Urdu/Hindi: Female equivalent of "maa'ii kaa laal".

When a man challenges another man, especially in the film world, one often hears " ko'ii hai maa'ii kaa laal jo....". If a woman was in that kind of mood, how would she address other women to seek out a female counterpart?

The point is that such challenges (ko'ii hai maa'ii kaa laal jo....) are issued by those members of the human species who have a Y chromosome and consequently high levels of testosterone. Since women have neither we really don’t have a feminine of ‘laal’ - at least not in this sense that I can think of at present.

From my line of work, even the absence of the Y chromosome does not stop many a female from portraying those characteristics which one would normally expect a possessor of a Y chromosome to have! Besides, this is an exercise in language. Just imagine a female equivalent of Bruce Lee coming up with the challenge!

From my line of work, even the absence of the Y chromosome does not stop many a female from portraying those characteristics which one would normally expect a possessor of a Y chromosome to have! Besides, this is an exercise in language. Just imagine a female equivalent of Bruce Lee coming up with the challenge!

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Of course I know what you mean! But as this kind of language goes it has until recently been very much a male domain! A female Bruce Lee challenging a male would of course use the same expression! But if she were to challenge another female ... now that is a challenge! I mean to look for an equivalent expression. I can't recall any film where such a scene took place and such an expression was uttered by one woman to another!

Needless to say there are gender neutral expressions which members of either sex can use, viz. ko'ii hai jo meraa muqaabalah kare! / ko'ii hai jo mere muqaabale ko nilkle! Just like the old Arabic expression: hal min mubaariz!

When a man challenges another man, especially in the film world, one often hears " ko'ii hai maa'ii kaa laal jo....". If a woman was in that kind of mood, how would she address other women to seek out a female counterpart?

I took it to mean more like a mama's boy, but thought based on the thread contents that it had some other meaning. Yes, I remember the 'laal' thread. Thanks.

Hmmm.

The priest of the sweeper caste:—lāl-begiyā, s.m. A follower of Lāl-Beg

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That's really interesting...I have heard people use laal-baig to refer to cockroaches (not sure if this is slang). I had no idea that it was a caste reference. Is this the same word. I have also heard roach called laal-pabakkar (or something like that, though not bujhakkar). I always thought this laal was a reference to the reddish-brown coloring. But it must be this 'laal' here provided in the dictionary entry.

It has been suggested by Neha Ladha on Hindi-Urdu Flasgship's Hindi Spken Thesaurus that someone could use the idiom:

"Aap kii HIMMAT?!" to challenge someone. Could this be an equivalent for women?

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In a word, no! "aap kii / tumhaarii/ terii himmat?!" can be said by either a male or a female to members of their own or opposite sex. It is totally gender neutral! In idiomatic English it'll be "how dare you!". An equivalent of this is "aap kii / tumhaarii/ terii majaal?!"

In a word, no! "aap kii / tumhaarii/ terii himmat?!" can be said by either a male or a female to members of their own or opposite sex. It is totally gender neutral! In idiomatic English it'll be "how dare you!". An equivalent of this is "aap kii / tumhaarii/ terii majaal?!"

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hmm. I didn't know it had to be female-only. I'm afraid we will never find an equivalent.

Do you mean "how dare you?" or "i dare you!" ? She made it seem as if it were "I dare you".

Originally Posted by Faylasoof
In a word, no! "aap kii / tumhaarii/ terii himmat?!" can be said by either a male or a female to members of their own or opposite sex. It is totally gender neutral! In idiomatic English it'll be "how dare you!". An equivalent of this is "aap kii / tumhaarii/ terii majaal?!"

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hmm. I didn't know it had to be female-only. I'm afraid we will never find an equivalent.

Do you mean "how dare you?" or "i dare you!" ? She made it seem as if it were "I dare you".

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I mean this: "how dare you?" for the above expressions with himmat and majaal.

... and yes we are looking for a female equivalent of maa'ii kaa laal !

QP SaaHib, as we use it and as many Urdu lexicons say as well, "maaN kii jaa'ii" literally means "maaN kii beTii", jaa'ii being just the feminine of "jaayaa", both were mentioned here (posts # 5 & 6). If you are asking for a feminine of "laal". then I'm not sure if we have one.

Let me chime in with my perception which is new but is not necessarily corrct, though.

I think we don't need any female equivalent here.

ko'ii maa'ii kaa la3l - a ruby stone (very big mostly) carressed and looked after by mothers - and by eponymy, applied to sons? (meaning that it is well cherished, good upbrought and precious). I may be at least indulging into folk etymology, but I think it is right...

Let me chime in with my perception which is new but is not necessarily corrct, though.

I think we don't need any female equivalent here.

ko'ii maa'ii kaa la3l - a ruby stone (very big mostly) carressed and looked after by mothers - and by eponymy, applied to sons? (meaning that it is well cherished, good upbrought and precious). I may be at least indulging into folk etymology, but I think it is right...

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Believe it or not marrish and QP SaaHibaan, there is a feminine of لال laal ! It is لالڑی laalRii !!

So now we can finish the exercise: “ ko’ii hai maa’ii kii laalRiijo ...!”

The expression as QP SaaHib gave is always with laal. Same meaning as laaDlaa, feminine laaDlii.

While لعل is Arabic, I'm not sure if takes لعلة / لعله as a feminine form and whether it would even fit in this usage. I guess not.

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Faylasoof SaaHib.When marrish SaaHib used "maa'ii kaa la3l" in Roman and you replied by using "laal" in Urdu script, I got the strange feeling that marrish SaaHib is possibly implying that the word "laal" is or should be "la3l". I know we have discussed this in a seperate thread but looking at the definions for "laal" in Platts, I have got a bit confused. I think Platts is (at least) implying that "laal" (red) is the "bigRii shakl" of "la3l" (ruby). I still think that it is Jawahar La3l Nahru but we shall not go into this yet again.

Faylasoof SaaHib.When marrish SaaHib used "maa'ii kaa la3l" in Roman and you replied by using "laal" in Urdu script, I got the strange feeling that marrish SaaHib is possibly implying that the word "laal" is or should be "la3l". I know we have discussed this in a seperate thread but looking at the definions for "laal" in Platts, I have got a bit confused. I think Platts is (at least) implying that "laal" (red) is the "bigRii shakl" of "la3l" (ruby). I still think that it is Jawahar La3l Nahru but we shall not go into this yet again.

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Actually, QP SaaHIb, laal is listed in standard Urdu dictionaries for both ruby (la3l) but also for a ‘favourite son’ and anyone who says maa’ii would also be expected to say the Indic laal and not the Arabic la3l.

The feminine of laal is listed in several Urdu lexicons as laalRii. Unlike laaDlaa / laaDlii, it seems to alter internally by adding ‘R’ before ending in the usual change of –aa to –ii to give the feminine.

Believe it or not marrish and QP SaaHibaan, there is a feminine of لال laal ! It is لالڑی laalRii !!

So now we can finish the exercise: “ ko’ii hai maa’ii kii laalRiijo ...!”

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I apologize for such a long delay in acknowledging your suggestion. I meant to come back to it but for some reason it slipped my mind to do so.

Yes, "laalRii" is an excellent suggestion and a perfect idiomatic equivalent for the challenge put forward from the female perspective. I have good mind to suggest that "maa'ii-laalRii" could be an innovation for a "challenge" in Alfaaz SaaHib's "challenge" thread.