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Author
Topic: ann, andy, experts: ejaculate risks (Read 14390 times)

I have been very curious about performing oral sex on a man. If I perform oral and he ejaculates in my mouth..how risky is this? I heard it is low risk but I just am afraid of doing this once or twice and then paying with my health. Is it true that people in serodiscordant relationships who used condoms never converted? And if he uses a condom and we are well lubed and he penetrates me anally, what kind of risk is this? Thanks.

Yes, the serodiscordant studies are true (there was more than one study), otherwise we wouldn't cite them on this website.

It is also true that giving oral is low risk, but nothing in life is absolutely 100% without risk. Even staying in bed, alone, hiding under the covers every day carries health risks. So many factors can come into play here (er, no pun intended) and we cannot tell you to go out and give unprotected blowjobs. You'll have to weigh up the CURRENT available evidence and decide what level of risk you are comfortable with.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

The rules are simple. First, whenever you have sexual intercourse (or oral sex), practice safer sex by using a condom or dental dam (a square of latex recommended for use during oral-genital and oral-anal sex). When used properly and consistently, condoms are close to 99% effective in preventing transmission of HIV. But remember:

___________________________Recent studies show that 26% of sexually active teenagers think it's impossible to get HIV through oral sex, and 15% more don't know whether people can contract HIV this way. The truth: it is possible.

Do you know how to protect yourself during oral sex?

While it's much easier to contract HIV through unprotected vaginal or anal sex, unprotected oral sex is not a safe substitute. If you choose to perform or receive oral sex—whether your partner is male or female—it's crucial that you guard against the transmission of HIV. Here's how:

Use a latex condom each and every time you perform oral-penile sex (fellatio)Use plastic food wrap, a latex condom cut open, or a dental dam when performing oral-vaginal sex (cunnilingus) or oral-anal sex (anilingus) (source: CDC)

OKAY. So first theyre telling me Condoms wont work in 1% of the time, which Im not comfy with and then they go and tell me oral transmission is possible. I read the lessons and I understand statistical risk like the meteor hitting me but nobody seriously is ever told not to go outside because its possible to get hit. And they make it sound like if that virus gets in my mouth, its possible. They sound really intense. Another question you must get 8 times an hour but Ill ask it anyway: why does the cdc do that? I know youtalked about them erring on the safe side but this is a little scary. I mean I dont want to not ever have an experience because the cdc says its possible that a little sucking may well infect me. Whats the deal with the cdc?? Is it political? K, thanks for your time ann.

Ice, if you want a 100% guarantee on anything then you have picked the wrong world to hang out in.

Nothing short of total abstinence sexually will give you that assurance, (although not against driving you crazy).

Latex condoms have consistently proven to be very effective in protecting against HIV transmission when worn properly and used everytime for intercourse.

Among the concerns you raise only giving blowjobs has a very slight risk possibility. Anecdotally there have been cases reported of transmission in this manner, but not in such a way as to clearly support the reports. Poor oral care (bleeding gums) might be a risk factor. Swallowing might be a risk factor. What it comes down to is this is an activity about which you have to decide what level of risk you're willing to accept.

Given the billions of blowjobs administered during the decades of the epidemic, we would have known long before today if there was a significant risk involved. However, if it's going to work your nerves then use a condom when giving oral.

That may not be the sure and certain answer you would like, but as I said above, you've picked the wrong world for absolute happy certainty.

I wanted to ask the panel about the risk of oral sex. If I am performing oral on 2 swingers, a woman while a man is having unprotected sex with her and I give gim oral too while I give her oral...(I think I' ve authored a run on sentence) what is the risk associated for me...? I know it can't be zero but could I be at risk for exposure and how much so? He has unprotected sex with her but says that everyone who penetrates her does so with a condom. What if I swallowed some of his ejaculate and her fluids? Okay thanks guys, I really appreciate the answers since this may be a scenario I experience tonight.

Speaking soley as someone who is currently going through hell worrying if I got HIV from performing oral sex on a man, I would personally say to not do it, or to go to the store and get some unlubricated condoms. They even sell "flavored" condoms. If I could turn back time, that's what I would do, in my situation.

Sure the chance of getting HIV from giving blowjobs may be "very low," but it's not worth the risk, in my opinion.

But... I can't tell you what to do. It's up to you to decide if the risk is worth it.

and just one more quick one in addition...I just got freaked out when I clicked on the (know HIV) weallhaveaids banner and it said:

HIV is transmitted through an exchange of certain body fluids - blood, vaginal secretions, semen, pre-ejaculation and breast milk. Most people get HIV through:

* Unprotected sex (vaginal, anal or oral) with an infected person.

are they just covering their bases or what? They make me feel like the only way not to get infected is through abstinence. In fact thats what they say and that condoms help reduce risk. So if I give a promiscuous man oral and there's semen in my mouth...I mean I know there cant be 100% risk free anything but at that website give me the impression that a little oral and then you've got it. So whats the deal with this? Thanks.

That's not the same as no risk, but as Ann has pointed out, several longterm studies of sero-discordant couples that involved lots of unprotected oral sex resulted in not a single sero-negative partner becoming HIV+.

My suggestion is that you stop surfing the net for stuff to scare yourself with. If you're old enough to be out there having sex then you're old enough to make informed choices for yourself about what risk level you are comfortable with.

You also need to remember there are other STDs out there which are much easier to pick up than HIV. If you're sexually active make sure you do the full panel of STD tests regularly -- I would say twice a year.

Yes, it is possible for either partner to become infected with HIV through performing or receiving oral sex. There have been a few cases of HIV transmission from performing oral sex on a person infected with HIV. While no one knows exactly what the degree of risk is, evidence suggests that the risk is less than that of unprotected anal or vaginal sex.

If the person performing oral sex has HIV, blood from their mouth may enter the body of the person receiving oral sex through

* the lining of the urethra (the opening at the tip of the penis); * the lining of the vagina or cervix; * the lining of the anus; or * directly into the body through small cuts or open sores.

If the person receiving oral sex has HIV, their blood, semen (cum), pre-seminal fluid (pre-cum), or vaginal fluid may contain the virus. Cells lining the mouth of the person performing oral sex may allow HIV to enter their body.

The risk of HIV transmission increases

* if the person performing oral sex has cuts or sores around or in their mouth or throat; * if the person receiving oral sex ejaculates in the mouth of the person performing oral sex; or * if the person receiving oral sex has another sexually transmitted disease (STD).

Not having (abstaining from) sex is the most effective way to avoid HIV.

If you choose to perform oral sex, and your partner is male,

* use a latex condom on the penis; or * if you or your partner is allergic to latex, plastic (polyurethane) condoms can be used.

Studies have shown that latex condoms are very effective, though not perfect, in preventing HIV transmission when used correctly and consistently. If either partner is allergic to latex, plastic (polyurethane) condoms for either the male or female can be used. For more information about latex condoms, see "Male Latex Condoms and Sexually Transmitted Diseases."

If you choose to have oral sex, and your partner is female,

* use a latex barrier (such as a natural rubber latex sheet, a dental dam or a cut-open condom that makes a square) between your mouth and the vagina. A latex barrier such as a dental dam reduces the risk of blood or vaginal fluids entering your mouth. Plastic food wrap also can be used as a barrier.

If you choose to perform oral sex with either a male or female partner and this sex includes oral contact with your partners anus (analingus or rimming),

* use a latex barrier (such as a natural rubber latex sheet, a dental dam or a cut-open condom that makes a square) between your mouth and the anus. Plastic food wrap also can be used as a barrier.

If you choose to share sex toys with your partner, such as dildos or vibrators,

* each partner should use a new condom on the sex toy; and * be sure to clean sex toys between each use.

The only one here who doesn't know what he or she is talking about is YOU. Stop posting in other people's threads and stop spreading FUD (fear, uncertainty and doubt). I've reported your post to the moderators.

IceFire -- please ignore San_2002. He has no idea what he's talking about. He's just trouble making. You can depend on Andy's advice, it is as always rock solid.

wow i cant believe i remembered my user name after a year just like thatQuick question:

First off I always use a condom for any anal penetration. But if I go down on a guy I dont make him wear one since I think I understand the risk to be very theoretical and minuscule at that. I have read the transmission page over and over but I still have a question for you guys...If a guy comes and I were to rub his ejaculate all over the head of my penis with my hands:

1) Is that a risky thing? Like what if his semen were to penetrate thru my urethra or something? Is that risky behavior? Is that dangerous?and...also..2) If I swallow his ejaculate...what kind of risk is that? I understand it may be riskier than not swallowing, but is this part of risky behavior? Or is that also part of those "nobody in the studies done has ever transmitted the virus through oral when both partners wear a condom for penetration, meteor kitting you on the head on the way to the bus" kind of thing?

I've merged your new thread into your original thread - where you should post all your additional thoughts or questions. It helps us to help you when you keep all your additional thoughts or questions in one thread.

If you need help finding your thread when you come here, click on the "Show own posts" link under your name in the left-hand column of any forum page.

Please also read through the Welcome Thread so you can familiarize yourself with our Forum Posting Guidelines. Thank you for your cooperation.

As for your questions,

1. Rubbing cum on your penis is not a risk for hiv infection. Hiv is a fragile, difficult to transmit virus that is successfully transmitted INSIDE the human body and the activity you describe takes place OUTSIDE. Small changes in temperature, moisture content and pH levels all quickly damage the outer covering of hiv, rendering it unable to infect.

2. There have been studies, as a matter of fact, that showed when serodiscordant couples used condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, but no barrier for oral, not one of the negative partners became infected. Not one! It's totally your call whether you chew on rubber, spit, swallow or don't allow anyone to cum in your mouth at all.

The main thing is remembering to use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, consistently and correctly. Have a look through all three condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use them with confidence.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Hi ann!Okay so tonight i have a follow up.As far as I know I did not swallow any semen. I did perform oral on him forever. And he on me. Im assuming Im good so far. There was some penis rubbing which i hear is okay too.The only thing is, he penetrated my ass with a few fiingers for a long while. Fingers unprotected. Assuming theres fluids everywhere, am I okay? like 2 or 4 fingers dry in my ass...is that a risk and what if there was his fluids on it.thanks

thanks rapidi guess i feel bad.because I know this man is promiscuous and doesnt use condoms much when he does anal with other guys. And he was showing me his test results but they were just for hepatitis. He kept saying his hiv neg status was on the sheet, but it wasnt. I could tell he was lying. And then said, oh well, i thought it was. Then So assuming he is hiv poz, am i still okay? So waht if he came on his hands and then penetrated me with his fingers without protection?

Yes, you're ok even if he's hiv positive. We always give risk assessments that assume the other person is positive.

It is unprotected anal or vaginal intercourse that is risky, not fingering. Even if there was cum on the fingers, it is still not a risk for hiv infection.

Hiv is very fragile and once it finds itself outside the human body, it becomes damaged and unable to transmit successfully.

Make sure condoms are being used for anal or vaginal intercourse and you will avoid hiv infection. Make sure you read through the three condom and lube links in my signature line so you know how to use them correctly. A correctly used condom rarely breaks.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Ann, if i get fingered pretty rough and somehow he has a cut on one of his fingers and some blood from his finger makes it thru my lining, so lets say theres blood to blood contact inside the body, do i need to go test for this? Thanks ann.

Okay, so if the guy is positive and I go down on him for a long time, I mean hours, and he is pushing it down my throat hard too, and he blows me too and he fingers me dry even with a cut on his finger (lets say), should I just go get tested over this incident? How risky was all that, I mean I went down on him a long long time since it was my first time too.

I dont know whats going on with me... I just keep seeing things everywhere that seem to indicate that performing oral for a long time on an hiv positive man is risky and cause for testing..I was just curious about doing it and thought Id be safe but I end up hooking up with a super promiscuous man who doesnt use condoms (which I know for sure). Im so depressed over this. What if I did get some of his cum in my mouth and swallowed it? What if his finger had his cum on it when he fingered me for a long time? I have a friend whos a girl and we always use safe sex but now I feel that I'll have to cut her off so I dont expose her to a theoretical risk of getting hiv from me or something. He was using poppers and the whole thing freaked me out. I also understand im more likely to get an std from him, but most of those can be delt with. Its hiv im worried about. Do I need to abstain from sex with her for 13 weeks until I get tested? Do I need to get tested over all this risk? Yesterday I felt, like, "oh well, I'm probably infected...maybe I should go look for some other promiscuous guys and have them have their way with me too." I almost thought something like, "since I probably infected maybe I can finally have unprotected intercourse with some guy.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

In a 1996-1999 study of MSM with a recent diagnosis of HIV infection, it was found that 7.8% of subjects (eight of 102) were probably infected through receptive oral sex.9In a 1986-1988 prospective study of HIV infection and AIDS among MSM in the Netherlands, four of 102 cases of seroconversion (3.9%) likely occurred as a result of receptive oral intercourse.10In a 1990-1992 study of gay men with newly diagnosed HIV infection, six of 37 patients (16.2%) who had been infected within a year before testing claimed receptive oral sex as the only possible route of their infection.11

I feel as though my life has just ended. I feel like I wanna believe what Im told here but everywhere else they say oral sex is risky. So now I think Im positive and I dont know what Im going to do for thirteen weeks. I know that what happened to me this weekend is the beginning of the end. I feel horrible, like Im just waiting for a test that will confirm what i believe. I just want to sleep and do nothing. Cant believe I went off and got myself hiv.

"...somehow I expect a bad result. Otherwise he would not ask. I said, I never did it in my life before – so easy. I mean, I had 4 times protected sex in my life. And the other times were just petting… touching… kissing… oral sex and never swallow. The Doc says: “I’m sorry, the HIV test is positive”'

This is someone here on this site. Protected sex and unprotected oral, never swallowed. Positive.

I just know what if this is it, this was my last week as a person without hiv and now im gonna have to face it. I dont think I can be as strong as those infected in this forum. Can someone help me..if this indedd happened to this person, then why not me?

Going into the poz only forums and bringing back to AMI the stories and experiences of HIV positive people is called "trawling" and it's considered to be the height of rudeness. It's a really low thing to do and certainly won't win you any fans around here.

That member's situation or indeed the situation of any other member (especially the poz members) of these forums has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with your case.

This is someone here on this site. Protected sex and unprotected oral, never swallowed. Positive.

You didn't read the entire post, and as Matty said, this is totally irrelevant to YOUR case. If you're going to read one post or one study and fall into oblivion because you have absolutely no training and no experience about HIV, and not trust the ones that have worked with this for years and years, then it's not going to be fun for you.

I dont mean any disrespect in trawling and I wont do it again. But you can empathize with me that there are stories where people did the same I did and tested positive. My mind is very fragile and this could not happen at a worst time. My only point is that people are getting it from oral and saying so in that forum and all over the net. Why should I not be worried? I spend my life having safe sex and barely any at that and then I try something with an hiv poz guy one night and I was told oral is safe and now I feel like I must have subconsciously been trying to get hiv.

Fragile mind or not, don't go dragging other people's business into your thread.

The risk of HIV being transmitted by performing unprotected oral sex is a theoretical one. There has never been a scientifically documented case of the virus being transmitted in that way. In fact a number of scientific studies have been done looking at transmission of HIV in sero-discordant relationships and not a HIV negative partner contracted HIV from performing oral sex (protected or otherwise) on their positive partner.

Not a single one. And you aren't going to be the first.

And no I'm absolutely not going to discuss the details of the case of the newly diagnosed member you so insensitively raised in this thread. Like I said before, it's the height of bloody rudeness and bears no relevance to the matters you've raised with us.

I understand that I had a no risk situation which does not warrant testing. And I thank matty the damned for the quick response. I dont know if this is the appropriate forum to ask this but it seems to be a benign enough question that has been in my mind....do inhalants like poppers and heavy illicit drug use have any correlation with aids? Whats the story with that?

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

I just want to thank you all for this wonderful forum and for answering my questions. I guess my intellect tells me okay oral sex in not risky but some other part of me keeps saying of course it is. I keep reading all these cdc, nih, etc studies that say its like 2 to 7 % of transmissions or less. I just keep thinking i'll be the first (!) to be here saying, hey, "I had oral sex once with a guy and now Im positive". Blah.. I know im probably over posting now. I should chill. I mean, I have no new questions. Just the same old nagging one youve all answered 10 times already. As far as I know,(!) he did not ejaculate in my mouth. And even then..ah forget it, Im being irrational. I should switch fears, since getting hiv from this incident is not possible. Maybe I should be afraid of meteors instead? Good nite. Thanks again.

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Hello allThe thing is, my possible exposure was friday night and now.. I have the "flu like" symptoms they talk about, I feel chills and my lymphnodes are sore and im not playing with them or anything, my throat is sore, my muscles are sore and everything. And Im never sick. Am I just seeing things thru the infamous hiv lens? Or should I be concerned as to my risk of infection? I've read in nih, cdc pages that its possible to seroconvert at this point. I'm guessing the answer will be symptoms or lack of symptoms mean nothing, only a positive hiv test does. But should I be concerned about this? Should I? I keep thinking I cant have sex with anyone for the next three months until I find out my status. Ever since this weekend I keep thinking I just made one of, if not the greatest mistake of my life. What if Im the lotto winner?

"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

I hate posting again as I feel its bordering on the ridiculous and all. I know oral is a low risk.. If he fingered me and used his own semen as lube..and three days later I get swollen lymph nodes and a sore throat that I have now had for 5 days and today there is like a white coating in the back of my throat..does this arouse any suspicion now at all? Should I test considering there is a small risk?

I know about the serodiscordant study in spain but what about this stuff?

In a 1996-1999 study of MSM with a recent diagnosis of HIV infection, it was found that 7.8% of subjects (eight of 102) were probably infected through receptive oral sex.9In a 1986-1988 prospective study of HIV infection and AIDS among MSM in the Netherlands, four of 102 cases of seroconversion (3.9%) likely occurred as a result of receptive oral intercourse.10In a 1990-1992 study of gay men with newly diagnosed HIV infection, six of 37 patients (16.2%) who had been infected within a year before testing claimed receptive oral sex as the only possible route of their infection.

Old news which wasn't scientific. The Spain study and the study that is still ongoing are true scientific studies not just taking someones word that they didn't have any other risky exposure. Now you can search on the web all you like and you can go test and collect your negative result. We really don't care, but don't come here trying to refute science.

If you keep on looking for things to feed your fears you are definitely going to find them. In spades.

Of course all you are doing is indulging your anxiety to absolutely no good purpose whatsover. You've already been told in a well informed way about your incident. Yet you continue to come back again and again with yet another but but but what about this. Personally I am not having any of it.

Get tested and collect your inevitable negative result.

The way I see it you aren't talking about the real issue, which I suspect is some anxiety related to having sex. If I am right about that then you need to deal with that in an appropriate professional setting.

Hi you guysIm sorry to post. I guess I dont really have a question. I had my first same sex encounter which I had fantasized about for years but I guess the fantasy didnt equal my reality. I am generally a very nervous individual and a bit neurotic and all and after having oral sex with this man I got sick a few days later and now I have this terrible skin sensitivity. Like my skin hurts when I touch it or if clothes rub on it or anything. Im going to heed the advice given to me which I believe to be that I did not have a risk of exposure and whatever I am experiencing is probably mostly probably related to very high levels of stress. In my mind, I thought I had hiv and I was just falling apart inside. I think youre all wonderful people, especially when dealing with folks like us who absolutely are convinced we're positive and you have to kepp telling us were not and all. Anyways, take care for now. Oh and Ann I read like all of your blogs. I was just reading one but youre such a good writer and I just kept on reading. I loved the pyramid in the middle of the forest. Alright later.

I was doing fine with my paranoia for a while but then this week my lymphnodes in the back of my neck started to swell and feel very sore without me playing with them or anything. So immediately I started thinking well this is about a month after my incident and maybe my body is responding to the infection and blah blah blah. I'm seeing a few women right now who are pretty cool and I've stopped myself from making any sexual moves on them even when theyve come over my place and all because I keep thinking if it would be irresponsible of me not to get tested before I have further sexual contact with anyone. I have always used a condom before and all my hiv tests before were neg but now im afraid of getting tested over my going down on that guy a month or so ago. I keep thinking if I test over that incident, ill be positive, and if I dont test and I dont tell future sex partners about my possible exposure then I'm irresponsible and putting others lives at risk. I've always used a condom and have always had negative results and I understand having a full std panel done routinely but I keep thinking I should test specifically for hiv for performing fellatio on that guy and if I dont I'm some sort of irresponsible a-hole putting others lives in danger.

Its just that I get freaked because I read this stuff on aids.about.com

It says

5. We don't need a condom for oral sex.

Again, untrue and a very dangerous myth. Condoms must be used each and every sexual encounter; vaginal, anal and oral.

Oral-Penile Contact (fellatio)

Theoretical Risk:With fellatio, there is a theoretical risk of transmission for the receptive partner because infected pre-ejaculate ("pre-cum") fluid or semen can get into the mouth. For the insertive partner there is a theoretical risk of infection because infected blood from a partner's bleeding gums or an open sore could come in contact with a scratch, cut, or sore on the penis.Documented Risk: Although the risk is many times less than anal or vaginal sex, HIV has been transmitted to receptive partners through fellatio, even in cases when insertive partners didn't ejaculate.

Our information is based on scientific fact, not guess work. If you want to continue to surf the web to power your anxiety then go for it. Don't come back here each time to question what you've found on another site. If you want to TEST go test. You didn't have a risk, collect your negative result and move on.