The 17" MacBook Pro has just been released. The 17" model has Firewire 800 and 8x dual layer Superdrive, both of which the 15.4" version lacks. The new MacBook Pro was presented during the NAB2006. The machine will cost $2799,- in the US, or round and about EUR 2879,- (differs per country) in the EU, or GBP 1999,- if you live in the UK.

Today's Ford Focus and 80 years old Fort T also "both had cylinders, they both required compression, and they both ran on gas", so you think they are in the same league, just Focus is "nicer"? Are you nuts?

Porsche is more expensive than Ford not because it's just "nicer"... if you dont believe me, talk to anyone a)whom you believe and b)knows something about cars.

Granted, a lot of Porsche's price is due to brandname, still the under-hood AND performance differences are real.

ones who buy the HP *specifically* thinking they are getting the same quality as an Apple are either very uninformed

ok, tell me what exactly inside the apple is of better quality than the hp's (remember, os doesnt count here - we are talking hardware)

>Today's Ford Focus and 80 years old Fort T also "both had cylinders, they both required compression, and they both ran on gas", so you think they are in the same league

YES... yes I do. Why? Because the point in this matter has nothing to do with engine internals/chassis design/etc.., the point is that an 80 year old Model T and a Focus are both in the same category (i.e. Automobile) just like the porche just like a range rover, just like lexus, etc... Just like an Apple laptop is in the same category as HP laptop (i.e. Computers)

>Porsche is more expensive than Ford not because it's just "nicer"... if you dont believe me, talk to anyone a)whom you believe and b)knows something about cars.

Ummm... I work on cars, Mercedes Benz and (older)Porsches to be specific. These cars are just plain engineered better than *most* of their american counterparts, are a nicer ride, and thusly command a higher price. If you need specific examples, I'll be glad to site them. I have a 420sel in my driveway right now, if you want to come over and compare its quality to a ford focus, be my guest.

>ok, tell me what exactly inside the apple is of better quality than the hp's (remember, os doesnt count here - we are talking hardware)

I'm seriously not trying to dog you here, but it seems apparent to me that you've never used an Apple (or driven a Porsche) before have you? If you think that simply comparing a list of numbers and part specs gives you a good idea of what the quality of the experience is like, then I don't know what to say to you to make you understand. The best thing for you to do (if possible) would be go to an Apple store and a Best Buy and try both of these computers to understand the differences.

To reiterate my original point, the HP might be right for some people (budget conscious). But people who think they are getting the same thing as the macbook pro *just because* on paper they have identical specs, are sadly mistaken. I type this from a thinkpad T30 that I just purchased. I could have easily had a similar or better speced dell/hp/compaq for half the price of the IBM. However, the quality of the thinkpad (titanium composite case, more durable keyboard, better battery, longer lasting internals, better reputation, higher resale value) was what sold me on it.

you sarcastically reply that it's the same as Porsches being priced higher than Fords.

me humbly retort that it is bad analogy because while Apple and HP are the same hardware, Porsche and Ford are REALLY different under the hood => thus difference in price.

and then you 1st claim that there is no difference between Porsche and Ford, and 2nd you flip 180 to claim that "Mercedes Benz and (older)Porsches" "are just plain engineered better than *most* of their american counterparts".
.... sooo ... what do you really-really think: is Porsche technically different-better than Ford, or not ?!

2) Apple and HP

I asked you to elaborate about what inside apple is of better quality than the same thing inside hp.

And you replied with marketing-blah-blah-blah-bs, like, "...dont simply compare list of specs ... quality of experience ... understand the difference".

"quality of experience" is inside your head (ie "opinion"), not inside apple laptop.

So I repeat my question: what EXACTLY inside apple laptop is of better quality than inside hp laptop?

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btw, apple's "quality of experience" exists 50% thanks to OSX/AppleSoftware being better than MS/FOSS crap, and 50% due to a sole company having full control over the system.