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Dish has some channels that DirecTV doesn't have too... so you could just as well ask that in the DirecTV forum.

I think the larger point here is... AEP pricing = AT250 + Premium Pack isn't the end of the world. In fact, it makes a kind of sense that you wouldn't get a discount for AEP over buying AT250 + Premiums when that is essentially what AEP is.

Probably the idea is AEP might eventually go away as a tier to simplify things.

Based on the pricing, I think they also want to move people off of AT120+... that would leave less tiers and less confusion I think from customers.

Dish has some channels that DirecTV doesn't have too... so you could just as well ask that in the DirecTV forum.

I think the larger point here is... AEP pricing = AT250 + Premium Pack isn't the end of the world. In fact, it makes a kind of sense that you wouldn't get a discount for AEP over buying AT250 + Premiums when that is essentially what AEP is.

Probably the idea is AEP might eventually go away as a tier to simplify things.

Based on the pricing, I think they also want to move people off of AT120+... that would leave less tiers and less confusion I think from customers.

I'm just talking their top packages. You raise it $15 you should at least add more premiums and make them all HD. Hell throw in the Epix channels. Come on Stewart you don't have to always defend Dish man.

At least others on here are stumped by a $15 increase too. Not you though you. I'm not putting Dish down. I like others just don't get it.

Based on the pricing, I think they also want to move people off of AT120+... that would leave less tiers and less confusion I think from customers.

Looking back there was a time where the gap between what is now AT120 and AT200 was $9 ... ten years ago AT120+ was created in the middle ... $4 less than AT200, $5 more than AT120. Over the past decade the gap between AT120 and AT200 has widened, becoming $15 in 2010. With the increasing price of RSNs the line probably belongs closer to being a little off AT200 instead of a little more than AT120.

BTW: AT250 over AT200 (with name changes) has remained a consistent $10 difference since 2004.

It would be nice if I could just opt-out of the rsn's [ didn't realize until lately they are so expensive] and other sports channels I never watch, and keep the same 250 package at the current price.

Opting out isn't the same as charging more for a separate sports package in my thinking.

Something else I've wondered about, if the Showtime channels are the same price between both Direct and Dish, why doesn't Dish carry the same amount of showtime channels as Direct? Seems Dish is missing a couple. Isn't the "package" the same across the board?

I am missing your point I think. How is that much different than a similar Dish package? It's nowhere near the channels of the Dish top package... And no RSN among many other sports.

I was responding to inazsully price of $85 bucks if you just get a couple of channels A La Carte which you can with the Big dish and pay alot less

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It would be nice if I could just opt-out of the rsn's [ didn't realize until lately they are so expensive] and other sports channels I never watch, and keep the same 250 package at the current price.

Opting out isn't the same as charging more for a separate sports package in my thinking.

Something else I've wondered about, if the Showtime channels are the same price between both Direct and Dish, why doesn't Dish carry the same amount of showtime channels as Direct? Seems Dish is missing a couple. Isn't the "package" the same across the board?

Showtime has way less HD channels than HBO & STARZ combind for the same price. Their movies suck.

I'm just talking their top packages. You raise it $15 you should at least add more premiums and make them all HD. Hell throw in the Epix channels. Come on Stewart you don't have to always defend Dish man.

At least others on here are stumped by a $15 increase too. Not you though you. I'm not putting Dish down. I like others just don't get it.

I'm not "defending" it... just attempting to explain it... and to be fair, the old argument of "raising prices didn't give me new channels" doesn't really wash anyway.

Lots of things go up in price without added value. Gasoline has gone up in price, yet my car still uses the same amount... grocery prices go up and sometimes the ounces in the package go down at the same time!

So yeah, it would be nice to pay more and get more... I think we all agree on that! But it isn't a realistic expectation no matter what the product.

Also the reverse is NEVER asked for by consumers... by which I mean...

When Dish adds some new channels, they typically do not immediately increase the package prices. IF the argument is "they raised the price, where are my extra channels" then the counter to that is "they added some new channels where is my price increase"...

And I personally don't want to encourage that correlation so that Dish does increase cost immediately whenever they add a new channel to the lineup.

Ok, I'll play... IF the only reason for Dish increasing is lawsuits...

Dyslexic?

What I said was I find it hard to believe that price increases has anything [or very little] to do with programming costs. The lawsuits are not the ONLY reason.

Why, pray tell, would Dish be the only corporation that does not pass its losses onto the consumer? Or is it that you honestly believe the AEP programming costs [ALONE] have actually increased $180/year/subscriber?

The price increases are not specific to the channels in each programming package.

AEP was underpriced (fighting to stay at then near the $100 price poing) ... this increase puts AEP at the same price DirecTV charged for Premier this year - until DirecTV raises the price of Premier by $5 in February (plus an additional $2 RSN fee in markets with multiple RSNs). Package prices are set where the market will bear.

AT120+ is a bad package to pick on if you are blaming lawsuits for specific price increases. There is nothing lawsuit related in AT120+ and the packages on both sides are going up only $5. What AT120+ does reflect is the never ending price increases demanded by RSNs (note again DirecTV's new $2 extra fee for multiple RSN markets). And while I do not believe RSNs represent $10 of the $15 price difference between AT120 and AT200, DISH has moved the price point to where they believe people will pay what is asked ... or pay $5 more and get DISH's most popular package, AT200.

A little extra in 2011 plus a little extra in 2013 and no price increase for 2012. Look at the big picture not the headline ... and also look at the credits DISH is providing for the two hardest hit packages, AT120+ and AEP. It is not as bad as it seems.

So that suggests that programming costs for all channels have risen and the increase only reflects the price necessary to offset that increase?

To oversimplify it, yes. Programming is not the only cost that DISH pays out, but it is a major portion of the bills DISH pays.

Then it has nothing to do with programming Costs, but the price at which DTV charges for a similar packages.

No ... but the price the market will bear is important. DISH sells itself as the low(er) price carrier. They need to stay at a lower price than their major competitors.

AMC is, and the AT120+ went up $10.

AMC is in AT120 and AT120 only went up $5. Don't gloss over the facts.

I am, which is why I can see a 700M loss in 2012 as one reason for price increases.

In the first three quarters of 2012 DISH is up (profitable) by $428 million. If they equal the worst fourth quarter since 2005 they will still post a profit of over $580 million for the year. Sure, they have had better years ... $608 million in 2006, $636 million in 2009, $756 million in 2007, $903 million in 2008, $985 million in 2010 ... I do not expect 4Q 2012 to be enough to beat 2011, but 2011 was not a typical year. It was the most profitable year in DISH history. 2012 will turn out fine. Another profitable year.

In the last 2 years, Dish has payed out $1.2B to TiVo & Voom. I find it hard to believe that price increases has anything [or very little] to do with programming costs.

Imagine how much they saved by not paying for Voom for all those years though It evens out pretty close to what they ended up paying Rainbow over all in the end, I agree with the TiVo point but I definitely have to disagree with the Rainbow part, imo Dish came out on top of that battle.Got the channels back, paid a little over what they saved in the long run and also got all of that extra spectrum.

I am, which is why I can see a 700M loss in 2012 as one reason for price increases.

It is incorrect to post the Rainbow/Voom settlement as a loss. Dish received valuable mobile frequency spectrum from Rainbow for that $700M. Now that is an investment that has yet to pay any dividends, but it isn't a loss anymore than a company buying 10,000 new computers for their data center is a loss.

I think your complaints are somewhat ill-founded. DirecTV announced similar price increases and also announced that their programming costs are rising higher than their price increase. Dish remains cheaper than DirecTV. Of course, all DirecTV customers are paying every month for NFL Sunday Ticket exclusivity costs...

Don't know what all the excitement is with AEP. My $150 bill with AEP and Hoppers and Joeys will go up a bit over 3% in February. That's after dropping when I converted from 722/622/211. 18 months is a long way off.