If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Re: Frampton vs Santa Cruz

I like this double-end-bag-boxing-soccer-thread!

Yeah, my son continued - at 18 he played attacker (pure, classical center with thick legs, good physique and the mentality of a striker) with a team that won their league, but due to the increased travel expenses turned down their place in a higher division. He lost some passion, turned down the ambition, and now plays for fun, parting time with Muay Thai and his work. Since some high ranked trainers told him at 15 he was more or less destined for, at least, the top national league, I'm mostly impressed with the way he has handled the shift in what his life became. At lot of young talents can't deal with that.

@Shadow. You know your way around Scandinavia, don't you? Funny thing about Skåne: the rest of the country considers the people somewhat egocentric with a more than hard dialect to understand, and still almost half-danish (as is I, by the way - half-danish, that is). But yeah, Henke was the King of Glasgow (and did well in both Barcelona and, for a short stint, United) - and one of the smarter players I've ever seen. I remember some national games where it was the little, unnoticed things he did that really made the difference. Great, great player. You mind naming your nephew? Just being curious.

@Skibbz. No, he never came closer to play in the UK than meeting some british team in the megatournament of Gothia Cup in Gothenburg. Around 37 000 players at the same place - its a fantastic feast of football. And yeah, I guess we sometime could have an interesting discussion about the aberrations of footballs scouting system all over Europe, with agents bribing starving mothers in Africa in order to take their young sons with them and only to dump those who doesn't succeed without passport somewhere/anywhere on the continent. Horrible stories.

Rigo and Frampton in Belfast would be something, worth a flight to Dublin and train up north - but too much and too soon boxingwise for McGuigans lad.

Re: Frampton vs Santa Cruz

Originally Posted by Grimm

I like this double-end-bag-boxing-soccer-thread!

Yeah, my son continued - at 18 he played attacker (pure, classical center with thick legs, good physique and the mentality of a striker) with a team that won their league, but due to the increased travel expenses turned down their place in a higher division. He lost some passion, turned down the ambition, and now plays for fun, parting time with Muay Thai and his work. Since some high ranked trainers told him at 15 he was more or less destined for, at least, the top national league, I'm mostly impressed with the way he has handled the shift in what his life became. At lot of young talents can't deal with that.

@Shadow. You know your way around Scandinavia, don't you? Funny thing about Skåne: the rest of the country considers the people somewhat egocentric with a more than hard dialect to understand, and still almost half-danish (as is I, by the way - half-danish, that is). But yeah, Henke was the King of Glasgow (and did well in both Barcelona and, for a short stint, United) - and one of the smarter players I've ever seen. I remember some national games where it was the little, unnoticed things he did that really made the difference. Great, great player. You mind naming your nephew? Just being curious.

@Skibbz. No, he never came closer to play in the UK than meeting some british team in the megatournament of Gothia Cup in Gothenburg. Around 37 000 players at the same place - its a fantastic feast of football. And yeah, I guess we sometime could have an interesting discussion about the aberrations of footballs scouting system all over Europe, with agents bribing starving mothers in Africa in order to take their young sons with them and only to dump those who doesn't succeed without passport somewhere/anywhere on the continent. Horrible stories.

Rigo and Frampton in Belfast would be something, worth a flight to Dublin and train up north - but too much and too soon boxingwise for McGuigans lad.

Absolutely his intelligence was the difference maker!

Do you remember in the champions league when he went to Barcelona? They substituted him in and he assisted on two goals that won the game. Insane.

That dude does things that only teammates or people with high soccer knowledge can appreciate.

Are you really half Danish?

Yes, sure, his name is Martin Braithwaite, he plays for Toulouse in France. (Both he and I are half Danish also.) He's one of their key players down there. They sign him after he helped his Danish squad win the cup for the first time in 34 years or something like that.

He's another example of having a strong mind. He was in a wheelchair when he was 5-6 and had to stop although he was a really good player. He eventually overcame his ailment, willed himself back and now is doing really well.

We still have a picture of him from a local newspaper when he was two kicking a soccer ball at a local bank opening.

We both are massive fans of Henke. We always joke that he was so big in Scotland, he could walk into any pub in Glasgow, point at a chick, no words spoken, only a loud "You!!!" And have her leave with him.

Re: Frampton vs Santa Cruz

That sounds like an incredible tournament, bet this kids love to play there. 37k is massive I can only imagine what it must look like if they're all on the fields. Maybe we could get a random topic thread going on the subject of agents and other similar delightful people... And spill the beans Shadow!

I don't think he beats rigo at the moment, however if it's off the back of a good character building performance against Santa Cruz, then I think he stands a much better chance. Problem is Rigo's left hand is perfect and frampton would find it incredibly difficult to compete with it. If it's in Belfast they'll put on a big show. 2014 isn't looking like a bad year so far.

Edit: @Shadow I don't think you can judge Frampton based off a comparison on how he'd against Rigo vs Leo. I think he's good enough to beat Santa Cruz. He's got the power, skill, fitness to give Leo a real test. I see that fight going the distance with both fighters getting bloodied and bruised. It'll be a lot of give and a lot of take from both fighters, but i think framtpon edged him in power and that could be the difference.

Re: Frampton vs Santa Cruz

Thanks for that report, Skibbz. How many times do we see a guy stay on a knee--as Cazares did--while the ref counts him out, then the fighter jumps up as the ref says "TEN!"

I am amazed at the amount of texts, e-mails & calls I have been getting about the fight's ending.

"Why did the ref wave it off, Cazares got up!" was the thought of so many.

"Cazares beat the count!"

Cazares what??? Beat this!!!!

Cazares did not--DID NOT!!!--beat the count. The ref hit "TEN" before Cazares shot up "like a rocket bound for the moon," as Skibbz so perfectly put it.

Gentlemen (and for the ladies reading, as we know they are), being up doesn't merely mean beating the count, which Cazares clearly did not. Being "Up" means the downed fighter has to be on his feet and in the boxing position, ready to fight. Cazares was nowhere near "Up." He was counted out. O-U-T!

Re: Frampton vs Santa Cruz

Here's some more fuel Commissioner. Cazares told Barry Mac that he's never been hit with a shot so powerful in his career. Says a lot!

The McGuigans are going to be flying stateside in the coming weeks to sit down with Richard and Raul, apparently want to line up a few fights; notably Santa Cruz, Abner Mares and Jhonny G. Looks like Rigo's getting left out to dry.... Poor fighter said he's willing to fight in Belfast and presumably for much less than Santa Cruz... But that looks unlikely now a multi fight deal with GB is on the horizon.

Re: Frampton vs Santa Cruz

Thanks for that report, Skibbz. How many times do we see a guy stay on a knee--as Cazares did--while the ref counts him out, then the fighter jumps up as the ref says "TEN!"

I am amazed at the amount of texts, e-mails & calls I have been getting about the fight's ending.

"Why did the ref wave it off, Cazares got up!" was the thought of so many.

"Cazares beat the count!"

Cazares what??? Beat this!!!!

Cazares did not--DID NOT!!!--beat the count. The ref hit "TEN" before Cazares shot up "like a rocket bound for the moon," as Skibbz so perfectly put it.

Gentlemen (and for the ladies reading, as we know they are), being up doesn't merely mean beating the count, which Cazares clearly did not. Being "Up" means the downed fighter has to be on his feet and in the boxing position, ready to fight. Cazares was nowhere near "Up." He was counted out. O-U-T!

Can't wait for Carl Framton v Leo Santa Cruz.

-Randy G.

Malik Scott pulled this stunt too. I was always taught to get up by 8 because the ref asks if your ok and asks that you step forward to continue . Al Gavin had us practice this . If you happened to get caught to the liver he had you stay down till 8 and try and breath deep. He would scream and drill that you have to tap your gloves and step forward . Even if you weren't on the floor he would stop the action and instruct what would happen if you got caught or stopped throwing punches. Drills drills drills until it came second nature

Re: Frampton vs Santa Cruz

Originally Posted by Skibbz

That sounds like an incredible tournament, bet this kids love to play there. 37k is massive I can only imagine what it must look like if they're all on the fields. Maybe we could get a random topic thread going on the subject of agents and other similar delightful people... And spill the beans Shadow!

I don't think he beats rigo at the moment, however if it's off the back of a good character building performance against Santa Cruz, then I think he stands a much better chance. Problem is Rigo's left hand is perfect and frampton would find it incredibly difficult to compete with it. If it's in Belfast they'll put on a big show. 2014 isn't looking like a bad year so far.

Edit: @Shadow I don't think you can judge Frampton based off a comparison on how he'd against Rigo vs Leo. I think he's good enough to beat Santa Cruz. He's got the power, skill, fitness to give Leo a real test. I see that fight going the distance with both fighters getting bloodied and bruised. It'll be a lot of give and a lot of take from both fighters, but i think framtpon edged him in power and that could be the difference.

OK, I'll take your word for it, I know nothing about him. Haven't seen him do battle. Yes, Rigo's surgical left hand is so razor sharp.

Based on what you say, that would be an exciting matchup. Personally, I'd like to see if Santa Crauz can keep up the activity against a master boxer.

I can only recall one or two volume punchers being able to maintain high work rates against master boxers and that's Joe Calzaghe vs Hopkins and Paul Williams vs. Lara and oth those fights were disputed to some degree.

Like Hopkins says, every punch you throw leaves an opening for a counter strike.

Re: Frampton vs Santa Cruz

Originally Posted by Skibbz

Interesting post Grimm did your son ever cross over into the UK? I've played against Malmo at a tournament, some decent footballers you Swedes have!

You're right when it comes to scouts.. I was scouted at a school game and invited to trials. The scout followed us all the way back to our home and before we got through our front door called us over to give us 'the good news'.. It's big business and that doesn't stop at the grass roots of the sport.

I think it depends a lot on the academy the young lads end up at though. Some academies are tremendous at what they do and they can take a young boy and mould a world class player out of him.. However not all academies are funded great or are prioritized so it can lead to a lot of broken dreams.. Murderous competition, agents like vultures and clubs who only want to see results. It's tough, but those that make it out can find their lives transformed, for better or worse..

@BrownSugar I just read that Hyde's put out words that he's willing to fly Rigo to Belfast to fight Frampton... What a show that would be. I'd think it would be a top job my Mcguigan sorts the Cruz Frampton bout, but also gets Carl signed up for a date in Belfast with the cuban professor. That'd have me chuffed... Ahh let it happen.

That was a very riveting conversation you and Grimm had about soccer recruiting... and I thought NFL style football was intense... I still can't wrap my head around it.

But yes ... I'm looking forward to getting a closer look at Frampton
Frampton and Cruz... ......make it happen

Re: Frampton vs Santa Cruz

You know how people act when money's involved, I've heard agents do some ridiculous and sometimes illegal things to sign up talent.

What d'you reckon the future holds for Rigondeaux seeing as everyone's sidestepping him out of the ring..

Skibbz, I'm in the soccer biz. I've seen first hand what agents do to try and sign talent. One time this motherf*cker had sweet talked my nephew into meeting with him without his parents or any representation.

He called me and asked me to be his representation. I sat there during this meeting while he told all kinds of stories of what he was going to do.

Other times I've seen shady sian guys show up to seemingly insignificant games. But guess what. YOU COULD BET ON THEM.

They approach a guy or two from each line, get them to fix a game.

There's so much fixing going on. Skibbz I'm telling you, I've witnessed fixed games in the CHAMPIONS LEAGUE! In the UEFA Cup.

The highest level I've ever played myself in Europe was the division just below the pros. In other words, if we won that league, we'd be playing against the pros.

You could bet on these games! I was astounded. And seeing as this was just a hobby, these games are so easy to fix, though I've never been part of that that I know of...

There's even a guy who I'm sure you know who used to play for Tottenham who's been calling me trying to get to my nephew.

This is just small time stuff. Imagine how it would be for big athletes. I remember back in high school I was living with this HOF Pro Bowler whose contract was expiring.

We were at the Pro Bowl in Hawaii at the players' hotel. (FWIW, Ray Lewis is an obnoxious POS.) Raiders coach Jon Gruden, at the time a rising star coach, was VERY aware of who's contracts were expiring.

You NFL heads may remember Rich Gannon -- an ex-Chief quarterback who went to Oakland as an old man while Elvis Grbac stayed behind in KC -- totally became an MVP candidate and looked like a million bucks.

Only problem was his game was built on scrambling and speed and he was reaching an as where athletes break down.

That entire week, Joe Gruden was on Peyton Manning like Manny Pacquiao on the damsels of Sarangani. Buying him beer, joking, schmoozing.

Though the public wasn't privy to this, this was out in the open! I wonder what goes on behind the scenes. Oh my goodness...

Remember how 50 and Tommy Smalls tried to make that big coup by stealing Floyd Mayweather away from Al Haymon and Swizz Bankz?! Sending secretive letters while he's in jail and making power moves on the outside, making enemies of Al Haymon, De La Hoya and Schaefer.