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Lost in translation - the dub will always be another language, another culture, another context, different thought process, alternate thought construction; then there's the horrifying prospect of the dub being written by a person or persons who have zero contact with the original writers.

Subtitles also have this problem somewhat, but at least they can use [longer explanations or puns]

Mostly because I can multitask while watching films with audio in English, but subtittled media demands my full attention. This has unfortunately resulted in myself not watching nearly as many subtitled films/shows as I did ten years ago.

I'll still watch films completely if they engross me and I do make time for them, but I will default to silly crap that I can half-watch because it's much easier to fit that into my schedule.

However, what really bugs me still is when a film is substantially re-editted for other markets.

I still refuse to watch Red Cliff (despite being a nut for all things Romance of the Three Kingdoms-related, thanks Dynasty Warriors!) because I know it was originally two movies that were cut down into one for the West. I want to see the whole thing!

I once watched Blade 2 without sound but with subs. A friend and I made the voices and sound effects.

It was the first time I watched Book, but I didn't have any trouble following the movie. I think it's because the cast are such good actors, especially Denzel, that they still easily communicate what is happening.

The "theatrical" release was cut to one movie so anything you see in a theater or streaming are usually that cut. I was curious and watched a little bit on Netflix. Not the same movie anymore. Its like watching Lord of the Rings theatrical after watching the extended versions but worse.

Which is sad since the thing in the West now is to cut a movie into as many parts as possible so they can make more money
include more characters and story.

When well handled, subs have the bonus of having the luxury of trying to bring across the original context as close as possible; i'm aware that on occasion this means a little extra reading than which is necessary but if it means more accurate context, i'm all for it. .

While I usually prefer subtitles myself, I think a good translation should be allowed to stray from the original text in some respects. There's a lot of subtleties to any language that are often lost on a foreign reader. Translating Shakespeare's works verbatim into German would sound terrible, because his plays rely heavily on the flow of the English language. Similarly, many puns or metaphors don't work from one language to another. And then of course you also have different cultural norms and expectations. Christian symbolism would most likely invoke a different emotion in a Western reader than in one who's Japanese.

The best translations are those that capture the spirit and feel of the original, even if this means changing a few minor aspects. There's an interesting article about the experience of translating Dharma into French which illustrates this point a lot better than I ever could. It's a bit long, but definitely worth reading.

Originally Posted by khaz

Speaking of Ghibli films - when Mononoke came to the west, I saw it dubbed first. It was actually pretty decent. Then Claire Danes's San opened her mouth, askghmangiyhklagsjfghjashtfag. Her San just destroyed everything; Gillian Anderson as Moro and Jada Pinkett Smith as Toki were great though.

All Ghibli films have very good dubbing. Not really surprising considering they were done by Disney, a company that knows a thing or two about voice acting in animation.

Cowboy Bebop had a pretty decent dub as well, but I guess you wouldn't care much for that. :)

The best translations are those that capture the spirit and feel of the original, even if this means changing a few minor aspects. There's an interesting article about the experience of translating Dharma into French which illustrates this point a lot better than I ever could. It's a bit long, but definitely worth reading.

Suppose somebody wanted you to say that he feels threatened by cats and dogs every time it rains a lot, because he is obsessed by English idiomatic expressions

I saw Alice by Jan Švankmajer and I'm still not sure what I saw.
Alice in Wonderland, without Dawson's Casting nor budget, but with drugs? not sure. Sockpuppets, skeletons, the White Rabbit eating it's own guts (sawdust), living slabs of meat. Totally recommended.

The best translations are those that capture the spirit and feel of the original, even if this means changing a few minor aspects. There's an interesting article about the experience of translating Dharma into French which illustrates this point a lot better than I ever could. It's a bit long, but definitely worth reading.

All Ghibli films have very good dubbing. Not really surprising considering they were done by Disney, a company that knows a thing or two about voice acting in animation.

Cowboy Bebop had a pretty decent dub as well, but I guess you wouldn't care much for that. :)

Oof, long article. I'll save that for lazy Sunday reading. And you're right, it is a decent dub but it just destroys the entire feel and immersion for me. :(

I saw Alice by Jan vankmajer and I'm still not sure what I saw.
Alice in Wonderland, without Dawson's Casting nor budget, but with drugs? not sure. Sockpuppets, skeletons, the White Rabbit eating it's own guts (sawdust), living slabs of meat. Totally recommended.

What you saw is the best movie adaptation (even though it doesn't have Chesire Cat in it :x) of Alice in Wonderland so far (alongside with 1951 Disney animation). Like book, it hardly makes any sense or have traditional plot. It captures perfectly the mood of the original and have fresh look at whole thing.
It seems to be pretty bizzare and dark, but never falls into "omg so grimdark, she's actually in asylum having lobotomy, that's what Alice is about" bullshit or "it's all about drugs" (another popular bullshit), but it's like a dream (the book is actually all about dream logic with some mocking of 19th century popculture and mathematics) that is only one step away from nightmare.

It's must see for people who likes original Alice and surrealism.

Also I would recommend every movie directed by Jan Svankmajer, he is goddamn genius that you can compare with masters like Tarkowski, Kubrick, Bergman etc.

I watched Lion King yesterday, for first time, because my friends almost went mad when they heard that I've never seen it. I DIDN'T CRIED WHEN MUFASA DIED (I must be a replicant). Also this animation is overhyped a little, I think I've watched a few others that I liked much more.

What you saw is the best movie adaptation (even though it doesn't have Chesire Cat in it :x) of Alice in Wonderland so far (alongside with 1951 Disney animation). Like book, it hardly makes any sense or have traditional plot. It captures perfectly the mood of the original and have fresh look at whole thing.
It seems to be pretty bizzare and dark, but never falls into "omg so grimdark, she's actually in asylum having lobotomy, that's what Alice is about" bullshit or "it's all about drugs" (another popular bullshit), but it's like a dream (the book is actually all about dream logic with some mocking of 19th century popculture and mathematics) that is only one step away from nightmare.

It's must see for people who likes original Alice and surrealism.

Also I would recommend every movie directed by Jan Svankmajer, he is goddamn genius that you can compare with masters like Tarkowski, Kubrick, Bergman etc.

That I full agree, it's quite faithful to the source material. Makes for some visually striking pictures.

Escape Plan
For a film whose claim to fame is starring both Arnold Schwarzenegger and Sylvester Stallone, this is a surprisingly subdued affair. There's little in the way of carnage until the very end, and even then we don't see a lot of physical stunts. It's understandable, given that both Stallone and Schwarzenegger are getting on in years, but it does highlight the film's biggest flaw: its main leads aren't very good actors. And since they can't cover up that fact by shooting large guns, they spend most of their screentime looking awkwardly at each other and mumbling their lines.

The supporting cast is much better, but not given a lot of opportunities to prove it. In fact, the B-plot about Breslin's friends trying to find him is pretty much forgotten halfway through the film and doesn't reappear until the very end. It's a shame too, because for once I actually liked a performance by 50 Cent.

I could talk about the plot, but there's really not much to say. The premise is somewhat unique, but the execution is strictly by the books. It's a decent escape film, but there's so many excellent works in the genre that merely being decent isn't worth any particular notice. It's not terrible by any means, there's some good lines, a few good jokes and the final twist is at least somewhat clever. But as a whole it's a completely unremarkable experience. Like Last Stand or The Expendables, this film is just an excuse to bring some aging action stars back on the screen, but unlike those examples Escape Plan never does much with its actors. Definitely not something I'll rewatch.

Originally Posted by GameCat

I watched Lion King yesterday, for first time, because my friends almost went mad when they heard that I've never seen it. I DIDN'T CRIED WHEN MUFASA DIED (I must be a replicant). Also this animation is overhyped a little, I think I've watched a few others that I liked much more.

I feel the same way. The Lion King is a very good film, but it's not significantly better than Disney's other output in the 90s and it's definitely not the apex of their work. Though I will say that the opening is one of my favourite moments in cinema. Such an amazing setup, it's a shame the rest of the film can't quite live up to it.

That said, it's easy to forget just how big this film was when it first came out. For a long time it was the highest grossing animated film ever made. I know very few people in their 20s who've never seen it as a children and I have quite a few friends for whom this was the first film they ever saw in a cinema, so it's understandable that they would be a lot more fond of it than I am.

Yeah, as someone who saw the lion king when I was very young, amidst going to see the rest of those 90s disney films in the cinema as their target audience, the lion king was just another disney film. I preferred Aladdin. Course, back then I also got really annoyed when they started singing and now I know all the bloody words and occasionally just listen to the songs, so what the heck did me back then even know.

I remember being disappointed with Lion King at the time, it was super-hyped and everyone loved it, but for me it was just clearly worse than thing like Aladdin, Beauty, Mermaid. I've never watched it as an adult, so I can't really say how accurate my opinion is.

I think my favourite Disney film is Hunchback of Notre Danme its probably got the most complex themes of all of them and its pretty dark for a childrens movie...shame the ending kind of ruins it. Lion King is alright but genrally the big deaths in older childrens films don't really affect me emotionally, one maybe i'm older and two i don't think the characters ar eon screen enough or get built up enough to make that kind of impact it seems well manipulative...

Arbitrage, out just last year, starred by Richard Gere. This movie is just like treasure hidden in straw. Don't know why it is not that well-marketed. It is a great movie with great star. If 2007/08 financial disaster brought us any goodies, this one of them, tons of exciting financial thrillers.

Story: Robert Miller, a over 60 years old finance magnate (a term I learnt from its DVD cover, how cool term), was a successful financer who was looking for retirement by selling his thriving business, Miller Capital. Yet the potential buyer, Mr. Mayfield, for some reason was stalling the acquisition talk. Robert seems to have everything of his life in good control, both his business and family. Except that in reality he was not that perfect, he was not god after all. First he was not an honest husband and father: he had an affair (just like any celebrity, how can you resist this? Pretty woman, walking down the street~) with a French artist. But what was worst: a big career crisis. Turnt out he sold his firm not because of desire for retirement, but because his firm had been in deep trouble that he was desperate for a bail out. He took a bad speculative gamble in a copper mine in Russia, lost big due to the Russian authority not honoring investor's right (here's the only part I don't like about this movie, it doesn't specify what part the Russian government may have done wrong. This is 2012 and Russia is a country with a functional legal system), and needed to cover this one hella financial hole. Just as the Mayfield acquisition was making progress, Robert and his little French girlfriend got hit by a terrible car accident, and the poor girl was killed. Robert was facing a possible charge for involuntary manslaughter. Not only this would jeopardize his family integrity, this criminal prosecution would give Mayfield an excuse to quit the acquisition talk and therefore, Robert and his family's business would go bankrupt. But there is a way out though, even though police had started to suspect Robert for this connection to the traffic accident, they had no solid proof, so Robert would still had chances to cover the whole mess up. So, what would he do to save his family and his career?

Remind me of another comedy many years ago, I don't recall the exact name but I remember that it's starred by Tom Hanks and Bruce Willis.

Gravity. Went the whole hog and did the 3D Imax thing. Glad I did. Visually A-mazing in terms of bringing you into the experience without overselling it, and albeit I didn't think the acting was Oscar material great (Clooney was a little too calm when the shit hits the fan imho. Though I though Bullock was pretty solid). Certainly a film to catch at the cinema rather that wait for the DVD. It's not saying anything profound of insightful, but Cuarón makes a hell of a movie. Recommended.