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What about Swellow vs Donphan? I thought it was quite well done, considering the types disadvantage. I know type disadvantages dont necessarily count in the anime but still...

Type disadvantage? Swellow was the one with an advantidge over Donphan(Donphan is a Ground type, Swellow's Flying/Normal, Flying is immune to Ground moves)...unless that's what you were referring to, in which case, forget it :P Or unless you were referring to Rollout(which is a Rock move)...

Type disadvantage? Swellow was the one with an advantidge over Donphan(Donphan is a Ground type, Swellow's Flying/Normal, Flying is immune to Ground moves)...unless that's what you were referring to, in which case, forget it :P Or unless you were referring to Rollout(which is a Rock move)...

yeah, I think he was referring to rollout. It was pretty cool how swellow won against donphan after getting hit by an attack that keeps getting stronger with every hit and a type advantage over it.

I can't belive it! First, Ash lost in the Indigo League becuase Charizard didn't follow Ash's orders. Then, He lost in the Jotho League because Ash's Charizard is not enough to beat Harrison's Blaziken. And Now he lost in the Hoenn League because...you know the rest. WHAT NEXT?! BTW, the only league he has won is the Orange League becuase he defeated Drake's Dragonite with his Pikachu.

Does anyone else agree that Grovyle's battle was made way more better by the fact one of the coolest BGM's ever played in the background. I believed that also played during the big fight between Grovyle and Exploud back in Episode 60 someting.

I can't belive it! First, Ash lost in the Indigo League becuase Charizard didn't follow Ash's orders. Then, He lost in the Jotho League because Ash's Charizard is not enough to beat Harrison's Blaziken. And Now he lost in the Hoenn League because...you know the rest. WHAT NEXT?! BTW, the only league he has won is the Orange League becuase he defeated Drake's Dragonite with his Pikachu.

It was kind of expected for Ash to lose, and as for the Jouto league, Charizard could have beaten Blaziken but the writers saw it fit for the time to boot Ash out,so they had Charizard "take more hits" thereby being why he lost. if you want to blame somebody( i know this is repetitve but) BLAME THE WRITERS!!!!!!!!!!

What a mediocre screw-up. This episode had SOME MUCH POTENTIAL, only so they can screw that up. The stupid writters throw May in to th screw the storyline, and show all evolutions of Mudkip and Torchic before even showing Grovyle, then not showing Sceptile until the 3rd ****ing League episode, the making of Massamune, also screwing up Charizard (I wanted Ash to win but why give Hyuuga A CHARIZARD, Magmar/Hundoom would have been better), now THIS! They once again ridiculed the Treecko line by giving Scepty a double KO and making Grovyle lose to a Metagross (giving both pokemon no wins during this battle), WHAT THE HECK IS THIS!?

At least it's not Johto's super *******ation, humiliating Charizard by making lose a Blaziken! Harisson must be using steroids on it because a Blaziken cannot beat Ash's Charizard maybe Hyuuga's but not Ash's.

This episode sounds like it sucked. I'm fed up with the writers. I proclaim that I could write better than them if I were to study for mayybe a year. Did I mention they SUCK? They should have let Ash win a league for once as the above posters have wrote. Truley frustrating...This is why so many people quit watching the show and the ratings dropped back during the pointless Orange Islands. Now where will Ash go for the next seasons?

Last edited by charizardpal; 1st July 2005 at 7:39 AM.

Er-hem!...Congradulations, Ash, you and your pokemon are hall of famers!"

Well, I watched that episode like a week ago...It's okay, but the battle is not as interesting as I expected it to be..Oh well...It's kinda sad for Ash to lose in the final round...
Overall, I give a rating 7/10 for the episode..^^

I can't belive it! First, Ash lost in the Indigo League becuase Charizard didn't follow Ash's orders. Then, He lost in the Jotho League because Ash's Charizard is not enough to beat Harrison's Blaziken. And Now he lost in the Hoenn League because...you know the rest. WHAT NEXT?! BTW, the only league he has won is the Orange League becuase he defeated Drake's Dragonite with his Pikachu.

LOL, it's amusing to see you people whining about stuff like this.

Do you know how long it takes for a person to actually get to the 'top' of a tournament? Take the world cup for example. Do you know how many countries there are that has participated in the world cup dozens of times and yet never won one? The one good thing about pokemon is how realistic it is when it comes to tournaments. It's very logical that a kid who's probably no more than 16 can't win a tournament yet. And the sole fact that a kid like Ash can even get to the best 8 is a great thing.

Give it time, please. Ash will probably win the very last tournament we get to see, just before the anime ends. I;m tired of you people saying stuff like 'OMG ASH IS SO STUPID HE DIDN'T WIN' or 'CHARIZARD IS SO STRONG, IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE THAT IT LOST!'

Face it. Charizard =/= God. It is a strong pokemon but not the strongest, and there are hundereds of pokemon out there that can defeat it. I know that can be hard to accept for hardcore 'Zard fanatics, but it's true.

Ash has competed in 4 leagues now, and had Kanto Pokemon in Hoenn. His experience is way up there.

Ash has mingled with the top pokemon experts (Drake, Bruno, Elm, Birch, Oak, gymleaders, etc) and you'd think he would have won. Many of those other trainers hadn't even left the continent yet. He should have won if not for the bad writers.

You dont seem to realize that he won the same place in Johto, 1 YEAR AGO, and with Johto/Kanto only pokemon. He mostly lost because he wasn't familar with Hoenn pokemon used by his opponent. He should have had the same edge to win a higher championship in this round.

Er-hem!...Congradulations, Ash, you and your pokemon are hall of famers!"

Ash has competed in 4 leagues now, and had Kanto Pokemon in Hoenn. His experience is way up there.

Ash has mingled with the top pokemon experts (Drake, Bruno, Elm, Birch, Oak, gymleaders, etc) and you'd think he would have won. Many of those other trainers hadn't even left the continent yet. He should have won if not for the bad writers.

You dont seem to realize that he won the same place in Johto, 1 YEAR AGO, and with Johto/Kanto only pokemon. He mostly lost because he wasn't familar with Hoenn pokemon used by his opponent. He should have had the same edge to win a higher championship in this round.

He's in the same place, but he had to won one more match to get there. He's only in the same place because the Hoenn league had double the participants of the Johto league.

And just because a trainer participates in four tournaments doesn't make him the king. Take Tetsuya for example. That guy must be at least 6 or 7 years older than Ash, and they only just won. A guy like Tetsuya could have entered up to 10 tournaments and lost each one. And Harrison probably entered much more tournaments than Ash (I'm only guessing), but he didn't win as well.

And is Ash the only one practicing? No he's not. Many of the other trainers are training too. It's not stupid that he got in the same place as last time. You are looking at this way to much in Ash's point of view. Just because someone was in a tournament three times doesn't guarantee him a win.

There are many good golf players that have participated in many major tourneys. Guys like Tiger Woods and Beejay Sing are only a fraction of the large number of golf players who play for life but never win the tournament? Now explain that please.

Hey now, this is an old thread! No idea where to post this, so I'm posting it here.

I got to thinking the other day... thanks to Phanpy's evolution not too long ago, it has swelled up to an enormous size! Donny's one big Pokemon. And I recalled that Swellow was able to lift up Tetsuya's own into the air and hurl the beast. That little stunt prompted me to wonder if Tetsuya's Donphan was slightly smaller than usual, since, after all, it is a large Pokemon. So I traveled to the episode pictures and...

Holy crap! I see now it wasn't smaller. In fact, it looked normal-sized, and next to Swellow, it was frickkin' huge! And me being the ever-buzzing Buzzhead, it ticked me off a bit!

I understand Swellow's Deus Ex powers and I've rationalized most of its other battles. Back when the episode aired, this little stunt didn't aggrivate me as much, but today it seems like Donphan was cheated a little to give Swellow some gravy points. Maybe it is because Ash has a Donphan of his own now that I give 2 cents about what happened, but I couldn't tell you and now I plain don't like it.

The entire ordeal seems like an insignificant thing to complain about (especially compared to other events that went down in the episode), but let V have his rant.

good point... stuff like that makes you wonder why we don't see Oosubame lifting Satoshi around places more often (then again, god forbid the writers bring in the concept of Fly and by-pass any potential fillers between two points). Anyway, I guess it was either that, or have even more of that "Tetsuya's Pokemon gets KOed, Satoshi's Pokemon gets KOed" pattern they had going on. Then again, if they did the latter, I wouldn't have much trouble imagining Juptor taking out Donphan, then it being the one to leave a dent in Metagross with Leaf Blade. Come to think of it, that's not such a bad idea, considering I like Juptor a lot and he was unable to get a single KO in this battle.

Yup, classes again. I'm gonna be at this for a while.

I translate for #Pocketmonsters (just because I know Japanese does not make me Japanese, stop PMing me).

I understand Swellow's Deus Ex powers and I've rationalized most of its other battles. Back when the episode aired, this little stunt didn't aggrivate me as much, but today it seems like Donphan was cheated a little to give Swellow some gravy points. Maybe it is because Ash has a Donphan of his own now that I give 2 cents about what happened, but I couldn't tell you and now I plain don't like it.

Swellow (and flying Pokemon in general) is just supposed to have incredible lifting strength for its size. It and that Wingull were able to lift Max and May back when it was just a Taillow, and some real birds can lift quite heavy objects compared to their body size. Not in Swellow's league of course, but I have read that Osprey are known to fly for short distances carrying fish that weigh even more than they do.

What were you people expecting? It was obvious that Ash was going to lose. If he did, the series would be over because winning a league is his dream. I don't care for the guy anyway, I'm perfectly happy that he lost to a respectable trainer, I am so bored of Ash now, we ought to stop focusing on him all the time, get a better trainer in and leave that guy to rot. We ought to have him win a league and then boot him out and feature somebody more interesting. I'm not bashing Ash, I'm just saying that if he wins a league, we ought to get a new character in. So many seasons with the guy is boring. TTFN!