theorellior:This just reminds you that the Founding Fathers, at the time things got interesting, were in reality the Founding Pizza-Faced Punks. And Franklin was their older enabler.

It's my understanding that there are two classes of "Founders" - the Washington/Franklin/Adams/Jefferson class, who were established statesmen already in 1776, and the Monroe/Hamilton/Madison class, who were their proteges (literally, in the Madison/Jefferson case).

And why wouldn't that make sense? In 1776, the former were in their 30s-40s, and the latter were barely twentysomethings (and they still had a war to fight). In 1789, when it became time to do away with the Articles of Confederation and establish a long-term system, it was the latter who were the foot soldiers in that effort, the former being the established politicos.

Sort of like examining the political players of the 1990s vs today: the Gingriches and (Hillary) Clintons and several others are still major players (some are still in government), but their proteges - Cruzes and RANDPAULs and Graysons and Weiners - were still in college at the time.

entropic_existence:Mikey1969: entropic_existence: Mikey1969: There are lots of moose in North America. In Europe, they're usually called elk.

So what are elk called? Because there's a difference here between a deer, an elk, a reindeer and a moose.

North American Elk aren't native to Europe.

Well, my point is that elk aren't moose... Even though Count Buffoon wanted them to be.

What we call a Moose is called an Elk in Europe. (European Elk). European Elk = Moose = Alces alces, they are the same animal. They knew that and knew they were referring to the same animal.

I guess what I'm curious about is how big the moose are in Europe if this guy thinks it was all just an 'exaggeration', because they're farking huge here. I would assume that they'd be comparable, and the guy would expect people to correctly identify them, since they have extremely unique antlers and are the size of a horse.

On a side note, I wish they'd sent him a farking bison, that would have proved that we don't have anemic animals here...

Mikey1969:entropic_existence: Mikey1969: There are lots of moose in North America. In Europe, they're usually called elk.

So what are elk called? Because there's a difference here between a deer, an elk, a reindeer and a moose.

North American Elk aren't native to Europe.

Well, my point is that elk aren't moose... Even though Count Buffoon wanted them to be.

Elk is a popular misnomer for Wapiti in North America. The first European who saw a Wapiti thought it was an Elk without having seen a European Elk for comparison. Things just sort of rolled from there. It's pretty similar to how Native Americans got stuck with being called Indians in spite of having nothing to do with India.

Fano:I like that part of the lewis and Clark expedition was to check if any mammoths or dinosaurs were still around.

After all, if God's Creation was perfect, how could anything go extinct? Maybe they were hiding.

It was Jefferson who instructed him to look. And while Jefferson was Christian he wasn't exactly into the whole Creationism thing. He just thought it might be a possibility that they survived somewhere, and as far as he was concerned West of the Rockies was pretty much completely unknown territory.

entropic_existence:Fano: I like that part of the lewis and Clark expedition was to check if any mammoths or dinosaurs were still around.

After all, if God's Creation was perfect, how could anything go extinct? Maybe they were hiding.

It was Jefferson who instructed him to look. And while Jefferson was Christian he wasn't exactly into the whole Creationism thing. He just thought it might be a possibility that they survived somewhere, and as far as he was concerned West of the Rockies was pretty much completely unknown territory.

I didn't know about that part of their agenda, but it seems like a COMPLETELY reasonable thing. That's a lot of gosh darned land.

It's like when Paul McCartney wants to write something boogie-woogie and comes off with the awesome piano on Lady Madonna. Thomas Jefferson wants to disprove some effete French snob, and leads America into hunting and celebrating not fearing nature.