I found that a bit strange also since it is right on the home page under "ABOUT".

Well, if it weren't for the PolAm Admin creating and maintaining this site then none of us (including all the carpetbaggers) would have a forum like PF to enjoy at all. So hats off to another PolAm for doing something to promote Poland!

I concur now that Paulina has explained his character to us.What I have found the most interesting in meeting the Polish members here is how much they know about the United States of America and how little us Polish Americans know about our Polish ancestory.

Thank you Tomasz Bartlomiej for creating the P.F. for us to enjoy and learn from.

Skip that nonsense. You are only making excuses for your policy of sitting back and thumbing your thumbs, As long as people are posting and there are some info about Poland you don't care one way or the other. It is all about money, so don't be pretending otherwise and talking fibs and porkies to people.

You hope to sound like a wise poet, but you have a long way to go. 'All about money' - please explain what you mean by that. If it was 'all about money,' there would be a dozen of other wanna-be 'poets' posting whatever is needed to meet their political, social, or commercial agenda. You obviously have no idea what you're blabbing about (but you may have a good taste of it if in fact the forum becomes money-driven). Don't forget that thanks to losers with a similar attitude to yours there have already been 3 partitions of Poland so far. On the surface, it looked good because the truth and reality has been hidden by the wolves in sheep clothes who defied the reality, which resulted in structurally weak government.

Btw. in your other post, quote:

Poles have right to choose what kinds immigrants they would like to see it their own country.

Have you read what is in the EU laws before Poland joined the EU? Now it's too late to read it but you still should for your own reference. Besides the many benefits, there are also serious social and moral costs of being a EU member. Our Polish politicians you have voted for made this difficult decision (it's true that they have hidden or spun a lot of crucial information but at the same time they have, and you're being a solid proof of that, counted on people's ignorance). Still, it is not possible to have a cake and eat it. Do you think the UK or Norwegian tax payers are in love with people who come to their countries, learn the laws they need, and take advantage of everything they can? Most likely not, but they have to live with it.

so maybe it is nit about religion but about people and culture.

Smart people and societies try to take the best from all cultures. But with a close-minded attitude, it would never be possible. Just read some facts about the Renaissance in Poland to learn about the crucial aspects of bringing out the best out of different people and cultures:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renaissance_in_Poland

The Renaissance in Poland lasted from the late 15th to the late 16th century and is widely considered to have been the Golden Age of Polish culture. Ruled by the Jagiellonian dynasty, the Crown of the Kingdom of Poland actively participated in the broad European Renaissance. The multi-national Polish state experienced a substantial period of cultural growth thanks in part to a century without major wars - aside from conflicts in the sparsely populated eastern and southern borderlands.

The Renaissance movement, whose influence originated in Italy, spread throughout Poland roughly in the 15th and 16th century. Many Italian artists arrived in the country welcomed by Polish royalty, including Francesco Fiorentino, Bartholommeo Berecci, Santi Gucci, Mateo Gucci, Bernardo Morando, Giovanni Battista di Quadro and others, including thinkers and educators such as Filip Callimachus, merchants such as the Boner family and the Montelupi family,[1] and other prominent personalities who immigrated to Poland since the late 15th century in search of new opportunities.

What would have happened if the Jagiellonian dynasty was as biased and 'patriotic' as some of the posters here?

Now, look what happens in close-minded cultures of Belarus, Venezuela, North Korea, or Cuba. Thanks to the 'patriots' ruling these countries, if given a chance, 80% of the population would move to Poland with a blink of an eye. What's wrong with this picture - Belarus is '100% Belarus-run', Venezuela is '100% Venezuela' run, etc. Their people don't even have a chance to read what's going on in the world so that they don't revolt too much. From my understanding, those who say that the forum should be 'Polish-run' mean a similar way of self-destruction.

What's wrong with this picture - Belarus is '100% Belarus-run', Venezuela is '100% Venezuela' run, etc. Their people don't even have a chance to read what's going on in the world so that they don't revolt too much.

You are kidding right ? Google that or better yet I did it for you. Take your pick about the revolting going on down there.

bing.com/search?q=venezuela+revolution+2014

The revolutions in Belarus and Venezuela has been an on going thing.

From my understanding, those who say that the forum should be 'Polish-run' mean a similar way of self-destruction.

No, what I mean by "Polish Run' is to have a Polish moderator to level the playing field to help eliminate the bias Brit's get that several non Brit. members here have brought to your attention.

They have chased many people off your forum that don't either have the confidence to participate or simply just turned offby their "our cup of tea doesn't stink".About the first time they ganged up on a new member with their stinky cup of tea that they are famous for doing they would be given some 'think time'. But as long as that clique is allowed to get away with it the forum may not self destruct but it will miss out on a lot of potential growth by new members being intimidated by them and never coming back.

That is what I meant.What a great place for a Polish person to practice their English reading and writing skills yet when I first came here they were being mocked by the Brit Bullies because they spelled a word wrong or used the wrong tense.

There already IS a Polish moderator who lives in Poland and he has been actively working on the site almost every day for almost a year now: polishforums.com/index.php?action=userinfo&user=50742. But apparently the facts don't matter when stereotype-thinking and ignorance is in full mode.

Do you think the UK or Norwegian tax payers are in love with people who come to their countries, learn the laws they need, and take advantage of everything they can? Most likely not, but they have to live with it.

Yeah, they need to let the young unemployed immigrants from hostile countries come, live at welfare, rape their daughters and impose their religion.

How dare they complain about that? Those Norwegians should be more tolerant!

Hi Arts, I have been here almost a year also. This is the first time I have seen you post.Thanks for being here to help us.

But apparently the facts don't matter when stereotype-thinking and ignorance is in full mode.

Was that really necessary ? (Rudeness breeds rudeness)

Those Norwegians should be more tolerant!

Well they have had a belly full and now are deporting "them" in droves. Read here:

bing.com/search?q=norway+deporting+muslims

In Sweden these "immigrants" are demanding that Sweden change the countries flag because "they" are "offended" because it has a cross on it.

In a large suburb (Dearborn) of Detroit Michigan U.S.A. has been taken over by these "immagrants" and is now calledDearbornistan.The people of Poland read the news, see the news on t.v. and are vey well aware of what is going on and from what I

have read here DEFINITELY DO NOT WANT the problems and beliefs these immigrants bring with them to Poland.Yes it's a hot topic but at the same time Poland still has a chance to avoid what they see going on around the world when it comes to destroying the cultures and economics of other countries.

Poland may be the last pure country (besides Japan) that refuses to tolerate their immigration.It's not because Poland is economically depressed that they haven't come, it's because Poland is 99% Catholic.I can't imagine them coming to Poland and telling the Poles to "change their countries flag" because it "offends" them.

Facts do not lie.

The Polish Form has the policy not to "bash" these "immigrants" or their religion which is fine.We should however be able to expose the problem for self preservation purposes.

I know. But that's what we have our brains for - so we wouldn't fall in it's trap. I always try not to fall in it, even if I give an impression that I did.

Oh, I actually speak two more languages besides English. Does that count? :)

Let me guess - German and...? :)

What gets in from the outside through other people is always filtered. You need to form your own opinion - best done by living outside the comfort zone that is your home country.

TheOther, I know all of this. You don't have to even live in another country. People have those "filters" even when they're on a holiday somewhere. I've read comments by Americans who were on vacations in Italy and they claimed Italians are rude, reserved, not smiling, cold even. I was surprised by such assessment. I've been to Italy also only on vacations and Italians for me were completely... normal. The only thing that irritated me was when I was at the post office next to the St Mark's Square in Venice. After some long wait when noone would come out for me I was sold some stamps. I wrote postcards and put the stamps on. The guy was gone again so I went back and waited and was making some noise to make sure he knows someone's there. Then an American couple came in and waited with me. At some point they started talking loudly but it didn't help. We wanted to find out where we can send our postcards. In the end we went out very irritated and we found the postbox by ourselves lol

At the time it didn't hit me that there were no clients when I came in although it's such a touristy place. Later I was explained that it must have been the siesta time and apparently "only dogs and the Germans walk the streets during siesta" in Italy lol

I guess I should count myself lucky that I was sold those stamps in the first place lol Now, if I knew this I wouldn't get upset and think "how rude and unprofessional" that guy was. I would simply visit the post office later, after the siesta was over.

But someone had to explain this to me, you understand? That this is the way it is in Italy.And in this way I sometimes also explain things on this forum. I explain that Poles aren't smiling not because they are unfriendly people. That's just the way they are. In Russia people smile even less. That's something even Poles notice and that says something lol I explain that Poles stare at people of different skin colour not because we're all so racist but simply because we aren't accustomed to people of different races and we're curious. With time the shock will probably wear off and people won't be so curious anymore either maybe.

I remember a British user, who lives in Poland, writing on this forum that Polish language sounds rude. Not just that Poles say rude things but the language itself sounds rude lol Maybe if someone told you German "sounds" rude it wouldn't irritate you but if you knew that this person has a track record of unfair, ignorant, biased comments it is possible that this comment about German language would get on your nerves even if you know well enough that German isn't exactly the loveliest language on the planet.

Some people are like that - they interpret things through their filter and judge it according to their filter. And they aren't always fair in that judgement or simply they're being subjective.

TheOther, you sound like if the foreigners coming to Poland were clean sheets of paper with nothing written on them. And that they will judge and observe everything in an objective way.

But that's not the case. It's usually grown up people coming to Poland who grew up in different countries with different culture and language and often different world-view, social codes and behaviours, customs, etc. It all affects their judgement.

I've read comments by Russians who feel claustrophobic in Germany, for example. All those laws and rules, people so rigid, you can barely breath, they say. One Russian complained that he can't play his accordion in his flat because of his neighbours. And in Russia he would open his window and people would sing together with him! How he misses that! Those Russians commented that even if you only go to Poland you already breath in a different way, more fully. So some Russians may feel better in Poland than in Germany, but I'm sure there are Russians who feel better in Germany than in Poland or even better than in Russia.

It all depends.Of course, I know that there are some universal things that foreigners complain about. Poles complain about pretty much the same things.That's not the problem.I have a problem with attitudes of some people here. And some of those people don't have very likeable personalities, some of them get on my nerves because of their snobbery or the way they conduct discussions.

Some people here have their obsessions. For example, some Western posters seem to be obsessed about Catholicism in general and in Poland. They are usually liberal/leftist atheists. There was a time when ranting about Catholicism was "a thing" on PF, in the same way as ranting about Polish women was "a thing" at some point and then Jewish topics and then again Polish women and then again Catholic topics and then again Jewish topics. Now it's Muslims lol Mainly because of Levi, of course. Now, why are some Westerners here so obsessed with Catholicism? Because they are atheists living in a Catholic country and they don't like it. And why Levi is so obsessed with Islam? Because he's a non-Muslim living in a Muslim country. It's understandable to some extent. But don't you just sometimes feel like telling Levi: "Levi, ffs, if you hate it so much over there then why on Earth don't you just move to a non-Muslim country??" Well, those Westerners usually can't move, because they came to Poland for their wives, apparently, which just adds to the frustration, I imagine. Maybe Levi can't move too, or at least not yet, and so he vents here.

And that's something that hit me fully only lately, I think. People often come here to vent. Now, if locals visit such forum, they can get irritated because all of that venting. That's why I'm starting to think that this forum isn't really a good place for Poles. Maybe we should just leave foreigners alone here so they could vent in peace. Foreign posters living abroad who come to PF usually are seeking advice that often can be given by foreigners living in Poland. So it's a "vent and give info" forum, not that much of a discussion forum, at least not such as I'm accustomed to.

There are still some discussions taking place but... I don't know... Yehudi wrote in the thread "Terrible past for the Jews in Poland?" that this forum isn't the right place for a serious discussion of Israel-Arab relations. But is it the right forum for serious discussions about anything? Fot that you need serious people and not keyboard warriors. Maybe I'm just accustomed to a different level of discussion because of other place on the internet I'm discussing in, I don't know. Here it's like kindergarten or some kind of battle arena in comparison. Here it's not about mutual understanding or learning something from others but about "winning" a discussion, apparently. It seems to me this is the main trend on this forum. For me, personally, it's disappointing.

Trust me, I've been doing this for almost my entire life.

How do you even know your home country then?

Don't know. Are you really ready for something other than a short vacation?

In what sense "ready"? To pack up my bags and start my life from scratch in a foreign country or "ready" as in being able to live in another culture of a foreign country?

Good on ya! I've been trying to get that across for quite some time now

TheOther, most of 38 mln of Poles or 23 mln of Australians can't just move abroad and experience life in other countries. So what are they supposed to do - base their views of their country entirely on views of foreigners that came to their country?

What if some of those foreigners are prejudiced or simply stupid or biased or whatever?I'll give you an example. There were foreigners on PF who claimed Polish women are so much more beautiful than British women and slimmer, etc. But there were also foreigners who claimed that Polish women aren't more beautiful than British women and they're nothing special and there are more beautiful women then them. There were also those who said that they don't like the way Polish women look like and they have round faces and bad skin which means they have bad genes and they have big noses too.

So, as a Pole who has never lived abroad - whom am I supposed to believe? Am I supposed to take one of those opinions at face value or what? And which one?

but it seems that people don't want to listen or simply refuse to use their brain.

TheOther, how about you? Are you ready to listen to others or "use your brain" or do you think only others should listen to you and "use their brain"?

I know a forum that has more moderators than actual users; if you need a link PM me ;)

Well, that's nice that you do. It's nothing that I haven't seen before though - there was a time when I was discussing on a political forum that had just a few active users, including an administrator and a moderator, I think :) I see that it has been taken over by bots now.

If you're implying that was the case with our forum then not when I was an active admin/mod there :)Don't worry, Admin, I'm not saying our mods were better than yours are, we even had to kick out one, but you implied that I was banning people for having different views and I had to defend myself.

That's the goal of PF - to allow anyone to have their voice.

Including me?

but at the same time allow others who don't always share your views to tell their side of the story.

If I consider some comment prejudiced then I can write that I consider this or that comment as prejudiced. I should have the right to do so just like Harry or any other Westerner has a right to call out users on their prejudices and they're doing exactly that. Very often.

I don't have a power to "allow" something or "not allow" something on this forum - I'm not a moderator lol

But I have the right to... COMMENT on other people's comments.I think we agree on this, right? Or am I missing something here?

Moderators (both the current, past, and the future ;).

What about Lenka? Or gumishu? What happened to him? He isn't even posting anymore...

You may be right; I don't track or am interested in forum personalities.

I do though. I am interested in people and in people's nature.And, yes, I can see that you don't judging by how much nonsense you wrote about me :)

It was (as far as I can tell) corrupted when DB was rebuilt a few days ago..

Damn it ;/

Could you elaborate what you mean by being "Polish-run"?

I suspected that johnny_reb would like most of the forum staff to be Polish. Judging by his post #69 I see it's not the case.

Based on your posts, I'd guess the leading points would be something like that:

How would you base anything on my posts if you "don't track or are interested in forum personalities"? How many of my 1,211 posts have you read? Not many, I suspect :)

1. If it is Polish or Poland-made, it's the best in the world, no questions asked. Period.

lol Wow, that's one of the greatest bullsh1t anyone ever wrote about me on this forum.

(for example, if there were 10 moderators formally based in Poland but none of them has been on the site for a week to do the moderating job it would still be better than 1 moderator from Germany who actually shows up and does the job well)

Complete bullsh1t again. There's not a single thing in my posts that would suggest that I think in such a way. It was johnny who wanted a "Polish run" forum so get off my back, will you...

2. All discussions that confront the established status quo in Poland should be avoided.

No.

3. All complaints or bad experiences about Poland should be avoided or deleted.

And again - no.

4. Posters who share personal views of moderators or administrators should be treated with utmost respect and, when possible, given moderator privileges.

Not sure what you're talking about here. What "personal views of moderators or administrators"? You mean how they're doing their job or sth? If they aren't written in a rude, offensive way then I don't see why users shouldn't be allowed to give their opinions. Or maybe they aren't allowed?

And have I ever claimed that someone should be given "moderator privileges"? What are you even you talking about?

5. To make the moderating process simple, a list of stereotypes about nationalities and religions should be created and followed (this would be especially useful to those who have been given moderating privileges but really aren't the sharpest knives in the drawer).

Sorry, but this makes no sense whatsoever to me.

Admin, you clearly have no idea what are my views, what and why I was writing on this forum for all those 7 years, etc.

I believe that's the gist of the problem.

And not that I dared to write something about your forum?

Look at the point #1 above.. you will never find out about the real life from the Internet or the media; the only things you'll have left are stereotypes or 'research' done by inept people.

I don't live in the internet or on this forum, unlike some people, but in a very real country called Poland. As far as I know TheOther doesn't live in Poland nor do you.

Will you at least agree that if some, let's say, well-travelled foreigner who lived in umpteen countries comes to Poland and writes on this forum that "All Polish women are wh0res" or he will go to Israel and he will write on some Israeli forum that "All Jews are greedy zionists who want to rule the world" or he will go to Germany and he will write on a German forum that "All Germans are Nazis" a local native Pole/Israeli/German who hasn't lived in umpteen countries can write that this well-travelled idiot is prejudiced?

It is not about information; it's all about experience.

Honestly? It's about a bit more, I think. You can live in a foreign country and be a complete prejudiced jerk towards the local culture and people.

Now you have a certain stereotype about Black, Asian, Muslim, Indian people..

I do? Or are you just talking in general?

But have you actually worked or gone to a wedding party or a funeral ceremony and sat with a Black, Asian, Muslim, or Indian people? I did and it has been much more truthful experience than even the most objective media can present.

You mean that the media won't show me their happy faces, I won't see them eating, laughing, looking with love at people close to them or crying after the loss of a family member? Wow, Admin, do you mean to say we are all human beings and we're pretty much the same everywhere? Now that's a shocker... :))

Listen, I don't have to live in another country or work with such and such people to respect them and their cultures.

Btw, you think that a certain poster who is now suspended would somehow cease to be a snob if he had gone to a wedding party at my grandma's village? I don't know, I kind of doubt that, tbh, but who knows lol

It's not even only about people - in fact most stereotypes brought to you by the official knowledge are twisted (do you think you know Mexican or Chinese food just because you visited 100 Mexican or Chinese restaurants in Poland? - then go to a restaurant in Mexico or China to realize how brainwashed you were ;).

That's all great but are you saying that I can't state that someone who writes that "All Polish women are wh0res" is prejudiced only because I haven't lived in another country? What is the point of all what you wrote right there?

I'm not making prejudiced comments about Black, Asian, Muslim, Indian people and I'm not writing anything about Mexican or Chinese food.I'd just like to be kindly allowed to disagree with other posters and make comments on their comments, sometimes to call out someone on their prejudice, sometimes share some knowledge about Poles/Poland/Polish history or explain some issues that I think may be important for mutual understanding between representatives of different nationalities who have often different mentalities, world-views, experiences, who are coming from countries with different history, etc.

You all sound like I'm not allowed to do that, while other posters are allowed.So what on Earth is this all about?

If you are alluding to the likes of Harry et al that is palpable nonsense. Nobody is being aggressive Paulina, apart from the racist cliquely posters of Polish blood here

I'm not a fan of both those groups, to be honest.

You might consider, since you are proficient in English yourself, that English is by definition a language of debate, where straight talking has its' place. With such a large corpus of language there is simply no need for the "flowery" discussion that often constitutes a Polish forum of this kind - there is nothing overtly "aggresssive" here - just opinion.

English is a language as any other and you can debate in any language and behaviour of posters can be agressive and it quite often is.

It isn't possible to have a normal discussion with Harry, unless you agree with him all the time. He already implied on this forum that I'm an anti-Semite (which was quite funny, considering that I was "accused" on PF of being Jewish too), he claimed that I'm a racist, anti-Irish and lately he apparently was preparing himself for accusing me of being anti-Muslim. A word in Polish that would fit him well is "napastliwy". And according to the admin of this forum I'm apparently a devout Catholic with "extreme opinions" lol I'm not sure what those extreme opinions would be exactly in my case, though. Maybe the fact that I think women should be allowed to be priests too? I admit - it's pretty extreme for a Catholic lol

And TheOther seems to be turning lately into Harry's clone. Soon he'll probably take delph's place and the madness will continue. No that I care anymore, to be honest. It's probably my swan song on this forum anyway.

(It's good that there's no word limit for posts on this forum... I think I broke my lifetime record lol ;/)

You don't have to even live in another country. People have those "filters" even when they're on a holiday somewhere.

There is a huge difference between being on vacation in a foreign country and living/working there. As long as you bring money, people will always be nice to you. Once you compete with them for jobs though and you are not willing to integrate, you will see a whole different side of their persona. Just read the posts here on PF that complain about Poles taking away British jobs for example.

No foreigner will ever tell you that (s)he knows Poland better than you or any other native Pole. That was not the point. What was said was that a foreigner living in Poland will be able to see certain things critically that a local wouldn't even notice. What you wrote here ...

One Russian complained that he can't play his accordion in his flat because of his neighbors. And in Russia he would open his window and people would sing together with him! How he misses that!

... is a simple example of what I was trying to bring across. Maybe the Germans have too many rules and should loosen up a bit like people in other countries, I don't know. But it takes foreigners and Germans who have lived abroad for a long time to teach them that because they cannot see it themselves. Same is true for the Polish people. Not everything that you consider perfect in your country is actually perfect. The version of history you were taught at school might not be the full truth. And so on and so forth. There are so many examples. Don't think, by the way, that only Poles are so defensive when it comes to a foreigner criticizing their country. Americans, Brits, Germans, Australians, ..., are all the same in that respect. It's human, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it's right.

Let me guess - German and...? :)

Would that help you file me under a convenient stereotype? LOL!

How do you even know your home country then?

Home is where my heart is, and at the moment that's the USA. Before that there were many other countries.

And TheOther seems to be turning lately into Harry's clone. Soon he'll probably take delph's place and the madness will continue.

Do yourself a favour Paulina and lose the patriotism, you will feel much better. You don't have to defend Poland the way you do, only idiots believe the kind of thing idiots post here anyway....and there will always be millions of idiots around. Its a futile experience.

I suspected that johnny_reb would like most of the forum staff to be Polish.

This idiot will have a problem no matter what, including if all the mods/admins were Polish, then it would be "why are all the moderators Polish...this is biased and creates a limited world view".

The idiot who started this thread doubted that Admin was Polish, once it became clear that Admin was in fact Polish the idiot had a problem with it. Thats how idiots function. You cant reason with unreasonable people.

The Other do you still think this idiot is a previous, former member idiot?

I would like to thank the people who gave "constructive" posts here in my thread.My point of how the Bullying Brit Boys insist on their immature tactics of trying to intimidateother posters with abuse has "clearly" been made as everyone can see.

Members cannot see which warning codes other members have, so how would you know that "nothing happened"?

We don't, we will just have to 'trust' the moderators to be fair and do the right thing equally for everyone.This goes back to the first post in this thread and may I quote:

The reason to ask this question is that seems everyone here that gets preference treatment, allowed to post derogrorory remarks towards others without getting a warning, are all Brit's !Could that be because the administrator is a Brit. ?

That is why I originally ask the question, "is the admin. a Brit", when I start this thread.I wanted to know why this childish banner is allowed to continue by them.My point was made and my question was answered so now I am good with it.Thanks again to everyone that contributed "constructive" posts here.Mission accomplished !

What was said was that a foreigner living in Poland will be able to see certain things critically that a local wouldn't even notice.

+10. And by sharing both good and bad experience Poland will only be able to progress in the right direction. If the forum was run the 'Polish-style' the bad things would have few chances to be discussed because anti-Poland 'dissidents' would be silenced.

The people of Poland read the news, see the news on t.v. and are vey well aware of what is going on and from what Ihave read here DEFINITELY DO NOT WANT the problems and beliefs these immigrants bring with them to Poland.

If that was the case, Poles would not vote to join the EU. It's like you bought a diesel car and later realized you don't want that and prefer a gasoline car. Poland had enough time to decide and research the laws to make an educated decision. The funny thing is most of those who don't want the problems associated with being a part of the EU have voted for it with their hands and legs.

We don't, we will just have to 'trust' the moderators to be fair and do the right thing equally for everyone.

You are welcome to share your warnings in the Random chat; we don't make it public to avoid creating gossip or giving ammunition to trolls.

I'm going to close this topic now to avoid discussions about unrelated things here; you may continue in the more relevant forum categories (unless someone has something important to add then we could re-open it).