I hear that Septuagint is the bible version which Jesus and His disciples use. How do you know it?

Because that's the version that's quoted in almost all instances the OT is used in the NT.

You mean that when the disciples of Christ write the letter to Church, they often quote some verses in old testaments in their letter. All old testament verses that they quoted are come from Septuagint. Isn't it?

If I remember correctly from a podcast I listened to on this topic--I think it was by Fr. Tom Hopko or Fr. Andrew Stephen Damick--Protestants wanted to use the Hebrew translations because they assumed it was closer to the source, when in reality the Hebrew translations they used were settled and agreed upon by Jewish leaders relatively late in history, like around the 11th or 12th century, whereas the Septuagint Greek works are actually much older.

If I remember correctly from a podcast I listened to on this topic--I think it was by Fr. Tom Hopko or Fr. Andrew Stephen Damick--Protestants wanted to use the Hebrew translations because they assumed it was closer to the source, when in reality the Hebrew translations they used were settled and agreed upon by Jewish leaders relatively late in history, like around the 11th or 12th century, whereas the Septuagint Greek works are actually much older.

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Logged

Every formula of every religion has in this age of reason, to submit to the acid test of reason and universal assent.Mahatma Gandhi

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Logged

Every formula of every religion has in this age of reason, to submit to the acid test of reason and universal assent.Mahatma Gandhi

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Did you see my comparisation of Psalm 40:6 and Hebrews 10:5?

according to wiki :

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity. The translation began in the 3rd century BCE and was completed by 132 BCE,[17][18][19] initially in Alexandria, but in time elsewhere as well.

so the later Christians could of translate the OT after the Midrash of the writers of the New Testament.

Logged

Every formula of every religion has in this age of reason, to submit to the acid test of reason and universal assent.Mahatma Gandhi

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Did you see my comparisation of Psalm 40:6 and Hebrews 10:5?

according to wiki :

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity. The translation began in the 3rd century BCE and was completed by 132 BCE,[17][18][19] initially in Alexandria, but in time elsewhere as well.

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Did you see my comparisation of Psalm 40:6 and Hebrews 10:5?

according to wiki :

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity. The translation began in the 3rd century BCE and was completed by 132 BCE,[17][18][19] initially in Alexandria, but in time elsewhere as well.

132 BC is some 150 years before the time of the Apostles.

U missed the 1st part.

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity.

Logged

Every formula of every religion has in this age of reason, to submit to the acid test of reason and universal assent.Mahatma Gandhi

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Did you see my comparisation of Psalm 40:6 and Hebrews 10:5?

according to wiki :

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity. The translation began in the 3rd century BCE and was completed by 132 BCE,[17][18][19] initially in Alexandria, but in time elsewhere as well.

132 BC is some 150 years before the time of the Apostles.

U missed the 1st part.

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity.

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Did you see my comparisation of Psalm 40:6 and Hebrews 10:5?

according to wiki :

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity. The translation began in the 3rd century BCE and was completed by 132 BCE,[17][18][19] initially in Alexandria, but in time elsewhere as well.

132 BC is some 150 years before the time of the Apostles.

U missed the 1st part.

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity.

Wikipedia isn't infallible, you know. Get better sources.

It's not my concern.

the thing is Jewish Midrash often merges two verses into one.. like f.e in Matt 1:22 and the passages of Heb..

Logged

Every formula of every religion has in this age of reason, to submit to the acid test of reason and universal assent.Mahatma Gandhi

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Did you see my comparisation of Psalm 40:6 and Hebrews 10:5?

according to wiki :

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity. The translation began in the 3rd century BCE and was completed by 132 BCE,[17][18][19] initially in Alexandria, but in time elsewhere as well.

132 BC is some 150 years before the time of the Apostles.

U missed the 1st part.

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity.

But the source you quoted says completed by 132 BCE. How do you get that to reconcile with Early Christianity?

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Did you see my comparisation of Psalm 40:6 and Hebrews 10:5?

according to wiki :

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity. The translation began in the 3rd century BCE and was completed by 132 BCE,[17][18][19] initially in Alexandria, but in time elsewhere as well.

132 BC is some 150 years before the time of the Apostles.

U missed the 1st part.

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity.

But the source you quoted says completed by 132 BCE. How do you get that to reconcile with Early Christianity?

the early post apostolic christians modified the text from the OT accordingly to the NT.

anyway the 70(72) apparently translated only the first five books of Moses.

why is the whole Greek OT considered so valuable than?

Logged

Every formula of every religion has in this age of reason, to submit to the acid test of reason and universal assent.Mahatma Gandhi

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Did you see my comparisation of Psalm 40:6 and Hebrews 10:5?

according to wiki :

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity. The translation began in the 3rd century BCE and was completed by 132 BCE,[17][18][19] initially in Alexandria, but in time elsewhere as well.

132 BC is some 150 years before the time of the Apostles.

U missed the 1st part.

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity.

But the source you quoted says completed by 132 BCE. How do you get that to reconcile with Early Christianity?

the early post apostolic christians modified the text from the OT accordingly to the NT.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Yes that's true, the letter of Aristeas clearly states that the 72 Jerusalem scholars only translated the Torah. The rest of the books were translated later, some before Christ and some after.

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

There are many that agree with other OT versions including the Masoretic text. Also "quote" is not the accurate term to use, to "quote" something means to copy the text word-for-word verbatim, there are very few instances of this in the NT, most the "quotes" are actually paraphrases. No one sat down writing their Gospel or Epistle with a text in front of them to copy from, they wrote down what the knew from memory, often paraphrasing the verse for clarification.

The pendulum swings back and forth between the LXX and MT. One really cannot say if one or the other is older.

Yes we can. The LXX is older, but it is a translation while the Masoretic text is not. What can't be said with absolute certainty is which one more accurately represents the original Hebrew autograph as both have errors. What Christian and Jewish apologists overlook but what textual critics take into consideration is the possibility that the LXX and MT were not translated/standardized from the same Hebrew text.

Sorry but that's actually true. The footnotes and side notes I've seen in some Greek manuscripts are enlightening to say the least. Also in most codices the NT is attached to the LXX and that says something right there because the Greek NT and LXX are supposed to be completely separate works. Polemics appears to the be chief reason for the "corrections" to both texts, though the Masoretic isn't free from this either and that's why my favourite OT version is the Peshitta OT because it doesn't have this polemical history behind it, it is a Jewish translation that was accepted by the Syriac Church and was used by both Jews and Christians.

So what? The vast majority of the Jews of the first century used the Septuagint.

Apparently the Jews who translated the septuagint translated only the Torah/Pentateuch(the first five books of the Bible which are ascribed to Moses).. The rest of the books were translated in the following houndreds of years, even on the times or Christians and by early Christians themselves apparently..

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

huh? in whose version?

Did you see my comparisation of Psalm 40:6 and Hebrews 10:5?

according to wiki :

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity. The translation began in the 3rd century BCE and was completed by 132 BCE,[17][18][19] initially in Alexandria, but in time elsewhere as well.

132 BC is some 150 years before the time of the Apostles.

U missed the 1st part.

The translation process of the Septuagint can be broken down into several distinct stages, during which the social milieu of the translators shifted from Hellenistic Judaism to Early Christianity.

But the source you quoted says completed by 132 BCE. How do you get that to reconcile with Early Christianity?

the early post apostolic christians modified the text from the OT accordingly to the NT.

anyway the 70(72) apparently translated only the first five books of Moses.

why is the whole Greek OT considered so valuable than?

I believe that you misunderstand what BCE means. What you quoted says that the Septuagint translation was completed 132 years before Christ. If that's the case, and everything I've read suggests it is, then these were clearly Hellenised Jews and not early Christians - unless you believe that early Christians could travel in time.

James

Logged

We owe greater gratitude to those who humble us, wrong us, and douse us with venom, than to those who nurse us with honour and sweet words, or feed us with tasty food and confections, for bile is the best medicine for our soul. - Elder Paisios of Mount Athos

Apparently not, seeing that many of the other books are quoted in their Septuagint version in the NT.

There are many that agree with other OT versions including the Masoretic text. Also "quote" is not the accurate term to use, to "quote" something means to copy the text word-for-word verbatim, there are very few instances of this in the NT, most the "quotes" are actually paraphrases. No one sat down writing their Gospel or Epistle with a text in front of them to copy from, they wrote down what the knew from memory, often paraphrasing the verse for clarification.[/quote]

Which they did from the Septuagint. The Septuagint is what was out there in the 1st century. Barely anyone could even read Hebrew, especially in the diaspora.