There are two teleportations btw--one, Master Chief to High Charity (the throne room, where you fight a few groups of grunts & brutes), and two, the Arbiter to a trail near the Control Room.

Ah, awesome! I figured there was probably at least one that I had just forgotten. Even knowing exactly where they were, I still can't really remember them. Oh well. I'll be replaying the game as soon as I finish the first one again.

smallfry wrote:

Your first point is the best I've heard. Good simple one.

Thanks!

-Disciple

Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:34 pm

failedparachute

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Joined: Wed Jun 20, 2007 4:59 pmPosts: 67Location: CT for the moment, when H3 comes out I'll be in VT

Re: Gravemind - Once Malevolent, Now Stirring?

Beginning of Gravemind and beginning of Uprising, if I remember right.

Also, for your benefit, a good deal of this has been discussed in this thread on/around page 5, I'd hate for us to be repeating ourselves, because somebody missed a post (I'm sure I'm guilty of doing tha before).

Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:39 pm

Drawingman818

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Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2007 9:48 pmPosts: 10

Re: Gravemind - Once Malevolent, Now Stirring?

Air Sparrow Hawk wrote:

failedparachute wrote:

Air Sparrow Hawk wrote:

Yes he was part of the tentacles, if he was part of gravemind then I think it is quite possible that he was an Infection form host.

I don't deny that Regret wasn't infected by the Flood, I just ask one question: how? Like I previously stated, any infection prior to his encounter with Master Chief would've been visible and he was supposed to be dead (or at least plasma fodder) after the encounter so how did he get infected? I keep find the idea that the Flood "raise the dead" circulating when that is not what actually happens, but rather they join with the host while it's still alive. I believe part of the problem is it's a discrepancy that, to my knowledge, Bungie hasn't addressed. I wish I had more time to discuss, but I gotta get back to work.

Well we already know that a Flood can only/will only (clarrification needed) infect living creatures due to the fact that when a squad of Marines was attacked by the flood, one of them escaped by playing dead.

However, we do not know for certain if this is the case with the Gravemind as he is a sort of 'super flood' it seems, and is far more intelligent than the others. Could he have some sort of medical power? I do not know. What is to say the Chief actually killed Regret? What if the Chief just knocked him unconcious then escaped only to have Regret become concious again and a flood infection form to have taken over him? I know it sounds far-fetched but it does seem like a possibility to me.

Another possibility is that Gravemind doesn't just infect the host, he fuses with it. So it's a possibility that after fusing with regret's body he was able to connect to Regret's brain and control him like that, he was then assimilated and absorbed fully into Gravemind.

Ideas? Contributions? Objections?

Don't go too Phoenix Wright on me though.

Actually, I think flood forms CAN infect dead bodies.Three things:1) If the flood needed to keep their victims alive to infect them, why is there a combat form? Why start killing things when it prevents you from infecting them? 2) Infection forms can bring dead combat forms back to life.3) Play the level "The Oracle" in Halo 2. In the beginning of the level there is a big elevator that you take down to a laboratory. There's a hallway full of dead bodies, and if you still have an ally left, it says something like:"We should have brought weapons to burn these bodies, Arbiter. Every one is a potential host for the flood."

Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:08 pm

failedparachute

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Re: Gravemind - Once Malevolent, Now Stirring?

Drawingman818 wrote:

Actually, I think flood forms CAN infect dead bodies.Three things:1) If the flood needed to keep their victims alive to infect them, why is there a combat form? Why start killing things when it prevents you from infecting them? 2) Infection forms can bring dead combat forms back to life.3) Play the level "The Oracle" in Halo 2. In the beginning of the level there is a big elevator that you take down to a laboratory. There's a hallway full of dead bodies, and if you still have an ally left, it says something like:"We should have brought weapons to burn these bodies, Arbiter. Every one is a potential host for the flood."

All valid counterpoints. Now if you allow me to riposte.

1) The combat form can be seen as a means to procure more lifeforms by subduing them. Note that Combat forms like to get in close, and melee the target, thereby rendering it unconscious and prime for the assimilation. Also, the Combat forms can provide a distraction, while the Infection forms attack from weird angles.2) They can only bring recently dead Combat forms back. And if the body has been mutilated (more than what the Flood did to it) then the Infection form is of little use.3) Again I believe it to be applicable to only recently deceased bodies, though the Flood may yet have use for the bodies, if they are too far gone to reanimate, possibly as incubators or as nutrition. EDIT: Perhaps the Covenant knows more than we do, after all, they've had run ins with the parasite before now. EDIT #2: The quote used is "Vessels for the Flood" which seems to support my claim as a possible use as incubabtors of Infection forms, or perhaps they are used as part of the atmosphere altering process.

Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:57 pm

Drawingman818

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Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2007 9:48 pmPosts: 10

Re: Gravemind - Once Malevolent, Now Stirring?

failedparachute wrote:

All valid counterpoints. Now if you allow me to riposte.

1) The combat form can be seen as a means to procure more lifeforms by subduing them. Note that Combat forms like to get in close, and melee the target, thereby rendering it unconscious and prime for the assimilation. Also, the Combat forms can provide a distraction, while the Infection forms attack from weird angles.2) They can only bring recently dead Combat forms back. And if the body has been mutilated (more than what the Flood did to it) then the Infection form is of little use.3) Again I believe it to be applicable to only recently deceased bodies, though the Flood may yet have use for the bodies, if they are too far gone to reanimate, possibly as incubators or as nutrition. EDIT: Perhaps the Covenant knows more than we do, after all, they've had run ins with the parasite before now. EDIT #2: The quote used is "Vessels for the Flood" which seems to support my claim as a possible use as incubabtors of Infection forms, or perhaps they are used as part of the atmosphere altering process.

Well, a recently dead body IS still a dead body, so that's a compromise I guess. And what is this atmosphere altering process of which you speak? It's been a while since I read the books and I don't have Ghosts of Onyx, maybe I missed something.

Sat Jul 07, 2007 11:00 am

endejas

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Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 1:05 amPosts: 138

Re: Gravemind - Once Malevolent, Now Stirring?

Atmosphere altering is in Halo. 343 says something along the lines of, "You're a very good planner. Your combat suit will serve you well when the Flood begin to alter the atmosphere."

As for the bringing back the dead, I've always believed that to be one of the Flood's powers. I mean, why not? The Flood only need a neural connection to infect a host. Your heart may have stopped pumping, but I think if your spinal cord is still in tact, then you're a potential Flood host.

There's allusions to this all over Halo. In Two Betrayals, when you find the dead bodies with Infection forms all over them. In Keyes when Cortana tells you that the Flood are gathering bodies. In Halo 2, when Half-Jaw tells the Arbiter that each one of the dead bodies is a potential Flood host.

Sat Jul 07, 2007 9:40 pm

failedparachute

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Joined: Wed Jun 20, 2007 4:59 pmPosts: 67Location: CT for the moment, when H3 comes out I'll be in VT

Re: Gravemind - Once Malevolent, Now Stirring?

The changing of the atmosphere is also present in Halo 2. Specifically, on the second Master Chief level on High Charity. The atmosphere becomes thick and cloudy (probably full of Flood spores).

As for the "reviving the dead" I still think that the Flood would only be able to use recently deceased hosts. I think some of those situations, we think the hosts are dead/comatose because that's the only way the game engine can portray the process of being converted into a Flood. And the quote you are referring to isn't Half-Jaw, but a surviving Elite, should one make it down the shaft with you, I just played that section last night.

Sat Jul 07, 2007 9:54 pm

Orpheus

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Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 5:21 amPosts: 39

Re: Gravemind - Once Malevolent, Now Stirring?

I agree with the idea that the flood can only take over recently deceased hosts. Because after a certain amount of time your brain cells die of oxygen deprivation-and once brain cells are dead, they're dead, and after a certain limit you can lose mobility functions, memories (you know how important those are to a flood if you've read Halo: The Flood) and besides all combat forms i've encountered in Halo 1 and 2 are perfectly fine with their mobility functions

but maybe a flood releases proteins/chemicals that make brain cells grow again in their victims, but they'd have to re-learn all their mobility control, which takes a while(lol imagine flood infection forms crawling on the floor, they'd be easier to kill than the ones I see)

Sat Jul 07, 2007 10:04 pm

gone2gofish

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Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2007 6:42 pmPosts: 2

Re: Gravemind - Once Malevolent, Now Stirring?

failedparachute wrote:

The changing of the atmosphere is also present in Halo 2. Specifically, on the second Master Chief level on High Charity. The atmosphere becomes thick and cloudy (probably full of Flood spores).

As for the "reviving the dead" I still think that the Flood would only be able to use recently deceased hosts. I think some of those situations, we think the hosts are dead/comatose because that's the only way the game engine can portray the process of being converted into a Flood. And the quote you are referring to isn't Half-Jaw, but a surviving Elite, should one make it down the shaft with you, I just played that section last night.

In the level where the arbiter opens up the shield wall, you drop down into entire floors where the air is thick with spores. It's fairly obvious that the flood modify the atmosphere to ensure 100% infection of all possible targets most likely, or even maybe, to kill all possible enemies through suffocation. (It seems that the flood don't need to breath) Then again, we don't know enough about flood metabolism to know how and if they need oxygen.

The flood obviously need intact bodies. They need little else out of it. Live or dead.

Personally, I find it interesting that the graveminds "head" looks awfully similar to an elites, especially if you look at the picture on wikipedia for the gravemind, and even has a semi-similar mouth setup. Maybe, the covenant and humans all fought against the flood long ago, and then the halo's firing hit the proverbial reset. Ok, that doesn't make much sense, but I figured i'd throw it out.

Sun Jul 22, 2007 6:56 pm

System Failure

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Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:09 pmPosts: 106

Re: Gravemind - Once Malevolent, Now Stirring?

Flood are capable to reanimate the dead. I've been be down by one to many combat forms the had be reawakened by an infection form. Also correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it explained in Halo: The Flood, that in the beginning the flood being severely weakened (lack of food) could only take over live hosts, but as time progressed, a body was a body also. Halo: The flood spoilers

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