Ok, so when they conceived of the Model 3, I thought it would be awesome because I'm not a fan of giant cars. I see the Model S as a comparable car to a 6 Series Gran Coupe or a 7 Series which are great but bigger than I like driving.

When I saw pics of the Model 3, I was on the fence, and when I saw the instrument cluster, or lack thereof, I lost a bit of interest. Then, the other day, I went to their website and realized they released more detailed stats and delivery time lines, plus the ability to "build" and order the car. So now, despite my problems with the instrument cluster, I kind of regained some interest.

What kind of performance are you talking about? Speed and handling or ownership and quality? I'd probably wait for a new 3 Series G20 in terms of driving pleasure. But for self drive capability, the Tesla.

What kind of performance are you talking about? Speed and handling or ownership and quality? I'd probably wait for a new 3 Series G20 in terms of driving pleasure. But for self drive capability, the Tesla.

I've driven a Model S P85D and it was FAST. And for a 5000lb car, it handled very well. Haven't driven a Model 3 PD yet so have no opinion on handling but 0-60 faster than an M3 is no joke.

What kind of performance are you talking about? Speed and handling or ownership and quality? I'd probably wait for a new 3 Series G20 in terms of driving pleasure. But for self drive capability, the Tesla.

I guess it is just because I am an old fart, but I have no desire for my car to have self drive capability - none at all.

I think it's objectively a decent car but I would never be caught dead in one. Why? Because I used to have clients who drove Teslas and they were insufferable tech nerds. Cars are just a gadget to show off for them. They were not real car enthusiasts. The Model 3 is for people like that.

I guess it is just because I am an old fart, but I have no desire for my car to have self drive capability - none at all.

Agreed, I enjoy driving so wouldn't need those options and per the website that's $8k of options that you don't need to waste money on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Germanauto

I think it's objectively a decent car but I would never be caught dead in one. Why? Because I used to have clients who drove Teslas and they were insufferable tech nerds. Cars are just a gadget to show off for them. They were not real car enthusiasts. The Model 3 is for people like that.

I'll stick with the douchebag BMW image, it fits me better.

What if it wasn't a "Tesla" but a future electric i340 or something, same opinion?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Germanauto

I never cared for the handling. They are heavy cars with absolute dead and lifeless steering.

I've ridden in a friend's 3. It's quick, but if you compared stats, it's only about as fast as a stock 335i. The instant torque makes it feel quicker though. Didn't really test out handling, but in normal daily driving conditions, there's not much body roll through turns.

I am really bugged by one "over-engineered" aspect of it though, specifically how the center console cubby is difficult to close, and if you repeatedly don't close it correctly, a message shows up that tells you to close it softer. Why is this necessary? Just build a better cubby door.

On a side note, the build quality still bugs me, and although Tesla owners can rationalize it, I for one cannot. My buddy had a fogging rear light after his first wash, a misaligned badge, and some unexplained noises. Unacceptable on a $50k new car.

I've ridden in a friend's 3. It's quick, but if you compared stats, it's only about as fast as a stock 335i. The instant torque makes it feel quicker though. Didn't really test out handling, but in normal daily driving conditions, there's not much body roll through turns.

I am really bugged by one "over-engineered" aspect of it though, specifically how the center console cubby is difficult to close, and if you repeatedly don't close it correctly, a message shows up that tells you to close it softer. Why is this necessary? Just build a better cubby door.

On a side note, the build quality still bugs me, and although Tesla owners can rationalize it, I for one cannot. My buddy had a fogging rear light after his first wash, a misaligned badge, and some unexplained noises. Unacceptable on a $50k new car.

That's good to know, which 3 does your friend have? As far as build quality, on the model S it was top notch. I wonder if the 3 is worse because it's cheaper or because they seem to be rushing things to try to hit target sales numbers.

That's good to know, which 3 does your friend have? As far as build quality, on the model S it was top notch. I wonder if the 3 is worse because it's cheaper or because they seem to be rushing things to try to hit target sales numbers.

Long range model, premium interior. I think those were the big options that he chose.

My mom got a Tesla 3 a few months ago. I am very impressed by the handling and drivability. Also, I happen to like the simplicity of the design - especially the interior. The 3 would be one of my top picks in this price range. I wouldn't trade it for my M3, but I would take it over any lesser BMW.

My mom got a Tesla 3 a few months ago. I am very impressed by the handling and drivability. Also, I happen to like the simplicity of the design - especially the interior. The 3 would be one of my top picks in this price range. I wouldn't trade it for my M3, but I would take it over any lesser BMW.

Yeah - very weird, but you get used to it. I like having all the options on one screen, thus my comment re: simplicity. You can tailor the screen to your preferences. It's definitely different to what we're used to.

One of my buddies got a Model 3 a couple months ago and let me drive it. The immediate throttle response was something I was very jealous of, especially with my F30 335xi and the current 230xi having throttle lag, there was none of that on the Model 3. And then on top of that you have the instantaneous power so it feels much sportier and more powerful than it is. It is a cool car for sure, though the regenerative breaking is something you notice right away as it will bring the car to a fairly quick stop (though you can adjust this).

On the note of build quality though, it was disappointing, he had a number of panel gap issues, some rubbing, some way too far away. Supposedly they are going to fix that for him as well as some chips in the paint when he took delivery of the car. I really did not like the fake leather, it was the worst I've seen in a car. And the backseat flooring is way too high up. I'd rather sit in the backseat of my 230 for a long trip than the back of his Model 3. I also really hate the empty dash, especially the wood paneling. I believe the white interior comes with an aluminum panel instead, don't know why you can't get it with the black interior.

You are correct. I didn't mean the base, I meant the Performance version, and with all possible options it's definitely not cheap.

Okay this is kind of fun. I just spec-ed a model 3. The $35,000 car of the people spec-ed all options comes in at $80,000. Eighty thousand. Yowza! It would be faster than a current M3 to 60mph. But would you get it before the next gen M3 is out? And they are building them in a tent? Is that right? It is a stunning number if you ask me. But I suppose it is priced where other cars of that performance level are priced.

Okay this is kind of fun. I just spec-ed a model 3. The $35,000 car of the people spec-ed all options comes in at $80,000. Eighty thousand. Yowza! It would be faster than a current M3 to 60mph. But would you get it before the next gen M3 is out? And they are building them in a tent? Is that right? It is a stunning number if you ask me. But I suppose it is priced where other cars of that performance level are priced.

Okay this is kind of fun. I just spec-ed a model 3. The $35,000 car of the people spec-ed all options comes in at $80,000. Eighty thousand. Yowza! It would be faster than a current M3 to 60mph. But would you get it before the next gen M3 is out? And they are building them in a tent? Is that right? It is a stunning number if you ask me. But I suppose it is priced where other cars of that performance level are priced.

That's what I got except I left off all the auto drive stuff because I like driving. So that lowered the price by 8k. Also, it still qualifies for 7500 in tax incentives so that brings it down to 65.5k.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StuP

I think people get too focused on performance numbers, the number of times you use full throttle and the redline in everyday driving is fairly rare.

BMW has always been about driveability, for straight line performance there have always been better options.

I don't see a Tesla being much more than 'socially aware' bragging, certainly not much of a deal in terms of $ / mph, (although off the line torque is wonderful).

I'm not a fan of purely electric cars, the ecological total impact's too great, and I shudder to think about maintenance costs of a 10 year old one as the batteries and electronics start to fail.

A turbo diesel hybrid might be an interesting path, but I haven't seen anyone pursuing it.

VW was toying with a turbo diesel hybrid golf abt a decade ago but price was too high.

The instant torque of electric is definitely appealing. My last car was a 535d x-drive and the diesel torque was addictive and more useful in day to day driving situations. Seems like electric is even more of that.