The most Important thing you'll never read...

Thanks for the reply!
Good question and one on my mind also!
SS will run out at some point or be privatized.(or both)
I am preparing to take care of my elders myself.
(somehow, however we can. we are bettering our situation daily)
It's clear the economic situation may be out of
anyone's hands to stop it at this point.
Our voices do not matter.
We need to INCREASE taxes and pay down the debt,
but with incompetent crooks in charge it will just get
stolen anyway. Plus, I would be labeled something just for
even bringing that solution up! The only "solution"
looks alot like a crash. Either of money or will to correct.
The only good thing I can say is Obama is trying,
what he is really trying to do and what affect it will have
on the situation remains to be seen.
Without some hope, I'm afraid we have none.
I feel we are doing the wrong thing anyway with the
big banker bailouts but not my call...
At least the little people get 13 dollars a week more!
Woohoo!
P.S. As in all my posts, only my humble opinion!

Economies and countries are fiat to begin with. There is no physical united states. there is no physical trade agreements. there are no physical
aspects to these systems which are not fleshed out and built upon some imaginary conceptual skeleton, and because of their human (or at least not
Godly) design, they are short sighted and impermanent. They will always crash in favor of the natural laws.

What the heck did humans expect? This is most likely nature battling against an unnatural pathogen called "civilization". No debating about
constitutions....

If we listen to our wild selves stuck in these mental idea prisons, all we want is to GET OUT!!!!

Just wanted to mention something I see as pertinate.
The fact we have had either lawyers or oilmen leading
this country for awhile now. Except for an actor once!(go figure)
Doesnt that just about explain it right there?
Think about all the similarities to
the way the country has been going for about 30 years now!

Unless I need to point them all out...

We need people with OUR demands in charge, not ones
with a personal agenda, vendetta, or plain ol lack of
common sense. Maybe it would help if they we're one of us.
Just thinking out loud here, sorry I will get back under the bridge...

Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
What I am not certain I agree with is that there is genius behind it all. I think that greedy and unethical people with a lot of power can all act in
very similar ways without having a master plan. Sort of by a form of financial natural selective action. (ie; people who behave in x way tend to do
better in our culture than people who behave in y fashion, and over time, there is a predominance of people behaving like x in the halls of power and
privilege.) You can have people act in very similar ways without actual conscious collusion.

Oo, oo, can I answer this?
Bind the devil in hell for a thousand years so we can have some peace?
Sounds good. Maybe let him out after that for awhile to deceive again, then toss 'im in a lake of fire forever? What you got?
An alien conscienceness fix for humanity?

Hey whatever works I'm all for! Just throwin stuff up here.
People are starting to get freaky anyway...

Thats where we give up our sovereignty as a nation I think....
I wish I could find this, but somewhere I saw in the first
bailout was the wording of exactly that.
In order for the world to go along with our debt,
we agreed to give up our sovereignty as a nation!

F****** scary, but I can't find it so it is just a rumor.
My nephew has dreams of chinese troops patrolling our streets.
They keep telling him they are here to help, everything will be the
same. Dunno, just kinda weird.....

Oo, oo, can I answer this?
Bind the devil in hell for a thousand years so we can have some peace?
Sounds good. Maybe let him out after that for awhile to deceive again, then toss 'im in a lake of fire forever? What you got?
An alien conscienceness fix for humanity?

Hey whatever works I'm all for! Just throwin stuff up here.
People are starting to get freaky anyway...

Thank you for that, Doda. Come on....what if we live in reality? Now what to do?

No seriously I don't know. Thats why I'm just a funny peon.
I think we need to stay positive no matter what, if nothing
else for our families. That is kinda our responsibility I feel.
We know these things are coming we can prepare,
not everyone can.....
We have to learn humility and compassion, regardless,
if we are to survive as a species. IMO
Thanks for the posts guys(and gals)!

Yeah it's all scary. They are rioting in the streets in Europe due to their economy. These Asian countries who have been taking the outsourced work
from America all these years aren't getting orders anymore cause Americans aren't buying, those people are already borderline poverty. My brother
lost his entire life savings he had invested for retirement after 40 years working for SWB. In fact, he took a payoff option 4 years ago in a lump
sum rather than opting for a monthly retirement check, and, it's all gone, all but the small amount that was left which they went ahead and cashed in
this week. I just told my mom since her house is the only one paid for that we may ALL be moving back home (3 kids and 5 grandkids). She tried to
act as though that wasn't the most tragic possible scenario of all.

Thank you so much. Gee whiskers, your gonna make my head swell!
(big enough already)
I think I'm in pretty good company myself! Couldn't think of a place
where fairly like minded(open) people can gather and shoot the s***
about stuff that matters only to the survival of the human race, no biggie!

(at least not in idaho!)

Consider yourself as having just found a new friend!
I see we're neighbors so....you never know!

What we would have to do is first, recognize that what we have is the natural result of our own choices, rather than something being forced upon us.
When we make these invisible enemies, (like the Illuminati) we cant fight them. We cant find them to fight them. If we realize that it has been us
all along selecting for these types of leaders, we can make an effort to select differently.

We can choose not to accept benefits to ourselves if those benefits are unethical. (ie; not buying the cheapest thing if it has been manufactured by
companies with policies we dont approve of, or are harmful to us) We can choose to elect someone from a third party, rather than from the two
entrenched and virtually indistinguishable parties we currently alternate between. We can choose not to take jobs or work in fields, or support
industries that destroy the environment, cultures, people, and economies.

What we would have to do isnt hard. And it could be accomplished within a generation with no war. No violence. But it likely wont. Not everyone
will come on board at the same time. Humans tend not to work that way. What will make it seem hard is that there would be a long period of time
between when we began choosing differently, and when we began to benefit from those choices. The people who began choosing differently first would
probably suffer economically in the short run for doing so.

But we didnt create this mess over night. What we have has evolved out of thousands of years of selfish choices made by individuals. And it is highly
unlikely we will sort it overnight. The solution will also be the cumulative result of decades (at least) of different, less selfish, choices made
by individuals. The good thing is that we can derive benefit even by incremental change. It isnt an all or nothing proposition. We can make our
lives incrementally better by consciously choosing to select against the sociopathic. By not voting for them, by not fighting their wars, by not
supporting their companies by purchasing from them. If there are no truly unethical comanies to purchase from or work for then by choosing
consistently the least unethical product, the least unethical job. But to do that, we ourselves have to be willing to have a bit less. It is more
expensive to not to buy from companies exploiting cheap labor. The most ethical jobs dont always pay as well. It is disheartening to vote third party
and watch your candidate lose. But the more people who are willing to act this way, the more likely it is that the herd will shift course. Over
time, the companies that are more ethical will out perform the most unethical ones. And we will have a race to the top rather than a race to the
bottom in terms of ethics.

We cannot win a war against phantom groups we cannot even identify. And even if we could, if our own choices are what made them powerful, we would,
(like we have historically time and again) find ourselves with another group of sociopaths in charge after we deposed the first group. What we need
to change are our choices. Not in one magnificent coup, but in our day to day very mundane lives. We need to individually begin to embody the ethics
we wish to see in our leaders.

They say you cannot cheat (or con) an honest person. My observation supports that. People who are conned, are often conned by being promised more
than they know they should get. By thinking that they will be taking advantage of the con artist. Of course, the con artist knows this and is using
it to their advantage. It is OUR individual greed that leads us to support greedy leaders. And the solution is painfully simple. We need to be less
greedy ourselves.

Obama must dissolve Congress and the Senate. Elections should be held and people who care about our country should be voted in the new house and
senate. All of the office holders should be imprisoned considering they have sold out their country to gain wealth and power. Whoever the string
pullers are should join the ex politicians in prison. Politicians should answer directly to the people and if the people decide to re-elect ther
representative early then they vote on it, no waiting 3 or 4 #in years while havoc is wreaked. This includes Obama and the presidential seat.

We should institute a new currency and all existing money and debt should be wiped clean. All citizens should receive approximately $10,000 in new
cash, viable business's should be allowed to borrow operational cash. The printing of money must be kept track of and published to the public on a
steady basis. # any debt owed to any other counties PERIOD. No handouts to other countries NONE! If other countries want to join our monetary system
they must embrace it solely, and they should receive the same as us 10,000 each, business's borrow for cash flow. Any countries that join our
monetary system become our trading partners and no others. Any wars that we fight using our treasure and sons must have their rewards if won and this
consists of the spoils of war! # this rebuilding and giving back #, who the # thought that # up, hang the mother #er. If we kick Irans ass we should
own their oil fields and the profits go to funding our military HELLO! I could go on and on because I have common sense, unfortunately no one in
government has any left by the time they get into office.

This is our reset people, I can't think of anything else that is going to save society as we know it. It's either this or stock up on food and guns.
If my family can't eat it will get ugly before we starve; in addition the world will burn because you can control some of the people some of the time
but not all of the people all of the time. Regardless of what some people think of the mental aptitudes of their fellow man people are more educated
today than at any point in the history of man (that we know) and when you have a lot of very smart hungry and scared sobs # hits the fan. This bs
about camps and all that # is a joke we are not sheep not even #in close I say again no one should underestimate what intelligent desperate people can
do when threatened.

I honestly believe that the world is at the brink and THEY ARE LOOKING TO US FOR GUIDANCE God forgive us because we have idiots and bought politicians
calling the shots. Considering that all of these measures and incentives to bail out our economy will cost every american family over 100,000.00
dollars A BETTER DECISION would have been to give every adult 25k$ in two installments over the course of 1 year. Cease all unemployment, social
security and welfare for 1 year while the states rebuild their coffers. Americans would again start spending, manufacturers would step up production
and begin to hire and purchase raw materials. The effect would simply ummmmmm RESTART THE ECONOMY. People would have jobs and a few bucks in the bank
and presto they buy # every day without fear. In addition those couples losing their homes would be able to pay it up to date (if 50k isn't enough
they deserve to lose it!), auto loans paid up to date, personal loans PAID! Guess what banks get their money and DONT NEED BAILED OUT! If banks are
still in trouble they made BAD DECISIONS and deserve to go under. In addition new cars are purchased and presto car companies dont have to borrow from
the Government and on and on, Long Live Capitalism or whatever it is for a fraction of what is being proposed for a DOOMED STRATEGY that a fifth
grader would be ashamed of. Anyone in Washington smarter than a fifth grader? No? That's what I thought, what a SHAME!

They say you cannot cheat (or con) an honest person. My observation supports that. People who are conned, are often conned by being promised more
than they know they should get. By thinking that they will be taking advantage of the con artist. Of course, the con artist knows this and is using
it to their advantage. It is OUR individual greed that leads us to support greedy leaders. And the solution is painfully simple. We need to be less
greedy ourselves.

[edit on 23-2-2009 by Illusionsaregrander]

Yes but what you fail to mention OR perceive is human nature is involved in these situations. Human nature is very difficult to overcome and most are
simply unable. If you sir are able to overcome human nature then my hat is off to you because you are an exception.

The only reason in my opinion that the bible still makes sense is because it touches and is based on mans (includes women) human nature. The bible is
basically a reference for dealing with human nature during the course of your life. You must put others welfare before your own and such. I know much
more is involved in the bible but human emotions and human nature have NEVER CHANGED since Jesus walked the earth.

Originally posted by interested-one
The only reason in my opinion that the bible still makes sense is because it touches and is based on mans (includes women) human nature. The bible is
basically a reference for dealing with human nature during the course of your life. You must put others welfare before your own and such. I know much
more is involved in the bible but human emotions and human nature have NEVER CHANGED since Jesus walked the earth.

I wondered how long until religion was mentioned. Have you read Illusion's thread,
Religious Belief vs. Evidence?

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