for someone who has driven both types, can anyone give the negatives and positives on each. This seams to be a big reason someone might buy one car or another. It's actually the only "real" difference between some buggies.

PBS is a pain in the AZZ!!! Balls need maintenance, and add 20 minutes to all your front end work, plus the ball caps never go in straight and strip the Knuckles..I hate PBS and that was a major factor in me choosing the 808 over the Mugen>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>GO!!!

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i don't understand what could be that differant. I have 7955 servos the wheels should be tight with that kind of torque. I mean how different could they be? I would think the pbs would have more stability, they offer the greatest range of motion. if my car is on i can't even move my tires by hand.

I'd put my mugen against any other car when it comes to turning. I ran a c-hub car (kyosho) for a while and never had a problem.Now I run a pillow ball car and don't have anything negative to say about it.Both worked fine for me...

i chose pbs over c-hub for durability and maintenance. ive had 2 of both cars and the pbs got as much maintenance in a year as the c-hub got each race day. theres too many screws in a c-hub suspension to fall out or strip. and if one does fall out you usually have to take off 2 others to get it back in. pbs you can strip out the knuckle if you don't lign it up first but that goes for any screw, but once they are set you are done, just wd-40 every cleaning and open and clean before a big race. c-hub suspension has 2 small bars of plastic that hold the lower hinge pin, for the pbs its a steel rod. hit a pipe in the middle of the straight and pbs will outlast c-hub all day. as far as turning goes, setup has more to do with how a car turns than how far the wheels go around and c-hub has the edge here, barely. with some modding you can get more turning out of c-hub or pbs. the losi suspension is different somehow, its like a reversed c-hub where the hub is outside? it is very durable and turns a lot also and has been working for them for a while now.

Personally I have driven all 3 setups. I really like the Losi C-hub design the best. It is easy to work on and I have never had any problem with that design. The C-hub design usually stips out at the king pin bushings unless you buy the expensive aluminum set. Used to drive me nuts. And now I drive a pb system. It is very durable, but can be a bear to work on and setup, but has been overall very good. There is not much of a turning difference between them if you ask me. So I would rate it like this:

If tamiya support doesent get any better in my area, I'll probably change to Mugen or Xray, I'm probably going for Xray, just out of curiosity.
But deep down inside, I really feel for Mugen, with or without PBS!