Comments on: Barred from Presidential Debateshttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/
a radical newsletter in the struggle for peace and social justiceSat, 27 Sep 2014 17:28:19 +0000hourly1http://wordpress.org/?v=4.1.1By: Beverlyhttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/#comment-26668
Wed, 20 Aug 2008 01:38:20 +0000http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=2536#comment-26668Example #1001 of how the Democrats are as crappy as the Republicans: Obama gets to select whom, when, where he will debate as opposed to there being a non-partisan entity to organize debates.

Example #1002: The gulag holding center (sans air conditioning) that Denver officials will use to contain protesters. Where are the Democrats (including Mr. Change Agent Obama) to demand protesters be allowed to protest at venues and exercise their right to protest and free speech?

So much for democray. Vote Nader or McKinney.

]]>By: Beverlyhttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/#comment-26667
Wed, 20 Aug 2008 01:32:33 +0000http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=2536#comment-26667So now Obama gets to pick and choose whom/when/where he will debate. Who died and made made him king? Shouldn’t non-partisan entities have a say in organizing debate forums?

I also saw the un-air conditioned, detention center gulag Denver will use for protesters at the Demowitic convention. Shouldn’t some so-called progressive/liberal/democracy cheerleaders, including Change Man Obama, demand protesters be allowed at the venues and anywhere else to exercise their right to protest in this here so-called land of the free/freedom of speech loving USA?

I guess not. So much for “democracy.” Vote Nader or McKinney or just stay home.

]]>By: r jackowskihttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/#comment-26610
Tue, 19 Aug 2008 12:42:03 +0000http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=2536#comment-26610If the other candidates were Statesmen, instead of self-serving politicians, they would refuse to participate in any debate which did not include ALL candidates.
VOTE NADER, please!
]]>By: Joseph Danisonhttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/#comment-26595
Tue, 19 Aug 2008 03:18:09 +0000http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=2536#comment-26595And if millions of Americans become engaged now, what will happen, Ralph? A bit of discomfort in the duopoly, maybe, because it would be such a surprise, but it could be managed and the programmed spectacle of antidemocracy would proceed to its predetermined conclusion. Obummer will make history as the first black president and nothing will change.

I’m voting for you, Ralph, as opposed to not voting at all, just to say that I didn’t vote for either of the empty vessels that have been selected for the electorate. We have been offered a choice between two approaches to the soft issues, a pseudo conservative and a pseudo liberal. We are not being asked for our opinion on empire, militarism, financial regulation, unconstitutional legislation, impeachment and/or prosecution of government criminals, or anything else of moment.

As clients of the state we are simply being queried about the service provided.It is not even a performance review of our corporate/state provider. How to satisfy consumer needs is the only contention. Health care of some kind. Are you being served?

Obummer said something amusing when asked what justices he wouldn’t have nominated for the big court. Thomas and Scalia he didn’t like. He wanted justices who would support the separation of powers. This would lead some to believe that he’s not in favor of the imperial presidency and that he’s going to downsize the presidency to something less autocratic. Uh huh. I’ve never heard him criticize the Patriot Act, the MilComm Act, the John Warner Fuck America up the Ass Act, and so on. McCain’s response to the same question was to eliminate every Liberal member of the court in the name of the correct construction of the constitution, which the fool has never read. Neither had the viewers in the televangelist’s big tent.

There’ ll be more of this Q & A as this farce goes forward and the electorate will choose the “liberal” or the “conservative”, which is to say, corporate money with a vague & ill-defined moral concern, or corporate money with no moral concern. The results will be tallied in such a way that Obummer wins simply because the state is aware that service has fallen off and consumers need to be served a bit better. A general dissatisfaction is building in the herd. This decision was made long ago.

I’m voting for you, Ralph. Somewhere in a parallel universe, you do actually win.

]]>By: bozhidar balkashttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/#comment-26538
Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:59:40 +0000http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=2536#comment-26538what!? uncle sam give up his tw0century-old dream to possess the planet?
no, not in one thousand yrs. that means once again no presidential debates but showbiz as always before.
both candidates have a script embedded in their heads.
of course, nader’s also has a script. he wrote it himself. and it is scary.
nader’s participation in the debates wld have signified onset of democratization process in US.
the funni uncle fears more democratization of US than even communism.
actually the uncle welcomes communism in korea and cuba.
that’s why cuba is still communist.
]]>By: steve connhttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/#comment-26535
Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:34:15 +0000http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=2536#comment-26535If Obama does not take on the issues raised by Ralph Nader, issues
which his backers fear, he will lose. The real question is whether
his corporate supporters care more about who wins or who loses or whether Nader’s issues are censored in the debate?
]]>By: Rich Griffinhttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/#comment-26531
Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:06:05 +0000http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=2536#comment-26531Ralph, I agree that you and Cynthia McKinney and anyone else who is on enough ballots to win the necessary electoral college votes should be included in the debates. Two things: I think you should debate the other independent/non-Rep.-Dem. candidates; and that we should organize MASSIVE protests (bus ‘em in, carp0ol, trains, whatever – recruit tens of thousands – IT CAN BE DONE, it just would take work!) at each of the debates.

These debates I mentioned will at the very least be televised on C-Span. I know it’s not enough but the system is SO corrupt. I want Obama AND McCain to both lose! I’ve voted for you 3 times, but this time I’m leaning towards Cynthia McKinney and the Green party, despite it’s internal problems (caused by lack of $$ and lack of access).

]]>By: Donald Hawkinshttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/#comment-26521
Sun, 17 Aug 2008 14:06:36 +0000http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=2536#comment-26521Morpheus: I imagine that right now, you’re feeling a bit like Alice. Hmm? Tumbling down the rabbit hole?
Neo: You could say that.
Morpheus: I see it in your eyes. You have the look of a man who accepts what he sees because he is expecting to wake up. Ironically, that’s not far from the truth. Do you believe in fate, Neo?
Neo: No.
Morpheus: Why not?
Neo: Because I don’t like the idea that I’m not in control of my life.
Morpheus: I know *exactly* what you mean. Let me tell you why you’re here. You’re here because you know something. What you know you can’t explain, but you feel it. You’ve felt it your entire life, that there’s something wrong with the world. You don’t know what it is, but it’s there, like a splinter in your mind, driving you mad. It is this feeling that has brought you to me. Do you know what I’m talking about?
Neo: The Matrix.
Morpheus: Do you want to know what it is?
Neo: Yes.
Morpheus: The Matrix is everywhere. It is all around us. Even now, in this very room. You can see it when you look out your window or when you turn on your television. You can feel it when you go to work… when you go to church… when you pay your taxes. It is the world that has been pulled over your eyes to blind you from the truth.
Neo: What truth?
Morpheus: That you are a slave, Neo. Like everyone else you were born into bondage. Into a prison that you cannot taste or see or touch. A prison for your mind.

Now what Robert Jensen just wrote that many will find startling.

The delusional revolution is my term for the development of sophisticated propaganda techniques in the 20th century (especially a highly emotive, image-based advertising system) that have produced in the bulk of the population (especially in First World societies) a distinctly delusional state of being. Even those of us who try to resist it often can’t help but be drawn into parts of the delusion. As a culture, we collectively end up acting as if unsustainable systems can be sustained because we want them to be. Much of the culture’s story-telling — particularly through the dominant story-telling institutions, the mass media — remains committed to maintaining this delusional state. In such a culture, it becomes hard to extract oneself from that story. Robert Jensen

So Ralph, I imagine that right now, you’re feeling a bit like Alice. Hmm? Tumbling down the rabbit hole?

Well those sophisticated propaganda techniques keep people in a box with walls made of bullshit and all it takes is a thought to teardown those walls because they are not that sophisticated bullshit never is.

]]>By: Blatzhttp://dissidentvoice.org/2008/08/exclusion-from-presidential-debates/#comment-26520
Sun, 17 Aug 2008 14:03:21 +0000http://www.dissidentvoice.org/?p=2536#comment-26520One can’t pick and choose which debates they want to do when they are running for the highest office in the land. It seems Obama is doing just that. He needs to be challenged on that.
How is he able to pick and choose what debates he will or will not participate in? He can’t have his cake and eat it too but then again when you are a media darling anything is possible.
His free ride in the media has gone on too long.
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