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None of this is verified BTW, it's second hand info from B&C forum but I personally believe it all. The FLG guys have said that the Iron Hands supplement is one of the strongest.

- The Iron Father gives units within 6 inches of him a 5+ invulnerable save.

- He automatically repairs 3 wounds on any vehicles once per turn

- A stratagem allows you to perform the repair action twice; another psychic power allows you to heal up to D3 wounds on any vehicles, meaning you can heal up to a maximum of 9 wounds on a vehicle of your choice.

-There is a way to turn a dreadnought into a character

The implications of some of these are pretty significant. Vehicles will be extremely durable, Dreadnoughts will be very effective as they can be made into characters (imagine this on a ranged Venerable Dread)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/07 14:58:57

Ishagu wrote:None of this is verified BTW, it's second hand info from B&C forum but I personally believe it all. The FLG guys have said that the Iron Hands supplement is one of the strongest.

- The Iron Father gives units within 6 inches of him a 5+ invulnerable save.

- He automatically repairs 3 wounds on any vehicles once per turn

- A stratagem allows you to perform the repair action twice; another psychic power allows you to heal up to D3 wounds on any vehicles, meaning you can heal up to a maximum of 9 wounds on a vehicle of your choice.

-There is a way to turn a dreadnought into a character

The implications of some of these are pretty significant. Vehicles will be extremely durable, Dreadnoughts will be very effective as they can be made into characters (imagine this on a ranged Venerable Dread)

Or on an Ironclad that can now walk to melee range in relative safety.

Guys, I have news from the he guy who told me the right profil and price for the repulsor executioner: apparently the Black Templars would be in the first Psychic Awakening book and will be pretty strong. In addition, Imperial Fists rule would be +1D for heavy weapons against vehicles and buildings while in devastators doctrine.

godardc wrote:Guys, I have news from the he guy who told me the right profil and price for the repulsor executioner: apparently the Black Templars would be in the first Psychic Awakening book and will be pretty strong. In addition, Imperial Fists rule would be +1D for heavy weapons against vehicles and buildings while in devastators doctrine.

thats good but unless fists have some fantastic relics (and their relics have sucked since they got IF relics) and strats I'll proably prefer the ultramarines, but it'll be good for Imp Fists. I bet hellblasters with the heavy plasma option would be REAALLY popular after that

Ultimately the power of an Inquisitor extends as far as he can make it extend

godardc wrote:Guys, I have news from the he guy who told me the right profil and price for the repulsor executioner: apparently the Black Templars would be in the first Psychic Awakening book and will be pretty strong. In addition, Imperial Fists rule would be +1D for heavy weapons against vehicles and buildings while in devastators doctrine.

godardc wrote:Guys, I have news from the he guy who told me the right profil and price for the repulsor executioner: apparently the Black Templars would be in the first Psychic Awakening book and will be pretty strong. In addition, Imperial Fists rule would be +1D for heavy weapons against vehicles and buildings while in devastators doctrine.

thats good but unless fists have some fantastic relics (and their relics have sucked since they got IF relics) and strats I'll proably prefer the ultramarines, but it'll be good for Imp Fists. I bet hellblasters with the heavy plasma option would be REAALLY popular after that

Good that has the potential to be downright broken if you build your list to abuse that buff.

My understanding of the playtesting roumer mill in terms of maximum OP to least.

Iron Hands
Imperial Fists
Ultramarines
Salamanders
Whitescars
Ravenguard?(Ithink they were just not being talked about but it's not a good sign for their power IMHO)

With latest roumers being it's now
Imperial Fists
Iron Hands

Ultramarines
Salamanders

Whitescars

And Ravenguard as sort of an unknown but again if no-one is talking about them its not a good sign for them being the meta way to play.

Ishagu wrote:None of this is verified BTW, it's second hand info from B&C forum but I personally believe it all. The FLG guys have said that the Iron Hands supplement is one of the strongest.

- The Iron Father gives units within 6 inches of him a 5+ invulnerable save.

- He automatically repairs 3 wounds on any vehicles once per turn

- A stratagem allows you to perform the repair action twice; another psychic power allows you to heal up to D3 wounds on any vehicles, meaning you can heal up to a maximum of 9 wounds on a vehicle of your choice.

-There is a way to turn a dreadnought into a character

The implications of some of these are pretty significant. Vehicles will be extremely durable, Dreadnoughts will be very effective as they can be made into characters (imagine this on a ranged Venerable Dread)

ASSUMING these are legit my thoughts:

A 6 inch aura of 5+ invuln for primaris is extremely good. A nice bubble like that will go a long way in protecting valuable aggressors, hellblasters and vehicles.

Auto repair 3 wounds and stratagems to repair twice pairs very well with vehicles and adds even further on top of the idea that you HAVE to 100% kill an Iron Hand vehicle to take it out of action. Not only is it going to double it's wound for the chart, effectively have 20% more wounds, it will also have a homeboy ready to crank out 6 wounds back onto it nice and shiny. A psychic power to repair could also be interesting, but depending on what the other powers are I'm not so sold.

A dreadnought character would be interesting, but I'm not convinced it will actually be all that great. Iron hands will likely be running vehicle heavy so it's not like you shut down anti vehicle fire by making one dreadnought a character. It's also only really going to matter on classic dreads due to targeting purposes which the best of (venerable) already ignores wounds on a 6 (wasting part of the tactic), and doesn't have a degrade table (wasting another part of the tactic). Now if we apply it to the Leviathan (which it really should not be able to be done on) then ok yeah now we are talking cash money. Now if we look further into FW options then yeah I can see the use of say a 1cp strat to buy an insurance policy for a valuable quad las dread or something, but that's about it. It's going to be stupid good if it works on leviathans and cool, but not amazing on other stuff. Furthermore even if you give it to a redemptor or something to give it a warlord trait or relic it's just a big "Shoot me in the face first" sign.

Ishagu wrote:None of this is verified BTW, it's second hand info from B&C forum but I personally believe it all. The FLG guys have said that the Iron Hands supplement is one of the strongest.

- The Iron Father gives units within 6 inches of him a 5+ invulnerable save.

- He automatically repairs 3 wounds on any vehicles once per turn

- A stratagem allows you to perform the repair action twice; another psychic power allows you to heal up to D3 wounds on any vehicles, meaning you can heal up to a maximum of 9 wounds on a vehicle of your choice.

-There is a way to turn a dreadnought into a character

The implications of some of these are pretty significant. Vehicles will be extremely durable, Dreadnoughts will be very effective as they can be made into characters (imagine this on a ranged Venerable Dread)

ASSUMING these are legit my thoughts:

A 6 inch aura of 5+ invuln for primaris is extremely good. A nice bubble like that will go a long way in protecting valuable aggressors, hellblasters and vehicles.

Auto repair 3 wounds and stratagems to repair twice pairs very well with vehicles and adds even further on top of the idea that you HAVE to 100% kill an Iron Hand vehicle to take it out of action. Not only is it going to double it's wound for the chart, effectively have 20% more wounds, it will also have a homeboy ready to crank out 6 wounds back onto it nice and shiny. A psychic power to repair could also be interesting, but depending on what the other powers are I'm not so sold.

A dreadnought character would be interesting, but I'm not convinced it will actually be all that great. Iron hands will likely be running vehicle heavy so it's not like you shut down anti vehicle fire by making one dreadnought a character. It's also only really going to matter on classic dreads due to targeting purposes which the best of (venerable) already ignores wounds on a 6 (wasting part of the tactic), and doesn't have a degrade table (wasting another part of the tactic). Now if we apply it to the Leviathan (which it really should not be able to be done on) then ok yeah now we are talking cash money. Now if we look further into FW options then yeah I can see the use of say a 1cp strat to buy an insurance policy for a valuable quad las dread or something, but that's about it. It's going to be stupid good if it works on leviathans and cool, but not amazing on other stuff. Furthermore even if you give it to a redemptor or something to give it a warlord trait or relic it's just a big "Shoot me in the face first" sign.

Leviathan have 10 or more wounds and are therefore targetable even if they gain the character keyword. All it does is allow them to become your warlord, and gain a warlord trait. They should be smart enough to disallow relics, as they've already managed that for existing character dreadnoughts

godardc wrote:Guys, I have news from the he guy who told me the right profil and price for the repulsor executioner: apparently the Black Templars would be in the first Psychic Awakening book and will be pretty strong. In addition, Imperial Fists rule would be +1D for heavy weapons against vehicles and buildings while in devastators doctrine.

thats good but unless fists have some fantastic relics (and their relics have sucked since they got IF relics) and strats I'll proably prefer the ultramarines, but it'll be good for Imp Fists. I bet hellblasters with the heavy plasma option would be REAALLY popular after that

Good that has the potential to be downright broken if you build your list to abuse that buff.

.

yeah the annoying thing is it's yetr another rule that will cement the dominant of multishot heavy weapons while leaving single shot hig damage in the dust.

Ultimately the power of an Inquisitor extends as far as he can make it extend

Marines have a problem with lots of single-shot high-damage weapons and lots of multi-shot low-damage weapons and not much in the middle. Suppressor Cannons, Centurion Missile Launchers, and Vindicator Cannons are about it. D+1 on heavies takes them to an embarrasment of riches there. Dakka mode Redemptors particularly.

Being able to just make a Dreadnaught (or two, depending on the strat) immune to most counter-AT fire is frankly a little silly.

Marines have a problem with lots of single-shot high-damage weapons and lots of multi-shot low-damage weapons and not much in the middle. Suppressor Cannons, Centurion Missile Launchers, and Vindicator Cannons are about it. D+1 on heavies takes them to an embarrasment of riches there. Dakka mode Redemptors particularly.

Being able to just make a Dreadnaught (or two, depending on the strat) immune to most counter-AT fire is frankly a little silly.

...all the Sniper rifles are Heavy. That's slightly bonkers too.

you'd be looking at Marine captains able to put out 4 damage shots. it is a little nuts yeah.

Ultimately the power of an Inquisitor extends as far as he can make it extend

nekooni wrote:Leviathan have 10 or more wounds and are therefore targetable even if they gain the character keyword. All it does is allow them to become your warlord, and gain a warlord trait. They should be smart enough to disallow relics, as they've already managed that for existing character dreadnoughts

ahhh yes thank you for the correction. I somehow completely blew right past that.

Aaranis wrote:I'm glad to see that after the Repulsor Executioner being better than a Neutron Onager, it's their Techmarines being better at repairing than actual Techpriests.

What's the point in playing anything other than Marines now ? They have all codices combined at this point.

I don't fault anyone their good stuff, but yeah, this. I read that and had to shake my head. I mean it makes sense, they are marines why wouldn't they be better techs than the ad mech. I mean it isn't like they learned their craft on Mars or anything...right ?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/08 01:49:00

Aaranis wrote:I'm glad to see that after the Repulsor Executioner being better than a Neutron Onager, it's their Techmarines being better at repairing than actual Techpriests.

What's the point in playing anything other than Marines now ? They have all codices combined at this point.

I don't fault anyone their good stuff, but yeah, this. I read that and had to shake my head. I mean it makes sense, they are marines why wouldn't they be better techs than the ad mech. I mean it isn't like they learned their craft on Mars or anything...right ?

isn't the Onager a lot SMALLER?

Ultimately the power of an Inquisitor extends as far as he can make it extend

Aaranis wrote:I'm glad to see that after the Repulsor Executioner being better than a Neutron Onager, it's their Techmarines being better at repairing than actual Techpriests.

What's the point in playing anything other than Marines now ? They have all codices combined at this point.

I don't fault anyone their good stuff, but yeah, this. I read that and had to shake my head. I mean it makes sense, they are marines why wouldn't they be better techs than the ad mech. I mean it isn't like they learned their craft on Mars or anything...right ?

They had a similar bonus in 6th-7th but you didn't complain.

CaptainStabby wrote:If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

jy2 wrote:BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

vipoid wrote:Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

MarsNZ wrote:ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.

Aaranis wrote:I'm glad to see that after the Repulsor Executioner being better than a Neutron Onager, it's their Techmarines being better at repairing than actual Techpriests.

What's the point in playing anything other than Marines now ? They have all codices combined at this point.

I don't fault anyone their good stuff, but yeah, this. I read that and had to shake my head. I mean it makes sense, they are marines why wouldn't they be better techs than the ad mech. I mean it isn't like they learned their craft on Mars or anything...right ?

isn't the Onager a lot SMALLER?

I'm not talking about the executioner, and if i was going to be mad about that I'd be mad it's like a leman russ shooting a neutron laster with longer range. I'm talking about the super heals, at the least I'd believe the ad mech should be better fixing machines than a tech marine, at the worst they would be on par, not worse than one.

Aaranis wrote:I'm glad to see that after the Repulsor Executioner being better than a Neutron Onager, it's their Techmarines being better at repairing than actual Techpriests.

What's the point in playing anything other than Marines now ? They have all codices combined at this point.

I don't fault anyone their good stuff, but yeah, this. I read that and had to shake my head. I mean it makes sense, they are marines why wouldn't they be better techs than the ad mech. I mean it isn't like they learned their craft on Mars or anything...right ?

They had a similar bonus in 6th-7th but you didn't complain.

I was unaware they had this exact same codex, with all of these abilities at the exact same time the ad mech 8th codex was out back in 6th- 7th. Could it be I'm actually comparing the game state to now when both of them had very different books back then ?

Could it be perhaps I was playing Skittari at the time, which had 0 tech priests in it as even an option so why would I care of an ability someone else had I had 0 access to as the Skittari and the Cult mechanicus was split between two different books ? No, couldn't be that, it has to be me taking exception now in some weird way to be upset currently and not then, just so you could comment on it.

Over looking that, looking at the now, it's a little silly they are better techs than the tech faction. I'd assume a techmarine will be more robust in CC, not better in the fixing department. I'd even give the iron hands more robust vehicles as it seems like the ad mech like flimsy vehicles based on the ones they bring around.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/09/08 03:11:54

Aaranis wrote:I'm glad to see that after the Repulsor Executioner being better than a Neutron Onager, it's their Techmarines being better at repairing than actual Techpriests.

What's the point in playing anything other than Marines now ? They have all codices combined at this point.

Price per model. The new rules are really good, but Marines still wind up outnumbered by a lot against the average army and they're still really fragile per point. They feel like they have the 'hammer' part of 'glass hammer' now, but the 'glass' part is still there too.

Aaranis wrote:I'm glad to see that after the Repulsor Executioner being better than a Neutron Onager, it's their Techmarines being better at repairing than actual Techpriests.

What's the point in playing anything other than Marines now ? They have all codices combined at this point.

I don't fault anyone their good stuff, but yeah, this. I read that and had to shake my head. I mean it makes sense, they are marines why wouldn't they be better techs than the ad mech. I mean it isn't like they learned their craft on Mars or anything...right ?

isn't the Onager a lot SMALLER?

I'm not talking about the executioner, and if i was going to be mad about that I'd be mad it's like a leman russ shooting a neutron laster with longer range. I'm talking about the super heals, at the least I'd believe the ad mech should be better fixing machines than a tech marine, at the worst they would be on par, not worse than one.

Aaranis wrote:I'm glad to see that after the Repulsor Executioner being better than a Neutron Onager, it's their Techmarines being better at repairing than actual Techpriests.

What's the point in playing anything other than Marines now ? They have all codices combined at this point.

I don't fault anyone their good stuff, but yeah, this. I read that and had to shake my head. I mean it makes sense, they are marines why wouldn't they be better techs than the ad mech. I mean it isn't like they learned their craft on Mars or anything...right ?

They had a similar bonus in 6th-7th but you didn't complain.

I was unaware they had this exact same codex, with all of these abilities at the exact same time the ad mech 8th codex was out back in 6th- 7th. Could it be I'm actually comparing the game state to now when both of them had very different books back then ?

Could it be perhaps I was playing Skittari at the time, which had 0 tech priests in it as even an option so why would I care of an ability someone else had I had 0 access to as the Skittari and the Cult mechanicus was split between two different books ? No, couldn't be that, it has to be me taking exception now in some weird way to be upset currently and not then, just so you could comment on it.

Over looking that, looking at the now, it's a little silly they are better techs than the tech faction. I'd assume a techmarine will be more robust in CC, not better in the fixing department. I'd even give the iron hands more robust vehicles as it seems like the ad mech like flimsy vehicles based on the ones they bring around.

I don't care. I played Skitarii too.

Did you bother to think of the repairs per price of model? Seems to make sense the Master of the Forge would do an okay job for the price?

CaptainStabby wrote:If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

jy2 wrote:BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

vipoid wrote:Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

MarsNZ wrote:ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.