Stark and Cap were both taking jabs at each other the whole time they were around each other to that point. I think some of the things Stark said did bother Cap some which is one of the reasons he wanted to fight him. That kinda thing happens with brothers all the time.

Let's not forget that what Rogers said to Stark cut to him as well. Because it was the truth!

It's going to be cool to see them tackle that modern celebrity aspect for Cap, considering he's going to be the one main figure other than Tony in the public eye. BW and Hawkeye are covert agents, Banner will be off who knows where, Thor is offworld...so it will be cool for Cap to have his celebrity status back and dealing with that in a different way in modern times...as opposed to being a celebrity/poster boy back in the 40's.

Yeah it certainly will be. The man out of time, but also the big celebrity of this day will be a great angle to play on for the sequel. I hope they decide to have that scene where he visits older Peggy, that will be very emotional.

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Quote:

‎ Part of the beauty of Spider-Man is he's covered head to toe, you can't see his skin colour or sexual orientation, and what's important is that he's a hero. He stands for the underdog and those that need protecting." - Andrew Garfield

I'd kinda wished during that scene that Steve said something like, "your father was 10 times the man you are." Clearly from IM2, Tony had issues with his dad, but I think he feels a strong connection at the same time. Like in the first one where he says he never got to say goodbye to his father. Steve telling him that would have sent him over the edge.

yeah i agree, could have even gone with the " I know men with none of that worth ten of you, your father for one." and then later they could have even talked about it, like in the scene after Coulsons death, or at least see Tony asking him questions about his father as in IM2 it was apparent he didnt know very much.

Oh, well maybe they'll touch on that in Avengers 2.

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Quote:

‎ Part of the beauty of Spider-Man is he's covered head to toe, you can't see his skin colour or sexual orientation, and what's important is that he's a hero. He stands for the underdog and those that need protecting." - Andrew Garfield

Yeah it certainly will be. The man out of time, but also the big celebrity of this day will be a great angle to play on for the sequel. I hope they decide to have that scene where he visits older Peggy, that will be very emotional.

I think they missed their chance with that scene in Avengers...personally I'm of the mind Peggy should be dead and Steve should visit her grave. If he's been on ice for almost 70 years that would put Peggy in her mid to late 90's. Not that it's not plausible she'd still be alive, but they'd have to do some amazing makeup work to pull it off.

I liked the backbone Cap displayed in this ..... very worthy of being a "Captain". He was already apprehensive about Stark's persona to begin with so everything Stark was doing was testing his patience. Keep in mind also that Loki's staff had a hand in the heightening of the friction.

I like the backbone he displayed, when he was displaying backbone.

Backbone, in terms of being a leader, is standing up for whats morally right and whats best for the team and the mission. Telling someone off just because you can...especially when that person's actions aren't actually affecting anything...isn't an appropriate move for a leader.

Leaders shouldn't pick fights. Or allow them to continue. They should most certainly try to diffuse the situation without violence.

The main problem I have with it is that this is Rogers' first impulse. To resolve the issue with violence. He never even tries to really talk to Stark, to find any common ground. The scene works because of the actors, but it just feels like a somewhat forced way to create drama between them.

If that moment was caused by Loki's spear...I could see that, but if that's the case, it wasn't well handled or shown.

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No he doesn't. Stark wasn't exactly being nice to Steve when he was talking about Loki (calling him a capsicle, fighting Thor without a plan, etc.). He seems like someone who thinks Stark is a jerk and isn't helping the situation. In Cap's defense, he wasn't. Cap got on Stark for testing Banner, which shows more Cap's worry for the safety of everyone (which is further seen by his regard for civilian life when the others were ignoring that aspect of the invasion).

Stark essentially helped Captain America defeat Loki. He may have saved Rogers' life. Whatever his methods, whatever teasing her may have done, Stark got results. Stark went after Thor, but this didn't really affect their mission. Thor taking Loki did. Stark just didn't listen to Cap about going after Thor.

By the time Captain America admonishes him, Stark was helping. He was obviously assisting Banner in finding the cube. He was also working on finding what Fury was hiding from everyone else.

And it's a moot point, because Captain America thinking Stark was a jerk doesn't mean its okay for him to be a jerk, too.

Rogers defending Banner and telling Stark to knock it off would have been fine. But Rogers then takes it farther.

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I'm with you on this, Stark was being an ass for most of the movie and it must've taken alot of restraint from Cap not to lay his ass out.

I don't have a whole lot of respect for Captain America when he can't ignore a few jokes.

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The way I see the quarrel between Rogers and Stark is that, Rogers saw the way Stark was provoking Banner and since he hates bullies (see CA:TFA), he decided to take a stand and fight for the "little guys", so to speak. He saw Stark as a bully and he wanted to take him down a notch, just like he once did as a 95-lb weakling, that's why he repeatedly told Stark to "suit up" so he could teach him a lesson. Although I don't really think Stark was being a bully, I think Rogers' response was appropriate given his personality, and I'm glad that he wanted to take a stand against aggressors. This reflects the way that he confronted Loki in Germany, as well.

Except that, as has been pointed out, Banner didn't need him to fight for him. Banner was fine. Rogers response essentially made he himself look like a bully by the end of it.

Captain America's comments about Stark pretending to be a hero ring false (because given his past actions, Stark clearly isn't just pretending) as do Stark's about Captain America. They're both out of line there, but Rogers was out of line first.

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Writer and Lyricist of GOTHAM'S KNIGHT: THE BATMAN MUSICAL

And if I'm right
The future's looking bright
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Backbone, in terms of being a leader, is standing up for whats morally right and whats best for the team and the mission. Telling someone off just because you can...especially when that person's actions aren't actually affecting anything...isn't an appropriate move for a leader.

Leaders shouldn't pick fights. Or allow them to continue. They should most certainly try to diffuse the situation without violence.

The main problem I have with it is that this is Rogers' first impulse. To resolve the issue with violence. He never even tries to really talk to Stark, to find any common ground. The scene works because of the actors, but it just feels like a somewhat forced way to create drama between them.

If that moment was caused by Loki's spear...I could see that, but if that's the case, it wasn't well handled or shown.

Stark essentially helped Captain America defeat Loki. He may have saved Rogers' life. Whatever his methods, whatever teasing her may have done, Stark got results. Stark went after Thor, but this didn't really affect their mission. Thor taking Loki did. Stark just didn't listen to Cap about going after Thor.

By the time Captain America admonishes him, Stark was helping. He was obviously assisting Banner in finding the cube. He was also working on finding what Fury was hiding from everyone else.

And it's a moot point, because Captain America thinking Stark was a jerk doesn't mean its okay for him to be a jerk, too.

Rogers defending Banner and telling Stark to knock it off would have been fine. But Rogers then takes it farther.

I don't have a whole lot of respect for Captain America when he can't ignore a few jokes.

Except that, as has been pointed out, Banner didn't need him to fight for him. Banner was fine. Rogers response essentially made he himself look like a bully by the end of it.

Captain America's comments about Stark pretending to be a hero ring false (because given his past actions, Stark clearly isn't just pretending) as do Stark's about Captain America. They're both out of line there, but Rogers was out of line first.

It seemed Captain was perturbed, but okay with Stark up until the point when Stark prodded Banner with that pointy, electrical thing. It made total sense that Captain would get pissed at Stark the way he did, since no one really had any idea of the level of control Banner had over the Hulk. Stark's "curiosity" could have resulted in everyone on the Helicarrier getting killed.

You see this type of no nonsense attitude in lots of leaders, especially those in the military. A single faulty action can result in the death of your squad mates. Captain's anger was justified.

Also, Guard, you don't seem to consider that Captain's knowledge on Stark was probably limited to Shield's dossiers. According to Shield, Stark was unfit to be a part of the Avengers Initiative. Yes, Stark did some heroic deeds, but that doesn't negate the negative aspects of his personality. Also, you seem to forget the way he acted in Iron Man 2... You know, the whole getting wasted and putting people's lives in danger by playing with his lethal weapons like they were child toys...

for anyone in the UK Chris Evans was apparently on the one show, I missed it so I'm not sure what they were talking about or what, but yeah. It'll be up on the BBC website later tonight.

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Quote:

‎ Part of the beauty of Spider-Man is he's covered head to toe, you can't see his skin colour or sexual orientation, and what's important is that he's a hero. He stands for the underdog and those that need protecting." - Andrew Garfield

I think some people are over analyzing Caps intentions in that scene. It wasnt about stopping a bully. It was the second time Stark did something reckless and Cap had to check him on it. The argument that followed was just a natural result from their time on the jet.

__________________"When you come at the King you best not miss"- Omar Little

He most definitely earned the leadership position. If you look throughout the film, Rogers was gaining respect of the others, and it all culminated in the final battle. When they needed someone to lead the way, its no surprise that they turned to Cap.

For example

Banner/Hulk-When Rogers told him "The only word I care about", you could see how much that meant to Banner. Its probably why the Hulk actually listened to Cap's orders.

Black Widow-He earns her respect on the Quinjet, when she advises him to sit it out as its way too dangerous for him, but he goes anyway.

Thor-Similarly, the scene of him stopping Thor and Iron Man was probably the biggest hint that he would become the leader. When Thor attacked him, and Cap held up and eventually calmed them down, he earned Thor's respect.

Iron Man-This was the longest development, as they developed together. They really grew together, and you could see the foundations being made of them becoming the brothers they are in the comics.

Hawkeye-Barton obviously accepts Cap as the leader, and Rogers is the one who tells him to "suit up" when BW and Hawkeye were sitting there wondering how to get back at Loki.

He also took the leadership role when he reprimanded Stark for trying to bring out the Hulk and reminded everyone to do their job.

So all this culminated into the scene where Cap gives the orders to everyone. If you look at that one scene it may seem that it was forced, but throughout the movie Cap was being built up as the leader.

Anyone else liked on how almost everyone in the film referred to Steve as Cap or Captain in a respectable manner? Personally, I also liked on how subtle they played the fact that Steve is not only a legend in the history of the MCU for everyone but on how he’s technically supposed to be like MUCH OLDER than his teammates, thus the way Steve carries himself (a man with wisdom) and how a lot of people looks up to him was played in a very great and subtle way imho.

I also liked on how Banner retorted to Natasha during that huge group argument on how hew as perplexed that SHIELD could potentially see Captain America as a Threat when they were talking about individuals emerging in the world with such strength and abilities at their disposal.

Also, another signal that Banner took a liking to Cap after the "Only word I care about" line, Banner was the only one who refers to Cap as Steve, when Stark, Rogers, and Banner were talking about the mystery of SHIELD and Fury. He says something like "C'mon Steve. You must've felt something is up too"

Also, Banner sort of defends Cap when he reprimands SHIELD for regarding him as a threat.

And again, when Thor and Cap are fighting side by side, you could sense a chemistry or brotherhood between the two as Thor asked if he was ready.

Basically, Cap had a sense of chemistry with every team member, even BW.

Backbone, in terms of being a leader, is standing up for whats morally right and whats best for the team and the mission. Telling someone off just because you can...especially when that person's actions aren't actually affecting anything...isn't an appropriate move for a leader.

Leaders shouldn't pick fights. Or allow them to continue. They should most certainly try to diffuse the situation without violence.

The main problem I have with it is that this is Rogers' first impulse. To resolve the issue with violence. He never even tries to really talk to Stark, to find any common ground. The scene works because of the actors, but it just feels like a somewhat forced way to create drama between them.

If that moment was caused by Loki's spear...I could see that, but if that's the case, it wasn't well handled or shown.

I get it now. You're just never going to back down from this "not understanding Loki's staff" issue. That's fine man. To some of us it was as clear as day the effect it had on all of the men in the room. At one point Stark even rubs his forehead and winces as if something is doing something to his mind. Banner even picks up the Staff without even knowing it...... but none of that's overt enough for you. It's all forced. We get it.

I get it now. You're just never going to back down from this "not understanding Loki's staff" issue. That's fine man. To some of us it was as clear as day the effect it had on all of the men in the room. At one point Stark even rubs his forehead and winces as if something is doing something to his mind. Banner even picks up the Staff without even knowing it...... but none of that's overt enough for you. It's all forced. We get it.

I was just about to say something along these lines.
Thanks Rock!
Mjolnir firmly on the nail.

__________________"On Olympus, we measure wisdom against Athena...speed against Hermes...power against Zeus. But we measure courage...against Captain America."

Speaking of which, I also noticed on how it felt as though she was giving him a look of respect/admiration when Thor took off to reach the top of the tower after Steve gave his set of orders.

I got more of a "What's my objective?" feeling from that look than admiration. Her eyebrows were pretty furrowed for admiration.

__________________"Why are you trying to kill my kid?! You know what? I don't care. You got some beef with him or me? Whatever. You trying to start a rogues gallery of some sort? I ain't got half as much patience as Batman or The Flash. If he dies...so do you." - Green Arrow