Well I wasn't spamming haunt in the openier just using mging, so that doesn't change my burst ;-;.
I kind didn't think spamming seed or haunt was a good idea , so i did the normal openier , and its dps is insane

Well I wasn't spamming haunt in the openier just using mging, so that doesn't change my burst ;-;.
I kind didn't think spamming seed or haunt was a good idea , so i did the normal openier , and its dps is insane

Im just personally tired of being forced to use a pet. I understand this is a "pet class" but I love the playstyle of sac. Even if its slightly behind thats fine, but now its essentially useless versus the other talents ( and was barely ahead when it got this nerf ), so meh, kinda sad.

Im just personally tired of being forced to use a pet. I understand this is a "pet class" but I love the playstyle of sac. Even if its slightly behind thats fine, but now its essentially useless versus the other talents ( and was barely ahead when it got this nerf ), so meh, kinda sad.

Still think I'll be taking Sac in most pvp situations unless they buff demon survivability some- way too squishy atm. And honestly with the amount of CC that healers have these days, it's not like the pet is easy to keep connected for CS anyway.

As an aside about lock pet design direction - I'll add that I leveled my lock in vanilla without a pet (DemoSac:VW was the way to go back in the day - 3%hp/4sec was OP!). Before avoidance, we couldn't really have a pet out anyway a lot of the time. Even in TBC, I raided as Sac, or if I did raid as, say Aff, I would just keep the pet on passive to keep it alive as a Dark Pact/Fel Int buff bot. This bullshit of locks being a pet class really didn't even come into play in WoW until LK. There's certainly no class design history that mandates that we can;t have Sac as a valid gameplay option.

This bullshit of locks being a pet class really didn't even come into play in WoW until LK

SL/SL was a big thing in tbc. And you really should not look at vanilla as something to dictate class design, that way paladins would still be buff bots.

That said, I hate GoSac- it is the frost dk of talents; easy to use and gives dmg. If there was an design intent to swap pets, sac them for certain utillity in different situations and resummon, that would be great. You know, to actually put some depth into the rotation. GoSac feels like the most noob friendly talent, really a shame what could have been an interesting mechanic, especially since destro got lesser buttons than an arcane mage.

PvE is a minigame // Rerolled from affly to spriest after 8 years, thx pandaland changes

SL/SL was a big thing in tbc. And you really should not look at vanilla as something to dictate class design, that way paladins would still be buff bots.

That said, I hate GoSac- it is the frost dk of talents; easy to use and gives dmg. If there was an design intent to swap pets, sac them for certain utillity in different situations and resummon, that would be great. You know, to actually put some depth into the rotation. GoSac feels like the most noob friendly talent, really a shame what could have been an interesting mechanic, especially since destro got lesser buttons than an arcane mage.

I will never understand why people want to over complicate things. More buttons does not always translate to more depth. Example: ISF. Sure it was an extra button to push every 20 seconds, but what did it really add to the spec? The answer is nothing. It was just a mandatory buff that you needed to keep up, just because. It wasn't fun to push, nor was it hard. It was unnecessary clutter.

I can see how some people would view pets in the same way. Two of our specs don't have any real synergy with them, and using them slightly decreases the effectiveness of Mastery as a secondary stat. And really, are they anything to manage. Sure you might have to occasionally move them around or manually change their targets, but for the most part they act as little more than a DoT that never has to be refreshed or monitored. Now, I know that for Demo a case can be made that the pets need to be managed properly for AoE, but for Aff and Destro, pets add little to no depth to the playstyle.

I will never understand why people want to over complicate things. More buttons does not always translate to more depth.

Same here, I dont understand how people enjoy the numbness of destro rotation; it requires 0 effort in contrast to other specs and yet people strive to simplify it even more. And yet RoF is being slightly pushed from the rotation. Guess green fire does the trick, people really fall for the flashy flame animations.

Two of our specs don't have any real synergy with them

Too bad, there was a time when we actually had a sinergy, give example felhunter
>gives intellect buff
>finds stealthers (long time ago)
>devours buffs
>Soul Link

then the players:
>dots to increase shadow bite dmg
>heals pet
>takes his mana
>uses DS while the pet is up

I loved my felpup more then my real dog, it actually made exploiting my weak spot a serious dmg to my dps or pvp effectivness.

PvE is a minigame // Rerolled from affly to spriest after 8 years, thx pandaland changes

Same here, I dont understand how people enjoy the numbness of destro rotation; it requires 0 effort in contrast to other specs and yet people strive to simplify it even more. And yet RoF is being slightly pushed from the rotation. Guess green fire does the trick, people really fall for the flashy flame animations.

Way to much ignorance in that statement, I play destruction because its what appeals to me, (direct damage caster, anything that isint a mage) do i wish the rotation was slightly more involving . . i guess but then again you dont really get points for mastering any rotation in wow right now.

SL/SL was a big thing in tbc. And you really should not look at vanilla as something to dictate class design, that way paladins would still be buff bots.

That said, I hate GoSac- it is the frost dk of talents; easy to use and gives dmg. If there was an design intent to swap pets, sac them for certain utillity in different situations and resummon, that would be great. You know, to actually put some depth into the rotation. GoSac feels like the most noob friendly talent, really a shame what could have been an interesting mechanic, especially since destro got lesser buttons than an arcane mage.

I fail to see how its more "noob friendly" as press the 2 minute CD and forget it, or put my pet on the boss, and once again forget it. Cause thats all pets really are at this point anyways.

Looking at Tier 16's stats right now, there is absolutely no Hit Rating on any piece at all (Welcome back to Tier 2). Additionally, there are no Blue sockets on it either. This means we'll have to obtain all our Hit from our other equipment. idk if I like this.

I fail to see how its more "noob friendly" as press the 2 minute CD and forget it, or put my pet on the boss, and once again forget it. Cause thats all pets really are at this point anyways.

Thats the fault on the PvE system, now- if there was some buffs that Observer could steal for a dps boost it would put up a bit more challenging scenario,right? Or some scenario that would need a lot of dispeling which would provide the imp useful and a certain need to control it?

I just wanna open some possibilities for "think outside the box" scenarios, but its up to blizzard to actually make boss encounters less rotation-based and more involvement -based.

Looking at Tier 16's stats right now, there is absolutely no Hit Rating on any piece at all (Welcome back to Tier 2). Additionally, there are no Blue sockets on it either. This means we'll have to obtain all our Hit from our other equipment. idk if I like this.

Might that be an indented nerf due to locks great gear scaling?

PvE is a minigame // Rerolled from affly to spriest after 8 years, thx pandaland changes

Thats the fault on the PvE system, now- if there was some buffs that Observer could steal for a dps boost it would put up a bit more challenging scenario,right? Or some scenario that would need a lot of dispeling which would provide the imp useful and a certain need to control it?

I just wanna open some possibilities for "think outside the box" scenarios, but its up to blizzard to actually make boss encounters less rotation-based and more involvement -based.

Might that be an indented nerf due to locks great gear scaling?

Except you could say they can do the same things with the pet sac abilities... hell last tier if they had the knock box for saccing succy, i would of used that on tsulong progression to knockback the sparks headed to the light beam on heroic difficulty and played another spec than demonology ( imo affliction was much more potent on that fight dps wise, however we needed the knockbacks ). You can add "difficulty" ( i dont really see how difficult it is to press an extra button, especially when all it really is is button bloat ) to either spec by doing what you suggested.

Looking at Tier 16's stats right now, there is absolutely no Hit Rating on any piece at all (Welcome back to Tier 2). Additionally, there are no Blue sockets on it either. This means we'll have to obtain all our Hit from our other equipment. idk if I like this.

One staff with hit rating is more than a third of the total hit rating you need. We'll manage.

Looking at Tier 16's stats right now, there is absolutely no Hit Rating on any piece at all (Welcome back to Tier 2). Additionally, there are no Blue sockets on it either. This means we'll have to obtain all our Hit from our other equipment. idk if I like this.

It's better in every way to not have hit and/or blue sockets. The other sockets are simply worth more, you can easily reforge into 5100 hit from the least favorable stats all over your gear.

The thing that would be bad if there is loads of crit... Which admittedly is more likely if for some reason hit is not on any items. But the lack of hit is a good thing, having crit is the bad thing.

I didn't read thru the other 113 pages so I don't know if this was discussed or not.

Are you guys thinking that UVLS Demo will still be viable for Tier 16? Combine it with the 84% trinket and a complete haste build (or possibly viable with the 8.1k haste build), that would be a ridiculous imp spawner. Question is, would it be enough to surpass the other 2 specs (or itself) with more current trinkets?

I didn't read thru the other 113 pages so I don't know if this was discussed or not.

Are you guys thinking that UVLS Demo will still be viable for Tier 16? Combine it with the 84% trinket and a complete haste build (or possibly viable with the 8.1k haste build), that would be a ridiculous imp spawner. Question is, would it be enough to surpass the other 2 specs (or itself) with more current trinkets?

The 84% amp trinket is no more.. its a static 14% now with an intellect proc.

Warlocks get buffed ONE TIME and suddenly developers are getting fired over it...