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or because they simply don't have the resources. We have to have reasonable expectations, It's Game-Labs, not Bethesda.

There is more they can do though, just taking 'treasure fleet' idea as an example. There is nothing difficult in implementing this and it draws players together for PvP. Simple.

But more importantly: a more complex system for RvR with PvP and PvE creating hostility (as it does) but also trade and then Port Specific kill missions for all ship rates popping up to add hostility and so on. Something that all players can feel involved in so that their actions have an impact on the game world (however small) so that the whole nations player base can be mobilised to a common cause? Content that attracts players to an area (with greater risk and thus more reward) and so creates PvP content, but player driven and relevant to the wider game world, not just arbitrarily positioned zones. Sailing from A-B yes, but try to make B the same place for more players?

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or because they simply don't have the resources. We have to have reasonable expectations, It's Game-Labs, not Bethesda.

Basically this.

I stopped testing, criticising and proposing when I realized this game can go on with so little funding just being an inmense (but empty) PVP arena kept up by the money of the dedicated vets (buying DLCs) and by the occasional discounts (rookies that pay for the game, stay some weeks and then go away).

Myabe Game Labs will find some investor in the future. I hope so, since the potential for a great game is still there. But until then, asking for deep changes in the game format is wasted time.

What I do regret is that some months before the game was quite funny (at least in my opinion) now it is too time demanding, boring and grindy.

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What is content and why are people complaining about the lack thereof? Check out the suggestions forum. It's full of very good ideas! I am wondering if ever only one suggestion made it into the game. @Wraith and @Teutonic are 100% right. You can't design a game relying on the players to provide all content.

Plenty of them Start reading from 2014 and take note of everything suggested that is in game or that was tested at any point during development. Might be a better mental exercise than simply writing something pulled out of a morning without coffee.

A hard thing is, to see one's idea that looked good on paper but that didn't work in action. And in that regard it seems many didn't notice or refuse to accept their suggestions didn't work.

But yeah, go check almost everything suggested and all the patch notes since the start before you post something like that. No disrespect meant sir, just pure truth against a void comment.

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I don't mean to attack @jodgi, I am genuinely curious what parts of NA they enjoy and what they would consider good content to add. Everyone wants something different, a game that already exists in such a small niche (age of sail mmo) cannot afford to only pander to one type of player. To implement the kinds of content I would like by sacrificing what people like Jodgi like would achieve nothing.

First off I want to commend you on your attitude, if more people conducted themselves like you there would be less fighting in these forums.

I think I have to disappoint you, I don't think it's possible to cater to both type players. I think what PVEers want is in direct conflict with what pure PvPers want, and vice versa. Even the most fantastic pve activity is infinitely less attractive to me than anything PvP. So yeah, I'm being impossibly difficult.

Why so defeatist? I've read up on Eve you know the most perfect sandbox game ever. PvP, statistically speaking, is a complete sideshow. You can go look at the numbers, it's public information, most game sessions or player sessions does not even contain any PvP at all. "Most" is an imprecise word, think 1 out of 100 to one out of 1000.

I do not think I'll be pushed out as there is the tremendous attraction of the upcoming duel zones. I won't be able to subject myself to Eco activities to replace a Bellona or two a week, there might be room in those zones for captains in cheaper ships. I'll admit I'm a bit anxious, though.

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"I constructed unrealistic expectations that weren't based on devs stated intentions, but rather my own ideas of what it could be. I now regret this."

You may be done testing and proposing, but you seem to reserve the right to criticise. Probably out of the goodness of your heart.

You see what you want to see. You hear what you want to hear.

Now, please read what I write: I liked a game that was actually there some months ago and it was called naval action (I have been playing almost 7000 hours in total). Such game has been changed in a way that induced me to quit. The missing 2000 players probably think like me, the remaining 500 think like you.

This is what I am saying. If you do not (want to) understand ... who cares?

PS: PVP is a sideshow in EVE online? Are you playing it? No, because otherwise you would not tell it. Even the most carebearish carebear of empire space shall live with the ghost of non consensual PVP in EVE. But point is that in that game there is MORE than that to do.

PS 2: but hey, no reason to get angry. Basically you are one of the smartest vet players still posting on forum. Even if - TBH - lately I noted a tiny bit of bitterness in your posts.

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Why so defeatist? I've read up on Eve you know the most perfect sandbox game ever. PvP, statistically speaking, is a complete sideshow. You can go look at the numbers, it's public information, most game sessions or player sessions does not even contain any PvP at all. "Most" is an imprecise word, think 1 out of 100 to one out of 1000.

I think you are overlooking the fact that EVE has thousands and thousands of players, with a "healthy" mix of PvE at the bottom of the food chain which feeds a very hardcore, rabid PvP-focused base at the top. This is mirrored in other, very successful MMOs with OW concepts and role playing bones. PvP alone should never and won't support a player population large enough to fill the Naval Action game world for the simple reason that PvP in NA is too costly and too high stakes in terms of player time and investment.

Now, you may say, why not just go out and buy a storebought, throw some mediums on it and have some fun? Well.. for the simple reason that most players can't be competitive doing that and it's not sustainable economically (the cost and availability of repairs alone precludes doing that). And this hugely interacts with the fact that dev's have never figured out a way to make losing rewarding in this game. There's no incentive at all to go out and lose. And there's nothing that whittles away at player populations more than feeling like you're wasting your time and not being rewarded for your investment. And so you have a bunch of PvP'ers looking for non- or consensual PvP, and then you have a bunch of people who are avoiding it all cost while they try to get towards the middle where they think they can afford it (time- or real-wise), and it becomes like shooting fish in a barrel.

And the new model where battles last less time while putting all those PvP'ers in first rates just so they can sail without fear of numbers won't fix that. Only content that encourages those younglings to keep at it until they want more consensual PvP, RvR, etc. etc. will create a sustainable population.

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Now, please read what I write: I liked a game that was actually there some months ago and it was called naval action (I have been playing almost 7000 hours in total). Such game has been changed in a way that induced me to quit. The missing 2000 players probably think like me, the remaining 500 think like you.

This is what I am saying. If you do not (want to) understand ... who cares?

PS: PVP is a sideshow in EVE online? Are you playing it? No, because otherwise you would not tell it. Even the most carebearish carebear of empire space shall live with the ghost of non consensual PVP in EVE. But point is that in that game there is MORE than that to do.

PS 2: but hey, no reason to get angry. Basically you are one of the smartest vet players still posting on forum. Even if - TBH - lately I noted a tiny bit of bitterness in your posts.

not to mention, if you want PvP in Eve Online. you legit can find it in 5 minutes.

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I talk to casuals all the time. I get casuals started all the time. I supply them with the ships I dont need all the time. I also dont just give them random oak ships. I get them fully pimped ships to help them out. I remember when this game first was released. I remember the hours and hours we grinded. I remember exactly how people reacted on ts going from surprise to trinco to connie to 3rd rate to paval and holy hello kitty the santi. Not one of the people said OMG look how cool this trade route is. This game at its very core is combat. Its limited marketing focuses on combat and not trading. Shit, I was sold a lobby based game with no trading at all.

I'll be honest, the trading and building don't intrest me in the slightest. I watched dozens of YouTube vids seen the combat and fell in love with the game. Odd how you don't see very much on the non combat aspects of the game.

All I ever wanted out of the game was a good fight against other players. Not ganking, not attacking underarmed ai traders, just good fights win or lose.

It was hard for me to join clans, given no voice chat and I'm HoH.

I always viewed my role as

you need me to hit traders( as boring as that is) to provide resources for other players, I'll do it

Need me to interdict an invasion fleet, I'll do it

Lose a port battle and need me to fight a delaying action( my favorite thing to do lol) so surviving ships can escape I'll do it. Actually done this a few dozen times. Ton of fun.

Need me to harras enemy nations/clan, tie up there players chasing me across the entire map I'll do it.

Hit a port solo to distract the enemy, give me a ring I'm your guy.

I don't care if I lose my ships in the process, all the mentioned activities to me are fun. Sailing back and forth to trade, struggling to stay awake or driving myself nuts to try and get all the crafting materials for a ship over a period of days or weeks is boring.

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First off I want to commend you on your attitude, if more people conducted themselves like you there would be less fighting in these forums.

I think I have to disappoint you, I don't think it's possible to cater to both type players. I think what PVEers want is in direct conflict with what pure PvPers want, and vice versa. Even the most fantastic pve activity is infinitely less attractive to me than anything PvP. So yeah, I'm being impossibly difficult.

Why so defeatist? I've read up on Eve you know the most perfect sandbox game ever. PvP, statistically speaking, is a complete sideshow. You can go look at the numbers, it's public information, most game sessions or player sessions does not even contain any PvP at all. "Most" is an imprecise word, think 1 out of 100 to one out of 1000. ﻿﻿

I do not think I'll be pushed out as there is the tremendous attraction of the upcoming duel zones. I won't be able to subject myself to Eco activities to replace a Bellona or two a week, there might be room in those zones for captains in cheaper ships. I'll admit I'm a bit anxious, though.

I haven't played Eve much, but from what I've seen and heard I would argue that it is a great example of how you can have a strong PVE section population supporting both a much smaller hardcore PVP population and a very dedicated RVR population. Also how you can have varying degrees of PVP and PVE so when a player goes from PVE to PVP it isn't so frustrating for them. (Like getting attacked while fighting AI, full PVE to full PVP unexpectedly and without consent) If the player had to go directly into enemy territory to find AI, and if their sinking that AI somehow affected the clan/nation whose territory they were in, it would feel more fair to be retaliated against by the enemy while raiding, instead of getting interrupted while farming. The player would have to consciously put themselves at risk in order to kill the AI, so that if they were attacked it wouldn't feel as unfair. I feel the complete dichotomy between what is "pvp content" and "pve content" serves to prevent people from "crossing over" from one to the other. The existing PVE content does nothing to push people towards fighting, it encourages people to avoid PVP while farming, and only do PVP when solely focused on it.

Also I don't propose purely PVE based content being added, rather more content that offers some PVE aspects while pitting different players against each other and giving them meaningful reasons to fight (something sorely lacking from the OW right now). Here's an example: For me, what I want to do most in this game is play as a pirate. Not the pirate nation, a pirate's pirate. No big ships, small hideouts, raiding ports instead of besieging them, attacking smaller merchants or ganging up on larger ones, squabbling with other pirates, unable to sail too far from the hideout, etc etc. I don't like sailing ships larger than a heavy brig or corvette anyway. I can think of so many mechanics that would not only make piracy interesting but also pit the pirate class against the clans that own ports they operate around, generating conflict between the two and encouraging clans to try to drive away pirates and assault their hideouts. This is a specific example of what I consider new "content," and while its not 100% PVP focused like RVR or solo dueling, it still would involve and encourage a lot of PVP. If you would like to know more about my proposal for a pirate class in game, I can PM you about it (don't want to derail this into a discussion of pirates.)

I'll give one little example though: A port raid. Pirates just show up and if they have 6+ they can attack the port. They then sail into the port and have to shoot up a few AI ships, maybe destroy a tower or two depending on the port, and then get to special points where they can drop off pirates to go "raid the port" they can also sink stationary anchored AI ships in the harbor. They can continue doing this until the raid is completed or they get chased away by the port's owners who can show up as quickly as they realize they are being raided and sail to the port or join from in it. This would be somewhat PVE but still push players towards PVP, not only in the battle itself but also because clans would want to extirpate pirates from their territory to make it impossible for them to stage a raid. (successful raids would destroy buildings, steal materials or maybe even warehouse goods, and reduce the prosperity of the port). Anyway suppose I should write it all up in a suggestion.

I think overall my big complaint is the lack of diversity in ways to play the game, and the way it does so little to push people towards fighting each other voluntarily or semi-voluntarily. The roles that are not available currently also happen to be the ones which appeal to me most.

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This game has a combat system but lacks any real content in the open world, it needs an actual economy system where crafting/ modules etc are everywhere and easy to get, POTBS had this done well, its wasnt a hard grind to get a ship and set it up and go have some fun, the ships and modules in game are way to overpriced and some just hard to come by so most people would prefer not to sail out and lose them.

Okay...

#1 … I don't really see the need or lack of content everyone is talking about...

#2 … There are plenty of resources readily available, I speak from experience, I craft a lot. I do not see the need to make materials more readily available in game. You can also purchase cheap ships in ports if you don't want to craft ships or purchase ships crafted by players, I did this for a long time and did quite well with a less than perfect built Renome. I had the rank to run larger ships, but could not afford them, so I always ran what I could afford to readily replace. Run medium cannons and 5th rates. I recommend anyone that plays this game to remain in a frigate until mastering PVP open world warfare. Otherwise you just run a great risk of losing everything you put your time and effort as a solo player... aka... that glorious line ship which I just lost to a player in a 5th rate.

#3 … You are encouraged to run what is affordable for you to run... to be competitive in this game, you do not need to have the largest ship or the biggest crews. This is a game of skill and meta. A player that only has 40 hours in game will not be able to match a player that has over 1000 solid open world PVP hours in game. In time such a player will be able to match this sort of ultimate dreadnought player, but it will take time and much practice.

#4 … This game is intended to have a player driven economy, and from my experience, if there is no cap placed on what players are allowed to sell their goods at, the economy will inflate. But that is ok with me... I craft goods and sell them faster because of the inflated economy. In an environment where players can ask 3000 reals for 12 pound long cannons... I can easily sell mine for 1000 or so each, this returns to me a great deal of reals per unit of resources and vs hours for production. The economy is good for sellers, but not for the newbie.

So all this lack of content talk just is not connecting for me... I return to the game every day and there is always plenty for me to do, I play for an hour generally or so, then get off. Sometimes I just sail the seas, other times I hunt, other times I manufacture goods and sell them, I can do what ever I want to, I just need to watch my back and always have an escape plan. I have lost many battles but now I have won many battles, when I started I was a baby, but since I have immersed myself in the game I have discovered ways of doing things for myself, but this means I always run what I can replace for myself easily. This approach has made the game far more enjoyable to me, the risk is low, I can afford my losses, and I play a balanced game of a bit of everything. Am I the best player? Probably not. But I still come back to the game with a new idea or mission in mind. The game is what we make it for ourselves to be. The content in my game is driven by m y choices from day to day, what I am doing and what others are doing around me.

So could we post what we would like to be content? Instead of just listing.... er… this game has lack of content.

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not to mention, if you want PvP in Eve Online. you legit can find it in 5 minutes.

Okay... Eve online you can travel at light speeds and warp right into star systems... I love Eve online too but... warping around does not fit into a Sailing Combat Game. Naval Action, in my opinion, will always be slower paced. This I feel is a good thing and really helps players get into that age of sail personality. At least it does it for me. I personally would never expect Naval Action to be EVE online... because its Naval Action.

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Let me place it this way. Naval Action has content with PvP, RvR, PvE, crafting, and eventually trading will be back to a state where one could consider it to be content. Granted I feel that RvR is lacking in variation, both it and PvE are very grind oriented it is still considered content. What is lacking is variation. Something new that draws players back every so often and keeps them interested in the game long enough for the next piece of content. Example would be special events. Things that you see commonly in MMO game-types. Many times this is holiday oriented or some addition to a story line quest. Not saying Naval Action needs a story line just giving examples. Just overall the game needs variation to keep consumers interested. Now, players taking breaks from the game is unavoidable but you need that thing to draw them back. That is what the goal of content should be after final release. Sort of what they have done on the latest testbed with the 25 kills and 5 boarding rewards. Create something more grand on the regular servers with a greater reward or something similar that rather than seeming like a boring task feels like a goal worth striving for.

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Might be a better mental exercise than simply writing something pulled out of a morning without coffee.

Thank you for worrying about my morning coffee. Indeed, I am not 100% happy with the latte foam from my espresso machine. It's probably a handling error on my side, so I'd appreciate some good advice.

20 hours ago, Hethwill said:

Plenty of them

...

No disrespect meant sir, just pure truth against a void comment.

Calling my comment void without giving any proof of your own claim is quite cheap and I am not inclined to let you get away with this so easily, sir! You fired a warning shot, so I shall hoist my colors and prepare for battle. *stiff salute*

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Now back on topic, which is good content suggestions. I am happy you fall on this matter, because I insist on my point that suggestions forum is full of good content ideas, but this source is not tapped on.

20 hours ago, Hethwill said:

Start reading from 2014 and take note of everything suggested that is in game or that was tested at any point during development.

...

go check almost everything suggested

I took my freedom to limit my research to two pages (50 posts) around April/May 2018. I decided not to go too far into the past to have a reasonable reference to the present game status. Nor should I go too close to present time in order to allow for some development time and implementation. Then I checked if the suggestion is actually proposing new content. If yes, I checked if it has been implemented in the game. Here is the result:

Out of 50 suggestions, I found 22 were proposing new content. 0 suggestions were implemented.

You may doubt if this sample is representative, but I fail to see "plenty" suggestions being considered.

Topic

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Author

Date

Content

Implemented

Move the near clipping plane closer to the camera

camera

unity3d

0

90

The Marinadtor

May 3, 2018

The Marinadtor

May 3, 2018

0

Increase how far we can zoom out

15

307

Macjimm

May 3, 2018

NethrosDefectus

January 16, 2018

0

Problems of NA 1 2 3

50

1,006

Slim McSauce

May 2, 2018

rediii

May 2, 2018

0

Duelroom 1 2 3

62

955

rediii

May 2, 2018

rediii

April 18, 2018

1

0

Naval Officer is a Shipwright 1 2

26

275

Jean Ribault

May 2, 2018

Wind

May 2, 2018

1

0

New fishing event

16

216

Capt Aerobane

May 2, 2018

Bach

May 1, 2018

1

0

When will you finally decide to keep a schedule that will conform to what you say?

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proof that somewhere along the line the game failed at being sufficiently entertaining on its own, and that people are getting so desperate that they have to come up with made up content. A weak excuse for absence of content.

Still I fail to see "plenty". From you short list of 3 suggestions, 2 were implemented 2016 or earlier, 1 in 2017. About 50 suggestions are generated per month, almost half of them propose new content. With 2 suggestions implemented per year, conversion rate is <1%.

Edit: I correct my first sentence. <1% is "nothing". Any example for 2018?