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League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

League of Legends XXX:Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

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Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

LGBTitPSupporterIn a Wonderland they lie, Dreaming as the days go by, Dreaming as the summers die - Ever drifting down the stream - Lingering in the golden gleam - Life, what is it, but a dream?- Lewis Carroll

Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

I got 77 I think.
I forgot a lot of characters who I don't really care about but I also somehow forgot Malzahar and Talon (JUNGLE TALON MAN) and Trundle.

Also I am interested in what people think of my ward rework, it was at the end of the last thread in an edit so:
also I was thinking, right this is how wards should word:
Sight/Vision Ward duration scales with gold value of your items, starting at one minute, +15 seconds or so per thousand gold's worth of items you have.

Wriggle's Lantern no longer grants a ward. Zhonya's Ring was split into Hat/Hourglass because it was the most powerful offensive and the most powerful defensive item, so why on earth does Wriggle's still have that?

New items
Vision Beacon: to deal with pesky stealthies, this is like a ward, and reveals stealth, but doesn't grant vision by default, so to get use out of it you need to pop it down somewhere where you already have vision, or drop CVs/Hawkshots/Mushrooms/Sight Wards on it. The reason you'd ever want this over a vision ward is that it lasts three minutes by default, I thought it was kind of unfair and maybe made Eve/Twitch/Shaco a bit OP if you couldn't antistealth them as easily with wards.

Regrowth Pendant + Amplifying Tome -> Everburning Torch. Some stats, and the old active from Wriggle's (except the ward scales with gold now)

Mana Manipulator + Null Magic Mantle -> Yordle Backpack. Stats, the mana manip aura, and UNIQUE PASSIVE: this item stores one stack of consumables. The first consumable you buy after this item will be put into the backpack. UNIQUE ACTIVE: use one of the consumables in the backpack.

BANG → !OH LOOK AT HER/.../YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN/YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN/YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN MEAN/RICHARDS

Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

Originally Posted by Dogmantra

Ward Stuff.

It's interesting, but I *really* dislike it. Supports are the common ward purchasers, and scaling wards with gold means that supports have to buy MORE of them to achieve the same effect, and with a 1 minute duration they're not very good at protecting against ganks, meaning that lanes will play even more passively than they do now.

Wards now absorb a much large portion of a team's gold, reduction incentives to purchase them.

The only good fix would be to have SEVERAL items granting extra wards, and design those items to synergize well with support characters, which I'm not convinced you've managed to do with your suggestions. It's a start, but the items aren't quite useful enough for what becomes a mandatory purchase.

Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

Originally Posted by Dogmantra

I got 77 I think.
I forgot a lot of characters who I don't really care about but I also somehow forgot Malzahar and Talon (JUNGLE TALON MAN) and Trundle.

Also I am interested in what people think of my ward rework, it was at the end of the last thread in an edit so:
also I was thinking, right this is how wards should word:
Sight/Vision Ward duration scales with gold value of your items, starting at one minute, +15 seconds or so per thousand gold's worth of items you have.

Wriggle's Lantern no longer grants a ward. Zhonya's Ring was split into Hat/Hourglass because it was the most powerful offensive and the most powerful defensive item, so why on earth does Wriggle's still have that?

New items
Vision Beacon: to deal with pesky stealthies, this is like a ward, and reveals stealth, but doesn't grant vision by default, so to get use out of it you need to pop it down somewhere where you already have vision, or drop CVs/Hawkshots/Mushrooms/Sight Wards on it. The reason you'd ever want this over a vision ward is that it lasts three minutes by default, I thought it was kind of unfair and maybe made Eve/Twitch/Shaco a bit OP if you couldn't antistealth them as easily with wards.

Regrowth Pendant + Amplifying Tome -> Everburning Torch. Some stats, and the old active from Wriggle's (except the ward scales with gold now)

Mana Manipulator + Null Magic Mantle -> Yordle Backpack. Stats, the mana manip aura, and UNIQUE PASSIVE: this item stores one stack of consumables. The first consumable you buy after this item will be put into the backpack. UNIQUE ACTIVE: use one of the consumables in the backpack.

This wouldn't work for several reasons. The main reason being that wards are bought the entire game. So having nerfed wards early game means you are going to be spending more gold on wards than before (and perhaps more importantly porting more often). This would not encourage buying more items.

The second being that somebody is always going to be getting less farm no matter what. There are 5 champions on a team and 4 sources of gold and experience (Top, Mid, Bot lane, and jungle). If you try and share farm bottom, then both characters will be underfarmed. 0cs exists for a reason. You can't get rid of it. Take your gold seals and quints, build your philo stone and accept it, (or play something super aggressive and get mass kills and build 4 wriggles).

Edit: Djinn so ninja.

Last edited by Mtg_player_zach; 2012-02-08 at 12:12 PM.

Originally Posted by Rutskarn

That's the kind of beard that says, "I'm rugged enough not to shave, but have good enough genetics/grooming habits that I can not consequentially look like a mountain rapist."

Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

Originally Posted by Djinn_in_Tonic

It's interesting, but I *really* dislike it. Supports are the common ward purchasers, and scaling wards with gold means that supports have to buy MORE of them to achieve the same effect, and with a 1 minute duration they're not very good at protecting against ganks, meaning that lanes will play even more passively than they do now.

It should mean that nofarm support dies a well deserved death, which is what I think needs to happen. I think it helps to emphasise that if you're going to ward it should be a team effort. And it encourages quality of warding over quantity.

Plus, I disagree that the lanes will play more passively. I think that wards in a lot of cases are just a crutch for subpar map awareness, especially during mid-late laning phase. I find that putting a ward in the bush or river ends up teaching players to rely on that ward too often in a lot of cases. I think it's better if you pay attention to other lanes and the jungler since it's a) free and b) teaches better map awareness. If you see the jungler just attempted to gank bottom (and you should see this more often because ganking should be easier when there are fewer wards) then you can afford to push up a bit, play more aggressively, or go for a kill without fear. That's just one of the ways that better map awareness covers for lack of wards. There are a couple of situations where warding is going to be better than analysis of your opponents' actions, but they're surprisingly rare. Try playing a few games where no-one's allowed to ward (minus free ones off Wriggle's, no point wasting it) but you have to communicate health totals of your opponents, how they left the lane if they're missing, mention every time you spot the jungler, sometimes go and check out his camps to see if he's been there recently. You'd be surprised how easy it is to not get ganked.

Doubleplus those changes should also kill the ol' ward in bottom bush which I also despise.

EDIT: I think a big part is how differently we look at the game though.

Last edited by Dogmantra; 2012-02-08 at 12:41 PM.

BANG → !OH LOOK AT HER/.../YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN/YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN/YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN MEAN/RICHARDS

Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

I guess ill just repeat this since it apperently got overlooked.

Lord_khaine got a smurf on the NA server by the creative name of Lordkhaine.

Anyway, the trouble with not having wards around is that map awareness can only take you so long, especaly when the enemy has a member who are permanently lurking in the jungle doing gods know what to the poor local wildlife.

Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

It should mean that nofarm support dies a well deserved death, which is what I think needs to happen. I think it helps to emphasise that if you're going to ward it should be a team effort.

Well, yes. But I don't think a mandatory Map Awareness Tax solves the problem well at all. Honestly, either a change in last-hitting mechanics or a strong increase in the team value of support items would be my recommended ways to lessen the 0cs game.

And it encourages quality of warding over quantity.

Not exactly. Warding is *really* strong, so having wards up as often as possible is a good thing. Wards lasting for short times encourages quantity even more than now...for the same coverage, I have to buy three times as many.

Plus, I disagree that the lanes will play more passively. I think that wards in a lot of cases are just a crutch for subpar map awareness, especially during mid-late laning phase.

Only partly true. They *can* be a crutch for weaker players, but they're also a huge boon and a tactical advantage for players who already have strong map awareness. I have pretty good map awareness, but I still love having wards on the map, because they give me EXTRA information, and information on your enemy's movements wins games.

Try playing a few games where no-one's allowed to ward (minus free ones off Wriggle's, no point wasting it) but you have to communicate health totals of your opponents, how they left the lane if they're missing, mention every time you spot the jungler, sometimes go and check out his camps to see if he's been there recently. You'd be surprised how easy it is to not get ganked.

I have.

And it's easy to not get ganked. But it's easier and allows me to play more aggressively when I have not only my own awareness and prediction abilities, but also actual visual information on my enemy's locations and movements. I like being able to tactically ward dragon, Red, and Blue to promote invasions and fights, and being able to ward key map locations to see enemy movement. It's a huge part of the game, and I don't think your proposed change will make wards at ALL valuable early-game.

EDIT: I think a big part is how differently we look at the game though.

Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

Originally Posted by Dogmantra

I think that wards in a lot of cases are just a crutch for subpar map awareness, especially during mid-late laning phase. I find that putting a ward in the bush or river ends up teaching players to rely on that ward too often in a lot of cases. I think it's better if you pay attention to other lanes and the jungler since it's a) free and b) teaches better map awareness.

Originally Posted by Dogmantra

If you see the jungler just attempted to gank bottom

While this is certainly true to a certain extend, wards are still more potent in the hand of 'better' players (for example, see any professional tournament - top uses 1 ward, mid usually 2, bot has also 1-2). Additionally most aggression happens from the party that has the superior vision (if you know there is a weakness, you attack. If you are not certain, you probably wont risk a death).

A good example of this is Rammus - his ability to gank while mostly ignoring wards is one of his main strenghts and forces players to play more defensively. If any jungler had that strenght by virtue of no wards being present, everybody would be forced into a more defensive role.

If you would remove the vision from any lane, it would force the player(s) there to be more passive, as they lack most intel. Additionally a lack of (or reduction in quantity of) wards would probably mean that CV would become even more important, an issue that has been addressed lately. Reversing that could in the worst case scenario also mean that top lanes need to sport an additional CV...

If anything, a cost increase in ward cost (or any nerf of their functionality) will probably increases the burden on support players in most higher level game..

Originally Posted by Dogmantra

sometimes go and check out his camps to see if he's been there recently

I really cant see that happening much, especially if there are no wards - if you are on your lane, everybody knows when you leave, which sets you up nicely for the jungler waiting at said camp with the player(s) from the closest lane...

What really needs to happen in the warding game though is the split of Wriggles from its active - perhaps putting it on a new item with pure support stats (maybe GP/5 + some weak regen for each nearby allied champion, built from Rejuvenation Bead and Faerie charm).

The weak regeneration if solo would keep most other players from buying it, and if it builds into nothing, its not as interesting as Philo or HoG for them.

In either case, current Wriggles has become such a standard item on so many characters (current metagame has up to three Wriggles in one team (Top, Jungle, Carry), it deserves a nerf...

Originally Posted by Eurus

Heh, what if Clairvoyance revealed wards?

I would fully support that, except maybe putting it on an underused summoner, such as the old Rally (making it a short timed pink ward in addition to its old abilities or such).

Re: League of Legends XXX: Must be Summoner Level 18 to View

So Xypherous is openly talking about the new champions abilities on the LoL forum. Apparently plays like Amumu/Leona, is AP, and will be played as a jungler.

He is an old sailor that uses an anchor for a weapon. Abilities known so far:

Q: Launches the Anchor. Pulls himself towards any terrain hit. If he strikes an enemy, he pulls himself towards the enemy while pulling the enemy towards him. kind of like a mix of Amumu and Blitz Q.

W: Some form of shield that makes people not want to hit you.

E: Slow version of Tidehunter's ult, keeping enemies close to you unless they choose to run and get cc'd by the spikes.

R: Homing tidal burst that travels up to a maximum amount of time towards a target/until it hits the target. blows up things it hits along the way, blows up and stuns on impact of actual target.

On how he is going to play:

Spoiler

Show

..Hm...

His Q is halfway between Amumu and Blitzcrank, but based on the range it will feel more like one or the other. Since it has a minimum drag distance for the opponent, up close, you can reset an enemy's position if they escape. Far away though, you'll move much farther to them.

It has the added dimensionality of interacting with terrain, which means his gameplay is much more straightforward - he's not going to ambush you from behind a wall - because he can't shoot through the wall. He's going to come rushing out and attempting to hook you or aim it so that he can hit guaranteed terrain behind you.

His passive gives him a heavy incentive to switch targets in a fight - and his shield, if used in the right time in a fight, will add heavy DPS incentives if he's ignored. His initiation is more reliable but less controlled - so, a quick hookshot into an ultimate can ambush unwary foes. There's some interesting play patterns here. His overall theme is delayed but powerful effects.

A lot of the challenge of this guy was properly conveying the heft, size, and power that he looks like he has - which meant trying to find delayed effects that also feel gratifying and powerful.