I posted this down in another thread but I thought this was important enough to warrant its own thread... When you turn 23 you get your second shout upgrade... Blinding Light is at 22 (or 22.6 or something) and Smite Prayer is at 23... I have noticed no difference between them... Smite Prayer requires slightly higher skills but the description and mana used are identical (one description says "reduce" while another says "decrease" but other than that... )I thought this was pretty lame but then I thought, "Well, at least I'll have two aoe taunts that both debuff divine resistance... maybe they'll stack" Not only can you not tell if they stack (you don't get an icon like Healers and Mages get for their debuffs) but Smite Prayer and Blinding Light (as well as Shout) are on the same timer... so you can't even use both... both of them are encounter only (neither is a pure AoE)I'm pretty convinced that Smite Prayer is not supposed to be where it is or is supposed to be different... most skills are upgraded every 14 lvls and so that means that Blinding Light is probably the correct shout upgrade... combine that with the fact that there is no AoE taunt upgrade for Paladins again and you've got a problemLet's look at the other tank classesMonk22 - Hand clap, Increases the hate towards the monk and interrupts all enemies in an encounter.23 - Focus Energy, Increases hate towards the monk and grants an increase in the monk's offensive skills.Guardian 22.6 - Shouting Cry, Increases hate towards the guardian and lowers the damage of all enemies in an encounter.23 - Smothering Cry, Increases hate towards the guardian and stifles all enemies in an encounter for a short time.Berzerker22 Enrage - Increases hate towards the berserker and grants the berserker a chance to go berserk with each swing. (do not know if this is aoe)23 Sunder - Increases hate towards the bruiser and deals a knockdown to all enemies in an encounter.Bruiser 22 Jeer - Increases hate towards the bruiser, and fears all enemies in an encounter.50 Abuse - Increases hate towards the bruiser and deals high damage to all enemies in an encounter.ShadowKnight22 Decree of Decay - Increases hate and curses all enemies with a lifetap shield. (This is awesome btw)23 Shriek of Terror - Increases hate towards the shadowknight and decreases the disease resistance of all enemies in an encounter.Maybe one of those classes can answer the question of whether or not they're on the same timer (i'm betting they are)... clearly everyone gets two aoe taunts (except bruiser who gets a 50th lvl upgrade... sorry guys) at 22 and 23 and they do different things... My suggestions for Smite Prayer to be altered togroup ward (small... maybe 100hps if pooled or 50hps to each group member)group hp buff (+50 to everyone)group ac buff (+50 or so)group heal (50-100 hps each)i particularly like the group ac buff because it seems very Paladin like but I'd be happy with any of them...

Cloudcr

12-22-2004, 09:12 PM

<DIV>One is ranged, one is not, both on same timer and decree of decay sucks.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Cloudcrak on <span class=date_text>12-22-2004</span> <span class=time_text>08:13 AM</span>

Lyones

12-22-2004, 09:28 PM

both are ranged... there's no such thing as a PBaoe taunt... (at least for pallies) both of them are "ranged" enemy group only taunts

Renn

12-22-2004, 11:50 PM

There is no upgrade for Smite Prayer, Blinding Light is the only one crafters can make upgrades for.

Deltree_c

12-23-2004, 12:47 AM

<DIV>That makes sense, I suppose. Wait, no it doesn't. Maybe? I could see the logic, but whether they are bugged or not, they're kinda worthless abilities, even upgraded. All signs are pointing to this being a problem, or an unusual design choice (which I have trouble comprehending).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>On a lighter note, Jeer is a bruiser ability, huh? No wonder it doesn't sell too well in Qeynos. Smashy smashy!</DIV>

Gilasil

12-23-2004, 09:36 AM

<DIV>Not logged on at the moment but if I recall smite prayer icon has a green background meaning it's AoE to mobs in your encounter only. Blinding light icon has a blue background meaning it hits all mobs in the AoE whether in the encounter or not. I think blinding light had some other small benefit but can't check right now. And yes they're on the same timer. It's possible one has a stronger taunt then the other but I don't really know. You choose the one you want depending on the situation.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I do know that when I was group taunting with blinding light it was working pretty well.</DIV>

Valhakar

12-23-2004, 10:25 AM

<DIV>Both have a green background. </DIV>

Aeggest

12-23-2004, 03:31 PM

<DIV>They are exactly the same, im guessing its a mistake - however i found one single, rare occasion, use for having 2 of them.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Grouped with a Paladin 1 level above me, he would use Blinding Light... usually i like to do an AE taunt, just to have a bit of agro if it should change, however my blinding light would not take hold - due to his debuff being better..<BR>Smite Prayer would - and I even think the debuffs stack <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That is the only use I have been able to find for it, not much - seeing as its rare to group with a paladin <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> - but its a bit.</DIV>

Belgor

12-28-2004, 08:28 PM

<DIV>I actualy think smite prayer is supposed to be a lvl 30-40 spell, since its among those spells you can buy it from the trainer, while the blinding light is a lvl 20-30 spell, and that is also where you can buy it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So its probably a misstake to have two identical taunts at 0.4 of a level between each other.</DIV>

Dankster

12-28-2004, 08:42 PM

<DIV>I just wish someone official would reply to this in some way, shape or form. I really do think it is an oversight on the devs part, I hope it is anyway. With thousands of spells, skills and whatnot, I could see something like this slipping past the final review before release. But to be released over a month, and I haven't heard a single word on this issue. I also realize they have bigger fish to fry, with making the game stable first and foremost, but throw us a bone here, and let us know if this was they way SOE wants it, or if it is an oversight, and will be fixed with the next patch <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

Belgor

12-28-2004, 08:45 PM

<DIV>they might not even be aware of the issue. bug/feedback it in game <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>but I would say smite prayer is supposed to be our level 30-40 AE-taunt, since we dont get any other then, and since that is where its sorted on the trainer.</DIV>

<blockquote><hr>Oxboy555 wrote:<DIV>I don't think Blinding Light is AE, whereas Smite Prayer is....please test this and report back.</DIV><hr></blockquote>Blinding Light is most certainly an AE. I use it all the time on groups, all of them get the flame around their head (just like taunt/inflame/etc) when I use it. Seems to be only mobs in a particular group, though, not every mob in an encounter, which sucks if you have two groups or a group + add or something. :

Oxboy5

12-28-2004, 11:37 PM

<DIV>I could swear I've dropped this on two equal green mobs beating on me, but only one gets the visual que you mention. Questions:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If it's not every mob in an encounter, is it truly AE? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Maybe it only affects undead?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Maybe it only affects mobs you've personally engaged (not adds)?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Bottomline: SOE needs to straighten this out for us.</DIV>

RyanLy

12-29-2004, 01:14 AM

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Oxboy555 wrote:<BR> <DIV>I could swear I've dropped this on two equal green mobs beating on me, but only one gets the visual que you mention. Questions:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If it's not every mob in an encounter, is it truly AE? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Maybe it only affects undead?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Maybe it only affects mobs you've personally engaged (not adds)?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Bottomline: SOE needs to straighten this out for us.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>They may have been in separate groups or both solo encounters. </P> <P>Spells/Abilites with a green background are AE's that only affect mobs in the same group encounter.</P> <P>Neither has appeared to be mob/aggro exclusive either.</P> <P>I'm hoping it's just a text description error with Smite Prayer.</P>

<DIV>I'm confused why two solo mobs pulled at the same time in the same way are considered two separate 'encounters' when they are simultaneously beating on you...</DIV>

Seomon

12-29-2004, 09:05 AM

<DIV>I got a Jasper today and wanted to upgrade Smite Prayer. The Alchy said it was a level 36 spell, and he couldn't do it with a Jasper, so I really think something's screwed up.</DIV>

Belgor

12-29-2004, 10:05 PM

<DIV>ah, yes</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Smite Prayer is listed as a level 36 spell for alchemists, and it is listed among lvl 30-39 spells on the npc trainer.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, when I got level 36, I got NO new ability, none whatsoever. All this points to the fact that we where supposed to get this skill at level 36, and not at 23 where we currently get it.</DIV>

RyanLy

12-30-2004, 10:35 PM

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Oxboy555 wrote:<BR> <DIV>I'm confused why two solo mobs pulled at the same time in the same way are considered two separate 'encounters' when they are simultaneously beating on you...</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <P>I'm suggesting that the two mobs were considered separate/individual solo encounters. The two were not "linked" (target one and both mobs get highligted) together.</P> <P> </P> <P>Which Trainer did you find the spell on Belgorim?</P></DIV>

Seomon

12-31-2004, 02:38 AM

<blockquote><hr>RyanLynx wrote:<DIV><BR><BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Oxboy555 wrote:<BR><DIV>Which Trainer did you find the spell on Belgorim?</div><hr></blockquote>There's 3 trainers in Eldaar Grove, one a Froglok, one sitting on the ground, and one standing. The one standing is the one you get it from if I'm remembering correctly.

FrozenEnzyme

12-31-2004, 05:43 AM

I'm beginning to think that Smite Prayer is supposed to be our level 36 spell....if you look on the skill list, you'll notice there is no spell given at the level 36 ding, and no spell given at level 35.6. Putting this at the level 36 ding would make sense to me.