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O-line draft hypothetical...

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m2karateman

RIP Killer

Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10408Location: Where ever I'm at now

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

kdsberman wrote:

The Legend wrote:

i disagree with Zach Brown one liner you had - he looks very fast but he s not a good football player - slow to read plays and always takes the path of least resistance. he looks too light to make an impact as a passrusher and doesnt seem to use his hands all that well. great athlete but more of a project than what should be expected with a 1st rd pick. even during the actual game he got beat on a deep pass by a fullback and was a half second slower than the other LBs in his reaction time

Im with you on this Legend. The times I've seen him play, he doesnt stand out as an impact player. Would he really be an upgrade over Levy or any other starting LB we have?

As I said, it was just a cross section of information from a bunch of different sites. I didn't watch the game, and most scouts don't watch it either, since the game setting is too difficult for players to actually showcase their true skills. These players have to learn entirely new terminology, work with all new coaches and players, and at times are forced to play positions they rarely if ever have. It's why most scouts and coaches leave after Wednesday practice. I read about five or six different reports and just about every one said the guy was fast and was in on plays. There was some mention of him not handling traffic well, and having some difficulty shedding bigger blockers. But for those athletes at the practices who were destined to be 43 OLBs, he was said to be the best of the bunch.

_________________I will not put on blinders when it comes to our QBs performances.

January 29th, 2012, 10:21 pm

liontrax

#1 Overall Pick

Joined: March 21st, 2005, 2:11 pmPosts: 1543Location: Wolverine, Mi.

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

m2karateman wrote:

kdsberman wrote:

The Legend wrote:

i disagree with Zach Brown one liner you had - he looks very fast but he s not a good football player - slow to read plays and always takes the path of least resistance. he looks too light to make an impact as a passrusher and doesnt seem to use his hands all that well. great athlete but more of a project than what should be expected with a 1st rd pick. even during the actual game he got beat on a deep pass by a fullback and was a half second slower than the other LBs in his reaction time

Im with you on this Legend. The times I've seen him play, he doesnt stand out as an impact player. Would he really be an upgrade over Levy or any other starting LB we have?

As I said, it was just a cross section of information from a bunch of different sites. I didn't watch the game, and most scouts don't watch it either, since the game setting is too difficult for players to actually showcase their true skills. These players have to learn entirely new terminology, work with all new coaches and players, and at times are forced to play positions they rarely if ever have. It's why most scouts and coaches leave after Wednesday practice. I read about five or six different reports and just about every one said the guy was fast and was in on plays. There was some mention of him not handling traffic well, and having some difficulty shedding bigger blockers. But for those athletes at the practices who were destined to be 43 OLBs, he was said to be the best of the bunch.

While I agree with m2k's assessment that the Senior Bowl is not truly indicative of a players abilities, I also agree with kds and Legends take on Brown. I watched every practice the NFL network displayed, listened to opinions by Mayock and his crew, then watched the game. To me Brown is fast and that's why he is around a lot of plays. He uses his speed to make up for his lack of instincts. That's not saying he can't develop into a good pro LBer. I just didn't see anything special about him, and hope he's not our 1st pick. If he turns out to be our pick, I'll hope I'm wrong about him.

If this years draft turns into a run on the top offensive lineman, beginning early in the 1st round. I could see where all the top Tackles and Guards will be gone by 23.

Mike Adams and Cordy Glenn impressed in mobile. Adams has the size, frame, and footwork to develop into a starting NFL LT. I don't see where he's any less then the kid the Cowboy's drafted last year in the 1st. As for Glenn, they had him playing LT alot, but it's too soon to say whether he could play there in the Pro's. At worst he could be a RT or G, and possibly a very good one.Even if these guys are all gone by 23, there is still a very healthy selection in the next tier of O-lineman. Many of whom might still be available in the 2nd round. At this point my feeling is the Lions will be deciding between CB, DE or Safety, if he falls this far, as their 1st pick.

January 30th, 2012, 2:20 am

m2karateman

RIP Killer

Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10408Location: Where ever I'm at now

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

liontrax wrote:

m2karateman wrote:

kdsberman wrote:

The Legend wrote:

i disagree with Zach Brown one liner you had - he looks very fast but he s not a good football player - slow to read plays and always takes the path of least resistance. he looks too light to make an impact as a passrusher and doesnt seem to use his hands all that well. great athlete but more of a project than what should be expected with a 1st rd pick. even during the actual game he got beat on a deep pass by a fullback and was a half second slower than the other LBs in his reaction time

Im with you on this Legend. The times I've seen him play, he doesnt stand out as an impact player. Would he really be an upgrade over Levy or any other starting LB we have?

As I said, it was just a cross section of information from a bunch of different sites. I didn't watch the game, and most scouts don't watch it either, since the game setting is too difficult for players to actually showcase their true skills. These players have to learn entirely new terminology, work with all new coaches and players, and at times are forced to play positions they rarely if ever have. It's why most scouts and coaches leave after Wednesday practice. I read about five or six different reports and just about every one said the guy was fast and was in on plays. There was some mention of him not handling traffic well, and having some difficulty shedding bigger blockers. But for those athletes at the practices who were destined to be 43 OLBs, he was said to be the best of the bunch.

While I agree with m2k's assessment that the Senior Bowl is not truly indicative of a players abilities, I also agree with kds and Legends take on Brown. I watched every practice the NFL network displayed, listened to opinions by Mayock and his crew, then watched the game. To me Brown is fast and that's why he is around a lot of plays. He uses his speed to make up for his lack of instincts. That's not saying he can't develop into a good pro LBer. I just didn't see anything special about him, and hope he's not our 1st pick. If he turns out to be our pick, I'll hope I'm wrong about him.

If this years draft turns into a run on the top offensive lineman, beginning early in the 1st round. I could see where all the top Tackles and Guards will be gone by 23.

Mike Adams and Cordy Glenn impressed in mobile. Adams has the size, frame, and footwork to develop into a starting NFL LT. I don't see where he's any less then the kid the Cowboy's drafted last year in the 1st. As for Glenn, they had him playing LT alot, but it's too soon to say whether he could play there in the Pro's. At worst he could be a RT or G, and possibly a very good one.Even if these guys are all gone by 23, there is still a very healthy selection in the next tier of O-lineman. Many of whom might still be available in the 2nd round. At this point my feeling is the Lions will be deciding between CB, DE or Safety, if he falls this far, as their 1st pick.

The only safety with a first round grade is Mark Barron, and I suspect he'll be long gone by the time the Lions pick. Depending on how the draft plays out, there may be some o-lineman available. Nobody expected Gabe Carimi to drop as far as he did last year. But there were more tackles with first round grades out there last year...so that's something to consider.It will depend on how many teams ahead of the Lions reach for a QB. Will Seattle reach for Tannehill at #11/12, or trade back to get better value? Same thing with KC? Do they take a QB early and create some serious camp competition for Cassell? Will Washington sign a FA quarterback, or will Griffin drop to them? If not, do they trade back into round one before the Lions pick to get a QB who might rise due to workouts and Combines?

When it comes down to it, there are five tackles, two guards and one center that warrant a first round grade.

OTMatt KalilJonathan MartinRiley ReiffMike AdamsCordy Glenn

OGDavid DeCastroKelechi Osemele

OCPeter Konz

Kevin Zeitler and Brandon Washington could push into first round contention with impressive workouts. Zeitler may not even need that, unless teams are looking for guards better in pass protection. If that were the case, even Osemele would likely fall out of round one, and he has obvious shortcomings there as well.

No other center deserves even a second round pick, let alone the first round pick. Ben Jones is probably the second rated center after the Senior Bowl. I have to imagine that Brewster's stock took a hit. It's one thing to have a bad practice, but it's quite another to get your butt handed to you all week against even the second tier competition. It's my understanding Brewster barely blocked anybody with much authority.

_________________I will not put on blinders when it comes to our QBs performances.

January 30th, 2012, 8:39 pm

allenslions

Varsity Captain

Joined: February 10th, 2011, 4:08 amPosts: 306

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

The fact is the lions wont be taking an olineman until after the 3rd.they plan on goin hard in freeagency after jared gaither .they put claims on him twice last year.and the rightside will be a compation between goz and culbreath with the loser goin insid

January 31st, 2012, 8:13 am

buell17

Afghan Allstar

Joined: January 9th, 2006, 1:16 pmPosts: 564Location: San Diego, CA

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

Wouldn't mind adding Gathier. He played very well in San Diego last season. Would still like to add some youth up front though.

January 31st, 2012, 9:24 am

kdsberman

League MVP

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pmPosts: 3527Location: Saginaw, MI

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

allenslions wrote:

The fact is the lions wont be taking an olineman until after the 3rd.they plan on goin hard in freeagency after jared gaither .they put claims on him twice last year.and the rightside will be a compation between goz and culbreath with the loser goin insid

I like the Gaither part and the competition for guard part too, but do they believe that a tackle turned guard will be an upgrade over Peterman?

January 31st, 2012, 11:31 am

allenslions

Varsity Captain

Joined: February 10th, 2011, 4:08 amPosts: 306

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

I among others felt goz was always a better guard prospect then tackle.and also look what the move did for similar players lile davis and gallery.it turn them from busts to probowlers.and didnt i tell u how the team felt about best

January 31st, 2012, 1:45 pm

kdsberman

League MVP

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pmPosts: 3527Location: Saginaw, MI

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

allenslions wrote:

I among others felt goz was always a better guard prospect then tackle.and also look what the move did for similar players lile davis and gallery.it turn them from busts to probowlers.and didnt i tell u how the team felt about best

Yes you did, and I hope u don't think I disagree with u, I was just curious. Seems like a good idea to me.

January 31st, 2012, 3:08 pm

allenslions

Varsity Captain

Joined: February 10th, 2011, 4:08 amPosts: 306

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

No i didnt think you disagreed with me.i just found it funny how scott was so secretive about it to me.then a week later it leaks to the press.also did u get a chance to check out miller.he is like a bowling ball with 4.35 speed

January 31st, 2012, 3:39 pm

inheritedlionsfan

League MVP

Joined: January 13th, 2006, 4:18 amPosts: 3666Location: Maryland

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

kdsberman wrote:

allenslions wrote:

The fact is the lions wont be taking an olineman until after the 3rd.they plan on goin hard in freeagency after jared gaither .they put claims on him twice last year.and the rightside will be a compation between goz and culbreath with the loser goin insid

I like the Gaither part and the competition for guard part too, but do they believe that a tackle turned guard will be an upgrade over Peterman?

I saw Gaither a lot from his time at UMD as well as Baltimore. When healthy, he is a force to be reckoned with. But the problem is he has back issues. He played well in SD the second half of the year. I'd like to add him but not with him penciled in as the LT starter. He is a risky proposition.

January 31st, 2012, 8:30 pm

allenslions

Varsity Captain

Joined: February 10th, 2011, 4:08 amPosts: 306

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

The back injury waz a muscle issue not a disk and hasent been a problem in over a year.his only issue is he wont play rt and this has caused problems with both the ravens an kc staffs.an when mcneil comes back he will sign else where

January 31st, 2012, 9:30 pm

kdsberman

League MVP

Joined: February 20th, 2007, 10:51 pmPosts: 3527Location: Saginaw, MI

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

Is it gonna take a monster offer to get Gaither in here? Im all for him playing LT for us, I just hope they dont break the bank considering how we have other important FA's to sign.

January 31st, 2012, 9:54 pm

m2karateman

RIP Killer

Joined: October 20th, 2004, 4:16 pmPosts: 10408Location: Where ever I'm at now

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

kdsberman wrote:

Is it gonna take a monster offer to get Gaither in here? Im all for him playing LT for us, I just hope they dont break the bank considering how we have other important FA's to sign.

That's my concern, is that Gaither will want more than he should really get. Plus, the idea that he won't play the right side under any circumstance is a red flag to me. If he's told to man the right side, then he does it and shuts the #$@% up about it and does his job. He's gotta earn the left side spot, and to do that he has to beat out Backus (or whoever, but I think they'll attempt to re-up Backus).

I have no patience of a guy who has the opportunity to play a professional sport, and that STILL isn't enough for him.

And please tell me, what is the deal with Best?

_________________I will not put on blinders when it comes to our QBs performances.

February 1st, 2012, 12:14 am

thelomasbrowns

Player of the Year - Offense

Joined: August 24th, 2010, 9:54 pmPosts: 2861

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

m2karateman wrote:

kdsberman wrote:

Is it gonna take a monster offer to get Gaither in here? Im all for him playing LT for us, I just hope they dont break the bank considering how we have other important FA's to sign.

That's my concern, is that Gaither will want more than he should really get. Plus, the idea that he won't play the right side under any circumstance is a red flag to me. If he's told to man the right side, then he does it and shuts the #$@% up about it and does his job. He's gotta earn the left side spot, and to do that he has to beat out Backus (or whoever, but I think they'll attempt to re-up Backus).

I have no patience of a guy who has the opportunity to play a professional sport, and that STILL isn't enough for him.

And please tell me, what is the deal with Best?

Is Gaither under contract with SD for next season?

_________________"Good teams don't worry about a whole lot of stuff. They travel, they play, they win. And it doesn't matter where they go, what the time block is, all those kinds of things. They never seem to bother teams that play well, and we want to be one of those teams." -Jim Caldwell

February 1st, 2012, 10:27 am

wjb21ndtown

Re: O-line draft hypothetical...

Forget the 2nd round. If we end up with a first round caliber OL man (not a dam Gosider Cherilus should have been a 2nd or 3rd rounder, an honest to goodness first round talent on the OL) I'll be happy. If this rookie can come in and out play Peterman at run blocking and pass block at least as good, I'll be a happy camper. It would be icing on the cake if he could slide in for Raiola next year, but I wouldn't be super mad if that wasn't a possibility.

IMO a first round OLman is a must. From there I really don't care what we do. I can't see counting on getting a OG/C that can step in and play THIS YEAR near the end of the 2nd round. For our second round pick I hope it is an impact player at LB, S, OG, or a VERY GOOD PROJECT WITH A TON OF UPSIDE at OT that can get some playing time this year.