An interview with Egidio Ingala and Marco Gisfredi of the Jackknives

A few weeks ago I received a CD in the mail from a band called, Egidio “Juke” Ingala and the Jackknives. The record entitled Tired of Beggin’ made it onto the hi-fi and into my ears that evening. I was knocked out by what I heard.

This band, as it turns out, is from an area near Milan, Italy. Each of the four members of this band are serious students of blues and have been playing this music for a very long time. Like many of their European counterparts they have gone directly to the source material to learn this art form. Also, like many of the European musicians that I have been listening to, they seem to treat American music with the utmost respect and reverence. Take one listen to Tired of Beggin’ and you will understand what I’m talking about.

Enjoy a conversation I had with harmonica player and vocalist Egidio Ingala and the band’s guitarist Marco Gisfredi.

David Mac (DM): What kind of music did you grow up with?

Egidio Ingala (EI): Well, my generation grew up with the music of the Italian songwriters and English Rock. I've never been a big fan of these kinds of music.

DM: When did you first hear American roots musical forms?

EI: It was when I was seventeen years old in the late 70’s.

DM: Marco do you remember some of the first experiences you had listening to American music

Marco Gisfredi (MG): I do. I had this cassette tape when I was eight years old. I would listen all the time to that tape. It was a cheap compilation with some Little Richard, Fats Domino, Chuck Berry and Bo Diddley music. I also had this B.B. King collection which I still listen to to this day. It features one of my favorite slow blues of all time, Don’t Answer The Door. I love the song so much that recently I bought the original 45 on vinyl. When I was fifteen, I was on vacation in London. I bought Magic Sam Live. That sure was a very inspirational record for me.

DM: Egidio,What were your thoughts as it relates to hearing this music for the first time?

EI: American music has always fascinated me, especially the music with black-American roots. I always liked to understand and go in search of the history of this music and discover the various forms, in particular the music scene of the 1950’s always fascinated me from the beginning. I was struck by the rhythm, the feeling, the voices, the sounds. I did not yet understand the lyrics but the music caught me immediately.

DM: Marco, how about you, what were some of your first impressions of hearing blues music?

MG: When I first heard this music I was very young and I had no idea about its history or its background. That came later. What first grabbed me was the natural superiority of this music compared with any other kind of music. I believe it’s something to do with the fascinating atmospheres this music can create. I remember one of my favorite songs at the time was Muddy’s Louisiana Blues. That’s some very deep stuff! Jimi Hendrix is reported to have said that "the first guitar player I was aware of was Muddy Waters. I first heard him as a little boy and it scared me to death". I can definitely relate to that.

DM: Marco how did you get started playing and singing music?

MG: When I was thirteen I decided to get some guitar lessons. I started with a borrowed electric guitar. I then switched to an acoustic and played with a rack harmonica. I went through a long Dylan phase. Finally, I went back to the electric guitar and bought a Stratocaster. That was my first real instrument. Recently, I started playing a little mandolin too, in the Johnny Young, Yank Rachell tradition.

DM: Were there others in your community who listened to or played this music?

EI: I never found friends in school that were blues fans. In my school people listened to a lot of rock like Deep Purple and Pink Floyd, things like that. In Italy at that time it was not so easy to meet friends who loved blues music like I did.

DM: What made you want to start playing this music?

EI: I started playing blues maybe because the blues in that period was my biggest interest. I felt that I had to be part of that music. For me it was a natural step. The day after I went to my first blues concert I went straight to buy my first Marine Band harmonica.

DM: What inspired you to begin singing and playing the harmonica?

EI: I remember very well the first blues concert. There was a friend of mine, who was much older than me. I was fascinated by his personality and he played harp too. Sometimes he took his harmonica and played some licks by Sonny Terry. I was impressed by that guy. One day he told me "Tomorrow night I’m playing in Milan with my band." It was at a small blues festivals. I went there and I was so amazed by the sound of the amplified harp. They were playing Chicago blues. So the next day I went to buy my first harp.

DM: Did you have any music teachers and or mentors that helped you as a young person?

EI: I picked up things from reading books that discussed the blues, the musicians and essential records to buy. For instance I remember coming across a reference to “Hoodoo Man Blues” by Junior Wells. I was fascinated by the title of that record. Then I discovered it was by a harmonica player who, up until that time, was completely unknown to me.

DM: Marco?

MG: I tried many teachers because I really wanted to get better at playing and thought that attending to music lessons was the best thing to do. There were rock guitar teachers. I realized it was a tremendous waste of time and money because nobody could teach me the old school blues style I wanted to learn. Nobody could even play it. I’m not saying music lessons are useless. Sitting in the same room with Magic Sam would be pretty useful. What I mean is that the kind of music lessons most of us could get in Italy, as well as in many other countries, are useless or even dangerous. The only thing you can do is LISTEN to the records you like and try and figure out what notes to play. I just love this Steve Cropper quote "Just follow the dots and you can't get into trouble."

DM: Egidio, let’s talk about your musical influences.

EI: I was always fascinated by the style of Junior Wells, I listened to his records for days. But my real musical references have become Little Walter and George Harmonica Smith. Little Walter was and will forever be the true icon of the blues harmonica. He was able to expand and give new shades to the blues. His harmonica licks were taken and copied by thousands of harp players. Every time you listen to his songs you can find always new things and new feelings.

DM: Then there is George “Harmonica” Smith. I know he is an inspiration for you as well.

EI: George Smith is on the other hand raw, pure emotion. You can see many moods at the same time. You can’t stay and be indifferent. His licks with the chromatic have left the mark. Little Walter and George Smith should be the reference points and the idols for every blues harmonica player. I also studied a lot of the records by Big Walter Horton and Jimmy Reed. I also studied guitarists like T-Bone Walker, Freddy King, B.B. King, Pee Wee Crayton and Tiny Grimes.

DM: Through the years I have talked to a lot of harmonica players who have been influenced by the jazz saxaphone. Does this apply to you?

EI: YES! Also I have been inspired by jazz musicians such as saxaphionists Gene Ammons and Lester Young. I have always been impressed by their sound that they were able to create with sax. It is a real hot sound! Even Roy Milton, Jimmy Liggins, Big Joe Turner and Wynonie Harris have influenced me a lot just because of their style and tastes. Thanks to them, now I have a wider and more varied knowledge of the black-American music.

MG:We have been called, “the Italian Aces” in an Italian review. That’s maybe the best compliment we’ve ever received because we all love the Aces and their sound, from their first recordings in the 50s to the 70s stuff. So players like Louis Myers, Eddie Taylor, Ike Turner, Earl Hooker, Jimmy Dawkins, B.B., Hubert, Sammy Lawhorn, Mickey Baker and so on are all main influences. And there are some less-known players that I love, guys like Hip Linkchain and Lee Jackson or Ulysses James from the Bay Area. I love jazz players as well like Grant Green and Bill Jennings. Also early rock’n’roll stuff like Roland James and Paul Burlison. Let’s not forget southern soul!

DM: Egidio, what were some of your early band experiences like?

EI: I started playing with a band about one year after I got my first harp. I started hanging around the Milan blues scene. I knew a lot of blues fans like me who wanted to play. We played blues classics like B.B. King, Muddy, but also songs like Slim Harpo’s Scratch My Back and things like that. In the mid-80s we were hired to do some gigs with Eddie C. Campbell and Little Willie Littlefield here in Italy. We were all at the beginning. We were a little fearful, but this helped us to get better.

DM:Let’s talk about the blues scene in Italy.

EI: In Italy there is little interest in all black-American music. There are festivals called “blues festivals” where there is not even a blues musician. As for myself, I have been playing for twenty five years now. In Italy there are some really talented blues musicians, but for the reasons I said before they find many problems in playing and finding gigs. For many of them it’s really hard.

DM: This might be a good time to talk about the formation of the band known as Egidio “Juke” Ingala and the Jackknives.

EI: First of all, this band is made up of four musicians who are all real fans of blues, swing, r & b and early rock & roll. I think our band, it’s a sort of natural union. In Italy the blues community is not so big. Everyone knows everyone. For a time I was thinking of a band that had the same goals and my tastes, a band that could interpret and express a sound, original, authentic. I was always attracted by the authentic sounds. It can be Chicago Blues, West Coast Blues or Louisiana blues. I found the right musicians to get that sound.

DM: Let’s talk about the other musicians in your band Egidio.

EI: Marco on guitar is definitely one of those guitarists who can express and recreate the authentic sound that helps set this band apart. He has a great pathos and each solo is never discounted. The same thing can be noted by Enrico on drums. His idols are Odie Payne and Fred Below. He plays with the right swing. He is an immovable pillar of the band. I used to play with Massimo our bass player in a band called Dirty Hands in the early 90s. He has a great feel for this music. His contribution to this band is vital.

MG: I would just like to say I think it is our bass and drummer that helps separate this band. Everyone collects records and truly loves the music we play. Massimo and Enrico have a deep knowledge about blues and vintage Afro-American languages and they can really swing. I would also like to point out Egidio and Massimo’s band Dirty Hands were quite popular on the European blues circuit at that time.

DM: Your brand new album, Tired of Beggin' is terrific. How is it being received?

EI: The album is getting some positive feedback from all over Europe.

DM: You have some interesting covers and interpretations of some great songs. You also have some very fresh sounding originals on the record.

EI: The idea of ​​recording some covers that are not so famous was a conscious decision. Personally I really liked also to “readapt” some covers with our own sound. I guess there are some interesting things in the covers we recorded like the tunes by Lonesome Sundown, Little Sonny Jones and the same with the title track by the Sly Fox and Ike Turner’s Tired of Beggin'. We are very satisfied with the sound we were able to create in studio. We like to call that sound, ‘old school blues played with a swingin’ feel’.

MG: We recorded in Italy at DepositoZero studios in Forlì. They’ve got a very nice sounding room, and they care a lot about recording live with vintage equipment.

DM: What’s next for the band?

MG: We’ll be playing at some blues festivals next summer and we’re planning a tour in Germany for the autumn. We try to keep us busy.

EI: One day we would love also to come over to the United States to bring our show. I think that the American audience and blues fans will appreciate our repertoire and our sound.

DM: What are your interests outside of music?

EI: I practice some sports like running and swimming. I love the mountains and nature photography.

MG: I like watching old movies, especially 60s and 70s American films. I dig hiking too.

DM: What would you like people to know about yourself and your band?

EI: The strong point of the band is our live concerts. It is there where we can express ourselves in the best way.

MG: We are fanatics who love to play this music and get great pleasure in doing that. Naturally we hope a little of this passion shows through our music.

DM: What do you like most about being a blues musician Egidio?

EI: Playing blues is one of the best ways to share my feelings with someone who has the same passion and who speaks the same language like we are doing now Dave. The blues is history and behind the history there is a culture, a tradition. When I play I just want to maintain this tradition and to do this you have to know the culture and history of the blues. This is the most fascinating thing for me.

DM: Thank you guys very much for doing this interview in English. I do appreciate that.