Soapbox: The Wii Changed The Face of Gaming, Before The Console Industry Promptly Forgot Its Lessons

Tom Whitehead believes that the Wii's good work has, in part, been wasted

The Wii is no longer in production in Japan

This week the Nintendo Japan website updated the status of Wii production, officially bringing it to an end. We'd previously argued that Nintendo could have ruled the micro console market with Wii and the company, potentially, missed a trick; it seems to be a decision made on the basis of precedence and convention. We've also already conducted and presented our Wii obituaries in various forms in 2012, as the arrival of the Wii U and the abandonment of Wii development by Nintendo had set the dye, even if it would carry on regardless for another year. There's a certain irony that the most disruptive home console in recent memory ends with a regimented business decision, and that itself reflects a caution not just within Nintendo, but the wider gaming industry at major corporate levels.

When considering the core game-changers introduced by the Wii, many will instinctively — and to a degree correctly — go straight for motion controls. With the Wii Remote and — eventually — MotionPlus, Nintendo took gaming from a preserve for enthusiasts to a universal act. There's often petty mockery of the 'Wii Sports generation', but I think it was the best thing to happen to gaming in recent times. For the first time in my whole life I wasn't just playing games with my older brother, but with my parents and any relative / friend that could instinctively reproduce motions — in other words, everybody and anybody. It was no longer my nerdy little hobby (I wasn't writing about, reviewing or critiquing games or the industry back then) but a shared activity, and I loved the fact that my family could, even in a heavily diluted and simplified experience, see what I loved so much about video games.

Like any viral trend, the motion revolution of the Wii brought its own problems. Shop shelves were crowded with mini-game shovelware that, annoyingly, seemed to sell well, and motion was applied aimlessly in some games; both issues helped give birth to the usage of 'waggle' as a derogatory term. Poor quality releases and a new market of gamers also admittedly brought problems for developers and publishers, as turning a profit on the system wasn't always easy. It brought some interesting reactions from rivals, too, with Sony practically mimicking Nintendo with the Move, while Microsoft introduced Kinect — all options had flaws.

Motion gaming isn't exactly dead, so the legacy of the Wii survives to an extent. Sony's backed away the most, it seems, with its motion bar thing on the new Dualshock which is there because, well, why not. The Wii U fully supports all Wii controllers, meanwhile, with upcoming releases (mainly those riffing on Wii predecessors) making use of those old Remotes, though plenty of games focus on the GamePad and largely avoid waving arms around. Microsoft's upgraded Kinect is no doubt nice and accurate, and arguably targets the motion crowd the most if it works as advertised. The common problems — across the board — that make these varied uses of motion so less effective than the Wii are the emergence of smartphones and tablets in grabbing large parts of the market, but more importantly the price of entry to the latest home consoles and their blatant return to 'hardcore' gamers.

There's something defeatist about backing off accessible experiences for the most part and catering to the twin-sticks and buttons crowd. A look at the launch libraries of PS4 and One show mostly gamer-centric releases, and Nintendo for its part priced out the Wii generation when it launched Wii U. We can go around the houses and discuss marketing, naming conventions, manufacturing costs and the technicalities, I get all that, but ultimately those that bought a launch Wii for £179 / $249.99 would have been given pause for thought with the $349.99 of the Deluxe model, with the white model pushing credibility at $299.99 — if you want to download anything (with digital content far more prominent than in the Wii days) on the 8GB system, you'll need a hard drive on top of that price, anyway. Yes, prices go up in real life, but Nintendo had perhaps under-estimated how important pricing was in making the Wii the console to own for families or gamers, like me, keen for fresh games at an affordable price. Combine value with an exciting new hook, and monster profits follow.

In that sense recreating the perfect storm of the Wii was almost impossible, and I still believe that the Wii U will get by, with lifetime sales maybe nestling somewhere between GameCube and Nintendo 64 levels; Nintendo will still turn profits and move on in a few years time. But affordability matters more than ever in moving beyond hardcore fans, and that's why I see greater price cuts as essential in the future, and why I think Sony and Microsoft have shrunk their target market too far. Dedicated gamers will splash out, but I struggle to see many families or loose hobby gamers throwing down $399.99 to $499.99 in the medium term for a PS4 or One. Launch sell-outs? Absolutely. Big sales into mid-2014? We'll see, the market is more crowded than in the last generation.

I'm aware that the smartphone / tablet gaming phenomenon has moved the goalposts, but also believe that the 'big three' manufacturers have all-too-easily backed down to the threat. Android and iOS are far from perfect — free-to-play can really mean exploitation in some cases — and consoles have been slow to offer a sensible middle-ground between the race to the bottom and the old full-retail model. Steps are being taken to hit that territory, such as the terrific efforts of Nintendo and Sony in particular to welcome smaller developers to online stores; download-only developers may bring us more innovation than anyone, and I think the big N is due plenty of credit for its current and potential future role in that. The Wii U eShop in particular looks like it has an exciting future.

Yet the Wii U, in its first year, hasn't found that balance of accessibility and value. Enthusiast gamers may put great stock in visuals or traditional experiences, but the Wii U hasn't found that ground between the Wii and so-called 'hardcore' credentials, and may ultimately end up tempting just a portion — not all of — the Wii crowd once again. Early messaging about the Wii U was trying to sell it up as a system that's great for CoD and triple-A multi-platform games (just look up early interviews by Reggie Fils-Aime or the launch date reveal) — a marketing campaign doomed to failure. The new reduced price is a step towards regaining families and gamers with a taste for Nintendo experiences, though I'd argue that hitting $250 / £199 for the premium model is the next logical move to give the Wii U a bump in late 2014 and beyond.

When Nintendo gave up the technology race in favour of innovation with the Wii, I was delighted, and was also thrilled that I could enjoy unique experiences without breaking the bank. The Wii U hasn't done that from day one — I mentioned my family earlier on, and my parents just bought a 32GB Wii U in a flash sale at that golden £199 price. There are now experiences, such as Wii Sports Club and Wii Fit U that I know they'll enjoy, and perhaps Wii Party U and Super Mario 3D World will be added to that list in the remainder of 2013; Mario Kart 8 is a given. Yet when I showed them my Wii U in the past, the interest was there but not with the same immediate spark and flash of anticipation. Nintendo Land was the embodiment of this — it's excellent, but for the most part less intuitive and fun than Wii Sports or Mario Kart Wii. The Zelda swordplay was ideal, but the splash of minigames was less focused, less immediate and, in cases such as Metroid Blast, utterly beyond gamers more familiar with a Wii Remote or touchscreen.

I don't claim to have a perfect answer to how these shortfalls could have been avoided, and I'm actually confident that as the price drops and the software library (retail and download-only) grows the Wii U will be just fine. I do feel that Nintendo and its home console rivals have reverted to safe options, however, in part relegating innovation to a share button or the ability to use voice commands to tell your One to switch to TV. To its credit Nintendo will possibly innovate the most with asynchronous multiplayer and its various control options, but I'll always remember the Wii as the system that seized affordability, simplicity, accessibility and diversity all at once, while never afraid to embrace its alienation and differences from the PS3 and Xbox 360. I rather adore my Wii U, but it makes me a little sad that it's not a joy easily shared by those that admired its predecessor to such a degree.

With a tighter market and game companies in retreat, the Wii's golden era (before its bubble burst) may be the last major disruption to the home console market for a generation or two. The likes of Steam Machines from Valve and who-knows-what will shake up the home console market for enthusiastic gamers, and they're going to be fascinating times, but the Wii entranced consumers of all kinds in the living room — arguably one of Nintendo's greatest achievements.

Do you agree that the Wii revolutionised the industry in a way that the Wii U can't? (374 votes)

I do agree, its concept was a game-changer that hasn't been matched by Wii U

37%

I largely agree, though we'll need to give Wii U more time to have the same impact

36%

I'm not sure

5%

I don't quite agree, the Wii U is innovative and capable of shaking up gaming

14%

I disagree, the Wii's concept and impact are over-stated

7%

None of the above

Welsh ex-pat Tom is responsible for the day-to-day running of the site. He's the guy to thank for the generally brilliant nature of the content which massages your eyeballs on a daily basis. Also has an unhealthy obsession with all things Bowser.

More Stories

User Comments (173)

The Wii did its job and it did it well. Now its the Wii U's turn. I'm gonna say this again... 2014 is the TRUE beginning of the Wii U's redemption. While the PS4/One face the inevitable launch hype crash, the U will flourish with games. I got nothing against the PS4/One. I just think those consoles are gonna struggle so freaking bad when the launch hype dies it won't even be funny. I wonder will 3rd party developers abandom THEM when it happens. I doubt it....then again I don't. Give the Wii U time. This console is long from dead. It has a promising future.

I think it's sad when I see all the untapped potential of Wiimotes and Motionplus for proper games. I prefer Wiimote for CoD, I prefer sword slashing than button pressing for Zelda and even the Zapper and Balance Board have lots to offer for fun games (an alpine Skiing and Shooting game could use both). The problem now is that the best motion controlled games were made by Nintendo and EA. Nintendo are moving on to the gamepad and EA are moving away from Nintendo.

I think the industry will remember the lesson again when the casual market are slow to adopt 'next-gen'. I'm not sure Nintendo have found their killer app for Wii U but I am glad they're still at least going to make some games that are significantly different to their rivals.

My gut feeling is the GamePad was a huge waste of development resources (they put a ton of work into it) for not enough payoff. And now it's a waste of manufacturing resources (cost). It's a boat anchor.

I really think they should have made an HD Wii. Period. Just updated the Wii with a faster processor, faster GPU, and more RAM to make it capable of running games which look good on an HD TV (which the original Wii definitely does not).

In other words, they should have invested in the fundamentals, not that huge, expensive, one-per-system controller. I hope it's a mistake they never make again.

I'm glad that people are beginning to take note more regularly that PS4/The Bone are likely going to face the same problems that Wii U has, and that the industry as a whole is going to be shaken up as the number of AAA titles in development implodes.

I like the Wii U GamePad, but from the moment I saw it, I thought it was a step backwards from the Wii Remote and Nunchuk combo. It reverts motion controls to a secondary role, it adds all the buttons, triggers and analog of a conventional controller plus touchscreen, NFC, etc... great for gamers like us, but intimidating to the casual crowd, who were allured by the Wii Remote simplicity. Even I, when Reggie started talking about playing COD and whatnot, just wanted to know if I could still play it with Wii Remote + Nunchuk, I don't want to play an FPS with dual analogs anymore.
The GamePad is not a step backwards once you take your time with it, you'll end up loving it regardless of your gaming background, but the first impression anyone gets is deceiving. It would have been so easy to keep the Wii Remote + Nunchuk combo as default.

@Kroisos Its gonna be BAD, man. The launch hype crash for the PS4/One is NOT gonna be pretty. I don't want those consoles to fail. I'm interested in them both but even I can see that those two consoles are gonna have a hard time convincing the huge 360/PS3 install base to make the leap. But like I said before... Will 3rd party devleopers run when the PS4/One inevitably struggle in the upcoming months? We will see.

As always, mixing thoughts. Some people like Wii U more because here you would not have that much motion gameplay that a lot of people hated on Wii. I personally don't mind and I really liked those games that used strong motion controls such as Skyward Sword, Wii Sports, etc.

I believe Wii U would do great once their biggest franchises start to appear, it has the best of both worlds considering is compatible with Wii and all of it's controllers but also it has that traditional gameplay that lot's of people consider just for "hardcore" gamers, so it's a win/win, and I'm glad to read that in some parts Wii U is starting to sell more since the price drop and release of Wind Waker HD and this is just gonna increase once Super Mario 3D World releases and the big 3rd Party games that would follow and then, start a 2014 with top-notch quality titles such as DKC: TF and Mario Kart 8.

I'm pretty certain I'll be purchasing a Wii U in the New year, if not before. There's enough games now to entertain me for a long time, I can't afford a ton of games so I choose what I do buy very carefully, the suggestion that there are no games for it simply isn't valid anymore, in my opinion. Wii was awesome, Nintendo, or anyone else wont hit those heights again anytime soon, but I hope & believe Wii U will be fine. I KNOW Nintendo will

I barely play any Wii games now since they're a pain with a separate menu. That has improved with updates but I wish you could just insert a disc and it would bring up the appropriate way to start - gamepad or wii remote. Personally I love the Wii U as I'm playing games I never could before like Assassin's Creed, Batman Arkham City and next year Bayonetta 2. However, it will be great getting games like Wii Party U this week, Wii Fit U, Wii Sports Club and Mario & Sonic at the Olympics in the next few so that others will enjoy the system too. I think we'll see a change when people can play familiar games and over time some of them will try new games. Down the line there will be lots of games coming for fans of Nintendo games to keep us all happy with Mario 3D World, Donkey Kong Country:Tropical Freeze, Mario Kart 8, Super Smash Bros 4, Yoshi etc!

What we do need to see very soon without a doubt is advertising. Casual gamers and families aren't going to know the Wii U is there once PS4 and Xbox One come out in November if Nintendo doesn't step up advertising AND have a new Nintendo Direct at the beginning of November. They get a lot of press when they have them and people talk about it too.

@AdanVC Agreed and lets not forget Bayonetta 2, Shin Megami Tensei X Fire Emblem, Yarn Yoshi U, MONOLITH'S X and that new IP Shigeru Miyamoto is working on. I honestly we will see all these games in 2014 and maybe some more at E3 2014. The Wii U isn't dead. 2014 will bring alot.

The Wii U doesn't have it's defining games out which is when a console really takes off. PS2 had it when it's rpgs and adventure games started rolling out. Xbox took off when it concentrated on its shooters. Wii took off almost immediately because its mission statement was fulfilled via Wii Sports. Wii U has been flirting with that impactful type game and it just needs to get it out there sooner rather than later. People (especially video game ethusiast) have shorter memories than you'd think.

@JuleyJules Here's the thing though... That massive casual market that bought the Wii has totally lost any interest in gaming since the Wii. They don't care about ANY other console. Those kind of people are the kind of people were it takes alotta pushing and advertising to get them back. The Xbox One tried its hand at casual market in the very beginning and got huge backlash from GAMERS. That casual market is GONE. They will not come back for a very long time... in my opinion.

@ Blastoise-san
The xbox one wasn't trying to get casual gamers at the very beginning. On which planet do you live that "Restrictive DRM that prevents you sharing your games" was supposed to appeal to anyone?

P.S> The casual market isn't"gone". They just play games on phones/tablets now.

@Linkstrikesback I'm referring to the very first Xbox One reveal. Where there was barely any games and the reveal was more about switching between "tv" to "games" to any other thing... all on your Xbox One. The Xbox One has dramatically changed since that time. Lol

@Linkstrikesback I think the casual market plays mostly Facebook games, Angry Birds, your typical Tower Defense, and... Temple Run. Thats why I laugh when I hear that Square Enix is putting classic FF games on phone/tablet market... Those games will not sell at all. The casuals just don't care and don't even bother get informed.

@Blastoise-san@Kroisos - I've been saying it for a while too. Just the fact that the PS360 are still doing so well is going to hurt both new consoles because Sony and MS will be juicing them til they die and then focus all their efforts on the new kids. I don't think EA and co. will run to the hills in January like they did to Wii U but there'll definitely be delays, support pulled, exclusivity deals reneged upon and disappointing games that will definitely make it hard for one, if not both, of Sony and MS.

I don't think I've ever racked up as many hours in a console's first year as I have with my Wii U. I'm scared to check the hours I spent on Wind Waker this month.

@Blastoise-san
Firstly, the casual gamers are never gone. They are just nebulous. They are hard to pin down because they follow fads - which are always next to impossible to anticipate. Every generation has been this way.

I sincerely think that ALL the systems will go through some serious growing pains since it will be very hard for them to set themselves apart from the rest of the entertainment out there. Everything is so integrated - even the televisions themselves. It used to be that the competition was for the spot under the TV now Smart TV's are staking their claim to that as well with their increased and expanded functionality. (I personally think that this will make the Xbox One and PS4 seem redundant). Wii U is facing this problem with Ipad and other adjacent/supplemental devices.

In the end, the games will pull the customers. But they absolutely have to hit the nail on the head to turn some heads.

The Wii U has a significant advantage of having the Wii's technology built in.

If the Gamepad stays the centerpiece in most of the games coming out it won't attract the "casual" crowd as easily.

A primary focus should be on continuing to provide Wii like experiences (like Wii Sports Club; Wii Fit U) and using the Nunchuck and Remote plus as viable gameplay options. The Gamepad can take a back seat sometimes and accompany the above options (like a Pikmin 3).

Other than Nintendoland (and arguably Pikmin), Nintendo themselves haven't even really embraced the Gamepad. The OS interface would need reworking, but I would not be surprised to see a significantly cheaper, Gamepad-less Wii U by next year, maybe rebranded Wii HD. The gamepad would then be sold as an accessory for off-TV play. Perhaps the Gamepad even morphs into an independent Vita-esque handheld compatible with Wii U, as a successor to 3DS... who knows, but much as I love the Wii U concept, the current strategy just isn't getting enough people's attention.

I agree that the opportunities opened with motion controls have so far, for the most part, been missed. But I think the Wii's greatest triumph is that, while other companies were focusing on photo-realistic graphics, less-than-engrossing narratives, explosive set pieces, and packing in enough sex and violence to get the "Mature" rating that seems to appeal to the high school crowd so much, Nintendo just tried to make Wii games that were, y'know, fun.

As a whole I'm unhappy with where the market seems to be heading. Microtransactions and other annoyances have started to creep in. I don't mind DLC, hell, I love it, but microtransactions, paying to unlock areas, lives, items, it's just cheap.

WiiU- $249.00

PS4- $400.00

XboxOne- $500.00

Consoles, however, are far from cheap. The 'gaming' industry is split right now because you've a a half-grand Xbox and a free phone app on opposite sides of the scale. It didn't used to be this way, and since the average gamer( in US, only, I think I remember hearing), is 32, obviously they remember the good old days when consoles were for video games and phones were so large they were bricks that doubled as a way to talk to people.

That's another area where the industry's split: gaming ages.

Huge debate, hell, the state of Texas debated banning M-rated games for minors. Developers( of course not all) aim their 'Mature' games at minors. 'M for Mature, 17 and up'. Now, just pointing this out, the age difference between the average (US?) gamer and what some developers are targeting their Mature games toward is over 13 years. 13 YEARS.

So you've an adult and a minor, both having specific games developed for their specific ages, until a company wants to be 'the' developer, so they just try to make M-rated games appeal to more people. And sometimes the appeal is just insane. Someone was hit in the head with a brick, stabbed, and then had their GTA V copy stolen from them. Granted, this isn't a common event, but it still happened. And then you've got the surefire way to sell copies, what is it, you ask? Why, sex appeal, of course! GTA, Duke Nukem, South Park Dead Or Alive, Saint's Row, Senran Kagura, are all very... Well versed in this aspect. And, hey, if you're an adult, then it's fine. it's your choice, but when the developer uses this 'appeal' to get minors interested? They've crossed the line, pure and simple.

And there you've got the Big 3. Nintendo tries to be family-friendly, while Sony and Microsoft are for generally more mature audiences.

And when you dig deeper you find 13 years difference in audiences playing the same game, microtransactions, cheap gimmicks, and people who are just trying to have some fun without having to right this long comment like I did.

Wii U was a natural move for me. I transferred all my stuff over, and I've packed my good ol' Wii away. It's now part of history for me. There is no need to keep it out and powered up anymore. I'll never get rid of it though. But back to the point. The Wii U is a complete replacement, because it's got a Wii built-in. If i want to play my old Wii games, or my old VC games, I just click a channel. Done deal. Who else has done that in Next Gen?And don't even get me started on why the Wii U rocks.

I don't think ditching the Gamepad from the package is a good idea. Nintendo would be better off doing another price cut later . Gamepad's potential has yet to be unlocked and it's going to reasonably take some time. We all witnessed how long it took motion control technology to get to the level displayed in Skyward Sword. That's the price of innovation.

Cutting the Gamepad out of the box package will be detrimental to its innovative 2 screen gameplay potential.

@shad0w-7 exactly the Wii u does more than the ps4, xbone and my PC put together for me the Wii u is going to be my favorite next gen system just based on what it can do right out the box co- op and off screen play especially and I know the games will be there no doubt as far as ps4 I will get it eventually as soon as a game I want pulls me in that I can't already get on my PC but so far no other system is doing anything that hasn't been done before@WinterWarm nice little read btw especially from someone your age great comment!

Something I want to point out since people keep brining it up, Sony and Microsoft can afford to wait for their next gen systems to pick up over time. The PS4 and Xbox One does not need to sell 20 million units in their first years in the market. Rather, Sony and Microsoft are playing the classic game of "keep selling the older consoles while we gradually get people onboard with our new hardware." strategy

People are under the impression the PS4 and Xbox One will be their main consoles for the next year or so. The thing is, they won't be. The PS3 and Xbox 360 will continue to be the flagship consoles for those two companies while they begin to move people to the next generation.

This the the key advantage Sony and Microsoft have right now, The PS3 and Xbox 360 are pure profit at this point, and as long as they push them they can take some time to build up the next gen.

Sony and Microsoft have already said the PS3 and Xbox 360 will keep going for another three years, so they have the model in place. Which also means they are ready to take some losses, and are banking on PS3 and Xbox 360 sales to pick up the slack. This also helps explain why the two consoles have held their prices and are not going down.

Nintendo on the other hand, has burned their bridges with the Wii. Rather then transitioning it into a budget console and putting out some new games to keep interest there, they have decided to pull the plug. Why? It still sells well, and is a solid money maker for Nintendo!

Back when the SNES launched, the NES kept getting new games until 1994. The NES was still supported while the SNES gradually gained ground against Sega and NEC. Why not do this again? What advantage do they get from killing off the Wii? Its not all about confusion, the simple fact is that the Nintendo has not cared for the Wii since 2011.

People are somehow under the impression that if the PS4 and Xbox One dropoff after the holidays, third-parties will panic and run into Nintendo's waiting arms. The reality is that those companies that feel uncomfortable with the next-gen's adoption rate will simply stick with the PS3 and Xbox 360 until things pan out and then move onto the new systems later on.

Most likely, Sony and Microsoft planned for this as well. They publicly stated that their current consoles will be supported for another three years. Which means even after the new system launch, the PS3 and Xbox 360 will remain the main consoles until the PS4 and Xbox One can take over in a few years.

Nintendo on the other hand has put themselves n a tough corner, because the Wii U will be their only console on the market. They no longer have the Wii to fall back on, so the Wii U has to improve the sales performance putting even more pressure on it.

Plus, they have potentially alienated a good number of Wii owners(myself included) who spent tons of money on the console, VC games, games only to see it tossed to the side when it could still be supported. I'll be very blunt, I feel like I got screwed over by Nintendo with the Wii. Sony kept the PS1, and the PS2 going for years after the new systems came out, and even Nintendo kept up NES, SNES, and GBA support as well. Why is the Wii being tossed out when it still sells? Not everyone can afford new systems! Why not keep supporting both?

Nintendo made a huge mistake by killing the Wii. It could have easily been a budget console that was catered to a specific market, but they have blown their chances. Plus, they risk losing even more shelf space in stores.

@Blastoise-san I think it will especially bad for Sony. (Them giving away nearly all the best games for £5 a month from desperation. Is not going to convince most people to pay £40 a game again other than for just Fifa / COD). The very biggest franchises will do ok I think the rest will have a very hard time.

@Caryslan Erm. Dude. The Wii U fully takes care of the Wii issue. You can migrate all your saves, WiiWare, VC games over to a Wii U to continue that expeirieince there. And then you still have Nintendo's next gen system to expeirience. Things like the new controller, the best Internet Browser across any gaming platform, MiiVerse and a new improved eShop with Indie titles dropping in on a weekly basis. Your Wii has been replaced by the Wii U. That's the next evolutionary step for you as a Nintendo gamer.

In regards to your statement about XBOX and PS3 being pure profit for their respective manufacturers. I seem to be reading fairly recently that MS or Sony were only now breaking even with their production costs on these 7 year old consoles, while the Wii was profitable from day one.

Nintendo hasn't abandoned anyone. They just have a new better Wii out there. It's called a Wii U. If you haven't abandoned them, you'll go and pick one up. Simple.

@LDXD I'm mostly talking about Nintendo themselves. As an example, after the SNES launched, the NES kept getting games like Kirby's Adventure, Yoshi, Yoshi's Cookie, Wario's Woods, Zoda's Revenge, and a few other games that Nintendo published.

And that's my point. I'm not expecting a new Zelda or Mario. But why not give Wii owners some new games from a lower-profile series? Why not give games like Xenoblade a wide release instead of forcing gamers to jump through hoops?

@Caryslan ahh OK I see your point they should still in some way support the system for people that aren't ready for the upgrade I know I would be very upset if let's say dark souls ll was a ps4 only title

@unrandomsam Yeah, man. Its might just ge really ugly. But here's the funny and sad part. When the next gen games don't sell because of the huge PS3/360 install base and launch hype dies, we're gonna hear the same 3rd pary developers that abandoned the Wii U say... "Oh, um... Its OKAY. We still fully support PS4/One! The sales for our game isn't that good but its whatever!". They are gonna be HYPOCRITES.

Don't know if anyone mentioned this yet but is it possible to get your splitscreen like that? the Zelda minigame from Nintendoland, I want to play splitscreen like that at any game where you use the Gamepad.

On Poll Topic: I chose 'I don't quite agree' cause there is so much potential. Not just gaming wise, people keep looking at it and saying: it doesn't improve games. That's cause it improves the overall gaming EXPERIENCE.

I largely agree that Wii was a gaming revolution that couldn't be matched by Wii U, but it wouldn't be smart to write off Wii U right now when we all know there is a going to be an absolutely massive year coming ahead in 2014. Donkey Kong, Mario Kart, Yoshi, Super Smash Bros. (if it's not delayed), and others will give Wii U a much-needed boost. Once again, it's the games that matter, and great games will foster great innovation.

The Wii is a fantastic console and I still play it regularly, but Nintendo should move on and support their struggling current console right now, and they are. Nothing against the competition, but I'm not aware of XBox One and PS4 having all that much once their launches are past. Who's to say that they might go through a slump as well? Meanwhile, Wii U would be having a total romp of a year if everything lines up correctly, namely Smash Bros. and its currently 2014 releases.

I just wish that the GamePad could be tapped into more. It has potential. It has a built-in gyroscope, 360 degree camera, a touch screen, and a comfortable grip. Surely there must be some developers eager to experiment with it? What will make Wii U innovative are good games that will use the features.

I have to see some games now starting with Super Mario 3D World, in 2 years they can't release games that seems the perfect fit for the console and a thing you want for than now it will really be a console for hardcore like Gamecube or N64.

Right now i saw as perfect fit just The Wonderful 101 in the whole games that are out there, it's only one perfect fit.

I will say this again, just don't stop to produce motion games! The Wii U has a gamepad, yes, and it is a lot of fun to use. But when there are not enough ideas for utilizing it in games, then please produce games focused on the Wii peripherals. They are still awesome and together with the better hardware and gamepad can still create wonderful experiences. Pikmin 3 showed that this is possible and I want other games to follow this direction.

The biggest lesson that I wish they all would have remembered is that games don't have to be expensive huge budget productions to be fun and enjoyable. Most of the games I have enjoyed lately have been indie or retro and have not come with a $60 price tag (The most expensive was LoZ:WW at $49.99).

There are places and genres the motion controls works well, but replacing a button press with a waggle just because will never be as good as an experience.

I think Nintendo unexpectedly hit a gold mine when they created the Wii. I doubt they were expecting it, I'm sure it wasn't in the plans that their idea was going to be the best selling console of the generation by such a long run. But, of course, it was nothing more than just an experiment gone right.

The Wii U is also an experiment... have they hit another gold mine? No. Are they going to? I doubt it. If this game changing idea was as brilliant to people as the Wii was, it would be selling a lot better right now. I know Nintendo has put little to no effort into advertising, so that's also part of the problem.

I think the main issue is they're trying to cater to two completely different audiences. They're trying to tend to their core audience again, after neglecting us a bit last generation, while also bringing in their casual audience from the Wii era, and I don't think it's working out. I mean, they could still figure it out, it's not too late. I don't know how they're going to do it, but if they figure it out... hey! Good for them!

I think in the end, they'll realize the audience they tapped into last gen is gone, and the Wii U will just be another N64, another Gamecube. And that's totally fine! There's an audience for that! As long as they focus all their energy to deliver great titles, I'm sure gamers who mock it now will come back and give it a try, hopefully realize it's not another failed gimmick, enjoy it, spend some money on it. It's not a bad console at all! It's the perfect gaming console, it feels great, it looks great, and it has a lot of brilliant minds developing for it. It's just not the Wii's successor. But it's not doomed for failure. I think the Wii U is going to be fine, it just launched at the wrong time.

I have a Wii U and I can firmly say "I dislike the gamepad" and I also dislike the fact I have to have the Wii U pad turned on even if I'm playing with the Wii U pro controller. The Wii U offers nothing new, the gamepad is an idea for the sake of an idea.

The Wii was a revolution. The Wii U is a console with a stupid controller.

NintendoLand told me enough about the Tablet to know that it's a fine enough idea, and off-screen play while the family is using the TV is invaluable.Now, watch as modern developers fail to actually put forth any effort into using it in a similarly innovative way. Same reason so many beloved series are dying out.

Think you're giving the Wii too much credit. It was a freak phenomenon that couldn't even last the duration of it's own generation. If it was the "revolution" of which you speak why have everyone including Nintendo and consumers gone completely the other direction? More like a short lived 'revolt'.

The Wii - Resting in Peace and dust under millions of tellys since 2007.

The problem with Wii U is that it is a jack of all trades, master of none. And it doesn't help that the majority of the people that bought into Wii don't even care about the Wii U, or don't know it exists. Or both.

Regardless, I don't expect a very long life cycle for Wii U unless sales start to quadruple. Even Nintendo has no real ideas for the Gamepad.

I'm afraid to use it too much because it costs over $100 to fix, has poor battery life, and is just way too big and bulky next to the far superior Pro Controller.

Given a do-over, Wii Us should have shipped with 64GB memory, no Gamepad, instead a Pro Controller and a Wiimote Plus. And it should have been called anything other than Wii U.

@gatorboi352 I say the Wii u has about a 5 year life cycle just as any other Nintendo console 64gigs still isn't enough you can fix that quick and easy for extremely cheap also the battery life on the game pad can be fixed in less than a min for under $11
The system will do fine once games start rolling in just as the 3ds let's not forget the Wii u has hardly any 1st party games right now
People mainly buy Nintendo consoles for Nintendo games problem is their aren't any outside of pikman 3 and a new super Mario that has been done so many times just recently I'm surprised the system is selling at all right now

@LDXD you're basing the Wii U's projected lifespan on the past. We don't live in the 90s or the early 2000s any more. The playing field has changed (as the article above notes as well). There were no smart phones or tablets in 206 when Wii launched.

64GB still isnt enough, you're right. But it wouldn't have hurt.

Buying an aftermarket battery is not a viable solution. It may be for you or me, the avid gamer that frequents gaming sites and lives for gaming. But for the crowd Nintendo wants to recapture, a 3 hour battery life is off putting and inconvenient.

Well the Wii had us with Wii Sports but beyond that it's launch was much like the Nintendo 64 where one game (super mario 64) defined it as a new era of gaming. Plus it took awhile for all the developers to figure out what they could do with the system. Example would be comparing Red Steel with Red Steel 2. I think we all need to take a look and realize that the Wii U didn't have that era defining game right off the bat at launch. But now I think Wind Waker HD is proving to be the start of that era defining game by showing off what the system can do. Having a secondary screen to glance at while navigating is a very cool addition to the fun of gaming. I feel it will improve from here on and become more fun. Because gaming should be about having fun and I feel Nintendo recognizes that more than the other two.

@gatorboi352 you can leave it plugged in and it has about a 4 1/2 hr before having to charge And I guess by what you're saying is by the time Zelda u comes out Nintendo will just give up on the Wii u at around 3 years? I seriously doubt it, the Wii u will probably be in its prime at that point and I can see it lasting 5 years no problem

I put it to you that the Wii was nought but a progressive scanning Gamecube with an inbuilt modem - developers knew exactly what to do with it but most weren't challenged by it and had already moved on to 1080p...exactly why the Wii U is for now not a challenge to develop for.

@Capt_Charlie Well I get the graphics but motion control I would think would take awhile for some of the developers to master on how to utilize. Same way as to figuring out how to utilize the gamepads capabilities too. I'd think. Just my opinion is all.

@Capt_Charlie@gatorboi352 y'all are seriously comparing smart phones to home gaming consoles lol
Yeah I have a perfect solution we should just lease our consoles from now on and we can just upgrade every 2 years wow I have no hope for the future gamer if people actually think this way

@gatorboi352@Capt_Charlie no blinder dude there will always be a market for home consoles they aren't going anywhere the Wii u is struggling because of lack of games mainly Nintendo games plain and simple remember that smart phones and tablets were blamed for the 3ds struggling now look at it you're buying into the media and most don't know what the hell they are talking about mark my words the Wii u will have 5 year life cycle maybe longer
Not to mention the Wii u has/is the closest thing to a tablet smartphone than any other console the same gamepad you say is the problem and want to get rid of so make up your mind

I've no doubt it will last 5 yrs +. Whether it sells enough units in that period to avoid being labelled an also ran within it's generation [like the N64 and Gamecube] remains to be seen - I've seen enough gens now to be confident which way i'd wager.

If we're still both here in 2018, I look forward to saying "told you so" or being told likewise!

I only say that the wii motion control is much more revolutionary and simple to use than the gamepad. And the fact to play with zelda skyward or metroid prime with the motion control has been really innovative.
Nintendo had found its dimension with the wii, they only had to improve the hardcore games offer.
With the gamepad they have done a step back
Yes there are new ways to play but I think that there aren't so many ways
You only have two hands and two eyes so in a way or in another you can't change too much the standard way to play
I think that the gamepad isn't the future
The motion control could have been the future in junction with the controller pro (selling the console with both controller)
About the wii now they aren't releasing games anymore so it is logic to stop the production, considering also that the wii u is retrocompatible and it is also a wii
Nintendo searches new ways to play but I think that the motion control could have been central for other 2 o 3 gen.
The asimmetric gaming or the touch gaming isn't so innovative, it's only a different way to input the same commands
The game pad has brought only problems of battery, weight, and it is uncomfortable because you have to see in two screen when you have only 2 eyes
They need to contrast the smartphones but I think that a console should be something different from a smartphone or a tablet

@Capt_Charlie The thing nobody knows is how many Nintendo has to sell of their own software to get as much out of it as Sony and MS get from a massive release. I presume Microsoft offers to take a very small amount and Sony is forced to match it or they would not get the release until late. Even Pokemon NIntendo has 55% ownership. As far as I know no information exists to make an accurate assessment. (All that is known is such as EA/Rockstar make a killing without any of the risk of creating the platform).

@Capt_Charlieyes but the ds is a portable, the two screen are near, and with two screen you can close or open the console to reduce the spaceFor a home console it's differentYou watch in two different direction when you play on tv or on gamepad

Nintendo have already claimed they are already selling it at a loss. Nintendo titans have fallen after higher profile failures. The late great Yamauchi-sensei stood down after the disappointing performance of the N64 and Gamecube whilst guru and 31 year veteran, Gunpei Yokoi was made expendable after the failure of the virtual boy. No one is indispensable at this level it seems - not even gulp Miyamoto-san.

Nintendo tried to incorporate the Wii U gamepad in various different ways that just confused the hell out of industry 'insiders'. I remember the video 'Iwata Asks', when the system was first announced in which Mr. Miyamoto says, that the Pad can be used in lots of ways and 'lots of ideas'!

Now I love Mr. Miyamoto but the problem is we need to be told how we are going to use it, plain and simple, not give out, 'lots of ideas'.

Unfortunetely, Nintendo's main idea was family, multi-player gaming like Nintendoland or Game and Wario. And with just one gamepad, it is just too complicated for developers to grasp, nevermind the gaming audience. And so that failed and we are left with a console; waiting for Nintendo to come up with ideas on how to use the Gamepad properely. Because sure as hell, 3rd parties are not gonna focus on it! They just want to program in simple PC .x86 architecture with traditional controls. Personally, I think the Gamepad is great for single player games, but it changes the developers mindset too much.

In short Nintendo were not ready to launch the console and were not ready for full HD gaming eithier. Now that will change, but man they are getting a lot of flack for it now.

Would have thought Nintendo would have learnt the lesson with the 3DS. You need your core franchises to make the most out of the system you are selling. That's Nintendo at its best.

@Gioku I agree. All this non-sense about only having two eyes and can't pay attention to both screens. Yes, the DS and 3DS concept works great because the screens are close to each other. You know what you could do, people? Hold the bloody GamePad higher! Like 3DS, you have to find your sweet spot for viewing. Who would figure that?

I absolutely LOVE the Wii U and the gamepad. I can't imagine a future N console without it. No it can't and won't compete at a Wii level. Everyone knows this. But the gamepad is brilliant way to meld iphone generation with home console.

@Capt_Charlie I have no doubt about it being another game cube or 64, why anyone in their right mind thought it would sell like the Wii did in the first place is beyond me For me the Wii was the worse Nintendo console I've ever owned I rather the Wii u be another cube or 64 the days of the nes-snes are long gone and Wii bored me to death I'm not a casual aside from a few RPGs the only thing I used it for was old classics

The Wii was a gaming revolution in that EVERYBODY could play it. When I say everyone I mean every Senior Home had 1. The Wii U could do the same. It needs that defining game though. A golf game using both motion sensors in the gamepad and on the tv could ensure a Wii U in every golfers home.I find it amusing to hear people gripe about the battery. Casual gamers won't care cause they don't play hours at a time and anyone with half a brain just plugs it in.As far as Wii U's place in the next gen battle....doesn't really matter. It will sell more then 25 million before its done. Will make money for Nintendo. And more then likely will have about 50 million over its life and be close to the same as XB1 and PS4. Remember part of the reason why PS2/3 and Xbox 360 sold so well is that "casual" gamers bought them as a cheap alternative to high priced DVD/BluRay players. By the way.....if a majority of your titles are games that come out annually.....you're probably not a "hardcore gamer"

The Wii U may have had a shaky start, but at least Nintendo are starting to address its problems with their firmware updates and first party software.

It's always been about the software and always shall be. Wii was lucky that it launched with Wii Sports. The DS, which was equally innovative, didn't really explode in sales until Nintendogs and Brain Training. Game Boy had its best sales in its 10th year with Pokemon. Remember the doom and gloom surrounding 3DS before Ocarina, Star Fox, Mario Kart and World? Now it's on track to be one of Nintendo's best-selling machines ever.

Nintendo have yet to find that mystery game or combination of titles that drive sales dramatically, though Pikmin 3 and Wind Waker are going to be a foundation for when Mario World, Kart, and Smash hit. But even if they never achieve those goals, we'll still have an awesome console and some fantastic software.

Can't agree @Thomas, the Wii might have brought more family into play for a short burst but it didn't posses the long term lasting power it needed. I stopped playing after about 2 years. My handhelds I play years later, The Gamecube I used through most of its life and on wards. The Wii didn't posses that, big titles like Mario Kart and Smash Bros. didn't hold my interest as long as they have on other systems. The library wasn't there for the most part and it was always frustrating hunting out batteries or recharging the Wii motes.I'll get a new Gamecube someday, I might get an N64 if I can find the people to play with me but as for the Wii, I'll take the few I like and they'll be played through the Wii U.Also more importantly it never held family that were new to gaming, in fact they were shorter lived on it then me. So I think moving on was wise because you can't make a traditional game to grab them that easily and I think building another concept that is as revolutional as the Wii to draw any of them back isn't about to come out yet and we likely won't see it for years.

The Wii had great momentum before its releases as people wanted to see what motion gaming was all about. That momentum ran for a couple of years as it was one of the hardest systems to find on the market '06-'08. Definitely a game changer!

I've had a Wii U for about two weeks and sadly I haven't felt that game changing experience. I'm not a Pikmin fan and 101 doesn't appeal to me. And the Windwaker is just an HD remake of one of my least favorite Zeldas. The right game needs to come along that shows what the system is all about. As of now, I still think it's like an HD 3DS without the 3D.

@Kirk isn't that thing extremely expensive? I thought I read somewhere it was like $1200 or something? If so I don't see it spreading like wildfire or anything and not sure if to many folks want to game with a catraption constantly on their face for instance I hate wearing goggles but I am interested in what it can or will do

@JuleyJules I believe there is a button you can press when you turn on your wii u to make it go straight to wii mode, not sure what it is though and i could be wrong altogether. Either way, going to wii mode from your wii u isn't really that big a deal is it?

Wii U = More memory, HD graphics, more features, hardcore games like Batman or Assassins Creed, not much support of first party or minor third party, though.

Wii = Amazing first party titles, shovelware (which I dont much care), revolution (it even was codenamed as "revolution), Not much third party support and very addicting to play.

Both consoles did something amazing, remember how people trashed the Wii for being six times less powerful than Xbox 360 and PS3, and even called it a last gen console rather than current gen? It still was something people would like to play (Wii like to play!)

For moi, the wii has been thee' greatest console since the SNES, it's groundbreaking, a huge shake up to the industry and brang new life to genre's that were just getting pretty makeovers with Zero hardware innovation in sight. I absolutely adore the wii for so many reasons....It's such a phenomenal cosnole and i love that it's HOME to 2D Sidescrollers which the N64 and GCN completely abandoned.... The Wii U? Can't say, but it looks like a big step back vs the remote while offering something different in a completely different direction. It just doesn't seem exciting, nor have NIntendo tapped into the potential of the Wii U game pad. Not the the giant leap in innovation that i was expecting, but it still looks pretty neat, besides the wii remote plus is compatible with certain games, so you might as well call it the Super Wii.

One thing I've noticed is that the Wii U just hasn't captured peoples' imaginations like the Wii did. After the Wii was announced people were brainstorming all kinds of ideas for it, imagining all the uses it could have. I've yet to see that with the Wii U, not even from Nintendo.

@SCAR932
What does that have to do with anything? They could have the best product in the world and still have low sales if everything else falls flat. I don't think any of the consoles will be the smash success some people deem them to be, but I also don't see how the Wii U being "doomed" spells doom for the rest of the industry. Even if it is that doesn't mean Nintendo is doomed either.

@Nintenjoe64 "I'm scared to check the hours I spent on Wind Waker this month"

Funny thing, I JUST beat the Earth Temple and went to check exactly that. 40 hours since last week's monday, which is when I got mine in the mail. Over four hours a day on average, on that game alone (in the same month they released freaking Pokémon, for chrissake). Somehow I don't think that would have been possible if I weren't on vacation this month, heh.

I fully agree with what you said, and feel the same way about my Wii U. I love the thing to death at this point, in a way that hadn't happened since the SNES (still my favorite console of all time).

@Zombie_Barioth
This is exactly how i feel as well. Nintendo doesn't even seem like they know what to do with the gamepad. It's innovative use is completely void from titles like SM3DWorld(outside of being an in-game shifting camera to discover secrets) and DK: Tropical freeze. It just doesn't seem as exciting or groundbreaking the way the wii remote was. Geez, the hype surrounding the Wii and it's launch were truley exciting, it was just incredible, the same can't be same for the Wii U, not by a long shot. I remain optomistic, but the wii u isn't the next gen leap in innovation that i was expecting, i as expecting something mind blowing, but as is it's still a lot more fresh & unique than whatever the hell those silly 'twins' are doing, which is next to nothing except offering more horse power, a new shiny coat of paint if you will with the SAME exact games from last generation. yawn.

@Zombie_BariothAlot of the "doom" talk has more opinion backing it than fact.

I honestly don't think Wii U will have any problems at all. It's only a year older than systems releasing in the next month, and the system is able to be setup to handle most of what people expect.

The reason why I say, "If Wii U is 'doomed', then so is everything else", is mainly working off the thought that it was "doomed" in the first place.I don't think it will do badly, while others continue to do so. The Wii U is a valuable part of 8th generation whether you think so or not.

Frankly, the tech race between M$ and $ony is what will ruin the entire gaming industry.By utilizing all sources to compete with PC's, gaming consoles keep skipping big parts of the advance. For example: the PS2 was awesome, but XBox couldn't rival it, so Microsoft tried to simply out-tech them with the XBox 360. But this started a trend partly provoked by us gamers.All of a sudden, technological superiority was more important than innovation or a good game library. As such, games became more visually advanced, but gameplay turned into a minor factor. Sony took its time, but followed the trend, eventually. Now, we have those insanely successful games which keep doing the same with better graphics (the usual FPS type offenders, but also GTA and even Mario), and nobody seems to care that Sony and Microsoft are simply too fast with their technology. They never fully used up the resources, instead turning gaming into a ridiculous arms race.Nintendo has proven that innovation needs good ideas, not neccessarily good tech. But on all fronts people compare the consoles by numbers, despite it being obvious that it's not Nintendo falling behind - the others are just going too fast and waste huge amounts of unused potential for their platforms.

At first, I laughed at those 'gaming will die with the next gen' stories, but if Sony and Microsoft keep going like this, the end might indeed be closer than expected...

I wasn't really a fan of the motion controls of the Wii in the first place. If you want my opinion, Wii U looks more innovative (play games on the Wii U gamepad? Awesome). The Wii U has a great chance to win this Holiday season due to some pretty good gaming gems plus the recent price cut on hardware. Overall, I find Wii U more my kind of gameplay. PS4 and X1 won't just lay down though, Nintendo will have to get some great IPs out there this Holiday and into the first half of 2014.

A lot of doom and gloom talk about PS4 and X1 too. They're going to be in the same place as Wii U was at launch- not enough games. Sure ACIV, COD, and Battlefield will help a bit for some, but I foresee a huge jump in software sales starting with the new inFamous and continuing after that. Don't get me wrong, I love Nintendo, but when it comes to third party support, companies are reluctant to join in, especially when they can use the "it ain't next-gen" argument.

I really think people aren't thinking clearly on this one. Their seems to be this misnomer that Nintendo has abandoned the Wii remote system and that's just not correct. Not only does the Wii-U come with it's own sensor bar, they went ahead and built a second sensor bar right into the gamepad (surrounding the video cam). I can play Wii remote games on the gamepad by itself without a TV. The inclusion of this functionality, the expansion of it to the gamepad and the additional functionality and freedom from hogging the TV are all additions to Nintendo's Wii-U. Unfortunately, the gaming industry is more focused on the gamepad as a touchscreen than Nintendo's preservation of Wii functionality.

I agree that the Wii brought a great deal of innovation to the gaming industry, even if that innovation was met with mixed reception among 'hardcore' gamers, but I have to wonder how long Nintendo could have kept up that particular form of innovation. Some people complain that Nintendo is playing it way too safe as of late by releasing titles they know will appeal to most Nintendo fans. But what if they decided to make more games that targeted families and other 'casual' gamers? I think that, eventually, we'd start to see more entries in some 'casual' franchises; for example, instead of only two Wii Sports games, there could end up being one each year so as to maximize the profit they would make by targeting the audience with the most money. That would be playing it safe in a different way; instead of releasing more Mario, Zelda, etc. specifically to please the hardcore gamers, they would be releasing more motion-control-centric mini-game collections specifically to draw in the casual gamers. In either case, Nintendo risks spoiling one audience and alienating the other. I would love to see Nintendo find some perfect balance between the two, but I see that being much easier said than done.

As my signature states, I have been playing video games since the days of Pong. I have owned more home and hand held consoles then most people have. You could say I am Hard Core Gamer (a real fan of video games, one who reads about them and is interested in them), or as I like to say, I am a GAMER. I have owned and enjoyed more home / hand held consoles than I can count on both hands and at least one foot. I can honestly say, even at this early stage in its life, THE WII U IS MY FAVORITE GAMING CONSOLE I HAVE EVER OWNED.

I love the Gamepad, The Internet Browser, Miiverse, the Backwards Compatibility, and the Gameplay offered by Nintendo Games.

I am by no means a casual gamer and I do also do not believe that smart phones and tablets have stolen console customers either. They have, in my opinion created a new gaming segment, many of which have never or never will own a gaming console. If anything, people that find that they really, really enjoy gaming on a tablet or smartphone, may decide to get a gaming console down the line but I seriously doubt anyone who is a GAMER, would abandon console gaming because they discovered smartphone / tablet gaming .... it is just too casual and superficial and does not provide adequate inputs or depth of play that GAMERS crave.

What I like about the Wii U is that it has the potential to satisfy the Gamers and the Causal Gamers as well ...

But it is up to Nintendo to make that happen and right now, they are floundering ... they have a short range plan but they need to pull out the guns soon and keep them out for a long steady while if they are to be successful with this system.

Of this next generation of consoles, and last one too, Nintendo is the only system good for an entire family, one that has young children and here is why ... I am 45 years old and although I do not mind games dropping the F bomb, I certainly would not want it dropping it if there were a 3 year old walking around. I can also say that at my age, hearing the F bomb dropped every thirty seconds has a lose of impact and is unnecessary. Same goes for sex. Ok, so lets put parental controls on all the systems and what do we get? Nintendo is the only system with top notch and fun gameplay for everyone in the family. No other system has platformers that match Nintendo's, no other system has party games as fun as Nintendo's.

So Nintendo can do great if they just get the message out and more importantly, get the games out. Get the games out that make the family that bought the Wii buy the Wii U. Make them want it and make them see how they really can not live without it.

Somewhere down the road I'll pick up a PS4 just to play some great First Person Shooters (campaign mode only) but if Nintendo would just come out with their own intelligent First Person Shooter IPs, I would never have a need for a PS4 .... because Nintendo would have everything.

@Nintenjoe64 what the trolls don't understand is the ps4/xBone won't sell gangbusters... They will sell through their launch stock, but it will fall to a trickle. $350 was too expensive for mass saturation, so $399 and $499 is going to be an even tougher sell, better graphics and all, the price point is just too high to sell a ton. The "hardcore" will buy it up, but the casual COD/FIFA/Maddens gamers will stick to their older systems for the most part.

When the ps4/xBone fall to the $300 range it will start to pick up. That's roughly the price the 360 and ps3 started to sell gangbusters... It might even be lower as incomes are falling faster than any other time in history. The economy in the US is still being suffocated by Obama, so people especially younger adults have a lot less disposable income than they did in 2006/2007.

I think when Nintendo announced the Wii U they were focused on bringing the same market again that they went after with the Wii, but since then I think they've changed their goal. I still think they want to make new experiences that are only going to be available on the Wii U, but I'm pretty sure they've realized that it doesn't have the same "WOW" factor as its predecessor had.

I love the Gamepad. It's ahead of its time apparently. They weren't able to break through the lowest common denominator brain in the market. Oh well. It is still a great console that will have many, many unforgettable experiences. I've already had many of them in its first year, with a few more on the way....

this convo is just silly... the wii u is everything the wii should have been and much much more. it is the best console with the best controllers. the gamepad is amazing... anyone who thinks it shouldnt be included is crazy. looking away from the tv while zombies attack? AWESOME. drawing a reciever hot route on the line of scrimmage? AWESOME. most of the games have been somewhat lukewarm so far and none are perfect but the wii had all the same unimaginative crap too.

wii never got the support it deserved. wii u isnt either... im not at all surprised. i know nintendo will support my habit enough to get me by and i can still always dream of gta or madden.

i always thought the wii would be my last console... im so glad nintendo changed my mind again.

@SCAR392
I'm well aware of where the doomed talk comes from. Heck, I wish I had a dime for every time I've heard Wii U is the next Dreamcast. I don't doubt the Wii U as a console, I'm just saying that even if it ended up Nintendo's next Virtual Boy it wouldn't be the end of the world. Even the "failed" consoles have their fans. Not that I think that'd happen though.

So what your getting at is if the Wii U is "doomed" and "has no games" then where does that leave the other consoles? Thats exactly why I don't think they'll be the huge success everyone thinks they'll be. It'll be a rather slow start after the usual holiday rush. Money is tight these days so most people won't be buying multiple consoles like before, so sales will be a lot more even. 3rd parties can't afford to abandon the current-gen consoles right now so theres even less incentive for most people to upgrade. We won't be seeing PS2-like sales so even if the Wii U only did Gamecube numbers the others won't do too much better.

Based on Nintendo history, they'll never flock to Wii U. no matter how much it sales. There's still that attach rate issue. The most we can expect if the Wii U picks up are a few more polished AAA games but nothing significant from studios like EA and Take 2.

It will remain a system for indies and Nintendo games no matter what. Like Bethesda said, Nintendo missed their opportunity to truly get 3rd parties on board.

I think as more First-party games come out the Wii U it will pick up in terms of sales, And don't get me wrong the Gamepad is cool and all (switching from TV to the gamepad is awesome!) but it kind of feels like a gimmick, It's annoying using the gamepad to do something that could in game easily be done in game.

I agree with pretty much everything in the article.The Wii was just so much more accessible. They were never going to win over mum, dad and grandma with a tablet controller because for the most part these people don't use tablets.

I agree with what's being said here. If they wanted to replicate the Wii's broader appeal something like Game & Wario would have been a better pack-in title side-by-side with Sports Club for "traditionalist" Wii players. And a cheaper price point.

Having said that I love the Wii U and my partner isn't a big gamer, but she likes Game & Wario and Spin the Bottle. Taking a nostalgia tour with the Streetview app the other day was also a nice display of this system's strength.

What Nintendo should have done with Wii U was made it an improvement on the Wii. They could have improved the Wii mote; designed a newer version, took it to a higher level for Wii U, The Wii U game-pad contradicts everything Nintendo said about the Wii.

The Wii was perfection and families loved it, Nintendo were always the Famicomputer company.

Nintendid what others didn't.Until they copied the concept of motion control on a home console and applied it on their HD machines, thus putting Nintendo back in the struggle for the strongest hardware.The "need" for awesome graphics has hit Nintendo hard so far, so now all they can do is playing Sony's and Microsoft's game by returning at their own graphical level, as sad as this is to say.That said, once Nintendo releases a console with the same graphical power as the others within their same generation, they're never gonna fall off their throne again.

The WiiU has been a mistake and I won't ramble on about why, most of it has been said but basically just the 'why is this better than anything I already have?' argument covers it. But as someone said the 3ds is great and will do fine so it should give them some leverage to play around with the WiiU before retiring it in 3-4 years. If they're REALLY lucky they'll make an amazing zelda or Metroid game and it will boost sales enough to make someone see it as a viable platform but that will be tough after... oh about a month from now.

The other consoles will have the opposite problem. I think the launches will be slow (after the day 1 sellouts) and then steadily people will shell out for the new other consoles, especially after a year when there is a little price drop, and then the WiiU will be a doorstop. At this point the sheer power of a console really does allow you to expand it's interface and input options almost as much as you want especially with bluetooth screens and tablets so the WiiU is unfortunately an old idea before it had a chance to wow anyone. The Wii U is just not future proof enough to entice anyone and doesn't have the launch buzz that the Wii had. The Wii was amazing because Wii sports blew everyone away enough to buy it (at a reasonable price), AND it demonstrated clearly all the useful, well implemented ways you could use the new controller. Even NOW the WiiU doesn't have it's Wiisports (figuratively), so the controller has been lost on everyone. A neat idea poorly implemented, and already past its prime. The real hope for the WiiU would be for them to actually DITCH the gamepad and get with some good AAA titles that we care about using motion plus. I' was sad about it but happy now that I finally discovered the other HD systems thanks to them dropping the ball. I'll give it anoter chance if something good happens in a year or so. (I was broke at the Wii Launch but sold both my legs to play Wiisports and Zelda at launch. Nintendo never put 2+2 together about the successful Wii launch I guess)

With the way I see it, Nintendo has always put innovation and refreshing technologies ahead of 'selling titles'. Don't get me wrong, I love Sony, and I'll play a game of Halo With my friends, but at the end of it all, I'll find myself going back to Nintendo more and more.

i bought the wii at launch because ninendo promised 'motion controls' i was so very mad when i dropped my wii remote and link finished off en enemy, that was the first of all its lies, then came the 2 year drought and nintendo telling us we do not want online play. then i understood the truth, nintendo was only making a new controller type to ONLY fight piracy. i promptly sold the wii and bought a USED one to play skyward sword then sold it again. i am stuck with my wii u but i didn't pay for it, that don't stop it from collecting dust

@Ren i agree 100%, the gamepad should have been optional and the price should not have been higher that $250 for the black unit. they tried to pull an apple and said 'they will pay whatever we want as we are nintendo!' funny how there was no shortage or sellouts of wii u, did hear a lot about bricked consoles, which i think was done to sell replacement units to pad number like xbox 360 did. they need to release one awesome game per month just like the golden days of ps2. no one looks to ps2 and how wonderful it was just to be able to play dvds when i was done playing, nintendo only wants you to pay for netflix

@Kaze_Memaryu power is everything, why do you think nintendo finally matched up to hd. it is ok if you can only afford the lower cost nintendo consoles but to then knock superior systems because they are too great and costs what they are worth sounds stupid. if nintendo kept up with the rest of the world then maybe they would have had gta v and been able to sell more units. nintendo can only sell big at christmas with a mario game because adults who buy their own games and systems any time of the year

@Mask0Gears it is not innovation when it is the exact same practice since 1980. they make games with lower quality graphics and much less content. when you try to say they are innovative or creative i hear it the same as call a small house cozy

The Wii was great but when you get down to it. The online services was clunky mess. Wiiware titles had to cater to a dinky 40 mb size. And well a couple of hackers were ruining online experiances. I'd say good riddence to that old console.

@AJ_Lethal yes it does, look how quick nintendo gave up on nes, snes and n64. they said the consoles were dead and so were the games. what did gamers do? created emulators! emulators let us play the old forgotten and out of circulation games. nintendo saw they were wrong but were furious that computers and other devices and emulate the games and their systems were not needed. then came the wii with a 'waggle' that could have been done with a button, now all the info from the pause menu has to be on the game pad, we have to hold the game pad up to the tv to use a scanner that can be done in game. these stupid little things are not needed except for piracy concerns

@GN004Nadleeh I'm having a hard time understanding what you mean by "much less content." Maybe you were sadly confused by the article about how much space the Super Mario 3D World download will take(which doesn't have anything to do with how great the game is actually going to be or how much replayability it will have); and maybe you thought the bigger something is in MB/GB, the better. Or perhaps you were under the assumption that the bigger a game's budget is, the better the game is. But, if you look at many of the good indie games that have come out that are only a teeny tiny percentage of the buget of games like GTA 5 and the like, you'll see that, arguably, those indie titles can be just as fun, or even more fun than the big budget games. And indie titles are unarguably in a whole other league of creativity when compared to COD, FIFA, Madden, GTA, etc.

"power is everything, why do you think nintendo finally matched up to hd." I haven't laughed so hard since........ well I'm having trouble remembering the last time I laughed so hard since I'm laughing way too hard to remember! You are joking, right?

It saddens me that I see so many ways that the Wii U can shine, so many new ways to play, that can only be achieved by the Wii U, but I'm only 15, no one cares, but I hope I can finish getting a team together and start making games that I can show to Nintendo

@Caryslanfinally someone speaking sense, it totally ties in with what Sony has said themselves.

"With the 2014 launch of our cloud service in the US allowing users to play PS3 games on the PS4, some people may switch consoles from the PS3 to the PS4," he added. "But that'll be a gradual process, and to say 'we're releasing a new console, so trade in your old ones for it' would be a maker's ego talking, plain and simple."

I also think Nintendo has made a mistake stopping support of the Wii , its like thay are trying to force Wii owners over to the Wii U. New consoles always have a gradual process going from one console to another, slowing but surely Nintendo are losing touch.

@MJKOP One of the things that Nintendo is falling short on in the advertisements for the Wii U is the fact that it is fully backwards compatible with Wii games, controllers and peripherals. If they informed the masses of this, with something like they are doing for the 2DS then they would have a bunch more people making the leap to the Wii U. PS4/XB1 can't say that they can play all of the PS3/360 games that gamers already own, or even use the controllers that you already have... the Wii U can say that and Nintendo should market to that strength as well! You get the full library of Wii titles (many mini-game collections that appeal to the casual gamer) and you also get the new and upcoming Wii U titles, it's like two consoles in one! And now you can play your Wii games anywhere in the house with the newest update allowing you to play any Wii game on just the gamepad anywhere in your house. Nintenod should cpitalize on this.

@GN004Nadleeh: do us a favor: put down your tinfoil hat and show proof of your statements OR grab a Scrabble game and a bottle of laxative of your choice. Shallow the Scrabble pieces with the help of said laxative and wait till you have to do a #2. Once you have done a #2, take a picture of your WC contents and post it here. Because they might do more sense than whatever you're posting right now.

"Motion gaming isn't exactly dead, so the legacy of the Wii survives to an extent." Or indeed the legacy of all the motion control devices that existed before the Wii... As I'm sure (as seemingly always...) the insinuation here is that the Wii introduced motion controls (which it didn't really).

@Haywired Sure it didn't introduce them, but nothing else did motion controls as well as the Wii before it released. If the Wii never existed, how long do you think it would've taken for someone else to do motion controls as well as Nintendo did?

@AJ_Lethal ok little fan boy go back to letting mommy buy you nintendo games only. 2 screen means can't play on a pc (we figured that fix already), motion controllers tried to take away keyboard controls ( we synced your wiimotes to the pc itself), screen on controller or you can't play (tablets are everywhere). thats proof is too much for your little mind fanboy. now i have a wii u, wii, gamecube, 3ds xl, 2ds, ps3 and a fully paid off ps4 preordered. life is good!

Nintendo isn't forcing Wii U on Wii owners. It's an upgrade. Having Wii U be the only console is a good decision, IMO.Sony may have been selling PS2 for 10 years after its release, but how many people would have just gone with PS3 instead if that was their only option?Not to mention that PS3 eventually dropped PS2 BC(and Other OS). PS2 was still relevant in a sense that it still played PS2 games.

Wii Mode on Wii U, on the other hand, plays all your Wii games and is built into the OS using components that already exist, vs. putting a "PS2 on a chip" with the PS3.

If you look at how Nintendo has handled their consoles, you either already have a Wii(with GCN BC), or will buy a Wii U and have Wii BC when GCN has already been out the door for almost 7 years now.

In otherwords, Nintendo's consoles have reached far enough back into their history that keeping an older console around is basically pointless when the newest one does the same thing, plus more.

@triforcepower73 power is everything and i will stick to BIG titles, that does include windwaker hd and pikmin 3. but as someone who bought every system myself. indie games to me are crap and i hate them, to much like tiger lcd games. nintendo made a hd console didn't they? thats following the leader

????........can I explain what i'm reading because why does it matter what system people enjoy as for indies how can you hate them their games as much as the AAA titles. So why is this kid tries so hard to bash this community.

@D3athBr1ng3r187 He's apparently 31(I'm having trouble believing that). Maybe he's having a hard time accepting the responsibilities of being an adult and wishes he were a kid again, so he has to have somewhere to act like one.

@GN004Nadleeh So you were serious? I'm not laughing anymore because you're obviously delusional or something.

AJ_Lethal According to his profile yeah. And I when I'm talking to someone who's older than me, I like to feel like I'm talking to someone older than me, not someone who's younger than me. And I'm only 14 so that's kind of embarrassing for him!

And then people say that Wii U shouldn't have a GamePad because there's no games for it.

This below is a message to all people thinking logical and with business mind of the gaming world.

Are you going to lament the fact that Wii U has exclusives but not third parties? Then if for 2 weeks a games isn't out you are gonna say that Nintendo doesn't support the Wii U? Then are you gonna say that you love the GamePad but it's not the right move, better adequate than innovate? Then a comeback saying Nintendo should innovate?

Every move Nintendo does in any direction gets a negative comment, it's like the internet has no purpose anymore for Nintendo.

You should be thankful they are listening to what you think but if you don't like how one thing it's done you shound't buy it, so if you don't buy it nor you are interested for it in it's current state it's supposed to not bother you. If you are bothered you will bother Nintendo and the successor if Iwata could not be as patience as him and decide it's not worthy listening to us.

I don't like many things that Nintendo does: i don't like the 2DS, top-view Zelda games, Wii Party U, Wii Sports Club, New Super Luigi U, Wii Fit U.

What do i do? I don't care about them and i buy things that i care for, like: Pokèmon Y, Braverly Default, Sonic Lost World and Super Mario 3D World to name a few.

I don't care what people or reviews say, if i like and i wanna play it on that hardware with that software that tickles me the right way, i'm gonna play it anyway.And don't go talking about wasting money and such arguments, for consumers, gaming is a wasting money business with every product. We just look at it as an investment in our fun, imagination and childish mind.

We look at it as escapism from 1st world problems. Gaming is fun, sometimes challenging and frustrating but always because you wanna have a challenge and all what comes with it always or sometimes, or maybe just fun if that is enough for you. That's the reason why you game...right?

@GN004Nadleeh But that's exactly the point - the PS3 and XBox360 were too far ahead of their time. An entire generation of consoles could've fit between those and their predecessors. But instead of using this potential (and saving loads of money on the way), both Sony and Microsoft decided to compete with the wrong machine - the PC.
Keep in mind: up until the PS2/GCN/XBOX generation, nobody cared if their consoles were as strong as PC's. They had fun with their games, and the only truly missing part was online gaming.
Now, new conoles are painfully expensive just for the sake of superiority, and the focus is shifted from good games to good-looking games. If they used the possible generation Sony and MS skipped, neither X360 nor PS3 would've been even half as expensive, companies around the globe would have a good pace they can keep up with to develop their games, ane PS4 as well as XBone would've been 2017 - 2018 projects. An example: why utilize 4k resolution NOW, when simply nobody can afford a TV for that and no developer will make visuals for that? Because it sound superior to have the absolutely latest stuff available. The usability of such resolution, however, is tossed aside.

And besides, you seem to underestimate the general damage this trend has caused. Some games on PS3/X360 might sell better, but both Sony and Microsoft struggle hard in actually making a profit out of that, simply because the manufacturing costs are too high. The next generation is even more blatant with their pricings, even though PS4 is cheaper than launch day PS3. They're still too expensive for what they offer, and we'll have to see how far the sales numbers go after the pre-order part is done.

@Kaze_Memaryu Sadly I agree with your comment but disagree about Sony/MS systems being expensive for what they offer because the Wii U has this same problem launch day and beyond and the system still has nothing to offer besides Nintendo titles for its expensive price until Nintendo did a price drop. Not trying to bash the system or anything but facts speak for itself.

@Kaze_Memaryu I agree but it's about finance rather than being expensive regardless of brand systems being superior to whatever because these companies wouldn't even have the money or time to even develop these systems nor the 3rd Part Dev's develop their games without their consumers so I just see a strong marking from whatever console we face and have what opinions the system has and price of budget for them.

@Kaze_Memaryu thank you for at least reading my opinion and then replying with your own instead of attacking me with fan boy rage! you make some very good points. the prices these days are too high and there are so few games that its frustrating. all games look the same to me since the unreal engine took over. i still think nintendo is trying to charge way to much for wii u when it feels so dated, especially since i got a launch day ps3. now if they can use the new super mario bros u engine to make a zelda four swords in 3d. mmm dreams

@Araknie now tell the rest of the world. the problem is you can like what you want but internet and reviewers are paid to push the crap on you and, nintendo for some reason love to have tons and tons of crap games before and occasional nintendo title.

@triforcepower73 at 31 that means i was gaming before you were ever born. my opinion and thoughts reflect years of playing. and one day you will have to buy a console with your own money and realize other factors such as cost of system, life time, how much use. yes i believe nintendo is backwards right now but the fact that i bought the console means i have the right to berate it and its policy. now as a zelda fan did you ever play the original with very little text or hand holding? how about a link to the past? i've been here a long time and nintendo has let me down since the gamecube. on a side note my cousin also plays violin in denver and i appreciate how much time and effort goes into learning it.

@GN004Nadleeh How the hell did you go from talking total and absolute gibberish to a couple of replies with text that actually does seem to reflect that you're a 31 year old and probably quite reasonable person? Your previous comments were full of spelling/grammatical mistakes so for me too it was hardly easy reading. And now you go and do normal comments, go figure... But seriously, if you re-read some of your own comments you might get why you were getting all the heat, because besides the uncomfortable reading material, the comments were also heavily opinionated. Actually I was about to give you some heat myself, but then rationality kicked in. It's fine to have your own opinion, but it actually is not fine (not specifically pointing at you, by the way) to see people virtually almost killing each other to make their point. Views can be shared or disagreed upon. No need to be calling people fanboy and what not, especially people that are way younger than you and me (I'm 43).Don't know exactly what your point was with 'I've been here a long time' though, because I was gaming long before YOU were born and 'here' on NLife you've only been since May. No offense though, although I would like to see more 'normal' comments from you (and quite a few other people) because it makes for a much nicer read, and you can still try and make your point without being harsh or insulting. Why not give that a try?Then to all the negative idiots, here's my list of irritating comments that I would LOVE to never see again (unfortunately not going to happen, I'm afraid) here on NLife, because besides making no sense they're simply not supported by fact so it's simply YOUR opinion, making it highly uninteresting to the rest of us. In no particular order:1. Because people defend Nintendo (or any other console for that matter), that doesn't mean that they are fanboys2. If you are so negative about Nintendo, don't share it with us, your comments are useless and add nothing. Sell your console, you're not making use of it so you're not worth owning it.3. The Wii U console is too expensive. - People wanted a price cut, then got it and it's STILL not enough. Wow, just wow...Make a list of what you would need to have remote play on PS4 and/or Xbox One and you would have to invest quite a bit more money, all the Wii U needs is an external hard disk which you can buy for next to nothing nowadays. 4. The GamePad is not comfortable/innovative/useful/whatever. Facts support none of these gripes with the controller, so it's just you. Maybe you have some freakish, alien pair of hands, I don't know. If you can't use it because of the second screen, that's also your inability. It's all been tested and approved and most knowledgeable people that tried it out found it VERY intuitive. If you can drive a car, then you can also look at two screens in your living room, come on. And why is it better to interrupt your game to bring up a menu, while you could have it on the GamePad and keep your TV screen void of all these menu screens and dials and meters? All this (and off TV play) adds to the experience, although admittedly, they haven't made full use of it yet and they DO need to advertise it more (or better). Still, Nintendo spent years and tons of money on creating and developing it and ergonomically it's very comfortable, as attested by many a reviewer. It's only people in comment sections on websites that complain, and don't get me started on idiots saying that they should drop the GamePad altogether, because that makes no sense whatsoever because Nintendo would then just be yet another HD console with no differentiation between them except the exclusives and they would never be able to compete anyway. Nintendo knows this, which is why they plot their own course and don't care what the others do. And rightfully so, it's just smart business.5. Nintendo is doomed/is going to do a Sega (Dreamcast). Read up on facts, NOT going to happen. Sega had no money left and were close to bankruptcy at the time of the Dreamcast, so as far as that goes it truly was their last bet in the home console market. Nintendo could risk making 2 or 3 more 'failed' consoles after the Wii U, and STILL have money left to make another one, that is how much money they have in the bank. The Wii U hasn't failed yet, because although it's in a tough spot, it sold remarkably well with next to no software and compared to other console launches and as seen with the 3DS (even though that's a different market) a few good games can definitely still turn things around.6. The Wii U is NOT next gen/not powerful enough/has old hardware. And that is the reason it's not supported by third parties. That too is a load of BS. First off, it simply is way more powerful than the Wii, and quite a bit (about 1 to 2 times) more powerful than the current HD consoles. Granted, that's not much, but still. And compared to the Wii it is huge, so Wii owners upgrading to a Wii U SHOULD have nothing to complain about. And then the third party developers... Now I could say that they hate Nintendo or are lazy, but none of that is true and is a bit fanboyish. The truth is, it's simply a business solution. The installed base of the Wii U is too little for the big titles to be able to make a profit if they would make their game for the Wii U. Public opinion however is heavily influenced by idiotic comments made by companies such as EA and individual, mostly 'anonymous' developers saying all kinds of things that are in no way helpful and are almost never supported by ACTUAL facts. Especially when they say that the game they are going to publish is coming out on the Xbox 360/PS3. No matter which way you turn that, those consoles are FACTUALLY weaker than the Wii U, so it has to be the money, just think about that. Oh, and the old hardware is also BS, because console hardware (except for the upcoming HD twins) has always been custom so a) you can't just compare graphics cards and other internals, also making sites that display the innards of consoles to 'reveal' what they can do kind of useless for that. Because the hardware is heavily customized it will not perform like similar hardware that is off the shelf and may very well have additional functionalities not found in the original hardware.b) the ACTUAL reason that most of the older third party software performed no better or worse than the current HD gen is that these games were not optimized towards the WiiU's GPGPU, so they were still CPU intensive and that was a bit of a bottleneck for the WiiU. There's things it can do that neither of the other two can do, so if developers make full use of it, every third party title should look quite a bit better on WiiU than on Xbox 360/PS3. So, once again, it's all about the money.I could probably come up with more, but this was already way more than what I initially wanted to say. If anyone reads all of it, AND has an intelligent reply to it, then thanks in advance.@Kaze_Memaryu Some very good points on the tech race, thumbs up.

I pretty much agree with this article, though personally think the Wii U will outsell the N64. Definitely not match Wii but fall between 40-50 million units lifetime. Afterall, we have to remember that the generations where Nintendo struggled most were when the competition competed with them DIRECTLY. Something tells me over the year, Nintendo's come to realize that the pursuing the "hardcore" crowd is a lost cause and from hear on out will get back to pushing more classic style experiences. Something that we must remember is that price and motion controls were only part of Wii's success. Another crucial element in its success is that it was essentially a living fossil of old school gaming via Nintendo's first party lineup. (I mean DKCR and NSMBWii were like total nostalgia punches.).

@GN004Nadleeh I bought the 3DS and Wii U with my own money[yes my own money that I worked for, not allowance(I don't get allowance)]. And yes, I have played the original Zelda. Haven't gotten around to LTTP, though. Hopefully, I will, though, one day.

@Kaze_Memaryu Thanks for the compliment and for your time, and sorry about that indeed. I always try to make short comments but rarely succeed. Nature of the beast I guess; especially with topics like these I can get carried away quite easily...

I have to say I'm one of those who really enjoys my Wii U. I have a dozen physical games and another dozen downloads, so I say it's doing pretty well, actually!

The Wii was a freak accident, there's no doubt about that. I don't know why anyone expects the Wii U to match it. That said, it's a great console, but its gimmick may be a bit ahead of the curve.

People say that the Gamepad shouldn't be bundled with the system and I just don't understand why. The very idea of doing that is to get 100% market penetration on the Gamepad - so devs KNOW that every Wii U owner has one. That enables them to make a better game. That was the entire purpose, and if you start selling Wii Us without Gamepads, you just miss the point.

The PS4 and Xbone are capable of this second screen tech as well, but they lack the 100% factor - does the player have a Vita/Smart Glass? Devs can't count on it. It makes ports suffer because they are going to want to program for them rather than Nintendo - AGAIN - instead of going with the sure thing and making the Sony and Microsoft second screen stuff optional in their port.

This is why I say the Gamepad is ahead of its time, but should not be removed. The games would suffer. How many times has it already been said in the past months that "THIS is the definitive port?" The Gamepad is always responsible. People are starting to figure it out.

Anyway I think the theory that Sony and Microsoft will have slow launches as well is interesting. I also think that if they do, Nintendo won't get the third parties back until at least 2015, if ever, but... I think the Wii U can stand on its own merits already/until then by virtue of its backwards compatibility (with controllers and peripherals even, which is unheard of) and year head start. Plus it's cheaper, and there's bound to be another price drop sometime in 2014.

They got this.

Plus, what was wrong with GameCube and N64? People sing their praises all the time!

@Falco
I may as well suggest that being a "grown-up" makes you any more capable at mental and social communication, as well as the fact that what you said was completely false in any non-bias or personalized way. It may be your opinion, which you are free to have, but you tried to state it in a manner that suggested that it was fact. That is why I was angry, ya idiot.