WOW! Last week when the focus changed from Buffy walking in the door to her "wide-eyed" dead mother lying on the couch, I was completely horrified. Honestly...let people get ripped apart by Vampires or Demons...that's not scary. Someone dropping dead of a brain anyurism is horrifying (because it's real!!!). I thought this show was supposed to be entertaining...not depressing and upsetting. It is supposed to be about hot chicks kicking butt and a bunch of tongue-in-cheek jokes...not death and special episodes.

I must say it was well put together. The whole silence thing made it very realistic. I just want to know why this happened this way and what the heck Joss Wheadon was thinking? If anyone has any insight to this whole "Buffy's Dead Mom" thing...please post.

The death makes sense to me. It is a powerful way of illustrating that some things in her life are beyond even Buffy's control. And I'm sure it will create some interesting family angst, with Buffy having to care for Dawn. It also clears the way for her dad, Hank, to make an appearance, although I'm not sure if that is planned.

--Heather

Rocky_Raccoon

02-28-01, 12:16 PM

Thanks alot for giving a major spoiler away in your topic GRRRRRRR. I don't have the WB and have to get a friend to tape them for me and won't get to see the feb. episodes for another month. You know not everybody gets to watch an episode when it's on. Next time be a little more considerate and don't put any spoilers in a topic.

Clint

stupidheadmike

02-28-01, 04:47 PM

Clint...in all due respect...If your in an area as such and do not have access to a major television network, you have no business wtching the show and also DUH, DON'T GO ON THE TV TALK THREAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Don't people discuss a baseball game the day after it's been on????? Don't people discuss the results of an election the morning after the totals are in????? GIVE ME A FRIGGIN' BREAK!!!!!!!!! OOOHHHHH Let's all cater to Clint and be real careful what we write on the INTERNET...he doesn't have t.v. and it may spoil something for him!!!! Well excuse me for posting a comment in a TV FORUM. It's not like I did it before the show aired (Then I could see you being mad). I am always a nice guy and real patient...but you buddy are a friggin' loser!!! If you love television so much and are afraid it may get ruined for you either: A) stay the hell off the internet. b) move to civilization!!!!!!!

Dude...you're a "tool".

And that's the bottom line...cause I said so!!!!

stupidheadmike

02-28-01, 04:49 PM

Heather...thank's for the info...you "rock"...I just may love you (provided you really are a girl...not a dude named heather!!!)

Oh...by the way...Clint sucks...just in case you haven't heard.

Wormwood

02-28-01, 06:37 PM

Originally posted by stupidheadmike
Clint...in all due respect...If your in an area as such and do not have access to a major television network, you have no business wtching the show and also DUH, DON'T GO ON THE TV TALK THREAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Don't people discuss a baseball game the day after it's been on????? Don't people discuss the results of an election the morning after the totals are in????? GIVE ME A FRIGGIN' BREAK!!!!!!!!! OOOHHHHH Let's all cater to Clint and be real careful what we write on the INTERNET...he doesn't have t.v. and it may spoil something for him!!!! Well excuse me for posting a comment in a TV FORUM. It's not like I did it before the show aired (Then I could see you being mad). I am always a nice guy and real patient...but you buddy are a friggin' loser!!! If you love television so much and are afraid it may get ruined for you either: A) stay the hell off the internet. b) move to civilization!!!!!!!

Dude...you're a "tool".

And that's the bottom line...cause I said so!!!!

stupidheadmike, I think your name says it all. Clint has every right to watch that show even though it isn't in his area. Your reasoning defies logic, are you trying to be Dr. Laura? You could have put the title for this thread something as "What's up with the latest episode of Buffy?". And by using spoiler space in the actual thread. By the way, grow up and have a nice day.

nevermind

02-28-01, 06:42 PM

Hey stupidheadmike, first things first. This is the TVTalk forum, not the TV Spoilers talk forum. Second, many people have these things called VCRs, or Tivo or Replay. They do not watch LIVE television for whatever reason. I don't think a **SPOILER ALERT** in the thread title and using the spoiler code in your post would have been too hard, would it?

You wouldn't post spoilers in the title of a post in the At the Movies forum the day the film opened just because you saw it, or would you?

And you did fly off the hook a little too much. No need to resort to name calling. You're not just catering to Clint, you're catering to all of us. This is the way things "happen" on this forum, and it's not too much to ask to keep it that way. You want to start a spoiler forum somewhere, go right ahead.

[Edited by dbrink on 02-28-01 at 03:45 PM]

DVDer

02-28-01, 07:02 PM

stupidheadmike:

Oh...by the way...Clint sucks...just in case you haven't heard.

You should be careful not just about posting spoilers, but about making comments that violate forum rules, such as the above. Personal attacks can result in accounts being banned.

--Heather
Moderator, DVD Talk & Reviews forums

Aaron Amos

02-28-01, 11:48 PM

Originally posted by DVDer
Well, Kristine Sutherland reportedly wanted off the show, and Joss wants an Emmy, so...

The death makes sense to me. It is a powerful way of illustrating that some things in her life are beyond even Buffy's control. And I'm sure it will create some interesting family angst, with Buffy having to care for Dawn. It also clears the way for her dad, Hank, to make an appearance, although I'm not sure if that is planned.

--Heather

I agree with DVDer! If the actress playing the mother wanted off the what a better way to do it! Even the causul viewer like myself knew the mom character was ill or dying!Besides Kristine Sutherland might of wanted to move on to movies,TV ads, made for TV movies(in other words Greener pastures!)Also was she in anything else besides Buffy at all these past few years? The death of the mom was more real than vampires and demons as we all have to face the fact our parents will die someday(or have for those on the board whose parent's are dead!)This episode was about Buffy confronting personel demons!

Rocky_Raccoon

02-28-01, 11:50 PM

I am not going to sink down to your level s&8t head mike. I was not rude in my message I don't think. You were very rude so I should not be surprised by you putting a major spoiler in your topic. It is just common courtesy to put spoiler space and not to put a spoiler in a topic. I have not gone in and read any Buffy threads on purpose so I don't find out anything. How could I not see the spoiler in your thread? Why should I not go to the TV Talk Forum just because you can't be respectful? I watch alot of shows and watch most of them the same week they are on and enjoy talking with people about them. Grow up dude and be more respectful to your fellow DVDTalkers. Thank you.

Clint

P.S. Hey Heather if you would ban him I would love you forever ;).

Aaron Amos

02-28-01, 11:51 PM

Originally posted by DVDer
stupidheadmike:

Oh...by the way...Clint sucks...just in case you haven't heard.

You should be careful not just about posting spoilers, but about making comments that violate forum rules, such as the above. Personal attacks can result in accounts being banned.

--Heather
Moderator, DVD Talk & Reviews forums

Can one get "banned " by doing what he did?

DVDer

03-01-01, 01:42 AM

Aaron Amos:

Can one get "banned " by doing what he did?

That depends on the circumstances and what exactly was said. Some members are simply warned via e-mail or on the forum, some are temporarily suspended, and some are banned. In my experience, it depends on:

a.) what negative things were said
b.) the circumstances around what was said
c.) and, depending upon the situation, a user's history

I don't know if what was specifically said in this thread would merit an administrator banning someone (I wouldn't think so, unless there have been previous warnings), but as I said, personal attacks can result in banning.

--Heather

clemente

03-01-01, 03:51 AM

What is the proper amount of time to no longer be a spoiler?

As apoint of fact, we knew Mrs. Summers was dead at the end of last weeks episode, on Feb. 20th. I think spoilers suck, especially being on the West Coast, but I don't think we should take great lengths to disguise our discussions because Clint won't get his tapes for another month.

It's simply a matter or making this forum work and not be a place to wait to discuss current plot lines.

DVDer

03-01-01, 03:59 AM

I don't think it would take too much effort to avoid placing spoilers in subject lines. That, I believe, was what angered Clint.

As far as the (non-title) thread content itself, I always assume when browsing a forum or newsgroup that any TV-related thread I open could contain spoilers.

--Heather

[Edited by DVDer on 03-01-01 at 01:03 AM]

stupidheadmike

03-01-01, 06:45 AM

To be honest with you, I don't think I did anything wrong by making my topic what it it was. How long after a show do i wait before its O.K. to discuss it openly. O.K., so if I had put more thought into it I probably could have been more considerate and not posted the fact that Buffy's mother is dead in the title. The reason for my reaction was due to Clint's reaction. I didn't post on here so I can be "scolded" by some dude without television. My assumption was anyone who was a faithful watcher of the show would have seen it already. I know I sound like a geek by saying this, but I make it my business to clear my schedule for "Buffy" being that I've gotten so into the show. A few years ago I started watching it after my sister told me "It has monsters and hot girls...the show was made for you!". Ever since then I've been hooked and watch it faithfully. How am I supposed to know that there are people who watch a show faithfully that they don't even get in their area????? I reacted to Clint's reaction. And if I can be banned for calling Clint a "tool"...then anyone who attacked me for attacking Clint should have the same warning. Anyway, this is what happens when people disagree. I meant no harm to Clint...I just wanted him to get real and see where he is being a little "whiny".

Look...I meant this thread to be informative..If I caused it to turn into anything else, I apologize. I just think Clint should realize that being he is not in an area that gets the show, he should stay away from Forums that talk about T.V. shows. In any event, if I need to post what way be considered a "spoiler", I will be as vague as possible in the title.

Thank You.

And Heather...thank you for trying help me in my point about it not being a "spoiler". That's all I was trying to get across (I was just a bit abrassive in my delivery).

stupidheadmike

03-01-01, 06:47 AM

By the way...sorry for the way the last post was written...I wrote this in the few minutes Iof free time I have befor work....gotta go.

rockinphotog

03-01-01, 09:22 AM

Originally posted by stupidheadmike
I meant no harm to Clint...I just wanted him to get real and see where he is being a little "whiny".

Great apology -rolleyes-

IMO clint was not at all out of line.

Too bad this whole thing turned negative,

but,

wouldn't it be cool if her mom came back as a vampire or demon and buffy had to stake her or chop her head off? what a conundrum. (sp?)

Rocky_Raccoon

03-01-01, 09:46 AM

Yes Heather , that is what angered me. Stupidhead you can post spoilers to your hearts content in the actual message in your thread. To post a major spoiler in the title that anyone opening that forum can see is just rude. If someone posted the shock ending of a movie that you were dying to see and hadn't seen yet in the title of a post in the DVDTalk Forum wouldn't you be pissed as hell? People don't do that in DVDTalk, why should you get to do it in TV Talk? What's the difference? That was my whole point. I was not opening any threads that were about Buffy. I could not help but see your message in the topic listings tho. I did have the WB but when WGN quit showing it I lost the WB in my area. I have called Directv upteen times asking them to add it but they still haven't. I have been a long time fan of Buffy and look forward to watching it. One of the things I most look forward to are the surprises. You took one of those away from me and it made me mad. Next time please do the nice thing and don't put a spoiler in the title of your post. That was all I was asking. I don't see why that is so hard for you to understand. I also don't think it is an unreasonable thing to ask.

Clint

stupidheadmike

03-01-01, 03:59 PM

Clint, just for you I am going to mend my ways. I was a "spoiler-posting" idiot but have seen the light. Due to my ephiphany (that you helped me get to...thank you...thank you, Clint) I will lead a crusade against the inconsiderate habit of ruining everybody's t.v. experiences.

O.K....I've had enough of the sarcasm..it makes me "sleepy".

To be honest...I understand what you are saying...but...it is different with a movie. Not everyone sees a movie the day it comes out. This is because a movie runs for a few months then runs again on video. Once it has been on video for a while, I feel the topic of the ending is fair game. Like the end of "The Crying Game". Dude I never saw the movie and know the guy turns out to be a chick at the end (Uh oh...did I ruin something else for you?????). How do I know this...because after the movie has been out a while its like...if you haven't seen it by now...you had no interest in seeing it in the first place. In this case, I feel, posting the ending for discussion is fair game. Contrary to what you believe, I would not post the ending to "Hannibal" in the title of the thread (my user name is "stupidheadmike" because I like the funny name...not because I have a low mental capacity). When it comes to t.v, very few "faithful" fans of a show would go two weeks without watching the show. Though I am sorry that you had to see my post, I stand firm in the fact that I was not wrong. It is television and I reiterate my example of a baseball game or an election. Once it has happened...its news and no longer a secret. MOVIES ARE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT DUE TO THE TIME FRAME IN WHICH WE AS MOVIEGOERS ARE GIVEN TO SEE A MOVIE. MOVIE=3 months (give or take a few months ...depnding on how good or bad the flick is) and TELEVISION = 1 night. You were unfortunate to stumble across the title of my post, but your situation is a rare one (in relation to how many fans already know what happened.). I have a hard time backing down when I know I'm right. Will I post what something was about in the title of a thread again? NO. Not because I feel it was wrong to do it, but because I don't want to waste my time having to explain the obvious to someone like yourself. Now stop pouting and go watch the episode...No matter what, it's still a great episode. And hey, maybe Heather is right..maybe Joyce will come back as a vampire. That would kick-ass!!!! Probably wouldn't be the most sensitive ending for this, but it would be rockin' none the less.

Heather, I'm trying to get a point across without offending Clint or anyone else (again). This was not my intention. Let me know if I am out of line with this post.

[WOW, I can't believe I went through all of this over an episode of "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" (I guess I just like a good debate...or I'm a geek loser...huh..whatever).]

[Edited by stupidheadmike on 03-01-01 at 01:05 PM]

stupidheadmike

03-01-01, 04:06 PM

By the way, Heather...what is "IMO"??? I'm real new to this and don't got the lingo down.

Adam Tyner

03-01-01, 04:24 PM

IMO=in my opinion

adamblast

03-01-01, 05:56 PM

Like others above, I think this was a terrific way to handle the actress's departure, and a terrific episode. I don't think for a moment that it'll get any Emmy notice, but I wish it would -- this series has been sorely neglected.

Where's it going to go from here? I don't know, but it sure makes me wonder more than ever what they're going to do with her little-sister-the-key after the end of this season or major arc. Are they going to turn her into a "regular girl" -- or leave Buffy completely all alone in the world?

Lurker1999

03-01-01, 06:18 PM

Some of us actually tape a week's worth of shows to watch on the weekends when we have time. It's a shame that this thread has degenerated into one person trying to explain why it's ok to spoil other people's fun because it's just a TV show and not a movie.

C-Mart

03-01-01, 06:44 PM

Just wanted to say that the spoiler should have been in the main body of the post, not the title. I know this has been said before, but when I first read the title I thought, "Great, now I know she's dead." I don't really watch the show, so this doesn't really effect me, but it does effect others.

Just because its on TV doesn't mean its news. I don't think "The Death of Buffy's Mom!" made the 11 O'Clock news.

Just my $.02

-CM-

Adam Tyner

03-01-01, 06:44 PM

Although this thread has degenerated, considering that Buffy's mom died a week and a half ago and the preview for Tuesday's ep talked about dealing with the death of a loved one... :) Unless you're two weeks or more behind, I can't see how this could come as a shock.

Peep

03-01-01, 07:49 PM

Originally posted by DVDer
That depends on the circumstances and what exactly was said. Some members are simply warned via e-mail or on the forum, some are temporarily suspended, and some are banned. In my experience, it depends on:

a.) what negative things were said
b.) the circumstances around what was said
c.) and, depending upon the situation, a user's history

So much for Geoff's "Zero Tolerance" policy.

:)

stupidheadmike

03-01-01, 10:20 PM

In response to that "Zero Tolerance" remark:

1) This was my first post in the "TV Talk" forum (doesn't anyone get a break around here?)
2) I didn't say anything really bad or use foul language
3) This is America, and last I checked, the First Ammendment gave all Americans the right to free speech.

If you want to say I'm inconsiderate than go ahead...but to say I should be banned is rediculous. I'm not a problem to the forum. But if you must ban me then go ahead. I'll be back!!!!

I DON'T CARE WHAT SHOW YOU PEOPLE ARE WATCHING...YOU'RE ALL A BUNCH OF TREKKIES!!!!!!

nevermind

03-01-01, 10:39 PM

Originally posted by stupidheadmike
In response to that "Zero Tolerance" remark:

1) This was my first post in the "TV Talk" forum (doesn't anyone get a break around here?)
2) I didn't say anything really bad or use foul language
3) This is America, and last I checked, the First Ammendment gave all Americans the right to free speech.

If you want to say I'm inconsiderate than go ahead...but to say I should be banned is rediculous. I'm not a problem to the forum. But if you must ban me then go ahead. I'll be back!!!!

I DON'T CARE WHAT SHOW YOU PEOPLE ARE WATCHING...YOU'RE ALL A BUNCH OF TREKKIES!!!!!!

-rolleyes-

1) Yes they do, but as said before, you flew off the hook, and continue to with such fine wisdom as the Trekkies statement. -rolleyes-

2) No foul language, I agree. But you continue to post things like (see 1)

3) This is not America, this is a privately owned website. Geoff has the right to make whatever rules he pleases.

If you were going to be banned, I think you would be already. Just calm down and let it go. :)

crankyman

03-02-01, 09:36 AM

please take further comments to the feedback area...

to get back on track...

i think having her come back as a demon or something would be pretty cool. maybe glory will lend a hand in that.

anybody figure out why they always had her eyes open?? i believe they typically close them if they die with them open...??

any ideas on that?

cranky.

Rocky_Raccoon

03-02-01, 09:55 AM

Ok Stupidhead let me try and explain this whole thing to you in simpler terms. You did something wrong. I called you on it. Instead of being a man and admitting you were wrong you ranted and raved and called me names like a spoiled little brat. You got in trouble with a mod. That made you rant and rave even more. That's where we are now. I never said anything about you getting banned. The mod said that. When I said this

P.S. Hey Heather if you would ban him I would love you forever. ;)

I was kidding. Hence the little winking smiley face. I did not want you to get banned. I was hoping for an apology but after reading your posts I didn't expect to get one.

In response to your last post a spoiler is a spoiler is a spoiler. It doesn't matter what kinda media it is. Whether it's a book or a movie or a tv show it's all the same. It's still a spoiler. There is nothing good about a spoiler. There is not a good connotation to the word spoil is there?
There are general rules of netiquette about this that are pretty common. Don't post a spoiler in a topic of a thread. If you are going to include spoilers in the body of your thread put a spoiler warning in the topic of your thread. In the body of your message before you write a spoiler write in big letters SPOILER WARNING or SPOILERS AHEAD or something similiar and leave plenty of space between this warning and the spoiler message. You could also use the new spoiler tags , which are great btw Geoff. I wish everybody would start using these more. These are all things you can easily do. It will also save you from alot of hassle down the road. Believe me if you keep posting spoilers without any warnings people are going to jump your case. They will probably not be as nice as I have been either.

It doesn't really matter how old a movie is or when a tv show was shown you should always warn before giving a major plot point away. It's just the nice thing to do. I was hoping to change your position on this but I have a feeling from reading your posts that this is a lost cause. I know the board is probably getting sick of this but as ya'll can tell this is a topic that I feel very passionately about. With information coming faster over the internet, competition between movie studios and television networks increasing, rising production costs, and entertainment news becoming more and more prominent in the so called legitimate news shows ; spoilers are becoming more and more prevalent. You have hollywood trailers giving away major plot points. Shows like access hollywood and entertainment tonight giving away major television shows plotlines. We can't really do anything about these things but we can do something about people posting spoilers on the internet. If we all try and not post spoilers , or put them in spoiler tags , and call people on it that do post spoilers I think there would be less fighting in general on the board. I am sorry if I am not making my point very clear. I work graveyard shift and have just gotten off work a little while ago and am very sleepy. I apologize to the board for all of the fighting that has been going on in this thread. I think Stupidhead that we should just agree to disagree and move on. I would hope you would think twice before posting a spoiler next time tho. I am willing to drop this whole thing if you are Stupidhead. What do you say?

Clint

stupidheadmike

03-02-01, 06:52 PM

Clint...no hard feelings...I will agree to disagree. To be honest you seem like a nice enough guy. And you have "somewhat" of a point about consideration. To be honest. I am new to this posting thing and didn't realize how upset people get over these things. In any event (so I don't drag this on any longer, please accept my apology for ruining it for you (and there is no sarcasm here). Enjoy the rest of the Buffy season and if you aver have a question about an episode you missed don't hesitate to post...I'll help you out.

See how this turned out. :)

Heather...I hope you're proud of my maturity. Do I get a Scooby snack?

nevermind

03-02-01, 07:09 PM

Originally posted by stupidheadmike
See how this turned out. :)

Kudos to both of you :). Good job :thumbsup:

Rocky_Raccoon

03-03-01, 02:04 AM

Thanks for the apology Mike :). Glad this all ended on a happy note. I may take you up on your offer. My friend sometimes forgets to tape an episode. Not often tho thank goodness hehe.

To get back to Buffy. I just read an article that the deadline has passed for the WB to renew their contract with 20th Century Fox. Now Fox can shop the show around to other networks. WB can match the first offer that is on the table. Alot of insiders think that Fox will sell it to their own network to keep it in the family. I kinda have mixed feelings about this. From a selfish standpoint I would love to see Buffy on Fox because then I could watch it every week. They also would have a higher budget. I am afraid Fox would want to mess around with the show too much tho. With Angel staying on the WB , I think it would probably kill the show and they probably wouldn't do as many crossovers. I think Angel is a good enough show to stand on it's own but who knows. Also the WB is a smaller network so they are willing to give a low rated show ( compared to the 4 big networks shows ) more of a chance. I think if Buffy did the same ratings for Fox that they do for the WB , Fox would cancel the series within a year or sooner. That would be very uncool. What are your thoughts on this?

Clint

rockinphotog

03-04-01, 11:10 AM

Talk about a big fish in a small pond becoming a small fish, overnight.

Sounds fishy:)

BTW they don't seem to need more of a budget episode-wise, it would only go into peoples pockets.

CKMorpheus

03-04-01, 11:35 PM

Hmm... I stopped watching this show after Buffy killed Angel. I never thought it would last as long as it did. Perhaps I shouldn't have left. Damn.

Rayman

03-05-01, 12:10 AM

This is all kinda insane. I think its reader beware when you veture into a forum dealing with TV shows. I beleive it takes some personal responsibility on both parites. In todays land of instant news there are really no shocking events left on TV.

Lets face it, Buffys mom was not really an integral part of the show. She was Buffys mom and sad she died, but lets face it, we watched buffy for how many years before she had a sister???? If nothing else, knowing buffys mom died makes me wish I had seen the episode. And besides, weren't there teasers that "something" was going to happen?

As far as buffy goes, cute show and I agree with a previous post, hard to imagine this show is still on. Of course Voyager is still on...

Personally, when there is something I don't want to know, I sure as heck dont' jump into a forum talking about it. Thats just no fun.

Have a great evening....

Me

Zien

03-08-01, 12:26 PM

There's an article at cinescape in which Josh Whedon discusses the mom being dead:

First of all, she isn't coming back.

Contrary to Internet fan speculation, there are no plans to resurrect Buffy's mother. While talking to TV Guide Online, Buffy the Vampire Slayer creator Joss Whedon addressed a number of fan spawned scenarios.

Regarding Dawn not touching her, Whedon says, "Dawn's special energy will not bring Joyce back. Some people thought that at the beginning of the next episode, she was going to touch her and heal her with her Dawn powers. I'm like, 'People! Missing the point!'"

What about Joyce's mystery date? Whedon dispels such talk, saying, "There is no mystery to the date...if you brought her back, it would have to be extremely earned, and there would have to be a good reason for it."

Whedon also revealed that plans had been in the works for quite sometime to leave Buffy and Dawn without their mother.

Regarding why the episode after Joyce's demise, Whedon explains why Spike wasn't there and the episodes final vampire battle, saying, "I stayed away from unnatural things as much as possible. I didn't have Glory (Clare Kramer) or even Spike (James Marsters) in the episode because I wanted everything to be very real. But because the show is Buffy, vampires are a part of that world. So I wanted to have the vampire fight, but put it in the context of this occasion, because life is still going on... things are intruding. [There's a] feeling that this tragedy has occurred, and the world is supposed to stop."