Zkills wrote:You are getting the wrong idea about Epona. You seem to think that Epona is a pay to win server which is far from the case. Sure buying plat helps, but someone who doesn’t buy plat can be just as good as someone who does, if not even better than someone who buys plat as long as they show up to many bosses. You will win drops eventually, and you will make money off it if you decide to sell instead of keep.

Now imagine if every server became free under this new loot distribution. You will actually be geared faster than you would in either Epona or a dom server, while also requiring half the effort required in a dom clan with dkp. Not only are your chances of getting loot higher, but you’ll also be able to buy and sell any drop you want. That’ll make everyone more happy, and that’ll incentivize (not force) more people to buy plat, which then reflects onto VR positively. That’ll also make every market free which we all know is a very good thing. For players on current free servers, it’ll fix the issue of extremely low chances at loot due to high attendances at bosses, and for dom servers it’ll turn this game into an actual game versus the part time job known as dkp/attendance, which ultimately makes players on both sides more happy. And yes it’s true the dominance makes more unhappy people than happy. Why do you think a majority of the complaints come from dom servers and all of the negative feedback/reviews for this game originate from dom servers (looking at the App Store and various other review platforms)?

I too have played in just about every scenario. Dkp, voting, underdog clan, dom clan, solo, small clan of friends, free server, feeder clan, and even ran my own clan back in 2013 or 2014 named rebellion where I was voted as chief and we managed to do well for a few months and gain traction before we decided to split up. I’ve also been playing since February 2012, 8 years now... And through all of my experiences and generally being an unbiased person, I can safely say free servers are the best option for this game if this game wants to be successful. I have seen and know of the advantages and disadvantages of both systems.

It’s a matter of preference, Epona is more P2W by far compared to any dom server, and I completely disagree with any playstyle where gold or outside resources affect what you can get in game.

See what I mean? It’s all preference... legit that’s all it is. For me Epona was too pay to win, and for you a dom server was too constrained on what you could do.

It’s all on a scale and there are plenty of servers out there each with their own unique systems

Working off of “preference” isn’t what makes things successful. Just because you prefer something doesn’t automatically make it the right thing. This game has run on “preference” for far too long and it has gotten us no where. Now VR is developing a new game and as much as I hate to think about it, that could mean the end of Celtic Heroes in a few years if change isn’t made now. We have proven time and time again that we can’t handle the ability to do what we want or prefer. Dominance has chased away more players than we could possibly count that would otherwise still be here if things were different, and Epona wouldn’t be the only good option to escape dominance, because now they are overpopulated which is causing too many problems. Believe it or not, those who are in dominant clans make up for a small percentage of the total player base, meaning yes, there is a much bigger world outside of your enclosed vision inside the walls of a dominant clan. Maybe if people here stepped outside of those walls they’ll see just how bad things are. And no, I do not mean being inside an underdog clan because a majority of those clans are simply mini versions of the dom clan, blinded by competition and hate for the dominant clan and if they were to come to power, would do the exact same things the previous dominant clan did (we’ve already seen it with clans like Havoc, Nova, Pegasus and Toxic).

VR needs to take back control of their own game and stop letting players run wild with it, doing whatever they want, slowly destroying this once great game that OTM has built up all those years ago. It’s no secret that this game has lost its charm, and the players are the ones to blame with the lack of content coming in second. But what good does making new content do when the players will just take it and destroy it. This game still has so much potential. It’s like a gold mine yet to be uncovered

Rip I didn’t realize this was a fixed action RPG, my bad, it was open world.

Oh one other cool fun fact, the game doesn’t revolve around your singular preferences .-. As said by myself and legit some of your own Eponians as well as a myriad of players from all over the globe and game, people like dom servers and people like Epona. .-. Both work, both succeed, both make the game money, and both make people happy.That should be enough to close this case I’m not saying your opinions are invalid, I’m saying your argument lacks warrants and sufficient backing.

These are my thoughts on dom and non dom servers. I’ve played a few servers of each. Writing as things come to mind. When I initially first played a dom server I didn’t like how I had to put in a lot of time in order to accumulate dkp for good gear. I didn’t want it to be like another job. I left for a non dom server. It was fun at first. Even though I didn’t get much luck winning jewelry. Probably only won twice. I did win dl and edl drops here and there. Was easy to get things for Druid. Warrior too. Was very hard to get things for rogue. Too many people going for purple. I bought chests to sell to make money more quickly to get rogue dl and weps. Ranger was a bit difficult to gear. Mage not so much. I mostly spent on play to get what I had as others were winning a lot. Very hard to compete against many people. It irritated many when someone who was already geared well won a roll. Of course to sell. Usually for a high price. I found many people in non dom server to be greedy. Not just myself. These thoughts and words weren’t mine alone. Others felt the same. Not a lot of camaraderie in the clans. Lots of clan hopping. People didn’t like it in one clan, they would up and leave when they wanted. Happened a lot. Not a lot of fealty around. People in non dom servers mouth of to others more often and lose their cool. Disrespecting one another. Dom clans have leaders and usually keep people in check which makes for a more enjoyable environment. I spent more plat on non dom server to get gear. I spent a lot of plat on dom server for lixes, fashion, mounts and other irrelevant items. Not everyone has to spend on non dom servers. A poor player can make a lot by being lucky with their roll. Dkp with decay is great. New people can sometimes catch up to others. I remember being in beta many times. Once in a dom clan in a beta server. No complaints there. I was once in an underdog clan. That’s quite fun but left after a long time to join dom. Underdog clan saw well geared people in beta and complained. They were looking at non dom server players. Lol some of these players left to those servers. Good for them. I’ve also been in a beta server when I was in a non dom server. People complained that their own gear was trash because they have terrible luck with rolls and have garbage gear that they could scrap together. They were comparing themselves to people from a dom server. I think it’s just all about preference and when it comes to a rolling server it is also about luck. I don’t think vr gives a flying f about what people are saying on this thread. I’m sure they’re making good income from all of the servers combined. That’s the bottom line for them. They won’t step in and dictate what the servers should be like and then shouldn’t have to. Not all servers have to be the same. Let them be as is. I’m sure vr thinks the game is doing well. That is all I could think of for the time being. No not true. I did like my time in rolling servers as I could pick up where I left off.

bob the mage wrote:It’s a matter of preference, Epona is more P2W by far compared to any dom server, and I completely disagree with any playstyle where gold or outside resources affect what you can get in game.

See what I mean? It’s all preference... legit that’s all it is. For me Epona was too pay to win, and for you a dom server was too constrained on what you could do.

It’s all on a scale and there are plenty of servers out there each with their own unique systems

Working off of “preference” isn’t what makes things successful. Just because you prefer something doesn’t automatically make it the right thing. This game has run on “preference” for far too long and it has gotten us no where. Now VR is developing a new game and as much as I hate to think about it, that could mean the end of Celtic Heroes in a few years if change isn’t made now. We have proven time and time again that we can’t handle the ability to do what we want or prefer. Dominance has chased away more players than we could possibly count that would otherwise still be here if things were different, and Epona wouldn’t be the only good option to escape dominance, because now they are overpopulated which is causing too many problems. Believe it or not, those who are in dominant clans make up for a small percentage of the total player base, meaning yes, there is a much bigger world outside of your enclosed vision inside the walls of a dominant clan. Maybe if people here stepped outside of those walls they’ll see just how bad things are. And no, I do not mean being inside an underdog clan because a majority of those clans are simply mini versions of the dom clan, blinded by competition and hate for the dominant clan and if they were to come to power, would do the exact same things the previous dominant clan did (we’ve already seen it with clans like Havoc, Nova, Pegasus and Toxic).

VR needs to take back control of their own game and stop letting players run wild with it, doing whatever they want, slowly destroying this once great game that OTM has built up all those years ago. It’s no secret that this game has lost its charm, and the players are the ones to blame with the lack of content coming in second. But what good does making new content do when the players will just take it and destroy it. This game still has so much potential. It’s like a gold mine yet to be uncovered

Rip I didn’t realize this was a fixed action RPG, my bad, it was open world.

Oh one other cool fun fact, the game doesn’t revolve around your singular preferences .-. As said by myself and legit some of your own Eponians as well as a myriad of players from all over the globe and game, people like dom servers and people like Epona. .-. Both work, both succeed, both make the game money, and both make people happy.That should be enough to close this case I’m not saying your opinions are invalid, I’m saying your argument lacks warrants and sufficient backing.

I’m trying to make this game feel more like an open world game where players can’t place restrictions on whatever they feel like and where players can do as they please. You can still do dkp if you want under the new loot distribution, but you won’t be able to assert dominance over everyone else or tell others what they can or can’t do. That will and should be VRs job. And good luck trying to get dkp to work because I can bet you once players realize they no longer have to work part time for their gear, they’ll never want to touch dkp again lol. Some clans on Epona have even used dom clan systems and rules, only players don’t join them because they’re forced to, rather because they want to. Everyone is better off, everyone is happy. A 100% open world game needs 100% freedom in order to be successful and grow, and dominance/server rules do just the opposite of that.

Zkills, Proud general of the beloved KodiakReavers of Belenus, the G.O.A.T clan

Paint It Black wrote:I don’t think vr gives a flying f about what people are saying on this thread. They won’t step in and dictate what the servers should be like and then shouldn’t have to.

They might not care, that’s why the nail has to be constantly hammered until it’s all the way in and they understand. You want them to care about this game, because when the developers care about their game you know they’re excited for the future of their game. I feel like that has been lost with VR especially with their focus on Warhammer. It’s why I get upset over things like the Dino exploit, because it shows that they don’t even care enough to step in with authority to stop a mechanic breaking exploit on a raid that was released not too long ago. It’s really concerning.

Why have I started to care about it so much now? Well recently the co founder of virtual realms was interviewed and stated the follow, “We won’t have crafting initially at launch, however giving players a variety of content in Warhammer: Odyssey is a top priority for us over the coming years”. What does that tell you? Celtic Heroes will no longer be a top priority for a long time, and the chances of this game dying within that time period are extremely high. Years is simply too long.Source: https://www.mmorpg.com/interviews/warhammer-odyssey-3d-mobile-mmorpg-developer-interview-round-2-2000108966

Even the finest of blades grow dull overtime, but with a simple resharpening that blade can reach its max potential once again. This game has grown dull, and instead of VR simply tossing that dull blade out and getting a new one, they have to be shown that a simple resharpening of that blade can make it good as new again. Changing the loot distribution is that resharpening. Removing the dullness of dominance/player controlled everything that has slowed this game down so much will restore the popularity of this game. Celtic Heroes is a very fine blade indeed, there’s nothing like it on the market, VR just needs to learn how to use it effectively. And who knows, Celtic Heroes may get nominated once again for best mobile iPhone MMO of the year or whatever it was once again like in 2013. It most certainly has the potential to reach that height again.

Zkills, Proud general of the beloved KodiakReavers of Belenus, the G.O.A.T clan

Zkills, perhaps it would be best for you to endeavor for a job at VR :-)

Well if that were the case, and let’s say for the sake of argument that they will not focus on this game as much as before, then I guess I’m losing out on a ton of time and $ I spent before. I no longer am interested in this game and it does have a lot of potential. I am not sure that rolling servers and dom servers is the main problem as to why this game will not succeed(per you foreseeing it’s failure lol) I normally see people quitting because they have lost interest. None of the current content excites them. I have logged in to check out the new boss and disappointed to see it’s more reskinned content. Where is the creativity? I’d have liked to see some outrageous boss in the Heroes Landing map. The map shows something that hints at the Loch Ness monster. A boss that emerges from the water would have been nice and it would surely attract players. I’d hope they don’t just reskin that giant snake that’s in fingals the game needs more content and give some help in some form to mid level gamers. Many quit before carrowmore. The prices in the shop are ridiculous lol I also think end gamers need more content to keep them entertained as well. I remember someone saying like what’s the point. It is called end game for a reason. It’s a good point. That is why many get bored. Transfer and start all over. They have nothing to do but they enjoy Celtic heroes very much and would like to keep playing but have nothing else to do. Example also being people make alts. Either to help out more with raids or that then have a lot of time on their hands after hitting end game on main. Making alts is a form of replay ability. We need more content. I’d also like for VR to resume with developer diaries. They need to give the community some excitement and there is no communication going on in between the two parties. Aging this reminds me of times the devs try to impress us only to be chewed out by the community. It’s a lose/lose kind of thing. So these are just a few of the things that could contribute to the games demise if that were to happen. Might I add that I still think the rolling server and dom server topic is about preference. Lol. I do think there should be some kind of notice to all new players to notify them about what type of server he or she is about to join.

More content will only temporarily satisfy players like all of the previous content released because the problem is much deeper than simply a lack of content. Yes, choosing between a rolling server and dom is preference, but preference doesn’t matter when talking about the health of this game. I might prefer to eat Big Macs everyday (I don’t lol) over more healthy choices like a sandwich from the deli. Just because I prefer the Big Mac because it tastes better and is cheaper doesn’t make it the correct and healthy choice. There is plenty of concrete evidence that shows how destructive dominance has been over the years, just like the Big Mac.

I’d probably go nuts if I worked at VR lol. I’m sure there’s a lot of good people there, but man some of their choices/decisions have been mind boggling and I’d probably try to set them straight (already tried to set difinitus straight a few times. Srry but ur the only admin who’s active on the forums ._. ) ._.

Zkills, Proud general of the beloved KodiakReavers of Belenus, the G.O.A.T clan

Zkills wrote:Working off of “preference” isn’t what makes things successful. Just because you prefer something doesn’t automatically make it the right thing. This game has run on “preference” for far too long and it has gotten us no where. Now VR is developing a new game and as much as I hate to think about it, that could mean the end of Celtic Heroes in a few years if change isn’t made now. We have proven time and time again that we can’t handle the ability to do what we want or prefer. Dominance has chased away more players than we could possibly count that would otherwise still be here if things were different, and Epona wouldn’t be the only good option to escape dominance, because now they are overpopulated which is causing too many problems. Believe it or not, those who are in dominant clans make up for a small percentage of the total player base, meaning yes, there is a much bigger world outside of your enclosed vision inside the walls of a dominant clan. Maybe if people here stepped outside of those walls they’ll see just how bad things are. And no, I do not mean being inside an underdog clan because a majority of those clans are simply mini versions of the dom clan, blinded by competition and hate for the dominant clan and if they were to come to power, would do the exact same things the previous dominant clan did (we’ve already seen it with clans like Havoc, Nova, Pegasus and Toxic).

VR needs to take back control of their own game and stop letting players run wild with it, doing whatever they want, slowly destroying this once great game that OTM has built up all those years ago. It’s no secret that this game has lost its charm, and the players are the ones to blame with the lack of content coming in second. But what good does making new content do when the players will just take it and destroy it. This game still has so much potential. It’s like a gold mine yet to be uncovered

Rip I didn’t realize this was a fixed action RPG, my bad, it was open world.

Oh one other cool fun fact, the game doesn’t revolve around your singular preferences .-. As said by myself and legit some of your own Eponians as well as a myriad of players from all over the globe and game, people like dom servers and people like Epona. .-. Both work, both succeed, both make the game money, and both make people happy.That should be enough to close this case I’m not saying your opinions are invalid, I’m saying your argument lacks warrants and sufficient backing.

I’m trying to make this game feel more like an open world game where players can’t place restrictions on whatever they feel like and where players can do as they please. You can still do dkp if you want under the new loot distribution, but you won’t be able to assert dominance over everyone else or tell others what they can or can’t do. That will and should be VRs job. And good luck trying to get dkp to work because I can bet you once players realize they no longer have to work part time for their gear, they’ll never want to touch dkp again lol. Some clans on Epona have even used dom clan systems and rules, only players don’t join them because they’re forced to, rather because they want to. Everyone is better off, everyone is happy. A 100% open world game needs 100% freedom in order to be successful and grow, and dominance/server rules do just the opposite of that.

In doing so you are calling for VR to step in and put restrictions on the game, to restrict player freedom. Don't you see the irony, the hypocrisy?Whether its John Locke, Hobbes, or Rousseau, people come together and form societies based around1) their interests2) protection of those interests3) constraints based off how they view the otherEpona, Gwyd, Arawn, Sulis, Herne, Danu, Morrigan, Mabon, etc, etc, etc... Each server has had its own history, its own players, and as such has its own interests, its own ideas on how to protect those interests, and has set up constraints based off how they view others. Epona has its ban list for players it considers hostile to the server, no different than a dom clan. Epona has constraints on how well geared your toon needs to be, the opposite of a dom server (someone with legit nothing can show up and earn gear over time).

Idr who it was, but someone once said the definition of freedom is the ability to make mistakes. I don't personally think quotes themselves are arguments for anything, but I like the way that quote puts it. Players in their freedom made the servers how they wanted them to be. That is freedom. Is it right? if not you will see servers rebel and change occur, look at Mabon, Sulis, Rosmerta, Morrigan, etc, etc... All you want to do is force what you think is ideal on the world. That isn't freedom, but the opposite of it.

Zkills, how can you say “ A 100% open world game needs 100% freedom in order to be successful and grow” then ask the developers to restrict the way we choose to play by forcing us all to adopt the methods you??

How can you say “it’s not about preferences” but my preference is what’s best for the game, when no one can guarantee the success of your plan?? (If I missed you citing another game that follows the mechanic you want implemented with successful results please quote yourself)

You talk about competition being what’s hurting this game, but the lack of competition is causing many of my clan mates to go inactive. Competing is the reason why many of us play this game!! It’s not rocket science. It is a part of so many people’s lives. Why do you think sports are such a big deal on a global scale?? Humans love competing in the real world. That’s why competition and dom clans exist in this game.

Then there is hard work. Have you heard of that? It’s something you do to achieve what you want in life. It’s why senior members at a workplace tend to make more money than new members. I have heard of many people leaving Epona because they are sick of people who have barely played on the server compared to them getting the best drops that become available. Dkp systems allow players who have contributed more than others to win better rewards. A concept that is synonymous with the REAL WORLD. How would you feel in ten years if you were let’s say, an accomplished game designer, with a chance to design a brand new game, but your company decides to roll a rice and give that opportunity to someone far less experienced and less accomplished than you are?? That doesn’t happen in the real world man. This parallel to the real world is a big part of what makes this game successful.

The freedom we have been given in this game by the devs enables us to choose the way we want to play, either it be free or dom servers. It’s clear from these last 11 pages that people disagree with you, and that simple choice should mean that the way we play this game should not be restricted, either free or dom.

I’m not the only person who feels the same way in regards to the above points I have mentioned. Please respect the values of the community and stop asking for VR to further restrict how we play this game.