WEBSTER, N.Y. (AP)  Police have found human remains in the burned-out home of the Webster, N.Y., ex-con who killed two firefighters and believe the victim is the gunman's sister. Police Chief Gerald Pickering said Tuesday the remains were found in the charred house that 62-year-old William Spengler shared with his 67-year-old sister, Cheryl. A medical examiner will need to determine the identity. Police say Willliam Spengler armed himself with a revolver, shotgun and military-style rifle before he set his house afire to lure first responders into a pre-dawn death trap on Christmas Eve. Pickering says Spengler "was equipped to go to war."

I know he was daft but even with that, what was the point to covering up a crime? He committed suicide.

Good question. I don't know, but I think your speculation might be correct. He probably wasn't real bright to begin with, and mean as a snake on top of that. I think most likely he started the fire to cover up the murder, then when the firefighters showed up, it escalated from there. Might not have originally intended to commit suicide. Who knows.

5
posted on 12/25/2012 1:13:59 PM PST
by JustaCowgirl
(Revolutions are not born out of success, they are born out of despair)

And because of the actions of these WACKOS we are supposed to give up our guns. BRING BACK THE STATE INSTITUTIONS AND LOCK THESE DANGEROUS PEOPLE AWAY FOREVER. It is the most loving and kind thing we can do for them and for us.

Read about this yesterday and called my sister-in-law this morning. She lives in Ontario, NY, which is not that far from Webster. I figured when they said they couldn't locate the sister, that he'd killed her, then set fire to the house. One online news article said the police are investigating the possibility that Spengler got the weapons from home thefts.

I worked in the NYS prison system for 25 years, but the guys picture didn't look familiar to me. I've been retired over 9 years, so it's possible my memory isn't like it was. The news articles were a little unclear as to the timeline of his incarceration and parole. One article said he'd served 17 years and had been paroled in 2009, another said he'd been parole in 2006. That's more than 17 years for a 1980 murder. So after reading several other articles, one in particular said that he'd been on parole for approximately 8 years since being released. That means that he'd probably been released around 1998, but was under parole supervision for 8-9 years after that.

The next door neighbor said Spengler didn't get along with his sister, and that after his 91 year old mother died this past October, Spengler had "gone crazy." I got news for that neighbor...the guy was crazy when he took a hammer to his grandmother back in 1980, and he never should have been released in the first place.

8
posted on 12/25/2012 1:23:44 PM PST
by mass55th
(Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)

I know, except it “says” the fire was meant to lure firefighters...although how can they know that?

The impression they wanted to leave was that he planned to shoot them after luring them there with the fire.

Your scenario has a gradually unfolding event with a not-too-bright, and mean, murderer (having killed his own grandmother) sort of winging it after starting out killing his sister.

The pattern of murdering family members seems clear. What isn’t yet clear is if he meant to commit suicide after he murdered his sister, meant to shoot the firemen etc or was this something that escalated.

The murderer had an arsenal of weapons ready for the arrival of any first responders, apparently, so if only from that, I’m leaning that he meant to do the entire thing from the beginning.

If true, then I don’t think the fire was to cover up a crime, since he was planning to kill himself at the end.

Seems like he was a destroyer...destroyed his grandmother, his sister, the house and the first responders he shot. And everyone connected to them...

Got his name up in lights, too, which was probably something he desired since he was a total loser otherwise...

I am a strong advocate that every time one of these liberal jackasses opens his yap to spout gun control, conservatives should respond that what we need is *not* putting such killers in mental hospitals, but to swiftly and surely execute them.

That is, clear the decks so intrusive federal judges cannot delay an execution for decades, nor overturn it except in the most egregious of circumstances.

Second, to declare the states “legally competent” to carry out the death penalty *as they see fit*, without federal judges nit-picking this function to death. If they want to hang, they can hang, or electrocute, gas chamber, firing squad, or lethal injection if they want. But it is up to them, the states.

15
posted on 12/25/2012 1:46:14 PM PST
by yefragetuwrabrumuy
(Pennies and Nickels will NO LONGER be Minted as of 1/1/13 - Tim Geithner, US Treasury Sect)

I actually want federal death penalty reform, so I don’t get glib on the subject. Orrin Hatch as chairman of the senate judiciary committee, is satisfied with the status quo, more or less, so until he is replaced by a conservative in a Republican controlled senate, such reform is unlikely.

19
posted on 12/25/2012 2:47:18 PM PST
by yefragetuwrabrumuy
(Pennies and Nickels will NO LONGER be Minted as of 1/1/13 - Tim Geithner, US Treasury Sect)

Wondering if “Maxwells silver hammer” came own upon sister’s head too like granny? Anyway since the murderous tasbard loves fire so much he gets to spend christmas day in fiery hell nice and toasty. He should have been executed or at least still be in prison for killing granny. Now all these victims would still be alive. Eff the non-justice Lieberal system.

According to Fox News, the killer was armed with a .38-caliber revolver, a 12-gauge shotgun, and a .223-caliber Bushmaster rifle. The Bushmaster is the same make and caliber semiautomatic rifle as the one used in the Newtown school massacre.

If you listen to the radio transmissions from the scene, it is clear that the guy used the rifle to shoot at the first responders as soon as they arrived, from behind a berm across the street from the fire, so he set them up in a trap.

I don’t watch Fox News, or any alphabet news station. I based my comment on the article posted, and that article did not identify the rifle. If it was a Bushmaster .223, then it is a very common rifle, and is not in reality an assault rifle (in newspeak, though, it is.).

27
posted on 12/25/2012 3:34:47 PM PST
by ought-six
( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)

I don’t watch Fox News, or any alphabet news station. I based my comment on the article posted, and that article did not identify the rifle. If it was a Bushmaster .223, then it is a very common rifle, and is not in reality an assault rifle (in newspeak, though, it is.).

28
posted on 12/25/2012 3:34:58 PM PST
by ought-six
( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)

“Murdered his 92 yr old grandmother with a hammer, and some idiot judge lets him out after only 17 years.”

That is nothing my cousin murder was released after his bail was reduced from 1 Million to $250,000.00. EVEN!!! when he bludgeoned an elderly couple who happens to be Berkeley Professors almost to death. Leaving the woman unable to speak and her husband. There place had blood everywhere yet this stupid woman judge I guess didnt think that was enough so she stupidly reduce his bail only to get out by using his house & boat as collatral and murder my cousin by cutting him up.

"Uh-oh, the evil military-style rifle was involved. Was it identified? Probably a single-shot .22."

It was a Bushmaster. I'll give the police and press credit here. In this article they avoided reporting this as a "deadly, highpowered, extra-triple high capacity automatic assault rifle," which is the verbiage typically used. I'm ok with referring to a Bushmaster as a "military style rifle"; That's essentially what it is. A Springield, a 98 Mauser, a Garand, or M-1 Carbine could also be characterized as "military style rifles."

From what I've heard, the chief of police's first impulse was to blame the killer, stating he should never have been released, and (to my knowledge) didn't blame the rifle. either the chief and press involved here have their heads screwed on right, or we're making some progress.

A Bushmaster is indeed a “military-style” rifle in appearance, as it is a clone of the M16. In functionality, it is not.

I, also, commend the police chief if he blamed the shooter and not the weapon, and applaud him for not calling the Bushmaster an assault rifle. We’ll see if he changes his narrative after the mayor and city council have a talk with him.

33
posted on 12/25/2012 4:08:21 PM PST
by ought-six
( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)

“. Well see if he changes his narrative after the mayor and city council have a talk with him.”

Won’t happen. Webster is a suburban town and doesn’t have a mayor or city council. Plus it is quite conservative or at least conservative leaning.

Add to that the fact that the head of the next agency involved is the Monroe County Sheriff Pat O’Flynn who would be welcome at any freeper’s table. He answers to the County manager Maggie Brooks who is also pro 2nd amendment.

We are dealing with good people on this one and you are NOT going to hear them blaming guns.

The news said a three page type written note. I doubt seriously this guy could type and he doesn’t look like the type of guy that would write a three page suicide note. I personally don’t believe he did.

37
posted on 12/25/2012 5:25:17 PM PST
by Duchess47
("One day I will leave this world and dream myself to Reality" Crazy Horse)

That judges name needs to be in the papers. Does the governor have to sign off on releases? Everyone involved in the process needs to be hung or tarred and feathered. Enough of this! We need our land back.

41
posted on 12/26/2012 6:34:43 AM PST
by demshateGod
(The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.)

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