One can only hope that we will see this in the new systems. And I mean a whole truckload of hope.

This.

Because when the PS3 got announced, everyone was hoping for a better graphics card with more memory, and more RAM overall. But then we got something equivalent to a NVidia Geforce 7800GT with 256MB VRAM.

This is not going to be in the Xbox 720 since it taped out early this year and they are trying to fabricate enough for launch production early next year with rumored low yield problems. This indicates the Xbox 720 will have a HD 7XXX GPU.

Still think ATI is a long shot for the PS4 and Sony will wait for Maxwell early next year with a Japan launch in spring of 2014. It is not just about whether a new GPU is ready or not, it is about how fast it can get into production and yield. Quantity and quality are fundamental axioms of production engineering, despite gushing schoolboy emotions.

Pacing in wait of Sony's imminent DOOM!...since 2006

PS4 - The Only Hardcore Gaming Console = All Your Baserape Are Belong To Us

This is not going to be in the Xbox 720 since it taped out early this year and they are trying to fabricate enough for launch production early next year with rumored low yield problems. This indicates the Xbox 720 will have a HD 7XXX GPU.

Still think ATI is a long shot for the PS4 and Sony will wait for Maxwell early next year with a Japan launch in spring of 2014. It is not just about whether a new GPU is ready or not, it is about how fast it can get into production and yield. Quantity and quality are fundamental axioms of production engineering, despite gushing schoolboy emotions.

You do realize they can incorporate advancements made in the 8XXX series gpu design into the gpu's for the next xbox/PS4, right?

You do realize they can incorporate advancements made in the 8XXX series gpu design into the gpu's for the next xbox/PS4, right?

It depends. If it is SoC, as rumored, and they are in production already, then no. If there is a separate GPU, it is still unlikely unless they tried to incorporate 8XXX features into a 7XXX console GPU. This is the reality of console design, the baseline configuration is locked in stone at launch and it takes a lot of acrobatic tricks to get to that point, finally limited by the time to fab. The 8XXX here is totally a rumor with a leaked spec and won't be finished until next spring meaning that is when it goes to fab, not when it is coming out at any production rate. Everything is pointing to a MS reveal of the 720 at E313, with launch in fall. No way to switch hardware that late in the game, the timeline doesn't support it.

Pacing in wait of Sony's imminent DOOM!...since 2006

PS4 - The Only Hardcore Gaming Console = All Your Baserape Are Belong To Us

It depends. If it is SoC, as rumored, and they are in production already, then no. If there is a separate GPU, it is still unlikely unless they tried to incorporate 8XXX features into a 7XXX console GPU. This is the reality of console design, the baseline configuration is locked in stone at launch and it takes a lot of acrobatic tricks to get to that point, finally limited by the time to fab. The 8XXX here is totally a rumor with a leaked spec and won't be finished until next spring meaning that is when it goes to fab, not when it is coming out at any production rate. Everything is pointing to a MS reveal of the 720 at E313, with launch in fall. No way to switch hardware that late in the game, the timeline doesn't support it.

Yeah, but who says the design is final yet. They could be doing test runs to see if one option is more viable than another. And even if the design is finalized, do you really think they would have so much trouble with the yields on a 7XXX derivative.

Going by what happened with Southern Islands, the 8XXX should be finished by Feb./March. If the Next xbox launches in November, that would mean that they still have 8 months till launch. I wouldn't expect to be producing final till 3, perhaps 4 months out from launch. Final design should be picked by early next year.

Even at worst, MS has until november to send out their final designs for mass manufacture given they launch @ 2013 holiday

That is right and nothing new has leaked to indicate it isn't Oban which is a SoC. While this guy is an idiot, his basic statements about fab are generally correct:

"If production wafers are really going in this year, the last time a foundry can run a test wafer is about November 1. Anything after that day will not come out of the fab in time for the results to be fed back in to the production chips."

This is what has to happen to make a holiday 2013 launch. Considering this is a tapeout from around February, there is no way it has HD 89XX in it.

Everything is pointing to MS introducing the 720 for E313, meaning they need pre-production prototypes by then, if they plan a holiday 2013 launch. Sony probably won't do anything unless these events turn into more than a rumor, then they might rush a PS4 alpha devkit out on the stage.

Pacing in wait of Sony's imminent DOOM!...since 2006

PS4 - The Only Hardcore Gaming Console = All Your Baserape Are Belong To Us

So pretty much we're (a few of us anyways) are debunking this rumor based on the premise that NextBox projected launch doesn't fit in with the time needed to produce these GPUs and that Sony would more than likely slap us all silly with PS4 before then to get out ahead of the competition. (if i got the subtext wrong smack me)

I still wanna see PS4 with an 8xxx chip at this point to be honest. If this is just cooked up rumor pie I'm afraid I've sopped it all up at this point

So pretty much we're (a few of us anyways) are debunking this rumor based on the premise that NextBox projected launch doesn't fit in with the time needed to produce these GPUs and that Sony would more than likely slap us all silly with PS4 before then to get out ahead of the competition. (if i got the subtext wrong smack me)

I still wanna see PS4 with an 8xxx chip at this point to be honest. If this is just cooked up rumor pie I'm afraid I've sopped it all up at this point

It is possible simply because AMD could use these consoles to gain a major advantage over the competition. However it can go either way. The article could be false or true. Presumably no one here works at/has inside information with AMD, Sony, and Microsoft. So the rumor cannot be denied either.

...I still wanna see PS4 with an 8xxx chip at this point to be honest. If this is just cooked up rumor pie I'm afraid I've sopped it all up at this point

Honestly though, a 7xxx chip ( something around the 7870, or 7950 would be fantastic) would still be a massive boost and with enough ram, be able to handle an obscene amount of graphic work. Honestly I'm more concerned with the RAM than specifically which GPU gets put into the console. New rendering techniques can help draw as much power out of a gpu, but file sizes and frame buffers tend to stay the same.

All we can do is wait until E3 2013. I'm pretty sure that Microsoft will present their new console, but couldn't there be a chance that Sony waits another year? I know it sounds a little far fetched, but think about it. I think they would do it if they have a specific plan that justifies or weighs out the additional time.

All we can do is wait until E3 2013. I'm pretty sure that Microsoft will present their new console, but couldn't there be a chance that Sony waits another year? I know it sounds a little far fetched, but think about it. I think they would do it if they have a specific plan that justifies or weighs out the additional time.

I am betting both systems get announced next year, but it wouldn't surprise me if Sony decided to a final unveiling at TGS 2013 instead of E3, but who knows! I just think if they wait until 2014 to release the system it is going to hurt them a lot more than it will help them.

That is right and nothing new has leaked to indicate it isn't Oban which is a SoC. While this guy is an idiot, his basic statements about fab are generally correct:

"If production wafers are really going in this year, the last time a foundry can run a test wafer is about November 1. Anything after that day will not come out of the fab in time for the results to be fed back in to the production chips."

This is what has to happen to make a holiday 2013 launch. Considering this is a tapeout from around February, there is no way it has HD 89XX in it.

Everything is pointing to MS introducing the 720 for E313, meaning they need pre-production prototypes by then, if they plan a holiday 2013 launch. Sony probably won't do anything unless these events turn into more than a rumor, then they might rush a PS4 alpha devkit out on the stage.

Using your own point, if the 8000 series launches in Feburary-March that requires the GPUs to be already in production, to make that launch. If that tech is ready, it is totally feasible to see them in a console releasing a year from now.
The TDP and wattage are very favourable to the console environment and you can bet that both MS and Sony knew about the 8000 series (maybe even 9000) before deciding on the final design

I would think Sony and Microsoft would have exclusive access to these newer chip designs before other people would just because of the magnitude of the consoles business, but like I have seen in the past it the dev kits that the developers currently have are probably running on the 7xxx series. I am willing to best both sides currently have or will have prototype chips in hand already for the new consoles if they are really planning on using the 8xxx series (which I hope they both do!).

Using your own point, if the 8000 series launches in Feburary-March that requires the GPUs to be already in production, to make that launch.

Except ATI is infamous for PAPER launches, not hardware launches. Of course there is going to be hardware in multiple stages of development at all times but there always comes a time for finalized hardware and that is where it goes into production fab. This is all speculation until then but the info so far indicates ATI finalization in the spring of 2013, making it pretty marginal for it to be in console hardware by late fall/winter 2013. Of course, MS is going to be on the inside track. However, if MS has already finalized on a SoC (System-on-Chip) with the CPU and GPU on one die, then it does not have the luxury of swapping GPU chips mid-stream. As usual, we have to wait and see what comes up leading to E3-2013.

Pacing in wait of Sony's imminent DOOM!...since 2006

PS4 - The Only Hardcore Gaming Console = All Your Baserape Are Belong To Us

you know what would be cool if both consoles used the same gpu in the PS4 and 720.
then all thrid party games will be even. and when it comes to frist party games this is where sony is the best,
there frist party games look better then other consoles frist party games i hope they have a killzone 4 ready for the PS4 launch

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