I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

That's really the only reason the parents are upset. Because now they have to figure out how to explain why Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy are all made up bullshiat but Jesus is totally real.

mattharvest:ManateeGag: I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

Why is a school talking about Santa or any other religious figure at all?

According to TFA, the exercise was to draw a picture of something real and a picture of something made up. Some kids started drawing Santa in the "real" column or whatever and the teacher decided that that is the moment when she must step in and correct these misinformed five year old plebes.

Shostie:mattharvest: ManateeGag: I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

Why is a school talking about Santa or any other religious figure at all?

According to TFA, the exercise was to draw a picture of something real and a picture of something made up. Some kids started drawing Santa in the "real" column or whatever and the teacher decided that that is the moment when she must step in and correct these misinformed five year old plebes.

What would you prefer? That she let them draw a fictional character in there? If the point was to understand the difference between things that and real and things that aren't, then that's fair.

Now, perhaps she would have been better off saying "I was talking about things, not people" or something, but that's not the point. I wasn't aware parents were entitled to have their kids' illusions protected by teachers.

Not really. Waldorf does draw from Anthroposophy and Rudolf Steiner, but it could hardly be called a "cult" movement. It is an educational framework and impulse designed to cultivate children's relationships with nature and cycles of the nature world. Rudolf Steiner was committed to an esoteric form of Christianity, which did make room for other-than-human Persons in the world--but that's really not exceptional for the Christian tradition, or many other religious traditions for that matter. The problem that I have is that the teacher entirely short circuits the very real and very positive experience of moving from exoteric symbolism to esoteric truth. There is a very real spirit of thankfulness, generosity and giving in humanity often associated with the birth of the new light (the Sun) around the winter solstice. Just as the cosmos gives us this light of increase, so too do we donate to each other's increase. Santa Claus is a way for children to experience this at the level they are capable of doing at that age. There will be a time they'll learn on their own that this is a subtle truth to be experienced inwardly for themselves--but wrenching the sacramental usage of Santa Claus out of the world of the youth does not strike me as a healthy move. We teach children lots of things at the level they are capable of appreciating--and then complicate them later on when they are capable of handling complication. In terms of Zen: "Yes there is a Santa Claus for those who do not know what he is. There is no Santa Claus for those who know what he is."

Not really. Waldorf does draw from Anthroposophy and Rudolf Steiner, but it could hardly be called a "cult" movement. It is an educational framework and impulse designed to cultivate children's relationships with nature and cycles of the nature world. Rudolf Steiner was committed to an esoteric form of Christianity, which did make room for other-than-human Persons in the world--but that's really not exceptional for the Christian tradition, or many other religious traditions for that matter. The problem that I have is that the teacher entirely short circuits the very real and very positive experience of moving from exoteric symbolism to esoteric truth. There is a very real spirit of thankfulness, generosity and giving in humanity often associated with the birth of the new light (the Sun) around the winter solstice. Just as the cosmos gives us this light of increase, so too do we donate to each other's increase. Santa Claus is a way for children to experience this at the level they are capable of doing at that age. There will be a time they'll learn on their own that this is a subtle truth to be experienced inwardly for themselves--but wrenching the sacramental usage of Santa Claus out of the world of the youth does not strike me as a healthy move. We teach children lots of things at the level they are capable of appreciating--and then complicate them later on when they are capable of handling complication. In terms of Zen: "Yes there is a Santa Claus for those who do not know what he is. There is no Santa Claus for those who know what he is."

/flame away, won't bother me

Fair enough. I know the kids who attend these schools do tend to perform well on standard measures later in life (SATs, for one). Pedagogically, they seem a bit mushy to me, but then again, most public schools are most certainly far too data, testing and outcomes oriented which is certainly bad for children I believe.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

As I said, I'm okay with teachers not encouraging lies...

Jesus F*cking Christ on a raft, it's not a lie. It's a child's story, a fantasy.Some of you take this "OMFG THERE IS NO SANTA UR LYING TO OUR CHILLDERN" nonsense much too seriously. What you think simply isn't important to their development.Let children have their fantasies. It really doesn't concern you.

I'm sure you'd be ok with an athiest teacher telling a christian student that there is no God too, right?

That's really the only reason the parents are upset. Because now they have to figure out how to explain why Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy are all made up bullshiat but Jesus is totally real.

Really? You know them? What a great coincidence! What else can you tell us about them that those of us who don't know them personally aren't privy to?

stpauler:Not so at her new school, where the teacher reportedly has a partner-in-grinchiness.

I hate that misuse of the term. I've been called a Grinch or a Scrooge before and it's utter bullshiat. They ended up having a change of heart.

You tell yourself you're not that kind but you don't even know your mindEven you could have a change of heartDon't lose that number You don't wanna call nobody elseSend it off in a letter to yourself, It's the only one you ownYou might use it if you feel better when you get home

Well......there isn't. However, 5-year-olds are supposed to believe in supernatural/mythical beings. They're kids. I stopped believing in Santa when I was 7, only because I figured out the handwriting on my gift tags was my mom's, and the handwriting on my sister's gift tags was my dad's. She was 2, so they kept putting "From: Santa" on hers, but after that they'd just put "From: Mom & Dad" on mine. It never bothered them that I found them out; I think they would have been hurt if I'd found the presents early or something.

Now, when a 40-year-old still believes that a jolly fat man who lives at the top of planet will squeeze himself through their chimney once a year.....then we have a problem.

I read an article one time that was talking about how learning that there is no Santa is a big part of growing up, and it helps kids feel responsible with that little bit of "adult" knowledge, especially if there are younger siblings in the house.