The Family (Or most of them)

The Family

May 7, 2007

Air India and other disasters

How many times have we heard it now -- that our police, our justice officials, our "intelligence," knew something was coming down or could come down -- and they did nothing about it?We are like helpless ants, living our lives and walking on the sidewalk, oblivious to the gigantic threat above our heads that could walk on us and squish us in a nano-second.And that's what has happened, continually, if you think about it.

This is some of the left-over debris from the 1985 Air India terrorist attack on a plane in Canada that killed 329 passengers who were headed to India.

And the Canadian "intelligence" knew it was coming.

We all know what this is -- it's 9-11.And how many warnings did the CIA and FBI and the rest of the American "intelligence" establishment get about that before it happened, if you're to believe reports?

If I recall, how many warnings were there about Columbine that were ignored or not properly heeded?And how many warnings did West Virginia school officials receive before a South Korean guy killed more than 30 people last month?

Hell, Bush was warned about Katrina...what did he do? F*ck all.Our governments tax us, they tell us what to do and that we'll be all right but they don't fix our roads or our health problems or stop selling us booze and smokes or prevent us from gambling.It's more money for them.They get us every which way -- but they don't protect us. How do they protect us?They spend billions on wars and military assignments that are pointless and that we don't want and need, they allow us to pay through the nose for energy and gas and give us a piss-poor education system.They DON'T do all those things they should. And they take our taxes for all that nothingness. And then the one thing you'd expect -- for them to protect us from all the shit -- they ignore it.They talk tough, but they've got balls the size of peas. And we accept it. When AREN'T we going to any more?

OTTAWA — A retired Canadian diplomat says he's not surprised by claims that Ottawa had hard intelligence prior to the Air India bombing indicating the airline was about to come under terrorist attack.

But William Warden, who served as high commissioner to New Delhi at the time, told a public inquiry Monday that he does wonder why former colleague James Bartleman didn't share the information more widely with senior officials.

Bartleman, now Ontario's lieutenant-governor, startled the inquiry last week by declaring that he had seen an electronic intercept, just days before the June 1985 bombing, that suggested Air India could be targeted by terrorists that very weekend.

Warden told the commission that if Bartleman was right then there must be others who were aware of the intelligence 22 years ago and who can shed light on it now.

The more important point, he said, is that "if such a piece of information existed there must have been at least a dozen people, or half a dozen people at the very least, who would have seen such a piece — and some of whom would have been scurrying to do something about it."

"I still have that feeling of frustration that the government machinery did not seem able to get its act together and to really step in at an early stage . . . It may have served to take the wind out of the sails of some of these people."

23 comments:

I always thought our government was the worst...and I still think it is. At least you guys have a modicum of an idea where your taxpayer's money are being used -- you have subways, a reasonably good free school system, free health care (in some parts of the world. While our money goes to financing the US/European educations of corrupt politicians children and their fancy cars with their own police escorts which motorists are expected to give way to so they won't be late for whatever godforsaken event they have to go to.

Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. By the time anyone (at least in the US) has enough name recognition to run for and win a high office, they have already sold their soul to the devil (big corporations), in my opinion.

It can be easy with hind sight to look back, and say why didnt someone do something. I am not absolving governments of guilt or blame, more just a matter of perspective.

Not everything is controlable, some things even extended warning wont help... for instance VTech shootings, you cant arrest unless they have down something wrong, Would the ability to detain without crime, or suspicion of potential crime be abused? Its not a simple, they should have done something...

What i would like to see is a global information sharing scheme i belive a lot of the issues come down to limited comunication between departments and governments. I do belive that prevention is the best solution, increased powers of arrest on suspicion may be of benefit (within VERY STRICT guidelines). still a band aid solution though...

If some madman keeps sending emails to people and threatening letters and has a website showing what a nutcase he is, and he's released from a mental hospital with warnings he's a lunatic and will harm someone...

...And everybody knew he was a ticking timebomb and they had to wait for him just to explode because he "hadn't done anything wrong," then we might just as well shoot ourselves in the collective heads.

I know we can't become a police state and just execute everybody or arrest them and throw away the key.

But surely there has to be some accountability on both sides -- the law to do its job and the nutcase to explain his zany actions -- to protect the rest of the world...

As it is, in this Air India case, the VTech shooting and so many others, governments and police authorities are just sloughing it off.

The squeaky wheel gets the oil, is what I've always found. In these big stories there's almost always evidence later that there were warnings but they were kept secret and nothing was done. In the case of 9-11, President Clinton warned the Bushies about Osama bin Laden before he left office and they said he was being paranoid. He even left them an entire plan to deal with the threat and they did nothing. Later they said he gave them no plan, but just an outline. Huh?

Politicians and governments are experts on ignoring warnings then excusing themselves after the fact.

I agree If the case is strong enough; IE. Mental impairment, direct threat, insert warning bell here, that Powers of arrest should be extended in this situation, or atleast DONT ALLOW HIM TO BUY A WEAPON.

Controls or surveilance may also provide a way of circumventing catastrophe, without impinging on the rights of the individual/community.

I dont know if it is "sloughing it off" as you put it, yes governments should be held accountable (to an Extent) but the issue is not a simple point the finger. Its all X's fault. There are many factors to consider... A) what makes these monsters? nature/nurture? Why do these people just snap?

b) can we control it.. will the solution create more probs, civil libs etc.

c)The unfortunate reality of the litagous society we live in, will our actions get us sued. (i think this is a major factor which slows most of the processes down)

My solution: 1) increased power for police, to be able to detain before a crime is comitted2) to set up an independant watch dog to assure such powers would not be abused.

3) any information, that is with held by a government which could save life, that can be disclosed without causing panic, or interfering with investigations of police should be revealed to the public. Clearly and without sensationalisation.

4) Create a level of protection for government bodies from frivolus lawsuits.

5)Most importantly dont panic, think about the issues at stake, dont let people justify anything out of fear.

Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want and deserve to get it good and hard. H. L. Mencken

Our modern approach to problem solving, especially our legal system, please do not refer to it as the department of justice, is completely REACTIVE. There is little if nothing done that could be considered proactive, the same goes for our Medical system.

The right of the individual now far outweighs the good of the community and it unfortunately coincides with the zenith of our cultural joyride to narcissism.Now we are stuck with the politics of victimization, everybody is a victim.

Your Honor, yes my client murdered 18 people but he had a terrible childhood and is just as much of a victim.

Governments and their agencies are entities unto themselves that are primarily concerned with retaining their influence and power. The price we pay for unbridled individualism may have finally proven itself to be unworkable.

Democracy would work beautifully if everyone was a 'good' person, unfortunately this is not true and we are handcuffed by the PC argument that the rights of 'evil' people are somehow equal to the rights of people who refrain from acting upon their impulses.

I want to go back to the times of Feudal governments. If the local lord didn't look after his serfs, they couldn't work and produce food for him! We need that kind of direct relationship with our rulers, so that each action equally effects the other party. Also, medieval knights are sexy.

The world of Farcebook

I have kids on Farcebook. And friends. And a fiance. And all are very intelligent human beings.

I am on Farcebook myself. But it is the TV of life now. It is the simple, devoid of ideas, unintelligent way of humans communicating. I am not saying people who don't Farcebook are any more intelligent, necessarily.

They are people who , I believe, are like newspaper readers are to television viewers --people of more depth -- and I mean that with no disrespect.

And they are people who need and want more depth, not less, in their lives.