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Originally posted by QuicklyScottWell, it's slightly subjective. I thought the hearts and the DEs were some of the most grindiest content I've ever played. Although I only did the starter zone DEs.

I understand that your hate on for GW2 is fueled by some kind of nasty MMO viagra but if you think the starter DEs and hearts were "the most grindiest content" I can't imagine what you would do in any of the old school games.

I have played games that required the player to kill thousands of mobs at 0.001% xp per kill to make a level. I used to play 12 Sky the original. Max level in that game used to take about 80 to 100 hours depending on xp bonuses and help from party memebers if you could arrange it.

Damn man, hating the game is fine. Gross hyperbole such as your comments is just the sign of a pure attention seeking troll.

Up till now I could ignore your barbs but I have finally come to the conclusion you have nothing of value to say.

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@doomgrin - bingo. 'Nuff said. After reading these posts, it's clear that some kids just aren't happy unless they have to complain about. Whatever happened to simply relaxing and enjoying the temporary escape?

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Has this David North guy actually played the game past level 40? The grind is there like in every other themepark MMO. It is a refined grind, less boring and less tedious than, let's say, WoW's but it's still grind.

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I got bored of the game already playing as a warrior Charr, doing quests in every Area from the lowest to the highest. I am level 43 and been grinding to explore the area, grinding hearts, going though skill points, finding the right locations for getting that vista, and grinding though mobs to level up my crafting to get to tier 3 Weaponsmithing and tier 3 Armorsmithing.

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Originally posted by Vannor

They havn't removed the grind at all. To get the most desired items in the game you have to XP grind (for 100 skill points for EACH item) and/or dungeon grind (50+ runs). They removed the need to grind to be competitive, they did not remove the grind. To get those desired items, the grind is worse than in most other MMOs.

Level grind is gone.. but that's only because they throw experience at you every chance they get. <-- Which I prefer over the old ways. However, it's not because the tasks are more stimulating, you wouldn't keep toasting at tables, collecting the eggs or killing things once the hearts or DE is finished, it's just as boring as any other grind. Lack of linking quest based storylines make almost every heart and every event kinda mundane as well, purposeless. Now we are grinding with even less reasons to grind.

I want the legendary and armor sets grind gone though, it's just too high.. it ruins the game for me and is the reason I'm not loggin in every day anymore.

Do be so impatient. The game is meant to be played for months, years even, it is an MMORPG after all. Just do whatever in the game that you find fun and over the weeks/months you'll earn enough points to get those legendary sets.

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Originally posted by IllyssiaPeople were beating the game very quickly, so while they got rid of the game grind perhaps ArenaNet made the challenge a little to easy.

I kinda agree with this. Having never experienced a real sandbox I don't have that to compare it to(closest I have come was FFXI) I think longevity is going to be an issue although I gotta say I am not having issues with it. 118 hours in and not an once of boredom yet. EXP gain is easy as hell, but I think in the overall game design its trivial anyways so I stopped watching the bar to be honest. I think the game has gotten rid of grinding in some aspects but it's really all about how you look and interpret what grinding really is. To claim their craft system, world exploration, and exp progression is grind is laughable from my understanding.

Offtopic does anyone know if there is any kind of compensation once you hit 80 since you wont be gaining EXP? I planned on 100% the map on at least one of my characters and thought I remembered seeing an answer somewhere but never found it. If I remember right I think it was skillpoints for a level after 80 but can't find anything solid.

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Sorry but the grind was NOT removed whatsoever in GuildWars 2, and is even the worst i've seen than some done previously. You see this pretty well with an alt trying to level it.

Trying to go from 20 to 30 last night on my alt was like pulling teeth. I had already done all that content before on my main (I explored every low tier end area for each race), and it was a literal grind finding xp to level off.

Hearts,

Events (they aren't dynamic),

Scripted Boss Fights,

Scripted Champion Fights,

Hidden # of bear-butts to obtain by a Progress Bar,

Horribly grindy so far, but then again the game is so easy who cares right?

This! Sorry OP, but this game is as much grinding as any other MMO.

They just removed quests and replaced them with Events (aka Mythic's WAR public quest system, which Trion copied for their game RIFT as well).

In fact, this game feels more grindy than any other game, as all these events start becoming stale and repetitive after you've gone through a few zones.

I actually started missing some good old Storyline quests like in LOTRO and Everquest 2. :-(

GW2 only has a personal storyline quest series and that's it. :-/

I have to agree, I actually felt it was more grindy in a way because my actions didnt matter, it just seemed like one big Zerg going form quest to quest.

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If you look for something, you will find it. When I play GW2 I just go out there and enjoy it and I don't focus on whether what I'm doing is a grind. "Is it fun?" is the corny, but paramount, question here. If you find yourself getting bogged down by redundancy I would suggest going to another zone. Keeps it fresh.

I know I am playing a themepark game with rotating canned events but I don't dwell on that and they hide it better than any game I've played. I just play the game and let myself get caught into what I'm doing.

On a side note I'm really glad my playing pace is behind the bulk of players. I've noticed there are still people showing up to events of course but 10 rather than 20-25 and it's more fun.

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Originally posted by Vannor

They havn't removed the grind at all. To get the most desired items in the game you have to XP grind (for 100 skill points for EACH item) and/or dungeon grind (50+ runs). They removed the need to grind to be competitive, they did not remove the grind. To get those desired items, the grind is worse than in most other MMOs.

Level grind is gone.. but that's only because they throw experience at you every chance they get. <-- Which I prefer over the old ways. However, it's not because the tasks are more stimulating, you wouldn't keep toasting at tables, collecting the eggs or killing things once the hearts or DE is finished, it's just as boring as any other grind. Lack of linking quest based storylines make almost every heart and every event kinda mundane as well, purposeless. Now we are grinding with even less reasons to grind.

I want the legendary and armor sets grind gone though, it's just too high.. it ruins the game for me and is the reason I'm not loggin in every day

Actually they did remove the grind, I play this game and never ever feel like I have to just get through something.

With the level adjustments I can RVR at any time, I can go to an lower level and still get good XP for events. I love the fact at level 36 I can go to a level 19 event and get full XP because my level has been adjusted to the zone I am in. I hardly ever even notice what level I am.

The exploration is mind boggling. The cities are HUGE, and the hidden puzzles are a thrill to search for. Not evertything is on the maps which makes it that much more fun for me.

I read a post where someone said there is no exploring, and laughed. This game offers more exploration tha any MMO to date. The sheer size and all of the underwater areas have kept me busy.

I am only level 36, but I don't even follow my level. I do have to be careful and not go into higher zones than my level, but I still have lower level zones to e\\plore for the first time.

the key to me is getting good XP wherever you quest As long as the levels are close or below).

I was never sure I would like this game, and I can tll you it has delivered on every promise.

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Sorry but the grind was NOT removed whatsoever in GuildWars 2, and is even the worst i've seen than some done previously. You see this pretty well with an alt trying to level it.

Trying to go from 20 to 30 last night on my alt was like pulling teeth. I had already done all that content before on my main (I explored every low tier end area for each race), and it was a literal grind finding xp to level off.

Hearts,

Events (they aren't dynamic),

Scripted Boss Fights,

Scripted Champion Fights,

Hidden # of bear-butts to obtain by a Progress Bar,

Horribly grindy so far, but then again the game is so easy who cares right?

This! Sorry OP, but this game is as much grinding as any other MMO.

They just removed quests and replaced them with Events (aka Mythic's WAR public quest system, which Trion copied for their game RIFT as well).

In fact, this game feels more grindy than any other game, as all these events start becoming stale and repetitive after you've gone through a few zones.

I actually started missing some good old Storyline quests like in LOTRO and Everquest 2. :-(

GW2 only has a personal storyline quest series and that's it. :-/

I have to agree, I actually felt it was more grindy in a way because my actions didnt matter, it just seemed like one big Zerg going form quest to quest.

First off trion was advertising the Rift event system before WAR ever came out. So they copied nothing.

Every MMO copied UO in that frame of thinking, because UO was the first game that ahad the balls to come out with a sub when people were told a sub game would never work.

A "grind" to me, is mindless killing the same thing over and over to just finish a damn level so I can move on.

This game allows you to level scale so you can go back to otehr zones and get great XP and see and do new content.

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The game is actually still quite grindy. Especially the hearts. I feel like the majority of people who are stating otherwise have not even made it past level 60 (which is fine, but that's where I think your opinion may start to change).

Hearts become very repetitive and the dynamic events just seem like knock-offs of all the other events you've already done. The events are so scripted that the higher level zones usually have a zerg of people running through the events in the same pattern. It doesn't feel dynamic at all and you'll find yourself doing this a lot at the end of the game if you're wanting karma gear.

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Originally posted by BadSpockGrind is how you define it.

When there is a break in DE's and I don't feel like seeking out Hearts, I explore, gather, and craft - got 22-24 on a toon last night going from 48 Armorsmith to like 115 (inlcuding exploration XP, gathering XP, killing XP for mats/stuff in my way, crafting XP, and daily acheivement XP.)

Nice. I play Rift just like that. Glad GW2 is helping people out of their ruts.

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Originally posted by sonoggi

Originally posted by Vannor

They havn't removed the grind at all. To get the most desired items in the game you have to XP grind (for 100 skill points for EACH item) and/or dungeon grind (50+ runs). They removed the need to grind to be competitive, they did not remove the grind. To get those desired items, the grind is worse than in most other MMOs.

Level grind is gone.. but that's only because they throw experience at you every chance they get. <-- Which I prefer over the old ways. However, it's not because the tasks are more stimulating, you wouldn't keep toasting at tables, collecting the eggs or killing things once the hearts or DE is finished, it's just as boring as any other grind. Lack of linking quest based storylines make almost every heart and every event kinda mundane as well, purposeless. Now we are grinding with even less reasons to grind.

I want the legendary and armor sets grind gone though, it's just too high.. it ruins the game for me and is the reason I'm not loggin in every day anymore.

grinding is not required for you to be viable in pve and pvp, therefore there is no grind. the grind for better looking gear is entirely optional. get your facts straight

I think you need to get your definitions and your facts straight. A repetative task to achieve a goal is grinding, getting a weapon is a goal. Playing a game in the first place is optional so by your idiotic definition grind doesn't exist in any game.

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No grind to be competitive? Nonsense. Matched up this last round we had a 5 man ranger group all with Mystic bows that drop a zerg of 20 in a single volley hitting for 990+ per strike. Right now hi-cap servers have an edge for a while until the rest catch up but you are either grinding to high holy hell to get a mystic or you are grinding for cash to buy one.

Just look at the requirement for some of these items. 200 skill point items. Lets say you can pack a level away in 10 minutes. Thats 2000 minutes... for 1 crafting component.

There is grind. The only place grind is eliminated is in sPvP (Structured PvP, aka the BGs) which is nice. However, to keep yourself alive and fighting in WvW the difference between well geared and scrub gear is substantial. I have twice the hps one of our recent Rangers have and I crit for +400 more damage then he does. Gear is significant and thus the grind for that gear.

It is a great game but stating there is no grind or less grind is code word for "I don't craft" and "I zerg a lot".