“Sorry I Couldn’t Tip More, But I’m Broke”

I work for tips, well at least for the moment anyway. I have been working at Papa John’s for going on 4 years, and it has been VERY good to me. I deliver in the UVA area so business is usually better than in other parts of Charlottesville. It’s flexible, EASY, and I have made some great money, especially when my wife was going through Nursing School. It has allowed me to spend lots of time with my little man, Isaac, over the years, and to me that is better than any monetary rewards.

Here recently, we have decided that it is time for me to move on to more stable employment, as the tips I make these days, are not comparable to what I was making in the first 3 years. I have made as much as $300 in one night before, but generally used to average between $125, and $160 a night, and then there’s my paycheck. The last year has slowed and it has become harder to make $100 a night. This has forced us to make some decisions about what to do next. Needless to say, I have started to look for something else, to bring our income back up to the DEBT DESTRUCTION level that we want.

Almost anything I do is going to bring with it day care costs, and to the tune of $800 a month, but we think we can still make it worth the extra expenses. Our snowball has gotten smaller in the last 5 months since my wages have dropped dramatically over that same time, so it’s time to make a change. The summer time doesn’t offer much relief with UVA students home for the summer. My plan is to continue to work at Papa John’s part-time, and somewhere else full-time. We need to kill our debt and fast! We are making steady progress, and have made more than our minimum payments on the student loans we have left, but it feels like we aren’t moving very fast, especially once the interests dings our balance.

I am currently going through school, debt free, and am looking forward to being able to start my Financial Coaching business to fuel my desire to help others with their money. I need to become debt free first though, so here’s to finding something to help me do it faster! I’ll keep you posted!

It’s Hard Not To Notice

Ever since we started working our Total Money Makeover, it is hard for me not to pay attention to the amount of orders I take that involve credit cards. In the past 6 months the credit card transactions have seemed to double, but the tips have increasingly gotten smaller. This is really no surprise to me, but it is amazing how people continue to rack up the debt, in order to have lunch or dinner, or even that late night pizza after being at the bars all night. I often find myself wondering if the entire night out for some of these people, was completely funded by the plastic devil that they carry so lovingly in their pocket. I can’t tell you how many times I have wanted to point out the dangers of credit cards to these students and other customers who use them. I don’t because it’s not my business to do so, but the urge is undeniable.

Last night I was delivering 2 large pizzas, that cost about $26. After arriving 25 minutes after her placing the order, she hands me $51, and asks for $25 back in change. Next she starts to apologize for “not tipping more” and declared herself broke. Huh? I guess it made her feel better to use the phrase “not tipping more”, but if you do the math, she should have said “not tipping at all” instead! This is something that you just have to get used to when you work for tips and believe me it happens more than you think.

It has always been hard for me to understand how someone could have something delivered to their house after little to no effort, most of the time because they don’t want to go anywhere themselves, and not tip the guy using his own car that is working for tips. Gas, oil changes, & constant car maintenance, add up and believe me it isn’t cheap, but it is something that I try not to let bother me too much, because if I did I would always be mad. The good and the great tippers really make up for the dead beats, and I thank them heavily each and every night.

If You’re Too Broke To Tip, You’re Too Broke To Order

Aside from letting you get to learn a little more about me, I really just wanted to point out something that seems so obvious to me, but not to others. If you are truly broke, and not just giving a lame excuse as to why you can’t give a tip, then why are you ordering pizza, not to mention the best delivered pizza there is? Why not head to Kroger, Giant, Food Lion, or Harris Teeter and get you a couple of frozen pizzas for half the price? They are no comparison to Papa John’s, but you will be much less broke and it makes much more sense doesn’t it? Don’t eat steak and shrimp if all you can afford is Ramen noodles.

Now I am at least glad that this particular customer paid with cash and not a credit card, so maybe there is some hope after all. I really wanted to respond to her “being broke” comment with, “Well, I write for a website called, enemyofdebt.com, maybe you could check it out”. It’s just a guess, but I am sure she wasn’t broke because she had plenty of savings and no debt following her around. I simply walked away hoping that the next customer would realize the service I was providing, which is usually how it goes.

I am looking forward to not having to rely on tips, so becoming certified as a financial counselor needs to happen faster. I am not looking forward to working a full-time, and a part-time job, mostly because I will hardly ever see my precious son! I remind myself that it is only temporary and that the benefits from doing so will enable me to teach Isaac the value of hard work and sacrifice, as well as kill our remaining debt so my career may begin.

More News From EOD

I got a little sidetracked with my goals for the week, regarding a new theme, but it is still something I plan to do. I actually tried a couple of themes but couldn’t get them to work properly so what I have is better for now. I have created a list of articles to help new readers find there way here at EOD, now all I have to do is post it. I will do so this coming week, I promise! The insurance blog I planned to write, got moved because I had a more important project come up. One thing I have found after writing for a year at EOD is that when I am inspired, GO WITH IT NOW! If I wait the inspiration fades and the blog article doesn’t pan out. The series called Keys To Effective Money Management is in the works, and I am hoping you enjoy it and learn from it as I post each new addition to the series.

I went to the zoo in D.C. this week, along with some museums, so I am hoping to post my adventure next Saturday. I am going to use Saturdays to let you get to know me a little more, and to update you on any progress or changes regarding EOD.

Carnival Update From This Week

These are the carnivals I participated in this week. In case you missed it, I posted the article I submitted, if they were chosen to appear in the carnival.

Thanks to all who hosted these carnivals so that we can all learn from each other about our finances! Have a great weekend!

About Brad Chaffee

Brad has been motivating and inspiring people to get out of debt since 2008 when he and his wife started their debt free journey. He paid off $26,000 in 20 months and has been enjoying the benefits ever since. Brad is very passionate about helping you reach your debt free goals before and after debt freedom. You can also follow his journey over at Beyond Debt Freedom or on Twitter at @AfterDebt. View all posts by Brad Chaffee »

24 Responses to ““Sorry I Couldn’t Tip More, But I’m Broke””

Btw… tipping is optional and you should never tip anyone more than 15% of the entire purchase. A 15$ order deserves at least 3$. I would give 4$ at least all the time for such order. I just avoid expensive places where they overcharge everything making the tip seem more than it should be.

The Papa John’s I work for charges $1.50 for delivery and no I don’t get all of that. The boss gives us a portion of it to cover a portion of our fuel costs. If you only knew how often our cars break down and need to be worked on just so you can get your pizza, not to mention the depreciation of ones car due to the thousands of extra miles put on it. Delivery charge helps cover those costs and allows the owner to give a little more incentive for someone to beat their car into the ground. The truth is that even if all we got were those delivery charges it would not be worth doing, and you would not be able to order pizza and have it delivered because no one would want to do it. Delivery charge is added to price, and you tip for service. When you go to the grocery store, part of the cost that you pay include the costs to get the product to the store, and that really includes anything you buy anywhere.

I have never thought tipping to be optional for people who work for tips, nor have I ever thought that you should ONLY tip 15%. I think that if someone provided you a service and they work for tips you should tip them. (Waiter/waitress, delivery person, etc.) There are places that have tip jars, and that I believe is optional, and I usually only tip in this situation when there is exceptional service provided. I have tipped and received tips way above your 15% rule, so I totally disagree with you there. Why should there be a limit on how much I tip someone? If I want to tip someone $100 just because I want to make someone’s day, why is that a problem for you?

When you talk about places that over charge on everything, I wonder if you see any value at all in quality or service. When someone brings you superior quality goods there is a cost associated with those higher priced goods and why shouldn’t the customer pay for better product? Papa John’s for example is more expensive than Dominos, but Dominos has very poor quality which explains there extremely low prices. You certainly have the right to avoid those places, which is why I like the free market, but just because someone’s prices are higher doesn’t mean you are getting ripped off. It most often means that you are getting better product.

I was thinking more when you go to a bar and you pay way more for the same whiskey.

I guess any tipping industry will just have to settle for my standards jeje i am not cheap i give 4$ to 5$ for all my pizza delivers… but i don’t go up from that regardless the entire order was 20$ or 40$. And i don’t give 1 cent more of the 15% at any restaurant. And if i order the same whiskey i won’t tip more than i would in another place.

You do have a point when it comes to alcohol but I still think that there are some considerations to consider. Some places may not get their bottles from the same vendor, and in more cases it is probably a matter of not getting as good a deal on a bottle because the quantity they buy may not provide such a discount to them, as it would someone who buys a lot more. That still means you get to choose which place you want to get your drink from which is good.

I do not think you are cheap, in fact you would be someone I would be happy to deliver to on any given day. It’s the ones that don’t tip at all that get me. To be perfectly honest even if someone only gives me a dollar or two I am perfectly happy with that. I think it really boils down to showing your appreciation and gratitude for having someone do something for you, and even a dollar shows that. Thanks for the discussion Pedro, I enjoyed it!

Well I will fully admit that I didn’t know you were supposed to tip pizza delivery people, back in the days when you would call in an order (waaaaay back when I was in college). When I was on the road I would very often order pizza to the hotel room, either Papa John’s (which you are correct, is quite good) or Domino’s, but my criteria for where I ordered from was based on whether or not I could order it online. That’s when I discovered that places added on delivery charges. I assumed that was how the deliver driver got paid.

It was not until I got on the TMMO boards that I found out you were supposed to tip these folks! I always did after that (and yes, it was always on a cc, I was traveling for work) but I did have a special cash tip always ready if I got the “magic phrase”. (You know, I never did…)

So while I agree that the lady who said she was too broke to tip was wrong, I cut serious slack to those who don’t tip. I honestly didn’t know better. Those that tip a buck or something? Well…another story entirely.

Hey Peacebug!!!! Great hearing from you, and I believe there are people out there that just don’t know. From what I know about you, you do not come off as the kind of person to intentionally stiff anyone. You’re too sweet!

And that magic phrase you are referring to, “Better Than I Deserve”, is a tad awkward to say to someone who has never heard of Dave Ramsey. Believe me, I have tried it…LOL! People seem to immediately assume that you just murdered someone or something because why would you say you were better than you deserve? LOL I have got a better tip a couple of times for the Dave Ramsey stickers I have on my back bumper and one time I got a great tip ($15, on a $30 order), because someone LOVED my license plate that says “IH8 DEBT”. It was great!

I’ll try to consider the fact that some do not know about the whole tipping thing, but you have to admit, when you work for tips, it can be a little frustrating to drive your personal vehicle to bring someone some food, and get nothing for doing so.

Oh I TOTALLY understand the frustration!!! I am not knocking that part at all. But since you do know me, and I admitted my total ignorance, I think it’s safe to say that it does exist. I think, having flipped burgers in my day, I would live in a state of aggravation, especially having experienced the change in income as you have. But it’s one of those things you really can’t control, unless we accomplish the goal of getting the whole country to start reading EOD.

I totally agree, if you can’t afford to leave a tip, don’t order, it’s a package deal. Though I have to admit that I do scrutinize service more thoroughly before I leave a 20% tip.

BTW, another tip for saving money. Start a garden. I have one growing on my apartment deck. Four containers of tomatoes, pole beans, squash and cucumbers which all do well in small spaces. In another month, my salad and vegies will be just steps from the kitchen. Time commitment: no weeds and 5 min a day to water.

You have talked about tips/or lack of before and although I thought of writing you,since I feel somewhat different than you…I let it slide.
But I really feel I have to point out something now.First let me say that I have waitressed for a dozen years,so I know all about tipping and the public.
The problem I have with your attitude is this,
no one is forcing you to work a job that entails tips.If it bothers you so much that some people are either too cheap to tip or just don’t think about it….then you need to find a job that has nothing to do with tips.No one forced you to work at Papa John’s and you knew when you took the job you were going to put a lot of wear and tear on your car.Why is that the customer’s problem?? Why do you expect them to tip you to help pay for that?
I can understand you wanting to get a tip for good service,but if it bothers you so much when people don’t do that…you need a different job!
Most people are in their “own little world” and don’t realize how others are affected by their generosity/or lack of.It is just life and there is no sense in getting upset about it.
Now,just so you don’t hate me too much…I really enjoy your site and think you are doing a great job.I wish you well on all you have planned for the future.But,please,stop thinking you are “owed” good tips.Just take whatever you have in life and be grateful for it!!

Peacebug – I like your way of thinking and thanks very much for the compliment. EOD for everyone!

Jim Hahn – Thanks for your comments, and you should scrutinize bad service. Even we do not leave excellent tips every time but we also try to take into consideration who’s fault the bad service really was. Sometimes the cooks mess up but the waiters/waitresses pay for the mistake. Also thanks for the wonderful tips on starting a garden. We have been thinking about doing something along those lines but truthfully had no idea about where to start or how to for that matter.

Darlene, Darlene – LOL I don’t hate you Darlene, just like everyone else you are entitled to your opinion and because this is America you have every right to voice it. I respect your right to that opinion but have to completely disagree with you. As someone who claims to work for tips yourself I am bewildered at your choice to take the side of the person that doesn’t tip someone for providing them a service. As Peacebug respectfully pointed out, there are some that really do not know, and I am not talking about those folks, only the folks that know they should tip, get the food, but don’t. This woman that I referred to in my article knew she should tip by her own admission which is why she apologized to me for it. I have made tons of money delivering over the years and have always had a problem with those that do not tip as MOST people who work for tips do. My point was in the article that if you are BROKE, maybe you should make a better decision about how you spend your money or at best go pick up the pizza and use your own car to do so. Since you are a waitress I am assuming you have no idea how much drivers have to spend on their cars each and every year just to be able to provide a convenient service and make some money to take care of their families. You asked me why it is the customers problem and I would say that if they want to continue to be able to order pizza to be delivered, then they SHOULD be concerned with the person that is destroying his car in order to provide that service to them! I am not going to sympathize with someone who doesn’t tip just because people choose not to consider how their decisions effect others. If you read my post you would have also seen that I stated in my post, I was planning to get another job which is already in the works. When I work a job then I expect to be compensated for my work and in this case, if everyone had your opinion then there would be no delivery drivers or waitresses because no one would be willing to do it especially for no tips. Incentive is lost which is the very reason I have decided to move on. Sorry you were so offended by my opinion but my opinion still stands. I am glad you enjoy my blog and hope you continue to enjoy it even though you disagree with me this one time.

I think you are making the right move by choosing a different career and moving on. I think (like Darlene suggested) you realized people don’t have an obligation tip and that bothers you and you need to move away.

The reason i jump into this topic is b/c i have discuss this with my mom before since she is one that thinks patrons pay you and you are not entitle to tip. She never tips pizza drivers btw since she worked all her life at minimum wage and never complain about it and at the same time have very little to spare.

The root of the problem here is not the poor people that choose not to tip. I am waiting for the day, we as a culture grow up and take away restrictions on tipping jobs. I understand papa johns is a franchise business with small business owners. However, i think a company as rich as papa johns should give incentives to their branches to provide a car and pay a regular employee to deliver the pizza with a hat that says “tippin is optional as expected”.

The real rat here is not the lady who is trying to save her cents but the company behind you owned by dudes who want you to wreck your car so they can drive their Ferraris and fly in their private planes.

Wow Pedro! I don’t view companies or corporations as evil so I do not expect them to share their wealth with me. They worked hard for their money and deserve it. I do not believe they are evil and in fact my boss is probably one of the nicest and most generous guys I have ever worked for. He should not feel guilty because he has built some wealth by successfully running 4 pizza places, and some of the people just starting out are making more than minimum wage. The drivers work for less than minimum wage which is another thing I do not see as bad, but as a benefit. It allows me to bust my ass and earn more money because if I do, people that believe in tipping for great service will tip me well. That’s why I have made more than $20 an hour in 3 out of the four years I have been doing it. I am moving on because I am making less than $100 a day now not because I think that people are not obligated to tip, but because with the economy, the amount of orders we get has fallen which means that I do not make as much in a night. Bless your grandmother for working hard for minimum wage all her life but what does that have to do with tipping?? I like tips because not only can I be rewarded for hard work that the customer benefits from, I can reward others with nice tips as well. Honestly I think your opinion of corporations is a problem since those same corporations provide so many benefits that even you get to benefit from. It’s not evil to make money and build wealth. I think you have it backwards as far as the lady who wants to “save her cents”, because she should be saving her cents by not spending it on something she can’t afford. Thanks to the very rare perspective that you and Darlene have enlightened me with. All I can say is, Thank the LORD for all the people who do not see it your way!!! Money, corporations, and tipping is not evil….it’s people that are good or evil. I believe in giving and am very glad I get to be able to share my money with someone who deserves it without feeling so negatively about them. Again thanks for sharing your opinions with me, now it all makes sense.

“The real rat here is not the lady who is trying to save her cents but the company behind you owned by dudes who want you to wreck your car so they can drive their Ferraris and fly in their private planes.”

This comment floored me. I am sorry you feel that way, because I don’t see it that way at all. Dudes who “want” me to wreck my car so they can drive their ferraris? Really? WOW! What this sounds like is class warfare and since I believe in personal responsibility and being able to build wealth for myself without taking from someone else, I do not resent those that have done it before me. Most rich people are more generous than you probably know!

Hey don’t forget that mean rich people where the ones that got you in debt (and millions others). Some mean rich people are the ones that would rather buy a Mercedes than spread the wealth among the people who made them rich in the first place (their employees). Well yes some are evil others are not. Some spread the wealth and give more and others don’t.. Just like some people tip well and others don’t.

I do not think all rich people are evil. While my mom is poor, my dad made millions taking advantage of the government (aka tax payers). Working for him, I saw him charge a 18,000$ for an ambulance repair he did that cost him hardly 1,000$.

I was raised in a very expesive school and must of my friends dads were business owners and i saw some who were rats and some who weren’t. I have seen a lot.

A great example of this… walmart/sams vs costco. Walmart cuts benefits, pay worst while being the #1 fortune 500 company. Costco treats a lot better their employees and speard the wealth better with the people who make them richer every single day. Instead of just using them, they actually treat them well and help society grow.

I can either choose to be a cynic or an ignorant. I strike to keep a balance between the two positions.

I understand where you are coming from and i don’t blame you. I am just spreading the finger pointing for you since you can’t just point your finger at the lady, we as a society share the blame. Your employer company (aka papa johns the corporation or dominos or pizza hut) are sound companies that made millions and can share a lot more than they are right now. They could cut their profits and pay you better per hour to cover for the economic downturn.

But yeah some do are evil (please emphasis on the word ‘Some’ and do not imply ‘all’). The hourly paid employee didn’t took GM or Chrysler out of business. It was the people at the top who made the big bucks and felt entitle to it.

i do not blame those who have the ambition. Specially the ones who share the wealth once they make it.(please emphasis on the word ‘once’)

thank you for your response… you have a good point of view and i enjoy looking at it from your perspective.

Pedro, I want to first thank you for being able to disagree with me in a respectful and productive way. I love those kinds of disagreements, so thank you! It isn’t often that people can disagree so peacefully. I will admit that I am probably a bit biased since I am the one currently working for tips, but it is still hard for me to agree with some of what you said. I am glad that you did point out that you realize that not all but some were who you were referring to. As you might know, some people paint all corporations and big companies with the same brush. There are some VERY VERY VERY generous givers that are rich and that own big companies. Thanks again for your respectful thoughts on this issue!

I love Papa Johns, but always go pick mine up. Too cheap to pay the tip. It’s a shame you don’t get what you deserve when times get tough for people. I guess it’s better than them not ordering anything at all though. I used to serve at a restaurant and found people to be poor tippers in general. I was always like, if you don’t want to tip, go get fast food.

I think it is hard for frugal people to swallow getting delivery when they can go pick it up themselves. I don’t blame them frankly. If you think about it, it’s just one more way to save a few dollars that eventually add up over time.

Brad, I just wanted to clear up a few things.
First,I believe everyone should tip for the service they get.I am a very good tipper because of being an ex-waitress.But I think if you work a job in hopes of always being tipped well,you are setting yourself up for frustration and bitterness.I worked with a girl that was there “just for the tips” and she would always run
to see what was left for her and be angry when it wasn’t much,or none at all.I made 50 to 75% more in tips than her and I think the difference in our attitudes was the reason.To use an old phrase,
I think she gave off “bad vibes”.She was there just for the money(tips) and I think it showed.I truly enjoyed talking to people and making their lunch/dinner a great experience for them.I got tipped accordingly.I made more in tips than anyone I worked with.
Secondly,an experience early in my waitressing career really made me “grow-up”.I waited on a lady that was by herself.I gave her my best service,but after she had left I saw that she didn’t tip me.I was whining to my co-workers about it and one of the girls knew the woman.It turned out that the woman’s husband was in the hospital dying of cancer.She probably had just taken enough time to eat some lunch before going back to be with her husband.Well,I really felt like a fool and I realized at that moment that the world did not revolve around me and my tips and others had their own problems.It may be that the woman that did not tip you had something tragic going on in her life.
Thirdly,it is very hard to pick up nuances on the computer.Two people can read the same thing and come up with two totally different perspectives.You saw the woman’s apology as that she “knew she should tip”,but was too cheap.I saw her apology as that she was unable to tip and felt remorse.If she was the type who didn’t tip normally,why apologize?
I did understand what you were saying in that maybe she should not have ordered at all and gotten something less expensive from a grocery store.Maybe she had her reasons,but that is not for us to say.
I did read the post and saw you were looking for another job,that is why I wished you well on your future projects.
Lastly,I,too am glad to live in a country where we can voice our opinions.And I am glad to “agree to disagree” with you on a few things!! Because of your blog I am finally getting rid of all of my debt and rethinking some of my long-held beliefs.I am sorry if I took your words wrong about the tips,but it sure sounded like whining to me!! LOL

Darlene you are so right! It is not healthy to base your entire night on a few stiffs, as they’re called. I admit it used to get the best of me but I realized that when it did, it truly affected the rest of my night. I have learned to shrug it off, and move on. The whole point of the post really wasn’t intended to bash this woman for not tipping, it was really intended to pose the question, should you be ordering pizza if you can’t even afford to tip? She just happened to be the unlucky example for that scenario, since it happened that same night I wrote the blog. I also am not so blind to ignore that there may have been a hint of whining in my post either. LOL We all do it at times right?

I am so glad to hear that you are getting rid of your debt too! That makes me VERY happy and let’s me know that no matter how hard this blogging stuff may get from time to time, it is worth it in the end. Perhaps you are giving me a little too much credit though, because the real person doing the hard part is you, I just helped you get started! The compliment is appreciated nonetheless! Thank you and I hope you continue to come back for more motivation!!

As the daughter of a pizzeria assistant manager, I try to tip well even though I’m at the stage in my life where a frozen pizza is a much more typical indulgence than a night out, but there have been a couple of times when I’ve been tempted to tip very little in response to bad service. Do you think that is ok?

Hey E.C.! I do think it is okay not to tip as good if you receive bad service. Tips reflect satisfaction. I will never not tip but if the service is a disaster, I will not be as generous as originally planned. Being that I work for tips myself I will usually start at $5 and either go up or down from there. I do usually try to consider if the person I am tipping was at fault or not. If the food isn’t cooked right I don’t blame them but if I am over there sucking on an ice cube the whole dinner, or if my delivery arrives after 1 hour, then I will usually lower my tip.

Since know Dave Ramsey I gone from giving $1 plus and change left over from pizza to around $5 when buy pizza. And since Pizza Hut refuses to add a place close enough to deliver and Dominoes has gone stupid and has garlic on pizza I am left with one choice. Papa Johns. Do not really like it and only get it once a week where as if pizza hut delivered I order it almost daily. Since my order usually around $25 my $5 tip is a 25% tip. Why I tip so much because smart neighbors has dogs who love barking and chasing at poor delivery person. The Basset Hounds thank I scared of them 300 pound guy vs 10 pound dog nope not scare and I let them know it too.

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Hello and welcome toEnemy of Debt! I founded EOD in April of 2008 in an effort to motivate and inspire financial discipline by focusing on behavior and truth. By teaching personal responsibility, debt free principles, and the importance of planning, people can learn how to take control of their finances one step at a time. I want to help! :)