What a TOTAL stink job by Lydowns today! Without Calvin we are nothing. Just goes to show how thin the talent base is on this team. You can thank Mayhew's poor drafting for that.

No, it's not just that. It has to do with coaching as well. The team was simply not prepared to play today. It's the coaches job to prepare them. Other teams lose valuable starters and continue to be competitive, if not win the tough games. The Lions are too heavily dependent on a couple key players, and they use that as an excuse for their losses. They are not reasons, just excuses. It also falls on the players themselves. Calvin can't catch the ball for the receivers, or throw the ball for Stafford, or defend the opposition. Those are all things that were in question today, and something Calvin has no part of during any given game. Same with Reggie Bush. I agree that it changes the defensive look that the team will see if CJ or RB21 is not in the game. But that's no reason or excuse for missed passes, dropped passes, or poor coverage. These guys get paid hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars to play this game and win, with or without CJ and RB21. They need to be reminded of that.

The other team gets paid just as much to play and take advantage of things like the Lions top 2 WR's not being in the game. Just saying, the Lions are not the only team getting paid.

October 7th, 2013, 9:15 am

thelomasbrowns

Pro Bowl Player

Joined: August 24th, 2010, 9:54 pmPosts: 2482

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

Mayhew should get on the phone and line up a real receiver. We've had some bad luck there, but it's about how you adjust (especially before the trade deadline).

_________________Jim Caldwell, on whether Jim Harbaugh is stealing his thunder: "Me? I don't have any thunder."

October 7th, 2013, 10:45 am

kdsberman

Team MVP

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pmPosts: 3422Location: Saginaw, MI

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

thelomasbrowns wrote:

Mayhew should get on the phone and line up a real receiver. We've had some bad luck there, but it's about how you adjust (especially before the trade deadline).

Dont tell Mayhew that, because that makes way too much sense. Remember, we got Olgletree!! That saved our season!

This isn't an excuse, but a statement of fact: The Lions are a top-heavy team.

Four players in particular are integral to their success: Stafford, Johnson, Suh and Bush. If any of those four is out for a given game, you should not expect the Lions to win (unless they happen to be playing a terrible team like the Redskins). However, if all four of them are playing, the Lions are a very difficult team to beat.

You can blame whoever you want for that: the coaches, the front office, whomever. The team as a whole doesn't have a lot of depth, and schematically the Lions are very one-dimensional*.

*The Lions offense is dependent on fielding Bush and Johnson at the same time. The players compliment eachother well and cannot both be shut down; defenses have to focus on one, giving the other one a guaranteed 150-200 yard game. The defense is based on the pass rush, and does best when the Lions are in the lead. It is not good enough to win any games.

October 7th, 2013, 11:17 am

m2karateman

RIP Killer

Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10066Location: Where ever I'm at now

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

thelomasbrowns wrote:

Look, it was bad. An offensive nightmare, that's for sure. But realistically, how many teams would light it up if their top two receivers were out?

It's not about 'lighting it up', it's about performance and doing what you get paid for. Quarterbacks are supposed to hit their receivers in the NFL when they are open, not miss them time and again. Receivers get paid to catch the ball when it is within acceptable reach, not drop passes that grade school kids would catch. It is the secondary's job to cover receivers, not allow them to run right past them for a deep TD pass.

These are not things the our top two receivers being out of the game affect, at all. Whether CJ and Nate are playing have no bearing on Stafford being inconsistent (AGAIN!), on Scheffler, Durham and Ogletree dropping balls, or our corners and safeties looking at each other with a 'what happened ' look on their faces when an opposing receiver just beat them all deep and they weren't within five yards of the guy.

BillySims wrote:

The other team gets paid just as much to play and take advantage of things like the Lions top 2 WR's not being in the game. Just saying, the Lions are not the only team getting paid.

I'm not talking about what the other team was able to do defensively. Our top two receivers being out does NOT affect our defensive coverage. And dropping a pass is NOT acceptable. I'm not even talking about having the ball knocked out, or stripped. We're talking about basic toss and catch here. The Lions were crummy at both yesterday. I understand the running game was going to suffer. I already addressed that. But the basic fundamentals of the game DO NOT CHANGE because CJ and Nate are in street clothes. It's a sh*t excuse. It was a sh*t excuse for the Arizona loss because RB21 wasn't in, and it was a sh*t excuse for yesterdays loss. If the other team flat out beats you, then that's fine. But the Lions beat themselves as much as anything yesterday. They were defeated before they even hit the field. The only ones who seemed to show up to play were the front seven of the defense. The rest of them seemed to be completely off base.

_________________I will not put on blinders when it comes to our QBs performances.

October 7th, 2013, 11:27 am

jrd66

National Champion

Joined: February 10th, 2005, 6:52 pmPosts: 850Location: Linden, MI

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

I guess I just don't get it. Or I'm some sort of apologist or whatever. What exactly do people think Stafford should be doing here? I saw last year a number of times where he flat out missed throws to guys where he could have made big plays. This year I don't see that. he was 25/40 I think yesterday. I saw 3 silly drops in big time situations. Bush on the screen, what's his face in the end zone and Scheffler on 3rd down for the game ending drive.

All QBs miss some throws. Stafford to me seems to be going to the right place a lot of times, and getting hosed by his teammates who don't make the play. He's not blameless, but the clowns on the radio who want Hill to play are driving me nuts. Calvin can't throw it to himself, but Stafford can't run the routes right and catch it himself either. The reason those other QBs 'make the other guys better' is because the other guys can actually play in those other cities.

Most of the Lions WR depth came off the street or from cuts off other teams. What I can't figure out is how these guys on the team now are somehow better than the actual proven retreads that might be signed off the street now. Guys like Braylon Edwards, maybe Breaston, amongst others.

I forget who wrote it, but the post about needing both Bush and CJ is spot on. I wouldn't be opposed to a trade now for a WR, except that I am not confident Mayhew can identify one that can play. He's had zero success in acquiring one in the past 4 years.

_________________OK. Schwartz is fired, the fans are happy, now what?

October 7th, 2013, 2:54 pm

Shotty

Millen Draft Pick - Epic Bust

Joined: July 3rd, 2012, 2:06 amPosts: 717

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

Broyles wasn't healthy, and doesn't look close to it. Durham is meh. Pettigrew sucks, Scheffler sucks, the GB refs still hate us (Stafford runs for a 1st on 3rd down, holding. We stop them three times on third down to have the stop nullified by an absurd penalty that their defense is committing all game long), Suh is the best DT in the NFL, Idonije was a FA for a clear reason, Reiff got beat numerous times, so the growing pains are coming, Stafford missed some easy throws that he should have been hitting since 2011 but still seems to miss for some reason, and we'd be lucky to win 5 games without Calvin. I'm not discouraged about this loss, though. The defense played great other than two plays, as usual, and if Calvin was in we would've controlled the clock worlds better and of course scored more points. Houston's hammy should've kept him out, Slay is lost, Levy looks really good, and since Fairley's injury he hasn't done anything. That's about it. Now lets get CJ back and show these Brownies whats up.

_________________

October 7th, 2013, 2:56 pm

kdsberman

Team MVP

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pmPosts: 3422Location: Saginaw, MI

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

jrd66 wrote:

I guess I just don't get it. Or I'm some sort of apologist or whatever. What exactly do people think Stafford should be doing here? I saw last year a number of times where he flat out missed throws to guys where he could have made big plays. This year I don't see that. he was 25/40 I think yesterday. I saw 3 silly drops in big time situations. Bush on the screen, what's his face in the end zone and Scheffler on 3rd down for the game ending drive.

All QBs miss some throws. Stafford to me seems to be going to the right place a lot of times, and getting hosed by his teammates who don't make the play. He's not blameless, but the clowns on the radio who want Hill to play are driving me nuts. Calvin can't throw it to himself, but Stafford can't run the routes right and catch it himself either. The reason those other QBs 'make the other guys better' is because the other guys can actually play in those other cities.

Most of the Lions WR depth came off the street or from cuts off other teams. What I can't figure out is how these guys on the team now are somehow better than the actual proven retreads that might be signed off the street now. Guys like Braylon Edwards, maybe Breaston, amongst others.

I forget who wrote it, but the post about needing both Bush and CJ is spot on. I wouldn't be opposed to a trade now for a WR, except that I am not confident Mayhew can identify one that can play. He's had zero success in acquiring one in the past 4 years.

Best post i've read so far right here.

Like you said, Stafford isnt blameless, but the Scheffler drop and the Durham hit in the facemask in the endzone says it all. These guys are worthless.

I guess I just don't get it. Or I'm some sort of apologist or whatever. What exactly do people think Stafford should be doing here? I saw last year a number of times where he flat out missed throws to guys where he could have made big plays. This year I don't see that. he was 25/40 I think yesterday. I saw 3 silly drops in big time situations. Bush on the screen, what's his face in the end zone and Scheffler on 3rd down for the game ending drive.

All QBs miss some throws. Stafford to me seems to be going to the right place a lot of times, and getting hosed by his teammates who don't make the play. He's not blameless, but the clowns on the radio who want Hill to play are driving me nuts. Calvin can't throw it to himself, but Stafford can't run the routes right and catch it himself either. The reason those other QBs 'make the other guys better' is because the other guys can actually play in those other cities.

Most of the Lions WR depth came off the street or from cuts off other teams. What I can't figure out is how these guys on the team now are somehow better than the actual proven retreads that might be signed off the street now. Guys like Braylon Edwards, maybe Breaston, amongst others.

I forget who wrote it, but the post about needing both Bush and CJ is spot on. I wouldn't be opposed to a trade now for a WR, except that I am not confident Mayhew can identify one that can play. He's had zero success in acquiring one in the past 4 years.

Best post i've read so far right here.

Like you said, Stafford isnt blameless, but the Scheffler drop and the Durham hit in the facemask in the endzone says it all. These guys are worthless.

Totally agree. If a good QB should be able to make any jobber WR look good, why did Denver go out and sign Welker? Why is Brady struggling?

_________________Jim Caldwell, on whether Jim Harbaugh is stealing his thunder: "Me? I don't have any thunder."

Look, it was bad. An offensive nightmare, that's for sure. But realistically, how many teams would light it up if their top two receivers were out?

It's not about 'lighting it up', it's about performance and doing what you get paid for. Quarterbacks are supposed to hit their receivers in the NFL when they are open, not miss them time and again. Receivers get paid to catch the ball when it is within acceptable reach, not drop passes that grade school kids would catch. It is the secondary's job to cover receivers, not allow them to run right past them for a deep TD pass.

These are not things the our top two receivers being out of the game affect, at all. Whether CJ and Nate are playing have no bearing on Stafford being inconsistent (AGAIN!), on Scheffler, Durham and Ogletree dropping balls, or our corners and safeties looking at each other with a 'what happened ' look on their faces when an opposing receiver just beat them all deep and they weren't within five yards of the guy.

BillySims wrote:

The other team gets paid just as much to play and take advantage of things like the Lions top 2 WR's not being in the game. Just saying, the Lions are not the only team getting paid.

I'm not talking about what the other team was able to do defensively. Our top two receivers being out does NOT affect our defensive coverage. And dropping a pass is NOT acceptable. I'm not even talking about having the ball knocked out, or stripped. We're talking about basic toss and catch here. The Lions were crummy at both yesterday. I understand the running game was going to suffer. I already addressed that. But the basic fundamentals of the game DO NOT CHANGE because CJ and Nate are in street clothes. It's a sh*t excuse. It was a sh*t excuse for the Arizona loss because RB21 wasn't in, and it was a sh*t excuse for yesterdays loss. If the other team flat out beats you, then that's fine. But the Lions beat themselves as much as anything yesterday. They were defeated before they even hit the field. The only ones who seemed to show up to play were the front seven of the defense. The rest of them seemed to be completely off base.

So, because our top 2 WR's were not playing, our offense was unable to stay on the field. As a result, our defense was on the field far too much. And that doesn't affect how tired our defense got late in the game? OK. No sense arguing with you.

October 7th, 2013, 3:09 pm

Shotty

Millen Draft Pick - Epic Bust

Joined: July 3rd, 2012, 2:06 amPosts: 717

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

BillySims wrote:

m2karateman wrote:

thelomasbrowns wrote:

Look, it was bad. An offensive nightmare, that's for sure. But realistically, how many teams would light it up if their top two receivers were out?

It's not about 'lighting it up', it's about performance and doing what you get paid for. Quarterbacks are supposed to hit their receivers in the NFL when they are open, not miss them time and again. Receivers get paid to catch the ball when it is within acceptable reach, not drop passes that grade school kids would catch. It is the secondary's job to cover receivers, not allow them to run right past them for a deep TD pass.

These are not things the our top two receivers being out of the game affect, at all. Whether CJ and Nate are playing have no bearing on Stafford being inconsistent (AGAIN!), on Scheffler, Durham and Ogletree dropping balls, or our corners and safeties looking at each other with a 'what happened ' look on their faces when an opposing receiver just beat them all deep and they weren't within five yards of the guy.

BillySims wrote:

The other team gets paid just as much to play and take advantage of things like the Lions top 2 WR's not being in the game. Just saying, the Lions are not the only team getting paid.

I'm not talking about what the other team was able to do defensively. Our top two receivers being out does NOT affect our defensive coverage. And dropping a pass is NOT acceptable. I'm not even talking about having the ball knocked out, or stripped. We're talking about basic toss and catch here. The Lions were crummy at both yesterday. I understand the running game was going to suffer. I already addressed that. But the basic fundamentals of the game DO NOT CHANGE because CJ and Nate are in street clothes. It's a sh*t excuse. It was a sh*t excuse for the Arizona loss because RB21 wasn't in, and it was a sh*t excuse for yesterdays loss. If the other team flat out beats you, then that's fine. But the Lions beat themselves as much as anything yesterday. They were defeated before they even hit the field. The only ones who seemed to show up to play were the front seven of the defense. The rest of them seemed to be completely off base.

So, because our top 2 WR's were not playing, our offense was unable to stay on the field. As a result, our defense was on the field far too much. And that doesn't affect how tired our defense got late in the game? OK. No sense arguing with you.

This. The defense was tired all game with the 3 and outs and they had a fantastic first half and probably would've had a fantastic game if it weren't for them being on the field so often. My MAIN KEY going into this game was to keep the ball out of Rodgers hands. That's what happens when you don't. Eventually he'll get you.

_________________

October 7th, 2013, 3:11 pm

jrd66

National Champion

Joined: February 10th, 2005, 6:52 pmPosts: 850Location: Linden, MI

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

Actually I forgot about the Durham face clank in the end zone. I was referring to the Patrick Edwards impression of Az Zahir Hakim..

_________________OK. Schwartz is fired, the fans are happy, now what?

October 7th, 2013, 3:41 pm

The Legend

Off. Coordinator – Joe Lombardi

Joined: February 11th, 2005, 3:01 pmPosts: 4030Location: WSU

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

jrd66 wrote:

I guess I just don't get it. Or I'm some sort of apologist or whatever. What exactly do people think Stafford should be doing here? I saw last year a number of times where he flat out missed throws to guys where he could have made big plays. This year I don't see that. he was 25/40 I think yesterday. I saw 3 silly drops in big time situations. Bush on the screen, what's his face in the end zone and Scheffler on 3rd down for the game ending drive.

All QBs miss some throws. Stafford to me seems to be going to the right place a lot of times, and getting hosed by his teammates who don't make the play. He's not blameless, but the clowns on the radio who want Hill to play are driving me nuts. Calvin can't throw it to himself, but Stafford can't run the routes right and catch it himself either. The reason those other QBs 'make the other guys better' is because the other guys can actually play in those other cities.

Most of the Lions WR depth came off the street or from cuts off other teams. What I can't figure out is how these guys on the team now are somehow better than the actual proven retreads that might be signed off the street now. Guys like Braylon Edwards, maybe Breaston, amongst others.

I forget who wrote it, but the post about needing both Bush and CJ is spot on. I wouldn't be opposed to a trade now for a WR, except that I am not confident Mayhew can identify one that can play. He's had zero success in acquiring one in the past 4 years.

i agree completely. m2k still upset about stafford beating out culpepper in 2009. these receivers arent playmakers and thats what the lions need. if they want to be serious about winning this season they should go out and grab a legit No 2 WR pair him with Megatron, put Broyles and or Edwards into there appropriate roles in the slot with Bush mixing in and then we ll see if Stafford is an issue. go get hakeem nicks and give up what they want - i dont wanna look back at calvin, stafford, suh's time with the lions and think that management never swung for the fences. last i checked he doesnt have demerius thomas, eric decker, wes welker, julius thomas, etc but i do agree with m2k that there were coaching issues in this one. yes they passed a lot but they were running some bs plays. i would ve liked to see more of bush in the slot with bell in the backfield. the way green bay was keying bush why not some more play action. maybe a flea flicker. why on earth the lions ever ever run an empty backfield so much is beyond me...just stop it with that linehan. i know they love there x's and o's but the basic fundamental of being too predictable on offense was a huge problem in this game and overlooked too often by this coaching staff

October 7th, 2013, 4:51 pm

Pablo

RIP Killer

Joined: August 6th, 2004, 9:21 amPosts: 9596Location: Dallas

Re: GAME DAY THREAD: Lions @ Packers

OK, I've been a little reluctant to post about this game. I'm actually pretty OK with the way things turned out...

The defense looked playoff caliber for the most part against one of the most potent offenses in the league... The front 7 were really solid.

The offense sputtered without CJ... Well, duh! I'm sorry, if CJ goes down the Lions are toast. Same with Stafford... To some degree Bush... There is a synergistic dynamic at work here that we have just got to accept.

Special teams - well remember last year... Punting has been really strong, Akers had one rough outing, the coverage units have been legit. The return game could be better, but again ST are way better.

Now, if CJ had to miss one of the first 5 games of the year I probably would have picked GB. The Leo's never win there, GB was coming off a bye. And hell, look who is still in first place!

To M2K's point, that was a winnable game and we could have done better but I'm looking big picture and I want CJ back and ready for CLE at full strength. Win in CLE, then 2 tough but winnable games in Ford Field with the Bungals and Cowgirls ---> could be sitting at 6-2 potentially at the half way mark...