After finally doing some semi decent albeit easy running for the last several weeks. Going to take a shot at my first tempo run in months. Was looking for some ideas though. Was thinking about going 4 miles warmup followed by 4 miles at GHMP so around 6:25 to 6:30 and then 2 miles of cooldown similar to the Pfitz style tempos, but am open to suggestions.

hillcruiser's approach sounds more nuanced than mine, but FWIW, I do almost exactly what you describe for tempos. I usually want the overall run to end up at 10-12 miles, though, so as the tempo segment gets longer as I get further into training, it eats some of the warmup/cooldown, to the point where my peak tempo might be 2 warmup, 7 tempo @ ~HMP, 2 cooldown.

@RunMapleRun, thank you for the vote of confidence. Assuming I make it through the 18/70 plan uninjured and there is no heat or headwind, I think my chances are good.

@HouTexRnr, I second what's been said already. With a 1:22 half and successful completion of 18/70, I think you could go sub 2:55 or better if conditions are good. That said, first marathons are always a gamble as you never know how you will react to the last miles.

@All, I have no problem with any additional tabs. I am 35, which I think means for age grading my time is just my time. With eight or so of us running Boston, we should try to meet up at some point, even if it is just in the starting corral.

Workouts don't make you faster or stronger. Recovering from workouts makes you faster and stronger.

I am not knowledgeable at all when it comes to computers. I can see the chart on 3:20 thread fine.

Yeah, their chart is different - it's just a static HTML table... I will take a look at XP and Firefox issue. Thanks. Oh, btw, if you have Chrome browser on your computer, can you check if you can see the table in the Chrome browser?

First real attempt at sub 3 will be next weekend at the Mississippi Blues Marathon 1/11. This will be my 5th marathon,. First was in 10/11 3:46:04, 3/12 3:15:25, 2/13 3:05:40 (BQ), 8/13 3:42:10 (this was at IronMan Louisville in 90+ degree heat, so I'm pretty proud of this one). Anyway, last February there was a way outside shot of me going Sub 3, but the 10 mph headwind for 11 miles put an end to that outside shot. My goal was to BQ which I did, and I wasn't going to blow myself up to chase the Sub 3. This time, its my singular goal, and I think with my base from triathlon training this year, and bumping my mileage up to 70-80 mpw since October I have a pretty good chance, although this course is kinda hilly. Hopefully the weather will cooperate. Right now in taper mode, and feeling antsy.

Cbf - You can actually export the chart as an image which might embed nicer. The problem is it's a static size image exactly the size of the chart in the doc.

Frank - that is the thing I would like to avoid - that will be a static image without different tabs, right? And every time I would do export and then upload the image. Right now I do a modification to a Google doc and then saying "Publish". And I have a nice chart with tabs. The issue euler314 is having is solved by using Chrome browser, I believe. Firefox has some security rules - that's why the table doesn't show up.

Cbf - You can actually export the chart as an image which might embed nicer. The problem is it's a static size image exactly the size of the chart in the doc.

Frank - that is the thing I would like to avoid - that will be a static image without different tabs, right? And every time I would do export and then upload the image. Right now I do a modification to a Google doc and then saying "Publish". And I have a nice chart with tabs. The issue euler314 is having is solved by using Chrome browser, I believe. Firefox has some security rules - that's why the table doesn't show up.

I actually hadn't noticed the tabs. That's pretty cool. Are you calculating the age grades or do you just want us to tell you what ours are?

Cbf - You can actually export the chart as an image which might embed nicer. The problem is it's a static size image exactly the size of the chart in the doc.

Frank - that is the thing I would like to avoid - that will be a static image without different tabs, right? And every time I would do export and then upload the image. Right now I do a modification to a Google doc and then saying "Publish". And I have a nice chart with tabs. The issue euler314 is having is solved by using Chrome browser, I believe. Firefox has some security rules - that's why the table doesn't show up.

I actually hadn't noticed the tabs. That's pretty cool. Are you calculating the age grades or do you just want us to tell you what ours are?

Cbf - You can actually export the chart as an image which might embed nicer. The problem is it's a static size image exactly the size of the chart in the doc.

Frank - that is the thing I would like to avoid - that will be a static image without different tabs, right? And every time I would do export and then upload the image. Right now I do a modification to a Google doc and then saying "Publish". And I have a nice chart with tabs. The issue euler314 is having is solved by using Chrome browser, I believe. Firefox has some security rules - that's why the table doesn't show up.

I actually hadn't noticed the tabs. That's pretty cool. Are you calculating the age grades or do you just want us to tell you what ours are?

Can you please put me down for the Manhattan Half on 1/26 goal time of 1:19 but it really depends on weather since the last 2 years have been very cold and/or snowing, as you can see in my pic from the 2011 race. Also doing the NYC Half on 3/16. Not sure about goal time yet, hoping to go for sub 1:19 since it's a faster course and there's a better chance for good weather. It's also a good fitness check for Boston.

Btw I am 28 if you want it for the age graded table. Not that it will change anything haha, still can't compete with you older guys.

I'll definitely be up for a beer or three at some point marathon weekend. My usual preference is to go from finish line directly to bar, but I could probably make sat pm work if something was going on.

I am in the fourth year of my second running life. Like many, I was fairly competitive in high school and college with decent PRs. After taking some time off (20 years) and gaining over 100 pounds (capped out at almost 260), I decided 4 years ago to get back into running ( I am now 40 y.o.). I've done 8 marathons with a pr just under 3:30 in March 2013 (this was after consecutive 50K races the prior two weekends) . I have followed no real training plans. I normally do 8 to 12 easy miles (8 to 8:15 pace) on Saturdays followed by long runs on Sunday (2 to 5 hours depending if I am on the roads or trails). I mix up weekdays with tempos and intervals or slow recovery runs. Last year I focused mainly on ultras and did 6 50K's (PR 5:30) and one 50 miler (just missed sub 10 hours).

I have no idea if I have a shot at sub 3-- I like eating and drinking too much to lose the final 30 that I think it will take, but hell I think I'm a pretty decent clydesdale and will give it a go. I've got half the first week in February. If I can go 1:25, I'll feel pretty good about my chances.

Hi guys. I've never joined a training thread, but I'll see if this thread can help keep me motivated. I'm 44, and will be 45 by the time the snow melts and the racing season starts later this year. Here's a kind of long intro.

I generally run a lot (except in the past year!), but I generally haven't had a formal training plan, though there are training principals that I know work for me. My informal, non-optimal way of getting faster (at least in the past decade) has generally been to pick up the mileage/be more consistent to get a better base, then start racing when I think I'm at the point where I won't embarrass myself (this sometimes means I have gone years between racing). Often, I don't do a race until July, and then I might get really fit as I do a popular weekly trail race series in the fall. By the time that's finishing up, it's cross country ski season, and the fitness kind of goes to waste. I've not been successful in running races that take longer than about 1:45, probably due to non-optimal training and fueling techniques, and my best distance is more like 10K. My long running races include running a ~22.5 mile mountain race 6 or 7 times, and running one marathon in 2012 (2:54:XX). In the mountain race, I have always had severe leg cramping each race starting about halfway through the race, and in my only marathon, I started cramping about 18 miles in.

I hurt my right knee a year and a half ago during a fast downhill on a training run, and made it a lot worse in May 2013 (during a pounding run with 4 dogs on leash), so I have not run much (for me) since May 2013. Last year, I managed only one race all year, a 12K with a bad knee in 44:18, about a minute slower than the year before. I DNSed what would have been my second marathon attempt.

Though I'm really an outdoors guy, I bought a treadmill about a couple of weeks ago to finally give me an opportunity once in a while to run faster than the 10:00-17:00 pace I usually end up doing on snow in the winter with my 14 year old dog. (I have actually let her drag down my summer training paces too - too hard to leave her behind.) I was 171 lbs a couple of weeks ago (at 5'9.5", the BMI was just 0.1 short of the overweight range ), my all time high, and in the worse shape of my life. The last several months I was also having unexplained chest pain, though doctors eliminated heart problems as the cause. I think my body was just not used to being out of shape.

I'll likely sign up for the Mayor's Marathon (Anchorage) again, and hopefully make it to the starting line this year on June 21. My goal is to PR, preferably by a lot. It will be one of the first races of the season for me, so I'll have to get in some good specific training sessions. I see myself as just dabbling in the marathon, so if I get fit, I'll have to go through the running calendar and find more interesting trail, mountain races, or road races before my favorite fall race series. A good fall target will be the Lost Lake Run (15.75 mi. trail), assuming I get into the popular race. I also compete in orienteering, though fitness isn't the limiting factor in my performances there.

My last several weeks of training mileage have been 18, 43, and 73, with an additional 35 miles or so per week of skiing. I'm down 5 lbs to 166 lbs, which is still far from race weight (about 153 has been the lowest in the last couple of years when I was in still able to get into sub-16 5K shape, about 140 lbs in PR shape). Chest pain is gone. I'm just doing low aerobic effort running for now, since I'm so out of shape and gains are easy at this point. First treadmill run was 12/18/2013: 7 miles at 8:52 pace/133 ave HR. Last night 10 miles, 8:11 pace/132 ave HR (73% of max). The runs not on the treadmill for now are very easy efforts, with a HR less than about 65% of my max of 181.

I am not knowledgeable at all when it comes to computers. I can see the chart on 3:20 thread fine.

Yeah, their chart is different - it's just a static HTML table... I will take a look at XP and Firefox issue. Thanks. Oh, btw, if you have Chrome browser on your computer, can you check if you can see the table in the Chrome browser?

Welcome FatGuy. I'm also doing DC R&R in March. It will be my third marathon. Like others have said, 28 mins is lot to take off your PR and a 1:25 HM is borderline. I took 21 mins off from marathons 1 and 2. I highly reco an 18 miler with 14-15 at MP about a month out during a heavy training week as a decent test. If that goes well you have a shot but not a guarantee. I ran an 18 with 14 @ 6:40 last cycle and still missed sub 3 by 1 minute. Regardless, I will be there with a 2:59 pace band if you want someone to run with.

Welcome Lightning. Looks like you already have sub 3 conquered and just need some consistency to do it again. That can be hard with so many other interests. Unexplained chest pain could be pneumonia. That's what mine was back in September.

I am not knowledgeable at all when it comes to computers. I can see the chart on 3:20 thread fine.

Yeah, their chart is different - it's just a static HTML table... I will take a look at XP and Firefox issue. Thanks. Oh, btw, if you have Chrome browser on your computer, can you check if you can see the table in the Chrome browser?