NostroZ:TrollingForColumbine: Epoch_Zero: CokeBear: Not sure why Hamas and the Orthodox Jews don't get along better. They both hate women, and don't like to see them mixing about with the men. Seems like they would actually have lots in common.

Different hats.

Isaac: I Iike your hatIshmael: Fark You

Is this what you really believe? That somehow all the oppressive controlling religious asshats out there would get along because they realize they all hate the same thing?

Just play that out in your mind for something that you actually understand.... How about ultra-conservative from Islam here in Dearborn Michigan USA and the local religious people's reaction to a group who shares the same books and acknowledges the holiness of Christ.

Please tell me you're trolling in your assumption that Hamas and Ultraorthodox Jews would ever agree on anything or their similarity purely based on hate.

I'll just assume it's based on your understanding limited understanding of the world and a simplification of any group to "they are not like me, so they are all the same."

I think it was just an observation that all religious extremists are asshats. in other words.

TrollingForColumbine:I think it was just an observation that all religious extremists are asshats. in other words.

Once again, I will ask you to refrain from pretending a FALSE EQUIVALENT is an okay way to hold an honest conversation. Hamas, an all powerful religious military group that was/is considered terrorist that controls the West Bank/Gaza vs. Ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel, who live and participate in a parliamentary Democracy of which they are about 8%.

Here is the definition of a False EquivalenceA common way for this fallacy to be perpetuated is one shared trait between two subjects is assumed to show equivalence, especially in order of magnitude, when equivalence is not necessarily the logical result. The pattern of the fallacy is often as such: If A is the set of c and d, and B is the set of d and e, then since they both contain d, A and B are equal.Example:"They're both soft, cuddly pets. There's no difference between a cat and a dog."

/You started with a troll comment of "Not sure why Hamas and the Orthodox Jews don't get along better."//Please don't tell me a false equivalency is not trolling.///Try this one. Your brain is soft and mushy, there is no difference between it and oatmeal.

Here is a list of all the Israeli weapons the United States Currently uses:

ADM-141 TALD (Improved Tactical Air Launched Decoy)- device used to protect U.S. warplanes from enemy fire. AGM-142 Have Nap "The Popeye" - a precise bomb which hits specific coordinates Python missile - A major air to air missile. M120 mortar - A 120 mm Mortar developed by Soltam Systems. SMAW - An Anti-tank guided missile developed by Israel Military Industries, based on the Israeli B-300. Cardom - A 120mm Recoil mortar system using modern electronic navigation, self-positioning, and target acquisition. Gabriel missile - A sea skimming Anti-ship missile. SIMON breach grenade - A rifle grenade designed to breach through doors. A variant is currently in service with the United States army. LITENING targeting pod - A precision targeting pod designed to increase combat effectiveness of aircraft. International MaxxPro - An MRAP armored fighting vehicle. Samson Remote Controlled Weapon Station - A Remote weapon system.

Please stop pretending that Israel just takes a hand-out... it's a military alliance. Much better than the money spent on Afghanistan / Iraq... tell me what's there to show for those trillions of dollars?

NostroZ:cptjeff: And meanwhile, the ultra orthodox in Israel are spitting on women who dare to show their ankles.

Seriously, how do any of these asses get women to have sex with them?

One difference in your attempt to create a false comparison between the two is that Hamas has dictatorial control over the Palestinians. The Ultra-orthodox in Israel comprise about 8% of the population and are dealt with in a Democracy.

Both I'm sure are not good in the sack when it comes to sex with women... but missionary authoritarian has never been a turn on for the ladies.

Hamas was elected. Just because we don't like em doesn't make them not elected.

And trust me. I really don't like them. But let's not pretend that there aren't sections of Israel where women are segregated from men. For the exact. same. reason. Because there are.

Gender Segregation is the issue here. And Israel is guilty of it as Gaza.

As for the 8% figure, that's how many Israeli Jews *self-identify* as "ultra-orthodox". When you can point to a sizeable Haredi population... it's easy to say "I'm not as orthodox as THOSE guys"

And the Haredi population, the most conservative of the Ultra-Orthodox, is also the fastest growing Jewish population, both in Israel specifically, and globally on average.

This isn't a BSABS-exhonerate Hamas. It's that shiat stinks everywhere it's happening. And we need to call it out wherever we see it, even if (I might go so far as to say *especially if*) it happens among our allies.

Fart_Machine:LargeCanine: Fart_Machine: LargeCanine: Gazans are a dependant population and they will never "grow up" as long as they are a charity case.

I'm glad you're in favor of removing foreign aid to Israel as well.

Alliances are two way streets. Each party gains something.

What do we gain from Israel again?

I am guessing that is not a serious question, but I will mention a few things. Cooperative intelligence exchanges with one of the best intel gathering nations in the world, military and technical cooperation - for example Israel pioneered UAVs and was instrumental in developing the Stuxnet virus, hot women, trade - Israeli businesses mostly sell to other businesses but there are some comsumer goods like Sodastream, Israel is a military ally - there was no question which side Israel would have been on if the Cold War had turned hot - that continues today, and a reliable UN vote. Oh, and Israel is a civilized democracy, unlike their neighbors, of course they are a natural ally.

Found some better pics. You can see her boyfriend bodycheck the race official: http://thestory.org/sidebars/katherine-switer-1964-boston-marathon

A very rare picture of a actual man (Tom Miller who she married and later divorced) tackling someone pretending to be a man, behind a nice young woman just trying to run a race and be left alone. Love his GTFO face as he plows into the guy.

NostroZ:Military might in the middle east. In the form of intelligence and future weapon technology.

Um, most of the friction we have in the Middle East is due to our alliance with Israel. And if their technology is so superior why do we keep giving them military aid?

LargeCanine:Fart_Machine: LargeCanine: Fart_Machine: LargeCanine: Gazans are a dependant population and they will never "grow up" as long as they are a charity case.

I'm glad you're in favor of removing foreign aid to Israel as well.

Alliances are two way streets. Each party gains something.

What do we gain from Israel again?

I am guessing that is not a serious question, but I will mention a few things. Cooperative intelligence exchanges with one of the best intel gathering nations in the world, military and technical cooperation - for example Israel pioneered UAVs and was instrumental in developing the Stuxnet virus, hot women, trade - Israeli businesses mostly sell to other businesses but there are some comsumer goods like Sodastream, Israel is a military ally - there was no question which side Israel would have been on if the Cold War had turned hot - that continues today, and a reliable UN vote. Oh, and Israel is a civilized democracy, unlike their neighbors, of course they are a natural ally.

BeesNuts:This isn't a BSABS-exhonerate Hamas. It's that shiat stinks everywhere it's happening. And we need to call it out wherever we see it, even if (I might go so far as to say *especially if*) it happens among our allies.

That's cool Mr.BessNuts, I'll be sure to check up on your future posts when I'm sure you're you'll be criticizing Pakistan, Yemen, Columbia, and Iraq, since they are ALL our ALLIES.

Yet, somehow, I think that you have an "especially if they are" Jewish, then criticize them policy for that US ally.I'm sure if I were to look at your history, you don't actually criticize US allies. You pretend to care about people, morality, etc... but in truth you just want a high horse from which to scream you superiority in religion and politics... which the Jews happen to have both inferior to yours.

/A false equivalency is just that... I doubt you even criticize your own country men when they force women to undergo transvaginal ultra-sounds just to have access to control their body's reproduction.//Stop throwing stones at people you don't know, when you live in a glass house yourself buddy.

NostroZ:Yet, somehow, I think that you have an "especially if they are" Jewish, then criticize them policy for that US ally.I'm sure if I were to look at your history, you don't actually criticize US allies. You pretend to care about people, morality, etc... but in truth you just want a high horse from which to scream you superiority in religion and politics... which the Jews happen to have both inferior to yours.

Well I guess we have the "if you criticize Israel you must be an anti-Semite" card in play.

Fart_Machine:NostroZ: Yet, somehow, I think that you have an "especially if they are" Jewish, then criticize them policy for that US ally.I'm sure if I were to look at your history, you don't actually criticize US allies. You pretend to care about people, morality, etc... but in truth you just want a high horse from which to scream you superiority in religion and politics... which the Jews happen to have both inferior to yours.

Well I guess we have the "if you criticize Israel you must be an anti-Semite" card in play.

You got it. If you harp on Israel for being immoral, when the same immorality that goes on in your back-yard and you say nothing. That's racist.

In this case, since the racism is directed at a group that has fought for a special term for hating them (since which other ethnic/religious group is believed to control the world, thus must be exterminated... and actually followed up on in practice as per WW2, post1947 Arab Jews being expelled/killed, Inquisition, Progroms, etc. etc.)

So yes. Much like if you're a white guy you cannot use the N-word.If you're not Jewish and/or are not critical of things evenly, but go out of your way to hate on Israel and Jews at large, you are an anti-Semite.

Maybe you'd like to start talking the same way about African Americans in America the way you do about Jews and Israel.See how that feels for ya on your hate train.

NostroZ:You got it. If you harp on Israel for being immoral, when the same immorality that goes on in your back-yard and you say nothing. That's racist.

I had no idea Israel was a "race". Seems to be it would be racist to go up to every Jew and blame them for what happens in another country they don't live in. That sounds racist. You wouldn't be doing that would you?

Also who says we don't criticize what goes on in our own backyard? Citation?

NostroZ:So yes. Much like if you're a white guy you cannot use the N-word.If you're not Jewish and/or are not critical of things evenly, but go out of your way to hate on Israel and Jews at large, you are an anti-Semite.

Nobody is equating all Jews with Israel except you. Funny that. But nice to know in your world nobody can ever criticize Israel unless they're Jewish. However I'm sure then you'd call them a "self-hating" Jew.

NostroZ:Maybe you'd like to start talking the same way about African Americans in America the way you do about Jews and Israel.See how that feels for ya on your hate train.

Do you frequently equate human rights abuses in Africa with black people living in the United States? Maybe you should check the mirror before calling other people racist.

NostroZ:TrollingForColumbine: I think it was just an observation that all religious extremists are asshats. in other words.

Once again, I will ask you to refrain from pretending a FALSE EQUIVALENT is an okay way to hold an honest conversation. Hamas, an all powerful religious military group that was/is considered terrorist that controls the West Bank/Gaza vs. Ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel, who live and participate in a parliamentary Democracy of which they are about 8%.

Here is the definition of a False EquivalenceA common way for this fallacy to be perpetuated is one shared trait between two subjects is assumed to show equivalence, especially in order of magnitude, when equivalence is not necessarily the logical result. The pattern of the fallacy is often as such: If A is the set of c and d, and B is the set of d and e, then since they both contain d, A and B are equal.Example:"They're both soft, cuddly pets. There's no difference between a cat and a dog."

/You started with a troll comment of "Not sure why Hamas and the Orthodox Jews don't get along better."//Please don't tell me a false equivalency is not trolling.///Try this one. Your brain is soft and mushy, there is no difference between it and oatmeal.

NostroZ:If you're not Jewish and/or are not critical of things evenly, but go out of your way to hate on Israel and Jews at large, you are an anti-Semite.

That's...special.

// if your hate of Jews/Israel prevents you from seeing the difference, you're probably an anti-Semite.// if you assume that Israel=Jews and vice-versa, you're stereotyping (like believing all black people are the same, or that "inner city=black people" and "black people=inner city") - highly correlated with anti-Semitism, but not indicative// if your hatred of Jews/Israel carves out special exceptions (it's only not OK for a country to have a large fundamentalist population if that country is Israel)...you get my point// hate on Israel all you want - there's plenty of reason to (and plenty of reason not to - hence the debate)

JohnAnnArbor:Sonic Yawn: Is anybody else wondering why the UN is involved with managing a marathon? Don't they have better things to do?

They run the "refugee" camps.

Call me crazy (no, that's not really a request), but shouldn't refugee camps be more about things like food, shelter, and medicine? If all those things are taken care of, sure, run a marathon. But it shouldn't be the UN doing it.

Fart_Machine:NostroZ: Maybe you'd like to start talking the same way about African Americans in America the way you do about Jews and Israel. See how that feels for ya on your hate train.

Do you frequently equate human rights abuses in Africa with black people living in the United States? Maybe you should check the mirror before calling other people racist.

You've obviously missed the point. What I was and am fighting against is the creation of a false equivalency between Hamas and religious Jews in Israel. That sounds like a hateful comparison.

Since you obviously have no sensitivity to Jews living in Israel, but treat trolling one or the other's emotions as a sport... I suggest you replace that with African Americans living here in the United States. I'm sure you've had some sensitivity training in not using the N-Word around black people or why it's wrong for you to talk about their culture. Haven't you?

Or are you so callous that you do not see what I am asking you to feel?

NostroZ:Fart_Machine: NostroZ: Yet, somehow, I think that you have an "especially if they are" Jewish, then criticize them policy for that US ally.I'm sure if I were to look at your history, you don't actually criticize US allies. You pretend to care about people, morality, etc... but in truth you just want a high horse from which to scream you superiority in religion and politics... which the Jews happen to have both inferior to yours.

Well I guess we have the "if you criticize Israel you must be an anti-Semite" card in play.

You got it. If you harp on Israel for being immoral, when the same immorality that goes on in your back-yard and you say nothing. That's racist.

In this case, since the racism is directed at a group that has fought for a special term for hating them (since which other ethnic/religious group is believed to control the world, thus must be exterminated... and actually followed up on in practice as per WW2, post1947 Arab Jews being expelled/killed, Inquisition, Progroms, etc. etc.)

So yes. Much like if you're a white guy you cannot use the N-word.If you're not Jewish and/or are not critical of things evenly, but go out of your way to hate on Israel and Jews at large, you are an anti-Semite.

Maybe you'd like to start talking the same way about African Americans in America the way you do about Jews and Israel.See how that feels for ya on your hate train.

Hey, you going to any parties this weekend? Let me know so I can not be there.

Sonic Yawn:JohnAnnArbor: Sonic Yawn: Is anybody else wondering why the UN is involved with managing a marathon? Don't they have better things to do?

They run the "refugee" camps.

Call me crazy (no, that's not really a request), but shouldn't refugee camps be more about things like food, shelter, and medicine? If all those things are taken care of, sure, run a marathon. But it shouldn't be the UN doing it.

Remember, the Arab strategy was/is to keep the Palestinians in permanent "refugee" camps, with no hope of relocation elsewhere in the Arab world. They even have their own UN agency, not the normal UNHCR (high commissioner for refugees). It's politics, not sense, that keeps them there. The UN caved on the issue of a separate agency way back in the 1940s and has been stuck with the work ever since.

lordluzr:Call him annoying... quick... before I feel something for people I'm used to hating on.

I take that back, you're very good at knowing what a false equivalency is. Obviously.

Thank you Mr. Lordluzr I'm glad your able to look inside yourself and see that hating on one minority in a foreign land is no better than doing so on your own local minority brought from a foreign land. Sure, one chose to be there, the other was chosen for... but that does not matter to the children born to Jews/Blacks. They are a minority in a foreign land and are hated.

Since I assume you do not live around many Jews, but I'm sure have been exposed to blacks in America... I ask you to open your heart and ask yourself if you have a right to criticize something so many people have done so much harm to, without actually being a part of that group. How in America, saying the N-Word by someone who never experienced that alienation and discrimination is considered racist.

It is a pleasure to know that someone online can say "Thank you" and understand that hatred, false equivalency, and blanket statements are a dishonest and impolite way to hold a conversation.

NostroZ:Fart_Machine: NostroZ: Maybe you'd like to start talking the same way about African Americans in America the way you do about Jews and Israel. See how that feels for ya on your hate train.

Do you frequently equate human rights abuses in Africa with black people living in the United States? Maybe you should check the mirror before calling other people racist.

You've obviously missed the point. What I was and am fighting against is the creation of a false equivalency between Hamas and religious Jews in Israel. That sounds like a hateful comparison.

Since you obviously have no sensitivity to Jews living in Israel, but treat trolling one or the other's emotions as a sport... I suggest you replace that with African Americans living here in the United States. I'm sure you've had some sensitivity training in not using the N-Word around black people or why it's wrong for you to talk about their culture. Haven't you?

Or are you so callous that you do not see what I am asking you to feel?

Holy Hyperbole Batman! You just compared criticizing Israel to attacking every Jewish person. I have no idea about what point you were trying to make otherwise. Have you taken your meds today?

You would think the Jews and Pallys would get along. they are both hated by their neighbors and they both harbor religious fundamentalist that treat women poorly.

/ducks

But the rest of the Arab world finds the Pals useful for generating outrage by pointing out how badly the Israelis treat them, all the while ignoring that the rest of the Arab world treats the Palestinians just as badly, if not worse. And the Palestinians foolishly keep on saying, "I hate the Isaelis too, guys! Guys! See how much I hate them? Can I be in the club now?"

give me doughnuts:But the rest of the Arab world finds the Pals useful for generating outrage by pointing out how badly the Israelis treat them, all the while ignoring that the rest of the Arab world treats the Palestinians just as badly, if not worse

It's called passing the buck.

Also, Palestinians living in Israel are more educated and have longer life expectancy than Palestinians anywhere else in the ME. I would guess their women have more rights in Israel than anywhere else, too.

Fart_Machine:I'm sure you've had some sensitivity training in not using the N-Word around black people or why it's wrong for you to talk about their culture. Haven't you?

Or are you so callous that you do not see what I am asking you to feel?

Holy Hyperbole Batman! You just compared criticizing Israel to attacking every Jewish person. I have no idea about what point you were trying to make otherwise. Have you taken your meds today?

So insults is all you have left... okay, callously lacking empathy it is for you Mr. Fart_Machine.

But make no mistake, only because you don't understand what it's like to be persecuted and why it's wrong for someone who is not to lob insults at someone who is, does not make it right. Just as much as it is for you to go to Harlem and scream out the N-Word.

As anyone can tell by this story, the UN is of no help... it's an inept democratic body with Middle East / African representatives where Israel is a member, will always vote to hate on the Jews... (Democracy cannot be two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat) & the UN is filled with a bunch of Jew haters - 26% of the resolutions they pass are passed against a country that is less than .1% of the globe.

All this goes on while Sudan has a genocide for a few decades.All this goes on while Haiti has thousands dying of Cholera.All this goes on while Syria is in civil war and Iraq is has been for a decade.

So please excuse me if I'm agitated when you throw insults at me, when you know nothing about persecution and only perpetrate it through commission or omission.