I really need to get some cash together to get the ole car fixed. Back window is still busted out from a storm we had in July, and exhaust is rusted out and needs replaced. It saddens me (but only a little) to keep it sitting there all lonely in the garage. I don't drive much, but damn it, I finally paid the thing off, I should be able to drive it!

Well, 'dude', there's more than a measured element of truth behind everything I say.

Of all my time working at a Chrysler-Fiat dealership, working with customers and other prospective car buyers, the question of paint colour has been brought up by almost every female buyer. The endless line-up of young women I've had to talk to when buying their Fiat 500 "because it's cute" and because of its wide colour palette are incontrovertible evidence. Who else do you think is in the service shop doing the pre-delivery inspection and preparation for the customer? I've endured the whole gamut of car buyers... Two notable exceptions in my memory were: a woman buying a car for her son's graduation, and a retired lady who wanted a Chrysler 200 no matter what. Truly, there is no exaggeration to my statement. One ex bought an Elantra because it was a shiny blue. The last one wants a Lancer because the way it looks in white. My mother inherited a Matrix and, very quickly, remarked about the drab colour. I am friends with a car girl who loves her Civic hatchback because it "looks sick", in her own words. I'd argue, with some clarity, that this trend isn't to be ignored and is a fair representation of the majority of the female demographic. Perhaps not applicable to you, but your circumstance is one against many.

Sorry, love, but my remark stands firmly on a foundation of fact and first-hand experience with said buyers; not on an unfounded, cookie-cutter, pre-conceived stereotype weaponised with the intent to incite a reaction or rebuttal-- which you may have perceived it to be. In other words, it's an unfiltered observation.

So what you’re saying is that all women care about is color. You pick a car company that puts out one model in North America with maybe three or four syles and “well, they all ask about the color”. Really? That’s your incontrovertible evidence? I don’t think they have too much else to ask about at that point.

You’re implying that men aren’t asking about color AT ALL. You’re also implying that they’re not looking at the body or “looks” at all. What keeps a guy from buying the Town & Country when they could have the 200 or 300. Same engine, same basic everything interior and drivetrain. But what makes one more desirable than the other?

Your “observation” is very narrow minded. You see a woman on the lot and you're already thinking "Hurr, wanna guess if she asks about the color? LAWL." First hand experience? Absolutely. But fact? Far from it. And quite frankly taking such a hard line makes you sound like a dick. Just an observation.

Originally posted by batmanwest

I really need to get some cash together to get the ole car fixed. Back window is still busted out from a storm we had in July, and exhaust is rusted out and needs replaced. It saddens me (but only a little) to keep it sitting there all lonely in the garage. I don't drive much, but damn it, I finally paid the thing off, I should be able to drive it!

Are you still fixing to sell? Or did the hail chew it up too bad?

I have a garage baby too right now. Non-op'd, still waiting for RockAuto to deliver some parts so I can finish the jobs I've started. She'll be out soon though. Replacing with a CBR F4i. Woo! Grad present!

I have a garage baby too right now. Non-op'd, still waiting for RockAuto to deliver some parts so I can finish the jobs I've started. She'll be out soon though. Replacing with a CBR F4i. Woo! Grad present!

How do you get your location to show text instead of a worthless number?

I have a garage baby too right now. Non-op'd, still waiting for RockAuto to deliver some parts so I can finish the jobs I've started. She'll be out soon though. Replacing with a CBR F4i. Woo! Grad present!

Not fixing to sell anymore While I made all the payments, my mom DID front a good chunk of the down payment...soooo I got guilt tripped a little by her when I brought it up. In the end, about 4 percent of the time it makes total sense for me to keep it. You know, for days that I want to go MTN. biking/snowboarding and the wifey can't come.

Anyways....the hail didn't do a thing to the car, it was the half of a tree through the back window, and the 30k miles driving from Columbus to Buffalo (about 700 miles round trip on heavily salted roads) that have taken a toll on the car. Sure I could drive it without the back window (and have) and can push the engine to drive on an exhaust that sounds AWFUL, but it's not good to do.

So while I live less than a mile from work, and bike pretty much everywhere, it sits in my garage as to not damage it any more than I already have. After the window and exhaust fix, it really does need new struts, an oil change, tranny flush, and air filter. :/ At times I really dislike meh car and cars in general.

I have a garage baby too right now. Non-op'd, still waiting for RockAuto to deliver some parts so I can finish the jobs I've started. She'll be out soon though. Replacing with a CBR F4i. Woo! Grad present!

How do you get your location to show text instead of a worthless number?

you can go in and edit your profile, that's what i did when i first noticed it.

also, anecdotal evidence (the women and car color thing) does not equal fact.

In the end, about 4 percent of the time it makes total sense for me to keep it. You know, for days that I want to go MTN. biking/snowboarding and the wifey can't come.

I had no freakin' idea that it was a TREE that did the damage, thought it was some Texas sized hail. DAMN! Well, work with it, love on it. I'm the same way about cars and bikes... makes no sense to have extra cars around when one does everything (snow, camp, commute, tow) and the basics are within reach on a cycle.

Yup, a tree. Well, not even a full tree, just the top of it. We had a gnarly wind storm July first, with a clocked wind gust of 89mph less than a mile from my shop. It was the one day out of almost a month that I decided to drive, and this homosexual of a limb fell on the back of my car just right and busted out the window, and dented/scraped the side of the car. Bastard.

The tree you see on the ground here, the top is what got me (kind of hard to tell what's going on, but maybe you get the point?)...

^the worst part about a broken car window is the glass you find in small pieces for years to come. Worse if it was a door window though. Insurance going to cover it?

and DAMN, 90 mph winds, that's nuts. 40 is fast, 90 is just crazy. Go kiteboarding on a day like that and never be heard from again.

Christ tell me about it. The window apparently "popped". There was broken glass on the outside of my front window. Still finding little specks of it all over the car. Pretty sure there are a few little pieces in the front defroster. I swear I can hear it.. :/

Insurance will not cover it. My deductible is too high....mainly because I set it so high. I have never had a ticket, no crashes, never an insurance claim in 14 years. Now it's biting me in the ass.

Yeah, that storm was insane. Knocked out power to over 500k people in the city alone, snapped a 3 ft wide tree in my back yard, tore the fence off of our dumpster out back of our shop and wrapped it around a tree....and so on. Out of my almost 27 years living in Ohio, I have never seen a wind/thunderstorm that crazy in my life...

So what you’re saying is that all women care about is color. You pick a car company that puts out one model in North America with maybe three or four syles and “well, they all ask about the color”. Really? That’s your incontrovertible evidence? I don’t think they have too much else to ask about at that point.

You’re implying that men aren’t asking about color AT ALL. You’re also implying that they’re not looking at the body or “looks” at all. What keeps a guy from buying the Town & Country when they could have the 200 or 300. Same engine, same basic everything interior and drivetrain. But what makes one more desirable than the other?

Your “observation” is very narrow minded. You see a woman on the lot and you're already thinking "Hurr, wanna guess if she asks about the color? LAWL." First hand experience? Absolutely. But fact? Far from it. And quite frankly taking such a hard line makes you sound like a dick. Just an observation.

If you want to broaden the discussion to now cover men, then, fair enough, let's do that if you are willing to digress further from the point that you are missing. Yes, men do acknowledge colour as an influence when buying a car. But, this is usually after they've already chosen a Ram 1500 pick-up truck or Jeep Wrangler with tonnes of chrome and the most obnoxious and utterly useless off-road, performance, sport, or "Call of Duty" bullshit packages. (Yes, Call of Duty is a real Wrangler package.) I was not placing men above women. We make equally silly choices, too.

Town & Country sales are usually male buyers, but only because of their spouse and/or kids; or they buy a Grand Caravan for their job. I have met only one man who voluntarily bought a minivan: it was because he could fit his kayak on the roof.

And no, I am not inferring that "all women care about is colour". That isn't what I said-- have a second look at what you are rebutting against. You are deliberately simplifying my point-- rather, you missed it entirely. So, please relax...

There is a difference between trying to agitate you with unfounded claims, and forming a conclusion based on the results of impartial observation. I've made the distinction; haven't you? Why are you so convinced that I'm going out of my way to insult you or women altogether? Do you really think that my objective from the beginning was to attack women? You must be kidding... You should watch your step, because that is a very serious accusation you could be making. My post still remains unedited and I submit with confidence that there is no malice in it. If you want to build a defamation case against me, you should, at least, verify the intent.

Let's refresh ourselves on what my impartial observation is made of: varying demographics of people buy cars. No, not just the Fiat 500 that was in my example, I'm talking about the entire fleet of Chrysler vehicles. Within those varying demographics, consistent trends develop across all groups of those buyers. I observe those trends and form relations based on consistencies between them. One of those consistencies (relevant to this discussion) turns out to be: female buyers exhibit a strong (stronger?) inclination to map appearance, colour, and presentation on a model's attractiveness and, thereby, its value when automobile shopping. I conduct the analyses, principally, through speaking directly with the buyers, themselves; it is not second-hand intel nor is it someone else's opinion.

At no point in that observation-- and this is where you are fundamentally wrong-- do I introduce what I think about the buyers. There is no wildcard "I think" factor between any of it because there is nothing for me to think about and, by extension, nothing for you to justifiably attach a misogynistic flavour to me. Strictly, I am conjugating a trend that persists within the demographic in question into a conclusion: that appearance is an influential criterion for most women who shop for a car. By proxy, due to its prevalence, it can be fairly assumed that this strong trend can represent female car buyers in general. If you want to put a number on it, then we shall: I'd argue with substantial clarity that about 80% of them have remarked on appearance. Eighty per cent of a demographic is not to be ignored.

I don't understand why you feel so threatened by my conclusion. I did not target you, at all. Just because a demographic trend does not apply to you, it doesn't translate into an insult. And please don't mock my literacy or ability to make observations... "Hurr, wanna guess if she asks about the color? LAWL." What, because I'm an auto mechanic, I cannot speak coherently? What if I studied computer science in Canada's premier technology university, Waterloo, and then scored multiple contracts as a CCNA-certified network programmer for Scotiabank? What if, after that, I decided on a career change and graduated from a premier technical college into an automotive service technician? You don't know me. So don't put words into my mouth. I don't know you, either, which is why I have no reason to attack you. So please watch what you say.

And if you don't call analyses of real-world interaction (with consistently true results) fact, then what would you call it? A sequence of inconvenient truths? Or maybe this was a conclusion that you did not want to hear. Is that why you're so offended? What is insulting me going to achieve concerning your demographic?

Yes, men do acknowledge colour as an influence when buying a car. But, this is usually after they've already chosen a Ram 1500 pick-up truck or Jeep Wrangler with tonnes of chrome and the most obnoxious and utterly useless off-road, performance, sport, or "Call of Duty" bullshit packages. (Yes, Call of Duty is a real Wrangler package.) I was not placing men above women. We make equally silly choices, too.

This is all I was looking for.

I just wanted to rebut a simple but perceivably inflammatory comment. Plus, I don't really think a comment like that has a home in this thread. Observation is not fact, it can lead to a good basis to support a fact but you need to be able to maintain irrefutable evidence. We're basically arguing over the definition of "only".

And there's no attack on your profession. Mechanics are hard working people. I know it. I've been there done that, and I have some massive respect anyone who chooses it as a lifestyle. The comment wasn't an attack on coherency. It was to shed light on an unconscious bias. That's it.

@batmanwest- that sucks. I have a high deductible too. So when some ass blew out my drivers window a couple years ago I couldn't claim it (could have if I had glass coverage, but it didn't make sense on a 9 year old car). I heard glass rattling in the door until the day someone stole that car (the first of three to get stolen from me). I found a window at a junk yard for like 30 and had a buddy put it in for a small bag.

I'm not too far north of you, I wonder how long it'll take us to have one of those crazy storms. Seems like we're starting to get weather up here that was the norm for places much further south twenty years ago, I imagine you guys are getting the same. Good thing there's no such thing as global warming.

Got back from the track day at sears point a few hours ago. First time there in the z06, and was consistently lapping at 2:05, which is what I was doing after 3 or 4 days in the WRX. Kept traction control all morning, but went to competitive mode after lunch, and had a blast.

Got back from the track day at sears point a few hours ago. First time there in the z06, and was consistently lapping at 2:05, which is what I was doing after 3 or 4 days in the WRX. Kept traction control all morning, but went to competitive mode after lunch, and had a blast.

didn't get it sideways much at all. the tiers were very predictable, and no "oh shit" moments, but was able to step it out slightly on purpose and use the throttle to make minor steering adjustments, which is basically what i was hoping to be able to learn while out there.

picked up Harry's LapTimer for my iphone to get some decent track timing at the track next time. Tired of looking through gopro footage and timing it for each and every lap.

They don't do any kind of timing at the track? I thought they did for track days, but maybe for competition only.

Nope. Some organizations that also run race groups (like NASA) will have transponders you can rent for a day, but generally speaking, it's very expensive. Even if you have a transponder, if the organization doesn't have it set up, you won't get times. I think the gear is like $1k minimum for a car if you buy it. I think most of the cost comes from the precision.

I thought the $20 for the app was more than fair, and for my purposes, being even half a second off (most places report 0.1-0.3s off from transponders) is fine.

We drive an 08 toyota sienna to the mountain and honestly it is so comfortable. A lot of people talk bad about mini vans but I love taking that snowboarding haha. We have a Mitsubishi lancer we use for everything else but the mini van beats it in snowboard trips

I'm trying to convince my parents to get one of those for my mom's commute. I was also considering a TDI Sportwagen for myself, but I found a good deal on a used Golf in nice condition. Now I'm waiting for the Mk7 Golf platform to make its way to the US next year. Golf 7 Debut in NYC

Don't think they'll continue to call it the "Jetta Sportwagen" here, but the Golf 7 variant wagon looks pretty sweet. The TDI versions of both can get 71 mpg.

I'm really hoping they bring the new GTD to America, though. That would be a sweet daily driver--sporty and still better on fuel than previous Golf models. If I have the option, I might have to make that my first new car purchase.

I'm trying to convince my parents to get one of those for my mom's commute. I was also considering a TDI Sportwagen for myself, but I found a good deal on a used Golf in nice condition. Now I'm waiting for the Mk7 Golf platform to make its way to the US next year. Golf 7 Debut in NYC

Don't think they'll continue to call it the "Jetta Sportwagen" here, but the Golf 7 variant wagon looks pretty sweet. The TDI versions of both can get 71 mpg.

I'm really hoping they bring the new GTD to America, though. That would be a sweet daily driver--sporty and still better on fuel than previous Golf models. If I have the option, I might have to make that my first new car purchase.

I have a feeling that 71mpg is not US miles per gallon and is instead the Euro MPG. They are different.

I drive a 2012 Honda CRV. Got the fuel efficiency I need. Got the room I want for Sports, Hauling, Fishing, Road tripping, camping/hiking, and packing 10 asian people. Got about the same amount of MPG as my 2001 Acura Integra GSR (325-375miles/tank). I'm not that old but it seems either older people drive them or girls, I don't mind my friends seeing me rolling in the CRV where they racing around like fools. haha

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