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So, What Did I Miss?

I take a road trip to Atlanta for a couple of days, take in a Braves-Tigers game, and get reminded in person that Carlos Guillen and Rafael Soriano are both still awesome, and I apparently missed quite a bit in Mariner-land.

1. The Richie Sexson Annual Second Half Tear looks to be just about underway. .300/.364/.900 in his last 7 games, including 4 home runs. This is why the team didn’t bench him. He’s a ridiculously streaky hitter, but when he’s running hot, he’s the most effective power hitter the offense has, and they can’t win without him driving the ball.

2. After the Friday night debacle, Hargrove responded with more line-up changes. Last time he shook things up, he did well, moving Lopez to #2 and dropping Vidro to #8. This time? Not so much. Vidro brings his pathetic little .721 OPS back to the #3 hole. Becuase clearly, this team needs more Turbo.

3. Hargrove may be noticing that Guillen is having problems with RHPs, however, as he got Broussard into the line-up on Sunday in RF. Apparently, Guillen and Ibanez are both too hurt to play. Hello Adam Jones! No? Arghh. I don’t love Broussard in the outfield, but RF at Safeco is the easiest spot to play, and Guillen doesn’t have much range with his bad ankles either, so the offensive upgrade against right-handers is probably worth the experiment. He really needs to be in the line-up more often, as the team just can’t afford to keep a .295/.349/.487 left-handed hitter against RHPs on the bench.

4. Also, from the box score, it looks like Hargrove made two terrific moves yesterday – the suicide squeeze is my favorite play in baseball, and should be used far more often than it is. Kudos to Grover for calling it in the perfect scenario, with Betancourt on 3rd and Bloomquist at the plate in a tie game. Also, for handing the ball to J.J. Putz to get the final out in the 8th inning. Sherrill’s good enough to get tough righties out, but since he’s set on playing the L/R matchup game with his bullpen, going to Putz instead of Morrow could have been a game-saving decision.

5. And, finally, the big one – Ken Griffey Jr gave an interview on Fox Sports Northwest where he said he wants to retire as a Mariner, and that Seattle will always be home. You have no idea how happy I am that I wasn’t around the blog for this, because I’d have been pounding my head against a wall trying to keep the trade-creating-posters at bay.

So, what does his statement mean? Well, obviously, he had a good time in his return to Safeco, and the numerous standing ovations meant a lot to him. There’s no doubt he’s going into the hall of fame as a Mariner, and the idea of playing his last game with the team that he broke into the majors with holds significant appeal to both him and a large portion of the fan base. And we know that the M’s organization absolutely loves stuff like this, so the executives will push hard for a Griffey return when it becomes possible.

But as far as making a move right now? Let’s look at this from a realistic perspective. The M’s currently have a better player than Ken Griffey Jr biding his time in Tacoma waiting for a spot in the line-up to open up. They have a quality left-handed hitter sitting on the bench, unable to get as much playing time as he deserves. And they have another outfielder in Tacoma who continues to take a significant step forward in development and, because he’s out of options, he has to be on the team next year or be in another organization.

We already can’t find room for Ben Broussard and Adam Jones right now (again, this is why the Vidro trade was so ridiculously awful), and next year, you have to add Wladmir Balentien to the mix. Between the three outfield spots and designated hitter, you’ve got four line-up spots for Ichiro, Ibanez, Guillen, Vidro, Broussard, and Jones. Toss Balentien into that mix next year, likely replacing Guillen, and you’ve still got six guys for four spots. And that’s not including Jeff Clement, who is making a huge push to make sure he’s not forgotten about as a source of LH power.

Yes, Junior is better than Broussard and Vidro. And he’s a better fit for this team than Guillen, as the team needs a LH bat in the line-up more than a right-handed bat. But the marginal improvement of trading for Griffey isn’t as large as you’d think, looking at his numbers. He’d be another guy blocking Adam Jones, who really needs to be in the Mariners line-up right now, and would make a larger difference in improving the team than Junior would. He’d be another guy blocking Wladimir Balentien next year, giving the organization yet another high salaried player at a position where they had a low salaried option, taking more money away from the budget and preventing the club from improving at other positions.

For the huge portion of the fanbase that loves Griffey, I hope he does retire a Mariner. It just makes more sense for that to happen in 2009 and not 2007.

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Comments

125 Responses to “So, What Did I Miss?”

byronebyronian on
June 25th, 2007 2:36 pm

We don’t need Griffey this year. We need starting pitching.

As much as I’d LOVE to see Junior come back, the Reds will want kids in exchange for him. I am not willing to send anymore good young kids for a guy who will easily play his last year with us. We’ve given away a bit more than we should have for two subpar vets (Ramirez, Vidro) and while Griffey is still light years above the average player, he’s not worth a Feierabend, Clement or whatever the Reds will demand in return.

Wishhiker on
June 25th, 2007 2:54 pm

I agree that’s it’s not a locigal move to bring him in here at this point. I’m just saying that the M’s front office would pull the trigger on this which makes sense in a financial way in the moment. Not that thier deals haveto make sense in any way at all.

williebfan on
June 25th, 2007 2:54 pm

#96

Good point and true, although he was younger then. Thanks for reminding everyone here. Short memories.

williebfan on
June 25th, 2007 2:55 pm

BTW, chaulk up another winning run for my man Willie.

John09 on
June 25th, 2007 3:13 pm

What is the rationale for keeping Vidro in the everyday lineup, let alone batting him third? I have to admit I thought Vidro would be much better than he’s been, but it seems the skillset that made him a productive player earlier in his career has diminished siginificantly.
The thought throughout the offseason is that Bavasi and Hargrove are in job-saving mode, is this is true, why keep Vidro in the lineup? Has Ibanez told people he doesn’t want to/won’t DH? That could be a scenario that is blocking the move of Jones to LF, Ibanez to DH, Vidro to PH duties.

The M’s as an organization, and Hargrove specifically, overrate batting average as an indicator of skill. Vidro’s hitting .292, so they think he’s doing just fine.

Tek Jansen on
June 25th, 2007 3:28 pm

Vidro doesn’t strike out and his batting average remains above league average. Hargrove and the FO cannot grasp the notion that a .290 hitter who makes contact can still severely hurt the lineup if he fails to draw walks, steal bases, and/or hit for power. So despite his hollow BA, Vidro will remain as the everyday DH.

not only that, but i don’t think that management will admit they were wrong about vidro…best case scenario is that he gets hurt, but that is unlikely and we really shouldn’t wish injury on anyone…

Adam S on
June 25th, 2007 3:31 pm

Iâ€™m just saying that the Mâ€™s front office would pull the trigger on this which makes sense in a financial way in the moment.
Why does this make sense in a financial way? Only if we traded Sexson for Griffey would we dump enough payroll for this to work. Otherwise next year we can’t afford Griffey and Ichiro.

What is the rationale for keeping Vidro in the everyday lineup, let alone batting him third?,
Hargrove is an idiot who loves a set lineup and think his Vidro’s .300 AVG makes him good and Bavasi (and/or those who recommended Vidro) is a poor evaluator of talent and trying to save face on a horrid trade. Not sure if that qualifies as rationale, but that’s basically the sad reason. If you trade for Vidro expecting 290/350/450 and he’s at 300/350/370, that isn’t (in the M’s eyes) reason to dump him.

msb on
June 25th, 2007 3:52 pm

I hate to think of John Mcgrath as the voice of reason, but hie is currently informing Ian Furness that a) Adam Jones is ready, b) he is cheaper & would in theory then give you money for pitching, c) the team is a marginal team at best and does Griffey put you over the top, and d) you can go to the bus station and find someone more productive than Vidro rather than spend the money on a DH

John09 on
June 25th, 2007 3:53 pm

Maybe the M’s as an organization think highly of BA, but as they must know, the reason for offense is to score runs. As a player, you either need to score them or drive them in (few people can make a career of “moving people over”). Vidro doesn’t do either and they have to know this. And he doesn’t contribute defensively or run the bases well. I just don’t understand why they play him, especially when they have a viable option in AAA. Maybe they don’t value Jones MLB ability right now? Are there thoughts in the organization that Jones is a “year away”?

colm on
June 25th, 2007 3:54 pm

He’s getting remarkably little attention for being mediocre.

Previously crap Mariners (Cirillo, Aurelia, Spezio, Jurassic Carl, going all the way back to the mythical Mendoza) have had their mediocrity broadcast more widely.

dnc on
June 25th, 2007 4:09 pm

114 – none of those guys hit .290.

And honestly, none of them were mediocre. They were all awful. Vidro’s numbers are bad, but not approaching the level of the players you listed.

This doesn’t mean I don’t think he sucks, or needs to be demoted. Just that it’s not as obvious as it was with the guys you’re comparing him to.

Dan W on
June 25th, 2007 4:09 pm

Hey – Vidro adds value by getting Ichiro to steal more!

gwangung on
June 25th, 2007 5:19 pm

This doesnâ€™t mean I donâ€™t think he sucks, or needs to be demoted. Just that itâ€™s not as obvious as it was with the guys youâ€™re comparing him to.

Well, that’s the problem with this organization. It has to be blindingly obvious for them to make a move (and I’m not talking about Bavasi; I’m talking about folks other than him). Vidro really sucks, but it’s not patently obvious to a casual fan. (Hm. Guess I’m saying that this group of fools are no more observant than the casual fan…)

joser on
June 25th, 2007 5:29 pm

What is the rationale for keeping Vidro in the everyday lineup, let alone batting him third? I have to admit I thought Vidro would be much better than heâ€™s been, but it seems the skillset that made him a productive player earlier in his career has diminished siginificantly.

All you have to do is look at this trend to see everything you need to know about Vidro. That would be fine for aging defensive specialist or slap hitting leadoff man, but for a guy whose entire job is to hit in the middle of the order, it’s rather pathetic. How Bavasi looked that that trendline and said “There‘s our next Designated Hitter!” I’ll never know.

I hate to think of John Mcgrath as the voice of reason, but hie is currently informing Ian Furness that a) Adam Jones is ready, b) he is cheaper & would in theory then give you money for pitching, c) the team is a marginal team at best and does Griffey put you over the top, and d) you can go to the bus station and find someone more productive than Vidro rather than spend the money on a DH

I don’t know who either of those guys are, but I’m guessing they’re on talk radio. And that’s good, because it means the word is getting out beyond the USSM echo chamber. Though given how much talk radio likes to spread controversy just to keep their ratings going, this may be less the result of clear thinking than just the desire to be contrary.

cgmonk on
June 25th, 2007 6:03 pm

@joser

I have no idea what ISO is, but it seems Vidro’s doing just as good as Ichiro is:

Joser,
John McGrath is a columnist for the Tacoma News Tribune, and he used to be a good journalist in the mid-90’s. Don’t know when, but apparently he’s gotten lazy and has written an annual column calling to trade Ichiro (lack of leadership) for the better part of the decade.

colm on
June 25th, 2007 6:09 pm

Isolated slugging. But Vidro’s not going to hitg 350-whatever or get on base more than 40 percent of the time.

I think Dave Cameron pointed out a while back that while Vidro is hitting for a much higher average than Everett last year, he doesn’t walk much, and he has a lot less power. Their OPS scores are pretty much a push.

He’s not Mendoza; he’s not a Spez-Aurel-irillo sized bust, but he’s about as bad as Crazy Carl.

DKCecil on
June 25th, 2007 6:19 pm

I asked in the other topic, but it was right before this topic was made, so it never got answered.

Iâ€™m interested if anyone here knows if anything has changed with Yorman Bazardo since he was traded to the Tigers. Heâ€™s pitched quite well for Toledo and even got called up for a little while. Has any of his velocity returned, or has nothing changed from when he was dealt and heâ€™s not still worth lamenting over?

planB on
June 25th, 2007 6:24 pm

Ichiro is not the DH. And I hear he has a glove.

Colorado Mariner Fan on
June 25th, 2007 6:28 pm

Cgmonk – are you sure you’re reading that chart correctly? Ichiro pretty much hangs right around .100 year-in and year-out – which is fine given his job as a leadoff hitter and other plusses. Vidro used to have decent ISO, but the last several years it looks like a ski slope. The trend since 2004 is pretty bad. Thus far in 2007 it’s .070(!). If Vidro was a leadoff/.400 OBP guy with speed, then maybe. But as a middle-of-the-order hitter with a no speed…

colm on
June 25th, 2007 6:42 pm

I see the same thing.

Ichiro below major league average for isolated power (which means what we all know for the evidence of our own eyes: Ichiro hits a tonne of singles) but he’s consistent.

Vidro flirted with better than average power briefly, early this season, but is now well below Ichiro, right in line with Juan Pierre, and a bit ahead of Luis Castillo. And he’s our DH.