Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
From: dennis.l.erlich@support.com
Subject: MANSON STRINGS GO DEEPER!
Message-ID: <9510291047.0F62100@support.com>
Organization: L.A. Valley College Public BBS (818)985-7150
X-Mailer: TBBS/PIMP v3.35
Distribution: world
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 95 10:47:50 -0800
Lines: 164
nobody@flame.alias.net (Anonymous)
>This is great. The references to Charles Manson were posted, not
>really, saying Manson WAS a Scientologists, and instantly Milne is out
>there denying Manson was a Scientologist.
>
>It's like what happened to implicate Eugene Engram in the AB affair. I
>think Vera came out and said something to the effect of ..."it is not
>true that Eugene Engram had anything to do with it..."
>
>Only problem was, no one of the critics, nor anyone else, had even
>mentioned Engram! (If someone can find that post it is an ARS
>classic).
>
>I want to mention that first, we have not seen the full text of the
>letter that Bugliosi sent and two, the copy of Helter Skelter I have
>has an "Afterward" section that was added in 1995 with Bugliosi's
>reflections on the case over the past 25 years. There is no mention of
>the letter sent to the Scientologists. In looking over it now, that is
>a very LOUD silence. Whatever his motives were for leaving it out, I
>believe he was coerced into writing that letter but he still has
>suspicions but only suspicions.
>
>Now, as DWTripp told us, the people on Course at LA Org were all of
>the concensus that the murders of James Sharp and Doreen Gaul WERE
>committed by Manson's Family! Helloooooo? Why would they think that?
>WOW! What a string to pull!
>
>It suggests to me that the local Scientology community at the time was
>aware that James and Doreen were KNOWN to hang out with Charles
>Manson's Family!
I'd never heard this.
>This is getting REAL interesting! At a minimum it
>tells that James and Doreen had some kind of connection with the
>Family.
No info.
>At the worst, it says that FOUR Scientologists were in
>Manson's family! Manson himself, Bruce Davis, James Sharp and Doreen
>Gaul.
?
>The other thing DWTripp mentions was that he was hanging out with GO
>people and they mentioned that there was the possibility that Charles
>Manson had done services at the LA Org. POSSIBILITY?????
No. Woof reconfirmed that Manson did the TR's course. The
search of LA Org was for the invoices and Qual records of
graduation. You know, his Success Story and stuff.
>You mean with
>all the Scientology attention to meticulous paperwork, waivers,
>receipts, PC folders, etc etc, that they didn't have absolute
>verification one way or another????
Back then there was little paperwork to sign up. You paid
your $15 for the Comm Course (it was a lot of money for me and
my wife - we had a infant girl and another on the way).
>In article <46ppt5$1v8@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, DWTripp
>wrote:
>
>I was on ASHO staff at the time. I did hold a tech post. My knowledge
>regarding GO actions in the wake of Manson's arrest came from my
>attendence at regular Friday night poker games where the presence of
>Henning Heldt, Martin Greenberg and other GO people was consistent. Yes,
>they did talk shop. The "claim" made at the time (I believe it was Martin)
>was that LA Org records had shown that Manson had possibly done a
>Communications Course and bought some books. No refernce was ever made
>regarding any purge of records and if such was done, it was likely
>initiated by LA Org Execs. Possibly even Erlich.
Nobody:
>This is bullshit. This is the GO trying to MINIMIZE Manson's
>involvement. Using the word "possibly" is trying to avoid an outright
>lie (Manson wasn't involved) to a fellow Scientologist.
>
>You all have the WRONG slant on this. I'm not saying Charles Manson
>was a Scientologist acting on behalf of the Church. What I'm saying
>is, Scientology may have played a significant part in pushing an
>already borderline personality over the edge.
Exactly so. When I read and saw Manson's methods of
controlling his followers, it really reminded me of the
scienokult.
>L. Ron Hubbard's believed that in general, the individual was superior
>to the group. He used to love to tell stories about individual
>achievement despite the group. He believed that when an individual
>gave up the right to dispense "personal justice" he was finished. And
>we certainly have seen that Hubbard had no remorse about using people
>for his own private purposes. I think it was his main thrust.
Both Tubby and Manson were Power Trippers of the same ilk.
Major control freaks over other's bodies.
>Frankly, I think that L. Ron Hubbard would have LOVED Charles Manson,
>and had Manson joined staff, I have no doubt he would have risen high
>in the Organization.
There were/are a couple of very similar types in upper
management.
>Scientology promotes ruthless sociopaths because
>they give the apparency of being "AT CAUSE". The only problem is, if
>you are willing to to break the rules for selfish purposes, it is EASY
>to be at cause. Until you get caught. And the overall net result of
>your CAUSE is more misery in the world.
Tell it.
>If any of you have seen the movie Helter Skelter, you will also notice
>lots of Scientology in it. For example, during the trial, Manson and
>the girl defendants do TR0 on the witnesses, trying to intimidate
>them, especially Linda Kasabian, the witness whose testimony was
>crucial. There is also an incident where a clock stops in the court
>room and Bugliosi looks at Manson and Manson gives him a look like,
>"Hahah! I made that clock stop by SOOOPER powers! Whadya think of
>that?"
The scienos still use the famous DeathStare(tm) when they come
to court. Boring into the back of the opposing council's
neck.
>Why did Manson call himself a theta clear? Well, there is no actual
>Grade Chart level called Theta Clear in Scientology.
I had a good friend, Simotus, that called himself an Operating
FSM. It was common to dub yourself something if you sniffed
the cult and quickly walked away. A goof, like ... you know?
>There is a
>definition of Theta Clear which means, a thetan who can stably stay
>outside the body (exterior). However, people are allowed to write up
>"Success Stories" any time they want and there were no TECHNICAL
>requirements to anyone wanted to attest to theta clear. I've seen many
>people do it in front of the examiner. This term is NOT a scientology
>beginner term. Either Manson read a LOT of LRH books, or he had been
>around the org for some months.
Plus he was gifted with the language of bullsh*t.
>I would sum this all up by saying, Manson was already sick, but he
>found license in LRH writings to illusion himself into believing he
>was a "Theta Clear" with the power of life and death over people. He
>also learned a lot about what makes people tick and the internals of
>the mind through his study of Scientology, enabling him to manipulate
>people very well. And believe me, Scientology can best be summed up as
>the art of "How to manipulate people". Of course they call it "Being
>at Cause" which is the same thing isn't it? Always having to be the
>one to call the shots?
I concur.
+--------------------------------------+
Rev. Dennis L Erlich * * the inFormer * *
dennis.l.erlich@support.com + inForm@primenet.com
"tar baby"