Even more E3 WTF

I know I said I’d do a post about the new Tomb Raider trailer. I guess I lied. I’m just feeling really burned out on arguments right now and don’t feel up to having one that is sure to be both heated and incredibly entrenched with no hope of either side convincing the other. Been there, done that, not up to doing it again right now. So instead I thought I’d post some of the other E3 wtf I found on sites that weren’t Destructoid.

More booth babes

Looking at the various gaming sites, you’d think that E3 was a convention devoted to booth babes, not a convention devoted to gaming and other consumer electronics. The week after the show, 1up users apparently think that the E3 booth babe roundup is the top feature on 1up.com:

Lest you get the impression that E3 might actually be a show about video games and boobs, IGN would like to assert that… nope. It’s just about boobs:

Seriously? I don’t even know what’s the most messed up thing on this page. First you have the booth babe battle itself. Because, you know, it’s not bad enough that these women are getting paid to be ogled at and pawed over by grown men who really should know better. No, what they really need is for men who would like to ogle/paw at them (but can’t, by virtue of not being at the show) to judge their attractiveness and post these ratings for the world to see. Intrinsc is clearly getting into the spirit of things by setting a high standard for what constitutes a booth “babe” versus a booth “acceptable girl”. I guess it’s a useful reminder for us feminists, who are all (by virtue of being feminists) unutterably, horrifyingly ugly.

But let’s not miss that we can get “babeology” updates and exclusive content through social media. OMG! Creepy coverage of half-naked women as purveyed by a major gaming website? SIGN ME UP!

The weirdest thing in all of this is that Kotaku only had one article featuring pictures of booth babes promoting a game. Or rather, car wash babes promoting a game. Just one. So what the hell, folks? Since when is Kotaku the classiest gaming website out there? Did I fall into an alternate universe again?

Game Trailers

On IGN I also managed to find some fail-worthy trailers I hadn’t seen on Destructoid, like this trailer for Skullgirls – a hand-animated 2D fighting game. Despite being hand-animated, each character features skimpy outfits and, if you watch closely (it’s pretty zoomed out) BOOB JIGGLING. Now, automated boob-jiggling in 3D games is one thing since you can get algorithms to do the heavy lifting (heh) for you. But it just seems ridiculous in games where the boob jiggle is hand-animated. Don’t you guys have better things to do with your time? Like, say, balancing gameplay? Or are you too busy balancing other things?

I also found this awful Catwoman-centric Arkham City Trailer complete with crotchcam, asscam, and wannabe porn riffs. I didn’t think it was possible, but this makes me want to play Arkham City even less than the interview that Destructoid did with one of the devs about Catwoman as a playable character. Yuck.

Yeah, you can practically hear the fail a mile away. I especially love gems like:

Why such an out-of-the way location for a prominent show sponsor? My theory is that Atlus’ booth was just too darned sexy for the main halls.

Not only was the booth plastered with drawings of ladies in lingerie, it also included the newly licensed King of Fighters XIII. And when we sat down to demo the game, Atlus’ spokesdude Aram and our own Janine both decided to play as the decidedly pendulous Mai Shiranui. Swing low, sweet chariot.

And people wonder why gamers get stereotyped…

Of course, this is the same guy who wrote a feature about Irrational’s preview of Bioshock Infinite and titled it: Irrational Declares Grey the Color of Girly-Men. Then, rather than explaining this rather controversial claim straight off, his opening paragraph centers on objectifying all of the staff who work at Irrational. But hey, he objectifies them equally, which makes everything okay according to Jim Sterling.

Yes, despite the new Soul Calibur title taking place 17 years after the end of Soul Calibur IV, Ivy is going to be returning. And of course the question on everyone’s minds is: will Ivy be a MILF? In this feature, Michael McWhertor asks the important questions, like:

Would it mean a more modestly dressed Ivy?

and:

Would the ravages of time have an impact on her vast… sex appeal?

I’m glad someone out there cares enough to look into these important journalistic issues.

Two bits of actual E3 coverage win

Anyhow, the first is a video in which an E3 attendee videos a line to jump in a bouncy castle with a booth babe and sarcastically reminds the viewer that E3 is a convention for only industry professional. (That professional is a term used loosely in the gaming industry should surprise no one, right?)

The second is a bit of news I didn’t see on any other website and which actually makes me quite happy. Apparently, Lara Croft models at E3 will “never happen again”. Quite an encouraging bit of news when you consider that the Lara Croft models often did promo shoots that resulted in things like this:

Can't say I'll miss them

The fact that both of these come from Kotaku actually frightens me, but there you have it. Maybe they weren’t intending to be ironic? It’s hard to say.

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About wundergeekIn addition to being a cranky feminist blogger, I am an artist, photographer, and somewhat half-assed writer living in the wilds of Canada with a wonderful spouse and two slightly broken cats.

Oh don’t get me wrong. Rape is NEVER funny, which is one of the big reasons that Jim Sterling makes me see red on so many fronts. His insistence that rape jokes can be funny is just plain offensive. All I’m saying is that it’s nice to know that EVEN JIM STERLING is capable of finding rape offensive if it’s, ugh – can’t believe I’m saying this, “extreme” enough. As much as I hate the dude, it’s nice to know that there’s some vestige of morality hiding under that oversized trenchcoat SOMEWHERE.

I’m just amused at the amount of fans who are now all confused because Jim’s decided that rampant misogny and outright abuse of women (nopt done by himself) isn’t cool, even looks like some of them are turning on him.

I think one comment even accused him of being a White Knight feminist…which caused me to spill hot coffee in my lap :)

To the best of my knolwedge, Skull-Girls is a loli-fighter. What’s supposedly a fighting game, but is basically a non-stop gratuitous panty-shot of oddly well endowed underage girls. Fans of these games are the creepiest subcommunity of gamers I’ve ever seen. The presentation of women in fighting games is pretty bad, but games like this take it to another level.

“What’s supposedly a fighting game, but is basically a non-stop gratuitous panty-shot of oddly well endowed underage girls.”

It can be both, sadly. the Arcana Heart series is really good, so anyone seriously into fighting games is going to have to learn to put up with little girls in swimsuits rolling around in slimy green blobs. Same with BlazBlue. Don’t like the scantily-clad Chinese woman that orgasms when you punch her? Too bad; she’s top tier. Get used to seeing her.

I’d be a lot less annoyed if this shit only came in bad games (like Bikini Karate Babes. Remember that?) because then I could just ignore it.

The thing with fighting games is I like to get pretty in depth with them. While I generally try a few throughout the year, I can’t play them all to the depth I want. Loli-fighters are the first things on the “I’m not going to try this one” list for me. Arcana Heart could be the best fighting game ever, and I’d never know, because I’ll never play it.

In theory, my game purchasing decisions should be “all about the gameplay”, particularly in the fighting game genre. In practice though, I can’t get into a game where I’m playing a 12 year old girl with DD sized breasts bouncing all over and panties constantly coming into view. Most of these games won’t develop a strong competitive scene anyways, so I’m not missing much.

Skullgirls appears to be an attempt to legitimize the loli-fighter genre. It includes various tournament friendly features, and they make claims of balanced gameplay. Hopefully it fails miserably, as it deserves to.

“Loli”
You have no idea what loli means. Look up the word. There seems to be only one loli character in Skullgirls, and she hasn’t been in trailer yet. Big eyes, somewhat “deformed” design does not mean “loli”. Sakura in SF is more of a loli than any shown characters in Skullgirls.

“What’s supposedly a fighting game, but is basically a non-stop gratuitous panty-shot of oddly well endowed underage girls. ”
Nope. Peacock , Squiggly, and Painwheel (http://img809.imageshack.us/img809/4035/umbsprite01collar2.png old sprites, and not the whole proposed cast, but yeah) are just 3 examples of skullgirls characters with minimal sexual fanservice. This trailer is old and has footage from when they only had two characters done.

Additionally, being able to choose assists from any non-supers the characters have, a mixture of CVS’s ratio system and Marvel’s tag system, and various gameplay decisions explained by Mike Z(the head gameplay designer/programmer) make the game much more likely to be balanced and deep than a fighter made by a major company like Capcom or SNK. Hardcore fighting game players have a lot of reason to be excited, especially since Mike Z posts a lot on dustloop/SRK, answering technical gameplay questions and giving design explanations.

“Arcana Heart could be the best fighting game ever, and I’d never know, because I’ll never play it.”
Do you have to want to fuck the character you’re playing to play them? This could easily go into “Street fighter is for gays.” territory. All I can hear is, “Wah, i care more about character design than gameplay.”

“Most of these games won’t develop a strong competitive scene anyways, so I’m not missing much.”
Except you are, because games like Blazblue, Guilty Gear, and Arcana heart have had major scenes across America, and are fantastic fighters that nothing else

Additionally, I don’t think you’ve actually looked at AH3’s cast. Zenia isn’t sexualized, she’s badass. Yeah, there’s fanservicey characters like Mei-Fang, Kira, and others, but some like Saki, Zenia, Elsa, Clarice, and others are very tame and awesome to play. The game is not filled with sexualized characters. No distraction there, just ignorance on your part.

“Skullgirls appears to be an attempt to legitimize the loli-fighter genre. It includes various tournament friendly features, and they make claims of balanced gameplay. Hopefully it fails miserably, as it deserves to.”
1)You don’t know what that word means, and you have no perspective of how much fanservice is in the game.
2)As i’ve explained, there’s more gameplay reason to be excited for Skullgirls than any Capcom fighter.
3)Why would it deserve to fail miserably? Oh no, a brilliantly designed game with incredible 2d graphics has some sex appeal!! It deserves to fail because it has sex appeal!! I assure you that the average great movie’s uncomfortable “Romantic” scene is more offputting than the sum of sex appeal in skullgirls.
Seriously, who gives that much of a shit about 2-3 “typically sexy’ characters? Grow up. Just because it’s not puritan like you, doesn’t mean it deserves to fail.

Yes, that is what normal people would think, but this blog is fiercely anti-semantic; meanings aren’t allowed here. Words are defined as whatever you want them to be, and other people are supposed to guess what that is. (Guessing that “loli” is used here to mean “cutely-drawn female regardless of personality or body shape” when OUT51D3R says it, for example) I’ve had large arguments about this in the past; it’s not changing.

“All I can hear is, “Wah, i care more about character design than gameplay.””

The people here actually do care more about aesthetics than mechanics or control or AI or anything else related to play. Once again: they’re not open to criticism. But that’s a side issue.

The main issue is that bad interfaces (of which aesthetics is part) can only be justified by a correspondingly good game. Because aesthetics are based on individual taste, that can be impossible in certain circumstances. (For example: Do you regularly play Dwarf Fortress or Aurora? You should. If not, why?) The game isn’t out yet, and previews and marketing are notoriously unreliable, so it’s hard to blame anyone for disliking it based solely on what they know.

” Because aesthetics are based on individual taste, that can be impossible in certain circumstances. (For example: Do you regularly play Dwarf Fortress or Aurora? You should. If not, why?)”
I would not play dwarf fortress if not for graphical mods, but that’s a poor example.
The issue with default dwarf fortress is not “I don’t like playing as looking character,” it’s “I really have trouble processing this information on the screen.”

“The game isn’t out yet, and previews and marketing are notoriously unreliable, so it’s hard to blame anyone for disliking it based solely on what they know.”
This is true, and I do agree that they should have not put their “typically sexy” characters first through production and for display in trailers.
But honestly, at the same time it is hard to advertise the actual merits of fighting games, and so producers resort to cinematic attacks, sex appeal, anime, large rosters, graphical accomplishments and gimmicks in their trailers..but yeah, I can understand how someone would get a poor impression from the video. However, while I totally agree that uncommonly “sexy” women are far too prominent/common in video games, especially in advertisements like these, I don’t think it’s reasonable to go point out every game with women with big boobs and go “Boo hoo this game sucks because it has sex appeal.” There’s too many FPSes in western gaming, but I don’t make a post going “Here’s every FPS shown at E3. Fuck you, FPS #1! Fuck you, FPS #2! You’re all failures for having something we have too much of!”

“Yes, that is what normal people would think, but this blog is fiercely anti-semantic; meanings aren’t allowed here. Words are defined as whatever you want them to be, and other people are supposed to guess what that is. (Guessing that “loli” is used here to mean “cutely-drawn female regardless of personality or body shape” when OUT51D3R says it, for example) I’ve had large arguments about this in the past; it’s not changing.”

What? That absolutely makes no sense. While I can understand that for certain words, especially adjectives tinged with lingo, or philosophical terms, etc., the meaning is loose and based very heavily on who is using it(and how they’ve seen it used, and where they’re from, etc..) Being..against definition is simply being against language. If words don’t have pinned down meaning, you can’t push counterpoints and finely debate points because the words themselves are not of agreed substance. I can’t just say “Nazi” to mean merely “Republican”, even if I dislike republicans it is very distorting and dishonest to simply bundle a whole new packaging of implication on something else.

Additionally, judging by that poster’s other posts, the definition does matter. If they are not little girls, then sexualizing little girls is a non issue. The way someone ties a word to their argument solidifies certain key elements that they have to maintain unless they wish to abandon the coherence of their sentences and thought process altogether. Therefore, loli still means underaged to the person I was addressing.

That’s because Sam is creating a rather distorted straw-woman to knock down. =P

We might not be as strict about definitions as he’d like us to be (ie. we don’t accept his definitions as The Only Truth), but as you yourself recognized, there’s always a rhetorical purpose behind the loose language.

My guess is that OUT51D3R’s using the phrase “loli-fighter” to denote any fighting game with strong fanservice elements and cute characters with childish proportions (eg. four to five heads tall), whether they’re underaged or not, because sexualized childishness is similar in kind (though very different in degree) to sexualized children. That is, I think, a fair complaint if that trailer is the only exposure you have to the game, considering the look of the character who it focuses on (even if the “hope it fails miserably” thing seems to be taking it way too far; hoping for the team behind it to work on less… ah, exclusive titles instead seems like it’d be better for everyone all around).

“We might not be as strict about definitions as he’d like us to be (ie. we don’t accept his definitions as The Only Truth),”

You still don’t get it, Ikkin. Definitions are not and never can be truth, they merely tools used to communicate. As with all tools, they must be specialized for utility, else we get words like “gameplay” which means anything from “AI” to “interface”, or some. very confused persons talking about “loli-fighters” without reference to anything that looks like children. I’d be happy to accept your definitions, if only they were precise! But people have explicitly (well, as close to explicitly as possible, given the above) stated that that’s not how things are run here. Let’s just drop it.

“Loli” is short for “Lolita”. A “Lolita” is an underage girl made to be sexually appealing(the term comes from a book named Lolita, which is about a middle aged man having a sexual relationship with a 12 year old girl). Thus a loli-fighter is a fighting game focused on sexualized underage girls.

The game is named SkullGIRLS, not Skullwomen. In the characters section of the Skullgirls website, three characters are described. One is described as a schoolgirl. Another is described as a young girl. The other is described as a girl, with no implication of her age.

So, we have a fighting game where the playable characters are all female. Most/all of them are underage. The art style leans heavily towards anime. Gameplay videos are full of bouncing boobs and pantyshots. It’s got all the characteristics of a loli-fighter.

“Do you have to want to fuck the character you’re playing to play them?”

Quite the opposite. I don’t play these games because their intent seems to be to convince me to want to fuck the characters.

“Why would it deserve to fail miserably? Oh no, a brilliantly designed game with incredible 2d graphics has some sex appeal!! It deserves to fail because it has sex appeal!!”

It deserves to fail because the sex appeal comes from underage girls.

“Except you are, because games like Blazblue, Guilty Gear, and Arcana heart have had major scenes across America”

Blazblue and Guilty Gear aren’t loli-fighters. They are anime, and have some “fan service”, sure. They do not, however, have playable casts that consist solely of underage girls. Arcana Heart most definitely is a loli-fighter, and to the best of my knowledge has never been an official part of any large tournament(though it’s been present as a player run side event at a few).

Okay, I was trying to be submissive before, but since it appears I can question you, I shall.

“A “Lolita” is an underage girl made to be sexually appealing”

NO. See, you’ve confused “lolita,” an English term, with “lloli” a Japanese loanword, which migrated back here through the weeaboo community. The Japanese use is quite different, hence the “Elegant Gothic Lolita” fashion that’s only sexually appealing if you have some strange fetish for Victorian evening-wear. A loli is a pre-pubescent girl, (and this loanword is needed because “shojou” covers everything until before adulthood, if you need to know) or, by extension, someone making the pretensions of one (IE teenagers and adults in the EGL scene). It’s not something inherently sexual, hence the fact that they also have the word “lolicon”, short for “Lolita-complex” (the M becomes an N because Japanese words always end with N or a vowel) to denote that a person is sexually attracted to that sort of thing, which would be redundant if they were supposed to be universally attractive.

“The game is named SkullGIRLS, not Skullwomen.”

Perhaps English is not your first language, but it’s quite common to use a diminutive gender as a collective noun to be informal. For example, the comic book “The Boys” does not, in fact, star any pre-adult males! Granted, it’s often used to infantilize women, but that does not make them into literal children,.

“In the characters section of the Skullgirls website, three characters are described. One is described as a schoolgirl. Another is described as a young girl. The other is described as a girl, with no implication of her age.”

So, out of the three characters revealed, one is a girl in a full dress (excepting her literally skeletal arms) that’s explicitly designed after cartoon characters, one is a girl whose age we don’t know, but is probably either in her late teens or early twenties, and a high school girl. Not seeing much loli here. (Breasts, on the other hand, are another issue. I’m thinking Cerebella only has those extra hands to keep the twins from popping out)

“Gameplay videos are full of bouncing boobs and pantyshots. It’s got all the characteristics of a loli-fighter.”

Oh, for fuck’s sake. Lolicons do not like breasts. They coined the whole DFC (Delicious Flat Chest, if you’re morbid enough to wonder) acronym to make it snappy. Do you have any idea of what you’re talking of?

“Arcana Heart most definitely is a loli-fighter, and to the best of my knowledge has never been an official part of any large tournament(though it’s been present as a player run side event at a few).”

Okay, so it’s pretty clear you’re not familiar with this subject. To wit: if a large number of people consistantly gather to play a game competitively, then yes, it is a major tournie game. It’s admirable that you feel strongly about it, but you’re a bit confused. Try to do a bit more research next time.
Oh wait, that answers that.

“A loli is a pre-pubescent girl”
“hence the fact that they also have the word “lolicon”, short for “Lolita-complex” to denote that a person is sexually attracted to that sort of thing”
You sure proved me wrong there, didn’t you? Your facts are more specific than mine, but really don’t disagree with mine overall. You acknolwedge that the term’s association with Lolita. You acknowledge that the characters are children. You acknowledge that sexual attraction to little girls is common enough in the fan community that there’s even a word for it(and for some reason, that word isn’t pedophile).

“To wit: if a large number of people consistantly gather to play a game competitively, then yes, it is a major tournie game.”
Seems I’m somewhat mistaken on this one. It gets played at SBO. Does it actually show up as an official event at any of the big league North American tournaments though? What’s the average turnout at an Arcana Heart specfic tournament in North America? How much prize money is involved?

Skullgirls may not be full of girls in schoolgirl outfits(though there is at least one). Is that necessary for a loli-fighter though? To an outsider(lol), the defining traits of the genre are: all female cast, anime style art, most/all of the cast underaged, and constant gratuitous panty shots/sexualization. Evidence points to Skullgirls having all those traits. If it’s not a loli-fighter, it’s a pretty close relative.

Skullgirls is still creepy and pathetic but it’s not about children, (Once again, compare to Arcana Heart where you have only one or two token women with actual breasts) and your contortions to prove that it is a “loli-fighter” are showing that either 1. You are prejudiced against this game and are abusing the language to assault it, or 2. You think that false equivocation is a legitimate rhetorical tool.

But, okay, let’s assume there is no categorical or functional difference between underage and prepubescent. Now, we all agree that paedophilia is a mental illness, yes? If that is the case, then we must conclude that the legislature can cause or cure a mental illness entirely by changing an arbitrary number called “the age of consent.”

Or we could admit that sexual attraction to adolescents is perfectly normal (for both sexes) despite acting on such being problematic, and that said attraction to cheerleaders or whatever is in no way comparable to paedophilia .

But that’s just my opinion.

Oh, and as far as tournaments go, Japan’s is Super Battle Opera too minor for you? That’s just the first thing that popped into in my head, and if you keep your definition of loli-fighter (which you shouldn’t because it includes games that lolicon themselves don’t see as loli) then I guess we can throw in EVO’s Melty Blood tournament.

I stopped caring about booth babes stories on review sites because it is something that simply has only something to offer to my libido and since I declare war on my libido at least once a week I really am not interested in giving it ammo.

Yeah Skullgirls I’ll pass on that.

Again: Catwoman is a dominatrix in combat: she wears leather, she did not have it grafted onto her body.

OK you forgot to say that they were actually contemplating giving Ivy the ability of eternal youth just so they could keep her clothes, or lack there of, the same way as in previous installments, hey Tsunade can pull that of. Ivy? I think not, but I could be wrong.

The bouncing booth babe video was in the previous post in the comments, so I’ll just repeat myself: That is just sad ;( .

Actually when it comes to news about Lara Croft from E3 I am more exited about the fact that she finally has some proper pants to wear.

Also since you make it a habit of mentioning alternate universes so much and with intent to make a statement that you expected two-dimensional people and got real live ones instead, you should:
a) Start watching Fringe
b)Get a better quality sarcasm production neural network, your current one is outdated in both hardware and software.

You seem to make a habit of telling people what they should do. I don’t think it is appropiate or welcomed. And, as a commenter, I find it annoying as hell. It’s not the first time you feel entitled to tell people what to do, when in fact you are not. Consequently, I would appreciate it if you just limited yourself to state your opinions on the subject of the correspondent post, and avoided telling people what they should and should not do.

About the post, well, I’m not surprised gamers are generally regarded as the second most retarded bunch in the galaxy, just behind creationists. It’s well deserved.

Oh right. I keep hearing about how blogs are “the old technology” lately. I guess that means that my sense of humor is outdated too?

Personally, I’m quite happy with my sarcasm. It’s taken nearly three decades of marinading in cynicism and stupidity to ferment to its current cutting edge. If you’re displeased with the quality of my sarcasm, there are plenty of cranky feminist blogs out there. You don’t have to read mine.

No, I actually like your sarcasm most of the times, but you repeat the whole alternate universe thing word for word in every other post, it is getting stale and I am sorry about not saying that and instead telling you what to do, it was 2 after midnight when I wrote that and I am sorry about that, you are a free willed human being not a puppet spitting out programed comments. Now please I like you sarcasm very much most of time it is suitably cynical and stupid and blunt, but you add too much stupid when you repeat the one line over and over again, honestly it starts to look like you are doing copy/paste with your sarcasm and it weakens the point you are trying to get across.

And sorry if I hit a nerve with the whole update your sarcasm neural network thing. I was not trying to say blogs are outdated, they are not. I am just discovering that that blogs even exist and I am trying to learn how to use them to the best of my skills.

I honestly do not think I can give you an answer that will satisfy you CaitieCat but here goes:
Did not intend to make a point of telling someone what to do, but a comment on someone’s blog is your opinion of a post on it and in my opinion the whole alternate universe comment is the only thing that repeats itself word for word and it distracted me from the point of there being way too much booth babe content coming from E3. That is all I wanted to say.

Man, I haven’t read the comments here in a while. They all seem to be focused on yelling at you in various ways.

God, this e3 stuff. I just. Don’t they feel embarrassed? Like..I can’t imagine anyone proudly playing that SKULL GIRLS game. If it was me I’d have to alt tab over to porn or something to not feel as ashamed.

I’m fully aware shouting accomplishes nothing,but I’d like to add that not a single fuck is being given on my part.

So please by all means enjoy this dyke’s blog and her pathetic feminist rants.She truly embarrases me and makes me ashamed to be a woman.
Both I and 99% of the BSN now know to stay clear of her ramblings lest our lungs give out from laughter brought on by the hollow words of an aging feminist who needs a good hard dick up her ass. :)

“Despite being hand-animated, each character features skimpy outfits and, if you watch closely (it’s pretty zoomed out) BOOB JIGGLING. Now, automated boob-jiggling in 3D games is one thing since you can get algorithms to do the heavy lifting (heh) for you. But it just seems ridiculous in games where the boob jiggle is hand-animated.”

Why not? They’d have to animate hair individually as well. If one part of the character is completely static then it’s going to look bad. The problem is more the characters’ costumes (and lack of sports bras) than artists doing their job.

“Don’t you guys have better things to do with your time? Like, say, balancing gameplay? Or are you too busy balancing other things?”

1. Don’t use the word “gameplay”, It’s the providence of the ignorant. You wouldn’t talk about “bookread” or “moviewatch”, would you? 2. Graphics artists are not programmers or testers, so no, this takes away nothing except the dignity of the player.

I mean yes, those costumes are ridiculous, (Especially Cerebella. I mean, fuck, just look at that skirt there) but that doesn’t mean the game should have shitty animation.

1) New vocabulary words are decided by common usage, not logic. Virtually every videogame commentator out there uses the word “gameplay” to refer to a game’s ludic elements, so “gameplay” is both valid and appropriate for use in that manner. If we got rid of every unwieldy amalgamation of word parts in the English language, it’d be impossible to talk a significant portion of the major inventions from the last couple of centuries (“Automobile? Pfft, that’s a terrible name. You wouldn’t talk about a ‘manumobile,’ would you?”).

In any case, no one is going to agree with you if you insult their intelligence for using harmless words, especially when that’s completely irrelevant in context. If anything’s the providence of the ignorant, it’s thinking that there’s any benefit to acting that way whatsoever.

2) That depends on the model you have for employing your artists and programmers. If you can save money by cutting back on artist hours, that money could be used to pay for more programming or testing hours. And, even if you have the artists permanently on payroll, they could be moved over to another game that would be a better use of their time.

1. The problem isn’t that it’s a neologism, it’s that gameplay isn’t even a useful neologism. A lot of other words have been written about this. Check here for starters.
2. Well, first, you’re forgetting that programmers aren’t fuelled entirely by money. Human beings need things like sleep. Second, Revenge Labs is an indie developer, so I strongly suspect that they don’t have the ability to make two games at once in the first place. But this is a bit off topic.

If gameplay wasn’t a useful neologism, it never would have been created. People, generally speaking, don’t create new words if simpler ways to say what they want to say already exist.

I mean, sure, “gameplay” is general to the point of uselessness if you’re in a position to need to ask for specifics, like the game designer at the end there. But that doesn’t mean it isn’t useful if you want to talk about “things that affect how it feels to play the game” as a category or if you’re talking about some of those elements that you really can’t describe more accurately. (And, in fact, people sometimes do talk about books and movies in similar terms, saying that a novel “reads well” or a movie is “hard to watch” without that being the sum total of their opinion of it)

And in any case, this really isn’t the place to argue this. It’s Wundergeek’s blog; she doesn’t need to change the way she does things to avoid setting off your particular berserk buttons when everyone else knows exactly what she’s talking about, and she really shouldn’t have to put up with the constant derailing caused by this kind of complaint.

This. Guess what? Language is evolving and people invent new words when old ones fail. This is coming from someone who feels betrayed that Oxford has added LOL to it’s dictionary, so if I can manage to live with words like gameplay, suck it up.

And yes, you are very much derailing, which just wastes everyone’s time and energy. If you want to discuss something actually pertinent to the issues of sexism and misogyny in gaming, awesome. But please for the love of god STOP derailing the conversation into your pet peeves constantly. This is not the place to air your complaints about sci-fi, or about my use of language you don’t approve of, or of how we’re all solipsists. If you want to talk about those things, then start your own blog and don’t do it here.

1. My “complaints about sci-fi” were specific complaints about Mass Effect, which we were discussing. I hardly see how that was beside the point.
2. This blog uses non-linear comment threads, so derailing isn’t possible.
3. We don’t appear to talk about “issues of sexism and misogyny in gaming” here; that’s talking about gaming culture and psychology. What we seem to do is critique the sexual aesthetics of video games, although one of us could be making a category error here.

I thought recently that maybe just linking to corrections instead of reiterating them would be less disruptive, but since you’re not comfortable, I’ll drop the philosophy.

It’s clear that a lot of people around here seem to think that liking a fictional character with large breasts and anime eyes makes you a sexist pedophile, it’s ridiculous. Admittedly, having a game with nothing but these characters might be a bit much but I’m not bothered really, it’s just harmless fun. Personally I think the skull girls game looks great, very impressive for an indie game and I hope it succeeds.

Liking a fictional woman with big breasts and anime eyes isn’t a big deal. Liking a fictional -little girl- with big breasts bouncing allover the place and constant pantyshots is creepy as hell. It is not okay to portray children in such a blatantly sexual way.

I love it when bloggers who make scathing criticisms of games based on rather petty things (Oh no, it puts sexy characters up front and there’s too much of that, what a failure!) don’t even bother to research what they’re complaining about.
It takes like five seconds to google image search “Skullgirls cast” and find an image of the cast, or google “Skullgirls characters” and find concept art of characters, half of whom have minimal sex appeal.

New rule. I reserve the right not to respond to any comment that insults me. I may respond or I may not as the mood takes me. But if you direct a question at me and in the same comment also insult me, don’t be surprised if I don’t feel like dealing with you at the moment of me actually reading said comment.

Dealing with trolls is exhausting. I don’t need the people who regularly post here insulting me all the time either.

I was just coming to post this! Curse your speed.
I always enjoy RPS; their commenters are the closest to actual human beings I’ve ever seen on a general gaming site. I was so disappointed that they did a booth babe feature until I actually looked at the pictures. That article was hilarious.

Wouldn’t it just be better if you sent these suggestions to Wundergeek via PM instead of introducing them here where it may lead others on a random tangent? I mean, these are interesting links, but perhaps we should try to remain on track with these blog posts, no?

You’re right, I guess I shouldn’t really encourage commenters to bombard you with PMs, should I? I guess I’m just letting my frustration get the best of me. Ever since Ivan has join this blog he’s kind of taken it upon himself to direct the discussions here, which I personally find to be rude and unwelcomed. But hey, if you’re not bothered by it it really isn’t my place to complain. =)

OK this is the first blog I am commenting on and also I have a habit of adding to any conversation thoughts and ideas the conversation inspires and/or reminds me of during the said conversation.

Now I might be doing it on almost every post wundergeek has done since I joined, but it is the way I have a conversation: I wait for someone to say their thoughts and then I respond to them and also add any of my thoughts on the subject the person across me I think is talking about. Is this how most people do it, or is it just me?

Now wundergeek you already pointed to my wall of text habit and I corrected it. If there is anything else I am doing wrong for this blog please point it out as I am still learning how you are supposed to comment on a blog.

I think the one thing you can take from this blog is that it’s all right to state your opinion on a particular topic, but your opinion should never be stated as fact. I’m not saying that’s what you’re trying to do, Ivan, but sometimes it comes off that way. I think it’s great that you’re so involved with this blog and I certainly don’t wish for you to stop, just try to take it a little easier. I know you have a lot that you want to talk about, we all do, but we’ll get to it in due time. There’s no need to hit us with a barrage of random thoughts all in one blog post. =P

Not sure if you know this, but the man who took the video of the bouncy castle is Shawn of the famed Mega64, a sketch comedy group. I love the irony here– a man whose job is to make hilarious and often ridiculous videos is commenting on the “professionalism” of the industry. It’s so true.
On a related note, a few years ago Mega64 made a video that satirizes “girl gamer” groups who overplay sexuality for no apparent reason. Sexy64– finally a gamer group just for the guys: http://youtu.be/YiOpe8_q_fk

That’s the thing that’s most frustrating of all. Soul Calibur actually has a super-fun fighting system! They don’t need all this garbage – SCII had awesome gameplay. So the run to the bewbs just perplexes me…

I think every female character has a more “tasteful” alternate costume for plausible deniability, but no one ever cares about them, since most people don’t really give a shit about costumes in fighting games (Sophitia’s alt, for example. You ever seen anyone use that?) And our “news” media for games always uses primary costumes. That being said, Iv’y alt is still probably as bad as most other characters’ main. It’s bizarre.

SCIV makes up for it though by letting you put everyone in everyone else’s costumes. It’s hilarious.

“Despite being hand-animated, each character features skimpy outfits and, if you watch closely (it’s pretty zoomed out) BOOB JIGGLING.”

Nope. Do your research. That trailer is rather old and only shows the first two characters they had finished. Several other characters, like peacock(who I just linked), painwheel, and squiggly are nothing like that.

“But it just seems ridiculous in games where the boob jiggle is hand-animated. Don’t you guys have better things to do with your time? Like, say, balancing gameplay? Or are you too busy balancing other things?”

Wow! I didn’t know that artists are the ones in charge of balance and gameplay mechanics for video games! You just rocked my mind with your incredibly solid logic!

Skullgirls has shown itself to be amazing in several ways, despite the laziness of random bloggers. Your babble about balancing gameplay is hilarious considering how those involved with the gameplay design include people who are well known among the competitive fighting game scene, like Mike Z. They share a lot of info about their decisions regarding gameplay and balance with the competitive players, and it honestly has a lot better chance at being balanced and deep than fighters from major companies such as Capcom. Of course, you wouldn’t know that since your interest in the games is not about the games, but about how they present themselves. Cool.

Anyway, what did we learn today? Oh, right, sex appeal can never be in video games because there’s too much of it in the industry, and anything that has it is a failure. Cool. If only you openly condemned your own articles for much greater failure.

It is true that uncommonly “sexy” women are too prominent and common in video games. But sitting down and designating any game with male-oriented sex appeal as a failure or whatever is just hilarious and ignorant, especially when you make basic factual mistakes.

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About

Go Make Me a Sandwich was started in response to my growing frustration with the escalation of sexist imagery being used to sell games. The purpose of this blog is twofold: 1) to raise awareness about things that often just go "in one eyeball and out the other" 2) catharsis.

Comment Policy

Okay, folks. Since I keep getting questions on the new policy, this is a little overdue. I'm essentially using a super-simplified version of the policies in place at The Border House and at GeekFeminism.org, albeit a bit simplified into a few easy to remember rules:

1)NO INSULTING OTHER COMMENTERS.

I don't care if they deserve it. I don't care if they insulted me, or if they insulted you, or if they came over to your house and kicked your dog. Don't do it. If you come along and see an insulting comment, don't get bent out of shape and insult the other commenter. That will just get both of your comments deleted.

Keep disagreements civil. You are welcome to argue with other commenters as long as you are arguing with their points and not resorting to polemics. That goes for BOTH sides.

2) NO DERAILING

I'm not opposed to the odd off-topic conversation that springs up in the comment threads, but there's a difference between that and actively wasting everyone's time and energy so that no one ever gets to discuss what we're here to discuss. If you're not sure what constitutes derailing, please go read Feminism 101 or Derailing for Dummies.

If something gets to the point of derailing, I will post a bolded comment in the thread to the effect of:

[This is derailing]

Any comment after that that continues the conversation will be deleted. Yes, even those comments trying to explain why the original derailer is derailing the conversation. Talking with someone trying to derail the conversation is like punching a tar baby. It's best just to not get involved at all.

3) MY HOUSE, MY RULES

I get to decide what constitutes insults or derailing. Don't argue with me for deleting your comments. If you're really, genuinely puzzled as to why your comment was deleted, feel free to ask in a civil manner. But don't tell me that I'm being wrong-headed or stupid.