It feels better when I finally blurt it out. It also feels better when I tell Carla how much I spent. Like, a dollar for coffee, a dollar for two pies, and a dollar for a small fries. Plus Ann, the cute lady behind the counter, gave me a free refill on the coffee.

And by Jiminy, that filled me up. Three buckeroos.

But Carla has this thing about McDonald’s. “They are ruining the planet!” she says. “They should have been hauled up in Copenhagen. Think of how many miles of Amazon jungle have been chopped down so farmers can grow cows to be killed for McDonald’s. McDonald’s buys more beef than anyone in the world. And antibiotics and hormones are stuffed down them in factory farms. We eat that!”

This is a cell-phone conversation. It’s around 8:30 at night, and I’m in the McDonald’s east of Paradise Hills — and I never go to McDonald’s because I like to support the little guy rather than the big chains, and they don’t come bigger than Big Mac’s. They’re 32,000 restaurants strong and turning even the French into obese little burger-munchers. Heck, they’ve opened a McDonald’s in the Louvre in Paris. Is nothing sacred?

“Look, 50 million Americans are obese,” says Carla, on the phone. She’s not letting go of this one. “Only smoking kills more of us. And the waste: every quarter-pounder uses 600 gallons of water, Edward. The way McDonald’s creates food, it takes ten calories of energy to make one calorie of food. Talk about sustainability.”

Good question. Actually, what happened was, well…typical. I was going to join a buddy of mine out here. Chew fat, couple of brewskis, maybe. Around 6:00 was the general idea. Meet — just meet — at McDonald’s. Except I got held up. Two hours late, if I have to confess. Figured I’d better still come. Irony: I have a cell, he doesn’t; he could still be waiting. As I caught the 961 bus in the dark, the driver warned, “Don’t forget, last bus back to the coast is at 9:07. You’ve got an hour.” (Though the final 962 comes by at 9:17.)

’Course, my buddy wasn’t there. Dammit, totally wasted evening. But I was definitely hungry, and I figured I’d better stay close to that stop. This big McDonald’s on Paradise Valley Road is only 100 yards away. There’s, like, two people inside. One guy drinking coffee, surrounded by big floppy books. And behind the counter, Ann. “What would you like?” she asks.

I don’t even bother looking at burgers and just order what look like total deals: a small coffee, two pies for the price of one, and a small pack of fries. A buck, a buck, a buck. How can you beat that? No wonder they have 32,000 stores. I grab my stuff and head for a table. First thing I see, looking ’round, is a “McFact: ‘Some 4000 family members of critically ill children sleep in a Ronald McDonald House somewhere in the world every night.’” Hmm… They can’t be all bad.

The one guy and I get to talking. Rusty’s a survivor of the marketing world’s downturn. He’s decided to go into the health industry. “That’s got to be expanding,” he says. He’s studying coding for medical billing. Oh, man. “I come here because it’s peaceful at night, and I like their double cheeseburgers,” he says. “They’re only $1.30. I don’t know why everybody doesn’t love McDonald’s.”

Lord. How did I not spot that buck-thirty burger? Still, I’m getting a good buzz chomping into my fries, combining them with the cherry pies. Sweet with salty. The pie’s hot in its cardboard box. Yes, it’s a sterile-looking turnover of pastry and red gunk, but guess what? It’s delish, ’specially with the coffee. Rusty sees my cup’s empty. “You get refills,” he says. So I get up and take my cup to Ann. No prob. She fills it for free. Long as I’m up, might as well check the menu.

Two girls come in. Beverley and Brandy. I ask their advice on which is the best deal. “My favorite’s the McDouble,” says Beverley. “It’s like the double cheeseburger but just one slab of cheese, so you taste the grilled meat better. And it’s only a dollar.”

Unbelievable, when you think about it. Of course, things like quarter-pounders are $4, $6 with fries and soda. But I’m full on three bucks. Maybe we need big bad corporations like Mr. Kroc’s in hard times.

I make the bus. Whew. Cell phone is ringing.

“Me.” It’s Carla. “Don’t even think of bringing back any burgers from McDonald’s.”

“You eating nuts and twigs again?”

“Not exactly. I ordered in a Domino’s double pepperoni pizza with sausage and jalapeños and olives and a side of chicken wings.”

Sigh. Say what you will, what Carla’s forking out for her pizza would’ve fed us for a week at Mickey D’s.

Comments

My husband and I just ate at the McDonald's on Del Mar Heights Rd. east of I-5 in Carmel Valley. In addition to the regular fast food, they have a bistro menu with pannini sandwiches, wraps, interesting salads, and soups. We had a turkey wrap, a meatball pannini, slaw side salad, and astonishly good shrimp and corn chowder for around $15. And the food was delivered to our table with real plates and silverware. Don't know if these "bistros" are located anywhere else; they're not mentioned on the website. Tell Carla there's hope for McDonald's.

I don't think Carla objects to the food, I think she objects to how the food is treated when it is alive. I must say I agree with her. I respect and admire people who don't eat meat for ethical reasons.

JohnnyJ - Yes we are designed to eat meat. However we are not designed to eat meat that has been force fed corn and other junk it would not normally eat, tortured, and pumped full of antibiotics and hormones. And why is someone a 'fool' if they choose to eat vegetarian? WTF do you care what a person chooses to eat, it's not like they're forcing you to be vegetarian.

And, we are not designed to eat meat on a daily basis, three meals a day. The only reason we can afford to eat meat on a daily basis is because of CORN. Corn production is tied into our political system in ways that would outrage anyone with half a brain that cares to look into our so-called food production in this country. That which is eaten in this country, what we call "food", is Frankenfood at best. We do not raise livestock. We grow cows. The manner in which this occurs is disturbing, violent, disgusting and shocking. We do not suffer from protein deficiencies. We actually eat too much protein, in the form of animal products. McDonald's, in affiliation with high-fructose corn syrup, are the leading contributors to the alarming and sky-rocketing numbers of children being diagnosed with diabetes. You cannot tell me that eating this food is good for you. It is also tied into poverty and perpetuates the cycle of poverty by offering one dollar items. Rather than go grocery shopping (and by grocery shopping I mean fresh produce, not Kraft Macaroni and Cheese), these seductive "deals" make the effort of making a healthy meal for yourself or your family seem quaint, at best. Why cook when for half the price of the groceries you can feed them crap? No cooking, no cleaning, why, you don't even have to get yourself out of the car!! I have not eaten a fast-food meal in over a decade. Call me what you will, but I will NEVER support a company that produces such an evil product. That said, I'll always love Ed...

Agree with you on principal, MsG, though I have some thoughts to add. For instance, the bulk of food in restaurants and food stores come from the same or similar sources. Even if McDonalds wanted to make the switch over to a different type of beef, for example, I doubt if it could find a supplier to provide that much product. And of course the prices would soar. BTW, I think it may be a bit of a myth that the poor patronize McD's more than other income brackets, at least most of the families I know prepare most of their meals at home. And most eat healthy food, they just eat too much of it. Where children are concerned, there is way too much snack food available, from corner stores, from pushcarts, from street and park vendors.

There may be a few places where you can be certain of buying farm fresh, organically produced vegetables and grass-fed meat and range-free eggs. Those places tend not to be located in poor communities, and the prices are generally pretty high, so it would be hard to work into a low income food budget.

I wonder also if it helps to think of McDonalds as evil. After all, they prepare the food, We The People of our own free will go inside and eat it. No one puts a gun to our heads. Are we evil? I think perhaps we are enjoying the fruits of our success. Remember it wasn't so long ago in history that procuring food wasn't a sure thing. Science has strived to improve food production and distribution, to make it perfectly bland and edible and clean and easy and cheap to consume.

I think it's good to take a look at how food is produced. There's a lot of factors that need to be considered while changes are made. No question changes should be made. I think McDonalds knows this, and are working on making changes.

"the bulk of food in restaurants and food stores come from the same or similar sources"

I choose not to dine or shop in these establishments.

"Even if McDonalds wanted to make the switch over to a different type of beef, for example, I doubt if it could find a supplier to provide that much product."

McDonald's could not afford to switch, nor is it in their best interest to. That is the reason why there is not an organic supplier for them. People that cultivate sustained methods of food production would never supply to McDonald's. They would have to succumb to their level of production, rendering their original intent void.

"And of course the prices would soar."

Of course they would. As well they should.

"BTW, I think it may be a bit of a myth that the poor patronize McD's more than other income brackets, at least most of the families I know prepare most of their meals at home. And most eat healthy food, they just eat too much of it."

This is not a myth. And you cannot get fat eating healthy food. FYI - snacks are a horrible means of controlling children. I have a great story I will post if you promise not to bash me regarding children and snacks.

"There may be a few places where you can be certain of buying farm fresh, organically produced vegetables and grass-fed meat and range-free eggs. Those places tend not to be located in poor communities, and the prices are generally pretty high, so it would be hard to work into a low income food budget."

Fast food companies target these locales specifically when determining where to open franchises. A head of lettuce is only a dollar. So is a double cheeseburger.

"Science has strived to improve food production and distribution, to make it perfectly bland and edible and clean and easy and cheap to consume."

Spend a day in a slaughterhouse and hear the horrific tales the workers have to tell. There is abuse to the employees of these death mills that are unbearable. There is nothing scientific about the processing of animals for food. You may be referring to the lab process that produces "food" that resembles nothing like the real thing. Fake odors, flavors, textures, all meant to make addicts of people who cannot supposedly afford REAL FOOD.

I hope you are right about companies doing a better job. But if you really knew about where this "food" came from, you might refrain from pulling into a line of cars to get your "meal".

Hardly. I belong to a food co-op. Yours is the knee-jerk response of most who cannot fathom a life without mass produced food. To put it into such ridiculous monetary "goals" such as putting grocery chains out of business speaks volumes to your lack of education of the subject matter.

OB People's in ocean beach..awesome. most all organic, with a small section of commercial produce. there is an great salad bar with assortment of various soups (mmm i love the chinese rainbow soup) and hot food upstairs. they have (or used to have) live entertainment every friday night. that is where i shopped every week. i miss that place. try it, you'll love it!!

Hardly knee-jerk and hardly uneducated. I have thought about these issues quite a lot. I support your position in theory, I am trying to understand how you intend to put it into practice. If you don't intend to do anything about McDonalds or Vons, what is your goal, MsG?

This community, and I am speaking of Barrio Logan, Logan Heights, Memorial, Sherman, Stockton, has not had a major grocery store chain supermarket in something like forty years; there was a Safeway on the corner of 25th and Imperial about that long ago. Many of the women pull their carts to one of the IGA-affiliated independent markets around here, which is no bargain. Second-rate produce in the bins, off-brand goods on the shelves, brand name food at more than top rate prices. Where these places get their meat, God only knows. A few places provide fresh made tortillas, where they get the corn they grind, God only knows. Many of the people here qualify to get free food from the local government-supported food banks; they give basically the same food as you would get in a supermarket, canned meat, processed cheese, dried noodles, white beans. No fresh organic meat or produce there. There was a co-op for a short time on Imperial, how good it was, I don't know, but it closed down. A farmer's market was started in Sherman recently, the times I went, there were few booths and fewer customers, no organic produce for sale that I saw.

The only large open land left is the Mercado property by the Coronado bridge, and that is some kind of Never-Never land; every so often, rumors float about a shopping center there, the last one I heard involved a Target as the anchor. When I was on planning, there was some talk of building a Ralphs on Market around 18th, as I recall. For this community, that's big. Frankly, I doubt we could ever get even a Henry's down here, much less a full-blown food co-op, and even if one were to open here, there would be no end of challenges to overcome.

Many of the people here produce some of their own food. Many grow chilies, tomatoes, nopal, melons. There are bearing trees in a lot of yards, fig, avocado, lemon, peach. Most immigrants come from agricultural backgrounds, they know what it is to grow crops, to raise small livestock. Virtually everyone I know has raised pigs or goats or chickens to be slaughtered. Our family in Texas grow food and raise animals on our lands, my friends in Texas run livestock on their ranches. Many of the people hired to work in slaughterhouses and poultry plants are Hispanic, or were, until the immigration raids began a few years back, now they have returned to hiring blacks and poor whites to do the work. Many Hispanics work in the fields and packing houses. We are not detached from the process, we are involved in it to different extents. Most of us are not ignorant about what it takes to provide food. We know how the glittering cans and sterile packages of meat got to the Vons. And we know what we are eating at McDonalds.

I remember reading in an article about Los Angeles when they did the fast-food ban some time back that in one nine mile area there were over thirty fast food chain restaurants. In the communities I have listed above, there are less than ten, and that's if you count Starbucks: hardly a glut.

Jack In The Box, 23rd and Market

Starbucks, 35th and National

Starbucks, Panda King, Little Ceasar's, 28th and National

McDonalds, Burger King, Del Taco, Pollo Loco, 28th and Main

I've talked to many of my neighbors and residents of the community over the years and I know that most recent immigrants don't eat out a lot. The Hispanic diet is based mainly on beans and corn tortillas, something you can't get at most fast food places. Once families are assimilated, second and third generation, their diets become more Americanized and they do tend to eat fast food at a higher rate. I will say that there are a lot of programs in the schools that educate and encourage parents to eat healthy. That means eating more fruits and vegetables, less meat. They don't talk about organics here. It isn't practical or realistic.

Oh, and while we are talking about schools, most of the children in this community qualify for the free meals program, which provides breakfast and lunch paid for by our tax dollars. The food served is okay in taste, meets minimum standards in terms of healthy eating: ketchup is a vegetable, hash browns are vegetables. Doubt if any of that food is organic, including the cartons of milk. And let me tell you, if it ain't pizza or cookies, the kids hardly touch it, anyway. Orange halves, apple slices, carrots, corn, a lot of it gets dumped into the trash cans. People can scold all they want, but the reality isn't easy to change. IMHO, sophisticated, well-educated, higher income adults can choose to eat differently. The reality here is complex, which people on the outside looking in don't always grasp.

My apologies, CF, for the lack of education crack. I stand corrected. Obviously, you have done your homework regarding the deplorable regional impact on the ability to purchase healthy food due to socio-economic conditions. Obviously this is a subject that I feel strongly about, and so do you. Did you watch Jamie Oliver's Food Revolution? The initial opposition to change by the lunch ladies was a prime example of resistance to healthy eating and a real eye-opener. And you are right. Kids have been conditioned to eat garbage.

Here is a link to his website, if interested. He is an example of what we should all be trying to do. I know that is impossible, given that we don't have the resources to put a network TV show on the air, but on a local level, one community at a time, I think it can be done.

Hi, Magics! Yep, the OB People's Food Co-op is the place. They have all kinds of stuff going on there now. Actually, it is one of the better places to learn hands-on about sustainable agriculture. They have lots of reading material and they host a variety of classes. Some people think it is too hippie-esque - my mother-in-law hates it. She could not get past the dreads. Bristol Farms is more her speed. I adore this place. It supports everything I believe in. And their prices on organic produce are really low and the quality so much better than organic produce from a supermarket.

No apologies necessary. I took it in exactly that spirit, that you feel strongly about this subject. I was trying to find the parameters of your involvement, what it is you want to happen, and how you intend to reach that goal. And I hope I outlined where the matter stands in our community.

As stated above: the big problem is corn. You know that they are teaching fish to eat it? You get farm raised salmon or tilapia and you are getting a fish that was fattened on corn. Last time I checked, there is no corn that grows under the sea. Unnatural.

They feed it to cattle. Remember when you were a kid and they were just starting to brainwash into thinking that "Corn-Fed" beef was superior to the grass fed beef that nature intended?

The Trader Joe's in La Mesa just redid their meet section, they now a big selection of grass fed beef. It's more expensive, but if you buy half as much it works out to be about the same price. We eat too much meat.

You outlined it perfectly. Thank you for taking the time to point out some very eye-opening facts.

This letter was in Saturday's paper -

Grocery store loss affects public health
My husband and I drove 10 miles last night to go grocery shopping. It was not our choice but out of necessity as the only major grocery store in National City is closing this month. We live in a community that is over served by fast-food restaurants and underserved by grocery stores. Sadly, childhood obesity is a serious problem in National City, as is diabetes. Ironically, that same day Michelle Obama was in San Diego promoting her campaign against childhood obesity, visiting a community that parallels National City in its lack of major grocery stores.

ELIZABETH TOY

National City

Why in such a densely populated area are there no major chain grocery stores? Everyone should have access to healthy food. My involvement is limited to myself and my family and friends who I have persuaded to read about mass produced food and make changes to the way they eat and shop. I have a small sphere of influence, but I have managed to get a few people on board. I believe that it starts in the schools. Teaching children basic life skills, such as finance and cooking (we used to have home economics when I was in school) will go a long way in helping future generations make better choices. Not allowing fast food chains and vending machines dispensing empty liquid calories on any school campus would be a start. I know that many schools are working to rid themselves of these choices. We did not have that choice growing up, but I am sure if we did we would have chose the bad one. So you can see that not having the choice to eat fast food and drink soda when I was a child affected my eating habits now. It can work. We ate what was given to us. My nieces grew up in the fast food campus environment and their eating habits are now disgraceful. I cannot for the life of me get them to eat healthy food. They find it distasteful. These companies spend millions of dollars in the lab creating artificial ingredients designed to make fast food addictive. I don't know, CF. I am just one person trying to get people to understand that we are poisoning our kids. I hope that programs like Jamie Oliver's takes off in America. It needs to start early. Otherwise, once the taste for junk becomes ingrained, you cannot change kids' eating habits. We need to go back to growing food, not corn to feed cattle to feed America's insatiable appetite for Big Macs. This all comes back to personal choice, like smoking, which is why getting food on the ballot is going to be next to impossible. But we were able to get bans on smoking, so who knows?

Yes, Tiki, I've read about that. The diet that farm-raised fish eat completely negates any health benefits derived from eating fish. It's turns it into cheap fish, so you can eat more of it. Again, promoting the vicious cycle of "you can afford to eat meat and fish everyday, at every meal". Unfortunately, none of this fish or meat even closely resembles wild fish and free-range beef. All over Europe, the pastures are full of animals grazing. Here, the pastures are full of corn, designed to become feed for livestock held in virtual torture chambers, sickened by this diet and given hormones to hasten their growth and antibiotics to combat the sickness that ensues when a ruminant is forced to eat an unnatural diet. And, yes, superior "corn-fed" beef is made-up nonsense. It just makes the beef more fatty and produces greater amounts of meat per head of cattle, enriching the cattle industry at the expense of these poor sickened creatures.

The store that is closing in National City is Ralph's, a store I shopped at, located in a community with a number of senior citizen housing complexes. That means that the only place to get groceries now are either the independents (see above), or Wal-Mart. Great choices, huh?

Like I said, the situation is much more complex than most people realize. We struggle to get and keep a chain store, how in the world anyone expects us to get organic produce and meat here is beyond me.

In spite of that, I do think things will change. Corporations can't ignore customer trends if they want to survive. Those of you with the means and money to vote with your wallet will change things for all of us.

Corn production is tied into government subsidies that keep farmers in a welfare state. The big corporations make considerable donations to politions that support the dairy and cattle industries. It's all a big, sick mess that all boils down to money. Nutrition is not even a factor in the production of food in our country. Big agriculture is even fighting soy milk makers, challenging them over the use of the word "milk" in their product names. And big corporations are jumping on the organic bandwagon, and in their attempt to produce "organic" products are trying to water down the strict requirements necessary to label a food organic. They want a certain "allowable" percentage of the food to be non-organic, which would be essentially the pesticides used to grow the otherwise "organic" crop. Sick, sick, sick.

That is terrible that they are closing down the Ralphs. Wal-Marts tend to have that effect on certain communities.

I rarely eat at restaurants. If I do, I choose small, independent establishments that offer a variety of vegetarian options. I love Mama's on Alabama. That was actually an Ed recommend a few years ago that has turned into one of my favorite places to eat. I joined a food co-op and I try to buy mostly organic. I am very angry that it costs more money to eat a non-f***ed with diet. I am sickened that meat is irradiated to kill deadly toxins that are the result of factory farming animals and that USDA regulations allow a certain amount of fecal matter to be present in our food. I am furious that the quality of the food used for school lunch programs is sub-par to even the low standards used for the fast food industry. Yes, I care, but when I try to engage people in a discussion about food, most take my vegetarianism as a reason to discount what I am talking about, thinking that my love of animals is the sole reason I do not eat animal products. People actually get angry when I try to explain why I drink soy milk. Last night we had dinner at my in-laws. My mother-in-law asked me again for the millionth time "you eat chicken, don't you?". My father-in-law said "well, fish is vegetarian". My MIL made pudding with fat-free milk. I told her I have made it with soy milk and it's really good. This led to the questions as to why I would drink soy milk over "real" milk, because "there is no calcium in it, is there?" And really, the important thing to my MIL is that it's fat-free, not hormone, antibiotic, dairy farm death mill free. Rather than get into it, I just said "I like the taste". My husband has a co-worker whose parents almost disowned her after she became a vegetarian. She was raised in Texas, where meat is a religion and not eating it is akin to treason. Tiki, I think you get the picture. It's exhausting and it is also a matter of personal choice. People think you are a lunatic for eating non-modified vegetarian organic food. The government's involvement in the production of food in our country is something we should all be concerned about. Allowing genetically modified seeds the are resistant to deadly pesticides become the norm is something that everyone should be concerned about, but NO ONE CARES. The few that do are classified as hippie tree-huggers who are trying to stop the good ol' American traditions of a delicious corn-fed, well-marbled steak. If anyone followed that steak to its origins, I can guarantee you they would not eat it. I have followed it. Seeing downed cows being dragged by hooks to the slaughter floor is the most horrifying thing anyone could witness and after seeing that I could not condone the eating of beef or any other animal brutalized in such a way for what we refer to as "dinner".

My favorite mom and pop restaurant is San Filippo's on 5th Ave in Hillcrest......it was more intimate before the expanded it a few years back...but a great place. Has covered patio dining in the back which is the best!