apocalypse now

Live Bloog 2: Wisconsin Recall Television Bloogaloo

Hello, it is almost time for your live-bloog of the tellyvision to begin, where we will sit and watch it for the next three hours or so and all tear our hair at the same time shrieking WHERE IS WAUKESHA? (It is in Wisconsin, idiot. Everybody knows that.) No no no, WHERE ARE THE WAUKESHA VOTES? Oh right, they are in Kathy Nickolaus’s toolshed, behind the Miracle-Gro. FOR SAFETY you guys, leave Kathy Nickolaus alone!

Anyhoo, get your beverages. Your Wonkette is out of beer and wine, and the rest of her liquor bottles have one half inch of EXTREMELY SUSPICIOUSLY watery-looking liquor in the bottom of each. (Teen kid.) But there is one new bottle of Stoli, ice, and limes. See you on the flip side.

8:05 PM — This nice lady on The Ed Schultz Show is explaining that 119 % turnout is actually not a Chicago/ACORN joke, it is a possible true number, due to same-day registration. That is a good clarification to know! (GOOD FOR CHICAGO UNION THUGZ.)

8:08 PM — It is sort of annoying to watch a news show with a hooting partisan audience, maybe? (The only hooting partisan audience we like is YOU.) So we have switched it over to the nonpartisan O’Reilly Factor. Did you know he is an Independent? Sure, why not! It is “true.”

5:14 PM — Once you are done reading Charles P. Pierce, on kid troubles at the polls over at Esquire, YOU COME RIGHT BACK HERE. No lollygagging around reading the rest of his brilliances! You get home!

Beverly Hills surgeon explains at home fix for crepey skin around the arms, legs, and stomach.

“This is what I did,” she told the guy from the election board, who was sitting on a window sill, while an observer from the state Democratic party looked on. “I took the turnout from 2008 and 2010 and I averaged them, and I ordered 1100 ballots for 203. They sent me 700. And I’m also thinking that my own estimate was low. So, I sent something I thought was low, and they didn’t even send me that many. The rest of them are back in the warehouse. Now, I’m thinking there’s going to be a rush at about five o’clock when people get out of work, and they’re telling me to call them when I get down to 100 ballots left. I’m going to call them when I have 200 ballots left, just to make sure there’s enough time for them to get here.”

Good luck, nice poll lady!

8:31 PM — Some person on twitterz reminds us of this greatness, dedicated to all the ACORN Thugz.

8:40 PM — This ancient person on The Ed Show tells us that Wisconsin was the first state, in 1959, to allow public unions to bargain collectively. #learning

8:50 PM — Oh. Horrors.

9:01 PM — The polls are totally not closing any time soon, so your Editrix will tell you a tragic tale of woe. (The Stoli is kicking in, we are pretty sure.) Once, in a small seaside California town, there was SUCH A CLOSE ELECTION. It was for County Supervisor. And one guy was a dick, and the other guy was an awesome veterinarian Mr. Cool Guy. And it was so close that there were a million recounts, and it came down to the provisional ballots (which you cast when for some reason they lost your name at the precinct.) Well! The county had fucked up the precincts on the sample ballots — the county had — and when people called the county registrar they were told to vote provisionally, and they did, and then they came to court and testified about all of it, and the judge, a Reagan appointee, ruled that the onus was on them to figure out their proper precincts EVEN THOUGH EVEN THE FUCKING COUNTY REGISTRAR WASN’T SURE, and invalidated all their ballots and Mr. Cool Guy Awesome Veterinarian lost, and the dick Republican won.

Our point (if we have one?) is FUCKIN ARGH YOU GUYS we think we might be already drunk. Also: this is not going to come down to “turnout.” It is going to come down to some fucking Walker-appointee judge.

9:31 PM — How will you kill yourself? Probably poison, don’t you think? Yes, “poison” sounds nice. TIME TO FREAK OUT. (For the next five weeks.)

9:53 PM — Confidential to the person whose Google search “Who tried to assassinate Gerald Ford” brought him to Wonket: IT WAS SQUEAKY FROMME, and the other one whose name no one knows because she was not named “Squeaky.”

9:56 PM — NBC has called the race for Scott Walker. We will believe it when we sober up and see it.

10 PM — DING DING DING! Commenter “Barto” figured out the mystery of the tragic county supervisor race. It was Bill Wallace, in Santa Barbara, and there has never been a fact in the history of the universe that has not been discovered by one commenter or another. Barto gets … nothing, as per usual.

WHO CALLS A RACE WITH 21 PERCENT? What kind of fucking nonsense is that?

10:06 PM — Seriously, we are not buying it AT ALL. We have vague hazy memories of other times a race has been called before it was won — can’t quite place where! — and we carry no brief for NBC. FO SHO.

10:10 PM — Well we for seven (please don’t make us do math) hope to fuck Tom Barrett doesn’t do anything stupid like CONCEDE before the fucking VOTES are counted. It’s just this weird hangup, we know, wanting to see the actual numbers. Haha, so silly, us!

10:27 PM — And now we shall pass out in a puddle of our own vague discontent (and limey vodka). Y’all hang out and watch the tellyvision without us. Someone please be sure to lock up when you leave.

Wisconsin has same-day registration; that percentage is "119% of voters registered pre-election".

Not that this'll stop Breitbart from arguing it to be proof that ACORN tried to steal the election, of course.

Lionel[redacted]Esq

Why, were their fake pimps seen in Madison?

tessiee

Yes, leaning against the palm trees.

barto

Miraculously, voter turnout in some areas is up to 119% (say whaaa?) Apparently latest librul vote fraud tactic is hiding voters in the woodshed until election time. Basterds!

ProgressiveInga

Is there an echo in here???

Boojum

Either that or same day registration.

VOTUR FROD!!!!

Antispandex

Voter turn out is actually down 1%. The Republinuts were aiming for an even 120. More proof of Democratic election fraud. I AM THE 119% !!! (I really don't live there, but this would be a fun time to be in the Cheese State).

Limeylizzie

I am sitting in sunny LA on our deck watching hummingbirds and finches, my trusty cats, Neville and Fiona by my side and I see this fucking, cuntish, lop-sided, wall-eyed freak and I wonder if God is in His Heaven and if all is right with the world.

chascates

Didn't go to the Diamond Jubilee? I loved the family swaying to the 'Hornpipe' which I believe is actually titled 'Jack's a lad' or something like that.

I posted this just for you last night, Ll, but in case you didn't see it, I know you get hot over uniforms so I thought you'd like this.

BearNoLike

Offshore-country-starting… well… effing whackos, really, when you think about it.

Seriously, though? Who would be dumb enough to invent a currency that could unite disparate cultures with similar core interests that equalize and support economies that would regularly trade anyway, and wait look a flotilla.

Nice Hat, Old. West Ham are you serious???!?!?!@#$P#@FOOK

Beanball

Prince Phillip is a Greek. Greek, I tell you.

And yes, the House of Windsor is actually the House of Saxe-Coburg.

Which is wut makes them fookin Brits.

Negropolis

But, Katie Middleton is from the isles and Diana brought in some native blood, so you'll have a fairly indigenous monarch one of these days.

But so what if we got 8 years of W, Nader voters got to stay pure and anyway Bush and Gore were EXACTLY THE SAME!! Obama's just as bad as Romney because he's not perfect on a few issues so vote for the racist woman-hating lunatic Ron Paul instead, because of pot and war!

Diabeetis

I don't support Paul, either, sorry. Nice try, though.

And Gore actually lost because of the Supreme Court and vote fraud, the latter of which the Democrats were too gutless to call for investigations into.

SorosBot

And because of everyone who voted for Ralph Nader, which was the exact same fucking thing as voting for George W. Bush.

tessiee

Granting that Gore ran a pretty half-assed campaign, thereby making the election easier for Jebbie and the Supremes to steal — Nader didn't take any votes away from bush.

Wile E. Quixote

Oh for fuck's sake. Saying that Gore lost because of Nader is like saying that Gore lost because of everyone who voted for the Socialist Worker's Party in Florida. Seriously, if everyone who voted for the SWP had voted for Gore instead of the SWP candidate Gore would have won Florida. Gore lost because he was a shitty campaigner, because he picked a completely useless piece of shit as his VP and because the Supremes got involved. If Gore had won his home state of Tennesee, which Clinton/Gore won in 1996 he would have been president.

Doktor StrangeZoom

I'm way too lazy to look up the numbers, but didn't the fuckups caused by the butterfly ballots in Palm Beach County alone outnumber the intentional votes for Nader statewide?

Mind you, Elderly Jews for Buchanan could always make a comeback.

Diabeetis

Exactly. The same people (still) bitching about Nader could just as easily as blamed the other third-party candidates running or the Floridians who didn't vote.

Bill Bradley should have gotten the nomination, or at least been Gore's running mate.

Exactly right, my favorite fact from that 2000 cluster fuck is when the press polled their efforts and actually counted all the votes. Gore team just wanted to recount urban areas, because of course that's where their missing votes would be. He would have lost, Bush team, trying to run out the clock, wanted every county recounted. Done that way, Bush would have lost. We went through the glory hole and it's been weirdness ever since.

Diabeetis

Yeah, because voting for pro-capitalist Democrats (including the one currently in the White House) who have been shafting the working class and the middle class right along with the Republicans for the past four decades is no less folly.

Dr. Nick Riviera

Please. You can argue that there isn't enough of a difference between Dems and Republicans, but you can't argue that one is not significantly better for you than the other unless you are a rich white male who doesn't give a shit about anyone other than yourself.

SorosBot

Oh. so what if many poor women die in back-alley abortions after Roe v Wade is overturned, at least Diabeetis didn't have to sully himself by voting for a Democrat who is not good enough!

Diabeetis

That's a pretty ironic thing to say considering it's actually rich white male liberals who push the lesser-evil nonsense most often (because they're economically and socially cushioned from the negative consequences of broken promises and compromise from the Democratic Party). By contrast, much of the non-white and non-rich Democratic base has gotten fed up and just stays home.

And for the record, I'm part-Latino and have been unemployed for over two years.

Dr. Nick Riviera

The most enthusiastic voters heading into the 2012 election are African Americans and teabaggers. Poor people vote in lower numbers in part because they have a nasty habit of being disenfranchised.

And for the record I'm 100% Latino whatever that has to do with anything.

Diabeetis

Well, you're the one who seemingly implied the only ones who were angry at Obama and the Democratic Party were wealthy white progressives.

Dr. Nick Riviera

lol, no. I said the only people who could argue there is no difference are rich, white males (and let me go ahead and throw in "straight"). And that is because for every single other group there is SOMETHING that Dems offer that Republicans don't. Now, as I originally said, you can say "That's not enough! 2 parties should differ more" but you can't say "Meh, no difference at all" because the only people that could possibly be true of are rich, white, straight males-progressive or not.

Diabeetis

My black Marxist union member friend who sees no difference between the Democrats and Republicans would disagree with you on that.

Dr. Nick Riviera

So would Alan Keyes and Marco Rubio. That doesn't mean they're correct

Wile E. Quixote

And for the record, I'm part-Latino and have been unemployed for over two years.

And for the record I'm a white guy and have one leg. What the fuck does that have to do with anything again?

alteredimages

It means you, the black Marxist, and the unemployed Latino better walk into a bar and start a joke soon.

CapnRadio

If it's the one where, when the bartender asks them, "What'll you have?" they answer "Black Russian," "Margarita on the rocks," and "I'm stumped," I've heard it.

Wile E. Quixote

I see what you did there. Take me! Take me now, you magnificent stallion!

SorosBot

Please. Voting third party is the exact same thing as voting for the Republicans, who much, much worse on shafting the working class (not to mention women, gay people, non-white people, etc).

Why do you want Mitt Romney to be in charge alongside John Boehner and Mitch McConnell?

Diabeetis

Women and non-white people are getting the shaft by the Democrats, too. Try again.

Boojum

But you get a reach around and a snuggle after.

Diabeetis

And you really think the Republicans are going to commit political suicide by actually seeing to it that Roe v. Wade will get overturned?

Oh, and please explain to me how it's different when a Democratic president does the same things as his Republican predecessor (i.e. supporting more neo-liberalism and turning Afghan children into red mist).

Boojum

Yes, I do. And it is different because the Democrat works to ramp it down, instead of up. If McCain had been elected, we would be blowing up Iranians as we speak.

Diabeetis

Obama *has* been ramping it up, and we're getting ready to blow up Iranians any day now.

So dead Afghan civilians are alright with you as long as a Democrat is in charge. Okay, got it.

Boojum

I just read all of your posts, since the beginning. You, sir or madam, are a concern troll. Begone.

SorosBot

Nah, this is a purity troll, not a concern troll; both are very annoying but they are different animals.

Dr. Nick Riviera

Don't forget America's greatest foe: Russia

miss_grundy

We would also be on the way to blowing up Syrians because McCain and Romney are now interested in getting into the fight there. But they haven't volunteered their children for the fight.

Yes, and you get to not change any of that by voting with the other 2% of ideologues for a third party candidate, instead of making a difference by voting in The Much Much Lesser Of Two Evils, (or) the Party That Didn't Start The Two Longest Concurrent Wars In American History That Turn MiddleEastern Children Into Red Mist.

SorosBot

No no, see, Obama and Romney are exactly the same, see, because Obama isn't a 100% perfectly pure liberal and he hasn't used his magic powers to make Congress do whatever he wants to push through a pure liberal agenda that would never really pass.

neiltheblaze

What bothers me most about him is his refusal to wear his Superman costume. We would have had single payer.

He should tell Congress he wants to abolish corporate taxation, disband all social services, and overturn Roe v. Wade. They'd do the exact opposite because Obama said it.

Dr. Nick Riviera

Yes, because they appoint conservative justices to the Supreme Court who do their dirty work for them.

SorosBot

Oh right, so a President Romney wouldn't appoint more Supreme Court Justices like Alito and Roberts who make Scalia look moderate. And Obama doesn't do the exact same thing as W – do you think he would have ever given us health care reform? Or that Gore would have invaded Iraq, or McCain pulled out?

We understand, you want the Republicans to ruin this country so you can claim you were pure by not sullying yourself by voting for a Democrat who is just not good enough. But don't lie to us and claim there is no difference when there are huge differences.

miss_grundy

There will always be people who will never be happy because the Dem isn't pure enough. Have these people been sleeping for the past three years? This man has been called a socialist, a communist, a Kenyan, a terrorist and everything else under the sun. He is the only one who believes in pay equity for women, the right to birth control and abortion, in health care for Americans. What does the other party want? They want this country to turn around and go back about 150 years, so that women, minorities and anybody they don't like do not have any rights in this country. There will always, always, be stupid people who will vote against their own interests. The "purists" are stupid because no one will ever be good enough. These are the people who will cut off their own noses to spite their faces.

SorosBot

I think some of the purity trolls must like being losers. They always want to complain that any given Democrat is really a Republican, regardless of their record, and would rather see Republicans in office then a Democrat who is not quite good enough for them. They'd rather have the country go to hell, so they can say they were fighting the good, pure fight and not making any of those messy compromises like actually voting for the best candidate who can actually win.

But hey, Obama hasn't given us true socialized medicine instead of a compromise that could actually pass, legalized pot, or completely eliminated the military, therefore he's just like Romney/McCain!

kingofmeh

however cynical one is, it's pretty hard to look back and say that president gore would have been just as bad as president bush.

tessiee

Please, Gore couldn't have been worse than bush if he'd personally flown a plane into the World trade Center.

Damn it! If only the Dems had run the undead corpse of Lombardi, they would have walked away with this!

Diabeetis

Oh, great, didn't take for this bullshit to start.

Dr. Nick Riviera

The only things you can count on in life are death and democratic foul-ups

bumfug

If Jonah Goldberg wimps out, maybe Jamie Kilstein can beat the fuck out of Walker instead.

Boojum

Do we have to settle for one or the other? Why not both?

Blueb4sunrise

I'm listening to Townes van Zandt, so that whatever happens in Wisc., It'll be an upper.

chascates

Great songwriter, depressing singer. Into Blaze Foley?

Beowoof

Hey if this isn't enough of a downer try some Jamey Johnson.

Blueb4sunrise

Will check those out for future reference.

Blueb4sunrise

I'm thinking that I may have adopted the wrong strategy…….

TribecaMike

His son JT is a fine writer and musician himself.

fitley

Teabagger votes count as two because of the extra scrotum laying across their forehead.

kingofmeh

exit polls indicate obama leading romney by six points. that's good on two fronts; one, it may indicate strong D turnout, and two, a no vote can't be spun as an anti-obama vote.

JackDempsey1

Prediction: Walker will take the whole enchilada.
And by enchilada, I mean a delicious food substance consumed in places elsewhere, but not here, and certainly not by someone who votes here, because, c'mon.
Prediction (edit): Walker will take the whole enchilada, but will consult with several Koch operatives about how to delicately broach the subject of enchilada consumption.

ThundercatHo

If Walker does take the whole enchilada (and by enchilada I mean a giant, brass studed, superheated dildo) I hope he takes it up the ass. Repeatedly.

tessiee

I don't know, doesn't "enchilada" sound kinda…
brown?
I predict that Walker will take a corn dog, but because of faulty depth perception, will stab himself in the forehead with the stick.

coolhandnuke

As a legally state approved (Oregon) cannabis grower, my green godesses are ready for sampling and tonight is prime for some THC….and drink my bong water Scott Walker you slimy twerp.

chascates

I look forward to making your acquaintance whenever I finally make the move to Oregon.

coolhandnuke

I'm in the North Coast Region–Manzanita–and I will extend a ripe dank olive branch to cement the bond.

neiltheblaze

You hiring?

coolhandnuke

I wish I could spread the health and wealth, but it is a Mom and Pot endeavor.

neiltheblaze

Well, if you ever expand your operation – keep me in mind!

Beowoof

I would love to see the exit polls, as they might give some hope.

Diabeetis

Perhaps Wisconsin Democrats would have had a better shot of kicking Walker out if they had voted for Kathleen Falk in the recall primary instead of, you know, the same guy who lost the first time around.

Not that being thrown under the bus by the Democratic Party elite has helped matters, either, of course.

Negropolis

The Dem nominee could have been Jesus atop a glorious, sparkling unicorn and it would not have mattered. This isn't about who did and didn't come to the state, or who was or wasn't nominated. This is about one party afraid to shoot, and one who will waste your life on a busy , urban sidewalk in broad daylight and call it self defense. This is about one party that doesn't have any qualms about bringing ricin to a knifefight.

When Dems can get over their qualms about what it takes to play to win, maybe we'll actually start winning consistently in competitive races instead of it looking like a crap shoot every time. When all the other side understands is power and force, and all that we're willing is to play "fair", we're going to get similar results, every time.

Does anyone think if the tables were turned and this was the recall of a Democratic governor that there would be a significant section of the Republican electorate that would fret over the very principle of a recall? That's exactly what happened, here.

One of these days, it's going to dawn on the Dems that in order to get into positions of helping people that they are going to have to want to win more than wanting to be "right."

BTW, I'm just glad we didn't spend more money than we did for this mixed result. In a way, it's kind of a good thing that Walker and his Kochwhores had to max out their credit cards to keep his seat and lose the state senate. So, I guess we got the result we we're willing to pay for, maybe.

OT but my Facebook alter ego had an entertaining encounter with some Paulbots while cheating on Wonkette with another blog. I very quickly got one guy to call me a communist and another to suggest that since we live in the same city, we meet up so he can kick my ass, because I am a loser whose ass NEEDS to be kicked. Then he called me an uneducated snark-trolling chode (paraphrasing that) and muttered something about Obama having unleashed the Stuxnet virus, and Stuxnet being responsible for the nuclear reactor meltdown in Japan last year, the result of which is that there is radiation in California now. What that had to do with anything I am not sure, but it was damned entertaining. Those Paulbots can be so much fun. I suppose we should thank Reagan for closing all the mental institutions, otherwise we would have missed out.

cheetojeebus

That Stuxnet is one clever mutha fukkin piece of code, geeze, able to cause a massive tsunami? Crack containment pools for stored rods..wow.

The exact quote was Your President had a hand in creating Stuxnet and may have caused a meltdown worse than Chernobyl and the radiation is in CA… So he didn't actually SAY he was talking about Japan, though I think it's a safe bet.

The first guy was blaming Ron Paul's poor showing in the primaries on the GOP hacking the electronic voting machines. Which actually wouldn't surprise me, but what about states that didn't use those machines? These morons are so far down the rabbit hole they're going to pop up in China.

I would call you out on the "cheating on Wonkette" thing, but in reality we should all be more like you.

chascates

Did he end his screed with "cancel my subscription if I have one"?

GeneralLerong

Isn't Stuxnet so 20 minutes ago? Aren't we all afeared o' Flame now?

tessiee

???

I thought we were all afraid of "bath salts".

Mittens Howell, III

Reading this thread is like walking into Cheers, except everyone is smellier and drunker.

On the upside, Kelsey Grammer wouldn't dare show his pasty face around here.

chascates

MITTENS!!!

Lionel[redacted]Esq

"How's it going Mr. Romney?"

"I've got the old fire in the belly."

"Meaning?"

"Well, I fired 200 people at the pork belly plant."

neiltheblaze

Hey! How's the veal in this joint?

FakaktaSouth

I would like to state for the record that I smell fantastic, like skinny Kirstie Alley maybe, but I say dumb shit like Cliff. AND I have to tell you how much it hurts me that Frazier is such a tool in real life. Just, gross.

neiltheblaze

As long as Niles isn't an asshole, I'm all set.

tessiee

No, he's the shit. I've seen him on a number of different talk shows. He's awesome in real life, too.

coolhandnuke

Last night I had a dream where I was dining with Norm, my girlfriend and Punky Brewster at the Hungry Heifer. I guess I shouldn't mix bacon and Dead Guy Ale after 10 pm.

Dr. Nick Riviera

He only shows up in the finest material like An American Carol or if there are some sexy babysitters around

AncienReggie

I'm pretty sure SorosBot is actually Kelsey Grammer. Or Woody Harrelson, I get them mixed up.

SorosBot

Hey now, I was still in high school when Cheers ended! And I'm probably more like Clavin than anyone else on the show.

tessiee

Cliff Clavin voice/accent:

I, eh, think you're mistaken, theah, Soros. Maaa and I were watchin the History Channel, and it eh, seems that the word "Soros", theah, comes from the ancient Greek for commenta. And then the word "Bot", that's from your ancient Romans, they carried on the tradition by chiselng their comments into clay tablets from the rivahbed, theah.

I have a theory that Nature abhors too much vile rot and will eventually eliminate it. No matter what the outcome, win or lose, there will be corruption charges in Walker's future.

Of course, that theory doesn't work with Dick Cheney or Wall Street bankers since they are Satan incarnate.

chascates

7:23 PM – Today
Herman Cain: If Walker Loses, You May As Well Write Wisconsin Obituary
THEHermanCain @ THEHermanCain : I told @cavuto on @Foxnews: If #scottwalker loses u may as well write obituary for #wisconsin. Dens & unions win right to keep status quo!

DustBowlBlues

Since you're covering winger tweeters, how about letting us know how Sarah explains how this upsets her, the half-term guv.

chascates

She issued a support tweet for him last week and will crow if he wins, ignore if he loses.

TribecaMike

But will she go his bail when the time comes? Or does David Koch already have that covered?

Fukui-sanRadioBarb

As opposed to working people being repeatedly skullfucked for their Ameros until they die a painful, uninsured death?

barto

that Herman is one smart mother-hushyourmouth!

alteredimages

I resent the fact that Walker is wearing a DEVO New Traditionalists hair helmet. He is no spud.

ProgressiveInga

State Senator Lena Taylor on the Ed show. L-O-V-E her!

DustBowlBlues

I refused to make dinner for the Old Man because I knew you guys would be here, but I'm sad I missed saying something rude to my favorite ginger, the barely legal age editor.

Lionel[redacted]Esq

But it is dark out, when Gingers usually scurry about safe from the sun. I"m hoping that Newell will join the fun.

Fukui-sanRadioBarb

He'll scuttle back from a darkened liquor store with smokes and vodka and be with us soon, I expect.

chascates

He'll look 25 when he's 60!

Lionel[redacted]Esq

You know, I used to think Wisconsin would be a neat place to live if I could stand being away from the coast, but between Scott Walker and Greta Van Sustren, I'm wondering if the Eye of Cheney shining down from Wyoming has not cast an evil spell on the entire state.

Well, the Mayor of Milwaukee when we first moved to Wisconsin was a guy name of Frank Zeidler and he was a socialist even while Joltin' Joe McCarthy, the junior senator, was pulling commies out of thin air. That took some huevos, Frank not Joe obvs.

DustBowlBlues

Oklahoma was a socialist state at the Constitutional Convention, then Bill Murray, who would go on to glory as the Guv, Alfalfa Bill Murray, (the guy I mentioned on a thread a few days ago who declared war on Texas) and a few of his cronies ran them out of the state.

commiegirl

Butte, Montana (or was it Missoula?) was lousy with Socialists once too.

Beowoof

Well most modern Americans are not aware of the right wing screwing they will have coming. I am afraid only another depression will make that clear to bring back socialism.

scvirginia

I think of history as cyclical: one generation fights to redress serious injustices & they achieve some progress. The next generation takes that progress for granted & by the 3rd generation, complete amnesia has set in & the labor leaders' grandkids are wondering why businesses must be hamstrung with needless rools, regz & worker protectionz. Then they will get screwed over & the progressive movements will once again look viable & even necessary.

George Skullfry

Probably Missoula. I know there was a branch of my commie Norsk family tree in Missoula.

SorosBot

Wayne: "So, do you come to Milwaukee often?"
Alice Cooper: "Well, I'm a regular visitor here, but Milwaukee has certainly had its share of visitors. The French missionaries and explorers began visiting here in the late 16th century."
Pete: "Hey, isn't "Milwaukee" an Indian name?"
Alice Cooper: "Yes, Pete, it is. In fact, it was originally an Algonquin term meaning "the good land.""
Wayne: "I was not aware of that."
Alice Cooper: "I think one of the most interesting things about Milwaukee is that it's the only American city to elect three Socialist mayors."
Wayne (to the camera): "Does this guy know how to party or what?"

George Skullfry

In grade school in Shorewood (which abuts Milwaukee), I learned that Milwaukee meant, loosely, "place of the stinking waters". Mudflats by the lake, y'know.

TribecaMike

In 1959 yet.

scvirginia

Will this Liveblog stay open through the recount? Just askin'…

Jerri

I hope the Great Dane is serving pitchers of tasty beer, because that will be entertaining TV.

DustBowlBlues

Is this a bar, or are you exceptionally hostile toward your partner?

Jerri

Haha, no, it is a brew-pub about two blocks from the Capitol building. They have lots of fantastic beer, a lovely little beer garden and giant, tasty nachos that I don't at all miss like the dickens right now.

(It is where the Ed Show on MSNBC is broadcasting from right now.)

Lionel[redacted]Esq

Wisconsin Recall drinking game:

1) Every time an announcer says "It's too close to call," Drink

2) Every time you see Scott Walker and want to slap him: Drink.

3) Every time some pundit says this is a referendum on Obama: Drink.

4) Every time some pundit says this represents the death of Unions: Chug.

5) Every time someone says "We are now going to Madison": Take a bong hit.

6) Every time someone says "Walker is leading": finish the bottle and hit yourself over the head with it.

Voted last week here in Tejas. Long line here, too. Got me a "Yo vote' " sticker to piss off the wingnuts (the few that we allow in the People's Republic of Austin).

Jerri

Man, I just want it to be over. This waiting is horrible. Not enough beer/antacids in the world for this right now.

barto

THIS JUST IN: busloads of Canadians being driven to WI polling locations and let out for a "smoke break". No telling what could happen here. As reported by some guy on a mobile phone in hush hush tones to Fox Gnus, he was told to get on the bus so he did it. Smart guy! Now he's an undercover reporter for a major Gnus outlet. Even smarter! Good times!

TribecaMike

The Medicine Hat contingent started brawling with the Ungava Bay crowd, and then a hockey game broke out. At least word, the death toll is in the single digits.

She really did stick up for McCarthy, she's such a nut case! From the June 1 LarryFlynt,com blog:
When the name Ann Coulter is mentioned, a flood of words comes to mind: mean, angry, extremist, conservative, inflammatory, hideous, arrogant, male. Regarding that last adjective, we are speaking specifically of a male who is angry because he looks like a woman — sort of. You could throw the adjective ugly into the mix, but that’s probably redundant. Seriously, how many men have you seen in a dress who are good-looking?

BarackMyWorld

I'm probably in the minority on this, but I think making fun of her looks seems unnecessary considering how ugly she is on the inside.

commiegirl

I'm in the minority with you.

Butch_Wagstaff

Same here. I've never cared for "Annie is a tranny!" jokes. The major reason I object to such jokes is that all the M2F transgendered persons I've met tend to be very smart & extremely tolerant individuals.
EDIT: same for the F2M folks I ever met.

"Seriously, how many men have you seen in a dress who are good-looking?"

From the tv show "My So-Called Life":
Patty: Your brother is always so difficult to get along with.
Graham: He only acts that way because he's insecure.
Patty: Well, that's no excuse. I mean, who Isn't insecure?
Graham [thinks]: RuPaul?
Patty [considers]: Yeah, actually, he seems pretty comfortable with himself.

One more glass and I'm switching from red to white. Almost out of red.

TribecaMike

Ann Coulter lives in Cali? Suddenly, it all makes sense.

flamingpdog

Our editrix lives in California. Have you ever seen the two in the same room at one time? I mean, except for the face, the neck, the boobs, the legs, (?naughty pieces – sorry, BarackMyWorld, I'm kind of in a rotten mood tonight) and the personality, they could be separated at birth!

hey i just got back from hot yoga. cracking open a bottle of cab. feeling good.

anything going on?

Blueb4sunrise

"Justice Clarence Thomas on Tuesday denied a request for an emergency injunction allowing Tombstone to use heavy equipment for work on its spring-fed water system in a Coronado National Forest wilderness area."http://www.roselawgroup.com/blog/wordpress/?p=521…

TribecaMike

Interesting, thanks. Having once lived in the area, I got a chuckle from the article informing its readers of the pronunciation of Huachuca.

I should have run for Congress on my "hey relax, things will work themselves out – now let's party" platform.

coolhandnuke

Anne Coulter: "If he loses the entire country will be California."

Would someone please tweet this rancid crone and remind her about the Gray Davis recall and Arnold.

Beowoof

She should be showing Sean that her dick is bigger than his.

coolhandnuke

I believe it was Bill Maher who described Coulter's penis/pussy as looking like a combination of Spiro T Agnew, three pounds of chewed up bubble gum and Yogi Berra's catchers mitt from the '55 World Series.

Diabeetis

Yeah, but Ahnuld was a "RINO" anyway.

TribecaMike

She knows, but as long it doesn't effect book sales and speechifying fees, she couldn't care less.

A girl brings in a crumpled cable bill. Fills out a sheet. Votes. ‪#milwaukee

Fare la Volpe

MSNBC is forcing Rachel to report that things are "too close to call" with only 1% in.
CNN has Wolf Blitzer's nasty mug saying absolutely nothing, but with more repetition, redundancy, tautology.
FOX News is screaming invective against Obama because, unlike Walker, he's not a "leader."
And HLN is reporting on a gay porn star serial killer cannibal. Lovely.

One of the old bitties who called in referred to the host as "Dr. Jew," so that was a plus.

Lionel[redacted]Esq

What percentage of the vote did the gay porn serial killer get?

FakaktaSouth

How do teevee people say "High turnout usually favors the Democrats" AND "We are a center right country." Both of those things cannot be true at the same time. And don't start with me about how sucky and right wing dems are, y'all know what I am saying.

The two huge protests that I attended last year, the only "bad" behavior I saw were guys lining up tp pee on the Fox News remote truck. I'd have protection too. if I were them. If Walker wins we may have the first instance of a TV remote truck being turned over. These early numbers are coming from the smaller towns, so Walker leading at this point is no surprise.

No, despite the warm Spring (warm March, cool April, normal May). Fuck, everyone is calling it for Walker now. Few results from Milwaukee so far, a third of the vote in from Dane (Madison) County. People still in line to vote in Milwaukee!

barto

"And one guy was a dick, and the other guy was an awesome veterinarian Mr. Cool Guy"

Tonight, the people of Wisconsin rebuked the liberal labor unions’ recall efforts and sent a loud message to President Obama: see you in November.

Donate today to help fight for a better America.

TribecaMike

For weeks, if not months, the polls have shown that Walker would win. Unfortunately, they can't poll the inevitable apocalyptic groans of doom and gloom which resound when one side loses after putting in an immense amount of effort to fight the good fight, but gets outspent by 31-1.

chascates

Greg Mitchell at The Nation:10:10 Howard Fineman tweets: "Exits were hinting at too-close-to-call late night but in the end it was a quick call for Walker — bad news for Dems, unions and Obama."

10:05 GOP leaders on TV claiming some Dems in Wisconsin will stay home in November, angry that Obama did so little on recall. Wonder if true….Lawrence O'Donnell opens MSNBC show by claiming big winner in Wisconsin tonight is…Obama.

10:00 What does it mean that exit polls showed 12% edge for Obama but perhaps easy win for Walker. Anti-union fervor?

flamingpdog

Barry's an old-line moderate Republican?

Dr. Nick Riviera

And nobody has their pulse on the minds of Democrats like GOP leaders on television. Good lord…..

That is all just a sense from many here that a recall in ths case is unwarranted, and the people who sensed that weren't aware of Scott Walker's history with recalls. He was all for them until he became Governor, then he "dropped the bomb" to "Divide and conquer". I thought money wouldn't matter in this, until it did, and upstate, outside of Milwaukee and Madison (and the Progs on Lake Superior) they just didn't have a dog in this fight. The people who felt a recall were unnecessary stayed home but intend to vote in November.

Negropolis

Wai,t Walker l going to end up in prison, right? If that's the case, this will make the loss much easier to swallow. If some weak-assed "indepedents" will is too weak for a recall, or it offends their silly, fucking sensibilities, the law can take out the garbage.

Scooter's dumb as a box of rocks, mean as a snake, and crooked as a street in the medina of Marrakech. This may win you election, but let's see if it keeps you out of jail.

TribecaMike

Independent voters — can't live with 'em, can't afford to rent all the buses it would take to drive all of them over a cliff (although it's the only thing I can think of that might wake them up).

glamourdammerung

Wai,t Walker l going to end up in prison, right?

Assuming someone does not pull that "looking forward" nonsense because they know the Republicans will scream about how it is just revenge for Walker winning the election. Though if they did, and I was Barrett, I would issue a very short, very snide version of "I told you morons so".

in my fantasies Walker's toilet explodes while he's making jailhouse gin in it

Diabeetis

You think Obama and the national Dems are going to regret leaving Wisconsin teachers twisting in the wind? Hopefully they learned something from this.

Dr. Nick Riviera

Wait…weren't you just arguing there is no difference between Democrats and Republicans? If so, what difference does it make if Barrett or Walker wins?

Diabeetis

Just because I think they're both crappy candidates doesn't mean the Democrats didn't have an opportunity to win this.

And I normally don't argue with people about the Democratic Party's worth (or lack thereof), but seeing people still whining about Nader after twelve years sets me off. I'm not even an admirer of Nader's and that shit annoys me.

TribecaMike

The Dems were outspent 31 to 1. I doubt any amount of money the national party put it would've changed a thing.

SorosBot

No, see, it's all Obama's fault, if he had enough willpower he could have made Walker lose!

Crank_Tango

He's morally weak, also.

Dr. Nick Riviera

Holy crap, really? Was it that bad?

George Skullfry

II don't think so. But it was something like 31 to 7 (million), so pretty much the same for all practical purposes.

Yeah, I've been seeing that ratio tossed around for a couple of weeks. I don't know what the Dems were thinking, but if it was along the lines of "We can either deplete our funds to match this now, or husband our resources for the fall and try to win back the House while holding the Senate and the Presidency," then that strikes me as reasonable.

Dr. Nick Riviera

Yeah, unfortunately the millionaires who funded this have very deep pockets that are never depleted.

I though Larry O'Dawg from MSNBC said something about 7:1, which is still almost encouraging, that it took a 7:1 spending ratio for them to get their landslide.

Negropolis

Are you serious? You think Obama putting himself in the middle of this clusterfuck would have changed the results? The exit polls show that Obama still has a good chunk of Walker voters. What he did was smart. It's clear now from the exists that if he would have gone in, Barrett still would have lost, and Obama would have alienated that very strange voter that votes for Walker and him both.

George Skullfry

I don't think we'll know what the final margin is until Milwaukee reports, so it may be premature to judge the effect of the DNC and Obama's hands-mostly-off policy. I'll agree that it was the safest thing to do as far as the Presidential race goes, but as a Democrat for 43 years now, I sometimes wish the national establishment would just do the right thing.

Dr. Nick Riviera

Yeah. But the truth is, Walker will do a lot less damage than Romney and a less corrupt justice system might throw ol' cross eyes in prison anyway for his various crimes.

And I think they were using this as a test case for the difference unlimited fundraising is going to make. Because honestly…if you can't get rid of this scumbag…?

George Skullfry

Fair enough. The Presidency is a much bigger deal than a mid-level governorship (based on SCOTUS appointments alone), even for the folks in Wisconsin. I can't fault the national political organization for being political.

I suppose it's that I grew up in, and went to college in, Wisconsin, and this result just makes me sick.

A couple of other thoughts I've been having about this: Much of the damage Walker wanted to do he and his cronies in the legislature have already done, and no governor could wave a magic wand and undo it. And if after all the shit he pulled he still had fifty percent of the people supporting him, then you need a truly transformational figure to oppose him. Barrett is not that guy. He's a non-fiery technocrat who just lost to Walker two years ago and who threw the unions under the bus during one of the debates last week. He's only been fundraising for less than three months, while Walker has basically been fundraising since early 2011, so he had a hell of a head start no matter where that money was coming from. And Barrett still couldn't move the needle towards the Dems' column in a significant way.

I've never been to Wisconsin, but my guess is that the damage ol' Scotty has done would take more than this recall to undo. If anything, the recall succeeding would have just enraged the other half of the population. It's a toxic morass and Obama is going to have enough of that to deal with this fall.

So let the Repubs gloat. Remember how nuts they went after Scott Brown won? Health care reform still passed. So fuck 'em. Ol' Cross Eyes has an excellent shot at seeing a federal indictment anyway in the near future.

i was going to say the same thing, but you said it far better than i could have (hot yoga, rex cab, etc.).

i will only add: if he'd gone in, he would have had to own the loss (and the news i'll be ignoring for the next three days will make it a referendum on him anyway). coming up he's got a likely greek withdrawal from the euro and/or possible euro collapse, 5-4s on health care, fucking syria coming to a global crisis point AND eurovision.

if i were playing the long game i wouldn't be fucking around with walker's recall either.

George Skullfry

So, with 98% in, we see that the turnout was about 112% of 2010, both statewide and in Milwaukee. That's actually pretty impressive for an out-of-season election.

Unfortunately, Barrett's chances relied on an exceptionally large turnout in Milwaukee (and Dane County), and a 2010-like turnout elsewhere. Neither of these things happened. Apparently the vast amount of out-of-state GOP money was able to jack up the pro-Walker turnout. While I still believe that a more vigorous involvement by the President would have increased the turnout in Milwaukee, I have to say that it doesn't look like it could have been enough to change the result. Even with 2008-level results in Milwaukee, Barrett would still be 80 or 90K short statewide.

So, score one for 11-dimensional chess. It would not have been worth the money and effort and commitment to lose 52-48 instead of 54-46.

Bear in mind "percent of precincts reporting" is one of those "Bill Gates walks into a bar and everyone is a per capita millionaire" figures, it's the percent of precincts, one precinct might have 200 registered voters (village of Nadaville) another 8,000, etc.

I'm not ready to be totally depressed either. Possibly because we have the open Giffords seat election next week and I'm saving some for that.

Negropolis

Surely, you are a glutton for punishment. Turns out her personally chosen replacement ain't worth shit as a politician. That big, fucking baby of a man – the one that used all kind of borderline violent and violent rhetoric against her in 2010 – will win her seat.

TribecaMike

Ron Barber is a smart and well-respected guy. That is a fairly conservative district, and nothing personal meant here, but your knowledge of southern AZ politics appears to be on a one-dimensional Hanna-Barbera level.

Negropolis

I didn't say he was stupid nor that he wasn't respected, but he's made a series of missteps that I think show that he's not a good politician. I don't know if you've been watching this nation over the last few years, but smart and well-respected don't win elections on their own.

Blueb4sunrise

errrrrrrrrr…….thanks?

and, well, to be fair, Kelly is a lying sack of shit too.

edited for Shirley's sake.

Negropolis

I was talking about Kelly. People don't think I was referring to Barber in that second sentence, do they?

Blueb4sunrise

I didn't . I was putting on a brave face and piling on Kelly.

BarackMyWorld

Wonkette founder Ana Marie Cox was on "The Last Word" just now.

When's our current overlord gonna get on the tizzube again?

TribecaMike

But is the current overlord a fox?

BarackMyWorld

Hellz yeah.

Crank_Tango

Oh I'd hit it.

Negropolis

I wish I could be sad, but I'm just kind of burning with anger, at the moment. Surely, there were a lot of legitimate right-wingers coming out to vote, but they didn't win the election. What won this election were those fence-straddling "swing voters" who don't give a shit about issues, but give a shit about process, and they won this for Walker because their tender fucking sensibilities were hurt by even the idea of holding a recall. This folks will be the death of this nation; the people that will destroy the nation because someone hurt their fee-fees.

We'll still have Wisconsin in November, but I almost don't want them. Wisconsin, you've been relegated to Indiana-grade stupid.

Dr. Nick Riviera

I think the best evidence for that is the 12% difference between Obama and Romney.

It's funny because they are appalled people put their nose in WI politics, but somehow missed out on almost all of Walker's money coming from out of state.

Crank_Tango

It's a referendum on Nobama alright, and uh…

Fukui-sanRadioBarb

It's funny because they are appalled people put their nose in WI politics, but somehow missed out on almost all of Walker's money coming from out of state.

Irreconcilable cognitive dissonance? Republicans? Say it ain't so!

mormos

it also might have had something to do with Walker outspending Barrett 25 to 1. You know, because he destroyed the unions that provide all the large sum donations for the democratic party.

The thing I hate the most is when working-class non-union people are jealous of people who DO have unions and vote to punish them, as if they are the problem. "Oh, if only for that teacher's union, I would have a better life." "I can't vote for Nobama because he's beholden to the AFL-CIO." You know and I know, those people wouldn't have the pay scales they have right now in their non-union jobs if it weren't for the unions. Let them move to a state where unions never even had a foothold. Instead of making $20/hr while their union neighbor is making $30/hr, they'll be making fucking $11/hr. And if they can't understand this now, they'll understand it even less when the Republicans finish their destruction of public education.

fartknocker

You have struck the proverbial nail with your hammer. This is all about eliminating the middle class. It was a sad night in Wisconsin. I hope that this is a wake up call to the middle class, but I sincerely doubt it.

Goes back to my CONSTANT call that logic should be taught in grade schools (to replace the magical thinking most Americans currently engage in).But I'm lucky if there will even BE grade schools in the brave new world.

Abernathy

Srsly, I could have personally slapped each and every idiot I heard whining about how they oppose everything Walker stands for, but recalls are wrong.

subsum

Fuck Wisconsin.

Fukui-sanRadioBarb

I just feel sorry for the public sector workers there.

This sucks donkey balls.

flamingpdog

I feel more than sorry. Unless Wanker gets frog-marched out of the State Capitol building pretty soon here, it's going to be payback time against the public sector workers.

Robocalls told them they had already voted when they signed the recall petition and didn't need to vote again. Maybe Dems and Indies can be morons, too?

Dr. Nick Riviera

Not only did they not NEED to vote, if they voted, it would be voter fraud and they would go to jail. Helpful robocalls!

George Skullfry

Well, a lot of them are in Milwaukee, which is only 44% in at the moment.

tessiee

"Confidential to the person whose Google search “Who tried to assassinate Gerald Ford” brought him to Wonket: IT WAS SQUEAKY FROMME, and the other one whose name no one knows because she was not named “Squeaky.""

It was Arthur Bremer.
This is the kind of stuff I remember, instead of my password, or where I left my keys.

flamingpdog

Sorry, tessiee, but Bremer shot George Wallace in 1972.

George Skullfry

Bremer was the one who tried to off George Wallace.

George Skullfry

Oops. Note to self: Refresh before commenting.

flamingpdog

Been there, done that.

tessiee

^^
^
You're right.
But then…
WHERE ARE MY KEYS??

George Skullfry

They're in the last place you look.

tessiee

"there is one new bottle of Stoli, ice, and limes"

Haw, I read this as "new bottle of Stoli, ice, and lines", as in lines laid out on the coffee table.

If the voting and counting is on the level, all I can say is: Wisconsinites, you deserve everything you are going to get.

flamingpdog

Except for the ones who didn't vote for Wanker.

Dr. Nick Riviera

Which is a good percentage of them. And amazingly a good percentage of those that did vote for Walker are somewhat insulated from harm in the state by wealth and prestige. Weird how that works out.

ttommyunger

You know, if they did all they could have done, then now they can move out. I'm resigned to living in the Sovereign State of Dumfukistan, so I don't complain, I just deal with it as best I can.

George Skullfry

It's gonna be close when they finish up.

ttommyunger

In that case, they'll prolly be able to steal it.

DustBowlBlues

Is the last hope for democracy for all of us to work at the local level? We've got a Democrat who has a good shot at taking out a Republithug two counties over. The House minority leader spoke at a dinner I recently attended about that particular race and how we need to cross district lines and work on races that are possible for us.

Is it possible to take back the country from the very bottom? No? Then this is how we're going to live forever? Thanks, Ralph Nader and Sandra Day O'Connor. (And you, too, Clinton, for screwing the D. party worse than that intern. If you'd kept your ego and your zipper under control, we'd never have Bush and this fucked SCOTUS).

Negropolis

I was thinking about this, tonight. You know, play their game; come in with a shitload of Soros/Moore/Stryker-bucks in some out-of-the-way state house/senate district, and just fucking bury the poor GOP schlub on the other side.

Citizens United can not stand. Well, it can stand and the nation destroyed under its weight, or we can save the nation and grind Citizens United into sand.

I hope the Dems take this as the boot-to-the-face example that the GOP and its money — or should I say the money and its GOP — will do anything, anything to win. I'm looking for revenge at the highest level, too, for this. I want Romney destroyed. NOW. And, if Reid doesn't change the rules in the Senate, after this, he can go to hell.

TribecaMike

I see your point, but when did wealthy Dem donors ever give a damn about a measly gubernatorial race? I gotta hand it to the right in that regard. They understand the importance of local and state politics.

Dr. Nick Riviera

They are very very good at politics. They have an excellent long game.

They spent 40 years in the desert. Then they built all this slowly, carefully, think tank by think tank, Fox News by Talk Radio, local election by local election, disaffected white by disaffected white, out of Richard Viguery's use of Goldwater's mailing list, since1964. Demographics are against them in the long run, but meanwhile… The suburban vote just around Milwaukee nearly equals the urban vote in Milwaukee and Madison. Throw in a bunch of rural counties where Walker edges by 600 or 1000 votes and such. Shit storm.

Wile E. Quixote

The problem the Democratic party has is that it's led by George McClellan types when it needs to be led by William T. Sherman types. Or for another historical analogy it's led by Neville Chamberlain/Lord Halifax types when it needs to be led by Bomber Harris types (fuck Churchill, he was an overblown hack).

Dr. Nick Riviera

This is true. If we had a party with half the skill and gall of the Republican party, we'd never lose an election. I can't believe it's possible for a major political party to be so terrible at politics.

Wile E. Quixote

Boy the way the Beatles played. Songs that made the Hit Parade.
Working guys, we had it made. Those were the days.
Didn't need the police state. Everybody pulled their weight.
Gee, our old VW ran great. Those were the days.
Democrats had balls back then, there were sane Republicans.
Mister, we could use a man like Lyndon Johnson again.
People seemed to be content. Fifty dollars paid the rent.
Take a little Sunday spin, go to watch the Dodgers win.
Score some weed that cost you under a fin.
Skirts were short and hair was long. Hendrix really sold a song.
I don't know just what went wrong. Those Were The Days.

Wile E. Quixote

Is it possible to take back the country from the very bottom? No? Then this is how we're going to live forever? Thanks, Ralph Nader and Sandra Day O'Connor. (And you, too, Clinton, for screwing the D. party worse than that intern. If you'd kept your ego and your zipper under control, we'd never have Bush and this fucked SCOTUS).

You know something, as long as there are Democrats who are so goddamned stupid and lazy to believe that Ralph Nader cost Al Gore the election in 2000 the Republicans are going to stay in power. Seriously, do you know how fucking stupid that is? Why not blame the Socialists and Socialist Worker's Party candidates, if only half of the people who voted for the Socialists and Socialist Worker's party had voted for Gore he would have eked out a victory.

If Gore had won his home state of Tennessee, which Clinton and Gore won in 1996 he would have won in the Electoral College. If he'd any of a half dozen states that the Clinton/Gore campaign carried in 1996 he would have won re-election. Did anyone at his campaign understand how the Electoral College works? Obviously not. Gore ran a lousy campaign, he picked an absolutely worthless running mate and he should have been all over Dubya like stink on shit. Why the fuck wasn't Gore hammering on Cheney's deferments, on his drunk driving record, on his last minute move back to Wyoming so he'd qualify to be Vice President? What the fuck was that mannequin doing in 2000. Go look at the Wikipedia entries and see how badly Gore blew it. He had a great economy going for him, the budget was actually running a surplus and he lost it to a moron like Dubya and a coward like Cheney and now idiots like you present him as some sort of martyr instead of as the incompetent fucking hack of a candidate that he was.

Yes, the Supremes got involved and they shouldn't have. But if Gore hadn't sucked the issue never would have been placed in the hands of those corrupt fucks on the court in the first place. Al Gore sucks, fuck Al Gore and fuck the morons who think that Nader cost him the election.

Negropolis

You know who sucked evern more than Al Gore? George Walker Bush, that's who. Republicans don't care if their candidates suck.

Republicans get shit done. Horrible, fucked up shit, excuse my French. So, the kool kids can keep playing in their little isolated sandbox, pretending to build a democracy while the winners of elections (Republicans) take it away faster than they can build it. I just don't hope they have the gall to ask what happened to democracy after it's gone.

Dr. Nick Riviera

Republicans would vote for a pumpkin if it had a flag pin attached to it and an R next to its name. That is because they understand you don't just vote for the guy, you vote for his whole party.

I remember thinking that Kerry sucked as a candidate but I got my happy ass down to the polling precinct and voted because Kerry et. al (and I would even include Edwards) and their agenda on their worst day were better than Bush and Cheney on their best.

But whatever, heaven forbid anyone besmirch the progressive prince who called Obama an Uncle Tom.

Wile E. Quixote

I remember thinking that Kerry sucked as a candidate but I got my happy ass down to the polling precinct and voted because Kerry et. al (and I would even include Edwards) and their agenda on their worst day were better than Bush and Cheney on their best.

Same here. And even though I caucused for President Obama in 2008 I would have voted for Hillary Clinton if she had been the Democratic nominee. What is it about the Democratic party that attracts so many goddamned pearl-clutchers (I'm looking at you Cory Booker) and purity trolls? Am I unhappy with a lot of President Obama's policies? You bet I am. Am I unhappy with the way he keeps bitching out and bending over for the national security police state (NDAA anyone)? You bet I am. Do I wish that he'd stop governing in a way that seems designed to earn the approval of David Brooks and go and kick Republican ass? Damn straight I do. Am I going to sit this election out and hope that a wonderful progressive candidate will come along who will dismantle the national security police state, kick the shit out of Wall Street and the rest of the crony capitalists who are ruining this country and whip the Republicans until they're whimpering and cringing like the worthless pack of yellow curs they are, will come along in 2016? Fuck no!

George Skullfry

Well, being one of those morons, I'd like to respond.

First, let me agree with you that Gore ran a terrible campaign, and made a really bad decision with his VP pick. One mistake you didn't mention was his refusal to make use of Clinton for what were apparently moral reasons (while Bill still had something like 63% overall popularity). If Gore had been a better, or even more pragmatic, campaigner, the election wouldn't have been close.

Nevertheless, Gore was who he was, the election was close, and was known to be close, and it was even known in which states it was particularly close. And this is where my irritation with Mr. Nader arises.

I've always admired Ralph, and so I believe he is serious when he says things like "there is no difference between the D's and the R's". But I think he is wrong about that, particularly with respect to Presidents, and I think a quick examination of SCOTUS and Circuit nominations over the last sixty years will give one example why I think that.

I also know Nader is smart, so I'm sure he is aware of that example of difference. He chooses to ignore it for rhetorical purposes, which is usually fine with me. His point about the parties' similarity is kind of an argument on average.

But, in the very specific, non-average, 2000 election, the identity of the next President was at issue, and very closely contested in several states. In none of those states was Ralph Nader going to be the victor. In a few of them, the probable Nader voters represented a significant fraction of the estimated difference between the major party candidates. In those particular cases, Mr. Nader had the opportunity to tell his partisans in those states "You know, in this special case, the lesser of the two evils is Al", but instead he chose to continue to tell them "They're both the same, vote for me".

I want to be clear that my irritation is not with those who voted for Mr. Nader, it is with Mr. Nader himself. I think he, like Al Gore, made a big mistake.

I don't think Gore is a martyr; I think he ran a shitty campaign. But it is possible to think that and simultaneously to think that he could still have won the election if Nader hadn't been such a tight-ass.

As they say, YMMV.

Cheers.

Wile E. Quixote

You make a lot of good points. I have an issue with this one though.

But, in the very specific, non-average, 2000 election, the identity of the next President was at issue, and very closely contested in several states. In none of those states was Ralph Nader going to be the victor. In a few of them, the probable Nader voters represented a significant fraction of the estimated difference between the major party candidates. In those particular cases, Mr. Nader had the opportunity to tell his partisans in those states "You know, in this special case, the lesser of the two evils is Al", but instead he chose to continue to tell them "They're both the same, vote for me".

It's not that I disagree with you about what Nader should have done in this case, it's that I don't think that it was in him to have done it. If Nader had said anything like this he would have seriously weakened the raison d'etre for his campaign, which was that you should vote for him because both parties were the same. The kind of people who buy into the "both parties are the same" logic are not the kind of people who understand nuance, if Nader had come out and said "Yeah, both parties are the same, but Gore sucks less than Bush so you guys in Florida should vote for him instead of me" his supporters would have accused him of selling out.

There's also the fact that Nader is a huge drama queen. If he had come out and said "Well, I know that I won't win but I'm running to make a statement about how similar the Democrats and Republicans are and corporate control of our political process." he would have ended up getting about as much media coverage as the nutjobs from the Natural Law party or the Constitution Party or the Reform Party or the Libertarians did in 2000 (Want to wind up a Libertarian? Point out that in 2000 Nader managed to get seven times as many votes as their candidate, Harry Browne did, despite being on the ballot in fewer states). If there's one thing that Ralph Nader believes in it's that nobody puts Ralphy in the corner.

Beanball

Much as I respect you Dusty, I have to say you're full of it.

I voted for Nader because I am not a Democrat, I do not believe in neo-liberalism or Wilsonian foreign policy or any of the Clintons or that hypocritical Gore, nor the imperial drift of the presidency since Nixon. I voted for a candidate who is opposed to all the above.

I am a far left-winger, and I vote for whom I chose, not because you think it's pragmatic or practical or what the fuck ever.

If Barney Frank (a raging homo) had been on the ticket, I probably would have voted for him over anybody.

It may be shot to shit, but this is still a democracy and I vote for whom I please and not to please you.

Dr. Nick Riviera

On the one hand you get Bush, but you have a clear conscience. On the other, you get comparatively more progressive legislation but you make compromises with said conscience. And no matter which you choose, you live with the consequences and so does everyone else.

When people lose their collective bargaining rights, women lose access to birth control, a Federal ban on marriage is put in place, you can hardly expect people to say "thanks" to you for putting your clear conscience above their actual rights. But as you said, it's a democracy and you get to choose who to vote for. Just don't expect everyone to thank you for it anymore than the 40 or so percent of Dems are going to thank the 50 or so percent of Republicans who exercised their rights tonight in Wisconsin.

If someone gave you 100 dollar bill and you suspected it came from somewhere nefarious, you would have a couple of options (assuming there was no way to know where it came from and they gave it to you, there was no giving it back). You could tear it up and say "This is my stand, I don't accept dirty money" and keep a clean conscience. Or, you could spend it on food for the homeless. On the one hand, you've participated in a dirty process with dirty money but that homeless guy appreciates it. On the other hand, you keep your principles. It's your choice and your choice alone and nobody can take that from you. But you can't expect the homeless guy to feel great looking at the tattered remains of what could be a hot meal lying int he gutter.

Beanball

I am going to try to say this with as little drama as I can: my political position is the spearpoint of the "liberal" agenda. I have have been on the barricades for a long long time, fighting an exhausting, uphill battle, however, I am a realist and, with Alinsky, do not expect to live long enough to see the day of the Revolution.

However, without me (and my fellow believers) with our misguided pure ideals and voting patterns, liberals would not even be where they are today, which is not really saying much, seeing as how you milquetoasts nominated that piece of shit Bill Clinton, just for starters. (Have you ever even been to a local party caucus?)

Be resentful as you want, justify it all you like, but I don't work for or believe in the Democratic party, or buy into their so-called planks.

The Constitution is moribund, the two-party system is a pay-to-play bait-and-switch game, and if you had any guts at all you all would be fighting for a new Constitution, one that was actually mutually beneficial, rather than the bullshit winner-take-all situation we see today.

The Republican Party may be full of blockheads and run by Neanderthals, but at least they have the guts to say "No", and mean it.

George Skullfry

There will not be a new Constitution (read the rules) without a violent collapse of the existing structure.

A violent revolution, even if successful, will lead to an oppressive government (cf., every revolution since the American one, which had non-replicable circumstances).

The two-party system sucks. Do you see a lot of examples of multi-party systems that don't suck? Also, the existence of the Presidency pretty much forces the two-party system nationally (I guess the Framers had something against the parliamentary system).

The country got much bigger (and in some areas more sparsely populated) than the Framers could have imagined. It's a problem, but for now it's a problem we have to deal with.

Are you seriously admiring the ability of the Republicans to obstruct?

Beanball

I admire their golem-like obstinacy and obdurateness, yeah sure, just as I admire "Dr." Rivera's feeble attempts at bogus analogy and strawman arguments.

As for the Paleoconservatives, their tactics are like a diamond piercing one's opponent's forehead. (Hey, it worked for the Vietnamese.)

I'm not really a Quixote, but I do like to think that I possess a certain amount of wiliness.

George Skullfry

I'm not DBB. For one thing, I'm halfway into a bottle of aglianico. But I have a response to you, which is:

1. You absolutely (at least for now) have the right to vote for whomever you choose. You should also expect to receive both praise and criticism for your choices, even as I do.

2. I'd like to point out, however, that in the upper comment DBB did not criticize people who voted for Mr. Nader, but Mr. Nader himself. For my own reasoning on this matter, please see my reply to Wile E. above.

3. Whether you like it or not, the electoral system bequeathed to us by the Constitution, and formalized over the last two centuries, has a strong tendency towards a two-party system at the national level. I am not arguing that this is a good thing, just that it is a thing.

4. With respect to item 3, when you vote for a third-party candidate for a national office (Pres/VP, Senator, MC) you are effectively casting one vote for whichever major party candidate you like least. The same thing is true if you don't vote at all. Failing to vote, or voting for a non-viable candidate, is always equivalent to voting for the candidate you hate the most. I also don't claim this is good, just that it's true.

5. Personally, I think the point of voting is to try to elect somebody (or, since I live in California, to legislate by referendum [I don't like this much]). But, voting can also be about expressing opinion, and that has certainly been important at various times.

6. Would you mind briefly describing "Wilsonian foreign policy"?

Negropolis

You hit upon a very important point, and that is voting for a third party at the federal level, and hinted at the difference of doing the same for lower office. Our system is not set up at the presidential level, especially, for successful third party success.

I've been wanting to get some Greens in at the Congressional and state legislative levels for some time, now, and I think it's a realistic goal if anyone was ever dead serious about it. But casting a third party vote in a presidential race is quite literally throwing away a vote, at best, and actually voting for the opposition, indirectly, at worst.

Beanball

I prepared a massive, multi-part rebuttal to your comments, but the internets keep crapping out, in the meantime, this: read Chomsky's What Uncle Sam Really Wants.

Beanball

Switched browsers, this seems to be holding a tenuous connection, so, to answer your questions as long as it holds out::

6. In context, I really should have said "neo-Wilsonian" foreign policy, as Wilson himself was somewhat two-faced vis a vis the implementation of his stated policies, which include self-determination for former European colonies; Wilson himself used the phrase, "making the world safe for democracy," which leaves a lot of wiggle room for all sorts of shenanigans. More recently, his policy can be can be summed up colloquially in the expression "exporting democracy at the point of a gun." It was Wilson, after all, who brought the US into WWI, against the isolationist wishes of the majority of the American electorate while promptly re-instituting the Sedition Laws. Not to mention his numerous military excursions into Mexico, Central and South America and the Caribbean. By these actions, Wilson showed his aristocratic neo-Platonic and anti-democratic elitism, while at the same time justifying his actions as being in "America's long-term interests." Again, weasel words, recently updated in the term "The Long War."

yeah, he needs to shut up- he already fucked us over once. I don't care what he has done since that is good(if it is ). For all the blathering(or what they consider intelligent conversation up above here), Clinton really helped us lose the election

Fukui-sanRadioBarb

(Huh, couldn't comment for a bit there)

Walker is going to have better numbers in the recall than in his initial election.

and, seriously, Walker's campaign headquarters is in Waukesha? Home of that election-fiddling woman?

I count at least 300k to come in just from Milwaukee, Dane, Kenosha and Racine. Everyone has called this but there are a lot of votes still to come in from strong Barrett areas. I never did the Kenosha Kid.

Negropolis

It's over. It'll be nice to have the final tally, but let's not get delusional, here. Things are bad enough as they are without getting silly.

Yup–Arizona came close to recalling Evan Mecham, but the slimy bastard managed to get himself impeached first.

Negropolis

I feel sorry for Barrett; I really do. What makes this worse is that Scooter is such a personally weak candidate, so this is ALL about the money propping up this clown. How must Barrett feel to again lose to such a horrible human being and terrible politician? It reminds me of the 2010 gubernatorial race here in Michigan where the citizens wouldn't give my city's mayor the time of day, with the only difference being that Snyder is nowhere near as shitty a person, personally, as Walker.

He actually has been. He mentioned speaking to Barrett tonight and shushed the booing.

TribecaMike

Shades of another sanctimonious twat, John McCain, in his 2008 concession speech.

Fukui-sanRadioBarb

YAY TROOP PANDERING!

Fuck you, Walker.

Negropolis

I hope that Walker enjoys tonight, because it's not going to get any easier from here on out. Rage can be a quick passing fad, but entrenched bitterness can last a very long time. You've won tonight, Scott Walker, but you'll wake up tomorrow to see what you really won: a state you so badly divided that maybe no governor will ever be able to put it back together again. Thanks for that. You have also won a whole new level of scrutiny. John Doe is not going to go away, and the spectre of a trial will not be ignored.

Another fun war to learn about is, "The War of the Triple Alliance"
Apparently, Paraguay decided it would be a good idea to attack Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay…the countries that surrounded Paraguay.
This did go as well as planned.

Well — I was hoping to see a corporate tool who relishes disenfranchising his own citizens and pretending it's the state's job to force down the cost of labor and make the poor suffer, and who outspent his opponent ten-to-one, would get righteously thrown out on his ass.

I did, however, catch about a solid minute of the transit of Venus before the clouds covered up the sun for good. I saw one thing that only happens every hundred years. I should be happy.

Scott Walker's wife is Tonette.She had a “charity” fundraiser recently where she asked women of a certain class to donate their designer handbags for an auction she held at the governor's mansion.I'm not making this up.

I don't think the calls had much effect really, but I'd love to see them get nailed for it. Right now I'm remembering how Nixon swept in '72, despite Watergate bubbling under. I'm hoping Walker gets similarly shamed when his luck runs out.

I gotta hand it to you, Wisconsinites, you showed some brass and fought the good fight. Still, I can't help but "recall" what Jim once said to Bart…

"What did you expect, 'Welcome, sonny'? 'Make yourself at home'? 'Marry my daughter'? You've got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know… morons."

Bad news from California: with 13% of precincts reporting, Birther Queen Orly Taitz is far behind the top two vote-getters, DiFi and Susan Emken, a Republican who has done, um, something or other. Orly trails her by about 200,000 votes, so I don't think she's going to get there. Ah well, it was a good run.

TribecaMike

Oh well, it was funny while it lasted.

Huevos Ocupados

"It's not getting any smarter out there—you need to come to terms with stupidity and make it work for you." – Frank Zappa

This seems as good a place as for this quote.

Steverino247

It's certainly true where I work. I get subpoenaed to testify every so often. When it happens, I remind myself that the point of it is to make me look stupid, so the sooner I do that, the sooner I get back to work.

Steverino247

Good news from California: Orly Taitz finishes a distant 6th.

So, while I'm sad about the recall, I can only hope Orly comes through with some more insanity about why she finished so far behind tomorrow.

Biel_ze_Bubba

That still suggests a horrifying number of mental defectives casting ballots for her.

Negropolis

Be still my beating heart. Is it true what I'm hearing over at the Kos kids website? Are the Wisconsin state Dems on the verge of actually taking back the state senate?!

If anyone is still paying attention, one of the state Senate recalls, Van Wanggard v. democrat John Lehman, is hanging fire, 52.6 to 47.4 with 75 % of precincts reporting. A win there would put a brake in the Senate against Walker excesses.

Negropolis

The lead is now just a bit over eighty votes with 95% of the wards reporting…I'm going to faint.

Negropolis

The wire has called it! Wisconsin Dems win the state senate! Walker agenda REJECTED. Walker, himself? Yeah, not so much.

Blog comment that seemed to best sum up this election was over at Hullabaloo, I think [alcohol fog 'n all] – that it was, at bottom, anti-union resentment. So progressives should resist despair, it was simply mentally-arthritic Repub oldz doing their knee-jerk "Unionz BAD" schtick.

OK, so I prefer to think we're doomed to corporate oligarchy, but that's just me.

horsedreamer_1

Love that the unemployed guy in the article voted for Wanggard, again. Maybe he can get together with "guy who wants lower corporate taxes do small businesses will start hiring" & the two can make a Baby Rand buttbaby.

"Former state Sen. John Lehman, D-Racine led state incumbent Republican Sen. Van Wanggaard, with 36,255 votes to Wanggaard's 35,476 votes, according to unofficial results with all precincts reporting. "

This is the most interested I've ever been in a state senate race, and that's just because I'm seeking solace after that fucking ALEC-Koch CUNT remains governor of WI.

George Skullfry

If I'm calculating correctly, this is above the 0.5% free recount level. Of course, I don't suppose the Repo will have any trouble coming up with the fee for a recount.

Your Kirsten Boyd Johnson doesn't love ME enough to even acknowledge that I have been fapping all OVER her virtual presence for weeks now.

LetUsBray

Has anyone heard anything about exit polling in Wisconsin showing a much thinner margin, like close to a dead heat?

I heard about this on the Book of Face, so it's clearly true. Still, I'd be interested in hearing if anyone heard this anywhere else.

Fukui-sanRadioBarb

CNN:

"Voters were split 52%-48% with Gov. Scott Walker, a Republican, taking a slight advantage over Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett, a Democrat, the CNN exit polls showed. Asked how they would vote if the presidential election were held today, a 12-point margin emerged. President Barack Obama would have carried the state with 54% to GOP candidate Mitt Romney's 42%."

Not too far off. More interesting is the "Obama voters must have voted for weaselcunt" portion of the electorate. What on earth is up with that?

horsedreamer_1

"Process". Democrats are too fair minded to support an "unwarranted" recall. Never mind that Walker has warrants.

George Skullfry

Unwarranted?

Hell, in California we recalled a Governor for telling the truth about how Texas oil companies were fucking us over on energy prices.

George Skullfry

Excuse the multi-level reply. Intense Debate has been doing some more strangeness to me.

For anyone who watched the "the Ed Show" tonight, I was the handsome bon vivant with the body of a svelte pre-teen Swedish boy in the background, I left after 10 minutes because it was a bummer, and Ed's head is frightening in real life.

George Skullfry

Oh, come on. I wanted her to go against DiFi. I was waiting for the "hotter, wetter, tighter" ads. And Orly's response.

George Skullfry

Completely OT: when the comment timestamps come up as date and time, rather than "x hours ago", what the hell time zone is Intense Debate in? GMT? Geneva?

Fukui-sanRadioBarb

For me it does that sometimes (and I also can't post new topix) but then it sorts itself out.

Who knows why?

DahBoner

Ugggh!!!!!

proudgrampa

Oh, crap.

thatsitfortheother1

Fuggin fugs.

BaldarTFlagass

Fuck. First the Spurs go down 3-2, now this. Come on extinction-event asteroid!!

Terry

Wisconsin had two shots at this, the first election and the recall. Basically, they deserve the Koch paradise they're going to get.

The worst part, besides him winning and all that goes with that, will be the smug gloating we will have to endure from all his supporters and the man himself. That will be insufferable.

Biel_ze_Bubba

Can't wait for the Dumbya-style claims of a "mandate", based on only 46% of voters wanthing the fucker thrown out of office.

Biel_ze_Bubba

Per the NYT, "Almost a fifth of the electorate was 65 or older, with only about one in 10 voters of college age."

WTF??? Watch these ignorant/apathetic whiners complain, when they graduate to no jobs.

Negropolis

Yeah, and turnout, in general, was not good. It was above 2010 levels, but not nearly close enough to the 2008 levels Dems needed to win. It probably didn't help that the recall was held a few weeks after classes let out, either.

CivicHoliday

And not surprisingly, the MASSIVE influx of money had a major impact on the election. Sigh…Citizens United the monster had a little appetizer and is now gearing up for a big November feast…

Dr. Nick Riviera

Yeah, but that's one thing you can say for Obama-unlike Barret he's got the cash to at least be competitive with the $infinity Romney will raise