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Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by DarkVagabond

This simply wont go anywhere and will be invariably closed as spam once someone hops in and starts spewing self-made-facts from their backside without accepting any information that opposes their view. As is customary with gaming forums.

I doubt you're wrong, I'm sure it will get ugly, if it makes it that far, still I really want to know what makes a person an idiot for not agreeing with another's extreme views.

I'd really like to hear from those who feel that way.

I would just like to point out that the part I added an underline to sounds like you are saying anyone elses views are extreem. That aside there is nothing that can explain it. Its called a fanboy or a hater depending on the situation. By definition they think anyone who doesnt think like them are morons. Though I think anyone that frequents forums are guilty of calling someone an idiot once in a while when we shouldnt. Its just alittle worse on these forums than elsewhere but it is everywhere.

It kind of reminds me of how Jesse Cox (OMFGCATA) did a stream of GW2. He also did a couple highlight videos. He spent the whole time talking about everything he liked/loved about the game but did mention how he didnt like the quest system. People completely ignored the fact he spent hours talking about what he really enjoyed and just ripped him consistantly for not likeing the questing.

Now, if person 1 bases an opinion on facts and person 2 bases an opinion that goes against the facts then yes, person 2 is an idiot. The arguments on TESO though there is no right side (for the class/turn based combat). You either like it or you dont.

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I guess after waiting all these years for a multiplayer version of Elderscrolls, the fans of the IP found out the mmo of the same name will resemble Elderscrolls in name only, departing from those things which made their games great. I could understand why fans are upset.

I would think people who love The Elderscrolls for what it is would be upset, while people who don't love it would be indifferent. What I don't understand is why use a beloved IP if you aren't going to draw on what made it great. My cynical side says a quick buck. Now...I'm a capitalist. I don't think there is anything wrong with making money. But, lately it seems like the genre has been caring too much about money and not about the love of the game or genre. I think that cynicism is starting to take hold as more people are realizing the mmo genre has stagnated into a one note band.

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Originally posted by xenogias

I would just like to point out that the part I added an underline to sounds like you are saying anyone elses views are extreem. That aside there is nothing that can explain it. Its called a fanboy or a hater depending on the situation. By definition they think anyone who doesnt think like them are morons. Though I think anyone that frequents forums are guilty of calling someone an idiot once in a while when we shouldnt. Its just alittle worse on these forums than elsewhere but it is everywhere.

It kind of reminds me of how Jesse Cox (OMFGCATA) did a stream of GW2. He also did a couple highlight videos. He spent the whole time talking about everything he liked/loved about the game but did mention how he didnt like the quest system. People completely ignored the fact he spent hours talking about what he really enjoyed and just ripped him consistantly for not likeing the questing.

Now, if person 1 bases an opinion on facts and person 2 bases an opinion that goes against the facts then yes, person 2 is an idiot. The arguments on TESO though there is no right side (for the class/turn based combat). You either like it or you dont.

No I'm not saying that, I just view someone expressing that they won't play the game due to whatever reason and bemoaning others for not feeling that way, as having extreme views.

My wording can be off at times I'm a horrible writer.

For the rest all good points. There's nothing you said here that I disagree with. It just seems really really early for fanbois and haters to exist for this game to me haha.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

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Originally posted by Terranah

I guess after waiting all these years for a multiplayer version of Elderscrolls, the fans of the IP found out the mmo of the same name will resemble Elderscrolls in name only, departing from those things which made their games great. I could understand why fans are upset.

I would think people who love The Elderscrolls for what it is would be upset, while people who don't love it would be indifferent. What I don't understand is why use a beloved IP if you aren't going to draw on what made it great. My cynical side says a quick buck. Now...I'm a capitalist. I don't think there is anything wrong with making money. But, lately it seems like the genre has been caring too much about money and not about the love of the game or genre. I think that cynicism is starting to take hold as more people are realizing the mmo genre has stagnated into a one note band.

I think one thing also clear with recent game revelations is, how slow they are to catch up to player wants and desires. Like three faction PVP, we've been asking for that since at least 2005 across the board, it took seven years for those games to finally start coming around again, at this point it doesn't seem to be at the top of many gamers priority list. Now many have moved on to wanting more freedoms, new combat systems, etc..

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

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Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by xenogias

I would just like to point out that the part I added an underline to sounds like you are saying anyone elses views are extreem. That aside there is nothing that can explain it. Its called a fanboy or a hater depending on the situation. By definition they think anyone who doesnt think like them are morons. Though I think anyone that frequents forums are guilty of calling someone an idiot once in a while when we shouldnt. Its just alittle worse on these forums than elsewhere but it is everywhere.

It kind of reminds me of how Jesse Cox (OMFGCATA) did a stream of GW2. He also did a couple highlight videos. He spent the whole time talking about everything he liked/loved about the game but did mention how he didnt like the quest system. People completely ignored the fact he spent hours talking about what he really enjoyed and just ripped him consistantly for not likeing the questing.

Now, if person 1 bases an opinion on facts and person 2 bases an opinion that goes against the facts then yes, person 2 is an idiot. The arguments on TESO though there is no right side (for the class/turn based combat). You either like it or you dont.

No I'm not saying that, I just view someone expressing that they won't play the game due to whatever reason and bemoaning others for not feeling that way, as having extreme views.

My wording can be off at times I'm a horrible writer.

For the rest all good points. There's nothing you said here that I disagree with. It just seems really really early for fanbois and haters to exist for this game to me haha.

I knew you didnt mean it that way. I usually read your posts when I see them so I have seen the agressive writing before. I kind of just wanted to point it out because you know someone will come in all butthurt and say "see see your the same!".

Oh and I think we both know that as soon as a game is announced, even if there is no information people will love it or hate it based off the name alone ;)

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Originally posted by xenogias

I knew you didnt mean it that way. I usually read your posts when I see them so I have seen the agressive writing before. I kind of just wanted to point it out because you know someone will come in all butthurt and say "see see your the same!".

Oh and I think we both know that as soon as a game is announced, even if there is no information people will love it or hate it based off the name alone ;)

HAHA, can't argue with either of those points. Yes for the agressive wording I'm guilty, I get that from everyone, even in the real world, I don't mean it that way it's just how it comes out.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

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Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by Terranah

I guess after waiting all these years for a multiplayer version of Elderscrolls, the fans of the IP found out the mmo of the same name will resemble Elderscrolls in name only, departing from those things which made their games great. I could understand why fans are upset.

I would think people who love The Elderscrolls for what it is would be upset, while people who don't love it would be indifferent. What I don't understand is why use a beloved IP if you aren't going to draw on what made it great. My cynical side says a quick buck. Now...I'm a capitalist. I don't think there is anything wrong with making money. But, lately it seems like the genre has been caring too much about money and not about the love of the game or genre. I think that cynicism is starting to take hold as more people are realizing the mmo genre has stagnated into a one note band.

I think one thing also clear with recent game revelations is, how slow they are to catch up to player wants and desires. Like three faction PVP, we've been asking for that since at least 2005 across the board, it took seven years for those games to finally start coming around again, at this point it doesn't seem to be at the top of many gamers priority list. Now many have moved on to wanting more freedoms, new combat systems, etc..

Well the three faction thing does sound interesting. And I always like to see more freedom because at heart I am more sandbox than themepark. But personally I don't like the direction mmos are going in terms of combat. Probably a lot of people will disagree with me, but for myself I left fps because those many 8 hour days finally began to take their toll on my hands, and I have no desire to return to that kind of gameplay. I am 43. Speaking honestly my reflexes are slower than they were at 26, and I'd rather rely more on strategy, tactics and brain power.

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Originally posted by Terranah

Well the three faction thing does sound interesting. And I always like to see more freedom because at heart I am more sandbox than themepark. But personally I don't like the direction mmos are going in terms of combat. Probably a lot of people will disagree with me, but for myself I left fps because those many 8 hour days finally began to take their toll on my hands, and I have no desire to return to that kind of gameplay. I am 43. Speaking honestly my reflexes are slower than they were at 26, and I'd rather rely more on strategy, tactics and brain power.

I agree with everything you said, with my condition (heart problems) at 33 I definitely prefer something a little less intense, I grew up on FPS and fighting games, so it's not that I don't like them, I just get too competitive and actually get angry at times lol, so I avoid anything that gets my blood boiling so to speak ( thank god forums don't effect me, I'd have had a third HA by now:).

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

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Heh , the only thing I want IF they are serious about a TESO , is that I don't want a mass open world , meaning thousands on a map. I want to be able to create my own private room (Diablo 1 and 2 style) and be able to play with a few friends.

If they go down the path of mass multiplayer , it will be generic like every other MMO and be forgotten.

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Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by Terranah

Well the three faction thing does sound interesting. And I always like to see more freedom because at heart I am more sandbox than themepark. But personally I don't like the direction mmos are going in terms of combat. Probably a lot of people will disagree with me, but for myself I left fps because those many 8 hour days finally began to take their toll on my hands, and I have no desire to return to that kind of gameplay. I am 43. Speaking honestly my reflexes are slower than they were at 26, and I'd rather rely more on strategy, tactics and brain power.

I agree with everything you said, with my condition (heart problems) at 33 I definitely prefer something a little less intense, I grew up on FPS and fighting games, so it's not that I don't like them, I just get too competitive and actually get angry at times lol, so I avoid anything that gets my blood boiling so to speak ( thank god forums don't effect me, I'd have had a third HA by now:).

Yeah I am competitive too and with my hands stiffening up and aching after less than an hour of fps I can no longer be competitive, so it becomes frustrating. Also, FPS has evolved too, moving away from the classic Quake style games to more team based fps with rpg elements.

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Originally posted by Terranah

Originally posted by Distopia

I agree with everything you said, with my condition (heart problems) at 33 I definitely prefer something a little less intense, I grew up on FPS and fighting games, so it's not that I don't like them, I just get too competitive and actually get angry at times lol, so I avoid anything that gets my blood boiling so to speak ( thank god forums don't effect me, I'd have had a third HA by now:).

Yeah I am competitive too and with my hands stiffening up and aching after less than an hour of fps I can no longer be competitive, so it becomes frustrating. Also, FPS has evolved too, moving away from the classic Quake style games to more team based fps with rpg elements.

Anyway, forums are the new unofficial mmo for veterans, hahaha.

Yeah I do actually prefer the new shooter mechanics employed today. Definitely adds more substance to multi-play. ANd yeah I can imagie that getting frustrating, with my meds I get a bad side effect with my joints, so I understand the pain you're referring to, I had to give up skating (both due to heart and meds), was almost about to give up playing live music, but I just can't.

At the last part so damn true lol.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

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TES wouldve been better with like a 4man coop than some MMO that restricts your classes/races. How many Elderscrolls restrict your classes and races? Thats not opinion. Why would you create a game with the name/lore of another but completely rewrite its playstyle to fit whats not in the previous games?

Youre surprised that people keep spouting thier 'opinions', but thats what makes the original elder scrolls so fun. The fact you get to make choices/opinions. This MMO seems to restrict your ability to make choices more than anything else.

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Originally posted by Distopia

It seems whenever I (or others) offer an opinion that isn't negative toward the game, there is a bombardment of responses to the tune of "but this isn't what I want from a TES MMO". Why should my opinion be based on what you want from a TES MMO?

Along with that there are also a number of responses that will sing a tune of "idiocy" because a poster isn't up in arms about things like TAB targetting, classes, etc.. Why should I care about others being sick of those things? Why should I want change if I actually prefer some of those things in an MMO (excluding class based, I do prefer skill based)?

Worst of all are those who don't understand the difference between withholding judgment, and being a sheep with wool over eye. WIthholding judgement means a person wants to see the whole picture, before offering a verdict. This is the complete opposite of the latter.

I just want to know why people think their opinion should be held by everyone, and people are mindless drones if they don't share it? Is it just trolling or what?

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Originally posted by Distopia

It seems whenever I (or others) offer an opinion that isn't negative toward the game, there is a bombardment of responses to the tune of "but this isn't what I want from a TES MMO". Why should my opinion be based on what you want from a TES MMO?

Along with that there are also a number of responses that will sing a tune of "idiocy" because a poster isn't up in arms about things like TAB targetting, classes, etc.. Why should I care about others being sick of those things? Why should I want change if I actually prefer some of those things in an MMO (excluding class based, I do prefer skill based)?

Worst of all are those who don't understand the difference between withholding judgment, and being a sheep with wool over eye. WIthholding judgement means a person wants to see the whole picture, before offering a verdict. This is the complete opposite of the latter.

I just want to know why people think their opinion should be held by everyone, and people are mindless drones if they don't share it? Is it just trolling or what?

MMOS with tab target Combat, and generic mmo art styling are ten a penny. You have such a wide selection of games to play this shouldnt of been one of them. This should of been for the crowd that dont like wow. That want more of a sandbox feel and an experience close to that found in TES. This isnt that game it is aimed at a compeltely different market. A market that is so spoilt for choice they really wont appreaciate the game for longer than 2 months. Just like SWTOR.

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Originally posted by deathshroud

MMOS with tab target Combat, and generic mmo art styling are ten a penny. You have such a wide selection of games to play this shouldnt of been one of them. This should of been for the crowd that dont like wow. That want more of a sandbox feel and an experience close to that found in TES. This isnt that game it is aimed at a compeltely different market. A market that is so spoilt for choice they really wont appreaciate the game for longer than 2 months. Just like SWTOR.

Problem with your argumentation is that you base your arguments on subjective and moral perspective but MMO games are business and as such risking millions and millions of dollars based on such arguments is unacceptable for most.

Ignoring apparent and documented nature of the subject is not going to strengthen your points.

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Originally posted by Gdemami

Originally posted by deathshroud

MMOS with tab target Combat, and generic mmo art styling are ten a penny. You have such a wide selection of games to play this shouldnt of been one of them. This should of been for the crowd that dont like wow. That want more of a sandbox feel and an experience close to that found in TES. This isnt that game it is aimed at a compeltely different market. A market that is so spoilt for choice they really wont appreaciate the game for longer than 2 months. Just like SWTOR.

Problem with your argumentation is that you base your arguments on subjective and moral perspective but MMO games are business and as such risking millions and millions of dollars based on such arguments is unacceptable for most.

Ignoring the truth is not going to strengthen your points.

The truth is that TES is a huge multi million selling franchise, Bethesda are great at making a TES style game. They know little about making an mmo, they are making a game they know little about simply because all they see is $ signs. But the issue here is they are no longer making a TES game, they are no longer making a game they have built into a multi million dollar behemoth. They are making a wow clone and like all imitators to WOW's crown. It will end badly Just like all the previous MMOs. Thier goal is to either release the game and cash in for the first 2 months of release as mcuh as they can (12o hours of gameplay??) and then let the game fade out of existance esentially fooling the fans into paying money for the game. Or they are looking to closely at WOW and zenimax think that TES makes alot of money so it should make alot of money as an mmo. porblem is it isnt going to beat WOW at its own game.

What they needed to do was, make TES into a TES mmo. not TES into a WOW mmo. When all the fans of TES were beging for multiplayer or an mmo version they werent thinking of WOW. but Zenimax obviously were.