Trinity Oaks' grain-feed mix : Natural Feeding for Rabbits - Page 5

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skysthelimit wrote:A large portion of the population of the world is lactose intolerant, because most mammals stop drinking milk after they are weaned. They can consume it, but is it is not a necessity.

This is my families experience. Though I hear that drinking raw milk may be the answer to many people's intolerance to dairy. Mainly, because it has the bacteria that hasn't been pasteurized out of it that helps break down the lactose sugars. My husband and son can drink raw milk fine. I haven't experimented yet because to quite honest I'm fearful of having a reaction. One daughter gets a stomach ache still and my other daughter started getting eczema when she started drinking it. So back to coconut milk for them!

I see a lot of comments of what would rabbits eat in the wild. Well, a variety of grasses, barks, etc. whatever they were needing and was available. But our domesticated breeds are so far removed from their wild cousins it would take many many generations of selected breeding to get them to thrive on a "wild" diet, and they would not be nearly as large or fast growing. Think of how many hundreds (thousands) of generations these breeds have been bred in captivity with us supplying everything they need nutrition wise - it would take just as long to get them back to the wild type foods of their ancestors.

Also, wild rabbits don't have the same growth rate, tenderness of meat, etc. that domesticated rabbits do. All of these production rates we so love would be diminished. I am not saying that more forage and fresh foods would not be extremely better for our bun buns - I too want to feed a more natural diet. However the thought that wild food is the best food is not always true. Wild rabbits have nutritional problems too, remember!

I would personally not be satisfied if my rabbits had only the production of the local wild rabbits I see in the brambles sometimes!

WallTenter wrote:I see a lot of comments of what would rabbits eat in the wild. Well, a variety of grasses, barks, etc. whatever they were needing and was available. But our domesticated breeds are so far removed from their wild cousins it would take many many generations of selected breeding to get them to thrive on a "wild" diet, and they would not be nearly as large or fast growing. Think of how many hundreds (thousands) of generations these breeds have been bred in captivity with us supplying everything they need nutrition wise - it would take just as long to get them back to the wild type foods of their ancestors.

Also, wild rabbits don't have the same growth rate, tenderness of meat, etc. that domesticated rabbits do. All of these production rates we so love would be diminished. I am not saying that more forage and fresh foods would not be extremely better for our bun buns - I too want to feed a more natural diet. However the thought that wild food is the best food is not always true. Wild rabbits have nutritional problems too, remember!

I would personally not be satisfied if my rabbits had only the production of the local wild rabbits I see in the brambles sometimes!

And, yet, rabbit breeders in other countries who do not have access to pellets still manage to feed their rabbits well, get great growth rates, etc. And, in fact, most of the breeds we use today were developed long before pellets arrived on the scene. Sooo...clearly, it is possible to feed our domesticated rabbits a pelletless diet and still get good efficient meat production!

"most of the breeds we use today were developed long before pellets arrived on the scene" yes but they did not develop in someone's blackberry patch. And there have been several hundred generations since their development as well. And rabbits only live to be 2yrs old and a processing weight of 14weeks on a NZW needs to only be 5lbs.

Anytime you collect as much food for an animal as it can possibly eat while keeping it away from all threats of predators you are not feeding it naturally. I am not against feeding more naturally, again, I'm just saying let's not forget that there are nutritional deficiencies in most "wild" feeds.

In my area, 'easter' bunnies get 'released' into the 'wild' quite often. They take over parks, and in some cases, the city has to hold a round up. In any case, they do quite well eating wild. Granted, I live in a very temperate climate, so even in the winter there is a lot of forage.

"In addition, my rabbits get a tablespoon or two of red vinegar in their water (helps with digestion, and also reduces the odor of their urine), and pregnant/nursing does also get a teaspoon or two of calcium drench (for goats) in their water."

If your rabbits were (or are) on a watering system, how would you get the calcium drench just to your does? The vinegar is easy but the drench not so much.

I can tell your from experience, my large meat breeds and show rabbits do not do well on the grain mix. They don't reach the weights the same time, don't carry the same flesh condition and don't grow wool like they would on pellets. It's possible, but it will take generations of selecting those who thrive.

Let me hop on the revival band wagon! Has anyone used this or a similar grain blend with success on show rabbits?

I've only just recently begun showing English Lops and I've found that a great many of the conditioning supplements that are commercially available include many of the same ingredients. After seeing 16 oz. baggies containing oats, wheat middlings, black oil sunflower seeds, and barley for sale for $12+ at the shows, I thought there HAD to be a more economical way to blend my own.

Then, because my brain likes to extrapolate data, I wondered why I couldn't simply make my own blend in bulk and begin gradually transitioning my rabbits from pellets onto a whole grain diet. Of course, the one thing that gives me pause is the fact that I've got a couple of buns who are currently well on their way to attaining Grand Champion status and I REALLY don't want to throw them out of condition just yet.

BirchLane wrote:Has anyone used this or a similar grain blend with success on show rabbits?

Yes, I used to.

But as Skysthelimit mentioned, they don't grow as fast or have the same condition as pellet fed rabbits. I still supplement with a grain mix occasionally, and also offer it at shows. They eat it like candy, but if too stressed wont eat pellets.

BirchLane wrote:I thought there HAD to be a more economical way to blend my own.

There is. I buy oats, barley, and BOSS in 50lb bags at Tractor Supply Company. I also add flax seed and wildbird seed (without corn) to my mix.

__________ Sat Sep 12, 2015 11:42 am __________

Miss M wrote:

skysthelimit wrote:Whoa this is an old topic

It is, but it's a Sticky, so we expect these to revive now and then.

I saw the link posted on FaceBook yesterday. Perhaps Raliallison and BirchLane found it that way?

Victory Garden Rabbits

Proud new owner of the highly coveted Get-away-with-it-card! (Homer's gift to me in a feeble attempt to curry favor and avoid the ban hammer.)

It was being passed around in the Backyard Meat Rabbits group on FB after a user showed her homemade grain mix. Lots of people were curious about a DIY option that could meet their needs without relying on pellets as much, if at all. I don't know that a complete switch makes sense for me right now, but it's definitely a springboard for conditioning my show buns and keeping my brood does in good flesh when they're raising huge (12-14, on average) litters.

Something you're going to have to pay attention to if feeding a grain mix is vitamin A. Rabbits have rather high vitamin A requirements and most common grains provide very little. Wheat, oat, barley, corn, and sunflowers are all deficient in vitamin A.

Infact, according to some published research many pelleted feeds provide insufficient vitamin A.

I have found very little information on vitamin A in hay. This little tidbit is very telling though...

We are not aware of any published values for vitamins in grass hays or other forges, mostly because vitamins are generally only seen in low amounts or not at all in dried forages (hays). Plants do not actually contain vitamin A, but they do contain beta-carotene which is converted into vitamin A within the horse's gastrointestinal tract. However, beta-carotene isn't stable once the forage has been harvested, so levels decrease quickly (within weeks) until the amount left is insufficient to meet a horse's nutritional needs. Consequently, vitamin A should be supplemented when horses are fed harvested forages. Vitamin A is known for its role in night vision.

Yellow and orange pumpkins and carrots are great sources of vitamin A (beta-carotene) and some varieties store well and most rabbits love them. I'm unsure how storage of these foods effects beta-carotene levels.