POTD: HK243 S TAR in .223 Rem

Dickson from North Sylva Co., a Canadian gun importer, sent us photos of their new HK243 S TAR in .223 Rem … which I guess means our lucky cousins to the North are now able to buy the HK243! (UPDATE: The HK243 is yet to be available for sale to civilians as it has yet to be classified by the Canadian government, this was a dealer sample).

The HK243 is a modern sporting version of the H&K G36. The main differences between the HK243 and the G36 is that these consumer rifles are, obviously, semi-automatic but have nicer furniture than the older dated military variants. The S TAR version (pictured here) has a folding/adjustable stock and a nice looking quad rail while the cheaper S SAR has a polymer forend without rails and a folding, but not adjustable, stock.

The HK243

Thanks Dickson.

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Aaron

What a Dick..Son!

Giolli Joker

“folding, but not adjustable, stock.”

It’s clearly collapsible; not adjustable means that it has no intermediate positions? (i.e. fully open and fully closed?)

Maxcoseti

It’s refering to the S SAR version, which has the “classic” G36 stock that’s not adjustable

Giolli Joker

Yep, I definitely misread.
Thanks.

ostiariusalpha

You’ve basically got it. All adjustable stocks are collapsible, not all collapsible stocks are adjustable.

dshield55

I, for one, cannot wait to spend $2,000 on an HK that’s barrel can shift in the polymer receiver after heating up.

iksnilol

I believe they only screwed up the version the German army is using, since the countries they exported to haven’t complained about them.

dshield55

I doubt it. The problem wasn’t a manufacturing mistake, it was a core design flaw. Let’s say your a german paratrooper in afghanistan (as was the case) and all of a sudden you have no idea where your bullets are hitting about 300 yards away. Let’s assume that means the bullets are off by about 12 MOA or 36″ at 300 yards. Given that the human eye couldn’t really discern a change of 1 degree in the barrel and that 12 MOA is 12/60ths of a degree or 0.2 degrees, then we can assume it would be even harder to realize if a barrel shifts in a receiver by that much. Anyway, although the receivers probably aren’t melting under heat, they most likely are losing enough of their strength that the weight of the free floated barrel can cause at least a temporary shift 0.2 degrees when heated. Had these guns been available for American civilians to own at decent price, we would have caught it a lot quicker. But SL8s cost like $2000 used, and so far it seems like nobody that owns one wants to do a youtube video to prove this myth wrong or right for fear of killing their gun.

iksnilol

While I don’t like plastics I will admit that when using the correct plastic it will work. The problem is that they switched out the type of plastic to an inferior one. Lebanon uses the G36 (I presume Lebanon is a pretty warm country), they’ve found no problems. So does Portugal and Thailand.

I don’t want to speculate but I wouldn’t be surprised if HK did it on purpose so that they can get a new contract with the German Army.

Phil Hsueh

Exactly. There’s even an article that explains the situation by specifically saying that H&K was not manufacturing G36s to the original spec and instead of using the polymer originally specified they had been substituting another (inferior) polymer instead. So the issue isn’t a design flaw, it’s a manufacturing defect, if you can call deliberately using the wrong material a manufacturing defect.

It’s also worth noting that not all polymers are the same, just like all aluminum and steel aren’t the same. Polymer is basically a fancy way of saying plastic but there are many different kinds of plastics, each with different properties such as heat tolerances. There are some polymers that you can put into the microwave for a long time and nothing will happen except that the material gets warm while other will completely melt after only 30 seconds. So saying that all polymers are the same because of H&K’s malfeasance and your experience is like saying all steel is the same and is bulletproof because you shot at a steel target made from AR500.

iksnilol

Agree completely with you.

Kivaari

Except many of the worlds armies couldn’t care less. It is why rifles are found with the rear sight jacked up. Ask a CT with such an arrangement and they will tell you it is the power regulator, making it much more powerful when set to 1000m. Thank god they remain stupid.

iksnilol

Meh.

A legit army of a legit country is different from Somalis who use life jackets in lieu of plate carriers.

kyphe

A very rare occurrence while using suppression full auto fire for long periods in very high ambient temperatures only found on certain factory runs of the gun. Not comparable in any way shape or form with a civilian semi auto rifle in Canada.

Steve Martinovich

Meh. H&K thumbed their nose at the civilian market for a long time. I have no real desire to reward them by giving them my money.

dshield55

I’m totally okay with HK charging way too much for their stuff, but yeah I hold a grudge against them because of their unamerican hatred of civilians getting the good stuff. If they ever changed management and followed FN’s suit by releasing some civilian belt-feds, even though it would probably MSRP at $18,000 and I would never buy one, at least I’d be willing to forgive them. Or heck, if they did a civilian MP7 pistol, we’d know they’ve changed their hearts.

Squirreltakular

A civilian MP7 would be amaaazing. I’d rather not think about how expensive ammo would be at the beginning, though.

SP mclaughlin

Hk has said 4.6mm is not for civilians.
However, they could re chamber it for traditional pistol rounds and sell it like hot cakes IMO.

Patrick M.

Oddly enough I’ve seen 4.6 on the shelves at big box stores

EHW2

Rechamber in .17 hmr

Brian Benner

I’m just waiting for Walther to release the MP7 in 22, fingers crossed!

Kyle

Unamerican? Bro, you know they are German right?

dshield55

Lol. Yeah. Foreigners doing business in America can be unamerican. Right? Right? Amiright?

I know the beaurocratic red tape was against them but i still hold the grudge. Excuses are plentiful but are irrelevant. Bottom line is there wasn’t sufficent company will to bring their long guns back to the U.S. market. “But the German govern….and they got burned by the last ban….” No. Companies are expected to deliver what the consumer wants or die on the vine. HK chose to die on the vine and I’ll honor their decision.

And know that many of the people that sound the most salty about HK are their biggest fans. My P7 is my favorite pistol I own. I just want HK to go bankrupt so maybe their tooling will go to auction. That’s the best chance we have.

You’re right dammit! To hell with the “fool me once, fool me twice” that HK dealt with… twice. They should have opened a $100 million factory in the 90s during the assault weapons ban so Mark could get a thumbhole stocked, neutered 91 wannabe.

Or they could have focused on lucrative contracts that wouldn’t bite them in the rear (alongside the hair-brained products they wanted to sell).

imachinegunstuff

Agreed, isn’t it proof H&K wants the civilian market by the fact this weapon exists for Canadians? Corporations live and die off profits, so if there was a profitable market they would invest in it. I’m not H&K fanboy, they make fine weapons though.

Mark

I don’t think the it’s fair to let HK hide behind the argument of all in $100mil factor or complete surrender to nihilism. PTR has built an entire business on a ball they dropped and the consumers have suffered decades of SW, Bobcat, Coharie Arms drama over lack of HK product offers. The AWB sunset in 2004 and in the following 11 years of firearms sales boom they haven’t made any moves other than another AR in a saturated market all the while they have sat on unique products and a valuable brand image. In all fairness they deserve the heat.

2 boo-coo

It must be a prerequisite to be a complete a##hole to work for TFB- like you and Phil W for example.

You mentioned German export laws in the article, and I’ve asked you about this before (I have never received an answer), but what are the specific German laws? I’ve been unable to find them myself, and, seeing as you mentioned German export law prohibiting the export of intellectual property, you must know the specific laws, right?

If you can’t cite anything, I’ll just go on believing that HK doesn’t care that much about the civilian market, much like Colt.

Steve Martinovich

If you’re going to use facts Alex, this discussion is OVER! 🙂

Anonymoose

Do they still make G36 C-mags?

Squirreltakular

Does anyone else not like the idea of the bolt release being inside the trigger guard? Seems unsafe, when they could have just made it extend out to the sides so that you don’t need to reach inside the guard.

Patrick

Once you get used to it (such as with a Magpul BAD lever or Phase 5 Extended bolt release) it feels much faster and more ergonomic than the paddle on the side of the AR. As far as safety – I guess your finger could slip when releasing the bolt and fire a shot. Let’s hope that most people are smart enough not to chamber a round unless the firearm is already facing in a safe direction.

Squirreltakular

It just doesn’t sit well with me. I guess I could get used to it, though. Chances are if you’re sending the bolt home, you’re about to send another round downrange.

FarmerB

As Patrick says, not too bad once you get used to it – although I haven’t tried to use it with Artic gloves. But I agree with the sentiment – surely, you’d have to think somebody must have said “is this really a good idea?” during the early drawing stage.

TheNotoriousIUD

Only ten round mags in Canada?

Wetcoaster

Only 5 rounds for semi-auto rifles and shotguns. If you see larger magazines, they’ve been pinned*

**Whether it’s kosher or not is largely up to the whims of the RCMP firearms division. Note that the Ruger BX-25s for 10/22s must be pinned to 10 rounds because they were deemed to be ‘made for handguns’ – going by the marketing for 10/22 Charger pistols.. Why those are affected but other large 10/22 magazines are not is one of the vagaries of the RCMP

Anon

Is the whole thing about getting 10 round .50 Beowulf mags and putting 5.56 in them true? Would that be legal?

Wetcoaster

They’d be 5 rounds unless they were considered subject to the higher handgun limit.

Until the RCMP sets its foot down on one side (LAR-15 mags) or the other (BX-25), it’s a legal grey area.

Note that officially, it’s based on which gun the magazine was ‘designed for’ so order matters: The Remington 7615 was made to take AR15 mags as originally designed, so its magazines get treated like AR15 mags.

On the other hand, if you were to design a semi-auto rifle tomorrow that fed from existing 10-round Accuracy International magazines, the legality of those (and many existing) AI mags would not be affected.

Steve_7

It’s up to a court at the end of the day, not RCMP. Been saying this all along. RCMP is a regulatory agency, they can’t enforce it. I don’t know why people keep getting wound up about their classification decisions. Courts enforce the law.

1leggeddog

We need someone to make legit .50 Beowulf Pistol Mags for an actual .50 Beowulf Pistol. THen well be good.

Steve_7

Theoretically it’s possible but RCMP have clearly making noises that they’re getting annoyed by people using this method to get around the ban. So 5-round .50 Beowulf magazines are more common and even more common are AR-15 magazines stamped “designed for pistol” or similar so they can hold 10 rounds.

There’s no law that says you can’t use a pistol magazine with a rifle.

I’m sure there are hardcore people out there who have come up with a .50 Beowulf 10-round pistol magazine but it’s just not worth the hassle from RCMP really.

If the Conservatives lose the election, expect an RCMP clampdown shortly afterward.

2 boo-coo

Do you get a hard-on when you see SS camo pattern?

Ed

And all you tacti cooler I thought were trashing the G-36 because German tacti cooler are killing the use of the G-36 for German Army use.

Maybe it can help put minds at ease? Liek, peeps who buy it be all: “it ain’t melting, bruh” then other peeps be laik: “Kewl, Imma buy it.”

Dan Atwater

The grown up part of my brain says “that’s silly, don’t even bother” but the 12 year old part of my brain is saying “omg rainbow 6”

RICH

It seems that the best H&K’s are the 91’s being built in the U.S. by PTR after they bought H&K’s tooling when the 91 was discontinued by H&K ! Many reviews put the PTR finish far above the factory H&K finish when H&K was still making the 91’s. I have a couple of each and agree with the reviews that are out there.

While RICH is incorrect about the source of PTR’s tooling, the guy in that hkpro post was comparing a 1989 FMP gun to a 1989 H&K gun, not a modern production PTR to an H&K. I’m not saying he is right about the quality of the fit and finish of a PTR gun as I have never held one, but that link doesn’t disprove that part of what he said.

HKGuns

Stop talking about stuff you obviously haven’t a clue about.

Really.

ant1248

If HK can import these to Canada then German export laws aren’t stopping them so they could import these modified as pistols to the US.

I’ve come around on their pistols (p30/SK especially), but they can keep the g36…..especially this civilianized monstrosity….

David Lowrey

Knowing H&Ks prices. This is one of the few times that the trigicon optic might be cheaper then the rifle it’s attached too.

Steve_7

Why bother with classification, it’s clearly non-restricted. Verification of non-restricted firearms isn’t required anymore since the long gun registry was repealed. Anyway given that we’re only allowed 5-round magazines, I doubt overheating is going to be a problem. Unless you use a mag. adapter and try and use a 5-round .50 Beowulf magazine. Even then though you’re looking at 18 rounds semi-auto.