why build a site from scratch when you can use this.........

littlephoenix

Graduate

Posts: 147

3+ Months Ago

well, as you all know, now days web2 apps such as blogger or wordpress that are well written for the web can be used for anything from shopping carts to directories to simple blog and none blog format sites. Why would anyone really want to create a website from scratch when you can simply use blogger or wordpress and design your front end, i mean the backend is written already, just install, and redesign. doesn't get any more simple then this......

HKt0p5

Graduate

Posts: 135

Loc: Bulgaria

3+ Months Ago

I don't get exactly your point, but I think I can say why not. Because I've tried, and it really is not as simple as you think. And also, "redesign"? Do you know how many files, for example, the xoops platform has? Or phbb, or wordpress? Not only that but it needs mods and all sorts of add-on-s. You can't simply, "redesign" like that, hey =3

kbergmann

Expert

Posts: 659

Loc: USA

3+ Months Ago

I have mixed feelings about using something else instead of building the site yourself ...

This really depends on how much you know about wordpress or whatever, as if you know it very well, then your idea would work great. If you don't know it and all they want is a simple page no shopping cart or anything, isn't it easier just to build a clean CSSed HTML page?

I suppose this comes down to what the designer/developer knows best!

George L.

Bronze Member

Posts: 2207

Loc: Malaysia

3+ Months Ago

User>Content>Developer>Purpose

There is this Web design pyramid where the "purpose" is at the tip of the pyramid. It is said usually it is economic(profit) purpose. The left side is the "users" and the right is the "developers". The "content" is the brick of the "pyramid" -- web design/development.

Hard to say -- individual perspective. (old woman with the young lady image).

Design for Screens

Use of active white space, and nice navigation.

It is something that goes this way in a list. We need different types of support to look into these four areas. At least it is something I can remember at this moment.

1.Technology2.Layout (Developer)3.Visuals (User)4.Content 5.Purpose

This list consists of the sources we can see in the pyramid. Hope this brings a little bit of ideas to why sometimes; developer builds from scratch and sometimes, they do as you said, littlephoenix.

dyfrin

Expert

Posts: 503

Loc: WI

3+ Months Ago

Accomplishment.

In this world of younger people full of fail, one would not understand.Rip it, mask it as your own, and you did it mentality is going to destroy future development.

celandine

Mastermind

Posts: 2008

Loc: Belgrade, Serbia

3+ Months Ago

the truly great sites out there are those made by hand. if you look at the really amazing pieces of work, the ones that make you think 'gosh I wish I had made that' - they are never going to be a reworked forum or wordpress template.

cheapness shows, lack of skill or knowledge shows, lack of class or imagination ultimately shows in the final product. and if you are good enough to transform a generic template into something truly amazing - you're probably good enough to make it from scratch to begin with...............

prateekshawebdesign

Newbie

Posts: 10

Loc: India

3+ Months Ago

no two people think alike...

i guess the main reason being that clients have their own preferences and they want their own brand and company name logo and identity that is "different" and "stands-out from the crowd" thinking...

custom websites is here to stay

Bogey

Genius

Posts: 8417

Loc: USA

3+ Months Ago

kbergmann wrote:

I have mixed feelings about using something else instead of building the site yourself ...

This really depends on how much you know about wordpress or whatever, as if you know it very well, then your idea would work great. If you don't know it and all they want is a simple page no shopping cart or anything, isn't it easier just to build a clean CSSed HTML page?

I suppose this comes down to what the designer/developer knows best!

I'm not so sure about this myself. I've tried building the whole thing from scratch and decided to go off of phpBB3 and so far... so good.

It took me about a whole two weeks to learn exactly how to use phpBB3 platform and I'm still un-awares how to do the administration page even though Joebert was nice enough to providing me with the general "skeleton" of administrative pages... I've long lost that thread and need to find it.

It's all in how much effort you are going to give your site.

calendine wrote:

the truly great sites out there are those made by hand. if you look at the really amazing pieces of work, the ones that make you think 'gosh I wish I had made that' - they are never going to be a reworked forum or wordpress template.

cheapness shows, lack of skill or knowledge shows, lack of class or imagination ultimately shows in the final product. and if you are good enough to transform a generic template into something truly amazing - you're probably good enough to make it from scratch to begin with...............

Doing by hand also gives you the true pride in your site. I mean, once you have the pride, it would be easy to update the site and everything... you will never get discouraged.

But if you use pre-installed scripts for back-end and only redesign, it is like a "get-rich quick" scheme... instead, that in this case, it is a "make a site quick" scheme. This is something that would help you to create your own site really quickly.

If you create the site from scratch you have a lot more respect towards it and more will to keep updating and improving on it. Try it... You'll like it.

spork

Brewmaster

Posts: 6265

Loc: Seattle, WA

3+ Months Ago

Uh oh, are people here confusing design and development again?

celandine

Mastermind

Posts: 2008

Loc: Belgrade, Serbia

3+ Months Ago

probably somehow when I say 'web design', I do mean the whole deal - decide how it's gonna look, do the visuals for it, and then code it - at least the html/css bit, plus maybe a little bit of scripting (forms etc) - somehow the idea of just designing the look of the site and then not doing any of the coding feels like a job half-done to me. so I guess I make that mistake quite often..... replacing the phrase 'web design' for 'web design/ development'..............

of course, I have no problem with someone using forum software and simply altering its appearance. but I don't call it web design when you take a ready made free template and change the font colors and logo on it, and call it a site....

HKt0p5

Graduate

Posts: 135

Loc: Bulgaria

3+ Months Ago

Bogey wrote:

I'm not so sure about this myself. I've tried building the whole thing from scratch and decided to go off of phpBB3 and so far... so good.

It took me about a whole two weeks to learn exactly how to use phpBB3 platform and I'm still un-awares how to do the administration page even though Joebert was nice enough to providing me with the general "skeleton" of administrative pages... I've long lost that thread and need to find it.

There is a thread like this? Please pleease post the link when you find it!- I'll definately need it as well. A phpBB3 is waiting on me for modding and customizing m(v_v)m

ATNO/TW

Super Moderator

Posts: 23454

Loc: Woodbridge VA

3+ Months Ago

Interesting thread. I've read it a few times. I'll comment now.littlephoenix, in answer to your question, it's because a generic blog software will never satisfy the needs of all business entities, or even individuals wishing to produce and support a website. I did want and needed a blog software for my company website, but guess what. Wordpress is not windows server friendly. It would have been my first choice but since it didn't work on a Windows web server and another did, the other won out.

But a prefab blog or even a really good prefab CMS of which there are many do not meet the needs of every website or business entity. In those cases it's those that understand custom design and development that win those bids.

And btw, George, your post was really good and informative. Are those points that you discovered on your own or did you find those somewhere?

George L.

Bronze Member

Posts: 2207

Loc: Malaysia

3+ Months Ago

I have lost my post during the power failure in my house. I am writing again.

Hi Mark,

Thank you very much. I really appreciate that. I discovered it in my head, I memorized for my final exam paper -- Internet fundamentals. The notes can be read here. I did not mean to plagiarize I just forgot to include a credit note. I did not even know who the author is, it was posted up for the students to download, by my lecturer Ms. Angela Lee. Thanks to her. Probably she discovered it somewhere else and put it together or edited. That was about two weeks ago the exam and I hope that I did well, and everyone did well too. I think the pyramid metaphor is quite good in a sense that it helps me to see 'it'. It can be seen at page 4 of the slide. I hope the slide can be informative, Mark.

For a (I am not sure 'mature' is a more suitable word here, but I think a more arrogant author) he has wrote a book called "Getting Real". It can be read for free online here.

Thanks Mark, again.

Bogey

Genius

Posts: 8417

Loc: USA

3+ Months Ago

HKt0p5 wrote:

Bogey wrote:

I'm not so sure about this myself. I've tried building the whole thing from scratch and decided to go off of phpBB3 and so far... so good.

It took me about a whole two weeks to learn exactly how to use phpBB3 platform and I'm still un-awares how to do the administration page even though Joebert was nice enough to providing me with the general "skeleton" of administrative pages... I've long lost that thread and need to find it.

There is a thread like this? Please pleease post the link when you find it!- I'll definately need it as well. A phpBB3 is waiting on me for modding and customizing m(v_v)m

And here's something else that one of the mods showed me some time ago (I bookmarked it )

http://wiki.phpbb.com/Adding_pages

And something else I found on phpbb.com (I think)

http://www.phpbb.com/mods/documentation ... e_mod_info

HKt0p5

Graduate

Posts: 135

Loc: Bulgaria

3+ Months Ago

Thank you!

Bogey

Genius

Posts: 8417

Loc: USA

3+ Months Ago

Yup. Your welcome

ayelletkod

Novice

Posts: 17

3+ Months Ago

Why not to do anything yourself? why not sewing your own clothes, growing your own veggies, designing your home yourself with all these DIY stuff?

Home-made is one way to do things, and usually its more difficult than it seems. especially if you want to change even the smallest thing in the set up tools you get to 'do it yourself'. the other way is leave it to be done by pros, i.e. a tidy job, a web adapted your needs and an 'insurance' it would work properly with other interfaces, applications atc.

most websites do need to addapt themselves to different localities and settings, and therefor need to be designed professionally.

rameshramaiah

Newbie

Posts: 5

3+ Months Ago

HKt0p5 wrote:

I don't get exactly your point, but I think I can say why not. Because I've tried, and it really is not as simple as you think. And also, "redesign"? Do you know how many files, for example, the xoops platform has? Or phbb, or wordpress? Not only that but it needs mods and all sorts of add-on-s. You can't simply, "redesign" like that, hey =3

if you already got that then u need to find alternative source.if not this one will really help u.

redesign your website can be just like a taking cup of coffee.if you have this software.

m not very sure how this will help u out .but if u r interested just have look.

learning does not cost u.right?

theBruney

Student

Posts: 67

Loc: China

3+ Months Ago

Why not build it from scratch? You can hold your head high and say you wrote the code all by your lonesome. Plus, you can satisfy customer needs as you are building to their specification. Off the shelf/generic products will not always have the exact design you or your customer are looking for. Not to mention, not building it from scratch is taking away the best part of being a web designer.