Composting Toilets. Clarification Please

Featured Posts

I feel I must ask the question. Are composting toilets legal? after the recent 'sabre rattling' on a recent post.

Firstly there seems to be a fair amount of ignorance on both side of the debate particularly over the subject of liquid waste (pee).

In order to correctly compost faeces it needs to have a low moisture content. This is usually achieved by having a separator, diverting the urine into a separate compartment (think cassette )which can be disposed of as you would any pee & lets admit it everyone using a thetford /portapotti knows it's pee that fills them up the quickest. I can think of no reason on earth why anyone would object about disposal of 'neat-piss' going down the elsan-point etc. Unless of course they insist on harmful chemicals being added ?

Regarding the solids.

The whole point of a composting toilet is to use the material as nature intended and produce naturally occurring Compost. Problem is people do-not compost their faecal-matter and dump bags of shit in the nearest bin. I suspect it is this that has led to the somewhat hysterical reaction by BWML to rule :

"Currently, composting toilets are not permitted in BWML marinas under the current waste transfer laws".

If the composting system is being carried out correctly, how are any 'Waste Transfer Laws being infringed. Surely using organic compost is not against any law.

Putting bags of shit into the domestic waste is LAZY and is just as bad as emptying your full cassette into the canal or roadside drain. It does happen and it is wrong but Composting toilets per se' don't deserve to be demonised.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

Guest

Guest

Composting

Composting toilets are increasing in popularity, particularly in areas with few facilities or very busy areas that suffer from frequently malfunctioning pump-out machines or Elsan units. Composting can be a great solution. The main thing to consider with compost toilets on boats is having sufficient space to compost solids correctly. Solids can take anything from three months to twelve months to break down into harmless compost. And as anyone who has ever lived on a boat for any length of time will tell you, space is always at a premium. You can never have enough space on a boat!

It ain’t what you poo it’s the way that you dispose of it

As the waste from a composting toilet may not have enough time to decompose sufficiently on board the boat before it needs emptying, this waste will still need to be disposed at anElsan/sanitary station. With the increasing popularity of composting toilets, we are hoping to pilot a facility for solid waste from composting loos as part of theLondon Mooring Strategybut in the meantime liquids go into the Elsan unit and solids should be bagged in a nappy bag and placed in thedomestic waste bins. Please don’t dump liquid and solid waste on the towpath or into the water, knowing that it hasn’t composted properly.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

I feel I must ask the question. Are composting toilets legal? after the recent 'sabre rattling' on a recent post.

Firstly there seems to be a fair amount of ignorance on both side of the debate particularly over the subject of liquid waste (pee).

In order to correctly compost faeces it needs to have a low moisture content. This is usually achieved by having a separator, diverting the urine into a separate compartment (think cassette )which can be disposed of as you would any pee & lets admit it everyone using a thetford /portapotti knows it's pee that fills them up the quickest. I can think of no reason on earth why anyone would object about disposal of 'neat-piss' going down the elsan-point etc. Unless of course they insist on harmful chemicals being added ?

Regarding the solids.

The whole point of a composting toilet is to use the material as nature intended and produce naturally occurring Compost. Problem is people do-not compost their faecal-matter and dump bags of shit in the nearest bin. I suspect it is this that has led to the somewhat hysterical reaction by BWML to rule :

"Currently, composting toilets are not permitted in BWML marinas under the current waste transfer laws".

If the composting system is being carried out correctly, how are any 'Waste Transfer Laws being infringed. Surely using organic compost is not against any law.

Putting bags of shit into the domestic waste is LAZY and is just as bad as emptying your full cassette into the canal or roadside drain. It does happen and it is wrong but Composting toilets per se' don't deserve to be demonised.

And yes I have a Composting Toilet on board.

I think you have answered the question. Yes they are legal and IF used correctly they are no problem. Of course you have hit the nail squarely on the head and it's a fact that most boats don't have the place or space to keep a few weeks of turds to compost down. I know of people who simply pour pee straight onto hedge bottom ( no big deal ) but it's the uncomposted solids in the rubbish bins people quite rightly object to. There are people with boats who live aboard and compost at their moorings but in general there is no benefit to a moving boat to be had from a composting toilet if used correctly.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

............liquids go into the Elsan unit and properly composted solids should be bagged in a nappy bag and placed in thedomestic waste bins

It will be interesting to see how that works out - I would suggest that C&RT have missed out a couple of important words (inserted in Red) and wonder what will happen to the trial when the C&RT bin men discover semi-liquid, non-dessicated slurry in the bins.

41 minutes ago, Clodi said:

Currently, composting toilets are not permitted in BWML marinas under the current waste transfer laws".

It is not just BWML, there are now (reports of) several Marinas all taking the same stance.

Irrespective of the legality of putting the waste into a bin, as 'Private' marina BWML, or any others can make whatever (within the law) rules they see fit - if they were to say "no car tyres to be put in the skip" would that cause as much outrage as saying "no composted poo"

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

I think you have answered the question. Yes they are legal and IF used correctly they are no problem. Of course you have hit the nail squarely on the head and it's a fact that most boats don't have the place or space to keep a few weeks of turds to compost down. I know of people who simply pour pee straight onto hedge bottom ( no big deal ) but it's the uncomposted solids in the rubbish bins people quite rightly object to. There are people with boats who live aboard and compost at their moorings but in general there is no benefit to a moving boat to be had from a composting toilet if used correctly.

If anyone is interested there is a really informative facebook group Compost Toilets for Boats and Off-Grid Living.

A couple living aboard full-time, especially if they're used to living with pump-out, saving it 'till you can get to the Pub/restaurant/ McDonald's etc, will generate a surprisingly small amount of dry waste, hence the reference to the 3 bucket system.

15 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

It will be interesting to see how that works out - I would suggest that C&RT have missed out a couple of important words (inserted in Red) and wonder what will happen to the trial when the C&RT bin men discover semi-liquid, non-dessicated slurry in the bins.

It is not just BWML, there are now (reports of) several Marinas all taking the same stance.

Irrespective of the legality of putting the waste into a bin, as 'Private' marina BWML, or any others can make whatever (within the law) rules they see fit - if they were to say "no car tyres to be put in the skip" would that cause as much outrage as saying "no composted poo"

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

I think you have answered the question. Yes they are legal and IF used correctly they are no problem. Of course you have hit the nail squarely on the head and it's a fact that most boats don't have the place or space to keep a few weeks of turds to compost down. I know of people who simply pour pee straight onto hedge bottom ( no big deal ) but it's the uncomposted solids in the rubbish bins people quite rightly object to. There are people with boats who live aboard and compost at their moorings but in general there is no benefit to a moving boat to be had from a composting toilet if used correctly.

If anyone is interested there is a really informative facebook group Compost Toilets for Boats and Off-Grid Living.

A couple living aboard full-time, especially if they're used to living with pump-out, saving it 'till you can get to the Pub/restaurant/ McDonald's etc, will generate a surprisingly small amount of dry waste, hence the reference to the 3 bucket system.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

I could further add that anyone who has been unfortunate enough to have cared for incontinent relatives, or babies for that matter will know that it is acceptable to dispose of suitably bagged waste in the appropriate manner.

But that is not my point regarding Composting Toilet Systems & as far as I know Marinas have not yet banned nappies ?

The extract from the C&RT posting suggest putting the solids in the waste bin.

I have a contract with Biffa for our caravan site and it is an annual ordeal to go thru the paperwork and list everything that could be put into the bin. We have to sign to say we have complied with the Section 12 of the "Waste Regulations 2011" legislation for Heirarchy of Waste .

Each wheely bin full of waste is weighed by the truck and we have to pay £0.20p + VAT per Kg on top of the £20+ VAT for the bin-rental and 'lift' (as they call it). Once at the sorting plant anything that is not on the declared list (how they identify whose it is I don't know) and you are in SERIOUS trouble.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

I think you have answered the question. Yes they are legal and IF used correctly they are no problem. Of course you have hit the nail squarely on the head and it's a fact that most boats don't have the place or space to keep a few weeks of turds to compost down. I know of people who simply pour pee straight onto hedge bottom ( no big deal ) but it's the uncomposted solids in the rubbish bins people quite rightly object to. There are people with boats who live aboard and compost at their moorings but in general there is no benefit to a moving boat to be had from a composting toilet if used correctly.

So ,the Bottom Line is :if you are Land Based and have a Compost Heap or access to one ,use a Composting Loo. if you live on or use a Boat then stick to established methods of Sewage disposal?Pump Out ,Elsan Disposal point etc.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

So ,the Bottom Line is :if you are Land Based and have a Compost Heap or access to one ,use a Composting Loo. if you live on or use a Boat then stick to established methods of Sewage disposal?Pump Out ,Elsan Disposal point etc.

Or, " if you live on or use a Boat" you might also have an option of a compost heap on land you own, so it really isnt just two options? Something the other thread hadn't considered perhaps before the haranguing galloped onwards.

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

From a hygiene point of view, double bagging of offensive wa﻿ste is essential. Strong bags not cheapo bin liners.

Erm, aren't we supposed to be reducing the amount of plastic we dispose of into the environment? And unless there is some kind of manual handling of waste at the processing site then double bagging serves little purpose imo

Share this post

Link to post

Share on other sites

Erm, aren't we supposed to be reducing the amount of plastic we dispose of into the environment? And unless there is some kind of manual handling of waste at the processing site then double bagging serves little purpose imo

Public health takes precedence over environmental concerns.

Biffa will empty their bins in to a lorry, there is some manual handling of the bins. The lorry will tip on to a landfill site, A tractor will cover with soil. It is not a perfect system by any means. The people who drive these machines have a very unpleasant job, it would be a lot worse if there is a lot of loose faecal material in the bins.

Biffa will empty their bins in to a lorry, there is some manual handling of the bins. The lorry will tip on to a landfill site, A tractor will cover with soil. It is not a perfect system by any means. The people who drive these machines have a very unpleasant job, it would be a lot worse if there is a lot of loose faecal material in the bins.