IMO, hunters are very strong because of the ability to DPS on the move and the overall simplicity of gameplay in SV and BM (didn't try MM, so can't tell if it's just as braindead as the other 2 specs). Those 2 things lower the skill-cap of the Hunter class to a point where every single individual automatically becomes rather good when playing hunter.

What this means is that in mediocre guilds consisting of both good players and baddies hunters will usually be at the top. In strong guilds, where people play their classes at their best (or close to that), hunters have no chance to compete with OP classes/specs. However, affliction locks will be severely nerfed in 5.2, so I see no problems there. And arcane's DPS is easily ruined by movement, so they can't be top in all fights and actually have to be quite good to pull out big numbers where movement is involved, so I see no problems there either.

As for the lack of cleave - every class in this game has some weak spot, that's part of the class system, just deal with it.

How does the changes to hunter now where stacking up and movement fight does affect our DPS when we don't need to aspect change and no min range?

You can always run and still cast anything, and eventhough if you're low in focus, you can still cast Cobra while running...did i miss some mechanics that makes you loss dps other than you being MC, changing platform and Lei's hide?

to me, what you've said doesn't make any sense.

How does the changes to hunter now where stacking up and movement fight does affect our DPS when we don't need to aspect change and no min range?

Ok, I think I can decipher this a bit. I'll try to answer it in the best way possible. The poster I quoted said those were single target fights, but they didn't mention they had movement. I said that movement is a big factor in all the OTHER classes, not hunters (or locks for that matter).

Originally Posted by Divinespeed

Vizier, Blade Lord, Lei Shi (You don't cleave adds, pure single target), Sha (Till Heroic phase, and then hunters are praised for their AoE), Spirit Kings (The small times where there are multiple adds, again you should be bursting the low target down).

All these fights hunters stand a chance at competing in damage, assuming your raid is doing the fight the proper way.

Also, can we agree by now that nearly every post by Nemesis can be assumed to be void, ignorant, and flat out wrong? Tired of reading 100% negative posts all the time.

They were responding on a post that said:

Originally Posted by Nemesis003

there is only 1 flat single target boss fight in heroic raiding this tier. So by your statement hunters can be close to the top on 1 fight. Every other fight at some point has mutiple adds (which hunters are not good at) or other various mechanics that allow hunters to "catch up" because other classes are doing something else.

I was just saying those mechanics affect other classes not hunters, which would make hunter dps a bit higher on that fight in comparison to the other classes because of those factors.

Ok, I think I can decipher this a bit. I'll try to answer it in the best way possible. The poster I quoted said those were single target fights, but they didn't mention they had movement. I said that movement is a big factor in all the OTHER classes, not hunters (or locks for that matter).

They were responding on a post that said:

I was just saying those mechanics affect other classes not hunters, which would make hunter dps a bit higher on that fight than the other classes because of those factors.

IMO, hunters are very strong because of the ability to DPS on the move and the overall simplicity of gameplay in SV and BM (didn't try MM, so can't tell if it's just as braindead as the other 2 specs). Those 2 things lower the skill-cap of the Hunter class to a point where every single individual automatically becomes rather good when playing hunter.

What this means is that in mediocre guilds consisting of both good players and baddies hunters will usually be at the top. In strong guilds, where people play their classes at their best (or close to that), hunters have no chance to compete with OP classes/specs. However, affliction locks will be severely nerfed in 5.2, so I see no problems there. And arcane's DPS is easily ruined by movement, so they can't be top in all fights and actually have to be quite good to pull out big numbers where movement is involved, so I see no problems there either.

As for the lack of cleave - every class in this game has some weak spot, that's part of the class system, just deal with it.

you couldn't be more wrong if you tried... but then agian people who have no clue about hunters typically are beyond stupid when they try to talk about them

Wow, the first page is a spectacular example of people's complete lack of ability to grasp statistics. DPSbot is fantastic, as it gives a sufficient sample size and allows sorting to look at multiple conditions. What it doesn't do is allow you to cherrypick parses and say, "OMG my class needs buffs!!!!".

lol... BM opening has one of the most complex openings in the game... we are overflooded with buttons to press (even Ghostcrawler admits it) for a proper rotation and then you come along and say we have a braindead specs...

What's so complex about it? I see people saying it a lot, but the opening is pretty much a set sequence of abilities, there are no random procs to watch for and you're flooded with focus, so no resources to watch as well. You basically need to press some buttons in the right order and nothing else. If that's hard for you... well, I guess that's possible, but that doesn't mean the spec is hard to play.

Originally Posted by Nemesis003

you couldn't be more wrong if you tried... but then agian people who have no clue about hunters typically are beyond stupid when they try to talk about them

Yeah, I know your point - "BM is the hardest spec to play". Guess your hunter is the only DPS class you've ever played seriously, if you think so. I've switched from boomkin to hunter because the DPS/effort difference is huge between these specs. As BM I can literally pay no attention to what's going on, fool around all day long and my DPS will still be rather good. Try doing the same on any caster and boy you'll be amazed how shit your DPS will be.