I have a question about familiars from a rules perspective: Is there anything in the rules that state that a familiar cannot be trained in a given class. My angle on this is to create an Improved Familiar (azata) with levels in sorcorer (probably 12-13 assuming I take the feat at level 7) or wizard.

I have a question about familiars from a rules perspective: Is there anything in the rules that state that a familiar cannot be trained in a given class. My angle on this is to create an Improved Familiar (azata) with levels in sorcorer (probably 12-13 assuming I take the feat at level 7) or wizard.

Familiars don't advance beyond the table, they don't get skill points, feats, etc, allowing one to level up makes them more powerful than cohorts

Which is ok with me, because of players access to 20th level and below monsters and npcs anyway and the influence of HOPF for main PCs meaning if you aren't a PC you aren't really anyone, I don't find it too much of a concern.

@ Manx - I don't deny that the power curve you mention does make the familiar in that case a bit of a twink. That being said, and given the circumstances of the campaign, I was truly wondering if there was such a rule sitting in PF somewhere. I have never found it, but this is the first time that I am attempting to perma-tank such a creature. If there is such a rule, please let me know so that I can prevent others from doing so in the future.

"It retains the appearance, Hit Dice, base attack bonus, base save bonuses, skills, and feats of the normal animal it once was, but is now a magical beast for the purpose of effects that depend on its type. Only a normal, unmodified animal may become a familiar."

"Use the basic statistics for a creature of the familiar's kind, but with the following changes."

"Attacks: Use the master's base attack bonus, as calculated from all his classes. Use the familiar's Dexterity or Strength modifier, whichever is greater, to calculate the familiar's melee attack bonus with natural weapons. Damage equals that of a normal creature of the familiar's kind." Bold mine

"Saving Throws: For each saving throw, use either the familiar's base save bonus (Fortitude +2, Reflex +2, Will +0) or the master's (as calculated from all his classes), whichever is better. The familiar uses its own ability modifiers to saves, and it doesn't share any of the other bonuses that the master might have on saves." bold mine

"Skills: For each skill in which either the master or the familiar has ranks, use either the normal skill ranks for an animal of that type or the master's skill ranks, whichever is better. In either case, the familiar uses its own ability modifiers. Regardless of a familiar's total skill modifiers, some skills may remain beyond the familiar's ability to use. Familiars treat Acrobatics, Climb, Fly, Perception, Stealth, and Swim as class skills." Bold mine

Note that the table of level improvement for familiars applies to both animal and improved. All of the rules noted above would also apply to improved familiars.

Therefore, we know that a familiar is based on the base creature. A creature with a template can not be used, as only the base creature qualifies. Notice that for saving throws it references the master's class adjustments but still states the familiar is using only the base save, which is listed.

In addition to these points, you can look online, there are many threads covering this area, including here on paizo's site.

I personally think it sucks since it means that the higher the level of the wizard, the more of a liability the familiar becomes.

2) This game has changed quite a bit from when the recruitment was still active. The GM has since up and disappeared, leaving us players to take control of the game. Currently, I am the GM, though that will change, possibly soon.

3) I am really not sure if we should be adding a new player or not. This game is already tricky enough with just us four, as again, we have no actual GM.

Spell casting is not this characters big thing(rather not his only big thing, it's not what made him the big power player) the concept would work almost as well were he a Mighty godling instead of eldritch, it's that people worship him, his power is political, religious.

We all get that kind of thing, but its fluff, some have whole citys, globule spanning trade roots and ships, Soon as Rosa gets some time and a location shes going to start on her, Construct Nation or city state.
So a cult at godling level is a bit small, If your going Thrall mind and Godling + cult, that would work, with say a temple location.

To cut down the combat and events nutty nuss of having masses of mooks fighting mooks, its taken they cancel each other out and only Hero Mooks and plays get into Rolling, even then at this level is 3 rounds and over, with the power levels being what they are.

Thats the hard part in all this, getting a fight in that is at a level thats a challeng and not waited to much on one side Payers Vs badguys.

That's where Akor who has the current GM hat on, did so amazingly well in the last encounter. When he passes on the GM floppy hat to who ever next, then I hope we get more of the same. :}

yeah i made my current character with no real home or followers statted out just for ease. I suppose myself (a summoner with fighter levels) and the cleric are the melee folks. not sure if the godling stuff was allowed, that'd be a DM call. This game isn't dead, but it is very slow. statting out a worthwhile enemy can take a week or two so we often go a good amount of time with few posts.

doesn't matter to me if we add a new character or not, if it comes to a vote.

It would be godling cult +leadership where they also worship him so that doubles it, so as a demigod he is a rank1 dietity.. That in and of itself is big, but I may have to up it even further if what you say is true,

I couldn't get both thralls and cult because that comes at lvl 20, I can't multiclass

Right. but as far as i know we arent using rules for deification, rather we are using Mythic Rules which have a similar flavor although more limited in scope.

Characters with divine rank really shouldn't adventure with non-divine-ranked characters, because the things that challenge them are so different due to that line being quite clear. similarly, Mythic and non-Mythic characters shouldn't adventure together for the same reasons. that's why the rules delineate "mythic damage source" and "non-mythic damage source" etc. and in the rules regarding divinity, everything is a divine rank opposed roll, which is automatically won if one person doesn't have divine rank.

Rank 0 is essentially you are ageless immortal, don't need to eat sleep or drink or breath (i do have to breath), but you can still be killed and you aren't all that much stronger
I don't know anything about mythic so ill have to look into that, could someone shoot me a link?

Was ni-jed by Tenro but yes thats just what I was going to say, has to be like for like or the game gos out of tilt.

Im hoping to play a godling in another game and had to nuerf it a hell of a lot, to make it work in that high power game, strip out a load of stuff per the PC and setting and better for it the class is.

Godlings get Traist and you can get ageless immortal with a 4 trait buy Dave no need for divine ranks at all.

Its immortal but not unkillable, thats the key, we are all mortal in this game, long lived yes but mortal. .

I think you need to have a look at mythic and see how it would work with Godling, I think it may just push you past the like for like limit here even with our 0 Rank godhood.

Unless the other say Im doing wrong here and they can, I would say come up with you PC core Idea and then take it from there, We has a Pos player come in not long ago buy they got asked to leve because they went with an over power uber build PC that did not fit the group.

I have changed my PC from Evil to LN to fit better and cut back her stuff to fit as it felt right to do so.

:)

I think thats the key, more what will work in game than a wish PC dropped into game.

Ill still have to check out this mythic thing but my proposed godling isn't all that strong (for a lvl 20) his strength lies in being hard to kill. But I do have an alternate character idea that I can mix with this a little, he's a storm Druid/master of storms who plans on becoming a god

the mythic playtest is somewhere around, read this thread. i am sure we have linked it somewhere. also take note that we are using the updated version of the mythic playtest rules that change the amazing initiative as well as some other abilities.