tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post1474324126362379197..comments2017-12-13T16:10:47.401-08:00Comments on Eurogenes Blog: Caste is in the genesDavidskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comBlogger71125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-57072632758576248212016-11-12T11:24:13.426-08:002016-11-12T11:24:13.426-08:00Jijnasu,
The topic is about casts and genetic pro...Jijnasu,<br /><br />The topic is about casts and genetic profiling. Whether in Somalia, Polynesia or South India you have to identify groups that represent similar in profile. I just pointed one criteria for identifying closer genetic groups which is skin color/native casts.<br /><br /><br /><br />For south India Mala and Vysya are good use cases to compare. Both are local communities with Nathan Paulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18392998104066477963noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-67942305192277247832016-11-08T11:17:28.138-08:002016-11-08T11:17:28.138-08:00Hi Everyone,
Regarding Davidski&#39;s Salmon (Gan...Hi Everyone,<br /><br />Regarding Davidski&#39;s Salmon (Ganges valley) vs Yellow (surrounding) waves: I think I&#39;ve mentioned it before on this blog, but I&#39;ve seen evidence that deforestation and intensive agriculture came to that area extremely late (post-IVC). I&#39;ve seen scholars attribute that to iron, but I&#39;m skeptical as there are other methods (fire, girdling, stone tools) Taymashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06665325852062369303noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-55023153246576658182016-11-07T08:57:42.726-08:002016-11-07T08:57:42.726-08:00@bmdriver,
Are you white, brown, black?
Whatever...@bmdriver,<br /><br />Are you white, brown, black? <br />Whatever, does it make a difference in what you are saying? Davidski is not making up data. Please feel free to analyze the data yourself.<br /><br />I&#39;m not sure if you realize that while we all may be racists internally you are the one that is coming across as one in your diatribes.<br /><br />The issue is whether or not there was aAPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09934397498634833316noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-61636580129261403542016-11-07T07:03:38.638-08:002016-11-07T07:03:38.638-08:00@Davidski
Thanks. Onge are not a true outgroup to...@Davidski<br /><br />Thanks. Onge are not a true outgroup to Brahmin_TN and Brahmin_UP as they both harbor varying levels of Onge-like ancestry on their ASI side. When we take Mbuti, a true outgroup to them, as the outgroup it is revealed that Brahmin_TN are equally related to Andronovo and Catacomb_Ulan_IV and Brahmin_UP are slightly more related to Andronovo than to Catacomb_Ulan_IV. So it is Onurhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05041378853428912894noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-78762602285522438022016-11-07T05:42:05.801-08:002016-11-07T05:42:05.801-08:00Mbuti Brahmin_TN Andronovo Catacomb_Ulan_IV -0.001...Mbuti Brahmin_TN Andronovo Catacomb_Ulan_IV -0.0017 -0.468<br />Mbuti Brahmin_UP Andronovo Catacomb_Ulan_IV -0.0075 -2.627<br /><br />Onge Brahmin_TN Andronovo Catacomb_Ulan_IV 0.0084 2.289<br />Onge Brahmin_UP Andronovo Catacomb_Ulan_IV 0.0021 0.682<br />Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-47227889217606490652016-11-07T05:22:48.526-08:002016-11-07T05:22:48.526-08:00@Davidski
Can you do D-stats for:
Mbuti Brahmin_...@Davidski<br /><br />Can you do D-stats for:<br /><br />Mbuti Brahmin_TN Andronovo Catacomb_Ulan_IV<br />Mbuti Brahmin_UP Andronovo Catacomb_Ulan_IV<br />Onge Brahmin_TN Andronovo Catacomb_Ulan_IV<br />Onge Brahmin_UP Andronovo Catacomb_Ulan_IVOnurhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05041378853428912894noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-29859565555849458382016-11-07T02:31:39.184-08:002016-11-07T02:31:39.184-08:00@aniasi
Sounds very complicated. I&#39;ve seen lo...@aniasi<br /><br />Sounds very complicated. I&#39;ve seen lots of attempts in scientific literature at things like that, and the results, sadly, were more often than not rather dubious.<br /><br />Usually what happens is scientists use programs like Rolloff to get a whole bunch of admixture signals and dates, and then they partake in mental gymnastics to make the results seem plausible. I don&#39Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-36093863885803706962016-11-06T16:33:45.275-08:002016-11-06T16:33:45.275-08:00@Davidski
Isn&#39;t there an analysis on when adm...@Davidski<br /><br />Isn&#39;t there an analysis on when admixture occurred between two or three populations? Also, you have more genetic data with both Iranian Neolithic and more steppe samples. Would it be possible to use these three to see what admixtures made South Indian Brahmins? I was thinking of the treemix analysesm roll-off, and other tools that have been used: one pulse of Iranian + aniasihttps://aniasi.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-85026488622811780872016-11-06T15:03:52.445-08:002016-11-06T15:03:52.445-08:00@aniasi
I wonder if they were a part of the origi...@aniasi<br /><br /><i>I wonder if they were a part of the original steppe migration, that penetrated the south, and later &quot;went native&quot;, and did not take on subsequent pulses of steppe admixture as northerners did, or if they were a northern Brahmin group that migrated south later, and then took on local admixture.</i><br /><br />Probably the latter, or a bit of both, but I don&#39;t Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-65152509567430507552016-11-06T11:42:31.498-08:002016-11-06T11:42:31.498-08:00History is interpreted by people&#39;s own bias, p...History is interpreted by people&#39;s own bias, predujice, agenda and understanding. One commenters makes a statement about Persians caste, another refutes it as Zoroastrian pagan nationalism, when time estimates are given for r m17 accusations of Jewish Zionist nationalism, when I refute aryan Dravidian theory as Christian colonial distortions with historical European accounts, I&#39;m classedbmdriverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02175936825472291559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-30833549041460514172016-11-06T09:20:25.839-08:002016-11-06T09:20:25.839-08:00@ak2014b
That article is highly inaccurate. Seem...@ak2014b <br /><br />That article is highly inaccurate. Seems like it was written by a hardcore Iranian/Zoroastrian nationalist. The Iranians were mostly deprived of basic rights, could not ride horses or carry weapons part is the most hilarious. The Asawira (Persian cavalry) were prominent in the armies of the of the new Islamic caliphate. <br />https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siyah_al-Uswari<br For the kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11512190546601297966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-19501947761441505972016-11-06T08:43:11.405-08:002016-11-06T08:43:11.405-08:00Which two west Asian proponents are you talking ab...Which two west Asian proponents are you talking about?bmdriverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02175936825472291559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-40256197756482961322016-11-06T08:42:20.678-08:002016-11-06T08:42:20.678-08:00@aniasi
The problem is very complex and hard to so...@aniasi<br />The problem is very complex and hard to solve. Tamil Brahmins do not constitute a single endogamous group but are constituted into several caste groups with distinct origins. Broadly based on literary &amp; cultural evidence they may be classified into a numerically small group that migrated around 2.5-2 kya during initial south indian urbanization, groups that migrated in the latterJijnasuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14851649346012458747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-37137561622094592492016-11-06T08:01:47.224-08:002016-11-06T08:01:47.224-08:00Correction:
I am very interested in the Brahmin_...<b>Correction:</b><br /><br /><br />I am very interested in the Brahmin_TN. It looks like he groups with Indo-Aryan speakers. Is it possible to see where in the subcontinent and when they arose? I wonder if they were a part of the original steppe migration, <b>that penetrated the south, and later &quot;went native&quot;, and did not take on subsequent pulses of steppe admixture as northerners didaniasihttps://aniasi.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-2604846924545194932016-11-06T07:51:50.757-08:002016-11-06T07:51:50.757-08:00@Davidski
I am very interested in the Brahmin_TN....@Davidski<br /><br />I am very interested in the Brahmin_TN. It looks like he groups with Indo-Aryan speakers. Is it possible to see where in the subcontinent and when they arose? I wonder if they were a part of the original steppe migration that later &quot;went native&quot;, and did on take on subsequent pulses of steppe admixture as northerners did, or if they were a northern Brahmin group aniasihttps://aniasi.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-40436507819119644242016-11-06T06:17:05.008-08:002016-11-06T06:17:05.008-08:00@ bmdriver
Also a scientist does get his own pref...@ bmdriver<br /><br />Also a scientist does get his own preferences, even prejudices, but, if he were driven from them, he would be a bad scientist. I spoke for ten years about an Italian Refugium of hg. R1b1 and subclades against all, and this year has been found Villabruna. I have said much more and am waiting that other findings prove or disprove my theories.<br />You link me with religion andGioiellohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13578860964923773647noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-36490632475996992892016-11-06T06:03:43.147-08:002016-11-06T06:03:43.147-08:00@ak2014b
There are probably both convergent and di...@ak2014b<br />There are probably both convergent and divergent processes involved. There is nothing unusual about social hierarchies and hierarchies with limited social mobility likely existed amongst all societies. A three fold division likely existed amongst proto-indo-iranians possibly proto-IE with warriors, priests and common folk. I am less sure about the creation of class of outcastes as Jijnasuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14851649346012458747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-51560536988117360422016-11-06T05:48:36.570-08:002016-11-06T05:48:36.570-08:00@bmdriver
I don&#39;t know anything about mouse mi...@bmdriver<br />I don&#39;t know anything about mouse migrations but I think we can sat without any doubt that a portion of modern Indian ancestry did originate from outside the subcontinent. What your failing to note is that while certain traditional ideas have been supported several others have been dispelled by evidence particularly from ancient dna. For example no more is the idea of a Jijnasuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14851649346012458747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-19013254367240205012016-11-06T05:41:57.646-08:002016-11-06T05:41:57.646-08:00There&#39;s a third possibility. Besides the possi...There&#39;s a third possibility. Besides the possibility that casteism is a feature of the Proto-Indo-European homeland culture, with outcasteism as a product of the Indo-European migrations into Europe and Asia, and the second possibility that they are independently evolved stratification schemes based on local context and history, a third alternative is that these things could be a ak2014bhttp://ak2014b.livejournal.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-71818254011563101852016-11-06T05:29:43.525-08:002016-11-06T05:29:43.525-08:00Castes, outcastes, casteism, outcasteism have exis...Castes, outcastes, casteism, outcasteism have existed in Europe. Not taking this into account renders the discussions here so far as speculative.<br /><br />http://www.cambridge.org/catalogue/catalogue.asp?isbn=0521027217<br /><br /><i><a href="http://www.cambridge.org/catalogue/catalogue.asp?isbn=0521027217" rel="nofollow">Defiled Trades and Social Outcasts</a><br />Honor and Ritual Pollution inak2014bhttp://ak2014b.livejournal.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-63540903577302602222016-11-06T05:12:07.527-08:002016-11-06T05:12:07.527-08:00If you google image, Shem, japeth and ham, though ...If you google image, Shem, japeth and ham, though not by any means a comprehensive study, but it goes to highlight how aryan Dravidian theory is an exact replica of such religious beliefs, that Abrahamic god chose light skinned tribes to enslave the dark skinned races with the mark of Cain.<br /><br />Japeth (European Caucasians) shall dwell in the tents of Shem ( Arab middle Eastern west Asian bmdriverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02175936825472291559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-42457132031587198472016-11-06T05:05:20.029-08:002016-11-06T05:05:20.029-08:00Jijnasu unfortunately the aryan theory is still qu...Jijnasu unfortunately the aryan theory is still quite prominent, in western intellectual circles, and often is cited and overlayed onto history, it does reek of semi religious political bias. And western history was laced with such prejudice and remains especially when re telling history.<br /><br />As for those who keep saying high caste have more west Asian (white) stock in my opinion are are bmdriverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02175936825472291559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-51746262035603572182016-11-06T04:16:49.488-08:002016-11-06T04:16:49.488-08:00@bmdriver
You seem to be going overboard ascribing...@bmdriver<br />You seem to be going overboard ascribing any theory suggesting immigration into the Indian subcontinent. A lot of theories on race from the 19th century are ridiculous but they have little to do with any of this. Much of what you&#39;re quoting is outdated. ANI wasn&#39;t even a single group. Time for all nationalists indian, italian or otherwise to realise that aknowledging Jijnasuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14851649346012458747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-27362449354077718742016-11-06T03:43:55.139-08:002016-11-06T03:43:55.139-08:00&#39;The best laid plans of mice and men come to n...&#39;The best laid plans of mice and men come to naught&#39;.mickeydodds1https://www.blogger.com/profile/04454926902513067703noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-64718966412062041222016-11-06T03:41:47.604-08:002016-11-06T03:41:47.604-08:00Gioiello i guess you reflect almost two thousands ...Gioiello i guess you reflect almost two thousands years of white superiority complex that manifested into colonialism, imperialism and slavery of the known world. Let me stick to my Indian nationalism is grounded more in morality, logic and unbiased reasoning than an expansionist attitude with a religious Christian theology underpinning it. I could repost historical account of European Christian bmdriverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02175936825472291559noreply@blogger.com