If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

Part 1:
Disgusting. When people spoke in tongues in the Bible, it actually served a purpose; those speaking were actually understood by people of other languages. It was not meant to be people spilling nonsense from their mouths. 1 Corinthians 14:9-10 says, "So it is with you. Unless you speak intelligible words with your tongue, how will anyone know what you are saying? You will just be speaking into the air. Undoubtedly there are all sorts of languages in the world, yet none of them is without meaning." Verse 22 goes on to says that speaking in tongues is pointless among believers: "Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers; prophecy, however, is for believers, not for unbelievers." What these people are doing is absolutely ridiculous.

"What luck for rulers that men do not think." ~Adolf Hitler"you are gay furthermore you like sex with men" ~god

Only if you expand your definition of "justifiable" to include allowing parents and church members to inflict brainwashing and emotional trauma on small children, and since we live in a society where children are taken from their parents and put in social services for years because their parents with their doctor's support took their kids off ADD medication, I think it's safe to say it is entirely NOT justifiable and these people belong in some sort of rehab.

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

When I ask my kid "What did you do in school today?" and s/he replies "I learnt about God," then I will give them a copy of the God Delusion and let them work it out for themselves. Until then I will say and do nothing to persuade them in either direction. And woe betide the teacher who tells my kids to ignore Richard Dawkins.

You guys seriously seem to think that learning about God at a younger age makes more people stick with what they've been taught as they get older. I'm sure for some this is true, but coming from a Christian school, I've seen plenty of kids for whom it has been very far from that. A lot of kids abandon what they "believed" as they got older, if they ever believed it at all.

"What luck for rulers that men do not think." ~Adolf Hitler"you are gay furthermore you like sex with men" ~god

I had a christian education, and I believe that is why I am so fucked up.

I was taught the christian's theory of evolution. That the firmament broke when god commanded it to and sent a pillar of water into the atmosphere that went so far into space that it froze. When it descended it not only created the great flood, but also brought with it the ice age. How Jonah in the belly of a whale explains dinosaurs. I could go on, but what's the point?

I started questioning the bible when I was about maybe 10, I stopped believing around 12.

I really don't see any point in teaching a completely unrealistic view point to a child who is impressionable. To any rational person, creationism is completely illogical. The end. Full stop. That is all. Let's move on.

When my son begins having questions about god, I will introduce him to the bible. I accept it as a foregone conclusion that he will one day have those type of questions. I expect he will laugh the answers off as I did. If he doesn't I will accept him as he is, even as I would accept if he decided to be gay, or listen to pop music, or any other horrid thing you can think of, because I love him unconditionally.

"Mom! I wanna be on the pep team!"
"Mom! Britney Spears is my favvy!"
"Mom, Jesus died for my sins."

Each statement a little more ridiculous than the last, and I may lose all respect for him, but I will still love him.

I find it impossible to respect someone so naive.

PS:

Don't try to 'save' me. My dad was a preacher, and if he couldn't I know you can't.

I wouldn't be too worried if after reading The God Delusion and comparing it with what s/he has been told about God my kid still believes. At least they'll have had the chance to make an informed decision. Although telling your kid you don't follow their beliefs is probably not a fun experience...

Thus you have proved my point. But first of all, I don't care whether anyone believes in evolution or creationism; I don't believe that is essential to salvation. Secondly, why is Jesus' death on the cross so ludicrous to you?

"What luck for rulers that men do not think." ~Adolf Hitler"you are gay furthermore you like sex with men" ~god

There probably was some prophet known as Jesus who was crucified for teaching his belief. He was probably a very great man, loved by many, and he had a great message, one that is easy to believe in.

Do I believe he was the son of god born of a woman touched by no man? No. I think Mary was probably very clever in her fornication and claimed to have been visited by an angel. Joseph was either the father, or loved her enough to go along with it. They were outcast from their village for their hubris and went to have their little bastard elsewhere.

Jesus was probably steeped in the idea that he was holy from birth, because after you tell such a ridiculous lie it is impossible to backtrack without looking like an idiot. So Jesus went and spoke to the masses, and taught them the way of peace and died for it.

You guys seriously seem to think that learning about God at a younger age makes more people stick with what they've been taught as they get older. I'm sure for some this is true, but coming from a Christian school, I've seen plenty of kids for whom it has been very far from that. A lot of kids abandon what they "believed" as they got older, if they ever believed it at all.

I had a Christian education but luckily, for me my dad taught me how messed up Christianity and other regions can be. The only reason I probably accepted Christianity because I was a child and was taught I didnít know anything about life. As I grew older, I started to question my Faith in about 6th Grade. I pretty much learned from Experience and Observation. I saw these people praying for Happiness everyday and yet nothing happen. They still had nothing. Yet they were so worried about where they would go when they die they couldnít focus on nothing else. I told myself to live the life I have now and worry about the afterlife (If there is any.) later.

*Both Made by Ph3nom*

With These Hands, I Can Take Life. With Our Body We Can Make Life. Doesnít That Make Us Godly.

My point that not everyone who is raised learning about God sticks with that.

Originally Posted by Hero

I had a Christian education but luckily, for me my dad taught me how messed up Christianity and other regions can be. The only reason I probably accepted Christianity because I was a child and was taught I didnít know anything about life. As I grew older, I started to question my Faith in about 6th Grade. I pretty much learned from Experience and Observation. I saw these people praying for Happiness everyday and yet nothing happen. They still had nothing. Yet they were so worried about where they would go when they die they couldnít focus on nothing else. I told myself to live the life I have now and worry about the afterlife (If there is any.) later.

And again. But in this case, you say you saw people praying for happiness. That's the first thing wrong; nowhere does the Bible guarantee happiness. Next you say they were too worried about where they were going that they couldn't focus on anything else. A- The Bible gives simple guidelines to know. Romans 10:9 says " If you confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart God raised Him from the dead you will be saved." B-Worry. Matthew 6:34 says, "So never worry about tomorrow, because tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Christians are supposed to be focused on now, because now is the time that Christians are supposed to act. You are judging by a very narrow view of things, I'm sorry to say.

"What luck for rulers that men do not think." ~Adolf Hitler"you are gay furthermore you like sex with men" ~god

My point that not everyone who is raised learning about God sticks with that.

And again. But in this case, you say you saw people praying for happiness. That's the first thing wrong; nowhere does the Bible guarantee happiness. Next you say they were too worried about where they were going that they couldn't focus on anything else. A- The Bible gives simple guidelines to know. Romans 10:9 says " If you confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart God raised Him from the dead you will be saved." B-Worry. Matthew 6:34 says, "So never worry about tomorrow, because tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Christians are supposed to be focused on now, because now is the time that Christians are supposed to act. You are judging by a very narrow view of things, I'm sorry to say.

I'm not judging by a very narrow view. The Bible calms God has done many things, which are, concerned Godly. Rising up from the died, turning water into wine or however it goes. If God doesnít guarantee happiness, why do they pray for it? You say Iím Judging by a narrow point of view but its all in the bible. Why place my faith in a Mass Murder and a Judgmental God. Why would anyone.

*Both Made by Ph3nom*

With These Hands, I Can Take Life. With Our Body We Can Make Life. Doesnít That Make Us Godly.