Even if I totally understand that DoC is better in theory, the difference between HotW and DoC is quite low in the sims (about 500 dps last time I checked), and I'm not sure I could manage both DoC and the other spells. Tbh, I'm pretty sure my dps in raid is under my gear's potential, while playing HotW. I'm afraid of the fact that if I switch to DoC, it will be worse . Is this REALLY better in terms of DPS?

It is much much more than 500 DPS if played correctly. If you're talking about SimC when you say sims, the default action lists are somewhat on the basic side of things in order to try to be applicable to a broader audience than if they were doing every single trick in the book and trying to juggle a thousand things at once. Realistically I think you can expect DoC to end up without about 5-7.5% DPS more than HotW if both are played optimally.

(it's hard to put an exact value on it since significantly less work has gone into the modeling of the HotW rotation relative to DoC.)

Originally Posted by Syel

Oh, btw, I know that Thrash has a better DPR than Shred, and I'm using it on OOC procs and stuff, but is it worth keeping a 100% uptime on it? I'm not sure, that's why I'm asking here

100%? Definitely not, since you couldn't get that high with out severely harming your Rip uptime. It is possible to get 80-90% uptime depending on gear though with minimal impact on Rip uptimes which it is a gain, yes.

Basically if spending 50 energy on a Thrash means that you would cause Rip downtime you would otherwise not have, it's probably not a good idea. Any other time it will be a DPS gain to spend the energy on Thrash.

My guild is about to start Heroic Horridon and I was wondering about how others have dealt with the new mechanic. On the first page it is suggesting Vortex, FF, and Moonfire. This seems pretty good, but I was wondering if anyone had tried getting Force of Nature and setting Treants to attack the add. They are up for 15sec every minute, and attack a number of times which should back the add up enough space so that I don't have to worry about the mechanic at all. Has anyone tried this? Any suggestions for the fight in general?

My guild is about to start Heroic Horridon and I was wondering about how others have dealt with the new mechanic. On the first page it is suggesting Vortex, FF, and Moonfire. This seems pretty good, but I was wondering if anyone had tried getting Force of Nature and setting Treants to attack the add. They are up for 15sec every minute, and attack a number of times which should back the add up enough space so that I don't have to worry about the mechanic at all. Has anyone tried this? Any suggestions for the fight in general?

Unless your comp is ridiculously melee heavy you won't have to deal with the Direhorn Spirit until very very late into the fight (if at all). I definitely wouldn't sacrifice DPS just to get Treants, Faerie Fire does quite well on its own. Using a macro like this should make it mostly trivial:

You can replace your normal faerie fire spell on your bars with it, and it will automatically target the Direhorn Spirit on Horridon and Humming Crystal on Tortos, while functioning like normal everywhere else.

Unless your comp is ridiculously melee heavy you won't have to deal with the Direhorn Spirit until very very late into the fight (if at all). I definitely wouldn't sacrifice DPS just to get Treants, Faerie Fire does quite well on its own. Using a macro like this should make it mostly trivial:

You can replace your normal faerie fire spell on your bars with it, and it will automatically target the Direhorn Spirit on Horridon and Humming Crystal on Tortos, while functioning like normal everywhere else.

Awesome. Thank you for the help. Our group is usually just two melee, myself and a fury warrior, so I don't expect it to be much of an issue.

Unless your comp is ridiculously melee heavy you won't have to deal with the Direhorn Spirit until very very late into the fight (if at all). I definitely wouldn't sacrifice DPS just to get Treants, Faerie Fire does quite well on its own. Using a macro like this should make it mostly trivial:

You can replace your normal faerie fire spell on your bars with it, and it will automatically target the Direhorn Spirit on Horridon and Humming Crystal on Tortos, while functioning like normal everywhere else.

Unless your comp is ridiculously melee heavy you won't have to deal with the Direhorn Spirit until very very late into the fight (if at all). I definitely wouldn't sacrifice DPS just to get Treants, Faerie Fire does quite well on its own. Using a macro like this should make it mostly trivial:

You can replace your normal faerie fire spell on your bars with it, and it will automatically target the Direhorn Spirit on Horridon and Humming Crystal on Tortos, while functioning like normal everywhere else.

I'm guessing this won't work on tortos if you're also having to keep armorpen on the boss right?

Alright, Update to Heroic Horridon progression. I just want to make sure I'm doing everything I can to make this encounter possible for us right now. I've started pooling energy and Tiger's Fury for specific targets, eg. First of each big add (Sandwalker, Venomancer,) and the Dinomancer. I've noticed this lets me get Rip up and down each target much faster making the fight a lot easier. I'm looking for ways to improve my DPS otherwise and try to add some CC. What Talents are people using? I'm currently using Soul of the Forest for additional energy and Heart of the Wild for Uber Traq as raid survival and AoE dps on door 3. What do you all suggest?

I understand that we should reforge our gear to get 1:1:1 secondary stats with mastery being highest, but should we reforge according to our stats after raid buffs? For instance, the raid buff "Might" grants a flat +3000 mastery to our stats. So should we reforge so that our stats are 1:1:1-3000 without buffs in order to maximize our Rune Proc? I believe we also get a crit bonus as well, but I don't know the number off the top of my head, so should we take that into account as well? what about Melee haste buff?

TLR should we reforge to 1:1:1 according to character sheet stats after raid buffs?

I understand that we should reforge our gear to get 1:1:1 secondary stats with mastery being highest, but should we reforge according to our stats after raid buffs? For instance, the raid buff "Might" grants a flat +3000 mastery to our stats. So should we reforge so that our stats are 1:1:1-3000 without buffs in order to maximize our Rune Proc? I believe we also get a crit bonus as well, but I don't know the number off the top of my head, so should we take that into account as well? what about Melee haste buff?

TLR should we reforge to 1:1:1 according to character sheet stats after raid buffs?

It's interesting though, because according to my stat sheet, mastery is not my highest secondary stat. After I get BoM, my mastery stat goes up by the indicated 3000 making it the higher stat, and when I hit the target dummy, my Rune proc is indeed mastery.

So if the +3000 mastery I get from BoM counts towards determining which stat Rune proc's, then I can reforge into the other stats yielding an increased proc.

I'm fairly sure the Rune takes BoM into account when determining which stat to proc.

I can't link my profile, but as of right now my stats are 5811 mastery, 6244 haste, and 6029 crit. Last night I had a pally buff me with might and then went to hit the dummy. The Rune proc was definitely mastery.

---------- Post added 2013-05-16 at 11:23 AM ----------

Plus, isn't this why we don't use windsong? because we're afraid that the haste proc will mess up the rune proc?

It's interesting though, because according to my stat sheet, mastery is not my highest secondary stat. After I get BoM, my mastery stat goes up by the indicated 3000 making it the higher stat, and when I hit the target dummy, my Rune proc is indeed mastery.

So if the +3000 mastery I get from BoM counts towards determining which stat Rune proc's, then I can reforge into the other stats yielding an increased proc.

In terms of getting the right proc for bears it will be almost impossible to get mastery proc (not totally but well i dont go for mastery) cause crit and haste gets 50% buff in bearform which is lovely.
Catus has an option for reforging that makes sure that crit is higher than haste if you sometimes have to tank (which i sadly have to)
if you are having trouble with reforging for rune try out Catus!