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FS: 2005 Noble M12 GTO-3R

Bathed in rare British Racing Green and leather interior, this Noble was assembled at 1g in 2005. It has been used as both a street and track car. It is robust, well sorted, and reliable. It is driven rarely enough to keep mileage down, but often enough to keep seals moist and the engine fresh. The car idles perfectly, runs incredibly strong, and sounds amazing--With the bigger a/r .60 turbos, this Noble ran 470rwhp on the dyno before being tuned to a conservative 437rwhp; it is scary fast, both around corners and in a straight line. The car comes with a wideband o2 sensor and the necessary cables and software to perform easy custom tuning.
Preventative maintenance: The clutch master cylinder, clutch, and flywheel are all new. The brake system was just flushed. Coolant and power steering fluids were flushed and replaced this year; transmission fluid was drained and replaced with Amsoil. The car just had an oil change with Joe Gibbs race oil. There are new gaskets and hardware on the valve covers, exhaust, and manifolds; most of the oil, coolant, vacuum, and power steering lines throughout just replaced, and connection hardware has been refreshed. New track axles and axle hardware front and rear. New wheel bearing in the rear, new flex sections on the exhaust. New insulation on intercooler box and heat shields, the exhaust has brand new DEI Titanium wrap. Spare wrap and insulation go with the new owner. The car also has brand new race seats and SFI-certified 6-point harnesses.

In addition to the upgraded parts listed below, Noble NUS0044 will come with all the factory parts: All intake piping, a very good condition factory clutch and flywheel, the factory seats and 4-point harnesses, a pair of front rotors, factory coolant overflow tank, factory axles, and all other incidentals.

M400 dual oil gauge and center bezel (Not installed)
Additionally, I have another 8 quarts of Joe Gibbs race oil that can go with the new owner, as I cant use the oil with the motorcycle engine in a Radical.

Issues:

The blow-off valve makes a bit of noise and may need some adjustment.

There is one A/C connection that has a small leak in it. This is an easy and inexpensive item to replace.

The paint has a few minor chips and nicks here and there

Asking $58,000. Willing to negotiate some with price, especially if you dont want all the extra parts that come with the car.

Please contact Josh by phone/text at (850) 635-5334 or email at jpwhsv@gmail.com

It should arrive before the end of July, youre welcome to come see it at the house or at the track--Ill be out at High Plains probably almost every thursday night and friday lapping day the month of August. Ive started something of a business, actually; bought 2 Radicals and sold one of them...Will have more on the way and am growing the local Denver Radical contingent, so there should be no lack of Radicals running around sooner or later. =)

It should arrive before the end of July, youre welcome to come see it at the house or at the track--Ill be out at High Plains probably almost every thursday night and friday lapping day the month of August. Ive started something of a business, actually; bought 2 Radicals and sold one of them...Will have more on the way and am growing the local Denver Radical contingent, so there should be no lack of Radicals running around sooner or later. =)

Well I took Josh's Noble in today to get its bill of health. Lots of minor fixable issues, but the biggest dissapointment is in the Dyno. Here's the printout. I expected some normal variation, but this seems a bit extreme. Hoping to remedy with Josh amicably, but it seems something is materially different and I wanted to keep record in this thread. (Note SAE corrections should be calculated using 105F, 29.66, 10% humidity for 1.02 SAE Correction Factor).

Well I took Josh's Noble in today to get its bill of health. Lots of minor fixable issues, but the biggest dissapointment is in the Dyno. Here's the printout. I expected some normal variation, but this seems a bit extreme. Hoping to remedy with Josh amicably, but it seems something is materially different and I wanted to keep record in this thread. (Note SAE corrections should be calculated using 105F, 29.66, 10% humidity for 1.02 SAE Correction Factor).

I feel compelled to respond to this, as I don't like the insinuation that there is something nefarious going on here. I have ridden in this car multiple times, it was actually the first Noble I rode in before I pursued buying a Rossion. The last time I rode in it was within a couple of weeks when it was sold. The car is running fine. Let me try and possibly point out some things and ask some questions that may help.

1. Is the car running poorly? Is the car's air to fuel ratio wacky, is the boost low, is the spark curve off? If none of these are true then you are simply dealing with differences in one dyno and one shop's "correction" factors vs. another. For starters he had it dyno'd in Denver. The SAE correction figures on turbocharged or supercharged cars are crap when they are dyno'd in Denver. Why? because the correction factors assume a linear function with ambient air pressure. That is simply not the case when you have a boosted vehicle as the denominator and numerator change in that equation. SO they over-correct, usually by about 10%.

2. The dyno plots that the facility gave him when he got it dynoed should not be used as absolute measurements of some sort. Dyno plots are a tuning tool, that's it. They should be used to tune the engine to the proper running condition that the owner desires. The runs must be done back to back on the same dyno to be used properly. There are people who like to get dyno plots as some sort of bragging rights and tell their friends how powerful there car is - these people would be known as "Desktop Racers" and thank goodness I haven't run into many of them within this community. If you want this - buy a Hellcat.

3. Josh has not done any major mods to the engine that would make one think it is much over stock. He has simply had it tuned and fixed some of the reliability items on the car -which are a huge plus, BTW. So let's review the facts. The M12 that you have purchased had an advertised HP figure from the factory at the crank of 352 HP at the FLYWHEEL. See the curve here: http://www.nobleforums.com/showthrea...here-s-Redline Assuming a 15-20% loss for drivetrain you get about 290 to 305 HP at the wheels. Given that he got a tune that did not increase the boost levels, the fact that the car is running 330 at the wheels is actually pretty good. There will be no violating the laws of physics here, the idea that the boost level, intercooler, and all internal engine components are the same, you are not going to get an almost 50% increase from the factory in power level.

4. The speeds Josh ran at the end of the long straight at our local track were high 120's. This is the same speed I run in my '91 Corvette with about 400 flywheel HP at sea level. At this altitude it is down a bit. My only point is that 330 WHP seems about right for those speeds. 400+ at the wheels in a 2400 lb car puts that straight away speed well above 140 so I have no doubt that the 330 WHP represents the identical running condition as when it left.

5. This is a used car. I am sure it was sold with no warranty - although maybe I am wrong here, if so you can ignore this point. I think Josh even had it checked out at a Ford dealer before it was shipped. Everybody is different but before I plunk down 40k+ on a car purchase I fly to wherever it is and spend the measley $300 on airfare to make sure it is what I want it to be. Hell, I even do it when I buy a $6k vehicle. When I bought my Rossion it was in North Carolina. I flew into see it before I bought it. It is your prerogative if you don't do that but sometimes there are consequences to those types of decisions. It is not because anything nefarious is going on or something failed on the car, it is just that your assumption of what the car would be like turns out to be different than reality. Have you driven or ridden in many other Nobles? If you didn't ever look at the dyno plot woiuld you consider the car slow?

I don't know you so I don't want to go too far here, but I just think that when somebody posts with the intent to "document it" and with words of "hoping to solve it amicably" - it sounds like you are insinuating something was wrong with the car and you got screwed over or deceived on purpose somehow. I do understand how the 437 HP plot could make you think something that was not representative of the car, but Josh posted those in good faith as they were exactly what the dyno shop spit out - it just was a highly optimistic dyno that is way more common in the industry than you might think. How many "dyno queen" owners want to go to a shop that gives them low numbers - they can't impress their friends as much then. Dyno plots are to be taken with a grain of salt. I'm sorry if this is your first experience with that lesson, but we all have learned that at one time or another.

What you have is a great example of a Noble that is meant to be driven. It is not a show car or a dyno queen - it is meant to be driven and enjoyed. If the car doesn't put a smile on your face when you drive it and hit the loud pedal you would be the first I have met with that opinion Drive the car and be happy you are blessed enough to own such a unique car!