For those of you who don't get the chance...here is the call from the Lightning Radio PbP guy, Dave Mishkin. The old coger doing color is Phil Esposito. The are great together. Especially Esposito...he just doesn't give a **** and will say almost anything.

Also...these video recaps are done after every Lightning win on YouTube.

Vasy is a goddmaned witch. The save he made at the end of the game was amazing. I saw it at my bar and thought it was in the net initially. We're wasting a Veznia winning year from our goalie if we don't find some defensive help. Another 40+ shot night. Sigh.

Another thing that stood out...when he was on the ice, Sergachev is a really smooth skater. The play where the guy took out his knee is a perfect example. The subtle move Sergachev made...he de-pantsed that goof. He's goona be a monster, bringing the puck up the ice, in a couple of years. He's a better skater than Hedman right NOW. As soon as he learns the finer points of playing defense...I think his ceiling is better than Hedman. Hope I didn't just kinx the kid.

Rocker wrote:Lots to like in the last win. Lots to skeptical of as well.

As others have alluded, we are finesse team. That typically doesn’t bode well in playoff time.

That said; we’re probably the best finesse team of the past five years or more.

Going to be in interesting chase for the Cup, to say the least. I stand by my prediction.

Here's the thing:

We've been a "finesse" team for 3 years now. Stamkos, Kucherov, Killorn, TJ, Namestikov, Palat, Callahan, Hedman...even Vasy (2 years ago) have a PROVEN track record of showing up come playoff time. Granted...some have grown substantially (Kuch, Namestikov and Vasy) but this is what makes me weary of trading these guys. ESPECIALLY Killorn and Johnson. KILLORN has better playoff results than STAMKOS! VASY was a MONSTER in the playoffs a couple of years ago when Bish was injured...Tyler Johnson is clutch in the playoffs.

We brought in Kunitz for this very reason...leadership during a playoff run...and he's playing great btw...

We simply need that push to get us over the top. It reminds me of the Bucs pre-2002. Always close...never quite there. Until we were.

We're bringing in a defenseman. WHO is gonna really help in the playoffs? Karlsson is and has been gimpy all year (foot injury). Eckman-Karlsson (whom I LOVE) is a KID. Green? He's playing better D this year but do you trust that in the playoffs?

McDonnough seems to be the best fit...short term (Karlsson, long term). ANOTHER Ranger Captain. Playoff experience. Vanek (VAN...formerly DET...as much as I HATE that moherfucker) seems to be another guy...if you're going offense...having a great year...but he's old like **** (32 or so). Maybe good for the playoffs?

I'm just thanking God we have Yzerman to figure this **** out because I REALLY believe, in my heart, if we can figure out how to win ONE Stanley Cup, we'll win MANY after. It's that FIRST that's the bitch.

And it's telling how good our skill players are...we are REGULARLY outshot. Yet we lead the league in goals and gpg.

We (I haven't looked this up) average less than 30 SoG/game...yet score like a sumbitch. And I'm CERTAIN we give up 30+ shots per game. Thnks to Vasy being a MONSTER, we're somehow 4th in goals against.

We are leading the league in points. Goals for. Goals per game. 2nd on the PP. And I'm bitching about how we aren't gonna win a cup.

Alpha wrote:You could have stopped there. In hockey, goaltending wins championships. If Vasy can stay healthy and maintain this level of play, we'll find a way to score enough goals to win.

Not in the playoffs.

We aren't playing Vancouver every night.

You give up 35+ shots/game against a playoff team? They won't score 2. They'll score 5..because we're playing the best offenses. Every night. And we won't score 4/night (like we have during the season). We'll score 2. Because we're playing the best defenses. Every night.

Our current defense (and especially our goal tending) is playing well enough to win games NOW. That's all well and good...and important.

It's not nearly good enough to win in the playoffs. That's just a fact.

We NEED a quality defenseman to get right come playoff time. Koekkoek, Sustr, Dotchin and Coburn playing regular minutes, will get us beat. This isn't "speculation". It's a fact.

Reading a lot of Joe Smith stuff in the TBT on his interview with Yzerman, it doesn't seem like Yzerman is going to make a huge splash. I'm sure he'll trade for a defenseman, but it's not going to be a major haul, from the sound of things. But then again, Yzerman is a freaking ninja GM so who knows. There's not a lot of smoke or rumors out there.

I think if we make any move, it's going to be a rental. Going to be someone who's a free agent after this year. That's the cheapest option as far as what we'd have to give up.

Alpha wrote:And it's telling how good our skill players are...we are REGULARLY outshot. Yet we lead the league in goals and gpg.

We (I haven't looked this up) average less than 30 SoG/game...yet score like a sumbitch. And I'm CERTAIN we give up 30+ shots per game. Thnks to Vasy being a MONSTER, we're somehow 4th in goals against.

We are leading the league in points. Goals for. Goals per game. 2nd on the PP. And I'm bitching about how we aren't gonna win a cup.

#firstworldproblems

Still...

Currently, we average 32.3 shots per game and allow 32.5 shots per game. I'm sure here lately, the past 6 weeks or so, is what's gotten us on the negative side of that (even if it is just -0.2).

Alpha wrote:And it's telling how good our skill players are...we are REGULARLY outshot. Yet we lead the league in goals and gpg.

We (I haven't looked this up) average less than 30 SoG/game...yet score like a sumbitch. And I'm CERTAIN we give up 30+ shots per game. Thnks to Vasy being a MONSTER, we're somehow 4th in goals against.

We are leading the league in points. Goals for. Goals per game. 2nd on the PP. And I'm bitching about how we aren't gonna win a cup.

#firstworldproblems

Still...

Currently, we average 32.3 shots per game and allow 32.5 shots per game. I'm sure here lately, the past 6 weeks or so, is what's gotten us on the negative side of that (even if it is just -0.2).

Awesome find. What site?

Is it possible to nreak it down from say after the NHL Christmas break to now and before the break to now? I suspect it very different after.

Ironic that this game was the first in recent memory where we substantially outshot our opponent...and lost.

pewterpirates wrote:Currently, we average 32.3 shots per game and allow 32.5 shots per game. I'm sure here lately, the past 6 weeks or so, is what's gotten us on the negative side of that (even if it is just -0.2).

Awesome find. What site?

Is it possible to nreak it down from say after the NHL Christmas break to now and before the break to now? I suspect it very different after.

Ironic that this game was the first in recent memory where we substantially outshot our opponent...and lost.

I don't find it ironic at all. What stood out to me was two periods worth of hockey in which we couldn't control the puck between the lines, were consistently out-hustled to possession; and (GASP!) gave up odd man rushes more often than what's palatable. I'm still a believer that this team has the gumption and talent to compete for the Cup; but we desperately need a calming presence in our lineup right now. On the defensive side.

Edit: Those few moments at the end of the 2nd period and in the 3rd, we had a hell of a forecheck. But as alluded to earlier in the thread, emotion based play will only get you so far, and count for diddly-shit come playoffs.

Is it possible to nreak it down from say after the NHL Christmas break to now and before the break to now? I suspect it very different after.

Ironic that this game was the first in recent memory where we substantially outshot our opponent...and lost.

I don't find it ironic at all. What stood out to me was two periods worth of hockey in which we couldn't control the puck between the lines, were consistently out-hustled to possession; and (GASP!) gave up odd man rushes more often than what's palatable. I'm still a believer that this team has the gumption and talent to compete for the Cup; but we desperately need a calming presence in our lineup right now. On the defensive side.

Edit: Those few moments at the end of the 2nd period and in the 3rd, we had a hell of a forecheck. But as alluded to earlier in the thread, emotion based play will only get you so far, and count for diddly-shit come playoffs.

We clearly seem to be having a problem transitioning the puck from the defensive end to the offensive (and through the Neutral Zone) for long stretches. Sergachev is very good at it. Hedman is as well. Unfortunately, Sergachev makes poor decisions from time to time (as rookies do) and isn't on the ice all that much.

We clearly have the talent to compete for the cup.

Equally as clearly, we need a veteran with TALENT (as opposed to Coburn) to upgrade the D. Karlsson would be ideal...he is the guy who plays our style and is fantastic in transition. McDonnaugh is decent but is a much better pure defenseman. A younger version of Strahlman. Either would improve the defense...and our chances.

Here's the million dollar question:

IF you were reasonably confident you could re-sign Karlsson...do you give up Sergachev? I think I actually would...depending on what other pieces were involved.

If I was confident in re-signing Karlsson I'd pack Sergachev's bags myself. He's easily the best overall defenseman the game has had since Nicklas Lidstrom. Now look, everyone here knows Lidstrom was better -I'm just talking about being head and shoulders above everyone else. Give him a couple more years and we'll be calling Karlsson the best defender of his current era no differently than we did with Lidstrom before him and Bourque before Lidstrom. If someone wanted to make that argument now I'd have a hell of a time discrediting it. The man's talent is borderline transcendent. If you can make that trade and you're confident Karlsson comes back you do it. Him and Hedman would be a death sentence to play against. You can split those big horses up and play them both 28 minutes a night each in every playoff game for the next 5 to 7 years and the other team has 4 minutes to figure out how to exploit them not being on the ice.

Even better is the consequences of the power play.... Karlsson blasting shots from the blue line and feeding Stamkos for the 91-timer on the 1st unit and Hedman feeding Kucherov on the 2nd unit. I love Sergachev and I love his attitude even more but he's just a member of a very long list of young players that any fan should not think twice about giving up.

Right now I've just got my fingers crossed for our boring minute munchers in McDonough and Hjalmarsson

Swashy wrote:If I was confident in re-signing Karlsson I'd pack Sergachev's bags myself. He's easily the best overall defenseman the game has had since Nicklas Lidstrom. Now look, everyone here knows Lidstrom was better -I'm just talking about being head and shoulders above everyone else. Give him a couple more years and we'll be calling Karlsson the best defender of his current era no differently than we did with Lidstrom before him and Bourque before Lidstrom. If someone wanted to make that argument now I'd have a hell of a time discrediting it. The man's talent is borderline transcendent. If you can make that trade and you're confident Karlsson comes back you do it. Him and Hedman would be a death sentence to play against. You can split those big horses up and play them both 28 minutes a night each in every playoff game for the next 5 to 7 years and the other team has 4 minutes to figure out how to exploit them not being on the ice.

Even better is the consequences of the power play.... Karlsson blasting shots from the blue line and feeding Stamkos for the 91-timer on the 1st unit and Hedman feeding Kucherov on the 2nd unit. I love Sergachev and I love his attitude even more but he's just a member of a very long list of young players that any fan should not think twice about giving up.

Right now I've just got my fingers crossed for our boring minute munchers in McDonough and Hjalmarsson

thats just stupid, Sergachev will most likely be better than Karlsson. We can trade alot of other players other than Segachev .. pointer is off limits as well.

Swashy wrote:If I was confident in re-signing Karlsson I'd pack Sergachev's bags myself. He's easily the best overall defenseman the game has had since Nicklas Lidstrom. Now look, everyone here knows Lidstrom was better -I'm just talking about being head and shoulders above everyone else. Give him a couple more years and we'll be calling Karlsson the best defender of his current era no differently than we did with Lidstrom before him and Bourque before Lidstrom. If someone wanted to make that argument now I'd have a hell of a time discrediting it. The man's talent is borderline transcendent. If you can make that trade and you're confident Karlsson comes back you do it. Him and Hedman would be a death sentence to play against. You can split those big horses up and play them both 28 minutes a night each in every playoff game for the next 5 to 7 years and the other team has 4 minutes to figure out how to exploit them not being on the ice.

Even better is the consequences of the power play.... Karlsson blasting shots from the blue line and feeding Stamkos for the 91-timer on the 1st unit and Hedman feeding Kucherov on the 2nd unit. I love Sergachev and I love his attitude even more but he's just a member of a very long list of young players that any fan should not think twice about giving up.

Right now I've just got my fingers crossed for our boring minute munchers in McDonough and Hjalmarsson

thats just stupid, Sergachev will most likely be better than Karlsson. We can trade alot of other players other than Segachev .. pointer is off limits as well.

Please don't take this personally but I need to ask you a serious question. Are you a new hockey fan yes or no? This isn't a bandwagon accusation, I understand why the Lightning are getting discussion here. It's like the Rays a few years back, fans don't come to message boards to talk about losers unless it's a message board for that particular team -it's the Bucs here. So with that said do you know and do you fully understand what you are watching?

I'm going to make things simple to quantify Karlsson

Defensively he's 7/10

To put in perspective Hedman is 8/10 and it's taken him 9 years to get to this point -buddy we don't have 9 years to wait for Sergachev right now

Offensively he's 10/10 while so too does a guy like Subban

In terms of IQ he's 10/10

In terms of taking over a game he's 10/10

He is the Paul Coffey/Bobby Orr model that is also one of the most defensively proficient players in the league.

You're basically trying to say that one day a Mustang is going to beat a stock car that will be used in this weekends Daytona 500

In short.... no man. That is not gonna happen.

Karlsson is already a HHOFer and he's only 27

This is why I asked if you're newer because seeing Sergachev's potential now it's easy to think he may one day be better but I'm gonna tell you. It ain't gonna happen.

Right now Karlsson's equal is probably in grade school figuring out the finer points of skating faster backwards than he does forwards.

Last edited by Swashy on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

Jason Bourne wrote:thats just stupid, Sergachev will most likely be better than Karlsson. We can trade alot of other players other than Segachev .. pointer is off limits as well.

Please don't take this personally but I need to ask you a serious question. Are you a new hockey fan yes or no? This isn't a bandwagon accusation, I understand why the Lightning are getting discussion here. It's like the Rays a few years back, fans don't come to message boards to talk about losers unless it's a message board for that particular team -it's the Bucs here. So with that said do you know and do you fully understand what you are watching?

I'm going to make things simple to quantify Karlsson

Defensively he's 7/10

To put in perspective Hedman is 8/10 and it's taken him 9 years to get to this point -buddy we don't have 9 years to wait for Sergachev right now

Offensively he's 10/10 while so too does a guy like Subban

In terms of IQ he's 10/10

In terms of taking over a game he's 10/10

He is the Paul Coffey/Bobby Orr model that is also one of the most defensively proficient players in the league.

You're basically trying to say that one day a Mustang is going to beat a stock car that will be used in this weekends Daytona 500

In short.... no man. That is not gonna happen.

Karlsson is already a HHOFer and he's only 27

This is why I asked if you're newer because seeing Sergachev's potential now it's easy to think he may one day be better but I'm gonna tell you. It ain't gonna happen.

Right now Karlsson's equal is probably in grade school falling all over the ice still trying to figure out how to skate

you are wrong thats all. How long have you been a hockey fan? How old is sergachev? Who leads the lead in defensive rookie scoring? lastly have you been watching Sergachev play ? fact is he isnt going anywhere and will be here as long as hedman has been here .

Swashy wrote:Please don't take this personally but I need to ask you a serious question. Are you a new hockey fan yes or no? This isn't a bandwagon accusation, I understand why the Lightning are getting discussion here. It's like the Rays a few years back, fans don't come to message boards to talk about losers unless it's a message board for that particular team -it's the Bucs here. So with that said do you know and do you fully understand what you are watching?

I'm going to make things simple to quantify Karlsson

Defensively he's 7/10

To put in perspective Hedman is 8/10 and it's taken him 9 years to get to this point -buddy we don't have 9 years to wait for Sergachev right now

Offensively he's 10/10 while so too does a guy like Subban

In terms of IQ he's 10/10

In terms of taking over a game he's 10/10

He is the Paul Coffey/Bobby Orr model that is also one of the most defensively proficient players in the league.

You're basically trying to say that one day a Mustang is going to beat a stock car that will be used in this weekends Daytona 500

In short.... no man. That is not gonna happen.

Karlsson is already a HHOFer and he's only 27

This is why I asked if you're newer because seeing Sergachev's potential now it's easy to think he may one day be better but I'm gonna tell you. It ain't gonna happen.

Right now Karlsson's equal is probably in grade school falling all over the ice still trying to figure out how to skate

you are wrong thats all. How long have you been a hockey fan? How old is sergachev? Who leads the lead in defensive rookie scoring? lastly have you been watching Sergachev play ? fact is he isnt going anywhere and will be here as long as hedman has been here .

Sergachev is 19 and hitting the ****ing wall right now. You seriously think he got a week in the press box just because he took a dumb penalty?

Someone has to lead rookie scoring for D.... Almost half of Sergachev's point totals are from being one of the league's best power plays

The kid doesn't even take defensive zone starts or kill penalties and you're trying to imply he's going to be as good as the best defenseman of this generation

And for what it's worth "You are wrong that's all" is Bootzing 101. Don't go down that path because you're not gonna win

you are wrong thats all. How long have you been a hockey fan? How old is sergachev? Who leads the lead in defensive rookie scoring? lastly have you been watching Sergachev play ? fact is he isnt going anywhere and will be here as long as hedman has been here .

Sergachev is 19 and hitting the ****ing wall right now. You seriously think he got a week in the press box just because he took a dumb penalty?

Someone has to lead rookie scoring for D.... Almost half of Sergachev's point totals are from being one of the league's best power plays

The kid doesn't even take defensive zone starts or kill penalties and you're trying to imply he's going to be as good as the best defenseman of this generation

And for what it's worth "You are wrong that's all" is Bootzing 101. Don't go down that path because you're not gonna win

you are a ****ing retard ...we do not have to trade a 19 year old phenom to get Karlsson . ALL 19 year olds hit a wall you stupid motherfucker . Not sure why you are bring up your boyfriend ?

Sergachev is 19 and hitting the ****ing wall right now. You seriously think he got a week in the press box just because he took a dumb penalty?

Someone has to lead rookie scoring for D.... Almost half of Sergachev's point totals are from being one of the league's best power plays

The kid doesn't even take defensive zone starts or kill penalties and you're trying to imply he's going to be as good as the best defenseman of this generation

And for what it's worth "You are wrong that's all" is Bootzing 101. Don't go down that path because you're not gonna win

you are a ****ing retard ...we do not have to trade a 19 year old phenom to get Karlsson . ALL 19 year olds hit a wall you stupid motherfucker . Not sure why you are bring up your boyfriend ?

What exactly is phenomenal about someone who hits a wall? You know who didn't hit a wall at 19 and have to get sent to the press box? Hedman because HE was a ****ing phenom, he was the best defensive prospect in years. The same could never be said for Sergachev nor can his play as a rookie be compared. Now that we've had to resort to personal insults it's clear you're out of your element. Contrary to popular belief on this board it is possible to have a discussion without acting like a child.