But convert the sequences into amino acids and the picture changes dramatically.

So, does this mean that the DNA sequences actually were different, but code for the same amino acid sequence? That’s pretty cool and definitely shows that it’s not horizontal gene transfer but convergence.

]]>By: Comrade PhysioProfhttp://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6221
Sat, 30 Jan 2010 22:02:40 +0000http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6221Fascinating post, Ed!
]]>By: LKLhttp://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6220
Thu, 28 Jan 2010 03:55:25 +0000http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6220This is so, so cool. I love this universe.
]]>By: Blackbirdhttp://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6219
Wed, 27 Jan 2010 21:32:52 +0000http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6219Cool post! A beautiful science story and I think this will become a textbook example of molecular convergence. There is a third group of echolocating vertebrates, many species of cave swiftlet – of fame due to the Chinese birds nest soup – also echolocate. It would be cool to look at their prestins. As for the cladogram discussion, a cladogram based on one gene shows just the similarities of that gene/protein. In many cases, this is informative on the genetic relationships of organisms, in many others, not.
]]>By: Ed Yonghttp://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6218
Wed, 27 Jan 2010 18:12:31 +0000http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6218Jacob – thanks for the correction on Li’s gender! Fixed.
]]>By: Jasonhttp://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6217
Wed, 27 Jan 2010 03:20:22 +0000http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6217Very, very cool. And butterflies using the earth’s geomagnetic field, and ants using the sun and counting their steps (http://thoughtfulanimal.wordpress.com/2010/01/26/path-integration-in-the-desert-ant/) – seems like a big week in the blogosphere for animal navigation.
]]>By: Jake Cameronhttp://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6216
Tue, 26 Jan 2010 23:33:11 +0000http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6216I’m with the first commentor!
As luck would have it, I am finally tackling Dawkin’s Blind Watchmaker this week, such a lovely illustration would well serve the next print edition! Thanks for your passion and clarity Ed!
]]>By: Lab Rathttp://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6215
Tue, 26 Jan 2010 15:03:38 +0000http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6215Jack: The cladogram is not *showing* that the cows are more closely related to bats. It is generally *known* that cows are more closely related, and they are just being used for comparison in the cladogram.
And if you put the right kind of information into cladograms, they can give an approximation of evolutionary relatedness, particularly if you use highly conserved RNA sequences.
]]>By: Lab Rathttp://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6214
Tue, 26 Jan 2010 15:03:01 +0000http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6214Jack: The cladogram is not *showing* that the cows are more closely related to bats. It is generally *known* that cows are more closely related, and they are just being used for comparison in the cladogram.
And if you put the right kind of information into cladograms, they can give an approximation of evolutionary relatedness, particularly if you use highly conserved RNA sequences.
]]>By: Jacobhttp://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6213
Tue, 26 Jan 2010 03:10:32 +0000http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/25/echolocation-in-bats-and-whales-based-on-same-changes-to-same-gene/#comment-6213The goal of most cladograms is to show how species are actually related. Whether they do or not depends on what data go into it and what methods are used to generate it, but that is the idea. Phentics is grouping species by overall similarity, while cladistics is grouping species according to traits they share due to common heritage. Most cladograms these days are generated with cladistic goals, even though some methods are rooted in phenetics.
Of course, the cladogram above is not supposed to show relationships, it’s supposed to show convergence, but most other cladograms are different.
]]>