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I can't believe that you made this into a public spectacle... this was between you and me and not anyone else's business. I'm sorry if my message seemed harsh to you or anyone else in this board. It was not personal in anyway shape or form. I did make it clear that I will not ship overseas but after three or four pm's from you really wanting to buy my armor, I tried to be more considerate during the holidays and thought I'd give you a chance. But for the terms that you asked for I cannot risk losing something worth over $1200 dollars. By declaring that the items are worth less than what they really are, if I do get insurance I will not get it's actual value if it gets lost or damaged and I will lose out, just put yourself in my shoes. I should've stayed firm with my item description and not bend it in anyway.

For the record, I did not sell the costume to someone else but it has been deleted from the Cargo Hold.

This has happened to me many times. you tell the seller you are interested, send PM, tell them you are sending PP and they come back and say either they have changed thier mind and don't want to sell or they have sold it to someone else?? I had a deal gone bad just the other week when I told a member I wanted the item and that I was first in line. he then responded a day later saying "I sold it to someone else". now here's the point where I lost it.. when I told him that it was wrong what he did, he told me to "get over it"???? now, you talk about going "postal" it was hard for me to keep my mouth shut. I understand where your coming from Alfredo and it sucks when you find something you want espeacially when your first in line only to have the deal go to someone else.

Ben,

I did not sell the armor to someone else. Alfredo blatantly wrote that in his message. What I said was that someone else local is interested in it, not I sold it to someone else.

In all fairness to Alfredo, he had 'committed to buy' and you had accepted.... Regardless of original set terms by yourself, by stringing him along is classed as intent....

Were he stateside, knowing that over there your law system is very flexible and open for a lot of different cases, you might have been in for a long and nasty court case...

Ill admit though, even though having hopes quashed in the past on items i may have been able to get, if not for the fact of 'No international bidders', i could seem bias... But ive learned a little heartbreak and perseverence pays off in the long run.... So i agree that it was wrong, but unfortunately it happens, even with the best of us...

Hey I was even tempted to get this armour, or at least try, but being 165cms id be copping a lot of 'Arent you a little to short for a Storm/Sandtrooper...'

I think one little French saying sums it up though... "c'est la vie"/Such is life...

Please continue to keep this civil. The for sale thread is now in the admin section.

On the idea of keeping some sort or rating, we have not found software that will work with this forum. It has been asked about before.

In general, there is always going to be little groups that like to sell to their friends first or runs that it looks like you can never get in on. In the last 5 years, there where many items I wanted and just never got no matter what number I was on the interest thread I was. That is life. Even as an Admin that has not always helped. So, I just got over it. You can let it eat at you and make you sick or just let it go! Remember, this is a hobby and meant to be FUN!!

What Alfredo neglected to mention was after the PM in which I agreed to sell to him, he sent me two other PMs with his conditions. Now, was that fair from my perspective? If he had presented those conditions in his first attempts to PM me, and I said yes, then I would be guilty of being unfair. To me it seems he had an ulterior motive with his intentions. Since Alfredo's offer was not accepted by another member here yesterday, I understand his frustration, but I wonder if he presented the same conditions to that seller as he did with me. In return, since I was the last seller that did not accept his conditions after I agreed to sell to him under my conditions, he is making it look as if I am to blame. Which I agree to some degree because I should've refused international offers but c'mon folks...two sellers did not accept his offers here! This is what I get for being considerate during the holidays? Tough crowd!

You have to remember that this is not ebay. This is a forum meant for discussing costuming, selling off parts is just an extra thing that we do. They are private transactions, NOT done through TDH. TDH mods have no responsibility in transactions, nor should they. It is a buyer beware market, mods don't need more stuff to worry about. I agree that it may have been a tad rash for the seller to change his mind, I've had that happen to me before. Just a couple of days ago I said I'd buy a motorcycle from someone, but ended up selling to someone else. Why? Because they got the money to them first. I know that isn't exactly what happened here, but it is an example. The item isn't yours until it is paid for.

TD2253
My apologizes to you if my observations of this thread seemed harshed toward your character.Which was not my intentions.
I agree with you that this matter should have stayed private between you and Madrid.

I understand both sides. However, one thing that sticks out to me from personal experience is the whole "Gifting" for lesser value to pay lower customs fees.

Where there is absolutely nothing wrong with this, as I do it all the time for my International Customers (and am happy to do so), there are pitfalls for the seller. I learned the hard way.

Just this year, I had two deals go very bad because the buyer requested that the shipment be gifted for a value of less than $100 ($20 to be specific). However, the buyer also requested that the shipment be insured for it's full value (what the buyer paid) which was $250. Canadian customs in this particular case, red flagged the shipment, and held onto it for 4 MONTHS ! the buyer, was upset with "ME", when all I did was follow instructions to the letter that the buyer laid out for me. Ultimately, I had to refund the buyer's money in the better interest of my reputation, and walk away with my tail tucked between my legs (like I did something wrong). In the end, the buyer ended up receiving the package, and I received no payment. This, is NOT fair.

So this is what your seller is trying to avoid. And for $1200, it's not out of line to want to protect yourself as a seller. Since this has happened to me, I no longer "gift" for a lessor value, if the item is to be insured. It is a conflict in terms to ANY customs official.

I totally agree, that your money is as good as anyone else's. And you're probably a very nice person. But the harsh truth is, in the world we live in today, the prop community is a breeding ground for trouble, and people wanting to take advantage. If you don't know someone, or have never had a dealing with them, it's hard to know for sure. So you have to take precautions as a seller, as there is absolutely NO protection for a seller in the U.S. that sells anything abroad. If someone wants to argue that, I can present a dozen cases in the last 7 years that will most certainly validate the point I'm emphasizing. Pay-Pal, is a joke. Pure and simple. They protect the buyer, above all else, at all cost. The seller gets the wrong end of the stick just about every time.

So where you would like some sort of "Feedback System" for "Sellers" in the interest of your protection as a buyer, we as sellers would want the very same thing for "Buyers". And when you get right down to it, it's not foolproof. People change their board names, log-in with a different IP address, pose as someone else, whatever. If someone wants to take advantage of you, ultimately, they will find a way, and there is nothing we can do to change that. TDH would have to start charging for auctions and sales, before anyone could justify their own personal time in mediating so many transactions here per day. they would need to pay for a full time employee. And that is not the focus of TDH. It is a "Discussion Forum", not an auction house. They allow people to "Buy, Sell, Trade" here. It is a privilege. They don't have to. And if problems like this continue, I wouldn't be at all surprised if eventually they revoke those privileges as a general rule. And frankly, I wouldn't blame them Again, it is a privilege. We should treat it that way.

At TheDentedHelmet.com, we try to protect each other, and keep a vigilant "eye" on those that may not be out for our better interest. And the Forum's Administration does enforce "Fair Trade". They have asked a number of individuals in the past, to "cease and desist" from selling their wares here after receiving a number of complaints and investigating matters. They are there for "you".

So that would be my best suggestion to you. If you find that you are having an issue with another member, and their business practices, you need to report it to the administration, and allow them to take look into it for you. In the end, they cannot get your money back as a buyer, or force someone to sell something to you, but they can certainly help mediate a transaction before it turns sour. And if fault is found with someone you're buying from, they will not hesitate in taking the appropriate actions when necessary. Otherwise, this matter should have remained "Private" between you and the seller. I too have had an instance just recently, where a member thought that exposing a "private transaction" might force me to play nice, and sell to someone I did not wan to sell to. Now, please don't misunderstand, I'm not saying that was your intent. But it could be misinterpreted that way. Better luck to you both (Buyer, and Seller)

TD2253
My apologizes to you if my observations of this thread seemed harshed toward your character.Which was not my intentions.
I agree with you that this matter should have stayed private between you and Madrid.

No worries Mike and thanks for the message! Merry Christmas and take care!

Quote:
Originally Posted by TD2253
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madrid Boba
Any news?

It is just to remind you that i will buy it from you right away....

Thanks

Alfredo

Hi Alfredo,

Sorry it took me a while to respond. If you really, really want the set I will sell it to you for $1200 plus the cost of shipping to Spain. Could you please send me your shipping address and also let me know if you can fit in the medium gloves and size 9.5 Caboots stormtrooper boots so I can include them in the set. I will check how much it will cost to ship out to you.

Thanks!
-Gene
____________________________________

I DID SAY IT PRETTY MUCH CLEAR "IF YOU DONT MIND"

It could have been enough if you reply with a "I can not do it for you Alfredo, please try to understand, i have to send it in one box, and with a 1200 invoice"

Then, probably i could have said" Ok, i understand, i want it anyway, please send it"

I HAVE NOTHING TO HIDE. AND I BELIEVE THAT I HAVE DONE RIGHT IN POSTING THAT HERE.

Let's not beat a dead horse any longer. No physical, nor financial damage was done except for our pride so please for the sake of the holidays and our common interest and love for this hobby, let's just put this behind us and move on.

Well after reading all of this, I would like to give my final 2 cents to this.

As a member that has only recently joined, I try to be as objective as I can, and I certainly do not come here to change things around. But the mods and members should take a few things into consideration.

Yes this is a forum, and not ebay. Some like it, some don't how business is handled here.
Can you implement an ebay system here, the answer is no.
However I notice quite a few people that say go to ebay if you do not like it here. The funny thing is, some sellers go to ebay first, and then come here and advertise that they have stuff listed on ebay, being afraid they won't get the price they want on ebay.But that's just something I noticed along the way.

What the mods/admins should consider is a general feedback topic. Aside from joining the costuming hobby, I have been collecting Star Wars stuff since '77, and one of my favorite forums I post at, has 2 "sticky" topics. One that only lists positive feedback for a transaction and one that lists only negative feedback for a transaction. And it works like a charm. If you sell something you post what you have for sale, the person that receives the items just posts if he received the items and if everything was as described, well packaged, etc, he posts what he feels is important to the deal, or what he feels comfortable posting about the transaction. If there is a neg. issue, you just post that you never got the stuff, or whatever else happened.
There is no cost involved for anybody, not for the seller, not for the buyer and certainly not for the website, admins or mods.
And to keep the topics clean only people involved in the sales are allowed to post, no flame wars, no other members jumping in, that stuff get's deleted. Now what's the advantage!? Simple, if you are new to a site you can read through those posts and see who you should avoid to deal with and who you can trust. A further aspect is, that the seller and buyer can leave a feedback if they wish, and a lot of people would think twice about screwing another member, cause now at least their member names are out there, visible for others and as a newbie you get a good idea of what's going on.

Now one could argue, hey I have been selling for years, and now one bad comment will ruin my reputation. Which of course is not true. If you are continously doing deals with others, and let's say there are 99 posts where everybody is happy, and all of a sudden you get one negative comment, it won't have an effect. But if you sold stuff 5 times and you get 4 neg. and 1 positive, then that's a different story. And looking back at the other forum, I think we only have 2 negatives ever posted over the years, and the rest is all positive.

Now having a similar system like this here, would certainly aid the transactions here. And as far as the comment is concerned logging in with different ip's and or user names, well you can only have so many ip's, and changing your username won't help you that much either, cause If "you" screw me, I can assure you can be found, and speaking for myself, I will find you.
That being said, in the above mentioned case between the 2 members, I think a lot of miscommunication caused the problem, but maybe it's good for something.

Oh, and those feedback topics should apply to the deals in the cargo hold, where one party has something to offer for immediate shipping. The guys that help others out by building stuff for them, that's a different issue. The conditions for those deals are made by the guys that do build the stuff, there is time and labor involved which has an influence to the shipping time. And once you accept the tems as a buyer, that's it.

But if you take someones money for an item you sell, than the buyer should at least be able to expect shipping in a reasonable amount of time. The same way as the seller can expect immediate payment.

When I find myself in times of trouble, mother Mary comes to me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.
And in my hour of darkness she is standing right in front of me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.

Let it be, let it be, let it be, let it be.
Whisper words of wisdom, let it be.

And when the broken hearted people living in the world agree,
there will be an answer, let it be.
For though they may be parted there is still a chance that they will see,
there will be an answer. let it be.

Let it be, let it be, .....

And when the night is cloudy, there is still a light, that shines on me,
shine until tomorrow, let it be.
I wake up to the sound of music, mother Mary comes to me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.

But it is not a question of pride, for me it is a question of principles and education.

Alfredo

Alfredo,

If it was a question of principles and education...then why is it that everyone is reading this? You claim to have principles and education, so why is it that you did not keep this private matter between the two of us as it should have been? If you had responded privately to my last PM regarding the conditions of the sale maybe I would have re-considered and the armor would have been boxed, sealed and on it's way to you today. But instead you had to let everyone in on it which is in-appropriate. I admit I may have chosen the wrong words to say and I already apologized several times on this thread, but this has been blown so out of proportion it's becoming redundant and irritating to say the least.

As a result, you have jeopardized both our reputations as seller and buyer and vice versa on this board by needlessly publicizing a business matter that should have taken place privately. Selling and buying on this board or any other boards similar to this one is a privilege and it's not a right and can be taken away. As a fact of life, we cannot always get what we want and certainly we live in an imperfect world and we all have to accept it no matter what. Making a big scene about it does not help improve the situation and it certainly shows bad demeanor on your part by carrying on with is. So please, let's just put this to rest right now. I want to remain a member of this costuming community and I certainly want the same for you.

When I find myself in times of trouble, mother Mary comes to me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.
And in my hour of darkness she is standing right in front of me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.

Let it be, let it be, let it be, let it be.
Whisper words of wisdom, let it be.

And when the broken hearted people living in the world agree,
there will be an answer, let it be.
For though they may be parted there is still a chance that they will see,
there will be an answer. let it be.

Let it be, let it be, .....

And when the night is cloudy, there is still a light, that shines on me,
shine until tomorrow, let it be.
I wake up to the sound of music, mother Mary comes to me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.

Let it be, let it be, .....

Thanks for the song! You did just that, put a smile on my face! Happy Holidays!