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ok mister specialist....just cuz i am a newbie at computers does not mean i am stupid....talk to me about chemistry and i will smoke your ASS!!!!! i assume i am one of the new "****ers" you are talking about and we make the site boring....well. us newbies have to start somewhere....so why dont people who dont like this site anymore go make their own site......out

Sorry guys... that came out all mean & rude and stuff, I guess. But my feelings stay more towards the idea that hacking is nothing more than a technological pissing contest between peaple who strive mainly for attention, money, & a reputation. I mean sure theres always the average joe blow's & the problems they cause but even on the more ethical side of things you've got guys yelling:

If you cannot do someone any good: don't do them any harm....
As long as you did this to one of these, the least of my little ones............you did it unto Me.
What profiteth a man if he gains the entire World at the expense of his immortal soul?

I think that first this is want Ennis didn't want if I remember correctly.

Sorry Dude I am going to have to endulge.

Ok HACKING, HACK, HACKER.

Are all what words.
What are words worth not a Damn thing.
I feel that maybe the words need to be considered just WTF they are words.
Specialist honestly dude I respect you. But man at times you act like an ass, as do I so I can't call the Kettle black.

Now for the thing about people callling you a Hacker. The average Joe that doesn't know sanything about computers calls a guy that, Pings someone a hacker.

I mean I was once helping a friend out. at work setting up a printer to our Network and the mapping them to it and they thought I was leet for that.

It is a mess considered word.

Now everyone that thought it would be fun, to jump on Scecialist, calm down. It is not that serious from what I heard him say, I might be wrong But, I heard him say that the term Hacker is GAY.

Then he said that those that aspire to that are stupid.

It is kinda true if you start this, just to become a Hacker. You will never finish you will, quit before you even anything useful. Trust me on this one.

Know at the same time if you do what a true Hacker does and want to explore computers because of curiosity then by all means go ahead. I would be glad to have you here, or anywhere at any time.

I am going to through in my usual statement.

Guess what guys we are all different and will not agree all the time but this is a community, and the debates are what make this place great. I mean look at my posts I used to post alot more I stopped to post to things that I think are important, FUNNY, or interesting.

Now with that guess what you are no longer Normal. You are above normal. You have transended the world that you were apart of. You were apart of a world of point and click. (God I hate that world)(I hate complacincy, and anything average). From the most Noobie to the most professional. We have all transended. We are all on a voyage. Along that voyage we will have many things that we face and many things that we, will learn.

That is the point right there to LEARN. That is why we are here. That is why, we started.

I don't care if your Uber, or a Neophyte you don't know everything and never will.

So chill out have a beer and calm down. Come on me of all people can say this, then maybe you should listen.

Your choice.

Now a couple thing before I stop typing, as for all the smartass's that thought they would question each other on knowledge there are those of you that I know more then and less then just like someone said everyone has something that they do really good. I think that you smartass's need to find your's. Or at least calm, down and come in the gray with the rest of use. ( I will explain that later to everyone that doesn't know. hint* Watch White Men can't jump)

Next you guys need to stop being to happy to debate I personally and the fore most person on those but sometimes just chill.

I am starting a new job, for myself so everyone knows and can get mad or not. I am starting taking yourself to serious, and the Calm down police. Basicly what these are, They are little things that I will do.

If I see a post where people are arguing over the word Hacker for instance I will go there.
Say a joke or something and leave.

Now with that in mind.

No joke this time, just a phraze.

Go get a beer.

Or some Jack and calm the hell down.

Sorry Ennis but someone had to do that they were getting mean.

Now you guys are more then welcome to Pm or Neg me to hell.
So you know I answer all Pm's with a day. So if you have something to say Pm me and I will reply.

Damn this thing is really long let me stop typing.

Oh yeah I need a life.

Hey specialist, dude take no offense but you need a beer.
That and man I know where your coming from sometimes.

There are three types of people when it comes to computers (ignoring those who don't use them at all, even at their jobs):

End users - these are your mass populous who use the machine in front of them because they have to. They may or may not like using them but because it's required for the job they're to do, they use it accordingly. Simple tasks such as basic manipulation through Windows, internet, email, and others are the general tasks accomplished. Most end users forget computers the minute they go home. I've also seen experts in their field completely clueless when it comes to basic computer management, example being programmers.

Power users - quite a few steps up the ladders than an end user, these are the ones who are pretty comfortable with the environment they're in and have surpassed basic computer management. Application management, registry manipulation, and other more advanced topics are what these like to work with as they aren't afraid of the machine before them. These are the ones to watch out for in work environment because more times than not, they believe themselves to be as high if not higher than the IT department. Now, I'm not saying that all IT are smart or good in their field because I've seen some pretty dumb IT "professionals" as well as some pretty dumb "power users". Definitely someone you can carry on a conversation about computers with.

"Hacker" - these are the ones that are all-encompassing in the computer field. Now, by definition, before Hollywood changed it all, a hacker was someone who was truly passionate about ANY topic/profession. A hacker of cars loved cars and all things about it. A hacker of cooking loved any and everything about culinary arts, etc etc. The list goes on. A hacker of computers loves everything about them and the pursuit of knowledge is an endless one. Nothing is too small or too big for someone who loves computers nor is there enough time to continue their education.

Of course, there's much more that can be said on all of these but to me, these are the three basic definitions. Notice, I didn't mention anything about being a white, grey, or black hat involving computers. I've seen "hackers" who've been nothing but nice and haven't ever caused problems and I've seen "script kiddies" who know nothing about anything bring down someone's PC by using someone else's program. A true hacker wouldn't destroy anything, ever. To get in, bypass, and leave a backdoor that allowed for later use and to never be seen or known was there, that's the epitomy of a hacker who wants to get into a system. Those that are script kiddies are worthless sacks of skin who aren't in it for the learning or bettering or self-education, they're in it for the wanton destruction and laughing factor, and these are the ones who should go to jail for the next ten years the next time they 'have some fun'.

The Specialist, it seems you need to just get away from computers altogether. Not even gaming, and definitely not as a job. You're jaded and biased and if you kept going, you'll turn out as a bitter blackhat, IMHO. Walk away now and do something else, like selling cars or be a master chef. Leave the continuing education for people like me. For I love to be around computers and do things with them. I'll never tire, I'll never quit, I'll never let anything stand in my way to be better with them.

We the willing, led by the unknowing, have been doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have done so much with so little for so long that we are now qualified to do just about anything with almost nothing.

First, to Ennis: Nice, I liked it. Easy to read, from the heart, keen insight to a majority of “neophytes”, uses positive reinforcement, etc. ( although you might have included something to the effect that one can learn even if they do not have up-to-date, state-of-the-art equipment. Just a thought. ) I am looking forward to your next installment.

Next, to |The|Specialist: Thank you. You spoke your mind. ( But who cares what you or I think anyway? )

... some people grow up surrounded by computers. They spend their youth living, breathing and not sleeping round computers.

How lucky you are to fit in this category. But, from your profile, your posts, and your tone, you are a punk kid. ( I don't kiss ass either; no way, no how, and certainly not yours! )

... Im not proud of the fact that the hours I've spent on computers which probably equal years... years that have been wasted... and in end the end I will probably spend the rest of my days working tech-support or auto repair then waste even more of my life on electronics. I don't feel smart, I don't feel like I've contributed anything, I don't feel important. I don't need a ****ing label to enjoy computers... I do what I want just because I feel like doing things.

Youth is wasted on the Young!!! ( who said that? George Bernard Shaw, wasn't it?) If you spent the rest of your days working tech-support, and you knew what you were talking about ( which is rare in that field), then you would contribute, and you would earn my respect and the respect of others, possibly ones who you care about their opinions. But would you be happy? Unless you grew up with a silver spoon in your mouth the best you can do is to be able to make a living at something you enjoy doing. That would be in fact an incredible feat! And if you enjoy it, you will work harder and thus be better at it ( gee, doesn't this go back to the original point of the thread when you think about it? )

As far as the term “hacker” goes, I do not consider myself a hacker by any means. My family and friends call me a geek, acquaintances call me a hacker because they do not know any better. I would like to elevate myself to a hacker ( in the sense this thread is presented, I do NOTHING I shouldn't ) but I do not have the time to devote to the learning. Point here is, the term is relative.

One last thing. Your posts did prompt me to fill in my blank profile, and much more importantly you apparently got others here to think. WOW! What a gift. And you said you don't feel like you've contributed anything.

" And maddest of all, to see life as it is and not as it should be" --Miguel Cervantes

I truly think that anyone's opinion, is like the age old saying.
Opinions are like *******s everybody's got one. So what you don't like, what Ennis, Specialist I, or for that matter anyone says. That is your Opinion.

(From this point on anyone referring to the word opinion, change the word to *******. I.e.
In my ******* I think that I will grow up to become President.) That should be kind of funny.

Oh well. I am just a geek with a big aptitude for learning.

I have said before as I will say in the future, I don't know everything. Probably never will, but I know what I know, I have a passion. As big as an undying fire. It will never go away. The love is there. Everyone had that or something kinda close to it at some point. Otherwise you would of left after the first time you got flamed.

Sorry for that if it was me! (>_<)

But in my ******* I think that we all are taking everything to serious.
Here I got a recomendation. Everybody should go to Val's Non-Sensical thread post something and smile.