I'd love to see it downtown, but I get the Cultural District draw as well.

Property values are highest in downtown. Only if FWISD had its own land in downtown would it be feasible to build there; but I do not think that FWISD has property in downtown; although I could be mistaken. Otherwise, Farrington Field makes the most economic sense.

I've been around the dance (ballet) world since '83-ish. I've had 2 kids go through Heights' dance program in the last 8 years in addition to many years of outside private studio classes.

This is just my opinion. That seems like a lot of tax money for something can't really prepare kids for a self-supporting career. Other than a few NYC companies, how many dance companies are financially viable?

I better like the idea of existing schools beefing-up their extra-curricular arts programs.

Property values are highest in downtown. Only if FWISD had its own land in downtown would it be feasible to build there; but I do not think that FWISD has property in downtown; although I could be mistaken. Otherwise, Farrington Field makes the most economic sense.

Fort Worth over everyone!

The district does have some property downtown. The Young Women's Leadership Academy will be moving just north of the ITC soon.

The FWISD purchase of the old Nash Hardware Building on Jones only occurred in 2012, before that, the FWISD had long been out of downtown. The building is being renovated right now to house the Young Women's Leadership Academy. Other that that particular city block, I don't think the FWISD owns any other land in downtown.

(side note - does anybody else think the empty lot to the NW of University and Lancaster would make a great spot for the new FWISD Fine Arts academy?)

Russ, your comment is interesting because that block used to be owned by the FWISD. It had a historic elementary school on the corner of Lancaster and University, and the Administration Building on the west side of the site.

Just moving this discussion to what looks like the right thread. I've been curious about the two academies that FWISD is going to build per the recent bond package.

John, do you know if the FWISD still owns that particular block, or if one of the museums has plans for expansion there? This would make a great spot for FWISD to build a Booker T Washington style high school surrounded by great museums.

Actually it makes so much more sense for FWISD and taxpayers to use land that is already owned (Farrington Field), thus more of the resources can be expended on construction, equipment and personal property acquisitions.

Question: Is there ever a time when Farrington Field's parking reaches capacity?

I bet it comes close on Stock Show weekends, but I doubt it does for Farrington events.

Good point, however now with the large parking areas having been recently added to WRMC, FF will be even more underutilized most of the year. FWISD might consider building a parking garage and lease the space to valet companies and near westside customers. An arrangement like that could produce some additional revenue for the district.

You could make an argument for putting it next to TCU so you could have cooperative programs between the institutions... In fact, an expansion of Alice Carlson might work geographically really well. What's the anticipated enrollment?

Will TCU donate land for such a project or would FWISD be required to pay fair market value for land in the TCU area? These are some of the first questions the district would face.

Will TCU donate land for such a project or would FWISD be required to pay fair market value for land in the TCU area?

For the purposes of idle speculation, what if all three sites were the same price? We don't know the cost to the district of any of the land - so the question is what spot makes the most sense? I'd like to see the school next to the museums to allow the kids to go see the paintings more often without having to cross University.

For the purposes of idle speculation, what if all three sites were the same price? We don't know the cost to the district of any of the land - so the question is what spot makes the most sense? I'd like to see the school next to the museums to allow the kids to go see the paintings more often without having to cross University.

Yes, next to the museums is an admirable scenario, but there is not a need to speculate of what price to the district is the FF location: it is free. "No Land Cost = more money for construction, furnishings, equipment and human resources".

Land cost will be a part of the mix when planning for the project.

DISD converted, I should imagine, a facility that it already owned and which just happened to be near the Dallas Arts District. Fortunately for DISD, the perfect scenario.

For FWISD, what makes sense most is to have a facility that uses each of its dollars to its fullest and best use; land acquisition would not meet that criteria when FWISD already possesses land in the immediate area.

Whoa! Check this out. Noticed it on VLK architects when looking for pics of the Summit project.

The master plan was developed to consider the possibility of the re-use of underused property around a historic school district stadium. The street is designed to be a pedestrian friendly, urban street environment with trees, wide sidewalks and urban amenities. A portion of the property will be the possible site of a performing arts center for the local school district, as well as a new multipurpose center to replace an older, antiquated facility. The development plan includes two office buildings with structured parking. Restaurants and street level retail spaces surround the office buildings. A “boutique” hotel located at the corner provides a much needed lodging option.

Whoa! Check this out. Noticed it on VLK architects when looking for pics of the Summit project.

The master plan was developed to consider the possibility of the re-use of underused property around a historic school district stadium. The street is designed to be a pedestrian friendly, urban street environment with trees, wide sidewalks and urban amenities. A portion of the property will be the possible site of a performing arts center for the local school district, as well as a new multipurpose center to replace an older, antiquated facility. The development plan includes two office buildings with structured parking. Restaurants and street level retail spaces surround the office buildings. A “boutique” hotel located at the corner provides a much needed lodging option.

The only thing that would make this even better would be to refurbish the stadium.

(I would like for it to be reshaped liked AGC as a Soccer Specific Stadium, for MLS or at the very least NASL, but that's asking for to much right now. So just to be realistic, just renovate the seats and concessions.)

What I suggest might be a more inclusive route is one that begins at the Montgomery Plaza and turns south to and along Foch Street with parking for the area at a future FWISD multi-level garage constructed at Farrington Field. Turning west from Farrington Field and crossing University @ Crestline to Gendy; turns north on to Gendy and then turns east past WRMC; and finally turns north along Van Cliburn Way to W7th/Camp Bowie. The connector could then back track to Montgomery Plaza.

Nice. Is this wishful projection or serious stuff? And, if so, it will be quite an improvement over the old football field and parking lot.

IMO, this should be serious stuff (post#24). This property has remarkable potential as I had early envisioned about it back in April 2014.

Remember how DISD made a ton of money by selling its high school stadium along Stemmons Freeway for future development to Trammel Crow. Why not FWISD doing something similar with FF and making a ton of money for itself.

Looks like this is a hot topic at the school bond meetings. Some board members want to put the arts school at FF, others want to put it "somewhere else" and sell or lease the FF land to "make money"

Personally, I think the FWISD should put the arts school there at FF, or buy back the land they sold to Kimbell (at the same cost of course) and build in the cultural district. The FWISD will never make enough money wheeling and dealing in real estate to pay for this project. Just use the land you have, which just so happens to be the most appropriate location for the school. All this property speculation is pointless.

The article also mentions the STEM academy is going in Benbrook. What a waste. "smh" as the kids say. Would have been great downtown.

Why not FWISD doing something similar with FF and making a ton of money for itself.

Looks like this is a hot topic at the school bond meetings. Some board members want to put the arts school at FF, others want to put it "somewhere else" and sell or lease the FF land to "make money".....The FWISD will never make enough money wheeling and dealing in real estate to pay for this project.

I suspect that the "others" who want to sell or lease the FF land to make money and for whom I am with think they can partner with a developer as did the Frisco ISD with Jerry Jones/Dallas Cowboys. Why not?

"A Lancaster Avenue school would need a design to complement the museum and retail district. Also, depending how district lawyers interpret deed restrictions limiting land use to stadium parking, the school might have to be built around and maybe even above current surface lots."

This is the first I've heard of any deed restrictions on the property. Does anyone know any details?

I don't have any specific details on the deed restrictions. I have heard through the years that much of the land that K.M. Van Zandt gave to the City had deed restrictions. Farrington Field sits on that land. A few years ago, Historic Fort Worth placed Farrington Field on its Most Endangered List due to development pressures of the surrounding neighborhoods. I was told by a FWISD official that the property would not be sold because of the deed restrictions and that if they sold it, the property reverted back to the City of Fort Worth.

I suspect that the "others" who want to sell or lease the FF land to make money and for whom I am with think they can partner with a developer as did the Frisco ISD with Jerry Jones/Dallas Cowboys. Why not?

Sure, why not? why not sell Arlington Heights, Paschal, and Northside campuses while we're at it? I'm sure all that land would fetch a good price with today's real estate values. We can always find cheaper land further out.

I suspect that the "others" who want to sell or lease the FF land to make money and for whom I am with think they can partner with a developer as did the Frisco ISD with Jerry Jones/Dallas Cowboys. Why not?

Sure, why not? why not sell Arlington Heights, Paschal, and Northside campuses while we're at it? I'm sure all that land would fetch a good price with today's real estate values. We can always find cheaper land further out.

I believe the analogy being made is to compare "oranges to apples".

I refer you to post#22 & 24. I think it is should be on the top of Fort Worth's eventual professional soccer club as the site of a stadium. Yes, we can always find cheaper land elsewhere, however, this property has the potential to be a goldmine for the district and the proceeds can and will be felt at all other school properties.

Aside from any deed restrictions, FF is a unique piece of real estate in FWISD's portfolio.

When thinking about land or other assets owned by public entities - consider that it is always easier for that entity to sell assets for money that can be used in current budgets - and that money will be gone in the blink of an eye. One or two budget cycles will burn through any money the district could possibly raise from the sale of that property. Also consider that the public at large has no way of knowing about any connection there may or may not be between the board members making the decisions and the private interests ready to reap huge fortunes when the public entity divests itself of these assets. Meaning, there is a huge potential for the board to let things go a little cheaper than they should, if the guys on the other side of the table are "good guys". Not saying that would necessarily happen, and I'm sure most of the school board members are on the up and up, and looking out for the best interests of the district, etc, etc, but the potential is there and the public perception is there.

The need is there for more educational opportunities in the core neighborhoods, and this is a golden opportunity. I mean we've talked over and over again on this forum about the need to allow working class families to inhabit the actual city. Public schools are a key part of this. People who work for a living need there to be free, and good, public schools, where they live. These magnet schools should be as close to the center of town as possible, so kids from North, East, South, and West FW can all get there.

Selling other public school campuses is not apples to oranges. Land of the size to build a HS campus is literally irreplaceable. Once you sell it, it's subdivided and gone forever. I didn't realize until John pointed it out in this thread that KM Van Zandt left this land to FW, but I guess that should have been obvious. Anyway if you think about it, there's literally no other way the city would be able to come into possession of this land. Now it's up to the citizenry of today's FW to realize we've got a great opportunity, and take advantage of it.

To my eyes Farrington Field is a stadium or am I missing something? Arlington Heights High School, I am pretty sure, is a school campus, right?

I believe the Farrington Field parking lot is the piece of land we are discussing. I consider it a prime location for a future school campus.

That's not apples and oranges - it's more like Red Delicious and Granny Smith. Both are large chunks of land owned by the FWISD.

Which by the way has just gotten a large school bond approved by voters who were told (okay it was "hinted") that the STEM campus would be in the Downtown area, and the Arts campus would be in the Cultural District.

They need to spend that money building schools - they don't need to raise further capital by selling properties. That's not part of what voters approved.

If I knew the STEM campus would be located in Benbrook I would have voted against the bond. This should be located as centrally as possible in FW.

School officials appear open to reconsidering the location of the STEM and possibly combining it with the visual and performing arts academy, depending on what a re-assessment of construction cost estimates looks like when it comes back from the outside firm responsible for managing the program.

One of the possibilities under study is putting both schools in the historic I.M. Terrell Elementary School just east of downtown

I feel like this is one of those jokes where you wish for something and it turns out all horribly wrong... Yes that's centrally located all right. Good luck getting any parents to send their kids there.

I feel like this is one of those jokes where you wish for something and it turns out all horribly wrong... Yes that's centrally located all right. Good luck getting any parents to send their kids there.

So this sounds like its getting closer to being a go for I.M. Yea. Gonna have to Agree with you there Russ, I don't see this being popular... Is there a less desirable area to build such a thing?

One of the beliefs that I hold about Texas Wesleyan holds true for me here also: when faced with the choice to relocate to Far West Fort Worth, the TWU believed that it was important to stay and be the catalyst for a part of the city that is in need.

Is there a more deserving area in need of having the benefits of the arts and sciences with the potential to have a positive change for a vulnerable population?

Part of me agrees that this location is less than ideal, while another part of me believes that attendance at these academies is deliberate and for a specific purpose. As such, location is not important. I have a feeling that something in the district's study of where to locate this academy has told them that and that's why locations like Benbrook and I.M. Terrell have been discussed and/or settled upon.

The existing elementary school is "underused". The population in that little freeway-encircled area does not have enough children to support an elementary school. The total population is about 600, according to city-data.com. It is not the case that the area is undesirable because there are not enough amenties there - it is undesirable because it is encircled by freeways, railroads, and access ramps. The only way to approach the area on foot is along Lancaster.

So lets think about this. There may be one or two families in that area that choose to send their kids to these specialized academies. That means there needs to be about 598 kids from outside of that neighborhood whose families decide they are going to focus on arts, or science. Just where are these kids going to come from? Speaking for myself, if I've got a choice to send my kid to Arlington Heights, or a STEM academy in literally the worst location within the city limits of Fort Worth, I'm going to stick with Heights and let the kid watch Khan Academy videos after school, thanks very much.

So if Andy Taft thinks this is somehow making Downtown a more desirable place to live, he's not thinking clearly. First of all, no matter where I live, I'm not sending my kid there. Secondly, living in downtown would not make a bit of difference to my decision, since it's not walkable from any residential area in downtown. I'm just as unlikely to send my kid there living downtown, as I would be anywhere else. The upshot of which is that FWISD and DTFW are about to pour millions of dollars into a project that literally nobody will take advantage of.

Each of the two proposed academies were supposed to be grades 6-12, and house 600 students each. Now it has been whittled down to only grades 9-12, and enrollment of 300 students each. At a certain point it's not what the voters approved anymore, and it should just be canceled.

I read Bob Ray Sanders editorial in favor of the IM Terrel location, and it made me curious. He seemed to think it was a wonderful place to be. So I looked it up on Historic Aerials.com (I love that site). You can see somewhere between about 1957 and 1963, that site goes from being part of about a quarter of downtown FW, to being completely whittled down by I-35, I-35W, and 287, to the little plot of land where it sits now. Then the high school was closed down in 1973 when the school system was integrated. Interesting history for sure. But terrible geography.

Whatever else can be said about I.M. Terrell, it is *not* a part of downtown (or the Southside, or even really the Lancaster urban village). It's on an island strangled by freeways (along with Butler Place), because of the grand American urban planning tradition of "well, getting cars in and out of downtown is more important than making the central city livable, so RAM THEM FREEWAYS THROUGH THE POOR PEOPLE and who cares about the consequences."

It's not connected to anything, and it's not a part of anything. Nobody who wants the attractions of downtown/urban living (such as, you know, being able to walk to things) is going to count an IMT STEM academy as a benefit.