im not sure life is far different there than here yet i dont hear of these things except in really rare occasions , most criminals here think of the farms as a remote location, less likely to go there , i think they also look at us rural folks more likely to be armed and not worth the effort ,

realizing that drug induced invasions dont follow normal thinking patterns - most criminals would not attack an armed encampment - something to be said for an armed populace - of course it might present problems for a corrupt government .......not pointing fingers-just sayin ,

We farmers and rural folk are targets because it takes time to get response. Added to that is intimidation of farm labour to supply intel and not to say anything before and after the attack. Intimidation is a big factor in our rural labour. We also find that the brutality of attacks is very server. You are more likely to be murdered because to saw the criminals. Often brutality is used to extract info from the victims or just because you caught them in the act. Murder is not an issue for the criminals. There is no morality or compassion. You have something I don't, therefore I will take it regardless of the cost.

In this attack the one perpetrator that was caught was a juvenile of 14. A case of attempted murder has been laid against him. He will be before the magistrate on Tuesday.

Its the exact reverse here the trees like to hide in the forest.Most crime is inner city "gremlins" because they know that the populace are less likely to be armed. Rural areas are the opposite there's a rifle, a pistol, a shotgun & more behind every doorpost in their mind.

Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)

Unfortunately, unconfirmed reports say it was the farmer's own hand gun, found under the bed, that was used.

Part of our license conditions are that "when a firearm is not under the direct personal and physical control of a holder of a licence, permit or authorization to possess the firearm, the firearm and its ammunition must be stored in a safe or strongroom that conforms to ....".

a) be manufactured from steel of at least 2 mm thickb) be capable of enclosing or covering the firearm concerned wholly c) have an effective integral locking mechanism

d) have a hinge mechanism for the cover or lid thereof which shall ensure that when the locking pin thereof is removed, the cover or lid shall not be capable of being opened or removed e) have a facility with the aid or use of which the lock-away safe, apparatus, device or instrument may be securely affixed to another structure such as a wall or a floor, or the body of a vehicle f) in the case of a lock-away safe used as contemplated in sub-regulation (5) if such safe can only be locked or opened with two or more keys that have to be used jointly.

Last Fall, we had a situation in Ottawa @ the War Memeorial & the Parliament buildings. Some a-hole gunned down two young reservists doing cenotaph duty, then ran to the Parliament Buildings(armed). He started shooting in there, as well. The Sgt @ Arms (an Ex R.C.M.P.) had to run to his office to retrieve his firearm (which was locked in a case). Then he had to enter another locked room, & unlock another storage case, to retrieve ammo.(All this while the guy was shooting inside the Parliament Buildings). When Sgt @ arms got there, the guy was cornered, but still fighting. He was finally dispatched by Sgt @ Arms (who I am told is now the Ambassador to Ireland?). Anyway - now because of this - we no longer have the citizens free access to the Parliament buildings we always had..now its full security etc. Piss me off!

DairyFarmer, if I were in your situation there, I think I would carry a side arm all the time. Or, as you intimate it should have been, have it securely locked away. Or is carrying all the time unlawful?

Here in the UK, we are thankfully pretty low down in the stats where criminal shootings are concerned. We are also known for our police not routinely carrying firearms. In fact only a small percentage of police are authorized to carry them anyway. Except at airports and other terrorist targets where you do see them. But actually, there are police vehicles, otherwise carrying out normal duties crewed by authorized officers. These vehicles will have safes in the back, so that if they have to go to an incident where firearms are suspected, they can arm themselves before arriving.

Carry is legal and I have my 9 iron with me at all times. Can't remember the last time it saw the inside of a safe. I could not think of the rational of leaving my firearm unprotected and with in reach of anyone, including minors. It just fuels the anti-gun maniacs. Some shops and banks have no firearm signs on their doors, I ignore them. If they get uptight I just take my business elsewhere.

I lived in the UK for 7 years. The Oval in London. I was there when that guy got shot on the Underground and they tried to blame it on the police. From what I have seen it takes them a good few minutes to get the firearm out, set up a bullet trap, load the firearm and then proceed. This does not include the time it takes to get authorization from the boss. Guess he also needs to fill in some forms, in triplicate, before giving the go ahead.

The decision whether police carry or not depends on the mind-set of the criminals. If they do not value life then obviously the police need to carry. I am all for the less than lethal options too. Many times a Tazer is more of a deterrent than a firearm. The criminal knows that you are not going to shoot him if he suddenly runs. But he knows that you will most likely zap him even if he lifts an eyebrow.

I am also of the opinion that anyone that looks suspicious can and should be stopped and questioned. I think that if the person is a law abiding person, interaction with the police goes a long way towards faith in the law. There is a segment of the population that are very anti it. Do they have something to hide? I bet these people don't complain when stopped in a road block. rather stop 100 people and cat6ch one criminal than be p.c. and let him slip through.

DF: That is a slippery slope. What constitutes a person "looking suspicious". We just went thru that here. Cops were stopping people at random & questioning. If they took offence - they were arrested. Since it was a violation of rights - it has been (supposedly) curtailed. Had an instance here last fall. Young fella was @ Mansion House where he met up with 2 friends.(Rhino has been to Mansion House). He consumed 2 beers, & left on foot thru the downtown core to go to Gord's Place. While walking thru the empty Market Square female cop drove by & eyed him up. She wheeled around and ordered him to stop, whereby she began the "questions" He informed her he had done nothing & found her line of questioning offensive - so he would be on his way. She tackled him from behind-called for back-up, & they beat he!! out of him - before running him in. He sued the Niagara Regional Police Farce, who had all these stories of his resistance..but their own video survelliance cameras showed different.We don't hear anything about this now -as its being dealt with "under wraps". Like I say - slippery-slope

Its all in the training and accountability. There are those that will abuse their powers. We have traffic police that are known to pull drivers up at night and arrest them for no reason or beat them up. There have been cases where the drivers have felt unsure and instead of stopping, have driven to the nearest police station, only to be physically assaulted in the police station in front of other police officers. They don't care that they are being filmed.

The rural/farming places I have visited in the States, specifically in Colorado, would have less to fear from bad guys then the bad guys disappearing never to be seen. Then again there are always stupid bad guys.

I know the laws here in the States are much different but, when you see a F150 with a rifle hanging in the window rack you tend to keep your distance. If you see a rodeo sticker on the truck that is another sign that you should keep your distance.

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