And sure enough, the comments about the Bike Working Group’s proposed Backbone Bikeway Network has brought out the usual bike-hating suspects. Surprisingly, though, the comments have been overwhelmingly in favor of building the network.

Of course, that may have something to do with the fact that the Times moderates comments on their blogs. So all the rabid, mouth-foaming, life-threatening, death-to-cyclists borderline insane, so-bad-they-make-the-Good-Doctor-look-good comments may be circling the silicon drain.

And man, would I like to see those.

So instead, we’re left with the observations of the relatively sane, though perhaps somewhat gas-addled drivers who managed to make it through the paper’s filtering process.

I read ‘em so you don’t have to.

Of course, many of the anti-bike comments fall into to usual category of bicyclists should be licensed and insured, just like drivers.

Yes, Just make sure they are licenced and pay fee’s like car owners do, and make em get insurance too!

If bikes want more space on the roads of LA then the bike should be registered just like cars and bikers should be licensed just like drivers. They should also be tested just like drivers after all it is a privelege not a right. And no bikes should be allowed on two lane roads if they pose a hazard to drivers.

A perspective that fails to consider that the overwhelming majority of adult cyclists have a driver’s license, and have passed the exact same test as their accusers. Or do they honestly think that no one on a bike has any other transportation options?

Then there’s the fact that here in California, the operator is insured, rather than the vehicle. Which means that your car insurance policy should follow you regardless of what vehicle you operate — even a bike, as I learned the hard way following my road rage case, when my car insurance company picked up the entire tab for my medical expenses.

There are those who will only support cyclists when we obey the law.

only if they start obeying the traffic laws. 75% run stop signs and red lights

And no drivers ever speed, run stop sighs or fail to signal. Or park in bike lanes, for that matter.

Then there’s this rocket scientist, who can’t seem to grasp the concept that fixies can still manage to stop, even without added brakes.

Sure, as long as the cyclists follow the rules of the road like everyone else. Too often I see them running stop signs and even red lights with wanton disregard for their own safety. The worst offenders are the people on fixed-gear bikes that don’t have any brakes at all. I am not allowed to drive a car with no brakes, so why should someone be allowed to ride a bicycle with no brakes on that same road?

no. infact the old law allowing people to ride bikes on the same roads that cars and trucks drive needs to be ended. they are a road hazard that should be on the sidewalk. when a person riding a bike is in the fast lane of a two lane road and is trying to make a left hand turn across traffic he is endangering himself and all the motorist on that same road. only if there is no side walk should it be legal to ride a bike on the road and only on the far right side at that. i am actually shocked that the ultra greedy insurance companies have not pushed for this already to avoid payouts that result from there injuries.

A few think there are better places to ride. Like the desert, for instance.

I disagree with giving them more room. The law provides enough room for bicyclists as it is. If they want somewhere to ride, they can ride to the desert and have all the room they want. As mentioned above, they are self-righteous and sanctimonious and do not DESERVE anything. Those idiots we see riding along the orads in their tight shorts and stupid helmets are not going to work and, therefore, should not get in the way of those of us who have to fight traffice every single day. I say drop the subject altogether,

Yeah, cycling a hundred miles out of your way in 112 degree temperatures is so much fun, when you only wanted to go a few blocks down the “orad” for a loaf of bread.

Or maybe Orange County.

I’m sorry but Los Angeles should not cater to cyclists. There are plenty of trails in the suburbs and most cyclists choose to live somewhere with more trails anyways. Suburbs like Orange County are prime real estate for pretty boy cyclists. LA is an inner city kinda place and always will be

Meanwhile, Julie is tired of getting stuck behind cyclists on the 405 Freeway.

I am begging you – NO!!!!!! let bicyclists ride on paseos and around neighborhoods. Bikes are NOT viable methods of transportation for work and should NOT be treated as such. I do not want to have to drive at 10 miles per hour because I’m behind a bicyclist on the 405….Please stop the insanity.

Never mind that many L.A. streets are already at or above capacity, and that the only viable solution is to reduce the number of cars on the roads. Or do they want us to remove the sidewalks so they can add another traffic lane?

On the other hand, Ron hates cyclists because of our fashion choices, as well as riding habits.

yes, please get these rude idiots off the streets, bicyclists don’t give a damn. they don’t care about anyone but themselves. Everywhere I go I see them challenge drivers, Never in single file, Run stop signs so they won’t lose momentum, ect…. Just because you ride an expensive bicycle and outfit yourself in ridiculious effiminite clothing, Does not give you the right to take over the road , which is what they do in packs. Are we supposed to stop all our cars on busy streets because your club needs to get to starbucks? I’m surprised there aren’t more road rage incidents against these self centered elitists. These people are riding for pleasure, the rest of us are trying to get to work,So stay out of the way, Heelhook

For God’s sake, NO! NHTSA statistics have shown that a mile traveled on a bicycle is 14.7 times more likely to result in a fatality than one traveled in a passenger vehicle. Not only is it far more dangerous, bicycling, unlike motorcycling, is disastrous to efficient traffic flow in a region notorious for that problem already. Bicyclists who want this are zealots who care nothing for all those they would inconvenience.

Of course, he fails to mention that cars are far more likely to kill someone.

Some have clearly never heard of dooring.

Are you kidding me, they cause enough hazards on residential streets as it is. Why do they need more space they all just ride on the line anyways. Is it that important to hug the white line? They are putting their lives at danger. Then they get upset when a car passes them going the speed limit. Scoot over to the right bikers, you have the whole bike lane to ride in.

There there’s the argument that bikes need to pay their fare share for use of the roads.

Bicycles should be registered and riders licensed the same asrequire for Autos. The fees collected can be used for more an wider bicycle lanes.
Auto registration fees in Calif have risen, the fuel tax in Calif is one of the highest in the nation and the bicycle riders want the motoring public to share the revenue to build them bike lanes instead of improving the road ways for autos for which the revenue is intende?
Les be fair, the autos pay for the auto lanes and the bikes pay for the bike lanes.

Hey, I’m all for that. Gas and licensing fees cover less than half of all road construction and maintenance fees, which means those who don’t drive or only drive a little subsidize those who do. So a tax that charges people for their use of the roads would mean a huge increase for people who drive two hours to work every day. And a huge decrease for those of us who don’t.

Put that on the ballot, I’ll vote for it.

Some think there just isn’t enough demand.

I think all three bike riders in Los Angeles deserve more space on the road. Maybe we could give them each their own lane.

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16 Responses to They drive among us: More insights on cycling from the gasoline addled

I always laugh at the great dirty unwashed illiterate ‘IR’s’ that come out with those kinds of things.

I have a sneaking suspicion that both LA Times there and Stuff here know when they’re on to a good thing for page impressions.

What I love doing here is what I call the ‘4 dollar trick’.

It requires $4 in one dollar coins (notes there obviously) and a ranty type demanding that ‘bikes pay their fair share’.

I simply go “right, calculated on my distance from last year this is about what I owe, however I’ll take that ($1) back because I cause 26,000 times less damage to the road, that ($1) back because in the long term I will be less of a drain on the health system, that ($1) back for the motorways I can’t use but take up significant amounts of road spending, and then that ($1) back for reducing the negative health outcomes on others because I’m not spewing carcinogens in the air. However I won’t mention parking subsidies as I’m fair and really I’m happy with my current position without demanding money from you.”

Hahahaha.

Even the most angry ‘user pays’ libertarian usually shuts up with that. Hahaha.

These people are so completely insulated in their own little worlds. Somebody needs to tell Julie up there that in many places in the world (but tell her there is a world outside LA first, ’cause I don’t think that’s occurred to her) thousands and thousands of people do find bikes a viable means of transportation to work.

I think some of them really believe the only people who ride bikes are people who cannot, for some horrible reason or other, drive a car.

I always love how the angry ranting comments and emails are usually the ones where it’s clear that the person writing has no idea how to use their own language, couldn’t spell “dog” if you showed it to them first, and obviously have no real opinion of their own except “I’m right!”

Thankfully, the only place you usually see stuff like this in Portland proper is from commenters on mass media sites (the Oregonian for example). I rarely run into people with this kind of point of view in the city itself. Even if people wouldn’t ride themselves, they are usually pretty friendly and understanding towards cyclists. I have to assume that most of the angry commenters come from suburban areas, and many seem to just spend their time trolling the internet for bike-related articles to leave angry comments on. Most of the impatient, angry drivers I encounter (surprisingly few) are near freeway exits and entrances too, which also suggests that they are from outside the city :)

Thanks for this summary–I didn’t have time to review all 300-odd responses and distill the essences of both the “for” and “against” statements, so this overview was very helpful. Not much there from the vast majority of these “against” commenters in the way of real substance to further any significant debate, but perhaps that’s just the nature of this forum.

But i did get a good laugh from the comment that we cyclists are “liberal cheapskates on bikes slowing down the traffic just so they can save a few bucks on gas.” That’s almost too good to be legit.

Oh thank you for this humorous look at those comments! I actually did read them all yesterday, and I was completely incensed by them. My only comfort is that these people are too lazy to vote, and, furthermore, probably wouldn’t understand anything that needed to be voted on, since they can’t read, apparently.

I love how the one commenter says “I’ll give them room on the road when they give me room on the sidewalk.” Does he not see the contradiction in his own comment? Because he squeezes us off the road in his car, a cyclist is forced onto the sidewalk where they must dodge pedestrians. The logic of our community astounds me.

I have so much more I want to say, but the fury I feel is going to give me a stroke. Thanks for the alleviating humor.

I should note, in case anyone doesn’t click on the “while bikes are increasingly the exception” link above about Portland – your reference makes it sound a bit like cyclists in Portland are increasingly being excluded from things, when in fact, they are increasingly being given freedom to do things which motorists can’t (continue straight at certain intersections where cars are diverted, contra-flow bike lanes that allow bicycles to travel both ways on one-way streets, etc).

“And no drivers ever speed, run stop sighs or fail to signal. Or park in bike lanes, for that matter.”

The California Drivers Guide points out that parking in a bike lane is legal unless posted otherwise. The DMV test has a question that reinforces this idea. Someone should change that so we dont have to waste so much money on hundreds of “no parking” signs.

“A perspective that fails to consider that the overwhelming majority of adult cyclists have a driver’s license, and have passed the exact same test as their accusers.”

You are forgetting the fact that a reasonably large percentage of adult motorists *don’t* have a valid drivers license, reiterated over and over when I read “The driver was cited for DUI and driving with a suspended license”. Typically not the first offense.

When anyone brings up the “Cyclists don’t pay taxes” thing I just tell them “I am just following the teachings of Sister Sarah and Brothers Glenn, Sean, Bill, and Rush, refusing to hand over my hard earned dollars to the Government which will surely waste my tax money! I challenge you to join the fight!”

On another, related note: while I do not own a car and do not pay registration fees or gas taxes (since I don’t usually purchase gas for my bike), I do have a valid drivers license, which I only renewed so I could continue to rent cars when I need to. When I do rent a car, I do pay for fuel, and I assume that a portion of the fee I pay to rent has to go to keep that car registered. So even those of us that don’t own cars do pay these taxes, just not to the same extent as car owners.

I’m not sure if you’ve got minimum parking requirements there but here, unless its in a pretty small area of the central city all premises have a ‘minimum parking requirement’ which the cost of the land, council taxes and maintainance obviously gets passed on to the consumer. Also the rego/licensing/gas taxes paid never ever cover the cost of just road maintainence and don’t forget what wear and tear we do cause is only a fraction of a fraction of that caused by cars.