Nintendo's Plan for "Redefining the Definition of Video Game Platforms" Around Two Years Away

Company has a "clear idea to some extent" on future hardware direction

Following the financial results issued last week, Nintendo has now issued the officially translated Q & A with shareholders in which company President Satoru Iwata addressed a series of tough questions, some of which concerned the company's plans over the next 2-3 years to bring back handsome profits.

It's clear, for example, that the company is being forced to think beyond this current financial year when outlining its strategies to return to its previous success. Touching upon ideas emphasized in January, Satoru Iwata moved to dampen expectations of dramatic hardware reveals in the near future, explaining that the company's bold plans to revolutionise gaming platforms is still a little while away, while repeating that the QOL (Quality of Life) platform will be unveiled in the current financial year ahead of its release next fiscal year.

Also, regarding what I mentioned at the Corporate Management Policy Briefing in January about our efforts to go into a new business area, namely our platform business that seeks to enrich people’s QOL (Quality of Life) in enjoyable ways, I would like to talk more specifically about the kind of business we have in mind within this year, and the current time frame we are working on puts the actual deployment of the initiative in the next fiscal year, with contributions to our profitability to follow in the following fiscal year. Moreover, I feel that we will be able to further stimulate our platform business by taking advantage of smart devices, and I think that we will be able to provide detailed information on this as well as some concrete results between the current and the next fiscal years. Also, the idea I mentioned about redefining the definition of video game platforms will also require approximately two years. This is how we would like to talk more about our mid-term measures and lead them to actual results. However, we will not be able to create a good environment for the company unless projects are undertaken simultaneously, so this is the kind of timeframe that we have in mind.

As has been previously stated, Nintendo is certainly aiming to provide greater connectivity and unity between its platforms, with plans for the Nintendo Network ID's increased role already partially in action with Wii U and 3DS. What Iwata-san has made clear is that one login will be key to play across multiple systems of various types — we'll all become more connected through the NNID.

I also mentioned in January (at the Corporate Management Policy Briefing) that we would change the definition of our platforms from being device-based to NNID-account-based. When our platforms are account-based, we can expand the number of applicable devices. In order to have rich and high-quality game experiences, we always want our users to play with our dedicated game systems that are specifically designed to provide such unique experiences, while at the same time, we may be able to select some portions of these games and make them available on other devices. Also, by encouraging users to interact with the physical figurines that I mentioned today, we may be able to create brand-new entertainment. In these ways, another critical point for us to carefully consider, or another key point for us, is how we can and should incorporate our entertainment offerings into the more fragmented time and opportunities of different consumers.

The issue of Nintendo's next hardware was naturally raised, especially in light of the Wii U's current struggles. It's been made clear that Nintendo is not short of ideas for its next product, but that it's still prioritising satisfying the current generation of gamers.

Once we launch a new platform, we naturally start to prepare for the next one. As it takes several years to develop a single platform, if you ask us whether we are preparing for our next system, then the correct response will be that we are always developing new hardware. On the other hand, the most difficult question for us to answer in public in concrete terms is when we are going to launch our new hardware and what kind of hardware we are going to launch, and I am afraid that I cannot talk about this in more detail. However, I can certainly assure you that we are not at a dead end of any kind in which we are out of ideas for developing new hardware. I of course believe that launching new hardware will not produce good results unless we first make sure that those who have already purchased our platforms are satisfied. We will continue to work hard to ensure that consumers who already own our platforms are satisfied, and make sure that people will continue to see great value in our software, but I would like to say that we are preparing for our next hardware system, and in fact, we already have a clear idea to some extent about the direction our next hardware is going to take.

It'll certainly be an interesting 2-3 years in the world of Nintendo, with its steps into NFC figurines, a QOL platform and the likely reveal of new hardware at the end of that period — remember the Wii U was first shown over a year before its release. Let us know what you think of Satoru Iwata's comments below.

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"The issue of Nintendo's next hardware was naturally raised, especially in light of the Wii U's current struggles. It's been made clear that Nintendo is not short of ideas for its next product, but that it's still prioritising satisfying the current generation of gamers."

In other words, they're not going to pull a Sega and just start pulling hardware support every few years.

As the article stated, the Wii U was announced a year before release. Just because they think they will be announcing this new hardware in a couple years doesn't mean they're giving up on the Wii U. Iwata even stated above that customers can't be happy with future hardware unless they're happy with current hardware. They're not abandoning anything. The Wii U could get a 5-6 year lifespan still.

I have a Wii U and I really have no problem with this. I'd rather they do what they can for the Wii U while in the meantime work and come out with something that will -Hopefully- be a game changer. In 2-3 years they it will be 5 years since Wii U was released. That seems to be the going trend with Nintendo console releases anyway, so I don't think this is too unusual.

Well, we all - and by all I mean me and more than a few others commenting on these boards - expect "Unity" to be their next hard ware platform, the combined "handheld-household" system. And probably their biggest problem is figuring out how to do a "2-in-1" w/ the staggered releases of their handheld 3DS Family and home Wii U systems. The 3DS is 4 years old so it's practical that a replacement would be 2 years away, but do they want to abandon Wii U so soon and risk losing their fanbase?

Besides timing issues they have a few other problems to solve before release:

Is it priced like a handheld or home console?Is it marketed as a handheld system that plays home quality type AAA games (Vita's somewhat abandoned strategy) or is it a portable system that can play portable games on a tv? (Like Wii U can do w/ DL'd GBA games)How do you play multiplayer - 1 system w/ add-ons or do you need multiple systems?Is it completely portable like a 3DS that can output to tv or is it a Wii U that has a portable Gamepad that can play games on it's own like a tablet?

Considering the quality of handheld games like Pokemon and Animal Crossing and the likes of Kid Icarus and SM3DL and MK7 I think the obvious answer is abandon expensive HD home games for portable ones, but it's Nintendo, so who knows?

One thing's for sure - if they only have 1 system to make games for there should be a steady supply of quality titles. Also less R&D costs for 1 console rather than 2. The big problem would be, as usual, 3rd party support. But I don't think they care.

It sounds like Nintendo is hoping some QOL product will fix their woes while the Wii-U lives out its short lifespan and once it's OK to kill the Wii-U in two years because at that point its been out long enough they plan on doing so for some 'revolutionary' new console. I don't know how this could possibly be conceived of as good news for a Wii-U fan or a fan of Nintendo games in general.

@DESS-M-8 What? How did you get that from this article? That's literally the opposite of what Iwata said. He specifically said that arbitrarily releasing new hardware won't wield any financial gain unless those who purchased the current hardware have been satisfying. How do you take that to mean they're abandoning the Wii U?

Nintendo needs to realize that they need to make corrective moves with the Wii U already. They can't just "weather the storm", plop out a new system and expect everything to be fine after a catastrophe like this. The Wii U is driving customers away from Nintendo.

@rjejr That would make the Wii U look like the PS2 in terms of sales....

....It would be uber weak.

.....or uber expensive.

I mean WHY is this even a decent idea?!?!

Knowing Nintendo, the handheld would only do 480p. Wii resolution on your large TV? Two generations behind the competition? No reason to "upgrade". Sure, it would have Nintendo games. But what else? iOS ports.

@faint this kind of depends. Right now they're not really utilizing the hd capabilities in meaningful ways. None of the gameplay from nintendo first party titles couldn't have been done on the 3ds. Games like 3d world, TF, and even MK8 could all have been done exactly as is on the 3ds with the only exception being reduced graphics.

So to me it's kind of a waste to just get HD 3ds games. The problem is to really start to use the features you get into the long expensive development cycles that are killing the industry right now. The thing is with nintendo's style their graphics actually upscale to HD quite well. We know this from the work people do with the program that shall not be named.

Now given that 3ds games can use as much as an 8GB card that's a good bit of space. If the wiiU had been a 3ds tv player with the capability to upscale and use some more advanced shaders you'd have missed almost nothing.

Given progression their next portable is going to be approaching HD capabilities. I think it would be really interesting if the next platform was portable only but you could buy a tv version capable of upscaling well. You could even have on startup the program load different shaders based on whether you're playing it portable or at home.

@unrandomsam - "One platform doesn't have to mean only one system. Only that it uses the same games"

You think they would spend the R&D $ to build 2 separate hardware consoles that both play the same games? Isn't that what they have now - 3DS has MK and SM3D and SSB, Wii U has MK, SM3D and SSB. Wouldn't people just pick either tv in western world w/ it's big tvs, or handheld in Japan , and they would only sell half as many of each console? Sure it would save on game development costs and cut down on game droughts but is it worth it to build two sets of hardware that play the same games? Vita says no. And Wii U isn't saying much more, though we'll know more after SSB.

I just don't see the reason to build and sell 2 consoles when a more powerful 4DTV can have tv-out via a Chromecast or Roku Stick. (4DTV not to be confused w/ 4K tv, just a 3DS upgrade than can play on tv)

Have they even started HD development? Sure, MK8 looks great, perhaps better than anything on PS3 even, but my idea of "HD" is more the photo-realistic cinematic experience found in Last of Us or GTA or MGS w/ 5.1 surround sound that really requires a large screen HD tv to appreciate. MK has been on several handhelds. Wind Waker looks like it could be a 3DS game. Pikmin 3 could probably survive on a handheld. SM3DW was SM3DL first. I don't think Nintendo NEEDS HD on a large screen / surround sound for any of its games. W101 needed a big screen, Bayonetta 2 needs a big screen, and X needs a big screen, but they aren't really "Nintendo games", their Platinum and Monolith's games.

Now I do think any future system Nintendo makes will need HD output, but 2 years from now the power of the Wii U should be portable enough. And 1 game download to an SD card - if Damo had his way - could contain both 2 speaker and surround sound and low res and hi res textures for screen and tv play. I don't expect Nintendo to be making 4k games for a long long time.

@rjerj I disagree with the HD part. I find most Wii U games I own look positively stunning in HD, including SM3DW, DKC:TF, Pikmin 3, and yes, Wind Waker HD, which most definitely wouldn't look remotely as good on a 3DS. I'm even not sure if a 3DS version would look as sharp as the Gamecube version. HD doesn't mean photorealistic graphics, it means graphics in high definition.

EDIT: And for what it's worth, I wholeheatedly agree with the idea of an unified platform. That is the way to go. I just don't think they should ditch the HD, and don't think they will.

Nintendo makes uber weak games - Pokemon, Animal crossing, Tomodachi Life, 2D Mario platformers and kart games. You can get more than enough power in a handheld for Nintendo games in HD on a tv.

And if the Wii U had Pokemon and Animal Crossing it would sell like the PS2. But it doesn't, b/ cNintnedo puts all its good games on its handheld.

One console, all of Nitneod's good games, on a tv or on a handheld. You could never convince me that wouldn't work. Do you really think any home console w/ a typical Pokemon game (not Rumble) could sell worse than Wii U? Or tv out wouldn't improve 3DS sales? It's practically a non-brainer.

So they are not going to just drop support and move on to the successor like Sega did with the Saturn. That's good to know as I got a Wii U last November (2013) and want to get my money's worth for it.

It's annoying that some people think this announcement signals the end of the Wii U. It doesn't. In all honesty, the Wii U entered development in 2007 (one year after the Wii launched) and wasn't released until 2012. It will be a while yet before we see Nintendo's next home console.

Nintendo needs to stop trying to redefine everything about the video game industry. Just make great games with a normal controller like you did for the first 20 years before the Wii came along.

The reason I now own a PS3 and spend nearly all my gaming time on that console is because Nintendo turned me off their own products through their insistence that everything is better with motion control or a GamePad.

@Jampie - Go find people who know what Nitneod is, then ask them to start naming Nintendo games. Stop them when they get to Xenoblade or X. Is either game in the top 10? Monolith can still make games for Nintnedo - look at Fire Emblem or Bravely Default on the 3DS. Plenty of room for Monolith RPGs on a handheld, or on a tv at low res. Everybody loved Xenoblade on Wii 5 years after PS3 and 360 were doing HD. I'm only playing it now on a 52" 1080p tv and its fine. I still don't consider it a Nintnedo game though

@ricklongo a lot of that is purely resolution. When you upscale wii and even GC games to HD they look quite good. So if you had a system capable of simply upscaling the resolution of 3ds games you'd probably be amazed at the results. Add in some extra tesselation and geometry shaders and you'd be even more amazed. Swap the fragment shader out for a more advanced one and it'll just get scary how different it looks.

Wouldn't that be interesting if they tied your NNID to a NFC figure? You can store all your data on it, and if you lose it, it's cheap to replace. I doubt that's where they are going, but it would be kind of interesting to love your data between devices using NFC.

I say in the next couple years they should release a new home console on par or better than the Xbox One's and PS4's hardware. It needs to be done, or Nintendo may end up like SEGA after this generation.

Yes, I agree, HD is better, but all those games you named could be played on a 3DS, and people would play them on a 3DS, and they wouldnt lose that much. They arnet about the graphics or sound. Of course they arebette rw/ beter graphics, bu they arne't a requirement.

How many of Nintnedo's top tier games - kart, SSB, NSMB, DK, Krby, Yoshi - would lose a lot on a handheld, or a handheld output to a tv? Wii had some great games over 5 years in SD while the other 2 consoels were doing HD, so they have already proved they don't need HD to sell consoles or games.

@Diddy_kong they have always pushed the boundaries from the beginning. The NES controller was a new concept at the time...very bold and risky after the video game crash of 1984. Super NES was a big change too, adding tons of buttons to the controller. Nintendo showed that off too early and allowed Sega to copy them. N64 introduced the analog stick to a major home console. Sony aped that. The GameCube was the one if the biggest market failures for any Nintendo platform and what did it do that was new and innovative? Nothing really.

So history shows that Nintendo is at it's best when taking bold new steps with its input devices. Not the other way around. The biggest issue with Wii U is not the controller IMO. I love the game pad, it is awesome! The issue is that IDs are tied to the console and also there is little third party support or major first party releases (Zelda/Metroid). That last bit is changing with SSMB and MK8 and it sounds like they are addressing the IDs soon (I hope!!).

@majorgamer I think the bigger issue is nintendo themselves isn't using the gamepad. Other than a few minigame collections it's mostly nothing more than offscreen. They should be leading the way showing how it should be used.

@rjejr So you are suggesting that Nintendo should make an SD handheld next gen.

Sorry but the truth is that a console needs fantastic third party support to even survive or otherwise it is a laughing stock.

Plus you really think Pikmin 3 or Mario Kart 8 or Super Mario 3D World could be pulled off with handhelds? Not a chance. Not without serious steps back such as dramatically changing the track design, reducing player and enemy count and lowering framerate (Super Mario 3D Land is 30FPS)

@Yorumi: I don't disagree with you. At the same time, they also need to court third party games that are a natural fit for the touchpad, such as Minecraft. Who would want to play that game any other way once they tried Minecraft with a touchscreen.

@rjejr But it still is a Nintendo game, whether you consider it one or not. Just because X wouldn't be the first 10 games that people list, it doesn't mean that it isn't a Nintendo game. By that logic, anything outside of Mario, Zelda, DK, and Metroid, Star Fox, Pikmin, Kid Icarus, Animal Crossing, etc doesn't count right? Steel Diver or Tomodachi Life would probably be the last thing people list, but is that not a Nintendo franchise? Lol... That's like saying that Fire Emblem isn't a Nintendo franchise because Intelligent Systems develops it. When people think of Pokemon, they think of Nintendo too, but GameFreak develops it. So would it be impossible for Nintendo to ever make new franchises if their first party studio games don't even count as their own games? Naughty Dog games must not be Sony games then. Is that why even when Nintendo does introduce new franchises/series, it never counts or something so people keep saying they rehash and have nothing new? Pushmo was developed by Intelligent Systems, does that not count as a Nintendo game? Also, I don't get what you mean by your comment for them developing for the 3DS. I never said Monolith Soft couldn't... I was just telling you that they are a first party developer for Nintendo because you said that the games they make "aren't really Nintendo games," when they are Nintendo games... What is the point of buying developers and making them first party if the games they develop don't even count as your games/games you own? :

I just want them to make good console with decent 3rd party game support and great modern Nintendo games... PS4 seems to be selling well without needing something like the gamepad, so I think a lot of people still want games consoles.
If they added a proper account system, expanded the VC and got more 3rd party games back, I'd probably buy a Wii U.
I guess this would sound a bit dry though, as its pitched to shareholders, not gamers!

@memoryman3 they absolutely could do it if they toned down the shaders and reduced the polygon count. 3D world is not super advanced, we have smash being made for the 3ds, etc. Nintendo games are not super technically advanced, and remember the 3ds is roughly as powerful as a wii with better shaders.

The fluid dynamics simulator in pikmin 3 probably wouldn't work on the 3ds, but is that a big deal? Well most people who talk about graphics and don't understand the technical side didn't even notice it.

So yes the gameplay could very much be done on the 3ds if the graphics were reduced. And as I pointed out if you wrote the program so that if it's loaded up a tv viewer it can load better shaders you'd be shocked at the difference it makes. In fact in many ways shaders are more important than the quality of the models used or even the resolution.

Now that I really think about it, Nintendo is really smart to support these small developers for the eShop. It's these developers that are the AAA title game creators for the next generation, and if Nintendo gets them looking at the gamepad in unique ways from the beginning, then it will be a natural transition for them. That might address third party issues in a year or so. I mean...it kind of already making a difference. Child of Light is on their system, for example. I think that company has the potential to make a real AAA title, and now they are fully vested in the Wii U.

@Yorumi: Pikmin wouldn't work because the screen real estate is way to small for a game like that and 3D World is a four-player experience, which couldn't be done optimally on their handheld devices.

So, as Nintendo themselves has stated, there are games that are suited to one or both, and some that are natural console only titles or handheld titles by their nature. Your examples are perfect examples of that. SSMB would be a perfect example of cross-platform, and Ace Attorney is a great example of handheld only.

@Turbo857 "They already stated that they will not release a new console until Wii U owners are "satisfied" with their purchase. It's not good business and Nintendo is already aware of that."

Two years from now they could have reasonably released all their major franchises, so they could probably say at that stage they've done their best to make people satisfied. Personally I already think the argument of being unsatisfied with the Wii U has run out of steam as the library is solid on exclusives alone (especially after Kart hits).

@Yoshis_VGMyeah, everyone is so quick to assume that, the truth is when spending all that money on creating a console from scratch, no company will ditch it so easily and move on, every one saw what happened to Sega and the lessons learned. Wii had six years if I'm not mistaken, and so I would say the Wii U will hopefully go till 2018 before it's replaced.

Good to hear that Nintendo will be trying to make the most of this current generation instead of abandoning the Wii U. I'm very curious about what the next console will be like; knowing Nintendo, it'll be something very few of us can predict.

@majorgamer you could make the exact same argument about smash, it's a 4 player game. So if it works there it words for 3dworld, and of course 3d land exists. That's like saying you couldn't do nsmb on the 3ds cause it's 4 player. Pikmin also scales down quite well, it's fine playing off tv, and while that's still bigger than a 3ds screen you don't have to go to much farther to get there.

Remember I'm supporting the idea of making all games portable and having something optional you can buy that is capable of upscaling and adding new shaders. Would pikmin be ideal on a 3ds? No, but it would be playable, and if you wanted a better experience you buy the tv viewer.

Given the way nintendo is currently operating this would be the better model. You wouldn't have to worry about what system a game is on, or having access to your games on vacation, and yet you'd still also have them in HD on your tv. And again just let me say you'd be amazed what a 3ds game would look like if you swapped the fragment shader and added a tessellation and geometry shader.

in my opinion, releasing a new home console AND handheld console in holiday 2015 or 2016, would be perfect.As long as they are truly united, it will encourage people like me who haven't owned a handheld since GBA to finally get one again. It will encourage both platforms. Right now, 3DS owners have no reason to also own a Wii U, or vice versa. 2015 or 2016 sounds about right around the time Nintendo would most likely launch a new handheld, and Iwata said, "we will not be able to create a good environment for the company unless projects are undertaken simultaneously" therefore I think the excuse of launching another handheld will be reason enough to launch another home console, apart from the fact that Wii U is ultimately a commercial failure.But with games like MK8, Smash, and Zelda coming to Wii U this year and next, I do believe the next console NEEDS to be backwards compatible, even if it is devoid of the gamepad.This is for Nintendo fans who might invest in their new platform, who skipped Wii U. there seems to be a lot of us, given the low number of consoles sold.Also, it would be for the Wii U owners, who invested money into the console & the games, so that they don't feel cheated or something.The only thing that worries me, is Nintendo's "redefining the definition" aspect of all of this.They did it with Wii successfully, and not so much with Wii U.I'd rather see Nintendo go back to a more traditional control scheme, a brand new UPDATED motion control OR touch screen, only one or the other, as an OPTION (not Wii mote or gamepad, in fact get rid of the Wii brand entirely, start something brand new, and have the traditional gamepad be separate from a touch screen designed for the new system as an accessory only, i.e.what microsoft does with surface, better yet, have the HANDHELD act as a touch screen controller like Vita can with PS4) but have as I said a traditional control scheme. An updated, new gamecube type of pad would make a LOT of fans happy, including me. Also, i'm sorry, but Nintendo needs to take the, "if you can't beat em join em" approach to hardware design next time too. x86 architecture, powerful components. We'll get 3rd party support, all the same games as X1/PS4, and we'll STILL get Nintendo's amazing games.Sorry for the rant, but this is just what I want Nintendo to do to truly succeed, in my opinion. In a couple years, a system equal to PS4/X1 will cost less to build then those systems do now, so Nintendo could enter at a competitive price range as they usually do!

Do you think a Pikmin game or Super Mario's Double Cherry or searchlight levels could be possible with 128MB of RAM? The levels would have to be compressed to fit on a smaller screen, game mechanics will have to be removed due to system limitations, and the game wouldn't feel the same.

A good example would be ZELDA! Do you think the 3DS has the chops to even run the Wind Waker without compromises?

@Gingadreadman what would be the point nintendo almost never pushes a system to the limit. Pay an extra $300 to get one game that might maybe make use of the power? HD resolutions had a bigger effect on people's perceptions of graphics than any technological advance(and pc's were doing that for years prior, and render in higher resolutions).

Here's the thing most people don't even know good graphics when they see them. Personal bias influences people more than anything as is the case with so many people calling wiiU games amazing and mind blowing. Or the people who thought OOT3d was some sort of major technical accomplishment even though it wasn't even rendering GC level graphics on a system more powerful than a wii.

Is MK8 doing something amazing? Not really, reflections look good, but it's missing a lot of bump maping and other detail. I don't want to cast aspersions here but rarely have I found people clamoring for more power than are even capable of really appreciating it.

@drumsandperc92 do you even know what people are talking about when they say x86 architecture? Or for that matter what architecture even is?

Something just doesn't have me convinced that Nintendo quite gets where it's going wrong and what it really needs to do to get it right going forward.

It just seems like what it's doing is what all the other companies are actually doing too but mostly a generation or so behind and somehow it thinks it's being unique by just changing it up a little and usually in a way that just alienates and p*sses off most people other than the FANS and some random casuals who don't know better in the first place.

All this talk of NNID and QOL sounds interesting but I expect when we get to see all this stuff in all it's glory that it's really just unified accounts and services like Microsoft and Sony have now had for a couple of generations and just more casual gaming and entertainment stuff which both Microsoft and Sony are also pursuing anyway.

I mean if integrating voice control throughout your entire system so you can command your entire entertainment unit with voice alone and using that same Kinect for all kinds of non-controller based motion entertainment and interaction etc (dancing and exercising and whatnot) isn't improving people's "quality of life" in one way or another (within the category of interactive entertainment), then I'm a monkey's uncle.

I just don't think Nintendo spends enough time looking at what everyone else is actually doing and sometimes I REALLY think it should because imo it should be doing all of it's own unique stuff ON TOP OF what basically everyone else is doing.

You can't just continue to give us all these gimmicky twists and novel approaches on actually pretty common ideas at the expense of all the stuff we've basically come to expect as standard at this point. You have to give us that stuff ALONG with the other stuff OR make it so totally and utterly mindbogglingly brilliant in it's own right that is could be considered worthy of consideration even without that other stuff; which really has not been the case thus far and certainly not as far as the majority of consumers are concerned imo.

@Montegarde read between the lines of what you're being fed by marketing. The wii u is now nearing two years into its lifespan and has yielded nothing and has an almost zero third party software showing and appalling first party showing. There is not one major title on the format.

That would cost money.

Where is that money?

QoL.

I have invested heavily financially into my Wii U, why? Because it IS the best format this new generation. Buthe I've been let down supremely by Nintendo not showing that same faith in their own product. This QoL announcement is the reason in the background why development is so slow for Wii u, they have teams working in this super Wii fit joke and steering away from gaming.

End fir Nintendo if they choose this route. They're majorly bank rolling an idea that was a super successful fad.

@memoryman3 the double cherry levels wouldn't be a problem. You think the 3ds is incapable of displaying more than a few characters at a time?

As far as power and gameplay, it's really complicated but so far there have been few examples where power has led to better gameplay in say the past 10 years. Generally power goes into the graphics and gameplay suffers for it. With the advent of HD gaming we largely saw a regression of gameplay. Games like daggerfall and morrowind are far more complex than skyrim for example. FF13 vs say 7, 8, or 9. There are plenty more examples. Interestingly where we saw some of the best examples of gameplay were on the wii. Tales of graces, xenoblade, mario galaxy and more.

It's generally paradigm shifts where power enhances gameplay. For example the advent of 3d rendering, or modern shader design allowing for more complex physics or ai patterns with a compute shader. The cost of graphics goes up exponentially and that money has to come from somewhere though, most often it's gameplay.

Finally many developers are on record as saying a restrictive environment makes them come up with more creative solutions. The morph ball, one of hte more iconic things about samus is from a limitation in the nes, megaman changing colors is similarly due to limitations. For that matter their arm cannons were easier to do with sprites than a gun.

If more power created a utopia of gaming we'd all be playing on pc's and certainly wouldn't be looking back fondly on past games.

Can't wait for the new console but that doesn't mean that I didn't liked the Wii u. I'm still waiting for some of Nintendo exclusives like metroid, ssb, zelda( awesome HD) and surprises that Nintendo got in store for us. Love the Wii u. Nintendo 4 life.

I acually think, that a hybrid of a handheld and a homeconsole would be an even greater failiure than the Wii U is supposed to be, because you had to decide if you would pack strong processing power in this device, making it more static and bund to it's position (a home console) or producing a console which is a truly handheld system which can't have that much power, sacraficing the possibillity of launching true HD games, with enourmous Worlds and insane ammounts of NPCs on one sceen, on it.Therefore they should stick to the two "seperate" pieces of hardware, bound together by a unified architecture (not the same to differentiate the systems, but not to different to be able to easaly port a game from one system to the other) and a unified personcentered ID (NNID with crossbuy and crossplay) the Homeconsole should work as the "power HUB" and let the handheld connect to it as some kind of hybrid of a "gameboyplayer"-like thing and a controller so you can play your handheld games on your TV and vice versa if you'r at home or are connected to another Nintendo Home console via your NNID. The last thing I would not mind to state about this "next gen" nintendo consokles is, that they should not try to reinvent the wheel whith it, they should focus on things like system integrity, fun gameplay, unified IDs and games that can be played on both consoles by buying one version not like SSB4 and of course building a machine which is not underpowered, BECAUSE no 3rd party developer (except for indies) want to code for a system which restrains their "intellectual freedom" by something as simple as computing power or forcing them to code in a manner to actually use less power of the CPU and get the same results (which is possibble if your code isn't a big pile of steaming s#*t like this thing dice calls code) The gamepad adds tons of possibillitys but is not utillized because it's a hassle to code for it (stating the mindset of 3rd partys)

@Josaku actually because of the way modern 3d programing works you don't need games ported if you build a proper design for a hybrid home/portable system. You need different hardware but that's all. The home part is like the gameboyplayer you mentioned so it can read the portable cards but it has more power than the actual portable system.

In modern 3d graphics a shader is a mini program within a program(the game itself). Shaders can be swapped on the fly, granted it can be performance intensive to do that on a running system. Because of that you swap them on startup. You have a little bit more development time because you have to make a second set of shaders but certainly nothing like what porting takes.

You switch the shaders on started depending on whether it's loaded on the portable or the home system. When you load it on the home system you instantly get better lighting, shadows, reflections, higher polygon counts, and even entirely new geometry(thing grass or leaves that are actual geometry rather than just painted on textures). You could also pack the game with high res versions of all the textures. The game would be night and day different, specially with nintendo's art style.

I'm not kidding when I say you wouldn't believe it's the same engine using the same models.

As far as the gamepad it's not hard to code for they're just making excuses. Multiscreen rendering isn't anything new.

That would mean it wouldn't be easy to just load higher res textures. Plus the home console would still be held back by the portable in terms of gameplay possibilities and have no third party support (less than Wii U).

@Diddy_kong Even back then they still redefined the video game industry. With the SNES, they introduced the diamond pattern of buttons. With the N64, they introduced the 360 analog control stick. Nintendo is always redefining their controllers.

@memoryman3 yep, though data storage technology allows for larger. Expense does go up but over time technology improves and allows for more data in the same physical space at the same price. (ie. years ago a 1GB flash drive was like $30, today you can get something like 32GB for the same price).

Anyway that said believe it or not a lot of wiiU games don't exceed 8GBs. Also program binaries are fairly small. What really takes up space in a game is textures and sound. I doubt the program code for most games today even exceeds 1GB, it's the textures and sound taking up all the space. Keep in mind most 3ds games are less than 2GBs(that's with textures and sound included).

So what this would affect on a hybrid home/portable system is you ability to add higher res textures and less compressed sound(you can do a lot with just shaders). But there is space to add more. Also lets keep in mind the rate data is expanding, from DS to 3ds we went from a max of 512MB to 8GB. Now a similar expansion seems impossible but it means 16GB cards certainly wouldn't be unheard of with the next gen portable.

@memoryman3 they'd only go to 50 if they take a huge step up in texture resolution. To give you an idea, SWTOR, a full AAA MMO with voice acting for every single character and every single line in the entire game(including the player's character who which had a different voice actor for every class) was only 30GBs at launch. Also new data compression algorithms are discovered frequently. When we look at this on the hypothetical hybrid system, vertex count is already lower, sound is more compressed, and texture resolution is lower. So you're saving a lot of space right there.

Remember we're also dealing with nintendo's style here, a cartoon style scales up much better with much less effort than something more photorealistic.

Take a loot at what people have been able to do just upscaling GC and wii games. You won't believe they're running the same binary.

I dunno what to think of their QOL platform. I've never held interest in the Sports/Fit/Dance titles, as I would rather just go outside and ride my bike for excercise, or jump on a trampoline, etc. I game to cool off. So there's a good chance that Nintendo's QOL platform may not interest me. If the Wii-U fails or is discontinued early, I may just become a full time retro gamer and not invest in new systems anymore. I've got like a dozen consoles, every Nintendo system, and a number of others, from Atari 2600 to TG-16 and Genesis to Ouya and PS3, and enough backloggery to entertain myself a few years at least without buying a single new game. Still the huge lack of advertising is disconcerting, which IMO is largely responsible for Wii-U's failure to gain market share. Nintendo is making all these secretive press announcements catering to the investors, that don't really say much at all but cause their hardcore fanbase to become disillusioned and confused. I love my Wii-U, but if it goes the way of the dreamcast, I'll be done with modern gaming, save for maybe playing indie games for cheap on the latest Ouya revision.

Whatever they come up with next I just hope to be surprised, excited, and not disappointed because of corners cut and missing features, such as: no Dolby, analogue triggers or ethernet sockets. And for heaven's sake make it region-free.

I have no intention of abandoning Nintendo, but I'm hoping they aren't (still) desperately grasping as straws and have a solid plan (this time). Cranking out Mario's and having nothing to talk about while you checked off The List didn't work. The former made people too bored to get excited over 3D World, and the latter has left everyone with nothing to talk about.

NNID: sounds encouraging, mostly because I assume it's finally doing what everyone has been demanding for years; backing accounts like the competition. Use of NFC: might as well, you put it in there.

The amount of people complaining about Nintendo developing a new bit of kit seems a bit short sighted. As has been talked about many times when the Wii was released and when the 3DS was released, Nintendo start on the next machine immediately so they get a few years of development time and then years of refinement on top of that. And why does everyone assume the hardware Iwata mentions is a Wii U replacement and not the successor to the 3DS? If they announce that in a couple of years then release the year after it will have been a healthy 6 year lifespan and no-doubt (like the DS and GBA were) be supported for a while after.

@rjejr Was wondering if you consider RETRO studio games as Nintendo games? Totally agree about the franchises not yet seen on the Wii U, I know GameFreak are being total ^&%^&%"£ ends about putting a proper pokemon on a home console but if Nintendo made one anyway (a proper one not colosseum or snap) then the wii u would be the worlds number one selling console at least for that month, and I would give my first born for another home console Animal Crossing.

You know Satoru Iwata is talking but he is not saying much 'as usual'. Of course Nintendo are developing their next hardware and of course it is going to re-invent gaming same as Wii did and to a much lesser extent Wiiu.

With Iwata in charge Nintendo are going to keep trying to have a console that is different to Sony and M$ but it will be underpowered as usual. Nothing has changed .

Unfortunately I think it is the only way they can stay in the game because they can't enter the arms race to produce the most powerful console. They're business plan won't allow it, it is not an option they can't afford to take the risk because they know it wouldn't pay off.

I trust that Nintendo is working on new consoles; that's a natural process for a hardware-based video game company. All I care about is WHEN they'll make NNID account-based. Nintendo is extremely behind the curve when it comes to this issue.

@Blue-Thunder to a large extent the arms race hasn't really paid off for sony or microsoft either. People tend to forget just how bad the ps3 launch was. Their consoles havn't survived on the profitability of their consoles but on the larger corporation's ability to feed it with money.

I think people tend to forget a lot of history. Sony built their success on weaker consoles, as did nintendo(talk about power the gamegear played games in color when the GB couldn't even do that). And for that matter nintendo's power consoles were bombs. The current generation has kind of thrown a wrench into that so far but it's really more an anomaly than anything else at this point.

"we always want our users to play with our dedicated game systems that are specifically designed to provide such unique experiences, while at the same time, we may be able to select some portions of these games and make them available on other devices."

THIS is what I like. Give me the power to Streetpass content for Wii U games by using my phone or 3DS to send the signal. I know that the phone would become too stretched if it was all the time, but could you imagine the possibilities?

"I of course believe that launching new hardware will not produce good results unless we first make sure that those who have already purchased our platforms are satisfied. We will continue to work hard to ensure that consumers who already own our platforms are satisfied".

Forget what you heard... Iwata is a boss. Statements like these are worth far more than gold and silver in my book.

@rjejr - I'm pretty sure whatever the next platform is, it will have some level of backwards compatibility between Wii U and 3DS games and whatever comes next...it's WAY to early to speculate on anything realistically at this point.

I'm glad they have something in the works. It's nice knowing they learned their lesson with the pii u. Next console will probably be the nintendo we all know and love...and one that actually makes and doesn't lose money.

@Mahe You're right that the Wii U is driving customers away, but... so did the GameCube. That was the era where Nintendo began being "kiddy" to its former fans. Soon Nintendo brought everyone back with the Wii and I think they can do it again as long as they're innovative.

@ICHIkatakuri "Was wondering if you consider RETRO studio games as Nintendo games? "

Actually, yeah, in regards to Metroid and Donkey Kong, any company making those games, even if it was Sega, I would still consider them to be Nintendo games as they are well known recognizable and established Nintendo characters. So I guess that defeats all my previous comments huh? bummer

@yoko19191 Yeah, Gamecube and Wii ruined Nintendo's image with the "hardcore" gamers. Gamecube was seen as kiddy, while Wii was seen as something for only casuals.

Funny thing is, while the gaming community saw the Gamecube as kiddy, Nintendo had some pretty adult-themed advertising campaigns for GBA and the launch of DS. There was this magazine ad for GBA SP that had a guy laying in bed naked next to his girl playing his GBA, with the caption: "GBA SP - the second best thing to do in bed" Then there was the whole "Touching is good" campaign for DS.

D you really think anybody buying SM games cares about the frame rate? This isn't Drive Club. And kids buying handhelds for Pokemon don't care if it's SD, HD or 4K, they only care that it's Pokemon. or SM. I think you might be confusing Nintendo's fanbase w/ some other companies.

@Jampie - "So would it be impossible for Nintendo to ever make new franchises if their first party studio games don't even count as the ir own games? "

Nintendo could make all the new IP they want. They could outsource all their new and old IP to whoever they want, they could contiue to make Mario games playing whatever sport they want. The important point is that the games they "Want" to make are almost always going to be possible, and just as good, on a handheld compared to a hoe console. It's what Ninteod wants. That's what important. Nintendo doens't seem to want to make cinematic photorelaistic experiences that are more watching than playing, they don't want to include tons of spoken dialogue, they just want to make games, and to license games, that can be playable on a handheld.

If hey relaly wanted to make home console experiences they should have put Kid ICarus on a home console - spoken dialogue, fighting, violence,, story driven cut scenes. By putting that on a hadnheld really showed me they prefer to make hadnheld games over home. And the sequel to the Gmaecube's Luig' sMansion. Why wasnt the sequel to a home console game on a home console? Becuase they didn't want it to be.

What I took away from this was "In order to have rich and high-quality game experiences, we always want our users to play with our dedicated game systems that are specifically designed to provide such unique experiences, while at the same time, we may be able to select some portions of these games and make them available on other devices."

This could mean cross play in some form, or using 3DS and Wii U to create greater asymmetrical multiplayer experiences, and a selling point for me would be to use this to solve the current 'no multiplayer' function on Wii U's GBA VC.

@majorgamer
You do know that Child of Light was made by a traditionally AAA developer right? It wasn't indie.

@Jampie
Considering the low marketing of eShop games, the lukewarm reception of the Steel Diver franchise, and the highly controversial omission in Tomodachi Life, I wouldn't be surprised if gamers don't consider them "true" Nintendo games. Personally I'm interested in all of the above.

Tells me not to buy that trash Wii U. It was a good call to save my money. Video game consoles are supposed to be a years-long investment. Not something that is to be terminated in a mere 4 years. I learned from the SEGA Saturn.

@unrandomsam - "One platform doesn't have to mean only one system. Only that it uses the same games."

Been giving it some more thought - not like I have much choice w/ the auto emails flooding my inbox - and maybe you're right about the 2 systems. Seems to work for Apples iPods, iPads, and iPhones, and Samsung w/ their 7, 8, 10, 12 Tabs and Notes and several different size phones. Why not make a handheld that will sell well in Japan and to kids and a home version for the west and old folk like me all running the same games? Cross save will be a must.

Question for you - if they go this route would we need to buy the game twice, once for each system, or just once like PS3 and Vita cross buy games? Or would it depend on the game like Sony?

I'ld still prefer 1 portable system that would auto hook-up to a HDMI do-hicky when near the tv, less hassle for saves and such, but the 2 may make more sense w/ the release timing, 4DS portable in a year to replace 3DS (and DSi are gone) and a home version 4DTV a year or so later to replace Wii U.

@rjejr given his completely lack of knowlege of what unity even is I doubt you're going to get much.

Read some of my posts on it, you can achieve a lot with upscaling and shader swapping. You could offer for download kind of a patch for high res textures, uncompressed sound and other things on the home console but it otherwise runs the portable games. They could even make it so you only have to buy one console(ie the home console could play the cards and download from the same eshop). You'd need to be able to sync your save for those who buy two(course if it's on the cart that's not a problem at all but for digital games it would need the feature).

Nintendo of course would have to decide they don't want to actually push a system to it's limits(and they generally havn't).

@rjejr@Yorumi Give this more thought,what if Nintendo wants to create the next step in 3D ZELDA games. Open world, epic horseback combat, lush dungeons and what not. It works well on the console but struggles to work on the handheld. The game would have to be downgraded to work on the handheld and the console. How would that work?

What if the handheld doesn't have enough buttons? What if the handheld is less powerful than the Wii U. How would multiplayer work? Would the next handheld really do well against smartphones?

If one fails, both will be brought down. That's why I think handhelds and consoles should stay very very far away from each other.

@brandonbwii Actually I didn't know that it was developed my Ubisoft until you brought it up. Just goes to show that no matter how much gaming you know and read, you can still miss some out on some pretty obvious stuff.

Anyway, thanks for reading my post and my point stands that Nintendo are starting to aggressively support indie developers to encourage them to become Nintendo developers. believe a story was posted on this website today talking about one such developer (Goodbye Galaxy)!

Thanks again for the info and I will try to be more careful with my comments in the future.

@memoryman3 that's because you don't understand what I'm saying about this. The fact that it's 2d has nothing at all to do with what's going on in the graphics pipeline. Please take some time to study up on shaders and in general how modern graphics pipelines work, as well as taking a look at some of the upscaled screenshots people have produced of GC and wii games. Those shots are made with the models that are in the game, they're just upscaling the resolution and adding some new shaders.

And again I need to reiterate this, the 3ds is slightly more powerful than a wii.

@memoryman3 The point of the upscaling is to show how much improvement can be seen with minimal investment. Wii games are using a fixed function pipeline so you can only do the most minimal post processing on them. The wiiU and 3ds are running a shader pipeline which is night and day different. You would know this if you took my advice and looked up how a modern pipeline works. Even with that you can get a lot more out of them but simply upscaling.

Unlike a fixed function pipeline a shader pipeline is capable of creating entirely new geometry, subdividing existing primitives, adding light sources and light effects, and even beefing up ai and physics through the use of compute shaders.

Finally you're using a straw man, I never said you could achieve the same results as hand crafting a game from scratch. What I said is that you can achieve very good graphical results and nintendo's style scales up very well.

Because of your refusal to even look up basic things you're essentially trying to argue something is impossible to a person who knows how to do it.

@memoryman3 - "what if Nintendo wants to create the next step in 3D ZELDA games. Open world, epic horseback combat, lush dungeons and what not."

I've been waiting for that since the Gamecube demonstration, I don't think Nintneod wants to go there unfortuantely. Zelda games don't even have spoken english languages yet. Spyro the Dragon on PS1 and all his dragon pals spoke english.

"What if the handheld doesn't have enough buttons?"

You are talking about the company that gave us the Wiimote, they don't care about buttons. And besides, the Gamepad lay-out is almost exactly the same as the 3DS and DS before it, why would a handheld not have enough buttons?

"If one fails, both will be brought down. That's why I think handhelds and consoles should stay very very far away from each other."

Well that makes sense, it is putting all of their eggs in 1 basket. Thats why I rethought my stance on that and conceded earlier today that 2 systems was a plausible option. I still think 1, b/c 1 would work if its mainly portable w/ tv out, but I'm ok w/ 2 also.

but that it's still prioritising satisfying the current generation of gamers

That is such a joke. The direction Iwata wants to go is everywhere EXCEPT appealing to hardcore gamers. He wants to Apple and Smartphone gaming market which simple don't give to craps about home consoles.

Since you seem so knowledgeable about the topic you wouldn't happen to know a good website which lists all of Nintendo's development groups and the games they make would you? I've been really interested in this stuff since Kid Icarus and Pikmin 3 apparently pushed back SSB production b/c there is only so much of Miyamoto to go around. I know Project Sora went away after Kid Icarus. The wiki site is a bit confusing:

Guess I'm wondering when we'll see another Sluggers or Strikers or Sports Mix - I'm assuming they're all the same group. And Wii U needs a Paper Mario though Sticker Star just came out 1 1/2 years ago but I doubt 3DS people would be working on a Wii U game. Guess I'm looking for something along the lines of this: