Israel boycott sparks campus debate

The American Studies Association’s recent vote to boycott Israeli higher education institutions in protest of the country’s treatment of Palestinians has ignited debate across college campuses nationwide in recent months. At Brown, many professors, students and administrators said they believe the boycott inhibits academic freedom, but others expressed support for the ASA’s decision.

Academic freedom

In a statement released Dec. 24, President Christina Paxson joined over 80 presidents of U.S. colleges and three prominent scholarly organizations in the United States — the American Association of University Professors, the American Council on Education and the Association of American Universities — in opposition to the boycott, the New York Times reported.

In her statement, Paxson wrote that the boycott “would be antithetical to open scholarly exchange and would inhibit the advancement of knowledge and discovery.”

The organization’s vote aligns the ASA with the movement known as B.D.S. (Boycott, Divest and Sanctions), initiated by elements of Palestinian civil society in 2005 to call for boycotts, divestment and sanctions against Israel.

“I feel that the boycott undermines a lot of things that academic freedom should represent,” said Jason Ginsberg ’16, vice president of engagement for Brown Students for Israel. Secretary of State John Kerry is leading negotiations currently, and the boycott impedes these conversations, he added.

“If you are critical of Israel’s occupation and policies towards Palestinians, universities are where conversations about these issues are likely to occur,” said a professor of history who asked to remain anonymous to avoid appearing biased in class. “By preventing these conversations from happening, you are potentially turning against your allies,” the professor said, referencing the perception of some intellectuals in those universities as supportive of the Palestinian cause.

But others, like Associate Professor of History and American Studies Naoko Shibusawa, said they feel the boycott does not hinder academic freedom, because it targets “institutions and not individuals.” Shibusawa is a member of the American Studies Association and voted in favor of the boycott, though she continues to work with a colleague in Tel Aviv, Israel. The University’s membership expired June 30, but Shibusawa said she has maintained an individual membership and called the ASA an important space for professors and students to present their work, hold conferences and network.

Mika Zacks ’15, a member of Brown Students for Justice in Palestine and a former Herald opinions columnist, said she is “disappointed but not surprised” by Paxson’s statement.

“It’s interesting to see what kind of academic freedom is valued,” Zacks said.

“Academic freedom is denied for the Palestinians,” who are underrepresented in Israeli higher education institutions some of which, like the Hebrew University in Jerusalem,­ exist on occupied territory, she added.

Universities have a role in the occupation — they build technology and support the military, Zacks said. “There is intellectual exchange happening, but the (Israeli) institutions themselves still take a pro-Israel stance.”

‘A much wider problem’

Others argue that the boycott ignores wider problems in the Middle East.

“Israel commits human rights violations, but isolating Israel’s behavior is ignoring a much wider problem in that region,” said the history professor. “Israel’s neighbors also engage in these abuses.”

“By singling out Israel and ignoring neighboring countries with horrendous human rights records, the ASA’s boycott of Israeli academic institutions is an offensive attempt to hide bigotry behind the mask of progressivism,” Jennifer Sieber ’14 wrote in an email to The Herald.

But Zacks called the ASA boycott a “courageous step” and another victory for B.D.S.

Rising tensions

The ASA boycott has created some tension among faculty members, students and ASA members.

Despite receiving support from over 60 percent of ASA members present at the vote, some of the organization’s members disagree with the boycott. “There is a generational divide,” Shibusawa said, adding that many older scholars are opposed to the boycott.

Prior to the ASA’s vote, the Association for Asian American Studies also voted to boycott Israeli higher education institutions, and the Native American and Indigenous Studies Association plans to follow suit at its annual conference in May, according to the New York Times.

Zacks said some students within the Jewish community feel conflicted. They desire to be part of a Jewish community but feel their personal support of the Palestinian cause can sometimes isolate them from some Jewish groups — particularly Hillel, she added.

“What’s painful is I have friends on the other side,” Shibusawa said, adding that she knows people who have lost friends over this issue, she added.

In her statement, Paxson wrote that “faculty, students and staff are free to express their own ideas and opinions on any issue.”

But Shibusawa said professors nationwide are afraid to speak their minds about the boycott, because it may jeopardize their chances of getting tenure or lead to accusations of being anti-Semitic.

“When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You are talking
anti-Semitism.”

– Martin Luther King, Jr., Harvard University 1968.

mxm123

“Clearly there is much in Mississippi and Alabama to remind South Africans of their own country, yet even in Mississippi we can organise to register Negro voters, we can speak to the press, we can in short organise the people in non-violent action. But in South Africa even the mildest form of non-violent resistance meets with years of imprisonment, and leaders over many years have been restricted and silenced and imprisoned. We can understand how in that situation people felt so desperate that they turned to other methods, such as sabotage.”

Because singling out a group when others commit far worse atrocities is racist and prejudice to its core. That’s why.

mxm123

Well i’m glad you don’t deny Israeli apartheid. For a country and its shills who go on and on about how Israel is “just like America” the straw man argument is pretty pathetic.

peepsqueek

Your broad term of apartheid, is not what he was referring to, as there are more human rights afforded in Israel than in the rest of the Middle East. Do you deny that? If so, give us some examples of human rights being better under Islamic Sharia?

mxm123

More human rights for whom. Palestinians ? Please.

The Hasbara claims Israel is “just like America”. So i guess what u’r really claiming is Israel is only slightly better than Islamic Sharia. That’s a long way from “just like America”.

Arafat

mxm,

Your ability to read and process information is very limited. You do not read what we’ve written – are apparently unable to objectively address information.

Normally people are told to stick to their day jobs. Unfortunately for the world, your cut and paste bile is your day job.

itaintmojo

Not only do I vehemently disagree that Israel is apartheid, anyone who suggests so is guilty of libel and slander in my opinion. Your hate lies are akin to KKK prejudice. The walls and check points are there to keep out suicide bombers. Suicide bombing is wày down and close to eliminated since the erection of these walls. The wall are saving lies on both sides. To call these walls apartheid walls is a racist lie

mxm123

Gosh I’m really really surprised that a Israeli shill disagrees that Israel is an apartheid state. When countries build walls, they build walls on their land. Not on land stolen to build apartheid extensions.

Arafat

mxm,

We’ve discussed this issue over and over again. Your inability to address the issues your opponents raise suggests you have limited intellectual abilities.

It is possible psych meds might help you understand the nuances of this topic a little better, but until you try them I’d recommend you stick to something simpler like basic knitting.

mxm123

Arafat, or Ari our paid IDF shill, which issue. Your endless Islamophobia. Well I guess as long as u get paid for it the rest of us have to deal with it.

peepsqueek

I repeat, If human rights in the Middle East is an issue for you, then it is only fair that you use a balanced scale of application to the whole region.

mxm123

Would u have used the “balanced scale” measure to justify apartheid in South Africa. Oh wait. Never mind.

peepsqueek

Nice dodge! There is no comparison to South African apartheid.

Before the Europeans Shaka Zulu has been called a military genius for his reforms and innovations, and condemned for the brutality of his reign.

Shaka granted permission to Europeans to enter Zulu territory on rare occasions. Henry Francis Fynn provided medical treatment to the King after an assassination attempt from a rival tribe member hidden in a crowd. To show his gratitude, Shaka permitted European settlers to enter and operate in the Zulu kingdom. Big mistake. Shaka should have kept his own form of apartheid.

Arafat

Islam is a religion of Peace. That is as certain as the three slogans
of the Ministry of Truth; War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery and Ignorance is Strength.

These three slogans of the Party in George Orwell’s 1984 are
especially applicable to Islam; a religion of war that claims to be a religion of peace, whose political parties (such as the Muslim Brotherhood’s Freedom and Justice Party) use “Freedom” in their name but stand for slavery, and ignorance of its true nature creates an illusion of strength for industrialized nations that imagine that they are only battling a tiny handful of outmatched extremists.

mxm123

This coming from a guy who continuously justifies Israeli apartheid and the theft of Israeli land.

Ari, our paid IDF blogger, could you ask your IDF bosses to at least provide you with fresh material to cut and paste.

mxm123

You and the other pro-Israeli shills are the ones who use the eternal dodge of pointing at every one else when raising the topic of Israeli apartheid and the theft of Palestinians land.

And now to justify Apartheid in South Africa, you bring up Shaka Zulu. Many a colonial was invited to live in many a country. There were not invited however to strip the locals of their lands and rights. So much for your justification of South African apartheid. Am I surprise. Not in the least.

peepsqueek

That was from a historical site. If your history teach had said it, would you be accusing him of justifying apartheid?

mxm123

No historical site states that Shaka Zulu invited colonials with the intention of creating apartheid in his land. The same for India, Indonesia etc. They did not invite colonials for the purpose of loosing their freedom.

Till what point due u sit here making up fiction to justify apartheid in Israel.

Arafat

“Criticism of Israeli government policy is not in and of itself
necessarily anti-Semitic. But what else can we call criticism that selectively
condemns only the Jewish state and effectively denies its right to exist, to
defend itself while systematically ignoring or excusing the violence and
oppression all around it?”

mxm123

“excusing the violence and oppression all around it?” – You mean like chasing people out of their homes and lands to built apartheid colonies (settlements) for fanatics ?

Arafat

The Muslim demographic is the fastest growing group in Israel.
Muslims are successful lawyers, politicians, journalists, doctors in Israel.
Muslims eat in the same restaurants, shop at the same stores, go to the same universities as Jews in Israel.
Why do you feel compelled to lie?

mxm123

Muslims from say Ramallah in the West Bank “eat in the same restaurants, shop at the same stores, go to the same universities as Jews in Israel.” ?

You mean they can trapeze over the Apartheid wall and go for dinner in Haifa ? Why lie in the name of religion.

Arafat

That’s not what I wrote. The wall was built because Muslims from Ramallah blew up restaurants in Haifa.

mxm123

Ari, our paid IDF settler/blogger, you stated Muslims in Israel eat in the same restaurants as Jews in Israel. Now you’re making excuses. Why lie ?

Arafat

They’re not excuses but are facts, something you have a difficult relationship with.

mxm123

Again, Ari, our paid IDF settler/blogger, you stated Muslims in Israel eat in the same restaurants as Jews in Israel.

A lie.

itaintmojo

He did not lie. Arab customers eat in Jewish owned restos as do Isrealis frequent Arab establishments.

You are a low info brainwashed liar.

You are a hater. Your words are from pure hatred.

mxm123

Can’t deny that Palestinians from the West Bank and Gaza have no freedom to travel. Therefore the invectives.

Hasbara as usual.

itaintmojo

They can travel but must go through checkpoints You are so dishonest and poisoned with hate.

mxm123

Only if they have a permit. You call that freedom to travel. Why the invectives when i point the truth regarding Israeli apartheid.

itaintmojo

There is no truth regarding apartheid if you apply that term to Israel. Seperation there is made to deter Arab violence. Arabs sitting on the Supreme Court of Israel, and holding seats in the Knesset can hardly be described as apartheid. Arab citizens in Israel are doctors, lawyers, and business owners. They would never trade that in to move to Gaza or Syria. Your contentions are one sided and come from pure hatred. Hatred you believe has been earned. But your hate has actually brought you zilch. Except for the release of 104 murderers who are celebrated by your fellow haters. Congratulations
You keep on hating and getting nothing except your BDS hate sharing. Meanwhile Israel will continue living productive lives and helping people. Like the 700 Syrian soldiers who have been nursed back to health in Israeli hospitals during the long bloody civil war that you say nothing about. Israelis will continue on doing good. They won’t stop doing good while you sit there and hate on them and accomplish nothing but hate membership.

mxm123

It is apartheid. Tell me who represents Palestinians from the West Bank in the Knesset. Just like South Africa which propped up a few coloreds, Israeli apologists pretend that the rights granted to Israeli Arabs are the same as for Palestinians (of whom there are a lot more).

Just an endless stream of propaganda.

itaintmojo

I said Arabs citizens inside Israel.
You can only distort and accuse. But your twisted versions won’t fly with people who are not into discrimation against Israel. You only have Jew haters to agree with you. Enjoy.

Arafat

itainmojo,

Discussions are held between reasonable people which precludes mxm from any expectation of progress on this issue.

His is the mind of someone beyond reason. A brainwashed mind unable to understand nuance and fearful of any information that does not fit into his perverted worldview.

You might as well talk to a Palestinian’s donkey.

itaintmojo

Yes of course
I won’t bother with him any more. It’s quite hopeless.

It’s not just him. The venom is so far wide spread I find it down right discouraging.

But I will gather myself and continue to counter the false narratives where, and when I can. I refuse to lie down while evil tramples. And we will be ready for when they come us again.

I appreciate your words of support thanks -:)

Arafat

Discouraging indeed, but not surprising.
Anti-Semitism: Man’s oldest prejudice, eh?
You know, don’t you, that it is said that if the Jews of Europe had armed themselves (this is a theoretical discussion) the Nazi outcome could have been very different.
This is America and we still have the 2nd Amendment. Owning and being proficient with guns is not a sin and can actually be a fascinating hobby to perfect.
I think you get my drift.

mxm123

This coming from a true Islamophobe who spends countless hours posting the same vile over and over again. Crying “Anti-semitsm” to cover for apartheid and land theft is a canard well honed by apologists like you.

At least in America and unlike Israel we have the first amendment and sooner or later the truth comes out. Your second amendment threats show me what a coward you are. Especially when confronted with the truth.

mxm123

False Narrative. You mean Israeli settlements and the apartheid that Palestinians are subject to are a false narrative ?

Common accept it, the usual tactic of pro-Israeli shills on any blog is to fill it with endless invective and half truths. And your “friend” Ari (the shining star of Islamophobia) is the perfect example. And u want to blame others.

mxm123

Arafat or Ari our paid IDF shill, hearing words like “progress” from u is a sick joke. Your endless Islamophobia is on every blog known to man is there for every one to see.

A Palestinian donkey has more integrity than some of the pro-Israeli shills.

mxm123

And I asked you about rights for Palestinians. Which of course you will dance around like the Israeli Ballet.

Why is it so difficult to talk about the apartheid that Israel subjects Palestinians to that you have to raise straw man discussions like Arab Israelis. Every one knows the distinction, But u choose to blur it. Why the endless propaganda ?

peepsqueek

If you believe Israel to be a true apartheid state, please tell us all: Which Israeli hospitals refuse to admit Israeli Arabs? Which Israeli restaurants refuse to serve Israeli Arabs? Which Israeli universities refuse to admit Israeli Arabs? Which Israeli buses refuse to board Israeli Arabs? In what elections are Israeli Arabs not allowed to vote? In what area of public life are Arab women not allowed to serve?

mxm123

Can a Palestinian from Ramallah apply to go to an Israeli university. No. While Israel rules them. That along with a host of discriminatory laws you pretend don’t exist my friend is apartheid.

peepsqueek

I said “Israeli Arabs”. Why would Israel ever be required to accept Arabs to an Israeli University from outside of Israel? Please attempt to give an honest response.

mxm123

“from outside of Israel ?” – well thats where the settlements are. I’m glad you admit its outside Israel. Settlements where Jews have rights as Israeli citizens and Palestinians are consigned to apartheid.

itaintmojo

This is a moronic double standard on your part and ignores Israel’s current programs to integrate Arab Israelis into the tech sector. A Jew cannot even go for a walk in Gaza. What a racist hypocrite you are.

mxm123

Is Gaza a part of Israel. Israel wanted a state where only Jews can immigrate. And now u want to steal more land. Why the hypocrisy.

itaintmojo

Gazans would be better off and better treated if they were part of Israel.

Israel gave back Gaza in 2005, and forcibly removed Eight thousand settlers. As appreciation for this Gaza has radical Hamas throwing rockets over the walls.

At least Egypt and Jordon kept their land for peace treaties without breaking them. Arabs in Gaza and Ramallah pulled a double cross and disrespected the pacts they signed off on.

Your singling out Israel is racist. Meanwhile Abbass fills his pockets in the form of Swiss bank accounts from aid money intended for Arab people. Your one sided hate campaign will be seen for what it is the further you take it. England Supreme Court ruled against BDS yesterday. Australia court date is coming and will see BDS the same.
Only here can you spew without repercussion. But you expose your hateful prejudice nevertheless.

mxm123

Israel gave back Gaza and made it a prison. How wonderful.

You may want to update me on what pacts Arabs in Gaza and Ramallah signed of on, cause the withdrawal from Gaza was done with no negotiations. More lies.

The English court did not criminalize BDS. You may want to check your facts.

At some point you’ve got to realize, the days of endless Hasbara are over.

itaintmojo

I stand corrected. Something I will bet that you would never do.

There was no pact. My error.
The withdrawal was unilateral. Israel gave up on Gaza. The violent attacks became too much to manage. They had to get out rather than spend so much time and resources protecting settlers and military servers. Israel in this case surrendered to the intifadah. I see many quotes here from Arab leaders at the time hailing the withdrawal as a victory of the intifada.

I’m not ashamed to learn. But I will never hate. I won’t even hate haters like you.

Arafat

mxm,

You should Google “Gaza + mansions” or “Gaza + luxury resorts” or “Gaza + restaurants” to better understand just what a terrible prison Gaza really is.

You do know that Yasser Arafat stole hundreds of millions of money from the Palestinians and that Hamas is doing the same thing to the Palestinians currently.

They steal this aid money and buy European villas with it, European suits with it, expensive cars, etc….Of course they also buy weapons with this international aid.

But, of course, you would never acknowledge these facts, so I think I’ll go talk to a Palestinian donkey instead.

itaintmojo

Hey, are donkeys really that bad? Is any animal as bad as mxm?

Perhaps you should talk to herpes if you want a closer comparison.

Arafat

You are correct. No animals are as bad as he for he is like the most vile of Human beings – a Hitler acolyte.
The worst of the worst. No shame, no honor, no regard for the truth. That is mxm. A Nazi wannabe.

mxm123

Talking from both sides of your mouth are we. “I will never hate” and now “any animal as bad as mxm”.

Typical Israeli apologist. Any lie, any smear, any falsehood. All for “Dear Israel”.

mxm123

Ari, our paid IDF blogger, there were bakeries in the Warsaw ghetto, Does that mean all its residents were well fed ?

There were corrupt Jews in WWII. Does that negate what happened to them ?

Your excuses (paid for of course) are endless.

Arafat

Google “Palestinians + Obesity”.
You will discover Palestinians are among the top ten countries when it comes to obesity.
(Little known fact.)
Must be too many bakeries. LOL!!!

mxm123

Google “Israel Settlement”. The whole world is “lying” i guess.

Arafat

Palestinian territories

The Palestinians are listed at the 8th place in world overweight population rankings.[15] This is due to decreased physical activity and greater than necessary food consumption,[16]
particularly with an increase in energy coming from fat. Two other
factors are smoking and urbanization. In addition, “leisure-time
physical activity is not a common concept in the Palestinian context,
especially for rural women, where lack of sex-segregated facilities and cultural norms are prohibitive factors.” Women in urban areas face similar cultural restrictions.[9]

mxm123

A veal calf that is caged 24×7 is obese and unhealthy for its age. Did you miss the words caged, 24×7 ?

mxm123

If i make up stuff, prove it. Israel got out because it was easier to consolidate the settlements in the West Bank.

You will never hate ? Oh please. Making endless excuses for Israeli settlement policy is not hate ?

itaintmojo

The walls and checkpoints were built to minimize suicide bombers. The walls worked. Suicide bombing is way down. Now the ingrates are forced to send rockets over the walls. The wall is a defence. Your contention that the wall is apartheid is an outright lie.

peepsqueek

To add: Every rocket fired into Israel is an act of war. Suicide bombers were acts of war, and the bombers were considered heroes and added to the war of martyrs.

This is why Israel has been entitled to violate certain UN Resolutions, because under the Rules of War, anyone who “specifically” targets your non-combatants and civilian populations are no longer subject to protection under these Rules.

itaintmojo

Thank you Peepssqueek, only, in my opinion Israel has violated very little, if any valid resolutions. The only thing the haters have left to hang on Israel are the settlements, and the use of the term “occupied” lands. But in reality both are points of slander, and will never hold up in court. The Arabs keep threatening to take Israel to the ICC (International criminal court). But this will more than likely never happen. They are idle threats. Israel would present their case before any court and win on the facts. In a court of law, Arabs would be reminded of The British Mandate Of Palestine, San Remo, The Balfour Declaration, and The 1947 Partition Plan approved by the League Of Nations for the rebirth of Israel. Arabs will be reminded in court of how they refused the partition and attacked the nascent Jewish state on its first day raising its flag. Israel won that war, and Israel won in 1967, and 1973. There is the Oslo Accords which Arabs signed off to, but then totally broke their side of the agreement. Then there was the pulling out in Gaza in 2005 by Israel, for hopes of peace, and the removal of 8,000 Jewish settlers from their homes there, which only brought Israel rockets from Hamas. Then in 2009, Israel agreed to a 10 month settlement freeze from the pressure of Obama, which led to nothing but more violent hatred coming back from Abbass and his ilk. Abbass suing israel for war crimes in any court would be laughable for Arabs. Abbass himself has followed in the footsteps of Arafat and loaded up his Swiss bank accounts from aid money intended for Arabs in Ramallah and Gaza. He is a criminal, and would be a laughing stock in suing Israel.

Israel should not be giving one inch of land back to Arabs, who lost what they had because of their own hatred. Abbass, and Obama should be told to get out and stay out till Arabs officially announce their intent to respect the existence of a Jewish state, stop hate teachings, and stop jihad. Till this announcement, there is nothing to discuss, except in a court of law, or on a battlefield. BDS and the rest of the haters can keep busy with their hate slander, and continue to poison their minds, and the minds of others. Israeli’s will in the meantime continue to work, invent wonderful things for the world to benefit from, love their families, and stand ready for all comers who wish the destruction of one of the finest examples of freedom, invention, and high standard democracies the world has to offer.

peepsqueek

Israel does not have to give land back to Palestinian Arabs, because 1.5 million Palestinian Arabs live in Israel as citizens on land that hypocritical activists claim is ethnically cleansed.

Four to five million so called Palestinian Arab refugee should have the right of return to a Palestinian State, not to Israel proper.

mxm123

“Right of Return” to where. The land they could possibly return to is being stolen by Israel for settlements. How convenient of you to ignore that. But then thats par for course for an Israeli apologist.

mxm123

” In a court of law, Arabs would be reminded of The British Mandate Of Palestine, San Remo, The Balfour Declaration, and The 1947 Partition Plan approved by the League Of Nations for the rebirth of Israel. ”

All of which concluded in the United Nations creation of Israel. And the settlements lie beyond those borders. A point conveniently ignored by this Hasbara.

peepsqueek

Had Arab Countries accepted 1947 Partition Plan (a Jewish State and an Arab State living side by side in peace), Palestinian Arabs would be celebrating their 66th years of independent statehood today, with pre ’67 borders. And there would not be one single Palestinian Arab refugee.

mxm123

Not voting for a UN plan does not strip people of their rights. No UN plan ever gave Israel the Land in the West Bank. Israel just plain steals it and forces Palestinians to live under apartheid. So much for pointing to a 1947 plan that Israel openly violates.

peepsqueek

Did you forget the 5 Arab armies immediately attacked Israel after they were granted statehood. Did you over look the fact that multiple Arab countries initiated a war and lost.

mxm123

Did you forget Israel had its own terrorist groups and plans to ethnically cleanse Palestinians in 1948 ?

But nice of you to continually side step that fact that settlements are beyond Israel’s borders

peepsqueek

Jews must be very bad at ethnically cleaning as Palestinian Arabs have tripled and quadrupled their population both inside and outside of Israel proper.

Jews have lived in Judea and Samaria—the West Bank—since ancient times. The only time Jews have been prohibited from living in the territories in recent decades was during Jordan’s rule from 1948 to 1967.

mxm123

And so have Arab, who are stuck in refugee camps, in what is Israel today.

peepsqueek

The fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree: that any Arab who had resided in Palestine for only two years before 1948, and then left, would be considered a refugee and so would his descendants! This makes them the only refugees in the world whose status is hereditary. The offspring, descendants, the great great great grandchildren of anyone who left during the war in 1947-48 remain Arab refugees until the end of time in the Middle East.

mxm123

” one-time special UN decree: that any Arab who had resided in Palestine for only two years before 1948, ”

Show me this UN decree.

peepsqueek

UNRWA definition of a Palestine refugee in 1952: “A Palestine refugee is a person whose normal residence was Palestine for a minimum period of two years preceding the outbreak of the conflict in 1948 and who, as a result of this conflict has lost both his home and his means of livelihood.”

In 1993, UNRWA changed its basic definition to the one in use today: [Palestine refugee] shall mean any person whose normal place of residence was Palestine during the period 1 June 1946 to 15 May 1948 and who lost both home and means of livelihood as a result of the 1948 conflict.

This definition omitted the reference to persons of Arab origin in the 1948 General Assembly proposal, and opened the possibility of including stateless persons who had
been residents of Palestine.

mxm123

The decree does not attest that Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine. It establishes a minimum standard.

If a state univ establish a minimum two year residency standard for in-state does not mean that most of its residents have lived in that state for less than two years.

Why do u make stuff up.

peepsqueek

You are completely misrepresenting what I have posted: “ANY Arab who had resided in Palestine for only two years before 1948, and then left, would be considered a refugee and so would his descendants!”

I was wrong as the definition did not say Arabs, it said Palestinians- “This definition omitted the reference to persons of Arab origin in the 1948 General Assembly proposal, and opened the possibility of including stateless persons who had been residents of Palestine.”

mxm123

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree” – that’s your statement.

The UN decree attests none such thing.

peepsqueek

If you read the notes and additions to the 1948 UN proposal, you will find it. Where do you think the United Nations Relief and Works Agency got that definition?

mxm123

Now it’s in the notes. Sure, the UN redefined Palestinian refugee status in “notes”.

At some point quit making stuff up.

peepsqueek

I posted the exact definition of Palestinian refugees as interpreted by UNRWA, and theirs is literally no difference.

mxm123

You stated that the definition”attest that Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine”. Those are your words. Where in the definition (or in the supposed notes) does it do so ?

Nowhere.

peepsqueek

It includes those who have only resided briefly in the geographical area of Palestine. Remember, many of the Palestinian surnames indicate they are from Egypt, Iraq, Syria, Kurdistan, Morocco, Tunisia, and the Arabian Peninsula. Everyone who lived there was included, but Arabs rejected this because it would have meant acknowledging the a Jewish State.

[Every] UN Resolution has notes and additions from the open deliberations. Do your own research as you will not believe anything I post anyway. Or contactLebanon Public Information Office of UNRWA:

So you make a claim that the UN reinterpreted the status of Palestinian refugees. I ask you to prove it and you tell me to do my own research.

How can i prove a lie ? You lied and are trying to weasel away from it.

peepsqueek

Refugee status was interpreted in UN Resolution 194 [1948]. None of that really matters as all Arabs Counties rejected it. Turkey was the only Muslim State to approve. Arabs rejected any notion of a Jewish State, and continued acts of war against the Jewish State made deals impossible.

mxm123

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree” – that’s your statement. You lied

There was alteration of Palestinian refugee status to attest such. Just like Ari, our paid IDF shill, you resorted to cut and paste nonsense.

peepsqueek

You obviously did not read the resolution nor go through the notes and additions. If I am lying then UNRWA is lying. What is the statistical possibility that the UNRWA would come to the same interpretation of refugee status in 1952???– “A Palestine refugee is a person whose normal residence was Palestine for [a minimum period of TWO YEARS preceding the outbreak of the conflict in 1948] and who, as a result of this conflict has lost both his home and his means of livelihood.”

mxm123

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree” – that’s your statement.

Show me where in the resolution it attests such. You are using weasel words to conflate “minimum residency with “resided only briefly”. You lied. Just like Ari, you’re resorting to cut and paste gibberish.

peepsqueek

Go through the notes yourself, or call me a liar. The fact remains that “any one” who lived in the geographical area now known as Israel, two years prior to 1948 would be considered a refugee. It does not state that their refugee status could be passed on to their decedents until the end of time. Most of the so called Arab refugees have been born in Arab Countries. That status applies to no other refugee in the world.

mxm123

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree” – that’s your statement. You can’t prove the veracity of that statement. And ask me to read UN documents to prove a falsehood.

“That status applies to no other refugee in the world.” – Because the entire world knows Israel wants to run the clock out on them.

peepsqueek

At some point, you are going to have to give an academic response to the dozens of factual points that I have posted here.

The “decree” is an Official UN mandate or definition

Your response just now was: “The entire world knows Israel wants to run out the clock”. Can you document the factual source of that statement? Of course not!

I documented my statement by providing the UN “decree”/definition of what constitutes a Palestinian refugee. The UN is very specific about how long you had to reside in the geographical location to be considered a refugee, which is only two years. The fact that the two year limit was pushed to be in the definition should be proof enough that at least significant amounts of people must be part of that identity. So there is no clock to run out as you have stated.

mxm123

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree” – that’s your statement.

For the nth time. You stated that. And now you can’t prove it. Which only points to the fact you lied. I did not ask what constitutes a Palestinian refugee. I asked u to prove that very statement u made. And your’e just dodging the issue. Typical.

The decree that mandates that you only had to reside in the geographical area for only “two years” to be considered a refugee, regardless of where you came from.

mxm123

Why do you lie. I did not ask about the decree, which sets a minimum . You stated.

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree” –

And you can’t prove it.

peepsqueek

I am not going to sift through all the notes and additions to prove what the UNRWA states as a matter of fact: “A Palestine refugee is a person whose normal residence was Palestine for a minimum period of TWO YEARS preceding the outbreak of the conflict in 1948 and who, as a result of this conflict has lost both his home and his means of livelihood.”

mxm123

Admit it. You lied. And keep lying. I did not ask for the definition of a refugee (and u know that). You stated that the UN passed a decree admitting that Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine. A common meme spread by pro-Israeli apologists. And you can’t prove it. I repeat u lied. Prove your statement.

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree” –

peepsqueek

My original post: The fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree: “that any Arab who had resided in Palestine for only two years before 1948” The only mistake, not a lie, is that it did not say “Arab”, it said “Palestinian”, as it states in UNRWA restatement of the decree.

mxm123

You lied. You stated.

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree” –

And you’re dodging ever since.

peepsqueek

You are obsessed with making me a liar, when it is you that has lied.-
“The entire world knows Israel wants to run out the clock”. Can you document the factual source of that statement? Of course not!

mxm123

Dodge dodge dodge. I stated an opinion. You posited a “fact”. And now you’re running as fast as possible from the “fact”.

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree”

peepsqueek

All that you post has been just opinions. I have documented everything that I have stated, directly and indirectly.

That “decree” still stands today, and the very same definition still stands within the UN definition (66 years), allowing those who resided only two years in the geographical area–refugee status. If you think the word “many” makes me a liar, then so be it.

You still have not confirmed any of your opinions. You actually believe that if you can trap me, that all of your invalid arguments will automatically become valid. Good luck Mr. 123

mxm123

You lied. Plain and simple. ‘

” fact that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine is attested to by a one-time special UN decree”

It is not the word “many”. It is the above complete falsehood of a statement.

You pretended to state that the UN agreed with pro-Israeli shills like you that Arabs were marginal residents of Palestine. And i caught u lying.

peepsqueek

Your misrepresentation of what I said is a lie, because clearly there were people who only lived there briefly, and not for hundreds of years as they all claim. That is why those who lived in the geographical area for as little as two years would be considered refugees.

No matter how hard you try, you cannot change the “fact” that this one time UN decree was special, as no other refugee in the world has this kind of status. And no other refugee in the world is allowed to pass this status off to his offspring and to the children of who ever he marries until the end of time.

mxm123

Your opinion is your opinion. But to claim that the UN passed a decree to attest such is a falsehood. The UN passed no such decree on “act that many Arabs resided only briefly in Palestine ”

My opinion, on your claim “no other refugee in the world is allowed to pass this status off to his offspring and to the children of who ever he marries until the end of time.”. It is because Israel has deliberately played a game of trying to run the clock out on Palestinians refugees. So that people like u can make the above specious claim.

peepsqueek

1.5 million Arabs live in Israel proper as citizens on land that you say was ethnically cleansed. There are twenty two so called Arab Countries in the Middle East and the banner of Islam flies over 99.9% of the Middle East land mass. And you never to keep repeating “ethnic cleansing” over and over again.

Egyptians were not Arabs, nor did they speak Arabic. Syrians were not Arabs, nor did they speak Arabic, Moroccans were not Arabs, nor did they speak Arabic, Iraqis were not Arabs not did they speak Arabic, Libya was not Arab, nor did they speak Arabic, the Sudan was not Arab, nor did they speak Arabic, Tunisia was not Arab, nor did they speak Arabic. Why are they all called Arab Countries, speak Arabic, and belong to the league of Arab Nations, and live under some form of Islamic Sharia, which is from Arabia? Religious philosophy is one thing, but complete take over has a historical pattern.

mxm123

“1.5 million Arabs live in Israel proper as citizens ” – and millions more as stateless citizens. As a result of a deliberate plan of ethnic cleansing by Israel.

Pointing to every other country is just a canard.

peepsqueek

That is false, because had “Arabs” accepted the 1947 UN resolution, instead of initiating a war, not a single Palestinian Arab would have become a refugee. Four more Arab wars against the Jewish State did not help their cause when they already had the pre ’67 borderers. Not accepting Israel’s right to exist do not help their cause. The regular bombing of public transportation and crowded market places did not help their cause.

mxm123

There was Arab migration and just as there was Jewish migration into British Mandated Palestine. The cutoff point was 1948.

Palestinians married into different communities. Just like any christian or other religion. But they lived on that land. And are now refugees.

itaintmojo

Again here your info is false. It was The League of Nations approved partition. Not the UN. And Arabs said no. They refused their state which was more land they are are willing to accept now. They refused because living next to a Jewish neighbour was that repulsive to them. So instead six Arab countries attacked the nascent nation.

mxm123

Voting No does not strip you of the benefits/obligations of a United Nations vote. Quit making stuff up. And of course the “nascent nation” performed its own share of ethnic cleansing at that time.

itaintmojo

I am not here to make stuff up. Everything I wrote to you is easily verifiable. You even make attempts to distort my comments which were totally honest.

Yes, Jews must share responsibility for the exodus of 1948. Share being the key word. It is clearly documented that Arabs had a hand on this exodus as well.
It is very basic to deduce that there would have been no exodus had Arabs chosen to agree to the partition. It was you who distorted the truth by implying that only Jews were responsible for this flight.

Israel is far from perfect. But they are far kinder than all the neighbouring countries. Kinder to Arabs ironically. To single Israel out is pure KKK style discrimination.

mxm123

Not to worry. You make up plenty of stuff. Your half truths, just like the Hasbara of every other pro Israeli shill has to be constantly challenged.

The settlements lie beyond the 1948 borders. So why are u pretending that Arab rejection of 1948 justifies their apartheid existence today.

Israel is far from perfect. Except of course for that pesky thing called apartheid it practices on its Palestinians. Quit raising straw man arguments.

itaintmojo

I made up nothing. I told it like it is.

You are an intolerant hater. You single out one people.

I think I will let you have the last word because you are completely unfair and far too poisoned with hatred. I can only thank you for exposing yourself for what you are. A racist who singles out one group to a higher standard then what is expected from anyone other group. You represent prejudice and discrimination.

mxm123

Single out one people ? In a discussion about Israel who should i single out. The Jehovahs ?

What’s the intolerance about me ? I post and counter post about Israeli apartheid and the theft of settlements. Why is that hate, Its the truth. Every country in the world has stated that Israeli settlements are illegal. And you call that prejudice and discrimination.

Quit playing “eternal victim”. Those days are over.

EatGentilesGetMoney

“The Palestinians are like crocodiles, the more you give them meat, they want more”…. Ehud Barak, Prime Minister of Israel at the time – August 28, 2000. Reported in the Jerusalem Post August 30, 2000.

* ” (The Palestinians are) beasts walking on two legs.” Menahim Begin, speech to the Knesset, quoted in Amnon Kapeliouk, “Begin and the Beasts”. New Statesman, 25 June 1982.

* “The Palestinians” would be crushed like grasshoppers … heads smashed against the boulders and walls.” ” Isreali Prime Minister (at the time) in a speech to Jewish settlers New York Times April 1, 1988.

* “When we have settled the land, all the Arabs will be able to do about it will be to scurry around like drugged cockroaches in a bottle.” Raphael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defence Forces, New York Times, 14 April 1983.

* “How can we return the occupied territories? There is nobody to return them to.” Golda Maier, March 8, 1969.

* “There was no such thing as Palestinians, they never existed.” Golda Maier Israeli Prime Minister June 15, 1969.

* “The thesis that the danger of genocide was hanging over us in June 1967 and that Israel was fighting for its physical existence is only bluff, which was born and developed after the war.” Israeli General Matityahu Peled, Ha’aretz, 19 March 1972.

* Ben Gurion also warned in 1948 : “We must do everything to insure they ( the Palestinians) never do return.” Assuring his fellow Zionists that Palestinians will never come back to their homes. “The old will die and the young will forget.”

* “We declare openly that the Arabs have no right to settle on even one centimeter of Eretz Israel… Force is all they do or ever will understand. We shall use the ultimate force until the Palestinians come crawling to us on all fours.” Rafael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defense Forces – Gad Becker, Yediot Ahronot 13 April 1983, New York Times 14 April 1983.

* “We must do everything to ensure they (the Palestinian refugees) never do return” David Ben-Gurion, in his diary, 18 July 1948, quoted in Michael Bar Zohar’s Ben-Gurion: the Armed Prophet, Prentice-Hall, 1967, p. 157.

* “We should prepare to go over to the offensive. Our aim is to smash Lebanon, Trans-Jordan, and Syria. The weak point is Lebanon, for the Moslem regime is artificial and easy for us to undermine. We shall establish a Christian state there, and then we will smash the Arab Legion, eliminate Trans-Jordan; Syria will fall to us. We then bomb and move on and take Port Said, Alexandria and Sinai.” David Ben-Gurion, May 1948, to the General Staff. From Ben-Gurion, A Biography, by Michael Ben-Zohar, Delacorte, New York 1978.

* “We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population.” Israel Koenig, “The Koenig Memorandum.”

mxm123

“Israel has been entitled to violate certain UN Resolutions” – We all get the picture. Stealing land for settlements is one of those “entitled” actions.

peepsqueek

I repeat: Had Arab Countries accepted 1947 Partition Plan (a Jewish State and an Arab State living side by side in peace), Palestinian Arabs would be celebrating their 66th year of independent statehood today, with pre ’67 borders. And there would not be one single Palestinian Arab refugee.

mxm123

You conveniently side step the fact that there was a deliberate pogrom to expel Palestinians in 1948. Just because Arabs did not accept the 1947 Partition Plan doesn’t mean they loose their land. And incidentally the settlements lies in land not granted to Israel in 1948.

Nice of u to quote a UN vote and side step the fact that Israel openly steals land outside its UN recognized borders.

itaintmojo

Another false narrative here misrepresenting history. Jews were not solely responsible for the flight of Arabs in 1948. Many Arab leaders urged evacuation till after the Jews were driven out and defeated. And some Jewish officials begged the Arabs not to leave. This is well documented. Your omission cannot erase this. The Arab exodus has shared blame from both sides. And of course it’s quite clear no exodus would have occurred had Arabs decided to accept the partition rather than attack. You are extremely dishonest.

“During the ‘long seminar’, a meeting of Ben-Gurion with his chief advisors in January 1948, the departure point was that it was desirable to ‘transfer’ as many Arabs as possible out of Jewish territory, and the discussion focussed mainly on the implementation.[18]:63 The experience gained in a number of attacks in February 1948, notably those on Qisarya and Sa’sa’, was used in the development of a plan detailing how enemy population centers should be handled.[18]:82 According to Pappé,plan Dalet was the master plan for the expulsion of the Palestinians.[18]:82”

Lies, lies and more lies. Anything to cover for apartheid.

itaintmojo

I admitted shared responsibility. Israeli officials did get opportunistic on occasion, but only when being attacked. The war in 1948 lasted 15 months. While Arabs were attempting to expell Israel some Arabs themselves got expelled. It’s called war. Arabs lost the war.

It is you who refuse to acknowledge the Arab contribution to the flight. Fairness in documenting what really happened goes against your hate campaign so you leave out those details.

You and your fellow haters will be seen for what you are so I suggest you all stick together in your hate club. It’s all you are going to get out of it. Your togetherness of hate.

mxm123

The usual excuses….”only when being attacked”. Please. The plan to drive away civilians was a distinct one.

I don’t make up stuff. I only point out lies in the age old Hasbara. Used to justify the continuing ethnic cleansing of Palestinians in the territories. Get used to it.

And our little mental midget (mxm) sees black when there is white and dark when there is light.

Might as well talk to a Palestinian’s donkey for all the good it does,

mxm123

Ari , our paid IDF blogger, are u going to update your “statistics” to tell us how many Palestinians were chased away from their homes in Israel. I thought Israel was “just like America”. Oh wait Israel is actually just like Somalia, Libya, Pakistan. You lied. Shocker. Just like most of these “statistics”.

Arafat

Mxm’x awake.
Time for simplistic drivel.

mxm123

Ari, our paid IDF shill, its the late shift at his ethnically cleansed settlement. Time to cut and paste more Islamophobic nonsenses.

mxm123

You never admitted shared responsibility. I just pointed out u were making up stories, at which point u back track.

Arab contribution to the flight has nothing to do with the Israeli settlement pogrom and the apartheid existence of Palestinians in the territories. Continuously using straw man arguments displays the vacuousness of your arguments.

Arafat

A report issued by the Palestinian Independent
Commission for Human Rights (ICHR) this week criticized the Palestinian Authority [PA] and Hamas for assaults on human rights and freedoms in the West Bank and Gaza Strip.

The report, which has been ignored by mainstream media and human rights organizations in the West, reveals that 10 Palestinians died in January 2014 in the West Bank and Gaza Strip as a result of anarchy, lawlessness and misuse of weapons.

The report also lists cases of torture and mistreatment in PA and Hamas prisons. ICHR pointed to an increase in the number of torture cases in prisons belonging to the PA’s much-feared Preventive Security Service in the West Bank.

During January, ICHR wrote that it received 56 complaints about torture and mistreatment in Palestinian prisons: 36 in the Gaza Strip and 19 in the West Bank. In addition, the human rights organization received innumerable complaints about arbitrary and unlawful arrests of Palestinians by the PA and Hamas.

Arafat

The Palestinian expulsion from Kuwait or 1991 Palestinian
exodus from Kuwait took place at the end of the Gulf War, when Kuwait expelled almost 450,000 Palestinians.[1] The policy which led to this exodus was a response to the alignment of Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat and the PLO with Saddam Hussein, who had earlier invaded Kuwait. The exodus took place during one week in March 1991, following Kuwait’s liberation from Iraqi occupation. The story received little media attention in the aftermath of the liberation of Kuwait.

The policy which led to this expulsion was a response to the
alignment of Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat and the PLO with Saddam Hussein, who had earlier invaded Kuwait. The expulsion took place during one week in March 1991, following Kuwait’s liberation from Iraqi occupation. On March 14, only 150,000 Palestinians were still residing in Kuwait, out of initial 450,000 – many of them fearful for their fate.[4]

In total, Kuwait expelled 443,000 Palestinians.[1] Several
Palestinians were killed by vigilante groups including some with links to the royal family.[5] With the completion of the exodus only 7,000 Palestinians remained.[1]

Kuwaitis said that Palestinians leaving the country could
move to Jordan, and that most Palestinians held Jordanian passports.[4] No reports of where the Palestinans actually went to after the expulsion have appeared.

itaintmojo

Yes, I recall this but had forgotten. Thanks for the refresher. And let’s not forget that approximately 800, 000 Jews were forced out of Arab lands in and around 1948. Israel took them all in. Israel is now taking Aliyah from French Jews who have had enough of hate and see a dark future. Looks like 8,000 French Jews will be moving to Israel in the coming year with a total of 30,000 in the next 5 years.

Arafat

Actually many of those 800,000 Jews who were forced out of Muslim countries settled in America and France as well as in Israel.
Ironic that those who fled to France – not that long after the Vichy French allied themselves with Hitler – are now seeing the Europeans true colors.

Arafat

In line with this thread check this out:

There are two UN refugee agencies in the world: First is the
United Nations Relief and Works Administrations (UNRWA) for 5 million Palestinian refugees (which includes the descendants of the original 500,000 Palestinian refugees from the Israeli War of Independence) which employs 30,000
workers. The UNRWA has resettled no Palestinians.

The second refugee agency is the United Nations High
Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR), which assists every other refugee in the world–including 100 million displaced people during the last 50 years–and employs 7,000 people. The UNHCR has resettled tens of millions of refugees.

Looking at these numbers, one would think that the cause of
the Palestinians is somehow morally superior to that of all other war refugees. After all, why have so many more workers been assisting a dramatically smaller group of people? But if the Palestinians are unique it is only because of their moral inferiority, as they are the only group of refugees that regularly commit acts of terrorism against innocent civilians.

Another obvious question: why hasn’t the UNRWA resettled any
of the Palestinian refugees? The answer, of course, is that the
surrounding Arab states would rather have these refugees remain a thorn in Israel’s side, than help them start a new life. The UNRWA is happy to oblige.

itaintmojo

You most likely have heard of the site American Thinker, but if not, I believe you will appreciate it. Its my daily dose of sanity, that keeps my faith in humanity. Chock full of truth and ignored facts. Thoughtful, intelligent bloggers for the most part too. I’ll bet dollars to donuts you will like it a lot!
Good evening 🙂

Arafat

I do know the site.
You might give Gatestone Institute a look-see.
Also great information and analysis.
Best wishes,
Arafat

mxm123

For which they were given a land called Israel. Now the fanatics want to steal more land. And pretend that they are for peace.

mxm123

“Jews were not solely responsible ” -Weasel Words. Which means Jews did it too, but until u catch me on this lie i will pretend that only Arabs did it. Same old Hasbara.

peepsqueek

Many left to get out of the way of a war in which Arabs started to remove the newly formed Jewish state from the map.

mxm123

And a lot were plain ethnically cleansed.

Arafat

If they were ethnically cleansed then why is the Muslim population in Israel currently at an all time high?

Why do you lie, lie, lie and then lie some more?

Are you nuts or just demented?

mxm123

South African blacks were ethnically cleansed into Bantustans. They had a growing population too. Does that mean there was no apartheid in South Africa. Just like Israel ?

peepsqueek

Ethnically cleansed and apartheid have two different definitions.

mxm123

Ari, our paid IDF settler/blogger, the African population in the Bantustans grew during Apartheid South Africa. Does than mean there was no apartheid.

Your fanaticism points to just lies, lies and more lies. Any lie, any smear is OK by u.

peepsqueek

You make good points without being completely circumspect. From 1948–67, the West Bank and Gaza were under Arab rule, and no Jewish settlements existed there, but the Arabs never set up a Palestinian state. Instead, Gaza was occupied by Egypt, and the West Bank by Jordan. No demands for a West Bank/Gaza independent state was ever heard of. Why?

Why did a number of Arabs Countries continue to attack the tiny Jewish State before there were any settlements in the West Bank or Gaza?

mxm123

No Palestinians state existed, but Palestinians were given full freedom. Not consigned to Bantustans with settlements for fanatics built around them.

The “tiny Jewish” state with plenty of American help (actually tens of billions), started its own share of wars. Don’t give me the “defensive” war baloney,

peepsqueek

Lets go back a little bit to the British Passport Palestine which was a travel document for Palestinians (both Jews and Arabs), because of the British mandate they were internationally regarded as British Protected Persons and were allowed in foreign countries to use British consulates because they did not have their own Country. Sounds ridiculous that Jews and Arabs did not have their own Country in the Middle East. Doesn’t that sound ridiculous to you?
Under the Ottomans they had to have documents to move from one territory to another. Today their are 22 so called independent Arab States and 1 tiny Jewish State. You don’t like it, what can I do?

mxm123

What’s ridiculous about it. Both communities shared a land in relative harmony. It was towards the end of the colonial era.

Having documents to move around, is different than being lined up in cattle pens for hours to receive permission to move around in their own land.

peepsqueek

Orthodox Jews are fanatics, even if they are tame by comparison to Islamic fanatics.

The most successful Muslim operation of the last two centuries has been the ethnic cleansing and removal of millions of Christians, Jews, Hindus and Buddhists from the so-called Islamic world. There are 57 Muslims Countries, all members of the United Nation’s Organization of Islamic Cooperation. What happened to all the indigenous people and beliefs that “rejected” Islam during the Arab/Islamic invasions?

In the year 1900, there were only 53 [independent] Countries. Arabs do not appear to realize in the first place that the present position of the Arab world is mainly due to the sacrifices made by the Allied and Associated Powers in War I and, secondly, that, insofar as the Balfour Declaration helped to bring about the Allies’ victory, it helped to bring about the emancipation of all the Arab countries from Turkish rule. If the Turks and their German allies had won the War, it is improbable that all the Arab countries would now have become independent states.

itaintmojo

Orthodox Jews may be over zealous but they do not indoctrinate Jihad. If you leave them alone, they will leave you be too. Not so with intolerant Sharia Arabs. Big difference.

mxm123

Stealing land to establish apartheid is not “Jihad”. Oh wait, I’m responding to an Israeli apologist.

Arafat

While I find it highly questionable that “not a single Israeli academic
institution has petitioned their government to protect the Palestinian right to
education,” perhaps that is because they are too busy giving those
students an education (including building the very Palestinian universities
that didn’t exist until the start of the dreaded “Occupation”).

And the accusation that Palestinians students are “forced to remain
silent or face persecution” would be news indeed to that Tel Aviv
University graduate student Omar Barhouti who has not only benefited from being
enrolled in a world class Israeli university (a subject he would rather not
discuss or have discussed) but is also free to travel the globe as leader of
the BDS “movement” calling for the very school he attends to be
shunned.

mxm123

Actually none of the Palestinian universities were built or funded by Israel. But nice of Ari, our paid IDF settler/blogger, to take credit falsely.

Ari, our paid IDF settler/blogger, won’t tell u that Palestinians from the West Bank cannot apply and attend any university in Israel proper. Because he’s too busy making up stories of “equality”

Arafat

This is also not true. Muslims from the West Bank do attend Israeli universities all the time.
It’s a shame with the endless billions in aid the Palestinians receive they couldn’t figure out how to build a university, but, there it is.

mxm123

Ari, our paid IDF settler/blogger, the billions in aid Palestinians receive is not from Israel. So quit pretending that Israel built those institutions.

And quit lying that any Palestinian from the West Bank can apply for university in Israel.

itaintmojo

No one is paying me to blog. Bargouti the big wig at BDS attended university of Tel-Aviv.

Arab citizens of Israel are by far the best treated Arabs of any country in the Middle East. No Arab Israeli citizen would move to Gaza or anywhere around there.

It is you who are a liar and hater

Should Sodastream go under from the hateful BDS Slander campaign that singles out only one country, then BDS will be solely responsible for the job loss of over 500 Arabs who need work to make their living.

mxm123

Are Palestinians from the West Bank free citizens of Israel. Nope. So what exactly are u crowing about.

mxm123

Liar and Hater. Confront and Israeli shill about apartheid and the vile comes gushing.

Arab citizens does not include millions of Arabs under Israeli rule. Good way to dodge though.

itaintmojo

BDS is nothing more than a hate club. They hate Israel They want Israel destroyed. BDS ignore historical realities to spread slander against Israel. BDS singles out only Israel in its libel campaign.

In the end the only accomplishment they will have is the kinship of hatred they promote.

Israel has and will have plenty of customers and BDSers will only have their vicious racist hate to show for their ultra prejudice position.

mxm123

People will hate u if you steal their land. Really.

Arafat

Who lived in north Africa, the Middle East and Asia before Muslim Jihadist hordes stole that land?

mxm123

Ari, the settler out paid IDF blogger, Israel steals land today. Thats a bit different than Stone Age, Ice Age or whatever age history u wish to use.

itaintmojo

Another mischaracterization through omission by your ilk. Arabs attempted to destroy Israel in 1948 on it first day of rebirth. They failed in this attempt. Arab haters of Israel again failed in 1967, and 1973 to annihilate the Jewish state. Land taken by Israel was for buffer zones against future attacks. Syria used to throw stones from the top of the mountain at the Golan heights. Israel took the top of the mountain and now Syrians can no longer lob projectiles downwards.
Land won during defensive wars is not “stolen land” and should not be given back to butchers who refuse to respect the existence of a Jewish state. You cannot erase history with your omissions.

mxm123

Oh brother. You want to pretend that Israeli leaders had no organized plan to evict as many Palestinians as they could get away with. And further want to pretend that Israel did not start some of these conflicts.

There is no concept called “defensive war”. Quit making stuff up as an excuse to subject Palestinians to apartheid.

If Israel wanted to get rid of Palestinians believe me they would. Just listen to Avigdor Lieberman and Naftali Bennett.

mxm123

And believe me they try really hard, Ask Avigdor Lieberman and Naftali Bennet. They have plans at the ready.

peepsqueek

The Palestinian Authority and Hamas wants to define “Palestine” as an Arab and Muslim State. They have applied to the United Nations for Statehood, and to be a 23rd Arab Country. They want Jerusalem to be a 23rd Arab Capital. This is quite hypocritical of a Government who believes that a Jewish State has no right to exist.

alex33

The hypocrisy goes both ways (visa versa too).

peepsqueek

Can you be very specific?

The implication of many settlement critics is that it would be better for peace if the West Bank were empty of Jews. This idea would be called anti-Semitic if Jews were barred from living in New York, Paris or London, but barring them from living in the West Bank, the cradle of Jewish civilization, the birth place of Solomon, David, and Jesus is called what?? Give it that a name!

Jews have lived in Judea and Samaria [the West Bank] since ancient times. The only time Jews have been prohibited from living in the territories in recent decades was during Jordan’s rule from 1948 to 1967.

mxm123

If you don’t want Jews to be barred from any place, then the same logic should apply for ALL Palestinians. Oh wait, that would be too inconvenient to advocate for.

Your religious history ends where my rights begin. The nation of Israel was created by the UN to accommodate Jews. Now fanatic Jews and their allies pretend as if the UN never drew any borders.

peepsqueek

With all the Arab wars against the Jewish State, and after subsequent defeats, Arabs created the doctrine of the limited-liability war. Under this theory, an aggressor may reject a compromise settlement and gamble on war to win everything in the comfortable knowledge that, even if they fail, they may insist on reinstating the status quo in the original UN Mandate Partition Plan.

What do you think Arabs were prepared to do to the Jews if they had won any of those wars?

mxm123

And may i add Jewish wars against arabs. Oh, please don’t give me the baloney about “defensive” wars.

Israel uses wars as an excuse for its colonization and apartheid. And Israel knows it operates under the doctrine of a guaranteed veto at the UN, thanks to its American poodle politician support. So it invents “laws” to excuse its apartheid.

What do u think Israel did when it won those wars. Or what do u think it did in Lebanon.

itaintmojo

Pardon, I try and avoid denigration in these posts but your contention that defensive wars are baloney is ignorant lunacy. Of course Arabs attacked. Anyone who gets attacked anywhere has a right to defend themselves. You are a bald faced liar.

mxm123

More lies…

“The Egyptian army concentrations in the Sinai approaches do not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. (…) We decided to attack him”.[13][14] – Menachim Begin.

In the past these lies used to work. Now unfortunately for the Israeli apologists there is the Internet and free media.

itaintmojo

What about 1948 and 1973? Those were not pre-emptive. But you hatefully bring up only 1967. This shows how totally unfair you are. If you want to sit there and push that Nasser lined up his army in Sinai for nothing go right ahead. Nasser also cut off the shipping port at the time. Both are acts of war and were instigation. Your hate cannot erase what really happened.

1967 – Quit making up excuses. An Israeli Prime Minister himself admitted that the preemption was a lie.

Hasbara. It never ends.

itaintmojo

Israel had no plan to cleanse. They reacted to Arabs rejecting a Jewish state. They reacted to 6 Arab neighbour countries attacking them. Without the Arab attack there would have been no exodus. That’s so obvious. You are hopeless. Please just keep doing what you are doing and finish the job of destroying Israel when you can. Otherwise if you can’t succeed in destroying Israel you might be thankful they let you live at all instead of allowing you to cry victim after you attack.

“During the ‘long seminar’, a meeting of Ben-Gurion with his chief advisors in January 1948, the departure point was that it was desirable to ‘transfer’ as many Arabs as possible out of Jewish territory, and the discussion focussed mainly on the implementation.[18]:63 The experience gained in a number of attacks in February 1948, notably those on Qisarya and Sa’sa’, was used in the development of a plan detailing how enemy population centers should be handled.[18]:82 According to Pappé,plan Dalet was the master plan for the expulsion of the Palestinians.[18]:82”

How do you even make this stuff up with a straight face ?

Arafat

If Israel wanted to “cleanse” Palestinians then they are not doing a very good job. How do you explain this reality?

Why are Palestinians given the same medical care as Israelis?

Why is Israel’s Muslim demographic growing?

Why is this if your lies about cleansing are true?

You want ethnic cleansing? Then study Islamic countries where the non-Muslim demographics are in severe decline, not Israel.

mxm123

Ari our paid IDF settler/blogger. Still denying that there was no such ethnic cleansing ?

Update us when your definition of Palestinians include ALL Palestinians. Why the half-truths ?

mxm123

Nice of you to blithely ignore the evidence i pointed to you that Israel did , in 1948, have a deliberate plan to ethnically cleanse Palestinians.

But then as a paid IDF shill, your cut and paste blurbs don’t address any question. Just endless Islamophobic Hasbara.

itaintmojo

Again here you try and erase The British Mandate Of Palestine who were the rulers of this land after the fall of The Ottoman Empire. The Brits made clear that a portion of land would be designated for the rebirth of Israel. Arabs revolted but were not the controlling government. The Brits decided there would be an Israel. The League Of Nations (not the UN) agreed. Only hateful Arabs called it Nakba. How ironic that what land Abbass says he would accept now for a Palestinian state, is less land than what Palestine would be now, had they accepted the 1947 partition plan. Your hate cannot erase history.

mxm123

Again what u try and avoid is that the land that Israel steals for settlements lies outside its UN borders. It’s the height of hypocrisy to point to a UN resolution and then the very moment make excuses for stealing land and subject people to apartheid in contravention of that very UN resolution. You Hasbara can’t change facts.

itaintmojo

Drivel. You can spew your hateful false versions here with impunity but none of your drivel would stand in a court of law. Israel defended itself and won. And we will be ready for when you come again. And when you lose next time you will be penalized again for your violent flagrant hateful attacks. Don’t expect to attack and hate and get goodies for it.

mxm123

A court of law ? Would Israel ever present itself. Never. It’s easier to cry “anti-semitism”. Quit making excuses for apartheid.

itaintmojo

I am not avoiding anything. Arabs said no to a Jewish neighbour and attacked. You ignore this basic fact. You ignore that if Arabs had said yes to the partition they would have had their statehood with more territory than what they say they would accept now. Arabs attacked and lost in their effort to destroy Israel. That is not an excuse. It’s called doing what you have to do to survive. Your distortion would be laughed out of any legitimate court of law. Next time try and figure out a way to get the job done and make sure your attempts to destroy Israel actually work. But if you fail I think whining and distorting what happened will get you nothing.

mxm123

And what you continue to ignore/avoid is the fact that settlements are outside the land granted to Israel by the UN. The hypocrisy of claiming a UN mandate while ignoring another UN mandate.

Hasbara has no limits.

itaintmojo

What is being avoided and ignored is respect and recognition of the existence of a Jewish state by Arabs in Gaza and Ramallah. Instead the officisls in those areas have indoctrinated in their school curriculams hate teachings towards Jews and Israel.

Even at this moment Bibi is coonsidering accepting Obama’s unfair proposal because Israelis are desperate for peace. Israel has a proven track record of giving land for peace. They gave back the Sinai in 1979 for peace that so far has been honoured by Egyptians. But Arabs in Gaza lied when they got back Gaza, and continued jihad. Arabs in Gaza and Ramsllah are not to be trusted in my opinion. They deserve nothing till they formally announce the end of Jihad and hate teachings.

mxm123

Recognition of a Jewish State. Ah, I guess that’s why Israel is busy grabbing land for settlements.

Desperate for peace ? Really. You don’t continuously steal land for settlements and pretend your all for peace.

You’ve yet to state what did the Arabs lie when they got back Gaza. It was an unilateral withdrawal. Why are u making up stuff now ?

Arafat

At the Oslo Accords Yasser Arafat was offered 97% of the West Bank and he walked out.
Israel returned the entire Sinai Peninsula to Egypt.
Israel withdrew all settlers from Gaza.
With Israel’s military might she did not need to do any of these things but she did in the interest of fair play.
But fair play with Muslims seems like an exercise in futility.
(See Sudan, Somalia, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Bahrain and human rights to better understand this.)

mxm123

Do remind us of the discontinuous Bantustans that Arafat was offered as a “state”. Or the settlers from Gaza who were withdrawn only to be relocated on settlements in the West Bank. One stolen land swapped for another.

Even Apartheid South Africa was a mighty nation.

mxm123

Respect and recognitions. You don’t earn it when u set about stealing land for settlements. Don’t talk about indoctrination when u have cultish settlers running around and destroying Palestinians farms etc, all with the tacit support of the govt.

What track record, when it comes to the Palestinians. Before during and after Oslo, Israel stole land for settlements. What agreement in Gaza ? That’s an open falsehood. The Gaza withdrawal was unilateral. Why keep coming up with falsehoods and pretend as if Israel is the eternal victim ?

Arafat

In November 1947, the UN adopted UNSCOP’s findings and voted in favor of the partition. The UN General Assembly’s partition plan was merely a suggestion and had no legal binding authority. The Jews accepted the partition plan and the Arabs flatly rejected it, setting the stage for the first Arab-Israeli War and an Arab invasion.

Had the Arab’s accepted the partition, international boundaries between Jewish and Arab states would have been established and the matter settled. In the absence of such a settlement, the only legal, binding authority was the League of Nations Mandate for Palestine, which designated the whole of Palestine, including the West Bank, as the future Jewish homeland.

So when state if “Arab’s accepted the partition” that would have still enabled Israel, under your “suggestion” theory, to steal their land. Cause after all any UN vote on Israel’s border was just a “suggestion”

alex33

Israel -including the occupied territories- is the only country on Earth where we have Apartheid.
Time to change it without violence rather then waiting until it will be done with violence. I support the non-violent boycott.

peepsqueek

I will ask the question again: How many Islamic Countries are you boycotting today for institutionalized apartheid, gender apartheid, sectarian apartheid, minority apartheid, religious apartheid, etc?

The marginalization of the Iranian Bahai’s by current governments is rooted in historical efforts by Muslim clergy to persecute the religious minority.

GENEVA — 15 March 2013 — The cradle-to-grave attacks against Bahais in Iran represent one of the broadest and most obvious cases of state-sponsored religious persecution in the world, said Heiner Bielefeldt, the UN Special Rapporteur on freedom of religion or belief. Speaking on 6 March 2013 in Geneva at a side event during the 22nd session of the Human Rights Council, Dr. Bielefeldt discussed the release of a new report by the Baha’i International Community, which documents rising violence against Iranian Baha’is and the utter impunity enjoyed by attackers.

alex33

Your Question was:
“I will ask the question again: How many Islamic Countries are you boycotting today for institutionalized apartheid, gender apartheid, sectarian apartheid, minority apartheid, religious apartheid, etc?”
As usual you are using semantics to Justify your point. You think that if we call the Israeli occupation Apartheid then you are going to call Apartheid any other existing problem, and the case is solved. Not so (except for you of course).
Never the less, those are legitimate problems that you are mentioning, and should be dealt with in the future.
As for the present, we have to go in order. South Africa was the first and Israel was chosen as second for the reason that we could solve non-violently an outstanding problem that unlikely could be solved with violence, and has been threatening with world war for a very long time.
In the meantime we should not forget about other outstanding injustice, many of which you well pointed out above.

peepsqueek

The Middle East should have a homeland for Assyrians, Copts, Kurds, Jews, and others. Here are a few examples-

Kurd Net Daily Online News:
“For years the 30 million Kurds spread across those territories have been the world’s largest ethnic group without an independent homeland. Only the Kurds in Iraq, who displaced Iraqi forces in the 1990s when a U.S. and British no-fly zone was in place against Saddam Hussein, have managed to carved out an area of real autonomy.”

Coptic News:
“Since Christianity came to Egypt in 57 A.D., we, the Christians of Egypt, have not had conflict with the Jewish people. Copts have been a marginal population held in captivity for sixteen centuries. We constitute the largest non-Arab, non-Moslem minority in the Middle East. The Church of Alexandria, is one of the oldest organizations in the Middle East. Despite this distinguished history, it is a church that has been under siege since the Islamic invasion.”

Assyrian News Agency:
“Keep in mind that these Christian minorities, the Assyrians, Armenians, Copts, are actually the original inhabitants of these areas with roots going back thousands of years before Christianity. What we’re seeing is a systematic attempt to cleanse the Middle East of its original inhabitants, this is a continuation of the genocide that took place in Ottoman Turkey in 1915.”

alex33

Yes, these are legitimate problems. The difference is that the Palestina/Israel problem has brought us close to world war several times already.
+ The Israelis/Jews are using massive international resources (money, trade, finances etc…) to support the Palestinian occupation, while Palestina is a poor country/nation with very limited financial resources.
Therefore the BOYCOTT AGAINST ISRAEL IS FULLY JUSTIFIED.

Arafat

“To clarify: Wahhabism is the only officially
recognized and allowed religion in Saudi Arabia. Other forms of Islam and other
religions are banned and persecuted by the state.

Saudi Arabia is the only Islamic state in which there is no
church, no synagogue and no other place of worship of any other religion.

Shiite Muslims have been systematically discriminated
against for decades. Jews are even forbidden to enter the Kingdom.

Saudi Arabia practices a form of Sharia law that is one of
the most brutal systems in the world. Saudi Arabia has at all times rejected
the Universal Declaration of Human Rights of 1948.

Women may not drive a car and can be punished by flogging.
Corporal punishment, including amputations and executions, are part of everyday
life in the country. Just two weeks ago a Sudanese immigrant in Saudi Arabia
was publicly beheaded for ‘sorcery.’ Saudi Arabia is one of the few countries
in the world in which the death penalty is enforced even on teenagers,”
the paper said.

peepsqueek

2.5 million Sudanese tribal Africans were displaced a few years back by the Muslim Central Government. They are still receiving international aid, mostly from the West.

As for Saudi Arabia, no non-Muslims can enter their holiest City. Talk about religious apartheid!

Arafat

peepsqueek,
Very true.
Few people know Saudi Arabia was once a very diverse land with Christians, Zoroastrians and Jews living there, but Mohammed and his followers changed all that.
Today, in fact, there is not one single non-Muslim citizen, but you never hear about academic organizations calling for boycotts of Saudi Arabia, now do you?

peepsqueek

I am afraid the far left does not want to rile over one billion people. You saw how mush heat and boycotting from the Islamic world that Denmark took over one political cartoon with a depiction of Mohammad, and the cartoonist was later attacked in his own home by a Somali Muslim with an axe.

Arafat

I think it’s worse than that.
I think the left is so stupid that their natural allies are always those they perceive as the downtrodden so they naturally ally themselves with Muslims – because, Muslims are always downtrodden.
Problem is Muslims are always downtrodden because their religion’s core tenets insure its adherents are backwards looking and disinterested in things that would change their standing.
But worse than that: Islam also insures that Muslims view those on the left as inferior. For anyone who knows even a little bit about Islam understands all infidels are inferior and are not worth associating with Muslims on equal footing.
So the left, knee-jerk thinkers that they are, sympathize with people who would destroy them if given the chance to do so.
You cannot get much dumber than that!

peepsqueek

I like all the Muslims that I know, but I have a big problem with Islamists and political Islam. As for the political left, no Islamist will ever support any liberal causes from women’s rights to gay rights, from marital rights to religious rights.

Arafat

I agree with everything you write.
I have no problems with Muslims. They are people just like you and I. The difference lies with the socializing aspects of their religion.
Just as, say, those in an Amish culture tend to develop certain predictable traits so do Muslims living in the Islamic world. And those traits are shaped by a religion that IS supremacist, misogynist, and whose end-goal is domination over all others.
I do not mean to imply Muslims are born different but only to suggest that anyone from any culture is typically shaped by that culture/religion. Furthermore Muslim religion/culture is backwards looking, cruel and disinterested in most values that we hold dear.

peepsqueek

As an American of mixed blood and mixed cultural heritage, as is our President, I can see what is wrong with the US, as no one is more critical of America and American government than Americans. And that is partly what makes us great, as we have a left, right, centrist, independent, and foreign press covering every issue and event, along with an unrestricted internet. We can express ourselves without fear of reprisals. Muslims can criticism our culture without fear as well. No Muslim, in a Muslim Country will ever criticism Islam or political Islam without having to watch his back.

Arafat

You are correct peepsqueek and this is an example of why democracy and Islam are incompatible. Democracy includes freedom of speech which is taboo under Sharia law.

Arafat

Anyone who knew anything about Islam knew the Arab Spring would never lead to democracy. Of course our main stream media and eminent university professors were all clueless despite their pompous predictions that all proved false in the end.

peepsqueek

The CAIRO DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS, which Muslim Countries have used in place of the UN Universal Declaration of Humans Rights, has been criticized for being implemented by a set of states with widely disparate religious policies and practices who had “a shared interest in disarming international criticism of their domestic human rights record.”

Article 19 states: “There shall be NO crime or punishment EXCEPT as provided for in the Sharia.”

Article 24 states: “All the rights and freedoms stipulated in this Declaration are subject to the Islamic Sharia.”

Article 25: “The Islamic Shari’ah is the ONLY source of reference for the explanation or clarification of ANY of the articles of this Declaration.”

mxm123

Whats the difference. Israel has proposed laws to make it a crime to advocate a boycott or it own Nakba laws that restrict the freedom of speech of its Arabs.

Arafat

“Let me (Andrew McCarthy) briefly address what Sharia is. There is no division in Islam – at least in classical Islam, Islamic supremacism, which is the Islam of the Middle East – between the secular and sacred realms. Sharia has ambition to be a total societal system.

To call it just a legal code really does not do it justice, because its
ambition is to govern everything from the great things to the small things, from the matters of economy, military relations, the setting up of a government or caliphate, down to interpersonal relations and even matters of hygiene. It is a soup to nuts framework for how life is to be lived – it is not only, in many countries, about girls being prohibited from attending school, but about the many other ways in which girls and women are suppressed, not only their education, but professionally and in interpersonal relations as well.

From the Islamic perspective there is a belief that Islam has to be imposed, and that Sharia is the necessary precondition for Islamizing a society. The first World Trade Center bombing was really our first significant exposure in the United States to radical Islam conducting terrorists attacks on our shores in what turned out to be a systematic way over time.

It is interesting to me that 20 years after the World Trade Center bombing we still do not have a good understanding in the United States of what Jihad is. If you listen to the apologists for Islamic supremacists who are featured frequently in the media, you would think that it is an internal struggle for personal betterment; that it doesn’t have any military component. If you listen to them long enough, you would come away thinking that it wasn’t anything more meaningful than remembering to brush after every meal.

But Jihad is essentially a military concept, and people on our side, or on the national security side, of this debate have it wrong when they say it is everywhere and always a military concept.

What it is — everywhere and always — is the advancement of Sharia. It is about the implementation of Sharia. Whether jihad is done violently or non‑violently, the point is to implant Sharia because Sharia is seen as the necessary building block for Islamizing a society.”

mxm123

Ari, the settler our paid IDF blogger, rather than address Israel’s own Nakba laws that restrict the freedom of speech of its Arab minority, posts yet another meaningless cut and paste.

peepsqueek

There is a difference between free speech and incitement to do harm.

mxm123

Talking about the Nakba is not “incitement”. Oh my bad, we are talking about Israel, where anything inconvenient is “incitement” and of course “anti-semitic”

mxm123

The very people who criticize Muslims of “rights” are the ones who blatantly strip Palestinians of all rights and pretend they are “just like America”.

peepsqueek

No one criticizes America and the American Government more than Americans. We know that we are not perfect. But you will not find an Muslim Americans in a hurry to go back to their Countries of origin to go and live under repressive systems of government.

mxm123

All Muslim American who have equal rights here unlike Israel may have come from repressive societies, Israel included. That does not mean they have no right to criticize American support for such repressive societies.

There are Jews who are uber-progressive. Except for Israel.

peepsqueek

How many Arab Israelis are leaving Israel to live in America? I would think a lot of Israelis would buy them a free ticket if they wanted to go.

mxm123

So much for claiming Israeli Arabs are equal citizens. Your attitude displays how equal they are in that country ?

But not to worry, the double talk from Israelis is well known.

peepsqueek

That was not double talk and I am not an Israel and I have no religious affiliations. What is your ambition in singling out Israel destruction?

mxm123

This blog happens to be one on Israel. How do u know i’m not on other blogs. What do i complain on an blog whose topic is Israel ? About cheescake ?

Arafat

mxm,

Yours is a sad, despicable world.

All Jews in Israel are bad, eh? Tell me how that is different than Nazism?

mxm123

Apartheid in South Africa was not Nazism. Does that mean Apartheid is or was not bad ?

alex33

Yes, there are many problems in the world.

What’s your point Falasha?

Arafat

My Point?
SJP should focus their energy on real problems.

mxm123

alex33 – Israel is “just like America”. Oh no its just like Sudan, Saudi Arabia, Mongolia. See how the comparisons with every third world basket case start when you question Israeli apartheid.

Josiah

In her statement, Paxson wrote that the boycott “would be antithetical to open scholarly exchange and would inhibit the advancement of knowledge and discovery.”

Where have we heard that line before, eh? Seems like ‘scholarly exchange’ at the expense of human suffering is a trademark of the Paxson era.

alex33

Israel is the last state with Apartheid.
Time to end the Apartheid, therefore I support the boycott.
Actually the boycott should be extended to the whole of Israel.

peepsqueek

That is fair, as long as you support a boycott of all Islamic regimes participating in real apartheid.

mxm123

Well at least you don’t deny apartheid in Israel.

peepsqueek

Hold all Islamic Countries up to the very same standard as you would hold Israel. Attempt to use a balanced scale.

mxm123

When those countries use American dollars to implement apartheid I will. I wan’t nothing to do with lack of freedoms. Anywhere. Saudi Arabia included.

peepsqueek

“I want nothing to do with lack of freedoms” So again I ask, in what other Countries have you called for a boycott?

mxm123

If i determine that America is funnelling billions to another country to foster apartheid or prop up despotic regime, i’m against it. This page is about Israel. I don’t have to have a preamble to every comment on Israel as to the list of countries i consider worse than Israel.

alex33

I do support fight against all injustice, we have many of them in our world.
However, if we want to be effective then we have to go in order.
First was South Africa, second will be Israel. I didn’t decide so, but I support this decision. What bugs me is that the world’s richest people are supporting Israel (and therefore its apartheid). Time to support the very poor Palestinians.
I should add, I am not lefty (in politics), I am Libertarian.

Arafat

alex33 –
You have no idea what you are talking about, but that never stopped people like you from having strong opinions.

alex33

Arafat (below), you are doing more damage to Jews and Israel then anybody else, and you are doing it with your insane arguments!
To start with, if you are a Jew, why are you naming yourself Arafat?
You must think we are all idiots, this isn’t working.
The confusion you are creating is backfiring on you.

F.E.: you are talking about George Orwell. Well, it is completely clear that in his story Israel is the oppressor. But, you can’t get it right.
Can you get anything right???