guys, you gotta understand the system. Its the system that causes prices to rise. That 1000 dollar board you buy is supporting possibly 3-6 livelihoods. The person that cuts or manufactures the raw materials, puts a 20% mark up on their products. The the board manufacturer puts a markup on the board that they manufacture, while other people like graphic designers and marketing people take a cut. The the brand buys the product and puts a markup and takes profit. Then they have a national distrubutor that then sells the boards to retailers at a markup, then the retailers sell the board to you at a mark up. Thats a LOT of marking up over the price of the original board. vut out the middle men and you will save money, and thats the bottom line.

ok, so what I did was buy a carbon board at the middle of this year. It was secondhand and was quite heavily scratched. I got it at a third of the price it would cost new. I spent a weekend sanding all the scratches out of the board. Then I sent it to a smash repairer to spray 4 coats of clear on it. It looks and rides magnificently! After a season of use it has developed a more scratches, so at the end of this season, I will re sand the board and have it clear coated again ready for next season. I already have an idea of the kinds of graphics that I want for next season, so can personalise my board the way I like it every season. It just costs me a weekend of sanding and 200 bucks for a really good paint job! Most boards that are manufactured now cannot be repaired or rejuvenated and still look good, so why spend so much money on them. Carbon fibre is still the ultimate material, and will be the ultimate material for many years to come. Look into brands like Newind, Carved, nomad etc and buy something that will last! You'll still spend over 1000 dollars, but it will last much much longer!

No, I never did. That was exactly my point to begin with...No magic filling.You brought up that magic valuable prototyping process not me.

Your initial comment to the board was that you were surprised they are the same construction. I mean there are differences in construction for sure..but same principle.

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I did not ask specifically for you to respond with your same tired "I love high prices" explanations.

These are the comments that inflame discussion. It is juvenile, but perhaps fitting.

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I asked you if you knew how to not click the mouse, if you don't like what you see here, but you keep clicking it.

So you put out a thread, end it with *** OK, I've got my helmet on and I'm ready for a beating, so please tell me what you know about the subject! ***

I was kind of hoping it was your thinking helmet, but you must have misplaced it.

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Sorry you are having a hard time with my very specific example explaining why your assertion, that it was the huge R&D cost driving the price, was very likely wrong.

What I am saying is that the cost of RD on small small production runs are big unless you just buy a ready made design from someone.

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I believe that theory holds no water and my detailed explanation of the Airush CNC proto and production tools capabilities makes clear why, sorry you think it makes no sense because you don't understand what I said, and what I quoted right from the mouth of Airush about their tools.

I understand what you said, I just disagree. I think on small productions having a CNC router does not make sense. I bet you thet if a company own their own CNC it will stand in a corner and devalue by far most of the time. Most cities where there are shapers will have a place where you can bring you cad drawing and they will make you the blank...but even so Much cheaper than owning a CNC..unless you make protos everyday. The point is that the information is right there in front of you. Cost of comparable products are the same...even for if the comparable industries have much much bigger production runs.

I keep on saying this over and over again: I think the boards are expensive, but they are not overpriced. Maybe your helmet comes with ear plugs and reality distorters? I do not think the alternative is cheaper boards I think the alternative is no boards.

Hey!....welcome back again...I knew you cared! I put my helmet on because I'm smart enough to know that if I brought up the subject of prices that maybe had room to get a bit less comfy, that I would take some kind of a beating before long, and you walked right in and gave me the hit in the head I knew was coming.No worries there, It's not a big deal at all, I am here to learn, discuss, talk, see and hear about new stuff, look at cool videos and for general entertainment, like most of us here.I do often value your opinion on non price related subjects, in other threads.I guess we will have to agree to disagree on almost every point along the way in this thread though.I just am not going to see the things you are trying to get me to see and you are not going see what I'm trying to show you either.So, better luck next time, in another thread maybe.Please, no hard feelings.

You can scan anything you want and write the G codes with out touching a keyboard now adays. $29 000.00 USDFast and easy if you have the bucks to play.

Desk top scanner 2500 bucks programing 2500 bucks.. for a different kind. But the same goes for it. writes all the G codes for you..

Looking at one for proto type car part for the after market industries.

And if Air Rush has a CNC it woul kick a core out in about hlaf hour but everything else takes the time. the lay up, the boxes inserted, plugs, time to harden. ( at 180 degrees it takes 1 hour for a board to cure in a press at 60 psi) Hard to do EPS in a press for surf boards unless you have one big bad ass casket made. Which would cost you thousands of dollars to make in machine time alone. And press at alot lower pressure. I don't really know but I think most surf boards are vac bag. If they are done in a press I would love to check it out sometime.

Right now we( jellyfish boards) has 6 hrs into a twin tip before paint and everything is hand done.Yes we are looking at CNC to speed up the things. But we will only do the rough shape and finish it off by hand.. I can make every board the same with the machine but they just ride different when done by hand for some reason. It is like you can feel the love in the board.

Hmmm might have to fly over sea to check out a board plant and see how they do them.

Looking at one for proto type car part for the after market industries.

the 'fair price' is the market price. if people are willing to pay X for a board, that's the fair/market price. if X is too high, the company sells little to nothing and goes out of business.

that´s naive but i do agree you will be a happier person by beliving on it

when you start calling facts and reality 'naive', it may be time to make a head doctors appointment. or better still, sounds like you could run for political office here in the states. You'd fit in perfectly with the Democrats.

Firewire is working on different models for strapless riding which will in turn be less $$ for you riders due to less hardware in the board...and the best part is that some of these models will be light wind weapons....actually most will work insane in the lighter conditions....(Baked Potato, etc.)

In the meantime...if you are in the US...and want a good light wind board at a discount...Firewire is selling the 6'0" Quadra 5 and the 6'2" Flexifire for $500 each...including fins. Firewire is not going to be continuing these models but the I highly recommend the 6'0" quad (really a 5 fin for your option). It works very well for light wind and goes upwind like a champ.

If interested in the $500 deal, shoot me a note/PM and ill point you to who you need to contact to get your board. Limited quantities left and US only.

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