By the way...since this seems to be the catch-all' talk about Trek 2009 thread...Having just watched the film again. I figured out what I like most about it.

My biggest complaint about modern cinema and TV is the death of the normal-looking/ugly character actor.

The cast of Trek 2009? That is one bunch of normal, almost ugly looking fellas. with the exception of Uhura of course. Pine is weird though. You see him in publicity photos and he's almost stunningly good-looking, but the film showed him in all his pock-marked glory.

Congrats also to Abrams for getting very good jobs out of Hemsworth, Cross, Greenwood and even Ryder.

Other than the fact that he looks like a linebacker (having played sword-swinging behemoths like Eomer in Lord of the Rings) and Kelley was always frail even in TOS. Not that Urban's build is his fault, but aside from some slight facial resemblance, he is the last person on earth I'd cast to play McCoy. Apparently in this timeline, McCoy is hooked on roids.

I find that many people have a limited perception of Spock, often focusing on the "logic" thing, while missing the complexity of the character.

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Yeah, all that missing complexity, like banging Uhura or throwing temper tantrums. That JJ, he sure knows how to add subtlety and depth to characters. It helps to use the writers from character studies like Transformers 2 also. I mean, that transformer with the wrecking ball nuts was right up there with Shakespeare.

I find that many people have a limited perception of Spock, often focusing on the "logic" thing, while missing the complexity of the character.

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Yeah, all that missing complexity, like banging Uhura or throwing temper tantrums. That JJ, he sure knows how to add subtlety and depth to characters. It helps to use the writers from character studies like Transformers 2 also. I mean, that transformer with the wrecking ball nuts was right up there with Shakespeare.

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I saw him kiss Uhura and have a few tender moments, no "banging" Temper tantrums are part of some classic Spock scenes in TOS. And I was talking about Spock in TOS, but you're so quick to jump in with your "this movie sucks" schtick you missed that.

That said, Spock in ST09 was presented as a complex character. There several well scripted moments with Uhura, his parents and of course Kirk that highlighted this complexity.

That said, Spock in ST09 was presented as a complex character. There several well scripted moments with Uhura, his parents and of course Kirk that highlighted this complexity.

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Which would be easy to miss with all the lens flare and "punch-its".

If people want to judge JJ Trek as just a fun romp, so be it, but don't proceed to defend it as some sort of great piece of drama. It's not, and as far as I'm concerned a lot of it is as bad if not worse in the writing department as The Final Frontier, it's just that you don't notice it as much because the budget is higher, the editing quicker, and the cast is more photogenic. People winced when an old Scotty hit the beam in The Final Frontier, but now, inexplicably, people seem to enjoy seeing a young Scotty get shot through the brewery like a scene from Willy Wonka. Maybe people's taste is what needs a reboot the most.

That said, Spock in ST09 was presented as a complex character. There several well scripted moments with Uhura, his parents and of course Kirk that highlighted this complexity.

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Which would be easy to miss with all the lens flare and "punch-its".

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Not if you pay attention. Are you really that easily distracted?

If people want to judge JJ Trek as just a fun romp, so be it, but don't proceed to defend it as some sort of great piece of drama. It's not, and as far as I'm concerned a lot of it is as bad if not worse in the writing department as The Final Frontier, it's just that you don't notice it as much because the budget is higher, the editing quicker, and the cast is more photogenic. People winced when an old Scotty hit the beam in The Final Frontier, but now, inexplicably, people seem to enjoy seeing a young Scotty get shot through the brewery like a scene from Willy Wonka. Maybe people's taste is what needs a reboot the most.

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I'm sorry, but where did I say it was great drama? There are some standout scenes, as there are in most Trek outings, but only the blindly delusional confuses Star Trek with great drama.

Both scenes with Scotty ( Scotties?) are funny. I laughed, just as I laughed when a drunk off his ass Scotty said "It's green" in TOS. Humor is not an anathema to Star Trek.