p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

This is one of those posts which the poster basically answers himself. However, I would appreciate it if you just chimed in your thoughts. There are lots of wise people out there who surely are going to share something to ponder over.

A bit of background:
In 2007, when I was in for a new camera. I ended buying a 1D3 because the classic 5D was overdue by then. I didn't feel like buying "old technology" I told myself: " pay more, but have a body for a long, long time"...., naive me. Now I know the 5D classic would have sufficed.

I basically shoot anything, but I would define myself firstly as a traveller who loves covering his trips, secondly as a landscaper, and thirdly as the typical guy who covers his family events. Yes, no sports, nor fast action, nor birding. Although I am not an action man ( I do not need 10 fps) I fell in love with the feel and AF of the 1D3. It felt as a tool, so well-balanced with my heavy lenses. I can really appreciate those features.

In 2010, I wanted to go wide to expand my landscape photography. I had a tough time finding a high quality lens for the 1D3. Basically, the only choice was and still is that sigma 12-24, whose performance I simply did not like. My reasoning was.... if I had to add one more piece of hardware...., why not a FF body to go wide? That's what I did. I bought a 5DMKII

From the very beginning, I saw the gain in quality. Files from the 5DMKII are better, so when the 5DMKII arrived, the 1D3 began gathering dust. Standard people usually make sensible decisions, but I'm hopeless at it. It really hurt to see such a nice camera unused, so I sold it. Call me whatever you want, but it makes me happy to know someone else is making a better use of it. I am just a passionate amateur, I don't obtain my living by taking pictures. I do not need a second body to cover that part of my body where the sun does not shine. No bride nor groom is going to sue me if my camera fails. Notwithstanding this, I must admit my worst nightmare is breaking my camera on the first day of a trip a few thousands miles away from home. So now, I only have my 5DMKII.

What's the problem now?
My problem with the 5DMKII is the percentage of out-of-focus files, which is too high...., surely due to my lack of mastery. I miss the 1D3 AF here so much. On stills, it seldom failed, and tracking people on the streets on AI focus was so convenient. The 5DMKII can't touch the 1D3 here. I have just come back from Vietnam and even though I have lots of keepers, I also have a good deal of blurry files in situations where there is no explanation for this. I've checked the exif data of those blurry files, and everything is just fine. I must admit it's really nagging. Still, I'm happy I sold the 1D3 because the files from the 5DMKII are nicer, and have double resolution, the screen resolution does help when manually focusing my Zeiss lenses (1D3 much worse here), and I can go wider.

I am not planning to upgrade my 5DMKII right now. Let's say my camera is still within year and mileage, so common sense says wait, but I am already thinking over the best upgrade for my 5DMKII.

ONE: Logical choice: 5DMKIII
Common sense says the new 5DMKIII is the camera for me, but the taste of the 1D series is just there, nagging me. The feel of the 1D series is hard to forget. I could grip a 5DMKIII, but gripped cameras do not feel the same.

TWO: Tempting choice: 1D4
Now 1D4s have a nice price tag, and are selling at about the 5DMKIII price. These are the pros I see:

1. I would have a trusty AF, which is the only thing I miss in my 5DMKII
2. I would feel the touch of the 1D series again.
3. Files from the 1D4 must be very close, if not better, to the 5DMKII files in terms of image quality
4. I would keep video possibilities.
5. I would have the same same screen resolution, which is so convenient for manual focus

BUT... -big "buts" indeed:
1. I'd lose the wide range (FF) and I'd step back to the situation in which I could not go wide enough
2. The 5DMKIII is simply better on the paper. ( better AF, more resolution, better high ISOs)

However, those "buts" could be minimized if I kept the 5DMKII. The 1D4 would be my main nice trusty body, and the 5D2 would act as my wide lens, and my spare body for my trips.

The D3s is basically a 1D4 with a FF sensor at a very similar price, at least here in Spain...., and both Canon and Nikon systems are so nice, that's beyond any doubt..... BUT my lens kit is already completed. No way for me to get rid of all that nice glass.

If by now, after such a boring post, you guys don't feel like cutting your veins... please, spare some of your common sense...

p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

It's so da*** expensive!!! and the 5dMKII files are so nice... really....

Yes, a 1DX is the answer. When it becomes old and grey, with a younger sibling out there, a some nice Mr. 1DX2 or something, turning the 1DX into an unusable piece of garbage..., that will be the right time.

p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

5DMK3 may the best choice based on the type of shooting you do. I used mine heavily in Spain (Barcelona) this summer. I got some great shots inside La Sagrada Familia and other locations. Having 22 MP meant I could crop images to show different items of interest.

I also have a 1DMK3 and decided to leave it at home. Why? Because I knew I would not need the fast frame rate, excess weight, and wanted to get more pixels on the lovely scenery of Spain. Also, the 5DMK3 focuses better and faster than the 1DMK3.

p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

Never having shot with a pro DSLR, but shooting with a 1V SLR I can understand your need for that complete rugged body style and their top-of-the-line features...it's the best...feels great in the hand

But given what you seem to shoot you could nearly buy 2 5D3's instead of a 1DX. A higher keeper rate; faster more accurate AF seems to be your big "gotcha" and from what I've read (Fred's reviews of both the 5D3 and 1DX and others who use 1D and 5D bodies) the 5D3's AF is much better than the 5DII and enough for most shooters (those that don't concentrate on; as you stated you don't, action, sports or In-Flight subjects).

Given budget isn't a issue (kinda ) I myself would test both out (rent if possible for a day or two or a week) and really see if the extra $3.5K must be spent to make YOU happy; that nothing but the best will do!

As for glass, after reading your lens kit, which covers wide to short teles just fine, the only holes I see might be a macro (the 100L IS might make a nice portrait lens), a fast mid-tele (300 f2.8L with a 1.4x TC for kids events/sports n stuff) or a wide TS-E like the new 24 MkII for you landscape shots.

That $3500 might be spent elsewhere instead of on just the body. Your current 5DII would become your backup or one heck of a nice hand-me-down, starter camera for one of your kids

Just 2c from an old film shooter with lowly cropped digital bodies; my old 1V was sold back in 07, it morphed into a new (my 1st DSLR) 40D w/grip, a 70-200 f4L IS and the 2nd gen 100 non-L macro...that I still shoot with; until next April when I go FF with a 5D3

Enjoy whatever you choose, have loads of fun and show us some of your images!

p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

Well, just to toss a log on the fire, you could always consider the 1DS Mark III. You mention you want a full frame, excellent AF, high(er) megapixel, not $7k in cost body. The 1DS3 seems to fit that more than the 1D4. It is arguable which camera produces better images (the 1DS3 or the 5D2) but, regardless it is an excellent camera.

It's weakness seems to be ISO, especially when compared to any camera that came after it (the 5D2, 1DIV, 5D3, and 1DX.) However at 1600 ISO and below, most would agree is generally acceptable.

p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

jopeme wrote:
This is one of those posts which the poster basically answers himself. However, I would appreciate it if you just chimed in your thoughts. There are lots of wise people out there who surely are going to share something to ponder over.

A bit of background:
In 2007, when I was in for a new camera. I ended buying a 1D3 because the classic 5D was overdue by then. I didn't feel like buying "old technology" I told myself: " pay more, but have a body for a long, long time"...., naive me. Now I know the 5D classic would have sufficed.

I basically shoot anything, but I would define myself firstly as a traveller who loves covering his trips, secondly as a landscaper, and thirdly as the typical guy who covers his family events. Yes, no sports, nor fast action, nor birding. Although I am not an action man ( I do not need 10 fps) I fell in love with the feel and AF of the 1D3. It felt as a tool, so well-balanced with my heavy lenses. I can really appreciate those features.

In 2010, I wanted to go wide to expand my landscape photography. I had a tough time finding a high quality lens for the 1D3. Basically, the only choice was and still is that sigma 12-24, whose performance I simply did not like. My reasoning was.... if I had to add one more piece of hardware...., why not a FF body to go wide? That's what I did. I bought a 5DMKII

From the very beginning, I saw the gain in quality. Files from the 5DMKII are better, so when the 5DMKII arrived, the 1D3 began gathering dust. Standard people usually make sensible decisions, but I'm hopeless at it. It really hurt to see such a nice camera unused, so I sold it. Call me whatever you want, but it makes me happy to know someone else is making a better use of it. I am just a passionate amateur, I don't obtain my living by taking pictures. I do not need a second body to cover that part of my body where the sun does not shine. No bride nor groom is going to sue me if my camera fails. Notwithstanding this, I must admit my worst nightmare is breaking my camera on the first day of a trip a few thousands miles away from home. So now, I only have my 5DMKII.

What's the problem now?
My problem with the 5DMKII is the percentage of out-of-focus files, which is too high...., surely due to my lack of mastery. I miss the 1D3 AF here so much. On stills, it seldom failed, and tracking people on the streets on AI focus was so convenient. The 5DMKII can't touch the 1D3 here. I have just come back from Vietnam and even though I have lots of keepers, I also have a good deal of blurry files in situations where there is no explanation for this. I've checked the exif data of those blurry files, and everything is just fine. I must admit it's really nagging. Still, I'm happy I sold the 1D3 because the files from the 5DMKII are nicer, and have double resolution, the screen resolution does help when manually focusing my Zeiss lenses (1D3 much worse here), and I can go wider.

I am not planning to upgrade my 5DMKII right now. Let's say my camera is still within year and mileage, so common sense says wait, but I am already thinking over the best upgrade for my 5DMKII.

ONE: Logical choice: 5DMKIII
Common sense says the new 5DMKIII is the camera for me, but the taste of the 1D series is just there, nagging me. The feel of the 1D series is hard to forget. I could grip a 5DMKIII, but gripped cameras do not feel the same.

TWO: Tempting choice: 1D4
Now 1D4s have a nice price tag, and are selling at about the 5DMKIII price. These are the pros I see:

1. I would have a trusty AF, which is the only thing I miss in my 5DMKII
2. I would feel the touch of the 1D series again.
3. Files from the 1D4 must be very close, if not better, to the 5DMKII files in terms of image quality
4. I would keep video possibilities.
5. I would have the same same screen resolution, which is so convenient for manual focus

BUT... -big "buts" indeed:
1. I'd lose the wide range (FF) and I'd step back to the situation in which I could not go wide enough
2. The 5DMKIII is simply better on the paper. ( better AF, more resolution, better high ISOs)

However, those "buts" could be minimized if I kept the 5DMKII. The 1D4 would be my main nice trusty body, and the 5D2 would act as my wide lens, and my spare body for my trips.

The D3s is basically a 1D4 with a FF sensor at a very similar price, at least here in Spain...., and both Canon and Nikon systems are so nice, that's beyond any doubt..... BUT my lens kit is already completed. No way for me to get rid of all that nice glass.

If by now, after such a boring post, you guys don't feel like cutting your veins... please, spare some of your common sense...

p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

I just had a shot at a very nice 1DsMKIII, but passed. For me, I would rather have spent the money on a 5DIII to get the higher ISO performance gains from the newest generation. Folks who have them say the grip added to the 5dIII is the most ergonomic yet. All I can say is it can't be worse than the brick on my original 5D.

Try one and you may find you like it. The 5DIII is more advanced in some ways than the 1DsIII, and even the 1D4.

p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

jopeme wrote:
This is one of those posts which the poster basically answers himself. However, I would appreciate it if you just chimed in your thoughts. There are lots of wise people out there who surely are going to share something to ponder over.

A bit of background:
In 2007, when I was in for a new camera. I ended buying a 1D3 because the classic 5D was overdue by then. I didn't feel like buying "old technology" I told myself: " pay more, but have a body for a long, long time"...., naive me. Now I know the 5D classic would have sufficed.

I basically shoot anything, but I would define myself firstly as a traveller who loves covering his trips, secondly as a landscaper, and thirdly as the typical guy who covers his family events. Yes, no sports, nor fast action, nor birding. Although I am not an action man ( I do not need 10 fps) I fell in love with the feel and AF of the 1D3. It felt as a tool, so well-balanced with my heavy lenses. I can really appreciate those features.

In 2010, I wanted to go wide to expand my landscape photography. I had a tough time finding a high quality lens for the 1D3. Basically, the only choice was and still is that sigma 12-24, whose performance I simply did not like. My reasoning was.... if I had to add one more piece of hardware...., why not a FF body to go wide? That's what I did. I bought a 5DMKII

From the very beginning, I saw the gain in quality. Files from the 5DMKII are better, so when the 5DMKII arrived, the 1D3 began gathering dust. Standard people usually make sensible decisions, but I'm hopeless at it. It really hurt to see such a nice camera unused, so I sold it. Call me whatever you want, but it makes me happy to know someone else is making a better use of it. I am just a passionate amateur, I don't obtain my living by taking pictures. I do not need a second body to cover that part of my body where the sun does not shine. No bride nor groom is going to sue me if my camera fails. Notwithstanding this, I must admit my worst nightmare is breaking my camera on the first day of a trip a few thousands miles away from home. So now, I only have my 5DMKII.

What's the problem now?
My problem with the 5DMKII is the percentage of out-of-focus files, which is too high...., surely due to my lack of mastery. I miss the 1D3 AF here so much. On stills, it seldom failed, and tracking people on the streets on AI focus was so convenient. The 5DMKII can't touch the 1D3 here. I have just come back from Vietnam and even though I have lots of keepers, I also have a good deal of blurry files in situations where there is no explanation for this. I've checked the exif data of those blurry files, and everything is just fine. I must admit it's really nagging. Still, I'm happy I sold the 1D3 because the files from the 5DMKII are nicer, and have double resolution, the screen resolution does help when manually focusing my Zeiss lenses (1D3 much worse here), and I can go wider.

I am not planning to upgrade my 5DMKII right now. Let's say my camera is still within year and mileage, so common sense says wait, but I am already thinking over the best upgrade for my 5DMKII.

ONE: Logical choice: 5DMKIII
Common sense says the new 5DMKIII is the camera for me, but the taste of the 1D series is just there, nagging me. The feel of the 1D series is hard to forget. I could grip a 5DMKIII, but gripped cameras do not feel the same.

TWO: Tempting choice: 1D4
Now 1D4s have a nice price tag, and are selling at about the 5DMKIII price. These are the pros I see:

1. I would have a trusty AF, which is the only thing I miss in my 5DMKII
2. I would feel the touch of the 1D series again.
3. Files from the 1D4 must be very close, if not better, to the 5DMKII files in terms of image quality
4. I would keep video possibilities.
5. I would have the same same screen resolution, which is so convenient for manual focus

BUT... -big "buts" indeed:
1. I'd lose the wide range (FF) and I'd step back to the situation in which I could not go wide enough
2. The 5DMKIII is simply better on the paper. ( better AF, more resolution, better high ISOs)

However, those "buts" could be minimized if I kept the 5DMKII. The 1D4 would be my main nice trusty body, and the 5D2 would act as my wide lens, and my spare body for my trips.

The D3s is basically a 1D4 with a FF sensor at a very similar price, at least here in Spain...., and both Canon and Nikon systems are so nice, that's beyond any doubt..... BUT my lens kit is already completed. No way for me to get rid of all that nice glass.

If by now, after such a boring post, you guys don't feel like cutting your veins... please, spare some of your common sense...

5D3 would appear to make the most sense. You get your wide and you get your 1 series AF. And the lens rentals test showed the 5D3 (and 1DX) to feature ultra precision AF for stills mode with the newest lenses. You could get a 5D3 and new standard zoom for a little less than the price of a 1DX.

1DX means death by wife so that doesn't sound too good (and it's bulky, although you actually seem to prefer that, well the 5D3+grip is even bulkier than the 1DX so.... joy)

(if you swapped D800 would be better than D3s I'd think from what you talk about)

p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

jopeme wrote:
This is one of those posts which the poster basically answers himself....

...I am not planning to upgrade my 5DMKII right now. Let's say my camera is still within year and mileage, so common sense says wait, but I am already thinking over the best upgrade for my 5DMKII.

ONE: Logical choice: 5DMKIII
Common sense says the new 5DMKIII is the camera for me, but the taste of the 1D series is just there, nagging me. The feel of the 1D series is hard to forget. I could grip a 5DMKIII, but gripped cameras do not feel the same.

TWO: Tempting choice: 1D4
Now 1D4s have a nice price tag, and are selling at about the 5DMKIII price. These are the pros I see:

1. I would have a trusty AF, which is the only thing I miss in my 5DMKII
2. I would feel the touch of the 1D series again.
3. Files from the 1D4 must be very close, if not better, to the 5DMKII files in terms of image quality
4. I would keep video possibilities.
5. I would have the same same screen resolution, which is so convenient for manual focus

BUT... -big "buts" indeed:
1. I'd lose the wide range (FF) and I'd step back to the situation in which I could not go wide enough
2. The 5DMKIII is simply better on the paper. ( better AF, more resolution, better high ISOs)

However, those "buts" could be minimized if I kept the 5DMKII. The 1D4 would be my main nice trusty body, and the 5D2 would act as my wide lens, and my spare body for my trips.

ONE: The 5D3 is the best gripped camera to date, ergonomically. Build quality is second only to 1-series bodies, and not far off. Having owned a 1Ds, various xxD's, and a 5D2, my current 5D3 gets all use but sports compared to my 1D3. And the 5D3 does sports well enough, despite what you may read about 6 fps being insufficient. The grip is great, solid, has the extra 'portrait' joystick that I now reach for on my 1D3. It is indeed both logic and common sense that tell you the 5D3 is the right choice; you answered it for yourself.

TWO: a 1D4 will not have trustier AF than the 5D3; only the 1Dx does. IMO, the files from the 1D4 are very good, but all said and done it would be a stretch to prove them better. If you don't shoot sports (or similar), you don't really need the 1D, despite you wanting to feel the touch again.

BUT: Those are big 'buts', and sound more fundamental to your intended use than all the rest. The 5D3 is not merely better on paper, it is.

THREE: I don't think you need a 1Dx for your intended uses. We all want one...

If I could own only one, single camera, the 5D3 would be it, even over the 1Dx; they are similar in many ways, and unless you need the 10+ FPS, there isn't a better choice out there. If you don't need a backup, sell the 5D2 while it's still worth something and move on. You won't regret it.

p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

+1 on what Jeff listed.

I had the 1Ds Mark III and 1D Mark IV, among others, and I still prefer the 5D Mark III over all of them for my type of photography. I don't do sport but for birding/wildlife 6FPS works just fine for my need. For more reach, I combine that camera with a 7D and the combo fits my need perfectly, well almost .

p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Long and boring post: Which body would you upgrade to?

Jeff,
Those are wise words. Good to know that BG-E11 grip feels more solid than ever on the 5DMKIII. That is really good news.

As I said, it will be a long time before I upgrade..., my 5DM2 is only 2 and a half and photogaphy does not pay my bacon butties. I have already reconciled to that 5D2 AF system. Each gorgeous detailed file makes me forget about the blurry ones..., so I will keep shooting extra frames, just for piece of mind.

Despite there are new releases out there, these are times of change. I sense things will change a lot and in shortly. For instance, that 36mp Nikon sensor won't be alone for too long. High resolution on a FF sensor at a reasonable price has always been Canon territory until now.

That rumoured D600 will democratize FF sensor cameras even more. ( another Canon's kingdom at stake) If a low price nikon FF camera comes to stage completing that 36 mp sensor..., canon must react, the sooner the better.