This movie passed 3 of 3 tests. It was entered by NessieNos on 2013-12-06 19:17:20.

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NessieNos said:

The only significant female character in the film is an elf invented for the movie. She's a pretty major character, but she only speaks to her male love interests and father figure. There are only a few other female characters in the film: a gossipy fishwife and a couple of little girls. None of them talk to each other.

Possibly worth noting: A lot of people are going to say this isn't an issue at all because JRR Tolkien's <I>Hobbit</I> doesn't have any significant female characters. But half of this movie doesn't come from Tolkien, and several major plotlines and characters were invented to give the film more romance, drama, and battle scenes, so "There aren't any conversations between women in the original" is no excuse.

Message posted on 2013-12-06 19:17:20

James said:

Well, you get no argument from me that the movie is a face down fail. But I still think that is something that should be taken up with Tolkien and not Peter Jackson or Fran Walsh.

For this movie to pass the test even more drastic changes would need to be made to the story. Such as inventing another additional character or changing the gender of an established one.

Tauriel also qualifies as a bad ass that is also the object of affection of two men. She wasn't exactly an ornamental character.

Message posted on 2013-12-24 08:05:18

claudia said:

I can't be positive without rewatching, but I really thought the two little girls talked to each other, and the elf talked to the older girl.

Possibly only about men (their father or the sick dwarf)... but didn't they?

Message posted on 2014-01-03 05:02:22

Don said:

I disagree with James. What exactly would make it so unbelievable to simply put in a female into a male character? There's really no reason why a _fantasy_ story can't have female warriors, etc.

Message posted on 2014-01-07 09:45:43

Kat said:

The daughters are both named and they do speak to each other (albeit briefly) and to Tauriel.

Message posted on 2014-01-10 16:47:56

Nyssa said:

A very brief exchange between the two daughters of Bard, Sigrid and Tilda, asking

Why is there dwarves coming out of our toilet
And if it was good luck.

But I think this is the only conversation

Message posted on 2014-01-11 11:00:38

polaria said:

I would like to say that this film fails because the female elf invented just for this film was failure in so many ways... But honestly, the named daughters of Bard do speak to each other and Tauriel.

Message posted on 2014-01-24 20:45:33

Beth said:

I disagree with the "Take it up with Tolkien" idea.
Yes, his books had few female characters, but it is not as if they are the only books in the world that could be adapted.
We exist in a time when people are aware of the Bechdel test, choosing to adapt (nearly) all-male is on those who adapt them.

Message posted on 2014-01-24 21:55:12

James said:

Don, just to be clear I am not saying that it would be "unrealistic" for there to be female warriors etc in a movie like this. The book had no such characters so their addition in the form of gender swaps would be a bigger knock to the canon than the addition of Tauriel.

This movie failing the test is something we should blame Tolkien for more than Peter Jackson.

Message posted on 2014-01-25 03:14:23

celedra said:

Sigrid and Tilda are indeed named, though whether they talk about things other than men is beyond my recall (even though I've seen the film at least six times oops).

To NessieNos - actually, the side-plot of Dol Guldor/the Necromancer comes from the Appendices to the Lord of the Rings books, so to say it didn't come Tolkien is a misunderstanding.

Message posted on 2014-01-26 21:24:14

isabella said:

The females doesn't talk about something besides a man.

Message posted on 2014-01-30 09:52:41

Bekah said:

I always thought they should have made one or more of the thirteen dwarves turn out to be female. After all, it is canonically hard for non-dwarves to tell the genders apart (both have beards), and the book is told from Bilbo's point of view. I'm sure the fanboys would have rioted, though.

Message posted on 2014-04-08 19:22:30

Todd said:

The named daughter says to the named female elf, "you killed them all."

Message posted on 2014-09-20 22:06:39

Merry said:

I don't disagree with the rating! However, I admit to having felt disproportionately happy during the scene in Bard's house where Tauriel, Tilda and Sigrid are present and Sigrid shouts for Tilda to help her; and I thought "YES! Closest one of the Middle-Earth films has gotten to passing Bechdel yet!"

Message posted on 2014-11-24 13:45:45

neil (webmaster) said:

I've updated the rating from 1/3 to 3/3.

Message posted on 2014-11-24 17:05:21

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