Questions from Students

If you were alive during the time of the Holocaust, would you have been part of the Resistance?I believe I would have banded together to help the allies defeat the Nazis and the French collaboration government.

If you were to have hid during those times, would you hide in secret or hide like René, by not showing that you were Jewish?I do not think I have the kind of personality to hide in plain sight like my Grandfather René. He had the right audacity and strength of character to pull it off. I would have hidden in secret.

Were members of your family sent to concentration camps?My Great-Aunt Fortuneé and second cousins Hélène and Maurice Brünner died in the camps. Friends of the family also died: teenagers Janine and Maurice David and their parents Camille and Joseph David.

What is the worst thing that impacted you because of the holocaust?I felt like I had to hide my identity because my mother was afraid I would be harmed by anti-Semitism, fueled by the fear that Nazi Germany would rise again, as it did after World War I.

Were you inspired by their stories as you sat at the dinner table?No, I was too young to understand. I had to put pieces of the puzzle together over the years, even into adulthood.

How long was Simone involved with the French Forces of the Interior?I do not know for sure. Certainly some time before August 1944, but it could have been earlier. She was still a member of OCMJ [L’Organisation Civile et Militaire des Jeunes] in May 1945 when parts of France were still under German occupation.

How many refugees did Madame Morali harbor at a time?Five to seven at a time twice a week between May 1940 and September 1942.

If you were in your family’s position, would you help the Jewish people?Yes I believe I would under the same circumstances, especially if I had a role model in the family to emulate like Céline had in her family—Marie-Léonie Vanhoutte, code name “Charlotte” in the Alice spy ring during WWI.

What inspired you to tell your story?When I visited my old school in Paris in 2010 I found the memorial plaque on the wall, acknowledging the murder of 120 of my mother’s school mates by the French collaboration government and the Nazis during the war, just because they were Jewish. That motivated me to research the extent that French Government and citizens collaborated with the Nazi regime. What I discovered was contrary to what I had accepted as common knowledge. I believe I owe it to those classmates who were murdered and young people of today, to tell the truth of how people behaved, both nobly and ignobly, during that time. And most of all I want to offer young people my grandmother as a role-model of courage.

If you had lived during the Holocaust would you have hid your faith to avoid punishment, or expressed your religion and accepted the consequences?If I knew that expressing my faith would condemn me to death, I would chose to live by hiding my faith. The Talmud teaches, “To take just one life, it is as if you have destroyed an entire world.” That includes sacrificing one’s own life.

Why would you risk your life to hide Jews? Why did Céline risk her life to hide Jews?Céline was a Catholic woman married to a Jewish man. She knew many Jewish family members and Jewish neighbors and was good friends with some of them. But she ended up helping hundreds of complete strangers. I think she believed it was her duty as a loyal French citizen to protect innocent people at risk of death. She had a strong moral compass.

Were people scared for their life even if they were not discriminated against?The short answer is yes, people were frightened at first. But as life normalized, many people felt thankful that they were not one of the discriminated and came to believe the Jews deserved to be ostracized and removed from their midst.

Were rations hard to live on?Yes, rations continued to decrease in size as the war years wore on. The Nazis were confiscating everything they could find and sending it by rail back to Germany to keep the German citizens and soldiers well fed and rich with stolen furniture, art masterpieces, vehicles, fuel of all kinds, rubber, leather, cloth, meat, vegetables, dairy, grain, gold, jewelry, everything they could lay their hands on. People in the cities were starving. People living in the countryside could grow and hide food more easily and were better fed, but there were shortages throughout the entire country.

Are you proud that your family saved lives?I feel very proud of my grandmother especially, but also my mother and her brothers. As young people they did their part, but grandmother risked not only her life, but the lives of her children. That took incredible courage.

If René could hide without hiding, why couldn’t other Jews?René had different circumstances than most Jews living in France. He was married to a Catholic woman who could support him with black market food, owned a country home outside the city where he could live, had never practiced his religion being a secular Jew, and had extensive experience as a soldier in the French Foreign Legion. Having been a prisoner of war in Germany, he understood how important it was to show no fear. He had grown children who could take care of themselves and did not need his protection. This gave him the freedom to take risks other family men could not.

What is it like to know that your grandmother was a hero?It is daunting to try to live as courageously as she did. I try to measure up to her high standard of strength and moral courage. She has also inspired me during trying times to buck up and be courageous even when it is hard to do. Her memory is a blessing.

Do Jews in modern day France have French citizenship? Yes, the Jews of France were given back full French citizenship after the war. Citizenship is granted to anyone who is an immediate family member of a French citizen: husband or wife and children. Religion is no longer a consideration for citizenship.

How did you find out about your family’s story?I used my memory of my father and mother and her brothers talking around the dinner table when they forgot us children were there listening. I also interviewed my older brother and my French cousins for their memories. After my mother died my brother and sister and I found photographs, letters, documents and grandfather’s Star of David in mother’s personal effects. But it was not until I retired in 2010 that I took the time to read and examine those valuable primary sources. Because I found out so much just by reading the documents and letters (all in French--mostly handwritten), I decided to go to France and do more research in libraries, museums and archives. I also found family documentation searching electronic databases online, such as the family connection with World War I spy, code name Charlotte, in the British spy ring called the Alice Circle. If you are interested, I provide some of those links on my webpage Links for Further Study.

Did your grandfather help fight the Germans?My grandfather René was not a member of the French Resistance clandestine army but resisted in a personal way by not wearing the Star of David on his clothing and by hiding in plain sight. Grandfather had been a soldier for many years, first in Algeria in the Foreign Legion and later during World War I in France, so he knew that fear was his greatest enemy. His way of fighting the Germans and the French police was by behaving as if he had nothing to fear.

Did the people who helped the Jews and got caught did they get killed too? If you were caught hiding or aiding Jews, you could be arrested and put in jail for breaking the French anti-Jewish laws. If you were caught being a part of the Resistance you and your family could be deported, and most French citizens who were deported died in the death camp of Auschwitz in Poland. It was dangerous in France, but not as dangerous as in Poland for instance, where people and their family members were often executed on the spot.

Did your grandma ever get caught, and if she did would her kids be sent to a death camp too?My grandmother was never caught hiding Jews or being a part of the Resistance. That was fortunate because if you were caught hiding or aiding Jews, you could be arrested and put in jail for breaking the French anti-Jewish laws. Her young adult children would probably have been interrogated by the police. That would have been dangerous considering their activities with the French Resistance--French Forces of the Interior.

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