Judge in bounty case scrutinizes key factual claim made by NFL

Posted by Mike Florio on August 15, 2012, 10:40 PM EDT

AP

Judge Helen G. Berrigan issued an order today in the bounty cases. Though it contained no ruling, it hinted at a decision she may be thinking about making, specifically as to Saints linebacker Jonathan Vilma’s defamation claim against Commissioner Roger Goodell.

Judge Berrigan has ordered the parties to identify by Friday at noon the date on which the NFLPA allegedly asked the NFL to defer disciplining players on March 21, the same day he disciplined the coaches and other non-players in the bounty case.

“The Court is aware that Goodell stated, during the March 21, 2012 interview with the NFL Network and ESPN, that he would have disciplined the players at the same time as the coaches but for the NFLPA’s indication that they ‘wanted some time to investigate [the allegations] and talk to its own players,'” Judge Berrigan writes in the order, a copy of which was obtained by PFT. “The Court is asking for the specific date on which this request occurred. If the date is already in the record, the parties may simply cite to the relevant document in the record; if it is not, then the parties shall submit the relevant evidence.”

Judge Berrigan apparently is trying to confirm — or debunk — the NFL’s claim that the decision to suspend the players already had been made at the time the league imposed discipline on the non-players. If the NFL hadn’t made the decision to suspend the players on or before March 21, then the statements made on March 21 by Goodell regarding Vilma could be viewed as unnecessary to the disciplinary process and thus not within the confines of Goodell’s job duties and, most importantly, completely beyond the scope of the labor agreement’s arbitration procedures.

In English, if Goodell actually hadn’t made the decision as to the players on March 21, Vilma’s defamation lawsuit can proceed in court.

At the August 10 hearing before Judge Berrigan, NFL outside counsel Gregg Levy reiterated the position that the decision was made as of March 21, but that the league waited at the union’s request. “[T]he Commissioner was prepared to issue his suspension decision with regard to the players at the same time that he disciplined the franchise and the coaches. But he held off doing that. He held off doing that because he was asked to do that by the Union, which represented to him that it was conducting its own investigation and no investigation ensued,” Levy said.

Judge Berrigan seems to be calling B.S., in not-so-subtle fashion. And it’ll be interesting to see what the parties submit on Friday in response to her order.

If, in the end, the NFL can’t substantiate the contention that the NFLPA asked for the discipline to be delayed beyond March 21, the impact could extend beyond Vilma’s defamation claim. Judge Berrigan will have caught the league with its fingers in the cookie jar of fabrication, which will influence to some extent the manner in which she views any other factual claims made by the league.

In a letter sent to the NFL Players Association on Wednesday, the NFL said it would neither facilitate the union’s investigation into the bounty scandal involving the New Orleans Saints, nor delay discipline against players, coaches and management allegedly involved in the pay-for-performance program that took place the past three seasons.

I’ve never heard the NFLPA dispute the claim that they asked to delay the suspensions, so why is the judge now subtly accusing this was a lie?

Seems to me she’s digging for a way to give the players an “out” by asking them to dispute something that they weren’t really planning on disputing so that she can create a loophole for them. Shady business…

Just curious. If D. Smith, called Goodell and asked that he wait (but never provided a formal written request) would a memo documenting the phone call be sufficient?

If that is what happened and the NFLPA realizes that acknowledging it kills the case then there is no doubt it will be denied by Smith. If it didn’t happen at all then there is a good possibility there will be an internal memo fabricated and thus disputed by the NFLPA.

In essence, the only way I see the NFL winning this little battle is if there was a formal written request from the NFLPA (or even from an individual player/counsel) or a recording of the telephone conversation.

The NFL needs to settle this. Cut all suspensions in half. Players end all legal proceedings. Call it over and done with and move on.

Those of us who know how truly engrained pay-for-performance programs are in the NFL know that the league would rather at least partially keep the illusion that the Saints were an abberation instead of it being uncovered in court that P4p programs are/were widespread and very common.

“Saints’ ‘pay for performance’ system commonplace in NFL”
By Bucky Brooks NFL.com
Analyst, NFL.com and NFL Network
Published: March 3, 2012 at 11:25 a.m
“The news of the New Orleans Saints operating a “bounty” program from 2009 to 2011 under defensive coordinator Gregg Williams has created quite a stir since the news broke Friday, but I will let you in on a dirty little secret: The practice is commonplace throughout the league.”

There was a report in March from Jim Trotter that the NFL supposedly sent a letter to the NFLPA on March 16th stating that they would not wait on the NFLPA to do their own investigation before they suspend the players.

Mr. Florio, I’m not sure if it qualifies as a legal request or not but here is what you posted in early March. The text seems to at least imply that the NFLPA made the request a couple of weeks prior to March 21.

Excerpt from: NFLPA issues statement on Saints bounties

Posted by Mike Florio on March 7, 2012, 5:57 PM EDT

We will vigorously protect the rights of all players. Until the facts are known, judgment based on reports in the media is speculative. That is why the NFLPA is undertaking a comprehensive review of the circumstances surrounding these reported violations of League rules. As part of this review, the NFLPA has requested that the NFL help facilitate interviews with members of New Orleans Saints management and coaching staff that were employed by the club in 2009, 2010 and 2011.

We recognize that this investigation was conducted over the course of many months. Accordingly, we have requested that the NFL provide us with sufficient time to complete our internal review as counsel to the players.

Did you just say that if they can’t prove the request for time or that they had made a decision then the deflemation lawsuit can continue because roger said “wanted some time to investigate and talk to its players” I don’t see the words “johnathon vilma” in any march 21st comments!!!!!!! So how is that defaming vilma if he never said his name and no one knew for sure who would be or how long a suspension would last

“Judge Berrigan will have caught the league with its fingers in the cookie jar of fabrication, which will influence to some extent the manner in which she views any other factual claims made by the league.”

Goodell has blatantly ‘leaked’ fictional evidence, had it blown out of the water, and tried again from another fictional angle. This is why it’s hard for us to actually believe any of this has been fair and arbitrary, and not just the whims of one man in power. Goodell’s punishment precedence has been terrible and speaks leagues of how poorly he understand what it’s like to play the game. It’s always seemed like he made up fines based on how he felt that day on the offense.

We just want the truth. I think Freeh gave Benson the truth. I think it looks bad on both sides. I think it doesn’t look as bad on the NOLA side as Goodell made it look in March and thereafter. I think Goodell goofed this one, and now EVERYONE looks suspect in the process.

Real suprise a judge from the eastern district of Louisiana is saying she would rule in favor of Vilma if she could… and to no surprise she is trying to find a way to rule in his favor. The whole state of Louisiana will hate her if she doesn’t.

Bottom line… Vilma has no case here. He never did. Even if she makes an illegitimate ruling in his favor it will quickly be overturned on appeal outside the state of Louisiana where a Judge won’t have to worry about public opinion and disgruntled Saint fans.

The fun part will be watching Jonathan Vilma and the NFLPA spend all their money on a worthless cause only to save some face value and raise suspicion to the public.

This is getting VERY interesting. I know some of the yokels on this site will come up with their “home cooking” comments, but if the Judge has caught the NFL/Goodell in a HUGE LIE, then they are flat out toast.

Goodell has been lying about this whole matter since day one. His chickens are coming home to roost.

Down goes Goodell.

I still say, this will not end well for Goodell. If he loses a Defamation Case against an active NFL player, he will be fired for cause by the owners and the rest of his contract will be terminated without pay. It would serve him well.

If the commish had indeed made up his mind on the discipline for the players by March 21st, he sure did not show it over a month later in an interview with Rich Eisen:

Q from Eisen:Something else that is first and foremost to the New Orleans Saints in many people’s minds about the punishment that you levied down based on the bounty case as well. When do you think the issue with suspending players who were involved in this is going to come to a head or a conclusion?

A from Goodell:“I hope to reach those decisions very soon. We have been continuing our work. We have continued to talk to players and other people that can give us a perspective. Once we have got all the information and we feel that we are in a position to be able to issue the fairest and most thorough types of decisions, we will do that but I expect to do that soon because this is a big element to me. This is player on player and what we want to do is make sure that people understand that there needs to be respect for players that play the game and that needs to start with players against players. We made it clear what we expect from the coaches and executives and clubs that these types of activities should not be occurring and that they need to do their part but the players need to do their part with each other and that starts with respecting each other”

“In a letter sent to the NFL Players Association on Wednesday, the NFL said it would neither facilitate the union’s investigation into the bounty scandal involving the New Orleans Saints, nor delay discipline against players, coaches and management allegedly involved in the pay-for-performance program that took place the past three seasons”

NFL is lying. On 8/10/12, NFL atty Levy stated in court that Goodell was ready to issue player suspensions on 3/21/12. Yet on 4/23/12, Goodell told the NFLN (Rich Eisen) that the investigations were ongoing and that they hoped to reach their decisions regarding player discipline soon.

Alternatively, if/when Levy’s proffer to the Court is verified it will serve as another example of the league attempting to involve the players and their union in the disciplinary process. Something the league wasn’t even required to do under the CBA.

Perhaps Judge Berrigan is exploring whether the players and their union were afforded the opportunity to prepare their respective defenses. Unlike the league, the players have first hand knowledge as to what occurred and equal access to their coaches and teammates.

If the league did agree, at the request of the NFLPA, to delay its ruling that would weigh heavily on the issue of fairness.

This is just so cool…R. Goodell has someone, a real judge, judge him and his process.
This has been unfair, and it is a joy to see it come to light. If this goes as I hope, I for one will have gained a step in respect of our USA system….

By the same token, if the NFL has uncontroverted proof the NFLPA asked for the delay, then shouldn’t the suit be over? I find it hard to believe that a lawyer would lie to a federal judge, so presumably the NFL will submit a declaration (which in federal court is signed under the penalty of perjury) substantiating the claim. But if the NFLPA submits a competing declaration denying this, then you’ve got a fact issue that presumably should go the jury.

Hopefully Commissioner Goodell produces the audio recording of Maurice Smith asking for delayed disciplinary action because he wanted to pursue his own investigation. Then it will be evident who the prevaricator really is.

Oh please with the this isn’t home cooked bs. I can’t stand Goodell but the judge still had a predetermined ruling to protect her judicial re-election. She has been looking for any excuse no matter how small to support her decision. You are supposed to let the evidence carry you to a ruling. Not try to steer evidence towards your decision you have already made. Would love to see Rog replaced. Would love even more to never see Vilma play again

I’ve never heard the NFLPA dispute the claim that they asked to delay the suspensions, so why is the judge now subtly accusing this was a lie?

Seems to me she’s digging for a way to give the players an “out” by asking them to dispute something that they weren’t really planning on disputing so that she can create a loophole for them. Shady business…
———————————————-

Let me help you with the tough ones.

Vilma’s point is that Goodell made up his mind before any players had a chance to meet with him. This is the basis of the “fairness” argument of which Vilma’s counsel is convincing Judge Berrigan . So now we have the NFL caught in a claim that it was ready to levy player suspensions on a specific date; only later to say that it was still mulling over the decision after the fact.

You guys all bitch & Moan about how these players act like idiots. Over & over again. You just don’t get the fact that given the state of the Game, there Are tons of issues we don’t even realize. The concussion suit alone could bring the NFL full circle.
Roger is in a very tough position. He does things needed for the league, knowing dam well , everyone will loathe him for it, but it is a necessary job & I personally think he has done a huge service to ensure we have football for the future!
In regards to this lawsuit, Vilma will NOT win, the league has evidence, they have written & verbal testimony from Gregg Williams, Sean Payton, “private sources”….. Do you honestly think, Roger would lie?? No, he would not!
Just think most of this knee jerk reactions are silly, and I for one know that someone like Goodell is needed to protect the NfL from outside influences & the league itself!

Translation: rather than applying the law this judge is looking for any excuse to support her own biased, predetermined judgment.
——————————-
Perhaps we should await her ruling before we decide whether and how she is applying the law.

My guess is that she thinks the law is clearly on Vilma’s side, but she is having to pour over the CBA to determine whether there is anything there that conflicts with the law.

Goodell may or may not have lied, we don’t know that for certain, yet. But we DO know for a fact that the Saints organization lied about their “pay-for-performance” program for years before admitting any wrongdoing. How have people forgotten this so quickly? Everyone has chastised Goodell for reaching a conclusion without knowing all the facts and now you’re doing the exact same thing! The judge has repeatedly said or otherwise indicated that she will “rule for Vilma” if she can. She has yet to see all the evidence the league has (whether or not the evidence is legit is irrelevant if you don’t look at it first) but has somehow reached her own decision. This is pure hypocrisy and whichever side you are on, you can’t say that the NFL’s “investigation” was unfair and this façade of a judicial process is fair and the same goes the other way.

Where are all the posters saying Vilma should shut up and take his punishment? How dare he challenge the King of the NFL! The King has become a joke and it will be real interesting to see how much power he loses when all this is over.

mjkelly77 says:
Aug 15, 2012 11:55 PM
Hopefully Commissioner Goodell produces the audio recording of Maurice Smith asking for delayed disciplinary action because he wanted to pursue his own investigation. Then it will be evident who the prevaricator really is.

_________________________________

Don’t need audio comments it was a March 3rd NFLPA press release. Problem is NFL said no on March 16th and in April Roger talked about still debating on player punishment.

phloorioisanarcissist | Aug 15, 2012, 10:20 PM CDT
Real suprise a judge from the eastern district of Louisiana is saying she would rule in favor of Vilma if she could… and to no surprise she is trying to find a way to rule in his favor. The whole state of Louisiana will hate her if she doesn’t.

Bottom line… Vilma has no case here. He never did. Even if she makes an illegitimate ruling in his favor it will quickly be overturned on appeal outside the state of Louisiana where a Judge won’t have to worry about public opinion and disgruntled Saint fans.

The appeals court is located in New Orleans. Thanks for playing better luck next time.

phloorioisanarcissist says:
Aug 15, 2012 11:20 PM
Real suprise a judge from the eastern district of Louisiana is saying she would rule in favor of Vilma if she could… and to no surprise she is trying to find a way to rule in his favor. The whole state of Louisiana will hate her if she doesn’t.

Bottom line… Vilma has no case here. He never did. Even if she makes an illegitimate ruling in his favor it will quickly be overturned on appeal outside the state of Louisiana where a Judge won’t have to worry about public opinion and disgruntled Saint fans.
—
You are so clueless. Do you have any idea what you are talking about? Your general opinions above are way off base, but technically speaking please note that the 5th Circuit Ct. of Appeal is located in New Orleans, so if you are worried about federal judges in Louisiana being biased simply because they are located in La, then keep worrying. But believe me, these federal judges are not worried about what Louisiana residents think of their opinions. The judge in this case has an opinion based on the actual evidence she has looked at. You have your opinion that is basically whatever the NFL says must be true, even when there is no evidence back ing up NFL’s claims, and even when some of the weak “evidence” presented was actually fabricated and / or misrepresented by the NFL.

“Bottom line… Vilma has no case here. He never did. Even if she makes an illegitimate ruling in his favor it will quickly be overturned on appeal outside the state of Louisiana where a Judge won’t have to worry about public opinion and disgruntled Saint fans.”

And so when this thing goes to appeals court and doesn’t get overturned, are you still going to spout your jealous, ignorant, biased opinions so boldly?

I’ve never heard the NFLPA dispute the claim that they asked to delay the suspensions, so why is the judge now subtly accusing this was a lie?
———————————
As I understand it (the post is a bit confusing), the question is not whether the NFLPA asked for the delay. The question is whether, when the NFL announced the delay, they had already made the decision on the player’s cases. If so, no problem. If not, the judge could rule that when the NFL announced the delay they acted outside the actions that were necessary to discipline the players as outlined in the CBA, and potentially defamed Vilma and the others by publicly declaring their guilt before the decision was made.

“I’m shocked, SHOCKED, to find fabricating going on in here.” The next thing you know, it will also be proven that Goodell was manipulating as well. Bottom line — Goodell’s investigation and the evidence didn’t justify the harshest punishments in the history of the NFL. The investigation by the FBI guy proves that Goodell is not to be trusted. Benson probably gave Goodell two options in their meeting — “Correct the mistakes you’ve made, or else start looking for another job.”

The CBA lets commissioner discipline be appealed to an impartial arbitrator of the league’s choice. Goodell has chosen himself as the impartial arbitrator. Shockingly, he has upheld the commissioner’s actions. The problem is that the CBA is a contract and all contracts contain warranties of good faith. If Goodell is going to act as an arbitrator, he has to be impartial. Not disclosing the evidence on which he made his decision is improper.

I’d expect the judge to conclude that Goodell’s hearings were a sham and enjoin the league from suspending Vilma.

“Even if she makes an illegitimate ruling in his favor it will quickly be overturned on appeal outside the state of Louisiana where a Judge won’t have to worry about public opinion and disgruntled Saint fans.”

Where do you think the appeal will take place? The 5th circuit is in New Orleans, in fact it’s just a quick trip upstairs from Judge Berrigan courtroom.

Why do you assume her ruling is unfair… regardless of it’s direction. She has listened to oral arguments, testimony and read through ton’s of briefs and motions from both sides. Her job is to form an opinion based on the facts presented. The NFL is basically making the argument that they have no requirement to be fair and just – No judge approve of that stance.

In a letter sent to the NFL Players Association on Wednesday, the NFL said it would neither facilitate the union’s investigation into the bounty scandal involving the New Orleans Saints, nor delay discipline against players, coaches and management allegedly involved in the pay-for-performance program that took place the past three seasons.

______________

So this round about proves that the NFLPA requested the delay before March 21. Which means the judge has to dismiss the case. She’s grasping at straws here.

I don’t get why there’s so many hate comments against Goodell. He had a lot of pressure on him to make the right punishments that would not only protect the league’s image, but ensure that bounties would never happen again. And he probably delayed punishing the players to make sure all the evidence was sufficient and credible enough to warrant punishment. And now he’s being treated like $hit for it. But sadly, I guess that’s what this world has come to.

“Judge Berrigan will have caught the league with its fingers in the cookie jar of fabrication,…”

Oh we know that’s what you’re hopin’ for, Mike.
Bring down the man!

Occupy the NFL!

pfft…

_____________

Exactly, this is all wishful thinking for Florio. The judge has to be careful how she proceeds. She is borderline demonstrating a bias towards Vilma. She is trying to manufacture a way to award him a decision, when a legitimate one doesn’t exist. And that will lead to a high chance of appeal success. And that’s why in the end after her media circus is over she will dismiss this case. No judge wants their decision over-turned.

Say, Has anybody thought just maybe Goodell has planed for this situation, And thats why he took so long to rule! He wanted to check with his lawyers, So he could have all his ducks in a row! Or Saints as it were. I’m not a Saints fan I’m a Football fan! And I’m sure pay for performance was common practice for all teams! The Saints were just dumb enough to get caught! Vilma might get his suspension cut! But not totally overturned

You gotta love the intelligence of the NFLPA. They wisely bargain to give Goodell sweeping powers to discipline players in exchange for some concessions, then when the discipline comes they put it in the courts with activist judges guaranteed to take their side. Very crafty indeed.

NFL is lying. They are going to lose. They have spouted so much disinformation. Everyone has forgotten that it was in fact the NFL who solicited the NFLPA for their input. ESPN’s Adam Schefter said Goodell is “soliciting input” from the NFLPA because “he wants to hear what the NFLPA thinks, what it believes and what it recommends” (“NFL Live,” ESPN, 3/22)NFLPA Still Waiting To Meet With Goodell Over Bountygate Punishments 3/23/12 They are not going to be able to prove it.

4/2/12 AP Source: NFLPA hires lawyer for Saints bounties
While Commissioner Roger Goodell weighs how to punish the two dozen or so players the league says might be connected to the bounties, the NFLPA also suggested that players have a lawyer and union representative present when they are interviewed by NFL investigators.
The NFL has said that 22 to 27 defensive players were part of the Saints’ pay-for-pain bounty pool, which awarded thousands of dollars of cash bonuses from 2009-11 for vicious hits that knocked targeted opponents out of games. One example, according to the league: Linebacker Jonathan Vilma offered $10,000 to any New Orleans player who sidelined Minnesota Vikings quarterback Brett Favre during the 2010 NFC championship game.
Gabe Feldman, a law professor and director of the Tulane Sports Law Program, said shortly after the NFL made its investigation public that he didn’t expect any criminal or civil legal action specifically tied to the bounties.

“They’re difficult cases to bring, because it’s hard to prove the injury was caused by a tackle with specific intent to injure, rather than a regular tackle,’’ Feldman explained at the time. “We all know injuries are a part of football. There can’t be legal liability anytime there is an injury. Otherwise, you can’t have football.’’http://articles.boston.com/2012-04-02/sports/31276153_1_bounties-goodell-nflpa

This is not a Louisiana State judge in a Louisiana State court. This is a Federal judge in a Federal court, so the contention that this judge is biased in favor of the Saints is ridiculous. In this case there has been a great deal of posturing from both sides and if you have followed any of the testimony and arguments from both sides you would know that the NFL and their attorneys have already been found to have engaged in questionable behaviors, i.e. leaking the story of details of a settlement. Good for Judge Berrigan for calling them out on their lies as many WELL DOCUMENTED sources have shown that Goodell claimed to have still been reviewing evidence before deciding on player punishment. If this is the case, then he should not have made any derogatory statements about ANY of the players if the evidence had not been fully reviewed.

Yesterday PFT noted she had concerns with payment for clean legal hits resulting in injury being called a bounty. Too bad, that is still against league rules. So even if she overturns the suspension that will be overturned on appeal, the particpation was still agaisnt league rules. Besides, you only have to show those Favre hits and you can demonstrate how fast clean legal hits can turn into cheap shots. Secondly she expressed concerns about the NFL’s process, that will also not hold up as Vilma and company refused to participate in the investigation from the outset, the league can counter by saying suspensions became necessary as a combination of the findings and punishments (suspensions) were harsh to drive an appeal in an effort to get the players sides of events. But again, Vilma and company refused to participate. All these things are dictated by the CBA. Just remember, this organization was told repeatedly that if they were engaging in these practices to discontinue them. They did not.

Now with that said, I think the player suspensions are excessive, but I also do believe you would have seen those reduced or reversed had the players gone into the appeals process. Once they refused to participate in the process that their pres agreed to in the CBA they lost the credibilty of attacking the process. Had they gone through the appeals process and then brought suit they’d have an actual leg to stand on.

This judge is looking for reasons to rule in favor of the players, as she has said in her statements, the danger is that she potentially overlooks the players culpability in the process. That’s a fast track to getting overruled on appeal.

What you have to remeber is that the team, players and NFLPA were given multiple chances to work with the league on this. They chose to try and stonewall it. There really isn’t much here legally for the player to hang their hats on, even if the NFL process was flawed, by refusing to participate the players abondoned the opportunity to dispute the integrity of the process. Add to that the fact that even AFTER the players refusal to participate in the appeals process the NFL extended the opportunity for the players to come in and present the version of events. So here is what you have: The league has to investiagate and players refuse to talk. League finds evidence of violations, league issues suspesnsion based on the available information and even after that the players refuse to talk to the NFL about it. That is why the judge has to look for reasons to rule in favor of the players. Becasue the players NEVER followed any of the practices agreed upon in the CBA. The judge will have a hard time ruling that the NFL process was flawed when the players violated the CBA in trying to thwart the porcess if she is concerned at all about being overruled on appeal.

For the record, my opionion is that suspensions for Loomis, Payton and Williams were appropriate. Vitt should have gotten a 2 game suspension at max.

Players suspensions are tough here, as the organization supported this. If you blow the whistle and nothing is found your career could be done. For that reason I think suspensions at the player level were heavy handed.

1. The NFL will continue to operate as it sees fit and just use this experience as a learning experience to erase any procedural slip ups or technicalities that may have occurred for next time it abuses its power. People shouting this as some sort of victory over the oppressive NFL need a reality check. It doesn’t question the power, it reinforces it by requiring a loophole that’s sure to be closed next time.

i never thought i would say this sentence, but goodolebaghead above has pretty much hit the nail on the head.

as for me i’m no former baghead, i root for philly. but when the head of an organization holds press conferences and issues press releases containing ridiculously false information about an employee, i think that falls outside the cba and is libelous. doesn’t seem that complicated to me. and for the nfl to keep adding to the lies makes it more apparent; except to those with a preconceived idea of a just outcome.

My facts are straight cash804. I am also aware that the Federal Court is located in New Orleans. However, if you are attempting to imply that a Federal judge, appointed by a US President would show bias in a case before her simply because of her place of residence I would tread very lightly with that implication and conclusion. Sounds like grounds for another defamation suit to me!

its going to be funny if goodell gets fired and the next guy up is even harder on player conduct. what do these guys think the next commissioner is going to let them drive drunk, hit their spouses and play football like it was the 60’s???

this comment section is filled with so much fail-in-life that it is comical. you people know absolutely nothing….Did any of you Saints haters bother to notice that this is federeal court, with a Clinton appointee as the judge….

The NFL is attempting to hide the true facts at all cost. They have even stashed Gregg Williams in Northern Thailand on an extended “backpacking” trip away from a possible Federal Subpoena from Vilma’s lawyers. I kid you not. The NFL has been in constant contact with Williams and wants to avoid at all cost truthful testimony from Williams that his “apology” was in fact written by the NFL. He is going on an extended trip to Africa next. What is the NFL trying to hide by keeping Williams out of touch?

Slowly but surely, the NFL’s case falls apart piece by piece. The judge has also said the evidence against Vilma verges on the ridiculous. The only thing the NFL has to cling to is not whether their evidence is good (it’s not), but procedural loopholes (did the Saints exhaust their avenues of appeal.) Pretty flimsy NFL.

I feel as though Vilma has done more damage to his reputation and character by so vehemently opposing and more or less attacking the NFL. If Michael Vick can go to jail for something as heinous as dog-fighting and get reinstated as a QB, what makes anyone think that even after Vilma serves his suspension and then IF the Saints get rid of him, then nobody will want him? If a team needs someone, the don’t just say no based on previous suspensions (even one as big as Vilma’s) they will evaluate what’s best for the team. What is not best for the team (the Saints in this case) is dragging out an offseason problem into the preseason and possibly the regular season, causing unwanted distractions and constant negative attention, as well as staff and players having to deal with courts when all they want is to get their team ready for football. Had it not been for Vilma’s defamation suit, the Saints as an organization would be able to move on and do what’s best for their team. This is a show of how Vilma is more concerned about himself than he is about the team and that is something that coaches and recruiters are more concerned about than prior suspensions.

I’m sorry – but the fact that this case is being tried in Lousiana really, really takes away credibility from whatever decision is ultimately made.
I personally do not lean toward one side or the other – I would just like to see justice served as fairly as possible.

jg725 says:
Aug 18, 2012 9:03 AM
I’m sorry – but the fact that this case is being tried in Lousiana really, really takes away credibility from whatever decision is ultimately made.
I personally do not lean toward one side or the other – I would just like to see justice served as fairly as possible.

…………………………………………………….

Vilma is employed in Louisiana. If he were a member of the Dolphins for example,the case would be tried in Florida Federal court.

The eventual decision given by Judge Berrigan will be fair in her opinion. That’s simply what Judges do. She won’t base her decision on the fact the Saints are the home team in her jurisdiction. Judges don’t like their decisions overturned and she knows this case is headed for the appellate court.

You spelled “winning” wrong bagadouche. And check your down votes there chum…it took more than us winning Saints fans to thumbs down your keyster into “no credibility because you are just an uninformed pitchfork waving mob member who just wants to see this crud happen to a team you hate” land…