Note: If you're going to rail against me about parental alienation or Father's Rights, go away. Don't comment here. If you don't understand that I'm dealing with an extremely abusive, manipulative NPD sex addict who routinely & systematically is destroying the kids with his mind-fuckery, please don't comment here.

It's that time of year again, the time when the kids start getting sick at staggered times & start missing visitation with Dad.

I have three kids.

They get sick at various times & pass it back & forth. This causes one to not go on visitation because they're too sick to go. Then the next time one or the other or both are sick, then the next time someone else is sick again.

By sick I mean a high fever, or coughing that can't be controlled with medicine, or a sore throat, or vomiting, or just, you know, actually sick. Not needing to be hospitalized. Sick. I don't mean minor sniffles.

STBX wants to keep track of all hours that each kid is sick & misses out on visitation and make the hours up on week nights or on my weekends.

This interferes with homework.

This interferes with extracurricular activities (either mine or theirs).

This interferes with bath/shower night.

This interferes with my weekends with the kids.

With three kids, what this equates to is the visitation schedule shot to hell, unable to follow it because either someone is sick or we're making up lost time. We're back to me having to again run my life according to STBX's demands. Always having to check in with him. Always trying to fit me & the kids into his schedule. NEVER getting the fuck away from him. This is unacceptable.

My first thought? Illness trumps the visitation schedule and it is time lost. If he doesn't like that, too bad. He can attempt to claim contempt, but if you document everything like you always do he is going to be hard pressed to argue the point effectively about it being in the best interest of the children (unless he wants vomiting, fevers and hacking coughs to invade his home and drag sick kids out if bed). If there is no stipulation in the visitation agreement for illness, ask forgiveness later rather than permission up front...

What a selfish POS but you already know that! You need it spelled out in your divorce that if the children are sick, there will be no visitation. Period. This is just another way for him to continue to have some control in YOUR life.

I agree with what Phoenix1 said about documenting their illnesses and state that your are acting in the best interest of the children by not sending them to visitation. It is not in the best interest to have "make up hours" because it interferes with their schedule.

If he doesn't like it, he can fuck himself. Oops, I mean he can share his concerns with whoever gives a shit. Oops, I mean his attorney.

Nature_Girl, sometimes I feel jealous of the others on our board that are getting their divorce ... like they actually GET divorced but then I think of you and I would sacrifice my turn if it meant for you to get your divorce first. Hang in there sister ~ you are so strong!

I think the D will be final in the next month. What that won't do, sadly, is clear this shit up.

I've offered him extra time in the past when the kids have had something fun & exciting to do and wanted to share it with him. He's either flat out refused, OR, he's taken the extra time but then stood the kids up for the next visitation. Have to keep the total hours even, doncha know? I finally learned my lesson (at the expense of the kids' hearts being broken) and simply don't offer extra time any longer.

Now he's going to play this game with me. Well, actually, we played it last school year, too, but not this early into the school year. I should have known he'd start with this because I've finally got some volunteer activities I do now (trying to rebuild my social life and make the world a better place at the same time), which are changing the time he can talk to the kids one night a week (still talks to them, the time is just different, that's all). I should have known he'd try to fuck with me like this. He did this to me when we were together, would use the kids to prevent me from having any social life whatsoever.

I am not going to let it happen again. I just don't know how to solve this problem.

Can you call his bluff and send the vomiting child. If he wants make up time he can deal with a vomiting child. Then the kids might pass the bug on to him and he decides for himself 'it's not a good idea for them to come if they are sick'

Me: BW

Best thing I gained in my divorce - my freedom.

Life's good.

Posts: 1452 | Registered: Aug 2012 | From: Australia

tryingagain74♀ 33698Member # 33698

Posted: 6:02 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

In my case, there isn't a "make-up time." I'm not taking the child to Disney World-- I'm cleaning up vomit, having a sleepless night, maybe doing a sick child visit to the doctor's office. In other words, I am doing XWH a favor. He is more than welcome to care for the sick child himself, but since he doesn't want my contaminated children near his precious Owife and stepchildren, he's more than happy to let me do the heavy lifting.

Does your STBX-monster ever want to keep the kids when they're sick? Because as far as I'm concerned, he's letting you do the tough stuff and then whining about his lost time-- but he gets the kid back when the kid is all better again! Yeah, that's not real parenting. Either step up and care for the child when he's vomiting, or shut your piehole and be grateful that your ex-wife is willing to do it for you.

FBS; now happily liberated!
Two DS and One DD
It matters not how strait the gate,/How charged with punishments the scroll./I am the master of my fate:/I am the captain of my soul.--"Invictus," William Ernest Henley

Posts: 3728 | Registered: Oct 2011

LadyQ♀ 32847Member # 32847

Posted: 6:39 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

What tryingagain said.

But I'm also of the mind that I have 26 days with my kids and he has 4. I'm willing to give up "my weekend" from time to time.

Tune out the noise of what others tell you about who you are and work it out for yourself...

Posts: 1650 | Registered: Jul 2011

SBB♀ 35229Member # 35229

Posted: 6:42 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

No. He either gets the kids when they're sick or it is time lost. No make-up time.

I know you're going to say you need to take care of them because he won't do it right and maybe that is the case - it depends on whether their colds/flu turn into respiratory issues or something else serious like that.

If you think he will neglect, abuse or do stupid things with their meds then I would insist that he just miss out. Full stop. End of story.

I have 50/50 and illness doesn't change the schedule. Handovers are done in person when one of the girls needs to stay home sick. I just about died the first few times I handed my sick little girls to that fool and he does supremely stupid things (swimming when my big girl is running a low-grade fever = ear infection a few days later). And he isn't even a sadistic fuck - he's just your garden variety idiot.

If you are forced to 'make up time' then I would insist he have them when they are sick. I would not allow him to monopolise healthy time. I don't think that is beneficial to you or to your kids.

I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5844 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia

debbysbaby♀ 32962Member # 32962

Posted: 7:42 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

He either gets the kids when they're sick or it is time lost. No make-up time.

This. This is my attitude towards it. He's the parent, too and he's fully capable of caring for sick children. I hate when these dads think it's all supposed to be about fun and games. If he chooses not to get them then he's choosing to skip visitation and he doesn't get to make it up. You haven't told him he can't have them. Does he have a bed for them to rest in? Does he know how to administer Tylenol and Motrin and clean up vomit? Suck it up, dad, when you divorced their mom you signed up for this. Deal with it.

-betrayed almost my whole almost 15 yr marriage
-divorced since 2004

Posts: 906 | Registered: Aug 2011

cmego♀ 30346Member # 30346

Posted: 7:58 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

If the kids are really sick, I make him come help. Seriously. I have primary custody (he only sees them e/o weekend), so if I'm really stretched thin, I will ask for help. In almost 3 years I've only asked twice, and the last time my son was so sick he ended up in the ER.

Otherwise, he will generally take them unless a high fever, and we will switch weekends (he picks up the next one if possible) or he will come and take them out to dinner or something to make up for the extra time.

Does your STBX-monster ever want to keep the kids when they're sick? Because as far as I'm concerned, he's letting you do the tough stuff and then whining about his lost time-- but he gets the kid back when the kid is all better again! Yeah, that's not real parenting. Either step up and care for the child when he's vomiting, or shut your piehole and be grateful that your ex-wife is willing to do it for you.

No, he does not take care of the kids when they are sick. He does not want them when they are sick and makes sure to tell me & them this fact. He is strictly only a Disney Dad.

He does not have his own place. He has male roommates who he won't identify (he used to live with a sex addict, and used to do his visitation with another sex addict dad & his child), and one of them acts very strange "in that way" towards my children. I've warned the kids never to be alone with this other guy. The kids do not have their own rooms or beds at his place. STBX has never been able to follow directions for giving the kids medication, he's always been either an underdoser or an overdoser.

He knows I don't want to send the kids out when they are sick. What kind of parent forces a sick child out of bed? A horrible parent does that. Is that what I need to do to avoid this problem of "make up" time? Maybe? My sick child this weekend ASKED to stay home.

STBX is wanting to make up the exact amount of hours lost. Not just a dinner out (he doesn't take the kids out for a decent dinner, anyway) and call it good.

So in the future I need to send the sick child out with his/her siblings, yes? Because that's the only way to avoid this problem of then having to make up the hours?

IMO, if he is voluntarily declining to take visitation because the kids are sick then why should he get makeup visitation.

Keep calm and carry on.

Posts: 49483 | Registered: Nov 2004 | From: Minneapolis

7yrsflushed♂ 32258Member # 32258

Posted: 8:42 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

Sorry Naturegirl, I agree with SBB and damncutekitty. You don't have to make up anything. Either he takes the kids during his visitation or he forfeits that time.

He does not want them when they are sick and makes sure to tell me & them this fact.

If he truly doesn't want them when they are sick then he IS refusing his visitations for that child. I would document it and screw making it up. He either sees them during his visitations or he doesn't.

Unless you have an agreement saying time is required to be made up then you have in good faith allowed him his time and he refused so he loses that time. Document it including the fact that the kids are sick and you should be covered. I'm no lawyer so check with yours just in case.

D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Divorced 9/2/14 and loving life!

Posts: 1990 | Registered: May 2011 | From: VA

hexed♀ 19258Member # 19258

Posted: 8:49 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

Yes if he declines visitation there isn't a 'make up time' option.

But that's just a lot of water
Underneath a bridge I burned
And there's no use in backtracking
Around corners I have turned

“Many of us crucify ourselves between two thieves - regret for the past and fear of the future.” -foulton oursler

Posts: 8723 | Registered: Apr 2008

Gemini71♀ 40115Member # 40115

Posted: 8:59 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

What everyone else has said.

Document that he declined visitation, and he's SOL. If he does decide to take the sick kid, make sure to document any deficiencies in his caretaking.

Definitely bring this up with your lawyer so you can come up with a better plan for the future.

Edited to correct stupid typos.

Double Betrayal D-Day 7/26/2013
Divorced 11/18/2014

Two steps forward and one step backwards, is still progress.

Posts: 2347 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: Illinois, USA

Chrysalis123♀ 27148Member # 27148

Posted: 9:13 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

He knows I don't want to send the kids out when they are sick. What kind of parent forces a sick child out of bed? A horrible parent does that. Is that what I need to do to avoid this problem of "make up" time? Maybe? My sick child this weekend ASKED to stay home.

This is where he is hooking you and manipulating you. He installed the "Bad mother" button and is stomping the hell out of it.

You know that the kids should stay in be and get well. He doesn't care.

Next time it is his parenting time, he gets the sick kid or he looses his parenting time. Once he knows this is the deal I imagine things will change.

We all know you are not the bad mother, you know that too. It is his disorder that is making you doubt yourself.

Don’t get to the end of your life and find that you lived only the length of it; live the width of it as well.

Posts: 3016 | Registered: Jan 2010

tushnurse♀ 21101Member # 21101

Posted: 9:23 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

I have to agree with DCK and Chrysalis.
I would also add that it should be an all or none thing. If he doesn't feel he can take care of the sick one, then none should go. It's too damn disruptive to their schedules for him to be able to pick and choose which ones he wants.

He is truly manipulating you by making you feel like a bad mom for sending a sick kid to be with dad. If he can't or refuses to handle it then he shouldn't get them. The End.

Ditto the others. He takes the kids in sickness or in health or he doesn't. There's no make up time for refusing to be a parent.

Me- 32
Happily engaged and moving on

Posts: 382 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: New England

Undefinabl3♀ 36883Member # 36883

Posted: 10:15 AM, October 21st (Monday), 2013

STBX wants to keep track of all hours that each kid is sick & misses out on visitation and make the hours up on week nights or on my weekends.

Sorry but this is a big fat fucking NO.

I AM for father's rights and all that hubbub, what i am not for is Asshole rights.

If he can't be bothered with a sick child, then that's his fault.

Also, (not that you are not already doing this) but documenting his missed visitations when the kids are WELL should be done at every instance, so that if this does come up, you can show him how many times he's missed while they are perfectly healthy.

I wish the Karma bus would LITERALLY hit him so that you wouldn't have to deal with this shit anymore.

Hi NG,
I agree with the others. I think I would document that he declined the children during sick time. And then refuse to allow him to make it up, including a line that says that it's disruptive to change their schedule just because he didn't want them when they were sick. Parenting time is parenting time, and it shouldn't matter if the child is sick.

Do you think you can do this? Are you afraid of him bringing you back to court? If so, are you comfortable with this solution - documenting everything.

Also, I get your "good mother" comment. I would do the same, as you know.