im calling BS. you might head engineering software development, or software...but no way a coder ends up heading engineering.

never heard of it and never seen it in 20 years of professional engineering.

the coders are in nerd land. the engineers are nerdy, but they arent playing WoW in the evenings.

Well, since we are a software company, "heading up engineering" means that all of dev and qa and all of the devops and all of our data centers and their management report up through me. My official title is "VP, Engineering".

Once a coder, always a coder. But I don't have a lot of time for code these days. I do miss it.

Software engineers are most boring people on the planet, 90% of them are either married or 30 yo virgins. Once we obtained device that belongs to company I used to work in from a guy from our team... He forgot to close browser. Fucker was watching porntube on corporate device, on corporate wifi, at work. Guy wears shirts in pants, uses ton of lube on his hair and says hello directly to everyone in company every friggin time he comes there. Creepy as fuck.

But most fucked up part is working with bunch of guys who are unable to talk about anything except from software, new hardware and getting drunk, maybe their kids if they're married.

Ok, I stand corrected, MOST HORRIBLE PART about them being nerds is that they keep picking on my food. I was told by my parents its rude to comment on other people's food while eating, especially when you want to make a negative comment. But every fucking day I get some comments from fuckers who want to tell me that "diet coke is unhealthy" or "you eat too much chicken", "your diet is boring", "you add ketchup to everything, that's weird", "why do you drink olive oil". Just shut the fuck up already, FFS. I swear one day I will burst out or start spamming them with detailed analysis of what they had for a dinner with pubmed articles about trans fats and other shit they digest every day.

Not sure how is that related to this particular job but for whatever reason everyone who has ever made a comment about my food was a software engineer

im calling BS. you might head engineering software development, or software...but no way a coder ends up heading engineering.

never heard of it and never seen it in 20 years of professional engineering.

the coders are in nerd land. the engineers are nerdy, but they arent playing WoW in the evenings.

True dat.

Coders don't make good team leaders/managers. Some are brutally inhibited. Others are near autistic. A few think they know everything and will take it personally if you criticise their ideas.

In my first job the IT manager was a former coder and I have to say, contary to the norm, he was a pretty effective manager and comfortable in his own skin. However, as a coder he was only average. On the day I gave my notice he took me out to lunch and told me he found coding hard and didn't really enjoy it.

Coders don't make good team leaders/managers. Some are brutally inhibited. Others are near autistic. A few think they know everything and will take it personal if you criticise their ideas.

In my first job the IT manager was a former coder and I have to say, contary to the norm, he was a pretty effective manager and comfortable in his own skin. However, as a coder he was only average. On the day I gave my notice he took me out to lunch and told me he found coding hard and didn't really enjoy it.

I would say 9 coders out of 10 are autistic. Especially younger generation, for whatever reason. Veterans (40+) are mostly cool, laid back guys who are generally good at dealing with people. My younger colleagues tho... I don't know a single guy who would make a good leader in future, myself included.

I could imagine myself planning bigger projects or making important decisions, but dealing with people, especially THIS kind of people... That's worse than parenting kids actually.

Trolling aside, honest answer - would you like to be team leader if you could make just as much money just coding?

Software engineers are most boring people on the planet, 90% of them are either married or 30 yo virgins. Once we obtained device that belongs to company I used to work in from a guy from our team... He forgot to close browser. Fucker was watching porntube on corporate device, on corporate wifi, at work.

LOL, you must work at a shit company if they have left porn sites unfiltered. Not to mention the "corporate wifi" bit, LOL. Tell your stupid asshat admins that wifis are not suitable for use in corporate networks as any stupid kid can attempt to hack them from his car in the parking lot.

Software engineers are most boring people on the planet, 90% of them are either married or 30 yo virgins. Once we obtained device that belongs to company I used to work in from a guy from our team... He forgot to close browser. Fucker was watching porntube on corporate device, on corporate wifi, at work. Guy wears shirts in pants, uses ton of lube on his hair and says hello directly to everyone in company every friggin time he comes there. Creepy as fuck.

But most fucked up part is working with bunch of guys who are unable to talk about anything except from software, new hardware and getting drunk, maybe their kids if they're married.

Ok, I stand corrected, MOST HORRIBLE PART about them being nerds is that they keep picking on my food. I was told by my parents its rude to comment on other people's food while eating, especially when you want to make a negative comment. But every fucking day I get some comments from fuckers who want to tell me that "diet coke is unhealthy" or "you eat too much chicken", "your diet is boring", "you add ketchup to everything, that's weird", "why do you drink olive oil". Just shut the fuck up already, FFS. I swear one day I will burst out or start spamming them with detailed analysis of what they had for a dinner with pubmed articles about trans fats and other shit they digest every day.

Not sure how is that related to this particular job but for whatever reason everyone who has ever made a comment about my food was a software engineer

LOL, you must work at a shit company if they have left porn sites unfiltered. Not to mention the "corporate wifi" bit, LOL. Tell your stupid asshat admins that wifis are not suitable for use in corporate networks as any stupid kid can attempt to hack them from his car in the parking lot.

Well, with LEAP and some other things, it's a lot harder...

We put all of our WiFi outside of our corporate network and in the DMZ.

If you hack it, you can have internet access, but you can't get back to any of our IP.

LOL, you must work at a shit company if they have left porn sites unfiltered. Not to mention the "corporate wifi" bit, LOL. Tell your stupid asshat admins that wifis are not suitable for use in corporate networks as any stupid kid can attempt to hack them from his car in the parking lot.

It doesn't work in parking lot, but you are perfectly right. I don't think it grants any access to our corporate stuff, it's just internet. But just about every company I've been in (not gonna say - worked in, I didn't) including Google, Sabre etc. got some kind of passworded corporate wifi.

Trolling aside, honest answer - would you like to be team leader if you could make just as much money just coding?

That's a rhetorical question Of course I wouldn't, not for the same money.

Having said that, there is no "just coding". Requirements capture, understanding the business context and the actual processes on the ground, dealing with legacy systems, dealing with overtly complicated change management systems... sometimes coding is the easy part.

That's a rhetorical question Of course I wouldn't, not for the same money.

Having said that, there is no "just coding". Requirements capture, understanding the business context and the actual processes on the ground, dealing with legacy systems, dealing with overtly complicated change management systems... sometimes coding is the easy part.

Dealing with legacy code is by far worst part. Especially when the guy who wrote the code doesn't work there anymore and got kicked out Not very smart move to fire the guy and then expect him to explain code to everyone in 3 months he's got left. On the other hand, veterans are reluctant to give such information away because it would make them useless... It's neverending story

I'm too young to deal with business context and things like that, my tasks revolve around just coding. I am aware about that part tho, but I still think dealing with people is biggest pain in the ass. Both those under and over you in hierarchy.

Team leaders are like fathers in huge family. It's hard to be both good, caring father and avoid spoiling your kids. I've seen all kinds of father - from despotic, "cool and laid back" to "I don't give a fuck, just do whatever and leave me alone".

Dealing with legacy code is by far worst part. Especially when the guy who wrote the code doesn't work there anymore and got kicked out Not very smart move to fire the guy and then expect him to explain code to everyone in 3 months he's got left. On the other hand, veterans are reluctant to give such information away because it would make them useless... It's neverending story

I'm too young to deal with business context and things like that, my tasks revolve around just coding. I am aware about that part tho, but I still think dealing with people is biggest pain in the ass. Both those under and over you in hierarchy.

Team leaders are like fathers in huge family. It's hard to be both good, caring father and avoid spoiling your kids. I've seen all kinds of father - from despotic, "cool and laid back" to "I don't give a fuck, just do whatever and leave me alone".

By legacy code I mean a system written in a language no longer supported. Like COBOL. Companies can rarely afford to re-write their apps. Especially if they have been in use for decades and have become functionally rich. Imagine if you have to peripherally deal with the side effects of such a system - which is essentially a black-box to you, since you have no insight to its inner workings and the people who developed it left a long time ago. And they didn't leave documentation behind

this went from being a good thread to a my cock is bigger then your thread, we know you are all the smartest and best and know it all, please talk on the topic of jobs in this sector, stop trying to prove anything here you sound pathetic

By legacy code I mean a system written in a language no longer supported. Like COBOL. Companies can rarely afford to re-write their apps. Especially if they have been in use for decades and have become functionally rich. Imagine if you have to peripherally deal with the side effects of such a system - which is essentially a black-box to you, since you have no insight to its inner workings and the people who developed it left a long time ago. And they didn't leave documentation behind

That's exactly the shit I'm dealing with, well, everyone is in that company. I think it's not working out well and we're doomed to be honest.

this went from being a good thread to a my cock is bigger then your thread, we know you are all the smartest and best and know it all, please talk on the topic of jobs in this sector, stop trying to prove anything here you sound pathetic

Pretty standard GB response. My bad for letting my mask slip a bit. What I MEANT to respond to the initial post was:

"I saw a bunch of books and magazines about programming languages when I was perusing bodybuilding mags at the bookstore. I didn't get one, but when I went back to my room in my mom's basement I vaguely remembered some of them when I was reading about the anabolic window"

Pretty standard GB response. My bad for letting my mask slip a bit. What I MEANT to respond to the initial post was:

"I saw a bunch of books and magazines about programming languages when I was perusing bodybuilding mags at the bookstore. I didn't get one, but when I went back to my room in my mom's basement I vaguely remembered some of them when I was reading about the anabolic window"

VBS, VB.net, VBA here. Also used to do C++ years ago but no more. I am not a programmer, but I just learned the languages and used to code some games for fun. Now a days I use my knowledge for scripting automation for a variety of things at work.

Used to also do html but that was back in the day.. now a days everything is dynamic with ASP, PHP, etc... etc... Just recently designing a site (fun project on the side) first time staring at PHP.

Got a bit dirty with powershell as well, I must as VBS is ever so legacy now although still does the job just fine in a corporate IT environment.