Being economically occupied by China, politically owned by America and what EVERYONE is missing about how to defeat TPPA

We can stamp our feet like the Green Party and the Unions have and throw a tantrum and just refuse to actually engage with the process OR we can see this as an opportunity to directly influence our political and economic independence.

The National Government are as dependent on their Chinese friends as the entire economy now has become.

…the fact that Metiria’s courageous admission that she took for her child 25 years ago could face more scrutiny and attention from the mainstream media of NZ than a National Party MP who is a Chinese Spy tells you all you need to know about how fucking braindead our corporate media are, and also how their owners are very sensitive to annoying Chinese business interests themselves.

The truth is that we are economically occupied by China. They see us as the Tibet of the South Pacific and in their cold war (soon to be hot war) with America over the Pacific, they intend to push their interests aggressively as they seek to become the dominant force in our region.

This economic occupation by China is of course happening while we are utterly politically owned by America.

Our inclusion into the 5 Eyes network with vast new upgrades for mass surveillance means our Intelligence Apparatus answers to Washington, not Wellington. The forced mass surveillance legislation rammed through under urgency, the rules gagging telecommunications companies from informing their customers that the GCSB or SIS are spying on them, aggressive whistleblower laws to prevent Public Servants from telling the people about illegal Government spying, the entire prosecution of Kim Dotcom and the attempt to assert US jurisdiction into cyberspace – all of these developments in NZ are part of an attempt by the deep state to cement their power over our political establishment.

China to the Left of us, America to the right – and here I am stuck in the middle with you sleepy Hobbits.

So what does a tiny country do when caught between two mammoth powers?

You tread bloody carefully.

What the new fangled CPTPP actually does is present NZ with a genuine opportunity to try and push for an independent economic direction with a trade deal that doesn’t include China or America.

Are there still concerns about the ISDS powers that could drag us in front of an international tribunal?

Of course there are.

Are there concerns about protecting Māori sovereignty?

Yes there is.

Are there concerns that this trade deal will only help NZ big business and none of our small exporters?

Could someone please send the Green Party a memo that they are actually in the fucking Government now? You don’t just throw tantrums, that’s what Opposition Parties do, you are now the Government and as such have enormous influence over the final agreement.

NZ First at least has the decency to show enough political skills to wait until the text is in front of us before they are ruling it out!

What everyone needs to do now is pause, take a deep breath and just try to consider all the moving parts of this before throwing tantrums.

I’ve argued that Jacinda, David Parker and Winston are all playing a dangerous game trying to navigate elites at home who want to trip the new Government up and an MFAT who are religiously free market and that the CPTPP represents us kicking for touch rather than a sell out of all the values arguing against the ISDS. Add the far larger geopolitical machinations between China and America and we either see the CPTPP as a means to advance our interests away from China and America or we all sulk while refusing to acknowledge that is even happening.

Having spoken directly to David Parker and Jane Kelsey over the last 24 hours, here is the process that needs to occur before this thing is signed off.

All 11 countries first have to

Finalise the negotiations (Japan is pushing for the sidelines of WTO ministerial meeting in Buenos Aires in December; haven’t heard from the Canada end)

Scrub and revise the legal text

Sign the text (Japan is saying this should happen in Japan in January)

Each party then undertakes its own domestic processes

Standing orders (397) require a new agreement (which this is branded as) or an amendment to an existing agreement to be tabled in the House with an NIA.

That is referred to the select committee, which does not have to hear submissions but the PM said they would.

The committee has to report to the house – although there is no requirement for a vote. National did not even have a debate on the report, only the implementing legislation. There is no set time frame.

It is not clear whether any implementing legislation would then be required; they will probably have to make some amendments to the existing Act to change the entry into force provisions regarding the IP stuff.

So what this all means is that there has to be a process, and it is our obligation as citizens to interact with that process to ensure that the CPTPP poses no threats to our democracy, that it it actually benefits all NZ business and not just some and that it protects the environment and human rights WHILE providing us independence from China and America.

Now, we can stamp our feet like the Green Party and the Unions have and throw a tantrum and just refuse to actually engage with the process OR we can see this as an opportunity to directly influence our political and economic independence.

You can’t be screaming about corporate threats to our democracy and ignore the current influence China and America has over our democracy because to do so would make you sound really stupid.

IF during the process we can’t get what we want, we always have the option to walk away and outright oppose it, but to do that before we’ve even understood the process or considered the geopolitical realities seems like the actions of children who are not ready yet for the big questions.

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“So what are we, children or adults?”
I feel like a child who has been interfered by a pedophile and had my lolly pop [sovereignty] stolen.I can react to this in an adult manner , and make a stirring speech about my human rights being infringed. Or I can get childish and kick him in the goolies and stuff my yoyo down his throat. Decisions!!!

Words are spoken to the crowds so to calm them so they don’t answer back with irrelevance.

The shift towards China is inevitable because the numbers of Chinese population. It doesn’t mean that the Chinese GDP exceeds that of the U.S that we need to bow to either. China has more resources and people than the U.S and New Zealand combined at China’s command. They can field a larger army, larger navy. But the fact remains that per capita New Zealand particularly the U.S is still very far ahead. And our technology is also very far ahead. But if Chinese expansion happens to rapidly the Chinese may make a miscalculation and become more assertive and pushy which would become contrary to there long term interests which is to win over the smaller countries to her south one being New Zealand on to China’s side. So the Chinese face a contradiction there.

So the speed and growth of Chinese expansion is one of the factors that will make China more assertive than it would other wise be because the long term trend in inevitable. Share numbers means China will catch up technological and roll back to a time 200 years ago when China and India was about 60% of the worlds GDP.

The whole of India, ASEAN, OCEANIA, Japan, The U.S can’t balance China. So again it is inevitable that U.S moves to ring fence Chinese expansion will crumble. Not the least that every one has had it with the U.S routinely organising military coups, and there are huge debt servicing questions the U.S will struggle to answer. Mean while China doesn’t have the same problems. With out the U.S the balance is not maintainable and us here in New Zealand will likely see more Chinese business and political aspirations appear in New Zealand as U.S business and political aspersions wain. It shouldn’t need to be said that U.S manipulates the New Zealand Government via 5i’s alone, not to mention all the back room deals done to get us involved in there wars.

In an arms race smaller countries must lose. And this isn’t aggression this is dominance. As I said China has a far larger population and they like New Zealand because of her freedoms unavailable in China. Sun Tzu the art of war is to win it with out going to war and maybe that’s why China has been so force full yet patient with Taiwan.

I don’t want to sound apocalyptic but I don’t see Taiwan being able to resist the pull of the mainland. With or with out American help, and Taiwan is just a 12 hr flight away or 4 days by sea. There will come a time when the U.S 7th fleet can not intervene because of Chinese aircraft carriers and China has always considered Taiwan apart of China. And they want Taiwan to be reunified. The fact that Taiwan was independent from 1989 to the present doesn’t make any difference in the long history of China.

The irony is that all of this is over a few useless rocks. a joint revenue scheme encompassing any oil deposits would solve this quick if the kami mummies and war dead weren’t screaming honor!!!

You can’t be screaming about Chinese threats to our democracy and ignore the proposed influence unaccountable multinational corporates will have over our democracy because to do so would make you sound really stupid.

You won’t be screaming about Chinese threats to our democracy and will totally ignore the proposed influence unaccountable multinational corporates will have over our democracy because to do so would mean getting up from your couch and miss that new reality show.

I respect your lead on this, so firstly we need to ask you what does the Government want us to do?

Will they support our rights to “self-determination” and protection of our sovereignty and elected Governance to protect us from corporate control over us and our regional and Central Governments from any issues communities and local business all need to survive?

Most concerning is that why as our elected paid Public servants all these MP’s have not represented us in a meaningful manner so we are already feeling confident about our future because they are paid by us to carry out what is best for our long term health and wellbeing, for all time going forward as they may not be around when 20 or 30 yrs. goes under our collective belts.

1/Why doesn’t Labour coalition show us the way as other leaders abroad do?

2/Why are we left to fight as if it’s our backs that are against the walls now?

3/Are we as groups of concerned citizens able to meet in consultation with these Government leaders who are running this ‘negotiating process’?

4/We don’t want just a bullshit written submission process as we have been doing this for 17 years now with local and Central Governments and got very little support.

5/ can we see the text of changes as apparently the ISDS is the same as ever and Parker was quoted by a legal expert on noon news as saying parker miss-represented the facts or “overexaggerated” any changes he said they made.

6/We need ‘active consultation’ with government for as long as it needs to take, can we request this?

7/ during any consultation are we able to request a widening of the “terms of reference”?

8/We should consider Government puts this to a referendum as the agreement is to control us for two generations i am told is this correct?

If the Greens go along with Labour on everything they will be wiped out in 2020. Good on them for not supporting this corporate, set up for the 0.001%ers,unfair trade agreement.
The Greens will be proved right in the end ,but NZer’s are too thick to comprehend what is going on in the world.
The Greens MUST stick with their principles.

The Chinese dictatorship remains the number one threat with a bullet. You can’t not call out a monolithic dictatorship seeking lebensraum for its populace at every turn and still consider yourself even vaguely “left-wing”.

I picked up an anomolly in labour’s cheif negociator today in Parliament during Q+A which a National MP asked David Parker about his claim that he had got changes made to the ISDS wording.

The minister asked if Parker stuck by his words and then said how come when he was involved in April 2016 over the TPPA settling on wording of that ISDS it was actactly the same wording as parker had agreedto, Parker responded by claiming that “his text related to a different agreement to a new free trade agreement called the CPTPP now?????

So is parker saying that te ISDS he agreed to was different from the one in the TPPA that was signed off by nationalm April 2016????

Can anyone clarify this please as someone is playing games here.

Many reports had been formerly comming out including Jane kelsey’s reviews saying the ISDS was the exact wording in both the TPP 11 and the CPTPP, so I am lost here.

maybe Labour knows something we dont yet???

I will find the hansard report wording on this after this day and post it later tomorrow.

Companies or industries were excluded from ISDS provisions, particularly around IP and pharmaceuticals.

More broadly foreign do alanine won’t be able sue the NZ government if the NZ government changes labour laws or anything like that.

And this maybe speculation but I’m hoping ISDS will be treated as a appeals court after going through New Zealand courts. It’s still really expensive to make an ISDS claim, easily costing millions. Tens of millions possibly hundreds of millions if the complainant wants a successful verdict.

But we won’t know a whole lot until 1 year after the agreement formally know as TPP comes into effect. That bits still in. We’ll only hear what people want us to hear about it, until then. I’m still pretty agnostic about it all.

The fact that on this issue the two major parties are united on their support for this deal means we have missed out on our Corbyn- Sanders revolution.
The more things change the more they stay the same in our neo liberal world.

Ha! I always you you would over-reach yourself and miss something. For once I’ve seen something you didn’t and we should both be glad.

The genius of Jacinda has shone again – keeping NZF in the tent while pretending to put the Greens at arm’s length enables her to have the attack-dog-muscle of Winston in govo, but the chiding influence of GP to balance the support base.

So GP can highlight the ills of TPP amplifying J’s true position while NZLP keeps the biz sector placated and NZF doesn’t look shrill. We get the benefit of the principles stance and the leaderly pragmatism.

Many decades of crying out for over seas capital to be brought into NZ plus two main parties facilitating corporatisation of govt depts and assets now being sold off to more transnational play money, can only result in the inevitable. NZ has been sold off. This has been deliberate and smack of corruption at many levels out of he public eye.

The Govt power to supply money has been capped vigorously and given private banks do it for fantastic private profit, and expatriate the dividends at the expense of Kiwis who are shackled to transnational masters.

Tis did not have to happen and reversing it will take public education and courage with action from a Govt that works for NZ.