The French secret service is believed to have refused to allow MI6 to give the Americans "credible" intelligence showing that Iraq was trying to buy uranium ore from Niger, US intelligence sources said yesterday.

MI6 had more than one "different and credible" piece of intelligence to show that Iraq was attempting to buy the ore, known as yellowcake, British officials insisted. But it was given to them by at least one and possibly two intelligence services and, under the rules governing cooperation, it could not be shared with anyone else without the originator's permission.

US intelligence sources believe that the most likely source of the MI6 intelligence was the French secret service, the DGSE. Niger is a former French colony and its uranium mines are run by a French company that comes under the control of the French Atomic Energy Commission.

A further factor in the refusal to hand over the information might have been concern that the US administration's willingness to publicise intelligence might lead to sources being inadvertently disclosed.

US sources also point out that the French government was vehemently opposed to the war with Iraq and so suggest that it would have been instinctively against the idea of passing on the intelligence.

British sources yesterday dismissed suggestions of a row between MI6 and the CIA on the issue. However, they admitted being surprised that George Tenet, the CIA director, had apologised to President George W Bush for allowing him to cite the British government and its claim that Saddam had sought to acquire uranium from Africa in his State of the Union speech last October.

The apology follows the International Atomic Energy Authority's dismissal of documents given to it by the CIA, which purported to prove the link, as fakes.

Those documents have been widely identified with last September's British dossier on Iraqi weapons of mass destruction, which said Saddam Hussein was trying to buy uranium ore from an unnamed country in Africa.

British officials admitted that the country was Niger but insisted that the intelligence behind it was genuine and had nothing to do with the fake documents. It was convincing and they were sticking with it, the officials said.

They dismissed a report from a former US diplomat who was sent to Niger to investigate the claims and rejected them. "He seems to have asked a few people if it was true and when they said 'no' he accepted it all," one official said. "We see no reason at all to change our assessment."

The fake documents were not behind that assessment and were not seen by MI6 until after they were denounced by the IAEA. If MI6 had seen them earlier, it would have immediately advised the Americans that they were fakes.

There had been a number of reports in America in particular suggesting that the fake documents - which came from another intelligence source - were passed on via MI6, the officials said. But this was not true.

"What they can't accuse MI6 of doing is passing anything on this to the CIA because it didn't have the fake documents and it was not allowed to pass on the intelligence it did have to anyone else."

Folks, there really is a Watergate style scandal coming. But it is not going to be about the administration. It is going to be about the Democrats.

I think you are right -- would guess we are going to see the Administration take the offensive shortly and run up the score on the Clinton RATS! I want the Clintons leveled because I believe they are behind this recent attacks on the President over Niger!

I still think there is something really, really bad that the French are trying to hide. No one would be surprised if they had sold parts, or even uranium, to Iraq.

It's not like they haven't sold Iraq entire reactors on more than one occasion, and provided enriched fuel as well.

The Israelis bombed the French Osirek reactor, and destroyed its replacement right while it was aboard a ship in a French port.... just another reason why the French support the PLO.

1975 : (IRAQ BUYS URANIUM FROM FRANCE) When Iraq purchased the uranium from France in 1975, Baghdad agreed to place it under the supervision of the International Atomic Energy Agency, a Vienna-based nonproliferation watchdog group. IAEA inspectors perform tests on Iraq's stash twice yearly.- "When Will Saddam Get the Bomb? Not nearly so soon as the Bush Administration claims, "By William R. Doerner, December 10, 1990 via TIME Capsule, The Evolution of the Iraqi Threat, http://www.time.com/time/classroom/article/0,12422,235482,00.html

1976 to 1989 : (IRAQ OBTAINS EQUIPMENT FROM ITALY) Banca Nazionale del Lavoro (BNL) (Italy) provides Iraq with Four commercial contracts with shipments of major equipment; $3 billion to $5 billion of unauthorized loans to Iraq, including at least $920 million of export credit guarantees and over 2,500 letters of credit ; they were indicted by US federal authorities, February 1991 - see http://www.nti.org/e_research/e1_iraq_N_imports_chron.html

1977 : (IRAQ BEGINS INSTALLING FRENCH NUCLEAR REACTOR) In 1977 the country began installing a French Osirak-model nuclear reactor, ostensibly for research projects, at El-Tuwaitha, 10 1/2 miles southwest of Baghdad. Four years later, convinced that the reactor's real purpose was to produce plutonium to be chemically reprocessed and used for weapons, Israel bombed the facility to rubble. After the Osirak attack, Iraq tried to realize its ambitions by buying bomb- grade material from underground suppliers. - "When Will Saddam Get the Bomb? Not nearly so soon as the Bush Administration claims, "By William R. Doerner, December 10, 1990 via TIME Capsule, The Evolution of the Iraqi Threat, http://www.time.com/time/classroom/article/0,12422,235482,00.html.

NOVEMBER 19-22, 1990 : (IAEA CONDUCTS TESTS ON IRAQ'S STASH OF FRENCH URANIUM)- "When Will Saddam Get the Bomb? Not nearly so soon as the Bush Administration claims, "By William R. Doerner, December 10, 1990 via TIME Capsule, The Evolution of the Iraqi Threat, http://www.time.com/time/classroom/article/0,12422,235482,00.html

DECEMBER 1990 early : (IAEA CERTIFIES THAT TESTS ON IRAQ'S STASH OF FRENCH URANIUM SHOWED "NO CHANGE" IN AMOUNT OR PURITY OF URANIUM") When Iraq purchased the uranium from France in 1975, Baghdad agreed to place it under the supervision of the International Atomic Energy Agency, a Vienna-based nonproliferation watchdog group. IAEA inspectors perform tests on Iraq's stash twice yearly. Last week the agency certified that the latest round, conducted from Nov. 19 to 22, showed no change"in either the amount or the purity of the uranium. Should the Iraqis elect to tamper with the uranium in the future, U.S. experts estimate, the process of turning it into a bomb would take a minimum of several months. Since an IAEA inspection might occur within that period, a diversion could be detected before an Iraqi nuclear bomb became a fait accompli. - "When Will Saddam Get the Bomb? Not nearly so soon as the Bush Administration claims, "By William R. Doerner, December 10, 1990 via TIME Capsule, The Evolution of the Iraqi Threat, http://www.time.com/time/classroom/article/0,12422,235482,00.html

Even after the Gulf War , Iraq doggedly continued to obtain items, often through front companies, for its nuclear program, from private and government run entities throughout the developed world....

Ann Coulter is correct in her boon, "Treason", as it cronicals the legacy of the liberals in America (and I would assume throughout the West by proxy), as being communist spies and agents in pay of Moscow. For a political party shown to be "moles" from the highest seats of leadership throughout the late 40's, 50's and 60's, many of those who denounce MacCarthy were guys like Mondale and poster boys for the 'rats until the late 80's. The Demcorat Party is a lagacy operation of hatred of America induced by close association with soviet communists and their attempts to subvert America during the Cold War until the fall of the Iron Curtian in 1991.

Has anyone else in American noticed that with the fall of the USSR, the Clinton's and the Democrat Hate Machine emerged on the American scene as did 'rat corruption in business? Might the 'rats actually be without "masters" for once as they have never really produced any ideas, other than to destroy American one law at a time!

I remember that UN briefing. I did some transcription on here and since I didn't want to type El Baradei's name all the time, I called him Blix's little buddy! I had the feeling all of those UN meetings were nothing more than an attack on the United States and covering for Saddam and the countries that supported him. Annan didn't want the truth to come out IMHO!

Very good points! I read somewhere recently that the new word the communist were using was to call themselves socialist to soften the inference! Didn't work -- I consider the members of the Socialist Party of America to be Communist!

Entity Name: Al Qaim Activity Memo: One of three phosphate plants slated for rehabilitation under the oil-for-food program in the first half of 2000. Historical Role in Iraqi WMD Programs. Site with a yellow cake production facility and very large superphosphate fertilizer plant; begun in 1982 and designed for 103 tonnes/year, with second cycle and refinery sections built with a 100% overcapacity; commissioned in early 1984; operational until damaged by air attack in 1991.

Oh, to support your "I was hoping the lid could stay on until the Cogressional hearings got started on 'Nigerian/Uraniumgate"

I'm on the email list for MoveOn.org. This is their latest propaganda....

Dear MoveOn member,

Three weeks ago, MoveOn launched a petition asking Congress to create an independent commission to investigate whether the Bush Administration manipulated and distorted evidence to take the country to war in Iraq. Over 190,000 of us joined the effort. Now Congress is literally taking up our call: Rep. Henry Waxman (D-CA) has written a bill that would create just such a commission, and it's already co-sponsored by a wide array of moderate Democrats -- including many who voted for the war.

This commission can really happen -- and the truth about the Bush Administration's manipulation of evidence can really come out -- but we'll need your help. We're launching a drive to get every member of Congress to personally pledge to support and vote for the independent commission. Please take a moment to ask Congressman Holt to pledge today at:

If you sign right now, your comment may be among those read on the House floor by some of the Representatives pushing this resolution. Reps. Henry Waxman (D-CA), Barbara Lee (D-CA), George Miller (D-CA), Sherrod Brown (D-OH), Lloyd Doggett (D-TX), Rosa DeLauro (D-CT), and a number of others are looking forward to hearing what you have to say and reading some of the messages into the Congressional Record on the House floor.

It's hardly a secret that members of the Bush Administration used misleading and scanty evidence to bolster their case. As US News and World Report noted in early June, even Colin Powell became alarmed at the level of intelligence distortion. When he read the first draft of his speech to the UN -- prepared for Powell by Vice President Richard Cheney's chief of staff -- he was so upset at the weakness of some of the evidence that he lost his temper, throwing several pages in the air and declaring, "I'm not reading this. This is bullshit." (US News and World Report, 6/9/03, URL below)

115
posted on 07/13/2003 8:53:13 PM PDT
by Calpernia
(Remember the three R's: Respect for self; Respect for others; Responsibility for all your actions.)

Entity Name: Al Tuwaitha Nuclear Research Center Activity Memo: Reported storage of 1.8 metric tons of uranium oxide powder, enriched to 2.6% U-235 [low-enriched uranium (LEU)], and an additional 13 metric tons of natural uranium; included the Tuwaitha Agricultural and Biological Research Center, which contained an undeclared biological laboratory unit identified by the UN monitoring system in 1996. Historical Role in Iraqi WMD Programs. Site of all R&D on uranium enrichment, including EMIS, centrifuge enrichment and chemical enrichment; enriched milligram quantities of uranium to 40-45 percent (for a total, with Tarmiya's product, of 0.6 kg with an average enrichment level of four percent); site of legal and illegal plutonium separation and fuel element production at Building 73 complex; produced five fuel elements from natural uranium, irradiated them in the IRT-5000 reactor, then reprocessed them to separate out the plutonium  all in violation of the NPT safeguards agreement with the IAEA; Iraq placed two unreprocessed irradiated elements on a truck and moved them around as IAEA1 moved, within Tuwaitha; Iraq declared Tuwaitha tested an oil-type centrifuge (model 1) in 1987, on an aluminum cylinder 3 inches in diameter with oil-lubricated bearings; a magnetic/pivot bearing centrifuge (model 2) based on Zippe type, for which two rotors were planned (all-maraging steel with caps and baffles electron-beam-welded into place, and a carbon-composite rotor cylinder with maraging steel caps and baffles held in place with epoxy resin) for which main drawings of components, feed and extraction pipes were supplied; Iraq claimed only single-machine tests from mid-1988 to late 1990; carbon rotor design speed of 60,000 rmp was achieved with two rotors (one in mechanical test stand and one with UF6 gas in process test stand); 1.9 SWU/year obtained, to be optimized to 2.7 SWU/yr.

Facilities: - Building 2: former cafeteria, then contained a large presentation featuring displays describing individual research projects - Building 3: administrative building with personal computers for hydrodynamic models - Building 4: agriculture research lab - Building 9: found by IAEA4 to be an unsafeguarded radiochemical laboratory where Iraq carried out chemical processing of three irradiated fuel elements and purification of the separated plutonium between November 1989 and July 1990; found by IAEA7 to have separated plutonium from exempted pins and irradiated pins, and produced Po-210 sources; site of hot cells with 150 mm lead shielding found, intact, by IAEA1-2; hot cell compartments were used for dissolution, equipment maintenance and mixer settlers; hot cells were also found to have been used for extracting 2.26 grams (declared) plutonium; found by IAEA15 to be the chemical analysis portion of the radiochemistry building - Building 10: found by IAEA7 to have produced uranium metal and to have melted and cast uranium metal; - Building 10 Annex: nuclear physics department - Building 13: Reactor IRT-5000, irradiated EK-10 and EK-07 cassettes, and Bismuth for Po-210 production - Building 15: Radioisotope production lab and site of two hot cells found by IAEA1-2, one with 900 mm of shielding, the other with 1200 mm barytic shielding; extensively damaged with all services destroyed; also originally contained 23 lead cells which were scattered as a result of the Gulf War bombing; found by IAEA7 to have produced UF4 and UF6 - Building 16: workshop, served as initiator workshop - Building 22: LAMA building, in or near which IAEA 15 collected samples, smears and tree trunks for tritium analysis; LAMA hot metallurgy testing lab, site of two hot cells found during IAEA1-2, which found no independent evidence of the use made of this building - Building 23: Laboratory and workshop building, declared to have been used primarily for laser and optics work; totally destroyed with all accessible equipment removed by Iraq prior to inspection; found by IAEA7 to be site of gaseous diffusion enrichment and ceramic capacitor fabrication - Building 24: Tammuz reactor office building and reactor building; site of badly damaged hot cells found by IAEA1-2; found by IAEA7 to be site of Tammuz-2 zero power reactor and hot cells, storage site for irradiated cassettes; disassembled cassettes and performed neutron measurements - Building 35: radioactive waste treatment center, site of two hot cells in good condition, plus undamaged machinery, found by IAEA1-2; found by IAEA7 to have handled wastes from irradiation program - Building 42: library - Building 63: materials testing lab (ceramics and metals), made unusable by Gulf War bombing, Iraq removed all equipment; found by IAEA7 to be cold material testing lab where Iraq conducted gas centrifuge enrichment - Building 64: engineering - Building 66: declared by Iraq to develop detonators, with future plans to undertake uranium metal production - Building 73 complex: included the "Italian" Area with fuel fabrication and chemical engineering research labs (both almost completely destroyed in the Gulf War) and a material testing building (whose essential equipment survived the Gulf War); site in which Iraq carried out a series of undeclared activities, revealed in IAEA 12 (all unsafeguarded activity took place in 73C--including production of 1 ton of uranium metal--except for the production of 18.9 kg natural uranium as five fuel rods, which took place in 73A using Al Jesira UO2); otherwise 73A and 73B were under safeguards; found by IAEA7 to be the Experimental Fuel Fabrication Laboratory, which manufactured EK-07 - Building 80: nuclear physics labs; found by IAEA1-2 to be a dedicated EMIS facility; declared use was research on plasma physics, ion source physics, magnet development and future cyclotron operation; Iraq removed its concrete reinforced floor prior to IAEA1, plus all equipment; singled out for unusually thorough demolition after IAEA1; serviced by large electrical (7.4MW) and cooling services found to be in excess of declared needs - Building 82: physics department; found by IAEA7 to house electronic research labs - Building 85 complex: chemistry and chemical engineering research and development; declared purpose was chemical and chemical engineering-related R&D, including pilot-scale extraction to recover uranium from ore with high organic content; contained a small UCl4 pilot line; declared during IAEA3 to have produced the UCl4 for testing EMIS at Tuwaitha and Tarmiya; extensively bombed, followed by "vigorous removal operation" and "extensive site leveling" by Iraq; two process halls removed before IAEA1; equipped with unusually large ventilation system; singled out for "unusually thorough demolition" after IAEA1; found by IAEA7 to be chemical research laboratories that produced yellow cake, UO2 and UCl4 - Building 90: found by IAEA7 to be the site of chemical enrichment activities for the nuclear weapon program; polymer chemistry research lab which performed enrichment by solvent extraction and ion exchange, and U6 enrichment research - Associated Location B: site at which IAEA4 found the two unreprocessed irradiated cells in a water- filled open steel cylinder, plus five irradiated beryllium elements from the IRT-5000 core, stored in a drum - Associated Location C: site of nuclear material including "uranium concentrates and various uranium compounds, oxide powder, etc."

I suspect that tools such as the Clintons, Schroeder, Chirac, Annan, McAuliffe and company (aka the 'Rats), former KGB operatives (but I repeat myself), ad nauseum, are beholden to the same masters.

If I may offer a thought that enforces Jim's position while perhaps answering your question, Imal.

Those you list, Imal, are part of the second tier, the operatives. Those you wonder about, the masters behind the scenes pulling the strings, are the secular Gods of the left and their ideology, their religion. They are not people, they are ideas. All come together under that big tent. All pursue the same goals, use the same methods, and think the same way. Their only outward commonality is their hatred of America but their true master is the religion of secular control.

We all know their predilection to projection, casting their own evil onto others. That was what was happening in the invention by Hillary, et al., of the vast right wing conspiracy. They are consumed with their vast left wing conspiracy so they reflexively see the mirror image in their environment.

They are the embodiment of the worst of man in his natural state. As Jim said, they are the anti-Christ, but they are also anti-goodness of man in his natural state. (Man is both good and bad in his natural state.)

I contrast that to man's spiritual state, also a natural state but one that transcends the physical. There has been much speculation as to why the Arab world, and much of the rest of the world for that matter, hates us. It is not because of our power, our material success, or our form of government. It is our values! Our values are diametrically opposed to theirs. We value freedom, we value God, we value moral and ethical behavior. We hold up a mirror into which they must gaze. That is like holding the cross up to a vampire.

I know this needs to be fleshed out but it is getting too long for this thread already so I will stop.

I don't think Pat Buchanan fits this description. I just think his anger and ambition have led him into the useful idiot role.

121
posted on 07/13/2003 9:06:53 PM PDT
by Mind-numbed Robot
(Not all things that need to be done need to be done by the government.)

Read any Rockwell/Buchanan/Rainmondo/Paleo/Anarchist thread. They all preach the same anti-Bush, anti-Republican, anti-war, pro-terror message. And they're damn quick to jump on the anti-Bush bandwagon at the slightest drop of any misinformation put out by the New York Times/Washington Post anti-America propaganda machine.

They have been practicing this for a couple of years now -- thread after thread -- and they will shift it into overdrive over the next year and a half.

Oh what a surprise, huh, a French fingerprint on an effort to undermine the United States. I have no doubt, remembering Putin's warning that the US would be sorry for taking action in Iraq, that the French were and still are working behind the scenes. It is no wonder the US doesn't want to ask NATO for help in Iraq. We can't invite the French who I am sure are, in the least, quite happy with any trouble we are encountering.

Lets not forget Germany who have also been caught selling to Iran. --Armed with the design and foreign technical advisers, Iraq was buying sophisticated manufacturing equipment, including numerically controlled machine tools that were then programmed to produce centrifuge components automatically and precisely. The use of these machines would have significantly lessened the need for skilled technicians. Headline: GERMAN FIRMS PRIMED IRAQ'S WAR MACHINE Date: 23 July 1992 Bibliography: WASHINGTON POST, 23 July 1992, PP. A1, A26 BY R. JEFFREY SMITH AND MARC FISHER http://www.nti.org/db/nuclear/1992/n9208257.htm

An excellent post, and food for thought. While I don't doubt the power of commonly-shared beliefs, I can't shake the strong impression that the activities of these people are too well coordinated to be explained by ideology alone.

I think there are real people pulling the strings of the International Socialists, and I want to know just who the hell these people are.

As Keyser Soze so aptly put it, "The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."

In this case, I think there is more than one devil involved, and I think it is well past time we flushed these scoundrels out of the shadows.

134
posted on 07/14/2003 1:35:52 AM PDT
by Imal
(The World According to Imal: http://imal.blogspot.com)

I was going to comment on your very good references, but I stumbled across this page, on a website you have mentioned. If someone wants to be shocked and appalled, all they need to do is read this web page.

It appears to be an official IAEA document, which has many details of Iraq's purchases of uranium, and how it was processed, and how much is missing. I particularly noted this minor purchase:

The yellowcake procured from Portugal was supplied in two batches. Batch 1, received on 20 June 1980, consisted of 429 drums containing 138,098 kg of yellowcake and batch two, received as three consignments over the period from 17 May 1982 through 20 June 1982, consisted of 487 drums containing 148,348 kg yellow cake.

Well we certainly don't have all the facts. That is for sure. But if suspicion of government is a conservative disease then I most surely do have it. I suspect I am the only one infected on this thread at least. Ps- getting late on this part of the globe. back later- thanks to all- later nopardons.

141
posted on 07/14/2003 2:23:25 AM PDT
by Burkeman1
(If you see ten troubles comin down the road, Nine will run into the ditch before they reach you.)

While I don't doubt the power of commonly-shared beliefs, I can't shake the strong impression that the activities of these people are too well coordinated to be explained by ideology alone.

There is no doubt they coordinate among themselves in various ways. They don't necessarily all meet is secret places at secret times but they communicate among themselves in various ways. Look at how central the French are to many of these avenues. Look at the UN and the opportunities there. Bill Clinton travels the world meeting with a variety of these people. There is communication but just no secret group of unknown people pulling the strings in a hierarchal manner.

144
posted on 07/14/2003 3:51:11 AM PDT
by Mind-numbed Robot
(Not all things that need to be done need to be done by the government.)

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