INDIANAPOLIS  The Indiana Supreme Court on Tuesday upheld the law creating the nations broadest school voucher program, clearing the way for a possible expansion.

In a 5-0 vote, the justices rejected claims that the law primarily benefited religious institutions that run private schools and accepted arguments that it gave families choice and allowed parents to determine where the money went.

The Indiana case has received national attention because the program has wide eligibility. Middle-class families are allowed to participate in Indiana, while in most states, such programs are limited to low-income families or those in failing schools.

there is another reason people oppose this which is never talked about.

Those already sending their kids to private schools (even though they would seemingly benefit a lot financially) might be opposed for the following reasons:

1 - Government vouchers will drive up the costs of a private education thus eliminating the most positive benefit (simple supply and demand). Which is exactly what has driven the cost of college through the roof in the last decade or two as government loans and grants have flooded US colleges.

2 - Private schools would be flooded with the rude, ill-behaved, liberally indoctrinated, feral children that private school parents were so desperate to keep their children away from to being with.

Broadly:
Catholic schools teach that Catholicism is the source of truth.
Christian schools teach that Christianity is the source of truth.
Jewish schools teach that Judaism is the source of truth.
Muslim schools teach that Islam is the source of truth.

And Government Schools teach that Government is the source of truth.

11
posted on 03/26/2013 9:24:12 AM PDT
by MrB
(The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter admits whom he's working for)

"2 - Private schools would be flooded with the rude, ill-behaved, liberally indoctrinated, feral children that private school parents were so desperate to keep their children away from to being with. "

This is exactly why I'm against this. The private schools will gladly take the gubmint money which will initially be given to the poorest of the poorest kids. The culture of the private schools will immediately change for the worst. Classes will have to be "dumbed down" for the new student.

This is exactly what happened to my kids' private school once they went Division II sports (allowed to recruit "athletes"). Now the school is falling apart as the white middle class kids are leaving in droves.

the one thing that private schools would have going for them in this regard is... unlike the public schools they don't have to take everyone, but can select only those them choose.

Of course.... that may no longer apply when they are receiving money from the government in the form of a voucher! I can easily see a situation similar to what occurring with student loans and colleges happening to private schools. After letting all the private schools get used to all the extra income a flood of parents with vouchers will supply... the government will simple come in later with demand X. With the threat that if demand X isn't complied with vouchers will no longer be allowed to be used at their school.

This will then be used to impose every left leaning crack job idea imaginable onto the private schools.

The cost of a product will always equal what people are willing to pay for it + the amount that is subsidized by the government.

Thus, if a private school education costs $5,000 a year because that is all parents are willing to pay for it... and the government come in with vouchers, grants, loans or whatever and pays for $4,000 of that cost...

what do you think the cost will be in the future? I'll tell you! it will then cost $9,000 for that same education!

When Indianapolis Public Schools had a district “Voucher” program a few years back, the overwhelming majority of parents sent their kids to THE CLOSEST SCHOOL. Simplicity for the PARENTS was the first family priority.

The teachers union, and the Bus Drivers Union threw fits until the program was canceled with the arrival of the new (now almost-gone) superintendent.

A few sent kids to specialty schools, but not very many.

17
posted on 03/26/2013 11:15:04 AM PDT
by tcrlaf
(Well, it is what the Sheeple voted for....)

there is another reason people oppose this which is never talked about.

I agree with both reasons. As a parent whose child starts private Christian school this fall, I want parents to have to sacrifice to send their kids to private school. That way, the only kids that will be there are the ones whose parents really want them to be. We make above median income, but not greatly above. The school he will be attending is less than some other private schools in the area, but we are giving up a lot to send him there. It's a very nice car payment, maybe two car payments. Or a bigger house. But, I will gladly give those up to provide him a better academic opportunity with a Christian world-view, surrounded by kids whose parents feel the same way and are very involved.

This is exactly why I'm against this. The private schools will gladly take the gubmint money which will initially be given to the poorest of the poorest kids. The culture of the private schools will immediately change for the worst. Classes will have to be "dumbed down" for the new student.

The vouchers will be for a fixed amount of money. Schools can charge more than the voucher, with the parents needing to kick in the difference. So high-priced private schools will not get any "inner city" voucher kids, but private schools with more modest tuition levels will be flooded with ferals.

21
posted on 03/26/2013 12:33:05 PM PDT
by PapaBear3625
(You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)

This happened almost two weeks ago and the teachers unions are going bananas. Yesterday they published a full page ad in all Alabama newspapers (with big letters) "STOP THE ATTACK ON PUBLIC EDUCATION" call your representative...all the numbers were listed, etc.

The bill allows families with children zoned to failing schools to receive tax credits to help pay for attendance at private schools or other public schools. It authorizes donation-funded scholarships for students zoned to failing schools whose families meet income requirements. It allows local school systems to seek waivers from some state policies.

“The real question is why government is involved in education in the first place. Even conservatives arent asking that question.”

It is a shame, the presuppositions we accept any more. Like with Medi-Cal or Medi-Caid or Social Security, we are interested in getting rid of fraud and illegal alien benefits and waste, but, few talk about chucking the entire program.

I could see a legitimate argument for the state needing literate citizens who understand their citizenship rights and responsibilities.

Ideally I’d like to see a public library in any county of over so many people, and at that library “free” (tax payer funded) literacy, basic math, and civics courses. Not forced, but available at various times and days for all citizens of any age.

The argument for this would be civil and common defense, as illiterate people who can’t add are not capable of modern warfare, not much. Also, citizenship requires a basic knowledge of the laws of the land.

That’s how it would be if I were King. The current model of public schools gone, no compulsory education. But no.

We have a program in our kids’ private Christian school, grades 7-12, where we raise funds for scholarships for underprivileged kids. Sure, those middle school kids come in sassy and underperform at first, but by their senior year they are transformed. They have real hope and real skills, and easily manage to get scholarships into good, primarily Christian, schools.

As for the kids who are hard cases and don’t fall in line, they get kicked out. It happens enough so that everyone knows it’s a real possibility. But they are a small minority of the scholarship kids.

28
posted on 03/26/2013 8:38:21 PM PDT
by keats5
(Not all of us are hypnotized.)

My daughter-in-law teaches in a private school, she said that they were not too thrilled with the voucher program. It depended on if the state then would have a say in how you ran your school. She teaches in a catholic school.

It depends on the character of the school. A school with a strong religious mission, as opposed to one with only the title of Christian will resist the temptation to let the money be the determining factor. But even a school with a more mercenary view will hestitate to offend its existing customers, who can, after all, chose to go elsewhere.

The reason why federal aide was allowed the colleges but not the schools was the specious distinction between a school and a college. Schools are for indoctrination, but colleges, not. But the GIs who went to college on the GI Bill often remarked how childish were the 21 years olds they found themselves in school with. High schools are for indoctrination only if they become no more than higher elementary schools, holding pens to keep boy and girls from growing up.

“I hope one of the arguments was the current public shool monopoly is failing to actually educate our children”

I think that this is what most people think of when the hear about vouchers.

Another argument that is rarely made and that will probably be a driving force towards moving states to a voucher system is cost.

If it costs a state an average of 10K per year to educate a student, a 5K voucher will net the state a 5K surplus.

If enough students leave the public system, there will be fewer teachers and administrators, fewer facilities, fewer buses, etc., which will lead to even more savings.

As states continue to struggle to meet their budget needs, the cost factor may end up being more important than the quality of education, which is a major talking point for many states but doesn’t seem to be a concern otherwise.

37
posted on 03/28/2013 5:51:44 AM PDT
by CriticalJ
(Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress.. But then I repeat myself. MT)

the second private schools accept those dollars the leftists will force them to use the same currculum as publik skoolz.

It's already being implemented! It's called Common Core and its descripton is filled with focus tested phrases that make it sound wonderful, but it's really set up to totally federalize education down to the lesson plan. It leaves room for no more than 15% input from the teacher.

All but 5 states have adopted it or are considering it through state legislatures where the elected officers know next to nothing about it. There are about 17 or 18 states that adopted it and are now trying to get rid of it.

It will even be enforced on charter schools and home schoolers. Bill Ayers (domestic terrorist and current education specialist) is involved in its design so you can readily figure what its purpose is...

Parents pay for their own brood. No tax credits (those w/out kids should not be paying for the brood mares to begin), reduce the overall taxes and let the parents hire/fire/elect/whatever for their own.

39
posted on 03/28/2013 9:39:52 AM PDT
by i_robot73
(We hold that all individuals have the Right to exercise sole dominion over their own lives - LP.org)

You are fundamentally correct. The idea of a Federal role, outside the District of Columbia or any other Federal Reservation, is absolutely asinine. That both parties have flirted with it, is one of the most damning examples of how far we have drifted both from the intention of the Founders & any realistic understanding of how human societies work for the better.

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