The Victoria’s Secret might have meant to tease and titillate. It ended up sparking outrage among Native Americans for having model Karlie Kloss walk out wearing a headdress that flowed to the ground.

Photos of the Wednesday night fashion show were posted online and comments, mainly from the Native American community, followed.

In an article posted on lastrealindians.com , Ruth Hopkins wrote that the costume added to the hyper-sexualization of Native women. yea right She also said the war bonnet is considered, among her Sioux tribe, an honor worn only by someone who displayed valor in battle.

“We’re a people, not a trend,” she wrote. “We don’t wear costumes. We dress in regalia, and every single piece means something special.”

The Victoria’s Secret Facebook page has been peppered with outraged comments. Linda Kewanimptewa of Prescott posted that she was boycotting the store.oh please, don't stop bringing in your beads to trade. Victoria's Secret will go out of business without people like you. “I loved your stores so much,” she wrote, “but thanks for disrespecting my culture!”

A petition on change.org has asked the lingerie company to apologize. The Victoria’s Secret fashion show is scheduled to air on CBS on Dec. 4.

In September, the handbag and clothing company Paul Frank held a pow-wow-themed fashion show that featured plastic tomahawks. It apologized after complaints from the Native American community.

Earlier this month, No Doubt premiered a video for its new song, “Looking Hot.” It had singer Gwen Stefani wearing a headband and beaded dress and battling band members dressed as black hat-wearing cowboys. The band pulled the video down on Monday after receiving complaints from F.A.I.R. Media, which promotes accurate representations of indigenous people. Idiots. As if Gwen didn't make that look better than it ever has and do your image a favor

I am a real Native American, Fight for the rights of every man,
I am a real Native American, fight for what's right, fight for your life!

When it comes crashing down, and it hurts inside,
ya' gotta take a stand, it don't help to hide,
Well, you hurt my friends, and you hurt my pride,
I gotta be a man; I can't let it slide,
I am a real Native American, Fight for the rights of every man,
I am a real Native American, fight for what's right, fight for your life!

I feel strong about right and wrong,
And I don't take trouble for very long,
I got something deep inside of me, and courage is the thing that keeps us free,
I am a real Native American, Fight for the rights of every man,
I am a real Native American, fight for what's right, fight for your life!

Well you hurt my friends, and you hurt my pride,
I gotta be a man; I can't let it slide,
I am a real Native American, Fight for the rights of every man,
I am a real Native American, fight for what's right, fight for your life!
I am a real Native American, Fight for the rights of every man,
I am a real Native American, fight for what's right, fight for your life!

I think I mentioned this in a thread a while back, but the thing I don't get is why this was a one-way deal. Europeans show up and cough, and 90 million Native Americans start dying. But why didn't the Native Americans cough and kill all of the arriving Europeans?

And presumably no diseases went back to Europe with Columbus and John Smith and Verrazano and all those guys. Why not? Why didn't Europe take the same disease beatdown that the Native Americans took? Was it just sheer luck? Did the Viking expeditions somehow inoculate Europeans? And why didn't the Vikings start the North American plague? Or is it possible that something like the Black Plague was carried from America with the Vikings and nailed the white folk 200 years earlier?

The book Guns, Germs and Steel is really good (Pulitzer-winning good, actually) about explaining this. The short version is that it goes back to the diversity of plant and animal life in Europe/Asia/Africa, due to the shape of the continents; crops that were feasible in India could be transported to China and Turkey and Italy and Spain, and be feasible there as well because they were all at about the same latitude. In America, you didn't have this; a crop feasible in Peru could be transported to Panama or Argentina, but the latitude difference meant it likely wasn't as feasible in those new places. Hence, less diversity.

Diversity in crops meant better farming. Better farming meant fewer farmers were needed to feed a city. Fewer farmers meant more administrators, priests, artisans, and engineers. More of all of them meant more innovation. More innovation led to steel, firearms, ships, sextants, and advanced forms of government. All of that stuff led to the Europeans sending ships to America, rather than vice versa.

Diversity also lead to Europeans/Asians/Africans being exposed to a much, much wider variety of plant-born and animal-spread diseases, and therefore developing natural resistances to them. Native Americans, having a much narrower range of flora and fauna, didn't develop that. As someone else pointed out, these germs ran wild in America once they were introduced, and killed something like 95% of the Natives before the Europeans even landed in force. It was pretty brutal, but also unintentional - the follow-ups, however, were both brutal and very intentional.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rain Man

It seems to me, though, that the Native Americans were too decentralized. Defeating 90 million Native Americans would be very tough, but I don't think that's the war. I think the war is defeating one tribe and then moving on to the next one. It seems like the eastern tribes would work together, but I don't think the western tribes did much of that at all, and they certainly wouldn't send troops east.

It seems like the Native Americans' best chances would be that the eastern tribes would ally and stop the Europeans at the beaches. If they got past the eastern tribes, I think they'd roll west to the sea like Sherman.

If there were twenty or fifty times as many Natives as there were, I don't see the Plymouth colony surviving King Phillip's War, or the Pequot Uprising. The Iroquois Confederacy would rule for a long time. The best place for a continued European settlement would be Maryland or Virginia, which was mostly inter-tribal swampland.

The Europeans probably would never penetrate past the Appalachians, and if they did, they would never in a million years be able to maintain a supply line across the Great Plains. It would be *teeming* with Natives, and given the expertise the plains tribes developed with horses once they got them, the Europeans would be helpless against the lightning raids.

Now imagine it as black, Latino, Asian, Jewish, Arabic, or any other nationality in the world. How do you think members of that nationality would react?

Thats all true... if it were some bucktoothed, subserviant looking charlie chan oriental with thick glasses, or a hooknosed jew holding a bag, a cow towing slave, gun toting latinos or arabs etc... it would be blasted and decried in the media throughout the ages.

Agreed on ALL of that, but please dont come after the Chiefs name ... Together Is Powerful.

No, I have no more a problem with the Chiefs than I do with the Kings; the Braves is no worse than the Rangers; and the Seminoles and Blackhawks are no more problematic than the Vikings or Celtics. It's one thing to be sensitive to their plight, but it's another to try and pretend that they don't exist, or that they aren't a fundamental part of our nation.

The only ones that I know that cross the line are the Indians mascot and the Redskins name, and they cross waaaaay over it.

Well, it could be regional. I was born in Virginia. We moved to Texas the Summer before I started elementary school, I did not go to kindergarten or day care. We moved back to Virginia the Summer before I started Jr. High School. I moved to Colorado during High School. I think that gave me an atypical education and made me more aware of prejudice that might otherwise have gone unnoticed.

Virginia: The Pilgrims created our country with the help of the Founding Fathers. Along the way we showed the Indians how to bathe and act like civilized men. Afterwards, the state of Virginia defeated the British.

Texas: Texas was already here. It's always been here. By the time the Easterners made it out this far we had already killed off all of our Indians and were busy eating cows and killing Spaniards/Mexicans.

Colorado: Well, yeah, what we did to the Indians was pretty ****ed up. But it's not like we're going to stop here and give all of their shit back. We kept some of their stuff around. You can go see it.

Born and raised in Williamsburg. I understood exactly what you were saying.