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We discussed the new Zorro & Man With No Name comics in our latest podcast. Let me know what you guys think.

So what 20 min. to hear you guys announce that you have zero interest in a Zorro comic? Thanks allot!

Just kidding, but yeah, your buddy is right I wouldn’t consider Zorro strictly a western character either, its roots are in the pulps, he’s often considered the first capped crusader, and noted for introducing many of the more familiar tenets associated with that genre, especially the Batman’s. Also Fairbanks is said to have pretty much single-handedly created the swashbuckler adventure movie genre with his introduction of the Zorro charter into the movies.
So I guess Western is only one aspect of Zorro.

Also just wanted to point out The Good the Bad and the Ugly was not a remake of Yojimbo. For a Fist Full of Dollars was.
More accurately Yojimbo, Fist Full of Dollars and Last Man Standing in that order were all three “remakes” or inspired by Hammett’s Red Harvest.

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Because you can't just steal a military horse, they are trained to return to barracks and marked.

Unless the horse was being abused and escaped... I don't think it's very logical.

I think that was the point. Hence the more contentious relationship with the reluctant horse, i.e. it jumping out from under him and the likes.
It’s been a while since I saw it, but I think the horse had been introduced as not fully broken yet, he still had a very wild side to him (much like the as yet unbroken Murieta.) Hence the attraction, and he probably stole it and named it Tornado for that reason, being unruly and untamable like himself. .http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b1...ho/Tornado.gif
Also if I remember in the sequal The Legend of Zorro I think the horse Tornado insists on only responding to Spanish commands, while Murieta (now Alejandro De La Vega) is trying to teach him to respond to English as well, the stubborn but loyal Andaluz clings to it’s roots and won’t budge until he says the command in Spanish.
I think this was the first time anyone had portrayed Torndo and Zorro at odds with each other, pretty funny.

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With that, which Zorro novels/movies do you recommend? (I don't have any novels, and I've only seen the Banderas flics)

I guess the original The Curse of Capistrano (1919), followed by any of McCulley’s subsequent novels you can get your hands on.
Just as important if you haven’t seen it, is Fairbanks' The Mark of Zorro (1920) which defined the genre, apparently even McCulley based his later Zorro novels with Fairbanks always in mind, so I’d say they go hand in hand.
You can see why Hollywood and Hong Kong (yes even Jackie Chan) are still trying to catch up with this freakin guy. http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...arch&plindex=0 Not to mention his mad Parkour skills.

Several movies followed, of them the Republic serial Zorro’s Fighting Legion (1939) stands out, based loosely on a premise introduced by McCulley in the original novel (they were called the Avengers) You'll instantlly recognize where allot of the influence for Lucas and Indiana Jones came from.
It also introduced the famous giant flaming Z seen in the Banderas movie and in uhm Daredevil too .
It drifts from the original premise (and look) and is really it’s own thing, but its part of what Zorro is today.

A lot of people love it (especially for the Rathbone duel,) but I’d skip the Tyrone Powers version(1940). Even though it’s obviously an act, I think he goes too far with effete Diego de La Vega, it is considered a classic though.
The Disney version is fun, was immensely popular for it’s time, and the first to be heavily merchandised. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBoO1YTlaKM you can just rent The Sign of Zorro(1958), which is several of their TV episodes edited into one movie, to see if you like it.
Or if you prefer the Comic Version Alex Toth’s famous run on the same Disney series is collected in Paperback.
Famous line: “When you cannot clothe yourself in a Lion’s skin, put on that of a Fox!”
And I believe they were the first to name Tornado.

There’s dozens more, from singing Zorro’s to female Zorro’s, Gay comedy Zorro, Zorro’s grand son the Ghost of Zorro, a few comic book versions, a comic strip, even the latest a Telenovela/Soapopera Zorro. It depends how far you want to immerse yourself in the mythos.
I think I would honestly just recommend those few highlighted above as really "defining" the character, before getting into any of the many more derivative versions.
Then go directly to Isabelle Allende’s Zorro A Novel (kind of a prequal to the original McCulley novel) which apparently Wagner is a huge fan of and will be picking bits and pieces from to launch the new series.
It’s not the greatest, it drifts heavily into the “romance” genre, but it introduces and focuses on several great elements. And makes an effort to plant it in historical context and really develop his dual nature so he doesn’t just appear one day fully formed. It's the back story.

Ofcourse everything I highlighted in bold above is the Diego (De La) Vega character played by Anthony Hopkins in the movie you saw. The character Banderas played is entirely a new character that I don’t think will be picked up by Wagner.

Last edited by Guicho; 08-02-2007, 11:29 AM.
Reason: Because I kept adding more and more stuff! And now added some dates.

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Tyrone's de le Vega is a classic because both men (Tyrone Power and Basil Rathbone) were trained fencing champions. One of them had been cleared for the olympic try outs once but I can't remember which.

If you watch the sword scene at the end of the movie, and have the volume turned up, you can hear the swords sing. That's how cool they were. I have rarely ever heard swords sing during a swordfight. That's because in order to get the metal to sing you have to be fencing properly, and most of the sound is post-dub which means you won't hear them sing.

They set up the sound in that studio to catch the fight correctly. Which also to me makes it the number one sword fight in any movie.

^_^

I love Isabel Allende's book. She took portions of Zorro's life from all the resources she could grab, from mini kid books to the original.

The ONLY thing I don't care for is her depicting zorro as a bald widower with no children at the end of the novel. For that I prefer to pretend that she is lying about the last chapter, and he really does have a family, because if you notice, she's claiming she is writing it under secrecy as many people still have a death notice on Zorro's head and that of his family

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I saw that a while ago, and there’s another one in this thread too.http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/a...ad1/Zorro2.jpg
Knowing these are only convention sketches I was going to hold off comments until we’d seen his actual finished cover art, because he does beautiful work.
More recently he tends to be over stylized (and by that I mean; more realistic proportions, perspective and lighting, tend to give-way to his particular style).
Which is great! I love that in his work. Especially in some of the more self-contained universes, or the superhero books. Something like Dick Tracy or Batman where especially the villains being almost caricatures really come to life when you drop any pretence of realism.

It's not however particularly what I wanted to see on Zorro...Am I evil for saying that? Because I do love his style.

Unless he's going (as he suggested) back to the pulps. Like some of the more extreme vibrant pulp style covers, chiefly associated with The Shadow Magazine. I think that take on it with Wagner's style would work great here.

I am curious to see who Wagner as Art Director has chosen (if that’s the case) to be the interior artist?
I think I’ve been spoiled by Cariello and was hoping to see something with a bit more grit and realism like he's been doing in Lone Ranger, rather than something (I hate to say it) more cartoony or over stylized.
Anyway, I’m sure it will be great!

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I looked up about this show awhile back. I suppose it's an interesting idea but it borrows heavily from The Phantom by turning Zorro into a mantle that's passed down through from generations to generation.

All in all, I would rather see the company take the Zorro story and relocate into another time period all together rather than slap a veneer of Zorro over what is essentially The Phantom [and to be more specific, this Zorro cartoon's concept is highly remiscient of the 1993 cartoon series Phantom 2040 ]