Asexual Men and Rape

A post discussing masculinity, asexuality and rape has been passed around Tumblr for a while, and I decided I ought to point everyone to it, because it provides a very interesting critique of virgin-shaming, rape apologism and fucked-up views of masculinity.

The author starts out discussing a personal experience of a friend and former partner of hers– an asexual man who was coerced into sex by a woman. The post was apparently prompted by a truly incredible piece of rape apologist insensitivity:

I remember once, I mentioned this whole story—my relationship with the man and this sexual scenario he found himself in—to another male. The boy I told this to is heterosexual and when I described it to him, he basically said to me: “Are you SURE your friend didn’t want it? Are you SURE he’s asexual?”

There are certain problematic aspects of this post: for instance, she suggests that female rape survivors are more likely to be believed than male rape survivors which is, tragically, all too often not the case. Nevertheless, she calls attention to a very important point: society’s fucked-up notions of sexuality really fuck over asexual men.

Part of being “a real man” is having sex with a lot of women (before eventually being ensnared by the old ball-and-chain, of course). Celibates are not “real men.” Virgins are not “real men.” The abstinent are not “real men.” Those with low sex drives are not “real men.” And, crucially, asexual men are not “real men.”

So of course asexual men endure the standard array of pathologization, criticism, mockery and disbelief when they come out as asexual: “there must be something wrong with you,” “you’re just repressed,” “you’re just a late bloomer,” “you’re a misanthrope,” “you can’t get laid,” “you’re gay, aren’t you?”

However, with a very few exceptions, asexual women and nonbinaries do not find their gender identity being questioned because of their sexual orientation. After all, in our culture, women are supposed to be less interested in sex; a woman who isn’t interested in sex at all isn’t that abnormal. A man who isn’t– God. There must be something wrong with him! He must be broken somehow! Unfortunately, as the author points out, sometimes this even leads to corrective rape of asexual men.

The same idea that men are always and everywhere hypersexual that causes so much grief to asexuals is also one of the major reasons that men have their rapes disbelieved. You can’t rape a man, after all. Men always like sex! (Unless it’s with another man, of course, but even then you get the homophobia and “he must have secretly liked it” bit.) A man will go down the street and want to fuck everything that moves! All men are secretly Jack Harkness in disguise! If you aren’t willing to fuck any lady with a pulse, it’s clearly a sign that you are not a real man.

In particular, a lot of people have this bizarre idea that trying to rape a man is like trying to stick a marshmallow into a parking meter. But I think we’ve all experienced our genitals not being under our conscious control– just ask any teenager who got an erection during chemistry, or anyone who went soft during sexual intercourse they really wanted. Women experience vaginal lubrication and, often, orgasm during their rapes; men experience erection and, often, orgasm during theirs.

The public’s anatomical idiocies aside, I think it’s pretty clear that anti-asexual-men bias and apologism for the rape of men have the same origin: the idea that men always want it. I think we all know that men as a class don’t always want it. Some men always want it; so do some women. Some men never want it; so do some women. Most people are somewhere in between. And everyone’s sexual desires depend on the person and the circumstance: even the horniest man is not going to want to fuck someone he finds physically unattractive, without protection, after he’s been awake for 72 hours and when his dick has several major injuries.

How, therefore, do we battle this idea of the hypersexuality of men? The article presents a few ideas:

We need positive portrayals of asexual men and virgin men and celibate men in mainstream media.

We need to accept that masculinity is completely and totally separate from a male’s sexuality.

We need to acknowledge that all males, sexual or asexual, have the right and the capability to say “No” to sex at any time.

We need to show men respect regardless of their sexuality and their sex lives, in real life AND in the media.

We need to acknowledge that men can be victims of sexual assault and we need to take it seriously.

We need to accept asexual men as being the equals of sexual men.

We need, as a society, to acknowledge and accept that men deserve love/respect/companionship regardless of their sexuality and their sexual activity. Asexual men deserve love just as much as sexual men do.

About ozyfrantz

Ozy Frantz is a student at a well-respected Hippie College in the United States. Zie bases most of zir life decisions on Good Omens by Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman, and identifies more closely with Pinkie Pie than is probably necessary. Ozy can be contacted at [email protected] or on Twitter as @ozyfrantz. Writing is presently Ozy's primary means of support, so to tip the blogger, click here.

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As a 34-year old male virgin asexual, I’m always taken aback at the idea of other asexuals masturbating (I never have or have felt any desire to during my lifetime) or being in a relationship (being unable to parse the sexual mind, I’ve never had a date that hasn’t abandoned me partway through the evening). I’m still a hetero-romantic and have fairly-chastely made out with four women in my life, all on New Year’s Eves while drinking (otherwise I’d be too shy to disappoint a heterosexual with my inability to even have the option of being waved on to second).… Read more »

What riles me around in this post is that a woman has to be unattractive for a man to not want to have sex with her, he also has to be wounded and tired in the process so his denial of lust is acceptable. As a post about asexual people i would actually rather see the diversity of emotions, a man is entitled not to want sex at a particular moment for the sheer audacity of not wanting sex at that moment, the need for excuses is what in my opinion perpetuates the problem described so well in this post.… Read more »

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7 years ago

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dontaskfor

We need positive portrayals of asexual men and virgin men and celibate men in mainstream media. As far as I can remember, Robert Walser, a swiss writer from the first half of the twentieth century, always tell the story of “asexual” male characters in his novels. Close friendship with woman but no love affairs, as in his biography. However, he wasn’t gay because I remember in “The Tanners”, there is a scene where the main character, being sit on a park bench, is cruised by another man, and the main character leaves the bench, amazed. I remember 10 years ago… Read more »

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7 years ago

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AB

@ozymandias:

AB, Schala, I am somewhat puzzled about what any of this has to do with asexuality, men being treated as hypersexual, or rape. Take it to the Open Thread.

Originally, it was just a single post mentioning something which I think you overlook when it comes to female asexuality. Why Schala felt the need to make insulting insinuations about my mother and give the 10,100th account of her own life is beyond me, but I didn’t have anything to say beyond that one post.

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7 years ago

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Darque

Can we all seriously use the excuse “trigger” for any kind of antisocial and derailing behavior on this forum?

Because I’m absolutely fucking offended that AB has derailed this thread to talk about the spectre of “men who feel entitled to sex” – in other words, hypersexual men, on a post that is about asexual men and rape. In other words, perpetuating the same stereotypes of men as violent and sexually aggressive in a place that is trying to combat that perception.

Yeah, fuck this. I’m out. For good this time.

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7 years ago

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Schala

It only tangentially has to do with asexuality because it hit a chord with AB from her personal life about being expected to be sexual, and she ranted about it the way Eagle3x would about being bullied by girls. It’s a trigger it seems. I did think I was asexual pre-transition, given I didn’t see myself having sex with anyone in the way I was expected to (ie penetrate someone), and didn’t care much about having it at all. I might be asexual for all I know and my desire for closeness and cuddling makes me accept sex as an… Read more »

AB, Schala, I am somewhat puzzled about what any of this has to do with asexuality, men being treated as hypersexual, or rape. Take it to the Open Thread.

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7 years ago

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Schala

Note that you can still care about your appearance. I don’t want the “tries so hard” thing though. Ideally your make-up takes 5-10 minutes if you wear any, you don’t routinely flat-iron or curl your hair, you don’t have mani-pedis more than once a year, you don’t have false nails, false eyelashes, eyelashes curlers, you don’t do weightlifting and your care about fashion is laughing about how silly those people trying to outdo each other while spending thousands on clothes are. I’m not looking for the homeless bum look, but I don’t want so-called perfection, because it’s everything-but perfection, it’s… Read more »

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7 years ago

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Schala

And before you think my physical criteria is settling for second best. Ideally the person who is on top of my list physical wise is not the Hollywood model, except Johnny Depp – I sorta like roles where he looks a bit feminine (like Jack Sparrow), but am under no illusion that anything would happen with him ever. I just appreciate his work and style. My ideal first best is not 6 feet 6 for a man or 4 feet 8 for a woman, doesn’t have DD breast or 6-pack abs and doesn’t wear designer-anything except maybe lolita fashion stuff… Read more »

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7 years ago

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Schala

I do find only a few people attractive. They have to be rather enlightened, don’t mind my being trans, be okay that I rant a lot, play videogames to rather high levels, be okay that I don’t like socializing much (1-2x a year with family or friends is nice, more is bothersome – inviting my brother over is not bothersome but it’s just one person) and understand that I don’t “get” and sometimes don’t care, about social conventions. I’ll try not to be an asshole as much as possible (I say please and thank you as an automatism), but tradition… Read more »

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7 years ago

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AB

The difference is that even people who don’t want a whole lot of different partners can still deem others attractive in a “If I was free on the market right now, I could see myself possibly hooking up with someone like that if they had the right personality”. Only wanting a few sexual partners in your life is not the same as finding only a few people attractive.

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7 years ago

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Schala

What is the difference with “finding 40 men a day you could see yourself having sex with” and, well, doing it at some point (not necessarily in a day)? Because my problem is less of one where I don,t see myself having sex with the person, but I don’t see myself with them period. Sex is out of the question if I’m not ‘with them’. And given I’m trans and generally not too easy to be around 24/7, I don’t expect to have lines of followers worshipping the ground I step on and being willing to be with me, either.… Read more »

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7 years ago

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AB

@Schala I don’t have your mysterious empathic sexuality, I can’t make myself want something just because someone else wants me to want it. In fact, I often react the opposite way, shutting down when a man becomes too aroused. My boyfriend sometimes jokes that when I’m having trouble falling asleep, he ought to pester me about sex, because it tends to make me immediately exhausted and devoid of energy. You’re privileged to have a sexuality which you can use to match that of your boyfriend, and right now you’re using that privilege to invalidate someone else’s experiences. You’re not a… Read more »

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7 years ago

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Schala

@AB I’ve had ‘something sexual’ with all of two men in my life. I wouldn’t even think of being sexually available for 40 men or having sex with 40 men over my entire life. I’m sexually willing to do stuff others might not be willing to, but having anonymous sex with people I’ve not even met is not part of that, having a different partner every night, or every week or even every month is not part of that. My libido is pretty much almost entirely reactive or empathic. If he (my boyfriend) wants it, it can make me want… Read more »

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7 years ago

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AB

I’ve got to echo Kita and Remi, I don’t feel like female asexuality is treated any better. But I think a big part of it is that women are already expected to be somewhat asexual to begin with, but still have sex with men anyway. At least for me, the biggest difficulty with having a low libido is that sex is way too often seen as something women do to reward men, something they owe men after the men have done a certain things for them, such as pretending to care for them in a non-sexual fashion (actually, the biggest… Read more »

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7 years ago

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The Kings Raven

For a positive media example of a male virgin (non-asexual) look no further than Marcus Cole from Babylon 5. He was portrayed as completely at peace with being a virgin as well as all round awesome, cultured and a decent person.

I remember having a conversation with a male friend of mine about being in a relationship with a slight libido mismatch (I had the higher libido). He found it literally incomprehensible that a man would ever not want sex, and was completely baffled when I told him that this guy a) was not cheating on me and b) was not gay. I was able to convince him that cheating wouldn’t have been possible, but that just lead him repeating “And you’re sure he’s not gay?” over and over again with a “does not compute” look on his face. Keep in… Read more »

I’ve actually been thinking about this lately because I have two Buddhist monks as classmates this semester. One of them is allowed to get married someday, and the other is not. I think, in addition to the myth that there aren’t any men who just don’t want it, media representations of men who “aren’t interested” or “aren’t allowed” (because of vows or whatever) come in only a few very stigmatized flavors – the creepy religious figure who preys on his flock, the creepy religious figure who converts all that passion into warped and fanatical belief, or the one who simply… Read more »

Tamen: My statement is that both male and female rape survivors are disbelieved (although for different reasons) and that it is both stupid and offensive to compare which kind of disbelief is worse. Kita and Remi: I have absolutely no intentions of delegitimizing the very real pain and oppression that asexual nonbinaries and women experience; I don’t want to sexualsplain your experiences. 🙂 In my experience, asexual men tend to experience oppression because of the intersection of their asexuality and their gender, because society expects men to be hypersexual. However, asexual nonbinaries and women still experience oppression, people trying to… Read more »

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7 years ago

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Remi

Like Kita said, Asexuals, regardless of their gender, face the same set of hang-ups and abuses. Both men and women are delegitimized and stigmatized for being asexual. As a Demisexual Genderqueer, I believed myself an asexual for a long time, and having a vagina didn’t keep people from trying to convince me I was broken, or pawing me in an attempt to “fix” me. And as a Demi, people don’t understand that I’m sexually attracted to one person and one person only and it wasn’t a choice. Saying “Women and Nonbinaries have it easier” isn’t true and delegitimizes the women… Read more »

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7 years ago

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Tamen

There are certain problematic aspects of this post: for instance, she suggests that female rape survivors are more likely to be believed than male rape survivors which is, tragically, all too often not the case. Ozy, I am having problems parsing this sentence. Were you just trying to say that female rape victims are all too often not believed as well? Or were you pointing out that the comparison (…more likely to…) itself is problematic (regardless of direction)? Or were you setting up you own comparison – “female rape survivors are less likely to be believed”? I would certainly be… Read more »

@slightlymetaphysical: I’ve been thinking for a while about a post about the variance between high-libido and low-libido people, and how that often becomes a massive worldview/communication gap. Does the term low-libido echo your experience a little better than asexual, would you say?

Noah- yeah, ‘low-libido’ is much better shorthand for ‘not wanting sex in the forseeable future’ than ‘asexual’. It’s still not a perfect match, because there are other reasons not to want sex, and libido is a bit ambiguous (eg, someone who masturbates a lot more than average but rarely wants to have sex with another person- low or high libido?), but I tend to find it works pretty well as long as everyone explains their terms. (it is entirely possible I’m *far* too fussy about this sort of terminology) Would love to read about the communication issues between low and… Read more »

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7 years ago

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Míng Yí

As an aging male virgin, this strikes a chord with me, but only somewhat. I’m not particularly ashamed of my virginity, but I don’t particularly publicise it; and I do skirt around it, carefully choose my words to lie by omission, in certain social groups, e.g. the people I work with are far to heteronormative. But where people do know of it, I have different experiences, often from the same people. Some flatmates I had in my mid-twenties, and a few friends who were round a lot, found out, and had two memorable reactions. One, they warned me not to… Read more »

[…] which I rediscovered today from a link in Figleaf’s asexuality tag. The second catalyst was this post by the ever-amazing Ozy of No,SeriouslyWhatAboutTehMenz?, which is an example of a post where […]

As a member of the asexual community (even if kinda on the outskirts), I’d like to thank you for this post. I thought it was a good example of where asexual issues and gender egalitarian stuff combine. It disappoints me, however, that ‘asexual’ has to be this discrete group of people in these conversations. It feels like the label of asexuality legitimises a lack of attraction or desire, turning it into a positive thing, but the more it does that, the more lack of attraction or desire, whether all the time or in specific circumstances, stops being legitimate for people… Read more »