Thursday, September 28, 2006

I can't understand Finnish language but could you, if you're familiar with it, let me know what these people speak about in the video? You can also see the commies protesting the late Shah of Iran during his visit. Shahbanoo has always been down to earth and gracious. Iran really misses the royal family...

25 comments:

Winston, not everybody protesting against a ruthless dictator is a commie.

In short, the protesters quite clearly asked the shah to go home (as you can hear in English on the video). The guy in a dark cap and tie with blonde hair and slightly unshaven interviewed around the middle told he doesn't appreciate the shah being given a reception by the city of Helsinki. The guy is today the foreign minister, by the way. A couple of signs told the message more bluntly, my favourite being the one which told him to f**k off in Finnish. This is freedom of speech and democracy which the shah quite didn't tolerate at home. Sad the mullahs are even worse of course.

Most of the midaged women you see interviewed are very positive and tell, in worst cases, that they used to be in love with the shah. Wake up, idiots, this is not a prince and princess tale!

Last but not least, it's questionable what the connection between travelling with a big entourage and being down to earth really is ;-).

By the way, Farah Diba visited Finland a couple of years ago promoting her autobiography. She presented it in the best bookstore in the country with a bunch of bodyguards surrounding her. After the official interview, somebody in the crowd asked her what the difference between her and Saddam's wife is. The bodyguards threw the questioning mind out.

Now, freedom of speech in action or then the question was too close to the point perhaps.

I think you sometimes confuse Freedom of Expression with "Freedom to be a Jerk" - private citiznes are under no obligation to allow somebody to insult them without doing something about it :)

I'm waiting for somebody like "LibyaWarrior" to excercise his so-called freedom of expression to say that muslims should kill American Christians or some such, and then I'll excercise my freedom of expression to knock him on his ass :D

Winston, technically the question was not a comparison but giving Farah Diba the chance to tell what the difference is. The reply was having the person asking thrown out instead of a polite whitewashing. That tells a lot.

It's incredible some people still think the shah was a saint or an angel.

I guess my knowledge of the former Iranian royal family is about as good as yours about Saddam: not deep but enough to draw some conclusions ;-).

Aryamehr, the current foreign minister is as much of a communist as the average conservative is a fascist or Nazi. In his wild young days, he used to demonstrate a lot, a couple of years before the shah's visit against the Soviet invasion of Czechoslovakia (you see these clips still sometimes on tv). Commies were never well-known for demonstraring against the Soviets, just for your information.

No dude, You don't live in Iran, you are probably a neo-commie and you never had to live under Saddam bombs for 8 yrs. Yep, I know little about my royal family and Saddam and you do know better. Have fun with your dumb views!

Like I said, you commies have always played dumb and stupid. Keep it up becuz it makes us feel better and makes us strong in our fight against communists and islamist appeasers like you!

Winston, calling people who voluntarily translate things for you dumb and commies (I'm against both commies and dumb people myself) is exactly the best way to acquire friendships and more voluntary actions in the blogosphere.

Calling people unrealistic names in fact tells any outsider reader more about you and your ideology than me and my perceived thinking. But that's not exactly my problem.

Thank you very very much for your tolerance, open-mindedness and general kindness. Thank God I've known other kinds of Iranians as well.

"By the way, Farah Diba visited Finland a couple of years ago promoting her autobiography. She presented it in the best bookstore in the country with a bunch of bodyguards surrounding her. After the official interview, somebody in the crowd asked her what the difference between her and Saddam's wife is. The bodyguards threw the questioning mind out.

Now, freedom of speech in action or then the question was too close to the point perhaps."

What an IDIOTIC comment/action! What does the Empress of Iran have to do with the wife of that lowlife murderer Saddam Hussein??!!! You communists make an excellent mockery of yourselves. If you can't appear civilized before foreign dignitaries or at least ask relevant questions you better sit at home reading the works of Marx and Engels dreaming of the bloody legacy of Stalin and Lenin!

Winston, NBA (non-blogging) is a good guy. He means well, trust me on that! I've had a lot of discussions with him on other blogs. I disagree with him a lot but he isn't malicious. I don't know enough to comment about the Shah one way or the other, I'm just saying NBA isn't the person you think he is :)

Oh dear, we have a real fight here! And now I feel guilty to Non-blogging, because it was me who asked him to visit here and help. Winston, he didn't mean to hurt you, just expressed his opinion, and to Republicans royals are exactly as acceptable targets of harsh words as presidents because both are public figures and as such are not entitled to the sensitivities and privacy rights of ordinary people (it is quite another matter whether the harsh words are justified). You could instead explain why you admire the Shah and his family.

The shah and his reputation was manufactured by Carter et al. The shah was basically framed and set up by a bunch American advisors who gave him the wrong advice. The poor Shah should have never listened to them.

Resorting to this kind of tactics is as an old art form. What they did to Shah is very similar to what they did to Mary Antoinette which led to her beheading by guillotine and the brutal death of her 10 year old son in prison. They even falsely accused her of inces in the court which was never pursued by the court because everyone in the court knew that they have gone too far and it was too vulgar. They made her 10 year old son to falsely accuse his own mother of incest. It's amazing what humans can do to other humans.

I should actually make a collection of labels put on me on the blogs. Communist and Islamist appeaser are new ones although some older labels indeed hinted towards that direction ;-). Note everybody that I wrote here earlier that the shah was anyway better than what came after him. That's not a typical Islamist appeasing viewpoint.

For Winston's information, during the most recent Israeli-Lebanese conflict I was labelled as pro-Israeli by a Syrian failing to admit Syria ever occupied Lebanon.

Pro-Israeli Islamist appeasing Communist is an explosive yet somewhat contradictionary combination :-). Craig should take back his words on me not being malicious and this would be even dangerous :-).

Winston, more seriously, instead of hitting people with dissenting views (you're for a democratic regime change anyway which to me means dissenting viewpoints should be allowed as well), it'd be interesting to hear what Maya asked you, that is why you admire the former royal family. I promise not to debate these issues with you here anymore, not because of self-censorship but because I've no interest in debates where the sides are not likely to accept each other's points from the beginning.

You try to play the innocent, but let's look at what you did:A translation was asked for. You gave very little translation and instead expressed your vitriol for the Shah and insulted his wife on a blog where those two people are very admired.Not very nice of you.Winston's first reply politely thanked you and disagreed.Then you came back and insulted the Shah's wife again.You were asked to please stop, but you didn't.

Now you go around complaining to others that you weren't treated very politely! Lol.Give me a break! You started the antagonism. Don't go whining to others afterward that your 'help' wasn't appreciated. You really weren't any help to begin with as you didn't provide much of the service you were asked for.

If a group of political dissenters funded by the soviets--as Shah's dissenters and political oppositions were--tried to overthrow the Bush adminstration or any other American adminstration, how do you think they'll be treated by the said adminstration?

Winston and other ex-pats like us get so emotionally outraged that sometimes we become speecheless at the display of ignorance and utter injustices manufactured by vicious people with agendas...I think we're still in a state of shock...

I strongly urge all Iranians and non-iranians to read about the history of Iran, specially 18th and 19th century Iran in order to get a complete picture of just how backward we were as a nation (thanks to the akhunds and the Qajars) and how far the two Pahlavi kings (albeit not perfect) brought us in a mere 53 years. Our societal and political problems were not caused in these short 53 years. Their roots were deep. But the young people of the 1970's were tragically short on memory and long on idealism and unwarranted expectations. And today's generation of young Iranians pay a heavy price for it.

A translation was asked for. You gave very little translation and instead expressed your vitriol for the Shah and insulted his wife on a blog where those two people are very admired. Not very nice of you.

I voluntarily translated parts of a video which nobody else on this blog currently understands because of language difficulties. If you want a professional translation of every word there, please find a translation service ;-).

You started the antagonism.

Absolutely not true. The first derogative word in in this thread was by Winston, labelling the protesters commies with no knowledge of who the people are. Later, we have here absurdities like someone called Aryamehr claiming he knows who's a commie from the appearance and who's not.

You've all the right to criticize the protesters (admittingly, some of them were communists but you shouldn't label all of them because of that) but labels like Winston started putting make the labellers ridiculous in the minds of someone who knows the historical and political background of the demonstrations better.

You really weren't any help to begin with as you didn't provide much of the service you were asked for.

If unhappy, I'm repeating, please collect some money and find a professional translator. Most of the video is quite boring, though, being a slow documentary from the 70s. That you don't understand it doesn't make a big loss indeed ;-).

Also, regarding Farah Diba, check my posts again, I've just been quoting a real life incident of something that happened and which I read about in an article of an Iranian writer living in Finland. Quoting an event is far less insulting than calling everybody one doesn't agree with commie, communist bastard, idiot, Islamist appeaser or jerk.

Anonymous,

I've no agenda except for that I definitely support a democratic change of regime in Iran. Iranians, most of those I've met truly nice people, do deserve much better than what they have at the moment. But to me, all people who claim to be for that must be able to tolerate dissenting opinions on disputed (= how much ever one adores the late shah, even the most loyal adorers can't claim he's not disputed by his opponents and neutral critical minds) historical personalities, otherwise the "democratic" nature of the regime change is discredited, freedom of expression being a cornerstone of democracy.

OK, enough from me on this topic. Won't comment anymore. You please feel free to comment any Finnish personalities as much and as critically as you want as long as the commentary is based on facts. Now you Iranians please go and throw the current regime out and replace it with something better. Your fellow countrymen living there deserve that.

You came to the blog and your first 2 comments posted were to criticize and insult the Shah and his wife on a blog that clearly respects and supports them.

You can try to lie to yourself about what you did and your attitude in your first 2 posts, but everyone reading them can see for themselves.

As for your translation, you are the one who complained to others that you so galantly came to this thread to help translate something, which you really didn't.I didn't criticize your lack of translation until after you used your I-just-came-to-the-blog to-help-translate sob story to others. You want people to think that you did something honorable by posting a translation and that you're the agrieved victim of impoliteness and hostility.YOU started it. Read your first 2 posts again. If necessary, step out of your shoes and look at the situation from Winston's shoes. If you still don't see what you did, you're hopelessly blind.

I have to agree with noon-blogging. You know I have always been a freind to you, and appreciated your friendship as well. but I always have told you that you are too harsh on people who do not aree with you. I think you should cool down a little my firend. Not everyone is a royalist and not every one admires the late shah. But they may be all for a democratic change in IRan. You do not have to agree with them on some points, but you have to and I mean that in capital letters "HAVE TO" learn to tolarate others' view points. IF, again in capital letters that is, you are going to advertise for a democracy and freedom of speech in yor blog. Otehrwise, it is much better to say that you are a royalist who is against the freedom of speech, unless it is something in the line of speech that you like and you agree with, which is more similar to what the shah was practicing as well.

I think we should all leanr better to get along, otherwise we may loose the few friends we may have in the blogworld. By few, I really mean a few, meaning that there are not enough....