the bloody sock incident if Joe Torre hadn't forgot how to manage in late inning situations.

If counting championships, Ernie Banks was never a winner, or charles Barkley, or whatever.... But I'm not defining winner by championships (I already conceded that I forgot about some of Marino's great 4th quarter comebacks). I am defining winner as the guy you want to have on your side late in a game when it's close and everything matters.

2 outs, bottom of the 9th, 2 men on, down by 1 -- do you want to see Jeter batting, or A-Rod? 4th quarter, need 90 yards for the game winning touchdown, do you want to have Montana as your QB, or Boomer Esiason? One shot at a 3-pointer for the win, does Larry Byrd take it, or Steve Kerr?

NDYanks fan, ignore CMFost, he's only talking out of his ass to get you riled up. Notice when you began talking football and ignored him for a while he had to come back with "Jeter = Winner, Ortiz = Winner, A-Rod = Not so much" The guy can't even type a comprehensible sentence, don't waste your time on him.

"Typical A-Rod. Doing everything to make himself look good but not really helping the team when it matters." - CMFost

For the record, ESPN is reporting that Jason Gimabi has been constantly calling Roger Clemens in an attepmt to recruit him to play for the Yankees. Apparently the Giambino texts him all the time as well including a text from the clubhouse after the Red Sox sweep that said "Hurry up."

Schilling is a dominant pitcher (well was, he is just a good pitcher right now) and it showed in the postseason. You can find holes in all great player postseasons (schilling, ortiz, jeter, rivera, clemens) everyone! Its probably because at that stage in the season your facing the BEST IN THE WORLD which means your not going to bat 1.000, strike out everyone, or get the save every time. Calling out someone for not being clutch against the best talent in the world in a game where 70% of the time you fail isn't exactly fair.

But I will say where Simmons has always been fairly hit or miss, he's been a lot more miss than hit lately. Hopefully he won't feed us 18 different irrelevant Celtics posts during the offseason, or do a mailbag more than once every three months.

Nats - If you define a winner by championships then you obviously must AGREE that Leinart is a winner. Pick and stick with it you can't be a woman and keep changing your mind about what is/is not a winner.

Sorry ladies...I know it's bad to generalize.

Todd - The Jeffrey Maier comment was classic, it made me laugh out loud.

I never said championships. I said wins close games and teams can count on him/her in the clutch. I apologized for my Marino mental block, but went on with clutch performances.

Look, Leinart may turn out to be the greatest QB ever, for all we know. He only lost 2 games in college in 3 years as a starter and he won a Heisman trophy. But in close games, late, his record wasn't very good.

Where do I begin? Note, it's not with the over-emphasis on April games (most Red Sox fans I know do the same every year this decade with the same results by season's end).

One, he rips the Orioles ("they'll be out of it then"), the D-Rays, who always plays the Red Sox tough, ("65 win team") and the Blue Jays ("absolute train wreck") when talking about the Red Sox Sept. schedule.

Two, he already has the Red Sox pencilled in for a 9-3 record vs. the Yankees by June (umm...only 3 games have been played and they were all at Fenway).

Three, he is writing off Rivera, who, like the Yankees, the past couple of years has had slowish starts to the season.

Four, he claims the Red Sox have cooled off ARod, only then to have ARod hit 2 more hrs last night.

I completely agree with you on your Simmons' assessment with the too much bball (some of which he contradicts himself) and he doesn't bring the funny lately. Plus, the added bonus of his "blogs" (can he stop calling it that) and columns being now posted at like 3-3:30 EST instead of the 12-1 pm (lunch time reading).

Yeah, the A-Rod comment Simmons made was stupid. It's not like he did poorly the rest of the series after Friday night's show... but then again, he did cool off in that he didn't hit a walk-off/go ahead in the 9th, but that's a pretty ridiculous standard, and the dude is still on fire. Using Simmons terms, if he cooled down to 125 degrees, he was back to 650 last night.

He didn't say necessarily that Rivera was done, just that he'd rather have Papelbon right now over Mariano. I think every biased Red Sox fan would say the same thing. And at this very moment in time, Papelbon looks better than Rivera (not saying Rivera won't necessarily have the better year, just that Papelbon is pitching out of his mind right now, and Rivera hasn't been Rivera yet).

He does say "if" the Red Sox go 9-3, but I agree with you that it's just dumb to say things like that. It wreaks a lot of why people hate Sox fans in the post-'04 era.

I think the only ESPN writer who gets the concept of a what a blog entry actually should be is Rob Neyer. But Buster's "blog" is still my favorite.

Todd, I see your point about Rivera vs. Papelbon, but their starts to this season are almost exact to their beginning of last season and we all know how that ended. It's too short-sighted to make comments like that, especially when it can blow up back in your face.

We all like giving someone a ribbing when our team/player does better than a friends; but most of my friends and family wait until things are actually finished. Simmons seems to be pulling a Tracy McGrady, and I hope that he is in a position to ask Tracy for a good crow recipe.

Yeah, it's just way too early to call anything on Rivera, especially given that he was off to a slow start two years ago and ended up just fine. (As for last year, Rivera was shut down for most of September also, right?).

I personally am looking forward to this weekend's series, as I think it'll be a better indication of how things are, with Matsui back in the lineup.

Question though, are the Yankees in NYC on Thursday? Because isn't it supposed to rain then... in other words, would they throw Phil Hughes against the Red Sox for his first start?

(Phil Hughes went to my rival high school (the rich, white kids' school in my city), so I doubly root against the kid).

As much as I would love to see ARod make a run at the record, especially being a Yankee fan, do not forget how rough Yankee Stadium is on right-handed hitters. Before Arod in 05, the last Yankee right handed hitter to hit 40 HR was Joe DiMaggio. (Soriano had 39 in '02)

If I was a fan, and the game was on the line, I would want Reggie Miller to have the last shot over about 99% of other NBA players.

The thing is, there are a lot of things that make a player great besides "tools". Draft analyzers want the biggest, fastest, strongest, smartest, etc. whatever... But that isn't all that makes a player great. JD Drew was considered a 5 tool player when Philly drafted him, and see how that turned out for them. But Vince Young was supposed to be not very smart and look how many teams passed on Tom Brady? Heck, barring injury, last year's NFL rookie of the year would have been a 7th round pick.

I don't know if Russell or Quinn will either one ever be great quarterbacks, but I know which one I would pick higher. More importantly, I know that Hoge is an idiot who hated Vince Young and now hates Brady Quinn, so I'd love to see him be very wrong on a first round QB for 2 years in a row.

Remember, Norm Chow's team took Vince Young when his boy Leinart was still available. Do you think Norm knew something we all don't?

I don't care if A-Rod hits 100 HR's with 250RBI's. If the Cubs sign him for $40 million a year, I will cease to be a Cubs fan. Everyone here knows I'm a diehard but if they start spending money worse than the Yankees, I will not be a fan. I don't think he's worth the $25.2 that he's making now. I don't think any baseball player is, or professional athlete for that matter. Athlete salaries are getting out of control. I'll become a Twins fan. They know how to win without breaking the bank.

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DanShanoff.com is a sports-blog spin-off of my long-time ESPN.com column, "The Daily Quickie." Anchored by an early-morning post of must-know topics, the blog is updated frequently throughout the day with new posts and user comments.