tell me where i act like sprint cup is the only level? i am mearly stating some drivers are cut out for it some arent, hence the lesser talented series, im a diehard schrader fan so dont tell me how he ran, he last won in 91, but im not a fool he had a avg career, btw schraders last year at hendrick, he was r&d for the 24 and 5 teams, this is why i dont like debating with you, you pick and choose and proclaim im saying something im not, i dont do that with the stuff you say, heck i even build your stuff up when your cryin about jamie, but whatever, if those guys had talent, they be in cup, tod bodine had many of chances in cup never succeeded, jack sprauge multi champ in the truck, couldnt do anything in cup, mike skinner, nothing and he drove for RCR if these guys had the talent the big teams would pick them up, but they dont, so let them stay in truck and NW so they can have a sporting chance, thats all i was getting at, but your mr positive and find negative #### that isnt even bein said.

Schrader wasnt the greatest driver in Nascar, but he was better than his stats show. Also later on with hendrick he had some of the worst luck ever. Whether it was being wrecked by teammates or dominating a race & some 89 cent part breaks on the car. He seriously had some crazy bad luck while whipping everyone on the track. Also early on he was touted to race Indy cars & even was gonnaa have a ride when he decided to go to cup instead. There were people in Indy upset that he turned his back on Indy cars. (dont know all the particuars of it though) Like I said he wasnt the best cup driver but was one of the better over all race car drivers in america. He could have easily of had double digit wins if he simply had no luck at all. (since most of his luck was bad)Often times fans get caught up in stats, instead of what is happening actually on the tracks.

i never picked a driver cuz they win all the time, i enjoyed kenny's personality and the way he carries himself, same reason i liked ryan and JJ, everyone thinks JJ is dull, he is far from it, but that is for another time, i was in the hospital that yr schrader was leading the coke 600, i was laying there, thinking "how cool is this dude?" just days before he gets his thumb cut off, because someone turned on the engine while he was looking around, and this bad #### is out there driving, i was so disappointing when his car died, and what did kenny say in the interview ? " well atleast i have a case of bud in the hauler to drink." always funny, even when things gone bad, just like a few month later at dega when gordon turned into schrader and kenny went flipping down the backstretch, he came out all bruised and blood in the one eye and said " i wasnt that pretty before the accident."he than had to get on the radio to calm jeff down cuz he was crying thinking her hurt kenny. to me kenny is nascar, he didnt have the wins finished in the top 5 in points once, but it didnt matter, he is just a cool guy, all i was saying is that some drivers are made to race in cup others arent, and find success elsewhere.

Schmoopy1000 wrote:Schrader wasnt the greatest driver in Nascar, but he was better than his stats show. Also later on with hendrick he had some of the worst luck ever. Whether it was being wrecked by teammates or dominating a race & some 89 cent part breaks on the car. He seriously had some crazy bad luck while whipping everyone on the track. Also early on he was touted to race Indy cars & even was gonnaa have a ride when he decided to go to cup instead. There were people in Indy upset that he turned his back on Indy cars. (dont know all the particuars of it though) Like I said he wasnt the best cup driver but was one of the better over all race car drivers in america. He could have easily of had double digit wins if he simply had no luck at all. (since most of his luck was bad)Often times fans get caught up in stats, instead of what is happening actually on the tracks.

Totally agree with you on this schmoopy,there is no doubt Kenny can and has always been able to wheel any race car he has been in. Mario Andretti was asked who he thought were some of the best drivers ever and he said too many variables,differant eras,ect.so it would be impossable to know for sure and aside throwing a few good names out,he wouldn't or couldn't say or did he want to get boxed into that question. Stats are one thing,but how do you really measure a drivers talent? The one thing for sure is,alot of drivers could learn a thing or two about public speaking and talking with fans,cuz there is no one better than Kenny Shrader when it comes to that.Dale Snr.and Kenny were good friends,but even so,Dale knew Kenny was better than his stats.Really wished Dale put Kenny in a third car rather than Michael Waltrip,i never really understood that.

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in 05' Kenny raced at our local dirt track where we raced (the LLM in my avatar) on the weekend of the cup race in Sonoma. He was probably one of the coolest people ever. He B.S.ed with everyone in the pits signed stuff, & just kicked it with everyone, telling stories like he was just one of us. He drove the promoters car which they could never get the handle of (they tried throughout the week I would listen to them from my house) So he took a crap handling car & finished 7th in it in the Extreme late model class. I remember all of us crew & LLM drivers sat in the same area of the stands during the race, & when one of the racers spun down from the outside lane coming out of two, right in front of Schrader. I realy dont know how, but he got it slowed down enough turned towards the wall & missed the car that spun in ffront of him & still got it straightened out before getting into the wall & just kept going. Just about every driver I was sitting with that was there from the LLM class basically said some form of Holy $h!t. Then a driver right next to me said I would have creamed that guy. No way I would have missed him. After the Main Schrader had to leave fairly quickly since they were a couple hours from Sonoma & he was racing the cup car the next morning. But during the day he was very accessable. He is a great ammbassador of our sport for sure. Tony Stewart came down too, to watch him, but back then he wasnt friendly at all.

MJ when someone points out how to act or talk all you can do is insult them. That is a sign of weakness.

How can you judge if a driver is good enough to race in cup or not?? Look at Dale Jarrett or Mark Martin. They sucked in cup at first, went back into the lower ranks and ended up having amazing cup careers and Mark is still racing today.

Even if your on a good team doesn't mean your getting a fair share. You mentioned Ken being an r&d driver at HMS. Well Look no farther from JB when he was at Roush. He struggled there and he was a nw champ at the time and went on to win a truck title! He did end up winning in cup though.

Mike Bliss may be the best driver without a good cup ride. The dude has done some great things in cars not very capable of much. Yet he is in the nns. So he doesn't deserve to race in cup.

Not everyone is JJ or Tony or Jeff. If Casey Mears, David Ragan, Joey Logano, and AJ Allmendinger deserve to be in cup so do Johnny Sauter, Todd Bodine and Ron Hornaday.

Schmoopy1000 wrote:in 05' Kenny raced at our local dirt track where we raced (the LLM in my avatar) on the weekend of the cup race in Sonoma. He was probably one of the coolest people ever. He B.S.ed with everyone in the pits signed stuff, & just kicked it with everyone, telling stories like he was just one of us. He drove the promoters car which they could never get the handle of (they tried throughout the week I would listen to them from my house) So he took a crap handling car & finished 7th in it in the Extreme late model class. I remember all of us crew & LLM drivers sat in the same area of the stands during the race, & when one of the racers spun down from the outside lane coming out of two, right in front of Schrader. I realy dont know how, but he got it slowed down enough turned towards the wall & missed the car that spun in ffront of him & still got it straightened out before getting into the wall & just kept going. Just about every driver I was sitting with that was there from the LLM class basically said some form of Holy $h!t. Then a driver right next to me said I would have creamed that guy. No way I would have missed him. After the Main Schrader had to leave fairly quickly since they were a couple hours from Sonoma & he was racing the cup car the next morning. But during the day he was very accessable. He is a great ammbassador of our sport for sure. Tony Stewart came down too, to watch him, but back then he wasnt friendly at all.

Tony has been here twice {Lebonan Valley} lets just say most could care less if he ever comes back and leave it at that.Kenny Shrader was here recently this year and has been here several times over the years and not once did anyone ever regret him being here.Kenny is excactly like you say Schmoopy and we always look forward to his visits.The other issues with some drivers today is how much money they donate and how they have to let the public know it.The heart is a wonderfull thing if given from it,taxe write offs is another to which all wealthy people do as corps.ect.Time and effort combined says a whole lot more about ones character,the money donation part,Dale Earnhardt seemed to do that best as a few others,"from the Heart" and don't tell anyone i did this. Dale and Kenny are of the few and it seems every year it becomes fewer,the whole atmosphere of Nascar just begins to sicken me as to what it once was and what it has become.Pick anything,i becomes harder and harder to find much positive in it.Thank God for Dirt and WOO or i would have no interest in much of it at all.The original topic of RedBull pulling out,i honestly don't care,i'd rather seem them involved with Dirt like Lucas Oils does.

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