Minutes from August 11, 1986 Interdisciplinary Team meeting

LOGAN CANYON
MINUTES OF ID TEAM MEETING
August 11, 1986
Attendance:
Gale Larson, Valley Engineering
Jack Spence, Cache Group Sierra Club
Steve Flint, Bridgerland Audobon Society
Rudy Lukez, Cache Group Sierra Club
Duncan Silver, FHWA
Todd Weston, UDOT
John Neil, UDOT
Jim Naegle, UDOT
Lynn Zollinger, UDOT
Howard Richardson, UDOT
Fred Labar, USFS
Stan Nuffer, CH2M HILL
Cliff Forsgren, CH2M HILL
Item 1 - Review of Minutes
A new name was added to the mailing list:
Randy Nielsen, Utah Wildlife Federation
160 Layton Drive
Salt Lake City, Utah 84115
(draft copy of the study only)
Item 2-Review of Draft Traffic Tech Memo
The draft of the traffic forecast technical memorandum was
discussed. Those committee members who had received the
memo had not had sufficient time to thoroughly review the
information it contained so the discussion was fairly
general.
Jack Spence thought that all of the data points needed to be
plotted and that the standard deviation and correlation co­efficient
should be shown also. Duncan Silver asked about
the design hour volume (DHV) and the directional split of
the traffic. If the DHV and directional split are to be ad­dressed
in the capacity/level of service analysis, it should
be stated in this technical memorandum so that readers would
know where to find that information. Duncan also suggested
plotting the 100 highest hour volumes to see if 30th highest
hour (which is presently being used by UDOT), is the best
one to use as the basis for the DHV. Written comments on
the draft memorandum were requested by the next meeting.
1
Todd Weston asked if it would be possible to get the infor­mation
out sooner so that team members had a chance to
review it.
Item 3 - Review of Manual Traffic Counts
Gale Larson reported on the manual traffic counts taken on
July 19 and August 2. Summaries of the counts were given to
team members for their review.
Item 4 - Review of Maintenance Information
Cliff Forsgren presented a summary of the evaluation of the
maintenance in the Canyon. The largest maintenance related
problem in the Canyon is snow removal. Portions of the Can­yon
are narrow with steep walls and the river is adjacent to
the road. The roadway in those areas has no shoulder and
there is nowhere to store or place the snow. Present prac­tice
is to plow all of the snow to one side of the road and
into the river. This procedure requires plows to move snow
across the traffic lanes. There was some discussion about
the desirability of this practice. Duncan Silver said that
there should be two criteria used in evaluating these pro­cedures;
1) how is the public served and 2) how safe is the
procedure. Howard Richardson told a bit about the proce­dures
and about the District's "bare road" snow removal
policy. Jack Spence asked how many times per year snowplows
would be moving snow across traffic lanes. The number will
vary depending upon the number of snow storms. Sometimes a
snow blower will be used to keep the road clear also. Snow
plow operators consider the present practice unsafe. Howard
Richardson invited any team members who would be interested
in a first hand evaluation to come and ride on one of the
plows this winter. Jack Spence asked how many accidents
have been caused by this procedure? It was not known if
there had been any. The options for alleviating the snow
removal problems would be to construct wider shoulders.
Flooding of the road was also discussed. Finding and dis­posing
of suitable berm material is the biggest problem as­sociated
with protecting the road during high runoff. Fred
LaBar said that anchor ice above Ricks Springs had been re­sponsible
for flooding a number of years ago and that anchor
ice is a continuing problem in the river. Todd Weston asked
if plowing snow into the river could contribute to the build­up
of anchor ice. Fred did not know for sure but thought
that it might.
Item 5 - Review of Accident Data
John Neil reported that the Safety Section had not released
the accident analysis runs yet. Jack Spence indicated that
the accident data needed to be analyzed for as many years as
2
possible if it was to be a meaningful evaluation. Duncan
Silver said that a goal should be statistical reliance and
that number of accidents was not as important as the
severity of accidents.
SLC82/07
3

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LOGAN CANYON
MINUTES OF ID TEAM MEETING
August 11, 1986
Attendance:
Gale Larson, Valley Engineering
Jack Spence, Cache Group Sierra Club
Steve Flint, Bridgerland Audobon Society
Rudy Lukez, Cache Group Sierra Club
Duncan Silver, FHWA
Todd Weston, UDOT
John Neil, UDOT
Jim Naegle, UDOT
Lynn Zollinger, UDOT
Howard Richardson, UDOT
Fred Labar, USFS
Stan Nuffer, CH2M HILL
Cliff Forsgren, CH2M HILL
Item 1 - Review of Minutes
A new name was added to the mailing list:
Randy Nielsen, Utah Wildlife Federation
160 Layton Drive
Salt Lake City, Utah 84115
(draft copy of the study only)
Item 2-Review of Draft Traffic Tech Memo
The draft of the traffic forecast technical memorandum was
discussed. Those committee members who had received the
memo had not had sufficient time to thoroughly review the
information it contained so the discussion was fairly
general.
Jack Spence thought that all of the data points needed to be
plotted and that the standard deviation and correlation co­efficient
should be shown also. Duncan Silver asked about
the design hour volume (DHV) and the directional split of
the traffic. If the DHV and directional split are to be ad­dressed
in the capacity/level of service analysis, it should
be stated in this technical memorandum so that readers would
know where to find that information. Duncan also suggested
plotting the 100 highest hour volumes to see if 30th highest
hour (which is presently being used by UDOT), is the best
one to use as the basis for the DHV. Written comments on
the draft memorandum were requested by the next meeting.
1
Todd Weston asked if it would be possible to get the infor­mation
out sooner so that team members had a chance to
review it.
Item 3 - Review of Manual Traffic Counts
Gale Larson reported on the manual traffic counts taken on
July 19 and August 2. Summaries of the counts were given to
team members for their review.
Item 4 - Review of Maintenance Information
Cliff Forsgren presented a summary of the evaluation of the
maintenance in the Canyon. The largest maintenance related
problem in the Canyon is snow removal. Portions of the Can­yon
are narrow with steep walls and the river is adjacent to
the road. The roadway in those areas has no shoulder and
there is nowhere to store or place the snow. Present prac­tice
is to plow all of the snow to one side of the road and
into the river. This procedure requires plows to move snow
across the traffic lanes. There was some discussion about
the desirability of this practice. Duncan Silver said that
there should be two criteria used in evaluating these pro­cedures;
1) how is the public served and 2) how safe is the
procedure. Howard Richardson told a bit about the proce­dures
and about the District's "bare road" snow removal
policy. Jack Spence asked how many times per year snowplows
would be moving snow across traffic lanes. The number will
vary depending upon the number of snow storms. Sometimes a
snow blower will be used to keep the road clear also. Snow
plow operators consider the present practice unsafe. Howard
Richardson invited any team members who would be interested
in a first hand evaluation to come and ride on one of the
plows this winter. Jack Spence asked how many accidents
have been caused by this procedure? It was not known if
there had been any. The options for alleviating the snow
removal problems would be to construct wider shoulders.
Flooding of the road was also discussed. Finding and dis­posing
of suitable berm material is the biggest problem as­sociated
with protecting the road during high runoff. Fred
LaBar said that anchor ice above Ricks Springs had been re­sponsible
for flooding a number of years ago and that anchor
ice is a continuing problem in the river. Todd Weston asked
if plowing snow into the river could contribute to the build­up
of anchor ice. Fred did not know for sure but thought
that it might.
Item 5 - Review of Accident Data
John Neil reported that the Safety Section had not released
the accident analysis runs yet. Jack Spence indicated that
the accident data needed to be analyzed for as many years as
2
possible if it was to be a meaningful evaluation. Duncan
Silver said that a goal should be statistical reliance and
that number of accidents was not as important as the
severity of accidents.
SLC82/07
3