I want racheal retire. She is not that ugly but her skating is so. Her legs, her arms. her neck and her face don't look good on the ice. And she was utterly overrated at U.S nationals. In general, she remindes me of Yuna. I want artists on the ice like everyone else does.

Racheal's mom says that she is using 2010-11 as a "transition" year and that they are looking at new coaches. Maybe she wants to move to the Bay area and start working with coaches there? I personally am very surprised at this, after all the time and commitment Racheal showed for her studies and how excited she seemed about college I thought she would get going this year. After all, can she really improve on her last season? Top 10 at Olympics and Worlds, National Champion?

Perhaps they take studies very seriously and do not want to do both? I feel that freshmen could relax a bit as far as the studies go. After all, there are many students who work like 20 hours while studying. But the US has only two spots so that skating may take a full focus for her to keep up the level.

Perhaps they take studies very seriously and do not want to do both? I feel that freshmen could relax a bit as far as the studies go. After all, there are many students who work like 20 hours while studying. But the US has only two spots so that skating may take a full focus for her to keep up the level.

I think you might be right, Bennett. Especially if Rachael goes into science, she'll have a lot of extra lab hours. I remember that Debi Thomas tried to do both academics and skating at once, and she was always rushing from one to the other. I can't imagine that one would get a lot of enjoyment from either in that situation. Rachael is smart to focus on just the one for a year and see where it leads her.

I wish someone could figure out how to correct the spelling of her name on the thread title! I think the a and the e have been transposed.

I think you might be right, Bennett. Especially if Rachael goes into science, she'll have a lot of extra lab hours. I remember that Debi Thomas tried to do both academics and skating at once, and she was always rushing from one to the other. I can't imagine that one would get a lot of enjoyment from either in that situation. Rachael is smart to focus on just the one for a year and see where it leads her.

THANK YOU, Princess9!! Skating is not like ballet. Yes, it requires artistry and elegance ,but that can be done by anyone. But to become the best ballerina, you must have a certain type of legs and hips. My friend's daughter was rejected at age 9 by one of the very best ballet compeny in Russia because of that. Rachael needs to work on presentation and speed etc, but to me she is one of the best skaters out there and She looks fine with the way she is.

Very nicely said! Figure Skating is Not Ballet. For a young lady to even be considered for a chorus job in the NYC Ballet, she must have a short torso and long legs.

I often read posts where the writer only considers the last competition of a skater infused with the writer's particular performance requirements. Nothing about past performances or possible future performance. Just no corrective criticism without a snarky adjective tied to it. Figure Skating is a Sport and does not require a body type. Sasha had a boyish body, but she was still a good skater. I was never moved by Irina Slutskaya's performances, but her Tech was second to none.

Let's check out Rachael, Ashley and Mirai in the coming season for the SPORT of skating as laid out by the ISU, and not by Ballet standards.

About the controversy over Rachael's scores at U.S. Nationals and then at the Olympics, I think the only thing for certain is that it brings the judging system into the crossfires again.

My personal opinion (many agree, including the NBC television commentators) is that Mirai should have won U.S. Nationals. But she didn't, despite a rousing performance, because of two under-rotation calls.

At the Olympics, I think Rachael should have placed fifth. But she didn't, despite a rousing performance, because of two under-rotation calls.

In both cases the jumps in question seemed no worse than many others in the competition that were ratified. This leaves the impression -- at least for me it did -- that the new judging system is just as whimsical as the old. It leaves the impression that it is the technical panel and the judges that are deciding the contest, not the athletes on the ice.

I don't know if there is any cure for this problem. Figure skating is a judged sport. The athletes just have to grin and bear it.

About the controversy over Rachael's scores at U.S. Nationals and then at the Olympics, I think the only thing for certain is that it brings the judging system into the crossfires again.

My personal opinion (many agree, including the NBC television commentators) is that Mirai should have won U.S. Nationals. But she didn't, despite a rousing performance, because of two under-rotation calls.

At the Olympics, I think Rachael should have placed fifth. But she didn't, despite a rousing performance, because of two under-rotation calls.

In both cases the jumps in question seemed no worse than many others in the competition that were ratified. This leaves the impression -- at least for me it did -- that the new judging system is just as whimsical as the old. It leaves the impression that it is the technical panel and the judges that are deciding the contest, not the athletes on the ice.

I don't know if there is any cure for this problem. Figure skating is a judged sport. The athletes just have to grin and bear it.

Great Post, MM! I think it comes down to the human preferences of the judges despite all the seminars they attend. It's the - and + GoEs, which no amount of seminars can assist in the judgements of what a judge expects, and that secretive Technical Panel which so many fans think had wrong calls.

I want racheal retire. She is not that ugly but her skating is so. Her legs, her arms. her neck and her face don't look good on the ice. And she was utterly overrated at U.S nationals. In general, she remindes me of Yuna. I want artists on the ice like everyone else does.

Ouch! But this may not be the first time to hear similar things on Rachael on this board, either, albeit not as blant as this. When I read her interview conducted by Vlad, I am happy to hear that she seems delightful and not affected by tons of negative feedbacks. Give the girl a little break. Also please be aware that her family, friends, and she herself may be reading the boards so that her grandma does not have to have a heart attack to see her being trashed online.

Very nicely said! Figure Skating is Not Ballet. For a young lady to even be considered for a chorus job in the NYC Ballet, she must have a short torso and long legs.

I often read posts where the writer only considers the last competition of a skater infused with the writer's particular performance requirements. Nothing about past performances or possible future performance. Just no corrective criticism without a snarky adjective tied to it. Figure Skating is a Sport and does not require a body type. Sasha had a boyish body, but she was still a good skater. I was never moved by Irina Slutskaya's performances, but her Tech was second to none.

Let's check out Rachael, Ashley and Mirai in the coming season for the SPORT of skating as laid out by the ISU, and not by Ballet standards.

Good points and very accurate. Figure skating is not ballet but it is not ice hockey either.
I believe it is a sport - and the tricky part is that it is a judged sport.

To ignore the fact that there are marks for PE, IN and CH seems to be a denial of the very key components, even the essense of what separates figure skating from so many other sports.

Some may thumb their noses at skating's attempts to be "artistic" but I feel those fans do not make up the majority of skating fans.

If we take away the music and presentation components from skating I doubt that I would watch or follow it too closely.

A new sport called "Ice jumping" would not have very much appeal for me.
I would rather see them jump with the music - which for sports fans - every skater says is much more difficult that merely jumping in practice.

"Ice jumping" witout the music and other requirements might actually feel less like a sport since it is so much easier doing most of the elements without regard to the IN and CH.

So , by your standard, Yuna is artistic? Well, good for you. I respect your opinion.

You didn't answer my question.

You can't just go and say "oh Rachel is awful," "she's like Yuna" or "you want those robots to win?" Those are just generalizations that do nothing to move the discussion forward. Why not explain what exactly you don't like about Rachael's skating?

I also think it's a low blow to use another skater to put a jab at another especially when it has nothing to do with the discussion topic at hand.

Back to the subject. I think we should see how Rachael will do without the pressures of high school and applying for college on her back. Just because all the news reports shows her as this ultra organized person, doesn't necessarily mean that she thrived (at least skating wise) on this environment. Like the others, I am curious to see what she'll do when she can devote a full day to training.

Definitely right away. I'm a Chemistry major and in my freshman year, I had two lab sciences (each with a 3 hour/once a week lab component in addition to the lecture periods) in my first semester and have had at least two or three every semester since.

If Rachael still wants to keep up her skating at a GP/Nationals/Worlds level, it's probably a good idea that she take this extra year to see because as a science major it will be very hard to fit her high level of training in with her choice of major. It's possible, but attaining to her high standards of good scores and good grades in both is extremely unlikely.

Good points and very accurate. Figure skating is not ballet but it is not ice hockey either.
I believe it is a sport - and the tricky part is that it is a judged sport.

To ignore the fact that there are marks for PE, IN and CH seems to be a denial of the very key components, even the essense of what separates figure skating from so many other sports.

There are other judged sports where artistry is a factor: Diving, Gymnastics, Children's Pagaents.

Some may thumb their noses at skating's attempts to be "artistic" but I feel those fans do not make up the majority of skating fans.

No one is arguing that skating should not be artistic. They are just waiting to see it, and does it compare with the other acknowledged performing arts?

If we take away the music and presentation components from skating I doubt that I would watch or follow it too closely.

That is your choice.

A new sport called "Ice jumping" would not have very much appeal for me.
I would rather see them jump with the music - which for sports fans - every skater says is much more difficult that merely jumping in practice.

That's hearsay. Perhaps you never competed but it is nerve wracking to be judged in any sport.

"Ice jumping" witout the music and other requirements might actually feel less like a sport since it is so much easier doing most of the elements without regard to the IN and CH.

Difficult to reply to since I do not know what IN and CH are. However, the Free Skate had jumping to music, and the modern LP has jumping to music. No one is taking that away.

That's hearsay. Perhaps you never competed but it is nerve wracking to be judged in any sport.

Difficult to reply to since I do not know what IN and CH are. However, the Free Skate had jumping to music, and the modern LP has jumping to music. No one is taking that away.

Evan just recently talked about the difference between jumping a quad in practice and in competition. Other skaters have mentioned this. I am sure you also believe it is easier in practice to circle the rink and jump without regard to music, or choreo/TR.

I will agree that if one is judged on jumps without music it could bring nerves into play. But it still feels like it is dumbing down skating, and seems like a step backward. We just disgaree on how best to demostrate jumps and other elements in the SP/ technical program.

For me, with quads and 3A's I want to see how the skater handles them in the context of a program. Period.
I have no interest to watch Evan or Patrick or any other skater landing practice quads.

You and I have been through the question of competing on this board atleast two other times. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz (yes, I have been judged in both music performance and in sports.)