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AlakeiThancan의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T10:45:49-06:00

Yrel didn't die, she is very much alive and well afaik, and probably already conquered AU Draenor, so she hasn't taken a hit at all, you can't honestly believe a Naa'ru to have GENDER just because it has a female voice, Calia is still alive, in an undead state, but alive nonetheless and capable to do whatever she pleases and Jaina being mistreated ends up in her being praised in the end anyways, no permanent reprecussions whatsoever.

Also if Blizzard portrays character not gender, please explain Geya'rahs character, and Mayla Highmountains too, while we're at it, explain Talanjis outside the over the top Mary Sue thing she got going on

So what, your opinion about female characters is a binary "Does she die?" option? If she dies, she's not subject to feminism, if she doesn't, then she's OP? Sounds a lot like "Let's drown her, if she survives, she's a witch, so we kill her, if she dies, too bad !".

A Mary Sue isn't defined by whether she survives or not, it's defined by a character, without any visible experience in her actions, being successful at every turn, without ever being harmed in the process. Yrel isn't a mary sue because she turned out evil. If she hadn't, then for sure she would be. Now sure, she's not been seen as vulnerable. Instead, she's a hitlerian warmonger. Not much better.

I'm not saying Naa'ru have gender, but her name is purposefully feminine and her voice matches it. Calia? Yeah, sure, she's alive(ish). Does that mean she's "protected"? She's seen her brother ruin her homeland, murder her father, she lost her child and husband in the process, she's been in hiding ever since, and the one time she decides to act for "her" people, she gets murdered for it. I'd call that "being hit", yeah. And Jaina being praised ... Yeah? So? Do all female characters have to end up in chains to be interresting in your universe? Also don't throw that "no permanent repercussions" ... She lost Arthas, she lost Uther, she lost Theramore, she lost her brother, she's responsible for her father's death, and she was condamned to death by her mom. Yeah sure NOW she's acclaimed by her people, after almost twenty years of them wanting her hanged ! Live through that and tell me it's "nothing whatsoever".

As for Geya'rah, Mayla and Talanji .... What is there to explain? Do I have to give you a reason for them being female? Like being male is a default state and if you want to create a female character you've got to have a reason? What the hell is this twisted question?

SJW's of the world, UNITE! STRIKE HARD AND FAST!

But its okay, as it was said in one TV comedy show: "Sometimes PC babies don't even know what they're crying about." :)

I'm giving arguments. Agree with them or don't, that's your opinion, but I'm giving arguments. Your "side" is saying "Boo hoo too many female characters" while having no arguments to back it up. And you personnaly? You're calling us crybabies. I wonder who's the more mature.

mpjunk의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T10:48:26-06:00

And let me guess, despite the combined power of the horde the Night Elves are able to beat us and push us out of Dark Shore. Cool can't wait to hear the BS story about that.\rYou don't know much about war do you? The hard part isn't taking land, it's keeping that land. Horde had no (or little, I don't remember if the trolls in the north were allied with the horde or not) foothold in Drakshore before this war. Add in the NE's natural propensity for stealth and guerilla tactics.\r\rLook at the real world for examples. Look at Afghanistan, Iraq. The US easily took those lands, but have had a hell of a time keeping them.\r\rAlso, horde is probably spread a little thin also. They are fighting in Arathi and Zandalar.

Willblade의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T10:49:56-06:00

Lovely way to dodge everything and just say "no u"\r\rnot... quite... but ok bro\r\rAlso if Blizzard portrays character not gender, please explain Geya'rahs character, and Mayla Highmountains too, while we're at it, explain Talanjis outside the over the top Mary Sue thing she got going on\r\rno one owes you an explanation and this isn't a chess game but i'll humor you because that's what you do with children: gey'arah isn't a great character admittedly (yet) but she's allowed to exist in the narrative, particularly because she may have importance later; mayla has been put on the backburner for now, but was the daughter of a chieftain and therefore inherited leadership; and likewise, talanji is the daughter of a king and therefore the heiress to the zandalari kingdom.\r\rsomehow i have a feeling that if these characters were men you'd have no problem with them. male-gey'arah is a hot-headed and proud orc but a dude? that's ok. male-mayla is the son of a murdered chieftain and has to learn how to carry the burden of leadership? oh that's fine. prince talanji can hold his own in battle and wants the best for his people and thinks his father's ways are archaic? what a great character!\r\rdude, just say you hate women in any kind of active role because you somehow feel Threatened by it and go, lol\r\rYou're already making assumptions of what I'd like and not like, I'll give you a hint, I play FF14, where most of the leadership roles\/spotlight is taken by female characters and I have absolutely no problem with it because they are great characters and not just a gender. How many orcs did we know from AU? A lot of them, which one did we get, a completely random female orc character, didn't even bother bringing Draka, who is a female and I'd have absolutely 0 issues with if she was put in leadership position of the AU orcs (and before you say she'd be too old, don't worry we had plenty of options to choose from, especially the boy whose wolf we rescued at Frostfire who'd be just a few years older than Geya'rah). Talanji is a princess you say? What sort of princess'ly deeds does she do outside being a generic 2010s Disney princess? Enlighten me on this because this is the most bland and generic character that has been done in this decade.\r\rAnd can you please make an attempt to write a response without referring to insults? I never insulted you, heck I don't even know you, but if I were you, I'd be embarrassed of having to rely on verbal aggression to prove my point.

SirVaksghn의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T10:51:44-06:00

Hmm... Setup for 4 sub-factions maybe?\r\r2 Alliance sub factions and 2 Horde Sub factions?\r\rHorde:\rOrc, Tauren, Trolls, Goblins\r\rUndead, BE \r\rAlliance:\rHumans, Dwarves, Gnomes , Draenai\r\rNight Elves, Worgen\r\rPandaren choose which Faction and SubFaction they are going to join\rAllied Races choose which subfaction they want to join.\r\rOrc Faction would be neutral to Undead Faction, Unfriendly to Human Faction, Hostile to NE Faction\rUndead Faction would be neutral to Orc Faction, Hostile to Human and NE Faction\r\rHuman Faction would be Neutral to NE Faction, Unfriendly to Orc Faction, Hostile to Undead Faction\rNE Faction would be Neutral to Human Faction, Hostile to Orc Faction and Undead Faction.\r\rPlayer Characters would start this way and based on which quests they do, change the subfaction they are in. Could Work and would be interesting?

1809537의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T10:56:06-06:00

This post was from a user who has deleted their account.

libetali의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T11:05:34-06:00

SJW's of the world, UNITE! \rSTRIKE HARD AND FAST!\r\rBut its okay, as it was said in one TV comedy show: "Sometimes PC babies don't even know what they're crying about." :)\r\ryou seem like a really interesting and pleasant person with a rich personality

toniplavna의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T11:07:15-06:00

RIP HORDE \r\rreeeeeeeeeeeeeeekt OP CINEMATIC

Kondey의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T11:12:24-06:00

So alliance is being torn apart

AlakeiThancan의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T11:15:08-06:00

\r\rYou're already making assumptions of what I'd like and not like, I'll give you a hint, I play FF14, where most of the leadership roles\/spotlight is taken by female characters and I have absolutely no problem with it because they are great characters and not just a gender. How many orcs did we know from AU? A lot of them, which one did we get, a completely random female orc character, didn't even bother bringing Draka, who is a female and I'd have absolutely 0 issues with if she was put in leadership position of the AU orcs (and before you say she'd be too old, don't worry we had plenty of options to choose from, especially the boy whose wolf we rescued at Frostfire who'd be just a few years older than Geya'rah). Talanji is a princess you say? What sort of princess'ly deeds does she do outside being a generic 2010s Disney princess? Enlighten me on this because this is the most bland and generic character that has been done in this decade.\r\rAnd can you please make an attempt to write a response without referring to insults? I never insulted you, heck I don't even know you, but if I were you, I'd be embarrassed of having to rely on verbal aggression to prove my point.\r\rThe reason they went for Geya'rah instead of any other orcs is simply because of lore. In the lore, we did the whole campaign on Draenor in one go, without being able to come home to Azeroth (I don't remember an equivalent in the Alliance scenario, but when Khadgar opens a portal to Orgrimmar in order to bring in Gazlowe and other workers and peons, Khadgar notes that he's not gonna be able to hold the portal for a long time, meaning it's pretty difficult to go to alternate draenor and back). When we go back to Draenor to recruit the Mag'har, we don't have the means to go back to that time period, we have to go on the CURRENT alternate draenor. Which is 39 years after we left it. Orcs are mortals. And pretty trigger happy when it comes to war. That's why we've got Geya'rah. Grommash is too old and literally sacrifices himself because he knows he wouldn't be good as a warchief anymore. The other chieftains are dead, either killed by the players, or murdered by Yrel (Durotan and Draka).\r\rGey'arah is the equivalent of Thrall. Simple of that. She's a mirror reflexion of who he is. Why is she a female and not a copy of Thrall? Because Chris Metzen left the company and probably didn't want that for Thrall's story. So they genderbent her so she's almost the same character but a bit different.\r\r\rAnd Talanji? A Disney princess? You do realize she's the whole reason Zandalar still stands? She's the one who forced her father's hand and went to investigate the blood trolls in Nazmir, and she's the one who lead that whole campaign there with extremely limited ressources. She's also the one who forces his father to listen to us, champions of the Horde (well, if you're a horde player obv). Also, she's the one who decides to join the Horde.

TheDarkAeonAnima의 댓글

kdark의 댓글

Malfurion and Velen should challenge all the Horde leaders to a 2v6. Throw in Rokhan and Eitrigg for extra cannon fodder. \rEasiest stomp ever.

Corer의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T11:30:08-06:00

Ooooh the human overlords won't be happy with this, muwahaha

Willblade의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T11:33:26-06:00

Yrel didn't die, she is very much alive and well afaik, and probably already conquered AU Draenor, so she hasn't taken a hit at all, you can't honestly believe a Naa'ru to have GENDER just because it has a female voice, Calia is still alive, in an undead state, but alive nonetheless and capable to do whatever she pleases and Jaina being mistreated ends up in her being praised in the end anyways, no permanent reprecussions whatsoever.\r\rAlso if Blizzard portrays character not gender, please explain Geya'rahs character, and Mayla Highmountains too, while we're at it, explain Talanjis outside the over the top Mary Sue thing she got going on\r\rSo what, your opinion about female characters is a binary "Does she die?" option? If she dies, she's not subject to feminism, if she doesn't, then she's OP? Sounds a lot like "Let's drown her, if she survives, she's a witch, so we kill her, if she dies, too bad !".\r\rA Mary Sue isn't defined by whether she survives or not, it's defined by a character, without any visible experience in her actions, being successful at every turn, without ever being harmed in the process. Yrel isn't a mary sue because she turned out evil. If she hadn't, then for sure she would be. Now sure, she's not been seen as vulnerable. Instead, she's a hitlerian warmonger. Not much better. \r\rI'm not saying Naa'ru have gender, but her name is purposefully feminine and her voice matches it. Calia? Yeah, sure, she's alive(ish). Does that mean she's "protected"? She's seen her brother ruin her homeland, murder her father, she lost her child and husband in the process, she's been in hiding ever since, and the one time she decides to act for "her" people, she gets murdered for it. I'd call that "being hit", yeah. And Jaina being praised ... Yeah? So? Do all female characters have to end up in chains to be interresting in your universe? Also don't throw that "no permanent repercussions" ... She lost Arthas, she lost Uther, she lost Theramore, she lost her brother, she's responsible for her father's death, and she was condamned to death by her mom. Yeah sure NOW she's acclaimed by her people, after almost twenty years of them wanting her hanged ! Live through that and tell me it's "nothing whatsoever".\r\rAs for Geya'rah, Mayla and Talanji .... What is there to explain? Do I have to give you a reason for them being female? Like being male is a default state and if you want to create a female character you've got to have a reason? What the hell is this twisted question?\r\r\rSJW's of the world, UNITE! \rSTRIKE HARD AND FAST!\r\rBut its okay, as it was said in one TV comedy show: "Sometimes PC babies don't even know what they're crying about." :)\r\rI'm giving arguments. Agree with them or don't, that's your opinion, but I'm giving arguments. Your "side" is saying "Boo hoo too many female characters" while having no arguments to back it up. And you personnaly? You're calling us crybabies. I wonder who's the more mature.\r\rMy opinion is that female characters can do whatever they want, make dumb decisions and still come out victorious without suffering reprecussions. Talanji leaves for a swamp and puts herself, the heir of the Zandalari, on the Frontlines. Dumb decision, she has plenty of followers who could do that for her, suffers no reprecussions for her dumb decision and still comes out triumphant. I'm sorry if I'm of the opinion of "If you're royalty, you should put your subjects between you and your enemy and not just jump at them screaming #YOLO!" with a person youve just met 5 minutes ago.\r\rYrel wasn't even me that brought her up into discussion, never said she was a Mary Sue, just that she succeeds in being a tyrant without suffering any losses in the process of doing so. There's nothing wrong with it, but it wasn't me who even brought her up at all for debate.\r\rThe whole "all female characters need to end in chains" argument is pure garbage though, I've never stated something like that, but if you make dumb decisions, you're expected to take the consequences for them, which none of these characters do, the biggest offender of this being Sylvannas whose inhumane tactics should be a massive blow to your grunts' morale and probably generate a lot of commotion (which doesn't happen outside Saurfang at all)\r\rAs for Jaina, do note I said on my first post since MoP, Jaina didn't go through any of that after MoP now did she? Yes she might've had her issues there, but suffered no consequences ultimately for allowing the murder of her father outside a couple insults, as she suffered no consequences for abandoning the Kirin Tor and her faction during Legion.\r\rYou don't need to give a reason no, for those characters being female, but seeing as they are all recent, all bland and have no character to them whatsoever, it's a good sign to start believing that it's an agenda. It might not be, but you can't really judge me for thinking it is.

Wepstar의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T11:39:55-06:00

Recover Teldrassil?\rIs it possible at all ?\r\rBut it will be pretty cool if Blizzard will rebuild Darnassus, and give NE their capital back, but ocourse with new graphic and e.t.c

AlakeiThancan의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T11:48:46-06:00

Yrel didn't die, she is very much alive and well afaik, and probably already conquered AU Draenor, so she hasn't taken a hit at all, you can't honestly believe a Naa'ru to have GENDER just because it has a female voice, Calia is still alive, in an undead state, but alive nonetheless and capable to do whatever she pleases and Jaina being mistreated ends up in her being praised in the end anyways, no permanent reprecussions whatsoever.\r\rAlso if Blizzard portrays character not gender, please explain Geya'rahs character, and Mayla Highmountains too, while we're at it, explain Talanjis outside the over the top Mary Sue thing she got going on\r\rSo what, your opinion about female characters is a binary "Does she die?" option? If she dies, she's not subject to feminism, if she doesn't, then she's OP? Sounds a lot like "Let's drown her, if she survives, she's a witch, so we kill her, if she dies, too bad !".\r\rA Mary Sue isn't defined by whether she survives or not, it's defined by a character, without any visible experience in her actions, being successful at every turn, without ever being harmed in the process. Yrel isn't a mary sue because she turned out evil. If she hadn't, then for sure she would be. Now sure, she's not been seen as vulnerable. Instead, she's a hitlerian warmonger. Not much better. \r\rI'm not saying Naa'ru have gender, but her name is purposefully feminine and her voice matches it. Calia? Yeah, sure, she's alive(ish). Does that mean she's "protected"? She's seen her brother ruin her homeland, murder her father, she lost her child and husband in the process, she's been in hiding ever since, and the one time she decides to act for "her" people, she gets murdered for it. I'd call that "being hit", yeah. And Jaina being praised ... Yeah? So? Do all female characters have to end up in chains to be interresting in your universe? Also don't throw that "no permanent repercussions" ... She lost Arthas, she lost Uther, she lost Theramore, she lost her brother, she's responsible for her father's death, and she was condamned to death by her mom. Yeah sure NOW she's acclaimed by her people, after almost twenty years of them wanting her hanged ! Live through that and tell me it's "nothing whatsoever".\r\rAs for Geya'rah, Mayla and Talanji .... What is there to explain? Do I have to give you a reason for them being female? Like being male is a default state and if you want to create a female character you've got to have a reason? What the hell is this twisted question?\r\r\rSJW's of the world, UNITE! \rSTRIKE HARD AND FAST!\r\rBut its okay, as it was said in one TV comedy show: "Sometimes PC babies don't even know what they're crying about." :)\r\rI'm giving arguments. Agree with them or don't, that's your opinion, but I'm giving arguments. Your "side" is saying "Boo hoo too many female characters" while having no arguments to back it up. And you personnaly? You're calling us crybabies. I wonder who's the more mature.\r\rMy opinion is that female characters can do whatever they want, make dumb decisions and still come out victorious without suffering reprecussions. Talanji leaves for a swamp and puts herself, the heir of the Zandalari, on the Frontlines. Dumb decision, she has plenty of followers who could do that for her, suffers no reprecussions for her dumb decision and still comes out triumphant. I'm sorry if I'm of the opinion of "If you're royalty, you should put your subjects between you and your enemy and not just jump at them screaming #YOLO!" with a person youve just met 5 minutes ago.\r\rYrel wasn't even me that brought her up into discussion, never said she was a Mary Sue, just that she succeeds in being a tyrant without suffering any losses in the process of doing so. There's nothing wrong with it, but it wasn't me who even brought her up at all for debate.\r\rThe whole "all female characters need to end in chains" argument is pure garbage though, I've never stated something like that, but if you make dumb decisions, you're expected to take the consequences for them, which none of these characters do, the biggest offender of this being Sylvannas whose inhumane tactics should be a massive blow to your grunts' morale and probably generate a lot of commotion (which doesn't happen outside Saurfang at all)\r\rAs for Jaina, do note I said on my first post since MoP, Jaina didn't go through any of that after MoP now did she? Yes she might've had her issues there, but suffered no consequences ultimately for allowing the murder of her father outside a couple insults, as she suffered no consequences for abandoning the Kirin Tor and her faction during Legion.\r\rYou don't need to give a reason no, for those characters being female, but seeing as they are all recent, all bland and have no character to them whatsoever, it's a good sign to start believing that it's an agenda. It might not be, but you can't really judge me for thinking it is.\r\rOkay, so regarding Jaina, I'm gonna give you a very simple and pragmatic explanation. The game doesn't revolve around her. Since MOP she hasn't had repercussions ... Well duh, since she wasn't even present on Draenor, and fought by herself in Legion. She DID suffer consequences for allowing her father to die, which is exactly what she goes through in the Kul'tiran questlines. She's condamned to death and it takes an entire zone of questlines for her mother to forgive her daughter. Regarding the Kirin Tor, why would she have any consequences for leaving? The council which she was a member of took a decision, which she didn't agree with, so she left. So what? She didn't betray them or kill them, she just left. Do you expect the Kirin Tor to send assassins or something?\r\rAs for the recent female characters being all "bland" ... Well first of, it's a matter of opinion (aside from Geya'rah who gets a wholesom 10 minutes of screentime, I don't see how any of the characters we talked about are bland), and second ... It's not a matter of gender, it's been like this since the minute world of warcraft came out. Aside from a few key characters in the general lore of the world (like Anduin, Sylvanas, Saurfang etc), most characters are created for a quest chain and then never heard of again. You think Occuleth is particularly interresting? What about Prince Farondis? Ner'zhul in WoD perhaps? How about Kael'thas, Vash'j and Illidan back in BC (I'm just talking about their lore IN BC, not in Warcraft TFT) ? \r\rSheesh even Garrosh is pretty bland. He went from not having met any humans prior to Wotlk to "I WANT TO MURDER THE ENTIRE ALLIANCE" in one patch, without a single reason behind this. After that it's just "Orcs or nothing lolz". There's no character development, no nuance, no twist. The only nuance you might see in that character is how he was angry at Magatha after realizing she manipulated him into killing Cairne, but even then, he doesn't even feel sorry for Cairne one minute, or apologize to his people, or reflect on his actions.\r\r\rCharacters in World of Warcraft are always bland. Only a few characters get special treatment, because you can't give a meaningful story to thousands of characters. Writing a good character takes time and they can only do that for so many characters for a given expansion. That's why alongside you Anduins, your Allerias, your Saurfangs and you Durotans, you have your Geya'rahs, your Lian Greymane etc.

Automag의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T11:50:14-06:00

Ladies and gentlemen, can we PLEASE keep the Sociopolitics off of these GAMING forums. There's absolutely no shortage of other places on the web to bring up and discuss such matters......

AlakeiThancan의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T12:06:02-06:00

Ladies and gentlemen, can we PLEASE keep the Sociopolitics off of these GAMING forums. There's absolutely no shortage of other places on the web to bring up and discuss such matters......\r\rI don't see why we should ? We're talking about the storytelling of WoW, so I think our discussion is pretty relevant to the website. And we're actually doing it maturely, by using arguments and counterpoints without insulting each other. So I don't see why we should stop honestly. Aside from your own personnal comfort which can be solved by just .. Ignoring us.

Vibriss의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T12:23:06-06:00

Doesn't really feel like this warranted a cutscene. It`s just a short dialogue, camera work was unnecessary.

juress의 댓글

on 2018-11-07T12:29:43-06:00

Anduin could not be any weaker then he is at the moment. What a leader, my o my.