ok, i just have a few questions for those opposing this bill. Before i go any further, i should say that i would call myself undecided on this issue. There is very little reliable information on this topic, and even if it were, it is not a simple issue.

First of all, have any of you criticizing the provisions of this bill actually read through it? Or are you just taking fox new's word for what is in it(insert any pundit here, on any network, they are really all the same, i just personally dislike fox "news"). I know I haven't, that crap is long. But my question is, do you actually know what is in the bill, or do you just object because someone told you it is socialist? Or do you support it simply because someone told you it is good? There is some data suggesting that many opponents actually agree with many of the ideas, clause, whatever they are called, if they are presented out of context. So, if you haven't, maybe go read the bill before you decide it is just Obama trying to destroy America.

Secondly, to those objecting on the grounds that tax increases will mean that you are paying for other people's bill, and that people object to having to help each other. Why do you object to paying for someones doctor, but you don't object to paying taxes for fire departments, emt services, and police departments. How is health care any different? Why do you object to giving up your money to save someones life from fire, or assault, but not cancer? If you object to your money being used to help others, you should object to taxes completely, and governments entirely. That is the entire idea. We all work together for mutual benefit. If you don't like that, go live as a hermit in the middle of nowhere, then you wont have to help anyone.

That's it for my questions, but I do want to say one thing about the idea that socialized health care would lead to longer waits for treatment. What the heck country are you living in? Most of us are spending more time waiting to be treated that being treated as it is. A good friend of mine had to wait months (more than six, i cant remember exactly how long) to get crucial dental work done, because of insurgence related hang ups. Even if Obama's idea is crappy as hell (which i think is still debatable) I fail to see how it could be any worse than what we have, unless there is some clause to raze every hospital and doctor's office to the ground. Heck, even that might be an improvement.

One last thing, on a very personal note. To the guy who mentioned the recent Massachusetts senatorial election, not all of us are proud of the fact that we betrayed Edward Kennedy, a man who spent his whole life fighting for us, buy handing his seat over to an enemy of his life's work, affordable health care for all American families. The man was not even cold before we stabbed him in the back. If some people consider that admirable, so be it, and congratulations on your success. But I would like to make it clear that this is not the universal Massachusetts feeling, some of us do realize how much we may have just screwed this country up.

I apologize for the wall'o text post, and to any who read it all the way through, I thank you for your patience.

@PieProphet Nope, I haven't read over the bill. That shit is to long, and I'm a computer scientist not a political scientist. I actually do hate the media in general, but Glenn Beck is the only show I watch of Fox News. The reason why Glenn Beck kicks ass is because he's not like typical media talking out of his ass, he is supporting his arguments with evidence of pass historical events. He also teaches about the founding fathers, and how we've lost track.

How have we lost track you may ask? Here is a good paraphrase from Benjamin Franklin "It seems that the more you help someone, the more lazy they get. But the more you guide them in the right direction the harder they try, and more successful they become." That is not a direct quote, but was basically what the quote was. Anyway, if any politician today were to say that, you know that they would get slammed for heresy.

I quote you asking...

But my question is, do you actually know what is in the bill, or do you just object because someone told you it is socialist?

... but then you say

That's it for my questions, but I do want to say one thing about the idea that socialized health care would lead to longer waits for treatment

If it is a socialized health care, then it is socialist, yes communistic. The following quote from me is not from fox, but my logical deductions of healthcare reform

If we no longer pick our Doctor, the value of the Doctor has dropped, therefore the pay will drop. We all know that big government yields two types fascism and communism. A communist system, one of the flaws of it is that people stop trying harder, because there is no incentive to work harder, if all Doctors will be paid equally

You were also saying something about why you want to pay taxes for some things and not Health care. Well it is not only fire departments, police stations and other local facilities, but we're also paying welfare for people who are to lazy to get a job. Those same people on welfare are out using that tax money to buy booze and drugs. And also let me add... Say I earned a pay check of $200 and a fellow employee is in a bind, and he needs to borrow $100. Let the $100 I paid him represent the taxes I've already paid. So I Personally feel up to this point that I've paid this guy a fair share, he should be good. Now let's say this health care tax is another $50. Now I'm paying my fellow comrad $150 and I've got $50 left over for me to pay car insurance, etc..

This health care bill will give government more power, this is undoubtful. I think the boiling question comes down to do you believe in big government?? Have you ever heard of big brother? or read the book 1984 by any chance?

lol I bet you don't even know who glenn beck is and even if you do, you've obviously never watched his show. It's crawling with historical evidence, and I'm already assuming since your from california you don't have an IQ.

xfelix wrote:lol I bet you don't even know who glenn beck is and even if you do, you've obviously never watched his show. It's crawling with historical evidence, and I'm already assuming since your from california you don't have an IQ.

First of all, it's spelled "you're".

Next, it is impossible to NOT have an IQ (assuming you have a brain). I think you were referring to having a low IQ, despite the fact that you can't determine the IQ of an individual by the state he/she was from.

Please, point me towards some videos of Glenn Beck's genius (by the way: everyone in the US knows about faux news).

First of all, I contracted the two words you and have to make you've. If you had a proper IQ, then I'm guessing you would know how to use an apostrophe. you are obviously never watched his show doesn't even make sense sanddouch,

Second of all, All you gotta do is watch Fox news at 5 central on the week days. From the complete idiocy of you last post I'm guessing it's about that time again.

xfelix wrote:First of all, I contracted the two words you and have to make you've. If you had a proper IQ, then I'm guessing you would know how to use an apostrophe. you are obviously never watched his show doesn't even make sense sanddouch,

Second of all, All you gotta do is watch Fox news at 5 central on the week days. From the complete idiocy of you last post I'm guessing it's about that time again.

Please, don't be dyslexic. I said "You're", not "You've". Learn to read.

lol... you don't even know what dyslexic is. That is when you mix up letters such as d and b, because you see them backwards.

Second of all, you began by quoting me from

lol I bet you don't even know who glenn beck is and even if you do, you've obviously never watched his show. It's crawling with historical evidence, and I'm already assuming since your from california you don't have an IQ.

I never said "You're", I said "You've". Where are you pulling up the word "You're" in that previous post is my question. You're bad at trolling.

lol I bet you don't even know who glenn beck is and even if you do, you've obviously never watched his show. It's crawling with historical evidence, and I'm already assuming since your from california you don't have an IQ.

Looking back, I have no idea what I was talking about.

Owait...

Also: Dyslexia isn't just letters being scrambled. I once knew a dyslexic person who couldn't tell the difference between 'when' and 'hen'.

dam sanddbox, you're grammar is so flawless in every single thread, that you have ever posted on this forum. Even when you're sitting down writing a program sometimes it can be a simple mistake, or subtle detail glanced over. You know what you do you look back, you fix it, then it works. I'm tired of you going in every thread that I post in and then you jump on my back about something, in this case a stupid grammar error. Talk about anal. On that note, I suggest that you give up on working on problems such as Health Care reforms and stalking every thread I post in, and get a life.