Defence of German banks a key factor

Schäuble and Merkel….implicated in an incredible scam

How Venizelos fired ELSTAT moles to cover up the truth

Spanish European Commissioner backs story of international fraud

The Western MSM have never questioned the ‘received truth’ that Athens understated its liability and obligations for several years following the launch of the euro. But few if any outside observers know the truth behind what happened when Papandreou took over the Premiership in Greece….and for Machiavellian reasons, the debt was suddenly overstated.

In October 2009, George Papandreou stepped into what one Athens source has called ‘the shitfilled shoes of Kostas Karamanlis’, and discovered that the two previous administrations had lied about both the size of the National Debt, and the ongoing level of government spending. In Greece, the folks you go to see to find out this kind of stuff hang out in an organisation called ELSTAT – the Hellenic Statistical Authority.

What happened in the weeks following was quite bizarre – and pretty fully documented. Somewhat panicked by the degree of mendacity he’d discovered, Papandreou confided to key Cabinet cronies that the real fiscal situation involved not balanced books, but a 7.8% deficit…well beyond the limits allowed by Brussels – although Brussels had, from Day One, been something of a paper tiger when it came to enforcing the currency rules. An insider from that time comments:

“Papandreou thought there was a serious chance he’d be thrown out of the eurozone. Unbelievable I know, but he did. But then things went rapidly from bad to awful. He really did have no idea what was coming.”

Rather like an Olympics Budget, the deficit figure kept rising with each week, as the new government opened more and more worm-cans. First ELSTAT said 7.8%, then 9.8%, then it went to 11%, before finally settling at 13.6%. Only then – some time shortly before Christmas 2009 – did Papandreou talk to Brussels, Paris and Berlin about the possible need for a bailout.

In fact, through her Interior Minister Wolfgang Schäuble, Angela Merkel already know about the Greek deficit lies. Schäuble became Finance Minister shortly after Papandreou came to power. Although Angela Merkel had shafted the wheelchair-bound assassin’s victim on at least two previous occasions, she wanted him now for three reasons: first, as Minister of the Interior, he had an excellent head for secrecy and covert operations. Second, he was hugely in favour of EU political union. And third, he didn’t have the scruples of his SPD predecessor, Peer Steinbrück. A lack of scruple was going to be crucial: for Merkel also knew that German banks were heavily exposed to the Athens deception.

Thus, if the eurozone members didn’t put their hands in thir pockets bigtime, Germany could be facing a severe financial crisis. (Sarkozy, says a Parisian diplomatic source, was even more terrified, in that all his exposed banks were completely guaranteed by the State).

Somewhere in the midst of these talks, Berlin requested a smaller meeting with the Greeks. At this meeting, three sources (two Greek and one German) allege, the small German delegation made an astonishing observation: the situation would “have to look more desperate” in order to justify a bailout to the other eurozone members. That is to say, only widespread fear of the entire eurozone being damaged would get the member States to pile in with bailout monies.

What Berlin was really worried about, of course, was that the Franco-German banking system might collapse if Greece wasn’t saved. And at that stage, little or nothing had been done to make the sector better able to withstand a derivatives wave.

The European Commission had in fact already issued a warning in July 2009 that Greece’s deficit was likely to reach 10% of GDP – if no counter-measures were taken to curb public spending – and that Commissioners regarded the official 6% GDP forecast as “over-optimistic”. But, Berlin argued, only something, say, 50% or more above that potential second figure would frighten eurozoners enough to get them to part with their cash.

Without assuming much, one has to observe that this plan does have Schäuble written all over it. And sure enough, in due course (November 2010) the eurozone learned that the Greek deficit was ‘currently running at 15.8%’. George Papandreou had meanwhile announced his first austerity package in January 2010, and in May of that year EU leaders unveiled a €110bn bailout with money from the European Union (EU), the European Central Bank (ECB) and the International Monetary Fund (IMF)….the so-called Troika. So clearly, the crisis was real enough….and the bailout fully justified. It seemed.

Fast forward now to 2011. Enter from left field former Hellenic Statistical Authority (ELSTAT) board member Zoi Georganta (pictured) who caused a sensation by alleging that the declared deficit for 2009 had been been massaged upwards in November 2010 by her boss Andreas Georgiou.

And lest any nasty male chauvinists out there want to dismiss Zoi Georganta as a lone madwoman, I should point out that six Elstat board members had been dismissed in June 2011 after clashing with Elstat chairman Georgiou. They too had spotted the Tippex liberally applied to the ‘revised’ data.

Says one Athenian source, “She was trying to tell everyone forever that she knew Pasok purposely sabotaged Greece at Germany’s request, to ensure our cooperation”. Zoi was off the money with her motive guesswork, but she was in no doubt that the figures had been got at and inflated. Investigators visited her, after which everything died down. It was said that she had changed her statement.

But now comes our old friend Evangelo Venizelos – author of the legislation to grant legal indemnity to all Greek Ministers: and in September, he orders the entire ELSTAT board (including Georganta) to resign….except the key villain, Andreas Georgiou. Just fancy that. And when Evangelo gets involved in the mire, you know a sh*tload of mire is being covered over with carefully planted (and watered) roses.

But given that Ms Georganta was not the only whistleblower at ELSTAT, the rumour persisted…albeit (as usual) without any awareness of this spreading scandal in the Western MSM. It persisted, in fact, throughout the eurozone. And in March this year, Zoi found an unlikely ally.

Joachin Almunia Amann is a former left-wing Spanish politician, and now a prominent European Commissioner. Currently responsible for Competition, in February 2010 – a crucial moment in the debt-inflation plot – he was the European Comissioner for Economic & Monetary affairs…the role now owned by Olli Rehn. Amann was thus in an unparalleled position to watch Greco-EU-German affairs unfold between the austerity announcement and then bailout agreement of 2010.

In a letter to the parliamentary committee of inquiry concerning allegations of deliberate deficit inflation of March 2012, Amman crucially stated that, ‘there was no obligation on each national statistical authority in the EU to follow Eurostat’s ESA 95 code on the inclusion of public utility accounts in the deficit’. But for some reason – suddenly – ELSTAT had decided to add it into the pot. In remarking upon this, Joachin defended the six resignees from 2011. (And thus, by implication, Zoi Georganta as well).

Highly significantly, Amann also observed that had the 2009 warnings from his Commission been been enacted even as late as Papandreou’s arrival, ‘the measures would have succeeded if they had been properly and promptly implemented without any need for a bailout’.

So it was that last Monday (June 25th 2012) Zoi appeared before the deficit Enquiry in Parliament. Having been the unhappy subject of quite a bit of interior ministry ‘attention’ over the last year, Ms Georganta decided to be more circumspect. She dumped on 2009 finance minister Giorgos Papaconstantinou, observing, “I have investigated the matter and found that he does not have any great experience with statistics, with economic issues. In my view, you cannot appoint such an inexperienced minister at such a crucial time.” Unless you don’t want any trouble, in which case you do. But she stuck to her guns about the debt being inflated, telling the Enquiry that the deficit for 2009 should have been 12.5% of GDP – and could have easily been brought to below 10 percent with immediate measures.

Crucially, Georganta, a professor of econometrics, confirmed to Greek media representatives that ELSTAT intentionally, and after being pressured by Eurostat (the EU’s tame body), inflated the 2009 revised deficit from roughly 12-13% to 15.8% using “non-scientific methods in order to justify the adoption of more and tougher fiscal measures in Greece.”

What conclusions should we draw?

Three years ago, I wouldn’t have touched a story like this with a bargepole. But since studying both the EU and the Greek tragedy in more detail in recent times, I’ve realised that a well-documented and sourced account, without collusion and based on trusted informants and mainstream Greek media reports, is more likely to be true than invention. Of course, a great many players on the geopolitical and european stages have agendas, axes to grind, and scores to settle. But when something fits, makes sense, and is in line with other discoveries made along the way….well, all I can say is that absolutely nothing surprises me any more.

So the conclusion I draw is that we have here opportunity, motive, testimony, media reports, personal ‘form’ and a jigsaw piece that fits very well with others upon which The Slog has reported over the last two years. In order to illustrate that assertion, let me introduce as a quartet four people I believe to have been pivotal in recent-history world affairs: Tim Geithner, Dominique Strauss-Kahn, Angela Merkel, and George Papandreou.

I will start by relaying this email content received from a heavyweight player in Greek affairs and a student of geopolitics. I’m sure he wouldn’t mind the tiny changes I’ve made here and there to improve his English grammar. He observes:

‘One very important person, I believe, is Strauss-Kahn. His connection with Papandreou is well known, and verified by his interview where he admitted that he had discussions with Papandreou a lot before the Greek door opening to the IMF [in 2010]. The point here is not the connection of S-K with Papandreou, but the timing of the dalliance which he was accused. I believe that S-K was at that point an ally of Merkel.

‘By the end of 2009, the international economic balance seemed to have permanently changed, and a new scene brought to being in which Europe was in a better position than the U.S. At the hub of the wheel there is Germany, asserting the role of economic power model, which could assure international monetary and financial stability.

‘The dramatic announcement by the Greek government of the imminent danger of bankruptcy [January 2010] opened the bag of Aeolus, revealing the weak and until then, unseen side of the euro. The Director of the International Monetary Fund, Dominique Strauss-Kahn, Minister of Commerce of France in the critical years of the early 90s when they entered the foundation for the creation of the euro, and Finance Minister of Germany, Schäuble, interior minister of Germany during secret agreements of the same period, realized that the U.S.would not let the window of opportunity that had opened be wasted – and that Greece would become the bridge for an attack on the Eurozone.’

The source is not a million miles away from where I am on this one. That is, DSK was taken out of the game for geopolitical reasons, and replaced with “our gal” (as Geithner calls her) Christine Lagarde. You can read several pieces related to this shift in my dedicated page here, The Strauss-Kahn Waltz. Left without an ally in establishing the hegemony of Europe at America’s expense, both Merkel and Schäuble now became deeply (and rightly) suspicious of the Geithner ‘amputation plot’ hatched in New York between late 2011 and early 2012 by a combo of Wall Street, Pentagon and Fed Treasury appointees. You can read more on this at US Bankers given a timetable for Greek Default and also at Greek default planners falling out over firewall.

The Americans hoped to gain a firewall, military bases and access to precious raw materials by befriending a post-euro Greece. That ambition still remains, but what the story unveiled above shows is that Angela Merkel and Wolfgang Schäuble are more than worthy opponents in the murky world of geopolitical jockeying.

I would like to thank all the American, French, German, British, Canadian and Greek sources who contributed so generously to helping my feeble brain understand at least some of the above events and allegations. I would also like to offer special thanks to one credit dealer and two journalists, without whose refereeing skills it would’ve remained a mystifying case of underwater rugby without the ball.

Oh geez… I don’t believe I have to state what is the most utterly obvious details in the world.. How much Germany is directly exposed to Greek debt TODAY is far far different from 2009 also… 2. You are not adding the obvious indirect exposure of debt from French, Spanish, Italian, and many many other banks to the German lenders. This is embarrassing for you that I have to point this out as it is fundamental to any sanguine discussion on this subject… I am quite certain that if there was no exposure (direct or indirect) on Germany’s part they would have thrown us to the wolves a long time ago… I have never known Germans to be loose with their money unless there is something in it for them… like the 45 billion made on loan interest alone since 2009 (and that is growing). Germans are far too responsible to gamble with their money… if they are helping Greece at all, they have their reasons. About your other two links? I never refuted those statements. Just how Germany is not exposed to Greek debt… which even a child would know the answer to… God, this is beneath me.

Oh… and for your racist insult based on my ethnicity?… You backwards barbarian… I imagine your people were still trying to start fire while mine were inventing the basic sciences that the whole world was founded on, and continues to progress on. From this Greek to you… screw yourself!… most ironically, your insult actually only applies to you who did not count up the relevant figures in the first place. It’s sad that your ignorance and prejudice not only blind you to the truth but make you quite an assh0le as well.

Sir… you are utterly wrong. If you go to the AMERICAN GOVERNMENT page for year to date information on trading volumes and with whom that I already provided you can clearly count (I hope) that the EU’s combined combination still adds up to less than the 16% that Canada is listed at… I have given you the actual American info… as long as you can add, then this conversation is over… if you can’t add or refute the actual American figures… I can’t help you.

You are correct, but our partners in EU & EZ they certainly do know all these, that‘s why they “appoint” always their collaborators e.g. Simitis + Papadimos covered up with Goldman Sacks our deficit with those derivatives so there was a help to get into the EZ, then Papadimos got his award he was appointed PM to save us and the country.

You are clearly missing the facts. EU-US trade volume far outweighs Canada-US trade. Canada is the single biggest COUNTRY, but the EU – being made up of SEVERAL COUNTRIES (get it now?) – has a BIGGER AMERICAN TRADE VOLUME THAN CANADA. Are you just another Greek with (deliberately) poor math skills?

Thank you for your comment MaxC. I think your way of attacking people because of their names is not the most fruitful path. It saddens me that if my fake name would John, Mary, Klaus or Bob you would value my comments more.

I am used to viewing this approach of judging arguments based on other people’s character as ad hominem. Maybe I am wrong. I have been tempted to do so but have resisted it because of my upbringing and education in classical philosophy and rhetorics.

I understand your fear of accounts where multiple people post under pseudonyms working for an ulterior motive. However, I do not operate so and it is my position that the anonymity of the internet is necessary for good political discussion.

How did come upon this dangerous idea?

Well.com and other venues, mostly closely affialiated with politically active professors. have been operating as non-anonymous discussion boards for politics for very long time, for decades, but nothing has happened or changed for the better because of them. That includes blogs, podcasts, forums etc..

We can remember, sticking to the United States and it’s cause of political change that were non-anonymously pushed — the protests against the War on Iraq, the Congressional election of 2006 for anti-war Democrats that was a failure, the 2008 vote for change in the name of Obama that did not change anything, the 2010 Tea-Party “restore our civil liberties” campaign that was betrayed after only a couple of months.

All those above campaigns had high profile pushers, all of them promised vital change. None of them delivered.

In Europe, for example in the United Kingdom the Coalition Government promised in it’s early days a return to more civil liberties but they changed their minds. Sarkozy promised a break with the state of affairs in France but turned into an American asset. In Hungary

That is why I choose to be anonymous. Leaving aside the fact that everybody else here is too anonymous for their own reasons.

Some people use the anonymity of the internet to organise parties for swingers I used it to record my own politicial thoughts and discuss them with others.

@ Mrs. or Mr. ANONYMOUS BURGUNDIAN
Due to the rigid knowledge, that for a deal are two parties, maybe more… involved, I have one -never answered- question to the commentator describing him or herself as Anonymous Burgundian.
For example a ‘’fantastic’’ brief story, just to understand my question ……. I am a submarine manufacturer and my dealers (sales forces) got me a new prosperous client (among others) in a different country. The upcoming deal sounds promising, due to the need of several new submarines in the country of the client.
I am offering my product, to a reasonable price (well equipped with complete inventory) and I try to convince them about that and how serious as well I am and honest and blab la bla.. Finally the price is accepted by the client……but he is asking (via my dealer) for ‘’something’’ …describe it as a gift!
A 10% (on top of the selling price) as I am unable to discount my excellent product, would be enough….to cover all desires – including my peoples commissions, as I was told!! This a win-win deal, I thought myself!! – not loosing my margin!!
But my margin, is less than 10% ( as I am not a medium class businessman selling sausages or beer for example – I am into the BIG business) ….. so what I have to do, is to add this amount to my selling invoice, OK…know I believe I get a DEAL!! Sorry, I was wrong …. I forgot (ME …. the honest and correct manufacturer) that I have to pay more tax on the overcharged deal. So I have to add, more than 10% ….. so much including of course the difference in the amount of the total Tax (to be paid).
Now starts the second part of the story, it is called financing…. NO PROBLEM, solution is ready, the BANKS of my country are financing the deal and because my submarine is not a product used for private use we can take also the issued (for that purpose) bonds of the clients country for payment!! Of course our banks are winning as well more than expected in the beginning! WIN – WIN for everyone!!
And NOW comes the question (to Mr. or Mrs. Anonymous Burgundian):
When the total amount of the deal is collected (in any means) what exactly is happening with the ‘’overdose’’ of the TAX collected? Am I, as an honest businessman obliged to pay it out to my TAX office, as I have collected at least 10% more money than I supposed in the beginning and the additional amount of TAX ? And when my country (which is honest as well and rigid in maters like that) is receiving as well, the amount of the overcharged TAX, what exactly is it doing with this amount? Playing the ‘’good’’ big mama at home…increasing the social welfare amounts spend for example? One more option, is that I (the honest and correct businessman), keep double books.

Any answer to that Mr. or Mrs. Anonymous from pretty Burgundy??

In any way, in my home language the fact that more money is finally COLLECTED (as a TAX difference) by the manufacturer or by its country itself is called: ‘’ Αποδοχή προϊόντος εγκλήματος’’ – and this is a legal term translated in simple English as
‘’Acceptance of a crime product’’
So next time, you speak about the ‘’Greeks’’ in general…… you better start speaking about the business partners involved in the deals, instead involving the rest of the population. They know very well, how they have to start pulling the rotten teeth’s out of the BIG mouth!!
I do not say, that we not had or will not have corrupted elite members nor politicians, but normally, it takes two parts….to complete a deal….maybe three or more sometimes!!
Just imagine….if ‘’WE GREEKS’’ start to claim & collect back…..all this accepted by others…. ‘’products’’ (that are simply raising our TTL debt – statistically as well – BUT LEGALLY NOT ACCEPTED BY THE GREEKS) !!
P.S. There was no VAT … in that kind of deals involved (just to remind you)
Kindly awaiting your reply!
But do it later…I am heading for an OUZO now.

Nobody in the EU and the EZ has voted the Germans as our leaders, their “extreme austerity measures” experiment to rectify the fiscal problem has failed everywhere in the EU, the solution is not to drive Countries to “sudden death and poverty “, they must apply other more efficient and socially acceptable measures as well.

The 3A countries of the EU&EZ have gained most of their wealth on their “exports” to the rest of us; the way EU&EC are operating finally South’s deficits are North’s surpluses.
It is most likely that soon they will face problems; some of them they are already feel it!!!

The problem is not “Fiscal” it is “Geopolitical” dominated by the “energy factor” and at the very end Germany will be again the loser as always is.
I hope that their approach will not open a painful “escape valve” for the solution of the global “fiscal crisis .

Hellas because of her “Geopolitical status” and her “Energy reserves “unfortunately still a claimed colony.

Surely the words ‘scientific methods’ when associated with accountancy is an oxymoron?

I continue to be amazed as to how the accountancy profession has got off Scot free from blame as to how we got in the financial mess we are in globally.

The world has been in awe of ‘creative accounting/financial engineering’ for too long can anybody really trust audits/accounts of countries/companies?

Regardless of my comments fine piece of research JW.

PS the site ‘TheRegister’ has interesting piece re Natwest and possible software problem, although I still cannot believe that a problem that occurred over 168 hours ago cannot have been rectified yet. In addition I remember Natwest in 70’s and certainly through the early 80’s ran the largest third party payroll service, I assume, if they still run that third party service their coffers could have been bulging as many companies pay from the early 20’s day of a month onwards add to that it is an end of a quarter for accountancy purposes.

@Burgundy… excuse me but I can only take statements from someone that will not quantify anything they say with facts very seriously. In any case, Greeks were not the ones to start this antagonism… the first volley was German magazine’s “Eurocheats” article… and the ensuing contempt from Germany came strong and quick… everywhere you looked Germans were going around talking about how we were liars, cheats, lazy, and retired at 50, etc. now… as we know from the OECD, these were lies… at the time this started the common Greek had no idea of hidden govt. debt and had nothing to do with corruption, the common Greek worked more hours than any other European and came in second to South Koreans in average hours worked, the common Greek also had the lowest average personal debt in the EU, and average retirement was 61 (now it is 67). So… WE did not begin this cycle of antagonism and we certainly did not take the problems of 2009 and turn them into the problems of 2012. If you need clarification on anything I have said… I can provide credible reference links anytime.

Especially since one of the Goldman ex-employees is the current head of the ECB — when it should have been an anti-bailout German, Weber. Especially since another one is the current Italian prime minister.

Basically the corrupt leadership and elite of Southern Europe had or has a bargain with US investment banks to hide the scope of their debt and deficit so that the local elite can plunder and the investment banks can increase their global stranglehold.

@Michel… we tried to! but when we tried to vote in an anti-bailout party? Merkel and Schauble started to openly advise Greece in the world wide media to vote for pro-euro partys… they pressured scared, and broken people to vote for the SAME liars that caused the whole mess!!! Not to mention the vote itself is legally suspect because of Pro-EU party ballot tampering (ND official just got three year sentence for tampering)… WE ARE TRYING! but the EU, Germany, IMF, even the US keep putting their noses into our business… ya’ know sorta like people that don’t really know what they are talking about, are so compelled to comment about it.

Hi, Ioannis, the whole mentality of Greece vs Germany is generated by corrupt Greek political, burecratic establishment who want to shift the blame from themselves.

They want the Greek populace, including yourself to feel that the Germans are to blame. As emotionally as possible. And then make the Germans think that the ordinary Greeks are to blame.

Thus, they can dissapear in the middle without any blame and they are hoping that with as much loot as possible.

The whole ” Germans want to bankrupt Greece” approach is false because there is nothing to take from Greece. No industry, no resources, no tax-base. What would the Germans do with Greece if they are not a lively trading partner? The whole case of German imperalism is dumb and counter-productive.

Actually, Germans benefit when the economy of Greece is healthy because then they buy German products. Hence, there is no motivation whatsoever to harm the economy of Greece

We tried to?… but German politicians intervened all over the worlds media advising us openly to vote Samaras and the Pro-Euro party’s into office. The ones responsible for lying to Germany and the rest of the world about our real debt… Pasok & New Democracy? the party’s that have run Greece into the ground? and placed the burden of saving Greece, and the EU banking system on the weakest, and poorest citizens of a destroyed country? These are the same people Germany wants us to vote back in. Also… the vote was rigged… one ND official sentenced to three years for ballot tampering, and the lawyers Bar has deemed the election legally null because of possible malfeasance through census manipulation. So… basically we tried our best to get rid of these guys and take a new direction… but “old guard” Greek politicians, Germany, the IMF, and pretty much the rest of the world intervened.

I only blame Germany for what their policies have done to Greece since 2009. Your opinion on the matter, as fantastical as it is, is written to come across as very informed… might I ask your sources? or if you could link me to any reporting that proves any aspect of what you said? I especially want to see something about how Germany was not that exposed to Greek debt… yeah, that would be interesting to see.

More Americans are waking up – and blaming Washington, not China – but far too many still take a government paycheck to question the status quo. If everyone in the USA were blaming China, they would be boycotting Wal*Mart. Far from it!

You are ignorant because you make silly, meaningless statements. If you have something of value to add… great. If you just want to run off your mouth… well, we have politicians that do that more than enough… save it please.

This article is false. The sources are made-up. The portraits of German politicians are political caricatures drawn out of apperances and not representations of their true personalities. It’s something a Greek looking to blame Germans would conjure up.

More importantly, the German banks were involved with Greek debt but not criticially enough to deserve that much attention.

Generally speaking and addressing this whole idea: the German politicians are not responsible for the corruption that has spread all over Greece. This is an old approach which tries to blame the Germans for everything wrong with Greece and how everybody is against Greece. Quite smooth but still false.

The Germans are quilty of taking advantage of the bail-out but nothing more. The truth is that Germans are naturally disposed to be against bailouts of any sort. And they were. Look at how two influentia German ECB board members resigned over the money printing and the bailouts.

That is the real inside story. Merkel would have never damaged herself with bailouts politicially if she could have avoided them. You do not know German domestic politics.

The second aspect is that you do not know how the German banking sector works. It is centered around supporting the middle-class and medium sized companies. Thus, the government and the central bank has always enough energy and assets to support any bigger banks who are exposed to foreign debt or crises. Speculation in foreign assets are a trivial part of the German banking sector. It would never have been a source of major panic in that system. German banks loan very large sums of money but most of the loans in that system are to domestic middle-sized companies that always pay back.

While external speculation are the major flow of income for French, British and American banks etc.. it is not a big deal for the Germans. If Deutsche Bank etc.. would get it’s fingers caught in a rotten pie, wouldn’t it have more easier for the German government to only bailout their own banks for roughly 30-40 billion euro than to support a much larger bailout?

Your conspiracy makes no sense. There is no motive.

The third aspect is the timing of this fake conspiracy. Is that by 2009 Greece was already sinking, it would have been too late for any operation of anykind to influence statistics. If one wanted to influence statistics in 2009 one would have started to work a decade earlier — half a decade earlier if one would really want to achieve the goal and invest seriuous energy and money into it. Besides, cabinet ministers do not evolve themselves in this kind of work. So this is a made-up fantasy from the beginning.

So no motive and no timing.

What is the realy story that everybody wants to avoid?

A country like Greece was destroyed from 1999 to 2009, that is when the reallly serious lying and luxurious living did the damage. Everything after 2009 has had no effect on its destiny. The same thing happened with the United States from 1979 to 2009. Greece from 1999 to 2009 was a miniature version of America from 1979 to 2009. The systems are very similar if you know the true inside story. Now the United States is blaming China and the Greeks are blaming Germany — even both of the scapegoats have a similar economic profiles..

I would suggest that the Greeks and the Americans take a long hard look in the mirror and then at their political elite if they want to know who corrupted them. They have allowed themselves to be dragged them to infamy and to the edge national destruction.

So this article started as a demonstrable manipulation by Germany and France to get euro citizens to save their banks to an ended up a conspiracy to replace an unfavourable IMF head? Of course, both are likely true, but posts quickly degenerate into a “Germany is a puppet state of the US” conspiracy theory.

Sorry, but since when were socialist German elites willing flunkies of the US?? Germany assuming European leadership along with Germany’s past suggest quite the opposite, one of traditional and demonstrable German-perceived superiority.

Replacing my tinfoil hat with my teutophobic hat, Germany has once again tilted European manufacturing in Germany’s favour at the expense of the rest of Europe with the EU, and as a result is perfectly placed to switch to arms production whenever such a need arises.

Please, what spurious long bows can you all draw to make the US-German puppet master-puppeteer conspiracy in that light?

And as for the US sabotaging the EU as a perceived economic threat, please, the only threat the EU represents is to its own people.

And people wonder why Greeks blame Merkel?… please, the problem Greece had in 2009 was easily solved… 3 years of German control later, and we are jumping off the buildings… and when she screws the pooch and the Euro dies, so will everyone else.

Their whole strategy is to create turmoil in the middle east and stifle Europe’s growth to keep the Eurasian continent from unity… they know that if Europe, Russia, China, and the rest of this continent started working together they’re finished.

Didn’t say that they weren’t incompetent puppets.
It is fortunate that they are,and that the puppet masters
are not as clever as they think they are.
However they do have a strategy ,and sooner or later
they will win ,unless extreme prejudice is used on them in
a counter attack.

I noticed a purple trend stretching back a couple of years on EURGBP a week or two back – against all the odds, it looked like EUR was having a crack at getting out of its death spiral. Well, no longer:

As someone remarked earlier, scheming and incompetence are not mutually exclusive, you know.

And this constant straw-manning, inflating any hint whatsoever of nefariously colluding actors into CIA/Mossad/Freemason/Illuminati/shape-shifting reptilians from the 4th density (see what I did there? ;-))… well, it’s just as tiresome as the few folks that insist that *everything* is the result of CIA/Mossad etc.

The only thing wrong with blaming them as incompetents,is
that they are all puppets.
The sneaky covert visits to the recent Bilderburg meeting
proves that fact.MSM has not of course reported on those
visits to kowtow ,but fringe media captured their arrivals and
departures on film.
Never waste a crisis as a means to usurp more power.

There is of course the alternative, simpler explanation.
1. They (govts, central bankers, the Brussels sprouts) are all completely incompetent, be they Greek, German, American or whatever
2. DSK is simply a vile scumbag who goosed the wrong chambermaid and got his just desserts without the CIA/Mossad/Freemason/Illuminati or whatever framing him
3. The Euro never could work due to its inherent design flaws but doctrinaire adherence to the vision means they will not abandon it
4. They are all powerless in the face of the impending disaster
5. Due to the combination of 1, 3 and 4 everything they try to do makes things worse.

I know this is less exciting than a financial mastermind hiding thunderbirds-style in a Batcave pulling the strings as part of a Washington plot on behalf of geo-political spooks but I suspect it is more likely than the paranoid conspiracy nonsense exhibited here. Thanks to NATO the USA already parks its mediterranean fleet in Souda bay in Crete complete with aircraft carriers and nuclear tipped cruise missiles.

@kfc1404.You are right,the markets are behaving like voters in Euroland,when given the choice in various referenda.The voters vote one way,then Brussels rearrange the vote.My point is that in a straight fight between the election rigging eurocrats and the unfettered powers of the capital assets of sloggers(et al),the result will be a financial ‘adjustment’,and Andy Murray proving there are at least 3 tennis players better than him.

That’s how the “agencies” work. Define the defects, passions and secrets of the target, and exploit them. Typical categories in the “manuals”:
The amoral government employee, The spoiled brat, The disaffected intellectual, The lonely secretary….

kfc – don’t get me wrong – i am very far from anything totalitarian, but i cannot help realizing that our “elected” politicians haven’t done much better either. Something’s not working properly in this system of “representative western democracy”.

One of the best pieces i have read from the Slog. As a Greek, i have seen all this tragedy/comedy happening, day after day… Nothing more to add except…i have a feeling that for the Americans, not letting EU/EZ become a global player is far more important than exploiting Greece’s strategic position and resources (kfc, i totally agree with your remarks).
Greece is a member of NATO. USA already has the needed bases in Greece (Suda Bay). Papandreou was totally an American puppet.
So, when all this started back in 2010, Greece was totally tied to the US.
It’s not the same now, after three years. A big portion of the population would rather see Greece going to “other” directions, especially the young and unemployed that have very little to lose.

Mo
Perhaps because they knew that, if it was offered, DSK would shag the hole in a bath.
More seriously, it’s a question that has always worried me. Part of me thinks that the Americans (born opportunists all) saw a guy they wanted rid of in a corner, and decided to poo on him bigtime.
But then, the way the Fed and the CIA groomed Lagarde for the IMF job remains deeply suspicious. And she is an American 5th Columnist, sans doute: how else could an innumerate lawyer get that job??

JW
1. First a superb piece of journalism. Thus speaks a journalist who envies you your energy and clarity of thought – even when you are completely wrong (Need to add that to forestall or cleanse the stain of brown-nosing)..
Just some points of details:
2. I don’t doubt that Giorganta – prof. of economics – appeared to have dumped on Papakonstantinou (not used to dealing with economic issues or statistics, But who leaned on her and why? Her words are so bizarre – given Papakonstantinou’s training and previous experience – it would seem her words were chosen to signal that she was somehow being forced to talk garbage. By whom and why?.
3. In Wiki:Papakonstaniou graduated from the London School of Economics (LSE), obtained a Master of Arts in Economics from New York University and a PhD in Economics from LSE.After his studies, he worked as a senior economist at the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development in Paris from 1988 to 1998.
4. More on Papakonstantinou – Michael Lewis interview in October 2010 http://www.vanityfair.com/business/features/2010/10/greeks-bearing-bonds-201010
5. A second gasp of admiration at pulling this together coherently.

With regard to DSK, the only thing I find hard to believe about the conspiracy theory, is, why did they choose such a non-descript woman to entrap him?
Or was it perhaps, such a cunning plan, that they had to show him in the light of the male equivalent of a nymphomaniac, who would attack anything in a skirt? Even someone who could not be described as a ‘femme fatale.’
@ M.de Santos, I suppose that the USA is on its own side, protecting its own interests, which is what we should be doing in UK. Won’t hold my breath on that though…..

@william: ‘the market’s patience,which is running out quickly.’
Is it? I’m not so sure. If we were to look at Monti’s statement last week when he said that the G20 had a ‘week’ to save the Euro, that week is going to pass with the Euro being saved, isn’t it?
If the markets were playing the same game they would have behaved differently this week, don’t you think? or certainly by now we would have seen some serious falls in the markets in all the markets.

So exactly whose side are the Americans on?From this not on the side of Europe and are we to side with Europe or America and her web of shits in London?
The American elite are determined to shaft the American taxpayer and the European taxpayer-how do we hold them to some sort of responsibility?
Yet the Americans inhabit the rarified atmosphere of Grosvenor Square for now whilst building an evesdropping monument south of the river and the Brits allow this-again why?
Exactly why are the Americans so determined to destroy Europe and us,is so thet thay are top dog,which they already are?
Is my target of distrust wrong?

Great insight. Now I wonder if Germany is an “ally” or stille an occupied nation of the USA/UK/F. Where is Germanies gold warehoused? Do they, after WW-II, really exercise an approved nation with a constitution ? Are they independent to oppose NWO?

Not the prettiest jigsaw I have come across, but the pieces fit perfectly. I posted some time ago that even Brussel sprouts could not be as stupid as they were determined to appear. There had to be a Machiavellian plot, if only because even the sprouts could not have created such a multiple series of disasters by accident. Or could they?

‘The U.S.would not let the window of opportunity that had opened be wasted – and that Greece would become the bridge for an attack on the Eurozone.’’
I said early last year that the US would sabotage Europe. Had political and fiscal union come to fruition, and the Euro become strong, it would have threatened the dollar hegemony. The US was always going to make sure Europe would not work.