Group G is a joke pe Chelsea, looks like a Europa League Group, but I think they hate it cause it leaves them exposed for the 2nd Round in February ( they can play tough teams that finish 2nd like when they got screwed in 2010 when they were in top form actually.
Group F is nice, it would've been maximum with PSG instead of Marseille who look set for 4th.

For Barcelona it's standard, just look at Milan guy's face when he saw H drawn :haha:.

That's what Bayern thought before Arsenal came to town for leg 2 last year

Seriously, wonder how they'll go without Goetze in there. He was def missed in the CL final. Would love to have Klopp at the Emirates.

Speaking of Bayern, any thoughts on tomorrow's Super Cup. Should be a good one I hope.

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Dortmund is doing just fine without Goetze. Mkhitaryan was a good transfer. Aubameyang as well. Sahin is back to decent form.
I firmly expect Dortmund to win the German league title this season again.

Bayern was struggling through every single one of their 4 matches so far this season even though they didn't lose yet.
Guardiola was the wrong choice as the Heynckes successor. Bayern's game is neither attractive nor really effective at the moment and I doubt this is going to change anytime soon.
I know many will disagree but I don't rate Pep as a world class coach.

As for the Super Cup tomorrow, I wouldn't be surprised if Chelsea beat them tomorrow.

As dislikeable as Mou might be, but in terms of coaching skills, he is miles ahead of Pep, who has yet to prove himself as a decent coach if you ask me.

(I personally don't have a problem with Mou, but I understand why people might have an issue with him)

What happens if the Bale deal went awry? Is there still the funds to cover all this spending or would they run afoul of FFP?

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Well, here's my take on it (and it's not the definitive truth but just what I think might be the situation)...

We've received about £40 million in TV money - probably to be used to pay wages etc... We've sold almost £30 million worth of players - gone straight back into the transfer funds... I think, judging from a lot of the more informed/reliable ITK info, we've been given a £50 million interest free loan from J Lewis (the real owner/man behind Spurs). This I believe was a loan to allow us to purchase players before the window closes and the bale deal is done, something we failed to do with Modric & Berbatov (clever move by the club and JL IMO)... Add on the Bale sale of £80-£90 million or whatever - you probably see £50m paying off JL as mentioned above and the rest invested in to the transfer funds, wages etc.

But... if the Bale deal was to fall through? All I can say is... hmmm...

BTW, Great to see Holtby showing his true class yesterday... have a feeling Siggi could be out come Monday but I do hope Holtby isn't also loaned/sold, as some reports are suggesting.

Group G is a joke pe Chelsea, looks like a Europa League Group, but I think they hate it cause it leaves them exposed for the 2nd Round in February ( they can play tough teams that finish 2nd like when they got screwed in 2010 when they were in top form actually.
Group F is nice, it would've been maximum with PSG instead of Marseille who look set for 4th.

For Barcelona it's standard, just look at Milan guy's face when he saw H drawn :haha:.

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Chelsea's draw isn't a joke, it could of been alot harder for sure, but Schalke are on the up it seems. Draxler, Huntelaar and Papadopoulos are all great players. They had a good Champions League last year too. Basel have been doing well the last few seasons, they aren't to be taken lightly. Steaua were probably are toughest challenge last year in the Europa League so it will be interesting to see how they do, they will give it a good go for sure.

Chelsea really should progress, but there are some intriguing games in that group.

What happens if the Bale deal went awry? Is there still the funds to cover all this spending or would they run afoul of FFP?

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Napoli are stronger this year imo, Rafa proved last year that he's adapting as a manager and i'm thinking he will do well. Callejon, Higuain, Mertens, Albiol, Radosevic and Reina are some top new signings.

They're like Spurs in many ways, selling their best player and investing the money to make them a much stronger team all round.

For me it will be between Arsenal and Napoli to get second spot behind Dortmund.

we've been given a £50 million interest free loan from J Lewis (the real owner/man behind Spurs)

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I'm assuming that's a £50m interest free loan from Joe Lewis, rather than John Lewis! :shock:

Ross - what's the consensus amongst Spurs fans (if such a thing is possible amongst football fans) as to how Joe Lewis views the club? Obviously he's a very wealthy man, but in the past I've been told by mates who support Spurs that whilst being a fan, he is a wiley investor that ultimately seeks to make a profit. Is this the impression you have, or is there the sense that he is willing to pump in £50-100m of his own cash under the right circumstances?

Ross - what's the consensus amongst Spurs fans (if such a thing is possible amongst football fans) as to how Joe Lewis views the club? Obviously he's a very wealthy man, but in the past I've been told by mates who support Spurs that whilst being a fan, he is a wiley investor that ultimately seeks to make a profit. Is this the impression you have, or is there the sense that he is willing to pump in £50-100m of his own cash under the right circumstances?

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No consensus or generally held view on this/him as far as I'm aware. All somewhat cloaked in mystery, though most (me inc.) would indeed suspect the wiley investor scenario to be the case.

Two matches in a week and Chelsea lucky to come second in both of them. Bayern seemed to be resting some of their better players. Is this a serious contest?

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They actually rested their players against Freiburg for that game.

At the end of the day, look at the teams on paper. Defence is very similar, strikers on both sides aren't great, the trio behind that striker on both sides are some of the best around though (Robben, Ribery, Muller, Gotze, Oscar, Hazard, Schurrle etc..).

The only difference is the sitting midfielders, the quality of Kroos and Martinez vs the technical limited Ramires says it all. Hazard and Oscar pick the ball up on the edge of our penalty area and have to beat 3-4 players to even get into the oppositions half. Bayern's big trio were getting the ball on the edge of our penalty area. That's always going to happen with Kroos, Martinez and Schweinsteiger as they give you the base to work from.

We've basically purchased a crap load of ammo and heavy artillery, but forgot to get anyone who knows how to set it up and make it work.

At the end of the day, look at the teams on paper. Defence is very similar, strikers on both sides aren't great, the trio behind that striker on both sides are some of the best around though (Robben, Ribery, Muller, Gotze, Oscar, Hazard, Schurrle etc..).

The only difference is the sitting midfielders, the quality of Kroos and Martinez vs the technical limited Ramires says it all. Hazard and Oscar pick the ball up on the edge of our penalty area and have to beat 3-4 players to even get into the oppositions half. Bayern's big trio were getting the ball on the edge of our penalty area. That's always going to happen with Kroos, Martinez and Schweinsteiger as they give you the base to work from.

We've basically purchased a crap load of ammo and heavy artillery, but forgot to get anyone who knows how to set it up and make it work.

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Agree with everything but the striker part.
I rate Mandzukic higher than Torres. Mandzukic is surely a typical penalty area striker when it comes to his finish. What Mario got over Nando and every other striker in Europe, is that he is also one who is always going for the ball and retrieve it. Just look at his contributions when it comes to Bayerns defense. They are unparalleled by any other striker in Europe, that's why he displaced Mario Gomez who actually had a great scoring ratio here.
We don't need a opportunist strikers like Gomez or Luca Toni (remember him? lol) who would camp in the penalty area for hours.

Chelsea really needs someone like Schweinsteiger or Martinez. Robust players with vision and football brains. Ramires just can't fill out that hole.

Oh and why the heck didn't Mata play?? I thought alongside Hazard he was the best player last year in Chelseas squad.

Agree with everything but the striker part.
I rate Mandzukic higher than Torres. Mandzukic is surely a typical penalty area striker when it comes to his finish. What Mario got over Nando and every other striker in Europe, is that he is also one who is always going for the ball and retrieve it. Just look at his contributions when it comes to Bayerns defense. They are unparalleled by any other striker in Europe, that's why he displaced Mario Gomez who actually had a great scoring ratio here.
We don't need a opportunist strikers like Gomez or Luca Toni (remember him? lol) who would camp in the penalty area for hours.

Chelsea really needs someone like Schweinsteiger or Martinez. Robust players with vision and football brains. Ramires just can't fill out that hole.

Oh and why the heck didn't Mata play?? I thought alongside Hazard he was the best player last year in Chelseas squad.

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Mata has played for two years straight, pretty much. The Olympics, Euro's, Confederations Cup, Spanish national side, 60+ Chelsea games last year etc..

He was burnt out at the end of last season, he really could of done with a summer off, but he played the Confederations Cup. He only got in 45 minutes minutes during pre season, where he got injured and he's been slow in recovering. The longer we can get away wihtout playing him, the better.

Totally agree about needing a Scweinsteiger or Martinez. Been saying it for 4-5 years in this very thread, people must be sick of hearing me go on about it. The problem is just obvious, but when was the last time he got an established midfielder? Meireles? Ramires before that. You're facing an uphill battle in todays modern game if those are the types of player you're putting in the heart of your team.

Good point above Fena, the game changed tonight when Martinez came on.

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Correction. He's busy agreeing personal terms at the Emirates before Arsene pulls the plug as he doesn't want to block the path of Gedion Zelalem.

How I see things now is that Wenger will not buy another defender or DM. He sees Sagna as the CB cover, and Flamini as cover for both RB, LB and DM/CM. So I think he'll only try and bring in a wide attacking player (di Maria, depending on whether he has any interest in signing with us), a striker (over-priced Michu on deadline day, having found out there is nothing else available), and the outside possibility of a keeper (Begovic). So probably two, maybe three additions if things go 'well' on deadline day. Though knowing Wenger, if we beat Spurs on Sunday it may well be none!

Clearly a sign he feels under pressure with deadline day coming. I'm hoping it's not reflective of pressure felt within the playing squad, as it remind me of last season when AVB needlessly came out when you lot were 10 points ahead and gave a press conference on how Arsenal were a club in crisis etc etc, and we know how that turned out.

On the flipside, if you listen to the actual press conference with Wenger yesterday, and how the questions are posed to him, it's clear the journos are just out to stitch him up.

No consensus or generally held view on this/him as far as I'm aware. All somewhat cloaked in mystery, though most (me inc.) would indeed suspect the wiley investor scenario to be the case.

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Interesting - based on Spurs' prior movements in the transfer market (players in, but players also out, roughly balancing the books), I thought this was the case, but you hear plenty of fans banging on now about how Joe Lewis is worth so-and-so amount, and that he's willing to put in the same amount as Abramovic / Sheikh Mansour etc.

I've heard that AVB has told Levy that he really needs just one more midfielder, just in case, and will be in for Fellaini at 23.55 on deadline day, right after he's had his medical at Carrington. :mrgreen:

I've heard that AVB has told Levy that he really needs just one more midfielder, just in case, and will be in for Fellaini at 23.55 on deadline day, right after he's had his medical at Carrington. :mrgreen:

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And the deal will get done.

Unlike Wenger, who will put in an offer that he feels is sufficient, which will be 20 million below Everton's asking price.

And Arsenal will sign nobody. They'll wait until the 31st of January having signed nobody, and will sign some 12-year-old African kid from somewhere nobody's ever heard of, and will never make it to the first team.

We look 10 times better than we did in the Champions League final 15 months ago. Was expecting it to be like that game, liking what i'm seeing so far!

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I totally agree, they looked pretty good to me, though I was only able to watch the first half. I plan to watch the rest later today. But from what I saw they looked much better than in that final you mention.

The one thing that never seems to change is Mourinho’s comments. There is a universal referee conspiracy against him, his team was the best and deserved to win, and his head-to-head against Guardiola is distorted by jealous journalists who fudge the statistics.

Totally agree about needing a Scweinsteiger or Martinez. Been saying it for 4-5 years in this very thread, people must be sick of hearing me go on about it. The problem is just obvious, but when was the last time he got an established midfielder? Meireles? Ramires before that. You're facing an uphill battle in todays modern game if those are the types of player you're putting in the heart of your team.

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What about Gündogan? He was just brilliant last season and I'm pretty sure he will replace Schweinsteiger in our national team once Schweini is approaching the end of his great career.
Chelsea got the money, I'm sure a high enough offer would bring the BVB around to let Ilkay leave the club.

I totally agree, they looked pretty good to me, though I was only able to watch the first half. I plan to watch the rest later today. But from what I saw they looked much better than in that final you mention.

The one thing that never seems to change is Mourinho’s comments. There is a universal referee conspiracy against him, his team was the best and deserved to win, and his head-to-head against Guardiola is distorted by jealous journalists who fudge the statistics.

I love it. :lol: Mou is probably the sorest loser in football history, but still he is a coaching fox.
Anyway I have to admit that Mou always had a hard time with referees when Real played FC Divelona. Those guys are the biggest fruitloops I've ever seen.

So many imponderables though, specially at this stage of the season and with other clubs, new managers etc, and indeed with our brand new squad needing to become cohesive and gel. Long term though (next 2/3 seasons), we look well placed I'd say, and no Spurs fan could or should have anything but praise for Levy/Lewis etc and how they've gone about business this summer. For me, Levy has played his hand like a master poker player these recent months/weeks.

Anyhow, great opportunity tomorrow to asses and test the waters VS your gunners, a side I'm all too aware were in title winning form at the close of last season.

Bayern didn't rest anyone. Besides Schweinsteiger (who is injured), Bayern played with their first team.

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Err, no. Martínez only entered in some moment in the second half, Gotze in the end, plus Alcantara was also injured. Lahm was playing as defensive mild, so Bayern was far from playing with it's first team by most of the match

Err, no. Martínez only entered in some moment in the second half, Gotze in the end, plus Alcantara was also injured. Lahm was playing as defensive mild, so Bayern was far from playing with it's first team by most of the match

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Martinez wasn't fully fit. FYI Neither Martinez nor the other two, Götze, Alcantara are part of the first squad.

I doubt Thiago will make it into the first squad this season. His transfer was unnecessary in my opinion. Guardiola won't play with 2 defensive midfielders as Heynckes did last season, that being send Martinez will have to take a set on the bench as he did all season so far.

Götze might replace Kroos sometime in midseason when he's fully fit, as he is obviously the bigger talent of them two.

Edit: Götze injured himself against Chelsea. Will be out for at least 3-4 weeks. Thiago also out for 2 months.

That said, no Bayern didn't rest anyone against Chelsea but Schweinsteiger.

I doubt Thiago will make it into the first squad this season. His transfer was unnecessary in my opinion. Guardiola won't play with 2 defensive midfielders as Heynckes did last season, that being send Martinez will have to take a set on the bench as he did all season so far.

Götze might replace Kroos sometime in midseason when he's fully fit, as he is obviously the bigger talent of them two.

Edit: Götze injured himself against Chelsea. Will be out for at least 3-4 weeks. Thiago also out for 2 months.

That said, no Bayern didn't rest anyone against Chelsea but Schweinsteiger.

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Yes, they did. Gotze it is going to play in the main team save some disaster, so that's two. Alcantara and Martinez might not start all the matches, yes, but one of them would be playing today instead Lahm as defensive midfielder.
So not only Bayern couldn't play with the full squad, but some of substitutes couldn't start from the beginning

What about Gündogan? He was just brilliant last season and I'm pretty sure he will replace Schweinsteiger in our national team once Schweini is approaching the end of his great career.
Chelsea got the money, I'm sure a high enough offer would bring the BVB around to let Ilkay leave the club.

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I would cream my pants if Chelsea signed Gundogan. He would be amazing.

Yes, they did. Gotze it is going to play in the main team save some disaster, so that's two. Alcantara and Martinez might not start all the matches, yes, but one of them would be playing today instead Lahm as defensive midfielder.
So not only Bayern couldn't play with the full squad, but some of substitutes couldn't start from the beginning

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What on earth are you talking about buddy? Götze is not playing in the first squad yet, even when he's fit. He might replace Kroos sometime during midseason as he tends to run out of energy by November, December.

Lahm won't play as a defensive midfilder since he just replaced Schweinsteiger. Bayern will play with ONE defensive midfielder unlike last season (Schweini). Other than that, yes Bayern played with the full squad.

What about Gündogan? He was just brilliant last season and I'm pretty sure he will replace Schweinsteiger in our national team once Schweini is approaching the end of his great career.
Chelsea got the money, I'm sure a high enough offer would bring the BVB around to let Ilkay leave the club.

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Funny you should mention Gundogan, he's someone i've been wanting in this thread from before he was even at Dortmund. He's just what we needed 3 or 4 years ago, even more so now.

There are players out there, Man Utd want Herrera who is that kind of player and he has a £25 Million release clause. We don't even look at players like that, we prefer to pay £30 Million for Willian when we already have so many players in his position, which makes no sense to me.

We're just far too inbalanced. Ramires is decent and breaking things up, Lampard is good at getting back to help out, and get forward in the oppositions box. What we don't have is someone who can hold he ball, start things off, make simple passes, play the dangerous creative players in etc..

So many imponderables though, specially at this stage of the season and with other clubs, new managers etc, and indeed with our brand new squad needing to become cohesive and gel. Long term though (next 2/3 seasons), we look well placed I'd say, and no Spurs fan could or should have anything but praise for Levy/Lewis etc and how they've gone about business this summer. For me, Levy has played his hand like a master poker player these recent months/weeks.

Anyhow, great opportunity tomorrow to asses and test the waters VS your gunners, a side I'm all too aware were in title winning form at the close of last season.

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Spurs are already winning the battle with Arsenal. Been hearing they are trying to delay the Bale to Madrid thing for as long as possible so Arsenal won't have enough time to bring in any combination of Benzema/Ozil/Di Maria. Cheeky

Let's not be silly. As if Ozil or Benzema would sign for us at this point! The only chance of that happening would have been if it had been done at the start of the summer, while selling the notion to them that they would be the first of many big money signings working under Wenger. Even then they'd probably refuse. As things stand, we'll be lucky to get Michu on deadline day for £25-30m, and perhaps another average to good PL player. In other words, the supporters forking out £2k a season treated like mugs once again.

Still think we've got a good chance of beating Spuds today, seeing as it will be a decent XI out (the bench will be atrocious, as ever) that knows each other well. They're favourites now for 4th place, though. A couple of weeks ago the odds were heavily in favour of Arsenal; now Spurs are marginally shorter odds. We have seen this all before of course, but this time the £110m (+wages) Spurs have invested may be too much for even penny-pinching Wenger's to overcome. At least he'll be truly motivated to make 4th so he can triumphantly lecture everyone about how anyone can throw huge amounts of money off the Eiffel Tower, and look very smug in doing so.