"Within various media there is a prevalent assumption among story writers, artists, etc., that large(r) breasts automatically make a woman more attractive; this often leads to "excessive" focus on said breasts (even if this assumption is not stated in the text), or the character with the largest breasts getting treated as the most attractive in-universe (regardless of who the fans think is really the most attractive)."

Ok, This needs to be re-worked. Saying that "large(r) breasts automatically make a woman more attractive" is not a assumption, that's an opinion. Now saying that the author thinks the audience of a work will find a large breasted character or the character with the largest breasts more attractive is an assumption. However, without Word of God as to why the author gave the character large breasts in the first then all this paragraph is doing is making an assumption of a potential assumption.

Buxom Is Better proper is fine but it would be best to keep anything related author appeal out of the trope. Buxom is better should derive strictly from things in the actual work.

Buxom sells, I'm leaning on no. Unless you know what went on in the through the character designer's head when making said character, it's anyone's guess whether or not the creator where trying to cash in on the appeal of big breasts and/or wanted to implemented his fetish in the character design. Either way it would require a lot insight.

World of Buxom, I'm iffy on. It sound vaguely reminiscent of Most Common Super Power, so it could a sub trope but I've never really liked Most Common Super Power. Trying to link it to Reality Is Unrealistic doesn't really work since that page deals with tropes that are mistaken for reality. Most people already know big breasts, in real life, are rare. Beside since it's fiction that pretty much gives the creator free reign to do what they want. Also busty characters tend to stick out more, I'm concerned that people might spot a few buxom character and assume this trope.

Personally I think we have enough breasts tropes and we're starting to get the point where there's way too much overlap between breast tropes. However if you're going to add one more I'd go with World of buxom, but World of buxom should only apply if the majority of the seen character super-power or not are busty. That way it doesn't overlap too much with Most Common Super Power. Also should also be required that the show have a lot of busty characters, on screen, preferable extras. That way there's at least some proof that's it really is a world of busty women.

Well those are my thoughts.

ImipolexG

09:55:07 PM Nov 1st 2010

I don't think we really need more tropes for this, personally. Buxom Sells, for one thing, can fit under Sex Sells.

Admittedly, Buxom Is Better is being misused somewhat, but I suspect that's inevitable. The trope page makes it pretty clear what it's about (bigger breasts = hotter girl) but of course some people are going to ignore that.

I'm seeing this trope being used a lot. Unfortunately, I don't think being used properly. It's pretty much being used to tag any big breasted character often the quip only talks about how big said character's breasts are.

I'm not surprise since this is the same thing that happened with Most Common Superpower and Gag Boobs, but I think it's far more of an issue with this trope since, not saying I could do much better, the name nor the description are as clear as they could be.

IMO, I think the breast bias or big breast bias would be a better fit for the name, as one of the tropers mentioned but that might be too late. However, I think for the description it needs to be made more clear that this trope is not just about having big breasts.

MarqFJA

05:38:06 AM Oct 31st 2010edited by MarqFJA

You know, you raise a good point. I've been so distracted by many things in the past months that I've neglected addressing this issue.

For now, I now realize that at least part of the problem is that we're trying to shoehorn multiple tropes into one. Here's my current take on it:

Buxom Is Better proper: The belief that 1) a true woman has to be big-breasted, and 2) the bigger the breasts, the more feminine/womanly and/or sexually attractive you are; can take the form of a buxom girl ridiculing a lesser-endowed peer's lack of "assets", or guys favoring a shallow woman for her bustiness while ignoring the kind-hearted Shrinking Violet with an average-sized chest.

Unfortunately Truth in Television in Western society and those that are heavily influenced by it.

Buxom Sells: Owing in part to Sex Sells, the majority of character artists/designers/writers either believe that making a female/hermaphrodite character noticeably big-breasted and/or deliberating designing the character and/or her wardrobe to draw Male Gaze to her big breasts would result in increased popularity, and thereby increased profitability, or they don't believe so, but are still trying to cash in on the relatively prevalent appeal of already existing buxom female characters by designing their female characters accordingly.

The likes of MaiShiranui, Ivy, Morrigan and Felicia would fall under this; one can't really deny that their character designers aren't purposefully emphasizing their bustiness.

Not that I don't appreciate a good pun, I was wondering change the picture on the page to a more literal one. Perhaps of a girl being jealous of a another girls rack or of a girl getting attention for being busty. What do you guys think?

MarqFJA

09:03:20 AM May 26th 2010

No, this one's fine.

Iverum

11:51:21 PM May 26th 2010edited by Iverum

Actually, a new image wouldn't be bad. This one doesn't explain the trope at all. Or really contribute to the page at all.

Why does there have to be a punny alt-name? Buxom is better is already a pun/snowclone of Bigger is Better and works fine. This website needs less puns, not more. Baby got Boobs is already a porn series.

@Iverum: Please state your issues, then, so we may work to correct them. Civil, well-mannered debate is always welcome in my book.

Iverum

12:16:51 PM Apr 2nd 2010

The article text just seems to meander a bit too much. It's a bit hard to pull exactly what this Trope is without rereading it. The article could be organized a bit better is the main point I want to make.

MarqFJA

12:30:22 PM Apr 2nd 2010

Okay, that is a reasonable point. Can you specify which lines/paragraphs are problematic?

Iverum

12:59:07 PM Apr 2nd 2010

Within the various forms of media, there is a prevalent assumption among story writers, artists, etc., that large(r) breasts automatically make a woman more attractive; this often leads to "excessive" focus on said breasts even if this assumption is not stated in the text, and/or the character with the largest breasts automatically being treated as the most attractive in-universe (regardless of who the fans think is really the most attractive).

This sentence makes the trope sound like Author Appeal. It's the first sentence in the article, and sets the trope up as something it is not. It's also a run-on, but we'll ignore that.

This trope is basically a female character that is at least reasonably attractive, and who is notable - and usually lampshaded in-universe - for having substantially larger than average breasts among other female contemporaries.

This sentence should probably come first. It gives a better idea of what the trope is. It still is a little unclear however. Are you saying that the trope is about female characters who are attractive with large breasts, or female characters who are attractive because they have large breasts.

<sigh> This is exactly why I wanted to continue tweaking the description in YKTTW stage; unfortunately, I kept getting a lot of "Just Launch It Already!" reactions and eventually caved in. But I digress.

1st Point: The paragraph was supposed to explain that the trope commonly arises from either Author Appeal, or assuming that "all men like big breasts, and the bigger the better", but in hindsight, I realize that it doesn't show that quite well. I don't get how it's a "run-on", though.

On a side-note, it was derived from the "Rename Booberiffic" thread in the Trope Repair Shop, which contributed a lot to Buxom Is Better's current form.

2nd Point: It's a legacy of the earlier Booberiffic. I think it was supposed to exclude undeniably hideous females who somehow qualify for the "big breasts" criterion. In short, Generic Cuteness is required, even if in-universe the character is supposed to be homely (e.g. Chisame Hasegawa, who is supposed to have "bad skin", yet is drawn in the same "blemishless" way as practically everyone else *

3rd Point: Okay, I thought I should go with brief and concise, given that I've been given some "description is too long" complaints in the YKTTW, but it seems that I was too brief. I'll have to expand that part.

Anything else?

Pill

04:21:26 PM Apr 2nd 2010edited by Pill

Just because it's "observable" doesn't mean its a trope. It is NOT a repeated pattern or motif in works, but merely a societal conditioning. That's like me saying that "many people have cell phones" is a trope.

If you all really insist on keeping this article (and I refuse to call it a trope, as it seems the definition of the word has been skewered on this site), I suggest you rename it to "Breast Bias", make it very evident that the opinion of breasts this trope gives is, in fact, a biased opinion, and keep it absolutely example-less. Also, delete any outward links that use this page just to denote characters people want to gush over for their breasts. We don't need another MCSP problem.

That aside, to expand on my previous rebuttal, your very own logic would dictate that Biggus Dickus, a trope that has a similar premise (in short, "bigger penis = better sex"), should also be treated the same. However, there have been no contention thus far about its validity as a trope.

The current previous prospective title, Mammaria Majores, can be taken as both an abbreviation of glandulae mammaria majores (sic; correct form majorum) ("Greater Mammary Glands"), and as pseudo-Latin for "major mammaries" (= "greater[-sized] breasts").

Proposed Alternate Titles (do not alter; additions are to be discussed first):

Mammae Majores: Second proposed title. Proper Latin for "Greater Breasts", akin to the Real Life term labia majora (lit. "greater lips"); cf. pseudo-Latin Biggus Dickus. The "proper Latin vs. pseudo-Latin" dichotomy, by completely unintentional but hilariously fitting coincidence, plays on a relatively common stereotype that "men are crude, women are refined". This Troper is a man, and admits that that particular stereotype is ironically true in many cases.

Notably lampshaded in one episode of Azumanga Daioh: resident Cloudcuckoolander Osaka describes the well-developed Sakaki as "American" and herself as "Japanese", with Yomi being somewhat between them as "Hawaiian" (as there's a very large Japanese minority in Hawaii). When Tomo asks about herself, the short reply is: "Japanese".

Hawaii also has a large portion of naturally large natives, and Yomi is always teased about being overweight.

The Real Life section should be cut too. Except perhaps for mentioning porn. Otherwise, most of them don't relate to the trope at all.

MarqFJA

12:34:09 PM Mar 19th 2010

While I may agree with you on the "Unknown Classification" section, I think the Real Life section is fine as it is, except maybe moving the "Gigantomastia" bit to the tail end of the article description.

And Since the Buxom Is Better phenomenon applies in Real Life, it stands to reason that anyone who's interested in the trope and its Real Life occurences would also be interested in knowing the current world records.

The "no more examples" tag ensures that this section does not become overloaded with Perverse Sexual Lust.

BigT

03:15:18 AM Jun 4th 2010edited by BigT

The whole point of the Unknown Classification section is to allow Wiki Magic to put it in the right section. The person who put it there didn't want it to stay, they just didn't know where to put it.

BTW, obviously that example would go under Anime/Manga.

Iverum

08:55:41 PM Jun 4th 2010

It wasn't a question of what type of media it was, the classification was acting as a separate section from Subversions and such. It made no sense.

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