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The only real issue I have with SA is the Reyes fiasco. He completely screwed the pooch on that. I understand not making any major FA moves now and can deal with it -- in 2014 we will have a much better idea of how the pieces fit and can address trades and FA acquisitions based on specific needs. Not to mention, quality FA's will be much more willing to join an up and coming team that is on the cusp of contending.

I disagree. I think, they were well on their way prior to the trade. The Dickey trade just made them roughly a top 10 farm. They are driven by their excellent pitching prospects and that's with losing Harvey.

I wasn't implying that you were a jaded fan, and for that I'm sorry.

Well, I guess I liked the farm a little more than most back in 2010, and maybe I like that lower level piching a little less than most now. In general, I think our lower level pitching tends to get over-rated and our bats under-rated.

In 2010, Omar's last year, the system graduated Davis, Niese, Tejada, and Thole. Since then, it has also graduated Harvey, Gee, Mejia, Duda, Nieuwenhuis, Valdespin, Turner, and Fernando

It's also had some hitting prospects whose stock has fallen. Havens still looked pretty intriguing then, though he had missed time with injury. Ratliff looked like he might be breaking out, and he had not yet had the career ending injury. Flores that offseason was ranked the #10 prospect in the FSL, Aderlin the #9 prospect in the Appy, Puello #13 in the SAL, and Vaughn #3 and Ceciliani #11 in the NYPL.

Some of the names from 2010-2011 will look disappointing now, but some on this year's list will look disappointing 2 years from now. But on the whole, I think the only really high ceiling talent added in the last 2 years seems to have been in the two trades. I think the pitching development seems to have improved some, but the position players seem to have stagnated some.

Well, I guess I liked the farm a little more than most back in 2010, and maybe I like that lower level piching a little less than most now. In general, I think our lower level pitching tends to get over-rated and our bats under-rated.

In 2010, Omar's last year, the system graduated Davis, Niese, Tejada, and Thole. Since then, it has also graduated Harvey, Gee, Mejia, Duda, Nieuwenhuis, Valdespin, Turner, and Fernando

It's also had some hitting prospects whose stock has fallen. Havens still looked pretty intriguing then, though he had missed time with injury. Ratliff looked like he might be breaking out, and he had not yet had the career ending injury. Flores that offseason was ranked the #10 prospect in the FSL, Aderlin the #9 prospect in the Appy, Puello #13 in the SAL, and Vaughn #3 and Ceciliani #11 in the NYPL.

Some of the names from 2010-2011 will look disappointing now, but some on this year's list will look disappointing 2 years from now. But on the whole, I think the only really high ceiling talent added in the last 2 years seems to have been in the two trades. I think the pitching development seems to have improved some, but the position players seem to have stagnated some.

You make fair point about our positional players but imo our farm is quite a bit better then it was even without the 2 trades. Fulmer, Tapia, Montero, Mazzoni all look like they can be very good.

I will give you that our positional players haven't done anything much but Sandy also traded Marte (who was once considered one of our top prospects) who prob will never make it to the ML's for a young outfielder who should be a pretty important part of the team.

The main thing here is that more money needs to be spent on the Draft as well as International Free Agency. Especially on positional players.

Is the farm system better?
Some might say it is considerably better. Even the most jaded fan would agree with that.

Also in 2011 the Mets payroll was 140+ million, and the owners had an unsettling financial future. One would would say that had a serious impact on impending moves. And while k-rod was a solid player, his 17 million dollar vested option was absurd. Both Dickey were traded for prospects that would eventually or are top 15 prospects.

I would say that in his time here Omar improved the farm a lot more considering what he inherited than Alderson has. Granted, Omar a lot more time but he also was in win now mode and lost some top picks. I really don't think Omar gets enough credit for the farm system he took over and what he turned it into.

Originally Posted by Mike Piazza

But I have to say that my time with the Mets wouldn't have been the same without the greatest fans in the world. One of the hardest moments of my career, was walking off the field at Shea Stadium and saying goodbye. My relationship with you made my time in New York the happiest of my career and for that, I will always be grateful.

I would say that in his time here Omar improved the farm a lot more considering what he inherited than Alderson has. Granted, Omar a lot more time but he also was in win now mode and lost some top picks. I really don't think Omar gets enough credit for the farm system he took over and what he turned it into.

BA rated the Mets farm in 2005 as the 19th best, in 2010, the Mets farm was rated 20th.

"You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

BA rated the Mets farm in 2005 as the 19th best, in 2010, the Mets farm was rated 20th.

In retrospect, was the 2005 rating accurate? Was it more productive than the 19th position, or less productive. Which way, I don't know. And in a few yerars the system as it stood in 2010 may prove to be more, or less, productive than the #20 spot.

As you stated (I think) ratings are snapshots, but they don't always end up capturing the right details.

“The Wilpons and Mr. Saul Katz — the people who say they don’t care about the team are sorely misguided,” Ojeda told the newspaper. “These are the biggest Mets fans you will meet."

I'm really not sold on some of SA draft picks. I really hope Nimmo and Cecchini develop into good players but I'm not sold on them. The reviews on Nimmo have certainly been less then stellar. Don't get me wrong they both have potential to be good players but they still haven't drafted the potential star positional player. They also could have done far better then Matt Reynolds last year.

Players were not necessarily drafted in the order of talent last season. A team's 11th round pick may well have been higher on their board than their 2nd round pick. I'm not saying this is teh case with Reynolds, but it is possible.

“The Wilpons and Mr. Saul Katz — the people who say they don’t care about the team are sorely misguided,” Ojeda told the newspaper. “These are the biggest Mets fans you will meet."

Players were not necessarily drafted in the order of talent last season. A team's 11th round pick may well have been higher on their board than their 2nd round pick. I'm not saying this is teh case with Reynolds, but it is possible.

Why exactly would they wait until the eleventh round to draft someone higher on their board than they guy they pick in the second round?

You realize this is probably the biggest reach you've ever made to justify any of the Wilpons baseball operations moves.

Why exactly would they wait until the eleventh round to draft someone higher on their board than they guy they pick in the second round?

You realize this is probably the biggest reach you've ever made to justify any of the Wilpons baseball operations moves.

Because with the new rules, you can't sign a player over $100k past round 10 unless you have money left in your bonus pool from the first 10 rounds. So in theory you can overdraft a guy in say round 3 to sign a HS player making bigger demands in say round 13.

Because with the new rules, you can't sign a player over $100k past round 10 unless you have money left in your bonus pool from the first 10 rounds. So in theory you can overdraft a guy in say round 3 to sign a HS player making bigger demands in say round 13.

And how much money did the Wilpons spend going over slot after the 10th round compared to how much they saved going below slot early?

During this year’s draft, the Mets’ Bonus Pool was $7,151,400 and they were allowed to spend $8,351,400 without incurring any penalties under the new CBA. The Mets spent $6,285,400 of their allotted pool money leaving a little over $2 million on the table. In accordance with the new rules, only $185,600 of that amount will carry over to the next draft and it is included in next year’s spending allotment reflected above.

And the Mets lose the Bonus Pool money the Wilpons didn't spend on their second round pick this year. They only would have gotten it rolled over to next year if Stankiewicz had refused to sign for slot. Since the Mets tried to lowball him for less than slot they don't get the extra second round bonus money allotted next year.

They will get the pick, but not the Bonus Pool space. The Wilpons basically blew a high draft pick over trying to go cheap in the draft again. This is not a real rebuild, it's a phony act they're putting on to fool the fans and keep them quiet while they slash payroll and put the savings in their pockets.

During this year’s draft, the Mets’ Bonus Pool was $7,151,400 and they were allowed to spend $8,351,400 without incurring any penalties under the new CBA. The Mets spent $6,285,400 of their allotted pool money leaving a little over $2 million on the table. In accordance with the new rules, only $185,600 of that amount will carry over to the next draft and it is included in next year’s spending allotment reflected above.

And the Mets lose the Bonus Pool money the Wilpons didn't spend on their second round pick this year. They only would have gotten it rolled over to next year if Stankiewicz had refused to sign for slot. Since the Mets tried to lowball him for less than slot they don't get the extra second round bonus money allotted next year.

They will get the pick, but not the Bonus Pool space. The Wilpons basically blew a high draft pick over trying to go cheap in the draft again. This is not a real rebuild, it's a phony act they're putting on to fool the fans and keep them quiet while they slash payroll and put the savings in their pockets.

They spent slightly less than what they had to, not anything major. I would have liked to see a few guys here and there signed, but no one I'm going to lose sleep over. These numbers are not 100% accurate either as some player's bonuses were not leaked to the media. I think it's fair to give the Mets another year to utilize the new draft better.