Netanyahu: Jerusalem is ours, I don't care what the UN says

I knew this was always his stance, as well as PM's before him but never in difiance of UN. This all while about 180 countries in the world demanding
Israel come clean about it's Nulcear weapons and sign the NPT.

I am merely stating that a thesis that I saw earlier in this thread by someone who really does not know what they're talking about who shall remain
nameless, that Israel creates returns on American investments through military technology "such as the Iron Dome" and the copy that the Israelis
made of the P-90 PDW, which clearly are derivitave technologies. Israel's military is primarily composed of equipment that the Americans have either
stopped using or are currently phasing out. The only revolutionary development that Israel has ever made, in my opinion, is the Merkava MBT, which
rivals the M-1 Abrams in alot of ways, not the least being speed and fuel efficiency.

I think the Jewish Israelis should have a little more compassion and understanding for the poor Palestinians and all other races, creeds and
religions. They have allready undergone ethnic cleansing and mass genocide. It would be a shame if history repeated itself once again as the last time
Jews did not seem to fair to well.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
I think Israel needs to have their own Regime Change as it's really looking. However, especially in that nation, that change has to come from within
not from outsiders at any level. Much the way America will have to sort it's own issues out and sooner than later most likely.

Having said that.... America protects Israel because there hasn't been a choice about protecting Israel since they cooked up functional nuclear
warheads out of Dimona with the help of South Africa. If the U.S. is NOT there to protect Israel two things will happen...right after the Arabs attack
from at least 3 directions fairly soon after confirming we're really really serious about staying out of it.

#1. America will lose all credibility it has left at any level with the rest of the World on much of anything. There are ways for Obama to
disengage with Israel. This isn't it. Israel and the US share numerous binding treaties and they include treaties regarding military aid. Also,
America ALREADY has U.S. military forces in Israel. Actually in the Sinai Desert as part of the ongoing 1979 onward Multinational Peacekeeping Forces.

What is that command supposed to do? Throw out white flags or shoot in all directions? No one will ignore them. Neither side can bypass them. Bad Bad
places for all this.....

#2. Israel will either get divine intervention as Holy Scriptures foresee happening and at the end of basically the line of events we've
watched happen over the past 10-15 years, too................Or................... Israel will be brutally defeated and Hamas as well as others have
made it clear...right in their own Charter as well as statements, Israel won't be merely defeated, they will be obliterated as a people and to a
person. Swept from the land, as it were.

Well, Israel has an answer for that and they have since they popped the first nuke to test and confirm it really worked as expected. It's called the
Samson option. It's no joke, it's no bluff and it's no simple threat. It's a statement of what they simply WILL do as they accept a defeat is
imminent. The symbolic meaning is something like this...

...The actual meaning is thought to be the use of their entire deploy-able nuclear weapons arsenal as pre-organized targeting lists would deem best
set ...and as a big "If we die, you get there first" to the whole region and all her enemies. A similar plan by the U.S. and Soviets are things I
heard rumored growing up..but who knows on that. Israel? I take them at their word and so has every U.S. President.

I like to call it the Jonestown option. After the game was up, Jim Jones had a suicide cult, killing off the members of Jonestown with poisonous
fruity drink, and mass shooting, after some government type went off to tattle about the brainwashing going on inside. Which is sort of what is
happening in the mideast anyways: the threat of getting rid of the witnesses in a religious group before they turn around and find another reality.

I would not be surprised if even our own country has decided to hide some nukes under sensitive locations -- crypto city I'm looking at you -- to
occult the evidence if ever an international trial were on the horizon. It's not the war that's the hard part, but the accusations and reparations
in court, shaming survivors, that drive economists up the wall with war.

With that huge religious ground, and the history of the names, the style of the people and the language... and the prophecies, how to deal with that?
Not the money, or how many international names they put on their computer friends page, or popular vote by people who don't have to live in the
country. It could set an historic precedent, that the UN empire, posing like a dictatorship with politically correct peer pressure, can't rearrange
the planet like that. Trendy global government might not be the right permanent decision. To opt out of a world like that, it could be an act of
valor to stay true to one's national identity. Decisions... If you had an only daughter and someone came around and tried to say she was theirs and
told her how to dress and think and believe, and forget where she came from, would you fight to the end for her? I suppose it's the same pressure
with losing a very famous city.

Israel has to do what Israel has to do, as long as they keep it NIMBY: not in my backyard. I don't want the UN emperors coming around here pouting,
with their policy-without-a-country plans, if they don't get their way. As if one country to rule at a time weren't enough, they want a monopoly on
ruling. It's healthy to want to say no to that kind of domination.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000You won't see a jew running into
a pizzaria full of kids and their parents and detonating a suicide belt and killing them all either to achieve "martyrdom".

A jewish martyr says "I will die for what i believe".
A christian martyr says "i will die for what i believe".
A muslim martyr says "you will die for what i believe".

Gross stereotyping IMHO. Are you saying there have been no Jewish terrorist acts? Israel is rife with stories of them and in fact many state that it
was Jewish terrorist attacks that prompted the creation of Israel in the first place. It was the Christians who committed the first historical
genocide with the Cathars, 100 thousand of their own kind who the Pope did not like for disrespecting the power of the church. The atom bomb was
dropped by a Christian. They have killed as many people because of or in spite of their beliefs as any other religion than history. And hell yes some
martyrs have taken others with them.

All of the religions are bloody at this point. All have evil and good quotes in their main book and evil and good history, and all are manipulated for
political reasons. To imply Jews and Christians are the good guys and Islam the bad guys is only playing into exactly what Satan wants you to think. I
am damn sure he LOVES these holy wars! Could the concept get more ludicrous? I can only imagine him rubbing his hands in glee at posts like these.

There is no "true" religion. And people tend to be only as civilized as their economy allows them to be, America excepted of course.

reply to post by FissionSurplusThe question is, why should the US
continue to support this tiny little upstart country with 1/5 of our foreign aid budget so they can continue their land-grab and genocide?

And the answer is obvious: it is because they have the most powerful lobby in Washington and have bought almost all of our politicians currently
residing in Congress five times over. It took a lot of money to make us this insane, and they have enough to more than get that job done. It does not
seem to be US supporting Israel so much as Israel guiding the US's foreign policy decisions.

If only we could legally cut the lobbyist tie we could be done with all of this madness. As long as lobbyists exist, politicians are inherently
corruptible and the monarchy has not left town but simply put on a new mask.

The funny thing is, the Iron Dome is based on out-dated American tech that they stopped using after the Star-Wars program fell through because Canada
took issue with having American installations on our soil. Instead of wasting all of the equipment that was procured to be installed in Canada, they
sold it to the Israelis, and shortly afterwards, developed missile-defense systems that are infinitely more effective. The Iron Dome was constructed
with 80's tech. It is a return on an investment of sorts, but not the kind that is referred to by some people. It was an investment that was intended
for Canada, but we refused, so the American government sold it to Israel. The sad thing is, Israel probably paid for the whole system with American
tax-payers' money as-well, though, so I would say that trumps them figuring out a debatably better way to build an FN FAL (Galil) or repackaging a
P-90 (piece of crap btw, just like most other bullpups) and calling it their own. I swear, if Israel weren't the new Apartheid regime of choice, it
would really be quite laughable.

You guys really need to brush up on your firearms knowledge...

The Tavor is most definitely NOT a repackaged FN-P90. The only real similarity is that they are both bullpups - Their mechanical functioning is very
different.
- The P90 has a proprietary magazine that feeds from the top, the Tavor uses standard M16/AR15 mags (STANAG) and ammo, feeding from the bottom.
- The P90 ejects it's spent brass downward, the Tavor can be configured to eject either left or right.
- The effective range of the Tavor is more than double that of the P90.
- The P90 is a PDW (Personal Defense Weapon), while the Tavor is an assault rifle (A real one unlike the AR-15...).
- Muzzle velocity of the Tavor is about 30% higher, and energy of the projectile fired from the Tavor is about 3x that of the P90.
- The Tavor can be converted from 5.56mm into a 9mm submachine gun - although I don't think I've seen any of that variety around here.

There's more, but these are pretty significant differences...

The FN FAL and Galil are also not related - it was designed to replace the FAL and is not a modified version or a knockoff. The Galil is based off
the AK-47 - so in this case it would be accurate to say they copied someone - 40 years ago...

In 2005, Brig. Gen. Danny Gold, then head of Maf'at, decided to start the program that would include the system's research and a demonstration
of the intercepting system.[12][13] In 2007, Israel commissioned the development of Iron Dome, choosing Israeli contractor Rafael over the American
giant Lockheed Martin. Israeli company mPrest Systems was put in charge of programming the core of Iron Dome's battle management system. Iron Dome
went from the drawing board to combat readiness within less than four years, a remarkably short period of time for a weapons system designed from
scratch, according to military experts.[44] There was no system like this, anywhere in the world, in terms of capabilities, speed, accuracy. We felt
like a start-up —Eyal Ron, a manager at mPrest[44]

You can say what you want about Iron Dome, but it works pretty good, 80%-90% interception rate - I've seen it in action and I'm glad it is in use...
The biggest complaint I have is that Israel took way to long to deploy something. I always wondered why they insisted on developing their own system
rather than use an existing one like THIS

I think what Gorman was trying to get across is that Israel makes significant technological and scientific contributions to the world. When he said
"USBs", he was referring to flash drives, thumb drives, or as they call them in Israel, "Disk on key". This is in Israel innovation. They have
one of the highest percentages of engineers, scientists, PhD's, etc, per capita, in the world.

It worked though. And the US is possibly going to buy it from Israel if they don't design their own.

Also most weapons are repackaged versions of other ones. AK47 was stolen from Nazi Germany, for example. In fact, most modern military designs are
redesigned nazi tech.

There are other inventions too. In medical and technology.

Like I said, people don't invest for fun. They are looking for profit. You use the same USBs that IBM invested to Israel to develop.

Claims have been made by a Singaporean company Trek Technology and a Chinese company Netac Technology that they invented the USB and has earlier
patent filed to prove it.

Creator controversy USB flash drives were invented by Amir Ban, Dov Moran and Oron Ogdan, all of the Israeli company M-Systems, who filed US
patent 6,148,354 in April 1999;[7] however, the patent describes a product that has a cable between the memory unit and the USB connector. IBM Patent
Disclosure RPS8-1999-0201 from September 13, 1999 by Shimon Shmueli accurately describes the USB flash drive.[citation needed] IBM partnered with
M-Systems to bring the product to market. Shmueli was later an expert witness for M-Systems and as part of his testimony in the Singapore court
presented the IBM disclosure and evidence to the fact that he invented the USB flash drive. M-Systems' product, developed by a team led by Dan
Harkabi, and named the DiskOnKey, was announced in September 2000.[8] Competing claims have been made by a Singaporean company Trek Technology and a
Chinese company Netac Technology,[9] but based on patents that post-date M-Systems'. Both Trek Technology and Netac Technology have tried to protect
their patent claims. Trek won a Singaporean suit,[10] but a court in the United Kingdom revoked one of Trek's UK patents.[11] While Netac Technology
has brought lawsuits against PNY Technologies,[12] Lenovo,[13] aigo,[14] Sony,[15][16][17] and Taiwan's Acer and Tai Guen Enterprise Co,[17] most
companies that manufacture USB flash drives do so without regard for Trek and Netac's patents.

Make it safe for tourists? Yes ok as long as they are not christian tourists. The jewish folk love to spit on christians over there. Well we are only
cattle to the real humans on the planet. Now that they have a homeland which they have cried about for years. I think they should all go back there to
live. With a bit of luck their semite brothers in the arab world with them turn it into green glas.

Make it safer for tourist as long as they are Jewish. Check out some videos on how people of other faiths are treated in Jerusalem by the Jews you
will see Israel should be the last nation to control Jerusalem.

Specifically Jerusalem?
Your 'check out how other faiths are treated by the Jews' is laughable, and deliberately generalised. Pockets of ultra orthodox Jews in areas like
Mea Shearim for example? Ha! They throw rocks at non religious jews for driving cars on the sabbath! That's hardly specific to 'all other faiths'.
You clearly have no idea how many mosques, churches, ba'hai temples, mormon tabernacles and samaritan worship places (to name but a few) exist within
Jerusalem.
Now, tell me exactly how many churches you can find in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. How many churches in Gaza? Not many in gaza, as they're getting burned
by the day.
In Israel, religious zealots have the freedom of expression (right or wrong) to give others a hard time. However,
if they cross the line, the law will fall upon them. If you don't believe me, explain why there are no Jews worshipping on the temple mount (or even
allowed to).
Love it or loathe it, Israel is a SECULAR DEMOCRACY that is rife with religious zealots of all faiths. Try and find that mix in any other middle
eastern country Sheldon, I dare you.

jews are not better than arabs, in fact many crimes were commited by israelites in the name of their IHVH, slaughter of the canaanites anyone? it was
a genocide, an undeniable fact of history and no one can change that. israel occupied lands that belonged to arabs and palestine and the arab world
want those lands back and i agree with them,

even though i think that Ahmadinejad is a lunatic and a danger to the regiion, Nethaniau is no better than him.There has to be a political change in
Israel from the inside as someone here in the thread stated and i can't agree more, but with Obama's and the US support, Nethaniau has his back
covered and will do as he pleases.

The other UN members need to grow some balls and show him they won't tolerate his behaviour, he basically told to UN to eff off.

When Israel and America lost the recent UN vote and Israel responded by planning new settlements, what does America do? Gives some lame statement
about being concerned or something... well whoopde do. Hows about stop funding and protecting them? Hows about stop voting with them.

Its about time the International Community stood up for itself and put sanctions and embargo's on Israel and America. Both are meglomaniac nations
that are out for themselves. It is clear.

edit on 23-12-2012 by spangledbanner because: whoops. spelling.

Without the US, the UN is more worthless than it is now. The US funds 25% of the UN alone.

US: 25%
China: 2%

Maybe if other countries pull their weight they can complain.

Cheers to Israel for staying strong. Other topics, I do not fully agree with Israels position. This one, I do.

No, I didn't. But yes it is very similar. That doesn't negate the actions.

And to those so vehemently defending Israel, claiming it is their land and it's been their land forever. Let me ask you this. Would you give your
life to defend it? Hell, have you even BEEN there? Your all quick to point the finger and say "dirty brown people = terrorists". Look at the true
history of what has happened to the Palestinian people and ask yourself, what would YOU do?

I guess I am just very confused. Why does everyone feel so adamant about protecting and securing Israel?? Israel is nothing but the thorn in the
Middle East's side. Every year we send them billions of dollars in aid, while our own soldiers who fought THEIR wars go homeless and hungry on the
street. Every year we give them billions worth of military equipment. What have they done for us? Well.. they've killed our soldiers and citizens.
That much we know is true. They throw a hissy fit anytime someone goes against them. They assassinate anyone they damn well feel. We know as fact that
they view everyone who is not a Jew as merely "cattle". "Goyims" if you will.

Jerusalem has been a holy land for Jews, Christians and Muslims for thousands of years. Do Jews claim more right than Christians? Jesus was crucified
on the outskirts of Jerusalem at "Golgotha". Would that not be one of the holiest places for Christians? The first people to ever settle Jerusalem
were the Canaanites. It wasn't until King David sacked Jerusalem, did it become under "Jewish" control. So therefor the statement that "it was
always Jewish land" is completely false. Before King David, Jerusalem was mainly controlled by Egypt under Ahmose I and Thutmose I. Jews have no
more right to claim Jerusalem as theirs, than do the Muslims or Christians.

And to the poster who stated that bigger guns control territory. Well.. your right. Israel holds onto its land, and continues to expand its borders
illegally because they not only have a very powerful military (thanks to the United States. And yes, its the US weaponry that works. Don't even speak
to me about the Merkava. That tank is a complete POS). Israel also has somewhere in the neighborhood of over 200 Thermonuclear weapons. Kind of ironic
that they cry about Iran's nuclear program, when no one is even allowed to LOOK inside of Dimona.

But I know.. the response I will get will be, "Well... those dirty brown Muslims are nothing but no good savage terrorists. The peace loving
Israeli's and the Jews have done nothing to warrant their attacks. They have been persecuted for thousands of years." And all I can do is roll my
eyes in disgust.

Originally posted by CincinnatiReds
Personally I'd rather Israel have Jerusalem, at least they'd develope it and make it safer for tourists. Islam already has plenty of "holy" sites
as it is.

You won't see a jew running into a pizzaria full of kids and their parents and detonating a suicide belt and killing them all either to achieve
"martyrdom".

A jewish martyr says "I will die for what i believe".
A christian martyr says "i will die for what i believe".
A muslim martyr says "you will die for what i believe".

Most of the time jews are not even permitted on temple mount, and if they pray they get carted off like a sack of garbage. It ain't right. Theres
alot of things that ain't right in this world but a man or woman or even a child not being permitted to pray in a place they consider sacred, a place
they should feel safe in, it's a travesty.

You're right, the are much smarter. They use entire countries as puppets by causing war.

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