Swisher never was and never will be a center fielder. Swisher never was and never will be a lead off man. Ozzie misused him but the fault for that lies with Kenny for putting him in that situation in the first place.

I don't believe Swisher was ever acquired with the intent of being the Sox's everyday CF, as was noted, he was the Opening Day LF in 2008. He was displaced more, IIRC, by the emergence of Carlos Quentin as the everyday LF, which limited Swisher's defensive flexibility

I don't believe Swisher was ever acquired with the intent of being the Sox's everyday CF, as was noted, he was the Opening Day LF in 2008. He was displaced more, IIRC, by the emergence of Carlos Quentin as the everyday LF, which limited Swisher's defensive flexibility

I think you're right that Swisher was brought in to play left but Kenny was saying that he could play anywhere in the outfield. The plan was originally to have Jerry Owens in center with Swisher in left. Owens got hurt early on and I THINK Kenny was the proponent of having him bat leadoff and play center. I think that is when Ozzie said that there is more to lead off than OBP and that caused a bit of brouhaha. I could be wrong.

either way, the two Swisher trades were the worst thing Kenny Williams has ever done.

I'd have to say the Todd Ritchie deal was his worst. Even KW himself admits that was his worst move as GM. The Swisher deals were definitely among his poorest moves though.

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I'd have to say the Todd Ritchie deal was his worst. Even KW himself admits that was his worst move as GM. The Swisher deals were definitely among his poorest moves though.

I don't know, Ritchie really sucked but at least he didn't cost the Sox anything. Kip Wells, Josh Fogg, and Sean Lowe all had pretty forgettable post-Sox careers. Wells has had the most success putting up a total 1.1 career WAR since the deal spread out over 9 journeyman seasons.

Swisher, Part I cost the Sox Gio who is probably the only guy Williams dealt in his tenure that you can get Sox fans to universally agree we would like to have back. Swisher, Part II netted the Sox absolutely nothing for a guy who put up a .268/.367/.483 slash line over the last 4 years in New York. Adding insult to injury was the fact that in the off-season between 2008 and 2009, the Sox were also dangling Jermaine Dye and supposedly had a deal with the Reds in place before opting to sell low on Nick.

I'd have to say the Todd Ritchie deal was his worst. Even KW himself admits that was his worst move as GM. The Swisher deals were definitely among his poorest moves though.

All the Todd Ritchie deal did was give the Pirates a chance to see our prospects fail. You could argue, those guys could have been used in a different deal to get a better player, but the Sox didn't really get burned there.

The Sox gave up Gio Gonzalez for one year of Swisher and then sold him for NOTHING.

They missed out on a huge talent in Gio and had a hot prospect in DLS that could have been used in a different deal.

I don't know, Ritchie really sucked but at least he didn't cost the Sox anything. Kip Wells, Josh Fogg, and Sean Lowe all had pretty forgettable post-Sox careers. Wells has had the most success putting up a total 1.1 career WAR since the deal spread out over 9 journeyman seasons.

Swisher, Part I cost the Sox Gio who is probably the only guy Williams dealt in his tenure that you can get Sox fans to universally agree we would like to have back. Swisher, Part II netted the Sox absolutely nothing for a guy who put up a .268/.367/.483 slash line over the last 4 years in New York. Adding insult to injury was the fact that in the off-season between 2008 and 2009, the Sox were also dangling Jermaine Dye and supposedly had a deal with the Reds in place before opting to sell low on Nick.

Kip Wells was actually pretty good his first 2 years in Pittsburgh, and then of course fell off drastically. In keeping with my excellent record as a talent evaluator I predicted stardom for Wells. I was mad when the Ritchie trade was made, even before Ritchie had that unbelievably horrendous year.

4/56M sure sounds like a lot for a player like Nick Swisher - especially coming from a small market team.

It might be the Indians spending their money stupidly. But, it may also be a sign that team profits are going up and up and so are salaries.

At least other teams are looking to add MLB quality players to their roster.

Quote:

Originally Posted by doublem23

I don't know, Ritchie really sucked but at least he didn't cost the Sox anything. Kip Wells, Josh Fogg, and Sean Lowe all had pretty forgettable post-Sox careers. Wells has had the most success putting up a total 1.1 career WAR since the deal spread out over 9 journeyman seasons.

Swisher, Part I cost the Sox Gio who is probably the only guy Williams dealt in his tenure that you can get Sox fans to universally agree we would like to have back. Swisher, Part II netted the Sox absolutely nothing for a guy who put up a .268/.367/.483 slash line over the last 4 years in New York. Adding insult to injury was the fact that in the off-season between 2008 and 2009, the Sox were also dangling Jermaine Dye and supposedly had a deal with the Reds in place before opting to sell low on Nick.

That's probably as much a condemnation of the talent level in the Sox system over the past 10 years as it is a kudos to KW for not giving up any other good players during his tenure.

I agree that the Swisher trade with the A's was worse than the Todd Ritchie trade.

4/56M sure sounds like a lot for a player like Nick Swisher - especially coming from a small market team.

It might be the Indians spending their money stupidly. But, it may also be a sign that team profits are going up and up and so are salaries.

At least other teams are looking to add MLB quality players to their roster.

That's probably as much a condemnation of the talent level in the Sox system over the past 10 years as it is a kudos to KW for not giving up any other good players during his tenure.

I agree that the Swisher trade with the A's was worse than the Todd Ritchie trade.

This is a key point which I'm surprised that nobody here has brought up. Teams are flush with cash, but not spending as much as soon. It's probably because they know that more players are hitting the open market later on before spring training and during the early part of the season. Why rush? i can't blame them.

I don't believe Swisher was ever acquired with the intent of being the Sox's everyday CF, as was noted, he was the Opening Day LF in 2008. He was displaced more, IIRC, by the emergence of Carlos Quentin as the everyday LF, which limited Swisher's defensive flexibility

Guillen, and that keen eye for talent, had it in his mind that Jerry Owens was a ML center fielder and lead-off hitter. Swisher would play left. Quentin - Guillen pencilled him in for Charlotte.
Owens got hurt, and Guillen messed around with TCM in center for a couple of games. Swisher was put there by default.
But also by default, he was cast as leadoff hitter.
Swisher is a good hitter - really a quality #6 or so with good power and on base skills. The Sox needed him to play roles which were not his strength.

Guillen, and that keen eye for talent, had it in his mind that Jerry Owens was a ML center fielder and lead-off hitter. Swisher would play left. Quentin - Guillen pencilled him in for Charlotte.
Owens got hurt, and Guillen messed around with TCM in center for a couple of games. Swisher was put there by default.
But also by default, he was cast as leadoff hitter.
Swisher is a good hitter - really a quality #6 or so with good power and on base skills. The Sox needed him to play roles which were not his strength.

Kenny was a big believer in Jerry Owens too. At SoxFest after the 2007 season when Kenny failed to acquire a CF (after announcing his plan 1, plan 1a, etc) said that Jerry Owens was a "fantastic" center fielder and was the leadoff man "for the foreseeable future."