Nice Guy Syndrome

“Nice guys finish last; women only want the bad guys. I treat her well but…”

Typically Nice Guys bemoan how they can’t get a date as women only like the “bad boys.” Nice Guys are very possessive but never seek to commit when in a relationship. Often, these men are clingy, insecure, self abasing, and their whole identity is based upon how other people view them. Nice Guys are desperate to please…everyone. In a romantic relationship, nice guys set their interest on a pedestal. She becomes the goddess of his life.

Nice Guys do have a somewhat valid argument about how some – note I said SOME- women cling to emotionally or physically abusive alpha males when better alternatives are available. However, the main reason why Nice Guys can’t find anyone to date is typically because of that mistaken view. They give up and just complain about the state of the world instead of looking at their own issues that prevent developing the relationship they desire.

I was a Nice Guy. Speaking from experience, I was very possessive toward a girl I liked but never had the balls to commit to dating. That failure was my fault entirely. But as a Nice Guy, I didn’t want to ‘risk’ the friendship. I was above such things as romantic relationships. So I thought anyway. I hovered around as a friend despite her expressing interest in changing our friendship to something else. I never committed. In the end, my lack of commitment ended the friendship. At the end my faulty subconscious ideas came to the forefront and I treated her like a possession that was somehow broken. Reflecting back I am ashamed of such an attitude and my lack of identity. This is unfortunately very common with Nice Guys.

Nice Guys view women as property. Not to beat up on the Bible, but many Nice Guys subconsciously buy into the idea of women as their property as found in the Old Testament and areas of the New Testament. Although they treat her like the finest porcelain, Nice Guys fail to recognize the girl as a human who often doesn’t want to be considered a goddess. The burden of being a porcelain goddess is unfair and impossible to live up to. She is his “life” and only source of “happiness.” Nice Guys proudly preach about “my girlfriend” or “my girl” or “my love” like a missionary among heathens. When around a Nice Guy preaching, count the possessive words.

Nice Guys have major insecurities. They feel unworthy of a relationship. They worship often from afar. Nice Guys pass a woman on the street and wonder how he appeared to her. Does she think I am ‘nice?’ Nice Guys have no real sense of self. Their only self is determined by how they think other people view them. They lay down their identity to become what someone will think is ‘nice.’ They are devastated when someone doesn’t like them. They are terrified of being hated. Ironically enough Nice Guys are often disliked for this very reason.

Nice Guys think themselves above “mere” sexual desires. They deeply want a spiritual connection with someone. However, they are unable to have this connection because of how unattainable they make it. They want to join with someone and lose themselves in the other. Nice Guys believe in the ONE; the one and only mate in their life that is perfect for them. Again, ironically, the idea of the ONE is intended to flatter her to his bed. Despite touting how he is above sex, Nice Guys are far more underhanded than the “bad” guys in order to get it. Nice Guys are often racked with guilt about their sexual desires and fantasies. This drives them to set her ever higher on the pedestal so not to taint her with those desires.

Nice Guys are loud martyrs. They toot their own horn about how nice they are to their love and other people. They love to speak about what they give up for others. They want people to be jealous of how “good” he treats his inner circle. He seeks the spotlight to reaffirm his sense of self.

Nice Guys won’t change until they realize their sense of self. Nice Guys can’t be changed by their goddess until they see their inner self. She can threaten to break up with him, but he will only fall to his knees and beg her forgiveness for his sins. She can walk away. This is the worst shock to the Nice Guy. For some, they are forced to finally see what they have avoided for so long. For others, they fall into a deep depression that only reinforces the Nice Guy Syndrome.Nice Guys finish last after all, right?

A person can only change themselves. No one can do it for them. The root of the Nice Guy Syndrome is a lack of identity. Such men have a distorted view of themselves. Typically, they think themselves a sinner unworthy of love. From this view they overcompensate to appear “good, kind, nice” without defining those words. Nice Guys are really just selfish. A person can only be selfless after they discover a self to give to others. People with a sense of self don’t need people to like them. A Nice Guy is unable to relate to anyone because he don’t know himself. How can you share what you do not know? All a Nice Guy can offer is empty adoration.

Now, nice guys do exist. They are the quiet men who know their self worth. They seek to ease suffering in others without asking anything in return. They relate to people on a human level. Nice guys have enemies and are okay with that. Nice guys kiss their love tenderly and do animal things under night’s camera. They commit to their word and pursue what they want. They know who they are and accept the face in the mirror. They work to change themselves because it is what they want to be, and not what they believe people want them to be.

Once a Nice Guy stops being “nice”, he will find people will like him a lot more. He will also find he can finally have a real human relationship.

35 thoughts on “Nice Guy Syndrome”

you say:”SOME- women cling to emotionally or physically abusive alpha males when better alternatives are available”. what better alternatives, better according to who………..the loser ‘nice/good guys’ who think they’re the so called ‘better alternatives’? if they’re the better alternatives, why are they single? leave it to a guy to tell a female what they need, what they want, and what’s better for them…………like we can’t possibly decide for ourselves, and we need patronising know it all guys to decide for us;p

Well, I would consider anyone who isn’t abusive to be a better alternative than someone who abuses another. The point of the article is to suggest that Nice Guys are actually in the abusive category. It is just done in a different way.

I admit that I was in the whining, needy, patronizing category of men. I, unfortunately, find myself sliding back into it time to time. Habits have momentum that take time to shift.

the fact of the matter is, females date jerks not because they’re jerks, or because they like being treated badly. females are attracted to jerks because they’re self confident, they don’t cling, beg, or grovel like ‘nice/good guys’, they take any rejection in their stride and move on unlike ‘nice/good guys’ who sulk like six year old boys, whine it’s not fair, and we don’t give them a chance………or turn into abusive a**holes about it

Exactly! Self confidence is important with any social interaction. However, self confidence isn’t a loud boastful thing. It is reflected quietly in how a person carries themselves and acts. Many jerks lack self confidence. Someone who is self confident doesn’t boast about his “conquests” or treats others poorly. Selfishness lacks confidence. While true selflessness (acting to help others without seeking a reward) is an act of complete self confidence. The confident don’t require or need outside feedback or adoration.

decent guy doesn’t have to mean insecure, clingy, whiny, lacking confidence ‘nice guy’ and a guy with a bad boy edge to his personality, doesn’t automatically have to equate to jerk………….just maybe they’re 2 sides of the same coin. the so called ‘nice good guys’ can be abusive as the alleged jerks they criticise…………try turning a self proclaimed, self righteous ‘nice good guy’ down. ‘nice guy armed with junior high compliments disappears, to be replaced by either a whining sulk……….or an abusive a**hole

You hit on the common trend with Nice Guys: they are actually not all that nice. As a recovering Nice Guy, I was possessive and fell into the mentally and verbally abusive category (passive aggressive). Nice Guys are self centered but also locked in to the point where they cannot articulate their (often sexual and emotional) needs. This focus on the self creates the insecurity and selfishness. Relationships become about the Nice Guy’s needs rather than that of his interest.

the response from so called ‘nice guys’ to females turning them down and telling them no, is why most females try and sugarcoat it. by saying things like:”i don’t wanna ruin our friendship”, “you’re a really ‘nice guy’, i like you as a ‘friend’, but i don’t look at you ‘that way'”…….most females just don’t want the hassle or rejecting him flat out, because ‘nice guys’ are emotionally immature and sulk about stuff……….so females try to let them down easy

One of the common traits of a Nice Guy is how they will hang on everything a girl says after she turns him down. Turning him down easily only serves to encourage and generate a false hope within him. Nice Guys often use friendship as a “door” toward a relationship. Even now, I find myself sometimes thinking that way instead of simply enjoying the great female friendships I have. It takes time to change habits.

if ‘nice guys’ weren’t such sissyfied little b*#@!%$ about everything, didn’t sulk and took rejection on the chin, females wouldn’t try to let them down easily. nice guys can’t take rejection, they sulk, whine or become abusive, so females try to do it softly not to hurt their feelings, and because we don’t want the “but i’m a nice guy” convos. it’s not easy for a female either you know

You touch on a problem, in my view, of relationships: the goal of getting laid. Sexuality does play an important part in a relationship. But, it is too often the end goal for males (and females for that matter). Sexuality is a reinforcing behavior to strengthen the trust and bonds between two people in a relationship. That trust and friendship should be the goal of dating, not doing the ugly.

You are right that guys often forget that women have a rough time with relationships as well. In many regards, it is harder for women than guys.

what the overwhelming majority of guys don’t understand is, attraction isn’t a choice for females, we don’t make a conscious thought out choice for one guy over another. if a female don’t ‘feel it’ for you, then no amount of arguing with her will change it. whining, sulking begging, grovelling and saying:”that’s not fair, i’m a ‘good guy’, give me a chance, get to know me, you’ll see i’m a ‘good guy'” will change her mind. either a girl feels it for a guy, or she doesn’t……..simple as that.

females respond to the feelings guys trigger in them. how often have you heard a female say about a guy she’s with:”i like how he makes me feel”, “i like how i feel when i’m with him?” that goes over most guys head. so big deal, a guy claims he’s a ‘nice guy’………….so do 95% of most guys, females are surrounded by guys who swear they’re ‘good guys’. well so what, it makes them no different to most other guys we talk to, who cares. you see one self proclaimed ‘nice/good guy’, you’ve seen them all. they don’t bring anything different to the table the rest of them do. they all look and sound EXACTLY the same. the same lame, junior high compliments about our looks and bodies, the same demented pick up lines, the same whining, sulking and insistance that:”i’m a ‘good guy, give me a chance”, “i’m not like other guys, i’m different”. i don’t wanna break it to you guys, you’re not……….and you aren’t

This is something I struggle to understand. However, I hesitate to generalize. There are as many attraction patterns are they are people.

For example, I guess I can be called a demisexual. I do not feel attraction for a girl unless I have known her for a long time. With the way my biology works, I have to be friends before I develop any interest in dating a girl. I don’t look upon a girl and think “Wow she’s hot!” or “I wonder if she is single?” I tend to not have any reaction at all outside of a “she looks cold with that short skirt ” or “Those glasses look cute on her.” I tend to need to be friends with her for several years before attraction develops. But, I know guys who function more like you describe. Just as I know girls who function more like I do.

You touch on a good point: truly nice guys (and gals) don’t claim to be nice. They simply live their nature without proclaiming it.

most guys don’t understand attraction and how it works for females. if they did, they’d give up behaving like overgrown, leg humping junior highers, and be done with their annoying tendencies to be ‘nice’, in lame attempts to earn females attention and approval

give up being friends first with females you want to date………..we females DON’T date guys we consider ‘friends’. we have a place for guys like that…………..you guys call it the ‘friend zone’……..and you all know what that means

Actually, I’ve only dated friends. I don’t do well with “standard” dating. I feel disingenuous and like I am leading the girl on in those cases. Human attraction exists on a spectrum. On one end is sexuality that has problems being ever satisfied. On the other end are asexuals – people who feel little to no sexual attraction. I lean in the asexual direction. I only feel attraction after I am in a relationship. It also requires several years to develop. This is a common trait of asexual attraction. Asexuals feel attraction only after a relationship is established, unlike the more accepted method. It is a matter of biology and neural networks.

In other words, people similar to me only date friends because we cannot feel all the good feelings you posted earlier unless we are already in a relationship of mutual respect and trust. We can “date” but this type of dating is closer to friends hanging out than what society considers dating. Therefore, many asexual people tend to only date friends and colleagues. The idea of a friend zone tends to apply more for “Nice Guys” than people who are psychologically asexual.

Many couples I’ve asked advice from who are married for 50-70 years told me friendship is vital for a lasting relationship. Emotions will come and go, but a core of mutual Friendship (you can often hear their emphasis on the word) is what lasts. Essentially, romantic relationships are friendships with sexual elements and deep trust added in. The sexual elements and resultant feelings wax and wane, but the deep trust and friendship is what keeps a couple together.

i agree with you, but that level of friendship normally develops after you start being with somebody. if being ‘friends’ with females was all it took to start relationships, guys who complain about being in the ‘friend zone’ would have no trouble finding girlfriends or getting laid

The problem with the “friend zone” idea is how it is considered negative – as if friendship is somehow less than romantic relationships. In many regards, romantic relationships are inferior to friendships because of how unstable they tend to be in Western cultures.

I agree that such levels of friendship normally develops after you spend time with someone. While “normal” people in the attraction spectrum go attraction > relationship (to oversimplify) asexual people are biologically incapable of such things. They tend to be friendship > relationship > attraction where a relationship is based on mutual interests rather than mutual feelings triggering the relationship. I know I wish I could date “normally” some days, but the idea makes me feel morally wrong because I will not have the same attraction feelings, if ever, for her.

i use the phrase ‘friend zone’ because most guys use it, almost always in a negative way. most guys being ‘friends’ and ‘nice’ with, and to females, is always manipulative for most of them. they use supposedly being ‘nice’ as a tool to try and get females into bed, or to get them to date them. for most guys, it’s always about sex, a females looks, or her body, no matter how much they lie out of their a**es and claim otherwise. a fact easily demonstrated by the fact that most guys, when confronted with an attractive female, will fall at her feet, and grovel in adoration. shower her with lame junior high compliments about her looks and body. “why are you so beautiful”?, “holy shit, are you a model?”, “do you know you’re gorgeous?”, “i’d treat you like a princess if you were mine”, “if you have a boyfriend, he’s soooooooooooooo lucky”. all after talking to her for 30 seconds, and based on NOTHING but her looks and body. and these losers and freaks call we females shallow if we prefer good looking guys?? whatever;p

The key is self awareness. Once a Nice Guy realizes being “nice” is a problem, or, rather, he being self centered is the problem. Once he is aware of it and wants to change, he can make strides toward the confidence, emotional maturity, and security he wants. I am speaking from experience in that regard. It takes time. Habits of a lifetime will all change quickly. Although many will.

as a female, none of that is my problem. i have a squillion guys who want my attention, and they all think they’re ‘nice guys’ and are entitled to something because of it. you turn one ‘nice guy’ down, 10 will step up to take his place hoping it will be different for him…….it’s no skin off our noses

when a guy talks to a female, especially if she’s super attractive, she has options when it comes to potential partners. so a guy gets ONE chance, and once chance only, to make a good impression probably. if he blows that, that’s it……simple as that

as much as self proclaimed ‘nice/good guys’ want to believe otherwise…………being ‘nice’ to females doesn’t entitle them to a girlfriend or pu*sy automatically………….it doesn’t entitle them to a damn thing…………and how they hate it

as for ‘nice guys’ having a valid point about females cliging to abusive guys when there are better alternatives available. clearly those guys AREN’T those better alternatives……………..they’d not be ‘friend zone’ fodder and permanently single if they were

As much as I enjoyed our discussions, your comments might be better suited in your own blog post. :). I will address a few of your points, however.

I didn’t suggest “Nice Guys” were valid alternatives to abusive males. Rather, Nice Guys are abusive as well. They tend to be emotionally abusive using passive aggressive methods. Nice Guys often place sex at the foremost of their goals. This is wrong thinking.

Nice Guys are human. They have insecurities and personal issues that need to be worked through. Nice Guys need to take care of these issues before a stable, healthy relationship can be enjoyed. Personal issues need to be addressed by each of us before we can enjoy a good relationship.

‘nice guys’ can’t accept there’s anything wrong with them that makes them single, it’s always the fault of females who won’t give them a chance. when they do finally admit they lack confidence, they blame females for that too. “my confidence is low because females won’t date me, and that makes me feel bad about myself. if females would give me a chance, i’d feel more confident” just like a drug addict or alcoholic that finally admits to drug addiction or alcoholism and says:”yeah i’m an addict or alcoholic, but it’s the fault of”. you never improve or change for the better, if you point the finger at everything or everybody else. there has to come a time in your life that you say:”i got problems, and i’m the only one who can fix it, the buck stops with me”. ‘nice/good guys’ are always victims and always blamers. the victims of something or somebody else……….something or somebody else is always to blame………everybody or everything else but them. none of that is remotely attractive to females i’m afraid

as for guys who spew that drivel about treating females like princess, queens and goddesses…………..a guy ain’t entitled a princess, queen or goddess………….unless he’s a prince, king, or a god himself…………….tough luck on that front sorry

it’s ok to say letting a guy down easily can encourage false hope, but often females feel they have no choice. females don’t want to feel like bitches for rejecting him and hurting his feelings, because as much as most guys believe otherwise………most of us aren’t the spawn of satan who get off hurting him, and even when we do it gently, we get called heartless bitch anyway. we don’t want the akward:”you’re a really ‘nice guy’, but i don’t look at you ‘that way'” convo with guys, that are invariably sulking like 6 year olds over it. and take into account thousands of years of social pressure on females that tell therm there are repercussions for being forthright and speaking their minds. when a guy speaks his mind, there’s invariably always an acceptance of that, and he rarely needs to justify it. but if a female speaks her mind, and is seen to be outspoken………the hounds of hell are brought down around her because of it

there’s also the issue of the unequal power distribution physically between most males and most females. ‘nice/good guys’ are angry, resentful and bitter toward females because females won’t date them. guys are generally stronger than females, and that can be physically threatening for alot of girls. maybe alot of them don’t want to run the risk of angering guys by telling them straight out, and risking confrontations………..that could well turn physical