Johnny Rockets wrote:You are not investigating. Your focused on a negative perspective, that being C.C. is broken because there are less members. That is an assumption. You are not looking for causes, you are finding exaggerated fault where fault may not lie, or at least not be the whole of the problem, or even a major portion of it.

You won't answer my questions, and insist Dukasaurs are not your responsibility to answer so keep beating that drum, Funky. So far inciting a Mod rebellion is unattainable, and looking at the disputed issues carefully isn't on the table either for you, so why not brainstorm up a different direction?

Take the points of division on the topics of scoreboards, freestyle and amount of available maps. Perhaps forming round table commitees? Referendums? Polls? Can you think of any other courses of action to make what we have better?

Just screaming that it's broke from the hill tops without EXAMINING the guts of the problem is .....well, peasant minded. ( Oh GREAT AND HOLY LORD LACK! WHEN WILL YOUR MACHINATIONS FREE US FROM OUR SELF FERMENTING DISCONTENT??? WHEN WILL YOU DELIVER US FROM DECLINE? WHEN WILL OUR SENSE ON INSTANT GRATIFICATION BE APPEASED??)

Great sites are made by the actions of the individual. Do you really think Landgrab is better?What changes do you want?

Will you answer anything? Or will you just troll out another reply?

J

I think you may have jumped a few guns regarding my actions/motives. If you investigate my activities on the forums you will find that I have examined the guts of the problem in the appropriate threads and my recent submissions have been aimed at finding a solution. I have discussed why my choosing specific demands to a "strike" would be ineffectual but you prefer to ignore this fact. You are acting as though I am suggesting we kill CC, that's exactly what I don't want to happen. We can have the age old debate "can you troll a troll?" some other time. I would prefer we stick to the facts.You or I cannot determine whether any of the questions Dukasaur brought up are going to affect the site one way or another because we are not privy to the actual numbers regarding what keeps people here and what does not. I am saying put someone in charge who will find out what is the cause and fix it accordingly.

I see your point. My position is is that you need to identify if the problem lies within the site, or not. Problems within require adjustment while problems without require development.The data required is serious feedback from the membership ( ..and not the minority that post)via an emailed questionnaire with an incentive provided to participate. This of course needs to implemented by the site admin, but we as members could contribute to the framework of the questionnaire/survey to ensure the proper questions are being asked.

I don't believe there is any withheld data that would be useful other than premium membership purchases and renewals, but considering that pegs down an accurate picture of site revenue I doubt that would be released. This is unfortunate, as it would point out IF there is a true problem here. I have heard of complaints that the forum is getting pretty stale, but for those of us that come for the game play this is not a huge concern. I'm not having any issues with filling or finding games, so in truth the overall question is: Is this decline in numbers impacting the enjoyment of the site.

A larger community does not always translate into a better community. If we had more numbers before the demise of flame wars for example, the absence of a few scores of juvenile vulgarity posters might improve the overall image of the site. This may draw more of the Christian crowd which seems to have a significant population here, or ease parents minds when they have their 12 and 13 year old's playing along side them. This could be beneficial depending on which group has a higher % history of premium purchases. Just an example.

In short, it's data that you need to confirm that a problem even exists. Due to the "Lack" of concern from the top, it is a solid position to debate that there may not be a crisis of decline.

You need to ponder this: Who would the owner/developer has put in 100's of hours programming in a dozen new features and upgrades over the last 2 years, ( one every 60 days...) but has not bothered to invest any time or resources into any marketing, advertisement, cross promotions, or increased referral incentives?Answer: He is either very poor at managing his business priorities, or the perceived problem is not as large as you may think, if it's a problem at all.

Now considering Lack built this place from the ground and grew it successfully to the point of becoming independently employed, I'd lean towards assuming that the decline is either a non issue, or one that is being dealt with in a long term plan.

The Big Frustration:

I think Lack falls short in addressing the memberships concerns on issues like this. Getting some notion of reassurance and direction would help dispel the negativity that abounds when it's perceived we are on a rudderless ship.

JR, lack has stopped giving fucks about this site a long time ago. There is no "if he wants to do that" or "if he doesn't do this" anymore. It's done! over! terminado!!All that is left to do is to enjoy the fact that a poorly run website gets what it deserves. Lack doesn't deserve to keep members the way he's been handling his website.

AoG for President of the World!!I promise he will put George W. Bush to shame!

Johnny Rockets wrote:I see your point. My position is is that you need to identify if the problem lies within the site, or not. Problems within require adjustment while problems without require development.The data required is serious feedback from the membership ( ..and not the minority that post)via an emailed questionnaire with an incentive provided to participate. This of course needs to implemented by the site admin, but we as members could contribute to the framework of the questionnaire/survey to ensure the proper questions are being asked.

I don't believe there is any withheld data that would be useful other than premium membership purchases and renewals, but considering that pegs down an accurate picture of site revenue I doubt that would be released. This is unfortunate, as it would point out IF there is a true problem here. I have heard of complaints that the forum is getting pretty stale, but for those of us that come for the game play this is not a huge concern. I'm not having any issues with filling or finding games, so in truth the overall question is: Is this decline in numbers impacting the enjoyment of the site.

A larger community does not always translate into a better community. If we had more numbers before the demise of flame wars for example, the absence of a few scores of juvenile vulgarity posters might improve the overall image of the site. This may draw more of the Christian crowd which seems to have a significant population here, or ease parents minds when they have their 12 and 13 year old's playing along side them. This could be beneficial depending on which group has a higher % history of premium purchases. Just an example.

In short, it's data that you need to confirm that a problem even exists. Due to the "Lack" of concern from the top, it is a solid position to debate that there may not be a crisis of decline.You need to ponder this: Who would the owner/developer has put in 100's of hours programming in a dozen new features and upgrades over the last 2 years, ( one every 60 days...) but has not bothered to invest any time or resources into any marketing, advertisement, cross promotions, or increased referral incentives?Answer: He is either very poor at managing his business priorities, or the perceived problem is not as large as you may think, if it's a problem at all.

I had a feeling we could see eye to eye with a little softening from both sides. I completely agree that some method of data collection would be immensely useful. The enactment of such a thing would be an affirmation of your theory and I would respectfully retract my suspicions/distrust of the owner if this came to pass. I did, believe it or not, consider the prospect of surveys that would pop up from time to time to paying(and non-paying) members to gain feedback. I would gladly fill one of these out once a month and I don't think most serious members would object. It's a good cause and it has the dual purpose of suggesting that someone cares what we all think and is minding the ship. Just good business, right?

I agree that lack of freshness on the forums is not necessarily a cause for decline but I'm suggesting it could be a symptom that warrants investigation in other areas. I am the last person to support flame wars and I don't even count them as forum activity, much less boosting overall membership/site enjoyment.

Johnny Rockets wrote:The Big Frustration:

I think Lack falls short in addressing the memberships concerns on issues like this. Getting some notion of reassurance and direction would help dispel the negativity that abounds when it's perceived we are on a rudderless ship.

This is all I am really addressing. If the site is going to be fine and issues are being dealt with accordingly to ensure, within reason, that CC's future is secure then a simple memo from time to time would be nice.

Gillipig wrote:JR, lack has stopped giving fucks about this site a long time ago. There is no "if he wants to do that" or "if he doesn't do this" anymore. It's done! over! terminado!!All that is left to do is to enjoy the fact that a poorly run website gets what it deserves. Lack doesn't deserve to keep members the way he's been handling his website.

Owners that don't give a f*ck, don't add improvements to the site every 60 days, so I don't buy your statement.If anything, this seems to be a breakdown of communication, with some insufficient hiring practices.

Give me 5 quick bullet points on how the site is poorly run, and your top three "This Must Change" issues.I'd like to see a little more than a fountain of negativity.

Gillipig wrote:JR, lack has stopped giving fucks about this site a long time ago. There is no "if he wants to do that" or "if he doesn't do this" anymore. It's done! over! terminado!!All that is left to do is to enjoy the fact that a poorly run website gets what it deserves. Lack doesn't deserve to keep members the way he's been handling his website.

Owners that don't give a f*ck, don't add improvements to the site every 60 days, so I don't buy your statement.If anything, this seems to be a breakdown of communication, with some insufficient hiring practices.

Give me 5 quick bullet points on how the site is poorly run, and your top three "This Must Change" issues.I'd like to see a little more than a fountain of negativity.

JRock

I will give you a "top ten" of his flaws/misstakes instead:

1: Close to no support whatsoever to the foundry2: Not listening to the opinions of the community 3: Not listening to his volounteer mods (as confirmed by many many current and past mods)4: Not posting and being active on the site5: Not giving us insight to his next move/plan.6: Inability to realize that his site has more problems than just "fewer signups"7: Not utilizing the potential of his member (plenty of scripts that could've been site implemented but was left to die)8: Lack of updates (yes he's been horrible at making updates for the majority of the past three years)9: Poor at prioritizing which updates to make (The majority of the updates he's made the last three years have been useless, he has subsequentially ignored the important ones)10: Making promizes he doesn't keep (oh how I hate this flaw in him! How many times haven't we heard he's working on hiring a programmer?)

AoG for President of the World!!I promise he will put George W. Bush to shame!

I realise this has been going on for 36 pages, and no-one is really going to be paying attention any more, but you can't get any interesting speed games up at all now. Which is really my only reason for paying premium. If that doesn't get better, I won't renew, and I'm sure that must be true for a lot of people.

You even have to queue to get an assdoodle game up, and they used to be going at 1 every couple of minutes.

The amazing 8 player classic escalating games that used to be up with ljex, prankcall, Buizerd, Becky, Meda and all those guys got downgraded to the less fun but still pretty good 6 player doodle esc. Now those won't even fill. Two player games get old pretty quickly, even on different maps and who wants to grind out points on Hive or Schloss or even Stalingrad day in day out to keep the rank up. Seems like the only thing going on at all is clan-world, which just never interested me that much.

Tenebrus wrote:I realise this has been going on for 36 pages, and no-one is really going to be paying attention any more, but you can't get any interesting speed games up at all now. Which is really my only reason for paying premium. If that doesn't get better, I won't renew, and I'm sure that must be true for a lot of people.

You even have to queue to get an assdoodle game up, and they used to be going at 1 every couple of minutes.

The amazing 8 player classic escalating games that used to be up with ljex, prankcall, Buizerd, Becky, Meda and all those guys got downgraded to the less fun but still pretty good 6 player doodle esc. Now those won't even fill. Two player games get old pretty quickly, even on different maps and who wants to grind out points on Hive or Schloss or even Stalingrad day in day out to keep the rank up. Seems like the only thing going on at all is clan-world, which just never interested me that much.

Shame. I hope it picks up, or I'm out.

Are you crazy? Of course nothing is wrong, just bury your head in the sand and it will all be ok. Keep buying premium, this is just a phase.

1: Close to no support whatsoever to the foundry2: Not listening to the opinions of the community 3: Not listening to his volounteer mods (as confirmed by many many current and past mods)4: Not posting and being active on the site5: Not giving us insight to his next move/plan.6: Inability to realize that his site has more problems than just "fewer signups"7: Not utilizing the potential of his member (plenty of scripts that could've been site implemented but was left to die)8: Lack of updates (yes he's been horrible at making updates for the majority of the past three years)9: Poor at prioritizing which updates to make (The majority of the updates he's made the last three years have been useless, he has subsequentially ignored the important ones)10: Making promizes he doesn't keep (oh how I hate this flaw in him! How many times haven't we heard he's working on hiring a programmer?)[/quote]

Gullip , your hormons are boiling( out of the 10 points, how many are constructive, and how many are hormon related ? just want to know )

I used to roll the daizzFeel the fear in my enemy´s eyesListen as the crowd would sing:Long live the Army Of Kings !

When there's fluctuation in the number of players, I would like to see how many of those players who joined/quit are new players and how many of those players are seasoned CCers. But I'm not bothered to count sorry