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Re: Zero Dark Thirty

Originally Posted by Blondie

So is the female cia agent who wouldn't let obl go .... is she real? Is there any truth behind that??

I googled and find some stuff but nothing concrete ..

If you read the book, "No Easy Day," written by a Seal who was in on it, her participation is validated.
But, her participation is that she was convinced the guy they called "The Pacer," was Bin laden. Others doubted, but she was resolute.

Don't make this a sexist thing though, because of more recent note, a woman CIA agent was pretty much responsible for the worst killing of CIA operatives in history, because of a screw up in judgement.

Re: Zero Dark Thirty

Hey Shiva, I'm gonna have to let Mike Nelson and his robot friends give you some advice, "just repeat to yourself that its just a show and I should really just relax." Seriously, its a ****ing film. To be sure, its probably a propaganda flick and as such I really don't care what it says. If its entertaining I'll watch it. Case in point, one of my favorite films about WWII is Fall of Berlin. No kidding, watch Fall of Berlin, its the most amazing thing I have ever seen, its so bad, so cheezy, so factually incorrect, so well damn its so counterfactual that its not right, hell its not even wrong. However, its a hilarious (unintentionally I am sure, if for no other reason than that if its intended audience didn't like it all involved in its production would have been unceremoniously shot) way to spend two and a half hours. Other WWII propaganda films I love are The Thirty Seconds over Tokyo Trilogy (be sure to watch all three, Destination Tokyo, Thirty Seconds Over Tokyo, and The Purple Heart). Are they necessarily accurate films? Nope, but they provide a good mindset into America's viewpoint of WWII and the fight against the Japs. Also, watch Flying Tigers and any number of John Wayne films. What was my point again?

Oh right, just relax when you watch this film. Also, and I know its hard for you to not be self posessed shiva, but really realize that nobody is going to be leaving the theater giving a flying **** what you would think of the film in question. If its an entertaining piece with an interesting story line -- and it looks like it will be -- then people will watch it. Also, the torture bit is known to be counterfactual and you are not a genius or an original thinker for pointing this out as even former GOP presidential frontrunner John McCain stated that the information obtained from torture did not lead to the killing of Bin Laden.

Re: Zero Dark Thirty

But it would be nice if people were smart enough to understand what it's doing.

And this whole whole intellectual tough guy routine about the efficacy of propaganda makes you, and anyone else that feels that way, extra vulnerable to it's message.

Wait, recognizing that its a propaganda piece and therefore realizing what it is wanting to do makes me vulnerable to its message? Nope, see that means I can enjoy it for what it is and understanding its message without buying into it.

Re: Zero Dark Thirty

Originally Posted by Suetonius

Wait, recognizing that its a propaganda piece and therefore realizing what it is wanting to do makes me vulnerable to its message? Nope, see that means I can enjoy it for what it is and understanding its message without buying into it.

If you can recognize it's propaganda, then it's not very good if it's intent is to influence. True propaganda is very subtle and nuanced. Even smart guys like you walk away thinking it was a good film and don't realize you took something away other than entertainment.

But we don't really care about that, we want to hear more "Youngblood" stories.

Re: Zero Dark Thirty

Zero Dark Thirty, Kathryn Bigelow’s new film chronicling the CIA’s hunt for Osama bin Laden, which opened in select theaters December 19, has largely received rave reviews and garnered a host of awards and nominations as the year’s best movie. It is a shameful work, and this reception says far more about the state of the media and the popular culture industry in the US than it does about the film itself.

With an emotionally exploitative opening of a dark screen and a sound track of fire fighters’ radio calls and frantic cries for help from the upper floors of the Twin Towers on 9/11, the film cuts to a CIA “black site,” where a detainee, his arms hung by ropes from the ceiling and his face cut and battered, confronts an American interrogator who promises “I will hurt you” if he fails to provide the information demanded.

The juxtaposition of the 9/11 soundtrack and the harrowing scenes of torture are presented as cause and effect, with one justifying the other.

Assisting the interrogator (Jason Clarke) are other individuals, their faces concealed by ski masks. With a break in the torture session, one of these assistants takes off her mask revealing Maya (Jessica Chastain), a rookie agent deployed “in the field” for the first time. Asked by the chief interrogator if she’d rather watch the brutality on a monitor outside the torture chamber, Maya instead insists that they go back in and resume their grisly work.

This introduces the main thread of the drama, using the term loosely, that is to follow, with Maya conducting a single-minded pursuit of clues leading to the whereabouts of bin Laden, while bravely battling resistance from the entire male-dominated leadership of the CIA until she finally prevails.

According to this improbable version of events, the junior female analyst single-handedly brought about the May 1, 2011 raid on the compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan that ended in the assassination of bin Laden and the shooting of several other defenseless men, women and children.

Bigelow provides a thin feminist overlay–some reviewers have gone so far as to draw a parallel between the protagonist and Bigelow herself, the first woman to win an Oscar for best director-—for a semi-fascistic cinematic embrace of the US military-intelligence apparatus and its crimes.