gm wanted to stick true to the z28 history and give us the most expensive Camaro ever! this Camaro is in no way like the first z28.....sure someone turned it into a track car and raced it, but this isn't exactly that..... that wasn't done in house. and all the z28's of later years were crap....especially my favorite(sarcasm)....the late 2nd gens and early 3rd gens! so really, there is nothing in this car that shows me what rolled off the line in 69....... its going to be overpriced.....in a new category of cars because the price has taken it out of the American sports car category and thrown it into the European car category...... this is why it will fail. it will be a hit amongst Camaro enthusiast....but not the rest of the world....Europeans will laugh.

I agree about the history and europeans will never drool over this Z/28.

They know they screwed it up and IMO a camaro purist has blinders on not to see it. It's going to be a great car to own! But they could've done something with an SS to stay true to homeage and offer 25-50HP option on the SS at the very least.

I posted my thoughts on the future of camaro, but they may not make a 6th gen. It's quite possible they hang it up instead of ****ing it up. Who knows? Somehow I think the camaro if made into a 6th gen will be a 3 yr production and then ended.

from what ive heard the "6th gen is underway and has been for a while....or the next alpha platform vehicle. supposedly its not going to have camaro styling to it and will be all new. they could very well change the name of what would be the camaro just to draw more interest.

on the european topic....they dont like much about any of our cars. automatic transmissions are crap on high performance vehicles.... seats are junk.... plastics...cars too big..too heavy.... they dont like the ls motors...too slow reving....and they hate chrome.... i dont see how they can say this is a "track car" true to its roots, when the thing weighs almost 4k lbs!!! thats not true to its " light weight" roots..... everyone in racing knows, you need a light car.... not a heavy pig with light rear glass...

from what ive heard the "6th gen is underway and has been for a while....or the next alpha platform vehicle. supposedly its not going to have camaro styling to it and will be all new. they could very well change the name of what would be the camaro just to draw more interest.

on the european topic....they dont like much about any of our cars. automatic transmissions are crap on high performance vehicles.... seats are junk.... plastics...cars too big..too heavy.... they dont like the ls motors...too slow reving....and they hate chrome.... i dont see how they can say this is a "track car" true to its roots, when the thing weighs almost 4k lbs!!! thats not true to its " light weight" roots..... everyone in racing knows, you need a light car.... not a heavy pig with light rear glass...

lol well they have trademarked the chevelle recently! So a name change isnt too far off!

this is why it will fail. it will be a hit amongst Camaro enthusiast....but not the rest of the world....Europeans will laugh.

The Z/28 is going to run into the same problem Corvette's do when they get compared to european cars. Yeah it may be faster, perform better at less of a price, but they will argue "its still a Camaro." Sad part is that is how the world will look at, just a camaro. Just like many people did when M/T compared the ZR1 to a Ferrari, many looked down at the ZR1 bc it was just a corvette. It's sad, but true

Who gives a rat's ass what the Europeans think about the Camaro, that is not the MAIN intended market for it. Sure you'll get a small minority of people over there who have an appreciation for pony/muscle cars, but to think we are trying to win over BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari, Lamborghini drivers, that's just..... GM is trying to satisfy the niche here. How did this get into a debate about how long the Camaro was going to last...again?

Who gives a rat's ass what the Europeans think about the Camaro, that is not the MAIN intended market for it. Sure you'll get a small minority of people over there who have an appreciation for pony/muscle cars, but to think we are trying to win over BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari, Lamborghini drivers, that's just..... GM is trying to satisfy the niche here. How did this get into a debate about how long the Camaro was going to last...again?

I agree, I don't care what Europeans think about our cars.

This I don't agree. Reason being is with maybe the exception of Ferrari and Lamborghini, those mentioned among OTHER foreign cars play a major role in track racing TODAY. This is NOT Chevy Camaro vs ford and dodge. Those days are long gone! The corvette is racing against all the euro cars you've mentioned and the camaro is getting its feet wet in track racing these models though that's short lived....

Who gives a rat's ass what the Europeans think about the Camaro, that is not the MAIN intended market for it. Sure you'll get a small minority of people over there who have an appreciation for pony/muscle cars, but to think we are trying to win over BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari, Lamborghini drivers, that's just..... GM is trying to satisfy the niche here. How did this get into a debate about how long the Camaro was going to last...again?

because the camaro will be put into a group with track ready cars like porsche...thats why it matters. its out of any classes here in the US market... so now you need to find cars to compare it against....not to mention its higher price will throw it right out of most comparissons of US cars...... you tell me who it should be compared to?

This I don't agree. Reason being is with maybe the exception of Ferrari and Lamborghini, those mentioned among OTHER foreign cars play a major role in track racing TODAY. This is NOT Chevy Camaro vs ford and dodge. Those days are long gone! The corvette is racing against all the euro cars you've mentioned and the camaro is getting its feet wet in track racing these models though that's short lived....

there is good and bad tt this car and gm now. because everything in GM is getting better, weve basically beaten all US car companies across the board. now GM is going for the world market. like the ATS aiming at the 3 series...and the new CTS... the new vette aiming at the Ferrari. Cadillac bringing its luxury to a new level comparable to Mercedes. this camaro is now in a league of its own and needs competition. where else to look but the more expensive European market.

The Z/28 is going to run into the same problem Corvette's do when they get compared to european cars. Yeah it may be faster, perform better at less of a price, but they will argue "its still a Camaro." Sad part is that is how the world will look at, just a camaro. Just like many people did when M/T compared the ZR1 to a Ferrari, many looked down at the ZR1 bc it was just a corvette. It's sad, but true

american cars a great bang for your buck...but you get better quality out of european cars....as far as fit and finish and just pure heritage. porsche, mercedes, audi, bmw....all have great heritage in the race world and make great motors and even better automatic shifter. GM paddle shifters suck compared ot a porsche or mercedes. this is where alot of european dollars go to. not to mention there suspension are years ahead of US. these are just some reasons why euro cars are more pricier than US. chevy is just finally (last 10 years maybe)listening to the racing world with the corvette racing team and using that info for the cars. all the european names i listed have been integrating their findings from racing into the street cars for decades.

This I don't agree. Reason being is with maybe the exception of Ferrari and Lamborghini, those mentioned among OTHER foreign cars play a major role in track racing TODAY. This is NOT Chevy Camaro vs ford and dodge. Those days are long gone! The corvette is racing against all the euro cars you've mentioned and the camaro is getting its feet wet in track racing these models though that's short lived....

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2010_5thgen

because the camaro will be put into a group with track ready cars like porsche...thats why it matters. its out of any classes here in the US market... so now you need to find cars to compare it against....not to mention its higher price will throw it right out of most comparissons of US cars...... you tell me who it should be compared to?

You guys are talking about the 2%'ers, I'm talking about the other 98% that just want a Camaro for everyday driving. I'm not sure if you realize this but we aren't really competing when those of us have cars that take it to the road track for HPDE sessions. You're looking for optimal performance when you do and to get the most bang for the buck, and in that regards, we have those euro boys beat by a mile when comparing new to new.

You can't compare a Camaro to Porsche in one sense because they are two different types of cars. Though it is cool that we can now be at a level to perform almost as well. I think if the growth of HPDE is for real, we will be fine. Just get out there and have fun

because the camaro will be put into a group with track ready cars like porsche...thats why it matters. its out of any classes here in the US market... so now you need to find cars to compare it against....not to mention its higher price will throw it right out of most comparissons of US cars...... you tell me who it should be compared to?

You guys are talking about the 2%'ers, I'm talking about the other 98% that just want a Camaro for everyday driving. I'm not sure if you realize this but we aren't really competing when those of us have cars that take it to the road track for HPDE sessions. You're looking for optimal performance when you do and to get the most bang for the buck, and in that regards, we have those euro boys beat by a mile when comparing new to new.

You can't compare a Camaro to Porsche in one sense because they are two different types of cars. Though it is cool that we can now be at a level to perform almost as well. I think if the growth of HPDE is for real, we will be fine. Just get out there and have fun

most bang for your buck for road racing ......ariel atom...want doors? used GTR...that is the best bang for your buck by far!

I would love a 1LE with a LS7 if priced accordingly. You could daily drive it and track it without worry. And, still have all the creature comforts if that's what you wanted.
Also, think of all the mods to go with that LS7.

american cars a great bang for your buck...but you get better quality out of european cars....as far as fit and finish and just pure heritage. porsche, mercedes, audi, bmw....all have great heritage in the race world and make great motors and even better automatic shifter. GM paddle shifters suck compared ot a porsche or mercedes. this is where alot of european dollars go to. not to mention there suspension are years ahead of US. these are just some reasons why euro cars are more pricier than US. chevy is just finally (last 10 years maybe)listening to the racing world with the corvette racing team and using that info for the cars. all the european names i listed have been integrating their findings from racing into the street cars for decades.

Sorry, but this is bullshit. I am in europe at home, and a lot of the mercedes,bmw and audi, there are in the same price segment how the camaro, arent not so good as the camaro.

Sure, when you buy a mercedes for 200000 dollar, you have a awesome mercedes, but its not all gold.

The normal audis, bmw,mercedes and all the other euopean cars are just nothing special.

You can't compare a Camaro to Porsche in one sense because they are two different types of cars. Though it is cool that we can now be at a level to perform as well or better at half the cost.

There, I fixed that for you

In the real world, the only Porsche to run close to the Z/28 will be a current 991 GT3, or last iteration GT3RS. You are talking $130-$150k+. The Porsche Turbo is a dog on track, no serious tracker runs one. GT2's are pretty quick but damn hard to drive fast because of the turbo lag.

american cars a great bang for your buck...but you get better quality out of european cars....as far as fit and finish and just pure heritage. porsche, mercedes, audi, bmw....all have great heritage in the race world and make great motors and even better automatic shifter. GM paddle shifters suck compared ot a porsche or mercedes. this is where alot of european dollars go to. not to mention there suspension are years ahead of US. these are just some reasons why euro cars are more pricier than US. chevy is just finally (last 10 years maybe)listening to the racing world with the corvette racing team and using that info for the cars. all the european names i listed have been integrating their findings from racing into the street cars for decades.

no you don't. Not at all. If anything the quality of European cars is going down. I have worked on a few and they are nothing special.

In terms of quality do you mean leather wrapped dash boards and projector lights that turn with your steering wheel?

Then maybe. But new Caddys and even the new Jeep GC are pretty nice in that department too

In the real world, the only Porsche to run close to the Z/28 will be a current 991 GT3, or last iteration GT3RS. You are talking $130-$150k+. The Porsche Turbo is a dog on track, no serious tracker runs one. GT2's are pretty quick but damn hard to drive fast because of the turbo lag.