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Re: The Red Sox Thread

Well, I think FIP has big problems as a stat, but I was talking about his development as a pitcher. When he first came up, he had a great change and not much else

In 2010, his fangraph pitch vales showed FB as +17, the change as +6.8 and the slider as + 4.1

In short he developed very good stuff. Compare that arc to Phil Hughes "progress" and tell me we wouldn't be overjoyed if Phil had that type or arsenal?

He actually looked pretty good his start before yesterday. At least he did through 6. Bobby V, in what seems to be developing into a recurring theme, left him in long after he had obviously gassed. That aside, he looked very good. The big difference in that game was that he had good FB control. He's had other games where his curve or change were sharp, but that's not good enough. He can't get by without FB control.

I really don't know what is wrong with him beyond that, but I do believe he is hurt and I'm leaning toward his back. He looks weak and frail and appears to have lost around 20 pounds. I'm wondering if he lost some mass and strength that recurring back problems have prevented him from regaining.

This is all just conjecture on my part, but the only injury I've ever had that directly correlated with loss of muscle mass was a back injury. Clay's injury was a hell of a lot worse than mine was and I believe it is still bothering him.

Re: The Red Sox Thread

Originally Posted by Bronson'sCornrows

He actually looked pretty good his start before yesterday. At least he did through 6. Bobby V, in what seems to be developing into a recurring theme, left him in long after he had obviously gassed. That aside, he looked very good. The big difference in that game was that he had good FB control. He's had other games where his curve or change were sharp, but that's not good enough. He can't get by without FB control.

I really don't know what is wrong with him beyond that, but I do believe he is hurt and I'm leaning toward his back. He looks weak and frail and appears to have lost around 20 pounds. I'm wondering if he lost some mass and strength that recurring back problems have prevented him from regaining.

This is all just conjecture on my part, but the only injury I've ever had that directly correlated with loss of muscle mass was a back injury. Clay's injury was a hell of a lot worse than mine was and I believe it is still bothering him.

Hard to believe he had 20 spare pounds to lose

I didn't see the last start, but the first part had to be encouraging. There was no carryover to the next one, though. He had absolutely nothing

IDK about the back injury and loss of muscle mass. If it were pain reducing mobility, there's ways around that- isolated weight machines like Nautilis or swimming acould get around that

If it's a nerve problem causing muscle wasting, you'd expect it to be the legs only

Wull be interesting to see how much rope they give him- they're not paying him very much this year and next

Re: The Red Sox Thread

I didn't see the last start, but the first part had to be encouraging. There was no carryover to the next one, though. He had absolutely nothing

Nothing at all. Mediocre FB control, no nasty change to put guys away. He seemed pretty angry about not getting a lot of borderline calls and close (but legitimate) balls, too. At least he seems to be as frustrated as I am after I watch him.

Originally Posted by ieddyi

IDK about the back injury and loss of muscle mass. If it were pain reducing mobility, there's ways around that- isolated weight machines like Nautilis or swimming acould get around that

If it's a nerve problem causing muscle wasting, you'd expect it to be the legs only

Wull be interesting to see how much rope they give him- they're not paying him very much this year and next

They could, but swimming is such an endurance demanding, aerobic exercise that I don't see it helping a naturally lanky guy maintain bulk. I guess you could fall back on a Nautilus or Bowflex type machine in an emergency situation, but it certainly isn't optimal.

Again, though, this is all conjecture on my part. Sox management and Buchholz are steadfastly denying any injury, so maybe I'm talking out of my ass on this one. I just know he looks like a guy who is hurt and he also looks a bit smaller and more frail physically. I don't know what other Sox fans think about the matter (please chime in here if you think I'm wrong!), but I was talking to my best friend about yesterday and he agreed that Clay looks like a guy trying to work through a nagging injury.

Either way, the Sox need to come up with some blister or unspecified shoulder injury to 15 day the guy and give him some rest. Maybe some side sessions would do him some good, I don't know. I just know I don't want to watch him start right now.

Re: The Red Sox Thread

Originally Posted by wang+cano=future

Is Middlebrooks 100% getting sent back when Youkilis comes off the DL?

I doubt this keeps up, anyway. He's got absolutely no strike zone control. His minor-league numbers show very little plate discipline combined with little skill for contact. His swing-and-miss numbers were awful last year (114 strikeouts to 26 walks in 472 plate appearances). Guys like will often come up and make some noise, but once pitchers figure out how to pitch to them, they turn into Jeff Francoeur.

Re: The Red Sox Thread

Originally Posted by RenoHightower

I doubt this keeps up, anyway. He's got absolutely no strike zone control. His minor-league numbers show very little plate discipline combined with little skill for contact. His swing-and-miss numbers were awful last year (114 strikeouts to 26 walks in 472 plate appearances). Guys like will often come up and make some noise, but once pitchers figure out how to pitch to them, they turn into Jeff Francoeur.

A lot of Sox fans might be tempted to, but it's tough as hell to pin that loss on Fat Albers. Dude has been unbelievable this season and has been overworked lately. If Bard had focused on the batters instead of the baserunners, at least one (probably two) of those runs in the second doesn't happen and he probably doesn't walk Gordon on four pitches to set the table for that 3 run shot.

It's interesting to note that Bob McClure has focused on helping the pitching staff work at holding runners. Bard took things way too far and it ended up costing us last night.

Re: The Red Sox Thread

Josh might be headed for the trading block.

According to a report by 98.5 The Sports Hub's Hardy, Red Sox righthander Josh Beckett played golf in the area last Thursday afternoon, two days before he was scheduled to miss a start against the Orioles because of stiffness in his latissimus muscle.