I've been focusing on my vitamin D level for a few years, because I read that low D was linked to all kinds of troubles, including some symptoms I had. Now I've been taking a high dose of D (10,000 iu per day) for a long time, and my D level is healthy (57) but I don't feel good.

Now I'm wondering about magnesium and vitamin D. Could low magnesium have been behind my previous difficulty in maintaining a high level of vitamin D? Could greatly increasing my mag intake enable me to maintain my D level while taking a much lower dose?

Somebody invited me to a magnesium Facebook group about a week ago, and it's a VERY active group, so I'm constantly going back to read the new messages and magnesium has been on my mind a lot.

In addition to using the mag oil on my skin and epsom salts baths (which, according to some sources, isn't a very good source of mag but great for detox) I've been putting some mag oil and baking soda in water and drinking that throughout the day. This coincided with me dropping my vitamin D intake in half (I'm running out and can't buy more until June) and for the past couple of days I've stopped taking it altogether.

Magnesium and Vit. D go hand in hand. As a B, I have lower magnesium levels than other blood types (according to Dr. D.'s books) and coupled with my vitamin D deficiency, my body was off-kilter. I take my mag and vit D pills together. I also noticed that being estrogen dominant affects vitamin D levels. I am balancing out my hormones as well.

Doing all three things together is helping - I feel like my vitamin D level is finally stabilizing. However, it is still not perfect because my I notice that I feel run down and tired with stress - which also affects levels. I try and take an extra 5,000 i.u. when that happens and then I feel MUCH better!

Magnesium and Vit. D go hand in hand. As a B, I have lower magnesium levels than other blood types (according to Dr. D.'s books) and coupled with my vitamin D deficiency, my body was off-kilter. I take my mag and vit D pills together. I also noticed that being estrogen dominant affects vitamin D levels. I am balancing out my hormones as well.

Doing all three things together is helping - I feel like my vitamin D level is finally stabilizing. However, it is still not perfect because my I notice that I feel run down and tired with stress - which also affects levels. I try and take an extra 5,000 i.u. when that happens and then I feel MUCH better!

Question....Is your D level low because you're estrogen dominant? Or high? You magnesiumlevel must be adequate if you feel better after taking MORE D......because if magnesium weretoo low to begin with, then additional D might actually lower your magnesium. IT's a viciouscycle....Taking extra D doesn't necessarily make me feel better or worse....I just know that without enough magnesium, the D won't go from being in storage to becoming active.

What I do is drink Natural Calm (mag citrate) in small doses all day long....a tsp at a time ina large glass of water....just so my muscles don't go wonky on me. People with fibromyalgiaseem to be highly deficient in magnesium and this is a condition more likely to happen inwomen...

I was looking all over for this website....finally found it. Lots of good magnesium information.

Also people who have had damage to their guts from gluten wind up with malabsorption.....a reason touse magnesium oil to bypass digestion. It's likely the reason my magnesium issues exist....Probably havehad issues absorbing all nutrients until I gave up gluten. It's been 8 years off gluten....Hope my absorptionof minerals has improved!

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

My sister loves using the mag oil. I take it orally. Like I said it seemed to dehydrate me really quickly when I sprayed it on. I was getting terrible UTI's..until I stopped using it. Hey but that's me. I don't know of people who have abnormal EKG's from taking fish oil either.

My sister loves using the mag oil. I take it orally. Like I said it seemed to dehydrate me really quickly when I sprayed it on. I was getting terrible UTI's..until I stopped using it. Hey but that's me. I don't know of people who have abnormal EKG's from taking fish oil either.

Interesting because when I first started using mag oil.....about 5 years ago, when I sprayed it on,it dried out my skin something terrible....I mean dry, flaky, scaly skin on my legs....and then, my skin was peeling off. Couldn't find any place to put it on my body where it wasn't almost burning my skin.

It doesn't happen now.. I have to think about what is different. Well, for one, I think I'm lessacidic...I go out of my way to try and stay alkalized by eating raw fruits and veggies, lots of salads, avoiding too much animal protein or highly acidic foods. So perhaps an alkaline mineraltopically hitting acidic skin causes this strange chemical reaction. When I use mag oil now, myskin stays soft. My hands used to look like there was no water left in them when I used to rubon the mag oil....but doesn't happen anymore.

Consider your diet.....How much of it is raw, alkaline and how much of it is cooked, too high in animal protein. Might just be a ph issue....

As for getting UTIs when using mag oil.....can't figure that one out. Unless you just weren't ableto balance your ph.

The trick is to use mag oil, take magnesium pills in a form you tolerate and get your calcium fromfood. We're all overly calcified from all the added calcium they keep dumping into foods. I triedto buy plain old Welch's grape juice the other day. Label said "fortified with calcium"......Had togo to three supermarkets until I found plain grape juice.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Estrogen dominance is related to low D levels. I was dx-ed officially by an endocrinologist.

As of yesterday, I was able to wake up with the sun in the morning without feeling tired (which was my normal waking schedule when I was in L.A. and getting enough D). It has taken me almost 1.5 years in L.A. to get to this point so you can imagine how low my levels were!

I will have health insurance as of mid-August and will get tested then. For now, I know I am finally getting my levels closer to normal.

As for magnesium, my asthma and allergies get worse if my mag levels go down.

Question....Is your D level low because you're estrogen dominant? Or high? You magnesiumlevel must be adequate if you feel better after taking MORE D......because if magnesium weretoo low to begin with, then additional D might actually lower your magnesium. IT's a viciouscycle....Taking extra D doesn't necessarily make me feel better or worse....I just know that without enough magnesium, the D won't go from being in storage to becoming active.

What I do is drink Natural Calm (mag citrate) in small doses all day long....a tsp at a time ina large glass of water....just so my muscles don't go wonky on me. People with fibromyalgiaseem to be highly deficient in magnesium and this is a condition more likely to happen inwomen...

I was looking all over for this website....finally found it. Lots of good magnesium information.

Also people who have had damage to their guts from gluten wind up with malabsorption.....a reason touse magnesium oil to bypass digestion. It's likely the reason my magnesium issues exist....Probably havehad issues absorbing all nutrients until I gave up gluten. It's been 8 years off gluten....Hope my absorptionof minerals has improved!

It's very educational to hear about all the different ways your bodies are telling you that you're deficient in magnesium (or vitamin D)! This is one of the many things I really enjoy about this Forum. People develop much more sensitive relationships with their own bodies through watching what they consume and responding appropriately to signals. Then you're able to achieve balance more and more quickly.

Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.Let me not pass you by in quest of some rare and perfect tomorrow.~Mary Jean Irion

It is funny that you mention this, Victoria. I had started taking more magnesium a few weeks ago, but I don't need nearly as much of it as a lot of people seem to think they do! I would never get out of the bathroom!! I hate to think what would happen if I literally bathed in it! I read about one guy, though, who was taking a lot of magnesium, and even though he never got diarrhea from it, he felt terrible and wiped out all the time. They checked his magnesium level eventually and found that he didn't need nearly as much as he was taking, and he started feeling like a new person after he left off a lot of it. Maybe we need more at a given time than we do at others - so it really is important to listen to our bodies and be aware!

So far I am doing well with the K2 from Jarrow. It is unbelievable the work I have been able to do even though we have been having 90 degree weather for a while now. No pain in my hip joints and lower back at night at all.

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

Absorbed magnesium doesn't have a laxative effect. It's the magnesium that doesn't get absorbed (that stays in the GI tract) that leads to looser stools. If you take a form of mag that's well absorbed, more gets into tissues and less stays in the colon. Take a poorly absorbed form, and you'll have the laxative effect with very little magnesium actually entering your body. When you bathe in it, the magnesium bypasses the colon and usually doesn't affect digestion at all (unless your body is truly and fully saturated with magnesium and excess makes its way there. I read about ONE case of a guy getting diarrhea from an epsom salts bath, but that's not typical.)

I wish I could "listen to my body and give it what it needs" but I'm having trouble hearing what my body is saying. All I know for certain is that something is out of kilter, but I don't know what. It might even be more than one thing that's wrong, and fixing just one thing (even if needed) may not do the trick.

It's hard to put the puzzle pieces together on my own, with limited resources. I wish I could go to a naturopath, pay for whatever testing he or she wanted done, and then still have money for whatever supplements or treatments were recommended.

The trick is to use mag oil, take magnesium pills in a form you tolerate and get your calcium fromfood. We're all overly calcified from all the added calcium they keep dumping into foods. I triedto buy plain old Welch's grape juice the other day. Label said "fortified with calcium"......Had togo to three supermarkets until I found plain grape juice.

Funny, I was looking for grape juice with calcium. I don't think my son gets enough.

Re: minerals, I was into the 80's vitamin craze of megadosing and I took a lot of minerals..then all of a sudden, I started triggering migraines from taking so much. I can't take more than a few hundred mgs of magnesium or calcium.. Calcium I can take 500mg now and I also use Tums so that's more but I don't know if I'm even absorbing the Tums? I mean I trigger a 2 day long migraine taking too much minerals.. So, IDK what's going on now. The only close thing I found was McDougal who felt we get too much minerals from a SAD and its not good. I'm not a raw foodist. I don't like raw vegetables. I gag down salads because I'm supposed to. I usually will make a green smoothie so I can get some raw spinach and kale but that's it. I love my vegetbales... cooked. According to Macrobiotics, vegetables should be eaten cooked and not raw. Raw broccoli is bad for the thyroid isn't it? Dr. Oz said not to eat raw mushrooms. They should be cooked. I wish Dr. D would give tips. I've asked him to do that already. You know he's reading this..

the merc and yeast together mess people up. fibro is intimately related to yeast. mag is used up in detoxing merc, fighting yeast, AND putting D to use.

low D test, according to some, is an indication of mag deficiency. I watched my D spike up and my mag plummet. I am on zero calcium for now (sure it is pulling from all of the soft tissue from depositing where it was not supposed to) and zero D.

I am enjoying the spring sunshine and making what my body can handle.

I am up to 3 teaspoons of ReMag a day and feel like junk if I miss it.

RBC goal according to Dr. Carolyn Dean should be 6.5Mine plummeted to 4.1 as my D was up and my doc was saying it (D) could go higher. It felt great when I was supplementing, until the plummet.

Will use a UVB lamp in winter most likely next winter and keep supplementation of D to a minimum if at all.

Could it be that those with high D levels (without supplementing) also have a decent RBC mag level? Me thinks it could be so, but no one has been testing for that because D is all the rage. Researchers see the high D and get so excited because these people are not sick. Mag can be pulled from tissue and bones when needed. Could also be that the sun does other great things for us besides D that helps us be healthy?

Would love to see ionic tissue testing become common as it shows tissue levels. And I would love to see mine. Only about 150 hospitals have this.

80% of body functions need mag. about 80% of US deficient in D. about 80% deficient in mag. perhaps body prioritizes other functions for mag than vitamin D production. perhaps that buildup of D from unnatural sources is not the same as the D we make.

perhaps, perhaps, perhaps. much to learn. one thing I think is clear, low Mg intake or a high burn rate is going to make the body do a heck of a lot of prioritization.

it has been stated that none of the Mg researchers (who intimately study Mg) recommend D supplementation. hmm.

p.s. majority of docs have NEVER ordered a RBC test. serum level is useless unless that's low and you are in serious crisis at that point. 1% of mag in serum. in cells, tissue, and bone. soft tissue calcification is not normal. it is associated with deficiency (for quite awhile) and perhaps of other trace factors.

AKArtlover.....Only info I can find on ionic tissue testing is in relation to implants of hip and in some cases issues related to the heart. Have you had this done? And if so, would you explain what type of doctor wasastute enough to even request this testing?

I'm taking the Remag and don't notice much of anything. It contains other minerals and trace minerals....Justnot sure it's the right form for me. Gut instinct tells me it's not....and can't put my finger on why.

I seem to do better on my Natural Calm, although I'm giving the Remag at least one bottle.

Was wondering why you chose Remag over the timed released form. I sort of feel magnesium goes through mysystem quickly which is why the timed release sounds interesting. I feel good right after I take Natural Calmbut it wears off within a few hours....or less.

As far as I understand to absorb calcium one needs some animal fat. Anyone know if this is true? When we lived in the western states we used to get Dr Bronners calcium/magnesium powder and sprinkle in on our food...try the health shops..its was cheap, tasteless, balanced for absorption and easy to use. I wish I could get it over here. It was a great source. Prior to going to the states I use suffer from leg cramps but they disappeared while I was there and I now suffer from them again...I wonder if it was this product which helped me ...emmmmmm

AKArtlover.....Only info I can find on ionic tissue testing is in relation to implants of hip and in some cases issues related to the heart. Have you had this done? And if so, would you explain what type of doctor wasastute enough to even request this testing?

Dr. Dean is probably one of the few talking about it. She talks about magnesium researchers using it and the results that they were finding in "The Magnesium Miracle"

I take that occasionally as well. B6 is a cofactor, malic acid has been found helpful in some with fibro or battling yeast overgrowth. I do like slow release, but I break up my ReMag into multiple doses, too. I also have some other B vitamins I take.

I'm taking the Remag and don't notice much of anything. It contains other minerals and trace minerals....Justnot sure it's the right form for me. Gut instinct tells me it's not....and can't put my finger on why.I seem to do better on my Natural Calm, although I'm giving the Remag at least one bottle.

I'm a big fan of listening to my body. Did post a link on here as well. I have some concern about mag and biofilm. My local doc said some critters can "steal your mag"- I need to get into more depth with him on that. Dr. Dean said something to the effect that you are using up your mag fighting the critters. One to find out more. I seem to be preferring ReMag right now, and I believe it is pushing the merc out pretty quick. Have had to increase my chelation dose and make sure I get it on time. I happen to be one who can feel it moving.

Was wondering why you chose Remag over the timed released form. I sort of feel magnesium goes through mysystem quickly which is why the timed release sounds interesting. I feel good right after I take Natural Calmbut it wears off within a few hours....or less.

I use all three at different times, but I am going heavy on ReMag right now. Someone said it is very adsorbable and like the transdermal, you could just hold it in your hand and it would start absorbing.I think it is really about the pushing the merc out right now. Heavy metals, from what I understand can jam up the cells. Also as I pull out the merc, I need maggie in there from what I am understanding right now. So much to learn. Listening to my body....

ReMag is supposed to be absorbed at the cell level and won't shoot out the other end unless you are supersaturated. Which is why she created it.

Also, the trace minerals are super trace and only there because she derived it from sea water. Super tiny amounts but it was something about labeling clearance. I noticed they changed it on their new bottles.

"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13,14

In the past few weeks, I've stopped taking vitamin D and increased my magnesium. In addition to the epsom salts baths almost every night and using mag oil almost every day, I've started adding mag citrate (mag oil) and baking soda to my drinking water.

I'm trying to figure out just how much magnesium I'm taking and how much I'm likely to be absorbing. I use about 70 sprays of mag oil on my body, and about 1/2 teaspoon in water throughout the day (1/8 tsp per 14oz cup of water.) I assume the oral mag is well absorbed since I'm taking it so slowly over time and it's not causing loose stools.

Does anybody know how much mag per spray and how much mag per teaspoonful of mag oil?

Also, I found a few links about magnesium and bicarbonate on that facebook page. I haven't had time to really read them carefully yet, but I'm sharing the links here now so they'll be easier for me to find later. Plus maybe some of you can help me make sense of them. http://drsircus.com/medicine/m.....-9919cce09f-10691761

Malic Acid is mainly found in tart, unripe fruits and most commonly associated with apple. That is because malic acid was first isolated from apple and named on the apple. Malic acid has many health benefits for the body. You can easily get a lot of malic acid from your diet by eating some fruits that are rich in this organic acid.

Natural Food Sources of Malic Acid :

Apples are one of the best sources of malic acid. It is a common saying that an apple a day, keeps the doctor. Part of the excellent health benefits of apples is due to malic acid in tart apples. Green apples therefore have more malic acid than red apples. One should really eat an apple a day as it has wonderful benefits for the body, mind and skin.

Grapes are a source of malic acid containing it in high concentration. Sour grapes have much higher content of malic acid, but it is still present in sweet ones.

Pineapple is a really tart fruit. Tartness is a real different from sourness. Pineapples leave a tingling taste on the tongue because they are quite tart. They contain a sufficient amount of malic acid.

Other fruits like berries, apricots contain malic acid.

Besides this, malic acid is also a permitted food flavoring and is used in sour candies, potato chips and many other snacks. It is also used as ingredient in skin care products.

And to answer your question about how much magnesium is in mag chloride (aka mag oil)It's 16 pumps equals 200 mg of magnesium.

"For transdermal magnesium supplementation and relief of aches, pain, soreness and stress, we recommend you put 4–8 tablespoons (2–4 ounces) or more in the bathtub or foot bath, and then soak for a minimum of 20 minutes. We recommend soaking in your magnesium bath on a regular basis for best supplementation. While 2 ounces is a desirable starting level, higher doses (4–16 ounces) used in a bath may produce better results. While you may use the spray pump (16 pumps equals approx. 200 mg of magnesium), for baths and footbaths it may be easier to uncap the bottle and pour the magnesium oil either into a measuring cup or directly into bath water."

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Just came back to put a quick note that I am working with a doctor who is supervising my progress and labs. It's important that docs understand chem/genetic individuality. There are no one size fits alls.

Have to come back later and read your posts Ruth and Chloe.

"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13,14

I started taking a magnesium citrate with malic acid by Thorne. Recommended on a website for fibro,I'm also using Natural Calm in my drinking water, taking Mag glycinate once a day and muscle tightnessis starting to lessen.

The Remag formula I'm taking also, but don't seem to be able to notice improvement when I took it alone. Seemto get the best results from the malic acid with mag citrate.....which tells me that my problem might not be just a magnesium deficiency as much as the fact that I could use a lot of malic acid. I eat apples but not 20 per day.. No calcium at all except from food and also taking one of Dr. D's vitamin D supplements.

I bought a product by Thorne called MagnesiumCitrimate which seems to be working well. Having to double the recommended dose, spreadfar apart. Not upsetting my gut at all.

This is interesting. Carolyn Dean's article on why she hates calcium.

Why I Hate CalciumCarolyn Dean MD ND | Tuesday, May 18, 2010 I talk all day and every day about magnesium but many people are focused on calcium. Women especially are led to believe that calcium, and lots of it, is necessary to keep their bones from crumbling away. Medically we just imagine that bones are made of calcium and don’t realize the interplay between the two.

However, if you’ve read anything I’ve written about magnesium, you’ll know that magnesium is the dynamo behind calcium. They are both necessary and equally important for strong bones and many other processes in the body.

Here are the words of one of my clients. “It was news to me and might be a shock to your readers, too, when you say to take 1/3 as much calcium as magnesium. All the magnesium/calcium pills I could find had twice as much calcium and magnesium in them. And the other shock was that you hardly advise calcium pills anymore but recommend angstrom calcium.”

Calcium (in the carbonate, citrate and gluconate forms) is only 4-10% absorbed. Unlike magnesium, calcium doesn’t flush itself out with diarrhea if you take too much. Calcium, instead, causes constipation and builds up in the body. Some researchers are saying calcium supplements are responsible for an increase in calcification causing heart disease, kidney stones, gall stones, heel spurs and fibromyalgia. Part of that buildup has to do with the fact that few people take magnesium with their calcium. It also has to do with the type of calcium taken.

Now, as usual, I’m leaping into the abyss here. But I can’t “unknow” what I know about calcium. And what I know is that most of the calcium being used is the wrong kind.

What’s the solution? We should try to get as much calcium as we possibly can from food sources. Go to The World’s Healthiest Foods, type in calcium to get a list of calcium-rich foods. If you do the math, you’ll see that we get much more calcium in our diet than magnesium. But if you need extra calcium take it in the angstrom form.

Angstrom-sized calcium is at a particle size between a nanometer and picometer and fully absorbed at the cellular level. It’s taken in small dosages and there is nothing left over to calcify any part of the body.

I’m often asked about ionic minerals. Ionic means a charge, not a size, so an ionic supplement is not necessarily smaller than any other minerals on the shelf. I asked the last person who inquired if her ionic magnesium gave her a laxative effect. She said it did. Therefore it can’t be an angstrom-sized product. I personally use and recommend a Pico-Ionic form of magnesium now.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

The problem is that many "citrate" products are made with corn. I'm highly reactive to corn, so any supplement with traces of corn in it will NOT help me to feel better.

The last time I took a magnesium malate supplement, I felt worse while taking it. I later realized that the particular formulation was not corn-free. I found out by emailing the company about it after I'd been taking it a while.

The problem is that many "citrate" products are made with corn. I'm highly reactive to corn, so any supplement with traces of corn in it will NOT help me to feel better.

The last time I took a magnesium malate supplement, I felt worse while taking it. I later realized that the particular formulation was not corn-free. I found out by emailing the company about it after I'd been taking it a while.

I hear you... it's all about reading labels on everything! I generally buy from companies that specifically state known allergens....gluten, wheat, dairy, soy, corn. Sometimes when nothing iswritten on the label, I suspect it's because something in the raw materials could be a problem.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

For the past couple of weeks, I've increased my magnesium intake and greatly reduced my vitamin D intake. I went from taking 10,000 iu of D3 per day, to taking 5,000 iu per week. I'm thinking of NOT ordering more when I buy more supplements next month.

I'm planning to order some supplements next month (ie, next week.) There are some that I've been taking regularly and simply need to re-order. But I want to figure out what kind of magnesium supplement I want before placing that order.

Does anybody know how well the mag chloride is absorbed when consumed orally? I've read all kinds of recommendations for JigSaw brand of magnesium malate and reMag (which apparently has trace minerals along with the magnesium) but those products are significantly more expensive than the mag chloride, especially when I'm buying the mag chloride in the form of bath flakes. Initially, I was only using the mag chloride (1 cup flakes plus 1 cup hot water = 2 cups mag oil) as the topical spray, but in the past couple of weeks I started adding it to my water as well.

Buying more of the mag flakes is probably the cheapest way to go. But is it the smartest?

For the past couple of weeks, I've increased my magnesium intake and greatly reduced my vitamin D intake. I went from taking 10,000 iu of D3 per day, to taking 5,000 iu per week. I'm thinking of NOT ordering more when I buy more supplements next month.

I'm planning to order some supplements next month (ie, next week.) There are some that I've been taking regularly and simply need to re-order. But I want to figure out what kind of magnesium supplement I want before placing that order.

Does anybody know how well the mag chloride is absorbed when consumed orally? I've read all kinds of recommendations for JigSaw brand of magnesium malate and reMag (which apparently has trace minerals along with the magnesium) but those products are significantly more expensive than the mag chloride, especially when I'm buying the mag chloride in the form of bath flakes. Initially, I was only using the mag chloride (1 cup flakes plus 1 cup hot water = 2 cups mag oil) as the topical spray, but in the past couple of weeks I started adding it to my water as well.

Buying more of the mag flakes is probably the cheapest way to go. But is it the smartest?

If I were you, I'd invest in a bottle of Dr. D's vitamin D because it's got co-factors to absorb itbetter....strontium....a mineral not found in most other D formulas. And it's the perfect 2,000 iu.And it's got some K2.

As for magnesium malate, I'd go with Thorne.....because it's a good company and I have neverheard of Jigsaw. I don't think it's an American company. Tell you why. I found a video on youtubefrom Jigsaw....and it's the strangest voice over with a script you read. You know how digitallyautomated dialogue can be transposed so words make no sense when you hear them? Well, thisentire video is simply digitally produced where words like magnesium are pronounced incorrectly.Makes me wonder who this JIgsaw company actually is.

Thanks for the link Chloe. I just asked them if the product is 100% corn free. Many times, the "citrate" part uses corn in the manufacturing. Since you're an A, Chloe, I don't think you react to corn the way I do.

Thanks for the link Chloe. I just asked them if the product is 100% corn free. Many times, the "citrate" part uses corn in the manufacturing. Since you're an A, Chloe, I don't think you react to corn the way I do.

Corn is a black dot for me and I'm generally not someone who reacts to corn anyway.

See, the fact that we walk around with achy bodies, sometimes it's truly difficult to distinguishbetween the ingestion of a food or supplement as the true cause of a bad day vs magnesiumlevels slipping below par. So many of our ongoing symptoms are related magnesium deficiencyI've often blamed some foods I might have not really reacted to as the culprit.

My point is that when the day isn't perfect to begin with....how does one know exactly what makes us feel worse?

I'm now fortifying myself with multiple different forms of magnesium when I wake up.....the mag oil all over body as soon as I get out of bed, the intake of one mag citramate, one magnesium glycinate with breakfast, then sipping Natural Calm in all my drinking water plus this new formula called Remag which I'm testing for the first time this week.. (which is Carolyn Dean's product) only it's literally impossible to find an actual place to order it. I somehow ordered one bottle two weeks ago from a link on her website and will just have to call the phone number on that bottle to re-order. I cannot seem to find an actual ordering page on the internet.

I can't tell which product is working best. None of them last all day. I have to repeat the processwith dinner.....I'm thinking if I can just build some mag storage with the mag oil, perhaps I'll needto take less orally.

I feel I'm making progress. I do notice improvement. Knees can get very stiff but that's joints/arthritis and not muscle or nerve pain.

Here's a list of known magnesium deficiency symptoms. Sometimes my symptoms like these feellike they're related to eating offending foods.....but is that in my mind? HaveI just been so low in magnesium for so long, that eating one toxin "seems" like it's REALLY toxic when in fact, it's the same old magnesium deficiency I'm dealing with for over 25 years. Dunno!

I wonder if mag. deficiency causes people to have pain in their jaws, shoulders, etc., when they are about to have a heart attack.

You're probably correct because people with low mag are more likely to have a heart attack because calcium tightens and magnesium loosens the muscles....and muscles, as in heart muscle...shoulder muscles, jaw muscles....all muscles that would need to relax if constricted.

And when muscles are so tight, nerves are impinged.

Most everyone is mag deficient but nobody is measuring levels or discussing this in conventionalmedicine.

Attention: Ruthie.....remember when you had numb feet and couldn't figure out why.....got no medical explanation. Wondering if you were taking a lot of D at the time, which likely lowered your magnesium.

I wonder if mag. deficiency causes people to have pain in their jaws, shoulders, etc., when they are about to have a heart attack.

On a similar note - I used to have severe palpitations along with a tight feeling in my heart, during a very stressful time in my life. Increasing my Magnesium just vanished both of those symptoms. I have read that a heart needs plenty of mag. in order to relax between beats.

Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.Let me not pass you by in quest of some rare and perfect tomorrow.~Mary Jean Irion

Have to share my super speedy application of magnesium oil. I dampen a folded (into a square) sheet ofpaper towel....then saturate with magnesium oil. Wipe down my arms, legs, backs of legs, torso, shoulders, hips, thighs....It dries super quickly because it's not as slimy and damp as if I sprayed myself.And nothing winds up on the floor or under my feet where I can slip on it. I put the paper towel that'ssaturated into a zip lock bag....Use it again the next morning. SO simple....far better than messy spraying.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

On a similar note - I used to have severe palpitations along with a tight feeling in my heart, during a very stressful time in my life. Increasing my Magnesium just vanished both of those symptoms. I have read that a heart needs plenty of mag. in order to relax between beats.

I'm not really sure I need so much magnesium. I have tried to increase my dosage before and ran into problems. Last night my heart was skipping beats - actually it was more or less stopping and starting again. I can see where more magnesium would help palpitations, but this seems to be causing the opposite problem! I've always seemed to react weirdly to some supplements. I know that being overly tired will cause my heart to miss beats, but I didn't feel all that tired last night.

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

I'm not really sure I need so much magnesium. I have tried to increase my dosage before and ran into problems. Last night my heart was skipping beats - actually it was more or less stopping and starting again. I can see where more magnesium would help palpitations, but this seems to be causing the opposite problem! I've always seemed to react weirdly to some supplements. I know that being overly tired will cause my heart to miss beats, but I didn't feel all that tired last night.

I wound up in the ER many years ago from nearly drowning myself in mag oil....same experience,palpitations and racing heart.

There is a link about why this could happen. I've copied and pasted from something writtenby Carolyn Dean.

MAGNESIUM MAKES ME FEEL WORSE AND WHY

There are five main reasons why you might feel worse after taking magnesium.

1. You’re not taking enough: When people feel worse with magnesium, I believe that the 1,300 enzyme systems that require magnesium just get jump-started and They Want More! (I used to write that magnesium was necessary in 325 enzyme systems but now we’re learning that 80% of the enzyme systems in the body require magnesium, which means 1,300!)

In the above statement, our reader said she couldn’t take more that 200-300 mg. But all 1,300 enzyme systems want a piece of the action once they’re been woken up! And with each enzyme system pumping away they are using up the little magnesium you gave them and, like I said, They Want More!

This doesn’t mean that you’ll have to keep increasing your magnesium ad infinitum! You will reach a saturation point of your magnesium stores and actually be able to decrease your magnesium intake. However, our reader above isn’t going to get anywhere near the amount she needs if she keeps getting the laxative effect on 200-300mg. That’s one of the main reason I decided to promote Pico-Ionic Magnesium. It’s absorbed 100% at the cellular level and has no laxative effect. So you can take as much as you require to eliminate all your magnesium deficiency symptoms.

2. You’re taking too much: You can also feel worse on magnesium if you take too much, too soon. This usually happens if you have fatigue and weakness from magnesium deficiency. Anyone in this category should start very slowly on any new supplement or drug. If you take a high dose of magnesium right from the start it’s like taking muscles that powered a bicycle and expect them to power a jet. Your body might just be so weak that revving up 1,300 enzyme systems all at once makes you feel jangled and even anxious because you don’t know what’s going on. Start with ¼ of the recommended dose of magnesium and work up as your body adapts.

3. You’re on meds and as your health conditions improve, your meds are suddenly becoming “toxic.” That’s because you may not require them anymore! Check with your doctor when you are using magnesium to treat health conditions and want to wean off your meds. For example, magnesium helps lower blood pressure. If you continue to take the same amounts of BP meds, your BP might get too low. This is not a “side effect” of magnesium. It’s a side effect of taking drugs when you don’t need them. Magnesium balances blood pressure. If you have low BP to begin with and are not on meds, start magnesium very slowly because, as I describe in #2, you want your body to slowly adapt to a mineral you may have been deficient in for a long time.

4. You’re taking too much Vitamin D: Here’s what happens. You feel great on your magnesium and then you begin to feel worse after adding a high dose Vitamin D supplement. Magnesium is required to transform Vitamin D from its storage form to its active form. That means if you take the extremely high doses that allopathic doctors are now recommending you can plummet into magnesium deficiency and not know what the heck is happening. In general, I don’t recommend more than1,000-2,000 iu of Vitamin D daily for this reason. And never take Vitamin D without magnesium.

5. You are taking too much calcium and it’s pushing out your magnesium: Read Why I Hate Calcium to understand why the most prescribed mineral is not a piriah because it’s causing heart disease in women.

6. You’re just taking magnesium and becoming dehydrated because you don’t take any other trace minerals. Read The Solution for Dehydration and take 1/8-1/4 tsp of sea salt in every pint of water you drink. How much water per day? Half your body weight in ounces of water. My new ReLyte, mineral and electrolyte formula is the next step in proper mineral balance.

7. Magnesium is getting into your cells and detoxifying chemicals and heavy metals. Sometimes this can feel like a healing reaction. That’s why with a pico-ionic magnesium like ReMag, which is 100% absorbed at the cellular level, I recommend to build up your dosage slowly as the cells detoxify and are finally able to work efficiently.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Well, I don't see anything in that that addresses the heart skipping beats. Palpitations seem to be the symptom that shows up in connection with magnesium the most. I have been taking magnesium for fifty years so it isn't as if my body is new at this, either. I never jump in whole hog with any new additions to my regimen except the crazy Vitamin D plan my doctor had for me. That certainly didn't work! According to testing, I don't have masses of heavy metals housed in my system, either. I eat sea salt every day and take other minerals besides calcium. My osteopenia has not progressed an iota during the last several years - in fact, the numbers have looked better for some time. And I wouldn't think increasing 400 mgs. of magnesium over a period of time a huge deal. Before I had the Clorox episode I had low blood pressure. It is back down to normal now without meds but can easily get too low. I feel great and can do most anything I want to do physically. If I want a smallish tree cut down, I can saw it down myself. I have been doing a tremendous amount of clearing in the yard this spring. I enjoy it to the fullest! So I wonder what the famous Carolyn Dean would have to say about all this..... For my part, I am going to drop back on the magnesium as I did before and see what happens.

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

HEART PALPITATIONS FROM MAGNESIUMMagnesium is a mineral with central importance in the normal function of your heart. It also helps form your bones and teeth, and plays a vital role in other organs throughout your body, including your kidneys and muscles. However, if you take too much magnesium, you can experience symptoms that include an irregular heartbeat, a symptom sometimes indicated by the presence of fluttering, or rapid heartbeats called palpitations.

THE BASICSMagnesium occurs naturally in a variety of foods, including spinach, soybeans, potatoes, halibut, almonds, avocados and lentils, according to the National Institutes of Health's Office of Dietary Supplements. It is also manufactured in supplemental forms that include magnesium carbonate, magnesium oxide, magnesium chloride, magnesium lactate and magnesium citrate. Different magnesium products carry different amounts of the mineral, and your body's relative ability to absorb and utilize this magnesium supplement depends on the form you consume.

MAGNESIUM TOXICITYWhen taken solely from dietary sources, magnesium presents no real danger to your health, the Office of Dietary Supplements reports. However, when taken in large amounts in supplemental form, the mineral can produce toxic effects that include not only heartbeat irregularities, but also breathing difficulties, nausea, diarrhea, dangerously low blood pressure, muscle weakness and loss of appetite. Adults and children over the age of 9 have a maximum safe daily magnesium intake level of 350 mg. Children ages of 4 to 8 have a maximum safe daily intake of 110 mg, while children ages 1 to 3 have a maximum safe intake of 65 mg. Safe magnesium intake for infants has not been established.

HEART PALPITATIONSIn addition to rapid or fluttering heartbeat, the Mayo Clinic lists potential symptoms of heart palpitations, including skipped heartbeats and heartbeats that produce an abnormally distinct pumping sensation. Depending on your circumstances, palpitations may manifest in your chest, neck or throat. You can develop palpitations whether you are resting or involved in physical activities. If you are resting, you can develop palpitations regardless of your current body position.

PALPITATIONS AND MAGNESIUMIn most cases, heart palpitations are medically harmless, the Mayo Clinic reports. However, palpitations can sometimes indicate the presence of deeper heart problems, including heartbeat irregularities and unusually fast or slow heartbeat. Seek immediate medical attention for heart palpitations if they happen in combination with symptoms such as fainting, chest pain or discomfort, shortness of breath or dizziness. If you experience heart palpitations while taking a magnesium supplement, ask your doctor if they could be related to magnesium consumption.

CONSIDERATIONSIf you have too little magnesium in your system, you can also develop heartbeat irregularities and other symptoms similar to those found in magnesium overdose, the Office of Dietary Supplements notes. If you have kidney failure, you have an increased risk for a toxic reaction to magnesium supplements. You can also develop a toxic reaction if you take large doses of antacids or laxatives that contain magnesium. Consult your doctor for advice on these products.

So it would be interesting to know how much magnesium you ladies have been ingesting, bathing in, applying, eating, maybe even breathing, etc.! I think you all are getting a lot more than I am! Chloe, I have been reading about magnesium for years. Especially, though, during the time I was having the problems with high blood pressure, but thanks for the links anyway! As with the Vitamin D conundrum, nobody really knows whether we are taking enough, too much or the right amount. So I will continue with Plan B and see what happens.... I don't have all the pain you people have talked about having. The only reason I increased my intake was to see if it would help me sleep longer.

I am beginning to wonder if my chest was somehow affected by the fall I had on my right side when I was a child and any strenuous activity that affects it puts physical pressure on my heart. Actually, that is what it feels like. I really have a hard time with even the pressure of a bra under those circumstances, but I have been blaming that on my esophageal problem. But now I am wondering if this might be connected too. I feel like I am going to die if I lie flat of my back, so I don't without being elevated.

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

For the past couple of weeks, I've increased my magnesium intake and greatly reduced my vitamin D intake. I went from taking 10,000 iu of D3 per day, to taking 5,000 iu per week. I'm thinking of NOT ordering more when I buy more supplements next month.

I'm planning to order some supplements next month (ie, next week.) There are some that I've been taking regularly and simply need to re-order. But I want to figure out what kind of magnesium supplement I want before placing that order.

Does anybody know how well the mag chloride is absorbed when consumed orally? I've read all kinds of recommendations for JigSaw brand of magnesium malate and reMag (which apparently has trace minerals along with the magnesium) but those products are significantly more expensive than the mag chloride, especially when I'm buying the mag chloride in the form of bath flakes. Initially, I was only using the mag chloride (1 cup flakes plus 1 cup hot water = 2 cups mag oil) as the topical spray, but in the past couple of weeks I started adding it to my water as well.

Buying more of the mag flakes is probably the cheapest way to go. But is it the smartest?

Thanks ruthie for the link. I don't post on fb but I can log in with my sister's password and get to thepage.

Spring....My magnesium intake is this: In the AM I'm wiping down my body with magnesium oil. Howmuch coverage I'm getting from a damp paper towel saturated with mag oil is guesswork. A few Tmaybe and some is likely left on the paper towel.

Orally, I take one mag citrate/malate capsule from Thorne which is 150 mg.

and one mag glycinate which is 100 mg. with breakfast.

I usually go by body aches and pains from that point on.

I put 2 teaspoons of Natural Calm in a 32 oz bottle of water and sip that until the bottle isgone. That's 350 mg of mag citrate.

Usually that's going to take me through to maybe 3 pm.

Dinner, I repeat the mag malate but not the glycinate. So that's another 150 mg.

And any adjustments I might want to make are with mag oil or epsom salts. I do not take more pills or powder.

I've read that people over 70 absorb about 2/3 less than what they could absorb when they were 30.That's my reason for taking as much as I do.

But in all reality, we're supposed to be getting 400 mg of magnesium daily and don't know how muchof what I'm eating in the way of high mag foods is being full absorbed.

And I doubt a person can OD on mag oil when used transdermally. I felt I was never really getting great benefits from it alone.

Although I've been taking 2,000 iu of Dr. D's vitamin D....phyto D daily.....every now and then, I take a little more just to make sure my level won't drop. But from now till end of summer, I will spend much more time outdoors in the sun. I keep reminding myself that if my D intake is too high before my magnesium storage is optimum, the end result is that I'm going to become more deficient in magnesium.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

I'm outside for hours nearly every day during the summer and somewhat less during the winter. I took 575 mgs. of four different types of magnesium today. I have taken at least 375-400 mgs. a day of these different types for decades besides what I got in food.

When I think of how healthy my parents were without taking a single pill of any description on a regular basis, I can't help but wonder just how much we are "overdosing!" They never had any broken bones or bad knees or hips. They were outside a lot and very active. I am all for taking anything that will make us better able to handle life's challenges whatever they may be, but I don't want to shorten my life in the process or bring on unexpected complications.

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

I'm outside for hours nearly every day during the summer and somewhat less during the winter. I took 575 mgs. of four different types of magnesium today. I have taken at least 375-400 mgs. a day of these different types for decades besides what I got in food.

When I think of how healthy my parents were without taking a single pill of any description on a regular basis, I can't help but wonder just how much we are "overdosing!" They never had any broken bones or bad knees or hips. They were outside a lot and very active. I am all for taking anything that will make us better able to handle life's challenges whatever they may be, but I don't want to shorten my life in the process or bring on unexpected complications.

Has your vitamin D level been measured? With plenty of magnesium (which you're obviouslygetting), you should be absorbing plenty of D from sunshine. But only if the mag you're ingestingis being absorbed. That's my only reason for continuing with the topical magnesium. I'veread on Carolyn Dean's site that it takes 4-6 weeks to raise magnesium storage levels. I can tell when my muscles feel relaxed that my magnesium is adequate. And it takes a whopping amountfor me to reach bowel tolerance....so I know I've been deficient for way too long.

My vitamin D level is 72. It's been holding steady for a few years. I took a lot of D to get it from50 to 70s (7,000 iu daily in winters) but at the same time, although my D level went up, I feltmy muscles getting tighter. I think it's possible for some people to absorb more D than othersfrom supplements and little sunshine, even without optimum levels of magnesium. For those who sit in the sun and still have low D, I'm not sure the ONLY shortfall is magnesium. Might be other co-factors that influence D.

Rather than ingest too many pills with the fear of overdosing, the safest form of magnesium islikely the transdermal. I intend to lower my oral magnesium when topical magnesium doesthe trick by itself. So far, it hasn't happened but I'm not always ritualistic with mag oil. Doing that more regularly now. WIll update after 4-6 weeks of applying mag oil daily to share my progress.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Chloe, one point of my post was that my parents never bothered about Vitamin D levels and all the other stuff we are discussing here, but they were healthy with no bone and joint issues that are gone over endlessly on the forum. I feel wonderful, and after considering everything, I think overdoing was the cause of my problem the other night with my heart. Sometimes things are just that simple!

I get diarrhea if I take more of any form of magnesium than I am taking now. With the diet I am eating I probably don't even need to be taking any at all! There is no telling how much I consumed in my breakfast this AM!

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

Chloe, one point of my post was that my parents never bothered about Vitamin D levels and all the other stuff we are discussing here, but they were healthy with no bone and joint issues that are gone over endlessly on the forum. I feel wonderful, and after considering everything, I think overdoing was the cause of my problem the other night with my heart. Sometimes things are just that simple!

I get diarrhea if I take more of any form of magnesium than I am taking now. With the diet I am eating I probably don't even need to be taking any at all! There is no telling how much I consumed in my breakfast this AM!

The rule of thumb (according to Çarolyn Dean) is that you take magnesium UP TO boweltolerance. So by what you're saying, you've reached bowel tolerance at your present dose.I'm constipated on less than what I'm taking....so I know I'm deficient. My bowel toleranceis higher than most.

My grandparents moved around a whole lot more than I think most of us are doing. They didn'thave TV or computers and my grandmother stood on her feet all day long in the kitchen anddoing all her own housework, reaching, lifting....hanging clothes out outdoors to dry after wringing them out manually, lifting baskets of heavy wet laundry. Carrying that basket upfrom a basement in an apartment building to the 3rd floor. No elevator in her pre war building. Never sitting down at all. Standing is weight bearing....and many of us aren't standing on our feet these days and certainly not doing as much physical activity as generations before us did.

We are rather forced to exercise for a lack of activities that would have been natural exercise as our parents/grandparents did. My grandparentscouldn't drive....walked in NYC everywhere, came home from shopping, carried heavy packagesup a few flights of stairs.....So much different that we don't think about unless we try tocompare lifestyles....... Today, so much office work, sitting down at computers. I think we're all guilty of this behavior although very used to it and it's a way of life.....not a judgement about ourway of life, but it has consequences. Kids today are even lazier....overweight, eating the wrongdiets....and diabetes is rampant in young children. Sad

Dunno....no need for my parents or grandparents to have swallowed pills....I grew up taking a basic vitamin formula....doctors were pushing parents way back then to fortify diets withvitamins. Who or what was behind those companies then.....do not know.

My kids got baby liquid vitamins from pediatrician.....I continued to give them a basic multi.My kids are in worse shape at their age than the generations prior.....Both have back issues....gut problems...I didn't grow up with back problems or gut problems.....neither did my husband.

My kids got lots of vaccines that I didn't ever have. And I fed them as healthy as I knew how todo....but fast food restaurants existed, kids had b'day parties at places like this....it wasn'twithin my state of consciousness then to have put them on a whole foods diet, avoiding gluten grains, sugars and transfats. I knew less then than I know now. And now my kids who areraising children of their own know more because healthy eating is on a lot of parents' radarscreens. Sadly, many parents are still clueless....which is why mandates about what can beput into our foods is sometimes controlled by politicians. Other times, our very intention tofight bad food practices are so heavily controlled by agri-business that junk food reigns whenit is doing so much harm.

It's just the way our culture has progressed.....more processed foods.....make up the differencewith pills I never saw a fast food restaurant growing up. Just different and probably so muchworse for everyone's health.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Yes, Chloe and Spring - I think about the lives my grandparents lived. Both my maternal and paternal grandparents lived rural lives, raising their own livestock, growing nearly all their own foods. One set of grandparents homesteaded 200 acres at the turn of the century, having 10 kids, half of whom were raised in a log cabin; the other half in the 'nice' house that Grandpa built. Never a phone, television or radio, or car. They had an outdoor toilet, and a pump with cold water from the well for the house. They worked from morning to night, ate lots of vegetables, fruit from their orchard, meat - either fresh, smoked, dried or canned. Lots of flour also. Grandpa lived to his upper 90's, Grandma died in her late 80's.The other grandparents lived a similar life, but on a smaller scale and with electricity, radio, telephone later on. I lived next door to them and we shared a big garden between three families. Fresh jersey milk. This grandad built houses with no power tools and they were works of art. He worked slowly, carefully and steadily. Both of them lived into their mid-80's.

But my parents came of age along with junk food - convenience food, it was called. It became a mixed bag of fresh food from the garden (sprayed heavily with pesticides), lots of outdoor play for me, tree climbing, mountains to run in, lakes and swimming pools (along with the new thing - television - to sit and stare at), country food (along with packaged foods of every fake color and flavor with lots of sugar).

And here we are today with the world as it is. I do my best to stay in touch with the outdoor world and getting myself out into it as much as possible. I have practiced hatha yoga, tai chi and qigong most of my life. I've switched to a standing computer station. I split my own firewood and heat my house with the wood. But a lifetime of fast food has weakened my body in a way that my grandparents didn't deal with. My health has been a struggle all my life and the supplements that I wish I didn't have to take, have made a lot of difference for the better. They sort of hold me together as eating right (finally) for the past 14 years is slowly, steadily healing me.

Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.Let me not pass you by in quest of some rare and perfect tomorrow.~Mary Jean Irion

Sort of a prickly sensation....yes, it happens to some people with sensitive skin. Suggest you diluteit until your body gets used to it.

Here's some mag oil info from a supplier. It mentions the prickly sensation people have. I wouldtry it as a foot soak if the topical is really annoying. But I did get used to it after a few weeks of use

Got this from a different website talking about magnesium and detoxing. When you think of thecapacity of the body to heal and the ability for cells to make good copies of themselves, this is very important information.

"Abundant magnesium allows for the creation of energy needed to pump excess calcium from cells and thereby to maintain proper calcium to magnesium ratio within cells. Excess calcium in cells reduces the amount of available magnesium and rigidifies cell membranes, thereby reducing cell function. In addition, the entry of calcium into cells can overwhelm the capacity of ATPase to remove it.

When too much calcium enters into a cell, entry of magnesium is blocked, and the cell loses its ability to pump out calcium.

When this occurs, the cell cannot transport nutrients, regulate its membrane, or preserve proper concentration gradients of minerals within itself or in the fluid outside its membrane (extracellular fluid). It is critical that proper concentration gradients of minerals be maintained in order that cells avoid being overwhelmed by toxic substances, including calcium and toxic metals".

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

My homeopath told me today to take Magnesium Glycinate so I can get more magnesium with less bowel tolerance trouble.

I was also told to take mag glycinate by an ND (not Dr. D) and although I took it for quite awhileI feel it's just not the right formula for me.

Although it didn't bother my gut and I could take a whole lot of pills, without coming close tobowel tolerance, I felt it wasn't being absorbed at all. Only thing I feel is absorbed isNatural Calm which is mag citrate....but I don't take more than is recommended on the package.And it's dissolved in a lot of water and sipped all day long.

For me, the best way to absorb magnesium is spreading out oral doses and using transdermalmag.

Wishing you good luck in raising your mag level.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

I still haven't gotten any response back from any of the companies about their products being corn-free. I'm going to stick with the mag citrate (purchased as "bath salts") until I get confirmation that other forms are safe. This is also far cheaper than any alternatives. I'm using the mag oil spray on my body about 5-6 times a week, plus putting some of the mag citrate in my drinking water, along with sea salt. I can always add more mag supplements later.

The only thing that's frustrating is that it's hard to know EXACTLY how much I'm getting this way. I might want to figure out a better system for calculating how much I'm using- perhaps mix up some mag oil with the sea salt already added into a different container (not a spray bottle) and measure how much goes into each cup, or maybe make up a big batch in some sort of pitcher to refill my cups from. Make a new batch each day with the day's supply of mag and sea salt.

I'll figure something out. I need to make more mag oil today anyway- I'm using it up much faster now than I used to.

This is an intersting discussion & I hope it doesn't scare people into not getting enough mangnesium. That happened to me with Vitamin A over 30 years ago. I really needed more than average, but was having way too little. I was a nursing mom & should have had lots more!I still take more A than average & take magnesium.

I would think that in doubt, take the average amount & see how it works.I remember that I was eating lots of foods that were supposed to be high in 'maggie' but still wasn't getting enough, so my absorption was bad.

Ruthie, I'm thinking rather than risking diarrhea with too much oral mag citrate, it wouldbe safer to use mag oil more than once a day if you feel you need it.

Yesterday, I had two servings of Natural Calm which I believe brought me just under the threshold ofbowel tolerance. Without a decent amount of magnesium citrate, I'm always constipated, even if I use a lot of mag oil...so I feel I can tolerate more oral magnesium than other people. And the mag citrate seems to do more for relaxing my muscles than the topical magnesium....although I think this has more to do with an absorption issue. What I don't absorb is going to loosen my stool, which for me, is a good thing. But for you, Ruthie....not sure this is in your best interest.

I can definitely feel more muscle pain when I'm not consistent with the mag. In the past, when I was taking mag pills, I'd found I could increase my dosage on "more sore" days and get relief.

I can't do more transdermal mag. It's hard enough to fit into my schedule already. Remember that I cannot stand the feeling of mag oil on my skin; using mag oil requires getting undressed, covering myself with mag oil, putting something back on, then showering and changing my clothes again 20+ minutes later. Or I can soak in a tub for 20 minutes. Neither is practical if somebody else needs the bathroom, or I have to be dressed so I can go pick a child up from somewhere, or chaperone a pile of middle-school boys in my living room or basement, or Hannah wants my company as she works in the yard... On the days I feel the worst, and am most likely to need extra mag, I'm even less likely to find the energy to use the transdermal mag.

I'm not sure if it's from the extra mag or my inconsistent use of egoscue exercises, but my back, neck, and shoulders DO hurt less than they used to.

I'm finding the mag oil on my skin less irritating than when I started using it. For a second use, I often just wipe the tops of my feet or fronts of my legs with a folded damp paper towel saturated in mag oil (i just keep the used towel in a zip lock bag and saturate it over and over again) Yesterday I had to wipe down my legs in the middle of the day because after rebounding they ached, but after 20 minutes just got another wet paper towel and wiped it all off. I don't find the need to re-apply the mag oil everywhere...just arms or legs and then remove it without showering. When it's not covering your entire body, it might not feel quite so irritating. If it's on my arms and I'm wearing short sleevesI can just run my arm under the sink faucet and get it off easily. Try a few "touch ups" of mag oilon just one spot at a time and see if you find it more tolerable. If of course, you can tolerate a decentamount of oral mag, then it's not a problem...Not everyone can.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

I don't seem to have a problem with the mag chloride orally. I can taste when the water seems "too strong" or "just right." Drink too much of the stuff that tastes too strong and I get loose bowels. Keep on drinking large quantities of the dilution that tastes good to me, and my bowels are fine. I'll use a second cup to properly dilute it if necessary- but now I know about how much to use and I don't over-pour nearly as much as did the first few days of this routine.

I just made more mag oil- I filled 2 spray bottles (for the bathroom and bedroom) and I also filled an empty molasses bottle to keep in the kitchen, rather than using one of the spray bottles in there. I also rinsed out the bottles so they spray more easily, and I had the idea to filter the mag oil this time- so I ran it through a tea strainer before putting into all 3 bottles.

I got the low vitamin D levels while I was using only the transdermal mag. I've stopped the supplemental vitamin D, and I don't feel comfortable doing that without significantly raising my mag intake.

I wonder if my body is using extra mag to detox the mercury from my mouth. If so, that would explain my extra-high need for mag right now.

Michael Lam, M.D., M.P.H., A.B.A.A.M., is a western trained physician specializing in nutritional and anti-aging medicine. Dr. Lam received his Bachelor of Science degree from Oregon State University, and his Doctor of Medicine degree from the Loma Linda University School of Medicine in California. He also holds a Master’s degree in Public Health. He is board certified by the American Board of Anti-Aging Medicine where he has also served as a board examiner. Dr. Lam is a pioneer in using nontoxic, natural compounds to promote the healing of many age-related degenerative conditions. He utilizes optimum blends of nutritional supplementation that manipulate food, vitamins, natural hormones, herbs, enzymes, and minerals into specific protocols to rejuvenate cellular function.

"Most adults are walking around with estrogen dominance due to our diet and exposure to environmental estrogen. Excessive estrogen reduces circulating Magnesium, leading to a relative excess of calcium. So any excessive calcium will only increase even more the already high ca/mg ratio in the presence of high estrogen. The lesions of arteries and heart caused by experimental Mg deficiency have been well documented and may contribute to human cardiovascular disease. Estrogen's enhancement of Mg utilization and uptake by soft tissues and bone may explain resistance of young women to heart disease and osteoporosis, as well as increased prevalence of these diseases when estrogen secretion ceases.

In summary:

a. Most of us are in an estrogen dominant environment, resulting in lowered Magnesium.

b. Most of us can easily get into a calcium dominant environment. Reason: Too little magnesium.

c. Most of us are in a magnesium deficient state.

As a result, we all end up with too much calcium.

What do you do? Simply reduce calcium intake and increase Magnesium. The ideal ratio is Ca/Mg ratio of 1 to 2 for adults. The same rule does not apply to growing children, and does not apply to those who are on whole food.

a. Obtain intracellular calcium and magnesium blood level if you want to be scientific about it.

b. Reduce calcium to 300-500 mg a day.

c. Increase magnesium to 500-1000 a day, or as tolerated (excessive amount can cause diarrhea).

You know, I haven't thought to ask, because last time I saw him, I wasn't so heavily focused on all this research I'm doing on magnesium and there wasn't this "aha" moment for me about all thedifferent issues magnesium deficiency is connected to......but I will ask....Next time DH and I go back is August....I do want to know what he thinks and do want to understand why there is aClear Cal formula and calcium in his mineral formulas that seems clearly out of balance to mefor a person who needs to raise their magnesium levels. I'm confused by the focus on calciumrather than magnesium in these NAP supplements....I feel calcium as a supplement is an issuefor me and my husband, although he doesn't really have much dairy on his diet and the foodshe could be eating high in calcium he doesn't like. But can't say he eats enough high magnesiumfoods to counteract any calcium he might take in... One of DH's issues for seeing Dr. D was elevated blood pressure....and despite all the supplements he was given with his SWAMI,it was never mentioned for him to take magnesium nor did magnesium come up with the shiftas a solution or adjunct solution for high blood pressure. I give him magnesium as a precautionand so did Dina Khader who he saw prior to seeing Dr. D.

If I didn't use myself as a lab rat, experimenting with high doses of magnesium, I wouldn't befocusing in this direction. But I know what I know and sometimes when you're the lab rat, whatyou know about your body trumps what people are telling you about yourself...

I'm glad you asked this question....I'm going to make it a point to find out what Dr. D thinksabout magnesium. WIth all he researches and focuses on, I'm quite sure he knows more thanwe do about this subject....but sometimes a lab rat just needs to question things.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

I'm glad you asked this question....I'm going to make it a point to find out what Dr. D thinksabout magnesium. WIth all he researches and focuses on, I'm quite sure he knows more thanwe do about this subject....but sometimes a lab rat just needs to question things.

Great. thanks. I never remmebered to ask him either. I'd like to know why I had a bad reaction to it for myself. Have you tried lecithin granules for your husband's high blood pressure? It really lowers it.. so much I have to really cut back on it. Recommended amount is a tablespoon a day and I take about a tsp or 2 in my smoothie. Dr. McDougall would say that the whole mineral problem is from dairy. If people stop dairy, their bodies are able to absorb calcium, and magnesium and the other minerals again. There is a person one of his star dougallers that had osetoporosis and reversed it going off dairy.

It's a good thing I COMPLETELY understand, or I'd have to laugh about this bunch of women whose lives consist of getting enough magnesium.

But yes, I was panicking about it in the shower, and then I drove to the grocery store to search out the mag oil or gel (never found any) where I began to get a cramp, popped magnesium and then realized the cramp was from other imbalances and quickly threw together a salad, paid for it and ate it- and was fine.

where I began to get a cramp, popped magnesium and then realized the cramp was from other imbalances and quickly threw together a salad, paid for it and ate it- and was fine.

Your cramp likely was from not drinking enough water daily. Muscle cramping is a symptom of dehydration. 64 oz a day. I also suspect if one is not hydrated enough, one's body cannot absorb and use minerals and vitamins either.

It's a good thing I COMPLETELY understand, or I'd have to laugh about this bunch of women whose lives consist of getting enough magnesium.

But yes, I was panicking about it in the shower, and then I drove to the grocery store to search out the mag oil or gel (never found any) where I began to get a cramp, popped magnesium and then realized the cramp was from other imbalances and quickly threw together a salad, paid for it and ate it- and was fine.

Good for you, Kescah!!

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

Great. thanks. I never remmebered to ask him either. I'd like to know why I had a bad reaction to it for myself. Have you tried lecithin granules for your husband's high blood pressure? It really lowers it.. so much I have to really cut back on it. Recommended amount is a tablespoon a day and I take about a tsp or 2 in my smoothie. Dr. McDougall would say that the whole mineral problem is from dairy. If people stop dairy, their bodies are able to absorb calcium, and magnesium and the other minerals again. There is a person one of his star dougallers that had osetoporosis and reversed it going off dairy.

We are both taking lecithin....1 T every AM in a membrane fluidizer drink mixed with flax oil and juice. DHeats practically no dairy anymore and I eat it sometimes but only my diamond cheeses/some yogurt.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Interesting topic! What I recommend for my client's is the same mineral form Dr D'Adamo uses in his Phytocal products for each blood type eg. the magnesium used in the Phytocal A is Magnesium Citrate, Phytocal B is Magnesium Oxide, Phytocal O is Magnesium Citrate and Phytocal AB is Magnesium Oxide. In most cases I have found that just taking the Phytocal products without additional magnesium works wonders. Good, natural products which are easily assimilated can make a huge difference.

What I recommend for my client's is the same mineral form Dr D'Adamo uses in his Phytocal products for each blood type eg. the magnesium used in the Phytocal A is Magnesium Citrate, Phytocal B is Magnesium Oxide, Phytocal O is Magnesium Citrate and Phytocal AB is Magnesium Oxide.

Good reasoning, Kiwi.

Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.Let me not pass you by in quest of some rare and perfect tomorrow.~Mary Jean Irion

I had my magnesium experience today when I ran out of regular store bought magnesium a few days ago. I did not notice the new bottle that my father had bought to replace the empty one. Well, lo and behold - asthma attack and inflamed lungs! Argh. I took the pills from the new bottle and found relief within 20-30 minutes. I found that magnesium has similar effects to my steroid inhalers. So glad Dr. D. found the magnesium and B connection. I was able to cut out all my asthma medications after starting the GTD. I only need to take magnesium on a daily basis.

We are both taking lecithin....1 T every AM in a membrane fluidizer drink mixed with flax oil and juice. DHeats practically no dairy anymore and I eat it sometimes but only my diamond cheeses/some yogurt.

And his BP is still high? He's internalizing his stress. He needs yoga, or chi gong and meditation..he can mentally learn to lower his BP with his mind alone. The mind controls the body. Most of the time it's our subconscious mind controlling it. He's got some kind of belief that he can't let his stress show and he interlizes it causing high BP. He's got to change his belief.

And his BP is still high? He's internalizing his stress. He needs yoga, or chi gong and meditation..he can mentally learn to lower his BP with his mind alone. The mind controls the body. Most of the time it's our subconscious mind controlling it. He's got some kind of belief that he can't let his stress show and he interlizes it causing high BP. He's got to change his belief.

No, his B/P is not still high....last few readings were good! Better diet, Tranquility Base.....+ magnesium.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Since I'm making dairy kefir on a regular basis, and therefore getting more calcium in my diet, I'm taking more magnesium. I do notice that when I eat foods high in calcium and don't take enough (or any) magnesium, I get foot cramps in the night.

“Those who say it can’t be done need to get out of the way of those who are doing it.”

Since I'm making dairy kefir on a regular basis, and therefore getting more calcium in my diet, I'm taking more magnesium. I do notice that when I eat foods high in calcium and don't take enough (or any) magnesium, I get foot cramps in the night.

Good news

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Probably not enough plain water, but I do drink somewhere between 1/2 to 1 gallon of liquids in the form of water kefir, herbal tea, and water... why do you ask?

I'm researching the correlation of muscle cramps with proper hydration. My mother had severe night thigh cramps and she was dehydrated. You drink a gallon of liquid a day? awesome. Do you sweat profusely? If one sweats a lot, that's how you lose electrolytes and mostly salt.

I'm researching the correlation of muscle cramps with proper hydration. My mother had severe night thigh cramps and she was dehydrated. You drink a gallon of liquid a day? awesome. Do you sweat profusely? If one sweats a lot, that's how you lose electrolytes and mostly salt.

I don't sweat a lot; mostly just when it's hot.

“Those who say it can’t be done need to get out of the way of those who are doing it.”

I'm researching the correlation of muscle cramps with proper hydration. My mother had severe night thigh cramps and she was dehydrated. You drink a gallon of liquid a day? awesome. Do you sweat profusely? If one sweats a lot, that's how you lose electrolytes and mostly salt.

Please share your research findings. I'm sure it will help many people. I've read by the time youfeel thirsty you're already very dehydrated.

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Thanks, Mayflowers, for the reminder to drink lots of water. It's hard to balance getting everything often enough. I am way overdue for water and also for my homeopathic remedy. I'm eating well though, made my ghee and soaked my nuts, made kefir and planted a veggie garden!

Are you getting enough of the other minerals? My foot cramps were always relieved by magnesium until just last week when two doses would not help. I wound up in the hospital in pain, and blood tests showed that I was fine on all minerals except a trace low on potassium.

I didn't want to take potassium, because it caused a cramp to get worse some years ago- I've avoided it ever since.

The next day, I called my homeopath, who insisted I start on potassium salt. Once I did that, my foot cramps have been alleviated even though I am cutting back on magnesium. I just don't need so much now.

Are you getting enough of the other minerals? My foot cramps were always relieved by magnesium until just last week when two doses would not help. I wound up in the hospital in pain, and blood tests showed that I was fine on all minerals except a trace low on potassium.

I didn't want to take potassium, because it caused a cramp to get worse some years ago- I've avoided it ever since.

The next day, I called my homeopath, who insisted I start on potassium salt. Once I did that, my foot cramps have been alleviated even though I am cutting back on magnesium. I just don't need so much now.

I hope you find a similarly good solution.

Sorry you wound up in the hospital...And if you were just a trace low on potassium, what was the actual cause of your foot cramps? Did they treat you at all at the hospital? Were youdehydrated in general? Or just low in potassium salts? What form are you taking now?

I've read if you have muscular issues on the right side of your body, it's a potassium deficiency....left sided, it's sodium. When I put a pinch of sea salt in a big bottle of water with juice of half a lemon and drink it all day, I know I'm getting sodium/potassium correctly in balance. Lately, the magnesium that's working best for me is Natural Calm. I still use a little magnesium oil transdermally but not as much as I once did. The Natural Calm is a powder (mag citrate) mixed in water first thing in the AM). I went through a couple of weeks where I just couldn't get my minerals balanced. I was outside a lot in the heat and I think maybe from sweating that my sodium was on the low side as my left knee was hurting. When I remembered to drink the lemon water with salt every day, knee felt better.

I'm glad to hear you're doing better. Sometimes too much of one mineral throws off the others.I just don't like taking a lot of calcium....Just what's in the basic Polyvite A because I'd rather getcalcium from foods if I can.

Astounding though that just being a "trace low" in potassium could give you so much pain thatit warranted a trip to the ER. Feel well!

Yes, just a trace low, but the cramp would not stop. Normally a dose of magnesium stopped it, but this time, two doses did not. I also took half a day's dose of a food-based multi-mineral, and that did not help. I had purposely gotten one that had no potassium, though- and over time, I guess I developed a potassium deficiency.

It was my right foot- glad to know about the right-left thing. Thanks.

I take potassium salt (in a little cardboard salt shaker), but as I don't like the flavor, I turn the top to open the pour spout into a tiny hole through which I can pour it into a capsule. I take 1/4 tsp. per day. And I have felt soooo much better- with much less magnesium.

I'm not saying it is the same for you, but it is just something to consider.

Yes, I did take Bioplasma when I was younger, but did not think about that lately.

I was just reading about demineralization of the body being caused by a high acidic condition because of the body using up minerals to keep the body acid balanced. I wonder if anyone has ever had a disease that didn't bring on a high acidic condition..... Another clear reason to make sure we eat the portions of Live Foods recommended by Dr. D. in our SWAMI's! AND the right portions of other foods that create a high acidic condition! We make our health so much better in so many different ways! If our magnesium is low, maybe we should be checking our pH. And, yes, I know that the blood and the urine are two different things altogether, but what we eat can certainly affect how our bodies are able to keep balanced. And the blood is going to do its best to stay balanced if it takes every resource in our bodies to do it!

Maybe when we have cravings it can sometimes be that our pH is simply too low. I suppose it is possible that they could also be caused by the pH being too high, but I don't think I have ever had that condition in my entire life!!

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

I was just reading about demineralization of the body being caused by a high acidic condition because of the body using up minerals to keep the body acid balanced. I wonder if anyone has ever had a disease that didn't bring on a high acidic condition..... Another clear reason to make sure we eat the portions of Live Foods recommended by Dr. D. in our SWAMI's! AND the right portions of other foods that create a high acidic condition! We make our health so much better in so many different ways! If our magnesium is low, maybe we should be checking our pH. And, yes, I know that the blood and the urine are two different things altogether, but what we eat can certainly affect how our bodies are able to keep balanced. And the blood is going to do its best to stay balanced if it takes every resource in our bodies to do it!

Maybe when we have cravings it can sometimes be that our pH is simply too low. I suppose it is possible that they could also be caused by the pH being too high, but I don't think I have ever had that condition in my entire life!!

That's a very good point, especially for blood type A....Acidity can become a problem for As whoare overdoing grains or eat too much acidic proteins. But I try to consume my 5-6 cups of vegetables per day plus 3 fruits. If other foods are acidic -- like nuts, seeds, grains and beans, I can't imagine what the solution could be because these are beneficial foods. I do know a person can become acidic by shallow breathing....hyperventilating....Proper breathing can restore acid/alkaline balance....

Spring, Can you please share what you were reading about demineralization ? Is it a book or something online with a link?

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

I've just started this study, Chloe, and my eyes have been popping out, to say the least. It is a huge study with so many tangents... Here is a link that I think you would be interested in reading and checking out some of the links in it:http://www.osteopenia3.com/Cause-of-Osteopenia.html

The reason I got more interested in this than ever is that our dear friend who was recently diagnosed with grade 10 bladder cancer (this is different from stage 10) is making sure he is testing alkaline all the time with an expensive machine that makes alkaline water. So from my looking into this and other related information I came across this about an acidic condition causing demineralization of the body. There is a lot online about this causing problems with the teeth, for instance - I suppose that is the most visible and noticeable sign of a mineral deficiency. And, of course, the mouth would be the first place to encounter foods or drink that create an acidic state.

With several different forms of stress lately, I developed a really bad case of too much acid. My reading was down through the floor when I finally got around to checking it. It wasn't so much that my stomach felt acidic, but I was aching from head to toe. So I have been loading up on anything that will bring the number up. I am feeling much better now but still have a ways to go. As soon as I feel better than I do now I am going to make a really alkaline soup that I can keep in the freezer if this should happen again anytime soon. I have been taking a lot of Chlorella too. This is a very interesting study and actually includes a lot of what we have already learned elsewhere.

I know that we A's are walking a fine line between not enough acid and too much. If I have had a normal reading for awhile and start eating a lot of lamb, for instance, my energy goes sky high partly because of the acid in the lamb, but if I ate lamb every day, soon my energy would plummet because of too much acid for my body. And, as Dr. D. has pointed out - I think I am relating this correctly - after strenuous activity an acidic condition can be created, and he feels that is a good sign that we have benefited from our exercise. But, for me, I can't do that on a regular basis because of the danger of becoming overwhelmed with too much acid. When that happens other health issues start appearing. One being the pain I have already mentioned.

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

Thanks for that link, Spring....very interesting. Pretty much stuff I know but forget I have to pay moreattention to...Ever read that book "Alkalize or Die"? By Theodore Barody.....I've read my book so many times, pages are held together with a big rubber band. When I was juicing, staying alkalized was reallyeasy....but juicing takes a lot of effort and so I rationalize I can just as well eat the veggies and fruit.

As for actually taking HCL....Every time I do that, I get these bumps on the bones of my fingers....something about HCL causes calcification on small bones whether or not I take calcium in supplementform or not. It's just weird and always seems to happen.

I also try to walk around with lemon or lime in my drinking water with a pinch of sea salt....which isalkalizing and a precursor for HCL to be produced naturally. Learned that many years ago from achiropractor who was telling me this when I was in my 30s.

Salt is alkalizing....So is magnesium. I put mag citrate powder in water and sip it during the day too.

Is all aches and pains an acidic condition? Or could it be from simple dehydration? I never can tellif I'm dehydrated although I rarely feel a sensation of thirst. Do you?

How much is a LOT of chlorella? Powder or pills? I have both and will give it a try. Green powdersin general are alkalizing but chlorella has a lot of other great nutrients. I tend to do things for awhileand then move onto something else. Will have to try chlorella again. Did you start with a lower doseand work up? Just need a ballpark dose amount if you could give me a suggestion.

Thanks again....good info on that osteopenia site!

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Chloe, I always start off with a low "dose" of anything. So I started with one capsule of Chlorella per day and worked up to about six. Which is still a "low" dose to many people. It helps the acidic condition to drink a lot of water (brings my number up), and eventually it helps the pain. But when I have a bad case of this it takes DAYS to get it under control. The main problem being, I think, that I am busy with other things and don't recognize it coming on before it gets really bad.

As for an acidic condition causing all pain, I don't know, but in my opinion right now, I think it causes a lot more problems than we have thought.

I have to be careful with even sea salt or my blood pressure will start going up. Or maybe the stress comes first, then I notice that I am eating more salt and blame my blood pressure going up on the salt! I have to do some experimenting on that...

I wish I could do the lemon, etc., but it is out for now. I tried a little stevia on a baked sweet potato that needed some help today, and it was really good! The syrups and honey have a tendency to bother me sometimes. I think I may be a little allergic to honey and maple syrup makes my stomach hurt every time I eat it. The stevia didn't bother me, so far, but I only used a small amount. It is a neutral for me.

I had a really bad experience with HCL the last time I tried it. Of course, my entire esophagus was inflamed so that could have been the problem. I have scar tissue from that, and I am wondering if that is the reason I have trouble with lemon, etc.. I am going to ask my doctor about it when I have my next checkup.

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

I think for type A, pain is likely due to acidity. Maybe not in an O but anything that is "itis"....sinus,arthritis, is generally inflammation and I'm thinking you're onto something with acidity being at itscore. Going to try chlorella again regularly, although I have little tablets which I will start a few at a time. I think 15 little pills equal 1 tsp. I remember doing this years ago....am going to try again. Maybe we should begin a new thread on managing "acidity" and pain syndromes and discussing different options. I'm not sure hijacking this magnesium, thread with our personal conversation is going to be helpful for those seeking information on magnesium. THoughts? Not sure what to use for a thread title so it adequately covers what we're talking about. Is the subject really ph? Minerals? Acidity? Aches/pains? It's essentially all of this...but what's the exact subject title?

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

I'm not sure hijacking this magnesium, thread with our personal conversation is going to be helpful for those seeking information on magnesium. THoughts? Not sure what to use for a thread title so it adequately covers what we're talking about. Is the subject really ph? Minerals? Acidity? Aches/pains? It's essentially all of this...but what's the exact subject title?

Well, "great minds" think alike, so they say, and I was thinking the same thing after this branched out in so many directions - even as I was writing the first post! Maybe someone would be kind enough to move these posts to another thread, but I don't know what under the sun to call it, either! No telling where this conversation will lead! Maybe we will have an inspiration by morning.

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

I may not be able to chime in here being O but, I had leg cramps some years ago sending me to the emergency room three times, only to be told that it was from diabetic numbers += this pain is incredible and always happens in the evening.

I don't say that is the case with either of you, but it might be worth testing for it...

Then again, there is no doubt for me that all things I 'feel' come from 'food'. I have less respect for any supplementations, (but I am not A) .. I would rather eat a food/fruit that will fix this or that.

I might eat a banana for potassium and other foods for different needs and watch what I ate the hours before... or did not eat. I find that almost all issues come from food intake, and the cure is there also.. Like in banana there are other things besides potassium, which might be there for a reason...

For me Maganese and B12 might be a good thing for cramps, but I found that out by accident.. when I bought Ligaplex ll (standard process from chiro) and it helped better against tension pain in the body, neck or headache, replacing painkillers. I use as much as I need to get rid of pain.

You might look for a place where someone knows how to test you on a Zito Hand. It is interesting to see the effects of specific supplents. You might call the comany to find out who has a Zito machine/computer program in your area.

Another place to look for practitioners that might be right for you to consider is at: ondamed.net which is especially helpful for osteo issues, and other mineral 'energy' adjustments. It has kept my pain under control for years.

Being here is invaluable, but not enough. We need ALL the Doctors. I needed them for a very small cancer spot-I could never feel!!! Please do your mammograms! Doing so saved me from cancer later on. I am grateful! Thanks for learning from my experience! I was lucky! I wish the same for YOU!

I don't think O-types have anything to worry about having too much acid. In fact, it seems to me that they thrive on it! The more the better! The pain I have been having isn't a cramp, it is downright pain, and raising my alkaline level helps it. I had been having trouble sleeping lately but when I got my alkaline levels into a decent range I have slept and rested wonderfully!

This is a very complicated subject, but one thing is certain, we must supply our individual bodies with what they need to get into the "comfort zone." If too much activity and stress deplete our stores, our acid level will go up because our blood is grabbing everything it needs from bones or anything else it can to stay normal. We are going to suffer if we don't take measures to replenish our bodies with the right foods and supplements. In effect, the blood will be robbing Peter to pay Paul and we are the losers if we don't do something about it. I've seen too many A-Types looking old as the hills when they are decades younger than I am. Not only do they look old, they consider themselves old and some of them are in their fifties! Is it because they are losing ground because of too much acid because of stress upon stress upon stress of all kinds for years? I can't help but wonder about too much acid taking its toll. When you think of people smoking, drinking harmful beverages by the gallon, eating the common, mostly junk diet in this country, besides not eating according to their blood type, and all of this being conducive to an acidic condition, it horrifies me.

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

I agree, Spring....this isn't really an O topic as much as it belongs to type As because we've gotlow HCL naturally, shouldn't be eating foods that require a lot of HCL and yet, when switched froma BTD for A to a diet for Teachers, my original diet had me eating foods I likely couldn't have digested.....if based on the theory that my HCL was going to be too low. I am following a professional SWAMI which in all reality might have taken low HCL into consideration as animal proteins once listed as beneficial if I followed the GTD book, ie chicken livers, lots and lots of cheeses are now given super low priority...moved to neutral.

And my pains aren't actually cramps either because magnesium which should uncramp a muscle spasm isn't doing it for me because often this isn't a spasm. It's tightness/stiffness either in soft tissue, joint, and taking calcium I know is all wrong and nothing about my issue is remotely due to diabetes. I don't have it. My fasting blood sugar is always in the 80s on blood work....so this would be the wrong topic for me personally.

Back to the drawing board. What is the title of this topic? Aches/pains/diet/type As? Or is thesubject more general which applies to all of us? I don't know. I too see a lot of type A peoplewho look older than me...(same age)....and specifically it's a dehydrated look to their faces....not dryness as much as a drawing of skin which looks like deep wrinkles/crevices in onceplumper skin.....as if there is no moisture under that layer of skin....Dehydration? Many of myfriends drink wine.....I don't. I don't really drink coffee because I feel it's so dehydrating.

Are you drinking a membrane fluidizer in the morning? I am with 2 - 300 mg of Uridine.......and on a bioimpedence test which will show aging....both cellular and otherwise, I've managed to get a better reading which tells me that fluid outside of my cells is finally getting past that cell membrane and getting into the cells. Earlier testing showed it wasn't.

This to me is why many people are looking older than they should....that cell membrane as Dr. Ddescribed to me is hard, stiff and not hospitable to allowing nutrients to enter inside. WIth diligence to the diet, eventually you get better readings on the bioimpedence test. I remember the first time my son took this test....He had the cellular aging of a man who was in his 90s....He is 48. His SWAMI is hopefully helping him improve his health so he gets better results with this testing. BTW, he's blood type A too.

Any insight to an appropriate new thread title? Would love input from other forum members whounderstand the issues or have had issues they resolved....although nobody is going to find thissubject unless they're reading about magnesium. And yet, my body seems to require a lot moremagnesium than I believe it should. And it's alkalizing. So perhaps this is a subject about thebenefits of being more alkalized....type As only? Can't see to figure out what to call this hugesubject!

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

I agree with everything you mentioned in your post, Chloe. Even to the appearance of so many A-Types. No diabetes here, either. Sugar is always great when tested. I stopped my Uridine until after this episode because I didn't know whether it would be acidic or not. Everything else is just fine - even lecithin is alkalizing! So I am continuing with all the rest - have even increased the "dosage." I'm feeling better every day, and I have lost some weight. Oh, and thanks for the explanation of the stiffened cell membrane and how it can block nutrients! Very interesting indeed! I have never had the bioimpedence test so I don't know how "old" I am. Now, that would be interesting. We know of one friend who has had it, and they had been doing very well, but they went on an extended trip, came back, had the test soon after, and their "age" had skyrocketed to 92! They are in their early sixties! They soon got "younger," though, with increased attention to their diet and supplements. They recently got SWAMI so they are all excited about that now as we all have been at one time or another.

For my part, it is a monumental success story that I have simply changed a few items in my diet, increased others and was able to work in my yard for hours in 93 degree weather (about 110 in the sun) yesterday with the humidity out of sight and had no worsening of symptoms whatsoever, especially when I think of the shape I was in Sunday! Ugh!

I still haven't come up with a good title for another thread. For all I know, You and I may be the only ones remotely interested in this subject!

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin

Chloe and Spring,Please do start a thread re: minerals/alka vs. acid/aches in blood type A!!!!!I am definitely interested! I would like to be as informed as you ladies are. I haven't a clue how to make sure my body is balanced with acidity/alkalinity.Not sure if I need extra magnesium or even which method to use.My only aches/pains are occasional stiffness if I sit too long or lift weights not often enough. Once in a while I may get a foot/toe or calf/thigh cramp at night.I worry about staying hydrated in my dry, hot environment.I rarely feel thirst.

Ao ISFJ Taster Rh+

"God gave us the gift of life. It is up to us to give ourselves the gift of living well." Voltaire"Whisper words of wisdom. Let it be." Sir Paul McCartney

Chloe and Spring,Please do start a thread re: minerals/alka vs. acid/aches in blood type A!!!!!I am definitely interested! I would like to be as informed as you ladies are. I haven't a clue how to make sure my body is balanced with acidity/alkalinity.Not sure if I need extra magnesium or even which method to use.My only aches/pains are occasional stiffness if I sit too long or lift weights not often enough. Once in a while I may get a foot/toe or calf/thigh cramp at night.I worry about staying hydrated in my dry, hot environment.I rarely feel thirst.

Anyone have a clue where this topic belongs? I mean under what forum topic should I start this thread?This doesn't seem to be a "supplement" topic....is it an ER4YT topic? Just don't want to put this in the wrongplace....

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

I think this is appropriate... Magnesium is available as a supplement, but like all supplements, can be found in foods as well...

I have been getting my magnesium from robust molasses. It seems to be the best-tolerated form I can find.

Confused....my question was in relation to a recent post by cajun (see post 99-102)....responding to the chatsSpring and I have had on this thread....believing it might be hijacking this magnesium threadas we were getting off topic.....So, now there are 3 of us in agreement thatour slightly off topic conversation about ph, and other minerals needed to be moved to anotherthread. I would gladly start that thread entitled "type A -balancing acidity, alkalinity/aches/pains"but I couldn't figure out what category was appropriate for this thread. Is it really a thread for supplements?

"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"

Listen A's as you are /// yes others are piping in also because we learn even through the back door.

But if you should not wish to hear from any 'others' just say so after each post from them.. they will see your objections and they can delete it for 4 days.

As for the topic we all learn, and that makes us more aware of differences.. Nothing wrong with some wrong answers like my experience with diabetes, I am happy you A's are less likely to have it.

Yet, I thought this interesting enough to post it twice!

Quoted Text

I don't think O-types have anything to worry about having too much acid. In fact, it seems to me that they thrive on it! The more the better! The pain I have been having isn't a cramp, it is downright pain, and raising my alkaline level helps it. I had been having trouble sleeping lately but when I got my alkaline levels into a decent range I have slept and rested wonderfully!

This is a very complicated subject, but one thing is certain, we must supply our individual bodies with what they need to get into the "comfort zone." If too much activity and stress deplete our stores, our acid level will go up because our blood is grabbing everything it needs from bones or anything else it can to stay normal. We are going to suffer if we don't take measures to replenish our bodies with the right foods and supplements. In effect, the blood will be robbing Peter to pay Paul and we are the losers if we don't do something about it. I've seen too many A-Types looking old as the hills when they are decades younger than I am. Not only do they look old, they consider themselves old and some of them are in their fifties! Is it because they are losing ground because of too much acid because of stress upon stress upon stress of all kinds for years? I can't help but wonder about too much acid taking its toll. When you think of people smoking, drinking harmful beverages by the gallon, eating the common, mostly junk diet in this country, besides not eating according to their blood type, and all of this being conducive to an acidic condition, it horrifies me.

A thread on:'Mineral acid/alcaline for A's Only' is what you are grabbing at... go for it I will not pipe in. promise. As for others just be pleasant with a standard precise message that tells them to bug out... If such 'do not this or that' message is precise, and politely worded, and repeated often - always with the same standard words - then Understanding happens and no one would object.

Being here is invaluable, but not enough. We need ALL the Doctors. I needed them for a very small cancer spot-I could never feel!!! Please do your mammograms! Doing so saved me from cancer later on. I am grateful! Thanks for learning from my experience! I was lucky! I wish the same for YOU!

Yes, this topic should probably be in Eat Right forum, because alkalinizing is all about food.

I spend my life trying to alkalinize, because I know that is the cause of my psoriatic arthritis. I probably touched on that fact in my thread about PsA. One of my long term symptoms has been burning in my bladder, and yes, I am afraid of getting bladder cancer. I juice and take Himalayan salt and eat lots of salads and other veggies in an attempt to alkalinize. I think I wrote something in my thread about the most alkaline foods- or I did in some thread.

Again, they are alkaline water, Himalayan salt, grasses, cucumber, kale, kelp, spinach, parsley, broccoli, sprouts, sea veggies, and green drinks. Of which I will pour some more as we speak. And yes, minerals! They buffer acids and are vital.

I will start a thread in Eat Right for this called Alkalinity. If someone can move this part of the topic there, it would be great.

My understanding is that the calcium/magnesium balance matters more than the total amounts of either one. Most Americans get way too much calcium via diet, and taking cal/mag supplements don't do anything to correct that imbalance- the supplements are completely worthless. Supplementing with JUST magnesium, however, helps many people.

Since you're on SWAMI, presumably you don't eat a lot of dairy and you do eat a lot of greens. You may or may not be getting enough calcium in your diet.

According to the muscle response testing I just did for my DD, Magnesium Citrate is the best form for her to use... It seemed like the major problem was all of the additives in the capsule that made the most difference, however. We found one made by Now brand that only has rice flour and the capsule and filling stuffs that was the best for her...

According to the muscle response testing I just did for my DD, Magnesium Citrate is the best form for her to use... It seemed like the major problem was all of the additives in the capsule that made the most difference, however. We found one made by Now brand that only has rice flour and the capsule and filling stuffs that was the best for her...