"My husband (JDHCalif) wrote a lengthy review and I wanted to add my 2 cents. We are actually now getting nearly 130mpg per day because his company installed an electrical outlet in his office parking area.

The car costs about $2 to fully charge at PG&E rates and each full charge takes the car about 45 miles. Even though we drive 130 mile+ daily commutes we are burning almost no gas...not insignificant in CA where gas is now $4.63 per gallon. The Volt is proving to be more than twice as economical as our Prius...and it drives so much better - even the regen brakes feel better. We are going to sell the Prius and get another fully loaded Volt for me (which net/net costs less than a comparably loaded new Prius)

Volt MSRP runs north of $50k.
How many charges will the batteries last?
Replacement cost of batteries will give you a sticker shock.
I have heard $8000+. My best estimate is 5 year battery life if
driven daily.

Now compare a similar size gasoline only car. Many are available around $20k yielding 28 mpg.

For a 10 year period, and 100,000 miles of driving,
the Volt will use 100,000/130mpg=768 gallons of fuel.
The gas car will use 100,000/28=3571 gallons of fuel.

Free electricity at work might be nice,First law of Economics TANSTAAFL: There ain't no such thing as a free lunch. Get enough people charging their cars at work and companies will start charging for it.

The range is pretty useless for a ‘westerner’. I drive 40 a day on my commute so if I did have one of these would just barely make if it didn't get charged while I was at work. Can't drive to anybody out in the country. What do you do if you get stuck on the side of the road “out of gas”?

12
posted on 04/15/2012 9:24:43 PM PDT
by Idaho_Cowboy
(The man of a thousand tag lines.)

Yep. That would be my choice in a New York Minute. I’ve crunched the numbers and there’s no question that for the price of a Volt, the Audi TDI is a MUCH better deal.

The problem for the Volt is that it carries a low-end luxury car price... and is as plain as an Amish buggy. For the same money, you can get into a whole lot of other cars that have more zip, more utility or more luxury (pick one or two of those, but not all three).

The Volt costs so much more than the Prius, which is priced starting just under the average selling price of a car in the US, that if one wants a hybrid and low fuel costs, the choice is clear: Get a Prius.

Suppose they actually get 45 miles on a charge (suppose...). At 130 miles/day commute, that means 65 miles one way. So the last 20 miles or so are on gas. When the gas engine kicks in, it is going to not only push the car, but start re-charging the battery. That engine will be under heavy load basically the entire time. That last 20 miles probably takes 40 minutes or so - some highway and then surface streets to final destination. In 40 minutes at full load that 1.4L engine will burn some fuel. In 40 minutes or so of modest load driving the 2.0L engine in my car would burn over a gallon of gas.

So then they get to work, charge, and do the same thing all over again on the way home. Although she claims they are burning "almost no gas" that has got to be an exaggeration. I'd estimate they are burning about 3 gallons a day. That's not bad but... Consider that you can easily find small commuter cars that get mid 30s for mpg in their scenario. They would burn maybe 4 gallons a day.

So they are saving themselves 1 gallon of gas a day. Oh, but they're also paying about $2 a day in electricity to recharge. (and skating along on the employer's good graces for another roughly $2 a day in electricity) And they have the high initial cost, the Mickey Mouse fooling around with recharging twice a day. The added dangers, operational restrictions/characteristics of an 80 hp slug...

I just don't see how it makes any sense other than making a status/political statement. I don't understand people that commute in dualy pickups either when they've never had anything more than an empty McDonalds wrapper in the bed of their truck. To each his own. But when you're doing something just to do it, don't try to rationalize it. I do enough of my own rationalizations - I don't need yours! ;-)

Now compare a similar size gasoline only car. Many are available around $20k yielding 28 mpg.

I can do better - 4 door Suzuki SX4 gets well north of 30mpg in actual driving (a buddy with one just told me about getting 39mpg out of his), and an out-the-door MSRP under 17K. I'm actually looking at something like this as my next car. Except my current car is running great and I don't have a spare 17K laying around. ;-)

You're right though. Your numbers or mine - just goes to show the Volt makes no sense whatsoever from a practical standpoint.

“The Volt, which cost nearly $40,000 before a $7,500 federal tax credit, could take up to 27 years to pay off versus a Chevrolet Cruze, assuming it was regularly driven farther than its battery-only range allows.”

Whadda deal!

28
posted on 04/15/2012 10:04:57 PM PDT
by rockrr
(Everything is different now...)

The Volt costs so much more than the Prius, which is priced starting just under the average selling price of a car in the US, that if one wants a hybrid and low fuel costs, the choice is clear: Get a Prius.

OK, we agree on the audi and while the Prius is a nice car, I think there are better choices.

For a gasoline only powered vehicle, this gets about 38 mpg and has more room and functionality than the Prius.

Four adults fit in the Honda Fit much more comfortably than the Prius and the cargo room of the Fit is way better. Take it to a garage sale or Home Depot and you will be surprised what you can haul home. Just don't haul over 990 pounds, including passengers.

29
posted on 04/15/2012 10:07:26 PM PDT
by gunsequalfreedom
(Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)

Go to Barrett-Jackson Auctions and bid online (while viewing cars on the SPEED Channel) on a fully restored or Retro-Moded (much better than new) late 50s ‘Vette or mid-50s Baby Bird for mid 20s to mid 40s

Drive it for 5-10 years sorta carefully but quite briskly

Resell (if you are insane) then at B-J for 2 times to 4 times what you paid for it

Garaged full actual replacement classic car insurance is often under $300-$500 bucks a year

The Volt is NOT a green car because it uses electricity generated by burning coal/oil/nat gas/nuclear

From an environmental perspective, I still like electrics where there is fossil fuel generation because it is generated at a level much more efficient than a car engine. There's some loss over transmission, and then the electric motors are 90+ percent efficient, still much better than a gasoline engine. Plus, pollution from the power generation doesn't end up at street level in the city.

I'm a perfect candidate for a Nissan Leaf with my short commute. I might even think of getting one after the second generation (not going to buy first). For the financials, it's not only that gas is effectively cheaper, remember for a pure electric there are also no oil changes, transmission fluid changes, clutches, etc., and brake changes will be few and far between with the regenerative braking. Nice and simple setup with a pure electric, little maintenance should be required.

But hybrids? No thanks. That much added weight and complexity for a little fuel savings doesn't look like a good idea.

I saw a Leaf pulled up to the front of the Fry's Electronics in San Diego. Plugged into a socket. The owner was compelled to hang around for a few hours as a hostage waiting for his Leaf to be charged enough to leave the store. When it was sufficiently charged, he pulled the charger and hunted down his wife and daughter so they could leave. I'm pretty sure the connection to Fry's power socket was done without permission. The slug even left the weatherproof cover open as he slinked away in his plug-in. Thief.

I've seen a few Leaf's driving around San Diego. Only 2 Volt's thus far.

The car costs about $2 to fully charge at PG&E rates and each full charge takes the car about 45 miles. Even though we drive 130 mile+ daily commutes

Anyone catch the flaw here? 45 miles per charge means they are only getting 90 miles on the batteries, the other 40+(she doesn't say how big of a plus)is run on the gas engine which, from what I've read, gets only 20 MPG due to the weight of the volt, therefore it is costing them 4 bucks for electricity(according to her)and another 9.3 bucks for 2 gallons of gas making a total of 13.3 bucks a day. Hardly 130 MPG as she claims. I also have my doubts as to the 2 bucks for recharging.

Further more, if they didn't have the charging station at work, he would have to drive all the way home on the small, underpowered gas engine, which would be the case in most situations. Not only that, summer is coming on and when he uses the air conditioner(assuming it has one)he will drastically reduce the distance the battery will take him.

Try driving across country on one of these machines, you would be on the gas engine most of the way, which would mean no savings at all.

The government is in full court press with volt ads, hulu is saturated with volt ads, makes a guy want to puke.

My daily commuter is a Porsche 911 Turbo that gets about 14-16mpg in city driving. Work is about 37miles one way. Gas here in California for premium is at about $4.80/gal and the car goes through one fill up per week with a 16.6 tank.

I estimate that my weekly gas costs are at $8-10 / per week for the two beers I buy for my buddy who owns the car.

We had an 18 wheeler lose its load of steel during rush hour in Houston a short time back. The freeway was shut down for most of the morning. Can only imagine what an acid spill would do. But I’m sure BO and the Energy and Transportation wizards have all these plans in place so not to worry. Right? Kind of like those stupid light bulbs. When Ike hit down here we didn’t have any power in some areas for weeks as well as no or limited gas availability. Can hardly wait to see what those clowns that buy these do then. And those Smart Cars are just as bad. If anyone who wants one of those ever saw one that had tangled with an 18 wheeler they might think twice. People’s brains are sometimes just totally AWOL.

48
posted on 04/15/2012 11:23:22 PM PDT
by Grams A
(The Sun will rise in the East in the morning and God is still on his throne.)

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