Having said that, and with the qualifier that I doubt many would find it offensive or a big deal, there's a bit of a difference between Crowe saying to Taylor and Cumming saying it on national broadcast. You can get away with some jokes with your mates or partner that you might not get away with to your boss or a stranger. So the fact that Crowe used to say something to Taylor in private doesn't necesarily excuse Cumming saying it to the wider public.

Remember when asked why there weren’t more Maori and PI cricketers and he said ‘they aren’t good at concentrating over long periods ‘ ?

It wasn't the smartest thing Crowe ever said. It's best forgotten.

Eric Rush on Sports Cafe stated the very fact. How many Maori/PI play cricket and make it through to higher honours? Murphy Su'a, Adam Parore, D.Tuff...now Rosco. Poorly worded maybe but not inaccurate.

Remember when asked why there weren’t more Maori and PI cricketers and he said ‘they aren’t good at concentrating over long periods ‘ ?

It wasn't the smartest thing Crowe ever said. It's best forgotten.

Eric Rush on Sports Cafe stated the very fact. How many Maori/PI play cricket and make it through to higher honours? Murphy Su'a, Adam Parore, D.Tuff...now Rosco. Poorly worded maybe but not inaccurate.

Poorly worded? What else could he have been meaning? Cricket to be fair, just isn't a sport that is popular with Maori or Pacific Islanders, it has nought to do with their ability to concentrate.

Remember when asked why there weren’t more Maori and PI cricketers and he said ‘they aren’t good at concentrating over long periods ‘ ?

It wasn't the smartest thing Crowe ever said. It's best forgotten.

Eric Rush on Sports Cafe stated the very fact. How many Maori/PI play cricket and make it through to higher honours? Murphy Su'a, Adam Parore, D.Tuff...now Rosco. Poorly worded maybe but not inaccurate.

Poorly worded? What else could he have been meaning? Cricket to be fair, just isn't a sport that is popular with Maori or Pacific Islanders, it has nought to do with their ability to concentrate.

I reckon it's far more likely that the lack of top class Polynesian cricketers has more to do with access to good cricket coaching at a young age. There's heaps in the club scene, but for many it's deficiencies in the technical aspects of the game that prevents them from reaching the highest level. For those that do end up in top sporting schools, rugby is more popular and has better pathways to success.

There's definitely some ingrained institutional racism against Maori & pacific islanders in cricket that I've seen perpetuated at club level at the very least. That image of "they aren't good at concentrating over long periods" - i.e. heavily implying they're lazy or won't put the work in - seems to follow them around, regardless of their work ethic. A number of top quality players are ultimately lost to the game as a result.

That's why it annoys me when people who should know better continue to use those stereotypes in normal conversation.

I also wonder why the treatment of Ross Taylor, given his immense value to NZC and his position as one of NZ's best has been consistently shabbier than some of his peers.

badmannotinjapan wrote:

Eric Rush on Sports Cafe stated the very fact. How many Maori/PI play cricket and make it through to higher honours? Murphy Su'a, Adam Parore, D.Tuff...now Rosco. Poorly worded maybe but not inaccurate.

I preferred participating in softball, touch rugby & athletics rather than cricket in the summer period during my youth. I thought i chose these sports over cricket because i enjoyed the competition and social camaraderie more, but all this time it turns out i was genetically predisposed to not being able to concentrate for long periods. How on earth i managed to complete 5+ years of full time university study is a small miracle.

I preferred participating in softball, touch rugby & athletics rather than cricket in the summer period during my youth. I thought i chose these sports over cricket because i enjoyed the competition and social camaraderie more, but all this time it turns out i was genetically predisposed to not being able to concentrate for long periods. How on earth i managed to complete 5+ years of full time university study is a small miracle.

Cricket is overall not as popular in Auckland as most of the country, and since a large chunk of PI's live up here they don't get the exposure to it. Plus I think it's just not seen as popular within their community.

Growing up in a diverse area (for the time) softball seemed more popular as a summer sport. I played softball myself, even made it to the North Harbour rep team before I couldn't stand playing for the filthy traitors but couldn't get into the Auckland team.

I preferred participating in softball, touch rugby & athletics rather than cricket in the summer period during my youth. I thought i chose these sports over cricket because i enjoyed the competition and social camaraderie more, but all this time it turns out i was genetically predisposed to not being able to concentrate for long periods. How on earth i managed to complete 5+ years of full time university study is a small miracle.

There's definitely some ingrained institutional racism against Maori & pacific islanders in cricket that I've seen perpetuated at club level at the very least. That image of "they aren't good at concentrating over long periods" - i.e. heavily implying they're lazy or won't put the work in - seems to follow them around, regardless of their work ethic. A number of top quality players are ultimately lost to the game as a result.

That's why it annoys me when people who should know better continue to use those stereotypes in normal conversation.

I also wonder why the treatment of Ross Taylor, given his immense value to NZC and his position as one of NZ's best has been consistently shabbier than some of his peers.

badmannotinjapan wrote:

Eric Rush on Sports Cafe stated the very fact. How many Maori/PI play cricket and make it through to higher honours? Murphy Su'a, Adam Parore, D.Tuff...now Rosco. Poorly worded maybe but not inaccurate.

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 amPosts: 21681Location: End of the road, turn right and first house on the left

Mr Mike wrote:

Gordon Bennett wrote:

There's definitely some ingrained institutional racism against Maori & pacific islanders in cricket that I've seen perpetuated at club level at the very least. That image of "they aren't good at concentrating over long periods" - i.e. heavily implying they're lazy or won't put the work in - seems to follow them around, regardless of their work ethic. A number of top quality players are ultimately lost to the game as a result.

That's why it annoys me when people who should know better continue to use those stereotypes in normal conversation.

I also wonder why the treatment of Ross Taylor, given his immense value to NZC and his position as one of NZ's best has been consistently shabbier than some of his peers.

badmannotinjapan wrote:

Eric Rush on Sports Cafe stated the very fact. How many Maori/PI play cricket and make it through to higher honours? Murphy Su'a, Adam Parore, D.Tuff...now Rosco. Poorly worded maybe but not inaccurate.

Not a single one of my Maori friends at school played cricket beyond the age of around 11 or 12, and even before then we’d play rugby all winter but I’d barely see them in the summer. I didn’t analyse it at the time but clearly the real reason was that cricket is an astonishingly boring game that is a waste of everyone’s time and resources and the bros were just quicker on the uptake about that incontrovertible fact.

I preferred participating in softball, touch rugby & athletics rather than cricket in the summer period during my youth. I thought i chose these sports over cricket because i enjoyed the competition and social camaraderie more, but all this time it turns out i was genetically predisposed to not being able to concentrate for long periods. How on earth i managed to complete 5+ years of full time university study is a small miracle.

It should have only taken you 3 years, right?

LOL. Includes post-grad bro.

If the low representation of Polynesians at the very top echelons of cricket was due to very slight differences in concentration levels that manifest themselves at elite levels, then that would say next to nothing about your specific individual ability to concentrate for long periods.

There's definitely some ingrained institutional racism against Maori & pacific islanders in cricket that I've seen perpetuated at club level at the very least. That image of "they aren't good at concentrating over long periods" - i.e. heavily implying they're lazy or won't put the work in - seems to follow them around, regardless of their work ethic. A number of top quality players are ultimately lost to the game as a result.

That's why it annoys me when people who should know better continue to use those stereotypes in normal conversation.

I also wonder why the treatment of Ross Taylor, given his immense value to NZC and his position as one of NZ's best has been consistently shabbier than some of his peers.

badmannotinjapan wrote:

Eric Rush on Sports Cafe stated the very fact. How many Maori/PI play cricket and make it through to higher honours? Murphy Su'a, Adam Parore, D.Tuff...now Rosco. Poorly worded maybe but not inaccurate.

Jesse Ryder too.

Heath Te-Ihi-O-Te-Rangi Davis

I used to watch him play club cricket on Kelburn Park. By Christ he was quick.

I preferred participating in softball, touch rugby & athletics rather than cricket in the summer period during my youth. I thought i chose these sports over cricket because i enjoyed the competition and social camaraderie more, but all this time it turns out i was genetically predisposed to not being able to concentrate for long periods. How on earth i managed to complete 5+ years of full time university study is a small miracle.

It should have only taken you 3 years, right?

LOL. Includes post-grad bro.

If the low representation of Polynesians at the very top echelons of cricket was due to very slight differences in concentration levels that manifest themselves at elite levels, then that would say next to nothing about your specific individual ability to concentrate for long periods.

I reckon it's far more likely that the lack of top class Polynesian cricketers has more to do with access to good cricket coaching at a young age. There's heaps in the club scene, but for many it's deficiencies in the technical aspects of the game that prevents them from reaching the highest level. For those that do end up in top sporting schools, rugby is more popular and has better pathways to success.

If they go to school with the whiteys and play cricket at those schools/club I'd assume they'd have the same access as anyone else, no?

I reckon it's far more likely that the lack of top class Polynesian cricketers has more to do with access to good cricket coaching at a young age. There's heaps in the club scene, but for many it's deficiencies in the technical aspects of the game that prevents them from reaching the highest level. For those that do end up in top sporting schools, rugby is more popular and has better pathways to success.

If they go to school with the whiteys and play cricket at those schools/club I'd assume they'd have the same access as anyone else, no?

I reckon it's far more likely that the lack of top class Polynesian cricketers has more to do with access to good cricket coaching at a young age. There's heaps in the club scene, but for many it's deficiencies in the technical aspects of the game that prevents them from reaching the highest level. For those that do end up in top sporting schools, rugby is more popular and has better pathways to success.

If they go to school with the whiteys and play cricket at those schools/club I'd assume they'd have the same access as anyone else, no?

One thing to add is that non-Maori Polynesians don't make up a massive % of the population so to have Rosco as one of our premier players kinda shows there is not a massive under-representation at the highest levels. You'd expect in sports where attributes like muscle mass are not very important, that the representation of Polynesian New Zealanders would be closer to their percentage of the population.