Welcome to The Dragon's List!
If you have not registered on The Dragon's List, the process is fast, easy, and free!
You can register by clicking here.
If you have already registered you can log in by clicking here.

Moderator

The movement afoot now is to go gluten-free. Advocates are saying that it promotes health and weight loss and for athletes it boosts performance.

I've nixed bread and anything made with wheat flour from my own diet (except on my cheat day). It's not really gluten free, since gluten is found in a whole lot of things you wouldn't expect. But I've had good results with weight loss so far and as a bonus my chronically bothersome sinuses have calmed way down.

But does that mean bread is the culprit in my allergies and difficulty losing weight? Or is it just a typical result of replacing 80% or so of the processed foods in my diet with fresh or low-carb foods?

Zhi Te Fa - BaGua Zhang

I have seen some work that puts forth the position that certain modern ailments only showed up in the bone record and references when hunter gatherers became agrarian. Not that cultivated grain alone, fostered a host of modern ailments, just a theory that has been thrown around recently. I think agrarian lifestyle may have changed the activity levels and periodically, as populations have historically become more sedentary, additional physical problems show up. Like our modern increase in rheumatoid like diseases, diabetes, obesity, heart disease and others. The theory of de-evolution is based in the prophylactic treatment of normally lethal ailments. Treatments, that do not cure the ailment but, do prolong the life of the afflicted. Many of which, live to pass on these conditions to offspring who in turn weaken the general genetic pool. Without prophylactic treatments these patients would normally die some of which, not surviving to pass on these weak genetic tendencies. Excluding non-genetic based conditions but, not non-genetic conditions that other genetic factors tend to protect individuals from these ailments.

What I have come to find is typically when someone makes the effort to change one thing in there diet...ie. no meat, no bread, no sweats, no gluten, etc. There is usually other healthy changes.

I personally am trying to get away from bleached white flower. In fact I personally am trying to go towards a less processed foods type thing. I hate ever telling myself I cant have something because thats usually the time I start just craving it.

I personally believe any food that is heavily processed is just a bad idea. I'm not going to say its bad for you but a bad idea. One thing I have found through my research, is that homemade bread is better than the store bought brand name breads. I know I found that switching to all natural whole wheat foods just seemed better on me than the cheaper, more common alternatives.

I love a Philly Cheesesteak sandwich. And it has to have extra onions & greenpeppers and lots of provalone cheese on it as well as extra mayonaise. Yummy. Arby's has a good one. They just switched to using angus beef in thiers.

Moderator

certain modern ailments only showed up in the bone record and references when hunter gatherers became agrarian

A whole lot going on there... living on top of animals much more closely, living in larger, closer groups, having to deal with environment polution... the list is huge. Last time I read up on it the concensus seemed it was difficult to explain why people switched - unless you agreed with the guys who bothered to study current hunter gatherer tribes and noticed things like the high incidence of terminal violence within the group.

I still think Pollan got it right "Eat food, mostly plants, not too much" the rest is personal choice and absence of any thoroughly conclusive evidence.

As for bread - do whatever works for you. I love the stuff though I buy quality and I've a bias towards wholemeal spelt. I don't have much time to spend cooking and a tasty source of carbohydrate I can put on a plate in under 30 seconds is something I have no intention to give up.

I eat bread and pastas in moderation but believe grains like wheat or corn are not healthy for humans or most omnivorous animals. For instance they make grain free dog and cat foods that have potatoes, pumpkins, sweat potatoes, or garbanzo beans as a filler instead of wheat, corn, or rice. These foods have been made for animals that have skin allergies and stomach issues and the foods actually work quite well after a month or two of feeding. Since I've personally seen major improvements in people's pets on these foods it's led me to believe that corn and wheat aren't healthy in large quantities and even rice is questionable.

An ideal diet would be one with lots of vegies, fruits, mushrooms, nuts, tubers, and animal proteins because this is what the hunters and gathers would have been able to collect and is what our stomachs have evolved to digest. In evolutionary terms grains are still a newer item to the human diet.

The bread in Europe is so good. The hard crusty type bread, served with extra-virgin olive oil with some herbs in it so you can dip the bread and then eat it is so good. And a good glass of wine to go with it helps. I prefer a white zinfindel or a chardonnay.

Moderator

Visiting Germany a few years ago I went to the grocery store with my sis-in-law ridiculously early in the morning. Didn't know why until I saw the crowd of people at the bakery section. We bought just one meusli roll (like a multigrain roll with whole seeds in it) for each person back at the house, which I thought wasn't enough, but with butter & cold cuts it filled me up for most of the day.

Germany has pretty strict laws about how its bread is produced, where the wheat comes from, etc. And it seemed no one kept bread in their house. They bought what they needed for the day and that was it.

I've been trying to convince my in laws into making there own pondasaw (SP?) rolls. as we go across town to get them and there easy enough to make its a bit of a waste of gas. The health benefits I don't even bother mentioning to them since it seems I get blown off about that stuff anyway.

But making your own rolls, biscuits, and breads fresh is my favorite way to go...it is a bit time consuming but I think they taste better and are definitely healthier.

Zhi Te Fa - BaGua Zhang

Yes the common diets world wide are generally high in grains, the typical Asian diet is no exception. What I was referring to is the various Yogi, mystic, shamic and Daoist diets that recommend the reduction and stepwise removal of grains from the diet.

There has been some new interest in the pre-grain diets, as cures for modern health issues. Daoists consider a grain free diet essential for reaching the higher levels of spiritual perfection. Yet, some Daoist diets add back in a small amount of grains back in solely or in combination with a limited or substandard amounts of additional foods. At this stage the diet is called the "air and dew diet" do to the unbelievable little food volume that is consumed. Daoists in general recomend a reduction in food volume beginning in middle age and in additional reductions every five years thereafter.

Zhi Te Fa - BaGua Zhang

Yes, part of a Daoist lifestyle is to starve the three worms also, called hungry Ghosts, Daemons and ills that live in the three DienTien regions. The Five Grains are looked at, as promoters of intestinal waste and feed the Daemon-worm of the lower DienTien. If you feed this Daemon it will in turn shorten your life by it becoming stronger than you yourself. Once you die (more quickly by grains) the hungry ghosts feed upon your corpus. The faster you die the better it is for the hungry ghosts.

The middle DienTien worm is also, a feeder of grain by-products, which causes the release of waste products that stimulate desire, longing and lust for more of everything. That worm breeds attachment to the material things of the world and you in turn hunger for them.

The top most DienTien has a worm that is in turn stimulated by the wiggling of the two lower worms this causes worry and anxiety about life and the world and how much of each you can have and get. And, together these three worms shorten the length and quality of your life. The Daoist way is to starve the worms.