Yes I sugggest that you ACT as if you are a person who doesn't have a problem! Once you convince yourself that you don't then it'll be only a matter of time before you don't, try it!

Anonymous Posted: 26/07/2001 23:16

Anxiety
Messages
Anonymous Posted: 07/05/2001 22:02
RE: CAN ANYONE SUGGEST HELP FOR SOCIAL ANXIETY.?
There are many treatments available for social anxiety and phobias. It depends on the severity. Does the anxiety interfere with your ability to function in everyday situations at work, etc. Have you read any self help books on the topic? A therapist specializing in cognitive/behavioral therapy (not analysis) could help you. If your problem is very debilitating there are many new medications (not tranquilizers)used specifically for treating these type of disorders. Medications such as paxil and sertraline work on the chemical imbalances in the brain which are believed to be the underlying cause. Tranquilizers are a bad choice since they only mask the symptoms, can become addictive, and as your body develops tolerance to them they stop working anyway. If self help books with a cognitive/behavioral approach don't help, seek help from an informed, sympathetic medical professional. Ignoring the problem doesn't make it go away and you deserve to be able to go out and enjoy yourself! Best of luck to you.

Anonymous Posted: 23/08/2001 00:21

Again can anyone suggest cure for social anxiety disorder. I tried pretending to be confident, not very successful, tried various different methods,so has anyone ever tried cognitive/behavioural approach or has anyone a cure for one of the symptoms - blushing.

Anonymous Posted: 25/08/2001 23:56

GO TO A HOMEOPATH!!!!!!
After twenty five years of trying to cope with anxiety, panic attacks, blushing, having to take early retirement, attending a psychiatrist for hypnotherapy, taking tranquilisers, coming off tranquilisers, reading self-help books, etc. etc. I finally found something which works without side effects - homeopathy!!
Go to a good homeopath and stick with it until you and he/she find the remedy which suits you.
Argent 6c is good for anticipatory anxiety.
Pulsatilla 6c is good if your main symptom is weeping.
Baryta Carb. 6c is excellent for people whose main feeling is wanting to hide.

Anonymous Posted: 24/10/2001 08:59

I had suffered for years with what I thought was severe social anxiety - i.e. I couldn't even go into the smoking room or canteen at work as I used to shake uncontrolably or sit there with tense muscles afraid to open my mouth..I couldn't go into pubs/supermarkets and for a finish could barely leave the safety of my home... After years of taking anti-anxiety/anti-depressants I finally stumbled across an article on the web that found a connection between extreme anxiety and magnesium defficiency. I started taking magnesium supplements (liquid ones are far better) and within 2 weeks I was 90% cured. I still get nervous speaking in front of large groups but I can handle it. All I had was a magnesium defficiency - had I known it sooner I could have saved hundreds of pounds and years of misery..... Anyone who wants to discuss this please answer on the site with email address and I will write back.

Anonymous Posted: 28/10/2001 07:47

I have just started taking Seroxat and am suffering worse symptoms than before I started, how long does this last ?

Anonymous Posted: 30/10/2001 11:47

The message posted in relation to magnesium supplement - are there any side effects to taking this? What symptons did it help?

Anonymous Posted: 30/10/2001 12:27

Re the magnesium supplement - only side effects from taking too much is diarrhoea! Symptoms it cured are anxiety, palpitations, shaking/trembling, low blood sugar, depression, high blood pressure. It gave me better results than prescription meds I had tried in the past, and is totally natural. if you need any more info write to scooby28ie@yahoo.co.uk

Anonymous Posted: 17/09/2002 19:53

can anyone suggest simple tips to relieve anxiety/depression without medication

Anonymous Posted: 20/09/2002 21:00

I THINK ITS ANXIETY, AT WORK I FEEL NERVOUS AND IF ANYONE COMES NEAR ME WHEN I DONT EXPECT THEM, I GET JUMPY AND SHAKY. HELP

Susan (bonso) Posted: 20/09/2002 21:07

I REFER TO THE ARTICLE ON MAGNESIUM SUPPLEMENTS FROM ONE READER AND HOW GOOD THEY WERE FOR HER. DO U THINK THEY REALLY WORK AS I EXPERIENCE THE SAME SYSTEMS AS YOU.

Anonymous Posted: 24/09/2002 16:32

My partner suffers from panic attacks and depression. It is often difficult to recognise the early symptoms which can cause its own share of issues. These can manifest themselves in many ways but by far the most worrying is the fact that she tries to deal with it by herself and pushes back against not only myself but also her family etc. She has been prescribed Cipramil in the past but does not make me or her family aware that she is taking the medication which would probably explain why we do not always notice the side effects. What I really would appreciate suggestions on, is how to cope best with and help her through the difficult times?

Anonymous Posted: 02/10/2002 11:40

I am addressing this to anon. who took the Seroxat I did exactly the same and felt much worse so I had to go off them and am still looking for an answer so good luck with it - did you ever try yoga or meditation that can help this applies to all anxieties - I am also going to look into the Buteyko Method which helps with the breathing.

Anonymous Posted: 23/10/2002 15:26

I have just been told recently by my doctor that i am suffering from anxiety after two years of suffering from light headiness loss of intrest in everthing around me including my girlfriend and no engery to do anything. I found myself drinking to excess which caused all types of problems. I have always taught myself quite outgoing so i feel this is not social anxiety. But i have often found myself lying awake at night concerned about the smallest of things i have also lost quite alot of weight over the last couple of months I am a 25 year old male about 5ft 9ins and weighed 7 1/2 stone before the my doctor placed me on medication called cipramil which has help with my engery levels i also feel quite good within myself and have also began to eat alot more. I have been on this medication for a month of a three month program what worries me is i still get anxiety attacks when on my own usally at night i also worry about when i come off this medication in two months time i know i can get the doctor to give me cipramil for another three months but i worry about staying on medication for a long period of time, can anyone who suffered anything similar please let me know how things went for you. I would be very greatful for any help you can offer

David (DavidO) Posted: 21/11/2002 13:08

I am a 29 yr old and I have suffered from anxiety for many years.At present I am taking Seroxat and they have not helped.I am also getting councilling,but I continue to shake,tremble and blush in social situations.Is there any "miracle"drug out there as this is causing me great distress.

Anonymous Posted: 02/12/2002 17:23

David,
I am afraid there is no miracle cure and searching for one is a waste of time.I learned this the hard way.What part of the country are you in.I am involved in a self-help group.I have found it very good.

David (DavidO) Posted: 03/12/2002 13:12

I am from Limerick.I would be grateful for any support you,or any group could offer me.Thank you.

Anonymous Posted: 04/12/2002 19:02

David,
I am afraid our group is in Galway.
However,we based our group on the activities of OANDA.This is a self-help organisation which helps with social phobia.There is a group in Limerick.You can speak to Mike at 087-6708051.You can check out details and see if this is for you.

Anonymous Posted: 05/12/2002 15:03

I am referring to the message relating to anxiety. I would like to know where in Galway the help group is.

Anonymous Posted: 05/12/2002 17:37

Galway Group Enquiry
Please e-mail a phone number and christian name to todeaus@yahoo.com
and I will phone with relevant info.If preferred,I can reply by e-mail.

pat (pajmcder) Posted: 04/01/2003 13:24

dave
have you tried cipramil for the anxiety, it has less side effects that seroxat. i have been on it a year now and i have found it helpfull. its not a cure. i have found that i dont worry as much as i use to or have as many negative feelings, or what people think of me, have you tried using any relaxation tapes. you have to keep using these constantly to get benefits . there is no magic cure but cipramil may make your life easier and it will remove any depression associated with it.

Anonymous Posted: 14/01/2003 15:52

I have experienced periods of anxiety and panic over the last ten years. Initally I took Seroxat, I was on Cipramil for a while and now have been prescribed a newly approved drug Lexapro (it is similar to Cipramil with fewer side effects). I would like to know has anyone been prescribed this drug as I have experienced pretty bad effects up until now. Its early days yet but I found Cipramil to have more postive effects. I believe that medication helps for the first few months, after this it is your own sense of wellbeing that is doing the work. I am beginning to understand why my panic/anxiety creeps up on me and know that the warning signs should not be ignored. I am based in Dublin and wonder if there are any groups I could get involved with, as it is a lonely condition?

Anonymous Posted: 18/01/2003 22:24

On the matter of anxiety and having had problems most of my life,I am now convinced that all these problems have their origins in happening in very early childhood. To overcome them ,it is probably necessary to attend a psychiatrist (spelt correct?)and delve into one's younger years. My problems arose from the loss of my mother when I was three and a father who was a cold fish and the subject of mother was a non starter.I personally got over the problem with people by seeing them all as 5 yr olds. Ask yourself, who is afraid of a 5yr old. Anyway it worked for me. Hope this may help someone.

Anonymous Posted: 24/02/2003 14:32

Hi all... I suffered from anxiety in "another life". It started when I was in my early twenties. It wasn't that I was a "shrinking violet" or anthing like that. I had friends, boyfriends a good job, not a bad figure etc., so where did it come from? I have no idea what caused it, but I do know that it definitely wasn't a throw-back to childhood since I and my siblings had an idyllic childhood. I went to doctors who fed me tranquillisers, a homeopath who seemed to have all the answers for a while and then I discovered books on mind control etc. e.g. The Power of Positive Thinking and others which I cannot recall at the minute. Therein lay the cure I was seeking. Just scanning the book doesn't work though, it's hard work and it definitely does take time but the rewards are huge. You must read them over and over and gradually, over a period of time you begin to change the way you think. It's hardly noticeable at first! I would definitely recommend this as the way to go for you, it sure as hell worked for me and it changed my life completely and for the better. Whatever happens, don't just ignore it and let it take hold of your life, because once you start running you won't be able to stop. Make your stand, draw a line in the sand today and do something about this debilitating problem before it consumes you.
Be brave,
Luck 'n stuff...

daniel (danmar) Posted: 31/07/2003 11:11

I am currently in hospital suffering from severe anxious and panic attacks. I find that exercise such as speed walking and swimming very relaxing and it makes the muscles tired and stops the mind from racing.

Anonymous Posted: 26/08/2003 00:39

I would just like to know has anybody experienced visual problems as a result of anxiety?

Anonymous Posted: 27/08/2003 11:07

What about tips for anxious teachers?

Claire (Clairo) Posted: 05/09/2003 10:53

Dear Anxious Teacher
I'm delighted you posted because I am about to contact schools regarding the long term health of teachers and their ability to deliver the enthusiasim and inspiration that all their students deserve ! Metamorphosis is a holistic therapy which has the potential to change the dynamics in the classroom, give back the joy of teaching to the teachers and substantially improve student performance. Please contact me at host.family@ireland.com for further info.
Wishing you health & happiness
Claire

Patrick (patrickbracken) Posted: 08/10/2003 11:36

I am 22 years or age and since I was seventeen I have suffered wiht Panic Disorder. Thankfully I have not had an attack in a while. But now I am suffering very badly from stress and anxiety. I have a constant fear of death that is my problem. I constantly think I have terminal illnesses. I have developed Irritable Bowel Syndrome (IBS) because of this. I have also been put on an anti depressant (Molipaxon) and it doesnt seem to work. I still feel tired, pains everywhere. I need help I have done all the Doctors and counsellers what else can I try. Please PLease somebody help me.

Claire (Clairo) Posted: 08/10/2003 12:15

Hi Patrick , don't worry lots of people feel this way and there is help available. Email me at host.family@ireland.com and I'll send you info on Metamorphosis. It allows you to change your physical repsonse to these unresolved stresses simply by activating reflex points in your feet hands and head.

Anonymous Posted: 08/10/2003 12:24

Hi Patrick, sorry to hear you are going through such a terrible time. I too get panic attacks though only now and again when i am v.stressed about something. I also always think the worst if I am feeling ill or if I get an unusual pain somewhere. I don't know if anti depressants are the solution though. Sometimes i think doctors prescribe them a little too easily without looking at the real underlying problem. Maybe you should try to concentrate on the good things in life, get out there and do some sports or something that you really enjoy that will take your mind off the anxiety. I know it helps me as I never get panic attacks when I am enjoying myself and I forget all my worries. Have you tried some alternative treatments? Sometimes these things are great for stress related problems. You should look into it. Anyway, best of luck, I wish you well, you are only young, your whole life is ahead of you, so relax & try enjoy life without worrying about death and making yourself ill.

Anonymous Posted: 09/10/2003 01:01

I've suffered from chronic anxiety and panic attacks for about 10 years. I recently started to supplement my diet with taurine tablets (it's a amino acid available without prescription). It's worked wonders. I feel relaxed enough now to be able to meditate (which is also a fantastic help) and breathing exercises are terrific too. From what I understand taurine works by helping promote GABA (also an amino acid, a defiency of which has been linked with panic attacks). It's worth checking out... there's more information on the net if you do a google search for:
anxiety taurine
Good luck!
Ronan

Anonymous Posted: 13/05/2004 12:19

Hi,
Recently I have been experiencing severe feelings of anxiety/depression (don't know which is which to be honest). The anxiety is generally triggered by extreme tiredness (usually caused by hangovers) and all my fears and worries seem greatly magnified. When I am feeling good (99% of the time) the same fears and worries seem like trivialities.
My wife has just just recovered from 4 years of depression & counselling. This took a lot out of me emotionally and physically as I am a worrier by nature. I am terrified to tell her how I feel in case it triggers a relapse in her symptoms. Having said all this I might wake up in the morning and feel great (this is what usually happens). This leads me to believe that maybe my symptoms are as a result of a deficiency? Any advice would be welcome.

Micheal (mikeephil) Posted: 20/05/2004 00:41

Has anyone heard of "The Linden Method"? or has anyone used it?. If so what do you think of it?. I am thinking of getting it.
For all of you thhat are feeling bad, there is help out there, you just need to find the treatment that works for you.

Anonymous Posted: 28/07/2004 10:31

Hi all, for those of you with difficulties in the area of Social Anxiety you might want to look at a new website http://www.geocities.com/socialanxiety_ireland/ which is all about a Cognitive Behavioural Group for people with Social Anxiety that is run in the Mater Hospital in Dublin. Its been running for a few years now and has a pretty high success rate as reported by previous participants. Referrals are taken from the Mater Hospital and all over the country, all the referral info is on the website along with feedback from previous participants.

Anonymous Posted: 07/10/2004 15:37

I have suffered anxiety for last few months and it is wrecking my life. I do not wish to take medication. My symptoms are panic attacks, shakes, light head, and my vision is affected. im full of fear and as I am a recovering addict I am fearful that this will drive me back to my addiction which numbed all my fears for years... Help???

Anonymous Posted: 19/04/2005 19:33

I am so pleased to have stumpled across this page. i tought i was goin crazy i am very social but then just couldn handle it.my doctor said i was depressed and put me on affex they seem to be working great.but i defo dont want them to be long term. is there any self help groups in dublin.anna 27

Anonymous Posted: 20/04/2005 09:42

HI Anna, I would recommend the Social Anxiety Group in the Mater Hospital. I completed the course there 2 years ago and it really helped me. You can get more info on it at www.geocities.com/socialanxiety_ireland
Hope you find some help
John

mary (FUB25532) Posted: 07/07/2005 23:40

Iam on 125mgs of lustrel after haveing a heart attack.Iam 8 months on them and always feel confuised.Will this pass.

Anonymous Posted: 29/07/2005 22:13

can anyone tell me about magnesium , what should i buy, i suffer from anxiety. i need help,do not want to take meds.

Anonymous Posted: 01/08/2005 14:01

everyone should check out the newly revamped website at www.socialanxietyireland.com

karen (kazzap) Posted: 03/08/2005 12:49

hi, i have suffered with anxiey attacks for the last 5 yrs. my symptoms include: tiredness, freaking out, knots in tummy/nausea, shaking, hard breathing, weak, weepy and fear i am dying, ihad been on gerozac (anti dep) and lexotan to calm me down when i started to feel panicky. i am just in the middle of a relapse and feel just awful. i just wanna go home, into bed. i have moved into a new house with boyfriend and i think this is wot freaked me out. i just want my mum at times like this but i know its not realistic. is there any self help groups in galway? i am 24 female.

karen (kazzap) Posted: 03/08/2005 12:56

patrick, i totally understand how you feel. i have suffered from this for 5 yrs on and off, even had hospital scans cos i told my doc i had a brain tumour and a problem with my lungs cos i couldnt breathe right, obviously she knew i didnt but sent me in to put my mind at ease. you just have to give out to yourself, scold yourself and tell urself 'there is nothing wrong with me', hard, but if you keep shouting this at yourself, you will eventually believe it.i dont get it that much anymore but i still freak out over other things, its the most terribl feeling and hard for other people to understand unless they have been thru it themselves. just hang in there and e mail me if u like at karenannver@hotmail.com. maybe we can be a crutch for each other! take care.

Anonymous Posted: 18/08/2005 16:41

hi my name is marie & i am 24 yrs old, i consider myself very shy & nervous person - i do socialise now and again but most of my friends have boyfriends & stay in alot. I am very relaxed person when i am around people i know & when i get to know people ive have been in my job for 3 years, i have never had a prob with it, i always had someone to go to lunch with. Recently my boyfriend went away for the summer & i started feeling very anxious about this, especially coming into work as well, has he was working here this time last year, i has a fear of working here while he was away cos i would get reminders of him being away, (sounds stupid) but everything was getting to me - i thought if i moved to another dept in another area this would solve my problem. I had a very tough summer, each morning i would fear coming to work or getting through the day, it was like if someone had died. i would empty reach most mornings (nervous stomach) & i would not have an apetite for the day, this is till happening to me, even thou my boyfriend is back. All i want to do is get on with my life & not worry bout lunch - since i change dept this has been worrying me. my gp said that this is anxiety!! my stomach is still in bits, this is making my life hell - has anyone got any suggestions?? i do not have a big apetite, but i would usually eat lunch. i would be grateful for advice - crtt_bo@yahoo.co.uk

Anonymous Posted: 30/08/2005 14:20

My name is Geraldine and for Anxiety attacks I was prescribed Xanax 0.25g. They are pretty good, but I only take them when I need them, the last time was a year and a half ago. But they have come back again now due to various changes in my life. Change and decision making seem to be the culprits in my case. My stomach is in knots and the usual feelings of negativity etc appear. But I keep telling myself I am not going to give in to the negative thoughts and find deep breathing and remaining around positive people is a great help. Where possible try and go High on Life!!!! Not an easy task but I also find writing down my worries fears is great, and setting aside a worry time say 6.30p.m. if you are at home, and when something starts to worry you during the day, say to yourself I am not going to think about that until worry time 6.30 p.m. and if its important enough by then you can consider it etc. I found alchohol the worst thing, especially for your tummy. And prayer also gets me through these shaky times. And talking about what is worrying me. I hope my comment might be of some help to someone. Great website. Thanks

karen (kazzap) Posted: 31/08/2005 10:34

hi geraldine, its great to hear from someone who has anxiety attacks as opposed to panic attacks as they are very different. i suffer from anxiety also and like you, didnt need to take tablets for about a yr until recently, again it was a change in my life that got me all hot and bothered. i am now seeing a counsellor to try to get to the root of things....she helps a bit. breathing is great as is talking, keep ni touch

Anonymous Posted: 01/09/2005 10:39

Hi Karen,
Geraldine here, and I am also from Galway. And thanks for replying to me. Sometimes you feel like you are the only one in the world feeling like this, and feeling sorry for yourself doesn't help I have learned that. Its funny, but when I talk about it to the few people that I know don't think Im loosing it and caving in, it helps. And the more you talk about and the way you feel they better I feel after it. Bottling up things and trying to put on a front takes alot out of a person, and just yesterday having been in galway city all day, I thought I would never get home. I know they anxiety will pass, and I try and say to myself push it out of my body, and keep saying to myself I don't want this, and positive thinking, by saying I am going to beat this, and you know it does help. It will pass please god. And I have the Xanax for emergencys and I find if I take 1 on time instead in the thick of the anxiety its better, prevention is better, and then I dont get too bad. Its a year and a half since I had the last episode an they lasted about 2 weeks, so I know I can do it and the tablets do return you to that feeling of Normal which is a great break. Chat soon. G

patricia (saxone) Posted: 04/09/2005 21:21

hi everybody,anxiety is terrible it ruins your life ,i have it for a year, i hate it, i was a very out going person now i hate going out, i think i am never going to get better ,every day is a struggle. i force my self to go out every day, sometimes i just want to give in and stay in the house but that not the answer, so what do i do can anyone give me the answer ,people with anxiety cannot stay on tablets forever?

karen (kazzap) Posted: 05/09/2005 11:04

patricia, YOU WILL GET BETER!are you on medication, if so what are you on? maybe your attitude needs to change too, dont take that in a bad way but attitude has a loot to do with our mood. there are a lot of days where i feel like staying inbed but i just think of all the things i am blessed with, i know it sounds corny but im not disabled, its not a life threatening thing etc...if you think that you will get better, then you WILL! email me if you wanna talk. karenannver@hotmail.com

Anonymous Posted: 05/09/2005 12:17

Patricia, it is tough!!! i feel like i have no hope either but with the support of family & friends!! i get anxiety every morning when i wake up!! i dont know whats causing - i think its the fear of coming into work cos ive been associating my feelings with work (long story) all of this is affecting my apetite as well cos im a very nervous person!!! it has been going on for neary 6 mths now!!! feels like it wil never end!! please god it will!! lucy, limerick

Anonymous Posted: 05/09/2005 16:40

To patricia, Geraldine from Galway here, I have to agree with Karen, feeling sorry for yourself doesnt help. Believe me I know,you have to push yourself. I get bad episodes of it and am just coming out of a bad week and a half. And they scare me because I think o no is this here for good. I find if I take the tablets Xanax .25mg before the anxiety gets too bad, it helps and I feel normal and then when I feel normal, thats when I work hard at the positive thinking, just because I have got respite from the anxiety thanks to the tablets, I push myself and say I can do this and I am not going to let this in on me, not easy put exercise, breathing anything to occupy the mind helps. I found this website brill, they more you talk about the anxiety or what you think might be causing it helps. My husband describes it very well, imagine if you won the lotto or got great news and you couldn't tell anyone wouldn't you just burst. What good is it if you can't talk about the nice and exciting things in life as well as the horrible stuff. It doesn't matter how silly it might sound say it out. Change is my downfall, but I know now what causes them and am getting better at controlling them. The tablets give me the lift when I need it and am feeling negative and then I feel them working, I get cracking. Hope to go to Knock Co. Mayo this week, will say a prayer for us all and our anxiety buddies or enemies. Believe me there is power in prayer.

patricia (saxone) Posted: 06/09/2005 21:09

hi anxiety friends ,no i do not take tablets ,i go out every day ,i busy myself all the time .i think this site is great it lets you know that your not alone all my trouble started when my brother died last year , i try to think postive thought, but god its hard thank you for your advice,i know i have everthing i need ,i pray all the time .i hope god helps us soon.

Anonymous Posted: 06/10/2005 14:36

I stumbled across this website and it has been of huge comfort. Just like Geraldine, it is decision- making and change (there usually in tandem)that brings about the anxiety that inevitably causes me to back out of my original decision.This is having a huge effect on my life in that I am unable to move out of home or go on to further education simply because of the fear and exhaustion from my anxiety. Nights and Mornings are the worst. Occaionally I will take a Xanex 0.25g when I find it very tough , and need to think some way rationally. What I need to know does anyone Know of a good cognitve/Behavioural psychologist/psychiatrist in the South East Area, wexford, Kilkenny Waterford as I changed the Irish council Phschotherapy guide and all the Cognitve practioners seem to based in the Dublin area?

karen (kazzap) Posted: 07/10/2005 11:10

no, i don't know of anyone down there as i am from agalway. i have been to a counsellor which i found helped. you are looking for cognitive therapy....what way do you think, i mean, is it bad thoughts you think and is that what you get worked up over, if so, cognitive therapy is the one for you..my boyfriend bought a book for me, i cant remember the name of it but i will look it up for you, its like an excercise book, mental not physical and its supposed to be excellent. i haven't used it cos my counsellor didnt think i would benefit from it as i have a different type of anxiety. its about Ä25.00 and i will come back with the name of it. take it easy and remember, YOU WILL COME OUT OF THIS. take care.

Anonymous Posted: 08/10/2005 14:56

there is a book i am reading at the moment called "the anxiety and phobia
wookbook" by edmund j bourne whick i bought of amazon.co.uk i have found it very helpfull so far.
also i am on cipramil tablets 20mg which i find helps me through the day,they have
less side efects that seroxator other meds. but what may work for one person may not work for another
every one is different.

Anonymous Posted: 10/10/2005 12:30

I would highly recommend the book "overcoming social anxiety" by gillian butler. As far as I know the only cognitive behavioural group in the country is based in the Mater Hospital in Dublin. However, it has had participants from all over the country, galway, cork, kerry, donegal etc. the website for the group is www.socialanxietyireland.com

karen (kazzap) Posted: 03/11/2005 12:29

i have just taken up yoga and i would reccomend it to anyone that suffers with anxiety. it is so relaxing. i do it once a week with an instructor in The Burren Yoga Centre and then i practise it at home every evening. our class starts at 6.30 and ends at 8. some people actually fall asleep during our session so that will prove to you how relaxing it is. i'm guaranteeing you, you will sleep like a baby after a session!

patricia (saxone) Posted: 03/11/2005 15:20

does anybody have vision problems with there anxiety

Anonymous Posted: 23/11/2005 20:28

I think people should take a more natural approach in combating anxiety as opposed to taking these dangerous chemical based medications.If anyone is looking for a natural alternative in helping combat anxiety and panic attacks. the solgar supplement GABA is very affective and also a 100mg
B complex (this includes all the
B vitamins)
will help with the stress side of things.When you are stressed the body uses up its supply of b vitamins which in turn can lead to being even more stressed and anxious.Kalms tablets are also excellent and can be safely taken with both the b vitamins and GABA.
The vitamins will take time to get into the system but with perseverence they will work.The kalms tablets will work quite quickly and are great to give a sense of inner calm.also make sure that there are plenty of omega 3,6 and 9 in the diet.Udo's oil is an excellent source and has all three.great for energy, stress and depression.
p.s the kalms tablets contain herbs and should not be mixed with medication so check with a doctor first if in doubt.

grey Posted: 28/11/2005 17:33

Hi All
Has anyone tried NLP or Hypnotherapy for social anxiety? If so did it have any positive effects or negative for that matter. I have read a couple of articles on NLP and it sounds interesting. Anyone any experience of it?
Grey:)

Paddymac Posted: 29/11/2005 09:34

I get light headed at times almost to the point that I feel I am about to pass out. I think this is caused by anxiety because of when it happens, overtaking on the motorway for example or when I am in the company of people I am not familiar with. I have tried the drug route but I would like to find a natural way of dealing with this. I am normally considered to be a very confident type of person and others cant understand why I feel this way.

Dee Posted: 29/11/2005 15:10

Just found this site. So relieved I am not going crazy..Have suffered with this for years. Tried counselling twice - didn't really helop. Don't want to go drug route. Just moved house which I think is totally freaking me out. Also has a series of rough events last year - death in the family, 2 family members diagnosed with cancer - then husband got sick. I seem to be obsessed with death - particularly losing my husband to the point where I think I am going to make something happen to him if I keep imagining it. Trying to meditate, deep breathe, think positive thoughts etc but finding it so hard. I feel jittery a lot of the time tho I appear outwardly confident. I wake in the morning and just feel PANIC and want to say at home. Does it have to be like this for the rest of my life?

karen (kazzap) Posted: 23/12/2005 15:34

dee, i think i'm in the same boat as you. i moved house and thats when my anxieties came back. that was in July. i still have not recoverd. i was very bad for about 2 months and gradually improved but i feel myself going down the slippery slope again. i don't know if i'm ready for a house and mortgage. i love my boyfriend but i will put my health and happiness before anything else. can anyone please please talk and help us? wouldn't it be great if we could get a doctor, a counsellor or somebody specialised in this area to join this discussion? sometimes i freak out ovre nothing, sometimes i feel i'm going mad, i cannot relax am constantly tired and moody although not depressed. i just want some answers.

Anonymous Posted: 04/01/2006 14:34

Hi,
I'm from U.S. and have social anxiety disorder. I've been on Paxil for years and it works fine. Also, found out I am ADHD (attention deficit/hyperactive disorder) so I take Straterra. I no longer worry excessively nor am I socially inhibited. I believe most of the world today is anxiety driven. I plan to advice my son to try natural taurine since he refuses to take meds.

ClinPsych Posted: 04/01/2006 17:06

Hi, I've just read many of the recent posts, I'm a clinical psychologist with an interest in working with anxiety disorders. My experience has been that a Cognitive Behavioural Therapy approach is very very successful in working on social anxiety and anxiety in general. the feedback ive gotten has been very positive from my clients. My personal and clinical opinion is that medication should only be used as a last resort in extreme cases, anxiety is primarily a difficulty with the way you see and think about yourself, others and the world.once people identify their thoughts that are causing anxiety they are on the first step to learning to cope with it. My opinion is that meds merely give an artifical short term relief and feeling of coping but when clients come off meds the probs re-surface if they have not addressed the way they think.
I would also recommend the earlier posters recommendation about Gillian Butler's "Overcoming Social Anxiety" or also the "Mind over Mood" is an excellent book that is used my many people working in the area.

karen (kazzap) Posted: 05/01/2006 16:42

Clin Psyc, i have that book but the councellor that i was seeing told me that i would not benefit from that book, mind over mood so i am afraid to read it. i think this site should have employed people like you to help with various discussions. i am on meds and i know if i came off them, i woould very rapidly fly down hill.i suffer from anxiety, hey maybe you could use me as your guinea pig!

ClinPsych Posted: 06/01/2006 19:12

Hi Karen, ok I suppose first off I would in general never tell people not to read a particular book as that for me undermines a persons motivation to tackle their particular difficulties. Mind over Mood as I said in my post is widely and very successfully used in the clinical psychology field especially in anxiety and depression. Learning more about ourselves and the reasons WHY we experience anxiety is always a positive thing.
It is a difficult thing to come off meds for anxiety as the thoughts of coming off them cause anxiety in itself! However, as with anxiety in general the worst thing about coming off meds, going on a date, speaking in public, job interview is the two BIG words, "WHAT IF...."
What if is the one of the first thoughts that I try to help people identify and change. People who are trapped in the never ending cycle of anxiety always fear the unknown, they want to be able to control for ever possible eventuality and every possible reaction people could have to them.
Its not possible.
What is possible is to learn to cope with the anxiety for almost any situation. I hope this has helped a little. I'm not affiliated to this site in any way but I will try to post bits of info that I think may be of help to somepeople.

karen (kazzap) Posted: 09/01/2006 14:44

CLIN PSYCH, do you think that a person who suffers with anxiety can ever be totally cured from it? i have tried counselling, reiki, accupuncture, bio energy, medication, yoga and to no avail.will i ever get out of this black hole?

ClinPsych Posted: 09/01/2006 16:09

Hi Karen, no-one will ever be free of anxiety, including myself. Nature has designed us to feel anxious in situations which we perceive to be threatening so as to aid the fight or flight response. So what I'm saying is that anxiety can be a good thing and we will always experience it so never feeling anxiety is not a worthwile goal.
What is a worthwhile goal is identifying specific situations where anxiety negatively impacts on your life. We all have little anxieties on a daily basis but its the 2 or 3 big ones that people should focus on. In these situations 2 things occur that maintain anxiety.
1) as i mentioned before, the "what if..." thinking, what if someone notices me blushing, sweating, stuttering or if I say something stupid.
2) People with severe anxiety constantly look inward, they focus on how fast their heart is beating, how flushed their face feels, their clammy hands etc. Focussing on bodily sensations increases anxiety which makes the heart beat faster etc ect, its a viscous circle.
The combination of the above two things result in people wearing "blinkers" in life. All they see is anxiety and the blinkers dont allow them to see the alternative explanations for their anxiety and to accurately evaluate if their anxiety is warranted in the situation.
What it all comes down to is being brave enough to face those things that make you most anxious. You will have many many "what if" thoughts before you go through it. A useful tool is to rate 1-10 before the event how anzious you think you will feel, rate if during the event and afterwards. What you will find is that anxiety CANNOT continue to rise and rise and rise. It HAS to come down over time and it does.
Finally a word of hope, one of my greatest clinical successes was helping someone to overcome anxiety in a specific particular situation that had blighted them for the previous 28 years. Through their motivation to succeed and a little guidance they now face that situation on a daily basis and cope with it. There's always hope...

karen (kazzap) Posted: 10/01/2006 09:44

CLIN PSYCH, i think we are on about very different types of anxiety here. perhaps i'm wrong, but i think the anxiety you are referring to is where people have to speak in front of a crowd and get anxious. mine is a very different type altogether. it started when i moved house in july and all was rosy. then one day, i could not wait to get out of it. i used to have really sick stomach when leaving work because i knew i had to go home.i couldn't stay in the house and had to move in with my mother for a few wks.the story goes on and on but i think we are on 2 very different levels here.

ClinPsych Posted: 10/01/2006 18:08

Hi Karen, yes some of what I`ve already said does apply to a social type anxiety. There are many different types of anxiety but the essentials of what i said earlier remain for almost all types of anxiety.
It all comes down to fear, this is an info sharing session and not a therapeutic one but from the details you gave there could be lots of anxious fears in your case, what if ive made the wrong choice, is it too early to committ, is the financial burden of a house to much, will i feel safe in the house, will this all work out, will i be happy here etc etc, you will know in your own mind what ure specific fears are.
The basic theory of anxiety is common across most anxieties and as is the methods which are most useful from treating it.
I would suggest writing down your greatest fear or anxiety about your current situation and rate from 1-100 how much you believe it could be true, in the next coloum write down all the evidence which you think supports your fear and in the last colloum the evidence which does not support your fear. What people generally find is that there is usually far more evidence (alternative thoughts or explanations) that does not support their particular fear or anxiety...

Anonymous Posted: 12/01/2006 20:53

hows things i used to suffer from anxiety it overtook my life for ten years.One day i overheard my cousin saying to some one that im a nervous person.I never actually realised that i was nervous before i sort of knew but wasnt really conscious of it.One day in easons i discovered a book called self help for your nerves by Claire Weekes.Since that day i have never looked back.It has changed my life,My anxiety has gone back to the normal intensity(a small bit of anxiety in life is normal and expected).Basically the book explains how its your nervous system and mental fatigue which causes and prolongs your anxiety.I URGE YOU TO BUY THIS BOOK AT LEAST GO INTO THE BOOK SHOP AND READ THE BACK OF IT.PLEASE GET THE BOOK IT WILL SAVE YOU.Good luck

karen (kazzap) Posted: 13/01/2006 12:32

anon, generally i don't reply to anons but this time i'll make an exception! i have just read your post and i am going to buy the book. if it has helped you, then maybe it can have the same effect on me! i will try anything!
clin psych, thanks for your help, i will try and do what you have suggested.

J Posted: 13/01/2006 18:15

hi karen im glad to hear that your going to buy the book(im the anon guy who suggested it).it has changed my life.one advice ill give you before you read it is to first of all read it all thoroughly.then read it again while making notes.then go over the notes every day.also stick to this one method.if you try too many methods youll get confused and discouraged.to find out more about the book type claire weekes into a search engine.but make sure you read the book every day or go over your notes every day or both.in 6 weeks time ill check back to this forum to see how your progressing as im curious.good luck j

ClinPsych Posted: 14/01/2006 14:26

Hi everyone, from reading the posts on this webpage and others I have been thinking of setting up an Irish online e-therapy business specialising in anxiety. I'd appreciate any thoughts the users of this forum would have on this, if they've used e-therapy, would they consider it etc? Many thanks

debs Posted: 15/01/2006 18:11

i am a new subscriber to this page and am so glad there are others out there. i constantly think i have a seious medical problem. after reading this page i am wondering if its anxiety ? it all starts off with what feels like butterflys in my stomach which quickly increase to a rapid heart beat. i then feel like im loosing control and have to focus hard on stabilising my heart beat. this happens only when iam out the house. Can anyone relate to these problem ? Could this be anxiety ? Iam also not very confident and avoid talking in group situations

j Posted: 15/01/2006 18:51

hi debs hows things id exactly the same problem as you.the feeling your getting in your stomach is caused by adrenaline by worrying about it and tensing up you are releasing more adrenaline and causind the feeling to get worse.basically your problem is with your nervous system you have to let the physical feelings come they will go in their own time.i urge you to buy a book called self help for your nerves its written by a doctor called claire weekes.shes dead now but she used to specialise in nervous illness and anxiety.this book has changed my life im now one of the most calm and composed people your likely to meet when i used to be a nervous wreck.BUY THE BOOK.at least go into easons and read the back of it.its an international best seller.also you can order it from easons.it only a hundred and seventy pages long.PLEASE AT LEAST GO INTO EASONS AND BROWSE THROUGH IT.Good luck J

belle Posted: 18/01/2006 13:35

I have been suffering panic atticks for over a year now ive always had anxiety probs and bouts of depression but the attacks are severe i have just found out that the origin of my anxiety comes from seperation anxiety when i was a child. My father died when i was 7 and i was terrified that my mother would leave too. I would feel physically sick leaving for school and always tried to fake being sick to stay at home. that became the norm for me so over the years i just though i hated school. I dropped out at 17 regreted it and went back at 22 and the anxiety came back. I got pregnant did my leaving cert and took 5yrs out for my daughter. I started college last year and thats when i started to get panic attacks. Im a wreak. Im tired all the time I cant concentrate and very emotional all the time lately. Im on medication but it just seems to be numbing me. Its great knowing where it comes from and im aware of the importance of breathing exercise and that i wont die and so on..... but its still there every day i cant see a way out of them i feel like im going mad !

belle Posted: 18/01/2006 14:03

Hi debs im new here as well. I get lightheaded palpatations sweating shakes and dizzy. Anxiety attacks can be managed if you do something as soon as you realise what they are unlike me i let it go on way to long. There is only one breathing exercise i find easy coz in a panic i dont have much control over my breathing. Count how long it normally takes you to inhale just your normal breathing habit. Then count how long it takes you to exhale. It should take longer to exhale this will control the ammount of adrenaline going into your system. If your inhaling is normally longer than you exhaling or their equal it will cause adrenaline to be continously be pumped into your body. you breathing if its wrong, acts like a tap thats dripping letting the adrealine in, if you plumb your tap by fixing you breathing there will be less ad. in your body. Panic attack is a fight or flight response, its a primitave response to danger or stress. If a cave man was faced with a saber tooth he wouldent have the thinking power we have today to get himself out of there he only had natural body responses which was fight or flight (run away). He would have needed the adrealine rush to help him fight or run fast. We dont need that response any more our brains are more advanced but when in a situation of danger or brain will still kick in with adrealine if we need it. A panic attack is when we get that sense of fear or danger when ther isent any logical reason for it so we go into fight or flight mode without needing to. the adrealine is pumping we are not running or fighting coz we dont need to and the adrealine causes the heart to race shaking accurs may feel dizzy may even think you are going to die but dont worry that cant happen . Its all just a reaction to stress or anxiety. This was long winded but it helps to know wat it really is. Two great books are "going mad2 (sorry cant remember the authors) and "When panic attacks".You will be fine they are common so try not to worry and do practice the breathing every day to change it, i can guarantee it will work !

tim Posted: 19/01/2006 21:36

the book self help for your nerves is out of stock in easons at the moment i tried to buy it yesterday after reading this site.

j Posted: 24/01/2006 18:49

hows things tim, you can order the book from easons go to www.buy4now.ie if you dont have a credit card get a 3v voucher you can get them from the permanent tsb and they can be used straight away.also the order is completely confidential.but whatever you do GET THE BOOK.

Dee Posted: 13/02/2006 17:04

Thanks for answering Karen. I checked back a few times. Lots of replies since I last logged in. I think I will try this book by C Weekes. Clin Psych - what do you mean e business? Do you mean counselling by web/email? I think my problems stem from a turbulent childhood and possibly separation anxiety. I am outwardly confident but can totally identify with the "what if" scenario. I am always tormenting myself about things that may never happen. What if my husband dies? What if I get sick? What if I lose my job? Normally when I am worrying about something that will never happen something else happens and you just cope. Even knowing this, I can't help it. It's become a mental habit. But more than that I have physical symtoms like palpitations, sweating etc. I've noticed a direct relationship between diet/alcohol/exercise and how good/bad I feel. Sometimes I think I am going crazy and I will never be free. I wish I could switch my head off. I also feel guilty a lot. Like everything is my fault and completely out of proportion to whatever my "misdeed" is.

Dee Posted: 14/02/2006 11:00

Tim - this book is available at amazon.co.uk secondhand for about £3

j Posted: 14/02/2006 12:04

hows things Dee im glad to hear that your getting the book i read in your message that you think that your anxiety stems from a turbulent childhood and possibly seperation anxiety.but i totally disagree i think you are thinking too much in your present anxiety state.everybody who suffers from anxiety is in a state of constant alert both mentally and physically causing them to think too much and over assess their problems.i can understand and respect where the clin psych is coming from as i am a 1st year psych student myself.but s/he is only coming from the one perspective from which s/he has been trained to come from.what you have to realise is that due to your constant state of adrenaline you are mentally fatigued.this is where ocd stems from.for eg when going to bed you switch off all the lights etc but as you lie in bed you may get the thought "is the cooker still on or is the tap still running" a person who doesnt suffer from anxiety is mentally relaxed and has their nervous system at a normal intensity so they dont entertain the thought as they know its false.but as you are mentally fatigued thoughts stick in you mind and you cant rest until you go and see again if the thought is true.you are feelin constant fear but the fear you feel is harmless what is causing you the real trouble is what you do when you feel the fear you add more fear causing extra adrenaline which exacerbates the problem.if you didnt add this 2nd fear and accepted the 1st and accept the fact that its going to stay with you for a while as theres no magic switch to get rid of it( except for tranquilizers etc) your nervous system would relax in its own time and you would fully recover.getting back to your idea of the seperation anxiety etc to prove to you that this idea is false and that your nervous system is really the problem ask yourself how come when i take tranquilizers etc your anxiety goes?the answer is because tranquilizers numb the nerve endings into the nuscles and organs etc which release the adrenaline.this is your problem your nervous system is over active.read the book and all will be clear.ill get back to you to see how your getting on once you read the book as im curious and interested.good luck j

ClinPsych Posted: 14/02/2006 23:18

yep I hope to have an e-therapy business up and running within a few months which will address mental health issues by email.

Dee Posted: 15/02/2006 09:15

Thank you J. I can identify with what you are saying. I find it very difficult to switch off . When I am afraid I try to rationalise it and sometimes I just think Ė forget it. Just feel it. ďItís just a physiological reactionĒ. Even when things are going well for me my brain is looking for the catch Ė Ďsomething bad must be going to happen or life is lulling me into a false sense of security or Iíd better be alert for the next disasterí. This is why I think it is related to my childhood. I was thinking that maybe I never learned to feel secure and safe for whatever reason. But I also identify with what you are saying i.e. that it is a chemical/nervous system imbalance. I had some major upheavals last year which set me back a lot i.e. I was afraid to go to work for no reason. I always made myself go though. The latest pattern seems to be imagining doomsday scenarios i..e illness/death - then feeling guilty because I think I will bring them on by thinking about them and then trying to think of something else. I sometimes think I am crazy. Itís exhausting. To the outside world I would appear ďnormalĒ. I canít wait to get this book and start reading it. I hope it helps. Thanks again for taking the time to respond.

ClinPsych Posted: 15/02/2006 12:23

Hi Dee, just thought I'd drop in a few more lines re the discussion. I think its great that J and others are giving lots of different views on what anxiety is, how it works and how we can change it etc. J is right I am trained in a particular way, in Cognitive Behavioural Therapy (CBT) which is one way (and most successful) way of helping cope with anxiety.
I suppose I try to steer people away from the chemical/nervous system imbalance way of looking at anxiety because I feel it disempowers them from looking at what they can change about the root causes and maintaining factors of anxiety. ie.e for alot of people who would come to me they can feel that they have accepted that it is a chemical imbalance and that only meds can address that. Not the case. As I think Ive mentioned in previous posts Anxiety is primarily about the relationship between three things: 1 Thoughts 2 Feelings and 3 Physical reactions of anxiety brought on by the previous two.
Looking at the details you've posted yes you may be right in saying you believe there is a link to your childhood and why you feel this anxious about yourself and the world around you.
Lets take an example
"The latest pattern seems to be imagining doomsday scenarios i..e illness/death - then feeling guilty because I think I will bring them on by thinking about them and then trying to think of something else."
What I suspect is happening here is that your anxiety (its good sometimes to externalise anxiety outside the person) is making links between events that have no logical link between them. ie if i think about X dying it will/could happen. You then try to think of something else which provides temporary re-assurance and brings down the anxiety quicker than if you didnt do the action (think of something else) so in effect if you didnt think of something else and experienced the anxiety and let it gradually come down (as it does) that helps to break the cycle of if i dont think of something else then the bad thing will happen.
You will always be anxious about something or other throughout your life, as EVERYONE else in the world is, we all experience anxiety, its a biological adaptive response, the trick is to be able to cope with anxiety as we experience it.....

j Posted: 18/02/2006 17:04

hows things clinpsych i read in your last post that you try to steer clear of the chemical/nervous system way of looking at anxiety as you feel it disempowers people.but isnt it just as disempowering to ignore it.you listed 3 things that make up anxiety with the physical sensations being the 3rd.this is where the book is so effective it shows you how you can control the physical sensations which empowers you making you in control of your anxiety.dare i be so bold as to ask you to read the book yourself.dr claire weekes dedicated 18 years of her life studying anxiety, curing people all over the world.her book is an international best seller.i think it came out in the 60s or 70s and it is still in print today which shows how good it is.she was even awarded an mbe by the queen.in the book she gives a physical and psychological perspective on anxiety.i was cured in just under a year.the reason that i write these post is because i can relate to anxiety suffers.i sympathise deeply with them.i just want one person to read the book and ill be happy.

j Posted: 18/02/2006 17:36

hows things dee its ok to think the thoughts that you feel ie the dooms day thoughts.id like to elaborate on what the clinpsych said on their last post about the trick being able to cope with anxiety as we feel it.when you think your worst case scenario thought you try not to think of them you try to make it go away but this is not helping, everytime you think the thoughts you cringe and your body tenses.dont be afraid of the thoughts accept them.when you think them, think to yourself in a calm and confident voice "i am only thinking this because i am suffering from anxiety and i am mentally fatigued."you then put the thoughts in perspective and see them for what they really are,which is ultimately just thoughts which will go in their own time.anxiety is worry/fear.fears about the future.its true that life is full of ups and downs.you said that you had some major upheavels last year, but you handled them, right?your still here today you came through them.and this will be the same with your future problems(problems in life are inevitable)you will handle them.you keep thinking to yourself what if this happens etc your focusing on the negatives.how about saying to yourself "bad things may happen but i can handle them ive faced problems before and i can face them again."your handing your power away.you must build on that little voice inside you that says i can do it i can handle it etc.your worried about bad things which you think might happen but dont forget good things happen as well.you keep on looking forward to the future try to stay in the present.your body is in a state of arousal but your safe.look around you everything is ok say to yourself everything is ok im safe.because the realistic and beautiful truth is that you are safe.when i say your ok i dont mean your totally ok(as you have a problem, anxiety) that would mean your ignoring your problem.respect the fact that your suffering from anxiety which will go away in its own time like a broken leg it takes time to heal.the advice ive given here is elaborated more thoroughly in the book.

j Posted: 20/02/2006 18:15

hows things ive spoken on my posts about the 2 culpruts in anxiety, thoughts and physical sensations ie nervousness.there are 2 types of anxiety sufferers those which suffer from the two culprits ive just mentioned this type of anxiety is called anxiety neurosis.the 2nd type is the same except the sufferer is also suffering from either a problem, sorrow or guilt in this case their nervous illness is complicated and they should seek counselling or get some outside help of some sort.in both cases thoughts and the nervous sensations play of each other.to illustrate how your bodies sensations play of your thoughts imagine if you were walking down the street and somebody points a gun at you, you would immediately think to yourself DANGER and your heart would start pounding your stomach would start churning etc.also though your thoughts feed of your nervous bodily sensations for eg when you have a panic attack or even when your stomach churns your body is sending messages to your brain saying, you guessed it, "DANGER."and although you cant see any immediate danger around you yur mind starts to make it up.you start thinking to yourself "what ifs."as ive said for the 2nd type of anxiety you must reslove your problem.STOP WASTING YOUR TIME LOOK THROUGH THE YELLOW PAGES AND GET YOURSELF A COUNSELLER.JUST DO IT.BUT ALSO GET THE BOOK BY CLAIRE WEEKES.as your also suffering from the physical sensations.i bet right now all you anxiety sufferers reading this are tense.i used to go around all day tensing my stomach as if mike tyson was about to punch me.i know the feeling of your stomach churning is unpleasant but tensing your stomach doesnt make it go away it prolongs it.relaxe your stomach muscles right now let them go soft.the feeling wont go away right away, keep this in mind as ive said your nervous system needs time to heal.but your churning will eventually go.i stress though what i am saying here is only the tip of the iceberg.for everything else GET YOURSELF DOWN TO THE BOOKSHOP AND BUY THE BOOK.

Sin Posted: 20/02/2006 22:23

I've just been reading some of what you guys wrote and I feel the same way a lot of the time as you do but don't know how to get past it. Even now as I write this I'm starting to panic and blush like a crazy person (dunno how crazy people blush but you get the picture I reckon!). I've tried to forget about it when it happens (the blushing that is) but the more I try to forget, the more I focus on it and the worse it gets. I know people are looking wondering what the hell is going on with me and why my face and neck are so red - to the point where most people ask have I got some sort of rash. It takes ages for the redness to go away. The fact that I know this happens makes it worse every single time coz I anticipate it before it even happens. Mostly the anxiety happens during work or in work situations but it's starting to happen more in my personal life as well. I dunno what to do. I don't want to take medication as that seems a bit drastic but I just want to be able to relax a bit more rather than almost literally wearing my heart on my sleeve (or face and neck in my case!). Does anyone have the same problem with physical blushing? If you do, how do you cope or have you learned to change it? Thanks guys!

j Posted: 21/02/2006 16:08

When you get into situations where you blush ie situations where there are other people around you become anxious as you know you will get nervous ie your heart will start palpitating rapidly etc you are selfconscious of other people seeing you nervous and you become embarrased and blush.im not ging to repeat what i have said in my earlier posts so go and read them now.
Good luck.

j Posted: 21/02/2006 16:15

hows things. if anybody has started reading the book it or if anybody is a former sufferer of anxiety and has also recovered by reading the book.could you please write a post as i would like some feedback.thanks J

ClinPsych Posted: 21/02/2006 22:07

Hi Sin, I work alot with people with social anxiety, which it appears from your post that you have difficulty with. First of all you're not crazy, we all blush, its a natural reaction to feelings of embarassment. These feelings result from thoughts that we have something to be embarassed about in each particular situation. Tripping on a step into a train in front of lots of people, ok generally accepted it would be embarassing. However for people with social anxiety lots of everyday occurrences are thought of as potentially embarassing. You are right, the more you try not to think about the blushing the more you will focus on it. Dont think of a pink elephant right now, bet you did..! As part of my individual and group work with people with social anxiety I use video role play alot. We enact one of the situations that generally makes the person very anxious. We get them to predict how anxious they will be before and during the anxious event and how obvious to others their blushing/sweating/trembling etc will be. What they find is that they over estimate how obvious their blushing is and they see this on the video's.
Do you do anything to try to hide the blushing? Alot of people i work with do things called safety behaviours to hide their physical symptoms of anxiety (eg women with long hair leaving down over face to hide blushing, not speaking to avoid stammering, wearing multiple layers of clothing to hide evidence of sweating) However this has the opposite of the desired effect as it actually draws more attention on the person.
In one of your last comments you ask can you change blushing, the simple answer is no, but you can learn to cope with it. The analogy I like to use with clients is that people with anxiety are like horses that wear blinkers. They only see the evidence that supports their anxious thoughts and miss all the evidence that contradicts it. From experience I would suggest that your anticipation of anxiety in various events is probably alot worse that the anxiety during the event itself.
Does every single person you meet notice your blushing every day...? How many people comment on it..? People with anxiety difficulties can generalise from one or two situations and apply it to every situation, eg if one or two people in work noticed my blushing then everyone must notice it and it must be really bad....?

Sin Posted: 21/02/2006 22:42

Jeesh, lots of questions. Okay do I do anything to hide the blushing - yep. Mostly I try to buy clothes that will at least hide some of it. Like I always try to wear something with a high neck so people can't see it. Also I try to buy make up, concealers, etc. to try to minimise how red my face looks. But I guess I don't know how many people notice it - I just assume they all do. People that don't really know me will comment. Okay, not all of them but a lot of them will coz they think I'm having some allergic reaction or something. When I write this it makes me realise even more how mad I am. I know the whole thing is completely irrational but I just can't help it.
You said that certain situations are accepted as embarrasing and that's true. But I could imagine for weeks on end about tripping up on that step on the train and when it does happen (which it inevitably will) it's one million times worse in my head coz I've imagined it for so long. It's such stupid things that make me embarrassed - like if someone asks me a personal question. It could be so simple as "where did you go out on Saturday" and I would start to get embarrassed. Sometimes myself I don't understand why. I've tried to pretend it doesn't matter that I'm going red but when I can see the people I'm with looking at my neck/face/chest, it just gets worse. And then sometimes my friends will make a joke of it and sure then it's into hyper-humiliation! I dunno what to do anymore. I really appreciate the response from you guys - makes me feel a little less of a loser.

j Posted: 22/02/2006 10:07

hows things sin your problem is basically you have bad nerves.your nervous system is made up of 2 parts the voluntary nervous system and the involuntary nervous system.the voluntary nervous system is under our immediate control it allows us to move our legs and arms etc. the involuntary though is not under our immediate control, the involuntary controls such things as your heart beat etc and responds to your mood.for eg when you are afraid your heart starts beating fast your stomach churns etc.when people experience a stressful period in their lives they put pressure on their nervous system and their heart starts beating fast etc basically they experience nervous sensations in their bodies.when the stressfull period is over the nervous system usually calms down.however sometimes especially if you over react to your stressful period your nervous system takes longer to calm down.but heres the catch, it would calm down but it doesnt for the following reason, you become aware of your nervous sensations such as your stomach churning and your heart beating fast.you become frightened of these sensations when really their just harmless bodily sensations(although i know from experience they can be unpleasant).to try and get rid of them you naturally tense up and try and control them.but when you tense up your body just releases more adrenaline making the problem worse. for eg as you read this your stomach is churning and your tensing your stomach trying to make it stop but your tensing of your stomach is doing the opposite it prolongs it.instead let your stomach muscles go soft.also your probably suffering from what is called jelly legs ie your legs shake when walking down the street etc.this is also due to your nervous system and i bet if you do suffer from this you do the same as when your stomach is churning you tense up your legs and try to control them.to test for yourselves how your tensing up is worsening your nervous sensations rather than helping them grab something in your hand and squeeze it really hard, see how your arm shakes.as i said your involuntary nervous system responds to your mood because of this counselling can help.it helps you to see your problems in perspective.

ClinPsych Posted: 22/02/2006 14:46

Sin you're neither mad or a loser, thats the first and most important point. You're just a normal person who happens to have social anxiety. What social anxiety all boils down to is an excessive fear of other people looking at us and viewing us negatively. Its a fear. This fear is manifested through physical reactions such as blushing. The anxious thoughts maintain the fears, safety behaviours and avoidance of certain situations.
Why does every single person need to like you? Hang on to the idea that you can accept yourself even if not every person you meet likes you (or thinks you're interesting, funny, witty, attractive etc) These are all things that people with social anxiety put pressure on themselves to be. If there is a lull in the conversation they take responsiblity for it and assume (wrongly) that they have to fill every gap and if they dont the other person will percieve them as boring and uninteresting. Communication is a two way street and both persons have to assume equal responsibility for the flow of conversation. It is very important to refocus yourself on the world around you and the people you are interacting with rather than focus inward which only helps to maintain the anxiety. Once you've left the social situation go easy on yourself, try to resist the tendency to replay the encounter in your mind looking for places where you might have committed a faux pas.
Anxiety affects your thinking in two ways. It leads you to overestimate the probability and gravity of danger (being socially evaluated) and it leads you to underestimate your ability to overcome adversity. If you are within travelling distance of Dublin I'd have a look at the Cognitive behavioural therapy group at the Mater Hospital. You can find more info on it at www.socialanxietyireland.com

Sin Posted: 22/02/2006 20:34

I am the queen of "conversation-gap-filling" and you're right, I do always feel that it is my responsibility to fill those gaps. This in itself leads to terrible moments of saying the stupidest things - just because I hate the "awkward silence". But you also asked why I feel that I need people to like me. Doesn't everybody feel like this? I guess I can't really accept who I am unless I know that everybody else accepts me too. Catch 22 really coz I know it's not realistic to assume that everybody would like me no matter if I have everything going for me under the sun. But how can somebody get past that need or desire for acceptance? Anyways, I guess I really have to try to forget about my "worries" and maybe just try to remember that it doesn't really matter if I do get embarrassed or if people ask me about it. Easier said than done but the battle has to begin somewhere I guess.
You also talked about when I leave a situation that has made me feel anxious, to try to forget about it. I guess this is one of my biggest problems and what causes me to think about future potential situations. I cannot let go of anything I've done. We all do stupid things in our lives for whatever reasons, but I re-live them day in, day out and I don't know why. And what's even worse is that I assume the people I was with at the time keeps thinking about what I did and how silly or stupid I was and that makes me embarrassed around them always - just in case they do remember!
I have seen that group at the Mater in the website you mentioned, but unfortunately I can't give the full time commitment they need due to work issues so I'll have to look for an alternative route and see what happens. Thanks again for all your comments - it really does help to have a neutral/unbiased "head" to talk to.

ClinPsych Posted: 23/02/2006 12:08

Hi Sin, just to re-frame one of your comments, how can others accept you if you don't accept yourself? You ask about how can people get past that need for acceptance by others? This is a common thinking error called black and white thinking. People think that they are either accepted or they are not (black and white) Life as we all know is not that simple, and especially not social encounters, there are too many extra uncontrollable variables. For example, our parents (hopefully) accept us as their children and they love us. However they might not accept bad behaviour from children, acceptance by others can be in bits and pieces. We can be accepted by our work colleagues as excellent at our jobs but maybe not as social friends outside of work. And yet we will be accepted by others outside of work for our social skills and not how good we are at our job. Think about your friends and acquaintances, how many of them are perfect and flawless, eg we all have friends who are a little disorganised, turn up late, over controlling, too emotional, over concerned with appearance etc, but this is just one facet of their overall personality, if we were to continually focus on the negative aspect of a person then we probably wouldnt have them as friends. Acceptance is about accepting people for the good things about them and the flaws.
You've mentioned twice now a key difficulty with anxiety in general and social anxiety in particular, " I ASSUME the people I was with at the time keeps thinking about what I did and how silly or stupid I was" This is whats called "Mind reading" The tendency with people who are anxious is to assume that they know what the other person is thinking and that the other person is thinking negatively of them. Here's an example, you're chatting to someone and they yawn and look over their shoulder. Anxious assumption and thought - "he must think the conversation is boring and must want to talk to someone else..." Only possible explanation...? Nope, he could have been up all night with a small baby and is tired (yawn) or he spotted someone else he knew and was thinking - oh i must have a word with that person too. Assumptions without thinking of all the possible alternatives (or more logical explanations) is a really really common difficulty. Try it out, see how many times in one day you make an assumption about something or someone, stop for a second and think, ok what else could explain it...>? The only way that we can improve our social performances and reduce our anxities is to put our selves in the situations. I'll try to drop in as much as possible and we can explore these issues more on here if you want.

Sin Posted: 23/02/2006 19:53

Hi...I'm reading your comments and I'm trying to figure out in my own head if I always get these panic attacks for the reason of "wanting to be accepted". I guess at the time it might not always seem that way but if I really think about it, it usually comes down to the fact that I'm worried about what that person or group might think of me because above all else, I can't bear it to be a negative thought. But what I don't understand is why is this a huge issue for some people (like me) and it doesn't really bother others. Why do I have a physical reaction to this need while others are completely unfazed by these pefectly normal situations. I'm sure everybody does have that same need to feel accepted but it's okay if they're not. I like to think I'm like that but I musn't be. So what makes me react this way or why would it have started in the first place? I never remember a time where I didn't have this problem in social situations - I'm just noticing it getting worse and worse.
I read an article on this problem somewhere a while back saying that it can usually start as a teenager and people eventually grow out of it. I think I've well stopped growing at this stage but I still have the problem. Does it pass for some people or is it one of those things that you just have to learn to live with? Actually, that's what I find the most horrible thing to accept - that I will be like this for the rest of my life! I want to be able to talk to people, work with people, deal with situations as most other people do without having this "thorn" in my side but I'm kinda scared at this stage that I will never be like that. Do you think people can change this behaviour?
Thanks for listening....

j Posted: 24/02/2006 14:46

hows things sin. you asked in your last post,"why do i have a physical reaction...".the answer is because of your nervous system.your nervous system is over aroused, you need to get it back to its normal intensity.when people come up to you from behind or if you hear a door slam, you might get a shock and jump etc.this is because your nervous system is more sensitized than normal.i think your only problem is your nervous system and your lack of confidence in social situations due to your nervousness.when you get into social situations you know youll get nervous and you do, and its difficult to be confident as your self conscious about other people seeing you nervous etc.i think your over all goal is to be a relaxed care free, confident individual.do you agree with me that your problem is due to your nervousness due to your aroused nervous system?do you think that if you got rid of your nervousness your problem would be gone?because i used to be a very nervous person always on edge, until i discovered that book by claire weekes.please tell me if your going to reply to my posts or not because i want to know if my efforts to help you are in vain or not.thanks J.

Sin Posted: 24/02/2006 17:02

Hi J..your efforts are definitely not in vain. Indeed I bought the book and it was delivered this morning so I'm hoping that it will help me through this as it seems to have helped you. I think the problem is down to being nervous or scared or something like that - just nervous I guess of what someone might say or do and how this will affect me and often I get embarrassed just at the anticipation of what might happen. The "what ifs" in this world are a killer and it's very difficult not to think of the what ifs. Is that a nervous reaction? Did you used to have the same problem where you'd anticipate a potential situation and then react? That's a really weird one but I do it all the time. Sometimes even sitting on my own, I will think about something that did happen or might happen tomorrow or the next day and then have all this rush of embarrassment, heart beating like crazy. Maybe that's not nerves - what do you think?

ClinPsych Posted: 24/02/2006 18:46

Hi Sin, you've queried what it is about you that makes you think and feel anxious in social situations. From working directly with people with social anxiety by far the most common factor I have come across has been bullying. This can come in many forms, bullying by peers, parents or colleagues. Bullying is where others purposefully make us feel bad about ourselves, knock our confidence and make us axious to be around people. This might not be applicable to your past but as I said it is the most common factor I come across with clients. However saying all that it is not critical to know what causes social anxiety in order to change it, and it can be changed.
You're absolutely right the "what if's..." are very difficult. But instead of trying to avoid thinking of the what if's embrace them logicially. Sit down and think, ok what if I...."say something in the group which one person thinks is a silly thing to say". In the greater scheme of your life how would this rank in terms of importance, in a months time will that person even remember the silly comment? how do i know they thought it was silly? am i making assumptions and trying to mind read again?
You say that you cannot bear the possibility of others thinking negatively of you. How do you know what they are thinking...? "they must think what I said was silly" thats an assumption.
In terms of the physical symptoms, letting go of control is an essential skill if you have problems with anxiety. People with anxiety try to control the body's reaction to anxiety (blushing) because they think that people will judge them harshly if they notice your symptoms. Trying to control the uncontrollable will end up with you feeling powerless and frustrated. What is important here is acceptance, acceptance of a certain level of discomfort in some situations. As humans we have to learn to live and cope with uncertainty. you know the old expression, nothing is certain in life except death and taxes. Its possible to happily co-exist with uncertainty, its the way the world has always been. Try another simple little experiment with yourself, your best friend has all the worries, anxieties and concerns that you have, what would you say to them....? try writing it down.

j Posted: 24/02/2006 19:28

hows things sin of course i had embarassing moments and what if moments.but today i have a care free attitude to life and i dont really care what people think of me as i have a concrete sense of confidence.the what ifs are not nervous reactions their just how your interpreting your nervousness.its as if you must validate why your nervous.for eg you heart palpitates so you think theres danger around etc the what ifs are also due to mental fatigue as your constantly thinking to yourself.im glad that you got the book.have a read of it and tell me what you think.good luck J

Sin Posted: 27/02/2006 10:01

Hi folks...so, does the whole problem of social anxiety just come down to self confidence? I don't remember ever being bullied so that's not the problem but maybe it is just a confidence thing. If you are happy in yourself, then you won't care about external unpredictable situations. If you don't have this confidence, then perhaps that intensifies the fear of the what ifs. But how do you gain self confidence? What is it that makes me less confident than those around me? These maybe just rhetorical questions as I guess only I know the real answer to them. In a family that grew up under the same outside influences, how is one sibling far more confident than the other? That's how it would seem to be in my case and I don't get it.
In any case, I've taken on board everything you guys have said and I'm hoping to try to change my "life patterns" and try to get a new me because I can't live with the old me for much longer - its way too depressing and spiralling out of control lately. So, here's hoping that I can stop this now before it drives me completely crazy.
Thanks for all your help!!

Christopher (UVL42722) Posted: 27/02/2006 12:35

Name: Christopher
About a year ago my confidence was that high I felt bullet proof. But I fell pretty hard when I failed a year at uni and felt I couldn't deal with it any more, I went on Citalopram 10mg (a low dose but boy did it work for me). My symptoms of panic were and are, just feeling nauseous I can deal with the mental side but wandering around feeling sick is pretty awful. I haven't been sick this year but I stopped my tablets two weeks ago cos like this post says it isn't a help it just numbs it and I am starting to get back to square 1. Got up this morning and I've been anxious for the past two hours mind you I drove to the supermarket so it isn't really bad again yet (like being scared of going out etc.). I bought some kalms tablets I'm skeptical if they'll work but I don't wanna go back on the medicine cos it isn't a fix. Any ones thoughts on what ive said appreciated :)

j Posted: 27/02/2006 14:39

hows things sin you find it hard to have confidence in social situations cause you know youll panic and you do.you know your heart will start pounding etc its difficult for anyone to be confident when they panic.once you read the book and get your nervous sensations under control youll become more confident everyday.youll be more in control of yourself.paul mckennas book instant confidence also helped me, i recommend it.

j Posted: 28/02/2006 13:40

christopher get self help for your nerves by claire weekes

angela Posted: 04/03/2006 08:13

I am 19 and suffering from obesity. I was on Celexa sence I was 13 and all of a sudden like 2 years ago I canged to a totally diffrent person. It was like I wasn't alive anymore it just stopped working I have not left my house in 6 months for a fear of dying. I really believe I am dying I have been to doctors upon doctors and nobody can explain my headachs and why my ears are ringing constantly my head feels like its going to pop and I get extreamy dizzy. I have had tests upon tests done and I am scared to the point I stopped taking care of myself like I used to I don't want anyone around me I keep to myself I have a beautiful baby boy Brandon he is my life me and the babys father live together my relationship is going down hill and family members don't understand me because I wont leave the house my boyfriend yells at me and tells me just to leave but i really cannot i get so bad when i go outside i shake and freak out and run back into the house I feel as I am a horrible mother and girlfriend so i tried to commit suicide and ended up in the hospital i seen another doctor and they perscribed buspar and it made me extreamley sick I am scared I heard that physical illnesses can cause anxiety but i never had this problem ever when i was on celexa i was 150 pounds and very active but now i am 220 pounds and very unactive and unhappy is there mabey something going on like an mysterious illness? mental illness? anxiety or social anxiety? I feel like I am in a hole and I can not get out - Angela .U.S.

ClinPsych Posted: 06/03/2006 09:33

Hi Angela, from your description it would appear to me that you are experiencing agoraphobia which is manifesting itself in panic attacks when you leave the house. People with these difficulties almost always experience physical sensations continuously, for example tension, trembling, a dry mouth etc. This in combination with your cognitive distortions (errors of thinking - ie the world is a dangerous place, if i leave the house I will die etc). There may also be an element of social embarassment of your current weight difficulties attached to your difficulties (ie I think I'm obese and what will other people think / say if they see me outside). The key to your current predicament is avoidance. You avoid leaving the house and there by get little exercise so your weight contiunes to increase. This contributes to your health difficulties and especially feelings of breathlessness. Feeling breathless (due to lack of exercise) increases your heart rate and then click the fears that you will die kick in. Making sense? By avoiding leaving the house you are maintaining your anxieties fears and health difficulties. There may be associated weight gain with the medication you were prescribed but blaming this would be a convenient excuse and would be counter productive for you. Perhaps the reasons the tests did not pick up any thing wrong with you is simply because tests cannot pinpoint anxiety and that is what you are suffering with. Think of your current situation this way:
Feel better feel worse, feel worse feel better.
By avoiding leaving the house you feel better but it leaves you worse in the long run (no exercise and belief that you have prevented your death) To make yourself better you need to feel worse (gradually leave the house and face your anxieties/fears) to feel better in the long run. You need to leave the house to prove to your mind that it is all in your mind. You say that you have not left the house in 6 months for fear of dying - how did you manage for the previous years of your life to leave the house and not die? A good cognitive behavioural therapist (if you constructively engage and be committed to change) would be a useful person to contact to help you overcome your difficulties

j Posted: 06/03/2006 15:43

hows things angela the reason you are afraid of going out is because you panic, your heart starts beating fast etc.there isnt actually anything threatening outside.basically you need to stop panicking when leaving the house. I found '"effective treatment of agoraphobia" by claire weekes worked for me.

angela Posted: 08/03/2006 04:09

thank you so much for your support I just seen the Doctor today and you were righ I have agraphobia and I am on medication. I feel really bad for anyone who has to go through it it's a horrible thing to face and I relize its not easy I have to keep telling myself its mind over matter but I relize its not just the meds that are going to help me I also have to help myself.......thanx again I really appreciate the advice I really needed it :)

angela Posted: 08/03/2006 04:24

where can I find the book for agoraphobia?

ClinPsych Posted: 08/03/2006 11:29

Hi Angela, congragulations on taking the first steps they're all ways the most difficult. I would encourage you to only use the medication as a stepping stone to being able to control your anxiety by yourself, which is very possible by changing the way that you think. I would recommend Mind over Mood Change How You Feel by Changing the Way You Think by Greenberger and Padesky and you can find it on Amazon. I would recommend this book as opposed to a specific book about agrorophobia as from your description of your difficulties I think you have a number of general anxieties and self esteem worries that a good CBT book like Mind over Mood will help you to address. Drop another message if you have any more questions and I'll do my best to try and answer them

j Posted: 08/03/2006 12:17

hows things angela you can buy the book from amazon.i would strongly recommend you buy this specific book for your specific problem namely agoraphobia.buying another book would just be going around the problem instead of facing it head on.although other books may help.i think your low self esteem is from you having agoraphobia.

ClinPsych Posted: 09/03/2006 09:06

Hi Angela, my advice to you (and it is up to you at the end of the day to decide whats best for you) is based on my clinical experience as a qualified clinical psychologist with first hand knowledge of dealing with anxiety disorders. My logic and reasoning for recommending Mind over Mood was that, yes ok you now have difficulty with agrorophobia but this is rarely where these difficulties originate, ie it would be my belief based on what you have said that there were other anxiety related difficulties present prior to the last 6 months. It would seem like the agrorophobia has become the culmination of a number of life stressors and anxieties for you. I think that it is a great idea to takle your difficulties with agrorophobia but this will only takle the culmination of your present difficulies. Taking a more holistic approach and trying to look at what got you to this point (and all the bits in between..!) will help you with relapse prevention and give you a greater understanding of yourself.
Again you mentioned in your post that you have been on Celexa since the age of 13. This drug is used to treat episodes of major depression and is not given lightly to young people. This is not the place to be disclosing the reasons for your need to be on Celexa but I would again ure a more holistic approach to looking at the way you see the world, this may well aid you in understanding the origins of your depression at the time and how this has resulted in your current difficulties. Best of luck.

con Posted: 09/03/2006 11:40

hi all,very interested in what ye all have to say on anxiety as i suffer from anxiety myself..the one thing i have to say,which i think isof vital importance,is to be careful when giving out advice to people..what might work for you might not work for other people.. to be giving out advice about such things as the nervous system, i think people should be very careful her..unles like Clin psych,you are qualified to do so..

j Posted: 09/03/2006 14:07

hows things con thats a very valid point.but the nervous system is of vital importance in anxiety.if a person has a calm nervous system then their anxiety is gone and thats a fact(how do you think tranquillizers work).no i dont have a certificate like the clinpsych, but i have the experience of having suffered from anxiety and panic attacks for over 10 years.the claire weekes method will definately cure you if you follow it.i feel elated now that im free of anxiety.its great but it was all thanks to claire weekes.go to www.panicfree.co.nz for more information on her method.

con Posted: 09/03/2006 14:52

cheers j, i appreciate your help..i will definetly purchase that book you were talking about..i was not directly contradicting you about giving out advise.. i think you know where i was coming from..another thing that i think is a bother to people in this country who suffer from mental problems in this country is the ignorance that surrounds such things..

G Posted: 09/03/2006 17:02

Hi I'm new to this website but so glad I found it. A month ago I got really sick had pins and needles sensation in my finger tips, toes, light headedness, headaches, just feeling wrecked no energy. Doctor told me I has viral infection affecting my nervous system. I was out of work for nearly 2 wks. When I returned to work I was bk at doc within 2 days with same thing again. Doctor told me I had virus bk again but referred me to hospital out-patients just to get it checked it out. The consultant at the hospital has referred me for an mri which is happening at the end of this month, she reckons it is probably viral but wants one done just to be sure. Although all my bloods were fine and nothing has showed up I cant help thinking, actually I'm convinced I am going to be diagnosed with MS. I am driving myself mad. I wake every morning with nausea feeling in tummy, nervous feeling, jerky all day...my head is wrecked. I have suffered from nervousness and anxiety before but I have never let myself get this bad. Help?

angela Posted: 09/03/2006 23:54

clin phyc,
thank you so much for taking your time to help me out and give me advice not alot of ppl would take there time to do so. I'm not really going to explain the whole situation but I was diagnosed with PTSD,anxiety,depression when I was 13. I experienced my first panic attack when I was only 8 years old I remeber it well although at that age I didn't understand anyhting It was at a concert I sang solo and I ran off the stage and curled into a ball I could not feel my whole body and I wanted to be alone I was telling people to get away from me I was terrified. I had a real hard childhood growing up but never talk to anyone about it. It feels as if it better to type my problems instead of talking face to face with ppl. I actually wanted to ask you 1 questioin It may be in my head but I really don't understand all the symthoms of anxiety. I keep getting constantly alot of pressure and a warm feeling and headachs so extreame that my vision is off I went to the eye doc. and I have great vision and I stopped driving because of it. In the long run I do understand that I am just making it all harder on myself by not leaving the house because I will never be able to experience life as what it is. I used to love snowboarding and walking through the wilderness but as crazy as it sounds it is not small places i feel closterphobic in its open spaces like I wont be able to make it home ontime I will die its like a never ending game i play with my mind and its torturing sometimes i believe that i am fighting for my life but nothing is physically wrong with me besides obesity which is an easy thing to cure with a good diet and exercise. I keep thinking that I am not going to get better. I think I may be a bit of a hypocondriac when someone tells me someone they know have haert problems..ect..I automaticly have it I tried self diagnosis which was extreamely disturbing because I had a brain annerysm,tumor ..everything my doc was like angela...stop looking up things on the internet it will not help u dont have every disease lol.I even went as far as reading books on phycology such as direct observatin,correlatin,behavioral,psychodyamic,emotion and my biggest fear organic brain disorders even though i dont understand any of it lol i went to that level becuase thats how scared i am

j Posted: 10/03/2006 14:37

hows things angela your sight problems are due to an over active nervous system.when your nervous system is over active you become nervous ie. your hands shake etc this also affects your optic nerve causing you sight problems, objects may appear to shake etc.

angela Posted: 10/03/2006 22:06

j
thank you i feel like im loosing my mind its very scary it's like the anxiety is taking over me it is possible to controll but its also very hard how long do i have to wait to make sure the medication is working?

con Posted: 13/03/2006 22:01

hi clinpsch..is there any chance you would give a contact e mail . i would like to discuss a few things with you only as i dont feel like discussing them over the net ??

Anonymous Posted: 14/03/2006 13:51

Hi Everyone,
I was wondering if you could shed some light on something for me. Firstly I dont like going to the doctor because I feel like a fool. But over the past 12 mths I have have noticed that I have been changing, I keep feeling like I have done something wrong, that I have upset someone (when I havent), that something bad is going to happen.. I have become more and more into myself and it has been said to me in work. I get stressed over everything. I have lost interest in everything and I just cant get myself out of this. I hate the way I feel and I hate what I am becoming if that makes any sense. I am a happy person and I dont know why I feel like this all the time. I dont know how to explain it to a doctor.. Am I just reading to much into this or is it anxiety?? Thanks for your help

j Posted: 14/03/2006 13:58

hows things angela, did you get the book i recommended? I think it will answer a lot of questions for you.i can tell you are very bewildered at the moment.there is a website www.panicfree.co.nz which was set up by a guy who recovered from anxiety etc by using the books.he has incorporated all her books into one cd.

j Posted: 14/03/2006 14:03

angela, you said it your last post about controlling anxiety.this is a major problem for people with anxiety they try to control it but unfortunately you cant directly control anxiety(except with the aid of tranquilizers, and even then your only masking it).but you can control it indirectly.

con Posted: 14/03/2006 18:52

i know the feeling sounds like anxiety alright..i think you should read a lot of the stuff that is already on this discussion page..i found the advice from different people and of their experiences was very helpful

Dan Posted: 14/03/2006 21:13

Hi, Ive found this web page by accident. Basically Ive noticed some changes in me that are worrying. Firstly, at work I seem to get agitated and nervous. I cant seem to sit still, jumping from one task to the next. I dwell on silly little things, running things over at the end of each day. Ive become bad company to friends as I drift in an out of conversations pre occupied with one thing or another, usually what I've said or other people have said to me. On a good day im not bothered, on the worst days i could be in a supermarket feeling dizzy, a sort of numb feeling accross my forehead, slightly shakey. Most days, this strikes me in the afternoon at work. I seem to loose composure, and my mind races. I blurt out silly things, that I often regret on my way home. I wish I could get a grip. I feel as though this may be an accumalation of a lifetime of say "a lesser form of anxiety". I didn't have the perfect adolescence, and did develop a bad self image. Maybe I was bullied. What Im asking for now is what can I do. I dont think I'd fancy going on medication. Thanks for any advice.

ClinPsych Posted: 15/03/2006 11:03

Hi Con, sorry for the delay in replying, at the moment I cant reallyt give out a contact email, that would make things a little more formal in terms of a therapeutic contract of sorts and that brings with it all sorts of other complications, however I'm working on something where in the next couple of months such a service would be available.

Bubbles Posted: 15/03/2006 11:05

Hi Dan, I've just read your posting. I do feel for you as I am going through similar stage myself. I posted last week what was going on with me - its in Discussions under heading of Paranoia. I've gone into some detail in that posting but can also relate strongly to what your going through. I cant offer advice I need it myself, but I can offer support and let you know your not alone! Keep posting, this website is fantastic are there are some really good people who post regularly and they too will offer support and possible advice.

ClinPsych Posted: 15/03/2006 11:15

Hi Angela, its actually a positive thing that you think your anxiety is taking over you because this could mean that you are facing up to situations that cause anxiety that you previously avoided. You are right, it is very very hard to face up to your anxieties but it is the only way to challenge your cognitive errors, we have to face and experience that which we fear before we can objectively judge whether the situation was worth expending all the energy we did worrying about it. Even when we have faced our anxiety provoking situations (and got through them), it is very important not to be too self critical looking back at what we accomplished, ie. i talked in public everyone must think i was a fool and said something stupid, or I only walked as far as the shop today and thats not far. Be proud of your accomplishments no matter how small you perceive them to be, they are giant steps for people with anxiety. The medication will not rid you of anxiety, it is not a magic cure for it, it will help you to temporarily cope with anxiety from a physiological basis, if you took meds only and came off the meds the over whelming anxiety will return, what the meds can help you to do is to face the anxiety situations and work on challenging your unhelpful thoughts that are fuelling your anxiety,long term only changing the way that you think can help you to cope with anxiety provoking situations. you can do it, you've taken alot of positive steps so far, why turn back now.....

ClinPsych Posted: 15/03/2006 11:28

Hi Anonymous, ok first thing that strikes me, I dont go to the Doctor because I feel like a fool. Why do you think the dr will think you're a fool, how do you know he will think that...? As for how you feel you have changed, it would certainly appear that you have some difficulties with anxiety, from your descriptions it sounds like you have what are called ruminations. This is basically a big word for you think and reflect alot on worrysome things. It would help in your case to be more mindful of the present. you worry that you have hurt someone - based on what objective evidence....? Or that something bad is going to happen, yes it may or may not, may happen to you or to someone else, we cant, as much as we'd like to, predict the future, if we could we would stop lots of bad things in the world from happening. Why is it your responsibility to predict and prevent bad things from happening? We cannot control how people will react to what we say or do, if they perceive something inocous we say as offensive then it may not be our fault, they may have had a row with their parent / partner / colleague etc which has them on edge, we cant take responsibility for controlling other peoples lives or how they feel. It is hard enough to control our own lives and feelings!!
I know you say you are a happy person but a number of things you have said dont tie in with that. You have become more withdrawn, have lost interest in everything, feel stuck in a rut and have feelings of self hate. Could you be depressed? You have explained yourself confidently and in an articulate way on here, copy it paste it into word, print it and hand it to your GP if you dont have the confidence to say it out loud. He will see enough in what you have written to point you in the right direction.

ClinPsych Posted: 15/03/2006 11:40

Hey Dan, it would seem from your description that you experience social anxiety on a daily basis and this is definitely something that you can work on yourself, with help or within a group (social anxiety group in Mater Hospital)
Most posters on here ask about how to control and prevent anxiety, you cant. Trying to control it can lead to feeling more intensely anxious for longer. You may ask well what am I to do while I'm feeling anxious, the simple answer is nothing!! Accepting and tolerating your anxiety when you're deliberately confronting your fears is the most effective way of ensuring your anxiety passes quickly.
Id encourage everyone to try this out. If you are 100% convinced that your anxiety will not diminish by itself, even when you do nothing, test it. Pick a situation that makes you anxious that you normally avoid or withdraw from and make yourself stay in it and let anxiety do its thing. Just stay where you are and do nothing other that feel anxious. What is fact is that anxiety cannot keep increasing and increasing, it has to plateau and slowly come back down and down. If you repeatedly face your fears then your anxiety will become less severe and will reduce much quicker each time that you face it. If any of you out there try this and it works for you I would encourage you to share the experience with your fellow posters.

ANGELA (QMV10711) Posted: 15/03/2006 13:11

Hi ClinPsych
Thank you for your posting. I dont like going to the doctor because part of me feels like its just me that feels this way..However reading the other postings I now know that i am not the only one. I dont want to be given tablets or anything I just want to feel 'normal' if that sounds right. I have a day off work tomm and I am going to go to see the doctor .. I will let you know how I get on (or if I even make it).. Thanks again

j Posted: 15/03/2006 14:47

hows things, i wrote in my previous posts about fear being the core of anxiety.the fear comes in the form of a rapid heart beat racing thoughts etc basically general nervousness(due to an over aroused nervous system).the problem when you suffer from anxiety is that you try to escape this fear but this just fuels it/prolongs it.if you just try to relaxe by letting your muscles feel heavey etc and then feel the fear, experience it(even say to yourself in a calm voice while relaxed come on fear bring it on)and i dont mean try to feel the fear by clenching your teeth or tensing your body i mean by relaxing being submissive towards it.youll see the fear for what it really is.which is ultimately just a feeling.if you practise dealing with fear like this you lose your fear of your fear and eventually you recover.can any of you sufferers reading this see what i mean about your fear fooling you.can you see how your fear is false.look back at past circumstances when you felt fear in certain situations, talking to people, doing a speech etc.see how your fear is fooling you.i know i make it sound too simple and i know that a rapidly beating heart can be scary.but once you understand that a fast beating heart can do you no harm and you see it for what it really is, which takes time, you lose your fear of it until it no longer matters if your heart beats fast or not.next time you get a panic attack relaxe and go with it experience it see it for what it is lose your fear of a fast beating heart etc. next time you have an attack try doing these 4 things as claire weekes teaches 1.face your nervous sensations dont try to make them go away thats what youve being doing up to now and hasnt worked before and it wont work again go with the sensations be submissive towards them actually consciouslly feel them 2.accept your fear, respect the fact that its going to stay with you for a while that it will go in its own time, that it wont just disappear as if by magic 3.relaxe, let your body feel heavey let your body feel as if it is floating, dont tense your muscles let them go soft 4.let time pass, the fear panic will go in its own time. if you practise doing these things you eventually see panic for what it really is, a bogey.and you lose your fear of panic and it eventually goes.you have to live with fear to live without fear!!!

Dan Posted: 15/03/2006 21:05

Thanks for all advice given, much appreciated. I do believe in the method of facing your fears through and seeing what might happen. Believe it or not I have spoken publicly to an audience of up to 60 people on more that one occasion. I can tell you, starting off is very daunting, your aware of every word while always trying to control your voice and breathing. But after a while your cruising and they cant shut you up!! I dreaded that job when I was first asked to speak, but now I'd gladly do it tomorrow. But its certain situations that cause me anxiety, I can relate that back to experiences in my past, and am able to question my perceptions and "mind reading". For example, I could finish my public speaking, but worry about mingling with people afterwards, talking to someone who doesn't want to talk to me etc. That comes from a low sense of self esteem I reckon. So, in a sense I am aware of when I am worrying unecessarily, but yet cant stop, and as said lately its manifested itself physically from shaking to having a dazed pre occupied look on my face, which compounds the existing anxiety, as I worry people are noticing how I look. I take from the replies to my first posting that I should try identifying whats worring me, and face it, whatever it be - rejection or an odd look etc. Can I ask the Clinical Phych, have I interpreted your reply correctly and if I know what causes these unecessary worries, how do I eliminate the silly negative thoughts and feelings that preceed them. Is it possible to regain a sense of self esteem on your own. thanks again.

j Posted: 15/03/2006 21:14

when you suffer from anxiety there are certain nervous sensations that are constant such as the palpitations and churning stomach.then there are some which reoccur such as the shaking hands and feeling nausious, these occur when your anxious state is intensified, for eg if your agoraphobic you dont have jelly legs when at home but you get them once you step outside because once outside your anxiety increases and is intensified.i mentioned in my last post about claire weekes method.you apply this method to all your nervous symptoms but for now ill show you how to apply it to your churning stomach.take a few mins to do this.up to now youve been trying to ignore your churning stomach instead concentrate on it, relaxe and analyse it for a while go with it, describe it to yourself.relaxe your stomach muscles, dont tense them.is it so bad?apply the 4 principles from my last post.face, accept, relaxe/float,let time pass.is it so bad?are you going to let a churning stomach upset you?yes i know its unpleasant.but go with your nervous sensations dont flinch from.by flinching from them you are doing no good.consciously try to make your churning stomach get worse by relaxing and applying the 4 principles.does it get worse?no it doesnt!!see how your nervous sensations are fooling you.the stomach is the most sensitive part of your body in relation to stress and the churning stomach is the last of the nervous sensations to go.

Sin Posted: 16/03/2006 05:58

Hi all...I've just been reading what you've been saying and the last posting from J. You've described an anxiety that is physically felt but not in a way that people can actually notice. For me, when I get nervous, anxious, etc. I go so red it's just not funny and sometimes, if it's really bad, my lip starts to quiver which is soo embarrassing. So, it's very hard to let the fear take over as such and completely relax with it. I know I have this outward display of my anxiety and that's what makes it worse and prolongs it. I've being doing really well this week as I've been in a stressful work situation and I'm really proud of myself for not getting too anxious - it hasn't gone away and sometimes it's been bad, but it hasn't been constant. But the thing is still the same - if the anxiousness is outwardly displayed to the world, how can you learn to be comfortable with that? I think that's the hardest thing for me to learn to do because I don't know if I will ever be comfortable with the fact that I look a certain way when I'm anxious and therefore, everybody around me also can see when I'm like that. It's so frustrating.

ClinPsych Posted: 16/03/2006 10:58

Hey Dan, well the first step in working on changing our negative thoughts is a step that you have already taken, identifying for ourselves that they are negative thoughts. One of the things about accompanying physical symptoms of anxiety is that when we have them we focus more on them which increases our anxiety and increases the physical symptoms and so the circle goes round and round. People who get anxious in social situations fear being negatively judged, however they are not in a good position to objectively judge how people are reacting to them for one reason. They are focussed inward on their physical symptoms which as ive mentioned increases anxiety even more. What is important is to be more mindful of what is outside us, our interactions with others, if we focus more on enagaging in the social interaction and trying to enjoy it then we have less resources available to be monitoring our physical symptoms. You worry about whether or not someone wants to talk to you or not, Ive mentioned before the issue of control and needing to predict in anxiety. We cannot reliably predict how anyone will react to us at any one time. Someone could be perfectly nice to us today and blank us the next day. Does this mean they dont like us and want to talk to us? Maybe they were feeling sick, under work pressure, distracted, other less self threatening explanations than they dont like us. Try enjoying the fact that you suceeded in making the public speech, live the present rather than worrying about a future you have little control over (future social interactions and reactions from others). your quesition about regaining self esteem on your own, absolutely, you are the only one who can ultimately change the way you feel about yourself, others will play a role through complimenting you or wanting to be around you but it will be up to you to interpret compliments and others reactions to you in a positive fashion.

j Posted: 16/03/2006 11:34

hows things sin did you get the book?i can relate to what your saying about being self-conscious, afraid of other people seeing you nervous and embarrased.you also say its hard to let the fear take over.but whats the worst thing that can happen if you let the fear take over? nothing youll stay exactly the same.you must lose your fear of fear.build on that little voice that says come on fear bring it(say this while relaxed of course and following the 4 principles).if you do this your fear gradually loses its significance until it goes away.as i said earlier be relaxed and let the fear sweep over you let it get as intense as you think it will get.and you will see that it actually doesnt get any more intense.as for as getting embarassed and nervous in front of other people.the reason you get embarassed in front them is because you get nervous in front of them.just before social situations you are saying to yourself "ok im not going to get nervous now, im not going to get embarassed now etc".but of course that doesnt work you still get nervous and embarrased and your lip shakes etc.instead you should adopt the mind set of, "ok im going to get nervous now im going to blush my lip is going to shake but ill just go with it, and if anybody sees it it doesnt matter what they think." yes i know this attitude takes courage but as i said you must build on that little voice that says i can do it i can feel the fear.because once you do that you unmask fear and see it for what it is.anyway you shouldnt care what other people think of you as long as you havent committed a crime or done some unjust or immoral than quite frankly screw what other people think.what they think is totally irrevelant, you are placing too much significance on what others think.other people dont go to work for you dont do your shopping for you dont pay your bills for you so stop caring about what they think!!!you are letting fear control you, lie down and relaxe some time and practise the 4 principles and try to make the fear worse.youll see that it doesnt get worse, it may persist at the same level, as i said nerves take time to heal but it doesnt get worse.you said you find it hard to let the fear take over, but its already taking you over.you think that if you dont tense up etc that your fear will escalate, but by tensing up it escalates.by relaxing and using the 4 principle and letting fear "take over you" you take over the fear.do you understand what im saying?

j Posted: 16/03/2006 11:42

sin, i forgot to say in my last post that when you get nervous etc in front of people and your lip shivers.it doesnt actually look as bad as you think.because you are in your present anxious state you are magnifying your worries.just like you are with your doomsday scenarios.if your lip shivers let it shiver.dont try to control it.do the same as when your stomach churns.go with it.build on that little voice that says it doesnt matter if it shivers until it becomes a big strong voice and it actually doesnt matter if it shivers or not.it will then stop over time.

ClinPsych Posted: 16/03/2006 13:59

Hi Sin, welcome back to the forum. Your question about the anxiousness being out there for the world to see, I may have said this to you before, but how do you know that its obvious to everyone around you? How many people have commented on it (out of all the people that you know and have ever known?) Whats the worst thing that they could think about you? that you're feeling a bit anxious, would you agree that there are alot worse things that they could possibly think about you? It is extremely difficult for someone with anxiety to be an objective judge of how their physical symptoms appear to others, they constantly over estimate how obvious they think their symptoms are. I would address this in group work using role play and a video camera. In the outside world you could try something else. Is there anyone you trust (friend or family member) enough to tell you the truth and to act as an objective judge. Put yourself in an anxiety provoking situation with them, predict before hand, during and after how anxious you think you appeared. Ask your friend afterwards to describe and rate how anxious they thought you looked. This is not as useful as the benefit of seeing yourself on camera but its the next best thing.
I see alot of hope in your post, you coped through a very anxious experience in work, the anxiety has not been constant, there's alot of positives there. As ive said before anxiety is an ever present and it will go up and down, the important thing is that we feel that we can cope with the anxiety itself.

con Posted: 16/03/2006 18:42

hi all..about the social anxiety,i suffer from it myself..almost every weekend i.e ..the pub !! i am constantly thinking about what people are thinkin of me,how they see me physcially.as a result i put on a big serious face and that keeps people away and to an extent hides my anxiety because i'm afraid people will notice it(anxiety) i have been told by my female friends etc that i am good looking and all the rest but no matter what people say to me i cant see it and only mull over a small negative comment,which may have only been a little joke, rather than think of the positive ones..i have been to see a behavioural therapist and i do find him excellent,what i try,and i stress"TRY" is visulise the way i act/react towards other people in social settings..i do confess it is not that easy..but like clysch said,at the end of the day,you can read as many books,listen to as manyy self-help cd's ..but you have to d DO these things not just THINK about it..

Sin Posted: 17/03/2006 02:49

Hi folks. Yes J, I bought the book. I haven't read it yet - it's hard to get time when it's quiet to actually focus on it so I need to do that.
ClinPsych, thanks again for your comments. I guess when I feel embarrassed, it is an assumption that everyone can see it and I also guess that they're thinking that there's something wrong with me. Fair enough, not many comment on it but I'm thinking to myself that they're obviously noticing it and wondering if they should say something. I figure it's completely silly to think that but it doesn't help at the time, do you know what I mean. I can't automatically think to myself that they don't notice - if I can feel it and it makes me feel like I just want to shrink away and hide, then I can only assume in my own head that they're also seeing it in me and thinking that I've got some kind of weird problem. I know I'm not supposed to worry about what other people think but I can't help that. And yes, like Dan, I imagine potential situations that might happen in the future and freak out about them which makes me dread the time it might happen. Then if the "potential" situation does actually arise, I practically pass out with nerves and shock. This might be a really simple case of meeting somebody who I've been friends with but haven't seen in a while. Rather than thinking "this is great, it's good to see this person", I just think "what will people think when they see this person say hello to me" - how stupid and irrational is that? I know in my own head it's silly but it doesn't make the reaction any less tense. But I have to say again that I'm so proud of myself this week for coping with the situation I am in and maybe I can just try to build on this bit by bit. I guess it took years for me to make myself as nervous and anxious as I am so it will take time to rebuild myself into a confident person. Day by day I guess but here's hoping!

angela Posted: 17/03/2006 06:33

I am defentlly not going to give up. Like you said before how did I manage all the other times before this. I have made a big decission a decission that would encourage me to change my life and well being. It is not going to be an easy change I understand I am going to have to be patient and this is probley one of the biggest decissions I have made in my life but I applied for a job. I got extreamly frusterated and called. I have a two hour test tommarow. It is an office job and it dosen't really matter to me if I'm hired or not but it means alot to me that I am actually going to go. I am terrified it is going to be like a whole new world to me sence i haven't left my house other than appointments and relitives on a limited basis. It is a scarey thought that I an trying to ignore but I relize I have to do it. I can't go on like this I have to take care of things and stop worrying soo much I have a beautiful baby boy and just looking in his eyes says it all hes 15 months old and I got really thinking how is mommy going to take him to the park and play football,baseball with him in the field and encourage him if he decides to play sports ..am I not going to be on the bleachers cheering him on because I fear social contact or because I feel like I'm dying but all the times I felt that way I go home and I'm fine. He needs me and I know I have to do this atleast try. I admitt I am afraid I don't know how its going to go and what to expect but i am going to do it..thank you all for your comments and every 1 is unique I am defentlly not a doctor nor trying to be 1 but I do understand 1 thing we all are suffering in some way from this it is a horrible thing to face and i dont understand why or how but I know we can do this I wish u all the best and thankyou :)

j Posted: 18/03/2006 21:06

hows things i dont blame people for being suspicious/apprehensive about buying the book i recommend.i know a book may seem like a trivial thing.all i ask is for ye to be open minded.youve all probably read books on anxiety before an it didnt help you much.but i honestly swear by it.do ye not think my posts sound logical at all.please go to google and type in "claire weekes amazon" click search no. 1 and click on customer reviews and read some of the 61 reviews.have you ever seen a book get such good reviews before???

tim Posted: 19/03/2006 20:25

andela can you tell me how you recovered so fast from agoraphobiaone minute you have not left the house in six months now you are applaying for a job, i do not get it ,how did you do it i would love to know, tablets do not work that fast, nothing does , you have done all this in fiffteen days that how long ago you started on this site , i suffer from agoraphobia it not that easy to recover so how did you do it ?

angela Posted: 20/03/2006 04:15

tim,
i wish i was cured but not. I do leave the house to doc appointments and relitives on a limited basis and i thought applying for a job would helpp take it away a bit but it didnt cause i didnt go.i was recentlly diagnosed with agoraphobia and trying to find ways to improve my phobias but dont know where to start. when i posted that reply i was stressed out and had a couple of drinks thinking i can do it but when it came time i turned back. I could have made it to the interview mabey got the job but i couldn't really go and live a normal life because i would probley run out of the job crying. sorry i made my reply so dramatic im just stressed out cause i dont know what to do

j Posted: 20/03/2006 14:52

hows things id like to make this my last post.it seems my recommendations have been in vain.i cant even get anyone to read the book I recommended and that frustrates me. I wonder if anyone read the reviews on amazon.i give up. good luck to you all any way.

con Posted: 20/03/2006 15:01

clinscyh..mood very low after weekend ..thinking on goin on meds but dont want to in case i get hooked on them..can you advise ??

Dan Posted: 20/03/2006 22:17

Hello again. Thanks for your advice Clinic Pysch. its also good to see people can relate to me. Today, I spent less time preocuppied with perceived social mistakes etc and the stressed out moments are becoming less common. At the bad times, I have noticed that I tend to always blame myself - for not saying hello or whatever. As though there is an in built negative idea of myself. That is what I need to conquer. Its strange how in those moments you imagine everyone else is socially perfect, with out flaw - how silly!! On the other hand, there are times when I feel great, on top of the world, when I realise that interacting socially is about generousity. On those days your glad to say hello, spark up a conversation and share yourself. Its about being good to other people, not how they percieve me. During those times my confidence is high. Thats what I'd like to ask, if anyone has the answer, how can one feel like this one minute and the opposite the next?
A message for those with 'high' social anxiety. Although Im still there, Ive come along way, take it from me, the only way to overcome it is to face down each of those situations that scare you. Dont beat yourself up if you make a mess of it, perceived or not. Believe me, funny as it sounds coming from me, but people seldom give a thought to whether people are shy or nervous, there mostly too rapt up in themselves to even notice. Even if they do they rarely see it as a flaw or unlikeable in any way. So keep facing each fear down, dont relent, and you'll get there. Remember I've given public speaches and would do it again in a jiffy, how strange life is. P.S. appreciate any answers to my question above.

ClinPsych Posted: 21/03/2006 10:40

Hi Con, sorry for delay in replying. I'm afraid I cannot advise re whether or not someone should or should not go on meds as it beyond my professional competencies, a visit to your GP would most appropriate. I have mentioned before that I believe Meds are a useful measure to help people as a first step to challenging the thoughts that make them feel down / anxious.
J - While I commend you for your willingness to listen to others and contribute to the forum I feel your last post was inappropriate. The concept of a forum is to offer advice to others and it is for them to decide whether or not to act on this advice. To me it is inappropriate to put pressure on people to accept a suggestion / recommendation and then if it is not followed up on to issue a statement that could lead people to feel guilty.

karen (kazzap) Posted: 21/03/2006 16:51

clin psych, can you reccommend a good book for my boyfriend. he has terrible social anxiety. there is only one pub in town that he will go into as he knows no body will be there, if i call his name while we are shopping he goes mad cos 'people will be looking at him'. if a restaurant is packed, he will have to leave. if our doorbell rings, his heart races....i could go on and on about it. i think it stems from a p***k of a teacher he had when he was young as his friend is also the same. i have suggested he gets help but no way. he asked me to get a book for him to help him so i'm asking for your help! thanks i advance.

ClinPsych Posted: 21/03/2006 17:59

Hi Karen, no problem, the book that we recommend to participants on the Mater Social Anxiety Group is:
Overcoming Social Anxiety: A Self-help Guide Using Cognitive Behavioural Techniques by
Gillian Butler.
You can get this on Amazon or they should have it in Waterstones in Dublin either. Get him to have a look at the Social Anxiety Ireland website it may be helpful for him to see some descriptions of people with SA who have come through the group. Hope this helps

Dannyboy Posted: 21/03/2006 20:58

Hi all, i have a query with regard to this topic..im really talking about anxiety/panic/ depression...im a young man.. in my twenties..ive had all of the above every year since i was 17-18..a phase a year is what i have come to expect..each year seeing a doctor when ive had a senario like a trip abroad for a year followed by a panic anxiety attack, or a situation like starting college when i was 17 ,...and missing a girlfriend 2 the point of spiralling into depression ...with the result of returning home...however no one would ever say this to me or indeed expect it..at the moment ive had a typical episode this year...just like last year at the same time...at the moment ive had a few stressful months , build up in to becoming very unhappy and loseing my normal witty self and out goin character to goin aay for a weekend , feeling anxious constantly panicky low and finding it hard to engage in conversation , however when im feeling my self..(which i do most of the year)..i would be seen as a character ...i just dont understand this ..i would love some one to give me a number of somebody who realy can help me to break out of this circle..as i went to the doctor yesterday again for a prescription of lexapro..which work enormously for 3-5 months ..then i cease to take them when im feeling myself again...i can go on 4 6-9 months with out feling any problems..then over a couple of months i slip back in to the 'dark days'.. .with out realising it ..until an occasion comes up (ike last weekend).i go away with friends ..which should be a great occassion..but instead am the oposite to how i should be...nervous-pannicky-depresses--really anxious....i ve come to expect one of these phase a year..and i d love to be able to chat to some one about my condition..as some times i get very low about this as i dont want to spend my life falling in and out of this trap....with the esult of goin to a doctor.(who every time to be honest didnt really care or know what was wrong)..with the result in medication being prescribed..which always work i might add....i dont realy know what i asking ye guys..just that id like your views....some times this feeling can realy feel like a nervous break down...wit complete lose of apetite and general apathy, accompanied by panicky feelings...does any one have any idea..?..would be much appreciated...

karen (kazzap) Posted: 22/03/2006 12:37

Clin psych, thank you mucho, lets hope this will help!

con Posted: 27/03/2006 18:14

hi dannyboy,how are things,if its any comfort i know what you are goin through.like yourself i am a character two and always the fella in the pub with the funny remark,mad for the women etc..was out on the beer last nite,great nite but today,as low as you could get.read up on this type of thing and kinda looks like bi-polar disorder but i am not a medical professional so obviously i cant say for definate,the only thing i can say is seek help from a connsellor because it just wont go away out of the blue,i am in my 30's now and this sh*t ha sovertaken my life..dont let it do the same to you..

Dannyboy Posted: 30/03/2006 13:33

thanks con appreciated...does any one recommend somebody in dublin to speak to about this..or is it better to go to a physciatrist or what..?..im not knowledgable on this...and have nt ever told anyone..to be honest..i find it very embarassing to have this 'flaw / weakness' in my character....but i kno i need to be able to deal with this and repair my nervous system properly and not with medication....last thing i want to do is go to somebody who starts wastes my time and their on time...so hence id appreciate a advice...this behavious cognatve therapy is it gud ..? or is it specifically for some thing else other than general depresion anxiety...(which i suffer from )..? thanks guys

j Posted: 30/03/2006 19:28

hi everyone you thought youd seen the last of me.well im back!!let me tell you all the reason why i write my posts.i once suffered from anxiety and depression.the reason i suffered from depression by the way just like you all was because i was suffering from anxiety.my anxiety was depressing me.but i recovered fully only a few months ago.suffering from anxiety is like being in a maze.you just dont know how to get out.unless you obtain the knowledge how.as i said in an earlier post i stumbled across a book in easons called self help for your nerves by dr. claire weekes and since that day i have never looked back.id been on medication xanax once or twice and lustral and seroxat on seperate ocassions had counselling for 5 years.all the medication done was to mask my anxiety.the counselling helped a lot as i was suffering from low self esteem etc.but even after the counselling my anxiety still persisted.in my opinion in the opinion of a former sufferer that is there is only one true way to beat anxiety for good and thats tha claire weekes way.ive said it before the culprit in anxiety is your nervous system.if you dispute this then ask yourself how come when i take tranquilizers my anxiety magically disappears.its because tranquilizers numb the nerve endings preventing adrenaline from being released.claire weeks shows you how to calm your nervous system all by yourself without medication.from reading claire weekes books my anxiety went in a few months.i strongly urge you all to get the book.read some reviews about it on the internet if your unsure.well thats all im going to say the rest is up to you!!good luck

con Posted: 30/03/2006 22:45

hi dannyboy..to be honest with you ,a lot of the stuff i put myself through is my own negative thinking,i've been at it so long now i am finding it hard to change..cognitive therapy is very good in my opinion but like everything else you have to go and do things !!!! no good just jnowing what you should do...if you know what i mean..would recommend a physciologist(not sure about spelling) rather than i physciatrist(again not sure of spelling)..the former in my oponion is more about action raher than just talking about it..you should look one up in your area..not cheap though

Dee Posted: 31/03/2006 15:17

HI J
GOT THE CLAIRE WEEKES BOOK! Can't say I am cured but it helped immensely. There's a big difference in how I feel and it's great to know that I am not alone. I have stopped trying to "fight" thoughts and just let them " go away". I know what you are saying about tensing your stomach, I used to do that all the time and it took me ages to even realise it. No wonder I used to have digestive problems! I also grind my teeth in my sleep. Lately I've noticed a dull ache in my shoulder and put it down to posture etc but I noticed that I grip the steering wheel really hard when I'm driving! I am trying to become more aware of my body and to chill out a little. I've cut back on alcohol and try to eat sensibly. There's a direct correlation - if I ead s*** I feel s***. Too much drink sends my nervous system into overdrive. Thanks for the book recommendation. I will be keeping it by my bedside and referring to it when I need it. I also (tho it sounds corny) have been reminding my self how "powerful" I am. I have been through so much (who hasn't?) but I got through it and will cope with the future. Take Care

j Posted: 03/04/2006 13:48

hows things dee, great to hear from ya.has the book cleared up a lot of your bewilderments.there is one thing i want to tell you.i advise you to stick to the book and not try any other method.i advise you to do this but of course it is up to you what to do.anxiety is really a fear or fear.thats the psychological definition of panic disorder.you must trust yourself and let the panic take over just practise doing it.because ironically by not letting the panic take over it does take over as you have fear of it.letting the panic take over sounds terrible but in fact its not as when you actually let it take over it doesnt actually get any worse but gradually subsides.also dont become preoccupied thinking when will i be free from this only become preoccupied with facing the fear and seeing it for what it is which is only a natural physiological state which eventually goes.i made a few mistakes along the way which hindered my recovery i started trying other methods to try and speed up my recovery, but i then went back to using the book which i should have stuck with in the first place.if you need any help with your recovery from some one who has been in your position and has recovered just drop me a line.and i will be more than happy to help.good luck J

andy Posted: 06/04/2006 14:03

I have been getting treatment for depression and anxiety for nearly 3 years now.I am on 40mg of cipramil and two .5 xaxex a day. I am a good bit better than i was but still find it difficult coping when i am alone. At times I get this feeling of an non existance, and total numbness while carrying on with my daily life. It is as thought I am in a transe all the time, I do every thing ok, but at times I do not remember doing it. My concentration is very poor, at times I can spend a night watching tv without having a clue what i am watching. It is the same when I read a newspaper, after 5 minutes i lose track of what i am reading. I recentely compleated an anxiety management course and found it helpfull, but it did not cover the points i mention. Can anyone shine some light on this for nightmare to end for me.

j Posted: 06/04/2006 16:24

hows things andy i used to have the same problem sometimes with the watching tv and not knowing what was going on, its as if i was unable to grasp the plot of the show or film.but the reason for this is quite simple your nervous system is working overtime as it is on constant alert.im sure as you read this your heart is pounding etc.when your nervous system is overactive it causes you to think too much.and you suffer from constant introspection, its as if you cant escape your own thoughts.id recommend you to read the book that ive recommended in my previous posts.but what i would even more highly recommend you to do is visit this site www.panicfree.co.nz.on this site a man by the name of david johnson has put together a programme which combines all of claire weekes books.you can even give him a call he gives his number on the site.just make sure you call him after 10 oclock as he is based in new zealand.i recommended you to do this but of course it is up to you.you have nothing to lose, but in my opinion so much to gain.david johnson has a clinic in new zealand in which he has been curing people from anxiety for the last 18 years.he also has the programme on cd as well as a downloadable version.good luck J

andy Posted: 06/04/2006 17:20

J. thanks for your reply. I have just looked up that site you sugested, and found it very interesting. I have just sent off an email to find out more. What is the name of the book you suggust.
Andy

j Posted: 06/04/2006 21:15

hows things andy.the name of the book is self help for your nerves by claire weekes.claire weekes wrote many books on anxiety and panic attacks etc she was even awarded an mbe by the queen.the thing is one of her books really isnt enough as they all have additional information.i myself bought 3 of her books.what david johnson has done is incorporate all her books into one.did you see on his site that he has a downloadable version of his programme that you can get straight away?it costs 99 nz dollars which is 50.22euro.i highly recommend it.good luck J

fi Posted: 06/04/2006 22:25

hi andy
i think you are brill, you were able to explain what you were feeling and got some help, i went to the doctor today and felt all those things but could not tell him because i felt he would think i was stupid, i am so glad that i am not the only one to feel like this, i know this doesnt make you feel better but you have helped me, thanks!

andy (RYV44309) Posted: 07/04/2006 15:36

Hello J. not having too great of a day, but i just have to get on with it. Had a good look at David Johnsons site and it is very interesting. I am going to save some money, and try to buy the download in a few weeks time.

andy (RYV44309) Posted: 07/04/2006 15:47

fi, how are you. glad i was of some use to you yesterday, Please never allow yourself to feel stupid, because you are not and never will be.It was also a boost for me to think as insane as i feel at times to be told that i was brill. All those feelings are part of the nightmare called depression and anxiety. I find that trying to keep busy is of great help. try not to sit around turning the unreal thoughts in your head,get up and do anything.please keep in touch, as we both may be of help to each other

j Posted: 08/04/2006 14:43

hows things andy.whether you get the david johnson programme or not is up to yourself.you say that your not having a good day, that your depressed.having depression and anxiety is slightly different than just having depression by itself.as more than likely although not always the only thing that may be depressing you is your anxiety.in this respect your depression is a symptom of your anxiety.when you suffer from anxiety you are very bewildered as you feel you are not in control.you may even go to the doctor with your bewilderments and he doesnt adequately answer them for you.the unique thing about claire weekes is that she was a gp and also had a degree in science namely physiology.this made her different from other gps who are usually trained in just the illnesses of the body.she had a more thorough understanding of how the body works.she won a scholarship to study the anxiety state.she was awarded an mbe by the queen for her work and was even nominated for the nobel prize, also she had her own programme on the bbc in the 60s or 70s.she says in one of her books how the lines were jammed from people ringing up after each programme.many people around the world treat people for anxiety by using her method.although david johnson is the only one i am aware of who has developed a programme for sale.also claire weekes books are a bit out of date as they are from the 60s.although they still work and are still in print after 30 years which more than validates her method.

con Posted: 10/04/2006 20:29

hi j,how are things,i got the claire weekes book that you were on about , i do find it useful but i find it concentrates,earlier chapters anyway,on people who are anxious over even going out etc,i have no problems with going out,be it to the shop or pub but what i find is that i just cant stop thinking and worrying about things !!! does she delve in to my kind of problem in later chapters...what do you think ???

Animo Television Posted: 11/04/2006 11:15

We are currently interested in making contact with people who feel they have a story to share about their experience of phobias. This is with a view for a short feature on Irish television. My email address is paili@animo.ie and telephone is 01-6174782 Responses will be treated in a confidential manner. E-mailing us at this stage will not mean a final commitment to the programme. The motive for this feature is to create awareness about how phobias can be very disabling for people in their daily lives. Many thanks and best wishes Paili

andy (RYV44309) Posted: 11/04/2006 11:57

J how are you. I got in touch with pacicfree last Wednesday by email. On friday last to my shock I got a phone call from New Zealand, it was David Johnson on the other end. I was in total shock to be actually talking to the man himself. We spent in excess of an hour talking, he was fantastic. For the first time in 4 years of suffering i was speaking to some one who knew what i was saying. It was a great booost for me personally that maybe just maybe i have found what i am looking for. At no time ever in the conversation did he mention anything about buying his programme, all he wanted to do was offer some advice and encouragement. Thanks for the info and take care . Andy

j Posted: 11/04/2006 14:33

hows things andy.thats great news.he cleared up a lot of your bewilderments didnt he?thats why ive been writing these posts for so long.ive been trying to make people see that there is a way that they can be helped and understand all their bewilderments so that they dont relapse.in my opinion it should be a standard thing that if you suffer from anxiety you use the claire weekes method.but unfortunately its not.maybe although it is early days we could make people more aware of claire weekes method.good luck to you andy, im happy for you.

j Posted: 11/04/2006 14:38

hows things con yes in later chapters she does.its in the chapter on obsessions.you suffer fron constant introspection in other words your obsessed with your own thoughts.maybe you could have a look at david johnsons site.www.panicfree.co.nz or even give him an email or a ring hed be more than happy to speak to you.just make sure you ring after 10pm as hes in new zealand hes very approachable so dont worry about annoying him or anything.good luck J

j Posted: 11/04/2006 14:42

hows things animo television.i used to suffer from anxiety panic attacks the lot i also recommend you ring david johnson.hes been treating people with anxiety and phobias for the last 18 years by using claire weekes method.i tried counselling and medication but the only thing that really worked was claire weekes method.

ClinPsych Posted: 11/04/2006 17:34

Hi everyone, the lady from Animo TV is looking for actual people who suffer from anxiety and in particular social anxiety to showcase to an Irish TV audience the extent of the debilitating effects of anxiety.
Con, hi, having constant worries and anxities does not mean that you have obsessions or OCD, that would only be the case if you believed that if you did not perform the thoughts that something bad would happen or by having the thoughts you are preventing something bad from happening. It is not realistic to have your goal as never to experience a relapse. I find that many of my clients go through periods where their anxities will re-surface, they trick is that people will have the tools and resources necessary to help them to cope through expected periods of anxiety.

con Posted: 11/04/2006 20:06

hi clysych..interesting you mentioned about the thoughts i have..my problem is that i overanylayse eveything that happens in my life and spend loads of time thinking negatively about things that may happen in the future and how i am going to handle them..eventhough i do know that thinking about things and whats going to happen will not change things,i still find it very hard to stop doing it..if you know what i mean..

con Posted: 11/04/2006 23:15

clin scyh,reading you comment, if your explanation of ocd is..quote"if you believed that if you did not perform the thoughts that something bad would happen or by having the thoughts you are preventing something bad from happening" i think i might be touching on that because that is the way i do think at times..e.g..if i think i am going to meet ex-girlfriend out at the weekend i would be thinking all week that if i do not act a certain way around her she will not want to talk to me again(means a lot for this not to happen as we parted friends)..and that if i act a certain way

j Posted: 12/04/2006 12:33

hows things clinpsych, i read in your last post that you were talking about ocd.i have a question for you how in your professional opinion do you get rid of ocd??

ClinPsych Posted: 12/04/2006 17:27

Hi Con, from your descriptions I would not believe that you have OCD. It involves compulsions to do certain events or actions to prevent a feared event from happening. What it appears you are doing is rehearsing an event due to your anxities around it. Its called a safety behaviour. We think that if we rehearse every possible thought and action about a feared event we will appear less anxious and will cope and perform much better. The opposite is actually the case. By rehearsing for an event we are limiting ourselves to a small repetoire of responses, it can make our conversations and tone of voice appear stilted and "rehearsed". Rehearsing is our attempt to control the future and more importantly how others percieve us and react to us. If we are constantly trying to act a certain way that we have thought about and rehearsed then it is virtually impossible to live for the moment and enjoy the social situation for what it is. If you parted as friends it was obviously a conscious decision for her that you were someone worth having as a friend. What do you think she would say to you if you told her you were trying to act a certain way to make sure she stayed your friend? She chose you to be a friend because of who you are and not how much of an act you can put on. By focussing so much on the future we have no time or energies left to focus on the here and now.

ClinPsych Posted: 12/04/2006 17:34

J, in relation to OCD, it is an anxiety difficulty just like panic attacks, social anxiety and anxiety in general. As I have mentioned before you cannot get rid of a natural human response like anxiety, but you can cope with it. As it happens, OCD is one of my main areas of clinical interest and experience. I help people to cope with OCD using cognitive behavioural techniques. It involves looking at the cognitive errors that underpin peoples obsessions and compulsions. You then collaboratively create a hierarchy of anxiety and feared situations. This is followed by a series of controlled and systematic exposure to the feared events with support from the therapist and the clients family. In my direct clinical experience I have found that this is the most effective method for helping my clients cope with OCD, it is also the method which has the most empirically backed research proving its effectiveness. Hope this answers your questions.

con Posted: 12/04/2006 20:16

clin sych,think you hit the nail on the head there..cheers,i undestand fully what you are saying,makes a lot of sence,what you describe is what i constantly do every day,always planning ahead for the next day,rarely living for the day..i think a lot of my habit of rehersing is me mixing it up with visualising which you are encouraged to do in a lot of according these selp help books/cd's..do you know where i am coming from ??

j Posted: 12/04/2006 21:26

hows things clinpsych.l will give you claire weekes view on ocd and obsessions in general.she defined 3 types of obsessions, 1.obsessions with your thoughts, which is basically thinking all the time, in other words constant introspection.2.obsessions with ideas or thoughts which cause you fear, for eg. if a person is waiting for a train they may get the thought of jumping in front of the train, or a person carrying a baby may get the idea in their head of dropping the child, the person doesnt want to do this of course, but the thought just comes into their head.these thought cause them fear of course which further fuels their anxiety.3obsessions with doing things or ocd, for eg a person may go to bed knowing they have everything turned off but will get out of bed and check again, they may even repeat this several times.claire weekes stated that of course these obsessions are harmless, they dont actually cause you any harm.it is what you do when you get these obsessions that is important, you become afraid or annoyed by them therefore adding further anxiety.these obsessions can be simply axplained, they are caused by mental fatigue due to thinking too much.when a person is mentally fatigued they find it hard to get thoughts out of their head.just like sometimes you may find it hard to get a song out of your head.instead of getting annoyed by your obsessions you have to accept them, you have to try to stop trying to get rid of them as trying to get rid of them exacerbates them.once you accept them you stop becoming annoyed by them and realise they are ultimately trivial things and the obsessions become devalued so to speak, the impact of having them is softened and they finally disappear.this is only a very short account of how to deal with them for a more in depth account people reading this who suffer from these types of obsessions will have to read the book.

j Posted: 12/04/2006 21:37

clinpsych i forgot to ask you a few questions in my previous post.to be honest you confused me more than answered my question.what do you mean by cognitive or thinking errors.people who have ocd know that its not necessary for them to carry out their obsessions.how do you mean "feared situations" in respect to ocd.what do you mean exposure to ocd.i find that psychologists in general dont actually tell you how to deal with the fear which comes in the form of physical sensations or frightening thoughts.and fear is the core of anxiety is it not.i think that you go around the problem instead of facing it head on so to speak.

fi Posted: 12/04/2006 21:39

andy my doctor wants me to go and speak to someone about how i am feeling but i dont want to am i wrong not to go or should i go dont know if this would help me just dont want to feel this way any more i feel lost

andy (RYV44309) Posted: 13/04/2006 18:41

Fi you have got to talk to someone sooner of later. I know what you are going through, because I am living with the nightmare for almost 5 years now. I was very reluctant to talk about it to anybody in the begining, but now i do not hide it from anybody. We did not volenteer to be this way, we are victims,so why have a stigma about it. The one thing I have learned about depression and anxiety is that recovery is in our own hands, but we all need guidance from somewhere. I have got a good bit better since going to an anxiety management course, and feel it would do you good to get a better undestanding of the whole thing. I still have anxiety problems like having no focus on life, no concentration, no disipline, no emotions, not caring, feeling of hopelessness,but i do know that I will recover sooner or later. Please try to talk to someone you can trust, like a good friend, or a trusted family member, or a professional. Believe me Fi you will feel great once you start trying, it is not going to be easy but it will be the best thing you will ever do. I do not know what age group you are in Fi, I am in my mid 50s, and still feel life is worth living. Take care and keep in touch. Andy

j Posted: 14/04/2006 15:51

hows things andy.would you recommend fi to speak to david johnson?

andy (RYV44309) Posted: 15/04/2006 12:05

J I am sort of ok at the moment, numb but ok. Yes it may do Fi good to talk to david,but not yet. She in my opinion needs a better understanding, and hopefully she can get a lot of help from this forum. I have not yet purchased Davids programme,as i am still trying to save enough money for it. Take Care Andy

ClinPsych Posted: 15/04/2006 20:32

Hi all, and J in particular. You are right in one respect there is one particular problem that I have been skirting around for a number of months now. The problem is the critical and personalised nature of some of your posts which aim to promote one method over all others, even going so far as to "advise" people not to try anything else. This forum is intended for a sharing of information with people who experience anxiety with the hope that they will learn both from professional and personal experience and adivice. It is not intended for "scoring points" off other people or making crass generalisations such as:
"psychologists in general dont actually tell you how to deal with the fear which comes in the form of physical sensations or frightening thoughts.and fear is the core of anxiety is it not.i think that you go around the problem instead of facing it head on so to speak"
Do not get me wrong, I am always open to healthy debate and discussion but in this case I feel that it is not in the best interests of the forum or the people who use it for me to engage in this further with you. I admire your devotion to the writings and methods of Claire Weekes, but it may not be for everyone, if my clinical practice has taught me one thing is that people will require a wide variety of methodological approaches and formats to help them through various difficulties in their lives. You claim that Psychologists rarely confront a problem head on with clients, what you must understand is that sometimes this is not possible, people who have experienced difficulties for a number of years can be vulnerable people and require time, patience and understanding before they can fully address their difficulties. with all due respect to you if you progress further in your current psychological studies this will become more apparent to you.
My intentions in contributing to this forumn were entirely altruistic in thier motivations. There are approaches and methods to which I have used and found to work exceptionally well with clients (such as CBT), but I will not denegrade other methods (such as Claire Weekes) simply because I do not use it. I would strongly encourage all users of this forum to look at many potential methods of help for their anxiety difficulties before choosing the one that suits them best. Best wishes to all users of the forum and I wish you all future success with your difficulties with anxiety.

drew Posted: 18/04/2006 17:14

hello ClinPsyph. just read your latest article, and i am asking you on behalf of members of the forum to keep on going. I know J does not agree with a lot of your opinions, but life goes on, i think your articles are very helpful. the only change i would like in you contribution is a bit more of plain english, as a sufferer of very poor concentration, and short term memory i find it difficult to understand at times. is there any publication you can recomend for me to help with my concentration, lack of interest in everything, no focus on anything.low esteem, no emotions. I hope you will continue to write on this forum for many years to come.
J I also think you are of benifit to people as well, but shoud not use the forum to attack other contributions from others. I know a lot of people who get a lot from this forum, but would never be able to contribute anything, they get reassureance from reading other peoples articles,so caal a truce in this game of words, it is helping nobody. cheers to all

Maria Posted: 18/04/2006 20:23

Hello Clin Psy.. new to this site and new to anxiety. Only recently have i experienced awful anxiety attacks which turn into out of control panic but each time i panic i end up crying which is awful as it has meant i have left my job and unable to see anybody.. staying in the house. I really really want to avoid medication which my doctor wants me to do. This is the worst thing to ever happen to me as i was always so normal and confident.. maybe leaving my job was harder on me than i thought and caused this. Can anyone tell me if they have problems with constant bouts of crying on a daily basis due to anxiety? i am not depressed or sad so i'm at a loss to what's going on. Any advice would be appreciated.. especially relating to the crying part. thank you :-)))))

con Posted: 19/04/2006 11:46

hello clin sych,i agree with drew ,please do keep contributing to this site as i have found your advice very helpful and often refer back to your advice..

j Posted: 19/04/2006 18:37

hows things sorry to everyone if ive annoyed you all especially the clin psych.i cant help but feel strongly about claire weekes method.i dont mean to sound arrogant or cruel but it is the best way to get rid of anxiety for good.any one who has recovered from anxiety by aid of her method will tell you that.by recovering by using claire weekes method you completely understand why you are in the state you are in an how to get out of it.im sorry but counselling makes recovery from anxiety very complex and confusing.when in fact it is quite simple.the clin psych listed before the 3 factors in anxiety thoughts feelings physical sensations.these are all easily explained by claire weekes.people may think thoughts such as something bad is going to happen etc and that thought brings on a bad feeling.accompanying this they suffer from palpitations etc.the thoughts they think are harmless but the sufferer is scared to think them they attach to much negative emphasis onto the thoughts.they are afraid to think them.but this is going about it the wrong way they should just think the thoughts even welcome them that way the become unafraid of them and they gradually go.this is just a sample of claire weekes method but doesnt it sound logical.im sorry for upsetting the clinpsych but psychology doesnt have the best approach to treating anxiety.

tim Posted: 19/04/2006 22:04

maria sorry to hear things are so bad for you at the moment . i went through all that crying stage it is anxiety.when you relise this it stops , i do not what to say to you it is different for everybody you have to find your ownway through this maze of fear , but you will ,it is not easy it is very hard but it can be done .i even quit fags, i think we can all learn of each other on this site ,

j Posted: 20/04/2006 15:10

hows things maria ill tell you the reason your crying so much, well ill tell you one of the most prominent reasons why.its because when you suffer from anxiety your emotions are magnified.for eg if you do something mildly wrong you will be filled with guilt.if some one done something wrong to you you may fill with anger, if you see something sad you will think it is awful sad etc etc.this all goes as your anxiety goes.

Maria Posted: 20/04/2006 22:24

thanks Tim & J for your replies :-) Tim when you said that when i realise it's anxiety the crying will stop i started to feel more positive as crying all the time infront of everyone is embarrassing. Can i just ask am i better off to relax at home or should i be forcing myself to socialise to get over this? i thought maybe if i just relaxed at home for some time it would be better as a recovery rather than forcing myself into situations that would cause me anxiety as it is very draining and i want to recover. thanks again for your comments.. very helpful :)

A23 Posted: 20/04/2006 22:48

Hi MARIA
I read your posting ad immediately felt I was writing it. I am very similar around 2 years ago, I got a panic attack. I had no idea what this was, my life completely stopped and work, college, boyfriend, everything was over. I was a confdent, happy girl with no major issues, had a lovely childhood. All of a sudden I was a person whO could not leave the house, AT ALL. Everything was fearful and I was always crying. It was just horrible. I was nt really depressed, but just felt low over the whole anxiety thing that had taken over everything in my life. After around a year I got over it and I am a new transformed happier person. I believe everything in this life happens for a reason. Sometimes we may nt know what that reason is.
Inthe last 3 months or so, I ve goten sick again, even tho i find it hard, I know i will get better soon. I could write a book on this but I just want you to know there is people suffering like you aswell and there is so much help available both medically and alternative. I myself find medication combined with alternatives, like meditation, yoga, simple relaxation techniqus good. Breathing exerices are brillent. Also I find book like the POWER OF NOW b echkart tolle very motivating and undersanding.
You have to be strong for yourself and try think of the anxiety as a means of bringing you to a good place in your life. Sometimes something bad must happe us to bring us to a good, meaningful and happy place. Just ake it day by day and baby steps.
I wish you the very best health and happiness. Best of luck to you. Mind yourself and CHIN UP GIRLY.

Anonymous Posted: 21/04/2006 11:11

I have a major anxiety problem & fear that if I cannot overcome this, I could end my marriage. I am extremely anxious & nervous when I am the passenger in any vehicle my husband drives. We had an accident a few years back & he has had a few unfortunate tips since. He is also a vocal driver commenting about other drivers.
I am pleading for your help. I think I should undergo hynotherapy but don't know where to go as I have heard of so many scams. I live in Galway & neither my husband who to be honest is not the worst driver in the world nor I can continue with my reactions & anxiety while he is driving. The horrible thing is I am fine with anyone else driving. This is going on at least 5 years and is now causing more & more rows to the stage where we are both unhappy about the situation. Please help me!

j Posted: 21/04/2006 12:13

hows things maria i read in your last post that you dont know whether to force yourself to go out or stay at home until youve recovered.im afraid if you stay at home away from situations that cause you anxiety your chances of recovering are very slim.instead you have to change the way you think in certain situations.basically you have to change the way you think in regards to panicky thoughts and panicky feelings that you have in anxious situations.once you stop being afraid of these panicky thoughts and feelings and even welcome them and see them for what they are which is just thoughts they just go.it is the feelings which come with the thoughts which are causing you trouble.for eg you may have a thought of getting knocked down while crossing the road and whenever you get the thought you cringe and become scared of it.instead you must think the thought even more than you want than the thought loses its value of fear so to speak and it eventually goes as it no longer matters if you think it or not.for more of this type of method to treat your anxiety get a book by dr claire weekes or visit this website www.panicfree.co.nz which is run by a man who treats people for anxiety by using claire weekes method.

j Posted: 21/04/2006 12:28

hows things you are anxious in the car because you fear another accident even though you know that another accident is very unlikely yoy cant get the thought out of your head as you are mentally fatigued.also your nervous system is over aroused.i recommend you buy a book by dr claire weekes.

Sandra (TNZ45648) Posted: 23/04/2006 19:31

Can you tell me what is the name of the book you are referring to?
You are right in that I keep thinking that another accident will happen and I know that I am making my husband paranoid & nervous about his driving capability. I have booked a session with a Hypnotherapy Clinic for next week which I am also willing to give a go. But, a book might also be helpful.

j Posted: 25/04/2006 19:12

hows things sandra the name of the book is self help for your nerves by claire weekes.dr claire weekes wrote many books on anxiety.each of her books has additional information in them.i recommend you visit the website www.panicfree.co.nz where you can buy a programme which incorporates all her books into one.

drew Posted: 26/04/2006 16:00

J can you tell me the truth, are you an agent for panicfree, do you receive commission for recomending Dr Claire weekes books. It just seems that you wont allow anyone else think of just the one system. I find it strange that after years of suffering and treatment, that these names are only being mentioned by you and nobody else . Not one of the professional people i have dealt with have ever recomended her books. I have mention her name at group meetings,and her name is not familier, strange do you not think.

j Posted: 26/04/2006 18:22

hows things drew first of all no im not an agent for panicfree or anything like that.im just an ordinary 21 year old student.i have a good bit of free time as im studying arts and i have free access to the internet in college thats why i write these posts regularly.your right there are a lot of systems for dealing with anxiety i tried most of them and i bet that you have as well, only to find that you were back at square one, you still had the anxiety although maybe it wasnt as intense or maybe you had fully recovered only to relapse.your right in one way that she isnt that familiar but her books are still in print and theyve been out since the 60's.she had her own programme on the bbc and was even given an mbe by the queen.do me a favour go to amazon.com and read a few of her reviews.her method is the only method in which you fully understand the state you are in how you got to be in that state how you are prolonging that state and how to get out of it.have you read any of her books if have you will see where im coming from.

j Posted: 26/04/2006 18:33

hows things i had to write another post as my posts are too long.read andys 3rd or 4th last post he mentions getting a phone call from panicfree.he says that for the first time he felt like he was being understood and thats the beauty of her method it clears away all of your bewilderments, you understant everything.the reason that i write these posts is to make people aware that there is a simple way out of their anxiety.i just want to promote her method it is the only true way to get out of anxiety for good.it angers me how professions like psychologists havent adopted her method.many sufferers go to counselling and the counsellor is just as bewildered as the patient and they go around in circles.dr weekes method is logical just read my posts do they sound logical to you.i just want to help people see the light.i promise you if you use her method you will be free in a matter of months.her book self help for your nerves is a good start.but as i have said before all her books contain additional info thats why i recommend panicfree its programme incorporate all her books into one.give it a go drew what have you got to lose.im not some guy who recommends false things to people for the fun of it.

tim Posted: 30/04/2006 20:37

maria it step by step ,put one foot in front of the other for now.go to the shop every day or for a walk. do not stay in ,it only give the anxiety power,belive me the more power you give it ,it will control you,we are all here for you .we all have been there. itget better bit by bit it slow .i stayed in it made it worse. when you relaise every body has problems in this life , it just another trial to get through , but what the hell we can do it ,and with a smile on our face, you will get bored crying and been miserable all the time you will want your life back so start now,tell the anxiety to get lost you have no time to think about it your busy,its like every thing else in life you can sit and think about it or go for awhile and for get it and slowly it get better. if you need to talk give me a shout bye for now.

j Posted: 01/05/2006 14:08

hows things tim and maria.i used to suffer from agoraphobia myself.although i didnt have it that bad i would still get panicky when outside.jelly legs is the main culprit in agoraphobia.ie your legs start to shake and you cant control their coordination.jelly legs are due to an over aroused nervous system.imagine for eg if somebody who didnt suffer from anxiety just found out that they won the lottery they would get weak at the knees and suffer from jelly legs also, as they would get excited and their nervous system would be over aroused.its true that maria shouldnt stay inside, she does need to get outside.but im sure she has forced herself outside many times in the past only to get even more panicky, she is aware that if she goes outside this will happen again.its like she cant escape her problem.what she needs to do is to start approaching her problem in the right way, she needs an effective method to fight her agopraphobia.presently she is not doing it the right way.

j Posted: 01/05/2006 14:21

(continued from last post)presently when maria tries to go out she is tensing up trying to control her body.she is tensing her legs trying to stop them shaking but of course tension doesnt help relaxation it exacerbates it.jelly legs are caused from the blood vessels expanding meaning more oxygen is being carried to the leg muscles causing them to feel weak.hyperventilation also plays a part.when maria goes out she forces herself to go out by tensing up her body.but this is the wrong way.does this post sound logical to everyone?there is a way that maria can overcome her problem.ill give you a concise summary how.at the moment as soon as she even approaches her front door she gets panicky.what she has to try to start doing is let her tummy muscles sag let her shoulders and arms sag and take deep breathes and exhale slowly.she has to stay in the present taking one step at a time.she will also be getting panicky thoughts which she tries to block from her mind,instead she has to let the panicky thoughts come but not entertain them.she must let the panicky feelings and thoughts sweep over her.as ive said before there is a book effective treatment for agoraphobia available by dr claire weekes which i recommend.good luck J

j Posted: 01/05/2006 14:26

hows things ive talked a lot about panicky bodily sensations.id like to say a bit about panicky thought as well.ive mentioned before about how the nervous system works.it has two parts the voluntary and the involuntary.the voluntary is under your immedaite conscious control hence its name.the involuntary isnt, it controls the heart beat etc and it is controlled by your mood your emotions.for eg when yoou feel fear your heart beats etc,when you suffer from anxiety there are two things causing you fear.

j Posted: 01/05/2006 14:34

(continued)the two things are your bodily sensations eg palpitations and panicky frightening thoughts, they both cause the emotion of fear.but they cant hurt you have your thoughts or palpitations ever hurt you before?the thing with thoughts is as soon as you get a panicky thought you become afraid of it and try to block it from your mind.this adds great significance to it.and builds up electric energy in your neurons in your brain meaning each time you think the thought it becomes even more powerful.what you have to do is let the thought come.you know the thought isnt true or at the most extremely unlikely.so why be so afraid of it.by being afraid of it you are giving your nervous system a shock.you must think it and say to yourself as you do "this thought is pathetic" this helps get rid of the fear emotion meaning the thought comes less and less until it goes.good luck J

DREW Posted: 01/05/2006 18:48

Hows things everyone, going through a rough time at the moment.My biggest problem over the last year or so is my concentration. It has got so bad that i can no longer keep a thought for more than a few seconds anymore. It has an terrible affect on my everyday life, cannot read newspapers, watch tv, listen to others holding conversation with me, difficulty enderstanding some of my post,listen in to music,or relaxation cds. The big problem is getting my message accross to professionals, I am consistantly being told not to worry ,and that it will all come back in time. How!!!!! All i am getting is medication, medication, medication. I get alot of advice on what to read or downloads to help, but what use are they when you have no concentration. Has anyone else experienced this, and how did you handle it.

con Posted: 02/05/2006 12:09

hi drew,i know where you are coming from but unfortunately i dont really know what to do about it myself !! same as you i find that even if iam having a conversation with someone that my attention only lasts a couple of minutes,even if that,my councellor tells me that in order to stop thinking so much i should try to do more things that i can concentrate on..problem is,i cant concentrate on anything to do it properly in the first place,if you know what i mean,just to let you know you are not alone,i find the same when i am trying to read or even concentrate on watching tv..its as if,when i do try to concentrate,some thing inside my head tells me tokeep thinking..i dont know..like you i am open to all syggestions..

j Posted: 02/05/2006 14:38

hows things drew.why exactly can you not concentrate?people who suffer from anxiety are obsessed with how they are feeling, its hard for them not to be.they are obsessed with their present state and are always anxiously trying to figure the way out.but this doesnt help it usually makes it worse.i suspect that this is what is hindering your concentration.the loss of concentration is a symptom of your anxiety it wont improve until your anxiety is gone.how are you presently dealing with your anxiety.

Anonymous Posted: 02/05/2006 14:52

Hi Drew, has it ever been suggested that you may have adult ADD (Attention Deficit Disorder)? did you have problems concentrating as a child in school? have a look at this link and see is it you..?
http://ericec.org/digests/e622.html

drew Posted: 03/05/2006 15:19

J, the only way i cope is with the breathing exercises & physical exercising, medication, and going for a few beers now and then.I do try to read and watch tv,listen to music,but it all passes over my head. so hard to explain this, but i get through most days doing lots of things,but not really experiencing anything,like just going through the motions without having any great memory of it.

drew Posted: 03/05/2006 15:31

con could not have worded it better, sometimes i fell i am on another planet,lost alone,watching others enjoying and getting on with their lives.making decisions is a no go area for me because i would probally change them all 5 minutes later. i honestly dont believe anyone knows enough about our problem, because they (the professionals) seem to do everything by the book. They do their 8 hours and off they go while we are left to suffer 24 hours non stop. There is no Celtic Tiger in our lives, because we just cannot get the people who run our services to listen.lets just hope that someday we can recover well enough to do something about the dreadful treatment sufferers like you and me receive. take care

j Posted: 03/05/2006 18:32

hows things, drew you were saying in your last post that you dont believe anyone knows any thing about your problem(meaning the professionals) and your right.ill tell you why, thay have never suffered from anxiety they cant relate.they are viewing anxiety from a clinical perspective.but thats where claire weekes is different she relates to anxiety sufferers on a personal level.so much of anxiety is from simple little things like tension.ill give you s sample of claire weekes method.if you let your tummy muscles sag as well as your arms and shoulders, you will get rid of tension in time.there are two layers of tension.the 1st is the tension that you do consciously but if you sag like i just said you will still have tension as that is adrenaline acting directly on muscles, and this is the 2nd layer of tension.and that can take a few hours to get rid of.also never try to relaxe as you will be anxious about relaxing instead let you body sag and accept the 2nd tension.

j Posted: 03/05/2006 18:42

id like to say a bit more about counsellings approach to anxiety.counsellors try to look for a root cause of a persons anxiety.but this is the wrong approach.instead they should be telling people how to deal directly with panic or fear which comes in the form of nervous sensations and frightening thoughts.wouldnt that be more effective??drew and con you are both in counselling how long have you been in counselling for?i went to counselling for 4 years and it helped but it didnt get rid of my anxiety.it think counsellors are just as bewildered as the patients.what do you think?why doesnt the clinpsych write posts anymore.i was lost until i found the claire weekes book.it has saved my life.you are all suffering needlessly.i just wish i could convince you all to give it a go.if you can read it and tell me you dont think its the best method you have ever tried i will give up trying to persuade you and thats a promise.good luck J

A23 Posted: 04/05/2006 11:00

To J
Hi J, I just wanna say I have been viewingf this website daily for the last few weeks, I wrote a post the other to Maria,I too suffer from agrofobia and panic attacks. My life came to a stand still over two years ago. College, Work, boyfriend, any thing outside of my house was horrific. Could write a book on it. But I got over it, with various therapies, find breathing so helpful. I recently havent been doing so well. And just wanna let you know, your posts keep me motivated to keep on going and overcome this trama. Thanks you seem like a lovley person. I wish you every happiness and health for now and the future.

ClinPsych Posted: 04/05/2006 12:43

Hi everyone, as I explained previously I withdrew from the forum for a while because i felt it was not being helpful to the users to get into what was becoming a personalised debate over methods and approaches but I am encouraged by the posts which have asked me to continue contribiting.
Just to clarify something for me J because you appear to be contradicting yourself in your last post:
"thay have never suffered from anxiety they cant relate.they are viewing anxiety from a clinical perspective.but thats where claire weekes is different she relates to anxiety sufferers on a personal level" Your argument as I see it is that people cannot be helped by professionals unless they have experienced anxiety themselves, has Claire Weekes suffered from significant anxiety problems..? What you forget is that psychologists, psychiatrists, counsellors etc are human too, as I have mentioned before we all experience and sometimes suffer from anxiety at times in our lives, out training does not exempt us from this, but what it does teach us to do is to cope with it. to say that mental health professionals approach their clients in a "clinical" way and dont relate to them in on a personal level does a huge dis-service to both the people offering there services and the many people who find help from these people.
It is really unhelpful and totally un-realistic to expect your life to be free of anxiety, anxiety is part of every day life, what do I wear today, what did that person think of me or my talk, what if something happens to my child in school etc.
Your criticisms of wanting to understand where anxiety comes from is again unfounded. In my clinical experience it is the number one question (after what can i do about my anxiety) that people want to know. why am i like this, why do i feel this way, why cant i be happy the way i used to be? these are all questions that concern people and upset them. Being able to explore in a safe and therapeutic way with people the origins of their difficulties can help them to bring meaning to their lives in terms of understanding their difficulties. This is itself is a start in helping people understand why they feel the way they do, it should not be underestimated or dismissed out of hand. I had a client who suffered for 23 years with panic attacks and wondered for all of those 23 years why he had them, no one ever explored it with him.. He was given meds for 23 years which clouded his difficulties but provided no answers as to why he felt that way. Through looking at his thinking and challenging his thoughts in a practical way that man stopped his meds and did not experience any more panic attacks. He still experienced anxiety from time to time but could cope with it, this is a realistic goal.
Physical approaches such as breathing, relaxation etc are excellent approaches to helping to cope with the physical aspects of anxiety, but they dont change the way you think. Mental health professionals have been castigated on here for not using the claire weekes method, we cannot presume that none do, again it is a generalisation. What we do use are methods which have been researched and researched and researched to see if they work, how they work and why they work, based on feedback from real people, we do not re-invent the wheel, the majority of our practices are informed by our clients, we learn from listening to them.

drew Posted: 04/05/2006 14:20

Ok J. I am going to try and read a claire book,which one do you recomend,is it easy to read (plain english) any idea where i can get it in Dublin. Don't know if my concentration will allow me read but am prepared to try.
ps J i am not attending counceling and never have,only anxiety courses

j Posted: 04/05/2006 19:12

alright drew hows things.you can get the book in any major bookshop such as easons.i recommend you get "self help for your nerves", it only costs around ten euro.the problem is claire weekes wrote many books on the anxiety state and all the books contain additional information which is needed for you to be cured fully(which is why i recommended that programme from panicfree.co.nz).but self help for your nerves would be a good start and it would help you a lot.give it a go if you think it is rubbish(and you wont) ill rest my case.good luck J

j Posted: 04/05/2006 19:16

sorry drew i forgot to say that yes, it is easy to read, self help for your nerves is only around 120 pages long.try to read it slowly as people who are anxious always try and read fast they have no patience.you may have to read over some parts a few times to digest it fully.once again good luck J

j Posted: 04/05/2006 19:31

hows things a23 agoraphobia, social anxiety there are all the same really they all involve panic in the form of panicky thoughts and physical sensations.its just the context of where you have the panic that is different.people who suffer from agoraphobia arent actually afraid of anything outside theyre afraid of themselves that is their pancky thoughts and nervous sensations such as a rapidly beating heart.there is a book effective treatment for agoraphobia by claire weekes that i recommend.good luck J

j Posted: 04/05/2006 19:55

hows things clinpsych yes people suffer from worrys in life thats natural and healthy which you know.but when i use the term anxiety i am referring to worrys which are out of proportion or magnified and thats not healthy of course, its depressing.maybe some counsellors have suffered from this magnified anxiety.but its different to everyday normal worries.for eg people who dont suffer from the anxiety im talking about dont get panic attacks when walking to the shop or talking to strangers.theres a big difference between the two.if there wasnt wouldnt everybody be on medication or in counselling etc?you said as an example of worry "what if something happens to my child" this may be a natural worry but its different to the anxiety that im talking about, for eg some one who has the anxiety that im talking about and thinks this may think about it constantly and have panicky feelings while doing so and the thought may consume them for hours some one who suffers from the normal everyday worries may think the thought for a few seconds and forget about it theres a big difference.yes claire weekes did suffer from anxiety for a very short period but she was a gp who also had a degree in physiology so she understood completely what was happening to her.

j Posted: 04/05/2006 20:12

hows things clinpsych ill tell you where anxiety comes from(and when i say anxiety i mean the magnified, out of proportion worrying which i talked about in my last post)according to claire weekes.basically it comes from stress, anxiety is extreme stress.for eg some one may have been in a car crash and their nervous system then got a shock.after the accident their nervous system will still be aroused as they may be in shock.what may happen next is they become conscious of their heart beating fast or their stomach churning and they become afraid of these nervous sensations.they may calm down but remain apprehensive dreading their nervous sensations coming back.and of course by doing this they do come back and each time they do they try to get rid of the sensations by tensing, they try to control them by tensing.their nervous sensations may go but the same thing happens and they return again each time more frequently until they more or less have the sensations constantly everyday.basically their nervous system becomes so overaroused that it becomes sensitized and even a small worry like paying a bill on time may bring on a panic attack.

j Posted: 04/05/2006 20:20

(continued from last post)anxiety can also start due to a problem, sorrow or guilt.for eg some one who runs their own shop may be going bankrupt.so they start stressing out a lot and once again their nervous system becomes overaroused.they may even get themselves out of debt but as their nervous system is still overaroused and they are frightened of their nervous sensations they still have the anxiety.there is a lot more that i could say but id be writing for a long time.J

j Posted: 04/05/2006 20:36

clinpsych please explain to me the concept of finding a root cause as the solution to some one suffering from anxiety.one i hear a lot about is seperation anxiety.in my previous eg about the shop owner you could say his root cause was his business going bankrupt.but after he had gotten over his financial problems he would still have the anxiety.of course things cause anxiety stressful things that is.but even after the stressful event is over the anxiety remains because they remain apprehensive and afraid of their nervous sensations.you mentioned a patient of yours who suffered for anxiety for 23 years.why does he still get episodes of anxiety was the root cause not found.are you saying that counselling doesnt cure your anxiety for good.there is a simple reason why people who suffer from anxiety feel the way they do, and why they got to be in the state theyre in.and they can can be cured for good and never relapse!!from reading claire weekes books i can answer any of your questions about anxiety in a simple and logical way.

Sin Posted: 05/05/2006 10:35

Hi J and Clinpsych,
I haven't written on this site for a while but I am always looking at the new posts. I think you both have very valid points on this subject so it is not productive for anyone looking at this to read the to-and-fro arguments about who's opinion on how to resolve this problem is the best one. As somebody that has been experiencing anxiety for as long as I care to remember, I believe that both approaches have value. Yes it is true that you need to deal with the anxiety on a daily basis and therefore learning to overcome this problem (through the Claire Weekes method or whichever method) is definitely beneficial. But I also think that this social anxiety is a learned behaviour that we have individually developed and "nurtured" over a period of time. I don't believe that we just wake up one day and have these horrible constant feelings. I personally think that they stem from somewhere and develop and grow over the years. Therefore, it is important to find out why and where they come from - as ClinPsych has also correctly stated.
So basically what I'm trying to say it, I have gained really good advice from both of you as it seems most other people on these posts have. So maybe, stop trying to get at each other and keep up the good work of writing posts to help the people that are suffering from this affliction that take the time to write their posts on this site.
I really do appreciate what you both write and I think you should keep trying to help people that put their posts here. Anyway, that's all in my little rant for the moment.
Thanks guys!

ClinPsych Posted: 05/05/2006 13:47

Appreciate the feedback Sin, thanks

j Posted: 05/05/2006 16:40

hows things sin.i am not having a go at the clinpsych, there is nothing wrong with having a debate.i am just telling my opinion which i believe to be factual.the clinpsch still hasnt answered my question from the previous post!!!sin you said you bought the book in march how are you finding it.also i never said that you just wake up one day and you have anxiety it builds up little by little every day due to you fighting it by tensing etc.

angela Posted: 06/05/2006 08:35

hello everyone I haven't been on in a while I just wanted to drop by and say hi..

j Posted: 06/05/2006 13:56

hows things angela, how are you at the moment, any improvements.

j Posted: 07/05/2006 15:42

hows things sin you said in your last post that you think social anxiety is a learned behaviour that is individually developed and nurtured over time and that you think they stem from somewhere and develope and grow over the years.i have answered them questions for you in my last posts.you must read up a lot on psychology sin the way you wrote that last post it was as if you were a clinical psychologist!!

j Posted: 07/05/2006 15:46

clinpsych why are you refusing to answer my questions.i have not insulted you.i have been telling you how the claire weekes method works why arent you telling me how the clinical psychologists method works.im confused its like you have something to hide, just be honest.what is the problem?

drew Posted: 07/05/2006 18:29

J. can i ask what you are up to. You just seem that you have to fight with someone all of the time. I happen to enjoy postings from Clin Cpych, but you semm to want a hobby in atacking others who offer advice than yours. Can I remind you that you are only 21 years of age, and would not have enough experieance to challange others. I joined this forum to get help, not to read silly crap that you can come out with at times. Anyone reading the forum for the first time , I am sure would be shocked at some of your attacks on others. Give it up please, because , this is supposed to be a help forum

j Posted: 08/05/2006 14:44

ok drew, ill stop.ya im only 21 but what does that matter, i havent experienced much of life thats true but ive experienced 10 years of suffering.i have been discussing things such as agoraphobia, social anxiety and tha anxiety state in general in my posts for the benefit of anxiety sufferers.my posts have been of reason and logic.psychologists in general dont know much about the anxiety state even in their training they are not taught about how the nervous system works and its impact on muscles which cause tension and organs such as the heart and these are prominent things in the anxiety state and thats a fact.i am trying to debate with the clinpsych in a logical fashion and with reasoning!!i havent attacked her/him on anything personal i have been discussing the anxiety state with him/her.what is wrong with that.it angers me how the claire weekes method is not a standard thing for people with anxiety, and yes i know they are strong words to say.but once you read the book you will some what understand, i say somewhat understand because as i said before each of her books contain additional info(which is why ive been recommending the panicfree programme).i dont mean to insult the clinpsychs profession but my interests are with the anxiety sufferers.

con Posted: 08/05/2006 17:44

have to say j that i agree with drew,sure,you do give valid advice but so does clin sych,i find his postings very helpful,i have the claire weeks book you are talking about and do find it helpful but clin cych has given me vital advice on a lot of things and yo do put him down..at the rate that you write sometimes,i sometimes wonder myself are you the one with the real anxiety ??? chill out a small bit on the forceful language..take a bit of your own advice..

Lisa Posted: 08/05/2006 21:52

Hi J,
This is the first time I have posted a message on this forum. I just read a couple of the recent messages and needless to say I was rather surprised by your last message. What evidence have you got that states psychologists have no understanding of social anxiety.
I am not a psychologist nor do I work in the health sector however I suffered social anxiety for a number of years and although I am alot more confident, I understand I will never be free of all my anxieties.
I owe my new found confidence to those psychologists who don't understand social anxiety.
Reading self help books won't work for everyone.
Slan,
Lisa

drew Posted: 09/05/2006 12:15

clinpsych, can i ask you for some advice, as I feel I am going insane at the moment.my concentration,short term memory, my interests hobbies watching tv, reading,are all gone,no emotions. I am on 40mg of cippramil and two .5 xanex a day.The real lows have gone but the anxiety remains despite me attending anxiety management courses. It is destroying me at the moment, so any help you can offer would be of great benifit.
keep up you great work please

ClinPsych Posted: 09/05/2006 13:41

Hi Drew, thank you for your recent words of encouragement. Looking back over your posts, my impression (just based on what you have written) is that you may primarily have depression as well as some undelying anxieties. Lets have a look at your difficulties:
Lack of concentration
Loss of interests in things you previously enjoyed
feeling alone and watching others getting on with their lives (you feeling stuck in yours??)
feeling of going through the motions
All of the above would be indicative of depression rather than primarily anxiety, you also mentioned lows (although not as bad recently, how low did you go?) I dont know if this is ever something that has been discussed with you or if you have ever thought about it. I notice that you are taking cipramil (an anti-depressant), although as far as i am aware it is also used with people who have anxiety difficulties. Perhaps the anxiety management courses didnt work out for you because they weren't addressing your primary needs? Take a look at the www.aware.ie website, see if you feel that the info is describing you, it may be the first step in tackling whatever is making you feel the way you do. Hope this helps.

con Posted: 09/05/2006 22:13

sending you on site drew which i think is very helpful..worth a look..www.clinical-depression.co.uk

Anonymous Posted: 10/05/2006 17:48

There is an interesting website by an Irish doctor about the nutritional treatment of psychiatic problems including anxiety and depression at www.omega3.20megsfree.com

j Posted: 10/05/2006 21:13

hows things folks i want to start of by saying sorry for my recent outburst of frustration especially to the clinpsych.the reason that ive been writing these posts is that ever since ive found the claire weekes method my life has changed around as ive gotten rid of my anxiety completely(yes of course i still have little worries like people normally do but i dont get panicky or neurotic about them)and i wanted somebody else to experience what i have experienced.

j Posted: 10/05/2006 21:18

hows things Lisa i think you answered the question of where is my evidence of psychologists having little knowledge of anxiety.you said in your last post that you understand that you will never be free of anxiety but the thing is and its the reason that i write these posts is that you can.

j Posted: 10/05/2006 21:24

listen con,and drew as i said earlier im going to stop writing posts for a while.but before i do i want to tell ye that the programme from www.panicfree.co.nz comes with a 6 month money back guarantee.what have you got to lose?absolutely nothing.ive been waiting a while to see if andy has bought it yet he said that he was saving up the money.im sure that if he gets it and writes a post it will more than validate what i have been saying.once again what have you got to lose, give it a go.anyway once again im sorry for my recent behaviour and good luck J

Lisa Posted: 12/05/2006 19:25

Hi J,
I'm fine. How are you? I don't think you fully understood my last point.I don't think its possible to be completely anxiety free.I think your are only codding yourself saying your are free of complete anxiety. Everyone feels anxious at some stage or another in their life.
Its great to hear Dr. Weekes book worked for you but I know it would not work for me and I'm sure its not for everyone. Likewise Im not saying seeing a psychologist is for everyone.
Personally, I had a positive end result. I am alot more confident now than I ever was.I have a great job, boyfriend and go out alot more. Things I never dreamt possible. I participated in group therapy.I got a lot of support from other members and the advice from the psychologists was invaluable.
Self help books, tapes... should definitely be used as a reference but it can be very hard to motivate oneself after a bad day and that's why I believe having the support of an expert is better.
But people will have to discover what suits them.
Thanks,
Lisa

Sin Posted: 15/05/2006 09:31

Hi J,
Sorry I haven't replied earlier - I was on hols. Anyways, I'm not a psychologist, far from it. Just my observations from reading the posts and having a think about how my anxiety affects me and why. Anyways, I haven't read all of Claire Weekes book. Honestly, I find it tough going to read. I am however, in the middle of reading a book by Gillian Butler (I think) called "Overcoming shyness and social anxiety" and I find this very useful. But as Lisa has said in her last post, sometimes you just need the support of an expert. I dunno really - but I'm doing my best to try to get through this whatever way I can and I'm hoping for the best!...

j Posted: 15/05/2006 15:30

hows things lisa sorry but i disagree.you can fully recover from anxiety and get back to how you "used" to be.i also went to counselling for 4 years and it helped my confidence but i still had the anxiety i was still nervous in social situations.but today i am completely free of anxiety.of course i have little worries like i used to have before i had anxiety.but theres a big difference between having anxiety and having minor worries that normal people have.i no longer feel panicky in social situations or when walking down the street im completely calm and relaxed.lisa check this website out www.panicfree.co.nz and tell me what you think.i stress again it is possible to be free from anxiety i know this is hard for you to believe as youve probably suffered for a while and have tried many methods but to no true success.be open minded thats all i ask of you.

j Posted: 15/05/2006 15:39

hows things sin what do you find tough about in reading the book what parts of the book do you disagree with.i want to ask you a question what makes you think that anxiety can stem from a root cause, what do you mean by nurtered over the years.im not being critical here i just want to try and understand where your coming from.sorry sin one more question do you suffer from agoraphobia and are you on medication.

Lisa Posted: 15/05/2006 22:12

Hi J,
First things first, let me quantify my anxiety for you. I suppose I am a little anxious about my upcoming annual appraisal meeting with management. But wouldn't anyone be anxious about that. (well they would be if they met my bosses!!!)
Before I went to group therapy and saw a psychologist. I was a loner. I was afraid to leave my house. I was constantly mind reading and forecasting the worst possible scenarios.I had no friends. I was walked all over in a dead end job. I had no confidence in my ability whatsoever. I had no voice. I was afraid to speak my mind.
I bought countless selfhelp books and cds to no avail. I was desperate.
I was so distressed I decided to enlist the help of a psycholgist to help me get to the root of my problems. It was the best thing I ever done and I will be eternally grateful to him.
I got the strength to tackle my inner demons. I finally found the courage to get out of my dead end job and get my current job which I am extremely happy in. I participated in some evening courses and made some real good friends.And I go out a couple of times a week with my work mates. I am no longer afraid to speak my mind. These are just a few ways I improved thanks to "the psychologist".
Perhaps cds and selfhelp books work for you. I tried them to no avail with the exception of one."Overcoming Social Anxiety" by Gillian Butler (an Irish Psychologist)I visited that site you reccomended, one issue I would raise about that site is what qualifications does David have. I must admit I am very sceptical of these people. At least Dr. Weekes studied medicine. I could setup my own site detailing how I overcame social anxiety and charge people for it. As you know, social anxiety manifests itself in different ways and there are many different levels. Surely, David cannot claim to have experienced every aspect of social anxiety and therefore be an expert in treating anxiety. He can certainly empathise with socially anxious people but offer a course of treatment. Well thats a different kettle of fish.
I would ask people to keep an open mind about both types of treatment.
On a final note, I think we will agree to disagree on the best method of treatment for social anxiety and let people decide for themselves.
Lisa.

andy Posted: 16/05/2006 10:04

just tried the panicfree .com. not impressed, am getting a full refund.still think clinsynch has the best ways and answers. very dissapointed as i thought this may have been the breakthrough i was looking for. So for me it is back to the drawing board.

j Posted: 16/05/2006 14:05

andy are you serious?have you listened to it all?are you sure youve given it a fare chance.the programme describes everything about the anxiety state.andy tell me exactly what it is you find disappointing about it.did you expect it to work straight away, because it doesnt it takes time from a few weeks to a few months.

andy Posted: 16/05/2006 16:17

Hello J. What did I find wrong?. Well it is a programme put together by a former sufferer using a doctors written work for inspiration. it is blatent he has no qualifactions, except that he was a sufferer,and is making enormous money from it. I found it no different to anything that I have tried over the last 5 years that was written by non professionals. I totally accept that it worked for you. But we all differ and all i say it was not for me, it bored me to sleep to be honest

andy Posted: 16/05/2006 17:07

hi everyone, does anyone here have any suggestions for digestive problems due to anxiety.

Sin Posted: 17/05/2006 07:40

Hi J,
I just found the book very repetitive and not really dealing with how to resolve the problems. That sounds kinda vague I guess but it didn't seem to say anything that I don't already know - like, just accept the anxiety and let it wash over you and eventually you'll begin to suffer less and less. Bit of a broad generalisation of what she's saying but again, I already know I need to accept it - the problem is that this is the hard part. It's very difficult to sit back and accept and feel "happy" about the fact that you're dying inside from embarrassment, anxiety, panic and just pretend it's okay. I can't do that. That's why I think there has to be a source reason why a person feels anxious in certain situations. Like why for example, can I queue up in a shop and buy something without feeling stressed but as soon as the shop assistant asks me a question at the til, I almost pass out with anxiety? It doesn't make sense so I need to know why these simple situations are triggering this response. So, that's why I think this is a learned behaviour - becuase the anxiety generally happens in the same set of circumstances each time while other situations are perfectly fine. I don't know if I'm explaining myself very well. But anyway, this is why I though Gillian Butlers book was/is a bit more effective for me than Claire Weekes but I guess, each to their own really - whatever gets us through this, we should keep working with.
As for medication - no, I don't want to go down that route. I think for me it would only prolong the agony because as soon as medication stops, the problem just restarts without the "chemical" help.
Also, I'm not agoraphobic. Just someone who suffers from anxiety at the worst possible moments and I just want it to stop!! So, that's all really...

j Posted: 17/05/2006 15:58

hows things sin sorry i dont understand the book says nothing about accepting your anxiety and being happy inside, are you sure youve read it.the book explains how anxiety is a physiological response due to your mood and that by understanding how your nervous system works you can get rid of anxiety.anxiety is having nervous sensations such as a churning stomach and a rapidly beating heart etc as well as panicky thoughts which is due to mental fatigue.sorry its just youre being very vague.can you tell me what it is exactly about the book you dont understand?

Anonymous Posted: 17/05/2006 18:12

Didn't read all the posts as there are so many! Just want to add that meditation is the way to go.

Sin Posted: 18/05/2006 10:05

Hi J,
Well, Iíve only read maybe half of the book because, as I was saying, I find it tough going to read. Not that I mean itís difficult or confusing to read Ė itís just that Iím not finding it very helpful so Iím losing interest in it. I know it has worked for you and Iím sure the method has worked for countless other people and thatís fantastic. I just donít find that itís helping me Ė thatís all, no drama. I know the book says that anxiety states are due to mental fatigue etc. and I think thatís right. But that doesnít really help me to try to stop the anxiety from happening and from having a visible physical effect.
So, Iím not saying to people not to read it Ė far from it. As Iíve already said, whatever helps people get through this is great and if itís Claire Weekes method, then brilliant. It just doesnít seem to work for me Ė but Iím gonna try to read it again in any case and Iíll let you know if I get any further this timeÖ

j Posted: 18/05/2006 17:49

hows things sin are you sure that you have read any of the book.its just that you said that you read in the book how mental fatigue plays a part in anxiety.it doesnt mention that until near the end and you said you have only read half of it.sorry it just seems that your lying to me for some reason.your under no obligation to read the book you dont have to say that you have to appease me.

j Posted: 18/05/2006 17:53

sorry sin i forgot to say you mentioned that the book doesnt help you stop anxiety from having a visible physical effect.you cant get rid of the visible physical effect intil you get rid of the nervous sensations themselves which are the cause of the visible physical effects.

Jimbo Posted: 19/05/2006 01:55

Hello. I have suffered from what i think is social anxiety and bouts of agoraphobia most of my life. I havent been so bad the past couple of years, but recently because of a traumatic experience it has returned, worse. I have just today read the posts in here, and it is very comforting to know there are others in the same position as me. I have read with intrest the posts, but one contributor in particular caught my eye. J, Im sure i can speak for most in here when I say that your advice is very much appreciated. I am delighted that the claire weekes books worked for you, and I probably will buy them when I can. However, you seem to be very adamant on recomending some nz guys website in particular. I sincerely hope that you arent that NZ guy, and that your advice is meant to help fellow sufferers and not of a commercial intrest. I think also that you should respect other peoples oppinions and professions, partuclarly the ClinPsych. If he is who I think he is, my friend has attended this mater self help group, and has had great results from it and cant speak highly about those running it. I too plan on attending when I build up the courage. I will also buy Claire weekes book, and hope it helps me, that something will help me, whatever it may be. Thank you to everyone that contributes to this site and please remember its people like me that you are trying to help, and advise....thats why I came here. I dont want to hear crap or childish carry on about who is right and who is wrong. Im an adult and will try all until I find one that works. Please respect everyones approach to this terrible condition. Thanks to all sincerely, this website could be a Godsend.

Sin Posted: 19/05/2006 07:17

Hi J,
No, Iím not lying to you Ė I would have no reason to. Anyway, I was responding to your earlier question and simply re-iterating what you have said in your earlier posts with regard to the mental fatigue and I was agreeing with you and the book on that Ė thatís all. Iím not saying Iím reading the book to appease you Ė again, I have no reason to. I want to read it to try to fix the problem and I will try again to read it, no drama. As I said, Iíll let you know how it goes if I do read it again.

Maria Posted: 19/05/2006 17:57

hello,
i'm at a loss as to what to do. I have anxiety brought on by an incident about 6 months ago. I have started acupuncture and also psychotherapy which i'm hoping will revert me back to my normal self. I went to my GP today who wants me to take six months of something called lexapro. I am really against medication and would love to resolve this myself i.e. psychotherapy, exercise, keeping positive. Can anyone please advise me if it is possible to overcome anxiety without medication? as i'm quite upset at the thought of having to take it. thank you in advance for any help :-)))

j Posted: 21/05/2006 11:00

hows things i just want to reply to andys earlier post.about the panicfree guy making loads of money.how is he making loads of money from it if he gives a money back guarantee?also andy im just curious what other non professional methods have you tried.

j Posted: 21/05/2006 11:19

hows things i just want to ask everyone a question.do you think anxiety panic attacks etc is a mental illness?or is it a physiological illness?from reading claire weekes books i believe it is a physiological illness which effects your way of thinking.there was an interesting experiment i read about lately.there were three groups of people who were split into two conditions, so half of each group were in either condition.the subjects apart from those in group 3 were given enipherol which is a chemical that stimulates the involuntary nervous system, causing your heart to beat fast etc just like in a panic situation.all the subjects were told they were given a vitamin.group one were told to expect symptoms such as a rapidly beating heart etc group 2 were told nothing and group 3 were just given a placebo.the groups in condition one were put into a room with one of the experimenters pretending to be a subject.

j Posted: 21/05/2006 11:37

(continued)for the first condition the experimenter acted in an ecxited and euphoric mood jumping around the room etc.the people in group one felt their heart beating fast etc but they knew why it was and they remained calm.the people in group 2 felt their heart beat fast etc and they acted in the same fashion as the experimenter.the people in group 3 acted as normal.for the second condition the experimenter acted angry and annoyed and panicky.the subjects in group one stayed calm although their heart was beating fast etc as they knew it was a side effect of the drug.the subjects in group 2 felt their heart beating fast etc and acted in the same fashion as the experimenter and became angry etc the subjects in group 3 acted normally.basically the people in group 2 didnt expect to have their nervous system aroused and were confused and bewildered that their heart was beating fast etc.and its the same when you suffer from anxiety your heart beats fast your stomach churns and you feel fear but you cant think of any logical reason why.if your agoraphobic you know theres no danger outside.its because your nervous system is over aroused and sensitised.what ever method you use to combat your anxiety you cant ignore the role which your nervous system plays.i ask you all do you think there is some deep psychological reason to your anxiety or is it that you nervous system is overactive and sensitised?

sara (saramac) Posted: 22/05/2006 12:27

Maria, I suggest you listen to your instinct, I took Lexapro and had horrible withdrawal symptoms. They say there are none but I found out 'they' are wrong. In my experience the best route to take was what you are already doing but to also add in meditation. I learned through a wonderful yoga class. There's probably meditation courses in your area. It has enriched my life in ways I never could have imagined! Mostly though the knowledge that I can take a short time out and achieve deep relaxation whenever I chose. I firmly believe taking an anti anxiety pill is just masking the anxiety and doing God knows what to your mind and body. It took me 2 months to feel okay again after coming off Lexapro. Some of the symptoms I experienced...couldn't walk straight it felt like the floor was tipping me up...I was very lucky I wasn't driving at the time...terrible head and face pain and an intense feeling that I was going to vomit several times a day (I never did actually!). My husband had to do all the cooking & mind me like a child I couldn't relax, my muscles were all tense and I was so anxious!! Of course I called the doctor and was told it would be gone in a day or two...it went on for just under 2 months! And I weaned myself off without any direction from the consultant I was seeing..he said there was no need as there would be no problem!!I was shocked and relieved to find out through forums on the Internet that my experience is common place and that for some it goes on alot longer and some even have hallucinations! Steer clear of Lexapro is my advise to you. You will get better I'm sure if you continue to do what you are doing. I did. There were many times I felt so frustrated and afraid I would never be myself again..I was wrong. Be patient & kind to yourself and don't be in such a hurry like I was that I ended up hurting myself more by taking 'a silver bullet' that was supposed to be an immediate magic quick fix. In the end I had to discover a long term method of dealing with the anxiety. It's not part of my life today.

j Posted: 22/05/2006 13:12

hows things maria you say that you had an incident 6 months ago.the incident gave you a shock didnt it.you feel jumpy and panicky now because of it.now your problem is trying to get rid of the panic you feel in the form of palpitations, a churning stomach, and general nervousness.the shock of the incident has made your nervous system over aroused and now the slightest thing can make you panic.do you agree with what im saying?

ClinPsych Posted: 22/05/2006 23:17

Hi Maria, welcome to the forum. In relation to your first question, the simple answer is yes, it is possible to learn to cope with anxiety without medication. I'm sure that anxiety has always been present in your life. In your case it has dramatically increased in intensity and frequency in the last 6 months which makes it much harder to cope with than before. Do you think you would be comfortable enough on here to give some general details about what the incident 6 months ago was? It would help to understand what it was about the incident that has changed the way that you think about the world, to see what it is about that incident that makes you see and think of the world as a more threatening place?
Ethical guidelines would recommend that a Psychological Therapy (there are many) should be tried as first line treatment before medication is suggested. If you want a broad over view of the role of medication in the treatment have a look at www.socialanxietyireland.com

Jimbo Posted: 23/05/2006 17:30

Hi Maria. Like you I have recently been through an experience that has me suffering very bad anxiety. I have been anxious most of my life, and fighting social anxiety along with agoraphobia etc. I have never taken medication of any sort although I have considered it many times. I remember many years ago going to a dr, and after hearing me describe my symptoms he perscribed me something that would 'take the edge off'. As tempting as it was to take the magic pill he gave me, I threw them into the bin as I was afraid of the side effects / dependance and having chemicals in me. Theres some groups around the country that I have been researching recently, and one in particular in Dublin that could help. Either that or I will probably vist a CBT therapist which seem to have good results with anxiety and changing our thinking patterns etc. Im looking into doing something about it over the next couple of weeks as I feel that I have been a prisioner long enough to anxiety and my irrational fears. Good luck Maria, the first and biggest step seems to be seeking help.

j Posted: 24/05/2006 14:19

hows things jimbo and maria.you may try cbt with a psychologist if you wish.i went down that road myself i was also on medication, ive taken psizer lustral, seroxat and on a few occasions xanax.but what eventually cured me was the claire weekes method.basically the claire weekes method explains everything about anxiety and the anxiety state which is crucial for you to understant if you are to recover fully.if you have never heard of claire weekes before just look her up in a search engine.jimbo im guessing the magic pill your on about is xanax or a tranquilizer of some sort.tranquilizers work by limiting the release of adrenaline into your muscles and organs such as your heart which makes you calm as your stomach stops churning and your heart stops palpitating etc.your nervous system is the culprit.

j Posted: 24/05/2006 14:33

(continued)once you understand how your nervous system works and how it is over aroused and how you are keeping it over aroused you can learn to get it back to its normal intensity thus getting rid of your anxiety.when your nervous system is in an over aroused state it causes you to become mentally alert.this is a built in natural phenomena from our evolution ie. the flight or fight response which our ancesters used as a means of keeping them safe.the problem is that when your nervous system is overactive it fools you into thinking that your in danger and you become caught in cycle of fear adrenaline fear.ie you notice that your body is in an overaroused state and you become scared.but once you understand how your nervous system works you can start to loose the fear of your rapidly beating heart etc. and the cycle breaks and you start recovering.for more about what im saying obtain one of claire weekes books, i recommend "self help for your nerves" as it isnt that long and the information is concise so you wont have to spend that long reading it as like all anxiety sufferers you are very impatient.this book would be a good introduction to her method.i say introduction as all her books contain additional info which you need for your recovery.alternatively you could visit this site www.panicfree.co.nz where you can buy a programme which incorporates all of claire weekes books into one.it comes with a money back guarantee.give it a go what have you got to lose!!good luck J

Jimbo Posted: 25/05/2006 11:29

Just finished reading 'Self Help for your nerves' by Claire Weekes. It can be got on Amazon second hand. Its small and very easy to read, I actually read it in one sitting. I dont think its of any great help to me, seems to describe anxiety in detail and its physical origins etc rather than offer any concrete solutions to overcome it. I have read the same principles about accepting fear and letting it pass etc elsewhere in the past. However I would certainly recomend anyone suffering from anxiety related problems to read it. What isnt for me may indeed 'cure' someone else.

ClinPsych Posted: 25/05/2006 12:41

Hi Jimbo, its great to hear that you are taking such positive initial steps to address your difficulties with anxiety. I am aware of the group that you are thinking of joining in Dublin and would highly recommend it. The group have a website in which former members of the group describe their experiences of anxiety and how they found being in the group. One word of caution is that dont be put off by the waiting list for the group, it is the only group in the country for social anxiety that I am aware of. People attend from all corners of the country and it is in high demand but it is run on a continuous basis so the waiting list moves quite quickly. They also have a twice monthly follow up support group, run by people who have completed the course which are quite active. There is also a forum attached to that particular website which former and prospective group members discuss issues.

j Posted: 25/05/2006 13:44

hows things jimbo self help for your nerves is more of an introduction to claire weekes method.thats why i recommend the programme from www.panicfree.co.nz.do you think the book has given you a better understanding of anxiety than you have gotten elsewhere.in her other books she talks about the four fatigues namely mental, physical, emotional and spiritual as well as more about things like second fear and thoughts and obsessions etc.thats why i think the programme from panicfree would be a great idea.you see self help for your nerves was the first book i read.i started recovering with it and then my recovery came to a halt.but i knew the method had some substance to it.so i bought some of her other books.but reading books can be quite tough as it takes a lot of patience.the programme from panicfree comes in cd form so it'd be easier to digest.and it comes with a money back guarantee, its up to yourself of course i can only advise you.good luck J

Anonymous Posted: 25/05/2006 14:08

You could go on Citalopram for a few months. It is used for depression but also for social/anexity issues. I have used it and it works well and has no side effects.
Also speak to someone close to you about it as this helps reduce the tension you feel about the situation and provides a bit of prespective about things.
Lastly - go out for a walk when you are feeling tense and anxious as staying in brooding is the worst thing for it - Belive me I know!
The most important thing to remember is you can get over it and things will be better sooner then you think but you have to take action and talk about things.
Good luck.

blueboy Posted: 25/05/2006 20:21

I have suffered depression/anxiety for many years.Ihave been on different antidepressants,over that period.While the so called experts tell you these are not addictive,try coming off them.The withdrawl symptoms are horrendous. All antidepressants have to be tapered off over a long period.

shawswelshgirl Posted: 30/05/2006 10:27

I've suffered with horrendous anxiety and panic attacks for nearly 2 years.My doctor prescribed Seroxat abd I had to stop after just 3 days....I felt so much worse after taking them. I'm not condemning Seroxat but it certainly didn't work for me.I am looking into CBT and praying I find the answer.

Mike Posted: 30/05/2006 12:44

Clinicpsych,
I was wandering if you have much experience in dealing with people with social anxiety, induced and/or caused by severe manic episodes seen in bipolar type 1 'classic' sufferers. In my case I had no psychological precipitations that caused my 3 manic episodes that lasted over 2 months each. I was delusional to the point of believing I was god-like, I impulsively said bizarre sometimes senseless remarks in public and overall was stunned and deeply humuliated by my first episode and the following 2. I understand the depression that has followed each episode may cause subsequent social anxiety and my ever occurring 'bumbling awekward incidents' that I endure, but the constant recollection of the manic episode/s haunts me deeply, preoccupying my mentality during social engagements outside my home. The irony is that when I was manic I was totally extroverted and the feeling of anxiety was unfathomable to me. Of course, I was without insight.
Mike

ClinPsych Posted: 30/05/2006 13:53

Hi shawswelshgirl, I am glad that you're taking the positive step into looking into what treatment options may be available to you. I would feel that it may be helpful to look at CBT not as the answer to your problems but as a means or way to understand and cope with your anxiety. It will help you to look at how your negative thoughts are influencing the way you see the world around you. I have mentioned before that a main difficulty in anxiety is that it is worrysome thoughts about a particular feared event happening. So people take a actions to prevent this feared event happening (avoid social situations, dont leave the house, perform routines, as examples). One simple question to ask yourself is how did you cope with what ever the feared situation was before 2 years ago, before the anxiety took over? What has happened 2 years ago that has magnified your fears about particular situations?
I had an interesting case of panic attack recently in the clinic. This person was at a concert, the lights went out and fireworks on stage and the person panicked, sweaty palms and racing heart and had to leave the concert. The person perceived a threat from the noise and the darkness. For others at the concert they experienced the beating heart sweaty palms also. The difference being that their thinking at that time was "my heart is beating because Im excited to be at the concert, this is fun and thats why my heart is beating". For the client their thoughts about the physical sensation were misinterptreted to mean danger. This is one aspect of how CBT will hopefully help you to identify your negative thinking errors and how to have more balanced thinking patterns. good luck

NM Posted: 30/05/2006 15:27

I first contributed to this discussion back in 2003 and haven't seen or heard anything since that would convince me that of anything other than the fact that to "cure" yourself of this condition, you have to change the way you think. Medication may help (a little :-)) in the short term but realistically it's only helping you to cope with what you have it's not actually doing anything to help. Go to a good bookshop and buy some mind control books and study them - I swear it really does work.

j Posted: 30/05/2006 16:39

hows things shawelshgirl there is a way that you can over come your anxiety for good and get back to how you used to be so to speak.and thats by using the claire weekes method.by using her method you get to completely understand your anxiety.i talk about her method in my previous posts.check this web site out www.panicfree.co.nz on this web site a programme has been put together which incorporates all claire weekes books into one and comes with a 6 months money back guarantee.by the way clinpsych i think that the reason the person at the concert got the panic attack was because she was already suffering from anxiety and when the fireworks went off it shocked her already overstimulated nervous system and gave her a fright ie her nervous system was sensitized to the slightest stimulus.

Andy Posted: 30/05/2006 16:45

J. have been in hospital for the last 2 weeks, and was unable to answer your last query. first of all david johnston is a multi millionaire from the several different sites with different names. Panic free is a money making company, and not in any way charitable. on your second point, i have had several types of non professioal help,but they only worked in the short term, because most working class people could never keep on going for help because of the high cost of visits. finnally I wish you would accept that Claire Weeeks will not work for everyone, because if it did then nobody would be suffering from depression, would they??

shawswelshgirl Posted: 30/05/2006 16:46

Hi ClinPsych,
Thanks ever so much for your response.
Two years ago my now-husband nearly died in a car accident which he by the grace of God survived only to be left paralysed for four months which were the first four months of carrying my son.He came out of hospital and within two weeks my daughters father dropped dead of a heart attack aged just 35.We had an a very amicable relationship for the sake of my little girl and it was an enormous shock.It was very difficult thereafter to try to explain to my daughter why he had to go.He was cremated the day before her 4th birthday.
As my pregnancy progressed I became more and more tired and I started to pass out and have terrible palpitations ( which I still have on a daily basis ).To top it all it was discovered my son was lying across my womb and I was hospitalised for three weeks until I had to have a caesaren section.It was explained to me that if my waters had broken he could've basically died.
All this happened in 8 months and I feel a different person to who my husband met,I feel almost lost and have no idea who I am anymore.I recently returned from Eurodisney with my children and there was one day my daughter was desperate to go on the little teacups that spin around.I queued for a little while until I became totally immobilised by fear and had to leave the queue for my husband to jump in and go on instead.I felt like I'd let her down and cried for the entire time of the ride trying to hide it from everyone passing.I fear everything and have panic attacks at any time of the day no matter how relaxed I feel.My husband is wonderful and even has a paper bag stowed in the kitchen drawer ready for when they begin!I don't want to live like this anymore....could there be a possibilty of it being some kind of imbalance??It can get so bad I really feel like I'm going to pass out and vomit at the same time it's awful.Thanks again.

shawswelshgirl Posted: 30/05/2006 17:04

Hi again,
The one thing I forgot to mention is my main fear is illness and death.I am convinced every day of my life that I am dying and all the tests I've had are useless and missing an underlying cancer/blood clot/heart disease/brain haemorrage.I've gone from visiting my GP maybe twice a year to once a week....although less now as I feel they're dreading the sight of me!!I literally just live with this feeling now and even accept it...but I still hate that it's making my life and my family's life a misery.I'll try anything.

ClinPsych Posted: 30/05/2006 17:27

Hi shawswelshgirl, wow you really have had a tough time of it in the past few years, that is alot of life stress to be carrying about. From your post I think you would agree that the one common theme across the incidents is death or risk of death. Considering the life experiences you have had recently I completely understand and would not blame you for viewing the world as a dangerous place. Pretty much all of the serious events that you have experienced have been events that are out of your control. This can be a difficult thing to accept, that the fate of those around us that we love is out of our control and sad things can happen to them no matter what we do or how much we wish it wouldnt.
Looking at your pregnancy, (im not a woman so wont make the mistake of claiming that I know whats it like...!), but from what I do hear about pregnancy is that it wreaks havoc with the bodies system. It involves carrying around this new little person inside you (very tiring so im told), this extra exertion will cause breathlessness, increased heart beat and sweating. Now for someone who is is experiencing both potential death, actual death and potential death of someone inside them is it any wonder that you might mis-interpret your (explainable) physical sensations as something that could increase your own risk of death. Perfectly understandable. With anxiety we can focus too much sometimes on the "but it could have happened" and forget to focus on the fact that the feared event didnt actually happen. Technically its called a selective information bias. Basically this means is that people will find evidence to agree with their negative thoughts quicker than they will see the more rational evidence which contradicts their negative thoughts.
What did you fear would happen in the Q or on the ride itself?
"It can get so bad I really feel like I'm going to pass out" - Have you ever tested your anxiety to the limit (and yes this would be very frightening), at some point when you feel safe enough to try, challenge this assumption that you have built up re passing out. How confident are you that you will pass out? The paper bag is your safety mechanism which you use to prevent yourself from passing out (or worse...?), and by using it you belive that you have prevented yourself from passing out, but if you didnt use it are you sure you would pass out.....?
Hi Mike, Im sorry I havent had time to get to your Q just now but will try to do so as soon as I can.

j Posted: 30/05/2006 21:44

hows things andy sorry to hear you were in hospital.i can understand how you think claire weekes method is not for everyone.what happens sometimes and what i presume happened to you is that the programme didnt start working for you straight away.it can take a few months for it to cure you.at the start you may become temporarily worse as you are noticing your symptoms more as you are facing/achknowledging them.i have total faith in the method.id recommend you email or telephone panicfree and tell them.im sure theyd give you another go for 6 months.do you not think that the programme gave you a thorough understanding of your condition.because of your present state you no doubt have trouble concentrating.how many times did you listen to the programme your supposed to listen to it fairly often.i myself read her books several time as my concentration was terrible and i was very impatient.i beg you andy dont give up on it.when you spoke to them on the phone you said they were fantastic it was like you were being understood for the first time in years.what changed were you expecting to be cured after listening to it once or did you disagree to what it was about.

j Posted: 30/05/2006 21:48

hows things nm i agree that you have to change your way of thinking more presicely you have to change your attitude to your anxiety.anxiety sufferers get angry and irritated with their condition as they are bewildered.and of course the more irritated you become the worse your anxiety becomes.

shawswelshgirl Posted: 31/05/2006 10:13

Hi again,
I just had this terrible fear that I was going to throw up on the ride and not be able to take care of my daughter if being ill brought on a panic attack.Before I had my son I had never felt faint or passed out....I remember the feeling of passing out so vividly it terrifies me.No matter how hard I tried to stop it I couldn't.The first time it happened I was in my sister-in-laws wedding,I kept passing out so an ambulance was called...they said my blood pressure was low which would've triggered it-but when I'm having these attacks I swear it's not just a thought,I actually HAVE that faint feeling which brings on the panic and I get that feeling of wanting to run.I do realise in my rational state of mind that if anything was to happen re passing out,it would happen regardless of wht I do to try to avoid it so not having ACTUALLY passed out on these occasions is slightly reassuring.I get so nervous in large crowds also I feel like I'm being stared at...almost as if they can see how weak I am.I used to be so confident,so so outgoing and happy-go-lucky.Now I only leave the house if I have to.I hate it.
I haven't pushed my anxiety no.Simply because at that time I really feel like I'm going to die,that I'm having a stroke or that I'm losing my mind.Of course I do realise that I wouldn't know if I was actually losing my mind but I still fear it,that I'm going to end up in an institution and all kinds of horrible thoughts.I've had so many tests on my heart and I'm still unconvinced it's nothing as I've been diagnosed with having an irregular heartbeat.I know this is apparently very common but when the palpitations start so does the anxiety.I feel like I can't win no matter what I do.

j Posted: 31/05/2006 13:10

hows things shawwelshgirl of course you can feel the panic its a physiological thing anxiety isnt all in the head, its very much so in the body.thats what ive been writing about in my previous posts,as i keep saying your nervous system is overactive ready to fire off at the slightest aggravation.im a former sufferer myself and i think its important that you understand how your nervous system works which is the reason you feel nervous sensations such as palpitations.anxiety is more of a physiological illness than a mental illness.its just that the nervous sensations affect you mentally.good luck J

andy Posted: 01/06/2006 13:33

J noticed how skillfully you avoided the subject of panicfree money making cures. I do not agree with people making money from other peoples illness. If david johnson is so concerned,why is he running several differant sites all around the world in different names. I am still not convinced that you are not an agent of panic free.

andy Posted: 01/06/2006 13:38

hello Clinpsych. some time ago you mentioned the possibality of setting up your own site. I think now would be a good time, as i feel that this site as great as it is, is getting dominated by the one person who seems to think he knows everying about anxiety at 21 years of age

j Posted: 01/06/2006 19:07

ok andy tell me how are panicfree making money.i mean it comes with a money back guarantee.im not an agent for panicfree if i was why would i be trying to make people buy it from this discussion forum.ive been on this forum for a few months now and your the only one who has bought it and your even taking it back.if i sound arrogant then so be it im the only one on this forum who has overcome anxiety and i know i will never relapse.i have my life back and its great.i just want people to overcome their anxiety like me.you dont have to believe me it doesnt really matter.but i will persist writing these posts, although i wont mention panicfree or claire weekes books again until im asked.test me andy ask me any question about anxiety and ill answer it for you adequately.

Janeymackers Posted: 02/06/2006 00:00

Fair play to you j!

andy Posted: 02/06/2006 13:37

ok j have the site to your self, you are the only person on the site to claim full recovery from panicfree. I shall continue with the trained professionals, because if there is one lesson i have learned from you is that they know best. Sorry J, but give me Clinpsych anytime.

shawswelshgirl Posted: 02/06/2006 16:20

Hi J,
Thanks for the response....you've brought me back to my original question,could the way I'm thinking and feeling be hormonal etc??I'm waiting to hear from the CBT ( therapist ) that I've been in contact with so I'm really hoping.
I bought The Linden method a few months ago and I have to admit it hasn't really worked for me but then i do think what's happening to me maybe far deeper-rooted,so that's not to say i don't agree with these people selling their ' cures ' as it were,I just think different people can need different methods---but I'm grateful for any advice you can give me and bring the old me back!!

j Posted: 03/06/2006 14:42

hows things andy the so-called professionals know best.i find it ironic how you said that panicfree are making loads of money and they give a money back guarantee.and people go to counselling for years sometimes but to no avail, ok they may improve but they still have anxiety and suffer from relapses.do they get their money back and they spend a lot more then e100.
you also said if the claire weekes method worked wouldnt the world be free from anxiety and depression.if counselling worked wouldnt the world be free from anxiety and depression.

j Posted: 03/06/2006 14:55

hows things shawwelshgirl thanks for your post.im welsh myself im from south wales.anyway yes your condition certainly is hormonal well chemical i mean.have you ever taken tranquilizers before.they limit the release of adrenaline causing you anxiety to go temporarily.anxiety is an illness of the nervous system which effects you mentally, it effects your thoughts, your way of thinking.you may think thoughts such as "what if this happens" what if that happens."you know that these thoughts are really a load of rubbish, yet you still think them.this is because you suffer from mental fatigue, its like you cant control your thoughts.but when you think the frightening thoughts they also shock your nervous system making your heart beat fast etc.i dont believe in root causes.i believe of course that there are causes of anxiety.but whatever your cause was try to remember, i bet that it involved a lot of stress which put pressure on your nervous system.

j Posted: 03/06/2006 15:03

(continued)anxiety sufferers also suffer from emotional fatigue.meaning that their emontional responses to things are increased or decreased.for eg you may feel less love for a close one.but you really love them as much its just your emotional responses arent being recorded properly due to the fatigue.also if you see something sad you may feel full of remorse and sympathy.also you are suffering from adrenal depletion as you are using up so much of your adrenaline and you only have a limited supplie, your adrenal gland can only produce so much.

j Posted: 03/06/2006 15:07

i forgot to say if any one here ever suffers from feelings of unreality this is also due to emotional fatigue.i thought this was important to mention as it is very bewildering to experience.good luck J

andy Posted: 06/06/2006 11:59

J. first of all can i tell you that i still have not got a refund from panicfree, just a promise of a refund. Also are you telling every one one this site suffering from depression and anxiety, that the claire weekes method is the only means of recovery,???????

j Posted: 06/06/2006 13:56

hows things andy, i want to start of by saying that im not enjoying this little argument that we are having.anyway yes for anxiety especially if you are suffering from severe anxiety and have been suffering for a long time then in my opinio, the claire weekes method is the only sure way to recover and stay recovered.dr weekes has cured agoraphobia sufferers who some psychiatrists said were incurable.having depression and anxiety is different then just having depression as you are usually depressed because you have the anxiety.in my opinion, the claire weekes method is the only way to fully recover and stay recovered.what other method works by curing sufferers and ensuring they dont relapse.

AB23 Posted: 07/06/2006 16:24

Hi everyone,
Was just wondering if anyone knows of any group therapy or organisations in the cork area that deal with agrofobia or anxiety. I have been suffering with anxiety/ agrofoba for 2 years. I just wish I had someone to talk to outside of my psychotherapist. Its nice to meet people who are suffering aswell. Thanks. I wish everyone the best of happiness now and in the future.

Maria Posted: 08/06/2006 15:49

hello,
thanks for previous answers to my earlier question. I Just wanted to update you all and let you know that i'm getting Cognitive Behavioural Therapy and it's working for me..it's at least worth at try for everyone :-))

LifeHandle Posted: 08/06/2006 18:19

Has anybody tried pure and simple stress management training. Anxiety is a heightened state of alertness and stress management will help to bring this heightened down so that the underlying problems can be better dealt with.

sam Posted: 12/06/2006 08:05

I was on lexapro 10mg for 18mths for anxiety and panic attacks and recently weaned off as I want to have a baby. I got through the withdrawal side effects no problem as I knew what to expect. The problem now is that my anxiety is back worse than ever. I took my last pill around 3 wks ago and feel so anxious from the moment I wake up every morning. Is this another side effect of the withdrawal or am I back to square one? Thanx for ur help.

ClinPsych Posted: 12/06/2006 13:56

Hi Sam, correct me if I'm wrong but aside from taking the meds did you do anything else to look at how and why and what it is you were anxious about? My opinion on meds is that they are useful in the short term for people to help get them into therapy of some kind as as they learn to change how they think and feel that the person be weaned off the drugs. Unfortunately in your case it would appear that the meds only had the effect of masking or covering up your anxities without ever addressing what it was that was making you anxious in the first place. To complicate matters for you planning to have a baby is a life changing decision which everybody knows comes with all sorts of new anxieties, will I get pregnant, will i carry full term, will the baby be healty, boy or girl, what to name the baby etc etc. I think it would be unusual for you not to feel anxiety at this time. But this normal and expected anxiety is magnified into severe anxiety and panic attacks like you used to experience. If I may ask, what was it you were previously anxious about and experiencing panic attacks about?

j Posted: 13/06/2006 00:28

hows things sam im a former sufferer of anxiety.first of all id like to say that it is possible for you to fully recover as i am fully recovered myself, although it will take you some time from a few weeks to a few months providing you go about it the right way.anxiety is a very bewildering thing to experience.your nervous system is overactive giving you a rapid heart beat, churning stomach etc.this is making you fatigued.as your nervous system is overactive you start to think too much, your thinking becomes overactive.you think panicky thoughts which also have an effect on your nervous system.the constant thinking is also making you mentally fatigued, which effects your concentration etc.also you are more than likely suffering from emotional fatigue, meaning your emotions are out of proportion.

M Posted: 13/06/2006 07:18

Hi all, Just found your discussion board. I have suffered with panic attacks for a number of years and went for cognitive therepy.My theripist told me about Grow this is a type of self help group.It has been amazing the help support and friendship there is wonderful.I have been with the group for about 18months and can honestly say I have not had a panic attack since.In the group you will find people who have suffered like you so you will feel less alone.I know it is difficult to take the first step but you could ask a trusting friend to come with you for your first meeting.meetings are held all over the country and you could look at the web site "grow.ie".Hope this might help someone.

sam Posted: 13/06/2006 08:17

Hi ClinPsych, thanx for your post. I have suffered from panic attacks and anxiety for 5 yrs now. I have tried cognitive and behaviour therapy, tried yoga and at the moment am practising meditation every day. I have no specific reason for my anxiety only that I have always been a "worrier". I have so much support from my husband and family so I really dont know where it all stems from. You are also right in saying I am probably anxious about getting pregnant but lately every day has been a constant battle. I dont know where it will all end.

sam Posted: 13/06/2006 11:51

Thanx J for the confidence boost. Its great to hear that I can recover and you are right in that I always have negative thoughts but am trying so hard to stop myself from been so pessimistic. How did you overcome your anxiety? At the moment I cant bear to be alone as I as so scared ill have a panic attack and wont be able to handle it. I guess I have the "fear of panic".

j Posted: 13/06/2006 12:50

hows things sam the reason that you are suffering from anxiety is because your nervous system is overaroused.you are caught in a cycle of adrenaline fear adrenaline.that is how meditation works it helps lower your nervous system ie your heart rate etc.your present state is scaring you which is prolonging your anxiety.you must learn how to change your attitude towards your illness.

sam Posted: 13/06/2006 14:25

Thanx j I know ur right and I know its up to myself to put it into practice I have got to prevent myself from freaking out over the littlest thing

ClinPsych Posted: 13/06/2006 15:22

Hi Sam, most people try very very hard to control their anxiety but this in many cases can end up resulting in making anxiety worse and prolonging it. Ive used the expression on here before "feel better get worse, feel worse get better". What this means is that many of the things that you may do to reduce your anxiety and distress actually maintain it. However, when you aim to get short term relief, you often end up reinforcing the very beliefs and behaviours that underpin your problem.
Take the classic example of panic attacks. I had a client whose life was controlled in every way by his panic attacks. He was a young man but had a huge fear that he would have a heart attack every time his heart rate increased. He specifically mentioned having a panic attack one day when he got to the top of the stairs in work, he believed he would have a heart attack if he did not sit down at the top of the stairs so he did and his anxiety went away. He got his short term relief from anxiety but by sitting down he reinforced his belief that he had prevented himself from having a heart attack (by the way all med results indicated he was 100% perfectly healthy).
To think of his situation another way, he had just walked up the stairs in work, this required physical effort which increased his heart beat. For another perso they could have the thougth "God I need to get fit Im tired after walking up the stairs". For my client he had a catastrophic thought for where there was a much more logical and likely explanation. His thought was increased heart beat, increased risk of heart attack and he made himself feel better quickly by sitting down. We worked on this and on getting him to challenge his thoughts and to look for the evidence for and against the thoughts he was having, to be more reflective in a positive and helpful way. Practically, he had to take those next few steps to his office without giving into the panic to be able to challenge his anxiety and specifically to challenge his unhelpful and unfounded thoughts. ie to make himself feel worse in the short term to be able to feel better in the long term.
I find it interesting that you mention how much support you have from your husband and family and that is really great. Unfortunately it can also be a double edged sword at times. I find in working with people who experience anxiety of many types that their family members can become unwitting co-conspiritors in maintaining their anxiety, eg accepting the persons thinking errors and buying into it rather than supporting them to challenge their beliefs and support them through experiening the worst that anxiety can throw at them and to see that you can come through the worst anxiety feelings without the feared event actually happening.
I would also have people coming to me who I call the "worried well", some people get so invested in worrying (my grandmother is a prime example) that they are not sure what else to do to occupy their thoughts, they forget what its like just to experience life and not to have to invest so much of their time and emotional worry in anxiety.
It is very useful for people to think about and look at the words that they use to describe events in their life. People who are anxious often use words like awful, horrible, terrible, or end of the world. Things are rarely that bad and it can be more helpful to use less extreme words such as unfortunate or unpleasant but not the end of the world. Extreme thinking leads to extreme emotional reactions. When you mislabel a negative event as "the end of the world" you end up making yourself overly anxious about unpleasant but relatively non-extreme events, such as a social embarassment such as tripping up going into a shop.
May people will say it makes sense to face their fears but they always say what do I do while Im feeling anxious? The simple answer is not much. Accepting and tolerating your anxiety while you're experiencing it is the most effective way of making sure that your anxiety passes quickly.
If you are convinced that your anxiety will not pass quickly test it out. Pick one anxiety provoking situation that you usually withdraw from, ,ake yourself stay in it and just let your anxiety do its thing, just stay there and do nothing other than feel anxious. It will feel unpleasant, that is guaranteed, but it is worth it to prove to yourself that nothing bad will happen other than the feeling and thoughts of anxiety. Anxiety ALWAYS has to reach a ceiling, it CANNOT continue to increase and increase with no end in sight. It will start to reduce on its own without any intervetion by you. Everyone on here can tell you lots and lots of things to try, you will not benefit from them until you try them for yourself because only you can convincingly challenge your own thoughts.

Sam Posted: 13/06/2006 23:09

Again thanx ClinPsych I know all of what ur saying makes sense and can work but it will not work for me Example, I was feeling anxious all day today but kept fighting the anxiety feelings by deep breathing and positive thinking By the end of the day I was exhausted and couldnt wait to get home Was feeling fairly ok and my husband was out for a couple hrs I fell asleep listening to my relaxation CD and woke up to my heart pounding
I tried to ignore it and watched TV for almost an hour before I had to get my husband to come home I felt I was on the brink of a panic attack even though I was using the techniques ive learned
As soon as my husband came home I began to relax
The way I feel is that I did stay in the situation by myself for an hour and the horrible feelings still did not pass even though I was watching a favourite program of mine That really disheartens me and makes me fear the future

AB23 Posted: 13/06/2006 23:57

Hi J,
Just want to start off by saying i view this website daily for the past couple of months. I sufffered from anxiety/ agrofobia over 2 years ago, it was the most horrific time of my life. Around 5 mths ago, anxiety returned into my life. I take medication, anti depressants, not relaxers. I also do alot of reading, tai chi and look for positive inspiration in various books. Like you with clare weekes books, I found great stength and comfort in echtart toll, 'The Power of Now' etc.
after reading your posts about the claire weekes method, I went to a bookstore and bought, self help for your nerves. I read only 2 chapters last night, and found it a little daunting, I felt that she was concentrating on ervous breakdowns, and felt the book was aimed at an older audience, i m in my earl twenties and felt i could t really relate to the book. I am gonna give her another shot tho. Any way was just wondering if you had any suggestions or advice on this particular book. Thanks, take care

j Posted: 14/06/2006 00:56

hows things sam yes it is up to yourself.but when i say that i mean that its up to yourself to find an effective method to get rid of your anxiety and then put that method into practice.the method that i used was the claire weekes method.this method describes everything about anxiety.it explains everything about the physiology of anxiety ie light headedness, churning stomach, palpitations, jelly legs etc and shows you how to get rid of them. it also explains panicky thoughts.for eg you may remember a time when you done something embarassing.the thing itself might not have even been embarassing because anxiety distorts your perceptions.every time you think the thought you may cringe etc but the thought itself is harmless, its the emotional effect of the thought which is the trouble.as i said earlier when you suffer from anxiety you are emotionally fatigued.this makes the thought seem worse than it actually is.a person who doesnt suffer from anxiety may forget about the thought straight away.

j Posted: 14/06/2006 01:04

its important for anxiety sufferers to know the physiology of anxiety.a rapidly beating heart or shaking legs when walking down the street can be very bewildering.these nervous sensations are due to an overactive nervous system.sufferers try to control their anxiety ie. the nervous sensations by tensing etc but this only makes it worse,there is a method for getting rid of these sensations i cant say how in this post as it would be too much to write.but i stress you can be cured from anxiety.once you understand why you are in the anxiety state and how it works you can start recovering.

AB23 Posted: 14/06/2006 17:58

hi j,
Thanks for your recent post. i know why and how I get the thoughts, how i control them. I have earnt that disciplining my ind is essential. My thoughts provoke my emotions, and then y emotions manifest, in some cases anxiety presents itself. Was just wondering if you feel discipling your mind is good and if so what techniques d you use.
Thanks A

Anonymous Posted: 14/06/2006 20:25

hi, i suffer from panic attachs and i'm a very nervous person, some time i have difficulty sleeping at night and read " self help for your nerves" a doctor recommended it to me when i was about 18 (now 24) and i have told a few people about it and they thought it was great ... i hope it works for you. i find not a lot of people understand anxiety and the effects it can have on your life. if you have a physical illness people take notice. but i sometimes think people around me thinks it's all in my head

sylvia Posted: 14/06/2006 23:44

would anybody know if you can have major depression and anxiety at the same time?started as post-natal depression a year ago,but despite efexor xl 200mg and xanax 5mg daily i still fell "on the outside looking in". my responses to life are numbed,and im avoiding people and former situations that i previously enjoyed. my nails are bitten really small and are disgusting. theres no way i could go to a group thing and my head is so tired i cant read for any length of time.even reading this mail is unbearable,how naval gazing and miserable i must appear. my heart beats really fast and i sweat even when home in bed!to really top it all folks-i have developed some kind of kleptomania in the last few months. every time i buy something i have to take something aswell..i can,t even believe what i have just admitted to..im so ashamed that i am a criminal..i look so guilty and am expecting to see myself on crimewatch any day now..for taking the most ridiculous items you can imagine. can any sane person assist me??..thanx.

ClinPsych Posted: 15/06/2006 10:59

Hi Sylvia, first let me say how sorry I am at the level of distres that you are going through. In answer to your question yes it is possible to have both depression and anxiety. The technical term for it is Depression with co-morbid anxiety. It is very common for people who have depression or anxiety to develop the other over time. You certainly describe alot of the symptoms of depression and it would appear that this is your primary difficulty with some associated anxiety. My impression is that this downward sprial which you find yourself in is contributing to thoughts and feelings that you are not a good person. Stealing things is just a manifestation of this, i feel like a bad person and stealing is what bad people do. Another possible explanation is that your feelings and responses to the world as you have described have become numbed. Stealing is not something you would have associated with yourself before. It obviously scares you what you are doing but it also probably excites you, the adrenaline kicking in, waiting to see if you will get caught or get away with it, it could be the only thing making you feel alive inside.
It also sounds that your post natal depression had really knocked your confidence in yourself and your ability to deal with the world. Do you have any support, is the baby's Dad around? How are you with the baby now, have you bonded with the baby? Post natal depression is a rvery common difficulty, you are not alone in experiencing these difficulties. It is important for you and your baby and your relationship to try and look at why you feel this way. Ask your GP for a referral to your local counselling service or have a look athis page from AWARE on PND http://www.aware.ie/online%20books/postnatal.html

j Posted: 15/06/2006 17:13

hows things A when you say controlling your mind what do mean exactly.anxiety sufferers try to control their thoughts but by doing so the thoughts escalate.you need to just let the thoughts come and try and let your mind float.its kind of hard to explain what i meam by float.try to imagine floating on a cloud and let yuourself feel heavey.floating helps to ease mental tension as well as physical tension.when you get nervous sensations or panicky thoughts try to realise that they are due to adrenaline and mental fatigue.also let your body/muscles sag, never try to relaxe as you will only become anxious about trying to relaxe.also as the book says you have to let time pass, as the nervous sensations will persist in their intensity at which they are at for some time, from a few minutes to a few hours until they get down to a more managable intensity.and even when they get down to a managable intensity you have to keep applying the method.your nervous sensations may go up and down during your recovery. self help for your nerves doesnt talk about recovery.during recovery you have what are called set backs.during which your nervous sensations etc may go back to being as bad as they were in the beginning.this is only due to your nervous system recovering and is part of recovery.but you must keep applying the method and eventually you will overcome the set backs which may last from one day to a few days.try not to discipline your mind as you will only become more anxious.instead let the thoughts come say to your self these thoughts are only questions they are useless etc, (for eg you may think what if this happens etc) and are due to mental fatigue.then try to mentally float.basically you apply the same formulae to thoughts as you do to the physical nervous sensations.also try not to be anxious about getting rid of your nervous sensations or thoughts try to go with the flow, float through the panic.good luck J

j Posted: 15/06/2006 17:17

hows things anonymous.claire weekes wrote 5 or 6 books on anxiety, each containing additional information which is necessary for your recovery.buy another one of her books and you will see that she talks about extra things such as the four fatigues, fear of fear and recovery etc.good luck J

j Posted: 15/06/2006 17:27

hows things sylvia usually when you have depression and anxiety the reason that you are depressed is because of your anxiety ie your rapidly beating heart, panicky thoughts etc.your head is so tired because you are thinking all the time and have become mentally fatigued.i think your kleptomania (although i cant say for sure that you have kleptomania)is due to your present state of anxiety.lots of anxity sufferers have obsessions, such as repeatidly checking if the lights are off or the taps arent running etc before going to bed.feeling as if you are on the outside and looking in on life is very common when you have anxiety, i used to get that myself.its because you are both mentally and physically aroused, because of this you feel as if you are on a different wavelenght to everyone else.good luck J

sylvia Posted: 15/06/2006 22:09

thankyou so much for not judging me. yes, it took me a year to really bond with my baby-the sweetest infant anyone could wish for.i am getting a nites sleep at last-this is my 3rd and last baby after a gap of 9 yrs,due to a new relationship etc. im hiding a lot of emotions etc from my partner and always make an effort to be smiley etc bcos i think when i had pnd years ago that was a contributing factor to my husband losing interest in our life together.anyway, made huge effort to get out and about today and baby in playgroup for few hours. i really made a huge effort to stay away from shop temptations. its not like i need or want the stuff but it..i dont know what im talking about. i cant even explain as im soo soo ashamed-its my worst secret and unburdoning it anonomously has been a relief.i do think im a fake, really bad and stained in some way. it doesnt show too much on the outside but the inside is hollow. will this pass? and folks.. theres worse to tell you..i have been caught..i was arrested and shamed within an inch of my life..dont know what will happen to me -legally i mean..ive never even got a speeding ticket b4 and i may have a court appearance to face.its like its happening to somebody else-and no, theres nobody i can tell bcos i am guilty and im in an awful mess, i dont know how i got into this ..and i feel im going to pass out when i think of what happened only a few days ago.as i type thisconfession and lay my shame bare my heart is pounding and i feel i cant breathe..its like im dying, but i know im not, not in the normal way anyway. now, i bet you,re shocked-i know i would have been a year ago to have known a real criminal, now i am one of the despised too.

ClinPsych Posted: 16/06/2006 08:44

Another explanation for allowing yourself to feel the anxiety is that it is about challenging your fears and thoughts which have little actual evidence. By letting the anxiety run its course then you are proving to yourself that the feared event (heart attack, going mad social embarassment etc) will not actually happen, thus proving to yourself that you can experience the physical, emotional and thought aspects of anxiety without the feared event actually happening. We are our own greatest sceptics, it is harder to convince ourself of something than it is to convince someone else. I would suggest trying this little exercise on a simple anxiety that you are having, it does not need to be in the actual situation, but think of a common one you experience.
Sit down with a sheet of paper and think of the situation, where it is, who else is there, what you are doing. Next, describe your mood and how you are feeling in the situation and rate its intensity from 1-100.
Next try to think about what you think in that situation, what am i afraid might happen, what is the worst thing that could happen if it came true, what was going through my mind before i started to feel this way, what does my feeling this way say about me?
In another section try to write down all the (factual) evidence that supports the thoughts you are having. Similarly write down all the evidence (alternative explanations) that does not support the anxious thoughts. Looking at the evidence for both try to come up with a more balanced thought about the situation which is not so negatively focussed as the initial anxious thoughts.
This all may seem a little hard to follow, i'll try to get back soon and illustrate the above exercise with an example related to panic attacks

anxy Posted: 19/06/2006 13:37

hi j i suffers from bad social anxt myself an i have read claire weeks book freedom from fear it true it can b very helpful this david johnstons freedom from fear program sounds very helpful but for sum reason im not able to log on 2 his website i realy would b most grateful j if u could give me his email address as i would realy like to talk to him an get this program .i myself was on medication from everything from prozac to nardil an 4 me d drugs dont work not 2 say dey mitent work 4 oda prople spent hundreds on stuff from internet an various councillers its such a frustrating thing but i refuse 2 believe it can not b over come.again j if u could give me that david johnstons email adress i realy would b very grateful.

j Posted: 19/06/2006 21:34

hows things anxy.are you sure your using the right web address, www.panicfree.co.nz you can email panicfree on david@panicfree.co.nz good luck J

anxy Posted: 23/06/2006 22:16

Well j thanks found d website after will prob buy the program as i said earlier i av tried alot of things 2 get better i no where u are cumin from with d posts i av always said if i found something that could really help me i would let people in on it 2 because i no how bad it can be an it would b nice for load of other people 2 b helped 2.i really do recomend this book but i say it really does take persistance.persistace is topsy turvy with me the whole time.i also av a great habit of goin into the negetive of an aproach after a while.thats why i av a question about d book j.that mentel fatigue/obsession thing is a problem i av when i am talking to sum one i get traped in my own head thinking about thinking its a nighmare i no that it sumting u av to accept and work with for a while but when u add in the first factor the nervousnes in that situation where u are meant to just float past the taughts i find they are very much intwined an it can b realy hard to do both .1 aproach would b alot easier if u av any tips j would really appreciate it tanks

j Posted: 26/06/2006 16:16

hows things anxy.im afraid i cant tell you everything about the claire weekes method in my posts, its just not possible, id be writing for too long, all i can give you is a brief summary.claire weekes method is based on four principles 1.facing, 2.accepting, 3.floating, 4.letting time pass.1.facing means not trying to get your attention of your symptoms, not trying to ignore them because this doesnt work it just makes your anxiety worse.instead you have to understand that your symptoms are physiological and of no great medical significance and that your contstant thinking or introspection is due to mental fatigue as well as your body being in an aroused state.because your body and mind are interlinked.when you think panicky thoughts your body reacts to them ie your heart beats fast etc and when your heart beats fast etc you think panicky thoughts.2.accepting means not tensing or fighting against your symptoms instead let your body sag and feel heavey let your shoulders and arms sag like a rag doll.also let yout tummy muscles sag.this helps get rid of tension.there are too layers of tension.the first layer of tension is caused by you consciously tensing your muscles.but if you consciously stop tensing your muscles you will still be tense.this tension that remains is due to adrenaline acting directly on muscles which is caused by your thinking.3.floating helps ease your thinking to get rid of the second layer of tension.when you suffer from anxiety you can think constantly about insignificant trivial things.try to let yourself mentally float as if on a cloud.4.letting time pass, means that you must keep applying the method all the time and be persistant as you say, for weeks or months until you recover.monitor yourself to see if you are applying the method.

j Posted: 26/06/2006 16:32

hows things anxy i forgot to say that things are supposed to be topsy turvy its part of recovery.sometimes your symptoms get as bad as they were before you started applying the method they may stay like this for a day or even for a week or two.these are called set backs.did the book you read talk about recovery at all.this is why many people who use claire weekes method dont recover and give up on the method.they have a set back and think "my symptoms are as bad as ever im never going to recover" and they stop applying the method they give up on it.you are looking for one approach, youll just have to turn the 4 principles into one approach.let your body sag and float.unfortunately claire weekes books all contain additional information.i assure you once you get all the information things will become much clearer.and you will fully recover in time.dont give up.J

Jimbo Posted: 27/06/2006 12:51

Hi, havent been here in a little while. ClinicalPsych, I have been trying to get an appointment with a CBT in Dublin, but its very difficult. Ive been through all the therapists listed in the Irish website, but no luck. I would prefer to visit a therapist one 2 one rather than attending a group setting, as I am not ready for that right now. Any ideas?..........Just one more thing, I have constant depersonalization / derealization also, are you familiar with this condition ?

j Posted: 27/06/2006 17:18

hows things jimbo feelings of unreality are very common when suffering from anxiety.anxiety sufferers always have their attention turned inwards on themselves.they are obsessed with their own thoughts, its hard for them not to be as they are so mentally fatigued due to their constant introspection.they are alsways trying to think their way out of their illness.but this just makes them more anxious.try to clear your mind by letting your thoughts or your mind float.this helps to ease mental tension.feelings of personality disentegration are also very common.anxiety sufferers are vulnerable to suggestion and find it difficult to make decisions they are always changing their minds about things.feelings of depersonalisation and unreality make you very emotionally drained and you may feel apathetic and depressed as a result.

megan (NTY48669) Posted: 27/06/2006 21:09

help anyone i suffer social anxiety too i am lost at what to do? dont want ot look like a nutter by shaking in public anymore ie panic attacks. Sick of being scared.

ClinPsych Posted: 28/06/2006 08:27

Hi Jimbo, thanks for the post. With regard to accessing CBT in dublin, what website have you been trying from? You could try www.psihq.ie, its the website of the Psychological Society of Ireland and it can shortlist Psychologists in private practice in the dublin area. If you didnt want to go down the private route your GP is the best person to go to in order to get a referral to your local Adult Psychiatry Service (who will almost always have a CBT therapist on board), although there may be waiting times associated with this option. I understand your fears about group work and there maybe things in your life that dont need to come out and be discussed in a group setting but from my experience of being involved in running these groups people only share as much as they are comfortable with. There is also no reason why someone couldnt attend a group and individual therapy at the same time so they had private space to discuss their difficulties as well as benefitting from the shared group experience.
In answer to your second question, yep I am aware of depersonalization (or derealization). It is relatively common and most people will experience it at some point in their lives (but usually cant describe what it is or put a name on it!!)
One person described it to me as being like being a ghost. No matter how hard the person tries, they cannot feel like they are genuinely interacting with the world and can't seem to perceive themselves as being normal. They feel like they are trapped between the real world and death. While they are struggling so hard to feel everything as normal again, there is a part of themselves which begs to just give up and stop the struggling. Put another way, it is an alteration in the perception or experience of oneself, so that the self is felt to be unreal; the person feels detached from the reality or their own body or mental processes.
Its usually found in association with lots of different difficulties but especially post-traumatic stress disorder, depression, panic disorder, and there has been alot of evidence linking it with prior use of marijuana. It often disappears without any form of treatment and usually professional treatment is recommended only if the disorder persists or causes distress. CBT has been found to be especially useful especially if you experience panic attacks also. Most interventions focus not directly on the depersonalisation but on the main depressive or anxiety difficulties.
Hope some of this has helped.

j Posted: 28/06/2006 13:57

hows things megan welcome to the discussion.i am a former sufferer of social anxiety myself.i too used to panic when talking to people etc.the panic and shaking etc is due to your nervous system being over aroused.our nervous systems are made up of the involuntary nervous system and the voluntary nervous system.the voluntary nervous system is under our conscious control hence its name, and allow us to move our arms and legs etc.the involuntary nervous system however is not under our conscious control, instead it responds to our moods.the involuntary nervous system is made up of sympathetic and parasympathetic nerves, these two nerves usually keep each other in check and balance each other out.the involuntary nervous system controls our internal organs such as our heart.when we feel the moods of fear or anger our involuntary nervous system reacts and the sympathetic nerves dominate the parasympathetic to making you panic.the sympathetic nerves cause you to panic by releasing adrenaline into your blood stream.the adrenaline then travels to your major organs such as your heart causing your heart to beat fast and your stomach causing it to churn.

j Posted: 28/06/2006 14:11

(continued)at the moment megan you are caught in a cycle of fear-adrenaline-fear.your heart beats fast your stomach churns, you shake etc, and you become scared.you fear your nervous sensations.but the mood of fear once again excites your sympathetic nerves releasing more adrenaline causing you to panic even more and the cycle repeats itself.when you are in social situations its not the person that you are afraid of its yourself ie your panic.at the moment your nervous system has been aroused so much that it has become sensitized meaning the slightest bit of fear will make you panic.there is a method called the claire weekes method which shows you how you can break the cycle and calm your nervous system.best of luck J

ClinPsych Posted: 28/06/2006 16:36

Hi Megan, does any of the following seem familiar to you:
to me it is an overwhelming fear of doing things people normally take for granted and the feeling of shame in yourself "
"For me Social Anxiety is the excessive fear, dread and nervousness I experience in my relationships with other people. Especially people in authority and people I don't know very well. It effects my self-esteem and my self-confidence. I feel very self conscious and don't feel at ease in social situations"
" feeling different to other people when I'm around them"
" I am ill at ease around people that I don't know and find the ordinary social situations that everybody encounters very difficult. These can range from going to the supermarket, job interview or going on a date"
" I tend to sweat quite alot in such situations and have a massive fear ot blushing and I tend to avoid all situations where this may occur"
" I have a fear in social situations that I will draw attention to myself, make a fool of myself or that people will laugh at me. People might think that I was very nervous, boring, strange or unusual"
" I don't go on tea break with the others at work and at lunch will sit on my own reading the paper because I fear I will say or do something stupid "
These are all direct quotes from people who have social anxiety. There are many different explanations for why people experience anxiety of any kind. From my professional perspective and from that of the people with social anxiety I have worked with two things are central.
(1) how we view and think about ourselves, and
(2) how we belive others view us and think about us
The first point is all about core beliefs, ie beliefs that have about ourselves, i.e
i am a good/bad person
i am a worthwhile / not worthy person
I am an interesting / boring person
If we hold negative core beliefs about ourselves then we are much more likely to believe that others can see those negatives in us too.
The difficulty with the second point is that many people with social anxiety believe that they have this special ability to read the minds of others. eg if i feel embarassed in this situation then the other person MUST see that and then they will think im weird or odd. If there's a lull in a converstation then the other person will think that i am a boring person etc.
If we are so focussed inward (on the thoughts and feelings and physical reactions that we are having when we are anxious) then we cannot objectively look out around us to judge if anyone has actually noticed us blushing, shaking etc. Have a look through google for the social anxiety group in the Mater Hospital and that may lead you in a direction where you can access some help.

Michelle (FSW48553) Posted: 08/07/2006 20:43

Social Anxiety Disorder.
Personally, I came across this at a an Aware monthly lecture given by Mr. O'Donoghue(?), Consultant Psychiatrist. Until this time, I had thought about depression and anxiety as a combined force and precipitating events as significant factors that can prempt depression.
When I was young social anxiety was about being awkward and shy in social situations. This became particularly relevant in teenage years.
Nothing I suppose has really changed in thirty years except for acknowledgement and empowerment.
The Mater Hospital Group run a Social Anxiety Group. It was by chance I found out about it while scrolling tne net......in search of an answer for a friend.....
First page gives a few quotations:-
I pass this one on.....'For me Social Anxiety is the excessive Fear, Dread, and nervous experience in relationships with other people. Especially people in authority and people I don't know very well. It effects my self esteem, my self confidence. I feel very conscious and don't feel at ease in social situations'
This was me and I weaved my way through work that would be more servile in character, to avoiding social occasions using the excuse to work overtime, to getting married and playing a shadow role.....I was brought to an abrupt end with a horse riding fall, a skull fracture and sensory impairments, activating bipolar and then intense anxiety.....this was worsened by divorc from a 15 year marriage I have had lots of time to mull this together and reckon that anyone with Social Anxiety problems should address rather than embrace over-work; alcohol; drugs.
Another quote from their page 'Feeling different to other people when I'm around them'.
What a driving factor in my submissive behaviour pre-accident!
Now I would pass on the wisdom I learnt.....If I am different....well, why not!!!!
The website is www.socialanxietyireland.com
The Mater is very central to a considerable number of people and perhaps a model could be developed for the secondary schools in Ireland. A chatroom exists.
Bacon 'Readeth maketh the full man'

sam Posted: 12/07/2006 12:54

Hi all
Its been a month or so since I posted on this website but i've been checking it regularily as I find it very helpful. I took advice from clin psyche with regard my anxiety and trying to control it. I was doing quite well in that I just let the anxious feelings happen and tolerated them rather than worrying about them.
Now however I seem to be having different problems. About 3 weeks ago I got an ache in my right arm that would not go away. The next day my left leg started aching. Anyway this pattern continued with my arms and legs for a few days and no matter how much I relaxed, would not go away. Anyway after weeks of worry I put my symptoms into a search engine and up popped Multiple Sclerosis.
I have myself convinced I have it and am thinking about going back to doc for him to check me out. Has anyone any advice on how I can come thru this as I am driving myself mad. My family think I should go to doc to put my mind at ease but I am so scared.
Please help.

ClinPsych Posted: 12/07/2006 21:17

Hiya Sam, well done on your efforts to tackle your anxiety so far. The internet is a fantastic tool for getting information, but it can also be dangerous. I remember the first time I looked up my psychology diagnostic text book in college, I diagnosed myself with loads of different disorders! When you went on the net you experienced something called a self fulfilling prophecy, ie you go looking for info that will fit with your anxities / worries about what it might be. There could be probably lots and lots of alternative less scary alternatives(eg sleeping more on one side in bed...) Your family are right you should go to your doctor. The fear for you is probably that he will confirm your worst fears and tell you that you have MS, however he could be just as likely to tell you that you are absolutely fine! The important thing is to go to the GP with an open mind and in confidence that he knows what he is doing and has no reason to lie to you. I have had clients who convince themselves (with little evidence) that there is definitely something wrong with them and are so convinced that they wont believe the trained GP's!! If we get a runny nose it could be pneumonia, then again it could just be a simple cold, sometimes the simple explanation is actually the real one.... good luck with the GP he will be able to give you the answers you need, your mind and your imagination wont.

sam Posted: 13/07/2006 16:40

Again thanx clin psych. Ive decided im gonna go to the doc tomor. I am frightened to death of what he'll say or that he'll think im been stupid but I have to get that illness out of my head.
I think deep down I know its anxiety that is causing all these weird sensations but until I get it checked by a professional ill always have that doubt.
Thanx again, Sam

j Posted: 14/07/2006 00:14

hows things sam i am just after looking at claire weekes book, "more help for your nerves" and i think i have found the cause of your aching.usually muscles are kept in a state called tone which is a balance between contraction and relaxation.however prolonged tension upsets the balance and allows chemicals of fatigue to accumulate so aching begins.this aching from tension is persistent meaning you probably find it difficult to stand up for long periods.good luck J

sam Posted: 14/07/2006 14:02

Hi J, Thanx for ur post which makes sense to me somehow. I am just back from doc who took bloods on me for various tests but he thinks they'll all come back negative and my various symptoms are down to my ongoing anxiety. As ClinPsyc said I be surfing the web and looking for a disease I can match to my symptoms.
Anyway my doc has referred me for cognitive therapy which seems to be the most effective treatment for anxiety. Does anyone know how long ill be waiting? I live in Sligo.
Also thanx for all your help, its great to know I can come and let off steam and get advice at the same time. Sam xx

j Posted: 14/07/2006 16:18

hi sam its important for you to understand the physiology of anxiety ie. your nervous physical sensations as they can be very bewildering, and therefore increase your anxiety.the only way that you can do this is to either read a few of claire weekes books or visit www.panicfree.co.nz.on this website a man has put together a programme incorporating all of claire weekes books into one.he also has his own clinic in auckland in new zealand where he has been curing people from anxiety for the last 14 years.i recommend you give him an email or a ring.its up to yourself.good luck anyway J

Conor Posted: 15/07/2006 11:52

J why do you give people on here false hope that they can be "cured" from anxiety, we are genetically programmed as humans to experience anxiety, its a protective response that has evolved for millions of years, you cant "cure" that. It also seems that you're undermining Sam's decision and her GP's to go for cognitive therapy, we should be encouraging her to follow through on her choices that she has made, reading your posts over the past few months really annoys me at times, there is more than one method out there, you seem to suggest the claire weekes method for every single problem on here, open your mind a little to the possibility that something else might work for someone. Im sorry if im offending you with this but Ive stayed silent on it for too long now.

j Posted: 16/07/2006 16:17

hi conor i understand what you are saying.but you can be cured from anxiety.and as far as i can see the claire weekes method is the only way to fully recover.it explains everything about anxiety.claire weekes was a doctor who suddenly became agoraphobic and started suffering from panic attacks etc.as well as being a doctor she also had a degree in science namely physiology.so she knew exactly how the body worked.she was aware of how our nervous system works and why her body became in a state of panic ie why her heart would beat fast, her stomach churn etc.through her understanding of anxiety she developed a method for curing anxiety.through out her life she cured agoraphobics that many psychiatrists who were so-called experts in agoraphobia deemed uncurable.i am not giving people false hope.its true that many people who read her books never recover.and there are many reasons for this.anxiety sufferers find it hard to concentrate therefore its not easy for them to digest the information.its also hard to take in information when you are in a state of panic and cant relaxe.some people read her books once and expect to be cured, but you have to keep on reading it as you dont understand her method fully until you are cured.it takes months for you to recover as your nervous system takes a while to become desensitized.all her books contain additional information which is needed for full recovery.also you cant ask a book a question.set backs are the main reason why people dont recover when reading her books.set backs are where your recovery comes to a halt, you may even be as bad as ever.you then start to think the method isnt working and you stop applying the method but you keep recovering again if you keep using the method.claire weekes method works when you have all the information and apply it properly.im living proof.

Conor Posted: 17/07/2006 10:15

"its true that many people who read her books never recover.and there are many reasons for this.anxiety sufferers find it hard to concentrate therefore its not easy for them to digest the information.its also hard to take in information when you are in a state of panic and cant relaxe.some people read her books once and expect to be cured, but you have to keep on reading it as you dont understand her method fully until you are cured" -
J if you're not one already you should be a polician, your above quote, if after reading the book you're not "cured" then its not the books fault, its your fault for not understanding it...? Im sorry but thats not fair to anxiety suffers to throw that back at them, keep reading it and eventually you'll understand.
Im delighted for you that you are a committed cured disciple of the Claire Weekes method, but its not the answer to everything. Anyway Im not going to get into a big long battle over this with you as I can see from previous posts that all it does is distract from others trying to get help on here, Ive said my piece and I'll leave it now.

Clin Psych Posted: 17/07/2006 12:18

Just to let you all know that I noticed that the Social Anxiety Ireland website are having an online webchat tonight in their chatroom at 9pm with a psychologist from the Mater who runs the Social Anxiety programme, could be a good opportunity for people to put their questions to him in real time. I had a look at the chatroom and people can enter anonymously so no need for anxiety about that!

j Posted: 17/07/2006 13:19

hi conor there is a lot of evidence to back up what im saying.do your own research on claire weekes, type her name into a search engine.read some reviews of her books.youll find that her method is the only method that has permanently cured anxiety sufferers.you may also find that she was given an mbe by the queen, was nominated for a nobel prize, and had her own programme on the bbc in the 60's or 70's.its a shame that there arent claire weekes councillors in ireland, and indeed everywhere around the world.people who suffer from anxiety find every day a struggle.they are bewildered by whats happening to them and are full of fear.unfortunately very few people actually recover.most will take medication or go to counselling for years, but they will still have anxiety and that angers me.because if they had the right information about their illness then they could recover.unfortunately counselling and medication doesnt work(in my opinion unless a method brings you complete recovery it doesnt work) they only help you cope with your anxiety by giving you support etc.

sam Posted: 20/07/2006 16:39

Hi all,
Again im looking for more advice. As i said in previous posts I went to the doc and all my bloods have come back clear. While this should put my mind at ease im still freaking out everytime my arm goes "funny" and still thinking MS.
Lately my right arm feels funny almost every day. It sort of feels weak and tired but I have full feeling and no numbness asuch. I told the doc this last week and he done neuro tests on me,ie.checked for strength and reflexes etc. But im still getting pins and needles when I wake up and the whole thing is really bothering me.
I know the only test for MS is an MRI but my doc told me my bloods would show up something if I was unwell in any way.
Can anxiety really affect my nervous system this way or am I in the early stages of this horrible disease?

j Posted: 20/07/2006 23:40

hi sam yes anxiety is more or less all about your nervous system.ill give you a brief explanation of how your nervous system works.your nervous system is made up of two parts the voluntary nervous system and the involuntary nervous system.the voluntary nervous system allows you to move your limbs etc and is under your conscious control hence its name voluntary.the involuntary nervous system however controls your internal organs such as your heart beat.the involuntary nervous system is then made up of the sympathetic and parasympathetic nerves.these nerves usually keep each other in check and balance each other out.also the involuntary nervous system isnt under your conscious control instead it responds to your mood, such as anger and fear.when you experience these moods the sympathetic nerves dominate the parasympathetic and adrenaline is released into your muscles and major organs causing your heart to beat fast and your muscles to tense etc.

j Posted: 20/07/2006 23:49

if anybody would like some information on claire weekes' method go to www.drclaireweekes.co.uk

Clin Psych Posted: 21/07/2006 10:13

Hi Sam. nice to hear from you again. It seems that your anxiety has grown to the stage that you can only believe things that will confirm your anxious thoughts, ie your anxiety is in control of you and not the other way around! Why would your doctor lie to you. If you were the Dr and you could find nothing wrong or no indicators of MS how would you re-assure your patient?
There are quite a large number of possible explanations for your pins and needles in your arms(besides MS!!) Here's just a sample of them...
Panic attacks in themselves will cause pins and needles, especially in the hands. This is caused by the rapid 'washing out' of carbon dioxide from the blood through breathing too rapidly (hyperventilation). Once the levels return to normal either through breathing more slowly or breathing in and out of a paper bag, they disappear.
Some medicines can cause a tingling sensation and this is made worse by mixing them with alcohol. It is a very bad idea mixing anti depressants and large amounts of alcohol as the effect of the drug is enhanced greatly.
what put your arm "to sleep" is that you probably were lying on it while you slept. This squeezed the nerves in your arm. Nerves, as you probably know, are the bundles of fibers (each a single cell, actually) that carry messages between your brain and the rest of your body.
Maybe your blood vessels were squeezed, too. That means that oxygen couldn't get to your nerves the way it should. Either way would affect how your nerves work--so your arm feels "asleep."
This doesn't last long. As soon as you take the pressure off, you start feeling a prickly tingling. Sometimes it starts to feel hot. Soon all the feeling returns.
Does your job involve typing or other repetitive movements, similar symptoms are common for people who have Carpal tunnel syndrome which is nothing more serious than bad ergonomics of the wrists and arms.
How old is your bed? Is it still supportive, similar symptoms have been reported in people who have old un-supportive mattresses.
you see there is a lot of alternative less scary explanations out there for whats happening, it doesnt always have to be worst case scenario, trust your doctor that he has your best interests at heart....

Sam Posted: 21/07/2006 14:11

Hi Clin Psych,
Again thanx. I know all of what youre saying makes perfect sense, its just my mind runs riot as soon as I feel any weird sensation anywhere in my body. I feel I really need to start the CBT as my thoughts are getting out of control and no matter how hard I try I cant seem to control them at the minute.
Ive been told I can be waiting up to 6mths to see a CBT therapist in Sligo but I dont know what ill do until then. I can go for a private appt but I really want a to try CBT as its meant to be the most effective for anxiety. I just need this constant reassurance with regard my health and cant keep running to the doc.
So again thanx for the reassurance and I guess ill just have to hang in there.
Sam

j Posted: 21/07/2006 15:13

hi sam the only way your going to get any bewilderments about sensations in your body cleared is by reading one of claire weekes books.i cant see how a counsellor is going to explain any of your physiological sensations to you.

Clin Psych Posted: 21/07/2006 16:25

J, would seem that you ignored the previous poster, Conor's, comments about supporting people in their decisions, and I would agree with him, it is very short sighted and egocentric to claim that there is NO other way than the Claire Weekes way, stop trying to force it on people, whether it is with good intentions or not, people are intelligent enough and able enough to make choices for themselves.
Let Sam go for her CBT or what ever else she chooses, and if it doesnt work for her she can make a decision on what else she may try. Because you cannot see how a counsellor will help her with her anxiety does not mean that they wont or cant help her.
Sam, 6 months is actually not that long within the health services for an appointment, although when you need help it can feel like forever. Waiting times can be up to 1-2 years in some places.
If you would like help sooner here is a link to some therapists in Sligo who you could go to privately
http://www.bodywhys.ie/Directory/counties/sligo.htm
Another thing you could try if CBT is something that you are interested in before an appointment is available is this book:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0470018380/202-7248352-7243067?v=toc&n=266239
Its called CBT for Dummies and I find it a really useful read in user friendly language, it may help you to get an idea of CBT before you go so you can decide if its right for you or not.

jan Posted: 21/07/2006 21:36

has any one tried the "aware " support groups.i find them a great help.the realisation that im not alone is all i need some times.

j Posted: 21/07/2006 22:55

hows things clinpsych are you able to clear up peoples bewilderments in respect to their physical sensations.are you able to tell people why they cant walk down the street without their legs shaking.im sorry clinpsych bu physical sensations or nervousness are at the core of anxiety.and you cant recover fully without having an explanation of them and how to cope with them.i dont believe that a person can recover from anxiety fully unless they use the claire weekes method.unless they had very mild anxiety.anxiety isnt a mental illness.its an illness of the nervous system.people who go to counselling for their anxiety spend years in counselling and dont recover they are just shown how to cope with their anxiety.let me ask you a question clinpsych if a person told you that they cant leave their house with panicking and their legs shaking etc what would you advise them to do?

Michelle Posted: 21/07/2006 23:37

Well, this site really takes the biscuit! I am a fifty years old female, and anything you want to know about anxiety and panic attacks I am your woman. Saying this, there are so many postings on this site, it should tell you all one thing: That is, anxiety and panic will never kill you, also, you all seem to be to engrossed in your condition. As time goes by, one learns to cope because it is either Sink or Swim! So please read "The Power of Positive Thinking" By Norman Vincent Peale. It helped me when I buried my twin boys who died at birth, also my daughter who also died at birth. May I add that this book still helps me today. Please remember you only get one chance at this life, so start putting yourself first, love yourself, and good things will happen to you.

shaky Posted: 23/07/2006 02:06

does anyone else have shaky hands and jelly legs?

Agnes Posted: 23/07/2006 21:16

Hi Sam,
Regarding the arms feeling numb.
You could have Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. Its not a big deal.
Most mornings when I wake up both my arms are numb. I have had this for years. But it goes away quickly. It is absolutely nothing to worry about.
Only a suggestion so don't go getting anxious about it & if that is the cause it is really very trivial & there are lots of ways that it can be relieved.

j Posted: 24/07/2006 17:08

hi michelle you can do more than cope you can fully recover.i know that its hard to believe but you can.i have fully recovered myself.

j Posted: 24/07/2006 17:21

hi shaky shaking hands and jelly legs are very very common.jelly legs are the main reason why agoraphobics are afraid to go out side.i used to get jelly legs although its wasnt too severe as i still ventured outside.but it is very bewildering.jelly legs are fully explained in claire weekes books.basically they are caused by panic.the blood vessels in your legs dilate meaning too much oxygen is carried to your leg muscles making then weak.its very bewildering not being able to control your legs while walking down the street.

Clin Psych Posted: 24/07/2006 17:51

J, hmm where to start, I suppose my belief would be that it is not good clinical practice to focus solely on one aspect of anxiety, such as the nervous system, it would be mine and clinical psychologys opinion that Anxiety is not that simple, and I know you would not agree with me on this, but bear with me.
I do not offer my clients the hope of never experiencing major anxiety in their lives or of curing them, i wont give them false hope. Its a long way to fall if you think you're cured and you experience a relapse. A lifetime is a long time and lots can happen which could trigger relapses such as bereavements, job loss, relationships ending, the list is endless. My hope for each client coming through my door is that I will help them to find the skills necessary to cope with and understand their anxiety, both physical and cognitive on a day to day basis and in the future.
It is not true and not my direct experience that people spend years in counselling getting help for their anxities. The average length of my clients therapy with me is between 6-8 sessions with the shortest being 3 and longest approximately 12-15 sessions. The aim is that the person can go about their daily life without their anxiety impeding them, stopping them from enjoying activities or experiences. I dont believe there is anything wrong in helping people to learn how to cope, it is teaching people how to cope that allows therapy to be relatively short in duration so that people are not dependent on and dont have to continually go to counsellors, psychologists or psychiatrists. The length of therapy is also dependent on what else is going on for the person, anxiety doesnt occur in a vacuum, people have other familial, relationship, work and other difficulties that co-occur and anxiety may be just one of these. You can see this in some of people's stories on here, they have lots going on in their lives that they need help making sense of in addition to their anxities.
It is not possible on this forum to give a long and extensive reply to your agrorophobia question. My approach is CBT and I use it because it is supported by years of international research, but much more importantly, i have seen it working for the most extreme of anxiety suffers. The basic approaches would be to provide psycho education about the nature of anxiety, looking at how the person has formed their fears, what maintains their fears, helping them to gradually identify and challenge their negative thoughts and to set managageable goals for themselves etc. I dont believe that I will ever and nor do I want to try to convince you or anyone else of the merits of my work, i believe in it and use it my clients but I do not force it upon them. I enter into an agreement with my clients at the start of our work together, and i emphasise our work together, I do not believe in dictating from above that my way is the only way, my clients are their own experts on anxiety and for them to feel better I need them to help me to understand themselves, its a collaborative approach.

Lisa Posted: 24/07/2006 23:40

Hiya Folks,
It's been a sometime since I last posted a message and it seems some things never change. J your still harping on about Dr. Claire Weekes. I hope the commission she is paying you is good. I am not going to critise her method. I am sure it has worked for some people. However, I must admit I don't appreciate how you disregard all other methods as inadequate " treatable for minor anxieties".??????????? Do you realise how ignorant and stupid that sounds. I went to see a counsellor some time ago and I found her extremely helpful. She really got me thinking and doing as opposed to hiding away. Don't be so negative about other treatments. What might have worked for you may not work for others and vice- versa.
Michelle, I am sorry to hear about your children. A friend of mine reccommended the power of now book to me, so I will definitely get a copy of it.

j Posted: 25/07/2006 20:24

hi clinpsych no i agree with you that anxiety is not just about the physical sensations thoughts do also play a role.but the specific thoughts themselves dont matter.and thats what counsellors such as yourself try to do, change peoples beliefs or thoughts.i mean no offence to you or your profession.you say that it wouldnt be good practise to focus on one aspect of anxiety.but dont counsellors just focus on thought and feelings.the nervous system is such a big aspect of anxiety that it cant be ignored.its true that people relapse but with the claire weekes method you cant relapse.because you develope what she calls the right inner voice, which is basically confidence.usually when people relapse when using a method other than claire weekes method or when the get a setback they think oh no im back at square one ill never be free.instead when you use claire weekes method you have an inner voice which says ive been here before i can handle this no matter what.

j Posted: 25/07/2006 20:27

hi lisa did that counsellor cure your anxiety.if a method doesnt cure your anxiety than in my book it is inadequate.by the way no claire weekes isnt paying me comission she passed away years ago.

S Posted: 26/07/2006 19:51

Hi,
I am new to this website - I have been suffering with aniexty for the last couple of months - thankfully the panic attacks have stopped with the help of medication, however I am now analyzing every little think I'm doing - i.e. combing my hair - its very frightening - Im so so scared - as I have never suffered this way before - Thank-you

Lisa Posted: 27/07/2006 12:57

Hi J,
Yes, I don't suffer from social anxiety anymore. I am not saying that "Dr Weekes Method" does not work. What I am saying is that it won't work for everyone. And the same could be said for a counsellor, pyschologist etc.It is up to the person to see what suits them best as opposed to you saying the only method that works is "Dr Weekes". I also imagine that The Dr Weekes method only focuses on generalised anxieties, but i'm sure you will tell me otherwise.
Initially, I bought self-help books by all the anxiety gurus. And some of the advice was very relevant, however the turning point for me was going to a cbt counsellor. She made me realised that I was normal. When I was constantly mindreading what people thought of me and presuming the worst ,it helped greatly to talk about these problems and to realise it was not possible for me to know what was going on in everyone's elses head. A book or a cd can't reassure you like that. But just let me reiterate a counsellor might not work for everyone either but it worked for me.
And I am sure I am not the only person in the world who had positive experiences going to a counsellor. So please bear this in mind when you disregard all other treatments for social anxiety.

Andy Posted: 31/07/2006 17:20

Hi all,been a while since i have posted anything, but have continued to read all the other postings every day. to me this site has become totally dominated by J. who is besotted by Claire Weekes and panicfree .com. He is so dismissive of any other help been offered from anyone else but himself. Just read his postings over the last 2 years and you will see that clearly. It was J who suggested panicfree to me in the first place, and having bought their cds i found them no useless. so i returned them on a guarenteed money back deal. Guess what I am still waiting for my money back 3 months later. I know j keeps denying he is an agent for panicfree, but i do not believe him, nobody could be that fanatical and not get paid. So my advice to all users of this great site is to be very careful about where you spend money on help.

hugh4066 Posted: 31/07/2006 17:37

If there is anyone suffering from panic attacks or agoraphobia then I would love to hear from them. I am researching a TV documentary looking at anxiety disorders and their treatment. You can get me at hughdrumm@eircom .net

Andy Posted: 31/07/2006 18:43

S sorry to say but this is all part of it, at times you feel as though you are going insane. I am a fellow sufferer,and I spend my life anaylising everything. But try to remember it is your mind playing games with you, it cannot phyisicalally harm you. Try some deep breathing and catch yourself thinking and confront those thoughts, ask yourself is this how I want to feel,you will slowly learn to switch off the thoughts for a while. Most importantly S remember that you are a normal human being, and you a valued as much as anyone else. we suffer from an illness, we did not volenteer to be this way. Always hold your head up you have nothing to be ashamed of. take care and remember you are not alone.

j Posted: 01/08/2006 23:56

hi lisa how are you.are you telling me that you dont suffer from anxiety anymore after seeing your counsellor.if so why are you writing posts on this forum.in one of your old posts you said that you didnt think it was possible to be cured from anxiety.has the counsellor cured you from your anxiety.it is possible to be cured from anxiety.please dont dismiss the claire weekes method until you have tried it.ive tried counselling and it didnt work for me and i cant see it working for other people.in my opinion a method doesnt work unless it cures you.it will only help you cope with anxiety at the most.and i dont mean to disrespect the clinpsych when i say that.i am saying this for the benefit of the sufferers.good luck J

j Posted: 02/08/2006 00:08

hi andy how are ya.did you try ringing or emailing panic free.are they not returning your emails or telephone calls.J

Andy Posted: 02/08/2006 14:26

Hi J. look J i have not stopped emailing panicfree and they do not want to know. In a way they behave in a simelar way way to you, they do not want to hear any form of rejection. As far as I am concerned, they are a money making racket and nothing else. As for yourself j i think you shold go back over all your submissions to this site, put them all together, and then i think you will come to see that Claire weeks has done nothing for you except turn you into an angry iritable young man. What is it with you that you have to attack every opinion that differs from you. The way you put yourself accross does not seem to be coming from a happy person, no J it seems like severe anxiety to me.
Regards andy

Andy Posted: 02/08/2006 20:49

Hi J, it's been a while since I've been here.There are now two Andy's????I'd just like to say thank you. I am not fully recovered yet but im getting there because I found pancifree wroked for me. When I first spoke to them on the phone it was like I was being understood, for the first time.I wrote in my post that I hoped that I'd finally found what I was looking for and I most certainly have.I understand everything at last.I know why I am in this state of anxiety and what I have to do to recover and to stay recovered.Once again, thank you.

Anonymous Posted: 03/08/2006 12:47

For what it's worth, I suffered from panic and anxiety for about 15 years. Then I saw a good psychiatrist and a good CBT psychologist and I have been panic and anxiety free for over two years. I think I was lucky to get proper treatment, and I am very grateful to them. As to being cured, then I would have to say that I am. Who knows if I will feel anxiety again ? The important thing is I don't care or worry about that any more. That's what being healthy is like. My advice is to seek out good professionals - they do know what they're talking about; they deal with this stuff every day. People like me just get back to their lives, that's probably why you don't hear so many good reports. Hope springs eternal.

sue Posted: 03/08/2006 13:53

I am 41 and have been on seroxat for the last 6 years for social anxiety. it had a miraculous effect and has completely changed my life. i no longer blush 100s of times a day, i no longer shake, i no longer have to avoid people and situations or rely on alcohol to take away my fear. therapy was absolutely no use although i still go because i feel i should as I have always had very low self esteem. (I started CBT therapy when i was 27 and it did not help - i feel angry that i was not told then about seroxat). i have had breathing difficulties for many years and that is one thing seroxat has not helped with. i go for weeks struggling to breathe properly - have been told it's chronic hyperventilation but nothing seems to help, not even breathing exercises. has anyone out there a similar breathing problem - a couple of contributors mentioned it earlier. i would like to try coming off seroxat but am afraid to. i still have many bouts where i feel down and have a sense of futility, so am afraid of coming off seroxat and returning to the way i was before. i do get nervous sometimes now but just like a "normal" person would - before, it was like terror was imprinted on my nervous system. god bless whoever invented SSRIs!! good luck to all the contributors - it is so reassuring to know others have experienced the same as me, I really empathise and sympathise with you all. i feel like changing career and studying psychology just to research and help people with this specific problem!

Andy 1 Posted: 03/08/2006 14:07

J looks like there maybe 2 Andys now . So from here i wll be Andy 1. that is the andy who did not get his money back from panicfree, and the same Andy who offered you some serious advice yesterday

Lisa Posted: 03/08/2006 18:26

Hi J,
I'm very well thank you, but have been extremely busy so I couldn't post a message sooner!
Let me clarify, my posts. Firstly when I said I was cured I meant my social anxiety was cured. I no longer fear what others think, I go out alot and actually enjoy myself. Infact I organise alot of social events???????
In my first post I said you could never be cured of all anxiety. I am afraid of rats and heights? But everyone is afraid of something? surely, you agree with that or are you going to cut off your nose to spite you face to prove me wrong.
You also asked why I post messages? and more or less imply that I need help with social anxiety? Firstly, I have possibly posted a total 3 messages in 3 months, however you on the otherhand have posted well over 100 messages????????
I, by chance came across the discussions while looking into eczema and dermatitis.
To be honest I was amazed by all the people suffering from social anxiety and felt very sympathetic to them having travelled the same path. I wanted to tell the people what worked for me. Like you, I am entitled to do that. You are entitled to your opinions, as am I. I suppose what bothers me is that you totally dimiss therapy with professionals.( I accept it didn't work for you, but it did for me and others)I don't disregard Dr Weekes method, I don't need it, because another method worked for me. I am not singling you out! As with Sue's suggestion, I don't think it will work for everyone but it has worked for some people. If people need medication thats fine but medication alone won't cure anxiety it will just take the edge of things, and should be done in conjunction with cbt.
Lisa

Michelle Posted: 03/08/2006 22:46

To Jay, you have said that I am only coping, but what else is there to do? Everyone of you seems to be managing very badly. We do suffer no doubt, and by now we know there is no definite cure, so all I can say is think positivily each day, and remember that: However long the day, evening comes at last!

j Posted: 04/08/2006 18:02

hi michelle you say that there is no cure.but the reason why i get so out of hand so to speak in my posts by disregarding other methods etc is because there is a cure for anxiety.thats what im trying to tell you people.im fully recovered , im cured.the claire weekes method will cure you please dont disregard it until youve tried it.michelle email me at noothmay@hotmail.com.

Will S Posted: 05/08/2006 00:47

Hello All. I have read with interest this thread and the references to David Johnson at panicfree.co.nz I bought David's program 4 months ago and have had very positive expriences with it. Whilst I believe that J's advice is well intentioned, his delivery may be a bit mis-guided. However only through eagerness to help others if his experiences with David's program are similar to mine.
If anyone has doubts about my authenticity, I invite you to view my blog which charts my experiences with David's program so far and make up your own minds.
www.willstarritt.blogspot.com
Thanks, Will

Norman (NCF48413) Posted: 06/08/2006 12:11

Re Anxiety. CBT and other counselling approaches can be very effective in dealing with anxiety. the tools of CBT are the minimum someone whould learn as they are practical and efffective. Burns: feeling good handbook is an excellent resource on CBT and anxiety. visit http://www.psychotherapy-ireland.com/index.cfm/loc/97/pt/13.htm for list of accredited therapists in your area. from norman warden

shaky Posted: 08/08/2006 02:22

J, thank you so much for you comment on shakiness an jelly legs, i started suffering from these symptoms last yr and have since been put on citalopram. This has eased the symptoms dranatically but I am no means cured has anyone had success of these symptoms by alternative means or otherwise as I don't want to reamin on the drugslongterm

J Posted: 08/08/2006 15:20

Hi Shaky the reason that your legs shake or go weak is quite simple.when you panic and hyperventilate the blood vessels in your legs widen meaning more oxygen is carried too your leg muscles causing them to go weak.Non-anxiety sufferers may get jelly legs if they suddenly became very excited.For eg if they just won the lottery.

J Posted: 08/08/2006 15:30

I'd like to briefly discuss the role of the nervous system in anxiety.As I've said before the nervous system is responsible for controlling your heart beat, is responsible for a churning stomach, and general nervousness.The nervous system responds to your mood.Moods such as fear and frustration cause your nervous system to become overactive ie. your heart races etc.Anxiety sufferers hearts may race constantly and they may constantly be afraid of this.And of course the mood of fear causes their heart to beat even faster or to sustain it beating fast.Its important to be told why your heart etc is beating fast.So your bewilderment and fear is removed.

J Posted: 08/08/2006 15:35

Thoughts play a big role in sustaining a person in a state of anxiety.But it is not the specific thoughts that are important.It is the emotional reaction which these thoughts bring.As they cause the emotion of fear.Which arouses their nervous system.The thoughts themselves are harmless its just the emotion that is the problem.Thoughts can not hurt you.

J Posted: 08/08/2006 15:46

I think that perhaps I have been too forward or dogmatic in my posts although I cant help but feel strongly about the Claire Weekes method.
I don't mind spending 5 or 10 minutes writing these posts.I believe they can make a real difference I wouldn't write them otherwise.But from now on I promise I will stop disregarding other methods in particular the form of CBT used by clinical psychologists.Although I disagree with them I have no right to insult the people who practise them.

LifeHandle Posted: 08/08/2006 23:15

When J talks about the nervous system, my understanding is that he is actually talking about the autonomic nervous system which in layman's terms is also called our stress mechanism.
One of the problems of our massive and highly intelligent brains is their huge capacity to pattern match. As such when we face any sort of threat even threats to our self esteem or economic wellbeing, we react as though we are being physically attacked and the body configures itself for fight or flight.
When I teach stress management it is very noticable how relieved people are to realise that they are actually designed to take this sort of reaction, and a big part of what they have to learn to do is cognitively realise that they are not being physically threatened.
Simple stress management exercises such as Deep Muscle Relaxation or the Quieting Reflex (both of which use abdominal breathing) will calm the mind and body by invoking the para-sympathetic nervous system. When this happens, a hormones are released which bring the pulse and breathing back to normal.
These are simple to learn and a good stress management course that steers clear of the mysterious will help.

LifeHandle Posted: 08/08/2006 23:16

Can Clin Psych recommend a good CBT course.
I recently applied for the Trinity one, but was unsuccessful.
As well as delivering stress management training, I would also like to give cognitive therapy.

Clin Psych Posted: 09/08/2006 12:54

Hi LifeHandle, there is not a huge amount of CBT training courses available out there as stand alone training packages. There is a a new one however starting in UCD that is specifially designed for working with children and adolescents, and alot of the skills learned would easily transfer to adult work. Here's a link to accredited CBT courses:
http://www.babcp.org.uk/training/cbtcourses.htm

J Posted: 09/08/2006 14:39

I'd like to make an apology to the Clinpsych and Andy.I'm after reading some of my past posts and I've realised that I have been very disrespectful to the two of you.No matter what method you use the main thing is that the sufferer benefits.

J Posted: 09/08/2006 15:14

Hi LifeHandle, coming from the Claire Weekes perspective the involuntary or autonomic nervous system is of vital importance in respect to anxiety.The involuntary nervous system is made up of sympathetic and parasympathetic nerves.Usually they balance each other out.But when a person experiences moods such as anger and fear etc. the sympathetic nerves dominate the parasympathetic nerves causing your heart to beat fast etc.When anxiety sufferers experience nervous sensations such as palpitations or a churning stomach.They don't understand why they are experiencing such sensations and they become frightened and experience the mood of fear and maybe anger which causes their heart to continue palpitating and their stomach churning etc.They are caught in a cycle of fear adrenaline fear.In my experience, this method shows you how to break the cycle.First by explaing how and why you experience these panicky physical feelings.Then you must accept the feelings by not tensing against them in other words by sagging your shoulders arms and shoulders and tummy muscles.Next you let the feeling of floating come over you.Physically and mentally try to float.Mentally floating helps you put your mind into neutral, so you stop adding to the panic by thnking panicky thoughts.And finally you have to let time pass, as the feelings cant go away straight away.When you practise doing this over time your attitude towards your panicky sensations will change and you stop being afraid of them.So you no longer have the mood of fear towards them.

LifeHandle Posted: 09/08/2006 17:57

Hello J
While Dr Clare Weekes may well have designed a good course, one of the major problems with this type of packaged approach (irresspective of its underlying quality) is that people buy the book, and then never do the exercises.
In the course I run, people actually get to practice the techniques in the class. They also have to start their stress management plan in front of me
Further to this, I then email them one or twice over the next month asking for progress they are making, REMINDING them constantly that unless they actually DO the exercises, they won't get the benefit.
Claire Weeks material may be as good as you say. However the sad fact of the matter is that the book or CD approach doesn't invoke the necessary behavioural change in most purchasers to make the difference needed.
Recently I have been asking clients if I can contact them in 6 months time to see if the changes stuck and made a difference. It will be very interesting to see what the results are.

J Posted: 10/08/2006 15:52

Hi LifeHandle I think the major problem with Claire Weekes books is that they all contain additional info which is needed for you to benefit the most.Meaning you will have to buy at least 3 books.Even then it is hard to put all the info together to make sense out of it.Also anxiety sufferers suffer from mental fatigue ie. their thoughts are foggy and they find it difficult to concentrate.The way the Claire Weekes method works is that you dont understand the method completely until you have recovered.One of the benefits of the website Ive beed suggesting is that you can ring them up and speak to them about the programme and you progress.

Crybaby Posted: 12/08/2006 04:32

I'v always liked the idea of allowing the mind to drift away. I do this a lot with music and find it very calming. However, I know that thoughts can't harm you but I have two drifting thoughts that occur on a regular basis. I am wondering why they keep coming up.
In the first one I am sitting on a very high wall(this actually happened when I was young) and someone comes up behind me and pretends to push me off. This gives me an awful fright and I can see myself falling and smashing into smithereens. Each time it comes up I try to change it by pretending that there is a trampoline below me and I get saved or that I can fly and miss the ground ect.
The second one is only happening lately. It doesn't give me a fright but I get a feeling of frustration. I'm in a prison cell and the door is open. There are four of me inside. On the right-hand side near the door I am very busy, in and out of the cell door doing loads of work. On the right-hand side near the corner I am sitting down studying mad. On the left-hand side near the door I am standing observing everything that is going on but in the left-hand corner I am crouched on the floor crying all the time. Each of the three try to get me up off the floor but it's no good. I am rooted to that spot. Then other people walk into the cell and try the same but they can't either. I stay huddled in a ball and won't eat for anyone. Does anyone know what this could mean?

Clin Psych Posted: 12/08/2006 16:00

Hi Crybaby, I dont do analysis as often as I would do other forms of assessment or therapy such as CBT but there was too much in your post to ignore!
I suppose the first thing that strikes me is your choice of name. It gives the impression of someone who doesnt value their own perspective on their difficulties. Someone who says to themselves and others, yes I have problems but if I talk about them then Im only a cry baby.
In relation to the first dream what strikes me is a sense that you feel that you are up there on a pedastal to be judged and judged negatively by others. You try to think about how you can stop yourself being put down by others, but no matter what you try you perceive yourself ending up being put down anyway.
I think this theme is also reflected in your second dream. The prison cell again is possibly the social isolation that you place on yourself, with the open door reflecting the odd social opportunity or your potential.
The different versions of you in the cell probably reflect the different aspects of your personality, as we all have different aspects to our own personality. What is interesting in your description is that you disregard the positive elements of your personality, the observer, the working hard part, the studing hard part, and place all the emphasis on the emotionally vulnerable and stuck aspect of your personality. This you think is more obvious to those who meet you and that they cant see and even if do, dont regard the other positive aspects of yourself.
If I was to hazzard a guess I would say that you experience feelings of depression and low self esteem at times. You dont value yourself and feel vulnerable to being judged by others. You dont see your work as worthwhile or recognised by others. There are many many different possible interpretations for what you are thinking but this is what is coming out for me, so I hope it helps in some way.

Crybaby Posted: 13/08/2006 00:54

Hi,Clin Psyche, God you really know your stuff! That was hugely interesting!
You were 100% accurate in why I picked that name. The last thing I would ever show anybody is myself crying. That to me is an ultimate shame and I have often been accused of being cold and uncaring. What people do not realise is that I have to be on my own to cry and so I would either be in the bathroom or I would go for a walk. I feel great compassion for other people who cry but I can't feel it for myself until I am alone.
I never talk about my problems with anyone because I cannot express myself very well and I don't want to appear weak. People see me mostly as a problem solver as well as someone who can solve their own. They think I am superconfident but I know that I am not. In fact many a time I wish that there was someone out there who would be there just for me for a change.
In the wall scenario, I believe that I have made some very bad mistakes in my life or judged some situations badly. I am wary now and hold myself back more in case the I mess up again so in effect I am keeping myself down.
I see the prison cell one a little differently though. I did find the other three quite interesting at the start but it's as though I cannot ignore the one in the corner. It seems as though that me is trying to tell me something because it keeps looking up at me with these pityful painful eyes. The me that is observing appears to be annoyed at times that no-one can do anything but the other two just look over and shrug. Sometimes the other people who walk into the room give out to the me on the floor, other times they are kind but no matter what happens there is no budge what-so-ever.
Maybe the person that goes up to the bathroom or for the walk needs to be seen in public. If that is the case there is no way will I ever cry in front of someone not even in front of my children.
You are also 100% right about my work. I would class myself as an extremely hard worker but no-one recognises it at all. But I have become used to that and carry on regardless. However I would prefer to have a different job then the one I am in. Certainly one where I would be recognised.
You also said that there are many interpretations to this but I don't think there is. I thought your accuracy on that was super, very insightful and very helpful.

mak Posted: 13/08/2006 19:47

Hi
Two years ago I had a small passing stroke. The worst part of it was the feelings that accompanied it-fear, internal tremor and a feeling of impending death and doom. I have been assessed by a psychiatrist and psychologist who said that it must be organic i e something wrong physically. Well, have been sent on a rollercoaster since. As well as varying degrees of terrifying panic attacks I have been scanned a few times over. I have tumours, one of them is active then bang no tumours. Every time I go to a specialist I get a different scenario and when they run out of avenues, they revert to simple anxiety disorder then change their minds again when they finally read my notes and see that my previous assessments came up with a cause in the physical realm. But two years on, I simply do not know what or who to trust. I just want my life back. I am seriously thinking of finding a specialist (endocrine, which is deemed to be my problem) centre in Europe to try to bring this to an end of some sort. Anybody out there got these attacks with thyroid, parathyroid or adrenal problems? would love to hear. P.S Am on Xanax for the attacks.

Lilybarlean Posted: 14/08/2006 12:54

My 77 year old mother has been taking a 7.5 dose of Tranxene for the past 30 years! It has now been discontinued and my mother is experiencing panic attacks and anxiety. She is unwilling to change to a stronger alternative. Is there any other low dose anti-anxiety drug on the market. Her doctor says that because the dose was so low it shouldn't make any difference if she stops taking them but she's experiencing otherwise.

Paul Posted: 17/08/2006 17:45

I have read J posts and i do agree that anxiety/depression comes down to an overactive nervous system which needs healing.I for instance have suffered for seven years with anxiety and depression taking valium and several SSRI's.Recently i have done Cranio Sacral therapy which has taken my body out of flight and fight but my brain still gets overactive under stress.From my research that is down to an overactive HPA axis in the brain.I am told new drugs in the future will target the HPA axis but in the meantime i need to do meditation,stress management to manage my anxiety.

sam Posted: 18/08/2006 11:48

Hi Lillybarlean,
Im no expert on this but I would think after your mother taking medication for 30 yrs, there's bound to be some withdrawl symptoms no matter how slowly she weaned off them.
I was on lexapro for around 18mths and it helped me and can be taken at quite a low dose. But when I came off it, I weaned myself slowly but still had withdrawl symptoms, as well as increased anxiety and panic attacks. That was my experience anyway so hope it will be of some help.
Good luck

DON Posted: 24/08/2006 13:12

I SOMETIMES FEEL I AM GOING TO DIE OR FEEL A BIT DIZZY BUT I AM NOT DIZZY IF THAT MAKES ANY SENSE OR I AM IN A SUPPERMARKET AND IT IS LIKE IT IS CLOSEING IN ON ME. I HAVE BEEN VERY GOOD THE LAST YEAR BUT I FEEL IT CREEPING BACK IN . I ALSO HAVE A TWIN SISTER SHE GETS THE SAME FEELINGS

Anonymous Posted: 24/08/2006 14:14

I have suffered from panic attacks for the last 10 years and tried counciling, prescription drugs all of which didn't work. Over the last year it has mainifested itself into a constant state of anxiety.... last night I went to get some reflexology done.... Oh my god such relief I got from it.. I went home... no anxiety... no stress... had an amazing sleep. I used to think it was a load of codology... Yeah right rubbing your feet in certain places will make you better... but if yesterday is anything to go by... I'll defo be doing it again...

ancaman Posted: 21/09/2006 19:10

hello,
i am the father of a twenty one year old young man who is greatly restricred in his life by severe anxiety and also panic .attacks. he doesnt want to use medication because of issues relating to his sister. i cannot say i disagree with him on the matter of medication.he relly has a bad thing about them and this wasnt helped by the manner of a psychiatrist he attended. looking through the contributions on this site has been very encouraging to see bravery in the face of adversity, i compliment you all on your efforts in seeking help and those who offer a helping hand to others..if anyone has any advice in what i can do to help my son i would be very grateful ,reading this site has given me renewed hope .thank you all and i wish you all well

j Posted: 22/09/2006 12:45

Hi ancaman you should check out these sites.www.panicfree.co.nz and www.nomorepanic.co.uk

ancaman Posted: 22/09/2006 14:41

thank you j will do

Davey B Posted: 01/11/2006 12:56

Hi, I have severly suffered from Stress for the last 3 years, these have develped into Pani Attacks and now the newest feelling is Fear. I constanlty fear the worst, i think im going to die with the slightest pain. Thishappens every day and is very very tiring. I have a very good sales job and love it. Symptoms are : ringing in my ears, pains in my left arm, dizziness. I know myself that when im out socialising, everything dissapears, its only when i thin about it. Im a very very outgoing and happy person and hiding this is killing me. Ive seen my GP and a counciller and it has helped but not cured. Can anyone help or advise me please?
Dave.

mary (BGA51955) Posted: 03/11/2006 16:19

Check your pill, they often cause mood disorders and anxiety and this:
Dear All,
I think everybody should be made aware of this. Especially when you consider that you go to the physician to make you feel better. People are being mis-informed about the advantages of these drugs.
The menopause only goes on for a few years and then it is over, most women who are on HRT do not know when to stop and many have developed horrible menstrual irregularities.
I have never been informed that the pill is a potent carcinogen and none of my girlfriends have either. These drugs should all contain a warning like they have on cigarette packets.
Proof of what I have written can be found by following this link:
http://www.omsoul.com/who-pill-bc.php
Also wikipedia .org has a page that describes the other drugs that are in Group 1, Chromium IV and tobacco are in there along with Radium?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_IARC_Group_1_carcinogens
What a laugh bring out an injection to prevent against cervical cancer when these cause it, an old snake oil sales man adage, sell them the cause then sell them the cure.

Bonnie Posted: 21/11/2006 06:29

I did not notice when I was younger working and going to school and raising my family that I had any significant anxiety problem. I was probably too busy to realize it. Later in life when I stopped work and such to devote myself to my family I notice that I started have some disturbing intrusive thoughts which lead to anxiety attacks. Negative experiences with members of my church misunderstanding these "episodes" lead to more anxiety attacks which lead to more intrusive thoughts which caused me to not want to be around people that I perceived were judging me, mostly church people (avoidance compulsion). I have a strong faith which helps me realize I am not my thoughts, but I can't help but feel guilt because I can't control them. I tried to go back to work but it interferred to such an extent that I eventually had to quit until I could get it under control. It seems as if I will never get my life back, but my mind and heart tell me differently. How can you develop this disorder later in life and be able to control it instead of it controlling you!

drew Posted: 21/12/2006 12:26

Hello all, i am looking for professional advice on how to come off medication.I am on 40mg of cipramil and 50 mg of seroquel and feel like a zombie at times. I am no longer depressed that I am sure of, but my GP retired 5 months ago and has not been replaced so far. I am very confident that I am ready to take this line of action but want to be careful that I do it properly.
Drew

nnat Posted: 19/01/2007 20:29

hi guys, does anyone know of a reputable hypnotherapist (preferably with psychology qualification) in Cork or if there are any CBT services in the same area. Really want to try and do something about my anxiety and depression, its ruining my life at the moment, but don't really know where to start with alternative treatment and don't want to go on meds again....thanks guys

nnat Posted: 20/01/2007 21:52

hi again, just wanted to add, clinpsych - your posts are really interesting and helpful to read. and drew, from my experience its worthwhile coming off the meds when yr ready and if you're careful - i was on cipramal for a while, and although can honestly say they were wonderful because i just didnt care, but i didnt feel like myself most of the time and there were some side effects. the idea of taken pills for the rest of my life was scary (not too mention expensive...). really want to try some alternative therapies. i'm not sure if its genetic, chemical or mental but i do think negative and destructive thinking plays a big part in it and it will take a long time to unlearn those patterns.
p.s. has anyone heard of the research done on clinically depressed patients using pulses (electrical, it think) to stimulate certain parts of the brain. i think i read about it in australia and the results were supposed to really dramatic...just interested, not advocating shock therapy....

Anonymous Posted: 29/01/2007 11:23

Anyone know of a good homeopath in south dublin area? The wanting to hide piece of the message above is exactly me..

Anonymous Posted: 31/01/2007 15:46

I don't know what to do anymore. Anxiety is taking over every aspect of my life.
My first experience of it in recent years was last april, but at the time I was taking several types of drugs at a party. Somebody brought up a conversation about children being molested & that was it. On came a really severe anxiety attack that lasted almost two days.
I don't take drugs anymore, I barely socialise, I lost my job as my manager told everyone that I was getting panick attacks & they treated me like a freak & used to try set them off on purpose. My confidence is gone.
I can't talk about sex, looks, take or give a compliment about anything, listen to others talking about sex, looks, compliments, can't listen to music or watch t.v, can't maintain eye contact or have any form of physical contact, even a handshake without setting off an attack.
I used to be so happy & sociable & positive, i miss the old me. Now I'm paranoid, get severe blushing all the time, hallucinate, my vision goes, I hear screaming at night. I get them around all my family & all my friends but in particular around the opposite sex. They are happening about 3 times a day & sometimes for much longer periods of time than the 'normal 10 minues' that i keep reading about. I'm grumpy, unmotivated & cynical.
I'm scared because in the last 2 months depression has kicked in. Its getting worse everyday & I feel like i'm going to loose the remainder of my mind. I'm beginning to hate myself & my own company. I thought I had hit rock bottom months ago but it feels like I'm just sinking deeper all the time.
I have had depression and anxiety several times during my life but never simultainiously. I can't remember how I pulled myself through before.
I've tried so many things, I do yoga religously, jog 5 times a week, read self help & motivational books, always putting the techniques into practice, I medidate, chant, swim, eat a healthy diet, go to self help groups & try really hard to get to sleep even though it is almost impossible. My CBT will be starting soon. I'm so tired of it all.

carol Posted: 07/02/2007 23:13

hi there this is in response to the last message i feel for you i really do. I have only starting suffering panic and anxiety attacks in the last 2 months but already I have had enough. I have resisted pills except for the odd xanax to get me through.
But am losing faith. I see you are starting CBT soon...Me too ! This saturday in fact. I am so looking forward to sinking my teeth into something in order to help myself as not sure how much longer i can cope. I too feel in fear of it affecting my job although my boss has been very understanding. But I can't get through one full day without feeling sick, panicky, anxious, teary and like I just want to run out of the place.
People are talking to me and I feel zoned out to the whole thing or like I just want to tell them to shut up.
I have my own theory about why this is happening (issues with family) but I suppose thats for cognitive therapist to uncover...
Lets hope he does as this is ruining my life at moment

marydoll Posted: 13/02/2007 16:30

can anyone help me . i am 52 i try and walk a lot go out every morn for twenty min walk .i noticed i was get a bad pain down front of legs but passed .this morn i was just half way down the road and i couldent walk it was like trying to lift something heavy on front of my legs i had to turn back i was hardly able to walk home again . i am do the same walk for months can any one help .

david (TBI37250) Posted: 19/02/2007 17:53

Hi there,
This message is to Carol and to the annonymous person above her who had taken drugs and is losing control. I am 32 years of age and stress came into my life 3 years ago because of my job. anxiety is now here and I have never taken medication because I am determined to to control it and not let it control me. It does work, I am a very outgoing person and I will not let it beat me. I do have little ways but it all depends on who you are and your situation. You are not alone though and if you want to have a chat about it, feel free to mail me at dublindavey@hotmail.com. Oh and Carol, what is CBT????
Dave.

c Posted: 20/02/2007 16:19

Hi
Does anyone know how to control nerves pre interview or public places.I get very nervous and feel panick attacks coming on in public places,like interviews, group discussions etc, I literally be shaking inside and feel I may be stammering, and not speaking properly, would medication help?,I havnt been to my GP yet. The funny thing is ,it doesnt happen always but can suddenly just come upon me in the middle of speaking, Im starting to now avoid these situations where i get palpations etc.

david (TBI37250) Posted: 21/02/2007 11:23

Hi C.
It's to do with your way of thinking, well that's what I think anyway. Usually panic comes from dread or negative thinking, think positive, relax and breath properly.
I hope this helps.
Dave.

Clin Psych Posted: 27/02/2007 21:30

Hi all, havent been around here in a while, too busy with work!! Anway, just thought Id let you know that I noticed on the Social Anxiety Ireland webpage that they have details of some new social anxiety groups running and proposed to run about the country. Have a look.

shooter Posted: 04/03/2007 21:01

hi my name is andy . i live in dublin 12 . i was currently diaganosed with chronic anxiety and depression . i knew for along time that i was not feeling well , but always put problem down to every other illness under the sun . is only in the last 6 months i have begun to face my problem . my doctor had me on lexapro , then lustral , just made me so much worse , went to a counsellor for 3 weeks but it got to the stage it was to much of an effort for me . i have axed my medication , just taking some b complex , magnesium and calcium tablets . i think that i have social anxiety but i am not sure , just not right talking to people , constantly breathless , feelings of weakness , negative about everything , have recently gave up 2 jobs , rented out with my home and split from my girlfriend . just could not cope so i am taking some time out . i really am trying hard to get over this but am finding it hard . grateful for any help

Brian (RUI49016) Posted: 23/03/2007 13:55

Hi,
My name is Brian and i have been suffering from anxiety and depression for a year or so. I feel sometimes like i am losing my mind because of worry and unpleasent thoughts. I cant watch gruesome stuff on the news or T.V anymore for fear of it stickinIi have done for a while but i still dont feel "normal" yet. I am seeimg a c b t counsellor and that has helped. I found my GP was only wanting to prescribe anti-depessants and xanax which i didnt find made any difference for me. One thing that has helped me a lot is a book by Claire Weeks", called "Essential Help For Your Nerves". Its helps me put things in perspective and explains how panic and fear work in people and practical ways of reducing their affect on you. I think this discussion page is a good idea, somewhere people can be honest about what they are going through. I am trying to get back into training or education at the moment but i am finding my confidence can hit rock bottom again very quickly and i feel depressed, anxious and apathy again. I feel like i am back to square one. I was wondering if anyone has any advice on how to ease back into the things.

not the norm Posted: 03/04/2007 20:34

I have other mental health conditions but anxiety is the ruler. Anxiety affects me in all cases when I try to read, watch tv, talk to someone,or even when I try to learn something. It blocks my ability to think and concentrate. I have read books and receive counceling. I have been told to do deep breathing excersises and some meditation techniques.
What I have found to help is a combination of things; talking, praying, reading the scriptures but even now as I am writing this I am having an anxiety attack. Whats needed is alot of positve influences in ones life and the question is how to find those positive influences. I started off with participation in church activities, positve affirmations and attend positve groups. Stay away from negative things.
Medications do help. I use to take xanax but I realized I was taking it too often now I take klonopin. Klonopin does add relief but I say to myself: do I really want to rely on meds for this condition all the time. So what do I do, I try and keep my mind occupied by reviewing my old college books, take intrest in things I normally would not and try to relax.

bigkev Posted: 08/04/2007 11:11

Anxity comes about for me by low self asteem . Get yourself physiced up that you are not the same as the other . you are better In fact you are you and individael You must set youself simple goal and targets and acheive those soon you will see a new you a you that annot understant yhe old you
Sit down and identify situations that make your anxiety worse and confront them one by one keep a diary off how you are coping and share with others your ideas schemes and palns for the future
I end by saying you are a person do not let others force you into anxiety nor panic attacks .
Finally God bless and keep your chin up
Big Kev
P.S. it works fro me

Anne (ZSM52965) Posted: 12/04/2007 23:11

Looking at some of the responses to the original query is slightly disconcerting i.e. magnesium deficiency ... cured in two weeks etc. The heart of the problem is lack of confidence, low self esteem, unstable upbringing or some factor that has triggered the anxiety. This may sound like a cliche but the answer is within yourself, find a good therapist and talk through your problems. You might eventually start to accept your shyness as part of your character; that blushing actually is not a negative thing and shows your sensitivity; that you can actually rid yourself of anxiety. However, you need to understand the root of it before you can address it.

lisa Posted: 19/04/2007 12:42

can anyone help . MY NAME IS LISA AND IV BEEN SUFFERING FROM ANXIETY FOR ALMOST TWO YEARS NOW . IV HAD ENOUGH. I WANNA GET HELP BUT I REALLY DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO. IM AFRAID IF I GO TO THE DOCTOR THEY WILL TELL ME ITS NOT ANXIETY AND SOMETHING ELSE AND I WILL WALWAYS BE LIKE THIS . IM ONLY 20 AND IT REALLY EFFECTS ME

Kathleen (kathnyc) Posted: 19/04/2007 21:51

hi lisa, i totally understand whereyou arecoming. i first started suffering from anxiety and panicattacks when i was 24, at first i didnt understandwhat was happening to me, and even when i did understand that it was anxiety and panic attacks i felt helpless and out of control. when i went to the doctor he prescribed paxil (also known as seroxat), which is a highly contoversial drug which is now widely believed to be more dangerous to those of us who suffer from this, and he gave me no advice on how to address the issues that caused these feelings in the first place. i realised that going to the doctor did not solve my problem,drugs do not work if the issues are not addressed, the feelings will remain. i decided to help myself, and i went out and bought lots of literature on the subject and learned that you can combat these feelings yourself, if you are willing to face the issues. there are thingsthat you can do dispel anxiety when it arises, breathing exercises are very important, relaxation techniques,positive self talk is a major part of helping yourself to cambat these feelings also, for example tell yourself, it is only anxiety and it will pass, it will not hurt you even if it is unpleasant, it always passes. positive self talk is something you can work on even when you dont feel anxious, which will have a beneficial effect on your daily life. all of this information and more is available to you to help. the act oftaking charge and deciding to help yourself alone is very empowering also, knowing that you are helping yourself step by step is very positive. when anxiety and panic attacks first affected me i didnt know where to turn for real help, i was almost afraid to leave the house in fear of having a panic attack in public, but i decided to do something about it, and little by little with knowledge and a self help program i eventually overcame the panic attacks, and can now reduce anxiety in stressful situations. you are young so dont let this run your life, dont go through years of this, theres lots you can do to help yourself.

linedrawer Posted: 19/04/2007 22:27

Hi Lisa, my heart goes out to you. Im in the same boat and have been going through a rough time for the last 8 weeks. Anxiety, panic attacks and depression often come together although not always. I' ve beeb on cipramil which is an anti-deppressant for the last 7 weeks. I was also prescribed xanex to get me through the first few weeks when the anxiety got bad. In the first few weeks I had to take xanex every 5 hours until the anti-deppressants kicked in. Modern anti-deppressants can be very good for anxiety or panic attacks and can also prevent further episodes. Im slowly, very slowly getting better. Some days are still horrific. Im pretty hopeful that the meds work though 'cause i've been here before and have come through the other side. Some dont agree with medication, but I find that it works and have had no trouble coming off them when i am better again. Please go to your doctor to sort this out. He or she wont be shocked. ! in every 4 people suffer with anxiety/deppression so its very common.

drew Posted: 22/04/2007 13:08

Can anyone explain to me in very simple and easy to understand terms what exactly disassosiation means. Over the past 5 months I have become numb to everything, I cannot focus on a thing, tv,reading, listening,coversation,eating, unemotional,unshockable,uncaring, making a phone call, all these things are now alien to me. I am on 40mg of Cipramil daily, could they be causing the numbness. The weird thing is that i dont feel as depressed as i used to be, just permentally numb
Drew

Softie Posted: 23/04/2007 15:34

I am a recovering sufferer from panic disorder with agoraphobia. A few years ago there was a group called OANDA (Out and About Association) based in Clontarf, who specialised in providing assistance for acute anxiety sufferers. They are still in the phone book, but phoning them only brings up an anonymous voicebox and they have no web page. I suspect they are moribund. Does anybody else know about this organisation?

andy (VBC61221) Posted: 23/04/2007 16:06

Softie, they are still in existence and operating, but are working from St Josephs@ St vincents Hospital on Richmond Rd while the premises in Clontarf are getting Renovated
Drew

Anonymous Posted: 26/04/2007 18:07

can anyone tell me what can help anxiety in the mornings
mine last for about an hour.

caro Posted: 03/06/2007 17:53

Hi i have just turned 29 and have suffered with severe anxiety attacks and chest pains and lung pains for over 3 yrs. I have visited so many doctors I am exhausted, I am taking some Lexapro for mild depression. Has anyone experienced these prolonged symptoms?

drew Posted: 06/06/2007 20:01

Caro, the chest and lung pain are all part of of anxiety and depression, I have experienced these symptoms for years, but find walking and talking to a trusted friend to be a great relief. Also perhaps asking your gp to try another anti-depressant. Good luck to you because I understand your suffering and you may be just exhausted worrying over it

linedrawer Posted: 06/06/2007 21:47

Hi Caro, My mum had symptoms like yours for almost ten years but she refused to believe they were caused by depression. She eventually went on anti-depressants. She is a changed woman now. Shes happy outgoing, all the things I missed when she was ill. It wont take that long for you to get better though. I really think you should be on stronger anti-depressants. Im actually on two different types at the moment having just come through almost four months of hell. Im on a low dosage of 2 anti-depressants because I have whats called resistant depression. It means that I did not respond to the first lot on their own. My doctor put me on a second one after about 6 weeks on one only and feeling bad still. You need to see a specialist (Psychiatrist) as he knows exactly what meds to give and how much of them. Your G.P. is alright for basic depression but you have it a long time now and its not shifting. You have an illness, please try and see a specialist. Your G.P. can refer you to one and tell them how long you have been ill and how bad. You are entitled to have a good happy life. Im just coming out the other side of depression now thank god. Im still worried about what the future brings but hopefully I'll be o.k.

Shanahie Posted: 17/06/2007 11:56

My wife has always struggled with anxiety and depression. Now she has run off with a married co worker leaving me and our four kids.
Can anyone tell me, could this drastic sudden life changing action be a symptom of her depression?

drew Posted: 17/06/2007 20:08

Shanahie, I think without a doubt her action is a direct result of her depression and anxiety. As a sufferer for 5 years now i have done lots of crazy things, like spending fortunes on things i never needed. She perhaps has found some comfort or distraction from the depression by moving out, but she will come round as it is only a short term cure for the terrible pain of depression. Hang in there friend and try to still love her because she is not trying to hurt you or the children, just running away from the manic hurt she cannot handle at the moment.

caro Posted: 18/06/2007 09:28

Thank you everyone for your help and advice,i will be asking for another anti depressant for sure..ive been on hols trying to relax a little,something i find so hard to do.

linedrawer Posted: 18/06/2007 16:21

HI Shanahie, Your wife is running away from the terror her anxiety is causing her not you and the kids. Ive often wanted to do the same myself. She has to be so afraid to do something like this. She is probably hoping to escape from her anxiety and depression by changing her whole life. This might work for a while but inevitably it will return unless she gets help.

noelle Posted: 18/06/2007 19:35

Hi all i am 37 yrs old with two small children,i have been very low in myself for the last 3 months and suffering with anxiety which has calmed down of late.
I went and had some blood tests done to rule out any other causes, the gp has recommend that i take seroxat if the bloods come back clear? i have researched this on the web and the results are not very encouraging. could anyone tell me or recommend an antidepressant that works well with little side effects, i occasionally take xnax although very rare. would really appreciate any comments been through this two yrs ago and do not think i could go through it again.

drew Posted: 19/06/2007 17:05

Noelle, i think you should discuss with your gp again, and explain your fears to him. There are so many different anti-depressants out there now, and it could be dangerous for you to take advice from a non professional. You mention that your anxiety has calmed down lately, so maybe try some relaxation cds, and make time for a rest of at least one hour everyday from your 2 children. I find going for walks help me a lot, and remember that you have been here before and recovered and will do so again. Talk to friends, use this site,get out of house,and stay ahead of this torment,take care.

linedrawer Posted: 19/06/2007 21:57

Hi Noelle. I like you have two small kids and am a stay-at-home mom. Sometimes it feels like you're the only person in the world feeling like this but I can assure you that you're not. To feel like you're going mad or losing your mind is probably one of the worse feelings in the world. I think you should go back to your G.P. and get another antidepressant. I've had Cipramil in the past. It's very good for anxiety, panic and also for depression. I had minor side effects with this medication but they were worth it to get better. I'm on prozac at the moment. They are also good. Seroxat has got a lot of bad press lately so if you're not comfortable taking these ask your doctor to prescribe you another. There are loads of different ones out there. Good luck. I will be thinking of you.

noelle Posted: 20/06/2007 09:43

drew thank u for your reply, i read that you are on cipramil my gp prescribed them to me 2 yrs ago i took them for 4 days and just felt that it heightened the anxiety even more so i stopped taking them. had a major hang up regards taking anti d meds back then. so i tried the vast majority of the alternative methods. i am now trying this cognitive method approach and it really makes a lot of sense but hard work. i feel now is the time to take anti d because i just can not go through this again yet i am so scared of taking them, you mentioned that you felt numb and a sense of detachment well i have had that from time to time and feel that it is part of our defense mechanism ? and i do not take meds just want to enjoy life and feel happy for a change. how are you now at this point and are you still taking your anti d?

drew Posted: 20/06/2007 16:54

Noelle,I suppose all of us using this site are waiting to enjoy life again.you are bound to get heightened anxiety for a few weeks after starting anti d but it will pass. I have also tried cognitive approach but found it very difficult to focus on it due to poor concentration. Do not be scared of taking them because they do help a lot and are not addictive. As for myself, well i am going through a very bad patch at the moment, but i will never give up trying to get better now matter how many dark days i have to go through. My medication was changed 2 weeks ago because of other health issues. I am now on Cymbalta 60mg daily, the side effects are awful for me,but everyone is different.I think that the fact you are using this site is proof enough that you can and will get better.so keep in there and get back in touch

class Posted: 21/06/2007 14:15

Over the last year i ahve found it hard to sleep and constantly felt under pressure to be getting things done all the time, i just never seem to be able to relax no matter what, I can't sit still. Is this anxiety?. I am a 23 year old primary school treacher.

Anne Posted: 21/06/2007 15:07

After reading all the different messages about how anxiety affects people - I would urge people to go and seek out a good psychotherapist/counsellor. I would recommend someone who uses an integrative method as in Cognitive Behavioural and Person Centred Approach, you can still do this even if you are medication. The thing is medication will take the edge of the feeling but what you need to do is understand where the anxiety is coming from and how you can manage it. and it can be managed I know this works I suffered from severe anxiety for years and tried medication and was lucky enough to find a really good therapist who allowed me to understand and helped me develop skills to manage my anxiety. Good Group therapy is also a real plus. Good luck to everyone who suffers with this.

drew Posted: 21/06/2007 18:24

Class, it seems like anxiety symptoms. Can i suggest that you take loads of time walking and exercising during your summer break, you have a stress related job probally with young children and this could cause anxiety in any one of us. Buy some relaxation cds also a book on anxiety, they are very essential help.

sammy Posted: 22/06/2007 17:21

hi all, for me this discussion had been very comforting. I am 23 yr old and i have suffered with anxiety for the past 12 years on and off. I believe it stems back to when my dad left. Like i said i suffer on and off but up to last year my life was free of this debilitating condition. Ever since however i have been diagnosed with mild depression and put on lexapro(i went off them a few months later when i felt better) i have been taking xanax since i was about fourteen (only when required), i have been to a homeopath and still im suffering. My family are all aware of my 'condition', but none know what to do to help and feel i should just get over it. I have a two and a half year old child and i want to be strong for him but i dont know how. Unfortunately i have very little patience for my energetic child and envy those other mums who seem to have it all under control. i intend to help myself but i wonder if i have the energy to do so...

Anne (annemb) Posted: 22/06/2007 20:43

Hi Sammy,
Just read your piece, and I just want to say to you, nobody has it all under control all the time it just seems that way. The best way to ensure you have good energy levels is to really take care of yourself, good supports and doing things you enjoy are essential. I believe that as children when any kind of a crisis happens particularly when a parent leaves for whatever reason it turns our world upside down and everyone in a family is trying to deal with their own bit around this. Often children are left with their anxieties because others around them are trying to cope with their own upsets, so managing anxieties particularly if you haven't experienced this as a child isn't easy. That's not said to blame anybody, it's just the way it can be sometimes. Learning to manage your anxieties can happen it just takes time, but it can be done.

Anonymous Posted: 06/07/2007 11:22

I'M CURED!
I suffered for years ... all the same symptoms and scenarios mentioned above. It came out of nowhere and stayed.
Eventually went to see a psych. He prescribed the anti-depressant Lexapro (10 or 15mg, I forget) which was fairly new at the time.
Im still weaning off it years later and it isn't especially cheap (about E50 a month I think) but it worked. My social anxiety is all but gone. The drugs help you break the cycle. I don't even think about getting worried when I'm heading into a situation that in the past would have scared the bejaysus out of me/made me sh*t myself (literally :S ).
Keep going to doctors until you find one that helps you.

j Posted: 10/07/2007 23:23

Hey Im an anxiety sufferer.I have tried all sorts to help me recover.And at last in the past year I have found a method which is indeed curing me.I am getting my confidence back and becoming happy again.Im sure that some of you have heard of this method its called the claire weekes method.For imformation go to http://www.drclaireweekes.co.uk/ .I have found a man who is a counsillor in her method.His site is http://www.healing-anxiety.com/ .All I can say to you sufferers is that this is working for me and I thoroughly believe that it can work for all of you.
John

Mags Posted: 20/07/2007 23:37

I suffer from severe anxiety and I have to take 1mg Ativan every morning to relax the severe tension in head. I just can't cope and would not be able to go any place. I don't know if it's anxiety or depression as I sometimes feel sick and not able to walk around town or go any place on my own. I could start out on a journey driving and half way I would just get this tension in my head sick feeling that I was not able to continue. When I would turn for home I would feel o.k again. Has anyone the same experience? I would love to hear from you or do you have a cure for same.

j Posted: 23/07/2007 12:17

Hi Mags,
You should give me an email my address is noothmay@hotmail.com

Anonymous Posted: 23/07/2007 15:25

I have gone through life thinking people do not like me. No matter what I do, this thought entered my head when I meet people. Any suggestions.

j Posted: 23/07/2007 19:21

Sorry excuse the lack of sense in my previous post .Mags I think that I can help you but there is too much information for me to write in a post.If you email me I can tell you in detail.Thanks, Jon

Kay Posted: 24/07/2007 11:07

Hi Mags, Sounds to me like you are having panic attacks. They are very frightening and almost suffocating. I have had them on and off for about 23 years now and they still frighten me. I always had this fear of going mad and being brought away, locked up and that would be the end of me. I recomend you read a book called "When panic attacks" by Aine Tubridy. I have read lots of books over the years but this one makes sense. Also I think you need an anti-depressant that also stops the anxiety. I am on Prozac 20mg a day and it does work. When you start new medication sometimes your symptoms can get worse for few weeks. But if you persevere the benefits will be great.

Clin Psych Posted: 24/07/2007 12:01

"I have gone through life thinking people do not like me. No matter what I do, this thought entered my head when I meet people. Any suggestions"
Hi anonymous, just a couple of observations. The first thing I would say is what evidence do you have that people don't like you? If you objectively look around you do people actively avoid you, and if you feel they do could there be an alternative explanation for their behaviour? You are experiencing a classic "thinking error" called Mind Reading. People who experience anxiety primarily have this difficulty, they believe that they know what someone else is thinking, I'll give you an example:
Social situation, pause in the conversation - you think "oh they must be thinking that I'm boring because I havent kept the conversation going" They must be thinking that I'm not an interesting person. Overall what we need to do to have relatively positive mental health is to learn to have balanced thinking, so for every negative thought that we have we need to practise thinking about what other positive or less negative thought could also explain the feeling or situation that we are in.
My concrete suggestion for when this thought enters your head is to objectively evaluate it. What objective evidence do I have that they dont like me? Am I trying to read their mind? I would also think about people liking you in general. Does everyone need to like you, is it realistic that everyone that you meet will like you? If you are thinking when you meet people that they dont like you then you are probably being quite introspective at the time, worrying and analysing your thoughts. While doing this you are probably not as responsive to the social situation that you are in are could come across as uninterested or aloof. Its kind of a self fulfilling prophecy, through constant worring about how we come across to other people we end up coming across in the way that we dont want to which reinforces our negative perception of ourselves.
I hope some of this has made sense.

Anonymous Posted: 24/07/2007 14:00

Many thanks for that. It certainly has made sense.
Regards,
Anonymous

j Posted: 24/07/2007 22:31

what you are experiencing is a panicky thought.panicky thoughts are not logical and sufferers dont decide to think them.they dont say to themselves ok now im going to think that these people i'm about to meet don't like me.these thoughts are thought subconsciously and that is why they scare you so much.they creep up on you and give you a fright.that is your problem you are scared of the thought.once you lose your fear of it it goes.

Kate Posted: 27/07/2007 23:40

To clinical Psych
I was just wondering would you know anything about twins, my identical twin sister and I are in our twenties and both have problems with each other ,we cause each other anxiety; we don't even have to open our mouths and we know what the other is thinking, We are very close in one way but she wants me to be perfect and to be honest I want the same for her and I know there is no such thing but that's the way is feels like, We both went into the same profession, and deal with other people's problems all the time etc but can't deal with this one.
I would be greatful if you could share any light on this, kind of a complex one

Clin Psych Posted: 29/07/2007 17:29

Hi Kate, I have worked with twins before, but in a wider familial sense. I am not sure how to respond to your post in specific terms, it leaves with me with a lot of questions. When you say you both want each other to be perfect, in what way do you mean? What kind of anxious thoughts do you provoke in each other?

Sue Posted: 30/07/2007 15:18

Hi everyone. I've just discovered this site & it's great to read others peoples fears & problems are just like my own. I've been taking Cipramil on & off for nearly 7 years now for anxiety attacks & have been through varying ups & downs during that time even to the point of having to give up my job. I'm on a bit of a downward curve at the moment as I had been doing great & started to come off the tablets but each time I try things start to go out of control again.
I have been to see a cognitive therapy therapist & she was excellent but unfortunately everything she taught me hasn't seemed to have sunk in as at times like this my negative thoughts surface & my self esteem seems to wane.
I have a book called 'Feel the fear & do it anyhow' which I find very helpful & I also got one from the library before, a red cover just called 'Panic' I think, that too was pretty good as the author really knew all about the exact feeling that you get.
For anyone out there who feels disillusioned please hang in there as I know I have recovered before so can do it again. We can all help each other & don't keep it to yourself as you'll need all the support & help you can get.

Sue Posted: 02/08/2007 14:42

Has anyone heard of or tried the Linden Method? I have read the website & it all seems too good to be true.

Kay Posted: 03/08/2007 20:46

Hi Sue. I have downloaded the Linden method at cost of around 70 dollars. It was o.k. I read it and re-read it and parts of it were helpful. The best book I would reccommend is "when panic attacks" by Aine Tubridy. It makes complete sense and the author is Irish so she speaks like we speak when having a coversation. The best bit for me in her book is when she says that panic attacks are not a sign of mental illness now or in the future. They are completely different to a mental illness. This was great news to me because for years I have been afraid of impending insanity and being carted away somewhere. Her book goes on to explain that panic attacks are actually a physical illness. The book comes with a C.D. which is good for a quick fix. Try it you could find it very helpful.

leigha Posted: 04/08/2007 12:15

can anyone help . i hve had anxiety for the past two years now and im now only 20. i always feel like im going to go insane and have anxiety forever.its really effecting me and im seeing a psychotherapist but i still see no changes. i have read books on it too but i dont really think they work . can anyone help please

Rascal77 Posted: 07/08/2007 12:15

Hi There.
I have been suffering with CONSTANT ANXIETY for just over 12 months. I've had a few bad panic attacks, but now manage to keep them under control if one does strike. But the real thing that bothers me is the chest pains, palps/flutters in chest and a strange feeling of loss of breath now and again. I am constantly focused on my heart, always thinking I'm gunna have a heart attack or stroke or something! I'm only 30, and a mother of 3 young kids. Does anyone else suffer from these symptoms, I would love to hear from you.
Thanks.

Kay Posted: 11/08/2007 12:23

Hi Kay here again. Has anybody been for therapy or counselling? I have been making great progress in getting better from anxiety and in the last few days I have been feeling anxious again. Stuff has been coming up in therapy which is pretty horific. This happened when I was a child. I burried stuff in the back of my mind and now its coming out. it reaally scares me because I thought I was getting better. Can anyone tell me if this is normal . please.

caro Posted: 12/08/2007 09:14

To Rascal 77.
I have to say i am relieved that someone else suffers like me, everything you have mentioned is exactly what I am experiencing, I also feel I'm about to take a stroke or heart attack and I cannot get better because I'm convinced of long-term illness.Can anyone help us with any advice? I am in counselling and on Lexapro. I am 29yrs.

Clin Psych Posted: 12/08/2007 13:57

Hi Kay, from my own experience in working therapeutically with people who suffer with anxiety, yes this is perfectly normal. I'll give you a short example, in the past few years I was working with someone who had quite strong compulsions and anxities about control issues. They could not pinpoint anything in their childhood that could have contributed to their anxiety. As we explored her early life more we discovered that she had an extremely controlling and emotionally abusive father who inflicted numerous traumas upon her. She had not previously made a connection between the two events and described relief at beginning to understand the origins of her anxities.
Obviously not everyone's anxieties will stem from one specific trauma or are easily identifiable to specific incidents. However through careful examination and discussion of clients' early lives you can build up a pretty accurate formulation of where the anxiety has come from. Part of dealing with our anxities is understanding why we are having the thoughts that we are and where they have come from. Through understanding this we can learn to challenge our anxieties and cope more effectively in our lives.

leigha Posted: 12/08/2007 22:16

hi kay. i started psychotherapy in april, and i felt great for the first few weeks of doing it. i really felt as if i was getting better. i went to australia for 6 weeks during the summer and over there i felt anxious all the time. I'm back 3 weeks now and I still feel anxious. It's terrible. I always have a fear that what I'm suffering is not anxiety. I just feel so depressed and i just feel like i cant enjoy life. My therapist has said that it's a very slow process but with work I will get better. Have you tried any other ways of getting better?

Rascal77 Posted: 13/08/2007 11:28

Hi Caro,
Email me any time. Just for a chat if you like. It is a relief when somebody has the same symptoms.
www.melissa.higgins77@bigpond.com

leigha Posted: 13/08/2007 23:48

Dear Rascal77, just wondering what psychological symptoms do you suffer from. i often feel that my anxiety is really making me depressed and that i cant live life to the full

Rascal77 Posted: 14/08/2007 10:52

Hi Leigha, my symptoms are all over the place. I could be feeling good all day and then 'wham' i have this surge of fear come over me like theres something major wrong with me or that something bad is about to happen (which it never does!). Other times I'm just constantly waiting for something to happen. I don't know what, but I expect something bad. I don't live life like I used to, just going to the shops is a task, the whole time I'm thinking I'm gunna have a panic attack. I have been depressed about it, but now I think I'm just mad that I can't stop thinking these stupid thoughts. From the moment I wake up, till the moment I go to bed, ANXIOUS, ANXIOUS, ANXIOUS!! I long for the day to be normal again. Feel free to email me if you like.

Kay Posted: 15/08/2007 11:21

dear clin psych. Thanks for your info. I am hopeful that some day soon I will be back to the happy person that I was and maybe even better and stronger. It can't come soon enough. To be able to see the joy that I have in my life would be great because I know I have a lot to be happy for. This crippling anxiety panic is so bloody horrible. My therapist says that what is happening is normal and that you can be getting better and something comes up in therapy and sets you back. I live to see my future being a more positive one.

Kay Posted: 15/08/2007 11:29

Hi Leigha. Thanks for your reply. I think you are great to be able to go to Australia for that long. I haven't been able to go out of this country on hols for 10 years. Purely because I can come home anytime I want when near home but if I go abroad I can't get home as quick if needed. So you see this anxiety-panic has really stopped me from enjoying my life to the full. My children are getting older now and I want to get them used to travelling to places so that they won't be like me afraid to go anywhere. I think its all a control issue or an escape door. It's a feeling of being trapped and not being able to get away. Are you on any meds?

kate Posted: 15/08/2007 13:07

To Clin Psych,
In relation to the question on identical twins, even writing about it makes me anxious, but I can only speak for myself on this one, she is the dominant one and always has been. I have always been self conscious about my figure and looks, but because Iím slim she is always saying to me put on weight and I end up arguing telling her to lose it, I know she is not really heavy about size 12 or so I Wouldnít want to be her weight, I Still think she should loose weight I cant understand why it doesnít bother her, that would be the main issue we have between us. I know logically we canít be ugly, as people have always commented on our looks etc but if Iím haven a bad day I cant bear to look at her,I think she feels the same way, every family occasion etc we end up sitting opposite sides of table giving each other a horrible look. She would be over protective of me in another way When I was abroad recently for the weekend she was there I was keeping well away cause I knew was making sure I was ok but going the wrong way about it, My friend and I just got tipsy she was like a bouncer trying to bring me home and telling me I made an idiot out of myself I wasnít even drunk. I'm off work for a week, so I will be at home and Iím glad she has a boyfriend that keeps here less focused on me. I know I sound mean about her, and I know she is a good person, but maybe its because she is like me, don't know really?
What you think?
Kindest regards,
Kate.

Bernadette (YOM59080) Posted: 15/08/2007 15:54

Does anyone know of any therapy which accepts medical card in Dublin. I'm in the Malahide area, suffer from panic disorder & I'm finding it very difficult to cope under stress and end up getting very upset, I really need to talk to someone but so terrified of others might think. pls suggest,thanks!

Bernadette (YOM59080) Posted: 15/08/2007 16:07

can anyone tel me of gp's which accept medical card at clarehall/malahide area pls?

leigha Posted: 16/08/2007 01:44

dear bernadette. there is a therapist in the malahide area called mia duddy who specialises in panic/anxiety . i don't know if she excepts med cards tho

leigha Posted: 16/08/2007 01:48

to kay ...no im not on meds YET! im tryimg my hardest to resist them . i wanna get better the proper way before doing the shortterm way withmeds. i often think that ill never be better and that makes me panic even more. the therapist says that psychotherapy takes a while but she says it will work . what does your therapist say. you should try going abroad cuz its more the thought that makes you more anxious

Mel (QZV63755) Posted: 16/08/2007 12:24

Hi Kay,
I too had a fear of going away as yes I understand the need to be near home & get there as soon as possible if I feel the need. Don't give into it any longer. Book a flight to somewhere in England, Manchester maybe as it's onlt about 40 mins from Dublin Airport. I've started with short flights like that, have done Edinburgh, London & Paris in the last few years & it's definately getting easier each time. It give's you a boost then when you do it & know you'll be ok. My worst bit is waiting in the tunnel to get on the plane, I find that scary so now I just wait till the end to board, bring a walkman to distract me & my boyfrind is great. Don't be afraid to let your nearest & dearest know exactly how you feel & why you need to put these strategies in place to help you on the way & take things easy.

Kay Posted: 16/08/2007 18:55

Hi Leigha. My therapist says that it will take time to recover. I have been having panic attacks for the past 23 years so they are not going to go over night. My husband knows about my panic attacks. I didn't tell him until we were married for about a year. I managed to hide them from him for the five years we dated. My therapist says I will get there but it needs to be slowly.I want to be able to go away for city breaks with friends or family to other countries. That's my goal.

Kay Posted: 16/08/2007 19:03

Hi Mel. I haven't flown in 10 years mostly because of this stupid anxiety/panic. The thing that scares me the most is not the plane crashing but the feeling of being trapped on the plane and panicking because I have no way out. I know it's unreasonable but that is what so frustrating about it all. My feelings about being trapped are coming out in therapy now and it's mostly because of stuff that happened when I was a child. Stuff that I had buried at the back of my mind. Hopefully this will release me from this fear.

Lester Posted: 16/08/2007 21:27

I've been out of work for almost two years due to depression, anxiety and possibly a neurological disorder. Nothing has worked to date and I'm fed up with doctors, consultants, hospitals, medication, etc.
Anyway, started reading a book last week which is heavy going but makes some sense to me. It's very comprehensive covering everything from medication to anxiety to moods. Might be worth taking a look at in the local library.
"The Feeling Good Handbook" by David D. Burns MD

Shane (BGA39208) Posted: 17/08/2007 10:28

I would suggest seeing a qualified counsellor/therapist. Most people try to run away from their anxiety, and in turn, give it more power to debilitate. By running away from it, you aren't accepting it as part of the human condition, and in turn, not allowing yourself to see what the anxiety may be about. The anxiety is often a message that something isn't quite right in your life. It could also stem from something from your childhood, teens etc..
Medication may have its place for short-term relief, but the underlying reasons are still there, and have the chance to haunt you again.
In working on this anxiety with a counsellor, you will be able to identify a range of inner resources and supports to deal with this anxiety. As anxiety is part of the human condition, it is through accepting its presence that true growth can occur.

Sharron (TCA64009) Posted: 28/08/2007 15:45

Can anybody recommend a GOOD psychologist in Kerry (preferably near Killarney but doesn't have to be), it is for my mother who is suffereing from anxiety attacks for over 10 years but they are now becoming more and more frquent. She cannot assert herself, has no REAL self confidence and is in love with a controlling selfish pig (not living together) who affects her badly - even when he is not purposely upsetting her. We, her children (4 grown adults who do not live anywhere near Kerry) are at our wits end, her sister takes over, thinks she's a doctor/psychologist and they just pump drugs and change NOTHING. My mother needs to see somebody, change some things and we need to start being proactive about this as the way she and her sister deal with it is to put it away once it sorts ityself out until the next time, and there is ALWAYS a next time. NOTHING changes and we are all really upset , my mother is also a bit of an attention seeker and a martyr BUT has spent so much time and energy raising her 4 children on her own and getting my brother off drink and drugs that she has become accustomed to these 'rewards'. Now that she has time to relax she can't and is pushing herself too hard working and trying to be 25 again - she is obsessed with her looks and being admired - again becaue she has no confidence. Mum has been for counselling but nobody has taken a real interest or been a dedicated enough professional to make any difference. I would appreciate any names and contact details, no point in telling me to tell my mother to do this or that, she doesn't think or behave logivally and will not make the necessary changes without a seriously good psychologist to help and encourage her. Thanks for taking the time to read this

Clin Psych Posted: 28/08/2007 19:11

Hi, probably the best place to look would be on the Psychological Society of Ireland website for Psychologists in private practice, or give them a ring to find out who is registered in that area

caro Posted: 29/08/2007 11:11

I have just experienced severe breathing difficulty in the last week,i have had problems relaxing before,but this is ongoing 1 week now,not able to breath or catch my Breath..does any one know if this is part of the anxiety cycle?

Ann marie Posted: 29/08/2007 12:39

To Caro,
What you could be experiencing is a panic attack, you can get shortness of breath, thightness across shoulders and chest this can be related to anxiety and deep breathing excersies can help, but I suggest you go to your GP and get check out to rule out any underlying medical condition, then you can focus on ways to prevent panic attacks eg deep breathing guided imageary etc which you will be glad to hear is preventable with good support.

Ann marie Posted: 29/08/2007 12:53

To lester,
Been out of work for 2 years is though, Its not the work but in work you meet people have independence etc and dont have time to concentrate on the negative side of life. You need to get yourself into a frame of mind in getting a job you like even for 5 hours mon- fri. Your mind is a powerful thing as i'm sure you know, even books on guided imagery and the power of positive thinging may help you get focused on work and being positive, years go by very quick then you back and see how simple things could be, by the way life wasn'tt meant to be a bed of roses but you can be happy if you decide to .

caro Posted: 30/08/2007 09:32

Thank you Ann marie for your advice,i went to my G.P and he is checking it out now, just to make sure there is nothing else.
Thanx.

Anonymous Posted: 31/08/2007 16:43

Hi there everyone,
Just looking for some advice. I live with someone who has suffered from anxiety and depression all his life. He was given tranquilisers many years ago, by a GP at the age of 17! He became addicted to these and eventually weaned himself off them. Anxiety and stress has had a huge impact on his health. He is currently attending a different GP who has him on medication for stomach problems (not digesting food properly and possible ulcer),medication to help him sleep, and something to calm him down. My worries for him are that the medications do not appear to be working. The GP seems to be treating all the individual symptoms without getting to the root of the problem. Every time he goes to the doctor he just comes back with more tablets. All I have managed to do is to persuade him to go for reflexology to relax him. I don't know what sort of treatment might help or how to suggest it.

Fran Posted: 01/09/2007 17:06

Anxiety and generalised anxiety disorder (GAD) inclduing social anxiety can hit you like a ton of bricks. It sort of sneaks up on you after years of being hidden under many guises.
The cure - many and varied, a medical model can be followed and often works well with therapy e.g. tablets and cbt (cognitive behavioural therapy). This is intself is only part of the equation. Unless you follow a path of fulfilment through personal development, education and training the medical model in itslef is insufficient.

Kay Posted: 04/09/2007 19:41

Hi. It sounds as if your housemate needs to see a therapist or someone he can talk things over with. I have been having panic attacks and anxiety since I was a teenager. I was refered to a phycotherapist about 5 months ago. I remember thinking and saying to her when I first went to see her that I had no issues and I had the perfect childhood so therefore couldnt understand why I kept having these panic/anxiety attacks. In the past few weeks I have started to remember things happened when I was very little. I now know that I was sexually abused by a family member and hard as it is to face these issues it has to be done if I am ever going to have some sort of a life and a peaceful mind. The person you are living with might not have the same issues as me but my therapist has told me that there is always an underlying issue buried somewhere in your memory from which anxiety starts. I have been to hell in the past but now am very hopeful that I can have a brilliant future. If you can get him to see a pyschotherapist. , it wont be easy for him to go and confront the past but sometimes its the only way forward.

Jan (osully) Posted: 04/09/2007 21:29

Hi Kay,
Everything you have said rings so true and sounds so familiar. It's very difficult to get someone to seek help when in their opinion they had a perfect childhood. I do believe that he has some underlying issue(I have my own theory on what it is). I am glad to see that you were helped by a pyschotherapist, I had no idea what sort of therapist to suggest to him. Perhaps now I can pick my moment and persuade him to see a pyschotherapist.
Many thanks and here's to a bright and happy future !

Rascal77 Posted: 05/09/2007 10:41

Hi,
Does anyone here suffer from dizziness/lightheadedness with their anxiety? I have had this for a week constantly. Sometimes it feels like somethings pulling me backwards or when I walk it feels like I'm tipping sideways. I went to the doctor today and he said it could be a type of virus that you can get in your inner ear, and that the anxiety would be adding to it.
I do know dizziness is a part of anxiety, just wondering if anyone gets it too?

Fran Posted: 05/09/2007 19:03

Yes it is common, my husband has had that!!

Kay Posted: 06/09/2007 15:56

hi rascal77, I had dizzy spells just before my anxiety got really bad. My G.P. gave me meds for vertigo. They helped but I think I got these dizzy spells because of my anxiety. It used to make me feel like I was going to fall over and sometimes I was afraid to drive. My doc said it was some kind of virus too. She never mentioned anxiety but I think thats because it never even crossed her mind. Just before my anxiety got really bad I was to and froing to my doctor with all kinds of ailments. I was praying that she would find something physical wrong with me because at least then I would be able to deal with it better than if it was a mental issue. As it turns out it was depression/anxiety/panic attacks and some days I prayed for the will to live just to get through to tomorrow. I'll never forget how bad those months felt. I'm hoping through therapy I can live again, feel joy in simple things realise that the world is not a scary place and finally for once and for all have a peaceful mind.Because to me a peaceful mind is the most important thing I can have. Then I can be truely happy.

George (NIV39780) Posted: 08/09/2007 03:06

For years I suffered from panic attacks. I would wake up in the middle of the night shaking. I also eventually developed palpitations. And then I started taking Aloe Vera soft gels for a stomach problem and the panic attacks have been gone ever since (almost two years now I think), along with the palpitations. So Aloe Vera gel might be worth a try. I don't know why it works or if it would work for everybody, but it worked for me.

Anonymous Posted: 09/09/2007 01:47

Hi Everyone,
The worst thing about sufferring from anxiety is being bewildered. You don't know what is happening to your mind or your body. You think that you are going crazy.
The mind and body are interlinked because of the nervous system. The nervous system is made of two parts, the voluntary nervous system and the involuntary nervous system.
The voluntary nervous system is under our conscious control and allows us to move our limbs such as our arms and legs etc. However the involuntary nervous system is not under our conscious control. Instead it responds to our mood or our emotions. Also the involuntary nervous system controls the functioning of things such as our organd and glands such as the heart and the adrenal gland. When we feel the emotions or moods of anger, frustration or fear etc our involuntary nervous system records these moods or emotions and reacts to them by becoming stimulated, for eg adrenaline is released into the bloodstream or the heart palpitates etc.
How a person developes anxiety is quite simple. They experience a stressful environment or a trauma etc something which causes them to feel the moods of fear, anger or frustration for a prolonged period. When the person experiences these emotions for a long time, their involuntary nervous system must register these emotions. ie their heart beats fast, adrenaline is released etc and after a while their involuntary nervous system becomestired from registering all of these emotions.
When the involuntary nervous system becomes tired it becomes sensitized, meaning that the slightest anxious thought is now exagerratidely recorded, ie a person thinks of something slightly stressful and their heart beats fast etc and they experience a lot of fear.
Its like in a movie how the scary music adds to the frightening scene. The symptoms ie the palpitating heart or the churning stomach, light headedness etc makes the thought appear more frightening.
As well as having a tired or sensitized nervous system anxiety sufferers also suffer from nervous fatigue.Nervous fatigue is made up of four types of fatigue.
The first is mental fatigue. This is where the suffer thinks constantly. Songs etc get stuck in their mind. And so do anxious thoughts. But as well as mental fatigue they also have emotional fatigue. Emotional fatigue is because of a tired nervous system. As I have just explained their nervous system is tired and registers emotions exageratidely. Thoughts that would usually seem a bit stressful now fill the sufferer with absolute fear.
Where suffers go wrong and add to their anxiety is by getting involved with anxious thoughts. For eg they may think "oh what if this or that happened etc" and then they think of the consequences of such scenarios. And their mind races on and on with more anxious thoughts. And when they think these anxious thoughts their nervous system responds by becoming excited and their heart palpitates and adrenaline is released etc.
The body only produces a certain amount of adrenaline at a time. When a sufferer gets involved with anxious thoughts and thinks anxiously they use up their supply of adrenaline. Adrenaline is needed by our bodies to combat stress. When a suffer uses up their supply of adrenaline they become physically fatigued. This is the third fatigue after mental and emotional fatigue.
When it feels like it is all too much to cope with a suffer then experiences the fourth fatigue, spiritual fatigue. They become depressed etc.

Stephen (PEA64039) Posted: 09/09/2007 02:35

Can't believe there are so many people out there like me thought I was the only one that suffered with this, think nothing but negative thoughts about people can't switch it off its a nightmare even though i know my thoughts are irrational i have suffered with this for as long as i can remember interested in talking with people who are going through the same thing as I am. Think this helps terrified about meeting new people always blushing and sweating for no reason

Kay Posted: 11/09/2007 19:47

hi stephen. You would be surprised how many people have this. People would say that I was really outgoing and confident and happy. That is the way it appears on the surface. My life has been spent avoiding situations where I dont feel in control so therefore I have a very small life. I am in therapy now so hope to start living properly and doing things people take for granted like holidays abroad, going to concerts and normal stuff. What are you doing to try and understand why this happens to you? Are you talking to anyone Doctor or therapist?

Anonymous Posted: 12/09/2007 18:38

In my last post I talked about mental fatigue. Mental fatigue is the reason why sufferers think so much. Thoughts get trapped in their head. Just like sometimes if a non-sufferer is tired a song might get trapped in their head. But where sufferers go wrong is they try to reason or make sense out of their thoughts. For example they may think what if I was to go bankrupt. They think this thoughts because they are in an anxiety state. They are in a state of fear. When they think this thoughts because as I explained their nervous system is sensitized their body exxageratedly records the emotional reaction of the thought and they may have an accompanying physical symptoms such as a churning stomach or a fast beating heart.
This makes the thought more frightening. They then try to reason with the thought. And they think of its consequences etc. But when they do this they think of more frightening thoughts such as perhaps being homeless etc. And when they do this they have more emotional reactions.
Even the physical symptoms thenselves can scare the sufferer. What happens is they experience a fast beating heart or light headedness etc. Then they worry about this. And of course the worry releases more adrenaline and the symptom gets worse. So they get caught in a cycle of fear adrenaline fear. They experience a physical symptom and then experience fear which causes adrenaline to be realeased the physical symptom remains at the same lever or increases and they experience fear again.
But the intensity of the symptoms always dies down. As they only have a limited supply of energy of adrenaline. The body can only produce a certain amount of energy at a time.

Anonymous Posted: 13/09/2007 11:23

These recent long posts sound very like previous posts from J, I wonder why the posts are anonymous now?

George (NIV39780) Posted: 13/09/2007 20:50

For years it was simply assumed that ulcers were caused by "worry". Of course we now know that ulcers are caused by a bacterial infection in the stomach and, in most cases at least, have little or nothing to do with "worry". In the case of anxiety, it is still commonly assumed that anxiety is caused by psychological issues (just like with ulcers in years past). Old "time proven" theories die hard. But at some point in the future we will discover that, like ulcers, anxiety is caused by physiological, not psychological, issues. The reality is that anxiety sufferers don't "worry" more than most people. They are just unable to control their "worrying" due to underlying physiological issues. I know that because I used to have anxiety and now I don't. I "worry" just as much as I did when I had anxiety, but now my body doesn't respond the way it used to. I can experience lots or stress now and it just doesn't cause the hormones to flow the way it used to. And that makes all the difference as to whether one can keep their sanity under stress or not.

hi Mary. I would have to say that I have noticed a link between the two. I have noticed that if I have a hangover or am tired that panic attacks seem to get worse. I don't have a hangover very often but even if I am tired I will feel more anxious and panicky.

mary (GAO65297) Posted: 04/10/2007 14:52

Thanks Kay. I am coming to the conclusion that i am getting about 95% of my attacks when i am hung-over, and the remaining 5 percent sometimes in very crowded environments. I guess there is a lesson here, that there is a link between attacks and alcohol consumption. Has anyone else noticed a similar pattern themselves?

Kay Posted: 04/10/2007 18:43

The drug Amytripiline is very good for panic attacks or anxiety. Your symptoms may get worse when you start taking the tablets at first but I can assure you they do subside. Also Prozac is not addictive. if someone has trouble coming off meds then its usually because they are not ready to come off them. I am on both of these meds and with their help and weekly therapy I am well on the road to recovery. When people tell others not to take certain meds its wrong. Every person is different and their reaction to meds may be different to others. But at the end of the day if someone has to go on Anti-deppressants then it should be o.k. for them to do so. Even if it is sometimes a placebo if it works then it's all worth it. I have never had any trouble coming off my meds, in fact I know when I am getting better because I usually forget to take them. So anyone out there whose doctor recommends that they go on Anti-depressants then if they're happy with it then take them. There is no stigma in taking these meds and anyone who thinks there is has a very narrow and closed mind.

shindlers Posted: 05/10/2007 17:32

Hi all dont really know how I feel, today im great but yesterday I felt like my heart was racing, and my blood pressure was up, i keep thinking im going to die, its a nightmare? does it go away? who can i talk to in the Ratoath are about this???

DOD Posted: 06/10/2007 21:27

I Have been suffering from anxiety for many years now.My symptoms are trembling,increased heart beat and facial blushing.This occurs whenever i am in large crowds or maybe when i may talk to a stranger or my daily routine is different.I have tried several anti depressants and anxiety drugs but as you maybe aware the latter is quite addictive and should only be taken on a regular basis.I have also tried COGNITIVE THERAPY but to no avail(i felt uncomfortable talking to a stranger)I think talking is the only solution to this problem,therefore i would be grateful if anyone knows of a support group in Limerick which could help.

Shannon (QPU65640) Posted: 13/10/2007 20:22

Hey! I'm 14, I suffer from depression and I'm rubbish in social things, due to my bullying and stuff. Today I went shopping with my sister and I felt quite anxious when ordering my food in kfc, stupid i know but later on i pretended to be someone i idolise like a celeb or something so when i kept thinking that i was Hayden Panettiere i felt really confident even a guy smiled at me!! I'm not going to take tablets because I'm too young and I don't want to! Hopefully I can beat it and the only way to do it is get out as much as i can! =]

Marie Posted: 15/10/2007 09:12

DOD, cognitive behaviour is a very good way to deal with anxiety disorders as I know from my own experience. Can I recommend a few books to you: Self Esteem by Matthew McKay and Patrick Fanning published by St. Martin's paperbacks in 1987. I saw a cognitive behavioural therapist in San Francisco who recommended this. We also worked with a book by David Burns which deals more specifically with anxiety attacks. I think it's called The Anxiety and Phobia Workbook and is available in Dublin bookshops (Waterstone's in Dawson Street have a good psychology/self help section). There's a bit of work and committment involved with all of this. If you are serious about dealing with it then you will have to be able to tolerate a little of the discomfort involved in talking to 'strangers'. Even people who don't have anxiety attacks have a certain amount of discomfort when getting to know new people. It's normal and you shouldn't let it stop you from getting the treatment you need. Underlying most anxiety are issues with self esteem and also the possibility that there are certain unconscious 'benefits' from having it too. All of which you should be able to work on with a good therapist. Don't just join a group who will talk endlessly and in an unfocused way about their particular problems. Take a focused approach, be patient, be realistic too - you may just have to learn to live with a certain amount of anxiety. Nobody lives an anxiety free life and a certain amount of anxiety can be positive and motivating as well and is necessary. But the most important thing I have discovered in dealing with my struggles with anxiety is that if you learn strategies to deal with it and this does mean changing unconscious beliefs on a deeper level which will probably require professional help. For example, for those of you who feel like you are going to die during an attack YOU ARE NOT GOING TO DIE(at least not yet and never will an anxiety attack be the cause of it I can assure you!). Also another positive statement which helped me counteract negative thinking was PANIC ATTACKS ARE NOT DANGEROUS, i.e., you may feel strange and dizzy and frightened because you are shallow breathing and your muscles are tense but there is a NORMAL PHYSIOLOGICAL BASIS for this. It's called the Fight or Flight response and it lasts for a LIMITED PERIOD only. I think one of the things that used to frighten me was that I would always feel this strange when I had an attack but truly it does pass as everyone knows and you do survive. I'm still alive and healthy, thank God, and it's 25 years since I first had a panic attack, so I'm living proof that they don't kill you ;-) I have also travelled the world despite earlier terrors of flying so to those of you who are frightened of flying please get some more information to ease your fears. Aer Lingus does courses for people who are afraid of it and if you don't want to do that there is a lot of information on the internet about it too. YOU CAN overcome it or at least reduce it to a manageable level but you must expose yourself to the situation, however slowly.
Hope this helps some of you who are frustrated and suffering with this. It is treatable and it is manageable but do take it seriously and get the help you need. I'm not anti drugs for it either but was only briefly on medication a long time ago but from time to time it has helped me function which can be important too. Good luck in your lives! Learn how to live life. You have the ability, you just need some help to show you the way.

Kay Posted: 16/10/2007 18:05

Hi Marie, Thanks for your information. Its good to know that I am not the only person with this illness. Since I found this site I have been greatly comforted in the fact that there are so many other people with anxiety/depression. When I am going through a particular rough patch I feel so alone, like the only person in the entire world that feels like this. My greatest worry is that some day I will get an attack so bad that I will panic and do something terrible. I have been assured by my therapist that after having these episodes for 25 years that I more than likely have experienced the worst. I would love to have a peaceful life without this crap in my head. When I am like this I am scared of everything, Christmas, holidays anything out of the normal. Even a day shopping with my sister panics me and I love to shop. Its just when I am in a bad patch these things seem like a huge effort and nobody can understand unless you have been there.

Marie Posted: 18/10/2007 21:33

Kay, so glad you are finding treatment after all this time. Do ask your therapist about cognitve behavioural therapy for this. it helped me a great deal, believe me. You don't have to suffer so much with this. cognitive behavioural therapy will help you change the way you think about anxiety and related to it. i.e. while it won't make it go away completely, it won't be the end of the world. nobody has a completely peaceful life. we all have our challenges. and you're right that you are not alone with it. it's very common. it's just not really the subject of everyday conversation a lot of the time because people feel embarrassed by it. but it can improve and to the point where you won't be panicked by a day shopping with your sister. what's the worst that can happen. I can assure you that you are quite normal and you will not do something crazy. buy yourself something nice. you deserve it :-)

Linda Posted: 21/10/2007 19:34

HELP I'M 24, FEMALE, AND HAVE SUFFERED FROM ANXIETY AND AGORAPHOBIA FOR THE LAST 3 YEARS. I have been so low to the point of suicide and so high where i m almost, dare I say the ugly word 'Normal.' I ve had so much different therapy natural and medicated and have conquered so much, like getting bk to a career, friends, etc. I JUST CAN NEVER GET BALANCE, I M WONDERING IF ANYONE KNOWS OF A SUPPORT GROUP IN CORK THAT MIGHT HELP, i would really appreciate it if anyone could shed some light, wud just love to meet someone who may share the same feelings as me, male r female.

Joe L Posted: 25/10/2007 16:28

While talk therapies may work for some people there are other ways totally ignored by mainstream medicine. Just google Orthomolecular Medicine & Dr Abram Hoffer and you will see many people can be helped with B vitamins & fish oils etc. BUT of course no big money in this so why should big companies with their patent drugs care.

Odysseus Posted: 27/10/2007 11:33

Hi All
I suffering from Depression/anxiety. I have had to live with this for the last 10 years now. I have tried antidepressants (cipramil,Zispin,effexor,Manerix) prob one or two more I've forgot. I never really got any benefit from these and was worse with some of them. I have just resigned from a good job because I felt i could not handle it or was not good enough.
Has any one tried cognitive behavioural therapy and has any one the name of one in the waterford area?
Also at the moment I am taking the following supplements Vitamin B complex, Zinc, Omega 3 and Rhodiola.
I Think that I feel as well on these, maybe better, than when on antidepressants. Anyone heard anything about Rhodiola? I've only heard good stuff on the Internet but there does not to seem much knowlege about it in western medicine. My pyschiatrist did not do seem to know anything about it and dismissed without even checking up on it it a bit which annoyed me.

Johno Posted: 28/10/2007 19:09

Hi Linda, Sorry to hear that you are suffering for such a long time. I also have looked for a long time for someone to chat too who suffers from an anxiety disorder but to no avail. Many meetings out there such as Grow/Aware are good but I also feel that finding another person suffering from anxiety to chat too would be more beneficial. You are from cork right, a new group Called OANDA has either started up or is running in Cork now. Its for people with anxiety and panic. If you want more details I can get them for you. Also I am open also for a chat and I have been suffering since I was 24 now am 34. Time does pass.

Johno Posted: 28/10/2007 19:23

Re:- Medications. Has anyone who has been an anxiety patient for a number of years noticed how the meds being used now are basically the same as the ones that were used before? I started off on tricyclic antidepressants for anxiety with valium. Next was moved in between almost 30 different SSRI antidepressants with major tranquillisers such as largagtil. Lexapro and Effexor are the latest weapons of choice but have been on both they were also not effective for me. The downer with the newer meds is although they may have fewer side effects, withdrawal is very painful, frightening and needs medical expertise. The old valium was always the one that helped me but only over a short time. They are very addictive and ok for temporary ease of symptoms. Have also tried the so called amazing CBT but CBT did not work for me. So as an very experienced and knowledgeable sufferer where have we come in the treatment of anxiety in the past 10 years. Full circle I guess???

Marie Posted: 30/10/2007 17:39

Chiron, thanks for that tip. it sounds good. relaxation is important when you have anxiety. I find hot baths, yoga, breathing deeply through my nose - this has helped me greatly with fear of the dentist ;-) Watching a funny movie can be a great antidote to anxious feelings too. Aromatherapy - especially ylang-ylang - is also pleasant and relaxing. I realise these of themselves don't prevent panic attacks but the better rested, more relaxed, better fed you are the easier it is to focus on and use techniques you have learned. This is especially true for cognitive behavioural therapy which if you do a search on the Internet comes up time and again as the best way to deal with panic and anxiety. The reason is that the panic cycle self perpetuates because of the way that you THINK about the experience. That is, you/we are afraid of the symptoms and thus make them worse by fearing they will happen again and so it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy. They do happen again because we are afraid of them. Cognitive behavioural therapy teaches you counter beliefs to the wrong beliefs that you are going crazy, will die, will never be 'normal' again type beliefs. It teaches you to change your response to what is happening by changing the thoughts that you think. This takes time, patience and energy but believe me it is well worth it. I am not sure about cognitive behavioural therapists in Ireland. I saw one in San Francisco (I am Irish though). But I am sure at this stage there are some. Search the Internet. I can assure everyone who is having panic attacks that they are 'normal'. Believing that you are not 'normal' is one of the things which can perpetuate the panic cycle. We are all normal people who are having or have had a distressing experience but one which can be managed effectively. Good luck. Get help if you need it :-)

Kay Posted: 05/11/2007 18:15

When does this crap in my head stop. Every time I think I am over the worse it comes back and bites me on the butt. I have been in therapy now for 5 months now and on meds so why the hell isn't this crap stopping completely? I am doing everything I am supposed to do and it still comes back. So fed up of this. Please somebody tell me something encouraging to keep me optimistic please.

polly Posted: 06/11/2007 12:58

I've had panic attacks for the last 10/15 years, it's got to a stage where I hate going anywhere on my own...can't go shopping, to the cinema etc.
my doctor doesn't seem to know what to do so I decided to go to a hypnotist but to be honest i've spent a lot of money and I don't think it's working! What else can I do?
Right now I'm having bad breathing problems and the doc has put it down to a lung infection but personally I think it's all part of the panic/anxiety that I feel.
Help, please.

Robbie Posted: 06/11/2007 18:49

Hi everyone, I too suffer from social anxiety and it's been going on for 5 years now, and I've also had my hope ripped from my heart many times too. Medication didnt really help me and just turned me into a zombie and I'm pretty much housebound now but i also take solace that this terrible infliction can be overcome. my best advice is to look up the linden method over the internet because it is a great thing to have if you suffer from anxiety , it explains everything and gives some of the best help to overcome this . At the moment ive started buteyko breathing retraining which is the most powerfull weapon i have to fight this condition , i would really advise people to check it out. It's done all over ireland and best of all its a natural way to fight this condition. Good luck to you all and remember you're not alone in this and that anxiety/panic attacks can be overcome permanently. God bless .

Anonymous Posted: 22/11/2007 21:22

get up on a stage, join a theatre group or do karaoke, make new friends...may sound crazy I sing on stages and I suffer from anxiety in many froms, this being one, trust me, jus let yourself go(in a good way) and the buzz you shall get youll wonder why your ever nervous talking!! or going out!!

leigha Posted: 02/12/2007 21:06

hi. i suffer from anxiety..well at least i think its anxiety . i just feel so sad about it all the time. It's my 21st soon and i just feel so nervous about it. this condition is effecting my life so bad . can anyone help. i was thinking of going to a hypnotist but its sooo much money and im only a student and im afraid it won't work. has anyone ever heard of taking anxiety . i really dont want to take anti-depressants

Anonymous Posted: 04/12/2007 01:19

Hi everyone I know what all of you are goin through I have very red cheeks all the time I have had it for a few years and I am only 15! I'm 25% irish but dont live in Ireland but I have found ways to help you guys out. I am a boy and to cover up my redness I actually put on a little bit of a make up to cover it up. If you use alittle bit its not noticeable I also use this acid lotion that kills skin cells on the surface to get rid of the redness I would like to help all of you out and also if you have any suggestions for me I am willing to take them

Marie Posted: 04/12/2007 17:44

Leigha, get a copy of Claire Weekes 'Self Help for your nerves' and also 'Essential Help for your nerves'. They were written forty years ago by her and are one of the best resources to help with anxiety attacks. she gives you information about what is happening to you; why your body responds the way it does, wrong beliefs which perpetuate the anxiety cycle and tackles the basic issue which is fear in a very easy to understand way. her advice is compassionate and accurate. depending on your level of distress with your condition she advises about medication or not. you may not need it but if you do you need to see a doctor and have it supervised. when I was younger I occassionally took medication for stressful situations but haven't done so for over ten years now. I remember being pretty anxious when I was twenty one too but I learned to deal with my anxiety over the years. still, as Claire Weekes points out in her books, there is no need to continue to suffer. good intervention at the right time is immensely helpful so go get the help you need. go to the doctor. see a counsellor. don't be afraid. you have a right to have help. you don't have to tell the whole world what's going on but do take it seriously and yourself seriously and get support. very best of luck to you.

leigha Posted: 04/12/2007 22:14

thanks marie. i must get a copy of that. i always fear that it is not anxiety and im gunna be left like this forever . i went to see a therapist for 3 months but found it did not help

Tom Posted: 11/12/2007 12:19

This is a wonderful site and every best wish to every one out there. Can anybody out there help me. I have been through the rounds on the professional side doctors etc, recurring inpatient treatment etc with very limited success. On high dose of a/d Lexapro, small dose of Tegretol and a Zimovane sleeping tablet. I experience frequent choking and vomiting which is getting worse, Alot of the times I have poor appetite etc. In a position where I am getting slower and poorer at doing any work. Help very much appreciated

Marie Posted: 11/12/2007 13:11

Tom, see my post below on 4/12/2007. Claire Weekes books, buy them, I can't tell you how much they will help you if you really pay attention to what she is saying. Also, you sound quite ill, can you take time off work. Also, see a counsellor for cognitive behavioural therapy. It's very helpful and helps you to stay off medication when you feel ready. Good luck.

Tom Posted: 11/12/2007 16:01

Thanks Marie. Comments very much appreciated.
This is a long term problem 20 years plus. Need a fresh approach. I will try to get the book you recommend. Is it still for sale. CBT and counselling did not work out for me in the past.

Kay Posted: 12/12/2007 16:26

Hi Tom, My heart goes out to you. 20 years is a long time to be feeling this bad. I am like this since march on and off and hoping to eventually get better. It really takes over your life. Everything is really difficult to do even simple things. Claire Weeks book is very good though I have discovered one called When Panic Attacks by Aine Tubridy. Its written by an Irish Doctor/ therapist so it's in our own lingo. Tjhe book is really good and comes with a c.d. with a shorter version of the book. I transfered the c.d. to my mp3 player so I can bring it with me wherever I go. I am in therapy and finding it beneficial. Is'nt it a terrible illness, I would love to know what causes it or is it different for each person. Sometimes I wish I had physical illness instead of this because then it make more sense.

Marie Posted: 13/12/2007 10:27

Kay, you sound well informed and compassionate and I'm sure you are upset and bewildered by what's been happening to you in the last year. I'm not sure what stage of life you are at. You really sound like you are trying to deal with this and you will deal with it and recover from where you are now. I first started having panic attacks 25 years ago when I was a teenager. I was overwhelmed, depressed and the distress and disorientation they caused contributed to much unease and unhappiness in my life not to mention the battering my self esteem and self confidence took. However, I've had a life since then, not anxiety free but a fulfilling one and with a lot of experience and adventure and achievement. The reason I say all this is to hopefully encourage you or anyone who is experiencing despair about this condition that it's not the end of the world. It's a challenge to deal with, certainly, but a challenge which can bring many positive changes, not least a fuller appreciation of your self and your life because of the psychological nature of it. Yes, physical illness is simpler to understand but when you start examining how you think and your beliefs you can really start seeing things in a whole different way. That's why it's important not to feel too sorry for yourself and not to think "isn't it terrible?" too often. You are strong, you can find courage, you will persist and you are still you regardless of these distressing symptoms. which I understand very well. I've been rereading Claire Weekes and I have to say more than any other treatment I have had for this she hits the nail on the head. It's fear that perpetuates them. when you realise they can't harm you and really accept them and not wish you didn't have to deal with them then they abate. but simultaneously life goes on. sorry, I've gone on a bit here but I really do understand and it's so important to see the light at the end of the tunnel which is there. Chins up everyone. you're not alone.

lazy Posted: 15/12/2007 03:03

I have been suffering from anxiety attacks for the last 3 months after giving up cannabis. I have real trouble sleeping have a strange feeling in my chest like my heart is beating too fast, get an upset belly and find it hard to get motivated about anything like going out and meeting people. Had about 5 attacks they last about a week and are really hard to deal with, i think im better then it comes back and its really hard to shake it off. I think the symptoms are not as bad as they were i think its because i know whats happening to me now but i cant stop it from happening its not quite as scary though,i find it helps to try to do something positive for yourself everyday like exercise. ive taken up tai chi which helps me and im taking chinese herbs for sleeping and to help calm me down. it's also good to talk don't bottle it up, i think it could be a long battle and find it very draining. good luck to you all and be as positive as you can,one day at a time.

nel (SHZ67465) Posted: 01/01/2008 22:00

Hello friends, an awful thing happened yesterday I was shopping in a supermarket with my hubby and a person from work came up to me unexpected and asked if i had a good christmas, I was that embarrassed i forgot his name to introduce him to my husband, I went beetroot red which made him go red my hands were dripping with sweat and i just made a complete fool of myself, my husband couldn't believe the state i was in after the encounter, i've gotta face this person in work i don't know what to do i feel like a right freak, i'm quite new in my job i'm afraid i'm gonne be talked about in work for being so wierd, but really i'm quite normal most of the time, i've just got no confidence at all, sorry i just needed to get this all of my chest as i'm fed up and miserable with myself for going red and having sweaty hands if i speak to anyone..happy new year to you allx

Tom (IUA67144) Posted: 02/01/2008 11:02

Nel; Try to say to yourself that you are ok when this type of situation happens to you. It can help. also try not to dwell on it too much
Happy New Year

DOD Posted: 06/01/2008 14:06

Hi Nel,i know exactly what your going through.Im a 35 yr old male and for many years now i have suffered from the same condition.Im fine outdoors if i meet a freind/aquantance,but inside my heart tends to beat faster,i sweat and then go red.This makes everyone feel uncomfortable and you just one to get away,fast.This has made my life a nightmare and my confidence is very low.I work in security(mostly nights)just to avoid contact with people.I am quite intelligent,but people that suffer from anxiety/blushing tend to work in jobs which falls well below their potential.I have tried anti ds and therapy,without success.Im afraid i dont have any solutions,but i do wish you well for 08.

Marie Posted: 07/01/2008 14:26

DOD, Nel. As long as you fear and avoid your symptoms you will have trouble with them. Read Claire Weekes. You have to face them, accept them. They are not a nightmare. They are uncomfortable and you wish they would go away that's all. By over dramatizing them and paying them too much attention you are making it worse. As Claire Weekes advises, try to float by them by accepting them and tolerating them until such time as you no longer are so sensitized to them. Not easy, I know. I don't like them either but you'll find it less depressing if you don't see them as the end of the world. They are not a serious problem in the grand scheme of things. don't worry about what others think. if anyone rejects you because of their noticing these symptoms (very unlikely) then so what. just be yourself and those who like you will like you anyway and those who don't, well, that's life. you can't expect to be liked by everyone anyway. do try to put something positive in your life. keep out there, meeting people, perhaps join a club, take up a new activity or do something your interested in with a group in a non pressurized setting e.g. hill walking or gardening or cooking. you need to be proactive in dealing with your life and the more positive you are about things the less vulnerable you are to depression and anxiety. but one way you will not get any better is to feel sorry for yourselves or avoid people. come on now. get up and get out. no self pity. you can do it. it takes effort and it is worth it. all lives worth living require risk and effort and positive thinking regardless of whether you have anxiety attacks or not. go for it! what have you got to lose. who cares what people think! most people are much more on your side than you imagine anyway!!

Tom (IUA67144) Posted: 07/01/2008 18:45

Hi everyone
I have come across EFT on the internet as a possible to relieve anxiety and depression. Does anyone know anything about it or has anybody experienced it?

Tom Posted: 07/01/2008 18:49

Hi everyone Not sure if my previous message got through as I pressed the reset message in error.
Reading on the internet about EFT as a possible aid to anxiety and depression. Has anyone experienced it, if so does it help

Natasha Posted: 08/01/2008 21:14

I was just reading through some of the posts, as a kinesiology student i have studied alot on Emotional Stress Release which is very useful for anxiety, stress disorders, depression, etc and would recommend going to see a kinesiologist about this but make sure you go to a well known practictioner as there are many people out there who aren't qualified enough. I am from Cork and could recommend to anyone a good kinesiologist in my area but for those of you in other parts do a bit of research first. Great results can be achieved! Best of luck.

DOD Posted: 11/01/2008 22:34

Marie,thanks for the advice.At times i am maybe too hard on myself and in 08 i have decided to tackle these issues head on.People can accept me for who i am.I will try to socialise more and maybe join a group or voluntary organisation.I will keep you posted,take care.

Marie Posted: 15/01/2008 13:30

good luck DOD. you sound like you're on the right track now in my opinion. don't forget to read Claire Weekes' books if u haven't already though. she's the best I think if u need encouragement on a daily basis. well worth buying.

Kay Posted: 17/01/2008 16:11

Hi guys, I would imagine after having anxiety all these years that I would know what triggers them by now, but still they sneak up on me. I hate feeling low I am always afraid I wont pull out of it. That this will be the end of me and I will spend the rest of my life in an institution. My husband is working nights at the moment so I think I am anxious cause he is not here and I have to look after the kids on my own.
Minding the kids is fine but when I am feeling low its hard. Do any of you ever feel like your the only person in the world feeling crap sometimes, do you feel alone and isolated? Someone please tell me this feeling is normal and that it will pass.

Despondent Posted: 17/01/2008 17:47

My boyfriend gets very anxious and has had panic attacks in the past. For the last few months he's been very down, often crying and asking for space from me but not wanting to break up either. He talks a lot about his fear of the future, of what will happen to us...all the time making things almost unbearable for us. He's scared of our future together and whether he can be a good boyfriend, life partner. We get on so well and really love each other. It's tragic because he's such a loving caring person and someone I love deeply but his anxieties and fears are taking over and causing us both to be upset the majority of the time. I feel like he's now dragging me down as I'm generally a happy person but I've been crying and down and avoiding friends for a few months now and don't think I can do it anymore. I'm generally ok and dont' have any history of depression or anxiety so its hard to understand. He has tried counselling -one session and he didn't like it. Thought emphasis was too much on childhood and sub conscious. I've no idea how to convince him to stay with counselling, I just end up pressuring him and giving ultimatiums which in turn make things worse. How can I convince him to get help? Did anyone else find counselling didn't work at the start but then did work? I've tried just telling him how much I love him and staying around and being patient but I'm so upset all the time I end up blurting out hurtful things and being really needy too.

Kay Posted: 20/01/2008 19:24

Hi despondent, Just to let you know I have been in counselling since last June. When I first went I thought there was nothing to say and it was a complete waste of time and money. I told my counsellor I had a great childhood and brilliant memories. It took eight sessions to find out that my childhood was'nt as perfect as I thought it was. I started having flashbacks and it turns out I was sexually abused by a family member from the age of four. I have spent the last six months or so dealing with vivid flashbacks of horrible things that took place then. My point is, it took eight or so sessions for me to start remembering this crap. I am not saying your boyfriendhad any-thing this bad happen to him when he was a child but it is amazing how the mind can forget or hide horrible memories. I think he should go back and stick with it for a while. Make a deal with him and get him to go for another 4 sessions at least. What I am remembering is frightening and sometimes I feel it will consume me completely but at least I know that there is a damn good reason for my lifetime of depression and panic attaacks. I still have really bad days when I am afraid I wont be able to get through, but somehow I keep going and hoping all the time that someday soon I will have peace in my heart and a love for life compared to just existing and struggling. best of luck.

Despondent Posted: 21/01/2008 16:40

Kay, thanks for your words of support and I'm sorry you've had such incredibly difficult memories to work through. At least you are taking the right steps which will help you to deal with them though and I hope it's helping. Sadly for my boyfriend, I don't think he's prepared to take that step right now and I can't be pushing him anymore. Like you said he insists he had a happy childhood and there's nothing in his past to talk about. In his case I think it was his parents marriage breakup that causes him such anxiety issues in relations - a bit obvious maybe, but in this case I think its true. Take care and thanks for your advice.

leigha Posted: 23/01/2008 10:27

to despondent,
i have been suffering anxiety for 3 years now and im only 21. i feel alot like your boyfriend to . i also went to councelling and i found that it did not work . my parents separated too so i think thats what caused my anxiety but it the anxiety just came outa nowhere . right now im taking magnesium tablets cuz i dont wanna go on anti-depressents! and they seem to have realy worked ....i feel great. sometimes i think that my boyfriend really gets sick of me crying and moaning and id hate for him to break up with me for it so dont give up on your boyfriend . it took me 2years to tell him and finally go to a counceller. their are many other treatments aswell but i defo suggest magnesium . its the natural anti-depressent!

Don Posted: 23/01/2008 18:31

I'm glad I've stumbled across this website whilst looking on the internet as I have found it very useful and interesting. It is very reassuring to know that I am not alone with the thoughts I have and the way I feel. I'm 33 and have been suffering from anxiety/panic for the last 12 years.
Anxiety/panic can be terrifying and very fustrating, its a very strange feeling - you can't see it, smell it, touch it, hear it but you can definately feel it - if its brings about physical actions (tight chest etc.) you can physically feel it - otherwise you just mentally feel it.
I think the mental feelings are the worst - you've no idea whats going on or what started it, you're terrified that something really bad is going to happen to you but from your inside not from the outside and the feelings build and build until you think you can't cope any more.
After all this time I can say that I realise what the feeling are - thoughts and thoughts that lead to physical sensations, wihtout the thoughts there is no panic or bad body sensations - this is much easier said than done in the middle of a panic attack though.
I've read many of the posts on this page with regard to treatments. From my own experience I've tried hypnotherapy (didn't work for me), medication (great was I was on it, only small doses, but once I came off it the feelings were still there), councilling (first time was no good, the other time was good and helped a lot in understanding) and books. I found the Claire Weekes book to be very good - when I read it I found someone who actually understood what I was feeling exactly. I haven't read any other books so I can't comment on them. Different things work for different people. I would say that the 2nd time I went on the meds it helped a lot - I was in a bad way and the meds gave me some breathing space and time for my body to recover. Unfortunately all the panic feelings come from thoughts - dealing with these is the hard part.
My advice to anyone suffering from these feelings is not to be afraid to ask for help. Go to your GP to ensure there is nothing physically wrong with you - it that is the case then work on the anxiety. Try the various forms of treatment, go on the meds for a short time if you need some time out from your thoughts - but most importantly talk to someone even if its just to let them know you don't feel well.
I wish you all well and that you will find a way to get past these feelings

Kay Posted: 23/01/2008 19:41

Hi Don< Like you say the mental thoughts are the worse. Inside you feel like your going to do something drastic and totally lose control and outside you seem relatively calm and in control. Nobody knows how bad these feelings are until you have experienced them but they are in fact very very common. The mind is a complicated thing and scientists to-day still dont know how it exactly works so its very hard to find the right help for sufferers. But like you say there is a different solution for each individual and there is help out there for people. The world would be an amazing place if no-body had anxiety to this extreme.

jackie (OXM65036) Posted: 23/01/2008 23:36

hi all
I havehad panic disorder for nearly two years now and it hit me out of the blue. i thought i was having a heart attack and ended up in hospital. i have never felt anything like it in my life. the symptoms are unreal. first the heart speeding up then the feeling that im choaking and floating away. does anyone else pee everywhere. after ending up in hospital another five times a doctor sent me to a mental health clinic were i was told i had gad. i havent been able to go back to work as its changed me. i don t like mixing with anyone any more. when you say to people that you have panic attacks they think you're mad. I think that after suffering crohns disease havin an illeostomy its a struggle every day

Tom (IUA67144) Posted: 24/01/2008 10:40

Hi everyone: The anxiety and mood swings combined can be really awful. Help is very difficult to find out there. I find the only time there is a cooling off period is in the evening time. Personal relationships get destroyed leading to isolation etc. It can be very hard to keep going, but that is the only option.

Buckets of advice Posted: 26/01/2008 18:09

Cognitive behaviour therapy worked for me. Really good shame attacking exercises. Can i recommend 'the feeling good handbook' by David d.burns (i think). and the power of now by Eckhart Tolle. Also exercise is great when feeling low and make sure to make yourself mix with people. Coffee is a no-no when anxious and i gave it up and it helped. hard to stay off it. Alcohol is also bad for mood. Diet also very important for mental health. Take care all. Oh, and meditation clears the head of junk thoughts.

Marie Posted: 28/01/2008 12:48

I second everything Buckets of Advice said! I used the Burns book when I saw a cognitive behavioural therapist for treatment. also recommend Self Esteem by Matthew McKay and Patrick Fanning. This was the basis of my treatment: improving self esteem, changing attitude, more positive thinking, exercise, dealing with criticism from others, setback etc. This book was v. helpful and still is to me.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 31/01/2008 12:41

Nobody here has mentioned Hypnotherapy, or more correctly Analytical Hypnotherapy. I use this to treat exactly the problems that most of you are describing here every day. There is no hocus-pocus involved, it is the use of psychoanalysis speeded up using deep relaxation.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 31/01/2008 13:24

I have been very saddened to see the unnecessary suffering on this discussion. There has been great advances in "talk therapies" in recent years. Out of these advances has evolved Pure Hypno-Analysis, a form of psychoanalysis. The beauty of this is that (a) the time taken to cure anxiety based emotional conditions is reduced to a matter of weeks, (b) in my experience,the condition is cured, not managed or reduced or temporarily relieved and (c) the success rate has multiplied significantly.
I am very experienced in this type of work with people suffering from all phobias and anxiety conditions. I can be contacted at kieran@kieranfitzpatrick.com for more information on this and happy to talk to people about modern options that work.

Joey Posted: 10/02/2008 13:41

Hi Everyone, Just before the new year I experience for the first time a panic attack. I was just reading the paper than suddenly i felt this hot sensation flushing through me, with labour of breath, heart started pounding and pins and needles going through my arms. At the time it was very scary. My wife took me to A and E. I was convinced I was taking a heart attack or stroke. After all the tests the Dr. said nothing was wrong with me but this did not convince me. It took me a couple of weeks to get over it. The doctors never said I suffered from a panic attack, they just said there is nothing organic wrong with me, Like I would know what organic means! My wife and I searched the web and found out it was a panic attack. I have had a couple of hot flushes since but I don't care about them, I actually laugh to myself when they come, cause I know what it is now and they dont harm me, I breath deeply and it subsides. I do suffer from stress and I tend to worry about everything. I did suffer boults of depression when I was 20, obsessive negative thinking and would have to attend Doctors etc.I don't know what caused the panic attack after so many years suffering from anxiety but the first attack came out of ther blue when I was relaxing, oddly enough. Iam now in my mid 40s. Stress and anxiety has to be a factor. As alot of things was going on in my life. I got into some un healthy habits like not going to bed very late at night, lack of sleep,obessive thinking, drinking to much alcohol, not relaxing and little exercise. I go to bed now before 12. I have stopped drinking alcohol and I walk every day for 40 min. I am determined to keep this up.I feel much better for it. I wish everyone the very best and I hope my experience shared can give some hope to you. That we are not alone. Any medication that lightens mood with little side effects prescribed by doctors can help for the occasional downers. They made me relax and it would cut down the obessive thinking process that i believe its due to chemical imbalances in the brain. Best of luck!!

Kay Posted: 11/02/2008 22:45

Hi Joey, I am confused constantly, my therapist who is great, tells me that all panic attacks have a source. In other words panic attacks are usually caused by some hidden memory. I have been treated on and off for the past nine years for anxiety, depression and panic attacks. My psychiatrist(yes i have one of them too) once thought years ago that there was such a thing as a chemical imbalance in the brain, but in the past year he now says that he can'nt deny it any more that the evidence shows him that there is always a reason. I know that there is always going to be a difference of opinion between doctors etc. Through my therapy I have remembered things very scary and horrible that happened to me when I was a child. I am having regular flash backs to scenes of me being abused by an elderly family member, who is now dead , thank god. I suppose the point I am trying to make is that I know now why I have been having panic attacks all my life, why I always had to be in control. I had buried all these memories deep in my mind and it took for me to become very ill with anxiety, depression etc. to sit up and take notice. whatever the cause, the symptoms are horrible and can be crippling.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 12/02/2008 11:07

Kay, what a wonderful post. It is rare for people who have undergone therapy to talk about it afterwards, but you have begun to describe your experience very well and have been very lucky to find such a good therapist and psychiatrist.
I do this work with clients every day. I use hypnosis/relaxation which speeds up the process and makes it more gentle. Once you discover and experience the original emotion felt in the causing event, (and there will be just one in the end), all of your symptoms will evaporate. Keep at it. Well done.
And maybe you could reassure people here that even though you do recall unpleasant past experiences they are all very manageable and liberating with the hindsight acquired. Some people are unnecessarily afraid of what they might recall and often the original experience is, in hindsight, something that to an adult is now relatively trivial. (Obviously, I don't mean in your case Kay).
If anyone wants more information on Hypno-Psychoanalysis, which I do and takes usually between 6 and 12 sessions to complete they can mail me, kieran@kieranfitzpatrick.com

Kay Posted: 12/02/2008 17:27

Hi Kieran, its good to know there are people like you who treat people like me for this horrible illness. The one main thing I found to be really important is talking. Talking to a really good friend or family member about exactly how you feel. We Irish are a great nation for denying things. Someone says to you "hello, how are you?" Our first response is usually "grand thanks". I had to pick a couple of really good friends and ask them could I call on them if needed just to talk or even for them just to tell me I would be o.k. and that I was really not going mad or insane. Half the time it would be about nothing in particular, but just to tell them how panicked I was feeling at that particular time or how anxious I felt. I would try to explain to them to the best of my ability exactly how I felt even if it did'nt make a lot of sense. I still have crap days about an average now about one every 10 to 14 days when I feel I am going backwards and not healing at all. Sometimes its all too much but I keep going in the hope that one day I can see the sun, enjoy little things and generally enjoy my life with peace. I wish more people knew about this site because I have found it to be very helpful. Thanks to all.

Joey Posted: 13/02/2008 00:08

Hi Kay, I know of another person who is a first cousin of mine, who suffers despression and is an alcoholic. She told me one day of an experience she had when she was young around10 to 12 years old. She said she was raped by male friend of an neighbour. She couldn't tell her mother because years ago parents had the habit of not wanting to believe them things. I believe what aided my anxiety was from my childhood and an element of my natural personality. I say this for good reason. My son who is 10years old suffers from panic attack, the childhood type,for example the dentist is one big issue for him so much so that the only way for him to be treated for fillings is under general anestist.He has anixety,if he has an issue with a teacher and he will use the sick method like "Ive cramps in my stomach Ma". We have been caught out a couple of times with him. When I was 6,I had to go to a long stay hospital. My mother and father had no choice. I had a medical condition of the bone. They took me to hospital which was 80miles from were I lived to leave me there for 18months. I remember so much even to the very first day when a nurse took me to look for birds nests only to find out within 10 minutes my parents had gone home with out me. I was just terrified. I couldn't sleep for nights and when I did sleep I woke up soiling my bed. Nurses would lift me,sheets and all and put me into a cold bath and give out to me. Now if I had,only half of my son's natural personality its a dead cert that I would suffer anxiety and panic attacks after going through them things in childhood and then I wonder to myself, How many more people suffer from depression, anxiety mental conditions because they didn't grow up in normal situations. The past in childhood has alot to do with the present in adulthood. Think of the saying"When you were a child you thought as a child and now your an adult you think as an adult.But in saying that I know people who had good childhoods but have and had anxieties and depression which is family linked like any other gene related conditions which become apparent when they become young adults.

Kay Posted: 13/02/2008 11:00

Hi Joey, I know what your saying that it could be a element of our personality but I really think what happens us as children shapes us as adults. Something seemingly small might happen to you as a child but it stays buried in your mind and sometimes comes back as panic attacks or anxiety. I was adamant that I had the best childhood any one could have and I firmly believed that. I was going to therapy for almost 3 months when I started remembering my abuse. I had genuinely forgotten about it. If you know your cousin well could you recomend a book to her. The book is "The Courage to Heal" by Ellen Bass and Laura Davis. I know it sounds corny but this book has been a brilliant help to me. It felt like it was written for me alone. The way the women in it describe the way they felt and acted throughout their lives before they remembered abuse was exactlyy how I have been all my life. It is through reading this book that I now realise that I am not mad or insane. The feelings I have now are all to do with abuse and its like I have opened a can of worms and I can't stop now it all has to come out and the hope that some day I will be able to have a normal life without too much anxiety or panic.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 13/02/2008 12:10

Hi Joey,
you have a good handle on these things, fair play to you.
You are right that more sensitive people would be more prone to anxiety as they can be more easily affected by traumas.
Your relation is not recovering, even though she can cite an experience in her past, because she has not been helped release the emotion that has been naturally bottled up by it. I do that work with people daily, many of whom had been in counselling for years talking about the same experiences. Talking and feeling are different things, especially with something traumatic the emotion of which has to be gently released.
I am a Hypno-Analyst and Clinical Hypnotherapist. I do not normally work with children, but there are Hypnotherapists who do. Children are wonderful hypnosis subjects and there is a very effective technique which works very well with them called the "blow away" which helps them release their anxiety. (No ethical Hypnotherapist will see a child without the parent or guardian present at all times).
There are also some excellent Child Psychologists who can help children get rid of anxiety and can change the child's life.
Lastly, the usual reason why people who seem to have had an idyllic family upbringing can end up with anxiety is that it only takes one traumatic incident to wound us emotionally and no parent can be blamed for a child experiencing something that that particular child finds a personal trauma.
I hope some of my experience helps.
- Kieran.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 13/02/2008 14:12

Kay, you are brilliant!
Your insights, understanding and experience I am sure will be enlightening to many here and hopefully bring them hope for a full and permanent resolution to their problems. Your greatest contribution, I think, is sharing that you uncovered forgotten memories. So many people simply don't believe that this is possible. We all have thousands of forgotten memories. In 100% of the cases that I treat the root cause is a forgotten memory OR recalling part of a memory that they previously hadn't been aware of any time they had thought about it in the past.
It sounds like you are well on the way. Well done and good luck.
- Kieran.

Marie Posted: 13/02/2008 22:30

hypnosis sounds intriguing. it has occured to me that some of my earlier fears were caused by nothing more than a thoughtful mind being easily suggestible so I assume it could just as well happen in reverse. The recovered memory theory is quite controversial from what I've been reading on the Internet and not yet fully accepted by the established field of psychology. there have been controversial cases of people having false memories of childhood abuse and suffering more and not less as a result but it seems that most are real and were buried by the sufferers because the trauma was so intense. I don't imagine that it's being suggested here that all anxiety and panic sufferers are harboring repressed memories of childhood abuses although it may be the case for some individuals. Personally, I think mine began as a result of persistent stress and lack of good coping skills and negative thinking and being physically run down and then most importantly the conditioned response which perpetuates them into a problem leaving you oversensitized and vulnerable - perhaps hypnosis would be good for deconditioning the response although I find it hard to see how the body could 'forget' all the tension so quickly. I have found cognitive behavioural therapy, relaxation (yoga, hot baths, relaxation response technique etc.), diet and exercise to be very beneficial in helping to manage and relieve the symptoms and especially in relieving the depression and frustration with the condition and also in boosting self esteem in general. It is liveable with even if it cannot ever be fully cured. And in it's more positive aspects one could look at it as a challenge which will lead you down paths you might not have other wise explored! I don't mean to downplay how miserable and bewildered the symptoms can make people feel sometimes, me included, but they do pass and it's a shame to stop living your life because of it or to use them as an excuse to stop living your life. I'm a big fan of Claire Weekes on the topic. She had a lot of experience helping people in this area and her books are practical and down to earth and can help people cope on their own or with the help of a therapist.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 14/02/2008 13:11

Hi Marie,
most science is based on the doctrine of cause and effect. Hence here also, there must be a cause for the many symptoms people suffer. The problem with emotional issues is that the cause is not evident. This is due to the mind's natural and normally healthy process of repression.
The idea of repressed memories is accepted in the field of psychology since the very beginning, as it was the basis of a lot of Freud's work over 100 years ago and who is still the starting point on most formal psychology courses.
"Traditional" psychoanalysis, sometimes referred to as the 1000 hours therapy is long winded, expensive and sometimes traumatic and has naturally, (especially in this day and age) fallen out of favour. People are looking for quicker more superficial fixes. Only in the past ten years or so has the use of Hypnosis been tuned to the point of completing that 1000 hours work in a matter of weeks.
To explain further. If someone were to take a physical "knock" at a young age that left them with an unhealed physical injury then that person would be more vulnerable in later life to physical stresses, maybe resulting in symptoms when playing a sport, or engaging in some other activities. If they were to go through a physically stressful experience in later life, they may be more affected by it that perhaps someone else who had not been previously injured. It may only then become apparent that they had this latent physical "weakness" all along. (Most times, even in physical cases like this, the original experience is also long forgotten).
Also, may of the things that you find ease your symptoms are very effective in easing and coping with even a physical complaint. But it does not cure the cause. Hypno-Analysis in my opinion does cure the cause. So no more symptoms to treat.
I understand your concerns regarding what is known a "false memory syndrome". This can only be an issue for someone who has attended a badly or under-trained therapist. I know many therapists and am often astonished at the lack of understanding of the basics of psychotherapy. With so many "versions", "quick fixes", "styles" and "techniques" emerging many of them either dilute the possible power of the mind to self heal and others, once again totally disregard the basic scientific doctorine of "cause and effect".
I am very happy to see people here openly, and with open minds, sharing their experiences. That is a great start to getting out of the old cycles. if those old cycles were going to fix the problem they would have done so by now. So well done to people beginning to reconsider even their own understanding of their own problems.
I am a member of The International Association of Pure Hypno-Analysts and there is lots of information on this powerful therapy on their website or indeed my own.
- Kieran.

Kay Posted: 14/02/2008 19:35

Hi Kieran, Can you tell me what you think about Reiki. I had a couple of sessions of Reiki lately with a really nice lady. I felt better after those few sessions than I have done in 10 months of therapy. I know I found out what the root cause of my anxiety/panic/depression was and its good to know that something did cause these feelings, but because reiki concentrates on getting rid of negative thoughts and energy(which is great) then I go to therapy and all those memories and feelings come up again and I feel the Reiki has been completely undone. What I am asking you is basically I am sick of this abuse taking over my life and reiki has broken the circle of negative thoughts so do you think I should concentrate on reiki instead of therapy? I am not trying to run from memories but I would like to be able to put them in a box once I have experienced them and carry on with living. What do you think?

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 15/02/2008 12:14

Hi Kay, personally I think that, whatever you choose to do with the Reiki, you should carry on your therapy to completion. It sounds like it is doing its job.
If you are finding the Reiki helpful that is a good thing.
I am reluctant to comment on individual cases in a forum as everybody is unique and nobody here is a client of mine.
- Kieran.

leigha Posted: 20/02/2008 21:28

hi , i am an anxiety sufferer and have posted comments on this page many of times. would anybody be interested in making a group???

Kay Posted: 21/02/2008 21:34

Hi Leigha, do you mean that some of us meet up? If so I live in county wexford. Lets see where others are from and take it from there.

meme Posted: 22/02/2008 09:35

I am worried about a lifetime friend of mine as she is going through a very difficult time at the moment. Her sister has cancer and she and her family are extremely close. unfortunately it is looking like it is a matter of time. My friend has always been positive and a power of strenghth for everyone around her. She has no partner and I feel really does not share her concerns or worries as she does not want anyone to worry about her. Recently she has had 2 panic attacks and this has knocked her for six. She wants to get through it and I feel the only way I can help her is to tell her she will and be strong for her. Medicine or therapy would be a last resort. Could it be possible these attacks are related to the sisters enevitable situation and they will pass. He went to her GP and he beleives so. I think positive thinking can work. She is in her middle thirties...

Marie Posted: 22/02/2008 10:07

Meme, you sound like a good friend to her. I've had panic attacks/anxiety since I was in my late teens. I think better intervention sooner could have saved me a lot of suffering with them. Your friend sounds like a typical candiate for this disorder. Strong caretaker type who doesn't show her feelings and is very responsible for those around her. Cancer is tough. My Dad died of cancer about a year and a half ago. One of the things my mother said afterwards was she wished they could have spoken more about it together but it happened so quickly they really had very little time to come to terms with it. So please encourage your friend to talk about her feelings about her sister if she can. I'm sure counselling would be very helpful for this. Don't view it as a last resort but as a crutch to get through a very understandably difficult time. Bottling up or not expressing emotion can contribute to panic attacks in my experience. It's something I do a lot too so I know it's easier said than done to open up. I find it good to sit still and try and be with what I'm feeling. Tune in on a deeper level. Walk. Write about it. Talk to a trusted friend or a therapist if necessary. It can be a relief to unburden yourself to somebody in confidence. But not easy if those around you think you are a pillar of strength and dependability. It can be hard to be vulnerable. Also, if you want maybe read a few books on the topic of anxiety and panic. There are plenty available now. Amazon.com is one source plus Easons, Waterstones, Hodges Figgis in Dublin to name a few. An important, key part of preventing it from getting worse is reminding yourself as your friend's doctor did that it does pass, that it isn't harmful although it feels very distressing. It's just a natural response occuring when you don't expect it because of stressful life events. Good luck to you and her....

leigha Posted: 22/02/2008 11:34

hey Kay , i am from dublin . but i think it would be a good idea. i always think its good to talk to people if they are going through the same thing

meme Posted: 22/02/2008 12:20

Marie, thanks a million for your input I am visiting her this weekend so will take on board you advise. Sorry about your Dad I am lucky to have not experienced such
a loss and wish you all the best in the future x

Kay Posted: 23/02/2008 18:42

Hi Meme, Your poor friend is going through a tough time. She is lucky to hava a good pal like you. Try and get her to talk to you if she wont go to a therapist. There is still a stigma attached to therapists/anti-depressants etc. Going to a therapist is nothing to be ashamed about. I do it myself and I am quite normal. I know from experience that keeping things inside and not talking is the worst thing any person can do. When you ask her how shes feeling, she probably says shes ok. Press her, ask her to even give you a few words to explain how she feels inside. There doesn't have to be a long conversation between you both, just simple words. Panic attacks are the scariest thing that I have ever been through and no matter how you explain them to somebody they can't understand until they have had one themselves. The overwhelming sense of something awful happening, or of you finally flipping and going absolutely insane are terrifying. I hope your friend is ok soon.

Joey Posted: 26/02/2008 00:14

Kay,Meme, your right about the panic attacks. All I can say is at that "moment" I really felt I was going to die. Its so shocking at first, from that deep feeling of despair, because my mind had convinced me I was near the end. With my faith in God, I started to pray and started to let everything go to God as I was helpless to do anything else. Something wonderful happened to me within all the stress of the panic attack and from the experience I had while in Hospital. Now even with my anxieties and worries I have a completely different prespective of it all.I was given a second chance! People who have near death experiences have alway said that its changed their life. They feel that they have a second chance of life and because of this reallization "they thank God" or If they don't believe in God, they may say "they may thank the existence around them"- existence around us? Maybe that is God?
Well that's what happen to me. Its two months from my Panic attack. I don't worry about tomorrow anymore or I don't dwell about yesterday either. Family and friends used to advise me about this daily to help me cope with my anxieties and worries but it made no difference as that's the way I felt and thought at that time. I just could not help it. Now, I just think of one thing! I thank God for every second of every day even though I might feel anxiety attacks coming on at times. I think and experience for the "very moment"now my family, my friends, my colleagues, my home, my space, my countryside,my experiences, good or bad.I think in real time!! I thank God for the happiness and also for the sorrow and pain of this very moment, this very moment, this very moment.It all about living for the very moment, its all that matters. I accept my suffering now and what comes in front of me will just like everything else will be behind me in a moment passed. Im not tring to force religion on anyone.But focus on something or some one that provides strenght has to be a positive thing. Just giving you all an insight how my panic attack changed my way of thinking. Some how it snapped me away from the pass. We all must see, hear and feel the positive around us in every moment of time. Im thinking of you all and in this very moment, its wonderful that we all can listen, talk and share. meme, your friend comes across as a pillar of strenght from the outside.Its in the inside that really counts. I believe, My panic attacks came from emotional stress and worry and with your friends stress and worry levels at present about her sister its only natural for the panic attacks to happen. I think Its impossible for her to see any positives at present. How could she, its a real hard time her her. The positive thing I see is your true frendship to her and this will see her through her difficult times, Its just to be there to listen. I believe she will see the positive side in time. Gentle guide her to seek help, even by simply giving her the phone number of a councillor or support group in your area to help her through this hard times. Even tell her about these dicussions. They are a great help. Panic attacks is a real life experience of near death. With her sister having cancer, Death could be very much in her mind at present. Try taking her to, maybe a friend who has a new born child just for a visit. It might help her to see new life, The opposite of death is new life. It may help her!!!! Its worth a try. As I said its only in a moment. Joey

Kay Posted: 05/03/2008 19:14

Hi all. just checking in on everybody. I have come to the conclusion that I only come on this site when I am having a not great day. It comforts me to know that there are lots like me. Even though I know the reason for my anxiety and panic, it still throws me when I have a not so great day. Especially after having a great month or so of feeling normal and then it rears its ugly head and knocks me. Does anybody else have the same type of pattern?

leigha Posted: 06/03/2008 12:18

hey kay , yeah im the exact same . sometimes i can feel great for about 2weeks and then it slowly creeps up again. i stopped going to therapy in october because i really didnt have the money as i am only a student but thing have gotton so but in the past month or so that im going to go back. do you find that therapy works

Kay Posted: 06/03/2008 22:03

Hi Leigha. I think therapy works. I have a really good therapist and she knows exactly how I feel. The reason I think she is so good is that she went through her own personal bad time years ago and she had to go to therapy herself. It was then she found the lack of resources for people like us. She had to travel quite far to get therapy. But I think the reason she is so good and very intuitive is because she has been there and bought the t-shirt as they say. I hope therapy works because I dont want to go through the rest of my life grabbing at things and clinging to the hope that some day I will live a normal life. Life should'nt be like that it should be easier. I know that we will all have ups and downs when something bad happens to us, but to feel this much anxiety and stess on a regular basis is very hard. Therapy has helped in getting me to talk about how I feel to my friends and family. To be able to pick up the phone and say to my best friend "Hi , I feel panicky to-day, can I come out and talk to you?" is very helpful because panic thrives in secrecy. The more you try and hide panic/amxiety the more it can effect us. So talking about it is like a release valve letting off steam. I sometimes think its a shit life when I am feeling anxious, but over all I know its a good life with little blips on the road. When you are feeling anxious do you tell anybody? Does it pass quickly?

leigha Posted: 07/03/2008 13:32

well the only person that really knows about it is my boyfriend ...not even my parents know that im going through this but im not that close with them so i would not want them to know . sometimes i tell my boyfriend but sometimes i dont , it depends on how bad it is i guess but he is very good about it . none of my friends know or anything and because it is so easy to hide , i think if i did say it to them they wouldnt think it was that serious because its very hard to notice if someone is anxious i think . the negative thoughts and anxiety go through my head every day for the past 3 years sometimes i can be in a great mood but its always in the back of my head

Marie Posted: 07/03/2008 14:36

Leigha, I've just been reading The Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle. Some of his tips/advice I am finding very good for dealing with anxiety. One I've been trying for the last few days is stopping thinking. Just stop and then wait, as he says, like a cat waiting for a mouse to come out of it's hole, and pounce on your next thought and see what it is. Try it and see. It's a great way of bringing yourself into the present moment and stopping those racing, anxious thoughts which can fuel panic. Kay, I think it's true about telling other people. The shame/embarrassment around the anxious/panicky feelings makes it worse. It's something I've always found hard to do but I'm less embarrassed to admit it as I've gotten older. Perspective of age I suppose and realising it's not as uncommon as you might think. I have realised to that holding onto strong emotion causes panic as well so I've worked on dealing with anger, fears, even positive emotion like excitement so it doesn't overwhelm me so much and I don't get so overwound and spacey. This discussion forum is good I'm finding for getting different ideas about all this. Nice weekend to you all!

Tom Posted: 07/03/2008 15:45

Hi everyone
Can somebody advise me how to stop what I do which is simply when I get an attack of anxiety I just do nothing.
Advice very much appreciated

Kay Posted: 07/03/2008 22:25

Hi Tom. I always did the same. Its like time stoped and I am the only person in the world feeling like this. Its the lonliest feeling in the world. I know I sound like a broken record here but the simplist advice I can give you is - just tell someone, Pick up the phone tell your partner, friend, or anybody you trust. Simply say "just rang to say I am having a panic attack". It would be a good idea if you asked these people first so then they can help you and not be shocked when you ring. Have you got someone you can just call and say that to? Or you could even just log on to this forum and say "hey guys I am having a panic attack" It helps me when I tell someone. I have a great friend whom knows about my panic attacks and I have often just phoned her and said"just rang to say I am having a panic attack" to which all she has to say is " I hear you Kay". Dont know if i am making any sense here. If you are actually stuck to the spot when you get a panic attack and cannt make a call or speak at all then the best thing to do is say to acknowledge in your head that you are having a panic attack and yes it is horrible but it will pass. After 24 years of panic attacks I still expect the next one to be worse, finally the one that will put me over the edge and I will finally snap and do something horrible like kill myself or i will be locked up. But you know that if you have been having these attacks for any length of time the fact is that they will never ever get worse. You will never have an attack that is worse than what you have already experienced. That helps me when having them, to know that yes I am having an attack but so what, bring it on I can take it. That said of course would be on a good day. On bad days I struggle like everybody else to make sense of it all. Tom I hope I have been of some help.

Tom Posted: 10/03/2008 10:42

Kay
Many thanks for your long and detailed help.I have talked in the past. One of the things I have found with anxiety is that it is very isolating, in that people who do not have it just do not understand it. Your suggestion of coming on the line is a good one. I am having a panic attack right now, but the task involved in writing it down has helped a little. Your other words are also very helpful

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 10/03/2008 11:16

My God Kay,
I am so sorry to hear about your suffering, (and that of all of the other people on this forum).
If none of you ever came near me myself, PLEASE have a look at Hypno-Analysis. Look up the International Association of Pure Hypno-Analysts who have lots of information about this therapy. Every week I help people become free from panic attacks permanently. It can take between 6 and 12 sessions depending on the individual. But compared to something like 24 years suffering this is well worth the investment of time and effort.
I would be happy to talk to anyone who wants to call or write to me kieran@kieranfitzpatrick.com with no obligation.
I am thinking of hosting an information evening on panic attacks some night if there was enough interest?
- Kieran.

Tom Posted: 10/03/2008 17:09

Kieran /Kay
Many thanks again for your comments
Kieran I am happy to attend an evening. The panic can be unreal as it has been today. Seems like there is nothing I can do about it. I am totally in despair about it and without doubt it leads to depression

Kay Posted: 10/03/2008 21:32

HIi Kieran, I too would be interested in attending a meeting or evening with others who suffer panic attacks. I looked up Hypno-Analysts and found it very interesting. If I thought for one minute that it would finally rid me of panic attacks I would grab it with both hands. The thought of living life without fear of panic would be absolutely fantastic. I am only 39 and have a lot of life in me yet. I want to go places, see things I never dreamt posible and do things others take for granted. What is the success rate with this Kieran? Does it mean I am running away from issues? I am so fed up of trying different things and being successful for a while but then after a while back it comes worse than ever, panic. p.s. Its nice to see a professional person taking the time and bother to try and help others. My hat is off to you for that.

Tom Posted: 11/03/2008 08:40

Hi everyone.
The thing I find about the panic(s) is the isolation and zapping of energy. I have attended alot and read alot over the years. However when it comes up again and again, in new and repeated situations, it leaves me totally crippled and very sick. What I am looking for is a technique(s) that I can apply when it comes up. Breathing helps a small bit, phoning a crisis line helps a small bit. But I am looking for something else. I also believe there is an awful lot of this been swept under the carpets and that it is ruining an awful lot of lives, I know it has badly effected mine, to date. I appreciate there is no one size that fits all. However when we are living our daily lives is when we need the help. I would like to open up the discussion. I am slightly cynical about going over the past, in that all we have is the present moment, but I can see the analogy of the physical injury in the past. However I desperately need help and have little finance which adds to the stress. Help and suggestions appreciated

Marie Posted: 11/03/2008 12:13

Tom, have you read Claire Weeke's books. They are very helpful and don't cost much. Also The Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle. It's a bestseller. Very helpful tips there too for this kind of stuff although I know some of it is a bit esoteric. Thanks, Kieran, for your sympathy for everyone here for whom panic/anxiety is a problem. I'm wary of overemphasizing the suffering involved though, although that is true, it's important to be optimistic if you can so you don't get too depressed by it. And try to accept limitations too. Even people who don't have panic/anxiety disorder have limits in life as well. Try to look at the good things in life too. A CBT therapist I went to once asked me a good question when we were trying to analyse it and that was what is underneath the panic? I'd never thought about it that way before. I was so overfocused on the panic/anxiety as the worst thing that had ever happened to me that I wasn't looking at the other stuff going on with me - good and bad. In my case I found there was a lot of apathy underneath the panic which was due to a lot of other things going on with me at the time. We need to look at the big picture I suppose but anxiety is so intense and unpleasant an emotion it tends to dominate everything else so it can be hard to. I'd love to believe it's completely curable, Kieran, but still not convinced. I do believe the unconsious has something to to with it, that the symptoms are a conditioned response and can be triggered by all sorts of things including food, strong emotions, fear, exhaustion, lack of sleep, drugs, alcohol, thoughts etc. That's how I experience it anyway. Good luck Tom. If you feel panicky try distracting yourself lightly. Read a lighthearted book. Look at a good comedy on DVD. Take a short walk. Do something that interests you but not too intensely. Talk to somebody - not necessarily about the panic. Or just sit still and let it gently wash over you if you can bear it. It does pass. Any combination of things can help. Try to focus on small positive things. Visit a garden or a park. Nature can be very soothing. The daffodils are beautiful in Ireland now! Bring someone with you if you feel lonely. Hope some of this helps.

buckets of advice.2 Posted: 11/03/2008 19:58

Hi all
found a great book called self esteem by matthew mckay,PH.D.+Patrick Fanning. Excellent and apparently therapists train with this. NLP and visual techniques etc. It advises to watch that negative voice in your head. Tell it loudly to stop(to yourself or people will think you mad) though, so what? I'm also getting acupuncture. Felt crap today when i had two coffees. Good luck to us all - Ps. No harm to look at past in order to understand it and then let it go. Tell it to feck off with itself.

Tom Posted: 11/03/2008 22:57

Kay
Once again, many thanks for your detailed comments, you are very good to take such time and interest. Kieran you are also very good to take such an interest. Kindest thoughts Tom

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 12/03/2008 00:03

Hi folks, I will give the idea of a little presentation some thought as there seems to be some interest.
As do other members of my professional association, I also offer free initial consultations to clients where they can ask questions and discuss their own particular experience without any obligation to take up the therapy.
I am quite busy up to Easter, but if anyone wishes to talk to me after Easter I would be more than happy to make an appointment for them for a brief initial consultation.
When a person applies themselves to this therapy it does work and results in a permanent resolution of the panic, fear and worry of anxiety related symptoms.
I can be contacted by e-mail.
Regards and a Happy Easter to all.
- Kieran Fitzpatrick. (kieran@kieranfitzpatrick.com)

leigha Posted: 12/03/2008 10:17

Kieran , i would be interested in an information night on panic and anxiety . im sure many others on the site would be too

Marie Posted: 12/03/2008 13:26

Buckets of advice, I have the Self Esteem by McKay and Fanning too. find it also good. Also the Panic and Anxiety Workbook by David Burns which I worked with when I saw a cognitive behavioural therapist. Has the acupuncture helped?

Col Posted: 13/03/2008 20:55

Hi Kieran Fitzpatrick,
I thank you for your kind and caring messages, your name
has popped up on more than one of these discussion boards
so I know you care.
I have discovered over the years that people who suffer with anxiety and depression are usually very open to suggestion
which in turn can make us very vulnerable. Also us sufferers
are usually unable to work thereby limiting our income. Would you tell us please how much you charge per session.

Col Posted: 13/03/2008 21:15

Hi Kieran,
Thank you for your kind offer of help, I am sure you appreciate
that when a person suffers with anxiety and depression they in
most cases are unable to work so income is limited. Also this
condition can leave one very vulnerable. Before I attend your
meeting can you tell me how much you charge per session
Also you mention that a cure for anxiety can take many sessions how many would you estimate.
I look forward to your reply
Col.

Col Posted: 13/03/2008 22:07

Hi Kieran,
I am interested in your treatment, could you let me know
how much you charge per session.
Thanks

Kay Posted: 14/03/2008 09:33

Hi guys, Have been feeling anxious since yesterday. It just comes up on me, I hate feeling like this so much. It infringes on your life so much. When I am feeling like this I get so tired, not really interested in anything, unfocused, loss of appetite and just a panicky feeling of being out of control and having no control over my thoughts. I am great at giving advide to others when they feel like this but find it hard to apply the same advice to myself. I am so so so fed up of this crap. Why can'nt I be happy and content?

Tom Posted: 14/03/2008 10:56

Kay
Understand exactly how you feel. There is a constant feeling of been battered. Take it easy. I too am good at giving advice but not good at taking it.
Look after yourself
Tom

Buckets of advice Posted: 14/03/2008 19:50

Hi Marie
Not so sure if acupuncture has helped yet. I'm on lemon balm tea and camomile tea. Multi vitamin B. I find staff in most health food shops very knowledgeable and helpful. Also in Self esteem book, careful not to have very high standards set for yourself. We all are inclined to do too much. I have found therapy in past to be a bit expensive and i don't work full time. Books are great if you do written exercises in them. Take care.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 17/03/2008 21:41

Hi Col, any information that you may be looking for including prices and duration of therapy can be found on my website. I realise that therapy can sometimes seem expensive initially, but it is relatively quick and worth it. Also, members of my association should be able to tell clients at any stage how well or otherwise their therapy is going.
Regards,
- Kieran.
kieran@kieranfitzpatrick.com

Anonymous Posted: 20/03/2008 13:35

Hello, I must admit I am extremely uncomfortable that someone is soliciting their services on this forum. Research (nice.org.uk/page.aspx?o=235216 - 18k - This group, the national Institute of Clinical Health and Excellance, NICE, review all of the international research and then make treatment recommendations. This is what all professionals and the NHS follow in the UK) has shown that cognitive beh therapy is the most effective way to deal with anxiety and also the new 'wave' of CBT is Mindfulness and Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (Get Out of Your Mind and Into Your Life: The New Acceptance and Commitment Therapy
by Steven C. Hayes is a great self-help book on this topic and the Anxiety and Phobia Workbook or even the Feeling Good Handbook are very good cognitive therapy workbooks and check out Christine Paedesky's website for more info). CBT therapists can be found by contacting Psychological Society of Ireland (PSI), Irish Council of Psychotherapy (ICP) or even the British Association of Beh and Cognitive Psychothearpy (BABCP). Also, don't assume that someone is a CBT therapist just because they say they are. Do some research before talking to someone. Good luck!

Anonymous Posted: 20/03/2008 13:57

Hello, I must admit I am extremely uncomfortable that someone is soliciting their services on this forum. Research (nice.org.uk/page.aspx?o=235216 - 18k - This group, the national Institute of Clinical Health and Excellance, NICE, review all of the international research and then make treatment recommendations. This is what all professionals and the NHS follow in the UK) has shown that cognitive beh therapy is the most effective way to deal with anxiety and also the new 'wave' of CBT is Mindfulness and Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (Get Out of Your Mind and Into Your Life: The New Acceptance and Commitment Therapy
by Steven C. Hayes is a great self-help book on this topic and the Anxiety and Phobia Workbook or even the Feeling Good Handbook are very good cognitive therapy workbooks and check out Christine Paedesky's website for more info). CBT therapists can be found by contacting Psychological Society of Ireland (PSI), Irish Council of Psychotherapy (ICP) or even the British Association of Beh and Cognitive Psychothearpy (BABCP). Also, don't assume that someone is a CBT therapist just because they say they are. Do some research before talking to someone. Good luck!

Anonymous Posted: 20/03/2008 15:54

The advertisement of services on this page is ridiculous -it is an open forum for discussion not another arena for the professional-client divide. This site is being utilised to target potential clients and it is a disgrace.

Tom Posted: 20/03/2008 16:35

As a sufferer from extreme anxiety and depression, I would dearly love some solution to. There a couple of issues I would like to just observe.
The buyer beware notice I appreciate.
Books are useful to read, but can encourage isolation because reading is a self centred activity. The problem with therapy is that it is good at the time of the therapy but wears off.
One of the features of isolation is that the person concerned is living in their head too much. I certainly am anyway.
I have found this forum very useful because I have realised that there are more people than me that are suffering effectively in silence.
Talking on a telephone line to someone is useful because it alleviates the sense of loneliness. A supporting voice is wonderful. I wish I could find some mentor in this respect. One of the things I have found is that the voice can calm the head down thus allowing rational thought to resume. However I appreciate lines like Aware and Samaritans have extremely scarce resources which should not be overused.
Comments / suggestions welcome. I can give out my email if anybody is interested and gives me theirs. I think we need to look after each other and try to take some burden off our families.
Happy Easter to everyone and thanks for your help

CW Posted: 20/03/2008 20:26

Hi Tom,
I read your letter and I agree with everything you say regarding this site being used as a fishing ground for money making egotistical people. I found this site recently and I look on it as
a bit of a god send. When I need to download worries and
concerns I can do just that ,and I know that there is somebody of likemind out there, what I don't need is a so called professional
telling me that they can help me, I discovered that the client becomes dependant on the facilitator, and the facilitator can
then charge exorbitant fees. Keep downloading and know that
we care, the Fee: No Charge!

Kay Posted: 20/03/2008 20:43

Hi Tom, I really feel for you. Is it true to say that you dont have anyone really close to talk to? I remember years ago I rang the Samaritans and they were anything but helpful. Maybe I was unlucky but the woman I got was somewhat lacking in the support that I truely wanted and needed at that time. I have many friends and family but only my husband and my best friend know or are interested in what I am going through in therapy. My family ask me sometimes but I know in my heart that they just dont get it. They try and I commend them for that but they just dont get it. I have spent god knows how much over the years on this condition and now that I am in therapy, I hope this will resolve it so that I can at least go out and get a job and finally keep it without having to phone in sick(which I had to do many times in my old job). Tom I wish you peace of heart and mind because you deserve it.

Joe L Posted: 21/03/2008 01:10

I agree with anon - this is not the place to hawk your services BUT would say let us have a discussion:
Has anyone researched Dr Abram Hoffer (he is 90 & in BC Canada so no I am not drumming up business for him - just read online or his books) & the whole idea is called Orthomolecular psychiatry.
He has treated mental health patients with megadoses of C, niacin etc and says he has good results. Of course he is called a quack and fool by the Canadian & US establishment & ignored.
So do the megadoses of Dr Hoffer work can anybody tell us - Please note I do think talk therapies can help but if the brain is unbalanced chemically all the talk in the world will not help.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 21/03/2008 18:11

Apologies for letting myself get involved in responding to individual requests for information on this site. My main reason for for reading this site was research and I will continue to read how people here are experiencing and describing their anxiety in order to continue developing my insight into this problem.
My initial postings were intended to make people aware of the existence of Pure Hypno-Analysis. People may investigate this themselves now. I will make no further postings here. If I contribute it will be anonymously as some others choose to do and not related to therapy. I believe in this as a very helpful and supportive forum.
Apologies again if it seemed I was soliciting clients. I am plenty busy and have no need to do so.
- Kieran.

Anonymous Posted: 21/03/2008 20:21

I too find it ridiculous that someone is trying to solicit their services via this forum, but in saying that isn't it a bonus if at least one person feels better as a result of seeing them?
I've received hypnotherapy in the past and found it hugely successful.
Because there's no regulation in this area in this country, be sure to check your hypnotherapists credentials before seeing them. They should be registered with one of this country's main bodies and be able to quote prices upfront.

Tom Posted: 25/03/2008 10:02

Kay/ CW
Thank you for your kind words. Lets keep in touch and help each other.

CW Posted: 25/03/2008 13:42

Hi Tom and All. Tom, just a thought, How do you feel when you are composing your letter to this forum? the reason I ask that is, a year ago I took up a creative writing course and I am writing anything and everything. My first story was about my life and the family, I didn't have to worry about how it looked because it was only for me. Did you know, that we, sensitive people have fab. imaginations. I have come up with some really good stories of fiction, and by
the time you have planned your characters, plots, etc. you may
feel how I do GREAT. Try it and let me know how you get on. Good Luck CW

Kay Posted: 25/03/2008 20:54

Hi all, I was saddened to read some of letters lately on accusing Kieran of looking for business. I honestly feel that he was trying to help and for that I thank him. Anybody who shows an interest in our plight is someone with a good heart in my book. Maybe I am being too trusting but I go on my instincts and they are usually right. So I thank you Kieran for showing an interest. Let's not let this forum end up in a debate on who is right or wrong, lets just do what we have been doing all along, thats giving each other support and being there for each other. I know I have found it very helpful writing on this forum. Makes a huge difference knowing I am not alone no matter how bad I can feel sometimes. talk soon.

Marie Posted: 26/03/2008 08:33

Kieran, just to say thanks for your contributions to this forum. To me you seem sincere and compassionate. Hypnotherapy from what I have read and from what you have posted about it is a valid option for the treatment of anxiety and one which, when I am more in a position to do so, I would be interested in trying. In no way did it seem to me that you were trying to profit from being on this forum but rather to offer help and information for people who could benefit from it. We are all adults here and able to choose between options for treatment when we have information.
I think the post about writing is good. I often write too and it helps me to express intense emotions which when bottled up cause a lot of anxiety. I came across a well reviewed book recently called Write for Life: Healing Body, Mind, and Spirit Through Journal Writing which has more about this. If nothing else writing takes the focus off yourself and your feelings and that in itself is relaxing.
Also something I find helpful to remember is your feelings are not you. You are much more than your feelings. They pass. This helps me not to identify with them too much and to let them pass and not feel victimised by them or too sorry for myself when I am feeling bad.

Tom Posted: 26/03/2008 10:21

Hi all: Thanks everyone very much including Kieran for your comments. CW I will try the writing. I find getting to sleep very difficult with a consequent knock on effect on mood anxiety etc...the next day

Tom Posted: 26/03/2008 12:17

Hi all:
Just had a very bad panic attack, sick etc. It crept up on me very quickly. I have read a book called No Panic which recommended instead of trying to fight the panic instead to just accept and welcome it and ask for more. Also called it a cartoon character Donald Duck. The panic did subside after a while. Has anyone tried this

leigha Posted: 26/03/2008 12:49

i agree, kieran seems genuine and he is just trying to learn about anxiety as we are so nobody should knock him for that

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 26/03/2008 18:36

Thanks for the kind words folks, I appreciate it.
As I said, I will continue to look in here and to post in a general manner.
This book, "No Panic" seems to be giving a right message.
Incredibly intense as they can be, it is hard for a person suffering one to believe that a panic attack is completely harmless.
Our memories are stored in their components. The pictures in the visual part of our brain, the sounds in the auditory part, etc., and the feelings in the kinesthetic part. A panic attack is when the "Feelings" from a past experience come back minus the other information.
How often has someone's name, voice, or face popped into your head in isolation? Or even from time to time an unpleasant image. It is the same with feelings, they can pop into your body detached from the original complete experience.
It is absolutely fine to relax and sit out the "attack". As it is a memory, it will be of finite length/duration. As you are still here, it is, by definition something that you have perfectly survived in the past and so will do so again. In fact, by calmly sitting out panic attacks, they can often subside on their own. When you give them importance and you raise your own sensitivity and fear of them they tend to reoccur.
They are only as frightening as you let them be. They are completely harmless. Even if during the first or subsequent times you thought you were losing it. You are not, they are "past memory feelings".
- Kieran.

Marie Posted: 27/03/2008 13:50

The Donald Duck idea is good. ridicule the panic (not yourself mind you!) instead of seeing it as a scary bogeyman out to get you. also putting the word "attack" in quotes gives me food for thought. if we feel under "attack" (although really we are not we just feel like we are) then we get defensive. I become very defensive when I am anxious and slightly paranoid also and resistant which just makes it worse and makes me very tense. letting go, accepting is the opposite of this. it's hard to do. scary in it's own way and it requires courage to let those defenses down and help and support and understanding too. something which helps me to let go physically is to imagine standing ready to ski at the top of a mountain and focus in the distance and let go down the mountain (you don't have to really do this though!) and keep your focus in the distance. even to focus your eyes on a point in the distance can help or a blank surface and just let your eyes relax. if your eyes are relaxed the rest of you tends to relax as well. this has helped me along with other techniques (breathing, thought stopping) when I'm feeling panicky or anxious.

dave Posted: 31/03/2008 21:25

hi all,was wondering if anyone else out there has the same problem as me.my problem is breaking out in a sweat when i enter a pub,meeting someone i know in a shop or any social place?in work i dont suffer from this at all but its really starting to ruin my life now!i now need to have a few drinks before i head to the pub just to make me relax.any advice would be much appreciated guys

Marie Posted: 01/04/2008 11:50

dave, accept, accept, accept! there's not much u can do about the symptoms but u can do something about how you think about them. don't let it "ruin your life" - that gives the symptoms too much power. one man here said he laughed at the attacks. sit them out, take it easy when they happen. focus on the other person in social situations and the subject of the conversation. go slowly. don't drink too much as a way of coping. it will just make things worse in the end. anxiety is hard to cope with because it is so intense and we would do anything to relieve it, including drink alcohol but in the end overdrinking will cause you a lot more problems than the symptoms of anxiety. take care. try not to worry.

Tom Posted: 01/04/2008 13:07

Marie and Dave: Tom here: Dave Marie is right, accept the symptons, forget the drink to deal with anxiety. Easier said than done. Do not blame yourself. Be kind to yourself. It is not your fault. It is very important to reinforce to yourself that you are okay as a person. Marie can you advise me on any thought stopping techniques that you have learned, as this is a big part of my problem, ie overanalysing and thinking about things that have not happened. Every best wish Tom

Kay Posted: 01/04/2008 20:06

Hi Tom. Have you ever read the book "The Power of Now" by Eckart Tole. I am in the middle of this book at the moment because like you Tom, I let my thoughts run away and end up worrying endlessly about stuff that might never happen. I end up totally exhausted in mind and body and then havent got the energy to do anything. The book goes on a lot about living in the now and not trying to get too much involved in your past or future. While parts of the book seem repetitive, the general idea is when you find your thoughts racing ahead the most important thing to do is STOP. Get up make a cup of tea or do something else and give it your full attention. Say to yourself, right now I am in the kitchen, I am now putting the kettle on and so on..... The idea is just to break the recurring thought pattern and when you do that more and more the consistent thoughts and anxiousness stop. I am trying to do this and it does work. Its like trying to break a bad habbit like smoking(although I do like the occassional ciggy). Sometimes if I am tired I find it hard to follow these suggested steps because lets face it some days are crap and others not so bad. its like trying to retrain your mind and memory. Like trying to learn to live with differnet ideas and thoughts. Dont know if I am making much sense Tom(in my head I am). Best of luck and keep writting to all of us on this forum. If we can help each other a little then its great. In a world thats become too fast, furious and cold we all need that human contact and interaction.

Marie Posted: 02/04/2008 10:25

Tom, what Kay said about the Power of Now is pretty much what I'm using these days to stop myself thinking too much. Just breathing gently into the tip of my nose and then deeply to the lower abdomen as he advises, being still. A yoga position which I have found very calming is the Tree Pose where you focus on an object in the distance and breathe deeply has helped me to clear the mind and tune into the moment and what I am feeling but you needn't do yoga for this to help you, just standing or sitting still in a quiet place will work just as well. It helps to focus your eyes on a point in the distance for some reason or on a word which is calming such as Peace, Love or whatever works for you. this is how meditation works. It can be hard to calm yourself down enough to do it sometimes I find. But it is really beneficial and relaxing and also energising in a good way.
One thing I have realised recently about the overthinking is that I love thinking! Maybe I'm addicted to it!! So sometimes I let myself think and then I say ok, that's it, that's enough thinking for now I'm overdoing it and then use one of the thought stopping techniques and tune out for a while.
Hope this is helpful to you. I have found all of the above really helpful and continues to be helpful for me in my life. Good luck.

ro Posted: 10/04/2008 19:48

I have survived panic attacks. This is mostly by taking medication for them. Its good also to keep oneself busy so one doesn t have time to anticipate them re accuring

Kay Posted: 11/04/2008 13:39

Hi ro. Its good that meds help you cause they got me through some pretty bad ones too. But i am finding that meds are just putting off finding out the reason behind them. Do you know what caused yours? Meds are brilliant and I probably would'nt be here without them, but, there comes a point when we should try and find out what causes panic attacks and why we get them. Have you ever been to therapy?

Kay Posted: 13/04/2008 18:43

Hi All. Just checking in. having panic's on and off for the last few days, just when I thought I was over them. It really knocks my confidence when this happens. I find when I get tired they become more frequent, does any one else find that too? Im tired at the moment so have'nt got the logical part of me to tell the panicky part that this will pass and it wont always be like this. Just would like life without panic.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 14/04/2008 10:51

Hi,
just a point following on from Kay's post regarding therapy to find out the root cause of panic attacks or general anxiety.
Panic or anxiety that is not clearing up itself is due to a cause that you are not consciously aware of. (There is nothing strange about this, most have us have forgotten the events that have shaped us. Potty training is a good example).
So my point is, go for a therapy that is aimed at finding the repressed memory rather than a therapy that focusses on talking about things that you are already aware of. If it was due to those things you would have sorted the problem out a long time ago. These may help with dealing with it but they are a very long way of going about getting rid of it permanently.
- Kieran.

Tom Posted: 14/04/2008 13:36

Hi Ro Kay and Kieran
From personal experience I think relying on Med's exclusively is fraught with danger. I have done so to my cost and the anxiety will not go away.
I am working on thoughts with limited success. I can see what you are saying Kieran as regards the source of thoughts. I sympathise Kay about your panics. I have had lots myself.

Murdie35 Posted: 24/04/2008 11:45

Hi I am wondering if I have anxiety problems. Where do I start. I have been to the doctor 3 times for an ear infection and it never cleared up and then she sent me to the A&E to see the ent doctor on call and the doctor there took an x-ray of my face and looked into my ear and told me it could be my sinitius and gave me stuff for my nose and eyes and as my doctor had given me 3 antibiotics for the ear and didnt work and have an appointment for the ENT Specialist in 2 weeks. Now since I came home from the hospital, My left side of my head has a bit of pain, my ear feels full and the top of my head and back of my head has this shivering feeling in it when I touch it. I am really worried now and need some advice or am I loosing it and feeling down because I dont feel myself. Help from anyone is very welcome. Thanks

Tom Posted: 24/04/2008 21:16

Hi Murdie.
I hope you are feeling a little better than when you wrote your comment. I think it is important to clinically pursue a diagnosis of your symptons until you feel to your satisfaction somebody medically has got at least some sort of fix on it. I have anxiety and depression for along time, and I have been diagnosed with same. There is lots of help of various kinds around but I think the best helps comes from having an indication of what is wrong with you. Pressure in the head is awful and creates an unreal feeling in your whole body. Try to ease your schedule and do some breathing to see if it helps. Breathing in through your nose and out through your mouth does help if it is anxiety. There are lots and lots of other options to try, but I think I would rule out physical before looking at anything else. Kind regards Tom

Anon. Posted: 25/04/2008 11:20

I have tried everything and I have found that affirmation and relaxation techniques do help. These problems are brought on by our thought process and reactions and it can be dealt with by our thought process. I am sick and tired of so called specialists saying I can feel your "suffering", " I feel so sorry for you,'' these sentences adds ammunition to the "FIRE" the psychological fire., Some of these "specialists" take courses advertised on the internet, they study at home and at the end of the course they are told how to attract business by targeting their market (on a site such as this) offer help, always mention how they can help because they are a trained ----- they are also advised to include their contact details now and then, profit profit profit!

Murdie35 Posted: 25/04/2008 13:03

Thanks Tom for that, I am still feeling the same and the side of my head feel stuffed and I have found now that at the back of my left ear where i had the infection, it feels like a lump as I felt behind the right one and its normal, and the lump is a bit sore. One of my friends told me it could be something to do with my glands and my ear and all that as they are all connected. But thanks for the advice, will wait and see the ENT next week.

Tom Posted: 25/04/2008 15:27

Hi everyone!
Murdie hang in there with the symptoms. I have been advised re: anxiety not to add fuel to the fire by dwelling on them too much. Very difficult to do but try it. Also if it is anxiety, the symptoms usually flare up and cool down a little again when the wave passes.

Kay Posted: 25/04/2008 16:41

hi all. I have been feeling crap on and off for the past few weeks. In therapy last week my therapist got me to explain exactly how I felt. I did and understood why I felt crap then. But I am doing all that I can talking to friends my husband and still this anxiety/panic comes back to me. My therapist has explained to me that the feelings I am experiencing are from memories of child abuse. Since I am still trying to come to terms with the fact I was abused and still sometimes dont believe. it the memories and feelings that I had then come back to haunt me. Until I accept that fact and am able to talk about the abuse without wanting to throw up these panic/anxiety attacks will not go away. What does anybody else think?

Anon. Posted: 25/04/2008 17:57

Hello Kay, I agree with your specialist you need to open up about your childhood abuse, but with your specialist, he/she is there to
guide you in the right direction and care for you when you are hurting. I know you will get the courage and you will talk and when you do you will experience a feeling of letting go, and you will then realise that you are a good person, you are loved and
you can move on, I did. Good Luck Kay.

Kieran Fitzpatrick Posted: 25/04/2008 18:25

Kay,
I am a therapist, a Hypnotherapist. What is important, more important than talking about it, is while talking about it letting the feelings happen, let them out. Don't worry about the accuracy of your memories, just go with them, be open to everything and just allow the feelings to happen. There is nothing to be scared of, the abuse is over and you have survived it. It is now okay to let go the fear.
Best of luck.
- Kieran.

Kay Posted: 26/04/2008 18:33

Thanks Anon, It is nice to hear something from a stranger that is encouraging. Sounds like you had a similar experience. Don't want to pry but did you feel like there were times you would never see the end of it and found it hard at times to keep going? If this is hard for you to talk about I understand. Thanks so much for your encouraging words.

Tom Posted: 28/04/2008 12:49

Hi Everyone; I think it is good to let the feelings out. Unfortunately I have found that the feelings do not occur neatly at a help session of what ever kind. This is partly why I am so interested in finding avenues to safely express same. Kay I have received some very helpful hints from yourself and also from other website users. There is one that I have come across which is to widen your fingers as wide as possible when any of these feelings occur and let them come out and imagine releasing whatever is in your system. I am really beginning to believe that there are different "systems" for different situations. What does anybody else think?. Lets keep talking and investigating. All the best. Tom

Anon. Posted: 28/04/2008 14:31

Hello Kay, Yes we do share the same past, and if I don't go into detail I hope you will understand. However, I found to my cost that if I did discuss my past with family they are too emotionally involved to really be of help they love me. When I talked to my close friends I was getting their different opinions and advice, which I really appreciated but, all it did was confuse me and bring me down. If you try to talk to strangers you discover everybody is a specialist or therapist. I discovered that when I had my meetings with my psychotherapist and only him, we were able to work well together I found less confused, he was recording our meetings and the feedback and advice from the Doctor was what worked for me, but I am glad to say Kay I am doing pretty well even my partner commented recently how I have changed, of course I get my down times but I was given "tools" by my Doctor how to deal with those times and it works. I am not very good at explaining myself but, I do hope that it will make sense to you and it will be of some help. Kay stay with your therapist, there are too many
"fly-by-night" helpers out there. I wish you success and I know that you want to put this horrible part of your life behind you and you will NOW OVER TO YOU, YOU CAN DO IT! Good Luck
I'm with you all the way.

Kay Posted: 28/04/2008 16:09

Thanks Anon. I hope you keep on doing well. It sounds silly but it helps to know that others are going through something similiar. I totally respect you not wanting to discuss your past. Thanks so much for your encouragement and kind words.

Anon. Posted: 28/04/2008 21:45

Good Morning Kay, Its me again, I was reading my entry to you and your reply. I did mention that I am not very good at explaining myself and, I now notice I didn't answer any of your questions. Well, as already mentioned I won't go into my experiences other than with my Doctor, I only visit him once a month now and I can cancel that if I don't need it, so that is good progress for me. Anyway, to answer your questions; yes, just like you I felt at times I was getting nowhere, that was when I was confused and I was listing to everybody's point of view, but frustrated because they didn't understand how I really felt and didn't have solutions. My frustration would then become fear because if nobody understood me and couldn't come up with an answer then I felt it must be all in my head and nobody can help me. As for finding it difficult to carry on I think I invented that phrase, I never thought I would say this
but I have dropped that sentence from my "work box" what I
mean by work box words are very dangerous tools, they can
put you up there among the sunshine and white fluffy clouds
with a clear blue sky OR put you right down there in the undergrowth of a dense forest where you may never see the light of day, I am not being dramatic with those two sentences.
If you really feel the sensation they both give to you, then you know how words can affect you, make any sense. Somebody else spoke about the power of words in their blogs and I do believe this. Anyway Kay your life is precious I hope you will always feel the sun on your face and know you are loved.

Anon. Posted: 28/04/2008 22:35

Hello Tom,
I have been replying to Kay for the last few days because we had similar experiences. When I read your entry you mentioned that feelings do not occur neatly at helping sessions I agree, for what it is worth, I recorded my feelings date, time, and what I was doing at that the time in question, that helped us greatly. I am not giving advice here I am just explaining what worked for me, my head was so "all over the place" I couldn't remember my own name. Enough about me, could you explain further the idea of the "fingers and letting go" sounds interesting!

Murdie35 Posted: 29/04/2008 08:54

Hi All, just an update on me. Well still feeling the same the pressure not as bad but still in the back of my head and crying with worry, Am scared now that I have something wrong with my head. My ear on the left now sounds like it might be clearing because when I yawn I can hear it move. If I have something wrong in my head or maybe I am just so worried about it. I hope I dont sound like I need to be locked up. Thanks for all the comments.

Tom Posted: 29/04/2008 09:31

Hi All: I hope everybody is well. first I think this forum has helped me a lot. Murdie, these are all symptoms you have, I just think you need to get a diagnosis that you are comfortable with, it may take more than 1 visit and 1 professional. When you are comfortable with your diagnosis you can then address relieving /fixing the problem. Another contributor said the use of words is very important and I agree very much. In fact in my own case, I believe words affect me on a daily basis in a positive or negative light depending on the words used. I would say it is very important not to chastise yourself like "locked up". None of this is your fault and you did not commit a serious crime, instead you are not currently feeling physically well because of various symptoms. Murdie please do not interpret as a criticism, I am only trying to help, I am not a medical professional, but I have a lot of personal experience of putting myself down, it only makes the situation worse and is addictive in its own right. One of the good things I have found about this facility is that I have picked up new tips and phrases that are useful, the work box phrase is a good one Anon and I fully agree with your descriptions of words. The fingers idea as explained to me is very simple, simply widen your fingers and concentrate and imagine on letting the upsetting feeling out. Regards to everyone and hello Kay

Marie (SCX70797) Posted: 29/04/2008 13:04

Tom, your words help a lot and I know that I need to use my words as well. I am calling the doctor on thursday for my blood results and maybe talk to her then, I do feel stressed a lot as with work but its funny work never got to me before like this and with the ear and everything maybe it is all built up and worry is not a good thing. This site is great as you can feel free to write and no one thinks your crazy. I am grateful for this and will try not to let the stress get to me. It is easier said than done. Keep in touch and thanks for all your words of wisdom.

Tom Posted: 29/04/2008 15:51

Marie: you are very welcome,very easy to say and repeat tips picked up elsewhere, much more difficult to follow. Hope everything goes well on Thurs, keep in touch. Regards to everyone. tom

Marie (SCX70797) Posted: 29/04/2008 16:17

I was wondering if I went to a hypnotist for my anxiety. I see them advertised for anxiety and also those herbal shops or chinese remedies for it. There is a shop like that in my town. Well take care and keep in touch. Thanks

Aine Posted: 04/05/2008 20:23

Marie: Acupuncture has helped me through the hardest part of anxiety that I experienced.
I also tried hypnosis, was ok but I think that perhaps 3 sessions wasn't enough for me - hypnosis is fairly dear though...
I can give you the details of the practices I visited if you want to contact me directly - and no I'm not a therapist etc selling my services...

Marie (SCX70797) Posted: 06/05/2008 10:59

Hi Aine, that would be great as it is awful sometimes with this anxiety. You can email me on murdie35@yahoo.co.uk. I live in the west so not sure if you know of any around here. Thanks for that all help is welcomed.

Tom Posted: 06/05/2008 11:04

Hi All; Hope everybody had a nice weekend. Anxiety has quietened down for me at least for the moment. I have tried Bi Aura for the symptoms with some success. Bi aura is non-invasive. To to my mind an individual needs to look at ones body clock and what you are reasonably able for at the time. This can change depending on your mood. I do think it is helpful to talk / email somebody at the time of an attack

Aine Posted: 06/05/2008 20:15

Hi Marie, I've sent you on the details of a few things I've tried and looked into.
Check out emofree.com - I find this technique very very useful; it seems to have made the biggest difference to me!

Kay Posted: 06/05/2008 22:12

Hi All. I have tryed Reiki lately as a probably last resort. After the first session i was surprised at how relaxed i felt and for the first time in a long time i could see how beautiful this world really is. I thought about hypnotherapy and was advised by a friend who suffers panic attacks like us as well as anxiety not to do it. She told me of a person she knew who got hypnotherapy and while it helped her it also set her back into a spin for about six weeks. She said that all the reasons for her anxiety and panic came out during the sessions but it all happened very quickly and she was severely ill because of these overwhelming feelings. I know everybody is different and each treatment can effect each of us diffenently so i cannt say whether hypnotherapy would be a good idea or not. I do know one thing though if I thought it would help me even a little i think i would be willing to risk feeling bad for a few weeks to finally get rid of anxiety/panic. by the was do any of you have trouble sleeping?

Anon. Posted: 07/05/2008 09:05

Hi, Reiki was great for me also, you described just how I felt. I would love to learn reiki but like everything in Ireland it can be quite expensive whereas a friend of mine in England went to learn Reiki 1 and it only cost her £85.
I went for hypnoses 120 euros first visit and 80 euros each
visit E920.00, more fool me. each week I was told it takes time analysis/hypnosis, don't waste your money.
Please would anybody out there know of a reasonably priced
reiki 1 course. I will keep looking in from time to time. Thanks.
I live in Dublin by the way.

Marie Posted: 07/05/2008 10:22

Hi all, I think any kind of body or breathing therapy helps people with anxiety a lot. i have had a lot of back pain over the last year due to earlier injuries and have been seeing a good physiotherapist regularly. I find an hour with her manipulating my body painful sometimes! but also quite soothing and restful and I notice I feel much calmer afterwards. She is not treating me directly for anxiety but the effect is there all the same. Massage helps me relax too. Must try Reiki and other bodywork techniques since they provide relief and put one in a better more relaxed frame of mind. I notice that my poor posture and shallow breathing often goes hand in hand with increased anxiety which is something I am trying to be more conscious of including using exercises from physio to strengthen my diaphragm and breathe better. Thanks for all the tips

Tom (IUA67144) Posted: 07/05/2008 10:38

Hi all:
Kay yes I have trouble sleeping and when sleep is interfered with it knocks me back. Has anybody been physically sick? I think this physically sick symtons is going away and then it comes back very intensely like this morning. Thinking about the future is a big leader for been sick for me. It induces an underlying feeling of panic. Tom

Kay Posted: 07/05/2008 23:04

Hi Anon, I'm learning Reiki 1 this weekend two day course and its 160 euro. This is very reasonable. another one was going to cost 300 euro.. Some people will charge a lot more than what they should. I will check for you and get back to you on prices. also tom, yes i get a sick tummy and constant nausea when i am stressed out. for the last few days I have been feeling nauceaus and not really eating a lot. its a horrible kind of sickly feeling really yucky. i even got to the stage thinking i would have to be pregnant to feel this sick. but of course i wasnt. I just hope by talking about my feelings with my therapist that these feelings will go.

Kay Posted: 07/05/2008 23:30

Hi anon, there are hundreds of places doing reiki 1 in dublin. some are expensive but I have found two in dublin that are reasonable. if yu want to look on the web in general just key in reiki courses in dublin and goodle it. you will get lots of information on learning reiki 1. good look.

Anon. Posted: 08/05/2008 14:04

Thanks a million Kay for getting back to me 160 is reasonable.
I have googled Reiki in the past and the fees were in the 300 mark, too much! Would you let me know how you get on, I would love to do the course.
To Tom;
In Kay's entry she mentioned nausea etc. This has been happening to me in the last six months since I stopped working. (maybe because I have more time to think) If I am facing something I do not want to do i.e. meet certain people, go to places I would prefer not to go to. I become very anxious and that is when I notice I feel sickly, as Kay said, like morning sickness. I have had depression and anxiety for many years but this sickly feeling is new to me. Anyway, I am glad you are all there to reach out to. Thanks again.

Kay Posted: 08/05/2008 15:44

Hi Anon. I dont think I am allowed to put web sites on this forum but I can give you the email addresses of just two of the courses i came accross while on the net. they both do reiki courses. One is general.enquiries@ide.cdvec.ie and the other one is Info@acuDetox.ie If not key in reiki courses in dublin and go to the second and third pages where you will find some affordable courses. If you dont get any information from these then i can give you my email address and i can send you the sites direct. You should go for it. Best of luck.

Anon. Posted: 08/05/2008 16:23

Thanks Kay you are very kind, I will do what you suggest and
let you know how I get on in the weeks to come.
All the best for tomorrow hope you enjoy every minute!

Do (QRP68163) Posted: 08/05/2008 20:47

Hi
Just a note to say that I have recently completely treatment by Hypno-Psychoanalysis and it worked for me. Having suffered from panic attacks for more than 12 years and tried hypno therapy, medication, couselling I decided to try Hypno-Psychoanalysis. I have now completed this treatment and all the fears, anxiety, panic and panic attacks have ceased. This form of treatment helped me to get to the root of the problem. I was able to deal with root of the problem and resolve it. I now feel completely better and am amazed that I was able to find the problems that lead to my panic attacks and solve them so quickly. The treatment wasn't easy from an emotional point of view, I had to face things I hadn't thought about for years or realised the effects those memories and feeling were having on me. But, having now faced them, learnt what they were/are, what effects they were having on me I am cured. For me it only took 6-7 sessions but it worked. Different things work for different peolpe, Hypno-Psychoanalysis worked for me and I would definately recommend it. However, I am not going to push this form of treatment on others - that is up to you to decide. There is lots of information on the web about this form of treatment, people can investigate it if they wish and form their own opinions. All I can say from my own experience,as I've said before, is that it has worked for me - I feel completely better and long may it last. For those of you reading this post I hope you find a way, whatever that may be, to resolve how your feeling and get better soon. Good luck.

Tom Posted: 09/05/2008 07:58

Thankyou Anon and Kay for all your kind comments. It is trying to handle this sickly feeling when stressed that is the challenge. Still it is good to feel supported like I do from this forum.

Ann Posted: 09/05/2008 11:57

Hi, I read your posting re hypnosis and psychoanalysis and while
I would agree with analysis I do not agree with combining both.
I know psychoanalysis works I have often attended for counselling and analysis and it is a wonderful way to download, unscramble your thought process and generally get one back on track, but I associate hypnosis with the theatre, I do not mean to offend, but
I think psychoanalysis would give you the same outcome. The main thing is, you are well and feeling wonderful but so am I and
may our good health continue.

Anon Posted: 09/05/2008 12:08

Hello Tom That feeling of sickness has passed but I think it is because I put off the two appointments I to attend. I am feeling
more guilty each time I postpone someone or something. I find
guilt to be a big problem with me and low self esteem.

Aine Posted: 09/05/2008 21:50

DO,
Can you email me the details of the treatment you speak of? ami-dr@hotmail.com
Thanks!

Kay Posted: 09/05/2008 22:29

You know all you guys are really great strong people. Myself included in that. Not many could cope with the restricted lives we have had on and off. I find also if i have something coming up or somewhere to go where i am not comfortable doing, i immediately get that sickly feeling. Butterflies are what others would say this feeling was. But to me its pure nausea. Then the event I had been dreading going to passes and I might even enjoy myself. Why I put myself through all the trauma of worrying about stuff that might never happen or even imagine terrible things happening like panicking or freaking out. The thing is I have never freaked out in public and never lost control so why do I worry about it? The answer for me is "child abuse". Through therapy I realise my big thing is control. If i dont feel like I am controlling the situation then thats it all hell breaks loose in my head and I panic. I have been in therapy now for almost a year. Its been a hell of a year. Times when I didnt think i would see 2008. I know from research that recovering from child abuse is not quickly fixed and it sometimes seems like therapy is my life. But I think the road I am taking is working, slowly, very slowly, but working nonetheless. I think of you all every day.

Tom Posted: 11/05/2008 13:34

Hi Anon & Kay:
This nausea & throwing up really got bad today and yesterday. It took a long time to get this nausea and throwing up under any control for the last 2 days. Feel pressure in the head and then the vicegrips seems to release me from its clutches for a while. A distinct cause of this is work stress and the feeling of not earning enough money to cover the bills now or in the future. Panic overwhelms me work wise and then I am good for nothing. I am calling this panic Donald Duck and I keep telling him to go away but to no avail. I have been in the heavy medication room and it really did nothing for me except blurred my thinking. It is good to get this stuff written down. Maybe somebody can relate to it. I am aware of things not to do, one of which is to add fuel to the fire so to speak but I cannot help doing so. I am aware of the mood swings issue as well, but somehow whatever I do does not seem to work. This Donald Duck has just taken over my life. I do not think I am crazy, but I do know I am all over the place. I am certainly glad of this forum so that I can write all of this stuff down. I do hope other people had a good weekend. Keep in touch Tom

Tom Posted: 12/05/2008 12:42

Hi Do
Tom here. Great to hear that you have conquered the anxiety.
Be very grateful if you could email me the contact to tnerruc@yahoo.com
Many thanks Tom.
Kay I read your words with great care. I think you are very strong and wise. I just hate this panic and sickness. Also to anon and Marie many thanks. Feel free to drop me a line on the email. Hang in there Tom

anon Posted: 12/05/2008 21:15

Hi Tom,
I read your recent posting and hope by now the sickness has
passed. The way I look at is, I have had it before and it will
pass, it takes the fear out of the situation for me if you know what I mean. I like most of us, don't have the answer but I care so keep posting.

Anon Posted: 12/05/2008 21:31

Hi Kay,
How did you get on with Reiki 1. I checked the internet
pages and have made enquiries with the view to booking my
course.
I have a friend in England and a month or so ago I explained how I was going through a bad time, she asked a Reiki Master
to include me on her distance healing list. Apparently, I am
sent healing every day and I must say it has helped me a lot.
"I never knock it until I try it".
I look forward to your posting.

Marie Posted: 12/05/2008 22:42

To all my fellow sufferers. Please step outside of your "heads" and back into reality. We are spending our days, weeks, months giving life; legs and strength to our fears and anxieties. They are feelings and we have to remember that
a feeling never killed anybody. And what are we doing! waiting
around watching and waiting for the next one to come along.
Wish me luck when I say I am going to live and not just think
about yesterday. Too few days, months, years left. I hope you
will do the same. Otherwise, we are just fodder for all those
therapists out there. Wake Up! it is up to you, Good Luck and
I hope this straightforward postings helps one more person.

Colette Posted: 12/05/2008 22:54

I have spent the last hour reading over the entries you have made to this site and, what is most obvious to me as a visitor
looking for an answer is we are all experiencing fear. My Mother used to say "Today was the tomorrow we worried about yesterday and, All Is Well" I think my Mother had the answer 90+ years ago. Its only a suggestion, what do you think?

Tom Posted: 13/05/2008 09:08

Hi Anon:
Many thanks for your kind words. Currently it seems to have lessened a little. It really is something else at its height. The distress it causes is unreal.

CU Posted: 13/05/2008 14:33

Hello Colette,
You brought me back to my childhood, my Mother used to
quote the same saying to us and thinking back, I was always
a worrier and this is when Mother would quote this to us.
I agree with you about worrying, and it is more obvious today.
We never hear good news on radio and t.v. anymore. When I
was a child we didn't have news coming into our lives from all
over the world, but now we get news flashes on the news channels, the newspapers are full with shootings, people being
stabbed. Advertisements telling us to buy alarms to keep us
safe in our houses. Insurance should we be ill and have no
money. SURE, IS IT ANY WONDER WE ARE LIVING IN FEAR!
CU

Kay Posted: 13/05/2008 15:28

Hi Anon. the reiki course was cancelled after. The lady organising it rang me and said the other two women doing it with me had to cancel due to change in circumstances. I was very disappointed but it is supposed to be going ahead in June. I am going for a reiki treatment on thurs so hopefully it will lift my spirits.
To Marie, i understand what you mean by living and forgetting about feeling bad. This is easier said than done. I am perfectly capable of doing this when i am in good enough form but when the day is bad its very hard to rise above the feelings of anxiousness. As for therapists they are there to do a job. i dont think they would train to do this work if they werent compassionate about what they do. I also dont think they could sit and listen to clients telling them sometimes very disturbing things just for the hell of it. Therapists, most of them anyway, have a very important part to play in recovery. O.K. i agree that not everyone will be suited to therapy but it helps people to open up and talk about their problems. Also, therapy is not a quick fix and it can be easy to get discouraged and give up on it. But on the whole therapy is the best way to find out why anxiety is caused and panic attacks(there is always a reason). It wont happen overnight but it will happen.
Tom. i hope you are doing ok. i am having a pretty rough time lately and finding it hard to see a way through but through therapy i am slowly finding a way. If i thought hypno-analysis would work for me, i would do it in an instant too just to stop the emotional pain.

Anon Posted: 13/05/2008 18:26

Hi Kay & Tom,
Thanks for letting me know about weekend. Sorry it was cancelled, I had visions of you enjoying the two days, you
have it to look forward to and I hope it will work for for you.
I have a family member ill and in hospital so I won't be taking any courses just at the minute. Enough about Reiki, I notice in your posting you said you are going through a low patch, I am going to try a bit of meditation and my own distance healing for both yourself and Tom if you wish. Maybe you would let me know if that is o.k. I have been told on occasion that it has done some good. Tom! if you are reading this just let me know if you are o.k. with this. I wish you both love and
peace.

Kay Posted: 14/05/2008 17:41

Hi Anon. the distance healing would be fine with me. i will take any help thats available. thankyou for being so caring.

Tom Posted: 14/05/2008 21:47

Hi Anon: This is very very kind of you to do this, and I am indeed very touched about this. To Kay, and to anybody else in distress reading this forum hang in there and keep going. Best wishes Tom

Tom Posted: 15/05/2008 21:10

Just a quick note hoping to find everyone well. Appreciate the support given during the week. Best wishes Tom

Anon Posted: 16/05/2008 12:10

Hi Tom, Kay and fellow sufferers, First of all I have sent you distance healing and will do each day so hope it is of some benefit, end of that subject.
You will remember I told you I have a family member in hospital, well its my older brother and he is an alcoholic but he is now so ill I don't think he will be drinking in the future the Doctor said that the next drink will kill him. I look at him now and he is like an old man, and I pity him so much but, I am so confused because it is my brother who caused me to be the way I am. The amount of anger I had towards him was unbelievable and it has gone on since I was a child. However, two weeks ago I lost the head and I didn't know what I was doing because I cringe now with embarrassment, I went to visit him in hospital as usual and before I knew it I was verbally attacking him and I think the other patients and visitors could hear me but at the time I was unaware of this. That weekend I cried, and sank into a big black hole, I won't go any further but I think maybe you have got the message. A week or so later my older sister "opened my eyes for me" when she said he is old now and his brain has been damaged with the toxins (we
were told) and he is not the man we knew the alcoholic. My
heart now bleeds for him and, I am glad that I am now at peace but will my anger come back some day and bite me on the B... when I least expect it.
I don't know if you will understand this posting I am not the best at writing but I do my best.
Love and peace of mind to you all.

Kay Posted: 19/05/2008 10:02

Hi Anon. Are you angry at your brother because he is an alcoholic? If yu have a lot of anger you need to get it out. You need to talk to someone maybe a professional about why you are so angry. When anger is kept inside it turns inwards and forms into depression or panic attacks. Either way is not nice. I have a lot of anger also and over time I have found the best way to express it is either for me to break dishes against a wall. Cheap dishes, thrown against a wall with strength is a great release. as you are throwing them say out loud you stupid f-----r or whatever else comes into your head. let it out and yes you have to clean up after it but its worth it. I also recently invested in a punch bag I thought it would be better than breaking dishes and ultimately cheaper but it dosent have the same release for me. I know it sounds a little potty but for me it works. obviously this is done alone. Is your brother the main factor in your illness? I know i have held anger for years and to me detriment it has caused me terrible bad times. It make it worse when the anger is through no fault of your own but somebody else. I hope i have been of help. talk soon and keep on going it will get better but you must talk about it to someone who wont judge or give advice just some one who will listen and support you. This is not your fault. Be brave my friend and get some help.

Anon Posted: 19/05/2008 13:00

Hi Kay, I really appreciate your advice, you have given me
a lot to think about. I think I will leave the plate idea with you I am far to practical Ha! (don't like cleaning up).
Keep smiling!

Tom Posted: 19/05/2008 19:41

Hi everyone:
Anon thanks again for the distance healing. I think your writing is very good and you should be proud of it. I decided to have a series of tests, which are due to take place next Friday. If I go the psychriatist he simply asks me what this vomiting is about. As it is continuing on a regular basis, I want to have an overall health check as I have lots of symptons some of which could be due to a physical situation. Kay I think you are right about the anger and letting it out. I find myself opening my fingers really wide and letting it out. I have used pillows as well. This suffering that we are all experiencing is bad, I really do not know what I would do without this forum. Best wishes Tom

Anon. Posted: 20/05/2008 09:36

Thank you for your nice words Tom, just thinking! a compliment goes a long way and we do not compliment each other enough, we are all too busy trying to keep up with the rat race. Anyway, Tom you are a gentleman thank you once again.
Re your suggestion about talking to a professional. I had a bad experience about 10/12 years ago which turned me off the idea.
My G.P. suggested I see a Psychiatrist, I attended for the session only to me interviewed by one of his trainees (for the want of a
better name). We sat with each other for 20 minutes and all she did was look at her watch and yawn, the body language
was dreadful. She then gave her notes to the Psychiatrist, he called me in to his office and asked me why was I wasting their time etc. Kay, Tom I had told that young girl that I had tried suicide on one occasion and am feeling as bad not to mention the reason for my feelings which I won't go in to on this open forum. You can imagine how vulnerable and raw I felt at that moment. My life was in the hands of that young girl because I hadn't got the energy to take it further. I never went to anybody again.
Tom I am delighted that you are going for that check up, you will feel the better for it, and Kay you are so supportive
of everybody, you are worth your weight in gold.
Have a really good day to you both.

Kay Posted: 20/05/2008 22:33

Hi Anon. thanks for your kind words. You had a really bad experience with the psychiatrist's trainnee. god this shouldnt have happened. its criminal and i find it completely astonishing that a junior could be left to talk to you. I know i watch my therapist like a hawk and constantly check to see if shes paying attention to me as i am talking. So far she has never let me down and the details that she remembers about stuff i talk about is amazing. I think thats why i trust her so much. I know i am lucky to have found a good dedicated therapist like her. I have heard other stories about therapists too. Not good stories. If you could find the strength to see someone else that would be of great help to you. Something like this is very upsetting to happen to you and you dont deserve to be treated like that. You get the help you deserve Anon. If you could find the courage to try another therapist that would be great. I am really very annoyed by your experience and I think I might have to go and break some plates!!!!
You deserve so much more than that please please see if you can find some help whether it be another therapist or something else.
Tom I hope you are doing ok. I think about the people on this forum every day and I pray we all get the lives we deserve back soon. peace and happiness to you all. Kay

Anonymous Posted: 22/05/2008 07:45

I am 55 (smoker) trying to quit with patch. but
got broncitis/pneumonia ...I was very tired and weak, but did'nt have the chills or sweating.
I am feeling stronger now... and am on the patch.
but i still have pains in my shoulders, is this common with pneumonia?? and my other question, how can I avoid getting it again. I know about the injection to prevent it, plus the flu shot. Its been 5 weeks.
Is it ok for me to go walking...should i cover my nose/mouth?? some friend said its important??? Thank You So Much.

Anon. Posted: 22/05/2008 11:47

To Anonymous. In my opinion your questions should be answered by your Doctor, you don't want to be given the
wrong advice by a non medical person, your health is far
too important to you and your family.
You are certainly going through the "wars" what with sickness
AND giving up cigarettes but, as an ex smoker I promise you
without reserve you will feel 100% better and you will be far
less likely to chest illness.
Look forward to good health my friend and I wish you the very
best of good health and luck.

Tigger Posted: 23/05/2008 11:44

Hey all hope you are all well.. Im new so am trying to get used to this place.. I have suffered with depression, Anxiety and panic attacks for the last 11 and half years. it just feels there is no end to it now. I have been on numerous medication and have been on prozac for the last year and half and serqual to help me relax and sleep. Now neither of these are working anymore the prozac is making my anxiety and panics worse so she is bringing me down off them as its effecting my day to day life terrible and my psych has suggest the mood stablisers but also that they make you put on weight and have a lot of side effects or go back to one of the drugs I was on a few years back and try them again. (she is suggesting ciprimil again). I just cant cope with the anxiety anymore. Do any of you have any suggestions for me? Any greatly appreciated xxxx

Kay Posted: 24/05/2008 14:17

Hi Tigger. Its horrible and feels hopeless to feel like this at times. All i can say is that different things work for different people. Do you know what causes your depression/panic? Over the years i have tried a lot of things. Medication especially. I think the meds work temporarily at least. I have also tried the Bach Flower Remedies which i thought were good with no side effects like meds. I wonder why some people sail through life with little or no illness unlike us. It seems unfair.
Do you talk to your psychiatrist about your life? Some people have recommended Hypno-therapy. I have never tried this but I would if I had the chance.
This depression has cost me a lot over the years in terms of money and also my quality of life. I wouldnt like to add up the finance I would say it is definately in the thousands and I am not talking one or two thousand here.
As bad as that is the cost to my personal life has been much worse. In that i have had a very small life very safe. Never travelled much and always said no to oppertunities that came my way for fear of anxiety/panic ruining it all. So playing it safe was the best way for me. I'm so fed up with playing it safe now though. I want to live, I want to travel, I want to get a job and be able to keep it and most of all enjoy it. Normal things but to me they would be amazing. Tigger it does get better. talk to others like us here on this forum. You are never alone. Log on here and write what you feel. get it out in the open.

Tom Posted: 26/05/2008 09:54

Hi All
I hope you had a nice weekend.
Tigger, I have relied on drugs over the years with only limited success. I am particularly concerned about heavier medication as the side effects on concentration is high. My mobility is somewhat limited so a lot of physical exercise is not really on for me. I can be really despairing and limiting as Kay says. Personally the only real support I am getting in 2008 is from this forum and from Biaura sessions. Other people are sympathetic but somehow do not undertstand. I have found some benefit in calling it something specific, and ridiculous like Donald Duck.
Donald Duck has really narrowed the scope of my life.I have a longer period of time than you, but the principle is the same. As soon as a med person hears about the length of time they want a history from other med people and attitude is very much tailored from that. Also therapists talk about homework, which is really tough to do on your own. They also talk about you solving your problems. I also dislike this idea of been told that everybody is different, and been held out as been almost a freak. Perhaps that is me been supersensitive.
Tigger I think it is a good idea to talk / write. I know that I have an empty life, I would wish for something that I could become passionate about, which did not involve much energy, as I find it hard enough to get through the day. To everybody else, I hope life is well and best of luck for the day. Tom

Tigger Posted: 26/05/2008 12:51

Hey there thanks for writing back Kay and Tom, really appreciate it. It is so unfair that we have had to go through this but what can we do, it's just not fair. I do talk to my Physco a lot, see her every 4 weeks and have great support with my dad but he still finds it hard to understand when I'm down and having panics. no-one knows until they actually go through it how hard it is and how much it takes over your life and ruins it as well. I get the panics mainly about death. I've seen a behavioural therapist and she helped but still doesn't help if ya get me...what can we do like? Go off the meds all together and see what happens? Are both of you still on medication??

Kay Posted: 26/05/2008 19:13

Hi Tigger. I am only taking prozac maybe twice a week now and I am off the rest of the meds. When I was at my worst I was on prozac, Amitriptyline and xanex every four hours just to get me through the day. I was also taking sleeping tablets too. I suppose Looking at it that way I am getting better. I know prozac taken the way I take it doesnt work like that. It is supposed to be taken regularily for it to work properly. Its really only like a placebo now. In that when i get up in the morning and if i feel bad the first thing i do is take my prozac but if i get up and feel ok then i forget to take it so i suppose thats a good sign. The one thing probably stopping me from moving forward now is the fear that i will ever get that bad again. It was such a very horrible time. I still get bad days and some days i am so afraid of what the future holds it is almost unbearable. I know my worst fear is that i will always be like this and i am doomed to a life of panic/anxiety. I live in hope like a lot of others, that some day i can live a full life, and be truely happy. I know that life will never be 100% easy. But just to be able to take it as it comes and cope well in difficult situations. Tigger, a lot of people i know have a fear of dying when panic attacks. Its is probably the most common symptom of panic. Some feel they cannt breathe and fear they are having a heart attack. I on the other hand dont have this fear. My fear is that i am going insane and will snap and do something irrational.
Tom I hope you are doing o.k. This forum for me too is a great help. I find comfort in knowing others are like me and knowing i am not alone is a a help too. I sometimes think this illness is more difficult for a man. It is sometimes considered to be a female illness and we both know that is not the case. I think sometimes the high suicide rate among men is due to this illness. Men find it very hard to talk about feelings (some men that is).
I think you are great Tom. I admire you for your courage to talk about this with us here on this forum. Please keep talking with us here. all the best. Kay.

Patrick (PgMckeown) Posted: 30/05/2008 08:13

hi
I work in the area of chronic hyperventilation and while most of my work is with asthma, chronic overbreathing causes blood flow to the brain to decrease quite significantly. Basically if you mouth breathe or have heavy breathing, various blood gases are disturbed and reduced oxygen reaches the brain. Depending on genetic predisposition, this can lead to excessive brain cell excitability.
The following exercise is simple and very effective for anxiety. In addition, you need to keep your mouth closed all the time and nasal breathe. Try the exercise for fifteen to twenty minutes when your mind is racing. If it works, please leave a message on the forum. If its does not work, please also leave a message.
This is a very gentle exercise and you should feel warmer while you do it.
This exercise can be practiced thousands of time per day. It is gentle, suits older people and will dramatically reduce symptoms.
Many small breath holds to reduce symptoms (anxiety, panic attack)
ü Do many small breath holds of 2-5 seconds each.
ü Breathe in, breathe out and hold breath.
ü Hold breath for 2-5 seconds.
ü Do not try to hold your breath for longer than 2 to 5 seconds because it would only increase breathing which will aggravate your symptoms.
ü After each breath hold, breathe normally for ten to fifteen seconds. Donít interfere with your breathing.
ü Continue to do a small breath hold followed by gentle breathing for ten to fifteen seconds. Practise this exercise until symptoms have passed.

Marie Posted: 30/05/2008 10:44

thanks, Patrick. sounds useful. I have been a mouth breather with allergies, sinus problems all my life as well as developing anxiety disorder. had to have surgery on my nose some years back to help me breathe better to stop chronic sinus infections. I read too about panic/anxiety prone people having extra sensitivity to suffocating sensations which I sometimes get from the feeling of not being able to breathe properly in a stuffy environment. will try your exercise when anxious and let you know.

Colette Posted: 30/05/2008 11:33

Hi Patrick, Your suggestion sounds good to me and I will take the advice on board. Do you have any advice on the following. When I am in a situation where I become anxious I need to take a deep breath but at these times it is not satisfying breath, do you have any ideas. This has happened to me all my life.
I do have mild asthma but it is very mild and I use an once a
day to prevent an attack.
I would value your views.

Tom Posted: 04/06/2008 10:13

Hi All: I hope everyone is well. Does anybody have any ideas about an absorbing change of mind thought, apart from the relaxation techniques. My mobility is limited so sports and a lot of exercise/ physical stuff is out for me. Thanks Patrick for your breathing exercise. Kay I hope you are well.

Patrick (PgMckeown) Posted: 04/06/2008 11:37

Hi Colette
The fact that you feel you cannot draw a satisfying breath is due to chronic overbreathing. The part of the brain that regulates breathing volume is sending continuous messages for you to take more air in. The greater the amount of air inhaled, the more the cycle perpetuates.
Just a person who is overeating- example ten meals per day may never feel full. Their body is craving food.
If you have been breathing through your mouth or heavily through your nose, your body becomes accustomed to this heavier breathing.
There are a number of books about how to reverse chronic hyperventilation. One of my books is called Close Your Mouth. Others available include freedom from asthma, or breathing free. Books will provide a very good insight into chronic over breathing.

Patrick (PgMckeown) Posted: 04/06/2008 11:41

"I need to take a deep breath".
Why do you need to take a deep breath? Is the breath a deep breath or a big breath?
More than likely, you are already taking big breaths. Therefore you dont need to take more big breaths as this will make symptoms worse. Instead try the small breath holds when stressed.
Physiologically, this is similar to the old brown paper bag but it is a lot safer.

Colette Posted: 04/06/2008 22:42

Thanks for getting back to me Patrick I will work on my breathing. It is tackling the ten meals a day that worries me Ha!
only joking.
-Colette

Anon Posted: 05/06/2008 13:16

Hi Marie & Tom, I haven't been on the computer for a while,
I'm busy visiting my brother and when I am not with him I
am busy worrying about him. He is hanging in there as the
saying goes. What I have to let you know is I have changed
a lot in the past month or so towards my brother, you will
remember I had feelings of hatred, frustration and anger towards him, well I have let that go, or I should say it has drained away. for the want of a better description. If anybody had said that to me a year ago I would have said Not Possible. God is in his heaven and all is good.

Kay Posted: 05/06/2008 13:36

Hi Anon. glad you are feeling better towards your brother. How did you manage to move forward? What did you do to get rid of these feelings about your brother?

Marie Posted: 05/06/2008 13:57

Just want to say thanks for posting, Patrick. I have been watching my breathing closely and today making sure I am breathing through my nose most of the time. Also watching my posture too as I know this contributes to bad breathing and I have to say I feel much better breathing this way. It's impossible to shallow breathe through your nose. Simple but effective advice and I even though I have "known" this for years my habit is to rush about stressed and shallow breath and gasp for breath sometimes. Also definitely helps contain the racing thoughts and the hypoglycemia which has gone along with my anxiety/panic.

Tom Posted: 05/06/2008 16:07

Hi folks Tom here, Patrick trying to start this breathing technique that you recommended. Kay and Anon, I too would like to know more about letting go Hope you are all well. Still trying to think of something I could be passionate about, to act as distraction suggestions very welcome

Tom Posted: 05/06/2008 16:08

Sorry Pressed send by accident. Wanted to say thanks for all the support you chaps are giving me.

Kieran Posted: 05/06/2008 20:36

Hi Kay, I honestly think it was when I lost my head with him, It was a moment of insanity! and out of character. When I came around all I could see was a weak old man who was very sick, it wasn't the man that harmed me. I know religion is out of fashion these days but I do my best to do everything in the name of Jesus even my intentions and healing towards others. So Kay my eyes were really opened and my memories forgotten.
Hope this makes some sense to you, I am not like this everyday
but I do my best.

Patrick (PgMckeown) Posted: 06/06/2008 09:09

has anyone sat down and practised the many small breath holds for twenty minutes or so? Good feedback is when you feel warm. This will enhance oxygenation of the brain due to the relaxing affect of CO2 on smooth muscle on blood vessels.
In addition, try to suppress sighs as a sigh is enough to maintain chronic hyperventilation.

Anon Posted: 06/06/2008 12:54

Sorry Kay I am sure you are confused when you received a reply
from my husband Kieran, I was using his laptop. I usually just
use Anon, Anne is my name I hope you understood my posting
regarding my brother.
Best wishes to both yourself and Tom

Kay Posted: 06/06/2008 15:50

Hi Anne. Thanks for setting things straight. I know how difficult it is to let things go. In my own journey, I too have had to some releasing of feelings and emotions carried inside me for a long time. I am still working on it and i know i have more to still come out. Everybody has their own way in dealing with releasing issues etc. The thing is to find a way that is good for you. Some people take self defence classes others walk or jog and others do art or writing.
Tom, do you know (and I am not asking you to tell me details) why you are anxious and panicky?
I kinda feel now at the ripe age of 40 that anyone who has this thing that we all have, have been through something very emotionally upsetting in our lives at some time or another. Some of us remember what happened others forget and bury the memories.
I dont know, its all really up in the air. People differ in opinions as do doctors. Hope you are doing ok Tom.

Anon Posted: 11/06/2008 13:17

Hi Everybody especially Kay and Tom.
How are ye all. I hope it is the sun that is keeping ye away from the computer.
Kay my brother has turned the corner and is regaining his health. he is becoming very aggressive with the medical staff and his two sisters ( myself and my older sister). I see the old brother resurfacing and all my bad memories are coming back even though I am an adult. I thought he had changed but no, he is still the manipulative person I always knew he was. I can't believe I fell for it again, I even told him that I love him and consider him my brother again, after all these years. My sister is the kindest person that I know and she has always "been like a Mother to him. he takes advantage of her every opportunity and then gives her abuse. I cannot bear it so I have been doing my best to show her what he is doing. I want to tell her everything but I can't. I am the youngest, thirteen years younger than my sister and nine years younger than my brother. I am so fed up with it all. Sorry about this outburst of emotion but I will do something drastic if I don't get it out. I don't want to sit with a counsellor and talk, so I will just keep typing. I hope yourself and our friend Tom (I hope you don't mind, but I do look on you both as friends) are doing well.
Anne-Anon.

Tom Posted: 11/06/2008 16:26

Anon; Thanks for saying I am a friend, very honoured. However the sun has not really helpe my mood. I have had a lot of agitation and finding it hard to shift. Feel going down again. I would like to get off this public forum for communicating. Would Kay or yourself be interested in emailing between us privately. If so I can. Anon that is your emotion saying you will do something. Quell that beast. I think I need somebody to bring me back to the now. Kay I hope you are well, I read that book by Edgar Tole. It is very relevant. We are a great bunch of people to be able to do anything with these afflictions inside us. Best wishes to all Tom

Kay Posted: 11/06/2008 20:25

Hi Anon. you are not a bad person for being taken in by your brother. Its him the baddness belongs to. Sometimes when bad people are sick they think they are going to meet their maker and try and make up for all the harm they have done in their lifetime. This may sound drastic but I think first of all you must confide in someone what he did to you and maybe that could be your sister. She has to believe you. secondly is there any way you can distance yourself from your brother. Just because people are family dosent mean we have to have them in our lives. There have been times when i have had to distance myself from my own family because they just dont get it. Now I see them on my terms only. I wont pretend its been easy, I have spent my lifetime running around after my sister and mother. I have stood on my head for them both. I know they love me but they have not been there for me in the past year. emotionally or otherwise. My mother is so emotionally draining its almost suffocating. I find it hard to look at her at times and not want to bloody strangle her for not protecting me when I was a child. She was so caught up in her own world that I just struggled to be safe. At just five years of age this is a monumental task. Please, get help. Have you got a close friend you can talk to. Keeping this inside you is not good. You deserve to be happy and at peace. None of this is your fault its your brothers. Its ok to hate him, its ok to resent him. Keep writing here too. Anything to release feelings and pent up emotions is good. I consider it a privilige to be thought of as your friend. I check my e-mails every day so I will answer you anytime.

Anon Posted: 12/06/2008 13:41

Hi Kay,
Thank you for your kind words I appreciate them and take note of all you say. When you suggested that I confide in
my sister. Well! my sister is the kindest most considerate person you would ever encounter, I have never known a time when she was not "there" for me and everybody else for that matter. She survived cancer, and I won't go into too much detail but believe me she has had her fair share of what life can throw at her, and I am not going to give her yet another problem to worry about. Kay I love her with all my heart and one leech in the family is enough. If when anger rears its head I will turn to the computer, its best for me at the moment.
As for keeping a distance, I was doing pretty well until he was taken into hospital and I wanted to lighten my sisters duties so I started visiting the hospital alternate days (as I say, for my sisters sake) but hopefully I will get back on track again soon.
Kay I do not want to say much more at this time for fear of being recognised by friends or colleagues.
Take care of yourself you seem to be a very genuine and caring person, you are a member of a dying breed! Anne.

Anon Posted: 12/06/2008 14:23

Hi Tom,
I knew there was something wrong when you went missing off the site, please keep posting I always like to read your entries.
Tom you know you have been in this 'bad' place before and you
came out of it so hang on in there.
With regard to communicating directly, one of my many problems is commitment and I become very anxious when I
have to commit, whereas I can pop in and out of the site, I
have no pressure because nobody knows me. I hope that
makes sense to you, I hope I am not letting you down, it is
the last thing I would want to do. I sincerely wish for you
peace of mind and happiness I know you deserve it.
Please keep posting, Anne

Tom Posted: 12/06/2008 17:08

Hi Anon. thanks for your kind words. Understand re the committment, as I have that issue as well. I just do not want to give too many details away on a public site in case I am recognised. Hello to Kay and anybody else that is reading this site and suffering from anxiety and depression. Kind regards Tom

Anon Posted: 12/06/2008 20:20

Hi Tom,
I still feel as if I am letting you down, we are all in the same position nobody wants to be recognised, but don't you think the fact that we are anonymous takes the pressure off us. I
personally don't need to go into every detail of events to be
helped and maybe you don't either, please let me know if you
agree or not.
We have to remember that we are HERE for each other, that
thought helps me and I do hope it helps you.
Suggestion; it is now 8.15 p.m. Thursday the 12th. and tomorrow is a new day and we can make it what we want it
to be it is totally in our "hands" we are in charge! Tom, sorry
I am going off on one as the saying goes, accept or reject my
idea I won't be offended.
All the best Anon.

Angst!! Posted: 13/06/2008 13:06

Hi, I have been reading a lot about anxiety and while for women much of it comes on in the run up to menopause, vital nutrients are key along with emotional support, exercise and relaxation along with good food!! Have a look at this website. Although it is aimed at women, the underlying causes may in fact be the same. I found this helpful. My own anxiety came on from 3 car accidents, family illness and job loss arising car accidents so it was something which needed many approaches. No one thing i.e. anti-depressants cures anxiety as it can have a no. of aggravators! Hope this link helps. There are some brilliant articles written by understanding medics. http://www.womentowomen.com/depressionanxietyandmood/anxiety.aspx

carebear Posted: 13/06/2008 15:21

Great to see so many people helping each other

Pearl Posted: 13/06/2008 17:53

Kay, Just reading about your anger management trick. I too have much long term anger which has caused me to be very depressed at times. I hold old hurts and have a very long memory for bad times as well as good. When I get angry all the old hurts just bubble to the surface and my usually clean language becomes very blue indeed. I hate losing control but when I do there are no holds barred. Do you think the dishes therapy would work for this. Perhaps I could visualise some people at the receiving end of the missiles?? Do you have some other tips. I've tried taking a few deep breaths but somehow, when I get going at the ranting and raving, I just cannot stop. It serves no purpose in the long run because the people I'm ranting at have heard it all before and seem immune to my hurts. At my age in life I should be over this but if anything it's getting worse.

Kay Posted: 17/06/2008 22:24

Hi Pearl. your comment made me smile. You know no matter what age you are its good to let your anger out. It will eat you up from the inside if not. everybody is different and for me breaking dishes was very good. Yes I felt silly and have to do it upstairs in my garage ( in case anyone sees me and phones an ambulance). But if felt bloody good. I since bought a punch bag and tried it but it feels wrong. Breaking dishes is the best way for me. I would suggest it to anyone keeping anger in. Best wishes Pearl.

Kay Posted: 17/06/2008 22:32

Hi Tom. Hope you are doing ok. You know what maybe some time in the future I would like to exchange e-mail addresses with you. but at the moment I am trying to live for the day that I am in and hence the commitment issue for me is also a huge one. Jesus sometimes i wont even commit to meeting a friend for coffee in case i get up that morning and feel crap and then have to cancel. Its getting better but slowly. Nobody knows who you are Tom There must be hundreds of thousands of Tom's in Ireland. And even if somebody does read this forum and figure out it could be you so what. You arent doing anything wrong. You are entitled to your opinion and also entitled to say whatever you feel on this forum. We are all in much the same boat so screw anyone who messes with us. We are damn strong people who have been to hell and back and we are still here.
Tom, please keep writting to us here on this forum. I feel like we are now a nice little bunch of friends, all there for each other.

Tom Posted: 21/06/2008 13:53

Hi Kay And Anon
Thanks for your emails. Been away for a few days hence no emails. Yes I think we are a good bunch coping with a very difficult and unpredictable condition . I think the unpredictability of it is the real killer, one day good , one day bad etc. On reflection Kay and Anon, you are both right re the forum, why not use it as a communication tool between us and just leave the big brother aspect to one side. Little tips etc on handling this condition are great. Know exactly Kay and Anon how you feel re commitments meeting up with people etc, do not know how you are going to feel at the time the commitment takes place. To close yes I would very much like to stay in communication via this forum. Tom.

Anon. Posted: 21/06/2008 19:52

Hi Tom, Great to see you back on the forum.
At the moment Folks I feel as if I am in a stock car race heading for the wall! I feel as if everything is out of my control and I can't do a thing about it, sometimes I just want to walk away, but, I know I will hang on because I have been here before and it got better. As you said Tom we all have our good days and out bad.
Sorry this is a "ME" letter, again glad to see your name back on
the screen.
Kay I am not forgetting you, hope all is well.
Anon-Anne.

Tom Posted: 23/06/2008 18:21

Tom here: Had a good nights sleep last night, it is amazing what this can do. To Anon, the only thing can suggest is trying to do something different in the relaxation techniques that we all have heard about. It does help me sometimes, as it breaks that awful feeling. I have taken on board that any improvement no matter how small is good improvement. I used to have a higher target and now realise that that is unattainable at times. Kind regards Tom

Kay Posted: 24/06/2008 20:14

Hi guys. I wonder if we will ever be rid of these feelings. I suppose we live in hope. i have been having a few iffy days (as I call them). They are crap and at times I struggle to get through them. I know this is going to sound weird, but do any of you have a fear that you wont get through this and do something drastic. I dont want to die i really want to live. But sometimes I am so afraid I wont be able to hack it and snap. This is my biggest worry at the moment. The crap weather does not lift the mood at all. Listen, this probably sounds desperate but I think its better to write about it and get it out in the open than to keep it pent up inside. By the way if you ever met me you would have no idea from my demeanour that I think like this sometimes.
Anyway friends, I hope you are all doing ok. I really, really appreciate this forum and its good to get things off your chest and out so it doesnt sound totally mad. Talk soon Kay. Hi Tom and Anne.

lilly Posted: 25/06/2008 00:07

I suffer from depression and sleeplessness as a result of fibromyalgia I have done everything my doctor has advised and nothing seems to be working I take long walks everyday (about six miles) but I still cannot sleep if anybody out there has any ideas please let me know

Tom Posted: 25/06/2008 09:27

Hi Kay and Lily: I have had both your feelings a number of times. It does go away and then come back again. I think some of it is caused by this stressful society that we live in with an emphasis on doing more than we can and yet appearing absolutely relaxed. And also the stigma of mental health problems Yes Kay as we discussed lets use this forum. Lily if you are new I hope you find the forum helpful. I do find a Horlicks drink helpful and also reading before sleep.I have started reading a self help book at night which at the moment I find helpful. Best wishes to all.Kind regards Tom

Kay Posted: 25/06/2008 21:55

Hi Lily. I still have to take half a sleeping tablet most nights to get me to sleep. I dont mind though because I think if we get a nights sleep we can cope with a lot more. Have you tried any of the Bach Flower Remedies? You can go to your health shop and tell them you are having trouble sleeping and they will make up a remedy for you. It will take only 10 minutes to make and it is all natural and it does work because I have used it in the past. other than that have you tired meditating? It is very good for relaxing just before you go to bed. There are lots of things you can try. But if you are really at the end of your tether, I suggest you get some sleeping tablets ( from your doc).. They will help you sleep for sure until you find your natural sleep pattern.
At one stage I was also drinking a glass of wine to help me sleep, but I dont reccomend that option. Its only going to lead to other problems.
Hope I have been helpful Lilly. By the way wellcome to this forum. Great bunch of people here and we will all support each other and you.

Murdie35 Posted: 27/06/2008 20:14

Hi all, well I have been suffering from this problem for a long time but in the last couple of months. its got worse and I finally went to the doctor today and told her how I was feeling and I cried with her and laughed with her too and she has put me on medication and told me I am normal and that a lot of people suffer from anxiety and I am not the only one. I am so glad that I went to her and talked so hopefully when the medication kicks in I will be able to start living again. She also recommended a book by Helen Kennerly Overcoming Anxiety and was wondering if anyone had read this. Reading everyones stories helps me and you are all a great bunch and it helps that I am not the only one suffering. Take care and talk soon.

Anonymous Posted: 30/06/2008 19:00

HEY, LOVE THIS WEBSITE,WE ALL SUFFER ANXIETY ESPECIALLY IN THIS FAST AND CHANGING WORLD.I HAVE FOUND THE AUSTRAILIAN FLOWER ESSENCES VERY GOOD AND INEXPENSIVE.IF I HAVE A STRESSFULL EVENT COMING UP I WILL TAKE emergency essence, ANOTHER ONE IS calm and clear.I COULD NOT LIVE WITHOUT THEM.ANY GOOD HEALTH STORE WILL HAVE THEM OR CAN ORDER THM FOR YOU.

Helen Posted: 09/07/2008 01:03

have stayed up way past my bedtime reading this discussion, it is very useful. i am starting to wean myself off Efexor and still going to weekly counselling. feeling dizzy and have headache but will see how it goes. i was transported back in time reading your post "finally went to the doctor today and told her how I was feeling and I cried with her and laughed with her" and i know you have done the right thing. i bought that book by Helen Kennerly Overcoming Anxiety, still in my bedside cabinet with all my hidden self help books. will start reading it and keep you posted. Lovely surprise to stumble across this forum and read your posts, good luck to all and hope some of you get some sleep.

Tom Posted: 09/07/2008 09:56

Hi Helen. Tom here, welcome to the posts, it does help to communicate with someone that has the same symptoms albeit not necessarily for the same reasons. I hope everyone out there that reads theses posts are doing well and in particular the small number who have helped and supported me over the past 6 months. Best wishes Tom

Kay Posted: 09/07/2008 11:29

Hi Tom. I was thinking of yourself and Anne yesterday so I am just checking things are ok with you? I am doing ok, well even. I have had no therapy for the past 5 weeks and really thought I would struggle with this. But to my amazement I was fine. I decided to treat it as a holiday from all the crap i have been through and I was fine. Back to therapy this week, as much as i dont like going i know its necessary. I still have some issues that I struggle with. I think I mentioned before I am in therapy for child abuse. Although i have had some horrible flashbacks, its been quite a journey and still is. The main issue I have now is, I am so afraid now that i will have flashbacks of abuse to do with my dad. I love him dearly and dont know whether I could handle it if he abused me too. I dont ever remember being uncomfortable with him throughout my childhood years so I have no evidence that he abused me. The thing is now i am obsessed with all men being abusers . Especially old men. I know this is definately not the case, but the child in me doesnt trust any man now. Not even my husband. The reason I am telling you all this is that its the best way to deal with it. If I keep it inside then it will eat me up. So to conclude, no, all men are not abusers and no my dad didnt abuse me, but its ok for me to have fears to the contrary because under the circumstances its normal for me not to trust.
Having said that, to all the male members of this forum I dont for a minute think that about you. Especially you Tom. I have come to think of you as a friend whom I trust. So please dont take the above personally. All the best. Kay.

Helen Posted: 09/07/2008 13:35

hi Tom and Kay nice to "meet" you both, i have read alot of your posts but not all so excuse any ignorance of your reasons for being here. Kay, I understand your fear of men, i have a big problem with domineering men and at one stage thought maybe my dad was to blame ...etc as was close to believing something similar about him but in the end there was no real reason to go down that road. i am not a victim of child abuse, more of accidental neglect or i like to see myself as the invisible child in my family, the one no one ever bothers about hence feelings of low low low self esteem lead me to have some really scary boyfriends and bossy friends whom i have now left far behind. it wasn't until i got married had kids etc until the depression hit me badly and even though its still there a bit i know its cause was years and years of covering up when i really needed help. I hope you are all getting the help you need and asking for more help than you need as that is the way forward for me anyway (easy said i know).

Tom Posted: 09/07/2008 23:50

Dear Kay, Helen, Anon and everyone who reads this forum. Hi how you are all well, I have found this forum is very good for lots of avenues, tips to cope, ideas to try out etc. For me I have had a change of meds and the result is very good. I hope it lasts. Zyprexa is the name of the med. Does anybody have any experience of it. If so I would like to know how it went, (the good and the bad) w Knowledge and information very helpful in these scary times that we live in. Kay I hope your therapy goes well. Lets all keep in touch and help each other. Kind regards Tom

Helen Posted: 10/07/2008 11:11

Hi Tom, i have never heard of your new medication but it sounds like it is doing the trick, i hope it keeps working for you. I feel a bit silly now re reading my last post as its probably too much info to share with people i don't know at all, i suppose its easy to get carried away on a post and forget it will be there for a long time to come. I have been reading up on Effexor and how to come off it and am trying alternate days and lots of omega 3 fish oils as apparently supplements help, does anyone have any advice on the correct time it takes to wean yourself off anti-ds and what supplements helped? Also is there any proof that eating better can help depression?

Anne. Posted: 10/07/2008 13:19

Hi Tom, Kay and all,
I am still here. I am most of my time with our brother in hospital all is forgiven and now I am watching him fading away to skin and bone and I wish God would take him. if there is such a thing as karma my brother has paid for his past ten times over and it is breaking our hearts to watch him. Doctor asked if we wished to tell him he is dying and we said no, but the next infection will be his last we have agreed to let him pass peacefully. Since I last wrote Kay/Tom we have had a few chats and I wish we could have more but he now sleeps most of the time. They say good comes out of bad sometimes and I agree, I am at peace with my brother Thank God Tom good luck on the med. and Kay you are sounding good long may it continue. Don't forget me even though I don't get to the computer that often at the moment. God Bless, Anon- Anne

Kay Posted: 10/07/2008 20:26

Anne,i read your post and you actually brought a tear to my eye. I dont cry , by the way. I am so so glad you are finding peace with your brother. I believe there is such a thing as Karma. I believe that one way or another people who harm others will pay in some way. I am not that religious by the way but I believe that is the way things happen.
Helen, I have written some pretty personal stuff on this forum and I am glad to do so. This forum is great because nobody knows anyone in person. So please dont worry about pouring your heart out we are all here for each other. Feel free to say anything to us. I think I can speak for the others too. I was comforted to know you too were suspecting your father partly for your fears etc. I know its weird but it makes me feel like "ok. so thats pretty normal to be wary of all men in your life after all that has happened in the past". Does that make sense?
I too wasnt hit with the major depression until I married and had children. I think it was when I saw how vulnerable they really are that it struck me what a completely abnormal childhood I had.
Tom, hope all goes well with the meds. Havent heard of the one your on. but good luck with it. I have to add Tom again I think you are great. Not enough men talk about this even though it affects lots and lots. So thank you for trusting us enough to confide in us. Talk to you guys soon. Kay

Anonymous Posted: 11/07/2008 00:23

i have no real explanation to the feelings i am getting. is it down to tiredness or stress ? but often throughout the day i get a feeling that i can't breath for a split second then i find myself trying to swallow in order to catch my breath.If i am commuting home from work or trying to sleep at night , as i am nodding off i get the feeling if i don't wake that i will stop breathing altogether and find mysel waking up quickly and almost in a state of panic, its worse at night as i almost feel i have to control this state of waking up in a panic while i'm commuting. Sometimes at night i'm afraid to sleep infear i will not wake, its as if my mind is telling my body to wake..weird i know but i need an answer to this .i went to my GP about this last year but he passed this off as stressed related since i had my baby , he suggested tablets which i cannot remember, as when i read the side effects i chose not to take them, also he suggested self-help books. i'm just really curious , and want to know is it anxeity or heart palpatations or all in the head and stress related

Kay Posted: 11/07/2008 11:47

Hi Anon. I get that feeling sometimes too. Even when i might be sitting watching t.v. I have noticed though that it is always when i am tired or under stress. Its like palpatations. I have been having them recently but i am not sleeping well at all so therefore i am tired and I can honestly say from experience, tiredness is a big factor in anxiety, panic or depression. If you sleep well then you can make some sense of fearful thoughts during the day. If yu dont sleep well everything seems so much worse the next day. Everything is overwhelming. Everything is too huge to overcome. So at the moment I am searching for any natural products that can induce sleep. I took sleeping tablets before but found that after a while the dose needed to be increased again and again. Its like my body became immune to the dosage i was on so I had to up the dosage.
As for your G.P. either change your g.p. or go back to your own one and explain how you feel again. yes having a baby can increase anxiety but it s not something that can be ignored. I find it amazing that this day and age all G.P.s arent more up to speed on anxiety related illnesses. Some seem to think its all in your head and it will go away on its own. But it has been proven anxiety is a physical reaction to something happened in your life. Be it years ago or recently. Best of luck.

Helen Posted: 11/07/2008 15:05

Hi Kay, Tom, Anne, Anon, hope you are doing ok today, Anne i am very sorry for your sad situation with your brother you are being very strong minding him in hospital and forgiveness is so hard but a real gift if you can feel it. I can't at the moment so you must be very special.
I don't know why but i am afraid of coming off my meds now just in case it all goes haywire, keeping it steady and very very slow. Thats all for now trying to calm down and do as little as possible today which is very hard for me.

Tom Posted: 12/07/2008 15:32

Hi all: Zyprexa also known as Olzapeine is supposed to deal with agitation / anxiety, it is a tablet taken at night and it certainly has helped my sleeping and the agitation. The agitation I had was like a very nasty high, head pounding, could feel the movement in my head and when it was bad it was very bad, and for not really important or big reasons.
What I think to get by in any shape or way with this anxiety / depression and associated symptoms a person needs a package of measures, not just one item. I agree 100% with you Kay that a good nights sleep is a vital tool to deal with any of this stuff. Anon I can recommend 1 Zimovane taken with Horlicks milk drink for sleeping
As I said earlier recently I was prescribed Zyprexa. I have been watching the effects of the Zyprexa carefully as regards the dosage given and what the doctor recommended has made me too sleepy both in the morning and during the day. Last night I tried a lower dosage and I feel more with it today. So I will continue along this course meds wise, as I think I may have found something that helps me personally in principle but I have to get the dosage right for my system. I do think there is a personal element here, no matter what the doctor says, taking a tablet that completely zaps one, cannot be good either in the short or long term
I also think it is very important to read the leaflets very carefully, and if there is any of the nastier side effects making themselves apparent then that medicine is not for you. Unfortunately despite what the Doctors say the meds are trial and error. I do wish the Medical Profession would be more forthcoming and upfront about this as the patient ie us could then approach meds with a more enlightened approach. To anon there are alot of meds and gp's out there, and I would keep searching until you are at least some way satisfied. Passing symptons off like you describe is not good.
However the gp in my view is only 1 element. This forum if it appeals to you could be another element, I have come to think of it like that.
I have also learned to my cost that higher dosages of med's do more harm than good, so my advice to myself and to others, is that if the med is not working in small doses, it is unlikely to work in higher doses, and unfortunately the nastier side effects are more likely in higher doses.
I also think this forum and similar ones are extremely important to have, for example my thought process for the rest of today is better having put my thoughts down here for example I am now going to make myself do some exercise after this script. I think we all need to support each other and start labelling these feelings as foolish characters in our lives for example I call my anxiety Donald Duck when it is in full flow. However like everyone else that has any of these feelings , I can have terrible times and can identify with most of the symptons in the posts.
But lets keep our chins up, I do believe we can control these feelings, and when the symptoms overpower us it will not be forever.
Kindest regards to all Tom

Kay Posted: 14/07/2008 11:55

That was an uplifting letter Tom. Good to hear you feeling positive.
Helen, I too was afraid of coming off my meds. I was afraid that I would go back to the complete nervous wreck that I had been. And I was afraid I would crack up again. Thankfully that has not been the case. Yes I have iffy times, but over all its been bearable. Like I said before though, now I am having problems with sleeping. These bright mornings bring with them a host of noises. Birds singing (I live in a wooded area so its hard not to hear the little things singing their heads off). Cows mooing very loudly in the field next door. My own dogs scratching and jumping around their pen waiting to get out and be free. These are all lovely natural things but my god they are really irritating me these mornings. I sometimes think I am a grumpy old fart. But anyway, I have tried earplugs and they for some reason make me feel clausterphobic. Also getting to sleep at night can be problematic sometimes. Heavily snoring husband who works long hours and as a result he tosses and turns all night. I am laughing as I write this. Sorry guys had to get this all off my chest.

Anonymous Posted: 14/07/2008 15:42

thanks to everyone who replied expecially Kay, its makes sense and i thought i was mad or something, glad if you know what i mean that someone else has experienced this

Anne. Posted: 14/07/2008 19:49

Hello Tom, Kay, and my new friends Helen and Anon,
First of all your letter did my heart good Tom you "read" sound really good and long may it continue. Kay I love birds but, NOT AT 5a.m. but my special love lies with cows for some reason or other. When our daughter was little, as we drove along the country roads every time we saw cows we had a little song we would sing about guess what, yes cows. There is an Irish Artist called Deborah Donnelly and she has produced some beautiful paintings of cows, check them out on line and you will know what I mean.
Helen, thanks for the nice compliment but Helen it is not as
difficult as you imagine. Looking at my brother as he is not
is truly breaking my heart because you would have to be made
of stone. If you had asked me six months ago how I felt I would give you a different answer, but now it is different. if I could help him along his "road home" I would, but that is not up to me. Enough about my family other than to ask you all to please pray for him if you can.
Helen fear of coming off meds. I have been there including a 20 year addiction to Valium. you are stronger than you think, now go for it but remember
"baby steps", not all at once in other words.
Take care of yourselves and I am not forgetting Anon but I
am running out of time, God Bless, Anne.

Helen Posted: 14/07/2008 23:55

Hi Tom, Kay, Anon and all.
Tom I hope Donald Duck is keeping his head down and you are settling on your meds now. I have been trying to find a name for my feelings and have decided on ďGrimĒ from a cartoon called ď The grim adventures of Billy and MandyĒ which I used to love. Grim (as in reaper) is a scythe-wielding skeleton in a black hooded robe and over 10,000 years old, speaks in a Jamaican accent. I think this image will make me laugh if I am down and will help me keep my chin up and I want to believe, like you, that we can control these feelings. Thanks for the tip!
Kay, I hope the birds are not driving you mad and you are getting some sleep. Sometimes moving rooms helps me, or walking around until I am exhausted. I was relieved to hear you were ok coming off meds as I have just heard one horror story after another. I am now down to one every second day and even though those around me notice I am grumpier I donít think that is a major set back. I feel ok now.
Take care all.
Helen

Kay Posted: 18/07/2008 19:28

Hi Helen, well done you for coming off the meds. One every second day is great. You will probably get to the point that you will even forget to take them and when that happens its great because it means that your mind is happy and settled enough to not even think about meds. Keep doing what you are doing, its working. Kay.

Tom Posted: 21/07/2008 09:27

Hi Helen Kay and Anon, Hope all is well. I think I have the right dose of the med, 50% of the initial dose. Makes me very tired at night if I take approx 2 hours before going to sleep at 12. Very dozy in the morning but I can handle that. My whole experience is that in principle meds are good but watch the dosage levels very carefully and keep trying until you get one that suits you personally and in the dosage level that suits. also meds is only part of the story Well done Helen on your meds story, and Kay and Anon I hope you are well. Kindest regards. Tom.

Shelly Posted: 23/07/2008 20:19

Hi everyone I have just been reading all the messages and it feels so good to know I'm not alone feeling all these emotions. The last month has been a mad rollercoaster ride for me. I hadn't been sleeping for months and had begun to have nightly panic attacks I finally cracked and a friend brought me to the doctor who immediately diagnosed me as depressed and put me on Prozac. My emotions completely worsened after 2 weeks to the point that I was paralysed with fear and couldn't leave my bed. I have found a good gentle holistic counsellor. I changed doctors and the new doctor has given me Gerax for 2 weeks and Buspar. Then my beautiful dog died in a freak accident last Sunday and I found her body. I've been on the Buspar since Monday and have been feeling a mild increase anxiety from it. Does anyone have experience of taking this and its effects. I have looked it up online but would love to get personal feedback. I have also tried meditation and have been reading Eckhart Tolle which has kind of helped. But after a month I feel so impatient that I'm not back to myself who was so capable and outgoing (on some levels).

Tom Posted: 24/07/2008 10:34

Shelley, Hi and glad you found the posts helpful to you. I have not been on the meds you talk about so can offer no specific comments. I do think you are doing the right thing, reading up and searching for info on it, so keep doing that. Unfortunately I do think there is no cure or quick fix for anxiety or depression and while difficult to accept same, there is the bright side of searching and maintaining the good points.
There are lots of items that help, other peoples posts I found very helpful. Biaura , Water exercise ie swimming etc I have also found helpful. Getting on top of those nasty and unhelpful thoughts and feelings by calling them a funny nickname has helped me on occassion.
While there is a lot of trial and error, I have found to my cost that relying on meds alone is not the way to go for the long term. Talking or indeed emailing like you have done can be very good.
Hope you feel better soon. To all my other friends using this facility hello and I hope you are keeping well Kind regards Tom

Helen Posted: 25/07/2008 15:05

Hi Tom, Kay, Anon and Shelly, feeling tired today and trying to stay put for an hour so logged on and caught up with your posts. So nice to be able to share our thoughts, i remember how hard everything used to be - like huge huge effort to make any lunch or wash dishes, these feelings are back abit but as i said i am only on low meds so am watching to see if i can over come these feelings of being overwhelmed, anyone else feel like that ? Shelly i can only offer advice about my own solutions that worked and that was weekly counselling, had to get to the real root of the anxiety and you might be suprised it could take a while. best of luck and hope all looking on the bright side today.

Kay Posted: 25/07/2008 15:36

Hi Tom and Shelly. to you shelly, tom is right. There is unfortuneately no quick fix for this problem. You did right by going to your doctors and also please keep up with the counciling as i feel its the best way to go along with meds. When I read about you having nightly panics, it kind of stirred something in me. For a fleeting moment it made me panic slightly too. I can sympathise with you. Night panic attacks are horrendous. It feels like you are the only person in the world. It feels like you are so alone and completely isolated. I have to say one of the worse things of this illness is the fear. I am so sick of being afraid. I am so sick of feeling extreme fear to everyday things. I am so sick of not being able to do things others take for granted. Having said all that, things are improving. I know what caused me to be like this so that in itself is good. In other words I am not mad. For the first time in 14 months of therapy the other Tuesday, I wished my abuser was alive. Up until now i was glad he was dead and I didnt have to face him. Now I wish he was alive so I could make him pay for the things he did to me. I know in my heart I wasnt the only child he abused. I seem to be the only one facing it though.
Anyway, hope you all are keeping well. Tom, Anne, Helen and all my other penpals!!!! Talk soon you guys. Kay.

Kay Posted: 27/07/2008 11:01

Hi guys. Friday evening it creeped up on me again. This anxiety. I feel nauceous, tense, cannt sleep among other stuff. I thought here we go again, just when I thought I wouldnt have to go throught this again. I keep looking at my kids and husband thinking of them makes me get up out of bed and try and get on with it. I hate it soo much. I also hate god , because to me hes the one at the moment messing up my head. I feel real anger anad have yet to find a way to get it out that is good for me. I have a punch bag and have tried breaking dishes, but I really want something I can get my teeth into and let go. I felt like thrashing my living room yesterday, but then I would have to go to the expense of replacing all the stuff i broke. Sorry if i am waffeling here. any help suggested woudl be appreciated or encouragement . Thanks all. Kay.

Tom Posted: 27/07/2008 16:14

Hi All, Tom here, Woke up this (Sunday) morning with that familar feeling of nausea and panic, think we all have had various versions of it and it is very debilitating.
I am telling myself that the setback can be kept to a mild one and therefore not escalate to a severe one.I decided to read back the forum comments and it did help alot. It very much helps me by writing it down and expressing it and seeing it for what it is ie a feeling. By writing it down I feel I am deciding that I can handle this setback and therefore it will not get up to a severe one.
Completely agree with you Kay as regards fear and also completely agree with you Helen about the feeling of been overwhemed. Hi to everyone else, I think we are a very strong bunch of people coping well with a very tricky and unpredictable condition.

Helen Posted: 28/07/2008 03:29

hi everyone, just wondering if there is a strong link between being depressed and an alcoholic? i have been thinking and thinking about how i use drink to get me by in certain situations and did the quiz on the AA website and it said i was definitely an alcoholic, gave me a real fright as don't think i am anywhere near it, however didn't think i was depressed 2 years ago either :))
Kay glad you are feeling stronger and stronger due to facing the facts it is extremely brave. Tom i hope your medication is working better now. can't sleep its 3.30am will die tomorrow! good night all.

Anne. Posted: 28/07/2008 09:54

Hi Kay, Tom and friends,
My brother passed over early morning on the 20th. and all I can say is I thank God that I was with him, he had a dreadful time but, I was with him. At that time I had forgotten everything and I was his sister Kay, if anybody had asked me that I would feel this way I wouldn't have believed it. When I saw him suffering so much my faith was seriously tested! However, after when I thought about it all the answers fell into place, God is good, and I am feeling fine and, my memories are good.
Kay and Tom you are both such a help to all I know you will work your way out of these uncomfortable feelings YET AGAIN
remember what you put out you will get back so, any minute now!
Please don't forget me, love Anne (anon)

Kay Posted: 28/07/2008 13:45

HI Anne. Sorry to hear about your brother. I am so glad you are doing ok. remember to talk about it to anyone who will listen. even some one on the bus. just tell them you have lost your brother and you are sad no need to go into other details with strangers. Its important you mourn right now and express your feelings. I think you are great a better person and stronger person than I am. I dont think I could see past bad stuff like you did with your brother. Please keep writting on this forum. we all need to hear you are doing ok. Helen its crap when we cannt sleep. I do exactly what you are not supposed to do when I cannt sleep. I lie there waiting for time to tick by. I should get up and do something instead of waiting to go to sleep. Tom, Looks like me and you had a not so good weekend. but you know what we are doing ok. Its ok to have setbacks. Nobody goes through life being permanently happy. we all have ups and downs. It just so happens that our downs scare us wittless and knocks us sideways. all the best my friends. Kay.

Shelly Posted: 30/07/2008 12:20

Hi all thanks so much for the responses, they made me smile;). I am beginning to come out of the very bad part of the anxiety. The buspar does seem to be working along with listening to Eckhart Tolle at night when I wake up. At least its not negative thoughts racing through my head making me feel like crap. I also reversed into a car coming out of my driveway yesterday. Totally my fault the guy was lovely when he could have been a complete asshole. But I don't know what the universe is trying to tell me or get through to me. I think i'm going to break a glass off a wall to break the cycle of bad luck. Its hard also to remain focused on positive thinking/changing thinking patterns but I cannot believe the amount of people who have gone through something similar since I opened up about what I am going through. This does help but as my counsellor says to me "You have to own your own shit!". Any way thanks for the responses I feel able to soldier on a bit better. x x x

Helen Posted: 31/07/2008 00:05

Firstly Anne, i would like to express my sympathy for you and your family losing your brother. i know you were by his side and are showing unwavering forgiveness which i know you should be very proud of. I have no idea how you are feeling but hope there will be some peace for you one day.
Tom, Kay, Shelly hope you are all hanging in there this week too, i have lost it a few times already and realize coming down off meds is hard enough, must have been totally on a high for the past 18 months AND thought it was reality. Still fighting my moods, really angry today and thought about "Grim reaper" and it actually made me laugh instead of cry so thanks for that idea Tom. I hope you are all getting some peace of mind, thats what i crave at the moment as it seems impossible to be happy with what i have. I promised myself to slow down and take the time to see the flowers, pat a dog, talk to someone at the bus stop, anything to be here in the now and not outside, watching life go by on the sidelines.

Anne. Posted: 31/07/2008 15:25

Thank you so much for your kind words, the more I read these
postings the more I realise how genuine you all are so thanks
once again. Helen hang on in there you will be just fine once all
those uncomfortable feelings leave you and you develop and get
comfortable with your new routine.
Folks I have an empty feeling, I can go on with this posting so
I will say bye for now.
Love to all Anne.

Anonymous Posted: 31/07/2008 16:47

well here's my story.dont even knno if its on the right discussions page..well over the last six years(mayby more)i have had my fair share of problems in life and now and breaking point.to this day,i dont think there is much hope for me and think i,m going to be like this for-ever.well i think i am.
anxiety
nerves(bitten to the core)
constant shakes
living in constant fear of things.
no self esteem
no confidence
mood swings or very bad moods
cant have a normal relaysionship with a women.
due to sexual iisues.....
have no patience what so ever.
OCD and ODD ARE MUCH PART OF MY LIFE
get less than than 3 hours sleep per night,thats not unless i drink 10 can of beer every night.i tend to drink to hide the fact that these proplems really does excist and they aint going away.dont even no Why i,m emailing you.is the fact that i,m trying to reach out to someone and hope for the best...........
this list goes on.....so with no job and no money.what is one person suppose to do

Life is precious Posted: 31/07/2008 17:25

To Anonymous 31/07/2008:
First, I'd see a health professional, preferably your GP.
Then go easy on the cans of beer - I think you already know this. That way you might even be able to afford to see a doctor or counsellor.
Good luck!

Anonymous Posted: 31/07/2008 19:13

thats the thing,i cant give up drinking.it has me right were it wants.

Life is precious Posted: 01/08/2008 08:44

To anonymous:
Come on... That's your real problem.
Do you really have to drink TEN CANS every night?
Try just one or two for a start and then think of alcoholics anonymous. You made the effort to write to this discussion. Now take the next step - it's in your hands.

Mal (JHP73374) Posted: 01/08/2008 10:04

Hi Anonymous,
I have experienced exactly what you described in your post for 20 years. I started having serious panic attacks at 16. They were frightening and distressing. I quickly found out that drinking alcohol gave an immediate relief. As I went through my twenties this escalated. I drank every night, afraid I may not sleep. My anxiety grew worse, so my alcohol intake went up to cope with it. Missing work, unable to cope with relationships, hating myself. Then a doctor prescribed Xanax for two weeks. This allowed me to continue drinking, an get through work the next day. I have been addicted to them since. This culminated in a series of hospitalizations at 33, 7 in a period of around a year. Around this time I went to AA. I was in and out for 3 years, but never understood what alcoholism was, as apposed to heavy drinking. It has been two months since I last drank, and have started on a year long detox for benzodiazipaine addiction. I am still uncomfortable in a lot of situations, but I have learned some coping techniques which I shall share. I stopped work to concentrate on my sobriety and mental health. I am on Certs, and of that I am paying back money I owe through MABS. As long as I have food and shelter, a packet of fags and the support of family and friends I find recovery a relief from my former life. I have a long way to go, but thats ok. If I could sum up in one line what I have learned it would be: You can recover, no matter what or how you feel at the present moment. I am going to post some sources I found particularly helpful. I wish you the very.

Kay Posted: 01/08/2008 10:57

Anonymous, I know you are drinking to avoid feeling. I have been doing that on and off too. It does make you feel less stressed for a while but all too soon wears off.
To Life is Precious, I think you are being really unfair to Anonymous. I cannt believe you are that black and white to presume they should go to A.A. Cannt you see the pain they are in? What he/she really needs to do is go to see a therapist/councellor. You can go public and you will have to wait to see someone. but in a emergency situation, yur g.p. will arange for you to see someone soon.
Look, everybody has different ways with dealing with anxiety,depression, panic. I have tryed lots of stuff. Conventional meds, alternative treatments, therapy even been to see a psychic to see if I had a future???? What matters is all of the above worked in some way shape or form. None on their own, but each one gave me something.
Please be nice to each other, the last thing we need is someone being judgemental, and condeming anyones way of coping. Kay.

Anne. Posted: 01/08/2008 14:27

Anonymous, You are in a vicious cycle and you can't see your way out, but you will, and also you will discover that you have
people who really care what happens to you, but you don't realise it just at this moment. I can sense your despair but please try to look on this part of your life as a test one that you are going to pass and in time you will look back and see it for what it is.
Kay's advice is the way for you and I do hope you will take it on board, please take care of yourself because I care what happens
to you even though I may never lay my eyes on you remember
I am rooting for you, please write in and tell me that you are
going to pick yourself up and go for that help.
One of your many friends,
-Anne

Anonymous Posted: 01/08/2008 18:08

Anne,in regards to my drinking.i get loans to get drink, just to put things out of my mind.its no excuse and with no income or job.what can i do???

Helen Posted: 03/08/2008 09:26

Hi Anonymous, Anne, Kay, Tom, Mal and Life is precious, just checking in and letting you know i am reading these posts even if i don't have much to say today, Anonymous i really really want you to talk to someone too, or just keep posting here until you are ready. I drink too much and so do most of the irish population so don't feel bad about it, you can see we all have had to devop coping mechanisms to deal with our feelings and hurt which is real and needs to be removed. As kay said there are numerous ways to try but we are all striving for the same result, getting rid of the terrible thoughts and feelings that are ruining our lives. ps i am reading a book called Home Coming by John Bradshaw its really explaining alot to me not everyones cup of tea as american but i like explainations as they help sort out this puzzle and get us nearer to where we want to be, it sounds like Anonymous you have just started this process so best of luck and keep us posted.

Mal (JHP73374) Posted: 04/08/2008 09:30

Kay. The immediate problem here is Alcohol Abuse. Absolutely nothing will change as long as alcohol is used as a coping mechanism. It is not a coping mechanism, it has the exact opposite effect. I have tried every treatment from concealing to anxiety reducing meds. But I continued to drink, and they and no effect.
I find the tone here one of compassion, not judgementalism. Some may put in terms we may not agree with. What matters is that saving someone's life is more important than saving someone's feelings.
He is drinking 140 units of alcohol a week at least, 22 is the upper safe limit for men. I would have drank probably the same. It took a terrible toll mentally and physically. Absolutely nothing will change until that is addressed first.
This is, of course, my own experience. And every case is different. But Alcohol is not a solution, in any way, for anxiety and/or depression. It exacerbates these conditions. And frequently causes them.
I wish all here good health.
Malcolm

Tom Posted: 04/08/2008 15:44

To Anonymous, you are in a bad space at the moment so like the other messages of advice and support to you, I think it would be good for you to try to stop the downward spiral. When I read your posts, it saddened me and reminded me of times when I was in a really bad space.
My bad spaces have nothing to do with drink so I can offer no practical help in this respect. I think you realise that drink will not stop your pain, it may dampen it down for a little while but at a high cost almost immediately after. I also think you know that your drinking is very high and will have to be drastically reduced / eleminated sooner rather than later
You may not feel ready now to engage with "professional help" if that is the case so be it. However most people would say that at a minimum you owe it to yourself to look at the options available and at least attempt to engage in one of the options. I think it is worth a try to seek out and identify the cause of your pain, it could be that you think you have been given a life sentence as a lot of us who have anxiety and pain sometimes think. I very much include myself in this category.
A suggestion I have is that it might be a good thing to write down your issues and feelings here on the website and after a short time put them all together and bring them to your gp. That would save having to speak about them, and also would probably cover more ground.
Maybe as regards the drinking could you substitute a post to this site each time you feel the need for a drink for the next couple of days. These are only very short term baby steps to see how it goes for a couple of days, to see could you stabilise slightly. A small personal step of improvement I have found is a huge motivator to want more. Good luck and I hope you win the battle. Your friend Tom
To Mal I would and I think a lot of people would very much like if you could post your coping techniques, as you clearly have successfully got to grips with a lot of items. I can identify with a lot of what you say as regards meds, I am now down to .5 of a Zimovane at night, together with a low dose of Zyprexa. I now realise there is no cure, but there are good days and coping with the bad days and trying to avoid slides is hugely important to dealing with these issues
To Anne I deeply sympathise with you as regards your brother, I think after the funeral etc can be harder to deal with so I hope you are coping well.
To Kay Shelley and everyone else Hello I hope you are also well. Lets all keep in touch. Kind regards Tom

Kay Posted: 05/08/2008 19:50

Hi all, I have been feeling exhausted lately. Not sleeping very well. On sleeping tablets not working sometimes. Find things getting on top of me easily. Kids are on school hols and the days are too full sometimes. I have to make myself have a bath, or make myself sit down for ten minutes. I have been travelling a lot for the past week, my mums in hospital, so the stress of all this is making me feel down. Sometimes I am afraid to go to bed because I wont sleep. I would love to get back to my natural sleep pattern soon. Any suggestions welcome. thanks guys.

Tom Posted: 06/08/2008 09:51

Hi Kay: Sorry to hear about your difficult situation, can easily see and agree with your analysis that it is the combination that is effecting you and things are always more difficult when sleep is broken.
I have recently found that taking my night med an hour or two before going to bed makes me a bit more drowsy and therefore easier to go to sleep. Find Horlicks Milk Drink and reading something light helps a little as well. Also that your bedroom is well aired. Thats all I can suggest on the natural side. It is the little things that I think can just give that little bit more help that could make a difference. Good luck and I hope tonight will be a good night for you. Hi to everyone else. Tom

Anonymous Posted: 06/08/2008 12:00

Hey all, I am just wondering, how is anxiety diagnosed? I suspect that I am suffering from it but havent had the time or the money to see a gp. Plus I am not sure if I genuinely am suffering anxiety so I dont want to be a time waster. I have had panic attacks in the past, the first being when I was 11, and they vary in frequency and strength from year to year. For the past year or so, I have been feeling nauseous all the time, as well as having that feeling that one gets before a big exam or an interview. Often there doesnt appear to be anything going on in my life that would warrant such feelings. I tend to freak out about safety. My cat was killed on the road last year and since then I am obsessed with the safety of my other animals. I am constantly ringing my parents to see if the animals have been let out or are kept in. I worry about everything, money, relationships, even though there are no huge problems at present. is this normal?? I have all the "factors" as they would say - my mother suffers depression and anxiety, and I have been on depression medication before, I have had recent trauma, as well as a history of childhood abuse.

Caitlin (DPM71068) Posted: 06/08/2008 12:38

Dear Michael, (Anonymous)
I was on the Mental Health forum and I noticed you posted your letter there. I replied but just in case you miss it I want you to read this about my brother and coincidence but his name was also Michael. If you are having problems with alcohol (and I think you are because he started drinking to forget) I am reluctantly detailing the last months of my brother, if it helps you then it will have been worthwhile, here goes.
My dear brother died of liver disease. He was an alcoholic. He had so much liver damage that the toxins started affecting his brain, I will spare you the details. He had to be given enemas twice a day so my brother had to wear nappies. On entering the hospital four months earlier he had a stomach that looked as though he was about to deliver a baby at ten months. He was seven and a half stone, again the toxins has accumulated. He was only allowed one and a half litres of liquid per day. After a month or so they inserted a device to help, it didn't! Did I mention the device (I cannot spell the name) he had inserted to help him urinate, none of the above was easy for him. Finally he starved because he couldn't eat, he forgot how to and he got infection upon infection. They tried to feed him through a tube but he rejected the tube, thought he was choking. Finally on July 20th, he passed away struggling to stay alive.
I am finding this posting one of the most difficult things I have had to do and you can guess why. I am doing it for you. I can tell you that my brother didn't want to go he would have changed how he lived his life if he had it over, he told me this.
My brother's lifestyle was the same as yours only he was
further on, that is the way your are heading. Don't end up the same. You say the drink has a hold on you, WRONG that is self pity and now owning your own problems. Take my advice and make my brothers painful undignified untimely departure worth something. Save yourself. I have done my bit now I wish you all the very best. P.S. Feeling sorry for yourself is not going to help, nobody will help you, you have to be seen to help yourself first, being cruel to be kind.

Anne Posted: 11/08/2008 14:52

Dear Caitlin,
You are very brave and despite having lost your brother you are still reaching out to help others. We have something in common quite a lot actually my brother passed away on the 20th July in pretty much the same circumstances and to be honest Caitlin I cannot bring myself to discuss it but again I compliment you on your unselfishness in trying despite your own feelings to help another and I hope this gentleman will take your advice, it is not an easy way to go.
Hello Kay and Tom, I'm still battling on and I always keep an
eye on the site to see how you are doing. To all my other lovely friends I apologise I am so bad at remembering names
and if I go back on to the main page I may lose this anyway
I hope you are all well and happy, God Bless, Anne

Kay Posted: 11/08/2008 22:42

Hi Anne. You are doing great. Just keep dealing with your grief. Thats the best way to go. Are you getting on with your older sister still? I am so lucky in that i have never yet lost anyone really close to me. Yes i have had grandparents die and some aunts and uncles, but I can say that honestly I didnt feel terribly sad when they died. Thats sounds like I am really heartless, but due to my childhood abuse issues, I was very select about who i allowed myself to love. There were and still are are only a small group of people whom I love. I dread the day that i have to deal with the grief of losing someone important to me. I think Anne you are so brave. I think you are very strong. Dont you know how strong you are? I wish you the very best and please continue to write to all of us here. To me all on this forum are like an extended family.
Hi Tom, hope you are doing ok my friend. Kay

Anonymous Posted: 12/08/2008 04:07

Hi I have suffered with anxiety and panic attacks for many years. I just wondered if anyone knows of any social phobia support groups in the Sunny South East. My family and friends have no understanding of my social phobia and I just felt that a support group would be a big help to me and others in the same situation.

Helen Posted: 12/08/2008 09:16

Hi Anonymous i have just found a few numbers you could try and some websites you could look at
Oanda, the out and about association Tel: 01-8338252/3 Practical help and self-help support groups for people suffering from agoraphobia and social anxiety disorder
Recovery Inc., Tel: 01-6260775 Self-help mental health programme for people suffering from anxiety, phobias and depression
Grow. Over 100 support groups throughout Ireland for mental health Tel: 021-4277520
www.adaa.org
www.algy.com
www.anxietynetwork.com
www.anxiety-panic.com
www.anxietycenter.com
Hope they help, in the long run you are better talking to people who understand or are like minded as family members are not always understanding and sometimes even the least understanding, best of luck finding the right support, logging on here is great as you don't feel so alone.
Hope everyone doing ok this week.

Anne Posted: 12/08/2008 12:19

Hello Kay,
I like hearing from you Kay thank you for your letters.
I am close to my sister but she is so so good she worries about me far too much so I do not want to add to her worries. We are very different she has hundreds (I am not exaggerating) of friends whereas I am happy with my own company I hate big crowds and loud noise.
I have a wonderful husband but got out of the habit of going out years ago and now I find it difficult (not leaving the house) socialising. I had a small retail outlet up to last year and Kay, you would never have believed that I had a care in the world, I wear the "mask" well.
I cannot stop thinking about the end, how will it happen, when, and is there an afterlife, I love God, I have problems with the church but now these worries are creeping in to my mind, and I ask myself what is the point of going on. My husband has booked our three week vacation, believe me Kay it is out of this world but I cannot feel any excitement, we go the week after next. Doctors have done me no good and I haven't got the mental energy to try another.
I am not doing well so please pray for me.
Best Wishes to you Kay and all
P.S. I cannot believe the above was written by me, totally out of character, but it is how I feel.

Anonymous Posted: 12/08/2008 16:27

Hi everyone.does any body know how to come across a good psychiatrist in dublin.any help would be great.
thank you

Anon. Posted: 12/08/2008 18:22

To Anonymous, If you attend a general practitioner he/she will assess you and if necessary refer you to a specialist in this field.
So I repeat, your Doctor is your first step.

Kay Posted: 13/08/2008 11:53

Hi Anne. Have you ever had therapy? I know where you are right now. I am not religious, but if there is a god(i think there is), then why does he let people suffer like this? Whats the point? I sometimes think too that this is all too hard and cant see logic in it at all. The only thing i can tell you is from personal experience. I am in therapy/counciling for the past 14 months. I have a very good therapist. She is not judgemental or patronising. Through therapy I have come to realize that my thoughts and fears are a direct result of past trauma. I have to remind myself a lot that, these feelings are not because I am mentally ill. They are for definate because of past issues. I am basically saying to you Anne, that unless we all deal with our panic/anxiety through therapy or some other form of talking then it will always be there. I know i will be in therapy for quite some time but I can see the difference its making to me and my thought patterns. When I have a crap day or an iffy time then I have to sit down and write down the things I know are true. Like, I am a strong woman, I am very brave to be dealing with this face on. These are true statements and kinda like positive affirmations. I know not a lot of people think therapy works, but I think it does and while it is extremely slow. Four steps forward and two back, it works. I can honestly say that without it I think I would have fallen apart and never got back together again.
You need to talk to someone Anne. Yes, its the scariest thing I have ever done but also one of the most liberating.
All the best. when you go on holidays, try and relax and enjoy yourself. Take xanex if you have to. You deserve to be relaxed happy and at peace in your mind.

Anne Posted: 13/08/2008 14:59

Hi Kay,
I know where you are coming from, affirmations are impossible
for me at the moment I cannot think of one good thing about myself and I haven't got the energy anymore As for therapy I have been very unlucky in the past with therapists three in total over the years, they were highly recommended by my G.P. (different G.P) but they couldn't see what was happening to me "on the inside" and before I open up to somebody I have to TRUST them.
Kay I am taking up precious time and space there are other people on this site so I will take your advice and do my best to appreciate and enjoy the exotic holiday my hubby has planned and after, maybe I will feel stronger emotionally to search for that empathetic therapist I know must be out there.
Thank you so much for caring about me,
To Tom hope all is well, Helen may I say you must have a "big heart" I can see you want to help, why couldn't the world have
more Kays, Toms and Helens.
I sound so ?? I am sorry, will be back up there soon PG.

Tom Posted: 14/08/2008 13:45

To Anne: I know exactly how you feel as regards doctors, councilling and meds. My meds had been increasing over years and last year reached a very high level. I have very slowly decreased and changed my meds this year and do feel better and more with it. I now realise that I am very sensitive to meds and I have in my own mind reached a conclusion that there is no one size that fits all for meds, much the same as councilling says that everyone is different.
Anne, the talking and feeling about what is going on the inside I can identify with. When I was feeling low I did not even make any sense to myself and felt great difficulty in communicating to anyone friend or therapist. I did not find much support from therapy and instead found that a lot of therapy left me wiped out, because it was apparent that a lot of my thoughts were different from session to session. I now realise that my thoughts are very much dominated by what is going on now and that remembering how you felt last week is prone to error and selectivity.
I am hoping for some pointers from people who read this website as regards what is a consistently major problem for me.
I have always been very mentally afraid of my job and nobody seems to understand this or come up with a strategy for me to apply. When I am working on something and the slightest thing goes wrong, I just overreact. I have seriously thought about giving up my job but am not in a position to do so and also feel that no matter what I did work wise, the same result would turn out.
The above has effected me badly and continues to do so. Also with the economic downturn, and my age and health the odds are stacked against me changing course. I also feel that it is not the job but instead is me.
I am reasonably good at what I do when I can concentrate on it, but when this fear comes on I am just feckless at everything, thus making the problem much worse. The thoughts of snap out of it, motivate myself etc make no impression when this fear is raging. I do hope that there is something I can do, which has not yet been suggested so again if anybody has any suggestions please feel free.
I also have a great fear of responsibility and been humiliated by not taking responsibility. Gadgets like computers etc also make me very fearful. I realize that I use up a lot of my mental energies on these fears and would welcome some helpful thoughts on this.. The fear of work really just knocks me out and when work is not done I am under more pressure and it is a permanently vicious circle.
I have with some success labelled the bad feelings Donald Duck and I do realize that I am more than my feelings. I have had little success with the concept of combating the fuse as regards the adrenaline in a panic attack. When I try to do relaxation I end up making myself more uneasy I do know from experience that the horrible overwhelming feelings will quieten eventually but sometimes they go on for days.
I have other fears but since work is a daily occurence, this fear exists daily
I would welcome some pointers as I feel in a reasonably good space at the moment
Hello Helen and Kay I hope you are well, thanks for your posts, I read them all with great interest, and Kay, I feel it is down to you that I have put a major cause of my fears on this website and hoping for positive feedback from anybody reading
To anomymous I believe you have to be referred by a GP to a psychiatrist. If I were you I would be very careful about this. Psychiatry in my view relies on meds and unfortunately there is little or no warning that some prescribed drugs can actually do more harm than good.
Many thanks to everyone for reading and apologies for the long post. Kind regards Tom

Anne Posted: 14/08/2008 16:02

Good to hear from you Tom, I am in a hole but soon P.G. I will
look up at the stars.
You are a survivor Tom and maybe nobody ever told you how
good you are at what you do, we do not compliment each other
enough and I am referring to a work environment but you will
always find somebody who will be ready to hurry you on and put you down. The more I read your letters Tom I realise you are highly intelligent (which I envy) and a lateral thinker. I can understand being of a certain age myself that you may feel trapped job wise but you have choices outside your work hours.
You will find the answer and thanks for your words of encouragement.
Kind and warm regards to all
Anne.

Anonymous Posted: 16/08/2008 14:13

To Anonymous who asked re a good psychiatrist. I am probably not supposed or allowed to mention names on a site such as this, but there is a woman psych who attends at Charlemont Clinic (I assume she still does attend there), and her initials are G.B.

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 16/08/2008 14:23

Anxiety can be such a crippling condition, and we seem to live in such anxiety-provoking times.
Maybe this link might be of help to someone
http://psychologytoday.com/articles/pto-20031023-000002.html

Kay Posted: 16/08/2008 18:10

Hi Tom. You are in a horrible place right now. I had to give up work 7 years ago when I really just started to have really hightened anxiety attacks. I am very luck to have a supportive husband so thank god i never had to go back to work. Sometimes then I think that if I had to work maybe it would have been better for me because then at least I would have remained in some kind of normality. As it is now my husbands job has taken a down turn and his wages are lower. So I would like to be able to pull my weight and bring in some money to help out. But the thoughts of going back to work scares me to my wits end. How do even think I can hold a job down. I can be doing ok for a few weeks and then hit a wall. What scares me the most is getting a job and having to leave after a few days or weeks.
So in one way being able to afford to stay at home and raise kids was great but in another way its making things really hard on me now.
Tom, I really feel for you. You are in a circle of doubt/fear/panic and one pushes the other one and so on and so forth. Isnt it horrible when your mind wont stop chattering and just be still.
A friend of mine told me recently that in Eastern Countries people start their day with some quite time or meditation. Maybe only 10 minutes. Then they finish their day with the same. The result is that they are less stressed and less inclined to be depressed or panicked. I have tryed meditation and have found it helpful at times. Its supposed to take practice and perseverence. Maybe I should try harder. anyway guys talk soon.

Tom Posted: 18/08/2008 15:50

Kay and Ann: Thanks for your words of empathy and encouragement. Sometimes I feel fine about work, then others it is like you say Kay, a brick wall where all I do is get into a very weird fluster and nothing is achieved. I am not proud of my behaviour at such times and wish there was something I could do to minimise such incidents. t other times I am the consummate professional.
To date today, I have had a bad day and am writing it down to this forum since it is only 4 pm and something can still be rescued from the day. Thank you Kay for explaining your own personal situation, I think this is very brave of you to do so. I would not knock yourself about work as you have done a very special job in raising children. Also most times particularly in these stressful times there is very little "normal" about work, instead most work places are choke filled with a lot of negative emotions and stress and really are pressure cookers for people, particularly for anybody who has any conditions like we do.
Again best regards to all who read this site. Tom

Anonymous Posted: 19/08/2008 13:27

hi anonymous.would look a bit strange ringing up Charlemont Clinic and ask for someone called g b.if you could text me her name on 0861772400.then take things from there.thanks

Helen Posted: 19/08/2008 13:53

Hello Tom, Kay and Anne, how are you all you today?
Anne i really hope a change of scenery might ease your mind at the moment. Try to relax and get lots of rest, even if it means staying in on your own, its quite tiring being away even if exciting.
Tom, my job(s) have caused me no end of headache, i think its a sign of real commitment that you haven't thrown in the towel at some stage.
Like you Kay i believe in Therapy and am going weekly, i look forward to it but never have a clue what we talked about the week before it doesn't matter. I talk about work A LOT actually i went as i wanted to resign from my 10th job and as i wrote my C.V. saw a terrible self destructive pattern going on, i am still in my job thanks to counseling and its broken a pattern for me, work is the stage for a lot of our lives problems and it may be worth taking stock of these fears and why you do what you do for a while.
Wishing you all peace and calm thoughts!
Helen

ScullyG Posted: 21/08/2008 15:31

Stress and Anxiety can be dreadful feeling as though you will never get through the awful feelings that it can generate.
Perhaps a black cloud, a huge weight, tummy churning, tight chest etc.
Very often stress can be caused because you are dealing with too many problems at once so your mind just gets overloaded. When you break the problems down bit by bit and deal with each one seperately it can help.
Remember to drink plenty of water and eat the right foods for your body to help your mind.
Therapy can be great and there are plenty of Therapists that can help but remember to check their credentials.
Remember to treat each problem as a challenge and to break it down to a smaller size that you can deal with. The highest wall starts with only one brick!
Good Luck

Tom Posted: 21/08/2008 17:17

Thanks G for the tips re: anxiety particularly the water one and looking at things as a challenge. Also recently received an article advising that when the panic comes to try to observe it and try to simulate that it is just our minds having an excesssive work out at the gym. The horrible feelings will pass eventually just as a person recovers physically after a work out. Feel it is hard to put this one into practice but thought I would mention it on the site in case it might help somebody else. To everybody on the site thanks for all the support and specially hope Kay Helen & Anne are keeping well. Kind regards Tom

Anne Posted: 21/08/2008 23:52

Helen,
Thanks for your good wishes I will take your advice and will
let you know how I got on when I return, take care of yourself as the ad says "Because you're Worth It".
Kay and Tom, I'm coming around this week but like everybody I have my memories and in turn comes tears and a little anger from past memories. Enough for now I hope ye are both doing o.k. and thanks again for being "there" for me and I hope I can return the friendship.
Folks! I have just realised something, We are all good caring people on this forum so, why is it only the nice people experience our troubles, Sensitivity! The Rest of the Human Race is Lucky to Have Us.
I'll be back soon Take care Tom Kay Helen
Anne

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 22/08/2008 12:28

For Anonymous. I have checked and see that the psychiatrist I had in mind does not seem to be in practice in Dublin any more, or perhaps she is retired.
Meantime, this link might be helpful (psychotherapists).
http://www.psychoanalysis.ie/Practitioners/

Anonymous Posted: 22/08/2008 19:45

anonymous,
yea dont think she does. thanks for the link..

Helen Posted: 22/08/2008 21:55

hi everyone hope you all have a good weekend and just wondering how does water stop stress? its one thing i never remember to do and don't like drinking water unless completely parched, wonder how it makes you feel down though?
Still coming off meds, went too fast and felt terrible again and talk about anger, my goodness didn't know i was capable of being so cross with everyone (as Anne said we are usually nice caring people:)) anyway am doing the day by day diary to check and keep an eye on my moods now, great to be able to share this and get if off my chest as don't want to really share that much of my feelings with my friends. Keep thinking that i will go back to being myself but have realized that i have gone down a new path and have changed forever, kinda scarey but its true once you have taken a good hard look at yourself and decide to make changes you can't go back.
Tom, how was work this week? did the feelings pass or not? Have you taken any holidays recently? It may help, is your medication making a difference now that its not so strong?

lola Posted: 25/08/2008 01:13

hi, don't even know if this is the right place to talk but i am so sad and frustrated that my husband does not appreciate the work i do with the children and house and my elderly mother. he has a law degree and wants to go further. i don't think he has any respect for me. But i would come in handy for sex if i wasn't asleep or like a statue. We are 21 years married this week and i feel like ignoring the anniversary and going on with my sadness. what's to become of us ?

Anonymous Posted: 25/08/2008 11:18

Iola:
I think you know the answers, deep inside yourself. Is this what you want for yourself! I feel it is important you have a talk with your husband. It does not have to be confrontational. Otherwise your self-esteem will continue to plummet until there is none left, and you will become unable to take any action. Actual support in "real life" will help you. Maybe talk it over with a professional.
You are a worthwhile human being, and must ask yourself: "Is this what I want".
All the best.

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 25/08/2008 11:35

Here is a useful link
http://psychologytoday.com/conditions/gad.html
Generalized Anxiety Disorder
This disorder involves anticipating disaster, often worrying excessively about health, money, family or work. Sometimes, though, just the thought of getting through the day brings on anxiety.

lola Posted: 25/08/2008 16:37

dear anonymous, thank you for going to the bother of answering my message. I agree with your advice. should i talk to my doctor first? my self esteem is not rock bottom yet but i need to address the problems before i drive myself mad. thanks again. lola

lola Posted: 25/08/2008 23:45

Dear patricia and anonymous. thanks for posting a message to me. will deffo have to do something. maybe speak to my doc to set the ball rolling regarding a councillor. thanks again for your help. lola

Gillian Scully Posted: 26/08/2008 10:28

Hi Helen
Go out and buy yourself a beautiful bunch or flowers or perhaps a nice house plant and dont give them any water!
If you are not getting enough water you are dehydrated which has an impact on your mind and your body - neither will function as well as they are able. Look on the internet about the symptoms for not drinking enough water.
If you had a dog you would not let it get to the stage of being 'parched' so perhaps you could do a little more to help yourself and drink water.
While you are reading all these comments before you make a reply go off and drink a nice pint of water and know that you will start to feel a difference. Aim for 2 litres a day?
The other side effect of drinking water is less wrinkles!
Go for it.

Tom Posted: 26/08/2008 12:19

Dear Gillian, I have read your comment with interest re water, you are perfectly right. Many thanks for been so incisive. I never thought about water like the way you have put it and I dare say I am not alone in this.
For this year so far I have very gradually and very slowly lowered meds and have been looking at all sorts of simple (emphasis on simple) alternatives like your water comments. I find I am now much more with it and while there are still dark moments I now hope that I can at least to some extent naturally control some of these points most of the time. Simple alternative suggestions are most welcome
Hello to Ann Kay Patricia and Helen. Yes the feelings re work did pass. At the risk of repeating myself, this site is very good for getting stuff down on paper, aid in assisting ordering the thoughts and getting some feedback from fellow supportive people.
The lead time is very short, the cost is zero, and for long term sufferers like a lot of us are, the site is a great help in helping to assess if we are just having a bad day which will pass or if it is a slide which may not without professional help.
All the best Tom

Anonymous Posted: 26/08/2008 12:37

Iola:
Here is the website link for accord:
http://www.accord.ie
Perhaps you could check with them first. Yes, maybe a doctor could give you a name of a counsellor, but doctors being very busy people, may often just recommend you anxiety medication, when what is actually needed is you and your husband sitting down with an objective third party.
All the best

Gillian Scully Posted: 26/08/2008 15:19

Dear Iola
In connection with your husband and it is not that he does not appreciate you but it does tend to be a 'man' thing and how they think.
Perhaps suggest a night out and it does sound as though as you need one for a chat. Pick a quieter type restaurant as opposed to a pub.
Tell him how you feel. Not as in 'you make me feel this way' but 'I feel this way because' etc. In other words dont point the finger!
Before you go out do your homework and cost out how much money would be needed if you were not around. It does add up and it is surprising the full amount.
Remember that you can change yourself but not other people - including husbands BUT it will have a knock on effect.
As for sex - would all gentlemen please avert their eyes as I do not want to give away the secrets here.
Sex is good but making love is much better. While you are out for dinner whisper to him you are not wearing anything under your dress. You are the woman you dictate how you want to me made love to - tell him what turns you on....not off....be positive about your love making. Lead more by buying him a book on massage along with some oils suggest you both need lots of practice!
Good luck

M.J. Morell Posted: 26/08/2008 15:27

To "Gillian Scully"
you seem to know a lot about everything particularly water, but the internet seems to be your book of reference, in my opinion, not a good idea. The internet can be a great port of reference but remember it is also open to every "Witch Doctor personality type" who has the price of an hours internet use to enter their "opinions' right or wrong under whatever title they wish to use.
I have a good knowledge of the human body and how it works
as it has been my profession for 40+ years and my opinion (backed up by my experience) one should drink when their body asks for it and then only enough to quench your thirst,
that is all that is required.
With every good wish for the future,
M.J. Morrell

Anonymous Posted: 26/08/2008 15:39

Sorry, Gillian. I know what you are saying, and I know there is the "man" thing, and the fact that their communication style is different and all that. But there is a BIG difference between the "man" thing and lack of respect.
Evidently, from Iola's post she is feeling serious loss of self-esteem, and she herself feels her husband is taking her for granted. Let us see what she has to say herself.
P

Helen Posted: 26/08/2008 21:40

Hi all, Tom Anne Kay hope you ok.
drinking water as i type (thanks Gillian, i am now comparing myself to a beautiful bunch of flowers :))
i am feeling ok this week, loads of anger as i mentionned before but its getting easier to spot my mistakes (timing things better like meals, getting kids ready, even getting away from them at times).
To Iola I would talk to a professionnal about your relationship too as its really really difficult to talk after so many years have passed and habits are engrained in a marriage - you will prob have to make some small changes very slowly and expect alot of resistance but you can change the dynamics over time if you want to, he may even want to change things too believe it or not. Weather the storm that may come and hold on in there and it may be just what your marriage needed. good luck. Helen.

lola Posted: 28/08/2008 00:59

Hi tom ann kay and anonoymous, I am sort of embarrased that you commented on my position. thank you for your comments. listen if i brought my husband out and say i have nothing on under my clothes we would not get dinner, we would get arrested! gillian i have to mention too. your are all so kind and helpful. We have tried accord they were lovely. the only change that happened was my husband put out the bin. that lasted for two weeks. after 21 years what do i expect? its one o five in the morning so you wont get this till morn. My name is not lola but i like that name. night night x

lola Posted: 28/08/2008 01:03

and helen thank you for your advice xxx

Anna Marie Posted: 28/08/2008 16:24

Hello Lola,
I just read your original letter to the forum and I am offering my
suggestions based on that only. I am married to my husband for
34 years and up until last March my Mother in Law was with us, and having a third party in a relationship - no matter how lovely she is - can cause problems. My husband didn't want my Mother in Law with us and we started growing apart, I cared for his Mother and our daughter, they took most of my time, my husband started doing his own thing, and before I knew it I had a Mother in Law a lovely Daughter but no husband I had left him out of the equation. That is not what
I wanted but that is what I got.
I am now a woman who has worked very hard to make a good home for us and the trouble is the family I have is as mentioned, a Mother in Law, a lovely daughter that gets all of
my attention but, no husband.
As I look back I there should have been two people in my marriage and in my mind, we should have set aside more time
for us and forget everything else it would have been easier, but I was too busy including other people in our twosome.
My husband felt he hadn't got a place in my life so he took up
evening classes, golf etc. and being me I always had the dinner
on the table, the laundry ironed and hanging in the wardrobe
I even manage the banking and bills. He was made redundant
as a husband, I see that now but at the time all I could think
was I am taking care of his mother and daughter, I am doing the cooking, laundry and now I am even paying the bills, why
should I have to do this he does nothing
In my story it was all my fault because I was doing what I thought was what was expected and he wanted, I never asked
how he felt. Everytime we talked either his mother would butt
in or our lovely daughter, so we just didn't bother anymore.
I got it wrong and looking back he tried but I didn't notice because I thought I was doing what he wanted I never asked.
This is just my story probably none of it relates to you other than your Mother being with you, does she play a very big part in your life, i.e. is she taking your husbands place.
My Mother in Law passed away and believe it or not we are getting closer slowly but surely, its never too late.
Your husband may think he has no place in your life OR he is
going through the male menopause i.e. what have I done with
my life I have to make an impression before I leave this planet
he is panicking, what do you think.

Kay Posted: 28/08/2008 19:44

Hi All. Just checking in. Tom, Helen, Anne hope you guys are doing well or even ok. Water seems to be the answer for everything these days. I have to admit though a few months ago i started to drink a lot of water and can say that I wasnt as tired. This was a big help to me because as we all know a tired mind is an overactive one.
Tom, I am glad work is ok for you know. I would love to go back to work even for a few hours a week. Just for me. To make new friends or just give me something to focus on. Although i have 2 school going kids, my days are kinda wasted away. Chasing my tail and getting nowhere fast. I think now they are back in school though i will be more organised.
Seems odd writting that because when i worked which was for almost 16 years. I would have been extremely organised in the workplace. I would have been able to multitask and not even break into a sweat over it. I miss those days.
Lola, wellcome to the forum. I think all husbands are like that from time to time. Mine certainly is.
While my husband has been good to me as regards panic/anxiety and particularily supportive of me going to therapy. He knows I had a pretty rough childhood. He is completely selfish when it comes to raising the kids or anything to do with the house. Its up to me to do everything in the house. I mean everything. I do it all. I soemtimes say to my friends that i might as well be a single parent. He is a good man but his parents still have a huge amount of influence over him. If he comes home from work anyway early he eats his dinner here and off he goes to see his dad or makes up some kind of excuse to go see them. Unfortuneately we only live up the road from them so its easy for him to do so.
God I sound like such a moaner. Tom, I hope you are not offended by these comments. That would be the last thing I would want.
Lola, what to do? I dont know. I am with my husband for 17 years now and I still cannt quite figure him out sometimes. anyway talk soon guys. a special hello to my long term friends on this forum. Kay.

lola Posted: 28/08/2008 23:33

Thank you anna marie for your comments. Yes my mother does play a big part in my life. i am usually piggy in the middle between my husband and my mam.It has been like that for years. your right, my husband thinks i care more about my mam than him. I try to explain because i am her only daughter i look out for her but that does not mean he means any less to me. My husband just wants me and the children and does not have much time for my mam. we dont live on top of each other as we have our own sitting room and dinning room.
If i had my time again i would not have moved in with my mam but the reason we moved in was that my Dad had died at the age of 55 the year before and my Mam was left alone in a big house. we moved in before we started a family and everything was fine, but as the children arrived as you say she would sometimes interfere or butt in. I know my husband and myself should have time on our own but its coming to the stage where i am fed up trying to please everyone and pleasing no-one. My mam is 80. she is very good to me and the kids and i love her to bits but i still have enough love inside for my husband and children, he does not accept this. I wish he did as we could have a happy life. In an ideal world we should have lived apart from mam but its not going to happen now. anna marie im delighted you and your husband are getting closer. I think you were a very giving person, not many women would look after their mother in law ! best wishes.

Anna Marie Posted: 29/08/2008 18:11

Lola,
Men are jealous of other people taking their partners time, sometimes even the children, so it is a difficult thing to do but I am going to ask you to allow for his nose being out of place (big child craving attention) but like us in the natural run of things you two are going to be left alone to be a proper family, family will get older and move away from home, and you two will rekindle the love you once shared together, trust me on this, but you are going to have to tell him this.
Lola you are being everything to everybody, you have been setting these standards and only you can do something about them. Encourage your children to become more independent
of you and with that spare time use it for yourself, some mothers do not believe we deserve it, if it were a paid job you would be taking lunch hours and finish at 5. Try these suggestions, lower your standards, help your kids to do things for themselves and you will see a change all round. Good Luck
Anna Marie

Kay Posted: 02/09/2008 21:27

Hi Guys. Just checking in on my pals. Tom, Anne and all my other penpals. Havent heard from any of you in a while. Tom, are you ok? I know Anne is on holidays, hope she is relaxing a little, she deserves it. Do any of you find yourselves letting your mind run away? I mean, do you find yourselves creating scenarios about your life of all the things that could possibly go wrong. then get into a state worrying about it?
I have been doing that of late. What if, what if, what if? I dont like it because it feels like I have no control over my thoughts. I know I was abused by distant family members when I was just 4 or 5. Now I have been worrying myself to the point of maddness that my dad could have done things to me too. I know I have never had flashbacks about him or ever been scared in his company or i have never worried about leaving my kids at his house. |If dad had abused me it would be my worst nightmare. I consoled myself with the others that they werent really family so as bad as they hurt me at least I didnt love them.
I send myself into a panic worrying about what if I start having memories about dad, how would I cope, what would I do, where would I turn? This is what I mean by creating scenarios. I send myself into a blind panic worrying about things that might never happen or never have happened in the past.
Dont know if I am making sense. Look forward to hearing some advice from someone. Kay.

lola Posted: 03/09/2008 00:35

Thank you anna marie for your insight. yes i hope our time will come to get together but i think when our time arises i will have nothing left to give. Its only in recent years that i realise that we do not agree about a lot of things. i wont give up but i do sometimes feel lonely not physicaly but emotionly. My spelling is a bit off. sorry. i really so appreciate you putting your time and effort in to your message. Its good to know there are kind people like you around. Lola

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 03/09/2008 10:57

Dear Kay:
Sorry to hear you have these worrying moments, and severe anxiety. It's becomes a bit like a snowball, getting bigger and gathering momentum as it rolls. It is important to try to stop it in its tracks.
I tentatively suggest a little book (and it is the only one I ever bought, and amazed at its usefulness to me anyhow in difficult times). It is by Deepak Chopra, and it is called the "Seven Spiritual Laws (of Success)". The name is maybe not quite in consonance with the content of the book, so do not be put off. I think it helps put things into perspective. Give it a try if you like.
A psychiatrist friend of mine once said to me: "Don't futurise". It was the wisest advice I have ever had. We have no control whatsoever over the future, and it is VITAL to mental well-being to live in today. As for the past, well it is history, and the past is another country.
I hope you have someone to talk to about your apprehensions, a counsellor or other professional. Just talking over something puts it right into perspective and indeed greatly diminishes what seemed like a mountain.
P.

Tom Posted: 03/09/2008 14:03

Hi everyone: Tom here,
Kay I would agree with Patricia re futurising. I have read another book by Edgar Toole The Power Of Now. Also I have a notice at my desk that talks about three days (Yesterday, can do nothing about: Tomorrow we cannot presume what will happen or how it will happen.) This simply leaves today which the notice says"Anyone can fight the battles of just one day. It is only when you the burdens of two awful eternities Yesterday and Tomorrow that we break down"
I can honestly say that I have found it difficult to even begin to think like that, but I can see the sense and benefit of so doing.
Kay to answer your question, thankfully I am doing well at the moment. Regards to Anne Patricia and all who read this site

Anna Marie Posted: 03/09/2008 14:24

Lola,
It is me again, just like a bad penny always turning up. You are in the thick of things and you are at your lowest.
Now maybe what I did was take the easy way out because I hadn't got the guts to leave, but now I am glad. As you get older and I am not old by any means, it is like starting all over again, you develop a different sense of priorities and life really does become a lot better and much easier. If you love your husband stay, if you don't really love him and you opt for the hard option i.e. being left with the children and of course your mother that will be o.k. for a time but what happens when your job is done as a daughter and mother, you will then realise you have nothing! and the man that you loved, you let him go.
What you are going through is transitory, but your love, if that is how you really feel will have gone also. You have to make choices. As I saw it for myself everyone else's life will move on, but my husbands love and commitment will still be there if I really nurture it.
Lola I can only tell it as I see it and as it was and is with us.
Remember I am a friend but only on paper and will always be
here for you but the choices are yours to make, so don't be led by anybody just take the advice on board, take real time out each day without panicking and think. You don't have to answer to anybody, absolutely nobody, slow down, take
the panic away and relax, and then in your own good time make your decisions but TAKE CONTROL don't let it just happen.
I hope you can make some sense of this rushed posting, and
get something from it. I check in every day so "talk" to me
any time.
Your Friend,
Anna Marie

Anonymous Posted: 03/09/2008 16:02

Lola:
I expect you have had lots to think about over these past times. There is no such thing as an easy choice, ever. On the other hand, we only have one life, and this is IT. We cannot tell the future, but by gosh what we decide today, even in the smallest things, sure does determine the future.
It is not quite so simple either. Maybe you do love your husband, but, importantly, does he love YOU. Love implies respect, above all things, and only you know in your innermost self if this man actually loves you. If you think he does (and this must be shown, not just SAID as lip service by him), and if you love him, then there is hope for your future. There is no reason why it should all fall to you, you are a human being with feelings and a right to a satisfactory and satisfying life. Yes, love needs to be nurtured, by BOTH sides, both sides.
If your husband sees you as an object which provides certain services, well, I do not have to tell you what to do. In one of your posts you mentioned that you went to ACCORD. From what you say yourself, it did not appear to have much effect on him. Do you think he has the "love and commitment" to you that Anna Maria mentions?
Everyone's case is different, for all kinds of reasons (financial, practical, emotional etc.). I do not see how you would necessarily be left with "nothing". To begin with you would have yourself, and you are your own best friend. Depends on what you mean by nothing. Maybe what you have now is nothing, hence your present anxiety and state of mind.
Speaking of futurising, again. Who is to say anyhow whether your husband will be there in the future, or indeed next year for that matter. None of us can predict anything, such as accidents, ill-health, other life events...
It is important to think through the situation, and talk it through with outside support, if at all possible. It is indeed your decision, and I don't think anyone would want to lead or drive you into any course of action.
All the best

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 03/09/2008 16:09

Yes, Tom. Agreed. And it is a difficult exercise to get into the "present" mode, and to live in the moment. We seem to have been programmed to mull over the past, futilely, and to think - so foolishly - that we can manipulate the future, as if we were some sort of magicians.
Oddly enough, once you get used to "living today" (a different thing to "living for today") a kind of peace seems to take up residence inside one. You can focus better on work, indeed on anything you are doing, and thinking processes also become clearer (all of which pave the way for a better tomorrow anyhow). It is also a difficult exercise to stop the mind from racing (racing nowhere), and this requires practice. If you race an engine non-stop, well you know what happens: burnout.
I hope everyone here is keeping all right. Can I say it is so important to love ourselves, and not be self-critical.
Best to you all
P.

Kay Posted: 03/09/2008 16:50

Hi Patricia, yes I am in therapy and have talked only this Tuesday about my scary thoughts with my therapist. I will try and get that book. any help is accepted right now thanks.
According to my therapist, its my inner child whos afraid and panicking right now. Because she had not been able to tell anyone at the time of the abuse, she is trying to let it out now. I do believe we all have an inner child. I sometimes have a problem getting in touch with mine though.
Tom, sooo glad you are feeling better. Isnt it great when we feel well. I know when I feel well I could take on the world. talk soon. Kay.

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 03/09/2008 20:11

Kay.
Here is a link you might find interesting, and helpful.
It certainly ties n with what your therapist is saying to you.
All the best.
P.
www.voicelessness.com
This is an excerpt from one of the essays written by a doctor in psychology.
What is "voice?" It is the sense of agency that makes us confident that we will be heard, and that we will impact our environment. Exceptional parents grant a child a voice equal to theirs the day that child is born. And they respect that voice as much as they respect their own. How does a parent provide this gift? By following three "rules":
(See "Giving Your Child Voice" (link below) for more. You may want to consider your own personal history to see whether your parents followed these "rules".)
What happens when a child's feelings, thoughts, wishes, and interests are never heard? He or she feels worthless, non-existent, and incapable of having an effect on the world. A child without voice has no license to live. These feelings don't go away as a child get older, instead they go underground, replaced by eating disorders, acting out, painful shyness, or sometimes over-responsibility (a child acting like an adult).
Nor do the feelings go away when a child reaches adulthood. Maintaining a sense of self and agency is necessary for our emotional well being. But for adults who grew up voiceless, this sense is very fragile. Without "voice" people are prone to feeling hopeless and helpless. Often, the voiceless have no "place" of their own; instead they struggle to anchor themselves in other people's worlds. "

lola Posted: 06/09/2008 01:17

Hi anonymous, and of course my text friend anna marie. seem to only write to this foram late at night. Kids in bed. actually hubby in bed too. I am really touched by both your messeges, I honestly dont know whether my husband has the love and commitment to me like anna marie's husband did. When you asked what did i mean about having nothing left to give, i meant would i still respect him when everything changed and moved on. you are both spot on who knows the future ? im sure my husband loves me as much as he could love anyone. sometimes i feel its not enough. I have my kids, my health(sometimes) joke! maybe i need something that is just not there. thinking i should do some charity work. i am so selfish. caught up in myself. talk soon. lola

Anna Marie Posted: 06/09/2008 05:48

Hi Lola,
How are you doing, hope you are o.k. just to say hello and
I am thinking of you. I feel you are getting too many suggestions so, just keep writing and I will read, I will refrain from offering advice until you possibly ask/or more important need it. Anon is correct that love has to come two ways but I didn't say that because I know you are not a stupid person so I wouldn't treat you as such, it is simple I care.
With regard to Accord I was a voluntary counsellor with them
for many years so I know it won't always work for many reasons but I am not putting them down it is just that you have to attend for the contracted time but more important the couple has to have 100% confidence in the counsellor and not think he/she are taking either side and I could be wrong but your husband didn't have complete faith in the counsellor. maybe I am wrong. Just to let you know you can go back at any time and ask to see a male/female counsellor for instance and stress that you need an experienced person. They take on and train new counsellors every year and after training they go straight into counselling so you need an experienced person.
Good Luck Your Friend,
Anna Marie.

Helen Posted: 08/09/2008 07:46

Hi Kay, Tom, Patricia, Lola, Anna Marie and everyone else.
Have been reading posts with interest, some more related to my situation than others but there is definitely a common thread about loving ourselves properly as that may not have happen for infinite reasons when we were little. Kay i really feel for you at the moment and your therapist seems to be great at explaining how your "inner child" has taken centre stage at the moment, i believe it is her time to get some attention and even if its scarey and i don't believe for a minute your dad is a threat, you need to let this process take its course. I would go with it and even buy a huge teddy for this little girl who is so scared (would love one myself but don't think i am really worth it yet!!)
I tend to agree with Patricia re "you wont end up with nothing Lola, you will always have yourself - what greater gift." I am starting to cry as i write this as i spent years with a manipulative older man and golly did he mess up my head, i would go slow changing a relationship that doesn't work unless you are scared of him, if you are then run like hell :))

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 08/09/2008 12:18

Hello to everyone:
Hope you all had a reasonably good and peaceful week-end.
We are here to exchange views, ideas, suggestions.... I hope. And I do not think any of us imagine any other poster is "slow" or stupid. It is always good to speak clearly about all matters. No one can tell any person what to do, because eventually it is our own call. We can only show possible paths. Nothing more. Just mention aspects which will maybe allow someone to think of aspects which might not have occurred to them.
All couples encounter problems in marriages. It would be very odd if they didn't. If there is love and respect, then the good odds for overcoming difficulties are right there.
It would be extremely irresponsible to tell someone to just leave his or her marriage, as in now this minute, and close the door behind you. It would be equally irresponsible to tell someone to stay at all costs, no matter the circumstances.
I have many married friends, some older friends happily married for 40 years. Their secret? They tell me one has to work at it, from day one. AS one husband said to me: "the spade-work starts after the honeymoon.". Very sensible.
I also have quite a few separated/divorced friends and acquaintances of varying ages. No, it was not easy for them, and not something they undertook lightly, but guess what: in all cases there was a lack of "respect" for the other.
Best to everyone
P

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 09/09/2008 11:18

I thought I would also post this interesting article.
http://psychologytoday.com/articles/pto-19930901-000024.html

Kay Posted: 10/09/2008 17:39

Hi Helen, thankyou for your encouraging words. They make complete sense to me. I think my inner child is badly damaged but not beyond repair. I have never been this scared of anything in my whole life and I am 40 now. There are days when I find it a real struggle but I think of my kids and its for them i try. I feel like I am grieving, like there has been a death in the family. Thanks again for your post.
Tom, Anne and my other pals, hope you are all doing ok.

Anna Marie Posted: 12/09/2008 05:01

Hi Lola,
How are you? You haven't posted for a couple of days so hope all
is well with you. I am going on holiday so take care and best of
luck.
Anna Marie.

debbles Posted: 12/09/2008 19:10

withdrawing from anti depressants at moment, given to me for anxiety but only made matters worse. on them for 3 years, went cold turkey, off them now 3 weeks. wondering how long the "horrific" withdrawal effects last. had good day today. hope it is the start of things easing up! could do with support from you, no group in ireland to support you during this difficult time. unless you have been there, very few understand. would appreciate it if someone has been there and beat these evil drugs? thanks debbles

lola Posted: 14/09/2008 21:27

Dear anna marie. My husband is very ill at moment and in hospital so it has changed my perspective on a lot of things. I know now he does need me and i still have feelings for him. I will be there for him when he needs me. Thanks for your kind and helpful words hope you have a lovely holiday. best wishes. lola.

Anonymous Posted: 18/09/2008 20:35

Dear Debbles,
I read your posting and have some idea how you are feeling. Are you coming off anti-deps. with the help of your Doctor ?, are you coming off them gradually ? It sounds as though you are over the worst of it if you say you are having a better day (today).
Write and tell me how you are getting on. I look at the postings most days.
You are not alone o.k.

Anne. Posted: 19/09/2008 17:39

Hi Kay, Tom Helen and all,
I can say I had a lovely stress free holiday and had time to do a lot of thinking. Although today when I awoke I felt the weight of the world on my shoulders, and does anybody know that feeling when you just want to sleep so you don't have to experience that ache in your heart, that is the only way I can describe it. Trouble is when I get this way I haven't got the will to something about it. Kay you suggested counselling to me many times, if I could only find one that I bonded with but from past experience it is like looking for a needle in a haystack and I haven't got the energy.
I am so sorry for sounding so ungrateful our holiday was lovely but it has left me uneasy, I suppose we all like our comfort zones.
I haven't felt this bad in such a long time, I need a bit of help from my friends and that is difficult for me to say.
I hope you have a lovely weekend.
Anne.

Helen Posted: 21/09/2008 23:06

Dear Debbles, i wish you the best of luck with the anti-ds. i am off them completely 2 weeks now and not a hint of a side effect. it took me 2 whole months and went from illness to feeling wobbly to having mad anger attacks. they are really strong i agree with you and it sounds like you are doing so well. i write in a diary everyday to check and you will see a pattern if you do this. take it slow and give your body a chance to adapt. now i am watching my self like a hawk and all i can say is i am sooooo emotional but its so nice feeling these emotions that have been suppressed for 2 years that i don't care if i cry in public. i really hope you will get the support you need and keep saying its easy, a bit like alan carrs method for giving up smoking if you believe its easy it will help.
Kay Tom etc sending you all my best wishes, listened to Ekharte Tolles The Open Door CD has helped me this week to getting over some of my anxiety and still drinking as much water as i can. watching funny fillms is helping to keep "Grim" at bay.

kenny Posted: 23/09/2008 11:18

One is anxious when expecting something that may end up pleasantly or the other way. The best way to approach the situation is to braze up for the worst and to wait for another time frame.
Or to make alternate plans whatever must have happened in the past for the future and work your plans.

kay Posted: 23/09/2008 13:09

Kenny
I haven't stopped Laughing Yet, do you know what you are talking about, maybe you are in the wrong section?

Helen Posted: 24/09/2008 07:04

Anne its great to hear from you but not so great that you feel so low. Please consider going to a counsellor again, I will help you set up the appointment if you like, or ask your husband to do it and just drop you there for the first few times. Imagine you found someone who could help you and you don't feel like you owe them (well you pay :)) and you can tell them the truth no matter how silly it seems. I remember hearing the story of Monty Don the gardener who was very depressed and how his wife used to dress him put on his wellies and drive him to their allottment in england where she would leave him gardening for the day and pick him up as she knew he needed to do it to get out of his depression. I always loved the idea that she didn't give out or complain but helped him get out of the cycle of thought that was stopping him living. Anne post in and let me know how you are this week ok?
Kay, Tom, Iola etc are you ok too? Kenny i did't get what you were saying either but its good to have a plan B.

Anne Posted: 24/09/2008 14:40

Hi Helen,
Thank you for your letter and it is a coincidence, just before
reading your posting to me I had made an appointment with a
counsellor so I will let you know how I get on. Helen, this depression has been going on for many many years and I have
cut myself off from friends over the years, so it is only natural I have come to this stage. I am really very confused and very low and although I have a wonderful Sister Husband and Daughter I do not want them worrying about me so I do my best to keep my feelings from them. Helen Thanks once again for caring, I will keep in touch, my appointment is next week.
God Bless Anne.

Helen Posted: 25/09/2008 07:41

Anne, i am so happy you made an appointment and i hope it will help how you feel. Its a relief when you can talk about your fears and worries but you wont feel you are burdening your family and you may find you will get some energy back to see an old friend again one day. Best of luck.

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 25/09/2008 10:23

Hello Kenny:
No, you are not in the wrong "section". I think what you are saying is that it is good to be realistic, as in: hope for the best always but be prepared for the downside too. It is anxiety-causing to expect perfection. There is no such thing and life is no utopia.
All the best to everyone,
P

BarbaraTX Posted: 26/09/2008 19:54

Hi, I found this web-site by accident. I know there are things here that would not pertain to me in the US, but all of us being human, having similar situations worldwide, I'd like to hang out here, if that's ok with all of you. I was going to comment on the hysterectomy discussion but that has had no "life" in quite a while.
Now, Anxiety and Depression is very close to me. My mother was extremely mentally ill; schizophrenic, manic depressive, you name it. I did grow up with her. I did not really have my depression come to the fore until I began having anxiety attacks and felt that hollow, hopeless feeling way too much. It is an awful feeling! I am very grateful to have found something that has given me my life back.
Perhaps I should feel blessed that I can take meds that work very well for me. I began on Paxil then switched to Celexa, which became Lexapro. I am at 20 mgs. I still can get sleepy easy (I think I've been that way all my life). When I told doc about it she suggested combining it with Wellbutrin 100mg 2x per day. It all works.
The gals that mentioned water and exercise, I believe are quite right. I have to force more liquids since I am just not a thirsy person. I constantly work on that. And exercise is wonderful - fitting it in is another story!
My one daughter has had a terrible time with bi-polar/depresssion/anxiety. It's been a long road for her since she was 14. She started on Paxil and it gave me my daughter back. She is 26 now with 2 children and separated finally from a horribly mentally abusive husband who beat her down (mentally) for 7 years. Talk about insecure and no self esteem.
She is with a nicer fellow now but he cannot understand antidepressants; is quite ignorant of it all. So she has been teased by the family and him and she stopped them. She took 40mg. then went to 20mg. (herself), then just stopped.
As another gal here said, finding a counselor she bonds with seems all but impossible to my daughter.
We have had some crisis times since she quite cold turkey. Physically she is not bad, but if she gets an anxiety attack (worse than mine are), it is a real fight for her. She does not live near me, which makes it worse. When she has her anger attacks, like another poster described, she calls or texts me and says she HAS to get back on Paxil, but then does not. I'd love her not to have to take anything; however reality is reality and lack of the proper chemicals in the brain is a very real thing. So I just support her with love and sometimes just cry along with her - I do worry so much about her and the grandchildren.
Anyway, I'm 55 yrs. old going on 25 inside. I am originally from NJ, USA and my life brought me to Texas in 2000.
Another time I will post about the child within experience I have had; if it helps anyone.
Thanks for reading all this if you were so inclined.
I have always felt drawn to Irish, Celtic, English. My Mother's maiden name is Colby (she passed away last September) and I was raised by my Aunt whose maiden name is Sweeny (she is gone too, now).

Kay Posted: 28/09/2008 11:53

Hi all. Tom, where are you? Havent heard from you in such a long time. Anne, glad you had a good relaxing holiday. Anne I am so glad you have agreed to see some professional. Its the best thing. Anne, can I suggest that you speak to your husband and sister too. Just a little at a time. If they ask you if you are ok just say "well no not really, I feel sad or anxious etc". Dont feel like you are burdening them, they will be delighted to help you in any way possible. The biggest and most important thing to do is break the silence. Please trust me on this one. I know when i am in a bad place or anxious its because i have stopped talking to those who are there for me. I have my husband, a fab friend and then my therapist. These three people are there to listen to me and help me. I repeat myself many many times to them and they know that its helps me hugely. It could be just for me to pick up the phone and ring one of them and say "look I feel really anxious and crap and I just needed you to hear me". Am I making sense?
Anne, you are on the right road. You will be ok. You will thrive even. Just keep talking. Please.
Hi to all by the way is there another Kay on this forum because there was a short message posted to Kenny on 23/9 and it was from a Kay and I know it wasnt me that posted it.
Talk soon my friends.

Tom Posted: 29/09/2008 19:25

Hi Anne, Helen, Kay Patricia and all who read these posts. I have been away on hols for the last few weeks to a place where there was plenty of sunshine. Feel the better for it and I think sunshine is particularly good for people with our conditions. hope everyone is well and regards to all. Tom

Anne Posted: 29/09/2008 19:56

Hi Kay, Tom, Helen, welcome to Barbara, and all,
Kay this page is not the same without Tom I hope he is looking in now and again.
I had my first session today and I am feeling "raw" I talked
about so many things in my past and present, I know therapy is the only way but nevertheless it hurts. with a bit of luck I will get there, wherever 'there' is.
Thanks Kay and Helen for the encouragement.
Anne.

l Posted: 02/10/2008 00:27

hi barbara, welcome to the "irish forum". thank you for sharing all your news. very heavy stuff! we all have our problems in this life and it is good to discuss them. I am on lexapro at the moment. i changed from prozac recently. think i feel better not too sure as my husband became ill with ulceritive colitis and i really had no time to worry about my feelings as he was really ill. now he is home thank god. you said you were fifty odd and felt twenty odd. well im forty five and want to be twenty five again. i am so relieved and yet i really need a laugh < was supposed to be going to tenerife this fri oct 3rd with the girls but naturally had to cancel.> life really does throw up some odd things for us to handle. i dont really make a good florance nightengale and that makes me feel guilty too. sorry barbara this message is a bit disjointed but anyway just to let you know not everyone is happy all the time. best wishes.x

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 03/10/2008 11:30

Hello to everyone:
I found this extraordinarily good and sensible stuff. It really makes sense:
"Problems due to missing 'basics' in peoples lives tend to develop over time, and so can be easily missed. Then, when the problem arises - be it anxiety, depression, addiction or some other nasty - they can't for the life of them fathom out why!
It's therefore a great idea to know what your own garden needs in order to grow well, so when you see something starting to wither, you can check your list and apply the necessary nutrients.
So here's the list. (At least, our list. If you think we've missed any, do let us know!)
1. The need to give and receive attention.
"No Man Is An Island"
Without regular quality contact with other people, mental condition, emotional state and behaviour can suffer quite drastically. This is often particularly obvious in elderly people who have become isolated. After days alone, their first contact may be their GP, who sees them for 10 minutes.
They are highly likely during this short period to appear 'strange' as their thwarted need for attention asserts itself in an outpouring of communication. If the GP takes this as representative of the patient's general mental condition, they may prescribe drugs, where really a few hours of being listened to would suffice.
You may also have noticed this in evening-class attendees who command the teacher's attention all the time, asking seemingly daft questions and not really listening to the answers!
2. Taking heed of the mind body connection.
This is so important, and so often neglected. Without correct and regular nutrition, sleep and exercise, your psychological state can suffer considerably. It is often seen that young people, on leaving home and the structure that provides, succumb to one mental illness or another. Their mealtimes, sleep patterns and other regular habits become disrupted, with predictable consequences.
It seems that people are increasingly treating themselves as machines!
3. The need for purpose, goals and meaning.
"The devil will make work for idle hands to do."
Perhaps the overriding element that sets human beings apart from other animals is the ability to identify, analyse and solve problems. This is what enabled us to develop to where we have.
If this ability is under-used, the imagination can start to create problems of its own - perhaps in an attempt to give you something to do because it is not occupied doing anything else.
Regardless, if a person is deprived of the outward focus and satisfaction created by achieving goals, mental illness is often close behind.
The need for meaning is perhaps even more profound. Viktor Frankl's book 'Man's Search for Meaning' documents the impact of lack of meaning on concentration camp prisoners, of which he was one. He says in it that "What is the meaning of life?" is a question that is asked of you, not one that you yourself ask. It is a hugely powerful and important read when considering mental health.
4. A sense of community and making a contribution.
Tying in with the need for meaning, this basic need provides a context for a person. It gives them a reason for being, over and above their own personal needs, that has been shown to benefit the immune system, mental health and happiness.
One obvious fulfiller of this need is religion, but can also be an idea shared with others, a club, charity or community work. In fact, anything that takes the focus off the self.
5. The need for challenge and creativity .
Learning something new, expanding horizons, improving on existing skills all provide a sensation of progress and achievement. Without this, a person can feel worthless, or that there is no real reason for their being.
6. The need for intimacy .
Tying in with the need for attention, it seems that people have a need to share their ideas, hopes and dreams with others close to them. For some, this can be as simple a talking to a loved pet, but for most of us, it requires that we have at least one individual with whom we can converse 'on the same level'.
7. The need to feel a sense of control.
"All your eggs in one basket."
The results of total loss of control over your surroundings, relationships or body are not hard to imagine, and have been well documented.
From survivors of torture, to someone losing their job, those who are able to maintain a sense of control somewhere in their life fare the best. This is why having a variety of interests and activities is so important.
8. The need for a sense of status.
Itís important to feel important. And we all know some people for whom this need is too important! However, if someone feels recognised for being a grandmother or parent or good son or daughter, this may be enough. Young people finding their feet can have improved self-esteem if they feel they have attained a position of trust and recognition.
Young boys in Birmingham, UK who were at risk of exclusion because of behavioural problems were trained as mentors and paid for helping younger kids who were also at risk of exclusion. Not only did the mentorsí own behaviour improve, they also reported greater levels of happiness, contentment and self-esteem. Much disruptive, problematic behaviour may be a misapplied attempt to meet this need for recognition.
9. The need for a sense safety and security.
We need to feel our environment is basically secure and reasonably predictable. Financial security, physical safety and health, and the fulfilment of other basic needs all contribute to the completion of this need. As with all of the following needs we can take it too far and become obsessive about it - you will see this sometimes if the need for creativity is not met.
Many Needs, One Life
It may seem that a life that meets all of these needs would be intolerably busy. But of course, one activity can meet many needs. Charity work for example, could be said to fulfil 1, 3, 4 and 5, and could contribute to 6 and 7.
Walking with a friend as a pastime might go towards 1, 2, 3, 5 and 6.
Generally, what this suggests, and what has been borne out by recent research, is that a more complex life is a more healthy one.
Then if one area of life fails or is taken away from you, your basic needs are maintained, at least in part, by those that survive.
So the message is...
If your progress through life has gone a bit awry for you or a friend, check if there is petrol in the car, and that the battery is charged before going to a mechanic to have the engine taken apart!"

Anne Posted: 03/10/2008 13:37

To Patricia,
That is the finest piece of useful information I have read in a long long time and well done for bringing it to our attention.
It appears complicated but when you break it down it is quite simple and makes so much sense, I certainly will take the information on board and introduce the practise gradually bit
by bit.
Reading the letter represents how I used to be and it
outlines the road back to good mental health. It is very easy
to isolate oneself from the rest of the world "opting out" and
then one day we open our eyes and discover we are in a very
lonely place and do not realise how we got there.
Thank you for your research, I for one appreciate it.
Anne.

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 03/10/2008 19:40

Thank you for your kind words, Anne. I do hope that this piece of sensible information helps a lot of people. It certainly resonated with me. It is simple to reach out to others, though often we tend to think others can mind read us. Well, they can't.
I also found this:
Harness de Power that Defeats Defeat
Questions for Self-Wholeness
1) Instead of always asking yourself why things always happen to you, learn to ask What is it inside of me that attracts these painful situations?
2) Instead of always asking yourself why things had to go this way or that way, learn to ask Why is the way I feel always determined by external conditions?
3) Instead of always asking yourself how to protect yourself in challenging situations, learn to ask What is it in me that always needs to be defended?
4) Instead of always asking yourself how to clear up your mental fog, learn to ask Can confusion know anything about clarity?
5) Instead of always asking yourself what to do about tomorrow (or the next minute, learn to ask Can there ever be intelligence in anxiety or worry?
6) Instead of always asking yourself why does so-and-so act this or that way, learn to ask What's inside of me that wants to hurt itself over how anyone acts?
7) Instead of always crying out, "Why me?" learn to ask Who is this "me" that always feels this way?
8) Instead of always asking yourself if you've made the right choice, learn to ask Can fear ever make a safe decision?
9) Instead of always asking yourself why doesn't so-and-so see how wrong they are, learn to ask Is what I'm feeling about that person right now good for me? Or them?
10) Instead of always asking yourself how to get others to approve you, learn to ask What do I really want, the applause of the crowds or to quietly have my own life?
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LOLA Posted: 04/10/2008 00:50

Hi patricia, like anne i found your list very interesting and useful. Well done for sharing it with us. Got me thinking i would like to do some charity work. Don't really know where to start. I used to be confident, lost a bit of that over the years. I do like helping people and also would love to do a job well. Are there any charities that could do with a helping hand for a few hours during the week. Any suggestions from anyone. Thanks lola x

Tom Posted: 05/10/2008 13:40

Dear Patricia
Thank you so much for your analysis and for the time spent putting it together, it is very comprehensive, thought provoking, soothing and inspiring. I for one will read and re-read it many times and start trying to apply it bit by bit.
Hello to everyone else that uses this site, I hope you are all keeping well. Kindest regards Tom

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 06/10/2008 10:16

Thanks Tom, and Lola, for your kind words. I hope you and everyone else is keeping well this Monday...
Lola: There are a myriad of organisations out there looking for volunteers. I wouldn't know where to start. However, one very worthy cause is helping the aged.
http://www.ageaction.ie/
Many lonely old people just love a quick visit, a chat and a cup of tea.
I also think there may also be a scheme where people go to read the newspaper for a blind person. You might check with an association for the blind of Ireland.
All the best
P

Tom Posted: 06/10/2008 10:36

Hi everyone, Tom here, Lola like you I would also be interested in doing a few hours regularly for some charity. Suggestions would be most welcome from anybody that uses this message line. Kay Helen Ann and Patricia I hope you are all well. Kind regards Tom

collette Posted: 07/10/2008 19:54

Ever since the news broke about the banks being in trouble, companies closing down jobs being lost. Every day I listen to the news and all I hear is doom and gloom and it is truly making me and everyone around me sick!
I have a problem with depression so it doesn't take much for me to "go down hill" and I am getting worse day by day. My husband is retiring soon and all he hears on the news is how bad pensions are doing after spending his life paying into one, what do we do, we are a couple who looked forward to a care-free end of days. I can't sleep I just lay awake wondering what our future holds, nothing is certain. I am so afraid, is this depression talking or does anybody else feel as I do?

Tom Posted: 08/10/2008 12:34

Collette, I empathise dearly with you. I am now able for only 1 dose of news a day. We are living in very scary times. Try to remain cheerful, much easier said than done. Kind regards Tom

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 08/10/2008 20:28

Hello Collette:
Yes, these are turbulent times, and, I fear, completely beyond our control. In any case, at the best of times we have no control over the future, and it is vital to live in the present. It is easier said than done to stop worrying, but worry is futile. In actual fact we do not even know what tomorrow will bring, let alone the future.
Hope everyone on here, Tom, Lola you all,are doing OK.
Best to you all
P.

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 08/10/2008 20:47

Hello everyone:
Well this article is VERY LONG I took an excerpt of two from it. It makes a good deal of sense.
http://www.gethappy.net/v208.htm
Excerpts.
""".... people almost ritualistically worry to ward-off a worse imagined consequence -- that of total calamity! Though very few people ever become consciously of this reason for their worry, it appears to me that most people worry out of a fear that if they don't, something far more dreadful will happen. Worry, in this light, becomes more like a ritual. The more you worry, the less likely untoward events will happen. If you stop, something bad will happen.
The fifth, and most important reason: people never think about it. Worried thinking is forward thinking. It focuses on upcoming events. Thus, being good worriers, most of us are thinking about today's worries. We've already forgotten yesterday's...
We stay so preoccupied with our immediate worries, we never bother to check-up on yesterday's. What was bothering us yesterday? What was worrying us last month? Or last year? Hardly anybody thinks to revisit past worries -- we're too busy with today's worries to bother. Yet, if we were to think about it, we'd find that most of the things we worried about yesterday never happened.
Worry is, basically, a form of superstitious behavior. We chuckle at those people who "knock on wood" or avoid going to the thirteenth floor in a building. Yet worry is the same. If we simply bothered to count up the times our worries actually came true, we'd find they happen about as much as "black cats crossing our path" brings us bad luck.
WORRY ANALYSIS
To break the worry-cycle, you need to begin to analyze them. We label it "worry analysis:" a process where you become aware of, study, and confront your worries head-on -- and conquer them through insight and understanding.
Apparently, worry is worthless. We spend countless hours of our precious time worrying about things that never come true. Keeping your own "worry journal" for a few weeks should make this clear to you quite quickly. Frankly, I've had people report back to me within days of starting a worry journal (with sheepish grins on their face) a bit embarrassed at how silly most of their worries appeared upon close scrutiny. Something they had never realized before, simply because they had never analyzed it.
Not only is worry low in cost-effectiveness, in a practical sense -- it is highly dysfunctional in an emotional sense. Worry makes for an unhappy mind. It is a senseless activity that only takes time away from the more positive, happy thoughts we should be concentrating on. And, realizing that it does no good -- that most worries don't come true -- is the first step toward eliminating it.

anon Posted: 08/10/2008 23:25

Dear Collette,
When I am worried and afraid I try to remember what my Mother always said to me worry and fear is the devils way of getting to you, don't you know that your Father in heaven will always take care of you if you let him, Never be afraid or worried. Those words comforted me.
We are surrounded by negativity, if we turn on the news or open a newspaper all we will see is negativity, it is what sells newspapers and wins audiences. We have heard all this before but we have to remember one thing and that is, Worry, Fear and Negativity will never help us in anything we do, these thoughts are a total waste of time.
"Today is the Tomorrow we worried about Yesterday and all is Well" Thank God (again one of my Mothers favourite quotes)
God Bless

Collette Posted: 09/10/2008 15:14

Thank you Anon and Patricia,
Funny, my Mother used to use that little saying a lot and I should have remembered it, "Today was the Tomorrow we worried about yesterday and all is well" thank you Anon.
Patricia, I am interested to know if you are a therapist if not please let me know the reading material you are interested in, because I am thinking about counselling and from your letters
you would be the "counsellor" I would choose. Please let me know. Collette

Kay Posted: 09/10/2008 17:22

Hi Guys. I am kinda worried about the way this forum has gone pretty negative. Yes the news is mostly bad and jobs are not as easy to find as before but I remember this happening in the 80's. I remember leaving school and only getting a part time job which I had for 4 years before i got a full time one. We have all been here before. None of us are going to go hungry. I too was worried when i heard of the banks etc crashing but you know I cannot do anything about it. I can just hope my husband doesnt lose his job.
Dont any of you remember growing up and not having the latest trends or fashions. I do. Dont any of you remember wearing the same set of clothes all the time? I do. I was never hungry or cold.
I think also that to try and stop worrying an over acitve and tired mind is almost impossible. So to say stop worrying over things that might never happen is futile to someone whos mind wont stop over analysing.
Hope all my friends are keeping o.k?

Tom Posted: 09/10/2008 19:35

Hi everyone, hope all is well. Collette many thanks for the material you are leaving on site, it is very valuable and of great assistance.
Concerning comparing current times to the 80's I think we should be careful about drawing direct comparisons.
For those of whom lived through it (I am one of them) I certainly was more resilient then and the conditions of anxiety and depression had not reared its ugly head in my life at that stage. Also I had the distinct advantage of youth with its attaching energy and vitality. Thats just my story, I am sure everyone has their one unique story to tell, both good and bad.
Anxiety and depression can be easily fuelled by outside factors and there are certainly plenty of negative outside factors at the moment that affects almost every person in some way or other. We need to empathise and try and cheer each other up by our mutual supportive messages.
I am glad I found this webiste and it is almost a year since I first left messages on it. We really are a great bunch of people to be coping with these conditions given that the current climate would test the most cheerful person on the planet.
Lets look after each other over the coming months
Hi Kay Anne Collette and Lola, I hope you are all keeping well. Kind regards Tom

Collette Posted: 09/10/2008 21:04

Dear Patricia,
Looking down the letters on this page I notice you suggested
Harness the Power - Guy Finlay more helpful information, thanks again you have given me a lot of help with your information. Thanks once again, my "cloud" is shifting and the sky is getting a little brighter.
Collette

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 10/10/2008 09:43

Hello to all:
I don't think this forum has gone negative at all. Quite the contrary.
I see insightful people doing their best to address their problems.
I did NOT say to "stop worrying". I did say worry is futile, which it is, and only makes the mind more tired and stressed. Two different things. And yes, it is possible to take measures to induce a better mindset.
All the best to everyone.
P

Collette Posted: 10/10/2008 13:03

Hello Friends,
I wrote in to this site with a head full of worries about our future and I once again want to thank Patricia's hard work and Toms empathy and words of encouragement.
To the person who wrote in saying that the site has become negative well, that is what depression is and by reaching out for help you find people like Patricia and Tom. This site is a life line for me, friends are helping me and with a bit of luck I will return that favour in due time. For many years I hid my worries from everybody kept smiling and nobody knew how I
was feeling, but that leads to anger frustration and soon the
smile is a habit but inside you are ready to erupt, that is not
good for anyone. So if the letters are a little negative it is all
in a good cause people are healing their wounds and that is good.
My husband is also benefiting from it, we read the information supplied and then discuss it, my husband is beginning to open up, and if you asked me a year ago would we be sitting discussing strategies for happiness I would have laughed.
Collette

Anne. Posted: 10/10/2008 13:29

Hi Folks,
Anne here, well as I told you I am going for counselling and I can't believe how much can be uncovered in one hour but I am
exhausted for the rest of the day. It is early days yet but I believe it will help me, anyway enough about me.
Tom and Lola did you get any further in the charity work idea
it has been recommended for me also so, there are a couple of
Bernardo and other charity shops near I will offer my services.
Maybe you would consider that Lola and Tom meals on wheels
and the other charities always need drivers, just a thought. if I
hear of anything else I will let you know.
Kay I read your letter and I know how much you care about everybody, don't be upset by the way the site is going, sometimes people open up and you and I know that is to be
encouraged God knows I kept stumb! for too long but since I
took your advice to seek counselling I am getting better, you
are a good person and never change.
Patricia you are helping people and I am sure it takes a lot of
time all that research your help in precious don't stop.
Colette we are a good bunch of people and welcome to this site
I have a sister Colette. Try not to worry about the times we are in, it will do us all good, it will "weed" the corrupt out of our
patch. Good comes out of bad.
Helen, where are you? I send my love
Anne

Kay Posted: 10/10/2008 16:06

Hi Anne, thanks for your kind words. Nice to hear from a friend. I am glad therapy is going well for you. Its very very tough at times. I am still attending therapy and can honestly say it keeps me grounded and real. In that on bad days (which I have plenty of) it makes me see whats important and keeps me from flipping out completely.
Patricia, collette, didnt mean to offend anyone by saying this site is becoming negative. I am really worried about my husbands job and so I dont listen to the news and I am constantly telling myself that its not as bad as everyone is saying so my reaction to comments about recession was an "defense reaction". I know I am sticking my head in the sand but I am in a pretty unsure place right now in my head and heart.
I love this forum and all the people on it. We are all so kind to each other. Thats the way it should be too. talk to you all soon. Kay.

LOLA Posted: 10/10/2008 23:56

hi Anne, reading about you attending counselling and doing well. I could do with some. Have not done anything about charity yet. Feel i need to sort some issues before i can take anything on. I really need to speak to an independent person to sort me out. Went with my husband before but i think I would do better on my own. Yes i think this forum is very good for everyone who is in trouble, emotionly.Tom have you found a charity to help ?Fair play if you have. I guess i lack confidence and need to address this. Greetings to everyone on the forum. Anna marie are you back home yet ?

Anne. Posted: 13/10/2008 14:39

Hi Lola, Kay and all,
Lola I agree with you about the counselling first and then you can continue looking after everybody else as you and Kay always have done, you are both kind people who put everybody else first, so as my counsellor said this morning take care of yourself first and then start thinking about helping others, that makes sense to me. Can I suggest that you contact an individual counsellor rather than a couples counsellor because you need YOU time like Kay attends and suggested for me, if you want the name of a counsellor I will let you have a contact number and they are not pre-occupied with making money the client is the important aspect to them. Good Luck
Kay again, only for you I wouldn't be attending counselling,
Kay you are worth your weight in Gold and please accept that
compliment. I have been "tuning" in to this page for many
months, possibly a year and Kay all you have ever done was
to help people see a ray of sunshine through the clouds. I
have a lot more clouds than rays of sunshine so keep up the
good work.
Kay worrying is not going to make one bit of difference to whether your Husbands job goes or stays, you have eachother
and do what I am doing to the "credit squeeze" two fingers (sorry) but you cannot do anything about it. It will bring people together again, No Mrs Jones's to deal with, the young
people will learn how to manage money properly, and we will
all be better people for it, trust me. Give yourself a big hug from me Ha!
Anne.

LOLA Posted: 13/10/2008 17:59

Dear Anne, I would very much like a contact number of an individual counsellor please as i really think it would help. Yourself and Kay seem to do well seeing one. Thanks again for your help. Best wishes, Lola

Anne. Posted: 13/10/2008 20:47

Dear Lola,
Suggestion, as we like to remain anonymous (and if I am not
mistaken you said you were using the name Lola, maybe I am
wrong!) do you have an email that doesn't have your name if
not maybe you could open one and I will send the name of the place to you, if you don't want to do that go to the yellow pages and look under counselling the place I am going to is in it and it is a about 3", I don't think I am allowed mention the name here as it is considered advertising. Good Luck and let me know how you are getting on.
Anne.

Kay Posted: 14/10/2008 09:48

Hi Anne. Thanks for your post. Yeah therapy/counciling seems to be the best way to go. It is not a quick fix, in fact it is painstakeingly slow. Lola, I would give it a try. There is a group of registered therapists on line you will get details I will find the name of the site and post it later on this forum. I think its so important to find the right one. I know of one man, a typical Irish man, rough around the edge and very reluctant to believe in therapy or anything different and his doctor suggested that he go to therapy for his depression/anxiety. He went to a therapist suggested by his g.p. and she turned out to be an alterantive therapist. Which is fine for somebody with a more open mind. But this therapist started telling this man on his second session with her, to do these tapping techniques(meridian therapy). Now to man hanging on the edge trying hard to see a reason for living this was too much. My point is when choosing a therapist be really selective, go with your instincts, if it doesnt feel right then dont be afraid to see some one else. Does this make any sense? I am typing away here and dont know if this makes any sense.
I am in therapy now for 17 months, I didnt think for one minute I would be there that long and I know I will be there for quite a bit longer. But then again I opened a can of worms and remembered stuff and I am still trying to come to terms with the horrible cruel things that were done to me as a child.
Anyway talk soon you guys and thanks again Anne for your post it made me feel very special. Kay.

Anne. Posted: 14/10/2008 12:12

Lola,
I agree with Kay entirely I have found the therapist who is
right for me and I was lucky. I, like Kay will be in therapy for 2 years plus because I have a lot to deal with from my childhood, it is not usually that long.
I know I offered to give you the name of a therapist but if that person didn't work for you I would feel so bad, does that make sense? Whereas Kay said she could give you details of a Group and you can take your pick. Go for it and Good Luck.

Anne. Posted: 14/10/2008 12:37

Hi Kay,
I am still laughing over the big Irish man who went for counselling and she offered meridian tapping Ha! Thank
God for your sense of humour!
If you can give Lola the name of the group of therapists
I probably sounded a bit "Cloak and Dagger" but I do try
to respect a persons anonymity, I suppose I watch too many
CSI programmes on t.v.
Anne.

lola Posted: 14/10/2008 14:23

Hi Anne, as you say lola is not my real name (Can you imagine a baby been called that in 1963 ! ) Unfortunatley my e-mail contains my name. would what you were speaking about make you a new you. God i feel i have joined the secret service ! Kay i agree with you 100% i would have to feel comfortable with a councellor. I think getting a good one would be the making of me. Thanks girls for your help.

Anne. Posted: 14/10/2008 20:05

Hi Lola and Kay
As I looked back on the postings and You LOLA asking "will it
make you a NEW you" I really have started a CSI drama HA!
Sorry!, but just before we finish I know a man who knows a
man who can get us all new passports HA! HA! I better go back
on the tablets!!
Its Good to have a LAUGH!

Anne. Posted: 15/10/2008 10:21

Hi Lola & Kay,
When I read my posting of yesterdays date I just realised I
had "cut but not pasted" the middle section so it must have
made no sense to you whatsoever Sorry about that blame
it on the weather Ha!
The Group I rang was Newlands because it was not in my district and I wouldn't meet anybody I know, and as mentioned I got the name in the Yellow Pages, if Irishealth considers this advertising they will not let it be printed so, if another "weird" letter is printed you will know why. Good Luck.
Anne.

lola Posted: 15/10/2008 20:20

Hi Anne, just to clear up the new you query. That was out of the yellow pages because when I read your text you said something about 3, so when i looked in the phone book there was one with 3 councillors in the one practice called the new you, hence, i jumped to the wrong conclusion. You cleared it up for me thanks. lola

Kay Posted: 18/10/2008 11:32

Hi Guys . Lola if you look up the M.I.A.C.P. on line it will give you a list of registered therapists. Thats the best way to go. Hope they post this because its a very important contact to anyone who needs help now. Anne and Lola you two make me smile when I read your posts.
Anne can i ask you a question? Dont feel you have to answer it. I find at the present i am not getting on with my sister at all. The relationship between is really strained. She knows i am in therapy for abuse. But some person she knows told her that i shouldnt be in therapy this long for abuse, that I should have sorted it out in 6 sessions. Yeah. like that would happen. Obviously this person has no clue how long recovery can take for something this traumatic. And the worst thing is she is actually a social worker who works with kids. Anyway, my sister just does not get this. She keeps asking our mother "whats wrong with Kay?" I am really frustrated by this and feel I can't even be in her company now because its so strained. I only have one sister and no brothers so its harder to ignore this problem. I am aware she is probably unnerved by all this because she was always in the house where the abuse took place with me as kids. she is only a year older than me. So far she has not remembered any abuse happening to her and she is adamant nothing like that ever happened to her. Its odd because one of my vivid flashbacks is me being abused while she was sitting on the other bed in the room looking out the window all scared and frightened. I know she was definately there that day and witnessed the abuse happening to me. So I suppose my question is what do I do? DO i avoid her because if i am in her company and pretending all is ok i am not honouring myself. I am hiding again and keeping quite like i did when i was little so hence it starts up panic and anxiety inside me. Would be grateful for your opinion guys.

Anne. Posted: 20/10/2008 14:39

Hi Friends Kay in particular,
The more I get to know you the more I am convinced that you are one strong woman.
You asked for my opinion so firstly forgive me while I rant and rave for a moment. I am so angry at the fact that your sister should be discussing your personal therapy with an outsider without your permission and secondly, the fact that your sister is listening to her and taking her advice, Kay I am practically tearing my hair out of my head with anger, WARNING! for those who are sensitive to bad language look away now... tell your sisters friend to keep her unqualified opinions to her Fu.... self, and as for your Sister tell her you expected more from her, you are dealing with your problem and you want her not to interfere unless she has something positive to add to your therapy.
Now! having got that out of my system I am calm. Kay clearly these two people have no right to discuss you and your family business. My sister knows what happened to me and she has been my rock that is why I love her so very very much, she is a Saint walking amongst us and that is how I was able to forgive my offender, you will understand when I say that I am not going into my case, that is between me and my counsellor/psychotherapist. My sister and I never
discuss it but I know where her loyalties are, I never ever have to put up with stress caused by anybody else other than self-imposed.
You asked for my opinion and for what it is worth here it is. Ask your therapist what he/she thinks, but if it were me and I felt mentally strong enough I would choose a time when I was calm and then I would have a chat with my sister to
"nip this in the bud", tell her that you do not want or need to have your personal business discussed with any outsider. Also, you and only you can tell when your sessions come to an end. As for your sister remembering, you have to take care of yourself and in time maybe you can help her (if she needs your help), remember it has taken you to this age before you were ready so she will with Gods help reach her appropriate time.
I have been writing as I was thinking so I hope I am making sense. Kay you are at this moment the important one so focus on YOU why! because you are worth it. God Bless You and I wish you peace and love and, I am sending you a big HUG!

lola Posted: 20/10/2008 15:37

Hi there everyone, Thank so much for the list. Called one that seemed to deal with my issues, low self esteem etc. Waiting to hear back. Anne and Kay reading your posts my heart goes out to you both and i think you are fantastic. I feel a bit guilty as my problems are nothing compared to yours. Keep doing what you are doing and i for one have so much respect for you both. Will keep you posted when i have more information. luv lola.x

Kay Posted: 21/10/2008 23:36

Anne, thank you thank you sooo much. God do you know what, you're bloody brilliant. I felt my heart soaring as I read your post. You are very blessed with having an understanding sister. I wrote my sister a very short letter just asking her to try and understand and just to trust me with the fact that I know what I am doing. She told me she hadnt time to study the letter she said she just glanced over it. Also I had asked her to read just five pages of a book I couldnt do without "The Courage to Heal". Her response to that was she was very busy and she might not get a chance to read it for a few months. My therapist is livid with her. I don't want to lose the only sibling i have but its getting more and more difficult to put up with her selfish ways. It was good to hear from someone else, not in my immediate circle, that she acted selfishly too. So for that Anne I thank you.
Its sometimes good to get the perspective of somebody not immediately related to your own personal situation. I wish you much happinness Anne, and thank you again for being there for us all. talk soon. Kay.

Anne. Posted: 22/10/2008 14:01

Hi Kay,
Thank you so much for all the very nice compliments but if you think about it, you are making me a better person by allowing me to help if I can so the gratitude is right back at ya!
Kay at the risk of sounding dictatorial I want to suggest that you don't try any further with your Sister, talk about anything other than your reason for therapy, she seams to be in denial and she will fight you all the way if you continue, but if you drop the subject completely with her, she will then start to think and with Gods help she will come around. You however, have your healing to do and as you said that will not happen overnight and you still have hurdles to jump so put all your energy into your healing and then in the future you will be "there" for your sister should she need you on this subject.
Kay I hope I don't sound as though I am preaching it is the
last thing I would want to do, you don't need it, I'll hold back on the compliments you khow what I think of you, we all are with you, so Go Girl!
Just a thought, you don't have to answer, but what does your
Mom think about all this?
Anne.

Anne. Posted: 22/10/2008 14:15

Tom, Helen, Colette, Patricia, Where are you? hope you are all o.k. just drop a line into the site so we know all is well.
Hi Lola,
Hope you are doing well please let us know how you are getting
on, did you go for the counselling yet or are you waiting until the time is right for you, you won't do any harm by having a chat with a stranger (counsellor) and family doesn't have to know. Anyway, take care of yourself.
Anne.

lola Posted: 22/10/2008 22:06

Dear Anne, Did ring one of the therapists on the list and left a message. Heard nothing back up to this.I am a bit worried about going but not hearing anything is giving me the chance to think about what i want to talk about. Just wondering, if i dont like the counsellor and dont feel happy, what do i do ? I am afraid i would be stuck with someone i dont feel comfortable with and not be able to get out of it. any ideas chicks ? luv lola

Anne. Posted: 23/10/2008 13:28

Hi Lola,
I am sure Kay will say the very same. I felt exactly that way,just start by saying hello and it seams to flow out from there, you will be all over the place that is how I was, but after a while you will discover what you want to focus on first look on it like a plate of spaghetti and you are taking one string out at a time that was said to me but on the second session she will start focusing in on things you said first session and that is the way it goes. Just remember she is there for YOU the counsellor is of no consequence and she will probably say that to you.
On the question of whether she/he will be the correct one. Before you start the session she will probably talk about that, tell her it has taken you a long time to get to this stage and you need to feel at ease with your counsellor so, can we see how we go. Just remember this it is your first time but she has had many people sitting in your chair she is used to this. All of the foregoing was said to me before I started so you probably won't have to say anything, hope that helps.
Anne.

Collette Posted: 23/10/2008 13:48

Dear Kay,
You may remember me, I wrote to this site some weeks ago and
I was being "negative". I apologise about that, when depression hits I cannot see things as others do.I am writing to thank you for giving the address of counsillors and I am going next week, I thought I should tell you. Thank you again for your help.
Collette.
Hello Anne,
You have such a caring nature, you will remember telling me
that you have a sister called Collette (I think your sister has a
different spelling). Just to say hello.

Kay Posted: 23/10/2008 18:36

Hi Anne. My mom is great now. she has educated herself in the last year about abuse by reading lots and because of that she is a huge support to me. This time last year i couldn't even stand to look at my mom or dad because I blamed them for what happened to me. Now I know they did their best and would have never left me in danger intentionally.
Lola, go see your therapist, like Ann says the first session is really an introductory for you both. I remember my first session vividly because I cried all the way through it. It was the first time i cried for years and I didn't know why I was crying just I was in a scary place in my head. I have now formed a trusting relationship with my therapist. If you feel ok with your therapist and comfortable with him or her then take it from there. Try and not think too far ahead just go from week to week. and don't worry about what you are going to talk about because you will probably find that when you start that things will flow.
I wish you the best of luck.

Kay Posted: 23/10/2008 18:41

Hi Collette. I hope all goes ok for you in therapy. I am so pleased you found the info. helpful. Therapy is good and it is all about re-educating yourself and re-training yourself. I am kinda of the opinion now that everybody should have therapy because of its benefits.

Anne. Posted: 23/10/2008 19:47

Hello Collette,
Welcome back and you are correct my sister does spell her name
differently (Colette).
Best of luck with the counselling, I think Kay should be collecting commission from these therapists only for her help we would still be "hiding under the bed" Ha!
Anne

lola Posted: 23/10/2008 22:20

Hi Anne and Kay, thank you so much for your posts of support. I will go to the therapist and will let you know how I get on. Luv lola

Anne. Posted: 24/10/2008 12:27

Hi Kay,
I am not the positive Anne today my husband sprung a surprise on me last night that we are going away for the weekend, just to the North and for some reason or other I am in a panic. I woke feeling all the old symptoms back again, I don't want to meet anyone I want to stay at home and I am shaking (inside) does that make any sense. It is already booked, he thinks he has given me a nice surprise so I can't say anything. He told me that he checked with my sister to see if I had planned anything and she said no, she is gone away also so I can't talk to her. I have had anxiety and panic
attacks for many years so I should know how to control them,
I think I am better giving other people advice, but I am no
good when I have to manage, I don't know what to do.
I am stupid I should be happy, anyone else would. I am sorry
for rambling but I had to get this off my chest, I know I sound
so stupid, give me your feedback Kay before the day ends if you can.

lola Posted: 25/10/2008 00:37

Dear Anne, just read your post. My heart goes out to you. stop panicking and think, what is the worst that can happen. I would give my right arm to be invited by my husband for a weekend away. You are in therapy you can handle this.For gods sake misses i would go on a weekend with you ! You deserve the good life, we all deserve the good life.From your advice you are strong. give yourself a break and bring back happy memories from the north. I for one are waiting to hear how you get on. all the best. luv lola,( getting used to this name !)

Kay Posted: 25/10/2008 11:12

Hi Anne. Didnt get your post until today so you're probably gone. I hope you had a good time. The same thing happens me. I am in control and something comes up that is not part of my mundane routine and throws me. All that i have learned about panic attacks and controling them goes out the window. The best thing I can tell myself when this happens is that, I can go home anytime I want. I can just get in the car and go home. To me then it brings things into perspective. Its kinda like a safety net. But then that comes with problems too because I have not been out of the country for 12 years. To me its too out of my control because I cannt fly a plane!!! I have made excuses over the years about the kids being too small to go foreign or that we havent got enough money. But its all an excuse. I just dont go out of the country because I have no control of when I come home.
I really hope you are ok. I am sorry now I didnt get around to going on the computer yesterday.
Let me know how you get on.

Kay Posted: 25/10/2008 11:16

p.s. Anne you are not stupid this is just a reaction to things being taken out of your control. Even though it is supposed to enjoyment this weekend to people with panic and anxiety is like a huge event. So, you are not stupid. Put the panic where it belongs - to your past. Just tell yourself, this panic has nothing to do with now its from my past. best of luck, I will be thinking of you and hoping you are doing o.k.

Anne. Posted: 28/10/2008 15:18

Hi Girls,
You are both so so good and thanks for your lovely caring letters.
It is a lovely feeling to have people who care (outside family). I let my friends go one by one because of my social phobia so your letters meant more to me than you realise.
I survived, if you were a bystander looking at me leaving the house you would have thought I was being taken to the Tower for hanging Ha! everything went well, I took a lot of deep breaths and took everything in my stride so, I was o.k.
I hope you didn't mind me sending my letter for help, I panicked. I think fear is the thing we are most afraid of, does that make sense?
I went to my therapist today she is great and I cried a lot but discovered a lot about myself and Kay as you mentioned at one time the child within, I am at that stage and it is difficult you know that. Thanks Kay for sharing your fears with me I know that you will grow your own wings and fly someday soon.
Lola you are another one with a caring heart, thanks for the
support (second time I said thanks, I know).
God Bless Girls. From Anne.

Tom Posted: 28/10/2008 16:22

Hi everyone, Hope you are all well.Have not checked the messages for a little while.
Anne sorry to hear about your panic about the weekend away, very happy to hear that it went well for you.
If it is any consolation I get exactly the same feelings about non-routine items (good items and bad items) and the feeling is very real despite anybody that I talk to downplaying the situation etc.
To my mind Anne you did exactly the right thing by getting it down on paper and out in the open, you did not panic, instead you sought assistance, like if you needed your car serviced you would go to the garage.
As well as Kay's point about safe place and therapy, can I add something that I have found does help me, and that is to label the feeling when it comes on, something funny like Donald Duck and literally tell it out loud to go away.
I have used this with some gradual success by practice. Also in the morning time if you are having an awful feeling, try telling yourself that you are going to absorb from the ground up into all your system white energy and that you are going to get rid of all the nasty dirty red and black energy. I cannot say it is a cure all because it certainly is not for me, but I do think it can help a little.
Regards to Patricia, Kay, Lola, Collette. Lets look after each other in the forthcoming winter months.

Anne. Posted: 28/10/2008 21:24

Hi Tom,
Thanks so much for your letter and I am glad to see you back
on the forum. Tom I just began to panic and it got out of control.
Looking back I did find it very helpful to put it in writing to a "faceless" person if you know what I mean i.e. I didn't have to worry about my letter affecting my family (they worry about me) we are faceless friends, here for each other but removed enough to be objective and lend support.
I know what you mean by people "playing it down" they want to help but they need to "walk ten miles in our shoes" before they could possibly know how we feel, am I correct?
I can relate to the "white light" idea, I have used it on other occasions in the past and thank you for reminding me I will use it again.
Thanks again Tom, Good Luck and again welcome back.
Anne.

Anne. Posted: 28/10/2008 22:16

Lola,
I have been spending too much time talking about myself.
How are you getting on being wife, Mother, Care attendant you
are always there for me, so complain away and I will be here
for you o.k. but, I am not going away on a weekend with you
(see your last posting to me) people will talk, or maybe you
meant my husband, I know your name is Lola and you're a
show girl but forget it !
best wishes, Anne.

lola Posted: 29/10/2008 17:28

Dear Anne, thank you for your kind words. love to read your texts. I am doing ok at moment, waiting to go and see therapist. Kids off school this week and they keep you busy. Got my hair cut and coloured today. Its amazing how getting your hair done makes you feel better about yourself. Im very disappointed i wont be going away with you ! seriously though i was delighted you went and did so well. text again soon. take care. luv lola.
hi ya kay hope you are keeping well. Tom welcome back to the forum. Feel we are all friends even if its in cyber space! luv again lola.
love lola

Kay Posted: 29/10/2008 21:08

Anne, glad you enjoyed your weekend. Isnt it crap when something supposedly nice like a weekend away comes up and we go into a blind panic. I think people never get how it feels to be so afraid unless as you say theyve walked in our shoes at some time or other. I know my sister never will understand it and almost condems me for being "weak" and giving into my fears. I know i am not weak and I have proved it to myself in the past year and a half. I am actually starting to think she is the weak scared one, because I know her childhood was like mine in some aspects and that I know she will never in this life time face up to it.
Tom so glad to hear from you. I try the white light to and it does help to calm and focus the mind when its in turmoil. I actually forget to use it at times too.
Hi Lola when are you starting therapy? Hope its soon.
Tom is right, we should be here for each other during the winter months. I always remind myself that winter is dreary and dark but just after christmas my daffodils bulbs in the garden start coming through the soil and its always a reminder to me that spring is just on the horizon. Its literally just a few months away.
To-day i am optimistic and have been for weeks now. The key i am convinced is talking and writting. I try to write in a diary type thing at least evey second day just to write down my fears in black and white. Even if they look weird and frightening on paper, its better getting them out in the open.

Anne Posted: 30/10/2008 11:37

Hi Kay, Tom, Lola,
Kay your sister "is not for turning" as the saying goes and I think she will fight you all the way, but don't let her denial affect your healing, keep your blinkers on and just continue down the road to peace of mind. You are so positive Kay, I know what you mean re the daffodils I long for that time of the year.
Lola, (the show girl Ha!)
I love your texts too I think you truly have the capacity to make the world laugh, and if you got the opportunity you would become Lola, Ha!
Tom how are you today,
Do you have an alter ego (I think that is what you call it) I often feel like swapping my life for an afternoon, I wonder would it make us better anxiety wise.
I would like to be Catherine Hepburn with Cary Grant. I used
to watch those old films on Sunday afternoons when I was a
teenager.
Kay who would you be? I know you are not going to suggest you be an Air Hostess Ha!
Have a Good day friends,
Anne.

Kay Posted: 30/10/2008 19:36

Hi Anne. Id be a high power business woman with fab figure, great clothes and so organised that it would make your head spin. I would be so confident in all that I turn my hand to and so sure of myself. Not in a cocky way but in a nice way. So also remaining very humane and kind.
I would keep the same kids and hubby I have now only I would be a working woman. Just thinking about it makes me smile. Of course if I was in this position I would probably be stresed out an see very little of my kids.
Sometimes we think the grass is greener on the other side and maybe a "High Powered Business Woman" would be wishing she could stay at home and raise her kids like I can.
You made me smile Anne. Keep up the good work.

lola Posted: 31/10/2008 21:35

Hi anne and Kay, Just read Kays message. Its spooky- i would have wanted exactly the same thing. High powered working woman with fab clothes balancing kids mother and anything else.As you say Kay other working women would give their right arm to stay home. Some times a monkey on a stick would not keep us happy ! happy halloween girls love lola x

Anne. Posted: 01/11/2008 14:15

Hi Girls,
Hold on to those thoughts because believe it or not your life is not going to stay the same forever. Your children are growing and they eventually want their own lifestyles and guess what, you get your own life back to do with whatever you want and that is where I am at the moment. I have my family but I have my free time back and I have taken a lot of courses and learnt a lot. Women of your age get back out there and pick up where they left off i.e. if you haven't gone to University go back. Think, what your ambitions were, then go for them, make it happen. I am in my late fifties so I have years on you girls and I can tell you it is possible. When I am down, I take it easy and don't expect much from myself, lowering my standards I call it. When I am back up I continue where I left off. When you are doing something you love and want to do, you will be amazed how it fulfils you, the sense of achievement etc. I don't want to give you the wrong idea, I didn't go to university but I have known women who have, but the university thing is only an example. We all have different ambitions and I always say if you want to achieve something go for it. Just a thought friends I hope it give you something to
think about, or maybe the above doesn't appeal to you if so, try to forget my ranting and raving. By the way I am 58 going on 28 its just my body that's 58 gravity etc. Happy Weekend
Anne.

Kay Posted: 03/11/2008 11:12

Hi Anne. You know your idea sounds like a plan to me. I feel like i have missed out on so much, not because i had kids. Its because I have lead such a small safe life. Of course its because of my childhood I was like this. I worked from the time I left school and had a great circle of friends. But the one thing i am sorry for is not going further. I mean doing some course that means something to me and actually working somewhere that is fulfilling and important to me.
I am waiting to burst out of this cocoon that I have been living in and spread my huge colourful wings. I want to taste life i want to travel, i want to go to concerts, i want to drive a huge truck, i want to do a course, i want to be free of any panic or anxiety that holds me back. Because I know deep down that I am very capable of all this stuff. I know I was born to do something with my life that will make a differeence to others.
Anyway talk about ranting and raving. Anne you got me thinking. Thanks for that. Good to look forward.

Anne. Posted: 04/11/2008 20:37

Tom,
Not a word from you, maybe you are feeling just like me today
Tuesday it is so dark out I just feel like pulling the curtains closed until next April but I can't do that cos the neighbours would notice and my husbands night sight is not the best Ha!
I came across some information from a person called Charles
on the Alternative Medicine site and it applies to Anxiety and Panic Attacks
"The Buteyko method or Buteyko Breathing Technique is a holistic health philosophy, for the treatment of asthma,but including many stress related physical and mental disorders linked to CHVS, that includes a set of breathing exercises developed by the late Russian doctor Konstantin Pavlovich Buteyko.
At the core of the Buteyko method is a series of breathing exercises that focus on nasal-breathing, breath-holding and relaxation. At present it is used to treat asthma, sleep apnea, snoring, *anxiety attacks and panic attacks.* These conditions are associated with disrupted or irregular breathing patterns and the Buteyko exercises aim to 'retrain' breathing to restore a natural pattern, akin to certain forms of Yoga."
I am posting it to you but I think it would help us all on this site check out his postings it may be worthwhile.
Good Luck
Anne.

Ellen Posted: 05/11/2008 00:36

Hello,
Iíve read some of the posts and I can relate. I think I developed my panic tendencies at University where I became very stressed and anxious. Social anxiety and lack of confidence were a problem to start but despite that first year and most of second year were pretty good and I actually felt positive out my future, but I took a nose dive halfway though second year. I entirely lost my confidence and ended up very isolated. I thankfully made it to the end of the course and despite doing quite well on my last assignment my confidence and hopes were utterly wrecked and I feel Iím left physically and mentally exhausted by the whole ordeal.
Iím now back at home, pretty much isolated from life and people. I feel like I canít face the ďreal worldĒ It doesnít look as bright welcoming as it once did ( its terrifying) and although I realise I need time to recover I know I have to find a way to start moving on. It just seems so impossibly hard I seem to get a bit better and then something causes me to flip back into this panic almost paranoid frame of mind and it is so scary and it saps all my energy. I end up thinking terrible things are going to happen Like I hear a noise and think itís a tidal wave and the world is about to end (the world ending used to a common theme) also I panic a lot about health fatal illness or injury. I can only hope with time I will get better, I am also aware Iím causing a lot of worry for my mum. Iím hoping joining this forum will help me move forward and get on with life.
I feel pretty nervous about posting this now, I really donít know what to expect. Iím not sure I described myself very well and Iím kind of afraid in case no one replies.

Anne. Posted: 05/11/2008 15:16

Dear Ellen,
I read your posting and you poor girl you have been through the mill, it appears that you worked really hard burning the midnight oil studying, you can only do so much before it starts to get to you, and for what it is worth I think you spent too much time with your head in the books, what do they say "too much work makes Jack a dull boy". So please stop berating yourself and learn how to relax and enjoy yourself again. When you are ready you will know it, then you can get back to the books.
Regarding all the weird thoughts, recognise them for what they are - only thoughts and then dismiss them. Tom a regular contributor has a method for dealing with thoughts and if he is looking in maybe he will describe it for you.
There is a great bunch of people on this site who have big hearts and are always there for me so relax you are not on your own and keep writing in.
Good Luck Anne

Tom Posted: 05/11/2008 18:57

Hi everyone, Tom here, welcome Ellen, I hope this site helps you as it has helped me in many ways.
I would advise that you read over the postings for the last year not in a very detailed way, but in such away that you will realise that we all have had good days and bad days throughout that time.
I think it is important with anxiety and stress to realise that there are good days and unfortunately there are bad ones. Hold on to the good days or indeed if there is not a full good day, perhaps there are a number of hours within a day that is relatively speaking good.
A technique I have learned from visiting sites like this and which I use is, to label the bad thoughts a cartoon character like Donald Duck. Then when the thoughts go on the atatck within you, dismiss then if by necessity literally saying "go away Donald Duck". This technique I find is helpful in cooling things down within my mind and most importantly I am not chastising or running myself down, I am instead telling Donald Duck (the negative thoughts) to go away.
Ellen keep posting , we are all here for each other. Tom

Kay Posted: 06/11/2008 21:32

Hi Ellen. Wellcome to the forum. Ellen you know when I think of some of the thoughts I have it scares me rigid. I think sometimes if people could see inside my head they would think I am totally off the wall. The panic and anxiety are terrifying. I know this sounds terrible but when my panic and anxiety are in full flight, I sometimes wish that I had a physical illness instead. I know people with physical illness probably would say to me get over yourself or dont be so selfish. But to people with anxiety and panic these feelings are like your life is over and you will never move away from them or move forward and heal.
I was very young when i started having panic etc. I was around 16. Do you tell anyone how you feel? Have you got a friend you can tell or family member?
Ellen, the best thing I can say to you right now is you will feel better. You wont feel like this forever. You had a life before this and you will have one after. I cannot encourage you enough to tell someone. Please. I can tell you from experience that it does release the frustration and desperate sad hopelessness. If you are not ready to talk to someone then write. get a copy and write. Write down exactly how you feel. Write down what's going through your head. No matter how off the wall it is. If you start with the writting things will shift and its a brilliant way of getting the constant circle of thoughts out of your head.
Also write here whenever you can. Most of us check this forum everyday and one of us will answer you and try and help each other.
Talk soon.

cassy (BXF77525) Posted: 07/11/2008 15:29

hiya i have been diagnosed with anxiety the doctor recommeded i should try an anti depressent called citolopram has anyone tried it is it any good ?

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 07/11/2008 20:34

Hello to Tom and absolutely everyone else on this great discussion. I have not been around of late, as a lot going on in life, but there we are, that's how it is. Hope you are all doing really well. I will read through your posts in a day or two. Life can be anxiety provoking, but you know you CAN get on top of it.
Take care everyone and have a good week-end
Patricia

Anne. Posted: 07/11/2008 21:01

Hi Everybody,
Kay and Lola how are you both, have you taken my advice and got yourselves alternate lifestyles, don't forget about me! I want to be included.
Ellen how are you today, I hope you are feeling a little better, you know you have friends so take care.
Hi Cassy,
The only advice I can offer you is to take your GP's advice, otherwise you may be given the wrong advice so good luck.
Anne.

Kay Posted: 08/11/2008 14:05

Hi Cassey. I haven't tried that particular one that your doc recommended for you but I have tried others. Is this a relatively new drug, if so its probably in the same category as cipramil. This one I have tried and it is good. Not too many side effects. Many people are against anti-depressants but I think they have a role to play in recovery. I think that they get you through the emergency stage until you can think more clearly and your head is not so confused
I know they helped my through the worst time until i could see forward. I am off them all now( I was on two lots and also xanex every 4 hours at one stage). I knew I needed to come off them when i started to forget taking them.
Best of luck.

Anne. Posted: 11/11/2008 13:08

Hello Friends,
I hope you are all o.k. with a bit of luck you are getting on with life and life is good. I am fine, although Monday is my day for counselling and I must say I always feel a bit raw after it but I know it is doing me good in the long run.
Bye for now and love to all.
Anne.

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 11/11/2008 15:10

Hello to everyone:
I never tire of recommending the articles on this site, because of the down to earth and commonsense approach of this Dr. Carver. You might like to look at the article entitled "Bad Nerves". (click on the link), or go to the web page and click on "Articles" in the menu up on the left of the page.
http://www.drjoecarver.com/3/miscellaneous2.htm
An excerpt.
"An on-going sense of tension and apprehension. The majority of individuals reporting ďBad NervesĒ also report a near-constant sense of tension, anxiety, and apprehension. As though waiting for something bad to happen, they report a sense of anxious expectation. There is also a feeling and attitude that they are not safe or secure, both emotionally and socially. Thereís a sense of living in a combat zone where a situation that creates sheer terror can occur at any time. This apprehensive expectation is a characteristic of anxiety and becomes part of ďBad NervesĒ when it becomes a daily emotional state that is not triggered by the presence of a real threat or danger. When in a safe and protected environment, individuals with ďBad NervesĒ remain anxious and upset.
2. The presence of a difficult, traumatic, or stressful upbringing. Patients reporting ďBad NervesĒ frequently describe stressful, traumatic or difficult childhoods. They are frequently the product of very stressful family backgrounds where a positive or healthy role model was not available. Many patients with ďBad NervesĒ describe how threats, yelling, screaming, and other anxiety-producing situations were part of their daily childhood routine. From descriptions, their families had little in the way of coping or problem-solving skills. Their history may include episodes of abuse or neglect, divorce, or severe family problems. Most individuals who feel they have ďBad NervesĒ can also list members of their family who experience the same condition.

Kay Posted: 15/11/2008 12:28

Hi Patricia. Your article on Dr. Carver was good. To me from this article I think he thinks that bad nerves or depression is usually founded. In that there is always a reason. My depression stems from childhood abuse. Although I am in therapy for this its still very tough. I am having a tough time lately seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. Its like a constant merrygoround of feelings. Most of which aren't nice. I know its a long slow process to heal but at times if i had known it would be this hard i would never opened up that can of worms.
I did have one moment last week though when my sister told me she remembered something about the abuse. I thought all I needed validation from some one else that it did really happne and i am not imagining it but when I got a little validation from my sister it wasnt as sweet as i had hoped it would be. It threw me, it was like oh crap, this is real.
Any way just needed to let off some steam. Hope you all are feeling well. I check on this forum most days and sometimes there are lots of posts and others there are none.
I am so thankful for this forum, because its such a relief to be able to get stuff out of your head and tell others about it and know that they care but also know that there is no pressure.
Hi Anne, hope you are doing ok in therapy. talk soon my friends.

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 17/11/2008 11:37

Hello Kay:
It is so unfair that you have to go through this present experience, so unfair because you (and not any child) deserves to be abused. Nonetheless, it is absolutely the right thing for you to do, let no one tell you otherwise. It is like ridding your system of toxicity, of giving yourself the chance to live the life you want. Suppressing the stuff only can lead to a festering inner sore, which naturally, even though suppressed, continues to poison the system.
You will come out fine. Good for you!
All the best
P

Anne. Posted: 17/11/2008 14:05

Hi Kay and Patricia,
Kay you know I look into this site every day and I am sorry you were going through a tough time, not that I could make it all better for you but I care, you are always there for me, anyway you know I am always sending you "healing thoughts".
Patricia,
As I said before keep posting the pieces of information I find
them helpful. Thanks again.
Lola and Tom I hope you are both doing well.
Anne.

Anonymous Posted: 17/11/2008 15:42

I have a 10year old boy who seems to be suffering with anxiety. He loves playing football but lately before every match he gets so worked up that he gets diarrhoea and vomiting. It seems to start the morning of the match and continues until he gets onto the pitch. The last time I couldn't even bring him to the match as it was an away match and he wouldn't have been able to travel. Any ideas on how to help him as he doesn't want to stop playing?

Helen Posted: 17/11/2008 17:01

Hi everyone on the Forum, Tom Kay Anne Patricia and everyone else i missed, I got caught up trying to do everything again and didn't take any time out to read the posts or reply so so so glad you are all still there as I know I am really struggling with all this "anxiety and depression" again. I was on anti-ds for nearly 2 years and off them now, wow its a very different world without them. I need to talk myself into going to work every day and psyche myself up for most things. One valuable lesson i am learning is to decide NOT TO DO SOMETHING every day. Sounds easier that you think, just pick one "supposedly important" thing and just DONT DO IT. if you are like me you are wearing yourself out trying to get things done, but today i have decided UNDONE is ok. Hope that makes sense. I have just spent a month working my fingers to the bone, alot of this through sheer panic that i am not good enough. I am still going to conselling and yet it seems to be making my extended family life impossible as i am so angry at my parents (now in their 70s) that i can hardly visit anymore. Why can i not just "get over it and move on" like most people.
Sorry for ranting and not catching up on messages for months. Take care of yourselves and remember to give yourself a break once a day :)))

Kay Posted: 17/11/2008 17:20

Hi Anon. I too have a ten year old who is very like this. He gets worked up where there is anything out of his routine coming up. He has gotten a lot better in the last year or so. I have learned new skills myself in therapy and seem to be passing them on to him. I know now that my son was picking up on my anxiousness even though I thought I was hiding it well from him.
Have you checked school or even from his coach. It only takes something simple for a child to get upset and then the pattern begins.
If its only when he has football then the problem might lie there. Some remark another child said to your son or in general could have him worrying. Its tough when children suffer with anxiousness because they are the ones that are supposed to be carefree and happy. My heart goes out to him and you. let me know how it pans out please.

Kay Posted: 17/11/2008 17:28

Anne thanks for the healing. I appreciate it very much. Hope you are doing ok.
Patircia, I know its true what you said. I try to think of these feelings like a septic wound. Every time I have rotten feelings then i try and think of it as if the wound is bleeding some more and more gunk is coming out of it. In order for the wound to heal completely then all the gunk has to come out if not some might stay in there and reinfect the whole wound again.
My therapist thought me this idea and it works.
Although on my bad days when my head spins with constant chatter all these analagyies go out the window and panic comes to the fore front again.
Its a damn slow process and there are times I am sorry I started the whole thing, but all I can do now is go forward. there is no turning back. That in itself freaks me out sometimes because then I have no control over my feelings and as anyone who hsas been abused knows control is a huge issue. Thanks so much for caring. Talk soon.

Patricia (GMC11099) Posted: 17/11/2008 18:00

Great to read you all! I see a bunch of brave people.
I posted this up before, but here goes again:
www.voicelessness.com
It is a truly great insightful site (with such human essays by the site owner, Dr. Grossman).
An excerpt:
Therapy for the "voiceless" involves addressing the original wound. In the therapeutic relationship, the client learns they are indeed worth spending time with. The therapist facilitates this by encouraging the client to reveal as much as they can, by valuing the clientís voice, and finding what is special and unique in them. However, the popular notion of therapy as an intellectual process is an oversimplificationóover time a benevolent therapist must find his or her way into the clientís emotional space. Often, after some months, the client is surprised to find the therapist with him or her during the day (when therapist and client are not literally together). Some clients will hold conversations in their head with their temporarily absent therapist and receive comfort in anticipation of being heard. Only then does the client realize how alone he or she has always been, and the missing parent (and the hole in the client's life) is fully revealed. Slowly and silently, the internal wound begins to heal, and the client finds, in relationship to the therapist, a secure place in the world and a new sense of value and meaning."""
The very best to you all. You deserve it.
P

An alarming number of dysfunctional families are also characterized by the presence of physical and/or sexual abuse of children, a condition where the child's personal respect and integrity are continually compromised by the threat of impending physical or sexual violence. In later years, these individuals may find themselves emotionally unable to handle the demands of adulthood, and complain of their inability to establish and maintain emotional (and physical) boundaries in relationships.

Ironically, many of the subtle clues exhibited in childhood and adolescence that might indicate there is a codependent-in-the-making are highly valued and rewarded behaviors. Children who are extremely compliant, overly willing to please, and easily yield to the wishes of others are frequently seen as "good kids." Parents love them, teachers love them, too. Only later in life when compliance means that their own needs never get met, does one come to realize that always being a "good kid" somehow relates to the misery of codependence in adulthood. This is not to suggest that all "good kids" become codependent adults. Only those children with the underpinnings of a dysfunctional upbringing are susceptible to becoming codependent.

Many adults have been raised in homes described above, particularly alcoholic or overly rigid homes. An autocratic style of parenting was the accepted mode of child rearing in the '40s and '50s. Order was commended and quiet, compliant children were viewed as content. Unfortunately, children raised in autocratic or abusive homes may later find themselves in a particular bind as adults and parents. Not only must they struggle with the day-to-day effects of their codependence, they only know one method of parenting--the way that was demonstrated by their parents and is now at the core of their own emotional turmoil. Parenting is always quite a chore for codependent adults. They know something is dreadfully wrong and many seek help in order to develop better parenting skills.

Research indicates there is greater incidence of codependence for females than for males. One view on this phenomenon is that males have a broader range of options for expressing the effects of their dysfunction than do females. Due to differences in upbringing, boys have the "option" of expressing their pain through rage and various forms of antisocial or violent behavior. Also, while drug and alcohol abuse and dependence is catching up among females, men still hold the lead in these areas. A typical adulthood scenario illustrating the difference between a boy and a girl raised in the same dysfunctional home might be that while she is miserably unhappy in her marriage and painfully aware of her own codependence, he is an abusive alcoholic.

Tom Posted: 19/11/2008 13:51

Hi Anne/ Collettte/ Ellen /Kay/Lola/ Patricia and all my friends on this site > Tom here.

I have been extremely caught for time recently and I have not checked in for a number of days. Things not going too badly for me generally speaking. I know exactly how you feel Kay when a panic and anxiety attack hits, it just wipes out all before it. I had a bad one yesterday but am over it today.

I like your analogy about the wound. I have a similar one as you know about calling it aloud Donald Duck and telling it to go away. I think in some way by taking proactive action in our inner selves and counter attacking this demon inside us we are just not lying down and letting it ruin our lives. Hang in there Kay, one thing I have learned is that this demon just does not go away, but it can be controlled in various ways and I think this website is a very valuable tool in assisting.

The idea of not doing one thing a day that is "very important" is also extremely good I think. I was not convinced about compartmentalising the worry and anxiety at nighttime until recent times but I can see the logic now and I am trying slowly to do so at night. A short walk during the day I find also helps and assists, I often do this now taking deep breaths of air as I start my walk outside the door.

Thankyou Patricia for looking after us and putting the articles on the website. I find them very thought provoking and comforting

Anyway lets keep looking after each other in the days and months ahead particularly with this constant diet of negativity in the news. Again kindest regards to all who use the site Tom

Anne Posted: 19/11/2008 22:09

Hi Friends,

What did they do to the site when we were asleep! I am not too keen on

change, I like my comfort zone but, everyday I "put myself out a bit" by

doing something outside of that zone and today I can treat this as my daily

exercise. Tom good to see your name on the page again. Kay how are

you doing today, be good to yourself nobody is going to do it for you, have

you got that high-power suit, Chanel briefcase and the XJ6 Jaguar yet, we

we discuss my childhood, and I can't understand it because I had a good

childhood with the exception of one aspect which I won't go into on this

site, it is other things that are coming into my memory, has anybody been

through that, I do feel the better for it though and I will continue, I trust

my counsellor so that helps. Anyway, enough about me.

Take care of yourselves,

Anne.

Helen Posted: 20/11/2008 00:31

Hi everyone, sorry my last post came up anonymous instead of under my name Helen. Anyway I am glad to be on this website again and I am enjoying your company, reading the articles that can actually "scream" out to you as they hit the nail on the head is refreshing.

Tom i hope your panick attack is well behind you today and glad you agree that not doing things is a good way forward. saying that i have been working til now again but i am keeping an eye on that critic that is on my case :))

Better get some sleep, am reading an unusual book called The power of Dreams, heavy going but knocks me out after a few pages! Then the dreams i am having are much stronger and full of imagery so its a fun way of trying to unravel some of the bad feelings and fear that as you rightly said doesn't go away.

anyway night all and sweet dreams

Helen

Anne Posted: 20/11/2008 12:10

Hi Helen,

Anne here, I am not getting on too well with this new site, have a look at the size of yesterdays letter! You mentioned you were in the pits again, don't you worry Helen you have been there and you know it will change. I know you want not to take anti-d's well then have a chat with your GP, does he understand or is he one of those who just pushes pills at you ? If you are going to deal with it yourself may I suggest that you keep yourself in the present and be fully aware of each decision you make, do not act on impulse, I say that because you seem different to me I become chair bound and live in my head, I see around me lots to be done I want them all done but I can't motivate myself to leave the bed if I am really bad or chair when I am not too bad. I have experienced bouts of depression for years since I was a child and as you know I am attending a counsellor. My major problem I have finally come to terms with this year but there are other things coming up and I will deal with them one at a time.

For me Helen anti-depressants are the way, I have no question about that now, I have been very very low (understatement) and I never want to go there again, but that is me we are all different. If I remember correctly you came off anti-ds yourself and you want to stay off them well you will, and this is just one of your tests stay with it and you will get through it, just stay determined and most of all please be good to yourself because we are inclined to forget ourselves when we are dishing out good deeds. Keep writing in and let us know I am sure I speak for all your friends when I say we won't tire of reading your letters. I wish you peace of mind and an abundance of love as your duvet Anne.

cassy Posted: 20/11/2008 13:36

anti depresants are good and relaxation tenqniques are

Kay Posted: 20/11/2008 17:24

Hi Anne, Helan, Tom and Patricia. Hey Lola where are you these days? Anyway, Helen, I think it was you that wrote that you can hardly bear to look at your parents right now. i know exactly how you feel especially towards my mom. I look at her and feel resentment because she was the one who was supposed to mind me and care for me but yet she was the one who left me in the house where I was subjected to horrendous abuse. My mom is 67 and I now see she has been a very selfish mother to me. I always said growing up that i had a great childhood and my life was totally blissful. It was to an extent but my mother was also completely self absorbed. I remember her shouting at my dad(who is a quite man), and telling him she was either going to leave him or kill herself. This all happened in front of my sister and I. I remember rushing home from school hoping she hadnt killed herself. This went on for years. Its no wonder i have a major fear and phobia about the word suicide. The fear I have about suicide is huge and I wondered for years about that well now I know. My mom is essentially a good person and I have good memories but she has a lot to answer for. I am full of anger towards her right now and then I am overcome with guilt because her being like that was obviously caused by her family circumstances growing up. One good thing is that she is finally going to see a therapist next week. Because she cannt cope with what happened to me. Its horrible feeling like this towards your mother. It just seems wrong. All i seem to have these days is bad memories of her and I know they werent all bad. I know there are lots of good ones in there too. Sorry if I am sounding like i am feeling sorry for myself , just letting off steam. you are a great bunch of people and I think of all of you as a support.

Patricia Posted: 21/11/2008 11:52

Dear Kay:

Good to read you! (and to see everyone else on here). You are quite right to let off steam. We are here to listen. It is healthy to vent your feelings, get them out in the open.

Kay, you have a good perspective on the whole matter. You are able to objectively see your mother's problems, and it is a sad fact that there are many self-absorbed people like her. The fact that her own upbringing had a big, if not entire, contribution to her problem, does not make it any easier. It does sound to me (having had occasion to discover a lot on the topic due to other circumstances) that your mother had/has a personality disorder. Hence her behaviour, dictated by the disorder which shackled her. I am quite sure the therapist she will see will note this fact.

and I think, Kay, if you look at the articles in there by a doctor in psychology, you will have a lot of light-bulb moments. If nothing else, such moments are validating for you.

You are a positive person, in the sense of being able to get things into perspective. That is a huge plus. You do not engage in black and white thinking.

Take care and all the best

P.

Anonymous Posted: 21/11/2008 14:35

Kay, I just finished reading your posting and I am in tears because in therapy I am trying to deal with the ANGER I had towards my Mother and the GUILT I feel because of this anger, I don't think she wanted me and some will say I am a grown woman build a bridge, but I feel like a little child when I was being ignored or the time when I was 19 and lying in St. Catherine's in Tralee after a severe car accident and only my brother r.i.p came to visit me. The funny thing is I always asked if I was adopted when I was very small, so Kay I think I craved love and am wondering if my experience was because of my need, I am sorry Kay I am very mixed up at the moment, your letter just got me thinking further. We will be o.k. and I am delighted for YOU that your Mam is going for therapy you are almost there hang in.

Kay at this very moment I feel so so lonely and vulnerable and I thank God that I have a hubby who is coming home to me when I can get a hug, How about that for self absorbed, so sorry Kay, God Bless.

Anonymous Posted: 21/11/2008 15:08

Hello again Kay,

I am only getting used to this new site it is me Anne who wrote about my Mother.

Anne.

Patricia Posted: 21/11/2008 17:06

Hello to Kay and everyone:

This "new look" website takes a bit of getting used to. Anyhow:

This is a useful book:

Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents (Paperback)

Millions of adults grew up with immature, self-absorbed parents who made their own children responsible for their physical and emotional well-being, expected admiration and constant attention, and reacted with criticism and blame when their slightest need went unmet. In this accessible book, psychologist Nina Brown helps grown children come to terms with the results of such an upbringing, including tendencies to overcomply to others' needs, withdraw when someone needs nurturing, and lack self-esteem. Through self-exploration exercises and protective and coping strategies, Brown helps readers work toward identifying destructive patterns their parents may have had, evaluating attitudes and behaviors that may be hampering their own adult relationships, dealing with self-doubt and other negative feelings, and piecing together a more integrated sense of self. --

jen1 Posted: 22/11/2008 00:00

Hi,jen 1 here.I have just logged on the site 4 the 1st time. Hello 2 u all out there who suffer the following, depression,anxiety & panic attacks.Firstly i love the opportunity 2 meet or chat 2 others out there with similar problems.I hope the site will be of benefit to me & many 2 follow.

I suffer from the above with the past 4 yrs & i understand others, out there in the same boat inside - out.unfortunatily i still cant pinpoint or get my head around whats happening.I have run out of options,i tried counselling, anti Ds & even changing my lifestyle.Im now off the anti Ds with over 6 mths but my views are that in the long run, there not of benefit 2 me,others may feel they are.

I keep saying to myself that im strong & that i want to fight the above.Im getting a focus house soon which is great but the waiting around 4 plans to go ahead is not easy.I was in a relationship up to 4 mths ago but it was putting wicked pressure on me as the partner back then wanted sex more than i could give. I tried to explain as best i could in the nicest manner that its not me, its the ******* depression.I had enough up to that time & called off the relationship.I feared to this day, will i meet the right person who will stick by me & understand.

As i have a love for children & art, i recently about 2 mths ago became a volunteer in a youth centre which has been 1 of the best choices so far that benefits.

I have a saying which i came up with myself, " u can never b ur own advisor but can b some 1 elses "

I hope that there is others out there who can relate to my position.

take care,hope to be in touch soon

Kay Posted: 22/11/2008 14:36

Hi All. Anne, waiting for your husband to come home to get a hug is not self absorbed. Its just needing a human touch. I know this merrygoround of emotions is overwhelming at times and its so difficult to see a future without feeling like this but I am sure we are on the right road. I dont think this life was meant to be hard all the time. Yes we go through tough times but we are supposed to have fun and be happy too.

Patricia thanks for the posts and the links they are great as you say for reassurance alone. It confirms that we are not all insane and what we are going through is a very human and common emotion.

By the way guys, picking up on what was discussed weeks ago, I am volunteering in the local Hope shop starting this mon. I know I will be nervous and probably anxious before hand but I think I need the distraction. Let you all know how i get on. Thanks again for all your help and support. Especially Anne and Patricia.

Helen Posted: 24/11/2008 22:42

Patricia, i just love the title of that book you recommended "Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting Over Narcissistic Parents" i would love to put that on a tshirt and wear it to my next home visit (joking of course).

Kay yes i can't really face my parents at the moment - hope this feeling will subside but its pretty strong and new as I always thought I was the problem but I am beginning to get a new perspective on my family and why i feel so absolutely useless and hurt after spending even 5 mins with them. Have not talked to them about this as they happily ignored the fact that i was on anti-ds though i told them and that i go to counselling every week for 2 years now - its as if my life doesn't actually exist in their eyes - but what can i do? Kay i am delighted to hear your mother is going to counselling too and this is hopefully part of the solution to you feeling ok with her one day. Its not going to happen soon but the promise of some true connection is there.

Anne, you are spot on i am not the same as i was over the summer when i first found this site, i am crosser and more afraid of life but I have reconnected with my husband in such a way now that the fears and moods are worth it for the moment. He is now so supportive and helpful it quite takes my breath away - i know we had grown appart and subconsciously i think he hated me taking pills to survive life - anyway for the moment i will keep going without the pills and keep checking in here with all of you if thats ok.

Jen1, nice to meet you too and that "demand" that caused you to break up with your boyfriend is a real problem experienced by lots of women so you are not alone, I have been there and its a real downer as you can't get close without feeling under pressure. Hope you feeling ok today.

x

Helen

cassy Posted: 25/11/2008 18:10

hiya has any one tried the sleeping tablet melatonin?

Anonymous Posted: 25/11/2008 19:39

Hi Girls,

Kay how are you getting with your voluntary job, when I was working part time up to this time last year I used to love it, it gave me a fresh outlook on life and I hope it works out for you too. The counsellor is really good she challenges me (in a nice way) she is definitely moving me on or helping me to move myself on, its like light bulbs turning on in my head.

Helen I love the way you said how your husband is helpful "it quite takes my breath away" I love how you described that, I am a romantic at heart. Maybe if you have support like your husbands you may not need to think about tablets, but Helen don't be afraid of them if you ever need them, and I mean REALLY need them and I hope and pray you never will. What are your fears, you don't have to answer that if you don't wish to but, sometimes if they are irrational fears it can help, different for everybody. Anyway, take care and keep writing in.

Tom don't forget us o.k.

All the Best

Anne.

Kay Posted: 26/11/2008 19:51

Hi all. Jen1 hi and welcome to the forum. There is a massive stigma about meds and anti-depressants. I hate that because me for one although I am off meds I would have no hesitation in going back on them if really necessary. I feel like they are a temporary thing to get past the overwhelming feelings of fear and anxiety. I truely believe meds have a part in recovery but in the long run arent a solution. Just a crutch. The more people I speak to the more I realise almost half the population is on anti-depressants or have been at some stage in their lives. The irrational fear thing is normal to anybody in our situation. My therapist has thought me a great writting exercise to deal with these thought. It really works. It basically means writting down these fears or unbalanced thougts and trying to come up with evidence to support them and then evidence not to support them. Other stuff too but too long winded to go into here. The point is I am learning that these fears and thoughts are damn scary and can send me into a panic but the bottom line they are just thoughts. Unbalanced ones. Not real. Not factual. Untrue. The whole idea of the exercise is to see that its ok to have these thoughts and its good to acknowledge them but not to give to much attention. Its an excercise i find very helpful and one I try and do on a daily basis.

Jen 1, the issue of sex is one that we all know about. I have been very very reluctant in that department and I know my husband probably finds its very frustrating at times but you know thats tough because if I have sex just to please someone else its completely disrespecting myself. I have done it in the past in fact i have done it for as long as I can remember. One thing I know now is that I am worth more. I can never ever again have sex to please someone else because every time I do that I am damaging myself and my spirit and my soul. Keep writting you guys. these days I seem to be writting essays not little notes. Thanks all.

A28dam Posted: 30/11/2008 21:26

well am really happy to find this web over here. i was taking anti depressants 8 month ago for like 2 years. i was suffering from Anxiety plus depression. for the last 8 month i had to stop cause i was woking as a cabin crew. these days am having few anxiety attacks!!! am not sure if i need to go on the pills or its just a bad week, but i cant help it now that its making my mind busy thinking what is the right thing to do!!! should i go back to it? or should i hold on and be more strong and everything will be okay! the thing is i am applying for a new airline now and everything is going okay, but very soon they will ask for a blood test and i am scared that if i took the pills they would find out and i will not get the job, some how am really lost !!!

best

Adam

folly Posted: 01/12/2008 02:37

hello, its now 2.24am. unable to sleep, stumbled on your page. u are so kind, helpful and supportive to each other.

i feel ashamed to say that at the end of 30+ years, i am more or less back to square one - anxiety, panic, roller coaster - off meds, on meds - struggle to come off them, perhaps reduce to 1/2 tab daily, then back on them again. counselling - another nightmare. [another story]

life has not been all bad, some moments of great joy and utter fulfillment. so many .......of utter despair, desolation, panic and always that anxiety - what a waste of life!!! of existence!!!

Anonymous Posted: 01/12/2008 14:59

Dear Folly,

Welcome to the site and you are correct I always find somebody on this forum will come to my aid when I need it.

Folly is it any help to tell you that I have been where you are now more times than I have had dinners as the saying goes. I don't agree that you are "back to square one" we all have "blips" in life and this is one of yours. When this happens to me I panic so I become my own GP, Pharmacist, Counsellor etc. I usually end up just as confused and panicked as you are now. So you are no different to any one of us believe that o.k. As for your meds. I have been like a yoyo for many years but I discovered eventually that I need my steady course of meds. but that is me not you, and only a Doctor can tell you what your needs are. I do know that the yoyo idea with meds is the worst thing you can do because you will never know the answer if you do not give medication a chance and I am talking months you will never know what will work for you. Another thing regarding medication that comes to mind I was told, never to be ashamed of how you feel and what medication you take to help you, half the world thinks they are normal, they are the ones I worry about!

If you get on well with your GP go back to him and take his advice, there are many types of antidepressants so I know I had to try out many before I found the one that suited me, so have a chat with him and take his advice.

I am with a Therapist/Counsellor now and I must say from the moment I met her we jelled that is very important, try and try until you meet the one that suits you. A good therapist is a person who you are at ease with and that you have complete confidence in to talk your mind, remember everything is in strict confidence, if you have not got that trust and confidence change to another and tell the counsellor why you are changing they will understand.

Folly when you relax and not panicked you will be able to make informed decisions, I know, so do not worry life can be good again if you let it.

Take care and I hope all goes well for you with GP and Counsellor but I do feel that is the way to go we all need help particularly the "Normal" ones Ha!

Anne.

Anonymous Posted: 01/12/2008 15:38

Dear Adam,

As I said to Folly you are welcome to the site I have always found help on this forum when I need it they are a great bunch and better still I always get the impression they understand how I feel when others don't.

You are doing something that I do a lot and that is Panic, you say it may be just a bad week, well that sounds o.k. we all get down times and the fact that you are going in to a job that you really want you are afraid you may need medication, it is only a fear and if you are fearful of anything it will only make things worse so my suggestion is for you to relax, trust in yourself you will be o.k. Have faith.

All the very best to you and let us know how you are getting along.

Anne.

folly Posted: 02/12/2008 12:38

hello anne,

thank you so much for your kind and very informative comments. now is not a good time for me, but i will take all on board and .......

warmest regards

folly

Kay Posted: 02/12/2008 20:33

Hi Guys. Where are our regulars? Nice to see new people on forum. Adam, My head is not in a good place at the moment so I sympathise. I think you are great actually managing to work anyway. I havent been able to work for 8 years due to anxiety and panic. Even after all these years of panic attacks and anxiety it still really throws me when it happens. Adam, do you know of any reason that caused your panic and anxiety? You dont have to say what it is. Meds played a huge part in my recovery. I think meds get you through the emergency stage so that you can see through the fog. It seems to be pretty foggy where i am now so much so that going back on meds is an idea I keep toying with. I am also in therapy and like Anne I am lucky I found a therapist I trust and like. I hate the thoughts of christmas and I hate the thought of not seeing my therapist for three weeks. I am so grateful for my husband and my two kids who I can honestly say give me a reason to want to get better and gvie me a reason to keep going. I hate this panic and anxiety, I hate it so much and if i had a choice I would rather have a physical illness than this.

Anne, I hope things are ok with you. I will be on this forum quite a bit during christmas. Lets all keep the communication lines open and lets all help each other along. talk soon.

Anonymous Posted: 03/12/2008 12:03

Hi Kay,

I read your letter to Adam and I was wondering why you hadn't been on the "page" for a while, I was worried about you.

You know I hold you in high esteem because your letters make sense and I read great strength in them so please use the strength you give others for yourself this time. Before I continue I give you full permission to tell me to mind my own business etc. and I won't mind o.k.

First of all if you had a choice what would you change about your Christmas period (you don't have to tell me, just think about it if you wish). Christmas happens every year and I ask you has it always been this way for you?, if the answer is no, pin point it and tell your counsellor, but you know that don't you. If it is your family make a stand and don't have them visit or don't go to them. I know I am sounding as though "its all very fine for you, its not that easy" wrong I did exactly what I am telling you to do. We women, Mothers, Wives and Daughters want to please we feel it is our job in life, we suffer terrible guilt if we don't, But that is wrong we are human beings who deserves everything that everybody else is entitled to, so please treat yourself with kindness and loving care, because you deserve it Kay. God Bless you, and as I said if I am on the wrong track please let me know I won't be offended.

Anne

Tom Posted: 03/12/2008 16:49

Hi all; it has been a while since I accessed the site

Kay I am sorry to hear that you are not in the best space at the moment. It is a year ago since I first came upon this site and you were one of the first people that gave me advice. I think we all know the destruction that anxiety etc can bring, I think however it is the people who do not face up to the anxiety that have the hardest time of all. From your posts I can clearly see that you are fighting with this tiger and I would suggest that you keep fighting and not this demon win. I count you as one of my best friends as regards this condition and I am sure there are quite a number of people who you have also helped that count themselves privileged to be your friend.

I hope all my other friends on this support line are keeping well.

Kindest regards

Tom

jen1 Posted: 04/12/2008 00:08

Hi, jen1 here.

Thank u kay and helen for ur advice on writing ur feelings down & not leaving any man win me over when it comes to my struggle with sex. Excuse me if im leaving out any1 who sent me advice.I have used the writing method in the past and it can benefit but it is best to write positive not only negative.

No sign of my keys for my new home as i was to get them on monday. It's frustrating & for the first time in about 15 years, i lost the rag last nite. As soon as I did, I broke down & cried a bucket of tears.Thankfully my ex was here to comfort me. We get on great in general & have a great laugh but we are not cut out to be a couple. In what u said in relation to pleasing ur partner when it comes to sex,I was in the same boat. As my interest in sex had been affected by depression, I sometimes was trying my very best to please my partner even though the interest had worn away.

I still feel I need to make more friends and possibly take on more days when volunteering.In the last week I have been suffering big time with the depression, panic attacks and anxiety. If any1 out there suffers panic attacks, I use rescue remedy which can relieve it. The 1 thing that starts my depression off is when im free of company for days.

When i have company, Im less aware that I suffer.There is times when I cant understand why im down coz i cant pinpoint a reason.I try my best to take on an interest such as art, internet, jewellerymaking etc as they can take ur mind off of things. stick to things u enjoy. Take care

Kay Posted: 04/12/2008 18:22

Hi Anne. Christmas scares me because everything shuts down and I know its sounds strange for a 40 year old woman to say that but I think I feel isolated at christmas. Even though I have my hubby and children its a scary time for me also because I know my therapist take 3 weeks off( she deserves it). I was like this last year also and I ended up having a great christmas. I have loved christmas for 38 years of my life absolutely loved it. Its just since entering therapy and finding out stuff i had buried and forgotten about that christmas has been an issue for me. Also I am avoiding my mother because she is just so manipulating. I usually see my mom a couple of times a week but its got to the point that I have to avoid her for now for my own sanity but with that is the hefty price of guilt. I have been responsible for my mom all my life even though she lives with my dad its still falls back to me to care for her and drive her places and keep her entertained. I cannt do that anymore not if I am to respect myself but its like giving up a drug thats no good for you but its still a habit. So thats another reason why christmas scares me because my realationship with my mom is struggling.

Tom, thanks for your kind words. You guys are great. I thank you all so very much for the help you have given to me and I hope we can continue to help each other.

Jen1, I too have been having whopping panic attacks and anxiety for the past week. The worst thing about it is that there is a constant chatter in my head with thoughts flitting from one thing to another not really making any sense. When this happens things i have learned to do to cope with this go out the window.

Anne, I dont mind telling anybody about perasonal stuff because its better to get stuff out of my head than fester inside. Thanks anne , talk soon.

A28dam Posted: 04/12/2008 18:59

hey guys,

First i want to thank Anne and Kay for there nice letter, i dont know but i feel that am making a family over here and thats a very nice feeling. kay if there is something i hate the most right now is the x-mas cause i had my first anxiety around christmas time 3 years ago. but u know what am not going to let it get to me this year. am going to fight it till i can enjoy that time of the year like the others. i agree with you that the Med.. is a good thing , but did u thought for one secound if ur doctor say take this pills it will help u alot, after few weeks u will feel better, and if ur doctor told u after few month that what u have been taken is only vitamen or something ..... am sure ur mood will drop down !!! thats why i think i can make it alone and i want to try every thing before i go to the med... am not saying that the MED.. is not good but some times we need to fly with out it ... iam working right now as a cabin crew and am going to change my company so its a very big step for me because am not only going to change the company i also have to move to dubai and thats a huge step . but i will take ur advice Anne i will relax and i will belive more in my self, as long as i made it till here then i have to go on .....

xxxxxxxx

adam

Anonymous Posted: 05/12/2008 12:41

HI KAY, You are not on your own being scared about Christmas, it comes every year the tension builds up the worry sets in and we are mental wrecks, and do you realise that only women catch this Christmas bug. Take Christmas and make it a gift for yourself! whatever it takes, try making the excuse for not visiting - you have the flu, or you have a TUMMY Bug that will keep them away. Kay drop that guilt pet, it is not yours throw it away, it will not do you one bit of good I was told that and it makes sense. Also Kay you are not your Mothers Keeper get that into your head, if you "step back" and dont jump into the role of doing your Sister is going to have no excuse but to take your place for a while.

Kay tough words coming up! who made you responsible for your Mother? you, you are so like my Sister she is a star from heaven and so are you but like her you have to NOT be the first to jump in to do things, CLAIM YOUR LIFE BACK! I mean that as your friend. You said your Mother is manipulating, now Kay is that what you expect of a Mother and I say that because you are feeling guilty but she is the one who should be feeling the guilt. Kay I am not perfect and sometimes I can be manipulative but I know I am doing wrong and the guilt sets in and I apologise usually to my husband. Can't you see how easy it is for all around you to let you continue to care for them, God knows I love being cared for, but Kay you need some of your own type of caring now.

I wish to God you knew your worth, you don't, if you could see me now I am wishing I could just get you over this Christmas and make you believe in yourself. Kay I have a mobile number spare and I will give it to you, I will leave it turned on and when you want to talk you ring it, withhold your number so it will be only for you I would be there for you to listen and nothing else, if it helps I will be delighted and if you don't want thats o.k. too. The mobile belonged to my brother and I kept it and I know he would want it to help someone to make up for past misdeeds.

Otherwise, Kay I will be on this laptop everyday, although I am not sure about Irish Health. Thats another idea I can give you an email address if that helps. You won't be alone with your fears and anxieties we all on this site will be in the same situation you know that and like every year we come out the other side having survived yet again, o.k.

I am going to tell you a little more about myself. To anybody who knows me I am a laugh a minute and I am very confident I can sell snow to eskimos, I was working part time up to this time last year when I could't keep going with the "Mask", I had been doing that for many years. I would be whatever you wanted me to be but never myself, I felt I had to prove myself, all my life. I told lies because I felt it presented me in a better light, and I am ashamed to admit it but on this site I have used different names and pretended I was different people, I am so ashamed because I don't like lying it was like running away from myself, not making sense am I. Anyway my therapist has convinced me that I am a good very nice person and I have decided to get to know myself Ha! If you met me I think you would find me to be a very loyal friend who cares about people, I have a sensitive nature but, I will stand up for what I believe in.

So I am now feeling as though I am totally transparent and it feels odd.

I am having a very quiet Christmas with my Hubby and Daughter. this is the first year I do not have my Mother in Law to worry about, she passed away in March and my Brother passed away in July, my sister has her lot coming home from US and England and will see them probably Christmas Eve for a couple of hours. so Kay if you want a Christmas ear I'm here o.k.

God Bless

Anne (if I ever talk to you I will give you my real name)

Anonymous Posted: 05/12/2008 12:50

Hi Adam (our Son)

I think this new job will be good for you and when you are in it these unpleasant feelings will pass that is all they are, feelings they can't hurt you.

My daughter has friends she visits regularly in Dubai, she adores it and you will have a wonderful life there, an opportunity not to be missed, so you see Adam you life is on the up and up as the saying goes.

Keep happy thoughts in your mind, stay away from meds. and go for that interview do not mention about having been on an anti-d's, its your business. Good Luck Anne

A28dam Posted: 05/12/2008 18:51

Dear Anne,

you have no idea what u did to me when u called me ur son... it felt sooo great.

thank you very much for your support, and i really hope that i can do the same to you. i know i might be much younger, but i have a lot of experiense in my life and thats what makes me who i am today.

i belive one day we will all look back to where we were and laugh. am sure we are much stronger today than yesterday.

i dont want to complain and say Why me !! why i have to feel like that!!?? cause i know every thing happen for a reson, and i might not find out the reson now but am sure one day i will.

but at the same time, i dont want to be blind and i dont want to let any moment pass without joy. i will live one time so i better make it a good one. please do the same.

Kay Posted: 07/12/2008 18:30

Hi all. I was just looking over the posts for the past year and I have just decided that I have come long way. This time last year I was in therapy on meds(lots of them). I am still in therapy but completely off meds now so even though I am in a lot of emotional pain at times I am doing it completely free of meds. I am feeling the feelings raw. I have also noticed a lot of people have come and gone on this forum. some people only write once and then dissappear. Part of me wonders if they are ok or still suffering.

Adam, god i think you are brilliant. You are going to Dubaii???? I think you are doing an amazing thing. Not a lot of people can say they have done what you are doing. Will you keep in touch with us and let us know how you are getting on please.

My kids keep asking me to put up the christmas decorations and I keep avoiding it. Its like if I do something will happen and I will crumble to pieces. I know that makes no sense whatsoever.

talk soon.

Anonymous Posted: 08/12/2008 14:58

Hi A28dam,

How are you "Son" as far as I am concerned you are our Son on this site so feel free to call me Mother Ha!

You do appear to be very mature but no matter how mature we are, we still need friends and help on occasions, I know I do, and I am in my late 50's going on 22! and I mean that.

How are you feeling about your future now, I do hope you are feeling a little more positive, keep writing in if it helps because I always check in everyday.

When do you make your decision about your job or, are you waiting for them to contact you. One way or another keep positive and try to Stop negative thoughts creeping in o.k.

All the best

Anne ( Mother!)

A28dam Posted: 08/12/2008 16:36

Dear Anne ( mother ) :

I was waiting for ur reply, and i was looking today and i was so happy when i see that you wrote me back. these days i feel very good... and thats because of ur support and my best friends.

well am waiting for there answers now i went to the open day and everything was fine and now they are doing the securty clearnes.. hopfully by Jan i will be flying away...

I really want to make a change in my life, and this is the time that i can do it, i will do what ever it take to reach for what i want , i wont give up no matter what..

Now i want to hear from you how are u doing ? enough about me ;) i want to know how ur handling everthing ??

Kisses

your son

Adam

A28dam Posted: 08/12/2008 16:48

Dear Kay,

Thank you for ur msg and yes i will be going there very soon i hope, and sure i will keep contact here. i feel i made a family already here, and even when i will be better i will keep writting .

Kay, i want to say i think u have to face ur fear, by not doing that u will make it bigger and bigger every day. think of them, how happy u can make them , and belive me if u made it this time you will be much much stronger than before ... keep the bad thoughts away, what ever u will feeel is just not real..

pleae let me hear from u what u decide to do .

Am here for you to support you as much as i can.

Adam

Anonymous Posted: 08/12/2008 23:49

Hi Jen1 and A28dam, Are you Related ?

Anne

Anonymous Posted: 08/12/2008 23:58

Hi Kay, Tom and all,

Hope all is o.k. with you both.

Anne

Helen Posted: 09/12/2008 21:48

Hi Kay, Anne, Adam and everyone else on this forum. I have been following your posts but not replying as something always gets in the way. i have a huge anxiety regarding christmas as well so this year i am changing the way i ususally behave ( serious people pleaser here :)) and trying to actually enjoy myself and yes i won't see my therapist for a while either but i will cope. like you Kay I have come off meds (off them since september) and i definitely am less sure of myself in the work place, but I have got a little better now but often wonder if i need the stress of work at all but i hate being at home even more, so i can't win but will look into a new job next year.

Anne you asked me ages back what my fears were and that threw me as i couldn't answer you. still unsure but its a feeling that i am absolutely useless at things and will get found out or feel i never do anything well enough for others so i am just plodding along and feel like a loser even if i am probably doing well. This is not really a fear is it ? just a feeling but it gets me down as it seems to use up alot of my energy. Anyway, i am working out there are some people out there i should just avoid for a while and most of my family are unfortunately in that category. The feelings are too raw and even simple conversations are unbearable for me as i want to scream instead of talking about banal things but know its not the right thing to do.

Kay you must listen to Annes advice about your mother, its your turn now and you can take a new path and a new approach to your relationship with her. I don't think i will ever tell my mum how i feel and when she is gone i will go to her grave and explain it all, the terrible sadness i feel and then it will be over. I was not abused as a child so i really don't know where these feelings come from, i was just ignored i suppose and i am 40 years old now and should have my own life but i feel i am only starting to live now, but at least its a start.

I just hope you all get some peace at christmas. i am even going to read some bible stories (kids versions as not that up to speed on religion) and get some solace there and remind myself what christmas is really all about. I am not spending christmas here with my family thankfully so maybe that is easing my pain. I know the thought of it is very daunting for some of us so you are not alone. Sorry to sound so down, its hard to be upbeat but i feel better now alot better than this time last year so there is an improvement.

Anne i am also delighted you are now becoming more transparent, so what if you have different names, we all have different personas we present to the world and behave so differently with different people, its great to be able now to put all those aspects of yourself into one wonderful person at last.

I think you are all wonderful on this forum and hope we will all get through this festive season intact. I will log on and read posts every day til christmas even if i don't rely straight away i am thinking of you all.

Helen

Anonymous Posted: 10/12/2008 13:10

Dear Helen,

I for one am delighted to hear from you, your letter appeared on the page just at the right time for me so thank you.

Christmas is not a good time for most women and some men because it is a busy time but, more important it brings out every negative feeling in us, fear sadness, anger, stress and sometimes people say more than is welcome, relatives in particular have a way of doing that. Like you, my counsellor will be missing for three weeks but we will manage, you know that.

Helen Love, reading your paragraph on thinking you are useless. I have come to believe that only the caring sensitive people only suffer with our problems and you know they are very precious gifts so please remember that, Sensitive people often set their "jumps" too high for them to get over but we don't expect anybody else to jump half as high. You said you feel like a loser you were never more wrong, the term low self esteem comes to mind. I find that people are often to busy thinking about their own problems to stop and say "Thank you" job well done, maybe that is all we need.

You mentioned that you felt ignored as a child and my counsellor said this week that the one string that goes right through our sessions was being lonely and ignored, my Mam was 42 when I was born and the nearest to me was seven years older. I remember I started school when I was 6 and shortly after my Mam and Sisters were sitting around the fire and they were deep in conversation, I was left out of the conversation so what did I do, to get their attention I pretended to speak in Irish and they all stopped and looked at me and I said thats what I learned today! it was a load of rubbish but I got their attention. I find it very difficult to be honest about myself because I feel I will not be accepted and that is not an excuse that is fact my counsellor/therapist told me that my personality type is a chameleon (I will change my "colour" to fit in to my surroundings, when I was me I was abused by two different relatives but I am not going in to that that is between me and my counsellor, but I will say when that happened ( I was just a little child and I was ME) I didn't tell anybody about it until about ten years ago before my Mam died, she was 83 and I shouldn't have, but I don't think she understood thank God.

When I discovered Irish Health it was an outlet for me as I very rarely leave the house only for Holidays and on other occasions only when I have to, I don't have a problem with actually going out I just cut myself off, friend wise I have my Sister. Helen this sounds as though I am looking for pity, please don't look on my letter that way, I am explaining how it is for me and I am not complaining although my therapist said it was not healthy.

I could go on but thats enough for today, thank you Helen for your understanding letter you made me feel a lot better. Helen don't apologise for as you said "sounding down" you don't sound down you sound very very strong just like Kay you are both strong women.

Thanks for being you the kind and caring person that you are.

Anne

A28dam Posted: 10/12/2008 18:30

hey every one, for the last few days i was here watching what every one is sending, i was just looking i wanted to take every one point of view.

i just want to say one thing ... why do we get scared of Christmas? is it because we might be a bet happy and something in our mind is telling us (( ooh no u cant be happy !!! because after good time u might spend u will have a very bad time )) or is it because we see people are happy and laughing and we think we are the only one who is suffring and these people dont feel us, and we feel disconected??? what is it about christmas ??????

I see alot of fear, Fear that we creat by our self in our mind. Fear that trying to stop us from doing the thing that we want to do in our life, Fear that make us think that we are weak and useless, fear that make a barrier between us and the future. I do belive in this the thing that doesn't kill you make you stronger.

All of us over here has a family and freinds , people out there thats they love us and respect us, and they want the best for us. these people are a reson for us to live.. but insted of letting these people in our life we are pulling away.

Thats what we need to learn now how to get these people back in to our life , and how to get our life back...

with love Adam

Kay Posted: 10/12/2008 21:44

Hello all. Adam, your are right its negative thinking and fear thats driving me to feel like this. I think you are doing the right thing carrying on and getting on with life. I have been trying to do the same and when I give up on something then I am mad with myself for giving into it. You push yourself and have drive and ambition. Take life by the hand and soak up every experience possible. I know you will and can do it I can see your enthusiasm from your posts.

Anne, I am so grateful for you and Helen. I am always moved by your posts. Anne, I had a flashback of abuse to me that took place in my grannys house at christmas. I was only 5 or 6. Christmas has been scaring me so much and I know that fear is usually driven by a hidden memory. So I brought myself back there and saw it happening all over again. It ripped my heart out because it took place at such a special time of year. These days my moods are swinging from rage to such sadness. I have put the decorations up for the kids and am trying hard to put the bad stuff to one side at least until after christmas.

Helen, if a child feels unloved or ignored then that is abuse. A child should grow up feeling happy and secure. You are right about my mom, I know I have to stop taking responsibllity for her. I rang her the other day and told her I woulnt be talking to her for a while, that I needed my space. I told her I didtnt need to be worrying about her killing herself( shes treatened to do so on many an occasion, I have been watching her since I was 7 or 8 to make sure she doesnt do it). I told her I needed to get me well for my babies and that was it. She said she would never dream of killing herself that she wouldnt do that to her family. I remember the night before I got married she stood outside my bedroom door wailing and crying because she didnt think "she could make it to tomorrow". This was after years of this crap , she couldnt even stop to think of me the night before one of the most important and special days of my life.

I am not bitter at all am I?

I think I have let off some steam there. Thanks guys for the ear. Are all of you guys going to be checking on the forum over christmas? Hope so.

Anonymous Posted: 10/12/2008 23:50

Hi Adam,

I am going to assume that you are Adam although I would prefer if you confirmed which story is the true you. The reason I am asking you this is because I was advised by my counsellor to not hide behind anything or anyone and let people see the real me, so I pass on that advice to you for what it is worth.

Yes Christmas is a time when it seems all the negative areas of our lives come to the fore and also when we are that bit older than say the thirties we usually have people who were dear to us have died. I assume you are in your twenties, (correct me if I am wrong) when I was that age Christmas was a great time I would never have thought I would feel anything other than pure pleasure for this time of year, but we never know what lies ahead.

What are you looking forward to this season and how are you feeling I hope you are doing o.k.

Tell me your story and we/I will listen.

Anne.

Anonymous Posted: 12/12/2008 08:52

Hi Kay and friends,

I wrote you a letter in to the forum yesterday and it was rejected Ha! let me tell you why. I was suggesting how you could deal with all the people who annoy you and make demands on your time i.e. shoot them, the Editor didn't see my sense of humour Ha! and when I re-read it I must say my message was "lost in translation".

I don't know exactly but there is something a little extra sad and "heavy" about this Christmas but, you know what, we are all going to get through it as we always do, particularly you Kay, you are stronger than you think, but use that strength for yourself let that be your Christmas gift to yourself. I always find Christmas a highly emotional time as you do, but we can't cancel it, we can change our attitude toward it for instance break the usual pattern of the days (Christmas Day, or Eve etc) do something completely the opposite to what you would normally do and that will break the thought process, try it, for what it is worth, and stay away from the people who "wreck your head".

Right! no more telling you what to do, and just one more thing before I sign off, again, I am so sorry for the deceit, that is not the real me and I am dealing with my problems, so I hope you will see me as a friend once again.

God Bless,

Anne.

Helen Posted: 12/12/2008 09:37

Hi everyone,

Anne, Kay, thanks for your kind words, they mean a lot to me.

I think its understandable to fear Christmas as for most of us its judgment day, do you have enough money, friends, rooms in the house etc, that’s why I try to go away at this time of year.

Like you Anne, going away is very similar to staying in all the time, you manage to avoid certain constraints. I would love to stay in more (but keep a part time job) and can understand why you would do it. Its easier than going out and what’s wrong with easy when things have been hard for so long. Its also a good sign that you enjoy your own company when I was very depressed I just kept out all day I would go anywhere rather than face the void.

Anne, as you pointed out I must be setting my “jumps" way too high which creates this permanent sense of low self esteem so here goes to lowering the bars one notch at a time starting with Christmas J .

Kay, I feel so sad when I hear about your childhood flashbacks, they must be unbearable, it is so upsetting for you and I am not surprised your emotions are taking over at the moment. I don’t want to pretend to understand as I don’t and don’t want to minimize what you are going through. I am glad at the same time to hear that you are taking the first steps to create a new relationship with your mum. Let yourself give up on things now and then (especially Christmas related stuff) and stop being mad with yourself, there is no correct way to live, decorate, celebrate etc and if you don’t do it someone else might J

I am not putting up a big tree this year as I put all the tree baubles out on the mantelpiece to sort out 2 days ago and then really liked the look of them just like that all in a long line so I now have my own treeless invention, then bought the kids a colorful musical gingerbread house snow globe for their room to make up for no tree and everyone’s happy (except for the constant chime of deck the halls in the morning and at night!).

I am delighted to have logged back onto this site and find you all here, as I said I will read the posts daily and am sure we can all help each other more than we know.

Adam, I know you are right when you say that we all have family and friends that love us and I am happy that you want to get these people back in your life whereas I am pulling away right now but when the time is right I will follow in your footsteps, promise.

Good night all.

Helen

Kay Posted: 14/12/2008 21:31

Hi Anne,Helen, Adam,Tom and anyone else I have forgotten to mention. Anne, I think of you as a friend. I look forward to logging on to this forum and getting your posts. Reading posts on this forum make me realise that I am not alone. You know if the truth be known we dont know what goes on behind closed doors. What I mean is people have all kinds of issues and anxiety related problems. People we meet in the school car park or in the shop or elsewhere and we presume they have a carefree life and wish we could be them( well I do that anyway). I am begining to discover that thats not always the case. Very few people live a truely free worry stress free life. We all have our baggage whether it be from the present or past. We chose to deal with it or not. Dealing with can be very hard. At times overbearing. But I am learning so much from this. I know how incredibly strong i am. I was always told I was a little bit ditsy and I have to admit I sometimes played up on that because that was what people expected of me. I have realised that I am intelligent, bright and have so much to say thats true and real. Am I making sense?

Helen, enjoy your christmas away. check in with us now and again.

Anne talk to you soon. Dont worry about pretending to be someone else in the past we have all done that in certain ways , I know I have anyway. But I feel that therapy for me is making me realise the person I am is actually likeable and its ok good even to be me. talk soon my friend.

Lou Posted: 15/12/2008 10:00

Hi All

I think (for what its worth) that there are probably 2 (maybe 3) big reasons why Christmas is a bad time. First, Christmas is (generally) a time when a lot of people ARE happy - the stress of the runup to the festive season is over and people are at home with their families etc so the fact that others are (so it woudl seem) happier than usual, it makes us feel worse than at other times of the year. I suffer with depression (or should I say I am overcoming depression) and it is a bad time for me too. You know, I cant actually remember the second reason I was going to suggest, had a really bad night!

Anonymous Posted: 16/12/2008 01:38

Hi Folks,

I think I have discovered what it is about Christmas that gets to me!

People! Big people, small people even medium people, but the ones that annoy me most are the ones I have to buy presents for, cook for and most of all, put up with when I don't want to.

Who would we invite to our homes if we had a choice and I mean only the people you really want, anybody in the world etc. I leave you to think on that one.

I haven't put up decorations yet, so I was thinking of leaving them in a box at the front door and as our visitors enter they can each take one and hang it wherever they want, and that will take care of decorations and christmas tree, what do you think.

Christmas dinner next. I am going to invite all the relatives around and suggest they each bring a favourite dish and I will cook the Turkey, that takes care of Christmas Dinner. I hate cooking!

And if they stay too long I will set the house alarm off, that should get them moving, what do you think.

As the saying goes "You Gotta Laugh"

Anne

Patricia Posted: 16/12/2008 10:41

Hello to everyone:

Been away on business for several weeks, and will find time over the next days to read all your posts!

Just want to say that yes, Christmas can be a sad time, when we miss absent friends and relatives. I do not like the "commercial" aspect of Christmas and I have never subscribed to that. There is no need to, if you stop and think about it. I am not a religious person, but I think that after all Christmas is the celebration of the birthday a long time ago of a very good and charitable man.

The shops will not be getting a lot of my money, that's for sure!!

Don't let what you perceive as others expectations get to you. This is not some kind of competition. You are all great people.

I find myself that lighting a nice big candle, or more than one, then sitting quietly in a darkened room for a little while, just letting the tension drift away, is so hugely helpful.

I do very sincerely hope you have a lovely Christmas, and that the New Year brings us all those things we most dearly wish for.

Best to everyone

P.

Anonymous Posted: 19/12/2008 12:24

KAY, HELEN, TOM, LOLA,

IT's December 19th. I hope you haven't jumped off the top of the Christmas Tree, if you haven't please drop me a line and let me know how you are getting on. I have the christmas tree up, no decorations yet, I haven't got the energy Hubby and I both got this virus it has left us three weeks later as though we have ME I am so tired all the time. Write in I miss you all.

Hi Patricia welcome back, at this stage I think I have moaned enough about Christmas so I am doing my best to find the happy bits as in Happy Christmas. We have had two deaths in the family this year and Christmas is an emotional time to say the least, but we could be a lot worse. Its cold outside, we have homes, enough food, a little drop of something to warm whatever (any excuse) and hopefully people who love you, Happy Christmas Patricia.

Anne.

Lou Posted: 19/12/2008 16:29

"could be a lot worse. Its cold outside, we have homes, enough food, a little drop of something to warm whatever (any excuse) and hopefully people who love you" - What a lovely message of goodwill. It is nice to see that some people have not been caught up in the mania that generally comes this time of year! My partner and I are not buying each other presents this year. Instead, we went to the pound last night and rehomed a dog that was due to be put down this morning...as a gift to each other. He has the biggest heart, and is definitely worth more than any designer or high tech gadget :) regards all

Patricia Posted: 19/12/2008 17:38

Hello again to you all. It is always so good and heartening to read your posts. You've got some good ideas for Christmas, Anonymous!!!

Well, if I had to invite one person, I would love to invite the man whose birthday we will be celebrating. I am not a religious sort of woman, but I do have admiration for him, and the things he did and tried to do to improve people's lot all those 2000 years ago. I bet he would be quite an entertaining guest too, as I don't think he was a "holy-moly", and nothing like those pictures that we see of him.

Mind you I would also like to invite Elvis. Heh heh.

I'll be cooking a goose this year, but it will probably only be hubby and I on Christmas Day, though people will turn up on Stephen's Day....

I wish for you all a peaceful, and even joyous Christmas, and everything you could wish for in the new year. Health, peace, and prosperity.

Take care all

Patricia

Tom Posted: 19/12/2008 18:44

Happy Christmas to all, I hope it is a good one. Kind regards Tom

Anonymous Posted: 19/12/2008 19:31

Hi Lou,

Your heart is in the right place and I hope you get everything your wish for

Merry Christmas to you and your partner.

Anne

Halo Dublin Posted: 19/12/2008 23:31

Hi everyone, have just been reading your comments, as I have also suffered from anxiety and depression and was hospitalised in 1993. Now I still get ups and downs but when I am down, I stop doing anything that has to be done in the house and go and spoil myself. Well you need to now and again. I had panic attacks but not anymore, I hope this is of some help to some on this forum. First of all I realised that panic is fear, I am in my fifties now and what more can anyone do to you when you have already battled with these problems. Just remember when you are self concious or nervious in company, other people are human just like you. If someone had a panic attack in front of you, what would you think?. You would say to yourself I know how they feel, I understand and when you see them again you would be supportive to them. Because the reason you get anxiety and depression is because you are a caring sentitive person. You will also come accross people who don't understand and can be nasty to you, these are people who life hasn't touched yet, so you just have to ignore them.

I don't like christmas either, but it is getting easier, the most important thing at this time, is to share your time with others, I know that can be difficult for some but thats the way I cope, by watching other people being happy makes me happy, especially if I have made a small effect in making them happy. I hope this info is of help to someone, but lets all get over christmas as I remember it use to make me panic just thinking of it, after all it is just another day and if you forget something its not the end of the world, you have the rest of the year to laugh about it.

Anonymous Posted: 22/12/2008 15:22

Dear Halo Dublin,

Your letter tells us all that no matter how bad it gets (you had your bad times) we always survive and hopefully are the better for it, I compliment you.

I am not at my best just now feeling a little melancholy but your letter has given me a lift so thank you and I hope you will keep writing in.

Kind Regards,

Anne.

Kay Posted: 22/12/2008 17:56

Hello to all my pals. I too am panicking about christmas. For a load of reasons none of which make much sense. I am glad I read all your posts though because I am comforted greatly by them. Anne, I will be checking in over christmas on this forum will you log on and let me know how you are too? Tom, good to hear from you. Hope you are doing well.

Patricia and Lou thanks for the posts they are definately uplifting and encouraging. I worry that I will crack up over christmas and lose the plot!! But its true to say that after 25 years of panic attacks that I have definately had my worst one. Panic attacks still throw me though. My therapist always says to me Kay, you have had panic attacks for so long and you have never "cracked up". These are just fear based feelings. They serve no purpose. They are a waste of energy and time. I know all this is true but needless to say at times they do still bother me greatly. Lou , how did your panic attacks stop? Did you discover why you had them in the first place?

i am starting to get my panic attacks back again. i feel like my body wants to collaspe. this morning i woke up feeling really miserable, like i was having an attack. i told my husband and he said u r like this beacuse u r worried about your tests results. no it wasnt that. im feeling like this for ages. i said it to my gp today. he is going to see me after xmas about this. im on depression meds and he said i might have to be increased by one more as these do help.

Anonymous Posted: 23/12/2008 14:12

Hi Everybody,

Well, I'm still here despite how I felt yesterday, I feel like a rabbit caught in the headlights of a car I am so worried if anybody visits, doesn't that sound completely stupid but that how I am. On St. Stephen's Day I will have my sister and her son and Daughters with their partners plus the odd stray to visit and I am feeling physically sick at the thought of it, but I know that I will have a big (enormous) smile on my whole body as though I am fine and inside I will feel as I feel now, scared and lonely, and I don't know why!

On Christmas Eve and Day my Daughter and Hubby spend it together, it will be the first in 35 years that we can have a proper family dinner of our own so we are all looking forward to it.

Patricia I do like your choice of guest to your dinner table, if I had him to mine I would kill him all over again with my cooking! But I know he will come anyway I found the empty lunchbox last year Ha!

Kay I am hoping that all is going relatively smoothly despite the hurdles and remember! you are a good person and worth ten of them (the ones who get to you, you know what I mean) as promised I will check into the site everyday, and if IRish Health are taking a holiday sure, I will be sending you positive vibes o.k.

Tom, I wonder what you are doing for Christmas because you haven't got a lot to say these days, I hope it is for a good reason whichever it is I will be remembering you over the Christmas period, keep in tough please.

Lola you are another one we never hear from now, is it because I asked you what other life you would like to lead and you took off never more to be seen, (with the name Lola) I would say you are in Beverly Hills somewhere!

Halo Dublin, you will find some good friends and a lot of help on this forum as I said yesterday your posting gave me a lift. I look forward to getting to know you in 2009 in the meantime take care of yourself.

Kissey, you are a terrible worrier just like me but I have a feeling you and i will see them all down so don't worry. and enjoy your Christmas.

Just in case the Irish Health team decide to turn off the lights and head to the nearest watering hole I am going to wish you all the happiest carefree Christmas you would wish for yourself and when you feel like screaming, shout Happy Christmas instead, God Bless you All.

Anne

I will still look in tomorrow.

Kay Posted: 24/12/2008 11:30

Hi Kissey. The best thing I can tell you to do about panic attacks is to just go with them. The more you run from them the more they bite you on the butt. I know this is easier said than done at times but they cannt get any worse. Odd things panic attacks , they are of no purpose whatsoever but yet half the population has them. Well actually thats not strictly true. Panic is a result of fear so if the body feels fear then the mind and body reacts in a panic attack. I used to think that a panic attact was purely in the mind but its not it all starts with a reaction in the tummy area. Think i am being too technical here.

Anyway Kissey, yes they are scary and I have been having them more coming up to christmas. Just keep talking about it keep telling your husband. Keep acknowledging them. All he has to do is listen. But the important thing is to tell someone. I usually text my husband a simple phrase like "I feel panic". He would then text me back "I hear you". Its important to tell some one and for them to hear you. Am i making any sense? Are you happy about going on more meds? Let me know how you get on. thanks talk soon Kay.

desperate Posted: 26/12/2008 21:18

hi to you all im just after finding your website and am i glad i have suffered with GAD/ANXIETY for the past year and its so horrible but its great to know other people understand since may of this year i have been taken cipremil which i find very good and it seems to be getting better but you have to get up everyday and try and fight it what do others think xxxxxxxxxnelly

Kay Posted: 28/12/2008 17:29

Hi desperate, I was on cipramil before and I have to say they were probably one of the best anti-depressants I have tryed. (I have tried a few). I think that ciparmil has less side effects than others. Are you feeling any better being on them? Wellcome to the forum and you know what if theres one thing I have learned through this forum is that a huge amount of people suffer with this. Its not just a few ,its very very common. I think that from my own personal experience, its the bodys way of saying " stop, theres something wrong and you cannt ignore it any longer". Do you know of any particular reason why this has hit you now? I know mine gets a whole lot worse when I am under stress or something triggers memories from my past. let me know how you are doing please?

Halo Dublin Posted: 29/12/2008 23:02

Hi everyone,

Just had a very exhausting xmas. The one thing I love at xmas is when the dinner is over, I go to bed and read that gives me a complete comfort feeling. This year I struggled on my feet trying to get everything done. Xmas day I was nearly there, just to prepare the turkey, threw it in the oven, left my sister to look after it and went to bed and fell asleep, and didn't care about skipping dinner.

Xmas night I woke up and had a ham sandwich, couldn't look at the turkey. I knew my sis was alright she watches alot of telly, and was happy enough. It turned out another sis ran out of turkey and used ours. Even with no thought put into cooking it my nephews and nieces though it was the nicest they had tasted. (they dont usually give compliments).

The two of us had a quite day, and then everyone came to visit the next day. I dont cook for them they know if they want anything, its in the kitchen. The only thing I give is advice when they look for it.

I seem to have taken my mother's role in the family, they all know I was very sick (13 months in hospital) this was when my mother died and I was having ECT. They all know I have come along way from that time. I am still on meds, but very little now. I have been discharged from out-patience and rarely see my GP. just for a prescription.

The advice I give to all the young ones in the family, when you have reached rock bottom in live, things can't get any worse and with support you will get on track again, but never forget to learn from any of your bad experiences.

With a very large family around me at xmas and I was ill but did not know what was wrong with me at the time. The feeling I remember was of feeling something like outside the window looking in at the festive happness in the family but not part of it.

I would encourage everyone on the forum who are taking meds. to keep taking them, but don't let them control you.

I used to think because I was taking meds. everything during the day revolved around them. Now I take them in the morning and go off to work and forget about it.

I remember a time when I could not stop to talk to people I knew, my mind would go blank, start trembling with an uneasy feeling all over my body, couldn't breath and had to run away in case they saw my reactions.

Thank God, that is all finished now, because I dont care what people think of me, because they probably have there problems too.

One last thing, I was lucky enough to have a very good consultant in hospital, and I remember him saying to a person in group theraphy who couldn't go into a supermarket without feeling faint, he told her to lay down on the floor, you cant faint lying down. Just imagine it, in your local supermarket, but now I see his point.

Happy and healthy new year to everyone.

Anonymous Posted: 01/01/2009 15:10

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL !

Anne

Helen Posted: 02/01/2009 17:29

A very Happy New Year to everyone on this site. I didn’t get a chance to log on over Christmas so am glad to see you all survived it as I did! Only had one bad day due to family commitments so kinda delighted with myself that the rest was fine once we escaped.

Patricia – you set me thinking about who I would really invite to Christmas dinner and loved your choice, if he wasn’t free I would love my two grannies to come back for a day and we could relive old times, Christmas isn’t the same without them!

Anne thanks for being on line the whole time, hope you didn’t feel too scared and lonely when the guests arrived.Imagine if we just told them the truth, and they put their arms around us and made everything better and it would all be ok one day. Anyway I am beginning to understand that the sensitive ones suffer but we also have a gift and a kindness denied to the more selfish. A real gift to be treasured, not bought in the sales and put on a shelf never to be used.

Kay did you see your mum over Christmas? I hope you are ok and I totally agree that panic or pain or even depression is our body saying " stop, there’s something wrong and you can’t ignore it any longer", I really like the way you put that and will remember it next time I start to feel out of control or useless, I will try and stop and listen to my body.

Hi there Halo Dublin, I am glad to hear that you don’t care what people think of you now, I manage so much better when I can think like that. You are so right you never know what is going on behind closed doors and they probably have their own problems and imagine they might not even be thinking bad things about us at all.

I love the new year and feel relieved we can all move on with our lives and think of SMALL ways to improve. Haven’t made any new years resolutions yet, has anyone ??? my favorite would be “to start believing I count” a bit vague I know so need some more specific ones to put in place. In the mean time Happy New Year 2009, look after yourselves and thanks for being here for me in 2008.

Helen

nelly Posted: 02/01/2009 22:01

dear kay, thank you so much for your support. i really dont know what triggered it off but there was a lot of family issues and then my brother died and we had not spoken for 4 years due to no fault of our own and neither of us would give in and never really got the chance to be the good friends that we used to be. now i know there has to be a hero in every situation but anyway kay got over the xmas ok. i had a some anxiety and panic but im good again. the cipremil are good. it was this time last year i got sick so i suppose i have come a long way but it is so good to be able to talk to someone that understands.

Halo Dublin Posted: 06/01/2009 00:21

Hi everyone,

Happy New Year, now we can start a new chapter in our lives. We have all survived through very bad times, trying to explain a panic attack to someone who has never had one is wasting your good time. Although I really dont care what people think, people still need to be needed, thats where I found myself in my mothers role with my family, they all respected and looked up to her. I truely know that I am stronger now than before my mental health problems started. I now respond to a crisis by priortising and taking control instead of hoping someone else will take over. If I am under pressure I accept help when it is offered. This makes others feel good too. I hope I am explaining myself in the right way as I know I will never be perfect, but I have found what works for me, and I hope you all will two.

God Bless

Patricia Posted: 06/01/2009 13:09

Hello to you all:

Again, a very very Happy and productive New Year to every single one of you. I haven't been on in a few days, but will post now in the next week or so. I've had a look through your posts, and I know you are all courageous and insightful people, soldiering on as best you can.

Hugs to all

Patricia

Posted: 07/01/2009 11:46

Hello Everybody,

HELEN, I am glad to read from your posting that you survived Christmas. Like you I was fortunate that I had only one day Stephen's day that I had to deal with (anyone else it would be a breeze) and the other days with Hubby and Daughter was pure joy Thank God. I looked in each day because I promised I would but Irish Health was closed for Christmas so I couldn't be "there for the people I promised and they for me.

I was with my Counsellor yesterday Monday and with a bit of delving we discovered that I never felt I was good enough to be myself, even in childhood I spend my time reinventing myself and finally I realise that, I am afraid nobody will like the real me also as I was last in the family the next was seven years older than me I felt lonely and that loneliness stayed with me always. Sorry Helen I got carried away with ME.

Like you I feel positive and look forward to 2009, that is how I feel now and I hope it will continue but I try to take each day at a time and even each moment at any one time.

Hello NELLY, Like you my brother passed away in 2008 and we had a lot of history but Nelly we could continue to beat ourselves up for lost opportunities but it won't change anything so all I do now is pray for him and try not to feel too bad both for what he did and what I did, I wish you continued good health and strength of mind God Bless.

Hello HALO DUBLIN, You sound as though you have your "act" together, you have come through a lot and now you are on your way Go Girl!

Posted: 07/01/2009 15:48

Hi Folks,

Posting number 1003 is from me Anne. Look forward to hearing from you all.

roggie Posted: 08/01/2009 13:06

hi, im new to this and am enjoying reading your comments, feel so much better knowing im not alone feeling anxious. thank you.

Anne Posted: 08/01/2009 14:45

Hi Roggie,

I am sure I say it for all who contribute to this site, welcome. I am glad that you found some comfort from our communications, you will always find somebody that can "be with you" when you need reassurance, I always found that to be so.

Tell us a little about how you came to suffer with anxiety and how it affects you, it affects us all in different ways as you probably are aware.

Take care and hope to hear from you.

Anne

Kay Posted: 08/01/2009 16:40

Hello to all. Well christmas wasnt the disaster that i expected. I managed to even have a good time. Apart from a few domestic crisis like leaking pipes etc. Helen, I didnt make any new year resolutions because all i want is for it to be a better year than 2008. Looking back on all the stuff that happened and all the stuff I remembered in therapy it feels kinda surreal. Its been almost unbelievable and some of the stuff still doesnt sit too well in my head.

Any way new year and daffodil bulbs coming up and evenings getting longer. Yahoo.

Nelly, sorry to hear about your brothers death. I think with your family stuff and this is enough to make anybody anxious. This forum is great and has got me through many a desperate time. Its hugely helpful to know that there are loads of people like ourselves. The one common thread most of those on this forum have is I think that we have all had some kind of trauma. And in most cases its family orientated. As the saying goes you cannt chose your family but you can chose your friends.

Anne, hi, glad to hear you got over christmas ok. Looking forward to speaking to you all this year with many good things happening to us all.

Helen, I saw my mother over christmas but over all kept a safe distance. I dont think she will ever understand whats happening to me. Although she went through a major depressive time when I was in my early 20's its the whole abuse thing that she doesnt get. Also these days i find myself afraid to look at my dad in case I start having flashbacks about him. Its a cycle of fear and panic and the more I avoid him the more the fear builds up. I know its normal for me to feel like this but it still scares me so much. Anyway i am back to therapy next week and part of me doesnt want to go but I know I have to continue with this stuff until its all out of me because only then will I be able to live the life without overwhelming fear that I always dreamt of. sounds very dramatic doesnt it?

Helen Posted: 08/01/2009 23:23

Hi all, how is the new year going, 8 days in and i feel ok. saw my consellor tonight and it was really helpful. was going to tell her i was going to stop (can't really afford much else if i see her every week) but decided to keep going by the end of session. talk about getting carried away with ME!! but its a safe place to talk about ME and this time last year i was smoking and drinking quite heavily to get through the weeks and just realized i only stopped to buy myself a bottle of water on way home tonight, what a difference!

so if i weigh it up counselling might even be saving me money :))

Lots of love to all of you, may you have more ups than downs this week!

take care

Helen

Anne Posted: 09/01/2009 12:32

Hi Friends,

Helen I agree with you about seeing the counsellor each week, my husband retires this year and while we have no big bills to worry about a depressive can always find something to worry about. I find talking to an outsider helps me because I care too much about my family to have them worry about me, but when I started she said and I am aware that they all say this, I quote; it is important that you attend weekly breaks would affect the flow etc. end quote. Well, since October she has cancelled three sessions and now she tells me she will be away for the month of March I can't believe it. I am going to have a chat with her next Monday. Enough about me.

Helen, you are right about money well spent I would keep with the counsellor and like coming off tablets, break away gradually until you don't have to ask yourself can I stop/should I,/what if, you know what I mean. Helen I think you are amazing the fact that you achieved so much in such a short time, I hope I sound sincere. My brother died July last R.I.P and he was a drinker from the age of 14 he was 67 when he passed away, so you know I am sincere.

You, by your postings have come a long way and I am getting there with baby steps so we are not doing too badly although I find it is a lonely road.

Like many of us on this site we we are always reaching out to others trying to help but we find it difficult to ask for support, what do you think? I look forward to reading what you have to say.

Kay a special Happy New Year to you. Yes we survived Christmas and, I as I said before we, I fall to pieces for weeks before and it is always O.K. will I ever learn. Kay I hope your family situation is finally resolved in lucky year 2009 life is too short, don't let any of them get you down, it is your life. I know you don't need my advice but I do hope this is your year. Keep in touch.

Hi Helen and Anne. Therapy, what to do? I just found out on Fri that my hubby has lost his job. I am trying not freak out about it. The therapy is an issue. How do I afford threapy weekly when we will be getting barely enough for food etc on the social welfare. My hubby is adamant that I should continue with therapy and we will dip into our small savings acc to fund therapy. I know my journey with therapy is not over and I know I still need to go and work through some issues but how the hell can I justify spending that money on myself every week at a time like this.

I am trying to remain positive and up beat and not freak out about no income coming into the house and everyone keeps saying to me "oh, now you will have to go and get a job". Most of them arent aware of my history and dont know to me getting a job and making a committment like that now would overwhelm me and set me reeling. Anyway, I hope and pray something comes up for hubby asap and that we can keep some semblence of normality for the kids. My little girl told her dad that she would ask her angels to get him a new job and I could see his eyes filling up when she said it.

The bright side is i think is that at least we paid off our morgage two years ago through hard saving and its good to know that at least our home is safe. Also I have some great pals including the pals i have made on this forum. Thanks so much for all your support and level headed advice especially to Helen and Anne. talk soon friends. Glad to hear you are both doing ok.

Celtic35 Posted: 11/01/2009 10:49

Hi

I am wondering can anybody explain why I am getting pains in my chest and left arm past couple nights in bed. When I am lying there I feel my heart surging which causes my body to jump as I am dosing back to sleep.

Thanks

Glenn

Patricia Posted: 11/01/2009 22:15

Hello to everyone:

Just been a busy time of late, a lot going on, but I am not forgetting you!

I will post a bit, in a week or so.

Just thought I would put this up. I think it says some important things.

Research has demonstrated that before the age of eight, we lack the ability to formulate a clear, separate sense of self--that is, other than what has been communicated to us by our caretakers. So if our parents are unable, or unwilling, to transmit the message that we're totally okay and acceptable--independent, that is, of our hard-to-control, sometimes errant behaviors (which, understandably, may frustrate or disappoint them)-- we're primed to view ourselves with ambivalence. The positive regard we receive from our parents may depend almost totally on our behavior, and we unfortunately learn that a considerable number of these behaviors are parentally unacceptable. So, naturally identifying ourselves with these objectionable behaviors, we inevitably come to see ourselves as in many ways unacceptable.

Additionally, adverse parental evaluation can, and frequently does, go far beyond individual behaviors. For example, parents may give us the more general message that we're selfish-or that we're not thin enough, smart enough, attractive enough, good enough, "nice" enough, and so on. As a result of what most mental health professionals would agree represents a subtle form of emotional abuse, almost all of us come to regard ourselves as only partially--or conditionally--acceptable. In consequence, we learn to regard many aspects of our self negatively, painfully internalizing the felt rejection we too often felt at the hands of over-critical parents. And this tendency toward self-criticism is at the heart of most of the problems we unwittingly create for ourselves as adults."...

Best to you all

Patricia

Patricia Posted: 12/01/2009 11:44

Dear Kay:

So very sorry to hear that your husband has lost his job... what a sign of the times we are in right now. Let us hope that he can find new employment, and that you can weather this setback for a while. It must be very tough on you.

I can understand your difficulty in even thinking about work yourself. But, maybe, you might consider even a bit of baby-sitting, an evening or two a week, and see how you feel about that.

I wish you luck and I know something good will come your way.

Patricia

Patricia Posted: 12/01/2009 11:46

Hello Celtic:

I think it is important you see the doctor regarding this type of pain, just to be on the safe side. It could well be due to anxiety, and the physical manifestation of that anxiety, but all the same, do see the doctor. It will set your mind at ease.

All the best

Patricia

Tom Posted: 12/01/2009 13:40

Hi all, Happy New Year to everyone who I have got to know and really trasure over 2008. Kay I am very sorry to hear about your husabands position, ity really is a sign of the times as if us people with this dreadful condition have not enough to put up with. Be gentle with yourself in the days and weeks ahead.

Personally I have had a pretty big anxiety attack over the last week, I guess the crash that happens to I think everyone did not help. Feel a bit better so therefore putting a post on as I do not want bto put too many negative posts on. Appreciate everyones support. Kind regards to all Tom

Anne Posted: 12/01/2009 15:04

Kay Chicken,

I am so sorry to hear that your hubby has lost his job, yet another thing to drag you down, I hope I am not going to bore you now but I am going to tell you how it affected us in the '80's.

On Valentines Day 1983 hubby arrived home and said that he was being made redundant the blood drained from my body as I stood there. He is an Industrial Chemist by profession so his salary and lifestyle were good. Our daughter was three at the time and we had a mortgage and bills to pay more than we should have. My husband is the loveliest man in the world but he is an academic so put him in an interview and he could not sell himself if his life depended on it, and with the very few interviews (not easy to get a position in that line) produced nothing. I on the other hand could sell snow to Lapland. My husband took care of house and child and I went out and got myself a job (in a shop) now used to that type type of work but discovered I was a natural. After 6 months the owner wanted to open another shop and asked would I run it, I agreed. I worked 6 days in shop and on Sunday I did the book-work I did that for 5 years and the pressure nearly killed me, but my small pay compared to what my husband earned was pennies, but I covered the bills and food. He finally got a job but never in his own line and those "good days" were gone. We managed and we are still managing but only just, this year hubby retires, he is 6 years older than me and I am not looking forward to that. What I am really trying to tell you is we all manage and for you Kay this might be a blessing in disguise, if you can get yourself a little job it will help keep your mind worrying.

Kay we are rooting for you get your "thinking Cap on"

God Bless Anne.

Anne Posted: 12/01/2009 16:06

Hello Again Key,

I only half read your letter and replied I hope they publish it now otherwise this one wont make sense.

I just noticed you said that you have a problem about going out to work and theres me writing telling you to do exactly what you feel you can't do. No matter what you decide I know it will be the best decision for you and your family, but just give the job situation a thought o.k.

Take care,

Anne

Kay Posted: 12/01/2009 17:06

Hi Tom, glad to hear from you. By the way please dont be afraid that by posting your feelings and worries here that they are negative. they are not. I am doing it all the time and its a huge release for me . Also the suport I get from all here is huge and I couldnt do without it. So , post away it will help you release worries etc. Do you hear me, expert therapist!!!!

Patricia, great to hear from you too and thanks for your support. Anne, I have been thinking of putting up notices locally for an ironing service. what do you think? I feel there would be no pressure involved and if it worked I wouldnt feel so bad about not bringing in money. All my husbands family and some others keep telling me I have to go out and bring home the bacon now that hubby is out of work and in my head when others say it to me i am screaming inside. I know to someone else it probably seems that nothing is stopping me and they dont know whats been going in my private life during the past yeara or so. P.s I am not lazy and would give my right arm to be able to commit myself to a job anywhere but its the anxiety etc thats stops me. I know I will get there and I am still doing the one day a week voluntary in the local Hope shop so its a huge step for me. So time will heal as will my regular therapy. let me know what you think about the ironing service idea. Thanks all talk soon.

nelly Posted: 12/01/2009 22:08

hello to all, nelly here. i had a bad day yesterday with anxiety, dry mouth, choking feeling but thank god im fine today. when that happens it wears me out my husband was made redundant also. he finishes this wensday so maybe thats why i was feeling like this. what do ye think xxxxxxxxxxxxxxnelly

A28dam Posted: 13/01/2009 08:47

hello everyone,

I know it had been a while since i wrote something here, but dont worry i have been reading everything written here from time to time. i was Extreamly busy with making all the papers ready for my new work, and now am moving from belguim to Dubai within 10 days to start my new life as a Cabin crew.

Yes i am excited but some part of me is very very nervous and worried. what if and what if ??? etc. Am keeping postive and i put in my mind what ever negative thought will appear i will throw it off and try to stay calm.

I do agree with Anne that try to do the things that u feel u can't do the most. you know guys the work that am doing ur not allowed to take any anti dep.. or sleeping pills... ect . sometimes thats put me on the edge. i feel like there is no backup plan. i guess i have no other way than facing this.

if i can get any tips i will be more than thankfull.

Thank you all

and hope to hear from you very soon Anne ( mother ) special kiss for you

Anne Posted: 13/01/2009 10:47

Hello Adam,

I wish you a happy and healthy 2009. You are on your way now you have the job you wanted and you got that without medication so well done. I am always giving advice but not that good at taking it, but for what it is worth, I always say worry never solved a problem so try and throw it out the "window" and what will be, will be. You are going to do fine, and think about it, there are very few people who are not on drugs be it recreational or medicinal so you are special and free.

Good Luck Adam,

Anne.

Anne Posted: 13/01/2009 11:04

Hi Nelly,

I am reading a book that was recommended to me and I am finding it very helpful and maybe you would also, it is called The Mindful Way Through Depression (freeing yourself from Chronic Unhappiness), it is an easy read and explains why we get recurrent incidences etc. I think you would enjoy it.

I have another theory for what it is worth. We build up a lot of tension etc. leading up to Christmas and then after the season NOTHING, that is like falling of a cliff.

Most Important, your husband losing his job that will certainly affect you to say the least so try to not analyse (I was told that) and be good to yourself and your husband. These are challenging times and we will get through them with the help of God.

Regards Anne

Anne Posted: 13/01/2009 11:18

Good Morning Kay,

You were asking what we thought about working within the home, you mentioned ironing, what about the likes of sowing i.e hemming, curtain making etc. if you don't have a sowing machine you would pick one up cheaply in the auction rooms. Also when hubby lost his job back in the 1980's a friend and neighbour of ours couldn't leave her home so she cared for two of our friends kids they were able to go out and work and they in turn paid her for caring for the kids so all three were earning. Just a thought.

Bye for now Anne

A28dam Posted: 13/01/2009 14:10

Dear Anne ,

As always the words u say makes me jump up so high from happiness. thank you very much , and of course i will do my best to stay on track. of course i have my bad days where i feel that i lost all the power to fight, and i dont feel like to put it over here cause maybe i will admit that i really have a problem or i really feel bad today.... and am aware that is so wrong !!! and i hope i can change it .

and Dear Kay, i think the best thing for you is to get on the internet and look it up what u really want to do or u like to do, outdoor or indoor.. first u need a clue what is it that u would like to do, and then u try to make a plan how to work on it from ur house ... like making cookies or cakes and sell it to the shops or something like that...some other thing u need to learn it before u do it, so it will take sometimes and energey but its worth it at the end.

and for you all guys, keep strong and we will be over this one day.

xXXXXXXX adam

Helen Posted: 14/01/2009 13:40

Hello there, i have been reading your posts and can fully understand the work related anxiety - had a month off work before/after christmas and my mood was so high. work is a hard cold place when you don't want to be there but need the money. Kay like the others my husband lost his job a few years ago and in a strange way it catapulted me out of the house (ok into 2 hours commute and low pay!!) however we made an agreement to send out cvs everywhere and whoever got a job first had to go! (like Anne i got one first). Anyway i used to count up the hours pay and work out what each hour would buy and i kinda got through it that way and by making a few friends at work too. Any work will help ease your finances - ironing sounds good to me, i am thinking about night courses now too to learn some new skills (sewing believe it or not) but try to not think about the whole concept of WORK but break it down into days and even hours so you will only be out of your comfort zone for say 2 hours on monday and then you can jump right back under the duvet so to speak :))) often its the IDEA of something rather than the reality that freaks me out. Tom i hope your feeling better and please please share your thoughts, you were so helpful when i first came on this site and i remember ranting quite a bit! All the best to everyone xx H

Kay Posted: 14/01/2009 20:46

HI to all. Tom, are you ok? Helen is right when i started to post on this forum you were a huge part of it and I used to look forward to your posts. We need you. you are part of the gang. Having said that there are days when I check on this forum and just read the mail and not post one back because I just cannot think straight.

Anne, thanks for the advice. I cannot even sew in a button (well I can but hate it). A friend asked me to mind her kids while she worked but my gut is telling me not to go there because she can be a bit pushy at times and take advantage. She was offering what worked out at €3.50 an hour. Do any of you guys know if thats bad pay or what is the going rate for minding children from your home? I have asked a few and they have said that they think this is a very low rate of pay.

Adam, I love your baking cooking idea and selling them in shops. I might look into it a bit more. Im practically green with envy over your career. Go you. I feel so excited for you. Your attitude is one we should all try and adopt. You just go for what you want and to hell with those iffy moments. I know you will succeed at this I know you have drive and ambition. You have a fabulous life ahead of you so grab it and live it to the full. Now I am going to try and do a little bit of that positive thinking myself.

Nelly. My friends and family keep telling me I am handling the news about hubby loosing job very well. And then I keep thinking "oh. maybe I should be freaking and crying and weeping over it". But I am not. Yes I am anxious about our future but i am trying not to think too far ahead. If I did that then Yes i probably would freak.. For the moment we are ok and have a little savings so not going to go hungry yet!!

Guys just before I go. There is one thing bothering me and thats my hubbys attitude to all this. His dad has a farm, and hubby works on it all day now since he lost his job. His dad doesnt pay him a cent even though he is also getting the pension. Am i being mean thinking that his dad could throw him a few euros for all the work he does? His dad knows our circumstances and knows the loans etc we have but still he doesnt acknowledge it. I hope this doesnt sound greedy but I know his dad and mum are very comfortable financially and feel they could pay hubby something towards all the work he does. Familys who the hell would have them.

Mags Posted: 14/01/2009 22:24

Has anyone had acupuncture for anxiety. I would like to know if it was a success. I took Lexipro last year and I felt well after six months then went off the medication and was fine until last Otober when the same symptons appeared again. So rather than go back on Lexipro and suffer for weeks until the body got used to the drug I decided on Acupuncture. Have had five sessions over and I feel so so cant say as yet whether it will be a success. My problem with anxiety is that I get severe pressure in my head and just cant go the places I should. I feel afraid to go into shops as I think I will fall. Has anyone those symptons I would like to hear from you. Mags

Anne Posted: 15/01/2009 11:06

Hi Helen,

Always good to read your postings you do make sense and you really get your message over in such a nice way so I hope everybody who needs a shoulder recognises your offer. On the other hand, when I try to help, I think my offer of help comes over as if it was a directive from Mrs. Thatcher and obviously it does not work so I envy your communication skills, keep up the good work I need it. Take care of yourself Regards Anne.

Hi Adam,

Thank you for your letter. I have never received such an "energetic" letter. Keep up the positive thinking and you will be fine. Take care, Anne.

Anne Posted: 15/01/2009 12:07

Hi Kay,

You sound as though you are doing o.k. thank God. As for 3.50 per hour minimum pay is something like 8 euros + and that is what you should expect that is what the baby sitters are getting (teenagers) so don't sell yourself short ok. I know what you mean about sowing I hate it. I have been known in my working days to use a stapler to take up a hem. With regard to your father in law, if your hubby has been helping on and off while he had his job maybe it hasn't dawned on him yet or, maybe he needs a "sledge hammer" reminder that children are not cheap labour, you know best. try hints here and there or better again get your hubby to have a chat with him. They say "you can choose your friends but not your family".

God Bless Kay,

Anne.

Anne Posted: 15/01/2009 12:22

Hi Mags,

No I have never had acupuncture for anxiety but have had it for frozen shoulder and am sorry to say it didn't work for me, maybe I am wrong but my theory is acupuncture is to prevent rather than heal. I spent a lot of time in the 80's reading up on it and if I remember acupuncture is used to keep the life force flowing freely through the different meridians in the body so if you are checked regularly a practitioner can check the five pulses (I think 5) in your wrist and they will know. I hope I am making sense, but that is just my opinion for what it is worth. I am practising yoga meditation at the moment and I think that would be a good road for you to go down. If you focus your mind on the breath you are taking your mind off everything else. it works but takes practice. a book and CD I am using at the moment will explain it all to you including what you are experiencing at the moment. the book is The Mindful Way Through Depression. I am finding it really great. Good Luck.

Anne.

Hypnotherapist Posted: 15/01/2009 15:52

Hi, My name is Richard and I work as a Clinical Hypnotherapist and Analytical Psychtherapist based in Waterford. You can vist me in www.safeharbour.ie

This is my first time ever in a forum but I would like to take this opportunity to be of whatever help I can regarding Anxiety and Depression issues discussed here. best regards ... Richard

Patricia Posted: 15/01/2009 17:39

Yes, Kay, I do think your husband might have a word with his father about getting paid something for his labour. It would seem fair.

Not all families are like this, I also think it is fair to say! I know of several where the father has helped out grown sons, far and beyond the call of duty. There are, thankfully, many great people in this world.

Best to everyone

Patricia

A28dam Posted: 15/01/2009 21:21

Hi all,

Dear kay , am so happy that you like the idea, and i hope u will go for it. and belive me who make me that strong all the time is my great friends who understand what am going throuw and they keep on encorging me to do whats best for me. and i love them for that and i owe them big times. and about ur hubby, i think he must speak up and tell his family. maybe they think that he dont need the money or maybe he offerd to help. but either way u must talk to him and they must know that there is nothing for free in life specialy that ur going in hard time right now.

And Anne that energy comes through people like you always willing to help and like to advice.

And for the acupuncture i dont think this works , cause i tried for along time , and it did nothing. it makes you relax but it does not take all the negative thoughts away from your mind .. and it does not take the doubts and the worries in ur mind. so if no medication then therapy is the best way.

and for all you guys all the best

wish me the luck , and i will keep you posted.

Kay Posted: 16/01/2009 19:38

Hi Mags, I tried accupuncture and didnt think much of it. but maybe that is because the lady doing it was running from me to two others who were recieving accupunturce at the same time. I felt she was being greedy trying to treat three of us at same time. Talk about not giving clients time. Anyway, I am with both Adam and Anne with their suggestions because I think therapy is probably the best way to deal with anxiety and depression. Yoga or some other form of relaxation is great for this kind of illness too. I am doing pilates once a week now since november and I love it. Its just one hour for me to relax and feel still and quiet. I have read more books in the past year and a half than I have in my life time from books on depression/anxiety to books on angels or alternative treatments. Most , if not all emphasise the importance of being still. Just sitting alone in stillness and quiteness maybe for even just 10 minutes. I am laughing as i write this because its not very often I parctice this myself. Mags, Have you ever tried Reiki? I did reiki 1 last July and was kind of mixed as to what I would get from it or in fact if it really worked. I have experimented and not given myself reiki for a while to see if I feel any better when I do actually do it to myself and I am pleased to say that I definately notice a marked improvement in my moods and thinking when I treat myself four or so times during the week.

I had a few Reiki treatment from a Reiki master last year and it was like waking up and seeing the sun for the first time in a long time. I know it probably sounds off the wall, but I found after two treatments I was more positive and less anxious. Anyway, enough of the Reiki, if you need any more info. please just ask me.

Adam, when are you off on you adventure? You lucky thing.

Anne, your advice is much appreciated and needed by me anyway and I am sure I speak for all of us when I say that. I value your opinion hugely and think of you as a friend. Dont think for a minute your opinion is not as important because it is. talk soon my friend.

Mags Posted: 16/01/2009 20:13

Hi Anne,

Thanks for your comments on acapuncture I do think you are right. Had my 5th session on l2th Jan. she put some needles around my head where I felt the most tension and since then I feel in very bad form. Got out of the car in town this afternoon and I was just staggering and my eyes were seeing double vision. I am weak all over was considering going back to my G.P. for another opinion. Do you know anything about Black Cohosh a herb I do believe and its supposed to be good for anxiety. Do you know has acapuncture got any side effects? I do believe for acapunture to work you must have at least 6 sessions and then have an odd one every now and then. Look forward to hear from you again you are a breath of fresh air to read all you comments.

Tom Posted: 18/01/2009 13:07

Hi all, Tom here, my head is reasonably good at the moment, really crashed for a while there after Xmas. Most people who read this space and contribute will be very familar with what happens, racing thoughts, feeling of going mad and extreme agitation to name but a few.

Find the pool and in particular water exercises in the pool helps. I have other relatively minor health issues that prevent me from doing long walks and vigorous gym exercises. Hello to everybody and for 2009 I will contribute more even when I am in a low mood.

I have an appointment with a Biaura person tomorrow evening, biaura is energy flow and healing. I have found in the past that this is useful to me. I think I agree that alternatives only really help with the prevention, but when a full blown attack is in progress, alernatives can only offer a little assistance and other assistance like talk, this site, exercise and meds are also needed

Kay I read your posts about your financial situation. Just for what it is worth, would it be an idea for your husband to say to his father, that past labor is a gift and therefore no charge. However due to changed circumstances future labor is at the minimum pay rate which is 8.65 per hour. That to me would seem very fair and similarly with ironing etc, I think your rate should be 8.65 or close to it and not the 4 that was mentioned. Kind regards to everyone Tom

Patricia Posted: 19/01/2009 17:54

Hello to all:

Maybe I put this up before. Anyhow here goes again. Sounds useful.

Women Who Think too Much: How to Break Free of Overthinking and Reclaim your Life (Hardcover) by Susan Nolen-Hoeksema Ph.d. (Author), From Publishers Weekly Practically everyone agonizes over decisions or situations from time to time, but overthinkers carry analysis and introspection to unhealthy extremes, "getting caught in torrents of negative thoughts and emotions,"according to this book. Even minor events can trigger a chain of second-guessing in which negative emotions are "amplified instead of managed." Kneading damaging thoughts like dough, overthinkers fall victim to a "yeast effect" that causes negativity to grow and take control of their lives, distort their perspectives and damage relationships, careers and emotional (and perhaps physical) health. Nolen-Hoeksema, a University of Michigan psychology professor and author of five professional books, explores why people overthink, contends and explains why too much thinking is predominantly a woman’s disease and prescribes a three-step program to overcome overthinking. Citing many studies (including her own) and occasionally zooming in on particular cases, she offers no-nonsense, reasoned and easy-to-understand advice and strategies, as well as a quiz to help readers recognize their own patterns of overthought. Excerpts: Strategy Don't go there. Description Choose not to get involved in situations that arouse overthinking. Example Jan knew that spending too much time with her mother was sure to result in weeks of overthinking, so she kept her visits short. Another example: Strategy Let go of unhealthy goals Description Let go of goals that are impossible or that cause you to act self-destructively

Patricia Posted: 19/01/2009 17:58

Just looking at Richard's post re hypnotherapy. I can say, and assure you all, that this type of therapy is invaluable! Some years ago I went through considerable trauma (no, no depression), but much anxiety and panic due to an overwhelming series of events.

I found the hypnotherapy truly got me back on the road in record time, amazingly so.

Patricia

Kay Posted: 19/01/2009 20:46

Hi Tom. Thanks for advice. I would love to take things into my own hands as regards my father in law paying my hubby, but I know that this would make hubby very annoyed. Dont get me wrong hes not an agressive or cross man but my god hes unbeliveably stubborn and comes from a family that dont talk or communicate at all. I am really getting angry about the whole situation now, hubby spends all day 7 days a week on the farm, a farm that hes not even sure hes going to get when his dad retires. I have been told I am becoming obsessed by the whole situation now(by my husband), but I am not I would simply like to know if we have a future on the farm or not. I dont think thats expecting too much but apparently others think different. I will probably be venting steam here during the coming weeks so be prepared all of you.

Anyway, Mags, I dont know if accupuncture has any side effects, I would imagine not but I am not educated very well in that field.

Hi to everyone else hope to hear from you all soon. regards. Kay.

Helen Posted: 20/01/2009 16:50

hi all, having a bad bad day today, made it into work on one hours sleep (worrying about someone in work) and they weren't even in!!

You could see it in my face and am just finished now so can escape to my duvet for a bit. Have to cancel and engagement and dreading it, hate letting people down.

Anne you once said that i was doing so well so quickly well i prob put on a brave text face - like you guys i have bad bad days but hope this one is nearly over. I am listening to cds about "the power of now" which is helping loads. I am trying to improve my diet and fitness too as don't want to go on pills again.

better go home.

take care

Helen

Anne Posted: 21/01/2009 12:57

Hi Everybody,

HELEN I just read your letter and I really hope you are feeling better today. Tell me are you being bullied in work or is it just a coincidence that you had little or no sleep the previous night.

I know I mentioned this before but the book I have just finished helped me understand our thought process and how we fall back into relapses and I think maybe it would help I can see you are doing everything to help yourself and do not want to go down the tablet rout, the book is The Mindful Way through depression by Mark Williams, John Teasdale, ZindelSegal and Jon Kabat-Zinn order it from the Library and in the back you will find a CD on meditation, it was recommended by a very good friend of mine he happens to be in the "head" business Ha! you know what I mean.

Be kind to yourself you deserve it and try to stop racing thoughts about negative things that is what gets us worked up, that is why you are finding The Power of Now helpful. Let me know how you are, Regards Anne

KAY I am fully convinced husbands come with families attached just to test us specially if we are the type who have a mind of our own, it is so so frustrating, Chicken! you are not going to win over husband or family I know because I have been there, just chill and what will be will be (I can just imagine your face now and hear you saying is she mad) you won't change them but you can change your situation what you do is up to you, so think, but don't panic it didn't get me anywhere. Good Luck Friend Anne. P.S. in my last posting I think, I was mentioning about my Margaret Thatcher approach and nobody taking notice of me, I meant generally I didn't mean on this forum particularly and I was complimenting Helen on her communication skills, she has what it takes like you Kay. Bye for now Anne.

Tom Posted: 21/01/2009 18:20

Hi All. Helen I can identify with the brave text concept.

I am having a difficult head time at the moment and putting on a brave face. I probably like an awful lot of other people crashed with the onset of the January blues. Inside feel s---e and barely getting by. Feeling confused forgetful and getting names etc mixed up. Making myself go the gym and get some water exercise, it does help my symptoms which are extremely queasy nausea feeling in the stomach and inability to concentrate, decide and progress issues. In the past when I felt like this I just gave up.

Now realise that the more I give up, the worse the symptoms become. It is myself is attacking myself. I call it Donald Duck. I know it is all to do with my inside being, mechanism triggering panic, I can taste the bile from the wrong type of adrenalin (the bad stuff) surging through my system. The mood swing takes over and it is extremely difficult to cope with and deal with the matter on hand.

I am making conscious effort to praise myself and have conquered the feeling of feeling bad about myself at the end of the day. I now tell myself to feel good about myself at the end of the day and it does ease me into sleep. so i suppose that is real progress as getting to sleep was a huge problem for me and to a large extent this has now disappeared. So Helen I know where you are coming from as regards 1 hours sleep, it really leaves you completely in a heap for the next day.

I do know that when my system relaxes the nausea eases down, so I know that the symptoms are unrelated to something physical. The problem is relaxing so that I can function properly. Any suggestions out there, I have tried lots of things but open to any new suggestions that somebody might have. Kay I think it was you that said that you felt sometimes like you were going crazy and yet you knew well that you are not. I feel exactly the same way sometimes. I just want a reasonably normal existence and this anxiety is preventing me from doing.

Life at the moment for me is one constant round of work stress. I have a very good partner and to the outside world we have it all. Reading the various posts have made me realise that I am not alone with this anxiety and stress, and perhaps people that I think have it all, have not in reality.

At the moment I feel the need for support and thank my lucky stars that I came across this website. By accident I found writing in this website does writing does. Thanks everyone for listening and lets look after each other in these difficult and gloomy days Tom

Tom Posted: 21/01/2009 18:27

Tom here again, I wonder if anybody has any suggestions for stopping to think about something and instead just to think about the task in hand fully. Suggestions greatly appreciated. Cheers Tom

Kay Posted: 21/01/2009 22:33

Hi ladies. Anne you made me laugh with what you said about my husbands family. I know what you said is true and I have to just step back and try and stop freaking out about situations I cannt control. Still at loggerheads with hubby and I know this sounds terrible but I am kinds annoyed with him for having no job. I know it wasnt his fault he was let go but some part of me thinks " well how could you, I need to feel safe and secure and now is not a good time to be out of work and putting extra worries and scenarios in my head".. I think thats my inner child throwing a wobbler.

Helen, I am sorry to hear you had a bad day, today I struggled at times, why is this person at work troubling you? My heart goes out to you, just keep talking to us here and let all your troubles and anxietys out. I do and I know for sure I feel better after doing so in this safe environment. I hope you sleep ok tonight, Its a very lonely place when you are awake in the middle of the night , it feels like you are the only person in the world feeling like this. Do you keep a journal, just to write down your fears, it doesnt matter how off the wall the are just write them down. My therapist told me the other day that it takes writting down stuff roughly about 35 times before the mind starts to let go of it. So like pick one worry and write it down, how you feel about it, how it effects you and how anxious it makes you feel . Do this for a long time until it becomes less of a fear and makes sense in your head. God i am starting to sound like a therapist now.. Dont know if i am making sense. Be good to yoursefl Helen, you are a valued friend and very much needed by me for one. Kay.

Patricia Posted: 22/01/2009 13:45

Hello Tom:

How are you? I think you are referring to "overthinking".

Overthinking means unproductive thinking. Here are some of the characteristics of nonproductive thinking:

1) Thinking the same thing over and over again, without attempting to reach a solution;

2) Thinking that does not lead to a solution, or at least closer to one;

3) Thinking that paints you as a helpless victim without integrating in what you DO have control over;

4) Thinking without reference to action, or thinking never followed up with action (even experimental action, to see what's true and what isn't).

No doubt anxiety is what triggers the overthinking.

I found this on the net:

Find a quiet spot. The quiet may seem like it would be a worse place to go if you were trying to clear your mind, but it really is helpful to be able to hear yourself think.

Think about what happened during the day. This step may sound very contradicting in regards to the main idea of the article, but it is one of the most important steps throughout this whole article. In order to clear your mind, you have to first acknowledge everything that happened in the course of your day. You will then, in turn, be able to stop thinking about what happened during the day.

Block out negative thoughts. After absorbing the day's actions, you must separate the good thoughts from the bad. With that being said, you now must try to block out the bad. This is very difficult, and takes a great deal of practice.

Block out positive thoughts. Once the negative thoughts are gone, try to 'blur' the positive thoughts. This is perhaps one of the most difficult things for a human to do, but it is important. Remember, the thoughts do not have to be forgotten, just 'blurred'.

Kay when Hubby lost his job, looking back now I blamed him and gave him a terrible time but thank God he managed not to "buckle" under the abuse I threw at him. I am so so ashamed to have acted that way and I have been making up for it ever since, but I now know that it was the only way of reacting to our Worlds being turned upside down. The security we provided for our daughter and our family home, now, no security, it all went instantly. Does any of the above make sense, if so then don't be hard on yourself.

We came out of the eighties stronger than we ever were, and life was better you will find that too, so sail on and know nothing ever stays the same. I'm doing it again! preaching! sorry. Take care.

Anne.

Tom it is good to see you back on the page. Patricia's advice sounds great to me and I am practising something like that myself but it is all down to practice, practice and patience, I know it will be worth it in the end, hope it works for you. Regards Anne.

Helen, I hope you know we are all rooting for you, write in and let us know how you are. Anne

Tom Posted: 22/01/2009 17:52

Hi all Tom here, Patricia thank you so much for your article on overthinking, yes I can identify very much with alot of its contents. Like the idea of doing what you suggest I hear you Anne about patience. I know I am not alone in these moodswings and negative thoughts, I find the moodswing very powerful and overwhelming when it is surging along. Lately have been focusing on what I forget and or misplace, give you a laugh, today I asked at the shop for five slices of ham, the shop assistant confirmed, then simply cut one packaged it and handed it to me. So I suppose lots of people in lots of situations are forgetful. Have had a reasonable day today.Kay Helen and all I hope you are doing ok Regards Tom

Kay Posted: 22/01/2009 18:48

Hi Anne, you hit the nail on the head. I feel exactly the same about the situation with hubby now as you did then. So much so that I dont even want to be in the same room as him. Part of me feels so ashamed for feeling like this because hes a good man and has always been a great provider. I love him but I dont like him, does that make sense. I want to resolve this but dont know how. I cannt feel like this forever because it will eat me up inside. But yes, its good to know that you felt the same in this situation.

Tom, when my head is thinking too much, which it often does, I write. I know i have mentioned this before but it does work. Its a slow process. But writting the thoughts down no matter how off the wall they seem make them less scary. The stuff I have written down is scary to me when I read back over it, but I know they are unbalanced thoughts and not real. Also saying them out loud, whether it be to a trusted friend or to yourself. Saying them out loud is releasing and releasing relieves pressure in the racing mind. It also does the soul and mind good to say out loud how blessed we are in other ways like good job or good friends or great home or lovely day. I am preaching now too. Sorry.

You know , this condition is so common. Every week I hear of someone who is feeling the anxiousness or panic that we all feel. I always wonder when I meet someone who is like us, why are they like that? Whats the reason? I know my reasons and I know what happened in my past to be like this. But I am sure and confident that there is a way through this, and I am sure and confident that as the fears are released that the pressure lessens in the mind. I also believe that this happens for a reason. I am not religious, but I think that and I have said this before too, that there is a higher power at work and maybe at times changes need to come about in our lives that we dont want to make and the only way of getting our attention is to stop us in our tracks. Like this panic and anxoiousness, is it the bodys way of saying STOP, LISTEN. Just a theory. I have to believe this therory because if not to me none of this would make sense. Call it my comfort blanket or my soother but its what keeps me going through very hard times. All the best my friends talk soon.

Anne Posted: 23/01/2009 11:40

Hi Everybody,

KAY, your reply is full of energy and whether you know it or not you are going to come up with an answer to the situation. All that energy/anger is not wasted, it is when you give up and lie down is when you are defeated, your answer will come. As for your anger and disgust towards your husband, I felt it all, on a scale of 1 to 10 he and his parents were below 1. Kay this is not going to last forever, as your letter said maybe it is a test to get us out of our comfort zone and test us. You should just read your own letters you don't need us, you are full of LIFE keep it up.

TOM, I am telling you now something that I have never told anyone other than my husband, I am really scared because I think I am losing my memory, my confidence is at an all time low. I can't remember names and I mean names of things and people I would use every day. my husband said it is because I am panicking. I hope he is right. I have cut myself off from the outside world and I know I am creating a cocoon for myself. I know that it is wrong, we all need eachother we are all full of fear like little children, or maybe I should say I do. Memory, I could write a book on it if I could only remember to start Ha! I try to bring a laugh into everything I do because otherwise I would go down altogether, does my rambling make any sense, I hope it does, God Bless, Anne.

As Tom said, we need eachother, have a calm and peaceful weekend and I will be thinking of ye.

Patricia Posted: 23/01/2009 11:45

Hello to all:

Well, these are anxious times we are living in, for sure. Gloomy news every day in the media. Odd how they never come up with the good news stories, of which there are many!

There can hardly be a person who does not have some kind of problem in his or her life, I suppose. Someone who is ill, caring for someone who is ill, trying to make ends meet, accidents, be the great or small, the usual hitches life throws up every day. All contribute to the sense of anxiety.

I think a problem is that many people think they can somehow "direct" the future, as in, control it to suit what they perceive is "best".. If you think about it for a minute, it is a totally daft idea. But it is guaranteed to produce anxiety. LOL.

The past is history (the past is another country, and they do things differently there!), the future is a mystery, so all we have is the present.

Patricia

Kay Posted: 24/01/2009 11:19

Anne, I feel for you with your memory loss. The worst thing is that the more we panic about things like this they just snowball and blow up until they consume every part of us. We wake up thinking about it and go to sleep thinking about it. I know this probably sounds off the wall but I have felt like this with other stuff. I for example am so afraid that sometimes I wont be able to take any more of this and will actually want to die and by that I mean kill myself. This has been and is a huge worry for me, because the fact is I dont want to die and I want to see my kids grow up and I have a great circle of friends as well as a suportive husband. But when I hear of somebody killing themselves it scares the life out of me and sends me off on this worry/obsessive/anxiety stricken spiral. I have discussed this with my therapist and she says that its a common feeling for someone in oursituation to feel, that they wont make it or that they will just fall apart and see no other way out. So I try to write about it and I will say it to my hubby and let it out. I dont do this as often as I should but sometimes I dont want him to hear me saying the same stuff over and over again.

Anyway I suppose what I am trying to say is, its probably your fear driving this memory loss thing. Its now become the focus of your attention and analysising it over and over again leads to a tired and exhausted mind. Anne, I really feel that you are not loosing your memory, but I feel its running you raged now and taking over everything. Do you have friends who come to see you? Anne, its not healthy to never leave the house. There are days no-one wants to go out and meet anybody, we all have days like that, but I cannt tell you enough how I feel that you should get out even if its just for a short walk. You are very coherant and speak very well on this forum, these are not the symptoms of somebody that is loosing their memory. I hope you feel a little better reading this because my intention was to let you know we all become obsesed with unbalanced thoughts now and again but to do one thing and that is remember they are just thoughts not true , not factual, not real. all the best my friend. Talk soon. Kay.

Tom Posted: 25/01/2009 18:20

Tom here, thanks Patricia, Kay, Anne for your support. Had a session with a Biaura councillor today and it helped somewhat. He had a good tip about when the feeling of anxiousness is overwhelming and that is to sit on a chair and put the 2 feet on the ground and repeat for about 5 minutes that I am grounded. I am going to give it a try.

Kay a lot of my anxiousness arises from my work situations and the job is a solitary job so not a lot of people interaction. I know my thought process is focused negatively, from help I have received I can clearly see this. I am optimistic about changing this in the future now that I am aware of it. Lack of people interaction is not the cause but it does not help. Most of the time on the outside I am fine but very frequently on the inside not good. Overthinking as Patricia has identified is a high feature as well. Thanks for your tip on writing

Kay can I suggest that as regards your husband you try to compartmentilise the current negative feelings and visualise putting them outside the room / house, and leaving them there. You know he is a good man and he no more than you is probably hurting at the moment.

My partner is a very hard working lady and needs time to chill out and takes to the bed regularly at the weekends binge eats and shuts me out completely emotionally speaking. In the beginning I found this very very hard to cope with, thought it was me she was getting at, have now realised that it is not me at all but she is just exhausted and she needs to relieve stress. I do most of the housework for both of us and she gets some well earned rest. The doing of the house work slightly helps my anxiety when it is fever pitch high.