'02cca

I've just come back from Road America's Brian Redmon Challenge...vintage racing. It was great fun with the Ford GT's the featured marque. I drove up in my 02 and a friend in a 356 Porsche.

The 356 Porsche people had their own corral, a mini-event and get together. They were very organized with a hierarchy and an agenda. In a larger sense, they were acting as the keepers of the flame. It was very impressive.

At Road America, I only saw three other 02's and one of them was racing. This was disheartening as I know BMW built a heck of a lot more 02's than Porsche did 356's and the 356 was every bit as important to Porsche as the 02 was to BMW. As we speak there are '02's rusting away, going to the junk heap. The registry is getting smaller all of the time.

Let me cut to the chase.

It's time we had a subset of BMWCCA called tentatively '02CCA or somesuch. We'd have our own events, ie; concours, tours, rallye's, dinners, etc. I know that other '02 people are more organized in other parts of the country than they are here in the upper midwest. Maybe you all might weigh in on this issue. I would prefer that we have some BMW sponsorship, however tentative.

By better managing the '02 and her legacy, we might also create more interest in this wonderful machine...thus kicking up her price at auction, a nice benefit.

I've just come back from Road America's Brian Redmon Challenge...vintage racing. It was great fun with the Ford GT's the featured marque. I drove up in my 02 and a friend in a 356 Porsche.

The 356 Porsche people had their own corral, a mini-event and get together. They were very organized with a hierarchy and an agenda. In a larger sense, they were acting as the keepers of the flame. It was very impressive.

At Road America, I only saw three other 02's and one of them was racing. This was disheartening as I know BMW built a heck of a lot more 02's than Porsche did 356's and the 356 was every bit as important to Porsche as the 02 was to BMW. As we speak there are '02's rusting away, going to the junk heap. The registry is getting smaller all of the time.

Let me cut to the chase.

It's time we had a subset of BMWCCA called tentatively '02CCA or somesuch. We'd have our own events, ie; concours, tours, rallye's, dinners, etc. I know that other '02 people are more organized in other parts of the country than they are here in the upper midwest. Maybe you all might weigh in on this issue. I would prefer that we have some BMW sponsorship, however tentative.

By better managing the '02 and her legacy, we might also create more interest in this wonderful machine...thus kicking up her price at auction, a nice benefit.

Thoughts?

Well I was at the Pittsburgh Vintage Grand Prix and the 02s came out in force!!! It was the most unbelievable BMW event I have ever been to! It was just fantastic!!!! Now BMW was the featured marque, so that helped, but BMW CCA put all the other clubs and marques to shame. We had a whole hill covered in BMWs, lots of 2002s, even three tourings!!! Lots of E30s, some e28s, and lots of others and then even some Alpinas and other rare euros, like an E30 touring. There were even a few pre-war and 50s BMWs!!

It was a great event and the people of the Allegheny Chapter really made thanks to all their hard work. We even hung out at the HofbrÃƒÆ’Ã†â€™Ãƒâ€ Ã¢â‚¬â„¢ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â¤uhaus in Pittsburgh on Saturday night!

One the highlights was watching the CSL and 2002 race cars tear up the track! They sounded and looked great. They raced in their own group. There was even a BMW 700 racer in another race group.

It was great to be there with everyone and the different variety of cars. I think it would be a shame if the 02 crowd split off from the greater club. We are all one big family here and the diversity of interest in different BMWs is what makes it great!

Yes, there was a split that siphoned off a lot of eastern BMWs to Pittsburgh instead of Road America. That conflict of events was very unfortunate and I hope the organizers can avoid it in the future (but I doubt either one cares).

Face it: there probably will not be a 2002 group at every event where you want it, but you can do something to at least informally organize them. Badger Bimmers hosts the 'Bimmer Bivouac' on the east side of the track at Pit Entrance. I make it a habit to at least check in there to see if any interesting BMWs or friends have shown up. You are welcome to make that your base of operations and I think you should. I found only one other E28 last weekend, but it turns out we know one another and I got my young neophyte visitor a ride around the track with him. Neither of us felt shortchanged because we've both been to 5er Fest, an annual event dedicated to 5 Series cars.

I've owned a couple of 2002s. I no longer do (except parts cars), but I do enjoy hanging around with owners of other old BMWs. I don't think you need to be exclusive about it.

That said, there are dedicated 2002 gatherings. Several every year, in fact. At least one young Badger owner was very excited to go to her first one earlier this summer. Were you there?

I'm Windy City, so I was not in the loop. I should probably monitor you guys a bit more. I might add, I'm most interested in staying within the fold of BMWCCA with this. Just more 02 events in our region.

Just an FYI the Pittsburgh Vintage Grand Prix was/is considered a regional event. It was advertised on the event calandar in the back of Roundel. I try to make a habit of checking that every month to see what is there!

Also my local chapter does do a one or two vintage events every year. Usually it is a scenic tour and is limited to pre-83 BMWs. So check your local chapter or better yet organize one for your local chapter!!!! If you want something from the club what better way to make it happen then to spear head it!

Problem is, my work schedule throws me out of the loop from September to November. That's just the nature of the beast. I'm going to miss the Windy City Vintage Fest that ZF is hosting in Sept, which pains me mightily.

The Brian Redmon Vintage racing is such a big deal that it should probably be a regional event with all state BMW Clubs boarding Wisconsin involved and Badger Bimmers hosting.

Problem is, my work schedule throws me out of the loop from September to November. That's just the nature of the beast. I'm going to miss the Windy City Vintage Fest that ZF is hosting in Sept, which pains me mightily.

The Brian Redmon Vintage racing is such a big deal that it should probably be a regional event with all state BMW Clubs boarding Wisconsin involved and Badger Bimmers hosting.

Well, there are three vintage events at RA every year. The Kohler International Challenge is the middle one. The Elkhart Lake Vintage Festival (ELVF) is last in August or September. Badger Bimmers does 'host' at the KIC - consisting mainly of opening up the shed we maintain there and providing tables, chairs, and a grille for charring assorted pieces of meat. One gentleman bought the brats this year. You would need to get the BB board to spring for more, but they might be convinced, as they have in the past, for the Road America 500.

The biggest bang for the buck is to get sponsorships for things. The regional dealerships don't mind too much and some aftermarket suppliers like tire companies or performance tuners might join in. Unfortunately, the economic climate isn't great for that right now AND we have an upcoming Oktoberfest in 2010 that will likely burn up a lot of the goodwill we've built up when we pitch sponsorships for that. Finally, as I learned way back when I first joined this club in 1985 with a '74 2002, BMW isn't much interested in supporting 'throwbacks' like you and me because we don't really generate much revenue for them with 20- to 40-year-old cars.

The notion of a sub-sect focusing on 2002s is not out of the question. The Club does have an interesting array of Special Interest Groups. A separate BMW club is probably counterproductive because BMW AG is emphatic in their demand for one "umbrella" club on each continent: Hence BMW CCA.

But several years ago the membership voted for a rules change that would allow for chapters based on other criteria than geographical locations. It seems to me, then, that it might be possible for X number of 2002 fanatics to form a chapter based on their mutual passion, not on their zip codes. The organization of a chapter of any sort has to follow standard policies and procedures, but it should be possible if enough people wanted to do it.

Satch Carlson

"The first failure of communication is the belief that any is taking place."

The notion of a sub-sect focusing on 2002s is not out of the question. The Club does have an interesting array of Special Interest Groups. A separate BMW club is probably counterproductive because BMW AG is emphatic in their demand for one "umbrella" club on each continent: Hence BMW CCA.

But several years ago the membership voted for a rules change that would allow for chapters based on other criteria than geographical locations. It seems to me, then, that it might be possible for X number of 2002 fanatics to form a chapter based on their mutual passion, not on their zip codes. The organization of a chapter of any sort has to follow standard policies and procedures, but it should be possible if enough people wanted to do it.

Oh, I think BMW GmbH is interested in 02's and everything else BMW. It's about branding and they know from branding. A quick tour around BMW Welt/Museum is enough to convince. Besides, my 02 is not my only BMW. Repeat business and brand loyalty is a pillar of their sales effort.

The notion of a sub-sect focusing on 2002s is not out of the question. The Club does have an interesting array of Special Interest Groups. A separate BMW club is probably counterproductive because BMW AG is emphatic in their demand for one "umbrella" club on each continent: Hence BMW CCA.

But several years ago the membership voted for a rules change that would allow for chapters based on other criteria than geographical locations. It seems to me, then, that it might be possible for X number of 2002 fanatics to form a chapter based on their mutual passion, not on their zip codes. The organization of a chapter of any sort has to follow standard policies and procedures, but it should be possible if enough people wanted to do it.

Agreed. Without BMWCCA's sanction, any '02CCA's bona fides would be weak, at best. Where to start? Would you have to apply to BMWCCA first? Or do you get a bunch of prospective members together and say we want our own special interest group. Chicken first? Or the egg?

Agreed. Without BMWCCA's sanction, any '02CCA's bona fides would be weak, at best. Where to start? Would you have to apply to BMWCCA first? Or do you get a bunch of prospective members together and say we want our own special interest group. Chicken first? Or the egg?

Form the group. Then ask for inclusion. FWIW, the cyber-group of which I am a member is very informal. No membership requirements of any kind; no dues; no monthly meetings or newsletters; just join up online and don't be too annoying. Nonetheless, it is a surprisingly cohesive group that manages to come together physically for E28 Wrenchfests (Your car's broke? Buy pizza & beer and ask everybody who actually knows how to fix it to come over.), informal get-togethers at members' homes, and an annual 5er Fest as the general equivalent of O'Fest. Their 'bona fide' comes from the fact that it is the most complete and accessible resource for E28 information anywhere. It's nice that 'CCA recognized it as a SIG, but not necessary to its existence. Honestly, it had neither BMW AG nor 'CCA sanctions and went its anarchistic way and it will continue to do so. But that's just one experience. You need to make your own.

Form the group. Then ask for inclusion. FWIW, the cyber-group of which I am a member is very informal. No membership requirements of any kind; no dues; no monthly meetings or newsletters; just join up online and don't be too annoying. Nonetheless, it is a surprisingly cohesive group that manages to come together physically for E28 Wrenchfests (Your car's broke? Buy pizza & beer and ask everybody who actually knows how to fix it to come over.), informal get-togethers at members' homes, and an annual 5er Fest as the general equivalent of O'Fest. Their 'bona fide' comes from the fact that it is the most complete and accessible resource for E28 information anywhere. It's nice that 'CCA recognized it as a SIG, but not necessary to its existence. Honestly, it had neither BMW AG nor 'CCA sanctions and went its anarchistic way and it will continue to do so. But that's just one experience. You need to make your own.

Thanks for your help here. But you're in Wisconsin? It's a long drive from say, New York or California to talk about Fumfers.

What about events? Tours? Concours? TSD rallye's? Enamel grille badges for entering events? Logo'd clothing? There would have to be regional interest to propel this along. And there would have to be dues, however minimal, to run all this stuff. I'm thinking that this SIG could be fairly large at the end of the day.

In fact, I'd prefer that the experienced hands at BMWCCA start it from the top down, giving it structure before I go out there and make a hash out of it. The way I see this, there would be 02 events that would be 02 specific. Otherwise, we'd play with BMWCCA when the events were of interest to 02's. I don't see this as a zero sum game as BMWCCA would have me participating with my 'other' BMW's.

Thanks for your help here. But you're in Wisconsin? It's a long drive from say, New York or California to talk about Fumfers.

... and yet we have one honored fanatic who drives from Southern California to South Bend, Chattanooga, and Tupelo to do so. I've gone to South Bend and Chattanooga. It would amaze you to see this crowd of lunatics. I suspect we might be more fanatical (certainly more organized) than the 2002 folks I once knew.

Who needs those? Actually, we've had all but the grille badges at 5er Fests - unless you count 5er Fest window stickers in their place. Autocross, too. All-night drinking parties in the hotel garage with creeper races down the ramps. Fried bacon & eggs at 2:30 AM on the roof of the garage. Even a nice sit-down dinner or three. You know Roy Wicklund's Inka M2 featured in last month's ROUNDEL? Ask Roy. He's one of us ('88 M5).

Logo'd clothing?

I have a long sleeve MyE28.com shirt and a short sleeve MyE28.com shirt. I also have a MyE28.com baseball cap. We're not real big on golf shirts ...

There would have to be regional interest to propel this along. And there would have to be dues, however minimal, to run all this stuff. I'm thinking that this SIG could be fairly large at the end of the day.

In fact, I'd prefer that the experienced hands at BMWCCA start it from the top down, giving it structure before I go out there and make a hash out of it. The way I see this, there would be 02 events that would be 02 specific.

I do not see that happening. If you aren't willing to do the work, why should they? Find the biggest,most cohesive 2002 group you can and get them onboard. Don't expect us to do it for you.

... and yet we have one honored fanatic who drives from Southern California to South Bend, Chattanooga, and Tupelo to do so. I've gone to South Bend and Chattanooga. It would amaze you to see this crowd of lunatics. I suspect we might be more fanatical (certainly more organized) than the 2002 folks I once knew.

I told you about those.

Who needs those? Actually, we've had all but the grille badges at 5er Fests - unless you count 5er Fest window stickers in their place. Autocross, too. All-night drinking parties in the hotel garage with creeper races down the ramps. Fried bacon & eggs at 2:30 AM on the roof of the garage. Even a nice sit-down dinner or three. You know Roy Wicklund's Inka M2 featured in last month's ROUNDEL? Ask Roy. He's one of us ('88 M5).

I have a long sleeve MyE28.com shirt and a short sleeve MyE28.com shirt. I also have a MyE28.com baseball cap. We're not real big on golf shirts ...

I do not see that happening. If you aren't willing to do the work, why should they? Find the biggest,most cohesive 2002 group you can and get them onboard. Don't expect us to do it for you.

Yeah, yeah, I hear you. I'm wondering where I'm going to manufacture the time to do this. Because of my in and out business schedule, I'm barely a participant in BMWCCA, as it is.

Still...considering the '02 fanatics out there...perhaps someone who's retired and would like to volunteer their time? And the idea of a separate '02 SIG does make perfect sense. It would, immediately, become the biggest of all the SIG's. I just can't do it right now.

From experience, I can tell you that a chapter is the real "club." Or the SIG. Or any other group of like-minded yahoos who get together and do stuff.

For National to organize these congregations is like the faculty trying to drum up spirit at the high-school assembly: True esprit comes from those in the trenches. That's why in order to form a chapter, we want to see people getting together and DEMANDING recognition because they are a noisy, boisterous group of individuals who can support the requirements of a chapter: structure, publishing a newsletter, etc. It doesn't take much, but it does take something.

I think the SIGs have that "something" in abundance---and I believe it's all good. Consider an anonymous chapter of some 4,000 members. Why are they members? Because they send forty bucks a year to the BMW CCA, perhaps becaiuse they enjoy the magazine, perhaps because they participate in Anonymous Chapter's events. The chapter gets pushback money from CCA to support its activities, primarily its newsletter, plus huge discounts on insurance for its events---try putting on a driving school some weekend!---and so on.

Let's say there's a pocket of Z1 owners who joined BMW CCA because, of course, they are BMW fanatics. Now they are members of Anonymous Chapterby default because they live there. But if they really have more in common with Z1 fanatics elsewhere, wouldn't it make more sense to send them the money to put out their own newsletter, provide insurance for Z1-specific events, and so on? They would still be able to play with their non-Z1 friends, because they're CCA. In fact, they could pay a little extra to be members of the Z1 Chapter and the Anonymous Chapter (I am a member of three chapters at the moment).

Yes, there are probably logistical details to be worked out. But I believe the first SIG chapter will happen sooner than later.

Satch Carlson

"The first failure of communication is the belief that any is taking place."

Yes, I take your point. The local chapters are the key. Without them, it doesn't happen. Okay, let me take this a bit further:

The 02 owners, back in the day, were the guys that started BMWCCA. Since those days, BMW A.G. has necessarily made other models thus diffusing the 02 congregation. Currently, within BMWCCA there is no provision for 02 owners to get together for their own purposes, ie swap meets, concours, tours, time/speed rallye's etc. Considering the amount of 02 owners in extant, the sheer fanaticism of the following and the contribution to the marque that the 02 is...we deserve a SIG with local chapters all our own.

I reiterate that this should all be under the umbrella of BMWCCA for the following reasons:

BMWCCA would bring legitimacy to the group.

We could piggy-back 02 events off of BMWCCA events.

02 owners are probably owners of late model BMW's and active in BMWCCA.

BMWCCA might be able to provide cheap insurance to 02 events.

BMW A.G. would see the need to support the 02 owners with parts, etc.

Today, 02 owners are either those who purchased their cars new. Those that re-purchased cars similar to those they previously owned. Or new owners who see the significance of the 02 for what it's worth. I might add, that the latter is the fastest growing group of 02 owners.

There's a template out there and that's the Porsche 356 Registry. They're doing what the 02 people should be doing. I have some inroads there and fully intend to query these guys as to what they do and how they do it. Reinventing the wheel isn't necessary.

Lets see how this rolls. I'm grateful for any input on this issue from anybody.
Cheers,
TS