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On a similar note, it's perhaps worth pointing out the 'wife acceptance factor' (WAF) of the VPC1. We often hear from folks wishing to buy an MP10 or similar such stage piano, but their other half simply will not allow it in the living room. I believe the clutter-free top surface of the VPC1 may help in this respect.

And even the lack of pitch and mod wheels. I see the appeal of it not looking tech. But yes, for that market, a matching wooden stand makes sense. Maybe with a closed-door cubby that could hold a laptop (on a pull-out shelf maybe?), with cables fed out the back, and maybe some discretely mounted jacks that one could cable to the ports of the computer held within.

@James: Something needs to be done about the Windows only software. Given the broad acceptance of Macs in this game a MacOS and/or iOS version of the software (for iPads) is needed (ideally for other OS as well!).

And of course this guy here would want to be able to edit touch curves without buying a new computer!

_________________________
"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva) Disclosure : I am professionally associated with Arturia but my sentiments are my own only.

The following is an extract from the 'Q&A' document prepared for the website:

Quote:

6. VPC Editor software/preset memoriesQ. Does the VPC Editor support Mac OS?A. No, the VPC Editor does not currently support Mac OS.

Q. I’m a Mac user – does this mean that I cannot use the VPC1?A. No, the VPC1 will still perform beautifully as a virtual piano controller with your Mac – just like the MP10, MP6, and other Kawai digital pianos. Moreover, you can still take advantage of the pre-loaded ‘Approved Touch Curves’ by selecting the desired memory from the VPC1 itself.

However, it will not be possible to make changes to internal touch curves, velocity offsets, or adjust the VPC1’s advanced MIDI settings.

Kind regards,Jamesx

James...I want to make sure I understand your Q/A. The operator's manual also states that the VPC does not support Mac O.S. for it's Kawai USB midi driver. Does this mean that with a Mac computer, the USB out to computer interface is rendered useless, and that I must then connect with additional midi in and out wires? If there is no Kawai USB midi driver onboard for interfacing with the Mac, would my Mac computer and the VPC work by way of the USB connection?

Please bear with me, but I'm still confused about the Touch Curve settings. According to the literature, these are manually assigned. How then will I be able to do that without benefit of the VPC editor?

Finally, the point is made that once assigned to one of the five memory slots, the computer is no longer needed. Would not the computer be necessary anyway to play the VST? This makes it sound as though the board will play a VST without a computer; i.e., just sit and play... no computer hookup.

I am seriously interested because of the action of the VPC as a second board for the studio only. However, it is incomprehensible to me that anything having to do with graphics, design, or music would not be supported by Mac OS. Are we to understand these limitations would also apply to Logic and Garage Band? Complete clarification would be much appreciated, and thanks in advance, Sir.Regards,H.K.

- can you, or can you not easily and secure place a laptop on the (curved) surface,

Well, I expect this depends on the construction and size of the laptop. If the laptop has small rubber feet it should sit snuggly on top. If not, a sheet of rubber or foam will do the job. As for size, the top surface is 24 cm deep, which should be sufficient for most laptops:

Originally Posted By: JFP

Where else do your SW Piano's come from.

A desktop computer, perhaps?

Originally Posted By: JFP

- is there already a suggested retail pricing for the European marked available ?

I'm aware of an approximate figure, but do not know if this will be the final price. My recommendation would be to contact Kawai Europe.

Originally Posted By: JFP

Still I hope an average 15" laptop will fit easily on top - that's the only thing I worry about reading about the curved surface.

While the top surface is not perfectly flat, as you can probably see in the video/pictures that have been posted, it's hardly rounded like an SV-1.

Originally Posted By: JFP

On the foto the small notebook finds it place, but there are plenty of bigger laptops around...

The computer shown in the teaser images was an 11" laptop, not a netbook (it certainly wasn't my little old Dell...). Yes, there are bigger laptops, but as noted above, the 24" depth should be sufficient.

Originally Posted By: JFP

perhaps Kawai can make an anti-slip accessoire with roughly a laptop footprint, that you can lay on top of the VPC. Doesn't have to cost the world- just foam or rubber like material .

Nice idea, but to be honest, it'd probably be easier and cheaper for the consumer to simply buy an anti-slip rubber/foam matt themselves from a hardware store. I recently purchased a pack of rubber/foam feet to stick to the underside of my pre-amps, preventing them from slipping around when placed on top of my Nord. Cost me 100 yen - problem solved.

Originally Posted By: JFP

Oh...after seeing the pics on Kraft and remembering the endless discussions (Slight over exaggeration...?) about a good music paper rest for the mp10 I'm a bit surprised to see the same old music stand design again on th VPC ? Why not the nice translucent music stand that comes with the es7 additional accessories ?!

The VPC1 uses the same music rest as the MPs models. The ES7 music rest is a different design/size.

Originally Posted By: JFP

Beats me - forgot to listen ?

In the five years or so that I've been a member of PianoWorld, I recall seeing two posts on this 'problem' - one of which concluded with the original poster simply using a piece of A3-sized art board (again regularly available from the $1/100 yen store) to support his individually photocopied sheets of paper from flopping over. Moreover, as the image I posted above (with the printed score) demonstrates, this is a non-issue when using proper (i.e. purchased) score books.

Originally Posted By: JFP

Still too many of those old paper rests in stock ;-)Some people at Kawai like the current design too much ?

Perhaps it's not cost productive to redesign and re-engineer a music rest because of a couple of reports about individually photocopied sheets of music flopping over?

Originally Posted By: JFP

VPC design is great, a nice and functional (!) music rest completes the design.

I agree - it's rare to find a MIDI controller that includes a music rest.

To be clear, I was suggesting that Kawai might be able to do that port pretty easily. It's not something I would want them to ask of a consumer.

Indeed. I've not seen this particular software, but porting a software that has a curve editor and can communicate with an USB MIDI interface seems a doable software challenge, even for a single developer that has the knowledge on the target operating system.

porting a software that has a curve editor and can communicate with an USB MIDI interface seems a doable software challenge, even for a single developer that has the knowledge on the target operating system.

With Wine you don't even need any specific knowledge of the target OS. It basically depends on what the original program was written with and what calls it uses, but in many cases, especially for relatively simple programs, Wine can create a straight port for you. It won't be the prettiest Mac app (basically, looks like a Windows app), but it will function. At least that's my understanding, I haven't used it myself.

I want to make sure I understand your Q/A. The operator's manual also states that the VPC does not support Mac O.S. for it's Kawai USB midi driver. Does this mean that with a Mac computer, the USB out to computer interface is rendered useless, and that I must then connect with additional midi in and out wires?

Macs (and most Windows PCs) do not require a special driver to function with USB MIDI as one is included with the OS. I believe this is true of all Kawai instruments that feature a USB MIDI port, including the VPC1. It should just be a case of connecting the VPC1 to your Mac using a standard USB A-B cable (included), waiting a few seconds for Mac OS X to install its built-in USB-MIDI driver, then starting your VI/DAW software.

However, thank you for raising this point, as I realise now that this part of the Q&A needs to be clarified further.

Originally Posted By: HisKidd

Please bear with me, but I'm still confused about the Touch Curve settings. According to the literature, these are manually assigned. How then will I be able to do that without benefit of the VPC editor?

I believe this is explained in the owner's manual, and will be covered in a later section of the Q&A once the VPC website goes live. Essentially, pressing and holding the power button, then pressing one of the five lowermost black keys selects the preset memory. By default, these are assigned to the different 'approved touch curves' that ship with the instrument, but these can also store key velocity offset information, and settings related to MIDI channels and routing.

Originally Posted By: HisKidd

Finally, the point is made that once assigned to one of the five memory slots, the computer is no longer needed. Would not the computer be necessary anyway to play the VST?

Yes, if you're using the VPC1 to control virtual piano software running on a PC, it's likely that the computer will be close by. However, there may be a situation whereby the computer is located elsewhere, but you still need to access different preset memories to select alternative MIDI routings etc.

Alternatively, if you're using a Mac and wish to change from the 'Default' touch curve to one of the built-in 'approved' touch curves, it will be necessary to use the button+keyboard procedure mentioned above. Note that you would only need to do this once as the previously selected memory is recalled each time the VPC1 is turned on.

Finally, while the VPC1 is intended primarily for use with virtual piano software, there may be scenarios where you use the board to control an external sound module or semi-weighted instrument such as a Nord or Korg etc. Perhaps you've set up different touch curves, velocity offsets, or MIDI channel/routing settings for a variety of devices - in this case, the button+keyboard combination allows the five memories to be selected without the need for a computer.

Originally Posted By: HisKidd

I am seriously interested because of the action of the VPC as a second board for the studio only. However, it is incomprehensible to me that anything having to do with graphics, design, or music would not be supported by Mac OS. Are we to understand these limitations would also apply to Logic and Garage Band? Complete clarification would be much appreciated, and thanks in advance,

Again, the VPC1 will function perfectly with a Mac using either standard MIDI IN/OUT cables or a USB cable using OS X's built-in USB-MIDI driver. Not being able to use the VPC Editor should not affect Logic or GarageBand etc.

You're absolutely right, however for the time being, the VPC Editor software is Windows only.

It could perhaps be argued that Windows users by their nature are more inclined to 'tweaking' than Mac users, and that the inclusion of 'approved touch curves' built into the VPC1 should negate the need for such adjustments.

However, the fact remains that Mac users make up a sizeable proportion of virtual piano players, so we need to find a way to make the VPC Editor available for OS X.

It could perhaps be argued that Windows users by their nature are more inclined to 'tweaking' than Mac users, and that the inclusion of 'approved touch curves' built into the VPC1 should negate the need for such adjustments.

It could perhaps be argued that Windows users by their nature are more inclined to 'tweaking' than Mac users, and that the inclusion of 'approved touch curves' built into the VPC1 should negate the need for such adjustments.

Good point. The default 'Normal' touch curve should work absolutely fine with the Nord Piano Library (it's what I've bee using on the MP8II to control my Electro), but a properly prepared touch curve would certainly be the icing on the cake.

1) I understand from your remarks that the curve of the VPC is so little that is a non-issue. Good to know ! Padding most people can provide for themselves. A nice fitting Kawai laptop pad would be welcome, but I fully understand that it's beyond the scope of Kawai making DP's and not all kind of (3rd party) accessories .

2) Mac editor. We'll see what comes out in the future. At least the controller works out of the box as it should with both Mac and pc and for touch control die hards you could use e.g. parallels or boot camp in the meantime.

3) Music Rest. Point taken. It's just that when you compare the extra translucent rest of the ES7 to the basic steel or iron rest of the mp6/ VPC , with a little bit more effort a rest could have been made for the VPC that at least looks a bit better and fits well to the otherwise classy design. Perhaps when the VPC becomes a big selling hit, it will be profitable enough to provide something like that as an extra accessoiry...

Anyway - I think Kawai succeeded in filling a gap in the DP/controller market where until now only products like Numa Nero resided. No secret that not everyone particularly liked these boards. Well done, few small side notes / suggestions (as always).

Okay, time to call it a night. It's been a busy day of fielding queries across multiple forums, responding to PMs, and supporting the press coverage.

Thanks to everyone for their feedback.

Cheers,Jamesx

James, thank you for your most helpful answers to so many questions. I appeciate your taking the time to render excellent service. I am a Kawai devotee, and have always found Kawai to be be customer friendly. Perhaps this is the result of being a family business. As a prospective buyer of the VPC, your insights and explanations are invaluable. I'll stay tuned for all we learn in the coming days about the VPC1.Regards!H.K.

On a similar note, it's perhaps worth pointing out the 'wife acceptance factor' (WAF) of the VPC1. We often hear from folks wishing to buy an MP10 or similar such stage piano, but their other half simply will not allow it in the living room. I believe the clutter-free top surface of the VPC1 may help in this respect.

James, don't you think ALL stage pianos score bad on this? The main issue I think is all the cables (pedal, midi, speaker, power,...). Below is Gatsbee13's picture from NAMM. What is the WAF score on this set-up?

I rather think the clean and shiny design of the VPC is true to Kawai's DNA of being an excellent acoustic piano maker. I love the looks of the VPC as I think it looks very elegant. Well done Kawai!!!

Although the VPC looks a lovely product and I am sure the piano action will be superb, I feel that the combination of weight (rather heavy), price (pretty expensive) and lack of modulation/pitch wheels will make it a slow seller. I have an MP10 which is great and I also have all the VST piano software as flagged up as optimised for the VPC. I can say that the basic default settings on the MP10 seem to be absolutely fine with all this piano software and I never had the need to tweak anything. Maybe I have not understood the subtlety of the whole thing but I think that may be the same for many other people too. The VPC will not be suitable as the sole studio keyboard and obviously will not suit any player wanting to gig without a computer. For the player wanting to gig with computer set up then they have to be happy to carry a heavy piece of gear around.

The new Casio PX-5s on the other hand looks ideal for gigging, is very light to carry and is much cheaper. It also has built-in sounds and lots of keyboard controller features. Undoubtedly the Kawai will have a better key action but the new Privia action is already winning praise and is likely to be good enough for many gigging/studio players.

Kawai's decision to omit modulation wheel/pitch bend and the overall weight of the product will I think lose many customers. I am also very surprised to hear about the lack of Apple OS compatibility.

Overall I am surprised about these shortcomings and feel uncertain about the likely commercial success therefore.

On a similar note, it's perhaps worth pointing out the 'wife acceptance factor' (WAF) of the VPC1. We often hear from folks wishing to buy an MP10 or similar such stage piano, but their other half simply will not allow it in the living room. I believe the clutter-free top surface of the VPC1 may help in this respect.

James, don't you think ALL stage pianos score bad on this? The main issue I think is all the cables (pedal, midi, speaker, power,...). Below is Gatsbee13's picture from NAMM. What is the WAF score on this set-up?

Yes, I also cringed a little upon seeing that picture! Not the tidiest of setups - looks like the plastic shipping caps are still on the pedals too. However there appear to be three sets of headphones being used (?), which isn't a typical setup, and I expect most of the cabling could be tidied/pinned to improve the appearance.

The point I was trying to make is that the VPC1 is more classically styled and 'piano-like' than other controllers, especially without all the knobs, faders, and button etc.

Although the VPC looks a lovely product and I am sure the piano action will be superb, I feel that the combination of weight (rather heavy), price (pretty expensive) and lack of modulation/pitch wheels will make it a slow seller.

I appreciate the point you're making. I also don't really believe this board will be flying off the shelves (it's too heavy for one...), however I'm hopeful that it will become something of a 'slow burner'. The number of players gravitating towards virtual piano software will surely continue to grow in future. And with its superior keyboard action and approval from the major developers, the VPC1 is well positioned to become the 'go to' board for such applications. A niche market, certainly, but one that is expanding.

Originally Posted By: funkycornwall

I have an MP10 which is great and I also have all the VST piano software as flagged up as optimised for the VPC. I can say that the basic default settings on the MP10 seem to be absolutely fine with all this piano software and I never had the need to tweak anything. Maybe I have not understood the subtlety of the whole thing but I think that may be the same for many other people too.

Yes, the MP10's 'Normal' touch curve is already very well suited to a number of the popular virtual piano packages. This is perhaps because some developers utilise a Kawai MP to create their software. However, as I mentioned earlier, the approved touch curves are the extra layer of icing on what is already a pretty delcious cake. During testing for the VPC1, many players had the chance to play both the 'Normal' touch curve and the 'approved' touch curve for each package, with the majority preferring the connection of the 'approved' touch. This was obviously true for the developers too, who had access to VPC1 prototypes during the development of the board.

Originally Posted By: funkycornwall

The VPC will not be suitable as the sole studio keyboard...

I believe this depends on the musician, and obviously the kind of music they're recording/composing. If the lack of controls does transpire to be an issue, an inexpensive MIDI surface or synth can be added very easily.

Originally Posted By: funkycornwall

and obviously will not suit any player wanting to gig without a computer. For the player wanting to gig with computer set up then they have to be happy to carry a heavy piece of gear around.

Again, I believe this depends on the individual. The VPC1 obviously isn't as portable as a Nord, however if the performer really demands the best keyboard action, I'm sure the'll find a way to accommodate the extra weight. The MP8/MP10 are also heavy boards, but it's not uncommon to see such instruments as part of a professional player's live setup...and the VPC1 is lighter than both.

Originally Posted By: funkycornwall

The new Casio PX-5s on the other hand looks ideal for gigging, is very light to carry and is much cheaper. It also has built-in sounds and lots of keyboard controller features. Undoubtedly the Kawai will have a better key action but the new Privia action is already winning praise and is likely to be good enough for many gigging/studio players.

I agree, the new Casio PX-5S offers a very impressive package (although I'm personally not crazy about the two-tone looks...) at a great price and weight. However beyond the number of keys, I don't really see any relationship to the VPC1. The two boards occupy quite different segments of the market in my opinion.

Originally Posted By: funkycornwall

Kawai's decision to omit modulation wheel/pitch bend and the overall weight of the product will I think lose many customers.

Yes, the lack of pitchbend/modulation wheel is undoubtedly a controversial decision. It's a deal-breaker for some, but of little concern for others.

Originally Posted By: funkycornwall

I am also very surprised to hear about the lack of Apple OS compatibility.

Yes, this is a disappointment. But not being able to use the VPC Editor software on OS X shouldn't prevent Mac-owning virtual piano players from enjoying the VPC1 with the board's built-in approved touch curves.

Originally Posted By: funkycornwall

Overall I am surprised about these shortcomings and feel uncertain about the likely commercial success therefore.

Well, this remains to be seen. The response so far has been mixed, but judging from the amount of discussion online, there's little doubting that the VPC1 is quite an interesting product. Despite your somewhat negative tone, I do appreciate reading your comments, especially as I know you're an experienced musician. It just remains for me to say keep on enjoying your MP10.

God you folks are letting your imaginations run away with you .... It's a 88 key controller keyboard with one of the best actions if not THE best action in the business ... Speakers, audio interfaces, software .... Why complicate it ? I see my NAMM prediction has come true before NAMM has even opened ... As soon as something is announced there is someone bitching about what it isn't instead of what it is ....

Originally Posted By: Dr Popper

My prediction is that no matter what is announced from where that someone will be on this forum complaining about it.

Played the VPC this afternoon. It feels similiar to the MP10...nice. It was hooked up to Ivory in the Kawai booth and monitored through phones (not very good ones btw). Again both nice sound and action although I was getting quite a bit of latency with the sound to action connection. Much more so then just a regular DP. I don't know if that can be adjusted or what...that's above my pay grade.

That new CS-10 was very nice ! Aside from the 9' Shigeru, my favorite keyboard in the room.

I'm not sure why you experienced latency with the VPC and laptop. As far as I'm aware it was a brand new computer with a good quality audio interface and fresh installations of the four piano packages. But I'll certainly pass on your comments to my colleagues working at the booth.

Good to hear your thoughts about the CS10 too. This is a new, improved version of the CS9, featuring the latest sound/action technology from the CA95. As other American forum regulars may know, the CS9 was not marketed in the US, so the appearance of the CS10 at NAMM should be warmly received.

Somewhat further off topic, but did you try the new GX grands? This is a new models that will succeed the RX range, and feature a number of the improvements introduced with the new Shigeru instruments last year.

God you folks are letting your imaginations run away with you .... It's a 88 key controller keyboard with one of the best actions if not THE best action in the business ... Speakers, audio interfaces, software .... Why complicate it ? I see my NAMM prediction has come true before NAMM has even opened ... As soon as something is announced there is someone bitching about what it isn't instead of what it is ....

Originally Posted By: Dr Popper

My prediction is that no matter what is announced from where that someone will be on this forum complaining about it.

For some time now, I have been daydreaming and breamstorming with my dad, an inventor aged 72, about building a unique audiophile-grade digital Grand (which does not exist to the present day, that is also taking the N3 and V-grand into account). I imagine the VPC could be a great starting point for this project...