I don't see why Kishkumen gets all upset when people grow suspicious of him. he admittedly has tried to argue with himself in very weird ways on this board over the years. It's crazy stuff. He's gone through the trouble to defend himself via different monikers, has gone through the trouble of responding to himself through different monikers, often putting up some battle with himself. Sometimes these posts are popping up within a few minutes of each other.

That some other anonymous folks are trying to say Kish is not Scratch can't be taken seriously. Afterall these other anonymous folks aren't doing anything different than both Kish and Scratch while playing the game (thanks Gad).

And you guys wonder why you're considered such a hateful and messed up group who isn't to be taken seriously. I mean come on. You can't see the nose in front of your face.

Author:

Kishkumen [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:30 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

stemelbow wrote:

I don't see why Kishkumen gets all upset when people grow suspicious of him. he admittedly has tried to argue with himself in very weird ways on this board over the years. It's crazy stuff. He's gone through the trouble to defend himself via different monikers, has gone through the trouble of responding to himself through different monikers, often putting up some battle with himself. Sometimes these posts are popping up within a few minutes of each other.

That some other anonymous folks are trying to say Kish is not Scratch can't be taken seriously. Afterall these other anonymous folks aren't doing anything different than both Kish and Scratch while playing the game (thanks Gad).

And you guys wonder why you're considered such a hateful and messed up group who isn't to be taken seriously. I mean come on. You can't see the nose in front of your face.

Yeah, stem, it is fine for you to talk out of your ass like this, since it costs you nothing to be impertinent and obtuse for whatever enjoyment you get out of it, but, you see, a number of us know each other in real life. So, sure, we use pseudonyms online; many do for the practical purposes of protecting other aspects of our lives, partly because, as is abundantly clear from cases like Laura Compton and John Dehlin, there is always some motivated soul out there who decides they don't like your rhetoric and so they make a big deal out of it. You may not think that we should have the right of a little discussion board where we can vent, speculate, play a little, etc. Obviously you disagree, and yet you are here, you are anonymous, and you are playing games. So, the big difference between us is that you don't like us, you want to judge us, and you hang around to make silly comments about it. Fine. Fair enough. Just remember, Elmer Fudd, that many of your criticisms are just as easily applied to you.

You ask why I don't like being called Scratch. It should be pretty clear. Scratch takes things farther than the rest of us are willing to. You will see neither Gadianton nor Kishkumen go to the lengths that Scratch does. You will also see that neither of us are as focused on Daniel Peterson as Scratch is. On the other board, Ray held up the threat of a defamation suit against me and Scratch from Daniel Peterson. So, 1) I do not go to the lengths Scratch goes because I don't agree with doing that, 2) and I am not eager to suffer for Scratch's choices. I have no indication thus far that Scratch will do anything to end Ray's ill-aimed crusade.

Surely even you can get that. Someone out there is so desperate to be done with Scratch, that that person has no scruples about squeezing whomever he or she can to push that process along, even an inch. If that person thinks Scratch is sick, he or she should look in the mirror.

Author:

Carton [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:40 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

Kishkumen wrote:

You ask why I don't like being called Scratch. It should be pretty clear. Scratch takes things farther than the rest of us are willing to. You will see neither Gadianton nor Kishkumen go to the lengths that Scratch does.

I don't have a dog in this race, but when I first became a member here I thought that you and Dr. Scratch were the same person. I've mentioned that before. I exchanged PMs with another poster on the board on a different topic, and I ended up asking about the Scratch/Kish thing. This poster replied to me and said that he/she had heard from another poster that Scratch, Kishkumen, and Gadianton were all the same person. Yes, this is third hand at best. But this is what I was told.

Author:

Samantabhadra [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:47 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

stemelbow wrote:

He's gone through the trouble to defend himself via different monikers, has gone through the trouble of responding to himself through different monikers, often putting up some battle with himself.

Kierkegaard wrote philosophical works under several different pseudonyms and their perspectives often clashed. Fernando Pessoa used the same technique within single volumes.

This is a relatively simplistic literary decision. Kishkumen is educated enough to be aware of its rich history in Western literature. You, apparently, are not.

Author:

Kishkumen [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:48 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

Carton wrote:

I don't have a dog in this race, but when I first became a member here I thought that you and Dr. Scratch were the same person. I've mentioned that before. I exchanged PMs with another poster on the board on a different topic, and I ended up asking about the Scratch/Kish thing. This poster replied to me and said that he/she had heard from another poster that Scratch, Kishkumen, and Gadianton were all the same person. Yes, this is third hand at best. But this is what I was told.

So what is your angle here, Carton?

I have a PM box that contains messages from Gadianton in which he and I are bantering about our mutual interest in home studios (music). The moderators are welcome to enter my PM box and confirm this. I also have PMs from Scratch in there. The moderators are also invited to check to see whether this is the case. They can even read them.

Your behavior in jumping on this accusation and repeatedly sharing your empty impression that all three of us are the same person is some kind of unfriendly gesture. I would appreciate it if you would knock it off. Your "impression" is mistaken, and you have already repeated it multiple times. The only further value it has is to stoke the fires of an unfounded accusation.

Author:

stemelbow [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:53 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

Kishkumen wrote:

Yeah, stem, it is fine for you to talk out of your ass like this, since it costs you nothing to be impertinent and obtuse for whatever enjoyment you get out of it, but, you see, a number of us know each other in real life. So, sure, we use pseudonyms online; many do for the practical purposes of protecting other aspects of our lives, partly because, as is abundantly clear from cases like Laura Compton and John Dehlin, there is always some motivated soul out there who decides they don't like your rhetoric and so they make a big deal out of it.

Yes. You tend to get motivated in making a big deal out of your particular anger or hate for certain people. I see that. You attempt to go after them for some reason or another, at times. Which is a shame.

Quote:

You may not think that we should have the right of a little discussion board where we can vent, speculate, play a little, etc.

That's ridiculous. Of course I grant you have such a right. I just think it's all silliness when the main point raised here is you and others don't like the way some LDS do things when you guys go about doing things the very way you complain LDS folks do. I point out the hypocrisy and you pout. I don't deny you have a right to behave hypocritically if you so like. Go ahead. But don't pretend I don't have a right to point this out.

Quote:

Obviously you disagree, and yet you are here, you are anonymous, and you are playing games. So, the big difference between us is that you don't like us, you want to judge us, and you hang around to make silly comments about it. Fine. Fair enough. Just remember, Elmer Fudd, that many of your criticisms are just as easily applied to you.

You are weird. You realize that much of my complaints about the goings on here is that it is largely a place of hypocritical complaints. If you are able to apply my own criticisms on me, then it's obvious you are able to recognize your own hypocrisy. No need to pretend it's not there anymore.

Quote:

You ask why I don't like being called Scratch. It should be pretty clear. Scratch takes things farther than the rest of us are willing to. You will see neither Gadianton nor Kishkumen go to the lengths that Scratch does. You will also see that neither of us are as focused on Daniel Peterson as Scratch is. On the other board, Ray held up the threat of a defamation suit against me and Scratch from Daniel Peterson. So, 1) I do not go to the lengths Scratch goes because I don't agree with doing that, 2) and I am not eager to suffer for Scratch's choices. I have no indication thus far that Scratch will do anything to end Ray's ill-aimed crusade.

That you wish to adamantly point out the differences between you and Scratch is weird too. We can see the differences. The point you ought to pursue if you're so afraid of Ray or DCP going after you, is to prove it. Come out with Scratch and demonstrate it. It ain't that hard. In the end, you enjoy the game and attention, obviously. You don't want the truth to be known. Then people will pay you less attention, or something. by the way the point is more, why are you so upset that people are suspicious of you? You are the one who has, over the years, promoted the notion that people ought to be suspicious of you, attempting to play different personalities with different monikers.

Quote:

Surely even you can get that. Someone out there is so desperate to be done with Scratch, that that person has no scruples about squeezing whomever he or she can to push that process along, even an inch. If that person thinks Scratch is sick, he or she should look in the mirror.

Get over it, and get over yourself.

Author:

stemelbow [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:56 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

Samantabhadra wrote:

Kierkegaard wrote philosophical works under several different pseudonyms and their perspectives often clashed. Fernando Pessoa used the same technique within single volumes.

This is a relatively simplistic literary decision. Kishkumen is educated enough to be aware of its rich history in Western literature. You, apparently, are not.

Funny you mention that. Over the years I have grown very fond of Kierkegaard (particularly Works of Love, and Purity of Heart--the first encounter I had with him as I studied the concept of pursuing a pure heart). Kish is not Kierkegaard. Kish is very talented, I'd say. But, to play this out on a discussion board is pretty vain. Pretty weird.

Thanks for whining about me, though.

Author:

Kishkumen [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:58 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

stemelbow wrote:

Get over it, and get over yourself.

So he says as he pushes me to do something I have no ability to do: unmask Scratch. Yeah, well, you are welcome to try to do that yourself. I have no ability to do that, no pull at all. I actually did try. Ray and I worked on the problem together. Now in his fevered imagination he believes that this is further evidence that I am Scratch, or at least part of the proposed "conglomerate."

Go ahead and ask Ray whether he and I tried to figure out who Scratch is.

I can also tell you the Daniel Peterson knows as much as I do about it. At least that is what he told me.

Author:

stemelbow [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:04 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

Kishkumen wrote:

So he says as he pushes me to do something I have no ability to do: unmask Scratch. Yeah, well, you are welcome to try to do that yourself. I have no ability to do that, no pull at all. I actually did try. Ray and I worked on the problem together. Now in his fevered imagination he believes that this is further evidence that I am Scratch, or at least part of the proposed "conglomerate."

Go ahead and ask Ray whether he and I tried to figure out who Scratch is.

I can also tell you the Daniel Peterson knows as much as I do about it. At least that is what he told me.

I don't care if you are Scratch or not. As I said yesterday, if you were, it would give me a personal boost in my own confused mind. I can't imagine a real Scratch type person out there without feeling a little dispirited. If you were playing Scratch to play some game for your own enjoyment, though pathetic, it would make me feel a little better in life.

As I said, you've promoted this very suspicion over the years. Deal with it. It's of your own making. don't' blame others for being suspicious of you.

Author:

Kishkumen [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:14 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

stemelbow wrote:

I don't care if you are Scratch or not.

Of course, you don't. You're just interested in the unmasking of Scratch. Contradicting yourself sloppily is so convincing.

Author:

stemelbow [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:23 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

Kishkumen wrote:

Of course, you don't. You're just interested in the unmasking of Scratch. Contradicting yourself sloppily is so convincing.

Why assume it's contradicting myself if I, simultaneously, don't care if you are Scratch while also being interested to know who Scratch is? If you are Scratch then I care, but since I don't really think you are, I don't.

As I said, you've created the suspicion yourself. Of course people will be suspicious of you.

Author:

Shulem [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:29 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

Kishkumen wrote:

stemelbow wrote:

I don't care if you are Scratch or not.

Of course, you don't. You're just interested in the unmasking of Scratch. Contradicting yourself sloppily is so convincing.

Yeah, stemelbow lies as he blows air out his ass. He says he doesn't care. But then listen how he goes on and on about how much of a difference it would make to learn that you are Scratch.

People like stemelbow lie all the time and pretty soon everything they say is just a lie. He is living a ____ lie. I'd like to stick his ass in Facsimile No. 3 and let the prophet do a number on him.

Paul O

Author:

stemelbow [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:37 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

Shulem wrote:

Yeah, stemelbow lies as he blows air out his ass. He says he doesn't care. But then listen how he goes on and on about how much of a difference it would make to learn that you are Scratch.

People like stemelbow lie all the time and pretty soon everything they say is just a lie. He is living a f*****g lie. I'd like to stick his ass in Facsimile No. 3 and let the prophet do a number on him.

Paul O

no doubt you'd like to do a lot of mean things to a lot of people. That's about the sum of your comments, I've noticed.

Author:

LDSToronto [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:40 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

stemelbow wrote:

Kishkumen wrote:

So he says as he pushes me to do something I have no ability to do: unmask Scratch. Yeah, well, you are welcome to try to do that yourself. I have no ability to do that, no pull at all. I actually did try. Ray and I worked on the problem together. Now in his fevered imagination he believes that this is further evidence that I am Scratch, or at least part of the proposed "conglomerate."

Go ahead and ask Ray whether he and I tried to figure out who Scratch is.

I can also tell you the Daniel Peterson knows as much as I do about it. At least that is what he told me.

I don't care if you are Scratch or not. As I said yesterday, if you were, it would give me a personal boost in my own confused mind. I can't imagine a real Scratch type person out there without feeling a little dispirited. If you were playing Scratch to play some game for your own enjoyment, though pathetic, it would make me feel a little better in life.

As I said, you've promoted this very suspicion over the years. Deal with it. It's of your own making. don't' blame others for being suspicious of you.

Hey, stemelbow, and all the rest of you pukes - back the ____ off of Kishkumen. My friend Kish has contributed more positive content to this community than the lot of you combined.

And if he says he's not Scratch, then, you stupid cowards, he's not Scratch!

Go back and tell the motha-fukca who put you up to this to do his or her own dirty work next time. And if any of you bastards who are participating in this attack are LDS, the lot of you should be hanging your head in fukcing shame as you march into the bishops office to turn your temple recommends in.

Assholes.

H.

H.

Author:

stemelbow [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:43 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

LDSToronto wrote:

Hey, stemelbow, and all the rest of you pukes - back the ____ off of Kishkumen. My friend Kish has contributed more positive content to this community than the lot of you combined.

And if he says he's not Scratch, then, you stupid cowards, he's not Scratch!

Go back and tell the motha-fukca who put you up to this to do his or her own dirty work next time. And if any of you bastards who are participating in this attack are LDS, the lot of you should be hanging your head in fukcing shame as you march into the bishops office to turn your temple recommends in.

Assholes.

H.

H.

You're an idiot. I am saying he is not Scratch, even though he promotes the suspicions himself. I'm asking him to stop pouting about Carton and others who have bought into the suspicion he himself has created.

Author:

Ceeboo [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:45 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

LDSToronto wrote:

Hey, stemelbow, and all the rest of you pukes - back the ____ off of Kishkumen. My friend Kish has contributed more positive content to this community than the lot of you combined.

And if he says he's not Scratch, then, you stupid cowards, he's not Scratch!

Go back and tell the motha-fukca who put you up to this to do his or her own dirty work next time. And if any of you bastards who are participating in this attack are LDS, the lot of you should be hanging your head in fukcing shame as you march into the bishops office to turn your temple recommends in.

Assholes.

H.

H.

Hey Stem!

Peace,Ceeboo

Author:

Ceeboo [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:47 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

stemelbow wrote:

You're an idiot. I am saying he is not Scratch, even though he promotes the suspicions himself. I'm asking him to stop pouting about Carton and others who have bought into the suspicion he himself has created.

Hey Toronto!

Peace,Ceeboo

Author:

LDSToronto [ Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:48 am ]

Post subject:

Re: Kish, Ray, and Doctor Scratch?

stemelbow wrote:

LDSToronto wrote:

Hey, stemelbow, and all the rest of you pukes - back the ____ off of Kishkumen. My friend Kish has contributed more positive content to this community than the lot of you combined.

And if he says he's not Scratch, then, you stupid cowards, he's not Scratch!

Go back and tell the motha-fukca who put you up to this to do his or her own dirty work next time. And if any of you bastards who are participating in this attack are LDS, the lot of you should be hanging your head in fukcing shame as you march into the bishops office to turn your temple recommends in.

Assholes.

H.

H.

You're an idiot. I am saying he is not Scratch, even though he promotes the suspicions himself. I'm asking him to stop pouting about Carton and others who have bought into the suspicion he himself has created.

no doubt you'd like to do a lot of mean things to a lot of people. That's about the sum of your comments, I've noticed.

Sticking your ass in Facsimile No. 3 for the prophet to do a number on is mean? It would fit right in with the other Explanations! Hell, I'm just giving Joseph Smith more ideas on how to fool the saints with his silly translations. So, add them up and what do you get? The answer is: Fraud.