Welcome to the GWTW Forum.Guests (non-registered users) can view the forum but are unable to post. If you don't have anything to say then why would you bother to register?One of the most popular sections of the GWTW Forum has long been the Swap Meet. A great place to sell old, seldom flown kites or to get great deals on used (gently flown) kites. Only registered users can see the Swap Meet section, let alone wheel and deal. 1000's (literally) of kites have changed hands thanks to the Swap Meet.There are several more benefits to being a registered user, but you'll have to join our little community to find out all the "secrets".Questions or concerns? Contact Steve ... just drop an email to: forum.gwtwkites@gmail.com

OK, I know this has been covered in many areas. But I dont have acess to flying many of these. I am currently still learning... My only UL is a Shadow. Lovely kite, but the learning curve on it for me is just fustrating. I know all my inputs are way to large. I do have a premier widow. Great kite for the money, I have a lgihter bridle on it which has helped me practice in some low winds but not quite low enough. So, here in lies my quandry. I want a slow moving, slightly forgivable full size kite. I have flown a few Nirvanas and like the style of them. But cant afford a $400+ kite. So my debate thus far is a WidowMaker UL, Mantis UL, and a heavily suggested Genesis UL. I havent flown a WM or a Genesis. Would love a suggestion, trying to even look out for a used one, or if there is a better option in some opinions that would be apprecaited. I live inland WA, so I am forced to deal with light winds much more than normal winds. I am looking for a trick oriented kite though, precision is fun, but I am trying to learn tricks..

Maybe I missed something, but it seems the specs on the Talon UL is about the same as the Vendetta. With the bigger sail area on the Vendetta, I doubt there is significant difference in the wind ranges. Now I admit that is speculation on my part since I have never flown the UL model of the Talon, but I can't see enough difference in the specs to call one a "true" UL vs the other.

The Vendetta and Exile ULs are both great kites and I have flown both in winds you can barely feel (2 mph?) They did fine. In the price range you are discussing, the Blue Moon Muse UL would fit the bill too.

The Vendetta UL does require a good bit more wind than most others. When there is not quite enough wind for most standards though, it is a really sweet kite. Having flown both it and the talon, the talon does go a bit lower without loosing much trickability.

The talon is a different style than the nirvana/vendetta type kites. Not bad at all, and it does a lot of things better, but it is very different.

All the kites listed are going to take more wind than the Shadow, which is truly almost an SUL.

People are listing preferences based on their own experience, of course, but recognize your Shadow is a lower wind trickster than any other listed in this thread. Personally, with a bridle adjustment, I consider the Shadow to be an exceptional low wind trick kite (with a lot of oversteer, granted).

As I've said before, if you can't decide or fly before you buy, get the one you think is the prettiest. You're going to be looking at it for a long time.

Blue Moon makes the best UL kites. Ken's kites are framed as UL's, but fly like SUL's. The advantage being a heavier framed kite, that will trick in very low winds. The Exile is the trickier, then the Mantis, but the Mantis will fly in lower winds. I've flown my Mantis UL, when people on the field where struggling with their SUL's.

The Talon is a free style kite, that is very well mannered. It rolls up and pitches, very easily. Blue Moon is probably better at the rotation stuff, while the Talon is better at the pitch tricks.

When the wind is low enough and you can see the leaves blowing on trees 40 feet up but it's not blowing on the ground you're better off with the Shadow probably because it's going to be so light that even if you do manage to get your kite up in the air it's not going to be there long enough for you to try mastering a new trick and then it's back on the ground. For wind like that you might as well enjoy your Shadow.

You'll need to have a reliable wind speed to work on learning tricksso any of these kites would be good. I have a Widow Maker standard which I love. I also have an Exile which is very nice but is harder to trick than the WM when the wind picks up a bit.They both go pretty low so I imagine the ULs would be even better.

Don't think that there's one kite that's going to be hugely better than another. They're all good but the pilot's skill is what makes the difference. Pilot skill takes time and trial and error. If the wind is too low it CAN be more frustrating. So pick a kite that looks good to you!

Our forum is made possible by the good folks whose ads appear above and by the members of our community (PayPal donation button at top)In case you missed it each ad is linked to the sponsors web site. So please, take a moment and visit our sponsors sites as this forum wouldn't be possible with out them.Interested in running an ad for your business or kiting event? Contact Steve at advertise.gwtwkites@gmail.com for a quote.