Saturday, February 05, 2005

Alan ran for Senator against Barak Obama in Illinois. Am I ever glad I voted against this miserable excuse for a human. What is it about the oh so religious that they can hate their own children? I suppose it is a step up from the murders Arabs do when their daughters "humiliate" them. Still. It seems rather unChristian to me. But, what do I know? I'm Jewish.

Well now that that is off my chest, let us look into the details. BTW I found the initial item at the DU. I was trolling for stuff to use against the Dems and found this. Kind of makes me ashamed to be associated with some Republicans. Did I mention I voted against Keyes?

Well here at an almost unreadable site is the daughter's side of the story. If it is true. Could be a hoax for all I know. But it does sound in character for Mr. Keyes.

Well any way let me quote the whole thing so it is easier to read:

I tried to love you and I failed...

Well, it's happened. Finally and officially.

A couple days ago I got my official two-week warning that I have to be out of this apartment; so finally for real I'm getting cut off. I got no severance or anything like that from my sudden termination of employment (don't I have freedom of speech? the right to protest Bush without losing my job? Hehe... most people would think that working under a parent would be security but for me it's quite the opposite.) and so I definitely don't have anywhere near enough cash to find a new apartment; not even one room rented from someone anywhere. I've been searching craigslist but even places where I'd have enough to pay the first month's rent on some room I never have enough for the deposit as well, so so far I've had no luck at all finding a new home, since shelter requires money. Sad boo.

After all the arguments and tension over the years, I always hoped it would never actually get to this point, although I suppose given our vastly divergent political beliefs it was inevitable.

My A n j u l s say no, no, it was not inevitable at all and this should never have happened. They say that parents have some modicum of responsibility to their kids - at least so far as making sure they are not homeless and starving - especially if their kids have done nothing aside from thinking for themselves. They say that different political beliefs should not lead to parents kicking kids out of the house. They say most parents would be thrilled to have a child who doesn't smoke, have sex, do drugs, hardly drinks; more thrilled to have a child who additionally does well in school, is active on all sorts of extracurriculars, gets good grades, gets into the Ivy League; even more thrilled to have a child who on top of that goes regularly to church, spends free time mentoring kids and serving food to homeless people; even more thrilled to have a child to on top of that is not only politically aware but actively going out to try and fight for the causes she believes in, considering the political apathy of most teenagers. They say that if all the above didn't cause parents to be thanking God every day for the child they were blessed with, that they certainly would be after the child puts off college for a year (wait, no, for ANOTHER year, since said child already deferred one year to go teach in India) to go support her father in his work. They say that I'm a good daughter, that I changed around my whole plans just because I thought it would be nicer for my dad if after the end of working all the time on the campaign trail he could come back to someone who loves him rather than an empty house. They say that it should be a source of pride, not of shame, for my parents that I'm so passionate about my beliefs, and work for what I believe in; even if they are not the beliefs my parents hold. They say that the only possible cause for shame anywhere in the whole situation is in the fact that after all this I am being cut off, jobless, soon to be homeless, and that although I have intelligence and motivation I won't be able to go to Brown after all because I have no money.

March to Lawyer’s Mall (in front of the State House) for the rally, featuring community leaders, Judy Shepard, and Maya Marcel Keyes, the self-described queer activist who is also daughter of ultra-conservative Alan Keyes, whose recent campaign for senator from Illinois included his calling Mary Cheney a “hedonist.” Maya group up in Montgomery County and will certainly have some interesting things to say about living with someone who is so outspoken in his opposition to gay rights.

Did I mention I voted for Bush and Obama?

Well I suppose this will be a great service to the "family values" crowd.

I wonder if Keyes' objection was to her sexual orientation or her politics? I wonder if Dick Cheney will have anything to say about this?

26 comments:

Anonymous
said...

I can't stand Keyes but his daughter sounds like a royal pain in the ass. Her post is all about HER ... how she sacrificed etc. Given that she trotted off to India rather than buckle down at school, and decided HERSELF that what he needed during the campaign was to have to come home and pay attention to her, my sympathy meter is barely twitching here.

She: hasn't finished school, apparently has no work history or skills other than those subsidized by her father's campaign, took a public stance against him during his campaign and now pulls a pity party for herself on the Internet.

Maybe after a few months flipping burgers a tiny tiny crack in her massive self-centeredness will appear, or that humongous chip on her shoulder will shift slightly.

I wouldn't hold my breath waiting, though. In my experience that takes years of hard knocks in the real world to happen, if it ever does.

You got it off DU? No wonder it's so bogus. Two weeks is not legal eviction notice anywhere, and if the chick can't spell or write any better than that, Keyes has been wasting his money sending her to school.

Maybe you should take it easy with the harsh judgement(s). You really have no idea about what happened or why, and this is a family matter. Btw, Jews kick disrespectful, disobedient kids out of their houses too, and no, that doesn't make them just a step up from Muslims who murder their daughters... what the hell?

But what does it say about Keyes parenting skills that he produced such an ungrateful daughter?

OTOH I understand ungrateful children. I was one once. I may even have one or several like that myself.

I still wouldn't kick them out of the house with no resources. That seems rather unparent like to me. My parents treated me rather better than that despite my ungratefullness. Sometimes it takes kids a while to grow up. A lot of parenting is patience under trying circumstances.

1. We don't know if Keyes really kicked his daughter out with no resources. At this point, it's a rumor, and there are all sorts of possiblities. We don't know if he might have been telling her things like, "If you don't go back to school, I will not support you," or "Get a job."

2. To the commentor who really wouldn't kick out a kid with no resources? Really? For how long? Could a 25 y.o. still live at home, not getting a job, not going to school, dissing you in public, and you'd still provide free room and board? What if the reason the adult offspring has no resources is because of bad choices adult offspring keeps making? Do you really owe it to children to subsidize bad choices all of their lives?

3. Didn't Harvard open up enrollment to students with an income under 40 thousand? If he's really kicked her out, she qualifies.Can't she stay at a Salvation Army or YMCA?What about all these friends of hers? None of them willing to let her spread a sleeping bag on the floor? What does that say about her character (and theirs)?Can she enlist?Join the Peace Corps?How'd she pay for that trip to India last year?

4. The letter posted sounds as though the author is rude, whiny, self aggrandizing, ungrateful, and as though the author as a massive sense of self entitlement. Sure, sounds like (if legit) Keyes may have been a really bad father. I don't think Ronald Reagan was any great shakes at fatherhood, either, but he was a terrific President.Madelaine Murray O'hare totally disowned her son when he became a Chrsitian.My best friend came home from school in junior high and found her bags all packed on the porch- because she kept going to church on Sunday mornings and her mom hated church-going. Oh, and her mom was a Democrat. Should all Dems be ashamed of themselves for that action? Of course not. It has nothing to do with them.

i.e. being really bad at parenthood is really sad, but I don't think it's a problem that afflicts only rightwing Christians.

A lot of good points here. Who knows what the right thing to do is, given that we don't know the actual situation.

The thing is the "family values" crowd claims to have the answers. They know how to parent and create sound families. Booshwa. They are just as stoopid about all this as the rest of us. The buddah has feet of clay.

Personally I'm with Bush. No Child Left Behind.

It is much harder to live with real people than to spout platitudes. I understand Keyes makes his living spouting platitudes. Perhaps it is time he changed careers.

I believe characterizing the religious with abuse of children is lazy thinking in the extreme. Worse, you're not quite sure this story supporting your broad association is even true.

There are plenty of noteworthy atheists with serious familial issues, disagreeing with them doesn't entitle me to assign pathologies to the whole group and still be taken seriously. Michael Newdow ring a bell?? The daughter has no role in his predatory litigation, but he claims to speak on her behalf.

I guess the oh-so-NOT religious should suffer in your esteem as well, if we're being fair and consistent, no?

You target a Christian, compare him favorably with a Muslim (you said Arab, but we know what you meant), and wash your hands based on Judaism.

If you will note my posts in the comments I never said I wasa perfect parent. Far from it.

And sure there are plenty of bad parents of all political persuasions. The Christian Right has no monopoly on bad parenting.

My point on making an issue of this is that the Christian Right clams to have the answers. Listen to Mr. Keyes or go to his www site. He will tell you he has the answers and they came direct from God. No challenge possible.

That is why I am making fun of that bufoon's parenting in this case. Not because I have done any better. But because he claims to know how it should be done, despite the evidence that he is just as inept as the rest of us.

Mr Keyes tells a lot of people what they want to hear. He makes good money at it. Don't mean he has a clue.

If as so many on the right believe that "gayness is a choice" how in the 'ell did he manage to get his daughter to chose a "lifestyle" he abhors? How in the heck did he get his daughter to be a Democrat politically? Did she fail economics? Is she against wars of liberation?

Ball in your court Mr. Keyes (or his supporters) there are questions. What are your answers?

BTW I voted for Bush on two of his main points - economics and the war. I intend to fight his third main point. The culture wars.

When has parenting been a totally deterministic science? I agree that Keyes shouldn't be promising people that if you follow his 12-step program your kids will love you and and you won't have family problems ever again. But how is the process of family-building that he preaches wrong?

You forget that families depend on more than one person. The parents and the children have to be willing to sign on the same agenda. If either side balks, then it's not going to work.

For many families, the christian view of family-building does work because it preaches respect and love for one another. A small proportion of christian families that have the same problems as Keyes' does not mean that the plan itself is a sham.

Remember that we haven't heard Alan Keyes' side of the story. If it's just because she's a gay activist then he would have thrown her out a long time ago.

Alan Keyes is just as human as the rest of us. He makes mistakes. Bush makes mistakes. Doesn't mean the gran vision that they present to others is pure dross afterwards.

If as so many on the right believe that "gayness is a choice" how in the 'ell did he manage to get his daughter to chose a "lifestyle" he abhors? How in the heck did he get his daughter to be a Democrat politically? Did she fail economics? Is she against wars of liberation?

Ball in your court Mr. Keyes (or his supporters) there are questions. What are your answers

Well I'm not a Keyes supporter, but I do know a thing or to about kids. Some are going to rebel. If I, as a parent say this is good the child will act as if its bad and if I say it's bad they will act as if its good, even knowing that it is not in their best interests. I know well of what I speak, having being on both side of this "emotional power struggle". Its kinda like the Dems today, even if Bush is right, they have to bitch, complain and tell you how they could do better (just elect me and I'll tell ya how).

I once told my father that as an American I had rights, he laughed and said that the only right I had was to be free of physical and emotional abuse, all others must be earned, that as long as I live under his roof, it was his rules, and as soon as I went out an got a job, put a roof over my head and pay taxes I could live my life, full of rights granted by the US Constitution. BTW, at 20 he kicked me out because I quit going to school, had no job and as he said 'I wasting my life'. Man did I 'find religion' pretty quick. Sadly, I don't see many parents like this anymore.

Responding to: "If as so many on the right believe that "gayness is a choice" how in the 'ell did he manage to get his daughter to chose a "lifestyle" he abhors?"

The point is that it was _her_ choice, not his.

Conservatives don't claim that they have a deterministic formula for raising perfect kids. Where did you get that idea?

By the way it's a bit deceptive to claim that Keyes "called Mary Cheney a hedonist". What happened is that he was arguing that homosexual behavior is hedonisitc and then the reporter _asked_ him if Mary Cheney was a hedonist. He had no choice but to agree. It is deceptive to make it look like he went after her. I have no doubt that if the reporter had asked him about his own daughter he would have responded the same way.

Which, by the way, should put to rest the fiction that he hates homosexuals. We don't know why he kicked out his daughter, but we know that he continued to support her long after he knew she was a lesbian, so it wasn't for that.

It's just amazing that when any religious conservative says that homosexuality is a sin, that they are accused of hating homosexuals. Religious conservatives also say that divorce, gossip, sex outside of marriage, and hatred and are sins. Do you assume that they hate all divorced people, gossips, anyone who has sex outside of marriage, and anyone who hates anyone?

Just an update on this: She is who she says she is, and the funny way of spelling angels is something she does in imitation of a friend living on the street - who really spells it like that. Read back a little on that blog; she is definitively a good writer.

I'm a bit appaled that you think her a spoiled brat because she relays the support she has had from her friends. She is, after all in a very difficult life situation - that's real, too.

It seems like both you and your guests have some illusions about being thrown out. I suggest you brave the almost unreadable site and read the older posts.

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