/would put that bunch up against the basement dwellers here in virtually any measure of accomplishment.//since the hackerspace around here even runs their own still for absinthe, i would even dare to include drinking in that.

Listen, you want to see our city in flamesCause you're full of pity and blameYou just want the freedom to sit at home and play videogamesMaybe we could drain some ingrained aggressionIf you came for a training session...

We're putting together a maker space in conjunction with our local library. It's a great educational resource and it will bring new purpose for our under-utilized library. It's really a cool idea- you don't have to own and maintain a lathe, CNC router, 3D printer, laser cutter, kiln, etc., just join the maker space and use theirs. Aside from the played out hipster hate, what's so bad about this?

"The rock which I most dread is the discipline of the institution, and it is that on which most of our public schools labor. The insubordination of our youth is now the greatest obstacle to their education. We may lessen the difficulty, perhaps, by avoiding too much government, by requiring no useless observances, none which shall merely multiply occasions for dissatisfaction, disobedience and revolt by referring to the more discreet of themselves the minor discipline, the graver to the civil magistrates."-Thomas Jefferson to George Ticknor, 182

redsquid:We're putting together a maker space in conjunction with our local library. It's a great educational resource and it will bring new purpose for our under-utilized library. It's really a cool idea- you don't have to own and maintain a lathe, CNC router, 3D printer, laser cutter, kiln, etc., just join the maker space and use theirs. Aside from the played out hipster hate, what's so bad about this?

whats so bad about it is that it removes another 'barrier' to being productive, even if a currently mostly imaginary one, that people like to use as an excuse as to why they are not accomplishing anything.

remember, every couch potato daydreamer is convinced they would be insanely rich and do many great world-changing things 'if only' all these barriers were not in the way. i have noticed than when you show people the barriers really aren't there, and people just like them are actually doing great things, many get excited and jump at the chance, but the reaction is almost universally very visceral and negative from some specific personality types.

no one wants to admit that they are simply lazy and unmotivated, they always need a reason for it not to be their fault, or even their choice if possible. anyone showing them up and putting a lie to their delusion always get a load of hate.

redsquid:We're putting together a maker space in conjunction with our local library. It's a great educational resource and it will bring new purpose for our under-utilized library. It's really a cool idea- you don't have to own and maintain a lathe, CNC router, 3D printer, laser cutter, kiln, etc., just join the maker space and use theirs. Aside from the played out hipster hate, what's so bad about this?

That's pretty damn awesome. I've found myself wishing I had access to manufacturing equipment once or twice.

Phoenix87ta:redsquid: We're putting together a maker space in conjunction with our local library. It's a great educational resource and it will bring new purpose for our under-utilized library. It's really a cool idea- you don't have to own and maintain a lathe, CNC router, 3D printer, laser cutter, kiln, etc., just join the maker space and use theirs. Aside from the played out hipster hate, what's so bad about this?

That's pretty damn awesome. I've found myself wishing I had access to manufacturing equipment once or twice.

One of the bigwigs from Make Magazine recently did a standing room only speech at the national librarians conference. Many librarians are now fired up to do tech projects and community based hacking programs. It's a win-win situation- geeks get a place to do their thing and libraries get more people through the door.

What I've noticed is that "anarchist hacker spaces" either are lying and there's a cabal of some sort in control, or they're really anarchist and people do whatever they like, possibly to the detriment of others. Nothing wrong with the cabal organization if they're open and honest about it, but usually they sell people on the idea that it's a utopian group. That's fine if you agree with what the group in control does, but god help you if you don't.

"No government" also means no rules to keep people from stepping on you, no guaranteed rights like a fair hearing or storage space of your own, and the majority of members can kick you out if they don't like you, even if the reason they don't like you is that you're black or a lesbian.

It's too bad, because a minimal amount of governance and organization would let a lot of these places go far, if the members weren't so against "the man".

If you're a business student, these things are interesting to watch, because typically the people running them assume they're too smart to build their organization using standard business rules and practices, then they go out and make every single mistake in the book without even recognizing that they're operating just like every other "unique" small business that's tried to exist.

AccuJack:What I've noticed is that "anarchist hacker spaces" either are lying and there's a cabal of some sort in control, or they're really anarchist and people do whatever they like, possibly to the detriment of others. Nothing wrong with the cabal organization if they're open and honest about it, but usually they sell people on the idea that it's a utopian group. That's fine if you agree with what the group in control does, but god help you if you don'

AccuJack:What I've noticed is that "anarchist hacker spaces" either are lying and there's a cabal of some sort in control, or they're really anarchist and people do whatever they like, possibly to the detriment of others. Nothing wrong with the cabal organization if they're open and honest about it, but usually they sell people on the idea that it's a utopian group. That's fine if you agree with what the group in control does, but god help you if you don't.

"No government" also means no rules to keep people from stepping on you, no guaranteed rights like a fair hearing or storage space of your own, and the majority of members can kick you out if they don't like you, even if the reason they don't like you is that you're black or a lesbian.

It's too bad, because a minimal amount of governance and organization would let a lot of these places go far, if the members weren't so against "the man".

If you're a business student, these things are interesting to watch, because typically the people running them assume they're too smart to build their organization using standard business rules and practices, then they go out and make every single mistake in the book without even recognizing that they're operating just like every other "unique" small business that's tried to exist.

Are you trying to provoke the traditional "anarchism does not mean anarchy" response? Anarchists are ok with rules, as long as they get to make them - and in this case their ground rules are pretty clear and commonsense, and they're here: https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/About

They're not utopians, and they've been doing really well for the past six years.

Basically, people find a cheap rental space and all chip in for rent and utilities, and then every member can pool equipment, resources and expertiese so that everyone has a far better lab than any one person could have individually.

Hackerspace Wiki maintains a list if anyone wants to check one out. Just look for one near you and see if they have an open lab night.