Sky still have Richie Porte, but beyond that I'm not sure who they have left to fill the super-domestique role. Wiggins out, Uran gone to QS... Cataldo and Deignan looked okay in the Giro but no idea if they'll be in the squad.

It's quite frustrating really, Wiggins could do such a brilliant job looking after Froome, he has the potential to cause absolute chaos with other leaders. It's a shame Sky can't sort their house out and get them working together. I wouldn't be suprised to see Wiggins at a team like Greenedge next year. I don't blame Wiggins though, I'm not sure I'd get on with Froome either.

There is fashionable view the Wiggins is the good guy and Froome is the source of all the problems but the reality seems more complex than that. Both are great riders and it's a shame they can't find a way to work together.

I've emailed Sky and given them the nod that I'm available, if need be. I'd be good for a couple of miles, I reckon... If they bring me on around the descent from Holme Moss or Woodhead Pass, then I haven't got too far to go to get back home either.

I think Wiggins is upset because he sees this as his last tour chance if, as he has said, he is going to return to track next year in build up to 2016 Olympics. Still surely better to be in the team just in case Froome crashes or cracks? Also surely final decision by Sky depends on warm up races? For me as a spectator ideal solution would be for Froome and Wiggins to race in different teams

He's taking it very well for a guy who's been completed shafted by his team.
The inference is clear - Froome will not have Wiggins in his team, so even if Porte and others crash or do badly in the Dauphine, they'll still be no place. Only if Froome himself gets injured would he be in.

I guess by going public - but appearing to accept the decision - he's hoping that pressure will be brought to bear by the sponsors.

I heard an interview with Froome last night in which he accused Wiggins of being mentally weak and having cracked on the occasion Froome appeared to attack the lead and tempororaily leave Wiggins behind (during Wiggins TdF win). Lovely.

Contador's conviction looking very harsh in light of the Roger's acquittal.

I don't doubt he was doping, probably out of comp and then transfusing blood. Still like the story that it was a tip-off by Bruyneel that led to his sample being sent to the only lab that could detect it. But in legal terms the conviction is unsafe.

> I heard an interview with Froome last night in which he accused Wiggins of being mentally weak and having cracked on the occasion Froome appeared to attack the lead and tempororaily leave Wiggins behind (during Wiggins TdF win). Lovely.

Do you have a link ? I hate trying to get the inferences in interviews through someone's possibly not impartial interpretation.

Well it puts the pressure on Froome to not fall off in the first , not get stuck behind crashes in the first week and so on and so forth.

All this stuff about him being a better GC rider is based on about 4km at the top of one hill. He didn't win the time trials that year and did lost some minutes earlier in the race due to carelessness. It's a risky decision on Sky's part as if he falls off, gets sick or so on their season will probably centre round Wiggins and the Vuelta..

> Well it puts the pressure on Froome to not fall off in the first , not get stuck behind crashes in the first week and so on and so forth.

> All this stuff about him being a better GC rider is based on about 4km at the top of one hill. He didn't win the time trials that year and did lost some minutes earlier in the race due to carelessness. It's a risky decision on Sky's part as if he falls off, gets sick or so on their season will probably centre round Wiggins and the Vuelta..

Also the velocast podcasts http://velocast.cc/ are well worth the money
"This week in cycling history" is fascinating - was listening last night to the stuff about Roche and Visentini in the 87 Giro. Makes Wiggins and Froome look like handbags at dawn !

Brailsford isn't interested in sentiment - DB / Sky / GB will be thinking > thanks Brad you won the tour for us once and your Olympic medals have helped secure funding for our wages and the BC 'project' / and all the sponsorship from Sky but your yesterdays man. Oh but one thing - we're looking a bit weak on the mens track squad now so we'd like you to get on the track for Rio and win a medal to get us loads more funding before you retire.

It's not unusual for an elite sportsperson to let there hair down after a long period of intensive training and deprivation - there needs to be release valve. Neither is it surprising that after a stellar year a persons performance dips the following season before refocusing on new goals.

There are multiple influences that make a sports person successful - I don't doubt that an improved BC set up helped Brad but I don't think you can put it purely down to DB.

> Without DB, Wiggins would have washed up years ago. He's a particularly self destructing character.

Out of interest, what were your opinions of Wiggins before he won the Tour? I only ask because it seems to be a particularly British trait to support someone until they win and then find every reason to knock them.

Things are pretty desperate when a national hero like Bradley Wiggins, first British winner of the Tour, one of the most successful Olympians, BBC Sportsman of the Year, honoured by the Queen, feted and admired throughout the land isn't at the start of a Tour de France in his own country.'

If Wiggins doesn't get a place (and part of me can't let go of the hope that he still does) I for one won't be supporting Froome. If that sounds like sour grapes then that is because it is.

I think Millar has it right. It's not that Wiggins isn't good enough, its that Froome is scared of some payback. I think its that Froome is scared that Bradley might actually be better than him which will overshadow his performance.

I'm actually quite pissed off about this. I'm coming from Canada to watch the start and I wanted to see Wiggins and to have that chance removed because of a decision by Chris Froome does not endear him to me.

My comment earlier about crowd reduction measures was only partially in jest. I think this decision will impact the level of interest in Britain.

> Things are pretty desperate when a national hero like Bradley Wiggins, first British winner of the Tour, one of the most successful Olympians, BBC Sportsman of the Year, honoured by the Queen, feted and admired throughout the land isn't at the start of a Tour de France in his own country.'

> E

Yes ,there is something not right about the whole situation.

And rather sad ,if it was going to be his last attempt at the Tour.

Could come back to bite Brailsford in the arse, if Froome hits trouble.

> If Wiggins doesn't get a place (and part of me can't let go of the hope that he still does) I for one won't be supporting Froome. If that sounds like sour grapes then that is because it is.

Ditto.

> I think Millar has it right. It's not that Wiggins isn't good enough, its that Froome is scared of some payback. I think its that Froome is scared that Bradley might actually be better than him which will overshadow his performance.

When I first read that I thought, nahhh, but actually you may have a point. If Wiggins stayed within a couple of minutes of Froome through the mountains as his team mate, he could take a significant chunk out of him in the final time trial and threaten his (assumeed) lead. Given The Mekon's behaviour in 2012, I wouldn't blame him.

In reply to kevin stephens:
Without being on the inside, no-ne can really know whether it is Froome or Wiggins who would be the cause of much ado in the team. Froome is the better GC rider no doubt, and he did what he did in the 2012 Tour to show he was but still supported Wiggins. Froome would've won that Tour and everyone knows it.
Last year it looked to me like a lot more unity in the team and they all rode great together demolishing the opposition. Perhaps that is a sign of Wiggins insidious affect??
Both are great cyclists and like all the top winners have an ego to match. The reality is Wiggins should've changed team but then I don't think he would have got the same deal or team support or results, whereas Froome has plenty Tour wins left in him.
As it stands they should've allowed Wiggins to ride and let him act in a responsible manner supporting Froome, but perhaps the rest of the team know he would've been a pain in the backside and they collectively decided they'd rather support Froome.
All conjecture but good cycling news that gets Sky in the news rightly or wrongly I doubt they care.

Unfortunately he gets things wrong from the start. It wasn't sky trying to bury the news or dismissing Wiggins form - sky have said absolutely nothing. Wiggins has done the talking - and to the BBC - and both facts are significant.

I still maintain the decision might not be a final as Wiggins claims - he's playing to the gallery and has ensured that pressure will be put on Froome. And very impressive by the former to make sure the latter come out as the selfish, egotistical, arrogant one!

But like most people I like wiggins, for all his faults, and just can't warm to Froome.

What I can't understand is why Frrome doesn't simply insist wiggins has to work early on - well before Porte and the other riders he can trust. That way he has an early warning of disloyalty.

More to the point - what's he worried about - Wiggins causing him to crash when no ones looking ?

Aargh! Why? Why would he have won it "and everybody knows it" when he lost over 2 minutes in TTs? How much time would he take in 2 or 3km at the top of a couple of climbs? Sprinters lose about a minute per km in the mountains - how much time would Wiggins have realistically have lost at the top of two climbs (one of which was flat for the last km)?

> More to the point - what's he worried about - Wiggins causing him to crash when no ones looking ?

He's worried about Wiggins working for him and staying within a couple of minutes of him throughout the tour then nicking it in the TT or at any time when Froome has a bad day like he did last year.
Which is what I'd do if I was Wiggins to make him pay for his stupid willy waving display on La Toussuire.

And lets face it GB who have stake in Sky will need Brad to save their bacon in Rio - funding being linked to medals and all that. As it stands the womens team MAY land a few but the mens track squad is looking weak. They'll be desperate for him to start focusing on the track to land a Gold in Brazil.

yep. given that Sky sponsor a team to build positive feelings about their brand they might be slightly regretting letting Froome loose. But as I said on our club's page - Brailsford won't give a stuff.

aye perhaps but to me Froome was coasting in that Tour and if out to win would've lost less time in the time trials, plus he kept Wiggins in it I'm sure you'd agree with that. All good fun debating though and really looking forward to this Tour.

Given his ability to focus on goals which inspire him, I kind of doubt he'd do anything he doesn't want to do. The concept of a team being able to "Tell" adult professionals what to do is just puzzling, particularly those with personalities, ambitions and talent.

> Even if Brailsford isn't interested in sentiment, why is that a disgrace - isn't it all meant to be about "winning" ?

Yes winning. But winning with style, grace and honour is even better.

Here's a quote from Vincente del Bosque - former manager of Real Madrid ( 2 league titles and 2 Champions Leagues) and Spain ( One European Championship and One world cup and who knows in Brazil….)

Before the last world cup final -

"On the day of the final I spoke to the players. I told them to think of themselves as the romantics of football facing the most important game of their lives. I was appealing to the romanticism that I think a lot of us carry since childhood. However much you professionalise football, however much money is involved, the important thing is to defend the nobility of football. I told them we aren't soldiers. We are not here to pick a fight. We are players, talented young people. We can play good football and achieve something collectively."

The same should apply to Team Sky.

The problem is Braislford comes from a business management background and sees things in B+W.
Hence all the talk of 'the numbers' - he recently referred to Froome as "a value added cyclist" - meaning the team had got more from him than they originally anticipated. But it's all so charmless and indicates someone who would be equally successful working for Heinz selling tins of beans and improving productivity. He's not naturally a man manger. He's an organiser - which is what he did for GB by bringing in other people with expertise.

Before Euro 2012 there was a big bust up between Madrid and Barca players. Real vitriol. But del Bosque took those in the national team to one side and managed to clear the air and bond the team with a common purpose.

If DB was a natural man manger - working with the shades of grey in all our characters he would have been able to sort team harmony out. But he sees the world in black and white.

In reply to AlisonSmiles: Well they pay the wages. If a boss tells a staff member to do something they generally do it.

Brad is a scholar of cycling history and is keen to leave a legacy - I'm sure if he had ridden for Froome people would have respected him hugely - adding to his legacy. And who knows he may have even got on the podium assuming Froome won so Brad could have still had a respectable 2nd or 3rd.

As far as I'm aware not many riders in the yellow jersey have acted as lead out men to one of their team mates on the last stage in Paris. Exactly what Brad did for Cav in 2012. Thats class.

In reply to Henry Iddon: Kind of laughing at the concept that a boss who tells a cyclist what to do would find that a particularly productive approach. What kind of a world that be, dictated to? Imagine that, eh? Potentially not the best way to get the best out of folk. I definitely don't always do what I'm told because sometimes my instinct and experience tells me to do otherwise, and my boss isn't dissimilar to theirs, he listens to reason.

I have a vast, huge amount of respect, and liking for both Brad and Froome, individuals who do their own thing as professionals looking to achieve their goals. There's a lot to admire with both.

> As far as I'm aware not many riders in the yellow jersey have acted as lead out men to one of their team mates on the last stage in Paris. Exactly what Brad did for Cav in 2012. Thats class.

agree completely - I think Wiggo would have played the perfect super-domestique role because he "gets it". And those shots from 2012 still give me goosebumps - seeing (I think) Liquigas desperately trying to get their bloke up to the front as Wiggo hammered it out. Class.

Which one ? Presumably dropping Whillans from the Everest expeds in the 70s rather than the Eiger in the 60s. Yes I can see the similarities between Whiilland and Wiggins, and even more between Bonners and Brailsford, but is Haston the Froome character who refuses to allow Whillans on the team? And would Whillans ever have offered to be no more than a super domestique.

But I could see Wiggins with a beer belly, punching foreigners and taking "practical fish keeping" as his reading material for the tour !

> He's worried about Wiggins working for him and staying within a couple of minutes of him throughout the tour then nicking it in the TT or at any time when Froome has a bad day like he did last year.

If wiggins could do his share of the work for Froome in the mountains and not lose more than a couple of minutes then a) he'd deserve to win and b) it would be utterly astounding

A more likely scenario would be that Froome loses time in the first week and wiggins demands protection or even to be team leader. I can't work out why more teams don't use two leaders to ensure other teams do more work.

> Which is what I'd do if I was Wiggins to make him pay for his stupid willy waving display on La Toussuire.

To be fair to Froome, it was pretty frustrating to have done all the work and still be expected to hang back just in case wiggo needed more nursing. Who knows, had Wiggins reacted better, would things have been differant now ?

I didn't really have an opinion on Wiggins pre 2012. I don't have anything against him now - but there are two (at least) sides to this story and all I can do is give my impressions from what he's said publicly. I haven't a clue what ultimatum he's given team Sky. Probably not unlike the one Froome gave inn 2011. Its down to the team management what they chose to do then. Presumably they thought they couldn't accomodate Wiggins' demands.

In reply to Enty:
Enty, you know more than enough about cycling to know that they only have to get to 3k and they'd get the same time as the group they were in, should they be involved in a crash. Could be seen as smart tactics?

But if they don't cross the line they get feck all - unless they changed the rules.
Remember Abdou having to stagger across the line to get his green jersey in 1991?
Then he went straight to hospital and missed all the celebrations.

91, how old do you think I am? Bugger, I am old enough to remember that year, though following the tribulations of England's cricket team was my choice of sport, in those far off distant days, (violin plays in background!).

The only person who has actually said Wiggo won't be in the tour is Wiggo himself (although apparently with very good reason considering the build up). Team Sky's official line is that the line up will be decided after the Criterium du Dauphine and Tour de Suisse.

I suspect Barilsford my have been caught wrong footed by the wider reaction in support of Wiggo, not just on their own FB page but for instance here:https://www.facebook.com/Wewantwiggo
Lets not forget that the ultimate paymaster is SKY. I can't imagine a sponsor more vulnerable to adverse UK sentiment (and the popular press when they decide to run with it).

So if no disasters in the Tour de Suisse I expect Wiggo to be appointed super domestique when the tour is announced and Froome will told to put up and shut up.

Of course Wiggo probably realised this when making his press announcement.

I think I posted earlier that I also think it's shame they can't ride together it would have been great for the tactics the other teams would have had to react to.

Amazing how for and against each character people are, I know almost nothing about them as people bar their media shows.

Froome the mild mannered swot with the polar opposite GF and Wiggins the moody cool kid. Wiggins won in 2012 Froome stuck his head up as a GC rider and got his knuckles wrapped by wiggins who did'nt invite him to the party pay him his bonus or congratulate him for winning the next year. Though pinch of salt this is all reported in the media.

Sad they're not both in but as is I hope the names all make it through to the mountains.

To those who say they've now lost interest, for real??? If Froome had reversed his car over Bradley's bike and glued one of his hands to his sideburns in his sleep to stop him riding it would only make it even more compelling to watch. The tour has already started. No rider is greater than the tdf and I am sooo excited and then I have the tob to look forward to over dartmoor. To quote the film Bolt.

> Putting Wiggins in so much danger at the end of 3 weeks, unbelievably risky, totally crazy..........but also f*cking beautiful!

Exactly, one of my all time favourite sporting moments, if not the most. Don't think that was team orders was it? I thought it was Wiggo's decision simply because he wanted to lead Cav out at the end, partly to say thanks for the domestique work the world's best sprinter had done for him.

> Exactly, one of my all time favourite sporting moments, if not the most. Don't think that was team orders was it? I thought it was Wiggo's decision simply because he wanted to lead Cav out at the end, partly to say thanks for the domestique work the world's best sprinter had done for him.

Of course it was team orders. There was even an in-race TV camera broadcast of Sean Yates giving his cod instructions over the radio reminding them what to do.

SY says no more than the team must get BW to the 1km mark and the rest will follow. Quite what is not stated by him but the commentators fill in that BW will lead out MC... And I cannot believe that was good journalism on PL's and PS's part, they just ain't that smart.

Having spent the afternoon watching the excellent doc Slaying the Badger - on Lemond and Hinault in 85 and 86 - I can understand why Froome is so paranoid. The moral of that tale is never trust a rival, even if he's a team mate, even if he owes you a favour and especially if he's a national hero. And although the film was ostensibly about Lemond, with Hinault the villain of the piece, but you ended up with more than a sneaking admiration for him !

Also, it has to be said that the racing was far more interesting back them - pre EPO and pre race radios

> Thinking about it Maverick and Iceman out of Top Gun may be more apt. But I'm not sure we will ever get to hear "You can be my wingman anytime Wiggo!"

Christ that's perfect.

B and C were deeply in love but their evil wives guarded their men jealously. Then the day came that they were forced to fight alongside each other and, in the face of overwhelming odds, they returned to Paris hand and hand in triumph and free, at last, to express their love without constraint.

> B and C were deeply in love but their evil wives guarded their men jealously. Then the day came that they were forced to fight alongside each other and, in the face of overwhelming odds, they returned to Paris hand and hand in triumph and free, at last, to express their love without constraint.

You know what - it would be just brilliant if Team Sky said "Wiggins will ride the tour, but will travel in a separate bus, stay in a separate hotel, and quite frankly we haven't a f**king clue what he'll do"

Won't happen, but it'd be brilliant entertainment and would cause confusion amongst all the other teams

well after the Tour de Dauphine, and Tour de Suisse so far I guess Brailsford has more questions than answers. Word on the cycling forums (vocal minority?) is that Wiggo is losing because he's sulking. What to the more reasoned UKC pundits think?

In reply to kevin stephens: I'm not sure what you can read into the tour de Suisse results yet. - he didn't give it full lash in the tt , and today is meaningless.

For froome, who knows as well what happened tho' I doubt that today was planned, and does indicate prep is not where it has been in previous years. But it could be something small , simple something bigger. But I wouldn't call Froome a glued on winner at this point

I suspect he isn't sulking so much as reacting to the situation. IF he is off the TDF team then there really isn't any pressure to win the Tour de Suisse. If you watched him today he seemed like a man who had no worries and that might end up in his favour.

depends weather he is team leader or riding in support of henao. if riding in support why bust a gut to finish with the leaders . save your energy for when it`s needed later in the race . if he started as leader he wont be anymore though

You can argue that the way he is riding vindicates the decision , but it's pretty obvious that Froome has insisted he's not in the team. Wiggins did what was asked of him to prove his fitness in California - and do good work for the sponsors - but got back to be told it would make no difference

Wiggins loses a further 2 mins today....isn't this just a case of throwing his rattle out of the pram?! If he wanted to ride the tour surely he would be trying to impress and making Brailsfords decision very difficult. Either he's not fit or can't be arsed. Who knows....either he is pissed off with Sky for saying hes not in the tour or he wasn't prepared to ride as a domestique for Froome and has ben playing tricks and running to the press.
Id put money on this being his last ride for Sky...

In reply to GrahamD: No, what we have is a lot of guessing. They might be right, but the TdS has a long way to go and we'll have to wait and see (of course somebody above might be Brailsford, in which case I bow down before their knowledge).

Exactly. Who knows? Armstrong and ullrich used to ride the Dauphine and Tour de Suisse respectively before the tour. Sometimes they won sometimes they didn't. Sometimes they were minutes down then smashed it a month later.
To be a tour winner you need to be peaking in July, not in mid June. Ffs.

> Wiggins loses a further 2 mins today....isn't this just a case of throwing his rattle out of the pram?! If he wanted to ride the tour surely he would be trying to impress and making Brailsfords decision very difficult. Either he's not fit or can't be arsed. Who knows....either he is pissed off with Sky for saying hes not in the tour or he wasn't prepared to ride as a domestique for Froome and has ben playing tricks and running to the press.

> Id put money on this being his last ride for Sky...

OR he has been told that he is in the TdF team, that he is now the leader as Froome has just sh*t the bed in the Dauphine and he needs to save himself ;-)

It could just be that Henao and Kennaugh have been given free rein in the TDS knowing full well that they'd be expected to be key Domestiques for the Tour, and that Brad is saving himself for the big Time Trial later in the race where he can measure his form against Tony Martin and Spartacus looking ahead to the Worlds ITT later in the year.

> It could just be that Henao and Kennaugh have been given free rein in the TDS knowing full well that they'd be expected to be key Domestiques for the Tour, and that Brad is saving himself for the big Time Trial later in the race where he can measure his form against Tony Martin and Spartacus looking ahead to the Worlds ITT later in the year.

Doubtless he would like to batter those two but I don't think that it would be a good indicator for the Worlds

> Armstrong and ullrich used to ride the Dauphine and Tour de Suisse respectively before the tour. Sometimes they won sometimes they didn't. Sometimes they were minutes down then smashed it a month later.

But we all know that the reason that Armstrong, Ullrich et al. were able to made dramatic performance gains over short time periods was not entirely due to peaking or tapering.

If Wiggins was serious about his willingness to ride for Froome in the TdF he would be showing some form and/or putting in an effort to ride for the team in the TdS, not soft pedalling on the back of the peloton.

If this is his last race with Sky it's a sad way to end. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he doesn't turn up for the start in the next couple of days.

Says he'll have 24 hours off the bike then start preparations for the 'Nationals' next week. Maybe he'll put in an appearance at our local '10' tomorrow night -- he set the course record in 2005 and it's well overdue for lowering substantially!

> "On the day of the final I spoke to the players. I told them to think of themselves as the romantics of football... I was appealing to the romanticism that I think a lot of us carry since childhood...the nobility of football..."

> The same should apply to Team Sky.

A del Bosque quote in the papers yesterday reminded me of your post !

"The most important thing is that we win and we have to win, however it works."

Eddie Boss is now the latest casualty from Sky's squad -- If Brailsford wnats to send the strongest possible squad to support Froome, he may have no option but to tell Froomey that Wiggo will be in the team ( assuming Brad doesn't give him the English archers salute and say I'm off to Orica next year - stuff you!)

8 mountain finishes with time bonus and short TTs (1 TTT, a hilly 34k, and a 10k on the final day), it's not a great course for him. He might ride it in prep for the worlds, but I don't think he'll be anywhere near the podium, if he finishes.

He held it back in 2006 and Dowsetts new record is inly 38 seconds quicker.

The 10 mile competition record is set on roads that are open to other traffic, and is subject to the vagaries of weather, course, and traffic flows. Picking the right course and day is the key.

I've no doubt that if Wiggo wants the record back he's more than capable of getting it. He's probably more than capable of getting the 25 record as well if he could be arsed to go for it. Just dpends on how much he wants the Kudos - as unlike most other events he rides there's little or no financial reward on getting the Comp Record.

In reply to Lord of Starkness: I've got a feeling he'll be going for an attempt at the Hour record in the autumn. The fact that he's now likely to be in the track team at the CGs makes it a far more logical goal than the Vuelta. And of course, it keeps him away from the rest of Team Sky

As regarding kudos - I think he'll spend the rest of the year doing things that enhance his reputation as one of the great all-rounders, rather than doing stuff that will be good for the team/sponsors. He did the later by winning in California (lots of good media for Fox) but it didn't earn him the reward he wanted.