The whole cannabis angle being played up is simply the DPD trying to deflect attention to their poor response to this woman's call for help. Whether it was the dispatcher that didn't take her claims seriously enough or the patrol officers taking their sweet time to get to the scene, when someone threatens physical violence to themselves or others there is no excuse for a more than a 13 minute response time in the inner city.

This is a tragic incident, and there's a lot of speculation and finger pointing going on. What's actually needed is a thorough investigation as soon as possible, and the police department needs to release all details, but not until the facts are determined. Personally,I don't know what the procedures are for dispatching police when a 911 call comes in. It looks like they should have been faster, but I'm not in a position to judge, and neither are the other writers unless they worked as police dispatchers.

irisman wrote:This is a tragic incident, and there's a lot of speculation and finger pointing going on. What's actually needed is a thorough investigation as soon as possible, and the police department needs to release all details, but not until the facts are determined. Personally,I don't know what the procedures are for dispatching police when a 911 call comes in. It looks like they should have been faster, but I'm not in a position to judge, and neither are the other writers unless they worked as police dispatchers.

Typical suburbanite. You're acting like this is a first time occurrence. If you had been paying attention you would know that stuff like this happens frequently in Denver under the not-so-watchful eye of incompetent Mayor Michael Hancock. Every week there is a different story about our town's bumbling police department. Sometimes the results are disasterous.

Postgrad wrote;The point with the distance is that it is not far, meaning there was no excuse for it taking 16 minutes. So, yes, it is relevant. The police could have briskly walked there in 16 minutes. So, yes, there is plenty of logic to the distance from the station. And it doesn't take long to zip down University or Evans from anywhere in the district. Certainly not 16 minutes. Please stop making excuses for failure.

Second, yes, they do have plenty of time. I lived in the area. You can see them sitting around in their cars or haplessly trying to find something to do as they are out in nearby areas, which doesn't seem to stop the car thefts. I myself have been followed around by them. Anyway, there's no excuse for a 16 minute response time. You think there weren't any cars in the area? There's always at least two. I can guarantee they didn't send a car from the other side of the district.

Okay, put down the bong and pay attention, I'll try to go slow. The proximity of the police station to the home, whether near or far, is not relevant. Patrol officers do not sit around at the station - they patrol. There is no logic to that line of thought.

You have no real idea what the cops you see are doing or what they just finished doing or where they're going, unless you both carry a police scanner around with you and you are psychic. I think it's hilarious that you complain that them hanging around "doesn't seem to stop the car thefts", and in the very next breath mention that you "have been followed around by them". This leads me to believe that you project the appearance of someone who would be doing something suspicious such as breaking into cars.

And you finish off with the punchline; "I can guarantee they didn't send a car from the other side of the district." No, in fact, you can guarantee no such thing. You have absolutely no idea what other circumstances were occurring at the time of this incident, no idea, none. Your guarantee is completely meaningless.

And just incase you think I'm some cop sticking up for other cops, I'll guarantee you that I'm not. I have spent time in more than one police station, involuntarily. My point here is not so much to defend their response time as to point out the logic fail of everyone pointing out how close the home was to the district house.

irisman wrote:This is a tragic incident, and there's a lot of speculation and finger pointing going on. What's actually needed is a thorough investigation as soon as possible, and the police department needs to release all details, but not until the facts are determined. Personally,I don't know what the procedures are for dispatching police when a 911 call comes in. It looks like they should have been faster, but I'm not in a position to judge, and neither are the other writers unless they worked as police dispatchers.

Just last November an audit of DPD response times showed that they have been slower even compared to a year prior. However the results showed:

And it takes officers an average of 7.2 minutes to respond to "critical incidents," compared to the 5.9 minutes it took to respond to the same kinds of incidents last year.

Domestic disputes, such as this one, fall into the highest priority level. In this cases the caller was on the phone for 13 minutes before she was killed and the police were not on scene until 15 minutes after the call was placed. That is more than double for the average response time for a call of this nature even taking into account the already slowed response time from the previous year. Take the info for what that is worth.

Big Lug wrote:Ah yes. A few years ago, Denver mayor Hancock and other city so-called "leaders" were bellyaching that the city didn't have enough money for basic services. In 2012 voters foolishly voted yes to Denver Measure 2, which is a forever property tax increase. We stupidly gave them an open checkbook.

According to media accounts, the tax increase won by 75%. Is it really possible that 75% of the public voted to increase their taxes during a recession?

Postgrad wrote;The point with the distance is that it is not far, meaning there was no excuse for it taking 16 minutes. So, yes, it is relevant. The police could have briskly walked there in 16 minutes. So, yes, there is plenty of logic to the distance from the station. And it doesn't take long to zip down University or Evans from anywhere in the district. Certainly not 16 minutes. Please stop making excuses for failure.

Second, yes, they do have plenty of time. I lived in the area. You can see them sitting around in their cars or haplessly trying to find something to do as they are out in nearby areas, which doesn't seem to stop the car thefts. I myself have been followed around by them. Anyway, there's no excuse for a 16 minute response time. You think there weren't any cars in the area? There's always at least two. I can guarantee they didn't send a car from the other side of the district.

Okay, put down the bong and pay attention, I'll try to go slow. The proximity of the police station to the home, whether near or far, is not relevant. Patrol officers do not sit around at the station - they patrol. There is no logic to that line of thought.

You have no real idea what the cops you see are doing or what they just finished doing or where they're going, unless you both carry a police scanner around with you and you are psychic. I think it's hilarious that you complain that them hanging around "doesn't seem to stop the car thefts", and in the very next breath mention that you "have been followed around by them". This leads me to believe that you project the appearance of someone who would be doing something suspicious such as breaking into cars.

And you finish off with the punchline; "I can guarantee they didn't send a car from the other side of the district." No, in fact, you can guarantee no such thing. You have absolutely no idea what other circumstances were occurring at the time of this incident, no idea, none. Your guarantee is completely meaningless.

And just incase you think I'm some cop sticking up for other cops, I'll guarantee you that I'm not. I have spent time in more than one police station, involuntarily. My point here is not so much to defend their response time as to point out the logic fail of everyone pointing out how close the home was to the district house.

Spend some time in that part of the city. Officers are constantly patrolling the Wash Park area, they are constantly heading down Buchtel, Steele, Evans, Louisiana, Iowa, and Downing. There's no way that officers were not in the area. That police station is substantial in size, and they are buzzing in and out. Go stand on a corner down there and see. There's a nationally known university right there as well. The police officers were not all the way across the other side of the district. What part of town are you in? You just don't seem familiar at all with that part of town or what it's like. I know the area, and I know officers are constantly around nearby. And yes, there are officers at the station, because it's the district station--not a small outpost. There's no excuse for it having taken so long. And like another poster pointed out, if there had been an officer or a council member involved, you better believe the response time would have been a lot quicker. My guess is no one in this quieter district wanted to respond to a call involving a gun.

Last edited by Postgrad on April 17th, 2014, 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

irisman wrote:This is a tragic incident, and there's a lot of speculation and finger pointing going on. What's actually needed is a thorough investigation as soon as possible, and the police department needs to release all details, but not until the facts are determined. Personally,I don't know what the procedures are for dispatching police when a 911 call comes in. It looks like they should have been faster, but I'm not in a position to judge, and neither are the other writers unless they worked as police dispatchers.

Typical suburbanite. You're acting like this is a first time occurrence. If you had been paying attention you would know that stuff like this happens frequently in Denver under the not-so-watchful eye of incompetent Mayor Michael Hancock. Every week there is a different story about our town's bumbling police department. Sometimes the results are disasterous.

Typical Denverite. You keep electing them and expect different results. What's that called?

Maybe 911 should have sent a firetruck instead, which would have been there in less than five minutes, probably saving her life. The cops probably had to finish a dozen doughnuts before they could leave.

boyhowdy wrote:Maybe 911 should have sent a firetruck instead, which would have been there in less than five minutes, probably saving her life. The cops probably had to finish their coffee and doughnuts before they could leave.

Wrong, the fire department will not enter any building when a gun is involved before police.

boyhowdy wrote:Maybe 911 should have sent a firetruck instead, which would have been there in less than five minutes, probably saving her life. The cops probably had to finish their coffee and doughnuts before they could leave.

Wrong, the fire department will not enter any building when a gun is involved before police.

Ah. Maybe not, but at least they would have been there. They probably could have picked up a random police officer or security guard somewhere else and dropped him off there quicker than the officers responding to this call. I can get all the way from Stapleton to Downtown in 16 minutes, and the police officers here couldn't go all of 12 blocks.

I think the DP misses the point. We in the West have a long history of free drug use; it is part of our culture and a God-given right. It would be an infringement on our rights to limit it and elected officials trying to limit it should be voted out.

The pot didn't kill this unfortunate woman; rather a gun with an unbalanced owner did. Let's investigate the use of guns that caused her death.

boyhowdy wrote:Maybe 911 should have sent a firetruck instead, which would have been there in less than five minutes, probably saving her life. The cops probably had to finish their coffee and doughnuts before they could leave.

Wrong, the fire department will not enter any building when a gun is involved before police.

Ah. Maybe not, but at least they would have been there. They probably could have picked up a random police officer or security guard somewhere else and dropped him off there quicker than the officers responding to this call. I can get all the way from Stapleton to Downtown in 16 minutes, and the police officers here couldn't go all of 12 blocks.

By "there" I can only assume you mean parked in the street waiting for police backup. It's fine to call into question the leadership. To put down those that are on the streets is foolish at best. This is a tragedy to be sure. There are also a lot of unknowns. At what point did the dispatcher notify police? Is 16 minutes too long? In this case it certainly was (condolences to the family). I've heard complaints against Denver police for many years (30 plus). I've also heard the same complaints about police in just about every major city I have ever lived in. As for "security guard", they are not law enforcement, and therefore have no bearing in the case. Your drive from Stapleton to downtown has zero to do with anything, except your arrival at work. I trust that is your only goal when you leave in the morning. I suspect the problem is with Hancock, the city counsel and chief White, in that order. Not the cops on the beat.

boyhowdy wrote:Maybe 911 should have sent a firetruck instead, which would have been there in less than five minutes, probably saving her life. The cops probably had to finish their coffee and doughnuts before they could leave.

Wrong, the fire department will not enter any building when a gun is involved before police.

Ah. Maybe not, but at least they would have been there. They probably could have picked up a random police officer or security guard somewhere else and dropped him off there quicker than the officers responding to this call. I can get all the way from Stapleton to Downtown in 16 minutes, and the police officers here couldn't go all of 12 blocks.

By "there" I can only assume you mean parked in the street waiting for police backup. It's fine to call into question the leadership. To put down those that are on the streets is foolish at best. This is a tragedy to be sure. There are also a lot of unknowns. At what point did the dispatcher notify police? Is 16 minutes too long? In this case it certainly was (condolences to the family). I've heard complaints against Denver police for many years (30 plus). I've also heard the same complaints about police in just about every major city I have ever lived in. As for "security guard", they are not law enforcement, and therefore have no bearing in the case. Your drive from Stapleton to downtown has zero to do with anything, except your arrival at work. I trust that is your only goal when you leave in the morning. I suspect the problem is with Hancock, the city counsel and chief White, in that order. Not the cops on the beat.

Gerald, follow the topic and posts. If a fireman can't enter the building when a gun is involved, then someone else would have to. A security guard would do just fine. At least someone would have been there. And it's council, not counsel. Like I said in many posts ago, if you'd read them, the lady's call appears to have been downplayed. We're not being told what level priority it was given. So, the problem with the 911 dispatch is still an unresolved problem. I think you'll find most problems in the City are unresolved, because the government isn't that great at fixing them. We still have issues with officers. So, sorry if officers are impugned, but that happens. We're not going to wallpaper over a problem. Problems need to be dealt with, not smiled over for the sake of feelings. And the department being unwilling to release the tapes as well as make comments is not the way to go forward.

gino wrote:If you should find yourself in a life-threatening emergency in Denver, consider yourself absolutely on your own. Plan accordingly.

Yeah, and it probably would have been better if she had taken the children and left. People try and use the police as an arbitrator in their arguments. In this case, she might not have been able to get the kids and leave. And she can't leave them. She relied on the police here. The police take care of themselves.

boyhowdy wrote:Maybe 911 should have sent a firetruck instead, which would have been there in less than five minutes, probably saving her life. The cops probably had to finish their coffee and doughnuts before they could leave.

Wrong, the fire department will not enter any building when a gun is involved before police.

Ah. Maybe not, but at least they would have been there. They probably could have picked up a random police officer or security guard somewhere else and dropped him off there quicker than the officers responding to this call. I can get all the way from Stapleton to Downtown in 16 minutes, and the police officers here couldn't go all of 12 blocks.

By "there" I can only assume you mean parked in the street waiting for police backup. It's fine to call into question the leadership. To put down those that are on the streets is foolish at best. This is a tragedy to be sure. There are also a lot of unknowns. At what point did the dispatcher notify police? Is 16 minutes too long? In this case it certainly was (condolences to the family). I've heard complaints against Denver police for many years (30 plus). I've also heard the same complaints about police in just about every major city I have ever lived in. As for "security guard", they are not law enforcement, and therefore have no bearing in the case. Your drive from Stapleton to downtown has zero to do with anything, except your arrival at work. I trust that is your only goal when you leave in the morning. I suspect the problem is with Hancock, the city counsel and chief White, in that order. Not the cops on the beat.

Gerald, follow the topic and posts. If a fireman can't enter the building when a gun is involved, then someone else would have to. A security guard would do just fine. At least someone would have been there. And it's council, not counsel. Like I said in many posts ago, if you'd read them, the lady's call appears to have been downplayed. We're not being told what level priority it was given. So, the problem with the 911 dispatch is still an unresolved problem. I think you'll find most problems in the City are unresolved, because the government isn't that great at fixing them. We still have issues with officers. So, sorry if officers are impugned, but that happens. We're not going to wallpaper over a problem. Problems need to be dealt with, not smiled over for the sake of feelings. And the department being unwilling to release the tapes as well as make comments is not the way to go forward.

Please excuse my spelling error. I am unfortunately not a post grad living in Stapleton.

Postgrad wrote;Gerald, follow the topic and posts. If a fireman can't enter the building when a gun is involved, then someone else would have to. A security guard would do just fine. At least someone would have been there...... We're not going to wallpaper over a problem.

Except a security guard has no police powers, if a security guard enters someone's home and the homeowner shoots him, the homeowner could conceivably invoke the 'castle doctrine' law.

Postgrad wrote;Gerald, follow the topic and posts. If a fireman can't enter the building when a gun is involved, then someone else would have to. A security guard would do just fine. At least someone would have been there...... We're not going to wallpaper over a problem.

Except a security guard has no police powers, if a security guard enters someone's home and the homeowner shoots him, the homeowner could conceivably invoke the 'castle doctrine' law.

And who is we, you got a mouse in your pocket?

The point is at least someone would have been there to help her.

"We" are the people who care. Care enough to want to do the right thing and fix problems.