ben_reddy:PsyLord: Really? Sarah Palin? I never thought that these award shows had any merit. This just adds to that belief. Seriously, swag and awards for actors and musicians but no widely televised awards for teachers, scientists, doctors, humanitarians, etc? Our society sucks.

So, if there were an award show for Best History Teacher, would you watch it? They should all definetely be recognized and awarded more than they are, but come on, there is enough crap on tv without having to search through the Best Gynocologist Awards.

/then again...

I think we have safely reached the point in history where the merits of an award is inversely proportionate to whether it is on TV, and how many people watch it.

Axissillian:-More complex characters-Morally and Emotionally challenging-Devoid of any "moral" or "message"-Doesn't focus on beautiful and affluent people-Forces the viewer to question themselves as a participant

- Also, no trite and convenient ending where all the characters go on to live happily ever after. The real story behind the King's Speech could have been more complex, but they decided to gloss over that whole Edward VIII being a blatant Nazi sympathizer, who actually Honymooned in Nazi Germany as a guest of Hitler, and Winston Churchill propping him up to keep him on the throne.

Winters Bone was a movie for grownups. The Kings Speech is a movie for people who wanted to escape being a grownup for a couple of hours. I guess in the end it's all subjective and a matter of taste, but I prefer the James Beard Award to not be handed out for cotton candy and gummy bears.

InmanRoshi:- Also, no trite and convenient ending where all the characters go on to live happily ever after.

If I can be allowed to continue to stroke my Winter's boner, the most provocative part of the movie for me was that I found myself rooting for the character to succeed due to my sympathy for her needs despite objectively understanding that her and her family would actually be better off losing the house and being taken in by the state.

Being able to root for a character making the wrong decision because you are given the opportunity to understand their motive's for making it is storytelling at its finest.

ben_reddy:PsyLord: Really? Sarah Palin? I never thought that these award shows had any merit. This just adds to that belief. Seriously, swag and awards for actors and musicians but no widely televised awards for teachers, scientists, doctors, humanitarians, etc? Our society sucks.

So, if there were an award show for Best History Teacher, would you watch it? They should all definetely be recognized and awarded more than they are, but come on, there is enough crap on tv without having to search through the Best Gynocologist Awards.

/then again...

I guess that's why the technical awards for the Academy Awards are not really televised. The smart, hard working people behind the cameras are not as interesting as the pretty actors.

Absolutely, but its annoying when people condescend to those that might think that. As if people who think its better than Winter's Bone are just dumb or easily placated.

Who was condescending? There are generally agreed upon criteria for what makes art great. If there weren't, there would be no realistic reason not to give 'Twilight' the Pulitzer prize. I was simply pointing out that by the standards most critics use to define great film-making, Winter's Bone is pretty much the better film.

Absolutely, but its annoying when people condescend to those that might think that. As if people who think its better than Winter's Bone are just dumb or easily placated.

I really liked Winter's Bone but my guess is that 10 years from now it will be The Kings speech they play on tbs along with Shawshank and The Hunt for Red October. And just like both those movies, no matter where in the movie it's at I'll be magically compelled to leave it on that channel and watch the rest of it.

Hoboclown:If great movies were based on great writing alone, they'd be books. Suggesting that the cinematography, editing, and performances of a film don't have as much importance to a movie as the script is straight up laughable.

They don't. The script is the fundamental part of the movie, because what we actually care about in movies is the really basic stuff of story, character and dialogue. Take a poor script and throw a great director and cast at it and you'll still get a poor movie.

A bad script is like getting bad food in a restaurant. It doesn't matter that the decor, music and service were good, it's still not a good restaurant. If you get good food, but bad decor and service, you'd probably consider it as an OK restaurant. A great restaurant is when the food, service and decor are all good.

buck1138:I really liked Winter's Bone but my guess is that 10 years from now it will be The Kings speech they play on tbs along with Shawshank and The Hunt for Red October. And just like both those movies, no matter where in the movie it's at I'll be magically compelled to leave it on that channel and watch the rest of it.

REO Speedwagon's 1980 Take It On the Run still gets regular airplay on classic rock stations. It's still a shiatty song, and many other songs and albums released that year that are much better despite not getting regular radio play today.

InmanRoshi:buck1138: I really liked Winter's Bone but my guess is that 10 years from now it will be The Kings speech they play on tbs along with Shawshank and The Hunt for Red October. And just like both those movies, no matter where in the movie it's at I'll be magically compelled to leave it on that channel and watch the rest of it.

REO Speedwagon's 1980 Take It On the Run still gets regular airplay on classic rock stations. It's still a shiatty song, and many other songs and albums released that year that are much better despite not getting regular radio play today.

farkeruk:A bad script is like getting bad food in a restaurant. It doesn't matter that the decor, music and service were good, it's still not a good restaurant. If you get good food, but bad decor and service, you'd probably consider it as an OK restaurant. A great restaurant is when the food, service and decor are all good.

Lousy analogy. The script by itself might be the recipe, but it takes quality ingredients and someone who knows how to cook to make a decent meal.

The script is the plot. The script plus the direction, cinematography, score, editing and performances is the movie. The writing is important, sure, but you're saying that's the only thing people are going to see. Seems like Hollywood could save a lot of money just publishing the scripts in book form and selling them in stores. It'd make the same money, right? Since that's all people want?

farkeruk:DamnYankees: Meanwhile, movies like Fantasia, Baraka and Koyaanisqatsi are brilliant films even though they literally have no story, no characters and no dialogue.

Which are really just music videos/soundscapes. Just because it's on a theater, doesn't make it a movie, unless you also consider U2's Rattle and Hum to be a movie.

My wife wants to get in the habit of seeing all of the Best Picture nominees every year. I was on board but after seeing the list...ehhhhhhh. Only ones I really want to see are Moneyball, The Help (kinda) and Descendants.

Has anyone seen Tree of Life? What exactly am I in for? The reviews make it sound like a David Lynch flick and I hate that kind of vague avant-garde weirdness.

xalres:My wife wants to get in the habit of seeing all of the Best Picture nominees every year. I was on board but after seeing the list...ehhhhhhh. Only ones I really want to see are Moneyball, The Help (kinda) and Descendants.

Has anyone seen Tree of Life? What exactly am I in for? The reviews make it sound like a David Lynch flick and I hate that kind of vague avant-garde weirdness.

/she's on her own for the Woody Allen movie, can't stand that guy.

I haven't seen The Tree of Life, but Woody Allen isn't actually in Midnight in Paris, so you shouldn't let that stop you. My brother-in-law feels the same way about him, but he enjoyed the movie.

Not to mention that as far as other Oscars for King's Speech go, they clearly were giving Colin Firth a makeup Oscar for that one because they didn't give him one the year before for A Single Man. Not that Firth wasn't excellent in the role, but that's not the role I would have given him an Oscar for because awkward and uptight posh British period drama is his bread and butter. Heck, I'd give him a supporting actor Oscar for Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy ahead of giving him one for King's Speech (and I think he was at most the 3rd best supporting performance in that behind Strong and Cumberbatch).

gunga galunga:xalres: My wife wants to get in the habit of seeing all of the Best Picture nominees every year. I was on board but after seeing the list...ehhhhhhh. Only ones I really want to see are Moneyball, The Help (kinda) and Descendants.

Has anyone seen Tree of Life? What exactly am I in for? The reviews make it sound like a David Lynch flick and I hate that kind of vague avant-garde weirdness.

/she's on her own for the Woody Allen movie, can't stand that guy.

I haven't seen The Tree of Life, but Woody Allen isn't actually in Midnight in Paris, so you shouldn't let that stop you. My brother-in-law feels the same way about him, but he enjoyed the movie.

It's more about one of those running arguments we have. She actively hates Michael Jackson's music because she thinks he's a creepy pedo but thinks I need to look past that kind of thing and see the artistic merits of the works of guys like Woody Allen or Roman Polanski. It helps that I don't like the styles of either of those guys.

-Trent Reznor didn't get another Best Score nomination this year? Huh. I would've counted on that.

-I'd love to see someone other than Meryl Streep win Best Actress this year, if only for the simple reason that the other four nominees haven't won anything.

-I'm surprised that Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close scored a Best Picture nomination with such lukewarm reviews (namely, overall rotten ratings at Rotten Tomatoes), but it's interesting to see Max von Sydow back in the hunt for an Oscar.

xalres:My wife wants to get in the habit of seeing all of the Best Picture nominees every year. I was on board but after seeing the list...ehhhhhhh. Only ones I really want to see are Moneyball, The Help (kinda) and Descendants.

Has anyone seen Tree of Life? What exactly am I in for? The reviews make it sound like a David Lynch flick and I hate that kind of vague avant-garde weirdness.

/she's on her own for the Woody Allen movie, can't stand that guy.

If you're not that bright, but want to feel like you are for a couple hours, watch Tree of Life. Otherwise watch a decent Malick flick like Badlands.

DamnYankees:rynthetyn: I'm glad Gary Oldman got a nomination for Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy. He was absolutely amazing in that role.

rynthetyn: I'm glad Gary Oldman got a nomination for Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy. He was absolutely amazing in that role.

Everyone was amazing in that movie. An acting clinic.

REPEATED FOR EMPHASIS.

That was the best damn movie of the year for me. I haven't seen The Artist or The Decendants but I can tell you that the best that can be said for Moneyball is that it knew its place. It wasn't high drama, it wasn't intimate drama. It was a nice, little work-place drama. That's all.

Tinker was a masterpiece. A genre masterpiece, sure, but a masterpiece nonetheless.

-Trent Reznor didn't get another Best Score nomination this year? Huh. I would've counted on that.

-I'd love to see someone other than Meryl Streep win Best Actress this year, if only for the simple reason that the other four nominees haven't won anything.

-I'm surprised that Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close scored a Best Picture nomination with such lukewarm reviews (namely, overall rotten ratings at Rotten Tomatoes), but it's interesting to see Max von Sydow back in the hunt for an Oscar.

From what I read TinTin was not nominated because the Academy doesn't view Mo-Cap as Animation. Although it won the Golden Globe for best animation.

rynthetyn: I'm glad Gary Oldman got a nomination for Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy. He was absolutely amazing in that role.

Everyone was amazing in that movie. An acting clinic.

REPEATED FOR EMPHASIS.

That was the best damn movie of the year for me. I haven't seen The Artist or The Decendants but I can tell you that the best that can be said for Moneyball is that it knew its place. It wasn't high drama, it wasn't intimate drama. It was a nice, little work-place drama. That's all.

Tinker was a masterpiece. A genre masterpiece, sure, but a masterpiece nonetheless.

Honestly, I think that the reason Tinker didn't get more nominations than it got is because so many people got ridiculously confused by the story because it didn't spell out and telegraph every little thing. If the general populous weren't used to being spoon-fed, I'm convinced that it would have gotten more buzz and more nominations than it got.

The level of stupid with regards to audience reaction to that movie was facepalmingly high.

/I wanted to head-desk over the number of message board comments I saw asking variations of, "why was Peter crying over kicking his roommate out?"

Hoboclown:farkeruk: A bad script is like getting bad food in a restaurant. It doesn't matter that the decor, music and service were good, it's still not a good restaurant. If you get good food, but bad decor and service, you'd probably consider it as an OK restaurant. A great restaurant is when the food, service and decor are all good.

Lousy analogy. The script by itself might be the recipe, but it takes quality ingredients and someone who knows how to cook to make a decent meal.

The script is the plot. The script plus the direction, cinematography, score, editing and performances is the movie. The writing is important, sure, but you're saying that's the only thing people are going to see. Seems like Hollywood could save a lot of money just publishing the scripts in book form and selling them in stores. It'd make the same money, right? Since that's all people want?

The script is a helluva lot more than the plot, but you're not wrong.

The writing is the most important element by leaps and bounds for novels and plays. For everything else, the other contributions make a huge difference.

See: all the recent Batman movies. Poor, cheesy scripts, decent movies. Visually fun and interesting with good performances. Also, Bridesmaids had no ending, but was still a fun time at the theatre.

/what career subplot?//the thing that only the true best friend can do is... knock louder? No last min cake? No finding the bride at her parents' cabin?///still funny

DamnYankees:rynthetyn: I wanted to head-desk over the number of message board comments I saw asking variations of, "why was Peter crying over kicking his roommate out?"

I have to admit that was a very abrupt scene, seemingly coming out of nowhere. I thought the Mark Strong stuff was a little more evocative while treading similar territory.

But at least you figured out what was happening. An awful lot of people didn't have the slightest clue that it was a breakup scene, and didn't get it even after it was spelled out for them that Smiley told Peter that if he had anything in his personal life that could put him under scrutiny he needed to take care of it, and that the next scene is showing Peter doing just that.

And even fewer people seemed to have picked up on the fact that Hayden's betrayal of Prideaux was personal as well as professional because they'd had some sort of thing in the past. Picking up on that puts you in the minority of viewers.

Puss in Boots gets nominated for best animated feature, but The Adventures of Tintin doesn't? This is some bullshiat right here. Also, Tintin only got nominated for original musical score, but not for screenplay adaption. No me gusta.

I wasn't so sure about it this time around. The score for the Social Network is front and center, driving the action. The score for Dragon Tattoo is more atmospheric, more of a "set the scene" type of score. It's definitely not as flashy, though it is good. So I'm not too surprised that it didn't get the nod.

interface2x:I wasn't so sure about it this time around. The score for the Social Network is front and center, driving the action. The score for Dragon Tattoo is more atmospheric, more of a "set the scene" type of score. It's definitely not as flashy, though it is good. So I'm not too surprised that it didn't get the nod.

Yeah, I didn't mean so much that it was good, but that he would've surfed the wave of Oscar goodwill from the previous year.

rynthetyn:DamnYankees: rynthetyn: I wanted to head-desk over the number of message board comments I saw asking variations of, "why was Peter crying over kicking his roommate out?"

I have to admit that was a very abrupt scene, seemingly coming out of nowhere. I thought the Mark Strong stuff was a little more evocative while treading similar territory.

But at least you figured out what was happening. An awful lot of people didn't have the slightest clue that it was a breakup scene, and didn't get it even after it was spelled out for them that Smiley told Peter that if he had anything in his personal life that could put him under scrutiny he needed to take care of it, and that the next scene is showing Peter doing just that.

And even fewer people seemed to have picked up on the fact that Hayden's betrayal of Prideaux was personal as well as professional because they'd had some sort of thing in the past. Picking up on that puts you in the minority of viewers.

I don't know how people could fail to see those things, especially the Prideaxu-Hayden stuff. I mean, Prideaux cried when he did...that thing. Why else would he do that?

I don't think that's right. Maybe I'm splkitting hairs, but I don't see her name listed. I think those guys were the producers. She got a 'writer' credit on that movie because it was based on 'her' book. Even if it were to win (which won't happen)_, I don't think Palin will have the trophy.

Besides, "Paradise Lost 3: Purgatory" was really good. I didn't see the other nominees, but The Undefeated should lose (be defeated by, lol!) to that one at least.

If you do a quick check, you'll see that "Undefeated" was not "The Undefeated." The movie that was nominated had nothing to do with Sarah Palin.

Like you, I was also surprised Paradise Lost 3 didn't get nominated. This was a series of films that literally saved someone's life. Of course, I guess it's not surprising since the first one didn't get nominated either, and that was one of the best documentaries ever made.