so are you saying that USTA is still paying for JS ? even when he is already a ''pro''?

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No I am not ,should have clarified that but he is working with their coaching staff from what I witnessed and seeing his ankle no good as I as coach would have kicked him off the court and told him take a couple of days off but when you are not worried about what is being spent you wont worry about his wallet or body .

true that .. most PD kids ended up going to D1 college program .. so everyone doing USTA tournaments are footing the bill for PD to send a few selected kids to play college tennis...
I like to see what kind of degrees and jobs these kids get after their college tennis career is over... I'm betting teaching tennis somewhere...
great system ...

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Correction... most PD kids don't even make it to a D1 college program. There are so many kids picked up and discarded along the way by PD. We only hear about a select few who have a bit more success.

I watched the match yesterday and Johnson was lucky he won that match. Johnson had matchpoints in second set up 5-2 and Thanasi ended up winning that set 7-6. Third set went like 30 games. Kid showed that he can be clutch in some very nerve racking situations. Good serve, uses his body well. Very solid backhand. He got injured in the third set and maybe that threw him off. But still Johnson really sucks im comparison to other player's from other countries. He missed an overhead and got so mad he took the other ball out of his pocket and parked it. Also missed a floater about 4 inches from net, like 3 feet about net. Johnson was complaining about calls the entire match it was ridiculous. Kept throwing his racket too. IMO I don't see him being successful in higher level tennis.

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I know where Thanasi gets his nerves "TODD LANGMAN" guys a brute !

As for Johnson the throwing the racket smacking the ball I believe I spoke of that a while back and got flack for talking about the NCAA champion haha but it will be his thorn

During his TV commentary PMac says that USTA HP is looking for the big athletic kids who may not be the highest ranked. But he does the opposite- takes the highly ranked 12's and 14's regardless of size and athleticism. Of the hundreds of juniors I have seen locally there is 1 that stands out. 6'5" at age 16, very athletic, crushes the ball. Ranked high in section- was impressive in zonals. USTA HP has never called or emailed this kid. I just can't figure USTA out.

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The parents of this kid should seek USTA out if they want help from them.

The parents of this kid should seek USTA out if they want help from them.

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No, I don't think so. There are so many parents contacting the USTA for free training and free education it would be lost in the shuffle. With the millions being spent it is the USTA's job to seek out those few players with genuine pro potential. There are very few 6'5" athletic guys rocking the ball. They are not hard to find. Of course PMac cannot spot talent because he NEVER scouts or checks out matches. I strongly believe in "management by walking around". When the top person in player development does not observe the players in action something is terribly wrong. Good leaders lead from the front.

No, I don't think so. There are so many parents contacting the USTA for free training and free education it would be lost in the shuffle. With the millions being spent it is the USTA's job to seek out those few players with genuine pro potential. There are very few 6'5" athletic guys rocking the ball. They are not hard to find. Of course PMac cannot spot talent because he NEVER scouts or checks out matches. I strongly believe in "management by walking around". When the top person in player development does not observe the players in action something is terribly wrong. Good leaders lead from the front.

1. Discussion # 1. How does this match reflect on Johnson and college tennis as he is the champ? Answer.....not sure because it was only one match that they played head to head. Lots can happen in one isolated match.

2. Discussion # 2. Is this kid showing extraordinary tennis talent for his age? Answer, based on his body of work.....multiple wins in main futures, Hopman Cup, etc....yes.

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No question that this 16 yr old kid is really good, better than most of the 16 yr old boys in US. He is currently ranked #758 in the world. His best win was beating Jose (Rubin) Statham (NZL) ranked #326, W 6-1, 7-6(3), in late October. Johnson is currently ranked #175. The 10 hr jet lag could be a big excuse for Johnson to have to play a hr long 3rd set.

JS was not part of PD, he lived at home in Kansas and trained with a private his whole junior career. He has of course received some assistance both before an after turning pro, as has Deit, but he is not a good example of USTA HP wasting money, in fact he is the poster child for why USTA HP PD is an unecessary waste, he's arguably the best American prospect(aside from DB of course ) and PD had almost nothing to do with it.[/QUOTE

JS = Jack Sock? He will be top #100 this year. Not sure if he is capable of winning a grand slam, but he would be as good as Isner. Sock went to a regular school and played high school tennis!

During his TV commentary PMac says that USTA HP is looking for the big athletic kids who may not be the highest ranked. But he does the opposite- takes the highly ranked 12's and 14's regardless of size and athleticism. Of the hundreds of juniors I have seen locally there is 1 that stands out. 6'5" at age 16, very athletic, crushes the ball. Ranked high in section- was impressive in zonals. USTA HP has never called or emailed this kid. I just can't figure USTA out.

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Andre Agassi is 5'11" tall
Pete Sampras measures 6'1"
Roger Federer is as tall as Pete and so is Rafa
Novak is only an inch taller than Rafa
Michael Chang did not look taller than 5'6"

How about Ollie Rochus? 5'5" is on the record!

Don't recall when and where I read an article that said that the best height for tennis is about 6'.

No question that this 16 yr old kid is really good, better than most of the 16 yr old boys in US. He is currently ranked #758 in the world. His best win was beating Jose (Rubin) Statham (NZL) ranked #326, W 6-1, 7-6(3), in late October. Johnson is currently ranked #175. The 10 hr jet lag could be a big excuse for Johnson to have to play a hr long 3rd set.

BTW, did Michael Chang win Roland Garros when he was 16?

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Johnson's been in Australia since Christmas. He played the qualies in Brisbane.

I watched the match yesterday and Johnson was lucky he won that match. Johnson had matchpoints in second set up 5-2 and Thanasi ended up winning that set 7-6. Third set went like 30 games. Kid showed that he can be clutch in some very nerve racking situations. Good serve, uses his body well. Very solid backhand. He got injured in the third set and maybe that threw him off. But still Johnson really sucks im comparison to other player's from other countries. He missed an overhead and got so mad he took the other ball out of his pocket and parked it. Also missed a floater about 4 inches from net, like 3 feet about net. Johnson was complaining about calls the entire match it was ridiculous. Kept throwing his racket too. IMO I don't see him being successful in higher level tennis.

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3rd round of the US Open three months out of college is pretty solid proof of being able to succeed on the Grand Prix Tour. Two months away from matches made him rusty. One rough match doesn't define a career. Johnson is obviously top 50 ATP material.

3rd round of the US Open three months out of college is pretty solid proof of being able to succeed on the Grand Prix Tour. Two months away from matches made him rusty. One rough match doesn't define a career. Johnson is obviously top 50 ATP material.

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Too early to tell. Getting to the top 50 and staying there are two different things. I hope he does i cheer for all the Americans!!!!

You guys he went to college used it to develop and looks like he is going to be the 3rd guy that has use that route in the last 15 ys to do something significant with it , Isner and Anderson being the other 2 ,

Johnson should be fine and if he can get contol of the attitude he may do well but maturity does not always develop in college so will see .

3rd round of the US Open three months out of college is pretty solid proof of being able to succeed on the Grand Prix Tour. Two months away from matches made him rusty. One rough match doesn't define a career. Johnson is obviously top 50 ATP material.

Ga i believe the top have attitude that they belong there , most of the Americans are taught through mind conditioning of coaches 'unfortunately' that those at the top are some type of special human , that they have a special talent , that it wouldn't matter where they came from they would still make it to the top .

what I have found through my study's of all great achievers whether it is sports or business they look at and impossible task and plow at it and make it possible, their reality is to achieve it and when they do they believe its theirs and no one cant take it from them .

I am re reading Nadals book and he is speaking of what I just wrote also finished another book of another great athlete and when growing up he had doubters but believed blindly he belonged and he achieved his goal .

If our players do 2 rounds its like WOW to me its a joke they should do better and believe they can and top 50 would become the normal in the USA tennis .

Ga i believe the top have attitude that they belong there , most of the Americans are taught through mind conditioning of coaches 'unfortunately' that those at the top are some type of special human , that they have a special talent , that it wouldn't matter where they came from they would still make it to the top .

what I have found through my study's of all great achievers whether it is sports or business they look at and impossible task and plow at it and make it possible, their reality is to achieve it and when they do they believe its theirs and no one cant take it from them .

I am re reading Nadals book and he is speaking of what I just wrote also finished another book of another great athlete and when growing up he had doubters but believed blindly he belonged and he achieved his goal .

If our players do 2 rounds its like WOW to me its a joke they should do better and believe they can and top 50 would become the normal in the USA tennis .

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NADAL BOOK IS A MUST READ!!!!!!! I love how he talks about adversity and how he already knows how to deal with it when he walks on the court.. MINDSET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NADAL BOOK IS A MUST READ!!!!!!! I love how he talks about adversity and how he already knows how to deal with it when he walks on the court.. MINDSET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ga i believe the top have attitude that they belong there , most of the Americans are taught through mind conditioning of coaches 'unfortunately' that those at the top are some type of special human , that they have a special talent , that it wouldn't matter where they came from they would still make it to the top .

what I have found through my study's of all great achievers whether it is sports or business they look at and impossible task and plow at it and make it possible, their reality is to achieve it and when they do they believe its theirs and no one cant take it from them .

I am re reading Nadals book and he is speaking of what I just wrote also finished another book of another great athlete and when growing up he had doubters but believed blindly he belonged and he achieved his goal .

If our players do 2 rounds its like WOW to me its a joke they should do better and believe they can and top 50 would become the normal in the USA tennis .

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I started taking the game seriously relatively late (about 17 yrs old - when I game up springboard diving) though my dad taught me good strokes from a young age. I started passing up players who had been far better than me.
What I believed was this:
If you can play someone relatively close, you can win a set.
If you can win one set, there is no reason you can't win the match.
If you can win the match, you SHOULD win the match.

You guys he went to college used it to develop and looks like he is going to be the 3rd guy that has use that route in the last 15 ys to do something significant with it , Isner and Anderson being the other 2 ,

Johnson should be fine and if he can get contol of the attitude he may do well but maturity does not always develop in college so will see .

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Would James Blake's two years in Harvard be considered as college before pro tour?

The list goes on and on. There are a lot of articles on the subject but this is the best one. With the average age of a top 100 player in the mid to late 20s. There appears to be a great argument for college tennis for a year or two.

The list goes on and on. There are a lot of articles on the subject but this is the best one. With the average age of a top 100 player in the mid to late 20s. There appears to be a great argument for college tennis for a year or two.

Reminds me of Malavi Washington. He went to Michigan for 2 years. I remember his father saying he wanted Malavi at a very good tennis school but not a very top program. Thought it was more important to play #1 for development to the pros and have to play the best college players, as opposed to going to Stanford or USC and starting as a #4, 5 or 6 and not always getting the toughest matches.

Todd Martin was similar at Northwestern where he play #1 for two years then went pro. Todd, as opposed to Malavi, I don't believe he went to college with the sole intention of developing for professional tennis. Martin if I recall was only around #18 or so USTA ranking out of H.S. He was a late bloomer and college worked for him.

The list goes on and on. There are a lot of articles on the subject but this is the best one. With the average age of a top 100 player in the mid to late 20s. There appears to be a great argument for college tennis for a year or two.

Ok so you have come up with how many who have gone to college and "done well" over a 40 yr span ? you are showing me 6 I will ad Isner so that is 7 over 40 yrs, n
Now do me a favor factor in how many tennis schools in the D1 arena per year times 40 , I believe its 6 to 8 per team , you can do the math on this for me I dont add well ,

My question if the no.s are what i am seeing then the route of college is a death blow for anyone "wanting" to go pro , but I am open for stats that contridict these that i am seeing ?

Reminds me of Malavi Washington. He went to Michigan for 2 years. I remember his father saying he wanted Malavi at a very good tennis school but not a very top program. Thought it was more important to play #1 for development to the pros and have to play the best college players, as opposed to going to Stanford or USC and starting as a #4, 5 or 6 and not always getting the toughest matches.

Todd Martin was similar at Northwestern where he play #1 for two years then went pro. Todd, as opposed to Malavi, I don't believe he went to college with the sole intention of developing for professional tennis. Martin if I recall was only around #18 or so USTA ranking out of H.S. He was a late bloomer and college worked for him.

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did it work for him or did he realize it wasnt gonna work and he hightailed it out of their as did Blake ??

I started taking the game seriously relatively late (about 17 yrs old - when I game up springboard diving) though my dad taught me good strokes from a young age. I started passing up players who had been far better than me.
What I believed was this:
If you can play someone relatively close, you can win a set.
If you can win one set, there is no reason you can't win the match.
If you can win the match, you SHOULD win the match.

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i agree with your thinking , a lot of people think the pros hit a different ball then the college or top Jr.s and trust me I have checked the can myself at a pro event , it is without a doubt the same ball that comes out of a can at a high level jr event ,

I never enter these debates, but here I go now. For most part college is not the right route to go pro. Almost nobody in the world is doing it apart from US where college sports are a huge thing. Young women are competing at age 14 and up in Europe, and not junior tournament, smaller pro tournaments. Unless all your college professors are going to pass you for no work, how are you going to balance training and studying? Your peers are playing pros at 17 and you are playing college tennis at 19? Playing better makes you better, not the other way around. I am for college education without question, and it is the right route for most tennis kids, but not for those with pro potential.

Ok so you have come up with how many who have gone to college and "done well" over a 40 yr span ? you are showing me 6 I will ad Isner so that is 7 over 40 yrs, n
Now do me a favor factor in how many tennis schools in the D1 arena per year times 40 , I believe its 6 to 8 per team , you can do the math on this for me I dont add well ,

My question if the no.s are what i am seeing then the route of college is a death blow for anyone "wanting" to go pro , but I am open for stats that contridict these that i am seeing ?

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"Nine of his Stanford players, including John McEnroe, Gene Mayer, Alex Mayer, Roscoe Tanner and Tim Mayotte, have gone on to be ranked among the top 15 in ATP world singles rankings", college works for some, I will work on more schools see if the list gets bigger.

"Nine of his Stanford players, including John McEnroe, Gene Mayer, Alex Mayer, Roscoe Tanner and Tim Mayotte, have gone on to be ranked among the top 15 in ATP world singles rankings", college works for some, I will work on more schools see if the list gets bigger.

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Please last 20 years at the most the game has changed from when they played !

"Nine of his Stanford players, including John McEnroe, Gene Mayer, Alex Mayer, Roscoe Tanner and Tim Mayotte, have gone on to be ranked among the top 15 in ATP world singles rankings", college works for some, I will work on more schools see if the list gets bigger.

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I know there's already a list out there. Just have to find it. There's a lot of examples college players who went on to top 200, 100, etc. Careers. We forget about guys like Mike Russell UofMiami, Don Johnson UNC, Michael Yani Duke, Dom Inglot Illini. There's a bunch more.

The clear fact is many more don't go pro or don't make it trying. Same goes for going pro as a junior and bypassing college. We all know the safe choice, blah, blah blah. This is another popular circular argument.

Brad. I realize its a ways off, but if its decided DB go the college route. I'd look for a place he could play #1 without a doubt as a freshman. That way he get the toughest matches every time out. Just a thought. Know you don't want to go there. Just sayin'.

It might change back to college players becoming good pro players. It seems like players are lasting longer and peaking later in their careers then 10-15 years ago. This, I think, would benefit the pro player that may want to go to college.

Before, it would have been a waste going to college at 18-22, I don't think that's the case anymore.

I think BB said they are going exclusively futures now. They have been on this path so long, why not? The player is 6'5", will be 17 soon, been training for 11-12 years, other guys his age are already playing some level of pros.

Seriously, seems to me when the mind set has been so firm for so long its time to cut the cord and hit the pros. See what happens. Once he starts competing solely vs others trying to make it, his game could skyrocket.

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The next few years will be interesting to watch, results will speak for themselve

I think BB said they are going exclusively futures now. They have been on this path so long, why not? The player is 6'5", will be 17 soon, been training for 11-12 years, other guys his age are already playing some level of pros.

Seriously, seems to me when the mind set has been so firm for so long its time to cut the cord and hit the pros. See what happens. Once he starts competing solely vs others trying to make it, his game could skyrocket.

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We like the cycle of players he is in and we will watch and see if he makes huge jumps over this next year which we will train for and expect to happen , by the end of this year he should have filled out with some more size "weight" and then see over the next year what he does , we will be making adjustments along the way as he plays more futures and in 4 to 5 years will see where he is at .

Coach #1: Good move. Juniors are not important. Go right to the Futures. You will need to mix in weeks of training when you see what he needs to work on. Good USA schedule of Futures in Fla, Texas, and Calif. Thanasi's team has the right idea.

Coach #1: Good move. Juniors are not important. Go right to the Futures. You will need to mix in weeks of training when you see what he needs to work on. Good USA schedule of Futures in Fla, Texas, and Calif. Thanasi's team has the right idea.

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Talked with Thanasi's coach and after the week he had he says ' were not passing out any cigars to much to work on' I love it , anyways yes we are looking to cover as many futures as possible this year another thing we have done is looked at the template of what the top So.Cal players have done over the last 6 to 8 years and see where they were game wise and physically to make our decisions.

WE believe we are ahead of schedule on some things behind on others such as junior compeiton but thats ok competition can be bought .

Talked with Thanasi's coach and after the week he had he says ' were not passing out any cigars to much to work on' I love it , anyways yes we are looking to cover as many futures as possible this year another thing we have done is looked at the template of what the top So.Cal players have done over the last 6 to 8 years and see where they were game wise and physically to make our decisions.

WE believe we are ahead of schedule on some things behind on others such as junior compeiton but thats ok competition can be bought .