Christmas is about family coming together and having a reverent celebration of a spiritual saviour.

Christmas is NOT some catch phrase spoken when you leave WalMart, it is not some tree with balls and lights hanging on them, it is not about filling your yard with tacky lighted reindeer or balloons of a fat man riding a motorcycle, it is not same banner strung across the street so pigeons can crap on it. Unfortunately far too many people who consider Christmas to be about the decorations, the catchy slogans, and the consumerism. They get the warped idea that this is what defines Christmas so when a tree is banned, lights forbidden, or catch phrases frowned upon they jump to the conclusion of the holiday or a religion being oppressed.

Christmas is about family coming together and having a reverent celebration of a spiritual saviour.

Christmas is NOT some catch phrase spoken when you leave WalMart, it is not some tree with balls and lights hanging on them, it is not about filling your yard with tacky lighted reindeer or balloons of a fat man riding a motorcycle, it is not same banner strung across the street so pigeons can crap on it. ...

I disagree. The Christmas holiday is whatever any person wishes to make it to be. But, traditionally, it can be many things - including an originally pagan practice of a tree, giving light to a fairy tale named 'Claus' fleshed out within a poem from the 1800's but whose character some say is based off a catholic saint. It is what ever the beholder and holiday practicer wishes it to be - religeous or secular.

You know, CL, the Danes have churches that are round in shape, such that the ancient Dane pagans-now-Christians could not sit their spears against the wall; that's good practice, I think, to have when entertaining a Republican in one's household, i.e. round walls to subvert greedy hands stealing what's not tied (or bolted) down. After all, the Robber Barons of Haliburton need whatever the Good Lord will give 'em.

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"Wesley told the early Methodists to gain all they could and save all they could so that they could give all they could. It means that I consider my money to belong to God and I see myself as one of the hungry people who needs to get fed with God’s money. If I really have put all my trust in Jesus Christ as savior and Lord, then nothing I have is really my own anymore."

First of all, this is in Denmark, not the USA. The Danish government does not answer to you or me, but to its own electorate.

Secondly, the Danish government is not banning anything. They are simply deciding not to display a religious symbol at an international forum attended by people of all faiths. This particular symbol is particularly inappropriate at this particular summit since it amounts to the ritual killing of a carbon-trapping tree.

Third, the Christmas tree is a fun tradition but it is not Christian at all; it is pagan.

The Danish people can display this symbol of their pagan Viking forefathers anywhere in the kingdom of Denmark they want except the summit.

The right is getting pretty desparate if this is the only example they can find of persecution of Christians.

You are silly, thinking the fear-mongers actually want to know facts or reality.

Jesus Is My Savior...He Saves Me From REALITY!---------------------------------------------We created god in our own image and likeness![George Carlin]---------------------------------------------"Reason & Logic" - A Damn Good Slogan!---------------------------------------------"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg, an American physicist

Secondly, the Danish government is not banning anything. They are simply deciding not to display a religious symbol at an international forum attended by people of all faiths. This particular symbol is particularly inappropriate at this particular summit since it amounts to the ritual killing of a carbon-trapping tree.

Listen - I don't think this is outlawing christmas or sticking it to anyone. But I want to take a minute for my tangent. I want to use part of Jasr's post because he touched on Christmas being Christian in origen and there will be non christians at this event.

Again - my issue is not htis particular event not having a tree - my issue is much broader.

this idea that non-christians are offended somehow by displays of christianity - however secular those displays might be (Santas and trees and pretty presents).

That people because they are not christian are actually somehow offended or uncomfortable and we need to protect the non christian feelings.

You know what kind of an asshole would I be if I went into a Jewish neighboorhood and declared myself somehow offended or uncomfortable with Jewish displays - the menorah, the thingy in the door frame, etc. If I indicated that you know the whole thing gave me a bad feeling. Or what if I went to India during Dwali and proceeded to pontificate how I do not approve of Hinduism, being all polytheist and pagan and these lights and god statues offended me?

I don't know, I feel like if I go to India, I am going to see some Hindu stuff and if I don't I am sort of disapointed by that. If I go into a jewish neighboorhood or Israel, I expect to see some displays of judaism. Ditto for going to a muslim country during Eid.

This is Denmark a traditionaly christian country don't you think people EXPECT to see some reflections of that culture? Are non christians REALLY that offended by christianity? Really that uncomfortable to be reminded that christianity exists ? Yeah, I get that many of the people joining the powwow are not christian but do you really think that are that easily put off? Further, could it be possible that non christians traveling to the christian world during the Christmas season might actually enjoy and appreciate all the pretty decorations and all the festivities?

I think we are so warped in our white guilt world we try to paint people different from us as somehow more fragile or easily offended and damaged when it is us who are the freaks.