This is a discussion on $5 NLHE Full Ring: JJ OOP Help Me Understand within the online poker forums, in the Cash Game Hand Analysis section; First Time posting in Hand Analysis - I tried converting the hand history with Hand Fire for Firefox with no luck so I apologize if

First Time posting in Hand Analysis - I tried converting the hand history with Hand Fire for Firefox with no luck so I apologize if this is hard to get through. This particular hand tilted me pretty bad and I would like some input on whether or not my play on the turn was incorrect and/or any other advice you'd like to share with me. Thank you in advance for your help and consideration.

I've never used the Hand Fire converter, try using this one (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) instead next time. I'll fix your post.

As for the hand, maybe it's just me but I feel like this a pretty mandatory spot to 3-bet pre... As played, I think your check/raise on the flop is pretty small, if you raised a little bigger you could have just jammed the turn based on the effective stack sizes.

#4

25th October 2010, 2:29 PM

WVHillbilly [22,658]

Online Poker at: Full Tilt

re: Poker & $5 NLHE Full Ring: JJ OOP Help Me Understand

Why are you flatting JJ OOP?

#5

25th October 2010, 10:05 PM

Numbuh 0ne [201]

Poker at: bodog

Game: holdem

Why are you playing with 2 8h?

#6

26th October 2010, 1:37 AM

DetroitJimmy [1,045]

Online Poker at: Looking

Game: NL holdem

[quote=Numbuh 0ne;1591123]Why are you playing with 2 8h?[/quote
He had JJ.

#7

26th October 2010, 1:51 AM

nabmom [4,585]

Game: NLHE

Everyone folded to the button. His raise makes me think he's trying to steal the blinds. With the JJ, because you'll be OOP for the rest of the hand, I would think a raise is much better than a call. Looks like Baudib1 is suggesting 4x the button's raise.

Why is that a better bet than 3x?

If, after that, the button calls, I would assume this is a good indicator that he has something in his hand. Did you have any sense of what range of hands he might play? Did you think it might be a steal with anything? Low pp? Suited connectors (better to play those against more opponents, right?, but doesn't mean the villain plays that way, especially at micro-stakes). Monster?

Assuming he would have called that pre-flop re-raise, the check and raise on the flop would, I should think, set off alarms that he hit something on the flop. Given the texture of the flop, would a better bet after a check be pot-sized?

#8

26th October 2010, 2:16 AM

baudib1 [6,604]

Online Poker at: Full Tilt

Game: NLHE

re: Poker & $5 NLHE Full Ring: JJ OOP Help Me Understand

raise more in 3-bet pots oop.

#9

26th October 2010, 10:01 AM

Darkphoenix5000 [27]

Poker at: Full Tilt

Game: NL Holdem

Quote:

Originally Posted by cjatud2012

I've never used the Hand Fire converter, try using this one (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) instead next time. I'll fix your post.

Thanks for the edit it makes a world of a difference and thank you all for the feed back.

Pre-flop his move looked like an obvious steal so I felt I was good preflop but I hadn't caught him with any bluffs or loose calls so felt he deserved some credit hence the flat call.

I agree my check-raise was quite small but I assumed I was trapping with the best as I assumed he had high suited connectors and missed the board.

I think the fact that he called bet/ all-in re-raise on the turn with a draw to catch a river straight with 7,2 is what blew my mind.

#10

26th October 2010, 10:09 AM

Darkphoenix5000 [27]

Online Poker at: Full Tilt

Game: NL Holdem

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numbuh 0ne

Why are you playing with 2 8h?

For anyone just reading this now there's an error on the hand conversion the turn was actually the 3h (which is where I bet out and re-raised all-in with the villain having nothing except open-ended draw and in which he raised my 2/3 pot sized bet and called my call-in with) and the river a 5 which he caught to make his 1 card straight.

#11

26th October 2010, 3:02 PM

cjatud2012 [3,907]

Poker at: Full Tilt

Game: STT

Ah, sorry, didn't notice the converter messed up. That's strange.

#12

26th October 2010, 3:23 PM

fx20736 [2,728]

re: Poker & $5 NLHE Full Ring: JJ OOP Help Me Understand

Flatting a raise when OOP is usually horrible. Unless you are really deep stacked and could put your opponent on a very narrow range of hands then you gain no information by flatting. Players open with their widest range from the button. I'm etremely tight and I am still playing about 25% of all possible hands. The only hand I would dream of doing this with would be AA and even then with AA you make your biggest haul when you are up against another big pair like KK or QQ so why even flat with AA because the hand you want to play postflop with will either call your3bet, thus adding value or 4bet you and then you can shove. You need to find out if his raise is a steal attempt or if he has a legitmate hand so you 3bet. Since you called where you trying to flop an overpair? That will happen less than 50% of the time with JJ or a set? If you do flop a set you may not get as much action as you think, becasue if you check either to check/ raise or bet the turn your opp may fold if he has AK or 99 or 88.
Now let's say you 3bet here. Villain calls because he has position and you flop a set of Jacks. If he flatted with AJs or KJs you may get his whole stack.