Hey guys,My casual group (about 5~6hrs of raid per week) is having serious issues on cho'gall (10N), although we did quite well until now (it usually took about 1~2 hrs on each new boss to kill it). the biggest problem is dealing with adds, so we want to drop on healer to increase dps on adds. but our options are basically:- Resto shammy respeccing to enhance - Disc Priest going shadow

our resto shammy is on of the best players we have, and the best healer... our priest disc is a very nice guy, but he sucks on dpsing. if we think on the raid comp, a shadow priest would be better to help with the adds.

So, since I'm the raid leader and I usually do the homework for half of my team, do you guys have any SP guide for me to read and help the disc priest do a decent dps?

for the basics guide you might wanna send them to wow.joystiq.com (wow-insider)

ya i know really cutting edge theroy craft, but for just the basics in a nutshell they have some good guides, i normally read them and then read the EJ/Tankspot/MTadin forums just so i have a lil better understanding

Brekkie:Tanks are like shitty DPS. And healers are like REALLY distracted DPSAmirya:Why yes, your penis is longer than his because you hit 30k dps in the first 10 seconds. But guess what? That raid boss has a dick bigger than your ego. Flex:I don't make mistakes. I execute carefully planned strategic group wipes.Levie:(in /g) It's weird, I have a collar and I dont know where I got it from, Worgen are kinky!Levie:Drunk Lev goes and does what he pleases just to annoy sober Lev.Sagara:You see, you need to *spread* the bun before you insert the hot dog.

Is VT/DP about to drop? Refresh (supposedly it's a dps loss if you refresh them early to give them the boosted effect from ES after the initial casting, so use MF until they're about to drop.)

If VT/DP has plenty of time: MF.

Target <25% / low on mana / moving and dots don't need to be refreshed? SW: Death (Masochism should be in your spec for mana returns and reduced self-damage from SW: D)

ES about to drop? If you have orbs, then MB, else MF to get orbs (generally you'll be able to generate at least 1 orb prior to ES dropping, you want to try and keep 100% uptime on ES.)

3 orbs? If Mind Blast is off CD, then Mind Blast, unless ES is already up with enough time to refresh any dots that are about to fall off.

In short, my priorities:

ESVTDPMB (3 orbs)MFSW: D (can be moved up in cases stated above)

---------Few key points:

On single target, once you've cast SW: P the first time, you shouldn't have to hard cast it again (MF should be refreshing it via talents.)

More often than not, Shadow Fiend is utilized to boost dps more than for mana returns (though if you KNOW you have mana issues, sometimes it's better to save it until your mana is below 90%, since it's a larger dps loss to use Dispersion mid-fight unless you're in a transition phase, but a glyphed SW: D is great for mana gains.) Dark Archangel should be used liberally (unless there is a "blow cds" part of a particular fight, then you'll likely want to make sure it's up for this) as it's a great dps increase + returns 25% of your mana with 5 stacks of Dark Evangelism.

For multi-target, generally you'll dot everything with VT (and SW:P if your mana can handle it) followed by Mind Sear. I prioritize the dots over Mind Sear since it's generally more damage per mana/cast time. Just keep in mind, you'll likely run out of mana on large trash pulls regardless of which direction you take (and focus firing is a valid choice for higher HP trash.)

MF and MS ARE considered dots and receive the effect of ES.

On trash, if they aren't going to last long enough for your dots to get a full effect... use Mind Spike/MB. Don't bother with dots on these mobs since MS removes them anyway.

Dot clipping no longer exists, so you want to try and refresh your dots as close to them being about to drop as possible without actually letting them fall off (unlike a hot healer, which wants things to drop off to get the full effect, dots continue to tick, instead of resetting when you "clip" them, hence the desire to refresh prior to them dropping.)

---------Reforge:There is quite a bit of debate, but haste seems to be the clear winner after Int (based on sims, but in reality if you aren't able to notice your dots missing rather quickly, then hit/spir definitely becomes more important.) After those, Crit/Mastery are roughly equal. A quick note about hit/spirit, if you have a healing OS (which you said your guy is Disc) then spirit is generally better than hit so you don't have to switch gear between specs, but hit gained from spirit doesn't transfer to your Shadow Fiend, which could potentially hurt mana gains/bonus dps.

Just one question, there are some people saying that after the MB buff (4.0.6a if I'm not mistaken) its a dps loss to hold it for 3 orbs, that you should use it on CD (if you have at least 1 orb). any thoughts on that?

Just one question, there are some people saying that after the MB buff (4.0.6a if I'm not mistaken) its a dps loss to hold it for 3 orbs, that you should use it on CD (if you have at least 1 orb). any thoughts on that?

Thanks again

I guess the real answer would be: It depends on the timer on your Empowered Shadow. The true benefit to using Shadow Orbs + MB is keeping the ES buff up.

Last time I checked the sims pointed to it being a dps loss to hold for three orbs as well as creating a chance for Empowered Shadows to fall off. This was a while ago, and I don't play Shadow enough to care, so I just drop it on cooldown.

I don't hold it for 3 orbs, that's why I prioritize Empowered Shadows first... meaning if you have 1 orb and ES is about to fall off...use MB. If you still have 10 secs on ES and have 3 orbs... use MB. As far as how the sims calculate that out, idk, but that's what I do and assuming my latency isn't hindering me too much, I do pretty well (I've broken 10k dps on some regular mode fights with my current gear {323 ilvl}, though my average is 7-8k.)

I mainly play as a Prot/ret pally. When I want to have fun however I switch to my Spriest.Feel free to look me up on the Armory, name is Iair on Farstriders. My priest is far from geared. I have two 359 pieces, I'm still rocking at least 1 green, and a few 333 blues. Not that I don't play, I just don't care enough to farm instances for the drops that I really need. I consistently pull 12k+ in 10 man fights with the few simple rules that I follow.1) Mobs that die in less than 10 seconds, do not DOT, just Spike 3 times then MB. When in execute range PW:D on CD. 2)If the mob won't be killed ridiculously fast, I start with VT then DP and finally SWP. From that point it's fish for an orb and cast MB once the first orb procs. After that the rotation is simple. Watch empowered shadow and don't let that fall, refresh DOTs before they fall off. I try to time the DOTs to be refreshed between 2 seconds and .5 seconds. Mind blast on CD as long as you have 1 or more orb.

Obviously low mobility fights, like Baradin Hold, the DPS will be obscenely high, I usually hit 12.5k while being the only person dispelling! My gear is not optimized, yet I rarely run low on mana. I do not use PW:D for mana, it's a DPS loss. I try to save Shadow fiend for heroism/bloodlust/timewarp, for extra DPS and not MP/5. Since I am an herbalist I will use lifeblood on CD, or if it's a shorter fight, I'll use it at the start and then save it for Hero and SF. I save dark evangelism for when I hit 70% mana and then use it on CD. If you do start running low on mana then feel free to pepper PW:D. Keep in mind that PW:D is a net DPS loss and should not be used unless you are in execute range or need the mana.

A lot of this I pulled from shadowpriest.com, but it mostly mirrors what I've been doing (possibly because I read it way back when ) and I'm posting it here for the work impaired.

Stat priorities/Reforging:

1. If an item does not have haste on it, reforge it for the maximum amount of haste.2. If an item has haste, reforge the secondary stat to hit/spirit.3. After steps 1 and 2, if you are under hit cap, sacrifice haste to reach cap. If you are over hit cap, trade some hit for crit or mastery (whichever is stronger for you*).

Your aim with reforging should be to have the most haste possible and secondly to reach as close to your hit cap (17%) as possible without being over. It's ok to be a little under the hit cap as long as you've maxed out your haste.

Prime - MF, SW: D, SW: PMajor - Fade (suggested), and any two of Inner Fire, Psychic Scream, Mass Dispel, Spirit Tap (I actually use PS, MD and IF since I don't typically have agg issues and don't have Phantasm)Minor - Fading, Fortitude, Levitate (though really you can pick any you want, nothing stands out as a must have)

8/0/31 includes all the mandatory talents, leaving 2 floating points. I've picked up 2 points in Inner Sanctum (primarily for Rags) though previously I had Psychic Horror and the final point in Mental Agility.

-----Other Stuff:

Most of what was posted in Key Points above remains true, however for AoE of 4+ mobs, Mind Sear (targeting a tank/melee is ideal so you don't have to switch targets/waste mana because targets died early.) I generally dot up the "biggest" mob (think Greater Scorpions in FL trash packs) then go into Mind Searing (works especially well if you get an Orb and have ES rolling.)

Try to time DA with procs/buffs to get the most out of itSF has to be out BEFORE heroism/BL to get the effect, other than that, its stats aren't "saved" when summoned, it updates as your procs change.

If I'm missing anything that you want to know, ask and I'll answer it to the best of my knowledge (or look it up if I'm not sure )

Oh, I suppose it's important to note, the reforging/stat priorities above assume you're receiving Dark Intent or can reach at least 2589 Haste (2435 for Goblins.) If neither is true, you can go as low as 1601 Haste (extra DP tic) then reforge to Mastery. If there is a chance you'll get DI, your best bet is to hover around 2141 (to ensure extra VT tic when you do have DI.)

theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.

I'll have to give it a look when I get home, though if anyone else is knowledgeable and can see it, feel free.

Edit: One thing I should probably ask, are you refreshing your dots before they drop off or after? Because you should be aiming to refresh them BEFORE they drop off to maximize dps. DP can be refreshed whenever (imp. DP makes it so you don't lose damage for refreshing early, making it ideal for movement heavy fights.) VT should be refreshed as close to it falling off as possible (within .5 seconds if you can, but a little earlier won't mess with your dps too much.)

Did you change realms? Cause the only character I'm seeing with your spelling is a gnome priest on Ravencrest.

Edit: Assuming that is your priest... I don't see anything wrong with your spec. I'd probably grab SW:D instead of Dispersion for a Prime though, unless you just REALLY have issues with mana, but between Dark Archangel and t12 2pc Shadowfiend, you shouldn't be having issues outside of spammed AoE. You also appear to be missing head/shoulder enchants.

I don't know, I'm trying to follow what shadowpriest.com says but my DPS won't go any higher. Can it just be the 359 healing weapon?

theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.

Your weapon is probably holding you downSecond trinket is shit for DPS. Too much of the item budget is taken up by the potion boostSpec's fine, no issue there

I dunno. Shadow and Affliction are both tricky to play. I'm horrible at both, always have been and always will be, something about it just doesn't click. Having said that though I was doing 20k in 359 gear, so I'm not sure what your problem is. :/

theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.

theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.

It's probably just a practice issue. Dot based specs require (at least in my opinion) more finesse than most of the other specs do. Knowing when to do what just takes time and a feel for the spec and fight.

Levantine wrote:Well there were blue trinkets that were better than the stone, so yeah. Volcano is a good buy though, it's horrendously overbudget, I believe it was BiS until like, heroic firelands trinkets.

I'm still using DMC:V, if that tells you anything. Variable Pulse Lightning Generator (the one from Rags) is the only possible upgrade for me from FL. It does look like there are some pretty decent ones from DS (I don't remember if the LFR versions are better than DMC:V, but the normal/heroic versions should definitely win out.)

Levantine wrote:It's probably just a practice issue. Dot based specs require (at least in my opinion) more finesse than most of the other specs do. Knowing when to do what just takes time and a feel for the spec and fight.

Well putting a huge warning in the middle of the screen anytime DP and VT are low (< 5 sec) kind of improved my dot uptime.

Also, after a read to sp.com, they say to use Mind Blast on cd (even without orbs) and refresh dots even if I don't have ES. However higher progressed sp friends tell me to never use MB without orbs and don't refresh a dot if I don't have ES.

...Confused?

theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.