The bad thing about that move is what it will cause from teams with their camera and sound guys badgering flight attendants worldwide for similar upgrades. I believe that World Race Productions will have to ban such requests. I want to see that sooner rather than later in addition to banning following taxis and all begging two rules changes that are long overdue.

I agree with the taxis and begging and maybe upgrades too...but as a Southern woman...you can never ban flirting!!

Logged

"Our fans are pretty good. They don't give away too much. Sometimes people love dropping spoilers, but our fans are good. They tend to do it in such a way that doesn't ruin it for fans who don't want to know."--Phil Keoghan

From everything I've read, including Jordan's post in this thread, their beef is with Jet, not Cord. I think it's important to note that because I suspect the way the issue has been handled by CBS and WRP is based in part on that distinction.

It's unfortunate that we haven't been able to hear both sides of this, but more importantly, I wish there was a way to put the four of them in a room and hatch this out, once and for all.

"Our fans are pretty good. They don't give away too much. Sometimes people love dropping spoilers, but our fans are good. They tend to do it in such a way that doesn't ruin it for fans who don't want to know."--Phil Keoghan

Thank you, Jordan, for posting here. I was very glad to see you and your brother win two seasons back.

I am fascinated with how CBS has handled the image of the Pious brothers in contrast to the "sainted" Cowboys. What I'm about to say may seem jaded/cynical/negative, but it truly reflects how I feel. The narrative we were force fed in Season 16 was very one-sided. The Cowboys and Pious Brothers were boiled down into such archetypes that it's not hard to see how editors and production were pandering to the lowest common denominator: Cowboys=GOOD; Pious Brothers=EVIL. It's a narrative where the all-American good-ol-boys lose with honor because they didn't cut in line and the winners are young blue-state whippersnappers who didn't have the decency to give up, lie down and let the sainted red-state Jet & Cord trample them to the finish line. HOW DARE THEY WIN?!? THEY GOT FIRST ONLY ONCE!!!1!111!!!

Trust me, this lowest-common-denominator bullshit works. I know it works, because a family member of mine unwittingly bought into this narrative. Over the course of the season, she fell in love with the Cowboys...but never had anything good to say about the Pious brothers. She would give a very bland explanation of her feelings with "they just seem like jerks to me." While watching the finale, she was very pissy when Dan & Jordan cut in line. Things got even worse, naturally, when it was clear that the Pious Brothers were running away with the money. After trying to calmly explain that the Pious Brothers' win had nothing to do with cutting in line and that they were cunning enough to get the plane de-boarding advantage, I didn't get any kind of rational response. In fact, I got some rather irrational, unrepeatable diatribe which seemed to imply that shifty east coasters don't need all that money... oh, and there was more to it than that, but I would rather not repeat such ugliness. To be fair, my family member did apologize later...but guess who she's rooting for once again this season.

Jet's homophobic slur towards Jordan, if indeed true, is sad and unsurprising. Reveals so much about his lack of sportsmanship.

CBS did show that temper Jet gave to Phil on the mat in ep 7. CBS also showed cowboys' somewhat sneaky behavior (the bus, the pullover, the indifference to lesbians, just name a few)

As for Dan/Jordan, CBS showed plenty good things about them. Their passion, their humor, Dan's support for Jordan.

As far as I can see, CBS is pretty fair regarding all the contestants. All they care is to give the audience some dramatic scenes, they didn't twist the contestants' personalities.

Stop blaming CBS. Stop pointing out that CBS is a master in manipulating viewers' feelings towards contestants and portraying in the way they want the viewers to see.

WE ARE NOT STUPID WE CAN SEE THROUGH MANY THINGS as long as you watch it really carefully and with your heart!I just love the cowboys even if they are faking to be nice or even if they are really evil. I don't care. And here is my opinion:Cord's 10 years pro in PBR, he suffered countless injuries,and his career earnings is only 330,000 something, and Dan/Jordan run a race and win 1 million, If I were Cord, and I do care money more than he does, I would say in front of the camera to Dan/Jordan: I don't care if you cheat or not, I don't care if it is against the rule or not, stop explaining because you DID CUT IN LINE.

From the batman, It's not who you are underneath, it's what you do that defines you. Basically, Jordan's post won't influence any real cowboy or CBS fans. And i'm glad we get rid of those fake ones.

CBS did show that temper Jet gave to Phil on the mat in ep 7. CBS also showed cowboys' somewhat sneaky behavior (the bus, the pullover, the indifference to lesbians, just name a few)

I'll give you those instances. However, when compared with all of the glowingly positive edits PLUS the incessant, overplayed generic wild-wild-west theme music that seemed to underscore their every move, it's safe to say that the edit was overwhelmingly positive for the Cowboys.

Quote

As far as I can see, CBS is pretty fair regarding all the contestants. All they care is to give the audience some dramatic scenes, they didn't twist the contestants' personalities.

I have to disagree. If CBS was truly fair, their editors and story-writers wouldn't have gone for the lazy narrative of "We lost because Dan & Jordan are meanies who cut in line!!! WAAAHHH!!" The reason they lost was because under the circumstances they didn't think outside the box and get to the front of the plane AND failed to grasp a crucial concept at the VR Task. None of their failure to win can be traced back to a line-cutting. But, of course, I'm afraid that will never assuage the über-fans.

Quote

Stop blaming CBS. Stop pointing out that CBS is a master in manipulating viewers' feelings towards contestants and portraying in the way they want the viewers to see.

Why do you insist I stop blaming CBS? If you think they don't manipulate viewers' feelings, you're kidding yourself. Want a current blatant example? Survivor Redemption Island...where we're supposed to be sooooooooo excited that powerhouses Rob and Russell have returned.

Quote

And here is my opinion:Cord's 10 years pro in PBR, he suffered countless injuries,and his career earnings is only 330,000 something, and Dan/Jordan run a race and win 1 million, If I were Cord, and I do care money more than he does, I would say in front of the camera to Dan/Jordan: I don't care if you cheat or not, I don't care if it is against the rule or not, stop explaining because you DID CUT IN LINE.

This is where you truly lose me. The Amazing Race is not a charity case. Nor is Survivor or Big Brother. None of the teams are more entitled to the money based on life hardships. It's all about who gets to the finish line first. With all due respect, Cord isn't the only guy out there with money problems. Who's to say that Dan and Jordan were super rich before the race, and thus, somehow less deserving? We don't know their financial situation, and it's unfair for people like my relative to assume that east coast = rich. And I don't think Dan and Jordan should feel bad for explaining themselves. I believe Jordan himself has even expressed regret over cutting in line because he is decent enough to realize it cast him in a bad light.

I'm just sick to death of reality shows being turned into huge morality plays. That's all.

I'll give you those instances. However, when compared with all of the glowingly positive edits PLUS the incessant, overplayed generic wild-wild-west theme music that seemed to underscore their every move, it's safe to say that the edit was overwhelmingly positive for the Cowboys.

look at your word choice: glowingly positive, overplayed, wild-wild-west theme music, overwhelmingly...all your word choice simply indicates that you try to use descriptive words to stress your points and opinions, there is no evidence, to what level are they glowingly and overwhelmingly positive?? it is just your opinion.Then i have mine, To me, by showing the scene, ' Sir, are you all right, just check on my fellow soldier' that shows really funny side of Jordanby showing Jet throwing the map towards Phil, that also indicates some not so good features of him.You will find plenty of examples in which CBS shows both good and bad of all teams. Beyond all that, all these 'editing, theme music, positive effects' you mentioned are nothing to the fans of Jet and Cord, some of the fans are already Cord's fans in PBR, personally, I started to like him only because of his smile, that's all. Like I said in my previous posts, we all have our own favorites, it doesn't matter how CBS shows it. we are just attracted to that.

Quote

I have to disagree. If CBS was truly fair, their editors and story-writers wouldn't have gone for the lazy narrative of "We lost because Dan & Jordan are meanies who cut in line!!! WAAAHHH!!" The reason they lost was because under the circumstances they didn't think outside the box and get to the front of the plane AND failed to grasp a crucial concept at the VR Task. None of their failure to win can be traced back to a line-cutting. But, of course, I'm afraid that will never assuage the über-fans.

you are exaggerating again, they never used the sentence'we lost because Dan/Jordan are meanies who cut in line'They only flashed back the scene where Dan/Jordan were cutting in line. And Jet called him cheating (I'll explain to you why he called him cheating to your last response. ）

Quote

Why do you insist I stop blaming CBS? If you think they don't manipulate viewers' feelings, you're kidding yourself. Want a current blatant example? Survivor Redemption Island...where we're supposed to be sooooooooo excited that powerhouses Rob and Russell have returned.

i never quoted your response or mentioned your name ,actually, the previous post I said that to everybody posted before who insists CBS are showing favors towards the cowboys and they are manipulating the viewers. Once again, it's just what you think.'why do you insist I' don't you think its a bit funny by starting your question like that while I wasnt even talking to you

Quote

This is where you truly lose me. The Amazing Race is not a charity case. Nor is Survivor or Big Brother. None of the teams are more entitled to the money based on life hardships. It's all about who gets to the finish line first. With all due respect, Cord isn't the only guy out there with money problems. Who's to say that Dan and Jordan were super rich before the race, and thus, somehow less deserving? We don't know their financial situation, and it's unfair for people like my relative to assume that east coast = rich. And I don't think Dan and Jordan should feel bad for explaining themselves. I believe Jordan himself has even expressed regret over cutting in line because he is decent enough to realize it cast him in a bad light.

I'm just sick to death of reality shows being turned into huge morality plays. That's all.

once again, I never said TAR is a charity case. I certainly did lose you.What i meant was Cord and Jet have every reason to be mad at Dan/Jordan cutting in line. Because it's a serious game, it's about 1million dollars. It's everyone's dream. Let's just imagine, If Cord and Jet were cutting in line in front of Dan/Jordan, and Cord and Jet won Season 16, I'm pretty sure Dan/Jordan would call them cheaters as well, maybe even worse. But Cord and Jet would never do that. They wouldn't even think of taking advantage like that (They would't even ask for help from other teams when they stuck in the flags task for so long in ep1,season 18.And they were even too shy to ask the detectives to team up with them in the intersection task in S16. They had to wave their arms to imply that.)some people may think they are dumb or not as flexible as Dan/Jordan. But that's just the cowboys we(cowboy fans) all love.

First, I'm not flaming, mungobuh is. I wasn't even talking to him/her in my previous post. I'm just stating my opinon to everybody.

Second, I don't watch Survivor.

Third, if you or the moderator here wants to blame the flame, don't blame me, blame Jordan, he posted here by saying something like that of the cowboys. As a fan, i have to say something that is fair to all the Jet/Cord fans

1. Editing is ALWAYS unfair. Editors, like us, are people and people are entitled to their opinions. Obviously they (or CBS) may have had a specific team that they like or they think the general public will like, thus the editing is geared towards them. It is impossible to have a complete objective editing of any episode. Personally, I think the Cowboy thing is WAY overboard. It's quite obvious that the editors (or someone else) likes the cowboys a lot and I personally get the feeling that they are being shoved down our throats.

2. Did Dan and Jordan "cheat" by "cutting the line?" Does it say in any rulebook that cutting the line is against the rules (thus can be classified as cheating)? I don't think. In addition, there were many opportunities for the Cowboys the catch up after the "cutting of the line" I feel that Dan and Jordan played it smart by asking for an upgrade. BUT the Cowboys did catch up at the virtual task, which then the Cowboys could of overtaken them. They didn't take the opportunity and thus loss. So therefore, Dan and Jordan cannot be blamed entirely for their loss. I personally think that they are to blame since they did not take the opportunity.

*Note: These are MY opinions and I believe that everyone is entitled to their opinions.

"While it is perfectly fine to explain why you think a racer or a team did not do well in a task, or behaved badly, or just isn't your favorite, it is NOT okay to be rude or impolite in doing so. We don't allow personal attacks on each other or on our racer friends. Comments on how they raced are fair, personal attacks are not. "Don't hate on the Racers, hate the game."

This is a topic that still, a year later, is causing a lot of interest and discussion, which is of course always welcome. And everyone has their favorites.

But I want everyone to please continue to remember our RFF guidelines and do NOT make this discussion personal amongst you. You are welcome to express your opinions within our guidelines, but there is no need to let the discussion become about you all and your differences, rather than the teams involved.

And if you are primarily discussing Dan and Jordan you are in the right thread. If you are primarily discussing Jet and Cord, let's use their thread, okay?

Thanks everyone!

Logged

"Our fans are pretty good. They don't give away too much. Sometimes people love dropping spoilers, but our fans are good. They tend to do it in such a way that doesn't ruin it for fans who don't want to know."--Phil Keoghan

I realize now that what I say and how I say it can be taken personally, and I apologize to all who I might have offended, especially Gekkou. I got fired up by Jordan's outrage because I would react the same way. I'm also--big surprise--not a big fan of the Cowboys and I get frustrated when Dan & Jordan are scapegoated.

I'm a cowboy turned Dan and Jordan fan. The brothers won me over right on the last leg of TAR 16. I was initially rooting for Dan and Jordan as well this season, meaning i don't mind them winning. But seeing how they're raced on the first leg.. you now know why they lost to Dan and Jordan.

Hopefully people will not buy the Dan and Jordan are "cheaters" story that the producers are trying to put forth.

It was totally unprovoked, and very embarrassing. I can not thank you all enough for the love and support in these last few posts. I wear my heart on my sleeve and do get emotional (sometimes too often and unsolicited). I am not proud of the tweets I made Sunday night and definitely wish the cutting Jet and Cord in line incident at the Shanghai airport had never happened (especially since it had no effect on the Race and ended up making me look like such an a-hole). Still, I try not to live my life with regrets. I am proud of the way my brother and I ran the Race and promise to all of you that if there is ever a true allstars season where they bring back all the previous winners, and I get blessed with yet another opportunity to live the dream, then I will try harder than ever before to make you all proud, and win the Race for all of the adoring Race fans out there (I have been one for 18 seasons, and will be one until long after the show ends).

Hi Jordan,

A belated congrats on winning.

Just found this thread. Can you clarify something you guys said in an interview?

Dan Pious: Yeah, Jet called Jordan a "fag" Saturday night for absolutely no reason and Jordan just said hello to him, so there was something on the Race and I guess, in all fairness, there's some stuff that isn't shown and I think it's an important thing to get out.

I remember reading on a forum (either this one or another TAR one) from people who were at TARCon where I believe this happened? They said you were blocking Jet's way and that's when he said it. I don't think they said you had said anything? I'll see if I can find the links again.

If Jet and Cord (it doesn't look like a specific one is differentiated against in this context) were saying things about the other teams, why haven't they come forward about it as well? They did so after the Joe and Catie incidents from what I remember. The only thing I can remember is Carol and Brandy talking to each other about it but they assumed he wasn't very social and if he was indeed homophobic he kept it to himself.

In the earlier episodes (going by those unaired Youtube clips on CBS's page) you guys also said you liked the cowboys but in the segment posted from the final episode at the airport where you guys went to talk to Brent and Catie (who seemed to be uncomfortable with the discussion) you said they didn't like you because they were homophobic or something like that. What caused this shift?