walkman wrote:Yup, I get the "black ain't always white" bit i.e. things are not always as clear cut as some might think. But "without sure ain't within"?? Without what?

I assume it's just wordplay, ie "without" as the opposite of "within". I don't think there's a literal meaning hidden in there, but I might be wrong.

No one ever says "Robert Mueller - that guy just shoots from the hip!"
No one ever says "Robert Mueller - what an erratic fellow!"
That is a contained man! He's the human equivalent of those Japanese watermelons. Jon Lovett

walkman wrote:Yup, I get the "black ain't always white" bit i.e. things are not always as clear cut as some might think. But "without sure ain't within"?? Without what?

I assume it's just wordplay, ie "without" as the opposite of "within". I don't think there's a literal meaning hidden in there, but I might be wrong.

It's also akin to a rhetorical device called "chiasmus" which for several years I mistakenly conflated with floating opposites, through watching The West Wing a bit too much

No one ever says "Robert Mueller - that guy just shoots from the hip!"
No one ever says "Robert Mueller - what an erratic fellow!"
That is a contained man! He's the human equivalent of those Japanese watermelons. Jon Lovett

I'd never even noticed this lyric before (which, you'd think after thirty years of listening, I would've), but the second half seems clearer to me than the first. "Without sure ain't within" meaning (I think) that the external world of 'objective' reality ("without") and the internal world of perception ("within") aren't the same. Seems pretty straightforward, no?

A saint wrote:I'd never even noticed this lyric before (which, you'd think after thirty years of listening, I would've), but the second half seems clearer to me than the first. "Without sure ain't within" meaning (I think) that the external world of 'objective' reality ("without") and the internal world of perception ("within") aren't the same. Seems pretty straightforward, no?

now, that makes sense. never read it that way before. finally, seems obvious. thanks.

A saint wrote:It really is a great lyric. And --as with all those early compositions-- I'm left wondering where they might have stolen it from

Do folks really think such Spacemen 3 lyrics are especially great, in comparison with the more recent output from Jason and Pete?

Sometimes they have an unwitting maturity, more often they seem raw and less refined, in comparison.

Personally I think most artists end up retreading older fertile ground. Yet they do so with a degree of experience, that allows them to better pick, choose and articulate.

For example, with the exception of a few embarrassing moments ("Jesus will you be my radio/cipher/substitute/placeholder/platitude") I think the last Spiritualized album was a lyrical triumph.

Hey Jane was not just an awesome song, but it inspired the best video since Stop Your Crying!

Whilst the themes on SHSL were familiar - sometimes a little too familiar - I loved the mature take on the well trodden subject matter.

For example, So Long... was such an amazing way to take the themes and tropes from Jason's whole career, distilling them down into a joyful yet timely reminder that the Spaceman / Spiritualized canon is obviously closer to the end than the beginning.

Similarly if you look at the lyrics on LICD, they tell the listener as much about where he's come from, as they show where he will be going.

It's not that I've got a problem with early lyrics from the Spacemen 3 days. I just think inevitably great artists hone and refine their craft, over time.

I'm not intending to devalue the earlier output, I just think it has a context.

No one ever says "Robert Mueller - that guy just shoots from the hip!"
No one ever says "Robert Mueller - what an erratic fellow!"
That is a contained man! He's the human equivalent of those Japanese watermelons. Jon Lovett