This is a discussion on Should I raise this for value? within the online poker forums, in the Tournament Poker section; MTT early stage of tournament . No reads on opponents. I am on button (around 1400chips) with AQd. Two players limps from middle pos. I

MTT early stage of tournament . No reads on opponents. I am on button (around 1400chips) with AQd. Two players limps from middle pos. I raise 120 (4bb), BB calls (2500chips), limpers fold.

FLOP:10s, Ah, 9h

BB bets 120, I just call (should probably raise).

TURN:2s

BB bets 120, I raise 400, BB calls

RIVER:2c
BB bets 420, I have around 750 chips behind. I call. Should I raise for value or just call?

When I raise I can get good 300 chips more at beginning of tourney what is not bad. But If I raise and he has something like A9, I am out. When I just call and he is better I am still in tourney... Its hard but you can get back from 350 chips at beginning

BTW conclusion about hand. He had A8

#2

18th September 2013, 8:05 PM

nomadnative [35]

Poker at: Bovada

Game: Both

I would have shoved the river for value. The pot is so big relative to remaining stack. And he probably shoves if he has a bigger two pair but calls with any ace. With 350 you have 11 bbs which is a shove or fold situation anyways.

#3

18th September 2013, 11:11 PM

ezevan1022 [91]

Game: holdem

This is a pretty thin spot and would be villain dependent, the looser and aggressive the more inclined I would be to raise the river the tighter and more passive I would lean towards just calling. I imagine a majority of people end up just calling in these type of spots.

#4

18th September 2013, 11:21 PM

Mr Sandbag [2,631]

Game: Holdem

Raise the flop, especially in a tournament. Players like to defend their blinds early in a tournament with almost any two cards. You don't know if he's bluffing, betting top pair, or betting a straight and/or flush draw. By just calling, you risk giving him the cards he needs. Your raise on the turn isn't really a strong enough move to get a lot of players to fold any draws they may be holding. If he calls your flop raise, shove the turn.

#5

20th September 2013, 8:03 AM

DevilMe03 [67]

Online Poker at: pokerstars

Game: holdem

re: Poker & Should I raise this for value?

If you lose you will be left with 330 chips in which case you will be in a shoving mode automatically. Think in these terms, by raising you are gaining 330 extra which will be very useful for later game and by calling and losing , those 330 chips have little significance.

#6

20th September 2013, 10:45 AM

iec [114]

Poker at: paddy

Game: mixed games

It depends on some factors, as played you extracted quite a good value despite not raising the flop donk bet.
And reshoving river or not depends if you value your life in case you lose more than the increase in chips and it can also vary based on tournament format, if it's 15 minute blinds you can keep the chips and find value rather elsewhere, if it's some turbo donkfest with many players at microlimits, more aggressive line should be taken. But well, regarding just the hand value we are very often ahead.

#7

20th September 2013, 10:46 AM

olliejjc16 [521]

Online Poker at: PokerStars

Game: Holdem

if you call him on the river you should be getting the rest of your chips in, either fold or shove because you'll be committing so much of your chips when you call that its best just to put the rest in to give you that extra boost if you are ahead

#8

20th September 2013, 7:16 PM

zegaum [81]

Poker at: Poker Stars

Game: Holdem

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevilMe03

If you lose you will be left with 330 chips in which case you will be in a shoving mode automatically. Think in these terms, by raising you are gaining 330 extra which will be very useful for later game and by calling and losing , those 330 chips have little significance.

It is true. If you entered the game to the point of staying with 330 chips, should push all. If these chips in your hand get some help ...

#9

20th September 2013, 9:19 PM

topper39 [499]

I think it's quite easy shove on the river. Omitting that if you just call and lose your stack will be almost useless, there's not a lot of hands crushing you from his range and mayn worse hand calling you(I can imagine even some wierdly played T or something calling your shove in this spot with those odds). 2c is perfect card OTR. Sometimes you may just attain to fold his bluff (I consider this board as quite drawy) but I would still go for value with shove here.

#10

20th September 2013, 9:23 PM

stefffan1 [131]

Poker at: pokerstars

Game: omaha

re: Poker & Should I raise this for value?

I would have probably raised on flop and shove all in on river. You have to play those hands aggressive.

#11

20th September 2013, 9:28 PM

Dalsue214 [160]

Online Poker at: Carbon/Aced

Game: Holdem

Quote:

Originally Posted by WeenieSVK

MTT early stage of tournament . No reads on opponents. I am on button (around 1400chips) with AQd. Two players limps from middle pos. I raise 120 (4bb), BB calls (2500chips), limpers fold.

FLOP:10s, Ah, 9h

BB bets 120, I just call (should probably raise).

TURN:2s

BB bets 120, I raise 400, BB calls

RIVER:2c
BB bets 420, I have around 750 chips behind. I call. Should I raise for value or just call?

When I raise I can get good 300 chips more at beginning of tourney what is not bad. But If I raise and he has something like A9, I am out. When I just call and he is better I am still in tourney... Its hard but you can get back from 350 chips at beginning

BTW conclusion about hand. He had A8

After reading this... I think he is stupid for calling with A8. The massive raise by you on the flop is something I would not have done.. Truthfully, I don't think you played this hand correctly even though it did work out for you.

#12

20th September 2013, 9:29 PM

psychotie [324]

Poker at: FTP

Game: hold`em

I def shove all in on River , there no point in keeping a small stack for later.

#13

20th September 2013, 10:45 PM

matiusaa [576]

Online Poker at: Pokerstars

Game: Holdem

I would have shoved. You have little stack remaining, in comparison to the pot, and he would have gone all in if he had something good. In the long run it is better to shove than to call

#14

20th September 2013, 11:54 PM

skrsh76 [993]

Poker at: pokerstars

Game: holdem

shove the river

#15

21st September 2013, 12:29 AM

1ofTheFellas [92]

Online Poker at: Poker Stars

Game: Holdem

re: Poker & Should I raise this for value?

I'm probably shoving here but I guess it COULD be player dependant.... If he seems fishy I'm shoving this river for value for sure.. Given the line he took, I'd be likely to shove too as it really looks like he's making block bets to keep you from betting much bigger.

#16

21st September 2013, 1:03 AM

Abedin120 [317]

Poker at: PokerStars

Game: holdem

I think that you should go all-in on the river after his raise of 420 chips because my opinion is that if he had AT or A9 like you were thinking then he probably will go re-raise/all-in on the turn when you made him re-raise to 400 chips. However it was early stage of the tournament, so you played well.

#17

21st September 2013, 7:30 AM

ak725 [48]

best play was raising the flop. by his betting it was obvious that he has the A, the only problem remaining - the kicker.
maybe raising big on Turn. Y would do that

#18

21st September 2013, 7:38 AM

jcdagenius [297]

Poker at: bovada.lv

Game: holdem

id just make call or min raise but not often....only thing that would reraise or call would have us beat as far as boats and runner runner 2's which is unlikely......cant call a raise of our raise though...

#19

22nd September 2013, 6:27 PM

kmichaels [156]

You should go all in because there is too many chips already in pot. But you have to be more careful because with a board like that easily any opponent could have two pair with the ace, because many players play any hand with the ace.

#20

22nd September 2013, 6:40 PM

RajDev1979 [893]

Poker at: 888Poker

Game: Holdem

re: Poker & Should I raise this for value?

In general if you think you have the best hand then raise for value to get paid by a worse hand. He must be knew that you holding A and something. He could have been allin if he had 2 pairs over flop. So you should go allin

holding few chips also was not a bad idea

#21

25th September 2013, 8:24 PM

WhiteFang13 [5]

Yes. He is a donk and you know he will pay you off with garbage.

#22

25th September 2013, 11:41 PM

Vfranks [1,672]

Poker at: ACR/WPN

Game: NLHE

Yeah I think you have to shove the rest of our stack if your thinking about calling in this spot. You would only leave yourelf like 300 chips or so, so your comitted.. why not just get it all in then.

#23

25th September 2013, 11:51 PM

grandpajesse [101]

Online Poker at: carbon poker

Game: PLO8 reg

You played the hand fine imo. I think otr, we are going for thin value iif we shove. We are specifically trying to get value from a weaker Ace. Since the BB cold called after you raised the two limpers, I would be inclined to believe that he had an AQ/AJ/A10 or A9 suited. Without reads, he could have an Ak, but the way he played it makes no sense for him to have either AK or AQ. Having said all that, people just play poorly, and with as few chips as you would have behind, I would be inclined just to get the rest in. If stacks were effectively much deeper, I would just call. Lol cold calling 10% of your stack oop early in an mtt. People just never learn. NH Sir.

#24

26th September 2013, 3:36 PM

PrecisionBets14 [11]

Poker at: Carbon Poker

Game: Holdem

I think you played the preflop round correctly by raising...but when the A high board hits and you are pretty sure you have the best hand, I would reraise the BBs bet on the flop and turn to make him make the ultimate decision about his A8 hand and not him putting you to a decision with your AQ. Take control especially when you are in position (on the button) like you were.

#25

27th September 2013, 5:42 PM

anderson1313 [29]

Online Poker at: poker stars

Game: horse

re: Poker & Should I raise this for value?

With the amount of chips in the pot you are already committed and I would go all in.

#26

28th September 2013, 4:16 PM

Bomysp [26]

Poker at: FTP

Game: Holdem

I think i would shove on river, second time bets for 120 and on your re-raise he just limps, then he didńt go all-in, so i think most players at these levels dont play something like 2 pairs this way... again I would go all-in on river insted of your play, because pot and implied odds.