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Sure, let's incarcerate even more people for longer for victimless crimes (yep, getting stopped for impaired driving is victimless). Great idea. Not.

No, too much power/authority in the hands of the employer. Seems as if employers already have pretty good recourse when it comes to detecting and dealing with drug use in the workplace. See no need to make that any stronger, really.

Driving under the influence of drugs is OK? You are really making this statement?

Originally Posted by Pops

Thats called football...I dont tune in on saturdays to see their grades

Some people are born on third base and go through life thinking they hit a triple. - Barry Switzer
Life is hard; its harder when you're stupid - John Wayne

Sure, let's incarcerate even more people for longer for victimless crimes (yep, getting stopped for impaired driving is victimless). Great idea. Not.

Driving impaired isn't really victimless, I mean it's a roll of the dice if there will be a victim or not.

I think the real question regarding legalizing drugs, especially when you're talking about exquisitely engineered devices of human destruction like meth, is how much would drug use increase if we made it legal? Increased use of meth is increased human misery, not just for the users but for society who has to manage the wreckage. When we make it legal (equivalent to lowering the cost), use will increase at least somewhat. The question is how much. If we could estimate how much, and it was tolerable, I think you could get people talking seriously about legalization.

But what I'm always reminded is that alcohol is a massive scourge in our society currently, and it's legal. Sure, we tried to make it illegal once and that was an epic failure, but that was because we already had a whole widespread culture built around alcohol consumption. We couldn't put the horses back in the barn.

So you wonder, if we legalize other drugs, if usage will increase to the point where they turn out like our current major legal drug, alcohol. Because that would be pretty bad. If each one, (meth, heroin, cocaine, crack, etc) caused its own massive set of traffic fatalities, domestic violence, dependency, and so on like alcohol does today, we'd be doomed.

No problem... then I have a few requirements - no addiction support either from tax dollars, pee test for any form of assistance, driving under the influence of anything is 5 years 1st offense, employers can test daily for any drugs and can fire without cause.

Lets do the same for alcohol. I would have no problem without alcohol or other drugs.

“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”

“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”

Driving impaired isn't really victimless, I mean it's a roll of the dice if there will be a victim or not.

Well, it is victimless until there's an accident, in which case punishment can and should be severe. There's a lot of interesting debate/discussion about this topic when it comes to regular DUI versus manslaughter.

I think the real question regarding legalizing drugs, especially when you're talking about exquisitely engineered devices of human destruction like meth, is how much would drug use increase if we made it legal? Increased use of meth is increased human misery, not just for the users but for society who has to manage the wreckage. When we make it legal (equivalent to lowering the cost), use will increase at least somewhat. The question is how much. If we could estimate how much, and it was tolerable, I think you could get people talking seriously about legalization.

But what I'm always reminded is that alcohol is a massive scourge in our society currently, and it's legal. Sure, we tried to make it illegal once and that was an epic failure, but that was because we already had a whole widespread culture built around alcohol consumption. We couldn't put the horses back in the barn.

So you wonder, if we legalize other drugs, if usage will increase to the point where they turn out like our current major legal drug, alcohol. Because that would be pretty bad. If each one, (meth, heroin, cocaine, crack, etc) caused its own massive set of traffic fatalities, domestic violence, dependency, and so on like alcohol does today, we'd be doomed.

There are two options:

1. Ban the precursor drugs that go into producing meth (convince companies that currently produce them to quit doing so... this was done with quaaludes), but would also mean more and longer sniffly noses.

2. Provide free drugs to people at government dispensaries, but the drugs must be consumed onsite and outreach programs for treatment will be offered. This is probably the smartest idea, but many will hate the notion of giving out free drugs to addicts, even if it means billions of dollars and thousands of lives saved. The other downside is that the restriction may still allow for a black market. Still, it seems unlikely because who will pay enough for something that's otherwise free, and I think people are much less likely to try it for the first time in such settings.

Actually, its because I am consistent unlike you who ignores current legal drugs ill-effects but is alright with them because you are likely a user.

“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”

oh.. yea, that's it. you get called on something and the best you can do is resort to "you are likely a user".

Go smoke another bowl, the gene pool needs further cleansing

I don't smoke pot and likely don't do nearly as much alcohol as you do...user.

“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”

As par for the course you don't have clue about me, so don't even pretend you do.

I know you are okay with alcohol being legal but not marijuana. Inconsistent.

And you know so much about me that you say I should "smoke another bowl".

“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”

I am not arrogant about it like others, but could care less if it was outlawed.

I think marijuana should be legal but it certainly doesn't keep me up at night. So you are for taking away even more of our liberties...got it.

“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”