I am actually very curious as to what our OOC schedule looks like . I heard that , although the A-10 cannot have a say in it , they expressed their displeasure with last season's line-up. Hard to believe we were 5-7. Can't wait for another showdown with Lipscomb.

Nothing replaces success in the revenue sports. Nothing. That's not to take away from the success in the Olympic sports - they do matter. It isn't a replacement for success in the flagship sports. - Debbie Yow, AD - NC State

I am actually very curious as to what our OOC schedule looks like . I heard that , although the A-10 cannot have a say in it , they expressed their displeasure with last season's line-up. Hard to believe we were 5-7. Can't wait for another showdown with Lipscomb.

I think we've been over this. Fordham's OOC schedule was appropriate for where it was (talking strength, not necessarily regional or "name" match-ups or timing, etc., which also drew complaints).

I find it hard to believe the A-10 would complain. Five A-10 schools had easier OOC schedules than Fordham per Kenpom. Fordham's OOC rank was 244 (Fordham itself ranked 202). And Syracuse always has a weak OOC even with some big time games salted in. Their OOC was 248, lower than Fordham's. I doubt the Big east or now ACC ever complained.

GW was at 207, Richmond 214. Given their ranks well below weight class. Then we start getting into tougher schedules. La Salle 124 was clearly above its weight class. Sain Joseph's 64. Dayton 77. davidson 98. Rhodey 113. VCU 128. Most teams have weaker schedules than their rank. Rhode Island was ranked in the top 25 and ended as Kenpom 34. Their opponents are 77 spots lower, Fordham's 42 spots lower. The Bonnie's were ranked 180 spots higher than their average OOC opponent.

You can't always tell how strong your slate will be. This year's OOC was stronger than last year's, which was ranked 350. The second worst in all D-1.

Fordham was 4-2 against lower ranked teams (although Rider was actually ranked fairly close to Fordham, and NYIT isn't Div-I) and 2-5 against higher ranked teams in OOC. The Manhattan and Sacred Heart losses were the bad losses.

Kenpom isn't the be all and end all. He doesn't distinguish between D-1 or D-II games and uses scoring margin, which is fine, but Lipscomb beat the crap out of a few non-D-I teams. Piedmont, Sewanee and Fisk. They also beat Missouri on the road. And they beat Florida Gulf Coast.

All in all Fordham's OOC strength was fair for where the team was. The team was a little worse than expected, and no doubt Sacred Heart and Manhattan were bad losses. Manhattan was of course a road traditional rivalry game. It's the losses more than the schedule itself. Duquesne lost to Tennessee-Martin, UMBC and Robert Morris, none quite as bad as the Sacred Heart, but not exactly murderer's row. The Bonnie's lost to Little Rock, Kenpom 245. Teams schedule some cupcakes and upsets happen.

I am actually very curious as to what our OOC schedule looks like . I heard that , although the A-10 cannot have a say in it , they expressed their displeasure with last season's line-up. Hard to believe we were 5-7. Can't wait for another showdown with Lipscomb.

Did you hear that they expressed displeasure with the 5 other schools that had weaker schedules? Where does one here something like this? I'm curious.

I, and others who attend games, are over the cupcake no-name teams we play. One or two fine, you need that at the very beginning of the season, but we need games that will challenge us and also that will draw interest for people to come watch.

I, and others who attend games, are over the cupcake no-name teams we play. One or two fine, you need that at the very beginning of the season, but we need games that will challenge us and also that will draw interest for people to come watch.

It's a bit of Catch-22.

Games that will challenge us and also draw interest can often lead to very poor OOC records and subsequently to lack of interest b/c we are always getting beat. Is getting 500 to 1000 more people in the stands going to make us a better program? I think that getting some winning way going is more important, then you can upgrade your schedule as you progress. I thought next year would have been a good year for a slight upgrade, but I do not feel that way anymore due to the recent developments.

Nothing replaces success in the revenue sports. Nothing. That's not to take away from the success in the Olympic sports - they do matter. It isn't a replacement for success in the flagship sports. - Debbie Yow, AD - NC State

I believe that our OOC schedule needs to reflect first and foremost where we are as a program each year and over the past few seasons and likely next season we need to be able to rack up some wins heading into the A10 schedule

That could well mean that we continue to play games against teams that do not get the fan base excited, but until we improve we will not be booking games against top notch teams unless we want to run the risk of losing, potentially badly

Could we play weaker teams that generate more interest, maybe, but who would those teams be? Local teams possibly but does anyone care about lower conference teams like LIU or FDU? We barely fill the gym when we play supposed long term rivals like Manhattan

Would we or should we play schools in areas where we want to recruit? With the changes in recruiting and transfers it seems that that old traditional logic has no value

Games that will challenge us and also draw interest can often lead to very poor OOC records and subsequently to lack of interest b/c we are always getting beat. Is getting 500 to 1000 more people in the stands going to make us a better program? I think that getting some winning way going is more important, then you can upgrade your schedule as you progress. I thought next year would have been a good year for a slight upgrade, but I do not feel that way anymore due to the recent developments.

Agreed. And some casual fans have no idea who cupcakes are, anyway. East Tennessee and Texas Arlington are top 75 Kenpom teams but folks around here probably think Iona and Hofstra are better. Not that I'd mind some games with teams like that, or Georgetown, Notre Dame. You still need some cupcakes now and then.

The Johnny Bach Classic if made annual is a good opportunity to bring balance to the OOC schedule. St Peter's and Lipscomb ended up decent but those 3 games looked fairly dreadful at first. If we are going to get a team who would not ordinarily come to the RHG here, it would be in that format where they don't have a pre-conference tournament invite but want to replicate a tourney experience with back-to-back-to-back games. You could integrate an invite to them into a home and home arrangement, just throwing out feasible options maybe DePaul, or Charlotte, or South Florida (though I don't think USF even has 5 players right now).

I was looking at this year to get into another preseason tournament but we would have likely needed 15+ wins to be considered and then our transfers have made it a poor idea.

If the A-10 was going to complain about our line-up it would have been in 15-16 as that was a weaker schedule than last year. Any complaints last year would have been about losing to the lineup but I doubt that happened although it would have been justified.

Nothing replaces success in the revenue sports. Nothing. That's not to take away from the success in the Olympic sports - they do matter. It isn't a replacement for success in the flagship sports. - Debbie Yow, AD - NC State

Nothing replaces success in the revenue sports. Nothing. That's not to take away from the success in the Olympic sports - they do matter. It isn't a replacement for success in the flagship sports. - Debbie Yow, AD - NC State

Nothing replaces success in the revenue sports. Nothing. That's not to take away from the success in the Olympic sports - they do matter. It isn't a replacement for success in the flagship sports. - Debbie Yow, AD - NC State

As of now, Fordham and Duquesne are the only two A-10 schools that have not been reported as participants in an early season tournament. There are several power conference teams that are in the same boat, and some interesting tournaments that have not been filled. I am not hitting the panic button, but would like to see some positive news. Here is a link to a site that tracks OOC tournament schedules:

Nothing replaces success in the revenue sports. Nothing. That's not to take away from the success in the Olympic sports - they do matter. It isn't a replacement for success in the flagship sports. - Debbie Yow, AD - NC State

Nothing replaces success in the revenue sports. Nothing. That's not to take away from the success in the Olympic sports - they do matter. It isn't a replacement for success in the flagship sports. - Debbie Yow, AD - NC State

As of now, Fordham and Duquesne are the only two A-10 schools that have not been reported as participants in an early season tournament. There are several power conference teams that are in the same boat, and some interesting tournaments that have not been filled. I am not hitting the panic button, but would like to see some positive news. Here is a link to a site that tracks OOC tournament schedules:

Kenpom isn't the be all and end all. He doesn't distinguish between D-1 or D-II games and uses scoring margin, which is fine, but Lipscomb beat the crap out of a few non-D-I teams. Piedmont, Sewanee and Fisk. They also beat Missouri on the road. And they beat Florida Gulf Coast.

Pomeroy doesn't use D-II games at all in his model. Playing a D2 or D3 team is the same as taking the night off when it comes to his model. Beating the crap out of a non-D1 team is irrelevant.