SSBB Is online and that's final

Well, since there's still non-believers out there, I'm making this thread, as proof that is is online. I'm tired of people saying its not online, it just makes 0 sense if it wasn't. So I made so good reasons and points and found quotes and USED COMMON SENSE to prove that its online.

Proof #1-

"As far as Wi-Fi play is concerned, Sakurai has confirmed some functionality."

"My plan is to include Wi-Fi connection compatibility and online functionality. One of the primary reasons Super Smash Bros. Brawl was created was that Nintendo, when taking Wii online, wanted to have Smash Bros. to do that," added Sakurai.

Common sesne #4- Putting SSBB online will only make Nintendo more money? so again, why not make their biggest title online?

Common sense #5- Nintendo needs some more good, online games. Why not SSBB?

Common sense #6- Brawl was delayed for a whole year and a month. THE only reason why a game would take that much longer to release is, online play

OK, first off all, NOBODY AND I MEAN NOBODY, CAN FLAME ME, BEACUSE WHAT I JUST SAID WAS VERY TRUE AND I GAVE QUOTES. So I don't want to hear any flamming in this thread. Not to me, or anyone else. Now I could've posted waaaaay more quotes, but i didnt want to take up the whole page.

OK, so my point is, how can you say it's not online, after reading all of that? You guys don't relize how much you piss people off when you say it's not online. Believe it or not, you really do. SSBB will be online. And unless you have GOOD reasons why it's not online, don't try to argue with me. Trust me, you don't want to even try me in a game of *who has the better points*. Again, no flaming. All shall be nice, civilized conversations. I gave good points, reasons, and quotes. I rest my case.........................

Qutes are quite convincing, but then again Wikipedia is never 100% sure anyways as well as ign.

As far as Nintendo's biggest franchise goes I believe thats Mario.

Strikers was easy as pie to make and most sports games are online now!

That is true. Why not spam Sakurai's inbox then? :lol: That sounds like fun actually.

What will make 'em more money is more games like Wiifit.

The friend code system shows that they really don't put online gaming as a priority.

Why is online one of your buttons? We can say Doshin is in Brawl until further notice, we can say it will have Sonic in it untill further notice, we can say it has online or not untill further notice!!!! I for one don't care too much if it is or not online. I see the annoying type fans are gathering rapidly. You don't know anything untill the game is released.

"As far as Wi-Fi play is concerned, Sakurai has confirmed some functionality. However, as stated in the Toukouken on the Japanese version of the Smash Bros. website, "there would be many hurdles to cross," and an online ranking system is unlikely to be implemented."

From 1up:07/11/2007

Back in the dim and distant days of E3 2006, Nintendo announced the hotly anticipated Wii fighting game Super Smash Bros. Brawl. While Brawl provoked some serious froth for a number of reasons -- including the fact that Metal Gear creator Hideo Kojima gave his blessing for series protagonist Solid Snake to punch it up with Mario -- the most exciting aspect of the game for many was the promise of online support, an area where Nintendo's remained painfully behind the curve.

It made for something of an unhappy surprise today when Nintendo announced a release date for Brawl and showed off the company's newfound dedication to online gaming... but not at the same time. In fact, the presentation included several online titles, but Brawl wasn't among them. While it's possible that Nintendo simply wanted to let gamers salivate over Mario Kart Wii and its addition of yet another Wii add-on to the system's growing arsenal of peripherals, it also makes us wonder if perhaps things aren't going quite as well with the game's online component as anticipated. As we think back, we also realize that none of the extensive weekly updates at the game's official site have made mention of its online gameplay, either.

Of course, an omission isn't the same thing as an actual change, but it did catch our attention. We'll be chatting with Smash Bros. producer Shigeru Miyamoto shortly, and this question's at the top of our list.

@mosteroids. I've never heard Miyamoto's name attached to Smash Bros Brawl, even as producer.

Also, the fact that Nintendo already announced that at E3, Smash Bros wouldn't be playable because they wished to show some new games and didn't want to steal the spotlight.

Also, one more point. Most online games for Nintendo have a friendcode mode (which is designed so that you can play against specific people) and a non-friendcode mode (so you play against anyone). I don't understand why the friendcode system is so bad. I cope happily with it. All you have to do is write down a 12 digit number. Is that so difficult?

@Shoko. I think you're right that they will be online in Brawl, as we haven't heard anything otherwise, however, those quotes seem like they're taken last year (recognising them from the E3 '06 cooldown period). Things can change whilst in development of games. Though I do feel that online would be a positive thing in this instance, although I'd want it to be completely flawless. And i think some of the common sense reasons are a bit farfetched. It's fair enough saying what it should be if Nintendo knows what's good for them, but in the end, only they know what online entails in the creation of Brawl. If it's not perfect, they may as well scrap it (or at least have a download for it later).

@mosteroids. I've never heard Miyamoto's name attached to Smash Bros Brawl, even as producer.

Also, the fact that Nintendo already announced that at E3, Smash Bros wouldn't be playable because they wished to show some new games and didn't want to steal the spotlight.

Also, one more point. Most online games for Nintendo have a friendcode mode (which is designed so that you can play against specific people) and a non-friendcode mode (so you play against anyone). I don't understand why the friendcode system is so bad. I cope happily with it. All you have to do is write down a 12 digit number. Is that so difficult?

@Shoko. I think you're right that they will be online in Brawl, as we haven't heard anything otherwise, however, those quotes seem like they're taken last year (recognising them from the E3 '06 cooldown period). Things can change whilst in development of games. Though I do feel that online would be a positive thing in this instance, although I'd want it to be completely flawless. And i think some of the common sense reasons are a bit farfetched. It's fair enough saying what it should be if Nintendo knows what's good for them, but in the end, only they know what online entails in the creation of Brawl. If it's not perfect, they may as well scrap it (or at least have a download for it later).

Click to expand...

Hmmm.... Many sources say he is. He knows a lot about it, but it isn't in his place to say anything according to the crappy ign interview with him. Whatever.

I say it doesn't matter, but it isn't confirmed so I'm not holding my breath.
A quote from smashboards:

"I really doubt that the team could stuff in online play if they weren't planning on including it. Their entire engine and architecture would not be designed with online play in mind. At worst, they would need to rewrite significant portions of the code to allow decent online performance, and that is certainly a likely possibility. If they have to redo portions of their underlying engine, then they would need to reimplement the various components of the architecture that depend on those aspects of the engine. It could get ugly, messy, and time-consuming. Besides, the team will certainly already have their hands full in the last few months of development and they won't have the resources to devote to it without having to significantly delay the game (and past the important holiday season).

Let me use an example: Halo PC/Halo:Custom Edition vs Halo 2. HPC has poor netcode, while the netcode for H2 runs the game very smoothly. Bungie released Halo as an offline Xbox title. Later, Microsoft contracted Gearbox Software to port Halo to the PC, resulting in Halo PC (and later Halo: Custom Edition). Gearbox had serious issues with implementing online play when they were developing the title. Why? None of the architecture was designed for working over a high-latency (online, non-LAN) network. They had to rewrite a lot of code to get it to function adequately, but even in the final product, online play is still buggy.

Gearbox President Randy Pitchford made a huge post on their forums addressing all the criticisms of Halo PC and why it was how was.

Regarding why the netcode was not as great as people would like it to be:
"Halo PC netcode is what it is for a reason. It had to be the way it is and any experienced and capable networking programmer would've made similar conclusions."
"As we got to the end of the project, I pushed hard. I wanted that same feel as the synched/deterministic LAN game on the Xbox. The engineers sat me down and told me the score, drew diagrams about the software architecture, the way the internet works and the challenges that they faced with the specification and they showed me why it had to be that way. The specification dictated the code and vice versa..."

Regarding how much effort it took to implement good networking code in a game not designed fo it:
"...For the last several months, the Bungie and Microsoft guys were in it just as deep as the Gearbox guys were - writing code, prioritizing tasks, etc. It was a group effort and it was pretty hard-core, non-stop - even bonding, if you can call it that."

Brawl may not be simple enough to allow great code to be written:
"Okay - Now lets compare to, say, Counter-Strike.
Counter-Strike has only hit-scan weapons. There aren't big explosions that move things around (and when things aren't around, no one else needs to care about whether or not they are in the same place). When a Warthog moves, we MUST make sure that every client knows it's in the right spot. When a guy dies in Counter-Strike (even in CS Source, which has ragdoll), none of the clients care where the body falls. It's okay for it to be different for each client.
So, they have a game design that keeps the problem from showing itself."

On the difficulty of building on top of pre-existing code
"Halo's networking system was from scratch, first generation, developed in six months by three engineers and launched into a very competitive world of PC on-line gaming with a game design that is not condusive to the inherent problems of the internet. This networking system had to be meshed into an existing C code-base that had been evolved over 10 years of Bungie games until, in it's last usage, was completely overhauled, retuned and refitted with bubblegum, duct-tape and infinite sleepless work nights specifically for the Xbox platform (which was being invented while all of this refitting was going on)."

These are the real problems real developers face. I just don't think anything will change this late in the game, so we best hope it does have online, because the decision is already made."

Hmmm.... Many sources say he is. He knows a lot about it, but it isn't in his place to say anything according to the crappy ign interview with him. Whatever.

I say it doesn't matter, but it isn't confirmed so I'm not holding my breath.
A quote from smashboards:

"I really doubt that the team could stuff in online play if they weren't planning on including it. Their entire engine and architecture would not be designed with online play in mind. At worst, they would need to rewrite significant portions of the code to allow decent online performance, and that is certainly a likely possibility. If they have to redo portions of their underlying engine, then they would need to reimplement the various components of the architecture that depend on those aspects of the engine. It could get ugly, messy, and time-consuming. Besides, the team will certainly already have their hands full in the last few months of development and they won't have the resources to devote to it without having to significantly delay the game (and past the important holiday season).

Let me use an example: Halo PC/Halo:Custom Edition vs Halo 2. HPC has poor netcode, while the netcode for H2 runs the game very smoothly. Bungie released Halo as an offline Xbox title. Later, Microsoft contracted Gearbox Software to port Halo to the PC, resulting in Halo PC (and later Halo: Custom Edition). Gearbox had serious issues with implementing online play when they were developing the title. Why? None of the architecture was designed for working over a high-latency (online, non-LAN) network. They had to rewrite a lot of code to get it to function adequately, but even in the final product, online play is still buggy.

Gearbox President Randy Pitchford made a huge post on their forums addressing all the criticisms of Halo PC and why it was how was.

Regarding why the netcode was not as great as people would like it to be:
"Halo PC netcode is what it is for a reason. It had to be the way it is and any experienced and capable networking programmer would've made similar conclusions."
"As we got to the end of the project, I pushed hard. I wanted that same feel as the synched/deterministic LAN game on the Xbox. The engineers sat me down and told me the score, drew diagrams about the software architecture, the way the internet works and the challenges that they faced with the specification and they showed me why it had to be that way. The specification dictated the code and vice versa..."

Regarding how much effort it took to implement good networking code in a game not designed fo it:
"...For the last several months, the Bungie and Microsoft guys were in it just as deep as the Gearbox guys were - writing code, prioritizing tasks, etc. It was a group effort and it was pretty hard-core, non-stop - even bonding, if you can call it that."

Brawl may not be simple enough to allow great code to be written:
"Okay - Now lets compare to, say, Counter-Strike.
Counter-Strike has only hit-scan weapons. There aren't big explosions that move things around (and when things aren't around, no one else needs to care about whether or not they are in the same place). When a Warthog moves, we MUST make sure that every client knows it's in the right spot. When a guy dies in Counter-Strike (even in CS Source, which has ragdoll), none of the clients care where the body falls. It's okay for it to be different for each client.
So, they have a game design that keeps the problem from showing itself."

On the difficulty of building on top of pre-existing code
"Halo's networking system was from scratch, first generation, developed in six months by three engineers and launched into a very competitive world of PC on-line gaming with a game design that is not condusive to the inherent problems of the internet. This networking system had to be meshed into an existing C code-base that had been evolved over 10 years of Bungie games until, in it's last usage, was completely overhauled, retuned and refitted with bubblegum, duct-tape and infinite sleepless work nights specifically for the Xbox platform (which was being invented while all of this refitting was going on)."

These are the real problems real developers face. I just don't think anything will change this late in the game, so we best hope it does have online, because the decision is already made."

Click to expand...

All that is based on the idea that Smash Bros Brawl wasn't originally intended for online play. However, proof 4 that Shoko provided says otherwise:

Shoko said:

Proof #4-
Quote:
"My plan is to include Wi-Fi connection compatibility and online functionality. One of the primary reasons Super Smash Bros. Brawl was created was that Nintendo, when taking Wii online, wanted to have Smash Bros. to do that," added Sakurai.

i think it would be better if you had specific usernames kinda like mmo games

you get a code once you bvuy the pacake and register online

Click to expand...

Yes, but would that also have to take into account any specific Mii's that they use? Take for example the Everybody votes channel. Likewise, take Warioware SM multiplayer. Now if you want to play as your favourite character zoidberg, then anyone else who has that same Mii wouldn't be able to. Also minding the factor that Wii's are often played by many people in the house, and so they would have to have something other than a Wii specific "username".

Staff Member

I am going to sit through this and just say my piece, there is a great chance that it will be online as shoko showed with his evidence but we can't be 100% sure it's online untill it is confirmed, official by nintendo.

Yes, the evidence did pile up but that doesnt mean online is going to be included, it might only be ranked point system like how well you do in the game, with no online battling, all we can do is wait and see.

I am going to sit through this and just say my piece, there is a great chance that it will be online as shoko showed with his evidence but we can't be 100% sure it's online untill it is confirmed, official by nintendo.

Yes, the evidence did pile up but that doesnt mean online is going to be included, it might only be ranked point system like how well you do in the game, with no online battling, all we can do is wait and see.

Click to expand...

A ranking system is supposedly out of the question. Otherwise I agree with you. G'night!

OKAY E3 2006, nintnedo wanted online gmaes, the most obvious choice? ssbb, that's the sole reason why it's being created is to show off that nintendo is gonna do multiplayer, but since it was delayed so much they just gave that responsibility to pbr and soon to be msc

It isn't like hes demonstrating or really ever confirming the functionality.

Click to expand...

Hence me saying originally:

me said:

@Shoko. I think you're right that they will be online in Brawl, as we haven't heard anything otherwise, however, those quotes seem like they're taken last year (recognising them from the E3 '06 cooldown period). Things can change whilst in development of games. Though I do feel that online would be a positive thing in this instance, although I'd want it to be completely flawless. And i think some of the common sense reasons are a bit farfetched. It's fair enough saying what it should be if Nintendo knows what's good for them, but in the end, only they know what online entails in the creation of Brawl. If it's not perfect, they may as well scrap it (or at least have a download for it later).

Click to expand...

We're not at polar opposites on this, I'm merely stating that there is a possibility of online play.

Wasn't Metroid delayed, or was it Mario Party? Something... But people thought it was to include online play, but nooooooooooooooooooo, no online play. But yea, probably online play for SSBB.. hopefully.

the fact that it was delayed jsut shows that they had problems cause nintendo's new to online gaming(i think my theory prevails)

"My plan is to include Wi-Fi connection compatibility and online functionality. One of the primary reasons Super Smash Bros. Brawl was created was that Nintendo, when taking Wii online, wanted to have Smash Bros. to do that," added Sakurai.