But a bare minimum JVM with your own lib to hardware interfaces, will have all the portability problems of modern java. lwjgl is great, but there are still driver/platform quirks. If every bit of OS interface code had to be your own...shessh... I think you underestimate even what awt does... never mind the IO and net libs.

By the way. My production java code is over 2x faster than the C code it replaces... So all this java->bytecode->C, if you want C write C.

I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious.--Albert Einstein

But a bare minimum JVM with your own lib to hardware interfaces, will have all the portability problems of modern java. lwjgl is great, but there are still driver/platform quirks. If every bit of OS interface code had to be your own...shessh... I think you underestimate even what awt does... never mind the IO and net libs.

By the way. My production java code is over 2x faster than the C code it replaces... So all this java->bytecode->C, if you want C write C.

Having a Java IDE while developing/debugging is a major productivity boost.

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Oh how I've tried!! I thought Unity would be the perfect solution for me (despite the $1500 price tag or the limitations of the Indie version). I tried to duplicate my engine test and benchmarker in it to get a performance comparison and ended up pulling my hair out (seriously, it must have looked like Cas' avatar). There's a pretty steep learning curve involved, and I've discovered that it has more limitations than my own engine work.

I've put in a lot of time learning how to make games with Java and LWJGL. I've also put in substantial time trying to figure out Unity, Ogre3D, Horde3D, a few other game engines, and some C++ alternatives as well. Objective-C (tried to learn it for making iPhone apps) was a nightmare for me; my eyes couldn't focus on the code formatting (seriously!). C++ ended up being more limited than Java due to the need for platform specific libraries (I'm trying to learn SDL, as it's cross-platform, but I'll still be limited to the same audience as Java).

BTW, the problem isn't Java. It's the device manufacturers that refuse to support Java (or other libraries). Hopefully Oracle can bring this around, but as it stands, it's a mess no matter what language you decide to use. If you want to get on XBox, learn C++ and DirectX. If you want iPhone, learn Objective-C and the Apple libraries. If you want Android, learn Java and the Android library. If you want Windows-Linux-Mac, learn C++ with SDL or Java with LWJGL.

btw: is the android lib very different? is it likely that i have much to rewrite to port my games? i hadn't the time to look closer yet

Well, I don't know your game code, so I couldn't say. The Android SDK is pretty straight forward though (IMHO) and there's quite a few tutorials out there. Keep in mind that it uses openGL ES for 3D, so fixed function pipeline only (for the most part). If your games are written in Java2D then they may just port right over.

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