Peter wrote:why to we always assume that peace is the natural progression for us and that an alien visitor would be peaceful, they just might as easlily decide that the arguing humans were the only ones on the planet that were devloped.

Yes... and this goes back to what I said in a previous post: it has even been suggested that we have evolved to argue (and we like to win) and not necessarily to be rational. It is whatever you decide what is right. One might decide to give up on thinking (or not focus on it) to solve problems in a diplomatic way (and an alien may not even hold this concept) and, instead, act according to the proverbial "survival of the fittest" code.

But in a world full of rules, where laws are enforced, and where certain concepts and illusions are promulgated, we don't have much choice. The ultimate way of living will be a consensus one (and even this one will have conflicts). If one wants change, one must strive for it. Becoming a politician in the system that we have is a start but one that many abhor.

Many of us like to winge about the world but the minute someone suggests that we do something about it via the proper channels (instead of protests) we are quickly put off.

But then again, it is also important to have focus and recognise what is important. Why bother with arguments and waste your energy when you can focus on being happy with what you have and who you love? In the end, consider what is productive. Sometimes being argumentative isn't the best method. There are other subtler ways. Check out work published by Dale Carnegie. Now that is a man using his brain, or, more precisely, using his knowledge on psychology to get ahead. As I said before, things are not black and white... so many grey areas!!

Peter wrote:Budda might also be considered an oddity and his followers the same, there are so many assumptions that to me are leading to a dead end. Science has followed one path, if we were to look back could we find minds that had different views but never got the funding or exposure to lead us in another direction.I think as far as aliens are concerned we are really looking for some other version of ourselves and not aliens, I am not sure we can even imagine what an alien might look or be like

Buddha is whatever you make of him. Sure, as the story goes, he had followers and they are still around today. The picture they paint of him is one that is quite remarkable. According to this picture, Mr. Gautama would encourage people not to follow him, but, instead, use his example to find their way - meaning that they wouldn't have to necessarily do what the man himself was doing.

But I can understand where the philosophy of the Buddha is coming from. He realised, through meditation, that the self is an illusion and that one can achieve a state of non-being, which, and he is spot on there, the closer you get to it, the more blissful it gets as conceptual reality disappears and you still your mind. I have reached states like these, and, although they may have only lasted for a split second...it was worth it.

Even Buddhism has been corrupted since the time of Buddha. There is a lot of mysticism that comes with it in its various forms, but, in its purest form, if you heed the story, the little prince was curious about the nature of reality and he was an excellent observer. Eventually he arrived at the conclusion that it is all mind. This means that everything we experience is a mental model. It is the first reli... ahem... philosophy (I don't consider it a religion) to acknowledge that reality can't be directly observed.

In fact, if you think about it, no creature holds the "true" picture of what the external world really looks like. You have to use mind projection... there is no other way. A bee might detect more colours in nature (wavelengths of light) than a human, a dog's vision is inferior but their sense of smell is highly developed, a bat relies on sound and so on. In fact, you could say that the colours we see are the codes made up by our neurons in order to describe different wavelengths of light. We are dealing with an electrical universe here...

On aliens: we can study carbon-based life and how it behaves here on Earth and then attempt to deduce, from observation, on what aliens might look like. Maybe they take up many forms according to the many different environments they dwell in. I wouldn't limit our imagination though, because, we can even imagine that which we have never encountered: a flying pig, a talking crocodile, a chicken with teeth...

There have been many depictions, however: Predator, Aliens, The Faculty, The Invaders, Independence Day... and The Darkest Hour - where the aliens are practically invisible to us! who knows, we might not even recognise alien life when we see it! Check out this trailer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUznviXV-U8

"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

Jack Reacher wrote:Yeah you cant really compare it to believing in a higher power, its not the same logic.

Really? When people hear "higher power" they immediately jump to God. I'm not talking about God, or some spirit. Something besides humans that have a better understanding of how things are, or exist. That's my version of a higher power.

uh.... your the one who is jumping to "God"... where did I ever mention God in my post? Kinda hypocritical

"There is theoretical abstraction, and then there is true abstraction."

It's a bit strange: I do believe in a "creator" but not in one that has created us intentionally. I do believe everything together forms a "God" but not one that is intelligent or self-aware.And I definitely do not believe in a creator of humankind.

The last "action" of the "God" I believe in was the Big Bang.

[ Post made via Android ]

This site is really helping me. I would like to express my thanks here, in my signature.~gamesaucer

It's a continuum. There is no present time. This is an illusion that we created. Every fraction of a second counts. There is no stillness (and even if you could stop everything from moving and just observe the stillness, time would still be there, or be conveyed as it passed, or the notion of it if you deem time itself to be an illusion too).

"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

yeah exactly, people always assume that time is moving just as we are. Like it bugs me when people say "time travel to the future is imposible because it hasn't hapend so there is nothing to travel to" well i see time as more like everything that ever will hapen has hapend and we just havent exsperianced it yet.just like places humans have never been or scene, they still exist .

Quantum mechanically speaking, it is often said that the universe secretly plays out all scenarios before concluding the most probable one. This is one perspective. On time travel, one can be sure of this: we can 'skip' time by travelling at speeds near that of light. Or at least time will affect you less the faster you go. In this sense, it seems more apparent that only travelling to the future is possible but you can never go back (well, so far it seems that way).

It's funny how in the film Time Cop it is the other way around. Travelling to the future is impossible but you can always go back. But don't the time travellers get back to their present time which is the future of the past time they visit (which really becomes their 'continuum present' the moment they enter it)? In a sense, everything has already happened. To spice it up, they throw the parallel universes equation into the mix (and this is a real possibility!).

Perhaps everything has already happened but at the same time, it hasn't always happened in the same way. In this universe you may be an atheist, but, in another, you might have completely let your guard down and allowed yourself to be influenced by a God-fearing cult!

In another, you might have never heard of Stephen LaBerge or Rebecca Turner and never discovered or even got to experience lucid dreams...

"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

. . . . mind blown ! any way summerlander you seem to have pretty decent knowledge of quantum physics and the like, do by any chanse watch the show The Universe on history chanel. its a personal favorite of mine .

Ty8200 wrote:I never said this higher power has to be a "being that created the universe". Again, jumping straight to God

well first of all you were totally taking about God you said that if you believed in aliens it would logicaly fallow that a " higher power " exists. what else were you taking about when you said " higher power"?

Ty8200 wrote:Do you believe that humans are the best and perfect form of life?

and no i dont believe humans are the perfect form of life, we get into far to many wars and all we can seem to do is fight and disagree with each other. and if you think about it what is the leading cause of war amongst humans? more wars have been staked in the name of God than anything else. I think if we can just put aside our differenses we might actaully make some progress.

... ... ... *Sigh* Just as I said, "higher power" doesn't have to refer to God. Just take a moment, you ready? Think of the words, higher and power. Simply a being of higher standing than us.

Reality is the sight, where reflection is the truth. Water is the glass, where deception is the stone.Reality is the cage, where limit is the lock. Mind is the key, where only the blind can see.

Jack Reacher wrote:Yeah you cant really compare it to believing in a higher power, its not the same logic.

Really? When people hear "higher power" they immediately jump to God. I'm not talking about God, or some spirit. Something besides humans that have a better understanding of how things are, or exist. That's my version of a higher power.

uh.... your the one who is jumping to "God"... where did I ever mention God in my post? Kinda hypocritical

Why do people keep misunderstanding me? "Higher power" doesn't have to mean God? Is that SO hard to understand? In my last long post, the one you and Golden Gram attacked me for, I said "higher power", not God. When Gram was describing what he thought I meant, he described God.

Reality is the sight, where reflection is the truth. Water is the glass, where deception is the stone.Reality is the cage, where limit is the lock. Mind is the key, where only the blind can see.