I'm suprised they did not show the Calendar and To Do functions. This is the Killer-app on my Treo. I'd be lost without it.

Someone brought up lack of IR, so it cannot be used as a remote. At first I thought that was a pretty gay suggestion, but now I think if anyone could solve the problem of TOO MANY REMOTES, it's Apple.

Not sure why everyone is whining about screen smudges. I NEVER clean the screen of my Treo, and when it's ON it looks perfect. You only see the smudges when the screen is off. I'm also rought on it, and carry it in the same pocket with keys, etc, and the screen holds up remarkably well against scratches. I'm sure the iPhone will, too.

I doubt we'll see a hard-drive version. But the memory will eventually increase.

Why do so many people want 2 batteries?

I think the price is right. Costs less than my Treo 650 did when new.

The iPhone will change the world.

BTW: new iPods sporting the same design as the iPhone will appear soon.

i agree. there's no way that this is the final product. it has six months before it's even on the market, and it's APPLE! correct me if i'm wrong, but in roughly 10 months they went from clickwheel ipod to ipod photo to ipod color to ipod video. not to mention at the same time, ipod mini - ipod mini upgrade - ipod nano. at the same time, they were rewriting all of os x for intel computers, updating their computer line, and much more that we don't even know about. so.. six more months of development is my guess.

I expect that Apple and 3rd party developers will create a LOT of widgets for the iPhone.

So far, the official word is that NO 3rd-party apps allowed. I think this will change as soon as they have a version of Xcode that is optimized for creating and compiling (non-PPC or Intel CPU) programs for the iPhone's advanced interface.

You can always use Google Docs and Spreadsheets, assuming you are connected to the internet. TextEdit should come standard, hopefully.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IHateRegistering

Can you get it inscribed when you order from the Apple Store?

I hadn't thought of that. For $500 - $600 I expect Jobs to do the actuall encoding.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IHateRegistering

Someone brought up lack of IR, so it cannot be used as a remote.

I'm glad they didn't add this feature. It already has Wi-Fi and Bluetooth so i hope I can eventually use my iPhone to control my AppleTV.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IHateRegistering

Why do so many people want 2 batteries?

One for phone functionality and one for other non-essential stuff like video and music. This way, even if you deplete your media battery, you still have juice left to power the phone. I think the logic here is that if the phone battery dies first it would then pull from the media battery.

Delving even deeper, Apple doesn't have to go to that much trouble. Instead, all it has to do is use its power management too disallow the media functions when the battery gets to a certain percentage.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IHateRegistering

The iPhone will change the world.

I think it already has. The one feature I think is sweet is the Random Access Voicemail. SMS and eMail have had these features for years. It seems so obvoious in retrospect. I wonder how long it'll before the other carriers and manufactures can get together to implement this system. I imagine that this was definitely something they want to include. Will they be able to pull if off?

Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"

So far, the official word is that NO 3rd-party apps allowed. I think this will change as soon as they have a version of Xcode that is optimized for creating and compiling (non-PPC or Intel CPU) programs for the iPhone's advanced interface.

iTunes is also a great place to buy extra services/Cool Mini Apps. I want iWork/iLife Lite, WiFi or Bluetooth Remote Control App for my Mac and Apple TV and some kind of Optical Charcater Recognition app for document scanning and automatic output as PDF etc... That should just about keep me oocupied for the next 5 years!

You know Mel, saying those two things over and over aren't going to make them true. So far you have provided no evidence that either of these things are true.

For the first point, if Jobs said it, please provide the time stamp for the time at which he said it during the keynote.

For the second, you seem to assume that because of the E-911 regs, all phones have AGPS. But as others have pointed out several times, a mobile can triangulate its position using network basestations to an accuracy that meets the E-911 regs. Triangulation using basestations is not AGPS. If you've got some concrete evidence that all US phones have AGPS, please provide it.

He did say it knows where you are. Maybe it's some kind of triangulation

Maybe it's another pairing that they are doing with Cingular, like with RAV.
Fact: Each cell tower is in a fixed location (obviously).
Fact: Each call transmits the tower ID that is picking up your signal.
Fact: This is already available to 911 Emergency

I imagine this is how it could be done:

Access Google Maps

Choose the "Find Current Location" option

iPhone sends request to Cingular's servers (like checking your VM)

Cingular grabs the originating Tower ID from the metadata

Server looks up address of Tower ID in database

Server respond with coordinates

iPhone auto-inputs data into Google Maps

Google Maps loads location

Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"

Apple employees int he sit down that happened today. Sure, I have no proof they know what they are talking about and that the people relaying the info are being truthful, but for me it's god enough. Especially since Jobs didn't tout it as a feature to the 4000 geekanoids yesterday.

Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"

Maybe it's another pairing that they are doing with Cingular, like with RAV.
Fact: Each cell tower is in a fixed location (obviously).
Fact: Each call transmits the tower ID that is picking up your signal.
Fact: This is already available to 911 Emergency

I imagine this is how it could be done:

Access Google Maps

Choose the "Find Current Location" option

iPhone sends request to Cingular's servers (like checking your VM)

Cingular grabs the originating Tower ID from the metadata

Server looks up address of Tower ID in database

Server respond with coordinates

iPhone auto-inputs data into Google Maps

Google Maps loads location

Yeah that definately sounds like a possibility. I'd also like to say at this point that I think Cingular deserve a little more credit for their involvement. People keep complaining about their service but It sounds lie they've really pushed their teams for this project and adapted their infrastructure to allow Apple to realize their vision. It will never suit everyones taste but there you go

Secrecy with this project was paramount and cingular played ball so to speak. Perhaps T Mobile was unwilling to do so. Cingular bought into the iPhone without ever seeing a demo of it till the very end. I think it was a couple of weeks before the keynote.

That is an interesting article.

I'm sure now T-Mobile would be more than cooperative to get in on this one.
Apple should bring them on board.

I think now that the new iPhone is out and many aspects of it are patented there may not be as great a need for secrecy going forward. Also companies may now see that it's ok to trust Apple on some things and give them leaway.

people around think i'm crazy. but this phone is a MUST HAVE!!! it's EVERYTHING I've always wanted. i travel from florida to NJ for a 3-4 days 4 times a year and I'll never go through the hassle of dragging my ibook through security and on a plane EVER again after i have this PDA!!!! Say goodbye Palm........

You know Mel, saying those two things over and over aren't going to make them true. So far you have provided no evidence that either of these things are true.

For the first point, if Jobs said it, please provide the time stamp for the time at which he said it during the keynote.

For the second, you seem to assume that because of the E-911 regs, all phones have AGPS. But as others have pointed out several times, a mobile can triangulate its position using network basestations to an accuracy that meets the E-911 regs. Triangulation using basestations is not AGPS. If you've got some concrete evidence that all US phones have AGPS, please provide it.

We did have discussions about this. It has been resolved.

Just how difficult is it for you to type AGPS in Google? Not very hard.

And Both jobs and Pogue said that it wasn't finished, with placeholders for icons (For what? They didn't say.).

They didn't demo Calculator, Clock, Notes or Calendar. When Steve & Phil organised to see a movie at 7 they missed out the final step that I'd have done on my p910 at least - hop into calendar and check I was free and then set an appointment and alarm.

I'd probably also cut the text out of the web browser and paste it in the note section of my alarm too since it was there.

They also didn't demo taking a photo with the camera or shooting video but Pogue said it worked ok yet Steve said it needed improving.

There was a few other things missing but no buttons shown on the screen. No RSS reader. I'd guess that's going in safari though. No MMS support though they could probably include that in the SMS bubble iChat clone.

Then there was things just plain not there like games, Office apps and the like. Still space left to fill up the black spaces on that home screen before they have to add a category menu like Palm/Symbian.

They didn't demo Calculator, Clock, Notes or Calendar. When Steve & Phil organised to see a movie at 7 they missed out the final step that I'd have done on my p910 at least - hop into calendar and check I was free and then set an appointment and alarm.

I'd probably also cut the text out of the web browser and paste it in the note section of my alarm too since it was there.

They also didn't demo taking a photo with the camera or shooting video but Pogue said it worked ok yet Steve said it needed improving.

There was a few other things missing but no buttons shown on the screen. No RSS reader. I'd guess that's going in safari though. No MMS support though they could probably include that in the SMS bubble iChat clone.

Then there was things just plain not there like games, Office apps and the like. Still space left to fill up the black spaces on that home screen before they have to add a category menu like Palm/Symbian.

Hopefully, all of this will be resolved in a way that we are all happy with.

Wow, finally there's a technology in the USA that's even more invasive than the one we have in the UK.

GSM Location based services, which we've had since the late 90s, just run off your nearest base station location so they aren't that accurate. A while back they started triangulating on some networks for more accuracy but it's still not brilliant.

I guess we're all going to get GPS in out phones now though, to go with all our CCTV cameras too.

Wow, finally there's a technology in the USA that's even more invasive than the one we have in the UK.

GSM Location based services, which we've had since the late 90s, just run off your nearest base station location so they aren't that accurate. A while back they started triangulating on some networks for more accuracy but it's still not brilliant.

I guess we're all going to get GPS in out phones now though, to go with all our CCTV cameras too.

Now, THAT'S invasive! But, most people over there when polled, said they either didn't mind it, or liked it. The security, they felt, seemed to be more important.

This guy think that the iPhone wil fail miserably due to it's high cost and contract with Cingular. He does some sense, but I have a feeling that Apple is much smarter than s/he is.

The problem is that it's just hard to know what Apple is up to. Sometimes they keep their secrets in plain sight, I've seen all those UI patents but I never really thought Apple would use them. Some people suggest that they spread false rumors to keep people confused.

Anyway, I do expect that Apple does do price reductions and adds models. I remember that the iPod Photos were initially very steeply priced, but those went down a couple times several months apart that I remember. Not factoring those possibilities into the armchair punditry makes it a tough sell in my view.

I showed the contents of Apple's iPhone Tab (all the videos on how the iphone works) to my 11 and 9 year old daughters. They both started shrieking like they were at the Ed Sullivan Show when the Beatles first played.

I'm dead if they don't each get one.

Migod, this will be huge.

V/R,

Aries 1B

"I pictured myself sitting in the shade of a leafy tree in a public park, a stylus in hand, a shiny Apple Tablet computer in my lap, and a pouty Jennifer Connelly stirring a pitcher of gimlets a...

The FCC requirement is that E911 must provide a caller's location within an accuracy of 50m (method 1 below) or 100m (method 2 below) 67% of the time (both methods also have accuracy requirements of 150m and 300m 95% of the time for the respective methods), the service providers were to meet this mandate as of December 31, 2005. However, many service providers had not met the FCC mandate by the deadline, extensions had been granted and fines have been imposed.

The FCC has also approved two cell phone location methods; 1) GPS, and 2) cell tower triangulation. Service providers are at liberty to choose either so long as they meet the accuracy requirements. But since GPS has proved to be the most cost effective (see links), most service providers have opted for the GPS method.

This would lead me to believe that most (if not all) new cell phones have GPS receivers, but that there is no strict requirement that GPS receivers must be included within the handset. I don't know what the cost delta is for inclusion of GPS receivers within handsets, but if it isn't trivial, I'd expect some of the cheapest handsets wouldn't have GPS receivers. Remember the accuracy requirement, within 50m/100m 67% of the time, not for each handset, but for the service provider's entire customer base on average.

Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!

The FCC requirement is that E911 must provide a caller's location within an accuracy of 100m 67% of the time, the service providers were to meet this mandate as of December 31, 2005. However, many service providers had not met the FCC mandate by the deadline, extensions had been granted and fines have been imposed.

The FCC has also approved two cell phone location methods; 1) GPS, and 2) cell tower triangulation. Service providers are at liberty to choose either so long as the meet the accuracy requirement. But since GPS has proved to be the most cost effective (see links), most service providers have opted for the GPS method.

This would lead me to believe that most (if not all) new cell phones have GPS receivers, but that there is no strict requirement that GPS receivers must be included within the handset. I don't know what the cost delta is for inclusion of GPS receivers within handsets, but if it isn't trivial, I'd expect some of the cheapest handsets wouldn't have GPS receivers. Remember the accuracy requirement, within 100m 67% of the time, not for each handset, but for the service provider's entire customer base on average.

That's why I had said, in our earlier discussion, that most cellphones had them.

But, it really is cheap. The cheapest GPS units on the market are now going for $79, at least the ones I've seen. That's for the entire device. The actual GPS functionality is just a fraction of that.

So far, that's two sites that support this phone with GPS. Ars, and AI, though we don't have a printout of the chat, as far as I know.

I showed the contents of Apple's iPhone Tab (all the videos on how the iphone works) to my 11 and 9 year old daughters. They both started shrieking like they were at the Ed Sullivan Show when the Beatles first played.

I'm dead if they don't each get one.

Since it's based on OS X, I've been wondering if it will have Parental Controls.
I'm guessing that on a $500 smart phone we won't be seeing these features at all.

Can only receive calls from people in the approved contact list

Can only make calls to people in the approved send list.

Can only talk within certain time frames to certain contacts (e.g.: No talking after 9pm with friends)

Same thing with sending Email and SMS messages to certain people.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffDM

Anyway, I do expect that Apple does do price reductions and adds models. I remember that the iPod Photos were initially very steeply priced, but those went down a couple times several months apart that I remember.

Good point! The first iPod was $499, and the larger capacity iPod Photo was $599.

That's why I had said, in our earlier discussion, that most cellphones had them.

But, it really is cheap. The cheapest GPS units on the market are now going for $79, at least the ones I've seen. That's for the entire device. The actual GPS functionality is just a fraction of that.

So far, that's two sites that support this phone with GPS. Ars, and AI, though we don't have a printout of the chat, as far as I know.

I would agree, if you look into the second location method (tower triangulation) the costs are extremely cost prohibitive (I think in the tens of billions of dollars). So much so that, on second thought, it would seem extremely stupid of the service providers not to include GPS, since this would be the most cost effective and timely means of meeting the FCC requirements.

Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!

back when E911 was imposed on the carriers they each had to choose how they would get location data, Verizon went with AGPS (Triangulation) while Nextel & Cingular went with GPS receivers in the phone. I'm not sure about Sprint.
Each method has advantages, I had a nextel phone that took forever to pull in a GPS signal and would not work in a car. VZ Navigator phones can pull in the location data quickly and accurately almost any time there is a cell signal available, inside a car or building, whatever. Cingular went down the GPS route, so for them to upgrade thousands of cell sites for AGPS is impratical. If the iPhone is going to have location data accurate enough for driving directions it will have to have a GPS receiver built into it, that's all there is to it.

One more thing to keep in mind: Obviously the iPhone is not in production and may change, Let's say Steve wanted to use the SiFR Star 3 GPS chipset, (actually does work inside, the best available today, as far as I know) He would have been negotiating the cost for the past few months, The best way for him to get a good price would be to pretend he didn't need it at all. He went through with the introduction pretending like he intended to release the iPhone without GPS, that could scare the guys over at SiRF into giving Apple a better deal on the 15,000,000 units. As far as I know most cell phone GPS units use lower quality GPS receivers to this would be a big sale for them any way you add it up.

And what does Steve loose by holding off that announcement, nothing, it's just another chance to hype the phone and excite the potential buyers.

IMHO the iPhone has about a 50% chance of shipping with a built in GPS receiver.

However if it doesn't what I really hope Apple will do is release a Bluetooth GPS receiver that you can plug into your car (or at least support a 3rd party one) and so you can at least get driving directions when in your car.

back when E911 was imposed on the carriers they each had to choose how they would get location data, Verizon went with AGPS (Triangulation) while Nextel & Cingular went with GPS receivers in the phone. I'm not sure about Sprint.
Each method has advantages, I had a nextel phone that took forever to pull in a GPS signal and would not work in a car. VZ Navigator phones can pull in the location data quickly and accurately almost any time there is a cell signal available, inside a car or building, whatever. Cingular went down the GPS route, so for them to upgrade thousands of cell sites for AGPS is impratical. If the iPhone is going to have location data accurate enough for driving directions it will have to have a GPS receiver built into it, that's all there is to it.

One more thing to keep in mind: Obviously the iPhone is not in production and may change, Let's say Steve wanted to use the SiFR Star 3 GPS chipset, (actually does work inside, the best available today, as far as I know) He would have been negotiating the cost for the past few months, The best way for him to get a good price would be to pretend he didn't need it at all. He went through with the introduction pretending like he intended to release the iPhone without GPS, that could scare the guys over at SiRF into giving Apple a better deal on the 15,000,000 units. As far as I know most cell phone GPS units use lower quality GPS receivers to this would be a big sale for them any way you add it up.

And what does Steve loose by holding off that announcement, nothing, it's just another chance to hype the phone and excite the potential buyers.

IMHO the iPhone has about a 50% chance of shipping with a built in GPS receiver.

However if it doesn't what I really hope Apple will do is release a Bluetooth GPS receiver that you can plug into your car (or at least support a 3rd party one) and so you can at least get driving directions when in your car.