Contributed by ben_conoley. Posted by ben on Monday, August 3, 2009 at 7:00 PM (EDT)

Cardiff, Wales' Future of the Left recently released their second record, Travels With Myself and Another. The band's vocalist Andy "Falco" Falkous recently talked to Matthew Bentel about the bands vision and goals.

How important was your sophomore release, Travels With Myself and Another? The band seemed to be shadowed by its predecessors, but has ostensibly outgrown those bands and settled its own course. Would you say this is true?

Well, I'll tell you in six months or so in terms of the wider perception but we moved on a few years ago. It's like having a really popular ex-girlfriend who keeps trying to kill you by leaving the gas on.

You're from the UK, so are not at the comfort of stateside media. Though NME has given a few nods to you, how do you think certain American media - especially, say, the influential indie webzine Pitchfork Media - have helped you? Do you think you'd be as successful in the states if it weren't for publications like them?

Doubtless it plays a part in terms of numbers in the crowd / inquiries to torrent sites but I'm yet to really convince about the effect of these media. Specifically in terms of the site you mention, many people at our shows are severely distrustful of Pitchfork in a similar way that a certain strata of British audience is suspicious of anyone they see get consistent coverage in the NME. Perhaps it's a game they play, post-hipster malaise tennis, but I've yet to find anyone with a good word to say about it.

This record seems to be getting pretty much blanket positive coverage but will that end up helping us out? Well, I'll be able to tell you in about six months time when I'm either writing another one or crying into my hands in some call center somewhere.

Your lyrics have been a major topic of conversation. They always get a bit crazy and maniacal but then always seem to come back to a point. Obviously intentional, but was this something inherent in your writing or a technique you picked up elsewhere and felt was more effective than writing more straightforward songs?

Although I'm obviously in thrall to my influences, as is anybody who opens their mouth to sing in the company of words, I don't have a particular form to my writing other than to limit its ridiculousness to merely silly. Straightforward songs hold little appeal for me so perhaps I'm reacting against that or maybe I'm just shit at holding onto a narrative thread convincingly.

Considering your lyrics still, coupled with the music, do you think you‚??re bringing a refreshing sense of rock and realism? The brash, attractive, if only because fanatical, though understanding, lyrics with the hard, low, trashing sound suggests your trying to speak on behalf of something larger than the typical band discourse; as if its miles away from simply making music and playing?

There's certainly no rhyme or reason in our existence other than being a rock band to the very best of our abilities. Although I would hope the music (whether recorded or at a live show) speaks to and of our personalities, I would feel awkward with the idea of representing anything other than ourselves through it.

Is there a certain concerted, directed message your trying to get across throughout the new record? On top of the band name, songs like "Arming Eritrea," "I Am Civil Service" and "The Hope That House Built" suggest some agenda, rather political and, while not completely denouncing any one ideology, considerable questioning the logic and the future of it.

There's no explicit message at all. It's important that we represent ourselves and only ourselves. As individuals we're political but I would struggle to convey the details of this in a three minute pop song.

How is going on tour with like a band like Against Me! Did that make sense for you, and do you think it added to your popularity? You guys seemingly share a lot of the same beliefs, destined to share the road together...

The tour didn't obviously make sense, not least to a bunch of their fans, but it was a particularly fun time which was ultimately incredibly rewarding. Interestingly enough their crowd was far more diverse and welcoming in the US than in Europe - I have no idea why this is. Reactions in Europe were almost universally diabolical.

Belief wise, well, the rock music fills the centre of both bands existence, and in that respite we are very similar indeed - all of our rock n roll is saved for the stage, and not for the lifestyle that accompanies it.

Then neither was I when you said what I just said to you. I said other music genres are bad, and here you're saying this band and 60-70% of bands are bad. The way you worded it is even worse, because mine had "imo" written all over it and yours is just elitist bullshit.

i agree with your point that old thrice is better than old brand new. but devil and god absolutely trounces alchemy. especially the fire side. the thing with thrice now is, if i wanted to listen to deftones, then i would rather just listen to deftones.

Agreed about BN better than Thrice, but the Fire EP is magnificent. I think it has its own flair compared to Deftones, both are good (and similar), but they are obviously different songs. I thought all of Alchemy was great, except for Air. Here's how it should go.

Your Favorite Weapon is shit compared to anything Thrice has released. Dude come on, seriously............."this isn't high school, this isn't high school, this isn't high school" and "tell all the english boys you meet...." ugh such crap of lyrics

How anyone could just feel "meh" about Deja or TAITA is beyond me. TIOS I can kinda see, I always looked at it as a collection of really great songs rather than a great album, so to a new fan, it would come across as not as good.

I didn't say it was better, I just prefer the sound of it better. I really hope I don't have to start putting "imo" at the bottom of every single fucking post I make, because everyone is really making it seem like I should.

Okay I did use the word "better", but I figured because we're all humans with subjective opinions that anyone reading my post will take that into consideration when reading said post. I'll go ahead and use disclaimers from now on. =P

Haha I wasn't trying to be mean, just to voice my opinion as well. Of course music is subjective, I just think those are some of the worst songs Thrice has recorded, and therefore make Vheissu just "okay" (IMO haha). Again, don't take it personally, I like discussing music with you, you're pretty open to new things.

It's not you, it's the general attitude or ignorance (for lack of a less 'harsh' term) of most people on here toward the whole subjective thing. I post my opinions on bands and people assume that means I have an ego, and even go as far as to make joke accounts of me and go around being egotistical assholes. I don't see why I'm singled out, all anyone posts is opinions. Maybe it's the way I come across, with my use of language or something? When a band's news is posted, I'll say something like "This band's early stuff is really good, but not so much the rest" and everyone jumps on me angrily. I didn't say "objectively, as the god of all musical taste, nothing else is worth listening to, only their early stuff. Anyone who says otherwise I will do away with". I'm expecting everyone to say their own opinions and everyone does. But it's ME who gets shit for it.

You'll never see me reply to someone else's post saying they're wrong, ever. I make sure I don't. I'll say "oh I prefer this one", but that's it.

Or MAYBE it's all just because I only really talk about music and other people talk about random unrelated shit, so I got a rep as the person who thinks he's a music authority. But really I'm just always voicing my opinions on bands, on a site about music. Aaaanyway. That's that.

It's BECAUSE I'm a new fan. I didn't try to get into them until I'd already dismissed them as crap like all the other bands they're placed with (but are better than). So it's my preconceptions that ruin the earlier albums for me. Odd that I'm aware of that but still can't get over it when listening. That mostly applies to the older Thrice albums, Deja Entendu I just find doesn't come close to TDAGARIM, and I don't feel any desire to listen to it again. I explained it pretty well to someone last time I got in on one of these Brand New/Thrice conversations, I wish I could copy and paste that.

I find it strange that "Tautou" leading into "Sic Transit" leading into "Good To Know..." leading into "Okay, I Believe You...", etc. does nothing for you. I don't know why, I just find that really odd. Especially for a fellow stoner.

YFW is just a fun pop punk album, but easily their worst of the 3 and shouldn't be taken into consideration when thinking of Brand New's sound. Especially for comparison with other bands. The Devil and God... > Deja Entendu > The Alchemy Index (only one I've heard, but I figured since it's their newest it'd be their most evolved).

i did really enjoy deja entendu, but devil and god is just boring to me. thrice is just an all time favorite band of mine. plus i just really enjoy all their albums, everyone is different in it's own awesome way.

Didn't think you were the type to like that kind of stuff. I can't take Brand New seriously at all. And people always call Thrice pretentious but when I saw Brand New live, it seemed like they thought they were the biggest/deepest rock band of all time. So boring.

I hated Thrice live when I saw them on tour with Rise Against / Alkaline Trio / Gaslight Anthem. It just sounded like nonstop screaming, at least live. Recorded it was better. I could see it growing on me, but we'll see. Have yet to see Brand New live.

Brand New live is killer. Jesse does the brooding "I don't care" thing so well. Then he adds some random bursts of energy and showmanship during the harder parts, it's great. Always sings his heart out, and Vinnie's harmonies are spot on.

you really should have gotten in on Thrice between the Identity Crisis-Artist in the Ambulance era. i saw them more than any band between that time, they were just amazing. i haven't seem them since, but i will on Halloween night when they play with Brand New. I've seen Brand new once, after Deja Entendu, and they were pretty good.

yea tim did the same thing in houston, it was cool though saved me money. only thing that sucked about that night was that i had to leave before Thrice played, my daughter got sick that night and had to take her to the hospital. You are so correct, Thrice as musicians and song writers are way better than brand new.

Eeesh. That's rough but understandable. That Thrice show in Austin got moved to the Red 7 so I got to see them with no barricade which is pretty unheard of these days. It was sickkkk. They played the obvious newer songs along with Betrayal Is A Symptom and Kill Me Quickly. Amazing.

the show in houston got moved from the verizon wireless theater to the meridian, also no barricades, but all i saw were the gaslight anthem. ok for the last time, i promise, brand new and thrice will be epic on halloween night, but it also is at the wireless theater. meaning $30 tickets. yeah i know SF>Houston, you win in the long run. thats the last time, i swear

ive seen bn twice and both times jesse seemed totally into it. the second time vinnie was hanging from the rafters upside down playing a guitar solo. thrice actually opened for them the second time and stood completely still for an hour.

It kind of makes sense, though. You can judge a band by their beliefs, ideals and actions, as long as you don't try to argue that their music sucks because of it when otherwise you'd say it didn't suck. There are bands I would like more if not for things they have done, do or believe in. Though I'm not going to say it objectively changes their music itself, because it obviously doesn't. I think I made some sense here, maybe not.

to be honest I don't like thrice because a lame kid named XvolcomX on the warped tour board circa 2001 was uber high on them. I don't know if I've ever actually listened to a single note, and I actually have 2 brand new songs on my ipod.

eh. I checked out some songs on itunes and they just seem whiny voiced and real angry about it. I just can't do any music like that.

But thatsyouth, I'm surprised you don't do any electric geeter, being into this kindof music. I mean all judgementalism aside, how do you love listening to eeeeewananawaawawaanaanaaanaaaa-eeeeeee yet enjoy sitting there strumming and plucking out your andalusian awesomeness?

Yeah, bands can have off-nights too. I saw Kid Dynamite only once before they broke up and was really disappointed.

I'm still surprised I only saw SM once since I was so devoted to their first two albums. They were good but not great--they headlined with Telegraph, actually. Nothing special. Again, it could have been an off-night. Bands are allowed to have those too.

Mclusky, well, they just have a certaihn abrasive noise rock influence that appeals to me greatly. Yet, buried under this raw, abrasive and pounding exterior is a certain pop aesthetic. this is what seperates them from their peers, as they werent afraid to write a straight up pop song but, then sontinue to fill it was awkward screeching guitars and surreal lyrics that would alienate any sensible person. Mclusky's wit can be straightforward or subtle, either way, its always appealed to me. Despite this, they always had an eclectic nature that expanded through different genres while retaining thier sound.

Future of the Left is an obvious extension of my obsession of Mclusky. Though poppier, they have evolved from their last album to have a more New Wave influenced sound. Despite the cleaner vocals and music, they still rock harder than any other band out there. And all of that surrealism has extended itself from mclusky to FOTL.

Okay but what I'm saying is they don't deserve to be shit on. They're really nice dudes making fun music that a lot of people enjoy. They're not offending anyone, invading anything or being annoying. I know that a lot of people dislike them here, but they go all out and 'hate on' them all the time and I don't get it.

Well, I don't think most of the bands covered on this site deserve to be shit on. I just wouldn't go out of my way to include them in that sentence because I'm basically professing my love for PBC and Gaslight (to an extent, I think both are overrated here). I don't love Fake Problems, but I won't talk shit on them either. No band that works that hard deserves it.

"If you pre-order Chuck Ragan's new record right now from SideOneDummy.com you will get a free picture disc 7". Also if you enter the code BLUNDER (case sensitive) for the next 24 hours we will give you an additional 20% off."

My GF works at Chili's. Their Jalapeno Smokehouse Burger or whatever is the absolute tits, like I can't order anything else ever, and I've had it probably 30 times in the last year. The giant bacon on that sucker is incredible. Coincidentally, her best friend (and a good friend of mine) went to the RBF/Beat show last night and said it was epic. Thought you'd appreciate that.

- masturbate a hell of a lot
- even if you're not playing, position your fingers to make the chords, and PRESS on the strings, then slide them up and down, much like the first tip
- scales FTW

play loud and as hard as you can. Honestly one night I just started banging out these three chords with all my heart for like 45 minutes straight, just cause I was feeling it so much, after that I've felt I have more command than ever before. I've been a noodler for a decade plus now though. You gotta find stuff you enjoy playing and or can sing to. Find easy songs that are fun. there are a lot of great songs that are 3 or 4 chords. Once you've got them down pat you'll just sit there playing them mindlessly and then the callouses will come.

yeah I have a fairly cheap acoustic too. Ha wow yeah, I remember playing that and being quite happy way back when. It's a good starter song. Not to suggest that I'm so far beyond starter. If its easy and can come off sound decent sounding I'm all in.

also figuring stuff out for yourself is definitely a plus. Two nights ago I was just sitting there strumming C and F and I was like "oh shit that's Tiny Dancer!!!! omg!!!!" And I can play it way better than just reading the tabs now.

i hate when you ask someone what kind of music they listen to and they respond, "everything". this is the most idiotic fucking thing in the world to me. do you listen to acid jazz? do you listen to polka? then you dont actually listen to everything.

I used to get angry/confused but now I just realize "everything" is synonymous for "very little" or "whatever's on the radio". Some people just aren't music fans. Though I think everyone has the potential to be one if they find a certain kind of music they really like and explore it.

most people are stupid though, and when people ask me something like that I know they don't want to get in to any sort of complexity beyond top 40 radio. Most people when they ask that mean top 40 radio or country from my experience. It's hard to convey that you have an open mind without saying everything.

That bugs me, too. The people at my work are like that. They think I hate music and tv because I don't listen to top 40 radio and reality tv. When I tell them what I listen to/watch they act like I'm making it up.

That is one of my biggest pet peeves. My other is people who say they are big 'movie buffs' but refuse to watch black and white movies, dismiss all animation as 'kid's stuff,' and haven't seen anything pre-Godfather. I know so many people who call themselves 'movie buffs' because they see the three biggest blockbusters of the summer plus the best picture winner (after it wins).

Okay. Heres the deal.
He told me to go ahead and tell you that he can go, but I would feel like an absolute fuck-tard if I already told you yes, then on Wed his parents said no. He said its extremely unlikely that they will not let him go. He also said he will most likely go regaurdless if they say yes or no.

dudley hasn't contacted me back. he's supposed to be my room but i haven't heard from him. depending on when MNpunkmaster is rolling into town, i might need to crash on the floor if we'll be there thursday. I just made reservation at the holiday inn for fri-sun nights. thursday is sold the fuck out.

I completely agree. I as well want to leave wednesay night. I have a class that doesn't get out until 5:30 so I hope you're cool with that. I want to hear back fron MNpunkmaster before i can be locked into something.

The show where the (not that) fat guy tries to find the love of his life through a bunch of (really) fat chicks is on.
They list their height and weight whenever they do a one on one with the camera. Some of the girls are beasts.

I don't mean huge, huge, I just like more meat on them bones than I think most guys. Or at least I don't mind it, it's not a fetish or anything for me. As long as she's got a pretty face, and can walk without waddling, AND her boobies match her body type, I think we have a winner. But I like really skinny girls too, so I take it case by case. It's not like I feel like I have to settle.

Has anyone seen Sights & Sounds live? A few months ago they blew two of my favourite bands out of the water (Carpenter and Polar Bear Club). Really, really impressive live show, in terms of intensity and likeness to their recordings. Listening to them now just reminded me of it, if you're wondering where this is coming from. No one likes random things posted in punknews comments.

Acoustic-driven punk rock with melodic but natural and non-cheesy vocals... someone said they remind them of Small Brown Bike's last recordings (vocally) but I don't think that's the BEST comparison. It works though. A lot of their lyrics really reflect how I feel about life right now.

For some reason they haven't received much hype or praise here, but those that like them seem to like them a lot, like I do.

I didn't like it at first. I though is sounded a little newer-Alkaline-Trioish. After multiple listens, some songs are really growing on me. I love the second song (I can't think of the name). Destroy Their Future took a while as well but I ended up really liking it. They sure did change their sound from Rogue's March.

Whenever someone asks me what I listen to, I always really hesitate because saying "I listen to punk rock" sounds so incredibly cheesy and the things that will run through their head when they hear "punk" kills me. So I pretty much have a mental breakdown when someone asks me that. But I end up just saying punk music. Then they ask what bands and then I waste even more breath by listing bands. Does anyone else hesitate or is it just me?

I always have to describe it as "sped-up reggae occasionally mixed with punk, often with a horn section." I know that's not even close to being accurate for anything other than third wave, but people are stupid.

If it looks like the person asking me has some idea about music, I'll say punk. But if they dont, I'll just say rock. And if bands have to be listed off I usually get a look as if worms are crawling out of my ears.
I try to name bigger bands, i.e Against Me!, Gaslight, Brand New, Alkaline Trio. But even then I get the stare of death.

I say something along the lines of "I listen to almost everything, but mostly punk music." Then they ask me like who, and I respond with "Oh, a bunch of underground bands, I don't think you'd know them." And they always test me all confident that they know punk, and sure enough, they never recognize a single band. Even though I listen to what I consider are some of the more popular punk bands. I guess people are expecting to hear Rancid, Rise Against, and Green Day.

P.S. Fuck the guy who hates people who say they listen to everything, I say it anyways and no I don't listen to acid jazz

I also hate when dentists and teachers and stuff ask. It's just like "there's no way in hell". One dentist girl, about 30, asked what I was listening to on my .mp3 player when I came in. It was The Gaslight Anthem, and I still avoided getting into it. She eventually squeezed their name out of me after saying "I listen to a lot of smaller bands, I'll probably know them". She just said "oh yeah, I've heard of them", lying, and went back to fixing my teeth. Bitch.

The bitch at the end was completely unexpected, but I cant say I didnt laugh.
Ive gotten to the point where I make up band names to see if people are being genuine with me about knowing what kind of music I listen to.

Man I hesitate like you wouldn't believe. If I say "punk" they either think mohawks or what people call 'emo' these days. I don't even consider saying "emo' in reference to Cap'n Jazz and friends, imagine what they could think after that! If people really want to know I just put on some songs for them. We need to come up with a solid genre name for "orgcore", one that doesn't sound lame and that people know what you mean when you say it.

Yeah, I can't say "I listen to a little emo too" anymore without people going "Oh, you mean like Silverstein?". "Punk rock" is that way too. Thankfully, no one can touch "desert rock" or "stoner metal".

I remember when I was in high school "punk" was big and all the Epitaph bands were popular so I usually told people I listened to "emo" and had to explain what hat was. I even did a presentation on emo in one of my classes and everyone had these totally blank stairs on their faces.

I never would have thought back then the would "emo" would have the connotation it has now.

Being a music major doesn't mean you'll find punk rockers. Most of them are hippies that love jazz or jam bands or they are theater snob types that love classical music. So I'm always feeling awkward about talking what music I'm listening to and it's so damn hard to find people to start a band because of this.

Punk is pretty much now a joke word to most. Thanks Blink-182 and such....

Sweet! I'm going on my third year but I'm a sophomore since some credits didn't transfer to the school I'm going to. Being a music major is such an awesome time. Except for that last part of theory that you don't care for. Good luck with everything.

I am easily one of the biggest Bach enthusiast on the planet. There is no greater composer than him through any time period. His music and just all of classical music gives me a feeling that punk doesn't. But then again punk gives me a feeling that no composer ever can. It's really an awesome thing to love both of those worlds.

and you are now on my top 5 of favorite people here because of this comment.

i usually hesitate myself, i mean i live in texas anything besides country or rap is foreign. when it comes down to it i usually point at the shirt i'am wearing, since all i really have are band shirts, or i go with the "music that doesn't come on the radio and i won't never listen to country and rap makes people stupid" i usually like to change the subject, unless i get the vibe that we might have some musical taste in common

I impressed a bunch of high school kids I was subbing for by knowing who Cursive, Horse the Band, Converge, and the Fall of Troy were. Apparently sense I was a teacher, I was too old to know what they were listening to.

I'd like to say "punk" or even more accurately "pop-punk" but people get the wrong fucking idea. But now i mostly just list bands and say "and stuff like that". But even then most people have no idea who the fuck band's like dillinger four are, so sometimes i even make up names just for shits.

If you like the hardcore stuff, get their last two albums. If not, you can pretty much start anywhere. BUT: only listen to Destruction by Definition, Battle Hymns, A Match and Some Gasoline, and War Profiteering Is Killing us all. The other albums blow.

"Destruction By Definition" and "Battle Hymns" are ska punk. DxD is by far their strongest release. Not a single song is "skipable."

"Suicide Machines" is pop punk. Everyone here hates it, but I love it. I also dig major label AFI, Alkaline Trio, and Against Me!, everyone else hates those, if you get what I'm trying to say.

"Steal This Record" I have not heard yet, but I imagine it's relatively similar to the s/t

"A Match and Some Gasoline" and "War Profiteering Is Killing Us All" are hardcore.

So in conclusion, knowing your hardcore background, I'd say get one of the last two, but "Destruction By Definition" is easily their best album. And before you judge a book by its cover, it isn't ska punk like Reel Big Fish or anything, it's still pretty heavy (in terms of ska, at least).

i think the dumbest thing i ever did in high school was this one time i was at my buddy's house and incredibly drunk. then this really slutty girl texts me, mind you we havent been talking all nite, and she says "whats up"

i decided to go out to my car and send her a picture of my fully erect penis in response. i woke up and read my outbox messages and about had a heart attack. luckily the bitch didnt put it on facebook or anything.

this is my view on the whole "why girls are sluts and boys arent" thing.

women are overall as a gender smarter, more mature, and way more aesthetically pleasing than men. men are just disgusting pieces of shit that go to unbeliavable lengths to try and sleep with anything that walks. men are already for the most part, failures as human beings so their promiscuity goes unnoticed. when women stoop to the same level as men, its unexpected, thus making them more succeptible to being called sluts.

He didn't say it was a flawless, always accurate argument. Generalizations are just that. They are generalized from repeated observations. Overall, it has been generalized that women and men are as he described. Certainly not all of them, but in enough cases to make that generalization it had to be true, or it never would have been made.

I still disagree. Look at stereotypes, sure they can be awful, but they all come from somewhere. You can't apply them to people individually, but you can make broad statements about them. He was using generalizations to make a generalization, not to pick apart anyone in particular.

Also, you must have read it wrong because in no way did he say they "should" be labeled as sluts. He was merely explaining why they are labeled as such, without any hint that he agrees with it or does it himself.

Two separate things. I bet the girl in the story fucks a lot of guys. Therefore, slut. He knows for a fact she's a slut. The other thing he said was a way for describing why women are often falsely labeled as sluts, you can't say that the girl in the story was falsely labeled. The "genius" thing he said was much more pro-women than anything.

He said it is wrong for men to call women sluts because there is no difference between them being sexual and men being sexual. How the fuck is that not pro-women, in their favour, or at least absolutely fair?

He calls a girl a slut in his story but shows sexually promiscuous behavior himself.
Sloane points out the hypocrisy.
He explains his view on why he is exempt from being called a slut and she is, aka his justification for him calling her a slut and why she is a slut.

Nope. My reading comprehension skills are not in question. If you cannot see how these all work together and the mind behind why people would say things, or the idea of purpose, then YOURS are in question, not mine.

Wooooooooooow. I can't say the girl was falsely labeled, because guess what? I don't know her or how many men she had relations with. Neither do you. But it's not about her. It's about the fact that the idea that men are exempt from being given a negative label because of their sexual desires because they are "dumb" and women aren't because they are "smart" and ~pure lovely goddesses~ who cannot ever, ever, show human like desires. Which is wrong...and extremely sexist.

I don't care if his ~*~genius~*~ comment gave positive attributes to women, it used generalizations about a complex subject and is therefore on shaky grounds and should not be regarded as a trustworthy argument.

I have no idea where you're getting this information. He has only posted twice in regards to this. He called the girl a slut and said this is his view/justification why he's allowed to say that. He never said he was against it. There was no negative.

He absolutely did not say why he's allowed to say that. His second comment was not a justification for his first one. His second comment was unrelated, explaining why he thinks women are called sluts as often and inaccurately as they are.

this is ridiculous. you are ridiculous. why would you even make a statement like that? that is incredibly sexist. women are not sluts by default if they have sex with people. women don't deserve to be called such a derogatory term in any circumstance. go post on the playboy forums with a mindset like that. and stop listening to glassjaw.

He DIDN'T SAY THAT. He said the fucking opposite. He said men call women sluts if they have sex with people and that's wrong, because from the man's point of view only women can be sluts and they fail to realize that a woman being sexual is no different than a man being sexual.

So if I call a retarded girl retarded, is that sexist? Calling someone a slut is either accurate or inaccurate, never sexist. It has nothing to do with gender, unless the user is sexist and throws the word around only to a particular gender.

But as the people on your side have said, that word itself has origins that apply ONLY to female. Now you and them have used arguments that contradict each other, both against me from the same side. I hope you see what's wrong with that.

It's not sexist because it does not attack the qualities society has attributed to her gender. Slut is sexist because it is a word that attacks "female" qualities, just as dick attacks "male" qualities.

The origin of the word is not a female-based origin. It comes from the Middle English word for mud. That there is a modern definition. Don't even try to play dumb and say that when a man is called a bitch, or a slut, or any other "female" slurs that you don't react a little and say to yourself that it's given to the wrong gender. If you do not, then you are not living in society.

In real life, I try to pick my battles not with people who will agree with me, but with people who are willing to set aside their personal opinions in order to really try to figure it out. Just saying.

But that's what the word slut is used for! You don't even have a problem with the word, your problem is with the fact that it has negative connotations, when you don't think it should. Now tell me how that makes whats-his-name's comment sexist.

Arguing connotation is even more flimsy than arguing a definition. You won't win this. Not because you are wrong or right, but because regardless of who is wrong or right, they are going to subjectively feel what they want to subjectively feel. You won't change their minds.

THis is what I meant by picking your battles, and determining in advance when arguing with people will be hopeless or not. I'm good at it by now.

"women are overall as a gender smarter, more mature, and way more aesthetically pleasing than men. men are just disgusting pieces of shit that go to unbeliavable lengths to try and sleep with anything that walks."

is a sexist comment because even though you are using positively connotative adjectives it is still limiting to the effect of "this is what women are and this is what they do, they can't be sexually free because they should know better sexual expression is a base stupid act"

It's not sexist, it's generalizations based on gender. Sexism applies on an individual basis, not a general one. It's sexist to go up to a woman and say "you are smarter than men". It's not sexist to say from observation that "women are smarter than men".

I know cuz I already knew that definition and I knew I was right before it had started, gender and sexuality are my areas of study I've read and experienced more on the subject than either of them likely ever will.

It's not at all, but even if it was it wouldn't matter. All my life I have noticed that I find myself unattracted to black people, all of them (hypothetically). I'm not being racist, its not their blackness that is unappealing to me, its the features shared by typical black people that I don't like. And to explain my "but even if it was it wouldn't matter"... if it was the skin colour I was unattracted to, racism is about the culture, the skin colour is just how you identify. If I said I found them ugly because I am racist and think all black people are stupid or criminals, then yes, that is racist. But what kind of fuckwad would relate appearance to actions? I could find fucking Hitler attractive but still hate him.

If this doesn't settle it, I will realize that you all lack the ability to rationalize and put aside false conceptions that you can't shake, and admit to being wrong. I truly feel with all my heart and mind that this is flawless.

I haven't the slightest clue on where you get the idea that sexism has to be directed from a single individual to another. they include general attitudes and beliefs.

he stated:

women are overall as a gender smarter, more mature, and way more aesthetically pleasing than men. men are just disgusting pieces of shit that go to unbeliavable lengths to try and sleep with anything that walks. men are already for the most part, failures as human beings so their promiscuity goes unnoticed. when women stoop to the same level as men, its unexpected, thus making them more succeptible to being called sluts.

I know, I've agreed with you on that more than once. In that image I posted I say it is theoretically sexist, or by definition sexist, but there the lack of directing it means you shouldn't be upset about it. The problem with sexism is that people get prejudged based on the sexist views of the person judging them. The problem isn't that they have those sexist views, if they're not put into practice they're harmless. And they CAN be fair to have, if that's all that person has observed how can you tell them they're wrong? Equality doesn't necessarily exist, you can't force it. You're Canadian, you should know that.

so i came back from band practice and saw that my comment started a lot of shit. let me explain what i meant more in depth. first lets look at my comment

"women are overall as a gender smarter, more mature, and way more aesthetically pleasing than men. men are just disgusting pieces of shit that go to unbeliavable lengths to try and sleep with anything that walks. men are already for the most part, failures as human beings so their promiscuity goes unnoticed. when women stoop to the same level as men, its unexpected, thus making them more succeptible to being called sluts."

the key is the final sentence that says "making them more succeptible to being called sluts". i never said it was wrong. i never said it was right. i was explaining where the double standard comes from.

as far as me being hypocritcal by calling aforementioned girl a slut, look she was a slut. she slept with at least 10 of my friends in high school. so im sorry, she was a slut. maybe im a slut as well, nowhere did i say i wasnt.

im not a sexist. im a realist. there is undoubtedly a double standard between calling men and women sluts, i was explaining why i believe this double standard exists. i was in no way advocating either side.

im sorry, if i offended you or found my comments to be sexist, as i am not a sexist. i admittedly have a mysognistic sense of humor at times, but i choose to display that on message boards rather than in real life situations.

in closing, holy shit first the gimper, now me. i guess every male from oklahoma is a piece of shit, eh?

not because of any believed superiority that women have cuz reasonably good guys like you will call women sluts and so will tripe that think women are worthless. It tends to come from women being denied the variety of sexual experiences, thats where it really comes from. Do I think you want to deny women the full scope of their sexuality? of course not. but I do think it adds to the miseducation of people who will.

whatever, im done arguing. honestly though, the original point i was making was in no way coming from a sexist place, i wasnt trying to be an asshole. i was giving my honest OPINION (one that i believe, for good or bad, a large majority of society operates under) as to why the word "slut" is so taboo beween men and women.

so honestly, i am sorry if i offended anyone. that was in no way my intention at all. if you wish to label me a sexist, without knowing me outside the confines of a punk rock message board, than by all means...

I'm not really arguing with you at this point either, your intent wasn't bad I agree. I don't think you are sexist just something you said kind of was, it doesn't define who you are on a message board or anywhere else. separate the sufferer from the suffering.

ok and one final thing. i actually went back and read the argument between you and blackjaw and you were under the impression that i was trying to analyze the world slut in order to defend me calling the original girl a slut.

not in anyways true. my examination of the world slut was a 100% observation. i admittedly use the word slut the wrong way a lot. in the same way as i admittedly will call someone "gay" at times. i dont literally mean they are a homosexual, i just mean they are lame. and alot of times when i used the word "slut" i dont mean the term literally, i mean the girl was just undesriable for some reason.

ok now that i feel like i can go to sleep not feeling like a sexist. im out.

This shit gets way crazy. From what I've seen on this site, I've come to this conclusion: No one knows how to fucking read. Everyone's so quick to pin something on someone, it's disgusting and is no better than a sexist or a racist. All I read from the comment in question was basically him describing why he thinks the slut word is easier to pull on women. Like if I were to say: "Historical events like slavery could have lead to the tension between white and black people." No where does the person stating it show their actual opinion on the topic, but more what their observation on why they think it's an issue for others. They don't agree or disagree. I love you sloane, and acris, you have some good ideas and I think everyone in this thread agree with eachother, but this was not a battle worth fighting and I feel you all jumped the gun and only came out bitter.

I consider myself a feminist -- hell, I consider myself someone passionate for all gender equality. In my local scene, a lot of people don't take feminists and the like seriously, and it's for this reason exactly. It's almost insulting to me. Just because we share the same ideas means nothing if you're going to go at it so blindly with no regard for what people actually are saying -- it's like people want to make others look bad because the words in the sentence could be rearanged into something sexist.

Although personally I don't like the idea of straight "feminism", I definitely prefer a term like "gender equality activism". It's like how there can be BET, but a White Entertainment Television would be horrible. Not fair, both are wrong, even if one was formerly or still is treated unequally and/or is the minority. A feminist is seen as a positive, a shovanist (the male equivalent, really) is seen as a negative, why?

Yeah, "feminism" is slightly ironic because it strives for equality by singleing itself out. I don't think chauvenist is the right term for it, but I get what you're saying and was attacked a couple weeks back (not trying to open a can of worms, so don't try fighting with me : ) ) for trying to promote male equality. It's pretty one sided sometimes. : (

I don't know, 90% of punknewsers are always in joking spirits to the point it's often annoying... and you're part of the 10% that's... not. You don't like people posting non-related stuff, and there's other things I can't think of that led to me seeing you that way. You just seem like a businessman or something, without the business. You're not the "angry serious" type which is why I said I recognize that you don't lash out at or get mad at people, you just kinda mind your own business. I don't think I've ever seen a "lol" from you. I asked just because I said "mothafucka" and stuff but then I'm like "I probably look like a jackass, mikexdude is all serious and mature all the time".

See if I'm way off that really goes to show how the internet changes how people come off.

PS: Never thought about this before, I'm not some weirdo dude who sits here analyzing behaviour patterns.

I understand. That said, I once was credited with the downfall of punknews along with MattRamone. I participate in off-conversations sometimes, but if it isn't 2-3 in the morning (like it is now), I am mostly on topic. I am not as mature in real life : )

After my next 4 or 5 reviews get posted, would you mind reading them and letting me know what you think, from a peer reviewer/critique stand point? I'm just looking to improve, and I like yours and brians better than mine.

Incorporate that into your reviews then, give them a voice. I don't like objective reviews, I like ones that balance between that and subjective. The Anchor Down one was way too much though I remember.

I'm actually considering writing a review that is straight fiction, meaning like a 1 page short story that somehow also reviews the album. I don't know how good it will be or how I'll do it though. Or if it will even be posted.

Besides the way shovanist is not an actual term for describing someone who is positive about gender equality, and it really just means "fucking asshole" nowadays. I just mean to say that the feminists who aren't for equality, they're for female SUPERIORITY, are no better than anyone.

For the record, and I say this all the time, I argue with people's words, not with people. After tonight I won't hold anything against any of you or see you any differently.

I wish I could say the same; I wouldn't say that I would "hold this against anyone," but I can't help but be irritated with the such antagonistic and mean spirited "activism" and will definitely think differently about people and how they approach certain things.

But it could affect things like whether or not I'll engage in a discussion with a person. For example, tonight I wouldn't have bothered to enter this discussion, because I felt that the people arguing against blackjaw weren't going to be open to a dispasstionate discussion.

not to stir anything up or that you'll read this but I took what he said as a defense because he showed a double standard with the slut comment. I called him out on it. he made that response which I took to be his opinion because he phrased it in such a way that it wasn't "society views women as" or some such.

What you are suggesting happened is like me calling a black person a thieving n-bomb and then me saying "people think black people are thieves because of past personal experiences with black people stealing their stuff.". Maybe it is like that, I don't know

Yeah I knew that that was why you guys were arguing what you were, you would have EXPECTED the follow up post to be a defense of the first one. But I thought my green and purple text in my little image cleared that up pretty well.

His comment was not support for his actions -- unrelated in someways. Yes, as you can see, I joked on your side when you pointed out that he called a girl a slut and then sent a picture of his piece, but when he opened a different debate, everyone fucking jumped on him. That is not what I suggested happened. And if you stated "people think black people are thieves because of past personal experiences with black people stealing their stuff," you are stating SOMEONE ELSE'S VIEWS and not your own regardless of how wrong it sounds.

allow me to respond in generalizations to this whole thread and ongoing debate:

FUCK YOU if you subscribe to the idea that it's racist that black people have their own television channel or that female empowerment is some lesbian conspiracy meant to stifle your beloved patriarchy. black entertainment television exists because literally every other television franchise was created for white people by white people. feminism exists because the patriarchal system we've been stuck with for so long was inherently damaging to an entire, unique, important half of the populace. homosexuals need to "show off" how "queer" they are because the straight white male (and i include myself in that category) is the only division of humankind lucky enough to live and develop relatively naturally (though there is something to say for the expected machismo that comes with swms) without fear of the repercussions.

i assumed these were all things that a punk society could rally behind. we dudes have had hundreds of chances to make our mark on this world (and guess what? we fucked it up pretty bad). step off your high horse and SUPPORT YOUR PEERS for fucking once.

the thing that got me in this thread is that scorpiondeathlock decided the right idea when a "slutty" "bitch" sent him a text message essentially checking in to see how he was doing was to get his dick hard and show it off to her. in what fucking universe do you all live that you think it's okay to cheer on this guy who got off sexually assaulting a member of his community?

you all wonder why angie and lint left over an arguably sexist comment by gimper. i'm surprised that sloane and acris and the other lady whose name i embarrassingly don't remember (you know, the one who was blindly encouraged to find a cute girl at the fest and use her up for all her hotel room was worth) haven't officially flown the coop after this horrible disgrace of a thread.

"FUCK YOU if you subscribe to the idea that it's racist that black people have their own television channel or that female empowerment is some lesbian conspiracy meant to stifle your beloved patriarchy. black entertainment television exists because literally every other television franchise was created for white people by white people."

But I never said I found the first thing racist or the second thing a conspiracy. I understand exactly what you're saying. BET obviously isn't racist, it's just not fair that WET would be racist. Neither should be racist and both should be allowed. It should be a mosaic not a melting pot, there should be MEET, MET, CET, AET, JET, fucking everything ET. I agree with you, I never said there shouldn't be BET. And I never said people shouldn't rally for feminism. I said the few that do and don't only want equality but want women to be superior to men are no better and in the wrong. Maybe they deserve that position for a few thousand years, to 'make up for' the fact that men have been in that position for a few thousand years. But two wrongs don't make a right. And it's not like the women fighting for feminism today were extremely discriminated against, they were born in the last 100 years.

And what "disgrace of a thread"? The only somewhat offensive thing that happened was the original post where he, as he later admitted was a minor fault on his own, called a slutty girl a slut. I still see nothing wrong with that, but some people would, I know. Everything that followed was 4 or 5 pro-equality people arguing over semantics as to how if at all his first and second post were linked. The thread is harmless, it wouldn't have been if the second post was him saying all women should be called sluts and if my posts were backing him up, but anyone with the ability to read, analyze and rationalize should be able to see that that is not the case at all. We're all on the same fucking side here, as I've been saying since the beginning.

Funny thing is, we are rallying exactly what you're saying which is why when we see people with the same values go off unrightfully, it's disappointing. Once again, people don't know how to read. I couldn't care less if people left this website because they're insulted by some fabricated dispute from their own ignorance. It's their fucking fault and hell, I love lintsay and angie was cool, but we don't need people like that bloating a music website. Regardless of gender. It's also funny that whenever sexism is brought up, someone has to post a long paragraph (like yours) that everyone agrees with to make someone look good or bad, even if it's completely irrelevant. Because it is. What you said, was irrelevant. This shit is really useless and the reason why no open mind outside the punk community will take punks seriously.

I'm glad this shit storm didn't happen when I called ffwoodycooks a slut last week.

In real life though, you guys need to quit being a bunch of haters and to stop all this stereotyping of women. Racism and homophobia don't fly here, why would sexism? It's no wonder there are so few ladies that post here.

God damn, I go to take a poop and txt my friend about hooking me up with this redhead and I come back and there's like all kinds of fest updates.

Instead of reading them all, if I could just get a few answers from you guys, we'll be good to go. Ok, I'd love to call to get the room asap. I think we pretty much are all cool with staying at the $60 hotel, so that's who I'll call. Things I need to know before calling:

1. Which nights? My understanding right now is Wednesday night through Saturday night. Is this correct?

2. How many people do I tell them are staying...4? (I know we have way more).

3. Can anyone think of anything else I need to know before making these plans?

Yeah, I'm bringing a sleeping bag. Only 2 or 4 people can sleep in beds, depending on the size of the beds. I think almost everyone should bring a sleeping bag if possible, except for maybe two people. If anyone has a bad back or some shit, let me know.

Ok, I'm going to just send an email out to our group I think, and wait to get confirmation from everyone on the dates. Not everyone will read these posts. As soon as I hear back from everyone on the dates, I'll book it.

I saw this vanity license plate a little while ago: MGGLBRN. Muggleborn? Like from Harry Potter? Or: Must Get Guys Loose, Bring Round Neighbors?

Also, I was at Qdoba with my coworker who's been eating lightly lately, and I asked if he was gonna get the little street tacos, and he said no, and I said "Oh going for the full blowner." I was tired today and I say weird things when tired. Full blowner is going to be my new go to word when talking about boners.

i wouldn't be surprised for one bit if you actually imploded at the fest. i could be standing next to you with BtMI or less than jake playing with a beer and a shot in our hands when out of nowhere a black hole sucks your body in with a pop. the beer can and shot glass falls to the floor. I'll stand there and shrug my shoulders saying out loud but no one can hear me, "About time."

I just got off "the wire" from my "inside guy", and this was done for a specific person's party. There's no plans for a reincarnation or reunion.
I've got eyes and ears all over this punk rock world, bitches!!! ...just too bad we do our reporting after the fact.

God, when did the org's taste go to such shit. This should be the biggest band on this website behind Mclusky. I'm saddened by the state of this website. Today, I shed a tear. Fucking Brand New? Really? Give me a break. Are you all 13?

I haven't been to the Epitaph site in years. He needs to collect them all and release a book, because I ain't sifting through 1,000 posts that read "FFTL is liek so hawt and Sony shoud have stayd in the band he was totaly the hawtest!!!!1111!1"

I guess one of my co-workers finally got caught for shop lifting energy drinks and was fired, but management didn't tell us but an inside source did "off the record". It's not good for her since she's going through a terrible custody battle with her ex and her 16 year old just had a kid. Bad decision on her part, but she was one of those unsuspecting sweet and innocent types.

I'm a master at this by now. USA Gold Lights are usually about $3 a pack, and are not bad compared to most cheapies. You have two beers already, so buy yourself a Miller High Life 32oz for 2 bucks. That leaves you with a dollar. I would recommend going to Wal-Mart (as much as fuck that store) and buying three Instant Lunch cups (they have a ton of great flavors) for about 30 cents each. Save those for after all the beer, eat them all in a row, and smoke your night away while blaring Eagles of Death Metal on the headphones.

well my friend and I stayed in the pit after Less Than Jake (we were right up front) just so we could throw shit and 30hfags and then leave, we had a bunch of items (shoes, bottles, some other shit) so right when they came out we just started whippin shit at them and they kept trying to "dance" to the side to avoid everything, and I had a full 5-hour energy shot bottle, and I scoped one of them right on his forehead (and I have a really good arm)

and during Less Than Jake's set, all the 3ohfuck fans made there way to the front, and they were all just standing there like logs, so there was like a huge chunk of the crowd with no movement, so my friend and I jumped right in the middle of them all and started jumpin all over and they all got scared

Yesterday, my manager was called a "fucking retard" by an angry customer. She replied, "You're a fucking retard if you think you can talk to people like that. Here's your fucking money, get the fuck out of my restaurant."

The customer left behind one of her bags to her takeout order, and tried to tell my manager that it was our fault and that we were trying to rip her off. She was using profanity like crazy, and when my manager told her that they could resolve the dispute without escalation, the customer got real close to her and called her a fucking retard. So, my manager gave her a tongue lashing of her own and refunded her for the only the bag of food she'd left behind. It was pretty rockin.

It would be better if it weren't B-Sides. As good as some of the songs are, it's pretty obvious why they were left off of the albums. Especially "Got it All". I have the special edition of Good News with that on there and it completely disrupts the flow of the original album.

True Story: that guy was really one of the nicest people on the Warped Tour back in 2003; genuinely cool... but being on the tour for 4 weeks straight, and seeing him hanging around everyday, I never had the heart to tell him I much I despised and could never get into his music, especially after he would be like "Hey, come and watch us play later, OK?"

Check out this band- http://www.myspace.com/newcreases
They played at Berea Fest but I stepped out for some fresh air when they played. I feel really dumb about it now. They're really good! They have both male and female vocals, which I normally don't dig, but they work realllly well together. Definitely listen to Wild Knives.

The best thing to do is to let your kid dabble with youth groups during high school. If anything ever turned me off of religion it was watching my classmates drop to their knees and cry while some shitty praise band plays.

Whoa, my friends best friend (aka, someone I've met, but don't really talk to) is in that video. She's the girl with the rose in her hair at 30 seconds. Before you post without rewatching, she's the normal one who talks shit about the other ones.

Oh yeah, that was stupid. I just assumed that since you replied to me you were asking if that was the one. But the head-band girls and everyone else in that video (except for the rose girl because she actually made fun of other people while looking normal) are definately retarded.

Christ almighty. Warped always attracted its fair share of steakheads and awful girls, and this just magnifies it. Presenter idiot in the "Hooker" necklace--you're just as guilty as everyone else in this video.

Redheads are my favorite by far. I decided a few years ago that I'm going to try to date a redhead if possible. The last 3 girls I liked were redheads, but none of those relationships took off. Now I'm about to give the 4th redhead girl a go and I'm pretty sure she's gonna be a winner. I'll find out tomorrow. Fucking stoked.

i dunno, a super bro dude. but you were nice and i had fun talking to you. that is why i made it a point to say goodbye to you at the show. we should hang out. let me know when you're back in chicago, we'll get some beers or something.

you were right about not giving a shit about baseball, but i do tend to side with the sox solely based on the fact that i lived in lincoln park with a plethora of rich and snotty cubs fans. but perhaps i pass judgment too fast.

from previous posts. but trust me, everyone is insecure in one form or another on the internet. it's okay. one day i hope to hang out and grab a beer with you, because i am sure you are a cool guy IRL.

i, regretfully, can not afford it. then again i am not sure if i would go if i could. if only to hang out with a few people. i see the bands i want to see in chicago - plus lately i have been on an alt-country ryan adams kick. oh well.

First off, I have "so it goes" tattooed on my right leg, so I do read.
The driving thing I cant really defend.
And really, its only been like 3 chicks ( in like, what, 4 months?) Im sure you have dude problems, you just do choose to share them over the interwebs (which is a good decision).

Resin is the sticky tar that gets left behind after smoking said pot. You can scrape it into a ball, light it up, and smoke it if you're down on greens. Not the healthiest choice, but sometimes you're desperate...

Life is sacred, so be it yea?
I couldn't give a shit coz you made me sick.
Nobody can refuse you the right,
To give up your life, just fuckin end it!
Pressured into suicide by the fucked up laws,
Then labeled a psycho for being sick of your bodies war,
No one should have to suffer the pain,
The strain and then be told that their insane.
Keep your religion out of our laws,
In fact fuck religion, fuck the law.
Assisted suicide its illegal we know,
So would you take me to the backstreets and fuckin slit my throat?

No.
Your laws and morals wont stop the killing,
So give people a chance to choose whether their living,
And the friends and family who assist the deed,
Won’t have to be ashamed of giving what you need.

You try to scream but the words don't come out.
You try to grab the pills but you cant move about.
You cant drown your self coz your being watched.
You cant reach for the knife coz they've been locked up.
You cant exercise by your self.
You cant eat or dress your fuckin self.
Your dignity's been taken away.
You've had enough, your time is up.

Why is it so hard to understand
That some people don't want that helping hand.
Some people want their independence,
And once that has gone they wanna quit existence.
But they're incapable of doing this on their own,
So they're forced to live and suffer alone.