I could never invest myself in any sort of super hero comics. I just can't get into it, so this isn't really going to be on the subject of comics, but on cartoons.

What the hell happened to Young Justice? DC Nation completely dropped the ball on that one. As I said, I'm no comic book fan but dammit if I didn't sit down and watch young justice. That show did it right. It seemed like every time I turned that show on there were 24 different super heroes and 27 super villains on the screen. That was great! That is what comic books are, right? The bajillion super heroes? I LOVED that there were so many characters there even if they weren't doing anything, at least they were there. That is using all of your assets in my opinion.

Heck I even looked up who this guy was since I thought he was so cool looking

RandV80:I've always thought that the DC universe is held back by it's origins and that this is mostly due to history. DC basically came first, and it's characters were born in the 30's to the backdrop of the great depression. Marvel came later, and it's characters were born in the 60's to the backdrop of... well the 60's. The latter is going to lead to far more interesting characters. DC can evolve their characters in interesting ways, but they're always tied down to their origins which quite simply aren't as good.

So Marvel owes it's current success to it's complete failure in the 1930's, 40's, and 50's? ;) (Not counting Captain America of course)

RandV80:I've always thought that the DC universe is held back by it's origins and that this is mostly due to history. DC basically came first, and it's characters were born in the 30's to the backdrop of the great depression. Marvel came later, and it's characters were born in the 60's to the backdrop of... well the 60's. The latter is going to lead to far more interesting characters. DC can evolve their characters in interesting ways, but they're always tied down to their origins which quite simply aren't as good.

So Marvel owes it's current success to it's complete failure in the 1930's, 40's, and 50's? ;) (Not counting Captain America of course)

Marvel owes it's success from learning to adapt to the times. Unlike DC that has a hard time doing that.

Sorry, but when you have to pay 50 bucks for a comic that isn't even 5 years old at this point, just to understand the story or to "collect" them, it is fucking sad.

Thankfully, Manga isn't expensive. I can buy 27 VOLUMES for less than 200 bucks. It costs 30 to 40 bucks to buy a single volume for most Comics, while I can spend 10 to 15 for a single volume. Cheaper if I buy in bulk.

I would love to read comics, if they weren't so fucking expensive for not reason other than people are stupid and putting way to much worth in a couple coloured pages of dudes/gals punching each other.

What comic that's less than 5 years old costs 50 bucks? If you're not a collector and just want to read the story, go for trade paperbacks. The pricing is pretty comparable to manga collections. 10-15 bucks is pretty much the standard for 1 volume. The only collections I've seen cost around 30 were hardcover deluxe editions.

The Deluxe Hardcover editions are the only ones they sell around here, other than the "singles", or whatever people call them. The ones that they sell for 10 bucks for a single chapter, each month. Also, the hardcover's cost around 40 to 50 around here in any store. Might just be the hell that is South dakota though. I can pick up a volume of any Manga for around 9 to 10 here as well. Again, might just be SD.

That sounds like they're gouging you. I mean, the list price of The Fables deluxe editions are 29.99, which are around 225 pages each. You can get them on Amazon for 19 usually. Compared to say the first volume of Akira manga, paperback list price 24.99 for 352 pages. That seems fair to me because both the hardcover and coloring adds to the cost of production. I might suggest just ordering online. Or finding a local comic shop that has occasional sales. My local shop has storewide 20% off promotions not too infrequently.

My opinion comes from a comic book geek in self-imposed exile from the big two. This is mostly due to lack of funds and frustration between the companies failing to evolve in some meaningful way imo.

I like Marvel better than DC, but only by a small margin.

Marvel has great characters. Each one, whether they are demigods or average people, have feet of clay. DC has some great characters too but they seem too perfect at times. This is why Grant Morrison referred to them as Olympic gods during his JLA run. A team like the Avengers is more like a group of friends and family working together for a common goal. They bicker and disagree and irritate one another but, at the end of the day, they put aside the differences to focus on the threat at hand. Yeah, DC has relationships like that (I.E. the JLI era or Wally West Flash and Kyle Rayner Green Lantern or Ollie and Hal for that matter) but that is due to the writers catching up to what Marvel already covered.

Story wise, I'd say both have their best runs and storylines. I can think of many Marvel sagas that stand out as the best (see Ultron Unleashed, Under Siege, and the Kree/Skrull War from the Avengers comics) and its had some classic writer runs (Chris Claremont and Peter David to name a few) but DC isn't a slouch in those departments either (Grant Morrison's JLA run, James Robinson's Starman, and Batman's Long Halloween for example). I'm sure many folks here can offer their favorite DC or Marvel writer era or comic story line or series to recommend to anyone.

With all this said, I'm at a point in life where I've grown tired of comics from the big two. First off, trying to keep up with multiple series with price covers of three dollars or higher while slogging through highs and lows of runs tends to make the hobby less enjoyable.

After DC pulled their New 52 line, I left that company behind. Tossing out their history to bring in new readers is a flawed idea. The company has broken their continuity so many times, its hard for any fan to keep up with what is considered cannon or not (a number of MovieBob's Big Picture episodes can attest for that). Marvel still has its continuity in place and is trying to bring in readers but with multiple titles of a certain team plus dragging us into one event crossover after another is not winning them any popularity contests. Plus both are guilty of over-saturation and price gouging but that is just how I see it. I could make an entire message thread of my beefs with Marvel and DC recent actions.

Lately, I'm getting back into TPB's and mangas. I'm currently caught up on Naruto and I'm now playing catch-up with One Piece. Meanwhile, I'm looking into books I never tried before until recently. I'm currently into Volume 6 of Eric Powell's The Goon (Chinatown alone cemented my vote for The Goon to be my all time favorite comic book character) and have just dipped my toes into Darwyne Cook's Spirit run (like to get into the original run by Eisner but that's gonna take some serious cash).

While I miss collecting Marvel and DC a bit, they have a long way to go before it can win this fanboy back to the comic book shop.

I do like DC a lot, but Marvel wins hands down for me. Superman and alternate universes kind of ruins it for me. I like Superman but, because he is so powerful, they have to make his allies and enemies powerful as well.

Well, DC have Batman, and Batman has the best villains IMO. I also like Gotham City and how gritty it is. DC also have watchmen.

Marvel has the X-men and Spiderman, which I really liked to watch when I was younger. Haven't read that much of the comics. I never really cared much for the avengers, or iron man, or those. I watched the movies and they were fun, but I wouldn't say that the main characters were particularly interesting. While Nolan made three batman movies that I love, and watchmen was also great imo. I keep associating superman with Smallville, and it's always made it hard to take him seriously, because I think that series is awful. Maybe the new movie will change it.

Marvel is superior to DC in almost every way. At least for me. I'm not sure I feel like going into specifics but a lot of people wouldn't care about DC at all if Batman wasn't a thing. With Marvel, you got Spider-Man, Wolverine, Hulk, Captain America, Iron Man, Thor and a few others that are of pretty high, nearly equal caliber.

It's hard for me to call. I like more of DC's characters but I like the Marvel characters a bit more. Then again, it depends on the universe. Ones I like in one are dicks in another rather often (See ultimate vs 616 vs. MCU Captain America).

And when it comes to the continuity effect, that's also hard to call. Marvel sticks to their continuity and doesn't stray from it. If they want something taken out, they retcon it somehow.

DC on the other hand just reboots everything. While I do like some of the stories, New 52 has been pretty bad to me. Batman? Great. Red Hood? Getting better from garbage. Green Lantern? Loving 3/4 of the books. Flash has been fun, though I miss Wally. Otherwise I really can't find reason to care about the others.

I guess if I had to pick I'd go with DC. Their civilians aren't assholes.

Marvel, all the way. I've always been more able to emotionally connect with Marvel comics than with DC comics. As an example, the DC comics I've enjoyed the most were when Kyle Raynor became Green Lantern. It was a regular dude who was a graphic artist who suddenly had this power to make his imagination come to life, and that was far more relateable to me than the main DC heroes. I tried to get into Superman and Batman as a place to start with DC, but I found both of them to be uninspiring characters. (particularly Superman) With Marvel it's the opposite - there are some that I just don't care about in the comics (Iron Man, Captain America, Thor), but the X-Men (and related characters), Spiderman and Ultimate Fantastic Four I love. (main Fantastic Four... eh, sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. Ben Grimm is one of my favourite characters, as is Sue Storm. I like the Ultimate Reed and Johnny better than main Reed and Johnny.) I fell down the rabbit hole with the X-Men back in the day - probably have every X-Men comic produce from 1990 to 1999/2000ish, including limited series, one-off's, crossovers with non X-Men comics, variant covers... oi. (I wish I had all that money back right now, come to think of it. Argh, childhood is the time to waste disposable income, I suppose.)

There are exceptions to this; Batman: the Animated Series is probably the best comic-based cartoon I've ever watched, and Teen Titans is one of my proud guilty pleasures. Both are (IMO) vastly superior to any of the X-Men, Avengers or Spiderman cartoons that have come out.

Lastly, no dissin' Jubilee! She's the source of my lifelong fetish for asi... erm... oh fuckberries. (hey, I was 14 when I started collecting X-Men comics!)

Check out their webpage. Elfquest.com. All the issues are there, free to read, legally :)

Also, thanks for recommending planet hulk, now I have something to read :P

You're quite welcome. It's a great story. Made me love Hulk. I liked him before, but now I love the big angry dude. I want to get my hands on all the World War Hulk comics (as that directly follows Planet Hulk).

Going to have to disagree somewhat - Spiderman needs to be the 5th archetype for Marvel, and Green Lantern needs to be a 3rd for DC. Spiderman is the kid who suddenly has superpowers, new responsibilities and has to deal with the world of adults (fighting crime) while also being a kid. (This somewhat applies to the X-Men as well; many of the X-Men started off as teenagers as their entire backstory revolves around a private school.) Green Lantern is human being who is given extreme power to wield for justice, which may apply to other DC characters. (Captain Marvel?)

Kazam24a:My Fav between Marvel and DC has always been DC... Not sure why just preference i guess...

That's kind of the whole thing right there, isn't it? And forgive me for quoting you just to make my own point, which is general and not specifically aimed at you.

There simply is no "best". It is what speaks to the individual on a personal level. Spider-man speaks to me and I relate to him. And I have for over 35 years. Does that make him the "best"? Not at all. Just the best for my money.

Someone else may feel Batman is best or Green Lantern (John Stewart, my personal fav of the Lanterns) or maybe even a lesser known character. This one is just too subjective to settle with any real debate. Because for most fans it's just too passionate a topic.

So my vote goes to "none". There is no best, just which character each person loves.

There's a few reasons why DC is superior to Marvel but the mains reasons....

Marvel....pretty much copies DC at every opportunity, be it characters or events.

There's entirely too many clones over at Marvel. Hyperion, Capt Marvel, MS. Marvel, Dr. Strange, Thanos, Nova and the Green Lanter...oops, the Nova Corps, Deadpool, Hawkeye,Xmen, Mavel Now in general, etc. Now, that's just the clones. I didn't count the "inspired by" characters. Take Hawkeye, for example. Hawkeye is a blonde haired Archer that is also a womanizer and dated Mockingbird, who is a blonde female martial artist. Green Arrow is a blonde haired Archer that is also a womanizer and dated Black Canary, who is a blonde female martial artist. One came long before the other. Now some like to argue that Doom Patrol predates Xmen by less than 6 months. Given Stan Lee's history, I don't think it's a stretch that he created the xmen based on what was happening at DC. The similarities between the two are...Uncanny! There's also Thanos, who pretty much IS Darkseid. They are the same character except Darkseid is obsessed with the Anti Life Equation and Thanos wants the Infinity Guantlet. Deadpool? A mercenary named Wade Wilson that wields guns and pistols and wears damn near the same costume as Deathstroke, who's a mercenary named Slade Wilson that wields guns and pistols.

In fairness, DC has copied Marvel. Blackest Night is basically Marvel Zombies and Namor was around long before Aquaman. But Marvel takes it's copying to a whole new level.

Lastly, the storylines in Marvel...are completely underwhelming. Take Age of Ultron, for example. If you've at least heard about the comic, you know where it's headed. I've only read a few issues and I already can guess there will be time travel involved or some alternate universe crap. A vs X started out EPIC, but the end result is a few mutants losing there powers, the Avengers realizing they are all assholes, Xavier retires..again, and Wokanda takes a pounding. Only one person died and there was some shit about dragons...

Ah, this episode had the BIG one, DC v. Marvel. Both universes have their strengths and weaknesses, and it's a matter of personal preference. I would prefer to have more money to spend on DC's magic-based New52 books, but I stick with Action Comics (because Grant Morrison was writing Superman's early days) and Batman stuff. One area of the reboot I think succeeded was raising the profile of diversity characters, like Batwing, Batman Inc.'s African operative, and Batwoman, the Jewish redhead lesbian inspired by (but not aligned with) Batman. As for Marvel, the one weakness I find with it (besides event overload and too many similar teams) is a lack of consistency between books for characters who appear in multiple titles. Exhibit A: when Bucky Barnes was Captain America, he sounded and acted different in Avengers (written by Brian Michael Bendis) than how he does in his own title (when it was written by Ed Brubaker). Exhibit B: Dan Slott's Superior Spider-Man had him execute a one-note '90's throwback called Masacre in the middle of Grand Central Station, and his Avengers teammates are mad at him for it (as if none of them ever killed anybody before), while the people of New York City love him.

AnarchistAbe:As far as the "big two" are concerned, I have a deep love for Marvel. You guys hit the nail on the head when you said that they are flawed, and that's what makes them so great. These ARE modern gods, and they squander and screw-up just like everyone else; it's "real", and it's refreshing to see.

The Avengers beat the Punisher in last year's "War Zone" miniseries. Frank just can't allow himself to win a fight against Captain America. But now he's rollin' with a new roster of Thunderbolts, so there's that.

You obviously don't know much about the DC universe if you think the Riddler and the Joker are the same guy. Names are similar but that is about it.

Also if Iron Man is an archetype because he is a regular guy in powered armor/suit with powers. You left Blue Beetle or Booster Gold off your archetype list. Also 3 of your 4 Marvel archetypes all got there powers through science. Only one was born with it.

My pick goes to DC. Have really liked there event comics like 52( amazing story I highly recommend it) Blackest Night, and not as good but still pretty good Brightest Day.

The Marvel universe is better. Marvel has Spiderman, X-men, and the Avengers, all which have many interesting and unique characters with their own stories to tell. DC has Batman... and that's about it. All the other main characters are dreadfully bland in both powers and personality. DC has better characters for darker, grittier stories, however, but that doesn't change my overall opinion.

I would have to go with Marvel. I grew up watching animated Spiderman and X-Men series. I prefer the Marvel characters because of that realism that Marvel is known for. That is to go against DC because, as said in the video, they are perceived to be as gods or in a "perfect" ideals and characters. I liked the flaws that Marvels gave us. Plus with DC, which universe are you talking about, whenever the DC fans get over a major plot point, like with the death of a major character, DC just comes out and says that "Owe, it's a different universe from the normal universe. Whereas Marvel a death is a death and it affects the characters deeply.Also Marvel wins all because of Joss Whedon, 'nough said.

The DC and Marvel universe both suck to live in however before the reboot i would say DC, in the Avengers/JLA comic they made it abundantly clear the DC populace actually respect their heroes more, plus in the DC universe super powers is less of a requirement (plus they have a larger non super powered hero ratio too). I find comfort in the fact that if i where in the DCU and got super powers I'd be better placed :)

P.S. Every story from House of M to Secret War except WWH, sucked. They where good ideas but BMB ruined then with miss characterisation and stupid endings plus some of them are taken way out of proportion to much worse/bigger stuff that happened previously.

Marvel has the more cohesive overall universe. They've never fully rebooted it and you know the basic backstory of most characters. DC has a lot of vagueries that they've tried to clear up with their latest reboot (what is it five times now already? Crisis, Infinite Crisis, Crisis on Infinite Earths plus the original universe?) but stuff has already turned sour. So Batman has been working for only 6 years, but he's got a 12 year old kid from after the time he became Batman? That f up was quick DC, it only took you 3 months of comics to fall flat on your face there. Marvel simply forgets about the stuff that didn't work and leaves the greatest hits as the back story. The only time that failed is in One More Day.

DC has the better individual stories because their characters are mostly these solid archetypes and thus lend themselves easily toward a more symbolic arc that allows them to put forward more philosophical or poetic points.

As for characters. Marvel has a massive advantage with the X-Men roster here. DC was never able to get a really good team book going, their characters work best alone. They also flunked the Wildstorm integration by smearing Stormwatch and the Wildcats out over different teams. Still, trying to find the best character is tricky, for me the mainline heroes are a given so Supes, Batboy, Spiderbrat and Wolveryuck (God I hate that dude)are not going to be deal breakers they all have their appeal and are awesome when written well. So the difference has to come from the second bench and this is where I hit a snag. It's a toss up whether I like Dr Strange or Wonder Woman more (both greats in their good days but have been lingering around for a long time with nothing of note coming out, current WW is pretty good though). Power Girl or She-Hulk (I really couldn't say)? Iron Fist or Batwoman?

I used to be a massive Marvel fan and overall their universe feels more complete to me but those stories weigh more heavily. In the end you're still meant to read this stuff and DC has the better end of the stick there. So DC wins by a slight margin (I've got more Marvel books at home but currently I'm mostly reading DC).

I don't really care though, I pick and choose the good arcs left and right when word of mouth reaches me across the internet.

Which reminds me, are there collected editions of Damage Control out there? That stuff was brilliant.

Hmmm, seems at the end of the episode you're instigating a flame-war between two hardcore "nerd" fanbases...isn't that against the Escapist rules? :P

OT: My vote goes to Marvel mainly because I think, as a whole, the cast of characters is a lot stronger than the cast of characters for DC. That said, I believe DC has the best villians...and by "DC" I mean Batman.

But if for no other reason, DC gave us Aquaman, and that's why they lose this one. :P

Vortigar: Marvel simply forgets about the stuff that didn't work and leaves the greatest hits as the back story. The only time that failed is in One More Day.

Not true, marvel tended to look back on some of their less stellar/nonsensical stuff/goofy stuff and later on made sense of it, the nest example. Ms. Marvels pregnancy (Didn't MovieBob talk about that?), DC tend to just rush it instead of letting it all in naturally.

I used to be a massive Marvel fan and overall their universe feels more complete to me but those stories weigh more heavily. In the end you're still meant to read this stuff and DC has the better end of the stick there. So DC wins by a slight margin (I've got more Marvel books at home but currently I'm mostly reading DC).

I don't really care though, I pick and choose the good arcs left and right when word of mouth reaches me across the internet.

Same here, weird, before the reboot i was a huge DC fan but now most of it is doing nothing for me. Marvel i again i like like some but I'm kinda against it on principle, AvX was just sad.

Which reminds me, are there collected editions of Damage Control out there? That stuff was brilliant.

Marvel all the way! Characters are more likeable and are not as overpowered and omnipotent as DC characters. Batman and maybe wonderwoman and teen titans are the only enjoyable DC characters. Marvel has x-men, avengers, spider-man and deadpool and all of them have different powers and abilities and personalities ranging from bloodthirsty mercenaries to charismatic scientist and space gods. Most of DC Heroes are bulletproof gods who can fly and punch a planet in half and only their banal weaknesses ( yellow color, fire , kryptonite, getting tied up by a man,weaknes to all natural and unprocessed materials, over reliance on water) is what sets them apart/

I think you get my point...I stopped being invested in ANY comic universe because every time I get attached to a character, both companies decide to kill 'em off for several years, sometimes permanently, rather than doing something much more sensible like having them just go off, retire for a bit, or do anything other than slamming the door shut on other creators to use unless they pull the eye-rollingly tired "just bring 'em back from the dead" trope that has made all death meaningless in comics (except for all the heroes I apparently like, who mostly all still remain dead...)