Sanctions have also soared for people on the mainstream unemployment benefit Jobseeker’s Allowance, with the DWP boasting today that over half a million claims have been sanctioned between November 2012 and June 2013.

This is all wonderful news according to Employment Minister Esther McVey who today proclaimed: “We always make the rules very clear – it’s only right that there is a penalty if people fail to play by them.”

Astonishingly many of those who have faced sanctions will have been plunged into poverty by charities who have been only too happy to sell out their service users for free workers and lucrative Work Programme contracts.

Household names including the Salvation Army (@salvationarmyuk), YMCA (@YMCA_England) and The Conservation Volunteers (@tcvtweets) have all defended these vicious measures whilst employing countless unpaid workers under threat of sanctions on mandatory workfare schemes.

Members of the Disability Works coalition have also got their snouts in the trough. Some of those on sickness or disability benefits who were sanctioned will have had benefits slashed due to ‘compliance doubts’ raised by charities such as SCOPE (@scope), Mencap (@mencap_charity) and MIND (@mindcharity). These so-called charities are Work Programme sub-contractors and have agreed to report back to the Jobcentre if a claimant misses a meeting or fails to attend ‘work related activity’. Charities claiming to support disabled people are now complicit in destroying people’s lives by snitching to the DWP that they aren’t trying hard enough to find a job.

This is despite these claimants having undergone a notorious Atos assessment which has agreed that they are unable to work at present. Appalling however sick and disabled claimants can still be sent to work unpaid on the Work Programme or face sanctions. They may be unfit for work, but they are fit for workfare in the eyes of the DWP.

With yet more workfare planned, alongside ludicrous new ‘conditionality’ for unemployment benefits which expects people to spend 35 hours a week looking for non-existent jobs, the number of sanctions is likely to rise even further. The poverty now being socially engineered by the DWP is unprecedented in living memory in the UK. In one of the richest countries in the world people are now being left to go hungry or homeless with the collusion of charities – whilst the Labour Party boasts they will be even tougher on unemployed or disabled claimants than the Tories. It is down to claimants themselves – and all those who support a welfare state that does not abandon people to destitution for any reason – to fight back against this callous war on the poor.

Listen john you keep doing this..mind want nothing to do with fucking workfare they have condemned it on many occasions even publicly.. I’ve been in touch with them a lot and every time they confirm they want nothing to do with at all ever..

Johnny, I am so shocked and dismayed at Mind, as they are meant to be on my side. It’s even worse the way that they try to wash their hands of it and justify themselves in that long paragraph, which basically boils down to: “Just doing my job.” No. If they were, they wouldn’t be doing this to us.

Very sad now. I’ve known, really, deep down that charities these days are big business and that they’ve lost sight of the people they’re supposed to represent, but seeing it in black and white, so clearly… that’s depressing.

Become a client of Mind or any other mental health organisation even just attending drop in day services or classes and they will bend you about to transform you according to how their funders demand their clients should be. That means discouraging you from working and destroying what little confidence you have so that you keep attending the drop in sessions and they keep getting the money for organising them and when they are funded for job search they will then try and ‘boost’ that confidence they took away from you in the first place to get you back into a job they are sub-contracting for.

I used to attend women groups at my local Mind centre and getting out in nature was discouraged even going to a local park alone. That was until a new CEO came along with his eco therapy project. Hey new funding coming in to set up activities connected with the great outdoors and so they couldn’t discourage it any longer.

IDS will claim this as victory knowing what a twat he is…that will followed up with idiotic propaganda in the daily hate how these disabled campaigners work for KGB and and rake in trillions in benefits and have been given mansions and how all NHS patients are malingerers getting free treatment and rolls Royce’s

Thanks for the link. I don’t think someone has removed the link, that web site has some problems at the moment, it will be back (I hope) unless something sinister is going on ?, I would put NOTHING passed this government, just like the last government.

Just spoken to Mind and it seems they DO NOT have anything to do with workfare but i will be having another chat further up the command chain tomorrow to confirm.
This needs to be cleared up as Mind are a very important resource for many and to ascertain wether they support workfare or not will effect any confidence people may or may not have in them.
Including me!

Johnny there is something wrong here..I’ve got stacks of mails from them plus the public statements outright condemning workfare plus the fact that a friend who was volunteer for them took her own life after being accused of benefit fraud ..mind would not and could not be so callous to intimidate and harass one of their own volunteers..wby don’t you contact mind and post back what they say..as this is a big issue for me. ..

Mind told me they were “totally independant”, they lied.
Problem is they believe their own lies and are convinced of their superiority in mental health. They would be more aptly named “Ego” rather than Mind. They will be charming at first but use quite insidious techniques that make you feel you are being understood and that they are wonderful people.Later you find out how much power you have given away to them – any criticism and they wont help you. They can be patronising and rude if you dont play the role as they want. They admitted that you only see a qualified mental health Atos person if you go with tthem.

Thanks john for that follow up..I am trying to volunteer for mind at present as I need their help on a number of issues…yes all this needs straighten ing out as a mind volunteer I knew took her own life

“Play by the rules” says Esther McVenom. But the rules of what sport I wonder? As far as I can tell this is like foxhunting – if the quarry (us on JSA/ESA) doesn’t run quick enough it gets hunted down…

The unemployed are being treated like today’s fox. The huntsmen in the DWP are quaffing plenty of Claret now aren’t they.

Sorry mate but I am in touch with mind on a regular basis and on many occasions they have emailed me telling me they don’t want anything to do with workfare and have issued public statements condemning it..
Time and time again they say this…

OMG. If you leave a job ‘voluntarily’ you can be sanctioned. So you could have been forced to resign? Or the workplace sucked, crap working conditions, your health was not up to it, crap boss, crap colleagues, crap pay you couldn’t afford to live on, dangerous workplace, ethical objections, found out your workplace was dodgy/criminal, found conflict of interest and had vto leave. Or you/your partner are moving house so you had to quit. Or you or your partner are having a baby. Or you or partner are going into hospital (or mental hospital, rehab, therapy etc). Or you’ve a sick kid or parent to care for. Or the company asked you to quit in ‘voluntary redundancy’. Or it was your own business but it folded. Or a family business can no longer afford to employ you.
What if you left because you were harrassed, sexually harrassed, stalked, bullied, physically assaulted, sexually assaulted, or RAPED in the workplace or by someone in/from it? Usually it would not be appropriate or tolerable to continue to work there. If it went to court the defence would say: You are lying or exaggerating or got over it, because you continued to work there, it didn’t happen, or it wasn’t that bad. In fact if a thing is pretrial they can order that the parties to a case be separated, either by court order (like against seeing your stalker and vice versa, with rules on how far apart in miles etc you must be), or by other ruling. So you almost certainly would not be allowed to continue working there. The company, even if they believed and supported you, would worry about their image, so might tell you to leave – and could keep your attacker on, especially if they outrank you and/or served longer.

You can leave under extreme circumstances citing constructive dismissal. However until the matter is decided, in your favour, by a tribunal you won’t get any benefits! So you are guilty until proven innocent! Catch 22.

It may be true that MInd “say” that they are don’t want anything to do with workfare but being a supporter of Disability Works UK who deliver “the work program” tells me otherwise, if they maintain this position it undermines there own “public statements” and NOT admitting this association is deceitful and i cannot abide deceit these days…. especially from those who expect my trust.

how the fuck they can call themselves disability organisations and say they help disabled people, while screwing over disabled people!

It’s like Hitler’s Germany: Sure, we have plenty of facilities for the disabled in Germany. Lovely mobile gas van clinics, held in friendly AMBULANCES. Nice shiny clean gas chambers tastefully decorated as showers. Big ovens to put in hundreds of disabled ex-stock at a time. Giant pits for shooting, or for getting rid of people when there is no fuel for the ovens. Hospital style science labs with interesting and varied opportunities to participate in medical research!

WOW petition, set up by sick and disabled people hit by Workfare, sanctions, Atos etc has only one month left to reach 100,000 signatures, and trigger a Parliamentary debate. We currently have just under 80,000. Please go to http://www.wowpetition.com and sign, and share as widely as possible. Don’t let us fall at the final hurdle. Thank you.

Mike the mainstream media have been that way a long while their more concerned about keeping in governments good books why else you think there is so much poverty porn yet the recent statistics announcement has barely had any exposure

They are just painting the image that banks didn’t cause the economy to go tits up the benefit claiments did!

Too true, and I have challenged the BBC especially about their apparent pandering to the right-wing Daily Mail viewer, or listener. I have made more than one complaint about some of their interviewers, like John Humphrys, for instance. He is a known right-winger, which showed well, in a very sympathetic interview attitude toward Reichsfuhrer Dumkopf- Schmitt, recently.

They (Mind, etc) ‘deliver specialist employment support to disabled people’ around the Work Programme. They refer people to jobs, support people in jobs, provide training, help with CVs, interview techniques, etc. ‘The specialist intervention support will be provided directly by individual organisations’ – that’s Mind and the rest (see http://www.disabilityworksuk.org/node/4).

So Mind, etc, don’t deliver the Work Programme, they deliver the services surrounding it to get people into a job and keep the job.

That means if you don’t turn up or engage in the ‘specialist intervention support’, they (Mind, etc) will report you to the Jobcentre. They have contracts to fulfil, audits to do, money to be made from keeping their part of the scheme.

E.g. The Job Centre will want to know who turned up for the ‘how to survive my first week working for Poundland’ training day. If it’s run by Mind, it’ll be part of their contract to tell the Job Centre or Advance (who look like they’re there to take the heat off the charities involved) ‘Bob Smith and Lisa Puttock didn’t.’ If you walk out of your job because it’s too stressful will Mind accept that from you or will they see it through the Job Centre’s eyes as leaving a job voluntarily which you’ll be sanctioned for? ‘Sorry Bob but you didn’t give us any warning you were going to walk out on the job today. We can’t tell the Job Centre it was due to stress as you didn’t tell us how you were feeling. We have to tell the JC you left voluntarily. Sorry to be like that but conflict of interests and all that, I’m sure you understand, but they pay us money.’

If Mind don’t do any of this, then why are they a key part of ‘Disability Works’? They need to come clean. By not doing so they make themselves look like they’re up to something very dirty.

It is frightening to see what the government are doing. I can’t believe they are even boasting about it on their website. I refuse to believe it. If they truly are stopping peoples money for no reason, when that person is doing ‘the right thing’ and trying to comply with what they want then that is just inhuman and evil.

Indeed so and the stupid fuckwits don’t understand that the REAL reason the ‘nasty party’ is being totally insane and callous is because they hope the Lib Dems get blamed by benefit claimants and those who still show a smidgen of humanity for them and get totally wiped-out at the next election. Unfortunately, Nick Clegg and others are so politically stupid they can’t see what the Tory game plan is!

This government have been harming & even killing people (below the radar) by cutting off money/access to services. Increasing chances of physical and/or mental and/or emotional dis/stress levels increasing as a result of knowing JCP Advisers are ‘actively’ trying to ‘find’ reasons to raise ‘sanction doubts’. This is the stated focus of their role since UJ arrived & any one of them just needs to ‘think’ something wasn’t done in exactly ‘the right way’ (as they define it that day).

It all sounds (and is) incredible and surreal. Strategies for ‘helping’ unemployed, sick and disabled people all seem to have been inspired by ‘Through the Looking Glass, Alice’s Adventures in Wonderland’ -(“Off With Their Payments!”).

……It was testing a food we liked, whether it be chocolates or cakes or fruit.
…….The Tories did workfare (in its current state) to themselves.
…….It lasted 35 minutes a week not 35 hours.
……They at least provided us with the travel and food (food we could eat)
…….We had a choice of what we did
…….If it was crap or we got injured, we had a right to sue them AND the right to replace ourselves with the individual JCP or WPP numpty that sent us, and THEY can do our placement. At the end of their placement their job has been filled or cancelled, and now they themselves are a jobseeker and get sent straight back onto endless rounds of workfare.
….If we fill out a survey after our workfare and say it was crap, we have the right to have the jobcentre manager or the workfare/WPP boss who sent us, not only sacked from their job, but thrown onto workfare for 3 years shovelling pig shit, while living in the pig sty because their house was given to us, free for us to live in or rent or sell.
….If the person in the government that decided to send disabled people on workfare, could be taxed one limb now and one limb each time they do it again. Or one limb (up to four) for each year (up to four) that they’ve been sending people on workfare. After losing all limbs they will not be decapitated, but instead will become eligible for instant and permanent workfare.
….If there was only one workfare placement and it was given to IDS, a year scooping up shit with his face.

Call me stupid or naive but I don’t believe that ordinary people support what this government is doing whether they are in or out of work. How did it come to this? A government with no mandate forcing their ideologically driven policies onto ordinary people.
And one thing I keep coming back to is this….Where are the Liberal Democrats in all this?….you just never see them.
Do they support these policies? or are they against these policies?
Everybody should make sure that they never get even so much as a whiff of political power ever again.

witlock
a very good point…
your e.g. is a brilliant example of how mental health problems are festered…how can one know what one’s state of mind/physical well being is going to be at any given point in time nor what triggers anxiety or panic attacks that grip one’s whole being in an extreme, uncomfortable, and uncontrollable manner. these things are entirely unpredictable and also a reaction to stress/distress, made much, much, worse in the short and long term, by trying to stay in control. the stress/distress of “taking it, rising above it, getting it right, learning how to confront fear and mastering terrors, pull your self together, cheer up, you lack moral fibre etc etc,”…
the premise is being both in control and out of control at once, in the very stammered mind of cognitive fog, ie 2 places at once..the cure is to get to the root cause of the distress, not overcome it with will power, and then to be sanctioned because one failed to be in or stay in control is barbaric and makes things even worse…the ultimate discovery is of the most powerful word in any language, NO!…
the dsm 5 is now thankfully widely rejected, and there is also a widening rejection, of pharm drugs, “unsafe at any dose”..”mad in america” and the “anatomy of an epidemic” by robert whitaker….he’s also on youtube, with the “anatomy of an epidemic”, well worth a look …..

Shocking as this may sound, I think the Coalition actually plagiarised this idea for slashing unemployment figures (using conditionality and sanctions) from an episode of ‘Yes, Prime Minister.’ I know this because I saw a repeat recently and the resemblance was uncanny.

Not that I am greatly surprised that this vicious government would steal an idea from a BBC political comedy to wreck people’s lives. Osborne is probably giggling about it. We’re just gambit pawns to them.

I heard that there are moves afoot to present a case to the International Criminal Court, alleging this government are committing crimes against humanity.
I expect that the Cameron fascists will be as indignant about that, as when the UN made a report recently.

Imagine the public outcry if the government said that they weren’t going to pay Old Jeannie’s pension – just leave the old codger to starve or freeze to death! But somehow it is socially acceptable to plunge unemployed workers into abject destitution without batting an eyelid! Well, sanctions are not on! This mediaeval barbarism must stop now, sanctions must go!!

I have never been more ashamed to be a citizen of this putrid pile of shite that this once proud land that people died for, and are still dying for has become.
What will be the future for future generations to come ? work until you drop ?
euthanasia provided by the corporation that one was known as the NHS.
I am disabled through a lifetime of hard graft. I played my dues. I served my community and now I am treated like something that Cameron scraped of his shoe by mindless sycophantic drones who supposedly work on behalf of the DWP.
I am now frightened at what I see happening across this land and why. I can hear the approaching jack boots and the Neo Nazi war cries of “work sets you free” getting nearer and nearer with every day that passes.

Tommaz Jay
Totally defeated, frightend and drowning in the putrid shit of a once proud land of our forefathers.

But men labour under a mistake. The better part of the man is soon ploughed into the soil for compost. By a seeming fate, commonly called necessity, they are employed, as it says in an old book, laying up treasures which moth and rust will corrupt and thieves break through and steal. It is a fool’s life, as they will find when they get to the end of it, if not before.

why do you think paul farmer give up because of all charitys to money to survive will have to take our bodies for that extra bit for themselves there isn’t a real charity left that doesn’t take your body for gain some hide it away some like sally army and others tell you but when they do this then realy all they are is a slave trader and that isn’t charitable at all why argue over who doing they all are whether they tell you so is another thing yes mind helps loads but those people who come into minds meeting places are there to lecture or teach one but for this mind gets that fee for providing its audience to them nah its all to do with greed but we didn’t do it bankers and the like did so please don’t argue over why or do they believe we pay for their mistakes jeff3

All charities are not taking part in workfare some have spoken out against it. Paul Farmer does not have to be associated with it. While the sactions are so dangerous and counterproductive noone involved with it could be thought of as ethical. I went without food for a month after my ESAwas stopped. Having had eating disorders it was too easy for me- just feeding into an addiction I thought id overcome.

Right a correction or rather a clarification needs to be made as i’m sure many of you have made the same error as I have.

MIND is a charity and i thought these were the people i was with as a client/patient, I was wrong.

MINDCARE is a NHS department that is seperate and has NO connection with MIND or workfare and are NOT in association with workfare.
I am with MINDCARE.

NOW where as mindcare is a NHS service, it is subject to the destruction imposed by this government. It is a referal service from your G.P. (Doctor)

MIND is a pet of this government in as much as it is supported by and in turn supports the government line of persecution of the unemployed they created (see the latest destruction of the shipbuilding induistry in portsmouth).

The subject we ALL should be concerned with is EMPLOYMENT and what the government and specifically the conservatives have done to reduce EMPLOYMENT every time they have been in power…

The liberals are NOTHING in political terms but tools/bystanders with NO political will of their own thus are not actually worthy of consideration.

While it is a worthy cause to fight the persecution of the disabled, mentally ill, unemployed and pensioners IT IS A DISTRACTION from the real problem.

Unless something is done to encourage EMPLOYMENT then The problem of UNEMPLOYMENT cannot be solved other than to wipe the unemployed from the earth.

Yes some disabled “could” find work of some sort IF and ONLY IF the jobs actually exist, an environment where every effort is required.

Before ANYONE can dare to denigrate the poor, disabled, sick or unemployed for not working they must FIRST be sure that there is work for them to do otherwise persecutors look no more than morons without the intelligence to walk and breath at the same time.

As an aside it has come to my notice that one tory has suggested that children who prove to be unable to support thermselves in later life should be guilotined and another mental case tory suggested that councils use cattle to cut municiple grass…Is this a reasonable example of the tory mindset i wonder?

john
yes, we are being parked, and emotionally distracted from this fact, we must ensure also that we do not become the benefactors of spurious charities, that have a profound interest in keeping us dependant on them for “freedom” or our route to it, “this way”, says the guide, kerching…
corny i know, but we must go to the place of our ancestors and remember, who we are, human beings.
we all have free and natural human rights, to the vitals of life, we are culturally illed, by what has been and is being done to us on a massive scale, by those who believe that they have bought/can buy the right to inherit the earth..that we are mere commodities to be traded for their profit, they are plainly and provably wrong to believe that….we need to fight tooth and nail for increases in our benefit entitlements, to end benefit sanctions and conditionality
skara brea, orkney….

This has been going on from the start of workfare NO charity can be trusted not to use their clients for money and the only thing that upsets them is lack of money! So don’t give or buy anything from these charity’s. I myself have written to the Y.M.C.A about them taking the p*** and nothing will change until we change our attitude to so called charity’s. Tell your family and friends ,write/email to the trustees, write letters to newspapers etc. Ask questions of charity shops before you shop/donate and remember some won’t be telling you the truth as in the Mind situation!
Remember you are not alone there are thousands of us going through this and millions unemployed. Check out the other websites and keep yourself informed of the rules!

Strz… If it comes to a it ask the advisor where have you not complied with your Jobseeker agreement and point out what you have done then ask to see the manager …you will have to wait ages then explain it to the manager.
I did see on this blog a few days ago someone who had trouble with there adviser. It should be on here somewhere, check out the right hand column as all the blogs are there!
All the best for tomorrow (My day as well)

At the moment, Royal Wooton Bassett, the place which was given an honoury title of “Royal” because it was the place where our fallen heroes were flown back to, is preparing a commemoration.

Yes our fallen comrades should be remembered, but it should never be forgotten that Blair, the Americans lapdog poodle, put us into a position of war, in the first place, based on fictional evidence that is still being investigated today……..

Over four hundred of our finest personnel gave their lives to a cause that should have been overlooked if the parliamentarians had listened to the electorate, instead of following the “gung ho” British Bulldog sentiments……….

…….Nevertheless, the fodder of what we are being fed, is a mask to cover what is going on behind the scenes……..

The “New Eugenics and Murdering Arm”, of our government, the inglorious, DWP, is closing ranks swiftly to try to cover up the amount of victims it has stockpiled in its bulging cemetery of shame that has resulted from its sanctions against the most weakest and underprivileged in our society……..

Call it what you will, i recognise it as murder on an epic scale, unrecorded and hidden from not only the rest of the world, but Britons alike.

Over ten thousand six hundred and counting, have fallen to this bitter, twisted regime manufactured by a few elite officials commanding central posts in our crumbling coalition government.

They bear no thoughts of shame or remorse, their wallets telling the true tales of involvement in the greatest mass murder since the last war……….

Our memorials to the fallen, always say, lest we forget…

What these arseholes in power are doing, is just the opposite, they are instrumental in a mission used by the Nazis in our darkest past.

You are being driven into a situation where the NHS is being hived off in huge chunks to satisfy the greedy, grabbing private health insurance industry. Your welfare means nothing to these giants who are pulling the strings via our corrupted politicians. You are just another stepping stone that lays in the path of total dominance to greed…………….

Deaths are of no significance to these butchers. All our present legislation has been significantly altered to welcome the changes they are trying to fulfill………..

Please check how many people have used the freedom of information channels to ask how many have succumbed to death since the introduction of the welfare acts………

The answer from the DWP is always the same, they are unaware of the spiraling death count and it would cost more than £600 to archive the information, therefore it cannot be collated……….

Meanwhile the murders are increasing whilst the biased media run hand in hand with our corrupt government to hide the truth of the real carnage.

The reason that the other political parties stand by and do nothing is obvious…….
They are quite content with what is happening because deep down it is doing them a favour in the long run. Lowering debt is beneficial. They may moan during prime ministers question time to give the impression that they object, but deep down they welcome it as it makes their ascendency a little easier and leaves scope to blame the party who was last in power.

Many reports have come forward quite recently regarding the apprehension of a leading Nazi by the world renowned Simon Weisenthal Centre……………..

Despite these reports being totally untrue, it must be recognised that more than 10,600 persons have died following attacks against the disabled and most vulnerable, by virtue of drastic benefit changes laid down by the DWP , following denial that disability exists…………..

BILL GUNNYEON had nothing to do with any of the deaths directly, but is the Chief Medical Advisor to the aforementioned government department that administers the cuts that have seen so many lives ended.

So the wrinkly old bird who lives in the big house on the corner, which incidentally has 240 bedrooms, is going down to do her bit of remembrance soon……….

“Good on her”, you may think, but never forget, she and her ilk are the biggest welfare scroungers this country has ever had.
The hardest thing she has ever done is shake hands, eat exotic foods and unveil pictures of herself. She has no idea what end of a corgi, the shit comes out and no doubt one of her loyal subjects, a serf, will have to clean it up…………..

No bedroom tax for this house, despite the starving huddling up in cardboard under bridges and in park shelters or near warm air ventilation shafts.

Double standards is not the issue, its whats reasonably fair to expect in this century, what is at stake.

We are all supposed to be born as equals, where does this argument lie when privilege throws the ball out of the window completely………….

When old wrinkly decided to put her monicker on the governments welfare reform acts, she gave it royal assent.

This means that she was happy with the powers that be, to screw you all into the ground, take away your lives, your dignity, your homes and your food.

“You are just plebs”, never forget this!

All the bollocks of, we are all in this together, was just a smokescreen for the ones stupid enough to accept it……….

Buckingham Palace has palatial dining rooms that can accommodate six hundred guests at one sitting, yet further down the road is a food bank where the likes of you and me have to humbly request the crumbs from the table.

As for remembering the the fallen from the war, she wants to remember the dead that are mounting up from the fallout she caused since giving the DWP HIT SQUADS the ok to blitz the disabled and most in need………….

Whilst she trundles down to the cenotaph in one of her limo’s or a stage carriage, you are having your independence stolen from right under your noses. Your mobility is a thing of the past.

Legislation bearing fancy titles like, Personal Independence Payments, are just the opposite of what they appear to say.
You are being shafted, big style, to pay for the huge hole in the economy that the City of London created.

Don’t worry, if this government and it’s extermination arm, the DWP could get away with it, they would kill you outright. The method they decided upon was more cruel, inflicts more stress, pain and agony, demeans your soul and takes away your very reason for living.

The government call it an austerity measure yet it only affects the poorest and weakest and has no effect whatsoever on the wealthy.

High speed rail, 20 minutes off a rail journey to Birmingham, “what an utter pile of crap”………………..

PEOPLE COME FIRST, NOT TOYS FOR THE STOCKBROKERS AND BANKERS AND HEDGE FUND MANAGERS…..

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