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Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

This discussion makes me think of what people must have said when Galileo informed people that the world was actually round. Since EVERYONE could just look around and SEE that the world looked flat, it must be so. It took some one with evidence from outside the local view to prove the assertion.

Here in North America, we have been experience substantially lower temps this winter than elsewhere around the world. That is pretty easy to check on the Weather Channel.

It is also easy to find images that show that glaciers in North America and around the world have been steadily retreating for more than a decade.
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The measurable fact that the oceans are rising is a bit harder to see ... unless you live near a coastline.
The measurable fact that the oceans are warmer is also a bit harder to see because it takes satellites to make the measurements.

I'm not sure how many data points are needed to establish a causal relationship beyond a coincidence.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

Originally Posted by AzaleaHill

This discussion makes me think of what people must have said when Galileo informed people that the world was actually round. Since EVERYONE could just look around and SEE that the world looked flat, it must be so. It took some one with evidence from outside the local view to prove the assertion.

Here in North America, we have been experience substantially lower temps this winter than elsewhere around the world. That is pretty easy to check on the Weather Channel.

Galileo tried, mostly in vain, to inform people that the earth revolved around the sun, rather than the popular notion at the time that the earth was the center of the solar system.

He was born 2000+ years too late to inform anyone that the earth is round. Or 450 years too early. Lol

Think you might be meaning to refer to Pythagoras or Aristotle.

Hindsight is 20/10, not 20/20...
After the fact, I always know what didn't work.

Seems that Sessions has had some headwind, conspiracy people, sometimes too. Poor fellow.

"Sessions became only the second nominee to the federal judiciary in 48 years whose nomination was killed by the Senate Judiciary Committee.[33] He was quoted then as saying that the Senate on occasion had been insensitive to the rights and reputation of nominees.[44] A law clerk from the U.S. District Court in Mobile who had worked with Sessions later acknowledged the confirmation controversy, but stated that he observed Sessions as "a lawyer of the highest ethical and intellectual standards".[45]"

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

Polar bears;
I've seen arguments that polar bears are not healthy; low body weight, fat content, size of cubs, more time on land. The argument that more are counted today does not quite fit. One factor in the count is concentration, not all good news there.
When you evaluate your bees do you count the number of boxes with bees flying or do you consider the details?

I must of missed the argument that polar bear numbers were down, but I will not refute your counter argument to the point not made.

It is hard to design a safety net that some will not use as a hammock.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

Indeed few towns (be it Canada or Russia or Alaska) are overrun by bears because - no ice to hunt on due to shifting climate.
This creates high density of the bears in few single spots - obviously (near the dumps).
This is because there are zero bears in other spots where they should be - on that non-existent ice - hunting the seals.

Does it tell anything about overall population numbers?
Nothing.
Populations boom and populations crash for any old reason (over-hunting vs. ban on hunting).
Sometimes the populations crash terminally.
If there is no ice to hunt on, bears will eventually crash.
Terminally.

Does it tell about unhealthy bear/human trends?
Yes.
The bears have to scavenge the dumps (or starve to death).

.. become a hero...... I was going to write this mournful elegy for the polar bears,..
The headlines caught Zac Unger's attention, and he decided to write a book about the bears.

You want to write a book about bear?
Then you need to travel the globe and spend few years doing it so to know the subject.
(not go to the nearest bear dump with your smart phone, and make a quick conclusion and write a "book" about it and become a "hero" of whatever).

PS: it is entirely possible that some polar bear populations will benefit from the climate change; depends on the location; the unlucky populations will likely terminally crash.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

There are several times as many polar bears now as there were in the sixties. That must be inconvenient too! You as a wise man said are entitled to your opinion. You are not entitled to your own fact. Amounts of ice are increasing not shrinking.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

Originally Posted by Vance G

There are several times as many polar bears now as there were in the sixties. That must be inconvenient too! You as a wise man said are entitled to your opinion. You are not entitled to your own fact. Amounts of ice are increasing not shrinking.

Of course there are more bears now - due to hunting ban. Who is arguing?

How many bears will be in 30 years still rummaging in the dumpsters. Who knows?

Thanks Saltybee for the ice numbers.

This entire topic with the sarcastic name "How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?" should not have been even open.

Working well for some. There will be "winners" - do doubt.
Not working so well for the others, however. There will be loosers - no doubt.

So why point the finger by this topic and laugh at the looser who happened to live in a less fortunate place?
What is funny when some people far from you are having calamities?
Is it cool if some coastal town will wash down?

The decline of winter ice coverage does not give a good indication of Arctic warming. The Arctic icepack expands EVERY winter due to the cold temperatures so it is not the coverage that is the crucial factor but the depth and age of the ice that is the critical issue. (Old, deep ice takes longer to melt than thin, new ice.) The summer time minimum is a more revealing statistic since it shows the borders of the old ice.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

Writing in the journal Scientific Reports the researchers say they have found evidence of an explosion in the same league as the eruption of Krakatau in 1883. It was one of the biggest volcanic catastrophes in recorded history. The shock waves traveled round the world three and a half times. The huge amounts of particles thrown into the atmosphere caused global temperatures to fall for several years as the ashes blocked sunlight.

The Skye volcano "was a massive climate disturbance that caused global temperatures to shoot up by 8C, four times the increase predicted to create huge problems for present-day humans."

Since the climate returned to normal 5 years after Krakatau exploded, Skype must have been not only much larger but continuing over many years, if not centuries.

Yes, a massive game changer. Let's hope one of those invisible" underwater volcanoes don't decide to go massive.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

My weather is about thirty degrees below seasonal averages right now and I hear they have snow in Maui at altitudes far lower than normal. Russia is having a really rough winter. Two feet of snow in Seattle. Friend in Pennsylavania reports hard winter. Last year the redux of the Shackleton expedition sent a cruise Icebreaker to take tourist to the point where Shackleton got icebound a hundred years before. Three ice breakers got stuck in ice trying to reach and rescue that ships passengers STUCK 150 miles north of where Shackletons ship was trapped; The passengers were taken over ice to land for air evacuation. Where did all that ice come from? 30,000 scientists publicly declared that the Climate Change industry is mythology.

This does not stop the Guvmint and University Climate industries from protecting their income stream. My bees are a mile off the road thru over two feet of snow average. I want some warming.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

Re polar bears. The bit i don't get is that we have had warm periods in the past, and polar bears are still with us. Does this mean they will not go extinct this time around, or does it mean they have evolved pretty recently from other bear species?

Perhaps they will survive in small numbers but be able to recover if the earth cools again.

About the <there are more polar bears than there used to be> proposition, complete non argument when they were slaughtered in their thousands and the population has still not recovered to pre commercial hunting levels. A more honest proposition would be compare present numbers to pre commercial hunting numbers, rather than the remaining population once it was so low that commercial hunting was banned.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

Just an interesting aside, a TV doco I onced watched showed an old abandoned polar bear trap. So simple you would hardly believe. A sturdy wooden structure was built just big enough for a bear to fit it's head in. A rifle was mounted on top pointing straight down. Meat was put in the box and when the bear put it's head in the rifle was triggered, shooting the bear exactly in the brain.

Large poles were erected around about because polar bears are curious and while walking past on their migration route would see the poles from a distance and come over to investigate. There was a log hut that had the hunters living in it. Each time a bear was shot a flag would go up to alert the guys in the hut and they would go and re set the trap. It was estimated that this one hunting station killed many thousands of bears, and would have generated huge profits.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

Polar bears are in no danger. They have lived thru warm cold cycles before and there is no degradation of their habitat. The seals are still there and indeed flourishing. Bears are even living to go inland and eat Snow geese eggs and young. These geese are so heavy on their habitat that they are turning the boggy grassland they graze on into shallow sheet water supporting nothing but mosquitoes. Massive food source that can be tapped once the bears learn to utilize it and a few are!

The ice is just not going away. Play explorer reinactments have run into too much ice to play their game. Glaciers in Our Glacier national Park are no longer going away. In fact there is now a new one that had previously melted. Now I see this mornings news of snow in Las Vegas Nevada! I cannot get to half of my bees because the road is impassable under two and more feet of snow. When I went to the doctor this morning it was a balmy -16F! and has warmed all the way up to -6F now. My bees are doing fine. They had flying days three weeks ago and I made sure they were stocked up. Winter wrapping is going to become more popular.

Re: How is that Global Warming thing working out for you?

This will go on for ever and ever thanks to Saul Alinski and his rules for radicals, always join and support a cause and remember the cause is not the goal but a means to the eventual goal which is power.