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Topic Review (Newest First)

06-14-2012 01:20 PM

Minnewaska

Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fstbttms

This is a statewide issue, not an SF Bay issue. California has hundreds of water bodies that exceed federally mandated levels for copper (the worst being Shelter Island Yacht Basin in San Diego Bay, Newport Bay and Marina del Rey.) The state is required by law to bring these bodies into compliance. Copper from anti fouling paint has been identified as a, if not the, major source of this copper. It is not a matter of choice. Copper has to be reduced.

I get it. However, I'm steaming off on why it has to be. Not at you.

06-14-2012 11:49 AM

Fstbttms

Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minnewaska

I tried to read up a bit on the Bay's problem with copper. Is this really about saving the Salmon? Which, as I understand, you can't commercially fish there anyway? I also read that brake dust from vehicles is the number one source of copper in the Bay.

This is a statewide issue, not an SF Bay issue. California has hundreds of water bodies that exceed federally mandated levels for copper (the worst being Shelter Island Yacht Basin in San Diego Bay, Newport Bay and Marina del Rey.) The state is required by law to bring these bodies into compliance. Copper from anti fouling paint has been identified as a, if not the, major source of this copper. It is not a matter of choice. Copper has to be reduced.

06-14-2012 10:31 AM

tommays

Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

I fall into the copper is about as benign as it get and whatever is we change to will just be the next thing to show up in the water table

Unless your going rip out all the old copper plumbing and ban copper plumbing you will still have 56% of the load going into the bay

Much like the NDZ which i do support as its just bad form to pump you poop in the bay it has changed nothing because they still allow all the water front homes to have inadequate septic systems which cause counts as high as 7800 colonies/100 ml and if rains than all bets are OFF

06-14-2012 07:03 AM

Minnewaska

Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

I tried to read up a bit on the Bay's problem with copper. Is this really about saving the Salmon? Which, as I understand, you can't commercially fish there anyway? I also read that brake dust from vehicles is the number one source of copper in the Bay.

What is it with the narrow minded people that insist this planet stay exactly the way they found it, when that's not the natural order of things. Otherwise, humans should have stayed put in Mesopotamia and dinosaurs should still roam the earth. You can't stop evolution and one species will always impact another. Germs spread, viruses spread, seeds spread and animals spread. The planet has fully frozen over and melted before, without factories even existing on the planet.

I do not advocate doing whatever you want. You can over tax the environment to our own detriment and there are many examples of that throughout modern history. But our impact can not and does not have to be zero. Whether there are any salmon in SF Bay is unlikely to have any detrimental impact on our Global environment and its ability to sustain human life. Its only the later that I give a darn about and we should do something about. Salmon did not always exist as a species, nor did they always exist in SF Bay.

06-14-2012 02:11 AM

Fstbttms

Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Quote:

Originally Posted by poopdeckpappy

As I have said already, I have no problem with losing copper based paints someday, my problem is forcing out a working product now based on assumptions, when we should wait till the final studies are complete and/or a equivalent product is available.

And don't say that's impossible because it's not

Your logic is flawed. There is no question that copper in the water column causes harm and there is no question that California has hundreds of water bodies that are impaired for copper, as per federal standards. Copper has to go away. Nothing is going to change that. And just as there was no equivalent replacement for TbT, there may very well never be an equivalent replacement for copper. There certainly isn't one currently.

06-14-2012 01:56 AM

poopdeckpappy

As I have said already, I have no problem with losing copper based paints someday, my problem is forcing out a working product now based on assumptions, when we should wait till the final studies are complete and/or a equivalent product is available.

And don't say that's impossible because it's not

06-14-2012 01:18 AM

Fstbttms

Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Quote:

Originally Posted by poopdeckpappy

So that means what? Kehoe shelved it until further studies are completed, if this yet to be named legislator share the same commitment then they too will follow the correct course and wait until further studies are completed, correct?

Kehoe shelved it because the bill in it current form would not get passed in the House and she doesn't have enough time left in office to see it through, not because there are "further studies" that will somehow change everything. IMHO.

Copper will go away eventually. Better get used to that concept.

06-14-2012 01:13 AM

poopdeckpappy

So that means what? Kehoe shelved it until further studies are completed, if this yet to be named legislator share the same commitment then they too will follow the correct course and wait until further studies are completed, correct?

It's either that or that was political mumble for " the yet to be named legislator " is a environmental activist who will see this pushed threw prior to the completion of the needed further studies

06-14-2012 12:40 AM

Fstbttms

Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Today I participated in the quarterly meeting of the Marina Inter Agency Coordinating Committee where it was announced by a member of Senator Kehoe's staff that SB 623 will be reintroduced in the near future by an as yet unnamed legislator, who shares her committment to reduce copper in our coastal waterways.

06-09-2012 12:54 PM

Fstbttms

Re: State Sen. Kehoe drops anti fouling paint bill

Quote:

Originally Posted by tommays

Why do you suppose the study REFUSES to compare the boat source numbers with the land source numbers ?