Liz Wolfe: Our sponsors: Paleo Treats. I just talked to Nick and Lee, the folks behind Paleo Treats. We’re going to do a little podcast with them, because they are the most interesting, fascinating…

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Amazing people on the planet.

Diane Sanfilippo: They are the most interesting couple in the world.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing} yeah!

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: “I don’t always eat Paleo Treats…” lol, jk yes I do.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: So, they’re awesome. We filled up a good hour. What’s cool about them is, you know, paleo is a part of their life, but like I talked about in the podcast with Nick and Lee, it’s the world is so much bigger, you know? And Lee has got it in her head at some point in her life that she was going to walk, like on foot, across north Africa. She’s worked with camels. I mean, she’s had the most interesting {laughs} the most interesting life in the world, and the same with Nick, and one of the most inspiring things that we talked about was kind of how to have the courage to make your life what you want it to be. It was just a really, really cool interview, so I’m excited to get that out there.

Diane Sanfilippo: Sounds like the “woo-woo” people who liked my interview with JJ will like that one, too.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, that’s why it was so perfect. Because I was like, Dang, you know, this is the stuff that we talk about . like, in a smaller concept, we talk about sometimes it’s difficult to go outside the box and eat paleo or eat real, whole food when your family is like “that’s weird, why are you doing that?” Well, Nick and Lee have basically built their lives around doing something that other people maybe wouldn’t feel like was ok to do, or just kind of thinking and living outside the box. And it’s the same concept, it’s just a wider paradigm. So, I just loved everything that we talked about. That will be up, I think, within the next few weeks.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. And how fun that they have this really cool company where they get to help folks eat amazing, delicious paleo goodies?

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, they are super awesome. And, did you know that their office is literally open to people? They’re just like, yeah, come over. Come hang out.

Diane Sanfilippo: I would totally walk in there all the time and just ask Lee to cut me some samples all the time. {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: And she totally would. And I think that we should actually do that one day.

Diane Sanfilippo: She cuts big samples. I think it’s Lee who cuts the big samples. So are we going to see them at Paleofx? I think they’ll probably be there? Maybe? Yes?

Liz Wolfe: And their offer for our listeners is 15% off, just enter the code BALANCEDBITES, one word, at checkout over at Paleotreats.com. . Pete’s Paleo, bringing fine dining to your cave. Another one of our sponsors. If you’d like to make eating paleo a little easier on yourself, check out Pete’s meal plans. The meals are great for the nights when you’re just on the run or out of time and you need real food fast. So true. There have been times when I get home, and I’m like, I just can’t. I can’t do it. I’m either going to eat a pound of bacon, which I guess that’s not such a bad thing. I’m not making my case here very well, but just to be able to pull some Pete’s Paleo meals out of the freezer and put them in the skillet and heat them up, it’s like, wow this kind of saved my buns.

Diane Sanfilippo: And I’m ok with that, but that’s pretty much, you know I come home from a trip and I’m away for 5 days, and I realize there is eggs and pickled herring in the fridge, and that’s pretty much it {laughs}, so nice to have options.

Liz Wolfe: Like, I could have some sardines topped with ketchup.

Diane Sanfilippo: Or, you know, for the folks who just are not cooking every single day. You know? Even if you do have the time and you just don’t feel like cooking that day, you know? This is kind of that thing you can keep in your freezer that’s a healthy, real food meal as opposed to some of that boxed junk that’s at the grocery store.

Liz Wolfe: Totes.

Diane Sanfilippo: Totes.

Liz Wolfe: Pete’s Paleo is generously offering our listeners a free pound of bacon. Well there’s your pound of bacon! You can just eat that.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} With the purchase of any meal plan. And the code to enter is BBLOVESBACON, one word, at petespaleo.com. Just note that just 1 cent will come off your order total with that code, but they’ll put your bacon in there. That’s what your cart will look like. And finally, Chameleon Cold-Brew.

Liz Wolfe: Available at many grocery stores nationwide. Check out their website for a store locator, or do as we do, and order it up online. Chameleon Cold Brew is organic, fair trade, super smooth, and rich. We love it iced or warmed up, black with grass-fed butter and even with coconut milk, that’s what I’m drinking right now. The last time my mom picked me up from the airport, which, as we were talking about Diane, is like 90 minutes away. So I was kind of like, “Mom? Will you drop me off?” and I gave her some Chameleon Cold Brew, just like as a present. Because I don’t know, I have this problem where whenever I see people, I want to give them something.

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh yeah! You gave me a giant jar of mayonnaise the first time we met.

Liz Wolfe: I did?

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. A 32 ounce jar. I’m pretty sure that’s the very first time we ever met.

Liz Wolfe: Well, it sounds like me.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} You gave me a giant jar of the wilderness family naturals mayonnaise. I was like, “hi Liz, nice to meet you,” {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Nice to meet you, here’s your mayonnaise. Sometimes I’ll just give people the cold liver oil. I’ll just carry it around in my purse.

Liz Wolfe: It’s like I’ll feel less awkward if we can part by me giving you this gift, and you’ll remember that. But anyway, I gave her some Chameleon Cold Brew, and I got a little late night tweaky addicted text from my mom the other day.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: She’s like, hey, I really like the Chameleon Cold Brew stuff, do you have any more of that? {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: The first ones free {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: Sorry mom. Anyway, for our listeners, enter the code BALANCEDBITES at checkout over at chameleoncoldbrew.com to save a whole bunch off your order. I think it was upwards of 20%, which would easily cover shipping, so.

Diane Sanfilippo: Some kind of great offer.

1. Liz’s book came out! [7:38]

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. That’s a good offering. This is my offering. Alright, so, my book came out! Woop, woop!

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: It came out fo’ sho, and I received word at about 4 a.m. the other day it actually hit number 94 of all books being sold on Amazon.

Diane Sanfilippo: Crazy pants!

Liz Wolfe: I mean, crazy pants! That includes every book! New York Times’ best sellers, books about squirrel anatomy. I mean.

Diane Sanfilippo: All the books.

Liz Wolfe: All the books.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s crazy. And you know, what’s actually kind of funny, too, is that as cool as that Amazon ranking is, it’s probably selling really, really well also in stores. Because that Amazon ranking doesn’t tell you anything about what’s happening in the stores.

Liz Wolfe: That’s true.

Diane Sanfilippo: And I know folks are watching people post pictures and talk about some of their favorite quotes, and I just watched Laura Schoenfeld from Ancestralize Me, I just watched her video review of your book.

Liz Wolfe: Ugh! I can’t get it to load.

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, it’s so cute!

Liz Wolfe: Awww.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m sure people are just excited and running out to the store and grabbing a copy in the store, too, because I know that people just can’t wait for shipping every time {laughs}.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: So, that’s really awesome. I’m super excited for you. It’s really a great book. You know, at the end of the day, I think it’s awesome that we can teach people about nutrition, but the thing that I’m never great at is also entertaining people while it happens. And I know I kind of always joke about that, just not being the funny one.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} I think you’re entertaining.

Diane Sanfilippo: You know, I’m the funny one if you’re there to laugh at me.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: You know, laughing with me, my sense of humor is like, I don’t really know where it is. But laughing at me is usually the best way. But anyway, I think there might have been two or three random jokes in my book, and it was like, awkward and weird, and the people who find them are like, wait, she said junk in the trunk in this book?

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: I think in one of the recipes, I wrote “turkey bacon is not bacon.” And it’s like, that’s my way of {laughs}. I take this stuff seriously but this is actually really funny. But your book is just really entertaining.

Liz Wolfe: I committed to it.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah!

Liz Wolfe: I committed to that.

Diane Sanfilippo: But the distinction.. and I kind of did the sales pitch when we were on the paleo tour, which we’ll talk about here in a second.

Liz Wolfe: Yes. Because I was so nervous! I was so nervous. You had to do my sales pitch for me.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s literally my 80th event is coming up.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: So I have a count in EventBrite, and the next even is number 80. So I’m seriously like the mom/MC/what’s the mom on the Partridge family? Or whoever drove the bus. I feel like I’m the leader of the family when we’re on tour {laughs}. Because I’m like, ok, here’s what’s going to happen. Anyway, even if you already know about what this whole paleo thing is, I think there are still so many questions that don’t get answered by a lot of the books that are out there. You know, even in my book, I talked about a little bit of sort of a history of the food pyramid and stuff like that, but not really getting into it too much, because I just had so many other things I was really covering, and I know that the way that you explain how we got here and what to do about it, and just the very level headed balanced, logical but funny, just plain legit, like real information is, I don’t know, for me it’s just a better way to learn about what this whole paleo thing is all about than just an “in defense of paleo”. Gosh I hope nobody ever writes that book.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} “In defense of paleo.”

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} but you know, why legumes are bad, why grains are bad, why this is bad, why this is bad. You know? I just feel like that’s tired and we’re over it.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: So I just really like your approach, and also it’s entertaining, and people want to read a book and laugh out loud and have that person on the airplane next to them be like, why did you just snort your mineral water?

Liz Wolfe: Your mineral water {laughs}. The coolest thing so far has been; I still feel like I’m removed from this. I feel like I’m watching this happen to somebody else. Because sometimes I just doesn’t feel…

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, I understand.

Liz Wolfe: It doesn’t feel real. It’s strange.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah.

Liz Wolfe: The coolest thing has been, because I don’t think I’ve ever announced this, but I set up eattheyolks.com, I set up a website for the book where there’s like a 20-page preview of the book, what it’s about, about me, and resources for people that find the book first, and then they’re like, I need more help, so they can go to the website and get some resources and whatever. So, a lot of folks, well not a lot of folks, but a few folks who were at the events in Texas that we just did, were not familiar with my work necessarily. They knew Bill and Hayley, they’ve been doing it for a long time. They knew your work, you’ve been doing it for a long time. But some folks just hadn’t heard of my book yet. And despite the fact that my elevator pitch for my book was absolutely terrible.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: I still, I said, hey, while you’re waiting in line to get your books and maybe get your books signed, check out the website on your smart phone, read a little bit of the book and this is what it’s about. And I had people come up to me and say, ok, you sold me, between then and now. I wasn’t going to get your book, but I did and I’m really excited. And that was cool, but what’s also been cool was, I was worried that it would only appeal to a small group of people who {laughs} have warped, lame senses of humor like I do. But my farmer, my local farmer, has ordered a case to give to people with their cow shares. So like, that guy is into my book and he’d never heard of paleo before. And that’s just so cool. That, along with all the people on Instagram who are taking pictures of their dogs and their cats and their rabbits, and their birds with the book, it’s like I feel like a lot of different people are getting into it, and it’s like yeeaaahhh! It’s so cool. It’s so exciting. So there you go.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, I think it’s pretty awesome. I thought that was really cool, too, people were like, I just read it. Or even reading the chapter titles, isn’t that one of the other recommendations you had.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: Even if you don’t want to read an excerpt, read the chapter titles. So, anyway.

Liz Wolfe: Just look at the table of contents.

2. #Paleotour updates [14:01]

Diane Sanfilippo: Do you have an excerpt. Oh, should we first talk about where we’re going next?

Liz Wolfe: Yes.

Diane Sanfilippo: And then maybe we’ll have an egg-cerpt?

Liz Wolfe: Yes.

Diane Sanfilippo: I love puns. {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} I love puns. Do you love puns? I love puns.

Diane Sanfilippo: Um, Denver. We’re going to be in Denver April 26th. Two days before my birthday. What?

Liz Wolfe: You’re like MJ. You’re turning the same age for the fourth time.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} She did say that.

Liz Wolfe: Mo’ Mercedes, mo’ problems.

Diane Sanfilippo: Um, so yeah. April 26th. So we’re almost 2 months out from that now, so you have plenty of time to RSVP. I think it’s actually happening in a store that can hold a bunch of folks, so we’re not, I don’t think we’re in any danger of having to shut people off from RSVPing, but definitely have lots of folks coming to that one already. So if you aren’t sure, or you don’t know the details, go on to balancedbites.com, click on the events page, and you can get all the details there for where that’s happening. Grab a friend. I know there are already some folks who told me on Instagram who’ve told me that they’ve booked a flight, which you’ve enlightened me to the fact that that’s kind of normal around Colorado to just hop little flights all over the place. Yes?

Liz Wolfe: Frontier airlines.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. So I thought that was really amazing, so I feel very honored if somebody is going to do that to come see us for an afternoon. So, yeah. I’m really excited, I’ve never been to Colorado, so I’m pumped about that.

Liz Wolfe: Awesome.

Diane Sanfilippo: Alrighty. What else?

3. Liz’s Eat the Yolks egg-cerpt [15:41]

Liz Wolfe: So I’m going to do a little egg-cerpt if you’re ready for that.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ready.

Liz Wolfe: I’m going to keep doing this, because people seem to like it. Though the book is out already. Alright, so this is the subsection in Eat the Yolks called, “Why cruelty free is a fallacy”. And here we go. “Unfortunately, many of us are educated about animals by the entertainment industry. And through that lens, we acquire an image of nature that is wildly and tragically inaccurate. It’s an image with a rosy filter, one that ignores the fact that nature itself is, and always has been engaged in a cycle of life and death. A cycle that seems cruel and violent, rather than innate and natural when we’re raised on Disney instead of Discovery. Nelson puts it this way.” That’s Richard Nelson, author of Heart and Blood. “If the characters in Bambi’s world are distortions of real animals, the forest they inhabit has almost nothing in common with an actual environment, and almost totally lacks a sense for ecological relationships. Rabbits, mice, and grouse live harmoniously with carnivores, like skunks, raccoons, and great horned owls. Herbivores take an occasional nibble, but predators never eat. This is not reality. In fact, Honey I Shrunk the Kids is more realistic in its honesty about the perils of living in the wild, although in this case, the wildlife is very small and the wild is the Szalinski’s backyard. In nature, creatures kill and eat one another. From the top of the food chain to the bottom, something, somewhere, is being eaten or used by something else. For us to attribute feelings and sentience only to humans or large creatures commonly farmed for food is convenient but hypocritical. Organisms from ants to bees to mice have been found to have the ability to feel, cooperate, and form relationships, and not eating meat doesn’t save these less frequently eaten creatures. Any of them can be killed off in the cultivation of beans, rice, corn, and even chlorella. Just because we’re not chewing on it, doesn’t mean it didn’t suffer on our behalf , although keeping it out of our mouths also keeps it out of sight and out of mind.” That’s it.

Diane Sanfilippo: Oooh.

Liz Wolfe: Ooh, good one!

Diane Sanfilippo: I did not get to that part yet!

Liz Wolfe: I think that’s a strong section.

Diane Sanfilippo: That’s really good. That’s good stuff. It’s; I don’t know. That’s the stuff that for me is the part I can’t communicate to someone who is feeling like eating animals is just wrong, because {laughs} I feel like that is just a fundamental fallacy. I don’t know; somewhere along the way, they got the wrong idea, basically.

Liz Wolfe: We want things to feel easy.

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: We want things to get to the point where it’s easy, and I just did this interview with; actually, it’s funny, an old high school buddy of mine, Lewis Howes, who is now doing all kinds of stuff in the build your business circuit, and he asked a ton of questions about this type of thing, and I almost felt bad after I got off the line with him because I felt like I didn’t explain things in a way that would make it easier for people to eat me. Because for me it’s not easy. When I think about one day killing one of my chickens, or having cows that we’re going to get in the spring and using them for meat. That’s really hard. It’s not easy, but it’s also one of those things where if you’re not taking too much, if you’re not being greedy on any level and you look at your food as, ‘this is nourishment and I’m lucky to have it’, which is another thing that I talked about with the people from Paleo Treats. In their travels around the world, the one thing that they’ve noticed is food and nourishment is not guaranteed to most of the world. We are incredibly lucky to be able to make the choices that we have. But if you’re looking at your food as a source of nourishment, and you understand the way our biology works, it’s still not going to be easy. It still doesn’t make me… I don’t glaze over the fact that I eat animals. It’s an important thing to me. So, I can’t make it easy.

Diane Sanfilippo: I guess from the compassion perspective, but, I don’t know, I guess there’s just that part that people feel like… oh, I don’t know. The intellectual side of it is what gets me tripped up.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: Where people feel like it’s any logical thing to intellectualize diet. That’s the part where I’m….

Liz Wolfe: Right.

Diane Sanfilippo: We’re doing too much thinking. Stop thinking so much. That’s what you kind of hit on there, was the innate what happens in nature. Here’s what would happen, and I think when Robb Wolf was on that I-Caveman show, it was like a perfect testimony.

Liz Wolfe: Mm, yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: It doesn’t mean that we take eating animals for granted. We appreciate it, and we have gratitude for the life that was given for ours, but I think there is just this element of intellectualizing diet where humans just want to feel so special and smart, and I think that’s not that smart.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} It’s not smart.

Liz Wolfe: I like it. Cool. To the questions?

Diane Sanfilippo: Questions?

4. How bad is conventional meat? [21:02]

Liz Wolfe: To the questions. Alright, the first one. “How bad is conventional meat?” And I can’t remember if we’ve answered this before…someone may have asked it before, but still it’s a good one. This is from Stephanie. “I completely understand the importance of eating grass fed quality beef, pastured raised poultry, pork, etc. At this stage in my life, I simply can’t afford it. I do try and buy organic meat and butter where I can, and all produce, but this isn’t always part of my financial reality. My question is, how bad is conventional meat? If I’m going to eat conventional meat, should I avoid fatty cuts and stick to the leanest available? I want to give people hope on this question, and I talk about this in the book, too. When you think long-term about these things. You know, we think about, at this point in my life, I can’t do it. At this point in my life, what can I do? Well, at this point in your life, you can put a dollar and your spare change away in a jar to save up for the day when you can buy a side of pork. Because this is spending differently. And here’s something that’s really encouraging, and I hope people feel encouraged about this. Five or six years ago, when I first started eating this way; 4, 5, 6, I don’t know. I was having to go an hour to a sustainable farm that was selling their meat for an exorbitant price. It was great meat, but my choice was to either spend my money on one thing or the other, and I chose that. So, we made some shifts in our life and what we were spending money on, and I was able to do that, but of course not everybody can. Not everybody can go to a farm that sells their meat for $10 a pound, or Whole Foods that’s selling grass-fed ground beef for $12 a pound, that type of thing. Not everybody can do that. However, now there are more farmers and more ways to connect with local farmers than ever before, and yes you may have to buy a side of pork, but from the perspective of affordability, once you get to the point that you can do that, it’s actually far more affordable. So, my husband and I did the calculations, and right now, we didn’t sell our old house, we have another house that we had to move into, we’ve got 2 mortgages, we’ve got a farm, we’ve got a lot going on and we broke. So this is really important to us, too. This side of pork that we bought, including the freezer that we had to buy to store it in, still came out to $3.50 per pound. And that is nothing. You couldn’t find that in a cut of conventional meat at the store. So I hope folks are encouraged by that. It does require that you shop a little bit differently and you kind of shift paradigms a little bit, and it’s not possible for everyone, correct. But don’t give up. So, that’s what I want to say about that. As far as the question, how bad is conventional meat. I think, to borrow your phrase, Diane, the reality is, conventional meat probably falls short in ways we actually don’t even know yet. It’s true that there is actually a deficiency in certain amino acids when it comes to corn-fed beef. I believe it’s deficient in tryptophan, I think I say that in my book. But I do think some meat is better than no meat. So, I personally would avoid the fatty cuts, stick to the leaner meats that you can find, and try and supplement your fats, which are really, really important, with. Yeah, that’s just kind of how I feel about that. And if you could work some liver in, which is a really inexpensive meat that’s rich in vitamin A, and then get some egg yolks in, which are rich in vitamin D, you can get some of those really important fat soluble vitamins while your ate it.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, she mentions that she is buying all of her produce organic, and I wouldn’t actually prioritize that. So I’ve talked about this in my book as well, and also the paleo perfectionism post, as well in a blog post I wrote about budgeting when you eat paleo, and really the most important thing to get the best quality are your fats. And so, this is where the grass fed butter; I think she mentioned that, organic meat and butter when I can. You know, I think it is more important to get an organic grass fed butter than to get all organic vegetables. I would just focus on the dirty dozen and the clean 13. The dirty dozen are the ones that you want to get organic, and the clean 13 are the ones that are totally fine to get not organic. And just a hint at how to decide, if you don’t have that list with you, which I’m pretty sure you can grab it on a smart phone, but anything with a really thick skin you definitely don’t need to be buying that stuff organic, so things like banana, avocado, anything else that your peeling, citrus, things like that versus berries, or anything where you’re eating all of the skin, lettuces, broccoli, those kinds of things whereas peeling the skin is just a little bit more protected, so just keep that in mind. I would shift the priority to spending more on the quality fats. Especially if it is grass fed butter, because you’re getting such great nutrient density from that, and that’s where, as you mentioned Liz, if you’re getting leaner cuts of meat, you want those fats that you’re eating to be more nutrient-dense fats. So even if you could invest in lard that your buying that’s pastured lard, where you get a small container of it, you don’t need to eat a ton of it at a time, but maybe with your lean meat, you’re able to eat some of that. But again, that’s something that you may need to kind of save up for. And I do think, you know I talked about this recently, I can’t remember who I was talking to, but every once in a blue moon I’ll post a picture of what I’m eating, and there will be a steak. Not every once in a blue moon I post a food picture, because that happens almost daily {laughs}. Not that often am I eating things like a steak, but when I do, I don’t buy steak at the grocery store to get my grass fed T-bone. I am not paying $30 a pound for that steak. So if people see that and think it’s elitist, I just paid about $4 or $5 a pound for a quarter of a cow. So yeah, exactly what you said. You have to kind of save up for that and make the decision that that is what your commitment will be. Obviously, if you’re in college or if you’re in a situation where you don’t have an extra freezer, it’s not always possible.

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: So I’m with you on kind of all those notes on what to buy instead. But this is where just, as you get older and everybody kind of changes their living situations as time goes on, did she say she was in college? She didn’t. But we were kind of just talking about that because that comes up too. It’s just a matter of storage and things. But, you know if it’s a financial thing, you’ve covered the bases but I do think that there’s always room for reestablishing your budget and reestablishing what you’re spending on. So it may not be a very short-term answer, like perhaps you’ve got a car that costs X-amount a month, or perhaps you have a higher cable plan than is really necessary.

Liz Wolfe: No, no, no. Game of Thrones is coming back, so.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} I definitely don’t get every channel. Like, we’ll go to watch something, and I’m like, oh we don’t get that channel. I have no idea. I’ve basically told the cable company I wanted the Food Network and whatever would get me the Food Network would be sufficient. But, those are things that may seem small, but there are so many things that happen as a cascade. Sorry, but if you have fewer channels, then you have a little more time to cook. A little more time to maybe search around for that farmer, or a little more time to drive to get that pig share or that cow share. So it becomes this cascade ripple effect of what happens when you shift your budget and your priorities around. Those are just a couple of the places where you can look to do that. But, I don’t know, those are kind of the tips that I have.

Liz Wolfe: Take heart.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: It is possible.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s not so bad. But I do think that the big takeaway is that it’s important to make it more affordable to get the better quality stuff, because anybody who thinks that those of us who eat all grass-fed beef at home are going to the grocery store and buying $30 a pound steaks is sorely mistaken because we’re not.

Liz Wolfe: Nu-uh.

Diane Sanfilippo: I know every single person who I’m friends with in this community, we buy animal shares. All of us. And I’m pretty sure the drop freezer was $100, or $150, and as you said, over the longer term how that ends up evening up the price of the actual meat, I mean, it’s so cheap.

Liz Wolfe: Oh my gosh, it’s so cheap.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Freezers are kind of cheap, too, they didn’t used to be this cheap.

Diane Sanfilippo: I don’t have one of those anti-frost ones, so it does have to be defrosted maybe once a year.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah me either.

Diane Sanfilippo: But, whatever. It just means we have to eat all the things, and then restock it {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. Ok.

5. Can you OD on certain foods? [30:00]

Liz Wolfe: Cool. Alright. “Can you OD on certain foods?” Christina asks, “my husband and I eat salads with dinner every night, and we have for the 1.5 years we’ve been married. All of a sudden, I have a complete aversion to them. I’m completely fine with cooked veggies, but the idea of raw greens with tomatoes and avocados all of a sudden grosses me out. Do you think I’ve OD’d on a certain nutrient? Thanks so much. I’m looking forward to hearing your thoughts.” This is total sacrilege, but this has happened to me with eggs before. I can’t believe I’m saying that.

Diane Sanfilippo: I don’t think it’s ODing on a nutrient, I think it’s just, you’re tired of eating something that you’ve just now eaten for a year and a half.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} A year and a half.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, I don’t think it’s a nutrient thing, I think it’s more a palate thing. And you know, if we think more about what is ancestral in an approach to eating, we would be eating seasonally, and we probably wouldn’t have the same foods available for 1.5 years exactly in a row, so that’s just kind of a basic take there.

Liz Wolfe: And this is different from an intolerance to a food.

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: Because you can, we got that question while we were in, I believe, Houston, building up an intolerance to a food that you’re eating constantly.

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: And there’s a huge argument for variety, for sure.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. I mean, I think this is just natural. It happens. It’s actually one of the big cases for not keeping yourself in a rut. Because, she’s not saying this happened to her, but this is one of the reason why some people end up going off the rails. They are trying to eat the same “paleo foods” every day every week. When I see the people {laughs} You know, we love you, but when I see the people who are prepping their entire meals for a week, and it’s literally the same thing in containers across their countertop for 7 days in a row, I’m like are you kidding me?

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: I would turn over and start scratching something. I can’t eat the same thing every day, in the same combination. You know what I mean?

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: It doesn’t mean I don’t eat sauekraut almost every day, or certain things almost every day, but the same combination of the same foods over and over again. I just think, you know, let’s be a little more creative than that, grab a cookbook, get some ideas, and see what else is in there. I don’t have an issue with salads. I love salad; I’m so lazy with vegetables sometimes, that it’s like I literally just eat salad because I can’t be bothered to cook something.

Liz Wolfe: {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: But, you know, crack open one of the many, many cookbooks we have out there, and you’ll grab a few new ideas that will take you really far in just changing up the types of things you’re combining for a quick veggie or something. Salads are mostly raw, so I think a lot of times people are just not wanting to cook veggies, but there are some really quick recipes that you can get under your hat and get used to making and just change it up.

6. Sports drinks, and a homemade alternative [32:57]

Liz Wolfe: Ok. Sports drinks? “Hi! What are your views on sports hydration drinks. I stay away from Gatorade and other mainstream drinks, but I’ve been using a packet from Skratch labs here in Boulder. I try and eat clean and as natural as possible. It seems strange to add hydration “stuff” to my water. From a performance standpoint, I do seem to notice a difference.” She gave us the link to Skratch labs. “I just read the ingredients, and the first listed is cane sugar, so I probably know the answer. I look forward to hearing what Diane has to say about it.”

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, me.

Liz Wolfe: What do you have to say about it?

Diane Sanfilippo: Um, well. I’m looking at what’s in here. It looks like they’re trying to do a little bit of some mineral balancing, magnesium and potassium, a little bit of calcium, sodium. Honestly, if this kind of thing makes you feel good when you’re working out, a better way to do it would be to just mix something up yourself. Like a full complement of minerals and a mineral salt, which this has some salty qualities to it, or some of the minerals that you would be getting from salt. A few pinches of sea salt, or a Real Salt or one of those type of salts, a few pinches of that, some maybe maple syrup or even just honey, some lemon juice and some lime juice and just shake that up. It looks like part of what you’re getting here, in one serving, is 10 grams of carbohydrate, which is about 2, well let’s see 10 grams, there’s 4 grams in a teaspoon, 4-5 grams, so it’s like 2 teaspoons of sugar, so that’s basic fueling for athletics. It’s not like the biggest deal in the world, that your getting sugar in if you’re about to go workout, but I just don’t prefer something that’s already premade like this. I just think, you know, squeeze some lemon, a pinch of salt, a teaspoon or two of honey, melt it down and go ahead and have that. I mean, that’s just me being the homemade kind of gal that I am. I won’t use flavored or mixed up protein powders, but I do have the 100% grass-fed organic whey protein here if we want to try it, if Scott and I want to have that after our workout, and I’ll add my own cocoa powder a little bit of maple syrup and just do it myself so that I know everything that’s in there. That’s kind of my take on that. Did you see the ingredients in this, Liz?

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, I mean I just think just looking at the ingredients, I’m like, I could just make this with lemon juice, a pinch of salt, and some honey.

Liz Wolfe: Yep, I agree.

Diane Sanfilippo: So basically, you’ll be on the master cleanse.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: Just kidding {laughs}. Oh my gosh.

Liz Wolfe: Isn’t that Beyonce’s thing? I got real mad the other day when somebody said I had the same numbers of hours in the day as Beyonce. I was like, yeah but I don’t have 80,000 people… literally she probably doesn’t even have to move.

Diane Sanfilippo: We talked about that on the podcast! Somebody posted it on Instagram.

Liz Wolfe: Ugh.

Diane Sanfilippo: It was like a mug that says {laughs} you have the same number of hours…

Liz Wolfe: And I’m like, yeah, well, she literally probably doesn’t have to lift a finger. She’s probably lifted from bed, and somebody wipes the sleep out of her eyes, takes the sweaters off her teeth.

Liz Wolfe: We talked about, we had a salt question that’s close to this type of question during the Houston tour, and I was just reading and I can’t remember where, kind of this whole, maybe this is what my next book will be about. Just the kind of shoddy dealings behind some sports drinks, like Gatorade and the science that they purport has, you know, something to do with your level of performance, or whatever, and of course it’s important to replenish, but I think it’s smart to avoid things like Gatorade and the mainstream drinks. But also pay attention to whether or not your craving salt during the day. Like, on a regular basis. Because I think what we talked about at the signing was that a lot of folks, when they go paleo, they’re taking out all these processed foods that have a ton of salt in them, and so basically they’re putting themselves on a low-salt diet and not adding enough salt back to truly replenish and establish a good electrolytic balance in the body. So, definitely make sure you’re getting enough salt and enough electrolytes during the day, and I’d be curious as to whether that affects whether or not you feel better…

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: With a drink like this.

Diane Sanfilippo: And it’s not just seeing a list of ingredients and having it seem scary, because magnesium, calcium, potassium…I think it’s important that when you look at a list of ingredients to know what it really is and where it could come from naturally in more of a whole food form. That’s the perspective I have when I read that ingredient list. Like, cane sugar, dextrose? Whatever, those two things are sugar. Ok. Not a big deal, this is intended for an athlete. We’re not freaking out that there’s sugar in this thing that’s intended for an athlete. You need some form of carbohydrate; those just happen to be a more simple form of carbohydrate, and that’s acceptable and that’s what you want. You don’t want to have to go through a ton of digestion. You want that to be an end usable form of the carbohydrate. So that part, that’s the thing I just want to throw out there. If it lists citric acid, that is usually derived from corn, so for people who have intolerances, etc, that’s why I just like the idea of making it yourself. I feel like once you get used to doing that, just like any other habit, it won’t be a big deal to take a spoonful of honey or two, and some lemon, or lime, or orange, and a pinch of salt. You won’t taste the salt. If you put a couple of pinches of salt and you do put the sweetener in there, you’re not going to taste it. So, just throwing it out there.

Liz Wolfe: I honestly cannot remember if we’ve done this one. Let’s just do it. Let’s talk about sweat.

Diane Sanfilippo: Let’s do that one, because I don’t, oh man.

Liz Wolfe: I think I read this, and maybe saw it when it came through, but I can’t remember.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.

7. Sweaty husband [39:49]

Liz Wolfe: Alright. Sweaty husband.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: {laughs} “My husband sweats so much at night that sometimes he can’t sleep. He said it never happened before we started sleeping in the same bed.” {laughs} Blame her. Jeeze. “We just got married. We have 100% cotton sheets and a faux down comforter. On the warmth scale, it’s on the cooler end if that makes sense, and we keep the thermostat on 61 degrees.

Diane Sanfilippo: Holy cats, 61 degrees? I’d be shivering.

Liz Wolfe: I feel like the tip of my nose would fall off.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’d be shivering!

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. “While his sweating doesn’t keep him up every night, I notice he’s pretty warm most nights. He’s been strict paleo for about a year now, except for the occasional lunch meeting or Sunday dinner with his family. His meals are typically 2-3 organic eggs for breakfast, a piece of chuck roast, grass fed, with broccoli for lunch, cauliflower, and a two grass fed hamburger dinner. He will sometimes eat an organic green apple with almond butter for a snack. Supplements are GNC men’s daily, magnesium calm,” I think that’s natural calm magnesium, “whole food D3 for maximized living, creatine in rotation, 3 weeks on, 2 off, I’m not entirely sure of that cycle. I don’t believe he’ll be taking it long-term, though.” I don’t know.

Diane Sanfilippo: My first inclination here, if it’s something that didn’t happen until you were sharing a bed. I don’t know, she didn’t really say… she didn’t say if this is something that changed with his eating habits. So that’s kind of where I’m like, well, hmm. If his food has anything to do with it, we’re not really sure. But I don’t really know where his carbs are if that’s kind of his standard issue daily intake. It looks like meat and nonstarchy veggies and some fat. So, 2-3 eggs for breakfast, with what else I’m wondering. I don’t know how big this guy is, this doesn’t sound like a lot of food but I’m not really sure. He could be eating maybe too low carb, so I would just look at that and if he’s not eating carbs I would add those in. This is something that happens a lot, just with people who wake up a lot overnight, or who end up with poorly regulated body temperature. If, for whatever reason, your adrenals are at all stressed by a low-carb state, it’s going to then affect your thyroid, and that will then affect your body temperature. So, that’s kind of one thing I would look out for, just nutrition-wise. I don’t know how big your bed is {laughs}. If you’re in a full or a queen bed, perhaps a king bed would help. I definitely notice feeling a lot warmer sharing a bed and that stresses me out a little bit. So, I think there’s just some changes that happen when you share a bed that I think most people would agree that while the peace of mind and the comfort and the emotional uptake you get from sharing a bed with someone, I don’t think most people think it’s actually easier to sleep that way. Would you agree? Disagree?

Liz Wolfe: I woke up 4 times last night because my husband snores like a chainsaw, so.

Diane Sanfilippo: Right.

Liz Wolfe: I don’t think I’ve gotten a full nights’ sleep in the last 4 years {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. I mean, I think that is really part of it. Like, honestly. I’m curious to hear what people have to say. Maybe you can write in with comments on the podcast post, or something. But, I just don’t think that sharing a bed is the most conducive to improved sleep. So, I’m not saying you shouldn’t share a bed but, I don’t know, can you get a bigger bed? {laughs} I don’t know how big your bed is.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: Cotton sheets. I don’t know. I’ve heard, have you heard of wool actually being cooler. I know that sounds weird.

Liz Wolfe: Actually, I was going to say something about this, but this is… wool is pretty expensive, like the good stuff, but one of the things my husband and I saved up for for like 5 years was a brand new bed, and we call it our grass fed mattress.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing} We need one of those.

Liz Wolfe: It’s called Savvy rest. It’s not cheap, but we got a Savvy rest mattress, which is totally nontoxic, straight up baked latex from the rubber tree, and we got all wool bedding, and it’s actually been really, really good. I’ve had nights before where I’ve been in a cold sweat and so has my husband, but now that I think about it, I don’t think that’s happened since we got our wool bedding. I got the wool comforter from holy lamb organics. Holy crap it was expensive, but it was a totally worthwhile investment. They’re really good people.

Diane Sanfilippo: Uh, I don’t have any of those things.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, well.

Diane Sanfilippo: But I don’t have my sleeping situation and temperature dialed in like that, and I tried to sleep at 68 degrees last night, it was definitely really cold for me, but I think it’s just the way that the air circulates in the upstairs of my house. I don’t think it’s my fault. I don’t think it’s actually that warm up there.

Liz Wolfe: It’s not your fault!

Diane Sanfilippo: Not my fault! Uh, what’s next?

8. What to use for sunscreen [44:55]

Liz Wolfe: Next. Ah, ha ha. Oh, we’ve done this one.

Diane Sanfilippo: Let’s do it again.

Liz Wolfe: Do it again? Alright. This is from Bevin. “What do you use/make for sunscreen? I think you’ve mentioned zinc, etc, but which brand or recipe? Have you heard of this news that mineral makeup and sunscreen can actually damage cells?” Yes I have heard of that. Part of the problem with industrial sunscreens that have like retinoic, oh gosh now I can’t even. I talk about this in the Skintervention Guide a little bit, but some of these conventional sunscreens, the so-called broad spectrum sunscreens, the ones with oxybenzone and avobenzone, actually when they come into contact with UV rays, there’s all this evidence that they actually are converted into something carcinogenic. Some kind of carcinogenic compound. So, I don’t touch conventional sunscreen with a 10-foot carrot.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m reading episode 126, and we totally did talk about this.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah, we did talk about this.

Diane Sanfilippo: So that was like a few weeks ago.

Liz Wolfe: Go back to 126.

Diane Sanfilippo: Well people keep asking us about it.

Liz Wolfe: No, it’s true.

Diane Sanfilippo: Did we talk about which sunscreen we used in that post? I don’t see it.

Liz Wolfe: I can’t remember. In Houston we did.

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh we did talk about it.

Liz Wolfe: I talk about it in the book too. Shade, cover up, or use badger balm, which is a zinc-based physical sunscreen.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok. Sorry, I didn’t remember this one.

Liz Wolfe: I remember the name.

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, that’s because I wasn’t here! This is the one you did without me. That’s why I didn’t remember it.

Liz Wolfe: Oh, there you go.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok, I’m sorry. I just had to say that I feel better about the fact that my memory wasn’t quite that bad.

Liz Wolfe: {laughing}

Diane Sanfilippo: That this was just a few weeks ago, because I wasn’t there and I didn’t listen to that one yet.

Liz Wolfe: You’re having a crisis because your birthday is coming up? {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Let’s do this one. This is kind of a 101 question, but I think it’s good. This is from Dennis. “why is natural, no sugar or salt added, peanut butter not included on the 21-day Sugar Detox, but whole milk is? Peanut butter has less sugar than milk.”

Diane Sanfilippo: Oh, I get this question so often. So, there are a few reasons for the food choices on the 21-day sugar detox, and not all of them have to do with actual sugar content. What? {laughs} So people get really tripped up on this thing, and people get tripped up when they start reading the labels on their food, because then they’re like, wait a minute. The grams of this versus the grams of that. A lot of what I’m looking to do on the 21-Day Sugar Detox is number 1 change your habits. And so for the folks who are eating peanut butter, it’s shifting them to buy something different. So, for those of you out there who used to eat a lot of peanut butter and no longer do, you know that this happens when you just have a different choice to make, and that’s one of the things I talk about a lot with how to help your friends and family kind of get on board. Literally having them make a new choice at the grocery store is step 0 or step 1 to this whole change that is going to happen and the rest of their lives. Because if you think about all the things we ask people to do when they change what they eat, it’s not just changing what you eat. It’s changing where you shop, it’s changing what you buy, it’s changing where you put it away in your house. All of a sudden, your fridge is packed and your pantry is empty. The fact that you have to cook, the fact that you have to do dishes. All these other things have to change when you change the food that you’re eating and what you buy at the grocery store. So, number 1, it’s to force people to chose differently. And so peanut butter is a default choice for a lot of people, so now they have to chose something different, whether that’s almond butter or sunflower seed or something to that effect. So, that’s one point. Another sort of strike against peanut butter, I guess, is it can be very high in aflatoxin, which is a mold that is very common amongst peanuts. Peanuts can be harvested and can sit in large vessels for a very long period of time before they are made into peanut butter. I don’t think it’s quite as common that it grows on other types of nuts, and I don’t know if that’s just because the peanuts themselves how they’re grown, how they’re harvested, how they’re stored, or if it just happens to be the sort of almost commodity nature of peanut butter. There’s so much more of it produced in the country than other types of nut butter, perhaps because it’s cheaper, or maybe it’s cheaper because there’s more of it, I don’t know what the economy is on peanut butter! But, aflatoxin is a mold that is known to be carcinogenic and have much higher quantities in peanut butter. So, I want people to get that stuff out of their diet. Those are pretty much the two main reasons. The third one is sort of, it’s a little bit of the paleo slant, where we’re getting rid of peanut butter because it’s not really a nut, it’s a legume. I want to get rid of foods that people might be sensitive to. So, peanut butter is not included on any level of the program. Whole milk is included on level 1 and level 2; it’s not on level 3, and that’s again to get people away from the processed foods and to make a new choice. It also is to start injecting the idea in their brain that full fat dairy is not dangerous or unhealthy. So, for people who are looking at this from a grams of sugar perspective, you’re going to lose out on this every time, because that’s not the point of the program. The point of the program is not actually to eat zero sugar. Because I wouldn’t include fruit, I would probably not even include a lot of vegetables. Like, if you wanted to eat zero sugar, you’d be on a zero-carb diet. That’s not the point of the program. So, the issue with the whole milk is really more to get you over to A) a new choice; B) eating more fat, and C) just avoiding the processed junk. I think the biggest thing that happens with people when they change the dairy products. First of all, they’re not usually eating much cereal anymore when they’re on this program, so most people don’t need to buy milk. But I think it’s a bigger issue around cheese and yogurt, for example. So people are just seeking out new brands and buying some different things. That’s kind of the big thing on why peanut butter is not included, why whole milk is, and then recognize that whole milk is not included on level 3 of the program, which is the most paleo-friendly level of the program. Sort of the most strict and, I don’t know, tightest guidelines. That’s it. That’s all I got. Did I lose you? Are you muted? Hello?

Liz Wolfe: Totes muted. I was sups muted.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: Super muted.

Diane Sanfilippo: Didn’t we do this next one already?

Liz Wolfe: Actually, I don’t remember, so maybe we should put a little “pa-ping” on that.

Diane Sanfilippo: I’m going to search the blog.

Liz Wolfe: Let’s do the white rice one. Just pop over to that, and that might actually take us to about closer to an hour. We’ll see.

Diane Sanfilippo: I think you may have done this one also on 126. I can’t, uh…

Liz Wolfe: The brown or white?

Diane Sanfilippo: No, the other one. Anyway, no I don’t see it on there. Ok, my search function on the website is meh. {laughs} We’re working on that.

Liz Wolfe: You know what I’m going to do? I’m going to jump to the hardboiled egg problems. I like this one.

Diane Sanfilippo: Ok.

10. [52:35]

Liz Wolfe: Alright, Scott asks, “This question is maybe more for Liz. I’ve switched to buying my eggs only from local farmers unless they are all out. The one problem I’m having since this switch is the ability to no longer be able to enjoy my hardboiled eggs as much. I used to, like, hard-boil half a dozen for snacks or a quickie breakfast when I didn’t have time to scramble them with butter, but these fresh eggs, which are often maybe only 1 or 2 days old when I buy them, will just not peel. Have you folks noticed this issue? I eventually can get them peeled, but the whites are destroyed and I have a pile of tiny little pieces of shell.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: One suggestion I got on the web was because these are so fresh, I should maybe try always have a dozen than are 3 weeks old on hand, but that seems crazy.” Scott, it’s not crazy. You should probably do that.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah. Short answer.

Liz Wolfe: Short answer, do that. Hayley from Health Starts in the Kitchen told me something really fascinating the other day, but I don’t know if this would work for eggs that have already been refrigerated. But basically, when we gather eggs from the chicken coop, leaving them out overnight without refrigerating them equates to an extended period of time of aging. It’s basically aging the eggs, and can make them a little bit easier to work with. However, I don’t know if that would apply to eggs that have been refrigerated already, that have gone from the farmer to the refrigerator to the market, or whatever. But, yeah, I’ve tried a ton of things to try and make it a little bit easier, like hard boiling in baking soda, because I believe the pH has a lot to do with how easy these eggs are to peel, as well as whether or not the inner membrane has separate a bit more from the shell. Totally just speaking off the top of my head, so I’m not entirely sure. I do think maybe Michelle at Nom-Nom Paleo has some kind of strategy for hard boiling eggs.

Diane Sanfilippo: She definitely has a post on perfect hardboiled eggs somewhere.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. So look for that.

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, older eggs are definitely a better way to go. When I had the meal delivery business, that was kind of… I would buy eggs to make all different kinds of stuff, and always keep like 1 or 2 dozen for an extra week before I would hard-boil them. Because that definitely makes a huge difference. I don’t know what’s happening to the shell or the membrane in that time, but yeah. It seems crazy, but it’s not. It’s a pretty simple solution. Just maybe mark, use a marker on the side of your carton that just says something about not using them for fried eggs or something like that in the meantime, and then save them to hard-boil for another week or so.

Liz Wolfe: Buy some extra eggs. And these eggs, fresh, fresh, fresh eggs will last for a long time. The ones you get at the supermarket have a two-week expiration date, and stick to that.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs}

Liz Wolfe: {laughing} Because we don’t know how far they’ve come or where they’ve been, but fresh eggs from a local farmer, those are good for a long time.

Diane Sanfilippo: I never pay attention to eggs-piration dates. {laughs}

Diane Sanfilippo: Unless it’s like a fish roe that’s in my fridge, that I get a little leery on. Like, fish I’m a little more weary on. But eggs, I’m like, I didn’t crack that shell yet. We’re going to be just fine.

Liz Wolfe: You do the sniff test.

Diane Sanfilippo: If I crack it in the pan and it smells or looks funny, that’s how I know it’s off. I use the old fashioned way, so I look at it and I smell it. That’s how I know.

Liz Wolfe: You told me one time that you should let soups and stews get to room temperature before you put them in the fridge.

Diane Sanfilippo: Mm-hmm.

Liz Wolfe: Is that real?

Diane Sanfilippo: Yeah, that’s real. It’s more for stews and chilis and things, and the reason is, if you put something in the refrigerator while it’s still hot, and it’s a thick liquid, the center of that liquid, or if you go to freeze it, the center of that liquid can’t cool to temperature below 40 degrees as quickly as the outside of what’s in that container, so basically you’re going to chill the outside and the center won’t chill fast enough. So you want to let that come to room temperature, or maybe not as cool as room temperature, but you want to let it cool down from the high temperature before you then refrigerate it. Does that make sense?

Liz Wolfe: Mm-hmm.

Diane Sanfilippo: The center of whatever you’re trying to chill is insulated and protected by the whole rest of that bowl or container, so that may not chill fast enough. The timing on it for the ideal food safety, and I do not stick to these strict rules in my own kitchen, but if you were working in a commercial kitchen, food can only spend a total of 2 hours between 40 and 140 degrees. So, 40 degrees and below is where your refrigerator should be. Your fridge is probably somewhere between 35 and 40 degrees, and over 140 is, you know, you’re cooking it, right? The temperature inside your chicken when you’re cooking it should be up to 165, so if you think about between 40 and 140, that’s basically like your food shouldn’t sit somewhere at room temperature for more than 2 hours. That’s just for inhibiting bacterial growth and things like that. If you allow something to come down in temperature for about an hour, sometimes, if you make broth for example or chili, or a stew in your crock pot, moving it to a cool vessel, so if you’ve got your big crock pot, dump it into a big pot or a big bowl that is obviously heat safe but that isn’t still hot from cooking, that will help it cool down a little bit faster. I mean you can just, before you go to jar the stuff or before you go to refrigerate it, just stick your finger into the center of it and make sure it’s not really hot still. So, that’s legit. It’s legit!

Liz Wolfe: It’s legit.

Diane Sanfilippo: It’s legit!

Liz Wolfe: My rule of thumb is if my dog wants to roll around in it, it’s probably gone off.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: I don’t know if you can pass that rule of thumb along to your food safety friends.

Diane Sanfilippo: He knows. Like, if the chicken smells a little weird, and I’m like, oh, I’ll just rinse it off and see if he’ll eat it. He will not eat it. He’s like, nope, that’s not good. So, he definitely knows.

Liz Wolfe: Oh, here’s my next experiment we’ll have to talk about some time. I’m going full on no shampoo at all. Not no-poo, not baking soda, apple cider vinegar. I’m going full on water only. So I might lose some friends, but hopefully not you.

Diane Sanfilippo: {laughs} Good thing, well we don’t ever have to really hang out in person, so.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: We can still be friends. Yeah, somebody asked me about that on Facebook the other day, about what I use for cosmetics and shampoo, and I do use the mineral makeup for cosmetics because I feel like it’s probably the best of the evils, but I don’t have the shampoo thing down yet. I tried for a little while. My best effort is to not wash my hair that much. {laughing}

Liz Wolfe: yeah.

Diane Sanfilippo: So basically, like, maybe twice a week I wash my hair. But, I’m definitely not all paleoed out when it comes to that stuff.

Liz Wolfe: It’s not even 80/20. I think it’s good to try and get to a point where you’re washing your hair less, and doing a little bit less of the conventional crap, but in general.

Diane Sanfilippo: I somehow feel more compelled to make things more natural, and this might just be false logic, but in my mind, if it’s going to go on my skin and stay there,

Liz Wolfe: Yes.

Diane Sanfilippo: And get more absorbed, I’m like, you know the moisturizers and things like that I just use coconut oil and all really natural stuff. But if I’m applying it and rinsing it, then I have a less compelling reason to feel like it needs to be perfect. Anyway.

Liz Wolfe: I tend to tell people that. In some ways, it’s not.

Diane Sanfilippo: We’re still absorbing things through our skin.

Liz Wolfe: Yeah. But, that’s kind of the way I look at it too. Anyway. We will talk more about that later. So, we’re rounding out an hour, and we’ll close it out. If you’ve been enjoying the podcast, help us spread the word by leaving a review in iTunes, please. Also, for that matter, if you’ve enjoyed Eat the Yolks, please leave me a review on Amazon or Barnes & Noble. I’d really like to keep the positivity flowing. And I love to hear from you. So, that will help keep both the podcast and my book in front of lots of folks. Until next week, you can find Diane at http://balancedbites.com/, and you can find me, Liz, at http:realfoodliz.com. Thanks for listening. We’ll be back next week.

February 12, 2015

Holy crap! I wake up frequently and sweat a lot, too! I keep my thermostat around 60, but it still doesn’t help my sweating in the middle of the night. my diet is very similar to the diet described. Could carbs really be the issue?!