yes I did Dub, I know all about carb backloading and IF, and have used them both myself in the past. I was just highlighting the fact that 40% carbs is high for cutting fat. The OP was talking ratios so that is what I addressed.

_________________Stu Ward_________________Let thy food be thy medicine, and thy medicine be thy food.~HippocratesStrength is the adaptation that leads to all other adaptations that you really care about - Charles Staley_________________Thanks TimD

yes I did Dub, I know all about carb backloading and IF, and have used them both myself in the past.

Just out of curiosity and total offrail, how did they work for you? What were your feelings about them?

awesome. Dropped two notches on my belt pretty much overnight and actually gained weight. Lifts all went up too. The fasted workouts weren't anywhere near as bad as I thought they'd be.

Only thing I noticed is the fat loss plateaued quite quickly. Could've probably gotten around that by cutting a bit more carbs but I wasn't really prepared to do that. It can be a bit of a struggle to do a day's worth of eating in 8 hours too but you get used to it.

I highly recommend the leangains 16/8 approach. Only reason I stopped was I wanted to do a more extreme bulk. I'll definitely go back to it in the future, but I might try a more Warrior Diet (google it) approach. Apparently fasting too often can jack your cortisol levels right up, which the Warrior Diet should, theoretically, avoid.

OK cheers for all the replies guys... really appreciate it. It's Saturday morning over here, so I'm going to do up a diet plan, one for training days and one for non-training, and then go shopping. I understand about how some people hate to calorie count or put a percentage on macros but I'm a chronic over eater always have been (I blame me being an only child for that) so to keep strict its important for me to detail it specifically. It is also why I like to eat 7-8 "meals" per day. I'll get back to you guys in a tick.

I'm going to aim for 2000 calories on non training day with a 20/20/60 split and 2300 on training days with a 30/20/50 split

Hello again guys, above are the links to my reworked diet on training and non training days. You'll just have to put the dot in, as I'm not allowed to post active links or images, and if I try copy+paste it, it comes out like gobbledygook.

In summary though training days I'm having 2300 calories with a 25c/20f/55p split and on non training days I'm having 2000 calories with a 20c/20c/60p split. I'm finding it hard to up my fats, leaving me with massive protein intakes, which I can handle for now. I'm going shopping now, so I'll look for another yoghurt that might help with my fats. I'm also eating 7-9 eggs a day now Robert ;-)

FYI, I train sometime between 4:30-6:30 (hence the pre and post workout shakes)

About the water. Bob said "don't sweat the small stuff", but this ain't small stuff.

If you are drinking that much because you are that thirsty, you need a medical evaluation focusing on possible diabetes, as well as a few less common things.

If you are drinking that much because you have believe myths about more water being better for you, you could be harming yourself. Stop following some water goal, and drink only when you are thirsty, and only enough to keep you from being thirsty for a few hours. Your body has great regulatory mechanisms for thirst, so that it can keep a whole bunch of metabolic functions in balance. Don't mess it up by forcing more water than it needs or can handle.

_________________Our greatest fear should not be of failure, but of succeeding at things in life that don't really matter.--Francis Chan

You have some broccoli there but that's about all the veg you have. Add some other fibrous vegetables. You don't have to count them in your calories since they are negligible, but the provide the micro-nutrients you need and they fill you up. You need some variety. Garlic, onions, peppers, mushrooms, tomatoes, greens, etc. You can cook them up with your meat, serve them on the side, or put them in a salad. Hove some with each meal. A couple of pieces of fruit or some berries eat day would also be good. Add a small handful of mixed nuts and you're good.

_________________Stu Ward_________________Let thy food be thy medicine, and thy medicine be thy food.~HippocratesStrength is the adaptation that leads to all other adaptations that you really care about - Charles Staley_________________Thanks TimD

You have some broccoli there but that's about all the veg you have. Add some other fibrous vegetables. You don't have to count them in your calories since they are negligible, but the provide the micro-nutrients you need and they fill you up. You need some variety. Garlic, onions, peppers, mushrooms, tomatoes, greens, etc. You can cook them up with your meat, serve them on the side, or put them in a salad. Hove some with each meal. A couple of pieces of fruit or some berries eat day would also be good. Add a small handful of mixed nuts and you're good.

Yeah I just put the broccoli there for an example, I don't think I could handle 7 days a week of just broccoli haha. I usually have a mix of fresh broccoli, bok choy, and frozen mixed veges, and mushrooms sometimes.. plus I put jalapeños in my omelettes. I'm also thinking about putting in 50g almonds with one of the meals to up my fat content.

If you are drinking that much because you have believe myths about more water being better for you, you could be harming yourself. Stop following some water goal, and drink only when you are thirsty, and only enough to keep you from being thirsty for a few hours. Your body has great regulatory mechanisms for thirst, so that it can keep a whole bunch of metabolic functions in balance. Don't mess it up by forcing more water than it needs or can handle.

I'll take your advice on board, I honestly do think I am drinking too much water... I'll try keep it to 3-4 litres a day.

Also read up on carb backloading after you guys just mentioned it, and I could easily adjust my diet to suit that, just by putting the rice from my first chicken meal into my second, and removing the wheat biscuit from breakfast, and replacing it somewhere else post workout. Is it worth giving that a try considering my current goals?

Just looking a little closer at my diet that I posted above (which I drew up on myfitnesspal) and realised the information for broccoli is way off. There is no way there is 12g of carbs in a cup of broccoli.. there is another broccoli entry which seems to be more correct (about 7% carbs)

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