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I totally agree, of course the event involving Akuha VS Akasha might set Tsukune off, an event wich could lead to a transformation like a Catalyst

Well rather then the fight between Akasha and Akuha .. I think that the fight between Akuha and Moka inside the memory, and after they return from Moka's memory the fight between the present day Akuha and Inner Moka is going to be the main factor that will push Tsukune's vampire developments foreword, and in result Tsukune's interference is probably going to even the fight between the present day Akuha and Moka a little (which from the looks of it ... is gonna be a hell of a fight )

Since from what I have seen Tsukune deems Moka being more important to him then Akasha and seeing Moka being hurt ... by her own sister, is probably going to cause Tsukune to snap. Furthermore it has already been established that Moka is the one who keeps Tsukune motivated to go foreword and become more powerful then he currently is (Rosario + Vampire Season I, chapter 25, page 29) and all of this development with Tsukune partially learning about Moka's childhood and meeting up with Akuha in the Wong Family Mansion is probably going to be another thing that is going to motivate Tsukune to become stronger ... similarly to the event's that happened in the Snow Women village, which lead Tsukune to become aware of how weak he is compared to the enemies that he has to face in the future .(Rosario + Vampire Season II, chapter 15, pages 21,22 ) ... so I see something similar happening during this arc as well ... though rather then realizing how weak he is ... I think that Tsukune is going to get some kind of power up, which is probably something that is going to hep Moka in defeating or rather, making Akuha retreat at that moment ... , since I doubt this is going to be the last time we are going to see her ...

hey guys while i was at work this past week i decided to take up drawing again . anyways my first drawing was of kahlua . now i know the quality of the picture sucks but thats cause i took it with my phone. right now i dont have a scanner. anyways i hope you guys like it . also the peice of paper i used was really crappy and well yeah i really need to get a scanner. and i might try to see if i can take a better picture

well i would like to do more kahlua since i have a big thing for her ever since she appeared in ch 13. i actually want to get a drawing notebook so i can draw at work. the piece of paper i used in that image was only 2x4 in and it had a crappy surface. when ever i do get it i plan to redraw that picture and try to put in her whole body

you know doing kahlua's hair is very difficult cause in the image i was using as a source had so much detail that i got myself lost many times while drawing it XD . specialy when ever i had to stop drawing to fix the machine when someone jamed it up. lol i hate working!

Well. that is a GOOD point. Akuha probably DIDN'T kill Akasha in order to keep the Shinso blood alive, but as the Akuha had suggested when she told Moka about Shinso blood heredity, all she really needs is Moka's blood. (Moka has Shinso blood in her since she is Akasha's blood-related daughter) You know what I mean?

Last edited by Solace; 2010-06-20 at 01:30.
Reason: Don't link to licensed content.

Exactly. Outer Moka is basically a replica of Akahsa, so in other words, what Akasha did was create another version of herself to preserve her blood in case something happened to her body (created a secondary body--why she sent Moka away in order to protect her Shinso bloodline and so that Akuha wouldn't get her hands on it) Likewise, since Moka is the blood daughter of Akasha, there is a high probability that Moka has Shinso blood in her. So in order to avoid conflict between Akuha and Moka, Akasha sent Moka away to be safe.

I have been trying to think about what we know about Tsukune's form so far, and try to add the pieces of information that where revealed in chapter 31.

While some thing aren't certain yet ( I mean we still aren't sure if Tsukune and Moka have Shinso blood in their veins ) ... the information contained in the latest chapter might change a few things that we assumed before. So going from the beginning

1.) The first few times that Tsukune has been injected with Moka's vampire blood aren't worthy to bring up at this point, since aside from slight changes in Tsukune's appearance in his vampire form (which might be the result of the R+V manga's art improvement ) and that the bat theme which appears when Tsukune or Moka change into their vampire forms, was started from the beginning and might signify Moka's and Tsukune's Shinso vampire status (Rosario + Vampire Season I,chapter 10, page 37 ) ... there isn't anything here that hadn't been brought up before.

2.) So I think the first developments that are worthy of discussing again is the time when the side effects from taking too much Moka's vampire blood have appeared. So apart from the usual stuff which are always brought up when we are discussing Tsukune's transformation ... the first thing that is worthy to look upon is what Inner Moka has said about Tsukune's condition at that time (Rosario + Vampire Season I,chapter 20, page 27 )

So taking the new information revealed in chapter 31 ... if the blood that Moka injected into Tsukune was the blood of a Shinso vampire ... it should easily be able to completely change Tsukune's physical build up changing his body into the body of a Shinso vampire , which explains why Tsukune felt like this at hat time (Rosario + Vampire Season I,chapter 20, page 28 )

The only thing that discounts that theory is that the typical vampire weaknesses should apply to Tsukune as well, but as we all know that wasn't the case (Rosario + Vampire Season I,chapter 23, pages 3 and 4 )

Again the information that chapter 31 provided might help us with that ... since apparently Shinso vampires can absorb the power's of other ayashi (Rosario + Vampire Season II,chapter 31, page 20 ) and if Alucard is any indication, taking the power's of other ayashi, transforms the body of a Shinso vampire as well (Rosario + Vampire Season II,chapter 31, page 21 )

So I think this is the perfect explanation why Tsukune isn't affected by the typical weaknesses of a vampire ... even if his body might already be like the body of a vampire. Simply said ... during the course of Tsukune's transformation his Shinso blood absorbed the human part's of Tsukune's body ... allowing Tsukune to retain the retain the immunity to typical vampire weaknesses, despite Tsukune's body being no longer human

3.) Of course I doubt that is the end of the developments that Tsukune is going to undergo ... since despite changing into a Shinso vampire ... there is no way for someone who was a human at first, to be able to control and keep in check the abilities and impulses of a vampire ... which is the reason why Tsukune has fallen into a Ghoul like state ... as well as why Tsukune needs the Holy Lock (Rosario + Vampire Season I,chapter 24, page 10 ), which is an item that allows Tsukune to learn how to control the abilities and nature of a vampire.

Simply said ... I believe that the majority of Tsukune's transformation is already finished ... and in a way he is still a hybrid between a human and a Shinso vampire, since during the course of his transformation Tsukune absorbed the part's of his body that defined him as an human ... and in result his transformation proceeded differently compared to a typical Shinso vampire transformation, making Tsukune into a hybrid between a human and a Shinso vampire, though it's probably not what a majority of us thought about when we where discussing what Tsukune might become in the future.

@AkuhaShuzen

Well, you really shouldn't post links to scanlation sites on this thread ... since the R+V manga is licensed and it might get you banned. Not to mention all of the crackdown on online manga sites that is going on lately. In the future ... just point out the page you want to reference to ... if someone is interested I'm sure they will find the referenced page on their own and you wouldn't have trouble with the mods.

1.) The first few times that Tsukune has been injected with Moka's vampire blood aren't worthy to bring up at this point, since aside from slight changes in Tsukune's appearance in his vampire form (which might be the result of the R+V manga's art improvement ) and that the bat theme which appears when Tsukune or Moka change into their vampire forms, was started from the beginning and might signify Moka's and Tsukune's Shinso vampire status (Rosario + Vampire Season I,chapter 10, page 37 ) ... there isn't anything here that hadn't been brought up before.

I think the bat theme was more of an expression of the vampire theme Ikeda used when Moka first took off her seal. More on this later.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris38

So taking the new information revealed in chapter 31 ... if the blood that Moka injected into Tsukune was the blood of a Shinso vampire ... it should easily be able to completely change Tsukune's physical build up changing his body into the body of a Shinso vampire , which explains why Tsukune felt like this at hat time (Rosario + Vampire Season I,chapter 20, page 28 )

It might be part of the reason why it's taking much longer than it normally does for a human to turn into a vampire in other literature. Normally transformations are much easier to carry out but in this case, pretty much everything is different.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris38

The only thing that discounts that theory is that the typical vampire weaknesses should apply to Tsukune as well, but as we all know that wasn't the case (Rosario + Vampire Season I,chapter 23, pages 3 and 4 )

Again the information that chapter 31 provided might help us with that ... since apparently Shinso vampires can absorb the power's of other ayashi (Rosario + Vampire Season II,chapter 31, page 20 ) and if Alucard is any indication, taking the power's of other ayashi, transforms the body of a Shinso vampire as well (Rosario + Vampire Season II,chapter 31, page 21 )

I wouldn't say so. Moka stated that it is because Tsukune was originally human that he is impervious to water and possibly other elements that constitute a vampire's weakness. So even though he's completely transformed, the base of his body is still human, so he shouldn't be affected by the weaknesses of normal Vampires. So I don't see how this nullifies your theory either way. Besides, chapter 31 stated that he took the powers of other Ayashi, but humans have no power. Abosrbing their blood wouldn't give him anything because they're just livestock to him. It's like saying that by eating a bird, a man can grow wings and fly. Ayashi's different because they're supernatural or mythical creatures like other vampires.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris38

3.) Of course I doubt that is the end of the developments that Tsukune is going to undergo ... since despite changing into a Shinso vampire ... there is no way for someone who was a human at first, to be able to control and keep in check the abilities and impulses of a vampire ... which is the reason why Tsukune has fallen into a Ghoul like state ... as well as why Tsukune needs the Holy Lock (Rosario + Vampire Season I,chapter 24, page 10 ), which is an item that allows Tsukune to learn how to control the abilities and nature of a vampire.

I think it is possible. Think back to the example I used with Hokuto and how he was still able to maintain his own consciousness despite taking off the seal. The amoung of Youki he used couldn't be any less than what Moka posessed, considering he was able to go one on one against her. Tsukune could not have inherited more power than Moka has from Moka. That wouldn't really make sense. That said, if Hokuto could manage to acquire full control of his powers, I have little doubt Tsukune can as well. Also, he's been able to control more and more of his power ever since he started training with Moka, and he still has room for improvement. I think there's a good chance he will eventually be able to fully control his powers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris38

Spoiler for Shinso inheritance:

Well, that's true ... and it might be possible that Akasha's Shinso power's have been transfered to Moka in that way. What I wanted to point out ... is that transferring Shinso power's along with you're blood doesn't seem to weaken the Shinso vampire permanently, (as seen in Moka's case ... after she has given her blood - which at this point is probably the blood of a Shinso vampire ) so rather then that being the reason why Akuha wasn't able to obtain the power's of a Shinso vampire from Akuha might be because only the few first blood transfusions between a Shinso vampire and another individual ( a vampire .. or like Tsukune an ordinary human for example ) have the chance of successfully transfusing and changing the injected person into a Shinso vampire ... in opinion it's probably something that depends on the amount of blood being transfused, but once the Shinso vampire crosses over the limit of injections that have a chance of turning someone into a Shinso vampire ( which, probably depends on how strong the Shinso vampire is ), his blood is unable to successfully change another person into a Shinso vampire. Well in a sense you where right that they become a little weaker ... though I doubt it has a effect on their combat abilities ...

Though maybe I'm over thinking this a little since their is still a lot we don't know and trying to put some ... well complex theories on this doesn't seem to have much sense at this point.

Well ... simply said I agree that Akuha was unable to take the power of a Shinso vampire from Akasha ... probably because that power was already transfered to Moka and from her it has probably been transfered to Tsukune ... though I doubt it has made Akasha weaker then she was before Moka has been born, since as we see can see in Moka's case, though she has been weakened shortly after injecting Tsukune with her blood .. she was still able to recover her strength after some time ... so returning to Akasha, I think that during the time she was pregnant with Moka, as well as during the time of birth , Akasha might be a little weakened and probably couldn't draw her strength correctly at that time ... but I doubt it's something that she would need ten year's to recover from. So I doubt that Akasha would be weakened, when she faces off against Akuha in the latest chapter ... let's also not forget that I doubt that Akuha has shown her true potential yet ( Rosario + Vampire Season II, chapter 30, page 15 ) ... and Akasha probably knows that she's against a formidable opponent which is why she has taken her seriously. ( Rosario + Vampire Season II, chapter 31, pages 32,33 )

Well I think that Moka's return to the mansion is going to put a stop to the fight between Akuha and Akasha and while I don't want to think about the outcome of that fight, since I still hope that Akasha will somehow survive this ... I think that during this whole situation Moka's Shinso power's will manifest themselves, making Akuha aware that she isn't targeting the correct person ... and during that time ... someone will probably interfere giving Moka the chance to escape.

Moka's case of transfusing her blood to Tsukune and Akasha's pregnancy are completely different matters. Moka is simply donating blood to an already living being. Akasha, on the other hand, was carrying Moka, who was relying on her blood to survive and to grow from a single-cell organism in a 9-month period (assuming vampire pregnancy lasts that long). Also, there's no telling whether or not Akasha deliberatly transferred all her power to Moka when she gave birth to her, unlike Moka who only gave Tsukune a temporary boost that inadvertetly turned into a permanent one. Moka's method was therefore different from Akasha's in that she transferred blood once at a time whereas Akasha's transfer was over an extended period of time i.e. all at once. Direct inheritence thus has a different effect altogether, the way I see it.

I mean would Akasha really lose her power since she gave birth to Moka, if that were true then Akuha would have no reason to go after her but only after Moka, although Akuha probably didnt know that a shinso having a baby takes away the parents shinso power, (if that were the case at this point we won't know until next months release or the chapter after that), so thats why she was still after Akasha.

Um guys... you're forgetting one little fact about pregnancy and why Moka getting the power of the shinso through being her daughter holds no water:

assuming that vampire pregnancy really is anything like human's, then from what I remember in health class, NOTHING from the mother actually comes in contact with the baby. Which is why Akuha's statement about it not being hereditary makes sense- it has to be through the blood, and the mother's blood doesn't come in contact with the baby's while they're in the womb

of course, for all we know, Akasha may have bitten Moka at one point to transfer the power along...

Um guys... you're forgetting one little fact about pregnancy and why Moka getting the power of the shinso through being her daughter holds no water:

assuming that vampire pregnancy really is anything like human's, then from what I remember in health class, NOTHING from the mother actually comes in contact with the baby. Which is why Akuha's statement about it not being hereditary makes sense- it has to be through the blood, and the mother's blood doesn't come in contact with the baby's while they're in the womb

of course, for all we know, Akasha may have bitten Moka at one point to transfer the power along...

You're correct on the part that blood from the mother doesn't come into contact with the fetus but Moka could've been born as a Shinso regardless of that fact. I personally don't think that Moka was born as one but the theory's still possible.

From Wiki:

Quote:

The (umbilical) cord is not directly connected to the mother's circulatory system, but instead joins the placenta, which transfers materials to and from the mother's blood without allowing direct mixing.

However, a baby takes on the DNA of both parents. It could be possible that once Akasha became a Shinso, her DNA was altered to reflect that. DNA determines your blood-type, so I would guess that in order for Akasha to continue being a Shinso is for her body to continue to produce Shinso blood after it was introduced into her system. Once she became pregnant with Moka, Akasha's DNA would transfer to Moka.

Still, this is a LONG stretch since the manga made it clear that you CAN'T become a Shinso through heredity. I don't know why people are trying to make that connection though.