Sunday, November 23, 2008

Dave's post appears to largely lament the lack of progress in the C implementations, be it their lack of performance, presence of memory leaks, or relatively primitive GC implementations. He briefly mentions alternative implementations, calling Rubinius "the light and hope of the Rubyverse" and summarizing JRuby as "great" before dismissing both.

In Rubinius's case, he may have a point. There have been many setbacks, and after a year of funding six developers it's still not really usable for real apps. The sad news that their team has been cut to two paid developers certainly doesn't help. Most will agree that the Rubinius ideal, that of Ruby implemented in Ruby, is a great goal...perhaps the highest ideal for a Ruby implementation. But in practice, it's turned out to be a lot harder to execute...and impossible to execute in a year with six smart hackers.

Update: My intent here seems to have been missed. I am not in any way claiming "Rubinius sucks", because Rubinius isn't even finished yet. I would not make such a claim about any incomplete project. I mention Rubinius only because Dave dismissed both in the same breath; to address one case I felt I needed to address the other. Rubinius will succeed...of that I have no doubt. And already it has proven many things possible nobody ever expected to see. It's unknown how long it will take to "get there" but it will "get there" eventually, and be a major contender for replacing the standard impls. Dave's use of Rubinius to help prove a lack of momentum is almost as questionable as his out-of-hand dismissal of JRuby. We've started to attempt an integration of Rubinius's kernel into JRuby, and we've added Rubinius's FFI and MVM APIs because they were very well-designed. We continue to contribute to the RubySpecs, and I eagerly offer any technical help I can whenever the Rubinius team has questions about how JRuby solves certain problems. What more good things do you want me to say about Rubinius?

However when we look at JRuby, Dave is entirely wrong to dismiss it in a single sentence. JRuby *is* what he wants, in almost every way.

JRuby runs on the best available dynamic language VM, Hotspot. Hotspot has its roots in the Smalltalk world Rubyists hold in such high esteem, and real steps are being taken to make it even better than before for dynamic languages. The end result will be trivially inlinable dynamic calls nearly as fast as static Java code, which no other VM in the world can claim.

JRuby does not have GC headaches and memory leaks like the C impls because we use the existing GC options on Hotspot...which are, again, some of the best GC implementations in the world. It's folly to say that an implementation from scratch is going to be able to compete with JRuby on JVM, because the simple truth is that making a world-class VM and/or GC is super dooper hard.

Even where JRuby still stumbles a bit, like the classic JVM problem areas of memory use and startup time, we've made huge strides. JRuby starts up no slower than Rubinius at its fastest...in many cases under a second. And memory-wise, we pay little cost beyond the JVM's own 20-30MB memory tax, while still working to reduce our overall consumption with every release.

JRuby is also moving faster than any implementation available. A year ago, we were generally a bit slower than Ruby 1.8.6; this year, we're faster in most cases than Ruby 1.9. A year ago, there were a handful of early-adopting production users; this year, dozens of them, ranging from small orgs and agile projects to governments, banks, and telecom. There's no lack of momentum when it comes to JRuby.

To top all this off, there's still dozens of folks working to make Hotspot even faster, it's GCs even smarter, and we just come along for the ride. Yes, we've done a lot because we haven't implemented our own VM specifically for Ruby. But that's exactly the point...we've been able to focus on areas that matter most, like actually running apps and running them as fast as possible.

The bottom line, as far as I can see it, is that if the C impls of aren't moving fast enough, and the "light of the Rubyverse" is hitting a few roadblocks, you damn well better give JRuby more consideration than one sentence. I certainly hope this wasn't a reflection of any continuing anti-Java bigotry in the Ruby world, since as I've mentioned previously that attitude will only make things worse. If it reflects simple ignorance as to why JRuby really will be a better Ruby, then we're not doing a good enough job educating...help us do better.

JRuby is continuing to do things no other Ruby has been able to do. We've cracked the Enterprise glass ceiling, with numerous deployments inside some of the most rigidly Java-centric and intransigent organizations around. We've shown it's possible for Ruby to perform extremely well, and we've only scratched the surface of Hotspot's potential. We've implemented most of Ruby 1.9's features in just a few months, where other implementations have barely gotten 1.8 working. And we're just getting started...we have plans upon plans to continue improving compatibility, performance, scaling, and ease-of-use, and the various folks working on the JVM will continue making it a better and better host for dynamic languages. If you haven't used JRuby yet, you're really missing out. It's time to give it a try.

(Footnote: Don't take this as a shot at any of the other impls; it's obvious JRuby had a big head start, and we've been funded longer (albeit less) than most of them. This post is squarely focused on anyone like Dave that thinks if the C impls don't solve all Ruby's implementation woes, Ruby is doomed. The truth is that Ruby will survive despite any lingering issues in the C impls, and JRuby is a crucial part of that survival.)