The not so good-
Lips not speaking.................Speak! Give him lines man!

One a side note-
This show needs to start zeroing on other characters and plots besides Piggy, Kermit, and side stories with Gonzo. Get the Electric Mayhem as the focus of several plots, or have a few of them like Zoot and Lips in a plot or two. Just branch out more with characters and different stories.

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I couldn't agree more on your last two thoughts about the episode. I rully wanna see Lips and Zoot talk more!! (especially Lips)

UGH! Those stupid people aren't giving Muppets good ratings! What in the name of Walter Elias Disney is wrong with these people? If they don't give them good rating this minute, the Muppets gone forever! Looks like the Muppets are doomed!

Again, it would certainly help is Disney and ABC would let the Muppets just be the Muppets rather than trying too hard to morph them into a Muppet Modern Office Family in an attempt to give them mainstream appeal; but that's not to say they should try to reboot/rehash TMS - they already tried that with MT and it didn't work very well. And again, they said the reason they got a new showrunner was because the show was lacking humor and heart . . . but when they try too hard to make this show mirror other shows that lack those qualities, it's very doubtful those qualities are going to materialize into thin air. What needs to happen is to stop bringing in other writers and producers from other popular mainstream shows and let actual Muppet writers do something. That's not going to happen though because there's a desperation to ensure the Muppets achieve mainstream success, which is why they're relying on mainstream writers to try to help them achieve that.

Again, it would certainly help is Disney and ABC would let the Muppets just be the Muppets rather than trying too hard to morph them into a Muppet Modern Office Family in an attempt to give them mainstream appeal; but that's not to say they should try to reboot/rehash TMS - they already tried that with MT and it didn't work very well. And again, they said the reason they got a new showrunner was because the show was lacking humor and heart . . . but when they try too hard to make this show mirror other shows that lack those qualities, it's very doubtful those qualities are going to materialize into thin air. What needs to happen is to stop bringing in other writers and producers from other popular mainstream shows and let actual Muppet writers do something. That's not going to happen though because there's a desperation to ensure the Muppets achieve mainstream success, which is why they're relying on mainstream writers to try to help them achieve that.

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Frankly the public doesn't give a hoot, they'll watch the occasional guest apperance on The View or chuckle about their super bowl ad and comment on youtube about "muppets is my childhood, miss piggy was the best also elmo and the two old guys with cookie monster", but no one wants to stick around for an actual muppet show, because we all saw what happened to the ratings, it doesn't matter who writes it.

I saw an article saying that Netflix wanted to pick up The Muppets before ABC took it. Wouldn't that have been better for the show?

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Not necessarily, because not everybody has Netflix, so this wouldn't have worked well enough if the idea is to try to have the Muppets achieve mainstream status, because they would only be seen by a small percentage of the public; that was one of the concerns about SST moving to HBO, as not everybody has HBO - but almost everybody has PBS, which is why it's good PBS will get the new episodes nine months later.

A few people have been saying that this episode ended on a cliffhanger. I didn't see Camilla's entrance as a cliffhanger... I thought it was pretty much implied that they would get back together. if there was a "to be continued..." I would see it as a cliffhanger (but do TV shows do the "to be continued" anymore?).

I beg to differ. VMX was perhaps the poorest Muppet movie we've gotten, and part of the problem was they brought in Simpsons writers for it; Simpsons and Muppets have very different styles of humor.

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I seriously disagree with that remark. Jim Lewis came up with the idea for that Movie, and for a lot of fans it was the first time since Jim Henson's passing that Kermit was more like himself.they also really wrote Kermit& Piggy, and Kermit and Fizzie. So yes that movie is not there worst by any means.

I seriously disagree with that remark. Jim Lewis came up with the idea for that Movie, and for a lot of fans it was the first time since Jim Henson's passing that Kermit was more like himself.they also really wrote Kermit& Piggy, and Kermit and Fizzie. So yes that movie is not there worst by any means.

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I have to agree with you on that. VMX is actually a guilty pleasure of mine due to everything you just mentioned.

I have to agree with you on that. VMX is actually a guilty pleasure of mine due to everything you just mentioned.

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Same here. I love VMX and watch it during the holidays every year. (Although I am also a guy who loves Muppets from Space and Kermit's Swamp Years, but can't stand Muppets Treasure Island ... So I guess we can't all agree on what is considered a good quality Muppet films)

Ah,I see. SO in that case i'm gonna agree with @D'Snowth . I really did not like that movie. I mean,I think the characters were alright but the overall tone and humor really didn't feel very Muppet-y to me. The whole movie felt off. Definitely my least favorite Muppet movie. But I do still enjoy "Kermit's Swamp Years"and "Muppets from Space".

Yeah, I don't think either MFS or KSY deserve as much hate as they get (I'll admit MFS was flawed with Tim Hill's direction since he didn't even like the Muppets anyway, but all and all it wasn't a bad movie, and KSY was fun despite being oddly anachronistic), but at the same time I don't understand why so many people love VMX; like you said Pig's Laundry, the humor and tone was not in the Muppet spirit - Simpsons, perhaps, but not Muppety.

Yeah, I don't think either MFS or KSY deserve as much hate as they get (I'll admit MFS was flawed with Tim Hill's direction since he didn't even like the Muppets anyway, but all and all it wasn't a bad movie, and KSY was fun despite being oddly anachronistic), but at the same time I don't understand why so many people love VMX; like you said Pig's Laundry, the humor and tone was not in the Muppet spirit - Simpsons, perhaps, but not Muppety.

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Yeah Muppets From Space had a few pacing issues and it could've done with a few original songs,the villain was dumb and some of the scenes were unnecessary. Kermit's Swamp Years was certainly a strange movie and very different from the other Muppet movies,it was experimental. But at the end of the day the biggest issues with the films is it wasn't what people expected.People always expect the Muppet movies to be the first three over and over again.