hey bab, I forget to mention, I had to "fast forward" most of Rafter's service games on your link. Too boring and predictable, in addition to I'm not keen on players that gift points. I loved Sampras in his earlier part of his career.......he would stay back and rally but Sampras had a GREAT forehand unlike Rafter.

Could you provide a link to a Hewitt/Rafter or even Hewitt and Sampras match?

Touche'

I've been waiting for that! Rafter is all attack all the time, isn't he? Maybe I wouldn't go that far

That said, I definitely would like to see more variety. Is that too much to ask, my friend?

we understand each other I think.

yes, more variety....I'm all for that. You realize I'm one of the few ones that actually understand your stand. I said, bring a FULL grass season, a full fast indoor season. That way, little kids in academies around the world would learn am more "All court" game with a flair of S&V.....the surfaces will reward it.

At this point, there is nothing you can do for the pros...they will not change no matter what. But the future can be better for sure and I agree you there.

Yes, indeed I have noticed that you "get" me. Likewise. I've never thought poorly of you now or going way back, especially since you and I are allies I always miss you when you're not around. But for all I know, you've always been here, just hiding out in the chats

So either poly isn't considered a major breakthrough or it's use preceded the 20 year limit. Which is it?

Didn't he talk about Borg in the late 70s already using 80 psi, which effectively provided him the "dead feeling" string?

Yes, technology has advance from the 90s but the big point all along it's the players and academies teaching the game with a whole different perspective than what your 90s players did.

The grips along can change the dynamics tremendously. The Rafa's of the world, grew up with a full western forehand and a oversize racket unlike Sampras who developed his strokes with a wood racket.

He did, but I wouldn't consider that 'widespread' use as I stated.I didn't think the discussion had as much to do with the teaching as it did with the actual technology itself.

Technology was enabler for the teachings......but the technology was already in place by the early 90s. That's all, the strokes from today's pros are maximizing that technology and at this point, you are better off re-calibrating the tour by getting away from a HC predominant sport to a equal opportunity for all surfaces with a greater spectrum of speed while perhaps restricting "some" of the technology for future generations

hey bab, I forget to mention, I had to "fast forward" most of Rafter's service games on your link. Too boring and predictable, in addition to I'm not keen on players that gift points. I loved Sampras in his earlier part of his career.......he would stay back and rally but Sampras had a GREAT forehand unlike Rafter.

Could you provide a link to a Hewitt/Rafter or even Hewitt and Sampras match?

Touche'

I've been waiting for that! Rafter is all attack all the time, isn't he? Maybe I wouldn't go that far

That said, I definitely would like to see more variety. Is that too much to ask, my friend?

we understand each other I think.

yes, more variety....I'm all for that. You realize I'm one of the few ones that actually understand your stand. I said, bring a FULL grass season, a full fast indoor season. That way, little kids in academies around the world would learn am more "All court" game with a flair of S&V.....the surfaces will reward it.

At this point, there is nothing you can do for the pros...they will not change no matter what. But the future can be better for sure and I agree you there.

Yes, indeed I have noticed that "get" me. I've never thought poorly of you now or going way back, especially since you and I are allies I always miss you when you're not around. But for all I know, you've always been here, just hiding out in the chats

I appreciate that!

Indeed, sometimes....some BS it's going politically and I think..."I know bab most be having a field day with that"

I can' really post as much as I would like, there is always the nagging from the significant half so I can't enjoy all my hobbies. But I do follow for the most part.

So either poly isn't considered a major breakthrough or it's use preceded the 20 year limit. Which is it?

Didn't he talk about Borg in the late 70s already using 80 psi, which effectively provided him the "dead feeling" string?

Yes, technology has advance from the 90s but the big point all along it's the players and academies teaching the game with a whole different perspective than what your 90s players did.

The grips along can change the dynamics tremendously. The Rafa's of the world, grew up with a full western forehand and a oversize racket unlike Sampras who developed his strokes with a wood racket.

He did, but I wouldn't consider that 'widespread' use as I stated.I didn't think the discussion had as much to do with the teaching as it did with the actual technology itself.

Technology was enabler for the teachings......but the technology was already in place by the early 90s. That's all, the strokes from today's pros are maximizing that technology and at this point, you are better off re-calibrating the tour by getting away from a HC predominant sport to a equal opportunity for all surfaces with a greater spectrum of speed while perhaps restricting "some" of the technology for future generations

That is where we disagree.However, we agree that the tour should move towards and equal opportunity for all surfaces and perhaps restrictions on future tech advances.Of course we both know this is pure fantasy..... The manufacturers won't let that happen.

BTW, very FEW players uses a 100sq size..........even club players don't use that big of a size, damn even myself a nobody in tennis uses a 98sq size. Do you know how many pros uses 100sq? I know Rafa is one, in the other hand Novak uses a 93sq if I'm not mistaken. Didn't Pete went up to 88sq recently? I know Wilson made one specially for him.

BTW, very FEW players uses a 100sq size..........even club players don't use that big of a size, damn even myself a nobody in tennis uses a 98sq size. Do you know how many pros uses 100sq? I know Rafa is one, in the other hand Novak uses a 93sq if I'm not mistaken. Didn't Pete went up to 88sq recently? I know Wilson made one specially for him.

Be careful Luggy, it takes a big man to admit when he's wrong.

I went about halfway through the list of top pros and nearly half use 100 s.i. heads. Over 75% use poly, mostly the Lux.

I guess the big question is when exactly did this major shift in head size and strings (i.e. the technology) take place. I thought it was within the past 20 years. Not prior to that, though it may have been available it was not in widespread use on the tour.

hey bab, I forget to mention, I had to "fast forward" most of Rafter's service games on your link. Too boring and predictable, in addition to I'm not keen on players that gift points. I loved Sampras in his earlier part of his career.......he would stay back and rally but Sampras had a GREAT forehand unlike Rafter.

Could you provide a link to a Hewitt/Rafter or even Hewitt and Sampras match?

Touche'

I've been waiting for that! Rafter is all attack all the time, isn't he? Maybe I wouldn't go that far

That said, I definitely would like to see more variety. Is that too much to ask, my friend?

we understand each other I think.

yes, more variety....I'm all for that. You realize I'm one of the few ones that actually understand your stand. I said, bring a FULL grass season, a full fast indoor season. That way, little kids in academies around the world would learn am more "All court" game with a flair of S&V.....the surfaces will reward it.

At this point, there is nothing you can do for the pros...they will not change no matter what. But the future can be better for sure and I agree you there.

Yes, indeed I have noticed that you "get" me. Likewise. I've never thought poorly of you now or going way back, especially since you and I are allies I always miss you when you're not around. But for all I know, you've always been here, just hiding out in the chats

Yeah, well we don't do that here anymore because... hmmm, now who was it But I never found you a lightning rod or polarizing member. Seems you get your share of grief, though

I went about halfway through the list of top pros and nearly half use 100 s.i. heads. Over 75% use poly, mostly the Lux.

I guess the big question is when exactly did this major shift in head size and strings (i.e. the technology) take place. I thought it was within the past 20 years. Not prior to that, though it may have been available it was not in widespread use on the tour.

Ok, My perception was WRONG, according to that list which I don't how official it is because I found some inconsistencies; 30 players out of 68 uses a 100sq. I couldn't believe someone like Stepanek uses a 100sq for example.

I remember in 2008, Novak's racket came into discussion and it was mentioned he used a 93sq which I found it small. I know he changed rackets and then struggle for a bit but anyways, his racket looks smaller to me.

So yes, I was wrong........it seems that perhaps over 40% of the tour uses a 100sq.

BTW, very FEW players uses a 100sq size..........even club players don't use that big of a size, damn even myself a nobody in tennis uses a 98sq size. Do you know how many pros uses 100sq? I know Rafa is one, in the other hand Novak uses a 93sq if I'm not mistaken. Didn't Pete went up to 88sq recently? I know Wilson made one specially for him.

The gloves are off with you, just so you know........so be careful on your future posts when addressing me again or perhaps the board

I went about halfway through the list of top pros and nearly half use 100 s.i. heads. Over 75% use poly, mostly the Lux.

I guess the big question is when exactly did this major shift in head size and strings (i.e. the technology) take place. I thought it was within the past 20 years. Not prior to that, though it may have been available it was not in widespread use on the tour.

Ok, My perception was WRONG, according to that list which I don't how official it is because I found some inconsistencies; 30 players out of 68 uses a 100sq. I couldn't believe someone like Stepanek uses a 100sq for example.

I remember in 2008, Novak's racket came into discussion and it was mentioned he used a 93sq which I found it small. I know he changed rackets and then struggle for a bit but anyways, his racket looks smaller to me.

So yes, I was wrong........it seems that perhaps over 40% of the tour uses a 100sq.

40% sounds about right....and from your comment, it sounds like you 'perceive' that that shift to larger head sizes hasn't culminated until recently which would certainly fall under the 20 year limit.

I went about halfway through the list of top pros and nearly half use 100 s.i. heads. Over 75% use poly, mostly the Lux.

I guess the big question is when exactly did this major shift in head size and strings (i.e. the technology) take place. I thought it was within the past 20 years. Not prior to that, though it may have been available it was not in widespread use on the tour.

Ok, My perception was WRONG, according to that list which I don't how official it is because I found some inconsistencies; 30 players out of 68 uses a 100sq. I couldn't believe someone like Stepanek uses a 100sq for example.

I remember in 2008, Novak's racket came into discussion and it was mentioned he used a 93sq which I found it small. I know he changed rackets and then struggle for a bit but anyways, his racket looks smaller to me.

So yes, I was wrong........it seems that perhaps over 40% of the tour uses a 100sq.

40% sounds about right....and from your comment, it sounds like you 'perceive' that that shift to larger head sizes hasn't culminated until recently which would certainly fall under the 20 year limit.

Here, have your big man award.

Some players coming up are using 95 (Dimitrov) or 98.........that shift you speak off; not idea to be honest. What was Agassi, Muster, Courier, Bruguera, Moya, Kuerten, Kefelnikov racket size? This could tell us a little bit more. Those were "old" players that made a living from the baseline.

Oh, good for you, hunting. My track record of never being wrong remains in tact.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk 2

Never????

man don't make me dig stuff up

so you do believe this shift to bigger frame took place at the end of the 90s? Most players like rafa came in early 00s............although Robredo for some reason uses a 102sq and he an older dude, Ferrer as well uses a 100sq.