National Anthems and Patriotism - Think Atheist2015-03-31T22:28:18Zhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/forum/topics/national-anthems-and-patriotism?commentId=1982180%3AComment%3A1365621&xg_source=activity&feed=yes&xn_auth=no@Kairan... You have put it cl…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-27:1982180:Comment:13685552013-08-27T10:37:33.381Zbongani muthwahttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/bonganimuthwa
<p>@Kairan... You have put it clearly. My apologies for reply after some days. Was hospitalised.</p>
<p>@Kairan... You have put it clearly. My apologies for reply after some days. Was hospitalised.</p> I hear you Elon, I want to be…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-27:1982180:Comment:13686702013-08-27T10:34:59.855Zbongani muthwahttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/bonganimuthwa
<p>I hear you Elon, I want to be Human, but have a sense of belonging to a certain geographical terrain.</p>
<p>I hear you Elon, I want to be Human, but have a sense of belonging to a certain geographical terrain.</p> I here you,tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-27:1982180:Comment:13686682013-08-27T10:33:38.383Zbongani muthwahttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/bonganimuthwa
<p>I here you,</p>
<p>I here you,</p> It's complicated. All I know…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-27:1982180:Comment:13684572013-08-27T04:13:24.145ZPope Beaniehttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/PaulRyan
<p>It's complicated. All I know is my American experience, and some history. Part of the answer has to be compatible with other countries, too. Defending one's country from attack is usually reasonable, while attacking other countries for the sake of helping them succeed in some form of idealism is debatable, and often has unpredicted, undesirable consequences.</p>
<p>African countries in particular have been subject to exploitation by the rest of the world. Even spending billions of dollars…</p>
<p>It's complicated. All I know is my American experience, and some history. Part of the answer has to be compatible with other countries, too. Defending one's country from attack is usually reasonable, while attacking other countries for the sake of helping them succeed in some form of idealism is debatable, and often has unpredicted, undesirable consequences.</p>
<p>African countries in particular have been subject to exploitation by the rest of the world. Even spending billions of dollars yearly for oil extraction and energy production has some negative consequences in those countries that have the oil.</p>
<p>Modernization itself can cause conflict and perpetuate or worsen inequality. Civilization is largely made up of different cultures with differing circumstances. I personally think that nationalism and sacrificing one's self "for God" have made war and terrorism more destructive. I wish we could all focus more on fixing our own problems at home before interfering in other countries. If we're really as good and feeling as successful as we want to as a country, we should be able to interest others in the world in participating while increasing their own peace and prosperity.</p> They did exactly that when in…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-27:1982180:Comment:13687042013-08-27T02:06:43.062ZSteveInCOhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/SteveInCO
<blockquote><p>They did exactly that when in the 1930s George Orwell did his radio show on an attack by Martians.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>It was Orson Welles, and that was a radio version of War of the Worlds by H. G. Wells.</p>
<p>Since Orson formatted the show as if it were a series of news bulletins it sounded frighteningly believable.</p>
<blockquote><p>They did exactly that when in the 1930s George Orwell did his radio show on an attack by Martians.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>It was Orson Welles, and that was a radio version of War of the Worlds by H. G. Wells.</p>
<p>Since Orson formatted the show as if it were a series of news bulletins it sounded frighteningly believable.</p> Unforatunately I was hospital…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-26:1982180:Comment:13681782013-08-26T10:42:41.306Zbongani muthwahttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/bonganimuthwa
<p>Unforatunately I was hospitalised few hours after I posted this discussion.Was involved in a terrible car accident, have few bandages there and there. I have read through most responses I am only discovering people talking about their America and not actually contributing directly to the discussion.Maybe I should ask these questions again:A)What does that say to me, as a Freethinker should I be patriotic, where do I draw the line in my patriotism? B)Do I belong to one geographically…</p>
<p>Unforatunately I was hospitalised few hours after I posted this discussion.Was involved in a terrible car accident, have few bandages there and there. I have read through most responses I am only discovering people talking about their America and not actually contributing directly to the discussion.Maybe I should ask these questions again:A)What does that say to me, as a Freethinker should I be patriotic, where do I draw the line in my patriotism? B)Do I belong to one geographically stationed group of humans or to all of them as they are scattered all over the globe? C)Should Free thinking soldiers go out there in the name of their country and fight wars that smell some religious defending?</p> Hey John, hi. Sorry man been…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-26:1982180:Comment:13682802013-08-26T10:31:24.593Zbongani muthwahttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/bonganimuthwa
<p>Hey John, hi. Sorry man been unable to access internet.</p>
<p>Hey John, hi. Sorry man been unable to access internet.</p> Look, I don't mind those kind…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-19:1982180:Comment:13658542013-08-19T00:42:37.758ZMikeLonghttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/MikeLong
<p>Look, I don't mind those kinds of decisions being made on a RATIONAL basis, but patriotism is just a tool (almost as powerful as God and the afterlife) for manipulating a population to charge into the mouth of the cannon.</p>
<p>Look, I don't mind those kinds of decisions being made on a RATIONAL basis, but patriotism is just a tool (almost as powerful as God and the afterlife) for manipulating a population to charge into the mouth of the cannon.</p> Flags, borders and national a…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-19:1982180:Comment:13658422013-08-19T00:22:05.044ZMelvinotishttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/Melvinotis
<p>Flags, borders and national anthems are arbitrary delineations of ideological differences. On one side of the river, they cheer your use of free speech, on the other side they kill you for it. Americans don't really know what it's like to have a lot of neighbors.</p>
<p>Our ancestors fought for what they felt they believed in (some were forced) and many felt that the differences were worth dying for. The memorialization of that in song helps people remember what they were fighting…</p>
<p>Flags, borders and national anthems are arbitrary delineations of ideological differences. On one side of the river, they cheer your use of free speech, on the other side they kill you for it. Americans don't really know what it's like to have a lot of neighbors.</p>
<p>Our ancestors fought for what they felt they believed in (some were forced) and many felt that the differences were worth dying for. The memorialization of that in song helps people remember what they were fighting for.</p>
<p>Rythm taps directly into your limbic brain, bypassing your cognitive functions. So some of you were right, it is a way to keep the masses in tow. <a href="http://fcit.usf.edu/holocaust/arts/musreich.htm" target="_blank">Hitler used songs extensively</a> to bolster patriotism, so obviously, things can go wrong in that regard.</p>
<p>As to religious connotations, yup, thats part of the package to get past peoples brain gatekeepers. </p> Group pride makes about as mu…tag:www.thinkatheist.com,2013-08-18:1982180:Comment:13656572013-08-18T18:19:00.163ZUnseenhttp://www.thinkatheist.com/profile/Unseen
<p>Group pride makes about as much sense as group guilt. By the time I was born, the industrial slavery of black people was over, and my family hadn't come to the US yet anyway when that was going on. Consequently, I feel no guilt over slavery. I do regret that it went on, but if I have anything to be proud of in the sense we are talking here, it's that my country expended 625,000 lives plus more than a quarter million wounded to bring it to an end. White lives, pretty much.</p>
<p>Group pride makes about as much sense as group guilt. By the time I was born, the industrial slavery of black people was over, and my family hadn't come to the US yet anyway when that was going on. Consequently, I feel no guilt over slavery. I do regret that it went on, but if I have anything to be proud of in the sense we are talking here, it's that my country expended 625,000 lives plus more than a quarter million wounded to bring it to an end. White lives, pretty much.</p>