This is what I've seen as a newer member of the DCI fandom: they tend to perform shows that will be very appealing to the judges, but not necessarily to the fans. So naturally, people prefer a show they can get behind. And because this is the internet, they exaggerate their opinion of "not my favorite corps" to "OMG BD SUX SO MUCH I HATE THEM!"

It's not completely their fault though. It's the way DCI judges. The system seems to be catered towards technical proficiency and not as much towards crowd connection and general entertainment value. If they did it the opposite way, or more balanced(as they do sometimes), less clean but more entertaining shows would win (e.g. Spartacus, Angels and Demons recently).
At the base, though, drum corps is a sport. Therefore, it is competitive. BD does what it does and wins. If the system somehow changed and they started losing because more audience oriented shows were winning consistently, I'd be damned if they didn't change their style to be more crowd friendly.

It seems to me that these people are hating BD only for the shows of the last few years. If people are hating a corps just for what they've done in the last 5 years, and not looking at what they have done for the last 50 years, or 40 in DCI, it is ridiculous. The shows fo the 90s are absolutely amazing.

I also don't understand how anyone can hate a corps. I know after marching how hard everyone works, and it pisses me off to see people hate a corps for the show design, and apply it to the whole corps.

I've been a drum corps fan since the late 1980s. I was never a BD fan until the past 3 or 4 years. Just didn't like their shows. Not sure what it was about shows like Burt Bacharach and Dada that changed my mind, but something did. Now I'm a big fan.

For the record I was a Madison Scouts, Phantom, and Crossmen fan. Still am, too!

There is the standard argument saying "their shows don't cater to entertainment" and although that is true, no one in the top six caters shows to the audience. It just happens that other corps current styles tend to work better with crowd entertainment. But another issue people have with BD nowadays is the dramatic change in style that has occurred over the last decade. At the beginning of the decade, BD was known as the screeching high trumpet, jazz playing ensemble. From their "Edge of Absurdity" show and on, they have turned into the esoteric, do ridiculously hard stuff (while sitting on chairs) group. This is what I like to call the old timmer argument.

This is where people are probably going to start getting pissed at me. In the last half of this decade, BD's staff (and many other people involved with the organization) have been growing increasingly cocky. Cocky to the point that some feel the ground they step on is holy. There are few people in the activity, outside of guard caption heads, who are as cocky as anyone in BD. This is coming from many people's opinions in the activity such as judges and corps staff.

This is where things start being conjecture. Many people in the activity see a huge amount of bias in favor of BD when it comes to judging. These people feel this so strongly that they can call if BD will win as soon as the finals panel comes out. It makes sense in many ways too. BD commonly score a statistically large amount lower in semis compared to finals. Sometimes so much that they loose a lot more captions compared to their finals score. This is not just because of a better performance. And my personal opinion on the matter; the lack of simultaneous responsibility in their designs makes it hard to believe that they win the amount of championships they do.

Edit: I will say they are absolutely amazing to watch, especially in the lot.

I hate to bash on BD because they're just so freaking talented. But at the same time, who makes promotional videos for the corps with phrases such as an "undefeated season" or that they need redemption after coming in second at finals in 2011? I think this is where most of the loathing/hate of BD comes from.

There is the standard argument saying "their shows don't cater to entertainment" and although that is true, no one in the top six caters shows to the audience.

This is not true. I can't speak for any corps but my own, of course, but connection with the audience is constantly emphasized at Crown, from the top designers all the way down through nitty-gritty of the performance.

I don't find the shows that they put together entertaining. Instead of enjoying a show based of it's music and drill, I get caught up and distracted by the use of props on the field. When the only thing I can remember about a show is the use of sticks, chairs, mirrors, boxes, or horses instead of the music, I personally am not going to have a good time.

Yes. Really. Not a day went by that you didn't hear blah blah, fuck BDB. It's silly, because they're the B corps. They're not going anywhere and they're the feeder corps for BD. I'm not a fan of BD but I'm not gonna lash out at their b corps because they win all the time...it does get old, but it is what it is.

Fan since 2006, here's my two cents. After being unconvinced of 2009 BD's "1930" show being as high of a scoring show as it was, I took to a forum after finals to see what the reaction of other fans was, I stumbled upon a post where someone had actually timed how long each of the top 3-4 corps' brass were playing during their show.
Carolina Crown was top dog (I haven't seen any timings since but I would believe it if they were at the top of that list nearly every year), Holy Name Cadets (as they were known for that year) and Cavies were not far behind Crown (within 30 sec), but BD's brass played a full 90-120 seconds less IIRC. I can't seem to find the post to verify though. If anyone can find it let me know.
From personal observation, BD do some really challenging music, and they always perform it spectacularly well. However, they also do a LOT of park and play. Sometimes the music/visuals are entertaining enough to distract from that fact, in recent years it just hasn't been. Some of their show themes are strong enough, but they just don't tell the story well or don't tell a specific story at all (eg "1930" IMO.) Others they have a weak/confusing/not-fan-friendly theme ("Through a Glass, Darkly" & "Cabaret Voltaire" come to mind) but try to make up with good music.
Now that being said, 2007 BD's "Winged Victory" is my absolute favorite show from any corps (despite being a huge Crown supporter), and I also really enjoyed "The Godfather: Part Blue." "Through a Glass, Darkly" took the whole season to grow on me, and I was really never impressed with "Cabaret Voltaire" or "The Beat My Heart Skipped."

This is similar to my primary complaint of the drumline too. When they play, they are playing some amazing parts and executing them well. But it's when they play. I remember timing the amount of time the battery played a few years ago, and it was in the neighborhood of 5 minutes. I know the pit is playing during many of those downtimes, but the battery would not play for minutes at a time.

Their players are as good or better than most of the top lines, so it's not an issue with their members. It's a choice of the show designers that they are playing so little during the show. And there are no negative repercussions to playing "less" than other corps.

They put the guard out front to make it more like a WGI show and then cut the battery and hornline books. This is my complaint.

If I might share my opinion, it might help a bit. I marched for 4 years, at both the div 2 (open) and div 1 (world) level, and have ALWAYS been a fan of the Blue Devils.

I spent a lot of my drum corps career fighting a good deal of cognitive dissonance. I've never been a fan of the styles of the old generation. I've heard stories of corps using excessive physical punishment in the 70s and 80s. My brass caption head at one corps used to tell us about how people WANTED the 3rd soprano part because those were the guys who were called on to punish anyone who stepped out of line. Let's face it, our activity came from the military, and there's a very long history of old-timers who are hard-asses and think that the best way to make anything better is through punishment. I've run 100s of miles over the years for missing my dot, playing notes wrong, being late to horn arc, missing releases, not dressing forms, being out of bed after lights out and myriad of other relatively minor infractions. I've found over the years that the people who support this type of instruction also tend to be the folks who don't like drum corps such as BD.

The Blue Devils always get crap for things like smoking in uniform, not caring about history and tradition, playing music that's "cool" in the lowest common denominator and other things that don't fall in line with the old traditions of drum corps. Old-school drum corps are resistant to change, and their old-school mentality clashes with the attitudes of a lot of folks from BD. Let's face it, the musicians at BD are DAMN good, and the drill-sergeant mentality just doesn't matter much to a corps like that.

In some corps, if you make a mistake it equals laps, or push-ups, or some other corporal punishment. In some corps (like BD) if you make a musical error, the punishment is practicing that music until it's right.

Keep in mind, my explanation is completely anecdotal and only a generalization. I'm sure that BD members are often corporally punished, but not to the extent of a corps like the Cadets.

The Cadets are to the Yankees, as BD is to the Red Sox. The Yankees boast of professionalism, and class with rules like 'No Long Hair'. Both the Cadets and the Yankees require hair to be cut short, and not hang down onto the uniform. Groups like BD are thinking, "What the hell does the length of my hair have to do with my performance?" The Red Sox of 2004 (world champions) were called 'The Idiots' because they ignored the traditional stereotype of baseball players and just were themselves. The Yankees/Cadets claim tradition, and honor, and history while the Red Sox/BD claim pragmatism, value and efficiency.

EDIT: I just realized it seems like I hate the Cadets. For the record, I also really like the Cadets. I just think they make a great opposition to a lot of the mannerisms of BD.

EDIT: Sorry, I don't actually have evidence that anyone from BD has ever smoked in uniform. I have heard lots of people say that they've seen it.

EDIT: People seem to not understand what corporal punishment is. It isn't just hitting someone. Any punishment meant to cause physical harm or discomfort is corporal punishment. Running, push-ups, sit-ups or anything else like that is considered corporal punishment.

You're telling me no one has ever had to run as punishment? Or push-ups?

The UN defines corporal punishment as "any punishment in which physical force is used and intended to cause some degree of pain or discomfort, however light." Every single corps does this to varying degrees.

I never saw it. There were times when we'd come back from meals moving too slowly and they'd have us take a lap or two, but that was more 'take a second to get your body/mind back in the right place' rather than 'you guys are being shitheads and I'm going to make you hurt'.

Of course, that was just my experience being in one section for one year. Perhaps things were different back in the day. The cadets earned their reputation for being super intense and hard ass back in the day, but I think the vibe is different now.

Edit: come to think of it, we actually got yelled at by the vis caption head once for doing push ups while he was working with the brass during vis block, haha.

We were put on laps in vis block regularly, this was in 2001ish - sometimes as a group (a few people making mistakes, but everyone ran) and sometimes individuals were called out to do it alone. Occasionally, everyone but the individual was made to run.

This is a good explanation as far as the corps' attitude, and may be the source of flak from older drum corps fans, but I think their recent string of shows (since 07 or 08) plays a more significant role...when you compare those shows to what corps like Phantom and Crown have put on the field over the same period, I think it's easy to see why people might prefer one and not the other.

Agreed. While many corps took a turn toward more "modern" music and styles/themes in the late '90s through the early 2000s, most of the biggies have made a return to more accessible, tuneful shows, thus widening the gap between corps like BD (with the exception of 2011), who stayed on that esoteric path. Give yourself some time in the activity, not just five or even ten years and you will find yourself becoming more of a fan of everyone, in their various incarnations.

To suggest that I, or many of my colleagues, hate the Blue Devils would be grossly inaccurate. If I'm sitting next to you in a bar and I find out you marched BD, your status as "drum corps kid" supersedes your title as "Blue Devil" or "Crossman" or "Pioneer."

That said, I have a number of small gripes about BD that add up, and some of them have been touched on here, but I'd really like to emphasize that the reason why I'd never see myself with BD is because I'm always receiving the impression that Blue Devils are all about winning. I feel like BD is the corps that you go to if you want a ring; members are rumored to wear their rings outside of their gloves, BD sends out contracts to people who haven't gone to camps just because they know they're good, and their shows are designed to appeal to judge sheets rather than audiences.

I met a girl at a camp for another corps once, and she was kinda cute so naturally I friended her on facebook. Sue me, right? Anyways, she ended up marching with a different corps (one that scores higher typically), and on facebook her contract acceptance status got a comment "Yeah So-and-So! Win it all!" or something, and her response "You know I will! Blue Devils 2013 here I come!" If her attitude reflects any BD personality in even the slightest, that isn't the personality I'd see myself marching next to.

My connection to drum corps is emotional. I value the connections I make with the people sweating beside me far more than I value the numbers from a greenshirt's pen. I'm there to work my hardest every day not so a greenshirt can give me a higher number than yesterday, but so I know that I did everything I could to bring myself one step closer to perfection. My reward is my personal achievement on the field. I could hardly care less about the numerical validation of that achievement.

This is my opinion of BD in maybe the recent decade. I have no opinions on BD 1970-2000.

But it's not like they don't put in the work too. I feel like amidst all this hate they get it's kind of implied that they are very lazy, but they still sweat it out everyday. They still work for perfection and get closer than other corps. I can understand not liking their competitive mentality, but it's still the drum corps experience.

"Everyone" doesn't hate them. Not by a long shot, although lots of folks criticize the top dog. When you march with them, you'll find lots and lots of cheering fans. I didn't care for the '12 show, especially the recorded sounds, but dang! They sure played and marched well. My favorite years are from the '80s, but that's when I grew to love the activity. I really loved '11 as it was, in my opinion, a refreshing return to the BD sound of old.

My bad, "everyone" was a huge exaggeration. I just don't hear many people complaining about the Blue Knights or Cadets.
I agree, their shows are kind of confusing and don't make any sense. Hopefully for their 2013 and 2014 shows they'll be more appealing to fans.

My friend and I complain about The Cadets a lot. Mostly, we hate the use of electronics and amplification. Last year, it was ridiculous how their amps and synth bass completely covered the tuba sound. We respect and often enjoy their shows, but the amps are so distracting, it's hard to get into them. From the mid-'90s until very recently, I thought BK was too esoteric, but I really enjoyed the last two years immensely. SCV has always been a favorite; '81, '82, '85-'89, '92, '04, and '12, but I hated 2011 (what the heck was with all that running?!). If you are a fan long enough, everyone has shows and eras that you love and dislike. No matter. As a member you will make have incredible experiences and a strong, deep connection to your shows, not to mention making lifelong friends. Enjoy it no matter what the fickle fans think.

They're talented and clean, no doubt about it. They've figured out how to win, so it doesn't matter that they can't get a standing ovation or large crowd support, as long as the judges see clean feet and hear tight music they can do whatever they want in terms of show concepts. I had a friend that marched from 2007-2011, when I asked him what his show was about in '11 he said "I honestly can't even tell you".. if that's where you wanna go, do it and I guarantee you'll have an amazing time. There's haters for every corps, you'll get it wherever you go, just do what you want and enjoy yourself.

Why don't I like them? The first show I ever saw of theirs was 2010. I thought the mirrors were really stupid. There were a few cool parts in that show musically, but at the end I found myself wondering "how are these guys considered top contenders?"

Since like 2009 at least, there's a guy from my high school who marched baritone there. For 2011, that kid ended up with the Baritone solo, and 2012 he aged out as the drum major. I never met the guy, but it always reassured my that my school/ community produces a ton of good things and a ton of good people (including NFL quarterbacks and famous actresses). So I like them for that little sixth-degree-of-separation.

Playing to the judges - everyone's already said it, no need to go any further.

Finally, I just cannot stand the butt-capes. The butt-capes really kill them for me.

I dont necessarily dislike BD but I dislike the pedestal that everyone puts them on. BD puts out a show that judges like then changes it half way through the season to appeal more to the same judges. They hardly ever do anything impressive marching wise or musically. Their shows are incredibly easy from a simultaneous responsibility standpoint (marching and playing not marching or playing) and as a result they are damn clean as a result.

Now this is a smart way of winning championships I will grant you but that is not the end of it for me. As a direct result of them winning shows and ultimately championships many corps jokingly (with a bit of truth behind it) state that they are BD feeder corps. After marching for four years and involved in the activity on at least some level for 9 close to 10 now it completely bothers me that people join a world class corps like Blue Knights or the Colts or any of the other corps out there and leave within a year or two stating that they are going to go win a championship.

Now this is not a fault of the BD organization but there are so many members of that corps that started somewhere else. These people are very talented and that is very obvious. But what if these talented people stayed where they started? And every year these people used their talent to make their home corps even better? I believe this would bring other corps up to the same level (eventually) that Blue Devils have attained.

Blue Devils never have to innovate to bring their corps to the next level. They get their talent yearly from other corps and as a result they always have the best of the best in terms of their members. While many corps have to start from square one every couple years because their top performers constantly leave to "go win a championship."

I think it's a number of things, yea people hate them because they're top dog, but when Cavies and Cadets were top dog they were never as hated as BD.

I personally hate them because they don't play to entertain the crowd, they play to the judges. I pay my money to go to shows and I support DCI, but they don't care about me.

There's also the fact that they pickpocket other corp members because they're almost guaranteed to medal. A league with only a few good teams is a dying one. Look at the NBA. Corps are dropping like flies, and whether you agree or not, people pay to see parity. I'd rather see 20 3 star shows than 4 5 star shows and 15 shitty ones. But I think this is really DCI's fault, not BD's. They just are the biggest offenders.

Do you really HATE them? The thing that pisses me off the most is the actual HATE. There are people in those uniforms. They are doing what they love. I can tell you right now, after marching, even a lowly open class corps, I can never hate any corps. After knowing what we all do, how hard everyone works, I have a massive respect for all corps. My pet peeve is people actually hating corps.

Honestly, I didn't have that much of a gripe with them until I saw them warm up on finals night. I was pretty inexperienced with DCI at the time, but I did notice that the rest of the corps moved orderly to the shuttles, with little to no talking. The Blue Devils, however, moved in a formation that closely resembled an amoeba. Along the way they talked and laughed and acted like stuck up pricks. I understand that they have deserved the right to act a little stuck up, but nothing like the blatant arrogance they displayed that night.

In regards to the shows, I don't really care for them. They have a few that I like, 2011 and 2003 among them, but most of the time the music they play seems noisy and chaotic. Also, their obnoxious and excessive use of props is fairly annoying.

Edit: I do not "hate" the corps, I simply find their attitude and show design annoying.

The more you know. Also, BD can be perceived as disrespectful because they're so relaxed about how they function compared to nearly everyone else. In my experience, they're classy and pretty chill. A lot more behaved than a couple teams...I would have preferred to have them standing next to us during the TOC performances than these unnamed corps...

We had food truck issues a few times last summer, and BD shared mealtime with us after a couple of shows. I sat with and conversed with some of the most respectful and understanding people I've met in a long time.

I think you may have a self-set stigma about BD that you may be applying to the corps and not giving them a chance.

Meh, Coming primarily from WGI this is not odd to me. I will say that when it is business time in the lot it is business time.

And this is going to hurt a lot of people's feelings, but the fact is that because BD cuts out all the brotherhood crap and just get right down to business is one of the reasons they are so damn good at playing.

I don't think they suck (15 world titles don't go to a corps that sucks). I actually find the music they put wit their shows to be incredible. What I don't like is the visual aspect and the shows just not making sense to me. I'm not a fan of judge-pleasing, but that's just me. I don't hate them, by any means. BD 2005 is one of my favorite shows, actually.

I go into every BD show wanting to be blown away. Lately, I keep coming away utterly disappointed. It's the same with Cadets, honestly.

I think, for me personally, because of the total technical excellence of the execution and complexity of the show design, the fact that every BD show of the last several years leaves me completely emotionally flat, bored, and uninterested bugs a bit more than when most other corps' show just don't quite work for me.

Plenty of shows just don't connect with various people in the audience. That's normal. Most corps, I see a show from them that doesn't "do it" for me, I just shrug and wait for the next corps. Plenty of BD shows in the past just didn't make an impression. But, I think lately, the fact that I watch a BD show, and can tell from the execution and skill being displayed that it's an odds-on favorite to win the title that year (and I'm talking about at the Walnut, CA show, very early in the season), and I'm left cold and unengaged, is just plain annoying.

I want to like BD. They've performed some of my favorite shows of all time. I enjoyed the Adsurbity show, fine. But the last few years, blech. A show performed that well should be more than just a complex skill demo, I guess.

...yes, yes I did enjoy that show. Wasn't a BD show, so not quite relevant to my point, but okay. I enjoyed Spartacus more, but that's not particularly relevant either. It was an example of a year in which I was looking forward to seeing the Cadets, and instead of being presented with an NPR production about breast cancer, or with a bunch of people yammering into a mike about what they believe, I was given an honest-to-odin awesome drum corps show. They didn't say "Yowza yowza yowza", for instance.

I've got high hopes that BD will blow me away this year. I'm prepared to be presented with a technically-excellent show that engages every aspect of the judging criteria with a high degree of accuracy, but does absolutely nothing to move me, but I'm not hoping for that...

Personally, I haven't liked BD lately due to their shows not really having a solid identity until just recently. Every great, memorable corps tends to have its own style that usually becomes very apparent in their shows. The Cavaliers have a controlled masculinity to everything they do. Madison is all about showmanship and nostalgia. The Cadets have a pristine sense of professionalism about them. It's fairly easy to pick out a show from any one of these corps, as they all have a very solid identity.

IMO, the Blue Devils have spent the past few years rediscovering themselves, and this has led to a bit of a disconnect with the crowd. They used to be the jazzy, "cool" corps (which already clashed with the old-timers) and now they're trying to be something else entirely. Their recent shows have all been less show and more critique of a concept. If their Dada show is any indication of what the next couple of years will hold for BD, I'm actually pretty excited.

Here is my two cents. Too much park and play. Shows are technically proficient, but lack an emotional connection with many audience members. They have won a lot, even though there are other corps that in the eyes of many fans, are or can be just as accomplished. A lot of folks feel they are a super corps, meaning performers go there to win, not necessarily perform for the audience. Fans feel that other corps are the underdog and they don't have a chance to win on finals night. Sometimes the BD "cool" comes off as arrogance, and folks feel on the outside of the show, rather than pulling for them to achieve.

All I'll say is make sure the culture of the corps is what you want. If you join any corps just to get a medal you will have a bad time. You want to wake up every morning loving the music and people you're stuck around all summer. I've never really connected with BD shows, so I went elsewhere. YMMV

I will be the first to admit, the band im in at my school is not the best, but we don't use synths, we used 3 tiny props last year and none this year or the year before, and we dont have a guard, but when we play, we PLAY. The audiance loves us. These bigger bands that have 2 times the people and props dont get the same appaluse that we get. I think the same idea can be translated to BD. I see them like the big school with lots of money, the can play to the judges, but they loose the audiance sometimes. Yes, they are AMAZING musicians, but all the talent in the world is nothing if the audiance doesnt "get it". I can testify my self to this, I usually like Phantom and Crown more because of the connection their music makes. I mean, Crown playing Boheiman Rhapsody sent shivers down my spine, and Sparticus was probably the closest we will ever get to theatre on the field, but something about BD, I just dont connect like I do with other corps. Dada, for example, was a very good show, IMHO, but their shows lack that magic, that musical connection that makes great shows amazing.

I kinda sorta feel bad about this not really but, I only really care for them because I know a someone who played tuna this year and my band director used to march there and teaches over the summers with them. Other than that I'm neutral and don't see why everybody hates them.

No one has mentioned that BD winning again and again is bad for the activity in the long run. Championship parity is something that would help grow the fan base. It is one of the big reasons the NFL is so popular; a significant number of teams, even small market/money ones, have a chance of winning.

Fandom tends to be a regional thing, imagine what it would do to get new fans there if Pioneer, or the Troopers or any small non big 5 corps had a legitimate chance at winning it all? What it would do for their recruiting, and finances?