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I agree that there is a lot of shit all over the internet. This is one of those things that popped into my head and made me start thinking. I have been reading, on here in fact, that HAART has greatly reduced KS but I certainly don't want to help this virus do anymore damage if I can help it.

Keep in mind, please, this is still very new too me. I did not even know what a denialist was until reading these forums. I am very thankful I found all of you.

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Diagnosed in May of 2010 with teh AIDS.

PCP Pneumonia . CD4 8 . VL 500,000

TRIUMEQ - VALTREX - FLUOXETINE - FENOFIBRATE - PRAVASTATIN - CIALIS

Numbers consistent since 12/2010 - VL has remained undetectable and CD4 is anywhere from 275-325

i would think that if pappers caused KS, then there would be lots of guys walking around dallas with lesions on their bodies. lol. everyone i know uses poppers

Exactly, I would have had the AIDS and KS back in the 80's from inhaling them nightly while dancing to "Don't Leave me this Way" or "It's rainy men"!!! I will say that they are probably not healthy, but then again neither is eating to much fried foods or drinking a 2 liter of Diet coke on a daily basis. As far as causing KS or AIDS, nope.

And if you do a search you will find countless threads relating to poppers and this road to no where.

Would you rather he ask this question over on the denialist forum where this claim stems, or would you rather he ask it here? You and I know the answer to his question, but are you even trying to take into consideration where this is coming from? I don't think you are. If you have a problem with his thread perhaps you should have never replied.

The last time I used some poppers was 1979, and even back then, I didn't like them, after that, I would just say ( as the bottle was going around) no Thanks, I'm good, but you go ahead, I don't need that shit, never did

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

Guys...THANKS! I GET IT! My ENT test last spring revealed KS lesions so I was asking here because this is something that has been on my mind the past 24 hours or so and I couldn't find a straight answer on the other sites.

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Diagnosed in May of 2010 with teh AIDS.

PCP Pneumonia . CD4 8 . VL 500,000

TRIUMEQ - VALTREX - FLUOXETINE - FENOFIBRATE - PRAVASTATIN - CIALIS

Numbers consistent since 12/2010 - VL has remained undetectable and CD4 is anywhere from 275-325

The last time I used some poppers was 1979, and even back then, I didn't like them, after that, I would just say ( as the bottle was going around) no Thanks, I'm good, but you go ahead, I don't need that shit, never did

In 1979 I sniffed model glue while building a Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress in my room, I was 9.

Would you rather he ask this question over on the denialist forum where this claim stems, or would you rather he ask it here? You and I know the answer to his question, but are you even trying to take into consideration where this is coming from? I don't think you are. If you have a problem with his thread perhaps you should have never replied.

Last I heard the only places there are restrictions in participating in discussion is in the Am I..., LTS and Women's thread, so we will leave that at that.

And yes I do have a problem with this thread. The information is right there in front of us in the AIDS MED lessons that clearly state facts. I have never checked out a denialist site nor would I have any desire. I will always stick with credible and scientific sources. I can't imagine why smart intelligent individuals would check out a denialist forum and take whatever information they have and compare it to the scientific facts and info in AIDS Meds to help make a decision. I guess I am surprised how any one would consider anything other than the facts as laid out from credible sources.

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"Let us give pubicity to HV/AIDS and not hide it..." "One of the things destroying people with AIDS is the stigma we attach to it." Nelson Mandela

It has nothing to do with those who want to check out denialists sites. Like I explained to you privately there are those who have just read about Emery Taylor's death and the circumstances surrounding it. It's not surprising that someone new to all this would ask such questions, especially after having the subject thrown into their thread in Off Topic.

Having just read the book "And The Band Played On, People and Politics of AIDS", by Randy Shilts, there was quite a bit of suspicion in the early 80's about the role (if any) of poppers on KS and HIV. The book touched on this quite a bit at the beginning. I believe researchers spent lots of time trying to actually find a link, and from memory I don't believe they ever found one, or proved one.

In saying that, other research seems to indicate poppers may weaken the immune system perhaps but I think that's about it... (apart from the burnt skin on the edges of your nose that you hope no one notices while it heals)...

Before HIV was identified and even a bit after, there was serious attention to Poppers as cause of KS and even a cause of AIDS - immune collapse.

This was early and mid 80's stuff.

Denialist Peter Deusberg perpetrated this theory long after it was proven false by medical consensus.

Peter Deusberg's theories are very important in denialist arguments, to this day.

Voila. Everyone understand now why these things are still on the net? Because people still die today of AIDS and "denialists" or "alternative" or "resistant" groups - whatever you or they want to label it - still bring up all sorts of wildcard theories to explain an AIDS death to be result of anything and everything BUT HIV virus.

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“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

"Poppers" are inhaled nitrites (amyl nitrite, butyl nitrite, etc.) that are inhaled through the nose, leading to an intense but brief "head rush." They are typically used in clubs to intensify the experiencing of dancing, and during sex to intensify and prolong the sensation of orgasm. By itself, the drug can't increase the risk of HIV transmission, though it can be dangerous in people with cardiovascular or cerebrovascular disease. However, people who've just snorted nitrites are not usually thinking about the future--for those brief moments they're not going to care that the condom just broke or that they promised to pull out before ejaculation. Sex is intense enough without taking a drug that removes what few restraints are left!"

"Can the immune system be negatively affected through nitrates from poppers?"

On May 3, 2001 Joel E. Gallant, M.D., M.P.H. replied:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------"Poppers (inhaled nitrites) are not thought to adversely affect the immune system, though few of them have been well studied. "

Posted on Mar 20, 2000 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------Hi Dr Gallant, Hope you had a great holiday, lots of rest and also sun and fun. I have two questions which I am worried about. The first is the association of amyl nitrate (poppers) with Kaposi? I am HIV+ since 94, started therapy in Jan 98. I am been doing fine on therapy (I was recently on viracept/3tc/d4t) started with crixivan/3tc/d4t in jan 98. I am currently off waiting to get the resistance test because I will restart eventually a new therapy without d4t and viracept because mild symptoms of lypoastrophy on my face. Probally the next combo with combivir, viramune and add 1592. So back to my questions... I do quite rarely use amyl nitrate on special occasions when having sex. Is it any danger using it on very irregular basis? Is is related to Kaposi?? Also I have read this study of hiv poz guys who are having anal sex and bottom are more likely at risk to develop colon cancer and it is not unusual, what do you think?? I really paranoid about all this, I am afraid every time I am having anal intercourse though everything is safe. My vL was less than 50 and my cd4 are over 400. Thanks so much Steve

On Mar 25, 2000 Joel E. Gallant, M.D., M.P.H. replied:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------Steve, In the early days of the AIDS epidemic, there was some concern that the use of poppers (nitrate/nitrite inhalants) might be linked with Kaposi's sarcoma. It's now clear, however, that this was simply an association that had no causal relationship: Gay men who had sex with numerous partners were more likely to become infected with both HIV and with KSHV (the virus that causes KS), and they were also the people most likely to use poppers. This is a classical example of the dangers of trying to attribute a cause-and-effect relationship on the basis of an epidemiologic association. Poppers have their problems: they can cause headaches and could be dangerous in people predisposed to cardiac or neurologic problems. They could also inhibit your judgement: in the rush of the drug effect they could cause you to engage in unsafe sex. But they won't cause Kaposi's sarcoma. Unprotected anal sex is associated with the transmission of human papillomavirus (HPV) and anal warts, which in turn can lead to rectal or anal cancer. If you've been a "bottom" it's not a bad idea to be checked for warts. There is also growing support for doing anal Pap smears in gay men with a history of anal intercourse to look for the presence of HPV-related changes. "

This is classic!!! I think they rank close to kissing as a form of transmission. Seriously are you guys just sitting around trying to think what ridiculous topic can I post now?

Educating someone through ridicule rarely succeeds.

While some topics may seem obvious and/or absurd to someone with some experience with this virus, they may not be so to someone newer. Lord knows this topic has caused lots of commotion in the past, there is no need to start the turmoil again in post#2 of this thread.

Perhaps a little understanding in an order - we all were new to this once too.

Thanks to drewm for raising the question and for several of the posters for clearing the air on poppers. I had the same question as drew and in fact posted it yesterday on another thread - because I have seen mention of poppers causing KS a number of times in different threads over the past few months. I have KS and have a real interest in understanding the connection. I am glad to find out there is no connection.

I don't understand why some found the question offensive. It is an honest question from someone who didn't know the answer. No one can claim to have perfect knowledge. The great benefit of these forums is exchange of knowledge and support. Let's be supportive!

I am not afraid to ask questions and will continue to do so. Thanks to all who weighed in on this...everyone. Like I said, I did not know what a denialist was UNTIL AFTER I ASKED THE QUESTION on this thread. When someone mentioned it, I looked it up.

Regardless, my inquisitive mind is now satisfied. After my Baptism by fire a few weeks ago here, I am no longer shell-shocked by some of the responses and can only hope that I don't slap someone across the face who is new here for asking a similarly "idiotic" question. Anyway, no offense taken as we are way beyond that and thanks again to you all.

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Diagnosed in May of 2010 with teh AIDS.

PCP Pneumonia . CD4 8 . VL 500,000

TRIUMEQ - VALTREX - FLUOXETINE - FENOFIBRATE - PRAVASTATIN - CIALIS

Numbers consistent since 12/2010 - VL has remained undetectable and CD4 is anywhere from 275-325

Please utilize what little brain power you have -- do you actually think with the large amount of HIV/AIDS cases in Africa that they're all sitting around snorting poppers and getting KS? The last time I was in downtown Kampala, Uganda I found it really difficult to locate poppers.

Please utilize what little brain power you have -- do you actually think with the large amount of HIV/AIDS cases in Africa that they're all sitting around snorting poppers and getting KS? The last time I was in downtown Kampala, Uganda I found it really difficult to locate poppers.

and anything else I'm sure

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

Drew I am glad you aren't deterred from asking questions! I am reminded of nychope1 who posted a message of hope and optimism on November 26 and faced criticism for being naive. Sadly we haven't seen nychope1 on here since December 18.

Had this question been asked by a 19 yr old diagnosed just recently my response would have been totally different. But the OP is not 19, has been poz for almost a year, with past posting history as well as the number of posts I don't consider new to the forums . To me the posts I reference seem to exemplify a good knowledge of HIV and what appears to be an ability to conduct research to find answers to any questions. I just thought that the research would have been done and the science based answer would have been obvious therefore no reason to ask the question. I guess my thinking was wrong, of course not rgarding the subject matter of KS & Poppers.

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"Let us give pubicity to HV/AIDS and not hide it..." "One of the things destroying people with AIDS is the stigma we attach to it." Nelson Mandela

I am 45, have had KS lesions on my arms and legs for over a year, made an honest effort to find the answer to the question of poppers and KS that had been raised in a number of posts, and could not find it before I asked it in another thread. I am becoming worried that there are some questions that shouldn't be asked, but I don't know how to distinguish between a safe question and one that is out of bounds...

Dunno, I fail to see why we should be ridiculing Drew for asking a question. Regardless of the age of the poster, number of posts, etc...Perhaps It would have been better to just refer him to the links you referenced rather than saying this...

My question, when it comes down to it, was really about the KS lesions in my esophogus (sp?) being aggravated by poppers. OK? I had Googled the words aforementioned and got conflicting information. I did not PM those who have extended compassionate answers and friendship through PM's choosing instead to post in the forums because somewhere I read that we should ask questions HERE for the benefit of everyone.

There could be a 19 year old recently dxd who has the same question and got the answer here.

Assuming that someone who was dxd a year ago would seemingly have all the answers or capable of doing scientific research is patently unfair. You know what they say about opinions. My decision to ask in the forums is not one that I regret and I will do it again when the next question pops into my head.

For those of you who simply were waiting to jump down my throat, you'll get you chance again so sharpen your knives (save me how this wasn't that bad---I don't care). And again, and again, and again, THANK YOU to those who explained this better AND for opening my eyes to denialism which, as I said, I have never heard of until last night.

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Diagnosed in May of 2010 with teh AIDS.

PCP Pneumonia . CD4 8 . VL 500,000

TRIUMEQ - VALTREX - FLUOXETINE - FENOFIBRATE - PRAVASTATIN - CIALIS

Numbers consistent since 12/2010 - VL has remained undetectable and CD4 is anywhere from 275-325

Drew I am glad you aren't deterred from asking questions! I am reminded of nychope1 who posted a message of hope and optimism on November 26 and faced criticism for being naive. Sadly we haven't seen nychope1 on here since December 18.

That would be because I believe he was banned, dear...for confrontational behavior and shenanigans.

I am 45, have had KS lesions on my arms and legs for over a year, made an honest effort to find the answer to the question of poppers and KS that had been raised in a number of posts, and could not find it before I asked it in another thread. I am becoming worried that there are some questions that shouldn't be asked, but I don't know how to distinguish between a safe question and one that is out of bounds...

Good freakin' grief. You're really gonna tell me you couldn't find anything relevant about KS and poppers here? Really? It's been so played out that it was a running joke on here in my earliest AM days - some 6 years ago now.

You could make a good deal of money selling those popper bottle straps...

Ya know....there really HAS to be a better way to administer poppers - er, "room oderizers". That burnt nostril skin really IS an issue - not to mention just how difficult srewing the cap back on can be with lubey fingers.

Eeeeek, I used to live right over the path of the LAX airport yrs. ago, and all I could think of was some dam plane part falling form the sky, and landing right on my bed when I was on the up-stroke plowing some ass

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"it's so nice to be insane, cause no-one ask you to explain" Helen Reddy cc 1974

Eeeeek, I used to live right over the path of the LAX airport yrs. ago, and all I could think of was some dam plane part falling form the sky, and landing right on my bed when I was on the up-stroke plowing some ass

A friend of mine lived in Atlanta during the late 80s and had a huge piece of ice come crashing through the roof of his house.... was determined to have come off of a jet passing over coming in for a landing at Hartsfield Intl. I am not sure if he was in the midst of 'getting sum' when it happend though.

Most likely. As I recall he LOVED them. So did I and used them till my head hurt.

I used poppers more when dancing rather than in the bedroom when I was getting my brains screwed out. The subject did make me think a bit though, most of the tops I have been with enjoyed using them. I would say close to 75% if I had to come up with an educated guess. AND... since I have been HIV poz for around 10 years, I would say some of them were poz too. (another guess... go figure!)

Most likely. As I recall he LOVED them. So did I and used them till my head hurt.

I used poppers more when dancing rather

Some mornings my lips were the most unusual blue color. I got so good using poppers while dancing could take the lid off with the same hand I was using to hold them. Which is a skill I still have except I am not dancing as much.

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"Let us give pubicity to HV/AIDS and not hide it..." "One of the things destroying people with AIDS is the stigma we attach to it." Nelson Mandela

Eeeeek, I used to live right over the path of the LAX airport yrs. ago, and all I could think of was some dam plane part falling form the sky, and landing right on my bed when I was on the up-stroke plowing some ass

Some mornings my lips were the most unusual blue color. I got so good using poppers while dancing could take the lid off with the same hand I was using to hold them. Which is a skill I still have except I am not dancing as much.

My dancing days are pretty much over. The music was SOOOOO much better back in the late 70s and early 80s (IMHO). I tried taking the lid off with the same hand but I spilled the bottle all over my shirt. You have more talent that I do my friend!