Sailors fighting in the dance hallOh man! Look at those cavemen goIt's the freakiest showTake a look at the LawmanBeating up the wrong guyOh man! Wonder if he'll ever knowHe's in the best selling showIs there life ice on Mars?

What happened here is that a man was enthusiastic and excited about his job and progress in his field, then some cynical bitter folk decided that wasn't on, so they'll drag him down and beat him and tell him that it is not OK to be publicly enthusiastic.

People don't understand nerds. Nerds are enthusiastic about things most people don't find interesting. That's kinda the definition of "nerd", as it's commonly used these days. Like, when gamer nerds crit with a vorpal blade while fighting a tarrasque, they're going to freak the fark out, because that's pretty incredible, right there.

NASA nerds are no different. When they find a rock with a geological composition that isn't in line with what tehy thought they were going to find, they're going to go, "Holy crap! That's farking awesome!" And the rest of the world is going to go, "It's... it's just a rock."

t3knomanser:People don't understand nerds. Nerds are enthusiastic about things most people don't find interesting. That's kinda the definition of "nerd", as it's commonly used these days. Like, when gamer nerds crit with a vorpal blade while fighting a tarrasque, they're going to freak the fark out, because that's pretty incredible, right there.

NASA nerds are no different. When they find a rock with a geological composition that isn't in line with what tehy thought they were going to find, they're going to go, "Holy crap! That's farking awesome!" And the rest of the world is going to go, "It's... it's just a rock."

Yeah, but even in the nerd community, this was played up that it may be something like an organic molecule, which would be EPIC nerdgasm for sure, though the average person would be quite meh about it. Instead, it now sounds as if it's going to be something far less interesting, even for a nerd, like a new kind of mineral not formerly known to exist there. Meh indeed, if that is the case.

Some of the commenters in TFA had it spot on: The typical American is about as scientifically aware as an old boot. When one of the people doing science stuff says "we've found something earthshaking", people assume Martians. Then when it's a fascinating crystal structure that scientists didn't expect to see in the mineral matrix, the typical American is easier to sway that all the NASA wonks are doing is stealing yer tax money. So what needs to be done is really that the people at NASA need to shut their yaps about stuff that gets them hard, because it rarely gives the typical American the same boner. When they're positive that they've got Marvin and his Illudium q-36 explosive space modulator in the Mars rover's specimen box, then they can throw a presser and show the video.

Elon Musk has paid off everyone who knows about the Martians that Curiosity unearthed. Scientists are supposed to be more principled than that, but there you have it. The question now is, what does Elon plan on doing with the Martians, and why does he need to keep them a secret?

NASA only gets their budget cut because it's run by scientists FOR scientists, so their budget keeps getting slashed. The Pentagon dropped several Apollo Mission's worth of bombs on Iraq alone. Why? Because the boring farks don't do anything but study rocks.

ALL WE WANT IS LIFE ON ANOTHER PLANET! That's ALL anyone outside the astrophysics community (read: 6.9999 billion people) cares about.Not building blocks. Not potential for future missions. Not confirmation of findings that were boring when the Viking probes made them in the 70's: but honest to goodness critters that ain't from Earth. Failing that, send some guys up there. Or ladies. No women have been to the moon. Make that your goal and get that sweet, sweet garterbelt money.

You have to feed the public's hunger. Play it up. Make people actually excited. Focus on that kind of research publicly while keeping the REAL science on the DL. Get people excited for that, you'll get a bigger budget. Go poke some more rocks or have a ceremony for the "first quadroon transexual astronaut formermly named Steve to visit the ISS on a leap year" or some other meaningless "milestone" that isn't putting people on the moon or finding aliens and you're not winning any friends in the public sector, even if you do invent useless crap like teflon and dried ice cream from time to time.

dahmers love zombie:Some of the commenters in TFA had it spot on: The typical American is about as scientifically aware as an old boot. When one of the people doing science stuff says "we've found something earthshaking", people assume Martians. Then when it's a fascinating crystal structure that scientists didn't expect to see in the mineral matrix, the typical American is easier to sway that all the NASA wonks are doing is stealing yer tax money. So what needs to be done is really that the people at NASA need to shut their yaps about stuff that gets them hard, because it rarely gives the typical American the same boner. When they're positive that they've got Marvin and his Illudium q-36 explosive space modulator in the Mars rover's specimen box, then they can throw a presser and show the video.

The typical person from any country is about as scientifically aware as...

"Rock, Neil? I don't know whether you looked at the planet before you took off, but it's made of farking rock!" "But it's Moon rock ..." "Oh, farking hell, this is Earth rock, Neil, come on! Have you heard, on the stock market, rock's gone up three points? No, it hasn't, has it? 'Cause it's farking rock!"

The change in the excitement meter has done nothing to have any effect on anyone's lives (who doesn't work for the NASA PR department). I for one am happy that somebody can be excited enough about their job that they can remotely sift tons of dirt on another planet looking for interesting things to share.

But now, NASA is backpedaling. The nature of Curiosity's discovery has been downgraded from "earthshaking" to "interesting," and many are crying foul. They feel misled, cheated and deceived, and Grotzinger has been roundly condemned for blowing the discovery out of proportion.

The media plays telephone with a sentence or two and actively builds up as much speculation as they can, then blames NASA when the bubble they created and inflated pops? Real classy guys. Pretty sure you're the ones doing the backpedaling here.

NASA only gets their budget cut because it's run by scientists FOR scientists, so their budget keeps getting slashed. The Pentagon dropped several Apollo Mission's worth of bombs on Iraq alone. Why? Because the boring farks don't do anything but study rocks.

ALL WE WANT IS LIFE ON ANOTHER PLANET! That's ALL anyone outside the astrophysics community (read: 6.9999 billion people) cares about.Not building blocks. Not potential for future missions. Not confirmation of findings that were boring when the Viking probes made them in the 70's: but honest to goodness critters that ain't from Earth. Failing that, send some guys up there. Or ladies. No women have been to the moon. Make that your goal and get that sweet, sweet garterbelt money.

You have to feed the public's hunger. Play it up. Make people actually excited. Focus on that kind of research publicly while keeping the REAL science on the DL. Get people excited for that, you'll get a bigger budget. Go poke some more rocks or have a ceremony for the "first quadroon transexual astronaut formermly named Steve to visit the ISS on a leap year" or some other meaningless "milestone" that isn't putting people on the moon or finding aliens and you're not winning any friends in the public sector, even if you do invent useless crap like teflon and dried ice cream from time to time.

This

dahmers love zombie:Some of the commenters in TFA had it spot on: The typical American is about as scientifically aware as an old boot. When one of the people doing science stuff says "we've found something earthshaking", people assume Martians. Then when it's a fascinating crystal structure that scientists didn't expect to see in the mineral matrix, the typical American is easier to sway that all the NASA wonks are doing is stealing yer tax money. So what needs to be done is really that the people at NASA need to shut their yaps about stuff that gets them hard, because it rarely gives the typical American the same boner. When they're positive that they've got Marvin and his Illudium q-36 explosive space modulator in the Mars rover's specimen box, then they can throw a presser and show the video.

DON.MAC:Had the idiot given a more details at the time, this wouldn't have been a problem but he wanted to be sure. I'm sure he will be looking for a job as NASA budget cuts get deeper.

Exactly. Just release the data or info to the public. Stop trying to keep everything a secret.

Do we really need a news conference to hear you didnt detect methane "at this time?"

I have to say this entire mission is sketchy. The fact that we're only indirectly searching for life, the ignoring of rocks we've never seen, slow release of lack of context (not remotely near ANY of the known methane concentrations), etc...

If i was a conspiracy theorist id say theyre intentionally hiding a lot.

Wouldn't that be great? Mining corporations would be falling over themselves to get there, and NASA's budget would explode, that is if history is any indication of what motivates large scale expeditions.

Wouldn't that be great? Mining corporations would be falling over themselves to get there, and NASA's budget would explode, that is if history is any indication of what motivates large scale expeditions.

/cynic at best.

Even if Mars turned out to be a solid lump of gold with a bit of dust on the surface concealing it, it would still be a good hundred+ years before we had the means to actually go there, mine it, and send it back in a remotely cost-effective manner.

Wouldn't that be great? Mining corporations would be falling over themselves to get there, and NASA's budget would explode, that is if history is any indication of what motivates large scale expeditions.

Wouldn't that be great? Mining corporations would be falling over themselves to get there, and NASA's budget would explode, that is if history is any indication of what motivates large scale expeditions.

/cynic at best.

Even if Mars turned out to be a solid lump of gold with a bit of dust on the surface concealing it, it would still be a good hundred+ years before we had the means to actually go there, mine it, and send it back in a remotely cost-effective manner.

Not to mention that even a miniscule fraction of that much gold would totally destroy the world economy if it could be brought here cost effectively. Gold is only valuable because it′s relatively scarce. And yes, kinda pretty for a metal.

Wouldn't that be great? Mining corporations would be falling over themselves to get there, and NASA's budget would explode, that is if history is any indication of what motivates large scale expeditions.

/cynic at best.

Even if Mars turned out to be a solid lump of gold with a bit of dust on the surface concealing it, it would still be a good hundred+ years before we had the means to actually go there, mine it, and send it back in a remotely cost-effective manner.

Not to mention that even a miniscule fraction of that much gold would totally destroy the world economy if it could be brought here cost effectively. Gold is only valuable because it′s relatively scarce. And yes, kinda pretty for a metal.

I'm no economy scientist, but would it? I thought the vast majority of the world had moved off of the gold standard by now. I can see it having an effect on certain jewelry makers, and possibly some high tech electronics...

Wouldn't that be great? Mining corporations would be falling over themselves to get there, and NASA's budget would explode, that is if history is any indication of what motivates large scale expeditions.

/cynic at best.

Even if Mars turned out to be a solid lump of gold with a bit of dust on the surface concealing it, it would still be a good hundred+ years before we had the means to actually go there, mine it, and send it back in a remotely cost-effective manner.

Not to mention that even a miniscule fraction of that much gold would totally destroy the world economy if it could be brought here cost effectively. Gold is only valuable because it′s relatively scarce. And yes, kinda pretty for a metal.

I considered these two points, which are good ones, but I think the first (if it was possible) would help to diminish the second. Gold is not only a good basis of curacy because of it's scarcity, but because it requires a lot of work to get a small amount of it. If it was in the least bit cost-effective to get it here, the time and energy required to do so would give it "sweat equity." I doubt that it would be cost-effective or bountiful enough to flood the gold market, and even if it did, someone would still get rich in the process, so it would still a good motivator for colonization . Just look at the last two US gold rushes: people got rich, the market adjusted, and new land was settled.

...and this time we wouldn't even have to commit genocide... Hopefully.

justtray:DON.MAC: Had the idiot given a more details at the time, this wouldn't have been a problem but he wanted to be sure. I'm sure he will be looking for a job as NASA budget cuts get deeper.

Exactly. Just release the data or info to the public. Stop trying to keep everything a secret.

Do we really need a news conference to hear you didnt detect methane "at this time?"

I have to say this entire mission is sketchy. The fact that we're only indirectly searching for life, the ignoring of rocks we've never seen, slow release of lack of context (not remotely near ANY of the known methane concentrations), etc...

If i was a conspiracy theorist id say theyre intentionally hiding a lot.

Last week: Here's the planet's size, orbit, distance, gravity. And here's the makeup of its atmosphere and how much water is in its oceans. Also it is tidally locked.

This week: We're not really sure there's a planet there but if there is that's what it would probably be like. Maybe.

More like.... "We've discovered an earth-like exo-planet orbiting a nearby white dwarf star. It is 9 times the mass of Earth, seems to have some sort of atmosphere consisting mostly of xenon, no water, and the star is pumping so much radiation that the chance for life is nil, but it's rocky!"

JosephFinn:So, this is the thread we're getting instead of discussing how NASA confirmed the presence of a shiat-load of water ice on Mercury?

Whoopty do. I drink a beer and twenty minutes later got water comin' out of dick. What do I need with ice on the closest ball of rock to a giant nuclear furnace I can't get to from here? If you said nothing, come forth and collect your prize of my aforementioned surplus water.

Kenedy was a crowd pleaser. We went to the moon on his mandate because going to the moon is a sexy project. Everyone wants in. Water ice on Mercury is nipples on a chicken. It's interesting but meaningless.

The Mars rover team, operating Curiosity, has also named a feature for Matijevic: a rock that Curiosity recently investigated about halfway around the planet from Matijevic Hill.

"We wouldn't have gotten to Matijevic Hill, eight-and-a-half years after Curiosity's landing, without Jake Matijevic," Squyres said

Full disclosure. I had to take something pretty heavy for a headache this evening, but am I reading this right? They tried to sneak in that Curiosity sprouted wings and flew halfway around Mars? and Curiosity has been around 8.5 when 1 yr just rolled around?

/Man that messed with my head. Fark a migraine I can't take this shiat anymore except on the weekend

doglover:JosephFinn: So, this is the thread we're getting instead of discussing how NASA confirmed the presence of a shiat-load of water ice on Mercury?

Whoopty do. I drink a beer and twenty minutes later got water comin' out of dick. What do I need with ice on the closest ball of rock to a giant nuclear furnace I can't get to from here? If you said nothing, come forth and collect your prize of my aforementioned surplus water.

Kenedy was a crowd pleaser. We went to the moon on his mandate because going to the moon is a sexy project. Everyone wants in. Water ice on Mercury is nipples on a chicken. It's interesting but meaningless.

Oh, and would you like kitty to Farky you with that!? Because that's damned funny.

Very disappointed, it's sort of becoming a running joke that every time NASA has some major announcement to be not major, and could just be a basically press release with the info, and not need to hype up a press conference...

In fact, NASA, do me a favor... Don't farking give any press conferences, or announce any "major announcements" unless it's something so radically new that it really would be one of the history books!

Continue releasing news about what you discover, but short of alien life, past or present, unknown materials/elements, or evidence of manufactured items that aren't from Earth... STFU!

p.s. - Don't let that one scientist ever talk to the press again, it's bullshiat hype like that that causes people to get disillusioned with space exploration and think they'll hype shiat up and lie about things to get funding they so desperately need, but assholes that can't see the end game will use against them to reduce funding in Congress!!!

rwfan:If anyone needs some eyecandy to soothe their butthurt from having their childish expectations let down check out this panoramic view of Gale Crater

Butthurt?

I'm not the one losing billions of dollars each time the budget's drawn up because I lack the skills necessary to talk to the American public and politicians about science. Going to other planets is awesome. Sending probes is less so, but still amazing the first couple times. Now I don't give two shiats about martian geology. Enough with the "billions of years ago" bullshiat and OCD mineralogy. Show me where the life is now, or send me there and I'll look for it myself. If we can't set up shop on mars yet, that should be the thrust of our endeavors. Maybe quantum entanglement could allow for ancible controlled probes so we could search the red planet in real time. That's the kind of crazy that gets willies up. And as strip clubs show, when willies go up wallets come out.

NASA nerds are no different. When they find a rock with a geological composition that isn't in line with what tehy thought they were going to find, they're going to go, "Holy crap! That's farking awesome!" And the rest of the world is going to go, "It's... it's just a rock."

LesserEvil:It seems that the Curiosity Rover has found PLASTIC on Mars.

To be fair, this might be a bit more than "interesting"

The type of plastic sampled as we know so far can only be formed using petrochemicals, meaning not only that there could possibly be a source of oil on the Red Planet, but that somehow it got turned into plastic. Even more interesting is that oil or petrochemicals used to create this type of plastic are only known to come from ancient fossilized organic materials, such as zooplankton and algae, which geochemical processes convert into oil pointing to the earthshaking evidence that there was once life on mars.

Um... that is really amazing, actually. That would mean that once Mars could have had an enorumous amount of water on it and an extremely large biosphere, not random pockets of bacteria here and there.

Smoky Dragon Dish:LesserEvil: It seems that the Curiosity Rover has found PLASTIC on Mars.

To be fair, this might be a bit more than "interesting"

The type of plastic sampled as we know so far can only be formed using petrochemicals, meaning not only that there could possibly be a source of oil on the Red Planet, but that somehow it got turned into plastic. Even more interesting is that oil or petrochemicals used to create this type of plastic are only known to come from ancient fossilized organic materials, such as zooplankton and algae, which geochemical processes convert into oil pointing to the earthshaking evidence that there was once life on mars.

Um... that is really amazing, actually. That would mean that once Mars could have had an enorumous amount of water on it and an extremely large biosphere, not random pockets of bacteria here and there.

Smoky Dragon Dish:LesserEvil: It seems that the Curiosity Rover has found PLASTIC on Mars.

To be fair, this might be a bit more than "interesting"

The type of plastic sampled as we know so far can only be formed using petrochemicals, meaning not only that there could possibly be a source of oil on the Red Planet, but that somehow it got turned into plastic. Even more interesting is that oil or petrochemicals used to create this type of plastic are only known to come from ancient fossilized organic materials, such as zooplankton and algae, which geochemical processes convert into oil pointing to the earthshaking evidence that there was once life on mars.

Um... that is really amazing, actually. That would mean that once Mars could have had an enorumous amount of water on it and an extremely large biosphere, not random pockets of bacteria here and there.

Except its a hoax site. Check the URL.

doglover:rwfan: If anyone needs some eyecandy to soothe their butthurt from having their childish expectations let down check out this panoramic view of Gale Crater

Butthurt?

I'm not the one losing billions of dollars each time the budget's drawn up because I lack the skills necessary to talk to the American public and politicians about science. Going to other planets is awesome. Sending probes is less so, but still amazing the first couple times. Now I don't give two shiats about martian geology. Enough with the "billions of years ago" bullshiat and OCD mineralogy. Show me where the life is now, or send me there and I'll look for it myself. If we can't set up shop on mars yet, that should be the thrust of our endeavors. Maybe quantum entanglement could allow for ancible controlled probes so we could search the red planet in real time. That's the kind of crazy that gets willies up. And as strip clubs show, when willies go up wallets come out.

machoprogrammer:Smoky Dragon Dish: LesserEvil: It seems that the Curiosity Rover has found PLASTIC on Mars.

To be fair, this might be a bit more than "interesting"

The type of plastic sampled as we know so far can only be formed using petrochemicals, meaning not only that there could possibly be a source of oil on the Red Planet, but that somehow it got turned into plastic. Even more interesting is that oil or petrochemicals used to create this type of plastic are only known to come from ancient fossilized organic materials, such as zooplankton and algae, which geochemical processes convert into oil pointing to the earthshaking evidence that there was once life on mars.

Um... that is really amazing, actually. That would mean that once Mars could have had an enorumous amount of water on it and an extremely large biosphere, not random pockets of bacteria here and there.

Except its a hoax site. Check the URL.

doglover: rwfan: If anyone needs some eyecandy to soothe their butthurt from having their childish expectations let down check out this panoramic view of Gale Crater

Butthurt?

I'm not the one losing billions of dollars each time the budget's drawn up because I lack the skills necessary to talk to the American public and politicians about science. Going to other planets is awesome. Sending probes is less so, but still amazing the first couple times. Now I don't give two shiats about martian geology. Enough with the "billions of years ago" bullshiat and OCD mineralogy. Show me where the life is now, or send me there and I'll look for it myself. If we can't set up shop on mars yet, that should be the thrust of our endeavors. Maybe quantum entanglement could allow for ancible controlled probes so we could search the red planet in real time. That's the kind of crazy that gets willies up. And as strip clubs show, when willies go up wallets come out.

This. So much this.

Yeah, I realized that right after I posted the first time. I yielded to the troll in the post right before this. He got me.

LesserEvil:Smoky Dragon Dish: Yeah, I realized that right after I posted the first time. I yielded to the troll in the post right before this. He got me.

Hey, I resemble that remark.... well, not really. I picked up the story from Slashdot, and posted before realizing I got trolled (and slashdot, as well), too.

We'd all like to believe Curiosity found something significant - but it doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon.

My hat's off to whoever did that. If you do a whois on the domain, that could fool non-technical people. If Slashdot got fooled, I'm in good company. I also Googled Xavier Jenks, and that name is associated with this website: Link, which doesn't appear to take itself seriously.

doglover:I'm not the one losing billions of dollars each time the budget's drawn up because I lack the skills necessary to talk to the American public and politicians about science. Going to other planets is awesome. Sending probes is less so, but still amazing the first couple times. Now I don't give two shiats about martian geology. Enough with the "billions of years ago" bullshiat and OCD mineralogy. Show me where the life is now, or send me there and I'll look for it myself. If we can't set up shop on mars yet, that should be the thrust of our endeavors. Maybe quantum entanglement could allow for ancible controlled probes so we could search the red planet in real time. That's the kind of crazy that gets willies up. And as strip clubs show, when willies go up wallets come out.

Apparently you don't give two shiats about what quantum entanglement is either.

The PR department, and you, are the reason it was downgraded.The PR department understands that you (yes, you. Exactly you, not the general use of you) are an idiot.

The news is likely that they found what they expected to find in the dirt. It confirms some theories and equations.That is huge news, and really is "earth shaking".But only for someone able to understand what it means. And that person isn't you.

ds615:The PR department, and you, are the reason it was downgraded.The PR department understands that you (yes, you. Exactly you, not the general use of you) are an idiot.

The news is likely that they found what they expected to find in the dirt. It confirms some theories and equations.That is huge news, and really is "earth shaking".But only for someone able to understand what it means. And that person isn't you.

If the news is that there's helium, especially helium3, in the rocks of Mars, then it'll be as important as finding oil, diamonds, rare earths or precious metals as far as spurring missions. (Finding actual life on Mars would most likely cause a sharp decline in missions, owing to the Prime Directive for Xenobiologicals that is or will be established to prevent damage to or human influence upon an alien biosphere.)

Helium, which is a non-renewable, very finite resource on Earth, is already nearly depleted worldwide due in no small part to the general ignorance of businesses and consumers who expect that the prodigal use of it in frivolous endeavors such as massive balloon displays at sporting and political events, birthday parties, parades and non-scientific stratospheric skydives (30 million cubic feet of helium lost for no reason other than to break a world record?!?!) does no harm because it doesn't explode, is non-toxic and doesn't require special permits or licenses to obtain. ...And while I'm on a rant: Mythbusters really should use hydrogen instead of helium because then they can blow it up afterwards.

We can't just bash hydrogen atoms together or crack heavier elements with a proton beam to produce more of it in quantity (yet), and unlike hydrogen or hot air, which may be a little 'splodey and not nearly as lifty, respectively, there isn't a nearly-unlimited supply and easy way to obtain and recycle helium available.

It is not uncommon for those close to a particular type of research to say that the research is more earthshaking than it really is.

Oh well, I was not expecting there to be living microbial Martians anyways. Though I would have just loved to be wrong. Still a slight chance that I might be wrong but it would foolish to bet that I am now. Still, Curiosity's scientists will be releasing over the course of the next few years a great deal of information about the chemistry of Mars. This is information that is needed so scientists can start to truly get a handle on the planet.

/Life in the past is far more likely though not a shoe-in. It hard to give odds as 1) we don't know how Earth life formed and 2) we still need the chemistry data from Curiosity as well as from future probes.