Draft week begins

And then, after we all wake up, about 12 hours until the Canadiens make a draft choice that culd jump-start the franchise.

There are no Sidney Crosby available in the 2012 junior crop, no players guaranteed to become superstars.

But there are promising prospects; and the Canadiens, picking third overall, should be able to grab a very-good-with-gusts-to-great player.

Pat Hickey has been assesing the top prospects in The Gazette this week.

Here are Pat’s takes on:

• Consensus top prospect Nail Yakupov, who probably won’t be there at 3.

• Ryan Murray, the top defence prospect … and a longshot to be picked by the Canadiens, even if he’s available. General manager Marc Bergevin says he’ll draft the best player available, but the Canadiens have gone D for two straight drafts, with Jarred Tinordi and Nathan Beaulieu.

• Filip Forsberg, widely touted as the safest pick in the draft … but not the most spectacular.

At HIO, we’ve been touting the virtues of Alex Galchenyuk, whom we see as the Canadiens’ chance to hit a home run with the third pick.

Bob McKenzie, who knows his stuff, describes Forsberg as “a big strong guy with a tremendous shot, a love of phsyical play and capable of playing the hard, pro-style grinding game.”

That’s great, but the Canadiens need the next Anze Kopitar, not an upgrade on Travis Moen.

Their perennial quest for a big centre could motivate the Canadiens to draft Mikhail Grigorenko, who certainly will be available at 3 because the Quebec Remparts star has sunk like a stone on many draft boards.

The kid is huge and highly-skilled. But there are concerns about Grigorenko’s compete level and the possibility he’ll end up at home, playing in the KHL.

The last great Russian playing for Patrick Roy in Quebec City was Alexander Radulov. ‘Nuff said.

941 Comments

Damien Cox does a good job of evaluating the risk of drafting a Russian player due to the amount of money the KHL can offer. No xenophobia or jingoism, just an explanation of the options offered to a Russian player.

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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

HAHA. To all the people who say Pierre McGuire knows all the prospects inside and out. He just said in a video on TSN that the habs should go after Galchenyuk because at 6′ 3″ Galchenyuk has the size they are looking for. You know why this happened? Cause this guy reads off a teleprompter and the guy who writes the script for the teleprompter doesn’t know the difference between Galchenyuk and Grigorenko. GM of the montreal canadiens… in your dreams.

I know I shouldn’t but… If he really did, that would be awesome. Since he probably doesn’t, I’d settle for him knowing their “names, ages, heights, weights, career statistics, what teams they played for, which leagues they played in, projected career paths, how they’ve lived up to projections in the past and how far away they are from playing in the NHL” as many as four days before the draft. Call me crazy but I’d like to win a few games next year!

If Grigs “really had mono”… (what sensationalist nonsense, cause all the teams looking to pick him can ask for his blood test results and if he really didn’t have it, the truth would have come out the next day) he probably dropped about 10 – 20 pounds. When I had mono my throat closed up to the size of a quarter and I could only drink food for over a month.

3 days before the draft and he doesn’t know who the different players are. Wasn’t everyone going on about how he knew the players in the CHL better than anyone? These guys should have been on his radar all year.

Has to do with the fact that 3 days before the draft he doesn’t know who the guys going in the top ten are. Also that’s wikipedia so… I can change it to whatever height I want. There was a twitter feed from the Canadiens mini combine that had him listed at 6′ 0.5″.

3 sleeps and the draft, then this place can go nuts trying to praise or complain of the first significant moves made by this new mgmt. team. MB’s honeymoon will most likely be over, if the hiring of Therrien didn’t already do so.

I myself am still happy with his early changes to mgmt. and have found a way to cope with the hiring of Therrien.

While everyone assumes that Cole-Pacioretty and Dd will be a line again…we must consider that Ples-Ak and Ak was once thought of that way…the chemistry evaporated over the summer. There is also injury to consider. The Canadiens need to have 3 second lines and a 4th line that is as good as a typical 3rd line to make the playoffs IMO. It is quite possible with our centers and with Cole and Patches, gio all being pretty consistent …if Bourque rebounds then you need only to fill two spots between the FA market, the trade market, Leblanc, our first pick this year, Moen? (amthough I think he should be the acnchor of the 4th line), Gallagher,etc. Depth is essential in todays game as the cap limits the top end talent and the amount of injuries require it be a part of any successful run anymore.

An LW is crucial. Hudler woud be a good stop-gap, but as an FA he’ll probably be aiming for big money and long-term, or take a discount and stay in Detroit. He’s probably dependable for 20 goals – 45 points, and he’s a decent playoff performer (about .5 ppg in the post-season).

So I would say yes, except I wouldn’t want to give him more than two years. You can see the Habs are moving to become a more physical team based on the hirings, and he doesn’t fit the mould.

Good idea though! Hadn’t thought of him. We certainly do need a scoring LW.

I think Moen is going to be too expensive – would love to see Staubby kept, I like his style a lot, he punches mean, not just going through the motions and he can skate. – but if he is not, I can see MB going for bigger and badder. I’m for trading Gionta cause he is small, is now injury prone and frankly Cole should be captain of this team… if we can get a first rounder for Gio – I would do it.

chances of jagr sporting a mullet this season…about 70 percent
chances of jagr using Montreal ,Pitts and the Rangers to jack up the money req’d to stay in Philly? about 104 percent
chances of jagr scoring 50 points..about 50 percent

Jagr needs 60 points in each of the next two seasons to end up 5th in all time scoring….he had 54 with the flyers last year..play him with Pleks and give him some powerplay time and he’ll score 60 points easy in that role for us.

Hard to say…Hartnell is a North/South and Jagr likes his East/West as does Pleks. He would def help the pp.

Re 24 below…I think if you sign Jagr it is as a RW (which I was for last year but not this year unless it is a one year deal)…..I think if you put Pleks with Jagr and Bourque and then gave Eller a legit winger in Gionta you might just have some depth…..maybe throw Leblanc on the LW?
The Habs need to be three scoring lines deep to compete…the cool thing is guys like Eller and Pleks are scoring threats but also very responsible defensively….somewhere though some grit needs to be added whether it be up front or on the back end it is a necessity.

I still say keep Bourque. Were those two 27 goal seasons just luck? He has the size and skills to do well. We all seem to agree that the coaching was suspect. Let him play under a new system for a whil and see what we can get out of him with Gionta & Plekanec for a while.

Go Habs Go!!

“Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

speaking of Radulov… somewhat forgotten in the draft excitement is the availability of Radulov, supposedly going cheap after his playoff misstep. The possibility of getting a potent winger cheap exists; hopefully it’ll be the Habs that acquire him and not the Leafs.. or the Bruins.. or …

Looks like a few changes upcoming simply due to roster players becoming UFA. Campoli, Moen (may be re-signed), Staubitz and Darche.
I hope only Moen and Staubitz of these 4 are retained, giving room to add some new blood to the lineup.
Dumping Gomez to Hamilton gives more cap room and ability to bid on the Parises of this season’s free agent crop.

Staubitz came here , did exactually what he was brought here to do and did it extreamly well. Except the game vs Tampa (and Malone was tossed) and he pounded another Tampa goon in the 3rd, anyone who took a dirty hit or was known to love hammering small Habs neet with Staubitz before or after any altercations occured. He deserves to be back. BTW +1 while with the Habs.

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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

If Jersey offered their late first, I would not take it for Gio. But he’s a vet and he has value so he could be a good bargaining chip.
also there is not much going on so everyone is dreaming up scenarios to pass the time.

Fair questions. I personally have little to zero interest in seeing this pick traded. First chance in years to get elite talent through the draft at forward position. Gionta has gotten a bad rap I feel. Look forward to watching him have a bounceback year.

Even if it were time to move on from Gio, makes zero sense to trade him after an injury plagued season, he needs to show he is back in form so his value is higher.

Nah dude. Florida is not going to part with Huberdeau. Bourque is worth very little on the trade market right now, best to keep him and hope he improves. This is our highest pick in decades, why is everyone trying to trade it away?? Teams win Cups by drafting well, there’s no way the Habs are trading this pick.

Forget huberdeau, Florida is not stupid, you like him a lot but guess what..so do they!

And Paranteau..I would take him for cheap but if he thinks he’s making big time money after getting 67 points, 49 of which were assists and he played with not one but TWO 30 plus goal scorers on a first line with first line minutes. No way. He ain’t getting those caliber line mates or minutes here and so I think you would be overpaying for him.

that second pararaph …you could easily insert DD’s name in there and it applies… I like DD and I understand where the rebuild mentatlity has people saying trade Pleks and keep DD…..I just can’t see it. Dd is a hockey genius, he works hard and hats off to him for doing what he does….but let’s put things into perspective…he had the teams top two wingers. I would prefer to have one gritter two way center like a Dubinsky if he really is available…..any forward who can contribute 20 goals and do the physical things Dubinsky can is someone Montreal should strongly consider

Signing Carkner if he ends up being available would be nice for the bottom 2 to add some size and nasty. I wouldn’t sign Souray and I doubt Florida would trade Huberdeau. I wouldn’t want to trade the 3rd overall to get him anyway. Send Bournival, Pulashaj and Weber to Florida if they would do it at all. I might consider signing Konopka for the 4th line, great on faceoffs, solid team guy and gritty. That would give Nattinen another year in Hamilton to progress.

Then I wish Bobo where there …I would love to have Dubinsky…get rid of Desharnais, Dubinsky and Eller as 2a and 2b centers, add in Galchenyuk and we are now a big and ultra talented team up the middle and Dubinsky provides plenty of grit. Dubinsky at 4.2 is not as bad as it seems …he is normally a 20 goal guy with 100 pim’s, can skate and will do anything to win a game….

I could even live with trading Pleks instead of Desharnais if we got Dubinsky and got decent return on Pleks from someone….this is again under the assumption we are drafting Galchenyuk or another big and talented center….Dubinsky is a much needed type of player in Montreal, he can fight, can agitate, will block a shot with his teeth and can play some offense and serious minutes to boot….he would add instant toughness without much of a drop in offense IMO….yeah he had an off year but the year before he had 54 points, 24 goals,etc…..given the other elements he brings….would love him to be a Hab

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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

warts are not that easy to get rid of…they burn…like the departure of DD would for many on here…60 point centres making under a million are rare….poor choice of words on my part but if we are drafting Galchenyuk and a guy like Dubinsky is available…I jump all over both and one of DD or Pleks becomes expendable. Eller does not have the trade value to match his potential while both Pleks and Dd could draw a decent return and Eller’s size and where he is at with his development is ahead of both Dd and Pleks at a similar age…if rebuilding is the game then I do not see Dd and Pleks as both aprt of the equation….Eller I do and Galchenyu7k or whoever? I dop then as well….the real question is how soon would Galchenyuk be ready? maybe you keep all of them for one year…

Yeah, it’s the choice of words that was arresting. I’ve seen the words ‘get rid’ used in relation to Brian Gionta lately, and now David Desharnais. People say “Get rid of Gomez, Kraperle, …” and it’s cathartic, but then they want to get rid of René Bourque, Lars Eller, next it’s Carey Price, then we should sign P.A. Parenteau so we can get rid of him because he’s no good without John Tavares….

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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

So was Desharnais until we put him betwee Cole and Pacioretty ….put Eller, Pleks or Dubisnky there and the results will be similar (but Pleks would probably have scored 75 points) …Eller likely around 50 and same for Dubisnky IMO…all hypothetical but Cole and Patches were the best forwards so I really think anyone with any playmaking ability would have scored consistently with them flanking them

I’ve always liked Dubinsky, and would be willing to take a chance on him returning to form if the price isn’t very high. High cap hit for what you get, but he’s a solid 3rd line option that can fill in on the 2nd.

Just a thought on Montreal’s draft pick… Scouts say that Grigorenko was like a “man among boys” in the Q. While Galchenyuk is a year younger than a lot of his contemporaries, including Nail Yakupov. Personally, I think that shows over-achievement on behalf of Galchenyuk, while maybe Grigorenko is successful because is has developed earlier than his competition. When they’re both in the NHL, maybe Galchenyuk will be the better choice…

Why make up or repeat nonsense. Galchenyuk is not a year younger than a lot of his contemporaries. Galchenyuk is just over four months younger than Yakupov. (Galchenyuk is listed as being older than Grigorenko).

Grigorenko played with an overager in Fredric Roy who also put up more points than Grigo did.

Thats the thing with Junior hockey… when you are talking a kid two years pre-draft, and another kid who is a 20 year old overager…. the impact on the team can be very similar. Even if the overager will never make the NHL.

Look at who led the CHL in scoring this season…. an overager in Brendan Shinnimin.

So Galchenyuk didn’t get a huge advantage playing with Yakupov, because at 17, Yakupov isn’t considerably better than the overagers Grigorenko played with.

Since it’s not being done as frequently, or maybe I’m just missing them, how about a round of 5 questions?

1.Bourque for a second round pick at the 2013 draft, yes or no?
2.New Jersey offers their late first round pick for Gionta, yes or no?
3.What Center is best suited to move to the wings, Pleks, DD or Eller?
4. In hindsight, would you have kept Roman Hamrlik on a 2 year deal at 3.5millions per?
5. Where does the Habs finish in the East next season?

1) No, I’d like to see how Bourque responds this year before throwing him out.
2) Not unless we’re committed to a full-blown ground-up rebuild.
3) Probably Eller, but I say that because DD had a phenomenal season at center.
4) Yes. Maybe we could have avoided the Kaberle pickup.
5) God knows. Optimistically, 6-8th… pessimistically, 8-12th.

1. Yes. He’s dead weight.
2. Aren’t they forfeiting their pick this year? In any case I don’t see them doing this.
3. DD
4. No. He wasn’t what we needed at the time.
5. Depends on the team. If no major changes are made, and trade #1 is done, then we are looking at last season’s last place team minus AK46 and Cammy. Won’t be pretty.

1. Of course.
2. Of course.
4. No. He would have played better than Tomas Kaberle, Chris Campoli, Yannick Weber or Raphaël Diaz, but all that would have meant is a lower draft position. He wouldn’t have been the difference maker to turn us into a contender. I wanted his minutes to go to the kids, and that happened until Chris Campoli came back and Tomas Kaberle was acquired.

Now Steve Wisniewski, there’s a guy who could have helped us sneak into the playoffs. The powerplay would have been much better, and he would have provided an edge on defence.

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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

I don’t think that about Bob McKenzie he has always been an honest reporter,so I do think it is the consensus ,compiled by the opinion of the 10 scouts interviewed.
That dosen’t mean the scouts have it in the right order though.

“That’s great, but the Canadiens need the next Anze Kopitar, not an upgrade on Travis Moen.”

really? Show some respect to forsberg , my goodness, you call yourself a professional, forsberg when drafted would instantly become, on any team, a blue chip prospects and you ruin the kid, because of your ignorance. stop following the consensus and praising these other prospects with torn acl/mcls and make a sound opinion, remember not to long ago kopitar was being shopped around out of LA because he wasnt always giving it his all, ( even had rumors to bring hm back to play with cammy)

forsberg is a very good pick and is will be way more professioal then youre writing style.

The kid plays in the 2nd level Swedish league and we’re supposed to show him respect? I’m not sure where the love comes from. He doesn’t sound like a first round choice to me. I’d take Matt Dumba, myself. Of course, I’ve been called bigoted for preferring the black, Canadian kid to the Russians. Go figure!

HABSGUARDIANANGEL, I think you may be overreacting. This is a draft class lacking in star power. There are high ranking players (Murray, Forsberg) who don’t seem show any jaw-dropping ability, but are just good all-around players. This doesn’t mean they will be bad, but if some of them were drafted next year, they may be in the 10-20 range instead of 1-5. That’s why Boone says we don’t need an upgrade on Travis Moen (not that an upgrade on Travis Moen would be BAD, but with the 3rd pick, we want a franchise player).

I don’t know what all the fuss is about – we have two good lines
cole, DD, Max-Pac (could use a #1 center for this line)
Bourque’ Pleks, Gionta (What’s wrong with that line)

our problem is the 3rd and 4th lines. very little production and we’re going nowhere with these Guys. fix those two lines and we have our self a pretty good team.

we’re not winning the cup for a few years till our young guys is good enough for the NHL so forget about it and build a playoff team for now. give these young guys time to grow and mature and we’ll have a stanley cup team in Montreal….

How could anyone show chemistry with someone like JM on the bench. you guys want to win a cup right away. keep on dreamin.
you’ll have a lot more years on your body before that happens. that’s why I’m saying. wait for the young guys. bringing in rejects won’t win you a cup. why do you think their management move them out. either because they’re not producing or it’s a money thing. why do you think Gomez and Karberles name come up all the time on this site and you want to bring in more. don’t get it.

Size is also wrong with that line. Gionta can play his heart out, he still gets knocked off the puck on a regular basis by the bigger wingers and defence. I love his heart and leadership, but he and Pleks just don’t win enough battles.

Hobie – There’s nothing wrong with bringing in a couple of older players for the time being if they’re gonna help the club make the playoffs no matter what position they play but it’s the young guys that’s gonna win us a cup and we have to be patient and wait.
like I said we don’t have a 3rd or 4th line that’s very productive and that’s our problem that’s what we have to work on. improve there and we got our self a pretty darn good team. this getting rid of Pleks, Bourque, Gionta and yes some even mentioned PK, I’m glad these guys aren’t managing the team. Boy oh Boy would we be in trouble….

Though I don’t agree with trading the #3 pick (in 3 years we’d have to trade the farm to get a player like that) what would you do if Washington came calling and offered Nicklas Backstrom and either their 11th or 16th pick?

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Being a Hab fan is like buying real estate: only over the long-haul will you appreciate the true value of your investment.

Comparing to Gomez is not a good yardstick, besides Gomez has nothing to do with this.

I just don’t like Backstrom’s contract structure, basically increasing over the span of his remaining 8 years. And his no trade clause. Also, could he continue his high scoring seasons without the powerhouse offense that the Capitals offered him?

Backstrom is not a scoring center, but mostly a playmaker.
So he’s got to have a decent set of wingers to keep the same production he’s had in Washington, where he enjoyed playing with gifted forwards. MTL does not have as many gifted forward as Washington does.

That’s not his fault, playmaking goalscoring or otherwise, he’s a #1 center. He instantly improves any of Cole, Maxpac, Gionta, or Bourque, and i can assure you they’d all love to play with him in a contract year.

WTF is up with people wanting to trade Bourque?
He’s a big, strong winger who scored 27 goals in each of his last 2 seasons. He was on pace for that same number before coming to this dysfuctional team with coaches and management who were not playing their assets correctly. I want to see Bourque for a much longer time, played properly before shipping him out for a bag of pucks!
I sure hope Bergevin doesn’t come to this site for advice.

Go Habs Go!!

“Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

Bourque showed his real colors, he is a nasty piece of work, he’s not an enforcer, nor a scrapper, and he rarely drops his gloves. All he does is play dirty until someone retaliates and we get the retaliatory penalty instead. Trade Bourque, we’ve had enough of these games where we lose by just one goal cause some so called tough guy got a “pansy” retaliatory penalty like hooking. As if having one tough guy in Emelin who can’t fight to save his life is bad enough after we had the yogurt eating Laraques. Bourque was acquired to be tough, all he ended up being was the dirty player he really is.

Hey, you shoulda heard the Calgary media and Calgary fans sigh a breath of relief, not only were they getting a superstar name Cammy, but they got rid of their “dirty” player who would get penalties at the worst times…… and inconsistent play, we thought L’Artiste and any Russian rental player shows up every other game, Bourque showed he is also lazy and inconsistent like he was before he came to Montreal.

was getting rid of AK a mistake? same mold- cut your losses right now and get rid of him…there is a reason he was shipped out of Calgary – and it wasn’t because he was an excellent power forward…poor work ethic, effort and attitude but I would hardly label him as dirty.

I was thinking, what if Ted Bird was right yesterday? He was talking to Bob Mckenzie in the morning show of maybe making a trade with the Oilers if they do happen to get Yakupov as their #1 pick come Draft.

Maybe. I’m not saying he is absolutely right, but the Habs could make this as a longshot.

Detroit already expressed interest in acquiring Weber and/or Suter. Weber already agreed that if it will happen and Ken Holland will offer him a contract, he may sign w/ the Red Wings. If Weber’s not available (if only he didn’t bashed Zetterberg’s face in the boards during the last playoffs), the most likely, Suter is the best choice they have. I think this is the logical move to them since Nicklas Lidström retired and they need a DMan who may fill that role he did there.

In terms of the Canadiens, I do agree that we have a strong blue line both veterans and young prospects. However, the team can put up a more tight defence by either acquiring some of Preds talent pool. And to make the team more robust, shave off some liabilites (like Kaberle) as a ‘long term’ solution.

I believe Detroit and Montreal are really trying their best in adding more depth and grit in their lineups. Both teams have long term goals.

Please provide a link to an article or source that shows Detroit expressing interest in acquiring Shea Weber. They can’t come out and say it while he’s under contract, that would be tampering and would cost them dearly. If you mean there are rumours they are trying to trade for Shea Weber, I’d like to see the source of that as well. In any case, every team would be kicking the tires trying to see if they could get a defenceman of his caliber. Even in the case of Ryan Suter, teams are not allowed to approach him or express interest until July 1. All the rumours you read are based on guesswork of what team has capspace and a reasonable shot at signing Ryan Suter.

Also, my original reply to your post was in response to your statement that Shea Weber had expressed interest in joining the Red Wings. I’ve never read that, please provide a source on that as well.

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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

This is what I’ve been saying most of the time. Kaberle should be sent to Europe. Good that you mentioned Campoli. I say, trade this guy too and get a young defenceman from the Bulldogs. What about St. Denis, this guy should do just well.

I actually want to see MB and his entire staff get a sizeable test sample with a guy like Bourque before trading him. He is coming off one of his least productive seasons, to trade him now would be to get the lowest return as we would have bought high and sold low.

The Habs team last year was a complete mess from Top to Bottom (Mgmt. to Coaching to Players).

PG halfway through the year has a moment of enlightenment and finally decides it is time to add size to the lineup, but doesn’t complete that transition as our defence was geared for the lightweight division and not the heavyweight.

I look forward to seeing how MB shapes the backend this off season, and I also look forward to seeing how perhaps Bourque playing with Gionta and Plex could motivate him. A veteran like Gio who fights in the corner and is the captain should provide some motivation.

I don’t think the roster is ready to compete for the cup, but the roster should be able to compete for a playoff spot. And then in 1-2 more seasons we start adding what we hope are bluechip prospects like Beaulieu, Tinordi, Gallagher and maybe Galchenyuk.

I wil probably still be called crazy on here, but I still want to deal this pick to get a cant miss guy like Nail. I’d give the #3, one of our seconds this year (later one), one of our seconds next year, and a decent prospect to move up to #1 and get Nail. Edm can then get their Dman at #3 and a few more quality picks to go with it.

That is way too much to give up for the Nail. next years draft is supposed to be very strong and from what the final Rankings are, he is not that much ahead of the next top 4. Give them the number 3 and Weber. If they want Murray and think they can get him at 3, they just picked up an extra player. I personally think Galchenyuk would be the one.

44har48, you’re absolutely right about being called crazy here. However, what I’ve heard is that Galchenyuk could be Yakupov’s equal or even his better, had he played a whole year. It doesn’t seem worth it to give up an asset to get a player that projects to be about the same as we’ll get in the 3rd spot.

Why do I have this bad feeling that the Habs will pass on Grigorenko, and he is going to turn out to be the next Malkin? And before anyone slings anything in my direction, this is just a feeling, I don’t claim to have any knowledge on any of the prospects other than what I’ve read. Haven’t seen any of them play.

I have that same feeling. I try to comfort myself by saying that no matter who we take between Grig and Galchenyuk, provided they stay healthy we are gonna get a really good player. To tell you the truth, Grigorenko impressed me in his interview at the combine more than anyone else as a level headed guy. Didn’t seem to me to be a guy who would bolt to the KHL next year, or when asked to play 3rd line duty.

From everything I read on him, I think that he is getting a bad rap. If this kid was Canadian, the same people who call him lazy and question his ankle injury and mono, they would be saying that he has amazing character for playing through those two things.

Could be, but how much direct experience with someone would you need before calling them a “floater” or suggesting they didn’t “really” have mono.

I’m not suggesting they’re not experts, but that they are going on very little data here.

And possibly letting their judgement be colored by prejudice.

There was nothing wrong with Grigo’s regular season either. He scored as a top prospect should. And his “failed” playoffs was still 10 points in 11 games.
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Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

I think you guys are talking about different players. The player returning from the concussion was Yakupov

However my only advice is that no proper scout makes their decisions based on a stat sheet, or Corey Locke would have gone first overall.

If you watched Galchenyuk in the playoffs, you saw a physically involved player, whose knee and skating looked great, who played limited minutes as he needed to regain his endurance after a long layoff, and who could have put up far more than 4 points if not for some stellar goaltending by Saginaw. Defensively you saw a player who was fine in his assignments, and most of his -8 was as a result of errors made by his teammates.

In Grigorenko’s playoffs, you saw a passive player who shied away from contact, looked lethargic, and played on the perimeter. Now don’t get me wrong here… he had mono, so that explains his play to me. I like Grigo alot and would take him if Galchenyuk and Yakupov go 1-2. But there is definetely more here than the stats suggest.

Grigo also got the majority of those stats in his first round series against a very weak Drummondville club. When he played against MacKinnon and Halifax, the points dried up.

You inferred a different message than I did from McKenzie and that line. I didn’t think he was saying it sarcastically. To me, it was simply, if you do believe this is the case, then you will disregard the latter part of the year and take him higher.

If anything, BM was just trying to make the scouts’ consensus more reasonable. He’ll have a hard time tapping his scouting sources in the future if he rags on their rankings on air. He’s just conveying info, not making his own judgement.

Kids mature at various rates. The teams have had a good look at him now and they see what they see. Five years from now he might have changed because adversity can forge character. Right now though he is what he is. The hype surrounding him (Roy, Quebec, Canadiens) all season didn’t help his development and he may very well be injured or ill. But the guys paid to make decisions smiled, chatted, and watched him like a hawk as he didn’t take the tests.

Yeah right. TSN is nothing but a hype machine. 2 top Russian/Russian-American players:

1) Had a dip in his stats after tweaking his ankle towards the end of the season, but still put up better numbers than the top ranked Yakupov in points and plus minus. Also put up 10 points in 11 playoff games with mono. So he’s lazy and unmotivated.

2) Had a terrifying ACL injury, which can end careers… See Mr. Markov. Came back and put up 4 points in 8 games with a minus 8 +/- and he’s deemed a stand up guy and a top 5 pick.

I’m not saying that Grigorenko is the best available guy for the habs, but I am saying that it’s not worth drinking TSNs cool-aid. They get hot about certain flashy players because it helps them sell TSN first and Hockey second.

They don’t have to sign the RFA’s for quite a while. I believe the qualifying offers have to be tendered by July 1st, but those generally don’t mean a lot, just that the team intends to negotiate with the player. I don’t see either Eller signing a one-year deal, although I can see Emelin doing so as he becomes an unrestricted free agent the following summer if I recall correctly.

Remember last year? And the year before that? Every single year people freak out about how long it takes to sign RFAs and every year each RFA signs before camp. There is no leverage for an RFA. They’ll be here.

Galchenyuk finished 20 points behind Yakupov despite being the center on the same line.

Galchenyuk has a lot of potential, but he really wasn’t being placed “right there” with Yakupov until the past couple of months, which is somewhat odd given that he missed the whole season. A player like Slater Koekkoek saw his draft ranking stall by missing most of the season, but it seems to be helping Galchenyuk to not have had his own game picked apart like those of Yakupov, Grigorenko and Forsberg have this past season.

I’m not so sure I agree with that. I see a lot of second line guys in this year’s draft.

Not every draft produces more than a couple of franchise players. The 2007 draft (which this one is often compared to) produced Patrick Kane and a ton of good NHL players but few guys that could rightfully be called people you would build a franchise around.

The 2005 draft produced Sidney Crosby. Montreal fans would argue about Price being a franchise player and the Kings might argue Anze Kopitar…I’m not sure that either guy is quite to that level, although they are both very good hockey players (as is Bobby Ryan).

In 2004, Ovechkin and Malkin came up together, but the rest of the first round picks are hardly superstars.

In 2002, Nash went first overall but the next best players drafted in the first round (Bouwmeester, Lupul, Semin plus Ward and Lehtonen) are strong NHL players but it would be a stretch to say they are franchise players.

I’ll be crossing my fingers for GALCHENYUK, if not, then I’d be open to dealing the pick (as a part of a package) for an established player (but I don’t want to overpay either, so using the pick to draft a player may be the best bet). If no Galchenyuk or trading of the pick, then I’ll accept Forsberg.

To all those saying Galchenyuk might be one of those KHL risks…he’s an american of russian decent. Also, he chooses to play for team USA and not team russia. Hows that for a russian!?

Please, HiB. No one is, ever, innocent. He was found not guilty. The burden of proof on the prosecution was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. The jury was composed of 12 ‘Dancing with the Stars’ viewers, astrology buffs and homeopathy cretins. They had probably the same reasonable doubts as the OJ jury or the Casey Anthony jury.

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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

“I got my hands on Central Scouting’s final rankings, if you’re interested. I know that by this point all rankings pretty much have the same players in the first five and they just juggle around a bit. The top five, in order.

In terms of off-season acquisitions, I would like to see the Habs do the following:

(a) The Liabilities:
Send – Gomez to the Minors, NO BUYOUTS!!!
– Kaberle to a European league like Swiss Hockey or KHL.
– Bourque to be traded in exchange to either a 3rd or 4th round come next year’s draft.

(b) The needed:
two top 6 forwards – A Centre and a LW on the 2nd line.

(c) The additionals:
Possible defencemen – Nashville is like Montreal. They have good DMen for the taking. Since Shea Weber express interest in going to Detroit, I would like to have the Habs either take Ryan Suter or Hal Gill back here in Montreal.

In his time with Montreal, Kaberle was on pace for 40+ assists and 45 points. There were only 11 defencemen in the entire NHL who scored 45 points last season.

Our PP also went from ~11% without Kaberle to ~15% in games that he played.

The guy is still a valuable piece as a 3rd pairing guy with PP time.

The problem was that our coaching was pretty stupid with him last year. Why we would make a pairing of Kaberle – Campoli, I still can’t for the life of me figure out. Why you would put two defencemen together who are both puck movers, are both soft, are both defensive liabilities and play them together (with Campoli on his off side to boot), I don’t think I’ll ever understand.

Get Kaberle a stead stay at home partner, who is tough, and I think you’ll see a completely different player.

Yet despite all this, the bad pairing, the villification he’s gotten, and everything else, and playing on a 28th place team… Kaberle was a mere -6 in half a season with us.

I don’t mind Kaberle, but I can’t stand the fact that the team had 3.5 million coming off the books in Spacek, and decided to add 3 more seasons of it at a million more for a player the team didn’t really need. That said, you can’t have Weber, Campoli, Subban, Markov, Diaz, and Kaberle on the same blue line, while paying Josh Gorges 4 million a season.

Guava- kaberle had 2 more seassons after Spacek. He was younger, had more offensive upside and was less brittle.
We needed him at the time as the future of Markov was uncertain.
Weber was the only healthy D-Man signed beyond this season at the time.
20/20 hindsight is so easy.

______________________________________________________
“It’s just an opinion – I could be wrong”

I agree with others. We have nothing but wimps mainly on our defense. We have no scrappers, no fighters, no tough guys, although we have a dirty player in Emelin and Bourque.

We need some grit on our defense. Then Kaberle would be in his prime, in fact if we had another whole team of real NHL players, this bunch that Gauthier signed could actually score goals and win…..kinda makes you wonder what we are doing cheering for a team of wimps who can only shine if Momma tells the bad boys to play nice.

Seriously guys? You’re defending Kaberle? He’s atrocious defensively and isn’t really what we need. There’s a reason why Boston and Carolina let him go..because he’s f’ing horrible! You can pair this guy up with Bobby Orr and it wouldn’t make a difference. There were far better options out there and trading for him when Spacek was about to come off the books is just shit management. Now we’re on the hook for 2 more years with this guy!

b) We can’t acquire two Top 6 forwards without creating giant holes elsewhere in the roster or the organization. These players will be acquired organically, through drafting and development, not in off-season trades. We don’t have the trading chips to get these guys, we don’t have the depth.

c) Not sure where you get your info regarding Shea Weber, I’ve never read anywhere that he stated he wanted to go to Detroit. At most he’s shown reluctance to sign a long term deal in Nashville.

To ‘take’ Ryan Suter will involve a massive contract, we’ll be in a bidding war with 20 or so other teams.

Not sure how Hal Gill figures in the same conversation as Ryan Suter and Shea Weber.

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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

Not only that, but if Montreal were to pick up 2 top 6 forwards, then Gionta would have to play on the 3rd line, Cole DD, Pacman, and Pleks would not be moved off of the top 6! The Habs need a real 2nd line power left winger, then they could bump Bourgue to the 3rd line and Moen, if they resign him to the 4th and the left side would be strong. If the Habs are going to keep Pleks and Gionta, they need a winger with some, skill, size and grit to help out. I still feel that with Eller and DD, the Hans can afford to trade Pleks to get that left winger, possibly with Weber and Pulashaj.

If the Habs draft Grigorenko or Galyenchuk and they are ready this up coming seaon, I would try them on the 3rd line with Avtsin and see if there is chemistry. The reports are Avtsin has a ton of skill, and he may just need elite players to bring him out. With Bourque on the left side, they would have skill, size and grit.

We have no evidence that he said anything of the sort. Please provide a source that quotes Hal Gill making negative comments about Michel Therrien. What I think is that you’re making an assumption that anonymous negative comments made to Dave Stubbs came from Mr. Gill, while that was just educated guesswork on the part of HIO posters. This is another meme that is gaining acceptance as gospel here, and is not founded in fact.
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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

I’m looking forward at this draft taking place in Pittsburgh. IMO, i would either choose:

(a) Take Galchenyuk for this 1st round just to be sure that the Habs won’t waste any effort stocking up some talent. He’s a good insurance (depending on how he would perform, if he gets here). Possibly, if Yakupov is available, the Habs should take him as a consideration too. Assuming the Oilers or the Blue Jackets won’t take him first.

or

(b) Take Grigorenko and do a trade for the Habs 1st round plus a Plekanec or Eller in exchange for either Jordan Stall from the Pens or P.A. Parenteau from the Iles.

Maybe also;

(c) Take Filip Forsberg just in case the Habs won’t be able to get either Yakupov or Galchenyuk. He’s a top prospect and I say he will be a decent taking at the draft like Galchenyuk.

I agree and would not trade Eller but I do think Stall is an upgrade. He has the skills that Plaeks has, maybe not to the same level, but he has size that Pleks does not have and plays a more gritty style. With the kids coming on the right side, I don’t know that the Habs need to sign Pareteau and if he wants to be a top 6 winger, the Habs would have to move Gionta to the 3rd line which isn’t likely so Parenteau probably wouldn’t sign in Montreal

No that is not what I said, you didn’t read the whole thing. Pleks may be a bit quicker and craftier, but Stall is as good at killing penalties, is stronger on the puck, younger and has not been given the chance on the 2nd line. That is why he has not put up more points. He is still an upgrade becuae he brings girt and size the Habs do not have at centre. Overall I think he is a better player . Maybe a bit less playmaking skill, but better in other areas.

But Eller waits till everything is perfect to shoot or score, kinda like Grigorenko’s assessment, in fact kinda like the way the habs play offensively……makes you want to say “Sh*t or get off the pot!” When will the habs ever shoot the puck on the net?

If Galchenyuk is taken by Columbus, do you take the best player available: Ryan Murray (IMO) or draft for need: Grigorenko, Forsberg…

I would take Murray. We drafted Price 5th overall when we were “set” in goal. A D core in 2 years that could consist of Gorges, PK, Emelin, Tinordi, Beaulieu and Murray would be too much to pass up. Markov could be good for another 2-5 years too.. I’m confident a good forward can be found with the 5 2nd round picks we have in the next 2 drafts..

I definitely like the idea of taking Murray. You can never have too many elite d-men. IMO it’s alot harder to acquire a superstar d-man than it is a first line center because teams rarely seem to part with their franchise d-man.

Don’t get me wrong I’m hoping we get Galchenyuk but Murray would be a great addition to the team. Markov doesn’t have many seasons left and what if he gets hurt again. D and secondary scoring was our biggest problem last year. Murray might also be NHL ready and provide immediate help to our blueline.

I agree, build from the back end. I would even try to trade down slightly and take one of the other top D available. The D would be set for years to come. For all the rest of the picks, take the best projected power forward available. If 1 of them works out = great draft.

If we do end up with Fosberg and he is indeed NHL ready, I’d love to play him with Pleks and… Jagr. (I mentioned this on the old thread…)

Assuming with get a potential top 6 forward that’s ready to make the jump straight away (big if), why not go for Jagr as a UFA to show the kid the ropes. Apparently he was quite good with the kids in Philly.

It would be a limited role for the big guy with some PP and the odd day rest, but I could see a fit for one year assuming he’s still in good shape. And that would make Pleks happy…

I am currently drinking heavily and visiting an holocaust of epic proportions on the carpenter ant population in my home. I’m sweating like a … well I dunno something that sweats a lot. Like my mother-in-law I guess. Where’s my beer?

According to reports scouts and doctors see no issues with Galchenyuk’s knee. That said, a lot of scouting reports are saying both Galcehnyuk and Teravainen have almost equal skill sets, and have the potential the be bigger impact players than Yakupov down the road.

So if you ask me, given that we have poop for centre now, and pretty much 0 depth for the position prospect wise, Galchenyuk seems like the best choice. I’d say he was the best choice whether we had depth or not to be honest.

People don’t seem to understand. Montreal won’t trade PK Subban just because they like the player they’re getting in return (unless they’re getting a star in his prime).

Subban is a hell of a talent, but in addition he’s good for the Montreal Canadiens and he’s good for multicultural Montreal, the city.

Teams assess their assets in more ways than on ice production and PK is pretty good in that department to begin with. In a semi-rebuild scenario, the Habs need a young player like PK who turns fans upside down, either by being spectacular and/or by fueling discussion and interest around the team. PK is a ticket and jersey seller, on top of being good. Why would you trade him for a pick in a presumably weak draft when you already hold a top-3 pick?

Unless PK is way worse in the room than anyone can imagine or contract talks are hell, I ‘guarantee’ PK won’t be traded for a guy who may not play with the big club next year.

Edit: in response to several suggestions about trading Subban for picks

Even though McKenzie has him at 12, I doubt Grigorenko falls out of the top 10.

Still, if I’m Bergevin, I’m scheming a plan to acquire a second, conditional pick in the first round, just in case. Develop a conversation this week with, say, Washington (both of the Habs’ second rounders and a good prospect or roster player for the 11th pick). If Grigor is still on the board at the time, pull the trigger.

I don’t know how much I’d trust him to fall that far. A big centreman with skill like him is hard to resist. The average of the rankings drops him down to #12, but all it takes is one team who likes him and ranks him much higher to snag him.

———————————
In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

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In the very long view, it is important that kids growing up in Québec love the Canadiens and recognize themselves in the team, and a bit of the team in themselves. There must be a strong, visceral, emotional connection between the fans and leurs Glorieux.

For 2nd Habs pick, go for, if still available: Nicolas Kerdiles. An American who speaks French: “As a fluent French speaker, have you thought about being drafted by the Montreal Canadiens?
“That’d be a honour because they’re such a great organization. My French speaking skills could help out there, maybe the fans would like that … I talk to my parents in French all the time over the phone, so that helps keep it sharp.”

Looks like there are two picks to choose from. Forsberg or Galchenyuk. Galchenyuk is a player that will bring scoring and excitment, Forsberg is the type of player that wins you the cup. My pick is Forsberg and he will make the team out of camp.

My take is that players from Sweden tend to be very good NHLers vs. the Russians who aside from a few exceptions, have turned out to be a bunch of talented but lazy and easily distracted children. It’s like the bright lights of North America have made these guys forget they’re supposed to play hockey 1st, not party and go clubbing like it’s a sport. If I had the choice between 2 equally ranked players, I’d definitely take the Swede over a Russian any day.

Just because Galchenyuk is a Russian name don’t assume what you don’t know. Gally was born in the US, his parents are Russian but he was born here and playing hockey in North America his whole life. He’s an American player with Russian influence but he is not from Russia.

Bob’s rankings are from a collection of pro scouts… Given that interviews and player intelligence is such a high measure of success these days, you’d have to think Fosberg as done really well in interviews and Grigs not so much.

Apparently the skill factor drops down a lot out of the top 10. Was surprised in that respect to see Grigs fall to 12. That seems too low for someone touted as a poor man’s Malkin.

I guess we’ll see on draft day. Here’s hoping MB has a bit of Holmgren in him and can make some moves if he finds the big lug falling too far. We have some prospects in the pipe. if you pick third and then could get him before 15 by moving an asset like Eller… maybe you do it… I don’t know. Our window is in 3 years. Imagine if we brought two top 6 forwards into that scenario instead of just the one.

Of course next year really features a bumper crop. Maybe we go hard tank just to be in on that action…

if Grigorenko is on the board, I doubt any team would deal for Eller (+ d prospect and a couple of 2nds maybe). The draft the Habs got McDonagh and Pacorietty was very similar in regards to how they say he talent levels off after the top ten. So it will be interesting to see what happens with those two 2nd rounders.

Interesting post and totally agree that our time is likely 3 years at least. Given that (and also not sure Eller gets it done), what about Eric Cole? Every Habs fan loves him, but you have to give something to get something.

Some people are suggesting Subban to dmonton. I love Subban, but if we could keep our three pick I would do it. Nail and Galchenyuk or Murray. Friday should be fun- aatleast until the third pick! And on a free agent note… why are the Habs not going after Nash??? Put Gomer and Kaberle in Hamilton and give the guy 11 million- he would come!

Everyone seems down on Forsberg. He sounds to me like a Kirk Muller type of player. I would be happy with that. I am sure he is not just an upgrade on Travis Moen or else he would not be ranked 3rd overall.

Hopefully Timmons knows best. Even Craig Button compared Forsberg to a poor mans Corey Perry (maybe not as nasty but still, that is good company). I just think Forsberg won’t be as bad a pick as some on here are making it sound.

Perhaps someone can solve this for me; Ryan Murray has been touted as the 1st d-man to go and a “can’t miss” prospect who played at the WHC yet he is the 8th(!) ranked d-man. If he is so good, why is he not ranked higher? Why wouldn’t Edn or CBJ take Reinhart or Dumba since they are ranked higher than Murray? Where is the disconnect here?
I for one would be happy to pick Galchenyuk, seems like a solid human with great skills and huge upward potential. Not for nothing and I hope this is not weird, but I watched a bit of the combine on TSN and they showed them measuring Galchenyuk’s thighs, dude’s got some serious tree-trunks.

Edit: I did not read the link from MacKenzie first, I was refering to the latest Craig’ List from Tsn which had Murray ranked 10th ( I think)
It would seem BM has the more likely scenario in his ranking. Still from what I have read and the jr game’s I have watched, Reinhart is the best d-man in the draft.

I think the best way to figure out who is going where, is to look at the teams need/draft history under current management.

#1 is Yakupov regardless who is picking.

#2 Columbus:
“Not only was it a terrible year for the NHL club this past season, but the prospect cupboard has been running bare for the past two seasons, particularly with John Moore and Ryan Johansen graduating to become full-time NHL players. In Boone Jenner and Memorial Cup MVP Michael Chaput, the organization has a pair of likely future NHL-caliber players, but outside of those two, they don’t have much in terms of offensive talent. Cam Atkinson and Matt Calvert have already shown the ability to play at the NHL level, but not with a modicum of consistency.

If the organization did have any strength, it would be on the blue line. It seems every year the club has a new batch of talented defensemen making the leap to the pro ranks – over the past two years they’ve seen Cody Goloubef, John Moore, David Savard, and Dalton Prout turn pro – and 2012-13 will be no different. One of the top defensive defensemen in all of college hockey, Will Weber will be joining the Springfield Falcons next year, as will WHL defenseman Austin Madaisky.”

Sounds to me like they are going to want a forward…my opinion it’s either Galchenyuk or Forsberg. The article says they like to take guys playing (or planning on it) in North America. So sounds like Galchenyuk to me.

Crossing my fingers that I’m wrong. Maybe Zeredev will have scared them off of Russians (not likely)…

He has Grigorenko listed 12th while Galchenyuk comes in at #5. That pretty well does it for me.

The only real question is who will go 2nd. If it turns out to be Galchenyuk, then Montreal will be looking at Murray or Forsberg (assuming Yakupov goes first overall).

It really doesn’t matter which two teams select first or second, it’s really about the players and Montreal’s options.

For those, like Ed Lopaz, who were hoping for Matheson with Montreal’s 2nd overall pick, I think you might want to go back to the drawing board. I doubt he will still be around at #33. Other players who may well be available at #33 include Frk, Samuelsson, Thrower, Kerdiles and Jankowski.

Respectfully disagree with the ‘you can always get a goalie’ remark. I don’t think you easily find goalies who can handle Price’s workload and perform the way he does. You pretty much need to be very lucky.

I agree that the Habs need an elite centre, but Price was a good pick. When prospects can become busts, especially young goaltenders, it’s quite remarkable that Price turned out the way he did – in a market like Montreal notwithstanding.

I respectfully disagree. I think Price has had a bigger impact on this team than Kopitar would have.
Let’s remember how much this team improved under Gainey as well, despite his mistakes.
That seems to be forgotten regularly.

Go Habs Go!!

“Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock