Be filled with the Holy Spirit

He did and we fell and we chose to ignore his command and before we fell was ever lasting life and no pain or hurt and crying, now we die and have
shorts lives and suffer constantly because we made the decision to listen to the fallen one.

It's always been the choice we made and the things we see today are because of that choice and it's not because he knew what was gonna happen but how
are they going learn to accept that evil has no place in heaven. He sent us to school and to endure this life because it's what are actions done for
us and he knows but we don't and thats why we seek him because we can go back.

He became flesh to lay the path to eternal rest because through Jesus the message of God was delivered and what better way to send a message than to
become one of us and speak with us, the old way was to hard and many lost the way and they hid the path in front of your eye`s, much better than a
burning brush or a book.

I'm saying that i personally believe parts of the bible are true. For example, i think Jesus was a man who indeed existed and was a healer and good
samaritan. There are records of him or someone describing him which exist outside of the realm of the church. I believe he was also ahead of his time
in medicine and 'faith' healing, also spirituality.

The bible like many ancient books have been twisted as they have been re-written over the generations to suit the needs of those in power. I believe
christianity was built upon good faith and with good intentions but it has been tainted.

I think Christianity was initially about self-empowerment and leadership by 'gods' side. It has strayed far beyond any of it's original values.

You also have to bear in mind that christianity was a follow up from the previous Judaism and judaism from the hebrews and likewise hindu religions.
Further back you get into the norse and celtic gods with striking similarities. If you dig as deep as i have to understand the true meaning of 'god'
and religion through the millennia, you would understand that 'god' as an image of man is wrong and has been twisted from the truth.

If you are interested i would be happy to give you a brief breakdown of christianity's roots and the roots of all major religions and how they all
follow the same scripture i one way or another.

Respect to you then, It's refreshing not to have to give the 'christianity through the centuries for dummies 101' talk.

. I am far to often shocked
at how little 'christians' know about there own religion.

well 1st of all we need to define who was given gods word and when. Was it: Adam, Abel, Anna, Daniel, David, Enoch, Jesus, Jacob, John the Baptist,
Jonah, Judas, Noah etc... Salih perhaps - sorry wrong book

. te he

'God' to me personally is infinitesimally unimaginable to the human mind. To even begin imagining gods rule and relm is mind boggling.

"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" - now let us stop for a moment and think about that, i mean REALLY THINK about that. "The
Heavens and the Earth" - thats a pretty big statement right there. Any god that can do that and only that is far beyond the understanding of meer man.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Gods word - that always gives me a chuckle. Infinite knowledge and divine being and he speaks to his 'prophets' in english... well hebrew if you want
to get technical, depends which book and version you read.

It's rather difficult to put these thoughts into words as it's such a massive topic and deal. hummmm... basically i believe 'god' is infinite god is
everything and god is nothing, god has no form, and forms all. God is not nature, nature is only a subset of god.... you see i can't do this in words,
rubbish!

I believe jesus was delusional but with the best of intentions. The mental and physical trauma that man was exposed to is enough to drive anyone to
voices in your head. Not to mention the pure *insert drug reference against ATS T&C* he did in the desert.

*** OH and just for good measure.. I was bashing Jehovah - God of Israel in my post. Not God the divine.***

I am far to often shocked at how little 'christians' know about there own religion.

I feel the same actually...

well 1st of all we need to define who was given gods word and when. Was it: Adam, Abel, Anna, Daniel, David, Enoch, Jesus, Jacob, John the
Baptist, Jonah, Judas, Noah etc... Salih perhaps - sorry wrong book . te he

This really depends on who you believe these people are... IF one bases his thoughts on what each of these people said, and their actions described
within said book... Theres only one real answer...

Adam was likely a myth based on the simple fact that there was no time in our past history where there was only one man on the planet... Out of all of
these people only one person declared himself to be the truth... and by reading what was written about said person... The feeling one gets about him
is that he was "the truth" as he said.

'God' to me personally is infinitesimally unimaginable to the human mind. To even begin imagining gods rule and relm is mind
boggling.

Gods word - that always gives me a chuckle. Infinite knowledge and divine being and he speaks to his 'prophets' in english... well hebrew if
you want to get technical, depends which book and version you read.

actually ancient Aramaic...

I believe jesus was delusional but with the best of intentions.

Now is that assumption based on what you know of the church and what they say about him... or from reading his words?

I don't understand how one can come to such a conclusion...

The mental and physical trauma that man was exposed to is enough to drive anyone to voices in your head. Not to mention the pure *insert drug
reference against ATS T&C* he did in the desert.

That's speculation... I've also heard the same thing about John when he wrote revelation... at least that is partially believable...

IF one is wandering in the desert for whatever reason.... Drugs would be the last thing on his mind...

OH and just for good measure.. I was bashing Jehovah - God of Israel in my post. Not God the divine.***

Jehovah was a false God... same with this YHWH character... in my humble opinion

This really depends on who you believe these people are... IF one bases his thoughts on what each of these people said, and their actions described
within said book... Theres only one real answer... Adam was likely a myth based on the simple fact that there was no time in our past history where
there was only one man on the planet... Out of all of these people only one person declared himself to be the truth... and by reading what was written
about said person... The feeling one gets about him is that he was "the truth" as he said.

Agreed about Adam, although reading through the Quran gives interesting insights into the supposed character. It's thinking about these things
that makes me wonder what the world could be like if all scholars from all religions, the top minds in science and the top historians could work
together, CAN YOU IMAGINE! Just what a wonderful scope of knowledge we could uncover. Im practically frothing at the mouth thinking about it.

You might like reading this...

And so i shall..

Now is that assumption based on what you know of the church and what they say about him... or from reading his words? I don't understand how one can
come to such a conclusion...

I have to admit that opinion was mostly formed from the churches hearsay and combing that with my understanding of pre biblical medicine and our
modern knowledge of psychology... I know, hardly scientific of me but give me a break.

That's speculation... I've also heard the same thing about John when he wrote revelation... at least that is partially believable... IF one is
wandering in the desert for whatever reason.... Drugs would be the last thing on his mind...

Yeah... this is were people get a little 'whaaaa?' on me. So after jesus was led into the Judaean Desert by the holy ghost to fast for 40 days and
40 nights right, there was little he could drink. Water was scare and even 'the son of god' couldn't conjure it up out of thin air.

It's little known and rarely documented that the Organ Pipe Cactus native to Judaean desert. When the body is under extreme conditions of
dehydrations the body is susceptible to the psychoactive alkaloids contained in the juices of the cactus. They have the effect similar to that of
taking a batch of pure L#D. Jesus drank from this cactus to survive.

It's a loose connection to his overall life but drugs have effects on the mind and body losg after the ware off.

Think of it as an alternative perspective... Take what I say as you will...

Agreed about Adam, although reading through the Quran gives interesting insights into the supposed character. It's thinking about these things
that makes me wonder what the world could be like if all scholars from all religions, the top minds in science and the top historians could work
together, CAN YOU IMAGINE! Just what a wonderful scope of knowledge we could uncover. Im practically frothing at the mouth thinking about
it.

I would personally be more interested in various religious sects revealing any hidden documents they might have stashed away...
*cough*Vatican*cough*

Yeah... this is were people get a little 'whaaaa?' on me. So after jesus was led into the Judaean Desert by the holy ghost to fast for 40
days and 40 nights right, there was little he could drink. Water was scare and even 'the son of god' couldn't conjure it up out of thin air.

It's little known and rarely documented that the Organ Pipe Cactus native to Judaean desert. When the body is under extreme conditions of
dehydrations the body is susceptible to the psychoactive alkaloids contained in the juices of the cactus. They have the effect similar to that of
taking a batch of pure L#D. Jesus drank from this cactus to survive.

It's a loose connection to his overall life but drugs have effects on the mind and body losg after the ware off.

I suppose its possible... Though I would suspect he wouldn't have had the answers he had to his followers if psychedelics were used...

I might suggest that you give the gospels a read one day... Not only are they amazing to read, but also rather amusing in many cases... Jesus stuffs
the scriptures down the law givers throats...

and the answers he comes up with are amazing... far more so then what you'll hear from any church...

There in you'll find the difference between hearing about Jesus... and reading about him

Well said. Your a light in darkness. Don't be discouraged by unbelievers or the hate posts that come from this. People who don't know God, also
don't know what real love is. (Agape love)
If they persecute Jesus, they will persecute you.
To all the unbelievers, atheists, and haters, well I'm told to love you, but have nothing to do with stupid arguments. It's not true that all roads
lead to heaven. We all die one day, if you don't want anything to do with God, don't expect Him to welcome you into His house when that day comes.
He loves you, in case you didn't know.

Who is the parent who would chose to not have their child knowing their child would not be perfect in all manner? Who is the parent who would forsake
their child for transgression and not provide guidance, love, and forgiveness? Who is the parent who does not dread the depth their child's agony or
dread the pain of their wrongdoings? Who is the parent who would not place themself to suffer to save their child?

I say that much more than the parent forgives, loves, provides and guides the child, the Father forgives, loves, provides and guides us and all his
creation.

How can one be so presumptive as to blame the Father for the sins of the child? How can one be so presumptive as to assume the Father does not suffer
when we have sinned against each other and Him? In all of one's professed studying of religion, how can one not have understood this?

Well said. Your a light in darkness. Don't be discouraged by unbelievers or the hate posts that come from this. People who don't know God, also
don't know what real love is. (Agape love)
If they persecute Jesus, they will persecute you.
To all the unbelievers, atheists, and haters, well I'm told to love you, but have nothing to do with stupid arguments. It's not true that all roads
lead to heaven. We all die one day, if you don't want anything to do with God, don't expect Him to welcome you into His house when that day comes.
He loves you, in case you didn't know.

** beginning of rant**

Right! Lets stop right there shall we sir/madam.

"People who don't know God, also don't know what real love is"

Whats kind of nonsense is that?...

I'm a non-believer.. I have no affiliation to any party, creed nor religion. I have a partner who i love with all my heart and i feel her love. I
wasn't out to personally call anyone out, but you just ruffled my feathers up the wrong way.

It's brainwashing nonsense like that i CAN'T STAND. Those that have not been accepted into or accepted gods word/house are perfectly able to
experience all the love the universe has to offer.

YOU being affiliated with god on this earthly plain gives you no more love then another other human being. What you experience with god's 'love' is
all in your head, trust me. I used to think the same rubbish. I get warm fuzzy feelings when i meditate and channel the either of the universe through
my body. That is real, that i proven, that is fact, not fiction sir/madam.

Get of your high horse and appreciate the love you are given by your fellow human beings, not some fictional character in your head. That is all you
will be offered in this life, never mind the next.

"I'm a non-believer.. I have no affiliation to any party, creed nor religion. I have a partner who i love with all my heart and i feel her
love."

Love for the spouse is the third highest love that man can achieve.

The second is the love for parents as a child or baby.

The Most High Love is God, being in the espousal of our souls to the Lord Jesus Christ.

If you care for information on it, look up the book "dark night of the soul", read from Rumi, revelation, and St. Teresa Avila.

"It's brainwashing nonsense like that i CAN'T STAND. Those that have not been accepted into or accepted gods word/house are perfectly able to
experience all the love the universe has to offer. "

You are getting mad over something that you do not understand. You call it "brainwashing nonsense" but either way, you are deflecting and closing
your heart to this information.

And if you were experiencing all of the love the universe has, would you respond in a rant towards your fellow human being? or would you seek
understanding of them with love?

"YOU being affiliated with god on this earthly plain gives you no more love then another other human being."

Correct, God loves each and every person just as much as He loves you. But the love you give is proportionate to the love you receive.

"What you experience with god's 'love' is all in your head"

Why would I trust you? Love comes from the heart.

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edit on 093131p://666 by backcase because: use of the wrong
word

Your right in one respect, i don't know why i let your rhetoric wind me up, it was childish of me.

You are as with anyone, entitled to your opinion and i respect that, but that doesn't mean i have to respect your words. There is no love of this
love of that and love of the other. There is only one love, and that comes form universal consciousness, It's derived from every living thing, not
god.

It's nonsense beliefs like that, that made me leave the church in the 1st place, thank you for the reminder. I wasn't asking you to trust me, that
was rhetorical, a 'figure of speech' whatever you want to call it.

Anyway, i'm wasting my time here. You like many other in the church are so caught up in your own outdated beliefs that there's no reasoning with
you.

I wish you all the best for a fulfilling life, all i ask is that you question your beliefs once in a while, it's healthy. I come back to assess my
stance on the church and christianity reguly.

I leave you with this: Zeitgeist (the original). It's not the be all and end of of understanding about religion but it's a good start. I suggest you
give it a watch but of course it's up to you what you want to understand in life. In return regardless or not of if you watch it, i shall read 'dark
night of the soul' you mentioned in my quest for knowledge.

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