Climate Concerns

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The "CLIMATE CONCERNS" group is dedicated to discussion regarding the topic of the ever present and serious issue of changes to our climate due to the introduction into the atmosphere of human induced effects which prove harmful to the environment and which eventually may prove destructive to our planet.

"people's vunerability to science denial" is not a fair phrase to use with the subject of "man-made global warming". Or as the climatologists like to say, "anthropogenic CO2" is responsible for…Continue

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I didn't know this forum was here when I started a new one on the same subject. I'll see if i can copy it and put it here where it belongs. It has to do with denial of man-made (anthropogenic) CO2 being the cause of global warming. We are close to being at the end of a cyclic warming period that occurs about every 120 thousand years. We still aren't as warm as the last four warming periods. In fact, we aren't as warm as the Roman and Medieval warming periods.

“We’re all in high school. We’ve never left high school,” says [former USGS head, and editor of Science] Marcia McNutt. “People still have a need to fit in, and that need to fit in is so strong that local values and local opinions are always trumping science.”

And specifically about climate change:

Americans fall into two basic camps, [Dan] Kahan [of Yale University] says. Those with a more “egalitarian” and “communitarian” mind-set are generally suspicious of industry [...] they’re likely to see the risks of climate change. In contrast, people with a “hierarchical” and “individualistic” mind-set respect leaders of industry [...] they’re apt to reject warnings about climate change, because they know what accepting them could lead to—some kind of tax or regulation to limit emissions.

I see a connection with liberals' core values (such as fairness and reducing harm) vs. conservatives' core values (such as loyalty and authority). Philosopher Rebecca Goldstein argues that those conflicting values are objectively not "equally good".

"In the last two years, researchers have linked both the dissolution of the Minoan empire in the ancient Mediterranean and the collapse of Levantine civilizations of the near East and the Harappan civilization of the Indus Valley to sustained drought.

"Others have identified seasons of plentiful rainfall as the impetus for the conquest of Russia, China and Persia by the Mongol horsemen of Genghis Khan.

"The connections with modern conflict, too, have been made before. In 21 studies of upheaval and conflict in modern societies, researchers have found clear links with rises in temperatures."

Relief carving from a palace in Nineveh, show Assyrian corpses floating on a river

"Candidates who have previously denied the science of man-made climate change are in a far more difficult spot than in the past. When pressed by the media or their opponents, many of these deniers will now reluctantly waltz around their denial, acknowledging that humans contribute, in some form or fashion, to climate change. But they remain unable or unwilling to recognize the overwhelming scientific evidence that human activities are far and away the primary cause of climate change, because that would obligate them to support some form of action to address it."

The Limits of Climate Negotiations

NEW YORK – If the world is to solve the climate-change crisis, we will need a new approach. Currently, the major powers view climate change as a negotiation over who will reduce their CO2 emissions (mainly from the use of coal, oil, and gas). Each agrees to small “contributions” of emission reduction, trying to nudge the other countries to do more. The United States, for example, will “concede” a little bit of CO2 reduction if China will do the same.

"For two decades, we have been trapped in this minimalist and incremental mindset, which is wrong in two key ways. First, it is not working: CO2 emissions are rising, not falling. The global oil industry is having a field day – fracking, drilling, exploring in the Arctic, gasifying coal, and building new liquefied natural gas (LNG) facilities. The world is wrecking the climate and food-supply systems at a breakneck pace.

"Second, “decarbonizing” the energy system is technologically complicated. America’s real problem is not competition from China; it’s the complexity of shifting a $17.5 trillion economy from fossil fuels to low-carbon alternatives. China’s problem is not the US, but how to wean the world’s largest, or second largest economy (depending on which data are used) off its deeply entrenched dependence on coal. These are mainly engineering problems, not negotiating problems.

...

"Fighting climate change does depend on all countries having confidence that their competitors will follow suit. So, yes, let the upcoming climate negotiations spell out shared actions by the US, China, Europe, and others.

But let’s stop pretending that this is a poker game, rather than a scientific and technological puzzle of the highest order. We need the likes of Musk, Lackner, General Electric, Siemens, Ericsson, Intel, Electricité de France, Huawei, Google, Baidu, Samsung, Apple, and others in laboratories, power plants, and cities around the world to forge the technological breakthroughs that will reduce global CO2 emissions.

"There is even a place at the table for ExxonMobil, Chevron, BP, Peabody, Koch Industries, and other oil and coal giants. If they expect their products to be used in the future, they had better make them safe through the deployment of advanced CCS technologies. The point is that targeted and deep decarbonization is a job for all stakeholders, including the fossil-fuel industry, and one in which we must all be on the side of human survival and wellbeing."

This breakdown -- this gap -- between the planetary emergency that the scientists are telling us we face, and the milquetoast and contradictory responses of our political leaders, is truly alarming.

On Obama's coal plant regulations,

... Kevin Bundy with the Center for Biological Diversity’s Climate Law Institute commented, "This is like fighting a wildfire with a garden hose -- we’re glad the president has finally turned the water on, but it’s just not enough to get the job done." [emphasis mine]

But we also know that, if we’re to survive this calamity, we need to accept the fact that we’re on our own. Ours is not a government of the people, by the people, for the people, but a corporate state that’s the captive of Big Oil which serves the interests of the ruling 1 percent oligarchy.