Well, Pochettino, LVG, and Mourinho have all publicly criticised him for his attitude, so there's no reason to think another coach wouldn't feel the same way as those three experienced coaches, each with a different outlook on the game. I don't think there's any doubt that there's a persistent doubt about his attitude or psychology.

But he's also talented enough for the likes of Mourinho to stick with him. Mourinho has also said very positive things about him in public, and he did start him, after all, in the FA Cup quarter final — a match that United's season depended on after being dumped out of the CL. So to turned to him for a very big occasion. I think he thinks the potential is great, but that Shaw is frustrating, and him going public is a bit of an act of desperation to get through to the player because nothing else is working.

Laz - I don’t get it, i said I’d rather lose Jose than Pogba...and what?
I don’t want to lose either ....I’ve backed Jose and will do still....

We need Savic alongside Pogba and Matic - not to replace Pogba.

Pogba was ace before the new year- some of the criticism he got earlier in the season was a joke and some just wouldn’t want to admit they were wrong about him- now after a recent slump for whatever reason (maybe a collective team thing) they are rejoycing that they were ‘right’ all along.

We need Pogba back firing like he had been
A few players need to go and a few key position s still need fixed...
There’s still positives and too early to write Jose off ffs

Halfway between the gutter and the stars

“I don't have any real proof and I can't be arsed to find any. But I bet I’m right” - Sid, 6th March 2018

This http://www.arabnews.com/node/1269646/sports (that I got on Reddit) is from a bit of a random source but maybe for that reason, a bit of distance and perspective from the day to day media hype in the UK, i feel like it makes good points.

I don’t like Jose’s style of football, which is why I didn’t want him as manager in the first place. But this Jose vs Luke Shaw debate is ridiculous. Mourinho has won the league with every team he’s managed, and he’s won the champions league with two different very unfancied teams. In contrast, Luke Shaw is a 22 year old who’s accomplished nothing other than, apparently, earning about £20 million in wages already.

I don’t like Jose’s football tactics, but in terms of psychology and building a winning team mentality, he’s up there with Ferguson. If that means signing more hard, hungry bastards from Eastern Europe or Africa, or Central America like Valencia, instead of pampered English lads who are expect to be millionaires before their out of their teens, so be it.

The debate isn't ridiculous. We've been down this road before where there's been a massive disconnect between a manager and players, and there's a concern about it happening again. Nobody questions the amazing things he's achieved in the past, but Mourinho himself had his issues with certain players at Chelsea and Real Madrid. Yes he won things at those clubs, but then matters went tits up soon after, in terms of team harmony.

How do you begin to unify the squad and get everyone pulling in the right direction if you criticise individuals in public? I don't think shelling out on 'hard bastards' is necessarily the answer, either. I think, with intelligent management, there surely has to be a way to get more out of the players currently in our squad.

Last edited by sheesh on Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

Bman, he loves Lingard and McT now so it’s got fuck all to do with signing sone hard bastard as opposed to so called pampered players. We signed Rojo who’s hard as fuck but he’s not a better lb than Shaw, it’d be different if Shaw was shite, he took on board criticism, got a horrible injury, came back lean and hungry and hasn’t had a bad game, where Jose thought he was so bad he needed hooked at half time is beyond me. And saying well I stand on the touchline and tell him what to do do it’s my mind in his body,

Ie when he dies something good, it was Jose, when he does something bad, he wasn’t listening.

Every attacking signing Mourinho has made has got worse under him compared to their previous club. Every one. Mkhi left and has a goal and 4 assists in 5 games at Arsenal. Memphis has 28 goals and assists in a season and a bit at Lyon.

Pogba scored/assisted as much in his last season at Juve as he has in two years under Mourinho. Zlatan scored half as much, Lukaku has scored less, Mkhi scored much less.

If people are going to hold up Mourinho's record elsewhere to shift the blame to the players, they should also look at how the players did elsewhere. I don't know how good Bailly was at Villareal, but I hope Lindelof was a lot better before we spent 30m on him.

His career isn't that impressive anyway. At Chelsea, Abramovich outspent every other club by a ridiculous amount. At Madrid he won one title in three years - they've won the CL three times since he left. The Inter team he inherited had won 3 titles in a row. He had the easiest possible run to win the CL with Porto - that and the CL at Inter are the only times he's overachieved with his squad.

Every attacking signing Mourinho has made has got worse under him compared to their previous club. Every one. Mkhi left and has a goal and 4 assists in 5 games at Arsenal. Memphis has 28 goals and assists in a season and a bit at Lyon.

Pogba scored/assisted as much in his last season at Juve as he has in two years under Mourinho. Zlatan scored half as much, Lukaku has scored less, Mkhi scored much less.

If people are going to hold up Mourinho's record elsewhere to shift the blame to the players, they should also look at how the players did elsewhere. I don't know how good Bailly was at Villareal, but I hope Lindelof was a lot better before we spent 30m on him.

His career isn't that impressive anyway. At Chelsea, Abramovich outspent every other club by a ridiculous amount. At Madrid he won one title in three years - they've won the CL three times since he left. The Inter team he inherited had won 3 titles in a row. He had the easiest possible run to win the CL with Porto - that and the CL at Inter are the only times he's overachieved with his squad.

I think you also (as I said elsewhere re Shaw) need to give every single player, whether they are supposedly shit or not, the same benefit of the doubt. You can't say "Mourinho's style is stifling Pogba" and then say "Shaw was shit anyway". You can swap Pogba and Shaw's names with more or less any other squad member. Not intending, specifically to highlight them... just that they have been done to death for the last couple of days so are a case in point.