Thanks Doug !
At least someone react here in OPF! I've been really amazed that almost none did react to my previous post about the attack against freedom of speech…
Are all OPFers sleeping?
It is about our and our child's freedom!
Back to Fox, Doug, the problem is that I'm sure that many many americans do listen…

To my American and foreign friends:
Please do not believe what Fox News broadcasted these last few days about "no go zones" or charia law in Paris. These are wrong and false informations

Fox News does have some nutty voices, for sure. One has to know the characters before taking insult! Some are honest and a few are so strident in their dislike of liberals, the UN, Europe, especially the French, that casual listeners can't be blamed for disbelieving everything, LOL. But the truth is that, on occasion they are the only news here that does tell the truth. Often CNN is almost anti-American and in those circumstances, Fox News can be an amazing window of fresh air. But then either Ann Coulter on Hannaty come on and one wants to avoid them like the plague.

So, Nicolas, I can understand if one finds nonsense reported by Fox News. I'd love to know who actually made the crass statements!

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Same with me, unless for fun or amazement, although it's a concern that many US citizens apparently get their outlook on the world from Fox news, only.

The real issue is that Fox News presents itself as a "News" organization, where in fact they are just a conservative right-wing Republican propaganda machine. Lots of their 'information' is not fact based ('some' of it is even factually wrong), but rather a one-sided opinion/spin.

Same with me, unless for fun or amazement, although it's a concern that many US citizens apparently get their outlook on the world from Fox news, only.

The real issue is that Fox News presents itself as a "News" organization, where in fact they are just a conservative right-wing Republican propaganda machine. Lots of their 'information' is not fact based ('some' of it is even factually wrong), but rather a one-sided opinion/spin.

Bart,

You sum it up well and with humor! 👻, but it's not a uniformly dishonest organization. sometimes the news and comments are straightforward, revealing and well-balanced. In this latter role, they balance the distorted or cherry-picked "news" form CNN and Al Jazeera and even the BBC. But to benefit, one must know the characters at play. There are some 200 News Anchors, people that have their own program time and reporters. They vary from right-wing paranoid nut cases to solid dependable reporters, commentators and analysts. Of course, the bad image of Fox News is not unearned, LOL!

For sure when Anne Coulter's lips move, you don't need the sound on to know she's spouting vitriol against Obama, Liberals and Europe! When coiffed Hannity's head appears, you expect the same somewhat diluted with 50% honesty. Occasionally, he's a voice of reason and his native intelligence, candor, wit and rational thinking emerges, but that's a very lucky day! But, I do admit, putting aside the easily recognizable nonsensical obsessions with an imagined "War on Christmas", a dishonest hypocritical Democratic party, Obama's doubtful citizenship and the like, he does once in a while surprise us all and present a valuable and much-needed insight to critically important news and societal topics.

A major common trait of those that harangue against "unchristian or anti-conservative values, is the penchant for having speaking tours as populist "experts" and the publications of books for sale. One such figure is four time ex-Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee and intermittent Fox News personality, a publicity hound! Like the regular Fox News anchors he sells bombastic anti-liberal books. Right now, he boosts his ongoing media attention fby attacking President Obama for his daughters' listening to songs by Beyoncé, and being a poor example and amoral.

The O'reilly show, A.K.A., The "Factor", is 100% honest but 10% harsh to the left, but always gives his opposition the opportunity to make independent closing remarks and "The last Word"! That's a redeeming feature. Greta Van Sustran seriously tries to be utterly honest and is a good person.

So, here in the USA, being familiar with the "talking heads", we can ignore the covens of delusional delusioners and find great news reporting by those we trust. Fox News might be partially infested with rabid preachers, but we know who these nutcase are!

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.

You sum it up well and with humor! 👻, but it's not a uniformly dishonest organization. sometimes the news and comments are straightforward, revealing and well-balanced. In this latter role, they balance the distorted or cherry-picked "news" form CNN and Al Jazeera and even the BBC. But to benefit, one must know the characters at play. There are some 200 News Anchors, people that have their own program time and reporters. They vary from right-wing paranoid nut cases to solid dependable reporters, commentators and analysts. Of course, the bad image of Fox News is not unearned, LOL!

For sure when Anne Coulter's lips move, you don't need the sound on to know she's spouting vitriol against Obama, Liberals and Europe! When coiffed Hannity's head appears, you expect the same somewhat diluted with 50% honesty. Occasionally, he's a voice of reason and his native intelligence, candor, wit and rational thinking emerges, but that's a very lucky day! But, I do admit, putting aside the easily recognizable nonsensical obsessions with an imagined "War on Christmas", a dishonest hypocritical Democratic party, Obama's doubtful citizenship and the like, he does once in a while surprise us all and present a valuable and much-needed insight to critically important news and societal topics.

A major common trait of those that harangue against "unchristian or anti-conservative values, is the penchant for having speaking tours as populist "experts" and the publications of books for sale. One such figure is four time ex-Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee and intermittent Fox News personality, a publicity hound! Like the regular Fox News anchors he sells bombastic anti-liberal books. Right now, he boosts his ongoing media attention fby attacking President Obama for his daughters' listening to songs by Beyoncé, and being a poor example and amoral.

The O'reilly show, A.K.A., The "Factor", is 100% honest but 10% harsh to the left, but always gives his opposition the opportunity to make independent closing remarks and "The last Word"! That's a redeeming feature. Greta Van Sustran seriously tries to be utterly honest and is a good person.

So, here in the USA, being familiar with the "talking heads", we can ignore the covens of delusional delusioners and find great news reporting by those we trust. Fox News might be partially infested with rabid preachers, but we know who these nutcase are!

Asher

As I said already:

Quote:

If one is caught as lying, you can't trust him anymore, whatever the subject is.

The O'reilly show, A.K.A., The "Factor", is 100% honest but 10% harsh to the left, but always gives his opposition the opportunity to make independent closing remarks and "The last Word"! That's a redeeming feature.

Hi Asher,

Bill O'Reilly is another comic, not to be taken seriously, not in my book anyway. Here's what he has to say about Amsterdam, the Capital of my country, and the rebuttal from a fellow Dutchman:Bill O'Reilly loves Amsterdam

You may also want to look at some of the other links at the right hand margin of the screen on YouTube about the numerous other incorrect representations by Bill O'Relily (like here, or here, or ...) on various other subjects.

Again, they are not a News channel, but a Conservative right-wing propaganda channel ..., but once you know their agenda, they are hilarious (if only people wouldn't believe everything they are saying).

Bill O'Reilly is another comic, not to be taken seriously, not in my book anyway. Here's what he has to say about Amsterdam, the Capital of my country, and the rebuttal from a fellow Dutchman:Bill O'Reilly loves Amsterdam

You may also want to look at some of the other links at the right hand margin of the screen on YouTube about the numerous other incorrect representations by Bill O'Relily (like here, or here, or ...) on various other subjects.

Again, they are not a News channel, but a Conservative right-wing propaganda channel ..., but once you know their agenda, they are hilarious (if only people wouldn't believe everything they are saying).

Cheers,
Bart

Bart,

I stand corrected! I had never seen such nonsense spouted by Bill O'reilly. He is another disappointment!

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.

@ Bart
Merci !
@ Asher
Can't be any LoL, these guys tell lies and there are so/too many people (not aware) that do believe them.
Again, and again : If one is caught as lying, you can't trust him anymore, whatever the subject is.

@ Bart
Merci !
@ Asher
Can't be any LoL, these guys tell lies and there are so/too many people (not aware) that do believe them.
Again, and again : If one is caught as lying, you can't trust him anymore, whatever the subject is.

A lot of the incorrect statements by Fox News talking heads are simply their brands "rants". Their talking points are built on prejudicial opinions. These are evolved in a cultural exclusionary bubble separating them from the real world facts. They're so infused with their causes that some just trust their colleagues more than Reuters, Le Monde or the BBC. They just "know"! If what their sources report resonates with their anti=liberal bias, the stories, naturally seem credible! So, out of naive ignorance they can sometimes spread inflammatory concepts and the develop consequential policy imperatives that are gravely flawed.

The basic defect at Fox is that, at their root thinking, they have a religious dogma and this is their validation tool, rather than research into verifiable facts.

However, I don't think that O'Reilly actual lies on purpose with any intent to deceive. He merely is sloppy and accepts what his sources feed him about the topics he's rabidly wild about. That is not lying, it's just delusional ranting.

It reminds me of a conversation with a relative of mine infused with the teaching of the Kabbala movement. They were selling water blessed by the rabbi, no less. People thought it had special healing properties due to a change in the molecular structure, a quantum physics effect, according to their understanding. Immune to reason, and I did try, a pious relative staying with us had cases of the water delivered for her food! There were even claims that Orange production increased with this water!

Now the folks who believe this nonsense and report the water's benefits, or those who go to spread their religion to villages they "discover" are not "lying"! They, themselves really believe their "voices" and feel they are offering some great truth to the world.

This is an important point and if a Fox News analyst, Kabbala preacher or a telephone-evangelist yelled at me to get the kids off the railway tracks as a train was coming, I'd not ignore them.

Delusions are segmented bubbles or fixed thinking inaccessible to critical reason. However those effected can still be reliable witnesses in many circumstances. Human societies are subject to "infection" with packages of ideas that compete for our very soul, worth and being. Once folk are "converted", recruited or otherwise "join that movement, they're pretty well lost for that segment of thought that the meme governs. The process works with such divers subjects as dying for the Emperor in Japan, forcing South American natives to become Christians by slaughter and intimidation, keeping African Slaves in the American South, thinking George Bush was fit for the Presidency of the United States or that 70 virgins await each martyr that blows himself up to kill folk shopping in a supermarket. In all these examples, the perpetrators sincerely believe they carry the banner of truth and enlightenment to the world, at whatever necessary cost.

Part of education in great schools is the acquisition of the analytical tools to help us sort out fact from fiction. Look at the debates between O'Reilly and John Stewart, Dawkins and Bill Maher. O'Reilly was convinced he is "Fair and Balanced" in his reporting and regularly allows his guests to challenge him! They did far more than that. They trounced him, exposing his nativity where he should have been able to substantially prove his various conservative talking points. Yes the fellow is still delusional, but he does repeatedly allow debate and gives really capable critics the opportunity to challenge and dissect the very ideas and "facts apon which his very career as a broadcaster and author depends. A liar would not do that!

In the end, we, ourselves, must provide voices of reason to educate our communities about the facts that can be substantiated. One of the sad facts of life is that socially, the more cultured we are, we tend to avoid confrontation and follow the advice not to get into topics like politics, sex or social rights issues.

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.

I guess Newsweek is as bad as Fox News.
Don
According to research conducted by the government's domestic intelligence network, the Renseignements Generaux, French police would not venture without major reinforcements into some 150 "no-go zones" around the country--and that was before the recent wave of riots began on Oct. 27. In France's "immigrant" neighborhoods, to borrow a phrase from the American military, "situation normal, all f---ed up."http://www.newsweek.com/europes-time-bomb-115189

Noam Chomsky is a professional cold-blooded anti-USA self-opbssed advocate. He has developed his silk smooth vitriol as a work of performance art. He's inverse of Fox News, but truly, the more erudite "other side" of the same hate coin.

He uses his rather elegant linguistics to promote the nobility of any enemy of the USA and the expose dastardly the evil and deceit of anyone either pro USA or pro Zionist. There is typically selective outrage. So black folk raped, pillaged and driven to exile in Darfur or else the Muslims massacred by the Christian Orthodox Forces of Serbia, (egged on the that ill-faired radio station), bring not a tear. I know about this from two very reliable and direct sources. First we had a Serbian boy stay with us during the war. He was 16 years old when he arrived and we knew from him the anti Muslim vitriol which astonished us as he was a lovely fellow and brilliant. The second source is my brother who was an advisor to Milosiovic and tried to dissuade him on his program of ethnic cleansing. Chomsky ignores the facts on the ground. A war of ethnic clean sic was fully underway. This part of the truth he skirts to avoid and focuses just on the tragic, painful and unforgettable cost of waging war - folk get killed. The radio station was an integral part of the war machine and a valid target, as everything had to be done to bring an end to the madness.

Nemanja, the boy from Belgrade, couldn't comprehend why we'd support ever the Muslims. After all we're Jewish. He expected immediate loyalty to the Serbian fighters. My answer was even more absurd to him - "It was the moral thing for a civilized nation to do: we stopped the slaughter of Muslims. It was needed and we did it and I'm proud of that."

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.

There is a double standard. In the middle East, cartoons and caricatures of Jews as demoniacal beasts destroying the world are not uncommon. However, the folk are naturally offended when a tiny hardly known French Satirical magazine is disrespectful to Muslim sensitivities. After all they make equal fun of Jews and Christians!

I would never do as Charlie Hebdo has done. I try to show respect where the person is sincere and not advocating anyone else losing rights.

In fact I celebrate diverse ways of societies recognizing some great divine force. This concept is present in most cultures. It does not mean I believe the Pope is somehow more or less important than the local scout master, or that I don't admire the Dalai Lama even more or that I have learned wisdom from Jainism priests from India. I believe all these ideas are allegorical expressions of reverence for life. However, in practice, the religions have done a poor job at core values and we get hatreds and ethnic violence and death such as recently happened in Paris.

If the Jews had 1.5 billion followers and lots of oil, then Zionism would be romantic and executing Jewish shoppers in a Kosher store in Paris would be an attack to be ashamed of. There would be no chance that the Jews in France would not be protected in their schools and synagogues. As it is, the largest Jewish Community in Europe is likely to be driven out.

What really should happen is that marginalization of muslim youth has to be addressed so they are proud to be part of one of the greatest civilizations ever. Unfortunately, even 3rd generation immigrants from Morocco or Algeria or Tunisia are still considered foreigners. Still, no nation has done more to promote the rights of man than France. Thank goodness that Napoleon invaded neighboring countries and then Muslims and Jews and Christians of any persuasion were rendered citizens and equal before the law.

Despite this national heritage, Prime minister of Israel,m Benjamin Natanyahu was formally requested not to attend the march in Paris and then President of France purposely stormed out of the Synagogue memorial service just as Natanyahu got up to address the Jewish congregation. Hollande needed to make a public point of distance and utter separation between him and the Israeli Prime Minister. It simply cannot be that France is to be seen as close to Israel, as the 1.5 Billion Muslim world is looking on.

The truth however is that orthodox religious Jewish values of modesty and reverence are very close to Muslim values. Muslim countries have been refuges for those escaping church persecution either from the Catholic Church, Luther's reform Church or the English state run version of Christianity. We both suffered the massacres and pillage of the Crusades.

Yes the cartoons are provocative and in bad taste, but are critically part of a free thinking rational society where one is open to be disrespectful to anyone who has power and influence! It must be near impossible for devout Muslims to approach understanding a right to defame the profit, but, yes, even that is legal in a fee society.

Then with free speech, others can argue against the disrespect. That's how we can learn. I don't like the idea of insulting a sincere religious person, but I do think that those in power can do with some tomatoes thrown at them.

My sneaky feeling is that God is not mad at Charlie Hebdo but at the divide between different cultures that we can neither show respect nor take a joke!

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.

Asher.
Do you have a tick box where I can audibly applaude?
MAybe a simple bow will suffice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asher Kelman

A lot of the incorrect statements by Fox News talking heads are simply their brands "rants". Their talking points are built on prejudicial opinions. These are evolved in a cultural exclusionary bubble separating them from the real world facts. They're so infused with their causes that some just trust their colleagues more than Reuters, Le Monde or the BBC. They just "know"! If what their sources report resonates with their anti=liberal bias, the stories, naturally seem credible! So, out of naive ignorance they can sometimes spread inflammatory concepts and the develop consequential policy imperatives that are gravely flawed.

The basic defect at Fox is that, at their root thinking, they have a religious dogma and this is their validation tool, rather than research into verifiable facts.

However, I don't think that O'Reilly actual lies on purpose with any intent to deceive. He merely is sloppy and accepts what his sources feed him about the topics he's rabidly wild about. That is not lying, it's just delusional ranting.

It reminds me of a conversation with a relative of mine infused with the teaching of the Kabbala movement. They were selling water blessed by the rabbi, no less. People thought it had special healing properties due to a change in the molecular structure, a quantum physics effect, according to their understanding. Immune to reason, and I did try, a pious relative staying with us had cases of the water delivered for her food! There were even claims that Orange production increased with this water!

Now the folks who believe this nonsense and report the water's benefits, or those who go to spread their religion to villages they "discover" are not "lying"! They, themselves really believe their "voices" and feel they are offering some great truth to the world.

This is an important point and if a Fox News analyst, Kabbala preacher or a telephone-evangelist yelled at me to get the kids off the railway tracks as a train was coming, I'd not ignore them.

Delusions are segmented bubbles or fixed thinking inaccessible to critical reason. However those effected can still be reliable witnesses in many circumstances. Human societies are subject to "infection" with packages of ideas that compete for our very soul, worth and being. Once folk are "converted", recruited or otherwise "join that movement, they're pretty well lost for that segment of thought that the meme governs. The process works with such divers subjects as dying for the Emperor in Japan, forcing South American natives to become Christians by slaughter and intimidation, keeping African Slaves in the American South, thinking George Bush was fit for the Presidency of the United States or that 70 virgins await each martyr that blows himself up to kill folk shopping in a supermarket. In all these examples, the perpetrators sincerely believe they carry the banner of truth and enlightenment to the world, at whatever necessary cost.

Part of education in great schools is the acquisition of the analytical tools to help us sort out fact from fiction. Look at the debates between O'Reilly and John Stewart, Dawkins and Bill Maher. O'Reilly was convinced he is "Fair and Balanced" in his reporting and regularly allows his guests to challenge him! They did far more than that. They trounced him, exposing his nativity where he should have been able to substantially prove his various conservative talking points. Yes the fellow is still delusional, but he does repeatedly allow debate and gives really capable critics the opportunity to challenge and dissect the very ideas and "facts apon which his very career as a broadcaster and author depends. A liar would not do that!

In the end, we, ourselves, must provide voices of reason to educate our communities about the facts that can be substantiated. One of the sad facts of life is that socially, the more cultured we are, we tend to avoid confrontation and follow the advice not to get into topics like politics, sex or social rights issues.

Asher.
Do you have a tick box where I can audibly applaude?
MAybe a simple bow will suffice.

Thanks Tom,

Thanks for reading my attempts to bring some sense of logic to the debate. I responded to my dear friend Nicolas' calling out of the "lies" by Fox News. Nicolas found the right target to attack, but it is not simply lying! It's an order of magnitude more serious and far more dangerous.

Thieves, cheating spouses, people selling stolen property and dishonest politicians lie. They know what they are doing. Lying is then a seemingly a reasonable way of negotiating one's path in life after such transgressions. "Did you sleep with that man" - "Of course not, I'd never cheat on you!" …and life can go on, "The hamburgers are ready - shall we open wine?"

By contrast, I doubt that Fox News talking heads consciously lie in general, even though they are not reporting the truth! They just latch on to circulating stories that resonate with their strongly felt prejudices! If I was in charge of Fox News, I'd separate News reporting from the Christian Right and the Tea Party extremists. Then they can have all the bloviating opions in separate political opinion programming, clearly separate from factual news reports. So we can't expect any changes as I do not have the funds to buy out Rupert Murdoch this year!

I really take seriously the challenge of dealing with the "delusionals" who want to run everyone else's lives. The problem is that they have no insight in their lacuna of religious thought. If someone wants to believe in the Buddha or Jesus or Moses I find that an interesting cultural phenomenon and look for the societal benefits in a moral scaffolding for children, rich story telling, poetry and music. However, when folk think they have a divine authority to execute nonbelievers, that's where we need to wake up. It's no longer entertaining and now we have nothing less than an existential threat to our future freedoms we so take for granted. Having a major news source like Fox News spout inflammatory hatred, only weakens out ability to tackle the "terrorist" threats.

Our responses have been military lame and as much as the efficiency seems brilliant, having drones picking off organizers of murder and mayhem is not enough or effective, as we can see. We need instead to improve the lives of the poor and disaffected. We need to get our allies to stop funding their extremists thinking in 10,000 schools generating the next generations of devout murderers.

Children need to have a stake in this current world, not just look for reward and fulfillment in a jihadist's homicide vest.

Our purpose is getting to an impressive photograph. So we encourage browsing and then feedback. Consider a link to your galleries annotated, C&C welcomed. Images posted within OPF are assumed to be for Comment & Critique, unless otherwise designated.