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The final goal is to ban all traditional climbing technique, to create one ethic.

Seriously? Are you paranoid?I think you need to travel more, meet a more diversed group of people/climbers, get to know them well. You may even tamper your extreme views. Seriously.I believe trad climbing is alive and well, maybe even gaining a little resurgence.

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"You have to decide to do a flag, where you can broke your vertebrae or a barn door depending of your pro" - the poster formerly known as Champ

luke the reason I get scared trad climbing is because R and X climbing is scary not because I bouldered. I know how to fall and trust a rope, blah blah.Yeah I don't see why you should be scared on 5.10 trad unless its r/x. Luke have you climbed Grimreaper?

I see lots of folks out there trad climbing. go to the Gunks on a warm weekend

Ah, but do they follow heuristic, superficial, safe parent rules or do they have a "balls deep understanding" like the man himself.Placing gear doesn't make you Trad. You need a secret international handshake.

I know guy, working a route for days, and finally doing a 5.13. After, they send it with the use of cam. Big deal. Go in a gym, try parallel bar, train a routine many time...and you will be able to do complex move. This is the same as climbing a 5.13 after many repetition. It could be fun, you could like it. But I don't like it. I prefer to learn like jackson 20 years ago when sport doesn't exist. And I am pretty sure that you don't learn by yourself, but with old climber with a strong trad ethic.

If you define trad climbing as some one who place cam in a crack...you are right that many people trad climb. In that way...the only think you can do is climbing classic with a lot of pro.

If you define trad as the people use to do it when they use piton and have to place less gear to avoid to be to tired, and you learn the similitude between hamp rope and dynamic rope and you use that technique, do multi pitch route in remote area, etc.. you never qualify 80 percent of the climber using cam as trad climber.

ordinarly, a good 5.10 climber can doa 5.8X route without too difficulty. There is always sand bag or situation that are very dangerous. Taking the decision to not playing the game of people who just plug cam in the rock versus challenging some one to place his life in danger just for there plaisir...I prefer to keep my definition of trad climbing.

Why does one need to know the similarity and difference between hamp and nylon dynamic rope in order to qualify as "trad" by ->you<- ? Why is knowing all that needs to be known about dynamic climbing rope insufficient?When was the last time *you* led on a hamp rope? Such arbitrary and asinine rule!

And answer the question put to you by Sam.

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"You have to decide to do a flag, where you can broke your vertebrae or a barn door depending of your pro" - the poster formerly known as Champ