You've been gone quite a while...I figured you took a trip to the South Pacific and hooked up with a native girl

We've been trying to get 2 options:1) SP keys (available in ABS or PBT)....these are available.2) Taller non-SP keys (in either ABS and PBT)....I had several sources that confirmed they could not do all the keys, was waiting for a couple more answers....then I had some serious life issues cropped up the 3rd week of April that brought almost everything to an absolute stop

Kinesis has a few sets they found of ABS BLACK with BLUE home row keys that are taller without labels (blank) for $40. If I could afford it, I would buy one set, but it's not a prudent purchase for me at this time. I'm in debt.

My bigger desire is to get keys in PBT and hopefully that are taller than the SP keys. But, if not available, I'll settle for the shorter SP keys made of PBT. The only drawback is that the key set pricing in ABS or PBT is very expensive unless you buy many sets.

I may be able to get involved again to try and source the taller keys (we know they are made in ABS) and maybe even PBT...our keyboards and fingers deserve it. But I don't know when I'll be able to do this, maybe towards the end of the year, so if someone wants to pick up where it's been left off....go for it.

You've been gone quite a while...I figured you took a trip to the South Pacific and hooked up with a native girl

We've been trying to get 2 options:1) SP keys (available in ABS or PBT)....these are available.2) Taller non-SP keys (in either ABS and PBT)....I had several sources that confirmed they could not do all the keys, was waiting for a couple more answers....then I had some serious life issues cropped up the 3rd week of April that brought almost everything to an absolute stop

Sorry to hear, man. I hope things are better :hug:

Quote from: input nirvana;610142

Kinesis has a few sets they found of ABS BLACK with BLUE home row keys that are taller without labels (blank) for $40. If I could afford it, I would buy one set, but it's not a prudent purchase for me at this time. I'm in debt.

My bigger desire is to get keys in PBT and hopefully that are taller than the SP keys. But, if not available, I'll settle for the shorter SP keys made of PBT. The only drawback is that the key set pricing in ABS or PBT is very expensive unless you buy many sets.

I may be able to get involved again to try and source the taller keys (we know they are made in ABS) and maybe even PBT...our keyboards and fingers deserve it. But I don't know when I'll be able to do this, maybe towards the end of the year, so if someone wants to pick up where it's been left off....go for it.

Quote from: boli;547827

But do you think Weyman from WASDkeyboards would even laser key caps we bought from somewhere else? Last I heard he wouldn't do it because of "could be lost during shipment" concerns. Also since he'll be offering PBT keys in a few months he might tell us to wait... (he has not replied to my last few mails so I'm not even trying to ask).

I see WASD is not planning PBT in the near future:

Quote from: wasdkeyboards;433197

Frequently requested, but not planned- PBT (currently unable to find a manufacturer with a reasonable price)

so maybe he would how be willing to order, say, 50 sets at $28.75 from SP, and then laser them? But I guess they all have to be the same color, then.

I'll try to get up to speed on this topic again. I can't believe this, but I've forgotten what happened and what the status was. I will do this soon.

I think I was unable to find all of the 'taller' keys in ABS. Kinesis buys them from a broker in Taiwan...not direct from a manufacturer.

I contacted 2 people on GH about 'taller' PBT, one can't supply all the keys, the other didn't follow up after a couple messages...my guess is they can't do it either.

Boli participated in group buy 4, which I've always been confused with...it's a combination of group buy 3 and 4....? Supposedly 7bit said the keys were going to be blank doubleshots....? I think Boli was going to verify at some point...but I don't think he has gotten them yet? That deal is a mystery to me.

BOTTOM LINE FOR BLANKS AT THIS TIME:-ABS short-available from SP-PBT short-available from SP-ABS tall-we know they are made, don't know who (a few sets are available from Kinesis for $40)-PBT tall-we don't know they are all made.-DOUBLESHOT ABS-allegedly available

The group buy 4 stuff wasn't shipped yet, but those blanks (1.25 unit wide key caps for the outer edges of the Kinesis Advantage) are very expensive because of the low volume: $4 for the number row and $3 for other rows, each! (so $26 for just 8 key caps)

BTW all of the group buy round 4 key caps are from SP, and SP doesn't make double shot blanks.

If I wanted a blank set I'd buy one of the few Kinesis set left (and recommend everyone who'd like blanks to get one while it lasts), can't beat the price and perfect fit.

Alas, I'm hooked to custom lasered key caps by now, so I'm waiting for PBT keys from WASD, whenever that may happen. In the mean time stuff like Diablo 3 and R/C helis keep spare time at a minimum.

Wanting Doubleshot blank keycaps is kind of a joke, as there is no practical difference to a normal blank keycap (except the underside has the potential to be a different colour) and it is considerably more expensive to produce them. As far as I know, they only exist on keyboards that had all doubleshot keys and one blank one (where it kind of makes sense) and possibly devlin.

So, I only want some doubleshot blanks for the extreme irony of it. In my opinion, it's not a big deal.

Specifically, all eight 1x1.25 side keys are R1 (instead of three R2 and one R4), the eight home keys are R2 (instead of sphericals), and -- the only actual issue -- the four modifiers are R4 instead of the fabled R5 which has recently turned out to not be a custom Kinesis creation, it's just that WASD doesn't have it.

Specifically, all eight 1x1.25 side keys are R1 (instead of three R2 and one R4), the eight home keys are R2 (instead of sphericals), and -- the only actual issue -- the four modifiers are R4 instead of the fabled R5 which has recently turned out to not be a custom Kinesis creation, it's just that WASD doesn't have it.

Correctamundo...it's been a complicated process so far.Eventually, we'll get another source for PBT or custom caps.

Sorry to bring this up again, but I don't think we have this info yet.

I bought a few DCS row 5 black key caps from Signature Plastics for my 3 Kinesis keyboards as well as the ErgoDox (which is being assembled by TheProfosist - I had opportunity to try out my friend's ErgoDox though).

SP still have some of those keys in their ABS DCS inventory (no PBT ones unfortunately), which you can order here if you are interested.

When mounted on the keyboard they are a bit less high than the originals, maybe half a millimeter. Their skirt is about a full millimeter shorter than the skirt of the original keys, but their skirt is flush with the stem - unlike the originals, where the stem is a little bit recessed.

At least the keys are a bit higher than the original second highest keys (orange in this picture), and as such they seem to work out OK. Not perfect, but the best replacement I've used so far.

Compared to the DSA keys that came with the ErgoDox they are a godsend. I hope the DCS keys for the ErgoDox will be better, but nobody could tell me what profiles they were, so we'll see...

Just a quick note....remember we had noted there were 2 types of Kinesis keycaps...the original white, doubleshot key caps that are shorter and with shorter skirts about flush with the stem. Then the newer, single shot that are taller and taller skirts with the stems recessed a bit. We also noted that the original doubleshots sat lower on the keyboard than the newer singleshots but maintained the same profiles. And, as a last item, the profiles stayed the same for all keycaps EXCEPT there was a minor difference with the 2 bottom rows of the key wells that later Kinesis used the same R4 key caps for both rows.

Does this assist with anything? I'm typing this from memory...

I really want to work on the Everything Kinesis article and adding the pics since they are so relevant...but I don't have access to it....

I'd love to see that article fixed up too. Any chance you could send me the pics in the mean time? It is such a good collection and I'd hate to see it disappear. I'd love to help you fix up the article too, if I can.

I'm going by the GH meetup tomorrow and will see Mkawa. Soarer send me several emails with all the pics, I'll start looking fir them this weekend, I hope they didn't get lost with my stalker problem last year, but I bet Soarer still has them in the event I come up dry. I have located a few more that are relevant as well. I'll see what I can do.

As you may remember, we wanted to clean out the crap (I didn't intend to have it grow to what it ultimately became), reconfigure everything in a wiki-type format for ease of use...but I don't know if that's still an option with whatever formats GH uses. Can you tell I haven't been around much?

One big issue was adding in the info, contacts, links for some of the alternate mainboards that had been cropping up, and some of the talented people I had found that did some amazing work.

Attention:After all my huffing and puffing about blank keycaps, preferably of PBT...I have found something today that will be far more awesome. I saw it at the GH meetup in Silicon Valley.

Option #1 I just saw this key in real life, and it looks at least 10 times better than the pic. The white is really white, and the 'geekhack' is a cool orange translucent polycarbonate. I want black keys with Klingon alphabet in either the same dark orange or red translucent polycarbonate. Will need to add backlighting to the Kinesis keyboard cherry switches. Beyond effing cool!

Option #2 The original idea to have the black key caps out of PBT, maybe with the 8 home row keys in red. I'm not nearly as excited about this anymore...

So, any news about Kinesis keycap replacements? I'm planning to order some for my other Kinesis from WASD as soon as I get my ergodox

Sorry for the necro... did you ever end up ordering from WASD again? I'm looking to get replacement caps for my Advantage and really like the look of yours in the pic. How did you order the thumb cluster? I emailed them the other day about replacement caps and they said they don't make a set for it.

Thanks! I'm in the process of ordering for my Ergodox, but I'll see how it goes

I took a screenshot from my order back then, so you can see how to map the Kinesis layout on a 104 or 105 key layout. The crossed out keys are only some I included for experimentation; they are not needed. They don't use the same online designer tool anymore, so you'll have to do it in Inkscape yourself, but that's probably for the better. And note that the four thumb modifiers are only Row 4 height since they don't carry the Row 5 (P1) keys, but this has not turned out to be a problem for me. I also just realized that the lowest row (with the arrow keys) is supposed to be P6 keys ("Row 0"), but using WASD's Row 1 for these has been no problem at all.

However, the above layout needs the following remarks:

The "Enter" text on the numpad 0 key should be rotated 90 degrees clockwise to make it read correctly when mounted vertically on the Kinesis (which you can do yourself in Inkscape). Also, you need two extra keys that won't fit on the first 104/105-key layout: (1) Another Row 1 1x2 with the centered text "Delete" rotated 90 deg. COUNTER-clockwise, and (2) another Numpad Enter with the centered text "Space" (like the other numpad enter: not rotated).

I asked nicely if I could get those two extra keys in return for all the unmarked keys that I didn't need anyway, and I could.

Just to echo m0j0 that I just got my kinesis and I am super excited to replace the keycaps with a set of blanks either all one color or in a rainbow. What is currently the best way to go for trying to do something like this? I have been reading through this post but unfortunately most of the pictures are dead, which makes it really hard to follow.

Do I have a buy a bunch of key cap packs from a place? Did anyone figure out the right keys for the thumb keys? What would the layout file for wasdkeyboards look like- or does anyone have a specific shopping list of parts? Thanks!

EDIT: From what I can tell, the cheapest option is to simply buy the blank keycap set from the kinesis website. I read that the cheapest kit to buy from WASD is the following, is that right? Has anyone bought that?Alternatively, am I understanding it right that I can buy just 2x of any 108 keyboard set and be okay? Like could I just buy 2x of this mass drop rainbow keycap set and be done at $60?https://www.massdrop.com/buy/npkc-rainbow-keycaps/talk

For the blanks I ordered (I think), one normal set, and then ordered single pieces for the missing parts; I'm still using the keys from my blanks purchase for the graphite as well.

Just look at what you're ordering and find something that fits you the best. I'm guessing the Ergodox sets will be the best + extra's. The 1.25x keys probably need to be ordered separately.I also see Signature Plastics / Pimp My Keyboard aren't selling the DSA blanks anymore..

I worked on this 5 years ago and gave up. I've been waiting years for someone to step up and compile a PBT or POM blank EXACT keycaps match for the Kinesis Advantage. I have the original ABS double shot and the current version ABS keycaps. The keyboard types better with the double shots and keyboards type better with PBT/POM keycaps. The keyboard DESERVES better keycaps.

Is this something we could send to Melissa at PMK? I know we'll all want different colour schemes, but surely we could compromise and find one scheme that would work. A blank set could be a good start.

I went somewhat quiet here and at Deskthority for a while, but I'm slowly ramping back up to gear. Kind of ran out of ergo boards to buy (that's not meant as a boast). I've found myself eyeing up typewriters, but having seen where that impulse has gone with keyboards, I'm content to just look for a while longer.

So still a bit confused as to the best way to replace keycaps. If I am interested in a color change, and I still want QWERTY legends, what will I get if I order the 104-set from WASD? Will the alphanumeric 1-width keys more or less be drop in replacements, if I want the legends to actually match? Or will there be a lot of keys that will be the wrong shape?

A look at the diagram that boli posted seems to show that vertically, the row numbers are swapped with WASD (number row is row 1 in the diagram, but WASD calls that row 4, for instance). It would seem that WASD's keys with legends from that set would not match the Kinesis at all?

Hi all, I'm in the process of working with Melissa at SP/PMK to configure a full PBT replacement. From skimming this thread though, it sounds like their key profiles do not match the current Kinesis profile. Is that the case? If so, what is different? Will the skirts just not go as low but the keys will ride at the same height? I want to know if I'm barking up the wrong tree in talking to SP.

Also, they still don't have tall keys so DCS R5s for the thumb modifiers will have to do. Has anyone tried these? Do they work ok?

Any updates here? I figured its best to keep this information all in one place. I have seen several posts around the internet where people are putting SA caps onto the Kinesis. There recently was a new high profile set called MT3 launched on Massdrop with available ergodox kits. The base kit has 8 r1 1.25 keys that could be used for the modifiers on a Kinesis. Any ideas about this? Is anyone using SA or MT3 caps on their Kinesis? I just hate the pad printed legends. I may end up buying the blank caps straight from the Kinesis website if there are no other solutions.

They sent me an extra KP0 and KPenter and a bunch of other keys I didn't end up needing. I've got almost all the keys covered but the tall keys, the square brackets and the tilde/|\ key on the lower left. Those I don't tend to use very often so I preferred to leave them properly legended. I'm quite happy w/ it.

Note the 3 and the 8 which should be right square bracket and KP8 respectively to have the proper profile.

They sent me an extra KP0 and KPenter and a bunch of other keys I didn't end up needing. I've got almost all the keys covered but the tall keys, the square brackets and the tilde/|\ key on the lower left. Those I don't tend to use very often so I preferred to leave them properly legended. I'm quite happy w/ it.

Note the 3 and the 8 which should be right square bracket and KP8 respectively to have the proper profile.