A tip is actually a service fee. That is normally about 10-15% of your bill. A bonus or extra would be 15-20% of the bill.

That makes no sense. If I give you 5-10% more it is a tip. If I give you 5-10% less it is a service fee? You can't have it both ways either it is a tip or it is a service fee. The actual amount matters little. You the server, or delivery person, don't get to set what I pay you. It isn't a fee I am paying you unless you are the one setting a specific amount.

If that were true then the entire amount would go to the staff. The staff doesn't even get half of it. When you order delivery, and there is a "delivery fee", your subsidizing carry out customer's orders.

So the customer is to blame because your boss isn't using a delivery fee for what it should be? The customer is the one that enables you to have a delivery job in the first place. If no one asked for delivery you wouldn't have a job. It is the responsibility of your boss to pay you and if they don't then it is them at fault. It is an extra and bonus of your job that you can also get tipped.

"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

A lot of times 45 minutes or w/e is their standard time they give to all customers when its not busy. But yeah he should enjoy the back of the line.

So if you put me at the back of the line, why do you then deserve a tip when you show up at my door? You treated me poorly and less then you treated everyone else, why do you get a tip? All I keep seeing from supporters of mandatory required tipping is selfishness. Because no one wants to put any responsibility on the server or the delivery person and always blame the customer no matter what. And even state how they purposefully treat them poorly next time yet still demand tips.

Perhaps thats why you don't get a tip? Because you treated them poorly, or you spread the word to your friends about them and they then treated them poorly. If you want tips you can't act like a cry baby and rage when you don't get a tip. Because it only shows how you really didn't deserve one in the first place.

"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

That makes no sense. If I give you 5-10% more it is a tip. If I give you 5-10% less it is a service fee? You can't have it both ways either it is a tip or it is a service fee.

The first 10-15% is the service fee, that's your base amount for the service. The extra 5-10% is the tip.

Originally Posted by rhorle

The actual amount matters little. You the server, or delivery person, don't get to set what I pay you. It isn't a fee I am paying you unless you are the one setting a specific amount.

That's fine. There will be people with higher priority than you and if you're ok with that then there isn't an issue.

Originally Posted by rhorle

So the customer is to blame because your boss isn't using a delivery fee for what it should be? The customer is the one that enables you to have a delivery job in the first place. If no one asked for delivery you wouldn't have a job. It is the responsibility of your boss to pay you and if they don't then it is them at fault. It is an extra and bonus of your job that you can also get tipped.

If you don't like it why don't you just go pick up the food on your own? You're not entitled to delivery so why do you think you should get it for free?

The first 10-15% is the service fee, that's your base amount for the service. The extra 5-10% is the tip.

Then why can I leave 0 as a tip and not be charged anything? It isn't a service fee because I am not liable to pay it.

If you don't like it why don't you just go pick up the food on your own? You're not entitled to delivery so why do you think you should get it for free?

I'm not getting it for free. The place I ordered from charged a delivery fee in order for it to be delivered. A tip isn't paying for the delivery because I can give you 0 and get it for free anyways. The tip is a tip. Why do you feel entitled for something extra for doing the job I've paid your boss for you to do?

If it is the fee for delivery then why do you still give me the pizza when I don't tip? What would happen if you refuse to give me the pizza when I refuse to give you your "fee"? After all I don't pay you to deliver it why are you still delivering it to me?

Last edited by rhorle; 2013-01-22 at 01:21 AM.

"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

Tip, it seems people forget what this means these days. It is not mandatory so why would you act like it is? Sure, I tip because I'm like that but some people are hardasses and that's just who they are. Complaining that they didn't tip is stupid imo.

I see a lot of the same people refusing to understand or maybe just accept what has been laid out to them in plain English within the last 70 pages of this thread. Maybe their grasp of plain English is kind of impaired, or maybe their moral compass is just out of whack.

Ignorance of how the system works is excusable. Deliberate ignorance of how the system works after it's been explained to you in plain English is just a stubborn self-righteous entitlement.

In America, tips are something paid by the customer to bring the waiter wage up to minimum wage. Bigger tips are an indication of better service, it is technically optional but it considered cheap, rude, and greedy, and for some odd reason people will find reason to defend their cheap and greedy nature. In other countries, a tip is a voluntary bonus given for exceptional service. The waiter fee is already rolled in to the price of your food.

Pizza delivery is somewhat different in that the "tip" goes to pay for gas, wear and tear on the vehicle, insurance, etc. all that stuff you would have normally paid taking a trip down to your pizza parlor and picking it up yourself. If you refuse to pay a tip to your driver, you're basically saying "hey thanks for spending your gas and mileage on your car to get my food to me, now here's a middle finger!"

I am in no way defending the American system, I think it's rather silly. It's based in capitalistic greed, allowing restaurants to pay their employee less and expecting the customer to make up for it. If you are a Euro or an American that simply refuses to accept that the culture is the way it is then you aren't being avant garde, edgy, smart or clever. You're just being greedy and rude.

Pizza delivery is somewhat different in that the "tip" goes to pay for gas, wear and tear on the vehicle, insurance, etc. all that stuff you would have normally paid taking a trip down to your pizza parlor and picking it up yourself. If you refuse to pay a tip to your driver, you're basically saying "hey thanks for spending your gas and mileage on your car to get my food to me, now here's a middle finger!"

This is true, but people should and do understand that though really good for the driver/waiter, tips are still optional.Tip if you want. I may be kind of frustrated when I get stiffed, but the next guy who tips me completely makes me not think about the stiff. Tip or not...society will still tip as a hole and we will still make good money.

In America, tips are something paid by the customer to bring the waiter wage up to minimum wage.

A waiter only needs to get one 6 dollar tip an hour to make above minimum wage. Federal law also ensures they always make minimum wage or their employer faces fines.

Last edited by rhorle; 2013-01-22 at 02:55 AM.

"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

Then why can I leave 0 as a tip and not be charged anything? It isn't a service fee because I am not liable to pay it.

Its a fee that is optional based on your service.

While you personally can leave $0 as a tip, if everyone stops tipping then the restaurant will start charging everyone more to cover that. That means that you will be paying more if you take your food to go or dine in. As it is now you can take your food to go and not worry about the service charge or tipping. If you take advantage of the service you should be paying for it. If you don't then your freeloading off other people that do.

Personally I don't mind freeloaders as that means I'm getting better service than they are.

Originally Posted by rhorle

I'm not getting it for free. The place I ordered from charged a delivery fee in order for it to be delivered. A tip isn't paying for the delivery because I can give you 0 and get it for free anyways.

Yes, thats called freeloading. Other people tip for the service and you get a smaller bill because of it. That's ok with me because I get my food first and you get to come after me.

Originally Posted by rhorle

The tip is a tip. Why do you feel entitled for something extra for doing the job I've paid your boss for you to do?

The boss pays the employee based on the assumption that they will be getting tips. The employee that is giving you service is not getting much out of it if tips are not given. The prices on the menu reflect that lower wage. If you don't want to pay for the service you have the option of just leaving with your food.

If you don't want to tip and freeload off of other people that's fine. As long as you're OK with not being the server or driver's priority.

Originally Posted by rhorle

If it is the fee for delivery then why do you still give me the pizza when I don't tip? What would happen if you refuse to give me the pizza when I refuse to give you your "fee"? After all I don't pay you to deliver it why are you still delivering it to me?

You don't have to tip. Well, unless everyone doesn't tip then your cost is going to be more to cover that. You also don't have to come first.

You can't freeload if you pay for your bill. The tip is not part of the bill unless it is a gratuity. As gratuities are when the place automatically adds the tip to the bill.

If the tip to a delivery driver is the fee for delivery then why do I still get my pizza without paying for the delivery? Why isn't it part of the amount the driver ask me to pay? According to the way it works it isn't a fee for delivery. Go ahead and get something delivered and see if they ask you for the tip when they tell you how much you owe for the delivery.

They won't. So its not a fee. Its a tip.

Last edited by rhorle; 2013-01-22 at 04:44 AM.

"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

You can't freeload if you pay for your bill. The tip is not part of the bill unless it is a gratuity. As gratuities are when the place automatically adds the tip to the bill.

If the tip to a delivery driver is the fee for delivery then why do I still get my pizza without paying for the delivery? Why isn't it part of the amount the driver ask me to pay? According to the way it works it isn't a fee for delivery. Go ahead and get something delivered and see if they ask you for the tip when they tell you how much you owe for the delivery.

They won't. So its not a fee. Its a tip.

I think people are just hung up on the definition of the word tip. As a delivery driver the word carries a different meaning, same for waiter/waitress.

I think people are just hung up on the definition of the word tip. As a delivery driver the word carries a different meaning, same for waiter/waitress.

As long as it is optional and up to the discretion of the customer to pay it is the same definition and not a different one.

"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

As long as it is optional and up to the discretion of the customer to pay it is the same definition and not a different one.

But unfortunately for you, and no matter how badly you want it to be, it still will carry a different meaning to me and everyone else who relies on tips for their income. Now you could counter that with, "Oh well your boss should pay you more" or something along those lines but the fact of the matter is until turnover in the restaurant industry isn't as astronomically high as it is today the people that rely on tips have no other option but to work with the system that is there. You are right, you are well within your right to stiff the delivery driver, just don't expect that driver to choose your home over other people's homes when presented the option.