GOV. BYRNE: It’s traditional — and there are two sides to it. One is that if they weren’t going to Trenton, they’d be doing something better. The other is that they’re getting paid for doing two jobs.

GOV. KEAN: It goes back to the abuse in dual job-holding. We allow it in New Jersey, but most states ban it because of the potential for abuse. The whole idea of sick days ought to be reviewed. Sick days ought to mean you’re sick, not an opportunity to bank days for a nest egg. The whole system is wrong and leads to corruption. We’ve just never faced that in New Jersey. At this point, the taxpayers should be mad because they have to pay.

BYRNE: I had lunch with two members of my administration recently. Neither of them ever used a sick day, and neither got paid for accrued sick days.

KEAN: That’s the way it works in the private sector, and how it should work in the public sector.

Q: Gov. Christie has proposed requiring an exam for graduation from fifth grade. In the larger picture, are we in any danger of creating an education system that teaches students to take tests rather than to learn?

BYRNE: Teaching to the test has always been a bad concept. On other hand, keeping track of progress has always been a good concept. I think there ought to be a balance between the two.

KEAN: Kids in the current generation are the most over-tested and under-examined, in my experience. There ought to be three tests somewhere between kindergarten and graduation, preferably national tests. And they ought to be used to assess schools, so we can correct those schools that are not teaching kids.

BYRNE: When I was in school, we got report cards and that seemed adequate.

BYRNE: I have no idea how we get student loans paid, but I suspect there’s a big default level. I think we start there. My guess is we don’t pay enough attention to that.

KEAN: The student loan program is out of control. We started it simply to supplement a system wherein governments — federal and state — gave money to deserving students to ensure they got through their education. Now, it’s become a system that, as governments have cut back on those programs, leads to excessive debt. That debt often forces students into occupations they don’t want, but pay enough so they can pay back this onerous debt. It’s a question of government priority. I believe government has to do more grants. The other thing out of control is college costs.

BYRNE: A lot of colleges are really remediation schools, where students are learning to read and write. We can’t cut that out without replacing it somehow.

KEAN: That’s another reflection of the failure of public schools. County colleges remediate at least 70 percent of their students. It’s a sign our public schools are not doing their job and colleges are forced to spend money to make up for the schools’ failure.

Q: State Democrats have been talking about a bill to raise the state minimum wage to $8.25, above the federal level, because it’s more expensive to live here. Is this a good idea?

BYRNE: When I was governor, the Republicans chastised me for trying to raise the minimum wage to a dollar. So has it ever been.

KEAN: I generally agree with the philosophy that New Jersey’s minimum wage should be higher than the federal rate. But you have to do it carefully, so you don’t price a lot of young people out of the job market.

Q: A new report says the Camden and Newark areas are among the 25 most peaceful in America. Is the message here that we have been sensationalizing crime in those areas, or that statistical studies have limitations?