Remember the flap a few years ago to not call illegal aliens by such a term, and how it was decreed they should henceforth be known as???

MIGRANT WORKERS.

The arguement then was that they were not "aliens."

Aliens then meant, at that time, that which was not born of the land.

They were so insulted by the definition they thought it meant "not of this earth" (extraterrestrials) so therefore it was made to look politically correct by the term "migrant workers."

This term still is not a correct definition of those foreigners who squat on US soil, sorry to say.

It was on the agenda of Bush and as well, now with Obama, to change our immigration laws.

The real problems are that the laws we have in place are fine but the US Government chose not to enforce them for the sake of workers to lower wages and to entice illegal aliens the world over to come to America to work.

Now I'll never sleep. I was OK that this issue wouldn't end the world at least for the next 8 hours, but now I'm not going to be able to sleep for wondering if my Constitution will read the same a week from now.

In a MAJOR political move, Obama appears on live TV to announce the death of Osama Bin Laden earlier that day.

People, this is a CUT AND DRY "Wag the Dog" Scenario! Our government has known Bin Laden's whereabouts for at least five years, but they have been keeping him alive for a "Politically Expedient Moment". That moment came last Sunday, and was used to distract the publics attention once and for all from his eligibility. The birth certificate NEVER WAS THE ISSUE! And with the disappearance of the definition from online dictionaries, there can be no refuting that SOMEBODY IS HIDING SOMETHING!

Quoting: Revolution

You're the one who needs to

WAKE THE FUCK UP!!!

Quoting: Revolution

If you believe we actually killed him last week. Sorry but my bs meter went off the charts when I got to that part.

Yeah, OK then. So lets say a US female visits Paris during her summer off from college, is raped, becomes impregnated, returns to the US to complete her studies and has the baby here on US soil.

That child would not be a citizen?

If that is the case, then why all of the Lobertarian uproar over 'anchor babies'?

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1158628

YES! The baby would be a citizen, UNDER the 14th AMENDMENT. But unless it can be verified that the child has TWO AMERICAN PARENTS, it WILL NOT be a Natural Born Citizen!

Quoting: Revolution

Did you know:

Only six other U.S. presidents had a foreign-born parent. Mr. Obama will be the first in nearly ninety years, since President Herbert Hoover was inaugurated in 1929.

Andrew Jackson (1829-1837) is the only president born of two immigrants, both Irish. Presidents with one immigrant parent are Thomas Jefferson (1801-1809), whose mother was born in England, James Buchanan (1857-1861) and Chester Arthur (1881-1885), both of whom had Irish fathers, and Woodrow Wilson (1913-1921) and Herbert Hoover (1929-1933), whose mothers were born respectively in England and Canada.

... Vattel, who, though not very full to this point, is more explicit and more satisfactory on it than any other whose work has fallen into my hands, says:

“The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives or indigenes are those born in the country of parents who are citizens. Society not being able to subsist and to perpetuate itself but by the children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and succeed to all their rights.

“The inhabitants, as distinguished from citizens, are strangers who are permitted to settle and stay in the country. Bound by their residence to the society, they are subject to the laws of the state while they reside there, and they are obliged to defend it…

United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898)

In this case, Wong Kim Ark, the son of 2 resident Chinese aliens, claimed U.S. Citizenship and was vindicated by the court on the basis of the 14th Amendment. In this case the Justice Gray gave the opinion of the court. On p. 168-9 of the record, He cites approvingly the decision in Minor vs. Happersett:

At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the Constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children, born in a country of parents who were its citizens, became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives, or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners.

BOTH Natural born AND natural born citizen now return NO RESULTS in searches on ALL active online dictionaries, with the sole exception of Wikipedia, redirects to Wikipedia, and quotes from Wikipedia.

IT'S A FUCKING COVER-UP, PEOPLE!

.

Quoting: Revolution

.

OP,

In the last 150 years, Congress has tried -- and failed --nearly 30 times to define National-born Citizen.

The last attempt was in 2004, with "S. 2128: Natural Born Citizen Act", which like all its predecessorsnever made it out of committee.

It's OBVIOUS that Congress believes Natural-born Citizen currently requires TWO parents to be U.S. Citizens, and that "natural born Citizen" means something DIFFERENT when applied to the Constitutional requirement to be President (as opposed to how the term might be derived from granted naturalized Citizenship).

"No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States."

----------------

notice the or, meaning a different clasification from natural born citizen

In general, a natural-born citizen of a country is someone who is legally recognized as that country's citizen as of the moment of birth, rather than by acquiring citizenship afterwards through naturalization.

In the United States, a person is considered to be born a citizen either due to place of birth within U.S. territorial jurisdiction (jus soli) or through descent from a U.S. citizen (jus sanguinis), or through some combination of those two elements.

"Natural born citizen" as presidential qualificationThe special term "natural born Citizen" is used in particular as a requirement for eligibility to serve as President or Vice-President of the United States. Article II, Section 1, clause 5 of the U.S. Constitution states that:

No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States. The fourteenth amendment to the United State Constitution provides an additional source of constitutional doctrine that emphasizes birth "in the United States" and subjection to U.S. jurisdiction at the time of birth, as the defining elements of citizenship (other than citizenship by naturalization):

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the Jurisdiction thereof, are Citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. . ." Amendment XIV, section 1. However, the full text of the fourteenth amendment does not mention the phrase "natural-born citizen" nor does it address Presidential qualifications in any way and thus provides little guidance in this matter. In fact, the phrase "natural born Citizen" isn't defined anywhere in the Constitution and its interpretation has never been squarely the subject of a U.S. Supreme Court ruling. Significantly, however, Congress, in which a number of Framers sat, provided in the Naturalization Act of 1790 that "the children of citizens of the United States, that may be born beyond the sea, . . . shall be considered as natural born citizens. . . ." This strongly suggests that the framers of the Constitution understood this phrase to refer to citizenship acquired at birth (whether or not that birth had taken place on U.S. soil).

The current effective federal statute, Title 8, Section 1401 ( [link to frwebgate.access.gpo.gov] first passed by Congress on June 27, 1952 and last amended on October 25, 1994, of the U.S. Code provides details on the circumstances under which persons are legally recognized by the United States to be "nationals and citizens of the United States at birth".

Some legal experts interpret "natural-born citizen" to mean a "citizen at birth." Under one such interpretation, anyone who is duly recognized as a "citizen at birth" persuant to the requirements of Title 8, Section 1401 of the U.S. Code would be considered eligible for the Presidency or Vice-Presidency.

However, this statutory argument is weakened by the following considerations:

Congress probably did not intend to address presidential qualifications in the statute codified at 8 U.S.C. Section 1401, because the law actually passed by Congress does not purport to relate to the "natural born Citizen" qualification for president under Article II; and Even assuming that it was the intent of Congress to define the constitutional qualification "natural born Citizen," an enactment by Congress would be insufficient to change the Constitution. The U.S. Supreme Court's reasoning in United States v. Won Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898)(which held that a person born within the jurisdiction of the U.S. but to noncitizens is thereby automatically a citizen) has been viewed by some legal scholars as indicating that a person born abroad, even to parents of U.S. citizens, does not constitue a "natural born" citizen. Likewise, Weedin v. Chin Bow, 274 U.S. 657, 663 (1927) recites that "under the common law which applied in his country, the children of citizens born abroad were not citizens but were aliens." But no Supreme Court case has yet squarely addressed what "natural born Citizen" means in the context of Article II, Section 1, clause 5 of the U.S. Constitution.

The only way for this issue to be conclusively determined would be for the United States Supreme Court to decide this precise question in an actual case. This means that someone who was born abroad, but who held U.S. citizenship from birth through a parent, would have to run for the presidency and be challenged, and then the case would have to make its way to the Supreme Court for a decision.

Throughout American history, several persons born abroad to U.S. citizen parents have sought the Presidency and none were challenged on their eligibility during their election campaigns. The most recent example of such a person was John McCain, born in Panama, who sought the Republican nomination for President in 2000. However, Senator McCain was actually born in the Panama Canal Zone, which means that he was born in a territory subject to United States jurisdiction. It seems likely that a person born on a U.S.-flag boat, or born in a territory under U.S. jurisdiction (for example, Barry Goldwater, who was born in Arizona before it became a state), or possibly even a person born in a U.S. embassy or consular office inside another country, would be included as "natural-born," under the legal fiction that a U.S. consulate is within the territorial jurisdiction of the United States.

Of historical note, Martin Van Buren was actually the first "natural born citizen" to become President. Prior Presidents had been born British subjects and were not "natural-born Citizens" but were eligible because they qualified by being "a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution."

Yeah, OK then. So lets say a US female visits Paris during her summer off from college, is raped, becomes impregnated, returns to the US to complete her studies and has the baby here on US soil.

That child would not be a citizen?

If that is the case, then why all of the Lobertarian uproar over 'anchor babies'?

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1158628

yes, it would be a citizenbut, not from two married U.S. citizens who are the parents

it would be a citizen because only the U.S. mother is claimed as the parent

whether it would be a natural born citizen is a different matter -- maybe because there is only one parent claiming the child and that parent is a U.S. citizen then yes, it would probably be a natural born citizen, too.

what folks are not realizing is that "citizen" and "natural born citizen" are not necessarily the same definition.

It's utterly amazing how gullible and outright stupid some of you people are. I have a Webster's dictionary from 1987, a Webster's New World Student Dictionary and pocket Oxford..."natural born citizen" isn't in any of them.

Yeah, OK then. So lets say a US female visits Paris during her summer off from college, is raped, becomes impregnated, returns to the US to complete her studies and has the baby here on US soil.

That child would not be a citizen?

If that is the case, then why all of the Lobertarian uproar over 'anchor babies'?

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1158628

YES! The baby would be a citizen, UNDER the 14th AMENDMENT. But unless it can be verified that the child has TWO AMERICAN PARENTS, it WILL NOT be a Natural Born Citizen!

Quoting: Revolution

Did you know:

Only six other U.S. presidents had a foreign-born parent. Mr. Obama will be the first in nearly ninety years, since President Herbert Hoover was inaugurated in 1929.

Andrew Jackson (1829-1837) is the only president born of two immigrants, both Irish. Presidents with one immigrant parent are Thomas Jefferson (1801-1809), whose mother was born in England, James Buchanan (1857-1861) and Chester Arthur (1881-1885), both of whom had Irish fathers, and Woodrow Wilson (1913-1921) and Herbert Hoover (1929-1933), whose mothers were born respectively in England and Canada.

Unfortunately for those pieces of poop...many people actually already looked these terms up already. I WOULD get incredibly angry about this, but I think that is their goal and they FEED on emotions. Did any of you foreigners actually look the terms up out of curiosity? NOW do you see why so many Americans detest that POS?

"For instance, Mexicans who give birth to a child right after they swim the Rio Grande have natural born citizens as babies. They call them anchor babies and they are natural born citizens."

Wrong....those who swim the Rio Grande and give birth to babies..here...those babies are Called: NATIVE BORN, NOT "NATURAL BORN"----There is a difference. Natural Born means BOTH parents hold citizenship.

Yeah, OK then. So lets say a US female visits Paris during her summer off from college, is raped, becomes impregnated, returns to the US to complete her studies and has the baby here on US soil.

That child would not be a citizen?

If that is the case, then why all of the Lobertarian uproar over 'anchor babies'?

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1158628

YES! The baby would be a citizen, UNDER the 14th AMENDMENT. But unless it can be verified that the child has TWO AMERICAN PARENTS, it WILL NOT be a Natural Born Citizen!

Quoting: Revolution

Did you know:

Only six other U.S. presidents had a foreign-born parent. Mr. Obama will be the first in nearly ninety years, since President Herbert Hoover was inaugurated in 1929.

Andrew Jackson (1829-1837) is the only president born of two immigrants, both Irish. Presidents with one immigrant parent are Thomas Jefferson (1801-1809), whose mother was born in England, James Buchanan (1857-1861) and Chester Arthur (1881-1885), both of whom had Irish fathers, and Woodrow Wilson (1913-1921) and Herbert Hoover (1929-1933), whose mothers were born respectively in England and Canada.

Could you please tone it down with the death/cancer stuff?Waay too angry-it could be a personal problem?IF this is true, it isn't even the fault of Obama you know. If it is true, can't you imagine what a terrible position he really would be in?Also, there are many people who have suffered from cancer in one way or another, (lost loved-ones or suffered from it...), and seeing someone cursed with it tends to make people wonder/ or even think that they have suffered from cancer because they deserved it.-Cancer is horrible and wishing it on people that you are angry-with condemns everyone who has been afflicted by it in my opinion.

OP has an interesting and compelling-maybe important topic here. Only on page 4 but it has veered-away from the idea that someone/something is changing the truth/facts right before our eyes.

Even the question of The President's birth is irrelevant to the topic, except for possible motive for this particular instance of reverse-propaganda, or info.-scrubbing, censorship, whatever it is called these days.

I'm wondering if there is an effort to derail this topic with the intense anger? It makes me personally uncomfortable seeing it and this topic deserves better.

I'm sick of seeing you post this repeatedly on my thread, so please stop.

"when injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty"—Adam Kokesh

“Then join hand in hand, brave Americans all! By uniting we stand, by dividing we fall!”—John Dickenson, The Liberty Song

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.”—Samuel Adams

"When you see that trading is done, not by consent, but by compulsion - when you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing - when you see that money is flowing to those who deal, not in goods, but in favors - when you see that men get richer by graft and by pull than by work, and your laws don't protect you against them, but protect them against you - when you see corruption being rewarded and honesty becoming a self-sacrifice - you may know that your society is doomed."—Ayn Rand

Natural born citizen refers to a person upon which citizenship is the result of being born on American soil.

There is no other definition.

A person born in another country of parents that are Americanis a cit zen, but not natural born.

A person who is naturalized comes here as a citizen of another country.

Obama is a natural born citizen if he was born in Hawaii, even if his daddy was Hitler

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1124613

you are wrong.

a person born in another ocuntry of paretns that are American ARE natural born.

read the Congressional Record pages above.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1371918

Yeah, and a person that criticizes jews is an antisemitic.

Not an anti-Semite, an antisemitic.

In other words, natural born can mean whatever you want it to mean, but natural born citizen is just what it sounds like.

For instance, Mexicans who give birth to a child right after they swim the Rio Grande have natural born citizens as babies. They call them anchor babies and they are natural born citizens.

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1124613

Stop trying to argue Obama's case here troll. We know what you are, and that you will never agree with the truth even though you know it to be so.

Face it, the idiots on Capitol Hill screwed up, and are in absolute cover mode now - with you likely being a part of that. Neat thing is that it's gonna get even more fun soon when Corsi's book is released (which is what started this whole thing).

Obama and his ilk have been lying for so long, I don't think they even know how to tell the truth. Unfortunately for them, there's enough of us that do...

why do you peeps give a shit?? really?? youre the same fucking tards preaching that it doesnt matter who the president is anyway.???

i get it youre racist and dont want a black pres, get over it already. maybe put down the fuckin twinkies next election, roll off your fat ass, and waddle into a voting booth. til then shut the fuck up

Be aware of what you KNOW and what you BELIEVE. Don't ever let what you believe block the path of knowledge, for knowledge is truth. Belief is a temporary crutch at best, and crutches are for disabled people.

Yeah, OK then. So lets say a US female visits Paris during her summer off from college, is raped, becomes impregnated, returns to the US to complete her studies and has the baby here on US soil.

That child would not be a citizen?

If that is the case, then why all of the Lobertarian uproar over 'anchor babies'?

Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1158628

YES! The baby would be a citizen, UNDER the 14th AMENDMENT. But unless it can be verified that the child has TWO AMERICAN PARENTS, it WILL NOT be a Natural Born Citizen!

Quoting: Revolution

Did you know:

Only six other U.S. presidents had a foreign-born parent. Mr. Obama will be the first in nearly ninety years, since President Herbert Hoover was inaugurated in 1929.

Andrew Jackson (1829-1837) is the only president born of two immigrants, both Irish. Presidents with one immigrant parent are Thomas Jefferson (1801-1809), whose mother was born in England, James Buchanan (1857-1861) and Chester Arthur (1881-1885), both of whom had Irish fathers, and Woodrow Wilson (1913-1921) and Herbert Hoover (1929-1933), whose mothers were born respectively in England and Canada.