That might depend on your definition of herding. I know of one of my (sold) pups that thinks she does anyway. Just don't tell her that the clydesdales she messes with, would have gone to the barn anyway, since their food is being put out that time of day. Some other DS owners use their brindles around the farm, and maybe some have actually gotten herding titles?[/quote]

I know how that is with the stock being on a routine. All of my farm critters know the daily drill so they anticipate and my Heelers just follow suit. Makes them and myself look really good.

I really do wonder if there are any DSs in the US that have any herding titles. If under AKC, then they would be registered as mixes or Mals. I wonder how I could find out, just for curiosity.

Poor ducks! I loved mine and would not consider feeding them to the dogs. Some dogs tried, but could not manage them on the pond. The diving abiltiy of a duck is no match for any dog (or coyote) as long as there is enough water. On land, they are a differnent kind of bird. Quite inadequate. Maybe a mean ram with a good set of horns is a fairer match for a DS?

Tell us about yourself: I have had a DS for almost a year. Gwen and I are considering participating in PSA and or possible Ring Sport. I also have a Great Dane. I have grown up around working GSDs and my last GSD was a working K9 officer. I am all about dogs and animals in general and want to learn as much as I can about training.

vneerland wrote:Poor ducks! I loved mine and would not consider feeding them to the dogs. Some dogs tried, but could not manage them on the pond. The diving abiltiy of a duck is no match for any dog (or coyote) as long as there is enough water. On land, they are a differnent kind of bird. Quite inadequate. Maybe a mean ram with a good set of horns is a fairer match for a DS?

I was thinking a nice genteel billy goat might make a fair match for a DS

Well, for the first time in 2 yrs, I lost 2 of my ducks last night and one was seriously injured, probably a fox I am thinking as I have had problems with them in the past with my chickens. The ducks and chickens are locked up every evening as are my sheep and let out to graze every morning for the day. BUT>>>I have had two mini horses given to me in the past month by different people, delightful little things great with my grandkids but they are destructive as all heck. Nothing is sacred to those piglets. They destroy all my critter enclosures trying to get to the food. Evidently they pushed open the door to the ducks last evening seeking the duck food. GRRRR! Needless to say the ducks wandered out. Guess I will have to redesign and padlock the duck door. Before long my little farm will look like Fort Knox!

Dang. I lost my ducks to the abundant local wildlife as well and will not retry that venue untill I have a good predator proof enclosure. The horse here is big enough not to fit in with the fowl though. She would much rather mess with the dogs (heads) anyway.

Started off life on a farm (including horses) but only just recently have been around mini's. All rescues. Interesting creatures. None behave in the destructive manner that Denise describes, though. (So few good deeds go unpunished .)

Denise, your rescue sounds interesting; I've enjoyed reading your posts. I volunteer at non-profit rescue that has barnyard animals and some exotics. (She "doesn't do" cats or dogs, yet always seems to have them; can't say 'no' to the never-ending battle.) She doesn't have BCs for herding anymore--what was said about barnyards knowing the drill--yep--that's it.

Though I can only hope to become the person who my animals believe I am, the things that they have taught me have made me a better human being. ~~~Sharon~~~

Tell us about yourself: Lifelong animal person- I professionally trained horses before my children were born. New to DS's, but not new to high drive working dogs. :) Currently have a 1 1/2 yr old DS, Koenig, and a 2 yr old English Pointer Sara. They are both rescues. Oh yes, I work at a multi species non-profit animal rescue, on Bainbridge Island, WA

It will be on video. I've been assured that this stockman can handle my dog. Heh. The guy who assured me of that has now seen Koenig take off like a bat out of hell after some canadian geese (that were 1/2 way across the lake... He knows my dog, so we'll see how it turns out! Here is the site, http://www.ewe-topia.com/WhatIsEwetopia.htm Not a lot about the trainer/stockman though.

Raven wrote:Started off life on a farm (including horses) but only just recently have been around mini's. All rescues. Interesting creatures. None behave in the destructive manner that Denise describes, though. (So few good deeds go unpunished .)

Denise, your rescue sounds interesting; I've enjoyed reading your posts. I volunteer at non-profit rescue that has barnyard animals and some exotics. (She "doesn't do" cats or dogs, yet always seems to have them; can't say 'no' to the never-ending battle.) She doesn't have BCs for herding anymore--what was said about barnyards knowing the drill--yep--that's it.

Actually, I don't promote that I do rescue anymore, particularly no dogs. Katrina/Rita rescues did me in so now when someone calls with a GSD, I just put them in touch directly with someone I know is wanting one. I had 23 extra GSDs after the hurricanes. YIPES! But on a more positive note, the Katrina/Rita rescue efforts did introduce me to my first association with the Dutch Shepherd. They called me from NOLA and said they had a brindle German Shep, would I foster it. I knew what it was and yes, I did foster the old girl. The family had to relocate because their home had 9 feet of oily, contaminated sewer water in it. The man cried when I got Sassy from him. I adopted her out to a wonderful couple who spoiled her.

But now that I have my little farm, seems everyone wants to unload their unwanted farm critters with me. Guessing it is because mine are spoiled. But if it is a farm animal that I think I would want, then I will take it. But maxed out right now. No exotics here; definitely no cats. I dont dislike cats, just no place for them because they will eat my ducks/chickens and the dogs will eat the cats!!

The mini horses are piglets, they will eat til they explode so I have to ration their feed. One of mine is very overweight and may end up having to put a grazing muzzle on him. So when they see or smell feed for the other critters, they will paw or push or stand on whatever they have to to break open an enclosure. My fencing looks pathetic after only a few months with these minis. Oh and in response to Judith about her horse, yes, they love love to torment my dogs in the kennels. They rub all up against the fencing teasing the dogs.

Tell us about yourself: I have had a DS for almost a year. Gwen and I are considering participating in PSA and or possible Ring Sport. I also have a Great Dane. I have grown up around working GSDs and my last GSD was a working K9 officer. I am all about dogs and animals in general and want to learn as much as I can about training.

How about a nice solar electric fence? It works wonders with my draft cross who WILL break out of any enclosure not electrified if he is hungry.. also keeps my fencing looking nice as he can no longer lean on it. Tractor Supply Carries some pretty good ones that are not expensive.

Kristie Elliott wrote:How about a nice solar electric fence? It works wonders with my draft cross who WILL break out of any enclosure not electrified if he is hungry.. also keeps my fencing looking nice as he can no longer lean on it. Tractor Supply Carries some pretty good ones that are not expensive.

That is a great idea! Actually have been thinking about that so I can rotate them in my pasture. They are real stinkers!

A neighbor to my farm stopped by this morning to tell me that he saw a very large bobcat crossing the road from my place early Sunday morning so that may be the culprit in the demise of some of my ducks. Always somethin'. May just have to get a guardian donkey.

Tell us about yourself: I have had a DS for almost a year. Gwen and I are considering participating in PSA and or possible Ring Sport. I also have a Great Dane. I have grown up around working GSDs and my last GSD was a working K9 officer. I am all about dogs and animals in general and want to learn as much as I can about training.

what they hey... add one more to the menagerie , although I am surprised you did not hear it, or have not heard it. The one that hangs out in the Lansing area can be heard at dusk ... it is quite freaky really.

Kristie Elliott wrote:what they hey... add one more to the menagerie , although I am surprised you did not hear it, or have not heard it. The one that hangs out in the Lansing area can be heard at dusk ... it is quite freaky really.

I have seen the red fox and also the raccoons but not the bobcat. I wonder what the bobcat sounds like; anything like a cat? Cant say I have ever heard one actually. It has to be a very canny animal because there are five standard guardian donkeys behind and on one side of my property. Believe me the donkeys are serious animals particularly since they have two donkeyletts, or whatever they are called. I dont care to have one tho seriously as they can do serious harm to a dog and I have personally tried to outrun one before which was a comical sight to behold! My fat hiney running in scrubs and Crocks across a muddy pasture, a big white donkey chasing me!

Back to herding though. Since our new member and judge, Mieke, herds with her DSs, I would like to here her take on herding with them.

Tell us about yourself: I have had a DS for almost a year. Gwen and I are considering participating in PSA and or possible Ring Sport. I also have a Great Dane. I have grown up around working GSDs and my last GSD was a working K9 officer. I am all about dogs and animals in general and want to learn as much as I can about training.

Tell us about yourself: Hello, I am an Irish Wolfhound owner, breeder, exhibitor and judge located in the southern USA. I am a new Belgian Laekenois owner and enjoy herding. I've always admire the Dutch Shepherd's work ethic and looks especially the rough coats. I'd like to learn more about the breed and their herding capabilities. THANKS!

<<<<<Since starting in a round pen with stock close up is how most trainers begin, I would recommend starting with a puppy in that type enclosure, quickly graduating to the larger arena, once and only once the puppy has the commands down. Because without firm obedience and when the dog is off lead, there is absolutely no way, no way you will be able to keep up with a DS on course. I say starting with a puppy in the round pen because I have found that my adult DSs and my GSDs are so overly equipped in agility and strength, compounded by high prey drive that the drive intensifies in a close area with the stock. Hence, resultant chaos and destruction. >>>>

Gee Whiz!!!! I've been out of town and off line for a few weeks and the herding chatter goes nuts!!!!! I sure missed out on the fun.

Thank you so much for relating your experiences with your GSD. In addition to my Belgian Laekenois, we also have a four year old GSD bitch that has very high prey drive. In the presence of stock, even the most accomplished obedience trained dog is not reliable. Stock changes everything! My herding instructor has trained and succeeded at trials with her GSDs. She does not believe in using round pens to train, especially in the case of a dog with high drive. The more the dog moves and increases her speed after stock, the more charged up and out of control the dog becomes. This is SO true in the case of my bitch. What worked like a charm and made a more thoughtful, responsible dog was stall work. You walk each side with two heavy sheep and stop, wait - and move to the next side of the rectangle and repeat. This is also useful to teach your dog to head. If the sheep move off you, put the stick in the right position to make the dog correct the problem. Stall work has also helped me understand where to place my stock stick. This came in handy at our recent trial. It wasn't pretty, but my Laekenois puppy picked up two of his AKC started legs at the Mid South Herding Trials in MS. Stall work is thought to be boring, but it is invaluable in learning the basics as a handler. The close proximity of the stock to the dog is immense pressure for the dog and should only be done in short sessions. The lesson must end on a positive and successful note or the lesson is meaningless. Also if you are not willing to commit to consistently correcting your dog's bad behavior, you're wasting your time and setting bad habits. All and all herding training is truly hard work, but worth it. Both my GSD and Laekenois have become happier and mentally sounder dogs from their lessons!

Tell us about yourself: Hello, I am an Irish Wolfhound owner, breeder, exhibitor and judge located in the southern USA. I am a new Belgian Laekenois owner and enjoy herding. I've always admire the Dutch Shepherd's work ethic and looks especially the rough coats. I'd like to learn more about the breed and their herding capabilities. THANKS!

<<<<<Since starting in a round pen with stock close up is how most trainers begin, I would recommend starting with a puppy in that type enclosure, quickly graduating to the larger arena, once and only once the puppy has the commands down. Because without firm obedience and when the dog is off lead, there is absolutely no way, no way you will be able to keep up with a DS on course. I say starting with a puppy in the round pen because I have found that my adult DSs and my GSDs are so overly equipped in agility and strength, compounded by high prey drive that the drive intensifies in a close area with the stock. Hence, resultant chaos and destruction. >>>>

Gee Whiz!!!! I've been out of town and off line for a few weeks and the herding chatter goes nuts!!!!! I sure missed out on the fun.

Thank you so much for relating your experiences with your GSD. In addition to my Belgian Laekenois, we also have a four year old GSD bitch that has very high prey drive. In the presence of stock, even the most accomplished obedience trained dog is not reliable. Stock changes everything! My herding instructor has trained and succeeded at trials with her GSDs. She does not believe in using round pens to train, especially in the case of a dog with high drive. The more the dog moves and increases her speed after stock, the more charged up and out of control the dog becomes. This is SO true in the case of my bitch. What worked like a charm and made a more thoughtful, responsible dog was stall work. You walk each side with two heavy sheep and stop, wait - and move to the next side of the rectangle and repeat. This is also useful to teach your dog to head. If the sheep move off you, put the stick in the right position to make the dog correct the problem. Stall work has also helped me understand where to place my stock stick. This came in handy at our recent trial. It wasn't pretty, but my Laekenois puppy picked up two of his AKC started legs at the Mid South Herding Trials in MS. Stall work is thought to be boring, but it is invaluable in learning the basics as a handler. The close proximity of the stock to the dog is immense pressure for the dog and should only be done in short sessions. The lesson must end on a positive and successful note or the lesson is meaningless. Also if you are not willing to commit to consistently correcting your dog's bad behavior, you're wasting your time and setting bad habits. All and all herding training is truly hard work, but worth it. Both my GSD and Laekenois have become happier and mentally sounder dogs from their lessons!

I'm enjoying catching up with you all!

Diane Koontz Bresee
Walland, TN

PS - This is a re-post. Don't believe I did this right the first time. I'm still trying to get the hang of this forum.

Tell us about yourself: Artist, Mother, Equestrienne, Educator, Homesteader wannabe, dog-lover. Not counting my current DS, I have had 2 GSDs and 3 rescued mixed-breeds. All of these dogs were rescues, except for my childhood GSD, who was a gift from my parents when I was 7, and my current DS who I bartered artwork for from the breeder. Maiyou, one of my current dogs, is a Pitbull/New Guinea Singing Dog of 13 years old. Still very active and "Young" in nature. I now also have a DS named Mokume, (pronounced "Moh-koo-meh") or "Moko" for short. Newest member of our pack is Freyja, a random mixed hound I rescued during a horseback trip in the middle of a state forest.

Don't own a DS yet, but am strongly interested in doing some herding training when I do get one. Have really been enjoying everyone's experiences and input.

Autumn Dufresne

"If you talk to the animals they will talk with you and you will know each other. If you do not talk to them you will not know them, and what you do not know, you will fear. What one fears, one destroys." ~Chief Dan George

Tell us about yourself: Malinois man who is converting to a different religion. I rescued a female DS from North American DS rescue (thank you Trudy!). Got hooked on DS although still fluent in malinois having them over 25 yrs. I train for obedience, tracking and agility with my mal and DS. Yvette my DS has HIC and the judges loved her as much as she loved her sheep. I am retired from the air force so I can train my dogs full time. I would never breed since I couldn't sell the puppies but admire those who do. I am considering getting a male DS rescue but since I am 60 yrs old that will be my last DS. My wife and I live in Mobile Al out in the country so my dogs prevent break ins (who would want to be protein supplement to a mal or DS). Looking forward to reading more about DS here!

My rescue DS is HIC. Judges loved her! Mostly a drover but did bunch and head. Both judges were working border collie people. No sheepherders in my area so we wont train but worthwhile to see here do it.