Moved to Panama. "Robbed" twice. Need gun.

This is a discussion on Moved to Panama. "Robbed" twice. Need gun. within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I carry a S&W 642 Airweight 38S+P every day, almost all the time, only notable exception, hour or so on Sundays.
Easy to carry. Suggest ...

You could also carry in the front pocket of a light jacket. May sound sinister, but a revolver has the advantage of being able to be effectively shot while in the pocket of a coat / jacket.

I once carried a (standard size) Glock 31 (.357 SIG). I still do (depending on what I wear). If I was someplace warm, and I wanted to have an effecticve round with a firearm easy to conceal. A firearm that you hardly notice and light.

Small thin gun to me equals Commander sized 1911. Of course, I'm one of those people for whom the answer to the question "What gun should I..." always involves "1911" in some way.

If you are in a position where you don't want to deal with the "waiting period" on a dog - how about adopting an already grown GSD or other such large dog? I'm assuming Panama has unwanted/abandoned animals much like the US. Maybe the local US military base has some guard dogs that are ready for retirement - already well trained and they understand English.

One question;

Do they call Panama hats, Panama hats there - or do they just call them hats?

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"Panama has private firearm ownership. As a resident or citizen you can get one too. If you can purchase the gun you can carry it concealed on your person in your car etc. This is a typical scenario in several countries. In the USA a handgun to me was like Karl Malden and the American Express Card - never leave home without it, and while home rest assured one was always very close by. In Panama it is nice to not have to carry a gun - not needed. If you want a gun you can readily have one in Panama. Remember Panama is under Roman Law. If you shoot or kill a person even a home intruder or a person in a traffic accident you can be incarcerated by the police during which they investigate the death. I am told there is a usual 7 day limit on this. There is also the crime of passion exception to murder. If you came to find your spouse engaging in sex with another and you killed them both it would be a walk under crime of passion but you may have to go to jail for a few days while the investigation took place. Remember you are not in Kansas anymore. Having an unregistered gun will result in a trip to the jail. Panama is not a full auto jurisdiction (machine guns)- no private ownership of full autos. I believe things like semi-auto AR-15's are available. I understand that there are lots of full auto AK's floating around due to Colombians smuggling them in but that too can mean big trouble with the police - ill advised and unnecessary. Silencers, and things like any other weapon, are not available for private ownership."

Here is something to think about before shooting someone in a Central American country. It’s not Panama but its right next door and their legal system is similar

AM Costa Rica “Crouse case has some instructive elements “
“Roger Crouse, a Canadian, sits in a nondescript prison at the end of a long gravel road in Liberia. Several facts are certain:
• He’s is a pleasant person, well liked in his community of Playas del Coco.
• He killed a man in what mostly likely is self-defense.
• He made some fundamental errors, the telling of which will be instructive to expats here.
• His trial on a murder charge begins Aug. 6.
• Crouse is probably going to prison for 12 to 16 years even though any reasonable person would agree he does not deserve to do so. “Welcome to A.M. Costa Rica

“Judges set Roger Crouse free”
“Roger Crouse, the Canadian bar owner who languished in prison for more than a year, went free Tuesday when judges found he was not guilty of murder.”Welcome to A.M. Costa Rica

To be clear, the fact that you are being somewhat vague and evasive about your reason for being in such a potentially dangerous situation does not endear you to certain members of this forum. No one here likes the idea of giving advice on guns to someone who seems a bit less of upstanding. It just rubs people here the wrong way. I am not making any assumptions about you, but I want you to understand the reason that members here are asking somewhat pointed questions.

That said, this is what i suggest:

1) Immediate protection. A knife, small enough to conceal but large enough to be effective and more importantly, intimidating if the gangs there are as fickle as you have said.

2)Get the paperwork started on a pistol now. Really you cant go wrong with any of the Glocks except the full sized ones if you're looking for a CC pistol. Which Glock is better than another is mostly a matter of personal preference when you get down to it. They are lightweight, hard to rust, easy recoil depending on what model you get, and they're just plain reliable as hell.

3) WHAT IS YOUR BUDGET?
Depending on how much spare cash you have around, I would further recommend a few measures such as a dog, a back up pistol (BUG), possibly pepper spray as a deterrent to avoid having to deal with the police in situations where a bullet may not be warranted in their eyes.

To be clear, the fact that you are being somewhat vague and evasive about your reason for being in such a potentially dangerous situation does not endear you to certain members of this forum. No one here likes the idea of giving advice on guns to someone who seems a bit less of upstanding. It just rubs people here the wrong way. I am not making any assumptions about you, but I want you to understand the reason that members here are asking somewhat pointed questions.

That said, this is what i suggest:

1) Immediate protection. A knife, small enough to conceal but large enough to be effective and more importantly, intimidating if the gangs there are as fickle as you have said.

2)Get the paperwork started on a pistol now. Really you cant go wrong with any of the Glocks except the full sized ones if you're looking for a CC pistol. Which Glock is better than another is mostly a matter of personal preference when you get down to it. They are lightweight, hard to rust, easy recoil depending on what model you get, and they're just plain reliable as hell.

3) WHAT IS YOUR BUDGET?
Depending on how much spare cash you have around, I would further recommend a few measures such as a dog, a back up pistol (BUG), possibly pepper spray as a deterrent to avoid having to deal with the police in situations where a bullet may not be warranted in their eyes.

Thanks for the advice, but what leads you to believe I am not upstanding. Please quote one of my posts. I didn't walk out my condo with the intention of violently robbing someone, these little twats did.

You said I had been vague, and evasive... quite the opposite I would of thought, I've explained exactly what happened, and am thus asking advice on different weapons available to protect myself, and my dog while it is young.

Very well. I do not believe it was your intention, its just how you came across.

What does your home security situation look like? Solid deadbolts on every door, including possibly the bedroom? Locks on every window? Alarm system? In lieu of a shotgun or pistol, do you have a baseball bat, machete, or similar means of defense?
Just some things to think about...

If those thugs know the area you live in, they will soon know exactly where you sleep at night, if they do not already. Never underestimate a young man trying to prove himself to his friends. They will be reckless and unpredictable. Even if they have only been moderately threatening thus far, you might find one trying to crawl through your bedroom window with a knife one day, on a dare. Be ready for it.

Does the common gang member have access to firearms? If so a lite Bullet proof vest (IIA or better) might not be amiss for situations when you know you will have to cross their paths in less than ideal circumstances.
That may be a rather extreme measure, but to be honest you seem to be in rather extreme circumstances to me.

Very well. I do not believe it was your intention, its just how you came across.

What does your home security situation look like? Solid deadbolts on every door, including possibly the bedroom? Locks on every window? Alarm system? In lieu of a shotgun or pistol, do you have a baseball bat, machete, or similar means of defense?
Just some things to think about...

If those thugs know the area you live in, they will soon know exactly where you sleep at night, if they do not already. Never underestimate a young man trying to prove himself to his friends. They will be reckless and unpredictable. Even if they have only been moderately threatening thus far, you might find one trying to crawl through your bedroom window with a knife one day, on a dare. Be ready for it.

Does the common gang member have access to firearms? If so a lite Bullet proof vest (IIA or better) might not be amiss for situations when you know you will have to cross their paths in less than ideal circumstances.
That may be a rather extreme measure, but to be honest you seem to be in rather extreme circumstances to me.

It all depends on your cash flow and your threat level really..

Currently I'm renting a condo, has extremely tight security. Won't let anyone in unless they recognise them. And they have about 7 security guards, first of all they'd need to get past the gate (only entrance)... Then they'd need to be buzzed into my building.

Basically... nothing to worry about there.

I'm gonna go get a Baton tomorrow, and will take a look at the glocks while I'm there.

Get an asp or other expandable baton. Don't get the "lighter" batton as they bend when you hit people with them. Buy some shorts with belt loops and get a holster if you go the gun route. Or if you wear the elastic banded shorts look at the smart carry system.

When you start looking at different guns, make sure you pick one that you can find ammo, spare mags, holsters, etc. for. I have no idea what the gun market is in Panama or what caliber restrictions they may have (i.e. Mexico and their military caliber restrictions) but it'd be a waste of time to buy something in a caliber that's not readily available.

I personally prefer .45acp but I would imagine 9mm ammo might be easier to find in greater quantities - and at a more reasonable price. By all means, call your lawyer and get his advice on self defense laws there.
Jack

Seems to me this gang is testing your reactions. Get some pepper spray and watch your back. If you carry a firearm you must be ready to use it or they may take it away from you. Don't overlook the fact
that they all probably carry at least a knife. Keep us informed on how you are doing. Good luck !

... What are the standard rules on when it is acceptable to unholster a gun? It seems I may encounter a fair few situations here in Panama, been here 3 months and had 3 already (one I didn't mention above). --- If 2 guys are throwing punches, like they were tonight (hit me in face, but his punch was remarkably weak as it was the young guy who did it and I could tell he was kinda scared and just showing off in front of older guys).
Anyway, say they're throwing punches, would you unholster, point and tell him to back off... or only pull out the gun if I'm in more serious danger.

I believe if I'm going to draw, I'm going to use.
There's no need to brandish the weapon just to try to scare these guys off. Might work on day one. Day two the thug has you ambushed and a 2" pipe across the back of your head. You're out for a week, his cousin in the local PD and his other cousin who is (was) your condo security now own everything you once did.

Panama is pretty liberal about private gun ownership. I believe only full-auto requires a special permit. Civilians are even lawfully allowed to have sawed off shotguns. I would carry a combat-class handgun (most likely a Glock for ease of parts and availability) with a couple hi-cap mags on my person at all times. In the car I would get the DeSantis "Kingston" holster that hooks on the front of the drivers seat for fast access in a carjacking situation. I would also keep a few 30 round mags in the car as well as the sawed-off with some 3" Mag #1 Buck. Panama is beautiful but it is also pretty crazy so stay sharp.