This Site is currently looking like a bombsite:
About 20 'live' threads & approx 500 posts!
Lots of erudite considered views but mixed up between overlapping topics.
I would like clarity on the one issue which IMHO will affect all of us most:

"Would Sale Sharks please make a formal statement to their supporters on how we are all going to get to Barton"!

We all support Dimes and BK in their ambitions on the rugby field. Next season we should be looking to:
* Be in the top 4 of the Premiership
* Be in the HC
* Be attracting around 10k crowds

The Stadium currently struggles to get 5k supporters to & from the Reds Friday night games.
The (part) WGIs won't be complete for 3 years.

Here's the reason why we won't be getting any answer from the management or their PR men.

In the midst of a mutal admiration session between the club's PR handout man and supposedly fearless and independent journalist Neil Leigh contained in Neil Leigh Twitter , Dave Swanton gives away just what the club thinks about the dedicated fans who have chosen to express their sincerely held feelings in this forum:

I must say this does all have an us against them mentality to it. I like Swanny, he used to be on my facebook. But he has been known for making the occasional sly comment towards the fans on certain sites and I don't care if I get into trouble for that.

While we're on the subject, without naming any names, this place does seem to be very quiet on the front of certain people who are either part of the SSSC or attend the away games very frequently. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if they got told what was happening weeks ago but have been told to keep it all quiet.

If I'm honest I've calmed down a bit since the other day. As I imagine others have. I still don't think I'll be as big a supporter as I was but I still wish success for the club, whatever the name, whatever the location. Reading comments like that, however malicious or not they may be does take the mick a bit.

There are people who inhale the happy gas, who think their views are normal. That cuts all ways, through all groups, and this "club" will be no exception. The more the "club" becomes a "club" the more it will think its views are normal, right, accepted and acceptable.

addendum: just to add in, I am meaning all groups with in a club fit into this. One tends to gravitate naturally to people of like minded views, which re-enforces those views.

mako shark, I know I won't get any answer from Dimes, never mind a straight answer. I just want to 'rack up' the embarrassment that I hope they feel for ignoring the people who pay their wages.

There are two reasons why they won't/can't reply:
1 For the reasons you give.
2 Because there isn't an answer.

'There isn't an answer' because there is no way that 10,000 supporters can get there in reasonable time, convenience or cost! Why haven't they taken that into account? Because either:
1 They haven't bothered to find it out!
2 They don't care since their money will primarily come from other means, eg: Hospitality!

Rugbydonmako shark, I know I won't get any answer from Dimes, never mind a straight answer. I just want to 'rack up' the embarrassment that I hope they feel for ignoring the people who pay their wages.

mmmmm I must have imagined sitting in front of Dimes on Tuesday night asking him questions on the Barton move and getting straight answers as well.

As to ignoring those who pay his wages I can't imagine him being so rude to Ian Blackmore and Brian Kennedy...

mako sharkRubydon,
Here's the reason why we won't be getting any answer from the management or their PR men.

In the midst of a mutal admiration session between the club's PR handout man and supposedly fearless and independent journalist Neil Leigh contained in Neil Leigh Twitter , Dave Swanton gives away just what the club thinks about the dedicated fans who have chosen to express their sincerely held feelings in this forum:

I am surprised anyone is surprised. It's not like we've not discussed this before on these pages. People should look at Ryanair and see that they have just decided to dispense with the silky PR front. Underneath it all, they're pretty much all the same. And as has been clear for some time now, RU has mostly dispensed with what was actually the 'USP' that is the holy grail for these people.

Customers are ten a penny. Fans cost much more. The thing is, fans have a much longer shelf life and the false economy will eventually catch up with itself.

This story is old, I know. But it goes on.

A rush and a push and the land that we stand on is ours
It has been before
So it shall be again
And people who are uglier than you and I
They take what they need, and just leave

Gordon 1974, Dimes did not answer the question on access on Tuesday night. He said Sale will put buses on from Cheshire Towns if needed and stated that the WGIs (part) is out to tender!

The WGIs will not be in place for several years and the full scheme some years beyond that Also the tram seems uncertain.

Dedicated buses are welcome but as H's D and others have estimated they are hardly going to touch the problem.

If you want to understand the reasons for concern, read the numerous posts under various threads on the issue! If SS had engaged with their supporters 5 months ago when this kicked off the outcome IMHO would have been quite different.

The bulk of Sale Sharks' income comes from their supporters one way or another. BK wants to achieve a break-even next season.

Dimes has now agreed to come down off his high horse and talk to supporters over the name change but I tend to agree with others that this is a smoke screen for embarrassment over the Barton problems.

He did say that the A57 work to move the round about and put in a dual carriageway would start in August and be completed in 12 months. Furthermore he also indicated that one of the problems at the moment was the poor traffic management system on leaving Barton after a game, which he was adamant that the club could manage better. He also indicated that many lessons would be learnt by the experiences of Salford Reds throughout the season

Considering how much has been said on on this forum I am very much surprised more people from here weren't at the event last week. They would then been able to say everything they have written here to his face.....

I'm sorry J Moon, but you're barking up the wrong tree there. Members of the SSSC were told nothing about any of this earlier than the rest of the supporters. We found out about it when everyone else did - so no conspiracy theories or smoking guns I'm sorry to say ....

I sit with approx 10 other ST holders, and at half time on Friday night I asked them all if they were going to renew their ST's, 9 men and 1 women all gave the same answer, pay for first home game a see, if a disaster, cherry pick and or watch rugby on the Television. Biggest reason? Most of us just make the kick time at EP as we work until 5pm. The journey to the ground is the problem.

Booked our tickets for this friday Salford v Wigan on line to see what the ground's like. Decide I want to try it because enjoy rugby occassion/ night too much to be put off watching Sale (esp Ritchie Gray etc) without seeing what it's like.

Mind you, maybe neither will taking an interest, but to learn is better than to remain in ignorance - or so my long suffering teachers tried to tell me.

And yes, I know all about spin, PR and other modern day ills (why can't people just tell the truth, except to HMRC and The Vice Squad, of course). Why this pathetic obsession with obfuscation that besets so much of life these days?

No matter what you say, or how you say it, someone somewhere will deliberately go out of their way to be offended.

I just popped over here to see if there would be any banter up for grabs before Friday night & now I am utterly depressed.

Something has obviously gone horribly wrong. I used to quote this message board as an example of how well a club could get on with its supporters, the communication from Dave Swanton was superb, it all worked so well for the benefit of both club & supporters.

You have my sympathy, you must all feel like the club couldn't give a toss about you, certainly no feeling of being valued supporters or an essential part of the club.

We may be taking a year out, bit of a sabbatical, some time off. If we do I hope things are sorted out by the time we get back. There has always been a good relationship between Sale & Newcastle, as fellow supporters we don't like to see you so demoralised.

I am still around and check on the board from time to time, mainly when I can.
I will if the consensus of opinion on here want me to return on a more regular basis, but I stopped posting as often as I did as it’s a supporters board at the end of the day and it was pointed out to me there were things I shouldn’t be commenting on. Fair enough.
I am always available on
Tel 0161-286-8915
Email dave.swanton@salesharks.com
If you ask a question and I can answer it I will, if not as I always have done I will see if I can find the answer and come back to you.
Anyway enough from me, if you want me to participate more let me know and I will, if not, again, let me know and I will keep my nose out.

I am sure you are right. I did have something on last Tuesday, but could have got around it if I thought there was any point.

I suppose this also makes discussion of the roof a waste of time. I did wonder whether Mozzer might have any comments on the "Premier League Audit" thread but he seems to have been "away" until today and so now I don't know whether he thinks it not worth discussing or whether he hasn't seen it because it's dropped so far down the list.

Monkey1 thank you for your kind comments

Swanny, I was certainly disappointed when you disappeared from this board. When the Fans Forum disappeared too, and the Sale/ County forum never got off the ground it did seem as though you were being less publicly accessible, though I acknowledge that you are always available for a "one to one"
I think it would be good to have you back on here more often.

Going back to the HsDs comment that I started this with, perhaps the CEO is not quite as entrenched as we all think.

We may not always have seen eye to eye, and as you well know the relationship between us has been somewhat exciting from time to time, nor do I expect that we shall always see eye to eye in the future, but part of your job title is Supporter Liaison and we are supporters - love us or loathe us.

There are those, with whom I disagree strongly, who call this The Negativity Board. Well, it is partly your absence which causes a perception like that. When rumour or speculation starts, it only gets "worse" if there is no correction or comment from the Club or wherever.

Unlike some of the posters on here, I don't expect us to be told every single detail of every single development and I, and am sure most others, would be happy with a comment along the lines of yours above: I can't go into detail ... sorry

I mean look at the amazing response that reply generated from young H's D! Not what you would normally expect, surely!

I know you have been attacked personally in the past (but then most of us have received a drubbing on here, but not to the sustained level you sometimes seem to have suffered) and I would urge some posters to express their views a tad more moderately, but weather the storm, ignore the t*ssers (me as well, if you feel that I fall into that category) - but get back posting.

As a PR man, I would expect you to have the skin of an armour-plated rhinoceros.

No matter what you say, or how you say it, someone somewhere will deliberately go out of their way to be offended.

I certainly would like to see you back on this board, Swanny. As people have said, the lack of any information from the club leads to all sorts of speculation, some of which may be ill-founded.

Those of us who work/have worked in a business environment are well aware that 'I am unable to comment at this stage' can sometimes be the only response at a given point in time but at least it is a response and we won't feel that we are being totally ignored.

Neil Leigh in the MENThe club had originally called a press conference for today leading to speculation that an agreement had been struck between the Sharks and ground owners Peel Holdings and Salford City Council.
However, that was then cancelled and it is understood the finer details of any potential tie-up with Salford City Reds, who have already moved in at Barton, are still being scrutinised.

H's DWhy didn't you ask and post that last September SandDancer?
Ive been putting such impressions of fellow supporter intentions up for the last 9 months, but few others have!

If a few more of us had................

Sorry H's D but the impact of Barton had not really surfaced last September, It was really a question borne out of frustration last Friday. The answers did surprise me I must say as we are all died in wool, cut my head off I bleed Blue SS supporters. But we are all going to give the first home game a go and if it goes well my ST's will be renewed.

The few I know willing to give it a go have said the same to me Sanddancer.
The club will be apoplectic with worry that so few will renew pre-season.
However I urge you to go to Barton before then. Or you may be put off in September.
The possible impact HAD surfaced on here Sandancer.
I started pointing out the access problems last May!

IMHO the shuttle buses will probably run from the Trafford Centre which will be used for parking. I am sure a cost will be attached.
As public transport links to the Trafford Centre improve so will they improve for Barton.

I fear Barton road will be chocker-block after each match for half an hour or more. Unlike Edgeley there will be no-where pleasant to go for a drink post match waiting for traffic to disperse..
These are two of the main problems in my view.
We will also be playing during the day at the week-end as Friday nights would be impossible because of congestion for two months in the run up to Xmas.

I've been trying to draw everyone's attention to it on here ever since then! Especially after September when I knew we were moving.
I still can't believe they are still going for Fridays! Its absolutely CRAZY!!

That seems to be the big concern for myself and those I sit with. We'd like to stay sitting together but the only way to do so is splash out several hundred pounds each for STs, which is a big gamble if the logistics turn out to be awful.

The club could always let fans buy STs but, for up to say 3 matches of the season, offer a refund for the unused games if the ST holder decided they couldn't cope with Barton.

Finally, aren't ST sales in May a really important chunk of cash flow for the club over the summer, so if we mostly wait and see rather than buying STs, how will they keep going until we start buying game by game in September?

The 'only' plus point I can see is that as Barton has standing behind the posts, so you dont have to have a season tkt to be sure of being next to your mates. My thinking is to go to an open day & check it all out - if there is one. Then switch to a 'pay as you go' basis for the standing ends. And I can then skip the games that get switched inconveniently to Sat/Sun pm when the TC & M60 are jammed due to shoppers & Utd supporters.

As I live in Sale my 'master plan' - should we move... would be to cycle to Barton & bypass all the traffic queues. Not perfect in bad weather, but I am used to it as I bike to work most days. Almost certain to be quicker than driving.

There's a small toll bridge (5p/10p) if memory serves that crosses the canal between Warburton and Rixton so the journey out through Carrington / Partington would be long but not impossible. There are also other bridges on the Trafford Park side of Barton Bridge.

Hold on...shaking my head reading some of the early comments on this particular thread (referring to the critics of the media guys twitter pages).

It is an assumption that the twitter comments were about things written by folk on here. It may be an educated guess but nothing explicitly saying so was said.

Secondly, and unless I'm mistaken, both of the twitter accounts referred to say clearly "all views are my own", not that of employers. We have all had an opinion and been able to separate that from our jobs and just get on with it.

Phrases like "contempt of the fans", "true feelings towards supporters". Please!? Back in your box. Jeez

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