Why I don’t want women to become ‘equal to men’

We need to stop saying that women want to be equal to men – or that we are striving for women to be seen as the ‘same as men in society’.

After many a frustrating conversation with people who have somehow managed to mix up egalitarianism, equalism and feminism, this blog feels timely.

There’s only so many times we should have to explain that feminism is NOT a movement to make women equal to men. Feminism undoubtedly means different things to different people, but can we stop watering it down now? The dumbing down of feminism has gone too far in the third wave. I have heard feminism defined as everything from ‘the belief that all people are equal’ to ‘feminists believe that women should be the same as men in society.’ What? Nah.

Feminism is not ‘for the equality of all people’. Feminism is not ‘the belief that women should be treated the same as men.’ Feminism is not ‘the movement to make women equal to men in society.’ Feminism is not equalism.

Feminism is the liberation of women and girls all over the world from the patriarchy and misogyny that continues to harm and oppress them as a class of people. Feminism centres women unflinchingly and unapologetically. Feminism is the conversation about women’s issues in the world; without having to add some tokenistic sentence at the end acknowledging that men also experience some things too. Yah, we know. But we are talking about women right now, so hush.

The problem with saying that we are working towards women becoming equal to men is that it frames men and male cultures as being the optimum culture or the ideal goal that women should reach to become equal.

I’m here to say: what a crock of shit.

For women to be valid, whole human beings in society – feminism has got to move beyond this notion that women are striving for what men already have. I don’t want anything men already have. None of it. It’s a mess.

If we take modern men and male experiences as the ‘goal’ level for women to achieve in personal life and society, what would success look like?

Would success mean that women’s suicide rates rise to the same levels as the male suicide rate because as women reach ‘equality’ they must follow the patriarchal value of eradicating ‘feminine’ emotions and expressions, including talking about their feelings and seeking help?

Would success mean that women’s cancer mortality rates rise to the same rates as men because as women finally reach the almighty peak of maleness, they also stop seeking help for medical issues because of embarrassment, and just like men do now; they begin waiting until a health problem has become unbearable before they seek help, meaning cancer has usually spread and is more complex to treat?

Would success mean that women significantly increase their rates of violent crime and interpersonal violence to match that of men around the world?

Would success mean that women increase their murders of their partners and ex partners by at least 200% to match the rates of women killed by male partners and ex partners each year?

Would success mean that women increase their rates of sexual violence, trafficking and exploitation of men and boys at an unprecedented rate never before seen in history to achieve ‘equality with men’?

Would success mean that women become the most likely group to die in gun and knife violence with other women all over the world?

Would success mean that women working in aid roles begin abusing, sexually assaulting and sexually exploiting boys in deprived areas to match the male role model we currently have?

Would success mean women in power developing regimes in which baby boys were murdered or aborted because no one wanted a son?

Would success mean that women must begin carrying out many more terrorist acts and mass murders all over the world, especially school shootings – to claim equality with the men?

Is this what we mean by ‘feminism is the movement to make women equal to men’? Or when we say this, do we just mean the ‘good’ bits like higher salaries and more power in society?

It’s not. This is the stuff of nightmares. No one wants this. Even people who claim to hate feminism and claim that women should be equal to men in all arenas don’t REALLY want to see this level of sex equality. No one wants this in the world. No one wants women to step up to match what men already have.

I don’t think we’ve thought through this whole ‘we want women to be equal to men’ thing. I don’t think we have realised that we have framed male issues and experiences as the goal we are all supposedly striving for, and what that would actually mean for us all. All sorts of people hark on about how women finally being ‘the same as men’ in society would mean that we were respected, paid higher wages and would be safer. It’s bollocks.

The reality is, we cannot assume that what men in have society is the standard we should be striving for as women. Men are miserable and harmed daily by the patriarchy – they just haven’t figured it out yet. Men’s rights activists kick off on twitter about male suicide rates but don’t look into the way male gender role stereotypes they support; are harming them every day. Campaigns argue that men and boys are also victims of rape and that is absolutely true – but do not admit that the vast majority of perpetrators of those crimes are men. Activists argue that men are significantly more likely to be killed in violence than women which is also correct – but the fact that more than 97% of violence and murders are committed by men seems to escape them. I’ve even seen campaigns from men’s rights activists arguing that family courts are biased against fathers and men – and there is some truth in that claim – but to them I say this:

The laws about family court weren’t written by women. The legislation about children remaining with their mothers was not signed off by women. The majority of all judges are men. Legislators were men. Policymakers were men. The research that the majority of family court attachment and bonding theory was based on came from JOHN Bowlby. A man. A lot of the legislation and policies were developed in a time where men were the breadwinners and women were the childrearers. It made sense to the men in power that women should take care of the babies and men should go out and do important man things. Nowadays, MRAs are positioning that as ‘reverse sexism’ – but actually, its a legacy from the patriarchy. The assumption that you wouldn’t want to play an active part in your kids’ lives, dreamt up, supported by, signed off by and judged by your fellow patriarchal family court judge. Think about it. Women were not in influential positions at the time these systems were being developed. Women did not orchestrate these patriarchal systems. Men did.

All of the things wrong with society at present (and all of the things that even MRAs hate about society), were created by, funded by, legislated by, demanded by, invented by and sold by men. Therefore, why should feminism support a movement of women ‘becoming equal to men’? In fact, why should we be using male experience and cultures around the world as a blueprint at all?

There is something important to be said here. Feminism is the movement towards liberation of women and girls from the oppression and control of the patriarchy – but actually, the real change will come for the world when we rise up and dismantle the patriarchy together. The destruction of patriarchal and misogynistic values benefits everyone.

As a woman who is proudly radical feminist, is a specialist in the psychology of sexual violence against women and girls – but is also the Chair and Founder of the first male mental health and wellbeing centre in the UK, serving around 150 men per month – I can see that the patriarchy is killing all of us.

Men come into our centre having been abused, neglected, sexually exploited, having suffered with mental health issues and lived in misery for decades and they sit in front of us and say ‘I thought I should just shut up and put up – be a real man and not ask for help.’ Men so harmed by gender role stereotypes that they cry in therapy and then apologise for crying because it means they are not a ‘real man’.

The best way I have found to explain it to people is that the patriarchy harms men, but oppresses women. Often times, men hear us talk about the patriarchy oppressing, killing and dehumanising women – and when we say ‘patriarchy’ they hear ‘all men’. Hence the annoying phrase NAMALT (not all men are like that!).

My view, is that if men could detach themselves from the patriarchy and see how it harms them and makes them miserable, they would stop fighting against feminism as a movement. However, and this is important, it does mean that we have to actively challenge the warped current wave of liberal feminism which oftentimes completely contradicts itself and props up the patriarchy in a number of concerning ways. Not least by claiming that these gender role stereotypes are real, innate qualities and not social constructs that harm us all.

To explain how the patriarchal values of our world harm men and women, I’ve made this handy table:

(You can zoom in on this image if it displays too small)

The point is this:

Men are not the blueprint.

The current epidemic of male violence cannot be the standard we all strive for. Men are coerced into, are propping up and are being harmed by patriarchal values. They don’t have it right. We should not be trying to emulate that. We should not be striving to become equal with men in their patriarchal misery – we should be challenging and dismantling the patriarchy and its global values until we can revolt.

True change in the world will only come with revolution. Revolution is not possible if we perceive male privilege and male experience as the ‘goal’ women should be working towards in the world. We don’t want to be the ‘same as men’. Why would be want to replicate a broken system? Why would we work towards total misery and increased violence?

I don’t know about you, but my vision for women is not that we become more violent, more misogynistic, more miserable, less able to speak about our emotions, less able to seek help, more likely to bully each other for ‘feminine traits’ and so confused that we begin celebrating the same toxic masculinity that is harming us every day.

That’s not my feminism. That’s not my vision for us all.

Imagine for a second, if we did dismantle the patriarchal beliefs and cultures centuries of male power have created for us. A world where men can show their emotions without worrying that someone will call them the ultimate insult: a woman. A society where women are not objectified as sex toys to be used up and thrown away when they get older or imperfect. A world in which teenage boys are not having to visit therapists and doctors about their erectile dysfunction and addiction to porn. A society in which rape isn’t a constant threat to women and girls all over the world – and a joke told about men in prison. A life in which men can participate and enjoy parenthood in equality with the mothers of their children because they believe their role is just as important. A workplace where a pregnant woman isn’t managed out of her job because she is perceived as unreliable – but where a man whose wife is pregnant is promoted for becoming a ‘responsible family man’. A world where women can become the main breadwinners and not make men feel insecure about it. A community where men can stay at home with the kids admiring the tenacity of the mother of his kids who rakes in the cash in a job she loves.

A world where the patriarchy no longer controls women, kills female babies because they were unwanted, hacks off vulva and clitoris of women, revels in porn, excuses everything with rape myths, positions ‘woman’ as the ultimate insult to men, sells women’s bodies and denies women the right to healthcare and advice about their own reproductive systems.

True feminism is revolution. Feminism is the liberation of women from the values and systems of the patriarchy. Feminism is the movement to challenge and dismantle the patriarchy, raising new generations of humans that do not fall into the same tropes we have. Feminism is not about centring men in our discussions or our events – but feminism will inevitably support men to be healthier and happier.

I don’t want to be ‘equal to men’. I want to rip up the blueprint and smash up the patriarchy and start again with our new generations. I want us all to take a step back, breathe and realise that the patriarchy harms all of us, and claiming that feminism is about women working towards being ‘the same as men’ in society is us moving in the wrong direction. And yet, the patriarchy in power are scared of women becoming more networked and more influential – because they know it will dilute the power of the patriarch.

With all the harm done to men by the patriarchy, I find myself asking men – what are you clinging on to it for? What is it about feminism that scares you? What is it about femininity that makes you feel so insecure? What do you stand to lose if we one day break down the patriarchal powers in the world?

Once we can answer those questions honestly and with integrity, we can take the first steps to breaking down the patriarchy and the patriarchal values, myths and messages being communicated all over the world.

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Published by jessicapsych

Psychologist specialising in victim blaming and self blame following sexual violence. International independent specialist researcher and writer for www.victimfocus.org.uk - Founder of VictimFocus, The VictimFocus Charter and VictimFocus Academy. Founder and Chair of The Eaton Foundation, the first male mental health centre in the UK.
Known to some as 'that woman with the fringe who talks about victim blaming and feminism all the damn time'.
View all posts by jessicapsych

532 thoughts on “Why I don’t want women to become ‘equal to men’”

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Basically it all comes down to stereotypes. Our society always comes down to them. It’s what we cling on to and it’s time we let them go. What a wonderful it would be! So when do we start that revolution?

If she does “not want” anything men have created, she should be the first to sell her car (man invented), never step foot on a plane (men invented), sell her clothes (cotton gin), remove her tampon and bleed all over (man in India invented), not type on her computer (man invented), lose the glasses (man invented), the scissors she cuts her hair with (man), and pretty much everything else.

Instead of being so pissy, maybe she should be more grateful for the fact that everything that keeps her from living in a grass hut, was invented by…

Well, honey. Besides COMPLETELY missing the point of this article, you’ve also riddled your response with historical inaccuracies, and you’ve boiled down human invention (sciences, art, etc) to some kind of singular entity. There’s no way in flying hell that anybody invents shit on their own. Reality is more complicated than mere propaganda.

When you can go back in time about 1-2 billion years to attempt stopping the emergence of sexual reproduction and just let unicellular cells to reside on this planet.
Only that will stop so called gender “stereotypes”.

I was researching editorials for a project in English and I happened to come across this. You presented your argument so eloquently that I could not resist reading the rest of your works and making an account just to comment. I know that this is somewhat wrong to say, but I have never heard a feminist with your same way of thinking and same skill of persuasion, and I love that you seem to be your own person.

I’m really sorry but I don’t like this article. I agree women deserve rights and that men need to learn respect. But feminism is just basically shaming men and not changing anything. And not all men are bad there are plenty good. And men have their own problems in fact now a days women are extremely excepted and not limited while guys still have those pressures e.g. if a girl likes super man or boxing she can get away with it while if a guy likes barbie or dancing they can’t. Girls have it much better now a days if you ask me. Why do you think the suicide rates are higher for men?

“And not all men are bad there are plenty good.” Never said that in the article.

“men have their own problems in fact now a days women are extremely excepted and not limited while guys still have those pressures” This is due to patriarchal belief which in RadFem approach is how society is structured and in basic fundamentals of sociology, e.g Durkheim, where we all are ingrained in it and influence each other. Structures predate us and therefore according to radical feminism, it is assumed that it has already influenced us in gender socialisation as children as well as adults as well.

To explain this further, it is due to the patriarchal society that men are more likely to commit suicides because patriarchal society has expectations of men not expressing their emotions due to predating ingrained ideas (look up the history of toxic masculinity for example) and therefore, it is the influence of society (where both men and women are apart of) which cause men to not able to seek guidance due to that ideal (internalised by them or projected by prejudicial people).

Gender socialisation is not just influenced by society but different sources that have been influenced by society. Therefore parents, media, education, authority – all kinds of different institutions and social systems.

And if society is predated therefore people must be influenced by society and gender socialisation will occur… the purpose of feminism in general is to stop this pattern and the purpose of radical feminism is challenge similarity between men and women by saying men are human too and are affected by society too because the patriarchy doesn’t equate to men.

Humans, including most men and women, evolved to be lumps of clay for a cult leader.

This is why so much about our nature is more arbitrary than we admit. Most people can’t escape the way they were raised, and I guarantee that the vast majority of boys could be raised to think pink and washing dishes is masculine if the owner of most things wanted boys to be that way (IE. you don’t get your meager property rights unless you fit the paradigm expected by the primary owner- dictators are the primary owners for example since all you capitalists can’t seem to think of owning outside of the word)

Dear Mr. Freeman,
The fact that you refer to males as men and females as girls indicates you don’t yet understand how ingrained the subjugation of women continues to be in our society, and you appear to be in denial (or at least ignorance) of your role in perpetuating the status quo. No one is saying all men are bad. Neither are they saying that women have it worse than men in every way. Try being less defensive so you can listen and understand. Also, not being able to play with Barbies because of the fear of being mocked is very different from women continuing to receive significantly less pay than their male counterpoints in most fields, not to mention anything about the statistics relating to violence against women and their unequal treatment in the courts. I’ll never understand why some men will speak up against minor, perceived slights against their group, yet remain silent in the face of gross injustice against others. I hope you do not fall into that category.

To Ms. Eaton,
Equality as a psychological or sociological term is very different from its importance as a legal term. While you might not seek equality on a social level, we still need to secure equal status under the law in terms of being considered entitled to the same rights as men. Please don’t undermine these efforts as you take issue with the concept of equality.

It is far more common for girls to want sex with men than for boys to want sex with women.

How many old women are having kids with young men vs the other way around?

Women do this to them selves. I told women it was flawed to go for old men because the reality is the only an old man can objectively do better is have property. The relationship claims are problems women claim of young men are fraudulent. Her feelings are based on his ability to command resource access. You find me an older man who doesn’t have more than his younger girlfriend. Even older women looking for younger men still want socioeconomic status just to have casual sex when that only matters to childbearing women.

The problem I have with this article is that she argues against her points as if she was arguing for both men and women like a FEMINIST (the advocacy of women’s rights on the basis of the equality of the sexes.) would. Instead, she ignores her own statistics and continues to shame men on how terrible at the top of the patriarchy. News flash the patriarchy power doesn’t get passed down to the men simply because they are men. Power is passed down to those who are getting the job done and some people who are working to possess that power. You won’t get power simply by whining for it, this is not how the business world works.

Suicide is the most common cause of death for men under 50, it is the most common cause of death for women under 35. Death by suicide rates are higher for men because of the methods they choose to end their lives. With more men opting to hang themselves or shoot themselves. Women tend to try and overdose which is often not very successful. While many argue that this is because women are just trying to get attention this is unlikely as it has been found that most women who do kill themselves have tried on previous occasions and women who have failed to kill themselves are more likely to die by suicide at a later date.

The article is about feminism NOT being anti-man, and points out, quite eloquently I might add, exactly how the patriarchy harms everyone. Is she shaming men because she’s stating facts? Male suicide rates are higher, more violent crimes are committed by men, etc? She never said women didn’t commit suicide or prevent violent crimes, but facts are facts. You might want to think about how the patriarchy has harmed everyone and how change can help EVERYONE. If she were bashing men, I wouldn’t have made it through the entire article. This was very fair and open-minded, in my opinion.

I’m really sorry but I don’t like this article. I agree women deserve rights and that men need to learn respect. But feminism is just basically shaming men and not changing anything. And not all men are bad there are plenty good. And men have their own problems in fact now a days women are extremely excepted and not limited while guys still have those pressures e.g. if a girl likes super man or boxing she can get away with it while if a guy likes barbie or dancing they can’t. Girls have it much better now a days if you ask me. Why do you think the suicide rates are higher for men?

Hey Dylan,
I think if you re-read this post again, you will see that Jessica has pointed out the issues you’re talking about since the patriarchy system has resulted in all those problems you’re talking about. Just check the handy table demonstrated above.

Wow, you are so confused, Women do not shame men. But truth tells and shows us that men have always shamed women and girls. Many moms allow this. The shaming of females is so sick and so bad, now, that dads shame their daughters about their private parts an doeruods. Men step over their daughters’ boundaries all the time, and shame them.

Unfortunately the article still locates feminism ideology in oppositional terms. It’s what feminism does not want in respect of “equality.” Many men don’t want to live in a patriarchical society either. But what does “Matriarchy” want? Read Sue Monk-Kidd’s novel “Diary of the Dissident Daughter” for some ideas of what it looked like in times past and what it might look like in times ahead…

Well, it’s intentionally vague. What would be the third reich besides it’s opposition to “zionism”?
All we get is that it’s supposedly glorious, not a shred of evidence on how.
Here it’s not different.
Even if we had magical powers and could make every man today completely adverse to committing violence, it would not be stable, as violence breeds itself and at every turn feminists defend violent women, so the next generation of men would be just as violent as the current one.
Feminism is such a flawed concept that it tries to explain female victimization by female perpetration with patriarchy, and half of the time it blames the victim, specially in complete absence of male influence.

Weinstein is a good example of it’s lack of predicting power, of both nazism and feminism. If jew=bad or man=bad by nature, one would not expect mostly non-jewish women to empower him so much by being the biggest audience drivers in his films. I’d say it’s just a highly functional person in a highly unstable market, who was sexually victimized by both men and women in it’s wee days on the industry passing forward the abuse that was normalized, and that the abuse was normalized because creative fields are degenerate by nature, of course this degeneracy most frequently consists of extensive drug abuse and other forms of self-harm and ideally would consist only of it but won’t ever consist only of it. As for why it persisted for so long, well, it’s the same explanation of why a +40 year old female Israeli teacher raped 40 of her early teens students, people looked the other way because they were goddamn good at what they did.

Good points in here.
Thank you for posting.
I do realise this goes with statistics and even iff it ruffles some feathers, are accurate.
You do not stereotype but present these statistics with the imply that both genders are suffering consquences of this seggregated system.
Some people have intelligence, thus , will understand.
More power to you.

are you saying being a man is bad ? nothing good happens if you a man ? I don’t want bad things to happen to anyone , and your right that men should start asking questions about ourselves and our behaviours. I also think we need to say ‘ Being a man is great , we can achieve great things and work together to make the world a better place’. There is too much negativity about being a man at the moment , we need International Mens Day on November 19th to show positive male role models and to say there is nothing wrong in being a man.

Hi….I really enjoyed reading your article, especially the parts iterating and re-iterating that men are not the blueprint. One thing that didn’t sit right with me though: the parts about wanting to get paid more. I work in a corporate office and the thought of a man similarly qualified as me and doing the same work as I do but getting paid more simply because he’s a man would have me quitting within a week. Why shouldn’t I make the same money he’s making? Why wouldn’t I want to be considered at par with him and not as someone second fiddle to his ‘better judgement’ or ‘expertise’?

Curious about this new angle – would love it if you could explain your point.

I can think of one potential reason- men don’t have the same hormonal responses and could arguable be seen to be more level, at all times of the month, possibly affecting important decisions. My girlfriend literally just told me, “I’m about to start my period”, as if I didn’t already know. This entails going bat-shit crazy at random times which has her eventually apologizing.

It may not be ‘fair’, but unfortunately it’s a reality. As a generalization, women, because of biology, are not as stable as men.

Men are the very reason your able to have this platform which is a good thing. As far as a lot of the negative things spoken of men ,women where behind alot of those negative things throughout history women have not been much better Let’s start with Jezebel.

Actually, that’s not factually true. Hedy Lamarr (female) came up with the invention for WiFi; and Ada Lovelace (also female) was the person who wrote the world’s first computer algorithm. Women actually had far more to do with the reason why this blogger is able to have this platform. Oh, let’s not also forget that a woman giving birth to you is part of the reason why you are able to have a platform in anything, anywhere.

If these are your only examples you could give to argue that men aren’t the reason why the internet and computers exist, then your claim doesn’t really have any substance to back it up.

First, to address Hedy Lamarr, who as you claimed, “came up with the invention for WiFi” – there isn’t any evidence to suggest this. Outside of the sensationalized online media articles trying to get clicks with flashy titles alluding to her being the “inventor of Wi-Fi”, nobody with any real credibility in the field would make such a claim. What you’re referring to is an invention called “frequency hopping” which Hedy Lamarr and composer George Antheil patented in 1942. Of course, they didn’t invent this, as many other inventors dating back to the 19th century made similar inventions (most notably Nikola Tesla, who conceived of it in a patent in 1903). As a matter of fact, not even Hedy herself claimed to have invented this concept.

You then brought up Ada Lovelace, who apparently “wrote the world’s first computer program”. As it turns out, there’s never been any evidence that she wrote the first program, nor did she ever claim to do such a thing. Her real claim to fame is being the first to publish algorithms written by Charles Babbage (often considered by many to be the true inventor of programming). Ada was a very forward thinking individual who predicted many aspects of modern computers, but she certainly wasn’t the world’s first computer programmer.

Also, the point about “women giving birth, therefore they can take credit for all inventions” doesn’t make any sense, since such a process requires a man’s sperm to turn an empty womb into a human life. Either way, the simple fact that everyone has a mother (and father) doesn’t mean that an inventor’s creations can be credited to the ancestors who contributed to their conception.

I’m typing this fully realizing on a page like this it won’t be well received, but I still encourage anyone reading to at the very least read what is being said in it’s entirety. I put this disclaimer here because the following will likely instantly result in backlash: The patriarchy is bullshit. There is no patriarchy, and by the same definition a matriarchy would be just as bad(What most consider a tyrannical form of government favoring one sex over the other). If you think any gender rules the world you’re woefully ignorant of the color green… Because money is the only thing that actually matters.

This blog is almost oozing with anti-male undertones. Nearly half is dedicated to summing up “Men or horrible, us women can’t be 1). 2). 3). 4). 5).”. Here’s the harsh reality and it will never change: Men’s priority will always be provide, protect, and procreate. That’s evolution, that’s the basis for which all male instincts are born. If you can’t come to grips with that, I don’t know what to tell you. Sure, there will be deranged individuals that take one of those aspects to what we consider a “societal extreme”, but that’s just something you’ll have to watch out for and avoid to the best of your ability. Much like men do(Replace Possessive with Obsessive, Fear with Manipulation, etc).

Moving on, feminism’s 3rd wave as a general rule of thumb isn’t about the liberation of women, it’s about being “more powerful than men”. It treats us guys like the enemy, which makes it hard to actually relate to one-another. It’s gotten to the point that for me, a guy, I won’t even approach a woman that doesn’t look like a dumb bimbo. Because the alternative could rapidly lead me to being thrown out of college on some sort of fabricated crime against said women. I’d strongly encourage everyone, men and women, to properly communicate to people, rather than following any sort of ideology. If you excessively antagonize one group for your own interests, you only alienate yourself from a much larger audience. You’ll alienate yourself from the group you’re targeting, and anyone not part of that group that doesn’t agree with your extreme viewpoints.

TLDR; This men vs women bullshit is getting old and if you really want to feel and be equal, communication is the only way that will happen. There’s good guys out there, and there’s bad guys. I’ve had a terrible track record with women but I’m sure there’s a lot of women out there that I’d love to meet to offset the completely horrible, manipulative, and hate-filled women I’ve gotten involved with so far. I guess that’s the point of this long-winded post: Judge by a person to person basis, 50% of a population is hardly a figure you can generalize and lump together.

TLDR(not really)2; “The Patriarchy” implies some sort of societal phenomena. It is not. It’s entirely created by a instinctual and biological role developed from before humans even called themselves human. There will ALWAYS be that element of men looking at other men and thinking “If you can’t protect or provide for your family, what good are you?” as there will always be the element of women looking at other women and thinking “if you won’t have children/be the definition of beauty for your boy toy, what good are you?”. I envy women a lot in that they’re able to be more open with their feelings and more caring to people. I’d like to be more like that, if I could, but there’s always that wall called instinct that makes every single step in that direction a struggle. It’s just not in my DNA. As a guy I’m at the point where I feel like I’m walking around with chains around my extremities because our society has devolved into such a state where alpha males are frowned upon. An example is the guy that got shot outside of a 711 for protecting his girl and kids from some dude because he had a chip on his shoulder about someone non-handicapped parking in a handicapped space.

TLDR3(for real this time); The world’s a fucked up place, there is no equality, get used to it. Feminism is inherently flawed because not only are you fighting against the wrong enemy(“The patriarchy), you’re fighting an uphill battle against instinct, biology, and society, and all of that could be considered the “tip of the iceberg” when corporations and conglomerates hold all the real power.

Historically, through all of civilized life, the majority of men that had children accomplished this by competing with other men based on property rights…being better is not required for property.

Women manipulate men for access to said property. This gives women less responsibility, but more access and is therefore a net profit. The beatings are a necessary evil to be with the men who want property dominance the most. Overtime, as less violent men are allowed to own progressively more property, there will be less female beatings. The only thing reducing violence are criminal penalties that ultimately reduce the property holdings of the violent population.

Who owns property, gets sex and has kids. Yay for capitalism. Reinforcing the paradigm.

And flipping changes nothing other than men will become the tops from the bottom when today women are the tops from the bottom.

MGTOW is a very effective strategy -mostly against the few remaining REAL women who AREN’T Feminazis or narcissistic monkey branching sluts (in total ,about HALF of western women).
a few the older women who carried women’s lib to it’s present hideous Marxist form are now facing the bitter reality and trying to put the brakes on the societal plummet they hitched their idealist bandwagon to back when they were fertile ,young and being pursued -or- they’ve retreated, like many MGTOW have done, encamped with their pets and a circle of aging, likeminded samesex support groups.
in summation, MGTOW is in effect a suicide pact with 2nd/3rd wave Feminism.
“smashing the patriarchy” ? to replace with WHAT ? a Matriarchy? or an androgynous mixed beige race wherein children are produced in cloning tanks and raised by computers? a new species of sexless humanoid
lacking all individual distinction ,culture, or anything else which impedes a communist global state?
modern feminism is in effect masculinizing women and seeks to feminize men-regardless of the author’s contention to the contrary.
ignore what they claim and examine the end results. I see Marxist goals, crafted by the Frankfurt School to do what Marxist/Leninism failed to do externally against the west, by attacking our society from the INSIDE ,using useful fools like Feminists, BLM, ANTIFA and Islamic invasion enablers to destroy western nativist marriage, the family and civil discourse itself through fascistic speech laws.
I totally agree that humans are at least mostly a product of nature and evolution, thus gender differences (inequalities) are NECESSARY for a specie’s long term survival.
the elites want us “reengineered” to be total tools or just mostly DEAD if we cannot be remolded.

Hey…I won’t even give attention to a female who isn’t a slut in your eyes. Why? Because the more men she has banged, the better she will be able to discern my value as a sex partner and human being.

Of course, outside of socioeconomic controls, the vast majority of men are not even close to competing with me. They need me to be poor just for basic sex. I think it is funny how losers think bogarting property they can’t possibly earn makes them actually better. Duh guys. If you can’t get sex without doing a lot of extra things, you are total loser.

Wonder why people hate communism….most can’t compete in objective by being superior humans but instead rely on restricted access to resources through social constructs. After all, with equal access to resources, I will out do most.

Bademoxy, how wrong you are. Social control and Social Power is something inherent to be human. Even Marx said that humans are social being in essence. What matters is having societal power and resources. You are bang girls even though you re poor cause you managed to fake societal power to them. People who are rich (Like CEOs) or, at least, in roles of power, like Governors, Judges, prosecutors, or sheriffs, have the true societal power allowing than to bang women without faking authority cause they are authority themselves. People with true societal power are the true winners.

The Patriarchy is inline with the natural order that’s why the system worked so well, Do not blame men for abusive behavior etc etc. Blame women’s biology as they tend to choose theses men based off of their biology and deal with the fall out of being mistreated etc, They cant control that, to put all men in this category of rapists and abusers is pure rhetoric. There are good strong men out there but they are not chosen because they don’t satisfy the dominant animalistic disrespectful behavior that attracts women, this is what women mean when all women say they want a confident guy, With the destruction of religion and marriage largely due to the destruction of the patriarchy and the rise of feminism, women will have to lay in the bed they created, same as they do when they choose alcoholics abusers and immoral men to have relationships with. They choose these men, then they have the nerve to turn around and complain about the men they choose. Smarter men realized this about women created the patriarchy and the institution of marriage to control this flaw. This structure largely led to modern civilization without it would we be as advanced as we are today? Fast forward to modern times take a good hard look at this landscape, largely due to society and media all women believe they deserve a six foot tall attractive man, can have sex with whoever they want when ever they want, can climb the corporate ladder and still be a good loving wife and mother. Completely unrealistic, sacrifices now have to be made largely its the feminine nature of women that takes the hit.
The Patriarchy empowers men to be a rock for their family and a righteous man leading his family gives man purpose and is inline with his biological nature, this tends to lead to a man being more successful. Women objectify themselves look at the racy sexy pictures they post are very insecure looking for societal approval they are followers by design. They lack a moral compass in this way and will follow whatever is put in front of them. Young women worship the Kim Kardashians of the world it’s really a joke, they are oftentimes more materialistic then men. Do you think morals would exist in the world if it not for righteous powerful men? If it were not for these men would women have a platform to speak on never mind a feminist movement?

When you write equal, the word you actually mean is identical. Society will flourish when women and men have equal individual and political power, but I agree with you, that is not feminism. Power is not something that can be given, it has to be taken.

I personally do want us equal I do want equal misery I do want wemon to die in war just like men I do want to beat a women’s face in and be able to get a bear later(like how I met some of my best friends) I do want men to come for word more with rape charges but I do want FAKE rape charges to be giving 2X the time that the defendant would get. I do want less male violence but I also want female violence actually punished (we all know a women can beat her man and no one cares) I do want little boys that get raped bye wemon to be able to come forword about it and there whole family not cheer for them for the cop that did find out to not pat him on the back and say “good job” when to him it was horrifying. To me there is no patriarchy there is just rich and poor and those laws are them making us fight each other. I personally want to be able to treat wemon like men and men like wemon but I can’t because I act sexual to my male friends(no homo) but I can’t ever touch a women . for fuck sake my buddy shoved his finger up my other friends ass just to win a “are you feeling awkward yet”game but if I brush up against a women’s elbow I raped her. This is the problem I see and just so you know wemon 100%objectify men as a bank as a dildo as a ride. I agree it is the system but I really just want you all to suffer like the rest of us and just saying I think any law that specifies gender is so unethical I really shouldn’t need to explain…….sorry if I didn’t do my spelling or grammar very well I have a learning disability and wanted to be the voice of the opposition you know

Little of my own view tho . I think you forgot that men and women are not the same we do not have the same Gene’s we have different chromosomes we have different chemical makeups we have different hormones we have different levels of all of them the structure of our brain is different the way the separate parts of our brain connect is different we look different inside and out in a lot of ways and then also comes fourth in our attitude yes people can be raised differently but you have to remember there is a biological and personality-wise difference between men and women yes sometimes that lime can be a little blurred for some people guess what that’s still biology that means they’re slightly different hormone wise Gene wise that’s the thing yes there’s a system over all of us but I just think it should be stated men and women are not the same yes men are more violent why are we more violent testosterone you don’t have it like we do so you can not ever understand what it’s like women have periods women have estrogen and in all honesty a lot of other chemicals separate us but those are the main two and we both have some of each it’s just the amount that we have but that’s beside the point you have to remember men are hardwired to be violent women are hardwired to be child bearers that’s biology yes you can change the environment yes you can change the upbringing no you cannot change nature as a man when I communicate with other men using violence gets what I feel across so much more and it does for them to some of the best friends I’ve ever had I got because me and them beat each other until we were black and blue until we were so broken that we just sat there laughed at each other and went and got a beer that’s the difference because if I punched a woman one time she’s not going to fight me for half an hour she’s going to mediately run away and call the cops but with a man I can sit there and punch him and get punched by him for half an hour and no one called the cops no one passing by called the cops no one that knows is watching called the cops and neither of us did why because we’re men we know sometimes violence is necessary when dealing with other men and yes that violent tendencies does make us more likely to come after women some of you want to say oh that’s making it out that all men are rapists guess what that’s in our biology that is literally hardwired into us to spread our genes as much as possible and that’s a possible way of doing it and that is sometimes passed on I’m not saying rape is a gene but I am saying just because testosterone is there and we have so much of it and sometimes it is so much it is equivalent to a bull elephant( percentage wise not actual mass of testosterone) sometimes we cannot control our self and yes that is a self control issue but that self-control issue is also hard-wired into us because testosterone pushes us to be violent to be a little bit more hateful and it takes a long time for a man to either lose his testosterone or learn how to use it and for a lot of men they can’t just like women can’t get over their mood swings they can’t get over the cramps they can’t get over the bleeding if I looked at you and told you hey stop being in a bad mood and so cranky just cuz you’re bleeding and feeling like you’re being stabbed well you would look at me like I’m a dick but you can look at a man and tell him stop being turned on by women stop being violent it’s in a lot of ways the same thing and I’m not saying it’s a good thing I am saying you need to understand that we are different and we are not as pacifist loving small and fragile yes not all women are like those four things but in general that’s what they are women are not big and strong and Burleigh and along with that comes more testosterone we’re already bigger were already stronger we have hair growing out of everywhere because of it and that just pushes us to be more violent and angry you don’t understand the anger that comes from testosterone because you don’t have it in the same quantity just like I will never be able to understand a woman’s mood swings and how she can love and then hate and then love and then hate her man within 5 minutes and I do want to say this masculinity is not a bad thing toxic masculinity yeah but just being masculine why is there a problem with being masculine just like why is there a problem with being feminine to tell a woman to stop being so feminine meaning of a roll in the mud get some cuts and bruises beat somebody up that’s what you would expect that to mean but when you say stop being masculine to a man you’re saying cry make yourself vulnerable let others hurt you let others make you want to die be less strong and be more submissive that’s what we’re hearing we are not hearing what you think we cannot take masculinity out of herself yes we can add femininity we can add a little emotions but that’s the thing men do have emotions and they do cry even the most masculine men in the world cry but they don’t do it in the same way they don’t look for help because why would we that right there is toxic masculinity but just being masculine means you’re proud of your body hair you’re proud of your muscles you’re proud how fast you can run a mile and how far you can throw a person if the chance ever arises to be proud about what makes you you and a lot of you women are not seeing that you’re not seeing that telling us to stop being masculine is not telling us to be a woman it is just telling us to stop being ourself and to be more like you and yeah I understand it’s a little difficult but you need to see it from our point of view because yes you’re in some ways stepping back and looking at it but you’re still seeing it from your point of view even a little step back you’re not able to see anything through the eyes of an actual masculine man of someone that is proud of who they are someone who is proud that they hunt someone that is proud that they work out someone that is proud that they can spread their genes as far as possible proud that they can grow a big beard and proud that if someone’s going to hurt their friends and family they can stand up and do something about it you’re telling us to stop being proud of this and you’re telling us to hate that we want to do these things and that’s one reason why men are killing them self because they don’t want to be who they are and you’re making it this way you personally the writer not as much but I do want to say reading your post yes I understand your point of view I also understand the point of you you’re trying to get me to see but I really hope that you can at least see it Through The Eyes of a man that is proudly masculine because everything you’re saying to that man is an insult because you’re telling him who he is is not worth anything and he already has to deal with the fact that if he doesn’t make enough he’s worthless if his house isn’t good enough he’s worthless if his car breaks down or he just doesn’t have one he’s worthless and yes that’s the system right there but at the same time you women are making it worse yes the systems causing it but the most feminist people are the ones pushing the wrong side just think little bit on what do the men you’re targeting see when you say these things not the toxic masculine man because that man does exist but the man that is just proud to be masculine just remember what you’re saying to him and that what you’re saying might come from a place actual Joy and caring but to him it’s a stab in the heart with a smarmy smile with it my actual View to a point

I am afraid the information age and the continued mistreatment of boys, later men to make them tough along with the much better treatment for girls, later women from infancy through adulthood will create a power imbalance favoring girls and women, which will in turn, drive women far over the average boys and men. We need to recognize it was never about genetics and effort, but about very real treatment of children and adults which is creating success and failure in the information age. This very real, differential treatment of girls and boys, later women and men is creating a growing mass of failing boys and men while creating a growing mass of successful girls and women. I will send you my learning theory by e-mail on just how the treatment we receive is creating very real, different results. We must lose the genetics models of learning and see just how our environments and differential treatment are creating this growing problem for boys and men. 1. See how average stress is made up correctly as many maintained layer of mental work which take up real mental energy – how situations and new mental work go on top of those layers which also take up real mental energy with in a limited amount of space. The leftover free mental energy will be far less for persons with the higher layers. 2. Note how the much better mental/emotional/verbal interaction, support, and care from parents, teachers, others are helping us as girls from infancy gain so much more raw materials for communication and learning. 3. Note how the more aggressive/much less supportive, even more distant treatment by parents, teachers, others is creating much more fear, anxiety, preparation for defense, more social/emotional distance (also with less verbal interaction); and fear of adults is creating higher average stress, less maturity, more activity for stress relief; higher muscle tension which hurts handwriting; and the combined high average stress (designed to make boys tough) along with much less knowledge and skills of social vocabulary; knowledge and use of syntax is greatly damaging independent reading and enjoyment of reading which require high social vocabulary/syntax experience and much more “free mental energy to perform the abstract skill of reading: visualizing, decoding, organizing, learning new words in print using one’s social vocabulary; and enjoying the process. When we see what is really occurring it is a wonder more boys and men are not failing in school and society.

You don’t understand. Some of the first things I learned growing up was that the world is separated into boys and girls; boys have short hair and girls have long hair. Boys wear pants, and girls wear dresses, skirts, ribbons, hair bands, bobby-pins, as well as pants. Boys like blue, but cannot like red or pink because that would be girly. Girls can like pink, blue, red, and any other color. Boys can’t play with dolls; they can’t even express an interest in dolls. Also, when I complained about this (because no matter how you cut it, anyone can see being able to wear pants and skirts was better than being able to wear only pants), I was told by all the male and female figures in my life, boys are better than girls, and that if I went around wearing skirts, all the people in the world would shun me including my family. And because boys are better than girls, boys have to protect the girls, let the girls go first, let them win, not hit them. And boys can’t cry, can’t act frivolous, because they are tougher. They have to be more stoic. I had to exercise more because I was male. And I was expected to be more capable, to earn more money, to be tall. Because I was male. And in return, if I stuck to my role and did well, I might get this thing called power (a power still circumscribed by the masculine expectations of life – a short haired shirt and pants power), and I wouldn’t have to experience this dreadful thing called pregnancy. And some girl will want to marry me if I abided by these gender roles; if I didn’t, girls wouldn’t want to marry me. Girls are expected to be pretty; I was supposed to feel lucky that I was not judged on how pretty I was. This was how the adults in my life explained things. To me, this seemed like a shit deal.

I went to school. The boys and girls separated themselves into boy and girl groups. Boys and girls didn’t really talk to each other and went as far as to attack each other. But the boys were physically aggressive with other boys. They formed relationships center on external things – sports, video games, tv shows. The girls held hands. They chattered away. They braided each other’s hair. They formed more tight knit groups and what seemed like closer relationships. They provided each other emotional warmth. I wanted to quit the boy groups and join the girl groups but I eared the boys would attack me, some of the girls would shun me for being an outsider, and my parents would find out about it. Our teacher was always female. Why was this I asked. Because mainly women chose to be teachers (or nurses, or secretaries). If a man was a teacher, it was a come-down. Oh another restriction I have to face I thought; there are some professions I cannot enter without losing a lot of face. Boys were troublemakers. Girls abided by the rules. Whenever a boy and girl were both accused of doing something wrong, it was often assumed that the boy did it. Boys were punished more for hitting girls. Girls would make fun of you if you were effeminate, even though they themselves were girls. Boys and girls push you to man up.

In adult life, because men are denied a lot of emotional warmth, women are often able to the provenance of emotional warmth for favors, something I cringe at.

But this isn’t a post about the costs of being male imposed by a toxic and fragile masculinity. Many women see thse costs somewhat clearly. This is a post about the wonder that boys and men don’t complain about these costs. Because you see — men don’t really complain. I’ve never heard men publically complain about not being able to wear skirts for one. Like I said, those born male aren’t even allowed to express an interest. At most, they complain about not being able to express enough emotions, about child-support. I’ve always wondered whether this was because men were completely brainwashed.

But you see, I almost never complain either. It’s dangerous to even express an interest in anything feminine because the masculine expectations of being male are heavily policed by both men and women. They still are heavily policed by both men and women. I believe this is why men go out of their way to try and protect their masculinity.

But you see, I don’t think men are entirely stupid. They don’t feel they can’t take off the straightjacket of toxic masculinity; this means they fight to hang on harder to the promise of male superiority and to the various forms of power they were promised. Otherwise, in my view, they are screwed.

I always wanted to ask on this…when some say they want to be treated equally, I get lost. As a man in the West, crying alone can land you a social life where you are routinely taken advantage of. We are expected to balance new liberal idealism with the older generations and their ideas of responsibility. “Take care of your wife”, they may say. When nowadays, the ability for a man who was raised impoverished and lacks opportunity will no doubt face some issues getting there. Then there’s those who say they want total social equality.

Every interaction between two men on different wavelengths has potential to become a power measuring contest. Typically the more confident Male to set the bar of the relations between these individuals is one who is physically stronger, which means that we as a society must be measured in this way.

In a corporate world it is measured by our ability to communicate and show our worth above others who may be vying for the same position or salary. This will turn worse than a physical fight. This becomes a measure of who is more cunning, which can destroy literally an entire life and its stability. In the current social order, that means destruction of man and woman, together.

If we are to have some kind of equality, and I dont mean to offend, women have to understand men conflict by nature. They will have to demonstrate an equal amount of power and ability over men to make themselves heard.

Men settle things through labour. We fight or we compete professionally. We make bonds and we break them. Women who want economic justice would probably want to express their worth as indispensable even held to a Male. Then perform accordingly.

I have never understood the methods of nude protesting as a power play. If anything most men are seeing it as a free show here.

Not really trying to explain in an outside way. Merely think that if women want this kind of social and economic equality, they need to develop the fortitude to challenge men on their terms.

It’s comparable to the great showdown between Queen Boudicca of the Brittanic Celts and Gaius Paulinus of the Romans in 60 A.D.

She led a ruthless group across Britain to gather up the tribes oppressed by Rome. Those who denied her learned something about crossing her. She used whatever means needed. Never did she submit to being something of a tool like Cleopatra.

Her downfall was to be too arrogant and allowed Gaius to choose the battlefield. The Battle at Watling Street was chosen, and he chose this due to it’s natural fortification and knew that even outnumbered, Rome could hold that line. Boudicca thought she knew warfare, but ultimately didn’t know to take into account what Gaius knew to be the best tactical approach.

Dont be Boudicca. Fight on men’s terms, because we have been fine tuned for our roles for thousands of years. Whether we like it or not…

(I personally dont like that I have to play this “game”. I believe we are already equal, but we are definitely different. In that regard, whatever is wanted by women would mean they tool have to know everything about men and how they conduct their operations.)

I wouldnt mind if we could establish something different. Mostly because I despite Anglo culture and how it has influenced social relations.

At its core, I argue it is one of the most reactionary kinds of culture and fundamentally places women as objects under a noble class. Marx is certainly a great figure to analyse the class components of the female sex.

Unfortunately, muscles are dumb and hold society back. When muscles attacks smarts, smarts need the legal right to eliminate. Otherwise, smarts has literally no reason to be violent as smart is default superior to muscles.

If women were capable of discretion outside of who has the property, we wouldn’t be so backwards and dumb on average….but to no avail. Women absolutely prefer a confident, wealthier moron over a non-confident, less wealthy, genius who’s only limitation is social structures imposing penalties for killing the muscled aggressor.

Your generalizing all women to fall into behaviors you paint them to have shows a lazy intellect. Many women myself included don’t care about what “property” a man has, because we are self-sufficient and can take care of ourselves. Many women who are poor would much rather stay in a homeless shelter, or a safe space, than have to deal with a jerk who has money. The reality is all women don’t fit into the picture you paint, as a matter of fact many women don’t. Fighting for equal pay for women has helped women become more self-sufficient, but there shouldn’t have been an unequal system of pay in the first place. It’s a fact that in most countries women are paid less than men even when they are in the same job and have the same qualifications. Systems that discriminate against women have set them up for poverty. Oh, and your women-blaming for society being backwards and dumb shows you write from your personal bias of misyogny; and your words cannot be trusted as a rational contribution to the conversation.

There is only one gender and that gender is male. So called “Women” are property and they’re good in the kitchen. I’m a real estate agent and I own a lot of these properties that are called “Women”. “Women” are used for their vagina and their cooking. Good sandwich making as well . Feminism is irrelevant because men usually do everything . Lots and lots of men risk their life for these so called “Women” to live. I don’t think “Women” would want to risk their lives for us men . Try to give me a list of “Women” who ruled the world . If I remembered they’re all male . I can go on and on . Just know that “Women” shouldn’t have equal rights . Stop feminism .

Yes. This is why we need rules that say you are only allowed the property you need….and anything additional to that is to the extent your work benefits others more than they benefit them selves which means you do not get to claim the excesses of other people’s labor as yours. The type of women that go for you will end up childless, and the future will be more peaceful, less greedy, but most importantly, less retarded.

go to fuck youself Adolf, in the 1930s as well as now. make up an argument or shut the hole up. you do not belong to any category, boy.
so many men are angry with feminist bias and harm it does every day to them, we make efforts to get society to lister to our voice. don’t you get you demage us all including yourself if you behave like that.

Proven wrong by all the female doctors who save people’s lives on a daily basis, female CEOs who own and run business you buy from, and female professors who teach people how to have careers like the real estate career you speak of. It is clear though that despite the REALITY that women are completely competent and capable, you would rather view them as simple-minded utilitarian “property”. Your obviously false view conflicting with glaring reality shows that you as an individual are the one who lacks basic human competencies. I’m going to bet if you are in a hospital dying from a heart-attack and a female heart-surgeon is the only one who can save you, you are not going to tell her to go make you a sandwich instead. But then again, there are always more Darwin awards to give out and if you are willing to reach for one by doing so, well that is your choice. Women are one half of the reason why the human population is alive, so actually, women have been ruling the world. You wouldn’t even be alive if it weren’t for a woman’s existence. You should check your disrespect and your absurd lack of basic logic. It’s obvious and embarrassing. Hopefully you are capable of better and prove that.

So why do good girls like bad guys?
I had this question for a real long time
I’ve been a bad boy and it’s plain to see
So why do good girls fall in love with me?
Whoa ooh ooh, whoa ooh ooh, whoa ooh ooh, whoa ooh ooh
You’ve got pep in your step
You live your life with no regret
How you look when you are wet
Is something I cannot forget
I just wanna kiss your lips
The ones between your hips
If I cash in all my chips on you
Then baby I’d be rich
So come on, sexy, please text me I’m ready for you
So come on, waiting, I’m begging, so please get here soon
So why do good girls like bad guys?
I had this question for a real long time
I’ve been a bad boy and it’s plain to see
So why do good girls fall in love with me?
Whoa ooh ooh, whoa ooh ooh,
Ooo lala, what lovely curves
Baby I get off by getting you off first
Sorry girl if this is quick
So please just take it in ass and suck my dick
So come on
Sexy, please text me
I’m ready for you
So come on
Waiting, I’m begging
So please get here soon
So why do good girls like bad guys?
I had this question for a real long time
I’ve been a bad boy and it’s plain to see
So why do good girls fall in love with me?
Whoa ooh ooh, whoa ooh ooh,
Guitar!
So why do good girls like bad guys?
I had this question for a real long time
I’ve been a bad boy and it’s plain to see
So why do good girls fall in love with me?
So why do good girls like bad guys?
I had this question for a real long time
I’ve been a bad boy and it’s plain to see
So why do good girls fall in love with me?
So why do good girls like bad guys?
(I wanna know, I need to know!)
So why do good girls like bad guys?
(So come on I gotta know, I need to know!)
So come on I gotta know
So come on tell me!
Bitch you gave me the fucking clap!

No one cares about men…we are expendible…the fairytales of “equality” and “well-being” men being “emotionally open” are puked out…but when men talk about how they feel and what they feel…the world, and feminism sits there and says “man up”

Men learn real fast that no one will help us, no one cares about us…all we are are wallets and tools for the meat grinder.

Countless men die each year to maintain cities and countries…building and defending them, no one bats an eye….one woman dies on a construction site and everyones in the street.

This comment is a waste of time…the needs and wants of men are of little importance or value…society and civilization will suffer greatly for this in the end.

no this comment is not a waste of time. thanks to voices like yours we get to know that there are other men who think clear and are ready to go on building society.
I am south european, if you just say that is legitimate for a man to defend himself from his partner’s violence, people don’t even think that violence is not distributed by gender but by personality’s traits: they just assume that you are a violent. Are comments like yours that allow people to change things.

It may or may not, in fact, be a waste of time commenting on that comment. I’m technically supposed to be working on a speech for Speech And Debate, and I got distracted reading comments on this article (which is totally AWESOME by the way.) Why do you think men are “expendable”? Why do you think female life is valued above male life? I think it has been pretty consistent the world over that the loss of all human life is tragic. I would also like to ask why you think that feminism is telling you to “man up” when you attempt to share your feelings. You probably have experienced that, as a male, but not because of feminists. Gender norms, such as the inability for men to share their feelings, have been deeply ingrained in not only American society but across the world, because of thousands of years of cultivation leading up to the stereotypes we have now. Feminists, in fact, are trying to abolish those stereotypes. I think it’s important for all human needs to have value, and I hope that you can find someone that you can be emotionally open to, and I’m sorry if that person isn’t as accessible as you’d like them to be. Terrible, damaging stereotypes are the problems that the feminism that I believe in and the feminist that I am are working towards solving.

Wow. I can see some of the damage that we have done with our patriarchy society. I certainly have felt emasculated in my past when I wasn’t making enough money to provide for my wife and children at the time. I felt shamed, belittled and worthless. My step-dad showed me the verses in the Bible, saying I wasn’t a believer because I couldn’t provide for my own immediate family. Indeed, I have often felt that I couldn’t cry or show my emotions because real men don’t do that, but it is hogwash because men have feelings too. Often I do see the arrogance of many men in not seeking input and advice from women thinking that the men know best and all. Men need the input and wisdom of the women in their life to help them make better decisions and have overall understanding how to resolve problems and issues. Jesus told husbands to lay down their life for their wives, but it is a difficult thing for husbands to do.

friend, try to understand that a generation separate we from you. a fucking generation. there is no need for us to allow women’s wisdom to make decisions for us, because women’s wisdom inform the life of men since the very beginning. when you are an infant your mom will teach you who you are and where you are im the world, when you are a kid you will have teachers, when you are a boy in university the majority of your intetlocutors will be females and some of them are gonna mark you, and it’s pretty rare they mark you better than girls because you are a boy no matter how hard you study, than you will have girlfriends collegues and supervisors and thanks to men trained like you they are going to womansplain you life and so on til you die. but you die alone, because as you noticed we are worthless for cultural or biological reason, who knows. and let me ask you, when you were in the situation not to able to provide for your family was your wife supportive and caring to you or she agreed with you dad about your being a bad believer?? consider that we are not in the fucking 1970s anymore, we are 40 fuckink 40 years later!!! women go to Mars. the good ones who understood it was better to study than talking in a theoretically laughable way of patriarchy, which by the way is a an ideal structure that cannot be identified as such in empirical experience of society.

Feminism actually isn’t a positive ideological belief system at all. It’s an example of misguided social engineering gone awry. Maybe if women didn’t have an inferiority complex about their own contributions to civilization they wouldn’t feel the need to undermine the traditional pillars of that civilization. In reality, men and women are two unique role players who fit best in male-female relationships usually with the male in charge. Anything else is a perversion of nature that leads to all sorts of unintended consequences, usually in the form of undeveloped, immature, and ill-equipped children of single parents. It’s mildly disturbing just how much momentum and legitimacy toxic social movements like feminism can build up over time.

….women don’t need to get paid more for doing less, but they do need to suffer the same sacrifices they expect from men.

And this is not to encourage women towards any kind of traditionalism. The best solution is for women and men to stop bargaining societal roles for access to sex-resources. Rich women are perfectly capable of having a great relationship and sex life with poor men whom they support to the extent they do not brainwash themselves with Disney like princesism.

Feminists keep making the same old tired mistakes.
1. Men need to be able to show their emotions just like women. NO, in general men don’t feel the same emotions as women do. This is entirely a woman’s viewpoint. And how dare you tell men how they should feel! Would you accept the same advice from a man telling you how you should feel.
2. The patriarchy harms everybody. NO, the patriarchy in the western world died out long ago. In the middle east and parts of asia it still exists to a degree but is fading even there. Why? Because of the technology MEN have invented to protect the individual when they travel (cars, busses, planes etc) and the safety of our modern society. I do not speak for the wilder parts of the world, but most of the most rabid feminists do NOT live in the wilder parts of the world, they are sooo busy trying to find a reason to bash their own men.
3. Men commit suicide for a variety of reasons, it is not because they can’t cry. Again, a woman telling a man what he’s doing wrong, “he’s being a man”. You have absolutely NO right to do that. Get back in your box. The world has changed and men, who like travel, adventure and danger can no longer find it in our modern society. So a small number commit suicide. Compared to the number of people who die in car accidents every year it’s tiny. But no one suggests banning cars, though think of the lives it would save!
4. It is true that feminism is not about equality between men and women. It never has been. It has always been about pushing women into positions of power at the expense of actual equality and fairness. Gotta count the number of vaginas in the business or government to make sure they’re represented, whether they deserve the position or not. But to constantly say it’s all about equality is a good sales pitch to get the more foolish men on side. And it worked. So when you meet a “feminist” man, you know you’ve just met an idiot.
5. You bring up examples from third world countries ( “kills female babies because they were unwanted, hacks off vulva and clitoris of women”) as an excuse to attach and belittle men in your own country. Should I mention the asian/eastern european female gold diggers who only marry a western man to get a ticket to the west? Should I say all women are like that? Seriously?
6. And you level untenable accusations such as (“revels in porn”). As if all men do this. In your article all men are guilty.
7. As you have already pointed out, most of the lawmakers were men and they have already created laws against rape. So you (“excuses everything with rape myths”) point is clearly flawed. Men convicted of rape are punished. Women who wrongfully accuse men of rape are routinely forgiven. Vast difference of outcome.
8. (“positions ‘woman’ as the ultimate insult to men”) NO, there are a lot worse insults. But let me ask you, would you like to be called a man? Would you feel insulted? I’m sure you would. Not least because you seem to dislike/maybe hate men.

This article is sooo full of misandry and crazy feminist nonsense I felt compelled to write a rebuttal. And I do feel sorry for the men you treat at your clinic, being fed this man blaming and man shaming ideology.
Both women and men have issues with our current world, but it’s not because of the “patriarchy”. Our world has changed dramatically in the last few hundred years and both men and women are trying to come to terms with it. So far the majority have managed to do so reasonably well, but a number of individuals and fringe elements (amongst which I count feminists) are determined to shadow box their fears; Which is only causing more problems for the world.
Maybe one day you will see the world in a clearer light, but I doubt it. Evangelists rarely see the error of their ways, they continue to indoctrinate themselves each and every day.

Woman who lie about rape can be harmful to men because they Lose their jobs, Lose their homes, unable to get another job because people can’t trust them and can sometimes lead to suicide and the woman who lie about rape go forgiven.

Wow. While I don’t agree with everything you have said I am very enlightened. It’s good to read things from a different perspective. While I am not a feminist, I really do like the point you made. You talked about the patriarchy as being like a system that needs to be broken, rather than having women equal to men. I didn’t really think about it like that at first but I think I agree with your point. I also liked how you mentioned some of the struggles that men face. It is so crashing because some of the feminists I have talked to don’t seem to care as much about men’s issues as well.

Power leads to corruption.
If women want more equity, they haven’t shown that they can handle all of the cumbersome shit that follows. Honestly. Women don’t want it. They want to cherry pick. Just like this article. Cherry pick all of the good, and reject all of the bad. The US is built upon the backs of hardworking Americans. Skyscrapers. Roads. Infrastructure. Transportation. Communication. Almost all of it by men. But women get to enjoy the fruit, too. The patriarchy isn’t too bad. It beats Marxism. Beats socialism. It beats Matriarchy, where the average life span is significantly lower, and infant mortality is exponentially higher. The author of this article is hanging up her daddy issues on men. Quit being lazy. Stop pointing your proverbial fingers behind your keyboard, paid for by a grant for your “losing a profit” NPO. Get out in the field. Get dirty. Be the change. Don’t be the “white feminist” voice behind your self pity.

First, I know that I’m late but I want to thank you for telling the truth about feminism. And thank you for doing the same thing all feminist have done to prove their supposed point….make broadly negative about men(in a way that put us under one blanket). I’m not going to say there isn’t some truth to it , but isn’t that how all good cons start? Anyway you put down allies(though misguided) as if their reasoning is completely irrational. Men’s sacrifice, ambition,drive, and yes even the computer systems you have typed this crap on made what we have to date…for the most part anyway. As such, it would be reasonable to do the same things (though with a little more finesse) as the men that came before. You can still do all without most of what you do broadly stated.

I really wish there would be true equality where women are equal to men in all regards.
Where women cannot stay at home away from the societal pressures of finding a job and providing for the family. Where men can stay at home and look after the baby and avail of alimony and child custody in case of divorce. Where women are seen as predators and looked at with suspicion every time they interact with kids.
Where men can wear whatever they want and not be called a sissy.

Feminism is becoming business and not a moment’s anymore. There are many models and women who post pictures with caption ‘women are not sex objects’ etc. but in reality they are selling their nude and erotic pics through Instagram.

Well, I see it in a different way. Women who post ‘nude’ pictures usually do it in order to protest against the hypersexualization of the female body and sometimes, just because they feel confident about their bodies, which I think it’s very positive.
Also, you don’t get any money from posting pictures on instagram, it doesn’t work like youtube.

Does success mean less workforce/ wartime deaths to men?
Does success mean a better claim to custody for men?
Does success mean better acceptance to battered shelters for men?
Does success mean fewer acts of infanticide committed by women?

True. Which is why there should be a focus on what’s what first things first. Also the reason why this article is so on point. Feminism should demolish the games you mentioned and at the same time not fall to the games the article mentioned. A really good perspective imo.

Patriarchal society? The rule and control exerted by men, subjecting them as the gender with the most if not all power and importance? The day we stop clinging on to that fallacy, is the day that real work can be done and real goals can be achieved. I let go of my victim mentality approach in society in my early twenties and behold, life has never been better.

Equal rights and opportunities aren’t the same as equal outcome and if I have learned anything at the age of 41, it is the fact that we’ve achieved discrimination in our blind pursuit of positive discrimination in our favor!
Acknowledge the fact that gender equality is biologically not possible, that we are closer to each others gender than we realize and that the differences are subtle yet blatantly obvious and important.

Men are interested in things and women are interested in people. That is why we are not working the hours, moving across the country for the job, working the physically and dangerous jobs, why we are not secluded on an oil rig and why we are not associating personal growth solving that mechanical flaw in some big machinery.

I agree that we shouldn’t strive to become equal to men, but also plead for sanity and promote the idea of ensuring human rights first and foremost, not only take it to heart based on gender.