Jenny McCarthy Maintains Stance on More Babies, Vaccines

In the September issue of Cookie magazine, Jenny McCarthy makes it clear that there will neither be marriage nor a baby carriage for she and boyfriend Jim Carrey!

“It’s wacky-weird that not only does he not want to get married, which I love,” the 36-year-old actress says, “but he also doesn’t want to have more kids, which I love.”

For now, the couple of more than three years are content to focus on Jenny’s son Evan Joseph, 7, who continues to thrive following his “recovery” from autism.

“I have him in every sport you can imagine for socialization, but he is [already] one of the most social kids you will ever meet,” she boasts.

Things have of course not always gone so well for mother and son.

In the interview, Jenny details an event she calls her “second rock bottom,” the first being when Evan went into cardiac arrest in 2004.

Following a seizure Evan was given a medication that caused him to stay awake for four days straight, suffering hallucinations and banging his head against a bed until he bled. Jenny recalls,

“I ran out of my house and into my driveway and screamed at the top of my lungs to God to just take him away, because I loved him so much and he was in so much pain.”

Going on “blind faith,” Jenny switched her son to a gluten-free, casein-free diet and the results were dramatic; Within two weeks, Evan’s vocabulary doubled, she says.

As a result of her experience, the biomedical approach to treating autism has become so important to Jenny she now serves on the board of Generation Rescue, an advocacy and research group that calls for — among other things — the elimination of toxins in vaccines and a delayed vaccine schedule.

“In addressing physical ailments like epilepsy, leaky gut, candida [a yeast infection], bowel disease, and food allergies, as well as behavioral disorders, like ADHD and OCD, that are associated with autism, we [parents at Generation Rescue] find that, along with those problems, the autism either gets better or goes away,” Jenny says.

Click below for Jenny’s theory on why Evan developed autism and her hopes for his future.

It was another Cookie interview last year with actress and celebrity mom Amanda Peet which drew Jenny back into the vaccine debate, and Jenny touched on Amanda’s comments in the magazine’s latest issue. “I think vaccines are one of the greatest things ever invented,” Jenny says. “I used to be [Amanda] before I had a kid with autism.” She sums up Generation Rescue’s stance on vaccines as,

“Vaccinations are safe — dot, dot, dot — for some kids. Vaccinations are not safe — dot, dot, dot — for other kids. Let’s protect the ones who are weak. We are pro–safe vaccine. Vaccines are just not one size fits all. If you gave everyone in the world penicillin, there would be some adverse effects for some people, and possibly deaths.”

Evan’s demeanor changed after he received an MMR shot at 14 months, and Jenny says she also sees a correlation between a series of ear infections, a severe case of eczema, and a hepatitis-B booster shot which all coincided for her son.

“Looking back, I’d say, ‘God, if a kid is having more than seven ear infections in a year and he’s got eczema, there are some issues here — his immune system is obviously under attack, and we need to put him in the sensitive category,” she explains. “Let’s just delay some of his shots. Not eliminate, delay.”

Jenny — who lists watching Evan pee on a fake tree in a waiting room as her most humbling mom moment — says it’s normal for parents to occasionally think, “I can’t stand my kid right now.” What’s more, she feels that anyone who says otherwise “is not living in today’s world of busy moms.”

The stress of Evan’s condition eventually took a toll on Jenny herself, and she admits she suffered a “breakdown” two years after receiving the autism diagnosis. “When your kid is psychotic or crazy, you go into this place of shock so you can remain calm,” she says.

“A problem a lot of moms [of autistic children] have is that they need to get out all [their emotions] later. I kept mine bottled up for two years, and then I finally released all this pent up fear, sadness, and anger. I just cried and cried and cried and cried and cried.”

Next up for the busy mom is 15-part series of instructional DVDs for children called Teach2Talk, which launches this fall. Developed in conjunction with Evan’s behavioral therapist and a speech-language pathologist at UCLA, the series uses video modeling as a form of therapy for all children — those with autism, and those without.

Jenny also recently launched a school for children with autism in Los Angeles, with another slated to open in Chicago in 2010. Eventually, she says she’d like to start 20 schools in all.

Her hopes for Evan are equally high, and Jenny — who has written several books about her journey — says she would even be happy to see those tables someday turned. She jokes,

“I want to … eventually watch him write a book about me: How to Care for Mom in Her Old Age.”

While I don’t always agree with her, I do agree with some of what she says (and I think she’s more clear about her opinions as she’s talked about it more). I, personally, believe there may be two forms of autism – one that is primarily genetically caused (i.e. nature), and one that is primarily environmentally caused (i.e. nurture). I see this difference as a real possibility for why different therapies work with different children, as well as why the children’s “problems” manifest so differently, and at different times.

Micheley
on August 12th, 2009

I don’t completely understand or know the full details of Jenny’s beliefs on vaccinations. And I know that their is a bad side and do encourage everyone to fully educate themselves on the side effects of vaccinations. And my cousin didn’t vaccinate her three youngest children until they got much older.
But ever since I saw the Hilary Duff episode of Law and Order SVU and the case was about a little baby girl dying because some other mother decided not to vaccinate her child, and the child passed the disease to this little girl who was still a baby and to young to get protected against it. And that episode just stuck with me, because how unfair is it that this mothers choice to not vaccinate her child led to the death of a baby who was not able to be vaccinated yet. And knowing that, that situation is even a possibility makes me (at this point with my knowledge and beliefs) against non-vaccination.
So Im not bashing anybody, and like I said I do admit that I don’t know all the facts, and I don’t know all of Jenny’s information or beliefs.
But my children are vaccinated.

While I do not agree with Jenny…..I think the word needs to get out there. We need to educate ourselves about ALL vaccinations!

Shelby
on August 12th, 2009

I have a feeling that this comment section will be very ugly very quickly. Just a reminder (myself included) that we are all validatd in our opinions and the reasonings for having them and autism is an extremely personal subject for many. It’s safe to safe that every one of us has had some interaction or known of someone who has autism. Also, it’s important to note that nothing is great for every child and as a mother it is important to take into account your children and what is best for them. I’m sure that will be under heat in regards to vaccinations and possibly having these diseases come back or affect other children. However, in regards to Jenny’s comments I feel they are very well said. I have 5+ years of experience and knowledge in regards to homeopathy and alternative treatments (many of which Evan has gone through). There are some points of hers that I do not agree with or necessarily think are said in the best way but all in all, I applaud her for being a mother who is not afraid to do what is best for her son. It takes a tremendous amount of courage, time, finances, willingness and love to help your child become the best they can be (irregardless of whether you use the words “recovered” or “cured” and what exactly that means). It’s clear that no matter how you feel about Jenny personally, you have to admit that she is a phenomenal mother. Everything aside, all I can wish for her is that Jim, She and Evan have a wonderful life full of continued blessings and growth from her son. I applaud you Jenny!

Ashley
on August 12th, 2009

Ok I understand she went through alot with her son and his autism. I dont however believe she is someone mothers should be listening to when it comes to the safety of their children. She is not a doctor she is “reading up” on what she thinks causes autism. It has never been proven and in fact has been proven it does not cause autism its just a shame she is spreading lies and causing people to not vacinate their kids when it is so important to do so. Spread some of them out if you want but listen to your doctor not the singled out co host for crying out loud!

Before she jumped on the anti-vaccine bandwagon, McCarthy claimed Evan was an Indigo Child. She said that his autistic behaviour was evidence that he was a more highly evolved person who communicated via ESP. She’s never retracted those claims, but since the publication of her book has gone to great pains to distance herself from the movement.

While I don’t totally agree with Jenny, I admire her convictions and her determination to make life better for her son. She is obviously a devoted mom doing what she thinks is best for her son. Evan seems to be doing very well, so perhaps this is what works for him. It may not work for 100% of autistic children, but it does for Evan, so kudos to Jenny for working so hard to help Evan get the best treatment possible for him and her commitment to helping other autistic parents.

Autumn
on August 12th, 2009

Raes, I think I heard about that several years ago and did think she was rather strange. I did read two of her books though, Belly Laughs (which was funny because it told about her pregnancy with Evan) and one that she wrote after her son had been diagnosed with autism. Even if her opinions/beliefs might be a bit unusual, I don’t fault her for having a deep concern for her son and his well-being.

“I want to … eventually watch him write a book about me: How to Care for Mom in Her Old Age.”

This was so funny…ha ha I really like Jenny and Jim together, they seem to truly love eachother and they seem like nice people.

And even though I dont agree with Jenny on a lot of things she says regarding vaccination, I do believe we as parents should look into vaccines more and make them more green, like she says “Vaccines are just not one size fits all”. That said, My daughter has her vaccines and if I have another child he/she will be vaccinated also.

JMO
on August 12th, 2009

What she feels is best for her and her son is her business.

I’m glad she’s clarifying though that kids should NOT have vaccinations just because HER son became ill. I think it’s up to each person to decide what is best for their child.

My children will be vaccinated because well I’ve said it before. I much rather have a child come out with autism then have a child die early in age from some disease!! However I will def. speak to my pediatrician about spreading the vaccinations a part and not allowing my child to have more then 1-2 vaccinations per visit. I hear some babies get about 4 on certain visits which I believe is way too much for their systems!

I wish her and her son the best. But I hope mom’s around the world don’t just use her as their learning tool on vaccines! She seems to be very vocal about this issue which is fine but she needs to remember some people don’t go beyond the, “this vaccine cause my son’s autism” before they freak out!!

Tess
on August 12th, 2009

While I am trying VERY hard to be respectful of other people’s opinions on this site, I am VERY tired of hearing there is no link to vaccines and autism. REALLY? Because when my NORMAL little boy got his MMR shot, he lost all his speech, started incessantly screaming, head banging and had massive diarrhea within 24 HOURS of getting his shot. There is no way anyone is going to tell me that was a coincidence! Doctors get about 5 minutes of training on autism in medical school! Basically it is “it’s not cureable, case closed”. I can guarantee you I know more about autism than any pediatrician! Parents like us spend HOURS reading medical journals, looking at the latest research, and AUTISM becomes our life! Oh, and did I mention that insurance companies will NOT pay for treatment, despite the fact that it has been proven effective? They will pay for everyone’s rehab, but not for kid with autism! Disgusting! That episode on Law and Order SVU was totally demonizing parents who don’t vaccinate. It was nothing but hate mongering! That said, I am NOT against vaccines, but until they take out the preservatives, and separate out the shots, my children will NOT receive them! Our kids are not a threat! If vaccines work the way they are supposed to, then the vaccinated children should be immune, and I would keep my children at home in the event of an outbreak. I wish I could vaccinate my children, I really do, but I have seen firsthand the damage it has caused, and I will not do any more harm to my child!

Ryo
on August 12th, 2009

It’s always interesting to me to see the differently people react to Jenny’s statements depending on whether or not their child has autism. Because it seems to me that parents of autistic kids would know more about it than people who read an article once in the Times.

I don’t have any children yet and i was just wondering if someone could please tell me what the MMR shot is for? What is it supposed to prevent? Thank you.

Jesse
on August 12th, 2009

I have heard too many stories like Tess’ and Jenny’s, so my 2 year is not (yet?) vaccinated. A major thing that bothers me about vaccines is the medical communities insistence that there are no side effects, and nothing ever bad can come from a vaccine. For every other drug they have to give off a laundry list of possible side effects (may cause drowsiness, head aches, blah blah blah) and we’re supposed to believe vaccines are completely safe for everyone?
I liked Jenny’s example of penicillin, some people just react very badly to certain foreign particles in their bodies. Why can’t doctors/big pharma/the government admit that and then we can move upward and onward?
I also think there should be more of a focus (especially in the U.S.) on keeping our bodies healthy, keeping our immune systems strong by eating healthy whole foods, exercising, not exposing our bodies to chemical crap.

kayleesmom
on August 12th, 2009

I strongly disagree with people (celebrities especially) spreading things like this, because people believe them! There is no proof of vaccines causing autism. She just needs to get past this. The PARENT decides what’s best for the child. If you don’t want to vaccinate, then don’t, but don’t try to put other parents down for their decisions. Yes, I do think this goes both ways.

Kay
on August 12th, 2009

I still love what Amanda Peet said about vaccines and it angers me when people don’t vaccinate their kids. I have a nephew with autism and one that doesn’t and they were given the same vaccinations. As far as a “cure” to autism- don’t buy that either. I respect her for her views, but sure don’t agree with them.

Alex
on August 12th, 2009

While I do not have autistic children, I have friends who have and I have seen first hand what it is like for them on a daily basis. To describe the virtual destruction of a child’s personality and being when they descend into autism would take more time and emotion than I can give at the moment. Until you too have seen it, I would respectfully warn any person against trying to judge a parent who takes the considered and situationally intelligent decision to think again when it comes to vaccination in the government dictated way. It’s no great surprise to me that some parents, upon seeing the experience their first child goes through, choose to do things differently with any subsequent children. Can any parent really say that they would repeat actions that they believe harmed their first child with other children? No, of course they wouldn’t.

Me personally? I will not MMR my children. This is not just down to the autism/bowel disease situation, I have other reasons for choosing this route. My children will always have staggered vaccinations, not multiples at once. I respect parents who choose the MMR and any other combined or close together programmes, but they are NOT for my children and they never will be.

To Tess – I feel for you. I’ve seen a friend of mine get as frustrated as you and it’s heartbreaking. She feels like no one listens to her just because her opinion might not be the most popular one amongst doctors, or even other (often misinformed) parents. Again, she is not the one at fault by not vaccinating her other children, she did staggered solo jabs, but she gets the abuse anyway, which is deplorable. I sincerely hope no one on this site would ever be that disgusting to another parent just because they don’t agree with their choices. Not everything is black and white. And to Tess again, I KNOW my friend knows more and reads more than most doctors about autism, so I’m with you on that one as well. A lot of people are going to scoff at that, but until they have walked a mile in your shoes, or those of my friend, they will never understand, period. Best of luck to your family, I’m sending love and hugs :).

Alex
on August 12th, 2009

Melissa – it’s measles, mumps and rubella.

Jessica
on August 12th, 2009

The link with autism and vaccines stems primarily for the MMR vaccine which USED to contain Thimerosal a preservative). The thought was that because Thimerosal contained Mercury, this must be causing autism. I’m not quite sure if Jenny is aware that Thimerosal hasn’t been included in vaccines in years. It’s difficult to take someone seriously when they’re arguing against something that’s not even there. I wholeheartedly wish they can find the cause of autism, but if it is Mercury as the main cause, then why aren’t people speaking out again amalgam fillings or fish? These deadly childhood illnesses have been virtually wiped out thanks to vaccines, whatever your decision-to vaccinate or not to vaccinate or to space- please do your own reseearch, talk to your doctor, don’t make such a big decision that may not only affect your child’s life, but other’s people’s children, just because some Hollywood celebrity told you to.

Vero
on August 12th, 2009

I agree with Jenny about the need to “green” our vaccinations to make them safer, as well as spacing them out. I spaced my daughters shots out just on instinct, I thought it was all a little too much. She is fine, but not everyone is made the same way. Preservatives are bad in foods and can be just as harmful in vaccinations. I think in the US considering we are not a 3rd world country, unless you plan on traveling to one and being exposed, it isn’t necessary to vaccinate your child when they are very young. It is smart to space it out, you wouldn’t take certin drugs in combination and the same logic should be applied to vaccinating children.

Finais
on August 12th, 2009

I’ve heard that the vaccine (MMR) can cause kids that are susceptible to autism to develop it. I don’t think it’s possible to know if you have a child who is susceptible to it though before it’s too late. So, in that way, I can understand any parents reservations about it. It’s supposedly the same situation as SIDS. Some kids are susceptible, and some are not, but it’s impossible to really know unless you take the risks and see what happens. I can certainly understand not wanting to risk anything. Having said that, my daughter is getting vaccinated on schedule. I’m still not willing to risk her getting a deadly disease if I could have prevented it.

marimel
on August 12th, 2009

I don’t have children of my own, but do schools (elementary, high school) in the states not require MMR vaccines and varivax (chicken pox)? I had the MMR, but got chicken pox when I was 4 so I never had to get that vaccine, but when I applied to college a few years ago I had to prove I was vaccinated with MMR and the thing for meningitis, when I spent a semester in Hawaii I had to prove MMR and an updated TB, and now that I am about to start my second degree I’ve also had to provide health records proving I was vaccinated. So basically, I am assuming colleges require it but does anyone know about primary schools? Also, does anyone know if MMR is something one can get later in life, such as in the teen years, when the immune system is built up and could possibly fight off any harmful side effects of the vaccine?

I personally don’t know enough about the benefits and downfalls to vaccines and their harmful effects to fully comment on the situation, but I applaud Jenny for taking a stance on the matter and being a voice for austism.

Denise
on August 12th, 2009

Vaccinations…good timely subject, especially since the government is pushing the swine flu virus vaccine through clinical trials at a ridiculously frenzied pace. There is no way that they can complete thorough (i.e. is the vaccine safe and effective, etc?) clinical trials so quickly as to get that vaccine on the market by October.

I used to be one of those gungho vaccinate my child for everything mother. Now that my daughters are 11, 14, and 17, I think I am DONE with any more vaccines. I can’t even remember how many they have each had over the years and the list keeps growing. Each year they come up with new vaccination guidelines (requirements) that my state (NJ) wants to force on every public school child. When does it end? Soon it will be the cervical cancer vaccine being required. Always more booster shots for measles, for DTP, etc, etc. My children were supposed to be done by age 5 (ok, one additional booster at age 10) and now it is just getting ridiculous. I am seriously looking into finding a new “religion” to get that exemption. I will NOT get the swine flu vaccine…my kids already had the swine flu in June.

As a side note, my oldest had an adverse reaction at 15 months to her DTP. I was told that this was the new, safe, acellular version and she had a major seizure within hours (and thankfully, hasn’t had one since). She cannot have the P (pertussis portion) ever again. But as I said, I was gungho and continued to vaccinate.

As for autism, what is causing such an increase in recent years? Maybe for some kids it is the vaccines, others something environmental. Why are there so many?

I think the key to Jenny’s son’s recovery was early intervention. It seems like her son had a mild form which was very receptive to the therapy she used.

Momof3
on August 12th, 2009

I was watching a show recently on the Discovery Channel and there was a doctor on there who said he feels that so many children today have autism, ADHD, etc. because of all the drugs mothers are given when in labor. He talked about how so many doctors if a woman hasn’t “progressed” to where the doctor feels she should be in her labor, they start pushing the drugs to “get her started”. Interesting concept when you think about it!!

Emily
on August 12th, 2009

Sorry, but I’ll take the CDC, AMA, AAP and my children’s pediatrician over the lady that used to be on singled out.

I don’t care how much research she thinks she’s done, she’s uneducated and should keep her mouth shut about vaccines. If she wants to talk about autism, fine. If she wants to talk about a gluten free diet, fine. But she clearly has no idea what she is talking about when it comes to vaccines.

nosoupforyou
on August 12th, 2009

I am a social worker who works in the field of autism and other developmental disabilities. The idea that autism is caused by “nurture” was not only abusive to parents but inaccurate. Autism is a neuro-developmental disorder. There has been no link shown between autism and vaccines. Autism symptoms show up most frequently around the age a child gets vaccinated. That does not imply a causal relationship. I respect those who wish to be careful and stagger vaccines.

Physicians spend 4 years earning a college degree. After that another 4 years in medical school. Then there are internships, residency, fellowships, licensing exams and board exams.

Reading books about autism does not give one this level of expertise.

gaia's mom
on August 12th, 2009

Hmm…this again. I actually really agreed with Amanda Peet’s comment and have a lot of respect for her candor. My cousin who I grew up in the same house with is autistic and honestly, every case is different. There are some very high functioning austitic people and some that will never speak or relate. My cousin can speak, but has a very difficult time understanding social situations, others emotions and his own. He can be a very very difficult person to be around because of it.

From what I know there is no connection between autism and vaccination. That avenue has been searched time and time, but statistically I don’t think they’ve found anything(correct me if I’m wrong).

And I saw that law and order episode too and its hard to argue with.

Tess
on August 12th, 2009

Thanks to everyone out there who had the kindness to try and understand where I am coming from – especially Alex! I would like to point out one thing though – thimerosal (aka mercury) is still present in MANY vaccines. The flu shot is FULL of it! There is NO official watchdog to make sure that thimerosal is not being put in vaccines. While I do believe there are limited efforts being made to remove it, I urge parents to ask to see the insert that comes in the box with the vial of vaccine that is being used. Odds are you will find thimerosal. I would also suggest googling the words “what’s in a vaccine?” I think many parents would be appalled if they knew what was in there! Check out NVIC.org. It has a wealth of information. I find it very curious how MANY, MANY parents are speaking out about vaccines, and the more we speak out, the more they try to quash it. Not try to offend anyone, but it reminds me of when they used to say smoking does not cause cancer…..right.

June
on August 12th, 2009

Could Evan just be allergic to gluten and casein? And his body reacted to these foods like it was poision?

Also, did Evan have 7 ear infections before his MMR vaccine? Because I would think that would suggest an unhealthy immune system before the vaccine.

Evan is lucky to have such a strong Mom that did not give up on him. I just wonder if she is pointing the blame in the wrong direction?

stevie
on August 12th, 2009

I too have a hard time taking her seriously. I also find it frustrating when celebrities take a stand and run with it, people tend to listen to them because they’re famous and that’s not always good. Personally I think some kids are more “prone” to Autism as others are prone to SIDS, once all the factors line up that’s it.
Momof3-I saw that also and read several articles on that before having my last child and it totally makes sense to me, I think the medical society pushes way too many drugs these days including those to kids with ADHD.

The most important thing to remember is when your children are involved you need to educate yourself about your decisions, don’t go by what a calebrity says to do or not do, do what is right for you and your child.

By the way, I’m confused so is she saying he’s no longer Autistic? I was under the impression that it didn’t just go away, I understand there are treatments out there for those with money but wow!

ang
on August 12th, 2009

Toei and dean did a ride for autism last sat and donated an autographed womens bike. Dean did a movie with jenny earlier in the ywar

gaia's mom
on August 12th, 2009

This is just my uneducated question, but there seems to be a boom of neurological ailment diagnosis in children period. I mean with things like ADD, ADHD, childhood depression. I wonder if part of the reason these illnesses seem more prevalent is because of overzealous doctors misdiagnosing patients. I mean when my daughter was 6months they said she had asthma when she had something different and less severe.

stevie
on August 12th, 2009

Just a question do they put all the vaccines together in the US? I know in Canada they don’t, at least my doctor doesn’t, I also request the ingredients ahead of time like PP suggested. Funny about the flu shot, when my kids get one they have the worst Winters ever so we don’t do it anymore. Now this whole H1N1 vaccination thing is on my mind…

Jessica
on August 12th, 2009

I’d like to point out that just because your child has a condition, and you read up on it, it doesn’t make you an expert. My best friend’s 7 year old son passed away in May from a malignant brain stem glioma. We searched for months and read through every piece of literature there was, that doesn’t make us pediatric oncologists. Like another poster said, I’ll take the AMA, CDC, and my pediatrician that went through 8 years of school, over a few mothers of autistic children who’ve read a few books on the subject. Until you yourself are in the laboratory and actually prove there’s a link between autism and vaccines, don’t preach to others what you THINK is the cause, when your personal experience may be merely coincidental. I’ll take autism anyday over watching my child suffer and possibly die from the measles.

bree
on August 12th, 2009

Your pediatrician is being ‘sold’ the vaccines by the drug reps….its all BIG PHARMA. you have to do some thinking for yourself! They dont get training in med school on this so their listening to the drug rep. LOOK AT THE INSERTS, PEOPLE!!!! Its not a secret—it lists the adverse affects right there. I am a practicing OT who sees loads of autistic kids who’s parents saw a drastic change in them after receiving a shot/combo of shots. I also see kids who were vaccine-injured and are now severly retarded……several who had seizures. Space them out of nothing else….they give WAY too many these days. Why should a little person’s neurological system be expected to handle so many toxins at once. If it takes a few more visits and a few more co-pays, so what!!!

Casi
on August 12th, 2009

People, MMR is Measles, Mumps & Rubella. The Children need this vaccine. I know some of you have concerns but what will you do if your child comes down with the measles? What if your child dies from it? What will you say then? I guess I should have had my child vaccinated! I know vaccines are a risk you take, but I would rather have my child alive with me than take the chance of my child catching one of the three, passing it on to others or dying. I think not vaccinating your child is selfish. You are not giving your child a chance against a world ridden with disease and getting worse every year.

gaia's mom
on August 12th, 2009

Stevie!

My doctor sure doesn’t, my daughter has never had more than 2 shots at a time and never anything unnecessary, just the standard stuff(nothing for chicken pox or the sort). For those getting 4 shots at a time(which I’ve read previously on here) seems like their doc is just getting lazy or trying to save the parents time.

noam
on August 12th, 2009

i appreciate that jenny has clarified some of her past statements, but i must admit i am not convinced that vaccinations play a role in autism. the autism diagnosis usually occurs between 18-30 months, which is also a time when there are a lot of scheduled vaccinations. i (personally)think the relationship is largely coincidental…also, the guidelines for vaccinations are pretty strict, at least where i live (kentucky). not only are there guidelines in the offices/hospitals, there is also an annual publication of vaccination complaints from the health department. parents also have a preliminary meeting before vaccinations are given, and then literature about each vaccination. maybe it’s just my healthcare system, but all the doctors i’ve encountered have been very knowledgable about vaccinations, their side effects, and, yes, even autism. perhaps older doctors recieved only “five minutes in med school” on the subject, but today’s med programs are much more involved on the subject than that…

One time for measles, then next time for mumps and last rubella, why do they have to be together?

One more question, when I went to enroll my daughter in school, they asked me if her vaccines were up to date and they also wanted proof, my daughter has had all her vaccines, but what happens to children that are not vaccinated? do they still get accepted?

sil
on August 12th, 2009

well said Casi!!! ITA, not vaccinating your child is selfish…this is so true!
I’m sorry about Evan, but i don’t agree with Jenny at all.

bonnie
on August 12th, 2009

“She is not a doctor she is “reading up” on what she thinks causes autism. It has never been proven and in fact has been proven it does not cause autism its just a shame she is spreading lies and causing people to not vacinate their kids when it is so important to do so. Spread some of them out if you want but listen to your doctor not the singled out co host for crying out loud!”

Ashley, doctors are not gods, they are human. Jenny did not go to medical school, but we don’t know how much she has RESEARCHED–not “read up” on, autism. (And guess what, going to Med School does not make you an expert on autism, especially if your curriculum refutes ties between autism and vaccinations, without possibly entertaining the possibility that such a link exists. Of course, if medical textbooks did, it would turn the medical field upside down). It is obvious that she has dedicated plenty of time to investigating and ultimately relieving her son’s autism symptoms. So what, she was the co-host for “Singled Out”–does that mean her doctor is right by default? Newsflash, doctors don’t know it all, especially in conventional medicine. Visit a hospital sometime and go on rounds. You’ll figure out that medicine in this country, for the most part, is often like an assembly line, largely focused on healing through drugs and/or surgery–but not completely I must add. Yes, alternative methods are gaining acceptance, however, the reality is that the strong arms of the CDC and the AMA are not open to entertaining anything outside of the same information they teach residents year after year. I do not want to generalize, after all, different med schools teach differently, but I know too many doctors that rely this to me.

Jenny did not blindly accept what her son’s doctors told her and so many ppl got up in arms about it. After, a government body told us that these vaccinations are safe, so they MUST be, right? (And we all know how much the government has our interests at heart). She’s doing what more people should be doing, questioning big Pharma and the CDC, an organization that refuses to delve further into vaccinations and their links to autism, and an organization that has its bread buttered by many of these drugmakers. It is no-win situation w.r.t. to getting the truth from either the CDC or the pharmaceutical companies. Who thinks that a pharm company will WILLINGLY disclose adverse side effects? Not I. How much of the CDC’s information results from INDEPENDENT (i.e. studies NOT paid for or sponsored by dirty drug money) research?

Erika
on August 12th, 2009

It’s interesting how she seems to ‘know’ that his autism was caused by vaccines. Like anyone actually knows. I don’t even have children yet, but I’ve taken biology classes, and in all of them I have been told that vaccines do not cause autism, so whenever I hear that vaccines ’caused’ someones autism, I just ignore it and move on. I assume that scientists know more than regular people whos children came down with symptoms around the time they got a vaccine. This is not to be offensive to anybody, just my opinion.

When I do have children, I hope they don’t end up autistic, but if they do, I will know that some kids just end up with it, and it is not the vaccines fault. These days everyone just needs someone/something to blame for all tough situations, and it’s a shame that life saving vaccines are taking the blame.

Nina
on August 12th, 2009

I did Dr Sear’s alternative schedule with my son because he had 6 ear infections in one year and I wanted to wait. He does have all his shots, and I am really happy that I did research and had a doctor that was ok with that.
This is my opinion but honestly I think autism has always been around a lot more than people think it just wasn’t diagnosed right, like some who are older and most likely autistic were thought to just have social issues..
I think parents need to do a lot of research and talk to specialists before making a choice, I hope no one chooses not to vaccinate just because a celebrity doesn’t!

Erika
on August 12th, 2009

momof3- I think that doctor may be right, it makes sense. I also think it may be something to do with preservatives/ingredients in food that a mother eats while pregnant. I knew someone who ate nothing but potato chips and ice cream while pregnant while her one child and that child has autism, while with her other kids, she ate healthier foods and they are fine. This is just one example, but it makes sense, and it could be true, for not all, but some kids.

Jen DC
on August 12th, 2009

The bottom line is whether Jenny McCarthy is an “autism expert” by your own definition or not, you should be as informed as possible before making medical decisions, even ones as seemingly “simple” and “routine” as vaccinations.

I understand the urge to believe that your doctor is always correct, however with two doctors in the family (dad and sister), a mother with a seizure disorder that went undiagnosed for over five years (leaving her with serious brain damage that could have been mitigated) and personal experience of being misdiagnosed with a viral infection when in fact I had pneumonia and a cyst problem previously undiagnosed despite all evidence of its existence… I’m here to tell you, they don’t know that much more than a well-read layman in terms of diagnosing. You know your body and your child’s body better than the doctor; it is your responsibility to check the doctor’s urges to push “care” on you for the sake of efficiency or convenience. I don’t know whether Jenny McCarthy is right or wrong about the causal connection between vaccinations and her child’s autism, but what she says makes sense: Space the shots out. If your kid’s sickly or picks up bugs easily, take your time even more. But medicine, like a lot of industries, is for money making. Yes, your doctor should “first do no harm,” there is a lot A LOT of guesswork in medicine. Collect and recite as much information to them to give the doctor the best opportunity to make the right guess the first time. And if you think he’s wrong, for the love of G*d, SAY SO.

In terms of refusing vaccinations being considered “selfish” well… I don’t see it like that. If you truly believe that it’s likely your child will suffer rather than benefit from the shots, isn’t it selfish to insist that your child get the shot? And are all these shots really necessary or are some of them optional? I don’t think it’s wrong to question the status quo, if your questions are based on legitimately held doubts or beliefs.

Kate
on August 12th, 2009

Jesse, the “bad” reaction that many people have to penicillin is an allergic one (I’m allergic to it myself). As far as I know, allergic reactions to vaccines are unheard of (I’ve skimmed through VAERS and haven’t seen anything attributed to a purely allergic reaction to the vaccine itself). It’s not even remotely a legitimate comparison. Also, saying that doctors don’t mention adverse reactions to vaccines? I’ve had a half dozen vaccines in the last year, due to traveling to sub-Saharan Africa, and every single one came with a “fact sheet” that mention the likelihood of any possible reactions, just like you would get with drugs from the pharmacy. There are certainly adverse reactions to vaccines, but they are well-publicized and are not comparable to the biological mechanism for an allergic reaction to penicillin, nor are they anywhere near the prevalence of penicillin allergies.

Tess, the only vaccines in the US that still contain thimerosal are certain brands of flu shot, menactra (meningitis), tetanus (by itself) and DT. Of these, the flu shot is the only one regularly given to young children, and there are brands available that are thimerosal-free. Odds are, you will not find thimerosal in your child’s vaccine because it is no longer in the majority of childhood vaccines in this country.

Gaia’smom, many doctors feel that the rise in autism is at least partially due to a rise in diagnoses (vs. a rise in cases). This doesn’t mean these kids are misdiagnosed, but 20 years ago kids on the edge of the spectrum would have been considered difficult to manage or quirky, not autistic.

Mimi
on August 12th, 2009

Jenny’s problem is that she has one kid with autism and seems to view the whole autism spectrum through his eyes. Well I have two sons with autism and they aren’t anything alike. What works for one, never works for the other. I’m happy her son is doing so well and most likely he has a mild form of autism. I don’t want to bum out her or other parents who think their kids are cured because they do so well at that age, but my oldest was doing great a 7 but by 10, the differences between him and other kids academically and socially became more obvious as the rest of the kids matured in ways that he did not.

I do believe vaccinations triggered something in my sons. My third son wasn’t vaccinated until after 2 and had his shots staggered and he’s completely normal. I know it’s not evidence to most people, but if I had another kid, I clearly wouldn’t rush out to vaccinate him/her. I also know many women will hate me for making that decision, but I don’t care what they think anymore than they care what I think.

Finally, I really resent the way normal people want to fix the disabled. My sons are different, not bad, just different. They won’t ever be normal, but they aren’t broken. Autistic people are smart and funny and loving, but they see the world differently. I can understand if society wants to decrease the disabled because they take more services, but the idea that they are less desirable people will lead to the same cure society devised for Downs Syndrome. There’s already talk of testing babies in utero for autism.

liza
on August 12th, 2009

not vaccinating your child is NOT selfish, it is an informed decision that parents have the RIGHT to make.
do your own research people, you may be shocked.
you are your child’s parent, your pediatrician is not.

Mary
on August 12th, 2009

I hope they find was causes autism because not any one thing causing it seems to be going on here. I had drugs during childbirth for my daughter & son and my son had a speech delay and my daughter didn’t. Both were vaccinated. I ate really well with my son and didn’t with my daughter while pregnant and it goes on. I do hope they crack the cause soon.
I love Jenny, when I saw her on Oprah years ago talking about Evan’s experience, I think she did so well speaking about the whole thing she went through. She’s a great advocate to have for autism.

Alex
on August 12th, 2009

I find people like ‘sil’ have a very blinkered take on it. When you consider the alternatives that some governments DO NOT allow (single vaccines are extremely hard to get in the UK), it is not selfish for a parent to not vaccinate, it is the only thing some parents can do. Just because they don’t agree with the MMR or any other combinations given at the same time, it doesn’t make them selfish, it makes them desperate parents who know they are doing the right thing for THEIR child, and are having to fight against people who will verbally abuse them because of it.

To those who ask, I don’t know the reasons against the single vaccines everywhere, but here the reason given is that children are not protected between the vaccines and that parents might not take the kids back for subsequent jabs. The first point is obviously true and an unfortunate necessity, but the second is a non-point for me, since any parent who would go to the trouble of getting single jabs for their kids will, of course, go back.

I think it’s just incredibly naive to just assume that single jab or no vaccine parents are selfish. Many have extremely good reasons (myself as a single jab parent included) that do not always include autism. I think all parents should research anything and everything they can, and then make the right decision for THEIR family according to THEIR circumstances. Parents who dismiss or accept without doing their research are as bad as each other. As are those who will swallow the information fed to them by government departments without question, because, like someone else pointed out, they ALWAYS have our best interests at heart, don’t they? Hmmm….

Regardless, it’s largely misinformed to call a parent selfish for this kind of choice. It so rarely comes down to that. You’ll actually find that most anti-MMR parents are not anti-vaccine, they just want separate jabs. Even those who are entirely against any vaccines have their choices and I respect that, even if I don’t agree with it. I personally respect all other parents, not verbally abuse them for a very personal choice.

Grandma2Three
on August 12th, 2009

Back in the early 90’s two of my children had adverse reactions to
some of their vaccinations. Their pediatrician stopped all vaccines for both of them. Their younger sister was never vaccinated, at his recommendation! There are many pediatricians who agree that some vaccines can be harmful to some children. My grandchildren now see a doctor who recommends staggering and delaying certain vaccines, and avoiding others all together. When I started doing research on vaccines I was surprised to find out there is a ‘National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program’ created by Congress.
I am NOT saying people shouldn’t vaccinate their children. I think all parents should make an educated choice. As parents we make choices for our children and our families. What might be right for my family might no be right for yours. I don’t look down on families that choose to vaccinate. I don’t understand the anger towards families that choose not to.

Rachel
on August 12th, 2009

I 100% support Bree and Tess. I think you may learn something from someone who’s actually living it!

JMO
on August 12th, 2009

Doctors probably do not really know for sure what causes autism. But let’s not forget that after age 40 they always say women are at a higher risk for having a child born with autism. So why is that? Why does age all of a sudden play a factor in having an autistic child? And if that’s the case why can’t they further research that and try to connect it with other cases of autism?

Personally I don’t think vaccines are the cause of autism and believe it also to be coincidental. However I’ve never personally experienced a child of my own who went through this so I will not judge. I just think it’s a tough call when you put trust in doctors when they say one thing but at the same time have millions of mothers saying another thing. I guess for now the vaccine debate will go on and we’ll just have to wait and see what comes of it.

But I don’t think not vaccinating your child is the right call especially when there isn’t enough research to prove otherwise.

brannon
on August 12th, 2009

My pediatrician has separate waiting rooms for children who are vaccinated and those who are not. Unfortunately I have yet to find any schools, stores, etc that do the same.

B
on August 12th, 2009

I went through the worries of having my daughter get the MMR vaccination done. Our Doctor explained to me that if there is a history of autism in the family that it actually might be smarter to wait until 2 years old. I decided to go ahead and let her have the vaccination and she is doing fine. I understand that parents might actually think that the MMR vaccination causes Autism, because the signs start about the time of the vaccination. But I honestly think that the child may actually have it from the beginning but it is hard to find out until 12-18months. Talking to your doctor and really understanding vaccinations and Autism is the best way to make the smart decisions. I may not agree with parents not vaccinating their child(ren) it really is not of my business, but I do not like when celebrities like Jenny McCarthy scare parents into thinking that vaccinations are more harmful. We need to actually listen to our doctors and if there is more questions ask where can we go to get the correct information.

Chris
on August 12th, 2009

It’s never a bad thing to ask questions. It’s never a bad thing to do research. It’s never a bad thing to take your time to make a well-informed decision.

I don’t know what causes Autism. I don’t know if anyone does. But, how can it be a bad thing to remove toxins from vaccines? How can it be a bad thing to space out those vaccines?

My husband is diabetic, and while he has a wonderful doctor that is intelligent, supportive, and patient, I can honestly say that the most successful treatments we have experienced are the ones that we have explored ourselves after extensive research. These treatments are supervised by our doctor, but they are ultimately our decisions and are based on our own judgment. The best doctor just can’t know your body as well as you can. And even the best doctor can never devote the intensive time and energy necessary that you yourself can. Our doctor is human, and there just aren’t enough hours of the day for him to be all-knowing about each and every condition that exists.

Take the time to educate yourself so that you can more effectively work WITH your doctor. And don’t be afraid to ask questions.

Bieta
on August 12th, 2009

This may seem kind of rude, but none of the antiMMR people have produced a reputable study that shows that there is a connection between Autism and Vaccinations. I mean if the correlation were so definite wouldn’t someone have laid the documentation out already? All I seem to be reading is “do you research you will be shocked” and “its the parents choice”. There have been plenty of independent studies done none that I know of have shown a link. Also if I’m not mistaken Thimersol has been taken out of all childhood vaccines for almost ten years now. My older brother is autistic(he’s 25) and I wish we could pin-point what ‘done him in’ as my grandpa says but that’s not how most illnesses work. He is who he is, he’s

It is every parents right to do what they deem best for their child, but your vaccinations impact everyone and the risk may seem small right now but if this ideology spreads we’re in for trouble. I mean there is no denying that if you aren’t vaccinating your child you’re basically depending on other people to be vaccinating their own and thats not right to me.

Erin
on August 12th, 2009

I think people forget that autism has only been recently diagnosed. People have had the symptoms for ages – only society used to shun those with it or worse, institutionalized them. I don’t want to get into a big thing, but I think to suggest that the vast majority of medical professionals are ignorant, complicit or uncaring is so wrong. Vaccinations are safe. Could they be made safer? Yes, and should be. The unfortunate truth is that the proximity of vaccinating and diagnosis cause many parents to draw an otherwise unlinked conclusion. For years many women in the North Bay (of the Bay Area) concluded that living near power lines caused their breast cancer. Then a comprehensive study that came out determined that these women had some of the same lifestyle factors (rich food, too much wine, sedentary activities, no children, etc.) AND lived near power lines. There’s a coincidental relationship. I wish and expect people would have frank conversations with their pediatricians before the vac schedule begins. Do you trust your doctor? Have you done a good amount of scientific research in layman’s language? Do you think the AMA, CDC, etc. are in on some conspiracy of silence or worse? (And by the way, sciencists knew smoking caused cancer from super early on…Dutch scientists said so in the 17th century! But the masses didn’t listen.)

dearling
on August 12th, 2009

Question – why separate children with and without vaccines? If the vaccines work, those children would be protected from things carried by the un-vax’d, right?

IMO, (after working with kids on the spectrum, close family friends with kids on spectrum, and being trained as a teacher, and a variety of anecdotal and scientific evidence that I’ve seen/read) I think there are multiple triggers for autism, and they can/do vary in different children, which would also explain/relate to the idea that different children (like mentioned above by the mom w/ 2 kids on the spectrum) respond to different therapies. Vaccines aren’t the be all and end all of evil as some (not necessarily here) portray them, but they’re not the saviors of the world either.

Nicole
on August 12th, 2009

American doctors are the same people who inflicted circumcision of countless infants in the name of preventing masturbation(eventually finding other “ailments” it cured). It wasn’t until 1999 the American Academy of Pediactrics admitted that it wasn’t necessary(this was years after the rest of the civiliezed world had given up the procedure and other medical societies had called it unethical). Now I know vaccinations do have benefits, but if there are any new delevopments, it will take the American medical establishment years to admit anything. In Denmark, they already are spacing out shots, and they have lower autism rates.

liza
on August 12th, 2009

separate waiting rooms for vaccinated kids and unvaccinated kids?
if vaccines work then why would there be any comcern at all of contracting these diseases from an unvaccinated child????

Tess
on August 12th, 2009

Ok, here it is: The AAP, CDC, and Big Pharma could care less about our kids. I would rather take my chances with the measles than make my already vaccine damaged child worse. Unless you have a child with autism,or have had to watch your child fall apart, possibly even DIE as a result of a vaccine reaction, you could NOT possibly have any clue where we are coming from! I don’t judge parents who do choose to vaccinate! I think anyone who has the nerve to call a parent who does not vaccinate their child selish, has a LOT of nerve! Seems to me they are the selfish ones! Tell me, when my child suffers a more severe reaction, are YOU going to take care of him? Are YOU going to pay all his medical bills that the insurance won’t? Are YOU going to lose your home, your marriage, your life as you knew it to take care of my child? I didn’t think so. I am not posting about this anymore, no matter what anyone says because I KNOW I am right, and believe me, there are plenty or parents like me who feel the same way! Our numbers are growing in leaps and bounds. Someday, probably not in our life time, we WILL be vindicated! Remember when Columbus said the earth was round and that called him a heretic? SAME THING HERE!

Marie
on August 12th, 2009

I understand this is an emotive issue and a heated, contentious topic and debate. However, I would like to say, just because Jenny McCarthy is a celebrity doesn’t mean she is uneducated or unread. I mean, what a weird thing to imply. Clearly, she’s an intelligent woman. I do appreciate when people say that the public listens to celebrities too much, and it’s true, and it’s not always a wise idea. That said, celebrities do have a platform and some of them do use it responsibly and draw attention to issues which are important to them and to others and they are not all empty vessels: many of them do mean what they say and have some knowledge and experience of what they are talking about and that’s often why they chose that particular topic or charity.

People have this strange idea that celebrities are a different class of human being and that their opinions don’t count; they’re not and they do, as much as yours and mine count. Their lives are just different and they’re famous. But the level and extent of this, and whether it was fame they sought or if it was a by-product of something else they wanted to do deep in their soul, various from person to person in lots and lots of ways.

Some people, and I believe Jenny McCarthy to be one of them, won’t express an opinion about something unless it is rooted in a great deal of understanding. And here’s the thing: it’s subjective. What she understands about autism comes from her experience as the mother of a son who is autistic, and the literature she has read, the parents and doctors she has spoken to over a period of years, and the books she has written, which have informed the opinion she has of a contentious issue. There are very few facts surrounding autism and consequently, debates and differing viewpoints in a way there never is over the location of a person’s liver or heart. We all know where they are.

Jenny McCarthy is not trying to indoctrinate people into thinking as she does. What she’s doing is putting an alternative viewpoint out there, sharing her experiences and encouraging research into autisim and considerations of how to deal with it and potentially lessen its affects. It’s not a cure, it’s a different way. And sometimes, if your way deviates from the ‘norm’, you do find you have to shout a little louder just to be heard – celebrity or not.

As for the whole vaccine issue. If one were to read Jenny’s comments you would see that she is not saying don’t vaccinate. What’s she’s saying is, let’s be cautious about HOW and WHEN we vaccinate, and that is an eminently sensible and considered idea.
Prescisly because there is too much we still aren’t sure of.

Alice
on August 12th, 2009

wow I don’t have time to read all the comments but I would like to see a “bad side effects of vaccines” map.
Maybe it depends on the countries and the doses because I’ve never had a problem with vaccines, everyone I know has been vaccinated and never had trouble, I wonder if vaccination isn’t even compulsory here (in France). I never even knew some people thought vaccines were bad before reading CBB. It’s not the first time the issue is brought up here.
BUT I’ve enver heard of doing several vaccines at once either O_o I think I had 2 once but that’s all… a vaccine makes your body work, you need your strength!!

Alice
on August 12th, 2009

liza – I believe it’s because vaccinated kids won’t catch the disease at all. Unvaccinated kids can catch it and then if the virus mutates in them it can become dangerous to even vaccinated children. Unvaccinated kids will spread the disease and make it dangerous to vaccinated children too. That’s why vaccines work best if everyone has them done.

skunknuggets
on August 12th, 2009

I had a bad reaction to either MMR or Tetanus shots that I received shortly before college. I now have a permanant twitch in my right shoulder than wasn’t there before. My arm also goes numb and I sometimes can’t use that arm. It wasn’t like that before those shots. Within five minutes of the shots, I couldn’t move my arm. All the dr said was to rest my arm and I’d be fine. No one in the office believed me. Being 18, I didn’t know to stand up for myself and now I have to live with the adverse affects.

I am skeptical about vaccinating. I still did with my first two children and my second child is suspected of being on the autism spectrum. It truly breaks my heart to have a 2.5 year old and have never heard his voice. I hope one day to hear “I love you, mom” but I may never get the chance to hear it from him. My third is still unvaccinated.

Jessica
on August 12th, 2009

Bieta, you are absolutely correct in saying that Thimerosal has been taken out of childhood vaccines for about 10 years now. It was originally what was blamed for causing autism in relation to vaccines. It’s not in them anymore and people are still blaming mercury in the MMR vaccine. I wonder if any of these women could possibly believe that all the chemicals, antibiotics, and growth hormones could have something to do with it. Just a thought.

Kate
on August 12th, 2009

“Vaccines aren’t the be all and end all of evil as some (not necessarily here) portray them, but they’re not the saviors of the world either.”

I don’t think any good doctor would argue that vaccines are risk-free. The fact of the matter is, however, that the risk from vaccinating — even if vaccines had been shown to have any role in causing autism, which they have been repeatedly shown not to, in large, independent studies — is far less than the risk of not vaccinating. Vaccinations (along with antibiotics, sanitation, access to healthier food, education, hospitals, and clean water) are one of the great medical advances responsible for drastically reduced infant and child mortality rates in the 19th and 20th century.

Marie, no amount of reading on autism changes the fact that Jennie McCarthy is not a clinical researcher or statistician and does not have access to a lab. There has been showing causation between vaccines and autism. So she may be well-read, but I’m not really sure what she’s reading, since there’s nothing out there (scientifically) that supports her point. I think making vaccines safer is a noble goal — every drug or treatment in medicine can stand to be safer — but the autism/vaccine link, at least as far as research currently shows, is not subjective.

Erica
on August 12th, 2009

I completely agree with Nicole, Chris, and others who have pointed out the inherently fallible nature of doctors. I respect them for their expertise, but the human body is not a machine; everyone is built a little differently and people should never underestimate the power of being your own biggest advocate. Almost every doctor I’ve ever had has told me that themselves. There is no way I would immediately dismiss the experiences of mothers with autistic children (and several pediatricians themselves) who choose to space out/forego certain vaccinations. And while I don’t agree with everything Jenny has said about vaccines and “curing” autism she is an incredible example of a proactive mother who didn’t simply take the word of someone just because of a degree. I think we all know people who have been moderately or severely misdiagnosed/treated by a medical professional. No one is perfect, but that’s not a doctor’s fault–the human body will NEVER be completely understood.

My older brother and younger sister are both on the autism spectrum. While I believe my sister would’ve always been autistic (albeit extremely high functioning) my mom noticed changes with my brother’s personality within days after a round of vaccinations. His pediatrician subsequently told her he would most likely never be in a normal classroom–not only was he in normal classes from 1st grade forward, he graduated with honors, owns his own place and makes waaay more money than me, a “normal” girl :). All because my parents refused to take one man’s word and give up on my brother. So again–doctors aren’t and never will be God. Nobody knows their kids better than their parents and I think that is what Jenny’s point is.

Cara
on August 12th, 2009

While I can’t sit and read every email and I can tell there are too many people out here that shouldn’t be writing anything!! If you don’t have a child with Autism or Epilepsy or anything under the spectrum, please do all of us who do a favor and refrain from saying or writing anything. All you do is make the parents angry that have to go through so much with our children, who are struggling…every single day and will the rest of their lives! And for the one comment I did read that said something like “I’ll vaccinate to not watch my child die and rather have my child get Autism,” is just a sick and horrible thing to say. You are saying that to countless parents out there who would give ANYTHING to “take away” their Autism, just disgusting. Shame on you who don’t understand. Stick with subjects that you know about and don’t go around pointing a finger at Jenny McCarthy, who has done more for us parents then any of you will ever know!

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 12th, 2009

“Jessica Says:
August 12th, 2009 at 3:10 pm

The link with autism and vaccines stems primarily for the MMR vaccine which USED to contain Thimerosal a preservative).”

God, I love people who don’t know what the hell they are talking about. Get your facts straight, honey. The MMR never contained Thimerosil as it would have killed the live strain of the viruses in the vaccine. However, mercury is STILL in a number of childhood vaccines, including the flu shot- 25 mg. Up to 2 flu shots a year for a child- 50 mgs. The mother gets a flu shot–the developing fetus is now subjected to mercury via the placental barrier, not to mention Rhogam shots for some mothers which contains mercury. Your ‘the mercury is GONE’ statement is incorrect, yet this tired old argument continues to circulate. Aluminum is nearly as bad of a neurotoxin as mercury, and is RAMPANT in many vaccines given to babies.

The amount of mercury is LESS than it used to be, but when a child is given up to 8 shots in one day, the ‘insignificant’ amount of mercury in those shots adds up quickly. Any child getting 25 the flu shot has just received more mercury than is considered by the EPA to be safe.

Quote from Dr.Mercola: “Of the vaccines today that still contain mercury, the flu vaccine is the biggest concern, according to Dr. Ayoub. About 80 percent of flu vaccines contain as much as 25 micrograms of mercury per dose. The EPA’s safe limit for mercury is 0.1 mcg/kg, so everyone who gets the flu vaccine receives an overdose of mercury. You would have to weigh at least 550 pounds to receive a flu shot and be within the safe federal exposure limits for mercury.”

Jessica
on August 12th, 2009

No Cara, I do not have a child with autism, but I’ve studied it and the linkage to vaccines in college with actual biomedical researchers-and guess what, nothing. It seems to me that all these mothers who consider themselves “well-read” are basing an emotional linkage to this. They NEED to blame something. There is not some big conspiracy with the AMA and pharmaceutical companies. Yes your doctor does buy vaccines from a sales rep, they also buy blood pressure cuffs too, it doesn’t mean they are “fixed” It is most definetly not terrible to say “I rather my child have autism than get sick from the measles and die” . I have 2 children and would absolutely prefer them living! remember vaccines save lives, basically erradicated polio. Statistically, more boys get autism than girls, do you think vaccines are sexist? Clearly this is an emotional and wsensitive subject, but all you’re going by is a hunch or coincidence. I can say the same thing to you aout “who should have the right to comment” until you’ve actually been in a lab researching this, you don’t know.

Micheley
on August 12th, 2009

Focussing on the comments about the rise in diagnosis’s of Autism and ADD, I think that people are now more aware and open about these symptoms and diseases. But along with that (and Im speaking specifically about ADD, I havn’t had to deal with many misdiagnosis of Autism) is a Misdiagnosis. Ive worked with many kids who have been diagnosed with add and given medication. I am a strong believer in the medication they are given and I see drastic changes, but I have also run into several kids who are kinda that in between of “normal” and ADD, and they are just a little more full of energy. Over the last five years I have been involved in seven cases where a child did not have ADD and were misdiagnosed.
Also another problem is the fact that children labeled to have a learning disability and children who are ‘ahead of the game’ (aka TAG) Are almost never retested. That label is stuck with them and no one goes back to check on things. Personally, when I was in 1st grade I got tested and put in TAG and I was in it the rest of my school years. My nephew was diagnosed for ADD when he was seven and given medication and it wasn’t until five years later when my sister requested it did they retest him and consider adjusting his medication.

Jessica
on August 12th, 2009

Getyourfactsstraight, like I said in my previous post, I studied this in a lab, in college, with professionals, my info comes from medical researchers and the CDC, don’t be so insulting and act like you’re the authority on autism because you’ve read about it in a book.

Jessica, how dare you make such a statement, basing emotions and the need for us to ‘blame’ someone for our child’s autism as the reasons many of us are anti-vaccine. Those of us who watched our perfectly healthy children dwindle into autism after shots know the truth.

We didn’t read about it or do some online research and come to that conclusion. Beforehand, I can guarantee you that most of us were pro-vaccine (hence the reason most of our autistic kids ARE fully vaccinated). You see, we watched it happen–people like you, who do not have vaccine-injured children, did not.

And if you ‘studied’ in college with biomedical researchers, why do you persist in your incorrect statement that the MMR once contained mercury? You come off sounding uneducated and flippant. You should also have gleaned from your ‘research’ that measles is NOT a deadly disease in a modern, sanitized society with healthy people living in it. Your children are not going to die of measles, mumps or rubella. Nor chickenpox. Nor polio because the only polio viruses running around the planet right now are vaccine-derived (WHO admits the recent outbreak in Africa is singularly due to a vaccine). Nor Hep B–show me a sexually promiscuous, drug-using newborn and I’ll show you a real reason to give a baby the Hep B vaccine on their birthday, otherwise, it’s is unnecessary.

gaia's mom
on August 12th, 2009

Tess, talk about mixing issues.

No one is denying the fact that a person who has a reaction to a vaccine should be cautious and possibly go without other vaccinations. That has nothing to do with vaccines CAUSING autism. Your numbers are growing because of gross misinformation and god forbid your lot should be “vindicated” by a massive outbreak of measles, mumps or rubella! Those diseases seem like distant memories but they are real and they can kill the strongest child.

And for me personally even if there was a connection between autism and vaccines, there is no way I wouldn’t vaccinate my child. If none of us were vaccinated I shutter to think about the possible pan and epidemics that could’ve occurred!

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 12th, 2009

“don’t be so insulting and act like you’re the authority on autism because you’ve read about it in a book.”

You tell us we are looking for someone to blame, then have the utter gall to also tell US not to be insulting? Pot, meet kettle. Where did I say I was an authority on autism? Don’t put words in my mouth. However, I get probably guess that I know a heck of a lot more about it than you ever will. I called you out on your incorrect statement about the MMR containing mercury, not to mention your equally incorrect statement that mercury has been removed from childhood vaccines (which you have yet to address). Where on earth do you get your ‘facts’? Even the CDC admits there was never mercury in the MMR!

What makes you think I gained my only knowledge from a book? My lab is also my home (good one, Cheryl!). I’ve studied BOTH sides religiously for years, ever since my son was diagnosed.

Alright…I joined this discussion a little too late, and I am glad that I did. I am absolutely disgusted reading comments from those that are not living with ASD. A big round of applause to Tess and Cara…couldn’t have said it better :)

christina
on August 12th, 2009

That woman is dangerous. DANGEROUS. Please talk with your physician about this issue, not JM.

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 12th, 2009

Christina,

Sadly, most of us did do just that. They told us to vaccinate our children who probably had underlying issues such as a poor immune systems or mitochondrial disease or severe egg/milk allergies. These are children that should never had received any vaccine, or at the very least, should have had them spaced out. Most docs take a blanket-vaccine approach to vaccinating children. Most of them would tell you that giving a Hep B vaccine to a newborn withOUT a Hep B-positive mother is a good idea.

Unfortunately, just talking to your doctor isn’t good enough.

Rebecca
on August 12th, 2009

I wonder if Brannon’s doctor’s office is actually set up so that sick patients are on one side, and well patients are on the other. Our ped back in San Diego did this and it was nice not to have to worry about Sally being sick and getting my baby sick when I was just taking her for a check up.

I don’t like that people assume simply because Jenny McCarthy came out saying she thought the MMR vaccine caused her son’s autism that people automatically assume that those of us that don’t vaccinate are doing so because we believe her. I hate when people assume I’m taking her word, or that I’m too stupid to do my own research.

Jessica
on August 12th, 2009

When it comes down to it, just because your kid has it doesn’t mean you’re an expert. If your child had leukemia instead would you consider yourself an oncologist. All I know about autism is what I learned in college, Obviously it’s emotional because it’s your kid, however facts, don’t materialize because you FEEL something. And you come off as the one uneducated, typically uneducated people are overly forceful in their arguments because they think it helps. Yes, you can live it, STILL doesn’t make you an expert. The people saying “their lab is their home” ok so you see the day to day struggles, and I admire you for that,I’m sure you’re all very strong women, but its dangerous to try and sway people without knowing for a fact. Actually, there was an outbreak of the measles in children in Europe a few years ago and many children died. Why don’t you tell their parents that the measles aren’t deadly.

Sylvia
on August 12th, 2009

I love Jenny, she is right on about the vaccine issue. One of the comments I read here said they would rather their child get autism than die of a vaccine preventable disease. What would you say to my situation? My beautiful, happy and interactive son plunged into a world of pain and confusion after his 3rd Hepatitis B vaccine. So I did some research on this shot. Turns out that there are very few cases of hepatitis B in the U.S., with most people with it falling into high risk categories of sexual promiscuity and I.V. drug abuse. NOT infants. I repeat, infants are absolutely NOT at risk for this disease, unless the mother is positive for hepatitis B. And the mother can be tested to find out if she is infected.

So why is this shot given to newborns then? Well your child’s pediatrician will tell you that if you vaccinate your baby now, then they will be “protected” when they are older and begin to be sexualy active. The problem with this theory is that the vaccine is only effective for about 5 to 7 years. Yes ladies, the vaccine for hepatitis B will have worn off by the time most kids enter the first grade.

So it comes down to a marketing campaign to sell a product. It seems the prosititutes and druggies weren’t buying enough of the hepatitis B vaccine, so the drug maker lobbied to have it added to the infant vaccine schedule. This vaccine has a very high rate of adverse reactions; death and disability.

We have been had. We are so gullible that we go along with something even though it makes no sense at all. But it is a money maker, so it stays.

But as a parent, I am outraged that my son was sacrificed for the all mighty dollar. At least I had no idea of the risks. For those of you that know, but still do it, I can’t imagine the guilt you will bear.

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 12th, 2009

“Alice Says:
August 12th, 2009 at 6:51 pm

wow I don’t have time to read all the comments but I would like to see a “bad side effects of vaccines” map.”

Most of VAERS’ (which is a joint collaboration between the CDC and the FDA) information comes directly from doctors reporting on vaccine reactions.

laura
on August 12th, 2009

Take her celebrity out of it. She is a mother trying to do best for her child with Autism. She isn’t telling people they shouldn’t vaccinate, she is saying look into alternative schedules and seperate vaccinations. She isn’t the only mom out there saying these things. To vaccinate or not is a highly personal choice and I think if all the exposure she has gotten for the subject stops and makes just one parent think about it, ask questions, and maybe delay the shots, then it is all worth it. We live in a medication happy society. I agree with her…..one vaccination does not fit all.

cheryl
on August 12th, 2009

Thimerosal is no longer used as preservative in most vaccines, but it is still used in the vaccine manufacturing process, and so vaccines still contain trace amounts. Even when they say “thimerosal-free”, their is still trace amounts.

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 12th, 2009

Jessica,

Once again….no one here is saying they are experts simply because they have a child with autism. I’m really not quite sure why you keep coming back to that. At any rate, to which outbreak are you referring? Can you please provide some stats or a link to the news article? It would be extremely helpful to note whether or not this occurred in an extremely poor part of Europe (aka what kinds of healthy food and sanitation is/was available to this particular community?). Measles can weaken an already-compromised immune system, hence the deaths each year in countries with horrible nutrition and sanitation. Also, please do not intimate that because I am on the opposite side of your argument that I am uneducated.

No one would discount the grief of any parents who had children die of any disease, but stating that the measles outbreak caused those children to die is inaccurate. Most of the kids who caught measles in the states in recent years were, in fact, fully vaccinated. However, like I said: I would like to learn more about this particular case in Europe. Jut saying that they died of measles isn’t good enough–there is always another story. Much like the current swine flu: people who have extreme underlying conditions are the ones at risk.

From Auckland Stuff.co. : “Last week it was confirmed that a four-month-old boy in Whangarei has the highly contagious illness and is the first confirmed measles cases in Northland since 2001.

The child has not been hospitalised and is recovering at home with his family.”

Why is this child NOT dying? Because he is healthy and lives in a CLEAN society with running water and good nutrition.

This is my point: we do not have to fear measles or mumps or rubella in a modern society. The fear-mongering of the ‘deadly measles virus’ is nonsense.

Jane
on August 12th, 2009

My oldest son first started showing symptoms of Autism shortly after being vaccinated. In responce I refused to vaccinate my daughter. Two years back, when she was just three years old, she came down with measles. I was extremely worried but had high hopes that she would recover and we would carry on. Unfortunately that did not happen, and like so many others who are weakened by Measles she caught pnemonia. She was just so little and weak, that she didn’t have the strength to fight back. I later learned that 2007 was the UK’s highest rate for Measles in quite awhile.
So I feel like I understand those who are for and against vaccines. I do not know if they are what caused my son’s autism, but I do know that they could have saved my daugther. And like Jenny had said when Charlie was first diagnosed his life was misserable, he was a completely differnt little boy and I often thought that nothing could be worse then that. But I was very wrong.
I now have a one year old little girl and she will be vaccinated but as others have said, staggeredly and necessity are important to be aware of.

Sarah M.
on August 12th, 2009

Gaia’s mom – Many different conditions are misdiagnosed ALL the time. This has nothing to do with doctors being improperly educated or negligent, but because for EVERY symptom there are numerous conditions that can have that particular symptom. The person (or parents for children) that are sick need to make sure to tell their doctors every symptom that is present so the doctor has all the facts before making their diagnosis. (I know you didn’t imply that doctor’s are negligent, but others her have and this was the best place to insert that sentence. :) )

I do like that Jenny is now watching how she’s phrasing things more now. But I still don’t like that she stated that Evan is ‘cured’ of autism. I have NEVER seen any evidence to suggest the there is a cure for autism. And by her saying that her son, no matter how she claims it came about, is misleading. Just because that may have worked for her son in no way means that it works for every child! And, hopefully not, her son may just be better right now and it could get worse again a few years from now.

As to the whole ‘several ear infections’ thing, I had ear infections a ton when I was a kid. Usually pretty close together, too. (I had tubes put in my ears and that stopped the ear infections.) I also had, and still have, VERY sensitive skin (not Eczema, but BAD rashes often enough to become beyond annoying at times). I was given the hep-b booster. With all 3 of these, I don’t have autism. Different things effect different people in different ways. I used to have bad allergies. (Allergic to dogs, cats, dust, molds, grass, weeds, cottonwood trees & Sulfa.) I’ve outgrown all but the dust, molds, dogs & cats. I still have the others. I did allergy shots for a while. EVERY time they tried to move me to the next level for the shots, I had a severe reaction. (Hives over my whole body, with the potential to effect my breathing. I had to go back to the office-after already having to wait for an hour after the shot initially-be give Benadryl and Epinephrin and wait for at least an hour longer.) After the 1st reaction, I was given Epi-Pens. After the 2nd reaction, I re-evaluated the situation for my instance. Was it better for me to have the shots and have that reaction much of the time, and as a result need an Epi-Pen (not fun), OR to take allergy medicine during the summers every day. For me, I went with the allergy medicine over the Epi-Pen. I saw others there regularly who never seemed to have the least bit of trouble with them.

There’s a show every now and again on TLC (in the US) about a family with 6 kids and ALL of them have autism. I would be curious to hear what she has to say on the subject…

Erin
on August 12th, 2009

Since when did having a child with autism make you the only people worthy of discussing the subject? I didn’t realize that those of us with an pro-vaccinations opinion should hold back because we might offend someone who’s dealing with an autistic child every day. It should go without saying that I and I’m sure every other decent person respects that you are devoted to your child, as any parent should be. You’ve been dealt a diagnosis nobody would wish for and handle it the best you can. I totally admire you for that. I can only speak for myself (obviously) when I say that my belief that vaccinations don’t cause autism comes from my own research, my sister who’s a pediatrician, and loads of talks with folks on both sides of the issue. I’ve made a decision for my kids and don’t like being scolded that because mine aren’t autistic that I’m not welcome in the conversation (Cara, Cheryl, mj) Maybe if we all didn’t get our backs up at the slightest provocation we’d be better able to have a helpful back and forth. No?

Alice
on August 12th, 2009

thanks for the VAERS website GetYourFactsStraight!! I was wondering about a world one cause the US is just one block for me, I guess it’s the same vaccines… but it’s interesting that this system exists!! I’ll look into it!

gaia's mom
on August 12th, 2009

Jane, I am so so sorry for your loss! I don’t really have words.

And Sarah M,

Yeah, when my doctor misdiagnosed my kid I wasn’t upset. I mean in other cases it would’ve pointed to asthma but she had mild adanoids(I can’t spell it). Which is a lot less common where we live.

Sarah M.
on August 12th, 2009

I forgot to mention that my cousin has 4 boys and none of them are vaccinated. All she needs for them to go to school/pre-school is a note from their doctor saying that it’s still ok for them to go.

Amy
on August 12th, 2009

Actually, the claim that unvaxed kids spread mutated diseases to vaxed kids is NOT usually the case. Generally, it’s simple vaccine failure- for instance, 50% of all Whooping Cough (pertussis) cases are found in children who have received the vaccine on schedule. Additionally, vaccinated children are less likely to be accurately diagnosed with WC because they’ve been vaxed and doctors assume that since they have, they do not have WC.

Let’s face it, in many cases, the vaccine doesn’t even work. We’re injecting a cocktail of disgusting substances into our children and getting what is often a false sense of security along with our side effects.

I don’t vaccinate my daughter. It’s not selfish, it’s our choice. You’re welcome to give vaccines to your child, but don’t blame the “selfish” nonvaxers when WC spreads in an elementary school because there’s just as good a chance that the vector point was a vaccinated child.

Shelby
on August 12th, 2009

Wow, it makes me sad to read over this. The sad part is grown women arguing, calling each other names, or that Jenny isn’t “qualified” enough because she hosted singled out. There is one thing here that should be upsetting every single one of us.

Autism is growing at a rate that is unexplainable (yes, there are more diagnoses and better testing, thank goodness!) However, I am absolutely terrified to think that by the time I want to conceive a child in the next few years that the odds of having an autistic child will be more than the current 1 in 150 children. That is horrifying in any way you look at it. Everyday there are thousands more children that are more who will suffer with his disease. There are lots of high functioning children on the spectrum but many who are not as well. Just look at the numbers, something has to have caused this (I’m sorry but the increase isn’t validated by better diagnosis alone…for me at least). These young children are growing up and are going to need better treatments, schools, patient teachers, programs to help them, and most importantly love. I praise anyone who is willing to dedicate any amount of time to help further autism research because we have a lot to learn about it especially what the causes and what we can do to better help children who suffer from it.

In regards to that, there is NO ONE and I will say it again NO ONE who is an expert on autism…nobody, they don’t exist. Until we know what the causes of autism are (which I pray we do soon) no single person will have all of the answers. So, in regards to that I absolutely believe that some of the above posters have done more than enough research to make educated decisions. Someone brought up the case of leukemia. Does it make you an “expert” on leukemia? No, but you will learn very quickly the terminology, effects and will often times do more research particularly about treatments because you have something none of the doctor or nurses have…emotion (and I say all of that with first hand experience as a friend’s sweet little boy passed away of leukemia). Furthermore, I believe that emotion and mother’s instinct are something that God blessed us with particularly as women. I’m sorry but there is no doctor who knows more about a child then their mother does (in regards to feelings, emotions, and regression). Your pediatrician is your pediatrician to provide information regarding basic well being of your child. If your child had a horrible rash, you would go to your doctor (presumably) and if they weren’t sure they would send you on to a specialist. There are thousands of specialists in our country who are better educated in regards to certain areas of medicine. These first hand mothers who experience a child going through autism are like specialists to me.

Let me just close by saying that autism is one of the most heart breaking diseases and no one can ever tell you anything until you go through it first hand. I nannied for a family for 7 years and saw exactly how autism can affect a child, marriage and relationships with siblings and the outside world. All I know is one day that sweet little boy was hugging and kissing me, looking into my eyes and said I love you. 4 days later after his vaccine, he couldn’t stand to be touched, looked at and removed himself from everything. It was as if he was in a different world and none of us would every be able to find him again. It took 5 years, THOUSANDS of hours of RESEARCH, thousands upon thousands of dollars in supplements, treatments and specialized diet but I finally got an I love you again. I would spend the next 15 years of my life doing everything I could because even if we never heard it again, him looking into my eyes and saying I love you meant the world. Praise God that he continues to make strides and that the I love yous keep going. Until then, he will always be a little boy on the spectrum but thanks to the steadfastness of his mother who wouldn’t stand to take a doctors opinion of “there’s nothing you can do.” he’s more like the little boy we always knew.

Do I think that vaccines caused his autism? I’m not sure. I believe there are definitely parallels but I don’t think it matters for him looking back. It happened and we did everything we could to recover him and did. Looking to the future which we all should, we need to fund research (so we can all have more statistics to share with one another), support mothers in every need (read again please), call out big pharmaceuticals, CDC, etc. Even if you are lucky to not have a child with autism please don’t forget that with these numbers your grandchildren may be a greater risk.

These children need our help, and mothers, fathers and families need it to. I wish you all the best in whatever facet of PDD you have experience with and pray that those without first hand experience never have to have it. Any discussion about autism is a good one for me, the more we discuss, the more we can learn, research and make educated decisions for ourselves and our children.

Cara
on August 12th, 2009

First, like Jenny McCarthy I am NOT, I repeat…NOT against vaccinations! As most have stated our kids with Autism are FULLY vaccinated, unfortunately. Second, I’m educated with a college degree, but my real degree comes from years and years of studying everything about Autism and Epilepsy as we now battle that as well, after years of not even realizing the two go hand in hand. I’m not going to go into our personal history because it is too extensive, like most parents out there and none of anyone’s business either. As for the last few comments, if you want to join in, have some compassion and maybe THINK before you speak. You wouldn’t go around saying rude things to someone who has cancer, etc. I don’t need labs, statistics, etc. We go with all the paperwork, tests, etc. that we have on our child, that is how we live our lives…daily with what we know and have learned. I just don’t appreciate the caddy comments from people who truly don’t understand. I do appreciate the comments from those who truly understand this. AND would anyone like to come make these comments to my son, he truly is the victim in all of this and I shutter to think of all the many more to come!

TEDS22
on August 12th, 2009

Here in Austalia,you have to provide the vaccine certificate to the primary(elementary)school to prove that you have had your child done!!As others have said,I would rather have my child not die of measles or mumps and I would not won’t my kid at school,with kids whose parents have selfishly put their childs health at risk as well as mine!!!!

JMO
on August 12th, 2009

Cara –

Since you directed your comment to me about what I said I think I have the right to say this.

This is a message board on a public blog with a topic being discussed. Whether you like it or not it’s going to be talked about so perhaps maybe if it bothers YOU so much you should refrain from reading anymore comments that are making you mad! I know MANY children with autism and I even have a nephew with cerebal palsy. I know all to well what it’s like to have and be around children with disabilities. I like everyone else have a right to voice our opinion on the subject matter. And until one day a researcher comes out with a public announcement that vaccines indeed lead to the possibility of a child having autism well then I’ll tip my hat to all of you mothers who were “right” all along!! I feel for you and many families who have children suffering from autism. But you are not the only one in this world dealin with this issue and your certainly not the only person who has to wake up every morning and take care of a sick child!! So I wish you and your child all the best but don’t come onto a public blog and expect the world to be silent about it!!!!!!!!!!!!

Liliana
on August 12th, 2009

I completely agree with Erin.

As a parent, you do what you think is right for your child. After talking with various pediatricians and reviewing reading materials pertaining to the subject, I chose to vaccinate my boys. Does that make me a bad parent? No. Does that make those against vaccinations bad parents? No. People may not see eye to eye on the issue but as long as a child’s best interest is at hand, it doesn’t matter. I may not agree with Jenny or others who choose not to vaccinate but I respect their opinions just as I hope they would respect mine.

And Cara, as long as comments adhere to the rules, they can be given by anyone- pro and anti-vaccination. I will never pretend to know what parents of autistic children go through but as I mentioned before, my opinion counts just as much as yours.

JMO
on August 12th, 2009

And btw I did say that I’d rather risk my child getting Autism then die of a the measles or some other disease. Damn straight! I’d rather wake up to my child every morning then visit him/her at a grave yard! Sorry if I may sound selfish to you but autism mas horrible of a condition it may be for a child to have I’d much rather deal with that then never see my childs face again!!!!!

JMO
on August 12th, 2009

Sylvia what I would say to your situation is that I’m very sorry this happened to your son and obviously most of us wish that autism was something that NO child ever had to deal with. But I can only speak for myself and like I said above. I’d rather deal with that then sadly have a situation like Jane (sorry for you loss btw) where I made a choice not to vaccinate my son or daughter and she/he ends up getting ill and passing away. You can certainly figure out a way to deal with autism but how do you deal with death??

Cara
on August 12th, 2009

Since it seems my comments are being taken way out of context and overstated, I never said you couldn’t come out and give your opinion, I just asked for some compassion. I was not addressing any of my comments to any one person. If you feel that way about measles and autism, I feel sorry for you, the end. Until you have a child that is yours and they are diagnosed….you’d re-think everything, as we have done for 8 very long years. AND I never stated anywhere in my posts, please go back and read, did I say I believe vaccinations are the only reason my son falls under the spectrum. I’m intelligent to know better….

Micheley
on August 12th, 2009

Wow its gotten even more heated in here!
I do not think it is selfish for parents to not vaccinate their children, I think that every parent is just trying to decide what is best for their child based on their personal beliefs. Just like every other ‘debate’ that has occured on this board, this topic has pros and cons.
Where I have a problem with it, is when it has the possibility to affect others who have not agreed to their decision. Like a second hand smoke victim. It is not their fault if they get cancer, they did not make the decision to smoke that cigarette, someone else made that decision and because of it other people’s health are at risk.
So the only reason I am against it, is because its not just your kid you might be affecting.

Erika
on August 12th, 2009

Liza- the reason is, vaccines do work against a disease. It is proven. However when a disease is spread to many many people it will start to mutate. If a person with a vaccine for say, measles, comes into contact with a mutated measles virus, they may still have a chance of getting the disease, depending on how much it has mutated. This is one of the reasons the flu vaccine doesn’t always work (along with the fact that there are so many different strains). THIS is why not vaccinating is selfish to other people, especially those who are elderly/young/ill and can not get a vaccine, and may eventually be dangerous to people who are vaccinated, if a lot of people stop getting vaccines.

This is why I love that my school district require vaccines for every child starting school. Unless you have had the disease or can not have them for a legitimate medical reason. They do not accept ‘religious’ as an excuse and they will actually not allow children who have not recieved all of their vaccines to attend school for the first few days. :)That way, nobody has to be concerned.
(This wasn’t meant to be this long, I got carried away lol)

Sylvia
on August 12th, 2009

Thank you JMO, I believe I am following your point, but what about my point? That the vaccine schedule has gone crazy. Too many, too close together. A mandatory vaccine for sexualy transmitted diseases? These should be available for parents to choose if they wish, but no way should they be on the mandatory schedule. And most parents don’t know about the vaccine exemption laws, so they are unable to really make an informed consent. Some vaccines are safer than others. Some make less sense to take the risk of an adverse reaction. These are all individual biologicals, each with unique properties. They shouldn’t be all lumped together as either “good” or “bad”. There are many problems with the vaccine program in this country. And kids suffer for it. When parents speak up, they are labeled as anti-vaccine. But that is pretty crazy, considering we were the ones that allowed our chidren to be vaccinated in the first place.

To any parent considering the pros and cons of vaccination:
I would ask parents of vaccine injured children what happened to them. Ask them what their pediatrician said when they reported it. Where they blown off? Told not to over react? What was done to help their vaccine injured child? ‘Nothing’ would be the most often response. You. are. alone. Buh-bye. Once your child has the nerve to respond negatively to a vaccine, the pediatrician doesn’t have much to say or offer you, other than the the typical response: “it was just a coincidence”.

Then do more research, and find out how many thousands and thousands of other “coincidence kids” there are out there.

The latest numbers are 1% of children in the U.S. has autism, and when you count boys, it is 2.6%. Those numbers are staggering. Compare that to the autism rate when we only vaccinated babies for highly contagious diseases. We have a huge problem here. And what does the CDC tell us? That it is all a big fat co-inky-dink! Great.

liza
on August 12th, 2009

hello ericka,
please please do show me the ‘evidence’ that vaccines work.
also any ‘evidence’ that nonvaccinated kids put vaccinated kids at risk would be interesting to see.

Jane
on August 12th, 2009

Sylvia- I respect everything that you said, but you come across that you assume that vaccines are the only reason autism is on the rise. Have you ever considered other reasons such as the unhealthy life style of many families/pregnant women/children?
We all know vaccines are not the only (if at all) cause of autism and so it is ridiculous to say that the rise is solely due to vaccines.
Liza- As I somewhat mentioned earlier, a few years ago many people were afraid to vaccinate and declined the MMR vaccine (I was one of them) and Im pretty sure there was a recorded rise in Measles. And like I said my daughter was personally and terminally affected by them. So how can you say that someone who is not vaccinated and may have the disease (fyi Measles is an extremely infectous disease) is not a risk to someone else who is not vaccinated. Of course it will pass, of course it is dangerous.

JMO
on August 12th, 2009

“I was not addressing any of my comments to any ONE person. ”

Actually Cara you were when you said this in your first post:

“And for the one comment I did read that said something like “I’ll vaccinate to not watch my child die and rather have my child get Autism,” is just a sick and horrible thing to say. You are saying that to countless parents out there who would give ANYTHING to “take away” their Autism, just disgusting. Shame on you who don’t understand. Stick with subjects that you know about and don’t go around pointing a finger at Jenny McCarthy, who has done more for us parents then any of you will ever know! ”

Obviously you were addressing me personally cause you used my quote from my comment by calling me sick and horrible. Well I’m sorry you feel that way but I stick to what I said. Even if that makes you mad or you find me “sick” and “horrible”. At the end of the day you our not my concern – my future well being of my child is!!

Sylvia –

Very much agree vaccinations have gotten out of control. When I was younger we did not get a chicken pox shot or flu shots we just dealt with those things if they happened. And in my very first post way above I stated that in my own situation that when it comes time to vaccinate my child I too will spread out the shots. I also don’t think it should be mandatory to recieve shots. I don’t bash parents who make the decision to not have their kids vaccinated but for me it’s a no brainer that my child is much safer vaccinated then not.

And for years vaccinations have been giving to children. We really don’t know what effects they may have on us many many years from now. But I survived them and so did all of my cousins, nephews, nieces, etc. The question is why now?? Why all of a sudden are large amounts of children getting autism? Why are so many children getting allergies?? The bottom line is who really knows for sure.

I think it’s just one of those things that will be debated for years and years because nobody really wants to give a definative answer.

But like I said it’s ashame so many kids are suffering but maybe it’s up to the parents to come together and figure out the alternatives on keeping our kids safe from getting life threatening disease while at the same time protecting them from things like autism.

jennifer
on August 12th, 2009

i just want to say i don’t agree with vaccines as a cause for autism. my reason for this is for one i went to a autism support group not to long ago where medical people came to talk about autism. they stated that vaccines have been ruled out for a cause of autism. plus if vaccines were the cause of autism they had tried to correct that and yet still many kids are turning up autistic. i have a 6 yr old autistic son and i can honestly say his is genetic. he has a half brother on his fathers side that has aspergers version. my son has a different type that is still in question on where he should be on the autism spectrum. just thought i would state what i know and my personal experience of this.

111. JMO— I definitely agree with you in that the rise in autism, allergies, and the likes will be debated for many, many years to come. I haven’t read through all of these comments, nor have I had to worry about making the decision to vaccinate or not, and nor do I know enough about Autism and possible causes to make a strong argument, but, generally speaking, I really think that contributing factors to the rise of autism and many other diseases/disorders/etc. are (among others, such as some of those I’ve read here) 1. improved technology, knowledge, and awareness on the subject has led to an increase in the ability to diagnose children and 2. environmental factors, such as hormones pumped into the food we eat, the amount of processed foods consumed, air quality, etc.

I praise and send well-wishes to all of you who are faced with the challenge of raising a child with autism, or any disability for that matter. I am sure the day-to-day is often a major struggle, but I hope for each of you that the good times far outweigh the bad.

homeschoolmama
on August 12th, 2009

To everyone here who has said “I will take my doctor’s word over hers. My doctor assures me that vaccines are not harmful”, I have only one word: Thalidomide.

10,000 children born deformed because of this supposedly-safe drug that was given to pregnant women to ease morning sickness. Yes, it was 40 years ago, and, yes (hopefully) there are better screening protocols in place today. However, the fact remains that it is not AT ALL uncommon for decades to go by before the disastrous results of a drug or intervention are truly well-understood and acknowledged. The first few years that Thalidomide was suspect, were, I’m sure, full of people who thought the link was overblown or that it was paranoid to think there was causation. Unfortunately, that’s the timeline for ANY horrible, yet subtle/nuanced/complex syndrome (like the vaccine-immune disorder/neurological problem potential link)’s cause to totally surface. It might be 10-15 more years before we really can definitely say. Until then, it makes sense to be cautious.

Anyone who is naive enough to think that the vaccine industry is not capable of cover-up, not self-interested enough to promote their agenda at the expense of public health is not familiar with the history of the nicotine and cigarette industry. The parallel should be PAINFULLY obvious – it was only a few decades ago that people were ridiculed for thinking that smoking causes lung cancer. After all, all the studies (released) at that time showed no link whatsoever. How many people died needlessly?

I think the reason autism is on the rise is because doctors are more informed about the disorder and are more quick to diagnose patients with it now than in previous times. In the past, autism was more often diagnosed as such things like mental retardation.

If vaccines cause autism, why hasn’t it affected all children in the same way. My family members and I have received countless vaccines over our lifetimes and no one has developed autism. But we have so far avoided horrible diseases such as measles, mumps, rubella, hepatitis A, scarlet fever and even the chicken pox.

I was born with a congenital disorder, so I know how it is to want to find a cause for what went “wrong” with your child. However, many times things just happen by random mutation and that’s that’s that. You have to move on and live life to the fullest regardless.

Sylvia
on August 12th, 2009

Through my many hours of research, here is the short version of what I have discovered:

Many children with autism have a genetic suseptibility to environmental toxins. So yes, the thousands of pesticides, plastics, and pollution that our kids are exposed to, as well as the toxins that are injected into them via vaccines. Another huge issue is the use of Tylenol at the same time of vaccines. Tylenol depletes glutathione, which the body needs to detoxify toxins. Pediatricians have been recommending Tylenol before and after shots for years. This issue is rarely addressed, but it is a huge player as well. Google “tylenol glutathione” or tylenol liver damage” for more info.

Most “medical people” are reluctant to address the vaccine/autism issue truthfuly. They just don’t like being part of that, and choose to more often quote from studies that don’t show a link. Many critics accuse them of conducting studies to side step the real questions, and I am one of them. The ol’ fox guarding the hen house problem. There can be many reason for a baby to regress into autism. But we can’t dismiss the link between vaccines and autism just because it is unpleasant. Let’s face it: babies who are babbling/talking, pointing, smiling, loving, and interested in the world, don’t just suddenly stop all of that without a biological reason. And the fact that this scenerio is happening in hundreds of thousands of homes accross the country means that some big change is taking place. This didn’t happen to this many kids a generation ago. New phenomena. Not supposed to be this way. Thousands of parents say it happend right after a round of shots. Why aren’t more people taking us seriousely? Because “medical people” say it is not so? Are there really parents out there that will believe industry over parents who are tyring to warn them of dangers in the system?

And I think most people weren’t suprised when Merck was found guilty of hiding study data that showed a higher death rate for people taking one of their blockbuster pain drugs (Vioxx), but the same people rush out and get their 11 year old daugthers vaccinated with Merck’s new blockbuster HPV vaccine because they believe Merck when they say it is safe? If they lie to make money on one drug, why on earth would you trust them with your child?

eternalcanadian
on August 13th, 2009

So agree with the delayed vaccine schedule and removing toxins from vaccines.

I discount anectdotal “evidence” as anything other than personal stories. It doesn’t prove anything. Give me long-term, wide-ranging studies, and then we’ll see. Besides, if vaccines cause autism, then why wasn’t there an explosion in autistim diagnoses when it first became common to vaccinate children, and when the vaccines really did contain mercury and thimoseral? I’m more willing to believe that pesticides, plastics, and other much more widely and unknowing ingested toxins are the cause of autism.

Mee
on August 13th, 2009

Sylvia- I did not know that about tylenol. Thanks for letting everyone know though, when I have children in the distant future, I hope I remember that. That is a good theory. Neither myself, nor any of my siblings have had a reaction to a vaccine, so we never took tylenol afterwords, but most people who say that their children developed autism after the vaccine also report that they had some kind of reaction. Maybe it is the combination of the 2, and not just the vaccines, that has something to do with causing a reaction that causes autism, since I don’t see any reasons why vaccines should cause it on their own.

Shelby
on August 13th, 2009

Interesting link about the Thalidomide Sylvia, I had heard briefly about that one. An interesting one that I researched was one that correlated the connection between those who have Alzheimer’s being the grandparents of the autism generation. Sounds out there but there is a LOT of interesting information regarding it within the links in our brains. Either way, I’m glad that there are those willing to dedicate the time, effort and money to move forward with research. Continuous knowledge will be all of the more helpful in the long run. I also agree with many of you that we may end up being the ones to blame because of the environmental connections with autism. Growth hormones, harmful PBA in plastics, unnecessarily powerful vaccines. Can we just get back the basics?

Rachel
on August 13th, 2009

I work with autistic children every single day so I accept all opinions simply because I go by the “how would I feel if it were me?”

It doesn’t mean I agree with all the opinions… I’ve just gotten very used to sitting back and listening with an understanding ear. I’ve had parents tell me that they KNOW it was vaccines that caused their child’s turn towards autism. I’ve had parents who told me they knew early on (way before those vaccines) that something was amiss but that things really turned around that time. I’ve had parents who don’t think the vaccines had anything to do with it and I’ve had parents who think the vaccines contributed to something that was already present in their child’s body. I even have a parent who has two autistic children… the youngest NEVER received a SINGLE vaccine.

But they all have the same thing in common and those are children who need parents to be their advocates and parents who don’t need to be arguing with one another over the cause.

Many are talking about the “rise” in the number of children with autism. Honestly… I don’t think there’s a rise at all. I see children in our classrooms who have sensory issues (issues that parents with a child diagnosed with full blown autism would balk at) who are diagnosed on the spectrum. People need to understand that there’s a large portion of children being diagnosed on the spectrum who truly have minimal issues and DO grow up to function just fine in society. And those children were around when I was a child as well… the boy in my kindergarten class who I remember well couldn’t or wouldn’t touch the sand or the dirt or anything gooey, and couldn’t stand loud noises, but otherwise was a perfectly nice kid who I graduated high school with… he would be diagnosed as having sensory issues today. Back then, he was just a “quirky” kid.

Personally I will be vaccinating my children. I agree with the individuals who say that they’d rather have a child on the spectrum than a child in the ground because they caught a deadly disease. And to those who say “it won’t happen” in these times and that kids are safe without vaccines now… in 2007 the Worldwide death rate from measles dropped from 750,000 to 197,000 (which is still high) due to vaccines… the US rate was the ONE rate to RISE. Of the 130 cases over half were parents who’d refused vaccines.

In 2008 there were 140 cases.

So saying that outbreaks cannot occur when the number of measles cases is rising every year is a farce.

Kate
on August 13th, 2009

Just a note for those looking at VAERS — it’s interesting to read, but completely unsubstantiated. Many “reactions” in it are initially attributed (by parents, patients, or doctors) to vaccines but are found upon review to be due to something else entirely, but they stay in the database anyway.

Jess
on August 13th, 2009

I am about to be a first time mother any day now and while I do plan on vaccinating my child, I do also agree that we should “Green our vaccines”. What harm could that do? I just wish there was a way of knowing in advance if your child will be sensitive to the vaccines (or anything else for that matter). I think what Jenny said was well put. She is not out to tell people what to do, she is just sharing her story and her thoughts. She is not discriminating against anyone who chooses to vaccinate, nor is she against it. There are certainly some children that are more sensitive to certain components of vaccines, foods, etc. And every mother needs to do what they feel is best for their particular child based on their sensitivities, autism, immune systems, etc. I know that I will be sharing as much information as I can to my friends and family and if possible others about my experiences no matter good or bad. That is what makes the mothers community thrive. Everyone deserves to get advice and opinions and have the option to incorporate what they feel may work for them in their personal lives.

Kasee
on August 13th, 2009

Tess,

The exact same thing happened to my cousin’s son. The thing is, he is a twin, and his brother got the same vaccines at the same time and he is fine so people use that as proof that it’s not vaccines. But I really think there is something to the idea that some are genetically more susceptible to being affected by vaccines. As for why the other twin didn’t have that reaction who knows, that’s medical odds for you. But I agree with you, the idea that the DAY AFTER he got his vaccine is when his autism magically decided to manifest physically seems much more than coincidental, and I do feel for your struggle when you experienced it and people try to tell you that one does not cause the other.

Sylvia
on August 13th, 2009

Well one of the big problems for many parents is that they don’t have a choice about vaccines for their children. Only a dozen or so states have a philosophical exemption that allows parents to opt out of certain vaccines, or all vaccines, based on their personal feelings about them.

I would think everyone would support everyone’s parental choice, but that isn’t how it is. The AAP (American Academy of Pediatrics) has stated that one of their top priorities is to abolish the philosophical exemption laws in the states that have them. (you can go to http://www.nvic.org to find out which states have them) I am lucky that I live in California, so I am not forced to vaccinate my son with the hepatitis b vaccine again.

Parents should not be strong-armed into vaccinating their kids. If a parent wants their child to have all vaccines except one or two, that should be their right. If they don’t want to risk any vaccine, that also should be their right.

But when you combine a corupt vaccine program with no parental rights, that is just wrong. Horrifingly wrong.

Maria
on August 13th, 2009

Having read Jenny’s opinions on vaccinations, I find that I do agree with her. My son is not autistic, but he had severe reactions to the vaccinations he received as an infant. We had to limit which vaccinations he received and eliminate some portions of them completely. This decisions was made after discussions with my son’s doctors and research into the effects that some vaccinations have on the immune system. I would urge every parent to do the research before subjecting your child to childhood vaccinations.

actualsize
on August 13th, 2009

Someday, probably not in our life time, we WILL be vindicated! Remember when Columbus said the earth was round and that called him a heretic? SAME THING HERE!

No, it’s not the same thing at all. There was evidence that the world is round, but there is no evidence that vaccines cause autism.

I think people hear the words “studies were done” but don’t really think about what that means. The epidemiological studies done today are incredibly statistically powerful. They’ve compared children who received the MMR vaccine with those who don’t, for example, and the rates of autism development are the same. That means something, doesn’t it? It means something to me.

And many studies, involving thousands of people, have compared children in different countries, some of which include thimerosal in their vaccines and some of which don’t. Again, there was no difference in autism development. When there are thousands of people, across multiple countries, wouldn’t you think that if there was a link, it would show up? That at least one of the many studies would turn up something?

Personally I trust evidence above gut feelings, or intuition, and that sort of thing. Then again, I’m not a mother, so maybe there’s something I don’t know.

Kate
on August 13th, 2009

People! If you’re not willing to deal with any and all potential issues kids can have- autism or other illnesses, for example- there is a simple solution:

Don’t. have. kids.

It’s not rocket science.

Sylvia
on August 13th, 2009

Oh, and I want to make one more comment. Many people have made the comment here that so many people were vaccinated so why isn’t everyone autistic?

First of all I want to underscore that the vaccine schedule tripled in 1989/1990.

If you were born BEFORE 1989, you recieved just a fraction of the vaccines that babies born after that date did. So most adults never had a vaccine (the hep b vax) at birth. At BIRTH! You would think some raging hepatitis b epidemic was going on if we started vaccinating babies that were only hours old. Nope.

And as I said in previous postings, genetic suseptibility and other environmental factors also come into play; Tylenol use, current viral infection while recieving vaccines, antibiotic use (antibitics kill good bacteria as well as bad. And you need good bacteria for a healthy immune response) and other toxic exposures.

Generation Rescue website has a good chart that compares the vaccine schedule from 1983 to the one in 2008.http://www.generationrescue.org/pdf/cdc1983.pdf It is pretty amazing. You can see that the odds are going to increase if you have a sensitivity to toxins, and that you may have skated by relatively OK in 1983, but in 2008 – no way!

And think about this: there are currently over 200 vaccines under development. How many more would you like to see added to the mandatory schedule? If you object to any vaccine, how will you like being ridiculed as “anti-vaccine”? What will be the magic number of vaccines being forced upon us, when the majority stands up and says “enough already!”? Will it even matter? Will people learn that they have long ago lost the most basic human right of being able t refuse biologicals being injected into their bodies against their will? The right to choose is very much in danger. It doesn’t exist at all in some states. The fact that many of you think vaccines are the best thing ever still doesn’t make the loss of freedoms any less horrible.

MammaDucky
on August 13th, 2009

The whole “pack protection” thing only works if MOST of the kids are protected. When you increase the number of children not immunized, it can start a snowball affect. That whole premis is for kids that cannot recieve vaccinations for health reasons. Their survival DEPENDS on everyone else being vaccinated, to protect them. So if you choose to not vaccinate your child, then send them to school with that child that cannot be vaccinated and your child passes some disease on to them..well, you can see where I’m going.
Yes, there are children that cannot be vaccinated. But before a parent jumps on the “NO VACCINE” bandwagon because you read something here or there, stop and think. Is it safer to delay vaccinations than to ignore them altogether? I think so. Don’t just close the door on vaccines. Protect your child, yes, but also think of the children who have no choice, who cannot be vaccinated. They’re counting on us to protect them.
I think Jenny McCarthy has made some extrememly reckless comments in the past. She’s settled some, but I feel that the damage has already been done.
Also, there is a good bit of evidence that her son was misdiagnosed. His symptoms started with seizures, and with the seizures treated, he improved. This falls more in line with Landau-Kleffner syndrome, which often is misdiagnosed as autism.
The whole Crystal child, Indigo Mom thing was bizarre as well.
Everyone Google Andrew Wakefield, the doctor behind the inital push against MMR vaccines.

Sara
on August 13th, 2009

Correlation is not causation. Lather, rinse, repeat.

I am appalled by vaccination hysteria, and I believe, with few exceptions, that parents who choose not to vaccinate are inherently selfish. Herd immunity. Look it up. While you’re at it, look up Andrew Wakefield; his 1998 MMR/autism study, which helped form the “MMR causes autism” controversy, has been soundly discredited.

To the poster who wrote: “Preservatives are bad in foods and can be just as harmful in vaccinations. I think in the US considering we are not a 3rd world country, unless you plan on traveling to one and being exposed, it isn’t necessary to vaccinate your child when they are very young. It is smart to space it out, you wouldn’t take certin drugs in combination and the same logic should be applied to vaccinating children.”

Preservatives aren’t always bad in foods; far from it. The preservatives used in foods have nothing to do with vaccinations. The US is not a third world country, but last time I checked, England and Scotland weren’t either. Check out the dwindling herd immunity in parts of those countries with respect to relatively common, preventable childhood illnesses like measles and pertussis (whooping cough.) Then listen to my sister, an ER doc, talk about attempting to resuscitate an infant dead from whooping cough. As for vaccine spacing, many, many scientific studies have failed to prove that vaccine overload causes immunological issues. There is no scientifically proven benefit to spacing vaccines.

I am a mother of three young children, and the sister of an autistic brother. There are relatively few topics of parental conversation that make my blood boil. Vaccination hysteria is one of them. Do your homework – get the facts, because they are what matter most. Not anecdotal evidence from strangers on the internet, or the opinions of a celebrity with no scientific background.

Sylvia
on August 13th, 2009

One of the few comments that I agree with Sara on is “Do your homework – get the facts, because they are what matter most.”

Don’t rely on information from the very people who make their living off of vaccines: manufacturers, pediatricians, and public health workers. They have all based their livilhood on the need for the vaccine program. That would be like asking the Pope on his views on birth control. You would need to look at ALL sides of the issue to get truely informed.

Find out what the risks are, then weigh those risks with the possible advantages. For example, the benefit of a vaccine for the measles would have a much greater advantage over a vaccine for a sexualy transmitted disease that a baby is not at risk for. Don’t think they are all the same. Choosing one vaccine and skipping another doesn’t make you anti-vaccine. Just an informed consumer.

Amy
on August 13th, 2009

Millions of children have been vaccinated and only a small percentage developed autism. I wonder if Jenny has ever stopped to think, “Maybe my son is just autistic and I should accept him as he is.” Instead, she is making claims, which have been disproved by science. Sometimes there are children with disabilities and we should accept them as they are, rather than try to come up with excuses or play the “blame game.” I think Jenny is mad because she wants to blame someone for her autistic child. Rather Jenny should be happy that she has a child at all. Sadly, some people in Hollywood alter truth to their own agenda. Jenny is one of these people.

Kerri
on August 13th, 2009

Doctors aren’t infallible, and yes, sometimes it does take the medical community a long time to decide that something is harmful. I’m not completely discounting medicine, but as a parent, I’ll have a say in my children’s medical treatment.

Personally, I plan on not giving my babies the Hep B vaccine at birth (as there is NO reason for it to be given then), and to stagger subsequent vaccines. Even if there’s no proof autism comes from vaccines, I’ll still err on the side of caution. From a common sense point of view, multiple vaccines at one time into one little body just doesn’t seem safe. Even adults have reactions to ONE vaccine.

Sara
on August 13th, 2009

Sylvia – medical professionals (like my father and sister, both physicians) and people in the pharmaceutical industry are just like you and me in that they, too, have children. Do you really think that the overwhelming majority are so sheep-like that they’re willing to look the other way – or even worse – buy into a vast conspiracy designed to further a vaccination agenda at the expense of public health – at the expense of their OWN children – in order to earn a living? Do you know how much the average public health care worker makes?

There is a risk involved with common childhood vaccinations, but that risk does not involve autism. And choosing one vaccine while skipping another does not always make one an informed consumer. I’m all about research – but again, research based on scientific evidence – not finger-pointing, hysteria, and a discredited study.

Alex
on August 13th, 2009

No offence to anyone, but a little bit of sympathy and understanding for Jenny and parents like her wouldn’t go amiss.

It’s so sad and sometimes actually offensive to see people who have no experience with autism dismiss it as virtually nothing. This isn’t even a vaccine point now. Most of the people who have said nasty things about Jenny or other parents on here clearly either have no experience with ASD or have children at all in some cases. I sincerely hope that none of you ever have to come into close contact with autism because I can guarentee you that you will eat your words and finally get why this is such a huge deal. And the saddest thing is that parents who already have kids with autism would welcome you to their world and support you with love and understanding, which is ironic considering there seems to be a complete lack of it towards them.

Something to think about….

JM
on August 13th, 2009

oh dear,
seriously credit to this woman for taking care of her son, loving him and trying to do what is right for him. but i do see this as quite a danergous issue when there is so little (some say no) evidence behind it.

personal stories, and individual experience aside, as it stands there is NO, and i mean NO real scientific evidence about there being a link between vaccines and autism. the original scare was caused by ONE high profile doctor claiming he had proof that there was a link. this turned out to be a lie, however, by that point many people had jumped on the bandwaggon. i promise, i know my stuff and there is a lot of confusion about this issue due to reports about how there is proof but honestly honestly there isn’t. what there is proof for is the danger of not giving your children vaccines at the appropriate age unless there is a genuine medical reason not to. kids NEED the MMR vaccine and it is dangerous not only for them but for other members of society if they don’t. you could be affecting other people’s kids by not giving them the vaccine not just your own.

second, if homeopathy is part of her son’s treatment, if you read up on it, and i mean genuine, non-biased, objective scientific reports on homeopathy, it is one of the biggest scams around in our society at the moment. homeopathy is essentially water. and sorry to hark on about this, but i am a big advocate for the truth especially when it comes to evidence and the truth, at the moment, we have no scientific evidence that homeopathy has any effect whatsoever on ANY illness. individual experience do not count as evidence, i’m sure if people are confused, it is not that difficult to look up what counts as scientific evidence.

i know people find these sorts of things hard to accept and with adults i say, it’s up to you. you spend your money and treat your health and well-being in the way that you want, it’s entirely up to you. but your kids? nope sorry, they deserve the best treatment they can receive and that just isn’t homeopathy. a parent deciding to give their kids homeopathic medicine instead of real medicine is similar to jehovah’s witnesses who choose to not allow their kids to have certain medical interventions such a blood transfusions because it goes against their own unfounded beliefs.

people are free to disagree with me, but remember we are all free to state our opinions…

Sylvia
on August 13th, 2009

Actually, the MMR has a very high rate of adverse reactions. The doctor who brought up the possibility of the combo shot of MMMR (which is Mumps, Measles and Rubella) was crusified by the medical community. He didn’t lie, they just didn’t like what he said. Epidemiological studies were quickly done to “disprove” this theory. But as it is, a small percentage of children who get the triple MMR vaccine get bowel disorders and autism. Not every kid, some kids. Instead of addressing this issue, and doing studies to find out why some kids have this reaction to this vaccine while most don’t, the entire issue is buried. They pretend it doesn’t exist. Well, it does exist. It is called autistic entercolitis, if anyone cares to google and learn more.

Would this happen to your child after the MMR? No one knows. You will just have to cross your fingers and hope not. Because any negative finding on vaccines are vigorously denied. Then buried. And unless they want to be ran out of town, few doctors have the guts to pursue such unpopular subjects.

GetYourFactsStraight – “Your children are not going to die of measles, mumps or rubella. Nor chickenpox. Nor polio because the only polio viruses running around the planet right now are vaccine-derived (WHO admits the recent outbreak in Africa is singularly due to a vaccine). Nor Hep B–show me a sexually promiscuous, drug-using newborn and I’ll show you a real reason to give a baby the Hep B vaccine on their birthday, otherwise, it’s is unnecessary.”

You can indeed die from measles, particularly if you are especially young, especially old, or your immune system is otherwise compromised.
Your son with mumps could end up with horribly painful, swollen testicles. He could even end up sterile.
Your daughter with chicken pox could end up in agony from shingles.
Your sister with rubella could deliver a stillborn infant with CRS.

Your children won’t die from polio. You did get that one right. That’s because WHO and UNICEF have virtually eradicated this disease – and that’s because of…wait for it…vaccination.

She is NOT telling people to not vaccinate their kids. She is telling people to make INFORMED DECISIONS. What’s wrong with that? Nobody really knows what causes autism. There are all kinds of theories out there, but nothing definitive. There are many things that are correlated to autism, though. Many different factors to look into.

People should never choose something for their family based on a celebrity’s opinion. But that’s not what she saying or asking people to do. She’s just asking people to do their research about vaccines. If you feel that it’s right for your family. That’s great. If you feel like changing the vaccine schedule is right for your family that’s great. Just make your decision based on research, not only what one doctor says about it, because doctors often don’t have the time to do the latest research on such things. Their practice keeps them quite busy.

Barb
on August 13th, 2009

You know, it angers me so that in America, we are not allowed to hear ALL of the facts in the news. I mean the TRUE facts, not what the CDC, Big Pharma, etc want you to hear. The CDC just admitted that the “studies” that they refer to that say “vaccines do not cause autism” are not really credible studies. Why is that not front page news???? What are they hiding???

Really new moms and women who are pregnant, please educate yourselves. Vaccines (along with other environmental factors) can and do cause autism, asthma, learning disabilities, ADHD, and the list goes on… There are pleny of credible studies to prove it. If you look, you will find them. Please, for your baby’s sake, educate yourself.

Jenny has NEVER said she was anti-vaccine. She, like many of us, are for safe vaccines.

One in 100 now (a CDC funded study) is autism’s new numbers. Wow, I cannot believe the government is not taking this more seriously.

Sara
on August 13th, 2009

Amen!!!! Autism’s numbers are very high. Why would they not take this more seriously?? I wonder what they are hiding???

Laura
on August 13th, 2009

For those of you who don’t get the Hep B vaccine at birth when do you give it to your child? Or do you not give it at all?

Also, regarding the tylenol being harmful…i thought it was recommended to give it to a child after a vaccine to prevent fever because a high fever can lead to a child having a seizure from the vaccine…or is that not true?

Sylvia
on August 13th, 2009

The hepatitis b vaccine would be best given when a person has risk factors for that disease. Mulitble sex partners and IV drug use are risk factors. Infants, toddlers, and grade schoolers don’t fall into those categories. The hepatitis b vaccine also has one of the highest rates of adverse reactions. Some countries have banned it. So weigh the pros and cons.

Giving Tylenol to prevent spikes of fever and discomfort is the reason for the recommendation. But Tylenol is so hard on the liver, it depletes glutathione which is exactly what the body depends on to detoxify what is IN the vaccines. And on top of that, some people naturally have lower stores of glutathione. Without testing, you can’t know whether or not your child is one of them. I would show great caution and not give Tylenol unless completely necessary. I would much prefer Motrin if it was necessary for fever or pain. Something to talk to your health professional with. But beware, they may have never considered this issue untill you mention it. But keep in mind that Tylenol overdose is the number one cause of liver failure in the U.S. It doesn’t take much more than the recommend dose to cause liver problems. This is a much more dangerous drug than people think.

I would urge all parents to investigate the risks of routine Tylenol use in babies.

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 13th, 2009

Sara,

I am talking about children who live in a modern, clean society with healthy food and clean water. How many children died of measles in the last ‘outbreak’ here in the states? (“So far this year, the CDC has confirmed reports of 64 cases in nine states. There were no deaths, but 14 people were hospitalized, said CDC spokesman Curtis Allen.”)That’s right…wait for it..none..zero deaths. WHO likes to toss around the measles virus as killing hundreds of thousands a year, when it is in fact poverty, lack of clean water and horrific nutrition among children that kill people in poverty-stricken countries.

Obviously there are complications with any disease, however the complications from the MMR are FAR more likely to occur. Yes, my son COULD end up sterile, but the odds of that are incredibly remote. And that would happen if I did not seek medical care for him if he became extremely ill from his mumps. These scenarios you put forth only contribute to the fear-mongering that has allowed the CDC to recommend dozens and dozens of shots before a child even reaches the age of 3.

As far as WHO eradicating polio. Sorry, nope. Polio is easily controlled by the use of clean, running water and NOT living in filth. Same with malaria. The WHO admits that the best defense against diseases like malaria are NOT a vaccine, but in fact sanitation. Poverty-stricken parents of children in India are contracting this disease because their children are literally shedding this live virus (after their polio vaccine)in their diapers and passing it on to their parents. As I stated before, the current polio outbreak in Africa in vaccine-derived. That is, it came from the vaccine, and the vaccine alone.

Sylvia
on August 13th, 2009

And let’s all not forget the astronomical amount of money that BigPharma spends of lobbying to get what they want:http://projects.publicintegrity.org/rx/report.aspx?aid=723
They even employ people to comment on discussion boards like this one. Swaying public opinion is part of the overall picture. They “educate” physicians, lobby politicians giving billions to both parties, they sponsor charities that are actually just fronts to promote their products. Don’t under estimate what multi-billion dollar companies will do to STAY multi-billion dollar comapnies.

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 13th, 2009

A bit news on the vaccine-derived polio outbreaks in the past few years.

“In 2003, the World Health Organization recommended discontinuing the use of live virus vaccine. But, the cost of switching to inactivated polio vaccine would present a financial hardship to poor nations, since the inactivated preparation costs about $2.00 to $3.00 per dose, while the OPV costs about 3 cents per dose.”

“Don’t under estimate what multi-billion dollar companies will do to STAY multi-billion dollar comapnies.”

EXCELLENT point, Sylvia.

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 13th, 2009

“the original scare was caused by ONE high profile doctor claiming he had proof that there was a link. ”

JM, I believe you are referring to Dr.Andrew Wakefield. Unfortunately, you are very misinformed about him and his research. Wakefield NEVER once told the public that there was a link between the MMR and autism. He NEVER claimed he had ‘proof’. He brought up a possible safety concern about a new MMR jab called Proquad (which was later pulled from the market due to ‘issues’ with the chicken pox part…yes, the ProQuad vaccine combined the MMR and the chicken pox…4 live viruses at once…incidentally, my son was given ProQuad..incidentally, he has autism AND encephalitis) and the media jumped all over that bandwagon.

The pharmaceutical industry is a multi, multi, multi, multi-billion-dollar-a-year industry. Dare to speak out against them and you might regret it.

Kate
on August 13th, 2009

Barb, where are these reputable studies? Could you please list them for me? Because I’ve done quite a lot of research (and I have access to databases that the average person does not), and I’ve never found one cited. I’m also curious why you trust the CDC’s study for autism numbers, but not their recommendations on vaccines?

GetYourFactsStraight, the reason the WHO recommends controlling malaria without vaccines is because there is no vaccine. Plain and simple. Furthermore, even if there was one, it would most likely not be cost-effective for the developing world (like the WC/rBS cholera vaccine, which is too costly for anyone but travelers…though it is still recommended by the WHO, despite cholera being incredibly easy to control with simply access to clean water and sanitation). I’m also curious if you’ve ever traveled to a malarial area? It has nothing to do with living in filth. When I was in rural Africa, I lived in clean tents, had clean (trucked in, bottled, or otherwise purified) drinking water, clean food, and showered regularly. But protecting yourself from malaria meant taking a daily oral prophylactic, covering from head to toe in clothing at sunset, making sure the tent was zipped at all times, and using bugspray liberally. And still, even with such a regime of “sanitation,” people get malaria. You also clearly know very little about these diseases, since mosquitos thrive in clean water — the cleaner the water, the more anopheles mosquitos (the kind that carry malaria). In fact, one of the first successful malaria control campaigns in Africa involving pouring oil over standing bodies of water to prevent breeding of the mosquitoes. Though it is possible to lower the prevalence of malaria with things like insecticide-treated bednets and DDT, the disease has nothing to do with sanitation.

I would still really be interested in seeing one large study (published in a well-respected peer reviewed journal) showing causation between autism and vaccines. Can anyone let me know where it supposedly exists?

So doctors, scientists, researchers, big pharm are willing to risk their own kids health? I mean these people are all exposing their children to these vaccines too and if its 1 in 100 I’m sure some of these people you accuse also have children with autism. If they don’t then you maybe on to something.

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 13th, 2009

Kate,

Environmental sanitation (from Wikipedia: “Environmental sanitation – the control of environmental factors that form links in disease transmission. Subsets of this category are solid waste management, water and wastewater treatment..”) has a huge impact on the transmission and perpetuation of malaria:

From the WHO website:
“Malaria
* Intensified irrigation, dams and other water related projects contribute importantly to this disease burden.
* Better management of water resources reduces transmission of malaria and other vector-borne diseases.”

From African-Tourism.org: “The collection of larvae which causes mosquitoes can be controlled by human beings, clean sanitation and environments e.g. empty cans, bottles, gutters, broken vehicles, pot hole bad roads, and slummy areas around water wastes were mosquito larvae infested mosquitoes….Malaria is an environmental and sanitation issue, which causes health problems that, can be exacerbated by prevention and reduction of lava control, clean and healthy environmental services. Malaria, like hypertension is a circulatory problem.”

I’m not sure what your point is in asking me whether I have ever visited a malaria-rampant area. Perhaps your time in Africa makes you feel that this somehow gives you more knowledge about this disease than me? A weak argument, at best.

FYI, there is a vaccine for malaria in the works. In fact, it is nearly through its final stages. So your statement that there is no vaccine for malaria is incorrect as well. Perhaps a bit more research on your part is in order? http://www.malariavaccines.org/

That’s the only one out there that I know of, sadly, as far as research into vax/unvaxed studies. I don’t believe there is anything in a peer-reviewed publication. Frankly, if Big Pharma and our own CDC wished to end this ‘myth’ that vaccines are safe, they should really look into doing a 3rd-party, unbiased study like this one. Anyone wonder why they won’t? I have a good guess. They won’t like the results.

Sara
on August 13th, 2009

I’m not the one doing the fear-mongering here; I’m presenting facts. Children can die from measles – did you read the painful comments from an above poster (Jane) about the death of her child? Where does she live again? In a slum? No – the UNITED KINGDOM.

As for seeking care for your son should he become ill with the mumps – guess what, it’s a virus, and there is no specific treatment for mumps. Meaning, seeking treatment does not guarantee he would not develop complications. Again – not fear-mongering – facts. You might want to change your user name. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mumps

Malaria is rampant in slum-ridden countries with poor sanitation. It’s also rampant in areas of those countries with good sanitation. And there is no vaccine against malaria; it’s not wise to build an analogy where none exists. Polio was eradicated in Western countries because of widespread vaccination. Plain and simple.

As for your words on Andrew Wakefield, he is pretty much reviled in the medical community. You want to talk bias? How’s this for ethics – Wakefield took money from vaccine litigants for his study, and then doctored the data to create a causation that does not exist. Again – facts. Look it up.

And yes, Elzbieta, that’s why my father, a respected pediatrician of over 40 years, vaccinated all six of his own children (including one with autism) has vaccinated hundreds of other children, and continues to do so to this day. Because he’s being paid big bucks by “Big Pharma” and has no ethics whatsoever. Forget about “first, do no harm” – way more important to him to satisfy the agendas of the drug companies.

There are risks and benefits involved with many of life’s situations. My husband risks being killed in a car accident on his way to work every day. But the risk is small compared to the greater benefit – he earns a paycheque. Vaccines are no different. For the most part, the risks are small, and the benefits to individuals and communities are great.

And for the final time – there is no scientifically proven link between MMR and autism. For ten years, various groups have tried – and failed – to produce a scientific link. No one has found a scientific link – not because of a vast conspiracy to disprove it on the part of government, the medical community, and pharmaceutical companies – but because it simply does not exist.

Kate
on August 13th, 2009

I’ve read the Burbacher et. al. study already. The conclusion of the study is that the methylmercury threshold is most likely not the same for ethylmercury (thimerosal). There is nothing conclusive linking autism or developmental disorders and thimerosal.

On the other side, however, there have been numerous studies published (in peer reviewed journals) that find no causation (and often no correlation) between vaccines and autism. A few: Schechter and Grether (2008), Stehr-Green, Tull, Stellfeld, Mortenson, and Simpson (2003), Madsen et. al. (2003). In addition, there have been large population studies done in England (Taylor, Miller, Lingam, Andrews, Simmons, and Stowe, 2002) and Finland, the latter following 1.8 million children over 14 years. Those are just a few of the big ones, but there are dozens of others as well, and even more if you consider animal-based studies and those peripherally related to the issue, like the Burbacher. And they all show the same thing — no causation, and very often, no correlation either.

Erika
on August 13th, 2009

I totally agree with you, Sara! Well said.

Sylvia
on August 13th, 2009

Sara, Dr. Wakefield didn’t take money from vaccine litigants, the hospital he worked for did. It was disclosed. It was only brought up years later to try to discredit him. Look up witch hunt in the dictionary and there you have it. If he is reviled in the medical community, it is because he has guts when most others would have caved into the pressure to alter their findings. The funny thing is that he is pro vaccine. He vaccinated his own children without question. But he merely reported that a subset of children were regressing into autism and bowel disease after a triple live virus vacccine, and perhaps this warrants further research. He suggested that it might be a good idea to give the M-M-R in separate doses while the triple vaccine was studied further. Oooooh-weeeeee did that ever go over badly with the medical community! That just simply is NOT allowed! No one questions a vaccine’s safety and gets away with it.http://www.cryshame.co.uk//index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=53&Itemid=71
The real life kids who DID regress into autism and bowel disease deserve research into what happened to them. And research into finding them help for their conditions. That seems to besides the point in so many of these discussions. But Dr. Wakefield didn’t turn his back on them. And for that he is paying the price.

Kate
on August 13th, 2009

Also getyourfactsstraight, I’m well aware there’s a vaccine in the works. It takes years and years to get from the “near the final stages” to mass producing a vaccine for human consumption. There are studies and tests, and most importantly for this issue, it takes a very high success rate/low adverse reaction rate (and often a low price tag) to get a green light from the WHO. The vaccine does not exist today — it’s not being used anywhere. So yes, I am correct in saying that there isn’t a malaria vaccine.

And sorry, but I think someone who is getting their information from wikipedia and african-tourism.org is hardly qualified to critique my sources. My travel to Africa gave me first hand experience with how difficult it is to protect yourself from malaria and how adequate sanitation is certainly not enough — something you don’t seem to know, since you appear to think it is enough. Malaria is not a “sanitation” issue in the way that the word is usually used. It has nothing to do with clean water (as I pointed out, quite the opposite) and human waste isn’t a vector. Cleaning up standing water will help, but that’s not a sanitation improvement itself, though it often comes with sanitation improvements. Also, you are misinterpreting the meaning of environmental sanitation. It focuses mainly on water quality, sewage treatment, etc. Dams do have to do with water, certainly, but they have increased malaria because they provide large amounts of standing, relatively clean water. This isn’t a sanitation issue by the classical definition, though it certainly does increase the disease risk.

danielle
on August 13th, 2009

Japan stopped using Thermosal in the vaccines given to Children. The Autism rates didn’t drop. What about preservatives in foods? Or what about the drugs they gave mothers in the 60’s? They have a link between Celiac disease and Autism in certain children? What if Autism is an autoimmune disease that impairs the brain? As I special education teacher, I can’t figure out why a couple of my students have a diagnosis of Autism. They are social and excellent verbal skills but they are in a self contained room. Autism should be a medical diagnosis but a school can diagnose your child with Autsim. How many people knew that?

These types of stories are suppresed here – you are not going see this on World News Tonight. But this boy exists none the less. Most kids who regress after the MMR do not have brain biopsies, so it is impossible to know how many of them have active measles infection in their brains. But no ones knows why, or how to prevent it from happening to YOUR baby. I only know that pretending it isn’t happening won’t get us anywhere.

danielle
on August 13th, 2009

Sorry, Every child with an IEP in the United States is required by law to have a reevaluation done. Parents can refused to sign the papers to have their children retested. In the day age of high stake testing, parents are refusing to get their kids a full battery of test becuase they special accomodatiosn for testing. All children are retested and some are exited from special education programs.

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 13th, 2009

Kate,

Pardon me…perhaps when you said there isn’t a malaria vaccine (stated quite emphatically by you, I might add), I should have taken that to mean that you KNEW there was one. Forgive me for not being able to read your mind. I also quoted you some WHO stats..perhaps you would like to contradict those?

I never once said that water sanitation is all that is required to combat malaria–but I believe that is the BEST way to combat this disease…”something you don’t seem to know, since you appear to think it is enough.” Hmm, I don’t recall saying that is was…perhaps you should stop misinterpreting my words.

Sylvia
on August 13th, 2009

This website was launched in response to Amanda Peet’s comments about all the great studies done:

Getyourfactsstraight, you need to take your name to heart. There isn’t a malaria vaccine. There is one in development. It’s a huge difference. “In development” means the vaccine is years and years from being able to be given to actual people (not in studies) and may not ever reach that stage. To me, that means there is no malaria vaccine.

And I’m glad that you can blindly quote facts from the WHO. You don’t seem to understand what those quotes mean, however, or have any interest in reading what I wrote when I explained them to you.

Sylvia
on August 13th, 2009

OK Kate, what exactly is your point? Your last comment seems to be awfuly hostile to another commenter. Why is that necessary?

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 13th, 2009

Kate,

LOL, my humble apologies for contradicting the words of an obvious ‘expert’ on sanitation and malaria…how shame-faced I am right now! Shave a few inches off that ego of yours.

I never once stated the vaccine was available–this by no means negates the fact that it is out there–in the LAST stages of trials and extremely close to being distributed. You wish to argue pointless semantics over the usage of the word ‘vaccine’….if it is not currently available to the public, then it must not exist? Feel free to debate that in a philosophy class, but not here.

This vaccine is not ‘years and years’ away from being made public…most likely it will be available in the next 2 1/2 years.

Sara
on August 13th, 2009

One more thing and then I have a newborn to feed (I’m sorry, but this really raises my ire) – “I am talking about children who live in a modern, clean society with healthy food and clean water. How many children died of measles in the last ‘outbreak’ here in the states? (”So far this year, the CDC has confirmed reports of 64 cases in nine states. There were no deaths, but 14 people were hospitalized, said CDC spokesman Curtis Allen.”)That’s right…wait for it..none..zero deaths. WHO likes to toss around the measles virus as killing hundreds of thousands a year, when it is in fact poverty, lack of clean water and horrific nutrition among children that kill people in poverty-stricken countries.”

Good point (sort of.) Why is it that in the US, measles is not endemic? Why is it that the CDC can confirm only 64 cases in nine states? Is it because of clean water? Sanitation? Healthy food?

No. It’s because of herd immunity…and what causes herd immunity? Vaccinations. Not clean water, not lack of poverty, not sanitation, not good food. None of those prevent measles; even immunologically healthy people can acquire measles. The ONLY source of prevention is vaccination.

Elizabeth
on August 13th, 2009

Amen Kate!
Getyourfactsstraight honestly the more you comment the more uneducated and ridiculous you sound. I didn’t realize Wikipedia was a valid source….

Erika
on August 13th, 2009

Kate, I also agree with you. And I don’t know why you are getting attacked for stating an opinion/facts.

GetYourFactsStraight.
on August 14th, 2009

Sara,

I’m really, truly wondering what ‘facts’ you would like me to look up concerning Dr. Wakefield? Your allegations that he took money are completely unsubstantiated and totally false….anyway, what Syliva said..there’s no point in rehashing it.

As for my son, IF he caught mumps and IF he had complications to them: “About 20-30 percent of males who contract mumps after puberty will develop an infection of the testes (Orchitis). While there may be a reduction in sperm count following this infection, sterility is rare.” RARE. Do you not get that?

No one, including myself, here is saying that these illnesses do not come with risks, but as I stated before, I will trust my son’s immune system over the RARE likelihood of sterility due to mumps over vaccine-induced autism (FYI my firstborn son, damaged beyond repair by his MMR, will never have children anyway due to his disability BECAUSE of the MMR….oh the irony). I am truly heartbroken for Jane. All I know is that vaccines let her and her precious children down in numerous ways. I find your attempt to use her dead child to make you case truly disgusting.

“And for the final time – there is no scientifically proven link between MMR and autism.” While I highly dispute this, do you not realize that there is also not a single study DISPROVING it? If you have a link, by all means, please provide it. The fact that your father is a doctor gives your argument no additional credibility…why on earth would it?

Sara
on August 14th, 2009

The allegations against Wakefield aren’t mine; they come from the scientific community. Wakefield is a charlatan, his biased researched has been discredited, and his defenders have twisted the facts to support their agenda.

I am very sorry for your son. But as a previous poster (a mother with two autistic children) said about Jenny McCarthy, you appear to see autism through his eyes only. You’re the expert on your son. You aren’t the expert on vaccines, science, or autism, and living with an autistic child does not grant you scientific credibility.

As the sister of an autistic brother, I am also not an expert and any theories my family may have as to what caused his autism are just that – theories. My family accepted long ago that Callum is who he is, and that in our collective lifetime, we may never have the answers we want. Want. Not need.

Additionally, the fact that I referenced my father being a pediatrician was not an attempt to bolster my credibility; it was in response to Elzbieta’s post – “So doctors, scientists, researchers, big pharm are willing to risk their own kids health? I mean these people are all exposing their children to these vaccines too and if its 1 in 100 I’m sure some of these people you accuse also have children with autism. If they don’t then you maybe on to something.”

And finally – “And for the final time – there is no scientifically proven link between MMR and autism.” While I highly dispute this, do you not realize that there is also not a single study DISPROVING it?” – There are also no studies proving that the moon is not made of green cheese. There are also no studies proving that dogs are not cats. There are also no studies proving that the sun will not rise tomorrow morning. I may believe that my toaster will explode when I make toast today, but every study in the world conducted on my toaster attests to its efficacy and safety; does that mean I should not believe that my toaster is safe, because there is not a study disproving it?

Numerous scientific studies have been conducted in an attempt to find MMR/autism causation – none exist because it does not exist.

Kate
on August 14th, 2009

“’And for the final time – there is no scientifically proven link between MMR and autism.’ While I highly dispute this, do you not realize that there is also not a single study DISPROVING it? If you have a link, by all means, please provide it. The fact that your father is a doctor gives your argument no additional credibility…why on earth would it?”

Please reference my previous post citing numerous studies that showed no link between autism and vaccines. A study can’t disprove something that doesn’t exist (they don’t work that way, as Sara says); instead, they can find an absence of statistical proof for such a link. If someone conducted a study to see if the moon was made of cheese, the findings would be an absence of statistical proof. Unfortunately, I cannot provide links to the studies because I have access to them through private databases. If you google them or have access to a university or good public library system you may be able to read them that way, or at least get a summary. Unfortunately, most peer-reviewed science journals are not free.

Finally, Getyourfactsstraight, stating that “there is a vaccine,” at least in the field of public health, means that there is a vaccine that can be given to humans now. It does not mean the vaccine exists in very early stage restricted trials or in research in a lab somewhere. There is a huge difference, and you’d be hard pressed to find a single public health expert who would say that there is a malaria vaccine right now. Most would agree that there may be one — perhaps even that there will be one — but not that there is one. And yes, these things do matter a lot, since the presence or absence of a vaccine has a major effect on how public health actors treat and prevent a disease, so it’s not just semantics that should be debated in philosophy class.

Mykala
on August 14th, 2009

Everytime this woman opens her mouth, I shudder. I will repeat, repeat, repeat: One CANNOT be “CURED” from autism! I feel sorry for parents/caregivers out there who look up to her and take her at her word. Maybe Evan was mis-diagnosed? There is NO CURE for Autism!

Sarah M.
on August 14th, 2009

Alex – By stating that I haven’t seen any proof that there is a link to autism and vaccines, I’m not trying to discount what the parent of an autistic child has to go through daily, nor have sympathy with them for their struggles. I’m simply saying that I disagree as to how their child got the autism. I understand how incredibly hard autism must be to deal with (I worked with an autistic child for a short time), simply from reading numerous known facts about autism and how people who have that disease are typically prone to act. Saying that I shouldn’t be able to say my feeling/opinions regarding the subject because I don’t have a child with autism is like saying I can’t read a story about how someone was severely burned and have sympathy them and for how much that must have hurt to be hurt in such a way, simply because I never have had that happen to me.

I really, really need to stop reading the comment section on CBB!!!!!

Rachel
on August 14th, 2009

Getyourfactsstraight,

“I am talking about children who live in a modern, clean society with healthy food and clean water. How many children died of measles in the last ‘outbreak’ here in the states? (”So far this year, the CDC has confirmed reports of 64 cases in nine states. There were no deaths, but 14 people were hospitalized, said CDC spokesman Curtis Allen.”)That’s right…wait for it..none..zero deaths. WHO likes to toss around the measles virus as killing hundreds of thousands a year, when it is in fact poverty, lack of clean water and horrific nutrition among children that kill people in poverty-stricken countries”

If this were indeed the case and sanitation, NOT measles had so much to do with hundreds of thousands of individuals dying of measles each year, and the vaccine could not possibly make a difference, then how in the world is it that between 2001 and 2008 as the number of vaccines in the countries with the most deaths has increased, the death rate has dropped from 750,000 individuals to 197,000… it dropped EIGHTY PERCENT!

I think that speaks for itself.

And how… in the United States, one of the “wealthy” “clean” countries in the nation, has the number of yearly measles cases INCREASED for the past several years while everyone elses drops?

Did you know that out of the 140 cases of measles last year they know that OVER half of them were children whose parents had chosen not to have them vaccinated. The others were patients whose records they were unable to obtain.

There may very well have be no deaths this year or last… but you watch, if the numbers continue to rise, deaths will become inevitable.

Alex
on August 15th, 2009

Sarah M – I’m not sure if your comment was actually directed at me, since there is another Alex who comments on CBB, but I’ll answer assuming that it was me you were talking to!

I don’t think that someone with no experience with autism CAN’T comment or CAN’T have sympathy with parents, but there is a distinct line between that and hurling abuse at parents for making a very personal and considered choise to not give their baby the MMR. I have however, seen a distinct lack of understanding about what it means to love and parent a child with autism. The parents with ASD children, who so bravely shared their stories on here, were not entirely treated with the respect they so badly deserve. Some of the comments on this thread (I’m not saying yours, there’s just too many to list the names and I don’t want to inflame the situation) have been deplorable. There are unfortunately, people who believe their opinion about giving the MMR is the only right one and any who disagree are sick and wrong. This is not the case. Every parent needs to do what is right for their family and their child. And they have the right to do that without risking getting verbally abused by strangers on a website. I commend everyone for sharing their views on this, some clearly more respectfully than others.

Jen
on August 15th, 2009

I’m willing to bet that you folks doubting the credibility of scientific studies done showing no link between autism and vaccinations would suddenly give credence to said studies if they supported your point of view; that suddenly these researchers weren’t being “bought”. You can’t pick and choose based on what you agree with and what you don’t. Either these studies are valid or they’re not, regardless of their findings.

There have been multiple studies in multiple nations using differeing date sets, and different funding sources, and not one as shown a link.

Btw, to the person above who commented on cirumcision? Jenny McCarthy had her son circumcised because she wanted him to have a “pretty penis”.

Sarah M.
on August 17th, 2009

I would encourage everyone to go to http://www.autismbites.com. It is the web page belonging to John and Robin Kirton. They have 6 children ranging from 3 to 14, all of them have autism. :)

TJ
on August 17th, 2009

Sarah M- I looked at the website do you know anything else about the family? I am curious why they didn’t get them all diagnosed until so late ( a year after their 6th child was born) it didn’t really say on the website so I am just wondering if you had heard about them before? Not trying to knock them just really curious about their story! Thanks!

Sarah M.
on August 17th, 2009

TJ – I don’t know much about them other than what’s on their website. I say a portion of their show, too, but I don’t think much else was said that isn’t on their site. I didn’t hear of them until I saw that their show was going to be on on TLC. I actually tried e-mailing them (to ask their thoughts on this topic) from their contact space on the site, but my computer wouldn’t let me. I am going to google them, too, to see if I can learn more from other places… I just put it here because they obviously have a LOT of experience with autism. I also wasn’t sure if anyone else had heard of them.

Sarah M.
on August 17th, 2009

‘Extreme Makeover: Home Edition’ (ABC I believe), apparently built a house some time ago for a family that has 5 autistic children. I don’t know anything else about that, though.

Sarah M.
on August 18th, 2009

Last one for now, sorry!

TJ – Here’s a link that I found that has was appears to be an interview/story with the Kirton’s. They go into a bit more detail than I was able to find on their website. I hope it gives you some of the information you were looking for. :)http://www.autismtoday.com/articles/Autism%20x%206.asp

michele
on August 18th, 2009

We forget how dangerous many of these illnesses are because they haven’t been around for sometime because of vaccines.
As for the Law and Order episode, it is not too far from the truth. A very similar thing happened to a friend’s child and nearly died.

EJmom
on August 18th, 2009

I just think it’s a shame that we’re wasting time on something that medical research has proven to be untrue. Why don’t we divert our time and energy to finding out what really DOES cause autism instead of wasting it on vaccines, which obviously DON’T.

And if Jenny’s son was “cured” of autism, he didn’t ever have it in the first place. It’s a condition like MS or cystic fibrosis, not a disease like the flu or an infection. It can’t be cured, only treated.

Laurie
on August 18th, 2009

Despite what you think of Jenny herself, I think her message is important: that parents should always educate themselves on everything regarding their kids and feel free to exercise their right to freedom of CHOICE and DISSENT. When we as parents are bullied into a particular choice because it is the popular thing at the time, this strips us of freedom at the most basic level. Even worse is when parents are admonished for even asking questions. When doctors and the AMA are seen as gods that should never be questioned, this is exactly when we need to take a look behind the curtain!

Many medications and, in fact, vaccines (like DPT) have been recalled for causing deaths and damage even after passing safety trials. Now, every year they are adding more shots to the vaccine schedule. I believe 72 shots in all in the first 3 years, usually 4 at a time, including Hep B (an STD!!) at birth! That is just crazy.

Ask your doctor next time where are the radomized controlled studies showing the safety of the all of the combined vaccines on the current schedule for babies. THERE ARE NONE! Where are the studies showing the safety of injecting aluminum into kids (a neuro-toxin, used to make vaccines more effective)? Nope none. Doctors have a lot of valuable training, but are definitely NOT trained to question anything a pharmaceutical company manufactors – they can only prescribe it.

I did not see the Law & Order episode, but I know that the Private Practice episode on measles was designed in collaboration with the AMA. Who, by the way, gets hefty donations every year from Merck and other big pharma. The non-vaxing parents were shown as dowdy hippies and measles as a deadly plague. Interesting, since measles was a common childhood illness not long ago, much like chicken pox.

When parents ask questions and demand answers, that’s when we see positive change. Like the removal of lead-paint on kids toys and BPAs in baby bottles. You should never turn over the well being of your child 100% to a doctor, an actress, a company or public opinion.

Madalyn
on August 18th, 2009

I think it’s amusing that the people who are against Jenny’s comments say they can’t take her seriously because she’s a hollywood actress, but are siting a dramatic TV show as their “resource” on why you should vaccinate. Most of the people against Jenny’s comments say she’s uniformed and uneducated, but it’s obvious that they didn’t even get the point of what she says, and they themselves have no facts to present in defense of their arguments. This woman is working alongside doctors, therapists, and nutritionists to find the best solution for kids who can benefit. Since those in favor of vaccinating think doctors know everything, maybe you should consider that. Even the doctors will tell you that they don’t know what causes autism, and it’s the specialists and parents living with it who are the experts. Jenny is spreading some really great information (if you actually read it and GET it!), and it is our individual responsibility to educate ourselves for our kids.

Deborah
on August 18th, 2009

When I had my first child, it was in the middle of the first round of “do vaccines cause autism?” I had to really search the available information and my soul to decide the right thing to do. Then I read the story of a woman who had lost or nearly lost (sorry, I don’t remember) her unborn baby because she was exposed to an unvaccinated child who was carrying pertussis, and the pertussis germs passed to her baby. This is a common problem — fetuses and young, not-yet-vaccinated babies are very vulnerable to diseases. If older kids are vaccinated, they don’t pass these diseases on. I decided that protecting my children, and the unborn and recently-born children of others, from deadly diseases was more important to me than heeding the advice of what turned out to be a shoddy researcher with severe conflicts of interest. My kids are vaccinated, though I did delay HepB somewhat (not a risk with casual contact). I’m glad I made this decision, especially considering how bad the research “showing” connections between autism and vaccines has turned out to be.

I do go to great lengths to find thimerosal-free (not low-thimerosal, but truly thimerosal-free) flu vaccines when my family gets flu shots. They are increasingly available, but you have to ask careful questions. Mercury is a known risk, and we’re not messing with it. But pertussis and other diseases are a far greater risk than today’s thimerosal-free vaccines.

Robyn
on August 18th, 2009

Jenny McCarthy is free to say whatever pleases her. HOWEVER, since she is NOT A MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL, I think I will do my own research rather than taking her word for it thankyouverymuch. Who gets their medical advice from a celebrity? DUMB.

Isa
on August 18th, 2009

I have a 4 year old daughter who has had about 3 vaccines. Since her birth she has been diagnosed with Lyme disease, candida, seizures, leaky gut and severe food allergies. I decided to wait until she was 1 to begin vaccinating at a slower schedule. Her pediatrician pushed for the MMR but at the time she was allergic to eggs and its cultured in eggs. I refused it because every bone in my body told me not to give her the MMR. I left his practice after that.

I now go to a pediatrician who does not push me on vaccines. We have had extensive blood work done on myself, my husband and my daughter and our immune systems do not get rid of toxins/poisons dumped by vaccines like other peoples immune system. We know now that my daughter’s immune system would have definitely been overtaxed/overloaded had we stuck with the normal vaccine schedule.

Every child has a different immune system and to say that all children should be able to handle all the vaccines is wrong.

I can tell you we do not vaccinate in our household nor will we.
Mothers, listen to your intuition. A mother knows best.

Michelle
on August 19th, 2009

I’m going to chime in here with my own opinion. At that’s just what is, an opinion. I think that most vaccines in general are safe these days. It’s the way they are administered that can cause the problems. When a child goes in for vacs it is not unusual for them to get 3 or 4 shots each of which can contain multiple vaccines. These vaccines basically give your child a very small dose of the disease to fight off and create immunity. When in nature would a child ever catch all those diseases at once? It’s just too much for their little bodies to fight off. A lot of people believe that many of the disorders on the autism spectrum are brought on by this over taxing of the immune system. My daughter was born 2 months premature, plus she has a structural brain abnormality. Her Ped. pushed to follow the normal vac. schedule for her. At 2 months of age it would have been the same as giving a newborn those 3 or 4 vaccines. I said no way. She is 20 months old now and we switched Peds. a good while ago. The new one was willing to spread the vaccines out. She is now up to date with everything except the MMR. If we can manage to find seperate vaccines for each component, then I have no issue with her getting the vaccines, seperatly and space out. If not she can wait until school age to get the combo vaccine. If, Lord forbid, she should ever show signs of an Autism disorder I want to know that it is NOT because of something that I allowed to be put into her body.

Deb
on August 19th, 2009

We’re waiting until our son is 5 years old to get the MMR and maybe the ChickenPox vax. These are the only two LIVE vaccines that they get. The rest are killed vaccines. Not to mention that the chickpox vax has HUMAN DNA in it! Hopefully he’ll catch the chickpox in the next few years, so then he will have lifetime immunity (the vax doesn’t give you that). Also, in a few years they’ll have the MMR available in separate components, which is another thing we’re watiting for. Three live viruses at once can definitely overwhelm the immune system. Having the ability to get the M-M-R in 3 separate shots will be much better. The Vaccine Book by Dr. Sears was very enlightening. Not against vaccines, but DEFINITELY educate yourself!!!

I have 2 children with special need my 4 yo has PDD-NOS and my 19 mo was dx with infantile spasms which is a side effect from the dTap vaccine she still gets her vaccines but not the dTap one until we get the ok from the nero, I can not say that my 4yo got pdd from vaccines but I can say it about my 19mo and it is state in the cdc website that infantile spasm (a severe rare form of epiliepsy) can occur after the dTap, there is no right or wrong answer here just go with ur gut feeling.

Mama Bear
on August 19th, 2009

BREE–You’re an OT. Stick to your therapy. I’m an MD. I went to medical school, I know what I learned (and did not learn) while I was there. We learn about infectious diseases including the vaccines that prevent them and SAVE LIVES. And yes, we even learn about autism (and more than 5minutes worth of info, TESS!). We are not just pupputs for “Big Pharma”. The vaccine schedule is based on years, and years, and YEARS of research and it is fine-tuned CONTINUOUSLY based on updated safety and study. Don’t shrug off MD’s advice because you think we don’t know what we’re saying or have sold out to corporate America. I didn’t bust my butt all those years to be an ignornant pill pusher, let alone put kids in harm’s way. And I certainly didn’t do it to be less informed than my patients. Some respect please.

Karen
on August 20th, 2009

I have read most of the comments on this topic. I believe Jenny’s contributions have at least made parents’ aware of the vaccine schedule. I was so upset that my Grandson received SIX vaccines (shots) at one time. Can you imagine that for a 13 month old baby? We have noticed he is a bit hyperactive for three years old, but the doctor said he was normal.

Who would give a 22 pound baby three shots in each thigh? THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT!

Nacole
on August 23rd, 2009

I read Jenny’s book “Mother Warriors” and it gave alot of information. It isn’t just about her “reading up” on things, it’s actual changes that she had made, speaking to DAN (Defeat Autism Now) Dr’s and speaking to other parents that have austic children. I encourage all mommys to read this book, even if your child isn’t autistic. It’s very informative. I think that my son might be autistic and have made some slight changes already, until I can get him tested. I no longer give my son (who is 14 months old, same age as Jennys son when he got his MMR vaccination) Tylenol because of the glutathione issue in autistic children. My son only gets Motrin. My son has other underlying health issues that go hand in hand with autistic children, such as the ability to not be able to break down the protein in dairy and wheat. I have decided for MY son, that he will get his vaccines ONE at a time and not all at once. Also, to make sure that the vaccines aren’t live viruses either. It’s my job to protect my son as much as I can. I applaud Jenny for fighting for her son, as well as every other Mommy/Daddy, for they ARE our future and they are defenseless, innocent and amazing creations. All I ask is that people not criticize/slander Jenny until they do read her “Mother Warriors” book. They will then understand what she has gone through, be able to look up the websites, understand what all the parents have gone through. The stories are amazing, heartbreaking but also very informative, as I stated before. I cried while reading the book cause it touched my heart and sometimes broke my heart but I thank Jenny McCarthy so very much for publishing this book and having the spine and stamina TO stand up for her son and all the others out there. Thank you Jenny!

Lee
on August 26th, 2009

Hello,

IN my opinion, my child was damaged by vaccination. He had a fit and zoned out. His Temperature reached well over the safe window and I put him in a the shower ran cool water over him while I phoned emergency services. He was unconscious but his eyes were open. You have no idea how scared you feel. When someone says We don’t know what is wrong, sends us to get x rays etc. They put him on antibiotics.
I vomited from the fear, I had to lay down because I was going to pass out . I feel I failed my son and did not protect him.
Vaccines are able to infect the children that are not vaccinated. They can reintroduce diseases into society that have nearly become extinct. So it is not the unvaccinated children causing the problem, it is the child who associates with the vaccinated children that are at risk. If you do not believe me do some real research. Ask a scientist who developed a vaccine and is willing to talk to tell the truth.
After all I have said I do believe in vaccines but there is a safer and more effective method. Homeopathically. To Europeans Homeopathy is mainstream medicine, do they know something we don’t???
How long before all children become victims of vaccines because their immune system no longer knows how to fight common childhood illnesses? They way homeopathy works is by challenging the immune system to become stronger.

Thanks to homeopathy my son is doing very well and you wouldn’t be able to tell he had suffered as much as he had.

My question is this, you hear all about what’s in vaccinations but nobody can tell me why they put mercury in flu vaccinations. What is the purpose of using Mercury in our vaccinations if in fact these can possible cause Autism and Alzheimer’s disease? If Mercury is bad what is the purpose for using this in our vaccinations can anyone explain this to me.

Thanks,

Jeannie

Tom
on October 18th, 2009

I was never vaccinated and I am very healthy with a strong immune system, alkways have been. My wife received the usual vaccines and sffers from various problems with weak immune systems, many allergies etc, and she has been assured by varying practitiones that her problems stem from the vaccines. Our childrenare not and will not be vaccinated, they are developing strong immune systems the natural way as God intended. This article by Dr Lanctot is worth reading. It seems jenny knows the vaccines affected her child, but she still says she would give the child the vaccines again??? What more evidence does she need to know she should be wary of vaccines.http://educate-yourself.org/cn/vaccinationsilentgenocide14nov05.shtml