Braves Acquire Dan Uggla

The Braves landed one of baseball's most powerful second basemen today, acquiring Dan Uggla from the division rival Marlins for utility man Omar Infante and lefty reliever Mike Dunn.

Uggla, 31 in March, had another fine season in 2010 with a .287/.369/.508 line in 674 plate appearances. Uggla is one season away from free agency, and extension talks with the Marlins broke off after he rejected a four-year, $48MM offer. Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports feels that the Braves will attempt to sign him long-term. Martin Prado will step in at third base as Chipper Jones recovers from knee surgery or log innings in left field if necessary, tweets Rosenthal. Uggla should be happy to remain at second base.

Infante, a super-utility type, hit .321/.359/.416 in 506 plate appearances for the Braves this year. He's under contract through 2011 at $2.5MM with another possible $1MM in plate appearance incentives. The loss may put the Braves in the market for a utility player, writes MLB.com's Mark Bowman. Dunn, 26 in May, is a hard-throwing left-handed reliever who came to Atlanta from the Yankees a year ago in the Javier Vazquez deal. Dunn racked up big-time strikeout and walk numbers this year between Triple-A and the Majors. The intra-division asking price for Uggla was expected to be large, but this is a disappointing return for the Marlins. They have succeeded in revamping their bullpen for the long-term, adding Ryan Webb, Edward Mujica, Dustin Richardson, and Dunn in recent trades.

The Cardinals, Blue Jays, Nationals, and Tigers were other reported suitors for Uggla.

2 draft picks (because we know all draft picks make it to the bigs in baseball) are better than 2 guys that can make an impact on the team now? This is not rocket science, the Marlins have a need and they are attempting to fill that need, the Braves needed a power bat.

I really don’t understand why so many people are cracking jokes about this trade. Just the other day most of you were omg lol Uggla is such a hack at 2nd base, he’s not even that good when you factor in defense. Then you guys talk about how he’s getting older and his #’s are going to decline… now it’s like he’s this gold mine that is irreplaceable. The Marlins get a younger and better defensive 2nd baseman and that’s a bad thing. Ok, sure. They weren’t going to get much for a guy going into his last year of arbitration.

I NEVER said Uggla would decline. He is getting better every year and us worth 16Mil a season. His defense is fine. Hanley is much worse, and most of his errors were trying to turn double plays that hanley screwed up. Infante is nothing more then an expensive bench player. Plus we were offered better deals from EVERY other team, including a top 100 pitching prospect. You will find out just how stupid your post is by the end of the season.

It’s amazing how a change of uniform can effect one’s image of another player. He is our legitimate right handed power threat now…and thank goodness we didn’t have to get rid of Prado. Now our main concern is addressing the needs at center and/or our platoon in rightfield. Our infield is intact…my main concern is whether or not our new hitting coach can get McClouth back to his old ways.

I think, if we can sign him, the Braves got the better end of this deal. Great job Wren. The first outta the box, at least we know Wren is trying and is doing his homework. Gotta love it.

I dig your math skills. A 28 year old is a half a year younger than a 30 year old. How long did it take you to figure that out? I think Uggla’s defense is underrated, but most people will tell you he’s a hack at 2nd base. But.. really, Hanley is the one that gives Uggla errors? Amazing set of math and reasoning skills.

2 draft picks (because we know all draft picks make it to the bigs in baseball) are better than 2 guys that can make an impact on the team now? This is not rocket science, the Marlins have a need and they are attempting to fill that need, the Braves needed a power bat.

I really don’t understand why so many people are cracking jokes about this trade. Just the other day most of you were omg lol Uggla is such a hack at 2nd base, he’s not even that good when you factor in defense. Then you guys talk about how he’s getting older and his #’s are going to decline… now it’s like he’s this gold mine that is irreplaceable. The Marlins get a younger and better defensive 2nd baseman and that’s a bad thing. Ok, sure. They weren’t going to get much for a guy going into his last year of arbitration.

I’m not sure why this is surprising. Uggla’s got massive power for a 2B, but his glove is putrid. He’s also only under team control for one year. And, he’s arb-eligible, so he’s going to get paid $10-12 million for that one season.

I’m not sure the Fish could have gotten much more for Uggla than what they got. Infante is under team-control for one season at $2.25 million, and Dunn is under team control for four more years (I think). That’s not a bad return on a one-year rental of a good, but not great, 2B, who’s going to get paid eight figures and might leave when the year’s done. Yes, in a vacuum, Dan Uggla for Infante & Dunn sounds like highway robbery; but we’re not in a vacuum, and taking each player’s contract situation into consideration, this deal isn’t as uneven as everyone is making it out to be.

If Uggla was signed to a team-friendly long-term deal, then I’d agree that the Fish got robbed. As it stands, I’m not sure I understand all the “that’s all it took?” talk. All the Braves got was a 2B who’s going to get paid about his value next season, and the exclusive right to negotiate an extension with him over the next year…

This reminds me of the Johan Santana trade — no one understood why the Twinkies couldn’t get more, but when you deal a guy who’s about to get paid massive bucks the year before he hits free ageny, you generally don’t get a ton back in return.

I’m not sure that’s right, but I’m not totally clear on how free-agent comp works either.

First, it assumes that the free-agent comp system stays the same next season, which it might not. Second, if they’d kept Uggla, they would have (1) had to pay him $12 million next season, (2) gotten a first- or second-round 2012 draft pick if they offered him arb (and he didn’t accept) and another team signed him.

So, what would you rather have: (1) Mike Dunn (under team control for four years and a known commodity) and Omar Infante (a cheap replacement 2B under control for one year, and a known commodity) or (2) a first-round draft pick, next year, after paying Uggla $12 million this season…

I’m not sure #2 is the better option, especially for a team like the Fish.

It would have been a 1st rounder (probably) and a pick between rounds 1 and 2.

That being said, The Marlins would have been committed to about $14M had they kept Uggla and signed the draft picks. At some point a team needs to try to win now, while the picks would have been nice long term, this is more of a sure thing and they can realize the benefits immediately. Now, if the Marlins turn a portion of Uggla’s money to the draft (say an extra $3M), then this could be better than keeping Uggla as this may be the last draft where teams can go overslot and the comp picks wouldn’t have been until the 2012 draft.

You’re probably thinking of type B’s. Type A’s cost the signing team their 1st round pick (unless their record was in the bottom 15 in baseball, then they lose their 2nd rounder) and the team losing the player gets that pick in addition to a sandwich round pick (between rounds 1 and 2). Of course there are exceptions to this such as if multiple type A’s are signed, but this is it in it’s most basic form.

I get you’re reasoning, but I still thought the Marlins were gonna get more talent. Mike Dunn tops at setup man/specialist, and while I love Infante and admire the job he did this year, I don’t think he’ll match this season ever again. Braves finally get a right handed power hitter to bat between Chipper and McCann. And Uggla loves to hit in Turner field 1051 OPS in over 50 games. Braves get a replacement for Chipper when he retires because Prado can play 3B. 5 yrs 58 million do it Wren.

Yeah — seems the Marlins went the safe & sure route (lowish-upside Dunn and no-upside Infante) instead of more of a high-upside route. Then again, maybe nobody was offering high-upside for one year of Uggla.

I absolutely 100% agree that this deal makes the Braves offense more potent next season; replacing Conrad/Infante with Uggla’s a huge upgrade.

I don’t think the Braves get Uggla to sign for 5 yrs, $58 million. I think there was a message just posted a second ago on MLBTradeRumors front page saying Uggly turned down a five-year, $71 million deal from the Fish. Possible he just had no desire to stay in Florida, and that he’d take less from the Braves. But, I think you’ll need to approach five years $65 million (minimum) to keep him, and probably need to match that last (alleged) offer from the Marlins.

“This reminds me of the Johan Santana trade — no one understood why the Twinkies couldn’t get more”I’ll tell you why they couldn’t get more: they overplayed their hand.I remember the Twins demanding top prospects from both the Red Sox and the Yankees. (Not just one but MANY) The Twins wouldn’t bulge and they waited until the last minute to trade Santana.(They waited until after the season was over.) By then, the Red Sox and Yankees wouldn’t budge. Also, the Twins overvalued what the Mets offered.Uggla is not a good fielder but Infante isn’t great either. Uggla posted 5 WAR last season and averages about 3-4 WAR a season. Infante’s BEST season (last season) was worth 2.7 WAR. Before that, he never posted a WAR above 2. Mike Dunn is your ubiquitous high potential/bad command relief pitcher. He posted a sweet ERA last era but pitched only 19 innings and had a walk rate of 8.1 per 9 innings. That ERA won’t last if he keeps walking that many.I understand the Marlins have a budget but I still think they should have done better. I’m not even sure if those two are worth just the draft picks alone that Uggla would have net the team.

Infante was worth 2.2 WAR in 04, the only other season in which he had more than 440 PA’s, last year he posted 2.9. Other than one down year in DET he’s prouduced well given limited AB’s. Uggla on the other hand was a 3.7 WAR. I wouldnt say he averages 3-4 WAR a year, if you take all five of his years he’s been worth 14.9 WAR, LESS than 3

Dan Uggla is no Matt Holliday. Holliday has posted 4 consecutive seasons superior to Uggla’s finest one. Holliday does not play horrible defense, either. It is true that the Rockies absolutely made off like bandits on that trade, though. Beane’s all-time worst.

No, it just isn’t very close.
Uggla has averaged less than 4 WAR per season since coming into the league. He is a fine hitter at a position where power is hard to come by, but that is offset by his very poor fielding. Scouting reports, UZR, the naked eye, etc. all confirm this.
To say Holliday hasn’t had one 30 HR season since leaving Coors is just to cherry pick a counting stat. Over the same 5 year period as Uggla’s career Matt has averaged an additional 2 WAR per season. 4 WAR players are very solid assets to a team. 6 WAR players are elite.

With a middle of the range payroll, Wren is stocking up on pitching…kinda like buying gold right now. Everything he does might not be perfect but he is definitely a hard worker and I think, like DOB, he should be the executive of the year.

mailing in next season, just waiting for the new comish to step in (soon right?) and end the missery that is the marlins ownership, those people dont deserve to own a team and that city does not deserve a team, either get them to sell and move it or contract the team and move them your self MLB…..i would bet we start to hear the hanley rumors with in the next 2 years same with josh johnson…

as a Braves fan, I sure hope you are right about hearing rumors of JJ and Hanley being moved in the next few years. I do not look forward to those guys coming to town ever. Leave my division and leave it fast!

as a Braves fan, I sure hope you are right about hearing rumors of JJ and Hanley being moved in the next few years. I do not look forward to those guys coming to town ever. Leave my division and leave it fast!

the problem is not the fans. we support the team, but refuse to support the ownership. that’s why the Marlins have one of the highest t.v. rating but attendance is so low….no one wants Loria to get any money.

because he isn’t expensive enough for the Angels.
they’d rather spend Moreno’s millions on a name, as in a Carl Crawford when they could have easily made a deal like the A’s did for David Dejesus — a similar enough player that would allow them to spread their money around
their all-in-for-one free agent signings haven’t added up to what they’ve been trying for, as in another WS
(in that respect they are still the old California Angels. ‘Sign Reggie! sign Baylor! sign any name!)

DeJesus is nothing like Crawford.In the last 4 years DeJesus has had ONE season with more than 3 WAR. Over that same time Crawford has gotten to 3 WAR or more in 3 years. The only season he didn’t was due to injuries. Crawford’s last two seasons were at 5.7 and 6.9 WAR. Crawford is elite, DeJesus is reliable. The Angels already have guys who could easily put up as good of numbers as DeJesus (Rivera and Abreu). What they are looking for is a true impact player.That said, I’m surprised that they couldn’t muster a deal better than what Florida accepted. I would have brought Uggla over, let him play for half a season and see how he does. If the AL suits him then you talk about his 5 year deal. If he is just OK – you let him walk and collect your draft picks. For $10m this year Uggla seems like a pretty safe bet.

I didn’t know that the asking price for a star second baseman within the division was a reliever and a utility player
wow
does this mean that teams can get josh johnson for a 4th outfielder and a middle of the rotation starter?

I wouldn’t want to extend him yet to be completely honest. He wants big bucks. I wanna see how he does in ATL before we give him fair FA market value on a contract. There is nothing wrong with letting him play the season, then extend him at fair value after the season, because you still have the opportunity to let him walk and take the draft picks if it doesn’t work out.

You understand there are pros and cons to this. Let him play out the season, have a monster season, and decline all extensions to test the FA waters. Give him an extension now at a good value, don’t worry about it in a year.

In my opinion there are absolutely no cons to not giving him an extension now.

He was demanding what he thought he could get as a FA with the Marlins. He is going to demand that from us. Why would you give that to him now as opposed to in 12 months after he has proved himself in ATL?

If he wants too much…he leaves, you get two draft picks, which in all likelihood will end up with more upside than what the Braves gave up to get him.

You shouldn’t be so sure that he will just explode in ATL. He could also turn in a pedestrian season that would lower his market value. That is the con to signing an extension now. The Braves have other players who, IMO, should be of much higher priority than Uggla as far as extensions go.

Dunn definitely doesn’t fit the profile of a LOOGY. He’s got a 95ish fastball and tends to be extremely wild (I’m not surprised the Braves sought to move him because having Dunn and Kimbrel in the same bullpen would have given Gonzalez ulcers by May). He’d be a good fantasy sleeper for 2011 as he could rack up a lot of saves if things break favorably for him (and not so favorably for Leo Nunez).

Andrus just finished his 21-year-old season. Most guys are working their way into the bigs at that point. He’s been a starter for two full years.

He’s got the tools to be the best defensive shortstop since Omar Vizquel and with a little base running work, he could easily swipe 40+ bags. Sure, he doesn’t hit for power and his on base skills are lacking, but, again, he just finished his 21-year-old season. Give him a break. Anyway, his .342 OBP in 2010 was above the league average (.335), and there’s certainly room to grow.

There is a difference in being an all-star on a team with Hamilton, Perez, Young, etc…and being an all-star on a team that can’t pitch, hit, run, field, lousy fundamentally, and the butt of many MLB jokes.

here’s the deal. Andrus fits in well with the Rangers because there are plenty of good bats in that lineup to help carry that offense. He gets on base, plays good D, and can run. His .643OPS wouldnt help ATL since they need offensive RH upgrades

Not sure if Wren was the GM then, but these complete steal of trades they have been pulling off the last few years seem to have made up for the Teixeira trade. Uggla, Jurrjens, Vazquez (even if it was only one year), and the trades to get rid of Francoeur and Escobar haven’t turned out poorly either.

Escobar for Gonzalez was terrible. Not saying Wren is a a bad GM, because I honestly don’t think that’s true, but Gonzalez is a barely above replacement level player who’s on the wrong side of the 30, and would probably benefit from pitch recognition lessons from Jeff Francouer he’s so awful. That for a player who lead the team in WAR the previous season, all because he was a “cancer”, a story that doesn’t seem corroborated anywhere except for Bobby Cox’s attitude, a 100 year old crone who doesn’t like anyone who doesn’t play baseball the “Bobby Cox way.”

Yeah, yeah. “But all the players gave Gonzalez a standing ovation hurr.” Maybe they were just welcoming a new player? What were they supposed to do? Hide in the dark and jump him when he walked in the locker room for the first time?

Although I personally wish they would do that, so that he couldn’t suck it up on the field any more than he already does.

I wasn’t taking in account who they got back in the Francoeur and Escobar trades, just saying that it was good that they got rid of Escobar’s attitude and Francoeur’s OBP. Although I agree that he should have gotton more for Escobar.In regards to the “cancer”, I don’t believe it was a “cancerous” attitude per se, but he did seem to dog it and not try sometimes, not quite Manny or Hanley Ramirez style, but he definitely could have given a lot more effort.

And I think Wren is actually one of the handful of good GMs in the league.

I didnt like the royals trade, but to be honest the jays trade didnt bother me that much, every time i saw escobar come to bat i wanted to punch him in the face. We got tim collins and pastornicky out of it (Though the ss isnt proven he was tearing up the afl, and we threw away the best part of that deal in collins to the royals) But Gonzalez could have hit 1 hr and still been better than what escobar was doing for us. It was obvious he didnt want to be in atl and nobody wanted him in atl.

good OBP and still a presence in the lineup. He needs to be in the two hole next season. Chipper was swinging the bat well when he got injured too. 1.304OPS in August. He may not officially be done just yet

Uggla and his agent should take notice of this. If this is all the Marlins could get out of him, it’s obvious no one sees him as a second baseman, and also no one believes he is worth the money he turned down from the Marlins. No one seen him as a long term solution. Still a nice deal for the Braves even as a 1 year rental.

Not so sure. The Marlins aren’t going to get a top prospect for one guaranteed year of Uggla’s services, and surely they don’t want to take on salary in the trade seeing that they’re planning to give Buck $6M a year. Two major-league-ready players is about what I’d expect them to get. In Infante, they’ve got a guy who’s earned the right to be an everyday 2B based on solid play at multiple positions over the last 3 seasons, and he’ll be affordable as a potential extension candidate for them after 2011. In Dunn, they’ve got a sleeper closer to more likely set-up guy with a 95 mph fastball and a wild streak that if tamed could yield big returns for several years at minimal cost.

And there are no guarantees with the free agent compensation. They’d only get the #16ish to #30+ish 1st round draft pick if the Uggla-signer finished in the top half of MLB teams in 2011 (and that team didn’t also sign a Type A with a higher ranking than Uggla). If a lower-finishing club signed him (or the higher finishing club also signed a Type A ranked higher than Uggla), then they’d just get a 2nd round pick (probably somewhere in the #70 to #90 overall range) to go along with their supplemental round selection.

Average attendance at PGE Park for Portland Beavers games was around 5,000. Hardly anyone shed a tear when the Beavers got kicked out in favor of MLS. I know you’re just saying the Marlins should move, but Portland can’t support Major League Baseball.

i always thought vancouver should have a team. baseball is huge there, only canadian teams that can keep up in the south. Its a pretty big and world class city.. it would take away from seattles fan base but meh

You’ve got to be kidding me! Not only shouldn’t we have traded him; but if we were going to, we sent him packing for OMAR INFANTE!?!?!? I am dumbfounded. Why? I WANT to be a Marlins fan, but I’m afraid that if I were to tell the Front Office that I want to be a fan, but I want the team to win, I might get traded to the Nationals for a jersey with “Natinals” written across the front.

The Jays couldn’t get Uggla, but after this trade, I think the Marlins might be dumb enough to give up Josh Johnson for a package of Jeremy Accardo and Miguel Olivo. Talk about highway robbery by the Braves. Good on em. The Marlins deserve to suck with moves this retarded.

So let see we get Uggla the best hitter on the fish.A guy who has alt of Power A guy who can hit 30 HR in a season and get over 100 RBI in season.For a guy in Omar a good Hitter But does not have the Kind of Power that Uggla has.Also Dunn a decent Pitcher. When he is on he was very good .But he was off he would give up runs walk runner etc.People have look back at the Tex trade and have said we gave up way too much.I think Fish fan if there is any Fish fans.Have to say to themselves our team trade away a great hitter and we got back not to much

It’s seriously hard to not continue to just keep bashing the Marlins organization over and over. I feel like the Sox could have said, “Hey, we’ll trade you back Andrew Miller and throw in season tickets to the Red Sox for 2011.” and the Marlins would have accepted.

im just throwing this out their….does this mean the price for middle infielders is lower than what we expect? maybe this knocks the price down a notch for guys like Kelly Johnson, Jose Reyes, Stephen Drew, etc. just a thought.

I doubt this has anything to do with the market. It’s just the Marlins GM being stupid. Does John Buck’s contract mean that catchers are hard to find? What about potential 5 tool CF’s since Maybin was traded for 2 relievers? Those CFer’s must grow on trees!

Infante is out of the picture with the draft picks since he wont be there after 2011, unless they give him a starting spot. More like 2 draft picks > than Dunn. IF Marlins can extend Infante, then the trade isn’t that bad.

Uggla doesn’t want to move. Braves want Uggla happy. Prado plays LF in Winter ball and can play LF, 1B, 2B, & 3B… so he will be moving around. If Uggla is in LF, then he’d be moving around between 3B, 2B, & LF. Prado is used to the utility-type.

Yeah and only a year before he was an All-Star, Infante was given to the Braves by the Cubs. Given away! Now they turn the coaches All-Star pick into a great option at 2nd base. I wonder if the Braves threw Uggla into a van with no windows and drove to the state line as fast as they could.

Horrible trade. Almost every other team in the majors could match that offer. Infante is a flash in the pan (though there is the Marlins leadoff hitter). Dunn has high upside, but he’s a reliever! Unbelievable. I liked their moves up to this point, but this is horrible. I like the arms they picked up, but not for the players they dealt (specifically Uggla, could care less about Maybin).

lmao love it. all and all i dont think this is terrible though. Uggla was looking at 10-12 mil arbitration, in lieu you have a solid catcher that is going to make you staff that much better (no lies jay fan here) he did very well with cecil romero and marcum. he is 6m infante 2.5 and Dunn under 1 – marlins get three needs filled and save some cash for hanley

nobody goes to see the Rays because they play in a covered cavern that’s about as appealing to look at as box/warehouse store
nobody goes to see the Marlins because they play in an outdoor cavern that’s about as appealing to baseball as holding the national bocce ball championships in new Yankee stadium

I guess the Blue Jays just couldn’t compete with this great offer. Marc Rzepczynski and JP Arencibia, and (insert minor prospect) just doesn’t give you the same return of Infante and Dunn. One Marlins fan said it would take Drabek. What a laugh.

This trade isn’t as bad as it seems at face value. The Marlins have a need for bullpen help, they’re filling that need. The Marlins also have a full season of Stanton coming in full force, power isn’t an issue. They acquire a better fielder and a guy that’s going to get on base for Ramirez, Stanton, and Morrison. He likely will bat leadoff, which was also a need that had to be filled. If Infante can replicate last season this is a great trade for both teams.

I’m not unhappy about the trade, I’m just surprised they traded him in the NL East.

think cogz will lead off, but your post is pretty rational. with dominguez taking third, infante at second, our defense will be a ton better. just need morrison and stanton to step up, along with hanley. but, look what happened to cogz last year. it isn’t for sure that stanton or morrison will bat well.

Cogs seemed to be snapping out of it before he was injured. He started the season batting less than .200, but was rounding out at .268 before he was hurt. He’s got the patience for leading off but Infante I think is likely a better overall leadoff hitter. I can see the lineup looking something like: Infante, Cogs, Morrison, Ramirez, Stanton, Sanchez. If they all are playing that their potential that’s a great start to a lineup.

Your argument hinges on the notion that Infante will replicate last season. Uggla is much more likely to produce than Infante, simply because Uggla has proven it year-in-year-out, while Infante could very well just be a flash in the pan.

And I’m not buying the reliever business. They’re cheap, and trading elite offensive production for them just doesn’t make sense.

The trade is full of fail precisely because Uggla should have brought back a much better return.

Hence the statement IF Infante can replicate last season. I didn’t say “He’s going to bat .300+ next season!”. He’s showed he can do it, now he needs to do it again. He’s a plus defender over Uggla and so long as he’s getting on base this trade is not a problem for me. And you can not buy the reliever business all you want, but check out the Marlins bullpen last season. Clearly the weakest link in the team.A guy that’s going into his last year of arbitration is not going to yield a high return, why doesn’t anyone understand this? The Marlins offered him 48 million, that’s not being cheap.

The Marlins obviously admitted this week that they got nothing for Cabrera and Willis. But as for Uggla, they get a good defensive 2nd baseman that can bat leadoff and a bullpen arm. They’re filling the needs of the organization. Uggla was not needed, but a bullpen arm and a leadoff hitter were. As for Ross, they were able to save a million dollars and gave Maybin the final chance he needed to prove he didn’t belong.

ummm …so the marlins just admitted what the rest of the universe has known
for a couple of years?
the problem with this trade is they essentially swapped a guy under control
for one more year…for another guy in control for one more year…and a
middle reliever….

ur no where near contending…so we know uggla was not needed…what was
needed was some common sense in getting back some value for uggla. one day
people are talking about KYLE DRABEK..who by himself has more value than
infante or dunn…the next thing u know u give up dunn for a gallon of milk
about to expire in 2 days.

u gave up Ross to save a million bucks !?!?

u just committed 18 million to John Buck….

WTF ?!!?

thats like giving up your washing machine to save on electricity than going
out and buying an XBOX with your savings…
lmaooo

So saving money to reinvest is failure? Take an economics class, for real. The Marlins fell out of contention last season and they let Ross walk to give Maybin his chance. The Ross ‘deal’ had 2 positives for the team, save a million and watch Maybin fail. Without that Maybin is likely the opening day CF because he’s out of options this season, so they club would have risked losing him for nothing if he was claimed. Could they have traded Ross before the deadline and got a deal? Sure, but the Marlins went on a hot streak and the organization let it be known that they were keeping the players unless they fell out of the race… and they did. It was clear that Ross wasn’t staying, all Marlin fans knew this. The organization made it clear every season that “Maybin was the future”. They held onto Cameron for too long, IMO.. he never showed signs of life for the Marlins. Can you blame them though? Cabrera/Willis for 2 total busts… they obviously wanted to give him as many chances as they could.

And as for Infante/Uggla.. how can anyone seriously blame the Marlins for this? They offered Uggla a fair deal and he declined. He’s replaceable. Infante isn’t going to his 30 HRs, but he likely is going to be a solid leadoff guy and a plus defender. What’s the problem?

u call giving John Buck 18 million dollars an “investment” ?!!?and I’m the one who needs an economic class?!! lolplease dont tell me u work for a brokerage firm…but if u do, tell me which one so i know who NOT to give my money to……175 AB in 09 and 291 AB in 2010 is a good enough sample size to judge any 22 year old CF prospect…they gave Maybin all the rope in the world…smh

So saving money to reinvest is failure? Take an economics class, for real. The Marlins fell out of contention last season and they let Ross walk to give Maybin his chance. The Ross ‘deal’ had 2 positives for the team, save a million and watch Maybin fail. Without that Maybin is likely the opening day CF because he’s out of options this season, so they club would have risked losing him for nothing if he was claimed. Could they have traded Ross before the deadline and got a deal? Sure, but the Marlins went on a hot streak and the organization let it be known that they were keeping the players unless they fell out of the race… and they did. It was clear that Ross wasn’t staying, all Marlin fans knew this. The organization made it clear every season that “Maybin was the future”. They held onto Cameron for too long, IMO.. he never showed signs of life for the Marlins. Can you blame them though? Cabrera/Willis for 2 total busts… they obviously wanted to give him as many chances as they could.

And as for Infante/Uggla.. how can anyone seriously blame the Marlins for this? They offered Uggla a fair deal and he declined. He’s replaceable. Infante isn’t going to his 30 HRs, but he likely is going to be a solid leadoff guy and a plus defender. What’s the problem?

I can’t wait for this press release. “It was tough to lose Dan Uggla but anytime you have a chance to acquire an ALL-STAR, you do it. Omar Infante is a WINNING player that will bring PLAYOFF EXPERIENCE and a WINNING attitude to our club. ALL-STAR.”

“Beinfest said on Saturday night that the team has already asked Coghlan to be ready to take fly balls in center field when Spring Training gets under way.” I think it depends on what happens in center.

I would have been so… Well I wouldn’t have been kind to someone that predicted this as the trade that got Uggla because it’s just so… Wrong. I love Infante more than the next guy, but we just traded our really good UTILITY player and 4 or 5 years of a high strikeout, high walk lefty reliever for one year of one of the top hitting 2B in the league. From a division rival. This just flat out doesn’t make sense for the Marlins. If this is all you’re getting why not just keep him?

Embarrassing day to be a Marlins fan. I have no idea how justify this deal. Sure he’s a free agent in a year but he’s also very likely a top five-seven free agent in the offseason and it’s a very good chance that both those picks end up in the 15-40 range. That is definitely worth more than Omar Infante and Mike Dunn

I think the most frustrating aspect of this deal is the baffling urgency to move him, can’t they wait a month a let a market develop and consider their options?

The Braves are thinking about the FUTURE! Think about Chipper is done after one more year. Put Prado on 3rd and Uggla on 2nd and then you don’t have to worry about spending big either through trade or free agency on Left Fielder. Clearly a brilliant move by Wren.

Apparently I’m the only one who likes this deal for the Marlins. They swap likely Type A free agents, replace Uggla at 2B with a superior fielder with a manageable bat, improve the bullpen and get Buck at catcher with the leftover money. Two positions and a reasonable bullpen piece filled in one deal for a guy who’s gone at the end of the year. Not saying it’s a clear win over Atl, just that the they benefit from it.

The Marlins could benefit from this, but not too much. The Fish did clear up money for Buck, but it’s not guarenteed that they’ll get him. The Braves will definitely find Uggla’s hitting abilities pleasing. Plus now the Braves fill their third base hole, with Prado moving over to 3B.

as a Mets fan I’m going to say…fudge…. and to the stat nerds who say he’s the worst fielder in the world; watch a few games..he makes some bonehead plays for sure, but he also makes some highlight reel plays that don’t compute in your saber-calculators. all things considered he evens out to a slightly below average fielder.

not sure what qualifies as a “perfect” possbility, but field position is yet another variable that escapes the all-knowing grasp of advanced metrics. Uggla is by no means a great fielder but I think it’s overstating it to call him a defensive liability…

I’m surprised the Mets didn’t try to get in on this with a better offer. Two reasons:1. They don’t want the Braves to improve, and Uggla will probably help them.2. Any change at second base would make Met fans happy. Luis Castillo, fairly or not, has become the symbol of every failure Omar Minaya ever had.

Then again, I don’t know if the Marlins front office has something against the Mets. It seems most of the team does – although I don’t know why.

I can’t believe the Rockies couldn’t beat this offer. Seriously frustrated with O’Dowds blinders, always thinking his players are better than the ones out there. Would Franklin Morales and Eric Young Jr gotten this deal done?

Awesome move for the Bravos. Leaves prospects to hopefully target Justin Upton, but who knows. Wren can be brilliant or retarded on any given day. I think this has more to do with the Marlins front brass being ‘less than smart’

Honestly, I was upset about Uggla being traded, but you know what – he wants a 5-year $71M contract – good luck with that! He originally wanted a 5-year $58M contract and now wants $13M more?!? He is a decent contact hitter, with great power, but his defense is extremely poor… I feel bad for any team that will be willing to give him $71M… I’m happy that we got Infante and Dunn – even though Infante doesn’t have much power, he’ll get on base… And Dunn will be very valuable in our pen… Plus we got John Buck, who had a career year last year – and hopefully he’ll continue doing well for us… Sorry your ego got too big for you Uggs – good luck to him & the Braves… Go Fish!!!

If infante’s season was not a fluke, I feel it was an even trade. Uggla could become a free agent after next year, while the Fish filled two holes. Infante was a good player this year, not the slugger Uggla is, but defensively he was much superior. Young lefties don’t come around very often, and the Marlins control him for years to come. The Braves will have to re-sign Uggla for it to have been worth it.

Infante proved last year he can play everyday. And Dunn is good against lefties.

Fish obviously needed to improve the ‘pen and they feel as though they can contend in ’11 and ’12.

They didn’t want to get just prospects (and it’s not like they would have gotten A+ prospects for one year of Uggla) as they are moving into their new stadium in 2012 and want players that will help the team win now.

Please explain to me why they wouldn’t have gotten at least one A+prospect in return for a 2B who gives you 30 hrs a year? And by 2012 will Infante even be with the team? Infante was the epitome of a guy who had a career year. Who knows what he will give you next year?

True, but middle relief is easy to find. I would think either Teheran or Vizcaino would’ve filled a bigger need on the Marlins than Dunn and it would not have been out of line to ask for either. No problem with Infante, even if he comes back to Earth, he is still a better glove than Uggla and he will be a good table-setter for Ramirez, Stanton and Morrison.

LOL at getting Julio Teheran for one year of Dan Uggla!!! You MIGHT get Teheran for Mike Stanton. I was arguing with Marlin fans yesterday that said that they wanted a lot more than the Vizcaino/Bethancourt/Marek estimate of what I thought it would take to make the trade. In the end, my proposal was actually way too much. Teams will not get much for rental players these days.

As for Infante, he was a fan favorite. He plays hard every day. But, he is no defensive whiz. His best postion is 2B but keep him there. He is brutal at 3B, OF or SS. He will hit close to .300 without much power or speed.

Just because Infante has been a bench-utility player for some years it does not mean he can’t play regular.. He did play regular with the Braves for a loong time (even qualifying for the batting championship with 506 plate appearances) and he could do it with any team because he IS very good!

I still believe that the Braves just robbed the Marlins, but i think it is unfair to say that Infante sucks or that he is “a bench player” when he was a very important player for the Braves last year! It hurts to see him go away but man.. Uggla is great 😛 and Mike Dunn is easily replaceable

I agree with the first part, but the second is up for debate.IIRC, Uggla was about 4 WAR last year and Infante probably projects to 2 WAR, so the difference is actually rather small. You can throw out the reliever and just say 0 WAR, but Buck may be able to make up the 2-2.5 WAR difference, and in the process, the Fish save themselves around 4 million.Another thing to consider is that maybe Bienfeist sees more upside in Infante, even though he has been a productive player for 2-3 years now. He is moving into his prime, so it’s not out of the question. If Bienfeist senses this, I would give him the benefit of the doubt on this one in light of his previous track record. Omar may just turn out to be even better next year.Of course I could be completely wrong about all of this, since I’m to lazy to go to B-ref and look at the numbers.

Edit: One more thing. Uggla plays a position which is notorious for early burn-outs by star players, and he is either 31 or is going to be 31 next year. This may be a case where the Fish decided that he is on his way down, and suckered ATL into a deal. Not likely, just sayin’

Wow…..I didn’t bother to read thru the previous 4 pages of comments. I just now heard of the deal. All I can say is……The Marlins are on crack. I searched for the players going back to FLorida and when I saw Omar Infante and Mike Dunn I suddenly was reminded of the movie “Menace II Society” when O-Dog was talking to the crack head. The crack head didn’t have money to pay for the crack so he offered him some cheeseburgers and some “extras”. How in the world does Loria justify trading Uggla, an all-star caliber 30 hr a year 2B for a super utility guy and an unproven lefty relief pitcher w/ control issues? There should be riots in the streets of Miami right now. What a joke of an organization. I can understand the need to trade him but they couldn’t coax more out of teams than this? I hope there’s a PTBNL.

The same way the Yankees justify paying Burnett $16.5 million (the same can be said about most of the Yankees, actually). It’s easy to talk about other organizations when yours throws money away to cover up problems.

I suppose the justification would sound something like “We really wanted to keep Uggla, we offered him what we felt was a fair deal and he declined. We didn’t let that get in our way and we contented to negotiate with him, offering more money. He declined all offers. It became clear that Dan’s talents could be used to help fill the needs of the ball team for the upcoming season. We have acquired a lefty reliever and a plus defender/leadoff hitter in exchange for Dan, who is entering into his final year of arbitration. As a player entering into his final year of arbitration, it often becomes an issue acquiring the full worth of a player. There is no guarantee that said player will resign with the team he’s been traded to, he is often considered to be a rented player.”

Just for those who didn’t realize it but Infante is also a free agent next year. I guess(but am very unsure) that depending on what position Omar is listed as that he could be a potential Type A next year as well.

I say this as an O’s fan that I am glad another good hitter isn’t joining the AL East but the Jays definitely could have made a better offer. I know another HR hitter isn’t a need but OBP is and when you have a lineup that is very close to competing you should make this move. If the Yank’s don’t get Lee then this division/wild card spot are very attainable.

Uggla needed to be moved – it was clear he had no interest in coming back to Florida and it’s irresponsible to offer him a 5 year deal at that kind of money. It’s too bad the Marlins didn’t get a lot back, but they have done a decent job with these moves fixing their greatest weakness last year by upgrading the bullpen

This deal is so bad it could change the lexicon of sports talk. “I was just Wren’ed” or “I just pulled a Wren on someone”. It can go to discuss a really good deal (Uggla for junk) or a really bad one (Feliz, Andrus, Salty for Tex). Sort of like “Aloha”. It can mean one thing or it’s opposite.

Actually, since he is moving into his prime, it is a contract year for him, AND he hit like a maniac last season while doing everything but sell programs, yes. Wouldn’t be surprised if he had a career year.

How often do you see a utility guy with over 500 PA and a .321 avg. (3rd in the NLK BTW)? The guy has been a productive player for 3 years now and is really coming into his own.

Actually, since he is moving into his prime, it is a contract year for him, AND he hit like a maniac last season while doing everything but sell programs, yes. Wouldn’t be surprised if he had a career year.

How often do you see a utility guy with over 500 PA and a .321 avg. (3rd in the NLK BTW)? The guy has been a productive player for 3 years now and is really coming into his own.

Can we please stop using WAR in an apples and orange comparison. Brett Gardner had a 5.4 WAR and Joe Mauer had a 5.1. Does it mean Gardner is more valuable to a team than Mauer? Of course not.

Dan Uggla was an all-star. What’s one way I know the Marlins valued him as such? They were willing to pay him 4/$48? Suddenly it becomes obvious Uggla wants more $$$ or years than they are willing to spend so they trade him for a 29 yo career super utility player who just came off of a career year and an unproven lefty relief pitcher who has a history of walking too many batters. You can certainly make the case that Infante might be an upgrade at 2B but that isn’t the issue. The issue SHOULD be maximizing the value that you get for a HUGE commodity like a power hitting 2B like Uggla. Uggla should’ve easily netted 1 top 50 prospect along with 2 bottom 10 organizational prospects whom the Marlins would have for 6 years of control. Instead they have Dunn and a 29 yo INF who will be a FA in 2 years. I just can’t believe that with 3 1/2 months left before ST that they could not have gotten better offers from 5-7 other teams.

So how should we compare them? First of all, Uggla was voted into the All-Star game by the fans, which I don’t see as much of an endorsement. Second, run prevention is just as important as run production. Otherwise no one would pay so much money for pitching. Third, Uggla is 31 years old, playing a position that has burned out much better players than him. If he stays at 2B, he likely will decline very rapidly in his 33-35 playing years. Infante is 28 (29?) and his numbers have been steadily trending upward for three seasons. Uggla’s numbers, which are very good, have nonetheless been fairly stagnant for the last three. He has hit his peak, while Infante may yet have another gear. Notice I didn’t say that Infante is going to crack 30 dongs next year, but there is a good chance that he can post even better numbers, while still providing stellar run-prevention. With Uggla, what you see is what you get, and now that he’s getting older, maybe less.When it comes to organizational control, it is likely that Uggla is a one year rental for the Braves, due to his salary demands. Infante is also in a salary-drive year, but is eminently more signable by a small-market team like the Marlins. Also, if there is a reason to move either player at the deadline, the Braves will likely have to eat some salary to get any worth for Uggla, while the Marlins will get good value for Infante, without the extra payout.As far as Dunn goes, he is a young BP arm with upside. Yes, he walks too many batters, but so does just about every other young pitcher. He also has huge K/9 numbers. He has the talent to excel at the ML level. He just needs the work. And with 5 years of cost control, the Marlins have ample time to figure out if he will work out or not.As far as Mauer v. Gardner goes, I don’t know where you found your numbers but this is what I found on BB-ref:Mauer – 5.6 WAR in 2010. It was an off year for him, since he posted mid 7’s the two previous years.Gardner – 4.0 WAR in 2010. It was a breakout year for him, since in the previous two years his WAR values 2.6 and -0.1.So you are right. Gardner is nowhere near as valuable as Mauer, not even when Mauer has an off year. Probably never will be either, unless Mauer’s career is cut short.So in the end, the difference in WAR was less than half a run. One side got a little more defense in the deal, and one a little power. The both had to give to get, but it looks like the Marlins retained more flexibility down the road, so I’m gonna call this deal a wash, with maybe a slight advantage to the Marlins.

According to fangraphs Gardner was a 5.4 WAR in 2010 and Mauer was a 5.1. Feel free to look it up. The point is, and I can do this w/ others, WAR is a good tool to use in an apples to apples comparison. Use it among players at different positions and it’s simply not useful at all.

-“First of all, Uggla was voted into the All-Star game by the fans, which I don’t see as much of an endorsement”.- Just using his resume and the fact they were willing to pay him like an all-star to show how he is valued vs what they got in return.

-“Second, run prevention is just as important as run production. Otherwise no one would pay so much money for pitching”.

I agree run prevention is important. However, Uggla’s enourmous offensive ability at 2B compensates for his defense. Infante’s glove and mediocre bat are not enough.

-“Third, Uggla is 31 years old, playing a position that has burned out much better players than him. If he stays at 2B, he likely will decline very rapidly in his 33-35 playing years. Infante is 28 (29?) and his numbers have been steadily trending upward for three seasons. Uggla’s numbers, which are very good, have nonetheless been fairly stagnant for the last three. He has hit his peak, while Infante may yet have another gear. Notice I didn’t say that Infante is going to crack 30 dongs next year, but there is a good chance that he can post even better numbers, while still providing stellar run-prevention. With Uggla, what you see is what you get, and now that he’s getting older, maybe less”.

Who cares what he does at age 33-35? First off, the Marlins didn’t seem to be too concerned w/ his age since they offered him a 4 year deal. My issue isn’t the fact that they traded him. It’s that they simply didn’t get anywhere near enough in return. Therefore what he does at age 33-35 is someone elses concern. And even the Braves right now are not looking past what he will do in 2011 and 2012.

You say that Uggla’s last 3 years have been stagnant but others would see it as 3 consistant all-star caliber years w/ 31 hrs, .265/.360 production from a 2B.

Infante’s greatest asset is his versatility. You make him an everday player at 1 position and suddenly he isn’t as special anymore.

-“When it comes to organizational control, it is likely that Uggla is a one year rental for the Braves, due to his salary demands. Infante is also in a salary-drive year, but is eminently more signable by a small-market team like the Marlins. Also, if there is a reason to move either player at the deadline, the Braves will likely have to eat some salary to get any worth for Uggla, while the Marlins will get good value for Infante, without the extra payout”.

As long as Uggla is hitting 30 hrs as a 2B he WILL NOT be difficult to move. He made $7.8 mil this year. Maybe thru arb he’ll make $10 mil? I doubt the Marlins would have to eat much and whatever they did eat, it would help them get better prospects in return.

Can we please stop using WAR in an apples and orange comparison. Brett Gardner had a 5.4 WAR and Joe Mauer had a 5.1. Does it mean Gardner is more valuable to a team than Mauer? Of course not.

Dan Uggla was an all-star. What’s one way I know the Marlins valued him as such? They were willing to pay him 4/$48? Suddenly it becomes obvious Uggla wants more $$$ or years than they are willing to spend so they trade him for a 29 yo career super utility player who just came off of a career year and an unproven lefty relief pitcher who has a history of walking too many batters. You can certainly make the case that Infante might be an upgrade at 2B but that isn’t the issue. The issue SHOULD be maximizing the value that you get for a HUGE commodity like a power hitting 2B like Uggla. Uggla should’ve easily netted 1 top 50 prospect along with 2 bottom 10 organizational prospects whom the Marlins would have for 6 years of control. Instead they have Dunn and a 29 yo INF who will be a FA in 2 years. I just can’t believe that with 3 1/2 months left before ST that they could not have gotten better offers from 5-7 other teams.

Prado/Heyward/Jones/Uggla/McCann would be my bet. R/L/S/R/L That’s a pretty magnificent to exhaust bullpens. and with Gonzo, Freeman, and McLouth at the end?
R/L/S/R/L/R/L/L. Our offense is looking magnificent, too bad our defense is now going to be absolutely horrendous behind Venters, Hudson, Hanson, Moylan and any other groundball pitchers we acquire.

I would switch Chipper and Heyward at this point in Chipper’s career. Heyward has MASSIVE power hitting potential, I think he would be best utilized batting in the heart of the order. But I can understand you’re argument for 2nd, his OBP was also remarkable for a rookie, so pitchers clearly already fear him.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the Braves trade for a defensive type CF who can hit lead-off and possibly platoon with McLouth. Someone like Rajai Davis or Tony Gwynn. In any event, Chipper needs to be moved from the #3 spot in the order.

I doubt Fredi has the guts to move Chipper down that far but I think that would be the best batting order. You have the best three power hitters on the team sandwiched between two guys who will have good averages, good OBP plus a little power.

Marlin’s trying to mimic the giants. Not as concerned with the hitting, but improve fielding and fix up that bullpen. Now they have gotten 4 more arms in a few days for their bullpen and a replacement second baseman. If they can hold teams down a tad with their middle relief they should improve. They spend no money. On the other hand, Uggla was a great move for the Braves.

I have seen a lot of pro-Marlin arguments here (saying that the deal was even), a lot more than I expected, actually (I was prepared to see a lot of jokes, lol), but I think what a lot of people are forgetting is that this was an intra-division trade. They just traded one of the top 2B in the league to a fellow division team. That, alone, makes this a bad trade for FLA.

Besides that… I liked Dunn, and Omar was great this year, but as said, Omar most likely just had his best season, and Dunn has control issues. One year rental of a top 5 2B vs. a make-or-break arm and a utility man? I’d take the Braves side any time.

it was the best trade Wren has made as a GM, i woudnt say its even because Omar will not have another year like 2010, Dunn is good but we have lefties Venters and O Flaherty in the pen that’s why we traded Dunn.

right now i would get Scott Podsednik to play CF and leadoff, we need speed a top the lineup and he’s cheap and get a veteran righty reliever like Kevin Gregg or Kerry Wood but dont know how expensive they would be, maybe Manny Corpas, Dan Wheeler or JJ Putz

right now i would get Scott Podsednik to play CF and leadoff, we need speed a top the lineup and he’s cheap and get a veteran righty reliever like Kevin Gregg or Kerry Wood but dont know how expensive they would be, maybe Manny Corpas, Dan Wheeler or JJ Putz

Yes it would take that much. Justin Upton has put up almost 8 WAR in his first 3 seasons. He has top 10 trade value in the entire league. But I digress… Keep thinking that because you fleeced one crapp GM, you’ll fleece another with fantasy baseball trades.

yes it would take that much. It might take more. Uptons younger than most of the prospects in your system already. Hes got 5 more affordable years. I cant think of many hitters with more value them him.

It would absolutely take that much, and maybe more, to get Upton. Upton’s signed for five more years for $49.5 million. Total bargain. Dealing for Upton will be ten times harder than trying to pry Adrian Gonzalez away from the Pads last season; Gonzo was only under the Pads control for two more seasons.

You don’t get a stud OF who is under a team-friendly five-year deal by giving up anything less than Prado, Teheran, Delgado, and probably Freeeman as well (although I think the D-Backs have a stud 1B in the pipeline, so they may not be as interested in Freeman).

It makes as much sense as it did the first two times they had a fire sale. Trade expensive players for players that are under control for longer periods of time. What;s the worst that could happen? You get 3,000 “fans” booing you at home games?

Crappy GM? The Marlins consistently do more with less than any other team in baseball. Piss on the owners and the lack of fan support all you want but the guys running the ship do an amazing job maximizing their resources.

Isn’t that the thing though? EVERY deal has to be looked at in payroll perspective, doesn’t it? The Marlins aren’t the Yankees and they have to budget. They lose the best player in the deal, obviously, but they’re probably a better team for it.

Buck is a good pick, but they need to sign a quality closer. Soriano, or Wood whoever of those two would be great. Wood is cheaper. But if they continue with they’re plan to play Coghlan in CF, I don’t see them winning the East. If they play Coghlan at 2B, Infante at 3B, and Scott Cousins in CF, I like they’re chances.

They’re most able because they have a RETARDED amount of pitching depth in the minors.Wait a second… I’m missing something here… don’t the Dbacks have a serious problem… what is it again?Oh yeah, they literally have zero pitching. Seems as though the Dbacks might be interested to improve their by far league-worst bullpen from last year.

They easily could have gotten an mlb ready catching prospect in exchange for ugglaThat would have saved them the money on Uggla and the ridiculously overpayment for buck. then they could have signed a loogy and back up infielder on the market for 2-3 mil a piece.No matter how you slice it, this was a poor deal

Yanks have just petitioned to have part of their revenue sharing and luxury tax money earmarked for the Marlins returned and redistributed to the other small market teams that actually care.

Ok, I was joking. I know they offered Uggs 4/48. However, they could have easily have gotten some decent prospects in return for lge minimum salary.AA in Toronto has to be sitting their dumfounded saying “B….But…but I would have given them more than that. How come they didn’t ask me first?”

Upton is def an elite talent and make no mistake, the Braves need a player just like him on their team, but trading away a top notch pitching prospect like Teheran for Justin Upton would be regrettable

As a braves fan i would tell you i would do it, but you must understand how braves fans are, its rare a 19 year old phenom just falls into your lap and is a projected #1 starter.. People were saying they wouldnt trade teheran for braun…….