Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10408Location: Where ever I'm at now

DayDreamer wrote:

I still think we ought to pick Berry in the first round, either at #2 or if we trade down.

Think of how much of a differencemaker Polamalu has been for the Steelers.

I like Berry's athletic skills an awful lot. However, I watched a number of Tennessee games, and never came away with being impressed on his play. Maybe it was what he was asked to do in their defense, but he never really stood out that much to me.

Would I like Berry on our team? Hell yes. At #2? I don't think so.

For every Polamalu and Ed Reed, there are three LaRon Landry's.

April 13th, 2010, 4:51 pm

m2karateman

RIP Killer

Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10408Location: Where ever I'm at now

Aaron Wilson, of the National Football Post, reports the Detroit Lions are considering taking Oklahoma State OT Russell Okung with the second overall pick in the 2010 NFL Draft, according to a source.

Nice. Keep send out the mixed signals Mayhew!!

April 16th, 2010, 9:58 pm

jomo269

NFL Team Captain

Joined: January 27th, 2005, 9:12 pmPosts: 1610Location: Midland, MI

Just say "NO" to Okung. Who's butt are they trying to blow smoke up?

If they pick Okung at #2 I'll puke, for a long time

Last edited by jomo269 on April 17th, 2010, 1:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

April 16th, 2010, 11:03 pm

njroar

Team MVP

Joined: September 25th, 2007, 3:20 amPosts: 3262

Regardless of his ties to the previous years, in his short tenure of being the guy, he's proven to be shrewd and able to pull off favorable, even if not the best, moves. The Roy deal, the Williams Deal, the Houston Deal, all the smoke screening as far as having the Curry Deal lined up....

I know we still have holes at CB, DE and RB, and future OL, specifically tackles, but its hard not to show some trust and realize that our front office isn't our biggest liability anymore and there's actually a light at the end of the tunnel. Depending on your koolaid intake the tunnel could be longer or shorter, but there's light back there somewhere.

April 16th, 2010, 11:33 pm

jrd66

Mr. Irrelevant

Joined: February 10th, 2005, 6:52 pmPosts: 958Location: Linden, MI

njroar wrote:

Regardless of his ties to the previous years, in his short tenure of being the guy, he's proven to be shrewd and able to pull off favorable, even if not the best, moves. The Roy deal, the Williams Deal, the Houston Deal, all the smoke screening as far as having the Curry Deal lined up....

I know we still have holes at CB, DE and RB, and future OL, specifically tackles, but its hard not to show some trust and realize that our front office isn't our biggest liability anymore and there's actually a light at the end of the tunnel. Depending on your koolaid intake the tunnel could be longer or shorter, but there's light back there somewhere.

Well said. There is no indication that these guys are fools, and many that they are quite sharp. Not all of their moves will work out, but they certainly seem to have a shrewd quality to their actions. I think they know what they are looking at. If they choose to pick Okung, I will not be too upset. I'd rather have others, but I'm starting to trust them a bit.

The only questionable draft decisions these guys have made are the choice of Pettigrew over Oher, which I think will end unfavorably for the Lions and the pick of Derrick Williams. Other than that, so far so good.

_________________OK. Schwartz is fired, the fans are happy, now what?

April 17th, 2010, 10:20 am

m2karateman

RIP Killer

Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10408Location: Where ever I'm at now

jrd66 wrote:

njroar wrote:

Regardless of his ties to the previous years, in his short tenure of being the guy, he's proven to be shrewd and able to pull off favorable, even if not the best, moves. The Roy deal, the Williams Deal, the Houston Deal, all the smoke screening as far as having the Curry Deal lined up....

I know we still have holes at CB, DE and RB, and future OL, specifically tackles, but its hard not to show some trust and realize that our front office isn't our biggest liability anymore and there's actually a light at the end of the tunnel. Depending on your koolaid intake the tunnel could be longer or shorter, but there's light back there somewhere.

Well said. There is no indication that these guys are fools, and many that they are quite sharp. Not all of their moves will work out, but they certainly seem to have a shrewd quality to their actions. I think they know what they are looking at. If they choose to pick Okung, I will not be too upset. I'd rather have others, but I'm starting to trust them a bit.

The only questionable draft decisions these guys have made are the choice of Pettigrew over Oher, which I think will end unfavorably for the Lions and the pick of Derrick Williams. Other than that, so far so good.

There are going to be times that they make questionable, if not downright awful picks. Every team does that, even the best teams. As long as they have an overall body of work in the draft that is favorable to the team.

As Lions fans it has become our nature to question the front office. That's not going to change in one year, and it won't change until this team is celebrating back-to-back Super Bowl victories.......j/k. But even the Saints fans are going to question the picks made this year in the draft by their team. It's what fans do.

April 17th, 2010, 10:33 am

njroar

Team MVP

Joined: September 25th, 2007, 3:20 amPosts: 3262

Not all draft choices make immediate big impacts. On the Lions we always expect them too, but we have to be real. Pettigrew missed camp and started slow, but really started to become a dynamic weapon in the offense as well as a big value in the running game before his injury. If he can stay healthy, I think he'll continue to be a threat for years to come. Oher might have made a more immediate impact, but long term, I think you don't see TE's like Pettigrew as often as you do OT's with that skillset. Next year's draft is much deeper in the OT class.

As for Williams, just about every receiver takes 3 years to get used to the NFL system changes and complexity of routes. With CJ out in camp and minimal pressure on Stafford in the preseason, Williams looked good. I'll be looking to see his impact this season and if he improves any, and then the next year before I'll write it off as a bust. The chemistry between him and Stafford in the preseason last year looked promising, and that chemistry goes along way in the league. Will CJ and Burleson give him room to operate this year, or will he be like Northcutt and BJ last year and not get any separation from the cb's and just be a body. Only time will tell. I think we all questioned the position he was picked, but I never hated the player picked.

April 17th, 2010, 10:39 am

m2karateman

RIP Killer

Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10408Location: Where ever I'm at now

njroar wrote:

Not all draft choices make immediate big impacts. On the Lions we always expect them too, but we have to be real. Pettigrew missed camp and started slow, but really started to become a dynamic weapon in the offense as well as a big value in the running game before his injury. If he can stay healthy, I think he'll continue to be a threat for years to come. Oher might have made a more immediate impact, but long term, I think you don't see TE's like Pettigrew as often as you do OT's with that skillset. Next year's draft is much deeper in the OT class.

I'm sorry, but I completely disagree with your bolded statement above. How often do you see a rookie OT come in and play not just one, but two different offensive line spots at such a high level? Answer: you don't. Particularly one taken that late in the first round. The big knock on him was his learning disabilities, and he showed little issue with knowing the assignments for both tackle spots. Sounds to me like Oher was the most over-analyzed player of the draft in 2009. I didn't mind the Pettigrew pick for the Lions (as a matter of fact, I predicted it), but you can't sit there and say that quality LTs come along more often than TEs like Pettigrew. Particularly a rookie LT that makes an immediate impact.

njroar wrote:

As for Williams, just about every receiver takes 3 years to get used to the NFL system changes and complexity of routes. With CJ out in camp and minimal pressure on Stafford in the preseason, Williams looked good. I'll be looking to see his impact this season and if he improves any, and then the next year before I'll write it off as a bust. The chemistry between him and Stafford in the preseason last year looked promising, and that chemistry goes along way in the league. Will CJ and Burleson give him room to operate this year, or will he be like Northcutt and BJ last year and not get any separation from the cb's and just be a body. Only time will tell. I think we all questioned the position he was picked, but I never hated the player picked.

I think all the criticism about Williams wasn't his lack of impact in the passing game, but his pedestrian performance as a return man. That is what he was drafted for more than to be an immediate receiver. Not only that, but the issues that Williams had (questionable hands in the return game, poor burst, no second gear, inconsistent performance catching the ball) were well known to the league. I thought Williams was a fifth round talent, in all honesty. There were plenty of other guys that would have been better picks as returners (Johnny Knox of Chicago comes to mind). My biggest issue with the pick was that the Lions could have taken any one of a number of CBs with return ability, which would have served a dual purpose. Lardarius Webb and D.J. Moore are just two of a host of CBs taken not too far after the Lions selected Williams that could have been used as returners (and probably done better) and could have either started at corner (Webb was used as a starter later in the season due to injuries for the Ravens) or at least been a good backup to develop.

Hindsight is 20/20, but I was screaming for the Lions to draft a CB in round three, both when they were on the clock for Levy and Williams. Levy was a pick I didn't see coming, and didn't agree with either. I was wrong with that one. But I still think Williams was a reach, and the Lions could have used better judgement with that pick.

April 17th, 2010, 11:16 am

steensn

RIP Killer

Joined: June 26th, 2006, 1:03 pmPosts: 13429

I was pumped on levy, but I agree williams was a reach. We should have nabbed a cb...

In the beginning I was one of those people that said the Lions should stay at #2 and take McCoy or Suh. But then I realized that #2 money was insane for DT and then I was all about trading down at any price. The Lions would be much better picking outside the top 5 and taking a Derrrick Morgan or Joe Haden instead. But the grim reality is nobody wants the #2 pick.

So if the Lions are stuck at #2 I see left tackle as much better investment than a defensive tackle. Eventually the Lions are going to have to draft one and pay him accordingly. Even if you don't think that Okung or Williams are all that the truth is that to get LT of their caliber means spending a top 10 pick on them.

Quote:

"He remains one of the best players in this draft, if not the best. … He's everything you want a defensive tackle to be," said Kiper. About Suh? Nope - Glen Dorsey.

First of all.... I understand the dilemma.

The "positional value" theory is important. There is certainly some merit to determining how much you can afford to pay certain positions.

There is also just the simple fact that it is more important a player that will succeed in the NFL, rather than drafting the "next" bust of the decade.

I realize that all of the guys getting paid THIS offseason are NTs in a 3-4 defense, but Haynesworth's deal seems to have triggered those flood gates to open, and it surely won't be long before other 4-3 DTs get their money too.

When it gets expensive to sign players at a certain position, the draft "value" of that position is elevated shortly thereafter. When there is no "supply" of quality players available in free agency at a position, then teams have to draft that position.

The reason that QBs, OLTs, and DEs are drafted highly is for this reason. The really good players at these positions are not typically allowed to hit the free agent market. Teams have to draft them.

As the article from the link points out, all 4 of the big name NTs were either given an extension or have been "tagged"........ so there was NO supply of DTs in free agency.

Perhaps this is the newest trend.

Teams may not be willing to give up on their talented interior DTs as easily as before. While Shaun Rogers, Kris Jenkins, and Marcus Stroud have been traded in recent years, the teams that gave them up have struggled to replace them.

I'll be curious to see if the run on DTs in the draft starts early!

.

April 18th, 2010, 2:50 pm

steensn

RIP Killer

Joined: June 26th, 2006, 1:03 pmPosts: 13429

I'm going to make my official Lions prediction, if we do not trade down we will be drafting Okung and moving Backus inside. I want either McCoy or Suh...

While I won't be terribly upset if they draft Okung, I do think there will be top talent at OT in the next few drafts. I don't think there will be another Suh or McCoy in the next couple of drafts. There is always hype, but it seems like these guys are a level above the typical top prospects. Time will tell, of course.

I guess in my mind, who would be easier to trade for with the Vikings? McKinnie, or Williams? Which do you think they would refuse to consider?