I started my post secondary studies at a small relatively unknown private college called RCC Institute of Technology (formerly known as Radio College of Canada or RCC) in Concord Ontario Canada – RCC is now affiliated with Yorkville University (an institute that’s not really a University, read more). RCC’s heavy recruitment campaigns and constant presence at my high school gave them a high profile with the high school students. Their enticing selling point was the ability to fast track your education and start making money – as high school students, we saw this as a great opportunity.

Needless to say it was a hard lesson of “if it’s too good to be true, it probably is”. In my last year of high school I inquired about RCC and like a vacuum salesman, one of their recruiters promptly banged on my front door. He sat in my house discussing all the positive benefits RCC had to offer with my parents and I. My parents were sold, I was sold, I wanted to make money – I was 18 years old, I was naive, it was like taking candy from a child. I didn’t tour the facilities; I didn’t question the financial implications. Instead I signed on the dotted lines (signed a contract), filled out an application for a government loan, and eagerly anticipated finishing school and landing my first highly paid job.

My first week at RCC was a rude awakening. When I attended, the facilities were substandard, the equipment outdated, the computers were yellowed with age, the keyboards missing keys, the CRTs monitors flickering with monochromatic colors, and the carpet peeling away from the walls. The cafeteria was a retrofitted garage complete with an overhead crane for removing engines (or something). I distinctly remember the lobby near the entrance adorned with leather sofas and leather chairs, but we quickly learned that these props were strictly for visiting guests – no students allowed. This wasn’t what I expected; this wasn’t what I signed up for.

Every day on my way to RCC I would ride past the local Community College (Seneca College of Applied Arts & Technology). I was impressed by the size of the school, the architecture, the cutting edge equipment, state of the art computers, a library, a fitness facility, a large cafeteria with a diverse selection of food, a couple thousand students – all of which RCC lacked. I assumed the cost for attending this school would be astronomical, but decided to ask anyway.

My conversation with the registration clerk went something like this:

Me: “I’m interested in attending Seneca College, how much does it cost?”
The clerk replied: “$1200 per semester”

I nearly choked, RCC was EXPENSIVE. I was paying nearly $4000 per semester compared to $1200 at Seneca – a semester at RCC was about 3 months, whereas a semester at Seneca was 4 months.

I asked: “I’m attending RCC will I be able to transfer any of my credits?”
The clerk: “Where is RCC?”

I scratched my head thinking: “How could anyone not know about RCC? I thought it was the pinnacle of technological education? “

I replied: “It’s around the corner, a 5 minute bus ride from here”
The clerk: “Nope… I’ve never heard of RCC, but here’s some information on Seneca’s transfer policies, and a course catalog”

I climbed back on my bike and continued to RCC.

Later that week I began doing some calculations where I realized the following:

A year at RCC would cost me about $16,000 dollars, this didn’t include cost of living, or housing expenses, and certainly did not include any part-time jobs since RCC’s rigorous schedule required that you catch up on your studies over the weekend. In total, a year at RCC would cost me about $23,000 dollars. Conversely a year at Seneca would cost me about $9,000 dollars (including living expenses), I figured that 3 years at Seneca would cost me somewhere around $27,000, but I’d have the ability to work part-time throughout each of those years, which would bring the overall total well below RCC’s single year program. So a single year at RCC (a private College) was roughly equivalent to 3 years at Seneca College (or any publicly funded Community College for that mater). This really got me thinking, and made me wish I had done more research before signing up for RCC – financially Community College was a much better deal.

I continued to compare RCC and Seneca, and to my horror I discovered that the RCC program only awarded a Certificate whereas Seneca awarded an Ontario College Diploma – now professionally and financially Community College was a far better deal. At this point I was convinced that RCC was probably not in my best interest, and decided to make the switch.

Back at RCC I notified the Registrar of my intentions to quit, attended a counseling session (where I was strongly advised not to quit and given the opportunity to switch programs), and was then informed that I would be have to pay 10% ($1,600) of the full years tuition ($16,000) for quitting. RCC had a dropping out fee!!! My jaw dropped, I was furious (and still evidently am, since I’m spending the time to write this entry), I considered staying with RCC to avoid paying this fee – I was only 18, I had no money. I then asked for some confirmation for the dropping out fee. The Clerk then produced the document I had signed upon enrolling, and there it was under the dotted lines – the contract I had signed when the recruiter came to my house. I paid RCC’s drop out fee and enrolled in a publicly funded college.

Words of advice:“if it’s too good to be true, it probably is” Publicly funded post secondary studies are the way to go whether it be College or University. Private education is almost always more expensive, and probably not as valuable for a professional career (although some private polytechnic schools are pretty good too). In my opinion, fast track programs should be avoided, because you can’t really compress education. Most of the learning experience is developing your own ideas, opinions, honing your learning skills, maturing, and gaining life experiences.

Many of my RCC friends that completed the single year certificate at RCC have fought for jobs related to their education since graduation. A couple friends have pursued additional certification, many have settled for jobs completely out of their field of study, and almost all are still paying their RCC student loans.

Before you sign on the dotted line, know what you’re signing for – a lesson learned the hard way.

It was interesting to read your post about RCC Institute of Technology. While many of your reactions to the school are accurate, others are misrepresentational or inaccurate.

Let me start by introducing myself. My name is Greg Toombs. I attended RCC, starting with the technician program in the fall of 2003, then the technologist program in the fall of 2004, and then the Bachelor of Technology program in the spring of 2005. After graduating in December 2005, I picked up a job at Research In Motion as an NPI RF technician. In short, I was debugging and analyzing prototypical cell phones still in developmental phases. I worked there for a year, then did some independent consultation, and am now pursuing a Master’s of Science in Control Systems Engineering at Lakehead University.

Firstly, RCC does not, and has never, advertised that one can finish the equivalent of a 3-year College Diploma in a single year. Three-year college diplomas to which you refer are typically technologist diplomas, and the technologist diploma at RCC does not take one year to finish. It used to take one and a half years when I was there; now it’s increased to two years (if I remember correctly).

Your depiction of the facilities is slightly sensational. There were no rules prohibiting students from hanging out in the lobby. None of the computers that I used while I was there were outdated enough to be inadequate for use. In fact, I was hired to help with computer upgrades in the labs, so I know that the school regularly updated its technology, and I always found that the tech department was diligent in their maintenance effort. It’s somewhat naive to presuppose that a high-quality lab facility is a perfect one. Students tend to remove keys and damage equipment no matter what school they’re at. Also, had you actually attended the program, you would know that electronic fundamentals and their associated test equipment (oscilloscopes, function generators, etc.) rarely need to be upgraded, as fundamental concepts in electronics and electrical engineering never change.

Note that, although in previous years students did not have time for part-time jobs, the new course model has allowed for half-day study that does indeed facilitate part-time work.

Your statement that RCC awards a certificate and not a diploma is wrong. RCC has fully OACETT- and CTAB-certified diplomas, and now also issues a degree as a Bachelor of Technology. I really don’t know where you got this idea.

You’re right about the cost and the lack of student support facilities such as recreation, though. I would strongly reconsider attending now, if only based on the amount that the price has increased since I attended.

That being said, your words of advice that private colleges and universities aren’t very valuable for a professional career don’t really resonate with me. You say that many of your friends struggled to find jobs after graduation from RCC. I say that RCC has a career centre that’s second-to-none, and the staff there go out of their way more so than any other institution that I’ve seen to prepare you for the job search, provide resume critiquing and building, provide professional networking and lead services, and administer effective classes on cold-calling and the general workplace. While I was there, the resident career counsellor actually issued a challenge: If, after 100 cold calls, a student did not get a job, this counsellor would perform the rest of the student’s job search in its entirety. Understand that the reason he was never taken up on this challenge is that RCC goes out of its way to prepare its students for the workplace and for the job search, and RCC has a very good reputation in industry.

I also take issue with your idea that one can’t really condense three years of education in a single year. First of all – You don’t have to. Three years are condensed into one and a half, and now two, years – not one year. Second of all, I find that your own ideas, opinions, skills, maturing, and gaining life experiences are better developed in the workplace than in school. What better way to learn about the real world than to work in the real world? To this end, the more compressed your program, the sooner you can enter the workplace, which is when an entirely different type of learning begins.

Had you attended the program and undertaken an earnest job search, you would have found that there is not much truth in the idea that shorter courses are perceived by industry as exhibiting a lack of dedication or thoroughness. On the contrary, companies in industry realize that attending a highly compressed program requires more personal sacrifice, which demonstrates more dedication.

The recent increases in tuition are unfortunate, and would conceivably prevent me from attending now due to simple economics. But I stand by my education and the education of all of the RCC alumni, and I am proud to have attended a unique school whose preparation for the workplace is effective.

Thanks for the lengthy response; it offers a great balance to my initial post. I attended RCC almost a decade ago, there is a good chance that things have changed over the years. For myself, dropping out of RCC was the best decision I’ve ever made. I don’t recommend RCC, but that’s my opinion.

It’s also great that you got a related job upon graduation; unfortunately many RCC grads don’t get a job related to their field of study. Let me emphasize this further, RCC graduates do get jobs, however these jobs are often unrelated or equivalent to what a high school graduate can get.

In response to your call out:

Your statement that RCC awards a certificate and not a diploma is wrong. RCC has fully OACETT- and CTAB-certified diplomas, and now also issues a degree as a Bachelor of Technology.

What I was trying to say was that: RCC programs awarded Certificates whereas publicly funded Colleges in Ontario (like Seneca) award Ontario College Diplomas (OCDs) – RCC awards a certificate not an Ontario College Diplomas (not a Diploma).

To clarify this further: the definition of a diploma subsumes certificate and deed – a certificate or deed can be categorized as a diploma, but an RCC certificate / diploma / deed is not a recognized Ontario College Diploma – please correct me if I’m wrong. According to the CCTT website, CTAB accredited programs only grant certifications – not diplomas. The term certificate and certification is also used on OACETT website.

Bachelor of Technology degrees are an entirely new can of worms – it’s a new degree offered by most Colleges, it is not equivalent to a University degree, and will take some time for industry to embrace. After searching for bachelor of science on a Monster I get over 200 results, a search for bachelor of technology returns ZERO results. There are exceptions to every case, but job boards provide a pretty good feel for the industry – technology degrees aren’t being taken seriously.

Thanks for all your effort to clearify what RCC is and isn’t,about the diploma first, the fact is RCC diploma and other public colleges diploma is the same thing call it OCD or just diploma all is called certificate opon graduation from a two years technologist program its just different name by choice and no industry to my knowledge has ever questioned RCC diploma certificates to that of OCD according to Adams definition, in facts industries accross Ontario and beyond has prefered RCC diploma students to that of so called public colleges because RCC has its history on the industry already.For any school to issue diploma certifactes in any technology field they must get approval from CCT/CTAB and OACETT otherwise the program is not accredited

About the Bachelor of Technology RCC is now issuing to its graduates, the degree is fully consented by the ministry of training and colleges/universities the same body that is reponsible for granting public colleges/universities the right to issue degree upon successfully completion of a four year study,so both RCC’s diploma and degree is aquiped to give its graduates unlimited opportunity be it working or doing future studies.

Adam I dont agree with your statement that most RCC student dont get job in the field,now point of correction no college or university will guarantee its graduates related job upon graduation be it MIT or Harvard U. but RCC goes extra mile to make sure that every graduates gets jobs in the field using different measures. I might agree with you in terms of cost but you know what that is why its called RCC private college off course it has to because Ontario gervernment is not giving them a cent.

A little about me,I graduated with both Bachelor of Technology and Diploma from RCC last Year August 2008, and in less than two weeks i gots a job as a Technical Specialist and after two months i got another offer As RF/Microwave Test Engineer from a different company which i am still with. so Adam as you can see from me and Greg who is completing his masters that as an RCC graduates you could do any thing once your willing to go for it.

I have to continue to disagree. An Ontario College Diploma has more recognition and is NOT equivalent to an RCC diploma. You’ll need to provide some references to prove otherwise.

You’re right, RCC has some recognition within the Southern Ontario market, but outside Toronto, it is relatively unknown. Ontario College Diplomas are still better recognized.

You said:

industries accross Ontario and beyond has prefered RCC diploma students to that of so called public colleges because RCC has its history on the industry already.

Do you have a reference, or story backing your claim. Where did you hear this? How can you back this statement up?

Many of the RCC grads I knew ended up working alongside high school students who were getting the same salary. One friend described RCC as “the biggest mistake he had made in his adult life”. I suspect there are other RCC graduates with similar sentiments, but who are too embarrassed to speak up. Here’s an excerpt that suggests this is a common occurrence:

career college diploma or certificate holders [like what RCC offers] earned almost the same as high school graduates but they were more likely to be employed. Men with a high school diploma earned $35,200 compared to $35,300 for those with career college diplomas or certificates however the employment rate for those with high school was 92 percent compared to 98 percent for those with career college diplomas. – http://weacanada.ca/files/articles/0903careercolleges.pdf

It’s common knowledge that IT / Software / Electronic graduates will be able to find a job upon graduation, and after you’ve incurred the debt to attend a school like RCC you need to take any job you can get. The job guarantee that RCC offers its graduates seems to be an advertisement ploy. I mean, of course you’ll get a job after graduation!! You have to in order to pay your giant loans, but you also might be working an unrelated job alongside high school students who are getting the same salary.

RCC isn’t suited for everyone, but neither are publicly funded institutes, regardless of the path we follow, more education will advance our careers. I suspect that Greg realized that he needed more than an RCC education and thankfully his courses at RCC paved the way to a publicly funded university.

Like you mentioned, people with drive and ambition will succeed regardless of the educational institute they attended. Thanks again for the comment.

LOL,You must have some serious loathing towards RCC. Any ways i will try and provide as much references as possible to prove you wrong again.

Before i start i will like to remind you that RCC is a recognized and authorized institution in ontario (view the list here).

You said “An Ontario College Diploma has more recognition and is NOT equivalent to an RCC diploma”. Do you have prove for that or your just adding personal sentiments to it, like i said before its just different name by choice otherwise all is known as college diploma i.e(Diploma). According to this CICIC website.

Those your friends that choose to work alongside with high school student and the Guy you said RCC was the biggest mistake in his adult life,well trust me they dont believe in them selves and people like you (Adam) contribute in limiting there capabilities just because they went to RCC. The statistics you provided was not and can never be general perspective of all graduates irrespective of the school the person graduates from ,Example my friend that finished with only diploma makes way more than that and me with Bachelor from RCC makes substantially more.

Adam you should know the fact,irrespective of where someone got there Diploma or Bachelor you will agree with me that this life is a continous learning even though you might be making millions you still need to upgrade and learn new things or advance the one you know already.Thats why peolpe with Diploma go for Bachelor after some time, and people with Bachelor go for Masters after some time, so i suggest Adam that if you havn’t done that already to go back to one of the public schools for your Bachelor if not Masters.

Hopefully i answered some of your questions and will continue to come back for more…

Your last link shows that RCC has been listed as a post secondary school in Canada. Similarly we can find a list that says that Tim Horton’s is a Canadian fast food restaurant – just because RCC is listed doesn’t mean it’s a well recognized school. Nothing has been proven.

I’ll say it again RCC Certificates aren’t equivalent to Ontario College Diplomas or University Degrees, and it appears that a couple Canadian provinces have issues with Yorkville University / RCC Institute of Technology:

Yorkville University is a private, for profit, … university … The university’s staff consists significantly of former staff from Lansbridge University which was ordered closed by the province of British Columbia and relocated to New Brunswick. The president of Yorkville Univeristy is Rick Davey, former manager of the failed Ontario wing of Devry college and the current manager of RCC Institute of Technology a trade school in Toronto … The university in ineligible for student loans in the province of British Columbia as well as others, graduates of their programs are not certified as counseling therapists in many provinces and regions including Nova Scotia and New Brunswick. The province of Ontario does not allow Yorkville University to promote themselves or market in the province using the term “University”, nor does it recognize the schools graduates. The RCC Institute of Technology, is a private technical college located in Toronto, Ontario, Canada which became a division of Yorkville University in 2007. – Wikipedia: Yorkville University

I’m an advocate of continuous learning and post secondary education. I think everyone should go to a University or College, but steer clear of the for profit / private institutes like RCC / Yorkville University. Your time and money is better spent in the public realm. If given the choice, I recommend getting a recognized degree or a diploma from a public institute.

I did my three year technology diploma from Seneca College and transferred to RCC to obtain my Bachelor of Technology. As for the education curriculum, I did not found any difference between both of them. The difficulty level and the quality of education is roughly the same. Both the institution grants accredited OACETT certified diplomas and degrees. However, RCC Institute of Technology is a private institution with limited recognition in the public and industry sector. Just to give an example, couple of places I went for an interview where I was asked “What is RCC?”
I know for a fact that I would obtain an employment with this degree but the question is what kind of employment and how far can I excel in my career. By considering all this factors, I have decided to go to Lakehead University and obtain a public degree which will open limitless options for me.

Hi again, Adam. I’m surprised it’s been nearly three years since I first wrote to you. I’m sad to say that, whereas I would still happily defend RCC as it was when I attended, it has severely slipped.

The best things it had going for it were its highly compressed program and its technician option. Both have since been removed, and the bid to concentrate on the B.Tech. has failed in my opinion. Now that I have some perspective, the problems that would lead to the college’s decline were already present when I was there – money was mismanaged, the building was rented instead of owned, and when management and ownership changed hands policies were inherited from an already-failed institution (Devry).

Considering that it’s a very old institution, it’s sad to see it go like this. If several key decisions in the late 1990s and early 2000s had been made differently I could easily see the college being far more prosperous than it is now.

One of the popular features of a technologist diploma from RCC was its transferability to an undergraduate Bachelor of Engineering at Lakehead University. When the university decided to also offer a transferral from the B.Tech. to my master’s degree I’m glad that I took the opportunity. However, I don’t see either transfer program lasting much longer. Many of my friends that had graduated RCC and transferred to Lakehead made the analogy of leaping from a sinking ship, and unfortunately I can’t disagree with them.

Hey thanks for this info. My kid is talking about going here in September for “video game design” I tried the old private college route many years ago and it did not work then either. Maybe he will read this and believe what I have to say. One can only hope !

Hey guys this has been some good input for me as I am attending to RCC in October for Bach. of tech. degree. I want to know overall is this a good place to go. I hear a lot of stuff from people its good and its bad. you got there for 2 yrs 9 months they help you get a job and even get you to work with ups while your attending school there. It seems pretty good. Then you can get your iron ring (or whatever it is) at lakehead university. Can you guys please let me know my uncle and aunt are bothering saying do research because they have a bad feeling there saying the same thing as ADAM said “if it’s too good to be true, it probably is”. Thank you

2 years and 9 months at RCC is significantly more expensive than a publicly funded equivalent (talk to a publicly funded community college). Also, most publicly funded schools allow you to fast track, work through the summers, and finish your program faster (if that’s what appeals to you). Publicly funded colleges also have transfer / articulation agreements with Universities like Lakehead.

If you want an iron ring then why not directly apply to Lakehead University and reduce your educational debt? Have you compared the cost of becoming an engineer through Lakehead University vs. going to RCC then Lakehead? When calculating the costs you might want to consider that: you can’t work through the summers while attending RCC, that publicly funded schools generously award bursaries / scholarships (I got one almost every semester), and that you could also transfer to Lakehead from a publicly funded college.

Graduates of career colleges (like RCC) make roughly the same amount as a high school graduate. Here’s an excerpt from one of my previous comments:

career college diploma or certificate holders [like what RCC offers] earned almost the same as high school graduates but they were more likely to be employed. Men with a high school diploma earned $35,200 compared to $35,300 for those with career college diplomas or certificates however the employment rate for those with high school was 92 percent compared to 98 percent for those with career college diplomas. – http://weacanada.ca/files/articles/0903careercolleges.pdf

As far as I know RCC does not have an exclusive agreement with UPS. When I went to Seneca, UPS hired students irrespective of what school they attended, they were conveniently located close to York University and Seneca College in Vaughan (above Toronto).

I had a similar experience to Adam. I was also taken in by the school’s recruitment strategies. I attended RCC and graduated.. this was over 10 years ago. I regret ever attending the college. Too many courses and no extra time for anything. Tuition was expensive as hell and its reputation as well as their diplomas aren’t even well recognized.

It’s a private for-profit college and its courses are NOT transferrable to real accredited colleges or universities(assuming you want to upgrade in the future) Without a real undergraduate/bachelor’s degree, you cannot get work visas in other countries(there is a world outside of canada).

Many years later I decided to go attend a real university to upgrade my education. Unfortunately to my dissapointment, my courses and my diploma from RCC were worth nothing and so I didn’t get to transfer over any courses. I had to start all over, however it wasnt all bad. I now had a lot of free time as a uni student even with a full course load and the tuition was also much lower. Upon graduation I felt a great sense of satisfaction as my degree was now recognized all over the world.

I would not recommend attending any private for-profit schools for anyone. This includes cdi college, devry university and the ever popular american univesity of phoenix :P Be smart and stick with public/state schools.

Hi Adam, thank you VERY much for this site. I want to share my story but I am too embarrassed to give my full details. But I can give you complete details, names of all the teachers and complete lay out of the building, the old white lady who ran the cafeteria back then, they had a small basketball court in that warehouse portion of the ‘school’, names of lab instructors, everything to prove that I went to RCC. I still kept all the lab manuals and notes. Minco was a good teacher though, but the rest were there for their paychecks only. They had no concern for the students or their situations. Anyways, here goes..

I am from Toronto, my family moved here in 1996. We came here with not a lot of money. I was enrolled in high school but I couldn’t focus on studies for some reason. Turns out it was because of the stress from living in a crammed, loud, unfit for a family, dirt apartment. But thats all we could afford. But one day in grade 12, a gentleman came to our class to do a presentation. All the other universities did the presentations in the school cafeteria, but this guy came into the math class. I was about to skip that class but for some reason I stayed. And when I heard the guy say, “yep, you can finish your diploma in one year instead of three and be job ready, heck employers line up to hire our graduates”, I thought about my family, how I could help them move into a nice home, so we could buy a nice family car, you know, the usual stuff. So right after graduating from high school I called the guy who came to do the presentation. He said he could come to my house, but I was too embarrassed of where we lived, so I told him I could meet him in my old high school. He suggested it would not be appropriate because I was no longer a student there, and instead asked if there was a Tim Horton’s near by, I said, “yes”, and we set up a date and time. It took 15 minutes and I signed the papers.

So, I went to RCC College back in 2003. I did the electronics technician program and then went to the electronics technologist program. Got two diplomas but never found a job. I started working as a security guard and then found a job in retail in downtown Toronto because I got extremely sick and tired of working night shifts. I am SO embarrassed to tell people that I went to RCC. I consider that a dark, dark chapter of my life. If I was not embarrassed I swear to God I would campaign openly to tell people to not send their kids to this scam house.

When we graduated, they gave us a THICK, HUGE list with names of companies and their phone numbers. We were supposed to call them up and apply for jobs. Turns out some of those phone numbers, well a lot of them, were phone numbers of small, family run businesses or shops. I called these numbers from the list for almost a month and a half, no replies or jobs so I gave up. I was getting really depressed. I had no social life, no money, no prestige of education to show, and was in HUGE debt. I went back to RCC in 2007 and asked them to find me a job or I would go on a hunger strike outside the school property, they told me they never promised any jobs, and that I never tried to look for one. And then they told me I should consider the “degree” option because I had graduated in 2004/05 and employers would say my studies/skills are out of date. I went there to go on a hunger strike, but being young, stupid, and naive I let them talk me into this and I enrolled in the degree program. But I had become depressed and could not focus on studies. I was angry, frustrated, and disappointed.

Long story short, I was increasingly in debt, living in a CRAPPY apartment with my family with mold growing in the washroom. Conditions in which NO human being should have to live. I had to travel everyday for almost one hour or so on TTC to reach RCC, and more than one hour to come back because by that time it was rush hour. I made a huge mistake by going to that RCC. I do not know what I was thinking. I guess I got duped into going there because I wanted to get out of the mediocre living in that broken down apartment and provide my family with a nice place to live. I got duped, into going to this horrible, horrible place they call a “school”. Please don’t waste your time and money at RCC.

Now I had dropped out of RCC. I had no jobs and no real skills that I was proud to show. I could not sleep at night and would wake up late in the day because I could not sleep. I was in a lot of stress. So one day I decided to pick up my life from where I thought it went wrong. I went back to high school to renew my credits because when I graduate we had OAC, or grade 13. But now there was none so I went back. I finished my grade 12 again and enrolled in York University for economics. They didn’t even bother looking at RCC transcript. I was blown away when York University sent me the admission offer with over $4000 in yearly scholarship. I completed my first year and right in the second year I found a part time job as a teller. I have now completed my first two years at York University full time and will start my third soon. Thanks to the connections and networking at York University I found a decent job at a bank, and kept studying part time some of the courses.

So, long story short again, please, please, please go to a public post secondary institution.

I believe strongly that if I didn’t come from an immigrant family, and if I had never seen my family back home fight through all odds against stacked up high, I would have committed suicide or given up on life because of this God forsaken place called RCC.

So Adam, I applaud you my friend, you are doing the humanity a great service. I sincerely thank you. I cannot believe I found this site. RCC has left some psychological scars in my life, and tonight I found myself googling about RCC and I came across your site, so I thought I HAD to tell my story.

All I can say is, STAY AWAY FROM RCC. Never give up. There is always hope. And when it seems like that you have no way out and there is no light, trust me, you just need to smile at the troubles and face them head-on, and you will realize they were not troubles at all.

I’m happy to announce that I went to RCC in the same period as Greg. I work for RIM. I’m a Product Engineer responsible for driving product development from design to realization and product transfer to Outsourcing. There are a surpisingly large community of RCC graduates enlaced in every level of RIM. I am referring to Technicians, Engineers, Managers, Directors and Sr Directors. I think that a person’s success rides on their own shoulders. What difference does it make as to where you study? Schooling is not a program that is downloaded into your mind, it is a place that presents opportunity, time and tools to learn what you wish to learn. Companies do not hire based on where you went to school. They interview you and through a series of answers and examples, you have the ability to illustrate your worth.
The last time I was at the school and was interviewing students on site for positions at RIM, I still saw the same excellent teaching staff. Asad Maham, Anastasios Kessaris, Michelle Pretzer (RIP), Minco, Suhkiani, etc are examples of the highly effective, highly accredited and dedicated professors who provide high quality education in a low student/instructor learning environments.

Doing it over again I would go to a college which had a co-op program.
CO-OP is very important for technical training and getting the foot in the door in companies. In fact that is the way I got my first ‘REAL’ job.

I fell for the RCC scam almost two decades ago, where even the cream of the crop grads couldn’t get a decent job to live in GTA. Valedictorian had a job which most people would not think was successful and worth the effort and money invested.

I remember some of the management and such would complain that we were whiners for wanting to find a job in remote towns and cities, but there wasn’t anything, just retail jobs in Toronto!. I remember their job placement books/reports, their interviews with current student/grads, it was educational in the fact how to make a good bullsh^t sandwich that
naive hs students will eat.

Adam your right on, I tried to warn people about the school, what your doing is a great service to people to carefully consider their future.

My advice: You don’t want a lot of education(University) but want to work in the workforce ASAP? Go to college with a co-op, that is in a town with some facility or tech industry. I wish I did :(

One last thing…. I remember an instructor there, he told a story about him and his wife being invited to a unique opportunity, about a traveling/time sharing company which was basically a scam, whenever anyone joined (agreed to be scammed) their time-sharing scheme, they would throw a party, a congratuate the couple on making such a great choice etc etc.

Two months later we had our ‘technician grad’ party where the RCC staff congratulated their current crop of students with beer, pretzels, pizza etc in that industrial cafeteria space which the cropped RCC info pictures could do no justice. ( I always wondered how they could serve beer without a license)

It was a year after I graduated and attended University after quitting my minimum wage technician job that I realized that maybe the story my instructor was telling was not his own but ours…

Well I have read all the comments and some good and bad… now need your help.
We had a gentleman hear today to talk to us and my son and the want him to come… says he would be a great fit… was real excited for him till I decided to do some research and found this site… now not sure what to think he wants to do the video game design program is there any other colleges that has this length program or what are the suggests on going there?… help please

Simple answer don’t go: That would be the best advice I could give someone.

Despite what they say(the institute), anyone who got a sweet job after graduation usually had good personal connections(family, friends etc.)
-Going to that institute will be a bad investment in time and money.
The piece of paper will be utter useless, unless you use it to continue your education, which you could have done by not going there!

I would suggest a college with CO-OP with programming (Algonquin in Ottawa) or University- Computer Science or Software Engineering.
Again with CO-OP. A lot of these universities have CO-OP (I would go to these) , and even though you might not work in the Computer Game Design Industry, the skills could be applied to ANY industry. Studying in those programs will enable you to contact gaming companies (like UBISOFT) and you can do projects which fulfill your course requirements and get that foot in the door… if its desired.

There’s the other coin of it too. The gaming industry might not be the best environment for someone to work, its usually low-pay, high stress, low benefits and usuaully only for the young 21-30, not a career.
It could be a career but the person would have to design their own gaming system, and market it. (Something you can do without going to institute, with a little research and drive)

If your son doesn’t have the marks for university. I would suggest repeating courses with low marks, (its free) one year of time is nothing compared with the debt and waste of time that institute is. As well as the depressing realization that ‘he would be a great fit’ was just a sales man making sale.

Wow, just wow.
I went to the open house today and they made me feel great, I’ve pretty much had my whole life of people telling me I’ll never amount to anything. when i found out about RCC from a presentation in my math class i thought this was my chance to prove everyone wrong. and I went there and there was bright faces and people who seemed genuinely willing to help me. But i did a lot of research into RCC and into the yorkville U that owns it. and i dodged what appears to be a huge bullet.
Thank you all for this otherwise i would of ended up nothing….
Now I’m off to research more colleges and maybe even university

Every college and university can give you a tour. Go take those tours. They do make a difference. I would personally stay away from “for profit” institutions. While many people have quite nicely succeeded from such institutions (it is really matter of probability like everything else in life) do you really want to be defending an expensive education for the rest of the life to others and especially yourself?

To the parents. Your goal is to make your child understand that repeating courses is not bad if time is the main factor he or she is considering. One year of life is nothing compared to the rest of the life ahead and it is a concept some young adults dont really learn to appreciate at that age. I would hate to say my friends that I am staying behind because of marks and watch them fly into colleges and universities and moving on with life; everyone is in a rush at that age. Also if your child does not have the marks for the university then talk to the admission people there and try to get your kids into pre-requisite programs at the university which will prepare them for their majors. Most universities do have such arrangements. You do not have to choose a major right away and get denied because that major required high grades at a very specific course in HS which your kid does not have.

Also my last comment is that dont be fooled and misguided into a judgement just because an institution had five graduates who landed 5 gratest jobs in the world; 5 being just an example. 5 is a very low sample to compare against the rest of the population of an insitution who probably will not have that chance to land the dream job. The posters here who claimed to be working for RIM did not mention couple of very important things. First of all that RIM is a quite competitive place. If they were hired then they proved to have a skill RIM wanted really bad. And second one is that if they were hired by a company like RIM then chances are that they were probably already bright enough to go to any educational insitution and do great for themselves; let it be for profit or non profit. But these cases dont represent rest of the students equally in all majors and circumstances. So be very careful where you are going to get your education from. The safer bet is always the safer conventional routes.

I really hope that this post helps someone to take a wise decision. I tried to be as less biased as possible. Thanks.

It seems like most of the people here went to rcc to find great job and make lots of money… engineering is not easy and all I have to say is that if you are not passionate about electronics then it’s not your field and I myself as rcc student won’t hire you. if you love electronics it doesn’t matter what school you go into you will excel.

I am a graduate of RCC back in 2007. I graduated with the now extinct CIS computer information systems diploma and Bachelor of technology. In my opinion RCC offers the same educational value as many of the colleges in the Toronto area. I can remember many of my teachers working for University of Toronto, York university, and George brown. The recognition of this education you received may be a little overstated by the registrars for the institute. My program had a 98% hire rate within 6 months of graduating. I was one of the 12 that graduated with a Bachelor of Technology and I can honestly that was less then a quarter of the students that attended first semester. RCC boils down to what you would like to do in your career. RCC certainly gives you the tools and credit need to obtain a job in your field. RCC also gives you the tools to jump start a career in which by definition we know will be a life long learning experience.(RCC reminds you of that too).
Yes it is true the campus is sub par. It is a small school, the “university life” experience which most teenagers are craving does not exist nor does RCC try to enhance it. This is a school for people who want to work, and get a good job, or start a meaningful career. About working during college, even though the program is demanding, most of our class was able to work since RCC does schedule the classes in one set 6 hour block allowing to schedule jobs around this. It is difficult to continue education from your degree as I have found. Most Univeristies will require me to convert my degree to a Bachelor of Science before continuing to a masters and that is if they take my B.Tech for credits at all. That said if you want a masters look at UofT, or UWO or waterloo.
I do agree RCC is expensive. My education totalled roughly 30000. Other colleges might have been cheaper but in my experience and I have been able to work with a variety of different graduates and RCC’s program seems to be the most well rounded program. (Fanshawee, Seneca, Mohawk, Conestoga). RCC also gave me a degree and a diploma. Which contrary to what you have read here are accredited since 2005 by Ontario.
I do not know how RCC has changed since the recent changes of Yorkville U, the purchase of OCAD and the loss of some very important staff. But when I went there I did get the education I was promised and the job I wanted after school in the time they promised. The hands on experience was exemplary. Go to a Showcase in week twelve of any given semester to see what you are capable of when you graduate, rather then a tour. It’s far more impressive.
All said RCC offers decent programs, unrivalled hands on experience, excellent employability, Poor overall university experience, and the jury is still our on continuing your education.

Sorry, a quality of a program is one in which offers CO-OP education. Doesn’t matter if you have all the knowledge in the world if you cannot apply it. To those undecided, go to a college/university that offers CO-OP education. If all you need is piece of paper and have the connections to get a job go ahead and go to RCC. Otherwise go to a school that doesn’t use salesman to lure students and shill on message boards.

I just saw on my Facebook feed that a friend is saying they’ve finally decided to enrolled in postsecondary after a long hiatus after high school. I remember back 5-6 years ago in my days in high school and having an RCC salesman coming and giving a presentation to us in our science class. I can’t thank myself enough for not really taking them seriously at the time -I ended up going to and graduated from UofT for computer science.

For those considering going there, think twice about your opportunity costs of going there. For what it’s worth, consider my my humble opinions: RCC is a really unknown institution; they have really pushy sales tactics that inflate the reputation of the school (don’t feel pressured to make a decision quickly!! and remember the salesman are just aiming for sales quota and not looking out for your best interest); take the praise you see on the internet of the school with a grain of salt i.e. the people up in the previous comments saying how so many RCC people are working at RIM right now, you don’t know if those are just people from the marketing department from their own school (the comments looks very suspicious in my opinion because I highly doubt they’re true)

They come to high school they give a presentation and tell that they will send you info, This is a lie; they will call you and call you and call you and they try to tell you what ever you are interested is wrong and you should get into technology. They talk about their reputation, but no one really knows who they are…

I did some research and noticed that they are priced 4x the competition and they survive by using sales people.

Just remember people, if they are as good as they claim; then why are they using sales people as their admission advisers.

Biggest waste of time and a scam!
This RCC isn’t actually some technology focused school.
if you really want to study engineering, please go to a real institute. Ypu will learn a lot better and more opportunities.
Im speaking from experience!
I wasted my time at this place, and all i was left with was a huge debt of OSAP to pay back the government. This rcc specifically sign you up for osap so you can’t get out.

—
Fast forward to present, im attending Seneca College for electronics, and its much better.

Same deal, guy from high school came, seemed pretty interesting, then came over to the house, then wanted $200 to apply to the school. I thought it was free to apply.

At that time, around 2005/2006, it costs $45 to apply to University. I applied to about 4 University’s at the time for Engineering. RCC guy wanted $200 to apply. I was like wow that’s a lot. My parents were like, we will think about it, and I was not to sure at the time. Seemed like a big sales pitch at the time. He basically said I had until tomorrow to apply, or a very short time (pushy sales tactics). A few weeks later the guy came back to my high school and sent me an email stating he will be back and I could still apply.

Overall, seemed like a big sales pitch to me, hyping up salaries such as “new grads getting paid over $40,000 after they graduate, and in the back my head I was like that’s not a lot. After reading these comments I am glad I did not go. For Engineering stick to your schools in Ontario that are public : Waterloo, McMaster, Ryerson, UofT, even UOIT(this should be your last option, unless you are doing grad studies) is better than this. The board of Engineering in Ontario or Canada basically makes sure that all Universities are more or less teaching students the same thing. RCC is NOT a part of this. This basically means the same thing you are taught in Waterloo is taught in UOIT.

When they talk about RIM, well RIM is basically not doing to well right now and I have a lot of friends who left RIM due to the company not doing so well. I personally know one guy who went to RCC and he works in IT.

I was nostalgically browsing the internet for RCC Alumni/Status and came upon this post. Talk about Flashbacks! I too had the visit to my high school, the high pressure recruiting at the kitchen table with my parents, the signing of the registration and the borrowing of money. It was $2000 for the year, 1973-74, and yes was considerably more than Community Colleges of the day. It seems little changed over the years. Wow! Our school was on King St, off Spadina and was also a very run down building, with some sort of a garment factory above us where we heard the regular rolling of some unit across the floor and the odd piece of the ceiling dropping on a student’s head. No cafeteria. No sports (other than table tennis, which the Jamaicans kicked ass at), no computers, no girls (we relied on New College at U of T for that.)
The program was intense and jammed at you. Not a lot of sympathy from staff, and too bad if you couldn’t survive, they had your money. For the era (digital electronics was evolving) the education was contemporary and what I needed. There were a lot of companies seeking graduates – Hydro, Bell, IBM, Phillips, Honeywell and others. I had 5 job offerings before graduating and went with Sperry Univac Computer Systems, figuring that was the way off the future – “Customer Engineers” they called us, which I thought was cool with my EET “Technician” status. So I was transferred to Victoria, servicing the new technology where we were moving from Key-punches with cards to a key-to-disc storage system. Then 1900 CADE was the unit. Anyway, won’t bore you with all that because that is exactly what I became with the whole technology thing – bored. So I quit, became a cop and never looked back, never relied on that diploma again. Made a lot more money too.
So all in all, I am surprised that in 40 yrs their recruiting strategy and approach to education hasn’t changed, although, maybe it is what works for them!

Can I chime in? I worked for a community college – government funded college for
20 years. The college just as Seneca, Humber, George Brown, Centennial were all accredited. Admissions would not consider transcripts from RCC or any other private for profit school for admission, transfer credit or even prior learning assessment. They (private for profit and vocational schools ) may be accredited, but there are different tiers of accreditation based on the MTCU mandates. Whether institutions such as U of T, or Ryerson would accept them, is a risk. I know at the college I worked for, transcripts were not accepted from private for profit schools. I don’t agree with it, I think every school and institution of learning, the curriculum, tuition costs, residence costs should be comparable, cross over on the same page.
We have to make it easier for students.

and every school wants new students, they all have quotas to meet. Among the colleges, there is a healthy competition. In admissions, the students came to us. We (or I) would provide the best customer service I could to the students. Tell them what they needed re admission requirements, testing, upgrading if necessary to get into their program choice. We never worked on commission as many admissions advisors / recruiters do in private for profit schools. As prospective college students they should question,are the recruiters looking after your best interest or to make a commission?

I think prospective college students should really consider their options carefully. I’m happy to read of student’s success stories regardless of where they were educated. It’s also what you do with what you’ve achieved. Good luck to all of you but be careful what you sign, find out withdrawing without penalty deadlines, and if your transcripts : certification would hold as much weight as a recognized college diploma. Some employers don’t mind, some do.
That’s just my two cents. Having worked for a community college I’ve been approached to work for 2 different private for profit ‘schools’ and I’ve turned them down. (also please note many private technical institutions and private vocational training institutions cannot even legally call themselves a school).Just be careful and go your research.

Thank you for having this information still readily available. Being informed about this institute really has given me a lot to think about in terms of private vs public universities and has swayed me from choosing RCC. Judging by the overwhelming response, i feel like like i dodged a blackhole. Thank you for speaking out.

Great blog, thanks for sharing. After reading about your experience, I’d highly appreciate your opinion. I saw the small piece in the comments about Yorkville University. What are your thoughts on it? I am highly considering enrolling because I work full time and have to pay off my new car so realistically it seems like the best option. They are offering the Bachelors of Business Administration degree to complete with 2.5 years if you’ve already completed a 2 or 3 year diploma, which I have at Centennial College (Hospitality & Tourism Administration program). I am also considering York University on Keele St for the same degree program but again, this would seem impossible in my situation. I am worried about the lack of physical campus to attend to, if I were to do the online route. Also, I’m worried that Yorkville University isn’t recognized enough and that it wouldn’t be appreciated on my resume as a degree. But the thought of the program being extremely flexible, more affordable (2.5 years only), not having to commute and the efficiently of doing it right online, seems like the perfect option. I am eagerly seeking to get a degree in business and need some advice about which route to take. Yorkville University is accredited, though private but the website and the admissions staff are impressive. Please help me!

Don’t do it. I had the same thought process and you should not enroll at Yorkville. Having just completed 3 terms there for the exact reasons as you, I’d say that you should take an online college diploma instead of anything at Yorkville.

The course costs are $1000+ each with a bunch of other unnecessary fees that they sucker the students into. If you take 3 courses per term you’ll finish in 2.5 years but think about it $3000 every 12 weeks plus the cost of books. And if you should happen to want to take a term off, they charge $300 per term. If you choose to withdraw for a term, they’ll charge you $200. There are online programs that are of more value in Ontario for less tuition. The courses don’t justify the insane costs and the professors are from all around the world; they’re all part time and not committed to the school. It’s really not a good school Erin.

I attended RCC over a decade ago and myself along with my graduating class all regret goin there. It was a waste of time. I made the smart decision to continue my education elsewhere at a real post secondary school. I went to a real campus and had a great experience. I won’t fault my professors but I will fault the way th school is run and giving ridiculous promises of 98% placement.

@ReallyCrappyCollege
I remember that same professor telling me that story. He was one of a kind. I stayed because he gave me confidence and made me believe in myself. As for the school, I would look elsewhere unless I am really desperate. They are all in it for the money. The president doesn’t give a crap about anyone. Didn’t want to know who we were or cared about what we did. As long as we paid our tuition. Go elsewhere.

I was in conversation with a counseller during last two days and was impressed for getting two of my children enrolled. I gathered more info from web sites and noticed that RCC / Yorkville is not even listed in the universities in Canada. I asked this question to the counseller and then,,,,,, no answer from them. Adam, you have opened many eyes and saved poor peoples money which is so very hard earned.

I attended RCC, graduating in 2005 from the Net Eng Technologist program (last year that program was offered, “3 year program” in 18 months).

Compared to other schools, you pay more to get less. Facilities were sparse but the available technology wasn’t out of date. Teaching was hit or miss. Some teachers were great, others really had very little domain knowledge, and some had issues communicating properly in english.

Overall it was expensive, but if you learned to teach yourself and to apply yourself, then you probably managed OK after graduating. A lot of my class went to RIM, and most people I graduated with found jobs within a few months.

As far as pay and jobs go, my experience is that is less related to your education than your personality. I’ve had no issues getting jobs or promotions since graduating, and haven’t been turned down or looked down on for having an accredited RCC diploma.

That being said, Most of what made it good (accelerated/dive in tech program) has been dropped or changed since I graduated, and the Devry/York university mergers seems to have done more to hurt the school than anything else. I would suggest a provincial community college or university over RCC/Yorkville now.

I wish my daughter and I had read this before she enrolled this past September. She is struggling with them right now about dropping out and the fees. They have been underhanded, crappy to deal with and unresponsive when asked questions. Unfortunately she is a distance learner so she isn’t even in that province and cannot just march into the facility to speak face to face with anyone.

I read this with a smile and will also offer my experience(2016-TODAY).

I kept getting this email about a Toronto film school and always thought about acting, I mean, who hasn’t right? Just recently i decided to take a deeper dive and open this thing up instead of deleting it. what do i see?! video game design…..

WHAAAAAAAATTTT?!

“this is PERFECT!” i say to myself, “time to make a change and go where i wanna be!”

I fill out the form, BOOM! send it out.

a few days later i get a call, to my surprise, and i was excited to speak with a gentleman(we’ll call him Wally). Wally was oozing with finesse and confidence not only in the school, but in me and what I could potentially do with myself after taking their course. we decided to meet at the school and we hit it off right from the jump. it was late, so i didn’t get a chance to view the grounds and we made another appointment to do so because “he had a good feeling about me.”

today was that day. i go over to meet Wally and he is busy. students already in the office. ones coming in for testing, ones walking up and through the corridor, which is fine.

Now, i was a bit early(about 15 mins), so after 15 or so he invites me into his office and tells me he will be there shortly. I sit down, his computer screen is tilted towards me with a scholarship form sitting on the screen.

i’m thinking to myself now “what the hell is going on here?”

At this point i want to see if he’s going to show me the place like he said or try and sign me up first and his intentions were quickly evident. we talk immediately about when programs are starting and that he could sign me up for as early as July. There was no more room for the April classes and in worst case i could start in October.

When i said i wasn’t sure i was prompted with a rebuttal, so again i gave an “unsure” response. He then told me a story about him meeting his wife a week before asking for her hand in marriage and that only a select few had this attribute in them.

In essence, he knew i wasn’t going to sign at this point and felt a jab at pride might have an effect. His last sales tactic………..unsuccessful

A little bit of time and gas wasted, but a VALUABLE lesson learned. I’ve seen these way too many times to know that if they aren’t willing to show you the product right off the bat(in this case the facilities) it’s not good enough for your attention. A lot of things are seen as “too good to be true” and flourish, this just doesn’t seem to be one of them.

in my opinion and experience it was all about the approach. i could have been on here years later giving one of these incredible stories of regret. i applaud you all!!! you gave me the extra boost i needed to post this and make the awareness grow!!

i would say, whether co-op, public without co-op or a REPUTABLE private school. just do your research. sit down and take hours out of your day, take days out of your week, weeks out of your months!!

Because in the end you have years at risk!! take that extra money and TRAVEL!!!!