Simply not true. Obama has shown leadership all through his political career and as far back as his days at Harvard as president of the Harvard Law Review.

people 'forget' this stuff...the first black president of the review to boot...

he has as much experience, both life and professional as Abe Lincoln had...

but PTA member, city council & mayor of a town of 9000 and governeor of a cash flush state which runs itself...

there is a reason the AK capital is landlocked in a very small town and you can't drive there, only fly or boat...keep the politicians out of everyones way...

being governor of AK would be the same as running a large school district...not a big deal...like all other states the governor does nothing, it's the legislature that runs the state...and each dept. head...
the gov is a figure head and can't make law or spend money without approval

at least he didn't lead a life of failure like bush:
Although not accepted to the University of Texas School of Law in 1970, he accepted a transfer to the Alabama Air National Guard in 1972 to work on a Republican senate campaign, and in October 1973 he was discharged from the Texas Air National Guard. lol, couldn't even get into this 2nd rate school with all of daddies connections...at least they kept him out of Nam

During this time Bush had multiple accounts of alcohol abuse[/b]. In one instance, Bush was arrested near his family's summer home in Kennebunkport, Maine for driving under the influence of alcohol at the age of thirty on September 4, 1976. He pleaded guilty, was fined US$150, and had his Maine driver's license suspended until 1978.

so he lost an election:
In 1978, Bush ran for the House of Representatives from Texas's 19th congressional district.

he's a religious nutcase:
He proclaimed June 10, 2000 to be Jesus Day in Texas.

so his only political experience was a 2 term governor of TX
and yet he could not point out Iran on a map!

and he was qualified??...then again looking at the smoking rubble in his wake, perhaps not...so much for 'exceutive' experience...

it's the person I'm voting for, not his 'experience', it means nothing...especially if garnered because your daddy was rich and connected...

And what provides the inspiration for the person to vote for? Is it party based or speech based?

I'll keep the experience aspect in mind when/if I go in for surgery.

you want a 47 yr old doctor with the newest techniques, 10 years experience, and a Harvard degree, top of the class...

or a 72 yr old, 3rd from the bottom of his class in some 3rd world country medical school, with shaky hands and antiquated mindset...

generally, less experienced are more cautious, therefore make less 'common' mistakes...although experience may help in more unique scenarios...

it's character based...and it's logic, not inspiration
there is no resume for this job...other than the Constitutional requirements, which he fits, and some say mccain doesn't...

this is why mccain will lose:
WASHINGTON DC (CNN) -- A new poll suggests that President Bush is the most unpopular president in modern American history.

A CNN/Opinion Research Corp. survey released Thursday indicates that 71 percent of the American public disapprove of how Bush is handling his job as president.

"No president has ever had a higher disapproval rating in any CNN or Gallup Poll; in fact, this is the first time that any president's disapproval rating has cracked the 70 percent mark," said Keating Holland, CNN's polling director.

CNN Senior Political Analyst Bill Schneider adds, "He is more unpopular than Richard Nixon was just before he resigned from the presidency in August 1974."

President Nixon's disapproval rating in August 1974 stood at 66 percent

even FOX has approval at only 28%...and they are joined at the hip (replacement)

not really...it's my results record they care about...
and how I treat them
you can have a lot of bad experience too...

which is better? 10 years good, 20 years 50/50?

I know many guys with more 'experience' who couldn't engineer an erection

Precisely, results speak more than anything else. And 10 years of positive results is always better. In my nearly twenty years in the industrial sector, not all projects have gone smoothly; most have though. But how you handle adversity and challenge will determine the customer's desire to work with you again.

Just out of curiosity, what area do you work in?

Back to the topic, the next coming months will reveal much about the way these candidates and their supporters handle themselves. And how they handle themselves will be the primary pieces we have to go on, IMO.

Precisely, results speak more than anything else. And 10 years of positive results is always better. In my nearly twenty years in the industrial sector, not all projects have gone smoothly; most have though. But how you handle adversity and challenge will determine the customer's desire to work with you again.

Just out of curiosity, what area do you work in?

Back to the topic, the next coming months will reveal much about the way these candidates and their supporters handle themselves. And how they handle themselves will be the primary pieces we have to go on, IMO.

I'm the president of a 40 person consulting firm, it's 106 years old, I'm the 4th one...
I have a dual BS in EE and ME and a MSEE
municipal/industrial water/wastewater
industrial construction
power

you hit the nail on the head:
anyone can be 'good' when things are going well
it's when they turn to shyte that the cream rises...
it's how you recover from the inevitable mistakes we all make...

I'm not big on either...
but I think we need a new way of thinking, the cold war mindset is done...
seriously though, mccains vp pick makes me question his judgement...
she's a nobody with no education nor experience who had a charmed life...
I'ld be saying the same if obama picked someone like that

it was a political move, god help us if she ever has to step up to PoTUS

I'm the president of a 40 person consulting firm, it's 106 years old, I'm the 4th one...
I have a dual BS in EE and ME and a MSEE
municipal/industrial water/wastewater
industrial construction
power

Good to see a colleague in here even if we have some conflicting views.

Not a consultant but VP of Engineering Services for a rep firm for industrial measurement and control instrumentation; Siemens process instruments, Foxboro I/A DCS, now the CitectSCADA distributor in portions of the southeast (was the FactoryLink rep for ten years) to name a few lines which would be closer to your market. We also do quite a bit in discrete manufacturing as well with test and measurement instruments; force, displacement, dimensional, etc. Although the company’s primary focus is mainly sales, my group provides the often needed support and implementation of some of our products.

Municipal is an area we may potentially try to get stronger in. But most recently pharma has been out biggest market.

Good to see a colleague in here even if we have some conflicting views.

Not a consultant but VP of Engineering Services for a rep firm for industrial measurement and control instrumentation; Siemens process instruments, Foxboro I/A DCS, now the CitectSCADA distributor in portions of the southeast (was the FactoryLink rep for ten years) to name a few lines which would be closer to your market. We also do quite a bit in discrete manufacturing as well with test and measurement instruments; force, displacement, dimensional, etc. Although the company’s primary focus is mainly sales, my group provides the often needed support and implementation of some of our products.

Municipal is an area we may potentially try to get stronger in. But most recently pharma has been out biggest market.

I just wonder if we have run into one another at some point.

differences with respect is what it's all about

I was VP Operations for a large control contractor that specialized in Pharma/Bio process control...
did work in NC for Cardinal near Raleigh
all over in fact...
we used Iconics f/e and proprietary I/O and controllers

pharma was the largest, now it seems to be water/wastewater, in large part because of government money and old neglected infrastructure...
times are good, we have >3 years of backlog and much work being negotiated

I was VP Operations for a large control contractor that specialized in Pharma/Bio process control...
did work in NC for Cardinal near Raleigh
all over in fact...
we used Iconics f/e and proprietary I/O and controllers

pharma was the largest, now it seems to be water/wastewater, in large part because of government money and old neglected infrastructure...
times are good, we have >3 years of backlog and much work being negotiated

I agree. We can debate here all we want. But in the end, we are all individuals making a living and we won't solve any political matters here.

I will need to say boo to Iconics (even though it is a decent HMI). It is funny that you mention it as we do not sell it directly but indirectly through Siemens. Moore had their 353 controller line and expanded it with the Procidia control system (think of a Barney the dinosaur Purple colored PLC) just before Siemens acquired Moore. The portion (or portions) of Siemens we represent includes all of the Moore products. Moore/Siemens packages Iconics (labeled as iWare) with the Procidia system. We recently finished a controls upgrade using Procidia at a chemical manufacturer north of Rome, GA. It was only about 500 I/O with three simple reactors. My guys actually said the integration with the controls platform and Iconics was probably the best hybrid DCS available.

On a semi-political topic. We are doing the controls programming on a carbons to liquid process in the Durham area. So there is some push for alternative fuels and energy and will continue to be an interesting project. It is starting with a small reactor but should provide insight on abilities.

On the pharma side, our salesman out of Raleigh lives in that market and rightfully so considering the growth of that market there.

I would like for our engineering group to do more in muni as our only real experience, albeit a large project, was supporting CH2MHill on a FactoryLink project at the Alexandria Sanitation Authority's large waste water plant. We continue to sell products but would like to sell our services as well.

I gotta agree with most people here. McCain made a stupid move to try to pick up stupid voters (which, to be fair, is a lot of them), but he's going to shoot himself in the foot with people who are actually educated.

I gotta agree with most people here. McCain made a stupid move to try to pick up stupid voters (which, to be fair, is a lot of them), but he's going to shoot himself in the foot with people who are actually educated.

so a fellow repub who knows her well, in fact from the same small town...

And some in Alaska aren't Palin-boosters. The Anchorage Daily News says local politicians are "stunned." Republican state Senate President Lyda Green, who, along with Johnson, is from Palin's hometown of Wasilla, said: "She's not prepared to be governor. How can she be prepared to be vice president or president?"

State Senate President Lyda Green said she thought it was a joke when someone called her at 6 a.m. to give her the news.

“She’s not prepared to be governor. How can she be prepared to be vice president or president?” said Green, a Republican from Palin’s hometown of Wasilla. “Look at what she’s done to this state. What would she do to the nation?”

State House Speaker John Harris, a Republican from Valdez, was astonished at the news. He didn’t want to get into the issue of her qualifications.