I might believe she was mentally ill, EXCEPT that for some time before she murdered her kids, she was 'faking' illnesses to get her husband's attention.

She had it all and still wasn't satisfied because it 'wasn't all about her.'

She should NOT be free. She took two young lives.

Sometimes I get the feeling our society goes lenient on those who murder children because hey, they were just kids. Like they don't have as many rights as an adult.

A life is a life. One month or one hundred years old, they have the same Constitutional right to life, liberty, and the persuit of happiness. These were defenseless little girls killed by the one person in the world they SHOULD have been able to trust and take care of them, their own mother.

I have first-hand experience with mentally ill mothers and this sounds like a case of a system that wants to release someone who is "functioning" to the hospital's (or state's) standards, but not necessarily to the public's standards. She may have learned what to say or do to get sprung this soon. And the system wants her off their books. I know that sounds cynical, but that's how it works for both parties. I've seen it (minus the killing-your-own-children aspect, mind you).

If she isn't compliant with her meds and psychiatric therapy, she'll wind up in a psychotic state again. This doesn't mean she'll become violent, but she certainly won't be functioning the way most people do. I hope the family members she now lives with know what dealing with her on a daily basis will be like. It might not be too pretty. Again, I've seen it.

The truth is that most mentally ill people do not exhibit violence toward others (usually it's toward themselves). That being said, some also "become" their illness. They don't comply and they learn to manipulate others to remain mentally ill. It's easier to be "sick" than to be fully functioning. It's an ugly, vicious cycle that never completely stops.

Like Andrea Yates, this woman's brutal murder of her children was likely done in a psychotic state. Her mind was possessed by visions and thoughts that most people (thankfully) never experience. That doesn't begin to justify her actions, but I do believe the demons that live in her head will not let her rest whether she lives in a mental health facility, a prison cell or her mother's house.

I have first-hand experience with mentally ill mothers and this sounds like a case of a system that wants to release someone who is "functioning" to the hospital's (or state's) standards, but not necessarily to the public's standards. She may have learned what to say or do to get sprung this soon. And the system wants her off their books. I know that sounds cynical, but that's how it works for both parties. I've seen it (minus the killing-your-own-children aspect, mind you).

If she isn't compliant with her meds and psychiatric therapy, she'll wind up in a psychotic state again. This doesn't mean she'll become violent, but she certainly won't be functioning the way most people do. I hope the family members she now lives with know what dealing with her on a daily basis will be like. It might not be too pretty. Again, I've seen it.

The truth is that most mentally ill people do not exhibit violence toward others (usually it's toward themselves). That being said, some also "become" their illness. They don't comply and they learn to manipulate others to remain mentally ill. It's easier to be "sick" than to be fully functioning. It's an ugly, vicious cycle that never completely stops.

Like Andrea Yates, this woman's brutal murder of her children was likely done in a psychotic state. Her mind was possessed by visions and thoughts that most people (thankfully) never experience. That doesn't begin to justify her actions, but I do believe the demons that live in her head will not let her rest whether she lives in a mental health facility, a prison cell or her mother's house.

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so- if I may ask you- with your background---Do you think someone who drown her children and only spent this amount of time in a Mental institute--- is there any way --- that was enouhg time to put her back on the streets?

I am confused, if Texas is "so tough" on criminals, why do they not "change" the provision with the "mentally ill" defense. O.K. at the time of the killing the person may be mentally ill and found not "guilty" by mental disease or defect, but where is the provision that if the person is found 'sane" in the future, they will have to "continue" their sentence behind bars.

See, it's things like this that piss me off!!! While I agree with the fact that this woman was obviously mentally ill (schizophrenia is an awful disease!), I also believe she has lost her right to live in society!

I agree whole heartedly with district attorney Roach who says,

"I, for one, will certainly urge the Legislature to change the law so that people who intentionally kill are not allowed to go free in our communities," he said.

Roach suggests that a jury be allowed to find a defendant guilty but insane, which would send the person to a prison hospital for treatment. Once it is determined that the person is no longer mentally ill, he or she would then be admitted into the general prison population."

I know there are the rare cases of a person being actually insane at the time of a crime, and it is a travisty to those people that the insanity defense is abused the way it is. I also believe it's largly because of this abuse that people resent and second guess the legitimacy of mental illness.

The public at large is being tainted because of these few people who use a Psychiatric Diagnosis as an excuse to commit horrible crimes. Every time we read a story about domestic murder we say "I bet she'll say she has bipolar". It has become so rampid that we know as soon as we read about it, that they will end up using mental illness as an excuse.

What pisses me off the most is that there are soooooo many mentally ill people that fight to get and stay well. We don't kill or rape or molest children... We live normal lives, yet because of these a$$holes that DO kill people, the rest of us that are mentally ill suffer from the stigmas attached to having the "same" mental illness that a killer has! It makes us look bad!

Having Bipolar disorder is starting to be looked at as synonymous with killing ones child and that angers me to no end! Why do these scumbags get to decide how *my* mental illness is perceived?!

I know I probably sound selfish, thinking that I am affected by these people's choices to kill, and maybe I am being selfish by feeling this way but I can't help it!

I am mentally ill and I never killed anyone, I should be judged accordingly, as should the rest of the mentally ill population.. but these people make it so that we no longer are.

The stigma will never go away if the insanity defense remains the way that it is.

Thank you for your insightful post. I completely understand what you are saying and I would be mad too, because the way mental illness is perceived is tainted so much when these losers committ their crimes and blame mental illness.

I have read your posts before and I must say that you write like somebody who is very mentally HEALTHY. You obviously have taken control and responsibility of/for your illness, or it sure seems that way to me, and I think you are to be commended for it. I have read posts of yours that are insightful and thought-provoking to me, and I appreciate your viewpoint and take on things. I must say that if everyone who had mental illness were as you seem to be, the world would be a better place. OK--just wanted to say that.:blowkiss:

Now on to this particular topic, personally, I am one who believes in the age-old good and evil theories. Obviously, someone who drowns/kills/maims/whatever their children is NOT mentally healthy, however, I also believe that they have a good dose of old-fashioned EVIL in them. And I know that this is not a popular viewpoint, but EVIL lurks all around us, often under the guise of good. I'm not talking religiously either, because although I am a spiritual person, I am not necessarily religious at all. Fact is, there are good people and bad people in this world of ours. By sheer numbers alone, some of these bad people are parents. I'm sorry, but mental illness alone does not make a mommy chop off her 10 month old baby girls arm. Mental illness alone does not make a mommy systematically torture her 5 innocent babies by drowning them. These women are evil who don't deserve to walk the streets.

As far as them being deluged for the rest of their lives with the thoughts of the horrible reality of what they did, I don't see them as living in a private Hell because of their actions. To me, if you can perform an act so vicious, then simply having the THOUGHT of doing it isn't going to hurt them to the depths of their souls for the rest of their lives. Yes, I do believe in regret....but I'm sorry, there is a certain line you cross when you violently kill innocent babies, and the fact that you can do it with no qualms, leads me to believe that THINKING about it leaves you with no qualms either.

I know my view on this not a popular one, it's my opinion only people, so don't flame or bash me. To me, once you cross that line, there is no going back. Period.

Thank you for your insightful post. I completely understand what you are saying and I would be mad too, because the way mental illness is perceived is tainted so much when these losers committ their crimes and blame mental illness.

I have read your posts before and I must say that you write like somebody who is very mentally HEALTHY. You obviously have taken control and responsibility of/for your illness, or it sure seems that way to me, and I think you are to be commended for it. I have read posts of yours that are insightful and thought-provoking to me, and I appreciate your viewpoint and take on things. I must say that if everyone who had mental illness were as you seem to be, the world would be a better place. OK--just wanted to say that.:blowkiss:

Now on to this particular topic, personally, I am one who believes in the age-old good and evil theories. Obviously, someone who drowns/kills/maims/whatever their children is NOT mentally healthy, however, I also believe that they have a good dose of old-fashioned EVIL in them. And I know that this is not a popular viewpoint, but EVIL lurks all around us, often under the guise of good. I'm not talking religiously either, because although I am a spiritual person, I am not necessarily religious at all. Fact is, there are good people and bad people in this world of ours. By sheer numbers alone, some of these bad people are parents. I'm sorry, but mental illness alone does not make a mommy chop off her 10 month old baby girls arm. Mental illness alone does not make a mommy systematically torture her 5 innocent babies by drowning them. These women are evil who don't deserve to walk the streets.

As far as them being deluged for the rest of their lives with the thoughts of the horrible reality of what they did, I don't see them as living in a private Hell because of their actions. To me, if you can perform an act so vicious, then simply having the THOUGHT of doing it isn't going to hurt them to the depths of their souls for the rest of their lives. Yes, I do believe in regret....but I'm sorry, there is a certain line you cross when you violently kill innocent babies, and the fact that you can do it with no qualms, leads me to believe that THINKING about it leaves you with no qualms either.

I know my view on this not a popular one, it's my opinion only people, so don't flame or bash me. To me, once you cross that line, there is no going back. Period.

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no bashing from me--- i think your post is very well stated, and i just have a real problem with her doing 2 fricking years- and she is back on the streets-----what she did to her children is uncomprehensible- then she says she was "crazy"--ok- although i have trouble with that even though i know it is a possiblity--- she gets 2 years worth of therapy and everything is just hunky dory??? if that was me-- and i really was nuts when i committed the horendous crime- about the time the meds and therapy brought me back to reality--- i would be so over the mountain whe i realized what i did--- that i would be nuts again-- and my opinion deems no disresepct to those that have had some troubles in their life--- i am talking about those who have killed because of it- hope that makes sense-

I am confused, if Texas is "so tough" on criminals, why do they not "change" the provision with the "mentally ill" defense. O.K. at the time of the killing the person may be mentally ill and found not "guilty" by mental disease or defect, but where is the provision that if the person is found 'sane" in the future, they will have to "continue" their sentence behind bars.

Cone on....2 years.....please.

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Right. It should be Guilty but Insane. The person could be put in a mental hospital as long as necessary and serve the remainder of the sentence in prison. Doctors have been wrong about mentally ill people being well enough to be released. It is too big a chance to take when they have killed another person, especially two children.

no bashing from me--- i think your post is very well stated, and i just have a real problem with her doing 2 fricking years- and she is back on the streets-----what she did to her children is uncomprehensible- then she says she was "crazy"--ok- although i have trouble with that even though i know it is a possiblity--- she gets 2 years worth of therapy and everything is just hunky dory??? if that was me-- and i really was nuts when i committed the horendous crime- about the time the meds and therapy brought me back to reality--- i would be so over the mountain whe i realized what i did--- that i would be nuts again-- and my opinion deems no disresepct to those that have had some troubles in their life--- i am talking about those who have killed because of it- hope that makes sense-

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I totally agree with you. If I were really mentally ill, once back in reality, I wouldn't last long. I'd commit suicide once I realized what my mind caused me to do. It would just be too horrendous for me to live with. I find that the best way for me to deal with pain of my actions. There is no way I could wake up every morning and look at myself. I do have doubts of this woman's mental illness though. Even not knowing all the facts, my gut tells me she was looking for attention and her action to kill her children was out of spite more than her "mental" illness. JMO

Thank you for your insightful post. I completely understand what you are saying and I would be mad too, because the way mental illness is perceived is tainted so much when these losers committ their crimes and blame mental illness.

I have read your posts before and I must say that you write like somebody who is very mentally HEALTHY. You obviously have taken control and responsibility of/for your illness, or it sure seems that way to me, and I think you are to be commended for it. I have read posts of yours that are insightful and thought-provoking to me, and I appreciate your viewpoint and take on things. I must say that if everyone who had mental illness were as you seem to be, the world would be a better place. OK--just wanted to say that.:blowkiss:

Now on to this particular topic, personally, I am one who believes in the age-old good and evil theories. Obviously, someone who drowns/kills/maims/whatever their children is NOT mentally healthy, however, I also believe that they have a good dose of old-fashioned EVIL in them. And I know that this is not a popular viewpoint, but EVIL lurks all around us, often under the guise of good. I'm not talking religiously either, because although I am a spiritual person, I am not necessarily religious at all. Fact is, there are good people and bad people in this world of ours. By sheer numbers alone, some of these bad people are parents. I'm sorry, but mental illness alone does not make a mommy chop off her 10 month old baby girls arm. Mental illness alone does not make a mommy systematically torture her 5 innocent babies by drowning them. These women are evil who don't deserve to walk the streets.

As far as them being deluged for the rest of their lives with the thoughts of the horrible reality of what they did, I don't see them as living in a private Hell because of their actions. To me, if you can perform an act so vicious, then simply having the THOUGHT of doing it isn't going to hurt them to the depths of their souls for the rest of their lives. Yes, I do believe in regret....but I'm sorry, there is a certain line you cross when you violently kill innocent babies, and the fact that you can do it with no qualms, leads me to believe that THINKING about it leaves you with no qualms either.

I know my view on this not a popular one, it's my opinion only people, so don't flame or bash me. To me, once you cross that line, there is no going back. Period.

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Thanks for your kindness, Julianne. It took a long time, much insight and being able to look at myself honestly and say "I don't like me" and then actually DO something about it- for me to get to this point.

I agree with the basic gist of what your saying, I really do.. but I also think there are some people out there who are honestly insane and in my opinion THAT is why we have the insanity defense. Not for every person who has Bipolar or Depression or a borderline personality.

My opinion of legal insanity is someone who is so out of touch with reality that there is no "bringing" them back to sanity- ever! But even those people, in my opinion, should be locked up for life but in a hospital for the criminally insane not prison. I feel this way for a few different reasons the first being they (the insane) are a danger to others in the prison system including the guards. A Psych. hospital is better prepared for insanity.. not only with medications but with training in how to defuse a situation that a prison guard would be clueless about.

A prison (and most of society.. myself included)) has no idea what it is doing while dealing with a true insane person. They toss medication into their cells and move along.

The insane are dangerous people because they do not think clearly and no matter how hard we try, we will never understand what is going on inside of their head. Most of them think they have monitoring devices in their heads and if a guard walks by, they think he's in on it. The insane person would kill that guard in a heartbeat honestly believing they were just protecting themselves.

IMO Prison is not and should not be an insane asylum... they already have places for crazy people - with experts trained in how to deal with them already on the premisis.

But also, IMO, If you kill someone you have lost your right to live amongst us and should be locked away for life. I think our only differing opinion, julianne, is how to house them.