This is my new favorite malt beverage. It is pretty expensive now; hops prices have gone through the roof, and 90 minute refers to the hops infusion. At 9% ABV, I'm only going to drink them one per sitting anyhow. The 90 Minute is better than the 120 Minute. My first taste of the 120, I was blown away; but by the end of the bottle, I felt that the brew lacked complexity. If it were music, it would be one long, loud C7 chord, where the 90 Minute is Link Wray's "Rumble".

RibRater, I was down there today, and they had some of the other Rogue Ales; American Amber, Brutal Bitter, Dead Guy, ... but they also had Chimay Grand Reserve and Chimay 500th Anniversary for the same price, so I got them instead.

Dearfolk, We Georgians thought we were lucky when Dogfish Head sent us some of their 60 Minute I. P. A. (at the time, they made a 6% version for states with that alcohol limit, and may still). Then we "popped the cap," so to speak, so now beer of up to 14% is available in our area. Imagine my glee to discover Dogfish Head 90 Minute! First it arrived in bottle, then we managed to have a new bar open up... Trappeze is its name (Google it up; I'll wait)... that carries loads of esoterica on draught. (No brag: they love me there.) Folks, I am noted for my prodigious appetite for both food and drink, but I can only polish off two draughts of 90 Minute I. P. A. in an evening... and I won't try for # 3 unless I'm going to someone's conveniently-closeby couch and/or REALLY have something to celebrate. Here's to Dogfish Head (beerless toast) and their plethora of witty and original products, and especially to 90 Minute I. P. A.! Untoastily Untoastedly Toastingly, Dead-Sober Ort. in the Chilly U. Ga. Library in Amazing Athens, Georgia.P. S. I agree that the 120 Minute I. P. A. is virtual overkill. We don't have that here (I don't think); they do in North Carolina and Florida (so we buy it there!).P. P. S. Yuengling Lager made its long-overdue appearance here last week. I have yet to drink one. I am told that their Black & Tan is also in our market. Dadgummit, more field work for the man who's trying to lose weight....

I haven't tried the 120. Around Austin, the price is $10 for a 12-oz bottle, and there are some things that even I won't do!

My personal guru for beer knowledge is Poverty Pete, and I asked him about the 120. He says that anything over 90 minutes is useless; the hops are used up before then. So, he thought that the 120 is just a marketing gimmick.

Bushie, the 120 is POTENT. Is it hoppier? Hell if I know, but I drank one and handed the keys to my wife to drive home from the restaurant. I was buzzed.

joerogo, IPA is "India Pale Ale". It is a copper ale with a lot of hops, comparable to English "bitters". IPA tends to be a bit stronger than regular American beer. The Dogfish Head brand has 60-, 90-, and 120- Minute IPA; the numbers refer to how long the hops infusion lasts. Longer = hoppier and more bitter.

Overlooked is that the 60 Minute IPA is really damn good, a truly well rounded craft beer. Considering that 60 Minute is about half the cost of the 90, and is 2/3 as strong (6% abv), it is really a better beer for every day drinking.

Bushie, the 120 is POTENT. Is it hoppier? Hell if I know, but I drank one and handed the keys to my wife to drive home from the restaurant. I was buzzed.

joerogo, IPA is "India Pale Ale". It is a copper ale with a lot of hops, comparable to English "bitters". IPA tends to be a bit stronger than regular American beer. The Dogfish Head brand has 60-, 90-, and 120- Minute IPA; the numbers refer to how long the hops infusion lasts. Longer = hoppier and more bitter.

Overlooked is that the 60 Minute IPA is really damn good, a truly well rounded craft beer. Considering that 60 Minute is about half the cost of the 90, and is 2/3 as strong (6% abv), it is really a better beer for every day drinking.

I erred when i said I'd bought the 120. I went back and checked the bottles and it was 60 minute IPA. I like IPAs, I like the bitterness and find them generally very refreshing. But Idid not like the 60 minute stuff at all- to me, it had a strange flavor, but my son, the beer maven, loves it.

As to the 21% alcohol in the 120 IPA - I don't see how they can achieve that level of alcohol by normal brewing processes. It has always been my understanding that yeast and bacteria die when the alcohol level reaches about 16%, and that after they die no more alcohol can be produced. In wine, anything over about 16% has been fortified by the addition of alcohol - such as in many Ports and Sherries.

So, can anyone help me to understnd how those high levels of alcohol are achieved in such products as the 120IPA?

I erred when i said I'd bought the 120. I went back and checked the bottles and it was 60 minute IPA. I like IPAs, I like the bitterness and find them generally very refreshing. But Idid not like the 60 minute stuff at all- to me, it had a strange flavor, but my son, the beer maven, loves it.

As to the 21% alcohol in the 120 IPA - I don't see how they can achieve that level of alcohol by normal brewing processes. It has always been my understanding that yeast and bacteria die when the alcohol level reaches about 16%, and that after they die no more alcohol can be produced. In wine, anything over about 16% has been fortified by the addition of alcohol - such as in many Ports and Sherries.

So, can anyone help me to understnd how those high levels of alcohol are achieved in such products as the 120IPA?

Cheers, John

Different yeast strains have different alcohol tolerances; you have to pick the strain that suits the style and gravity of the beer. There's a strain available to homebrewers that can ferment up to 25% alcohol (at least that's what they advertise). I think champagne yeast is even used on some high gravity beers because of its high alcohol tolerance.

Bushie, the 120 is POTENT. Is it hoppier? Hell if I know, but I drank one and handed the keys to my wife to drive home from the restaurant. I was buzzed.

joerogo, IPA is "India Pale Ale". It is a copper ale with a lot of hops, comparable to English "bitters". IPA tends to be a bit stronger than regular American beer. The Dogfish Head brand has 60-, 90-, and 120- Minute IPA; the numbers refer to how long the hops infusion lasts. Longer = hoppier and more bitter.

Overlooked is that the 60 Minute IPA is really damn good, a truly well rounded craft beer. Considering that 60 Minute is about half the cost of the 90, and is 2/3 as strong (6% abv), it is really a better beer for every day drinking.

Thanks for the lesson.

Joe, you can geet a 4 pack of DFH 90-, or 6 packs of 60-, Indian Brown Ale, and Raison d'Etre, at Wilkes-Barre Wegman's.

I just had a conversation with a beer maven and he suggested to me that, while there might be yeasts with an alcohol tolerance of 21% , he thought it more likely that the 120 IPA as concentrated by freezing the beer , extracting the water and thus concentrating the alcohol. He says Sam Adams does that with some of their product and also Molson blue is frozen as part of the process. Maybe someone should e-mail dogfish Head and see if they are willing to explain their process.

For those homebrewers, and non homebrewers, wondering how you ferment out a 21% alcohol beer when most yeast strains go dormant around 13%, you have to use a special high gravity yeast strain, some chemical tinkering with the malt sugars, then a very prolonged multi-staged fermentation.

A homebrewer who tried it because supposedly it couldn't be done outside a professional brewery setting gives the details here.

I just had a conversation with a beer maven and he suggested to me that, while there might be yeasts with an alcohol tolerance of 21% , he thought it more likely that the 120 IPA as concentrated by freezing the beer , extracting the water and thus concentrating the alcohol.

The TTB (successor to the ATF in the US) considers that "distilling" and no beer brewed in the US can use that technique and be sold as "beer". As will be noted in this TTB ruling http://www.ttb.gov/rulings/94-3.htm (caution- it's a head spinner). "ice beer" in the US can only be made when the alcohol level is restored by adding water after the process.

"Accordingly, water and carbon dioxide must be added to concentrate in order to restore the volume to not less than, and the alcoholic content to not greater than, the volume of the beer prior to concentration."

During production of ice beer, the beer is cooled below freezing causing the formation of ice crystals. ... After this freezing process, brewers restore to the beer at least the volume of water lost when ice crystals are removed.

Thanks, Jesskidden, and that just adds to the confusion. If Molson blue is not sold as beer , what is it, and does Sam Adams sell their expensive high alcohol stuff as something other than beer? And, why concentrate the alcohol in the beer only to bring it back to its previous level?

As for myself, a self-confessed non-beer maven - I'm one of those who likes a refreshing beer now and then and sometimes like it with food, especially fried sefood - I probably should not be adding my relative ignorance and lack of involvement in this thread. But, what does "TTB" stand for?

Thanks, Jesskidden, and that just adds to the confusion. If Molson blue is not sold as beer , what is it, and does Sam Adams sell their expensive high alcohol stuff as something other than beer? And, why concentrate the alcohol in the beer only to bring it back to its previous level?

From what I understand, all the high ABV Sam Adams products are done with the various "super yeasts" and other techniques noted above, not through freeze distillation. The major US brewed "Ice" beers (now somewhat of a dying fad) claimed that the freezing, skimming and re-adding water gave a beer a "rich and slightly sweet taste, with a smooth finish." http://www.anheuser-busch.com/PDF/Bud_Ice_Bud_Ice_Light.pdf

The legality of the process is (as you can imagine after reading that TTB ruling) somewhat confused and, the way I understand it, is that the craft-brewed eisbocks that do exist aren't shipped out of their home states. (Anyone know for sure?)

Thanks again, guys, I think I'll stick to my local IPA, made in nearby Kingston NY, and such perennial favorites as Yeungling and Rolling Rock. And I think in the future I'll avoid these esoteric beer discussions and stick to simple stuff like wine and distilled spirits.

Thanks again, guys, I think I'll stick to my local IPA, made in nearby Kingston NY, and such perennial favorites as Yeungling and Rolling Rock. And I think in the future I'll avoid these esoteric beer discussions and stick to simple stuff like wine and distilled spirits.

Cheers, John

Yeah, John, it's best to stay with simple things, like how to make a Martini.

I know you'll agree that the only real man's Martini is made with Sterling vodka, shaken (not stirred) with ice cubes and a generous splash of vermouth, then garnished with 3 large, jalapeno-stuffed olives.