Lion's mane mushroom for brain healing

I am currently taking lion's mane mushroom to try to reverse my depression. My depression was not caused by substance abuse, but I believe past substance abuse damaged by brain and made my depression much worse. My depression has not responded to numerous prescription drugs and supplements that I have tried. I have been taking lion's mane capsules for about a month. I started at 1 gram per day, increased to 2 grams per day after a few days, then increased to 4 grams per day for a few days, and I have been taking 6 grams per day for the last 2 weeks. I felt significant improvement in my sense of well-being for the first few weeks, although that feels like it is fading in and out a bit, and while I do feel better, I don't feel great.

There is little information online regarding the particular questions that I have. Does anyone know the answers to these questions?
1) How long does it take for the full depression reversing effects of lion's mange to kick in?
2) What is the maximum dose of lion's mane a person should reasonably take?

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The brand of lion's mane mushroom I am taking says it is activated, freeze-dried, mycelium, so it does not appear to be an extract. The instructions on the bottle say to take 1 gram per day. What is the maximum safe dose?

The brand of lion's mane mushroom I am taking says it is activated, freeze-dried, mycelium, so it does not appear to be an extract. The instructions on the bottle say to take 1 gram per day. What is the maximum safe dose?

Nosher, you've probably already found an answer to this question, or have abandoned the initial idea. Regardless, I will post a few relevant things I know about Lion's Mane, both for yourself, and for others who may find or stumble across this thread in search of information.

1) I doubt that there is a maximum safe dose, at least not within reason, given that Lion's Mane is an edible mushroom and people are known to cook hundreds of grams of the fruiting body and eat it in one sitting in a meal. I have not come across any studies or anecdotal reports which contradict this statement of non-toxicity.

2) Given this, I think it is more important to find out the minimum effective dose, given that it is not a cheap foodstuff. In this study:

participants were given practically 1 gram per day of Yamabushitake (Lion's Mane) dry powder per day. I don't know how much that would translate into in terms of raw fruiting body powder. Assuming about a 90% water content (which is a rule of thumb water content value for mushroom species), that would be around 10 grams per day. This dosage was effective, according to the study (and free of side effects, a was to be expected). However, it is a large amount to take (for cost reasons only, you may be willing to go this far if your budget allows for it).

Most vendors of Lion's Mane suggest anywhere from 1 gram to 4 grams per day of Lion's Mane raw fruiting body, according to the package. This seems reasonable, particularly for somebody with no "real" (i.e. medically relevant) cogintive deficits. The effect is dose-dependent, meaning that you'll likely find greater effect the more you take. 1 gram seems to be a reasonable floor, given the state of publicly available information. Starting there, I would advise titrating upwards and gauge your own reactions.

3) In my own experience, anywhere from 2-5 grams per day, split into 2 doses, seems ideal. I have not experimented with higher doses due to cost. At this dose, I get acute effects, including:

All these effects are non-placebo (you may ask and challenge me to produce the grounds for such assertion if you wish), and are consistent with the scientific and anecdotal/historical literature on this mushroom.

Hi Heraclitean- wondered if you can suggest a source for the Lion's Mane at those dosages. When I check US sites that sell it, its generally much smaller doses and therefore would be quite expensive.

Thanks...

Hi there. I'm in the UK, so unfortunately don't know any US sources. I believe I have seen a few US-based compaines, specialized in selling bulk medicinal mushrooms though, whilst looking for UK sources, so I am fairly confident that they exist. You might have to look outside of your "usual" nootropics/supplements pages though.

http://www.fungiheal...shroom-extracts"At Fungi Health we are dedicated to improving our customers lives, through the use of our full spectrum,medicinal mushroom extracts. "include the whole mushroom so probably a better value since u'd need to ingest a lot more of the powder compared to the extract (I think).

Thanks for the reply Heraclitean and everyone else too. Brainfogged... is NGF - nerve growth factor? Not sure if this is what I am after.. .just the effects that Herclitean mentioned. And yes if there are UK sources of Lion's Mane that are cost effective, maybe it would be worth the shipping to US.

Hi Heraclitean- wondered if you can suggest a source for the Lion's Mane at those dosages. When I check US sites that sell it, its generally much smaller doses and therefore would be quite expensive.

Thanks...

Hi there. I'm in the UK, so unfortunately don't know any US sources. I believe I have seen a few US-based compaines, specialized in selling bulk medicinal mushrooms though, whilst looking for UK sources, so I am fairly confident that they exist. You might have to look outside of your "usual" nootropics/supplements pages though.

All these effects are non-placebo (you may ask and challenge me to produce the grounds for such assertion if you wish), and are consistent with the scientific and anecdotal/historical literature on this mushroom.

Is lion's mane the only supplement you're only taking or could those changes be explained by other supplements or other lifestyle changes you've done?

I've only came across studies of lion's mane preventing infection and brain related diseases for mice and also faster healing . That study you provided only proved to be a promising treatment for cognitively impaired people , but not healthy adults. I don't think I've come across any studies stating that it improves perception , STM , and mood in humans or mice.

All these effects are non-placebo (you may ask and challenge me to produce the grounds for such assertion if you wish), and are consistent with the scientific and anecdotal/historical literature on this mushroom.

Is lion's mane the only supplement you're only taking or could those changes be explained by other supplements or other lifestyle changes you've done?

I've only came across studies of lion's mane preventing infection and brain related diseases for mice and also faster healing . That study you provided only proved to be a promising treatment for cognitively impaired people , but not healthy adults. I don't think I've come across any studies stating that it improves perception , STM , and mood in humans or mice.

Maybe those effects could be related to the increased NGF activity.

I am quite sure that the Lion's Mane caused, or at least catalyzed, these changes. I did not add or subtract any supplements or carry out any significant lifestyle changes at that time.

You are right that there are no studies relating directly to peception enhancement, but I believe that any substance which increases myelinization, or improves the quality of the myelin sheath (such as supplementing with Omega 3's in case of a deficient diet), will likely improve perception since those delicate nerve transmissions from the sensory organs to their respective "processing centres" in the brain will be more protected, causing these perceptions to be more "accurate" and detailed. Another member on these forums, I believe Golden1 is his nickname, also had the same perception enhancing response (I read about it after I noticed my own).

With respects to mood, I wouldn't say that it improves mood (it is not antidepressant, or if it is I don't notice it because I am not "depressed"), but it does increase "equanimity"... perhaps a more scientific term would be "resilience"? This is my own experience, and it seems as if the Japanese have suspected that Lion's Mane could have this effect, as they tested for it, with apparently positive results:

The memory enhancing effects are supported by anectodal and historical literature, and has been studied in vivo with regards to states of pathological memory impairment (http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/21383512), and furthermore, makes sense based on what we do know about this organism.

I agree that increased NGF synthesis is likely one mechanism behind these effects. I suspect that there may be more to it, though, because the compounds in the Mycelium are apparently stronger stimulants of NGF synthesis, and yet I get much better results from the Fruiting body. Although it is possible that this could be due to the mycelium being "cut" with the substrate on which it was grown, thus reducing volume of "real" mycelium content per pill, or because the compounds are more unstable than those of the fruiting body, or whatever other reason, I think there is much we still do not know about the mechanism underlying its effects on humans and other animals. In conclusion, I believe NGF is only part of the story, albeit probably an important part.

Thanks for the reply Heraclitean and everyone else too. Brainfogged... is NGF - nerve growth factor? Not sure if this is what I am after.. .just the effects that Herclitean mentioned. And yes if there are UK sources of Lion's Mane that are cost effective, maybe it would be worth the shipping to US.

Jayfoxpox- that does look like a decent source. Thanks- Sally

Hi Sally. From your post count I can see that you are new to these forums, so first of all, welcome! I would like to caution you at this stage about something important you must keep in mind when using supplements. You will see, scattered throughout this forum and others, many anecdotal reports on different supplements and drugs which have helped (sometimes greatly so) some people, followed by angry or dismissive posts by other who claim to have gotten no effect and rave about "saving your money" (implying that those who take that supplement/drug are being defrauded).

In my opinion, this is not really because "everybody's body is different", which is what the believers usually say to the skeptics/cynics, only to be pummeled with a "no, were are not that different, and if it worked for real it would work for me too!" as a response. But it is true that the etiology (cause) behind similar symptoms, especially when these symptoms are vague (i.e. they are hard to quantify accurately), could be very different indeed, meaning that what is appropriate for one will not be so for another.

Let me give you a very simplified example. Suppose you have two men, one with a headache because of an inflammatory response in cortical tissue of the brain, caused by a concussion, and another with a headache because of a genetically inherited tendency for the blood vessels in the brain to expand too much (Disclaimer: any resemblance of these conditions to reality is a coincidence. They have been created ad hoc for the purposes of furnishing my argument with a hypothetical example). If they both took a pill which had vasoconstrictive effects, the second man may say to the first "I am cured! I have never felt better in my life", whereas the first man would look at the second with envy or disbelief. In this case, we have an identical symptom (headache), with different etiologies and hence with need of different types of intervention.

That is the inherent difficulty with diagnosis (and especially self-diagnosis). We are not often very skilled at extrapolating from a set of given symptoms towards a definitive causative mechanism, so we are left fumbling in the dark, trying different approaches in the hope that one of them will strike gold. The general inefficiency and ignorance of the average health care worker whenever dealing with anything remotely idiosyncratic, who cannot keep up to date with the latest discoveries in their fields (never mind other fields) and who has not the time and/nor inclination and/nor true vocation to really inquire into a patient's life, history, habits and dispositions, further compounds this problem for us.

In conclusion: by all means look for improvements to your life, by all means seek to be the best you can be, and that means, among other things, dealing with physiological obstacles which can get in the way of this. But be prepared for disappointments and dead ends. Most of us eventually find a solution to our problems, especially if they are not very grave (such as a terminal illnesses, severe neurological degeneration, etc.). But it will likely take time, and money. Whether you are willing to take the risk, is eventually entirely up to you.

Thanks for the reply Heraclitean and everyone else too. Brainfogged... is NGF - nerve growth factor? Not sure if this is what I am after.. .just the effects that Herclitean mentioned. And yes if there are UK sources of Lion's Mane that are cost effective, maybe it would be worth the shipping to US.

Jayfoxpox- that does look like a decent source. Thanks- Sally

Hi Sally. From your post count I can see that you are new to these forums, so first of all, welcome! I would like to caution you at this stage about something important you must keep in mind when using supplements. You will see, scattered throughout this forum and others, many anecdotal reports on different supplements and drugs which have helped (sometimes greatly so) some people, followed by angry or dismissive posts by other who claim to have gotten no effect and rave about "saving your money" (implying that those who take that supplement/drug are being defrauded).

In my opinion, this is not really because "everybody's body is different", which is what the believers usually say to the skeptics/cynics, only to be pummeled with a "no, were are not that different, and if it worked for real it would work for me too!" as a response. But it is true that the etiology (cause) behind similar symptoms, especially when these symptoms are vague (i.e. they are hard to quantify accurately), could be very different indeed, meaning that what is appropriate for one will not be so for another.

Let me give you a very simplified example. Suppose you have two men, one with a headache because of an inflammatory response in cortical tissue of the brain, caused by a concussion, and another with a headache because of a genetically inherited tendency for the blood vessels in the brain to expand too much (Disclaimer: any resemblance of these conditions to reality is a coincidence. They have been created ad hoc for the purposes of furnishing my argument with a hypothetical example). If they both took a pill which had vasoconstrictive effects, the second man may say to the first "I am cured! I have never felt better in my life", whereas the first man would look at the second with envy or disbelief. In this case, we have an identical symptom (headache), with different etiologies and hence with need of different types of intervention.

That is the inherent difficulty with diagnosis (and especially self-diagnosis). We are not often very skilled at extrapolating from a set of given symptoms towards a definitive causative mechanism, so we are left fumbling in the dark, trying different approaches in the hope that one of them will strike gold. The general inefficiency and ignorance of the average health care worker whenever dealing with anything remotely idiosyncratic, who cannot keep up to date with the latest discoveries in their fields (never mind other fields) and who has not the time and/nor inclination and/nor true vocation to really inquire into a patient's life, history, habits and dispositions, further compounds this problem for us.

In conclusion: by all means look for improvements to your life, by all means seek to be the best you can be, and that means, among other things, dealing with physiological obstacles which can get in the way of this. But be prepared for disappointments and dead ends. Most of us eventually find a solution to our problems, especially if they are not very grave (such as a terminal illnesses, severe neurological degeneration, etc.). But it will likely take time, and money. Whether you are willing to take the risk, is eventually entirely up to you.

Good luck!

Hi Heraclitean,

Thanks so much for the detailed reply. I acutally am not new to these forums, just haven't spoken up much ( maybe not at all- can't remember). Thanks for the welcome though - nice regardless. Although I've been interested supplements of various kinds for a long and for dealing with various issues, I have very much a layperson's level of knowlege in that I don't really know the chemistry much at all. I appreicate your explanation and I'll ask questions and keep plodding along. Meanwhile, I think I will try the Lion's Mane.

Thanks for the reply Heraclitean and everyone else too. Brainfogged... is NGF - nerve growth factor? Not sure if this is what I am after.. .just the effects that Herclitean mentioned. And yes if there are UK sources of Lion's Mane that are cost effective, maybe it would be worth the shipping to US.

Jayfoxpox- that does look like a decent source. Thanks- Sally

Hi Sally. From your post count I can see that you are new to these forums, so first of all, welcome! I would like to caution you at this stage about something important you must keep in mind when using supplements. You will see, scattered throughout this forum and others, many anecdotal reports on different supplements and drugs which have helped (sometimes greatly so) some people, followed by angry or dismissive posts by other who claim to have gotten no effect and rave about "saving your money" (implying that those who take that supplement/drug are being defrauded).

In my opinion, this is not really because "everybody's body is different", which is what the believers usually say to the skeptics/cynics, only to be pummeled with a "no, were are not that different, and if it worked for real it would work for me too!" as a response. But it is true that the etiology (cause) behind similar symptoms, especially when these symptoms are vague (i.e. they are hard to quantify accurately), could be very different indeed, meaning that what is appropriate for one will not be so for another.

Let me give you a very simplified example. Suppose you have two men, one with a headache because of an inflammatory response in cortical tissue of the brain, caused by a concussion, and another with a headache because of a genetically inherited tendency for the blood vessels in the brain to expand too much (Disclaimer: any resemblance of these conditions to reality is a coincidence. They have been created ad hoc for the purposes of furnishing my argument with a hypothetical example). If they both took a pill which had vasoconstrictive effects, the second man may say to the first "I am cured! I have never felt better in my life", whereas the first man would look at the second with envy or disbelief. In this case, we have an identical symptom (headache), with different etiologies and hence with need of different types of intervention.

That is the inherent difficulty with diagnosis (and especially self-diagnosis). We are not often very skilled at extrapolating from a set of given symptoms towards a definitive causative mechanism, so we are left fumbling in the dark, trying different approaches in the hope that one of them will strike gold. The general inefficiency and ignorance of the average health care worker whenever dealing with anything remotely idiosyncratic, who cannot keep up to date with the latest discoveries in their fields (never mind other fields) and who has not the time and/nor inclination and/nor true vocation to really inquire into a patient's life, history, habits and dispositions, further compounds this problem for us.

In conclusion: by all means look for improvements to your life, by all means seek to be the best you can be, and that means, among other things, dealing with physiological obstacles which can get in the way of this. But be prepared for disappointments and dead ends. Most of us eventually find a solution to our problems, especially if they are not very grave (such as a terminal illnesses, severe neurological degeneration, etc.). But it will likely take time, and money. Whether you are willing to take the risk, is eventually entirely up to you.

Good luck!

Hi Heraclitean,

Thanks so much for the detailed reply. I acutally am not new to these forums, just haven't spoken up much ( maybe not at all- can't remember). Thanks for the welcome though - nice regardless. Although I've been interested supplements of various kinds for a long and for dealing with various issues, I have very much a layperson's level of knowlege in that I don't really know the chemistry much at all. I appreicate your explanation and I'll ask questions and keep plodding along. Meanwhile, I think I will try the Lion's Mane.

Cheers,

Sally

With lion's mane, I do notice an increase in focus but it makes me very sleepy and that's the part that worries me which is why I take it at night of 300mg. During the day it's hard to tell if it makes a difference other than I sleep well.

Thanks for the reply Heraclitean and everyone else too. Brainfogged... is NGF - nerve growth factor? Not sure if this is what I am after.. .just the effects that Herclitean mentioned. And yes if there are UK sources of Lion's Mane that are cost effective, maybe it would be worth the shipping to US.

Jayfoxpox- that does look like a decent source. Thanks- Sally

Hi Sally. From your post count I can see that you are new to these forums, so first of all, welcome! I would like to caution you at this stage about something important you must keep in mind when using supplements. You will see, scattered throughout this forum and others, many anecdotal reports on different supplements and drugs which have helped (sometimes greatly so) some people, followed by angry or dismissive posts by other who claim to have gotten no effect and rave about "saving your money" (implying that those who take that supplement/drug are being defrauded).

In my opinion, this is not really because "everybody's body is different", which is what the believers usually say to the skeptics/cynics, only to be pummeled with a "no, were are not that different, and if it worked for real it would work for me too!" as a response. But it is true that the etiology (cause) behind similar symptoms, especially when these symptoms are vague (i.e. they are hard to quantify accurately), could be very different indeed, meaning that what is appropriate for one will not be so for another.

Let me give you a very simplified example. Suppose you have two men, one with a headache because of an inflammatory response in cortical tissue of the brain, caused by a concussion, and another with a headache because of a genetically inherited tendency for the blood vessels in the brain to expand too much (Disclaimer: any resemblance of these conditions to reality is a coincidence. They have been created ad hoc for the purposes of furnishing my argument with a hypothetical example). If they both took a pill which had vasoconstrictive effects, the second man may say to the first "I am cured! I have never felt better in my life", whereas the first man would look at the second with envy or disbelief. In this case, we have an identical symptom (headache), with different etiologies and hence with need of different types of intervention.

That is the inherent difficulty with diagnosis (and especially self-diagnosis). We are not often very skilled at extrapolating from a set of given symptoms towards a definitive causative mechanism, so we are left fumbling in the dark, trying different approaches in the hope that one of them will strike gold. The general inefficiency and ignorance of the average health care worker whenever dealing with anything remotely idiosyncratic, who cannot keep up to date with the latest discoveries in their fields (never mind other fields) and who has not the time and/nor inclination and/nor true vocation to really inquire into a patient's life, history, habits and dispositions, further compounds this problem for us.

In conclusion: by all means look for improvements to your life, by all means seek to be the best you can be, and that means, among other things, dealing with physiological obstacles which can get in the way of this. But be prepared for disappointments and dead ends. Most of us eventually find a solution to our problems, especially if they are not very grave (such as a terminal illnesses, severe neurological degeneration, etc.). But it will likely take time, and money. Whether you are willing to take the risk, is eventually entirely up to you.

Good luck!

Hi Heraclitean,

Thanks so much for the detailed reply. I acutally am not new to these forums, just haven't spoken up much ( maybe not at all- can't remember). Thanks for the welcome though - nice regardless. Although I've been interested supplements of various kinds for a long and for dealing with various issues, I have very much a layperson's level of knowlege in that I don't really know the chemistry much at all. I appreicate your explanation and I'll ask questions and keep plodding along. Meanwhile, I think I will try the Lion's Mane.

Cheers,

Sally

With lion's mane, I do notice an increase in focus but it makes me very sleepy and that's the part that worries me which is why I take it at night of 300mg. During the day it's hard to tell if it makes a difference other than I sleep well.

I've heard about the sleepiness side effect from a few other forum members. I haven't experienced that myself: I don't find it stimulating or sedating... it is neutral with regards to energy. If it makes you sleepy, then consider it a bonus and take it before bed for some restful and reconsititutive sleep!

I don't know about it's medicinal benefits, but I'd just like to say I got some freshly grown Lions Mane at a farmers market. I cooked it with some pasta, olive oil, and some mild green that I can't remember and man was it tasty! A very mild tasting mushroom, if your eating it in food be sure not to cook it with any strong flavors or it will completely overpower the mushroom's flavor.

I don't know about it's medicinal benefits, but I'd just like to say I got some freshly grown Lions Mane at a farmers market. I cooked it with some pasta, olive oil, and some mild green that I can't remember and man was it tasty! A very mild tasting mushroom, if your eating it in food be sure not to cook it with any strong flavors or it will completely overpower the mushroom's flavor.

It does have a mild and wholesome flavour... haven't cooked with it yet, but I may try it now!

We know that hericenones and ericanines are partly responsible for the effects. I suspect that they are only part of the picture though, and would recommend sticking to bulk powder to make sure you get the full spectrum of benefits. 1-2 grams a day should suffice, although dosing higher is a good idea if you can afford it.

Thanks for the reply Heraclitean and everyone else too. Brainfogged... is NGF - nerve growth factor? Not sure if this is what I am after.. .just the effects that Herclitean mentioned. And yes if there are UK sources of Lion's Mane that are cost effective, maybe it would be worth the shipping to US.

Jayfoxpox- that does look like a decent source. Thanks- Sally

Hi Sally. From your post count I can see that you are new to these forums, so first of all, welcome! I would like to caution you at this stage about something important you must keep in mind when using supplements. You will see, scattered throughout this forum and others, many anecdotal reports on different supplements and drugs which have helped (sometimes greatly so) some people, followed by angry or dismissive posts by other who claim to have gotten no effect and rave about "saving your money" (implying that those who take that supplement/drug are being defrauded).

In my opinion, this is not really because "everybody's body is different", which is what the believers usually say to the skeptics/cynics, only to be pummeled with a "no, were are not that different, and if it worked for real it would work for me too!" as a response. But it is true that the etiology (cause) behind similar symptoms, especially when these symptoms are vague (i.e. they are hard to quantify accurately), could be very different indeed, meaning that what is appropriate for one will not be so for another.

Let me give you a very simplified example. Suppose you have two men, one with a headache because of an inflammatory response in cortical tissue of the brain, caused by a concussion, and another with a headache because of a genetically inherited tendency for the blood vessels in the brain to expand too much (Disclaimer: any resemblance of these conditions to reality is a coincidence. They have been created ad hoc for the purposes of furnishing my argument with a hypothetical example). If they both took a pill which had vasoconstrictive effects, the second man may say to the first "I am cured! I have never felt better in my life", whereas the first man would look at the second with envy or disbelief. In this case, we have an identical symptom (headache), with different etiologies and hence with need of different types of intervention.

That is the inherent difficulty with diagnosis (and especially self-diagnosis). We are not often very skilled at extrapolating from a set of given symptoms towards a definitive causative mechanism, so we are left fumbling in the dark, trying different approaches in the hope that one of them will strike gold. The general inefficiency and ignorance of the average health care worker whenever dealing with anything remotely idiosyncratic, who cannot keep up to date with the latest discoveries in their fields (never mind other fields) and who has not the time and/nor inclination and/nor true vocation to really inquire into a patient's life, history, habits and dispositions, further compounds this problem for us.

In conclusion: by all means look for improvements to your life, by all means seek to be the best you can be, and that means, among other things, dealing with physiological obstacles which can get in the way of this. But be prepared for disappointments and dead ends. Most of us eventually find a solution to our problems, especially if they are not very grave (such as a terminal illnesses, severe neurological degeneration, etc.). But it will likely take time, and money. Whether you are willing to take the risk, is eventually entirely up to you.

Good luck!

Hi Heraclitean,

Thanks so much for the detailed reply. I acutally am not new to these forums, just haven't spoken up much ( maybe not at all- can't remember). Thanks for the welcome though - nice regardless. Although I've been interested supplements of various kinds for a long and for dealing with various issues, I have very much a layperson's level of knowlege in that I don't really know the chemistry much at all. I appreicate your explanation and I'll ask questions and keep plodding along. Meanwhile, I think I will try the Lion's Mane.

Cheers,

Sally

Please drop us a line to let us know how it went for you, once you've had time and opportunity to evaluate your results.

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I've never heard of Lion's Mane until I joined this forum. It looks like something I should seriously consider adding to my already-epic LSAT Stack.

Definitely give it a whirl. If you respond well to racetams, then by all means go with Lion's Mane (the reason I bring racetams up is because those who notice racetams tend to notice subtle changes in their physiology, and Lion's Mane is subtle, but it is working in the background, like Victorian children who were meant to be seen but not heard).

Oh, and by subtle I don't mean "almost impossible to discern", I mean that it won't get you high, euphoric, make you "love everybody" or make you manic. It definitely works, though.