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My sample size may be small but It doesn't prevent noticing certain traits that could prolong over time. One thing I can say definitely is that Calderon would not come down & jack deep 3's early in a shot clock, his decision making IMO is currently far better.

Easier to mesh & involve new team-mates when your an unselfish player, which Calderon is. Lowry is more selfish which would/does take more time to acclimate especially considering he has the keys to a free flowing offense.

your sample size of 15 games is way too small im sorry. if you recall lowry was starting on the same unit as bargs. is it fair to say that calderon has played with the better defensive unit ? i def think so. id like to see lowry on the same unit as amir and davis rather then bargs and rookie jonas.

and ya ppl are talking as if calderon is superior to lowry when in all actuality lowry is the better over all player. in this forum ppl are quick to support the player who is haveing a good streatch.. but when that same player has a few bad games the same posters will scortch that player.

right now every one has rose coloured glasses on and forget how average he has been over his career. we need to sell high now because calderon never remains at this level and always goes back down to earth.

Originally Posted by B2B

Did you not point to Bargnani as being the reason in a next thread as to why the Raptors were on this current win streak.

True or false,

Lowry has also played lesser competition & come up short.

The team has found some resemblance of chemistry under Calderon.

Bargnani has played poorly to start the year

Amir closing out games has been a defensive improvement over a 20 yo centre.

Anderson has come back & given production out of the SF spot

Casey slowed the pace down, apposed to increasing it for Lowry.

did i point to bargnani as to why the Raptors were on this current win streak. i dont understand your question. bargs has been injured has he not ? how could he be the reason the raps are winning ? sorry maybe i just dont get what your asking me.

as for lowry does he not need time to gel and build chemistry ? you dont need time to get familiar with your team mates ? calderon has played with these guys and is familier with casey from last season. how do you compare the two ? lowry played 15 games, he was playing through injuries in atleast a quarter of those games. give the guy some time before you judge his performance.

your sample size of 15 games is way too small im sorry. if you recall lowry was starting on the same unit as bargs. is it fair to say that calderon has played with the better defensive unit ? i def think so. id like to see lowry on the same unit as amir and davis rather then bargs and rookie jonas.

and ya ppl are talking as if calderon is superior to lowry when in all actuality lowry is the better over all player.

Are you reading my posts selectively.

I stated in several of them that Lowry is the better talent. The issue is not Lowry as an individual talent, issue IMO is his ability to run a free flowing offense.

Originally Posted by smith&wesson

did i point to bargnani as to why the Raptors were on this current win streak. i dont understand your question. bargs has been injured has he not ? how could he be the reason the raps are winning ?

calderon played more with amir and ed then lowry did in those 15 games that lowry played.

Calderon won with Bargnani at the start of the season in one of the 3 games Lowry went down to injury.

Bargnani poor play is definite factor in those losses but IMO Calderon's play has been a bigger factor in this current run of wins.

Originally Posted by smith&wesson

also the first 15 games with new team mates and a new coach and system counts for nothing ? you dont need time to gel and build chemistry ? you dont need time to get familiar with your team mates ? calderon has played with these guys and is familier with casey from last season. how do you compare the two ?

It does count, just like Jose building back team chemistry counts for something.

I stated in several of them that Lowry is the better talent. The issue is not Lowry as an individual talent, issue IMO is his ability to run a free flowing offense.

Calderon won with Bargnani at the start of the season in one of the 3 games Lowry went down to injury.

Bargnani poor play is definite factor in those losses but IMO Calderon's play has been a bigger factor in this current run of wins.

It does count, just like Jose building back team chemistry counts for something.

Once again I'm not slagging Lowry as a talent.

i know you arent and we are just discussing the topic. i dont even disagree with you. the team has played better with calderon. but what im saying is for the most part it seems ppl in this forum forget how many games lowry has played, forget that he is on a new team and in a new system and they also forget that he was playing through injuries as well.

calderon being able to create for others is a good thing but can be bad too. we have a bunch of players who cant create for themselves and rely on one play maker ? thats discouraging

with d rose out the bulls are still respectable. if calderon went down our players would be lost. i dont like the fact that we have become so dependant on him because i havent seen him take this team very far in all the years he has been here. just plays well for streatches at a time when another player threatens to take his starting role but never sustains that level of play.

i know you arent and we are just discussing the topic. i dont even disagree with you. the team has played better with calderon. but what im saying is for the most part it seems ppl in this forum forget how many games lowry has played, forget that he is on a new team and in a new system and they also forget that he was playing through injuries as well.

calderon being able to create for others is a good thing but can be bad too. we have a bunch of players who cant create for themselves and rely on one play maker ? thats discouraging

with d rose out the bulls are still respectable. if calderon went down our players would be lost. i dont like the fact that we have become so dependant on him because i havent seen him take this team very far in all the years he has been here. just plays well for streatches at a time when another player threatens to take his starting role but never sustains that level of play.

if you dont consider a team comprised basically of Jose and Chris and a bunch of mariachis to the playoffs where in reality given the rosters they shouldnt have had any bussiness making them..............

i know you arent and we are just discussing the topic. i dont even disagree with you. the team has played better with calderon. but what im saying is for the most part it seems ppl in this forum forget how many games lowry has played, forget that he is on a new team and in a new system and they also forget that he was playing through injuries as well.

calderon being able to create for others is a good thing but can be bad too. we have a bunch of players who cant create for themselves and rely on one play maker ? thats discouraging

with d rose out the bulls are still respectable. if calderon went down our players would be lost. i dont like the fact that we have become so dependant on him because i havent seen him take this team very far in all the years he has been here. just plays well for streatches at a time when another player threatens to take his starting role but never sustains that level of play.

if you dont consider a team comprised basically of Jose and Chris and a bunch of mariachis to the playoffs where in reality given the rosters they shouldnt have had any bussiness making them..............

really ? they had no business making the playoffs ? they were first in the atlantic division that makes them a 4th seed. the league wasnt full of super teams at the time. we were better then any other team in the atlantic and the east was much weeker back then.

you say the team had no talent yet if you look at the rest of the east in those years the compitition wasnt exactly very stiff either

i know you arent and we are just discussing the topic. i dont even disagree with you. the team has played better with calderon. but what im saying is for the most part it seems ppl in this forum forget how many games lowry has played, forget that he is on a new team and in a new system and they also forget that he was playing through injuries as well.

calderon being able to create for others is a good thing but can be bad too. we have a bunch of players who cant create for themselves and rely on one play maker ? thats discouraging

with d rose out the bulls are still respectable. if calderon went down our players would be lost. i dont like the fact that we have become so dependant on him because i havent seen him take this team very far in all the years he has been here. just plays well for streatches at a time when another player threatens to take his starting role but never sustains that level of play.

i don't think it's fair to judge anybody who has played the bulk of his career with Andrea in a starting role by their record. sorry, just don't. what has become clear to all this year regarding Andrea has been true for 7 years. throw the records out the window.

Originally Posted by nycericanguy

well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

i don't think it's fair to judge anybody who has played the bulk of his career with Andrea in a starting role by their record. sorry, just don't. what has become clear to all this year regarding Andrea has been true for 7 years. throw the records out the window.

bargs gets his fair share of blame. chris bosh does too. but calderon doesnt as far as im concerned if you are a big part of a failing team you take some of that blame too.

jamie do you think calderon will sustain this level of play if he re signed ? i dont.

you know my opinion on this. this could almost be considered baiting LOL

and no i don't think he will be able to play at this level for much longer but longer, i believe, than you think.

your not a master baiter so dont worry about it lol

does calderon not always raise his level of play when there is another player competing for his starting role ? after ford was shipped out did calderon sustain his amazing game from when ford was injured ? when jack left did he sustain that play ? he has been consistently inconsistent.

what makes us think if we trade lowry, calderon sustains this level of play ? he never has before. he always comes back down to earth.

he is a different player this season and i apreciate his efforts but is it a coincidence that he is in a contract year ? his value has never been so high in 8 seasons so why not sell high on him now while we have the chance?