Senator Tim Kaine: “Las Vegas Shooter Only Stopped Because He Didn’t Have A Silencer on His Weapon”

In the video below, Senator Tim Kaine repeats his former running mate Hillary Clinton’s post-Mandaly Bay shooting anti-silencer rhetoric. According to the Virginia Democrat, silencer deregulation should be spiked because killer Stephen Paddock “was only stopped because he didn’t have a silencer on his firearm, and the sound drew people to the place where he was ultimately stopped.” The Senator then asks . . .

“Can you imagine what would have happened if he’d had silencers on these weapons?”

In fact, nytimes.com reports that it took police nearly two hours to locate Paddock’s 32nd floor room. They did so — ultimately – by hearing the sound of the smoke alarm in Paddock’s room.

Of course, facts are not the stock-in-trade for the civilian disarmament industrial complex.

Even so, the SHARE Act deregulating silencers is now on ice. And if and when the bill heads to the Senate — House approval is highly likely — the chances that it will get the five Democratic votes it needs to head to the President’s desk are somewhere between slim and none. And slim just left town.

I own silencers and depending on the situation, it could make a difference. Acting otherwise is disingenuous and contaminates a fact based argument that gun owners can win. But lying about it polarizes the conversation beyond reality.

Given the LV situation, yes, the smoke alarm was an oversight on the shooter’s plan. But had the shots been much quieter, it would have changed the dynamic, but how much? That is under speculation.

However the distance the shooter was firing across would require supersonic ammo for any predictability, and for the gun to cycle properly and predictably. That means there would be less noise with a silencer but not that much less.

Further, the suppressor would have put the shooter on some radars unless he went the oil filter route. But that is already covered under different laws.

So keep this topic level or we are only one youtube video away from loosing our rights. Admit what things do. There is a gun show loophole. Ive used it…both directions. And when I shoot subsonic with my suppressor, I can reduce the sound signature to nothing more than a click.

If you purchase a firearm from an FFL dealer at a gun show, federal law requires the same background check that you’d experience if you bought a firearm at a brick-and-mortar dealer.

If you purchase a firearm from an interstate private party at a gun show, federal law requires the same FFL-based transfer process (with a federal background check) that it requires if you purchase a firearm from an interstate private party any other way.

If you purchase a firearm from an intrastate private party at a gun show, federal law requires the same background check that it requires if you purchase that firearm from an intrastate private party at the seller’s home (i.e. none). Federal law simply doesn’t cover intrastate private sales, because they used interstate commerce as a justification for the NFA, GCA, AWB, and Brady Bill.

A loophole is a special exemption in, or tricky interpretation of, a law. This is simply an example of Congress not trying to exceed the Constitutional clause they used to justify a law.

There is no gun show loop hole. There’s a “I’m selling my personal property and the government will not allow me to access an instant NICS check on the buyer using something like a smart phone app” loophole that is intentionally there so the government can collect gun store firearm records in blatant violation of the law. Not one more step back. If we give up a single right at this point, with Republicans controlling of 3/4 of the state governments and all 3 branches of the federal government, that’s the end.

“And when I shoot subsonic with my suppressor, I can reduce the sound signature to nothing more than a click.”

BS. Maybe with a suppressed .22 shooting subsonic ammo, which is certainly not applicable to this situation. (For fun, shoot off a suppressed .22 firing subsonic ammo in the house while your wife is doing dishes… bet she perceives more than a click.) No suppressed caliber is applicable to this situation… 400 yds… effectively automatic fire.

I have fired the M16 (full auto guns) with .22 rim fire conversions with silencers and they work very well and it is indeed silenced to the point no one would have heard anything 400 yards away and the .22 is lethal at that range.

And accuracy even with sub sonic center fire ammo was irrelevant when firing into a large crowd as a matter of fact the nut case shooting his full power ammo could not have been aiming at all considering how fast he was firing. The result was the same, many dead and wounded people.

@cisco kid — No, no you haven’t. .22LR wouldn’t be accurate or have the adequate, immediate efficacy of any centerfire cartridge at 400 yards. Oh, and people would still hear it — if they weren’t also attending a rock concert.

And accuracy, especially with sub-sonic ammunition, would still be relevant even when firing full-auto, especially given the severe drop at any realistic range. It is also actually a fact that he still absolutely was, and would absolutely have to be, aiming to hit literally anything — even at a crowd as large as 30,000. Volume of fire can only make up for so much, not that someone is inexperienced with machine guns and mid-range riflery as you could understand that.

Are you getting paid to post this bunch of lies, Shotgun Sam? It sounds like you are. I suspect you don’t really know what a suppressor does. I also suspect you don’t know anything that goes on at gun shows because if you did you would not be spouting ‘Gun Show Loophole’ rhetoric. But most shills for the Elite’s Anti-Gun team really do know these facts but they are willing to sell out their country for the few bucks the Anti’s throw at them. Shills are moral prostitutes.

The Military uses silencers to obscure the direction of fire. If the nut case at La Vegas had used a silencer with sub sonic ammo yes he could have killed hundreds and hundreds of people. Many people at the shooting say they only located the direction of fire because of the noise as the shooter was over 400 yards away. They then saw flashes of light coming from the upper floors of the building. And no the smoke alarm did not direct police to the building the noise did. The smoke alarm only told them which room he was in but to know that they first had to know where the gunfire was coming from and which building.

Except you are wrong. The military uses suppressors to keep troops from going deaf. Oh and to be harder to see with night vision. NOT because it makes them invisible NINJA ASSASSINS OF DEATH!
Military Times says,
“Experts from both services say suppressors offer numerous advantages in a firefight. They suppress muzzle flash and make troops harder to see at night. They can help troops avoid hearing loss and the lifelong effects of hearing damage. But suppressors also come at a cost. They require more maintenance and money, and there are serious questions about their service life. ”
“Weapons suppressors are not silencers like those in movies, where a whisper of sound puffs out of an assassin’s gun. Instead, the devices decrease but do not eliminate the bang and sonic crack of high-powered rifle rounds.
The first benefit to using them is better communication from training to combat, said Matt Walker, a retired Army command sergeant major who is now the deputy ­director of the lethality branch at the ­Army’s Maneuver Center of Excellence.”

The 22,000 people in that crowd were corralled by high chain link fencing into the show area. There was ONE entrance to that area, in or out. I’ll bet that will change in the not distant future.

Whether or not they knew the direction of fire was irrelevant, there was only one way in or out and damn few places to find cover from the incoming bullets even if you knew their direction of travel. When they heard the gunshots, evident from the many videos, they had no immediate reaction as though it was gunfire and panic set in only when people started falling from wounds. Suppressed fire would have made no difference. Eventually someone directed their attention to the hotel and they could see the muzzle flashes, but there was still not a goddam thing they could do except try to get out the exit and scatter.

The SHARE act may be dead, how about some way to suppress the lies from these Dems? The First Amendment protects the freedom of speech, it does not give carte blanche to lie.

A 22lr at 400yards is absolutely lethal…don’t listen to these guys giving you a hard time…and it’s not like you’re gonna be picking out single targets at that distance at night…firing into a packed crowd as an area weapon…will go through skulls..throats..chest.. not that much penetration is required for a round to kill someone. If it can go through 1/2 plywood at 440 yards you better believe your skin and a tshirt isn’t going to stop it

Eventually lethal, you mean. Rimfire ammunition doesn’t have nearly the same immediate terminal effectiveness as its more powerful centerfire cousin. It would likely have required something like an order of magnitude more rounds downrange to produce the same body count as the guns he had with him.

Did I miss something Chip? Assume that Cisco, Jim, RammerJammer are probably all the same troll. Or did we learn something different? Every time I see one of the aforementioned names in the comments at least 1-2 others pop up. This guy must have no life.

quote——————————The police located the shooter based on the smoke detector alarm sounding in the room, as a result of the smoke discharged from the shooter’s weapons.——————-quote

The only thing that was unmasked as you said was your own arrogance and stupidity. What does it take to get through that thick skull of yours. The Police, The Band , and The People specifically all said they looked toward the sound of gunfire and then saw the flashes of light in a building over 400 yards away. Now the explanation cannot get any more simple than that. The smoke alarm only told the Cops which room he was in it would not have been in sight or audible from 400 yards away. Yes eventually all the racket would have cause the management to call the police and then after contemplating the info they may have guessed maybe the gunmen might be in that building but all that would have been way way after all the other people being shot at instantly heard and saw the gunfire as it happened. Again is this all getting too complicated for you. Come on prove your sane enough to admit you were wrong.

@cisco kid — He actually unmasked your own willful pig ignorance, whether you like to think so or not, which you are now trying to (and are going to fail in) projecting onto him. And everyone else who has effectively demolished your (non)arguments. What does it take to get you to stop projecting through that thick skull of yours? No one was even talking about locating the building in general by just the smoke alarm in the shooter’s room and you damn well KNOW that, so stop lying. The explanation cannot get any more simpler than THAT. Again, this was always too complicated for you even before you decided to slither up out of whatever sewer you were spawned in. So, come on, take your own advice — for once — and actually prove your own (non)argument or prove that you are actually sane in the first place, and finally that you are wrong. Same as you are now and have always been.

Yea, thou I type through the valley of the shadow of comments, I will see no words; for this software doth suck; My mouse and keyboard, they confoundeth me. Thou preparest a blog before me in the presence of mine internet: thou anointest my eyes with posts; my screen scrolleth over. Surely blankness and fury shall follow me all the days of my life, and I will dwell in the depths of the comments for ever.

You win the interwebz😋😋😋😋 Somewhat seriously I’ve had comments disappear,reappear and vanish in the inter-ether. I’ve been through WORSE here too…the Springfield Illinois betrayal is the main reason I stick around. I may just go to fakrbook…

The INFORMED firearm owner should take Kaine, Clinton & all of the political morons to a range and destroy their hearing by demonstrating, with a rifle (other than a .22 LR) equipped suppressor, and destroy their hearing SO THEY FINALLY UNDERSTAND THAT A SUPPRESSOR-equipped rifle is NOT silent! I thought, as a kid, I’d never have sufficient knowledge and intellect to run for a political office. Gee, was I wrong…intellect and knowledge are, apparently, not required to be a politician (but, it does help!).

You have that right. My wife (real, actual female) and I have thought that for a long time. All that choir boy stuff, effeminate look, etc. Check out his bio. We have said we could see him as one of those pedophile priests very easily. All he needs is the robe with nothing on underneath. Fudd ads in his campaign, complete with the plaid hunting hat. Sorry if this offends anyone. I try not to do that. But when it comes to this douche, and Hillary, Pelosi, etc. it becomes unavoidable. Worse, I have read that some Dems want to run him for President in 2020. Worse than Hillary. Worse than Obama.

Can’t help it. Every time I see this numbnuts, my impression is that he’s probably a pedophile who hasn’t yet been exposed. Also, he looks just like W.C. Fields which makes everything he says seem even weirder and less credible than it already is.

I didn’t. I was aghast that he got elected. Then I remembered the huge population of Dems/Libs just outside of D.C., living in the Virginia suburbs. THEY are the ones who got him elected. Time to get a republican governor in the Statehouse again!

I don’t think it would have the 5 D votes anyway. The rules would need to be changed to 50 votes and we know that Mitch ain’t gonna do that. I’m so pissed about this. It was a long shot to begin with and this asshole ruined it for us. After all, if someone craps in their pants we all must wear diapers.

This argument about him having a silencer is bullsh*t, and it needs to be disassembled and exposed. He could have gotten a silencer, he just didn’t. He certainly had the money, and obviously wasn’t a prohibited person, since he bought all those guns legally. The absence of the Hearing Protection Act did not prevent him from getting one. They are already legal in 42 states, including Nevada. If a homicidal nut job want one, they’ll get one. That left-wing douchebag Christopher Dorner proved that.

Just had to get my dalily dose of The truthaboutgunaboutgun. Woke up to HLN, covering the Las Vegus massacre. News chick was going on about how good it was that perp was not using a silencer, cause there would have been more people shot. But the snow flake comment would win an Emmy for ignorance was “NATO” rounds were used and those are for war because they are for war. Should only be available to police and military.
The talking heads are turning themselves inside out trying to determine “motive” How about just evil as the motive.

The guy had a clean record and routinely passed background checks. Had he wanted to silence his rifles, he easily could have. He had clearly been planning this attack for a long time, a 1 year wait for some cans would not have been a barrier. Making suppressors easier to get has no bearing whatsoever on this.

Wrong. The only reason he did not use silencer is that he could not get them in a reasonable amount of time and when we say he planned it for a long time that is only pure speculation. What is a long period of time? That could mean just about anything. When dealing with the mentally ill yes they often do plan things but generally its not for months and months as they often change their minds just as normal people do. And as time goes on its more and more likely he would have changed his mind not once but many, many times. In other words going through the paper work and time needed he probably would not have even attempted it and reality proved that is just exactly what did happen. He had just about all the latest bells and whistles except of course a silencer and that was no accident and that is my gut feeling from prior experience with scatter brained people.

In my own experience even normal people are impulse buyers and for mentally ill people that goes far more than even double or triple. The more hoop’s and trouble a guy must go through to get a silencer the more likely he will back out of it at some point or not even try to get one to begin with. I think the only improvement on the original silencer law (current one) is that a mental test should be administered as well and that goes for all gun purchases as well. A periodic psychological test to renew a gun buyers certificate “to buy” would be and should be passed for all firearms and silencer purchases. Its been done in foreign countries for years and yes many people do indeed own guns in foreign countries and think nothing of doing this and even agree with it because they see the value of it and are used to doing it. Its called being a responsible gun owner for the safety of society. They do this in civilized countries.

I would say a lot of “normal people” breathed a huge sigh of relief now that the silencer repeal bill is now dead and gone.

I must say one of the most chilling moments of my life is when I first was shown a full auto M16 with a modified pistol length barrel with telescoping stock and with a drop in .22 rim fire kit with silencer. The guy built it to go under his jacket. I asked the fellow “why the short barrel”? With cold dead lifeless eyes he said ” how long do you need it to be”. I realized then why he really bought such a monstrous machine and I realized this guy was not playing with a full deck. He did not buy it for recreation or because it was “cool” he had in mind possibly using it to kill people. Now you know why I am so against silencers being sold without being heavily vetted and why psychological tests should be administered. Luckily the guy never killed anyone and that was many decades ago. Like a lot of people he probably just changed his mind.

Can’t tell if your serious or pulling my crank? The most chilling moment in your life was when you saw a full auto .22 rimfire? Was this guy named Bruce, because the shark in Jaws also had cold dead lifeless eyes? Your life must suck and be one boring MFer.

@cisco kid — He’s right, you mean. The actual reason he did not use a silencer is because he didn’t care to. That you say that it’s because he couldn’t get one in a reasonable amount of time is what’s actually pure speculation on your part. What is a reasonable amount of time? You could make it mean just anything. When dealing with killers like this, they often DO plan things out for months and months — even if they change their minds like normal people do. We’re not dealing with normal people, though, and that’s the whole point. In other words, it doesn’t matter what kind of paper trail there is: he just isn’t going to bother with it even if he did want to use a silencer. Which he didn’t because there were none present. Your “gut feeling” is based on exactly nothing more than pure speculation as you have absolutely zero prior experience to go on at all, whatsoever.

Your own experience is moot and irrelevant, as none of the alleged circumstances in which you claimed to have found yourself are even remotely relevant or applicable to this or any other heinous tragedy. The more hoops and trouble a guy must go through to get anything he wants, the more likely he’ll just get it illegally. Whatever you like to “think,” if you can even call your “thought” process “thinking” to begin with, is still also irrelevant and inconsequential. None of your (non)arguments is grounded in fact or common sense, and nor do they have any bearing on the scope or meaning on the right to keep and bear arms — which stupid laws like prohibitions on silencers can only undermine. There is no “improvement” upon lunacy except to REPEAL IT. And, no, psychological exams should not be required, either, because they WOULD have to be required for the exercise of all other rights, full-stop. Equal Protection Clause and all that. And, no, in “civilized” countries, they do not debar their citizens the right to keep and bear arms, either — the countries you’re alluding to automatically and by default fall straight out of that categorically, period. There is also no demonstrable “value” in doing so, either, regardless of how many people agree with it, even if literally every single solitary other person on the face of the planet says “yes” and but ONE lonely soul says “no.”

You don’t speak for “normal people” to begin with because you don’t even fit into that category — and no, no you don’t — and even if you did, which you don’t, you’d have no authority to do so, anyway. Normal people actually breathe a sigh of relief when they know the asinine plans of thieves-by-proxy like you go up in smoke. Just like any gun control bill WILL at the federal level, even after something like this. And no, the silencer bill is not “dead and gone”, either. It will come back up for another vote eventually, and it eventually WILL pass. There is absolutely nothing that you or anyone even remotely like you can think, say, or do about it, either.

I will repeat the still-unrefuted statement that none of the experience you claimed to have had ever took place, and you’re still talking completely out of your ass. Same as it ever was with you. You can only be so sure of your unsubstantiated and unsupportable assumptions about this alleged character because you made him up, too. So, now you know why the rest of us ADULTS are so dead-set against any new gun control laws being passed and are GOING TO get as many old laws repealed as possible because of bold-faced liars like you. If psychological tests were ever required, you wouldn’t be worried because you couldn’t pass them, anyway, given your propensity for pathological lies. Luckily, we now know to immediately discount anything and everything you say out-of-hand because we can and shall immediately discredit it, just as we have so many times before and will continue to do forever more.

I would like to add to your comments, but I can’t, you are spot on. This “ciscokid” idiot is one of the most incredible liars I’ve ever seen on these boards. His self-righteousness is hilarious. This guy is probably a danger to himself or others, given his delusional state.

Here’s a radical idea. Instead of trying to prevent people who are “a danger to themselves or others” from buying or owning things, why don’t we just lock them up? We’ve already certified them to be a danger so why are we not removing them from society?

Both police and witnesses disagree with Senator Kaine: Witnesses initially thought the gun shots were fireworks while the natural echo chamber of a big city made the police have no idea where to look once they knew they were looking for gun shots. But hey, why let a little thing like the facts get in the way?

When you believe and follow false narratives, you are hostage to their inevitable outcomes. Problem, reaction, solution. Lone wolf, white shooter, no known motive, limited firearm experience, multiple reports of more than 1 shooter, no political or religious affiliations….right as 2 pro gun pieces of legislation were looking promising. What timing.

When you believe and follow false narratives, you are hostage to their inevitable outcomes. Problem, reaction, solution. Lone wolf, white shooter, no known motive, limited firearm experience, multiple reports of more than 1 shooter, no political or religious affiliations….right as 2 pro gun pieces of legislation were looking promising. What timing.

There is no such thing as a ‘silencer’ for any weapon. There are, however, suppressors, which attenuate the blast of the fired cartridge. Suppressors only work with sub-sonic rounds of ammunition (i.e. bullets travelling less than the speed of sound which is about 720mph). The speed of a .223 round is about 2040mph. The round breaks the sound barrier and thus makes a very, very audible CRACK sound, even if it is nowhere near you. Suppressors or silencers are not a factor in this particular equation.

Within 6 minutes people in floor below were reporting shooter on 32 floor, no suppressor would reduced a supersonic round enough to miss that. Where were the police/armed security for the next hour that could have stopped this? Reminds me of the delays at the Pulse. Should have ended within 20 minutes, if he had been robbing the casino he would have been dropped in 5 minutes

If he put that much full strength ammo through a suppressor in that short amount of time, the suppressor probably would have melted. Plenty of videos showing just that happening.

At night it is the flash that you find, not the sound. Especially in a place like Vegas with all those tall, sound reflecting buildings. You’d be hard pressed to find it no matter how loud or quiet. The smoke, on the other hand, from the rounds…you could see that daytime if he wasn’t back far enough from the window. Otherwise you are looking for some other sign, such as, oh broken windows.

Oh, let me add: Kaine is an idiot. Willfully ignorant or just lying, he’s an idiot for making such an easily debunked claim.
But then the people who voted for him and Hillary are easily led.

Kaine still talks out his A–Hole all the time! Proves it doesn’t take brains to be a democratic polecat! What stopped the shooter was a bullet to his own brain by himself! He’s the same SOB calling for the blood of Republicans to start flowing in the streets!

Progressives are all incurably insane. Look at the pics of Hillary’s VP candidate and he looks like he is totally whacko. Progressives are born without a moral compass. The LV shooter was a progressive democrat activist that wanted to beat out the shooter at the republican softball game.

I compete with a 22 l.r. and we have matches at 200 yards and have no trouble hitting the bulls eye at 200 and to hit a crowd at 400 would be a piece of cake and lethal as well. Read the inscription on every box of .22 ammo. It states be careful lethal up to 1 mile and they are not joking. I suggest you quit making such a fool out of yourself when you know so little about firearms or target practice or what a .22 can do. I have killed ground hogs with a .22 at 200 yards. And believe me anyone hit in the head at 400 would be dead guaranteed. I once as a kid fired off a .22 at a hawk the bullet went 3/4 of a mile and buried itself right under the bedroom window in the wooden siding on my buddies house and that was at a range of as I said of 3/4 of a mile. I never again fired any .22 into the air.

You don’t compete at all. If you did, which you don’t, you’d likely be competing with something that wouldn’t take kindly to high ROF and accuracy would diminish quite quickly. Especially at 400 yards, twice what you falsely claim to compete at. That description is also not on every box of .22LR ammunition, which tells us that you’ve never, ever bought any to start with. I suggest you stop projecting your foolishness onto people like me, because I know better than you do, when you know absolutely nothing about firearms at all. You haven’t ever killed anything, either. And no, headshots at 400 yards with a high ROF weapon of any kind are not guaranteed — that’s actually a guaranteed miss (of the head anyway). If you had actually ever done any of things that you’ve claimed to have done, which you haven’t, then whoever instructed you in gun-handling and target selection failed miserably, too. As did you.

You’re ignorant, incompetent, and a danger to yourself and everyone around you.

Just to be clear; the deadliest gun attack in U.S. history was Wounded Knee, South Dakota. When the American government sent troops to disarm the Sioux and massacred them all! Too bad we didn’t afford the Sioux coverage under the 2nd Amendment. That is why we have it! To protect ourselves from the government! Chicago has gun bans and is worst crime riddled, shooting murder city in America! Law and order follows the gun culture. Its nor our fault that a criminal wants to do something like that. You cant legislate evil. Just look at Obama and Clinton and Bush!

Yes, they can melt. Especially if they’re not full-auto rated. But, since we don’t know specifically how many of his guns he used or how many rounds he fired from each, we won’t know how hot those cans would have been had he used one, anyway.

Back-pressure also increases the cyclic rate of a gun, sometimes to the point of serious unreliability.

There would have definitely been more casualties! And to think otherwise your lying to yourself. Keep in mind the outside noise that will also drown out the sound signature of the suppressor, factor in traffic noise, also factor in the distance, but most of all there was a freaking concert going on!!!! Now how many decibels is a concert, probably around 110dBA if not more. And the only time most people ever heard a suppressed rifle is on YouTube, and keep in mind a video is being made and there usually shooting on a quiet farm where there is no other outside noise to drown the suppressor. Secondly I just want it to be known that I’m a gun lover and this comment was not intended to offend anyone but it’s just my opinion on the matter.

There definitely wouldn’t have been more casualties! And to think otherwise would only be you lying to yourself. YouTube videos never pick up all of the noise made by a rifle, suppressed or not. In fact, they hardly pick up any of it at all. Sound pressure is still often well above 120dBA, if not up to and over 140. Yes, there are YouTube videos that demonstrate this was the same sound metering equipment that the U.S. Army uses, too.

And just how the heck does Tim Cain know this? Was he talking to the man? The only way he could make that statement was if he was communicating with him. That man stopped because he had cameras set up in the peep hole of the door and on a cart in the hall. He say the police coming and turned his focus on them and realized that they were coming to get him and took his own life. Tim Cain knows this but he jumped on the lefts next agend which is banning silencers. Tha left wants to ban silencers why? So if they come after Americans they won’t be able to fire at them and hide their location. If I’m wrong then I’ll say so but with all that is going on with the left I believe this. They want to take control of this country and us. They = elitist and NWO. I put nothing past these people and neither should anyone else.

400 yrds is about all the 556 good for the kinetic energy about spent. .308 is still got stopping power and as a suppressor unless your firing subsonic ammo and your close to your target they degrade your range. On too of that subsonic ammo usually jams a couple times not enough energy to move the bolt.

the question I have is this: how did nobody notice this guy carrying neighborhood of 20 semiauto weapons? that’s a lot of weight and space. plus all of the ammo. lets say for each person hit by a round, he has to fire maybe 4-5 rounds for each hit. he is having 4k to 5k rounds available. that’s no small amount. I’m just wondering about haw many fired casings there are at the end of all this.

After reading many replies or comments, few know ballistics. Given the trajectory, wind currents, altitude drop, and distance a .22 would not have the trajectory or impact. The percussion depth/tone of the bullets exiting the barrels puts the caliber in the 7.62 range. I am not an expert, but I am not tone deaf.