There are friends who have been so involved in my life and support that they are more family than my blood-relatives.

Nobody can decide who his family is and I found some things you said to him quite rude. The drama is over the top, but I don't think that pretty much telling him that his relationship will not last is very nice or helpful of you.

But if they couldn't work it out, remember that wives and girlfriends may come and go, but moms - and daughters/children - are forever.

Honestly, if someone told me this, I would write off the rest of what they have to say. Girlfriends when the relationship has only lasted a month, maybe. But wives aren't permanent family? I'd like to hear my dad's response to that- their fiftieth anniversary was last month. And this GF is the mother of his child. He's got that forever tie to her.

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I would advise anyone in that circumstance to speak assuming they will stay together and the SO will hear everything you say.

Agreed. If he repeats this to GF, it's not going to end well.

I was upset by the assertion that wives aren't forever. It presupposes that divorce is around the corner, that women are disposable objects while mothers and sisters are the only constant things in a man's life. This attitude is responsible for a large number of toxic situations between a married couple and the husband's family of origin.

The "wives and girlfriends may come and go, but moms - and daughters/children - are forever" remark reminded me of something one of my husband's *former* friends told him right before our wedding, when another friend of my husband's was being a jerk to me and my husband defended me. The former friend said "Women come and go, but friends are forever". Interestingly I'm still here almost 6 years later, and the jerk friend, and the friend who made the "friends are forever" remark are no longer in our lives.

POD to the previous several posters. I would add that the comment that "daughters/children are forever" totally misses the point that the nephew's child is also the child of the GF....which would be forever....which means that if the nephew wants to have a good relationship with his child he will want to either be with the GF or be on good terms with her. I find it very disrespectful to for the OP to make her lack of respect for the mother of the child known.

But if they couldn't work it out, remember that wives and girlfriends may come and go, but moms - and daughters/children - are forever.

I'm sorry, but I think this part of your advice was, frankly, terrible. Yes, okay, girlfriends may come and go (although they will go much more quickly if Mommy is taking first priority in the relationship), but if you go into a marriage thinking that your wife is disposable and your mother is not, you might as well go right from signing the marriage certificate to drawing up the divorce papers. When you get married, you break apart from your parents and form your own family unit. This isn't to say that your parents aren't your family anymore (they are, of course), but you have now formed (or at least started to form) your own immediate family, and that family has to start to come first.

Again, the mentality that a wife is temporary and a mother isn't is just setting yourself up for problems of epic proportions.

Logged

"Follies and nonsense, whims and inconsistencies DO divert me, I own- and I laugh at them whenever I can." -Jane Austen

She just is not welcome to interact with the rest of the family, at what are considered to be family events.

For events that he is hosting, you or the rest of the family have no say in who he invites. For events that others are hosting, I agree that him inviting her is stepping over the line of etiquette

That is true. Though given the dramatic history involved with this person, I would hope that he would choose to avoid creating more, by leaving her invitation unwritten. There is no reason to include her as "family." She is most decidedly not. Nor is it fair to the rest of us, to have her forced into our orbit at every turn, when it can clearly and easily be avoided for a pleasant time to be had by all. Hers can just come at another time, WITHOUT us. It would be different, if she'd demonstrated that she could be trusted to behave - WE certainly can. But she can't, she hasn't, and she won't - ever. So why continue to force the issue and have her there? I am slowly beginning to understand why there is such a problem with so-called "family events," if he insists on not getting a clue here. Nobody wants to attend what should be a happy event - and be subjected to THAT. It's bad enough, when the person is IN the family. But when they're not? Oh, E-Hell no!

I was with you up until you started in on how his stepmother was not "family". My father and stepmother were married for 18 yrs. My relationship with her didn't just disappear because she and my father divorced. I would have no problem cutting off blood relatives who told me that she was no longer my family. She was the one who was there for 18 years. Not the other relatives.

If I were throwing a party for a child you can bet that I would be inviting my stepmother. If that meant other family didnt come, so be it, that's on them. Step Mom may not be in your Family, but it sounds like she still is someone Nephew considers family - you dont get to decide who his family is.

She just is not welcome to interact with the rest of the family, at what are considered to be family events.

For events that he is hosting, you or the rest of the family have no say in who he invites. For events that others are hosting, I agree that him inviting her is stepping over the line of etiquette

That is true. Though given the dramatic history involved with this person, I would hope that he would choose to avoid creating more, by leaving her invitation unwritten. There is no reason to include her as "family." She is most decidedly not. Nor is it fair to the rest of us, to have her forced into our orbit at every turn, when it can clearly and easily be avoided for a pleasant time to be had by all. Hers can just come at another time, WITHOUT us. It would be different, if she'd demonstrated that she could be trusted to behave - WE certainly can. But she can't, she hasn't, and she won't - ever. So why continue to force the issue and have her there? I am slowly beginning to understand why there is such a problem with so-called "family events," if he insists on not getting a clue here. Nobody wants to attend what should be a happy event - and be subjected to THAT. It's bad enough, when the person is IN the family. But when they're not? Oh, E-Hell no!

I was with you up until you started in on how his stepmother was not "family". My father and stepmother were married for 18 yrs. My relationship with her didn't just disappear because she and my father divorced. I would have no problem cutting off blood relatives who told me that she was no longer my family. She was the one who was there for 18 years. Not the other relatives.

If I were throwing a party for a child you can bet that I would be inviting my stepmother. If that meant other family didnt come, so be it, that's on them. Step Mom may not be in your Family, but it sounds like she still is someone Nephew considers family - you dont get to decide who his family is.

This. Especially the bolded from Pastry Goddess and cutejellybeen. Nephew should not have lied to folks about his stepmom being invited, but no one gets to decide who he loves as family.

I told him he needed to work it out if he can with her. It was important. But if they couldn't work it out, remember that wives and girlfriends may come and go, but moms - and daughters/children - are forever.

To answer the questions about my sister's ex-husband above: He has done anything and everything he could, to destroy the relationship my sister has or could have with her sons. There has been soooo much ugliness on his part, for so many years, that if he died tomorrow, I would probably quietly get drunk to celebrate -

First of all, your sister has proven that the first paragraph is not true: Mom will only be forever if he toes the line and turns his back on his GF.

And, even if the Ex did say horrible things about your sister, your sister's actions seem to prove he was right. There is a lot of vindictiveness on your sister's part: against her Ex, against her Ex's Ex (stepmom), against the son's GF.

Quite frankly, I wouldn't want to have anything to do with her as well.

Logged

I have enough lithium in my medicine cabinet to power three cars across a sizeable desert. Which makes me officially...Three Cars Crazy

She just is not welcome to interact with the rest of the family, at what are considered to be family events.

For events that he is hosting, you or the rest of the family have no say in who he invites. For events that others are hosting, I agree that him inviting her is stepping over the line of etiquette

That is true. Though given the dramatic history involved with this person, I would hope that he would choose to avoid creating more, by leaving her invitation unwritten. There is no reason to include her as "family." She is most decidedly not. Nor is it fair to the rest of us, to have her forced into our orbit at every turn, when it can clearly and easily be avoided for a pleasant time to be had by all. Hers can just come at another time, WITHOUT us. It would be different, if she'd demonstrated that she could be trusted to behave - WE certainly can. But she can't, she hasn't, and she won't - ever. So why continue to force the issue and have her there? I am slowly beginning to understand why there is such a problem with so-called "family events," if he insists on not getting a clue here. Nobody wants to attend what should be a happy event - and be subjected to THAT. It's bad enough, when the person is IN the family. But when they're not? Oh, E-Hell no!

I was with you up until you started in on how his stepmother was not "family". My father and stepmother were married for 18 yrs. My relationship with her didn't just disappear because she and my father divorced. I would have no problem cutting off blood relatives who told me that she was no longer my family. She was the one who was there for 18 years. Not the other relatives.

If I were throwing a party for a child you can bet that I would be inviting my stepmother. If that meant other family didnt come, so be it, that's on them. Step Mom may not be in your Family, but it sounds like she still is someone Nephew considers family - you dont get to decide who his family is.

This. Especially the bolded from Pastry Goddess and cutejellybeen. Nephew should not have lied to folks about his stepmom being invited, but no one gets to decide who he loves as family.

I think your sister has to acknowledge that this action is essentially cutting off this girl. That's your sister's choice, of course, but very few parents would let their child see someone who had cut off themselves. If I was a parent, I couldn't see ever being comfortable with that.

Unfortunately, your sister can cut off, or snub, this girl but this girl is not an island and it would be foolish to think this won't have an effect on your sister's relationship with her son and gd. It's not fair but it's the way it will work.