torakrubik wrote:My view is that HI is the visual input of sensory cross-wiring between waking reality and the dreamworld. I don't believe that the senses digitally switch into the dreamworld when we enter dreams. The HI would explain the continuous visual transition from waking reality to the dreamworld.

That's also an excellent way to put it!

I'd add just one thing... there is a point where a consciousness can be receiving no visual input what-so-ever. This would be the point that is most commonly referred to as "The Void". It would be when you, as a consciousness is experiencing absolutely nothing... just you.

I'd call it the lack of a reality frame.

For myself, I don't see much separation between this reality and any other reality we might experience.

Voids.. I dont know what to make of them.. Ive had weird experience from a void and it may of completely changed things for me.

I was stuck in a void (well not stuck.. I should rather say LOST as I could leave. I was in a void and didnt know which way to go..or phase or however one wishes to call it to move out from it. I sat and sat in this timeless void (felt like I could of stayed there forever if i wanted) ..not knowing what to do..didnt know which way to go out.. it was different directions could of taken me to different places..nothing to be seen thou.. just a knowing of that like worm holes which couldnt be seen or dimensional zones all around the void out of it. I ended up hoping for the best and coming out of it, then I woke up, well rather this body did.. I was lucid so continuous flow of waking consciousness to this body once I'd made my choice, I then just found myself in this body and just opened my eyes and was so so confused as I hadnt ended up in the right place, the place i knew..

I'd lost this bodies waking memories and didnt know my own children, they WERENT my children. It took days to get all my memories real life?? memories back.. I like had to "download" the memories from the bodies consciousness (interestingly a well known OBEr has same kind of experiences with downloading info he recieves from sources which are given to him while OBE ... Im sure him and I have done the same thing).

The house I woke up in.. this reality..wasnt the home I very vaguely remembered coming from, it was wrong. The children here (this bodies children).. i didnt know, I didnt know their names, nothing at all about then, I didnt have any emotions at all towards them.. all I knew is that they were this bodies children.. so I had to come to know them. First downloaded the info on them into my consciousness from somewhere (it came with a downloading which included other info too.. it was like a flow of info which started at one point and then each part of info i got spread out and lead to other info streams..till all the info I needed was there. I then had to get used to them..taking days.. till I had feelings like one would for ones children. It was like my responsibility to take the children on as they belonged to this body, a role I had to do.

Thou this experience happened to me a long time back.. Im still confused over it and believe I may of ended up in a different body to what I'd previously been in... all due to becoming lost/ forgetting something.. while in a void.

Those voids are the biggest mystery to me out there. They dont fit with reality or something or maybe are entry points to all realities. You can exit very different to how you went in (i dont know if all voids are like that or just certain ones or one). Did my consciousness do a body swap due to the void? I consider myself a possible "walk-in" due to this void. ..................

So what was my experience actually.. a case of amnesia lasting days so I didnt know who I was or anything else about my family and life??? I forgot to say.. I didnt even know my name at first or who I was. (Ive researched that when I tried to work my experience out.. apparently that is very very rare, not at all likely). What about the knowing and remembering thou vague.. of a different house to the one this body lived in?? (maybe in amnesia it is possible to believe dreams over reality???? I dont have a clue). All I know is something happened and I believe it wasnt a case of medical amnesia but something to do with the void I experienced when in lucid state.

While I was in the actual void.. I think I may of actually known whoever I was. The only confusion I had while in the void was of the right way out from that hence why I spend such a long time in there trying to figure it out. So my memory of myself was wiped on leaving the void.

Last edited by taniaaust1 on 11 Feb 2013 01:47, edited 2 times in total.

From my own experience, The Void seems to be just a lack of reality. That's all. It's the nothingness of potential... if that makes any sense.

Your term "an entry points to all realities" would seem to be appropriate. It's also a "place" (and I use that term extremely loosely) in which, I've found to be quite nice to just sit there. To experience nothingness is to experience your consciousness on an intimate level you can't attain in this physical reality.

As for the experience you had, which you're interpreting as a body swap of sorts... I can only guess at the reason for the experience, but the reactive nature of the void with our thoughts could be what triggered your experience. This stuff is so personal and unique to each individual consciousness, it's hard to say one way or the other.

Ryan wrote: It's also a "place" (and I use that term extremely loosely) in which, I've found to be quite nice to just sit there. To experience nothingness is to experience your consciousness on an intimate level you can't attain in this physical reality.

A place which is no place. I too thought it was extremely nice to sit there (even if my thoughts were very chaotic at the time). So so still, completely nothingness, peaceful.. feeling that one could stay forever there if one wanted. No feeling thou at all of how long one spends there for me anyway. (thou I dont know if others get a time sense around themselves and how long they spent in void, if a stay there was shorter???).

Maybe someone can tell me that. Those who havent spend a long period in the void.. did you have any idea there of time?.....

Then on the other hand.. there is that other thing one can experience which is completely opposite to void.. where all is existing in same space and where one is all and experiencing throu all... opposite of being the only thing which exists in a place. Still peaceful but opposite to void. Many achieve the all is one thing via meditation.

Maybe I'll think of all those different things as "zones" maybe someone can start up a discussion on the different "zones" (unless someone else knows what to call them). There is also a third one Ive experienced where creation itself takes place.. being formed from energy before it becomes physical.

It's my experience that "time" is only relative to the reality frame you're experiencing... and each reality frame seems to have it own rules and timing. This would account for the rather wide range in "duration" of time in comparison to our physical reality.

Since the void is a "reality-less" reality frame... time wouldn't seem to apply. Or at least, none of which I've been able to map with any regularity.

Ryan wrote:It's my experience that "time" is only relative to the reality frame you're experiencing... and each reality frame seems to have it own rules and timing. This would account for the rather wide range in "duration" of time in comparison to our physical reality.

Since the void is a "reality-less" reality frame... time wouldn't seem to apply. Or at least, none of which I've been able to map with any regularity.

thanks that is how I thought it would be even for someone who didnt spend long in void.

Dreams always seem to have their own time. One thing Ive found thou which does run in the same time as us is my OBEs which are of the ones extremely close to our physical reality. Time in those for me runs the same as time in ours. eg I can go OBE and spend what I think is about 15 mins out and then bring myself back to my body and look at the clock and it will be around that time. I think the further the way you get from our 3D earth dimensional energy..the more time alters.

At that point, focus upon the imagery... and allow your consciousness to be taken further and further away from the physical. Keep that focus though. If you lose focus at this point, you'll lose awareness and fall asleep.

I feel like I've seen hypnagogia a few times, and I focus on it: I see it and let it continue what it's displaying, but when I'm aware of it, it fades away, making me wonder if I actually saw something, or it was a strong daydream while I closed my eyes. Any advice or thoughts?

Roxas: Did you have fun chatting with the ghosts?Sora: You shouldn't call them "ghosts". Sure something seemed a little off but I'm sure they're still my friends

taniaaust1 wrote:thanks that is how I thought it would be even for someone who didnt spend long in void.

Dreams always seem to have their own time. One thing Ive found thou which does run in the same time as us is my OBEs which are of the ones extremely close to our physical reality. Time in those for me runs the same as time in ours. eg I can go OBE and spend what I think is about 15 mins out and then bring myself back to my body and look at the clock and it will be around that time. I think the further the way you get from our 3D earth dimensional energy..the more time alters.

I have a slightly different view/perspective on what a "dream" is relative to what the average person believes a dream is.

To me, a dream is nothing more than a projection in which you don't realize you're projecting. They occur in the same reality frames that any other kind of projection does, meaning they're at the mercy of whatever "time" that particular reality frame is set to.

I'm also very on the fence in regards to what most people believe to be the environment that an OBE occurs in (aka an Etheric projection, or the "real time zone" as labeled by Robert Bruce). There are lots of good arguments both ways, and at this point I choose to not fall on one side of the fence or another because both are very possible.

Guitar48300 wrote:I feel like I've seen hypnagogia a few times, and I focus on it: I see it and let it continue what it's displaying, but when I'm aware of it, it fades away, making me wonder if I actually saw something, or it was a strong daydream while I closed my eyes. Any advice or thoughts?

Yeah, it seems to be that when you gain that "awareness" of it, you immediately snap back to reality and begin questioning what you were just experiencing. Well, what you were experiencing WAS real and DID, in fact, happened! Afterall, you DID directly experience it... and what you directly experience is real.

This is what Peter was touching on above... what is the NATURE of Hypnogogic Imagery? I'm starting to believe that they're more than just "random" imagery from your mind. I'm wondering if they're glimpses into other reality frames... a kind of Remote Viewing of sorts. Perhaps we can control these "images" a bit tighter too.

As always more questions that answers. As I said I think that HI is always present and it takes a look inside to connect and then with our skills we interact with HI or a deeper component of it. In the waking world HI could intrude. I had several experiences when my first daughter was born of flashes of a few seconds that felt like I was displaced a little in position with my point of view and I was seeing just outside of my body the world through her eyes and felt the puzzled mind and wonder of a child just experiencing awareness. This was really interesting as in hindsight it was the same imagery as HI and projected into my vision in real time during the day. IF so then its possible to receive external input for our HI, lucid dreams and then the question on which and what reality surfaces or the components of energy that we interact with in a LD

I am open minded like Ryan on where and what and always tempered by the exception that proves the rule so have had enough un-explainable events to question reality but not enough experience to form a solid view.

Who are you I asked, the reply "dont be silly, we are your daughers" many years before they were born

HI is very interesting to experience. There is no end to the variety of sensory inputs that just pop up and then disappear. I find that many of them are super-clear. The other night there was the perfectly clear sound of glass breaking, somtimes actual tastes, people's faces staring at you, hi-fi music at concert volume. Always something new and surprising. For me the best HI occurs right after bed, although I don't expect to get lucid then. I often watch it and try to extend it before going to sleep. It can be pretty trip-like and disorienting, expecially the speed at which things come and go and the intensity and clarity levels of the senses. Sometimes it feels like "channel surfing" with the television remote.

Peter wrote:As always more questions that answers. As I said I think that HI is always present and it takes a look inside to connect and then with our skills we interact with HI or a deeper component of it.

I think it is always present and hoping to develop abilities to getting it going at the right time to induce dreams and hopefully enter them consciously.

Have you ever had a dream, Neo, that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to wake from that dream? How would you know the difference between the dream world and the real world? Morpheus

Is HI also responsible for waking reality. We could be missing the point in the sense that the outside world is an illusion formed on the inside (we dont see outside of our mind) and in waking life what we see is the same HI but projected outside and sensory input used to create it.

In closing eyes or the odd time we get a mix up and see HI during the day for instants it might be the same phenomena. With eyes closed we lose immediate sensory input and then need to tune into random firings that create the HI and from there use our intent to make our dreams or act out our beliefs.

The brain might have no choice but to make the HI as it could be the reality creating process, in the day buy sensory input and create the waking word and without visual stimulation from option 2, using random recalled stored thought to just have a go. Hence the unformed HI until we attempt to insert our awareness in there and this is the input needed to get our inner worlds going.