JHern wrote:[In the meantime, you can tell the gov't entity that controls your park about:-Chavez Ridge in Los Angeles (formerly the largest hook-up spot in the area, lots of needles, lots of criminal elements, gang activity, etc.)-San Lorenzo Park in Santa Cruz (disc golf pushed out homeless camps and needles no longer litter the ground)-Pier Park in Portland (formerly a gang-fighting location, that park used to be the murder capital of that city, until disc golf transformed it, now the entire neighborhood is being transformed and gentrified)-Mackey Park in Sacramento (formerly called "Tweakerville" the vapors from the meth labs used to be so heavy that people using the park would pass out and need emergency medical attention...today is a safe park with childrens area, disc golf, and bringing the neighborhood together)

All of the above were disc golf courses installed at the request of city police departments to abate criminal activity, and they are all fantastic success stories, and have saved their cities immense amount of money while raising surrounding property values and commerce.

Add to this list Rosedale Park in Kansas City, Kansas. The course was installed in 1984. Before that time, you didn't let your kids play there with your supervision during the daytime. It was a huge park for prostitution. So much so there's a sign that says you can't back into the parking lot (which was a signal you wanted to pay for sex). Now, Rosedale is KC's busiest park with 2 disc golf courses. It's also got 2 softball fields that are packed every nigh of the spring/summer/fall, and a shelter that has 2/3 big parties every week.

Nice Timko...one day somebody should perhaps compile factual stories from all these courses, and try to get written narratives from relevant government officials, police chiefs, etc.. It would have to be a big community effort, relying on locals to get their local stories and testimonials. This could grow into a large book. Whenever a park board grows concerned about disc golf and tries to sully its reputation and shut a course, then all the local players will have to do is whip out the book, go to public meetings, and simply read from it during open comment periods. Would be a great tool...

Leopard wrote:less cocaine and good weed than you'd find in the country clubs

This. Pay to play doesn't get rid of undesirable activities unless the person that owns the course doesn't want them around.

Perhaps not, but it does increase the percentage of people going out to play golf, and decreases the percentage of people going out as "something to do" while getting drunk or otherwise. Its not possible to eliminate these behaviors, but reducing them is something..

My home courses are in a park that had a bad reputation because of drug use and because it was a hook up spot for weird old men. It was pretty bad for years. Nobody in their right mind would take their family to the place because you never knew what you were going to see.

Since the courses have gone in, the park has improved a lot. You don't see junkies or paraphernalia at all, anymore. More and more, you see families there having cookouts, joggers, bicyclists, etc. There is, however, still the problem with the pervs, even though it's been greatly diminished. They park their cars along the road up to the main parking lot and, I guess, just wait for somebody seeking the same to take notice of them. It's lead to some odd encounters while searching for errant discs. Sometimes you just kind of sneak up on them.

I don't really know what steps are being taken by the authorities or by the disc golf club to fix it. When I see them, I try to chat them up, ask them why they're sitting in their car, ask them how they're doing and then I usually make sure to warn them about the pervs. Anything to make them as uncomfortable as possible and let them know that we know what they're doing.

There's one hole where the tee pad is right next to the road. When a car is parked by it, I have one friend who just pulls out his cell phone and starts taking pics of whoever is in the car as overtly as possible. Every time, they drive the hell out of there within seconds. It's good for a laugh even though I think taking pictures like that has the potential to cause a physical confrontation.

Anyways, I guess we're fortunate because the behavior of the disc golfers, while not always great, is way better than the behavior of the park visitors before the courses were built.

Why are gay dudes looking to hook up instantly "pervs" and lumped in with undesirable behavior? If it were nice normal teenagers coming to the park to make out in their cars would you be trying to make them uncomfortable and wishing they would leave? Just curious.

Jesse B 707 wrote:Why are gay dudes looking to hook up instantly "pervs" and lumped in with undesirable behavior? If it were nice normal teenagers coming to the park to make out in their cars would you be trying to make them uncomfortable and wishing they would leave? Just curious.

I actually thought about elaborating in my original post to avoid this kind of comment, but was worried that it might be a little too vulgar. Being new to the board, I didn't want to offend anybody. I thought I had implied what activities were happening enough in my initial post, but I was obviously wrong. I will keep it mind and make sure I cater to the lowest common denominator in my future posts.

But to answer your question, a couple just making out in their car is not what I would consider undesirable. A couple performing fellatio on each other just feet away from a tee pad, in plain sight of disc golfers and other people using the trails is what I would consider undesirable behavior. Proposition strangers with offers to perform on them is also what I would consider undesirable behavior.

The gender or orientation of the people involved doesn't really matter, but in this case, it happens to be old gay men doing it. That's why I labelled these old gay men as perverts. If it were straight couples, it would still be considered undesirable behavior and they'd still be perverts.