I was exited until i saw the recent damage buffs to other classes which overshadow our AW buff. DKs just had their 2h passive buffed to 20% from 10% along with other buffs. I think its time for sword of light to be 20% too.

"I notice my rating actually boosts when I remember to have fun. Playing competitively while also enjoying yourself and focussing on having good games instead of getting rating is way more important.
After 2.2k the fun devolves into a twisted realm suffering and despair and you will quit pvp from extreme traumatic stress and you will probably xfer to Moon Guard and join some Belf rp guild and become a prostitute in Silvermoon."by Clukclukbewm

When I saw the AW and SoJ buffs I was kinda 'meh,' it doesn't really seem substantial enough. Personally I feel like Ret's big hit should not be like a combo finisher, off the top of my head I can't really think of any other melee who's main strike that operates that way. (Or just buff CS and if required adjust TV damage down to compensate)

This. They claim they don't like immunities as concepts, so why haven't they tweaked bubble? Make it closer to something like dispersion? Dispersion is like 5 seconds ever 2 minutes, while bubble is 8 seconds every 5, and can be dispelled. Bubble is so underwhelming these days, considering things like deterrence and dispersion might as well be immunities.

This. They claim they don't like immunities as concepts, so why haven't they tweaked bubble? Make it closer to something like dispersion? Dispersion is like 5 seconds ever 2 minutes, while bubble is 8 seconds every 5, and can be dispelled. Bubble is so underwhelming these days, considering things like deterrence and dispersion might as well be immunities.

Please check out my post about changing bubble (was locked by Fhi, since moved to the Tweaking Ret thread).

Did it Nairobi. Important stuff. Too bad it didnt came up before since is hard they change anything this big so close to deadline =/

"I notice my rating actually boosts when I remember to have fun. Playing competitively while also enjoying yourself and focussing on having good games instead of getting rating is way more important.
After 2.2k the fun devolves into a twisted realm suffering and despair and you will quit pvp from extreme traumatic stress and you will probably xfer to Moon Guard and join some Belf rp guild and become a prostitute in Silvermoon."by Clukclukbewm

I was exited until i saw the recent damage buffs to other classes which overshadow our AW buff. DKs just had their 2h passive buffed to 20% from 10% along with other buffs. I think its time for sword of light to be 20% too.

p.s. please keep all the pve out of this thread.

I think Sword of Light should have never been lowered to 10% in the first place. It should have stayed at 20% like it was in Cata. There was no reason for them to nerf it in Beta.

yeah I agree we suffer the most when it comes to switching targets constantly and our aoe overall is indeed weak. Yeah our single target is not that bad but still our finisher attack templar verdict dmg for example is nothing compare to frost strike or obliterate and they can do it way faster than our templar verdict which is suppose to be scary strong since we build it up then boom unleash it.

I think when they nerfed it from 25% to 20% we were pissed then when they did 20%-10% we collectively shit our pants.

Man, how I cried that night...

"I notice my rating actually boosts when I remember to have fun. Playing competitively while also enjoying yourself and focussing on having good games instead of getting rating is way more important.
After 2.2k the fun devolves into a twisted realm suffering and despair and you will quit pvp from extreme traumatic stress and you will probably xfer to Moon Guard and join some Belf rp guild and become a prostitute in Silvermoon."by Clukclukbewm

you guys gotta look at it like this: if blizz buffs a core ability such as judgement, crusader strike, or TV, then you gotta ask yourself if, coupled with wings, how much damage would it do? we have to find a way to buff rets sustained damage without it being affected if we pop wings (otherwise it could do obscene amounts of damage).

so far i'm liking the current changes they've done to rets (sacrifice being able to cleanse, better heals, lower cd on wings, etc) they've given us nothing but buffs, which is good, but it still doesn't address our issue of doing subpar damage outside of cds.

increasing sword of light's damage could be a good idea considering frost dks just got that as well. another suggestion could be maybe slapping a +20% haste buff to our inquisition to sort of make our rotation a bit more faster to pull off.

you guys gotta look at it like this: if blizz buffs a core ability such as judgement, crusader strike, or TV, then you gotta ask yourself if, coupled with wings, how much damage would it do? we have to find a way to buff rets sustained damage without it being affected if we pop wings (otherwise it could do obscene amounts of damage).

so far i'm liking the current changes they've done to rets (sacrifice being able to cleanse, better heals, lower cd on wings, etc) they've given us nothing but buffs, which is good, but it still doesn't address our issue of doing subpar damage outside of cds.

increasing sword of light's damage could be a good idea considering frost dks just got that as well. another suggestion could be maybe slapping a +20% haste buff to our inquisition to sort of make our rotation a bit more faster to pull off.

- First they need to stop keeping Ret under a microscope and get a broader perspective... to that end, while Ret might be a good burst spec, even Guardian + Winds + Holy Avenger is not the best burst in the game... so, ultimately Ret is being held to double standards as usual (Frost mages can be OP for 7 years and it's fine, Ret is never allowed to be above average for more than a few weeks.)

- Even if you feel that nerfing burst during cooldowns is necessary anyway, there is still no excuse for it taking this long; the solutions are literally countless and many of them are very easy to implement:

- Buff TV by 30% , nerf wings and holy avenger damage buff by 5%.
- Buff our glove bonus to 5000 PvP power, but make the effect not work while wings are active.

I can sit here all day thinking of solutions, they are endless and very easy to code. The big dilemma of buffing Ret sustained without buffing burst is really just laziness... there is barely a problem at all, and it can be easily fixed.

I have been playing Ret Paladin on the public test realm and reading the comments of the forum here I highly doubt any changes like these will be placed in game, on the PTR atm rets are in quite a good place and in blizzards eyes I think we are just right in their minds. I doubt they will increase sustained damage and reduce burst much as I don't think blizzard want to be changing how classes are played, as any changes to bursts for e.g. will cause lost of raging on the forums and in tickets as some players play Ret Paladin for this exact reason, this being said maybe in a future patch things may change but I doubt large spec changes like this will happen soon.