It’s ALIVE! The Man Boobz Forum, that is.

BREAKING NEWS: Because of the gender issue and other issues people have raised with proboards, I will be moving the forum to another platform, probably phpBB. Just give me a few hours! I’ve locked the proboards forum down in the meantime. Post below with any thoughts and/or advice.

You asked for it – well, a majority of those who took the poll did. You got it! The Man Boobz Forum is open for business. Right here, right now.

I hope the discussions here on the blog will remain long and spirited and sprawly, but now you guys have a place to go to discuss, well, whatever you want to discuss, actually (within the limits of the forum’s comments policy, which you should all read). Raise you own issues, link to Man Booby stuff, link to off-topic stuff, link to your own blog, talk about books, talk about Magyck the Gendering cards, plan get-togethers, you name it. One bit of warning: I’m going to try to keep discussions on the forum a little more civilized than they tend to be here on the blog; this means I will be more stringent about the commenting rules and much quicker to ban offenders, temporarily or permanently.

I encourage everyone who regularly comments here (and who wants to post on the forum) to register there using the same nickname you use here. Also, please post a comment here after I approve you (just to verify that it’s really you behind both accounts). If you’re a regular commenter here and you’re interested in being a moderator of the forum, let me know.

Note on gender: Not everyone here identifies themselves as male or female. Unfortunately, proboards requires you to check either “male” or “female” when registering. The good news, for those who don’t fit the gender binary or who simply don’t want people to know what gender they are, is that you don’t have to display your gender in your profile or posts. (Go to your profile, and click “modify profile” and you’ll find a way to “hide” your gender as well as other ways to customize your profile.)

Post any feedback you have about the forum here or on the forum itself.

There are biological reasons for desiring/having a penis or a vagina, and all that. I’m reasonably confident that the brain actually develops with the expectation of a certain set of genitals, and transgenderism may be, in part, when the expectation doesn’t match reality. (There is precedent for this expectation with phantom limb syndrome)

The social construction comes from trying to make the statement “you have a penis, therefore you like trucks” or “you have a vagina, therefore you should be a home-maker.” Gender roles certainly are a construct, and to some extent trying to classify people as male or female, apart from possibly making a statement about which genitals you own, doesn’t deterimine much else.

@Kirbywrap: I am certainly not denying that a lot of gender stuff, and those restrictive roles and norms and such, are social constructs. I think most of what we think of as gender is a product of our culture. But it still seems really funky to me to say that something that is so deeply important to us is purely placed on me by outside forces.

It’s a complex issue, and I’m really not sure what the right answers are. Which is why I’m perfectly happy to accept that someone is a PUMA-PIE.

I agree with you, I think that the biological differences between males and females do have some affect on personality and so on. That wouldn’t be a construct. You do run into problems with things we just don’t understand yet, like exactly why someone in a visually male body would identify female, and vice verse, or how intersex people’s biology affects them, so a binary male/female isn’t quite adequite as a language.

So yeah. Biology plays a role, and that isn’t a social construct. There may even be things that we think are social, but are actually biological. But the goal is to get rid of expectations and prejudices about things that are social, so we treat each person as fairly as possible. In that regard, operating under the model that all things are constructed is helpful, because it means we treat each person as an individual.

And not matter what role biology does play, there are always exceptions to the rule. Because people are a weird and wily bunch! And it’s very important to accommodate those exceptions.

And trying to explain all of these shades of meaning to people does get difficult. I think it’s easier for most people to conceive of things of things in a binary fashion. Either we are creatures of biological habit, OR it’s all a social construct. Nuance is difficult, and when trying to enact social change we want to make things as easy as possible on people.

I agree with Ami… it’s your body, Slavey, and if that kind of surgery is what you need to live a joyful life, then go for it. Doesn’t really affect my life any, and I believe that people have a right to pursue whatever form of happiness suits them.

If you were trying to make some kind of statement about transgenderism or gender in general, you rather failed.

I have to admit, I don’t always understand the drive to transition from one gender to another, but that’s because I’m cis. Even when I do stereotypically masculine things, I’ve never felt like less of a woman, just a woman who does these random things. Nor do I feel especially feminine when I do something stereotyped as female. I’m just me, a woman in a woman’s body. To get into the mindset of thinking of myself as male is really, really hard for me. I don’t even like playing male video game characters, because it’s hard for me to relate.

But you know what? My understanding isn’t required. Transpeople don’t necessarily need my understanding, only my respect and my belief that their lives and bodies are theirs and theirs alone, to do with as they wish. And that’s really not very hard to give, not at all. I don’t understand people whose hobbies are collecting things, either, but that doesn’t mean I’m trying to make them stop.

@MertvayaRuka Kirby and I suspected that too xD the problem is.. ffs I deal w/ actual transphobia irl xD and in comment threads all sorts of places.. it’s not like the “what if I did this to myself and called myself that!?” isn’t something almost every anti-trans person reaches for xD I’m more curious why he hates trans ppl xD cuz there are so many (rapists, gender traitors, ppl trying to sneak into other gender places for nefarious reasons, etc etc ) and I wanna know which one his is xD

Also, NWO is a circular human centipede, and hence makes up both the end and the front. NWO has always managed to keep purr (this seems like the right pronoun for PUMA PIEs) head up purr ass, so it is not too hard to imagine.

“kirbywarp… transgendered people and reassigned body parts. What a crazy thought. It does sound insane doesn’t it? HAHAHA. Keep on keepin on, you people rock!”

Spoken by a person who has apparently never been to BMEzine. Alas, kids these days. I remember when I first worked up the courage to… “oh god TWO SEPARATE PIECES!!!!!”

Generally speaking people are not born with horns either. And yet, to the interested, technology provides.

Also I would like to point out that I have a superpower — namely, that my views are arranged such that when silly people say “Yeah? Yeah? Well, if you support gay marriage then why don’t you support marriage of more than one person ha ha I totally win” their posture of smugitude is promptly punctured by “Well, about that…” Or similar with the matter of penis installed on forehead, much as this is apt to be a somewhat challenging procedure from a medical point of view, I think it’s probably a worthwhile cause for the person’s body to be consistent with their dickhead identity — both for their sake, and for the edification of everyone else.

It’s not impossible to shock me, I guess, but it seems to be beyond the reach of the average trollgoon and is getting more difficult as I grow older.

“Also I would like to point out that I have a superpower — namely, that my views are arranged such that when silly people say “Yeah? Yeah? Well, if you support gay marriage then why don’t you support marriage of more than one person ha ha I totally win” their posture of smugitude is promptly punctured by “Well, about that…””

I too possess this superpower. “Yeah, actually I do support the marriage of more than one person. It would make my partner ridiculously happy and she’d feel so much more secure if my wife and I could marry her”. Completely fucking boggles them.

“It’s not impossible to shock me, I guess, but it seems to be beyond the reach of the average trollgoon and is getting more difficult as I grow older.”

Well, after a while of seeing trolls on the internet you realize what one-trick ponies they all are. It all revolves around shocking and upsetting people or making people miserable. Those are always the end goals. Once understood, it’s very easy to deny them those goals.

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