If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Lil update on Zion. Seems he'll be okay long term. Kind of a worry there. He'd still go high in the draft even if it was a fairly serious injury, but there's always a big chance of a changed game, especially with the lower body. Seeing that it's not the hugest injury, he'll be cool.

Watching Pelicans games is what Georges Bataille meant by limit experiences.

I never thought he'd get injured that way but a knee or foot injury is the biggest fear I have for a player like Zion. He's just so massive and uses so much athleticism that any injury that takes his athleticism is extremely worrisome.

I never thought he'd get injured that way but a knee or foot injury is the biggest fear I have for a player like Zion. He's just so massive and uses so much athleticism that any injury that takes his athleticism is extremely worrisome.

That's kind of my only real issue with him. Lower body injuries are so risky. If he breaks a finger, or something like that, there's relatively little I worry about there even if it's fairly long term injury. But injuries to legs and lower back are always such big risk factors for players like him.

That's kind of my only real issue with him. Lower body injuries are so risky. If he breaks a finger, or something like that, there's relatively little I worry about there even if it's fairly long term injury. But injuries to legs and lower back are always such big risk factors for players like him.

I'm just talking nonsense here and I totally understand if you tell me I'm just talking nonsense.

But does Zion have a totally different kind of athleticism than most other players?

Like, I see people comparing him to Lebron, and due to his size and his musculature and his strength and dunking ability, I see that. But he doesn't actually look much like Lebron. I feel like young Lebron looked a lot more fluid, had more fast-twitch explosion, and a lightness about his movement. With Zion, he moves more like a tank with jetpacks on.

I'm just talking nonsense here and I totally understand if you tell me I'm just talking nonsense.

But does Zion have a totally different kind of athleticism than most other players?

Like, I see people comparing him to Lebron, and due to his size and his musculature and his strength and dunking ability, I see that. But he doesn't actually look much like Lebron. I feel like young Lebron looked a lot more fluid, had more fast-twitch explosion, and a lightness about his movement. With Zion, he moves more like a tank with jetpacks on.

I'm just talking nonsense here and I totally understand if you tell me I'm just talking nonsense.

But does Zion have a totally different kind of athleticism than most other players?

Like, I see people comparing him to Lebron, and due to his size and his musculature and his strength and dunking ability, I see that. But he doesn't actually look much like Lebron. I feel like young Lebron looked a lot more fluid, had more fast-twitch explosion, and a lightness about his movement. With Zion, he moves more like a tank with jetpacks on.

The best comparison is Barkely. Not old Phoenix Barkley, Auburn and Philly Barkley. Look at some of his old clips from Auburn. He is a bit shorter but the athleticism for a "big" guy is strikingly similar. In fact, here you go.

The best comparison is Barkely. Not old Phoenix Barkley, Auburn and Philly Barkley. Look at some of his old clips from Auburn. He is a bit shorter but the athleticism for a "big" guy is strikingly similar. In fact, here you go.

Edit: Just as a side note, Zion is currently listed as 2 inches taller than Barkley was, and 24lbs heavier. So basically a stone more for every inch. Obviously by the end of his career, Barkley had put on a ton of weight and was probably more like 285lbs himself instead of the listed 251, but still. The weight issue comes back: everyone knows that Barkley had problems as he aged due to weight. That's a risk I'm willing to take though. Prime Barkley level ability in exchange for a 50/50 weight issue in a decade.

It does say a lot about Zion though when the two best physical comparisons that come up are Kemp and Barkley. Both incredibly talented players who were extremely good, but had relatively truncated careers due to serious conditioning, weight, etc, problems. Hopefully with todays trainers, conditioning staff, dieticians, etc, Zion won't fall prey to that.

Not to bring up Lebron again in case a certain someone comes in the thread to accuse me of having a crush on him or whatever, but a huge part of Lebron's success has been his (frankly almost paranoid) concern about his body. He puts so much time, effort, money, etc, into maintaining his physique and we saw what dividends that paid last playoffs. That a guy 15 years deep in his career, having been pretty much exclusively the guy during that entire time, including around a decade of carrying sub-par rosters, could still perform at that level, for such long minutes, is incredible. If Zion could even have 80% of that longevity, it would be amazing.

Oh man, that would be a disappointment. Not that Larry Johnson sucked, he didn't, he was very good, but imagine drafting a guy you've heard might be the next Lebron, or maybe Charles Barkley, and he ends up being Larry Johnson.

It would be that kind of lame disappointment where you're still getting something good so you're not even entitled to complain much.

Yeah, probably. I'm just thinking of Barkley and I'm getting images of the dude who was 23/11 for basically a decade, whereas like you said, Larry Johnson kinda had 2 great seasons (did you know he played 41 minutes a game in his second season? I'd forgotten that) and then fell off a cliff. Obviously not his fault, injuries are injuries, but I just have the Barkley that was averaging 24/12/4 at 31 in my head, while the automatic image of Larry Johnson is 9/5/2 at 31 and then leaving the league the next season.

Yeah, probably. I'm just thinking of Barkley and I'm getting images of the dude who was 23/11 for basically a decade, whereas like you said, Larry Johnson kinda had 2 great seasons (did you know he played 41 minutes a game in his second season? I'd forgotten that) and then fell off a cliff. Obviously not his fault, injuries are injuries, but I just have the Barkley that was averaging 24/12/4 at 31 in my head, while the automatic image of Larry Johnson is 9/5/2 at 31 and then leaving the league the next season.

I'm just going off of what you guys say since I haven't watched a minute of college ball.....but it seems like everyone is touting Zion's motor. Seems unlikely a guy with a high motor just mails it in with conditioning.

zion is so damn exciting to watch that whoever gets him will instantly be my second favorite team.

As for us, Im thinking the one *outside* shot we do have at Morant or Barrett is for the knicks to be slotted in to the 2 or 3 slot and for us to make the AD swap for that pick as the centerpiece of any deal. I'd actually rather have Ja or RJ than any celts deal(even if tatum is included) because we get more team control years

So I'll be rooting for the knicks to get a 2nd or 3rd pick. I think the big gaps are 1----------2/3------4

I'd rather have tatum(if the celts do include them in an offer) than the 4th pick as a centerpiece

Jesus, Larry Johnson, now that’s a name that I haven’t heard in quite some time. What an amazing and on point comparison. Grandmama was the man before injuries got him, but that guy was as mean a dunker as there ever was. I remember watching him, Zo, Mugsy, and Del Curry being amazing (but the Bulls).

If Zion could be the player LJ was that would be amazing, and he was a threat whenever he stepped in the court (so much power in a 6’6 -6’7 frame. That is who Zion should pattern his game after as that is who his game best reflects.

People say that he is Charles Barkley, but Charles Barkley was more smarts than power. I remember Barkley doing an interview with Danny Ainge (when Ainge was a commentator on TNT), and during the interview Ainge told Barkley “stand up. I want people to see how tall you are compared to me. You play power forward, and I played point guard. There isn’t a great height difference. So how do you play in the post with guys who are 4 - 7 inches taller than you?”

Barkley’s response was classic Sir Charles “Because I’m smarter than they are.” When people say a player had a high basketball IQ, Barkley had that IQ.

Zion is a high IQ guy, but in college basketball it’s hard to tell who has that high IQ, and who is just doing it on talent. Larry Johnson was smart, but he let his talent carry him most of the way. I want to see Zion at the next level before I say he can be Charles Barkley, for now Larry Johnson is a fine example.

I was thinking about the draft today and the question came up to me that I thought was interesting.

After Zion, what player has the most upside? I don't mean who will go 2nd. I mean throw risk out of the window and what player has the highest ceiling?

I just don't see it with Barrett. Maybe Morant. I've got a few ideas but I'm interested in what other people think.

The way I figure it is, we probably aren't going to be drafting super high in this draft so wherever we are it might be worth the risk to get the highest upside guy possible. So I'm looking at who people think those players are.

I was thinking about the draft today and the question came up to me that I thought was interesting.

After Zion, what player has the most upside? I don't mean who will go 2nd. I mean throw risk out of the window and what player has the highest ceiling?

I just don't see it with Barrett. Maybe Morant. I've got a few ideas but I'm interested in what other people think.

The way I figure it is, we probably aren't going to be drafting super high in this draft so wherever we are it might be worth the risk to get the highest upside guy possible. So I'm looking at who people think those players are.

I've watched the last 4 Gonzaga games.
Hachimura is very impressive. Big Body, good handle & a nice mid range game. Runs the court like a mad man.