Flat Earth PSYOP: CIA Black Op Designed to Destroy the Truth … There is an insidious conspiracy at work throughout the entire Internet which seeks to destroy Truth Movements everywhere. One of its organs of mischief is known as the Flat Earth Society (FES) and its explicit purpose is to take down every single truth-oriented website, blog and/or organization which permits an open comment section at the bottom of their posts and articles. – The Millennium Report

Something terrible has happened.

The “common wisdom” that people grew up with is fading rapidly.

It’s not comfortable or soothing. It’s upsetting and unsettling.

It makes people unhappy. And it’s causing big arguments in the alternative media as well – as we can see from the above flat earth excerpt.

There are some in the alternative media community that have adopted the idea of a “flat earth” enthusiastically.

But others believe it is a CIA psyop designed to discredit people who don’t believe what government affiliated entities tell them anymore.

This is the result of the Internet. The “dominant social themes” we’ve grown up with are in flux.

And this process will continue.

Did the US go to the moon? Did a group of countries even put an international space station into orbit?

Does global warming exist? If so, is it caused by man-made carbon?

Are vaccines healthy? Can they cause autism, asthma and other conditions?

What about allopathic medicine generally? Can pharmaceutical companies be trusted?

What about large agricultural companies like Monsanto? Are they providing us with food or poisoning us?

What about the economy? Do central bankers know what they’re doing? Or are they actually trying to cause crashes to create world government?

These are just some questions we can ask now that we wouldn’t have thought to ask even ten years ago.

It’s the Internet that has made the difference.

With the Internet you can read hundreds of articles in a day. After a while you can start to see patterns that you never would have seen prior to the ‘Net.

You end up questioning things that you would never thought to have questioned before.

The list keeps growing.

The Internet is a process not an episode.

We’ve begun to wonder if dinosaurs existed – at least to the degree that they’ve been promoted.

The same thing goes for evolution. Perhaps we don’t question the fundamental premise but we have questions nonetheless.

After all, they’ve yet to find the subtle evolutionary changes that are supposed to take place. The fossil record hasn’t revealed it.

Lately we’ve been using the Internet to investigate nuclear weapons and how they’ve been promoted thematically.

When it comes to nuclear weapons, there are various elements that are common to other themes we already distrust.

Most of the information we get about nuclear weapons comes from the government.

And the government created nuclear weaponry at great expense. It employed over 100,000 people and erected a mile-long building to get the uranium it needed.

When government types want to lie they make everything very big. That’s one sign of a dominant social theme.

Another is museums. Dominant social themes are often supported by museums.

Hiroshima has a museum. We just found out the wall-sized photo of the atomic mushroom cloud that greets you on the way in is fake. It’s a photo of Hiroshima on fire.

In fact, there’s a lot of evidence that Hiroshima was firebombed. Sure, it may have been nuked too but firebombed, yes.

There were 66 bombers sent on August 6 (666) 1945 to bomb a city that had already been bombed twice. It’s quite likely in our view that these bombers actually went on and bombed Hiroshima.

And the Japanese themselves (and AP) reported Hiroshima had been firebombed on the morning of August 6.

We’ll continue to scrutinize the nuclear narrative. Maybe nukes were invented later than the US claimed. Maybe there aren’t so many nukes as governments claim they are.

Maybe only some of them work. Maybe they’re not as powerful as they are said to be.

We do know that many of the photos of nuke tests in the 40s and 50s seem fake. What else is fake when it comes to nukes?

(If you want to follow some of our articles, just type in “Hiroshima” and “Daily Bell” in a search engine.)

And then there’s NASA.

It’s easy to go on Youtube and find videos that make a persuasive case that NASA has faked almost its entire record, from sending rockets into space to traveling to the moon.

As with nuclear weapons, when it comes to NASA, there’s been little or no objective reporting.

NASA’s narrative is provided by NASA.

In fact, that’s how dominant social themes are created and propagated.

They’re developed secretly and widely dispersed without media scrutiny.

The media tends to “cheerlead” rather than investigate.

Our task is to investigate dominant social themes to determine if they are true or not.

At this point, we’re not certain anything we grew up with is entirely credible.

Sure we know it’s probably a CIA psyop. But how do we explain Admiral Byrd whom the government sent to explore the frozen land of the South Pole and who later revealed in an interview that there was an unknown continent beyond Antarctica?

Or the Youtube video about a 1,000 year old Japanese map showing a flat earth and continents beyond it.

Perhaps the video is a hoax. Perhaps other information is less than credible.

But we won’t discount the idea of a flat earth entirely.

We won’t discount anything at this point. We’ll keep trying to figure things out. You should too.

Conclusion: Such information has an impact on other parts of your life: How you live and the way you save and invest. It’s all part of the same process. Telling truth from lies is very important. The Internet can help us sort it out. That’s how we take something that is “terrible” and turn it into something good.

You don’t have to play by the rules of the corrupt politicians, manipulative media, and brainwashed peers.

When you subscribe to The Daily Bell, you also get a free guide:

How to Craft a Two Year Plan to Reclaim 3 Specific Freedoms.

This guide will show you exactly how to plan your next two years to build the free life of your dreams. It’s not as hard as you think…

How scientific of you. Congratulations. You win the edumacation award.

Blinko23

Have you ever been in an airplane you moron? You do realize that if you simply look out the window off to the horizon, you can ACTUALLY SEE THE CURVATURE OF THE EARTH?!

So are airplanes now a conspiracy too? When you get into an airplane to travel to another continent, are the Elite really putting you in a virtual reality chamber to fake everything, including the curvature of the earth?

There are issues within the flat earth “debate” – CIA generated or not – that travel far beyond the curvature of the earth. Any time DC and the City of London go out of their way to make something off-limits – and Antarctica is basically off-limits from what we can tell – our suspicions are raised. And just because Antarctica is “mapped” doesn’t mean the map is entirely accurate or hasn’t been tampered with. As far as we know the entire mainstream map of the world, the one presented everywhere, has significant problems as regards perspective and continental relationships. We are more comfortable at this point with questions than answers. That’s why we set up this site originally.

Blinko23

Antarctica is not off limits. ETOPs rules say that only twin-engine jets are not allowed to fly over it. But 4-engine jets are not hindered by these rules.

If the flat earthers were serious, they could just pool their money, or crowdsource, and charter a jet to do a fly-over.

Jarle Andhoy used this 16m ocean-going yacht for the unauthorised Antarctica trip.

Norwegian man Jarle Andhoy has been fined for sailing to Antarctica without permission, but he refuses to pay …

Andhoy entered New Zealand illegally in 2012 and was ordered out. He left from Auckland on a 16-metre steel yacht, Nilaya, and sailed to McMurdo Sound. Among his crew was Mana Party activist Busby Noble.

New Zealand authorities tried to halt the yacht but Andhoy made it to McMurdo where he tried to find traces of his previous yacht, Berserk, which had disappeared in a storm with the loss of three men in 2011 ..

Norway’s state media NRK reported that Judge Unni Sandbukt of the Nord-Troms District Court had convicted Andhoy of sailing into Antarctica without permission of the Norwegian Polar Institute.

He was found to have lacked permission and failed to meet strict demands for insurance and preparedness for environmental consequences when he set sail from New Zealand.

Yes but my point was you *are* allowed to fly over it. You could do so at 40,000 feet to verify:

(a) the curvature of the earth, which can be seen from any high-flying jet anywhere in the world

(b) that Antarctica is a continuous continent, mostly covered by ice and with specific boundaries, surrounded by the world’s major oceans and,

(c) that there is no continent “beyond Antarctica” as detailed by Byrd

Chartering a 4-engine jet to criss-cross the south pole several times might cost around $100,000 or so. Certainly do-able by either a wealthy individual or a crowd source effort by thousands of flat-earthers.

Not so sure it is that simple. Seems like various kinds of permissioning might be required.

Here from the Treaty:

Article 7 – Treaty-state observers have free access, including aerial observation, to any area and may inspect all stations, installations, and equipment; advance notice of all activities and of the introduction of military personnel must be given.

Article 8 – Allows for good jurisdiction over observers and scientists by their own states.

And so it seems …

1. “Advance notice of all activities must be given.”

2. States must exercise “good jurisdiction over observers.”

Blinko23

Since I am home today with a sports injury, I find myself still posting on this thread despite my best efforts to the contrary. 🙂

That treaty has to do with ground-based activities and fly-over of various installations set up by various states, for treaty compliance. It does not restrict any commercial or private fly-over of the continent at high altitude.

So my suggestion still stands.

What I am asking you (and/or flat-earthers) to do is to take a page out of Graham Hancock’s playbook. He doesn’t just make this or that unsupported claim. He actually visits each and every place he writes about. He even taught himself to scuba dive and has performed over 300 dives to gather evidence, even proving in one of his dives that an ancient city lay under the sea at India’s southern coast. The Indian government finally had to admit that the city existed when the 2004 Tsunami laid part of it bare. Bravo for Hancock. He actually gathers evidence to prove his biggest claims.

The Daily Bell is a major and well known website. You guys could make a post in the flat earth forums announcing your intention to launch an aerial expedition. You could invite the flat earthers, and all your readers, to a kickstarter campaign. You could even do some guerrilla marketing to get the mainstream press to cover it. You could easily raise anywhere from $50k to $1 million.

With such an expedition, you can easily prove or disprove everything related to the flat-earth theory and Antarctic landmass anomaly theory. And since you guys are the ones making the claims, you should be the ones who go out and supply the evidence (a la Hancock) or at the very least organize a crowdfunding to hire a team of specialists to do it.

The expedition could even be mounted fairly cheaply. You don’t have to fly across the continent. Four separate trips to circumnavigate the Antarctic coastline, with a rented high resolution camera fixed to any window, pointed down at the coast. When you map the coast and stitch the photos together, you will find that they exactly match the images you can buy from commercial satellite services or for free from Google Earth. That is what you will find and you can then lay all the theorizing to rest.

I have friends who shoot freelance video for major outlets like the BBC (Planet Earth, etc.). They have flown all around Antarctica, including landing in the deep interior. They used standard COMMERCIAL MAPS and satellite images to plan and execute their trip. The maps and images were ACCURATE as they came back alive to tell the tale! I guess that’s why I am somewhat riled up by this baseless theorizing.

Take a look at this video. The narrator is a pilot who relates a tale about another pilot named Mac who flew without an ADIRU Air Data Initial Reference Unit that compensates navigation for the curvature and spinning of the earth. The ADIRU was broken and when he tried to fix it he was put in touch with the only company that actually makes ADIRUs for airplanes around the world. The company is a NASA subcontractor (naturally) and has never gotten back to him to answer his questions.

His main question is why was he able to fly for six hours without an ADIRU and without having to make any navigational compensation. In other words, the plane should have drifted off course over six hours but did not. Of course, perhaps the anecdote is fake. Or the video is a hoax. Anyway, you can see the video below. Maybe you have time to watch it since you are injured. Sorry to hear.

Okay, I watched most of that video and it is nonsense. The narrator claims that nobody has been able to replicate Foucault’s gyroscope experiment “even with 21st century technology.” I suggest he goes back to school.

In college I studied physics and engineering. We replicated Foucault’s experiments in year 1 with cheap mechanical equipment that can be found in any college physics department!! Therefore, anything else the narrator says in the video is highly suspect, including the anecdotal story of the ADIRU unit. If the video maker could not even take it upon himself to verify a college-level physics experiment then he has ZERO credibility.

Okay, I have a new and even easier proposal for you and your staff. Forget about flying around the Antarctic, which is a major effort, though do-able. And please stop watching this or that non-credible YouTube video about navigation equipment, flat earth, or other such diversions.

JUST TEST YOUR THEORY with this easy and relatively inexpensive REAL-WORLD EXPERIMENT:

1. Join up to any of the popular model rocket forums

2. Make a post that you want to do an experiment to fly a rocket up 30 miles or so and that you will pay for it. Won’t cost you more than $10,000, which is very do-able even for a single individual.

3. You will get MANY takers. Vet the list. Find the best guy

4. File your paperwork with the FAA

5. Strap a GoPro to the model rocket

6. Launch and recover the model rocket

5. Now review the GoPro video footage to convince yourself as to the roundness of the earth

6. Problem solved. The world is round, not flat.

You don’t even have to fly the model rocket all the way into space (roughly 76 miles). It’s been done. But you don’t have to go up that far. 30 miles or so is more than enough to show the spherical curve of the earth.

You see, in ancient times if you claimed that a pebble and a large boulder both fall at the same velocity, you would end up in a big argument. The smartest men in the city would sit with you around a bonfire, as you all endlessly debate the veracity or falsity of your hypothesis. Endless, endless debate. All useless.

It took many more centuries for someone like Galileo to loudly and finally proclaim what now seems obvious to us:

“WHY NOT JUST FRICKIN’ TEST THE HYPOTHESIS INSTEAD OF ENDLESSLY DEBATING AND PONDERING?”

So Galileo drops two different sized rocks from the leaning tower of Pisa and proves that a small rock and a big one fall at the same exact velocity. End of debate. The scientific method is born.

Launch the model rocket. Then please write an article about the whole thing:

We are not conducting an investigation into the flatness of the earth. We don’t have theories, as already mentioned. We have a philosophical position. It is a consistent one. We will not discount large ‘Net themes out of hand. Even false or exaggerated, they may yield useful or enlightening information. In this case, we learned ADIRUs are only made by one company in the world and that is a NASA subcontractor. This too may be false. But most interesting if true. Thanks for watching and for the feedback.

Blinko23

Understood. But the philosophical position (question all dominant memes) while correct, can lead to some outlandish territory that damages your site’s credibility.

While DB has not stated categorically that “the earth is flat” your recent articles certainly imply the distinct and credible *possibility* that this may be so. And that is a HUGE thing to imply, which puts your reputation on the line. Makes you look potentially nuts to be honest.

So all I am saying is that instead of continuing to *imply* the possible flatness of the earth, and thereby bleeding your reputation, simply TEST THE HYPOTHESIS with a cheap experiment that puts the issue to rest once and for all.

One model rocket launch from the deserts of New Mexico. Cheap. Easy. Fun. Make a vacation out of it.

alaska3636

Hi Blinko,

Since you have some time, check out the GoogleEarth of Antarctica. Why do you think the middle of the continent is pixelated while the half dozen other spots in the world I clicked on seemed to be fairly high resolution?

Blinko23

Lack of commercial satellite coverage (other than military). The Polar Geospatial Center satellite, for e.g. was only launched in 2011 and they have been using that to improve resolution in that area:

Give it up, friend. Blinko simply cannot fathom a lie so big as the ball earth. It’s too uncomfortable for him to entertain.

dave jr

Perhaps ‘ordinary’ (non-elitist) people are not allowed to travel to Antarctica or fly over in their dinky twin engine Lear jets because they might discover the ice sheet is growing http://principia-scientific.org/antarctic-ice-at-all-time-record-high-we-have-more-to-learn-says-boffin/. Meanwhile anyone is free to witness the shrinking ice in the artic (northern commercial hemisphere) where supposedly polar bears are drowning and the fate of mankind hangs in the balance. Notice disturbed jet streams (polar vortex shinola). Notice weather mapped EMF rings that disturb jet streams. Notice the aid of oil exploration and extraction up there as well as the northern passage. Which I am not opposed to. I am opposed to the lies and manipulations promoting the easily extractable ‘carbon credits/taxes’ which I am supposed to pay out of guilt. Ha, there is a conspiracy theory for you. Hoaxes beget hoaxes. i.e. global warming needs its maintenance.

dave jr

As usual, I don’t know why I waste my time here.

natural human

I have had a private pilot license since the age of 16 so, of course, I’ve been in an airplane. And I can tell you the horizon is flat, as will any rocket video not shot through a fisheye lens. What you think you see is distortion emanating from the curved plastic windows of airliners. As I’ve stated before, do some research on Youtube before setting yourself up as you do. There is more than ample evidence to question the ball earth.

Wayne Kisby

Is this website big enough to make a difference.. Maybe you can do a story on “lawful rebellion” and “admirality law”. BTW, the earth is flat and if Sven can prove otherwise, i would love to see the evidence.. I grew up on a globe, i know what it feels like to reject Flat Earth, only problem is… Water cannot stick to the outside edge of a spinning ball.

Sven

Seems to me the work has already been done on proving the earth is round. Why would I let a nutter detract me from the science that exists. I’d say the burden of proof is on you to prove the earth is flat.

Why did Admiral Byrd say there was a continent beyond Antarctica? Maybe we don’t know everything?

Blinko23

Admiral Byrd suffered from carbon monoxide poisoning when he was stuck near the pole, waiting for a rescue mission. He went mad. There was a PBS documentary a few years ago that showed he was also less than honest when detailing his missions to the press. He is not a credible source.

While it is healthy to question a lot of things in this world, the “flatness” of the earth is not one of them, at least for anyone with a high school education or more. I’m seriously beginning to wonder now if The Daily Bell itself hasn’t become a CIA psyop, ever since that shutdown/restart episode from 2013. If not, you are now doing their job for them, conflating legitimate 9/11 Truth research and such with the flat earth society!

Cass Sunstein would be proud.

Some of the stuff you guys have been linking to recently is just ridiculous. All those YouTube “documentaries” about moon landing hoaxes and space station hoaxes have no credibility. The vanishing astronaut nonsense is just that – nonsense, and has more to do with video frame blending and other such video glitches than anything else (I work in film and video).

Jeesh. The earth is round. Nuclear weapons exist. Hiroshima was nuked. We went to the moon. Dinosaurs clearly existed.

On the flip side, 9/11 was clearly an inside job and the War on Terror is fake, with perpetual false flags and outright hoaxes being promulgated on us by the Elite. This is all beyond a shadow of a reasonable doubt for anyone who cares to research it. But just because those dominant memes are artificial, doesn’t meant that *all* dominant memes are.

Sure, question everything. That is healthy, especially in our day and age where so much has been revealed to be fake. But do so with a proper background in the sciences and common sense. And if you lack the background, then get some scientific advisers on your board; Engineers, physicists, film and video technicians, maybe even and astronaut or two! Don’t just link to some YouTube video put together by some teenager living in his parent’s basement

croasdale

I’m perplexed also about where DB is going with this. You can look to the sky with your own eyes and with a telescope and see that all large bodies are round. Gravity forces this shape on large objects (stars, planets, moons) during their formation.
And what is meant by “beyond Antarctica” anyway? Every direction “beyond Antarctica” is north.
I’m as skeptical of what I read as most here, but to say the earth may be flat borders on nutter territory, imho.

Within some of the thousands of videos on a “flat earth” are questions and observations that seem intriguing and worth exploring. Certainly we shouldn’t make definitive statements, but we’ll try to evaluate the legitimacy and consequences of what we’re examining. We applied the same process to global warming, vaccines, central banking and Einstein’s gravitational theories, which Tesla rejected. “Nutter”? Hope not.

These are all legitimate areas of exploration, to come to a a possible contrarian viewpoint, especially when there are very credible scientists, like Wakefield, who have been wrongly persecuted by the Elite global establishment. In all the above subjects there are even large bodies of work by professional scientists that support the contrarian view.

But with flat earth, fake space stations, fake satellites, fake moon landing – there is absolutely nothing other than a few kids and bonafide nutters putting up YouTube videos or web pages, that don’t even pass a high school level science analysis of the various theses they put forth. That stuff is all nonsense. Absolute nonsense and only damages the credibility of DB.

“There is absolutely nothing other than a few kids and bonafide nutters putting up YouTube videos or web pages,”

These are the “nutters” who have discovered and disseminated NASA’s fakery – which is extensive and admitted.

Why are you so trusting regarding the Pentagon and NASA? NASA is a military facility and like the Pentagon, its first allegiance is to the system itself – not the truth.

natural human

You’re doing the right thing, DB. Continue exploring the evidence. I, too, rejected it at first. It takes a lot of “education” to overcome and supplant one’s common sense. Your dissenters above rely on their educations to form their world view. Sad. Very sad.

dauden

Very admirable stand, DB. There is plenty of evaluations to be made in the inconsistencies of what’s being called “science” when exposed to more light turns out to be a lie. The “why” is the hardest to uncover.

We certainly have not decided that the earth is flat and we mentioned the CIA psyop clearly. But just because PBS decided Byrd was mad, if it did, doesn’t make it so. And sure a flat earth seems fanciful – ludicrous. But some issues and questions raised among the narratives of some of the thousands of videos on the subject seem intriguing and beyond the scope of what current “science” suggests.

And as far as NASA goes, we’re not convinced of anything NASA says just because NASA announces it. They have an entire replica of the “space station” in a football-sized pool and have already admitted that they mimic space activities there. Nothing to stop them from performing various actions in the pool and then pretending they occurred elsewhere. Apparently they had an accident in “space” and now astronauts are being fitted with snorkels.

“During the last spacewalk to use U.S. spacesuits in July, Italian astronaut Luca Parmitano had to quickly retreat to the station’s airlock when a leak inside his suit’s plumbing enveloped his head in water. Since then, NASA engineers and the astronauts on board the space station have been working to identify and fix the problem.”

You’ve already sorted through the government’s “lies” and decided which ones to discount. We’re not so convinced as to where that “bright line” is.

You want to believe the entirety of the Pentagon’s narrative regarding nuclear weapons, that’s fine too. We’re not convinced all of it is valid by any means. That doesn’t make us allies of the CIA.

Sven

I’ve done a little research and by far my favorite, zaniest claim by flat earthers is that the sun is 32 miles wide. Wowzers.

Blinko23

DB did not write categorically that the earth if flat. But in some recent articles, including this one, DB is clearly insinuating that a flat earth *may* be a possibility. And that’s just nonsense. The notion of a “flat earth” should be dismissed outright, if not ridiculed. Anyone who took high school physics or has access to a $100 telescope can clearly see and understand that large celestial bodies are roughly spherical.

NASA has a replica of the space station in a giant pool of water for TRAINING PURPOSES. Underwater training is the closest and most practical mechanism to simulate zero g. Yes, there is also the famed vomit comet plane but that can only create zero g for 30 second burst as it goes into a parabolic dive. Completely impractical for complex training that requires hours of a sustained zero g environment. So saying that NASA has an underwater space station replica (subtly implying that they shoot their “outer space” video there) is not proof of any fakery.

NASA space suits use water cooling and also has condensation recycling systems. If those systems spring a small leak, then water can infiltrate the inside of the suit. So some astronauts fitted their helmets with snorkels, just in case, as water in zero g could pool close to their faces, even if present in small amounts. So again, snorkels prove nothing as to possible NASA fakery.

Getting back to the moon landing (over the years I’ve watched all the hoax docs) it does appear that *some* footage and photos maybe have indeed been faked. This was ostensibly done to give the public clear imagery for PR and propaganda purposes, especially if actual footage was either poor or compromised due to some malfunction. Would have sucked to only have crappy footage (or zero) after spending a trillion dollars. So yes, some was faked. And there is where all the moon conspiracy stuff comes from. But just because some was fake does not mean that ALL was fake – especially when there there is a Mount Everest sized data dump of contrary evidence that have no credible elements of fakery to them. I worked in major motion picture visual effects. There was no way they could have faked all that stuff back in 1969. Not even Stanley Kubrick could have done it even with a $1 billion budget.

You can go to Cape Canaveral yourself and watch rockets being launched. Bring a pair of very powerful binoculars. Watch the rocket go up. Way, way, way up. Where do you think that rocket is going – to an underwater hideout?! With a pair of powerful binoculars, if you watch a night launch, you can even see the final stage start its orbital arc. If that’s STILL not enough proof for you, save up a few million and become a space tourist. The Russians will still fly people up there for the right price.

As I mentioned, get some scientific advisers. You have some great articles. But too many recently fall squarely into quack territory. If DB itself has not been officially co-opted by the psyop masters, then you are essentially doing their work for them by printing this type of stuff.

Finally, if Byrd saw any kind of continent “beyond Antartica” where is it? The surface of the earth has been explored and mapped in detail by numerous countries. A continent has no place to hide. You can even go to Antartica yourself on numerous tour packages or even put together your own private expedition at modest cost. Bring a powerful camera drone with you. Send it up. Look for the lost continent. You won’t find it. Relying on the verbal account of one man, who lied many times on the record, is again – not proof of anything. It’s not even a piece of evidence worthy of further exploration. It is precisely nothing.

If you want credible evidence of lost continents, read some of Graham Hancock’s books. At least he brings up massive amounts of evidence that points to a lost civilization that preceded ancient Egypt and that now lies mostly under the sea. While he does not conclusively prove his case, he does build up a very convincing one.

natural human

Wow. You quite enjoy your enslavement, don’t you.

Blinko23

Great counter argument. Excellent analysis. You brought me to the light.

You’re new to DB. We’ve written regularly about Hancock and initial civilizations for years. We haven’t changed our approach. We analyze dominant social themes: Elite propaganda that seems valid on the surface but collapses when you examine it closely. NASA should be exempt? Every time we look, we discover more apparent fakery – most recently a lunar rover that seems modeled on a world war II jeep. It doesn’t help that NASA is obviously misleading taxpayers, as you yourself admit. And you have no questions about how and why NASA mistakenly destroyed the film from the initial moon landing? Or why the US hasn’t been back for 50 years? At some point your “common sense” collides with our sense of what’s increasingly ridiculous.

As for a “flat earth,” we won’t discount it as part of our philosophical positioning.We want to ask questions about themes in the news, not make declarations. In fact, above, we wrote: “We won’t discount anything at this point. We’ll keep trying to figure things out. You should too.”

That’s our position. Yes, we probably wouldn’t extend it to examining the possibility of a space turtle but we’re happy to examine all facets of the alternative media to try to determine for ourselves (with viewers’ help) what makes sense and what doesn’t.

We’ve been at the forefront of asking such questions. And by asking them, we’re sometimes able to develop insights that we wouldn’t have had otherwise.

So …

The alternative media needs to ask more questions, not less. Especially when it comes to US government and military programs. If we don’t, who will?

Blinko23

Been a reader since 2003 or thereabouts, so I am not a new reader. And I mentioned Hancock precisely because I remember the DB writes about him. He is an example of someone who is doing it right. He makes what appears to be an outlandish claim but then backs it up with mountains of real-world evidence. In fact, after reading his books, I am convinced his theories are correct.

The DB also turned me on to the book “Forbidden History” which I likewise also found credible. Really opened my eyes. I might not agree with all their conclusions. But at the very least they proved that mainstream paleontology and archeology are filled with massive holes.

As for the jeep thing, not proof of anything other than Boeing going with a well-tested and popular design. The WWII jeep performed well on all types of terrain during the worst possible conditions – so why not use it as the basic structure for a moon rover? If anything, that is just evidence of Boeing getting away with intellectual property theft. So there is that conspiracy. But to say that moon landing is fake because Boeing modelled the rover on a jeep is just silly.

As to why we haven’t been back to the moon in 50 years – because it is super expensive and can no longer be sold to the general public. To begin with, we only went there due to a political cold war, in competition with the Soviets. Furthermore, an objective study of history demonstrates that gaps between initial exploration and further exploration or colonization is completely normal. Columbus “discovered” the new world in 1492. But how many decades later did it take for further serious exploration and colonization of the new world?

You are making reasonable points. But even in this, your last response above, we find a lot that we are less certain about than you. We are not sure there ever was a real “Cold War.” We certainly don’t believe much of the Columbus myth-making and the fakery, if it exists, when it comes to Boeing, is that the company charged $40- $60 million for what may be a dressed up jeep. And there is more … so much more. It seems to extend to every facet of the Anglosphere establishment. It is not neat and clear cut to us.

Blinko23

Fair enough. And yes, I mention the “cold war” with some invisible caveats, knowing full well that there was a lot of fakery involved with that as well. In my estimation though, it was more complex and many elements of competition and conflict between the major powers were indeed real, though maybe not for all the reasons were were told.

Lockheed Martin once famously charged the government $400,000 for a single, off-the-shelf screw, which was discovered in an audit. Contractors ripping off the government to ridiculous levels is par for the course. So charging $60 million for a modified jeep is unfortunately “normal.” Again, not evidence of fakery. But yes evidence of extreme corruption.

Anyway, I think I’ve exhausted this thread with my comments. I am still a reader and will continue to be one. Just wish some of the more outlandish and unsupported theorizing would be more strongly prefaced as such, or just put in a separate section (or separate site) clearly labelled as “out there” ponderings.

Wrusssr

Scraping portions of one’s belief system can be unsettling, whether an unfaithful spouse or discovering you’ve been spoon-fed giant lies. Once done, though, what’s replaced is closer to the truth than what you thought you had.

Worked newspapers in Houston during the moonshots and picked up my information and art and pictures direct from NASA. Never questioned The Walk. Subsequent Hollywood releases confirmed that belief system for all of us.

Then the ‘Net arrived and with the flood of new views and opinions I began, out of curiosity, comparing the new with what I thought I knew, and took a second look at stuff like the faces of that first landing crew and knew, then, something wasn’t right.

Armstrong’s (and most of the others) subsequent silence began to make sense, finally.

Then I ran across some notes that a WWII instructor pilot left behind a few years ago who had standing among other pilots and aviators. In them, I found this:

“I was privileged to have been a part of it; saw two horses bolt when an airplane buzzed the farmer and his wagonload of corn they were pulling; saw a man land on the moon . . .

“Neil Armstrong was a soaring enthusiast who had soared with us before he got into the space program. A lot of us knew and visited with him when he came, and found he liked to relax around six or so people and talk flying. Put him in a crowd, though, and he said very little.

“Later, [following the moon shot] he stopped talking much to anyone, anywhere.

“His friends out here mention it every time we get together. . .”

Little things add up.

Even with so many working and churning information that’s good, bad, outright propaganda, disinformation, and deliberate lies, truths and glimpses of truths emerge with the process. Little and big pieces of information form inside the kaleidoscope. Dr. David Ray Griffin’s books and writings ripped the mask off 9/11, a lone comment by a Monsanto exec that said if they’re forced to label food that contains GMO ingredients, “. . . we might as well put a skull and crossbones on the can.” That $3 billion (+) has been paid to victims injured by vaccines produced by an indemnified (by congress ) pharmaceutical industry for death and injuries their vaccines have caused with an estimated of only one in five injured ever gaining access to the court; that global warming is a lie, as was/are the swine flu, Ebola, and Zika “viruses”; that the Rockefellers, et al, have built an organic seed vault in a granite mountain north of Stavanger with a bomb-proof door to hold the world’s organic (natural) seeds. (Why would they do that?) That every “mass shooting” recorded this century in America has been a false flag event. Why? Did you know the Bolsheviks killed at least 60 million mostly white Christians Between 1917-1944 in Russia, with one estimate being more than 140 million? This from the files that were opened in Russia. Know who funded the Bolsheviks? There’s a direct link there to today’s economic crisis.

Take the red pill and exit the matrix. Why would the controlling authority teach us the truth when it is not in their interest?

Blinko23

I have swallowed the red pill (all of them). I am fully aware that controlling authorities feed us one peace of fakery after another. But my point is that it’s not ALL fake.

There is a difference between being a conspiracy theorist and being a conspiracy factualist. I count myself in the latter group.

9/11 being an inside job, for e.g., is conspiracy factualism. There is a mountain of evidence proving this is the case and almost no evidence, other than unsupported government statements, to the contrary.

On the other hand, if I told you that the earth really rests on the back of a giant turtle, like in Hindu mythology, and that governments around the world are trying to hide this from you – that is a conspiracy THEORY and a bad one, as it will be unable to provide even a shred of cogent evidence to support it.

So yes, question everything, but then throw out anything outlandish that cannot be supported by any kind of serious evidence.

Please take a look at the press conference held after the first astronauts came back from the moon. It’s absolutely creepy. And Stanley Kubrick’s apparent confession of a role in faking at least some of NASA’s space presentations appears credible to us or at least worth considering without dismissing it outright. He made them in the context of his movie “The Shining.”

Obviously, you haven’t done enough research and believe what you’ve been told. Science is not credible in and of itself. Having a few degrees does not qualify for truthtelling. It takes time and an honest heart to determine falsities and dark plans.

dauden

Why does the King James call it science….”falsely so called”?, 1 Timothy 6:20 ….Timothy, keep that which
is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and
oppositions of science falsely so called:….

Consider that there are dimensional portals to ‘parallel realities’ that one can ‘stumble upon’ – or through which a communication is intentionally leaked/shared. We cannot know anything we are not the vibration of – and whatever we ‘meet’ we interpret through the structure of our existing beliefs. So some non-physical aspects of our greater being are invisible to us – or perceived in ways that do not awaken from the focus within three dimensional physical existence.
Experiences that ‘do not fit’ are generally ignored, denied, dismissed or pushed aside as anomalies – but not given focus… until they register with an individual or group of individuals as significant and relevant information to the opening of an expanded perspective.
It is incumbent on the ‘continuity manager’ to keep enough of a sense of order relative to the capacity to embrace perspective. Multidimensionality may sound like an exciting idea in theory – but consider non-linear Consciousness is not a continuity in time and space so much as of unified focus.
Much of what ‘suppresses’ our expansion of perspective is a defensive resistance that arises from un-owned and thus un-balanced fears.
My intuition is that perspective is the shifting point of reference and that the ‘fixing’ of perspective to a sense of materially defined ‘life’ is reflecting a fixity of self-concept.
The self-concept is a vehicle of evolving and expanding transformation – unless it is identified as the arbiter and controller of such – in which case all is ‘transformed’ or distorted and coerced to conform and fit to its image or idol of self. The truth of anything is always more than any perspectives upon it or ideas about it. The Infinite is in every ‘part’. But our perspectives or focus within the whole are unique and richly interpenetrating and reflecting in each other. So it is with all ‘levels’ of expression. No Star System or Galaxy is an island unto itself. But the living connections and communications are of resonant frequencies of thought and feeling. Many human beings are experiencing their thought as if it were reality – rather than the vehicle and focusing within a participant reality. But that is itself a statement of a particular vibrational quality that I would immediately balance within myself so as not to live that reflection.
The Net comments are full of ‘most people’ commentary when it comes to a seeming lack of interest in ‘waking up’ to an alarm or indeed to alarmism. The only one who needs to wake up is the one who uses ‘most people’ as the justification for delay or diversion.
When truth is made into war – no truth remains available because truth is not this or that but is this AND that AND…
But in any moment our working model is what works for us – in our reasons for being, for our unique explorations and experience within All That Is.
So those who are identified and fixated in ‘power’ will explore using everything to that end – but all are part of a greater ‘dance’ whether we recognize it or not. I prefer dance to ‘plan’ but the words are not what they point towards.
Maybe we don’t know what we think we know, because we believe we are who we think we are. And so forgive us for we know not what we do – out from a mis-taken identity in oppositional thought.
There is a perspective in which all movement is a shifting focus within Consciousness just as the pixels on your screen can ‘create’ a virtual reality ‘space’. The communication is not in the pixels or even the type and text – nor the language or definitional archetypes of human experience. Communication never really leaves the ‘mind’. But our experience of reflection is a richness of appreciation and gratitude for being – subject only to knowing our thought truly. Conflicted thinking reflects conflicted experience – and this itself can become an object of fascinated exploration – albeit as an experience of warring parts in tragi-comic misalignment. A closed mind is not a mind – but an active denial of the nature and function of Mind – that cannot ‘be’ closed without the polarity of ‘not-mind’ in which to hide the intent to experience in oppositional polarity – and that invites the recognition of free will.
Free will includes the capacity to experience a loss of freedom as part of a greater dance.
No response sought here – but I appreciate your honesty relative to Everything Being Brought to Question – and see that honesty as the capacity to not be caught in deceits without uncovering the truth of such device.
Maybe you are thinking of Antarctica in terms of known resources relative to existing paradigm – but expansion of perspective opens a different quality of Resource that is fitting to the recognition of what was always there but had been ‘hidden’.

Prove what to who? No one accepts what he/she is unwilling to believe – but a process of communication can and does lead to shifts of perspective where what was ‘previously thought’ is no longer held. I cannot prove to you that I exist – or what that I or anything actually is – but we can feel ourselves to be in communication – or indeed not in communication.
I don’t know that Newton or Einstein and others have actually discovered what gravity is – but the attraction between objects with mass – though extremely tiny relative to other ‘forces’ is more than capable of ‘sticking water to the outside of a spinning planet’.
I feel more attuned with the ‘Electric Universe’ than the gravitic model – but I can see how the belief in space as void and gravity as a property of ‘stuff’ serves the notion of a dead universe rather than an energetic expression of multidimensional information – of which you and I and this communication medium are all part of – regardless what we may believe we have proven or disproven.

Bruce C.

If it’s upsetting and maddening to have “our” beliefs challenged, think what it’s like for those who live by them and represent them. A lot of the subjects raised in this piece are interesting to me and curious, but they’re not particularly threatening to my livelihood or career or even my convictions (for the most part.)

This reminds me of a radio program I heard the other day in which a status quo representative was saying that you can’t sue people for claiming things that aren’t true if most people believe they are, and vice versa. It was a weird conversation.

rross27

“We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false”. – William Casey, CIA Director (1981)

“Withholding information is the essence of tyranny. Control of the flow of information is the tool of the dictatorship.” – Bruce Coville
“The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media.” – Bill Colby (1920-1996) former Director of the CIA

Thank you. Question everything. Dominant social themes infect every part of our lives. They don’t begin and end with 9/11

Blinko23

I agree with you (I think most of your readers feel the same). But you also have to realize that some things are in fact nonsense.

If someone told you that the dominant meme that humans are mammals is false; That they are instead large cockroaches that eat bananas – you would dismiss that as obvious nonsense (at least I hope you would!). Likewise, stuff like flat earth and “no satellites in space” is also nonsense. Just a little common sense, a study of the history of science and some high school physics would reveal that.

By all means keep questioning everything. But before you print the more outlandish stuff, make it your duty to talk to scientific advisers from across the spectrum to get a contrarian view to your own contrarian view. Weigh the evidence objectively and do the homework. Then only print the stuff that is well reasoned and well supported.

The inheritance of a jealous god means that what is kept is the Only and Exclusive while anything else is invalidated or demonized and heartlessly denied.
I don’t disagree with your points so much as expand to include them – but not in alignment with what I might call heartless science – which is not as innocent of hidden agenda as it may like to believe.
Disinformation can be a ploy – but also a passing on of false currency – which can also be propagated or set up as a ploy or ‘meme’. This of course begins with our persona or masking identity that passes off as our presence when it is obviously a part of a collective agreement to deny or suppress awareness of presence. Some our masking operates ‘authority, gravity, seriousness and credibility’ in the regard of others.
Discerning communication amidst the ‘noise’ is a willingness not to focus in the noise that masks the signal – if we so allow. So even though disinfo bombs are being mixed in with
information relevant to awakening from controlled narratives – they will still serve the purpose that the reader holds – regardless the propagator’s intent.
Scientism operates a corruption of science – which has its own Trojan Horse blindness, and institutional (and personal) ego. Though a harnessed technologism seems to have replaced enquiry into the already true – so as to gain personal credit and indeed patents – for ‘discovery and invention of application, this too is part of the results and valuable feedback.

But if you believe there is none within You- or at least none you will open to or accept because it is too terrible – then you MUST seek ‘outside’ for the completion or fulfilment of a sense of being denied or deprived a fundamental acceptance and validity of being.

Seeking validation in external terms is a ruse to mask a sense of invalidity within.

The true Nature of Conscious Experience of Reality is covered or filtered by many levels of conditioning – such that a fragmented sense of self operates under the belief that external conditions define it, when it is a now hidden level of Consciousness that defined itself relative to conflicted inner conditions that it then sought to externalise as an attempted solution or expediency of escape and avoidance.

Lies are not neutral. Out of mind-sight is not really escaped or evaded – but influencing or usurping your thought and perception to beliefs that keep it hidden and ‘protected’ from exposure.

Self-honesty is no longer willing to turn a blind eye to a narrative that is a pretence given defence in one’s own Name.

Only in self-honesty can the true be recognized true – but of course if you want – or believe you need – to fool yourself then fool must you be and fooled must see the validation of your self – despite the assertion of your power to limit and deny, evade and misconstrue Everything – so as to seemingly have what your falsely framed thinking dictates as your belief in yourself, your world and your purpose or function in life.

The information era has to give way to one of Discernment – that is aligned in the heart and not a power struggle of mind-fragmentation. Or true presence is forsook to a robotic hollow mentality of terror defined rage – masking as an illusion of power – alone and comfortless.

The Electro-magnetic quality of vibrational relation is one of resonant correspondences and synchronicities. Experience is within and of the field of such vibrational communication. The reflected embodiments of accepted Idea have an experiential validity from which to grow or expand the current sense of Existence, but fixation in self-definition against this true movement of Life unfolding unto Itself is an out-of-true dissonance given investment and identification.

Reading one’s experience truly is yielding it to Source Awareness instead of keeping and using it for judgement of a presumed dominion.

In ordinary terms – this means pausing from reaction and instead allowing one’s peace – that is – a freedom from coercive interference. Even with heated passion or frozen fear, this is the grace of true feeling recognition and the shift of insight to an expansion in which what seemed to besiege can in a core sense be embraced – and brought into relational awareness such as to take a step in a connected sense of being.

Without this connected sense of being is everything necessarily and inevitably interpreted and used by the ‘program’ of dis-integrity – including of course the presentations of kindness and respectability in forms that mask the denied but active fear, rage and heartbreak that we individually and collectively struggle to suppress or scapegoat and kill or render powerless.

We live as if everyone ELSE has to wake up and get the message – but are the last to wake up to the ploy that kept us from truly aligning and integrating rather than judging and coercing our self, our relations, our world.

But my judgements say more about me than about the true of the world or anyone in it. Or rather – they reflect partial distortions that can be traced back to their roots in my core beliefs – some of which are personal and others collective.

If enough people get stuck in the same place, they call it reality. A working model serves the purpose that you recognize as truly enlivening and fulfilling to who you feel and know yourself to be. Then you LIVE this presence which communicates itself – without having to impose or assert your own self upon others – not accept invalidation or denial from others.

Truly the Movement of Being defines and identifies us perfectly – as we accept and allow – but Life is never pinned down in fixity for the Context or Perspective Shifts in ways that our linear 3D thinking cannot embrace – much less control.

If you depend on the evil or the false to gain a sense of validity and righteousness – then of course you must accept perpetual war – for true victory would leave you without a power source.

I cannot tell anyone what to accept or look out from as true – and nor can anyone else but your heart recognition. This appears to be the very last place anyone looks and so everything ‘else’ has to be tried first because when Something Terrible Happened – we lost our sense of connection and communication to a hate that rages and a fear that guilts and undermines any capacity to stand.

Deceits can be like jokes that inadvertently reveal the mind game that thinks itself invisible by assigning its own agenda to others.

Hating evil is easy – but reciprocated in a like conviction. Uncovering the deceits by which hatred operates ‘divide and rule’ in our OWN mind, and narrative beliefs and definitions has to FEEL enough to recognize what is truly moving rather than give blind hate a backstage pass. It’s no use denying or rusing our inner conflict onto others – except to ‘create’ a hateful world out of a loss of love or sense of love denied. If we were not love – we would not hate losing it and insist that love is unreal so as to assert a self made in hidden hate and ‘love’ this grievance as our source of power over a world that ‘fails us’.

Reality is experience according to perspective. Look to the framing mind or indeed to the free Imagination of your calling. The call to joy is the movement of reintegration in which the energy bound up in conflict is released to align freely along the lines of what you truly are unfolding and recognizing yourself to be. You cannot be what you are not and truly appreciate yourself or others thereby.

Praetor

When they unleashed energy using charge particles, everything changed. Something’s good and something’s not so good. One good thing is, we can now check-up on the liars, with relative ease!!!

Pilgrim

Yeah, just trust the internet.

Yesterday I was reading an article that decried the fact that numerous African nations have draconian, extreme laws against sodomy and/or homosexuality in any form.

I tried to do an internet search because i couldn’t remember the name or details of the homosexual African leader that was so brutal and sexually deviant that homosexuality was banned far and wide because of his abuses of power.

It didn’t matter what combination of words I used, all I could find was articles about those poor downtrodden homosexuals oppressed by those evil republicans and conservatives.

What few references I did find were on sites that required payment or the purchase of a book.

My point is that this big expansive internet we often view as representing all areas of thought and we think of as neutral in its content has been so thoroughly scrubbed it’s shocking!

His name was King Mwanga II of Buganda, by the way, just in case you’re curious.

dauden

This article today is why I keep read the “daily” bell. I really appreciate your frankness in telling us how you see it. Personally, looking into the evidences the flat earthers have revealed, it does look as if the spherical earth subscribers have the burden of proof to bear.

Blinko23

Uh, no they don’t. See my post near the bottom of the page.

I am really beginning to wonder now if the Daily Bell has not been co-opted by Cass and his gang:

Why do you keep mentioning Cass Sunstein in connection with DB? If you were a regular reader as you say you are, you would know we did a fairly comprehensive article on him a little more than a month ago. Ron Paul picked up the article for his Liberty program.

We are also aware what others have written about Sunstein and we mentioned the potential CIA connection to flat earth promotions in THIS article. As part of our journalistic discipline, and as part of a philosophical position, we do not discount dominant social themes out of hand, no matter what they are. In this sense, our statement was rhetorical: But that was made fairly clear.

The larger point of the this article was to make clear that as the Internet advances, it will bring more and more elite dominant social themes into question. Your ferocious concentration on a single line in a thousand word article begins to be puzzling. You say you are a regular reader of DB but you have no idea of our familiarity with Sunstein. It seemed you weren’t aware of our high-profile discussions of Graham Hancock either.

As far as our credibility goes, we will stand on a ten-year record that has exposed hundreds of elite dominant social themes and led the way to cultivating inter-generational skepticism about many aspects of modern, elite-dominated belief systems.

Regarding the fakery and false photographic evidence involved with NASA, that’s well known as you yourself admit further down in this thread. Our recent nuclear weapons reporting revealed a whole bombing squadron was dispatched on the night of the atomic bombing to a city near Hiroshima that had already been bombed twice. This is the squadron that may well have firebombed Hiroshima. It’s something that ought to be further investigated. We won’t hold our breath.

Also, you write, “While DB has not stated categorically that the earth is flat your recent articles certainly imply the distinct and credible *possibility* that this may be so.” We have not written any articles focused on a flat earth and its “credible possibility.” Not one. And we made our current statement within a larger philosophical and hypothetical context.

Finally, we begin to believe we have seen some of your rhetoric repeated almost word-for-word elsewhere on the ‘Net – and by others. It begins to resemble a campaign.

If I seem somewhat obsessed, it’s only because DB has been one of my go-to informational sites for years and I’ve noticed a lot of stranger and stranger musings on the site which I feel damages its credibility in the public mind.

I mention Cass and his cognitive infiltration precisely because the DB has recently been exhibiting exactly this type of information – false conspiracy theories (flat earth) that only serve to diminish actual criminal conspiracies (9/11) when the two are conflated.

And yes, I know you guys have exposed Cass and that is another reason I keep bringing him up. Don’t you see how your recent writings play directly into his hands, especially when he is connected to flat earth promotions? You are doing his work for him!

For example, anyone new to questioning 9/11 might come across your site and now see articles about flat earth, mysterious continents beyond Antarctica, fake space stations, fake moon landings, etc., etc. and will then think to themselves that questioning 9/11 is in the same territory as thinking the earth is flat! Is that what you want? I know that is what Cass wants! So why give him what he wants?

r2bzjudge

“It’s easy to go on Youtube and find videos that make a persuasive case
that NASA has faked almost its entire record, from sending rockets into
space to traveling to the moon.”

Man actually walked on the Moon. I find nothing persuasive about any claims of a Moon landing hoax.

The astronaut on the Moon photos and movie films could only have been produced by people who were actually on the Moon at the time. PERIOD.

Rockets have obviously been into space, as the space station can be seen from the ground, orbiting the earth. Photos of the Earth have been taken from outer space. Photos of the back side of the Moon and close up photos of the planets have also been taken, which required a space craft to take the photos.

Jim Johnson

Boy howdy you hit it out of the park with this article. When I read NASA again claim “nobody saw this coming” when Wal Thornhill had reviewed papers filed 10 years ago predicting what they would see on impact with the comets, I get a full understanding of how my most precious sciences have been relegated to LSD chewers with chalkboards (he calls them mathemajicians). All this to maintain electricity gets to us by metered wires. It takes true effort to walk away from this blasted machine, as I realize most of what I was taught is suspect, at the very least. In school, we knew there was a high-school version of history, then the true college version with all its’ cuss words and porn. We shrugged, yet agreed this was well and proper. As it should be. But the true levels of disinformation has gone well beyond what is healthy and right. On the up-side, you kids have a whole universe (literally) of mind-blowing facts to parse, with all the attendant answers and possibilities it holds. For that, I am truly jealous.

alohajim

Regret wasting so much time in the comment section on the polite pissing match between DB and Blinko. Some (not so) clever psyops going on.

DB – you were bound to get much flak and reaction after running the nukes/Hiroshima article. Blinko’s reaction is textbook! To allow the truth of 911 to reach the public is nothing – any number of minions/puppets/organizations/nations can be thrown under the bus. No problem. If nukes never existed and were not used on Japan in 1945 then this is a giant problem. As is faked moon landings and faked ‘space travel’ to a lesser extent. The implications are that all governments have been colluding and lying to their people for at least 71 years.

Nobody writes at such length and with such purpose as Blinko’s comments on this thread without very strong convictions, lots of free time, and strong motivation. But the ‘strong convictions’ part seems to be to only to discredit any inquiry and/or dialog on the truth of nuclear weapons or moon landings and space travel. The flat earth bs is just a distraction – a ploy to lump legitimate issues of contention with those with no legitimacy (sorry DB, it’s too easy to refute a flat earth). The ‘motivation’ part (Blinko – apologies in advance, I know nothing) appears to be a pay by the word arrangement.

Note there is another commentator adamant about how the Apollo missions and all of the mood landings were real events. For a very good reason – when the truth is known, trust in governments and statists of all stripes will vanish.

Bottom line : DB’s article’s on nukes/Hiroshima and moon landings have hit a nerve, are doing their jobs, and have elicited expected and predictable responses from our ‘authorities’. Go DB!

my name is irrelevant

“Bottom line : DB’s article’s on nukes/Hiroshima and moon landings have
hit a nerve, are doing their jobs, and have elicited expected and
predictable responses from our ‘authorities’. Go DB!”

Here! Here! I agree with your self-evident observation! The exposure of just one has the potential to set them back 1000 years! Possibly even result in their bloodlines going extinct, as humanity may react in unconstrained horror and cleanse itself of them!

Today, the nuclear bomb lines of questioning appear to provide the greatest immediate risks for them, as I feel that they intend to fool humanity with a SPECTACULAR GRANDE SHOW, when all of their missiles are released at once on our planet and then “Miraculously” fail to detonate through a “Divine Intervention”. Out of CHAOS… a divine new reign…

🙂

Their advanced black ops UFO projects (and all NASA promotions of the nature of “Space”) with their directed narratives surrounding them both are interlinked with the phony bomb, and so are very critical belief systems to be maintained at all costs too. But the nuclear bomb promotions hold a much greater, less confusing, body of evidence for us to consider, here and now.

Hence the concerted efforts to quell these lines of discussion and explorations! They’ll take the site down if they have to, but it may be too late for that option to be quietly effective.

Rather than argue with paid (and disposable) minions, I prefer to explore other less considered possibilities concerning the nature and properties of space, as I believe all of modern day academia is probably compromised. One of those more fascinating finds (and one that is more in agreement with Tesla than Einstein) for me has been The Primer Fields series by David Alan LaPoint:

Unfortunately the minions got to him on Facebook and he gave up on his series, but those first three videos are incredible eye openers for me! I have watched them numerous times and still am learning more each time I view them. I even built his bowl shaped magnet assemblies to see first hand for myself how they work and to better understand their unique properties.

Our curiosity for knowledge of truth and reality will never be fulfilled. Humans will NEVER stop questioning! And that is a wonderful (and fun) trait to nurture.

Thank you,

natural human

Totally agree. However, I do not think FE is a distraction. On the contrary, it’s right in front of your face to observe. I discounted it at first, for about month. But the smartest person I know is the one who pointed me toward the evidence, that is, the evidence that isn’t in my face every day and night. Folks, if you have an open and inquisitive mind you MUST question the ball earth. You at least have to question it. Totally discounting it out of hand is goes against everything most of you proclaim to possess – critical thought.

my name is irrelevant

I have not paid any attention to the flat earth arguments yet, so I have no opinion on them and have nothing to add. I simply am running out of time each day. Although time is a poor excuse.

I agree that its healthy to explore that issue (rather than dismiss it) and someday maybe I’ll get there.

Thanks,

nathenism

all you have to do is watch what the sun does every day to prove the earth is not flat…if the earth were flat the sun would never touch the horizon and from our perspective it would be smaller when further away and much bigger when straight overhead…every single thing we can see is smaller when far away and bigger when close up…this proves beyond any doubt the earth is not flat…

Jeebus. Now I’m part of a conspiracy because I don’t believe the world is frickin’ flat?!?!?

Seriously alohajim and DB?

Guys, as I said, question all you want! I agree everything should be questioned. But at the same time, some things are just silly, unless supported with incontrovertible evidence. And that, more importantly, giving serious credence to certain subjects could do more harm that good. In fact, such writings could play directly into the hands of the NWO as it helps to delegitimize the alternative press in the public mind. Am I a nut for pointing out that obvious risk?

In late 2001, I had similar reactions to what I wrote in this thread, but directed against a friend who told me that 9/11 was an inside job. I told him he was nuts. I wrote him copious emails pointing out why his thesis just could not be true. But at the same time, I told him I was open minded and would read any *credible* and well supported evidence he could send me. So he did just that, turning me on to the work of Michael Ruppert and later David Griffin, Alex Jones and others.

After reading 9/11 material for 18 months, I came to the firm conclusion that my friend was correct. 9/11 was indeed an inside job. That blew my world apart but at the same time I was happy to know the truth and was more than willing to change my mind, in light of the mountains of INCONTROVERTIBLE evidence that exists on the subject.

In contrast to 9/11 – the flat earth, moon landing, no satellites, no space station, no nuke hoax stuff – lacks the support of incontrovertible evidence. Sure there are a bunch of YouTube docs out there with bits and pieces of interesting anomalies. But many of these fall apart with any serious investigation, especially if one has a background in the hard sciences.

I first got interested in the moon landing hoax (and UFOs) when I was a mere teenager. I am 50 now, so believe me I have seen EVERYTHING on the subject and have more than given it a fair shake over several decades. I always kept an open mind. And my conclusion is that this particular conspiracy theory is just not supported by the facts. There is a veritable mountain of solid and incontrovertible evidence FOR and almost no *incontrovertible* evidence AGAINST. And as for flat earth, no space stations, no nukes and such – I’ve already said my peace on that.

I really think that many people in the “Truther” community are suffering from a form of PTSD. What I mean by that, is a phenomenon I observed in myself after concluding 9/11 was an inside job. For a few weeks I had a mild emotional breakdown of sorts. I was still outwardly normal to everyone but my internal world took a hit. What else are they frickin’ lying about? I revisited all the moon hoax stuff. I researched Area 51, the Illuminati, Free Masons, and on and on. I felt that the entire world was an illusion and I was pissed off about that. I started to believe in just about every conspiracy I read about. Took a few more months for the pendulum to rebalance, where I realized that the only way forward is to just operate with a calm, scientific and objective analysis of any possible conspiracy. Anything that did not pass muster with such an analysis should just be quietly discarded, unless and until truly incontrovertible evidence appears to the contrary. That is my modus operandi. I would think that could also be called common sense. But what do I know.

As for being paid by the word – yeah, I wish! Believe me, right now I could use the cash.

And as my (hopefully final) word on the moon landing and such – I humbley admit that I am willing to change my mind if some truly mind-blowing and incontrovertible evidence pops up. Like, for e.g., Buzz Aldrin putting up a YouTube video where he admits the entire thing was fake, supplies behind-the-scenes footage of how the fakery was done and then he gets mysteriously poisoned the next day. Now THAT would get me to change my mind! Until then, I conclude that it is all bunk. Sorry if you don’t like that.

dave jr

I’m with you Blinko. The DB saved me from insanity several years ago, but now I think they have fallen off the edge of the earth on some topics. Columbus and his financiers knew the earth was spherical over 500 years ago for Christ’s sake! And what should DB say to Galileo, Copernicus and Kepler? Just take and add to the 90% of good information offered at this excellent site and ignore the goofy stuff. Truth has a way of working its way out.

As far as the moon landings, my problems center on the idea that 1960s technology could operate a rocket engine in reverse. Also that the Eagle could land with enough fuel payload, one small rocket motor and be able launch and reach escape velocity, albeit in 1/6 gravity, reach lunar orbit and that the command module had enough fuel to break orbit, accelerate back to earth orbit and brake for descent. I find it impossible that the flimsy and angular shaped lunar module could have held 15 psi (atmospheric pressure) without blowing out at the seams. I also don’t like the infamous and very defined ‘foot print’ on the otherwise powdery depicted surface of the ‘moon’ which would require a certain % of moisture to pack it so definitively. And many many other questions that won’t/can’t be answered just like 9/11.

No, I think NASA had a very important mission after Sputnik was launched. Werner Von Braun was already employed to develop a heavy lift rocket, the Saturn series, to put satellites in orbit. Since this (earth orbiting hardware) was secret government business, a good cover story was needed and JFK, wittingly or not, delivered it admirably.

That being said, still, all Americans should be proud of the achievements. To bad the Authoritarians think they have to lie all the time. That will be their downfall.

If you can find an article or even a sentence where we reported we believed the earth was flat, please provide it. What we did say is that we would not discount the meme outright. In other words, we would treat it seriously and see if anything emerged from the discussion that seemed credible. We did this with Peak Oil, too. At first we weren’t certain about abiotic oil but later on, along with others we began to understand the truth was much different than we thought.

That doesn’t mean the earth is flat, or that we believe any of the assertions being made, only that some of the discussion has raised questions that may ultimately provide additional insight. The same goes for the moon-landings and “weapons of mass destruction.” We’re not at all certain that the Pentagon and NASA are regular truth-tellers. Are you?

dave jr

Why not entertain evidence of a tooth fairy? I come here for serious evaluations of pertinent events in todays world. Thank you for that.

And we are not yet through with peak oil. I talk of the economic benefit of the easy energy in the low hanging fruit that may have passed (peaked). You talk of commodity quantity as if it were the same concept. You haven’t sufficiently challenged me, so I persist. And thank you for what challenges you do make, seriously, much appreciated. Only time will tell.

Now wha??, I’d wouldn’t believe NASA or the Pentagon even if they did tell the truth, just based on their track record.

Dave, we’ve appreciated your feedbacks through the years. But there is nothing of the “tooth fairy” involved in appraising NASA’s various forms of fakery. And surveying ‘Net based information about Hiroshima and Nagasaki has already led us to a discovery of an unaccounted-for bomber unit. If you want to discover the truth about dominant social themes, you often have to travel into past and make controversial assertions. That doesn’t necessarily mean they’re “goofy.”

Blinko23

Well dave jr. reanimated me from the dead. Haha. Sorry.

“What we did say is that we would not discount the meme outright. ”

Don’t you see that that the above therefore creates the implicit *suggestion* that the world may indeed be flat? It’s almost the same thing as stating the hypothesis outright.

Anyway, a geologist friend of mine recently reminded me of the simplest, cheapest way to quickly prove to oneself that the world is NOT flat. Just get on any boat and approach any mountainous coastline. Bring a pair of powerful binoculars with you:

If the world was flat, the peak and base of the mountain will appear AT THE SAME TIME on the horizon as you approach the coast.

On the other hand, if the world has curvature, the peak will appear FIRST and then the base will slowly grow under the peak until the mountain is fully formed.

After you do the above easy experiment, you can then *discount the flat earth meme outright*. But do still continue to question all sorts of things. I am not implying that you should stop questioning stuff. Even outlandish stuff.

Finally, I thought this article was apropos. We scientific types can get riled up when people say ridiculous things that can so easily be proven or disproven. Luckily I didn’t have access to a propane tank during this thread discussion:

Just rhetorical nonsense. There are elements within the Flat Earth debate we won’t discount, ie: ignore. We’re interested in some of Admiral Byrd’s experiences, even though you claim he was insane. We’re interested in why planes apparently are not directly tracked in certain regional areas of the world. This doesn’t mean the earth is flat, only that certain issues emerging from the debate are interesting and seem to warrant further investigation.

Blinko23

“This doesn’t mean the earth is flat, only that certain issues emerging from the debate are interesting and seem to warrant further investigation.”

You return here to repeat the same single point over and over, hijacking the thread and increasingly making it unreadable. You obviously have an agenda. Or perhaps you are still “injured.”

Blinko23

Because nonsense on otherwise fine alternative news sites drives me up the wall! I feel it could hamper a wider awakening amongst the general population.

My agenda is Truth, same as yours.

Btw, I am equally critical of Alex Jones. I am a fan. But sometimes he goes far into wonky territory and I post comments on InfoWars as well, calling him out.

Ditto with the late Michael Ruppert. I credit him with really waking me up. Then I was dismayed when, towards the last year of his life, he started posting nonsense on his CollapseNet blog, starting to believe in ancient alien artifacts, and other weird David Ickian stuff, with no supporting evidence. So I called him out on that too.

You are welcome to post. Just don’t say the same thing over and over. If you read through the thread, you’ll find others have made the same point.

Blinko23

Thanks for the feedback Dave and good to know that I am not alone in my thoughts and that some other long-term readers have similar sentiments.

As mentioned later in this thread, I will still hold out a 1-2% chance that the moon landings were fake. I am otherwise 99% convinced that they took place.

The concerns you cite above are all engineering based questions. None of which are mysterious. I studied mechanical engineering and physics in college. Some of our undergraduate courses covered aerospace engineering, fluid dynamics and of course endless Newtonian physics. We tested everything with actual experiments and, like all engineers, we built things – a full sized fuel efficient car, scaled down planes and rockets, etc. We briefly studied the Apollo program and some of the physics and engineering behind it. We visited Heroux Aerospace that manufactured the landing gear for the Eagle.

All of the science works. There is nothing fake or conspiratorial behind any of it.

* As students we had to work a lot of this stuff out ourselves, often from first principles. *

In other words, we had to PROVE that theories worked by building things in the real world, according to the theories, so that they were no longer theories but demonstrable, physical objects and processes. Mathematics and engineering really stand alone among the scientific disciplines. There is NOTHING RELIGIOUS about them. You don’t just take it on faith that something is so. Students have to prove that things actually work. If your professor lied to you about something, you would find out pretty quickly once you put it to the test!

If you don’t believe me, no problem. Either study engineering yourself if you are interested or find an engineer/physicist that you trust (a family member?) and have him or her go through all of your questions in layman’s terms.

I will address just one point you made. The footprint. Pretty easy to test, no? Go out in the desert or the beach. Walk on the driest sand you can find (no moisture). Does your boot leave a clearly defined footprint? Yes or no? There’s your answer on that.

dave jr

I’ve earned a bachelor degree in ME. Also I am involved in a family business that is State certified in materials testing for aggregate products. Any material dried and shaken through a 200 mesh is considered LBW (loss by wash). This with its natural moisture content (up to 30%) is considered to be clay. Step on clay and see your foot print. Dry it in an oven to 0% moisture and step on the pile of dust and look for your ‘foot print’. I can tell you from experience it will only leave a depression without definition. The same holds true throughout the coarser meshes without moisture. So please don’t pretend to be an AUTHORITY if you don’t know what you are talking about. peace.

Scott W

I had not heard the fake nuke story before, but it makes a lot of sense and explains why Albert Einstein is a sacred cow. Einstein’s E = M c 2 equation and the equivalency of mass / matter and energy is stated to have been the impetus behind nuclear weapons research. There are several things wrong with this statement:

– Mass and matter are often blindly interchanged. They are not equivalent; mass is a property of matter.
– The speed of light varies through different media (e.g., refraction in water), vacuums are extremely hard to find in nature. Why would the speed of light in a non-existent vacuum have any relevance outside of a vacuum?
– The speed of light in a vacuum is not actually constant. Rupert Sheldrake studied the historical value of this “constant” and it wasn’t.

This equivalency formula is associated with Einstein’s relativity theories which are theoretically wrong and have been experimentally disproven.

Dayton Miller ran some experiments a century ago which verified the existence of an æther. Einstein stated that if Miller’s experiments were correct, then “the whole relativity theory collapses like a house of cards”. After Miller’s death, Robert Shankland did a hatchet job on Miller’s work which was then promptly forgotten.

The John Chappell Natural Philosophy Society has demonstrated and proven the incorrectness of both of Einstein’s relativity theories in several different ways. They even produced a movie about it: “Einstein Wrong”.

Yet, despite all of that, the meme of “the genius of Einstein’s mass-energy equivalency and relativity theories” remains as strong as ever. If nuclear weapons are a hoax, and Einstein’s theories are the supporting evidence, then that explains the Einstein hoopla.

Yes Einstein was perhaps developed to take Tesla’s place. Tesla was a real genius. Thanks for your insights. Please continue to share them. We intend to write an article on Einstein soon.

Scott W

I look forward to the Einstein article; there is enough material against Einstein’s theories to write several books.

Another thing to consider is that the fusion model of the sun is often used as an example of the intense power of nuclear fusion which is the same energy source used by “nuclear weapons”. If the sun can use nuclear fusion, then so can the military.

Unfortunately, for the hoaxters, every observational measurement of the sun does not support the nuclear fusion theory. The interior of the sun is cold (as evidenced by the coolness of sunspots) and the corona is super hot. These measurements and other characteristics of the sun do, however, support the model proposed by proponents of the Electric Universe. Is it any surprise that the Electric Universe model is ignored / rejected / ridiculed by mainstream science.

Thank you for sharing the John Chappell Natural Philosophy site! Awesome resource!

Pilgrim

Since psyops exist . . . why?

I briefly took martial arts in junior high. One principle I learned applies here. The principle is that whatever inertia your opponent has, utilize that inertia to defeat him. That’s the purpose served by psyops.

In martial arts, if an opponent is coming at you, pull him toward you, destabilizing him and then simply step to the side, etc.

Mentally well-balanced people learned at a young age to trust their parents, then their teachers, then the nice newsman on television, then the newspaper. These people don’t need to have psyops used against them. They already believe as they’re told and they vote as their told.

Those with trust issues see through illusion and deception, often without solid proof. Since these people are already on a trajectory, psyops uses that inertia and pulls these people in the direction they’re already going beyond their intended point of interest into conspiracies that are intended to make them look like tin-foil hat conspiracy theory nut-jobs.

Did the moon landing take place? With a powerful enough telescope you can see the junk they left behind.

Did 15 Saudi Wahhabis really fly planes into the WTT? Sure, but just like the attack on Pearl Harbor, it was known ahead of time. Do you really think surveillance isn’t as good now as it was in 1941? How do I know? The stock on all four airlines involved tanked in the days leading up to the attack. Do you really think GWB was smart enough to set up that whole thing in 9 months? A good number of people in government knew it would take place. Don’t forget that the president is only temp employee, the vast majority of the apparatus of government is there decade after decade and administration after administration.

Today’s government incompetence is so transparent more and more people are questioning government’s involvement in activities seemingly against America’s best interests. Thus the psyops. If government can get those looking for the truth behind the lie to consider and embrace tin-foil-hat stuff that is against conventional wisdom, they have discredited their detractors and defeated their opponent using his own inertia.

“If government can get those looking for the truth behind the lie to consider and embrace tin-foil-hat stuff that is against conventional wisdom, they have discredited their detractors and defeated their opponent using his own inertia.”

But at one point it was common knowledge that vaccines were a kind of universal panacea. Now we’re finding out that a lot of evidence was concealed and destroyed showing vaccines can be injurious and even deadly.

At one point it was common knowledge that oil came from dinosaur bones. Now it is regularly argued that oil is produced from geological pressures.

At one point it was common knowledge that the world was about to run out of oil due to Peak Oil. Now there is so much oil the price has plunged.

You write: “Did 15 Saudi Wahhabis really fly planes into the WTT? Sure, but just like the attack on Pearl Harbor, it was known ahead of time.”

Are you sure? Why do you believe it? Because the mainstream media reported it? Could there be some other explanation? Why have there been reports that many of the hijackers are still alive?

When it comes to nuclear weapons, It’s obvious common knowledge that Hiroshima was destroyed by an atom bomb. But in just a few weeks of reporting we’ve discovered 66 bombers were dispatched on the morning of August 6th, 1945 – the night of the atom bombing – to a city near Hiroshima that was already fire-bombed twice. It seems possible these bombers may actually have firebombed Hiroshima. There are numerous other anomalies or outright lies surrounding the Hiroshima narrative. Even today’s “witnesses” to the bombing were very young children when it occurred.

At what point does the potential “truth” blend into “tin-foil-hat” stuff? And should that prevent someone from scrutinizing it?

Pilgrim

NO! It should never prevent someone from scrutinizing it. It’s a given that our government has become amoral and has embarked on numerous disinformation campaigns from the serious all the way down to the trivial. During the soviet era propaganda kept the people in the dark, the joke in Russia was that the only way to get food in your fridge is to put the television in it.

The bottom line is we’re being played. People are being conditioned to trust the internet. I literally read someone say that he only trusts sites ending with .gov or .edu. OH . . . MY . . . GOD! Those are the sites least likely to be disseminating truth!

Your response to my post is a prime example of the success of the psyop protocol You and I can’t even agree on the twin towers debacle. Personally I think a Tesla particle beam weapon was involved. I know that sounds like tin-foil hat stuff, but how else is metal turning into powder explained? Let’s not forget that the gold in the basement became salvage, even though it wasn’t effected by the fire. Hmmm. Who got it? I dunno, do you?

There’s a game of chess going on and we have no clue who’s moving the pieces. But I am of the firm opinion that if every US government alphabet soup agency, department and commission was shut down, the world would be a better place.

DB has always attempted to explain dominant social themes. Sometimes we are correct, sometimes less so. But our mission is to alert people to these memes so they can THINK FOR THEMSELVES. And this thinking should galvanize various forms of human action that will lead to more independent, fruitful lives.

As for people “being conditioned to trust the Internet,” we would recommend that people spend at least some spare time on the Internet because they can read in a day what used to take a year and read in a year what used to take a lifetime or more. The Internet is a helluva tool. What you do with it is up to.

I am not a name

“DB has always attempted to explain dominant social themes. Sometimes we
are correct, sometimes less so. But our mission is to alert people to
these memes so they can THINK FOR THEMSELVES. And this thinking should
galvanize various forms of human action that will lead to more
independent, fruitful lives.”

Yes, this is exactly as I view your mission. It is a visionary endeavor in my opinion, in a world where few exist. It must be very difficult for you to showcase content that conflicts with your stated mission to appear on your site.

I imagine that having to stare at that editorial at the top all weekend is bringing a bit of anxiety? Are you stuck with Mr. Wile’s occasional editorials contractually, or indefinitely?

Are WE ALL stuck with enduring more of Mr. Wile’s adopted (HIS Internet Reformation definition and HIS organic Brexit process, thus HIS supporting proofs) belief system promotions on your otherwise critical-thought provoking web site?

Mr. Wile founded The Daily Bell and though he is no longer affiliated, he continues to contribute when he chooses.

dave jr

“how else is metal turning into powder?”
Actually into liquid that flowed like several gushers at the corners of the towers every 30 stories or so, saw with my own eyes, on government sanctioned news releases. The answer is thermite, which the spherical tell tale particles has been verified by independent labs to exist all around the site and in the debris.

dauden

Here’s one only an hour long, summarizing the debate about the flat earth. Is it so “scientific” that we just accept their explanation without questioning further? Anyone can reason this out for themselves……….https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEAs0tdNLjI

thanks

I withdrew from these discussions earlier this weekend because I am reluctant to further challenge the good messenger (The Daily Bell) at this time, because the DB is ever evolving, growing in awareness (is self-correcting as new knowledge is realized), and because others such as yourselves with better skills and records exist with their own messenger web sites.

The majority of the population are not quite ready for these deeper discussions brought up in this and other articles in the recent past here at TDB. They have a short memory and appear to be too busied to self-examine, they still seem to be in a deep state of denial that they may possibly be acting as participants, rather than in opposition. They simply fail to understand their own roles taken in directed history promotions. I forgive them.

The Daily Bell, through a unique “kid gloves” approach to questioning dominant social promotions, is not spooking the herd with their messages as so many other messengers do. TDB asks only for rational, critical thought from readers which invites self-exploration, invites research, rather than issuing frightening statements of fact. Brandon at Alt-Market possesses very similar and effective writing skills. I really want to leave you all alone… You are providing a very difficult service to present and are doing it well.

However, The article posted Saturday at the top is one of the weakest editorial arguments I have ever seen published here. It appears to be a cheerleading article for a longstanding concept that the author refuses to criticize (is buttressed by false premise and correlated/promoted by false facts) honestly. I still refuse to discuss it directly in that thread because doing so may cause a greater harm than is necessary, but since this thread is about to fall off the front page (and lists several questionable DSTs in a catch-all fashion), I hope the staff of TDB will take some moments to look within themselves.

My points:

The Internet Reformation concept (assuming it exists) the author talks about is dominated and controlled by TPTB almost fully. The powers that be have carpet bombed the Internet with limited hangout “truther style” web sites in order to seed their gardens for mind controlling of the peoples. The author fails to recognize the significance of that obvious fact in his article.

Yes, the Internet is an extraordinary tool! For the open minded critical thinker, it is enabling a rapid advancement (and enabling much greater depths of understanding) in a lifelong continuing education process. There seems to be few open minded critical thinkers among the masses though, if we can loosely define a critical thinker as one who adopts nothing, but is willing to explore all, relevant to his/her interests.

For the average Joe and Jane the Internet may more honestly be conceptualized to be little more than a tool primarily used for Consumption.

Further, it appears that the author has adopted a dominant social theme (that being the Brexit promotion as being an organic, population driven process) himself! He is apparently asking you and I to believe that HIS dominant social promotion has a basis for proof in reality! His argument that Brexit somehow provides evidence for his Internet Reformation concept is terribly misleading. I reject all of his nonsense, flatly today, as a greater body of evidence provides food for thought elsewhere.

To the author: Please, re-examine your current beliefs. It appears by your behavior that you have allowed your mind to adopt. A critical thinker is better served by entertaining thoughts without an adoption. Growth ceases when you allow that to happen to you (and you know it).

Thank you for hearing (and thank you for your service) me out,

thanks

I’d like to add… I hope others will exercise a bit of compassionate restraint as well. This need not become any more confrontational and challenging of an issue for TDB than it already is. Please allow my commentary to drop off this front page and die…

This comments section has been a most interesting and rewarding read. Thanks DB for making it possible!

In the spirit of new, unorthodox and challenging ideas, I submit the following:

At one time, it was “common” knowledge that man was created (somehow) by a supernatural being in a place (curiously) named Eden.

Later, it became “common” knowledge that man (somehow) evolved from apes.

Would you care to examine some recent, excellent evidence that man might be a
HYBRID? Yes, a cross between two animals, the mother being a chimpanzee and the father–well, how curious are you and how well does the evidence hold up?