Dave Henderson and friends (Robin Booth, Trevor Loudon, et al), devotees of Johnny Dalhoff/Ultimate who had abandoned (or been tossed out by) Scientology...Chch is full of new Hendo's Holes - where the Tivoli/Westend used to be in the Square and in ratepayers' pockets where the council bailed him out by buying 5 properties - but hey "What we paid for the properties is irrelevant because he will buy them back off us," Council Chief Executive, Tony Marryatt said. Yeah Right!(hope he answered that email from Nigeria too...)

“I always used to complain that Jews ran the world,” said Reginald Weber, author of “Zionists and Zookeepers: The Unholy Alliance.” “But now I’m starting to worry that nobody’s in charge.”

Yes, my thoughts exactly.You only have to look at George Bush, oir even our "dear leader" to know that a conspiracy is beyond the capabilities of those that aspire to power.Dumb and dumber. Before the discussion has begun JK has informed us that he has already made up his mind on marijuana law reform. I guess he wants the drug money to stay with the gangs, after all, they did save the world from financial collapse.Bankers, pah.

gosh, that's an interesting perspective, but it seems to me that Bush, Blair, et al, conspired quite successfully to invade a country for no valid reason whatsoever, resulting in hundreds of thousands of deaths and millions of refugees.

and Goldman Sachs, et al, also seemed to have conspired quite successfully to use the collapse of US and European credit markets as a means of facilitating tens of billions of dollars flowing from public treasuries into their own bonus-fattened bank accounts.

but you prefer to think such conspiring for power and monetary gain is beyond their capabilities? mmm, hmm. must be all just cock-ups then, eh?

The end result was a cock-up certainly, and because of false certainty on the part of those who colluded they set in motion chains of events which they thought they could predict with that same certainty. Only to be proved wrong.What's that saying "Life makes liars of us all"

Unbridled certainty is the problem, and those in positions of power and influence are easy prey to their own human weakness's which power does not make them immune from.So Ian Wishart with his wacko liberal/Soros conspiracy theories is wrong. And if those with influence in this debate grab hold of his arguments they will commit mistakes that, if they have a conscience, they will regret.The caveat, of course, is they may not see it that way and their conscience may never trouble them.

it seems to me that Bush, Blair, et al, conspired quite successfully to invade a country for no valid reason whatsoever,

That I doubt. Perhaps there are those a little further down the chain with their own agenda? Those that supplied and manipulated the "intelligence" that led Blair and perhaps Bush to make their case for war. You cannot tell me that Blair, himself, went to Iraq and came back and told the British people that he had seen WMDs with his own eyes and they had no choice other than go to war.The question is whether others, further down the chain of command, lied to further their own agenda or was it a self perpetuating mass hysteria, political momentum, seemed like a good idea at the time, sort of thing.And what Andin said.