Why does it have to be either, 1) Holmgren stupid, Gillis genius or 2) Holmgren genius, Gillis stupid?

Holmgren's offersheet was well thought out and it was worth a try. Gillis had a feeling it wouldn't work. Neither of these two GM's have lost or gained anything.. So why is either parties getting bashed/praised?

Both of them were smart for doing what they did/tried to do.

Who's actually saying this makes Gillis a genius? We just spent a week listening to many of our knee jerk reactionary fans calling him an idiot because he didn't go the offer sheet route, which he thought would only get matched so he figured the only way to get Weber would be as a UFA next year. Getting matched doesn't necessarily make Holmgren an idiot either, perhaps after talking to Weber he got the impression that Philly wasn't his preferred UFA destination, so the only way they could get him was to gamble and call Nashville's bluff that they could match.

Really the only idiots left here is our own lemming fans who started jumping off bridges as soon as the offer sheet was signed.

Who's actually saying this makes Gillis a genius? We just spent a week listening to many of our knee jerk reactionary fans calling him an idiot because he didn't go the offer sheet route, which he thought would only get matched so he figured the only way to get Weber would be as a UFA next year. Getting matched doesn't necessarily make Holmgren an idiot either, perhaps after talking to Weber he got the impression that Philly wasn't his preferred UFA destination, so the only way they could get him was to gamble and call Nashville's bluff that they could match.

Really the only idiots left here is our own lemming fans who started jumping off bridges as soon as the offer sheet was signed.

I was using hyperbole that was equal to the insanely stupid reactions. Reading the last page of the Weber thread it was "Well, Holmgren is an idiot", "Well Gillis is pretty smart, I guess", and before the matching it was "Smart offer by Holmgren", " Gillis".

It's just something I noticed, there is never any in between on a subject/topic.

In the end, no one is worse/better. Though, you can argue that 29 other teams are losers.

Then he would've signed a retirement contract with Nashville, or New York, or one of the host of other teams who'd offer him the same.

I don't think Nashville offered him one or he would've signed with them previous to the Philly offersheet.

I doubt any other team would've offersheeted him one, as there was the idea that Nashville would match (despite not offering him one in the first place, they too may have been waiting for the new CBA) - which is why the Canucks didn't offer one.

The Canucks didn't offer him one, other teams may have felt the same way Gillis did.

Then Weber would have probably reached an agreement with Nashville on a retirement contract if there were none floating out there. He would have never accepted the one-year offersheet due to CBA uncertainty.

Then Weber would have probably reached an agreement with Nashville on a retirement contract if there were none floating out there. He would have never accepted the one-year offersheet due to CBA uncertainty.

Possibly, we don't know that for sure though. Alternatively the 14M, with the potential for more signing bonuses next year, might be more appealing than whatever Nashville offered him (remember this is a team that offered him 4.5M last year).

Possibly, we don't know that for sure though. Alternatively the 14M, with the potential for more signing bonuses next year, might be more appealing than whatever Nashville offered him (remember this is a team that offered him 4.5M last year).

Well, we're playing the "what if" game, aren't we?

What if Weber didn't care where he was playing, and only wanted the retirement contract? (pretty strong what if, as many media outlets have speculated this)

We don't know that - especially if his only other option was another lowball 3 or 4 year deal from Poile. It's all moot now, but we can still play the what if game...

On 1040 last night Gillis said something along the lines of Weber wanting to take advantage of the current financial situation. That pretty much rules out a 1 year offer sheet. With the next CBA looking worse for the players, it seems pretty clear that Weber wanted a contract under the current CBA, with long term.

On 1040 last night Gillis said something along the lines of Weber wanting to take advantage of the current financial situation. That pretty much rules out a 1 year offer sheet. With the next CBA looking worse for the players, it seems pretty clear that Weber wanted a contract under the current CBA, with long term.

I agree with you 100%, my point is that what if he wasn't offered that contract. Again, it's moot now and just serves as exercise in frustration so probably not worth pursuing.

I don't think Nashville offered him one or he would've signed with them previous to the Philly offersheet.

I doubt any other team would've offersheeted him one, as there was the idea that Nashville would match (despite not offering him one in the first place, they too may have been waiting for the new CBA) - which is why the Canucks didn't offer one.

Several teams hosted Weber in an effort to convince him to sign with them. If none of those teams had any inclination to offer him a contract why were they wasting everyone's time by trying to woo him?

Teams were trying to convince Weber to accept their offers, not the other way around. He had plenty of suitors and could've easily gotten a suitable contract even if Philadelphia was out of the picture.

Several teams hosted Weber in an effort to convince him to sign with them. If none of those teams had any inclination to offer him a contract why were they wasting everyone's time by trying to woo him?

Teams were trying to convince Weber to accept their offers, not the other way around. He had plenty of suitors and could've easily gotten a suitable contract even if Philadelphia was out of the picture.

We gave him a tour, and then (reportedly) offered him a 1 year deal. It's not a given that he would've been offered a retirement contract by another team - they also may have decided a 1 year-deal would be the best route, as even if Nashville matched there he would be a UFA in a year's time.

He toured, what - maybe 6 teams? With two of those teams being Vancouver and Philadelphia. So maybe the other 4 thought like Philly, maybe they thought like Vancouver. We know for certain that Philadelphia destroyed any possibility of a 1 year deal.

Darren DregerVerified ‏@DarrenDreger
Now that Nashville has matched, expect Titan Sports to ask for a no trade or modified no trade clause for Weber. Can't be traded for 1 year

Would there be any reason for Nashville to give him a (modified) NTC at this point?

[nevermind] Once again Dreger get's clarified. First, he's surprised that Nashville matches. Then speculates that Weber and agent were surprised that Nashville matched. Now this.

Elliotte Friedman ‏@FriedgeHNIC
Re: adding a NTC to Weber deal. NHL's position is CBA dictates that cannot happen. The offer sheet is the contract; no changes allowed.

Weber could hold out and not play this year. Thus, Nashville has to pay $27 million to him for nothing. It's a weird situation because I don't think Weber wants to play in Nashville. If they trade him next year, one thing is for sure though...he ain't going to Philly.

And I doubt Weber DIDN'T want to play for Vancouver, just that the number of years was a bigger factor than his dream destination.

We gave him a tour, and then (reportedly) offered him a 1 year deal. It's not a given that he would've been offered a retirement contract by another team - they also may have decided a 1 year-deal would be the best route, as even if Nashville matched there he would be a UFA in a year's time.

He toured, what - maybe 6 teams? With two of those teams being Vancouver and Philadelphia. So maybe the other 4 thought like Philly, maybe they thought like Vancouver.

New York was apparently prepared to offer him a contract but he rebuffed them and it sounds like the Canucks went through a similar thing as they never actually presented him with a contract offer.

Even if he had no other interested teams he still could've gotten a long term deal out of the Predators. Nashville was offering Suter a similar deal to the one he got in Minnesota so it's pretty obvious that Weber could've gotten something along those lines. It wouldn't have been nearly as front loaded as his current contract is, but the end result would've been the same; a 10+ year big money deal.