A mother shares about the pressure she received from her spouse, and how her son's botched circumcision caused her to regret going against her instincts. Posted with Permission from Author

When I found out my second child was a boy, I started immediately thinking of the differences I would find in parenting and care-taking between him and my first born daughter. As I sat at lunch one day with my sister and mother, my sister asked me if I planned on circumcision. We sat there talking and she informed me if she could go back, she wouldn’t do it to my nephew. My mother agreed, stating that if she had had the choice all those years ago, she doesn’t think she would have done it to my three brothers. I was unsure, however; I don’t have a penis, never had to care for one, never knew anything different than circumcision. But I was young. The world was changing. So I did what any reasonable young mother would do. I researched.

I googled everything I could think of, day and night. I watched videos, read articles, looked up scientific facts on pros and cons. I blogged and tweeted my concerns, asking for help making this decision from friends, family, and even strangers. In my heart I knew it was wrong, I couldn’t find any reason to justify it, but I also struggled finding a reason to justify not doing it to my husband. He was convinced it had to be done, that it was cleaner, that it was easier to care for, that it was the natural thing to do. My son would look different than his peers, he would look different than his father, and women wouldn’t be attracted to it. I tried to show him the research, I tried to discuss it, I tried to show him the videos, but to no avail. I couldn’t convince him and I was tired of fighting. Finally, someone gave me this advice, “If you’re still unsure and it’s that important to your husband, just let him decide, even if you don’t agree on it.” So I did. I relented and said, “Fine, dear, have it your way.”

The days and weeks leading up to the birth of our son, I still tried, without luck, to make my husband reconsider. Not even reconsider really, but to just consider another option. He wouldn't watch the videos and stated plainly that I had no idea what owning and cleaning a penis entailed; it would be much more difficult if he was left intact. Did I really want that?

My son was born early on a July morning, and by the afternoon the nurse came around to ask if we were choosing circumcision. I was alone in the hospital room at this point and nearly told her no, to leave him alone, but instead I choked out a yes and was told that he would be picked up tomorrow morning for his “procedure.”

The next day, I sat; silently praying they wouldn’t show up, that they would forget about us, about him, about his penis. They allowed me to finish nursing while they described the way it would happen, what they would do to soothe him and had me sign the forms with a shaky signature. They promised it wouldn’t be more than an hour- two tops. He would come back, right as rain.

I sobbed as they wheeled his little bed away from me.

Five hours later, I awoke from a nap to my husband standing in the room, questioning where he was. I didn’t know, they took him away this morning and I hadn’t seen him since. He walked to the nursery to question the nurses where they explained that he had bled “just a little more” than they were comfortable with, so they kept him a little longer just to make sure.

“You’re lucky!” The nurse laughed at my husband. “Most babies are way too small and the doctors have a lot of trouble getting the whole thing off. You have a big boy!”

For days, my son slept. Not the sweet, peaceful sleep of a newborn, but a fitful, obviously painful sleep. When he awoke, he screamed in pain, unable to be soothed, unwilling to nurse or cuddled closely. He screamed when he urinated or defecated; he was only happy when his diaper was off, but so long as his penis went untouched. I lived in fear of diaper changes. I wanted nothing more than to just leave him be; no diaper, no pulling his penis to ensure the foreskin wouldn’t grow back, no Vaseline on the base. Just freedom from pain is all I wanted for him. We both sobbed during those moments, his diapers always speckled with blood and his face always tear stained.

The healing process never seemed to end. As he got older, the bleeding stopped, but the wound never healed. At first, his pediatrician told us to continue to just put the Vaseline on it, continuing to treat it like we always had. It wasn’t until six months of questioning did she inspect a little better and found that, while the doctors considered him a “big” boy and claimed to have no trouble with his circumcision, they actually snipped too much off. Now, he will have a permanent scar about a half of an inch long at the tip of his penis. When it will become a scar, I have no idea (as of right now, it’s still an open wound, 14 months later.) We’re still required to keep Vaseline on it several times a week. We find blood occasionally on diapers and hear him screaming at the first sign of a dirty diaper. He runs away after his diaper comes off and holds himself sobbing. During those nights when his cut reopens, he and I both lay awake at night crying, wishing for an end.

We should have allowed him that choice, we should have waited. If we had, he wouldn’t be in pain several times a month... he would be whole with no pain, as he should be. I don’t know if this has changed my husband’s view on circumcision, and I don’t blame him for this. I blame myself for saying yes; I blame myself for signing those forms; I blame myself completely, and I will fight for tomorrow’s sons- whether they are my own, my nephews, or a stranger's. No boy should have to go through this pain, not for his parents peace of mind.

Kim

9/7/2011 03:32:56 am

Oh, mamma. I do know exactly how you feel. My story is almost exactly like yours (except my son has healed and I do hope he will not have any future problems). I didn't want it, he did. He did not want to research anything or really talk about it. I took my boy at 3wks old and consented to this awful procedure. I went into the room when she was about half way finished. I'll never lose that day from my mind. I play it over and over again, all the what if's. I should have stuck with what I knew to be right and my husband would have been ok. As a matter of fact, I've been so upset by this issue my husband finally agreed to watch a video of it and now tells me had he watched it before he would have felt differently!!! Why can't we just trust our mother's feelings and not cave in to the pressure? We teach our kids not to fall for peer pressure about smoking, drugs, sex etc... Then we as adults let someone who has not done the research push us into a wrong decision. I pray for recovery for you little one. I know nothing I say will comfort you and nothing comforts me. All I can do now it inform others who are willing to listen. I find it so frustrating to open my heart about this to someone and they still not really get it and say they are still going to do it. That just kills me inside. I just want to shake them and say--did you not just hear what I said?!!!! Good luck mamma--maybe we can save some from this awful experience. We have to get to the government and insurance companies. It must stop--we have to be heard.

Your article was written and published without any consideration for the human (right) element. You never even once addressed how one might feel after having part of their body cut (harvested) from them and sold without permission... Think about this for a moment ... waking up with 666 on your forehead without your permission... and or against your will... This argument comes down to human rights and your GOD given right to do with your body as you choose... (Just ask pro abortionist) ("It's my body to do what I want.")

Nature does not make mistakes. Your article implies clearly - since you cannot make the right choice to keep clean and protect the use of your body "we" without consent will make the choice for you.

You have got to be kidding Ginger.,.

You reporting on foreskin. You do not even know what it feels like with or without it... You can only read and see one. It reminds me of when getting a councilor before my divorce. I left it up to my wife to find a therapist... She found one all right - some woman come hear me roar - nasty unhappy person... I mentioned after three sessions, if it was uncommon for a couple to have both a male and female therapist... OMG you could not have imagine the nastiness that came from my wife and therapist... Finally I stood up and said to both of them - When you tell me what it is like to ejaculate and hit the ceiling, I will tell you what it feels like to have blood run down my leg once a month. (I have only read) My advice to any couple - Husband and wife should request a male and female councilor and both attend both sides of therapy together...

Ginger you can read as many books as you want and tell me what you read and that is all the empathy you have to give/tell me anything or any male regarding his anatomy and vise a versa - it is like me telling you what is best for your vagina.

Your article failed in/on so many levels... First and most important - Everyone has the right to be born without harvesting body anatomy.

Nature does not make mistakes...
Did you know that that "meaningless" little piece of skin when harvested ....

SLICE - and three feet of veins, arteries and
capillaries, 240 feet of nerves and more than 20,000
nerve endings are destroyed; so are all the muscles, glands,
epithelial tissue and sexual sensitivity associated with the foreskin.
what nature intended as an internal organ irrevocably externalized.

Think about your eye lids and what would happen without them - or better yet a vagina without the outer folds of skin covering and exposed without it... or how about your mouth left open... that is want happens when destroying and harvesting a male foreskin.

So Ginger as I have written to the NY Commissioner of Health in response to harvesting foreskins to prevent HIV and that he must be in agreement of removing young girls breasts in prevention of breast cancer later on in their adult life... Do you take that stance? Or believe that leaving the juices of a raw chicken on the cutting board is a great idea... or are you intelligent enough to have learned and read about disease prevention in food preparation/cooking... Do not insult the intelligence of those that naturally care about their bodies.

THE ONLY THING THAT PREVENTS HIV AND STD'S IS PROTECTION AND THE INTELLEGENCE OF THE PERSON TO MAKE THE RIGHT DECISION. REGARDING HARVESTING ANATOMY IS A HUMAN RIGHTS ISSUE - PERIOD!!! IF YOU THINK I AM KIDDING HERE IS A WEBSITE YOU SHOULD LOG ONTO AND SEE WHERE ONES' SON'S FORESKIN IS BEING SOLD. http://ccr.coriell.org/Sections/Search/Search.aspx?PgId=165&q=foreskin

Should we presume the people in faraway lands are as informed as Americans in keeping their food preparation area as clean as we do... now there is another worthless taxpayers dollars working research putting us on the same playing field of those running around bare foot - Our Nation so easily spending our dollars and making pharmaceutical companies rich instead releasing their cures,

Yes doctors make money from the insurance and then get money for forwarding on to research/cosmetic institutes. Are you finally getting the picture?

Arleen Leibowitz... another woman making decision about the

Autumn

3/13/2013 11:27:03 am

You are absolutely imbecilic. Did you truly read her article? She SAID she DIDN'T want to circumcise her son, she SAID she didn't HAVE a penis and couldn't make the decision but her husband pushed for it. Her HUSBAND, not her. Her husband, the one with the penis. You ignorant arse. She feels bad enough, take it somewhere else why don't you? Because you clearly didn't read one word in this article.

K Howard

12/11/2012 07:34:24 am

Parents DO NOT alow anyone to chop your children's genitals.. It is SO weird, if they want it done let them do it. Ah people are so weird. The "natural" thing to do is leave it "natural". fighting this is getting tiresome. I am glad it is not common sheep practice in Australia. ELECTIVE SURGERY ON YOUR NEWBORN does that not ring alarm bells.
this poor kid will prob have a very bent erection by the time he is an adult as the skin fuses to fully heal. So many regret stories after the fact. :(

Carol

9/7/2011 06:00:19 am

Jesus Christ! I would divorce someone or run away if I suspected they wanted to mutilate my children! Why do women do this? Husbands and lovers are replaceable. You child's penis is not. I would rather my child be raised without a father than without a foreskin.

Carol

9/7/2011 06:03:17 am

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to be insensitive. I've just heard this type of story so many times. I'm just shocked that so often women value their relationships with their husbands so much that they are willing to force their children to make such a terrible sacrifice.

Brad

9/7/2011 11:27:11 am

Carol, I don't blame you for feeling rage. And I agree. A spouse is replaceable...not a child's genitals. In fact, I did break up with a woman that I was considering proposing too once I found out her views on circumcision and just how bullheaded she intended to be on the subject. Worst part was that I knew, as the father, I'd be pretty much left out of the decision. So I introduced her ass to Mr. Curb.

But people are told over and over again that it isn't such a big sacrifice. I would imagine it's far easier to be coerced into doing this than it is a lot of things.

Christopher

9/8/2011 10:10:03 am

What a heartbreaking story. I sympathise deeply with you and your son. No mother and child should go through the trauma you both are suffering still.

Please don't blame yourself, you are NOT to blame. Put it down to cultural normalcy in a climate of circumcision myths perhaps, if you cannot find it in your heart to place some blame at your husband's feet.

Why is it you don't know if this tragedy has changed his view on circumcision? It must have been equally distressing for him.

I can only add that it's clear from your words of love, both for your son and your husband, you will use that love to nurture your little boy close to your heart as each day, month and year passes by.

Bless you.

Christopher

Jer

9/13/2011 12:31:04 am

I'm so, so sorry. For both of you... :*(

Wishing you peace and healing,

Jer

Lacy

9/13/2011 01:17:16 am

I hope you and your husband find peace tough this together and I hope that peace comes with communication and understanding- it's okay to let go of blame and move on. I pray your son finds healing.

Laura

9/13/2011 02:54:21 am

I am not trying to inflame the situation . .but I think this is really really dramatic! Most baby boys are circumcised . .my father was not . .he was super ashamed of his penis and by the way his penis always smelled no matter how well he cleaned it! My father insisted that my brother was circumcised because of all the grief he got in the high school locker room for looking different! I circumcised my son because my husband is circumcised and I want them to look the same .. also no matter what anyone says I have been a nurse for a long time a circumcised penis is cleaner, less chance for penile cancer and decreases risk for STDs as well! To each their own . .but in my opinion you guys are way over the top dramatic . .I have seen the procedure done in person many many many times when I worked as a postpartum nurse and it isn't barbaric .. def not traumatizing enough to leave your spouse rather than have your son have a circumcision that in my opinion is CRAZY! No one has every said any procedure is without risks . .you have to research who is doing the procedure how often they do it etc . .again their are always risks .. my son is circumcised and I wouldn't have it any other way ..I love a circumcised penis and there is nothing wrong with that!

lisa

9/18/2012 04:27:06 pm

and to you laura... you make me sick. im a student midwife in australia and i would NEVER ever encourage anyone to consent to such a horrific act of abuse.

your a nurse, your someone who is supposed to protect. your blessed enough to work in the area of maternity and yet you do not advocate for the vulnerable women and babies in your care. you dont deserve your job if you truly believe circumcision has a place in this world. male or female.

lisa

9/18/2012 04:27:24 pm

and to you laura... you make me sick. im a student midwife in australia and i would NEVER ever encourage anyone to consent to such a horrific act of abuse.

your a nurse, your someone who is supposed to protect. your blessed enough to work in the area of maternity and yet you do not advocate for the vulnerable women and babies in your care. you dont deserve your job if you truly believe circumcision has a place in this world. male or female.

k howard

12/11/2012 07:41:05 am

been with my uncircumcised husband for 16 years he washed in a normal manner mostly daily his penis does not smell. Just as an unwashed vagina does smell as does an unwashed penis. washed penis will NOT smell..

Heather

9/13/2011 03:54:37 am

I have to disagree with you on several points. A circumcised penis is not cleaner. The foreskin is fused to the glans and protects it and keeps it clean during the childhood years. Once it has separated at puberty, then a quick rinse in the shower is all that is needed. The risk of penile cancer is so small that more children die each year from circumcision than men die of penile cancer, so you are actually increasing the risk of death if you circumcise. Also, no studies have ever conclusively proven a decrease in STD's. In fact, condom use is far more effective. My husband has performed circumcisions himself in residency training, and he felt that it was the most horrifying, barbaric procedure that he has ever been a part of. Mistakes are made all the time and it does not matter how much experience a doctor has. He has witnessed botched circumcisions by experienced physicians. We have 3 happy, healthy, intact sons as the result of his experiences and the fact that there are no benefits that outweigh the risks of the procedure. Our boys absolutely deserve the right to genital integrity. I hope that the author and her family are able to find peace and healing, and no, I do not believe that this is overly dramatic in the least.

Thank you for sharing your story and life with those who read. It's raw, many people can't handle raw life. I appreciate it and your willingness to stand up for genital integrity. Love to you and your family.

Intactmama

9/13/2011 02:23:27 pm

Laura most of your "facts" are wrong. It's not cleaner (teach him to clean it as you would a daughter, it doesn't prevent STDs (condoms do), and it's a very painful procedure. And saying you did it so they look the same is such a horrible reason. My son has a different nose than my husband, but he didn't get a nose job. It's not a parent's decision, it's the person who owns the penis' decision. So sad that people think this way.....

Mary Lanser

9/14/2011 04:24:14 pm

Personally, I think there is something seriously wrong when a Nurse thinks that there is nothing barbaric about cutting a baby's genitals. Not traumatic? No way. People are being too dramatic? No way. But in my experience there have been Nurses who were instrumental in siding with a spouse who was dead set on circumcision. There are all kinds of Nurses, I just happen to favor the ones who believe in the rights of the child!

I have been with both circumcised and uncircumcised men, clean men of both dispositions do not smell. Unwashed men are smelly either way.

Too, I have yet to meet a woman who considered circumcision one of the criteria on which she decided to have sex with a man.

Incidentally, since we are talking about drama, at least 100 babies a year die following circumcision - it doesn't take a lot of blood loss for a tiny new born to bleed out - but hey, what's a dead baby when you could be facing a smelly penis?

kritik1

9/21/2011 03:56:14 pm

Laura's claim of un-clean penis is a myth. Ask any medical professional including nurses and they will tell you both the circumcised and the un-circumcised penis could be clean or dirty. Go to any major medical web site in America and they do not support what Laura claims.
I challenge anyone to mention any major medical website in America that claims to be so.

Kristen

9/29/2011 09:09:38 am

Thank you for sharing your story. I'm sure that it was very hard to write, I bet it's even harder to live. I just had my first son, and left him intact. And reading the sad story of your son just reassured me that I made the right decision.

Rebecca

10/1/2011 08:50:16 am

laura, did your father choose to circumcise his smelly penis as an adult or did he decide that a smelly penis (which I have never encounter as a result if not circumcising) was better than going through the agony if having his genitals sliced into? It would ve interesting to know if an adult who feels strongly for circumcision would put themselves through the agony of the procedure before they reccomend it for an infant whos only defense comes in the form of his parents.

Angie

10/1/2011 09:22:38 am

My husband of 29 years is uncircumcised. He's never had a UTI and I have NEVER noticed him smelling. I've only had 4 yeast infections in those 29 years. It's never been a problem. We also decided before our children were born that any boys WOULD NOT be circumcised, much to the horror of my family. We had girls, but no amount of pressure wouldve changed our minds.

sarah

10/1/2011 10:27:20 am

This story is heartwrenching. However, one of the saddest parts to me is that you don't know if it has changed your husband's feelings about circumcision. I really REALLY feel like this is something that the two of you need to discuss, maybe it's too emotional so soon, but you guys need to talk about the situation and what effect his feelings and stance on the issue had on you and YOUR duty as a mother... maybe he didn't know that a mother's instinct is usually a bit more in tune with the baby, maybe your intuition came from a place of understanding what may happen.... I just wonder if this experience has possibly NOT had an effect on how he makes decisions (obviously not based on any research at all) and if that might impact your relationship later.... there are many more decisions that will need to be made in the course of your parenting experience together. You guys need to communicate with each other about this experience fully. I certainly hope you have him read this beautiful thoughtful story you've written.

Tonya

10/1/2011 01:03:43 pm

My oldest son (from a previous marriage) is circ'd because I simply thought "that's what you do with boys" and my ex was circ'd. I was young, uninformed about the true nature of the procedure, and really didn't give it a second thought. Worst. Decision. Ever. He had problems with fusing and trapped smegma forming cysts no matter how clean we kept him or how diligently we followed our pedi's instructions. I can't tell you how many times I had to separate the fused spots myself and even take him to his pedi for it to be separated there because it was so extensive. This went on until he was about a year old.

Fast forward six years. I'm divorced and remarried. We were expecting a son and started discussing circ'ing. I was firmly against, but my (circ'd) husband was pro-circ (for spiritual reasons, though we're Christian, not Jewish or Muslim). I told him about my feelings on it and what happened with my first son's circumcision. I gave him facts and reference links. I told him also my reasons for feeling that there is not requirement of circumcision under the new covenant and just asked him to think it over. He brought the topic up independently several weeks later and decided after much research, thought, and prayer that he could not justify having it done. So, our three month old son is intact and will remain so unless HE chooses to have it done (barring TRUE medical necessity, which is highly unlikely).

Amy

10/3/2011 04:56:15 am

Tonya, congrats, I'm so glad your rational discussion with your new husband was so successful :)

My brother and sister in law are currently expecting. We don't know yet what sex the baby will be, but I sent my sister in law a little info via facebook just in case to get the thoughts going. She didn't reply... but we will see.

Katie

10/4/2011 11:48:41 am

Wow luara, this story needed to be dramatic this story shows a diffrent part of circucision you shouldn't be bieset everyone is diffrent. My mother was present for my brothers circumsion and the look in his eyes she could tell that it was tramatic for him and a pain we will never feel. We where made like this for a reason and that our skin has away of protecting us, our gentials are kept private and if you are really loved inside and out thats all that matters! I do like this story its very honset and Im so glad I made the right choice with my handsome, happy son. I don't think I could have gone through this without going crazy.

Lindsay

10/11/2011 07:06:16 am

Thanks for Sharing your story. My oldest son is circumcised... However I did not research it(just made too many assumptions due to our society). I can at least claim ignorance... I can't imagine how hard it would be, to not be able to do that. Please know that you will save other babies by sharing your sons story. My son also had complications( not this bad...but it did cause Him extra pain and bleeding). This story I hear too many times. Husbands who can't get over themselves to protect their boys... They bullythe mom so hard she caves or just refuse to even talk about it. Not to mention they usually have other family members on the dads side... So horrible.

Lindsay

10/11/2011 07:09:03 am

And to anyone who Is still torn about cleaning/STDs... Most of the world does NOT circumcise their baby boys... Europe has never really circumcised and they are not having all these issues with their penis. Only in America does all these "issues" seem to arise

Donna

11/23/2011 12:17:33 am

http://circumcisiondecisionmaker.com Has evidence-proven FACTS about circumcision. You can use this site to double-check the logic behind your circumcision. You may be surprised at what you learn.

Michaela

11/23/2011 12:28:46 am

I have a friend who's son is 21. A day after his birth, she was bullied into signing consent forms for circumcision because the hospital had already begun the surgery. The nurse blamed mom for 'neglecting' to take care of the paperwork, and shamed her into signing the forms.

21 years later, her son still has issues with intimacy due to his surgical site. The skin separates and his penis bleeds. It's painful and embarrassing. A surgeon he's seen recently says he'll need reconstructive surgery, a skin graft to fix it, and weeks of recovery. Even if he chooses to have the procedure done, he may still come out the other side of it with erectile dysfunction.

The OB who performed his circumcision also demonstrated all four commonly-performed types of episiotomy to a roomful of medical students - using his mother's vagina and perineum. She had 27 stitches and major scarring. At the birth of her second child, another (much smaller) episiotomy was necessary because the scar tissue would not stretch around her daughter's head to let her out of the birth canal.

pp

11/25/2011 11:15:31 pm

I will never forget the day I did it I was 10 years old. I went to the bushes for 3months and still when I came home I was not healed. It took me another month at home to heal. Now I leave with the fair of parenting a boy. How will I feel when he is old enought and asks me to go do the prossidure. I don't wantt him to go thro that pain

Jenny

12/4/2011 10:59:46 pm

Laura, How dare you call any child's medical issue " dramatic". I wonder how you would fare going about your normal daily activities with an open wound on your genitals? How about if you can't communicate your pain with words? I got a chill reading your response and wonder where your mothering instincts are?
I left my children alone and as 2nd or 3rd grades they are neither "smelly" or chronically infected. They have actually never had one. and the statement that most boys are circumcised is not true. 9 years ago the stats were about 50/50, I would imagine now there are less circumcised boys. I don't believe God makes mistakes.

Dr. Ron

5/7/2012 11:58:49 am

Circumcising your son today is short-sighted. Twenty-five years ago circumcision rates were in the 90% range. Nearly every single boy in the United States had his foreskin cut off. We were then socialized and brainwashed into believing the foreskin was dirty, infection prone, smelly, and only poor people had foreskins. We were taught in school that the foreskin wasn’t necessary. This has all changed. Thanks to the Internet, parents are doing their research and learning the truth. Health, human sexuality, and anatomy classes are teaching accurate information about the natural penis. The foreskin is being de-stigmatized. As a result, better than 50% of boys born in the last couple of years are intact, and this trend is only going to continue. In another twenty-five years, perhaps less, the circumcision rate will be half of what it is today, if not lower. We have never been able to deny social progress, so at some point, circumcision for kids will be banned. That leaves the question, which side of history will your son want to be on every time he looks at his penis?

lisa

9/18/2012 04:25:39 pm

thankyou so much for sharing your story with us. i cry for you and your boy...

and to you laura... you make me sick. im a student midwife in australia and i would NEVER ever encourage anyone to consent to such a horrific act of abuse.

your a nurse, your someone who is supposed to protect. your blessed enough to work in the area of maternity and yet you do not advocate for the vulnerable women and babies in your care. you dont deserve your job if you truly believe circumcision has a place in this world. male or female.

Harmed

12/11/2012 08:22:38 am

I'm surprised that no one has considered the on going trauma to the child - even after genital surgery that has 'gone as planned' the poor kid has someone messing with his genitals several times a day. Left intact, you just leave it alone. With complications (as above) this genital fiddling will go on for months or years. What does this do to the psyche of a boy that will someday become a man. I can't imagine the brain interprets this as anything less than sexual molestation.

Brother K

12/11/2012 09:26:35 pm

It's heartbreaking that so many American moms don't want to know the horror of circumcision. They think it's normal because it's all they've ever known. Cultures that circumcise women feel the same way and say the same things in defense of the practice.

Amanda

12/12/2012 09:51:39 am

its not your fault ma'am......... and i am an intactivist, yet i say it is not your fault..once we know better we do better. Learn from this and all will be fine.