Ken Nordtvedt mentioned on another forum that he has identified a "unique clade" of R1b which has a hotspot in west Norway, but is also found in Sweden and Denmark. He says it is characterized by the following markers:385 = 11 13439 = 11441 = 14446 = 15He also said the clade did not look like a young one to him.Does anyone have any idea whether this cluster is more likely L21, P312*, U152 or U106? How does it match up with the Scandinavian members of the various R1b projects?

Since no one has responded, I thought I would give it a go myself. I ran the values from Nordtvedt through Ysearch using the usual R1b standard values for the additional markers. Though the vast majority of matches had not been deep clade tested, I found 3 P312*, 2 L21 and one U152/L2 amongst the results (assuming the self reported subclades are accurate). Only one of these was Scandinavian, Eriksson, confirmed P312* from Sweden.

Since no one has responded, I thought I would give it a go myself. I ran the values from Nordtvedt through Ysearch using the usual R1b standard values for the additional markers. Though the vast majority of matches had not been deep clade tested, I found 3 P312*, 2 L21 and one U152/L2 amongst the results (assuming the self reported subclades are accurate). Only one of these was Scandinavian, Eriksson, confirmed P312* from Sweden.

There are at least 3 different subclades being involved that are in the 3000-6000 years of age. The implication to me is that this north-south cluster includes a lot of "convergence" or people that are not that closely related.

It sounds like the true subclade is a subset of the P312* paragroup.

Of the confirmed L21* folks I have identified, I couldn't find any with this exact pattern. That worries me a bit. Either I'm missing something or some people mark themselves as "R1b1b2a1b5*" in Ysearch when they are just guessing. Of course, "R1b1b2a1b5 (tested)" shows up when FTDNA data is linked.

I have done a little more searching on Ysearch and am pretty well convinced this cluster is P312*. It is almost certainly not U106, as those who have tested DYS 492 are all 12. The following Ysearch entries are are very similar and fit the proposed cluster very well:Ericksson Sweden 29TRV P312*Hanson Norway JFGYS R1b but not deep clade testedSmith England NXMWE P312*Lundberg Sweden Y4PW3 R1b but not deep clade testedNote this is a different cluster from Nordtvedt's north-south cluster.