Posted - 2012.04.17 01:21:00 -
[4651] - Quote
We are all here to fly spaceships and blow stuff up, NPC's, other players, space rocks.. .why on earth would I want to walk around in a station I will probably never load anyway. If you bored of flying space ships.. can I haz your stuff... then go take your dollies out the cupboard and have tea parties

We are all here to fly spaceships and blow stuff up, NPC's, other players, space rocks.. .why on earth would I want to walk around in a station I will probably never load anyway. If you bored of flying space ships.. can I haz your stuff... then go take your dollies out the cupboard and have tea parties

^^ that is the reason why WiS needs to be a separate game, like Dust 514, but using the WoD team, linked to EVE for capsuleers that want to use it and focussing on avatar based gameplay.

There are a number of players like you and forcing something on them that is against what EVE has had as content for the last decade is wrong. That's why it really should be a separate, yet linked game so WiS can stand on its own with its own funding, gameplay, etc.

(a) Not all the players post on the forums. Yes or No?(b) Can you tell me how many post on the forums out of the total population?(c) Can you claim a majority, based off a forum thread, from that?

The answer to all three is no. Not all the players post on the forums. You can't tell there is a majority, thus claiming a majority from a forum thread is patently false. Spin whichever way you want; but you do a disservice to WiS by keeping on with those types of lies.

I am asking you politely, stop lying about WiS. You are harming a product a number of us want for EVE Online.

The only one doing a disservice to WiS and this thread is you. Posting unfounded accusations about me saying I'm posting lies about WiS with the intention to harm it is simply you trying to redirect attention, all the while continuing this flame war, derailing this thread with more personal attacks on me - twisting and portraying everything out of context.

A) CCP has stated in various threads they view the forums as a source of information.B) The forum community represents a percentage of the eve online player base.C) Based on the overall attitude of the majority of players posting in a specific thread title, the general attitude of the player base can be ascertained.

Pertaining to the issue - I posted and linked 2 different threads showing the majority of players posting in those threads were in support of WiS Ambulation. As such it was a good indication of the overall general viewpoint of the player base at that time. Notice I said WiS Ambulation, not WiS Incarna.

Everyone who follows this thread knows that I am an avid advocator for the implementation of WiS as a integral part of this game, Eve Online; not some byproduct to be released as another game that only relates to Eve, as you have expressed.

Now I'm telling you to stop spreading lies about me, my intentions or my viewpoints pertaining to WiS. This new redirection ploy of yours with misinformation and false accusations won't work and needs to stop now. Continuing to post such blatant falsehoods will only force escalation.

I would LOVE to see something that takes you into the various colonies on planets and particularly the major city environments (which I imagine would be quite different from one race to another), where they could build on some of the stories you might find in the Chronicles.

Some futuristic, Blade Runner type (as one example) story driven game play, something with a lot of depth and character development, would be great.

Was the above quoted post I made deleted!

It appears to have been, and I'm probably violating the forum rules for reposting it, BUT I very much would like to know what exactly was wrong with it, that it got deleted, so I can be sure not to do it again. So.... someone please let me know before this post gets deleted. Sorry I'm a newb here, maybe mentioning Blade Runner starts flame wars or something.

(P.S. The original post included a quote from Ai Shun, that also didn't seem out of place under most forum rules I'm familiar with, but is also gone).

I think the initials are D theres a C in there and a M

up to you to put em rightGoons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.

Posted - 2012.04.17 02:10:00 -
[4655] - Quote
DMC, you persist in taking this thread off-line. Please take it to EVE Mail. You do not attack only me, but other posters in this thread that do not match your viewpoint. You continuously take it off-topic. Please stop doing that! WiS is an important issue for me and many others.

Edit: Either way, I will block your misinformation and personal attacks. No need to read that garbage.

C) Based on the overall attitude of the majority of players posting in a specific thread title, the general attitude of the [people posting in this thread] can be ascertained.

fixed that

also, the people on the forums is a small % of the ppl in the game yes?the ppl in this thread are only a % of the ppl that even post on the forums yes? Or are you trying to tell us EVERYONE that posts on the forums is currently posting in this thread?Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.

Now I'm telling you to stop spreading lies about me, my intentions or my viewpoints pertaining to WiS. This new redirection ploy of yours with misinformation and false accusations won't work and needs to stop now. Continuing to post such blatant falsehoods will only force escalation.

Look out people! Cartman is about to "force escalation"!

Do we need to link-up the thread where you melted down and started hurling insults when you got called out for making a sweeping generalization and were simply asked (politely) to back it up with factual evidence?The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'no.'

C) Based on the overall attitude of the majority of players posting in a specific thread title, the general attitude of the [people posting in this thread] can be ascertained.

fixed that

also, the people on the forums is a small % of the ppl in the game yes?the ppl in this thread are only a % of the ppl that even post on the forums yes? Or are you trying to tell us EVERYONE that posts on the forums is currently posting in this thread?

Statistically you can use a sample from a population. But when the sample is self-selecting, not just once but twice over, you are basically dealing with a polluted base set of data. You've lost the element of probability when the sample has an inherent bias.

It would be the equivalent of surveying at the NRA annual conference about gun-control and saying: "Well, the majority of people are in favour of carrying multiple guns! We checked these numbers and they definitely support it!"

It is a ludicrous example, but that is why any self-selecting, biased sample across a forum population should be treated with caution and why one should not make claims like has been made before.

Now I'm telling you to stop spreading lies about me, my intentions or my viewpoints pertaining to WiS. This new redirection ploy of yours with misinformation and false accusations won't work and needs to stop now. Continuing to post such blatant falsehoods will only force escalation.

Look out people! Cartman is about to "force escalation"!

Do we need to link-up the thread where you melted down and started hurling insults when you got called out for making a sweeping generalization and were simply asked (politely) to back it up with factual evidence?

yes please!!

DO WANTGoons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.

Now I'm telling you to stop spreading lies about me, my intentions or my viewpoints pertaining to WiS. This new redirection ploy of yours with misinformation and false accusations won't work and needs to stop now. Continuing to post such blatant falsehoods will only force escalation.

Look out people! Cartman is about to "force escalation"!

Do we need to link-up the thread where you melted down and started hurling insults when you got called out for making a sweeping generalization and were simply asked (politely) to back it up with factual evidence?

I, too, would like to see this. Who wants to take a bet on who the sweeping generalization was about?

Do you have a source for this? I've seen you claim this; I've seen other people claim the opposite. Thus far I've not seen a single iota of proof for these assertions. Now I recall from an earlier thread you were lambasting people for claiming the opposite. I sincerely hope you can back up your claims.

Obviously you and others like you are so blinded by ignorance that you can't even accept the actual truth when it's presented. Feel free to look over the events and multiple forum threads during the summer of 2011, then STFU.

http://eve-search.com/thread/76478-1/page/3#62Heh, don't know what country the two of you live in but according to the 'Free' world country's, a person is innocent until proven guilty. In other words, the burden of proof falls on you to prove I am making false statements.

Anyway, you definitely excel at posting a bunch of 'Nada' while beating your chests and stomping your feet.. so no more soup for you. Hope you choke on it since the two of you are incapable of doing a little bit of research.

This, folks is why I will always read DMC's posts in Cartman's voice. There's more of the same if you go read this very thread over on EVE Search, there's a good reason so many DMC posts have been removed from this thread.

I am guessing "forced escalation" means he's going to report these posts to CCP (mommy) just like he does whenever other players don't agree with him or point out when he makes stuff up (lies) to suit his position. Can't wait to see how he spins this again, it's always entertaining.

The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'no.'

Do you have a source for this? I've seen you claim this; I've seen other people claim the opposite. Thus far I've not seen a single iota of proof for these assertions. Now I recall from an earlier thread you were lambasting people for claiming the opposite. I sincerely hope you can back up your claims.

Obviously you and others like you are so blinded by ignorance that you can't even accept the actual truth when it's presented. Feel free to look over the events and multiple forum threads during the summer of 2011, then STFU.

http://eve-search.com/thread/76478-1/page/3#62Heh, don't know what country the two of you live in but according to the 'Free' world country's, a person is innocent until proven guilty. In other words, the burden of proof falls on you to prove I am making false statements.

Anyway, you definitely excel at posting a bunch of 'Nada' while beating your chests and stomping your feet.. so no more soup for you. Hope you choke on it since the two of you are incapable of doing a little bit of research.

This, folks is why I will always read DMC's posts in Cartman's voice. There's more of the same if you go read this very thread over on EVE Search, there's a good reason so many DMC posts have been removed from this thread.

I am guessing "forced escalation" means he's going to report these posts to CCP (mommy) just like he does whenever other players don't agree with him or point out when he makes stuff up (lies) to suit his position. Can't wait to see how he spins this again, it's always entertaining.

I've noticed that DMC does make lots of sweeping generalizations. And he does seem to get all huffy when people call him out on them. But then, that is hardly anything new on the EVE Online Forums.

Posted - 2012.04.17 03:45:00 -
[4663] - Quote
Ahh, looks like the Trolls are out in force trying to prove what exactly? That all their hard work at derailing this thread and trying to get it locked will soon be destroyed.

Thank you Doc (Pee Wee) Fury for linking that thread. Now players can view the whole thread instead of just the selective quotes you have posted. Whenever I view any of your posted replies, I see someone who is suffering from a Pee Wee Herman mentality.

Oh, by the way, you're still a troll which is all that thread you linked proves. I provided proof which backed up my statement and you still can't link anything to disprove that statement.

I did a GIS for "Pee Wee Herman mentality" but didn't get any hits. I guess that condition must only exist in your mind.

DeMichael Cartman wrote:

Oh, by the way, you're still a troll which is all that thread you linked proves. I provided proof which backed up my statement and you still can't link anything to disprove that statement.

If it is trolling to ask you to prove what you declare is factual while you chide others for "posting incorrect statements without checking the facts", then I am guilty as charged. The "proof" you provided is a thread from 2006 where maybe 100-200 unique players voiced opinions one way or another about ambulation, it does not contain any relevant statistical information or corroboration by CCP that a "majority of players want WIS". FYI, the forums represent probably less than 10% of the total number of players and that is being generous, so using the forums to gauge the desires of EVE's entire player-base is entirely disingenuous .

If you can produce tangible and verifiable evidence to back up your assertions, I and others would still like to see it instead of your tiresome "no you" retorts. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'no.'

Let's discuss the NEX issue. Team Avatar has not mentioned anything about nex, I would like to have a few words from the devs on whether access to future wis features would require nex payment. Wis could be useful as an avenue of inflation control. Lets say a corp room requires a monthly starbase charter priced 7000 aurems, that would be two plexes, then that's about 1 billion removed from the economy; while plexes purchased explicitly for wis features would never enter circulation.

Let's discuss the NEX issue. Team Avatar has not mentioned anything about nex, I would like to have a few words from the devs on whether access to future wis features would require nex payment. Wis could be useful as an avenue of inflation control. Lets say a corp room requires a monthly starbase charter priced 7000 aurems, that would be two plexes, then that's about 1 billion removed from the economy; while plexes purchased explicitly for wis features would never enter circulation.

It's probably worth mentioning that there is nothing in the NeX store that you can't buy with ISK.I can post on a forum, therefore I represent everyone.

If it is trolling to ask you to prove what you declare is factual while you chide others for "posting incorrect statements without checking the facts", then I am guilty as charged. The "proof" you provided is a thread from 2006 where maybe 100-200 unique players voiced opinions one way or another about ambulation, it does not contain any relevant statistical information or corroboration by CCP that a "majority of players want WIS".

Oh still twisting things around to justify your actions.

Two different threads were linked, one from 2006 and another from 2011 posted just before the Incarna expansion. If you had bothered to read those threads instead of spouting more crap you'd see the overwhelming majority of players posting in those threads are in support of WiS Ambulation. This thread also corroborates the opinions voiced in those threads. Players wanted WiS Ambulation, not WiS Incarna. I never once said it was a statement from CCP but please keep posting more of your troll lies.

Doc (PeeWee) Fury wrote:

FYI, the forums represent probably less than 10% of the total number of players and that is being generous, so using the forums to gauge or make claims about the desires of EVE's entire player-base is entirely disingenuous .If you can produce tangible and verifiable evidence to back up your assertions, I and others would still like to see it instead of your tiresome "no you" retorts.

Personally I don't care what the percentage amount is, it's a sample size that gives an estimation for a larger amount. Anyway, please file a petition to CCP explaining how using the forums to gauge or make claims about the desires of EVE's entire player-base is entirely disingenuous. While you're at it, be sure to include the CSM and FanFest opinions as well.

Sigurd Sig Hansen wrote:

Ai Shun wrote:

Guys, more focus on WiS - less on DMC please

But he's more fun to talk about

OMG, how sad and hopelessly desperate, creating a new alt is definitely fail, especially attempting to give credence to the troll attacks.

Posted - 2012.04.17 07:28:00 -
[4672] - Quote
Wow. I never realized there was so much consternation over WiS.

*sigh* Well... I do hope that CCP continues with plans to put it in.

Maybe it could be an entirely separate game, but I would primarily like that if it was completely linked with EVE, and could be accessed seamlessly as if you're in the same game, including the chat channels, market, Corporations, etc...

Though I suspect that perhaps my vision of what WiS could be surpasses what is feasible.

Personally I don't care what the percentage amount is, it's a sample size that gives an estimation for a larger amount.

Opinions and extrapolating a sample to a population are different things. Please read up on a biased sample and how self-selection impacts the validity of a sample across a population. Forum responses are not part of a true, random sample. I will try to explain this in a way you would understand.

"Would you be able to survey the NRA in the United States on gun control laws and then apply that as representative of the entire world?"

In the same way, you cannot take a thread that only attracts people who post on the forums and have an interest in the topic as representative of the population of EVE Online. It is fundamentally flawed based off simple logic.

We are all here to fly spaceships and blow stuff up, NPC's, other players, space rocks.. .why on earth would I want to walk around in a station I will probably never load anyway. If you bored of flying space ships.. can I haz your stuff... then go take your dollies out the cupboard and have tea parties

^^ that is the reason why WiS needs to be a separate game, like Dust 514, but using the WoD team, linked to EVE for capsuleers that want to use it and focussing on avatar based gameplay.

There are a number of players like you and forcing something on them that is against what EVE has had as content for the last decade is wrong. That's why it really should be a separate, yet linked game so WiS can stand on its own with its own funding, gameplay, etc.

Let's discuss the NEX issue. Team Avatar has not mentioned anything about nex, I would like to have a few words from the devs on whether access to future wis features would require nex payment. Wis could be useful as an avenue of inflation control. Lets say a corp room requires a monthly starbase charter priced 7000 aurems, that would be two plexes, then that's about 1 billion removed from the economy; while plexes purchased explicitly for wis features would never enter circulation.

It's probably worth mentioning that there is nothing in the NeX store that you can't buy with ISK.

well they can easily exclude nex-purchased starbase charters from the general isk-based market.

Let's discuss the NEX issue. Team Avatar has not mentioned anything about nex, I would like to have a few words from the devs on whether access to future wis features would require nex payment. Wis could be useful as an avenue of inflation control. Lets say a corp room requires a monthly starbase charter priced 7000 aurems, that would be two plexes, then that's about 1 billion removed from the economy; while plexes purchased explicitly for wis features would never enter circulation.

You are trolling right?

the Nex should never be in EVE The only thing the NEXfail could be useful for is maybe as a link between EVE and DUSTpushing that button ,not expecting something.But suddenly the door opens and the next thing i see myself flooting in space,just before i wake up again.thank god for clones

We are all here to fly spaceships and blow stuff up, NPC's, other players, space rocks.. .why on earth would I want to walk around in a station I will probably never load anyway. If you bored of flying space ships.. can I haz your stuff... then go take your dollies out the cupboard and have tea parties

^^ that is the reason why WiS needs to be a separate game, like Dust 514, but using the WoD team, linked to EVE for capsuleers that want to use it and focussing on avatar based gameplay.

There are a number of players like you and forcing something on them that is against what EVE has had as content for the last decade is wrong. That's why it really should be a separate, yet linked game so WiS can stand on its own with its own funding, gameplay, etc.

Switch off CQ. Problem solved.

I have but me being selfish would prefer CCP effort spent on other things rather than "Leisure suite Larry" type game play

We are all here to fly spaceships and blow stuff up, NPC's, other players, space rocks.. .why on earth would I want to walk around in a station I will probably never load anyway. If you bored of flying space ships.. can I haz your stuff... then go take your dollies out the cupboard and have tea parties

^^ that is the reason why WiS needs to be a separate game, like Dust 514, but using the WoD team, linked to EVE for capsuleers that want to use it and focussing on avatar based gameplay.

There are a number of players like you and forcing something on them that is against what EVE has had as content for the last decade is wrong. That's why it really should be a separate, yet linked game so WiS can stand on its own with its own funding, gameplay, etc.

Switch off CQ. Problem solved.

I have but me being selfish would prefer CCP effort spent on other things rather than "Leisure suite Larry" type game play

Valid point indeed, as I also prefer CCP spending my money in other things rather than wardecs, nullsec and other uninteresting crap. So my subs are cancelled until CCP delivers something i feel like paying for it again. Be it EVE or WoD, only time will tell.EVE residents: 5% WH; 8% Lowsec; 15% Nullsec; 72% Highsec.CSM 7: 1 highsec resident out of 14.-a

Let's discuss the NEX issue. Team Avatar has not mentioned anything about nex, I would like to have a few words from the devs on whether access to future wis features would require nex payment. Wis could be useful as an avenue of inflation control. Lets say a corp room requires a monthly starbase charter priced 7000 aurems, that would be two plexes, then that's about 1 billion removed from the economy; while plexes purchased explicitly for wis features would never enter circulation.

I have nothing against the NEX store in principle. When it was first released, i just felt that CCP had priced me out of a new feature buy charging the ammout they did and the whole thing felt like a huge waste anyway, as we had no public avatar areas to show off to other people

If WIS would had been delivered as promised I think both it and the NEX store would have been a success. I could see people willing to trade their plex for AUR so that they could enter the poker tournaments in Jita or gamble for prizes in a Somer blinks style interface in Dodixi... But this is not the case and will not be the case for some time to come, so the NEX store is essentially useless.

We are all here to fly spaceships and blow stuff up, NPC's, other players, space rocks.. .why on earth would I want to walk around in a station I will probably never load anyway. If you bored of flying space ships.. can I haz your stuff... then go take your dollies out the cupboard and have tea parties

^^ that is the reason why WiS needs to be a separate game, like Dust 514, but using the WoD team, linked to EVE for capsuleers that want to use it and focussing on avatar based gameplay.

There are a number of players like you and forcing something on them that is against what EVE has had as content for the last decade is wrong. That's why it really should be a separate, yet linked game so WiS can stand on its own with its own funding, gameplay, etc.

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