Thousands rally at U.S. Capitol against gay marriage

San Francisco’s Archbishop Salvatore Cordileone addressed the crowd at the 2014 March for Marriage rally on June 19 in Washington, D.C. He attended the event despite protests from more than 80 organizations who objected to his presence. RNS photo by Heather Adams

WASHINGTON (RNS) Faced with a string of losses in the court and a rapid shift in public opinion in favor of gay marriage, planners of Thursday's traditional marriage rally aimed to show lawmakers -- and especially courts -- that they will not give up without a fight.

I’m surprised you use the term “several thousand” when the official estimate is “less than 2 thousand”. Very dismal turnout.

John

Sad I thought one of Gods commands was not to bear false witness on your neighbor…lying is lying.. they’re were not thousands as you try to infuse in your story. The turnout was extremely low. I was hoping if there was one paper that would lie it would be you! What a disappointment and you once again have reminded me NO ONE will speak the truth when it isn’t in there favor to do so.. a lie is a lie.

Even The Washington Times, which was a sponsor of the march, has the headline: “Hundreds march in defense of traditional marriage”. One would think a religion-based news site would have reported the story honestly. Is that too much to ask or is dishonesty typical of people of faith these days in relation to marriage?

Neon Genesis

Is the author of this article going to actually respond to these objections or will they just leave the article as it stands in the face of the facts?

Jim

It was a flop, don’t try and spin it any other way

candide

looks like heather is just another liar for jesus.

rally attendance was about 1000 which means it’s being inflated to about 2000.

not several thousands.

the real journalistic story is what a colossal failure it was after having been pumped and promoted for months.

if it hadn’t been for diaz busing in the low ses blacks and hispanics from nyc with the promise of a sight seeing tour their would only have been a few hundred.

heather needs to find a new career.

The Great God Pan

“None of these groups (organizing the rally) are extreme or radical or anything like that… If there were such an individual or organization that was really truly hateful, I wouldn’t be here.”
–Salvatore Francisco, Archbishop of San Francisco

“We don’t hate people because of their race, I mean, we’re a Christian organization. …That’s a complete falsehood.”
–Frank Ancona, Imperial Wizard of the Traditionalist American Knights of the Ku Klux Klan

Atheist Max

“I killed my son in the bloodiest way I knew how
and if you don’t believe me I’ll do worse things to you.
You are nobody to say it is wrong.” – Yahweh.

JudasKnows

Lol……this just shows how desperate the biblethumpers have become……

Neon Genesis

The real journalist story is why do news sites like RNS treat SPLC-certified hate groups like NOM as a genuine Christian group that’s just standing up for the “biblical” definition of marriage and doesn’t provide any sort of context for NOM’s history of radical extremism.

This rally was about one third the attendance of last year’s. At this rate, there will be 200 – 300 attending next year’s. The rhetoric of the speakers can’t hold back the speed of history in just the past 24 hours. The Federal government has given more rights to gays that live in states that don’t have gay marriage. The Presbyterian Church has voted to allow gay marriage ceremonies. Almost everyday, something is in the news about the forward progress of gay marriage.

Tired Christian

One man, one woman. And that will be the attendance at next years rally.

Guys… the focus should not be on the numbers of how many did come and how many didn’t come. The focus should be on the fact that there were more than 100 people, and not one major news team covered it. That should be the focus. the silence was deafening.

Jimmy Chonga

I really gotta laugh, side-splitting, tilt-over and bawl laugh, when gays site “history” as justification for support. If I look at history, ALL I see is gays on the WRONG SIDE. It’s rather amusing how God, in His Mercy, is tolerating the muses of the evil one these days. When the hammer falls, O! and it will! The end of this non-sense will be precious and WIDELY APPRECIATED.

News like this isn’t made very public. I read about it on internet but nothing elsewhere.
Why can’t people see that the family is the building block of civilization. Life is generated through one man and one woman. God made it that way since the beginning of time. Who are we,, mere human beings, to change God’s plan of marriage and life?

Suenomi

Wow, the haters are out in force today. Keep it up, please. Seriously, especially Jimmy and your kind advice that those of us who oppose you should just go “shoot ourselves”?

Remarks like that will one day come back to shoot you in your own foot. You’re gonna get back all that you give, sweetie.

Pitbull friend

There were no official estimates unless the associated press lied. Why if the press attended didn’t they have better coverage? Oh yeah the news coverage of Americans protesting the status quo is not covered in print or visual like the doublespeak of “1984”

Pitbull friend

Exactly.

Pitbull friend

There was no official estimate it could have been a million for all the publicity given in the past to people in support of natural marriage between a man and a woman.

Pitbull friend

That number was taken from the associated press and they don’t lie, right?

Pitbull friend

Funny you choose the KKK. You know they have killed ‘papists’ you may color yourself in homosexual tolerance but in reality you are just wearing a dirty white sheet.

As Christians, we are called to love and pray for those who do not espouse our Gospel ideals, yet love with the truth which is often twisted or perceived as ‘hate.’ There is the fallacy of universal attribution which says, If everybody is doing it, it must be OK. History has shown this to us many times. Numbers will not matter in the end. The natural law will ultimately win out and be vindicated in the end, whether supporters of the redefinition of marriage believe that or not.

Pitbull friend

As an atheist you worship you’re own lack of biblical knowledge? Get rid of the quotes or everyone will know you are crazy.

Heather Adams

Hello,

I am the author of this article and I was at the event yesterday. Unfortunately, the police no longer provide estimates for events in DC. There is no official estimate of how many people attended. I could only use my best judgement. I thought there appeared to be 2,000-3,000 people. But because I was unsure we decided to go with “several thousand.”

Pitbull friend

There is no history there is just that sad desire for legal legitimacy to make the feelings of loneliness go away. It is not natural to commit homosexual acts it never has been that is history. It is natural to want to belong which clearly the homosexual community wants.

Pitbull friend

Explain the radical extremism of NOM.

Pitbull friend

Research the source for numbers the AP.

Doc Anthony

“Dismal”? Not at all. If only three kids and their pet kittycat had shown up, it still would have been a beautiful and worthwhile event.

At this time, America needs ANYTHING that can buy this corrupt gay-mess nation a little more time before a well-earned Divine Judgment falls upon it.

So kudos to all who attended this important rally.

Pitbull friend

So bigotry is your color of the rainbow, I thought so.

Will Byrd

EXACTLY what I thought as I saw this!! 2K is not several thousand. Can these people do ANYTHING with honesty??

Pitbull friend

The media is owned by three families or groups Gannet being one. These have refused to cover rallies, protests, even crimes against churches, the desecration of Catholic graves, murders and assaults of people trying to practice their faith. Yes these crimes happen in America. The same media controlled behavior was seen in Russia’s Stalin, Germany’s Hitler and in Bush and Obama’s United States.

Neon Genesis

Why did you go with the highest estimate possible if you couldn’t find an exact number? Even the NOM-friendly conservative news site, The Washington Times, reported that only hundreds showed up at the rally.

Chutney

What’s a little lie when you’re doing the lards work? Fuel for the fire, maybe?

Pitbull friend

No need to explain Heather these people complaining just want to be supported in their sin choices. The Associated Press said 2K and no official estimate.

Neon Genesis

I also find it concerning that this article doesn’t refute the archbishop’s false claim that none of the groups at the rally were radical hate groups and doesn’t even mention the involvement of the SPLC-classified hate group, the National Organization for Marriage.

Neon Genesis

Sounds like you’re only here to complain to justify your sin of bigotry and hate.

Chutney

Why not guess high to make your article look good, right? What’s one more lie in the face of all of the violence and lies that the gay community have had to endure at the hands of christians?

carmen

Numbers really don’t matter, would be nice but the important thing was that someone was there to represent the truth…..where one or two are gathered there I’m also.

Nellie

The Walk for Life West Coast started out with a few thousand.

Anybody care to check the number on the last Walk?

Give it time. People slowly, but surely, come to know truth…either in this life or in the next! Nobody, not even homosexuals, fool God!

C Mark

No one rallied against “gay marriage”. They rallied FOR marriage. “Gay marriage” is a false social construct invented by those who want to play house in an effort to mask their sins. It doesn’t exist. You can call it whatever you want but it’s not marriage. A cat can have kittens in the oven but that won’t make ’em biscuits.

Doc Anthony

Gay Marriage IS Radical Extremism.

Osama Bin Laden tried to kill America from the outside. He was a terrorist, 100 percent. But he failed.

The Gay Activists are trying to kill America from the inside. They are terrorists, 100 percent.

But unlike Bin Laden, they are succeeding.

Doc Anthony

…And also the forward progress of catastrophic Divine Judgment, which is about to fall on a corrupt gay-mess Ameirca.

C Mark

The SPLC??? Oh, please. They are nothing more than a mouthpiece for the “progressive” fascist Left. Funny how their hate group list doesn’t include any radical Leftist groups.

JudasKnows

Biblethumpers love to spout scripture in regards to marriage, if we were to believe in what the bible says, adam and eve did not know they were even naked till she ate of the serpent, so God must not have wanted humans to even know what their ‘private parts ‘ looked like …..so if eve could not see adams Dingy without satans help how did god expect them to procreate??? Lol.

Laurie

Mandy Roach, there is another side to the argument,,.it is called science or biology, We observe and we reason and we look honestly at outcomes for going against natural law, not hiding its destructiveness and pretending it is not there,

B.F.

Homosexuality is a sin; there is no ambiguity to that (ref. Lev 18:22 & Lev 20:13). This is an objective truth in the light of the will of God. Those who are guilty and unrepentant will not have an inheritance in the Kingdom of God (1COR 6:9-10). However, the term “several” can be subjective as to what that means in terms of a number. I’ve heard arguments as a kid to the meaning of “several” and “a few” and to what number those terms represent. Did the writer “willfully intend to deceive” (the definition of “lie”) readers; I doubt it based on the context of the story. But in your subjective opinion if a ballpark estimate constitutes lying then I guess we’re all guilty of lying; on probably more than one occasion. But make no mistake about it, those numbers will grow to more than just “several thousands” in years to come; just like the March for Life has grow with every passing year.

JudasKnows

Jesus hung around with 12 guys drinking wine,im betting some touchy feely went on amongst the grouo before he married a prostitute

Doc Anthony

You did just fine Heather, and your explanation is spot-on (at least to anybody who has ever taken a class in journalism).

Permit me to offer free large paper bags (suitable for putting over one’s head in shame) to all of the slimy worm posters who kept trying to attack Heather on the issue of the population count.

…Liberals like to rely, unanimously, not on sound arguments, but on citing numbers…or alleged lack there-of, to show others supporting their side. Men and men, women and women can live and do whatever they want together. But don’t ask the state to recognize it as on par with marriage between a male and female. If the definition of marriage is arbitrary, then why not open it up to 60 year olds marrying 12 year olds? People decided marriage was between men and women and, if that can be changed, the definition of adulthood can be changed, as it was also decided by people. Why not multiple spouses? Who are we to say no? I could care less if someone’s gay. But don’t tell me I have to ackowledge acting out immoral desires as normal.

ciao

Mainstream media NEVER reports the accurate numbers in the pro-life movement in D.C. every year which border on a million. If you are impressed by numbers, go to non-mainstream media for accurate numbers and events that are always ignored or played down.
It’s not the numbers, it’s the message.

ciao

Numbers tell us a little, the message tells us everything.

ciao

JohnD, there’s no need for name calling—that’s what people do who have no real answers.

JudasKnows

Why is it that so called Christains twist scripture to meet their needs when they decicde to pass judgement on others….i know many people that dont go to church or follow any particular religion but lead their lives in a more “morals and values way of life than most christans claim to do…..’

Neon Genesis

“Progressive fascism” is an oxymoron as fascism by its nature is a conservative ideology and this shows you have no clue what your’e talking about.

Joshua

That is the most flawed logic of all. Osama was avowed and open and self-aware of his intent. Gay and human rights activists — whether you like it or not — are marching for AMERICAN values (and btw AMERICAN values ARE NOT Christian values) like Freedom, Justice, Equality. If you and the other co-religionists of hate don’t like America — go somewhere else and found a Christian Theocracy where ‘perverts’ get stoned to death. Huh. That sounds a lot like some sandy, hot places I can think of…

Neon Genesis

Mike Huckabee said God would punish America if we legalized gay marriage so your argument that no one rallied against gay marriage at the march is baseless and nonsense.

Rachel

It doesn’t matter what ya’ll March for. My generation has decide this is a non issue and we will teach the younger generation the same. It is OK to marry the one you love no matter what color or gender. The point is to find someone that will love till the end. By the way I’m 19.

Gail

Don’t like heaven – get hell….your choice – a lifetime to choose but after that it is final.

Joshua

Fr. I don’t think its natural to be celibate, now is it? Oh, how are the boys doing? Was it natural for the bishops and Vatican to protect and promote the rape of thousands of children?

Fandango

Just because gays call it “marriage” does not mean it really is marriage. For instance, you can call a refrigerator a chair if you want to. That doesn’t make the refrigerator a chair. To me, marriage in the truest sense of the word is between a man and a woman. Promoting gay marriage promotes the gay lifestyle, something I don’t care for. However, if two people of the same sex want to sleep together and they are consenting adults, fine, I just don’t want the “In Your Face” type of thing that many gays seem to promote constantly. But actual legal gay marriage? No, I am not at all for it.

Larry

Hey Mark, if there are sound arguments against marriage equality (ie rational and secular ones), the rest of the nation would be eager to hear it. But that isn’t going to happen. As it stands now, whatever arguments being employed haven’t amounted to much in the 20 court cases so far on the issue.

We keep reading the same words over and over again to the effect of, “The marriage ban does not bear any relationship to the interest of supporting families or procreation” and “the objections raised do not overcome the right to equal protection under the law”.

The fact that you have to resort to bad analogy tells me all I need to know about the soundness of the arguments employed, or really the lack thereof. The definition of marriage is not arbitrary. It is determined based on whether there are secular and rational reasons NOT to allow a union. There are plenty of those for the examples you chose, none for marriage equality.

Fandango

Your generation is not the ONLY generation, dear. Many other generations have a say, so before you think that being 19 gives you the right to say what goes and what everyone else will HAVE to accept, get down off your high horse and realize you are but one person in one generation. There are many others. You don’t rule simply because you are 19. When you get much older, hopefully you will come to understand that in fact, you don’t know everything. At 19, you only think you do. That will change. I hope.

Rachel

The Presbyterians call It marriage.

Larry

Then they would have said “hundreds of thousands”. Reporting on general estimate of people on the DC Mall has become practically a fine art form.

Of course those people were not “supporting the natural marriage between a man and a woman”, the laws never affected them. They were supporting the idea of feeling superior to gays under the color of law. A celebration of prejudice.

C Mark

Hogwash. Conservatism has nothing to do with fascism. “Progressivism”, Marxism, Fascism, Communism. Four sides of the same collectivist coin. The only difference are your fashion choices.

Gail

Maybe the Muslims will take you out – they are known for being very firm in their beliefs.

Larry

So we are in agreement that none of you have a secular or rational reason for opposing marriage equality. Its all “its a sin”, “you are going to hell”, “I hate gays”.

The great thing about religious objections are, they have no bearing on the laws whatsoever, NOBODY HAS TO CARE. The rally is all for the notion that our government is beholden to your version of God. A spit on the face of our notions of religious freedom.

Rachel

Haven’t you been paying attention to the statistics or popular opinion in general. The younger you are the more likely you are to approve gay marriage. As we get older and vote and we do vote, this will become the norm. And your ideas will die with you.

C Mark

The PCUSA has been steadily losing congregations and members for decades. This move will only hasten their demise. You can’t turn your back on God, then expect your sins to be forgiven.

JudasKnows

When gay marriage is finally allowed in ALL STATES,the president of NOM and the FRC can offiacally come out of the closet….everyone knows Tony Perkins (FAMILY RESEARCH COUNCIL). Is a closet Queen…..isnt it always the ones that protest to much that Grab their ankles behing closed Motel doors…..lol

Frank

Keep up the good fight. Many, many more people support you they just live in fear of the gay activists. Ask them anonymously and they will tell you marriage in man plus woman. Can’t change the truth of God, ever.

C Mark

“… they just live in fear of the gay activists.”

Lately we learned they’re fascists, not activists.

Chris Kirby

To all of you condemning the march for marriage event:
What is more important – Getting your opininon across or obeying the will of our Father, which is the only meaning of life?

Leo

Did you all see the pictures of the “thousands”. It looked like a few hundred people. Obviously, Christians are realizing that same-sex marriage doesn’t effect their marriages at all.

Rachel

The churches are graying and they are not bring in young members to replace the ones that are dying. This old way of thinking is going extinct and ya’ll have failed in passing it down to your children. That crowd of thousand looked pretty grey to me.

Rachel

Sorry for the typos it’s hard to type with the kids jumping on me.

Chris Kirby

It doesn’t affect their marriage directly, no. But they know it is wrong. Archbisop Cordlione said it perfectly: being pro-marriage does not mean you are Anti anything else (paraphrase).

Neon Genesis

That you would openly cheer on the destruction of a church because you disagree with them on this reveals your hypocrisy and true motivations.

B.F.

Hey Larry, there is only one argument that trumps all other arguments to justify traditional marriage between one man and one woman. Because that’s how God created it. He created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve. Never does God mention or elude to anything else other than one man and one woman. However, in the godless society that we seem to live in these days, of course they (judges, etc) are going to take the godless approach.

God has made it absolutely clear that those commit serious sin, including ANY sexual sin, without repentance will not enter God’s Kingdom. Yeah, yeah, you’re going to say “well that’s your God”. Be assured that there is ONLY one God. And He has made His law clear on all, including human sexuality, not to appease Him but rather for our own sakes; which it seems many here on the comment section do not understand.

But just as certain that one would splatter to a painful death should they step off of the top of the White Cliffs of Dover, an unrepentant sinner will not enjoy eternal life if they knowingly and willfully choose to defy God.

Neon Genesis

Please stop talking about politics as if you know what you’re talking about because you clearly don’t.

Neon Genesis

I wonder if Heather Adams will condemn the rampant homophobia in the comments section of her article or is she unsure about that too?

Larry

” Conservatism has nothing to do with fascism.”

Except for their appeals to reactionary religious groups, being beholden to corporate interests over public concerns, regular appeals to bigotry as a rallying tool, constant efforts to undermine democratic processes, and an antagonistic relationship to civil liberties.

In their defense, they lack the central leadership seen in fascism, lately have been antagonistic to the interests of the military , nor engage in organized paramilitary thuggery.

Larry

Which is why they keep losing court cases. Its nothing but spouting scripture and nothing like understanding concepts of law. Especially equal protection and civil liberties.

Larry

Its recognized under the law. That is the only definition which matters.

Nobody is asking what you think marriage is supposed to mean. The point is what the laws say here. Essentially you are arguing that your distaste of gays requires color of law. Yet the problem is none of you guys can come up with a reason to do so that has to be taken seriously.

Ronnie

Nice try Mike. Thousands of courageous pro-family supporters who are opposed to the redefinition of marriage. Courterfeit disordered unions will fall on their own. Christ will be the Victor….

Larry

Which means B.F., you have NOTHING.

This is why I said RATIONAL and SECULAR arguments. You know, ones which have to be taken seriously by a court and the laws of a democratic and free society.

The great thing about religious freedom is I never have to give a flying crap what you or anyone else thinks God wants or God says. Our laws never have to reflect your religious views. I never have to be compelled to care what you think God says by our laws.

What you have made absolutely clear is that you have no respect for anything which does not follow your religious view. You do not understand what religious freedom means. You chafe at the idea.

Ronnie

No, they were trying to protest the ‘redefintion’ of natural marriage which will further destroy the institution of marriage, the family and society. Prejudice is more prevalent on the anti-God, anti-Christian side by the way.

Ronnie

So you’re okay with deliberately killing innoncent children in the womb? You’re ok with children raised in these disordered erroneous counterfeit unions having violence done to their development? You’re ok with objectifying women? Finally you’re ok with people getting hurt as long as it doesn’t affect you?

Ronnie

Calling evil good and good evil are you? Gays, whether it is intentional or not, are destroying the natural definition of marriage and society. But no need to worry, God will have the final say…..

The Great God Pan

Not much of a rejoinder, is it?

I realize that there isn’t much to be said when your movement is reduced to lifting its PR strategies straight from the Ku Klux Klan, but sometimes it’s better to just remain silent.

Ronnie

Freedom, Justice, Equality?…..Loss of freedom, justice and equlity is more like it if you continue on the path of denying or justifying your sins…

Ronnie

I’m still laughing at your absurdity. Again calling good evil and evil good. Satan would be proud….

Lorayne

Note that the quibbling is in full swing; let’s consider a FACT. Sodomy is the “joining” of two anatomical parts of the body that are contrary and abnormal to their purposes !) release of waste, 2)creation of new life. Avoid/ignore these facts, as you will, but you can’t refute them! If you have neither a penis, an anus nor a vagina you are; alas, incomplete as one gender or another. Let’s call you “an other”? Usurping the definition of marriage to dis-include these facts is Common Core logic…unsustainable. No revision of this fact changes its cultural, spiritual and/or universal meaning. It is sad that some of us do not have the ability to function within these norms..Indeed, you have my compassion. BUT, form your OWN Collective facts and behaviors and leave my family alone, especially my children!!

Ronnie

It doesn’t matter…Christ will have the final say…And guess what?…Gravely depraved descriptions of this disorder by His Church leads me to believe that it won’t be pleasant for those advocating these sins, unless of course, they repent…

Julian

numbers of people, popularity, age of participants mean nothing in the fight for right or wrong. if only ten old people were fighting against slavery and everyone else was for it, does that mean that slavery should be allowed? Does something being old make it untrue? Truth apparently does not matter to many, they are more concerned with emotional factors and personal desires. I am young (mid-twenties), but I don’t base my opinion on what my demographic thinks, but rather use my mind and think for myself what is the truth here. logic and reason, not emotion and desires. And to be honest, there are plenty of young people on both sides, but maybe not the unthinking herd brainwashed by the media, politics, and the indoctrinating education system.

“tradition is the democracy of the dead” – Chesterton

Rachel

Christians are having unmarried sex at the same rate as the atheist and cohabiting at the same rate. So who are you to decide who can get married and who shouldn’t when you can’t even follow your own dogma?

Rachel

Do you mean your own dead or dying tradition? I didn’t see too many 20 year olds that rally.

C Mark

And the “progressive” isn’t even aware of his fascist tendencies. Bwahahaha! Yeah, we won’t shut up.

C Mark

If there were any “rampant homophobia”.

Gail

One form of deception is a good as another, perhaps? A case of the pot calling the kettle black.

C Mark

What are you blathering on about? I don’t cheer the destruction of any church. I simply point out that as the people of the PCUSA abandon God’s Word the church has weakened. That’s a very sad state of affairs and I pray every night that all people (myself included) do penance, sin no more, and avoid that which leads them to sin. Changing God’s immutable definitions of what is a sin is not the same as not sinning.

C Mark

There aren’t too many 20 year olds at ANY rally.

JudasKnows

Church membership is on the decline, and no wonder when all one sees of organized religion is the likes of right wing gunhuggers grabbing their bibles and spewing their political bible quotes and warning people of the END TIMES….its the religious doomsday rightwingers trying to hang on to the last piece of hate they can spew from the pulpit to fan the flames of the evangelicals ….people dont fall for the church and religious leaders of Eternity in Hell baloney anymore….for if it were true,hell would be full of the same church members that judge others daily……God made Gays, God made breeders…..everyone should be allowed to marry no matter what biblebeaters interpert as Gods Law……lol

C Mark

“reactionary religious groups”

Right. Because refusing to accept “progressive” changes to teachings we’ve followed for 2000 years is “reactionary”.

Larry

The only prejudice here is your own. You fail to note the difference between your religious beliefs and our civil society, which has no innate compulsion to share them. You are simply trying to move the goalposts and engaging in euphemisms to cover up true intentions.

The definition of marriage is determined by civil law. That is the real issue here. What you think God has to say on the subject was always immaterial. Our laws are not bound by your religious beliefs. They require rational and secular purpose.

This was a rally to protest changes in Civil law, not what is going on in various churches. It is a protest borne entirely on prejudicial motives given social sanction by selective religious tests. You admit that your motivation is entirely religious in nature and lacks a rational basis.

Larry

YEP! I am also OK with the idea that one’s personal private decisions are not subject to the approval by finger-pointed self-righteous narcissists with a delusion of authority.

Ronnie, nobody granted you the authority to decide what others are supposed to do in the privacy of their homes. You are welcomed to your opinion, but there is no compelling reason it requires color of law.

Larry

You are not disagreeing with what I said. Just a little miffed by the characterization of it.

Larry

When you lobby to deny civil liberties to others for no apparent rational or secular motive, it is inherently hateful.

When you say that you support legalized discrimination under the “guise of love of truth” and “fighting sin”. Its a load of self-delusional crap. You are merely using excuses to justify harmful behavior towards others and seeking social sanction for it.

Angels rape human women! (I suppose they were asking for it…)
“The sons of God came in unto the daughters of men.”
“There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.” Genesis 6:2-4

Nearby, a 12-year-old girl named Jordan unfurled a rolled-up poster, revealing a phrase she had heard over and over that day and seen on hundreds of other signs: “Every child deserves a mom and a dad.”

Rolling her eyes, she said her grandfather had brought her to the march.

“It’s stupid,” Jordan said, looking around at the crowd. “If two people feel a certain way about each other, then why shouldn’t they get married? They shouldn’t judge other people because of how they feel.

Thank you Heather for a well written article, I for one do not think your estimate of “several thousand” people attending the rally was an overestimation, we cannot expect her to stand outside with a counter for an exact total and unless you were there and did a count how can you question an educated estimation that by no means exaggerates the size of the event.

Further, I think this piece was written by an unbiased observer and it is quite interesting (though neither good nor bad subject matter). I will be looking for more of her pieces in the future!

realoldguy

I have many redneck friends. I love rednecks just like I love all people, as my church teaches. But it’s that redneck agenda that I just can’t stomach. Just thinking about it makes me want to hurl!

C Mark

Argumentum ad populum. You’re also assuming that today’s young people will maintain their “progressive” voting habits as they age. A lot of folks my age were politically more liberal when we were 21. Then we grew up.

TheOccasionalAtheist

So you’re ok with misogyny, murder and treating women as less worthy than a man? Cuz your bible is.
So you’re ok with god killing 42 children for calling a bald man bald. You’re ok that the same god wiped out all of “creation” (don’t tell the Chinese or anyone anywhere else in the world) but he’s really a good god and besides, you don’t want to go to hell.

Can you explain these bible verses in the context of a “loving god”?

An uncircumcised boy should be abandoned by his parents. Genesis 17:14
“I will not destroy it for ten’s sake.”
God does not give a goddamn about children. Genesis 18:32

Your god is hateful and pathetic, just like most of it’s followers.

KC

Larry, where does your secular reasoning come from? Historically, where do the principles of our civil rights come from? Do you know? Your thoughts/ideas are based on what philosopher, writer, speaker, religious figure? Do you know? Name them and tell me why you subscribe to their ideas. Then we can have an honest discussion.

stevekarper

Bottom line – congress shall make no law respecting any establishment of religion (first line of amendment 1.

You can keep your home, your church etc from doing marriage ceremonies for gays, but you have zero right to use your religion to interfere in civil law marriage, be it for gays aethists, or people who simply dont want to have a religious ceremony

Any wonder your losing? Any wonder only a couple thousand showed up for the expected million,

And Diaz from NYC told people his busses were only going to DC to tour various historic places and monuments – another monumental lie

stevekarper

WE didnt redefine marriage – we expandded it to additional minnority groups of two loving couples

And the natural thing reminds me of how conservatives said that allowing inter-racial marriage was both unnatural and an affront to the santity of the white race. (1967 when scotus trashed the last 16 of once 41 states with bans on “interacial un-natural marriage)

stevekarper

The emessage was simple – only right wing god botherers give a damn about and want to stick their nose into other peoples bedrooms re marriage

Meanwhile str8s destroy the instittution of marriage with a 53% national divorce rate and weell over 30% of american kids growing up in single parent families . Why arrent you conservatives screaming about that mess

IMO because its the 10th anniversary of MA having marriage equality, the state has the lowest divorce rate in the nation – about 36%……..

While the biblbe thumper people in the south (the confederacy) have in most of those states the worst divorce rates in america.

stevekarper

Who are you to define sin? Maybe animus against gays is a sin, just as for most of your kind, it was the same kind of animus against other minority groups eg Blacks, Jews, Asians etc – all generally in the name of their bibbbbbble

stevekarper

tehn I’m proud to be a sinner , responsible for passing marriage equality in MD and IL

YOur sin is hating minorities and using God to justify it. Same old Poo

stevekarper

Here is what else came from religion

the hatred of the Jews that led ultimately to the holocaust
the christian crusades that killed millions of Muslims, no wonder some of them hate us – societies have long memories
the thousand year dark ages when the catholic church ruled Europe and there was only a LORD and serf society that didnt end ultil after the HOLY INQUISItion
Slavery justfied by the bible, then segregation and the KKK

Certainly from someone who opposes birth control and prob proves his manhood by creating more children then he can afford to educcate etc. Creating more people who will only listen to the religious extremists instead of learning to think for themselves

stevekarper

Tath makes about as much sense as the nut job republican who called Obama worse then hitler

So says the high priest of San francisco who was caught driving drunk with a young man and used the churches influence to cover up the rape of kiddies in his previous diocese, Oakland. Celibacy has been a total disaster for the church as well as unnatural

Larry, the issue is what marriage IS…a permanent union between a man and a woman ordered toward the procreation of children that are raised by their natural mother and father. This has been the definition for millennia and is the best arrangement for human flourishing. This isn’t, however, an argument against marriage equality, it’s just an argument that what you are advocating isn’t marriage.

stevekarper

Nattuaql law in case you didnt know it justified bans on inter-racial marriage. That is where that BS comes from.

thanks for spouting racial hatred also

stevekarper

Good for you and 80% of the youth in the country including those up to age 30

Bet its 90% of college students except in the bible schools where there always is a minority enemy to hearden the heart, corrupt the soul, and gain control of minds

Notce how few sport the BS about moral values – were making progress in teaching the world that in the context of treating minorities equally, morals and values are code words for religious hatred

stevekarper

And got your minds poisoned in ultra conservative churches

stevekarper

do you know the difference between when you dream and are awake? IMO altsheimers is setting in.

stevekarper

Your entitield to your MYTH eology. Your not entitled to force it on others

stevekarper

I’m pro marriage for all minorities consenting adults over the age of 18

Tell the archB to do something about the endless hidden molestation of children thanks to their dumb poop celibacy policy

Instead of this BS distraction.

catholic church has lost about 30 million people over the last 25-30 years

stevekarper

The supreme court said its ok., trashed the last BS sodomy ssome years ago

Soddom and gemorraa is about the rape of strangers in the desert. Even the arch conservative Koran says ” if your enemy comes to you in the desert you will give him salt

S&G was the inspriation for the Geneva convention on protecting prisoners of war

Stuff the S&G hate where the sun doesnt shine.

stevekarper

tradition is the democracy of the dead” brained poisoned from early youth about equal rights for minorities

time for me to put on my “some dudes marry dudes, get over it and go out to the bar with my gay friends

Virtually all who have known someone who committted suicide due to these haters.

stevekarper

you can be sure that many of the leaders of the anti gays are kluxer-redncks

Just always need someone to hate to make their poisoned by right wing religion minds feel better..

Ralph reed is for all practical cases a kluxer as he tries to demonize our first black president

heres another one of those Aholes – he went to iceland to spout his hatred of gays and got laughed out of the place, escorted to the airport and put on a plane

Franklin Graham. cheers for marriage equality in Iceland 49 to zero where a evangelical [expletive deleted] said gays deserve death

He also got sent on a plane – to moscow with continuing service to the gulag

stevekarper

boo hoo

stevekarper

including the independence from that racist pat roberson and his church – the church of the confederacy in america

stevekarper

Everything about the hatred of the lastest minority to demand and deserve equal rights under marriageLAW

not your natural law which justified bans on inter-racial marriage in the past

C Mark

The SPLC is Morris Dees and he needs money. He ran out of Kluxers to sue a long time ago (there weren’t that many chuckleheads anyway) so he’s going after anyone who dares to disagree with his Leftist politics.

C Mark

Another lie perpetrated by “progressives” and their media stooges. The woman who did the investigation says its a lie. Keep spreading your desperate filth.

“I had no other way to save humans. So I shot my son with the first century version of an AK-47. That precious sinless blood had to be spilled.
So now I can save you humans if you want…you can come and spend eternity with me…

Hey…
where are you going…?” – Yahweh

Exhausted Evangelist

If God wants to intercede, let him (not that I have any say in it).
Next year see if He shows up by himself.

He is always a no show. I’m getting tired of that.

Exhausted Evangelist

I’m done waiting for God to speak up at these rallies.

I don’t think he exists.
I’m tired of god – he is an awful leader.

Exhausted Evangelist

What fight are you talking about? God quit this racket years ago.
Funny how religion is fading and he doesn’t care at all.
Kind of makes you wonder if the whole thing is nonsense.

I’m turning Atheist.

Exhausted Evangelist

Maybe God is giving us a sign.
A SIGN HE DOESN’T EXIST.

Exhausted Evangelist

GOD LEFT THE BUILDING
AS SOON AS HE CREATED THE FIRST SCIENTIST.

Jon Newlife

If you are cowardly trying to set the slippery slope idea into the minds of readers, without saying it, let me hold your hand, doing it for you…
Just remember, the fine citizens of the United States aren’t that afraid of slippery slopes, otherwise we would not have legalized freedom of religion. Talk about a slippery slope.. Jim Jones, David Koresh anyone?

Tony

I believe that homosexuals as persons, should be treated with the same respect and dignity as any other person, regardless of their sexuality. However, a HOMOSEXUAL UNION is NOT marriage! It is a HOMOSEXUAL UNION! Lying something into existence is no different than insisting upon calling myself a bird, because I am able to fly (not by my own means, but by use of an exterior source; a plane). No matter how loudly I claim it, I am not a bird, and will never be a bird! An integral part of marriage is procreation, of which homosexuals CANNOT comply with by their own means. Simply call it what it is; a homosexual union (which I am not opposed to), but do not take away from traditional marriage that which is only relevant to a man and woman. This entire issue of equal rights to marriage has become insane! Truth cannot be changed, no matter how much one wishes for it.

bento

The L-O-V-E argument is a very, very flimsy one. The sexually involved father-daughter couples in Australia and Germany are consenting adults who are in love with one another, but that alone doesn’t justify their sexual relationship. Love is not reason enough.

tanya

The headlines shouldn’t be “Thousands rally at U.S. Capitol against gay marriage”, but “FOR MARRIAGE.”. Marriage isn’t a “gay” thing.

tanya

I don’t think anyone can judge a persons feelings, which are subject to change over time and even during the course of a day. But you can judge actions, they are objective , and they can cause some sympathies one way or another.

I am a proponent of traditional marriage: one man, one woman, ONE time. My first target, though, is not gay marriage. My first target of sexual depravity is a certain Trinitarian-incarnational-atoning-resurrecting-ascending-soon-to-be-returning-God who sacrificed Himself to Himself. This God inseminated another man’s wife with himself in a grotesque act of supernatural incest wherein the Father and Son are one which means that Jesus inseminated his own mother with his holy-salsa-holy-spirit-semen. Inseminating another man’s wife or fiancee is NOT a traditional marriage stance. In fact, it is sleazy behavior on the part of the Christian God. Support traditional marriage by blaspheming against the Holy Spirit. Glory!

Ronnie

You know Larry, I don’t give a damn what you do in the privacy of your own home even though I pray for people caught up in this confusion. Why not leave it in the bedroom and please leave children out of it!
But it’s not those of us who have moral objections to these unnatural sexual preferences who are bringing it out of the bedroom and forcing us to violate our relgiious liberty and forcing us to expose our children to this. My children know that no matter what your sin is, always love that person but never, never embrace or love the sin. Stop forcing others to accept what our faith tells us is wrong.

Ronnie

Oh Larry….Who is using euphemisms? Marriage equality? What exactly is marriage equality? Do three people have marriage equality? And if it succeeds when the age of consent is lowered, do men and boys, or for that matter sisters and brothers have marriage equality. If not why not? Why are we discriminating against those arrangements? If two of the same sex can marry, other arrangements must also have the right to marry. Arguments will not suffice to change this reality. Redefining the natural definition of marriage which God intended will damage not only the natural family but society…But I have hope and faith that Christ will have the final say.

Ronnie

Hey Steve…Natural law never prohibited inter-racial marriage because race is innate however sexual preferences are not.

Ronnie

Joshua…Jesus was celibate so I think it is very natural. As for the teenage boys and young men that the few (one is too many I agree) homosexual priests abused (2% of all Priests), you should see the public schools where it is 100% worse. As for the so-called cover-up, most Priests were sent away for treatment but unfortunately were assured that they were cured by the secular doctors. The few that were moved around were mostly from liberal dioceses with one of the bishop actually was gay himself!….. Personal attacks confim you lost the argument.

Ronnie

Thank you Heather for confiming this. Those who opposed this rally are trying to discredit anyone involved and the numbers. Thanks for the info….

Ronnie

bishopaccountablity.org…Is this the same group which has been discredited?

Liz

Bryan, you said that marriage is “a permanent union between a man and a woman ordered toward the procreation of children that are raised by their natural mother and father.” By your definition of marriage, any older heterosexual couples who are already done with procreating/raising children in their previous marriage and now just wanting to watch beautiful sunset together should not be allowed to marry, right? How about young heterosexual couples who decide not to procreate and raise children because they like the child-free lifestyle? Should they not be allowed to marry by law? What about any opposite-sex couples who are unable to procreate? Should they be legally denied to marry? Your “definition” of marriage is irrelevant because it is out of touch with the reality of modern “purpose” of marriage.

Ronnie

Obama caused alot more deaths than noted, especially because he’s considered the most pro-abortion, pro-baby killing, President we’ve ever had.
But of course, God loves gay people. He doesn’t love their sin though. But what diffenece does it make if all these countries embrace unnatural counterfeit unions? Most countries listed the natuual marriage between a man and a woman is dying. And Europe is dying from population decline.. The other countries are in bad shape economically. The whole world is falling apart and we redefine marriage! That is making it much worse..Children deserve and need both a father and a mother more than ever….Hope and faith will save us….

Liz

Ronnie, Jesus was celibate? I am not saying he wasn’t, but how would you know that? The Gospels have no record on the life of Jesus from age 12 to 30. Do you know something other biblical scholars missed? Your assumption/claim what Jesus was or was not is baseless since you know nothing about the18 missing years of his life. Don’t make claims you can’t support.

Samuel Chapman, Jr.

Oh BF, have you not read the Bible: “Never does God mention or elude to anything else other than one man and one woman.
“Genesis 4:19
And Lamech took unto him two wives.
Genesis 16:1-4
Now Sarai Abram’s wife bare him no children: and she had an handmaid, an Egyptian, whose name was Hagar. And Sarai said unto Abram, Behold now, the LORD hath restrained me from bearing: I pray thee, go in unto my maid; it may be that I may obtain children by her. And Abram hearkened to the voice of Sarai. And Sarai … gave her to her husband Abram to be his wife. And he went in unto Hagar, and she conceived.
Genesis 25:6
But unto the sons of the concubines, which Abraham had….
Genesis 26:34
Esau … took to wife Judith the daughter of Beeri the Hittite, and Bashemath the daughter of Elon the Hittite.
Genesis 31:17
Then Jacob rose up, and set … his wives upon camels.
Exodus 21:10
If he take him another wife….
Deuteronomy 21:15
If a man have two wives, one beloved, and another hated….
Judges 8:30
And Gideon had threescore and ten sons of his body begotten: for he had many wives.
1 Samuel 1:1-2
Elkanah … had two wives; the name of the one was Hannah, and the name of the other Peninnah.
2 Samuel 12:7-8
Thus saith the LORD God of Israel … I gave thee … thy master’s wives….
1 Kings 11:2-3
Solomon … had seven hundred wives … and three hundred concubines.
1 Chronicles 4:5
And Ashur the father of Tekoa had two wives, Helah and Naarah.
2 Chronicles 11:21
Rehoboam … took eighteen wives, and threescore concubines.
2 Chronicles 13:21
But Abijah waxed mighty, and married fourteen wives….
2 Chronicles 24:3
Jehoiada took for him two wives….
Mt.25:1
Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.

How many spouses do you have, BF?

Puss

Someone had to look at that face first thing in morning and last thing at night for 43 years ? God help him. If people could be ‘cured’ – she’d be the ‘cure’ for straight men.

Looks very sexually frustrated too. Why not just get herself a good vibrator and she’d not need to concern herself with other people’s sex lives.

SCD

Ummm……. You might want to consider this small fact…. God did not write the Bible. Men who lived long ago did. We do not even know the identities of some of them. Why would we take their word that they were speaking for God? …. And, your argument is downhill from there.

Rick

Well, what do you know? The Washington Post changed their headline overnight (June 20-21). Now it reads “Thousands march in defense of traditional marriage”. The images of the event do not lie and more people did not materialize after the event ended. They are proving the lack of integrity they are known for.

Don

Apparently, you believe in the bible and you’re entitled to your beliefs. But like so many bible thumpers, you are self-righteous and intolerant of those with different beliefs–not what this great country was founded on. In case you’ve forgotten, life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

That’s according to your religion, but I can name you 35 Christian religions that accept Homosexuality as a God-given trait, and welcome LGBT with open arms, hearts and minds as parishioners with full sacraments, including communion, ordination to the clergy and same sex marriage.

As for “God’s Word” if anyone follows the Holy Bible as the literal Word of God, they may well go to your “Heaven” but they will also spend the rest of their life in prison. Below are God’s irrefragable commandments:

Women inferior to men:
CORINTHIANS 14:34 Women should be silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak, but should be submissive, as the law also says.
TIMOTHY 2:12 “But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence”

Killing commanded for these offences:
DEUTERONOMY 13:13-17 A town that allows the practice of more than one religion must be burned to the ground and its citizens slaughtered.
DEUTERONOMY 21:18-21 “If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey the voice of his father or the voice of his mother… then all the men of the city shall stone him to death with stones.”
DEUTERONOMY 22:13-21 A woman not a virgin on her wedding night must be executed.
DEUTERONOMY 22:22 If a married person has sex with someone else’s husband or wife, both adulterers be stoned to death.
DEUTERONOMY 22:28-29 A virgin who is raped must marry her rapist.
DEUTERONOMY 25:11-12 If a man gets into a fight with another man and his wife seeks to rescue her husband by grabbing the enemy’s genitals, her hand shall be cut off and no pity shall be shown her.
LEVITICUS 18:19 A married couple who have sexual intercourse during a woman’s period shall both be executed.
LEVITICUS 20:9 “Anyone who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death.”
NUMBERS 15:32,35 Anyone who picks up sticks on the Sabbath must be killed.

Marriage:
• No marriage will be sanctioned between people who have been divorced. (Matthew 5:32)
• No marriage shall be sanctioned between Christians & non-Christians. (2 John 1:9-11, 2 Corinthians 6:14-17)
• No marriage shall be sanctioned in which the wedding ceremony shall occur during the women’s menstrual cycle (Leviticus 18:19, 20:18, & Ezekiel 18:5-6)
• No marriage shall be sanctioned of people of different races. (Deuteronomy 7:3, Numbers 25:6-8, 36:6-8, 1 Kings 11:2)
• A married couple who have sexual intercourse during a woman’s period shall both be executed. (Leviticus 18:19)
• No marriage shall be sanctioned involving a widow (unless it is to her brother-in-law). All women whose husbands have passwed away shall refrain from intimacy & pleasure for the remainder of their lives. (1 Timothy 5:5-15)
• No marriage shall be sanctioned for any man who has had sexual thoughts of any woman other than his intended (Matthew 5:28)
• A woman not a virgin on her wedding night must be executed. (Deuteronomy 22:13-21)
• If a married person has sex with someone else’s husband or wife, both adulterers be stoned to death. (Deuteronomy 22:22)
• A virgin who is raped must marry her rapist. Deuteronomy 22:28-29)
• If a man dies childless, his widow is ordered to have intercourse with each of his brothers in turn until she bears her deceased husband a male heir. (Mark 12:18-2)

God hates disabled people:
LEVITICUS 21:17-21 “Speak to Aaron, saying, ‘No man of your offspring throughout their generations who has a defect shall approach to offer the food of his God. | ‘For no one who has a defect shall approach: a blind man, or a
lame man, or he who has a disfigured face, or any deformed limb, | or a man who has a broken foot or broken hand, | or a unchback or a dwarf, or one who has a defect in his eye or eczema or scabs or crushed testicles. | ‘No man among the descendants of Aaron the priest who has a defect is to come near to offer the LORD’S offerings by fire; since he has a defect, he shall not come near to offer the food of his God.”

God approves of slavery:
COLOSSIANS 3:22 “Slaves, obey your human masters in everything; don’t work only while being watched, in order to please men, but work wholeheartedly, fearing the Lord.”
PETER 2:18 “Slaves, in reverent fear of God submit yourselves to your masters, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh.”
EPHESIANS 6:5 “Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.” —

Left handedness is an abomination to God:
Genesis 48:13-19 (King James Version)
13 And Joseph took them both, Ephraim in his right hand toward Israel’s left hand, and Manasseh in his left hand toward Israel’s right hand, and brought them near to him.
14 And Israel stretched out his right hand, and laid it upon Ephraim’s head, who was the younger, and his left hand upon Manasseh’s head, guiding his hands wittingly; for Manasseh was the firstborn.
15 And he blessed Joseph, and said, God, before whom my fathers Abraham and Isaac did walk, the God which fed me all my life long unto this day,
16 The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth.
17 When Joseph saw his father placing his right hand on Ephraim’s head he was displeased; so he took hold of his father’s hand to move it from Ephraim’s head to Manasseh’s head.
18 And Joseph said unto his father, Not so, my father: for this is the firstborn; put thy right hand upon his head.
19 And his father refused, and said, I know it, my son, I know it: he also shall become a people, and he also shall be great: but truly his younger brother shall be greater than he, and his seed shall become a multitude of nations.

Matthew 6:3 (King James Version)
But when you do alms, let not your left hand know what your right hand does:

Matthew 25:33-34…41 (King James Version):
33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
…
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left
hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Ecclesastes 10:2 (King James Version)
A wise man’s heart is at his right hand; but a fool’s heart at his left.

Psalm 118:15-16 (King James Version)
15 Shouts of joy and victory resound in the tents of the righteous: “The Lord’s right hand has done mighty things!
16 The Lord’s right hand is lifted high; the Lord’s right hand has done mighty things!”

Psalm 16:11 (King James Version) Thou wilt shew me the path of life: in thy presence is fulness of joy; at thy right hand there are pleasures for evermore
Psalm 110:1 (King James Version) A Psalm of David. The Lord says to my Lord: “Sit at my right hand, until I make your enemies your footstool.”

Killing naughty children commanded by God:
DEUTERONOMY 21:18-21 “If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey the voice of his father or the voice of his mother… then all the men of the city shall stone him to death with stones.”
LEVITICUS 20:9 “Anyone who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death.”

Sex for procreation is merely an animal function. Sex for love is a uniquely human function, and knows no bounds of gender.

It isn’t right to force gay people to marry straight people we’re neither romantically nor sexually interested in, and a heterosexual woman certainly won’t thank you for forcing her to marry a gay man who doesn’t love her.

Do an older couple past child bearing age have no right to marriage, since they cannot conceive a child? Do a couple that cannot have children of their own through infertility not have the right to marry?

Adopted children raised by either same or opposite sex couples are better off in loving homes, and it doesn’t matter whether they are male or female. Google is your friend – the evidence is overwhelming.

More than 25 years of research have documented that there is no relationship between parents’ sexual orientation and any measure of a child’s emotional, psychosocial, and behavioral adjustment.

We can turn to a host of experts and research findings on the topic including:

American Academy of Pediatrics
American Psychiatric Association
American Psychological Association
National Association of Social Workers

Starting with the American Academy of Pediatrics, which said the following about same-sex parenting:

“There is ample evidence to show that children raised by same-gender parents fare as well as those raised by heterosexual parents. More than 25 years of research have documented that there is no relationship between parents’ sexual orientation and any measure of a child’s emotional, psychosocial, and behavioral adjustment. These data have demonstrated no risk to children as a result of growing up in a family with 1 or more gay parents. Conscientious and nurturing adults, whether they are men or women, heterosexual or homosexual, can be excellent parents. The rights, benefits, and protections of civil marriage can further strengthen these families.”

Here is a sample list of US based organisations that are known to support LGBT families: The United Nations, The American Medical Association, American Psychological Association, American Anthropological Association, World Health Organisation, American Academy of Pediatrics, Child Welfare League of America, National Association of Social Workers, North American Council on Adoptable Children, American Psychoanalytic Association, American Academy of Family Physicians, American Association for Marriage and Family Therapy, Council on Child and Adolescent Health, American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry, Mental Health America, California Psychological Association, American Counselling Association, American Sociological Association, American School Health Association, National Association of School Psychologists, not to mention countless universities, local governments, labor unions, and virtually every human rights organisation that exists.

Ronnie

Derek…I’m exhausted from reading your reinterpretation of the Bible. That’s why our Church always wanted someone who knew what they were talking about, who studied the scriptures to interpret them for us as Catholics….Where to begin….
The Bible is the inspired word of God. The Old Testament readings and their laws were based on the cultural or traditional laws of that time. Jesus in fulfilling the law did away with those laws but upheld the moral law. I notice very few quotes were from the New Testament, but even those Jesus reaffirmed and said that divorce was prohibited…unless, as with annulments, that marriage never really was a valid marriage to begin with. As for the absurdity of “God approving of slavery” let’s not get ridiculous. No rebuttal there. You can pick and choose any scripture reading and believe and justify anything you like. That’s exactly why you need someone who studied scripture and who interprets it light of the Holy Spirit and in my case as a Catholic as the Magisterium confirms it.

Ronnie

He was the Son of God, wasn’t He? Based on sacred scripture which was inspired by God Himself and by His Church.
For those who believe no explaination is necessary, for those who don’t no explaination is possible….

Ronnie

Again Derek….Just because some new unnatural sexual preferences or inclinations are condoned by major organizations which I might add, have discredited themselves long before this, does not make that behavior moral or good.
And studies have confimed over and over again that children do best when raised by a mother and father. Imagine what the studies will confim later on when these children raised in disordered unioins come forward. I hate to think of the implications for society.

Ronnie

Your rebuttal says it all. No need to respond. Although 80% rejecting me sounds like I’m in good company. Also other times in history I’m sure the 20% were on the losing side.

Ronnie

Hate to break this to you, Stevekarper, but that story was confimed as a ‘hoax’…..

Jasom

U do realize that in the south untill recently u could get married at 14 to someone 60. It was us that decided to change it. It was the sheriff in waco that said was why he couldnt get involved when child protection services were called to the branch davidians.

Daniel Berry, NYC

As far as I can tell, God created both me and my partner. But neither of us are named Adam, Eve or Steve. Does that mean we don’t really love each other or something?

Daniel Berry, NYC

Actually, Mr O’Neil, the definitely of adulthood DOES very from place to place and from age tho age. I’d think of a different argument.

AS to relying on “numbers,” it isn’t we who are trying to put human rights up to a vote: that seems to be the province of conservatives.

Larry

No, that is the issue between you and your church.

It is not how our laws look at marriage. Procreation is not considered the sole or even a defining purpose behind marriage. It is a series of legal defaults, rights and privileges associated with creating a family. Biological procreation is not a necessary element. Your response also ignores the glaring fact that gay couples HAVE children.

The only person “redefining marriage” is yourself. You are reducing it to the most crass, and insulting manner possible. You demean ALL marriages without biological children, all ones with adopted children, all marriages with step-children

In addition, none of that is a compelling argument to ban marriage equality. As noted by every judge who has seen such cases, there is no relationship between banning marriage equality and procreation/creation of families other than creating arbitrary, discriminatory stumbling blocks to existing ones.

You are trying to say that same sex marriage isn’t a “real marriage”. But as I noted before, you don’t think many legally recognized marriages are either. But such thinking requires not being a hypocrite looking for an excuse for legalized bigotry.

Larry

@Ronnie,

The people relying on euphemisms are the ones who complain about “redefining marriage” and “protecting marriage” when in reality it is about attacking the civil liberties of others. Trying to have the laws reflect their own (allegedly religious based) bigotry.

Its telling you have to divert the discussion to polygamy, pederasty and incest. You are too dishonest or stupid to realize we ban such things because we have rational and secular purposes behind such bans. You can’t say that for same sex marriage. Which is why you use analogy.

Faith and Christ have no say in our laws. Keep it in your church, stop trying to attack the religious liberties of others.

Larry

Secular reasoning does not come from religion. The idea of ideas supported by evidence and logic are as far from religion as humanly possible. Faith is the absence of evidence and reason. Faith is the foundation of religious belief and the complete opposite of objective observation and analysis.

Our laws are not beholden to any given religion. That is what religious freedom requires. You may express your faith, but our laws cannot be compelled to follow it. You can never have a legitimate legal argument in our country which relies of what you think God says or wants.

Larry

Bullcrap! You want to control what people do in private. You want our laws to force people to act according to what you think God wants.

As for children, you want to deny parents the ability to raise them in a sane manner for entirely discriminatory and bigoted reasons.

Your moral and religious objections don’t give you the ability to override the rights and liberties of others. Your religious liberty does not entitle you to harm others. It does not entitle you to be protected from things your religious views despise by the laws.

Nobody has to do squat because your religion tells you so (other than let you pray in a civil manner). You don’t like to be in the presence of gay people or to acknowledge they exist, you figure out a way to keep away from them. Our laws don’t have to pay attention to that.

Larry

And yet your response is “progressives are worse”.

So you are denying the appeals to bigotry, attempts to subvert the democratic process with gerrymandering and modern day poll taxes, and frequent attacks on civil liberties.

What about those was incorrect? Obviously not much given your response.

Larry

carmelitaspats666, that was an awesome response!

Ronnie

Larry…Personal attacks lead me to believe I’m getting close to the truth. No one is denying you your civil liberties. You are free to marry someone of the opposite sex. The issue of bigotry is debatable. I think it’s biology.

…” we ban such things because we have rational and secular purposes behind such bans. You can’t say that for same sex marriage”
Of yes we can. Same-sex counterfeit unions are not the natural union of a man and a woman, and not unlike three people marrying, or sisters or brothers. They all have the sam thing in common: redefining marriage to include other relationships which are other than a man and a woman.

“Faith and Christ have no say in our laws. Keep it in your church, stop trying to attack the religious liberties of others.”
Relgious intolerance? And wasn’t our laws bases on the Natural Law?

Larry

“The L-O-V-E argument is a very, very flimsy one.”

It was always the kind of bullcrap argument people throw around when they want to use bad analogy and avoid the topic on its own facts. It was always a strawman used by the anti-marriage equality crowd but was always lacking in relevant facts.

The real argument is whether there is not whether a marriage is ALLOWED because 2 people love each other. Its whether there is a reason to BAN a union where 2 people love each other. Marriage rights are permissive absent cause. The reasons for doing so have to be rational and secular.

This knocks out all of the stupid “slippery slope” examples people use. Incest, polygamy, buggery, pederasty all have rational and secular reasons to be banned. There are none for same sex marriage.

Larry

So C Mark, is it better to get your robes and pointy hood dry cleaned or can you just put them in the wash?

Larry

“He was the Son of God, wasn’t He?”

You may think so, but I don’t have to. Nor can you demonstrate it to be so.

The thing about faith is, you can’t prove it.

Larry

Actually it wasn’t. Nobody denied the bodies were buried on convent grounds without graves. They just denied the sceptic tank part.

Neither C Mark nor Ronnie red that “revision”.

Larry

What is personal about impugning the intelligence and veracity of your posts?

Your bigotry is well demonstrated in your posts. You are not denying it, merely giving offense to the characterization.

You are entitled to your opinion, but if you want our laws to take it into consideration, you have to cough up something besides your own distaste for gay people and Bible quotes. Something rational and secular. You obviously do not have that.

“Same-sex counterfeit unions are not the natural union of a man and a woman, and not unlike three people marrying, or sisters or brothers. ”

There is nothing rational about that remark. Probably nothing secular either. 🙂

“Relgious intolerance? And wasn’t our laws bases on the Natural Law?”

No. “Natural law” is a bullcrap designation for whatever a theologian wants to declare as true without commentary or analysis. It always meant whatever one wanted it to mean. Religious intolerance is forcing people to abide by the dictates of your faith to their own detriment. Being told you can’t treat others like crap is not religious intolerance. Its just being civil.

steve Karper

Mark your slippery slope arguments arent going anywhere

Just as your types of arguments about protecting the sancitty of the white race didnt go anywhere re eliminated bans on inter-racial marriage

IF anything you should be glad that gays want to support the institution that us str8s are wrecking with our 53% divorce rate, as well as havng 30+% of american children growing up without two parents.

Pls respect the love and commitment of people who happen to be different.

Larry

Natural law is whatever the judge wants it to be. It was pj It was used to deny interracial marriage in 1960.

The judge used this exact quote:
Acts 17:26 (KJV): “And [God] hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation.”

Anyone relying on “natural law” is telling us that they have nothing rational or reasonable to back up their opinion.

Ronnie

Bigotry works both ways…My view is that Larry you’re so blinded by your justifcation for the sin of engaging in same-sex behavior that you’re incapable of opening yourself up to the possibility that there is hope and healing from this. So I’ll close with wishing you the best (I’d say a prayer for you too if you don’t mind). I hope someday you find the truth you’re looking for.

Ronnie

Actually Larry it was definitely a ‘hoax’! If you weren’t so blinded by your hate for Christ’s Church you might be able to open your heart to the love Christ has for you and stop persecuting His Church.

Larry

Ronnie, I am not the one trying to attack civil liberties of others. You are. I am not the one with the disgusting idea of forcing our democratic government and rule of law to follow the sectarian dictates of a given faith. That is also all you.

Natural law was the justification for conservatives screeching about the ending of the last 16 states bans on inter-racila marriage in 1967

its history is racist.

Whoa re those most opposed to equal rights under civil law for gay people – the states of the old confederacy

billywingartenson

There are many examples of how the4 support for marriage equality is growing and about 55% of hte people support it. For eg the younger crowd, who know gay people and properly respect them, its more then 75 to 80%

Your entitled to your fantasies.

Soon america will catch up with eg Europe where in 2010 Icelands parlaiment voted 49 to 0 for marriage equality

in Feb, scotland voted 105 to 18 – almost 6 to 1 for marriage equality

Why is the USA so far behind? We didnt solve the problem of religious hatred that justified slavery, made America the second to last nation** in the western world to end slavery, and then it took us another hundred years to end segregation

Conservative religion – a house of cards that always needs a minority group to demonize to keep the people from realizing what is really happening in the name of God

hell will be filled with these right wing xtians.

sam

the laws of the christian religion mean nothing to worshipers of Isis or other gods like myself. So stop trying to force your religion down our throats. there is a separation of church and state for a reason to protect people from your gods tyranny.

Barbara

Mike, you are absolutely correct. I’d like to now how many of these supposed thousands were illegally in this country,

This is before Jesus saved us of our sins. It is Jesus grace that saves us from Gods wrath and it is Jesus grace that saves this country from the wrath of God now that everyone is in favor of homosexuality just like the citiesSodom and Gamora.

bob

Why not take away tax shelters for churches? If the government cannot make laws for the church to follow then they surely shouldn’t be taking help from them. It would be hypocritical and morally corrupt.