This needs thinking thru, but it just occurred to me that BM ought to be a membership organization. Only members may buy tickets. Existing members screen and sponsor new members. If all 57.000 ticket sell, then no more members are admitted until less than 57.000 tickets sell. This would NOT keep "new blood" out, for the natural turnover is considerable. It would strengthen our esprit de corps, and keep out voyeurs. Off the top of my head, I cannot think of a single downside.

Elliot wrote:This needs thinking thru, but it just occurred to me that BM ought to be a membership organization. Only members may buy tickets. Existing members screen and sponsor new members. If all 57.000 ticket sell, then no more members are admitted until less than 57.000 tickets sell. This would NOT keep "new blood" out, for the natural turnover is considerable. It would strengthen our esprit de corps, and keep out voyeurs. Off the top of my head, I cannot think of a single downside.

Not everyone who desires to attend Burning Man will know experienced burners.

I like the diverse nature of people that attend Burning Man. There will always be sparkle ponies, clueless and the radically-leaching "true burners". I see the sponsorship concept narrowing the type of people that are able to attend. Which seems like a bad thing. (What is to stop, experienced voyeurs, from sponsoring more of the same?? After all, they have attended at least once...)

There is no fair way to distribute 50000 tickets to 55000 people. Some folks are going to be left out.

What I see this year is a high percentage of burners trying to buy more tickets than they need. Oh sure, they lament on being a "true burner" and ramble on about "the ten principles of Burning Man"... But really, they want to ensure that THEY get a ticket (fuck the other burners...).

I've been looking at the Glastonbury festival ticket model. Every individual registers and gets a registration number. When you purchase tickets you give your registration number. This allows for people who do not purchase tickets but are registered... a problem with your plan that assumes all members will go. You may purchase tickets for multiple individuals, but they all must be registered. Each ticket purchased must send a photo of the registrant to be laminated to the ticket. You have the option of maintaining your registration # for multiple years if your information does not change. The number of people purchasing tickets may exceed the number of tickets available, but each ticket sold goes to a specific person, so there is no hoarding. The company they use is See tickets. I am only throwing this out as a model, I haven't fully read their refund policy if there is one.

Midnight on a carousel rideReaching for the gold ring down inside2015 eplaya meet and greet/ Barbie Death Village/ 7 and E/ Wed. 6PM

The Bureau of Land Management determines how many people are going to be allowed onto the Playa. There are some intrinsic limits on the road leading to BRC, which we seem to have reached (ie: only so many vehicles can travel down a single lane highway).

I believe the permit was re-negotiated every 5 years. This permit usually allowed for some population growth over that time period. The permit for the 2011 burn was a temporary 1 year permit which did not allow any population growth. (which is why BM sold out for the first time ever)

I have not seen the lease for the 2012 burn, so I do not know exactly what the population limits will be. (Although, one can deduce a basic number from the posted ticket tier limits and extrapolate from there) - The BLM website has all the previous leases, exclusion zones, and federal mumbo-jumbo available if one is motivated.

I hope this helps a bit

Love Rice

Roach: "I feel like in this day and age, every girl should know how to build a flamethrower."

Elorrum wrote:I've been looking at the Glastonbury festival ticket model. Every individual registers and gets a registration number. When you purchase tickets you give your registration number. This allows for people who do not purchase tickets but are registered... a problem with your plan that assumes all members will go. You may purchase tickets for multiple individuals, but they all must be registered. Each ticket purchased must send a photo of the registrant to be laminated to the ticket. You have the option of maintaining your registration # for multiple years if your information does not change. The number of people purchasing tickets may exceed the number of tickets available, but each ticket sold goes to a specific person, so there is no hoarding. The company they use is See tickets. I am only throwing this out as a model, I haven't fully read their refund policy if there is one.

I do not believe that a experienced burner has any more right to attend than a virgin... There is no fair way to distribute 50000 tickets to 55000 people. The maximum population of BRC is dictated by the Bureau of Land Management.

There have been many discussions regarding putting a participant's name onto each ticket. So basically, everyone will need to have photo ID with them when they get to the gate. This is not exactly bad, but I see it causing delays at the gate (oh, Dude, my ID is in a bin at the front of my cube van, so I will have to unload everything to get it. What do you mean I cannot get in without ID?? I left it in San Fran/Vegas/Chicago, etc...)

stretch80 wrote:The Bureau of Land Management determines how many people are going to be allowed onto the Playa. There are some intrinsic limits on the road leading to BRC, which we seem to have reached (ie: only so many vehicles can travel down a single lane highway)....

....I hope this helps a bit

Nyet. That's not what I was asking. I'm saying, who would be the arbiter of the initial 57,000 members in the concept Elliot proposed? Who chooses and how would that initial membership be vetted?

I'm with Trilo.

M*A*S*H 4207th: An army of fun.I don't care what the borg says: feather-wearers will NOT be served in Rosie's Bar.Yes, I am the arbiter of doing it right or wrong. Guess which one you are!

stretch80 wrote:The Bureau of Land Management determines how many people are going to be allowed onto the Playa. There are some intrinsic limits on the road leading to BRC, which we seem to have reached (ie: only so many vehicles can travel down a single lane highway)....

....I hope this helps a bit

Nyet. That's not what I was asking. I'm saying, who would be the arbiter of the initial 57,000 members in the concept Elliot proposed? Who chooses and how would that initial membership be vetted?

I'm with Trilo.

Yes, who indeed?? This sparks a "burnier than thou" argument. I dislike the exclusion that any proposed membership scheme would create...

Unless the population growth allowed meets demand, by nature, some burners and virgins will have to stay home.

Love Rice

Roach: "I feel like in this day and age, every girl should know how to build a flamethrower."

Elorrum wrote:I've been looking at the Glastonbury festival ticket model. Every individual registers and gets a registration number. When you purchase tickets you give your registration number. This allows for people who do not purchase tickets but are registered... a problem with your plan that assumes all members will go. You may purchase tickets for multiple individuals, but they all must be registered. Each ticket purchased must send a photo of the registrant to be laminated to the ticket. You have the option of maintaining your registration # for multiple years if your information does not change. The number of people purchasing tickets may exceed the number of tickets available, but each ticket sold goes to a specific person, so there is no hoarding. The company they use is See tickets. I am only throwing this out as a model, I haven't fully read their refund policy if there is one.

I do not believe that a experienced burner has any more right to attend than a virgin... There is no fair way to distribute 50000 tickets to 55000 people. The maximum population of BRC is dictated by the Bureau of Land Management.

There have been many discussions regarding putting a participant's name onto each ticket. So basically, everyone will need to have photo ID with them when they get to the gate. This is not exactly bad, but I see it causing delays at the gate (oh, Dude, my ID is in a bin at the front of my cube van, so I will have to unload everything to get it. What do you mean I cannot get in without ID?? I left it in San Fran/Vegas/Chicago, etc...)

no quick ID.... go to D lot and think about being better prepared. with a photo on the ticket, the ticket is your photo i.d. I think Glastonbury has a refund policy with a fee, and then that frees up a ticket for another registrant.

Midnight on a carousel rideReaching for the gold ring down inside2015 eplaya meet and greet/ Barbie Death Village/ 7 and E/ Wed. 6PM

Elorrum wrote:no quick ID.... go to D lot and think about being better prepared. with a photo on the ticket, the ticket is your photo i.d. I think Glastonbury has a refund policy with a fee, and then that frees up a ticket for another registrant.

D-lot is a given... I suspect the size of D-lot will need to increase

Hmm, logistically not impossible... Photos on the tickets would help. So, there would be a cut-off time for ticket sales? Transfers of tickets and gifting a ticket would become complex. I imagine some burners would freak out over their implied loss of privacy (what?? They want my photo & name?? {insert freakout here} )

This would limit all ticket sales to the Official Burning Man ticket page. Therefore no quick selling of your ticket to a friend, it would need to be handled by BM and then either held in will-call or mailed. Not necessarily a problem.

Love Rice

Roach: "I feel like in this day and age, every girl should know how to build a flamethrower."