You just get arrested for possession of a legal gun at the Empire State Building? Is this like a NYC law? I live upstate, and you are definitely not simply arrested for having a legal gun with permit on you in public. It sounds like going up to a security guard/cop and informing them that you are carrying, and asking what the policy is for the premises, and if you can leave a gun with someone, is just about the most correct thing you can do in this situation.

WalkingCarpet:"KelvinTheClown: Remember, gay marriage licenses from state to state will be honored, but your gun permit is not.

Until someone gets killed by or menaced with someone holding a gay marriage license this analogy makes zero sense."

Fine - your killing and menacing of the English language put aside, here's a better comparison: Drivers' licenses from state to state are honored, but gun permits are not. Meanwhile, VASTLY more people each year are killed and injured by cars than by guns. And while driving is a privilege (i.e. nobody technically has to grant it), gun possession is supposedly a constitutionally protected right.

Yet people like yourself are perfectly OK with someone going to jail as a result of the latter being denied, while you would no doubt be up in arms (so to speak) about any infringement on the former. And because there are more people who drive cars than there are gun owners, society condones that. There's a term for this - it's called tyranny of the majority.

dittybopper:Tell you what: In the true spirit of compromise, I'd be willing to accept universal background checks for all non-family gun transfers in order to get national reciprocity.

I'm willing to concede that NYC often treats these issues with an absurd degree of punishment, however I do not want a city full of armed tourists, regardless of the background checks. Now, if you'd like to make arrangements with NYC law enforcement upon your visit to our city, I'd be more than willing to have them mind your weapon while you sample the fare at a different Applebees or Olive Garden than the one you frequent in your town.

Gordon Bennett:Eejits. I was under the impression that if you get to carry a deadly weapon then you accept extra responsibility to ensure that you obey all related laws. Now they've been arrested and if there is any justice will lose the right to carry a gun having now committed a gun related offence.

I don't usually come down on the side of the gun-nuts, but...

There are too many laws to know them all. The old, "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" is a weapon of the elites against the masses.

If the police get to carry guns wherever and whenever they want, so should the citizenry. There should be no "super citizenry" but this is what police have effectively become, above the law, and usually beyond reproach.

Frankly, I would rather see police be nominated and elected within their communities, with term limits. It should be a community service, not a career, save for a much smaller group of specialized professionals. We definitely need something to remind police that they are and "us" and not "us vs. them" in our society.

Statistics prove you are far more likely to be wrongly shot by a police officer than a gun-toting citizen--regardless of the color of his neck.

The rule should be, "No harm, no foul, you get a warning." We live in a society where it is easy enough to warn someone and attach it to their record, so there is proof they have been "educated" to a law. Habitual and repeat offenders will be caught and then punishment or fines may indeed be merited.

It is the mark of a totalitarian regime to be able to arrest you for any infractions of the law, regardless of intent. (Read Silvergate's "Three Felonies a Day")

If you are the one who outs yourself with good intent, one should not be arrested. One should be warned and directed to immediately correct the situation. Our laws should not be "gotcha" laws, nor should they be to generate revenue for jail owners, nor used to justify the ever expanding police states.

Arrest should be limited to those showing a clear threat to society. Merely possessing a weapon is not a threat. Especially one politely asking if there is a place to store it when they see a sign saying they are not allowed to have one on the premises.

The tourist was obviously not of a "criminal mind" arrest is completely unnecessary here. Why we are so excited to spend upwards of $50,000 a year to incarcerate people, but not give children pre-school, students a reasonably priced college education, and have minimum wages of employees liked to maximum wages of capitalists? We are pretty screwed up about what we spend our tax dollars on.

We arrest far too many people and deny far too many people their liberties in our nation for victimless crimes. We are no longer the home of the free, but the home of the "Pending detention and incarceration at the whim of arbitrary authority." Not to mention, home of the heavily taxed to pay for the security/police state.

dittybopper:f you have a permit that passes some federal standard on training and background checks issued by your home state, then why not let them carry everywhere it's legal to carry a gun?

Because NYC is very different them yokelsville, south hickstucky.

The chance of law enforcement or others not being readily available to you if you need help is lower (especially in a place like the farking empire state building). You have a far greater chance of hitting something other than a cow or a barn if you miss your target. What passes for threatening\suspicious behavior in bumblefark is just how we hail cabs or tell the guy selling us a dirty water dog to go heavy on the onions.

and most of all, we don't live in fear afraid of our own shadows every day.

Nothing against guns, but CCW in a place like NYC is far more trouble than it is worth.

Yanks_RSJ:No, the most correct thing a gun owner can do before traveling is to learn the gun laws in the specific area to which he will be traveling.

In NYC, you cannot carry a firearm without a permit issued by the city itself.

Because of the byzantine nature of local, state, and federal laws, along with the fact that some places chose to ignore federal laws about 'safe passage' (I'm looking at you NJ and NYC), what we really need is national reciprocity.

If you have a permit that passes some federal standard on training and background checks issued by your home state, then why not let them carry everywhere it's legal to carry a gun?

Tell you what: In the true spirit of compromise, I'd be willing to accept universal background checks for all non-family gun transfers in order to get national reciprocity.

If you're too stupid to understand that the places you visit around the country might have different laws than those of where you come from, then you are definitely too stupid to have a CCW license and as a license holder I'm glad you got arrested.

Hopefully his gun will be confiscated and melted down by NYC and he will be banned from owning additional guns for many years to come.

Tommy Moo:You just get arrested for possession of a legal gun at the Empire State Building? Is this like a NYC law? I live upstate, and you are definitely not simply arrested for having a legal gun with permit on you in public. It sounds like going up to a security guard/cop and informing them that you are carrying, and asking what the policy is for the premises, and if you can leave a gun with someone, is just about the most correct thing you can do in this situation.

No, the most correct thing a gun owner can do before traveling is to learn the gun laws in the specific area to which he will be traveling.

In NYC, you cannot carry a firearm without a permit issued by the city itself.

Tommy Moo:You just get arrested for possession of a legal gun at the Empire State Building? Is this like a NYC law? I live upstate, and you are definitely not simply arrested for having a legal gun with permit on you in public. It sounds like going up to a security guard/cop and informing them that you are carrying, and asking what the policy is for the premises, and if you can leave a gun with someone, is just about the most correct thing you can do in this situation.

Are you completely naive? You live in upstate NY and you don't know about the really strict gun laws in NYC?

In all fairness, the guy DID ask if there was a place to store his pistol. It's not like he barged in and started waving it around like a retard. I just think its kind of stupid that he got arrested. Your tax dollers at work folks.

We're also not talking about someone who assumed everything was unregulated and carrying a gun wherever you wanted was cool. He applied for, received and possessed a valid CCW permit. He also respected local regulations (once he learned that they exist) and asked the right people how he could comply with them. In return he got thrown in jail.

"Hello Officer. No, I didn't know that the speed limit is 55mph here. How can I go about complying with that? Wait, why are you writing me a ticket?!?"

He had already committed the offense at that point. He should have known how to comply beforehand.

If you get caught illegally carrying a firearm, what's the difference in charges between carrying a 'loaded pistol' and carrying an 'unloaded pistol?'

On the same note, what's with the sudden frenzy of describing every gun anyone is ever caught carrying as 'loaded?' Anyone with any sense about firearms knows that any gun that is still assembled is loaded... whether that are actually cartridges in the gun or not.

If we had national reciprocity, it would make it significantly easier for me to own a handgun in my own state (NY).

It would essentially turn NYS into a "shall issue" state, which it isn't now. I'd put up with the crap to get a pistol permit (which is required even to possess a modern handgun) if it meant I could actually carry it outside of "Hunting and Target Shooting Only".

The security at the Empire State Building is a little odd. I once visited with some friends and they don't let you bring knives or wrenches up there for some reason. They do have little boxes that they'll store stuff in until you come back down at least.

I guess they don't want anyone to hijack the building and crash it into an airplane or something.

Damn, a sig? Thats a nice gun right there... They need to keep the gun, release the guy and tell him to stay out of NYC for at least a year... But this is NYC, so I am sure this guy will be treated like a sociopath about to murder everyone instead of a dumb-ass like he really is.

Tommy Moo:You just get arrested for possession of a legal gun at the Empire State Building? Is this like a NYC law? I live upstate, and you are definitely not simply arrested for having a legal gun with permit on you in public. It sounds like going up to a security guard/cop and informing them that you are carrying, and asking what the policy is for the premises, and if you can leave a gun with someone, is just about the most correct thing you can do in this situation.

Are you an idiot or trolling again?

You can't just go to random states and just hope you can carry legally there. As a NY resident you should know that. And you should damn well know you can be arrested for carrying a pistol illegally in public, in ANY damn state.

Skanque:Tommy Moo: You just get arrested for possession of a legal gun at the Empire State Building? Is this like a NYC law? I live upstate, and you are definitely not simply arrested for having a legal gun with permit on you in public. It sounds like going up to a security guard/cop and informing them that you are carrying, and asking what the policy is for the premises, and if you can leave a gun with someone, is just about the most correct thing you can do in this situation.

Are you completely naive? You live in upstate NY and you don't know about the really strict gun laws in NYC?

The only thing I see is that they do not have a reciprocity clause with the state of Georgia. There ought to be a much smaller deal made out of a Georgian with a CC permit carrying in NY than some random guy with no permit from any state brandishing a gun with the serial number filed off.

Tommy Moo:You just get arrested for possession of a legal gun at the Empire State Building? Is this like a NYC law? I live upstate, and you are definitely not simply arrested for having a legal gun with permit on you in public. It sounds like going up to a security guard/cop and informing them that you are carrying, and asking what the policy is for the premises, and if you can leave a gun with someone, is just about the most correct thing you can do in this situation.