Posted by csudak on 1/2/2013 11:00:00 PM (view original):Also, arfy you may be able to answer this, on the vote you got elimated, you had 3 votes, dubs had 3 and horvie had 2, but jhard didn't vote. Who was jhard suppose to vote for, since you and him were so tight? If he was suppose to vote horvie, I wonder how that tiebreaker vote would have gone.

The only reason we got the votes to eliminate you on the revote was that horvie realized you screwed him and I think trevnasty came with me tsut and sjurat, as ghutton said he wouldn't vote for you.

Jhard and ghutton would have worked hard to get trevnasty to vote with them. Me, tsut and sjurat would have voted together, but if push came to shove someone might have flipped to avoid a fire building challenge.

Interesting to think about.

Jhard didn't vote that time because he didn't want to vote me, and he didn't want to vote against horvie and trev..

If you don't believe we were so tight, I'll prove it. He'll post a message!

Posted by csudak on 1/2/2013 10:53:00 PM (view original):Tyson, can you posts the results of the aggie vote on 12/10. I was curious about that vote when it happened, that was the vote that ended me and arfy relationship's as the votes made me realize arfy had to be in with part of the "big 4".

How would this make you realize it? We had no one else to vote off?

Because you didn't vote against the Big 4 in that vote. Had they voted you out instead of caesari in their last vote, I likely would have voted with sjurat and that tribe and it would have be 6-4 against trevnasty, I suspect.

The original talk was for trevnasty from one side and sjurat from the other. The I switched the target to nyaggie from sjurat to protect sjurat. In the end, nyaggie and Casey voted with ghutton against sjurat. sjurat voted for trev, and the rest of us voted for nyaggie, including you, which meant you and I were with the Big 4 at that point.

Dubs, what are you talking about? You weren't even in the tribe when we voted Nyaggie off. You were on the other team.

nyaggie was the first vote of the Merge.

Me, you, jhard, trev and Horvie voted for him

sjurat voted for trevnasty

Casey, ghutton, nyaggie and tsut voted for sjurat I believe

caesari was the last tribe vote for you guys. He came in 12th
We then voted out bhazlewood in our last vote

Posted by Arfy on 1/3/2013 12:59:00 AM (view original):I though Denise should have won over Skupin. Denise was at EVERY single tribal.

AND I think the biggest robbery in all of survivor is not rewarding Russell with something. His gameplay was inspiring. Funny thing is that I though I was going to hate him when I saw him bury the shoes or whatever it was that he did on the very first episode. But the things that he did week in and week out just amazed me to the point to which I really respected.

Sure, it's easy from the outside to see someone burn a bunch of people and say what a great job they did, and maybe it is a great job to play that way and get everyone else out, but no one who see's the game that way, looks at the perspective of the people that got burned. If you have a deal with a bunch of people, then break all those deals and make it to the end, you might see that as great strategy, and people on the outside looking in might see that as great strategy, but the people that got burned are very likely to be bitter. People can talk all they want about who played the "best" game, but every season of Survivor, the jury are the ones who get to decide what criteria makes up the "best" game (admittedly, most juries vote for whoever screwed them less, but with that history, that should be part of your plan to win in the end).

Just because I don't directly lie to people, or break alliances, doesn't mean that I play a "clean" game. I look at "outwitting" to mean out-maneuvering, slight of hand, influencing and getting others to do your "dirty work" for you. I think you can play that way, without directly lying to someone and, with careful wording, without breaking any alliances. Lying seems like the easy way, and sure it works, but people have long memories and it will (well, should) only work once.

Then again, you CAN play that way as long as you bring someone with you to the end that played a similar style, if you can out-finesse them with the jury members on the way out, and the way you sell your speech/answer questions. You and awags both burned bridges down to the ground last season, but I thought awags broke way more deals than you did and that you'd be a lock to win because of it...yet somehow awags swayed enough of the jury to take it. Lots of different styles to play, and clearly lots of different styles win the game. Just because I don't respect straight out lying as a strategy doesn't mean that I don't respect the fact that it can win. Just as I don't get your assertion that playing a clean game "isn't playing the game".

I only brought awags last season, because I bought into his bullshit. He played me. I'm your buddy....we can do this together. I could have taken Mr. Mojo at the end, but I stayed true to my word. As far as dirty work....he did all of it last season. I just sat back and voted for whoever he told me to. How you think I was dirty, I have no idea. But in the end....He played a better game. I would have voted for him too. He played everyone. No one is EVER going to agree on what they look for in a wnner. Maybe that is something that somebody should find out next time before the game begins.

And FYI- The reason i don't find playing a clean game "as playing the game" is because you are not taking control of your own desitny. If you can somehow do it, more power to you. But the guy that does whatever he has to to get there to me is actually "playing the game".

Arfy did just sit back last time. Awags had control and often it seemed Arfy was the bad guy. Awags had the whole thing mapped out early. I applaud home for running thenshownfrom start to finish.

In Survivor XII – Redemption Island, be careful who you vote for! Several players will earn the opportunity to re-enter the game, which could be dangerous if you had a hand in voting them out! And of course to survive, you must make predictions on a wide range of sports including: NCAA Tournament, NBA, NHL (hopefully), MLB, Masters, Kentucky Derby, World Baseball Classic, and others. New For This Season:*Redemption Island Theme: When a player is voted out, they will go to Redemption Island. At each merge (and once during the final tribe), there will be a Redemption Island challenge involving all of the players who were recently voted out. The ONE player who wins that challenge will return to the main island. All of the other Redemption Island inhabitants will be eliminated for good. Players cannot pass immunity idols while they on Redemption Island!

*Some of the early tribe challenges will have an individual aspect, where each member must submit a pick or a set of picks. They can discuss the picks with their tribe, but are not required to.

Ghutton 9 and I will be hosting. The plan will be to start sign-ups in early March and begin around the start of the NCAA tournament. If you are interested in playing and would like a reminder when sign-ups begin, either post in the thread or send me a sitemail.