A new report claims Apple is lining up suppliers for a 7.85-inch iPad, and that the company recently inked a deal with AU Optronics to provide displays for the rumored device.

Monday's report from the Chinese-language Economic Daily News ( Google Translate) is the third in five days to claim that Apple is planning to release a so-called "iPad mini" in the third quarter of this year. On Saturday, a leaked document from Samsung Securities indicated Apple planned to release a "new 7-inch product" later this year.

And last week, DigiTimes also claimed that Apple will begin production of a 7.85-inch iPad in the third quarter of 2012. It was said the device could be priced between $249 and $299.

Monday's report sided with on screen size, saying the 7.85-inch panels will be supplied by AU Optronics as well as LG Display. Apple will, however, exclude its rival Samsung from supplying displays, the report claimed.

LG is expected to provide Apple with between 70 and 75 percent of the displays for the rumored "iPad mini," while AUO will supply the remaining components. Backlights for the alleged device will be supplied by Radiant and Forhouse, the report said.

Finally, the Chinese newspaper also claimed that production of the 7.85-inch iPad will be handled by Pegatron Technology. That would be a shift for Apple, as most of its devices, including most iPads, are currently assembled at Foxconn, but Apple has recently come under fire for its partnership with the company.

While most claims of a smaller iPad model have come out of the Far East, last month The Wall Street Journal joined the fray and reported that Apple was testing a new iPad with an 8-inch screen, smaller than the 9.7-inch display currently found on Apple's touchscreen tablet. The smaller device is rumored to have a screen resolution similar to the current iPad 2.

Well, that rumor's perfectly believable -- can't think of more than a million reasons why Apple would flee China as a production center, if they were to drop Foxconn. And who better to predict such trends than a Chinese publication that's knee-deep in the Chinese business world?

Thanks though for clearing up where the small-screen rumor was coming from -- could someone please start a rumor about the "iPhab"? I need a few more laughs than the Chinese industrial complex can afford

Let's assume this smaller ipad is "true"...How can Apple possibly price this thing so it doesn't compete with ipod Touch and used market iPads 1-2???

ipod touch = $199~
used ipads = $300~
NEW ipad = $500~

Anyone else see a problem here with this small ipad? Would some people want 7-in ipads? Sure! SOME!!! It's the same group of people claiming Amazon Fire is a contender to iPad a few months ago. Look at where Amazon is at now? Still only attracting mostly ebook-focus readers... No doubt, ebooks are hot and bring a lot of money to the table, but I don't think Steve Jobs vision starts or ends with ebooks. Jobs vision with post-PC tablets is meant to become our daily multi-purpose tool...form-factor and design is critical to making this tool functional and not just look good in your hands.... and if true, this smaller ipad would be post Steve Jobs biggest mistake by his core group of executives.

Well, that rumor's perfectly believable -- can't think of more than a million reasons why Apple would flee China as a production center, if they were to drop Foxconn. And who better to predict such trends than a Chinese publication that's knee-deep in the Chinese business world?

Doesn't Pegatron also manufacture in China? I think this has more to do with not putting too much of your manufacturing in the hands of one company (Foxconn), which also helps to stimulate a little price competition between suppliers. I've noticed over the past few years that supply chain leaks in the end tend to be the most reliable source of future product information.

I've no idea why 7.85". Seems too close to the current 9.7" iPad but I'm sure there is a reason. Maybe instead of a genuine tweener device this is just a slightly smaller iPad with a lower price to compete with the Kindle. Same principle as the they do with the MacBooks - 13" versus 15", etc.

Let's assume this smaller ipad is "true"...How can Apple possibly price this thing so it doesn't compete with ipod Touch and used market iPads 1-2???

ipod touch = $199~
used ipads = $300~
NEW ipad = $500~

Anyone else see a problem here with this small ipad? Would some people want 7-in ipads? Sure! SOME!!! It's the same group of people claiming Amazon Fire is a contender to iPad a few months ago. Look at where Amazon is at now? Still only attracting mostly ebook-focus readers... No doubt, ebooks are hot and bring a lot of money to the table, but I don't think Steve Jobs vision starts or ends with ebooks. Jobs vision with post-PC tablets is meant to become our daily multi-purpose tool...form-factor and design is critical to making this tool functional and not just look good in your hands.... and if true, this smaller ipad would be post Steve Jobs biggest mistake by his core group of executives.

Why would Apple care about the used market when pricing their products? Have they ever shown even the slightest consideration for that?

What you should have in your "pricing model" is separate prices for iPad 2 and iPad 3 since there is an expectation that both will continue to be on sales after the iPad 3 is released. I doubt Apple will price the iPad 2 with any consideration of the used market, either.

I could see that Apple keeps both models in production and then at a future point in time they replace the iPad 2 with a smaller model. Not saying they will have a smaller iPad, but that's how they could approach the release such a device.

Apple has said multiple times that a 7-inch screen is too small for tablet apps.

And do you think Apple has always followed it's own public statements? What Apple says in those statements really can't be viewed as anything other than marketing. Every company says their products are the best and their competitor's products are lacking in some respect. That's all those statements were, and yet so many people take it as gospel just because Steve said it.

- nobody reads anymore --> we now have iBooks
- the shuffle doesn't need buttons --> the buttons are back
- you don't need Firewire on your laptop --> less than a year later the ports were back

Apple sometimes changes it's mind about things. Some statements may be intentional mis-direction. But it's all about marketing your current products, not about what the future products might be.

There are 2 arguments against 7" being too small. the first is iPhone/iPod Touch and the second is that higher resolution displays are now available.

Steve Jobs addressed both points in the 2010 earnings call:

Quote:

If you take an iPad and hold it upright in portrait view, and draw an imaginary horizontal line halfway down the screen, the screens on these seven-inch tablets are a bit smaller than the bottom half of the iPad’s display. This size isn’t sufficient to create great tablet apps, in our opinion.

While one could increase the resolution of the display to make up some of the difference, it is meaningless unless your tablet also includes sandpaper, so that the user can sand down their fingers to around one-quarter of their present size.

Agreed. This is more about spreading FUD prior to the release of the iPad 3.

Now one day there might be a smaller iPad, but it is just as likely here might be a bigger one. I for one would like a full A4 sized iPad. But the market for a bigger iPad would be smaller than the current size. And as all the smaller iPad imitators have amply demonstrated, a 7 inch tablet is less popular than the current iPad.

Now, there are no doubt people who think a 7 inch would be the right size, so why not? On the other hand, it might be too hard for Apple to find the right niche (including price points) between the iPod Touch and the Ipad. On the gripping hand, why not just sell a lower price iPad 2?

Let's assume this smaller ipad is "true"...How can Apple possibly price this thing so it doesn't compete with ipod Touch and used market iPads 1-2???

ipod touch = $199~
used ipads = $300~
NEW ipad = $500~

Anyone else see a problem here with this small ipad? Would some people want 7-in ipads? Sure! SOME!!! It's the same group of people claiming Amazon Fire is a contender to iPad a few months ago. Look at where Amazon is at now? Still only attracting mostly ebook-focus readers... No doubt, ebooks are hot and bring a lot of money to the table, but I don't think Steve Jobs vision starts or ends with ebooks. Jobs vision with post-PC tablets is meant to become our daily multi-purpose tool...form-factor and design is critical to making this tool functional and not just look good in your hands.... and if true, this smaller ipad would be post Steve Jobs biggest mistake by his core group of executives.

On Wednesday Apple will be in a position to offer two basic grades of iPad. The current technology with minimal tweaks can comfortably hit the $399 price point and a new iPad with a higher resolution can come in at $70 north of the current model.

So if Apple offers a $399 iPad and already sells a Touch line that spans the range of $199 to $399, what is the fit for a smaller iPad. How many consumers, given a choice between a smaller iPad or a tweaked iPad 2 at roughly the same price point, would prefer the smaller unit. My guess is not many. Compare them back-to-back and the smaller unit is DOA.

The Touch, especially if it gains a moderately larger screen, appeals because it is pocket-friendly. An 8-inch iPad not.

What I think these rumours are supposed to do is slow down sales of the new iPad in that if some consumers think an 8-inch unit is coming, they might be inclined to hold off on a purchase just in case the different size is more to their liking. It is highly suspicious that these rumors have been fired up just before the next iPad is about to be announced.

There is another problem. No one believes any more that Apple would bring out a new iPad in March and then a another new version in the fall. Clearly Apple is updating this product once a year. So if you're in the business of generating rumours, in order to encourage readers to take an interest, you have to make it seem plausible that a new product is coming later this year. Hence such a product needs to be conjured up, even if none exists.

Apple has no reason to develop a smaller iPad. The company has argued that the iPad is the right size for a tablet and has the sales success to prove it. If there was a compelling 8-inch tablet threatening the iPad, that would be different. Where is that threat and with the iPad 2 soon to be available for around $400, where is that threat going to come from.

Consumers are willing to settle on the iPad in the millions so, as they say, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

I've no idea why 7.85". Seems too close to the current 9.7" iPad but I'm sure there is a reason.

Because it's the size of the Kindle Fire and some folks think that Apple needs to be making a product to compete with the Fire. Despite the fact that the iPad already beats it in sales several times over.

Also, Digitimes has a zero track record for being right and this is an old rumor that hasn't been true for two previous years. Add to this that Jobs said that a 7 inch size was too small for a tablet and folks are better off believing that this is a free press stunt to benefit the companies name dropped rather than a bonafided leak.

If Apple makes something in the 5-7" range it will probably be towards the low end and be either a larger iPod touch to go with the current or more likely to replace it as a game focused item. NOT an iPad.

If Apple makes something in the 5-7" range it will probably be towards the low end and be either a larger iPod touch to go with the current or more likely to replace it as a game focused item. NOT an iPad.

Yet filling the same purpose. Aren't you arguing semantics more than asserting that Apple would never offer such a size at all? Apple might call it an iPod, but users (and the press) would still call it a tablet. The fine distinction between the two would be lost on buyers.

Yet filling the same purpose. Aren't you arguing semantics more asserting that Apple would never offer such a size at all? Apple might call it an iPod, but users (and the press) would still call it a tablet. The fine distinction between the two would be lost on buyers.

The Touch is a tablet. I don't agree, though, that it's strictly semantics. I think it valid to refer to a product with let's say a 4.75-inch screen a revised Touch and not an iPad. It is a different class of device to be used in different scenarios. They would be companions not variations of the same theme. Owning both would make sense. On the other hand, a 7-inch tablet would represent an alternative that is dramatically inferior to either in some important areas.

The Touch is a tablet. I don't agree, though, that it's strictly semantics. I think it valid to refer to a product with let's say a 4.75-inch screen a revised Touch and not an iPad. It is a different class of device to be used in different scenarios. They would be companions not variations of the same theme. Owning both would make sense. On the other hand, a 7-inch tablet would represent an alternative that is dramatically inferior to either in some important areas.

In this case a screen smaller than 5" isn't the focus, it's a 7" display. In what way would a 7" iPod be inferior to a 7" iPad or be considered anything other than a tablet? Serious question.

Why would Apple care about the used market when pricing their products? Have they ever shown even the slightest consideration for that?

What you should have in your "pricing model" is separate prices for iPad 2 and iPad 3 since there is an expectation that both will continue to be on sales after the iPad 3 is released. I doubt Apple will price the iPad 2 with any consideration of the used market, either.

I could see that Apple keeps both models in production and then at a future point in time they replace the iPad 2 with a smaller model. Not saying they will have a smaller iPad, but that's how they could approach the release such a device.

He has a point about the pricing. Going from 10" to 7" doesn't adjust the price much (or at all for some components) so you have to use less grade components and even offer less HW features to bring down the price. If they do offer a 10" iPad 2 for $399 that leaves a 7" at $299... and that's at 8GB. It's hard to make a case for such a device as I think it could negatively impact the iPad market for the longterm. I think a 7" at $100 less than the 10" model with the same capacity but with a 1024x768 display seems more feasible, but that also has hurdles.

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In this case a screen smaller than 5" isn't the focus, it's a 7" display. In what way would a 7" iPod be inferior to a 7" iPad or be considered anything other than a tablet? Serious question.

7" iPod Touch is a 3:2 device. That means 22.62 sq inches compared to a 7" iPad at 4:3 with 23.54 sq inches. Then there is the fact that the 7" iPod Touch could have a back panel that isn't milled to cut down on costs, a less engineered logic board, only come in WiFi (no cellular option as is expected with the iPad), use a cheaper display (cheaper tech and lower pixel density), less bright backlight, no digitizer (if the iPad had it), no HD camera on back (only one for FaceTime), battery life that doesn't have to meet or exceed the iPad, year old Apple A chip, less RAM... and on and on. Converting iOS for iPod Touch to 7" would also be cheaper than converting iOS for iPad to 7".

If we say that a 7" iPad is definitely coming I wouldn't expect it until Apple no longer sells the 1024x768 9.7" display iPads. Just like with a larger iPhone display wouldn't come until after they deprecate the 480x320 display. Best to limit the number of displays users need to support when possible.

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And as all the smaller iPad imitators have amply demonstrated, a 7 inch tablet is less popular than the current iPad.

But is that because they are 7 inches or because the software running them is inferior? It's not all about size, but it's how you use it.

But seriously, it's correlation vs. causation. You can't pick one convenient statistic (size) and say that's responsible for the end result (low sales). One could look at the classic example of increasing ice cream sales resulting in higher crime rates because the two statistics move in tandom...ignoring the fact that it's the weather than influences both. Both ice cream sales and crime rates increase in the summer time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SolipsismX

He has a point about the pricing. Going from 10" to 7" doesn't adjust the price much (or at all for some components) so you have to use less grade components and even offer less HW features to bring down the price. If they do offer a 10" iPad 2 for $399 that leaves a 7" at $299... and that's at 8GB. It's hard to make a case for such a device as I think it could negatively impact the iPad market for the longterm. I think a 7" at $100 less than the 10" model with the same capacity but with a 1024x768 display seems more feasible, but that also has hurdles.

They could also differentiate by features. For example, the iPad can import photos from your camera, the iPod Touch and iPhone can't. There is no technical reason for this. It's just Apple's way to direct sales to certain models. Of course, in doing this, we'd be back to the argument that this new device is a large iPad Touch, not a smaller iPad.

I agree that having and iPad 3 and aiPad 2 and a smaller iPad would make for too crowded of a pricing structure. Which is why I suggested that one alternative would be for the iPad 2 to be a temporary lower-priced option until a smaller iPad is released. Having previous gen iPhones as the low-price option makes sense because there's not a whole lot that can be done with the iPhone form factor. But using year-old tablet tech as the low-cost option may not be the best for that market.

Again, not saying there will be a smaller iPad. Just that it's not obvious that it will never happen. A lot of the same rhetoric was written on these boards about there never being a CDMA iPhone for Verizon, and for many of the same kinds of reasons (Apple said ATT was the best, fragmentation of the supply chain, etc).

7" iPod Touch is a 3:2 device. That means 22.62 sq inches compared to a 7" iPad at 4:3 with 23.54 sq inches. Then there is the fact that the 7" iPod Touch could have a back panel that isn't milled to cut down on costs, a less engineered logic board, only come in WiFi (no cellular option as is expected with the iPad), use a cheaper display (cheaper tech and lower pixel density), less bright backlight, no digitizer (if the iPad had it), no HD camera on back (only one for FaceTime), battery life that doesn't have to meet or exceed the iPad, year old Apple A chip, less RAM... and on and on. Converting iOS for iPod Touch to 7" would also be cheaper than converting iOS for iPad to 7".

If we say that a 7" iPad is definitely coming I wouldn't expect it until Apple no longer sells the 1024x768 9.7" display iPads. Just like with a larger iPhone display wouldn't come until after they deprecate the 480x320 display. Best to limit the number of displays users need to support when possible.

Those are all possibilities of course. My question was what would absolutely be inferior if it was an iPod rather than an iPad? Related to that, why shouldn't a buyer consider either one a tablet if it's a 7"+ device?

They could also differentiate by features. For example, the iPad can import photos from your camera, the iPod Touch and iPhone can't. There is no technical reason for this. It's just Apple's way to direct sales to certain models. Of course, in doing this, we'd be back to the argument that this new device is a large iPad Touch, not a smaller iPad.

There is not technical reason they can't make a device at one inch differences between 5 and 15" inches and all market it as an iPad but I think we'd all say that won't happen. I certainly don't see a technical reason for not having a 7" iPad, but I do see many reasons why a 7" iPod Touch would make more sense from a cost, marketing and logistical standpoints.

I will not surprised to see a larger iPod Touch come Wednesday but will be surprised to see a smaller iPad.

Quote:

Again, not saying there will be a smaller iPad. Just that it's not obvious that it will never happen. A lot of the same rhetoric was written on these board about there never being a CDMA iPhone for Verizon, and for many of the same kinds of reasons (Apple said ATT was the best, fragmentation of the supply chain, etc).

There were people saying that CDMA was old tech and not popular enough to warrant it but i think most were more balanced in that they would offer it when it was the right time, just as they will likely offer a China Mobile iPhone when it's the right time.

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In this case a screen smaller than 5" isn't the focus, it's a 7" display. In what way would a 7" iPod be inferior to a 7" iPad or be considered anything other than a tablet? Serious question.

Here's my way of distinguishing tablet vs Phone/touch class product.

Does it present a full web browser?

If yes it is a Tablet
if no it is a mobile pocketable device

Quote:

Originally Posted by SolipsismX

He has a point about the pricing. Going from 10" to 7" doesn't adjust the price much (or at all for some components) so you have to use less grade components and even offer less HW features to bring down the price. If they do offer a 10" iPad 2 for $399 that leaves a 7" at $299... and that's at 8GB. It's hard to make a case for such a device as I think it could negatively impact the iPad market for the longterm. I think a 7" at $100 less than the 10" model with the same capacity but with a 1024x768 display seems more feasible, but that also has hurdles.

I disagree that you need to use lower grade parts. The key to reducing BoM costs isn't using lesser grade electronics it's in the consolidation of parts.

Whereas the iPad has 3 chips to do Accelerometer, Compass and Gyro parts being announced today can do all three functions in a single chip.

This reduces the cost of the chips but even better makes it easier to QA test the product. Any Tablet coming out in Q3 simply has access to more modern internal components and that can have a big influence on overall pricing.

He's a mod so he has a few extra vBulletin privileges. That doesn't mean he should stop posting or should start acting like Digital Jesus.- SolipsismX

And as all the smaller iPad imitators have amply demonstrated, a 7 inch tablet is less popular than the current iPad.

That's because they aren't iPads. The 7" form factor is superior, it's just using Android that sucks.

Quote:

Now, there are no doubt people who think a 7 inch would be the right size, so why not? On the other hand, it might be too hard for Apple to find the right niche (including price points) between the iPod Touch and the Ipad. On the gripping hand, why not just sell a lower price iPad 2?

Why does it have to be cheaper? Make it exactly the same price, and I'll still buy it.

Those are all possibilities of course. My question was what would absolutely be inferior if it was an iPod rather than an iPad? Related to that, why shouldn't a buyer consider either one a tablet if it's a 7"+ device?

1) I detailed examples of inferiority. You can look at the displays of the iPhone and iPod Touch to see one is inferior to the other. Sure, they are both 960x640 resolution but one is IPS and the other TN. That said it's probably not feasible to use TN on a 7" device if even Amazon uses IPS on their $199 loss-leader.

2) The buyer can consider it whatever they want. They can call it a PC if they choose to, but we're talking about what Apple would release so I tackled it from what I think their perspective might be to maximize sales, help the iPod arm and without hurting the iPad arm, hence me suggesting it would be 7" iPod Touch, not a 7" iPad.

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I'd personally be very surprised to see a smaller Ipad/larger iPod announced this week. Most of the noise to date indicates something for later this year rather than now doesn't it?

They didn't update the Touch last Autumn. I didn't they would since they've never released the iPhone along with the new Touch and it wouldn't be good to have both at the same time. Now is the time to update the Touch.

My reasoning as to why I wouldn't be surprised by a larger Touch is that to go to a larger iPhone you need to rebuild the UI to be idealized for the new I/O. This would give devs a heads up without giving them an official heads up. I don't expect this... just saying I wouldn't be surprised by it.

Note the iPhone 3GS will likely be pushed aside in favour of the iPhone 4, iPhone 4S and 6th gen iPhone come this Autumn. That means that they'd no longer have to deal with the 480x320 display which would be the time that they could offer a new size. The iPod Touch is already Retina across the board.

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So that's three different sources saying that there's a 7.8"-ish minitablet coming this year—DigiTimes, Samsung Securities, and now this from Economic Times.

What would justify a second tablet in one year? A really high-quality autostereoscopic screen is what, so the kids could watch Pixar 3D movies, and adults could watch seriously good 3D like Wim Wenders' Pina, Scorcese's Hugo or Werner Herzog's Cave of Forgotten Dreams. I mention these only to note that the serious directors don't see 3D as a gimmick these days.

Somone is going to be making high-quality glasses-free 3D tablets. Might as well be Apple first. Both AUO and LG have been innovating with parallax-barrier autostereo screens, I believe. This size would be a good starter size to test the technology and the market. If it failed to attract a mass following, it wouldn't be such a disaster, since it would be seen as a niche effort, like a new iPod, and not a flagship product like a new type of iPad.

So that's three different sources saying that there's a 7.8"-ish minitablet coming this yearDigiTimes, Samsung Securities, and now this from Economic Times.

What would justify a second tablet in one year? A really high-quality autostereoscopic screen is what, so the kids could watch Pixar 3D movies, and adults could watch seriously good 3D like Wim Wenders' Pina, Scorcese's Hugo or Werner Herzog's Cave of Forgotten Dreams. I mention these only to note that the serious directors don't see 3D as a gimmick these days.

Somone is going to be making glasses-free 3D tablets. Might as well be Apple first. Both AUO and LG have been innovating with parallax-barrier autostereo screens, I believe. This size would be a good starter size to test the technology and the market. If it failed to attract a mass following, it wouldn't be such a disaster, since it would be seen as a niche effort, like a new iPod, and not a flagship product like a new type of iPad.

And yes, Steve/Jony would have been behind it from like 2011.

If Apple could make a 7" gaming platform that would get good battery life and offer 3D and have a development platform to make 3D games easy that seems like it could be a winner. I'm no so sure about 3D movies on a 7" display being the ideal release platform.

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If Apple could make a 7" gaming platform that would get good battery life and offer 3D and have a development platform to make 3D games easy that seems like it could be a winner. I'm no so sure about 3D movies on a 7" display being the ideal release platform.

Me neither on the ideal-for-movies part, maybe more suitable for kids, but that's a good point about 3D games.

I'd personally be very surprised to see a smaller Ipad/larger iPod announced this week. Most of the noise to date indicates something for later this year rather than now doesn't it?

Not impossible. After all, Apple didn't really update the Touch last fall so it could be that the intention is to upgrade it on Wednesday. Just saying.

It wouldn't be the first time that a surprise announcement happened. Don't forget that there has been so much focus on getting the dirt on the next iPad that an update of the Touch could easily fly under the radar.

If Apple updates the Touch at this time I have a one-word explanation for that timing - V-I-T-A.

Would like to see this for car audio applications. Double din is 4x7 with a 8.06" diagonal. Most modern cars have double din head units so adding this would be easy to implement. I've been wanting to see this for a while, car manufactures make gps systems that rarely if ever get updates and they have clunky interfaces. I could see OEM's adding this to cars from the factory too, why invest millions in making your own interface when you can use apple instead?