I had lunch yesterday with a university professor from Sweden who was visiting my workplace together with a Swedish delegation. He was not a royalist himself and might even be a republican, but I took the opportunity to ask him his opinion about the SRF. I must confess I (in a somewhat machiavellian fashion) omitted that I actually had a fair amount of knowledge about the Royal Family so that I could find out how he, as a Swede, would describe the RF to a complete stranger who he believed knew nothing about the Swedish royals. Here is what he said:

1) CP Victoria is "very competent" and "represents the country very well". She is also "very popular".

2) Carl Philip is OK and so is his bride. BTW, he had met Sofia personally before and said "she seems to be a nice person". He specifically mentioned "she was involved in a program to help children in Africa" and didn't mention anything about her controversial past. The fact that he himself was involved in development programs in Africa (Kenya) might explain why he thought so highly of Sofia, but, in any case, his reply illustrates how Project Playground was good PR for her.

3) Queen Silvia, according to him, "doesn't speak Swedish properly". He also said she goes to Brazil very often, officially "on vacation", but people actually suspect she goes there "to have plastic surgery".

4) Maddie according to him "had problems in her youth" and decided to move to NY. He then said she married "a foreigner" and moved to the US where she had a daughter. He apparently resented that Madeleine had left the country.

5) He said nothing about the King and I didn't push the subject any further.

I had lunch yesterday with a university professor from Sweden who was visiting my workplace together with a Swedish delegation. He was not a royalist himself and might even be a republican, but I took the opportunity to ask him his opinion about the SRF. I must confess I (in a somewhat machiavellian fashion) omitted that I actually had a fair amount of knowledge about the Royal Family so that I could find out how he, as a Swede, would describe the RF to a complete stranger who he believed knew nothing about the Swedish royals. Here is what he said:

1) CP Victoria is "very competent" and "represents the country very well". She is also "very popular".

2) Carl Philip and so is his bride. BTW, he had met Sofia personally before and said "she seems to be a nice person". He specifically mentioned "she was involved in a program to help children in Africa" and didn't mention anything abou her controversial past. The fact that he himself was involved in development programs in Africa (Kenya) might explain why he thought so highly of Sofia, but, in any case, his reply illustrates how Project Playground was good PR for her.

3) Queen Silvia, according to him, "doesn't speak Swedish properly". He also said she goes to Brazil very often, officially "on vacation", but people actually suspect she goes there "to have plastic surgery".

4) Maddie according to him "had problems in her youth" and decided to move to NY. He then said she married "a foreigner" and moved to the US where she had a daughter. He apparently resented that Madeleine had left the country.

5) He said nothing about the King and I didn't push the subject any further.

What do you think ?

All these things has been written so many times in swedish press, there is nothing new in them, besides that we all know why Madeleine moved to NY, maybe not because of problems in her youth.

All these things has been written so many times in swedish press, there is nothing new in them, besides that we all know why Madeleine moved to NY, maybe not because of problems in her youth.

Yes, I know, but my question actually was if, although it was just an isolated conversation, his opinion was representative of the average public opinion in Sweden about the royals, i.e. favorable about Victoria and CP/Sofia, not so much about Silvia, and clearly negative about Madeleine, at leasr after her decision to leave Sweden.

I had lunch yesterday with a university professor from Sweden who was visiting my workplace together with a Swedish delegation. He was not a royalist himself and might even be a republican, but I took the opportunity to ask him his opinion about the SRF. I must confess I (in a somewhat machiavellian fashion) omitted that I actually had a fair amount of knowledge about the Royal Family so that I could find out how he, as a Swede, would describe the RF to a complete stranger who he believed knew nothing about the Swedish royals. Here is what he said:

1) CP Victoria is "very competent" and "represents the country very well". She is also "very popular".

2) Carl Philip is OK and so is his bride. BTW, he had met Sofia personally before and said "she seems to be a nice person". He specifically mentioned "she was involved in a program to help children in Africa" and didn't mention anything about her controversial past. The fact that he himself was involved in development programs in Africa (Kenya) might explain why he thought so highly of Sofia, but, in any case, his reply illustrates how Project Playground was good PR for her.

3) Queen Silvia, according to him, "doesn't speak Swedish properly". He also said she goes to Brazil very often, officially "on vacation", but people actually suspect she goes there "to have plastic surgery".

4) Maddie according to him "had problems in her youth" and decided to move to NY. He then said she married "a foreigner" and moved to the US where she had a daughter. He apparently resented that Madeleine had left the country.

5) He said nothing about the King and I didn't push the subject any further.

What do you think ?

As a swede I'll give my candid thoughts on this:

1) CP Victoria is "very competent" and "represents the country very well". She is also "very popular".

Fully agree

2) Carl Philip and so is his bride. BTW, he had met Sofia personally before and said "she seems to be a nice person". He specifically mentioned "she was involved in a program to help children in Africa" and didn't mention anything abou her controversial past. The fact that he himself was involved in development programs in Africa (Kenya) might explain why he thought so highly of Sofia, but, in any case, his reply illustrates how Project Playground was good PR for her.

I think this is more to do that he is involved in the area. It's not a very well known fact. Peoplpe know who she is but think it's good that CP is allowed to marry who he's in love with.

3) Queen Silvia, according to him, "doesn't speak Swedish properly". He also said she goes to Brazil very often, officially "on vacation", but people actually suspect she goes there "to have plastic surgery".

Hahah, that Brazil thing I've never heard, but the plastic thing is common known :P And she speaks sooo bad Swedish. She seems nice but a little stupid because of it.

4) Maddie according to him "had problems in her youth" and decided to move to NY. He then said she married "a foreigner" and moved to the US where she had a daughter. He apparently resented that Madeleine had left the country.

Never heard anything about problem in her youth (but I'm younger that her and don't know old stuff about them) but everyone saw it that she ran away after the breakup and disappeared and moved and married a non Swede. Chris is far less accepted than Sofia. I (and others) think that Madde seems like a spoiled perty princess. I'm not saying that I think she is as a person, but that is the image that is portrayed

5) He said nothing about the King and I didn't push the subject any further.

Oh, the king is a standing joke. Can't remember the name of the town he's in. He's known as stupid and having affairs. Thank god we have Victoria in our future.

[...] Why can't she just renounce her place in line and live as Mrs. O'Neill in Britain with her husband and children? [...]

That is not possible (renouncing) but for the rest she can perfectly have a private life. There are many other royals whom are in a line of succession and do live a life in relative anonimity. All her aunts (however not in line of succession because before 1980 the succession was male-only) are all Princesses and they are seldom in the publicity.

Princess Margaretha lives a quiet life in Oxfordshire, United Kingdom.Princess Birgitta lives a quiet life on the Island of Mallorca, Spain.Princess Désirée lives a quiet life on two castles in Halland, Sweden. Princess Christina lives a quiet life, first at a pavillion in the park of Ulriksdal Palace and now in a mansion in Slottsbacken (the neighbourhood behind the Royal Palace in Stockholm).

They are the proof that Princess Madeleine can live a quiet life. Also in the enormous wide stretched beautiful country of Sweden with only around 9.5 million people. Plenty of opportunities for a secluded life as Princess of Sweden.

That is not possible (renouncing) but for the rest she can perfectly have a private life. There are many other royals whom are in a line of succession and do live a life in relative anonimity. All her aunts (however not in line of succession because before 1980 the succession was male-only) are all Princesses and they are seldom in the publicity.

Princess Margaretha lives a quiet life in Oxfordshire, United Kingdom.Princess Birgitta lives a quiet life on the Island of Mallorca, Spain.Princess Désirée lives a quiet life on two castles in Halland, Sweden. Princess Christina lives a quiet life, first at a pavillion in the park of Ulriksdal Palace and now in a mansion in Slottsbacken (the neighbourhood behind the Royal Palace in Stockholm).

They are the proof that Princess Madeleine can live a quiet life. Also in the enormous wide stretched beautiful country of Sweden with only around 9.5 million people. Plenty of opportunities for a secluded life as Princess of Sweden.

Haha, different times, different rules.

Also, who could see Madde living out of the city? :P Not me, she's as much city girl as they come here in Sweden.

Princess Christina has done more "official" work events than Madeleine during the last years. Her work events are hard to find because they are not at the royal calendar. And of the king's sisters only Birgitta is a HRH.

Also, who could see Madde living out of the city? :P Not me, she's as much city girl as they come here in Sweden.

The Internet changes things, as does the IPhone and digital cameras everywhere. It's very unlikely that Madeleine, a beautiful woman who happens to be a princess with beautiful children and a (relatively) wealthy husband, will ever get out of the limelight. And if she doesn't 'cooperate', the press will make it so she has to 'endure'.

I had lunch yesterday with a university professor from Sweden who was visiting my workplace together with a Swedish delegation. He was not a royalist himself and might even be a republican, but I took the opportunity to ask him his opinion about the SRF. I must confess I (in a somewhat machiavellian fashion) omitted that I actually had a fair amount of knowledge about the Royal Family so that I could find out how he, as a Swede, would describe the RF to a complete stranger who he believed knew nothing about the Swedish royals. Here is what he said:

1) CP Victoria is "very competent" and "represents the country very well". She is also "very popular".

2) Carl Philip is OK and so is his bride. BTW, he had met Sofia personally before and said "she seems to be a nice person". He specifically mentioned "she was involved in a program to help children in Africa" and didn't mention anything about her controversial past. The fact that he himself was involved in development programs in Africa (Kenya) might explain why he thought so highly of Sofia, but, in any case, his reply illustrates how Project Playground was good PR for her.

3) Queen Silvia, according to him, "doesn't speak Swedish properly". He also said she goes to Brazil very often, officially "on vacation", but people actually suspect she goes there "to have plastic surgery".

4) Maddie according to him "had problems in her youth" and decided to move to NY. He then said she married "a foreigner" and moved to the US where she had a daughter. He apparently resented that Madeleine had left the country.

5) He said nothing about the King and I didn't push the subject any further.

What do you think ?

Ι'm not swedish but struck me two things he said. First the Silvia Queen how many years? about forty amounts not yet know well the language? and second said nothing about the King imagining the opinion of him

Ι'm not swedish but struck me two things he said. First the Silvia Queen how many years? about forty amounts not yet know well the language? and second said nothing about the King imagining the opinion of him

As far as the King is concerned, I assume that, because he is viewed as "a joke" by some people in Sweden, they prefer not to say anything to avoid having to say something negative to a stranger who is not from Sweden like myself.

On the language point, I happen to know several people who have lived for 40 years or so in a foreign country and still can't speak the local language without an accent or without making mistakes. It's actually more common than you might think. What surprises me is that Silvia, prior to being queen, was, if I'm not mistaken, an interpreter. I assumed then she had a talent for, or at least an interest in learning other languages.

Now, going back to the topic of the forum, I don't really think we can compare Madeleine to the King's sisters as the latter are not members of the Royal House (except for Princess Birgitta ?), whereas Madeleine is. I also happen to think that leaving Sweden again to move to London won't help Madeleine boost her popularity domestically. On the contrary, it will probaby draw more negative feelings about her and Chris.

It has nothing to do with being a member of the Royal House or not. The average man in the street will not be able to tell the difference between Princess Birgitta (who made an equal marriage and remains a HRH) and Princess Désirée who married a Friherre (Baron) and is no HRH.

If Princess Madeleine wants, she can have a secluded life. If Agnetha Fältskog and Annifrid Prinzessin Reuss, Gräfin zu Plauen nee Lyngstad, the most über-famous Swedes of the world, are able to disappear almost completely off the radar, then a Princess Madeleine who is largely "Big" in Sweden and the other Scandinavian countries can do as well. Come on, have we any idea how immense and empty Sweden actually is, with thick green forests, mountain slopes, fjords and many, many secluded islands... If there are countries in Europe where you are able to withdraw from regular society, then it are Norway, Sweden and Finland...

It has nothing to do with being a member of the Royal House or not. The average man in the street will not be able to tell the difference between Princess Birgitta (who made an equal marriage and remains a HRH) and Princess Désirée who married a Friherre (Baron) and is no HRH.

If Princess Madeleine wants, she can have a secluded life. If Agnetha Fältskog and Annifrid Prinzessin Reuss, Gräfin zu Plauen nee Lyngstad, the most über-famous Swedes of the world, are able to disappear almost completely off the radar, then a Princess Madeleine who is largely "Big" in Sweden and the other Scandinavian countries can do as well. Come on, have we any idea how immense and empty Sweden actually is, with thick green forests, mountain slopes, fjords and many, many secluded islands... If there are countries in Europe where you are able to withdraw from regular society, then it are Norway, Sweden and Finland...

Hahah, well yes. If you want to have miles to the closes corner store and do nothing all day :P Madeleine hardly seems like a country girl to me. She seems very fond of her cafe's and clubs. That's not a bad thing, but I think even Göteborg or Malmö would be to small for her.

I hope the paps leave M,C & family alone in London. It's a wonderful city (yes, I'm biased!) and most people here wouldn't give two hoots about who they are. They ARE areas they could live in with minimal attention, it's just a case of if they've thought of them I suppose.

As far as the King is concerned, I assume that, because he is viewed as "a joke" by some people in Sweden, they prefer not to say anything to avoid having to say something negative to a stranger who is not from Sweden like myself.

On the language point, I happen to know several people who have lived for 40 years or so in a foreign country and still can't speak the local language without an accent or without making mistakes. It's actually more common than you might think. What surprises me is that Silvia, prior to being queen, was, if I'm not mistaken, an interpreter. I assumed then she had a talent for, or at least an interest in learning other languages.

Now, going back to the topic of the forum, I don't really think we can compare Madeleine to the King's sisters as the latter are not members of the Royal House (except for Princess Birgitta ?), whereas Madeleine is. I also happen to think that leaving Sweden again to move to London won't help Madeleine boost her popularity domestically. On the contrary, it will probaby draw more negative feelings about her and Chris.

I must say, I didn't realize that Silvia's Swedish was lacking, and that really surprises me. Certainly some people can live in a country for decades and still not speak a language perfectly but, as you mentioned, Silvia had worked as an interpreter. According to Wikipedia, Swedish is her 6th language, so I would expect her to have an above-average facility with languages. I would also think that being queen would give her even more incentive to focus on making sure she speaks the language correctly.

As for Madeleine, I must admit I feel a bit bad for her. I think, in a way, she's caught between loyalty to the family she was born into, but also loyalty to her husband and children. And it seems she's been judged very harshly for that (I mean, I know some criticism is bound to happen, but I'm surprised by the strength of some of it). I think - or at least I hope - that London might be a good balance for her, at least for now. As has been mentioned, it's a good place for Chris to work, and it's much closer to home for Madeleine. It definitely seems like Madeleine and Chris are still trying to figure things out, which I don't necessarily see as a bad thing, but rather a relatively normal thing. For many couples, the first year or so of being married requires some adjustments, it's just that, for Madeleine and Chris, these adjustments are unusually magnified.

I hope the paps leave M,C & family alone in London. It's a wonderful city (yes, I'm biased!) and most people here wouldn't give two hoots about who they are. They ARE areas they could live in with minimal attention, it's just a case of if they've thought of them I suppose.

Didn't Madeleine live (briefly) in London when she was 19 or so ? Nobody seems to have noticed her there back then. She also said once in an interview that she had never met the PoW's sons, which I find surprising considering the rumors that the BRF considered her as a potential match for Prince William.

It is no surprise that Queen Silvia has an accent and maybe makes language errors. Queen Máxima (an Argentinean in the Netherlands), Crown Princess Mary (an Australian in Denmark), Queen Paola (an Italian in Belgium) are all in the same league. All of them are amazingly fluent in their new adopted language but yes, any native Swede, Dutchman, Dane or Belgian will be able to hear an accent, to hear some errors, etc. It is the same with me. I am fluent in French but here in the Bourbonnais any native will immediately hear I am not a born Frenchman.

It is no surprise that Queen Silvia has an accent and maybe makes language errors. Queen Máxima (an Argentinean in the Netherlands), Crown Princess Mary (an Australian in Denmark), Queen Paola (an Italian in Belgium) are all in the same league. All of them are amazingly fluent in their new adopted language but yes, any native Swede, Dutchman, Dane or Belgian will be able to hear an accent, to hear some errors, etc. It is the same with me. I am fluent in French but here in the Bourbonnais any native will immediately hear I am not a born Frenchman.

Well, I would expect that Silvia would certainly always have an accent (if someone learns a new language as an adult, it's almost inevitable that they'll always have an accent), but the comments here make it sound as if her Swedish is really noticeably bad. To me, that would indicate that it goes beyond the typical occasional grammatical mistake we all expect from someone who's a non-native speaker of a language. However, I speak no Swedish whatsoever, so I'm just going by other people's reactions.

Well, I would expect that Silvia would certainly always have an accent (if someone learns a new language as an adult, it's almost inevitable that they'll always have an accent), but the comments here make it sound as if her Swedish is really noticeably bad. To me, that would indicate that it goes beyond the typical occasional grammatical mistake we all expect from someone who's a non-native speaker of a language. However, I speak no Swedish whatsoever, so I'm just going by other people's reactions.

The accent (and grammatic faults) are very very clear. Not that I have a problem with it but in combination with the Kings image of being "stupid" it doesn't help :P And it puzzles me that she worked as an interpertor.

I love her voice, and her spoken Swedish has always sounded very beautiful to me, the same way that I love English spoken by someone foreign. (I am thinking of the wonderful lilt certain people give to English coming from certain other mother tongues). Queen Silvia has a wonderfully modulated voice. Very lovely. Easy on the ears.

P.S. I also know for a fact that Queen Silvia was immensely popular in Sweden during the 1980's (and I assume as a young bride and mother in the 1970's). No matter what someone might say now, she was very special in Sweden back then and for a long time. She is special. I just adore her.