Black Talon

This is a discussion on Black Talon within the Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Is the Ranger T the same as the old Black Tallon, would this be a good defence round for a Springfield NM. in a 200 ...

I remember the old media frenzy when Black Talons became popular. The media made them seem that they were more powerful than a neutron bomb. Here's a Wikipedia link for the evil Black Talonhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_talon.

I like the .45 230g Ranger-T +P. It shoots accurately and feeds reliably. Current production is about the 3rd generation of this bullet, and probably the best yet. For pix of expanded bullets and expansion and penetration data:

I use the 180gr Ranger T. I think it is about the 3rd gen for this projectile. It's more PC without the "deadly" lubalox coating on the jacket. Interestingly enough, the Winchester Supreme ammo in 7mm Rem Mag that I hunt with still has this "deadly" coating.

Anyway, here is a pic of the newest stuff. There was a release in between that was labeled the Ranger SXT, which some rumored to say stood for "Same eXact Thing," but I believe Winchester labeled it as Supreme eXpansion Technology. If you can get your hands on some of it, go for it. It shoots great IMO.

I'd sure hate to be the person who used Black Talons for a shooting. There is just enough histeria remembered over that name that some reputation hungry ADA just might decide to give it a shot just on the name alone theory. Not saying it was or is a bad round, just that there are plenty of other rounds as good or better without the negative association. Last I heard the IALEFI did a survey and found no agency that issued or approved the Black Talon round, and had found a some (stupid chiefs IMO) who had banned it from carry.

I was refering to the origional ammo that is labeled "Black Talon". The Ranger though similar is different (and better) and from what I hear is a fine carry ammo. The only issue I have with the Black Talon is that a person risk being guilty of name association.

I (unfortunatly) know a few ADAs who would love nothing better than to do a press confrence saying that they are prosecuting a "Black Talon shooter" for manslaughter. Why manslaughter? Simple answer (scary but they do think this way).
#1. Manslaughter is easier for jury to bite than a murder charge.
#2. Manslaughter actually captures more attention in the press.
#3. Most people (real honest people who care) pay less attention to a news story about manslaughter than they do murder.

personal defense ammo has come far in the last 30 years, and it's been 15 since BT has been available... I'm sure anything new feeds better and expands better.

Honestly, I'd take my chances carrying KTW or Velet over Black Talon. "KT-What? Vel-who? Never hearda them" Heh I went looking for my BT and found some other oddball ammo including KTW and Velet :) I've got to bring the cam home someday and
grab some pics for the new guys.