Handguns for disabled and/or handicapped shooters

A number of members have asked for more information on the training of disabled and/or handicapped shooters, with which I've been involved for more than 15 years. In this thread, I'll try to answer some of the most common points, and open it up to further discussion.

First, we have to consider what constitutes a disability or handicap in terms of using a firearm. There are some injuries (e.g. amputation, nerve damage, etc.) that render certain types of firearms more difficult to use (e.g. firing a handgun one-handed), but with adaptation, can still allow the use of others (e.g. firing a rifle from a rest using the other arm). I haven't had much experience with these sorts of injuries, so I'll confine my discussion to more serious damage. Also, for the purposes of this discussion, I'll confine my remarks to using a handgun. Long guns pose a different set of challenges, and require a different approach.

If someone is confined to a wheelchair, or must use a walker, this poses a number of problems. Paraplegia is a common problem with the shooters I've worked with. It's often coupled with a serious reduction in upper body and/or arm strength as well. Another common illness requiring the use of a wheelchair or walker is multiple sclerosis, which also affects upper body and/or arm strength and/or control. For someone using a walker to stand still and use a handgun is even more difficult than for someone in a wheelchair - they rely on the walker for vertical stability, so letting go of it altogether is usually not an option.

So, for someone in a wheelchair, or using a walker, how does one go about using a handgun, and training them to be effective with it?

Firstly, there's the problem of choosing a handgun. All the usual considerations of controllability, stopping power, etc. come into play, with the added element that the handgun must be controllable by someone with limited strength and/or flexibility. I tend to ask the usual questions, with the added emphasis described above:

1. Most important of all is that the shooter MUST be able to shoot the weapon accurately and control its recoil adequately (i.e. get fast second and third shots if necessary, as accurately as the first shot). This means that a light, hard-kicking revolver such as a Titanium or Scandium .357 Magnum is hardly ever appropriate! I've fired these beasts, and although I can be accurate with them, I simply can't get the rapid, repeat shots that I might need in a self-defence situation - so I won't buy one. Of course, some revolvers which are unmanageable with the standard, factory grips can become much more manageable when fitted with a better set of grips - for example, Pachmayr Gripper Decelerator grips are famous for taming magnum recoil better than almost anything else out there. If these big, fat, soft grips fit your hand OK, they're an excellent choice for recoil control: but they can hamper CCW, as clothes tend to "hang up" on the soft rubber, exposing the gun.

2. Given (1) above, the handgun should be in a caliber suitable for defence. Obviously, the .45 and .44 calibers are great, but not everyone can control them. On the other hand, the .22 LR is not very good as a "stopping" round, but there are some disabled and/or handicapped shooters who simply can't handle anything with greater recoil! So, choose a cartridge that is the most effective possible "stopper" - within the limitations of (1) above.

3. One now has to decide how the gun will be used. Will it be carried a lot? If so, how - holster? Pocket? What about wheelchairs? Walkers? Placement on body (e.g. ankle, waist, shoulder holster, etc.)? One has to choose a revolver that fits one's needs. It's no good trying to carry a 10" barrel S&W .500 Magnum in an ankle holster for bear defence! :D So, given the primary importance of (1) above and the secondary importance of (2) above, this is the third decision factor. Choose a gun that physically fits one's needs.

4. A final factor which is particularly important for disabled and/or handicapped shooters is whether or not they can operate the gun effectively. This involves a number of issues:

(a) Can they hold a pistol firmly enough to prevent "limp-wristing", which causes FTF/FTE problems? If not, they're limited to revolvers for defence. On the other hand, if they can't handle a long DA trigger pull, they might not be able to use a revolver too well, either! This is a vital area to check out in practice, and see what will best suit their needs.

(b) Can they hold the gun in an extended arm position, so that the sights can be used, or is their upper body or arm strength and mobility too restricted to allow this?

(c) Can they perform the "manual of arms" in terms of drawing, shooting, reloading, etc. with the chosen weapon? Are there limitations? This involves testing various methods and locations of carry, to see which ones can be used by the individual in question. Sometimes, standard carry modes don't work, and something unique must be developed.

(d) Can they maintain the firearm adequately? Do they have sufficient strength and manual dexterity to field-strip it, clean it, lubricate it, etc.? Many of them don't, and have to rely on friends to periodically come to their home to clean their guns for them.

(e) A related issue is the accessibility of practice facilities for disabled and/or handicapped shooters. Are suitable ranges available? Is accessibility adequate for those with wheelchairs or walkers? How about setting up and retrieving targets? It's all very well if they can get to the firing line, but not much good if they don't have the accessibility needed to get to their targets!

The answers to these questions will depend very much on the individual shooter. I've found it best to start them off with a .22 LR pistol and revolver, letting them get used to a minimal level of recoil, and become reasonably accurate, before moving on to higher-powered cartridges. From this level, I usually move up to standard-pressure .38 Special. After this has been mastered, I'll try them with .38 Special +P or lower-level .357 Magnum cartridges in revolvers, and 9mm. Parabellum in pistols. For those who are able to do so, I'll then move up to .44 Special and .45 Colt in revolvers, and .45 ACP in pistols. I've never been "higher" than this with disabled and/or handicapped shooters.

I find most of them "stick" at about the .38 Special +P level. Heavier recoil than this is usually not an option for them, due to the difficulty they encounter in controlling the firearm. Some can handle a .44 Special or .45 Colt/.45 ACP revolver, but their numbers are relatively few. Also, I find the vast majority do have "limp-wristing" problems with pistols, making the use of a revolver a virtual certainty. Some of them, due to advanced levels of muscular deterioration and/or lack of arm strength and control, can't get beyond the .22 LR caliber at all.

I think the firearm most frequently chosen by these shooters is a K-frame S&W revolver, in .38 Special or .357 Magnum (mostly shooting .38 loads) for those who can handle it, and in .22 LR for those wanting minimal recoil. I've also used S&W, Rossi and Taurus revolvers in .44 Special (the full-weight, steel-frame guns), and a few S&W N-frames in .45 ACP and .45 Colt, but the bigger revolvers are suitable for only about one in ten of the shooters I've worked with. J-frame snubbies are mostly not suitable, because their small size and proportionately greater recoil makes them less easily used by those with strength and/or mobility and/or flexibility problems - again, one out of ten can use them. For those who can handle semi-auto pistols without "limp-wristing", I've mostly found that 9mm. is the biggest caliber they can handle, and the "safe-action" pistols like the Glock or Springfield XD seem to be most "user-friendly" for them. External safeties are mostly not suitable for their use, given limitations on their hand strength and mobility. For those who can only handle .22 LR levels of recoil, I've found the Ruger and Browning pistols to be most useful and most easily mastered. A few use pistols in .32 ACP or .380 ACP.

As for ammunition selection, many of them battle to control +P and Magnum levels of recoil. I've found most of them can handle the .38 Special Federal Nyclad load, in either 158gr. or 125gr., at standard velocity. Of course, this excellent round is no longer manufactured: but one can still find old stocks here and there, and I've stored some away for issue to them. In 9mm. Parabellum, I mostly recommend the Federal 9BP standard-velocity load, which is about as good as one can get in this caliber. Practice is with standard-velocity loads. As always, "speed's fine, but accuracy's final", and I train them to put at least 200 rounds a month through their guns as ongoing training. Many of them also have access to .22 LR revolvers or pistols, and I encourage them to put 500 rounds a month through these, as it's dirt cheap.

For those using revolvers, a trigger job is often a very useful "accessory". My personal favorite gunsmith for this is Clark Custom Guns in Princeton, LA - for $97, they do an absolutely wonderful action job. I've had people shoot my revolvers and tell me flatly that the trigger pull is too light for reliable ignition - but they go bang every time... One can, of course, have a trigger job done by almost any competent gunsmith. For those with really limited income, a set of Wolff reduced-power springs can often be "good enough", even if not the best solution.

I mentioned that there are some shooters who can only handle .22 LR. My standard practice with them is to require them to use up a minimum of 5,000 rounds in initial training, and at least 500 rounds per month thereafter. I want them to hit a moving ping-pong ball 9 times out of 10, at ranges varying from 10 to 20 feet, before I consider them well trained enough to use this caliber as a defensive round. I equip them with a good, deep-penetrating load such as the CCI Velocitor, and train them to put half-a-dozen rounds at least into the face, between eyes and upper lip. Personally, once they can do this, I'd hate to be in a CQB situation against them - I'd probably die!

One also has to take physical limitations into account. One of the most effective defensive shooters I know is a paraplegic with less than 50% upper body strength and mobility, who's permanently in a wheelchair. In training her, a huge problem was that if she extended a handgun at arm's length, her arm and hand shook so much that she couldn't get an accurate sight picture! She also didn't have the hand strength to manage a DA trigger pull. The eventual solution was a hoot. We bought a Browning Buck Mark in .22 LR, and she put several hundred rounds through it, but was still unable to get a good sight picture. So, we bought a laser pointer unit (the kind that teachers or lecturers use), wired it up for pressure-pad operation, and mounted it in a set of rings (using inner "filler" rings to take up the gap) on top of the Buck Mark. We put the pressure pad in the center of the front strap, where her middle finger goes beneath the trigger guard. I then spent quite a while aligning the laser with the bore, "shimming" it in the rings so as to get it to point accurately. Once this was done, I got a machinist friend to make up a set of aluminum "filler" rings to fit the laser and scope mount, accurate to within 1/1,000", and mounted it permanently. I trained her to ignore the sights, not to lift the gun off her lap - just rest the butt on her thigh, illuminate the target with the laser, and shoot. It took about 10,000 rounds to get her reflexes trained - but she can now hit a moving ping-pong ball, at 10 to 20 feet, every single time. I've seen her go 100 rounds without a miss! Obviously, she's not able to deal with targets behind her, or to one side, very easily: but our solution is a lot better than nothing, and she's a lot more comfortable with her ability to defend herself. I'd hate to be the mugger who tried to rob her! My last sight in this world would probably be an intense red light in my eyes!

I hope this has answered some of the questions I've been asked. If you have more, now's the time to ask! Also, I hope that others who've been involved in this field will join in the discussion.

A FINAL APPEAL: Many of the disabled shooters I work with are on severely limited incomes - workers compensation, welfare, Social Security, that sort of thing. Many of them can't afford a decent handgun, and I have to scrounge and beg to get something suitable. I also find the Crimson Trace laser grips to be an invaluable accessory for them - but these cost as much as many used guns, and are financially out of reach for many of them. If anyone is interested in helping out by buying or donating a gun or a set of CT grips, I would really, really appreciate your help - as would the shooters! Please PM or e-mail me if you would like to help.

Peter .... thank's a million for that ... excellent work. Not sure about your typing speed but, that looks like about an hour of effort .... it's much appreciated and I'll archive that and print it off too.

I'll be PM'ing you.:)

Safety First

April 11, 2004, 08:07 PM

That was good information..now let me ask you if you have experience/input with my particular problem..I have a very serious eye problem in my right eye which was my dominate eye and I am right handed. I do ok aiming with my left eye but if you have any tips for a right handed person aiming with the left eye, as always any tips/info will be appreciated.

Variable

April 11, 2004, 10:43 PM

Well heck, I'm a wheelchair bound shooter and I must say he covered everything I can really think about. Good write up Preacherman! I'm going to have to PM you for some pistol advice.

Preacherman

April 12, 2004, 06:38 AM

Safety First and Variable, I've PM'ed both of you.

P95Carry

April 15, 2004, 12:01 AM

This needs bumped and .. guys, please note the appeal .. I have endevored to help a little .. and whilst not everyone can .. anyone who feels they may be able to assist .. do drop Peter a line. This is a VERY worthwhile cause.A FINAL APPEAL: Many of the disabled shooters I work with are on severely limited incomes - workers compensation, welfare, Social Security, that sort of thing. Many of them can't afford a decent handgun, and I have to scrounge and beg to get something suitable. I also find the Crimson Trace laser grips to be an invaluable accessory for them - but these cost as much as many used guns, and are financially out of reach for many of them. If anyone is interested in helping out by buying or donating a gun or a set of CT grips, I would really, really appreciate your help - as would the shooters! Please PM or e-mail me if you would like to help.

MrMurphy

April 15, 2004, 11:32 AM

Old friend of my dad's had polio, and was on those odd looking arm-hook crutches. But he had a Beretta 92 and a stack of hicaps (this was before the ban anyways), and though he had to sort of hunch over to stay on his crutches and keep a sight picture, he had 45 rounds at the ready, and generally hit right where he was aiming at. With an HKS magloader to help him load, he had nooooo problems. :)

mtnbkr

April 15, 2004, 12:39 PM

My brother has almost no use of his right arm and certainly no fine motor skill. Operating any handgun is difficult because it generally takes two hands to load and make ready even a revolver. Once it's loaded, he is fine. While he's not a particularly good shot, he handles and enjoys 357mag loads. We've tried autos, revolvers (SA and DA), nothing really works for him without a lot of fumbling. :(

However...

He has discovered "the rifle". His technique is a bit different and he still needs some help with loading, but shortly after shooting my scoped bolt gun, he was able to hit bowling pins at 50yds almost 100% of the time and over 50% of the time at 100yds. His technique is to bring the rifle to his left shoulder (this is a RH gun, btw), put his right arm out in front to act as a "shooting rest" and fire. He's basically shooting this gun one handed with a rest.

Once he's out of school, I may try to find him a used NEF Handi-Rifle in either rimfire or an inexpensive centerfire caliber (he likes the recoil). I think he could handle that with one hand (the loading part).

Chris

shooter58

April 15, 2004, 02:57 PM

Preacherman, as a handicapped shooter (I have posted about this previously), I would like to say that you are to be commended for your dedication to this endeavor. I just wish there were more of you to go around. God will surely bless you for your efforts. I will try to donate as situations allow. thank you.

Ala Dan

April 15, 2004, 05:58 PM

I must say, Great Work there Preacherman!

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

longeyes

April 16, 2004, 12:40 PM

Very nice post.

Maybe Beretta would like to cut some special deals for its tilt-up barrel models? Good for disabled shooters, very good PR for them.

Paul "Fitz" Jones

April 17, 2004, 01:16 AM

I have spent time bedridden in a wheel chair, powered chair of stores when shopping and on forearm crutches so am aware of problems of some handicapped. When I was Deputy Marshal in the 60s my wife became really upset as I regularly stay over night with juries during their deliberations. I had taught her to shoot well but was concerned that any factory load could go through walls of the average home.

I was aware of deaths of from accidental weapons discharging in homes and apartments from bullets going through walls and floors so I thought of the idea of loading a hollow base wadcutter backwards in 38 special with a normal target powder charge for my wife to have handy nights. I figured that the hollow base would be effective when fired at close range in a bedroom without the bang ruining her ears and if it was fired accidentally it would open up and slow down when going through the walls and furniture to become slow enough to not be fatal in other bedrooms.

To make a long story short all my officer buddies thought it was a great idea for their wives and that would make a 38 special in a J frame Smith for those who could handle them could be a very effective close range round with less liability at other distances. Handicapped folks like I was for years spend more time indoors and I think a magnum caliber would be a liability.

russlate

April 17, 2004, 04:12 PM

Don't forget that you might be coldcocked or sucker punched and semi-concious because you dropped your guard, and need something you can use in extremis.

My Bodyguard and standard pressure ammo ( 38 Special ) backed by a CZ83 in 380 ( w/ 2 or more highcaps ) come out about the same at aboout 200 ft. lbs. muzzle energy. I believe that even under anaesthetic causing inability to articulate I could still use these guns. Perhaps not at the level I'd want, but I could use them.

Anthony

June 19, 2006, 05:06 PM

Hi Preacherman,

If your students or anyone else who might fit into this category needs assistance acquiring a gun or related shooting equipment give Travis Noteboom a call at Crimson Trace...the Laser Grip people.

He has spearheaded an effort to help disabled hunters and shooters enjoy their sports once again. Several companies have formed alliances with him to offer discounted guns and equipment to those who need it.

Travis has helped my disabled student acquire some items she was in need of.

VacuumJockey

June 19, 2006, 06:35 PM

This is a really useful writeup! Shouldn't it be a sticky?

1 old 0311

June 19, 2006, 07:14 PM

Thanks Preacherman. You took the time to do something that a lot of us take for granted.
I got my disabled Father ( Parkensons) a S&W 60 with Crimson Trace Laser.

Kevin

Essex County

June 20, 2006, 04:35 PM

This is an older thread, but I missed it earlier. I have Primary Lateral Scrosis that has taken it's toll on me since I was 44. I just uurned 60 and I consider Myself lucky. I can walk fifty feet with a cane on even ground and stand for 5-8 minutes. I shoot a lot. I have a benchrest I can drive to and I can still rack the slides on my .45's. Life is good. My Wife of 40 plus years is very suportive of my hobby. Keep active and do as much as you can...Essex

sm

June 20, 2006, 05:11 PM

Preacherman is to be commended, and I agree as I too have worked with Folks with Physical Limitations.

One thing I am a HUGE Believer in for these Folks, and also I use for kids, new students, ...etc.

Are the Speer Plastic Training Bullets :
http://www.speer-bullets.com/default.asp?s1=3&s2=8 [scroll down a bit].

Plastic Training Components

Do you want to get a little handgun practice at times you can't get to the range? Don't have a heavy-duty backstop in the garage? SPEER Plastic Training Components are the prescription you need for short-range practice. This isn't loaded ammo. We make the bullets and cases--you supply the power. A standard large pistol primer provides all the power needed to propel the reusable bullets at velocities between 300 and 400 ft/sec. Cases are reusable, too. You don't even need reloading equipment to assemble Speer practice ammo. The case/bullet system is available for 38/357 and 44 caliber revolvers. For the 45 Auto, use our bullet and a standard 45 Auto brass case with a drilled-out flash hole. A backstop for these bullets can be quickly built from a cardboard box and carpet scraps.

Bullets and cases are sold separately so you can replace lost or damaged bullets.

SAFETY FIRST: Never use propellant when loading Plastic Training components. Treat the resulting ammunition with the same respect given conventional ammunition; velocity is high enough to injure the skin. Use only in well-ventilated areas. Brush the bore every 12-18 shots to prevent accumulation of primer residue.

Besides no recoil allowing for focus on basic fundamentals, these offer other great features such as :
-affordable
- allows practice indoors - such as a barn, well ventilated warehouse , do consider sound proofing , jurisdictions and such.
-Extreme heat/ cold, snow, rain...whether physically limited or not , one can gain great practice.

Donate a box of these, and some sleeves of large pistol primers. Donate a backstop, make a barn or warehouse available.

I use these without primers for loading, unloading the cylinders, Something the physcially limited find useful, especially if we have no dummy rounds.

They would rather spend the monies on the training bullets than dummy rounds they share.

-Fun.

Training means Safety and everything else, Fun should be a part as well IMO.

aggie

June 21, 2006, 12:14 AM

Didn't know about this thread until tonight. Thank you!

As a "disabled" shooter (genetic birth defects of both forearms, wrists and hands, no thumbs) I've not yet been able to work with another "disabled" shooter to develop their abilities. Your info will be archived on my system for that dat. You've taught me a lot.

Thanks & God bless ya'll !

RustyShackelford

June 22, 2006, 03:32 PM

I recall Massad Ayoob writing an article about this subject for a gun magazine in the late 1990s. Ayoob made some good points about handgun selection, power, reloading drills, etc. You may get this article from him, see; www.Ayoob.com for details.

For the limited budget, power and types of use(concealed carry, protection, etc), I would suggest a Beretta .380ACP with a tip up barrel design or a simple S&W 638 or 649(Bodyguard) design; .357magnum/.38spl. Taurus also make the excellent "Protector" models in .357/.38spl in several formats(stainless/blue steel/Ti frame). I bought a new Ti Taurus Protector in .357magnum. I used +P+ Magsafe .38spl loads for CC/protection. The .38spl Protector/S&W Bodyguard designs would be a smart choice because they can be shot DA or SA but the hammer spur(s) will not catch or snag on clothes, walker/wheelchair bags/purses/etc. A new Taurus/S&W can shoot many types of .357mag/.38spl rounds and offer decent marksmanship too.

For carry loads I suggest the Glaser Silver Safety Slugs or Magsafe .38spl +P or +P+ loads. The Remington bonded Golden Saber 125gr .38 JHPs or the 158gr Lead SWCHP +P rounds would be smart too.

Your posting is very well done. I appreciate the time and effort you put into it -- thank you very much!!!

I am handicapped, having lost mst of my fingers due to complications with a kidney transplant and being a diabetic for almost 47 years (I'm 48 now)

I have retained a little more than half of each thumb (to the knuckle, but without any bend to the mid point). I also have a stub on my right index, again, to the knuckle, without any bend to the finger. The left hand has four stubs, about a half inch in length.

I currently carry, when I feel I need to, a S+W light weight Chief Special 38 Specal. I'm lucky enough to have a couple of boxes of old Winchester SiverTips ones with 95 grain bullets, not the newer, heavier, 110 grain type. I wish they still made these!!!! Much easier to hold on target, and higher speed for better expansion.

I also own several other handguns bought before I lost my fingers. One I like a lot, for its sie, is a mint ColtMustang Light weight in 380 ACP. I have not tried to shoot this pistol, and I know I should before carrying.

How can I test various pistols safely? One round at a time? Two? Should I have rounds loaded with lighter charges for my carry pieces?

Any advice will be very welcome.

Scott

sm

August 27, 2007, 01:36 AM

sbieg,

Welcome to THR!

May I call you Scott?

I am sorry to hear of your physical limits.
I do appreciate you being so up front and honest to share, as to help others, I respect the fact, this is not easy for you.

My personal opinion is to find someone that is "seasoned" with assisting shooters , physical limits, and firearms.

Being blunt, this may mean another person that is also physically limited, or someone in Physical Therapy that is a shooter, or anyone in the Medical Profession that has experiences with Physical Limits, and understands Anatomy , Physiology, Diabetes, Pharmacology and the whole bit.

Being tacky, some folks in the "teach folks to shoot" business don't know beans about assisting those with physical limits as (tacky) they are still on a pink cloud and sipping the kool-aid themselves.

I did not look to see if you listed a location, still this is what I would suggest.

1. If you have a shooting range ask if there is a Medical Professional that works with Physically Limited folks.
Besides shooting, there is the fact some days are better for you than others, and things such as Meds and medical reactions do come into play.

2. If you are near Memphis, TN, contact Tom Givens at Rangemaster.
Besides shooting, you have other "staying safe" needs that need to be assessed and addressed.

Mr. Givens has too many years on the streets, as does his assistants, and
here is the key.
Nobody in the US that teaches CCW has had more students in a gunfight that those students that have attended Rangemaster.

In the near future, SouthNarc, is supposed to be coming to Rangemaster.
Now I have no idea what YOU can physically do, or if this class is something you could participate in, but I sure would call and find out!

Mr. Givens and his folks , have experiences with physically limited folks, there are others, still Rangemaster comes to mind first.

My take, so if Givens says different, ignore me, and listen to him.

3. Guns: I suggest light loads and one round at a time.
Speer Plastic Training Bullets allow one quality practice of handling a gun, along with less/no felt recoil in getting correct basic fundamentals down pat, and practice.
No Speer bullets? Get someone to reload cases with primer only.
Deal is the "gun going off" and adding another dimension to only "dry fire".

Personally, I like dedicated 38spls, and most are set up to shoot 158 gr to point of aim/point of impact [POA/POI] standard pressure rounds are IMO/IME best. I suggest standard pressure LSWC,or LSWC-HP
a. Guns are set up to shoot these
b. Guns have less wear and tear , especially if an older gun and not really rated for +P use.
c. Less felt recoil affording more effective shot placement, and effective follow up shots
The other loading, is the 148 gr wadcutter.

Gun fit is the key, and especially in your situation.
The ability to try a variety of stocks/ grips on the same gun, is a huge benefit.
I like used S&W Model 10 (blue) and 64 (stainless) for a number of reasons, one being so many stocks/ grips are made for these K frames.

Even if this means having to get a custom made stock, or take a factory one and file here and build up there and smooth some over there

Thinking your hands/ fingers, a Eagle Secret Service Wood Stock, with the finger groove "rounded" and the 'thumb side" being filed to give a "thumb rest" and the right stock smoothed to allow better trigger finger reach , comes to mind.
Just based on someone else's hand and what worked for them...

I get yelled at for what I am about to share:
Try a Ruger Standard .22 rim-fire pistol.
Just the old Standard, skinny tapered barrel 4" or so, MKI, or MKII.
This gun "fits" quite a few "physically limited" hands.

Used Ruger Standard usually easiest to find.
Dura-Matic is real easy to take apart, and these fit and have "point ability"

Yeah, I know it is a .22 rimfire, still if you can hit a tennis ball everytime, and a golf ball on a good day...
I know "limits" can and do change and if a bad day hits with meds reaction, beats yelling and using a pointy stick.

sixgunner455

August 28, 2007, 01:36 AM

sm, I agree about the Ruger .22. I don't carry mine most of the time, but when I know my wrist can't take anything more, it can still take the Ruger and I can hit anything I need. Usually, I carry a 642, but if I know that the wrist can't handle the recoil, I'll move to a 9mm or the Ruger. I never advise someone who can regularly handle the stronger recoil to carry a .22, though.