The benefits of studying Torah

In Israel, 60 percent of ultra-Orthodox men do not work. They study the Torah and collect welfare benefits, and some Israelis -- including some ultra-Orthodox Jews -- question whether that's a good use of public funds.

Categories:

Tags:

16 Comments

That's so unfair. Everybody should be paid to stay home and read their holy book of choice!

Now then, where was I. Oh yes. In issue #336 of Mighty Thor, we see that the noble son of Odin is once more vexed by the cunning Loki. Seems the god of mischief has stolen all of Thor's best ale (leaving nothing behind but a few ancient bottles of 'Old Dwarf' which is only fit for removing tough stains or consumption by... well... old dwarves).

I didn't know they did this. I'm surprised they've been able to support this so far. Maybe ultra-Orthodox men & women are a small percentage of the total pop. (I may have missed the specifics on that in the link.) I think the government-religion link or absence of link is interesting when you look across the globe. I wonder why religion is stronger in some areas and disappearing in others. (Sorry, I wonder a lot about things.)

It's not as if this sort of thing happens only in Israel. The Greek Orthodox Church enjoys special favor in Greece.

"There's no constitutional provision for separating church and state; the church is exempt from taxation, Orthodox priests' salaries and pensions are paid by the state, and religious education is compulsory in public schools at all grade levels."

The Europeans are way ahead of the US when it comes to the theory that increased taxes for socialist government means less disposable income for the churches..

This is a variation of the Beck mantra.

In the US the only time this really comes to a head is the question of vouchers for religious schools-particularly among tax paying religious with school age children who want their per pupil expenditure money to be credited back as some form of tuition credit. It has been argued that forcing students to attend secular schools (based on economic force) interferes with true separation and that the tax money should be rebated to preserve separation.

There's a fine line between wall of separation, taxpayer support, and secular coercion.

@Susan: Didn't mean to belittle the post. It's just that, as much as we may sometimes carp about favoritism (or lack thereof, if you watch FOX) toward Christianity in this country, we really have no concept of what it's like to live in a country where there really is a state-sponsored religion, whether it's Israel or Greece or someplace else.

The average church tax in the European Countries with church taxes (Austria, Denmark, Finland, Germany, Iceland, Sweden and Switzerland) is close to 2.0% of income when individual taxes, misc taxes (burial taxes, etc), and direct government subsidy to the churches from general funds is included.

The UK, France and Medi Countries have other tax structures to fund churches (and various real estate and preservation perks)

Sharon is correct that Christianity has a special place in Greek governance but I think the American forefathers had it right. Mixing state and religious affairs is a bad thing. Without exception, nations that mix the metaphysics of religion and state affairs have "problems" with minorities (to put it mildly).

It deeply troubles me that some in the US lately seem to be turning their back on reason and trying to turn the US into a "christian" nation rather than focus on western values and ideas that originated from pre-Christian civilization. (democracy, logic, physics, etc..)

However, although I see the religions of the world as myths (much like I don't believe in Zeus), I also believe those that those that are (or are not) religious should be protected under free speech laws. (unlike the communists that used force to try and eradicate those that didn't agree with them).

Religion should be a private affair though not something coerced on others through the use of state propaganda. (anymore than someone religious would like atheists or other faiths to have a special place in their own governance).

It might be politically incorrect thing to say (given most people are religious) but freedom and theocratic rule are simply incompatible concepts. It's called the "dark ages" for good reason. The best gift mankind has at its disposal is reason and observation. The rest are mostly narratives empty of substance.

Well said indeed. Didja see today's news story about the woman who is sentenced to death in Pakistan for allegedly blaspheming? And an Imam says that if the government doesn't do it, he'll be happy and right to do it.

@Cynical: That is horrible. I cannot imagine how anyone could justify, in their own mind, that words spoken (or accusations of words spoken) are worse than the actions of carrying out a death sentence. If God is all powerful, words are nothing. An all powerful God would already know what's in each person's mind and heart. Who are we (human), to carry out a punishment for something "God" already "knows"? And, an all-powerful "God" would not need protection from words by us. No matter what you believe or don't believe, it doesn't make any sense...or at least I cannot see any sense in it any part of it.

Or in CT. Dr Petit ensured the death penalty will be around a few years longer.

Or in China. Recently some dissidents...

Sorry, I'm about to go on my Christopher Hitchens rant that religion isn't the only cause )or excuse) of violence in the world.

Reason is mankind's greatest gift? Then why are we in the Mid East? Why are the Western Economies on the brink of financial collapse? I call it the triumph of human reason and greed (for resources like oil). You may have other explanations.

Thank God we are no longer in the Dark Ages! I am so happy to feel the new enlightenment and get giddy all over. Hartford is a mecca and a testimony to human reason.

I'm repeating what I read. I'm aware that there is violence wherever there are humans (and in the so-called lower species as well, but mostly because of the actual food-chain). As a non-religious human, I'm horrified by the ways that some "religious" humans choose to subvert THEIR "God's Word" into something so clearly evil. And no, religion isn't the only excuse for violence -- we don't have a state-run religion (although some would opt for a religion-run state, clearly) and we surely excuse a lot of violence, based on greed, vengeance, or lack of planning (where ARE all those renewable-energy plans that the supposedly worst-president-ever talked about 35 years ago? Oh right, he was a joke and we NEED all that oil).

I'm wondering how a country with an economy rated 24th among developed nations, with a population of just over 7.5 million, a labor force of just over 3 million, a per capita income of under $30,000, an unemployment rate of 6.2% and almost 25% of its population below a poverty line requiring entitlement assistance manages to fund its welfare state?