Supreme Court finds for appellants on Named Persons

The Supreme Court of the United Kingdom has just handed down its unanimous judgment on the appeal against the Scottish High Court appeal judgment which had been in favour of the Scottish Government in relation to Part 4 of the Children and Young People [Scotland] Act of 2014.

The Supreme Court did not unhold the broad appeal on the basis of Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights [ECHR] – but it has upheld the narrower appeal on Article 8 which relates to the information sharing provisions in Part 4 of the Act.

It found that, iunder Article 8 of ECHR the interests to be protected include the right to family life and to the privacy of that life – and that this right requires the protection of the state.

The High Court judges spoke of the need not to ‘standardise children’.

They found that the provisions of Part 4 of the Act ‘interfere’ with the Data Protection Act’s measures in the sharing of data.

They found that the information sharing provisions of Part 4 of the Act and its statutory guidance are not in accordance with the law.

Their two conclusions are that:

the information sharing provisions of Part 4 of the Children and Young People [Scotland] Act are incompatible with Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights;

and that these provisions may disproportionately interfere with rights under Article 8.

They therefore found that the information sharing provisions of the 2014 Act ‘are not within the powers of the Scottish Parliament’.

The Scottish Parliament has been given 42 days to lodge with the Supreme Court any proposals it may wish to make to amend the information sharing provisions of the 2014 Act.

This ruling must mean the immediate cessation of the raft of pilot introductions of the Named Person provision implemented in councils across Scotland with the encouragement of the Scottish Government. These will now be challengeable at law.

It is worth noting that in its judgment the Supreme Court said:
‘“The first thing that a totalitarian regime tries to do is to get to the children, to distance them from the subversive, varied influences of their families, and indoctrinate them in their rulers’ view of the world. Within limits, families must be left to bring up their children in their own way.’

And Mr Swinney’s got such a mild and reasonable manner for someone defending a measure that (even if he hasn’t the nous to realise it) has just that wee bit of a whiff of authoritarianism about it.
It’d get a wry smile from George Orwell.

I’m so glad you have highlighted this part of the Supreme Court’s judgement – apart from the legislation itself being deeply flawed and unworkable (who would want to be a midwife, health visitor or teacher in this Snoopers Charter with the responsibility lying firmly at your door should anything go wrong? And it will!), I have always regarded the intention behind the Named Person scheme as sinister and politically motivated. What better way for a political party currently in power intent on destroying a sovereign state than to start insidiously monitoring families under the guise of child protection and welfare AND manipulating the thought processes of the next generation from cradle to voting age! What safeguards are in place one wonders to ensure that the ‘Named Persons’ nominated and appointed aren’t also registered as SNP members or share the same ideology as the SNP??

I am astonished and disappointed in equal measures with the opposition parties at Holyrood for allowing the Named Person Scheme to get to this stage – wholly uncontested at the time – the Scottish Liberal Democrats forever wishy washy grey and woolly and can never decide what they want or what they believe in; the Scottish Labour Party so busy coming to terms with the fact that they are completely irrelevant in 21st century Britain, they have taken their eye off the ball; the Scottish Conservatives who initially voted ‘aye’ and then woke up and realized once the fight was on to stop the Named Person the actual implications and consequences of such state sponsored interference and now that the horse has bolted are trying to shut the proverbial stable door; the Scottish Greens are so busy trying to save the planet and erect wind farms all over the place, ironically they are destroying our beautiful landscape and have forgotten that people matter too. And that leaves the Scottish NATIONALIST Party whose sole aim and objective is to destroy the UK and turn Scotland into a separatist state with its roots embedded in German Nazism and ‘policies’ based on a type of socialism floundering and rejected elsewhere in the civilized world.

Ironically, democracy which Sturgeon and her ilk are so keen to loudly promote to whoever will listen, is being sold down the river in the name of nationalism and separatism.

Not in my control and hadn’t noticed this myself [so thanks] – and will pass on your concerns.
This us likely to be one of the consequences of recovery from recent outages which were beyond our control.

My personal view on this is that we are better without the thumbs up and down. They don’t mean anything and they just clutter the page. I think they are more of a trivial facebook/twitter thing than something for a forum.

You also get people who simply use them just because they don’t like the poster regardless of what they say. I am pretty sure if Malcolm or NCH posted a story about a lovely old lady being recognised for her lifetime commitment to helping retired guide dogs there would be someone petty enough to give it a thumbs down!

Absolutely delighted at the Supreme Court ruling.
The Named Person legislation is perhaps well intentioned but ill-conceived and is typical of an SNP government which always knows better and just won’t listen even to those, often experts in the particular field who although broadly supportive voice legitimate concerns.
The list of issues over which they have faced legal challenge and lost grows, and the amount of money they have wasted on appeals to attempt to “get their own way” similarly grows.
Sometimes the mature response is to say “OK we got that wrong”……….but that is a phrase I suspect we will never hear from the SNP.

Yeah! Let’s have a second chamber like at Westminster, so that when we vote them out the parties elect them to the second chamber so that they can continue to work against our wishes.
That’s one of the main issues we Scots have with the UK set up. We already elect Regional MSP’s in Scotland. Most voters were with the SNP but they need agreement with other parties in Holyrood to pass legislation.
The Tories and Labour are politicizing child protection, at least on this site. Once the courts have agreed on the finer points Scottish children will get the support that they need.

It is probably worth being clear that this will not stop it being implemented – it just means there will be some amendments to it. Amendments which could have been got to without a stack of cash wasted on legal battles if politicians could be a little more grown up and a little less obsessed with never admitting they don’t know everything.

Ok so this does not mean the Named Person legislation cannot ever be implemented, it actually means that if this had gone unchallenged the SNP would have pushed through legislation that breached the European Convention on Human Rights of its citizens… you could not make this up.

The judges also said that the specific proposals about information-sharing “are not within the legislative competence of the Scottish Parliament”… are they competent an anything …42 days to set a timetable to rectify the legislation, saying that in the meantime it “cannot be brought into force”… so SNP it’s up to you now to stop the breach of human rights via your illegal pilot scheme.
And to round this embarrassing SNP debacle up John Swinney had the gall to say he wanted Scotland to be “the best place in the world for children to grow up” doah’ fair enough and pretty obvious….but you kind of messed up by starting off by abusing their human rights…

And they would have got away with it if it wasn’t for those pesky kids…

(I’ll get my coat)

The extent to which it is defective must be marginal if it got as far as appeals to the Supreme Court.

Be interesting to see how much any revisions are actually material in terms of what is rolled out but my gut feeling is that they will be marginal and a lot of people happy at today’s ruling are going to be spitting blood.

What exactly are the information sharing provisions that are outwith the Scottish Governments powers. Are they within the powers of someone else?
It seems to me that information has to be shared if children at risk are going to be removed from dangerous parents and their partners.

MM, the Scottish government and that includes the MSP’s from all parties who voted for this appalling legislation should sit back and reflect on the fact that in excess of 64% of Scots did not want it.
Wake up and look around the world people are fed up with being ignored by those they elected, Scotland is a prime example where no one challenges because it is not tolerated, we have poor quality MP’s and MSP’s and need radical change along with the electorate getting a wake up call and putting a stop to below average performance all round.

The Scots are like bugs in a rug with their elected Government at Holyrood and their almost total takeover of the Scottish seats at Westminster. They have challenged, and sent Labour and the Tories on their bikes.

It “seems” to you MM that you are better placed than Supreme Courty to make a judgement on human rights eh?

Not a very good start for Swinney, couldn’t handle sheep and livestock payments on time…can’t implement illegal legislation ontime…and now has 42 days to come up with a plan to cover his butt…this is what happens when you give a country to second rate single policy local councilors…

When the Unionist dust or excremental discharge settles,do the thickest amongst us realise that the Bill WILL PROCEED.
Accurate Reporting of facts has never been a Unionist strong point. Lying is a given.

Of course it will go ahead in some form or other…nobody is disputing this…can you collective narcissists not read ???? anyhow I am just happy that the SC has upheld the European Convention on Human Rights…something the SNP hypocrites said recently the UK would government would give up ( given brexit) …anyhow, I leave you to your nat love-n with NCH/MM and wee Willie et al… bye the way the micro details of the ruling are in the Guardian…enjoy.

The micro-details are actually on the Supreme Court website where we can all see the full judgement and indeed a summary for the press.
From what I can see, not being a lawyer and having read it only very quickly, it looks like a couple of minor tweeks to the data protection provisions in the Act are all that’s required of the government lawyers who drafted it. The Supreme Court seem sufficiently relaxed about this as not to require the revisions to be resubmitted to them but to have that matter dealt with bya lesser court.

Rather than try and bulldoze the act through in a half hearted mightier than thou fashion…should one trick poney and her cohorts not have got their dictorial and invasive “flagship act” right first time around…?

you are drifting off topic Mr Mackenzie, do try to focus on the issues at hand and not the histrionics of a bygone age.
the scottish government are already running illegal pilot schemes built around blind ignorance of article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights of its citizens, you and I are paying for this illegal action, is this acceptable to you ?

Not another BT die-hard that can’t hide his anti Scots agenda. The Court Of Session give the Government the all clear. These Lords down South have picked a nit in their judgement and are asking the Court of Session to have another look at Section 8, or whatever it’s called.
It’s not going to make any difference, it’s going to happen. I suppose some find anything that attacks Scots worthwhile even if the facts are that the Scottish Government is taking a stance to protect children while the Westminster Government takes a stance to protect the abusers.

If you got blocked,Murdoch,I would wear that as a badge of honour. The Tory rabble on here show no restraint towards decency.
I appreciate your seafaring knowledge. Keep it up.
As for Scotland,we will return to Sovereignty shortly,despite the bigots and fools.

You’re a laugh. A minute.
Boris Johnson as foreign Sec. And you think you have the upper in any argument?
Sorry to burst your worty Balloon,but unless your High Priestess manages to get the Ukok back in Europe,under normal terms,there will,most certainly,be a Referendum.
This will happen suddenly and with little notice. No 2 year affair this time!

Once more you manifest your comprehension issues. Unless Scottish Govt has the required Act of UK Parliament to hold an Independence Referendum, then Scottish Govt would be attempting to declare UDI , which would be self defeating.

Nicola S is more cautious than her rhetoric, which has obviously whipped you and your fellow SNP zealots into an Independence Feeding Frenzy. Scottish opinion may have shifted a wee bit but not enough to make separation a certainty. She has indicated she needs to see a consistent 60% poll for Independence over a 12 month period before she will consider Indy ref(2). Independence is an even harder sell than it was at the referendum in 2014. Brexit has destroyed the SNP’s original shaky currency plan. The absence of a credible economic strategy is glaring when oil revenues are plummeting. Brent looks as if it may fall below $40. Funding Scotland’s deficit is UK dependent with by UK fiscal transfers worth more than 5 per cent of gross domestic product. To qualify for EU membership an Independent Scotland ,according to George Kerevan SNP MP, would have at least 5 yrs of self- inflicted draconian austerity (Note Kereven is the SNP’s member of the House of Commons Treasury Select Committee) .

The evidence of the witnesses at today’s special sitting of Holyrood’s European Committee suggests Brexit may be a net advantage to Scotland.

Not exactly what Nicola S wanted to hear.It would make any rational Scottish first minister pause!!.

But back to the Supreme Court’s Judgement,it now leaves Scottish Govt to try and make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear

AS, apart from your repulsive remarks I hope you have enjoyed waking to the results of the latest YouGov Poll.
I suggest the First Minister and all Scottish politicians sit back and get on with their jobs. The NHS and the Scottish economy top the list, Ms Sturgeon and her ministers have been warned repeatedly that the economy is failing along with our education system.
Wake up to the real world!

SNP has got themselves into the mire again, by ignoring the human rights of Scots, ‘oooh the shame’ as laid down by the highest court in the EU,Good intentions from the brownkilts to re-invent the wheel ? nae chance, expected left-wing extremist totalitarian MO I am afraid. Those boots you polished for the long march to freedom need re-souling bro.

It is not rocket science to work out:- (a)there is near as damn it NO desire for Indyref(2), (b)marginally more Scots want a UK deal with the EU rather than a separate Scottish deal with the EU and (c) however you juggle the figures, Nicola Sturgeon cannot be confident of winning any Indyref(2)

From all her pronouncements since Brexit, Nicola S conforms to YouGov’s finding that the largest section of Scottish opinion is that Scotland should wait until the UK’s deal with the EU is clear,
and then decide whether to have a referendum.

As Alex S has said EU clarity on UK’s deal could take 4-7years to be negotiated, any Indyref(2) could be a long time coming ,if ever.

Why would the UK govmt “Try” to get back in Europe ? the people have voted “OUT”… lol, a bit like saying Scotland should turn its back on the majority of its peoples wishes and say “OUT”… come on AS, whats your gripe with democratic process ??? is this the “normal terms” you refer too ?

Right wing fundamentalists and so called Christians based in Newcastle (England) wishes to ensure children are not protected from harm.
JS will do a wee amendment then the Tories and Liebour will have to decide if they wish to protect children or give a charter to abusers.
Some of the brexit nut jobs on here will vote with their venom.

I think that it is absolutely despicable that anyone should suggest, just to attempt to score a cheap political point that people who do not support the Named Person proposals “wish to ensure that children are not protected from harm”.
My views on the matter are entirely child centred and apolitical and I afford those who agree with me and those who do not the courtesy of assuming they operate from the same fundamental principle.
The opinion of Scottish professionals working in the childcare/education sector was far from unanimous on the matter but no one was stupid enough to suggest that those opposed were not equally concerned about protecting children. The discussion was about the best way to do it!

NCH, what has individuals politics got to do with this subject, the poor caliber of MSP and no second chamber has led to this mess, the next step will be to see how many teachers are prepared to be held legally responsible.
I suspect this has a long way to go and will do even more damage to the SNP.
People are waking up to the fact that they are being dictated to.

Dear Cheesy Wotsit the issue here is that if the Scottish government had been allowed to bulldozed this benign legislation through, it would have broken Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights. Is that something you agree with; yes or no ?

Mr Salmon, maybe they could deduct this figure from the revenue gained locally and nationally or perhaps deduct it from the wages of the local employees, maybe even knock it off Scotland’s share of national debt ? do you have agrown up solution as to what do you actually suggest ?

You nationalist folk, especially your popularist built cult leaders espouse a nuclear free Scotland, but the actual facts are that the SNP are a coven of hypocrites and supports existing nuclear power stations, their upkeep and their upgrade. You only have to look at 3 Mile Island/Chernobyl/ Fukushima Daiichi to know that nuclear power stations are far more likely to do us harm than a nuclear weapon, maybe the SNP government should be looking at potential risk rather than perceived risk. We have a two faced SNP Government which has a position which they think is populist and popular, to be anti-nuclear, but the hypocrisy is that they know that they depend on nuclear power to produce half of Scotland’s electricity. Methinks you are chasing the wrong fox in circles dear chap.

It is quite obvious Mr Salmon that you selectively read the FT, the rationale behind the Hinkley delay is twofold, one of national security and one of a commitment to the use of an French Company to be a partner (Ref; EU vote, in case you had not noticed) There is a rumbling in the “City’s” financial jungle that our PM is looking at options to raise additional funding from UK based investment, I say rumble because nothing is certain in such uncertain times. However, we can all be certain that your nonsense will continue to grace these pages and your empty rhetoric will continue to amuse those of even a modicum of progressive thinking .

‘Rumbles’ in the City’s financial jungle might need taking with a pinch of salt, for the culture in that jungle seems so heavily committed to self-enrichment that there’s surely little chance of interest in such a long-term investment as Hinckley Point – unless St Theresa writes an open cheque.

Was there any mention in the Supreme Court judgement about there seemingly being no independent appeals procedure incorporated in the Children and Young People [Scotland] Act of 2014 – apologies to Ms Krankie is there is one but I have never heard any mention of there being so.

A ray of sunshine indeed,Mr Kirk!
The figures though upon which this optimistic outlook as based are pre the EU referendum.
Since then, we’ve voted to come out of the EU; the PM has resigned, the Chancellor has been sacked, Liam Fox is in Trade and Industry, Boris Johnston is in the Foreign Office.
The Stock Market and the £ have been “volatile”. The banks have been stress tested and it doesn’t look good
The CBI have reported that manufacturers business confidence has fallen at its fastest rate since early 2009, and there have been falls in both investment and hiring. From surveys by Deloitte, the Institute of Directors and others there is general agreement that brexit will reduce economic activity. The Bank of England agrees.
HM Treasury have published a paper entitled “Forecasts for the UK economy: a comparison of independent forecasts” ( you’ll find it here: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/539316/Forecasts_for_the_UK_Economy_July_2016.pdf). It makes depressing reading.

Hope you took your brolly today AS… the rain must have been the reason for such a low turnout…. liked your speech…”Scotland did not vote to leave Europe, Scotland did not vote to retain Trident, and we want to show the powers that be that we won’t tolerate this” … which powers might that be ? one horse pony…anyhow I know Scotland voted to stay in the Union… but must have missed the vote on Trident… hows about we have a vote on nuke Scottish energy next ?

Karl, though I didn’t attend I did see the start of the ‘blue parade’ because the West Coast Motors’ Citylink bus from Campbeltown arrived at Hillhead just as the marchers were emerging from Botanic Gardens at 10.30.
There were plenty of them, and passing George Square on West Coast Motors’ (really) Scotrail shuttle bus from Central up to the bus station at 13.30 the square was a sea of blue and white, with a lot of EU flags as well.
But the highlight of the day – a bit like the Kremlin unveiling their latest nuclear missiles in (the real) Red Square parades – was the unveiling of Scotland’s alternative to Trident.
This was a piper, in great form, but with his pipes rigged as a multiple flamethrower (pointing skywards, of course).
I’m told that the occasional heavy showers were no deterrent, and he was still belching flames in George Square.
Probably required an EU derogation from all those pesky health & safety rules, but it was enough to make any aggressor think twice.
A.Salmon, you’d have been proud of him.

Robert,so glad you enjoyed your trip to Glasgow,And your unexpected glance of ,at least,2000 Saltires,which incidentally ,represent the Oldest Used Flag in the world.
Must have been enlightening ?
Ps. Same flag produced anything that is any use ,to anyone,today!

I wonder what our “friend” AS would be saying if the boot was on the other foot. i.e. The Yes campaign for independence had won by the same majority and the No campaigners kept crying foul and insisting on another referendum. Would s/he simply accept the democratic argument?

what are you worrying about? When Scotland takes independence you threatened to return home to brexitland. With all the others who threatened this, Baron Moan has left already house prices will drop! What a boost for local folk wanting new homes and the folk from down south who whishes to live in a progressive country which will work with the EU

Team GeeBee lurch from one disaster to another.
A least it’s better comedy than ” live at the Apollo”!
Warships,fecked- Car Industry Fecked, – Hinkley Fecked.
In fact,given that the whole of Team GeeBee has conspired to lie about the true desperate state of the economy,it gives me no satisfaction to say that all who read this will soon be cursing the demigods they once worshipped!

You have 2 aircraft carriers!
How many ships do you require to protect an Aircraft Carrier?ie- battle group!
Ukok has 19 at present!
Your expertise would be ungratefully received?
You are all being conned sideways!!

They’re not aircraft carriers, they’re Gordon Brown’s vote spinners.
You need naval aircraft and naval warships for an aircraft carrier battle group. We’ve got neither.
They should hold a national competition for the best use to make of them. Testing anti ship missiles is not allowed as a use, unless nobody can come up with a better idea.

MK, maybe they should listen to Mr Sillars who reckons the state snooper legislation will be as unpopular as the ‘Poll Tax’
The inability to understand the public’s anger fits with the arrogance of Sturgeon and her cabal.
It won’t take much more poor performance before she finds that it is her that is gone past her ‘sell by date’