In mid July a relative told my mother that I was in the process of placing her in a long term and taking her assets. All of which is untrue. Everyone that knows my mother knows she fears any kind of institutional care because she was raised in an orphanage. Using this lie they then took my mother to her banks and opened a joint acct at 1 and transferred the money from another to their own account, including her monthly social security check (since resolved). She was told not to answer my calls and did not.

Long story short about 12 days later I received a call from the state social worker telling me has dementia she is in the hospital,. Then a couple of days later I am told by the hospital social worker "she is of her own person".

She was told at discharge from the hospital she could either go home with me, go to long term care of adult foster care. She came home with me.

Also at her discharge the hospital did not tell me she had or has any mental illness, even though she signed the HEPPA form to allow me to discuss and have any medical records. I was given instructions to care for her broken arm, acquired while with the relative that took her money, days prior to her recent hospitalization. I DISCOVERED BY RESEARCHING SHE IS TAKING MEDICATION FOR DEMENTIA AND SCHIZOPHRENIA/BI-POLAR. I immediately contacted the hospital medical social worker who confirmed she was on this type of medication, was surprised the doctor did not come talk to me/us before discharge and told me the diagnosing doctor had minimal training in the area and is not certified.

My mother use to work with the mentally impaired and was an ombudsman for people in long term care. She knows her rights. She will not voluntarily take testing or give anyone DPOA. She believes people want to control her or put her in long term care.

She did file a police report under the "Elder Law" against the relative that took her money, most of which has been spent on a "new home". It is under investigation. I was told she will have to testify. I know she cannot do this because she does have something wrong mentally. I do not know what it is because I am not a doctor.

Why do I say this: She hallucinates, seeing things that are not there or happening. She is paranoid and trusts no one. Her events begin at dusk. She will repeatedly ask the same questions on issues that have happened that day/hour to within the last 5 or 6 years, but is able to remember events long ago. She states that the relative that did this to her lives with her. This person has not lived with her for 40 years. She also states she has not seen or talked to me for 20 years, but I spoke with her everyone 2 or 3 days (we are separated by mileage), visiting and doing repairs to her home as often as I could She often says she is not hungry, but practically licks her plate or she cannot remember if or what she ate. When I discovered she was urinating in a bucket in her bedroom she told me she was not able to hold her urine long enough to get to the bathroom. These are just a few examples of her state of mind/actions.

What do I do? I have no legal authority, she will not cooperate because of her fear. She is currently in my home but I cannot afford to financially support her and cannot ask others to continue to care for her. Quitting work to care for her is not an option for me.

She does not realize she has something wrong mentally and wants to go home after her cast is removed. She currently blames her mental state on hitting her head when she fell, but thinks she is getting better.

I need her to be diagnosed so she is cared for properly mentally, physically and financially. I also need to prove to the courts she will not be able to testify in her own behalf because it is difficult for her to remember current events unless you repeatedly remind her what happened.

On an average she has been in the hospital once a month since January. She refused to allow her medical information released to anyone, until the last hospitalization, so I do not know why she was hospitalized, However, even though she gave permission for the last hospitalization they did not tell me why she was there. Her records were requested with my mom's signature to be sent to my home but I have yet to receive them.

It has been suggested to me that I allow her to go home, knowing she will again be hospitalized. When the hospital contacts me again refuse to take her home until they have had her mentally diagnosed by a certified geriatric psychologist, even though SHE WILL NOT COOPERATE, and run the necessary tests for her medical condition. She has stated she has some medical conditions that I was not informed of and have no records of.

55 Answers

I never figured out - and don't think anybody else did either - how my great-grandmother's youngest daughter, who lived out of state, was the one who, somehow, was able to "swoop" down, put her mother in the nursing home, apparently in such a way that my grandmother, even though she was the oldest and local and took elderly people into her home as a, I think, adult foster care, couldn't get her out, or at least didn't and I think she would have if she could, then years later, after she was gone - (euthanized, as well, my mother would say, though not using that word) - and everybody except the youngest brother, who I believe was still somewhat older - seemed as if it had turned out that she had gotten most of her mother's estate - (do know my grandmother did get her nice china cabinet) as well - don't know how or what happened to the person they had taking care of them (both great-grandparents, though this was done after he passed away and granted, she was in a wheelchair, so just not real sure what it was all about, supposed could have had something to do with it but still...grandmother and mother just saw it all but they wouldn't even try to do anything, just like later with another situation

My sister in law who is an attorney working for State, started planning at least 8 yrs before my parents were euthanized by her. She had my brother transferred to the State Health Care Adm Dept (my brother also worked for State and had advanced Parkinsons. Instead of taking retirement she wanted to know all the tricks in order to take over my parent's estate. Even after efforts to save my Mother's after the sister in law ended my Dad's life, I had to borrow and dig up funds to protect my Mother, the lawyers were corrupt from day 1 to end. You won't win. You have to have money and you have to find honest lawyer specializing in wills, trust etc and that will be hard to find. Try out of town lawyer in family wills/trust. You have to do this because there is little protection for bad lawyers and bad lawyers are plentiful. Every family is different. Try the large legal colleges, law department and you might have a good opportunity. Educating yourself is the goal. My sister in law ruined our house staff, ended our primary caregiver's life because she knew everything, ended my parents lives, and ruined my sister and my lives, and my sister and I were only allowed to watch the nightmare. Elderly Protection was zero and only protected the killer. Look out if you are accused of stealing or lying because you will notice that the person doing the wrong is also setting up her script and doing the real wrong. (first signal that we ignored)

Not sure if you realize this, but the thing that your mom does late in the afternoon? That's called sundowning. Very, very common in Dementia, and probably the reason she's on an antipsychotic. Except it's not working.

Now, you could call 911 when she's hallucinating. They might see her as a danger to herself and by that means, you might get her a better psychiatric workup. Early in her course a vascular dementia, my mom had paranoid delusions and hallucinations and antipsychotics did nothing for them. They diminished over time. Of course, she was in facilities when this was happening, not at home.

Does your mom know what meds she's on? Wouldn't she like to go see a REAL psychiatrist and get rid of the inappropriate meds she was given in the hospital ? (Just trying to come up with a line for you to use)

I believe you are simply going to have to take her back home when her arm is healed. Hope for the best, but prepared with your answer the next time the social worker calls. "I don't have the means to care for my mother and she won't give me permission to use her funds for her care. The state will have to manage her affairs if it is determined that she can't ".

Thank you lealonnie1. It is obvious you have taken the journey I am beginning. I appreciate the HIPPA laws for those that are of "sound mind". Having said that I firmly believe if there is a mental disorder this law should be dismissed.

Amazes me that the medical and legal community expect a person to care for others when they are not allowed to know what it is they are getting into, caring for or the needs that person may have. Absolutely RIDICULOUS. It is mental, emotional and financial abuse to the person that is stepping up to do the right thing. It is like being on a roller coaster that never stops.

It is just a matter of time before there is another flare up and she is taken back to the hospital for care. This time I will refuse to take custody until all testing (mental and physical) is completed. If they do not want to give me the information because of HIPPA then I will not take custody again.

You need more than hugs, but we are all sending them anyway. This is a great site to help us all know that we are not alone. It also points out that no matter how bad things look, others are sharing the same problems. God bless you and help you. ALL states have departments of elder abuse. You should be checking into this. Lots of love.

I moved my elderly folks here to Colorado from Florida 4 years ago September. I watched my father hobble around, refusing to use a cane, and my mother trying to hide his disability from me. I did everything for them that they would allow, but I could not force them to do anything they should have been doing, like using a cane or a walker, or hiring some in home help. I realized I'd have to wait for some serious accident to occur before I could really 'do' anything at all. That happened on June 24, 2014 when my father fell & broke his hip. That's when a brain tumor was discovered as well. The Rehab facility would not release him back to independent living, so I had no other choice but to find an Assisted Living Facility that would accept him, with all of his issues. At that point, he agreed to sign over his assets to me,and I would pay their bills & take care of all of the finances for the rest of their lives. (Medicaid is the org that does a 5 year look-back on funds; Medicare comes with Social Security, regardless of how much worth a person has). So.......I had to let go of what I could not control, and wait until the chit hit the fan before I could get them the help they truly needed. Now that Dad's passed, my mother is still in the Assisted Living Facility, refusing to use a cane or walker, and stumbling around like Dad did. I have no control over this either........and I know that she WILL fall one of these days & probably wind up in a similar situation to my Dad. Furthermore, she's suffering from dementia, but when I had her evaluated by the MSW, she put on The Face and convinced the woman she was 100% fine!! The MSW wound up telling ME that 'your mother is doing very well & needs no medication'!! My point is: there is only SO much a daughter can do for her parents. With you living 3 hours away, and your Mom being distrustful of you, etc., what can you realistically DO here, but wait for the phone to ring with the next round of bad news? I don't want to sound cold-hearted, certainly, but I do want to sound realistic.

The elder care situation in this country is abominable. As far as getting the docs to talk to you about your mother's medications or diagnosis, good luck. I have medical AND financial POA & still have to jump thru a ton of aggravating hoops even in order to pay a BILL....as if a thief is going to try & pay someone's medical costs. Uh huh. The last person that wouldn't talk to me because of HIPAA laws (and if I NEVER hear that word again it will be a day too soon) I hung up on, saying Fine Then, I Won't Pay The Bill, Thank You. And I didn't pay the bill. When it went to collections, I put a note on the letter saying that he'd passed away & no longer lived at this address. Good luck to THEM now, trying to get $67 out of a dead man.

Again, I wish you good luck & godspeed trying to sort through the nightmare that's known as elder care, especially with dementia..........I wouldn't wish it on a dog.

What if you pointed out to Mom how the other relatives had lied to her about you? She's afraid of them now. What if you told her getting the "check-up" would help insure they wouldn't be able to hurt her? If she asks how, tell her it will help her get some security at home or something like that. I agree with what is stated above. It's going to take a "little white lie" to get her to get the diagnosis and help she needs. And she does need it. And if you can't get her to a geriatric psychiatrist, take her to a neurologist that specializes in Alzheimer's/dementia. I know this is all overwhelming but to accomplish what you want for your Mom will take strength and perseverance. I don't envy the journey in front of ya'll. Good luck.

Definitely go for the psychiatric evaluation, You may have to wait until she is hospitalized again to do this. It is very difficult because of the way that the laws are written to have someone evaluated unless they can be deemed a danger to self. These are some very complicated issues you are dealing with. You are clearly stating that you cannot take care of her, but it is obvious that you are concerned for her safety and welfare.-So try to gently persuade her to have the evaluation because you do deeply care and you want her to have the very best chance for a good quality of life.

I just wanted to wish you the best of luck! You have a lot on your shoulders, and I know that's a understatement. All the advice given here helps a lot, and just having a support site like this is a life saver. I agree on somehow getting guardianship for mom. You know whats best for her, and having you over ANY of her decisions from this point on is whats best. I hope that she can get into a long term care facility, and I've heard from a lot of people that once they are there for awhile they adapt well, and even like their new surroundings, and make friends. I know how difficult it can be to place her there, but you said you aren't able to stay with her 24/7 due to work so sounds like best option for all. Again, best of luck! It will take some time to get it all worked out, but you will because your determined to take care of mom's best interest. Take care of yourself during the process:)

newtothis ... get ready. You know it is coming. This is my second time around. Last time all the assets were hidden when my dad died. My mother WAS aware of this happened 15 years ago. Now she does not remember.

Stressed, I am familiar with the FMLA, by which an employee can get leave from her employer. Since you wrote that you "cannot even get the doctor(s) to give me FMLA", I was confused as to why any doctors would be involved in making decisions on FMLA - that would be up to your employer. What am I missing here?

Gardenartist give a hug ... my employer is not a physician. Do not even work in the medical field. FMLA is "family medical leave act" where an employee can miss work without being reprimanded by the employer to care for a person that is ill.

sendme2help give a hug. I too believe everyone should be able to live how and where they want, not just the elderly. In 2010 I set up all her bills on auto pay so she had no worries there. Many months I have told her she can live with me, just let me know when and if you are ready.

I do not know what medical records will be released. Just asked for them in case she needed them. What is a 5150 hold? Never heard of it. I can get her RX list by accessing her RX insurance.

babalou FYI ... I live 300+ miles away, making it difficult to physically visit. However I spoke with her every 2 to 3 days and sometimes several times a day. She told me the other day she has not seen or spoken to me in 20 years and the relative that did this to her lives with her. They sure did ..40 years ago.

Re: Waiting for her medical/psychiatric records to arrive at your home? Her records, confidential psychiatric would most likely only be released to another physician. Additionally, her permission could have been instantly revoked the minute you left. Make an appointment with the doctor. Do not underestimate your mom's ability to work the system in her favor, to her own detriment.Feeling lost? It's working. Time for some tough love.P.S. I am an advocate for letting the patient choose to run their own life, as long as theg are nof a danger to themselves or others. This is hurting you, therefore, the 5150 hold to be evaluated. How do you provide for that to happen? Take her to her own home.

Back to the beginning. It seems as though you and your mom were not in close contact? And that there was not a lot of trust from her, in you, for whatever reason?Things may need to go back there. Mom may need to go back to her home. Something will occur. And this time, you will tell the powers that be that you are not available . Your mom needs a guardian appointed by the state who can force placement . Yes. It's very sad. But without your mom's cooperation ( which she can't give, not her fault) it may be the only way to go.

So many issues but first of all you need to be concerned about the health of your mom. Bring her to her PMD or get the name of a good neurologist. They will work her up and decide whether she has dementia. ( sounds to be like she has dementia with delusions which is common). Aricept is used for dementia and Risperdal is used for delusions and paranoia. Just b/c she is on risperdal does not mean she is bipolar. That is false info.Once you get a diagnoses, the dr will be able to tell you if your mother lacks capacity. If she does, you can petition for guardianship. Good luck!

Stressedinmi, A diagnosis of schizophrenia or bi-polar is serious and those ilnesses do not just arrive out of the blue without a medical history. With the HIPPA release that was signed, obtain her medical records. A short-cut to the pharmacy with a HIPPA release can possibly get her Rx history.Keep in mind that getting an accurate diagnosis by a qualified geriatric psychiatrist can also help her return to independence once treated properly.You need an advocate for mom.

Dear Stressedinmi, So sorry that you are going through this. Although it sounds harsh, that someone told you to take her home, that would be the shortest route to getting her some help, if you backed out until you were asked by APS to intervene, because then you would have written support to take to court for a conservatorship or guardianship. You are at that extremely difficult part where even if acting in good faith, you will be prevented legally every time you try, and this amidst false accusations from your mother and anyone else. Give your number to the paramedics and to her neigbbors to call you when the event happens, and it will, and you will be there. At the hospital, after transport. Do not take her home, be a part of discharge planning, then go to court with an attorney. Make your choice of living arrangements after you have legal POA authority.Consider this, she must have had presence of mind enough to file a police report.She is, like you said, experienced with all her own issues, rights, and the system.Do not worry, she has been diagnosed, you just don't know yet. What is written as the diagnosis works against you, and maybe her, unless you get her to a good geriatric psychiatrist to write the truth and to advise you. I really don't like that you can be put under this duress and manipulated by someone with a mental illness making very poor choices, until her rights to do so are taken away. She will hurt you more. You can consider calling APS to come out once you take her home, and allow the system to be her guardian. Maybe at that point, she will cooperate and trust you. Take one day at a time, one week, one hour. Can she manage with the broken arm at home over the weekend? Tell APS you have tried but have no authority to help.

I spoke with a State Elder Law Attorney. He said: Even though she was lied to by the person that got her funds and it is highly unlikely her money will be recovered in criminal court or civil court, and no charges will take place because she signed the forms, even though all the money was hers. She could recover her tangible items or the money for them if she took them to civil court. It will cost me more in gas and time off work then what she will recover for these items.

Also found out today that the sheriff and police departments involved have not even finished their reports (17 days later), yet filed anything with the prosecutor.

Yes, I know Medicare goes back 5 years, again another problem.

She has not be diagnosed by a board certified psychiatrist or similar so it is not recognized. The hospital/doctor did not even meet with me to inform me of the medication she was on. She will not cooperate to get tested. She thinks she just needed time to recover from hitting her head during the fall that broke her arm. Again another problem.

I personally have or am trying to do the right thing for her, but meet dead ends everywhere with the legal community, as well as with her. I cannot afford to hire an attorney, quit or miss work, drive 300+ miles one way to take her to appointments that will be required. I cannot even get the doctor(s) to give me FMLA. Lets not forget she was release to me "only a broken arm" .

Bottom line... no one really cares. The "Elder Laws" are a joke. The legal community, representatives for the elderly and the medical community do not want to get involved beyond finding someone to take care of the elderly when everything has gone wrong.

All these answers are good ones. I deal with "sundowners" also and the UTIs that cause irrational behavior. I found a lawyer that deals with the problems of the elderly especially the monetary problems. People think they can just transfer assets and get away with it. This is NOT true. Medicare will check back six years. You really NEED a lawyer in this case as she is in no condition to care for herself.

it sounds like you have quite a dilemma there! As for the bank account situation, something stinks just from what you described, especially since you mentioned that she was told not to answer your calls. Something is definitely suspicious about this whole thing because from your description, it sounds like someone took advantage of your mom big time. As for the other problems, you really want to get all of her records and find a good attorney who specializes in situations with the elderly. One of the first thing you going to want to do is to put the bank account back in her name and remove who all ever else is on there who happens to not be long on there. If you're in a position to do so, you may very well want to go for guardianship of your mom.

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