Tickling England’s Tummy

You don’t have to take my word for it. That’s not even my headline. This wee nugget of smug mischief-making comes from a chap called Tim Montgomerie and it was in the Times of London last week. Read it here.

Tim runs the Tory website “Conservative Home” – he’s a leading figure in the Tory Party, if you feel like checking – and his mission for the last couple of years seems to have been to use the electoral threat of UKIP on Europe and Immigration to push the Tories even further to the right.

He expects that we’ll vote No. Then he expects us to be punished for being so annoying as to have had the referendum at all. This is what he says:

“If the battle for Scotland is nearly over, the battle for England might be about to begin. Today’s Future of England survey finds that most English voters want the UK to survive, but they want the terms of the relationship to change. Most think Scottish MPs should be prevented from voting on laws that apply only in England and also want Scotland to lose its budget subsidy. The average Scot currently receives about £1,400 more than the average English voter from the UK Treasury. Wales’s most disadvantaged communities are particular losers from the current spending settlement.”

He goes on to make his push for UKIP to push the Tories…who will then pish the other British parties. As follows:

“Until now the Conservatives haven’t felt it necessary to respond to the English awakening. It is not, after all, in the interests of Mr Miliband or Mr Clegg to empower an England leaning to the right. But I know a man who would benefit from tickling England’s tummy. He smokes. He drinks pints. And he’s called Nigel Farage. He does even less well in Scotland than the Tories. He’s got nothing to lose by wrapping himself in the St George’s cross and I predict he will.”

Okay? Got that?

First, he expects us to Vote No. Then, as a reward for our Loyalty to the “Family” of UK plc, he wants and expects UKIP to push the other Westminster parties into a competition as to who can stick it to the ungrateful, whiny, and worst of all COWARDLY…Jocks the hardest.

The 2015 UK election isn’t just going to be about austerity and punishing the poor and the disabled and the old…Scotland is in the firing line now. We all have got targets pinned to our chests. Whether we vote Yes or No.

The 2015 UK election, Tim says, is likely to be won on a “Punish Scotland” mandate.

heartoftheworld99
4 years ago

JimnArlene
4 years ago

pictishbeastie
4 years ago

David Agnew
4 years ago

Its clear to me no that the only thing Better together have achieved is to make it impossible for Scotland to remain in the Union. So it either ends with a little dignity with a yes vote, or dies quite literally from being stabbed to death by Westminster.

Tog
4 years ago

Inevitable that the referendum would heighten nationalist feeling in England and that this would be used by Ukip, the Tory right and the yes campaign in Scotland. The politics of grievance, envy and division sadly rumble on.

Illy
4 years ago

Abulhaq
4 years ago

In certain circles Scots are generally perceived as surly ingrates, scroungers and whingers. It has become a media “urban myth” so virtually impossible to correct. That this is usually tinged with a dislike of Scots per se is hard to ignore. Westminster is turning revanchist whatever the result. Project Fear appears to have spooked the spookers.

Peter Arnott
4 years ago

MBC
4 years ago

If there is a No vote isn’t it just crazy to punish the Unionists who have just voted No? That’s the illogic that No voters just don’t get. They don’t get the revanchist mood of Tory England and that the fact of just having held a referendum on such stark binary choice terms that Cameron has forced on us changes everything.

What pushed Tom Devine to finally vote Yes, is that he realised that if there was a No it would just turn messy and prolong the agony. A No outcome, and the expectation of more devolution within the Union, which is the majority No position (fools….) would, he said, ‘just frustrate the Scots and alienate the English’. Better to quit now, with a handshake, that leave the running sore of the constitution to fester longer.

setondene
4 years ago

jingsandthings
4 years ago

After a No vote, if that actually happens, then it will be interesting to witness what happens in Scotland whether or not rUK carries out these threats.

Labour thinks that they see off the Nats in the referendum, then its win, win, win all the way forward. Not realistic. Better Together and Labour have run such a negative, bitter campaign that I suspect few who previously voted for them will continue to give them their vote. Many eyes have been opened, and win or lose, the Labour Party in Scotland is facing dire days. A schism on the left, lots of new wee parties and the shrinking of Labour until it become little more than a shrivelled, mouldy husk of its former self.

And the great grassroots movement that has grown will not be content until it can forge a way forward that delivers the changes necessary for Scotland and all its people to prosper.

But that is if there is a no vote. With a Yes vote, as I fervently hope there will be, then that enormous grassroots movement needs to remain as the driving force that shapes our new country.

Angry Weegie
4 years ago

“Many eyes have been opened, and win or lose, the Labour Party in Scotland is facing dire days.”

I’m not so sure. Many will fall for the “keep the Tories out” argument and, unless Labour actually win in 2015 (unlikely, I know), they will continue to claim (in Scotland only) that they wouldn’t stick to the Tory austerity agenda and so it’s al the fault of the Tories. The Holy Grail of a future Labour government to sort everything out will still exist.

David Agnew
4 years ago

Not this time, tories now have enough to tear that one to shreds. Every stupid and imbecilic utterance from them on health, tax, Barnett – since siding with the Tories, they are all hostages to fortune.

The UK constitution would have to undergo a massive root-and-branch revamp in order to satisfy your statement above. And there’s not the remotest appetite for that, in either Westminster or the English electorate.

mb
4 years ago

“One thing most people would agree on is the issue of Scottish MP”–except it’s constantly used as an injustice inflicted on them as if it’s our fault. Scottish MPs are only voting in a parliament that they are eligible to vote in because it’s the UK parliament and Scotland is part of the UK. Westminster and the UK want it both ways. They want to keep Scotland in the union but Scotland should have no representation in that union. They’re like the Romans. They like us for the land, they like to be able to show us off on a map in front of all their international friends and say ‘That’s ours. But they’re not with us’.

Davythemidge
4 years ago

Once we’ve all got over the hangover and we realise what we’ve just done; amidst all the optimism, excitement and energy, I hope we make sure that all those who mis-informed, all those who mis-led and all those who downright lied will be remembered and brought to task. I’m not normally one for holding grudges, but some of those journalists and politicians who tried to hold our country down need to face the consequences……make them squirm.

JWil
4 years ago

If there is a NO vote in September and very quickly afterwards the UK government lets the electorate know what that actually means and Scotland has been put into a position like Catalonia, where referendums are illegal, there will be hell to pay. It’s better to vote YES and avoid that possibility.

edulis
4 years ago

# Tog

I am bound to say that this English backlash is not new. Ever since I can remember, Scots in England have been the butt of jokes. I should know, I lived there for 20 years. Remember the Question Time from Lancaster where some wisecrack raised an almighty guffaw from the audience by suggesting that all England’s nuclear waste should be dumped in Scotland.

Peter Arnott
4 years ago

Douglas
4 years ago

Exactly, and you have to wonder just how the questions in this poll were put to people. I mean, the majority of English people probably feel confused about the whole thing, and if somebody comes and asks you a loaded question…

Dean Richardson
4 years ago

The English people will accept a victory for Yes. It’s the British who will feel resentment and cause problems, but the British think they’re entitled to rule everywhere by God-given right (or some other form of right, as secularism is increasingly common these days). If you hear any whining from south of the border about a Yes victory, you’ll know it’s the Brits being their usual bitter, petulant selves.

Paul Holden
4 years ago

Actually there are many of us English who support Scotland’s bid for independence. Anyone who has the good sense to vote for freedom from those corrupt greedy idiots at Westminster definitely has my support

MBC
4 years ago

hektorsmum
4 years ago

Many I am sure are with us, but unfortunately jut like us they have the belligerent few, the ones whose voice is heard the loudest. Overheard at the dinner table, Englishman, who knew we were Scots, informing US man about the referendum. Well we want them to stay, we subsidise them , but we want them to stay. We got up and left. The feeling was he wanted a fight and we had no intention of giving him it.
When we were on a trip my Husband felt eyes boring into him, turned round to see two men glaring at him. seems it is not quite the correct thing to have a Saltire on your haversack. This is only one of the many incidents which have happened to us in the past few years since the referendum was called. The thing is they do not even know our political point of view, so may I say that all these BT types will not get a warm welcome either.

rowantree633
4 years ago

Reblogged this on A Yes Voter in Nairn and commented:
We will pay for a no vote – no doubt. A no vote is not just a vote to stay in the union, it is a mandate for Westminster to do whatever it likes and we will be powerless to counter it…

MBC
4 years ago

If there is a No vote wiser heads in the UK parties will do what they usually do by just trying to manage and contain Scottish expectations by selling us a pup, and finding ways to reverse or check devolution without seeming to do so in an obvious way. But Tory England is now divided, and they have to fight a battle on two flanks in the UK now – the Scots, and UKIP. Guess who they will find it most strategic to placate? So expect to hear more of voices like Boris Johnston’s telling us we don’t need more devolution, that devolution is perfectly adequate and the SNP have simply ‘failed’ with what powers they do have, and Labour gleefully joining in.

I have always felt that the SNP have failed to communicate adequately why independence will differ from devolution. What the additional levers of power would be capable of delivering. I think there are a lot of No voters who think devolution works and is adequate. And they will swallow this Tory line.

hektorsmum
4 years ago

MBC. what a foolish Nation we have if they do not understand the difference between Devolution and Independence. People in Sub Saharan Africa understand it without the benefit of an education.
Then of course we have people so frightened that they would leave the important levers of power with their neighbours. Who you are friends with, who you are enemies with, how you defend yourself. Along with the control of ALL the revenue, these are the important things. I for one do not want to see our Nation dragged into another inevitable war by those in Westminster. Since 1707 that is all they have done for Scotland, got our young men killed. If you look at the record since then you will see what I mean. I also want everyone to have a voice in this country of ours, right now we have none.

John Page
4 years ago

A key element in this campaign ( and hopefully not, but, if necessary, in a future campaign) will be the role played by second rate SLAB careerists in using what remains of their political machinery to maintain the Union and their self interests.
I see two prime short term objectives in the event of a No vote:
1. Target 20 sitting SLAB MWPs in so called traditional Labour seats for the 2015 election
2. Break the Labour hold on Glasgow
Is there anyone up for crowd funding a group of investigative journalists to provide the libel lawyer proofed background information for these objectives in terms of the following: low turnout constituencies, fiddled expenses, multiple houses, poor voting records, outside “consultancy” income, nepotism (especially in Glasgow) etc
Surely there are 20 individuals who have emerged with credibility and experience to continue the wider Yes campaign to stand as a single left/green/independence candidate in these constituencies
There are clear elements of Labour being a self serving cabal that gives life to its Scottish machine notwithstanding the death of its ideals: we cannot wait for it to die a slow death…….ruthless determination and intelligence is needed to finish it quickly

Hugh Wallace
4 years ago

Douglas
4 years ago

What’s interesting is the way they fabricate news stories. They go and take a poll and are probably looking for a set of results, loading the questions. And then they run the story, but is it real?

As information, it’s a kind of fool’s gold. But they set the news agenda with it and then, inevitably, it produces a reaction, because it has to be contested. And what is worse, it feeds into policy making, so that you have somebody in the main parties working out how to tap into that poll result today possibly? And then, the policy feeds back into the news feed and it becomes a kind of self-fulfilling prophecy.

But the polls/media/news manufacturing industry is being exposed by the free press.

My guess is that most English people living down south don’t really know much about Scotland and why we want independence. So, if we get a YES vote we probably have to try address that in some way. I’m pretty dubious about most of the polls.

But the point: the polls are a way of setting a news agenda and selling a story with some enhanced credentials. But you have to question those credentials and wonder where it leads.

Paul Holden
4 years ago

Agreed, Most people down here have little idea. However that will change when you vote Yes and people in England see just how much better the lives of ordinary Scots will become. We will then finally start to demand much more of Westminster ourselves then we get at the moment. Good luck Scotland and please vote YES for all of our sakes

Illy
4 years ago

That’s another reason that Westminster won’t even *try* to stop Scotland using the Pound, because an independent scottish currency would be so hard, people visiting from scotland would seem richer than they are, since the scottish pound would be worth more than an english pound.

Which would make any better conditions in scotland seem even better than they actually are.

Douglas
4 years ago

Clootie
4 years ago

I really do fear the backlash after a NO vote. This will not be from the majority of the English population directly. It will come as a result of Right Wing politicians (I include Labour) and the MSM inciting anger through a series of false statements and misleading hype.

The UK cannot continue with that type of resentment building on both sides of the border.

Having become more aware of the Westminster/Whitehall behaviour over the last two years I will never trust them again. The fact that many of my fellow Scots have been cowed into subservience once again will not lead to my acceptance of the situation.

Above all my disgust for the Labour Party in Scotland has no bounds. An opportunity to deliver the type of nation that it was founded to attain and they turned their backs on the people in greatest need of such change. Party before People, Power before Progress.

I hope people take back power from the politicians. The one thing I have seen coming out of this campaign is how much WE all have in common as regards the best future for Scotland.

I will never forgive Labour or the BBC for putting my nations future at risk.

Peter Arnott
4 years ago

Tim Montgomerie: In 1951 Scotland was a divided nation — not, as now, between unionists and separatists but between Conservatives and Labour. Scotland elected 35 Tory and 35 Labour MPs. But a rot started to set in, a rot that has lasted for six decades and has made it hard for any Conservative leader to win a majority of MPs in the House of Commons.
By 1966 Scotland was electing twice as many Labour MPs as Tory MPs. Even in the 1980s when Mrs Thatcher was winning landslide victories in England she was going backwards in Scotland. By 1997 the very foundations of the Scottish Conservative party were riddled with rot; north of the border became a Tory-free zone. Even now there’s only one Scottish Tory MP.
If the Conservatives were the heartless, self-interested bogeymen of Alex Salmond’s imaginings the prospect of Scotland leaving the UK would have been irresistible, but every single Tory MP has resisted it. Moreover, David Cameron has worked with the other unionist parties to offer Scotland even more devolution if it votes to stay. Tory donors have helped to bankroll the Better Together campaign. Most credit for the likely defeat of the nationalists shouldn’t go to Alistair Darling but to one of Scotland’s least favourite politicians. George Osborne’s strategy of insisting that an independent Scotland couldn’t keep the pound has probably done more than anything else to torpedo the nationalist dream.
But if the battle for Scotland is nearly over, the battle for England might be about to begin. Today’s Future of England survey finds that most English voters want the UK to survive, but they want the terms of the relationship to change. Most think Scottish MPs should be prevented from voting on laws that apply only in England and also want Scotland to lose its budget subsidy. The average Scot currently receives about £1,400 more than the average English voter from the UK Treasury. Wales’s most disadvantaged communities are particular losers from the current spending settlement.
Until now the Conservatives haven’t felt it necessary to respond to the English awakening. It is not, after all, in the interests of Mr Miliband or Mr Clegg to empower an England leaning to the right. But I know a man who would benefit from tickling England’s tummy. He smokes. He drinks pints. And he’s called Nigel. He does even less well in Scotland than the Tories. He’s got nothing to lose by wrapping himself in the St George’s cross and I predict he will.