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We all know that national security counts big in the US and that privacy and due process are kind irrelevant when that enters the picture. I was just curious, since political discussion lately died down on here, if people still care at all. I personally really am optimistic for the world as a whole and how it develops, but this is kinda a sting in the side for me.
So whats all of you guys' take on the Snowden affair, he brought on some change in a matter, even if its miniscule and what do you think does it say about the US nation (that is seemingly under dire threat right now, by commie terror devils).

Also, no summery, because I believe that the news who talk about this deserve the traffic, as long as people are still allowed to read the news without being punished immediately. (I mean of course they are already profiling everyone and building a case against you too just to be ready when you make a joke about the wrong thing, or something... Also its mostly metadata, which means that they can leave out anything that doesn't fit the story they are going to present at your mock trial. Maybe even the Pres will step up and prejudice your case, if need arises.)
Is this shit really worth it?
Looking forward to any pros contras and insights.

Nothing good comes from this spying. Mainly due to the success rate of such being so low. The waste of resources and the regard for basic human rights is disgusting at best. In regards to the monitoring and depending on the person, this either instills a sense of false security or fear. Neither are good for a healthy society. As far as Obama and his purposed changes, I highly doubt they will change for the better, even if they spin it to seem that way. For a man who supposedly pushes for equality, I don't see him living in a glass house for the world to peer into. Then and only then could I possibly take his words seriously. But little too late, considering my distaste for the man as it is. Anyone who uses victims, including children, to push for an agenda that promotes tyranny, is not a man who I can respect, let alone consider to be a real man. I care not for who views this as I post my words with pride. I do not fear my government. But my government should fear me, alongside every other citizen of the United States.

Welcome to the internet censorship club. Join the world community of internet censorship.

inb4 US makes SSH tunneling software illegal.

Well at least we get to live in a balanced socio-economic system where the lower class receives ample distribution of wealth to pay for living expenses and there is no ethnic/class/gender discrimination. /sarcasm (And while I'm ranting - **** animal cruelty!!)

I am really bothered about one thing:
If national security really matters to you and you have to make the decision wether to continue to employ the NSA, lets first look at my list of points and ask why:
- The budget the NSA requests for its ops are secret, so you wouldnt know how much it is you will have to pay.
- It is definitely more than the fbi gets, which isnt secret.
- The information about what they do with the monsy is secret.
- This includes their works results.
- When they actually tell you what they do, it could be untrue, because by giving you arguments against them, as they are responsible for national security would mean that they are not doing what they call their job.
- In fact they never once did not lie.
- They think that you know that they exist already could be used as an argument against them, which is why they actually think its bad you know at all.
- The reason for all this behaviour is, that you might not want to pay them the money, or become so diselusioned with people who do, that you might convert others against it. (Also all the people in some remote country might get some snipets by word of mouth, mind you those dangerous resourceful people often cant even read their own alphabet).
- While doing so is at a moment not legally a crime, talking to someone who does say anything against the US and their millitary global involvement can simply be killed on the suspicion of "when you did talk you probably did more than talk". This already happened to a thousands of foreighners and a dozen Americans.
- All of those decisions are based on information the NSA keeps and that they can manipulate and do manipulate at will. Say you didn't actually call Al Zawahiri? No problem. The new truth is only a few keystrokes away.
- One day the NSA will have shut down enough of the internet and the passive mass media to move on to talking not just over the phone. However, if you cant talk over the phone, the bigger reach and the major portion of your rights are already gone. After the web they are just closing the gaps they left out.
- While the process of turning the historical example of Germany into a facist state took over 120something years, It was a steady trend. You need to reverse that trend at some point, or the wave naturally grows to the crashing point. We won't be alive (barely), if we are lucky.
After I am done with the cons, here are the pros:
+ Even though the info the NSA gives us, or the Pres, or Congress is all lies, it's scarey lies. Since we are on average dumb, the only way to convince us of our actual savety completely is giving them money, so they stop scaring us. (Which they say of course they will. "The war on terror will be over when the last terrorist was killed".
And I ask you, do you want the total war on terror?)

- The reason for all this behaviour is, that you might not want to pay them the money, or become so diselusioned with people who do, that you might convert others against it.

But what does it have to do with National Security? Have they caught the organizations responsible for the assassination of Kennedy, the sabotaging of the Pentagon missile defenses on 9/11, and the sabotaging of our aerospace defense during 9/11, election fraud, the assassination of Andrew Breitbart, and the planting of chemical weapons in Syria? No? Not yet? Well I guess we need to give them a bigger budget!!

Originally Posted by Ronin

- One day the NSA will have shut down enough of the internet and the passive mass media to move on to talking not just over the phone. However, if you cant talk over the phone, the bigger reach and the major portion of your rights are already gone. After the web they are just closing the gaps they left out.

That's stupid.

"The war on terror will be over when the last terrorist was killed".

And a terrorist is anyone who asks delicate questions?

Originally Posted by Jin-Roh

If you just go by who killed more, suddenly the US is worst than nearly everyone the US has fought. So unless you want to be put on the terrorist watch list and risk having the government locking you away your entire life without a trial of evidence of wrong doing, possibly being sentenced to be executed, I suggest you say that America is the best country ever.