"The Parthian dynasty fell about 75 AD to another horde from Central Asia. Kushans, a Turkish type people known as Yueh-Chih in China moved from Central Asia to Bactria, where they stayed for a century. Around 75 AD, one of the tribe Kushan under the leadership of Kujula Kadphises gained control of Gandhara and other part of present Pakistan"

Well, Yue-Chihs were Caucaid. As far as I know, Yue-Chis were later called Tokharians. They're the so-called Iranian population of Central Asia. And if Kushans are somehow related to them, if they're not their descendants, well then Hazaras, being Asiatic has got nothing to do with them.

Well, Yue-Chihs were Caucaid. As far as I know, Yue-Chis were later called Tokharians. They're the so-called Iranian population of Central Asia. And if Kushans are somehow related to them, if they're not their descendants, well then Hazaras, being Asiatic has got nothing to do with them.

Take a look at other discussions about Kushans. It has been repeated many times. Yuechi were not Iranian stock.

If current day Hazaras are livinig in the lands of the ancient Kushans, there is no reason to deny their relationship with these locals, while you can't provide any historical proof that these locals were forced to move or slayed. Furthermore, Current day Hazaras are not totally mongoloid.

Hazara people lived in feudalism system until one hundred years ago. Hazara people has long history of living in mud built houses in villages. Hazara people has long history of agriculture and tradations.

The name Kushan is derived from the term Guishang, used in Chinese historical writings to describe one branch of the nomadic people, called Yuezhi or Yuechi. These nomads who were of Indo-European stock, roamed the northwestern China but during 176-160 BC, they were driven west by another group, the Xiongnu

There is evidence both from the mummies and Chinese writings that many of them had blonde or red hair and blue eyes, characteristics also found in present-day Afghanistan, Pakistan, Tajikistan and Central Asia, due to the populations' high genetic diversity. This suggests the possibility that they were part of an early migration of speakers of Eastern Irannic Languages.

By the way, a normal Hazara is a good example of the Northern Mongoloid population. Ofcourse, for instance, they grew more facial hair than Central Asians, but they're, to a very high degree and uniformly Mongoloid.

Kushans were Buddhists whose admistrative writings were in Prakrit and
who translated religious texts into Sanskrit. Nobody knows for
sure what language they spoke in Central Asia. Some of their coins had
Greek inscriptions and pics of Greek gods.

Yes, the Yuechi Tocharinas were Indo-europeans, but not iranic. Hazaras was first time migrated to Afghanistan at the 12th century, and they are not the descendants of Kushans.

Maziar, can we say Iranians are not the decendants of the early locals of Iran before Aryan migration? if a group of people migrate into a place they definately mix with the locals, if both parts are quite significant, we can find clear genetic and cultural elements from both parts (in the case of Hazara), then how can we exclude any of them from their ancestral line?

Man we've had enough of your childish complaints, you, Hazaras, and the rest of your comrades, Tajiks, Uzbeks and all put all the blmae on us Pashtuns for wahetever situation you guys are in right now, Grow up, read history, Afghanistan had never been damaged that severely as it was by the ancestors of the Hazara people [Mongols], you guys shouldn't even complain, our cities were razed to grounds by your people, we don't say nothing, but every forum i go to, i see the BS by you guys about us Pashtuns, as if we are the only devils and wrong doers in Afghanistan.

By the way, to clear your confusion, Kushans werent' Hazara, the Buddhas weren't built by Hazara, they were built by the Kushans, an Aryan Tribe that assimilated with the rest of the Aryanic Tribes, collectively known as Pashtuns or ethnic Afghans.

By the way, to clear your confusion, Kushans werent' Hazara, the Buddhas weren't built by Hazara, they were built by the Kushans, an Aryan Tribe that assimilated with the rest of the Aryanic Tribes, collectively known as Pashtuns or ethnic Afghans.

Peace

Who are Hazaras then? Did the Mongol troups come with their wives to this land, and killed all the locals?

I would just like to clarify. The Buddha statues were not built during the reign of the Kushans, but the Ephtalites..who were ironically anti-Buddhists initially.

The Mongols killed every living being in Bamian, including, dogs and cats and lined their heads up in mounds.

The Hazaras are said to be descendants of the Mongol armies, not Genghis Khan. The Mongol armies were made up of many different Turkic tribes as well as Mongols. Bamian was setup as a garrison town for the Mongols and when the Mongols were eventually amalgamated with the rest of Persia and Central Asia, the Mongol hordes remained in Bamian, where they eventually converted to Shiite Islam.

Genetic studies have proven that they have Mongolian and Turkic ancestry. Hazaras today are prevalent in every city in Afghanistan and have intermarried with every ethnic group. My mother's grandmother infact, was a Hazara from Ghazni.

The perceptive man is he who knows about himself, for in self-knowledge and insight lays knowledge of the holiest.
~ Khushal Khan Khattak

As for the Kushans, they are remnants of the Greater Yue-Chih, or the Tocharians. They were not Mongols, but Eastern Iranian speaking nomads from China who were pushed out of their ancestral homes by the Huns. They were followed by other Scythian nomads who were also fleeing the Huns and eventually swept over the Semi Hellenic city states in Afghanistan and made their empire there. They converted to Buddhism and were responsible for many of the caves that are in "Gharchistan" or Bamian.

They were defeated and swept over the Kitharites (Huns) and then finally by the Ephtalite Huns. The Ephtalite Huns have a mysterious past but are said to be remnants of the Tocharians and had cultural traditions similar to the Massagatae Saka. They ruled Afghanistan and eventually converted to Buddhism and Hinduism. Hinduism eventually won out in Eastern Afghanistan and Peshawar and Taxila, but Buddhism was still strong in Bamian where the Buddhist monk went to visit and noticed the Giant Buddha Statues.

The Ephtalites had various wars with the Sassanian Persians and Turks, some of which they won, some of which they lost, but eventually they were overrun by a joint Turk-Sassanian attack and were dispersed.

--

Most of the information is from History of Central Asia, compied by UNESCO and historical departments from various universites across Central Asia, South Asia, and Europe.

The perceptive man is he who knows about himself, for in self-knowledge and insight lays knowledge of the holiest.
~ Khushal Khan Khattak

do you have any evidence behind the claim that Pashtuns shaved Buddha's face?

I have a very clear evidence that the Bamiyan budddah has been destroyed little by little in the last 200 years since Pashtun come to power in Afghanistan. before 200 years it was a complete buddah body statue.

I'm a Naiman Hazara, therefore I'm a Hazara too. I think we are more Mongoloid than Turkic now. Before the Great Mongol Empire, our ancestors were more Turks than Mongols in Hazarstan regions. But it was after the Mongol Empire when we became known as the 'Hazaras'. You guys know that the Mongol Empire was divided into four states. Hazaras are from the Chaghatai and Ilkhanates of Afghanistan and Iran.

Hazara acestors lived in Central Afghanistan for more than 2000 years. Kushans are also our Turkic ancestors. The reason why some people say that they were Indo-European is because they had many races in their army and government, they even had black looking people possibly Indians. But the high ranked Kushans were Kushan Turks who built the Buddhas of Bamiyan.

The Turanian armies kept increasing our numbers. Specially during and after the Great Mongolian Empire Hazara population became larger and larger. When our Mongol ancestors completely lost power, the defeted soldiers from Iran, Iraq and other cities returned to Hazarstan/Hazarajat.

An interesting fact is that some of our Hazara sub-clans are still called by their old names. For example Naiman, Besud and etc...Today if you go in Mongolia or Kazakhistan you can find many communities (tribes) who have the same names, but they are separated by small communities everywhere in Mongolia and Kazakhsiatn. Here are only some of the Kahlkh-Mongol tribes that exist in Mongolia:

As you can see there are Naimans and Besuds still in Mongolia. But in Hazarajat/Hazarstan areas today we also have Turkomens which were called Oghuz Turks in the ancient times. Also we have 'Jaghuries' who are the biggest the most ancient Hazara sub-clan. They were mainly Uyghur Turks, but after Oltan Khaan their name changed to 'Jaghuri'. They were good fighters, hard workers and also good horse riders. The name 'Jaghuri' is derived from the word 'Chau Quri' or 'Jau Quri' which was a position given to a direct ancestor of Chinggis Khaan who had to lead 100 Mongol soldiers, during Oltan Khaan. That's when they became known as Jaghuri people.

If we look back in the past, we don't see many differences between Mongols and Turks. They had same believes and culture. But Turks today specially Turks in Turkey, because of their geographical location, they tend to be more European and Middle-Eastern. We have Turks and Mongols in our Hazara tribe, we don't see any differences. I think the reason is because we give more value to the name 'Hazara' more than the smaller names such as jaghuri, Besud, Naiman, Turkoman and etc...

If you look at the any ancient sources, you cannot find the name 'Hazara' before the Mongol Empire. The reason is because they became known as the 'Hazara' during and after the Empire. Before that they were called buy different names. My point is that the people who are called Hazara today have more than 2000 years of history in Central Afghanistan. We are the Mongols and the ancient Turks of Afghanistan.

Any link for the list? The list is comprised of Turkic and Mongol tribes, in fact most of them seems to be Turkic. Some of the tribes mentioned in the list are listed with Turkmen or Uzbek, currently we can find in Afghanistan. Here are some of them but there might be more:

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