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We need to talk about Augustin

I know we have already talked about his performances in the match/post match threads but i think it deserves a separate thread.
What are we gonna do with him?Should we move him even if it's one year contract?I think we should do that if we want to have any glimmer of hope and success in the playoffs.

It's kinda crazy but he offers nothing.He is getting destroyed by almost everyone who faces him.Offensively we thought we got a shrewd point guard who could organize the game very well and easily find a teammate in a good position to score.We have seen none of that.Decision making is suspect at best.BTW is it only me who sees that his dribbling is sometimes "weird"?I mean sometimes he bounces the ball and it reaches almost his head height.What makes it worse,is that he's not even good at free throws.

***** Christ,we're talking about a complete failure so far.As being said already,i thought we were getting a really good player who could help us coming off the bench.I know some will say "Pacers,where the PGs come and die" but in this case it's all about him.And don't get me started with the Collison comparisons.Give me DC over the current DJ all night long.

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Re: We need to talk about Augustin

here is my take on it...... Augustin is not this bad......... he was a decent player in Charlotte for two years and a decent 3 point shooter and then get here and can't put the ball through the hoop. The guy can play, why he is struggling so much is tough to say, I think he is struggling mentally, dude averaged 14 ppg and nearly 7 apg in Charlotte, don't tell me he is not good or he is an awful player because that is not true. He is in a MAJOR shooting slump, however I am confident he will break out of it, maybe he is out of shape, or maybe he just needs more time to adjust to the offense and his new teammates. Will he break out of the slump remains to be seen, I am not saying he will start playing like a stud, but maybe around 6 ppg and 3 apg. I am just going to give him time

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

I don't think Augustin is this bad either. I've been following him since college and I really always liked his game. I was someone who was really excited when we got him. I just think its either all in his head now or maybe the hype he was getting from the players/fans got to him? That or maybe he just doesn't fit in with this team...it could happen. Same thing with Green. Also those two were on pretty bad teams last year and they kind of had to stand out right? That is a possibility as well, but who knows. Whatever the case is, we've only seen small flashes of "good" from these two players and it is not nearly enough to justify keeping them on this team. I think they just don't fit in here, or they really....I mean REALLY need a lot of time to get some chemistry going here in Indiana, because last year that chemistry here was pretty damn decent. Unfortunately, the fans here, including me are having a hard time believing in patience. We've waited for years for Indiana to be good, and after what happened last year it got to us. We finally got a taste of something more than just positive, it was borderline great for a lot of us. We expected greatness practically this year, but instead we're seeing a team that has gone downhill in comparison. It's been a while since I've watched a full basketball season with a good Indiana team so I'm not sure how long the wait really is, but so far in this early year a lot of us feel the need to panic and the East is looking pretty tough. Patience is not a virtue around here right now and I can understand why. Hopefully our front office and coaching staff has more patience than the fans. (In this case, I say this hoping they are doing the right thing, and something eventually changes by some miracle)

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

The only suspense left is to see whether or not this is the end of his NBA career or if he's just do for a massive upswing based off of his previous season's statistics. Up until now I've assumed the latter, but I'm starting to wonder if I'm wrong and it's really just an unexpected ending.

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Re: We need to talk about Augustin

Like I've been saying forever Vogel needs to speed the tempo for the second unit, posting up Mahinmi and play half court is not going to get it done, Vogel needs to stop with the over coaching and let guys like Lance and DJ run free to see what they can do.

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

I think the issue is the offense. Everyone has said, "The Pacers need a true point guard." However, with the "simple" scheme of Frank Vogel, how can Augustine be expected to excel as a true point guard? No, the player the Pacers need is similar to Monta Ellis. For years I fought against the notion; however, the Monta Ellis advocates were right. We need a player who can create offense; both in the form of points and passes.

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

The only suspense left is to see whether or not this is the end of his NBA career or if he's just do for a massive upswing based off of his previous season's statistics. Up until now I've assumed the latter, but I'm starting to wonder if I'm wrong and it's really just an unexpected ending.

I don't think is the end people thought the same thing about guys like Felton and Crawford last year in Portland and look at them kicking a** now.

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

The only suspense left is to see whether or not this is the end of his NBA career or if he's just do for a massive upswing based off of his previous season's statistics. Up until now I've assumed the latter, but I'm starting to wonder if I'm wrong and it's really just an unexpected ending.

He got those stats playing for what may have been the worst team in NBA history. That team decided not to keep him. That should have told you something. The fans there were glad to see him go for the very reasons that everyone is on his case about in Indy. Collison was better then and he is better now but not without his own limitations.... ...

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

Like I've been saying forever Vogel needs to speed the tempo for the second unit, posting up Mahinmi and play half court is not going to get it done, Vogel needs to stop with the over coaching and let guys like Lance and DJ run free to see what they can do.

See, I don't think the second unit should pick up the pace to suit Augustin. With a lineup of DJ-Green-Young-Hansbrough-Mahinmi, the only thing that would accomplish is giving more possessions to the opposing team's second unit, meaning we'd likely lose even more ground when the starters are out.

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

here is my take on it...... Augustin is not this bad......... he was a decent player in Charlotte for two years and a decent 3 point shooter and then get here and can't put the ball through the hoop.

Maybe he's better than his shooting slump suggests, but consider that Charlotte last year wasn't just bad; they were historically bad. And even on a historically bad team, somebody has to score points on it. Then consider that this historically bad team decided not to re-sign him (even in a backup role) just a few years after making him a lottery pick. A bad team that was badly in need of assets and talent decided to let this guy walk, even though he wouldn't have cost much to keep.

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

In hindsight, sure. At the time, I'm not sure many people would have thought DJ would play worse than AJ.

Right, but at least a few of us thought we should keep him on as our 3rd stringer/insurance policy. He only costs 400K more than our current 3rd stringer, Ben Hansbrough. I can't say Ben is worse without seeing him play, but A.J. is a proven commodity - not a great shooter, but he'll manage a game effectively for a backup.

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

I wanted to keep A.J. Price; I thought he had potential. O'Brien was right when he said he may have been the steal of the draft. If A.J. Price had been given the attention of Lance Stephenson he could have been more. I am not suggesting that he could have been a star, but I believe he could have been a steady point guard.

Like I've been saying forever Vogel needs to speed the tempo for the second unit, posting up Mahinmi and play half court is not going to get it done, Vogel needs to stop with the over coaching and let guys like Lance and DJ run free to see what they can do.

Totally agree with this! Like a change of pace running back is used in football, the second unit should run and gun! DJ and Green are made for this kind of up tempo game. And so is Lance once he rejoins the bench

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

He got those stats playing for what may have been the worst team in NBA history. That team decided not to keep him. That should have told you something. The fans there were glad to see him go for the very reasons that everyone is on his case about in Indy. Collison was better then and he is better now but not without his own limitations.... ...

Maybe he's better than his shooting slump suggests, but consider that Charlotte last year wasn't just bad; they were historically bad. And even on a historically bad team, somebody has to score points on it. Then consider that this historically bad team decided not to re-sign him (even in a backup role) just a few years after making him a lottery pick. A bad team that was badly in need of assets and talent decided to let this guy walk, even though he wouldn't have cost much to keep.

This myth that Charlotte didn't want him back needs to end, Charlotte offered him an extension and he said no, according to the Charlotte reporter on 1070 Augustin turned down about 6mil a year for the next 3 years because he wanted to get out of that place at any cost, somebody should make this post and the Djones was a cancer post an sticky somewhere so I don't need to repeat it every time somebody brings one of the myths back.

Re: We need to talk about Augustin

See, I don't think the second unit should pick up the pace to suit Augustin. With a lineup of DJ-Green-Young-Hansbrough-Mahinmi, the only thing that would accomplish is giving more possessions to the opposing team's second unit, meaning we'd likely lose even more ground when the starters are out.

You are bringing up a good point, I was thinking about benefiting DJ but I forgot about the other scrubs.