I've just begun a project which I fully expect to be a difficult undertaking for me. However it is one which I am very excited about so I'm willing to try and learn more about coding to pull it off.

I'm going to be starting out using the swfotefuss code, but I plan on stripping everything that is starwars based and changing the theme completely. I am going with an ancient roman theme.

The reason I want to start with an swr based code is because I plan on having the ability to travel by sea from different parts of the roman empire. I intend on changing the space system quite a lot, but I have no clue where to start or even what I'm doing once I find out where to start. The first thing I want to change is to remove the third set of coordinates from travel, that third set is useless in a nautical theme.

I have a few ideas for that, they may not be the correct way of doing things and I expect to be corrected if they arent. The most simple solution I can think of is to just hide that third set of coordinates from players. Leaving the coordinates alone in the code, and just setting the third coordinate to 0000 for all locations, as well as having to modify the calc and course commands to automatically input 0000 for that coordinate.

I'm unsure of what pitfalls might lurk in that method though and would like some input from anybody who might have experience in this area. Also, if anybody has any better suggestions for me I'd be very receptive.

You ought to consider travel time and landmass locations... otherwise you'll have your folks sailing along mountains, if you're not careful. The SWR code, generally speaking, sees space as a wide open place. The coordinates are stored with the ship, IIRC, and it makes checks for things like combat there. Also hyperspace, landing procedures, planets, multiple "space" rooms, all sorts of things will need to be accounted for. Personally I'm just using Smaug by way of LOP, and making a ship sailing system all out of mud progs, it's bulky though and I wouldn't suggest other folks do it. Short of making your own travel system, this may simply be the best way. *shrugs*

I considered using smaug, but I don't want the overland map system. I prefer the standard method of movement. Smaug would probably be a better starting point for me if only it had oceanic travel. The space system will work nicely for me in that regard though. Instead of Planets, I would use land_masses or continents or something to that nature. Instead of starsystems it would be called something else, territory or something. I'm not planning on having ship to ship combat, but if I do decide on implementing it in the future then a lot of the work would already be done.

By the way, if anybody is interested in helping me out with this project I'd be more than grateful. Currently I'm only looking for coding help, but in the future I'll need a LOT of building help since I plan on building a very large world from scratch. I currently have the code up at zeno.biyg.org port 3000 if you're interested. It's still stock swfote for now though so there is nothing to check out. I'm still doing a lot of research so I can get the right weaponry and armor for the period as well as political and military organization. I've already done a couple weeks of pure brain-storming and plan on doing a couple weeks of pure research before I do any major code changes.

KayleOff the Edge of the MapGroupAdministratorsPosts1,195JoinedMar 21, 2006

The space system isn't as well suited for this as you think. And you really need to weigh the pros and cons of having to convert the space system to work with oceanic travel versus writing an oceanic travel system from the ground up. There's also a metric ton of things that need to be taken into account for sea travel, that don't for space travel. For instance: currents, wind, curvature of the earth, etc. None of these things are even touched upon in the space system, and all of which are extremely important for sea travel, especially in the time period you're looking to create.

The space system isn't as well suited for this as you think. And you really need to weigh the pros and cons of having to convert the space system to work with oceanic travel versus writing an oceanic travel system from the ground up.

Well my idea is to simplify the system a great deal. The system I have in mind is merely a method of transportation that will get you across the mediteranean faster than walking or riding with a caravan by land would. There would be public passenger ships that you could take (ie: the pluogus) that are faster than land travel but require you to stop at every port along the way. But more powerful and rich citizens would have the ability to commission their own ships which would be the ultimate form of travel across the mediteranean. That would be the extent of the system. So my main task would be stripping out features rather than adding features.

There's also a metric ton of things that need to be taken into account for sea travel, that don't for space travel. For instance: currents, wind, curvature of the earth, etc. None of these things are even touched upon in the space system, and all of which are extremely important for sea travel, especially in the time period you're looking to create.

That's all fine to think about, but I'm not looking for a highly advanced system here. Though I am intrigued by a mud based on oceanic combat which would have that level of complexity to the system. But that's just not where I'm looking to go with this mud. I do think there should be "random event" type things that could slow your travel down, such as a storm here and there. But that could be handled without all of the calculations of currents and wind and temp and all that.

With the information given as to my intent, does that spark any new ideas for how I could handle this? And thanks for all of the input so far.

KayleOff the Edge of the MapGroupAdministratorsPosts1,195JoinedMar 21, 2006

I've already tried to simplify the SWR space system for use as an oceanic travel system, and I'm telling you, it doesn't work. You can't just strip stuff out and make it work. It would require rewriting a great many number of calculations because they're all calculated using three point vector math. And you only need two point vector math, and the values can't just be shifted, the math is different. You're better off writing something new.

I considered using smaug, but I don't want the overland map system. I prefer the standard method of movement. Smaug would probably be a better starting point for me if only it had oceanic travel.

The overland system is only active in situations where the exits from zones place you on the map. I've no idea how the space system works but I think Kayle is right in saying that it's probably not well suited for what you want either. Overland will probably require that things be added on to make it fit what you want, while it's pretty clear a lot would need to be stripped from the space system to make it fit.

It doesn't really look like there's an easier solution available than building your own system tailored to how you'd like it to work.

I've already tried to simplify the SWR space system for use as an oceanic travel system, and I'm telling you, it doesn't work. You can't just strip stuff out and make it work. It would require rewriting a great many number of calculations because they're all calculated using three point vector math. And you only need two point vector math, and the values can't just be shifted, the math is different. You're better off writing something new.

Alright, I'll bow to your experience in this matter. And after re-reading the description I gave for what I want to do with it I've figured out that I could just use a much simpler way of doing things anyway. I'm going to be taking another look at the available codebases and see which one fits the rest of my theme better.

Samson said:

The overland system is only active in situations where the exits from zones place you on the map. I've no idea how the space system works but I think Kayle is right in saying that it's probably not well suited for what you want either. Overland will probably require that things be added on to make it fit what you want, while it's pretty clear a lot would need to be stripped from the space system to make it fit.

It doesn't really look like there's an easier solution available than building your own system tailored to how you'd like it to work.

I might have to take a second look at that system and see if I can tweak it around a bit to fit my needs for other portions of the mud. But as I stated above I'm going with a different idea for oceanic travel that is much more simplistic but will have the feel that I'm looking for.

Thank you both for your input so far. I'd appreciate any further ideas or helpful advice you might have for me too.