The most accurate answer I can give is: as soon as the art is done... We started with all the largest art blocks and then will be moving on to the smaller ones. So the pace will increase as we get further along the process.

I'm hoping to have it out by mid to late October... You guys won't have to wait once it goes live because Lulu.com (the printer) prints on demand, so the CCD will be available at Amazon, Piazo, and all of the major book retailers can order it for you even if you're not in the USA.

I don't have a fixed price yet, but I'm confident that it'll be in the (USD) $15 to $20 range.

Just thought I'd share some of the art that will be in the CCD! These are gnomes in their natural environment... a lab.

I'll never forgive Hickmann and Weiss for turning gnomes into the comical creatures of 'Tinker Gnomes' so the CCD puts them in charge of steam and clockwork gear that actually functions...but the CCD doesn't go into much detail beyond the basic nature of Gnomes and I hope to produce a more detailed manual later.

I've spent the last 9 days fighting with the layout software, but I can claim victory!!! I finally stumbled across the order of operations necessary to allow the PDF bookmarks to post in the proper order. The first day was lost to researching the problem: only to discover that the manual and the help file were obviously written by someone who never actually used the software. They were detailed in their information on what each of the buttons did and both files were full of snazzy features, but... no where was the order of operations listed...

BAD EDITOR'S!!!!! NO BISCUITS!

To be kind, I can only say that the actual order of operations is so bizarre that it could have only come from the mind of a software engineer...

BAD CODE-MONKEYS!!! NO BISCUITS!

...but after 8 days and several failed attempts I have finally prevailed and now have a fully bookmarked PDF.

Now it's off to fight the Resolution Demon and figure out where my digital editing quality can be improved a bit. -----------

I also wanted to comment on something I posted earlier; as to the lethality levels of the core critters vs. the ones in my book. Sorry, that wasn't really the right way to look at it because the truth is... I (and any other Storyteller/GM out there) can kill off a party with a flock of ducks if I really felt the need and Critters, Creatures, & Denizens has its fair share of party killing combinations of mutations and creatures. I guess I've just been studying nature long enough to know that the only time that Nature does anything ad hoc it is when genetic code gets... mutated.

Lastly, I offer up the following links to my blog where sessions 20 & 21 show a pretty good example what a game can look like using the mechanics I've set down in the CCD.

Though in fairness, neither giants nor undead zombie giants or the dragon appear within the pages of the CCD. These creatures were constructed using a synthesis of the Core Giants and CCD principles. I'll see if I can get links up for those critters later.

This last link is to the sheet I printed out for use at the game, it even has the Hp I rolled for each... the funny thing is that several of the undead giants actually made their saves against the dragons breath weapon, but they still didn't have enough HP to survive even half of the damage.

And I thought the DCC monster stat blocks were too big . I am really interested in your mutation rules and such so I will be supporting this product but I could never use these monsters in my games if that is how they are presented. I like to run fast paced games and that is just way too much information for me to have to read over and check. That's not to say this should be changed, my style of gaming is just not suited for this product I guess.

And I thought the DCC monster stat blocks were too big . I am really interested in your mutation rules and such so I will be supporting this product but I could never use these monsters in my games if that is how they are presented. I like to run fast paced games and that is just way too much information for me to have to read over and check. That's not to say this should be changed, my style of gaming is just not suited for this product I guess.

I do intend on supporting this work, but I would suggest that not all of the information shown needs be in a stat block. One assumes that the DCC manticore actually has some Strength; it is nice, but not necessary, to have that information. I would just use the standard DCC statblock, and then add info in your text if it is important to the encounter envisioned. Normally, it matters little what a creature can drag.

Ouch! Sorry to say, but yeah, those stat blocks are just too big, and a lot of the extra information wouldn't see use in 99% of games. Even the layout doesn't help soften the impact of so much information. For example, why have two separate lines for the Critical Die and Critical Table, when you could've simply listed it like this:Criticals: 1d20 (DR)Apologies if it sounds harsh, but my first impression on opening the document was, "Is this for D&D3.5e?" As it stands, I couldn't use it I'm afraid.

Well, I've Always believed that one critic is worth any number of yes men or sycophants, so thanx for the input. I've been trying to come up with a good way of explaining my position... here is the best that I've come up with:

I consider myself to be a storyteller, which in my mind is different than a DM. I have chosen to render the critters in as much detail as possible because it will (I hope) satisfy other storytellers like me, and because it is the more demanding design requirement. This is not to say that one style is superior to the other, simply that storytelling (or 'matrix style play' as defined by chapter 8 of the "Campaign Sourcebook & Catacomb Guide"; TSR, 2nd ed) is a style with unique requirements to pull off successfully. Details are the key ingredient for this kind of storytelling: and there is no such thing as having too many of them. IMO, and if you'll excuse the pun, the stat blocks here represent the bare minimum necessary to flesh out a critter. If you look at the blocks you'll see that they break down into 3 basic data sets, what it 'is' (ability scores/ action die), how it manipulates the environment ('lifting and moving'), and combat statistics; and I've listed them top to bottom in order of their importance to a storyteller. Besides, the neat thing about details is that the end user can ignore anything that they think is extraneous, and jot down their own 'module ready' stat blocks based on their needs and not my assumptions about what constitutes said 'module block'. While at the same time, if the end user has gone through the full exercise in critter creation/ conversion then even if all stats aren't in play the game will still benefit from the cohesion my approach brings to the table. One of the things I know to be true is that what one person thinks is 'mission critical' might be useless trivia to someone else... and there is no way to know in advance how this will be defined by the end user. So I may as well write to the most demanding of the assumptions and standards in order to facilitate the maximum number of users. I do not expect the end user to use any more of whats written than they want/ need.

@ sheriffharry & bholmes4> Thanx for the support and recognizing the value of details!

Addressing some of the specific concerns:

@ Collin> As to the 'look' of the blocks, yes, they do resemble 3.5e and thanks for confirming that I got it right. There is a rather large (and growing) contingent of players and GM's out their of all types who don't know any other format and this is my way of trying to make them feel welcome now that they are in strange territory. As to your other point about not combining two related data points onto one line, well, this simple question has an oddly technical answer. The short version is that horizontal layout space is at higher premium than vertical space. Each stat block has to have one column to define the title and entries, and at least one column for the actual data. Believe it or not, adding even the few extra characters per cell can have radical implications on the number of columns available across the page; if I'm going to add more width to the table then I want that space to be describing more critters. Using this format was part of the significant savings in word and page count during the editing process.

@ RC> Thanx for your support! I have two key reasons for giving ability scores to critters:

1. any RPG environment can be described most simply as an attempt at modeling a real world environment (to the degree and tastes of those involved) and the most fundamentally important aspect of this model is the 'player character'; who is in turn fundamentally defined by its ability scores. IMO the only difference between PC's and everything else that populates a game environment is that I don't have much control over the PC's motivations/ goals/decisions. I also believe that within the gaming environment, a critter without ability scores is a 'non-corporeal' figment of PC's imagination. Seeing ability scores in the critter info was one of the things I liked about 3.x.

2. the mutations had to be written from the point of view that they would be applied to player characters... who are defined fundamentally by their ability scores. If I were to maintain a policy of 'stats are for players not monsters' then I would in fact need two systems to handle the mutation process.

As to needing to know how much a critter can drag... to me this is critical information that replaces the need for 'threat ratings' or 'CR' value for the critters. In the wild, most critters won't attack anything they can't carry or drag off into the shadows; pack hunters, spiders, wolverines, and the humble shrew being notable exceptions. If an animal is violating this rule it is a signal to characters that the animal is sick, starving, or (in FRPG setting) compelled by spell or technology into non-standard acts. Secondly, if an ogre has captured an adventuring party, tossed them into a hole, and placed a heavy stone over the entrance (a surprisingly common scenario) knowing the maximum size rock that could be used (ogre's lifting and carrying) becomes vital knowledge. Then it is a simple matter of adding up the collective strength of PC's to find out if it is even possible for them to escape on their own or if they must wait upon the next time the ogre removes the lid. From this decision the story will progress in radically different directions. If they possess sufficient strength then I have two basic choices as a storyteller: let them escape and revel in the glory of defeating the ogre, which could be exactly the boost to player morale that they need to get motivated. Or have them make a collective stealth check to see if their actions alert the ogre.

In the FWIW category, the entry for sprinting is how I determine who surprises whom. If PC has greater sprinting value than the critter: the critter is surprised. If the critter is faster then PC gets a luck roll against DC set by situation to determine if PC is surprised. Just something to think about.

Well, I've Always believed that one critic is worth any number of yes men or sycophants, so thanx for the input.

A commendable attitude. Valid criticism helps us grow. Keeping an open mind helps us recognize valid criticism when we are presented with it.

Quote:

@ Collin> As to the 'look' of the blocks, yes, they do resemble 3.5e and thanks for confirming that I got it right. There is a rather large (and growing) contingent of players and GM's out their of all types who don't know any other format and this is my way of trying to make them feel welcome now that they are in strange territory.

I would strongly consider discussing this with Joseph Goodman before investing too much time and energy into this format, if you have not already. Not that there is anything "wrong" with your goal, but I imagine that making a DCC product look like a 3.5e product may be antithetical to some of the DCC design goals.

Even with Joseph's blessing, I would strongly consider who you are looking to please. I suspect (although I have no real data to support this) that the format in the core rulebook will please more of the group who has invested in the DCC rpg. Extra data is good, but do you really want the person using this book to have to cull the data into a statblock? I would suggest an appendix of compiled statblocks, and making this appendix available as a bonus pdf to those purchasing the physical book. Why? So that statblocks can be cut & pasted.

Quote:

@ RC> Thanx for your support!

No problem. The DCC rpg community is a great community to support, and it really feels like a great group of folks.

I understand that, if you don't please yourself as well as pleasing others, a lot of the joy goes out of developing a gaming project. And who wants that?

So long as the money holds out, I'm purchasing everything that Joseph Goodman approves for licensing, so that's the bar you've got to clear as far as I am concerned. He hasn't steered me wrong yet!

Thanx RC, I have a green light as far as I know... Mr. G has seen an earlier version wrought with distressing grammar and an embarrassing degree of typos and while I don't like to quote other folks emails without their permission I think I can safely paraphrase his position having a lot of positive things to say and the mutation tables as well as the demons that I wrote are among the things he liked about the CCD, but had the same 3.5e reaction as the rest of you but was OK with me wandering off in this direction. I haven't been that quiet about what I'm doing, so if there was a problem I'm fairly certain that someone would've said something by now.

As far as the format is concerned... *sigh* Of all the things I expected folks to dislike... I never thought it would be the format. I suppose in the grand scheme of things this might be a positive sign. To answer your questions RC, I must say that my goal is to produce a gaming manual that can be used by the widest variety of GM styles. Specifically I am interested in the folks who have read the core rules and thought "This is great, but what if...". The reason the info is there and arranged in this fashion is to facilitate ease of use for the folks who try the optional movement rules I propose as well as having useful info like the critter's usual weapons, damage, and ranges and DC's for special attacks so you don't have to flip pages in the core rules as often. By this I mean that if a critter has spells or class abilities then you'll need the core rule book out for reference. Though I must admit that there were certain ubiquitous types of attack like 'trample' that ended up on page 14 of the manual because I got tired of re-writing these types of attacks.

Additionally, creating the file you propose is a rather large undertaking in it's own right. If I could fit 10 critter stat blocks on one page (not at all a certainty) it would still take somewhere around 40 pages to fully document all the critters listed in the CCD. And each entry would only be a stat block and a page reference... which would require you to have to juggle using both the cut and pasted version and still have the CCD open to reference the beastie's abilities and powers. Sorry, but that doesn't sound at all helpful. Especially since it would be far quicker to simply print the the page(s) covering the critter if you have the PDF or photocopy the relevant pages if you have the book and then use a highlighter. You'd still be able to use the other helpful features and have most of the information needed to run the critters special abilities from that printout/copy.

I would also like to point out that it took me about 35-40 minutes to create both of the giant sheets referenced in the links above by running the DCC version of giants through the conversions to my format, and then to turn those into zombies. I ran the two game sessions referenced above with just the core rule book, the battle mat/ props, and those two sheets of paper. I had my players excited, involved, and on the edge of their seats for the better part of 8 hours between both sessions. Arguably, I'm going to be the most familiar with the material: but in all fairness I'm also a dyslexic whose had double cataract surgery a few years back. My reading speed makes a snail seem speedy and from my rather odd vantage point, the format for critters in the core rules are naught but a jumble of abbreviations, numbers, and punctuation marks that are interspersed with some text. None of which is easy for me to interpret... and quite literally gives me an eyestrain headache that has on occasion worked its way into a full blown migraine.

Unfortunately this is not a new problem for me. The industry standard for modules for a long time now has been 'scrunched' abbreviations, punctuation, numbers, and scraps of text all written in a prose format. The stat blocks I developed for the CCD are really just extensions of the tables I've been using to make sense of the chaos for years.

Oh... And did I mention that putting that file together would take me at least 3-4 more months... not including editing and rechecking to make sure nothing got missed. ugh... nightmare time... sorry.

Thanx RC, I have a green light as far as I know... Mr. G has seen an earlier version

Good. I don't want to think of you toiling to be told "No" at the last minute!

You seem to be already very far along in this project, and if Mr. G. is happy, I'm happy. The next obvious question is: print or pdf? And, if print, are we talking POD? Because, if so, you can "update" to add the shorter stat block file afterwards, and anyone who buys now should be able to download it then at no additional cost. If you feel like doing that.

If I really like the book, the odds are good that I will produce such a file for my own use anyway, and, when I have done so, you would be more than welcome to include it as an extra in this way. That's not a guarantee....I've got a lot of projects on the go right now! Just food for thought.

Make the book that appeals to you. You seem to have a certain style and need to remain true to it in my opinion, even if I don't prefer that style. If I were to make a creature catalog my stat blocks would be even shorter than the ones in the DCC book, a far cry from what you made. The reality is you won't sell enough to justify trying to appease the rest of us and I would stick to what makes you happy. That way even if the sales are flat, at least you have something you can use and be proud of.

Good luck and I am still holding out hope I will find some gems that I can use in this product.

Make the book that appeals to you. You seem to have a certain style and need to remain true to it in my opinion, even if I don't prefer that style. If I were to make a creature catalog my stat blocks would be even shorter than the ones in the DCC book, a far cry from what you made. The reality is you won't sell enough to justify trying to appease the rest of us and I would stick to what makes you happy. That way even if the sales are flat, at least you have something you can use and be proud of.

Make the book that appeals to you. You seem to have a certain style and need to remain true to it in my opinion, even if I don't prefer that style. If I were to make a creature catalog my stat blocks would be even shorter than the ones in the DCC book, a far cry from what you made. The reality is you won't sell enough to justify trying to appease the rest of us and I would stick to what makes you happy. That way even if the sales are flat, at least you have something you can use and be proud of.

Well said!

Agreed, and I hope you took none of my comments as a call to make something that doesn't appeal to you!

I'm just catching up with the reading on this thread. Having read that your goal is to have Critters, Creatures, & Denizens ready as soon as the art is perhaps mid to late October, I'm wondering if things are moving along as you were hoping at the time of the post. By the way, I enjoyed the big table as I love information, but I can see how it may be cumbersome for quick draw DMing. Still there is always ways to minimize or reduce, (perhaps a highlighter might even work for the most relevant info). It's the adding on that takes the most effort and accuracy in my experience.

@ Zargon-Thanx for the support... and reminding me that I'm waaay past due for an update! As far as when we'll publish, well... the truth is I'm starting to develop a facial twitch when I hear the word 'deadline' or the phrase 'due date'. This is the first time I've ever tried to do anything like this. The process has been fraught with hurdles and the entire process has been a serious roller coaster ride full of interesting lessons.

When I was still searching for an artist, I drew out all of the 'art blocks' that needed filling and then made two tallies: square area, and number of drawings. This allowed me to get a better handle on what was needed, but it also allowed me to organize things so that we started with all the largest blocks and move towards the smallest. Things are going well and by both counts we are more than 50% done and that doesn't count the batch of art blocks that I got a couple days ago. Things are speeding up now but I don't know if I'll make my end of October promise, but we're trying really hard.

Right! Thank You Zargon! Thank you for reminding me to come up for air and let everyone know what's going on.

Contrary to any prevailing rumors, neither I nor my project have been eaten by mutant wombats! To explain where we're at I should explain the process a bit. It works like this... I send out 'scribbles' and idea sketches to the artist then he sends the finished work to me and I process it with some digital magic. I have a spread sheet that tracks the # of pics and the total square area completed. IN terms of the former the project is at 83% complete; in terms of the latter the project stands at 88%. I have one batch of scribbles along with a couple of pics that need to be re-done, then covers and this puppy gets tucked into bed. So... dare I make any more predictions,but I'm confident that I can bring this book to a close before the end of the year.

That's the good news...

The problem is that even if the project completed tomorrow, my printer has a 6 to 8 week lead in time before hard copies go out. It's in the fine print at the bottom of the contract. Fortunately I'm not locked into any distributing deals with the printer and may do my own parallel marketing and sales. My hope is that I can start selling PDF versions soon and set up pre-orders for the hard copies.

Of course... I've no idea how to do any of that. And there's where we get to the nub of why this is taking such a long time: you guys are having to wait for me to surmount the learning curve at each new phase of the project. I was deeply naive as to how much work was involved in something like this; I shouldn't have made any promises as to delivery dates... oh well... live and learn I always say. I'm trying to come up with a way of saying thanks to everyone for being so patient. I figure step one is to get the damn thing finished.

Hey folks the answer is very soon. We ran into some trouble near the end of the year. For the record, I was finished with the last edit of the manuscript by the 15th of December... then I got an e-mail saying that for reasons beyond anyone's control, the artist wouldn't be able to finish the project. We parted amicably, and I would heartily recommend Glendy's services to any who need a great artist. Since then I've cobbled together a cover from editing room scraps and have been diligently plugging in the holes from the missing art. Ironically, my first impulse was to just shorten the book by pulling the unfinished pages, but that would have made so much hash out of my layout that it would have created more work to remove the pages than to find something to fill the gaps with. Thus, the "Story-Starter" program was born... Little inserts that can (I hope) spur some interesting games/ quests.

I just finished jamming through the revisions and only have two small entries to tweak, but because of all the revisions I'll be handing it over for one final edit to make sure I didn't garble anything up by mistake.

My wife is doing the editing, and has to fit it into her work schedule... Then I'll be sending a copy into Mr. Goodman for a final review...Then I submit a copy to the printer for a review copy to see if my layout works...Optimistically, I'm seeing mid to late February.

I still don't have a final price yet, but all previous estimates were based on a color cover and B/W interior... now the cover is B/W as well. This will save time and theoretically allow a drop in $... I still need to crunch the numbers.

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