Exposing the underbelly of Armstrongism in all of its wacky glory! Nothing you read here is made up. Every crazy, weird and wacky quote is straight from the pens of Armstrongite leaders or members who think they possess some insight into God and the Bible. What you read here is the up to date face of Herbert W Armstrong's legacy. It's the gritty and dirty behind the scenes look at Armstrongism as you have never seen it before!

David C. Pack's Wacky World 2

September, 11, 2013

What David C. Pack Eliminated Speaks So Loud We Can't Hear What He is Now Saying

I
believe it is important to remember what Dave Pack wants you to
forget. After all, he said he'll want you to forget this stuff, that he
ever said it in the first place or that he didn't mean it to mean what
you thought he meant it to mean.

Remember he said...

"I want to make a statement about...me...now, if I became deceived, I will never tell you what I'm going to tell you now...I am telling you if I go off into strange ideas, misconduct, rebellion, you name it, don't follow me. I want to tell you that now, because if I start doing that I'm gonna try to get you to follow me!
I'm gonna come to you and tell you it doesn't apply, it doesn't mean
me, no, no, no, no, no, no, it's OK to follow me because ABCD and XY
and Z.Do you understand what I'm saying? Listen to me now, when I tell you don't follow me if I go off into weird ideas, or if I get off into other things that are total absolutely unscriptural conduct, because if I do I'm gonna paint it with a different face and try to get you to follow me.Do you understand what I'm saying brethren? Please remember that, because I promise you that if I become deceived, I'll forget it, and I'll want you to forget it...And I hope you'll remember it well enough to quote it right back to me...But I'll tell you what, I'm not going anywhere."

Well
maybe Dave Pack did not go anywhere back then, but he has since and so
let's be reminded of what we must forget was ever thought about the
largest, most complex and yet simple to decode prophecy about David C.
Pack and the Return of the Disfellowshipped by God under one leader
(guess who?) in the Bible.

I
admit, I am not a brethren in the RCG, but someone has to do what Dave
asked or he's going to deceive us all. He told us that. (I love that
quote). So, if no one else is going to remember it well enough to
quote it right back to Dave, I guess I will for at least future
posterity in such matters.

12)Eliminated The readers of the Haggai prophecy
announcements (this is #21) who believed them would be the most
disillusioned and the biggest candidates to QUIT everything if God did not
return His people to one House this year! This would work directly
against what God is doing—directly opposite His overall purpose.

It
is easy to see why this was eliminated from the original 24 reasons in
the original Announcement 21 The Time is Now! Dave understands at least
the price of being wrong, which he was. It remains to be seen how many
are dis-illusioned, which is a good thing, because who wants to be
"illusioned." Sticking with Dave is to be "Illusioned." And yes, it
would work against the purposes of RCG

13)Eliminated Further desolation (Hag. 1:11; 2:16-17) from God of the
splinter “houses” would practically wipe out the few remaining senior leaders in
them. This includes pastors and elders, all of whom are NEEDED TO CARRY OUT THE
BIG WORK!

Dave wanted those senior leaders
to come over to him so badly and further delay would take them out of
the picture before this could come about. Dave must now believe that
these senior men will live longer and have more time to still come over
to him. Or perhaps he has given up on this ever happening, which I am
sure is the safer bet.

14)Eliminated The onset of all future years
would never come with clarity—with any certainty! Would God leave thousands who
are now aware of this prophecy in such a condition? Hardly.

Oops
can't say this anymore! Dave has now stated that even more clarity is
coming after the screw up in "timing." Things never before seen are now
going to be seen so that's clarity alright. Thus, this has to go.
Obviously this years failures don't muddy the waters. They clear them
up. Just you watch.

15) Eliminated Next, for those
who will see the value of how to pursue spiritual matters, there is this: After
fervently seeking God about it, not one reason the prophecy is off this year
ever emerged in the minds of even one of our 16 Headquarters ministers! I (we)
have NEVER prayed about, studied over, meditated on, fasted about and counseled
with other ministers regarding a subject more than this one—in fact no other
subject is even close! -

And
isn't this a sad one? If we leave this one Dave's crew of 16 kiss ups
look like...well...kiss ups. Dave has now learned that everyone
agreeing with you is not a sign of truth. It's a sign of...kissing up,
probably to keep status and jobs. Dave has also learned that just
because you pray, study, meditate, fast and ask other kiss..., ministers
about the topic, doesn't mean you're going to get the right answer.
"Woe be unto you when all men speak good of you" and all that. So we
have to vote no on this being on how one pursues spiritual matters ever
again.

16)Eliminated Similarly, as questions emerged
throughout our pursuit of truth with the many details of the prophecy, so many
of these details kept coming clear as direct answers to prayer. And these were
often immediate.
﻿

This one has to go
because once again, Dave has learned what we all knew ourselves, that
details that keep coming like clear answers to prayer are no sign of
anything. You simply end up with a very detailed mistake.

17) Eliminated Recall Haggai
1:13: “Then spoke Haggai the Lord’s messenger in the Lord’s message unto the
people…” Haggai is the messenger to God’s people, with what is an all-important
message from God. Would not God make clear in such a unique message He describes
as “the Lord’s message unto His people” the correct date for action? What kind
of message would it be if people did not know WHEN TO CARRY IT OUT?

Here
we now see that Dave has learned once and for all that "A" with God
does not always lead to Dave's "B". I would think since the people
still don't know when to carry it out, the message was flawed to begin
with. It might do Dave some good to consider that the message of Haggai
never had anything to do with him, RCG or the Splinters. He made that
all up in his head and this is why there is confusion as to the
"when." "Never" is the answer to the "when".

19) Eliminated Imagine God not
revealing the year the remnant is coming—but only the day and month. Vast
amounts of time would have been wasted by His leaders studying and preparing for
something that was not imminent. Would God put His Church in such a position?

I
can imagine it now Dave. Can you?
I'm pretty sure you even got the day and month wrong. Evidently God
has put 'His Church" in this position, maybe just for fun. Who knows?

20)
Eliminated Of interest, God revealed to me during ELUL
four years ago my role as the modern Joshua.

Evidently
not of interest at all and eliminating this may mean Dave will have to
rethink his "Joshua" fantasy. I bet the world "Elul" will never feel
good again to Dave! It also reveals that Dave now has to wonder just
what God did or did not reveal to him. I'm going with did not.

21) Eliminated Also of
interest, I and The Restored Church of God learned about the New Testament
remnant last ELUL (August). Let’s ask: Would timing of when we were shown the
prophecy not be tied to its unique timing of fulfillment during the very next
available ELUL?

This one
violates eliminated reason 20 because Dave knew FOUR YEARS AGO he was
Joshua but kept it to himself until now. He should have revealed this
the very next available ELUL! Again, evidently it's not tied to
anything Dave tied it to. So this one had to go. Dave is going to have
to stop tying the wrong knots on his sailboat which seems blown around
by various winds of doctrines he makes up.

"And I hope you'll remember it well enough to quote it right back to me..."David C. Pack

So I did...Dennis C. Diehl

September 10, 2013Dennis Muses: "I never said that...."

Wonders in the Wiggle Room

The Fine Art of Altering Church History

From David C. Pack's Original , Pre August 31, 2013 Announcement 21

"The Time Is NOW!

Now comes a series of reasons Haggai’s prophecy will be fulfilled this year.
They are summarized, with only a very little detail added. More could be said of
each, but the descriptions given will suffice to those willing to think just a
little about them. Realize there are over 30 more reasons—many of them very
powerful—that I have left off the list because some will be covered later or
because they would only be recognized as proofs by our Headquarters ministry
(involving various miracles, some big). Readers would be largely unable to
appreciate them as proofs:

1) Understanding the meaning of the prophecy, starting with Haggai 1:2, automatically carries the
requirement of taking a position on it. This cannot be avoided after
one learns it. Think about this. The position of the remnant is that “the time
is not come” to rebuild God’s House. Are they right or wrong? God indicts their
thinking, meaning they are wrong! If the prophecy is not now,
the net effect would be that God agrees with the remnant’s view. Worse, so
should those currently in God’s one Church because they now know the meaning
of the prophecy. Think this through. One does or does not agree with the
remnant. God does not—and we do not. The time is now! Let’s go further.

2) Directly related, why (or how) would God command the remnant to “Go…build the House!” (Hag. 1:8)—but not mean NOW? How could He mean some
undetermined future year? Why would God tell them (twice) to “consider
their ways”—but not mean that they should do this now? Try to imagine God
saying, “Consider your ways, but take your time. There’s no hurry. In fact, take
years to think it over—even though you have been out of My Church for 20
years! You don’t have to DO anything now.”

3) Also related, if God waited 2,500 years to reveal the prophecy’s meaning
(3,000 years when various related much older Psalms are considered), is not His
waiting done? Does His revealing it not signal that He has reached the time to
fulfill it rather than having reached a point one, two or three years out?

4) Next, why would God wait longer? What would He wait for? The remnant is
absolutely ripe for deliverance.

5) Internally, and this is no small thing, God’s Church is truly
ready to expand the Work in a BIG WAY. The prophecy features
this as the MAIN PURPOSE of the remnant returning! Without the
prophecy’s fulfillment, this expansion would be delayed one year—or more! Why
would God notify His Church of the prophecy’s existence at the very same time
our staff is ready, our websites are ready, our literature is ready and even
God’s college is ready for more students if the prophecy were not
imminent? Why would God notify His Church if HE were not ready?

6) Related to this, the buildings on our campus can very soon handle
significantly more staff than we have now. This is already true without
the other two buildings scheduled for completion in the late fall. However, this
extra size works perfectly if the prophecy occurs this year.

7) Also related, but separate, our infrastructure is ready to
receive and serve a much larger flock this fall! This includes field ministry
being ready, but also other things.

8) Maturing interest from many in the world due to one year of explosive
television expansion requires many more laborers in the ministry by this
autumn.

9) The Restored Church of God is experiencing an AWESOME period of growth and
development at this time—in the runup period just prior to the prophecy’s
fulfillment. This is putting it mildly! To us, this is powerful indication that
we are on the right track for this year—that God is not only pleased
with His Church, but that He is helping it get ready.

10) If the prophecy did not happen this year, the remnant would remain
another year (or more) undergoing ever worsening false ways.
Worse off, they would have a commensurate shorter time to spiritually
recover before the Tribulation. Think worse condition, less time to recover.

11) If reunification occurred next year (or any year after), those with God’s
Spirit would have one more year cut off from God’s Church. This carries the
potential for more to quench the Holy Spirit (I Thes. 5:19)
and lose salvation.

12)Elimintaed The readers of the Haggai prophecy announcements (this is #21) who
believed them would be the most disillusioned and the biggest
candidates to QUIT everything if God did not return His people to one House
this year! This would work directly against what God is doing—directly
opposite His overall purpose.

13)Eliminated Further desolation (Hag. 1:11; 2:16-17) from God of the splinter “houses” would
practically wipe out the few remaining senior leaders in them. This includes
pastors and elders, all of whom are NEEDED TO CARRY OUT THE BIG WORK!

14)Eliminated The onset of all future years would never come with clarity—with any
certainty! Would God leave thousands who are now aware of this prophecy in such
a condition? Hardly.

15) Eliminated Next, for those who will see the value of how to pursue
spiritual matters, there is this: After fervently seeking God about it, not
one reason the prophecy is off this year ever emerged in the minds of even
one of our 16 Headquarters ministers! I (we) have NEVER prayed about, studied
over, meditated on, fasted about and counseled with other ministers regarding a
subject more than this one—in fact no other subject is even close!

16)Eliminated Similarly, as questions emerged throughout our pursuit of truth with the
many details of the prophecy, so many of these details kept coming clear as
direct answers to prayer. And these were often immediate.

17)Eliminated Recall Haggai 1:13:
“Then spoke Haggai the Lord’s messenger
in the Lord’s message unto the people…”
Haggai is the messenger to God’s people, with what is an all-important
message from God. Would not God make clear in such a unique message He
describes as “the Lord’s message unto His people”
the correct date for action? What kind of message would it be if people did not
know WHEN TO CARRY IT OUT?

18)Now Point 12 Since the apostasy, God had not wanted the remnant back in His Church,
but now He does. He would first reveal the remnant to His leader,
then tell him how they would return, and finally that
He meant NOW. This was the order in which these things became apparent.

19) Eliminated Imagine God not revealing the year the remnant is coming—but
only the day and month. Vast amounts of time would have been wasted by His
leaders studying and preparing for something that was not imminent. Would God
put His Church in such a position?

20) Eliminated Of interest, God revealed to me during ELUL four years ago my
role as the modern Joshua.

21)Eliminated Also of interest, I and The Restored Church of God learned about the New
Testament remnant last ELUL (August). Let’s ask: Would timing of when
we were shown the prophecy not be tied to its unique timing of fulfillment
during the very next available ELUL?

22)Now Point 13We might ask: does the DEVIL know the prophecy is on? For those who
understand how the devil works—that he counterfeits EVERYTHING God does—a
variety of counterfeit theories have recently appeared about how God is
going to reunite His people. Should not the devil be expected to do this at the
time it would cause the most confusion? You will soon see that most of these
theories are coming from men standing on the wrong side of this prophecy.

23) Now Point 14 With God’s people split up, it is now almost impossible to do a
powerful Work. (This might be the one area where the splinter leaders would
agree.) God’s Church is largely stymied in working with both brethren
and the world because of the confusion and deception from top leaders about
where God’s Church is, who has the truth, who is carrying on after Mr.
Armstrong, who is doing the true Work, etc. (Reread #22.) There is no other
way to proceed than for God to remove leaders who have lulled with
deceit many thousands who were blind (Rev. 3:17) to begin with.

24)Now Point 15 World conditions cry out for a big Work NOW!!!—not one or more
years from now.

I repeat: There are many more reasons for a 2013 fulfillment, with a
few of a personal nature—and others involving God moving miraculously to reveal
crucial things at certain times within an extraordinarily complex prophecy that
involves hundreds of verses. I have not included all of these reasons
because others would likely not accept them as legitimate. They are, however, on
MY much longer list (now 56 total). And these reasons stand on bedrock in the
eyes of ALL our Headquarters ministers.

From David C. Packs Updated, Altered, Erased and Redacted New Announcement 21 Post August 31, 2013

"The Time Is Imminent!

Now comes a series of reasons the fulfillment of Haggai’s prophecy cannot be
far off. They are summarized, with only a very little detail added. More could
be said of each, but the descriptions given will suffice to those willing to
think just a little about them:

1) Understanding the meaning of the prophecy, starting with Haggai 1:2, automatically carries the
requirement of taking a position on it. This cannot be avoided after
one learns it. Think about this. The position of the remnant is that “the time
is not come” to rebuild God’s House. Are they right or wrong? God indicts their
thinking, meaning they are wrong! If the prophecy is not soon, the net
effect would be that God agrees with the remnant’s view. Worse, so should those
currently in God’s one Church because they now know the meaning of the
prophecy. Think this through. One does or does not agree with the remnant.
God does not—and we do not. Let’s go further.

2) Directly related, why (or how) would God command the remnant to “Go…build the House!” (Hag. 1:8)—but somehow mean many years from now? Why
would God tell them (twice) to “consider their ways”—but not mean that they
should do this now? Try to imagine God saying, “Consider your ways, but take
your time. There’s no hurry. In fact, take years to think it over—even though
you have been out of My Church for 20 years! You don’t have to DO
anything now.”

3) Also related, if God waited 2,500 years to reveal the prophecy’s meaning
(3,000 years when various related much older Psalms are considered), is not His
waiting done? Does His revealing it not signal that He has reached the time to
fulfill it rather than having reached a point one, two or three years out?

4) Next, why would God wait longer? What would He wait for? The remnant is
ripe for deliverance.

5) Internally, and this is no small thing, God’s Church is truly
ready to expand the Work in a BIG WAY. The prophecy features
this as the MAIN PURPOSE of the remnant returning!

6) Related to this, the buildings on our campus can very soon handle
significantly more staff than we have now. This is already true without
the other two buildings scheduled for completion in the late fall.

7) Also related, but separate, our infrastructure is ready to
receive and serve a much larger flock! This includes field ministry being ready,
but also other things.

8) Maturing interest from many in the world due to one year of explosive
television expansion requires many more laborers in the ministry in the near
future.

9) The Restored Church of God is experiencing an AWESOME period of growth and
development at this time—in the runup period just prior to the prophecy’s
fulfillment. This is putting it mildly! To us, this is powerful indication that
we are on the right track—that God is not only pleased with His Church,
but that He is helping it get ready.

10) For each year that passes before the prophecy’s fulfillment, the remnant
would remain another year (or more) undergoing ever worsening false
ways. Worse off, they would have a commensurate shorter time to
spiritually recover before the Tribulation. Think worse condition, less time to
recover.

11) Altered Similarly, those with God’s Spirit would have one more year cut off from
God’s Church. This carries the potential for more to quench the Holy Spirit (I Thes. 5:19) and lose salvation.

12) Was Point 18 in old Since the apostasy, God had not wanted the remnant back in His Church,
but now He does. He would first reveal the remnant to His leader,
then tell him how they would return, and finally that
He meant soon. This was the order in which these things became apparent.

13)Formerly point 22 We might ask: does the DEVIL know the prophecy is on in the near term?
For those who understand how the devil works—that he counterfeits EVERYTHING God
does—a variety of counterfeit theories have recently appeared about how
God is going to reunite His people. Should not the devil be expected to do this
at the time it would cause the most confusion? You will soon see that most of
these theories are coming from men standing on the wrong side of this
prophecy.

14) Was point 23 With God’s people split up, it is now almost impossible to do a
powerful Work. (This might be the one area where the splinter leaders would
agree.) God’s Church is largely stymied in working with both brethren
and the world because of the confusion and deception from top leaders about
where God’s Church is, who has the truth, who is carrying on after Mr.
Armstrong, who is doing the true Work, etc. (Reread #22.) There is no other
way to proceed than for God to remove leaders who have lulled with
deceit many thousands who were blind (Rev. 3:17) to begin with.

15)Was point 24 World conditions cry out for a big Work NOW!!!—not years from
now.

Some summary review. Since the prophecy has been revealed, brethren have new
knowledge. They know God disagrees with the remnant’s decision that it
is not yet time to come together and build His House. With knowledge comes
responsibility (Jms. 4:17; Heb. 10:26).

Could
not agree more and now that we know the simple complex Haggai Prophecy
did not come to pass as presented, the responsible thing to do is
apologize.

September 10, 2013Restored Church of God Members Deceived Into Thinking David C. Pack Never Set Any Dates

For
many weeks, David C. Pack set about presenting his ultimate prophecy
about the great coming reunification of all the Churches of God under
his own superfantabulous tent. That prophecy also included his specific
promise that three COG leaders would die by a specific date. Pack
admitted he knew specifically who these three were as did The Sixteen.

When
Dave's prophesied event failed to happen, Dave was stunned. How could
his god lie to him? What had he done wrong to irritate his god so much
that he failed to keep Dave's utterances? After a few days of wearing
sack cloth and ashes, Dave immediately scrubbed certain dates and
promises from his original posts. Now when any RCG members goes to
those letters they can state that Dave NEVER made such promises because
it is plainly not there.

We all know for a fact that
Dave never got on his knees and repented of his ludicrous prophecies.
Dave is incapable of sin and has admitted over and over that he searches
himself for sin and can't find any. Since his god also did not speak
to him, Dave had to edit his prophecies in order to justify his god in
not making the great reunification happening.

Dave will
never admit he was wrong. He will never admit that he blatantly lied to
his members and to the public. The Sixteen, those loyal ministers who
had their "eyes washed" will continue to stand by his side lying for
Dave. Dale Schurter, Larry McElroy and Wadsworth RCG pastor Gregory
Kaidannek will continue to defend the false prophet that their "holy"
bible tells them to reject. These men along with David C. Pack are men
without honor.Bob Theil has a excerpt letter up on his blog from an RCG member who denies that Dave Pack ever set any dates.

09/09/13 p.m. Apparently, many of those in RCG are in denial about
what has been happening. Got the following as part of an email today:

A friend of mine, is now attending with him and says that he didnt
say that it would occur on that day. That people are misunderstanding
him. I read it and he said it. Now, Dave-Pack had removed it and is
saying something different. My friend says to me show me the proof.

This
all reminds me of the COG members who to this day also deny that HWA
and other COG minsters ever set any dates in 1971, 1972 and 1975.
Members are so blindly loyal that they cannot perceive their leaders to
be capable of error. That attitude comes from having pounded into them
the concept that all COG leaders are directly under Jesus Christ in government and God cannot make a mistake.

What
these members fail to realize is that their leaders are not loyal to
them and could care less if they defend them. Loyalty is a one way
street in Armstrongism. It is from the members upward. It is not from
the top down, as true servant leadership should be. COG leaders like
Dave Pack and Gerald Flurry will continue to lie to the members and be
disloyal to them till the day they die.

September 9, 2013Dennis noticing some Waggle in the Wiggle

This ain't Rocket Science Folks...Oops, This is Rocket Science Folks

David C Pack's Pre-August 31, 2013 Comments on the simplicity and
non-complicated nature of the Haggai Prophecy about Himself and RCG

"God Reveals Secrets

Before continuing we must also grasp something
repeated from before. I am neither a prophet nor have I any self-prescribed
authority to bring any prophecies. What will be shown is entirely GOD’S
prophecy—from HIS WORD—explained and conveyed through the only office He ever
uses to bring biblical truth to His Church (Acts 2:42; Eph. 2:20). The Bible
warns that “no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation” (II
Pet. 1:20).But God does work through His chosen
servants. In fact, He never reveals His Plan through anyone else. The
many sermons I have given, including much of what you have read and will read,
bring GOD’S interpretation of phrases, symbols and terms that He uses, not my
private opinions. The reader will find that a crucial part of Zechariah holds
powerful keys, but was written in code. But nothing within it is complicated. Each verse has a clear explanation if we just allow the Bible—meaning
GOD!—to interpret the meaning through other scriptures. The “code” it is written
in becomeseasily unlocked."

David C Packs Post August 31, 2013
comments on the complicated and puzzling nature of a the same highly complicated
Haggai Prophecy about himself and RCG

"Mr. Armstrong puzzled and puzzled and puzzled over certain much less
complicated prophecies. He often said that things he learned
came over time—not all right away, or even
close in some cases. There are points we learned “late” in what is an enormously complex
prophecy. We knew from early on in our pursuit of the truth that
this prophecy did not carry with it the kind of time that Mr. Armstrong always
had to properly sort through prophecies—ones that, however great in magnitude as
we know some are, were simpler to
understand."

September 9, 2013Dennis Muses: "Giving up the Ghosts..."

Just What Do You Mean

"God Haunted"?

Brutus and the Ghost of Caesar

haunt(hônt, hnt)

v.haunt·ed, haunt·ing, haunts

v.tr.

1. To inhabit, visit, or appear to in the form of a
ghost or other supernatural being.

2. To visit often; frequent:haunted the movie theaters.

3.To come to the mind of continually; obsess:a riddle that haunted me all morning.

4. To be continually present in; pervade: the melancholy that haunts the composer's
music.

v.intr.

To recur or visit often, especially as a ghost.

n.

1. A place much frequented.

2. also hant or ha'nt(hnt) or haint(hnt)Chiefly Southern
U.S. A ghost or other supernatural being.

God haunted is what James Malm, Samuel Kitchen
and E.W.King are. David C. Pack and Gerald Flurry are God Haunted. All of
those who listen to them are God Haunted.

Being
God haunted, using the above definitions,
to often visit the scriptures...any scripture found anywhere on any
topic to try
and discern what it must mean for you today and to pick a way in which
it can
control, alter or influence your thinking. Mistaken and mispoken
ministers do this to the congregation knowlingly or, more likely,
unknowingly.

Being God Haunted is to continually obsess on
everything from "God's plan" to "Jesus Christ NOW is _____" fill in the blank.
It makes you wear or not wear certain clothes or kinds of clothes. It dictates
the foods you eat or don't eat . It may dictate how you cook that food or even
if you do. Being God Haunted determines the days you keep or don't keep as
sacred or meaningful. Being God Haunted makes one keep those days in exact and
certain ways and times. It calculates and measures.

Being
God Haunted determines just how you view
marriage and "roles." If it is God/Christ/My Church Leader/Me and then
my wife
to be followed by the kids and their pets, the woman is going to find
out real
fast what God Haunted religion is going to do to her individuality. God
Haunted
parents ruin kids and teach them that conformity in spite of
individuality and
the authenticity of each person is all that is required. God Haunted
parents
forget they got to make life choices themselves unless they too are the
product
of God Haunted parents who only demanded conformity to the family ways,
now pass
it on. God Haunted parents send their kids to God Haunted Summer Camps
or programs where the kids then learn the fine art of either wearing the
mask of conformity or the fine art of getting around the rules and
having some fun.

Gerald
Flurry is God Haunted. His obsession
with HWA and the Book of Malachi where in he sees himself as "That
Prophet" is
classic God Hauntedness. It's also classic delusional thinking. He's
not "that prophet" and he's not even that intelligent. Gerald is
Haunted by the Ghost of HWA who I am not confident was God Haunted in
the same
ways. HWA had his ghosts but I don't perceive they were obsessions with
how
exactly to be and do things to be on God's good side. Being God Haunted
is the
fear of doing something Biblically inappropriate or forbidden upon pain
of death
or being cut off from the Deity. Purification rites are being God
Haunted.
Washings and sacrifices are being God Haunted. Giving money you really
do not
have to give is being God Haunted. Allowing your pastor to badger you
into
giving up retirements, homes, possessions, stuff, time and effort , with
the
appropriate scriptures to back it up, against your better stomach
twitching
judgment, is being God Haunted.

Dr. Robert Thiel is God Haunted. He worries
about how God views football, make up and the role of women. I suppose he has
mused on NASCAR too. I don't know. But if the question came up, he'd have to
search the scriptures for a principle with which to make a judgment on the
matter. That's God Haunted.

Being God haunted agonizes over questions about
what constitutes leavening or at what age my child should fast on Atonement. It
never crosses their mind to ask the child or even teen if they wish to
participate of their own free will. They are afraid they might say not this
year and then the Deity will be really miffed. Being God Haunted asks whether
God approves of oral sex or not. As one minister begged when the presenter at a
Refresher Program thought this needed to be addressed "in the Church", "Stop,
stop...don't answer that! You'll lose the entire French Church!" End of
discussion.

Being God Haunted begs for an answer to whether
you can eat out on a certain day of the week or turn on your lights or stove.
Being God Haunted keeps you near breathless to hear the next "announcement" as
to what God is doing this week which obviously He forgot to include in last week's
announcement. Being God Haunted looks back at what actually happened as opposed
to what one said must happen and rewrites the script to keep it ever about to
happen.

And
of course, David C Pack, head of the
Restored Church of God, is God Haunted. Seeing himself as spoken of by
the
prophet Haggai and Zechariah is classic God Haunted. It is classic
mental
illness as well I am sure by someone's knowledgeable definition. I
can't judge
Dave's religious sincerity. But he is God Haunted and obsessive about
meaning
and what God, Christ and the Devil are doing these days concerning his
Restored Church of God and himself. . They all are and they
search and search the scriptures to find meaning and to define
everything they
can think up to think on. He is obsessive about all things HWA. Being
God
Haunted never means "I was wrong," "I misspoke" or "I got a little
carried away
with scripture and I apologize." It always means, "The Prophecy still
stands!
We (not I) were wrong in the "Timing." And the God Haunted pursuit of
the
content of God's mind continues unabated and unexamined.

One of the worst explanations of scripture ever given in WCG as to how one should study the bible is found in Isaiah 28 9-11

…9 "To
whom would He teach knowledge, And to whom would He interpret the
message? Those just weaned from milk? Those just taken from the breast? 10 "For He says, 'Order on order, order on order, Line on line, line on line, A little here, a little there.'"11. Indeed, He will speak to this people Through stammering lips and a foreign tongue,…"

This
scripture is God, MOCKING the drunken priests of Ephraim and their way
of teaching. It is God, through Isaiah, telling them they talk like
babies. Later God says if that's the way you want it, that's the way
God will respond and we'll see how that works out for you.

New International Version
"For it is: Do this, do that, a rule for this, a rule for that; a little here, a little there."

New Living Translation"He tells us everything over and over--one line at a time, one line at a time, a little here, and a little there!"

These
are not compliments and certainly NOT how one should study scripture to
get "Gods intended meaning" or to promote "Letting the Bible interpret
the Bible."

When I was pastoring in Kentucky, people would
tell me that various areas or places "had the Haints." That meant it was
haunted. It had ghosts and was full of strange and weird things and
happenings.

Is
there a cure for "the Haints"? Only time and
with experience I suppose. Some clear thinking people, and I'm not
seeing a lot of
that in some of the COG membership as they sit week after week being
entertained
by the fairy tales of a Dave Pack or the lesseer players like Thiel,
Malm, Kitchen and King,, will reach the point of clarity and finally
give up the
ghosts.

Many won't and really probably can't.

On this topic in the behaviors, requirements and
machinations of the key players in the Church of God unending God Haunted drama,
it will take time and a deep level of finally coming to see what "by their
fruits you shall know them" actually means to the observer of these things. This is the only real Ghost Buster I know and
you'll know it when it shows up.

It usually presents itself when you hear the
voice in your head, almost mid sentence or mid sermon say...

"This is stupid...I ain't afraid of no ghosts"

September 8, 2013Dennis Muses on a Sunday Morning

1, 2, 3, ____

Before
pastoring in and for the Worldwide Church of God, I did
not know what either depression or anxiety was. When the Receivership
drama hit
in the late 70's, I believe that is where it began to present itself to
me and
any tendencies I may have had towards such episodes and reactions to
life's
circumstances. The first medical experience I had with solving it
ended up with my being told, "you'll be on these meds the rest of your
life." Ummm...no. I have issues that need to be faced and resolved
and when they get put in their proper perspective, I won't feel as I
feel and won't be stuck. That proved to be the truth and it did not
come from thinking. It was a gut reaction.

These
are not easy topics to speak about. Well they are if
one is being generic and has no actual experience with it, but when it
is
personal, the first reaction is that others will think one is weak. But
now I know how many human beings feel and struggle the same way. Back
then I did not. What good is an experience if you don't share the
insights? In religion
and in the Church of God, you "lack faith" or need to get closer to God
in some
way if you suffer depression or anxiety. Nonsense of course, but it is
effective in promoting the guilt (I did a bad
thing) and shame (I am a bad person) that often goes with the turf of
religious
practice. Coping with change and events can be challenging with all the
things that are at stake in this world. It's ok to need help. It is a
wise person in this day and age who has a personal counselor who
actually knows how it all works.

My
first conscious experience with this dual demon of depression and
anxiety came in the late 70's when the WCG went into Receivership. I
knew in my soul when the Receivership hit that the Church
and the Armstrongs were to blame and deserved it. I didn't want to
believe it
but in my gut, I knew it was true. It was not an attack against
religion. It
was not government persecuting a church for its beliefs. It was no
angry Satan
attacking Herbert W Armstrong for preaching truth. It was a legitimate
concern
government and those affected by the WCG and HWA had about the
organization and
what was going on with it. It's when I went into my leave me alone
shell and simple tried to be the best local pastor I could be. I still
believed the message. It was the messengers I was having problems
taking seriously

At any rate, quietly and insidiously it ate away at me. It
was the first time I wished I had made other choices but the die seemed to have
been cast. One thing lead to another and the many things I knew or heard behind
the scenes began to take their toll. Once transferred for the last time , it
broke through and I ended up having to address the depression, which in
hindsight was really my internalized and repressed anger with no place to go
safely or effectively, had to be addressed.

n the course of "treatment" I was asked to take a simple 18
question test. No problem. here is how it went.

1. 1, 2, 3 __________

2. 1a, 2b, 3c 4______

3. .....and so on.

My first thoughts were they thought I was stupid or retarded.
My second thought was along the lines of wondering what the hell was going on
and how did I get to this point. Was basket weaving next?

I could see the answer in my mind. But when I tried to write
it down, I lost it. It was the only one I missed.

When I went back for a "chat" with my counselor he told me I
did very well. I smiled because it was the first thing that felt good in a long
time. Then he cut me to the bone. "Dennis...it is no great honor to be the
most intelligent guy in a mental hospital." (It was a Charter
Facility)

﻿

I just stared at him. It was one of those moments where you
know someone is right but you want them to say something more kind and helpful
than that. It was then I realized that lots of folk who struggle with such
things are very intelligent. It was the first time I realized it didn't matter
if one used it badly or it simply caused one's head to spin with thoughts that
lead to depression, which is the anger at the past unresolved or anxiety which
seems all about future fears and concerns.

We/I had to do
another little experiment in the program. A standard wooden pallet was in the
middle of the room. There were about 10 of us and given the simple task of all
getting on the pallet with no feet touching the floor. Great! Now I'm a
complete idiot (You have to recall I grew up visiting a State Hospital every
week where my brother, blind, deaf and speechless lived). Now I was going to prove I was handicapped!
We did as instructed and the counselor said, "Ok , let's go back and talk about
this." Sure, fine. I was not in a good mood.

﻿

The counselor asked one question of the group to consider.
"Tell me where you were on the pallet. The center, the inside or the outside.
Got me! I woke up a bit more forever. I was on the outside with my arms out
holding everyone on the pallet. He asked me if I had the thought of stepping
off the pallet so others had room? Got me! "yes." He said we had to work on
that but I got the point and it was a life lesson never to be forgotten.

What's the point? Going back to "It is no great honor being
the most intelligent guy in a mental facility," I see the same thing going on
with Dave Pack and his Restored Church of God. I think you know I have little
use for the one man show in church and religion. It is too dangerous and to
think one man would be allowed to filter my world of experience and thought ,
hopes and faith through his mind is obscene to me. RCG members allow it all the
time. It's why we write about thinking for one's self and not letting others
filter your experience through their own baggage or way of being and seeing.

Dave
Pack is an intelligent man in many ways but not
theologically and I think most here know what I mean by that from
previous
comments of mine on the topic. He, like most in the Church of God
ministry,
are mere Bible readers and commentators. He just does it well. Bob
Thiel and Gerald Flurry do not do it all that well. That is not the
same, however, as being
theologically trained or competent. He is an excellent speaker and can
present
material very well. Not to me personally of course, as his
presentations are
almost humorous to me knowing what he is actually doing or how he really
does
not understand the origins and intent of the original material he now
presents,
but that's a different topic.

Dave
seems both "intelligent" and clever. Clever is the
devious part of intelligence and not a good combo. Clever always falls
to
reality and truth. It serves a short term purpose but clever always
ends up
biting you in the ass. Clever is what Dave being forced to use now to
keep his Haggai Prophecy alive and kicking. Those outside the sphere of
clever influence can see it
clear as day. Those inside the circle tend to not see it and excuse it
when they
do. You have to be good at that gut stirring denial in the Churches of
God at
times. I was.

﻿

In some ways, I feel sorry for the man. The excuse making,
rewriting, editing and blame placing where it does not actually belong is a
common approach those given to hyperbole and theological nonsense end up
perfecting when the excrement hits the rotating device. In religion you always
get to say "God is revealing more," "Rejoice! We have more time," or in Dave's
case, "The Prophecy stands true. It is the timing that "we" i.e. "he" did not
understand. In my world we call that "Weinlanding." You actually crash but
you survive saying, "any landing you survive is a good landing."

"Apostle" Dave is intelligent. He is clever. He is
persuasive sorta depending. He is driven. He reads well. He can make up many
points to be known. He copies HWA very well. I think he is sincere and really
believes he is spoken of in scripture. "Apostle" Dave Pack is the most clever and "intelligent" guy in the Wild World of God mental facility.

But let me pass a life lesson on to you Dave...

"It is no great honor to be the most intelligent
guy in a mental health facility."

I'd
also be curious to know where you'd end up on the pallet... In the
middle or on perimeter? I doubt it would be anyplace in between.

September 7, 2013David C. Pack: Where You Choose To Wait For My Prophecy To Come True Could Be Deadly

David
C. Pack just cannot get it through his head that NO ONE in the hundreds
of COG's came over to his side this past weekend. Your failure to
really trust in his god caused you to deny his god and your salvation is
now at risk. If you stay in your current COG waiting to see what
happens, you are destroying your chance of salvation. David seems to
be saying, "It is better to come on over to the dark side, even if I am
wrong than to stay where you are and give your money to them. Its my
money and it belongs to me. Your questions and fears should not be part
of the equation. I am incapable of being wrong, trust me, it will be
OK in the end."

Lacking the prophecy’s fulfillment, having vested themselves in the
announced date, some brethren outside The Restored Church of God are
surely wondering what to do now. You face a choice: wait inside God’s Church and Work—or outside…

If you stay where you are, you have chosen to continue under false
leaders in a place of division and deception, one drenched in false
doctrine and under a false government, all while witnessing accelerating
collapse around you. Of course, some may just go home. Unavailable to
you will be healings, blessings and almost daily exciting announcements
of God’s Church and Work. (Just view our “Behind the Work” film right
after the Feast of Tabernacles to see the sharp contrast with your
group.) Or would you rather support the exciting Work of God being done
in His Church, under His government, in His full truth, while experiencing the peace, joy, love and unity only possible in one Church?

The only real alternative you have is to follow Christ’s Spirit back to His Church.

Think hard about what you will do. You do not need to wait until our
next “Fruits” letter highlights how we continue to explode in growth and
the reach of the Work while other groups do not. You need not miss out.

Do not stake your salvation on the timing of the
Haggai/Zechariah prophecy. I repeat a final time. The prophecy is TRUE.
Just next week’s announcement will inspire you beyond belief—it is way beyond what you could imagine! Don’t miss it!

3 comments:

Anonymous
said...

Yes, many agrees that Mr. David C. Pack is a clever and intelligent man. And they believe that he knows that "To much is given, much is required." There is no immunity, there will be consequences. Even Moses, the greatest man who ever lived didn't made it to the Promise Land. Samuel the Prophet assigned his sons to be judges and what happened? King David the Man after God's own heart didn't have a perfect life. Whenever Mr. Pack prophecies,some of God's people's head are shaking like "No he shouldn't." But still they stayed because they know he is God's anointed, they love and respect him. And they know he is not perfect. And they know that he knows there is no immunity. There will be consequences.

Dave called me many years ago when I told him that he was giving a whole bunch of BS and that I would end up alone in a rocking chair with no one wanting to be around me. He asked me how said would my life be. I assure you my life is way better than his and I praise and pray to a living God daily. He has only proved my life when I would no longer allow a so called leader of a church tell me what I should and should not do, what I can and cannot do. I was given the same spirit he is suppose to have yet i have no need to tell anyone how they should worship. Theology is the base word Theos which means personal. When as humans will we take personal responsibility for our beliefs instead of stating what is heard from the phony pulpit. Good luck Dave I hope you do not end up in that rocking chair.

Pack recently said in a message that "we have thinking people here", obviously no one thinks there, and he does not want anyone to either. Especially the ministers who are all "yes men" and wash-ups from the real business world who are now heirlings.