Kerrey's Online Learning Torch

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Kerrey's Online Learning Torch

Bob Kerrey has championed education throughout his tenure as a Democratic senator from Nebraska. He currently chairs the congressional Web-Based Education Commission, which is investigating how all students can benefit from quality Internet tools and technology.

The commission, which includes NetDay founder John Gage and other lawmakers and educators, will make policy recommendations to Congress and the president in November. Kerrey spoke with Wired News about the importance of enriching education with technology and how the government can help.

Wired News: How did you get involved with the commission? What are its short- and long-term goals?

Kerrey: The first involvement began just with my own efforts in education. I've spent a lot of time working, especially in the K-12 environment, trying to help teachers and superintendents and principals both get the money and the political support that they need to do a good job. It begins with my passion for education. I still think education is the most important thing that we do in the country.

The Web forces change on us very fast because it centers the power on the individual. That's what led up to my belief that Congress needs to take action in making some recommendations about how we regulate the Web. The commission voted on what problems we were going to try to solve, and one is the regulatory question, one is teacher training, and one is the digital divide – trying to make certain that all students have access to the technology.

WN: According to your Web page, you've been a pioneer in bringing online courses to high schools. What are the advantages of online learning over traditional classrooms?

Kerrey: Twenty-four hours, seven days a week. That's No. 1. You're not limited by what goes on in the room. Secondly, you get to select your teacher – you can browse the marketplace. Thirdly, although we're not there yet in any one of these areas, I think you can still get the interaction. You may associate with a class of 50, 10 students in California, five in New York, four in Florida, three in Michigan – your class may be not bound by geography.

I still think – in spite of (the) very provocative headline on this month's Wired (magazine) – I still think human beings are very much a part of this. Creative and complex learning, especially, is very difficult to do unless you've got a group of people together. But, you can easily foresee a time when, in relatively short order, it's going to feel like a person on your screen.

WN: Do you think all education will eventually be Web-based? Is it important to have a connection to a real classroom teacher?

Kerrey: For the moment at least – until all your wizards out there figure out how to deconstruct my body – the body matters, the physical presence matters. The smell, the touch, the feel, and all that you've got in that physical environment that you do not have on the Web. There's a lot of startling things that you can do on the Web that are quite impressive, but they're not like the warmth and the energy that comes straight from another human being, whether it's your teacher, or just classmates involved in a discussion.

Especially for creative learning and for complex learning, I think you need a physical group. I don’t think you can replace that physical presence with the Web.

At the same time, I think you can substantially improve the amount of generic or remedial learning that occurs, and you can rapidly begin to solve some of the more complicated problems that are going on away from the school. And I think you can do another thing which is terribly important, and that is to help a school district – especially some smaller rural school districts – have a complete offering of curricula that today may be difficult for them to do.WN: As you've looked into Web-based education, how has the thinking changed surrounding it? Is it a more viable option?

Kerrey: We quit worrying about input and worry much more about output. (We have) an opportunity to stop worrying about (whether) the teacher met all these requirements, is the classroom organized this way, have you used the right books – all these questions about the input side – and worry much more about the output. I'll give you an example:

Let's say that next year Sony PlayStation 2 does a strategic alliance with somebody and they produce a game. After you master the game, you know algebra. We give you a test, you take the test, and (the student) has now demonstrated that she knows algebra. Rather than trying to figure out is PlayStation 2 a good device, it's a good device if the student, in the process of playing the game, they know algebra. It's not a fanciful hypothetical. It's a possible hypothetical. I see this technology as potentially eating into what is currently entertainment playtime.

WN: How much input has the commission received from teachers? What are their goals and concerns about Web-based education?

Kerrey: We're receiving a lot of input from teachers and the biggest challenge to the teacher is, it's very difficult for a local school board to come up with the money to do two very important things. One is to help the teachers acquire the skills, and then secondly provide the small amounts of money to do research into the question: What works? And that's where, in my view, the federal government could play a big role. I think we can help by providing state and local districts with the money that they need to do both training, and research and development.

The next thing we hear is that they are in such a heavily regulated environment now, that they just say, "Don't put any more regulation on us, don't make it harder for us." Thirdly, they emphasize to us, "Don't go down the road of educational television," which was very disappointing. It produced more sleep than it produced enlightenment. It was a talking head up on the screen.

WN: The new economy is so driven by the Internet and epitomized by Silicon Valley. What can these private companies bring to public education? How can they help the commission achieve its goals?

Kerrey: I don't have an answer to that question. I tend to put it more to the private companies. I want to make certain that we get our regulatory environment right so that there's an incentive. So the private company says, "Hey, I can do that." Then I think we've got it right.

A lot of people are knocking on the door and doing educational work anyway, (and) we'd like to see more of it. It may mean that we need to provide some tax incentives for people to be able to come in and do partnerships, especially on the research and development question. But anything that we can do to create incentive-based partnerships between the private sector and the public sector in the task of educating our students, I'm for. I favor it. I think it can only be good.

WN: What will you do with the information that you receive? What will come out of this?

Kerrey: I think we'll probably harken back to the preamble of the Constitution and try to make it more perfect, rather than perfect.

I hope that the commission contributes in a positive way to the Elementary and Secondary Education Act (the law which authorizes all elementary and secondary education programs) and likewise, I hope that our recommendations in November will help answer questions about what can Congress do to close the digital divide, to increase the amount of teacher training that is being done, and to alter our regulatory structure so as to increase the amount of Web-based education that occurs in America.