This place is boring, and that wasn't always the case. Perhaps it is because the stronger personalities seem absent, or perhaps it is because the new format is less "personable" then the old one. Possibly both. It's hard to say that the quality of the "site" has itself deteriorated, but to the extent that the quality of the content impacts the quality of the site itself has deteriorated, so has the site quality in the same manor. DoubleR pointed out to me once that I just have a tendency to be nostalgic, and I think that could be what's going on here, but where is Danielle? Where is The Fool? Where is JacksonRaine or Ren? I'm not saying that I love everyone here, but there are some people who made this site worth coming too. Seeing a lot of hyperbolic bullsh!t or pseudo-intelectual ramblings just doesn't cut it for me. Sorry CodyFranklin, SocialPinko and the rest of you who post in the philosophy forum. Even worse is when I see people intentionally try to kill threads (I'm calling you out SP), for whatever reason. What a fvcking brilliant way to scare off new members!

I'm liking F-16 more and more though. His are genuinely good contributions, and they stand as a stark contrast to others. 16k is still alright in my book... but what of the lot of you who ran ScottyDouglass off? Wtf? Is it your sole purpose in life to achieve ideological homogeneity? What a dreadful state of affairs that would be. We NEED people with whom to disagree, and with whom we can disagree in an environment where no one is going to either (1) make it personal or (2) take it personally. That's a necessary prerequisite to debate.

But then again, the adolescent mentality about the lot of you all is profound. There are "cliques" that are formed, who target and isolate "enemies" and devote efforts and energy to making that member whom they desire to target there "subject" of focus. It's the same bullsh!t you all pulled with the Fool. Granted, I think some of the more emotionally sensitive members also played a role in that instance, but the point remains.

BossyBurrito is hilarious as always. Keep up the good work. WallStreetAthiest is also alright in my book too. He's got fantastic taste in music, and therefore his predilection for profanity (when studied in an academic context is at once understandable and forgivable). WriterSelbe is cool, although I would like to see more content. Freedo, I'm worried, man. I really am. I need something that will make me want to sign on, and you used to be one of the reasons, but now... there is nothing to work with. Ron Paul, you irritate me, but in a good way. Post more stuff and argue with more people. Thett, I need to hear more too. Yours is a perspective that DDO should hear from with more persistent regularity. Royal Palidin, I'm bored. Be more creative.

And guess what, if you got pissed reading this... GOOD! Get angry! Post on the forums! Tell me WHY I'm wrong and take action! BE more active, in sum! Sooner rather then later! DDO should be a place that is fun and interesting, and it seems that we have taken a turn for the worst in my period of hiatus.

What a vague and ambiguous statement. WHY is it (whatever 'it' is) interesting? Elaborate! And if you're afraid that someone is going to lash out at you, do not fear, I'm more aggressive than anyone here (ask around, lol) and I have no qualms about intervening on your behalf. All of this because, at heart, I'm interested in getting to the bottom of why the bottom fell out of of DDO.

What a vague and ambiguous statement. WHY is it (whatever 'it' is) interesting? Elaborate! And if you're afraid that someone is going to lash out at you, do not fear, I'm more aggressive than anyone here (ask around, lol) and I have no qualms about intervening on your behalf. All of this because, at heart, I'm interested in getting to the bottom of why the bottom fell out of of DDO.

I just started here today. My input is not important enough because I am yet a youngin here. I thought your thoughts and input were interesting. I know nothing of what you are talking about but felt the passion in your eagerness to boost the site. I find that interesting. I liked it.

I'd be willing to bet that it is not so much that the quality has dropped, but that it has lost its novelty. It is the same members that always seem to be here. They offer the same views that they always have and have nothing new to spark interest (that has to come from new members).

What a vague and ambiguous statement. WHY is it (whatever 'it' is) interesting? Elaborate! And if you're afraid that someone is going to lash out at you, do not fear, I'm more aggressive than anyone here (ask around, lol) and I have no qualms about intervening on your behalf. All of this because, at heart, I'm interested in getting to the bottom of why the bottom fell out of of DDO.

I just started here today. My input is not important enough because I am yet a youngin here. I thought your thoughts and input were interesting. I know nothing of what you are talking about but felt the passion in your eagerness to boost the site. I find that interesting. I liked it.

What a vague and ambiguous statement. WHY is it (whatever 'it' is) interesting? Elaborate! And if you're afraid that someone is going to lash out at you, do not fear, I'm more aggressive than anyone here (ask around, lol) and I have no qualms about intervening on your behalf. All of this because, at heart, I'm interested in getting to the bottom of why the bottom fell out of of DDO.

I just started here today. My input is not important enough because I am yet a youngin here. I thought your thoughts and input were interesting. I know nothing of what you are talking about but felt the passion in your eagerness to boost the site. I find that interesting. I liked it.

What a vague and ambiguous statement. WHY is it (whatever 'it' is) interesting? Elaborate! And if you're afraid that someone is going to lash out at you, do not fear, I'm more aggressive than anyone here (ask around, lol) and I have no qualms about intervening on your behalf. All of this because, at heart, I'm interested in getting to the bottom of why the bottom fell out of of DDO.

I just started here today. My input is not important enough because I am yet a youngin here. I thought your thoughts and input were interesting. I know nothing of what you are talking about but felt the passion in your eagerness to boost the site. I find that interesting. I liked it.

This place used to be fantastic. We had real conservatives, extreme liberals, libertarians, socialists and everything in-between. Now? We have a few petulant teenagers who run people off the site they don't like, who ought to be old enough to know better. Even worse, we have people who kill threads (for reasons that, if tempted, I might be inclined to explore at greater depth). Running ScottyDouglass off was a threshold moment, as I see it. He was a fairly socially conservative religious man whose perspective the site benefited from, but was taunted by the band of wannabe intellectuals of DDO. I'm about diversity, in the truest sense of the word. I like people who have strong opinions -even ostensibly crazy ones- that they are willing to express. Dialogues between contrasting perspectives are important, but this propensity to alienate and silence those with whom -some- disagree is disconcerting.

Other AWESOME members in the past: DoubleR, Ore-Ele, RoyLatham (though he never had a real presence in the forums), Cliff.Stamp, Kleptin, Koopin (before all his posts read kfc and nothing more), and etc. Now? We have wanna-be philosophers and future Arthur Schlessingers (and one potential Jacques Derrida, if Derrida had an IQ of 101). It's disgraceful.

What a vague and ambiguous statement. WHY is it (whatever 'it' is) interesting? Elaborate! And if you're afraid that someone is going to lash out at you, do not fear, I'm more aggressive than anyone here (ask around, lol) and I have no qualms about intervening on your behalf. All of this because, at heart, I'm interested in getting to the bottom of why the bottom fell out of of DDO.

I just started here today. My input is not important enough because I am yet a youngin here. I thought your thoughts and input were interesting. I know nothing of what you are talking about but felt the passion in your eagerness to boost the site. I find that interesting. I liked it.

What a vague and ambiguous statement. WHY is it (whatever 'it' is) interesting? Elaborate! And if you're afraid that someone is going to lash out at you, do not fear, I'm more aggressive than anyone here (ask around, lol) and I have no qualms about intervening on your behalf. All of this because, at heart, I'm interested in getting to the bottom of why the bottom fell out of of DDO.

I just started here today. My input is not important enough because I am yet a youngin here. I thought your thoughts and input were interesting. I know nothing of what you are talking about but felt the passion in your eagerness to boost the site. I find that interesting. I liked it.

This place used to be fantastic. We had real conservatives, extreme liberals, libertarians, socialists and everything in-between. Now? We have a few petulant teenagers who run people off the site they don't like, who ought to be old enough to know better. Even worse, we have people who kill threads (for reasons that, if tempted, I might be inclined to explore at greater depth). Running ScottyDouglass off was a threshold moment, as I see it. He was a fairly socially conservative religious man whose perspective the site benefited from, but was taunted by the band of wannabe intellectuals of DDO. I'm about diversity, in the truest sense of the word. I like people who have strong opinions -even ostensibly crazy ones- that they are willing to express. Dialogues between contrasting perspectives are important, but this propensity to alienate and silence those with whom -some- disagree is disconcerting.

Other AWESOME members in the past: DoubleR, Ore-Ele, RoyLatham (though he never had a real presence in the forums), Cliff.Stamp, Kleptin, Koopin (before all his posts read kfc and nothing more), and etc. Now? We have wanna-be philosophers and future Arthur Schlessingers (and one potential Jacques Derrida, if Derrida had an IQ of 101). It's disgraceful.

I understand and I agree. I just like to chat and I am interested in debating. I just found this site while browsing.

To label the forums completely dull is, as you noted you are prone to, nostalgic of you, even when somewhat rationalised.

If I remember one of our discussions awhile back you explicitly stated to another member that 'your personal experience is meaningless' . Now, it's a different situation here, but it still seems awfully hypocritical on your part here. Doublethink?

Now, I grant that your subjective stance, upon which value is predicated, may well be that the forums have declined, or become dull. In some senses I would heartily agree, nevertheless, I must reprimand you for utilising rose-coloured glasses.

However, like your old posts which I may have often disagreed with in part yet respected, you make some good points. There is a sort of ideological homogeneity on DDO, like you said. Many people deride those who hold alternate views. If you're one against 5, and you fail to respond to all 5 and then 2 or 3 of them declare that you 'haven't responded' , the others note this again and again over multiple discussion threads and you have an issue. Sheer arrogance and presumptiveness gets people nowhere. Sadly, nuanced and subtle views are often not understood, and are ignored. Much less chance that you'll respond if you agree with most of what somebody says. Nevertheless, you'll assert your own position, not the subtle / unrefuted position.

Of course, this post probably won't make your blood boil YYW. Perhaps I'm just too dull a member of this website, eh?

"Tis not in mortals to command success
But we"ll do more, Sempronius, we"ll deserve it

At 10/5/2012 1:24:49 AM, Logic_on_rails wrote:To label the forums completely dull is, as you noted you are prone to, nostalgic of you, even when somewhat rationalised.

If I remember one of our discussions awhile back you explicitly stated to another member that 'your personal experience is meaningless'.

That sounds like something I have said, but also sounds taken out of context. Generally when I say something like that is when I am avoiding saying something to the effect of "you're so-called personal experience is implausible bullsh!t and as such I am reasonably sure you are lying." Saying "your personal experience is meaningless" is a nicer way of establishing the same logical consequence without invoking the -unnecessary- emotionally charged backdraft.

Now, it's a different situation here, but it still seems awfully hypocritical on your part here. Doublethink?

I have never claimed to be perfect, and I have changed my mind a lot. Oh, sh!t... I'm flip-flopping. Call the inconsistency police! But really, I don't have values, positions, stances or subscribe to any ideology other than consequenialsim (which is a loose ideology at best).

Now, I grant that your subjective stance, upon which value is predicated, may well be that the forums have declined, or become dull. In some senses I would heartily agree, nevertheless, I must reprimand you for utilising rose-coloured glasses.

You must "reprimand" me? Oh, brilliant! It's like one of those sado-masochistic episodes of caning in british prep-schools. How lovely. We should write a 50 shades of DDO next. But nevertheless, lol, in all seriousness, when I make a conescending remark like the one you mentioned (which I can't recall doing, but it does sound like me, so I'll operate here pursuant to that condition) I'm usually substituting it for something more -well, for lack of any other way of describing it- personally malicious.

However, like your old posts which I may have often disagreed with in part yet respected, you make some good points.

I'm quite flattered.

There is a sort of ideological homogeneity on DDO, like you said. Many people deride those who hold alternate views. If you're one against 5, and you fail to respond to all 5 and then 2 or 3 of them declare that you 'haven't responded' , the others note this again and again over multiple discussion threads and you have an issue.

Very interesting, although the premise that a dropped argument constitutes a lost argument is bullsh!t. If the premise to be countered was itself nonsense, then of what value is it to waste character space expressing its idiocy? None. I recognize that's a controversial view, but it is and has always been the way I see things. That has a significant impact on how I judge debates, as well. To the best of my knowledge, though, I have never been counter vote bombed, even when I gave 7pt losses.

Sheer arrogance and presumptiveness gets people nowhere.

In most workplaces, that's correct. In politics or academia, not so much. The bold go farther then the conformists or the team players. Those who directly challenge others are usually the ones who make names for themselves. Granted, arrogance and presumptiveness needs to be backed up with ambition, resolve and a savvy work ethic -but all are necessary prerequisites to advancement within (any truly competitive) infrastructure. Yes, you will make enemies in that process. Yes, doing so is acceptable.

Sadly, nuanced and subtle views are often not understood, and are ignored.

I am only nuanced and subtile in regards to RP, because anything more and she might loose her cool. (lol, that was a joke). But there is value in the understated, although it is often overlooked, indeed.

Much less chance that you'll respond if you agree with most of what somebody says. Nevertheless, you'll assert your own position, not the subtle / unrefuted position. Of course, this post probably won't make your blood boil YYW. Perhaps I'm just too dull a member of this website, eh?

Nothing makes my blood boil on DDO. I'm not looking to boil mine of any other's blood. I'm looking to make this site worth coming to again. There are changes that must take place in order for that to happen. We NEED new members, strong new members, who should be welcomed to the community with open arms. We NEEd diverse members, for all ideological backgrounds, however fringe-oriented, to contribute and so so under the expectation that NOTHING on the internet should be taken personally.

We need fierce debaters who viscerally and accurately argue their points so as to facilitate a dialogue between positions of contrast (however great or small) in both the debates or the forums. What I don't want are 18 or 19 year old passive aggressive INTJ's banding together to form a mob of Lenninist conformity. (the school of thought that argues that either conform of be gone).

Recognize, though, that it's not only your fault. Oberherr contributed too, as did others. Others are just as guilty though. That is unacceptable when newer members have started the topics. We want new members, yes? We want them to feel welcome. We want them to share their thoughts and ideas and feel free to do so without fear of reprisal.

K. That wasn't meant to literally end the thread. It's a joke of sorts. Furthermore I posted further analysis later on. Far from enough to cite as a general characteristic of my posts.

So what you're saying is that you were just being an assdouche for no higher cause than being an assdouche? Disappointing, SP. The point, though, isn't to convict you of high crimes or even low misdemeanors. It's to get you and others NOT to discourage others from posting.