I have understood you are not very fluent in Finnish, so how can you tell that this one is a good satire?

I think it is as drab as the one by Eronen was. There’s no point in writing satire if your blade is this dull. The writer just lists endless prejudices of how he thinks his poor less intelligent imaginary countryside cousin sees the world. All of them based on stereotypes. This has been written 1000 times before.

Oh and I’m not comparing the offence level of these writings. Just pointing out this isn’t a very good text. Makuasioista ei voi kiistellä, I guess.

Indeed, I like the way that Jouni found a way to hate ‘everybody’! Why? Because it shows just how arbitrary the whole thing is, and how easy it is to find a reason to hate if you are that way inclined.

Now, tell me what profound or even less profound messages Eronen was trying to communicate?

LOL
Okay my Finnish is not perefct but i understand it well, no blame okay ha ha ha other wise we will have a new subject in Jouni K list of hates LOL
How r u JK, have a happy day
Hi MT, Mark best to u all
SMILE

There really isn’t anything in Finland to compare with Private Eye, but that is no great loss really. I think it’s fair to say that satire in Finnish is normally much more carefully crafted than “Piss off, Bandy Knees”. Sarcasm is also still a rarity. Try answering “hyvää päivää” with “onko?” or “hauska tutustua” with “varmaan” sometime and see the look of confusion.

I mentioned Olli above as an author to check out for good Finnish satirical writing. Here is an example dialogue with someone trying to fix a thermometer on the outside of a window:

“I am not blaming all Finns to be like him, why do you blame all Somalis to be like this Somali if he did rape her wich i doubt he did?”

The same song stuck in repeat mode. Whatever it takes to direct the conversation away, uh?

I. Did. Not. Say. A. Single. Word. About. Somalis.

You just don’t learn, do you? I was worried about the conversation tarnishing the reputation of immigrants. You showing you can’t read but *still* accusing people and lying about their words… well.. obviously you don’t think the tarnishing is going well enough so you thought to add your contribution to it?

It is too early to tell exactly what the impact will be. Rape is not exclusively an immigrant problem, and neither is fucked up youth. It seems most of the people in that facebook group didn’t really know what was going on. The group name was claiming they were innocent, but they still went to court and paid a fine, suggesting they were guilty. Some of them were trashing her. Sad to say that this is often the case with rape perpetrators or people that don’t respect the rights of women that they blame the victim somehow. However, the same can be said for victims of racist crimes too, where victims are all too often blamed. That seems to be a pattern amongst some that just don’t want to accept that one of ‘their own’ has done something wrong.

But let’s see how this pans out.

Väinämöinen

The vast majority of people on that facebook group were not saying outrageous things, so let’s keep that clear in the picture too. Most people wanted to know the truth. That seems quite normal reaction. There are many things said in internet forums that are quite disgusting.

You don’t make political policy on the back of internet forum comments!

Interesting behaviour from D4R by the way. I NEVER said anything about ALL Somalis. I only asked for an opinion about those Somalis that were involved. Yet D4R comes here and claims that I have said that ALL Somalis are guilty. What the hell is problem with this person???

Once again: Could you please comment what do you think of this. Finland gives a safe place for somali so he can get away from that horrible place. And in return this somali goes and rapes Finnish girl. What do you think, how this affect Finns? Do you think that it is right that these Somalis are still allowed to stay in Finland?

Yes it’s a scandal, Farang, as much as you don’t like it, and other crime in Finland is not going to make it any more or less of a scandal.

This rape case is something else. But attacking the ethnicity of the perpetrator is politicising rape, and not in the right way. I’ve campaigned a long time against violence against women and the attitudes of some of these young men don’t surprise me. But these are attitudes that are also deeply rooted in native Europeans. Just take a look in any men’s rights forum and you’ll find men scouring the internet looking for false rape claim cases and using this to cast serious doubt on rape statistics and also to place more blame on the victims.

These attitudes and actions should be condemned, but not because they are done by foreigners, but because they are just wrong.

How do Finns feel about it? Well, if we say that if the immigrants had never come, then the rape would never have happened. But you could say the same about the notorious sex tourism to Russia by Finnish men, where a lot of rape and abuse has also taken place, and also the child sex tourism of Finns to Thailand. If all Finns were stopped from travelling, then of course these things wouldn’t happen. But it’s a stupid argument, as i hope you can see. There is a lot of work to be done in Finland to make women feel safe, in their own homes and on the streets.

I’ve been studying this a long time – you might even say it began when i had to listen to and watch my dad best the crap out of my mum on a regular basis as a child. I don’t know anything about this? Anyhow, funny how i point out how some men try Tito diminish rape and violence against women, and here you are, bang on cue, complete with insults.

Child marriage is a custom that was common to many peoples in the past, not surprising given the average lifespan between 30 and 40 years and is illegal in all Islamic countries now, though you go and try to police the whole world. Still, i knew you wouldn’t give up an opportunity to bash Islam.

Elven: “I am not blaming all Finns to be like him, why do you blame all Somalis to be like this Somali if he did rape her wich i doubt he did?”

The same song stuck in repeat mode. Whatever it takes to direct the conversation away, uh?

I. Did. Not. Say. A. Single. Word. About. Somalis.

You just don’t learn, do you? I was worried about the conversation tarnishing the reputation of immigrants. You showing you can’t read but *still* accusing people and lying about their words… well.. obviously you don’t think the tarnishing is going well enough so you thought to add your contribution to it?

And there were two, not one. And you doubt it? WTF?

How about you comment on the Finnish guy who raped the woman? what, cat got your toungue? oh you can’t comment on him do you, because he have a pass just being a FInn, but all focus and attention is on every mistake Somalis do, so to use against them, right, well your dirty strategy is against you now 🙂

But you did relate them to a rape case and thus generalized my people to be a rapist, i will not tolerate that kind of stigmatizing my people, as i showed you, Finns can rape too but no one is generalizing all Finns to be rapist, why then you do to us? is’t time to grow up Elvin. some brainless habit you got right here.

you are cool, you wash your hands of everything. When you need to be a victim, you enroll quickly.

It was the behaviour on facebook (later IL) that was beyond comprehension. And Finland has to deal with this kind of trash

Then let’s condemn all rapes by all colored people, let’s not focus on one colored peolples rape cases, by doing so we’re making mistake of missing other rape cases done by other races, i am against rape, so let’s condemn all rape case be it done by a caucasian, african, asian.

Interesting behaviour from D4R by the way. I NEVER said anything about ALL Somalis. I only asked for an opinion about those Somalis that were involved. Yet D4R comes here and claims that I have said that ALL Somalis are guilty. What the hell is problem with this person???

Once again: Could you please comment what do you think of this. Finland gives a safe place for somali so he can get away from that horrible place. And in return this somali goes and rapes Finnish girl. What do you think, how this affect Finns? Do you think that it is right that these Somalis are still allowed to stay in Finland?

Well i don’t know about the case i guess we will have to wait how the court will judge him, if he is guilty then i condemn him for doing such a horrible thing, rape is a rape and it’s one of the disgusting crime against woman. Farang, you should also remember that, the majority of Somalis are law abiding good peole who just want cohabit with peacefully, this person if he did really rape her then he belongs to prison. That’s my take out on this.

I agree. But I also think the wrong expectations are being brought to bear here. Immigrants are being treated like a visiting football team, where if one player behaves appalingly, the whole team is tainted. We must start to treat immigrants as individual citizens.

I see this is another problem that comes from politicising immigration and particularly of politicizing ethnicity.

Minä en näe siihen muuta lääkettä kuin tiukan maahanmuuttopolitiikan.

I do not see this as medicine. Remember, nearly 90% of rapes in Finland are committed by Finns. There is a lot of work to be done if men in general are to give women the respect and safety they deserve.

They deserve the bad press in this case. I hope they come to their senses. But it looks like there is a blame game going on here, and for outsiders, it’s very hard to know what to think. From what I understand there was a conviction and a fine, correct me if I’m wrong.

The immigrant reputation is likely to be dented for those that are already pessimistic. I think media stories tend to reinforce our existing beliefs rather than change a lot of beliefs. Maybe less people are on the fence than before, and maybe too that when the press is always negative, which by definition it is of course, then it accumulates. These are youngsters (the facebook commentators) we are talking about, wet behind the ears and full of testosterone. I don’t think we can judge the entire immigrant community based on their actions.

How is condemning rape and opposing violence against women a double standard?

You talk about things you have no idea about and possibly no intent to find out about either.

And how on earth did you come to that conclusion?

I find that insulting and hurtful, considering I had to live through domestic violence as a kid. Maybe you don’t know what it’s like to have violent parents and then go to school the next day and play like everything is normal at home!

I was talking about rape and rape statistics and then you go and drag up a study about domestic violence!!! WTF? And then you have the cheek to tell me I don’t know what I’m talking about.

Defending disguisting ideas will create you a lifetime job. What is your reward? Ordinairy people spitting in your neck.

Care to explain why you think I am defending disgusting ideas? A warning Väimäinön, my threshold for tolerating personal abuse on this blog is low, so tidy it up or you’ll lose the right to express yourself on this blog!

Here, this surprised me to. Should we start working to make women less violent (in families), shouldn’t we?

I have no problem with that. Violence and abuse against men is an under-researched topic. This is another example of a debate that became politicised and public perception has probably suffered as a result.

However, the study you linked to can be misleading. It lumps serious assault with homicide, thus hiding the fact that consequences of male violence are typically more severe. But on the whole, I would like to see a lot less violence and abuse within relationships, regardless of the gender. Violence and abuse are signs of dysfunction in the relationship and poor management of emotions and thoughts. Violence can be reactive and out of insecurity, or it can be to establish or reinforce power. Not all perpetrators are the same.

It is not good that men are laughed at when they report domestic assaults. I am amazed how still today it is okay for women to be seen slapping a man on television, while the reverse is at least unacceptable today. I would like to see equality in this issue. Perhaps you jump to too many conclusions by thinking that I am not sympathetic to violence against men.

Some men are married or have partners that suffer psychological problems that lead to her provoking anger in order to take the victim role as a way of shaming the man and gaining dominance in the relationship. Such women are typically possessive, impossible to please, and emotionally extremely dysfunctional. It certainly is not the straightforward idea that men are violent and women are victims.

Nevertheless, men MUST take responsibility for their actions too. Men that get into dysfunctional relationships must find alternative ways of coping than becoming aggressive or succumbing to emotional abuse or provocation; they must take responsibility for their own naivety in understanding emotional relationships and not simply become passive victims themselves. Likewise, exactly the same can be said for women when it’s the man that is being abusive, provocative and aggressive. In other words, people in general can benefit from more emotional and relationship literacy, so that couples don’t end up in these destructive patterns of behaviour. Often, the couples do ‘love’ each other, even if that deteriorates into a power struggle and abuse.

Sounds like you are only fulfilling your own preconceptions. Can you really compare a ‘facebook’ page of comments against PS parliamentary aides news articel on UusiSuomi?There is clearly a different profile and quite possibly also privacy issues at stake that could limit reporting.