Rodgers wants “risk-reward” conversation over playing on Sunday

Posted by Mike Florio on December 18, 2013, 10:08 AM EDT

AP

It’s been six weeks and two days since Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers fractured a collarbone. With the team now two wins away from an unlikely (given the 0-4-1 run right after Rodgers exited) NFC North crown, Rodgers seems to be more intent than ever on playing when the Steelers come to town on Sunday.

At a minimum, Rodgers is finally speaking the language that gets to the root of the balance that team doctors are trying to strike.

“I think there has to be on some level a risk-reward conversation,” Rodgers said during his weekly radio spot on ESPN Milwaukee, via Tom Silverstein of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel. “You have to base that on the evidence you see on the scan, but also how I’m feeling and if I’m able to do normal football movements without pain. That obviously goes into the equation.”

Rodgers is right. The reward becomes qualifying for a playoff berth and chasing a championship, with the collarbone getting more and more healthy each and every week. The risk, apparently, arises from the possibility of breaking the collarbone again, possibly badly enough to require surgery.

Whatever the risk, that’s the discussion Rodgers and Dr. Pat McKenzie need to have. After decades of teams bullying (subtly or otherwise) doctors into letting players play, Dr. McKenzie seems to have gone the other way, protecting a grown man from consciously accepting the possibility that the collarbone could break again.

It’s hard not to wonder whether the situation would be different if the Packers had a traditional owner — someone who ultimately held the keys to the car and who would be tempted to push his underlings to push the doctor to let Rodgers play if he wants to play, and to explore finding a different doctor who possibly would provide a different opinion.

Dr. McKenzie’s willingness to protect Rodgers is admirable. Not enough team doctors have, over the years, put the interests of their player-patients over the importance of keeping happy the entity that has the power and funds to find a new doctor. But as the Packers compete for a playoff berth, it’s hard not to wonder how many other teams would allow a doctor to trump the wishes of a player who understands the risk and who is willing to accept it.

Regardless, Rodgers seems to be moving closer to taking a stand.

“Sometimes those guys have to save you from yourself,” Rodgers said. “Doc and I always have had a close relationship and an honest relationship. I think he trusts me on how I’m feeling. It doesn’t mean I’m not going to battle him.”

At some point, it’s a battle that the franchise quarterback will win. Every play of every NFL game entails risk of injury. If Rodgers understands what could happen if the collarbone breaks again and accepts that enhanced risk, he should be allowed to make the final decision.

Give me a break! He’s putting a little pain and a small risk of reinjury ahead of helping his team make the playoffs. You’d think the reward would exceed the “risk” by this time. I’ve never heard of a small bone taking this long to heal.

I’m a packers fan and sorry but I don’t think McKenzie is protecting Rodgers from himself. Nothing Rodgers has said comes across as him wanting to be back out there or pushing to be back out there at any point since being injured. Rodgers seems to be taking the Derrick Rose approach of not pushing to play and protecting his future rather than risking anything for this season.

TheDPR says:Dec 18, 2013 10:27 AM

My question for the doctors would be whether re-injuring the collarbone could be career-threatening. If not, you take the risk. If so, you find out the odds and then decide whether to take the risk.

cannonballdookie says:Dec 18, 2013 10:27 AM

Play or don’t, I’m sick of hearing about it every week, he’s starting to turn into a drama queen.

THAT is a topic that should have caused my Redskin’s coach, Shanahan, to yank RGIII during last year’s Seattle playoff game. If Rodgers faces far greater injury potential, my advice is to rest him. With Flynn and other Packer weapons they may still beat the Steelers, and Rodgers’ health will get stronger.

Keep in mind your opponent also. The Steelers defense will go out there with the intention of putting Rodgers back on the bench. They’re a scummy organization.

noeffinway says:Dec 18, 2013 10:33 AM

So, are you saying that risk vs reward should be considered with all injuries? Or just this one because it’s the pack and you feel they should get special considerations with this too??? Protocol is protocol, stick with it!

Yeah, Favre would have put his own selfish aims of attaining stats ahead of the well-being of the future of the organization. And then, he would have gone out and pulled a Romo…just like he did for the Vikes. Or how about his season with the Jets where he refused to acknowledge that he was hurt and he played like garbage for most of the season.

I will always love the Favre-era but let’s not forget how furious we would be when he would pull his cowboy routine and blow it late in games. Most TD’s, most INT’s. Double-edged sword.

Give me a break! He’s putting a little pain and a small risk of reinjury ahead of helping his team make the playoffs. You’d think the reward would exceed the “risk” by this time. I’ve never heard of a small bone taking this long to heal

—

Hate to impugn a fellow Vike-fan, but I’m guessing you know a thing or two about small bones….

Will you Packers fans PLEASE get off your high horses and stop this “the sports team from my area, as well as the fans are better than the sports team from your area, as well as your friends.” Stop saying “we.” “You” are not on the sideline or the front office. “Green Bay proves it’s not about winning.” Are you kidding? Why would they sit Rodgers out? Because they want to win games in the future! These are the same fans who perennially want to fire every player because the Packers didn’t win by fifty point. Remember Mason Crosby? He had to go! Finley? He can’t catch! James Jones? He can’t catch and he fumbles! Tramon Williams? He’s a practice squad guy.

For the self-proclaimed “Greatest Fans of the Greatest Franchise” you all know shockingly little about football. Does tailgating in five degree weather make you special? Ha!

I’m pretty annoyed by the situation. What risk? You Break your bone again and you’re out for 8 more weeks? Season doesn’t start until August, suck it up.

tavisteelersfan says:Dec 18, 2013 10:40 AM

In the Risk Reward equation, two factors:
1. Steelers pass rush is not what it once was.
2. Steelers are playing very angry (at themselves) and people are getting hurt … for crying out loud, James Harrison had to leave with a concussion, is that not the most ironic thing you’ve ever heard.

Good of the team should trump Rodgers ego. First dr. needs to sign off, then coach needs to decide if risk is worth taking. There is an element of pain but more important is collarbone must be healed properly. After a long layoff, Rodgers is rusty. Needs minimum of one full week of practice before playing. No one realistically expects Pack to make it past Saints/Panthers or Seahawks anyhow.

shlort says:Dec 18, 2013 10:41 AM

Play, don’t play. It doesn’t matter all that much. Flynn is getting in the groove and can handle the offense effeciently. He is not Aaron Rodgers, but the Packers can win out withour Rodgers at the helm.

Having Rodgers back in there without meaningful practice is probably going to slow the Packers down until the timing is back in check.

I am not for shutting Rodgers down. If he can play and be effective, play him. If he can’t play or can’t be effective, then Flynn is more than good enough to lead the team. If they make the playoffs, great. If the don’t make the playoffs, oh well.

Carl Gerbschmidt says:Dec 18, 2013 10:42 AM

The Great Ted Thompson the Genius says:
Dec 18, 2013 10:18 AM

Give me a break! He’s putting a little pain and a small risk of reinjury ahead of helping his team make the playoffs. You’d think the reward would exceed the “risk” by this time. I’ve never heard of a small bone taking this long to heal.

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ONe of the many differences between Packers and Vikings. Our coaches/executive staff have control of the team and do what is best for the team, both in the short- and long-term. I think even you can agree that it is an approach that has worked well (copyright 13 world championships). Meanwhile, vikes typically go for the immediate return (copyright Favre), fall short, and then damage the long-term prospects of the team. And/or let the inmates run the asylum (copyright randy moss). I think we know how well the Viking approach works (0 championships).

Joemontanaflacco says:Dec 18, 2013 10:43 AM

You’ll know when Rodgers is finally cleared to play; Steelers’ fans will start jumping out of buildings.

It’s his collarbone. The next 8 years, or even next season, won’t be jeopardized even if he were to break it again. This is coming from a guy who played college ball at WR for 4 years, fractured his collarbone and came back too soon because it was towards the end of the season and broke it again. After that I still didn’t require surgery and just went about healing in the off-season for 8-10 weeks.

duece5 says:Dec 18, 2013 10:46 AM

twonis says: Dec 18, 2013 10:34 AM

I am so sick of the “Favre would have played” argument.

Yeah, Favre would have put his own selfish aims of attaining stats ahead of the well-being of the future of the organization. And then, he would have gone out and pulled a Romo…just like he did for the Vikes. Or how about his season with the Jets where he refused to acknowledge that he was hurt and he played like garbage for most of the season.

I will always love the Favre-era but let’s not forget how furious we would be when he would pull his cowboy routine and blow it late in games. Most TD’s, most INT’s. Double-edged sword.

It is absolutely the job of a doctor to put the health of their patients ahead of all other concerns.

And I’d also like to ask all of the guys saying he should play if it makes sense to gameplan with Rodgers at QB, send him out, have the collarbone rebroken in the first quarter, scramble to reorganize and definitely not have him for the playoffs. Doesn’t it make a whole lot more sense to wait until the risk of reinjury is reduced and you can feel secure in having him for a playoff run?

It isn’t a question of toughness. It is a question of good sense.

bucketman9 says:Dec 18, 2013 10:50 AM

It is time. – Kevin Greene

myasylum11 says:Dec 18, 2013 10:52 AM

You guys hear about when Favre showed Evil Knievel how it’s done, and jumped the Grand Canyon on a moped meanwhile breaking only half as many bones?

The Bears will lock this division up this week when the Lions and Packers both lose & the Eagles fall to Chicago……

Thanks for playing…..

The Bears needed the Browns to choke Sunday or it would have been a big L!
Bears and Quitler will finish 0 – 2!

fartweasel says:Dec 18, 2013 10:54 AM

Rodgers loves the attention. He is gonna play out the injury as long as possible to stay in the lime light. What a drama queen. Either play or shut the hell up and let your team concentrate on winning.

stellarperformance says:Dec 18, 2013 10:56 AM

Rodgers wants to play. This is not similar to Adrian Peterson laying out and avoiding injury now that the Vikings are going nowhere (again) and his chances of rushing for 3000 yards are out the window.

twonis says:
Dec 18, 2013 10:34 AM
I am so sick of the “Favre would have played” argument.

Yeah, Favre would have put his own selfish aims of attaining stats ahead of the well-being of the future of the organization. And then, he would have gone out and pulled a Romo…just like he did for the Vikes. Or how about his season with the Jets where he refused to acknowledge that he was hurt and he played like garbage for most of the season.

I will always love the Favre-era but let’s not forget how furious we would be when he would pull his cowboy routine and blow it late in games. Most TD’s, most INT’s. Double-edged sword.

———————————————

That’s not even accurate. The Jets didn’t put Favre on the weekly injury report but they knew about his injury and Mangini admitted after the season that he knew Favre was hurt but he was still their best option.

I think Rodgers is finally coming around to accept what other Packers fans already know deep down in their cheese-clogged hearts, but just can’t bring themselves to say aloud:

This division belongs to the BEARS this year. He’s been watching that new explosive offense tearing teams up, seeing it now boast some of the most dangerous weapons in the game, including the most dangerous WR duo in the league – and on top of it, it’s only getting better as we get closer to that week 17 showdown. The fact is, the Bears are getting hot just at the right time, heading into the playoffs.

Rodgers knows that the division belonging to the Bears is a foregone conclusion. And now, he’d have to jump into the fray, all rusted and fragile and timid, and try to outgun the suddenly high-flying pinball machine of potency that the Bears offense has become. Rodgers doesn’t want any part of that duel. Not right now, anyway.

And while the Bears defense has turned to garbage (bizzaro world!), they can still do JUST. ENOUGH. With the return of Briggs, Ratliffe emerging in the middle, and an occasional hot game by Peppers, or, ahem, a big crunch-tastic sack by Shea McClellin (*shiver*) – Rodgers and the Packers have rightfully recognized not just the risks involved, but that this season is a lost cause for the Pack.

It’s a new era in Chicago – the BEARS are the new offensive bullies of the North. Whatever he may say in the media, Rodgers has already accepted this reality. Now Pack fans better get used to it!

coachkilla6 says:Dec 18, 2013 11:01 AM

On a side note, the Packers should obtain Adrian Peterson in the offseason. AP would be a serviceable backup to Eddie Lacy.

Wow, lotta people have a whole lot of insight into what Rodgers is really saying to his doctor, what the bone scan really looks like and what the implications of direct trauma to a healing clavicular fracture really are. As a physician, I’m thinking the next time Im making a decision about sports participation for one of my patients, I might just post the question here so I can take advantage of the insight of the myriad of experts right here on PFT.

Rodgers loves the attention. He is gonna play out the injury as long as possible to stay in the lime light. What a drama queen. Either play or shut the hell up and let your team concentrate on winning.

It’s a new era in Chicago – the BEARS are the new offensive bullies of the North.

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Agreed, it is a whole new era in Chicago; Jefferies and Marshall are game changers allowing Cutler to throw Hail Mary’s into coverage knowing that there’s a chance his receivers will make him look good by winning the jump ball. I hope The bears beat the Eagles and the Pack beat the Steelers, that week 17 game in Soldier Field could be fun to watch and the winner would deserve to win the division and host a playoff game. Not overly optimistic about either team winning in the playoffs but week 17 could be a fun matchup.

Give me a break! He’s putting a little pain and a small risk of reinjury ahead of helping his team make the playoffs. You’d think the reward would exceed the “risk” by this time. I’ve never heard of a small bone taking this long to heal.
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What the hell? Rodgers said in the interview that he has no pain, did you happen to miss that one? And, every analyst in the game has said 6-8 weeks minimum. I’m guessing you’re a doctor that specializes in clavicle breaks?

I think he should start. Steelers are a solid team, but a winnable game. It would be better to get back into chemistry then than in Chicago.

World’s Greatest Fans HA!!!! Does that include all the fans who until the end of the Dallas game were posting on Facebook they had Packer tickets for sale CHEAP….. Just like all the Steeler fans who went to the game Sunday night dressed as empty seats, much like the Browns fans did….yep great fans…

The Packers may get TO the playoffs with Flynn, but they will definitely need Rodgers IN the playoffs. Part of the risk-reward here is the chance of making another Super Bowl run in the playoffs. It’s hard enough to get into the playoffs, let alone make a run. Just ask the Ravens, who kept running into the Steelers and losing before breaking through last year.

I’m not saying if Rodgers should or shouldn’t play. But, the whole situation seems a little weird.

He’s been a “maybe” every week for 6 weeks? Not likely. I’m guessing he was hurt way worse than they have ever admitted. But also, why not get a second opinion? One guy/Doctor makes the entire decision on if he will play? That just seems odd. Players get 2nd opinions all the time.

This isn’t an RGIII and knee. This is his collarbone on his non throwing shoulder. Does it hurt? Sure. I guess. He said it does. But, does it affect his throwing? What will happen if he plays and gets hurt again? If thats the whole concern, then just admit it and shut him down for the year.

(Please take note: my questions and discussion did not bring up the Vikings, or either teams fans. 90% of the posts on either the Vikings or Packers are just getting stupid on this website)

Lets try to be objective and serious folks, even if the other NFCN teams continue to choke (and I know my team sucks and hasn’t won a Super bowl, blah, blah, blah), with that defense, are you cheesers so drunk with green and gold koolaid that you believe there is a playoff run in this team?

Rodgers loves the attention. He is gonna play out the injury as long as possible to stay in the lime light. What a drama queen. Either play or shut the hell up and let your team concentrate on winning.
…………………….

It’s only been said 10,000 times on ESPN and NFL Network, it’s not up to Rodgers to play, it’s never been up to Rodgers. Its 100% up to McCarthy and he has said repeatedly, Rodgers will not play until the scans show complete healing and he is cleared by the doctors. Imagine that, an NFL team that is actually run by the guy who coaches the team, not the players or an eccentric owner. Sanity on an NFL team, shocking.

The Bears are the same “offensive bullies” that got swept by the Lions.

artvan15 says:Dec 18, 2013 11:47 AM

If you want to play and not listen to the doctors you should sign a waiver that if you get hurt within the next 2 games the Packers can void some of your contract you signed. I bet he wouldn’t play then!!!

Aarron forgets he’s an investment of the club and the club must protect the investment they have in him. I think it should be perfectly clear to him that if he pushes to go back and the Dr. doesn’t want it and he does go back and gets reinjured the contract becomes null and void.

Favre would have played.
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Favre was also doped up for almost the entire 90s, can’t remember things, and sent pics of his d*ck to reporters. I’m perfectly OK with our new franchise QB not making the same decisions as Favre.

It’s amazing how Packer Fans really believe they are good fans. This coming from a fan base that turn on any player that leaves, blame refs, coaches, even Aikman and Buck ,and have even choked their own kids if they lose. Never in the history of sports have there been more self righteous cry baby fans ever. Favre spent 15 years in GB, one year in Mn he said he finally felt like he was home. That should tell you all about the Packer fans. We all know about your Superbowls. One can only imagine how many titles Favre would have had in Mn instead of waisting his time in Mamby Pamby land. His best year ever was in Mn at the age of 39!!

dcviking says:Dec 18, 2013 12:02 PM

Any guesses as to the color skirt or perfume Aaron was wearing during this interview?

“At some point, it’s a battle that the franchise quarterback will win. Every play of every NFL game entails risk of injury. If Rodgers understands what could happen if the collarbone breaks again and accepts that enhanced risk, he should be allowed to make the final decision.”

The risk is you break your collarbone and need surgery, the reward is you take your team to the playoffs. If you don’t take the risk it isn’t going to matter because your team won’t be in the playoffs and you won’t have anything to do for the next 6-7 months other than rehad a broken collarbone. But at least you tried. Whats more important, the chance at the playoffs or missing your tee time.
Suit up.

Isn’t this the same team doctor that can’t get players back on the field? It’s amazing how long it takes packer players to get healthy, Cobb would’ve been back on the field weeks ago with a real competent medical staff.

It’s amazing how Packer Fans really believe they are good fans. This coming from a fan base that turn on any player that leaves, blame refs, coaches, even Aikman and Buck ,and have even choked their own kids if they lose. Never in the history of sports have there been more self righteous cry baby fans ever. Favre spent 15 years in GB, one year in Mn he said he finally felt like he was home. That should tell you all about the Packer fans. We all know about your Superbowls. One can only imagine how many titles Favre would have had in Mn instead of waisting his time in Mamby Pamby land. His best year ever was in Mn at the age of 39!!
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This looks to be just another frustrated Vikings fan rooting for an inept team for years. Never in the history of sports……. What are you like 9 humor us all with more whining. Favre’s best year? I’m guessing SB XXXI Champs. Get a clue, Son.

The Bears are the same “offensive bullies” that got swept by the Lions.
_______________________________

Yup, and lost to 4 other teams, too (including the Redskins – now that’s bad!)

But (records aside, for the moment) your retort completely misses the point:

I’m not saying the Bears aren’t (still) without some massive ugly flaws right now, but it’s time to face the facts: this isn’t the same team (3 yards and a cloud of dust offense) other NFCN teams are used to seeing in the Bears.

Not only has it done a 180 from the putrid Bears offenses of the past, under the Lovie years, in particular, but it continues to get better, more in sync, more dialed in, more potent and dynamic, with each game. Imagine what this offense will look like NEXT year?

To reiterate my original point: The future of offensive juggernaut-hood in the North is in Chicago, NOT gb (or, LOL, Detroit).

Your mistake, my friend, is the common one among packers fans – that you’re stuck in a rear-ward-facing perspective. We’re talking about the FUTURE of the North, and you can bet your cheesecurds that it will be the Bears’ Offense that is gonna be THE force to contend with.

“But, but…2010!!” Blah blah – yeah, yeah, I get it.
But the reality IS (and will be), that your memories of 2010, however fond and well-fondled, aren’t going to stop Marshall, Jeffrey, Forte & company in the Trest Coast offense in 2014, or 2015…or week 17, for that matter.

Seriously, the Doc should be able to tell if the bone is mended well enough to play. If it’s just a matter of doing football moves with pain then have a shot and suit up. Geez I remember Jack Youngblood playing with a broken leg that wasn’t healed or Ronnie Lott cutting off a finger to get in the game…sack up Aaron!

Brett Favre would play this Sunday if it was him in this scenario. Rodgers is the complete opposite type of player in this sitauation. That’s no knock on Rodgers, it depends on how you feel about a tough it out type of guy vs. a worried, careful approach type of player. Just sayin’…

I wonder how many times in the next DECADE rodgers will lead the pack to NFC north titles. We all know all other teams in the north need to rebuild and try to compete with AROD.. #ONEMANARMY#

gbmickey says:Dec 18, 2013 3:11 PM

Why do Viking fans continue with the Favre would play crap acting like Favre was a product of their organization. You know Favre never sat out a game to injury until he played for Minnesota. That’s the best you guys can do to rip the Packers? Getting pretty weak.

Deb says:Dec 18, 2013 3:30 PM

No, don’t recall a lot of risk v. reward discussions when Favre was playing. Miss that old tough guy. As for Rodgers … they didn’t need him last week.

A guy that got blasted by Peppers in the NFC title game – got right back up and continued playing in the game (unlike Quitler).

Dude holds onto the football forever in order to make a big play – putting himself at risk of getting blasted by angry 300 pound defensive players unlike sissy Peyton/Brady who need a billion screen passes/checkdowns so they don’t get touched.

Dude’s oline allowed over 50 sacks in two seasons with him under center, not one complaint.

But a bunch of keyboard tough guys think he’s soft, so he totally must be…. smh.