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This is why we must prevail in the Zimmerman SYG argument.
If this becomes a precedent setting case, we must prevail. Zimmerman's side is going to push the point that he isn't racist and that he had a right to defend himself. That he was a racist or not shouldn't be allowed to be a factor in the decision, because in the end, what people will remember is that he became the aggressor, chased down Trayvon Martin and was still allowed to get away with killing him based on SYG.

So this is what I've been thinking all morning: Let's say Zimmerman wasn't a racist. What do you think the real racists are going to do based on the decision if they know they can chase down black kids and killed them knowing they won't even have to be held accountable for manslaughter?

In other words.....we must lie and distort the truth so that we can further our agenda....

I think this needs to be addressed from a psychological perspective rather than a shouting contest. Yes, we are right about Second Amendment and SYG, but the antis at the moment appear to have more power to their emotions and our facts are not being effectively deployed.

For all it is accused of being right wing bias, where has Fox news been in all of this? Where is the NRA? They might put out nebulous gun stats, but while gun control may be the aim of some- the heated rhetoric of the black community has little to do with gun control. It has to do with their very real concern about black males going down the tubes one way or another (the reason is less important than the perception).

Black people in the US, and a considerable number of the white people in the US sincerely believe that black people are the victims. Their lack of concern for the facts or details doesn't stop them from having their own analysis promoted by their chosen community leaders be they academics, militants, or ministers.

Before I go on, of course it needs to be said that I am not referring to all blacks, it shouldn't need to be said but for some reason it does. A classic example of the breakdown from fact to emotion is the FBI Hate Crimes List. Every black person in America is aware that black people are at the top of the victims list on the FBI Hate Crimes. They have been told this. What they haven't been told, haven't checked out for themselves, and don't want to hear is that they aren't at the top of that list because of WASP people they call "white people". They are at the top of that list because Blacks and Mexicans are fighting for the ghettoes and low end districts of Southern California.

The disinformation that goes into the perceptions of the black people of the US is so thoroughly consistent that it has to be deliberate and coming from a common source or related sources. It's coming from a relative handful of black race baiters who see anger as a powerful weapon that unleashes itself at critical mass without the instigator having to be responsible for the creation of the mass or the outcome of the explosion. And no one takes these people to task, except a handful of white people on these bulletin boards because if you call these people (all of these people) on their bullshit they will engage in an uncivil barrage of accusations bordering on screaming to keep from hearing the truth.

As long as people who would challenge are afraid of being called Uncle Toms and racists then the truth will suffer. You will have black kids in junior high school building rage against white people because their parents and teachers are lying to them (sometimes innocently) about everything from black history to white oppression.

We hear a lot about "sincerely held beliefs" on these boards. When black people refuse to apologize for error or ignorance and instead say, "Well in my mind they was ....." what they are saying is that they have sincerely held beliefs put in place by trusted persons which excuse or justify their anger and obstreperousness.

It is said that branches draw their life from the vine. Each is separate yet all are one as they share one life giving stem . The Bible tells us we are called to a similar union in life, our lives with the life of God. We are incorporated into him; made sharers in his life. Apart from this union we can do nothing.

This is all about one man wanting to gain reelection by turning one race against another race and then reaping personal gain over the bodies of those that were sacrificed for his cause.
Very simple, no psychobabble or anything else needed.

The difference between pigs and people is that when they tell you you're cured it isn't a good thing.

Over the last 30 years race relations at the community level have gotten better and better, neighborhoods and schools were integrating, the cultures were integrating.
My own family has many black members now.
Obama started fanning the flames 3 years ago turning black against white and deliberately creating tension between the races with his constant meddling.
He should bring Americans together rather than divide them for his purposes.

The difference between pigs and people is that when they tell you you're cured it isn't a good thing.

Over the last 30 years race relations at the community level have gotten better and better, neighborhoods and schools were integrating, the cultures were integrating.
My own family has many black members now.
Obama started fanning the flames 3 years ago turning black against white and deliberately creating tension between the races with his constant meddling.
He should bring Americans together rather than divide them for his purposes.

I disagree. My life wasn't exactly spent on the front line of race relations, but it was close to that line. When Maryland desegregated, we had to move. It wasn't our racism which caused us to move, it was the destruction of the peace and safety of our town and my school which caused us to move. We moved from a Southeast Washington address which had been quite nice, to a cookie cutter refuge in Silver Spring Maryland. That neighborhood in Maryland has now gone the way of our older home. We moved to Fairfax, and now it's gone to hell in a handbasket. Everyone I grew up with has moved to the far outlying suburbs, and some have moved to the Outer Banks. You can't get much farther away than that without moving back into the flight zone of the next metropolis. My grandparents house, one of several my family built on their farm which became part of the town, is now a bad neighborhood. In the 30 years that you are talking about, 200 years of a stable and law abiding community has been undone.

I disagree. My life wasn't exactly spent on the front line of race relations, but it was close to that line. When Maryland desegregated, we had to move. It wasn't our racism which caused us to move, it was the destruction of the peace and safety of our town and my school which caused us to move. We moved from a Southeast Washington address which had been quite nice, to a cookie cutter refuge in Silver Spring Maryland. That neighborhood in Maryland has now gone the way of our older home. We moved to Fairfax, and now it's gone to hell in a handbasket. Everyone I grew up with has moved to the far outlying suburbs, and some have moved to the Outer Banks. You can't get much farther away than that without moving back into the flight zone of the next metropolis. My grandparents house, one of several my family built on their farm which became part of the town, is now a bad neighborhood. In the 30 years that you are talking about, 200 years of a stable and law abiding community has been undone.

I'm sure in different areas you see different circumstances, a lot of it is an economic class thing.
i have a feeling it will revert around here to pure racial segregation again

The difference between pigs and people is that when they tell you you're cured it isn't a good thing.