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Phoenix Coldon, a junior at the University of Missouri-St. Louis, has been missing since Dec. 18, 2011. Phoenix was last seen in the driveway of the family's home at about 3 p.m.

The Coldon family lost their life savings and their home because of a cruel hoax that led to a false lead in the disappearance of their daughter.

Please take a moment and let Phoenix's family know you care. Please CLICK HERE and read about the case of missing Phoenix Coldon

Please stick with the facts as reported by LE or MSM, and link them. Link them often if necessary.

Please clearly state when it is your opinion. If you are making an inference please clearly outline and link the facts and evidence that have led you to form that inference. Wild speculation about any case player has no place here.

Please PM a mod with any questions or concerns and alert any TOS violations or offensive posts.

And finally, PLEASE address one another respectfully.

We will no longer allow discussion of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson,the Black Panther, or the Neo Nazi's protest(s). There are way too many and timeouts to continue this discussion. We will allow MSM links to such protests, but no discussion.

We need to stick to the facts of this case and that's our discussion here. Please, we ask that you do what you do best - SLEUTH THE CASE.

Blogs and Twitter links and discussion of them are allowed only if it's an approved WS link or a link from main stream media (MSM).

Clarification on WS stance regarding the "victim friendly" issue. I had a discussion with the owners about how we were to deal with this. This is what I was advised:

At this point in the investigation we don't KNOW exactly who ALL the victims are now. We KNOW that Trayvon is a victim, because he is dead. However, news breaks and new leaks come forth everyday and it is still unclear whether Zimmerman was a victim of any violence. Until more verifiable FACTS are available, WS has chosen to err on the side of treating both the confirmed (Trayvon) AND potential (Zimmerman) victim, both as victims.

Like I said, that may change after we have more verifiable information

Hope that helps clear this up.

Please bump as needed.

Just a reminder:

WS does not permit links that request or suggest sending donations without the clear permission of the owners . This is to protect our members and for no other reason.

Are there payphones in Sanford anymore? I never see payphones here in SW Florida anymore? Most businesses have pulled them off their properties? I'm just asking because I wonder where the phone call came from? Payphone? Land Line? Cell Phone? Calls are not that hard to trace anymore?

I still can't understand what kind of call would make 15 officers and a helicopter show up? I think we can rule out 1) Bomb threat 2) Hostage situation.

I was thinking someone may have called in and said they were George and they were going to commit suicide? But that would NOT bring a helicopter?

Burglary? Someone breaking into Zimmerman's home? Would that many officers arrive? Would they really employ the helicopter for a non-violent burglary?

So confused! Any ideas?

Justice for Trayvon

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Are there payphones in Sanford anymore? I never see payphones here in SW Florida anymore? Most businesses have pulled them off their properties? I'm just asking because I wonder where the phone call came from? Payphone? Land Line? Cell Phone? Calls are not that hard to trace anymore?

I still can't understand what kind of call would make 15 officers and a helicopter show up? I think we can rule out 1) Bomb threat 2) Hostage situation.

I was thinking someone may have called in and said they were George and they were going to commit suicide? But that would NOT bring a helicopter?

Burglary? Someone breaking into Zimmerman's home? Would that many officers arrive? Would they really employ the helicopter for a non-violent burglary?

Are there payphones in Sanford anymore? I never see payphones here in SW Florida anymore? Most businesses have pulled them off their properties? I'm just asking because I wonder where the phone call came from? Payphone? Land Line? Cell Phone? Calls are not that hard to trace anymore?

I still can't understand what kind of call would make 15 officers and a helicopter show up? I think we can rule out 1) Bomb threat 2) Hostage situation.

I was thinking someone may have called in and said they were George and they were going to commit suicide? But that would NOT bring a helicopter?

Burglary? Someone breaking into Zimmerman's home? Would that many officers arrive? Would they really employ the helicopter for a non-violent burglary?

So confused! Any ideas?

Who knows Lola. The reporter couldn't even get the date correct so there is no telling what all took place. Sure seems like an over kill to me with the helicopter, etc. I guess Sanford PD is in CYA mode right now, better safe than sorry.

~jmo~

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If the last call from the girlfriend is accurate, it began AFTER Trayvon ran. Then there were four minutes when Trayvon was talking to her. GZ got off the phone with SPD about 19:13:40, leaving 2 minutes and twenty seconds that we don't know where he was. That gets us to 19:16 when the girlfriend's call is cut off and the 911 calls began to come into the SPD.

We know where they both were for at least that last 40+ seconds when we can hear the screaming on the 911 call (recording labeled Call 3 from the Sanford web site that has now been removed.).

I'm at the point where to me it does not matter who was chasing whom, who initiated the physical confrontation or threw the first blow - if there were any blows. To me, that last forty seconds of Trayvon begging for his life and screaming for help shows a period when Trayvon was NOT attacking GZ. During that forty seconds GZ made the choice to shoot that teenager. If I were on a jury, that forty second would prove to me that this was murder.

IMO, JMO, etc.

Good stuff. The timeline is really key to understanding this case. And if you want to listen to the recordings again, the Wikipedia article on Trayvon Martin has them.

The start time of call with Trayvon's girlfriend is only known the the nearest minute. We don't know if T-Mobile dropped the seconds or rounded to the nearest second to determine that time. The four minute call length has the same problem. But if his girlfriends description was accurate, it ended before the screaming started. And that would have been at least 15 seconds before the first 911 call. (It takes time for people to recognize a problem, call 911 and get an answer).

As for the clicking noises, to me they sound like GZ is running across gravel. Perhaps between the condo driveways or in the gap between buildings.

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I don't know if anyone else has this feeling, but the whole call has my "Hinky Meter" on high? And I hate to keep on harping about it, but I just don't get it? Police know George moved out? They said they knew where he is?

It sounds like the police verified that it was a prank call, so it wouldn't have been a search warrant (that was my first thought when FT said he heard a bang... thought they busted in his door?). Plus, if it was a search warrant, I doubt that the SPD would have been involved since they are no longer in charge of this case, but there were Seminole County officers on scene? I wish it had been a search warrant because I would love to dig through Zimmerman's computer history (the nosy in me).

Think they'll release the call? It's a separate investigation?

Justice for Trayvon

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Good stuff. The timeline is really key to understanding this case. And if you want to listen to the recordings again, the Wikipedia article on Trayvon Martin has them.

The start time of call with Trayvon's girlfriend is only known the the nearest minute. We don't know if T-Mobile dropped the seconds or rounded to the nearest second to determine that time. The four minute call length has the same problem. But if his girlfriends description was accurate, it ended before the screaming started. And that would have been at least 15 seconds before the first 911 call. (It takes time for people to recognize a problem, call 911 and get an answer).

As for the clicking noises, to me they sound like GZ is running across gravel. Perhaps between the condo driveways or in the gap between buildings.

(BBM) I believe the clicking sounds came from the keyboard of the call-taker who was typing name, address and location information into the computer as he was getting it from the caller (GZ).
JMO

Justice and power must be brought together,
so that whatever is just may be powerful,
and whatever is powerful may be just.
Blaise Pascal

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http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...&postcount=989
Were exactly was GZ at that point? He claims to have taken the cut through to the next street, then followed the same path back. But that doesn't really fit with where TM's body was found. GM could have been between TM and home.

Brought over from the previous thread. When you state "cut through", are you thinking sidewalk cut through? This is not where Zimmerman was when he didn't know the address - he was on the cut through street. He was trying to describe it during the call. He was telling them to take a left..no not a left..."it's the cut through, I don't know the address". If you look at the map, it is the street that curves around to the left and straightens out again. That is my understanding.

The police never actually walked Tracy Martin through the crime scene, by his own admission. He stated this during an interview on MSNBC.

JMO

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Who knows Lola. The reporter couldn't even get the date correct so there is no telling what all took place. Sure seems like an over kill to me with the helicopter, etc. I guess Sanford PD is in CYA mode right now, better safe than sorry.

~jmo~

What a shame they didn't care as much when a young black man was shot to death and lay dead in their morgue. JMO

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Those two simple words flowed easily from the mouth of social commentator Bill Cosby during an exclusive interview Friday regarding the Trayvon Martin case, arguably the most high-profile, citizen-on-citizen U.S. slaying facing the Obama administration.

Trayvon was killed Feb. 26 in Sanford, Fla., by neighborhood watchman George Zimmerman, who told police that a “confrontation” with the unarmed 17-year-old led him to shoot in self-defense.

Mr. Cosby, a Navy veteran, said “the gun” empowered Mr. Zimmerman, whose actions have stirred a firestorm of debate, protests and remarks from President Obama.

“We’ve got to get the gun out of the hands of people who are supposed to be on neighborhood watch,” said Mr. Cosby, whose remarks were the first he has made publicly about the case.

“Without a gun, I don’t see Mr. Zimmerman approaching Trayvon by himself,” Mr. Cosby explained. “The power-of-the-gun mentality had him unafraid to confront someone. Even police call for backup in similar situations.

“When you carry a gun, you mean to harm somebody, kill somebody,” he said.

Those two simple words flowed easily from the mouth of social commentator Bill Cosby during an exclusive interview Friday regarding the Trayvon Martin case, arguably the most high-profile, citizen-on-citizen U.S. slaying facing the Obama administration.

Trayvon was killed Feb. 26 in Sanford, Fla., by neighborhood watchman George Zimmerman, who told police that a “confrontation” with the unarmed 17-year-old led him to shoot in self-defense.

Mr. Cosby, a Navy veteran, said “the gun” empowered Mr. Zimmerman, whose actions have stirred a firestorm of debate, protests and remarks from President Obama.

“We’ve got to get the gun out of the hands of people who are supposed to be on neighborhood watch,” said Mr. Cosby, whose remarks were the first he has made publicly about the case.

“Without a gun, I don’t see Mr. Zimmerman approaching Trayvon by himself,” Mr. Cosby explained. “The power-of-the-gun mentality had him unafraid to confront someone. Even police call for backup in similar situations.

“When you carry a gun, you mean to harm somebody, kill somebody,” he said.

Thanks. It's one of my favorite songs. If you click on the title it will take you to the YouTube video, but fair warning: you will cry. I still do every single time.

I loved it. THANKS it reminds me how great the human spirit is, and makes me more grateful to the Real life heroes who not only play hero on the big screen but do the kind of work that George Clooney, Brad Pitt, Damon And others do to contribute to social justice. Loved the vidio.

Women are Angels.
And when someone breaks our wings,
we simply continue to fly... on a broomstick.

Brought over from the previous thread. When you state "cut through", are you thinking sidewalk cut through? This is not where Zimmerman was when he didn't know the address - he was on the cut through street. He was trying to describe it during the call. He was telling them to take a left..no not a left..."it's the cut through, I don't know the address". If you look at the map, it is the street that curves around to the left and straightens out again. That is my understanding.

The police never actually walked Tracy Martin through the crime scene, by his own admission. He stated this during an interview on MSNBC.

JMO

then how did he know the walk his son took home and where he played when his body was found? He was told by the police.

Women are Angels.
And when someone breaks our wings,
we simply continue to fly... on a broomstick.

We're flexible like that.

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Brought over from the previous thread. When you state "cut through", are you thinking sidewalk cut through? This is not where Zimmerman was when he didn't know the address - he was on the cut through street. He was trying to describe it during the call. He was telling them to take a left..no not a left..."it's the cut through, I don't know the address". If you look at the map, it is the street that curves around to the left and straightens out again. That is my understanding.

The police never actually walked Tracy Martin through the crime scene, by his own admission. He stated this during an interview on MSNBC.

JMO

I posted this link last evening and asked you to please indicate where the "cut-through street" is you keep referencing in your posts. Could you please take a moment and point it out to me. TIA.

Brought over from the previous thread. When you state "cut through", are you thinking sidewalk cut through? This is not where Zimmerman was when he didn't know the address - he was on the cut through street. He was trying to describe it during the call. He was telling them to take a left..no not a left..."it's the cut through, I don't know the address". If you look at the map, it is the street that curves around to the left and straightens out again. That is my understanding.

The police never actually walked Tracy Martin through the crime scene, by his own admission. He stated this during an interview on MSNBC.

JMO

I keep seeing this repeated.....but according to the satellite view of the neighborhood.....there are only THREE streets in the entire neigborhood, but there are no cut through streets at all.....the cut through is a sidewalk, no street there.

FYI,, The reporter that issued the story about GZs home being "pranked" has retracted the story on her website.. WTH? It truly IS a full moon! I really wish MSM would be more responsible..

Have you got a link to her website? The article is still there unchanged, and there's nothing on her Facebook or Twitter except confirmation that it was a prank. Maybe she means her story was a prank, or that she was pranked.

I don't criticize the media much, but this is ridiculous! At least get the day/week/month right, you know? Did she really talk to Frank Taafe at all?

I'm the proud mother of a new attorney! It's better to know some of the questions than all of the answers. ~ James ThurberThe only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do nothing ~ Edmund BurkeWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. ~ Mark Twain

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