The biggest story right now isn't the plethora of information that Wikileaks has supposedly unveiled. In fact nobody really seems to know much about this leaked information, all we seem to hear is that "thousands of cables" were leaked. Instead the biggest story has to do with a scandal involving the man responsible for orchestrating the supposed "leaks".

Really makes me wonder, what is actually going on?
Thus far we have: No highlights of leaked information, no individuals named, no corporations or groups being outed.

Everyone seems to be thoroughly focused on absolutely nothing (what else is new), and I gotta say, I haven't had this good a laugh in a really long time.

i read today one of the 'cables' is about one of kim jong il's sons not being fit to take over from his father because he plays too many computer games. infact they stated than none of his 3 sons are really upto it and it may be left to the militarys generals.

Really makes me wonder, what is actually going on?
Thus far we have: No highlights of leaked information, no individuals named, no corporations or groups being outed.

huh?
have you been following the coverage of the guardin, nyt and spiegel? they published a lot of specific articles concerning single topics/nations/corperations... like the un spying, shell in nigera and so on and so on

Just being clueless and not reading anything about a certain topic and then blaming the press & media for their "crap" is also a reasonable method, don't you think? Of course trying to get [+]es at a gaming site from similar not informed persons is the correct followup.

No one will be charged with anything, no one will be fired, no one held accountable. Obama will probably be re-elected, if not then the next scum bag will come in with a fresh start to continue the corruption under the guise of democracy.

Give it a rest, this news doesn't mean shit until someone is held accountable (which they won't be). Wake up kid.

so your post is about the consequences and not about the actual information?

i really feel like the sheer amount of stories really downplays a lot of things, on top of all the drama with assange... its a shame but not everything has been analysed thoroughly so maybe its abit too early to judge

Nobody should be punished for the content of the cables. They were private cables sent by people doing their jobs, and well I might add.

If you are talking about punishing specific countries, I think the reason nobody is doing anything is because all of them have a mutual understanding of the inner workings of the diplomatic system. These are not the most secretive cables that any country has that have been released. Nothing top secret (from my understanding).

I just don't know what you expected to be the outcome. Even wikileaks knew they wouldn't be doing serious damage to international relations by releasing the cables. The sole purpose was to inform citizens of the nature of their own governments. Any punishment will be handed out by the citizens via elections and lobbying to make changes to current systems. That seems rather unlikely in the United States, although the old breed of politicians are approaching the end of their careers here and it's possible that in coming years the new generation will make positive changes.

Democrats pray she makes a campaign during the next presidential election. All she will do is take away votes from a qualified republican candidate. Every liberal and the majority of conservatives in the US know that she is not qualified to be president. She is unelectable.

"There is a growing sense that the former Alaska governor is not qualified to serve as president, with more than seven in 10 Americans now saying she is unqualified, up from 60 percent in a November survey. Even among Republicans, a majority now say Palin lacks the qualifications necessary for the White House. "

"The survey indicates that a majority of Republicans, 54 percent, feel Palin is qualified, with 44 percent indicating she isn't. But only 29 percent of independent voters questioned feel she is qualified to serve as president, with 68 percent disagreeing. According to the poll, nine in 10 Democrats feel Palin is not qualified."

Polls are not always that accurate, but when all the polls read the same way, you can feel slightly more confident in their results. I for one hope she runs. Of course you can't be sure of anything but I'm confident that Americans are not as stupid as you believe.

Based on current polls your statement is false. *edit* Just to clarify this statement, there are no polls equivalent to each other about Palin and Obama. The polls about Palin ask the question of whether or not she is qualified to hold the position of President. She has no job, that being said only 30% of the country think she is qualified. Meanwhile the Presidential poll refers to how the public believes Obama is performing his job. The job only 30% of the country believes that Palin is qualified to perform. His approval rating is 43% and has hovered around 45% for the past 3 months.

I only responded to inform you of current issues in my country. I even provided relevant examples supporting my position. You can continue to make baseless claims about Americans and our political system if you like. I'll no longer interfere.

Actually, a recent poll (just after he caved in on tax cuts for the rich) among people who donated time or money to Obama's campaign showed that 74% disagree with his policies, and 51% will not vote for him again.

All it will do is create more mistrust between people and GVT's ironically the very thing its trying to undo.

GVT's are always going to be underhand and secretive, its what you need to do to survive.

And the reason these wikileaks will backfire is because as Vampire said (and of course I in other posts) when you steal something and use it, you tarnish yourself. You lose credibility.

Its like reading someone's diary, even if you find some juicy gossip, you're a complete cunt for what you did and every GVT knows they talk and slag each other off behind their back.

Its not going to pit them against each other and cause any trouble because unlike the idiots on the internet thinking it will these people have a real understanding of the world. Not from behind their keyboards.

In fact, they might actually become stronger and sign some kind of deal because the actions of wikileaks encapsualtes them all.
The only thing EVERY SINGLE GVT has in common is secrecy.
And this us vs them attitude will backfire.

its really only deluded internet types that think differently becuae they are so far disconnected from reality in the first place.

"The REAL ACTUAL outcome is everything stays the same AND gets worse." Worse for who? This is the same "us vs them" attitude that you say will backfire.

"All it will do is create more mistrust between people and GVT's ironically the very thing its trying to undo." It's not about trust, it's about revealing actual powers. It's creating equality, not trust. Knowledge = power, so knowledge spread around is power spread around.

"And the reason these wikileaks will backfire is because as Vampire said (and of course I in other posts) when you steal something and use it, you tarnish yourself. You lose credibility." True, but wikileaks has never itself stolen anything, only made the stolen information available for the masses.

Worse for who? This is the same "us vs them" attitude that you say will backfire.

If you're going to start talking about the source of things let's remember that society without a GVT would be chaos. People are too stupid as a whole to govern themselves.

It's not about trust, it's about revealing actual powers. It's creating equality, not trust. Knowledge = power, so knowledge spread around is power spread around.

Equality is nothing but a bullshit ideal that will never happen because people are not equal. Never have been, never will be. They don't look, think, act, work the same. So why would we be equal?. Go the Saudi Arabia and kiss your Girlfriend on a beach. Then when you're arrested and thrown in a cell, let's see how you feel about your equality spiel.

True, but wikileaks has never itself stolen anything, only made the stolen information available for the masses.

Wikileaks has facilitated and promoted it more than anyone.
If I find a kilo of heroin, it doesn't mean I should go out and sell it.
Your attitude is a very weak one which tries (and fails) to shift responsibility and shows exactly why GVT's exists because that attitude is common in everyday people and it only leads to failed economies/countries/disaster. Most good countries are that way because of their leadership. Its no the other way around.

"If you're going to start talking about the source of things let's remember that society without a GVT would be chaos. People are too stupid as a whole to govern themselves"

This is still the same "us vs them". Government is made out of people. People are the government. Government is the people. I agree that we wouldn't manage without a government, but separating the two... not wise :(

"Equality is nothing but a bullshit ideal that will never happen because people are not equal. Never have been, never will be. They don't look, think, act, work the same. So why would we be equal?. Go the Saudi Arabia and kiss your Girlfriend on a beach. Then when you're arrested and thrown in a cell, let's see how you feel about your equality spiel."

Being same =! being equal. You can treat different people equally. It's an ideal, yes, but one worth living by. We should be equal because... i don't know. I've been battling with this same issue for the last 4 months. I used to think like you do about this, but I've changed my opinion based purely on instinct. I just think it's fair. I'll give you an answear propably within next 3 months that's more theoretical. I don't uderstand your example of being thrown in jail in saudi arabia though.

"Your attitude is a very weak one which tries (and fails) to shift responsibility"

You and I weren't talking about responsibility. My comment you quoted was a reply to this comment:

"And the reason these wikileaks will backfire is because as Vampire said (and of course I in other posts) when you steal something and use it, you tarnish yourself. You lose credibility"

Wikileaks are responsible for what they did, but they did not steal anything. And I don't see their credibility challenged. Or are you saying that spreading stolen information is same as the theft?

Obama ran on a campaign of government transparency, and specifically spoke out in support of leaks that show wrong-doing. We've only seen about 1% of the leak so far, and we've already found dozens of suspicious, wrong, and even outright ILLEGAL events.

While the vast majority of the political backlash will go on behind the scenes, there have already been a ton of public reactions by foreign governments. Just because YOU can't see the damage that it has caused, it does not mean that the damage isn't there. You seem to have very little knowledge of politics, the leaks in question, or even the result of leaks in the past.

No one has or will resign, it's up to the citizens during the next elections to choose the right candidate/s.

Wow you are being serious.. Yea I'm sure the tea-partiers will do the right thing come 2012.

The fact of the matter is that most major events going on right now (TAS Scanners, War in Iraq/Afghanistan, Economy Gone to Shit) are a direct causal effect from the attacks of 9/11. None of this bullshit would be happening if it wasn't for what transpired that day.

My only hope is that someone, whether it be Wikileaks or anyone else, will eventually uncover and distribute information that shines light on the findings of 9/11: loads of thermite found in the dust of the WTC, building 7 obviously being imploded, inaccuracies of the pentagon attack and the footage that wasn't released etc.

Was referring to the conspiracy theories, I wasn't aware you subscribed. Also by subscribing it makes you anything BUT a realist. That is because your world relies on disregarding certain information, while simultaneously inserting information that has not been presented to you.

Who said anything about conspiracy theories? Everything stated above can be backed by the research of scientists and professionals over the past 9 years.

Clearly it is you who has disregarded information and has approx 9 years of scientifically infallible information to catch up to speed on. In this way you are much more of a "theorist" than I am. I can't believe you used the "C" word!!

It's called showing how the other guys' demonstration is flawed and/or wrong. If you're going to call "opinion pieces" articles that debunk Steven Jones' claims when they are clearly not then what's the point? Give me a specific argument for/so-called proof of the presence of thermite in the WTC and I'll provide you with the debunking.

We also get to vote on senators and house representatives. Citizens run for office and eventually take those positions. We will see what happens in 2012 in terms of elections. But I personally always have hope for the future, I'm 23 now so let's say in 10-20 years my generation will start holding positions in the government.

You don't represent a valid counter-argument. You're pulling specifics out of thin air that weren't presented in my generalized statement to begin with.

It's obvious that the citizenship has rights and a say in the government here. I'm also aware of corporate corruption, but it doesn't negate the fact that the citizens have to continue playing their roll in the government and electing the officials they think are best fit. As I said before this is an optimistic view. If the people stop voting they lose power completely.

Sure it is but democracy sucks dick. You think we have the power for change? We can't control those who we elect after they're elected. They don't run their votes and decisions by us. They're bound by party politics and play by their rules until their term is over and then we re-elect them on the same lies they fed us 4 or 6 years ago and nothing changes. gg wp no re.

nothing we don't already know, but the is media acting like retards blowing it out of proportion since they are the ones NOT reporting what they should have been and feeding us irrelevant bullshit

~ The very word 'secrecy' is repugnant in a free and open society; and we are as a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings. ~
John Fitzgerald Kennedy

If that is correct then please make a short summary of what else we will learn in the next releases.
Sure, I suspected quite a share of what is now actual knowledge, but stuff life Israeli military activity in Nigeria, China backing South Korea and several other things, I for one did not see coming.

Use your own words to predict something that you 'know' that will be verified by the so far unreleased cables.
you are the one who says there is nothing we don't know already, so it should be fairly easy for you.

Quoting something afterwards is the same as a doing this:

Person A: "Tell me a number from 1 to 100."
Person B: "Fifty-Five."
Person A: "I knew you would say fifty-five before you said it. Here is a piece of paper with a 55 on it."

And then A pulls it out of a stack of papers with the numbers 1 to 100.

of course i don't know what exactly will be leaked next, i can only assume

but what i am sure off, is that what will be leaked will be too no surprise to me (yes im confident, but there is a reason for it, from what has been leaked so far, it really isn't something i would call a "secret leaked", but maybe the next cables will surprise me, dunno)

I've liked Ron Paul for a while, however I disagree with his stance of pro-life. He has also dodged the issue of same-sex marriage (which I support), but tbh I'm highly skeptical of any politician in the main stream media today.

You see how Christianity attempts to control governments, even if the church and state are supposed to be separated.

The Shell story was fairly lucrative as well. It pretty much confirms what everyone has been saying about corporations.

On the left, you see concerns over corporations confirmed. On the right, concerns over government. The lesson to be learned - we shouldn't favor corporations or governments, because they're both evil (religion, also, is evil).

There's a great deal of tactical information to be gathered. Just in showing everyone how various entities operate, the leaks have proven valuable. If nothing else changes, tactics certainly will.

The cable released by WikiLeaks shows that Ratzinger was the leading voice behind the Holy See's unsuccessful drive to secure a reference to Europe's "Christian roots" in the EU constitution. The US diplomat noted that Ratzinger "clearly understands that allowing a Muslim country into the EU would further weaken his case for Europe's Christian foundations".

Wikileaks isn't about exposing anything specifically (i.e. some trivial diplomatic cables). What wikileaks is trying to do is to make it harder for secretive networks/governments/companies to function effectively.

By creating a panic that any information can potentially be leaked into the public domain, secretive networks will attempt to tighten their security which in turn will make them less effective to operate.

You can read a very well written piece explaining their mission statement here:

have you read the original paper? i'd disagree atleast slightly on most of the comments on the issue of assange's "theoretical work". in their stubbornness most commentators only take in those sentences they ctrl+f'ed the word "conspiracy" in and in doing so largely miss the point.

true, assange argues against authoritarian secrecy (and yes, he also goes in detail on how to undermine such secrecy) but also explicitly for another form of governance.

Since unjust systems, by their nature induce opponents, and in many places barely have the upper hand, mass leaking leaves them exquisitely vulnerable to those who seek to replace them with more open forms of governance.

nowhere does he talk about morality, what he does is equating being secretive with being "unjust", as if there weren't good reasons to conspire in these days. if anyone assange knows this, being the public figure of an highly secretive group.

After reading a fair amount of the cables themselves, the diplomats seem more like journalists. If only they reported their findings to the American people, maybe the United States could function as a real democracy. Diplomats are now journalists, and journalists are now entertainers/propagandists... does that sound anything like democracy?

It's extremely bizarre how the diplomats are basically exactly what our journalists should be. And yet, when we receive the kind of journalism we should always have, the U.S. government tries to censor it. Why exactly? So we can listen to horsecrap like Fox news? It doesn't seem to have a legitimate function. If the American people read the real stories, they would be far more supportive of what the United States government is doing. By not knowing what's real and what isn't, they tend to imagine wild, crazy things, and then vote based on that lunacy. Let's face it... just by the amount of religious people in the world, it's obvious regular people are terrible at distinguishing between fact and fiction.

Maybe we should turn all our 'diplomats' into journalists, and put all our 'journalists' in Hollywood.

Excuse me but whats all the commotion about, ive been geeking up in games and have no idea what the heck is going on. All i read is "wikileaks this and that", too lazy to read walls of text because the text itself seems so unappealing and dull, like reading yesterdays news, so break it down for me, in a way a 7 y-o would understand.

I had exactly the same thought just a few days ago. Then hnns gave me this link which I thought was pretty informative.

You are absolutely correct that much of the focus is on the framing and the nature of the event rather than any of the content. People seem to want to say "aww, shit! now the cat is out of the box! americuuu's in trouble now, oh lawl!"

Actually reading some of the cables gave me more that feeling of insight typical of good literature rather than good news, analysis or facts in general.

Of course, in the end, the content isn't really - perhaps - the most important thing. The shifts in political gravity, the potentials inherent in this medium etc. may rip up other more far-reaching concerns for people in the know.

Concerns are already at an all time high. Public opinion in the US has been so badly deformed by the media that whenever a bit of truth shines through, it comes off as so bogus that it must be demonized.

Democracy knows no greater perversion than a corporately sponsored president/politician/judge etc. This is exactly what Private First Class Bradley Manning showed us by leaking the information to Wikileaks, and what happened? He is being demonized and everyone is saying he should be executed for "treason", instead of acknowledging that he has essentially sacrificed his life in order to bring forward the dark truth of reality.

This is what the people of the US are now living under, how else could the massive gap between the rich and the poor be explained? Those in power are corrupt, and the people are like children at the mercy of the pedophiles that own them and keep them believing they have it best.

I just hope we're only seeing the beginning with wikileaks and maybe someday justice will be served.

Do you find it strange the U.S. government has done nothing to condemn the illegal downloading of data from siprnet, yet has constantly done everything it can to limit the freedom of speech and press on the internet and elsewhere? The actions of wikileaks are deplorable, not the actions of the person who accessed siprnet? That's their public attitude, to which they have convinced private individuals and private industry to essentially function as government property.

Do you think they are deliberately attempting to blur the line between private and public, and if so, why?

I don't see much point in asking these types questions. The US government obviously has many high-profile interests to protect, least of all, the people to whom it supposedly serves. If any further proof of this is required, one would need to look no further than the instant and heartless condemnation of an army private whose only crime was revealing the truth.

Its not so surprising that a government carries out deeds in secrecy in order to appease its apparent sponsors, most of whom being corrupt foreign powers as shown by the cables to be China, Saudi Arabia etc.

However these facts, which until now have been labeled as "conspiracy theories", beg a much more pressing and urgent question that must be answered:
If the US government carries out secret operations under the influence of foreign powers in order to ensure "prosperity" - What power do the people really have?

Who really dictates policy and influences what the US government does?

As much as I support free-speech, free-press and the U.S. constitution, much of this wikileaks stuff is cult-like. In particular, the fixation on Julian Assange.

It is interesting seeing how people desperately want to change the order of things. I'm certainly in favor of correcting the power-balance. I mean, weed should be legal. Why isn't it? Because the aristocratic powers are all douchebags. To force your way of life on others, not because you're 'protecting' yourself, but because you're a douchebag, is completely fucked.

Well I think we should make Assange an honorary American. I'm in favor of anyone in favor of crushing tyrants. Any American who's taken time off from their busy, lobotomized life to actually read the Declaration of Independence is also in favor of crushing tyrants. The most core element of our foundation, what the union was built upon, was the extreme opposition to tyranny.

It is truly a tragic sight, to see so many tyrants now thriving on a crumbling foundation. At least the ideas of our forefathers are not lost, only lost to Americans.