You're not going to be able to get it until you've been there, and nobody's going to be able to adequately explain to you how Black Rock City used to be when the first three streets were populated by groups of people who shared their weekends all year long, or year around, to participate in BRC. When the trapeze troupes, fire spinners or other groups performed rehearsed material all day and night.

Soul in the Machine is one of the most incredibly fascinating musical performances I've seen, and The Mutaytor shows were awesome, but, such things might be impossible for YOU to experience this year. To put this in the context of a concert: You don't tell the artists "Sorry, you can't come in the building. The show sold out."

Camp operators are among those legally responsible if some douchebag fucktard "participant" helps himself to the liquor and happens to be underage, or undercover. You can't just build a camp off of Craigslist or the ePlaya, because, how do you know you're not going to wake up in the morning and discover that one of your new friends hasn't left the playa with your camp generator and bikes. How do you know the stranger you're camping with isn't a predator or a violent drunk? If you say "Hey, this is my camp, everybody's welcome to help me," are you prepared to be sued if somebody cracks their foot or impales themselves on one of your new friends' rebar stakes, or somebody gets killed on your mutant vehicle?

On the playa, I split most of my days between working on the vehicle, slinging root beer or absinthe, and volunteering at the airport. My wife does her own volunteer things. It's like working; we meet in the afternoon. And, the way I view it, we're not going to get to buy camp core tickets because OTHER PEOPLE WORK EVEN HARDER.

Burning Man is hard. If it wasn't, it wouldn't be any fun.

I don't think you get it, but, I don't blame you because there's nowhere else like Black Rock City. It's not like a party where everybody just shows up in cool clothes, has a good time and leaves when they feel like it. If it's reduced to that, it will cease to be Black Rock City.

Until you've experienced it, you simply cannot understand.

Excellent post but it did leave me with a hard case of the ticket guilts....I wonder if I will spend my time in BRC this year wondering if I am working hard enough for my ticket? Maybe I have some work to do......I aint no sparkle pony but I am what I call a "third tier burner" OK maybe second tier when I'm good

Really, the nature of the burn is change. I think it does us good to be reminded that the ground beneath our feet isn't actually solid. Or that there aren't any feet, I suppose. Having a list of "must have" experiences is like that pin that holds the dead butterfly to the card. IMHO.

The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

RedHeaven wrote:Excellent post but it did leave me with a hard case of the ticket guilts....I wonder if I will spend my time in BRC this year wondering if I am working hard enough for my ticket? Maybe I have some work to do......I aint no sparkle pony but I am what I call a "third tier burner" OK maybe second tier when I'm good

Trishntek wrote:The ticket allotment for these organizations is based upon their history, their GIFT to BRC, and their allegiance to the 10 principles. If they receive an offering of tickets, they must still purchase them at $420 per ticket. The tickets are not "given" as you state..

Once you expect something in return for a gift it is no longer a gift.. it's a trade.

if I were you, I'd use that word Gift a little more carefully, especially to a person who has never experienced BM.

So is a GIFT defined by the motive of the GIVER or the perception of an observer. It reminds me when I GIVE something to someone, Trish finds out about it and immediately suspicions I have ulterior motives.

Why is it so difficult to understand a gift is unconditional? A gift is an unmerited expression of generosity.

If you are motivated by glory-seeking, ticket-receiving, festival attending or laid getting, IT'S NOT A GIFT!

If you feel indebted, ingratiated, ticket guilt, no fun or no glory by receiving a gift, THAT'S YOUR PROBLEM! It in no way affects the motive of the giver of a true gift.

Now GRATEFULNESS is always appreciated! When anyone ever asks me, "What is Burning Man?" My shortest answer is simply, "It's a gathering of the most generous, grateful and unpretentious group of people you will ever experience." Nowadays, I'm not sure,,,,

Trishntek wrote:So is a GIFT defined by the motive of the GIVER or the perception of an observer. It reminds me when I GIVE something to someone, Trish finds out about it and immediately suspicions I have ulterior motives.

When people don't understand the distinction, I explain that: you give gifts, while you exchange presents.

The present exchanges are often what people hate about the holidays and with starting Christmas/birthday traditions everybody gets sick of after some time.

"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

Trishntek wrote:So is a GIFT defined by the motive of the GIVER or the perception of an observer. It reminds me when I GIVE something to someone, Trish finds out about it and immediately suspicions I have ulterior motives.

Why is it so difficult to understand a gift is unconditional? A gift is an unmerited expression of generosity.

If you are motivated by glory-seeking, ticket-receiving, festival attending or laid getting, IT'S NOT A GIFT!

If you feel indebted, ingratiated, ticket guilt, no fun or no glory by receiving a gift, THAT'S YOUR PROBLEM! It in no way affects the motive of the giver of a true gift.

Now GRATEFULNESS is always appreciated! When anyone ever asks me, "What is Burning Man?" My shortest answer is simply, "It's a gathering of the most generous, grateful and unpretentious group of people you will ever experience." Nowadays, I'm not sure,,,,

The term BMorg used to define what camps get the tickets does not have the word gift in it, and for very good reason..

just to be clear, here are the criteria they are using.

1 History – A camp, project or participatory work must be in our database from past years. (We have ways to track name changes for groups over time.) 2 Demonstrated Community Benefit – A project has been interactive in a way that has been experienced as meaningful, provides support for Black Rock City’s infrastructure, or provides services for our community. Basically, how the project helps make the community and create its magic. 3 LNT – A group has demonstrated adherence to and good practices around Leave No Trace and are committed to our community perpetuating the message of LNT. 4 10 Principles – A group or project fully embraces the 10 Principles in their entirety.

A gift is a gift, without strings attached, as defined by the giver, or recipient, it doesn't matter. A gift does not need to be material, it can be made of time, or an experience. even a thought.. We the burning man participants know about gifts, as this is one of the lessons the playa teaches so many of us, the BMorg knows this.... so to decide tickets based on gifts if kind of ass backwards gifting logic.

either way, to someone who has never been to the burn, and probably thinks gifts are something you give to others that give you gifts in return only on special occasions, like birthdays and christmas, this is not a good term to use.. The playa has taught us that a gift is in fact a gift, something you give to another without merit, or expectation of return, just like i have now given you the gift of correct knowledge..

Participation in the community is not identical to having a ticket for the main event on the playa this year. A general spirit of inclusion does not guarantee individual access to a limited resource. Being on the playa is not the only way to participate.

In a sense, you are already participating. You've made a point (however redundant) on ePlaya, so clearly the bar for participating has not been set overly high.

In reward for your participation, you will not be penalized for confusing principle and principal.

The theme camps were too big to fail and had to be bailed out at others expense.Gee sounds like we heard this before.This is a money grab for the BM.org.They were able to sell almost half of the 53,000 tickets at the highest tier.Yes 25,000 tickets were sold at 390 and 420 each.

An unintelligible passionate yearning drove them out into the desert T.E. Lawrence

socks wrote:The theme camps were too big to fail and had to be bailed out at others expense.Gee sounds like we heard this before.This is a money grab for the BM.org.They were able to sell almost half of the 53,000 tickets at the highest tier.Yes 25,000 tickets were sold at 390 and 420 each.

Just a minor technicality: those 10,000 tickets sell for $390 regardless if they sell to theme camps or if they had gone for the Open Sale. They are making zero dollars different on that, so if it's a money grab they're far stupider than you think. They've also sold more than half above tier 2 for years, so it's amazing no-one complained before now.

Also, if you're combining the $390 & $420 tickets, it's 28,000 sold, not 25,000. 3,000 at $420, 15,000 at $390 in the main drawing, 10,000 in whatever the new volunteer/theme camp/art sale is being called.

It's a camping trip in the desert, not the redemption of the fallen world - Cryptofishist

Theme camps that are fortunate enough to be placed and be allowed to purchase additional tickets for their core members ( if needed ) are being given the opportunity to come and spread as much unconditional love to all Black Rock City citizens, new and old, as their energy and bank accounts will allow. Which is what we always do...........

The CO wrote:The gift you give already belongs to the person you give it to.

Exactamundo x100 +1... I've had deep and somewhat animated conversations about that one with people - How they cannot get this is beyond me. What is given in love, is still GIVEN, not leased or loaned. I think even Ushakov's (or Websters, for that matter) Dictionary would describe as such. Beautifully put, CO - you are beacon of truth in strange culture!

And, unless you've tried to put together a theme project, you can't really have an idea of what "at others' expense means." If you're building something, it starts with the raw materials and all the spring and summer weekends you sacrifice to bring stuff to Black Rock City. Our friends don't have tickets yet but they're getting ready to drop thousands on a trailer to haul other people's art and mutant vehicle out to the playa. To hear some individual who hasn't spent money yet holler about their "expense" is a bit.... ....what is it?

Most theme camps are only 8-20 people, each volunteering hours a day to entertain people like you. There are about 700 of them at any burn, and, the fact is they're more interesting than bunch of snarky hipster individuals wandering around enjoying people's gifts and services.

If you have a problem with Burning Man, don't go. I'm only able to go every other year, and so I promise you that not only will somebody appreciate your ticket as much as you, I also promise that you'll survive the experience.

Last edited by ZaphodBurner on Fri Feb 24, 2012 9:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

"The Red Baron is smart.. He never spends the whole night dancing and drinking root beer.. "-The WWI Flying Ace