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As for the whole vexxed 'auto' issue? well I believe you shouldn't get a car licence unless you can drive with a stick. I feel the same with bikes. Once you know how to use gears though I see no reason why you should be forced to if you choose not to.

Why? Should I also know how to use a spark advance and manual choke? Perhaps everyone should get an old boat of a car without airbags and seatbelts as their first car. Also kids today should really go learn how punch cards and vacuum tubes work before they are allowed to learn about computers.

Why? Should I also know how to use a spark advance and manual choke? Perhaps everyone should get an old boat of a car without airbags and seatbelts as their first car. Also kids today should really go learn how punch cards and vacuum tubes work before they are allowed to learn about computers.

Didn't expect everyone to agree but my own belief is that learning to use a vehicle with gears teaches you a whole lot more about the physics of how it works and behaves. Drivers nowadays are hopelessly de skilled and 'Driving' is almost universally seen as something that can be combined with other activities, talking on the phone, eating,applying make-up, updating your facebook page etc. Many people only thing a car has three controls. Stop. Go. And Steer. Despite the fact that vehicles have become infinitely better over the years and continue to improve accident statistics seem to have plateaud. Why? Because people can't drive because they don't understand how a vehicle behaves so they abuse the laws of physics. The results are predictable. See the 'Bad Crash' thread for a prime example of this mentality.

Didn't expect everyone to agree but my own belief is that learning to use a vehicle with gears teaches you a whole lot more about the physics of how it works and behaves. Drivers nowadays are hopelessly de skilled and 'Driving' is almost universally seen as something that can be combined with other activities, talking on the phone, eating,applying make-up, updating your facebook page etc. Many people only thing a car has three controls. Stop. Go. And Steer. Despite the fact that vehicles have become infinitely better over the years and continue to improve accident statistics seem to have plateaud. Why? Because people can't drive because they don't understand how a vehicle behaves so they abuse the laws of physics. The results are predictable. See the 'Bad Crash' thread for a prime example of this mentality.

Pete

The double edged sword is that although things are being made safer and easier we are to a degree getting dummied down by our reliance on them. For example: How many don't know how to spell or speak well, due in part to the fact that they rely on spell and grammer checking applications too heavily? Spell checking undeniably is a good thing however it is even better when the writer has a decent understanding of how to spell and use the words that will best convey their thoughts.

Will the day come when most of us will not know how to chew our own food? ;>

Not only did I teach my (now adult) children to drive a car with a manual transmission, all of their first cars were manual shift. In a pinch, they would be able to drive pretty much anything that is street legal.

Learning to ride / drive a manual teaches coordination - clutch, shift, throttle and steering. Anyone who can't handle that in a cage probably shouldn't be on a motorcycle, except as a passenger.

Drivers nowadays are hopelessly de skilled and 'Driving' is almost universally seen as something that can be combined with other activities, talking on the phone, eating,applying make-up, updating your facebook page etc. Many people only thing a car has three controls. Stop. Go. And Steer. Despite the fact that vehicles have become infinitely better over the years and continue to improve accident statistics seem to have plateaud. Why? Because people can't drive because they don't understand how a vehicle behaves so they abuse the laws of physics.

I hear the attention argument brought up in the manual vs auto debate all the time, but I think most people get it wrong. Driving an automatic doesn't make people drooling morons behind the wheel, drooling morons simply choose automatics. Would forcing them to drive stick make things better? Personally I don't think so. I think they would still text, drink starbucks, update their facebook WHILE shifting. Really the root cause is that there are too many people on the road who just suck at driving and either need more training or the removal of their licenses.

To look at it another way, attentive drivers should be better with an automatic. I consider myself a very attentive driver. If someone calls me I refuse to answer my phone until I've reached my destination or I've safetly pulled off the road. I personally think that driving stick would actually hurt my driving ability because shifting takes away from me paying attention to the road. Driving a stick is a distraction.

Now some reports may say "driving manual is safer than automatic". But like most studies/news reports they are usually confusing correlation and causation. Manual drivers are probably safer because of the type of people who by manuals are different than the typical automatic driver. Essentially all the pete roper's in the world skew the statistics in favour of manual shifting.

But really, isn't knowing the implementation details of a manual transmission entirely irrelevant when driving a vehicle that doesn't have "gears" in the traditional sense of the word? Every vehicle I own right now is driven by a CVT. The feeling of shifting gears is an foreign sensation to me now. The gearbox is simply a work-around for the fact that internal combustion engines physics aren't well suited to driving a vehicle. They have a narrow power band, they can't start themselves up from 0 rpm, and they stall when they drop bellow a certain RPM limit. It's because of these reasons that the gearbox/clutch were invented. If we end up driving vehicles with cvts or in-wheel motors then what's the point of forcing everyone to learn about outdate tech? This is why I draw the comparison of shifting to spark advance. The arugments that driving stick is good would imply that driving with manual spark advance is better. But does distracting the driver in any way make sense?

I personally have found that I have more brain cycles available to analyze what is happening ahead and behind me especially when passing or other busy situations.
I don't believe I will ever go back to a manual shift. Manual shifting in a car is so automatic (pun intended) that I don't have to think about it. It isn't true for me on motorcycles. Perhaps if I rode 30k + miles every year on a bike it might be different.

aprilia mana 850

Hey guys yes it me Tommy , I kinda thought this sit where a bunch of bullies So I closed it and Just re opened it ! And now see most of you where joking , and I missed judged you all to fast. !so with that being said. I'd like back in the gang lol