When I looked up the model number of the 20 ft 4 gauge cables on Amazon.com the single reviewer there says they aren't solid copper. The reviewer claims that not even the clamps are solid copper.

jlpaul65

New Member

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 1:01a

classicmac said: When I looked up the model number of the 20 ft 4 gauge cables on Amazon.com the single reviewer there says they aren't solid copper. The reviewer claims that not even the clamps are solid copper.††Good Catch Classicmac.This is also confirmed on WalMart where a reviewer stated "the text of the product information says they are copper clad aluminum wire" (this was the 16ft 6 gauge version)These must be a†better cable than the ones that have been posted on sale at Sears & Kmart recently since those were only rated at 225amps for the 6 gauge copper clad aluminum and these are rated at 500amps.

hpmax

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 1:14a

What is the advantage of "solid copper?" Its heavier and more expensive and if you need major current fast (like to start a car) the skin effect may keep most of the current in the outer bits. 4 gauge aluminum might well be better, cheaper, and lighter than 6 gauge copper.

hpmax said: What is the advantage of "solid copper?" Its heavier and more expensive and if you need major current fast (like to start a car) the skin effect may keep most of the current in the outer bits. 4 gauge aluminum might well be better, cheaper, and lighter than 6 gauge copper.

I read that also where the staffer said they were an all copper version. If your not willing to risk it and need a set, Sear s has their 20 ft 4 gauge all copper cables on sale for $62.99 plus tax on sale with store pickup available.† They come with what looks like a decent carrying case, goggles and gloves for $10 more than the woot 20 ft 4 gauge version shipped and you know for sure what your getting.jumpers†

pianoCM

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 8:47a

If ones intend to use this jumper once or twice a year, I believe 8-gauge CCA would be more than enough.

Anyway, can someone feed me some info whether why we need the 16' one? For head-to-head and side-to-side, 12' is enough, no need 16' and for front-to-back, 16' is NOT enough but 20'.So why there is 16' version?

smw

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 8:51a

Not sure what the number of times you use it have anything to do with the gauge. If you're lucky you'll never need one, but if you do, it's the sort of thing that you want to work right the first time, because Murphy says that when your battery fails, it will be cold, dark and raining.

Some whys:- In some cars, batteries are on the "other side".- Both cars can be a little farther apart, leaving easy access for driver(s) to get in and out.- Both cars may "need" to be farther apart, depending on conditions.

Random thought: If I eat steak once or twice a year, Should I believe a plastic knife would be more than enough?

pianoCM

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 9:16a

smw said: Not sure what the number of times you use it have anything to do with the gauge. If you're lucky you'll never need one, but if you do, it's the sort of thing that you want to work right the first time, because Murphy says that when your battery fails, it will be cold, dark and raining.† So, does that mean the 8-gauge CCA cable probably won't work first time while the 4-gauge all-copper one will absolutely do?†

pianoCM

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 9:19a

serenity22 said: Some whys:- In some cars, batteries are on the "other side".- Both cars can be a little farther apart, leaving easy access for driver(s) to get in and out.- Both cars may "need" to be farther apart, depending on conditions.

Random thought: If I eat steak once or twice a year, Should I believe a plastic knife would be more than enough?† R u referring "plastic knife" as the 8-gauge CCA cable and shiny silver knife as 4-gauge all-Cu one? OR††12' cable (plastic knife) vs. 16' cable (silver knife)?

pianoCM

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 9:29a

serenity22 said: Some whys:- In some cars, batteries are on the "other side".- Both cars can be a little farther apart, leaving easy access for driver(s) to get in and out.- Both cars may "need" to be farther apart, depending on conditions.

Random thought: If I eat steak once or twice a year, Should I believe a plastic knife would be more than enough?††- In some cars, batteries are on the "other side".a. Vehicle A's battery is on the driver side while Vehicle B's battery is on the passenger side, you meant? Then why can't they park side-to-side where the batteries are close (move the Veh. B to the left side of Veh. A)b. You might say "can't do that" 'cuz there is blockage (say another car) is on the left. Fine, then why not using the 20' one which can be used in your item 2 and item 3 on your list

- Both cars can be a little farther apart, leaving easy access for driver(s) to get in and out.- Both cars may "need" to be farther apart, depending on conditions.A 20' one wouldn't be more flexible? Both cars can be a little MORE father apart where the 16' is out of reach?

Seriously, I just try to educate myself why we need the 16' one.How's about why not 18'?

To me, the 20' is more like the universal one which can be used in any scenario but it's bulky, heavy and costly while the 12' is more practical, cheaper, lighter and use once in a while.The 16' just comes in to compensate both but has no value or not much value since they can do what 12' can but can't do what 20' able to do (front-to-back)†

smw

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 9:30a

pianoCM said: † So, does that mean the 8-gauge CCA cable probably won't work first time while the 4-gauge all-copper one will absolutely do?†Using this voltage drop calculator, with a 16', 8 gauge CCA (which is essentially aluminum, the copper cladding is a very small percentage of the total cable size) cable you'll be down to 8.83 volts (assuming a 100 amp starter). With the source car running, the voltage will probably be slightly higher, but since the alternator can't provide anywhere near the required starting current, it's probably only on the order of a few 10ths of a volt.

With a 4 gauge, 16' copper cable and the same starter, the voltage will be 11.2

pianoCM

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 9:39a

smw said: pianoCM said: † So, does that mean the 8-gauge CCA cable probably won't work first time while the 4-gauge all-copper one will absolutely do?†Using this voltage drop calculator,†with a 16', 8 gauge CCA (which is essentially aluminum, the copper cladding is a very small percentage of the total cable size) cable you'll be down to 8.83 volts (assuming a 100 amp starter). With the source car running, the voltage will probably be slightly higher, but since the alternator can't provide anywhere near the required starting current, it's probably only on the order of a few 10ths of a volt.

With a 4 gauge, 16' copper cable and the same starter, the voltage will be 11.2† Now, it makes a lot more sense in term of "silver knife vs. plastic knife" example that given by the other one.† Thanks a lot, m8

My reference was tongue-in-cheek that the deciding factor for a tool is not how many times you use it. You need to get one that will do the job.

In case of these cables, the colder your climate, the larger your vehicle (battery), the dead-er your battery - the higher (thicker, lower-number) the gauge you need. Length is a separate issue. Will the lower (thinner, higher-number) gauge cables not do the job? In many cases they will. The above variations will be the deciding factors.

In the end, for me, the higher gauge is the way to go. I want the job done as fast as possible. Why? Because:- As smw said, it could be cold, dark and raining. Or snowing. Or windy.- I could be in a bad neighborhood.- I could be in a hurry.- The driver of the other vehicle could be in a hurry. We have all seen it. Willingness to help changes inversely the longer it takes.- The other vehicle, or my own, could be in a bad spot - oncoming traffic, blocking traffic, etc.- There could be a cop breathing down your neck, or children screaming in your ears.- I could be in a colder climate while traveling.- I might be helping someone else with a larger battery than mine.

I could go on....

Peace of mind for only a few $$ more, and the investment lasts for a long time. A long, long, time.

smw

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 9:53a

serenity22 said: Peace of mind for only a few $$ more, and the investment lasts for a long time. A long, long, time.† This is true, I have the same jumper cables I purchased after I bought my first car, in 1984.

pianoCM

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 9:58a

I agree as I believe we all agree that 4awg > 6awq > 8awg and all-Cu is better than CCA. This is science and there are no argument.Still, the length is something that is on my mind.

Anyway, are we 100% sure that those jumpers on Woot are 100% Copper?

smw

Senior Member - 1K

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 10:09a

Since these cables aren't listed anywhere else online (at least that Google knows about), it's tough to say for sure. Even though the Woot staffer confirmed that they were, I'm still not convinced.

zapy

Dismembered Member

posted: Jan. 8, 2014 @ 10:30a

I have a set I got from Sears back in 1985. Those are true pure copper. 16 feet long which allow vehicles to be far apart like at a grocery store parking space any the jump vehicle pulls up to the trunk. 4 gauge wire. The absolute best investment I have ever made. I'll pass these down to my kids when I die.

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