UN Introduces New Feudalism Under Guise of Social Activism

“Global Goals” Is Lavishly-Funded Public Relations Endeavor “We the People” Never Voted For

This month delegates to the United Nations ratified the so-called “Global Goals For Sustainable Development.” This will involve a radical, far-reaching social and economic transformation of everyday life that has been in the works for decades.

In true Hegelian dialectic style, the program is taking place as various black swans linger on the economic horizon, while some of the very interests involved in the “Global Goals” are likewise putting the finishing touches on the Trans-Pacific trade agreement, designed to (not coincidentally) crush the nation state.

No “world citizens” voted for the UN’s “Global Goals,” yet everyone is compelled to participate.

Such an ambitious program will cost, by the UN’s own estimate, as much as $5 trillion annually. A social makeover of this scale requires enlistment of ideologically-motivated shock troops from all walks of life to act as change agents in their own spheres. Thus a portion of such finances will be apportioned to thought and behavioral modification toward ideational acceptance of continued corporate ascendance, wealth and resource redistribution, and the breakdown of traditional borders that for better or worse have defined the human condition since the feudal era–from gender and common morality to the nation state. As the “Global Goals” website declares, “We are not a generation of bystanders. We are global citizens.”

Below is the campaign’s slickly produced promotional video.

Truthstream Media has developed a clever interpretation of the UN’s “Global Goals.” Unfortunately, these are by no means exaggerations but rather illustrate the hypocrisy of this campaign, which in reality involves an accelerated privatization of the commons and even our own bodies combined with elaborate psychological warfare to disguise such endeavors as social activism.

What’s that you say? You’re not on board? See you in the gulag, comrade.

Goal 1: End poverty in all its forms everywhereTranslation: Centralized banks, IMF, World Bank, Fed to control all finances, digital one world currency in a cashless society

Goal 14: Conserve and sustainably use the oceans, seas and marine resources for sustainable developmentTranslation: Environmental restrictions, control all oceans including mineral rights from ocean floors

Goal 16: Promote peaceful and inclusive societies for sustainable development, provide access to justice for all and build effective, accountable and inclusive institutions at all levelsTranslation: UN “peacekeeping” missions (ex 1, ex 2), the International Court of (blind) Justice, force people together via fake refugee crises and then mediate with more “UN peacekeeping” when tension breaks out to gain more control over a region, remove 2nd Amendment in USA

Goal 17: Strengthen the means of implementation and revitalize the global partnership for sustainable developmentTranslation: Remove national sovereignty worldwide, promote globalism under the “authority” and bloated, Orwellian bureaucracy of the UN

[This month delegates to the United Nations ratified the so-called “Global Goals For Sustainable Development.” This will Screen Shot 2015-09-30 at 8.53.44 AMinvolve a radical, far-reaching social and economic transformation of everyday life that has been in the works for decades.

In true Hegelian dialectic style, the program is taking place as various black swans linger on the economic horizon, while some of the very interests involved in the “Global Goals” are likewise putting the finishing touches on the Trans-Pacific trade agreement, designed to (not coincidentally) crush the nation state….]

Genesis 11:1-4… “And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech. And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar; and they dwelt there. And they said one to another, Go to, let us make brick, and burn them thoroughly. And they had brick for stone, and slime they had for mortar. And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.”

Nationalism, as part of the Western tradition of the White Man, is partially on the way out historically. World power is now a contest between American and Western imperialism on one hand, and China leading the developing countries, most of the people of the earth on the other.

Nearly 90% of the earth’s people are non-White, and have been dominated and brutalized by the White West in the past two centuries. What is happening now historically is that they are gaining power, and overthrowing White imperialism. If one is one the side of the earth’s people, one will view the change favorably; if one is on the side of Western imperialism, promoted by homicidal racist violence, one will oppose it.

Respectfully, Folktruther, as Antony Sutton’s research revealed decades ago, the east vs. west paradigm is a Hegelian construct. The global elite were behind the rise of communist China and Russia, later remaking China into their model Technocracy. China is ahead of the US in Agenda 21 edicts having outspent the US last year on the implementation of Smart Grid technology and China’s new Social Credit tracking system is NWO Technotronic Era on steroids. A presidential level Smart Grid Partnership was enacted between the US and Russia in 2012 – and so much more to the deep integration and global “harmonization” underway.

There are deliberately planted memes in the alt media of doomer porn and American self-loathing which mislead many to root for Team B Global Mafia Oligarchs. Both of these memes have, as at least one of their objectives, a goal of creating of a learned helplessness acceptance of the dissolution of the US as a sovereign nation state.

Incidentally, in a recent Greg Hunter interview of Catherine Austin Fitts, Fitts mentioned what she called a “trial balloon” in a Peggy Noonan WSJ column that discussed the prediction of an unnamed person of great influence who said the US could very well be broken up. Also this summer, Rothschild owned The Economist ran an article on the fragile nature of Russia predicting it will fracture. The blog redefininggod.com discussed yet another article on the break up of China. My guess is one of the objectives of the Ukraine mess was to fracture it. Iraq is shattered, as planned and seen in the New Middle East map.

I can’t see anything favorable about what’s headed our way unless the elites hit some kind of entropy wall and / or divine intervention unravels their plans. Hubris has its limits and backfires, as is evidenced in the GMO scheme, geoengineering, and 9/11 waking up a lot of smart and determined people.

Very incisive, gwp. Great comment, especially this hopeful part, “Hubris has its limits and backfires, as is evidenced in the GMO scheme, geoengineering, and 9/11 waking up a lot of smart and determined people.”

It would be hilarious if it weren’t so tragic. Russian leadership is essentially arguing for a multipolar(cartel-structured) world, The Anglo-American Axis a Unipolar world. But even this is a “Red Herring” as the Problem-Reaction-Solution formula is in play here as well. Unipolar-Multipolar-Global…the Hegelian Dialectic strikes again; of course GLOBAL GOVERNANCE is the definition of UNIPOLAR, just the polarity would be in a different facet of the structure already in place. So many of these dupes NOT realizing that an end to US hegemony in the globalist playbook only gives rise to GLOBALIST HEGEMONY!! It’s a joke!! It’s déjà vu all over again.

No everyone has been brutalized by the 13 banking families that control the west and are owned by the City of London Crown Temple and vatican. Western troops especially Americans, have been used as pawns by this nexus. There is no white imperialism, there is only banker imperialism which many times does not favor Europeans.

The queen of England has announced on record the mideast and Caribbean is the future of the U.K. That is not overthrowing anyone, that is planned genocide by Lizzy as she plans to exterminate the former inhabitants of the British Isles.

12,000 Boer women and children were starved behind barb wire in South Africa by the British. Eisenhower starved from 3 to 6 million Germans in an open air cage after the war was over.

Yes this chimera of “white imperialism” is being supposedly overthrown as they are being replaced others of the banker class who simply want them gone, therefore we see massive immigration in many countries.

American soldiers engaging in war all around the globe and a large part of them are no longer white, there is not enough of these “white imperialists” left to go around. Yet they keep on killing. Illegals are now promised resident alien cards if they are agree to join the services. War is big business and all wars are banker wars.

Even at this point, “White Imperialism” is a red herring. Imperialism is Imperialism no matter the adjective used to describe the noun, it’s still the noun. What this reveals mainly, is that the cloak of “White Supremacy” is being shelved for “Global Supremacy”….revealing White Supremacy to have been an OP all along. It’s all about Social Engineering for SOCIAL CONTROL, point blank.

The people of the Western tradition are White. the people of the earth that were colonized and imperialized were non-White. The instruments of power were money, guns, and truth. At the present time in history, non-White people are gaining power, and White people are losing power.

Unfortunately, your last comments actually illustrate my point….it’s a FALSE DICHOTOMY, a HEGELIAN DIALECTIC. Or quite simply: an INVENTION…which is what the “White” race & the “Negro/Colored/Black” race was, is, and always will be. The terms have no relationship to a region, culture, land, language that preceded it. It was invented by legislation in The colony of Virginia in the late 17th century(much the same way Jim Crow laws were) to DIVIDE & CONQUER by preventing solidarity & unity amongst commonly oppressed, indentured Africans, Irish, Scottish who were rebelling against the slavemasters of that period. A good series on this would be “The Invention of The White Race”.

That is exactly what Putin is not doing. It is very clear in his speeches concerning a desire for a multi-polar world, not a unipolar world. Consequently that is why the BRICs are forming. They will print their own money.

Stalin is dead, the wall came down. Putin has a 90% approval rating by the people he represents. That is the highest in the world. They have banned GMO, banned off shore money laundering havins, the top political structure of Sakhalin has just been arrested by a crime unit. 12 governors behind bars and 8 more under the gun. There is also a new law in Russia making it illegal to brush over Stalin’s crimes. The Russian communist party at times attempts to do this.

Putin refused to shake hands with Obama at the UN. Today commenced the first bombing of ISIS by Russian planes in Syria. Looks like there will not be a pipeline from Qatar to Europe through Syria, thereby slowing down this unipolar world. They will still be buying Russian gas.

It’s as simple as this: approximately 80+ years ago this very vision was fleshed out by an entity known as “Technocracy, INC.” out of Columbia University; a book was published called “Technocracy Study Course(can be found in PDF form)”. This, Brzeznski’s “Between Two Ages”, & the end goals of The Zeitgeist films spell out what the masses have to look forward to: the imposition of all the worst distopian scenarios. The fact that its becoming so blatant only underscores that most of us don’t want to know, and be burdened with the responsibility it comes with. I mean GLOBAL CITIZEN? How does that NOT point to a GLOBAL STATE, and by definition GLOBAL GOVERNANCE?

Also, not coincidentally(IMO) one of the founders of Technocracy, Inc. was the man who created the Peak Oil Theory(completely debunked BTW), which along with another distopian novel, “Silent Spring” was used to kick off the modern day environmental movement, complete with Earth Day, The Green Revolution(petrochemical-based farming), Club of ROME’s “Limits to Growth”, Global Cooling(which became Global Warming/Climate Change fraud), & National Security Study Memorandum 200…just to name a few.

When this is all said and done: this is ultimately every single goal of Eugenics…the truly completed version which has been disguised among other things as: Family Planning, Bioethics, Genetics, Transhumanism, Transgender/Hermaphroditism. The Jaffe Memo/Population Council/Planned Parenthood/Homosexual agenda certainly applies and is prominent in this intended NWO.

Great timing on this: on October 10, my city will be celebrating its 2nd annual “Re:Imagine” festival, with the downtown area blocked off to cars, and pedestrians and bike riders are honored. Best of all is the Agenda 21 programming…yay!

I didn’t think of that, Recynd. It’s the “eternal return” of “reduced inequalities.”

I was looking at the logo for Goal #1, No Poverty, No poverty appears to involve a one-child-per-couple policy. Other than that it seems to flout marxist cultural prescriptions. The couples are heterosexual and the children are gender-normative. Notice the independent little boy standing on his own, while the little girl hangs on to both her parents.

The rise of a world economy requires a world political governance to regulate it. The major aim is to assure that this serves the earth’s people rather than a money or power oligarchy.

With the increasing world transportation and communication, an earthperson movement can be developed historically to generate a political culture that can sufficiently influence such a governance, especially as Washington and Western power declines. We are living at a time in history when earthpeople for the first time in history can generate a world governance increasing economic stability and restricting violence.

But since this will conflict with American power, and the American people have been indoctrinated to identify with American power, against the interests of the American and earth’s people, the power threat will most likely increase American political reaction. This would include an increase of racist bigotry and violence that we are currently experiencing. This will be inflated as the American economy unravels under oligarchical Free Enterprise.

Oligarchical Washington will most like apply its Divide and Ruin strategy to the American people, as it has to the Muslim people and in foreign affairs. This will probably include an increase in fear threats inflated to induce Americans to support oligarchical violence. The American ideological untruth may therefore be getting even wilder and more childish over historical time, becoming the New Normal in the media and truth institutions. The first casualty of violence is truth, and it is likely that the authorized violence domestically will increase.

He’s a nut, Toni. Essentially everything he says in this comment is either completely wrong, perfectly evil, or nonsensical.

Mark agrees with the creation of a one world government that controls every human being from cradle to grave. Not being all that bright, he lives in a sort-of dream state, where the crafters of the New World Order are not the “oligarchs” he denounces, and where the New World Order will be the “dictatorship of the proletariat.” As I say, he’s a nut. It’s going to be just like 1984, contrary to his childish dream that, as he says, “The major aim is to assure that this serves the earth’s people rather than a money or power oligarchy.” “The major aim” of the NWO is to enslave everyone, and “the earth’s people” have no say-so about it.

Mark apparently approves of the Mohammedan invasion of Europe, an entirely artificial program of the crafters of the New World Order, because he does not like the idea of homogenous cultures flourishing happily in the patchwork that used to prevail; only French people in France, only Irish people in Ireland, only Swedes in Sweden, etc. People who disagree with him are “racists,” just because they cherish their heritage–for Mark, the elimination of the visible remnants of Western Civilization is essential to the program and those who imagine that the West can be restored, and think they can push back the tide, are counterrevolutionaries who must be denounced and suppressed.

America, the least racist place in the history of the world, has to be undone. Blacks, particularly in the Northern cities, have systematically been made into the most racist people in the world in the last half century–precisely because American culture was too secure in its ability to assimilate “the other.” To observe this plot is to be, for Mark, who exemplifies this project, by definition, a “racist.” Chaos is the only way to undo what made America so wonderful that everyone in the world wants to live here. If there’s going to be a New World Order ruled by one charismatic man, with a one world religion and a one world cashless currency, the United States Constitution must be eliminated. And only chaos can make that possible. The Moslems of the benighted lands of Africa and Asia are the tools the NWO crafters are using to undo Europe; Blacks from the Southern States, and the Indians from Oaxaca and points south are in turn the tools for the destruction of America’s stable culture. It was not a coincidence that Northern cities with no black people prior to WWII were suddenly filled with Black people by the 1970s–and that the Welfare State combined with a systematic indoctrination in racial grievance ruined them.

Mark likes this dynamic, because it “proves” that America is a “racist” place, and therefore justifies its destruction, to make way for the NWO.

Mark makes up mumbo-jumbo phrases for the same reason bureaucrats do: to appear smart and thoughtful. I wouldn’t try to get definitions from him; just remember its nonsense, not actually intended to convey a coherent idea.

I see you included Castro and Charlemagne as Jews, but, Dublin, you left out your former designees, Hitler and Eisenhower. But like poisonous Patrick says, you have stay right on top of us crazy people.

Considering all of Mark’s comments over the years, this is it! An absolute wall hanger! I truly can’t stop laughing. This is the guy who has referred to me and a few others as “crazy as a loon”. It reminds me of the alcoholic who thinks everyone else is a drunk.

“Earthpeople”(really cracking me up with that one) have as much chance of forming their own world governance, as they have at figuring out who is in Grant’s tomb. World government is here, but it wasn’t earthpeople, who I would guess are Mark’s beloved “workers” from a bygone empire, who formed it.

Folky’s comments used to tick me off, but now I look forward to them like the Sunday “funnies” of my youth.

I see why the scientific revolutions take so long, Rick. It is necessary to legitimate holistic conceptions in people who are committed to insular and limited views. In the 17th century scientific revolution, it was necessary to legitimate the notion that the earth was a planet like the others, and moved as they did. This notion is still not accepted by about a quarter of Americans. The national science association did a poll and a quarter of Americans still thought that the sun moves around the earth.

The problem of legitimating the holistic truth grows more difficult as revolutionary theory nears people and power. The 19th century revolution in what we now call biology, that humans evolved like other organisms, is still not accepted by about half of the American people.
The science and Pew polls over the past 3 decades have been quite stable, and nearly half of Americans think that God created humans within the last ten thousand years.

The marxist revolution in social theory, the major world social theory viewed from a people’s perspective, has been stigmatized, distorted and ideologically repressed in the US War on Communism. The marxist prediction that fewer capitalists would own more and more of the economy appears to be quite true, but religious ideology, as in the case of evolution, conflicts with Atheistic Marxism.

Expanding the marxist revolution would tell the holistic truth about relations among the past, present, and future persons of the world. This would generate an earthperson world-view, as I refer to it, incompatible with the Western tradition of the White Man. Therefore it is unlikely to be legitimated in the USA, because it conflicts with the American power delusions that restrict American consciousness. But I’m glad it amuses you, Rich, because as reaction deepens in the USA in the coming decades, connecting the truths is going to become increasingly illegitimate.

‘Earthpeople’ is a precise term rreferring to the past, present, and future persons of the earth. Since the American truth tradition is formulated largely from the perspective of power rather than from the perspective of people, precise terms about people and the truth connections among them have been ideologically repressed historically. That is why we tend to identifiy with our own oppression, and the oppression of other people. That is why a truth revolution is needed, to state the obvious from a people’s perspective rather that a power perspective.

We live in a universe where there are many billions of stars, over a hundred million in our galaxy alone. It is conceivable, and even likely, that the planets around them are inhabited by other creatures, include technical civilizations that include space people. An interesting scientific book was written by Carl Sagan and a Russian scientist conjecturing on how far apart these technical civilizations would be. The equation relied heavily on the life time of the civilization, the longer the life, the closer the civilizations.

scientists are now searching for intelligent life on other planets, perhaps giving up finding any on our own. When I use the term ‘earthperson,’ I am contrasting it with a space person.

Because the mainstream truth traditions of state powers are formulated from the perspective of power, they tend to downplay or ideologically repress our relations among persons, especially power relations. That is why our general conceptions of people appear so surreal and unfamiliar. The American power system, in particular, is an anti-people power, based largely historically on homicidal racist imperialism. This is the killing of non-White people, or the threat to kill them, to steal their collective and personal property and power. So the American truth tradition, is a White truth tradition, in a world where nearly 90% of the earth’s people are non-White. American power therefore kills millions of non-White people, and the American people, including MHB commenters, identify with American power against the earth’s people.

Earthperson as opposed to a space person? You’re not helping yourself out, dude.

You would do better to argue that “earthpeople” are “global citizens” or something, rather than a collective term for all “past, present and future persons born on earth” (a concept conveniently covered by the word “people“), and then contrasting them to all those “people” supposedly born “in space.”

think in a world historical perspective, Toni. there are a little more than 7billion people living on the earth today. there were less in former years. there will be an unknown number in future years, 0 if we can’t get it together. This is a precise holistic conception, and is capable of being express mathematically.

But it is incompatible with the ideological implications of the Western tradition, and particularly the American ideological tradition. Americans are taught to conceive political and cultural reality in a space-time constriction. American is spatially conceived implicitly as a homeland all its own, ideologically separated from the rest of the world. The time restriction is historical; Americans are historically illiterate. We are taught that way in school, universities, and other learned bureaucracies. Americans forget the past, deny the present, and ignore the future.

This is the historical result of being indoctrinated by the truth institutions of ruling power to view reality from the perspective of American power rather than from an earthperson perspective. And we can transform this conceptual and ideological pathology in the 21st century.

You can’t understand the definition of ‘earthpeople.?’ That never occurred to me, that people couldn’t understand it. It’s a math offshoot of von Neumann’s game theory. I’ve been formulating the conceptual structure for so many years that I apparently am assuming too much. I better do it in pictures, venn diagrams.

You seem to forget that, once, people killed or died to get here. My impoverished forebearers did. They worked as domestics so that the next generation would do better (they did), and the generation after that (again, they did). People from all over the world moved here to escape the class systems from their own countries.

Truly, even “the poor” in this country have it so much better than in so many other places, standard-of-living-wise.

Yes, there have been terrible persecutions. Native Americans. Chinese. Mormons. Blacks. Catholics. Japanese. Irish. The poor always suffer, everywhere. But for the most part, these groups have endured and are stronger than ever.

There was a time when America and Americans (all of us, not just whites) was blessed, and helped raise the standards of living for many other countries. Today? Not so much. But that’s the fault of “secret combinations”, dark oaths, and a global elite, not the average white person.

Quite true, recynd. Also the case with my forbears. In America. And that is emotionally a reason to feel grateful to America.

But the rest of the world, 95% of the earth’s people, suffered from American imperialism, which killed millions of non-White people in imperialist wars in Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, and in other countries as well. And American imperialism also looted the rest of the world, and intentionally restricted the industrial development of underdeveloped countries, as did England and other White Western countries.

Under the Terror War, oligarchical Washington is pursuing a Divide and Ruin policy which is sowing chaos in the world to diminish opposition power. And Washington is going to spend nearly a trillion dollars creating new nuclear weapons and delivery systems. Consequently, Terrorwar American power is now the major enemy of the earth’s people. I know this is difficult to accept for most Americans.

So the immigrants who poured into the US from all over Europe and Asia at the turn of the 20th century were just joining the oppressor?

The thing about your argument is this: white people feel…and have felt…no loyalty to each other. We’re not tribal. Darwin thought the Irish were about as low as humanity went. Protestants and Catholics were still killing each other as recently as the 1980s. The Croats and Bosnian Serbs look white to me, though I guess the Serbs are Muslim, and the Croats (the ones I’ve known) are Roman Catholic.

You talk so much about “imperialism”, and you might be right…but it’s a more modern phenomenon, not an historic one. The British colonized around the world, but the US didn’t. Yes, we stuck our nose where it didn’t belong, but you can’t pin those actions on regular US citizens, who, for the most part, were minding our own business.

WE …commoners, that is…are as different from, say, Henry Kissinger or Zbignew Brezinski, than we are from the man in the moon. Don’t lump regular “white people” in with them, just because we happen to be similarly-skinned.

I don’t know what world you grew up in, but I went to school with as many Mexican kids as I did whites. It made no difference to me. In my immediate family, I have Vietnamese, Japanese, Mexican, black, and white relations. I couldn’t care less if my son marries a black, Asian, or Hispanic woman (Lord, just let it be a woman!). I do hope he’ll marry a Mormon girl…does that make me a bigot? So be it.

It’s YOU who divides people into groups by skin color, friend, not me. It’s YOU who seeks to impose his will onto others here. You are the ultimate statist here…you just haven’t gotten your way yet.

interesting post, Recynd, I printed it, and will respond over time in sections. section 1.

The immigrants that came here in the joined the oppressed, but later identified with the oppressors. The dissident Puritans who were persecuted in England came to the US, and killed the Indian Americans to steal their homes and homeland, and enslaved African Americans.

The Irish who were starved to death in Ireland during the Famine, which was at least partly deliberate, came to the US and oppressed the African Americans, told in HOW THE IRISH BECAME WHITE.

The African Americans who emigrated to Liberia exploited and oppressed the Africans, creating a backward and reactionary state.

The Jews who were massacred by the Nazis went to Israel where they oppressed the Palestinians in an apartheid state.

And so it goes, historically, demonically. Just as a child that is sexually abused in childhood is more likely to abuse children when adult–because that is what he knows–so a people oppressed by power will on attaining power themselves will identify with the oppression of another people, because that is what has tended to be imprinted on their historical memory.

You bet it is, Mark. It’s just that you don’t actually know why. It’s because it’s complete nonsense, and anyone who bothers to pay attention to your strange formulations is likely to simply break out in peals of laughter.

That is, to accept your scenario, your narrative, is to demonstrate mental illness.

Western Civilization, which was phased out over the course of the 20th century and was officially ended with the 9/11 event, was the best thing that ever happened to the world. (It started, roughly, A.D. 500.)

These people, obviously, enslaved the innocent savages and tormented them, and it’s a good thing they will soon be eradicated. “Earthpeople”? Not for long, if the likes of the folkiedeciever have their way.

My God, Toni, how do these monsters get away with it? The sooner they are rendered incapable of displaying their pretentious triumphalism, the better. The wonderful tribal life of the jungles and deserts will quickly be restored; the put-upon peoples of the non-white regions will give up T-shirts,blue-jeans, gym shoes, air conditioning and automobiles. Not to mention computers and cell phones.

And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

They key is “Our” likeness, not Mine. Who is Us?

In the world that was all Races today were there, and are here now..
Recynd, Your own religion teaches the universe was an open book in the world that was. I was in the Priesthood and I agree

It’s a study. If your hungry, you will seek and you will find, If you knock, the door will be opened.

As I said. I can’t debate peoples thoughts or opinions on Religion. But I answered you.

I believe that we are made in the image of our Creator (Father in Heaven), who also created Jesus and angels. We may look like angels, but they didn’t create us. That’s why they’re not included in “Our”. Jesus Christ, through the power of God the Father, created this Earth. Christ is the Word. Angels are helpers, not gods. They minister to us, and they act as messengers. Sometimes “demons” pretend to be them.

There is scriptural support for this view, whether one agrees with it or not. I have not seen any theologian, modern or ancient, who posits your position. If you can point me in the direction, I will read up on it.

Again, this isn’t argumentative or meant to proselytize to you (or anyone), merely to ask for clarity.

I was listening to Freeman’s most recent YouTube post and he briefly spoke about Sitchen’s view of the Annunaki and elohim (I think Sitchen uses the terms interchangeably?). Is this sort of in line with what you believe?

I don’t know much (clearly) about this, but it would at least give me a reference point.

The majority of the American people endorse oligarchical violence. Polls have shown that the majority of Americans favor legally killing unarmed prisoners convicted of capital crimes. The majority is in favor of torturing unarmed prisoners, which often results in their death, after a sequence of programs advocated torture by dramatizing unreal conditions.

You are not a lawyer, Patrick, so you are not fully aware how irrational, pathological, and barbaric the laws are carried out, not that you’d care. I assume that you would support and promote torture as well, including the raping of youths. It’s routine in American prisons, which has imprisoned 20 to 30 million Americans so far, and the number is increasing.

I can assure you, Mark, that it does not take a couple years in Law School to make one aware of the evils of the legal system, much less the good things it is supposed to represent. In fact, it’s better not to get indoctrinated there, if you want to be aware of these problems, or the ideals.

I was only pointing out your factual, and linguistic, fallacy. A “capital crime” is one punishable by death. By definition. If people think that people guilty of capital crimes should be executed, it’s a lot like people who think that apples should be squeezed if one wants to make apple cider. It’s in the meaning of the word itself. A capital crime is one punishable by death. It’s what the word means.

That’s to say, if the people you despise did NOT think that capital crimes are punishable by execution, it would be the same as you saying that people don’t think that you find fish in water, or staples in staplers. Only stupid people don’t know these things.

How this leads to the problem of torture I leave to your own imagination–which is fertile, certainly, but strange in ways I wish never to understand.

I don’t know why I answer this stuff, its probably my weakness for pointification. But Mr Good Guy explains that lawyers use the term of a ‘capital offense’ to mean that a defendant COULD be SENTENCED TO DEATH on it, not necessarily that he actually was. My wife did capital cases for years.

Some Christians, in fact, regard the caduceus as a very evil symbol. Glad that wasn’t the interpretation you intended (and I really didn’t suspect it to be your meaning).

Mark is a difficult playmate to have fun with, but I do try to coax him out of his doctrinaire-ianisness (to coin a word no one will ever use again) sometimes. I don’t doubt he feels the same way about me.

This is a big sandbox, to me. Sometimes, we get sand in our eyes. Sometimes, no harm was intended.

Patrick, I can see how posting the caduceus graphic would be shocking to a lot of people! Most likely to both you and Mick. Not my intent. It really was just my visualization of your phrase.

The site you directed me to piqued my interest, so I did some research. I was surprised to find that only in the United States does the caduceus have any medical connotations. It was popularized by its adoption as the insignia by the U.S. Army Medical Corps in 1902, spreading from there. Funny thing is they took the caduceus instead of the Rod of Asclepius, a traditional symbol of health, which is a rod wound with a single snake.

Asclepius was a Greek god known as the Healer. His daughters are Hygieia (hygiene), Iaso (recuperation), Aceso (process of healing), Aglæa/Ægle (beauty, splendor, glory, magnificence, and adornment – outward health, I’m guessing), and Panacea (universal remedy). The rod represents both recuperation and the itinerant physician. The snake comes from the non-poisonous Snakes of Asclepius which were allowed to roam free in the healing temples, eating rats and keeping the place clean.

The caduceus was chosen by the Army probably because it was more symmetrical or something. I don’t think evil can be imputed to it at least till after the AMA took it up. Lol. It’s certainly not emblematic of Western medicine as a whole, since only American medicine uses it.

In the article, Mike Adams argues that it is the symbology of the caduceus itself that indoctrinates the subconscious into evil. It “announces” evil, as if it were imbued with it from before the beginning.

Allopathic medicine has much that doesn’t recommend it. But its evils are accomplished through the ordinary and brutal means of profit extraction and power consolidation that we have come to expect from such organized endeavors.

Yes Recynd, that is what came to mind for me as well; the part about Moses, that is.

Now, as for Patrick and Mark’s(our beloved Volkie) role as one bête noire to another. If only I had the means, I would finance a sit down. Perhaps a few bottles of pinot noir, some stogies, and a light hearted mediator, perhaps Ric. I think we would all enjoy that. The written word, and our desire to sound learned, can sometimes get in the way of what we really want to say, or at least make it harder to decipher. It would be a hoot, and I’m sure all would walk away friends.

Num 21:5
And the people spake against God, and against Moses, Wherefore have ye brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? for there is no bread, neither is there any water; and our soul loatheth this light bread.
Tools specific to Num 21:6
Num 21:6
And the LORD sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died.
Tools specific to Num 21:7
Num 21:7
¶
Therefore the people came to Moses, and said, We have sinned, for we have spoken against the LORD, and against thee; pray unto the LORD, that he take away the serpents from us. And Moses prayed for the people.
Tools specific to Num 21:8
Num 21:8
And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live.
Tools specific to Num 21:9
Num 21:9
And Moses made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole, and it came to pass, that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived.

The “serpents” were gods, elohim– supernatural beings.

This passage from Numbers is the key to much that follows, not only in the history of the Israelites, but of the human race. Why did Moses put a snake on a stick, that anyone who gazed upon it would be healed? Because God became sin itself, placed upon a tree, to be gazed upon, for the rescue from sin of all mankind.

It was symbolic of all the tragic reality of the fallen human race.

It came to symbolize health, because the only source of health is God Himself, who sent His only begotten Son, to rescue us from our inherent corruption. All we have to do is gaze upon Him, and our sickness is undone. Moses gave us that symbolic glimpse of Messiah (he gave us lots of others, too).

The serpent, which is not a snake, is a symbol of “wisdom” because of what the Nachash said to the woman:

[Gen 3:1-24 KJV] 1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? 2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: 3 But of the fruit of the tree which [is] in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. 4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: 5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

I said:
“In the article, Mike Adams argues that it is the symbology of the caduceus itself that indoctrinates the subconscious into evil. It “announces” evil, as if it were imbued with it from before the beginning.”

Patrick, when you say,”It all started at the start.” are you addressing my critique?

But this was written pretty late, Patrick, about -1200. A snake was considered a creature of wisdom many centuries earlier. This passage is written to defame the poor creature. And what do you mean, that a serpent is not a snake.

The Hebrew word rendered “serpent” in Genesis 3:1 is Nachash (from the root Nachash, to shine), and means a shinning one. Hence, in Chaldee it means brass or copper, because of its shining. Hence also, the word Nehushtan, a piece of brass, in 2Kings 18:4. (http://www.therain.org/appendixes/app19.html)

I normally don’t chime in these Religious threads but this has been going on for a while.

The “Serpent” is just one of Lucifer’s names. It was Lucifer in the garden of Eden. One of the most powerful entities God ever created. God obviously created more than one of these entities as scripture spoken here has already shown.

There were people of ALL colors and races here long before Adam and Eve.

We were created in the image of the Angeles. When the tower of Babal act went down, only our language changed, Not our race,

There will be no Races or Gender in the New World Peter called the 3rd World Age.

That’s it. I won’t go into endless nonsense, petty arguments.

If you don’t know by know, pray the Slumber falls on you when the Serpent, that Old Dragon, Lucifer and all his names comes riding on his dirty white horse, a fake and sets up 10 kings for 1 hours.

Ric: I have never heard this interpretation of Genesis before. What is your source for this (i.e., people before Adam and Eve, people made in the image of angels, the Third World, genderlessness in said Third World)?

Ric is right; the last column Reply prison on this serpent conversation is too long. So, I’m starting again.

First, Recynd said on Tuesday night:
“The serpent and the staff has a Biblical source too: Moses and the brazen serpent.

“Patrick? You care to chime in?”

I try to keep theology to a minimum around here (believe it or not), so I thought I’d let the matter rest. Then Mark said, on Wednesday afternoon:
“why did the snake come to symbolize health and, with the female gods in early history and pre-history, with wisdom?”

I answered with the passage from Numbers that explained why Moses commissioned a statue of a snake on a stick, explaining, in part:

“The “serpents” were gods, elohim– supernatural beings.

“This passage from Numbers is the key to much that follows, not only in the history of the Israelites, but of the human race. Why did Moses put a snake on a stick, that anyone who gazed upon it would be healed? Because God became sin itself, placed upon a tree, to be gazed upon, for the rescue from sin of all mankind.

“It was symbolic of all the tragic reality of the fallen human race.

“It came to symbolize health, because the only source of health is God Himself…”

Immediately after that, in a separate comment, I quoted Genesis 3, where the Nachash tempted the original two humans, introducing the passage saying, again in reply to Mark, “The serpent, which is not a snake, is a symbol of “wisdom” because of what the Nachash said to the woman:” After that I summed it up: “It all started at the start.” (I was not thinking of Mike Adams’ thinking on the symbolic power that continues to inform original sin, as Toni asks; I meant that the “start” was the beginning of history, in the Garden of Eden.)

Again, the Nachash is not a snake. To make this perfectly clear, I linked to Dr. Bullinger on the subject, including a quote from the piece to make it clear that part of his analysis of the problem is etymological. Mark, obviously not having clicked through and read what Dr. Bullinger wrote, replied, in dimwitted fashion “it was brass or copper that tempted Eve?”

Ric then mentioned that “We were created in the image of the Angeles,” which is almost true, and very important in this connection. Recynd asked about this, so I’ll bet other people are curious.

The elohim, the “Sons of God,” appear to shine, like bronze just out of fire. They also appear serpentine. The Bible is replete with references to this (as you will discover if you follow the breadcrumb trail through Dr. Heiser’s material). Before the Fall, Adam and Eve were part of the Divine Council, apparently, which met in Eden–so they talked to the gods all the time. The “us” and “our” of Genesis 1:26 is the Divine Council, not Yahweh, but lesser, created beings, called the “Sons of God” throughout the Bible; they are also called “elohim,” which is often translated “gods.” These are the gods that ruled over the various nations (and still do, for the most part–Allah being a prominent example). They are not angels, which are lesser beings, usually described as a sort of messenger, so far as we can tell.

You can see why I was reluctant to weigh in. It’s a subtle topic, and very large. It’s worth learning, though. Heiress is the go-to guy. (You can also find him on YouTube.)

Your attempt at blasphemy is pathetic, Folk. Scorn will give you wrinkles, and it makes a person generally unpleasant to be around. Think about that for a bit.

Of course there are other “gods”…who do you think the Egyptians were worshipping? Practitioners of Voudon? The Hindu?

However, these are not MY gods, and they are not the creators of this world or did they create us, body OR soul. They have no powers of creation at all. They can seem quite powerful to us, but they are nothing next to God.

It’s one thing to discuss these topics with people who can conduct themselves with a semblance of respect, but you are just being nasty. What a superiority complex you have!

gosh, thank you very much, Toni. How do you suppose that happened, do you think. What’s the point of it.

take your time in responding, Toni. Weirding people out is the point of many of my posts, which I think of as unwierding, because I happen, myself, to be …different. I am hoping that your scholarly inclinations will overcome your Nazi sympathies.

oh no, Toni, most of my posts are in moderation; this one just disappeared. Previous ones did as well, but they never reappeared again. It is not the disappearing that is unusual, it is the reappearance.

I’m glad my posts amuse you; I use them to posit and shape ideas before presenting them seriously.

I couldn’t tell if the bells were getting louder the songs they ring I finally recognize
I only know hell is getting hotter the devil’s getting smarter all the time
And it would be nice to walk upon the water to talk again to angels on my side
Time is getting closer I read it on a poster fanatical exposers on corners prophecy
It would be nice to walk upon the water to talk again to angels at my side
I just come back to show you all my words are golden so have no gods before me I’m the light ( I’m Alive)

-I know! And always complaining from the best seats in the house, right?

Yes, Toni. Just one more little bit of control, and everything will be fine. We, the oligarchy, promise not to ask for any more. When we are done, YOU will be blessed with PEOPLE POWER! That is, earth people power, not space people power. The space people will be just fine, because they have already achieved earth people power. But not really, because they are from a different planet. For example, if they are from Altair-5 they would have Altair-5 people power. This is not to say that Altair-5 people could not evolve into a higher form, and receive Mongo people power. At that point, all Mongo people will turn brown, and be allowed full membership into the United Federation of Planets.

Of course, this will only come to fruition when domesticated cattle flatulence is brought within acceptable limits.

There are no world controllers yet, although there may well be if the earthperson population can’t organize. The Western banksters are rapidly losing power, and the Western alliance is fragmenting. In the next decade or two, China will be the leading power in a more multi-polar world, but power systems tend to become more oppressive historically as they age. China is supporting the UN which it will control increasingly as it gains power. It will rule the world through it, and in the usual way, will serve its own power interests rather than the people’s. Unless the people unite, and this can only be done by forming a minimal world political culture.

not usually, no. Mostly its polemical drivel, except when it is genuinely insane. But I like to see the change that occurs over months, since it usually takes that long to digest ideas that penetrate the ideological reaction of most commenters.

no, not everyone, but mostly. Most commenters here identify with reactionary populism, and those who object to the standard bigotry have generally left the blog. They are mostly like you, supporting fascism, and opposing liberalism and socialism.

However the bigotry appears to be specialized. Infowars commenters, for example, tend to be anti-Catholic, and I didn’t know that bigotry against Catholics was still a viable cultural current. Probably it is in the South. Memory Hole bloggers tend, on the other hand, to be anti-Semitic, I haven’t noticed any particular anti-Catholic tendencies. Nor any anti-Semitic ones in Infowars. Both blogs are of course anti-Muslim.

Professor Tracy mentions that, “some of the very interests involved in the “Global Goals” are likewise putting the finishing touches on the Trans-Pacific trade agreement, designed to (not coincidentally) crush the nation state.”

I want to add that the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) trade agreement is part of a triumvirate of current US trade strategies that includes the less-well-known TransAtlantic Trade and Investment Pact (TTIP), and the secretive Trade in Services Agreement (TISA).

TISA is the largest component of the three, combining 52 nations, more than TPP and TTIP together, and 70% of all trade in services worldwide. However, as reported on Scoop Feed, “Earlier this month Uruguay’s government decided to end its participation in the secret negotiations of the Trade in Services Agreement (TISA).”

For more about Uruguay’s withdrawal from global negotiations and secrecy, and an outline of the aims of the confidential TISA document, which was supposed to remain secret for five years after signing, follow this link:

I am in a rather “happy mood”, being Friday evening..listening to the Bee Gees : “Don’t throw it All Away on Love.. ..”, when I stumbled across the UN’s Goals..costing a mere $5Trillion !!

A quick glance at the Seventeen Goals..reveals that the ONLY GOAL..WITH THE “ILLUMINATI EYE” attached..is Goal 13..which states that Urgent Action Must be taken against Climate Change..”, which as All who know what the “Agenda” of the 1% is..is to Continue Controlling All Resources..especially the New Plastic Digital Money..by their FAKE SCIENTIFIC GOOGA !!

All or Most of the other Goals like Elimination of Poverty etc is a “far-fetched Alien-Dream”. It will Never Happen on these “idiotz” Watch..because Deception..Deceit..Dishonesty..is their Chief Hallmark..from the zionists Planning & Executing 9/11..to Sabra..Chatilla..Gaza..Palestine..& of course..amongst many more : The USS-Liberty..

But not All are “blinded”.Many principled people such as Dr Alan Sabrosky, Chris Bonnell, Ken O Keefe, Gerald Celenté, Alex Jones, Gordon Duff, Edward Said, Sikander Mohamed, 1500 Architects 400 Pilots etc etc..have spoken out..so that about 70% of Americans now know the Truth of 9/11 & the real Aims & Objectives of the zionist-Movements..but much more needs to be done..BEFORE THE NEXT USA-ELECTION..”IF” ever there will be one. According to William Tapley..Obama is the Last President of the USA..& Pope Francis is the Last Pope .. !!

Oh, and if it’s not obvious from my remarks, for the sake of readers who did not glean it, I will state explicitly the two factors that underlie my reasoning in this matter.

The first is that almost all problems of Biblical interpretation trace back to translation issues. Specific words, in English (actually, ALL translations) are often used as doctrinal anchors, but are completely misleading because the translators did not realize that the principle of parsimony can actually destroy the original meaning (parsimony is the goal of trying for a one-to-one translation of each Hebrew or Greek word in the original into a single English (or other) equivalent. Hence, the complete confusion that arises when “Nachash” is rendered “serpent.”

Sometimes, it completely destroys the original intended meaning. Take, for example, the last chapter of John’s Gospel (https://www.blueletterbible.org/nasb/jhn/21/1/s_1018001), starting at verse 15. To understand what’s going on here, we have to know that there are four words in Greek for what we, in English, call “love.” (One is the love of your neighborhood, or childhood memory about your first pet, for example; another is the love of close friends; another is erotic love; and finally, the greatest kind of love, the kind only God can provide, from outside ourselves.) Two of the Greek words for “love” are used in the passage: “phileo” and “agape.” Peter keeps saying “phileo” in response to Jesus’ hope that he’s already got “agape” for Him. Finally, Jesus gives up, and accepts Peter’s lesser form as “good enough for now.” As you can see, the true message is completely lost in translation. You have to take the time to dig it out.

The other factor is the inarguable truth that the Bible, all 66 books, is an integrated message system from outside space-time, written by something like 40 different people over the course of thousands of years (the word itself, “Bible,” means “library”), guided by the creator of the universe to tell mankind what’s going on, why we are here and what we are supposed to be doing.

That fact has four implications that must be borne in mind at all times when discussing the Bible. First, that each contributor carries into the composition his own style, temperament and vocabulary; second, that the closer we can get to the original texts, and the concepts that the original writers had in mind, the better we are able to glean the intended meaning; third, that since it was all inspired by God Himself, in the form of the Holy Spirit, coherent themes and teachings, threads of thought, are woven consistently from Genesis to Revelation; and fourth, that probing and analysis of the text are not just necessary, but an intended part of the point of the project to begin with: we are expected to interact with the text, because that’s how the truth is actually found (which is not to say that the surface meaning is not true, also).

So textual criticism of the Bible is not only acceptable, but essential. This is in contrast to the Koran, which Moslems believe is the word-for-word transcription of what Allah told Mohammed in that Arabian cave in the seventh century. Moslems can’t tear the text apart and question what it means, and the history of its construction and interpretation, because it is, in essence, for them, the very embodiment of Allah.

“there are other gods besides the Judaic and Christian God?
Jesus was a scapegoat that voluntarily took the sins of humanity on himself?”

Exactly. This is a perfect summary of the Gospel–that is, the message of the Bible from Genesis on.

In fact, Mark, the very invocation of the term “scapegoat” is a demonstration of that. If you read the passage of scripture it comes from (Leviticus 16), and recognize that Jesus is the predicted Messiah, you will see that that’s who the symbology was originally intended to point to. As I said (in the comment still in moderation), this is one of the threads of coherent meaning that can be detected running from Genesis to Revelation.

I’m ashamed to say, Patrick, that, although Jewish, I have never read the Jewish bible, the Old Testament, all the way through. I’ve tried, God knows, I’ve tried, but it is so lengthy, boring, tedious, preposterous, barbarous, and irrelevant that I could not summon the fortitude to endure it. It is true, as well, that I do not enjoy the notion of God as a homicidal maniac.

Now the Christian bible is quite different, and I sailed through it in a few hours, especially as it is so repetitious. I confess I don’t see how it inspired a world religion. But I’ve tried to read the Sacred Books of other religions as well, failing miserably as usual, and it appears that what is Written, which most people don’t read, has little to do with what people believe.

It takes work, no doubt about it. The Bible can’t be “read.” It’s too dense, to many-layered. It has to be studied. Yours and my comments were trapped in moderation for a few hours, and one of mine (just below) talks about how I suspect that you are purely secular–so what you say here does not at all surprise me.

But if you actually tried to understand the book, the” library,” that defines your people, I assure you that it would transform your life–and you will be happier for it.

The book is indeed boring and tedious, if you don’t have the keys that help to unlock it. Dr. Heiser, and Dr. Bullinger, are examples of people who hand us such keys. Once opened, we can see the vast oceans of fantastic, technicolor, thought-horizons that used to look like barren, dull junkyards.

Bible study becomes the greatest adventure available on Earth. You should give it a try.

Patrick, you are absolutely correct. I studied the Old Testament (it took me more than three years of daily study) and it was the best thing I ever did. One of the results is that I take God and His precious gift far more seriously than I ever imagined I would, hence my strong reaction to what I thought was Folk’s blasphemous flippancy.

I AM sorry, Folk. Of COURSE Jesus was a scapegoat who voluntarily took our sins upon Himself. The key to the Old Testament is understanding the relationship between the Israelites and God. God did not force himself upon hapless, unsuspecting people. The entire Old Testament is full of prophecy about the Messiah…everything in it points to Him. It really is a wondrous thing.

Don’t be TOO sorry, Recynd. My stuff is not blasphemous because I take the basic myths of traditional religion about as seriously, and critique them with the same seriousness, that I would Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs. I was just interested in Patrick’s view that there were many gods assumed in the Old Testament, when the Abrahamic religions are conceived as monotheistic religions.

Religion is a power ideology. It posits powerful gods, or Almighty God, in a Trancendental theory which contains a largely covert political subtext that legitimates earthly power. That is why it has endured century after century, it has served the power interests of ruling power.

However it increases personal power as well. The Muslims in Gitmo and in the other American torture chambers could endure the horrors inflicted on them by Americans, including the sexual tortures, and still maintain their integrity, even while being tortured to death.

It is much more difficult to maintain this kind of courage with a secular ideology.

” I was just interested in Patrick’s view that there were many gods assumed in the Old Testament, when the Abrahamic religions are conceived as monotheistic religions.”

This is just a nonsensical slogan, devoid of meaning. You could worship Zeus, and claim he is the only god–would that make you a “monotheist”? In other words, what’s so great about monotheism?

The Bible teaches that there are lots of gods in the Divine Council, and many of them were assigned rulership over the nations. But they are all created beings. There is one God, YHWH, who created all the rest, and He created a nation for Himself, you, Mark, being one of those people, and He gave them a purpose.

The stupid slogan is a shoehorn to squeeze Mohammed’s weird ideology into the Biblical tradition. No one should pay it any mind.

We all have a giant selection before us of gods whom we shall worship (“atheism” is one of them). The point of the Bible is to direct us to the One who created all the rest, and, as the Commandment says, “have no other god before Me.” Ask yourself this: if there are no other gods, why did that commandment make the Big 10? Is YHWH stupid?

No, He’s not stupid, and He didn’t forget that He created all the others. He is advising His people not to drift into the ways of the other nations, because it won’t work out well. Guess what? They couldn’t do it, and paid a terrible price, over and over.

I think it was on that third tablet in Mel Brooks’ History of the World Part I.
But seriously, this discussion was good for me. Patrick noted a few years back that he sometimes stays out of Bible discussions here because he finds the book to be “pregnant” with meaning. My own journey is finding that to be overwhelmingly true, as I am starting to see what he meant by that. When reading scripture, it seems the first layer of meaning is usually hidden in plain sight from me, probably because my early church experiences with the Bible sucked so bad, that it hardened me and put scales over my eyes as well(yes that is from the Bible). Why did church and Sunday school work so hard to neglect that the Book is about the supernatural? Wouldn’t that have made the whole idea of religion better? Isn’t that what religion is about? Believing in that which we cannot see? All our lives, Hollywood bombards us with tales of the supernatural, but it stops as we walk through the doors of a church.

Thanks for the link to Heiser’s site; I was unfamiliar with him. Do you know of Chris White? I thought his debunking of Jordan Maxwell was top-notch. Now THAT’S the kind of de-bunking I always hope to see vis-a-vis Sandy Hook or chemtrails, but never get (maybe because the conspiracy theorists’ theories aren’t de-bunkable).

Heiser is also Jewish and about is credible as snow white. I have read it until I got to the two divine pillars Judaism in heaven. yawn. Many claim he is just another intel source with a bs story.

You put too much stock in Constantine the Roman Ceasar who got together with his boys and plagiarized the Vedas and came up with the bible. Many of the stories in Ceasar’s bible or nothing more than a rehash of ancient Vedic tales.

Manu saved the world from the flood about 2 billion years ago.

What Jesus really had to say is covered very little in the bible. The Essene gospel comes much closer. However the real message of Jesus is to be found in both Hinduism and Buddhism frankly. It all revolves around the OM vibration, the cosmic creator, you know the one Jesus referred to as his father and communicated with.

The word is not a book, although most backwoods country preachers will try and pawn that off as the gospel.

I find Hinduism and Buddhism very interesting. I’ve pondered as to how it remains out of the Jewish-Christian-Islam circle, yet is closer to Christianity than the Talmud and Koran could ever be. I can’t really tell whats the difference between the Talmud and Koran for they both say the same thing “kill the infidel, rape, steal from anybody who isn’t your race or religion.”

I refuse to enter the far right prison column, and I hope the rest will join me here.

Recynd, replying to Mark (and please, Mark, if you insist upon using a different handle, stop using one that has “truth” in it–it does not suit you), says

“It’s one thing to discuss these topics with people who can conduct themselves with a semblance of respect, but you are just being nasty. What a superiority complex you have!”

That’s just his style.

He’s a Jew, which is fine, no problem about that. There are four kinds of Jews: secular Jews, who are uninterested in theology, much less taking over the world; nominally observant Jews who are fine people, good neighbors and citizens who are sometimes maddeningly socialistic politically and others who are, more and more, horrified by the results of those policies; Orthodox Jews who really take Jewishness seriously, but have no desire to take over the world; and full-fledged Talmudists who really intend to conquer the world.

Oh, there is a fifth category: those who, like Peter and Matthew and the rest of Jesus’ pals, had nothing to do with the Talmud, and saw Jesus in every page of the Torah. Lots of Messianic Jews are waking up to the truth every day. If a Jew simply reads the Bible (the Old Testament is all it is to them), and disregards the traditions of the rabbis (as Jesus did– Mat 5:17 “Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill), he/she will awaken to the fact that their predicted messiah arrived, right on Daniel’s schedule.

I think Mark is a secular Jew who knows little about these matters. Which makes it a real possibility he can end up in the fifth category. So be kind, Recynd.

It’s true that I know little about conventional religion, but I think it the central ideology of political culture. America has been a highly religious country historically, which is why the American people, in crucial ways, are ideologically insane. Religion has been used to legitimate the racist violence that is central to American imperialism.

Dublin is a scholarly anti-Semite with a rich fantasy life, stating wildly preposterous assertions in the customary religious way, or in his case, anti-religious way. Kol Nidre is a sung or chanted prayer (or non-prayer as it turns out) that begins the Holiest day of the Jewish religion, the Day of Atonement, where you have to fast and pray all day. I remember it particularly because I have never felt more intense boredom in my life, except possibly in some social science classes.

I should explain that all the prayers are conducted in Hebrew, or in this case Aramaic, where the meaning is unknown to the congregation. This is often the case in religion, where the services are conducted in an unfamiliar language, preferably a dead one. Latin, Greek, Hebrew, ancient Chinese, etc have been old favorites, to keep the people from understanding the superstitions, absurdities, and perverse moral values they are adhering to.

In this case Dublin is quite right. I looked it up and, astonishingly, it is not a prayer at all, but a declamation that all the oaths and promises that one is going to make in the coming year are not valid! Why? God knows, its religion. Unconvincing explanations are made, but apparently that the reason that the non-prayer is famous and is repeated century after century is because people liked the melody. Jews pride themselves that their religion is more rational than the others, but that’s probably because they read the bible as little as Americans do, and don’t know what is actually in the religion. Obviously I don’t.

25 For I do not want you, brethren, to be uninformed of this mystery–so that you will not be wise in your own estimation–that a partial hardening has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in; 26 and so all Israel will be saved; just as it is written, “THE DELIVERER WILL COME FROM ZION, HE WILL REMOVE UNGODLINESS FROM JACOB.” 27 “THIS IS MY COVENANT WITH THEM, WHEN I TAKE AWAY THEIR SINS.” 28 From the standpoint of the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but from the standpoint of God’s choice they are beloved for the sake of the fathers; 29 for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30 For just as you once were disobedient to God, but now have been shown mercy because of their disobedience, 31 so these also now have been disobedient, that because of the mercy shown to you they also may now be shown mercy. 32 For God has shut up all in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all.

The worst form of blindness, as I say, is the Talmud, which is an active evil. But Mark is a completely different breed of cat: blind because of the passive religion of secularism, which is just as prideful as is the talmudist.

Paul makes explicit in Romans that all ethnic Jews will one day be redeemed–because that’s what God promised, and He can’t break His vow. But there is a mystery about the intensity of the rejection of their messiah. In Matthew 5:17, the word “abolish” is a term of art in Hebrew, referring to the rabbis accusation that He was misreading scripture. Jesus put them on notice that He, the Author of scripture, was CORRECTING, undoing the false interpretations they were teaching the people. He denounced their “traditions,” which is the Talmud. He was in essence telling them, stick with God’s Word, not the words of men.

It should not be surprising that such an essential part of the redemptive Plan would have many categories.

Heiser is as phony as a 3 dollar bill. The best way for people to form an opinion on Sitchin’s interpretations of the Enuma Elish would be to read the books like I did, some 15 of them and see if they fit within one’s personal conception of reality. It beats analyzing something you have never read hands down.

Buddhists, Hindus Mathatmas worldwide will tell you that Sitchin is pretty close to what is taught in their temples for hundreds of years and I have talked to many of them. I am going with them over Heiser every time.

If you read this article (http://www.sitchiniswrong.com/nephilim/nephilim.htm) and can’t see that Sitchin could not speak the ancient languages he claims to have translated, there’s no point in talking. Sitchin was a crank. He piled up a lot of money, though.

All the articles are that good.

Heiser is perhaps the world’s premier expert on the ancient languages.

On an unrelated matter, The propaganda on who is worse in Syria is at an all time high. WE bombed the hospital with Doc’s without borders and now the US claims 4 of the missiles out of the 26 Russia launched hit Iranian hospitals.

According to Reuters, “opposition to the so-called Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership (TTIP) has risen over the past year in Germany, with critics fearing the pact will hand too much power to big multinationals at the expense of consumers and workers.”

“Popular anger appears to be focused on the encroachment by corporations into every corner around the globe,” as well as, “the secrecy covering the treaty and its negotiations.”

Memory Hole News/Analysis Feed: Scoop Feed

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