Currently in news lately there's been loads of issues about migration to Norway and religion, cultures that they bring which may hurt Norway as a nation. Basically, they demand us to change our lives to meet theirs, which I personally think is wrong. This is what I would call sneakislamifying. Already in some countries which used to be based on Christianity, like England have already adapted to Muslim laws because the political correctness is stopping them from saying no. This is also happening in Norway, we almost got Hijab in the police uniform, but the change was reset because there was so much commotion and nobody wanted it.

Here's a list of changes the Muslims have demanded so far
* Less freedom of speech (Blasphemy law)
* Seperate care for the Muslim elders
* Halal-food served in Norwegian prisons
* Alcoholfree days - Some days where no shops can sell alcohol
* Make Muslim holidays national
* Sex-split swimming pools
* Praying in their workspace
* Sharia Courts
* They want their own banks
* Imam education

This is what that have been pointed out as sneakislamifying of Norway. Many of these points have already been approved in Countries such as England and it's starting here in Norway too. So what I ask that; is the current government party too naive and is afraid to be political correct? or is it simply that all the citizen wants it?

The way I look at it is that we have a problem to integrate those whom come from Muslim countries, we pack them up in suburban places and pack them all together so it's hard for them to adapt to the new society they have come to. As of Norway, we do have Ghetto's and Oslo the capital of Norway is filled with them, but mostly just in certain places of Oslo. What I believe is that if we spread them all around the country they would have had it easier to learn the language and fit more into the Norwegian society, but we don't we pack them all in the same place.

Freedom of speech is something Norway managed to obtain in 1814 and I'm proud that I live in a country as good as this. Now they want us to remove some of that little freedom of speech we have left, by re-instating the blasphemy law (Yes, we used to have it, but we have secularized our society so we removed it) and I believe that this is just a start, and more will follow if we give in (at least when it comes to radical Muslims). Our government is made of 3 parties in Norway, two of the parties have worked for a secularized society, but they want to give in and "religify" the country yet again. Are they just hypocrites or are they afraid of being political correct?

When it comes to serving halal-food in prisons I don't think we should. 30 % of the people in Norwegian prisons are made of migrates whom demands special treatment for their illegal crimes. You are there to learn a lesson or something (I haven't been to jail so I don't know). This goes for all religions, not just Muslims. When you serve your time, you sit there and be quiet.

I'll try my best to explain what I know about the Sharia Courts; As I see it is that Islam is not just an religion, it's a political system that does not support freedom of speech and believe in uppression of women. Such judging shall not take one step into Norway, when they cross the Norway border they should leave their old politic system behind and adapt to the laws of Norway works and not try to make us instate a law order which does not support women at all.

They want their own banks that does not have rents, because that's not allowed by their religion or something, I'm not too updated on the subject, so if anyone wanna fill me in, please do!

Now I want you to understand that I did not create this thread to bash Muslims or anything like that, this is something I've wanted to discuss for a very long time, but I haven't had the guts to say anything due to the political correctness throughout the world. Ever since the incident about Hijab in the police uniform, the party "Fremskrittpartiet" in Norway have set critisism of Islam on the daily agenda it is now easier to discuss these things. That's how I feel. Now, I do not know about the situation much in other places than Norway and England so I would like to hear your thoughts on this. I have been reading some on hwo the situation is in the US and I was lead to this movie I found on Youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SoPrMEkz5s

This pretty much explains what's happening in Norway and what might be prevented if the right party comes into the government this year. There have also been made some prognosis on the current flow of immigrants coming into Norway each year (which is about 25,000 each year) then there will be more immigrants in Norway by 2050. This is pretty scary when it comes to ethnic Norwegian. Being a minority in your own country is something I don't want to happen and with fresh Muslim political parties starting up which works for their own agenda gives us an idea of what's happening.

I really want some comments back on this on what you views are, and if you're a Muslim please help me debate this issue!

i do think this shall answer why such stuff happened.

the government of yours, since you did said there were 3 parties, would most likely be republic or democracy kind. and being that kind, the party surely would want more people to vote for them. hence, tons of compromises.

with the muslim immigrants going into your country, it is safe to say it would change the political status of parties... therefore, it is also safe to say that those parties would want the muslim to vote for them. hence, they would give the muslims what they wanted in return for their vote so they can rule. easy to understand? give and take.

there is unlikely any way to stop such crisis from happening due to the fact that it is a "democracy" or "republic". with the majority voting, persons that knows what should be done cannot change anything much.

It doesn't quite work that way in Scandinavia. A government usually consist of 2-3-4 parties gaining the majority of the votes, it's not one way or the other.

Furthermore, we have a long history and culture, contrary to USA. And the kind of muslim immigrants we recieve, does not believe in the same things as muslim in USA (generally speaking of course). The muslims in denmark have often grown up far out on the country where they came from, where the believes are very, very oldfashioned. As in, women don't leave the house, they don't talk to men, they don't complain or go against the husband or the sons, they DO NOT have sex, else they may be killed, and so on... That's why it is a very serious issue...

if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

o0James0o wrote:
if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

Do you actually believe what you just said? If not, then don't even subject others into doing something that you won't even do on your own. Those suicide bombers showed more determination than you ever could, and that's not even an argument because they're all dead, while you're still very much alive.

o0James0o wrote:
if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

Do you actually believe what you just said? If not, then don't even subject others into doing something that you won't even do on your own. Those suicide bombers showed more determination than you ever could, and that's not even an argument because they're all dead, while you're still very much alive.

yes, i do believe in what i said... i am giving others advices, rather or not they listen is their problem. suicide bombers show more determination? those kind of idiots? dont make me laugh. heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

yes, like you said, it is no longer an argument because theyre dead. hence, theyre good men. why? because theyre dead!

o0James0o wrote:
if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

Do you actually believe what you just said? If not, then don't even subject others into doing something that you won't even do on your own. Those suicide bombers showed more determination than you ever could, and that's not even an argument because they're all dead, while you're still very much alive.

yes, i do believe in what i said... i am giving others advices, rather or not they listen is their problem. suicide bombers show more determination? those kind of idiots? dont make me laugh. heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

yes, like you said, it is no longer an argument because theyre dead. hence, theyre good men. why? because theyre dead!

...Chill dude, the problem of this thread is how to prevent the 'islami-fication' of certain European countries. Not to get rid of Muslims themselves. While I can see your point, in practice, that's a whole new ball game altogether.

...Back to the thread, while I can see the value of respecting other people's beliefs, making the country's leaders bow down to their wishes to each and every little nitpick they have is far too much. Immigrants should learn how to conform, or if not conform, fit in the country they moved in, not the other way around. The religious tolerance can be stretched to show respect to their beliefs but this doesn't apply to the overall welfare of the country, such as laws concerning every citizen. My suggestion is to 'hint' to them that this is Norway, and not Saudi Arabia, majority of the population are Europeans and natives and religion and state are as separate as it could be.

o0James0o wrote:
if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

Do you actually believe what you just said? If not, then don't even subject others into doing something that you won't even do on your own. Those suicide bombers showed more determination than you ever could, and that's not even an argument because they're all dead, while you're still very much alive.

yes, i do believe in what i said... i am giving others advices, rather or not they listen is their problem. suicide bombers show more determination? those kind of idiots? dont make me laugh. heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

yes, like you said, it is no longer an argument because theyre dead. hence, theyre good men. why? because theyre dead!

...Chill dude, the problem of this thread is how to prevent the 'islami-fication' of certain European countries. Not to get rid of Muslims themselves. While I can see your point, in practice, that's a whole new ball game altogether.

...Back to the thread, while I can see the value of respecting other people's beliefs, making the country's leaders bow down to their wishes to each and every little nitpick they have is far too much. Immigrants should learn how to conform, or if not conform, fit in the country they moved in, not the other way around. The religious tolerance can be stretched to show respect to their beliefs but this doesn't apply to the overall welfare of the country, such as laws concerning every citizen. My suggestion is to 'hint' to them that this is Norway, and not Saudi Arabia, majority of the population are Europeans and natives and religion and state are as separate as it could be.

you cant prevent such unless you start some muslim exclusion act, but heck, how do you know if someone's muslim? well then, lets start the middle eastern exclusion act, or immigration exclusion act...

but you do know, laws are meant to be broken, if not, why be law enforcement and laws in the first place? hence, exclusion might help a bit but it wont help a lot. the best way to stop them is to stop their source, hence, genocide.

im not anti muslim or anything, im just speaking of the truth.

true that in pratice thats a whole new ball game, but it isnt unachieveable, if one have strong allies and is strong in itself... if not, lets just stick with the exclusion acts...

or maybe, tho this isnt really a nice option, lets create a muslim town!! but hey, when they gain more influences, you ought to bow down to their demand either way...

o0James0o wrote:
if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

Do you actually believe what you just said? If not, then don't even subject others into doing something that you won't even do on your own. Those suicide bombers showed more determination than you ever could, and that's not even an argument because they're all dead, while you're still very much alive.

yes, i do believe in what i said... i am giving others advices, rather or not they listen is their problem. suicide bombers show more determination? those kind of idiots? dont make me laugh. heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

yes, like you said, it is no longer an argument because theyre dead. hence, theyre good men. why? because theyre dead!

...Chill dude, the problem of this thread is how to prevent the 'islami-fication' of certain European countries. Not to get rid of Muslims themselves. While I can see your point, in practice, that's a whole new ball game altogether.

...Back to the thread, while I can see the value of respecting other people's beliefs, making the country's leaders bow down to their wishes to each and every little nitpick they have is far too much. Immigrants should learn how to conform, or if not conform, fit in the country they moved in, not the other way around. The religious tolerance can be stretched to show respect to their beliefs but this doesn't apply to the overall welfare of the country, such as laws concerning every citizen. My suggestion is to 'hint' to them that this is Norway, and not Saudi Arabia, majority of the population are Europeans and natives and religion and state are as separate as it could be.

you cant prevent such unless you start some muslim exclusion act, but heck, how do you know if someone's muslim? well then, lets start the middle eastern exclusion act, or immigration exclusion act...

but you do know, laws are meant to be broken, if not, why be law enforcement and laws in the first place? hence, exclusion might help a bit but it wont help a lot. the best way to stop them is to stop their source, hence, genocide.

im not anti muslim or anything, im just speaking of the truth.

true that in pratice thats a whole new ball game, but it isnt unachieveable, if one have strong allies and is strong in itself... if not, lets just stick with the exclusion acts...

or maybe, tho this isnt really a nice option, lets create a muslim town!! but hey, when they gain more influences, you ought to bow down to their demand either way...

Um...genocide is like equal to dropping atomic bombs on some highly populated place here on earth and therefore not acceptable. That could cost any country who decides to do that ousting from the UN and possible WWIII from the angered Muslim nations [which are definitely many and well-armed btw, think of Iran].
But the one about the Muslim Town? I don't think it's needed, from what I can gather, the Muslims cited here are like extremists and seclude themselves willingly. No need to worry about them further influencing others.
It would be a big problem though if one of them got elected in a position in a government [not that I'm saying Muslims in office in European governments are bad] and turned out to be an extreme radical and a fascist. That would be bad.
And about the exclusion act you've mentioned--not possible. Human rights groups would charge them with racial and religious discrimination and this would only bring more cause and sympathy for Muslims.
But there is an alternative to the one you're proposing. The government should limit immigrants, no questions asked. If they're so damn worried about the Muslim population going out of hand then limit the Muslims coming in. Apart from that, they should issue strict rules about orienting immigrants to their way of life. Not necessarily convert them or secularize them to something that violates their beliefs, but give them guidelines of what is acceptable religious zealotry for their part. Most of these Muslims are old-fashioned from what I can gather and place their religion over others. So the government should try its best on how these Muslims can follow their religion and chosne lifestyle but without drastically affecting others in their area as well.

o0James0o wrote:
if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

Do you actually believe what you just said? If not, then don't even subject others into doing something that you won't even do on your own. Those suicide bombers showed more determination than you ever could, and that's not even an argument because they're all dead, while you're still very much alive.

yes, i do believe in what i said... i am giving others advices, rather or not they listen is their problem. suicide bombers show more determination? those kind of idiots? dont make me laugh. heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

yes, like you said, it is no longer an argument because theyre dead. hence, theyre good men. why? because theyre dead!

...Chill dude, the problem of this thread is how to prevent the 'islami-fication' of certain European countries. Not to get rid of Muslims themselves. While I can see your point, in practice, that's a whole new ball game altogether.

...Back to the thread, while I can see the value of respecting other people's beliefs, making the country's leaders bow down to their wishes to each and every little nitpick they have is far too much. Immigrants should learn how to conform, or if not conform, fit in the country they moved in, not the other way around. The religious tolerance can be stretched to show respect to their beliefs but this doesn't apply to the overall welfare of the country, such as laws concerning every citizen. My suggestion is to 'hint' to them that this is Norway, and not Saudi Arabia, majority of the population are Europeans and natives and religion and state are as separate as it could be.

you cant prevent such unless you start some muslim exclusion act, but heck, how do you know if someone's muslim? well then, lets start the middle eastern exclusion act, or immigration exclusion act...

but you do know, laws are meant to be broken, if not, why be law enforcement and laws in the first place? hence, exclusion might help a bit but it wont help a lot. the best way to stop them is to stop their source, hence, genocide.

im not anti muslim or anything, im just speaking of the truth.

true that in pratice thats a whole new ball game, but it isnt unachieveable, if one have strong allies and is strong in itself... if not, lets just stick with the exclusion acts...

or maybe, tho this isnt really a nice option, lets create a muslim town!! but hey, when they gain more influences, you ought to bow down to their demand either way...

Um...genocide is like equal to dropping atomic bombs on some highly populated place here on earth and therefore not acceptable. That could cost any country who decides to do that ousting from the UN and possible WWIII from the angered Muslim nations [which are definitely many and well-armed btw, think of Iran].
But the one about the Muslim Town? I don't think it's needed, from what I can gather, the Muslims cited here are like extremists and seclude themselves willingly. No need to worry about them further influencing others.
It would be a big problem though if one of them got elected in a position in a government [not that I'm saying Muslims in office in European governments are bad] and turned out to be an extreme radical and a fascist. That would be bad.
And about the exclusion act you've mentioned--not possible. Human rights groups would charge them with racial and religious discrimination and this would only bring more cause and sympathy for Muslims.
But there is an alternative to the one you're proposing. The government should limit immigrants, no questions asked. If they're so damn worried about the Muslim population going out of hand then limit the Muslims coming in. Apart from that, they should issue strict rules about orienting immigrants to their way of life. Not necessarily convert them or secularize them to something that violates their beliefs, but give them guidelines of what is acceptable religious zealotry for their part. Most of these Muslims are old-fashioned from what I can gather and place their religion over others. So the government should try its best on how these Muslims can follow their religion and chosne lifestyle but without drastically affecting others in their area as well.

all those you point out is true... ohh how i hate those wtf ever groups blocking the way to solve problems.

anyways, i am in favor of WWIII, wars are good for both the economy and killing off some population... look, a few days back i was readin about the cutting penis foreskin helped save tons of africans from getting aids... which means they would breed more nicely and add more population onto this overpopulated world... not to mention that it is "OUR" tax money that is spent to help them. ahh, how nice...

im in favorite of being radical (i myself am one), being moderate or close to moderate doesnt solve the problem, they just try to fix it but they can never solve it once and for all... why? because they dont seek revolutions!

humans rights groups, heck, they can go eat feces. i really hate all those kind of groups... i mean, theyre full of hypocrites. anyways, if exclusion isnt possible, then we must assimilate them into the society of yours. if they dont want to, we must do such on their children. it is meaningless to teach a old dog new tricks. hence, lets teach the young dog.

o0James0o wrote:
if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

Do you actually believe what you just said? If not, then don't even subject others into doing something that you won't even do on your own. Those suicide bombers showed more determination than you ever could, and that's not even an argument because they're all dead, while you're still very much alive.

yes, i do believe in what i said... i am giving others advices, rather or not they listen is their problem. suicide bombers show more determination? those kind of idiots? dont make me laugh. heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

yes, like you said, it is no longer an argument because theyre dead. hence, theyre good men. why? because theyre dead!

So you believe that a good man is a dead man, regardless of how idiotic the man was. Well then I don't see you killing yourself in any hurry. And while you're at it, why not kill a bunch of bystanders? It'll be seen as an act of benevolence and servitude by what you believe in.

And you know what, that's exactly the mindset of the religious Islam leaders, who ordered those suicide bombers to commit those hideous acts of malice and violence. You are turning into those idiots that you despise, and you're doing so because you speak of death. But the dead don't talk, and people will never learn a thing once they're dead. Even an idiot knows that!

albeitalways wrote:And about the exclusion act you've mentioned--not possible. Human rights groups would charge them with racial and religious discrimination and this would only bring more cause and sympathy for Muslims.

There are human rights groups in the Muslim and Islam regions, and even they are against the inhuman practices of those religions. They're not that stupid.

o0James0o wrote:humans rights groups, heck, they can go eat feces. i really hate all those kind of groups... i mean, theyre full of hypocrites. anyways, if exclusion isnt possible, then we must assimilate them into the society of yours. if they dont want to, we must do such on their children. it is meaningless to teach a old god new tricks. hence, lets teach the young dog.

If it was due to the humanitarian movements performed by the various human rights groups, so that even an idiot like yourself can voice your opinions on an open forum like this one, then you are a hypocrite of the first order, when you openly criticized the very people who were responsible for your freedom of speech. So don't you even try preaching my children about dead people being the only good, while I'm here who's twice your age, still able to teach you something that you've obviously ignored during your history lessons at school.

I'm feeling that this topic is getting out of hand. I don't want to discuss genocide of the muslim people because that is something I do not want. Please stick to my lead topic and discuss ways to prevent this, how is the status in your own country and so on?

Currently in news lately there's been loads of issues about migration to Norway and religion, cultures that they bring which may hurt Norway as a nation. Basically, they demand us to change our lives to meet theirs, which I personally think is wrong. This is what I would call sneakislamifying. Already in some countries which used to be based on Christianity, like England have already adapted to Muslim laws because the political correctness is stopping them from saying no. This is also happening in Norway, we almost got Hijab in the police uniform, but the change was reset because there was so much commotion and nobody wanted it.

Here's a list of changes the Muslims have demanded so far
* Less freedom of speech (Blasphemy law)
* Seperate care for the Muslim elders
* Halal-food served in Norwegian prisons
* Alcoholfree days - Some days where no shops can sell alcohol
* Make Muslim holidays national
* Sex-split swimming pools
* Praying in their workspace
* Sharia Courts
* They want their own banks
* Imam education

This is what that have been pointed out as sneakislamifying of Norway. Many of these points have already been approved in Countries such as England and it's starting here in Norway too. So what I ask that; is the current government party too naive and is afraid to be political correct? or is it simply that all the citizen wants it?

The way I look at it is that we have a problem to integrate those whom come from Muslim countries, we pack them up in suburban places and pack them all together so it's hard for them to adapt to the new society they have come to. As of Norway, we do have Ghetto's and Oslo the capital of Norway is filled with them, but mostly just in certain places of Oslo. What I believe is that if we spread them all around the country they would have had it easier to learn the language and fit more into the Norwegian society, but we don't we pack them all in the same place.

Freedom of speech is something Norway managed to obtain in 1814 and I'm proud that I live in a country as good as this. Now they want us to remove some of that little freedom of speech we have left, by re-instating the blasphemy law (Yes, we used to have it, but we have secularized our society so we removed it) and I believe that this is just a start, and more will follow if we give in (at least when it comes to radical Muslims). Our government is made of 3 parties in Norway, two of the parties have worked for a secularized society, but they want to give in and "religify" the country yet again. Are they just hypocrites or are they afraid of being political correct?

When it comes to serving halal-food in prisons I don't think we should. 30 % of the people in Norwegian prisons are made of migrates whom demands special treatment for their illegal crimes. You are there to learn a lesson or something (I haven't been to jail so I don't know). This goes for all religions, not just Muslims. When you serve your time, you sit there and be quiet.

I'll try my best to explain what I know about the Sharia Courts; As I see it is that Islam is not just an religion, it's a political system that does not support freedom of speech and believe in uppression of women. Such judging shall not take one step into Norway, when they cross the Norway border they should leave their old politic system behind and adapt to the laws of Norway works and not try to make us instate a law order which does not support women at all.

They want their own banks that does not have rents, because that's not allowed by their religion or something, I'm not too updated on the subject, so if anyone wanna fill me in, please do!

Now I want you to understand that I did not create this thread to bash Muslims or anything like that, this is something I've wanted to discuss for a very long time, but I haven't had the guts to say anything due to the political correctness throughout the world. Ever since the incident about Hijab in the police uniform, the party "Fremskrittpartiet" in Norway have set critisism of Islam on the daily agenda it is now easier to discuss these things. That's how I feel. Now, I do not know about the situation much in other places than Norway and England so I would like to hear your thoughts on this. I have been reading some on hwo the situation is in the US and I was lead to this movie I found on Youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SoPrMEkz5s

This pretty much explains what's happening in Norway and what might be prevented if the right party comes into the government this year. There have also been made some prognosis on the current flow of immigrants coming into Norway each year (which is about 25,000 each year) then there will be more immigrants in Norway by 2050. This is pretty scary when it comes to ethnic Norwegian. Being a minority in your own country is something I don't want to happen and with fresh Muslim political parties starting up which works for their own agenda gives us an idea of what's happening.

I really want some comments back on this on what you views are, and if you're a Muslim please help me debate this issue!

Well written and very relevant topic!

I live in Denmark and the situation is pretty much the same, although we aren't getting quite as many immigrants...

I'd hate to sound like a racist, or a moron, but Islam is a "threat" to the national culture to some extent, and the political correctness which should serve to guarantee fairness or justice or understanding or whatever, really is a problem in this connection, cause it doesn't go both ways..

While everyone should be able to believe in whatever god they choose to, the way Islam is interpreted by many of the muslims in Denmark is the suppresing and restricting one, which really is far from what I believe in, or what "we" believe in in Denmark.

I think it's fair that we're open to people of different believes, and allow them to follow their religion to an extent that is within the laws, but I don't think we should allow them to put up demands that are suppressing or restricting, or absurd by our measures. If you choose to live in another country with another set of rules, you'll have to follow those rules and that's that... I don't think anyone from Denmark or Norway would move to Irak and expect to be allowed to get drunk, fuck around, express their homosexuality, claim that Allah didn't exist and so on...

Contrary to many Islamic countries, religion and law doesn't go hand in hand here. While the laws are based on christian believes, the bible doesn't dictate the law as the Coran does, and that's something the immigrants will have to understand and respect.

Well, Denmark is actually doing a good job when it comes to immigration because political correctness and discussion about minority groups are actually allowed to be discussed in Denmark. The current government in Norway are people who have been working on to make Norway into a secular country since 1980' and they do whatever they can to prevent Christian groups from doing stuff (which is why they removed the blasphemy law). But even though they are trying to create a secular state, they keep on giving into demands of radical Muslims and slowly making our culture into theirs and out laws for that matter.

It's not like they are doing rash movements about changing the way we live, but it's slowly happening and if we give in to the demands then they will understand that Norway will be an easy take because everyone is scared of saying STOP due to the fact that they will be looked upon as racist for being strict towards the Muslim world. To be honest, I'm surprized that no one have called me a racist yet for calling out my points in the lead topic.

I'm feeling that this topic is getting out of hand. I don't want to discuss genocide of the muslim people because that is something I do not want. Please stick to my lead topic and discuss ways to prevent this, how is the status in your own country and so on?

Currently in news lately there's been loads of issues about migration to Norway and religion, cultures that they bring which may hurt Norway as a nation. Basically, they demand us to change our lives to meet theirs, which I personally think is wrong. This is what I would call sneakislamifying. Already in some countries which used to be based on Christianity, like England have already adapted to Muslim laws because the political correctness is stopping them from saying no. This is also happening in Norway, we almost got Hijab in the police uniform, but the change was reset because there was so much commotion and nobody wanted it.

Here's a list of changes the Muslims have demanded so far
* Less freedom of speech (Blasphemy law)
* Seperate care for the Muslim elders
* Halal-food served in Norwegian prisons
* Alcoholfree days - Some days where no shops can sell alcohol
* Make Muslim holidays national
* Sex-split swimming pools
* Praying in their workspace
* Sharia Courts
* They want their own banks
* Imam education

This is what that have been pointed out as sneakislamifying of Norway. Many of these points have already been approved in Countries such as England and it's starting here in Norway too. So what I ask that; is the current government party too naive and is afraid to be political correct? or is it simply that all the citizen wants it?

The way I look at it is that we have a problem to integrate those whom come from Muslim countries, we pack them up in suburban places and pack them all together so it's hard for them to adapt to the new society they have come to. As of Norway, we do have Ghetto's and Oslo the capital of Norway is filled with them, but mostly just in certain places of Oslo. What I believe is that if we spread them all around the country they would have had it easier to learn the language and fit more into the Norwegian society, but we don't we pack them all in the same place.

Freedom of speech is something Norway managed to obtain in 1814 and I'm proud that I live in a country as good as this. Now they want us to remove some of that little freedom of speech we have left, by re-instating the blasphemy law (Yes, we used to have it, but we have secularized our society so we removed it) and I believe that this is just a start, and more will follow if we give in (at least when it comes to radical Muslims). Our government is made of 3 parties in Norway, two of the parties have worked for a secularized society, but they want to give in and "religify" the country yet again. Are they just hypocrites or are they afraid of being political correct?

When it comes to serving halal-food in prisons I don't think we should. 30 % of the people in Norwegian prisons are made of migrates whom demands special treatment for their illegal crimes. You are there to learn a lesson or something (I haven't been to jail so I don't know). This goes for all religions, not just Muslims. When you serve your time, you sit there and be quiet.

I'll try my best to explain what I know about the Sharia Courts; As I see it is that Islam is not just an religion, it's a political system that does not support freedom of speech and believe in uppression of women. Such judging shall not take one step into Norway, when they cross the Norway border they should leave their old politic system behind and adapt to the laws of Norway works and not try to make us instate a law order which does not support women at all.

They want their own banks that does not have rents, because that's not allowed by their religion or something, I'm not too updated on the subject, so if anyone wanna fill me in, please do!

Now I want you to understand that I did not create this thread to bash Muslims or anything like that, this is something I've wanted to discuss for a very long time, but I haven't had the guts to say anything due to the political correctness throughout the world. Ever since the incident about Hijab in the police uniform, the party "Fremskrittpartiet" in Norway have set critisism of Islam on the daily agenda it is now easier to discuss these things. That's how I feel. Now, I do not know about the situation much in other places than Norway and England so I would like to hear your thoughts on this. I have been reading some on hwo the situation is in the US and I was lead to this movie I found on Youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SoPrMEkz5s

This pretty much explains what's happening in Norway and what might be prevented if the right party comes into the government this year. There have also been made some prognosis on the current flow of immigrants coming into Norway each year (which is about 25,000 each year) then there will be more immigrants in Norway by 2050. This is pretty scary when it comes to ethnic Norwegian. Being a minority in your own country is something I don't want to happen and with fresh Muslim political parties starting up which works for their own agenda gives us an idea of what's happening.

I really want some comments back on this on what you views are, and if you're a Muslim please help me debate this issue!

Well written and very relevant topic!

I live in Denmark and the situation is pretty much the same, although we aren't getting quite as many immigrants...

I'd hate to sound like a racist, or a moron, but Islam is a "threat" to the national culture to some extent, and the political correctness which should serve to guarantee fairness or justice or understanding or whatever, really is a problem in this connection, cause it doesn't go both ways..

While everyone should be able to believe in whatever god they choose to, the way Islam is interpreted by many of the muslims in Denmark is the suppresing and restricting one, which really is far from what I believe in, or what "we" believe in in Denmark.

I think it's fair that we're open to people of different believes, and allow them to follow their religion to an extent that is within the laws, but I don't think we should allow them to put up demands that are suppressing or restricting, or absurd by our measures. If you choose to live in another country with another set of rules, you'll have to follow those rules and that's that... I don't think anyone from Denmark or Norway would move to Irak and expect to be allowed to get drunk, fuck around, express their homosexuality, claim that Allah didn't exist and so on...

Contrary to many Islamic countries, religion and law doesn't go hand in hand here. While the laws are based on christian believes, the bible doesn't dictate the law as the Coran does, and that's something the immigrants will have to understand and respect.

Well, Denmark is actually doing a good job when it comes to immigration because political correctness and discussion about minority groups are actually allowed to be discussed in Denmark. The current government in Norway are people who have been working on to make Norway into a secular country since 1980' and they do whatever they can to prevent Christian groups from doing stuff (which is why they removed the blasphemy law). But even though they are trying to create a secular state, they keep on giving into demands of radical Muslims and slowly making our culture into theirs and out laws for that matter.

It's not like they are doing rash movements about changing the way we live, but it's slowly happening and if we give in to the demands then they will understand that Norway will be an easy take because everyone is scared of saying STOP due to the fact that they will be looked upon as racist for being strict towards the Muslim world. To be honest, I'm surprized that no one have called me a racist yet for calling out my points in the lead topic.

I for one won't call you racist because I understand how a freedom country should work. You are both looking out and voicing for the interest of the greater good, that includes those who might call you a racist in order to externalize their anxiety, but never internalize what's actually their own shortcomings in order to change themselves for the better. Therefore until the Muslim community actually realize their own shortcomings by turning their attentions toward their own old-fashioned and outdated inhuman practices, we can't force them to change anything.

o0James0o wrote:
if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

Do you actually believe what you just said? If not, then don't even subject others into doing something that you won't even do on your own. Those suicide bombers showed more determination than you ever could, and that's not even an argument because they're all dead, while you're still very much alive.

yes, i do believe in what i said... i am giving others advices, rather or not they listen is their problem. suicide bombers show more determination? those kind of idiots? dont make me laugh. heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

yes, like you said, it is no longer an argument because theyre dead. hence, theyre good men. why? because theyre dead!

So you believe that a good man is a dead man, regardless of how idiotic the man was. Well then I don't see you killing yourself in any hurry. And while you're at it, why not kill a bunch of bystanders? It'll be seen as an act of benevolence and servitude by what you believe in.

And you know what, that's exactly the mindset of the religious Islam leaders, who ordered those suicide bombers to commit those hideous acts of malice and violence. You are turning into those idiots that you despise, and you're doing so because you speak of death. But the dead don't talk, and people will never learn a thing once they're dead. Even an idiot knows that!

albeitalways wrote:And about the exclusion act you've mentioned--not possible. Human rights groups would charge them with racial and religious discrimination and this would only bring more cause and sympathy for Muslims.

There are human rights groups in the Muslim and Islam regions, and even they are against the inhuman practices of those religions. They're not that stupid.

o0James0o wrote:humans rights groups, heck, they can go eat feces. i really hate all those kind of groups... i mean, theyre full of hypocrites. anyways, if exclusion isnt possible, then we must assimilate them into the society of yours. if they dont want to, we must do such on their children. it is meaningless to teach a old dog new tricks. hence, lets teach the young dog.

If it was due to the humanitarian movements performed by the various human rights groups, so that even an idiot like yourself can voice your opinions on an open forum like this one, then you are a hypocrite of the first order, when you openly criticized the very people who were responsible for your freedom of speech. So don't you even try preaching my children about dead people being the only good, while I'm here who's twice your age, still able to teach you something that you've obviously ignored during your history lessons at school.

first of all, i really hate it when people uses my suggestions against myself. why? because it is in human nature that we are all selfish bastards, hence, it is highly unlikely that we would do onto others the same as we do onto ourselves.

And while you're at it, why not kill a bunch of bystanders? It'll be seen as an act of benevolence and servitude by what you believe in.

heres my reply:

heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

it is highly unlikely to get people to join one's cause if you kill bystanders right at the beginning. that, to the majority, is an act of terrorism even if it might be fighting for freedom for oneself.

And you know what, that's exactly the mindset of the religious Islam leaders, who ordered those suicide bombers to commit those hideous acts of malice and violence. You are turning into those idiots that you despise, and you're doing so because you speak of death.

ohh please, they fight for the idiotic religious cause, and here i am giving advice for the humanistic cause.... its very different. tho you can argue that both involves death, but hey, death is a common thing. especially when our population is 6.7 billion.... it is unlikely we would even care if someone die unless that person is someone who you knows or cares for...

But the dead don't talk, and people will never learn a thing once they're dead. Even an idiot knows that!

is that not the main reason why a dead man is a good man?!

If it was due to the humanitarian movements performed by the various human rights groups, so that even an idiot like yourself can voice your opinions on an open forum like this one, then you are a hypocrite of the first order, when you openly criticized the very people who were responsible for your freedom of speech. So don't you even try preaching my children about dead people being the only good, while I'm here who's twice your age, still able to teach you something that you've obviously ignored during your history lessons at school.

i am or might be grateful for what they done, but in any sense, they did it for selfish reasons. freedom of speech? sure, but it is not completely free, or is it?

i admit my hypocritical nature... if i wasnt, i wouldve done something big long since... i speak of such humanistic things but never does act...

i am not saying to preach to your children a dead man's a good man. i am saying that it is highly impossible that i can make you think like i want you to do, so, why not brain wash the childrens? just like how religion and morals does such. children are the best prey.

history sir, are written records. i highly doubt that there are people who doesnt take a side when writing things. also, i highly doubt that a person would see the same thing at different light. also, those who prevailed are themselves justice. the winner or one own nation's history would always seem righteous while the enemy is always the evildoer. hence, i take in what i want to know from history and cast the rest of the selfishness aside, for it is meaninless for me.

o0James0o wrote:
if a government have 2-3-4 parties, it is even more worthy to gain extra support (tho it might not last long...)

i dont know what kind of muslim are in usa... maybe theyre the "tourists" that bush called...
it is their business for what they believe in, if you doesnt like it, kill them. the only good man is a dead man...
dont go around complainin without doing anything. it is hard to change a person, therefore, do give them salvation by killing them.

Do you actually believe what you just said? If not, then don't even subject others into doing something that you won't even do on your own. Those suicide bombers showed more determination than you ever could, and that's not even an argument because they're all dead, while you're still very much alive.

yes, i do believe in what i said... i am giving others advices, rather or not they listen is their problem. suicide bombers show more determination? those kind of idiots? dont make me laugh. heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

yes, like you said, it is no longer an argument because theyre dead. hence, theyre good men. why? because theyre dead!

So you believe that a good man is a dead man, regardless of how idiotic the man was. Well then I don't see you killing yourself in any hurry. And while you're at it, why not kill a bunch of bystanders? It'll be seen as an act of benevolence and servitude by what you believe in.

And you know what, that's exactly the mindset of the religious Islam leaders, who ordered those suicide bombers to commit those hideous acts of malice and violence. You are turning into those idiots that you despise, and you're doing so because you speak of death. But the dead don't talk, and people will never learn a thing once they're dead. Even an idiot knows that!

albeitalways wrote:And about the exclusion act you've mentioned--not possible. Human rights groups would charge them with racial and religious discrimination and this would only bring more cause and sympathy for Muslims.

There are human rights groups in the Muslim and Islam regions, and even they are against the inhuman practices of those religions. They're not that stupid.

o0James0o wrote:humans rights groups, heck, they can go eat feces. i really hate all those kind of groups... i mean, theyre full of hypocrites. anyways, if exclusion isnt possible, then we must assimilate them into the society of yours. if they dont want to, we must do such on their children. it is meaningless to teach a old dog new tricks. hence, lets teach the young dog.

If it was due to the humanitarian movements performed by the various human rights groups, so that even an idiot like yourself can voice your opinions on an open forum like this one, then you are a hypocrite of the first order, when you openly criticized the very people who were responsible for your freedom of speech. So don't you even try preaching my children about dead people being the only good, while I'm here who's twice your age, still able to teach you something that you've obviously ignored during your history lessons at school.

first of all, i really hate it when people uses my suggestions against myself. why? because it is in human nature that we are all selfish bastards, hence, it is highly unlikely that we would do onto others the same as we do onto ourselves.

And while you're at it, why not kill a bunch of bystanders? It'll be seen as an act of benevolence and servitude by what you believe in.

heres my reply:

heck, theyre a waste of resources for we feed and clothe them and here they didnt try to do anything but to die? heck, why dont they die a fetus so we can save all those we wasted? not to mention suicide bombers takes a lot of people down with them. if you want to suicide for a cause, please do 1 man 1 kill or many men 1 kill.

it is highly unlikely to get people to join one's cause if you kill bystanders right at the beginning. that, to the majority, is an act of terrorism even if it might be fighting for freedom for oneself.

And you know what, that's exactly the mindset of the religious Islam leaders, who ordered those suicide bombers to commit those hideous acts of malice and violence. You are turning into those idiots that you despise, and you're doing so because you speak of death.

ohh please, they fight for the idiotic religious cause, and here i am giving advice for the humanistic cause.... its very different. tho you can argue that both involves death, but hey, death is a common thing. especially when our population is 6.7 billion.... it is unlikely we would even care if someone die unless that person is someone who you knows or cares for...

But the dead don't talk, and people will never learn a thing once they're dead. Even an idiot knows that!

is that not the main reason why a dead man is a good man?!

If it was due to the humanitarian movements performed by the various human rights groups, so that even an idiot like yourself can voice your opinions on an open forum like this one, then you are a hypocrite of the first order, when you openly criticized the very people who were responsible for your freedom of speech. So don't you even try preaching my children about dead people being the only good, while I'm here who's twice your age, still able to teach you something that you've obviously ignored during your history lessons at school.

i am or might be grateful for what they done, but in any sense, they did it for selfish reasons. freedom of speech? sure, but it is not completely free, or is it?

i admit my hypocritical nature... if i wasnt, i wouldve done something big long since... i speak of such humanistic things but never does act...

i am not saying to preach to your children a dead man's a good man. i am saying that it is highly impossible that i can make you think like i want you to do, so, why not brain wash the childrens? just like how religion and morals does such. children are the best prey.

history sir, are written records. i highly doubt that there are people who doesnt take a side when writing things. also, i highly doubt that a person would see the same thing at different light. also, those who prevailed are themselves justice. the winner or one own nation's history would always seem righteous while the enemy is always the evildoer. hence, i take in what i want to know from history and cast the rest of the selfishness aside, for it is meaninless for me.

I'm feeling that this topic is getting out of hand. I don't want to discuss genocide of the muslim people because that is something I do not want. Please stick to my lead topic and discuss ways to prevent this, how is the status in your own country and so on?

Currently in news lately there's been loads of issues about migration to Norway and religion, cultures that they bring which may hurt Norway as a nation. Basically, they demand us to change our lives to meet theirs, which I personally think is wrong. This is what I would call sneakislamifying. Already in some countries which used to be based on Christianity, like England have already adapted to Muslim laws because the political correctness is stopping them from saying no. This is also happening in Norway, we almost got Hijab in the police uniform, but the change was reset because there was so much commotion and nobody wanted it.

Here's a list of changes the Muslims have demanded so far
* Less freedom of speech (Blasphemy law)
* Seperate care for the Muslim elders
* Halal-food served in Norwegian prisons
* Alcoholfree days - Some days where no shops can sell alcohol
* Make Muslim holidays national
* Sex-split swimming pools
* Praying in their workspace
* Sharia Courts
* They want their own banks
* Imam education

This is what that have been pointed out as sneakislamifying of Norway. Many of these points have already been approved in Countries such as England and it's starting here in Norway too. So what I ask that; is the current government party too naive and is afraid to be political correct? or is it simply that all the citizen wants it?

The way I look at it is that we have a problem to integrate those whom come from Muslim countries, we pack them up in suburban places and pack them all together so it's hard for them to adapt to the new society they have come to. As of Norway, we do have Ghetto's and Oslo the capital of Norway is filled with them, but mostly just in certain places of Oslo. What I believe is that if we spread them all around the country they would have had it easier to learn the language and fit more into the Norwegian society, but we don't we pack them all in the same place.

Freedom of speech is something Norway managed to obtain in 1814 and I'm proud that I live in a country as good as this. Now they want us to remove some of that little freedom of speech we have left, by re-instating the blasphemy law (Yes, we used to have it, but we have secularized our society so we removed it) and I believe that this is just a start, and more will follow if we give in (at least when it comes to radical Muslims). Our government is made of 3 parties in Norway, two of the parties have worked for a secularized society, but they want to give in and "religify" the country yet again. Are they just hypocrites or are they afraid of being political correct?

When it comes to serving halal-food in prisons I don't think we should. 30 % of the people in Norwegian prisons are made of migrates whom demands special treatment for their illegal crimes. You are there to learn a lesson or something (I haven't been to jail so I don't know). This goes for all religions, not just Muslims. When you serve your time, you sit there and be quiet.

I'll try my best to explain what I know about the Sharia Courts; As I see it is that Islam is not just an religion, it's a political system that does not support freedom of speech and believe in uppression of women. Such judging shall not take one step into Norway, when they cross the Norway border they should leave their old politic system behind and adapt to the laws of Norway works and not try to make us instate a law order which does not support women at all.

They want their own banks that does not have rents, because that's not allowed by their religion or something, I'm not too updated on the subject, so if anyone wanna fill me in, please do!

Now I want you to understand that I did not create this thread to bash Muslims or anything like that, this is something I've wanted to discuss for a very long time, but I haven't had the guts to say anything due to the political correctness throughout the world. Ever since the incident about Hijab in the police uniform, the party "Fremskrittpartiet" in Norway have set critisism of Islam on the daily agenda it is now easier to discuss these things. That's how I feel. Now, I do not know about the situation much in other places than Norway and England so I would like to hear your thoughts on this. I have been reading some on hwo the situation is in the US and I was lead to this movie I found on Youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SoPrMEkz5s

This pretty much explains what's happening in Norway and what might be prevented if the right party comes into the government this year. There have also been made some prognosis on the current flow of immigrants coming into Norway each year (which is about 25,000 each year) then there will be more immigrants in Norway by 2050. This is pretty scary when it comes to ethnic Norwegian. Being a minority in your own country is something I don't want to happen and with fresh Muslim political parties starting up which works for their own agenda gives us an idea of what's happening.

I really want some comments back on this on what you views are, and if you're a Muslim please help me debate this issue!

Well written and very relevant topic!

I live in Denmark and the situation is pretty much the same, although we aren't getting quite as many immigrants...

I'd hate to sound like a racist, or a moron, but Islam is a "threat" to the national culture to some extent, and the political correctness which should serve to guarantee fairness or justice or understanding or whatever, really is a problem in this connection, cause it doesn't go both ways..

While everyone should be able to believe in whatever god they choose to, the way Islam is interpreted by many of the muslims in Denmark is the suppresing and restricting one, which really is far from what I believe in, or what "we" believe in in Denmark.

I think it's fair that we're open to people of different believes, and allow them to follow their religion to an extent that is within the laws, but I don't think we should allow them to put up demands that are suppressing or restricting, or absurd by our measures. If you choose to live in another country with another set of rules, you'll have to follow those rules and that's that... I don't think anyone from Denmark or Norway would move to Irak and expect to be allowed to get drunk, fuck around, express their homosexuality, claim that Allah didn't exist and so on...

Contrary to many Islamic countries, religion and law doesn't go hand in hand here. While the laws are based on christian believes, the bible doesn't dictate the law as the Coran does, and that's something the immigrants will have to understand and respect.

Well, Denmark is actually doing a good job when it comes to immigration because political correctness and discussion about minority groups are actually allowed to be discussed in Denmark. The current government in Norway are people who have been working on to make Norway into a secular country since 1980' and they do whatever they can to prevent Christian groups from doing stuff (which is why they removed the blasphemy law). But even though they are trying to create a secular state, they keep on giving into demands of radical Muslims and slowly making our culture into theirs and out laws for that matter.

It's not like they are doing rash movements about changing the way we live, but it's slowly happening and if we give in to the demands then they will understand that Norway will be an easy take because everyone is scared of saying STOP due to the fact that they will be looked upon as racist for being strict towards the Muslim world. To be honest, I'm surprized that no one have called me a racist yet for calling out my points in the lead topic.

Here's my story, last year my parents and sisters went to Paris but I was left behind because I needed to finish something to graduate. My parents went there for their honeymoon, and were shocked to see that Paris is different in a few years, there were strong Muslim changes in the physical make-up of the city that they won't tell you in the tourist guide leaflets. They later learned that this is not limited to the physical change, they could feel something different about Europe.

It is not racist of you to complain, it is like if I'm a visitor to your house, I am expected to accept or live around your mores and customs, not the other way around. I've never heard of inhumane customs from Norway, what are they complaining about? The very core of their demands are opposite to the freedom and liberty that has become a way of life not only in Norway but to other countries as well.
I've read somewhere that a gay man was beaten up in Denmark (not sure about the country), which was the first country to accept the third sex by a gang of Muslim men. No one dared speak up for him because of fear.

My dad said that most politicians in Europe are making deals with some Muslim representatives because of p-o-w-e-r, plain and simple.

I understand that Europe for the most part has become peaceful with one of the most civilized citizens on earth, I just hope you've still got a lot of fight left in you guys to start voicing your discontent. You are already being bullied! You need to forget your fear and start working together, but a lot of people are too engrossed with their own lives and will try to silence the nagging discontent in their minds, I hope we won't see Europe lost again to crazy megalomaniac rulers.

And I am not a Muslim racist, Islam is one of the most beautiful religions from what I understand, just like Christianity, it has some adherents who choose to twist God's teachings, peace!

I'm feeling that this topic is getting out of hand. I don't want to discuss genocide of the muslim people because that is something I do not want. Please stick to my lead topic and discuss ways to prevent this, how is the status in your own country and so on?

Currently in news lately there's been loads of issues about migration to Norway and religion, cultures that they bring which may hurt Norway as a nation. Basically, they demand us to change our lives to meet theirs, which I personally think is wrong. This is what I would call sneakislamifying. Already in some countries which used to be based on Christianity, like England have already adapted to Muslim laws because the political correctness is stopping them from saying no. This is also happening in Norway, we almost got Hijab in the police uniform, but the change was reset because there was so much commotion and nobody wanted it.

Here's a list of changes the Muslims have demanded so far
* Less freedom of speech (Blasphemy law)
* Seperate care for the Muslim elders
* Halal-food served in Norwegian prisons
* Alcoholfree days - Some days where no shops can sell alcohol
* Make Muslim holidays national
* Sex-split swimming pools
* Praying in their workspace
* Sharia Courts
* They want their own banks
* Imam education

This is what that have been pointed out as sneakislamifying of Norway. Many of these points have already been approved in Countries such as England and it's starting here in Norway too. So what I ask that; is the current government party too naive and is afraid to be political correct? or is it simply that all the citizen wants it?

The way I look at it is that we have a problem to integrate those whom come from Muslim countries, we pack them up in suburban places and pack them all together so it's hard for them to adapt to the new society they have come to. As of Norway, we do have Ghetto's and Oslo the capital of Norway is filled with them, but mostly just in certain places of Oslo. What I believe is that if we spread them all around the country they would have had it easier to learn the language and fit more into the Norwegian society, but we don't we pack them all in the same place.

Freedom of speech is something Norway managed to obtain in 1814 and I'm proud that I live in a country as good as this. Now they want us to remove some of that little freedom of speech we have left, by re-instating the blasphemy law (Yes, we used to have it, but we have secularized our society so we removed it) and I believe that this is just a start, and more will follow if we give in (at least when it comes to radical Muslims). Our government is made of 3 parties in Norway, two of the parties have worked for a secularized society, but they want to give in and "religify" the country yet again. Are they just hypocrites or are they afraid of being political correct?

When it comes to serving halal-food in prisons I don't think we should. 30 % of the people in Norwegian prisons are made of migrates whom demands special treatment for their illegal crimes. You are there to learn a lesson or something (I haven't been to jail so I don't know). This goes for all religions, not just Muslims. When you serve your time, you sit there and be quiet.

I'll try my best to explain what I know about the Sharia Courts; As I see it is that Islam is not just an religion, it's a political system that does not support freedom of speech and believe in uppression of women. Such judging shall not take one step into Norway, when they cross the Norway border they should leave their old politic system behind and adapt to the laws of Norway works and not try to make us instate a law order which does not support women at all.

They want their own banks that does not have rents, because that's not allowed by their religion or something, I'm not too updated on the subject, so if anyone wanna fill me in, please do!

Now I want you to understand that I did not create this thread to bash Muslims or anything like that, this is something I've wanted to discuss for a very long time, but I haven't had the guts to say anything due to the political correctness throughout the world. Ever since the incident about Hijab in the police uniform, the party "Fremskrittpartiet" in Norway have set critisism of Islam on the daily agenda it is now easier to discuss these things. That's how I feel. Now, I do not know about the situation much in other places than Norway and England so I would like to hear your thoughts on this. I have been reading some on hwo the situation is in the US and I was lead to this movie I found on Youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SoPrMEkz5s

This pretty much explains what's happening in Norway and what might be prevented if the right party comes into the government this year. There have also been made some prognosis on the current flow of immigrants coming into Norway each year (which is about 25,000 each year) then there will be more immigrants in Norway by 2050. This is pretty scary when it comes to ethnic Norwegian. Being a minority in your own country is something I don't want to happen and with fresh Muslim political parties starting up which works for their own agenda gives us an idea of what's happening.

I really want some comments back on this on what you views are, and if you're a Muslim please help me debate this issue!

Well written and very relevant topic!

I live in Denmark and the situation is pretty much the same, although we aren't getting quite as many immigrants...

I'd hate to sound like a racist, or a moron, but Islam is a "threat" to the national culture to some extent, and the political correctness which should serve to guarantee fairness or justice or understanding or whatever, really is a problem in this connection, cause it doesn't go both ways..

While everyone should be able to believe in whatever god they choose to, the way Islam is interpreted by many of the muslims in Denmark is the suppresing and restricting one, which really is far from what I believe in, or what "we" believe in in Denmark.

I think it's fair that we're open to people of different believes, and allow them to follow their religion to an extent that is within the laws, but I don't think we should allow them to put up demands that are suppressing or restricting, or absurd by our measures. If you choose to live in another country with another set of rules, you'll have to follow those rules and that's that... I don't think anyone from Denmark or Norway would move to Irak and expect to be allowed to get drunk, fuck around, express their homosexuality, claim that Allah didn't exist and so on...

Contrary to many Islamic countries, religion and law doesn't go hand in hand here. While the laws are based on christian believes, the bible doesn't dictate the law as the Coran does, and that's something the immigrants will have to understand and respect.

Well, Denmark is actually doing a good job when it comes to immigration because political correctness and discussion about minority groups are actually allowed to be discussed in Denmark. The current government in Norway are people who have been working on to make Norway into a secular country since 1980' and they do whatever they can to prevent Christian groups from doing stuff (which is why they removed the blasphemy law). But even though they are trying to create a secular state, they keep on giving into demands of radical Muslims and slowly making our culture into theirs and out laws for that matter.

It's not like they are doing rash movements about changing the way we live, but it's slowly happening and if we give in to the demands then they will understand that Norway will be an easy take because everyone is scared of saying STOP due to the fact that they will be looked upon as racist for being strict towards the Muslim world. To be honest, I'm surprized that no one have called me a racist yet for calling out my points in the lead topic.

Here's my story, last year my parents and sisters went to Paris but I was left behind because I needed to finish something to graduate. My parents went there for their honeymoon, and were shocked to see that Paris is different in a few years, there were strong Muslim changes in the physical make-up of the city that they won't tell you in the tourist guide leaflets. They later learned that this is not limited to the physical change, they could feel something different about Europe.

It is not racist of you to complain, it is like if I'm a visitor to your house, I am expected to accept or live around your mores and customs, not the other way around. I've never heard of inhumane customs from Norway, what are they complaining about? The very core of their demands are opposite to the freedom and liberty that has become a way of life not only in Norway but to other countries as well.
I've read somewhere that a gay man was beaten up in Denmark (not sure about the country), which was the first country to accept the third sex by a gang of Muslim men. No one dared speak up for him because of fear.

My dad said that most politicians in Europe are making deals with some Muslim representatives because of p-o-w-e-r, plain and simple.

I understand that Europe for the most part has become peaceful with one of the most civilized citizens on earth, I just hope you've still got a lot of fight left in you guys to start voicing your discontent. You are already being bullied! You need to forget your fear and start working together, but a lot of people are too engrossed with their own lives and will try to silence the nagging discontent in their minds, I hope we won't see Europe lost again to crazy megalomaniac rulers.

And I am not a Muslim racist, Islam is one of the most beautiful religions from what I understand, just like Christianity, it has some adherents who choose to twist God's teachings, peace!

Really nicely said, but I think that europeans have no fight left in them (even here in croatia, ever since the last war 20 years ago). It is just too much fighting, changes and everything in too long history. One politician from Netherlands told me on one conferenece: we just need to sit down, do nothing, read o book or two,... and most of other politicans (from UK, Italy, The Netherlands) agreed with him. They were all politically moderate, and I think they expressed the most common european thinking: why bother. muslims are here , and they will never be content until they have it their way. We give them freedom, and they are exploiting that freedom to introduce their backwards ways of living. I think that when European people truly realize what happened it will be to late. I mean, today there are idiots who protest the way illegal immigrants are treated, but when the same immigrants start killing them and robbing them on streets they blame weak government.