At this point I think we can stop the question of if DeSean Jackson will become an ex-Eagle and focus on when that will happen. Everyday the reports grow in volume and strength. Just a week ago Jeff McLane slammed the door on the notion of DeSean being traded. Now that’s changed.

The Eagles have intensified their efforts to trade Pro Bowl wide receiver DeSean Jackson in the last week, according to three independent NFL sources.

While there have been earlier reports that teams reached out to inquire about Jackson, in several cases it has been the Eagles that have directly or indirectly shopped the wide receiver to gauge interest, two of the sources said.

The team had no comment on Friday.

The Eagles’ marketing of Jackson leads to the near inevitable conclusion that he will not be with the team this season.

I don’t mention this as criticism of McLane. The initial report did seem crazy. McLane checked with his sources and heard no info about Jackson being on the outs. Obviously McLane talked to some new sources and got a very different story.

No one is sure exactly what to make of this situation right now. Confusion runs rampant.

Many of you have asked how I think the Eagles have handled the situation. The knee-jerk reaction is to rip them for letting this turn into a disaster. But I’m not sure that’s totally fair.

Any team thinking about acquiring DeSean Jackson would be wise to find out exactly why the Eagles are done with him.

Right now the Eagles know all the facts. We don’t. We can only speculate about what caused a seemingly benign situation to go toxic so quickly. It sure feels like the Eagles know something we don’t.

Back in 1990 the Eagles made a shocking cut of a gifted young WR. Cris Carter hauled in 11 TD passes in 1989 and was given his walking papers after the season was over. The Eagles caught a lot of flak for this. Buddy Ryan’s infamous response, “All he does is catch touchdowns.”

Later on we found out that Carter was an alcoholic and drug addict. Carter will tell you that Buddy Ryan not only saved his career, but saved his life by cutting him. Carter had his”moment of clarity” when he got cut. That caused him so sober up and change his life.

My point isn’t to say that DeSean has the same situation as Carter did, but rather that there could be unknowns that will help the situation to make more sense down the road. If this is just about sideline spats with Bob Bicknell, DeSean not fitting the Chip Kelly way and things like that, I will be disappointed for sure.

I’m not going to speculate on what issues there could be with Jackson. Do that as you like. You do read stuff like this and it does make you wonder what goes on around him.

Some looking out for DeSean's interests prefer that he stays on east coast, away from distractions near home. Might not have say in matter.

This is one weird situation that still has a long way to go. We may not know the full story for a while.

_

Scott

Reminder: Chip Kelly’s Oregon offense never needed a speedy WR to stretch the field vertically.

ztom6

what offense couldn’t use a player like that? can’t believe it’s even a question in people’s minds. It’s not football related, whatever it is.

austinfan

It’s all relative to the guy you’re NOT playing.
In Chip’s offense, a big WR with average speed, good hands, good route running and good run blocking may be just as valuable as Djax.

ztom6

he’s not. DJ produced 60 first downs tor the Eagles, led the league in plays of 20+ yards. You’re not going to replace that with some less athletic bigger guy.

Mark Saltveit

Funny thing is, DJ never had more than 43 first downs in 5 seasons under Andy Reid, who built his offense around DeSean. Or more than 21 plays of 20+ yards (vs. 25 under Kelly.) Chip’s offense boosts all skill players. That includes DJ’s replacement, whether it’s Maclin, Cooper, Darren Sproles or Brandin Cooks.

ztom6

Absolutely, but DJax is still a special player whose skills can’t easily be duplicated.

Mark Saltveit

I guess we’ll see. One striking thing is how DJax consistently came up small in the playoffs. Averaged 50 yrds a game over 6 games. Keenan Lewis owned him this year.

ztom6

Yes that is a point oft-repeated. It’s also clear he didn’t have the same chemistry with Foles he had with Vick.

shah8

NO.

shah8

Actually, to be specific, the Oregon offense has always depended on RB and OWs with deep speed. Remember, it’s a kind of more-passing triple option offense. You can run it with slower people at WR and RB, but you won’t get great results because it’s dependent on breaking defenses, not wearing them down. If a defense gets to slow the offense, it forces more plays to be run, and more mistakes that could occur. Fewer big plays means lots of running around, for not so many points, and greater-than-another-offense coerced simplification if you get behind or are in a shootout.

D3FB

The 2010 Ducks team that went to the title game, only had two significant players who ran a sub 4.5. That would be Barner and James and both were primarily used as backs. They combined for only 329 yards receiving. Maehl was the go to receiver and only ran a 4.62.

shah8

I remember that team, Cam and Nick smushed it. But yes, those two players had the speed, and they were, ultimately speaking, the players that mattered in the offense. I mean, you think Darron Thomas was going to be throwing accurate deep throws all over the place?

Just like Georgia Tech in 2009 with Dwyer and BeBe Thomas, compared to Tech in 2010 with slower Anthony Allen (who still made it to the NFL) and stone hands Stephen Hill. Joshua Nesbitt was still there and still good, but not nearly the dominance in offense.

You really really really require get-away-from-the-cops speed at RB to win with offenses like TO or Oregon. Even better to have WR with speed as well.

SteveH

Well Chip’s not very smart so he would probably trade away the one player who absolutely holds this whole dog and pony show together. Stupid head coaches, when will they start listening to the fans…

austinfan

Yep, the fastest starting WR on his teams at Oregon was Huff at 4.48. He actually started some TE/WR hybrid types. His fastest guys have been scatbacks, and he trades for Sproles. Coincidence?

Mark Saltveit

Huff is also available and underrated this year, good late round pickup. His college production was limited by some truly horrific family BS, like his drug-addict mom hitting him in the head with a 2×4. She’s in prison now.

holeplug

And once they played an SEC defense they got smashed into the ground.

D3FB

They threw for 375. They only ran for 75 because Auburn was vastly better up front. That has nothing to do with skill players.

austinfan

That was due to a lack of talent on the OL, not the WRs. Oregon struggled against teams that could match up against their OL, which is why Chip spent on Peters and Kelce and drafted Lane. He’s seen his game film.

Mark Saltveit

You mean the National Championship Game where they only lost to Auburn on a last minute field goal after a fluke play? In Kelly’s second year ever as head coach at any level? Yeah, burn on Chip!

Mark Saltveit

Jeff Maehl, of admittedly average athletic skills, still holds the NCG record for longest reception. That’s what Chip Kelly’s offense can do for people. DeSean had a career year with Kelly, and that wasn’t because he worked hard or learned new skills in the off-season.

Vick or Nick

My $0.02 :

DeSean was quite vocal about wanting a restructured/extended/new deal going into next season.

Eagles, in my opinion, want DeSean to take a pay cut. DeSean has the
NFL’s 3rd highest base salary for WRs, and 5th biggest cap hit.

As good as DeSean was last year, I think the sensible fan would agree
thats too much when Eagles have other needs to take care of, including
the handful of players that need to be resigned next off season.

As always, negotiating with DeSean and his agent will not be easy,
and the Eagles know it. Thus, they would rather move him now when his
value (prior to all the toxic media coverage) was as high as it would
ever be.

no thats not how it works my friend.. they give upfront money for signing bomus that dont count on next years cap… AND by the way then next year u get rid of desean, and do it right, not like this failed attempt that has us potentially releasing one of the best eagles of all time and getting NOTHING for him.. and even if we got a 5th then WOW we got a Fing 5th for one of the best eagles WRs of all time.. woo hoo.. im so stoked.. smfh… i thought the eagles were done with this failed FO management.

The fact that we might lose DeSean is bad enough, but add in the fact we might not even get anything for him makes this so much harder to swallow.

shah8

Aldon Smith is still a 49’er. Michael Irvin never stopped being a cokehead, and he stayed a Cowboy.

The bigger thing is that many issues are much harder to cover up than they used to be. Ryan Mallet, for example, has serious and consistent rumors of hard drug abuse. Others are noted for marijuana, or a violent temper. If there was a rape case about to happen, I think we’d have long heard something about it.

Thus, I think it’s a little early to presume that the Eagles have a good reason that we aren’t aware of.

ICDogg

Yeah, it seems insane to me. I would like to think that there is a good reason for this but have no evidence that there is.

What? im not saying it 100 percent is, but thats how crips use spelling. tell me why else would it be that way? I kno he rides with crips, snoop dog is like an uncle to him.. the rapper on his lable is FOR SURE a crip he raps about irand all…i think he name is kid cali?? something like that

D3FB

Like I said it’s conjecture. It’s asinine because you are taking information from somebodies life and inferring serious criminal activity. For all you know CC means central Cali, or Crazy Cars. I mean Richard Sherman is from Compton, bet he is gang banging too!

being in gang isnt alway criminal activity.. see u dont even understand gang culture… u are ignorant to the full truth and only can speak in absolute terms, u r limited.

Neil

Damn, talk about an existential beatdown.

D3FB

You specificially said the Cali Crips. Crips aren’t exactly the local VFW. They are a street gang. You didn’t use it as a disambiguation. The purpose of street gangs isn’t to help the little old lady cross the road or any other philanthropic goal.

Neil

Let’s look at this a little differently though. Realistically, how many degrees of separation are there betwen Desean and criminals in his network. Two or three at most?

D3FB

Guilt by association? Alot of players came out of low income areas and still have friends who probably live less than upstanding lives.

Neil

That’s true, but those players don’t dress like Desean to broadcast their loyalty to that lawless culture.

Jernst

So were cutting our most explosive offensive weapon because we don’t like his clothes?

Neil

I remember watching a video some Gs took getting their people to all go have some fun blocking a freeway both ways with a wall of cars. Then with the rest of their cars they drifted in circles in the space they had cleared. One walks up to the camera, “THIS IS HOW WE DO”.

Everyone there was dressed like Desean. This is what Desean is identifying with, and based on his instagram these are the kinds of people he’s associating with. It’s not the clothes but the people in them. They use the clothes to identify themselves to each other as a part of a broader culture. The problem is this culture is basically criminal in nature. If they think they can block a freeway and waste everybody’s time and nothing is going to happen to them, they will do it just to show that they could. It’s a culture of pure, virulent antinomianism.

Jernst

In the immortal words of the late, great kenny powers, ” Well, that’s mighty white of you, Neil.” Of course, DeSean does seem like the kind of guy who might identify with gang culture, but to offer his clothing as the ultimate sign that he identifies himself as a thug criminal because you saw a video of a bunch of assholes blocking traffic to spin their tires (who I assume due to the tone of your post, also happened to be black) who happened to dress similarly to him, makes you sound absurdly ludicrous. And, frankly no different than those who condemned rock n roll music as the soundtrack of the devil because Elvis shook his hips or any of the never ending line of generations who think the next generations clothing and music are a penultimate sign of the collapse of societies moral fabric. There’s been nothing substantiated that would show he’s a criminal or a bad person. He dresses a certain way and raps in his spare time. These things do not identify him as a criminal. And, as much as I hate to make this about race, the fact that you’d judge a young man who has never had a legal transgression and has been a stand up member of society based on his clothing and how he “looks” like the thugs u saw in a video once reeks of not so subtle racism or at the very least a serious generational misunderstanding. Please be more intelligent than to make arguments based on someone’s character based on clothing. By the way, I’ve never seen desean dress like a criminal (whatever that means – as if he dressed up like the hamburgalar or something)

Neil

This is a mindset fundamentally subversive of order that young men with nothing to lose gravitate toward. People who embody this mindset might not burglarise houses when they’re the one in 100,000 that makes it to the NFL, but that potential is always latent until the individual changes as a person. You could look at it like an instinctive survival reflex of the personality when growing up in tough circumstances with no guiding authority who can teach you better. It has nothing to do with race, but it’s interesting that you immediately latch onto that because it hides the true nature of what you’re talking about. Look at what they do, not what they are.

I’m not saying Jackson is a criminal, but if I had to pick one player to hang with criminals knowingly, willfully, it would be Jackson. This is exactly what he’s trying to tell everyone with his attire. If I had to pick one guy who would get his house robbed because he was stupid enough to trust people who would rob him, it would be Jackson.

Jernst

I latched to race? You described the people in your drag racing video as a bunch of G’s. If this was 1955 you would have just used the N word like you really wanted to.

I do judge people by what they do. DeSean is a productive member of society that has worked really hard at his craft and spends a lot of his spare time volunteering and doing charity work. And yet, you judge him with this pseudo-intellectual rationalization for latent racism based on his outfits and what he looks and sounds like to you.

I saw a video too, actually. It had a bunch of white people in flannel shirts listening to country music. They repeatedly dropped the N-bomb and then went out and strung a black guy up from a tree.

So you see, any time you wear flannel or listen to country music you are basically identifying with a destructive murderous element of our culture. Signifying to other like-minded individuals that you too want to murder all black people for no reason. It’s a mindset fundamentally subversive of order that young white southern men with
nothing to lose gravitate toward. People who embody this mindset might
not burn crosses or lynch young innocent black men when they’re the one in 100,000 that makes it to
the NFL, but that potential is always latent until the individual
changes as a person.

See how ludicrous that sounds. I give Riley Cooper the benefit of the doubt that he’s a good person that made a drunken mistake and used a hurtful word that he normally wouldn’t use. And, until Jackson actually does something criminal I’m not going to judge him because people that look like him have committed crimes before.

Neil

Hah. I’m just using the word they would use for themselves. You can call me racist, but you’re the one who keeps talking about race.

Sorry, but the rest of that is too long. Sorry bud.

James Adair

Kelly gave the reason a while back. Big people beat up little people and DeSean is little people. The rest is just seasoning.

Jernst

That type of reason would make some sense. If it’s schematic I defer to Chip. He knows what fits his scheme better than I.

If DeSean truly did some criminal, damaging stuff…then by all means, label him as such and ship his ass outa town.

However, if we are cutting DeSean, because, as Neil points out, his choice in clothing signifies that he’s a gangta espousing the lifestyle of criminal behaviors, and we know this because Neil, himself, once saw a video of similarly dressed “G’s” drag racing and saying “this is how we do” into the camera…then I’m sorry, I will disagree with said reasoning.

Jernst

Also, if big people beat up little people is the sole reason, we’d entertain the possibility of moving Jackson if we had the opportunity to replace him with someone bigger. I doubt (assuming the reports are true) that we’d be this aggressive in trying to move him without that other person on the roster. I think we’d be happy to take his top 10 level production until we knew we had his replacement.

yes i know cali crips, u have no idea,…a gang “crips, bloods” are a group friends, they grow up together there is a certin amount of loyalty….its a brotherhood.. desean has likely been a crip since he was very young.

D3FB

Ok but you suggested that his association with these people was one of the reason the team would want to cut lose with him. If it was simply a group of friends that wouldn’t be the case.

idk, maybe it was a new friend, people change and do dumb ish.. i cant tell u exactly what happen because idk.. thats why he was postying things about snakes on his twitter.. sometimes friends can be fake.. even in gangs even in a brotherhood like the crips i kno hard to belive huh?? lol

Just because you are affiliated with a gang doesn’t mean that you are doing dirt. Gang like that LOVE to have celebrities affiliated with them. Do you really think Snoop and DJax are hanging out at some crack house in LA? No they just seem to like what the lifestyle represents for whatever reason.

Mark Saltveit

“You didn’t use it as a disambiguation.” Did you just go Wikipedian on his ass? Damn.

Neil

This is actually the only thing I think he’s ever said that isn’t asinine. I think this is Charlie’s soon to be fabled only interesting comment ever.

YES!!! it is.. he def rolls with crips. its not made up, crips emphasize words with extra Cs and all that..

BobSmith77

Goes both ways and in many ways it is much easier to keep tabs on a guy too especially after hours.

For example, I know for a fact that the Red Sox had someone whose sole job was to deal with Red Sox players & clubhouse incidents but in particular Manny Ramirez. That person had a cell phone on 24/7 during the season and traveled with the team to every away game.

Ramirez was a complete scumbag who would do all kind of ridiculous things including walking out of bars/restaurants with huge tabs, banging groupies on the road, etc. This person basically acted as a handler to immediately clean up any of Ramirez’s messes, ensured they stayed quiet and out of the media, and that Manny was on the field & ready to play.

austinfan

Michael Irvin was a great practice player and a warrior on the field, two things never said about Djax.

Weapon Y

What could DeSean Jackson do? Tell Chip Kelly is his mama is fat? This just sounds like a stupid pissing contest.

Sean

It seems to me that DeSean is trying to force a new contract with guaranteed money. I don’t think he’s totally unreasonable in doing that, but that seems like the situation. There was a report today that he’s actually the one who won’t return Chip’s calls, and not the other way around. It may be the case that he’s demanded a new deal, and the Eagles have bristled and are annoyed he even asked. As a response, his agent is leaking reports that the team might release him, because he wants it to happen, so he gets a cut of that new deal.

Dave

You don’t think its unreasonable for a player to ask for more money 2 years into a contract? What exactly would you consider unreasonable,; 1 year into a new contract, 6 months, before the ink is dry?

Adam

It’s unreasonable because he signed the damn contract in the first place. The fact that he signed a deal for most of the guaranteed money up front is no ones problem but his own. He took a $10m signing bonus because he was spent all his money and couldn’t keep up his lifestyle. No team will trade for him because of his salary, so clearly he hasn’t outplayed his contract.

If he wants a new deal it’s because more guaranteed money because of his short sightedness, and the Eagles won’t put themselves in a position to give in to demands like this. It sets a bad precedence for them from a contract negotiation stand point. It’s not their MO at all. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t want to see DeSean go, but if all this is happening because DJax doesn’t want to play out the deal he signed, then I don’t have a ton of sympathy for him.

Sean

Well, by your logic, no signed contract should ever be renegotiated in any way in any field, nor should the signee ever even ask to do so. I still don’t think he deserves a new contract, and I definitely don’t think the Eagles should give him one. At the same time, let’s not pretend that asking for guaranteed money as a football player following a career year is some sort of unforgivable offense that should end his tenure with the team.

Adam

Quotes from DeSean after signing his new deal:

– RE: Distractions of 2011 contract: ” That’s something that was going on (in 2011). But from here on out, I can say as a professional, that won’t happen.”

– “I still feel I have an opportunity to make $51 million. In five years, $51 million still comes out to (average) $10 million-plus. So I’m still able to go out there and feel like I’m getting my worth. I’ve just got to put it on the line and do what I need to do.”

– “So I felt a long-term deal was better for me. This is the place I want to be. This is home to myself. I love the fans. If I wanted to try anything else, I could have easily tried it.”

– “”My contract situation, I feel good with what was on the table and I didn’t want to pass that up. The relationship I had with the Eagles, I would rather take the opportunity than go anywhere else. So, regardless of what money I thought I could have got, or how much more, I’m comfortable. I’m not greedy. I feel good where I’m at here and like I said, I still have ways in my contract of making whatever I’m worth in that contract.”

– “I’m happy with the deal that I’ve gotten. If I wasn’t happy, I wouldn’t have signed it. I’m very happy with it, and I felt I got my worth. I just want to go out there and continue to play at a high level, regardless of what [other] deals come.”

– “I gave them my word that I’m going to come here and do what I can do to put everything on the line.”

Adam

Asking for a raise and refusing to play without one are two very different things. If it’s the latter, then I can see where the Eagles are coming from.

Mark Saltveit

He did that too, in 2011. And he got a big raise as a result. I think part of this is just to say, don’t even think about trying that BS again.

DeSean has to know that, if he doesn’t get traded — and he’ll have to restructure in order to get traded, unless some Dallas/Oakland type team makes a stupid decision — he’ll get released and have to negotiate from scratch, which means a pay cut of at least $5 million per year. Is a guarantee worth that much to him?

If so, then we should be worried why he is so unconfident about his ability to produce in the future. Teams will always give someone with his skills a decent 1 year unguaranteed “show me” contract. So if he’s got the goods, why is he worried about a guarantee?

Richaud Jeaffreson

Very insightful. I like it. Sounds very feasible.

planetx1971

At this point I miss an old fashioned boring off season so much. This one has a sphincter factor of ELEVEN. Much like Chip’s has to be for the circus Wednesdays press conference will be.

Daniel Norman Richwine

I maintain Chip thinks Jackson will quickly lose his speed, and at that point become basically a useless receiver. Speed goes faster than anything else, starting at age 27, and without that, what does he really offer?

Yup, and Darrel Green remained blazing fast not only through his 30s but also his early 40s.

JJ_Cake

Daryl Green was not a big guy, but he wasn’t skinny either. Don’t remember him ever getting knocked out in a game.

Dave

If you’re inferring he never had a concussion, remember that he played 295 games over 20 years. The probability is pretty high that he got his bell rung more than once.

xeynon

Joey Galloway is the exception that proves the rule. Most athletes who depend on speed begin to decline in their late 20s and fall of a cliff in their early 30s.

holeplug

This is every athlete not just fast guys

xeynon

True but it’s even more pronounced with pure speed guys. Receivers like Marvin Harrison and Isaac Bruce who relied on guile, smarts, technique, and great hands as well as speed declined somewhat once they lost a step but were able to remain effective players nevertheless because of their other attributes. Can’t see that happening with DJax who has elite speed and is no better than average in any other area.

He has GOT to be in deep…. JaCCpot the 2 C’s i believe stand for cali crip. i bet thats whats up with the whole robbery and such not.. gotta be..

kevinlied

Desean grew up middle class in a close family with a strong, even overbearing, father. The guy adopted three other kids that lacked a male role model. Desean was made to adhere to a rigorous schedule throughout his childhood and teenage years so he could capitalize on his athletic talents. He doesn’t really fit the gang member profile.

Yes most of what u said is true, BUT you fail to understand where desean grew up. He went to school, he rode the bus. Infact he had to ride a bus from one side on LA to the other. he even says it it the doc…. and thats where he met all of his friends. AND to be a gang member there different levels. he could be an honary memeber.. kinda like a mascot in a sense, but respected for his talents. those talent also give the chance to make money legally. by selling rap albums, doing shows… and plenty of pro players do that and its legal.

kevinlied

I know where he grew up, and I’m not saying it’s impossible that he feels some allegiance to the Crips, but lets not assume that because he’s a black guy from the L.A. area that enjoys aspects of the “urban” lifestyle that he has to rep a gang. None of us know Desean. Like, at all.

Right back to be a 7-9/9-7 team if they move Jackson for 3rd round or less.

planetx1971

At this point it sure feels like less. This off season already was a buyers mkt. for receivers BIG TIME with a supposed historically deep draft. Everyone is sitting around waiting for him to be cut. And you’re right, I just don’t see us being even close to good enough to go the addition by subtraction route. I personally have lost sleep over this whole debacle.

BobSmith77

Yup and why the timing of this is even worse. Getting a mid-to-late 3rd round pick is at best $.50-.60 on the dollar for him too.

If they move Jackson, they inevitably now would have to use a high draft to replace him at WR too on a team that did little in FA, has an older OL, and has several needs.

kevinlied

Eh, it’s one player, and a WR at that, and it’s football. Somebody on here had a good post showing that the early/mid-2000s Eagles’ O with T.O. scored barely more points than the Eagles without T.O. Reasonable minds can differ about Desean’s value — I happen to like him a lot — but he’s no T.O.-in-his-prime. In any event, the offense is certainly worse without him but perhaps only incrimentally so. I don’t think he’s the difference between making the playoffs and not.

A_T_G

Good perspective. He certainly adds something to this offense, but it is hard to estimate how many of his receptions would have been caught by the next guy, or a different receiver. It is hard to gauge how many of Shady’s 20-yard runs would have been 15-yarders if the safety wasn’t so deep.

xeynon

On the other hand, it’s hard to estimate how many of Shady’s 15 yarders would’ve gone for 20+ if the receiver had been able to block more effectively (DeSean tries, but his size hinders his effectiveness). This logic cuts both ways.

austinfan

Name all the top offenses that depend on a 4.4 or faster guy to clear out the field for the running game and the other WRs. Like Denver? NE? Cincy?

I can also name a lot of bad offenses with top WRs, Houston, Miami, Tampa Bay, Cleveland, etc.

That’s a stretch and it is what he can do in the open field too once he gets the ball in space.

Granted the current state of rules & contact in the NFL enhance his value but there is simply a lot more to it than ‘he’s fast.’

Adam

I’m not referring to just straight line speed. Quickness, speed, whatever you want to call it, what DeSean does in space is because he’s fast. If DeSean loses a step or two he doesn’t have the hands or size to be near as effective. I’m not selling him short, he’s a great receiver. One of the best in the league. But if he wasn’t as fast as he is, then he simply wouldn’t be.

3 step, 10 steps, stepping up one’s game, wow. For “(l)osing a “step” (being) a vague way” of defining speed you seem to have it pretty nailed down.

D3FB

A step in the 40 would be around .1 to .15. So you are telling me that if Djax lost .3-.45 seconds off his 40 he would be faster than any other receiver on this team? Let me guess at your response “man you so stupid! you can’t see because you not uzings logics son! I’m smarther than you all despite a lack of credible evidence to support by theories, STFU”.

oh so you are the one assigning the timing of the steps? lmfao.. are you fo real right now?

Losing a “step” is a vague way of saying someone has gotten slightly slower.. so…

STEP YA GAME UP!!!

D3FB

Yes go watch any overlap video of two people running a forty. The difference between one step is just over a tenth. The most experienced scout on the planet can only eyeball a time to within about a .05 of a second. That’s to an incredibly trained professional. The average fan is much less accurate than that. So for people to notice a slight dip in speed its probably at least several hundreths of a second. For that to be three of those as you postured, that would be a decrease of at least a couple tenths.

ok now watch those videos of 40, that same players everyday and when they retire THEN get the data on how much speed they lost.. lol.. dumbass.. AND a slight dip in speed for desean and desean is still a dangerous weapon!! and he is only 27!!! my god man.. AND you still dont what a losing a step mean, you cant calculate it because it varies for different people!!! step it up!!!

Flyin

Simply state your how he is more than “fast”.

BobSmith77

Agility, general acceleration, and ability to quickly reach top speed.

Thing that always irked me about Jackson isn’t he is technically sloppy as a player & that if he had honed running more precise routes that he would have been even that more effective.

Flyin

Thanks for some attributes… here is a question, would you rather have TO of ’04 or DJax of ’13?

Uh, I’d say overall Mike Wallace has had a career equivalent to DeSean’s. Ask Miami how they feel about paying him all that money. And Wallace is big enough to actually do more than DeSean if he had a mind to.

shah8

How about *you* ask Miami how they feel about Tannehill’s passes to Wallace.

Or how about *you* ask Miami why they even *got* Mike Wallace.

Or how about *you* examine what Miami *asks* of Mike Wallace. I’ve not seen him very much down there, but he plays a much less versatile role as WR than DJax does.

if he wasnt fast> thats a broad term my man.. ted gin is fast and he isnt great.. see what im saying is desean is MORE then just fast, he is alot more savy then any weak football minded eagles fans give him credit for being

Adam

And Calvin Johnson is as fast and is a better receiver. Difference is if Calvin slows down a bit he’d still have other physical abilities to be great. DeSean… no.

actually he is a much bigger target and if he slow’d down would always take hits and always be hurt.. thats me using your logic better then you….

Adam

That doesn’t even make sense. Your letting your man crush get in the way of logic here. If you can’t see that a DeSean Jackson without his speed isn’t a great receiver than that’s just silly. There is nothing wrong with him being great because of his speed. Still means he’s great. But once he loses that, he won’t be anymore.

without all of his speed?? sure. duh!!! If he only lost a step hed still be fast and explosive. lol.. and he is a lot more savy then people give him credit for… and he is shifty as well.. NOT TO MENTION has good hands and can extend and make all the catches away from his body.

But again players his size dont ever really lose their speed, and if they do its when they are 32-34.. steve smith finally started slowing down.. i think i told u before but you really need to step your game up, i feel like im teaching you right now. you owe me money

D3FB

Megatron has missed 3 fewer games than Djax has up to this point in his career, despite being in the league an extra season. Not to mention megatron’s size makes him less susceptible to big hits. He may be a bigger target but he’s also stronger and isn’t skin and bones.

And guess what? megatron is also made up of skin and bones. he really isnt a transformer lil guy. Desean is a smaller target, and shiftier in tight spaces and avoids hits.

Step your game up.

D3FB

Dunta Robinson disagrees with you. Think of it this way. A safety is running full speed and gets to run into the following three players. Djax, Megatron, Jason Peters. Who will suffer the most damage. It’s simple physics.

smh.. a hit to the head is a hit to the head… body size has no bearing on it otherunless its the guy that is doing the hitting!! (dunta robinson).. big WRs have grt concusions too!! wow… step ya gem up? yeah STEP YA GAME UP!!!

A_T_G

“smh.. a hit to the head is a hit to the head…”

Luckily, that head is irony.

Mitchell

LOL “body size has no bearing.” You do realize bigger people have bigger bone structure/muscle mass(in general) which translates into being able to sustain hits more easily. STEP YO GAME UP!!!!!!!!!

xeynon

Holy crap are your posts annoying.

Can’t you argue without insulting people? And what’s your issue with proper grammar?

Are you even serious right now? Megatron is a beast and probably the best WR in the league. DeSean is very good but hes’ no Megatron. They each have different skillsets so why even try to compare them? Anyway, I still think DeSean brings a little more to the table than just flat out speed.

D3FB

CK was saying that Megatron will no longer have value once he loses a step, because he is big he will suddenly get hurt. He was saying this wont happen to Djax because he is small. They are obviously not easily comparable. Djax has more than just speed however Megatron has much more to fall back on.

Ben

Settle dwon there Charlie, just because fans are questioning your statements doesn’t mean their stupid and telling everyone to “Step up their game” just makes you look silly and ignorant.
Having said that, I actually agree with you that he has that “twitchy” kind of speed which allows him to get open easier than other receivers and his overall talent at the WR position makes him more valuable.

i am reffering to the most emotional love/hate fan base in the entire universe… i live in philly u cant tell me nothing!!! We are smart, smart and LOUD. And are prone to major overeaction. but there is a large segment who really dont know much and are just loud… lets be honest

Yeah and those offenses last year all had piss-poor QB play for the most part and it didn’t matter who they had at WR.

Having a top WR is even more important than a top flight RB in today’s NFL.

xeynon

This is a bit hysterical.

Jackson is a good player but he’s not worth 3 wins, particularly not when the guy who’d be replacing him (Maclin) is a proven NFL player and the team has guys like Ertz who will probably be better this season and will be able to take up the slack.

BobSmith77

Maclin is largely an unknown at this point and the Eagles aren’t likely getting the pre-injury Maclin this year especially right away anyways. Beyond that they have little depth at WR. I understood why they cut Avant at this point. Just don’t even have a known #3 WR at this point.

Ertz will likely get better but he isn’t a guy who has the athletic skills or speed to put out wide like Graham or the pure physical prowess where he will command consistent double teams either.

Just seems like they are doubling down on McCoy which is asking an awful lot of him.

xeynon

Maclin will be 14 months into his recovery by the time the season starts. In today’s NFL, with modern medical and rehab techniques, that is ample recovery time. He’s only an unknown in the sense that every player coming back from injury is – it’s far more likely that he’ll be effective again than not based on historical precedent.

This also considered the best WR draft class in years, and the team will be drafting at least one, maybe two. Competent veteran receivers are likely to become available via trade/release as the rookies come in.

If the Eagles had to play a game next month, yes, the WR corps would be worrisomely thin without DJax. Fortunately, they don’t have to play one until September.

BobSmith77

Maclin’s injury even with the development is medical and rehab techniques doesn’t ever come back to 100% and the full-time recovery is closer to 18-24 months.

Just been a couple of outliers lately that have come back in a year or less in the NFLs with the similar injury. Those are best-case examples.

Imagine Maclin will still start out a bit slow & his production will pick up as the year goes on a bit as long as he doesn’t deal with other injuries.

Yeah it is a deep draft in WRs but 1-year WRs production is notoriously limited and almost non-existent once you get out of the 1st round.

It isn’t like the Eagles have a stock pile of early round draft picks or a single high draft pick either.

Yeah they will almost inevitably draft a WR early on (first 3 rounds) if they trade Jackson and probably even bring in a vet but I bet bottom dollar they don’t get close to the same level of production. Maybe 70-80% if they are lucky.

austinfan

I’m not convinced there’s a smoking gun, I think it’s an accumulation of incidents, from Chip having to demote him to dissing his position coach, to a lack of dedication to off season conditioning, etc.

And two factors really matter:
1) He’s a bad fit for Chip’s system, if Maclin doesn’t get hurt, you wonder if he would have been gone last year
2) He’s really not that good. And Chip knows it.

Sure he had this great 2013 season, or did he?
Here’s something to consider, DeSean had five games against the Redskins, San Diego, Oak and Minn.

Those four teams had horrid pass defenses, four of the six worst in the league. He feasted on them, but was meh against the rest of the schedule, very similar to his first five seasons.
71 g 274 524 4785 23 prorate to 16 games
62 118 52% 1076 17.3 5 TD

Suddenly DeSean looks like the same old DeSean when he’s not playing really bad defenses. A good but not special WR for whom it would be hard to justify a $12M cap hit EVEN if he was on his best behavior AND was actually a good fit for Chip’s schemes.

If you look at the 6 games after the bye week, other than the Minnesota game, where they just threw it up for grabs after falling behind, Chip was phasing DeSean out of the offense. And they were still scoring 32 ppg without DeSean’s heroics.

Flyin

This is easily the most intelligent comment I have read on this situation!

BobSmith77

I understand you points and Jackson has his limits including inside the red zone. If he isn’t returning punts either, that takes some of his value away a bit too.

Still the Eagles don’t have anyone remotely capable of replacing him on the roster right now, don’t have much depth at WR right now, and won’t be as good next year offensively.

If Chip really is in a ‘win now’ mode and wants to take a step ahead forward, trading Jackson does the exact opposite of that.

OregonDucker

But he can’t play if he’s in jail or in the hospital.

BobSmith77

And why are the Eagles trying to trade him if they know he is a huge injury risk and possibly might not have pass a physical if that is the case.

shah8

/me placed face in palms…

There is a reason I’m hostile to the notion of Foles being QB, and one of my suspicions about what this is about is that DJax is very pissy about Foles being QB in the way Percy Harvin was with Ponder (despite his all world stats for as long as he was healthy in 2012). That, however, could be from my own prejudices on the matter. Now, why might DJax get pissy despite his numbers? He keeps having to spend his talent making the QB look good rather than the other way around. Nick Foles, mind, does not make very many deep throws where he leads the WR. Virtually all of the completed passes were underthrown or thrown into the end zone.

Of course, of course, you *could* just imagine that he’s such a deadweight, and just not as good as “everyone” thinks he is. Plenty of idiots do, and they play games with numbers to cherrypick towards favored conclusions. However, such idiots will not convince anyone else. Do you know why? Most people can do stuff like, oh, recall the playoff game against NO and imagine what would have happened had he not played. Most people can remember other games, and imagine what the DC would do otherwise if DJax wasn’t there and didn’t have to slope strength to face him.

Adam

I’m not sure I’d use a game where the guy was invisible until NO’s starting CB went down as a point for a guy.

shah8

You *do* remember the coaches film, where Foles didn’t pass to open Desean Jackson multiple times, don’t you? Again, this is part of why I’m not on the Foles bandwagon. He really can be overly conservative in a way that’s not beneficial for wins against serious teams. I mean, what if he was like, they cover TEs well against Arizona? Would he have made the nice throws to Ertz then, and believed it would work?

BobSmith77

Jackson was open wide in the Saints’ game and Foles wasn’t throwing to him? Que?

Lewis was grabbing & clutching him from the start and the refs was allowing it.

shah8

It’s not easy to google, especially because I believe Mycatsnameismilk had the best analysis, but if you can search Bleedinggreennation for them, you’ll find plenty of grist.

Yes, Keenan Allen didn’t play a perfect game. Few CBs do, but you face a lot more good CBs in the playoffs, and you have to find your guy when they make the occasional mistake.

BobSmith77

Foles didn’t have a great game but the O-line sucked again in the Saints’ game in the running/passing game and the refs really let both teams clutch & grab all night long.

Even the pass interference call the Eagles finally got on Jackson I thought was largely a makeup call to a degree. Yeah it was technically a penalty but that had been going on all night long prior to that. Eagles were just as guilty though especially Williams who quickly realized it was going to be a game where as long as you didn’t throw/push or blatantly grab someone down you weren’t going to get flagged.

Jackson didn’t help matters by throwing up his hands & pouting a couple of times to the refs too. Nearly impossible to quantify the in-game psych battles that go on but Jackson is a guy I think you can easily get into his head and if physically intimidate too even though that has become much more difficult/if not impossible given the limitations on tackling.

shah8

The OL did not suck, according to my recollection.

And it really seems like we’ve all forgotten what Maclin was like…

Ben

I thought that it was Foles who engineered a late game heroic comeback that gave us the lead and it was a poor special teams play along with a poor defensive effort that led to the eagles losing that game. In the 4th quarter with 5 minutes left, Foles threw a short TD to Ertz thus giving us the lead Eagles 24 Aints 23.

austinfan

It’s a lot easier to find another WR than another QB. You just provided the best reason to dump Djax.

Ben

Wow, I guess Foles still needs to convince some fans that he is the man. Not me though. All this kid has done since he became an Eagle is improved. He is just finished getting his feet wet as a starting QB, in his first season with a new HC and brand new offensive scheme and he puts up 27 TD’s vs, 2 INT’s, and wins the division with a season QBR of 119.2.
This is a special QB that has broken almost all of Drew Brees’s records in high school and tied a very prestigous record in the NFL in that Oakland game. Ohh I am allover Foles’s bandwagon for sure and soon you will be too. He’s going to build on last season and maybe break another record or two, and if were really lucky he just might be hoisting that elusive Lombardi trophy over his head in the very near future. Go Eagles !!!!!

We will all remember this as the night when shah8 passed the torch to Charlie Kelly as “Igglesblitz most hated poster”.

austinfan

Me rolling my eyes. DeSean is a one trick pony who is a better fit as a #2 in a play action oriented offense with a big possession WR as the #1. He depends on space to use his explosion, which puts a lot of pressure on the OL to buy time for him to make his move. He’s mediocre out of the slot, and can’t break an arm tackle to save his life. Yes, he can put up big games against teams with bad CBs who can’t press, but throw him off his route and he’s out of the play.

A good WR, but good WRs aren’t that hard to find these days.
Not a great WR because he’s too limited by his size .
A poor fit for Chip’s scheme – isn’t versatile, and his lack of size limits him.
Not a team player, still immature (i.e. he’ll never grow out of it), undisciplined and is not happy if you don’t feed him the ball – which ain’t happening in Chip’s scheme.

shah8

That is all bull.

Especially the part where you say that good WRs aren’t that hard to find.

Mike Vick played with shit WR at Atlanta, and it wasn’t like they didn’t draft and sign prominent players. Of course, the only one that was any good was Roddy White, who matured well after Vick was gone (and no, it doesn’t have to do with Vick being bad at passing–he was terrible as a young WR). I got to see the 2010-2012 Vikings with absolute shit at WR beyond Harvin and a bit of Sidney Rice, both injury prone. We all know what it was like for the Eagles when Dmac had all of FredEx to throw to.

Fling all the poo you want. The usual history of dropping great WRs (and yeah, DJax is good to great) is that they find success elsewheres, and your team sucks for the losing of him.

Talent is talent is talent. You can be allergic all you want to talented people. Ultimately, without them, you don’t win very many games.

austinfan

Good WRs aren’t that hard to find anymore, take the five worst offenses last year and check out their WRs. Now take the five best offenses and check out their WRs. Strangely enough, there’s similar talent at WR. What makes a good offense is overall balance, QB, RB, OL, TE, WR isn’t that big a deal anymore. Conversely, with better athletes at DT and the increase in “A” gap blitzing schemes, interior OL have become more valuable.

Reason is simple, the shift to passing at the HS and college level the last two decades, the change in rules in the NFL, and the development of spread type schemes has made WR less important relative to other positions. Just look at where 1,000 yard WRs have been drafted the last decade, no longer bunched in the 1st round but all through the draft. Look the depth of WR talent the last few drafts. and especially this draft.

Depth at skill positions is now as important as quality, because having a solid slot WR or 2nd receiving TE allows you to set up mismatches against teams that can take your #1 WR away. And depth protects you from injury, if you build an offense around a $12M receiver who’s undersized and prone to concussions, your offense is one hit away from a disaster, if you spread money around and go 5 deep, you can withstand an ACL.

Jernst

Great points! I just wish we’d obtain these other WR before aggressively (if you assume the reports are true) shop our best one. If we drafted a WR high overall and he looked like a good talent and fit this year and Maclin showed he’s back after his ACL surgery and Cooper looks to be legit as a #2/3 WR and we traded Djax next year as well as adding a prospect next year too, I’d be thrilled. Pushing the man out the door with only Maclin on a bionic knee and a 1 year deal and Cooper, seems awfully risky, especially if we don’t get good compensation. Guess I’m saying I agree with the reasoning to want to move on from DeSean just not the execution.

u meant “says anyone with any common football sense that watchs the eagles games.

GvilleEagleFan

To add to your point #1: Not necessarily that he’s a “bad” fit for Kelly’s scheme, in fact I’m pretty sure I remember reading from Tommy and Jimmy that DeSean really embraced run blocking in a way he never really bought into under Reid. However, I was bored in class the other day and was doodling some plays we could incorporate with Sproles (basically IZR with a backside WR screen) and you have to think about how we can get our best personnel on the field. While DJax undoubtedly helps the run game by forcing safeties to play honest and respect his speed, you also have to figure that even when Jackson is giving good effort in run blocking that most NFL CB’s not named Rodgers-Cromartie could easily shed him. Bottom line, his positive effect on the run game also comes with a negative if he’s actually asked to block instead of chipping and then releasing into a vertical route.

Think about it this way: You can only have five skill position players on the field at once. Shady is going to play 90% of snaps (if not more), whether that’s good or bad. So on the vast majority of plays you’ve got Jackson, Maclin, Cooper, Celek, and Ertz who can all make legit cases for being every-down players. Then factor in that regardless of whether we kept DeSean, it would be pretty foolish for the Eagles not to invest in a young WR when this is supposedly the best class in 10 years for the position. The depth of the class combined with the level of talent already on the roster means that you can take a WR whenever he’s the BPA and feel confident that at some point (even if it requires trading down in the first round) a WR WILL be the BPA. Now you’ve got the five aforementioned players in addition to Sproles and a rookie WR fighting for playing time in four possible spots.

My initial thought was that Kelly would just develop an “A” group and “B” group and rotate them like hockey lines, using our depth at the skill positions to push the tempo even faster. But looking back, while familiarity with the scheme was definitely a factor that limited our max tempo, I don’t think the resistance by the referees and the league against increasing the pace of play past a certain point is going to stop. So, if you can move on from Jackson and take the dead money on his deal in a year when you’re not trying to extend Foles, Kendricks, Boykin, and Cox and at the same time allow Maclin, Ertz, Sproles, the rookie, and Cooper more time on the field b/c Jackson isn’t monopolizing one of those four remaining skill position spots I think it makes sense. Giving him more playing time is going to help the case to get Mac to resign with us if he’s healthy, and Sproles/Cooper/Ertz give us enough security beyond Mac if he’s not so that a disappointing Maclin wouldn’t mean a rookie WR is pressed into service before he’s ready.

Tack onto all of this that moving on from Jackson can serve as Kelly’s example to the rest of the team about what the consequences are if they don’t conform to the Kelly Way, and I’m really starting to come around to the FO’s way of thinking on this situation. Honestly, I’d still prefer that they figure out a way to make it work with DJax, but I’m no longer as sick to my stomach with suspicion that Kelly might not be the messiah he looked like in Year 1.

Toby_yboT

That’s just plain old fashioned rationalization. You can do the same thing with any player on any team and get similar results, I suggest you might start with:
Nick Foles
Riley Cooper

But we don’t want to do that exercise with them, because they aren’t on their way out.

I’m not even a Desean fan, before this season I stated numerous times that Maclin is our best WR. I just hate to see that we’re rewriting history and trashing players on their way out the door. I’m also disappointed to see that this comment section might becoming an echo chamber.

SteveH

My guess is that they were going to try and shop him quietly, but media stuck their nose in and blew up their spot, so now here we are. Situation is probably more toxic for us fans than the Eagles organization. Seems they made the decision to move on from him some time ago.

May as well just bust out the popcorn and enjoy the ride, should be entertaining to see what exactly caused this falling out.

kevinlied

Or they already shopped him quietly and weren’t blown away by the offers, and the media caught onto it while they were fielding round 2 (or round 3 or 4) offers. Lurie’s Eagles are pretty good about keeping things close to the vest. I can’t imagine that educated speculation from a newish blogger, who ostensibly hasn’t developed pipelines like the established beat guys, broke this thing wide open.

SteveH

So.. the Eagles intentionally leaked this thing to the media in order to turn those 3rd round offers into even worse offers? I don’t get it.

A_T_G

Jimmy has been around, running BGN and Blogging the BEast before his current gig. Besides, regardless of how long the Eagles had been shopping DJax, Jimmy was the guy to figure it out, right?

He took a lot of heat for his post, and never retreated from it or sold out his source. I think he deserves some credit now.

kevinlied

I definitely didn’t mean to sell Jimmy short. My point is that we don’t know whether the Eagles had been shopping Jackson for months and already had a sense of his value or whether the media foiled their plans by breaking the story. Rank speculation on my part, but I’d assume it’s the latter, given how good the Eagles, and, frankly, NFL teams in general (with notable exceptions) are at keeping things quiet.

BobSmith77

If they did that and Roseman waited until after FA & before the draft, then Roseman is largely a dope. I find that hard to believe that the timing of this was so poorly thought out by the FO.

TommyLawlor

While I can’t offer any real inside info on DeSean, I can tell you that the movie White House Down is beyond awful.

Maybe DeSean recommended that to Chip for movie night.

A_T_G

I couldn’t find that one, so I just watched a History Channel special on the building of the White House backwards.

nathalie a

just watched ‘snowpiercer’. not too bad, for that kind of movie. for some reason i was looking forward to it for months, and i thought it would be deeper. just another action movie post apocalyptico thingie.

the midatlantic

I can’t recommend “Homefront” w/ Jason Statham and James Franco either. I CAN recommend a chicken sandwich with dijonnaise and a bottle of red wine. Ying/yang.

austinfan

Yep. The most ludicrous plotting I’ve seen in a long time, plus the obligatory put the kid in danger and the suspension of time trick where ten minutes lasts for a half hour. And the scene with the girl waving the flag calling off the fighters was so off the wall I was thinking it was really supposed to be tongue in check – then I realized the writers weren’t that clever.

D3FB

It can’t be as bad as the “quarter mile in 10 second cars” that take 5 minutes in the Fast franchise.

Kevin_Slates

You can’t offer any info on Desean because you don’t have any or because your not revealing what you know?

On my supermarket receipt they use LOL as an abbreviation for “Land of Lakes” butter.

Flyin

I thought it was a self reference to “the Land Of the Lost”

Mac

My wife’s grandma told us it means lots of love

Ben

I believe that along with Spadaro, McPherson and the rest of the Eagles writers that you have been censored. I think you know much more than you are allowed to share. Whenever this subject comes up, the answer is followed by a joke, just like Howie and Chip when they resorted to humor about the very same questions. Whatever that is, it has got to be really bad for the Eagles to be in hush-mode. Tommy I hope that you get to write the real story when the censorship has been lifted.

Toby_yboT

That would surely be a deal-breaker.

BobSmith77

Normally, the ‘street opinion’ of the Eagles’ fans is

nathalie a

of course there are unknowns. which will always remain so. and while intellectually i can make my peace with that, my guts need this thing to be over soon, not necessarily because i ache to see djax go, but more importantly because i want to know who they will get at the position.

and tommy i don’t know why you used the word ‘disaster’. i like to think you keep your head cold (about the temperature of a pbr, say,) and not dive into frenzied hype. do NOT disappoint me thomas.

in the 2nd round they picked travor laws before they picked desean jackson… he has always been the underdog.

Flyin

that’s because he can walk under a dog.

Flyin

Tommy, you are fueling the riots that Jimmy Konsparicy started. You know you will be sacrificed on the field at the Linc to remove all these DeDemons.

TommyLawlor

Fair enough. Just give me a final PBR and final glance at the Eagles cheerleaders.

Flyin

You will have a case of PBR for your enjoyment and enough pampering by the Eagles cheerleaders… that will leave giants fans to never want to say “Big Blue” again.

spatto

This is BS the Eagles are making a mistake if they do not get at least what Minnesota got for Harvin. Buddy did help Chris Carter by releasing him but he did not help the Eagles by releasing him. Kelly, Howie and Lurie need to go the extra effort to keep this talent in Philly. If they do get rid of Peanut I hope Kelly does what I think will eventually happen in the next few years in the NFL. Eliminate small receivers and basically use very athletic TE’s in the traditional receiver spot

kevinlied

Buddy may well have helped the Eagles if the stories about Carter’s prodigious use of blow are true. Check the annals of the ABA and the ’70’s NBA for stories of how quickly hard drug use can lead to one’s decline and how destructive that decline can be to a franchise.

The thing about Percy is that he was making a fraction of what Jackson makes. Plus he’s younger and more versatile (though also more injury prone). The number of teams that can take on Jackson is much smaller, and the number of teams that can do so and aren’t in blow-up mode is smaller still. You have to expect a softer market.

BobSmith77

League has changed since then and the Eagles would get what the Vikings got for Harvin.

Still getting a late 3rd rounder or less would be nothing short of a disaster at this point in the offseeason.

Scott J

Does there have to be drama EVERY year! Argh!

Miami_Adam

I see a few people sort of brought up the notion below, and this is pure speculation, but I think Desean’s problem might be with Foles. He’s been tweeting stuff about “7 & 10” all day, and earlier in the season we all just shrugged off things like the MIN game where DJax was yelling on the sideline after a Foles INT and then Foles got called for a really dumb illegal block on a DJax TD run. Maybe this is more about Chip buying into Foles than DJax wanting to do things off the field.

BTW, the only current Eagles jersey I have is a 10, and I DJax will be good wherever he plays. He’s just a special talent.

Adam

I could see him having an issue with the guaranteed money that other receivers got this year and him wanting more. Also pure speculation, but it fits his MO.

his problem is with foles? for real dude.. lol… his problem is that he is being placed on the trade block… he respects vick, he posted ihs about avant when he was released, he gave congratz to coop mac kelce for getting new contracts as well

Miami_Adam

And why was he placed on the trade block?

And continuing with the theme of you making stuff up, DJax sent 1 combined tweet for Maclin, Coop, and Kelce signings and 1 tweet for Avant when he was released. He sent 7 consecutive tweets last night for Vick.

i said nothing of the tweets not being combined.. lol.. and so what if he did send “7” of them.. he was paying respect damn… YOU are the one making stuff up about his realtionship with foles.. put that in your pipe and smoke it

A_T_G

No, you are right. An interpersonal problem within the locker room is a ridiculous hypothesis. It is definitely because the cryptologists within the Novacare Complex were finally able to crack the super secret gang affiliation hidden in his recording label.

yeah desean cant stand the white guy who set nfl history passing stats.. yes i will chose to eat the bullshit because it makes so much sense.

A_T_G

No need to eat, you seem full already.

GvilleEagleFan

I think you’re really on to something, A_T_G. I think that while Foles has a good arm, deep anticipation throws are going to take a year or two for him to work on, and by then DJax will either have played out his contract or lost the speed that makes him a special player. Why not move him now when we have plenty of other weapons on offense and a deep WR class to draw a replacement from?

“ felt I was open, but he didn’t see me right away,” Jackson said. “I just thought I was open. It took a little bit for the ball to get there. Big part of the game. Big turnaround. Felt I was open but wasn’t able to get the ball and make a play.”

shah8

I am very sure Foles got screamed at after that game. He cleaned up a lot of his sloppy play since. Foles also stopped trying to make passes where he feels comfortable lofting balls, and he didn’t do it much if any after that game.

Greg Richards

Either go ahead and trade him or say you’re not going to trade him. I’m sick of this story either way.

Flyin

If you are sick of the story either way, find a story that makes you feel fuzzy inside in the meantime.

Wow Tommy, and you write a column for the Eagles so coming from you I must now try to ingest this madness with more credibility than ever before. Are you making any gaurantees that DeSean will not be on our roster for training camp? It just boggles my mind to no end why the Eagles would be wanting to part ways with a very good receiver at age 27 who’s had his best season to date after just learning the intricacys of a brand new HC’s offense. He went to the probowl in his first season in a new offensive scheme for gods sakes. IMHO, DeSean brings a unique skillset to this offense and to replace a player like him would be difficult at best. I would think Chip couldn’t get enough speedy players like DeSean.

GvilleEagleFan

It’s not that he doesn’t want DeSean, I think that what’s happening is that DeSean is going through some off the field stuff that is making him less desirable to the Eagles. Don’t think of it as whether DeSean is worth his contract or the non-football problems (that I’m convinced go far beyond what is public knowledge) in a vacuum, think of it as whether those costs are worth the benefit of the upgrade DeSean provides over Maclin or Cooper or Ertz or Sproles or a rookie WR. With Chip’s offense being so multiple, you really can’t think of DeSean as taking up the top “WR” spot, you have to think of him as taking up one of five “offensive weapon” spots. Sure, he’s one of the best in the league at what he does (stretching the field and making safeties play deep) but this is a run-first offense and even a willing run blocking DJax is going to be limited by his size.

Also take into account that a Kelly offense without DeSean will likely be much more focused on creating catch-and-run opportunities than it will be taking too many deep shots in the passing game, which happens to play to Foles’ skill set. I think a shift toward this kind of passing game is also evidenced by releasing Avant and acquiring Sproles. I think you could also see a lot more use for Celek, Ertz, and even Casey as screen blockers in this kind of passing game.

Vick or Nick

My $0.02 :

DeSean was quite vocal about wanting a restructured/extended/new deal going into next season.

Eagles, in my opinion, want DeSean to take a pay cut. DeSean has the NFL’s 3rd highest base salary for WRs, and 5th biggest cap hit.

As good as DeSean was last year, I think the sensible fan would agree thats too much when Eagles have other needs to take care of, including the handful of players that need to be resigned next off season.

As always, negotiating with DeSean and his agent will not be easy, and the Eagles know it. Thus, they would rather move him now when his value (prior to all the toxic media coverage) was as high as it would ever be.

Adam

I’ve got no qualms with paying the agreed upon price. You don’t ask a guy who just had a career season to take a pay cut. Bad business, IMO. Problem arises when/if he’s asking for more money. That is the issue for me.

Surely with this middle school PR fight that’s going on in the media, DeSean’s camp would leak that the Eagles asked him to take a pay cut if that would have happened. Don’t see it being the case, but that’s just me.

ICDogg

I don’t know. It seems like it almost has to be a lot more toxic than that.

BreakinAnklez

Only time he has opened his mouth about a contract was when he was DIRECTLY asked about it by our wonderful media.

Miami_Adam

I think the money is a red herring. The Eagles have $16.25M in cap space this year, which is the 7th most in the NFL, according to overthecap.com. There isn’t even anything out there that the Eagles could spend so much money on at this point.

Frencheaglesfan

I think that if the FO and Chip want to part way with Desean, they will do it soon, they now they are going to take a huge complaint by the fans, they will try to explain the situation and after that huge hit, we will have time to swallow it and will be pumped up for the draft.

nathalie a

hahaha. the front office and staff don’t give two tosses about the fans and their complaints. and they are to be thanked and commended for that. that’s not to say that at times, the fans’ opinion wasn’t the best one, but still…

No matter what happens. I sincerely hope that DeSean the man will be ok. I’ve been a fan of him since i heard about him before that draft. I think he needs a strong shoulder to lean on and noted that he would have trouble after the death of his father. No matter where he plays I hope he can find the answers he is searching for…

ICDogg

Lost in all of this is how exactly the Eagles are going to get better from basically cutting Desean (or trading him for a mid round at best pick).

austinfan

Depends on how you view both Djax and how he fits in Chip’s schemes.

1) If you think he’s special, it’s a big loss, if like me you think of him as a marginal top 10 WR who lacks scheme versatility with a limited shelf life, he’s not that hard to replace.

2) If you think he makes Chip’s scheme work, it’s a big loss, if like me you think he’s a beneficiary of Chip’s scheme, especially against weak defenses, he’s not that hard to replace.

I was never a big Djax fan, so I’m not overwrought about losing him. Chip’s history says he has little use for a WR like DeSean, now a young Steve Smith, that would be a perfect fit. Chip’s scheme, at least in Oregon, used big WRs with average speed and fast/quick scatbacks. DeSean is not a good underneath receiver (needs room and time to work his magic, easily brought down with arm tackles, and ideally matches up best with a QB with a cannon), his primary value is as a deep threat.

The draft pick haul won’t be great, but this is a deep draft.
The cap relief will have a big impact in 2015-16, gives them $6M they can roll over and takes $11-12M off the books the next couple years.

I think Chip wants to reallocate resources, he doesn’t see the need for star WRs, OL and defense are higher priorities. Most top offenses tend to be balanced and don’t depend on high priced skill people (can only afford so many once you pay a good QB). Even if DeSean was a boy scout, I doubt he’d play out his contract, since he has serious character issues from Chip’s perspective, his departure is no reason for remorse.

GEAGLE

Here is my best guess:
..
We need Desean to open things up for the offense when the only above average speed we had was him,shady and Ertz…if you are lining up coop,Celek,Avant, and shady, YOU BETTER have Desean out their creating some space..
…
But If Coop is on the field with say, Ertz,shady,Sproles,Brandin Cooks and Moncief type weapons…We don’t need Desean commanding attention, because all our weapons will command it…
…
A lot of us talk about Chip wanting a stacked arsenal of weapons he can throw at defenses in waves. Well, if you have a stocked arsenal of Mac,Moncrief(or whatever 3rd round WR), Cooks(or whatever first round WR), Ertz in a bigger role,Celek,Sproles and Shady, then guys are going to have to sacrifice individual stats and touches, if Desean was a major headache this year, when we really didn’t have many serious weapons and he was crucial to our offense, how will he act when we are stacked and will have to sacrifice some touches and snaps?
…
Keep him, trade him, I don’t really care. We all knew he would essential be a free agent right now because of the contract he signed..just so happens we are basically deciding to make him walk….but that doesn’t excuse how poorly we have played our hand? You want to trade Desean, you do it out of the blue, when no one sees it coming. What you can’t do is let the media start a shitstorm to the point where every GM is laughing at us, playing chicken, waiting for us to cut him…
…
I think we have to change our approach. Tell Desean and his agent, you don’t get another dollar out of us. You want a new deal, then you will restructure so we can trade you and get some value…until then you will shut up, come to work, and fall in line until we can get value in return…Desean will get a new deal from someone, someone will get a probowl WR, and we simply can’t be left with our dick in hour hand, We simply have to now play hardball, and be willing to keep him into July if need be, but eventually some desperate coach and GM who is on the hot seat and can’t wait for draft picks to grow up and save their job will give us value for him….we just can’t trade him as soon as we would have liked, because we played our hands like it was AMATUER hour..
…
My beloved Howie, “you broke my heart Fredo”

GEAGLE

Remember that Chip quote a few months back? Something along the lines of “we aren’t just looking at what guys can and are willing to do, but we also care about what you are willing to sacrifice”….

ICDogg

What the hell is a “marginal top 10 WR”?

Neil

I would assume someone who’s 9-11

BreakinAnklez

DeSean opened up the field. You have to keep a safety back to account for him or he’ll burn you over the top. He opened up the field for Coop underneath and his deep threat helped the run game. To say he is simply a beneficiary and not an asset to this offense is crazy. He gave 10x the effort blocking than Mac has ever even thought about giving.

The cap talk is crazy, his deal doesn’t limit us cap wise at all. Foles could command a big contract, but let’s see if he can even come close to replicating his play on the field last year. Kendricks won’t be a huge deal because he has yet to show he can play consistently, Boykin is a slot corner, Cox has been decent but nothing that would command a top DE salary. Thornton has 0 pass rush ability. Everyone on offense is locked up for the next couple years and no one on the defense is that talented that they’ll command top dollar.

Corry

That’s what I’m wondering. How do you get better by gambling on the draft (and Mac’s knee)? It’s a receiver heavy draft, but there’s no guarantee of landing the guy you want/need.

BobSmith77

Simple. They won’t if it happens (at least this next year).

Ryan

Has anyone even thought of the possibility that Chip thinks that Maclin is a better receiver anyway? Maybe he thinks that Mac can equal or exceed what DJax did last season in his offense. Prior to this season, Maclin was widely considered the better and more complete WR. I wouldn’t rule it out when factoring in why this is potentially happening.
Why put up with the headache if you have a replacement that you think is better while also being cheaper?

GENETiC-FREAK

All the Maclin supporters might get their wish to see if he is better than DJax

Insomniac

Times change. Maclin didn’t really live up to the expectations anyway. He’s a #2 receiver that could have grown into a stud #1 before he got injured. Plus…self tacking ain’t what Chip wants so why would you think that Maclin can replace Djax?

GENETiC-FREAK

To think alot of fans are saying DJax is easily replaceable is silly.. Saying he has only is speed to depend on is just lazy.. DJax should just ask to be released this team doesnt deserve your talent this fan base doesnt thats for sure.. Using you as trade bait.. Ask for a release or just sit out until you get cut.. Chip n Roseman better have a good replacement for his talent coz self tacklin Maclin sure isnt the answer.. NFL is a business but you win with the talent on the field not off it

The only good thing about this DeSean drama is the funny shit that has been going on on twitter.

we know more inside info about the missing Malaysian airline than we do Desean Jackson situation and that’s not saying much

#jacpocalypse

ICDogg

I thought it was #jaccpocalypse

GermanEagle

Smart. Arse.

scratcherk

Did Jimmy Kempski screw the eagles? They were trying to trade him under the radar until Jimmy came along with his theories and foiled their plans. Now they have to turn around and aggressively shop him. Maybe they could have gotten a high draft pick before but no longer.

Not saying I would want Jimmy to do anything differently but its funny how he started this series of events that drastically affected the Eagles offseason plans.

GEAGLE

I would prefer being in the dark then letting our media completely devalue an asset to the point where we are lucky to get a 5th out of him

austinfan

Don’t be silly. By the time the media gets hold of the story NFL insiders have known about it for a while, it’s like players who “drop” in the draft, except by the time they publicly “drop,” they’ve already fallen on teams’ draft boards. Everything leaks eventually, but by the time information leaks it’s usually old news.

And DeSean’s trade value has nothing to do with the media. Eagles had to wait to sign Maclin and Cooper, and it made sense to wait for Tate to sign, now there are no alternatives but the draft for teams looking for starting WRs.

GEAGLE

While what you are saying is true, you are taking an overly simplistic view of the situation…5 days ago Desean was hearing these rumors and saying he was hurt and how he wants to be an eagle…fast forward a few days of media shitstorm and Desean is now tweeting pics of him associating with players from every rumoed team. When Desean starts fanning the flames, that’s the point of no return…so silly, would be pretending the media has no impact on this situation…just wait til the owners meeting shitstorm

austinfan

Doesn’t matter what DeSean thinks, it’s obvious Chip didn’t want him back. So media doesn’t matter, all that matters is Eagles have plenty of cap room and don’t HAVE to move him until they want to move him.

Fans go crazy, but there is no way to deal a player without a media firestorm, and a patient team just ignores the nonsense and keeps its eyes on the prize.

Anders

The problem with that view is that if we hear anything, it is because somebody wanted us to hear it.

The media hasnt devalued him. The Eagles according to reports tried to trade him last as well, so it is not something new.

BobSmith77

If the Eagles plans were truly and radically compromised by this, then the FO (especially Roseman) screwed up big time. Highly doubt it although the Eagles have no leverage now and some team is almost inevitably going to pick their pocket I bet.

GEAGLE

If Yous think this is a mess now. Just wait til the owners meeting…when our coach and GM have to, stand up in front of the world and say we have no desire to trade him, when everyone knows we will be blatantly lying..

nathalie a

oh . so even on here you blame jimmy kempski ?? *that* is most definitely the most hilarious thing about this whole hullabaloo wrapped in a hooplah.

GEAGLE

I know right now everything seems really bad, and it certainly seems like we played our hand like it’s AMATUER hour…but I wouldn’t be surprised of Howie has a wildcard up his sleeve that we aren’t accounting for….this was all botched so bad, that I have a hard time thinking Howie could be so dumb..
…
Every team is leaking intel or ATleast rumors about this mess. jets say they interested but not at his current contract, same thing is coming out of San Fran and Seattle..panthers intel suggesting the same…..yet, Raiders are flying quietly under the radar, not saying a thing about this,and that was the team who was rumored to initial make an offer during the combine, which is what started this entire mess….

HipDaDip

What happened to that? Wasn’t it two seconds? I remember being sort of iffy on the return value when I heard. Any chance the third rd pick was leaked so fans feel better about the haul?

GEAGLE

Nothing happened, it just evaporated…which is why I’m thinking they may be our eventual dance partner..yeah the rumor I heard was two seconds, who knows why the 3rd was leaked but if they wanted to make us ok with accepting two twos, saying we will cut him and get nothing in return would make me give my right arm for those rumored two twos right about now
…
I heard we already had a deal in place on Wednesday but compensation and team wasn’t known, then all this raiders silence when rumors are swirling involving all the others rumored teams and the fact that it seems like we botched this as bad as we possibly could! and I know Howie is smarter then that! makes me think he has an ace up his sleeve

BobSmith77

More and more I don’t think Howie has ‘an ace up his sleeve’ as this continues to drag out especially with the developments the past week.

GEAGLE

If he doesn’t, it’s an epic BOTCH job….and I really find it hard to believe that we allowed this to happen, or ATleast I HOPE, which is probably a counter measure to try and maintain my sanity in the midst of this nightmare

Oh absolutely…cutting him would be as close to malpractice as I seen since Andy was doing dumb shit after dumb shit..
…
I still find this so hard to believe…an organization that has done so much and emphasized changing it’s imagine, goes and does something like this….it’s such a botch job that I keep holding hope that Howie has an ace up his sleeve, but that’s probably more to maintain my sanity, then reality

Crus57

At this point it looks like we will have gotten more for trading a declining McNabb than we will for a peaking DJax. Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue.

GEAGLE

I’d try and Dangle both Barkley and Desean to the Raiders, see if they would be interested in bringing two Cali boys home….then I’d dangle both to the Browns new GM

BobSmith77

Do wonder how much this comes down to money and Jackson’s current financial status.

Jackson spent big-time even before he was drafted & had to take out a large advance against his rookie contract from Rosenhaus.

Since then, there have been a ton of articles linked to him spending ludicrous amounts of money including the infamous ‘$25k LA bar receipt’ tweeted by one of posse in ’11 and continued reports about how lavishly Jackson spends, the size of his entourage, and how much he has poured into his ridiculous rap career which I am sure is heavily self-funded.

It wouldn’t surprise me if Jackson is largely broke on a cash flow basis if you look at his monthly expenditures and that the reason he needs another large signing bonus is that he burns though cash on a monthly basis at a frightening pace.

Still doesn’t make Jackson any different though than a ton of other NFL athletes though.

Question is what transpired (and became known to the Eagles) since early Jan til know that they wanted no part of Jackson going ahead forward? Speculate all you want but it wouldn’t surprise me if Jackson either got involved with someone the Eagles want no part of on a financial transaction/partnership or has a debt that belongs to someone again the Eagles want no part of if it gets publicly disclosed.

GEAGLE

The one thing left that works in our favor is he doesn’t have any offseason bonus’s In his contract. We don’t owe Desean a penny until September, so we dont have to be strong armed into releasing him any time soon..we can hold him hostage until August and hope someone bites. heck, I’d rather get 2015 pick, then lose him for nothing

BobSmith77

That is a really good point and something I was wondering. It gives the Eagles some leverage with Jackson but still doesn’t help them in trying to move him for something useful in return.

GEAGLE

One thing working in our favor is the impatient nature of today’s NFL…there are more then a few GMs/HC on the hot seat, desperate to save their jobs…all it takes for one to think, hey I gotta do something or I will be unemployed next year and decide that They can’t wait for some draft pick to develop enough to save their job, and part with something for his services as a desperation attempt to save their job

Patrick

Also, the Raiders could be “tricked” into trading for him, since they pretty much can’t get a player to sign for them to save their life, despite their ludacris cap room. Either they trade for him, or DeSean has to stay with the Eagles to avoid going to Oakland. Win/Win

Question: any info out there on Desean’s agent situation? Wasn’t there a switch in agents recently. Some twitter scuttle on the new agent propaganda so he (presumably a he) can get paid via new deal.

GEAGLE

He is represented by Segal, an agent we have always worked well with. Segal negotiated the Vick and Riley Cooper contracts…maybe even Maclin, but I’m not sure about him…def Cooper and Vick tho

ACViking

The Eagles have generally worked well with every agent, as far as I know. Certainly since 2012. And even when Banner was in charge.

Rosehaus’s only problem with the Eagles was his client was a complete ass. And, like a good agent, Rosehaus took the heat.

The only agent in pro sports who doesn’t play well with teams is Scott Boros — and all he does is get his clients (baseball) the biggest contracts in the history of mankind.
_________

GE . . . always good to see you over here.

ACViking

Looking at the terms of DJax’s contract, it seems like this was the off-season when the Eagles and Jackson either renegotiated/restructured — or moved on from each other.

He’s getting paid Top-5 WR money for this season (or in that neighborhood). That seems like an awful lot for a guy who’s not what the coach wants and, I think, not in the class of Fitzgerald, A-Johnson, C-Johnson, AJ Green, JJones and maybe even Josh Gordon.

Anyway, just seems like this was the off-season where something had to happen, given the contract structure.

That said, I still think the explanation for what’s going on here is the obvious one: There’s more to this than we know.

A Roy

There has to be something sub rosa occurring. I find it hard to believe the organization would’ve tried to move him last year and this year just because he’s a diva and/or doesn’t get along with a coach and/or is unhappy with his remuneration and/or hasn’t “gotten with the program.”

Teams (albeit other than the Eagles) have kept alleged rapists and alleged murderers and convicted criminals and other sordid and sundry bad actors over the years. Why? Because they can help the team win. Hard to believe a minor malcontent pro bowler would be shipped far below his value without another underlying reason.

ChaosOnion

I looked into his numbers a bit the other day. Starting all 16 games, Jackson is 19th in total receptions, 9th in yards, 9th in yards per reception and 15th in TDs. This next is a bit of a mouth full. Looking at WRs with 80+ receptions, Jackson is 3rd in yards per at 16.2 y/r. He is behind Gordon (18.9 y/r) and C. Johnson (17.8 y/r.)

Looking at WRs with 1300+ yards, Jackson appears closest in performance to Jordy Nelson and next closest to Pierre Garcon. (If I compute a Normalized Euclidean distance between players using the vector [Age, G, Rec, Yds, Y/R, TD, R/G, Y/G], this appears to hold true.)

What does it all mean? Jackson is maintaining a y/r average on par with
Johnson and Gordon, an elite level y/r metric, at 80+ receptions per
year. He really does take the top off the defense, open running lanes and take pressure off other WRs because he can get you 16+ y/r at any time. But that is the only elite level metric.

He gets lots of double teams and plays in a run first offense, so that
could indicate why more of Jackson’s metrics are not elite. Jackson is also a Punt return threat, but at 27 years old he wants to stop doing that. (I will not blame him for that.) Remove those considerations, and you could probably get similar results from Jordy Nelson / Pierre Garcon.

anon

not bad for a guy that’s 5’10 135.

eagleyankfan

Gordon play all 16 games?

ChaosOnion

No, he did not. I forgot to include that. Both Gordon and Johnson only played 14 games. That is why I looked at a yards per reception metric, not just yards per game. He represented himself well in that metric, but overall, Jackson is not on the level of Megatron. Gordon was a freak last year and it will be interesting to see whether his production continues this season.

Erik Richardson

This entire situation with and about DeSean is really sad. I mean on both sides. DeSean although immature hasn’t done anything (from what we know) that would be to the point where they are seriously considering cutting him. This is their 2nd rd pick. You do not just cut someone unless what they’ve done completely violates major team and NFL policy rules. He’s not a drug addict, he’s nto in the clubs getting in shootouts. I mean yes, he allowed his contract situation affect him in 2011.. But, he owned up to that. He had a record breaking season last season. He was asked a question about his contract and answered accordingly. Could he have said “no comment”? Sure. It would have been the wiser response. But, almost anyone being asked after a record breaking individual season for your team. Do you think you should get more?..(The media already knowing what his contract numbers are) Would answer yes, I think I deserve more. They are treating him just like they treated Lito and Asante. More-so Asante, becasue Asante was still good enough to help that team. Remember Andy’s big thing about competition at all positions??? When they traded for Asante, they gave him Lito’s RCB spot, w/o any competition at all. Same with DRC when they traded for him. They saw he wasn’t a slot CB, nor was Asante. But, somehow, somebody had to go. And since Asante was older, less of a tackler and his INT numbers were down he drew the lot. Only to see how much worse DRC and Nnamdi were than Asante or Lito. They are allowing the fire to fuel and grow. They are devaluing their own player. Then to turn around and mention cutting him, to get NOTHING??? Why would the “Gold Standard” do that? Does that make any sense at all??? He’s a top 20 player. You do not just cut a top 20 player and get nothing return.

LAEaglesFan

just a thought but to me it looked like desean didnt play as hard for foles as he did for vick. maybe chip noticed something similar and didnt want desean on the team for that reason

Anybody that says desean is a one trick pony, has no idea what is going on on a football field. ANY football field.

eagleyankfan

It all has to do with “value”….

Weapon Y

If Lurie does nothing to stop Chip, he’s going to allow one of his most valuable assets (arguably second to Shady) to be taken by a real team, and walk away from this joke of an organization. Lurie needs to give Chip Kelly an ultimatum: If you release DeSean Jackson or trade him for below his value, you’re fired.

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