although I do not agree with blovski's conclusion that the frustration and grind time justifies the limit.

I was saying that the unique kingdom states thing maybe justifies the grind time/frustration. Especially since the idea of everyone having the same stuff and it just being a click to get it is equally uninspiring from my POV. Appreciate people might have a different spin on that. Summarily: the locker fishing expeditions at the moment are the only thing in the game I'll ever scum for rather than rolling with the punches. I get why it's like that now though it's still frustrating.

So what a lot of you are saying is that playing a normal dungeon isn't fun anymore.

Now, I'm definitely not saying that... doing three or four runs just to find an item you need to try out a certain strategy or synergy isn't especially fun. That isn't really part of the normal dungeon.

I vote infinite lockers if you 100% all four directional Vicious dungeons.Or as a more realistic goal, how about if you beat Vicious Gaan-Telet.

How about after beating the four directional vicious dungeons or beating vicious Gaan-Telet you get to replace your locker with The Vault(TM) which contains every item in the game that you've unlocked.

How about both? You just change the dark souls quest so it gives you the vault (after all, once you own GT you can store a hell of a lot of stuff in there), and you make a quest that forces you to beat all 4 Vicious. You could even have that quest unlock GT.

berpdreyfuss wrote:"to make players fret over lockerable item selections" is fine, and I enjoy deciding which Item to keep and which to give away. I think the infinite lockers should be an achievement which you can get if you are far in the game because that's the point where you start thinking about special combination or want to try special hard challenges.

Yeah, that was pretty much the initial iteration of this request. As you said "beating the game" is when you need more breathing space in choices and playing style. The game should let you go wild for a bit.

BUT I would still argue for a lower threshold - Vicious Gann-Telet is simply not a "normal" challenge. Hell, even just "beating all directional Vicious dungeons once" would be a big enough achievement for most players, if there's some form of progression on this route (e.g. about 10 locker spaces towards the endgame / upgradable 6 locker space + reserved slots for Vicious rewards) then it'd be fine.

I mean, really, I'd be happy if there's a reduction in the current bank upgrades - I'm at the 40000 threshold now and really do not see any incentive to grind that much more money. Then I think about how new players must feel about the kingdom economy when it seems to go under a depression just like in real life....

Actually, the Vicious dungeons have been (mostly) nerved to a level where they are beatable as a semi-hardcore/skilled player. Using the optimal class and preps you shouldn't have too much trouble with any of them.

Here is an idea I had that would alleviate alot of concerns raised by both sides. As players we really don't want to lose hard to find or useful items out of the lockers. The dev's idea is for people to have a unique kingdom.

What if the items that you bring back from the last run, as in the lockerable items, were available as a choice for your next run. So basically a rotating locker. Since those items don't come back if you die it would keep people from not lockering their favorite items. Also to prep an item from here could cost significantly more, not an outrageous amount, I would think at most 3-5 times as much to also keep the regular lockers desirable. You still have to do a few runs to find the item you want, but you wouldn't have to do runs to replace the item you usually use.

In the end you end up with 50% less grind, slightly more but less stable locker space and maintain a unique kingdom experience.

edit: Had a couple more thoughts to add. These no real need to gate this to a certain quest/upgrade as the gold cost and mostly open locker of a starting player provides little incentive to use these slots instead of the locker, while still providing an opportunity to try a new item. And to keep in spirit with the devs it really add to the meaningful decision. Do I just want to try this item a couple times or do I want to have it regularly available. It gives you chances to experiment but can be balanced to not replace regular lockering.

Sorry for the text wall but to me anyway it seems this could add some gameplay value while keeping to the spirit of what both sides desire.