[WW] 5.4 -Siege of the Fist

As were in between pulls tonight on Thok Ive been testing it and its still working the same way. I think its just the interaction with Spirit Link. Because it drops off when I dont pair them after two roars

My personal testing and simming has shown that both crit and haste are valued at over 0.5 agility on a straight patchwerk fight. With movement, target switches, adds and downtime, agility edges ahead. The actual difference is minimal. Sim your char to see what's best for you.

The biggest reason you gem agi is how well it collectively scales with weapon damage. Wep damage is king for scaling our dps so as you upgrade your weapons the gains from agi will become larger.

So doing some personal testing Ive noticed a dps increase when dropping 4p for higher ilvl off pieces with 2p. My secondary stats stayed almost static through the upgrade. Checked again on target dummies and I was seeing anywhere from 5-8k increase for each individual 10 minute iteration. With no buffs I was sitting at ~305k using 2p, with my lowest iteration being 289 with 4p and highest at 308k with 2p and higher ilvl offpiece

The biggest reason you gem agi is how well it collectively scales with weapon damage. Wep damage is king for scaling our dps so as you upgrade your weapons the gains from agi will become larger.

So doing some personal testing Ive noticed a dps increase when dropping 4p for higher ilvl off pieces with 2p. My secondary stats stayed almost static through the upgrade. Checked again on target dummies and I was seeing anywhere from 5-8k increase for each individual 10 minute iteration. With no buffs I was sitting at ~305k using 2p, with my lowest iteration being 289 with 4p and highest at 308k with 2p and higher ilvl offpiece

Define higher level offpiece. How big of a bump up was it? Were the stats on the items preferred?

As to stats Im currently at the white crit cap so I have been balancing into haste and out of crit slightly. The stats on the items arent perfect, but I havent finished simming for mastery levels and seeing if there is a swing in secondaries somewhere that I could hit as a balance. ATM my stat set up is crit to white hit cap > haste > crit > mastery.

As to stats Im currently at the white crit cap so I have been balancing into haste and out of crit slightly. The stats on the items arent perfect, but I havent finished simming for mastery levels and seeing if there is a swing in secondaries somewhere that I could hit as a balance. ATM my stat set up is crit to white hit cap > haste > crit > mastery.

Isn't it better to get your haste to your prefered level, and then all into crit, even if that means going over the white crit cap?

As far as I know haste is still the best stat, but only if you can use the energy it gives you, so once you reached your prefered haste level you can go all for crit. Crit after white crit cap is still worth about 82% of the crit before the cap (cause melee does around 18% of our damage), so it is still very good.

Edit: Just checked your armory, and our stats are really very similar, even though you are 2 ilvl's higher than I am. The difference is that I'm using TEB and you have AoC trinket, which explains me having the same amount of stats while being 2 ilvl's lower.

Isn't it better to get your haste to your prefered level, and then all into crit, even if that means going over the white crit cap?

This is just from personal experience, but I found a larger increase when I focused on crit over haste for secondaries. I've gotten quite used to using Chi Brew, and since I'm using AoC I can afford to have slightly lower haste atm. If/when I get a H TeB, Id get a little more haste to balance it out.

Some of the quick pointers would be starting to gem any off pieces you get around your WW set. Common sense yes, but that much crit will be wasted in heroic gear. You will exceed your white crit cap (60%) so it will diminish slightly in value. You would want mostly agi to help get those bigger weapon damage numbers, but as always sim yourself and check how to best optimize.

Your haste is actually under what I would say is the optimal range. Around 10-11k is where most of the high end WW monks are sitting at atm. Its a bit personal on the exact number you go for based on latency, and how much you are intending to optimize strictly for each fight. IE fights where you lose 2-3 seconds dps time on a semi regular basis for w/e reason you would want less haste. If you keep capping gcds at that low haste you just need to work on the rotation more. Make sure you arent hitting EB exactly on cd if it isnt going to be a gain. Ive talked to a couple people who do that with the cdr trinket, and it wastes potential resources. Even if it sits off cd for 3-6 seconds its better to not waste what you get out of it.

Chi Wave should take priority over a standard BoK filler so that will come with more practice.

Is the reason you recommend 10-11k(is this buffed or unbuffed) haste that you don't use ascension any longer?

Is Chi Brew the go to talent then?

I was finding with Ascension and like 6k(unbuffed) haste I was finding it hard to blow through all my resources regularly.

( FoF, Chi Wave( is this the best option for this tier? ), Energizing Brew )
I'm around 530 ilvl but have lucked out to have a 548 weapon also I have an Assurance of Consequences now.

Basically yes. Chi Brew, once the Hot Fix went in to tie Chi Brew Chi generation to our mastery, the change made the talent a bit too powerful and is now the go-to talent for overall Chi generation. However due to the lack of haste from switching to Chi Brew, you are still going to get haste starved waiting on energy for Jab and/or Rushing Jade Wind. To that end you increase your haste to compensate. That is why people say for those who do not have the Assurance to go 10-11k haste rating (there is no buff or unbuff option, just unbuff). If you are using the Assurance, to drop about 1500 or so Haste Rating from the 10-11k haste rating.

I'm approaching 570 ilvl this coming week (http://us.battle.net.../Jazzy/advanced) and I'm wondering about some old math that was going around about TTP and TED. Do you guys think grabbing a Normal Thok's Tail Tip would be just as good, if not better, than grabbing a Normal TED or even Heroic AoC? Kind of confused on trinkets and what to grab. My DK Tank still needs TTP so I'm not gonna get it any time soon and since I can't coin it.....

A heroic Thoks will certainly be bis for you and a noticeable dps gain. You will want to play with sims and see when it becomes enough of an increase to your monk to warrant taking over any str classes that may want it. From some sims I've done on the matter at roughly ~575 gs it becomes enough of an increase to be a comparable roll to your other would be recipients. Normal should still be an increase over a H AoC as that trinket is vastly over valued by many. The proc is all that it really gives you. But in a normal I'd run your own sims with it just to see how it turns out. At a quick glance at your gear Id say the Thoks would certainly be better than normal TeD.

Hi there ! I've been reading these forums for quite a long time now, it's time to write some words...

It seems a lot of monks trust the sims from SimCraft, although it appears that it doesn't take into consideration the cd reduction from AoC. Even with FoF set as the top priority, the cycle shows two casts separated by 25-26s minimum. Does anybody ever saw this inside his sims ?

Now, without talking about sims, I'm ok with the fact that the trinket is less efficient in some encounters where we cannot cast FoF on cd, but the dps gain of the trinket can't be "only the proc". Celestalon also said in recent tweets that WW monks should try to use FoF on cd to be optimal, so reducing its cooldown must be a good thing...

Hi there ! I've been reading these forums for quite a long time now, it's time to write some words...

It seems a lot of monks trust the sims from SimCraft, although it appears that it doesn't take into consideration the cd reduction from AoC. Even with FoF set as the top priority, the cycle shows two casts separated by 25-26s minimum. Does anybody ever saw this inside his sims ?

Now, without talking about sims, I'm ok with the fact that the trinket is less efficient in some encounters where we cannot cast FoF on cd, but the dps gain of the trinket can't be "only the proc". Celestalon also said in recent tweets that WW monks should try to use FoF on cd to be optimal, so reducing its cooldown must be a good thing...

It could be any number of reasons why it is still FoF is not being used more often in your Sim

a) You have too much haste and it's saying you will be energy capping while FoF is being cast

b ) try taking out some of the conditions for FoF (such as RSK is X seconds from coming off cooldown)