Are students who pay tuition required to lift weights three times a week at 6 a.m.? Do students who pay tuition have to avoid certain classes that they want to take because they conflict with practice? Do students who pay tuition have to attend mandatory study halls even if their grades are good? And so on ...

Being on scholarship is having a job. Maybe it's well-paid, or maybe it's not, but it's far from "free."

And to beat my favorite dead horse, does "chaos" ensue when coaches leave or athletic directors leave or school administrators leave? They have no penalty for changing jobs, but students do. Cuonzo Martin left Cal's men's basketball program to go to Missouri, and stole two recruits from Washington and shook up Cal's recruiting class. That seems a lot more like "chaos" to me than Ali Patberg being immediately eligible at Illinois.

Finally, the Power 5 schools already have an enormous advantage, and allowing transfers to be eligible immediately would, I believe, help mid-majors because then athletes would be able to spend a year and have a much better idea of where they fit, and how important it is to them, or not, to play the game rather than sit on the bench for a Final Four team. Sitting out a year and paying your own way is a major, major deterrent to many athletes who otherwise might want to try out the WCC instead of watching from the bench in the Pac-12.

No, it's not "free" and not one person here has suggested it is. And one of the costs is that if you bail out and leave your teammates and coaches and fans in the lurch, you have to sit out a year.

Quid pro quo.

And yes, coaches bolting also causes chaos which is why they pay a penalty of hundreds of thousands to millions of dollars.

Maybe players should be able to pay a million dollar buyout to be able to play immediately. You want them treated like coaches, so there you go. That should satisfy you.

BTW, since you brought up Martin, he had to pay Tenn $1.3 million when he bolted for Cal. Then his Cal contract provided:

"If Martin himself leaves prior to April 14, 2017, he will pay $1.1 million to the University. If he leaves between April 15, 2017 and April 14, 2018, he pays the University $1 million. If he leaves between April 15, 2018 and April 14, 2019, he would owe the University $750,000."

Given his demonstrated unreliability after bolting twice, Missouri has put HUGE buyouts in his new contract. If he leaves before April 30, 2018, Martin would owe Missouri a lump sum of $10.5 million. It tapers down over time, but is still $5M in 2020, $3M in 2021.

Last edited by ArtBest23 on 04/11/17 11:01 am; edited 3 times in total

"Cuonzo Martin left Cal's men's basketball program to go to Missouri, and stole two recruits from Washington and shook up Cal's recruiting class."

"Stole"? Bitter, bitter! If they recommitted because they preferred to play for him, that's not stealing. Shaking up Cal's recruiting class? Well, yeah. Same reason. Recruits commit, at least in partiality, to a coach. The very same thing happens in WBB--all the time. Coach gets fired or leaves, some recruits (and some players) leave and go with him or her. It's a fact of life. Deal with it.

_________________Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom

Are students who pay tuition required to lift weights three times a week at 6 a.m.? Do students who pay tuition have to avoid certain classes that they want to take because they conflict with practice? Do students who pay tuition have to attend mandatory study halls even if their grades are good? And so on ...

Being on scholarship is having a job. Maybe it's well-paid, or maybe it's not, but it's far from "free."

And to beat my favorite dead horse, does "chaos" ensue when coaches leave or athletic directors leave or school administrators leave? They have no penalty for changing jobs, but students do. Cuonzo Martin left Cal's men's basketball program to go to Missouri, and stole two recruits from Washington and shook up Cal's recruiting class. That seems a lot more like "chaos" to me than Ali Patberg being immediately eligible at Illinois.

Finally, the Power 5 schools already have an enormous advantage, and allowing transfers to be eligible immediately would, I believe, help mid-majors because then athletes would be able to spend a year and have a much better idea of where they fit, and how important it is to them, or not, to play the game rather than sit on the bench for a Final Four team. Sitting out a year and paying your own way is a major, major deterrent to many athletes who otherwise might want to try out the WCC instead of watching from the bench in the Pac-12.

No, it's not "free" and not one person here has suggested it is. And one of the costs is that if you bail out and leave your teammates and coaches and fans in the lurch, you have to sit out a year.

Quid pro quo.

And yes, coaches bolting also causes chaos which is why they pay a penalty of hundreds of thousands to millions of dollars.

Maybe players should be able to pay a million dollar buyout to be able to play immediately. You want them treated like coaches, so there you go. That should satisfy you.

BTW, since you brought up Martin, he had to pay Tenn $1.3 million when he bolted for Cal. Then his Cal contract provided:

"If Martin himself leaves prior to April 14, 2017, he will pay $1.1 million to the University. If he leaves between April 15, 2017 and April 14, 2018, he pays the University $1 million. If he leaves between April 15, 2018 and April 14, 2019, he would owe the University $750,000."

Given his demonstrated unreliability after bolting twice, Missouri has put HUGE buyouts in his new contract. If he leaves before April 30, 2018, Martin would owe Missouri a lump sum of $10.5 million. It tapers down over time, but is still $5M in 2020, $3M in 2021.

The buyouts only apply if the coach leaves before the end of his/her contract. A player's "contract" is only one year at a time. If they choose to leave at the end of the year, why should they be penalized?

_________________A leader is one who knows the way, goes the way, and shows the way

Are students who pay tuition required to lift weights three times a week at 6 a.m.? Do students who pay tuition have to avoid certain classes that they want to take because they conflict with practice? Do students who pay tuition have to attend mandatory study halls even if their grades are good? And so on ...

Being on scholarship is having a job. Maybe it's well-paid, or maybe it's not, but it's far from "free."

And to beat my favorite dead horse, does "chaos" ensue when coaches leave or athletic directors leave or school administrators leave? They have no penalty for changing jobs, but students do. Cuonzo Martin left Cal's men's basketball program to go to Missouri, and stole two recruits from Washington and shook up Cal's recruiting class. That seems a lot more like "chaos" to me than Ali Patberg being immediately eligible at Illinois.

Finally, the Power 5 schools already have an enormous advantage, and allowing transfers to be eligible immediately would, I believe, help mid-majors because then athletes would be able to spend a year and have a much better idea of where they fit, and how important it is to them, or not, to play the game rather than sit on the bench for a Final Four team. Sitting out a year and paying your own way is a major, major deterrent to many athletes who otherwise might want to try out the WCC instead of watching from the bench in the Pac-12.

No, it's not "free" and not one person here has suggested it is. And one of the costs is that if you bail out and leave your teammates and coaches and fans in the lurch, you have to sit out a year.

Quid pro quo.

And yes, coaches bolting also causes chaos which is why they pay a penalty of hundreds of thousands to millions of dollars.

Maybe players should be able to pay a million dollar buyout to be able to play immediately. You want them treated like coaches, so there you go. That should satisfy you.

BTW, since you brought up Martin, he had to pay Tenn $1.3 million when he bolted for Cal. Then his Cal contract provided:

"If Martin himself leaves prior to April 14, 2017, he will pay $1.1 million to the University. If he leaves between April 15, 2017 and April 14, 2018, he pays the University $1 million. If he leaves between April 15, 2018 and April 14, 2019, he would owe the University $750,000."

Given his demonstrated unreliability after bolting twice, Missouri has put HUGE buyouts in his new contract. If he leaves before April 30, 2018, Martin would owe Missouri a lump sum of $10.5 million. It tapers down over time, but is still $5M in 2020, $3M in 2021.

The buyouts only apply if the coach leaves before the end of his/her contract. A player's "contract" is only one year at a time. If they choose to leave at the end of the year, why should they be penalized?

Actually, every major conference now provides four year scholarships. So if the school is committing to four years, doesn't seem unreasonable to get the same from the player.

Hey people---this thread is supposed to be keeping track of what the header says...attrition, transfer, and injury. I know I've been guilty myself of joining in the side discussion, but as the initiator of the thread, could I respectfully ask that we all take THAT discussion to a new thread please?

Thank you.

_________________Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom

I'm wondering where you got the information on Makenzie Ellis from Colorado. I haven't seen anything and the CU Buffs web page posted an article yesterday that included her competing in the national 3x3 tournament.

I'm wondering where you got the information on Makenzie Ellis from Colorado. I haven't seen anything and the CU Buffs web page posted an article yesterday that included her competing in the national 3x3 tournament.

BC might be on the hotseat next year, its a private school so no idea on the contract length but its a tough job made even tougher when your best player leaves.

Fasoula is sort of like Shepard to me, big bodied posts, not very athletic. Shepard can shoot the three while Fasoula is crafty with her post moves. I might prefer Fasoula if I was recruiting both but it could be close.

Anyone heard anything about Jessica Shepard visiting South Carolina ? I was at the South Carolina softball game Saturday and the women's basketball team was there in the stands for a while . Big white girl sitting next to Alexis Jennings looked a lot like Shepard . I did a little research and found that Shepard played on the U18 team coached by Dawn Staley back in 2014 . Aja Wilson was also on that team .

About leaving Notre Dame: “I talked a lot with my family and my coaches, and they wanted me to stay,” Patberg said. “But life’s too short, and I followed my heart. It’s going to be hard, but they all want me to do what’s best for me, and so do my teammates. I’m lucky that I have a lot of support.”

Any Florida team might find her attractive....including the University of Florida.

really a significant loss for Duke.

Not really...With the guards Duke will have she will be the 4th guard..Most likely she wouldn't see more playing time than this year..

Not true at all.

Primm played backup point, backup SG, and backup wing...and was put into the lineup when there was a need for a defensive stopper outside of Lambert.

Lambert is injured and will likely miss the year. Primm was far more productive than Faith Suggs. Haley Gorecki is coming off of nearly two years of injuries. Jayda Adams is a freshman. Only Mikayla Boykin would be ahead of her (outside of Lexie Brown and Rebecca Greenwell).

Boykin could have started with Brown/Greenwell (replacing Lambert) with Primm as the primary perimeter backup. Or Primm could have started (McCallie does like the Keturah Jackson defensive stoppers).

BC might be on the hotseat next year, its a private school so no idea on the contract length but its a tough job made even tougher when your best player leaves.

Fasoula is sort of like Shepard to me, big bodied posts, not very athletic. Shepard can shoot the three while Fasoula is crafty with her post moves. I might prefer Fasoula if I was recruiting both but it could be close.

Sometimes you have to wonder what goes on in a teenager's mind to make some of these choices: for months she had a list of UNC, Tennessee, Ohio State, and South Carolina. She eliminated UNC, but didn't change the other three.

So then she chooses out of them: Baylor. Four days after the #2 Post of her cycle - Kalani Brown - signed with Baylor. Both Brown and Mompremier (the #3 Post for 2014) play the same position, and are in the same class, so one of them would have to play a role of back-up to the other one. This last season, Brown started 26 of Baylor's 37 games, Mompremier started 10, and Lauren Cox started one game.

And Cox, who was the overall #1 for 2016 and the #1 Forward, can at least spend some minutes playing the 4. as she is a decent perimeter shooter, but Beatrice looks locked into the 5 spot for her career. Despite those 10 starts, she averaged under 15 minutes per game....

You could see this one possibly coming. Minutes decreased dramatically from freshmen season , always seemed to be in mulkey's doghouse . She obviously lost her confidence out on the floor . Dont know who's to blame for that though tbh ...Somebody needs to keep an eye on Dawn ijs

Oregon State's Breanna Brown, a RS junior, has graduated and has elected to continue her education and play her senior year at Georgia Tech. As a graduate transfer she will be eligible immediately, and as a 6'3 forward/center she'lol be welcome on MaChelle Joseph's team.

_________________Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom

Marist is losing two players from its 8-player squad of this past season. Jordyn Jossart, RS freshman combo guard, is leaving and will transfer to her hometown D-II University of Mary. Morgan Bartner, sophomore post who was generally the seventh player in the 8-player rotation, has not stated a destination as yet. Coach Brian Giorgios does not seem perturbed as he has 3 prospects coming in as well as two transfers who will be able to play, as well as a few others returning from injury.

_________________Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom

Montana State picks up two transfers from Seton Hall: Claire Lundberg, a 6'1 F from Andover, MN, and Martha Kuderer, a 5'11 F from Eden Prairie, MN. Both will have to sit out a year, after which Lundberg will have one year of eligibility remaining and Kuderer two. Lundberg will be pursuing a dual degree in engineering and physics.

_________________Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom

You could see this one possibly coming. Minutes decreased dramatically from freshmen season , always seemed to be in mulkey's doghouse . She obviously lost her confidence out on the floor . Dont know who's to blame for that though tbh ...Somebody needs to keep an eye on Dawn ijs

Actually she averaged the same amount minutes (around 14.5) as she missed six games this season playing only 32 games this year to 38 last year. She shot a better FG percentage, averaged more points than last year, averaged more rebounds, had more double doubles, averaged the same amount of blocks this year as last, but also was a turnover machine as her turnover to assists was horrid in both years. Maybe the issue is that her minutes did not go down but remained the same. Maybe she expected to see more playing time than last year. Who knows.

_________________Cave Canem!
We must listen to each other no matter how much it hurts. Bishop Desmond Tutu.