I can't find any info on the supposed "liberal nature" of Jamal Khashoggi, a "critical reformer". It seems to me that Jamal was a different kind of hardliner, a man of the Muslim Brotherhood and thus an ideological enemy of the Saudi Royal family. Nothing liberal about Jamal.

Propaganda is to some scholars as a carrot on a stick to donkeys. Karen Armstrong being the prime example on how it can induce a desired behavior.

For him Saudi Arabia was not Islamic enough and wanted it to become more Islamic. During his career he was an editor plus religious police for a govt run newspaper whose role was to make sure that any liberal or opposing views are suppressed or edited out.Later when he moved to the west, he didn't like Saudis breaking ties with Muslim brotherhood(they found them as a threat that would ndermine the kingdom) or even tactically approving the Israel's right to exist.What he forgot was Saudis are also followers of islam and might take criticism very seriously.After all mohd sent assassins to murder his critics.

Jamal Khashoggi was a brother hood supporter who would have done the same to his opponents if he was in a position of authority or power. so this is a case of islam on islam. Lefties loved him because he was an Islamic brother hood supporter who would love to see the destruction of Judaeo christian civilization. Look at the nasty leftist media who to this day continue to spread lies about this man and his original motives.You cant trust the main stream media to tell you the truth anymore.its a fact. https://www.frontpagemag.com/point/271617/jamal-khashoggi-bin-laden-we-were-hoping-establish-daniel-greenfield

Well it seems that even the NYT made a 180 degree turn and calls Khashoggi an Islamist and Osama fan boy.

Mr. Khashoggi’s first claim to fame was his acquaintance with Osama bin Laden. Mr. Khashoggi had spent time in Jidda, Bin Laden’s hometown, and, like Bin Laden, he came from a prominent nonroyal family. Mr. Khashoggi’s grandfather was a doctor who had treated Saudi Arabia’s first king. His uncle was Adnan Khashoggi, a famous arms dealer, although Jamal Khashoggi did not benefit from his uncle’s wealth.

Here many guys are defending killing, halal butchering and quartering of a human being , journalist Khasoggi!

They defend most brutal ruler of Saudi Arabia, a country which is root of all evils being birth place of war lord Mohemmed and his most cruel religion . Country which attacked US on 9 /11. Country where OBL was born. Reason they all think Khasoggi is worst than Prince Salman! Why because he was working for WAPO, a paper who writes againstTrump.

Well in spirit of defending Trump they go to extent of proving that Saudis had nothing to do with 9/11. CIA did it! Jews did it!!

Here many guys are defending killing, halal butchering and quartering of a human being , journalist Khasoggi!

They defend most brutal ruler of Saudi Arabia, a country which is root of all evils being birth place of war lord Mohemmed and his most cruel religion . Country which attacked US on 9 /11. Country where OBL was born. Reason they all think Khasoggi is worst than Prince Salman! Why because he was working for WAPO, a paper who writes againstTrump.

Well in spirit of defending Trump they go to extent of proving that Saudis had nothing to do with 9/11. CIA did it! Jews did it!!

Any Jew who suck up to SA is a traitor . SA is the the most anti Jewish power of the world,, A place where Islam was born, their prophet hated Jews. All just to increase personal wealth

mmmmmm. Like the saying goes. "in Business there are no emotions - only economic interest". Therefore, Saudis do business with him due to financial gains to which they expect to benefit.

As for that Muslim hatred of Jews. You can kill him with the sword or honey. Amid virulent hatred of Jews taught in SA - Kushner is showing Jews positive side. The same is true with Israel & SA. Since Israel (Jews) is the only force which capable of helping the Sunnis against shi'te Iran - Saudis these days love & admire Israel. Will that "love" remain in the future? we don't know.

Khasoggi was killed not because of his extremist connections with Jehadis, Wahhabis or Muslim brotherhood or his Anti Trump stand. No need for Trumpians to thump chest.

Sodomy Arabia killed him because of his views against ruling family or house of Sauds. Khasoggi was part of Saudi establishment for decades, although not of Royal lineage. He liked limited reforms for SA. He was critical of recent reforms. It was all typical journalists mentality to be critical of anything. We don't know whether he recruited Mujahidins to fight Saudi Royals. Unfortunately any totalitarian government can't stomach criticism.. Loves to liquidate critics.

It can't get more hilarious than that. The more trump barks at asylum seekers from Latin America - the more they come. If they are smart - Once they get to US borders, immediately declare they "love President trump and admire his leadership". Than watch trump praise their courage and welcome them into the US

Migrant Caravan Swells to 5,000, Resumes Advance Toward U.S.

CIUDAD HIDALGO, Mexico (AP) — Despite Mexican efforts to stop them at the border, a growing throng of Central American migrants resumed their advance toward the U.S. border early Sunday in southern Mexico.

Hombre wrote:It can't get more hilarious than that. The more trump barks at asylum seekers from Latin America - the more they come. If they are smart - Once they get to US borders, immediately declare they "love President trump and admire his leadership". Than watch trump praise their courage and welcome them into the US

Migrant Caravan Swells to 5,000, Resumes Advance Toward U.S.

CIUDAD HIDALGO, Mexico (AP) — Despite Mexican efforts to stop them at the border, a growing throng of Central American migrants resumed their advance toward the U.S. border early Sunday in southern Mexico.

Golly Hombre for an isreali you seem to believe you know a lot about what Trump will do--does that come with the freedom to block someone who owns you time after time. Obama bowed to the Saudis and he was your man.

Hey Dude, also I would expect you might care or understand the importance or Borders, being at Isreali and all, right? Guess Asylum seekers are anyone who breaks the law to enter multiple countries?

idesigner1 wrote:Trump's policy is guided by his supporters who by and large opposes unchecked migration of illegal aliens.

Even democrats living in border states are against unchecked migration from South America.

Even Democratic president would not have welcome such a blatant violation of US borders. Trump is s bit dramatic .No one likes unchecked migration of foreigners.

Aaaaaand Yet.Trump is a tyrant whop hurts children. Democrats don't give a damn, they want to be back in power, no matter the cost--even if it means destrpying a man's reputation with a coached outright lie.

Khasoggi was killed not because of his extremist connections with Jehadis, Wahhabis or Muslim brotherhood or his Anti Trump stand. No need for Trumpians to thump chest.

Sodomy Arabia killed him because of his views against ruling family or house of Sauds. Khasoggi was part of Saudi establishment for decades, although not of Royal lineage. He liked limited reforms for SA. He was critical of recent reforms. It was all typical journalists mentality to be critical of anything. We don't know whether he recruited Mujahidins to fight Saudi Royals. Unfortunately any totalitarian government can't stomach criticism.. Loves to liquidate critics.

Actually Dude, he was a member of the press--he was killed in an embassy--as far as i'm concerned he was a human being and there should be consequences for his murder--but you know as always Muslims do what they want==if Trump didnt care at all, he'd do nothing, but thanks for catagorizing him as a "Cave Man," as usual, Obama did nothing when it came to muslims committing atrocities except shrug and say, "I'm the messiah! 3 point shot!"

idesigner1 wrote:When Iran was at war with Sadaam, Israel helped Ayatollahs by supplying arms.

Now it helps SA against Iran.

Not only Israelis but western power also think that supply both sides with arm so that they will destroy each other ie. Sunni vs Shia.

But that's not going to work they all Shias or Sunnis are sworn enemies of Israel and western culture. West and all non Muslim countries are their enemies!

You are right. However, with the new era of Internet, facebook & twitter, it is possible to sway public opinion among the young (I-generation) throughout Arab- Islamic world away from 7th century radicals to present day.

idesigner1 wrote:Trump's policy is guided by his supporters who by and large opposes unchecked migration of illegal aliens.

Even democrats living in border states are against unchecked migration from South America.

Even Democratic president would not have welcome such a blatant violation of US borders. Trump is s bit dramatic .No one likes unchecked migration of foreigners.

Again - you are right to a point. trump loves only trump. He lives and craves compliments. shove a compliment up is rectum then watch him "dance"

We have seen this play out time & time again when foreign leaders like Abe of Japan, Xijipin of China and president of Eu - all came to U.S. publically praised trump then watch him reverse his tariff against their countries.

You are right. However, with the new era of Internet, facebook & twitter, it is possible to sway public opinion among the young (I-generation) throughout Arab- Islamic world away from 7th century radicals to present day.

Then how does this work? The only efforts I can see are censorship and the struggle against fake news.

Propaganda is to some scholars as a carrot on a stick to donkeys. Karen Armstrong being the prime example on how it can induce a desired behavior.

You are right. However, with the new era of Internet, facebook & twitter, it is possible to sway public opinion among the young (I-generation) throughout Arab- Islamic world away from 7th century radicals to present day.

Then how does this work? The only efforts I can see are censorship and the struggle against fake news.

The latest headlines say that Kashoggi's body parts have been found in a well at the Saudi consulate. It seems that Erdogan thought better of releasing his tapes. I switched off the TV when he was clearly using the murder to ramble on patting himself on the back. The Guardian says

Erdogan clearly calculated that it did not suit him, or Turkey, to release the audio of the killing, and apparent video - both of which multiple sources have confirmed that his officials indeed have.

His decision to return the onus to Saudi Arabia was interesting, and unexpected. After exerting extreme pressure on the kingdom through more than a fortnight of piecemeal leaks, he opted out of a coup de grace when he had the world’s attention.

‘Hindus and Muslims belong to two different religious philosophies, social customs and literary traditions. They neither intermarry nor eat together, and indeed they belong to two different civilisations which are based mainly on conflicting ideas and conceptions.’ Muhammad Ali Jinnah