While Michigan and its fans take great pride in the Big House being the "biggest" house, such a slip to #2 - in the grand scheme of things - isn't a major to deal, in my opinion. Especially in light of the cause behind it.

But apparently not all M fans feel the same way. MZone reader FS sent us a link to the Michigan Daily where, in a Letter to the Editor, one U-M senior "blames" handicapped fans for knocking the Big House down a notch and then proceeds to "call them out," saying they better pick up the slack of the "missing" fans:

Blame fans in wheelchairs for lower stadium capacity

To the Daily:

In response to the settlement the Michigan Paralyzed Veterans of America reached with the University regarding Michigan Stadium's wheelchair accessibility: Nice work guys, your wish finally came true. You have fought hard to ensure that you are able to see Michigan football in person. It is very important that you guys be able to view the game - important enough that the Big House will lose 1,300 seats and potentially the title of "largest stadium in college football."

Since you guys are willing to sacrifice Michigan Stadium tradition in order to see games, you must be fanatical about Michigan football. And, because you felt your rights to view a game were violated, you stuck up for yourselves. I commend you for making sure everyone has an equal chance to see a Michigan game.

Here is what I ask of all people who will be helped by this agreement: I expect all people in wheelchairs to work extra hard to make up for the loss in seating. I expect to be deafened by the roar on third downs coming from wheelchair sections. I expect to see every wheelchair decked out in maize and blue. I expect that wheelchair sections have their own original cheers.

Because people in wheelchairs are going to be accommodated by the Michigan community, it should not be too much to ask that these people return the favor.

it is pretty sad, i would expect something with a little more thought from an english senior. maybe it is just because i am a chemical engineering major, but seriously, is it that hard to write an editorial without sounding like an emo high schooler? anything coming from LSA should knock your socks off. $20 says he sold at least one of his tickets for a profit.

That is unbelievable. No doubt he is going to regret that letter. If not now, some time in his future when he runs for some podunk political city office, this will come back to bite him in the ass. We create our own Karma.

we had several years during the '90's when Tennessee (of all schools) was a little bigger. they finished their rebuild about 2 years ahead of ours and had a couple thousand more seats for awhile. i think they changed the stadium announcement from "largest crowd watching a game ..." to "the __th consecutive crowd over 100,000...".

thought for the day- this is two weeks in a row that Yost has posted about a minority of the population forcing the majority to accomodate the minority's needs.

last week it was 6 muslim women wanting the gym to themselves (or at least just for them and other women) at the expense of all the men. this week it's a few hundred disabled taking up the seats of several thousand other fans.

angst aside, i don't see where this kid's letter is much different than many of the comments (and maybe Yost's post??) decrying the "special" arrangements made for the girls @ harvard. it's never a clear cut issue.

a minority group inconveniencing the majority is naturally anti-democratic and cuts against the underlying premise of "majority" rule. it is one of the biggest frictions and an achilles heel for any democracy (not often you get to cite de tocqueville on a cfb blog, huh?).

anyway, interesting to see who falls out on which side of the minority rights debate since it actually effects michigan football (and not a bunch of 2nd raters @ harvard).

It'd be one thing if the handicapped section was overflowing every game. I've never seen it more than 1/4 full. That's not saying it's never been full. Disabled people have just as much right to watch a game as anyone else but if the demand isn't there...

the debate on "numbers" is also an interesting contrast to last week's post.

michigan & the law school were the center of the rulings on the use of "quotas" for admissions. the civil rights act of '64, doesn't typically allow the use of "numbers" for addressing minority opportunity for education.

the ADA, however, is all about "numbers". as w/ the stadium now, it's entirely about how many seats for how many people.

the civil rights act addresses gender, race, religion- basically touches the entire population in some way. the ADA addresses a very small fraction by comparison. yet the ADA zealously considers "numbers" and requires "quotas"- you'll have X number of seats reserved for the handicapped in M stadium. while the civil rights act requires a balancing act and explicitly bars the use of numbers or quotas for defining the rights of the bulk of the population.

I've got to say I agree with SiC. It's pretty frustrating when it happens, but this is life, and people on both sides feel that they're not being treated fairly. Similar to the previous post on Muslim Women and Harvard Gym hours thing, this, in my opinion, is also a case when tolerance crossed the line (by a toe or something).

I know I shouldn't compare healthy, able muslim women to the needy disabled, but this is happening at a grander scale where thousands of people are affected by mere hundreds seats. On the different side of the same coin, we should not undermine the muslim students' piety. As I understand, Islam is probably one of religions that require the most amount of dedication to follow, and we should respect that.

I have to applaud the athletic department for not caving into every single demand they get. We shouldn't underestimate their decision making process, I'm sure it's pretty long and tough. the athletic department even offered to have "mobile" seats that could be altered to accommodate the disabled, but it was rejected.

Anyway I am not complaining too much about the situation, but the fact remains that there's no real solution to it, because I am sure people on the other side of the fence would have a lot of counter arguments. But this boils down to simply a matter of opinion, i guess.

Well in life it comes down to this, "sometimes we've just got to give and take. " So it's definitely a positive thing on the image of the school to be able to resolve this without a lawsuit. and to disabled fans who previously were not able to get tickets, I welcome you sincerely to the game in the fall.

about the poster on the daily, yeah, he's kinda asshole about it.

Anyway I'm an Engineering Grad Student, so I don't think this is a matter of the traditional LSA vs CoE point of view, I think he's just expressing his frustration with a little too much unintentional sarcasm.

soon enough we would be number 1 back again, and it shouldn't be a cause for concern. if any Nittany Lions come into our house and make a fuss of it, we'll just give them 2 numbers. 9 and 0.

....or fan abuse, criminal activity, or drunken rampages, or teeth lost due to drunken rampages, children born out of wedlock, pizzas delivered by graduates, guest appearances on "Cops" or even just general douchebaggery.

But we're just talking about stadium capacity here. Try to stay on topic.

I seriously can not believe some of you. Surrounded in columbus, you make the point I was just about to bring up. This is the exact same situation as those Muslim women at Harvard. The only reason you are all criticizing this guy is because Yost wasn't the one to bring it up. I promise you, if Yost was the one to write that article everyone on this blog would be singing his praises.

I for one actually read the article and it's mostly facetious, albeit, perturbed sarcasm.

Last season I sat right behind the wheelchair section and not one game was it full. I could understand adding seating if there was a demand for it but there is clearly not.

Give the kid a break for speaking his mind. And please, please, stop clinging to everything Yost says as truth, and everything he bashes as an utter fallacy. He's just one man.

I love football as much as anyone, but from another site I read that the Big House did not have very good wheelchair access. This seems to have solved that problem. As to the letter while I agree with Catie that we all create our own karma, one never knows if a close family member of the author or the author themselves will end up in a wheelchair. I assume that this person is not grateful for having full mobility.

Well, for starters - and enders - religion is a choice. Being handicapped isn't.

And has been pointed out, this wasn't just about seating capacity, but accessibility.

The Muslim women CHOSE not to go to the gym during the co-ed hours, but they had equal access and the ultimate decision was thus theirs. In this situation, if there weren't access/seats, the disabled folks had no way to attend the game.

In addition, it's not like by adding these seats, everybody else was banned. If the change was that only handicapped people could attend the games for the first quarter of each game, then yeah, I'd be singing a different tune.

Finally, this was in response to a Justice Department lawsuit against the University because of claims the previous/current wheelchair capacity/accessibility violated federal law. Harvard's previous open gym hours did not.

whose idea was it to actually put this letter in the paper? this certainly was not the only letter to the editor that was sent in recently. even if the student was a fictional charater, the daily no doubt spiked in readers/site hits.

I know that this is pretty cynical, but how long will it be till we have the stadium closed to guys for 5 hours a week so the muslim women can use it...

What a moron. That said, I don't understand the numbers the law requires - I've never seen a wheelchair section even half full.

Whatever, it's the law and Michigan should comply with it, just like OSU fans comply with the law that require them to be drunken yokels who must throw dangerous objects and Michigan fans. At least I'm assuming that's a law in Columbus.

As a Michigan football fan who is handicapped (although I think I would prefer to be called a Euphemism-American) but not even close to being wheelchair-bound, I don't really know how to feel about this.

"Well, for starters - and enders - religion is a choice. Being handicapped isn't. "

as far as i see, if you respect their choices in choosing a religion, the last thing you want to tell them is that they have a choice to change their religion. I find that statement pretty hypocritical because it's subtly saying "well you could always believe in something else", hence undermining their beliefs.

"The Muslim women CHOSE not to go to the gym during the co-ed hours, but they had equal access and the ultimate decision was thus theirs. In this situation, if there weren't access/seats, the disabled folks had no way to attend the game."

They didn't choose not to go, their religious laws FORBID them to do so, not much of a choice there. So in order to use some facilities, people would actually have to change religion to do so?

The disabled always had ways to attend the games, I've seen some of them attend it and they might have to go through some trouble in getting to their seats. That's definitely true, but a lot more people are paying a price for their convenience. What about people that lose their season tickets privileges? Isn't it the same thing, that on one hand we have regular season ticket holders, and on the other hand we have guys who are only able to go during those hours.

"In addition, it's not like by adding these seats, everybody else was banned. If the change was that only handicapped people could attend the games for the first quarter of each game, then yeah, I'd be singing a different tune."

if you lose your seats, you can't attend the game, you get nothing and it's the end of story. on the other hand, if they put aside some hours in a day, guys would be able to access the facilities other times, and it's not like the facilities is permanently made non-coed. if that's the case, then yeah, I'd sing a different tune too.

Everything I said here is a matter of opinion, it might change some time later, but right now that's how i feel. There's no grudge, or feeling of dissatisfaction, because life is , pretty unsurprisingly, unfair. I am sure at some point all of us would offend someone else, but I am pretty sure I don't mean to hurt anyone's feelings, and it just shows that we're engaging in a pretty intelligent conversation!

anyway kudos to Yost for bringing in a new perspective. In any case the thing has been put to rest for the time being.

I suppose the guy, although an asshole, did have a right to speak his mind, and none of us are obliged to read it, linger on about it. But regardless of whether we are on a wheelchair or not, we are all maize and blue, and we should help each other make our gameday experience better!

"Here is where we will have to agree to disagree. I find more disturbing your selection of breakfast locations."

Why is that? I wasn't the one who brought up eating Wheaties and peeing - that was you. And I don't eat Wheaties - I prefer Rice Chex.

If you were speaking figuratively, then I believe the culprit who left the "cereal bowl between the urinals" was Yost since your little snide (which interrupted a perfectly intelligent non-"UM sucks! Haha!" conversation - as you are wont to do) resulted from his posting about the stadium capacity. In any event, I wouldn't pee in Yost's cereal if I were you.

"Yet, because the college you know is Michigan, I have no doubt you can balance your Wheaties while tapping your foot..."

How many times do I have to tell you?!?!?! I don't eat Wheaties!!! I eat Rice Chex!!!

Now if you'll excuse me, I must go home and order a fine Italian pie to be delivered to my home by one of your fine graduates. Have a great weekend!

"....or fan abuse, criminal activity, or drunken rampages, or teeth lost due to drunken rampages, children born out of wedlock, pizzas delivered by graduates, guest appearances on "Cops" or even just general douchebaggery."

You forgot full beer cans thrown at pregnant women.

T(hat's not a knife Whets, it's a throwing star!!!!!)

Tcalero,I find your characterization of the readership here and it's agreement with Yost's posts offensive. The majority of people here are in no way "yes men" and quite often disagreements abound. What makes this site great is the ability to read and digest diverging points of view and (hopefully) learn from those differences.

"....or fan abuse, criminal activity, or drunken rampages, or teeth lost due to drunken rampages, children born out of wedlock, pizzas delivered by graduates, guest appearances on "Cops" or even just general douchebaggery."

Which of course are typical anecdotal references dredged up by certain folks for a temporary feeling of superiority.

My noise reference pertained to many a fine discussion on noise production in the big house with a little tweaking humor tossed in concerning the temporary loss of stadium capacity to of all people--Penn St. fans.

My Wheaties con ammonia reference is a hat tip to T-9 who likes to use the phrase when someone seems agitated over nothing. I have chosen to adopt its colorful image.

As someone married to a person who is in a wheelchair (but not being a Michigan fan), I can tell you that the reason the wheelchair seats may not have been "full" is that if the stadium wasn't real wheelchair friendly (restroom access, etc.), they would not bother coming.

Most folks who are in chairs would (a) prefer not to be in them, and (b) would appreciate the opportunity to do the same things that those not in chairs do.

I used to work for a guy in a chair. He was a potential D1 athlete until he hit a stump while skiing moguls. As an aside, I'm curious about the device that allows people in chairs to be lifted to the general eye level of people who stand. Had a gyroscope similar to that upright scooter thing (can't remember the name right now). I know Brian was excited by the news a few years ago and I recently saw an ad for it. Are you familiar with it?

Whets, I've been busy wasting my time in other ways. Specifically taunting Sparty fans with my "Michigan State: Easier to Beat than App. St." T shirt at the East Lansing BW3 while watching our BBall debacle. And your collectors items are on there way, speaking of....

In other news- I'm trying to get some Bodog suckers to pay my rent this weekend. Already $60 up since 3pm today ($20 an hour). The popularization of poker for people who don't understand math has to be the biggest geek revenge ever.

whet: I thought the wheaties close to the urinal was pretty funny and understood the shout out perfectly.

tcalero: I present the recent lash marks I own given my propensity to NOT always agree with Yost, nor any of my other community members.

SiC: well done sir !--de Toqueville?? I defer to the new master of the elite ;-) and, your point about the tension between the quota issues contained in the ADA as opposed to the non-qouta balance requied by the Civil Rights Act? Brilliant

Bama Tax man. Carolina in da house!As a handicapped person that has really been to the big house on a game day I know and accept that it might not be the best environment for me. I chose to go even knowing that I couldn't see shit. I asked for and recieved no help from anyone. I loved it anyway, and when I really want To see the game I'll go and sit in front of the TV.As for Whoopins I've yet to see a southern boy up for my yooper a$$. Lemme know as I'm in LA (Lower Alabama) about two to three times a year.

The Big House will always be the Big House. We're talking Michigan football here. The only time you'll hear about being number two is from some flamer with nothing substantial to say.

On the other hand, Penn State, Tennessee, and OSU have huge stadiums without legal issues regarding handicapped seating. Just play by the darn rules.

Making allowances for minorities is the price we pay for living in a democratic and open society. It may not always seem fair. But, it is right. Fair is often defined by teacher as everyone getting what they need rather that everyone getting the same.

Here's one for you Yost: Religion is not really a choice. It is a family legacy. We are born into a culture and family tradition. It is taught to us from birth. Assuming that you consider yourself a Christian, did you actually seriously consider any other faith along the way? In our society, most who choose something other than Christianity are looked down upon by family, friends, and neighbors. That Harvard story was a feature about one facility of many on one campus making allowances for a small group. If the words Muslim or Islam did not appear in that article, no one would have batted an eyelash.

Bob said 'everyone gets what they need"Who needs half to threequarter empty handicap areas?Also yes I did at one time examin my faith and the reasons for it. Looked at the other guys as well as none at all. I believe I made a real choice.Whets, My fig tree is starting to open a bud. I believe a pic is on the way tomorrow.T9 and the rest of the dirty snow crowd... I'm sending warm thoughts and my best wishes for an early spring.

Michigan Stadium making it only the second largest stadium in the country, just behind Penn State's Beaver Stadium.

Seriously 56 some odd posts and not one "Big Beaver" comment? Come on the overly serious bug has bitten everyone square in the ass lately and we are all getting riled up into a frenzy. I wholeheartedly agree that anyone that thinks this was a bad move on the U's part obviously has never known or been close to anyone with a handicap. It is a very respectable move on their part and I would feel honored to be a season ticket holder at such a fine University. That being said we can now all bow to the Big Beaver until we once again reign supreme.

This moment of levity brought to you by the good people at Chill Out Inc.

And the worst part about my comment is that the next time you're, um, "doing the do", you're totally gonna picture Joe Pa's O-face and start cracking up. Well, you probably wouldn't have, BUT NOW YOU WILL!!!!!

*Evil grin*

And I totally expect a call when this happens, because I will laugh for about 27 minutes straight, guaranteed.

You guys all seem to want to take the high road on this one, but I think you are missing a larger point and the low road that got us here. The only reason there was a lawsuit against the U is because of a bloodsucking lawyer equivalent to an ambulance chaser. Sam Bernstein ( the scum bag on every other commercial break promising massive legals settlements for worthless losers ) and his son Richard brought this case to exploit an ADA regulation that in my experience has never been a problem at the Big House. Before the University announced it was going to spend hundreds of millions of dollars on renovations, I can't recall hearing one single complaint about handicap access to the stadium - can you??? But once the dollars were exposed the scum bag blood sucking lawyers jumped into to get a piece of the pie! Honestly, someone please show me or point to a story of a handicapped person not be treated well at the Big House. And then tell me why we need to increase access by a multiple of 3! I'm all for equal access but this is coming at the expense of the majority for the sole purpose of creating legal fees for the most disgusting law firm in the state of Michigan.

Think about the thousands of people already on a season ticket waitlist that will no have thousands less seats to wait for... And also think about how much of the donations and contributions you make to the University were wasted on this frivolous suit - The plan had already called for improved handicapped access!

A. It's the law.B. The improved access could lead to many more people who need them taking advantage of the access- we'll wait and see. If not, I would foresee plans being made in future years for use of those seats by the unimpaired.C. If you'd like to discuss tort reform I'm all about it. And I agree that the suit is frivolous and probably money based, inspiried . Heck, I'll even trade attorney jokes with you. But whining b/c someone may have to wait longer for tickets to a stupid football game is ludicrous. Most people make choices in this lifetime and I don't know one person who's in a chair who chose to be there. If I have to wait a few more years so they have the opportunity I have than so be it.

it never asked me for a password and it is still up as of 3 pm sunday, nonetheless, it is picture of a person trying to cut their wrist with an electric razor, and it says your doing it wrong. i don't know why it seems so broken...

I'm thinking it was a rather innocent person who happened to share your first name and last initial there Tom C. Handlejacking happens quite often over at MGoBlog, but there aren't any identifying avatars and such (pretty much). It usually involves humor of some sort such as

"Hey everyone- cookout at my place this weekend. I'll supply the souls of young puppies and the boosters will have grab bags full of cash." -Jim Tressell

You know, something like that. Only that's way too realistic. It'd probably be more like...

Shocking to find there is another Tom C in the world... no offense meant...

Anyway, Joshua tell me where in the law it says that the Big House has to have 329 handicap accessible seats??

It is pretty sad that we would so readily give up are status as the Big House because we are made to FEEL like we are doing something good and noble. Not that I'm against handicapped people going to games its just that I've never heard of any complaints previous to this lawsuit. The renovations already had massive improvements planned in terms of accessablity, wider aisles, etc.

There is nothing admirable or noble in disenfranchising alums on the wait list in favor of the few - especially when there are no facts or complaints on record to support such nonsense as a 3x increase in capacity.

If you are going to state "Its the LAW" know what the law is... in this case ADA calls for (roughly) 1% of capacity to be handicap. So if you want to stick to the law you should be fighting for more seats!!We pay a terrible price for ignorance in the country and its sad my M friends buying in to the PC garbage that is ruining our country and now the Big House...

I'm all for a great game day experience for all who would like to go, but don't let PC run over the voice of reason...

Olympus gang, you can't go wrong. 510 uz can take a pic of bacteria.Uhh welcome to the other tom c? Wonder who is older>Whets I'll give you a tree full of blooms and trust you on it. You win. Wait til next year.

"Anyway, Joshua tell me where in the law it says that the Big House has to have 329 handicap accessible seats??.....If you are going to state "Its the LAW" know what the law is... in this case ADA calls for (roughly) 1% of capacity to be handicap. So if you want to as stick to the law you should be fighting for more seats!!

First, the ADA DOES in fact call for roughly 1% of all seat to be handicap accessible. I knew this, but thanks for attempting to point it out in a condescending manner. The compromise which has been made calls for 329 seats to be available in the lower bowl, saving your "disenfranchised alumni" 746 seats that you didn't have to give up if we went "By the law". Granted another 200 are slotted to be available in club seating and suites, but I don't foresee those being more readily available to the impaired than they are to the general public. So what I should've said is: "It's the law to have 1% and we won't even have that. You should feel lucky the federal government didn't require more."

"It is pretty sad that we would so readily give up are (sic) status as the Big House because we are made to FEEL like we are doing something good and noble.....We pay a terrible price for ignorance in the country and its sad my M friends buying in to the PC garbage that is ruining our country and now the Big House...

You want to know what's truly sad Tom C? It's sad that I share an allegiance to the same team as an individual who compares the "terrible price of ignorance we pay in this country" to the idea that 229 more alums will have to wait for tickets. Do you not see the irony here? Your entire argument is

1. You never heard a complaint.2. Political correctness has led to the the idea that people who are not as fortunate as you will be given an additional LESS THAN 1% of the seats in which to enjoy games at Michigan stadium.

A wise man once said "Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." I see no malice in your statements, and reasoning with the stupid is an exercise in futility, so I'll simply exercise my right not to expend the energy on such ignorance.

Probably that or the fact that there are only 53 season ticket holders in the handicap access...

Look ADA was adopted in 1990, the Big House was built in 1927 and more than 75% of the seats are below grade (without tunneling into the earth or completely rebuilding the stadium it would not be feasible to get wheelchair access). Bernstein had to know he would never win a lawsuit (especially because there is no demand to support it) but also knew he there are enough saps out there to feel sorry for the cause. Thus, he could delay constructing waiting for a hearing and put even more pressure on the U with negative press that would be sure to follow. So the U was forced to settle and give away the Big House.

Oh well, who wants to play in a "Big House" anyway. I guess I'll just wait for the next tradition to come around.

Just to add my $0.02, I'm 29 and disabled, partially paralyzed from the waist down, entirely from about the knees down. I've seen a lot of comments saying the handicap section is never full but in the games I've been to since my injury (OSU '07), (Wiscy, MSU the year before), I've never encountered a situation where the handicapped section (I usually end up in the south end zone to the east side of the middle) was NOT full.

If the letter writer could spend a week in the shoes of someone unable to walk it would change his perspective forever.

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