5 String and Ampeg Classic 810

I have heard that the classic 810 does not handle the low B string (and in my case A string) very well. Is this true? I have only got about an hour in on an SVT 4 and Classic 810 and was playing my drop A tunning and i didnt seem to have any troubles, but then again i was at GC so wasnt playing too terribly loud. Let me know what the deal is with that.
Thanks alot,
Dave

It's been said a million times, that cab is designed to go LOUD not LOW. Its specialty is midrange not huge bottom end despite the Ampeg name. But it'll do the low B it just won't be as loud, hit has hard or have as much punch as the other strings.

at low volumes, by yourself, with no other competition, you could tune down to a C, and you'd be happy. but take that to the gig, and you'll be about as present as the invisible man. low frequencies need LOTS of power and speakers that can properly handle 'em.

you want low, yet affordable? go with an Acme B-4, and prepare to ruin EVERY other cab that you'll ever come across. no other cab will slam the low B quite like a good ol' Acme.

I base the requirements of my cabinet on what I need on stage to hear myself and to sound pleasing to my ears. If you don't go through a decent PA with good subs you'll always be chasing the ideal bass cabinet, particularly when you play larger gigs. For my tastes, an 8x10 cab (or a 2x10 cab) will perform just fine for the stage, even with a 5-er. The dual Yorkville LS800P subs under the mains in my PA are what get my bass sound out to the dance floor.

When you consider that with an electric bass, there's waaaay more energy at the 2nd harmonic than at the fundamental, it's actually more adequate than it looks on paper. That's 60-ish Hz for the B and 80-ish for E.... Then again, I don't feel that a whole slew of fundamental makes for good bass tone anyway...

at low volumes, by yourself, with no other competition, you could tune down to a C, and you'd be happy. but take that to the gig, and you'll be about as present as the invisible man. low frequencies need LOTS of power and speakers that can properly handle 'em.

you want low, yet affordable? go with an Acme B-4, and prepare to ruin EVERY other cab that you'll ever come across. no other cab will slam the low B quite like a good ol' Acme.

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I was utterly unimpressed by the B-4. Sure, it had very authoritative low end but it seriously lacked musical tone. IMO of course . Give me an Ampeg 810 any day. Or even better, a Bergantino 610. All, my biased opinions of course....

I was utterly unimpressed by the B-4. Sure, it had very authoritative low end but it seriously lacked musical tone. IMO of course . Give me an Ampeg 810 any day. Or even better, a Bergantino 610. All, my biased opinions of course....[/QUOTE]

If the B4 was lacking in musical tone, it was doing it's job - it's not supposed to have any tone. I don't mean this in any offensive way, but what you put in is what you get out of it. This might mean some more tweaks at the EQ level, but ultimately I find that I have waaaaaaay more flexibility because it lets each instrument speak. Not always in a good way either...but that's because of my crappy playing.

Once you get spoiled by a B4 (or even better, a vertical stack of B2s), the Lack of Booty from the Ampeg 810 becomes mighty apparent.

at low volumes, by yourself, with no other competition, you could tune down to a C, and you'd be happy. but take that to the gig, and you'll be about as present as the invisible man. low frequencies need LOTS of power and speakers that can properly handle 'em.

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Usually, "presence" isn't about extreme lows, as I interpret it anyhow. A straight SVT and 810 can be very "present" and easily heard. But, the 810 is "pre-slotted" in the mix to be approximately between the kick drum and the guitar.

If you want high power fundamentals from a 5 string, the 810 is NOT made to do that...and you are not gonna do that with 300W, tube or SS, notwithstanding.

Different speakers are made to do different things. Trying to get one to do a different job may not be very productive.

Trying to boost extreme lows without enough power or speaker response will suck so much power out of the upper bass range that you may indeed be "invisible". In that case, removing the low boost and putting the power into hearable frequencies will make big difference.

Your ear does not hear low frequencies well until they are very loud. So you may need 4 to 8 times more power to get very low frequencies out at a similar perceived volume as higher ranges.

If the B4 was lacking in musical tone, it was doing it's job - it's not supposed to have any tone. I don't mean this in any offensive way, but what you put in is what you get out of it. This might mean some more tweaks at the EQ level, but ultimately I find that I have waaaaaaay more flexibility because it lets each instrument speak. Not always in a good way either...but that's because of my crappy playing.

Once you get spoiled by a B4 (or even better, a vertical stack of B2s), the Lack of Booty from the Ampeg 810 becomes mighty apparent.

Lonnybass

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Sometimes, trying to get the flattest possible response isn't the best way to get something to sound good. The B4 just didn't sound good, my biased opinion of course. A cabinet can be both accurate (to a point*) and sound musical. Meyer Sound's PA cabs, for example. To my ears the Acme boxes didn't do this. But I don't think all that fundamental is necessary or even advisable in most cases either....

*You're only going to get so accurate with a multispeaker box (or any real speaker) no matter what you do. The laws of physics dictate this and Acme's cabs don't circumvent those.

Another biased opinion, but have you tried the aguilar gs412? in my opinion, the 4 12's will handle the lowest of the low's much better than 8 10's, while still giving you plenty of tone when your not shaking the stage. Of course, having 1000+ plus watts cant hurt either.

When you consider that with an electric bass, there's waaaay more energy at the 2nd harmonic than at the fundamental, it's actually more adequate than it looks on paper. That's 60-ish Hz for the B and 80-ish for E.... Then again, I don't feel that a whole slew of fundamental makes for good bass tone anyway...

(...)

I was utterly unimpressed by the B-4. Sure, it had very authoritative low end but it seriously lacked musical tone. IMO of course . Give me an Ampeg 810 any day. Or even better, a Bergantino 610. All, my biased opinions of course....

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good to know mark,

but all the more you have yet to "unlock" what a B-4 can do.

FYI & IMHO, that's what i love about the blank canvas of the Acme. i.e. with a flexible EQ like what's on my iAMP-800 or Aguilar DB680, i can find whatever sound i want.

AND, the fact that the tone is more neutral, i have a great starting point from which to combat a boomy or dry room.

also, given the huge price discrepancies btwn a Meyer and Acme, i think for what the Acme can accomplish in both its waaaaay smaller size and weight, its a nice compromise.

like Lonny said, the Acme low B slam will ruin all other cabs for you.

Drop C is only have a step away (1-fret) from B. So.... I wouldnt expect it to be very impressive.

For stuff like this, you either need EFFICIENT 10's or you just need to get some bigger speakers. Be a little open-minded, and vary up your stack a little bit. Balance out with a 1x15 and a 2x10 or 4x10. Or if you find a way to Biamp (which the 4pro does, if you were interested in it), it'd be even sweeter.

The best sounding bass performances I've heard (usually as part of a band situation) have usually been when the bassist does NOT push the fundamental lows out to the crowd or even the PA. That stuff gets lost so easily during a live show even from the best, most capable equipment. Your mileage will vary depending on venue, and music style, but nobody will notice if the fundamentals of your lowest notes are missing/attenuated. There are people here using 50hz high-pass filters on their power amps who play with extended-range instruments and say that it *increased* clarity significantly and didn't compromise any of the power available from such low notes.