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The Politics of Occupy Wall Street, One Month In

Monday, October 17, 2011

Occupy Wall Street demonstrators face off with police after the deadline for their removal from Zuccotti park was postponed on Oct. 14, 2011.
(Spencer Platt/Getty Images/Getty)

Welcome to Politics Bites, where every afternoon at It's A Free Country, we bring you the unmissable quotes from the morning's political conversations on WNYC. Today on the Brian Lehrer Show, Slate political reporter Dave Weigel discussed what impact the month-old Occupy Wall Street action is having on the political debate.

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Disappointed with Obama?

When it comes to roller coaster rides on Wall Street, the New York Stock Exchange used to be the only game in town. For the last month, however, Occupy Wall Street protests have taken the spotlight off of turbulent markets and on to the public square, where the "99 percent" have camped out since mid-September.

Why have they stayed so long, and what would it take to make them leave? That's sort of the overarching complaint about these protests: To many on the outside, they appear to have no end in sight, no logical political conclusion—electoral or legislative—that could fix what protesters think is wrong with the country.

Dave Weigel said that perception is mostly accurate. The protesters in general—whom he describes as the "post-Obama Left"—have given up thinking they can get what they want through traditional political means.

You meet more people who voted for [Obama] really thinking it was their last-ditch attempt at using politics to get what they wanted...They saw this once-in-a-generation chance to really change America and they think it's gone, so they're being realistic about what they can do now...They've moved on from thinking they can get anything done in Washington.

Defining the income inequality problem

Whether or not Occupy Wall Street influences elections or legislation in the immediate future, there are signs that they've sparked a new national conversation about income inequality. Dave Weigel cited polling that showed a majority of Americans agreeing with protesters' complaints about wealth distribution.

That Occupy Wall Street has got Americans talking about income inequality is no small feat, Weigel said, especially in a climate where it's easier to characterize such discussions as "anti-Capitalist" or "anti-American" than to consider the arguments.

The movement's been pretty successful so far in saying the question is, why has inequality been rising so much over last 10 years? Why are CEOs being paid so much?...What this movement is trying to do is define the problem, and to explain inequality, which most people don't really want to understand.

Another reason it's less political

Though Occupy Wall Street is largely a left-wing movement, it's not simply the negative image of the Tea Party.

The Tea Party has enjoyed tremendous success influencing elections and steering the national conversation toward spending cuts and smaller government. They've enjoyed clear political success, not least because they have a clear political target in Barack Obama.

Occupy Wall Street, on the other hand, does not have a clear political target; the near-entire political establishment is their target. Dave Weigel said that's eventually going to implicate some heroes of the Left.

It's less political because some of the villains that will get exposed in this process are going to be Democrats, people like Bill Clinton, Robert Rubin, Barney Frank.

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Stephen Reader covers politics for It's a Free Country, WNYC's interactive politics site. He joined the station in 2010 and has also worked for Studio 360, WNYC's Peabody Award-winning show about art, culture, and creativity.

Comments [57]

anna22
from new york

"Yesterday there was a guy with a small sukkah there. He was friendly. Passers-by were stopping to talk with him. Nobody bothered him."This is charming. Something to be proud of? You seem to be proud of the fact that no Nazi chanting and antisemitic attacks took place at that moment. Nice. Bravo.

I want to formally apologize for any inflammatory comments I've made on this thread. To an extent, I would agree with some of the commenters here that seem to have confused OWS with some kind of anti-semetic conspiracy.

The OWS movement is a public display. It is held in public places. It attracts all types voicing a very wide range of opinions. However, it is beyond a stretch to surmise that the OWS movement is fomenting anti-semitisim of ANY kind. There simply is NO evidence that a goal of this movement is to discriminate against any group. On the other hand if some nut or group of nuts show up to this public gathering espousing hate of any kind, they should be expelled and denounced immediately. There should be no tolerance for this despicable rhetoric at any point. In the meantime, my hope is that the conversation stay on point.

"What kind of nation is it that spends far more to kill enemy combatants and Afghan and Iraqi civilians than it does to help its own citizens who live below the poverty line? What kind of nation is it that permits corporations to hold sick children hostage while their parents frantically bankrupt themselves to save their sons and daughters? What kind of nation is it that tosses its mentally ill onto urban heating grates? What kind of nation is it that abandons its unemployed while it loots its treasury on behalf of speculators? What kind of nation is it that ignores due process to torture and assassinate its own citizens? What kind of nation is it that refuses to halt the destruction of the ecosystem by the fossil fuel industry, dooming our children and our children’s children?"

It's usually the case that new cultures among immigrants are initially rejected by resident americans. After an adjustment period, the new culture is generally accepted, and the hate speech and hate crimes agaisnt that culture is diminished.

Jews are perhaps the most assimilated ethnic group in the US. Yet according to the US human rights commission, 80% of the hate crimes are agaisnt jews. Only 7% against Muslims.

To those who minimize the anti jewish and anti zionist (really one in the same) utterances of a significant minority of the OWS crowd, I will stop complaining about racism against my people when the attacks against us is as low as the attacks agaisnt Muslims!

One mispoken word by a person of note in relation to black people gets that person fired and condemned by the media. yet violence and clear hate speech against jews gets no media attention, and is minimized by supposed civil libertarian liberals on this blog.

Do you want to become a Publius’ Forum Pundit?Please read the following rules carefully and then feel free to send us your latest Op Ed.1). If you want blind Liberal sentiment, go check out the New York Times, ABC or the Clinton News Network (CNN), NOT HERE. This is a site for Conservative, Republican, Libertarian or classical American ideas…The rest of the web is filled with Liberal heresy so NO Liberal content will be posted on this site unless I am making an example of how particularly stupid a piece is(now, I mean liberal in the late 20th century American political sense, not classic liberalism such as that proposed by men such as John Locke and Thomas Jefferson, etc.). It’s my site and I can do with it what I will. I am the benevolent dictator of PUBLIUS’ FORUM.2). No copyrighted material unless you are the copyright owner. Write the piece yourself. This forum is for YOU to let the rest of us know what is on your mind. Certainly, you may use quotes from other writers but it must be noted somehow. (either by footnotes or within the body text)3). No overtly sexual content. Sexual references will be fine as long as it leads to a legitimate point. This is NOT a porn site!!!!4). No racist tripe will be tolerated. We are all created equal under the constitution, regardless what the relationship between the races was when the document was originated and adopted.5). No white supremacist content will be accepted. PERIOD. You’ll have to try somewhere else, Adolf.6). Foul language is allowed but not just for the sake of foul language. Again, it must be germane to the point you are trying to make. If all you want to do is curse, to hell with you.7). All links will be tested by me, Publius, before posting to be sure that it does not go somewhere I do not like. See rules above for an idea of what that might be.8). I reserve the right to change any rule at any time. I can also add more rules, so check back every once and a while. I AM KING HERE! It’s good to be King.9). Finally, no one gets paid for posting on this site. This is a FREE public forum.THATS IT, FOLKS. ENJOY THE EXPERIENCE.

QUOTEDearest gary from QUEENS -You can formulate an actual thought!Not that we don't appreciate your regurgitation of other peoples' ideas by posting the excerpts of random articles. At least their attributed.QUOTE

ANSWER:

Yes dboy. I can and have formulated my own thoughts. Here are 2 recently published articles I wrote. Let me know if you want to read more:

A Tutorial on Economics for Liberalshttp://www.publiusforum.com/2011/08/20/a-tutorial-on-economics-for-liberals/

"Critical discussion of Israel's repressive regime, abuse of innocent people and the USA's non-sensical support of this tyranny is NOT anti-semetic. And, is a disservice to Judaism to not have the capacity to discern the two."dboy, why don't you leave discussion of antisemitism to me. If you are interested in repressive regimes, you have such a choice. There are some 200 countries in the world. In many of them humans are boiled, cooked and fried, children are sent to armies, brothels or become slaves, women are killed for being raped, etc., etc. etc. But you seem to be interested in Israel and Israel only.Hmmmm

one example for gary: "A George Soros funded economist taught a course to the Occupy Wall Street protesters... " -- using this to say that Soros is funding OWS is on its face... totally lame. In fact, Soros is smart enough to know that his money would only taint this movement, and thus he has stayed out of it. fact.

Yes, April and the like, insurance sector isn't the problem, military-industrial complex isn't the problem, oil business isn't the problem, lack of universal health care isn't a problem and most importantly lack of any protection of employees isn't the problem, only Wall Street. Sure.Speaking of manipulation, distraction and brainwashing ....

"It isn't the greed of individuals that is at issue. It is the basic nature of the organizations they work for (and believe in). They are by mandate driven by greed rather than concern for the good of the whole."Joanne, and which organizations in America have a better nature? Warning, my background in this country is in high end non-profit sector (and purely academic somewhere else) and I'll respond competently.Don't you think that the problem is somewhere else - structural?

Meanwhile, no liberal has been able to claim Andy Breitbart's substantial reward to prove that ONE tea party protester acted out of hate for any race or ethnic group.

INDEED, 70% of the polled who identify themselves as tea party say they support Herman Caine. A BLACK man!

Despite all this, Democrats like dboy and Pellossi et al get away with the liberal media by slandering the tea party as racist. Have you heard the celebs say that? Sean Penn and Morgan Freeman. real DUMDUMS.

Critical discussion of Israel's repressive regime, abuse of innocent people and the USA's non-sensical support of this tyranny is NOT anti-semetic. And, is a disservice to Judaism to not have the capacity to discern the two.

"Could we keep the antisemitism issue separate? Somehow I doubt the thousands of demos world wide and the tens, hundreds, thousands at each are anti semitic. Ad busters didn't start this. It combusted on American soil. Lets' focus on the greed of finance on Wall Street"That's interesting. April, the reason you think you can dictate whether or not antisemitism should be discussed ... is?The reason you insist that the focus should be Wall Street .. is?I have no doubt that the focus on Wall Street is a DISTRACTION from real problems this country faces.Adbusters started this and most other protests. Speaking of the world, they were asked by Italian protesters, for example, to disappear. American left should do the same. We don't need neo-Nazi distractions.

Could we keep the antisemitism issue separate? Somehow I doubt the thousands of demos world wide and the tens, hundreds, thousands at each are anti semitic. Ad busters didn't start this. It combusted on American soil. Lets' focus on the greed of finance on Wall St, at the LSX, and around the world. And remember that, contrary to what Michael Moore said last week, there IS a difference between the two parties. Obama is trying hard to tax millionaires and corporations, why his Wall St donations are down. Give the guy some credit. We should have been demonstrating in DC two years ago, demanding Single Payer to get a Public Option. Like FDR, he said we had to make him do it. We didn't. Waited for The One to do it for us, against obdurate opposition from before his inauguration. We should go down and support him now, in front of congress, asking them to pass the Jobs bill with tax increases on the wealthy and corporations.

It would also be nice to see coverage of Southern demos. Ten or so in my home state, NC, alone, including at B of A in Charlotte. Go to Occupy Together for a full list of where they are world and country wide.

"You know you folks stirring up this anti-semitism idea in OWS are the kinda people who diminish the real and serious meaning of anti-semitism." Oh really, Robert. Gary is right. The organizers are known antisemites and the presence of antisemitism is palpable. I myself was there twice (by chance the first time in the second hour of protests - yes, on Sept. 17) The second time, I noticed several antisemitic signs and asked idiotic prominent American Jewish progressive intellectuals standing next to the most offensive sign to deal with antisemitism.Last week, I listened to one of the activists who said that they now ask "antisemitic loonies" (his words) to leave. dr anna (a masters degree in Jewish history, focus on antisemitism)

Face it, OWS is more of a "Free Country" than even 'Its a Free Country'(tm)(sm)(R). With it comes all types. I am 100% Sure that if I go I will meet more "crusties" than considered academics because that's just what the country IS.The point is that you have to do your homework and not let, I don't know, Glenn Beck, do it for you.Filed mainly to offset the naysayers. -ja

OK, How am I reaching? Can you form an argument? Or do you just know how to rant, like your buddies at the illegal "occupation"?

Just IMAGINE if ONE tea party was actually caught spitting on those black Congressmembers who DELIBERATELY provoked it by walking through the tea party crowd, as opposed to their usual route through the tunnel.

You know you folks stirring up this anti-semitism idea in OWS are the kinda people who diminish the real and serious meaning of anti-semitism. There are always an element of anti-semites and racists and anti this and thats in protest movements--look at what happened in Rome over the weekend. A minority violent group got the attention away from the majority peaceful group. So to say this is an anti-semitic movement is wrong. You sound like FOX news. There was no anti-semitism at the start of this; it had/has nothing to do with OWS!

Regarding the caller who offered that 'Who Controls the Media' doc, mentioning that it was produced by National Vanguard: Just so everyone knows, that's a group associated with white supremacists/separatists.

I can't believe you'd agree that the media is a more a reflection than a determinant. As long as it's a business, it will find that which is most entertaining, not that which is most important, for the public to know. Therefore, it may reflect our interest in being constantly entertained, but not necessarily doing their job to inform us and present facts or balanced views.

The things "Occupy Wall Street" take effort to identify because everyone states it differently. The bottom line for everyone, though, is an end to the culture of greed that runs our world, and that all our institutions have been built around. When you think about it, nothing less will actually do.

In that way it's the exact same complaint as voiced by the 60's "counter culture" that identified the their target as "the system" and why "don't trust anyone over 30" made complete sense at that moment in time. I'm now a systems scientist who can identify the specific procedures of that pervasive culture of greed, that you'd need to trace to locate where it is and see what would need to change.

A variety of my Tweets directly address it too. The central feature of the world culture of greed is the popular expectation that finance should provide forever multiplying ownership of the earth's talents and resources, for no other service than some owner having saved some money in the past. That's the actual main job of "Wall Street".

The problem is somewhat less the pure madness of the value system that represents. The structural problem is that it naturally overwhelms the entire society that (madly) attempts to support and sustain it.

It isn't the greed of individuals that is at issue. It is the basic nature of the organizations they work for (and believe in). They are by mandate driven by greed rather than concern for the good of the whole.

A British paper informs us that Bard College students are gracing the Occupy Wall Street throngs in New York, playing hookey on their $57,000 a year classes. Or are they? I suspect they're apple-polishing for extra credit. Last year, that towering intellectual, Bard's Leon Botstein became the first college president to welcome the International Solidarity Movement (ISM) as an official campus organization.

Attention Bard parents, who thought you were shelling out a fortune to put a little artsy sheen on your precious darlings! Actually, you were thrusting them into the hands of the ISM, a terrorist-enabling group awarded a gold medal by Hamas for all their lovely help.

President Botstein now explicitly funnels campus funds and resources to ISM, which trains students on Bard's idyllic grounds to take "direct action" against Israel. "The training was led by 3 Bard students. 14 trainees were present," notes Bard's ISM website. "Many were headed for December's Gaza Freedom March to break the Israeli siege of Gaza."

Those eager, painfully naive Bard students smelling up the streets of New York aren't being transgressive! They're trying to be virtuous like their hero, student activist Rachel Corrie, who was ferreted to her death in Gaza by the very same ISM. After all, "direct action" is what all those lavishly credentialed grown-ups keep telling them to do.

In case you're worried about Leon Botstein's paying a price for his outrageous antics, let me assure you that destroying young people's souls is lucrative work. George Soros -- imagine that! -- just donated $60 million to Bard College for international work under the aegis of the brand-new Bard College Center for Civic Engagement.

These callers are terrifying - total ignorance, total absence of understanding, total brainwashing.Yes, the caller, the problem is this small group. Sure. Ever heard about systemic problems, ever heard exploitation? Yes, it's a rhetorical question. BTW, it would be nice if callers present themselves and name the number of people THEY have abused and exploited. It's time for justice.

I am one of the 99%. I am in full support of the Occupy Movement, but am discouraged by its lack of an organized message or being hijacked by the larger Democrat Party. The Occupy Movement needs to focus on creating change for ALL of the 99 by getting true representatives of the people elected to Congress and the Presidency. Rally for intellectuals and business professionals from all walks of life to run for Congress and commit to ONE term: within that term they should focus on Amendments that change term limits, campaign finance reform; and create real regulations on lobbyists. That is how the people will regain their power.

A survey of Occupy Wall Street protesters, done by the liberal magazine New York, shows that more than one-third – 34 percent – are convinced the United States government is no better than al-Qaeda. (When I sent that figure to a liberal academic acquaintance of mine, he responded, “Not a very big n[umber].” And perhaps that’s true if you were polling the liberal arts faculty of a university.) Another 37 percent say capitalism can’t be saved; it’s inherently immoral. And when asked to explain how they would fix Wall Street, New York magazine received the following responses: “A maximum-wage law.” “President Elizabeth Warren.” And “Burn it down.”

This is the movement to which the Democratic Party – from Barack Obama and Joe Biden to Nancy Pelosi and Debbie Wasserman Schultz – wants to tether itself?

I think this movement is what Obama has been waiting for, and even what Obama had hoped for back when he was just a candidate. But he can't embrace it totally until it proves that it isn't going to unravel into something messy that could lose him this election. I also believe that if he WERE to embrace it now, it would put the movement in danger from agents who would strive to ruin it -- remember the Haymarket Affair. It wasn't the protesters who attacked the police in that incident, but rather, people who wanted to make the protesters look bad.

So, I think Obama is hoping that the movement will continue, and give him a mandate upon election to do all the things he couldn't do, say, using nuclear options, in his first term. No president can do everything in his first term, because of all that can be undone if he doesn't make it to a second term.

As Abe wrote earlier this week, anti-Semitic incidents have been a dark trend at the Occupy Wall Street protests. The Emergency Committee for Israel highlights several of the assaults in its latest web video, and combined with the haunting music and approving quotes from Democrats it makes for a very powerful and disturbing message: [video]

ECI is calling on politicians who have supported the protests, like President Obama and Rep. Nancy Pelosi, to condemn the displays of anti-Semitism.

“It’s not surprising that elements of the modern left are anti-Semitic,” said ECI chairman William Kristol in a statement. “It is surprising that respectable liberals have praised the protesters while ignoring the anti-Semitism. Liberals have pretended to see nothing hateful and hear nothing hateful, and therefore have said nothing to rebuke their allies. Will they now speak up?”

Why do the majority of Americans vote against their own interest? Do they identify with financially succesful politicians they have nothing in common with because they delusionally believe that they will be rich one day? Do they truly believe that those who are not rich are lazy and did'nt work hard enough? Do they believe that the rich deserve to be rich because they are smarter? I would like to explore this topic from a in depth.

It's also time to take the protest to Washington DC. I bet there would be huge crowds. There should be a serious march on the capital and an OWS Lobby should be set up and get into the halls of congress and get in the face of these folks and let them know what they're doing wrong and why.Bring back the Glass Stiegel [sp?] Act that Bill Clinton and the behest of Phil Graham (that scum) dissolved.

It isn’t just a few crackpots engaging in anti-Semitism incidents at the Occupy Wall Street protests. Apparently, the main organizer behind the movement – Adbusters editor Kalle Lasn – has a history of anti-Jewish writing.

Back in 2004, he wrote a highly controversial Adbusters article entitled “Why Won’t Anyone Say They Are Jewish?” which peddled some of the more feverish theories about American Jews, neoconservatism, and the Bush administration (emphasis added):

Adbusters, the anti-consumerist, Canada-based magazine which reportedly sparked the protest movement, has been accused of anti-Semitism in the past, most recently for comparing the situation of the Palestinians in Gaza to the plight of the Jews held in the Warsaw Ghetto during World War II. This resulted in Jewish groups publicly boycotting the magazine.

Gotta love Eric Cantor whining about people pitting Americans against Americans. Of course, _no_ conservative ever called progressives or liberals "un-American" or "anti-American." Herman Cain never did that. Newt Gingrich never did. Not Boehner or McConnell or Palin or Bachmann. And certainly never Eric Cantor.

David Brooks wrote in his Monday New York Times column about a possible connection between anti-Semitic sentiment and the movement due to its progenitor. “Take the Occupy Wall Street movement. This uprising was sparked by the magazine Adbusters, previously best known for the 2004 essay, ‘Why Won’t Anyone Say They Are Jewish?’ — an investigative report that identified some of the most influential Jews in America and their nefarious grip on policy,” he wrote.

A quick sampling of the anti-Semitism on display among the Occupy Wall Street set yields the flamboyant and aggressive protester who yells,“You’re a bum, Jew” at his yarmulke-wearing interlocutor; the conspiracy theorist who laments that “Jewish money controls American politics,” and warns the Russians not to let the Jews take over Russia too; and the self-described Nazi with the swastika tattoo who regrets that America has been handed over to “other people.” Ah, people power.

The Jew-hatred among protesters and sympathizers is diverse and unapologetic. It is, in fact, atmospheric. Tune in randomly to live television coverage of the spectacle and you’ll see—as I did—placards scapegoating Israel, Zionism, or “Hitler’s bankers.” Check out the continuous flurry of protest-supporting tweets and blog posts, and you’ll get more of the same.

Does anyone recall how hard the media worked to portray the Tea Party as bigoted? The false accusations of racial slurs, the cropped photograph of the gun-wielding Tea Partier—who turned out to be black, the tortured racial interpretation of the Tea Party’s desire to “take the country back”?

Despite the press’s efforts there would be no denying that in the 2010 midterm elections the Tea Party supported a multi-ethnic set of candidates straight out of a Benetton ad. And while Occupy Wall Street enumerates classic anti-Semitic conspiracy theories in the name of progressivism, Herman Cain has become a Tea Party favorite, beating Mitt Romney by 41 percent to 7 among the movement’s supporters.

And shocking that the MSM is silent on it. it's not "anti zionism" stuff. It's anti jewish hate speech. This is what the Democrats falsely, and without evidence, attributed to the tea party. (Andrew breitbart's reward for any evidence is still unclaimed.) And the MSM had no problem making those false allegations headline news. The supposed tea party republican racists have made Herman Cain leading in their polls now!

watch this video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3Y9CARUwio&feature=player_embedded#!

I believe this movement is scaring even the news media. Even PBS, which did not cover the story Friday night in an actual segment, but as a "footnote". The issue is corporate influence in our politics, in our media and this is what is driving people's anger. Brian, I am barely hanging on to NPR right now. The derisive , condescending coverage really has to end. Thank you.

Do you really think they're paying a lot of attention? Well if so they're not doing anything about it.The president is a talker not a walker. (I don't believe I used that phrase but it states how I feel that all will understand.) It's time for Oh bummer to get out. He should not run again. He's a loser. He failed. This is the presidency and unlike in school you can't retake the course, it's too serious a position for that.Dump Obama!

You can tell more about Obama by the anti zionists in the administration.

And you can tell a lot about the Occupation wall st crowd by those who announced their full support for them, such as the American Nazi Party, the Communist party of the USA, The anti western, anti american, Iranian terrorist sponsoring regime.

Besides accepting funding from the controversial billionaire, Stiglitz has engaged in numerous projects with Soros and sits on the boards of multiple Soros organizations, including one openly seeking to remake the world’s economy.

Stiglitz is a leading proponent of more government regulation of the economy.

He previously chaired the Commission on Global Financial Issues of Socialists International, the world’s largest socialist organization.

Why has no one mentioned the Star Ledger article last week which disclosed that a separate group meets at a nearby park. The group appears to be planning the actions that result in arrests, but it's meetings are closed.

If we are being lied to about the General Assembly of the OWS being in charge, how can we trust them about ANYTHING?

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