posted at 4:56 pm on August 16, 2012 by Allahpundit

Joel Gehrke of the Examiner calls it a “startling” bit of news. I agree; the same passage jumped out at me when we headlines the WDBJ story this morning. But does it really say what we all think it says? Quote:

Why in the world would a new business owner say “no” to a photo op with the Vice President of the United States?

McMurray said it was President Obama’s recent remarks about small business and who built what.

“Very simply, ‘you didn’t build that’” McMurray said. “Speaking of small businesses and entrepreneurs all across this country and actually last night my wife was up all night. No sleep, she’s worked a full 24 hours.”

Then, several paragraphs later:

Here’s the back story, we’re told that shortly after Crumb and Get It told Biden’s advance people ‘no’ — the secret service walked in and told Chris McMurray ”Thanks for standing up and saying ‘no’ — then they bought a whole bunch of cookies and cupcakes.

The “standing up” bit sure does make it sound like they were thanking McMurray because they agreed with his objection to Obama’s “you didn’t build that” rhetoric. But I’m not sure: Click the image below and watch the clip at the link. Reporter Orlando Salinas doesn’t say anything about “standing up” in the video, only that the agents thanked McMurray for saying no and bought some stuff, which leaves their motive more ambiguous. Could be that they were just hoping to avoid the logistical hassle of having to secure the bakery and surrounding area before Biden arrived and thought that Biden’s advance team might skip the stop altogether once the first business owner turned him down. (Didn’t work out that way.) Would a small group of Secret Service agents really risk the White House’s wrath by saying something politically unhelpful like this? This isn’t a case of one random agent out of the hundreds employed by the Service phoning a reporter to badmouth O anonymously. This is Biden’s own security team; the White House knows who they are, and they’re surely in no mood for new political headaches from the Service after the “unpleasantness” in Colombia. Seems hard to believe the agents would tempt fate by gladhanding an Obama critic in that environment. High risk, little reward. But I don’t know, anything’s possible.

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That is quite simply bullshite. If the american people knew what sort of gross disdain with which the Clintons treated their military and security assistants, they likely wouldn’t have won a second term.
It is not the reporting of their deeds, but their misdeeds.

You host, you’re substituting your authority for Ed’s and AP’s in making admin decisions, and admin decisions will be made on membership issues.

BS. I was NOT the first person to suggest using my website as a meeting place for the DROVES of HA regulars, who have gone on the record stating they WILL LEAVE if FB registration becomes mandatory.

Your interest beyond money, I don’t know enough about you.

My interest is this:

If the Council issues a diktat that all villagers must join the Labour Party in order to meet at the townhall, which has historically been used by conservatives and libertarians, then I will open my home to anyone, who would like a place to meet and discuss the pertinent issues of the day.

The HA administration is free to make whatever decisions that it wants and HotAirians have made it clear over the past week that they, too, will exercise their right to make their own decisions as to whether they will consider lining the pockets of liberal millionaires and billionaires in order to comment on a conservative website.

You want to be Prince Charming on the white horse, well, there’s more to it than that.

Actually, I don’t. I do not, have not, nor ever will have a desire to grow a pen1s and ride in to save anyone on a white stallion. Pen1s envy is soooooooooooooooooooo 19th century.

It took hard work to form the HotGas community. My attitude is, you don’t like how it’s being run, then start your own like they did, from scratch, or join one that’s more to your liking. There’s a creeping feeling of dread among the admins when a membership talks about moving to another platform. Why do that to Ed and AP? Have they treated you unfairly?

Paul-Cincy on August 16, 2012 at 6:29 PM

Are you kidding me? Do you seriously think that I am trying to hurt Hot Air, Ed and/or Allahpundit? Really? I have no ill-will or animus to them at all.

I LOVE HOT AIR, ED & ALLAHPUNDIT AND LOATHE FACEBOOK….AS DO ABOUT 95% PERCENT OF THE HOTGASIANS THAT HAVE COMMENTED ON THIS ISSUE. WE ARE **BEGGING** THEM NOT TO DO THIS!!!

PS: You obviously did not read my response to you yesterday. I will find it for you.

We do need to keep in touch. I’ve been going to start a blog, but still haven’t had time. Perhaps we can hook up over at “Resist We Must’s” blog? I’m checking out for the night but will check this thread in the morning.

We do need to keep in touch. I’ve been going to start a blog, but still haven’t had time. Perhaps we can hook up over at “Resist We Must’s” blog? I’m checking out for the night but will check this thread in the morning.

JPeterman on August 15, 2012 at 1:53 AM

Terrific idea. Will do, and I will likewise check here in the morning.

You can all use my blog, if you want. I was thinking about starting a companion community site where people can register to post articles.

I don’t care about language although I think that we could all agree that some decorum (overt racism, anti-Semitism, etc.) would warrant warnings or bannings. On the community page, we could make decisions as a community.

As you all know, I don’t have any advertising on my blog and make no money off of it so you there would be no aggravating pop-up ads, etc.

I love HA, but I hate FB and will never join it. If HA goes the way of FB, I — like many of you — will be out of here.

Anyhoo, I just wanted to raise the possible alternative. Obviously, my feelings wouldn’t be hurt if you guys said no. It’s not a vanity offer. Just an alternative offer to avoid FB tyranny.

We do need to keep in touch. I’ve been going to start a blog, but still haven’t had time. Perhaps we can hook up over at “Resist We Must’s” blog? I’m checking out for the night but will check this thread in the morning.

We do need to keep in touch. I’ve been going to start a blog, but still haven’t had time. Perhaps we can hook up over at “Resist We Must’s” blog? I’m checking out for the night but will check this thread in the morning.

JPeterman on August 15, 2012 at 1:53 AM

Terrific idea. Will do, and I will likewise check here in the morning.

You can all use my blog, if you want. I was thinking about starting a companion community site where people can register to post articles.

I don’t care about language although I think that we could all agree that some decorum (overt racism, anti-Semitism, etc.) would warrant warnings or bannings. On the community page, we could make decisions as a community.

As you all know, I don’t have any advertising on my blog and make no money off of it so you there would be no aggravating pop-up ads, etc.

I love HA, but I hate FB and will never join it. If HA goes the way of FB, I — like many of you — will be out of here.

Anyhoo, I just wanted to raise the possible alternative. Obviously, my feelings wouldn’t be hurt if you guys said no. It’s not a vanity offer. Just an alternative offer to avoid FB tyranny.

I don’t know. Haven’t we heard that the First Family doesn’t get on well with their detail? Imagine what it must be like having to hang out with Biden all day. Credit the agents for being human, possibly even Common Sense-oriented ones, and wanting to react in some way to the nonsense they hear from these people day-in day-out.

I refuse to join facebook. I belonged for a while and learned that WAY too many of my old friends around the U.S. were raving moonbats, and I quit. (Without getting into any arguments with them.)

I will always view Facebook as a terribly juvenile place and concept (not to mention a data-mining juggernaut), and the idea that we might have to join it to post here would likely mean I don’t even read here anymore, much less post.

not that i didn’t get that gore, clinton et al were scum bags but just… i’m not surprised just a tad speechless. i am saddened and angered that adults behave like this in OUR white house to people who will take a bullet for any one of them and their family members. what greater sacrifice is there? what pigs-classless white trash with cash pigs.

( oh and why should a secret service agent give up their career because a set of matching douche bags is decorating the white house furniture? it speaks to their training, ethics, and dedication that they would still save the life of someone who they perhaps harbor some personal resentment of or with whom they very much disagree politically.)

it makes sense though seeing how the left thoughtlessly and cruelly champions every low life cop killer there is for murdering the very people who will take a bullet for the average citizen.

as for the baker- saving the constitution, democracy and capitalism one cupcake at a time. mmm.mmm.mmm.

It is important that a president, even an obnoxious and incompetent president, can depend on people to keep their mouths shut;
YiZhangZhe on August 16, 2012 at 6:33 PM

I think I can buy that. OTOH, “people” might like to depend on a president, even an obnoxious and incompetent president, to keep his own mouth shut (national security secrets and suchlike).

On another subject, I’m trying to follow this dustup about mandatory FB and list migration, etc.

I can’t possibly read all the threads, even a lot of them, and rarely post because by the time I do catch up on a thread, my point of view has been expressed by other HAers and I don’t do ‘me too’ posts.

However, being a part of the HA community, which I consider myself to be, I find discussions about list migration, etc. disturbing. Not just as a disloyalty to Ed, AP and other valuable contributors, but because I’ve seen other active, vibrant lists diminished this way. Not only does the new branch not flourish, the main host seems to seriously wilt as well. Nobody wins.

I’d like to have Ed or AP explain to me in a way I can understand why this FB thing is necessary or good. It will certainly eliminate me from participation since I will never entertain the prospect of using FB, or Twitter either for that matter- call me Neanderthal, so the decision will have been made for me.

This FB thing is causing way too much heartburn for the wrong reasons.

Please remember a couple of things… HA is no longer an independent entity, it is a subsidiary of Townhall. This ‘brilliant’ idea may not be of the HA admins doing, so they have to accept it and shut up. Townhall is signing their paychecks.

And, since no policy statement has been issued, I’ll take their explanation at face value… it’s an experiment. And, the admins watch the comments… I suspect they’re well aware that this ‘experiment’ is not being received well by the regulars.

And they are response for the unease since they haven’t clarified, or detailed any future plans for the potential integration of FB with the HA site.

I’m inclined to let things stand until I hear more about the issue.

Just let it ride for the moment, cool your jets, stop growling at each other, and stop fretting over unknowns. There’s way too much real shite out there to actually worry about, rather than snap at boogeymen.

Stick to the issues at hand, and only worry about those things you can effect.

That is all.

P.S. — I do have a FB account, but for professional reasons. And yes, I would categorically refuse to use it to comment here.

I’d like to have Ed or AP explain to me in a way I can understand why this FB thing is necessary or good. It will certainly eliminate me from participation since I will never entertain the prospect of using FB, or Twitter either for that matter- call me Neanderthal, so the decision will have been made for me.

Until the situation clears up, I’ll just continue to read along.

timmytee on August 16, 2012 at 7:46 PM

Same here. I must have missed this announcement, but it is very disappointing. I love HA, but if I have to be on FB to post (or read?) I will probably stop reading, no less posting. I know I’m only one person, but it seems to me that alot of the HA family would be lost.

Such a shame. Hope it doesn’t happen. What is the point of all this? What is the reason?

I have already bookmarked “resist me much’s” site, just in case one day I get shut out of here. lol

Hope not.

Been busy this summer, both my kids are getting married next year. So I have to go back and read what I missed about this.

They just can’t stay on topic and discuss the real news. Crumb and Get It said no on principles and business is booming. Is anybody outside of Radford talking about Biden and that other place, what’s it called, River City Grill?

Stick to the issues at hand, and only worry about those things you can effect.

That is all.
CPT. Charles on August 16, 2012 at 8:20 PM

No, that is not all as far as I’m concerned and I believe many HAers would agree. Our feelings are a measure of our devotion to this forum and if, as you say and I think you are right, that admins are monitoring the messages, then they need messages that express our hope and fears for HA.

If this situation is Townhall driven, then they need to hear and heed as well. You’ve already said that our comments do impact the decision-makers.

I may have missed some messages but I can’t recall any of us growling at each other. Fretting, yes, and for that reason many of us have already stated our agreement with your view of ‘wait and see’, but no one member has the right to call for shutting down a discussion.

A Special Ops friend of mine who is now buried at Arlington told me all of the time how much he and his guys hated the clintons. HE was alive long enough to get a taste of obama and could tell that he was a jackwagon when it came to the military. Truly the clintons were real jerks with the troops, especially those close by.

that’s true…it doesn’t mean though that years after their service they can’t write about the people/presidents/vps, etc, they served and shed some light unto their ‘real’ personas, or at least their personalities outside the cameras…

Maybe it’s a “courage of your convictions” kind of thing. Like thank you for standing up for what you believe in and saying no, rather than just doing a photo op with a man you disagree with. No? Too naive?

Former SS agent Dan Bongino, who served on both President Bush’s and Obama’s security detail, told me that President Obama treated him well. Dan is a fair, but blunt speaking person running against Senator Cardin, so I take him at his word. He joked that President Obama supports Cardin, not him. He did not comment on the former SS agents’ positions on former presidents as was put forth in a book. Dan doesn’t traffic in gossip.

Good on the baker. Hope he thrives as a result of sticking a finger in the eye of totalitarians (as that rarely happens andwould be inspiring).

On the FB thing, calm down. As soon as I heard about the possibility, I created a whole new gmail account, which I will use to create a whole new FB account (all free mind you) so I can keep coming here and commenting. I won’t even have to use my real name or any other personally identifiable information, if that’s really your conern.