quote:And you're what I call a hypocrite, lower case. Look, I make it a point never to argue religion, even on message boards, because all faith is personal and I don't seek to question anyone's faith and find it disgusting for others to question faith. So I'm out.

All well and good, but you're talking about moral relativism.

Catholics beleive there is only one truth, and that truth lies in scripture and the authority of the Magisterium.

If you are Catholic, there cannot be two truths (i.e. 1. abortion is ok 2. abortion is wrong).

If you are Catholic, you accept the teachings of the Church. Yes, it is pretty much a "no questions asked" thing.

re: Catholics should not pull for Notre Dame tonightPosted by Bayou Sam on 1/7/13 at 2:07 pm to UGATiger26

The second table of the ten commandments are not tenets of the Catholic faith...in other words, "not murdering" is not something you do based on God's authority, but on natural reason. According to Catholicism anyway.

To put this in other terms, if a Catholic came out and said murdering was awesome, it would be inappropriate to say he or she was "unorthodox". Rather, they'd be morally depraved or insane, a classification which would anyone of any faith, including no faith, would recognize.

re: Catholics should not pull for Notre Dame tonightPosted by Bayou Sam on 1/7/13 at 2:10 pm to UGATiger26

quote:If you are Catholic, you accept the teachings of the Church. Yes, it is pretty much a "no questions asked" thing.

The "teachings of the Church" are different in kind. Some are open to questioning, some are not.

It's also worth pointing out that actions are different than thoughts. So for example, Catholics can question the wisdom of their being no female priests, or the wisdom of priestly celibacy. But they can't violate in deed those teachings without being excommunicated.

re: Catholics should not pull for Notre Dame tonightPosted by UGATiger26 on 1/7/13 at 2:14 pm to Bayou Sam

quote:The "teachings of the Church" are different in kind. Some are open to questioning, some are not.

I was under the impression that abortion has been put to rest.

Evangelium Vitae.

If my understanding is unclear, you seem to be knowledgeable.

ETA: From the Cathechism

"2271. Since the first century the Church has affirmed the moral evil of every procured abortion. This teaching has not changed and remains unchangeable. Direct abortion, that is to say, abortion willed either as an end or a means, is gravely contrary to the moral law."

re: Catholics should not pull for Notre Dame tonightPosted by Bayou Sam on 1/7/13 at 2:22 pm to UGATiger26

I think there are in actuality very few moral questions (and even theological / dogmatic questions) in Catholicism that are really beyond discussion. This is one reason why Catholicism has such a rich intellectual tradition. The real controversy comes when Catholics actually, say, get an abortion themselves or authority figures within the church provide someone with the means to get an abortion.

On the other hand, it seems fairly certain on the basis of traditional catholic arguments that the pope and other catholic thinkers are on sound ground to argue that abortion is morally wrong. After that, there is another question--whether society should permit said evil to exist.

re: Catholics should not pull for Notre Dame tonightPosted by Bayou Sam on 1/7/13 at 2:24 pm to UGATiger26

quote:gravely contrary to the moral law

Right, this is what I'm saying. This may appear overly technical, but something in contradiction to the moral law is not something in contradiction to the faith. Moral law is supposed to be based on natural reason, and is applicable to all people, Christians, Muslims, pagans, whomever. The case of abortion just happens to be a very firm moral law, based on a very strong tradition and clear reasoning.

re: Catholics should not pull for Notre Dame tonightPosted by Vegas Bengal on 1/7/13 at 2:29 pm to BeeFense5

quote:How are you calling anyone else a hypocrite when you are the one admitting to blatantly disregarding church teaching?

The day I have an abortion (a physical impossibility) or the day my child is aborted, then I am blatantly disregarding church teaching.

Matthew 7: a “Stop judging,* that you may not be judged.b 2 For as you judge, so will you be judged, and the measure with which you measure will be measured out to you.c 3 Why do you notice the splinter in your brother’s eye, but do not perceive the wooden beam in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me remove that splinter from your eye,’ while the wooden beam is in your eye? 5 You hypocrite,* remove the wooden beam from your eye first; then you will see clearly to remove the splinter from your brother’s eye.

re: Catholics should not pull for Notre Dame tonightPosted by joeytiger on 1/7/13 at 2:53 pm to UGATiger26

"People who claim to be Catholic yet say things like "but I beleive women have a right to choose" have no idea how the Catholic Church works. "

I am Catholic and could care less what people do with their bodies or unborn children, that is between them and God. I just pray for those people to see the light and quit killing children. Love they neighbor brah (no matter who they are) I think you need some brushing up on the Catholic Church.

re: Catholics should not pull for Notre Dame tonightPosted by joeytiger on 1/7/13 at 3:05 pm to RollTide1987

I disapprove as well, but like I said that is between them and God. Eventually they will reap what they have sown, but while here on earth I will love them all the same and pray that they see the error of their ways. That is how I interpret my religion.