In theory you can have the most impact on the game thru jungling or mid-laning. Jungling can become really, really difficult tho if all of your lanes are magicly losing or have no CC to support your ganks. But at least you have control over most objectives. :)

I think that's what most of us forgot here.
Make sure the time investment you'd need in order to learn the role to such an extent as to reliably dominate in it is worth it, whichever lane has the strongest carry potential. After all, no matter how strong of an impact jungle has on early and mid-game I damn sure am not going to make good use of it, for example. >.>

It's all fine to discuss theoretical possibilities, but this thread is still a question and a request for help from an individual. :)

"Defending a position by citing free speech is the ultimate concession: you're saying that literally the most compelling thing you can say for it is that it's not illegal to express."

I think that's what most of us forgot here.
Make sure the time investment you'd need in order to learn the role to such an extent as to reliably dominate in it is worth it, whichever lane has the strongest carry potential. After all, no matter how strong of an impact jungle has on early and mid-game I damn sure am not going to make good use of it, for example. >.>

It's all fine to discuss theoretical possibilities, but this thread is still a question and a request for help from an individual.

I think that's what most of us forgot here.
Make sure the time investment you'd need in order to learn the role to such an extent as to reliably dominate in it is worth it, whichever lane has the strongest carry potential. After all, no matter how strong of an impact jungle has on early and mid-game I damn sure am not going to make good use of it, for example. >.>

It's all fine to discuss theoretical possibilities, but this thread is still a question and a request for help from an individual.

Kind of reminds me of those people who see something unbanned like shen or amumu in ranked and instant lock it because they got told it's "OP" then they really fail at it

Nothing is really that great without a load of practice, and you getting a feel for it /enjoying it imo.

I agree that he is a viable jungler and let's be honest... you dont need to practice jungling with him. Pressing q and autoattacking minions mindlessly doesn't make him any harder to play than any other jungler. I might have missunderstood you but it sounded like Darius hard. It's more a thing of understanding the jungle and knowing what to do which you need for every jungler

About the sightstone: I really like the item but I'm not sure if it is the right item to snowball you ahead. It wont make your jungle faster and neither will it make you a lot tankier. It is an amazing item to stay ahead once you managed to get an early lead but even then I'd only buy it if your lanes are too stupid to ward for themselves although you asked them to. You dont need to ward their jungle all the time. 1 Ward all the time (talk with mid so both wraith entrances are covered or just ward the other entrance when one is warded) and an occasional ward at buffs when you know buffs will respawn are enough. That would be an average of 1.6 wards per 3minutes [1 permanent, 1 ward every 5min] or 6.67 gp10 (let's say you ward things which are not really necessary and round it up to 7gp10 => you need 16min and 40sec to have the sightstone pay off. A very long time). Looks nice but considering you will fall behind in gold as a jungler and it doesn't really help you do your job (stand in the frontline, soak some damage etc) which would make forcing objectives easier. I guess thinking about it I'd hardly ever get the sightstone as a jungler.

PS: My point of view might be totally wrong due to exactly 0 sleep. If i'm wrong tell me

I don't build a single GP5 item with Darius because if you have half a brain and know how to gank you'll get the kill if the enemy doesn't have flash.

I didnt suggest buying a gp10 items... that was you. A sightstone is nothing but a gp10 item which doesn't generate money but generates wards and saves you money.

Also Darius isn't faceroll, if people know what they are doing they can shut him down considering he has to get close and personal. If you fuck up a your ultimate (missed-timed) in a team fight and don't get the last hit then there goes most of your damage as him due to his q and w not being much when building tank. He's easy in the jungle but then again most are when clearing camps... People say he isn't viable in the jungle but really are clueless, I personally think he's much more viable in the jungle than top because it's much harder to counter pick in the jungle.

Ganks do require practice and please for the love of my sanity start with red buff... It makes the clearing much eaiser and you can if you decide by level 3 to get e to attempt a gank.

Also Darius isn't faceroll, if people know what they are doing they can shut him down considering he has to get close and personal. If you fuck up a your ultimate (missed-timed) in a team fight and don't get the last hit then there goes most of your damage as him due to his q and w not being much when building tank. He's easy in the jungle but then again most are when clearing camps... People say he isn't viable in the jungle but really are clueless, I personally think he's much more viable in the jungle than top because it's much harder to counter pick in the jungle.

Ganks do require practice and please for the love of my sanity start with red buff... It makes the clearing much eaiser and you can if you decide by level 3 to get e to attempt a gank.

Depends on so many things where to start. Can't really just say "ima start red errygame".

Unless I'm invading, chances are I'm going to start red every other time with Darius, he doesn't need blue initially and he clears much better with red.

Darius not need blue? Lolwhut? He is pretty blue reliant for the CDR as well as the mana regen. You need it to clear camps with any sort of speed and not almost die.

I used to be of the mind that top cannot Carry, but then I played Kayle top and won because 1) I completely shut out the enemy, 2) She deals crazy amounts of damage, and 3) Split pushing wins games, especially when they have to send two or three people to stop you or they will fail.

While that's all fine and dandy, what if top needs an early gank though, and you're purple-sided? Or the other way around, bot needs an early gank and you're blue-sided.

It all depends on so many things.

It's hard to even get a gank off so early with blue buff with blue side to be honest. :/

Also, you can't really predict the enemy top if he's going to push or not so red either way, they generally won't push so far until I reach level 3 and I can gank by then if needed by putting a point in my e.

---------- Post added 2013-01-20 at 12:57 AM ----------

Originally Posted by Axethor

Darius not need blue? Lolwhut? He is pretty blue reliant for the CDR as well as the mana regen. You need it to clear camps with any sort of speed and not almost die.

I used to be of the mind that top cannot Carry, but then I played Kayle top and won because 1) I completely shut out the enemy, 2) She deals crazy amounts of damage, and 3) Split pushing wins games, especially when they have to send two or three people to stop you or they will fail.

Duronos I was agreeing with you on Darius being good in the jungle, I just disagree with the sightstone due to the reasons already listed above

One thing I have to strongly disagree is starting red to increase your jungle speed. That's just a waste of the buff. The buff is nice and everything but its true power is the slow and bonusdamage for ganks. I don't say starting red is bad (I love starting with a smiteless red into a smited blue and ganking top with 2 levels advantage) but it's a bad decision to use it if that early if you dont plan to gank with it asap.

Duronos I was agreeing with you on Darius being good in the jungle, I just disagree with the sightstone due to the reasons already listed above

One thing I have to strongly disagree is starting red to increase your jungle speed. That's just a waste of the buff. The buff is nice and everything but its true power is the slow and bonusdamage for ganks. I don't say starting red is bad (I love starting with a smiteless red into a smited blue and ganking top with 2 levels advantage) but it's a bad decision to use it if that early if you dont plan to gank with it asap.

Alrighty, I'm all about red I guess... Personal preference considering I play Shaco a lot who I love starting red with (though you can go the blue deceive over and get enemy red easily).

Shaco has the option to do some crazy stuff. Plant some boxes at blue and let your team pull it and attack it a few times (best make sure that those guys are premade with you...accidental steal would suck) and prepare to steal his red. The other way round when the enemy jungler starts red

Shaco has the option to do some crazy stuff. Plant some boxes at blue and let your team pull it and attack it a few times (best make sure that those guys are premade with you...accidental steal would suck) and prepare to steal his red. The other way round when the enemy jungler starts red

why would you even need your team to do any damage to it, 3 boxes takes out the buff alone.

Mid definitely, the ability to get massive amounts of CS farming wraiths/wolves between creep waves + the impact on Top and Bot you can have is enormous. You can single-handed carry lanes for other people by ganking at the right times and the right amount of times.

Jungle;
On succesfull ganks you get the kill or assist. In the best case you give you adc a double kill bot (or take it for yourself).
Junglers who have lots of mobility and great initiation and are present in lanes a lot especially.

But... Sometimes it's not the lane / jungler that carries. It's making a good call.
For example; Blue got invaded, our support helped me on red, said to go their blue. So i did, he helped and warded. We got few kills bot and won the game. All cause of one awesome call.