Comments on: The Better Angels of Our Nature: Why Violence Has Declinedhttp://www.kurzweilai.net/the-better-angels-of-our-nature-why-violence-has-declined
Accelerating IntelligenceTue, 03 Mar 2015 17:18:15 +0000hourly1http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1By: Mr.Xhttp://www.kurzweilai.net/the-better-angels-of-our-nature-why-violence-has-declined/comment-page-1#comment-63333
Mr.XThu, 06 Dec 2012 10:51:18 +0000http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=172497#comment-63333@Cristleo:
"Humanity since it’s existence upon this earth has deteriorated spiritually and morally."
Let's see: Crime rates have been higher, wars, genocide, treachery and thieving all have been more numerous in the days of old than today.
Let's think logically: If the morality of humans has deteriorated since its existence, you must take into account that we know for sure: There have been humans before the jewish and christian faith.
This means -since detoriation means something has been more/higher etc- that the ancient heathens -generally- were morally and spiritually superior to the followers of monotheistic faiths.Like christianity.
Which means, that your conclusion of "more God" can't be a solution.How can one make such a mistake?You started with part of the solution already written out, therefore you could only miscalculate.You have been brainwashed, probably since birth, that your religion and its followers are the only good, true people.The religion you have is less important for this, it has been decided by accident of birth.
Btw: Spirituality is the exact opposite of canned, "fast-food" religion.Jesus may have been spiritual, but it's followers mostly... not.
Spirituallity is about direct experience, and the word itself comes from the word for breath.This maybe so because the Greeks, and through them the Romans, had contact with ancient Indian traditions.
Many of these aim to master the breath in order to master the mind.
"Wars and human conflicts before were waged using simple armaments of bow and arrow, a one bullet rifle at a time to kill and enemy one at a time."
Untrue.Men killed men, women, and their Children not only from afar, but while looking in their eyes,delibarately.With terrible swords and clubs they send brains flying and sliced open stomacs, staining the ground with grey matter, blood and guts.They also raped almost everything that could move.
Anyway: Lack of skill doesn't prove lack of want.Which means our means changed, not mankind.
However: Whole armies have been encircled and annihilated- with the latter as a main goal- one just has to think of hannibal and his immense hatred.Genocide was commonplace, as was rape and living from the land you crossed without regard for the people.Taking with violence all you could get.
Wasn't the Illiad about Achilles immense wrath, dishonoring Hectors corps by patrolling the hood with it as extension of his chariot?It was also about humans, and the sins of the Greeks.Now you may say: A fairytale.But nonetheless, there maybe some truth in it, not less than in your favorite stories;)
Where did I stop? Incestous conquerers beheaded rebelious people and later decorated their possessions with "trophies".Greet my friend vlad.There was a baroness once, who bathed in the blood of young girls to keep her skin fresh and young.
Armies threw dead animals into besieged cities to spread illness.Armies used burning arrows to burn down civilian populations, so as to be able to better administer what's been conquered.Today, this is at least formally illegal.
Many people have been given to the sword, just to show who's boss.
I didn't even mentioned Ghengis "gorious" deeds.
Shall I speak about torture, which today is mostly practiced in the more religious countries, and the castratition of people, and of slavery!?
Most people today, in the more civilized countries, would at least give lip service to ideals directly opposed to such practices.
Your Christian friends, and others, would have said: God wanted it, feel the true justice.Just read the old testament, to see how this makes sense.As society changes and religious power waned, you guys retreated to the new testament.There will be a day, in which your fairy tales won't inspire surpression and murder anymore.
If we'd speak about this alone, and I made you believe that I'm one of you... I'd probably hear your archaic morals.
There was a klan which burns crosses.
Religion is anti-democratic, the hierachy of the "churches", and the hierachy of god own tribe with his angels, the tribes he supports etc can at best be described as paternal-autocratic governing.This goes for many religions, including the Christian FAITH which has been taken as example by me.
It has been said that myths come into existence to back up the already existing "morality" of a people.Therefore, their morals are somewhat arbitrary and have to be questioned HONESTLY.
"But now, wars are waged with nuclear bomb threats"
Threats.Says it all.MAD, if you happen to have heard of it,has dramatically reduced the number of wars fought between major powers.The wars that kill the most, I may say.
"WMD’s,"
Why do you list this, too.You already listed two out of three common wpm's.And now, list me the wars that used these weapons, and let us see if mankind back then has been less cruel in the constant application of all within their means, with the aim in mind to destroy some human life.If you want.
"It is proven that man if left alone will exterminate himself unless there is an infinite God -his creator to intervene."
The writing and peer pressure of ancient shephards, who wrote so many things now disproved, proves nothing.Maybe you want to look up the word "proof."
"(this verse implies that God must intervene in the chaotic affairs of humanity to avoid total extinction of humanity upon this earth.)"
So, your interpretion of a translated book that is rather old is what you call a proof?
Btw: You Christians used to be better at rhetorics, now you use blabla without meaning, e.g must intervene... to avoid total extinction of humanity upon THIS earth, is there another one where humans won't go extinct without your fantasy friend?Oh, yes, some are in heaven.Why is it bad if we all go to heaven?Making more humans, hm, maybe it's already crowded?
And why do you write TOTAL extinction, this is redundant.You fanatics used to be better, as I already said.;)
Maybe I think this because of the internet: Now the sheep, too, not only the shephard, can write their opinions everywhere.Reading older adherents of your religion is a bit selective, since not everyone could write and publish books, especially not books that got preserved over the times.@Cristleo:

“Humanity since it’s existence upon this earth has deteriorated spiritually and morally.”

Let’s see: Crime rates have been higher, wars, genocide, treachery and thieving all have been more numerous in the days of old than today.

Let’s think logically: If the morality of humans has deteriorated since its existence, you must take into account that we know for sure: There have been humans before the jewish and christian faith.

This means -since detoriation means something has been more/higher etc- that the ancient heathens -generally- were morally and spiritually superior to the followers of monotheistic faiths.Like christianity.

Which means, that your conclusion of “more God” can’t be a solution.How can one make such a mistake?You started with part of the solution already written out, therefore you could only miscalculate.You have been brainwashed, probably since birth, that your religion and its followers are the only good, true people.The religion you have is less important for this, it has been decided by accident of birth.

Btw: Spirituality is the exact opposite of canned, “fast-food” religion.Jesus may have been spiritual, but it’s followers mostly… not.
Spirituallity is about direct experience, and the word itself comes from the word for breath.This maybe so because the Greeks, and through them the Romans, had contact with ancient Indian traditions.
Many of these aim to master the breath in order to master the mind.

“Wars and human conflicts before were waged using simple armaments of bow and arrow, a one bullet rifle at a time to kill and enemy one at a time.”

Untrue.Men killed men, women, and their Children not only from afar, but while looking in their eyes,delibarately.With terrible swords and clubs they send brains flying and sliced open stomacs, staining the ground with grey matter, blood and guts.They also raped almost everything that could move.

However: Whole armies have been encircled and annihilated- with the latter as a main goal- one just has to think of hannibal and his immense hatred.Genocide was commonplace, as was rape and living from the land you crossed without regard for the people.Taking with violence all you could get.

Wasn’t the Illiad about Achilles immense wrath, dishonoring Hectors corps by patrolling the hood with it as extension of his chariot?It was also about humans, and the sins of the Greeks.Now you may say: A fairytale.But nonetheless, there maybe some truth in it, not less than in your favorite stories;)

Where did I stop? Incestous conquerers beheaded rebelious people and later decorated their possessions with “trophies”.Greet my friend vlad.There was a baroness once, who bathed in the blood of young girls to keep her skin fresh and young.

Armies threw dead animals into besieged cities to spread illness.Armies used burning arrows to burn down civilian populations, so as to be able to better administer what’s been conquered.Today, this is at least formally illegal.

Many people have been given to the sword, just to show who’s boss.

I didn’t even mentioned Ghengis “gorious” deeds.

Shall I speak about torture, which today is mostly practiced in the more religious countries, and the castratition of people, and of slavery!?

Most people today, in the more civilized countries, would at least give lip service to ideals directly opposed to such practices.

Your Christian friends, and others, would have said: God wanted it, feel the true justice.Just read the old testament, to see how this makes sense.As society changes and religious power waned, you guys retreated to the new testament.There will be a day, in which your fairy tales won’t inspire surpression and murder anymore.

If we’d speak about this alone, and I made you believe that I’m one of you… I’d probably hear your archaic morals.

There was a klan which burns crosses.

Religion is anti-democratic, the hierachy of the “churches”, and the hierachy of god own tribe with his angels, the tribes he supports etc can at best be described as paternal-autocratic governing.This goes for many religions, including the Christian FAITH which has been taken as example by me.

It has been said that myths come into existence to back up the already existing “morality” of a people.Therefore, their morals are somewhat arbitrary and have to be questioned HONESTLY.

“But now, wars are waged with nuclear bomb threats”
Threats.Says it all.MAD, if you happen to have heard of it,has dramatically reduced the number of wars fought between major powers.The wars that kill the most, I may say.

“WMD’s,”
Why do you list this, too.You already listed two out of three common wpm’s.And now, list me the wars that used these weapons, and let us see if mankind back then has been less cruel in the constant application of all within their means, with the aim in mind to destroy some human life.If you want.

“It is proven that man if left alone will exterminate himself unless there is an infinite God -his creator to intervene.”

The writing and peer pressure of ancient shephards, who wrote so many things now disproved, proves nothing.Maybe you want to look up the word “proof.”

“(this verse implies that God must intervene in the chaotic affairs of humanity to avoid total extinction of humanity upon this earth.)”

So, your interpretion of a translated book that is rather old is what you call a proof?

Btw: You Christians used to be better at rhetorics, now you use blabla without meaning, e.g must intervene… to avoid total extinction of humanity upon THIS earth, is there another one where humans won’t go extinct without your fantasy friend?Oh, yes, some are in heaven.Why is it bad if we all go to heaven?Making more humans, hm, maybe it’s already crowded?

And why do you write TOTAL extinction, this is redundant.You fanatics used to be better, as I already said.;)

Maybe I think this because of the internet: Now the sheep, too, not only the shephard, can write their opinions everywhere.Reading older adherents of your religion is a bit selective, since not everyone could write and publish books, especially not books that got preserved over the times.

]]>By: cristleohttp://www.kurzweilai.net/the-better-angels-of-our-nature-why-violence-has-declined/comment-page-1#comment-63230
cristleoThu, 06 Dec 2012 07:46:33 +0000http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=172497#comment-63230My view is contrary to what Mr. S. Pinker believes. Humanity since it's existence upon this earth has deteriorated spiritually and morally. Wars and human conflicts before were waged using simple armaments of bow and arrow, a one bullet rifle at a time to kill and enemy one at a time. But now, wars are waged with nuclear bomb threats, WMD's, chemical warfares designed for mass carnage, and human destruction. It is proven that man if left alone will exterminate himself unless there is an infinite God -his creator to intervene. If you believe that God - the Creator of everything exist read Matthew 24:22 (this verse implies that God must intervene in the chaotic affairs of humanity to avoid total extinction of humanity upon this earth.)My view is contrary to what Mr. S. Pinker believes. Humanity since it’s existence upon this earth has deteriorated spiritually and morally. Wars and human conflicts before were waged using simple armaments of bow and arrow, a one bullet rifle at a time to kill and enemy one at a time. But now, wars are waged with nuclear bomb threats, WMD’s, chemical warfares designed for mass carnage, and human destruction. It is proven that man if left alone will exterminate himself unless there is an infinite God -his creator to intervene. If you believe that God – the Creator of everything exist read Matthew 24:22 (this verse implies that God must intervene in the chaotic affairs of humanity to avoid total extinction of humanity upon this earth.)
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