While watching some older PPV's on tape, I noticed that back in those days, when a wrestler would submit to a hold, he would nod his head, thereby signaling that he gave up, or they would employ the old "arm drops 3 times when the ref lifts it up" stuff. They never used the "tapping out" like they do today. In fact, at WMX, Bret "tapped" while in Owen's sharpshooter...of course, back then it was just an indication of him showing that he was in pain or psyching himself up to try to escape, but it brings up the question...Why did wrestlers adopt the "tapping out" as the universal "I give up" signal? I noticed that they began doing that around the time that Shamrock was in the WWF, and I have seen the tap-out used in the UFC matches. Makes you wonder if Shamrock gave Vince the idea to use it, or if Vince was more aware of the UFC now that he had one of UFC's stars working for his promotion. Any ideas?

Originally posted by TwisterF5Why did wrestlers adopt the "tapping out" as the universal "I give up" signal? I noticed that they began doing that around the time that Shamrock was in the WWF, and I have seen the tap-out used in the UFC matches. Makes you wonder if Shamrock gave Vince the idea to use it, or if Vince was more aware of the UFC now that he had one of UFC's stars working for his promotion. Any ideas?

I'm pretty sure it was something along those lines, but I'm not certain. The timing does indicate that Shamrock's hiring was the reason it happened, and I would kind of just assume Shamrock gave the idea to some of the people he wrestled, so that it would stay consistent with his MMA background and make him look like the real deal. After that, it probably just caught on since it's way better than nodding your head or having your arm drop three times.

And wrestlers still do that thing where they hit the mat in agony, and now that the tap-out IS the universal signal for giving up, it's really annoying.

The first time I saw Shamrock in the WWF the announcers made a point of mentioning tapping out as how submissions were earned in the UFC. Since Shamrock was pushed as being from the UFC, I think it was done to lend some additional credibility to Shamrock. Kind of like showing he's a UFC guy, not just a pro-wrestler.

Also, it gives something for the fans to react to. Someone tapping is an action the fans will pick up on more and will cheer/boo quicker and prob. louder. And without tapping, we wouldn't have had the "You Tapped Out" chants for Brock

I see two sides to this. It could be true about the Shamrock/Taz business. But I could also see it as being a lame way to try and show how tough a character is because he didn't say "I Quit." Saying that was always a big deal. Especially when you had I Quit matches like Foley/Rock and Flair/Funk. It was important. It kind of takes away from a submission hold nowadays because the wrestler will yell "Ask him!" but the only way we know the person gives up is by tapping.

Originally posted by XManiac24 It could be true about the Shamrock/Taz business. But I could also see it as being a lame way to try and show how tough a character is because he didn't say "I Quit." Saying that was always a big deal. Especially when you had I Quit matches like Foley/Rock and Flair/Funk. It was important. It kind of takes away from a submission hold nowadays because the wrestler will yell "Ask him!" but the only way we know the person gives up is by tapping.

You know what? It's a indicative gesture acknowloging "Yes, you...the person putting the very painful hold on me...I'm your beeeyotch". Unless it's a stip match where a mic comes into play...what are you going to do, have a ref bring in a mic every time there's a chinlock applied? You have to remember that you have to play to the crowd as much as the camera, and the crowd doesn't pick up on things like having someone say it...they just see the ref signaling for the bell. So for that alone it makes for a better effect.

I don't think for every submission match they needed a microphone. That's where selling comes in, man. That is the key to playing to the crowd. Whether it is audible or not, the shaking of the head and the pain sell is more than having the mic to express he quit. Combined with the ref...it works.

I am sure you've seen Bret and Perfect from SummerSlam '91. If you haven't, I suggest you do, because it is a good example of my point...which you missed.

I've never liked the tap-out. A wrestler pounding on the mat when in the figure 4 could always draw crowd support and keep the fans in the match. When a wrestler would submit prior to the tap out, they would shake their heads up and down when informing the ref, thus giving a physical indication. Why they killed a cheap (yet effective) to get crowd involvement for a match because of Shamrock still makes little sense.

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maybe wrestlers could pound their fists when in a submission hold to motivate the crowd, and have the announcers maybe a couple times point out the difference between pounding with the fist and tapping with a flat hand. i too think the tapping was a good way of gettin the crowd behind the wrestler in the submission hold.

IIRC, this very issue was used in the ending of a match on Raw once. Vader was in a submission hold (don't remember his opponent, might have even been Shamrock), and he slapped the mat a few times, losing the match. Afterward, the commentators (JR, Kevin Kelly, and Michael Cole, I think?) were speculating that Vader didn't MEAN to tap out, but that he was just pounding the mat as has been discussed above.

Taz had locked the Tazmission on Bigelow, who was reaching for the ropes, and tapping the ramp to it. The ref saw it as a tapout and called it.

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Not having ECW house shows actually makes sense to me, especially since it said the ECW Superstars are going to continue to be on house shows, just not their own house shows. So they'll still be on RAW and SmackDown-brand house shows.