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Will never get to the level we and the club wants if our top players (2 are new signings) are not available for selection. This, together, with other players carrying knocks it is an incredible situation after less than a handful of games played.

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Will never get to the level we and the club wants if our top players (2 are new signings) are not available for selection. This, together, with other players carrying knocks it is an incredible situation after less than a handful of games played.

It's very worrying. Loy and Low have both been injury prone in the past so it can't be a huge surprise to Hartley.

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Players get injured due to the way they play the game, if you ask them to take it easy, you won't get the same performance out of them, we aren't any different to any other club, it gives others a chance to shownwhat they are capable of, we have depth this season, and should always have enough to beat most in the league at Dens.

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Players get injured due to the way they play the game, if you ask them to take it easy, you won't get the same performance out of them, we aren't any different to any other club, it gives others a chance to shownwhat they are capable of, we have depth this season, and should always have enough to beat most in the league at Dens.

After 4 games WTF??

We are struggling with injuries, two of which are our major summer signings. Something is not right.

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We are struggling with injuries, two of which are our major summer signings. Something is not right.

What difference does one game, four games or fourteen games make, players get injured, it's a fact, that's when you need others to stand up and be counted, saints had a few players injured before the league started.

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What difference does one game, four games or fourteen games make, players get injured, it's a fact, that's when you need others to stand up and be counted, saints had a few players injured before the league started.

Bottom line is hartley only trusts about 14-15 of his players.....guys like ferry are just filling a bench,with zero chance of going on

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If, with 3-4 injuries to players who'd almost certainly be in the starting XI, our bench is widely considered "weak", then we don't have the "two players for every position" that may have been implied, following this summer's transfer dealings.

However, like at least 8 other SPL clubs, we're in no position to pay a consistent level of salary across a 22-player squad, so we're bound to have a few less experienced / less gifted players in that squad.

A big, strong, goal-threatening striker to add to Loy & Hemmings would be great, to give Hartley a 2-from-3 option.....but how many of that kind of striker are there, either on the "available/out of contract" market, or playing in the lower leagues (here/Ireland/England)?

If Hartley can't get enough out of Roberts/Tankulic, and can't move them on, he's probably stuck with no available budget.

We really need to find a like-for-like backup/future replacement for Thomson, but again, where does Hartley find such a player, and the funds to acquire him & pay his wages? As with strikers, if we have midfielders who aren't going to deliver what's required, moving them on isn't a quick fix.

Hartley may have signed some of the players in question, on 2-year deals, but we're one of many clubs who do have to take a bit of a gamble on how a player may develop. I'd suggest if we're getting a 50% or higher success rate, we're probably doing better than most others.

Other than Celtic & Aberdeen, I'm not convinced any other club doesn't have exactly the same problem, and finances are - I think - clearly the reason. No-one's borrowing money now, so wages have to fit within the income the clubs generate. As an example, removing 3 key players from the Arabs, plus another couple of experienced players not staying on, seems to have left their team with identical issues....this seemed obvious from the mistakes made against us & against Celtic today. Other than the current top 3, I think the other 9 clubs could finish the season in any random order (but I think Hearts may make that group 10)....though Killie seem to be trying hard to be this season's County.

The clubs that finish immediately below Celtic & Aberdeen (I think Hearts will start to drop points soon) may be the ones who can utilise their "2nd choice squad players" to best effect, and I suspect that's only going to happen by giving them frequent games to try to improve them.