Rosetta: Before we get going with our interview this morning, this is Steve Rawls, the
marmalade recipes, for goodness sakes, I’m surprised we don’t have more of a response
because usually I can’t run off enough copies. I guess no one likes to make jelly; they
don’t like that sticky business. Personally, the little ol’ jelly maker here thinks it’s neat,
but a woman called in the other day to tell us how marmalade came about. Do you know
how marmalade originated, Steve?
Steve: Yeah, from an orange peel, right?
Rosetta: Well, that’s how orange marmalade, but no the original marmalade. Do you
know where real marmalade, why we have marmalade today?
Steve: I’m afraid not.
Rosetta: I thought you’d never say no because you knew I was going to fall on the floor!
Well, it came from Mary Queen of Scots, and the problem was she was really, really sick
and in olden days they called being sick “malody.”
Ron: Malady.
Rosetta: Malady. It was a malady when you were sick?
Ron: Right.
Rosetta: Okay. Well, she was very sick and she couldn’t eat anything. And they finally,
this woman in the kingdom, cooked up something.
Ron: A subject.
Rosetta: No. She cooked up a sticky substance. And she served it to Mary Queen of
Scots and she ate it and it was the only thing that she had eaten for a long time. So they
named it, they took the “mar” from Mary and the “malady” and they called it, it’s a
contraction, and they called it marmalade.
Ron: Hm.
Rosetta: Now that’s a true story, that’s how we have marmalade, and if you want the
recipe, the orange marmalade with the Gleason style, send me a self-addressed envelope.
By the way I have extra recipes from the meat pasty, the Cousin Jack meat pasties, and
cheesecake.
2
Ron: May I just pick one up without sending an envelope?
Rosetta: You may, Ron, because…well I don’t know if I’ll let you do that or not. I guess
so.
Steve: Make him pay for it.
Rosetta: I should make him pay.
Ron: I’ll pay eight cents anyway.
Rosetta: If any of you would like to come out to the station and pick up the recipes rather
than mailing them in, please feel free because they’re in my desk drawer if I’m not here.
There’s a whole staff out here that does nothing but give out Gleason recipes. (Laughter)
No if you want to come up and get them you can.
Rosetta: Now Steve, we’ve told them that we’re going to discuss legislation and
broadcasting that affects everyone and what does that mean?
Steve: That, well, let me start with the background of the whole thing. I don’t know if
the people out there know that broadcasters have to have a license. Now a lot of business
men have to have a license. You can’t be a doctor without a license; you can’t run a
business without a license. You can’t drive a taxi, for instance, without a license. So
most of us have to have a license for another reason; to drive a car. You have to have a
license in your pocket, a license on the car. You have to have two licenses and you have
to have a license to almost live anymore, or so it seems like. And so we broadcasters
have to have a license to operate. Without it we are forbidden to operate and, of course,
now we have a problem in the broadcast industry. I think I can best illustrate it in the
following manner. Most of us have another kind of a license. It’s called a marriage
license, but let’s just suppose that this license was only good for three years and at the
end of that time you had to go before a seven member marriage commission and prove to
their satisfaction that you had been a superior husband and wife. But this is the kicker.
Anybody that wanted to could come in and file an application against that, against your
wife or your husband.
Rosetta: Oh, so if somebody had designs on my husband then they could come in and …
Steve: Sure, they could just come in and file an application on him and if he could
convince the marriage commission that he could do a better job than your husband in the
next three years, then he’d get her. That might be all right in some cases, but it’d sure
throw a monkey wrench in the social system here. And that’s what we’re up against in
broadcasting. Every three years, every broadcaster in the United States has to go before
the Federal Communications Commission and as the law is now interpreted is if someone
can out-promise us, they may get our license. Now that’s rough if you think about it for
awhile. If you’ve been in the business for 15 or 20 years, you’ve got a building to pay for
and you have equipment to pay for, it can be rough. It can be rough on your employees.
3
They may lose their jobs, if somebody can come in and grab your license. Now they
have a job, now they don’t. In fact, with that kind of a threat hanging over you every
three years, it’s difficult to get financing for radio station equipment, it’s difficult to hire
employees and give them any assurance of a stable future, or anything else. And so for
those of you out there who are operating a business, say that three years, or two years, or
even a year from now, the government came in and said, that’s it, you’re out, get out of
business. Okay, now the reason I’m worrying you out there with my problem is that I
believe it’s your problem, too. Both the radio and television are an important part of our
lives. They’re a community resource in this town, as such, and if they’re changed for the
worse everybody out there will suffer. Broadcasting means a lot to us. It means college
and pro football, basketball and baseball, Super Bowl, World Series, the Olympics. You
have a wake up service courtesy of your clock radio, weather reports, snow warnings,
driving conditions, even the school lunch menu that Ron gives every morning.
Ron: He sometimes gets us in trouble with that.
Steve: Yeah, well still, still, it’s a service. And you get music, of course. You get news.
As a matter of fact broadcasting is a principle source of news for most people, especially
in this town when you have a late afternoon newspaper. People have to depend on radio
for news until the paper comes out. And you get documentaries. Of course you have
interview shows like Scooter, editorials, you get coverage on political conventions,
election returns and inauguration, trips to the moon, and of course, entertainment. And
through broadcasting we get to know not only the President but the mayor and Chief of
Police and school board. As a matter of fact it’s a vehicle that affects our daily lives
every time we turn around. Well, I’ll stop there. I’m just trying to remind us all of the
importance of broadcasting in our daily lives. And just like electricity or water, you
don’t miss it until you don’t have it. Every time that you plug that little button, service is
always there with the exception of a mechanical breakdown, it’s there 365 days a year
without a break. Okay, let’s broadcast programming. It has a lot in common with
another great free enterprise here in the United States and that’s the department store.
Take Sears and Roebuck, for instance. They carry a tremendous variety of merchandise.
They carry school clothes for the kids, they carry fur coats for Mom, they carry hunting
clothes for Dad, tricycles, bicycles, appliances, and every other kind of a thing. And they
regularly bring in new ideas like the new trash compactor and they advertise these things
and phase out old products. Broadcast programming is a lot like that. We put all kinds of
programs for all kinds of people. We have programs for kids, teenagers, dad, mom,
farmers, matter of fact, the whole family. We try out new things and it’s aggravating to
the public sometimes.
Rosetta: They get upset with some of our commercials.
Steve: Well, it’s not the commercials but the programming that we air.
Rosetta: Oh, yeah. They get upset with that.
4
Steve: You know, we try new things and phase out old things. And that’s what the
people’s preferences determine what we put on the air.
Rosetta: I think that’s one point we should probably establish, Steve. Do we pay
attention to people when they complain or compliment us?
Steve: That’s the only way that we have of recog…, of adjusting our broadcast
programming is from letters, phone calls. I’ve been trying, I’ve been scratching my head
for months trying to figure out a simple things like the proper music format in a two
station market. And there’s so many people out there that, say for instance, they like
country mus.., country western music. You hear from them, but you never hear from the
majority of the people it seems.
Rosetta: Is this, you mean, when we’re talking about programming though, music,
you’re hearing the majority of people in this area are letting you know they like country
western music?
Steve: No, no. I didn’t say that.
Rosetta: Oh, you didn’t.
Steve: No. I said the only ones that you hear from are a few that like, I’m going to have
to find out someway what the majority of the people here in Helena area like. Okay.
There are 7,000 commercial radio stations in the United States and they have a
tremendous variety of everything from music, comedy, drama, news, national news. For
instance, we carry NBC for NBC emphasis, public programming, public information.
We have something for everyone. You get more program choices in the United States
than in any other country in the world and that’s why our system is everyone’s system.
There are 350 million radios. Did you know there are more radios in the United States
than there are bathrooms? Did you know that?
Rosetta: Well, jeepers, that’s a very important statement.
Steve: How can you answer that one?
Rosetta: I don’t know. We have a call.
Ron: Yes, we have a call with a question for you. Go ahead please.
Caller: Yeah. I’ve got two questions actually. I wondered what the percentage of
stations that had actually lost their licenses because of this licensing regulation and then
the other question I wanted to know is whether he thought TV or radio programming was
better or worse because of FCC regulations or whether he thought it really made any
difference?
Ron: Hm. Thank you.
5
Steve: Okay, in answer to the first question, there have been approximately 200 radio
and television stations that have been filed against by different groups. And in answer to
the other question, the FCC does not determine our program content as such. They tell us
what we cannot do. We cannot go into broadcast programming that has to do with off
color things. That’s the only guideline that they set.
Rosetta: Uh, someone didn’t want to come on the air with that.
Ron: They just wanted to say they like the Scooter program.
Steve: Thank you.
Rosetta: Yeah. Thank you. We like to hear that. Now, please, as long as the boss is here
all 5,000 of you call right now and say…
Ron: You think programming is better or worse because of the FCC control?
Rosetta: Well, that’s just what the lady asked.
Ron: Right.
Steve: Yeah, that just what…. I don’t know, Ron, whether it’s better or worse. They
don’t really control us that much as to our programming.
Ron: TV they do since they came in with that ruling on prime time.
Steve: Oh, in television, I know that in television news casting that the local stations are
responsible for what the network newscasters say, that’s true. And their licenses are held
in jeopardy that way.
Rosetta: I will remind everyone that our guest this morning is Steve Rawls who is
manager of KBLL Radio.
Steve: I don’t really know anything about TV except how to turn it on.
Rosetta: All right.
Steve: Or off.
Rosetta: This is another call.
Ron: Go ahead please.
Caller: Ron, as long as we’re talking about the program, on Sunday morning, really from
7 to 8, the music is horrible. It’s a continuation of the Shindig and all that sort of thing,
6
the type of music. I was wondering if we couldn’t have either if not completely sacred
music, semi-classical or something to set the mood for the day. Some of the songs are
terrible, some of the music is just awful. It’s rock and roll and it’s banging away and it’s
just awful. I have called two or three times but the people who are on at that time don’t
seem to know, it’s already set up.
Ron: Uh-huh. Okay. Thank you.
Steve: Okay. In response to that lady’s question, the only way we can clear up anything
out there that you don’t like as far as music or programming of any kind, calls really
don’t accomplish that much. What we need is letters. We need letters from everyone and
if you’ll just address them to the manager of KBLL radio we’ll do something about it if
there’s … of course, that’s what we’re trying to get into here. We’re trying to serve
everyone, not just a few. So we need your letters.
Rosetta: We have another call coming, but I would like to tell you about what’s
happening at the Needle Nook. Classes are being offered in crochet, knitting and crewel.
The Needle Nook is located at the corner of 16th and Ewing. You can call 443-3837 for
information. Lisa has some good buys on stitchery, she’s making room for new things
that are coming in. The Lowe’s Homes knit and crochet patterns are being discontinued
and their, she does have some things on special this week, so stop in at the Needle Nook.
Remember where it’s located and that’s 16th and Ewing at Crane’s Fabric Specialty,
where stitchery is an art.
Ron: We have another call, go ahead please.
Caller: Yes, I have one comment which wasn’t really what I called about, but because I
heard him make a statement about TV and I guess he’s right, he doesn’t know about TV,
I think he’s mistaken on this thing about local stations being responsible for what’s on the
national news. That was what this I think fellow called Whitehead came up with the idea
of doing it this way with the idea of trying to get a bill through Congress and everybody
raised a big fuss about it.
Ron: Right.
Caller: And nothing’s been done about it yet, but it’s got everybody in kind of a tizzy
you know. What was really going to happen to it? But this thing I called about was on
these types of things where you have announcements that could be, that are controversial,
say advertisements like the old cigarette type of advertising type of thing, you know?
Ron: Right.
Caller: Does the station wait until you go through, people go through a whole formal
procedure to try to present another side or is the station willing to cooperate? Now I’ll be
specific. There have been ads by the utility company in regard to the need for more
energy and how much more energy, and there have been ads in regard to the amount of
7
reclamation they have done in Eastern Montana and I have seen pictures of the
reclamation other than that being shown on TV and talked about on radio.
Ron: Right.
Caller: And I have read various studies on energy that refutes their advertisements. Now
I’ve been told, I don’t know much about it, I’ve been told that there’s some sort of whole
long process that we have to sit down and listen to the radio station, to monitor the TV
station for at least a full day or maybe a full week, you know, for the whole time that
their on the air and get a record of how many times this is on before we can do anything
legally. Will the station require this of us, or would they be willing listen if some of us
came in and said we’ve heard enough of these things to know what’s going on and we
think it’s controversial and we’d like to present the other viewpoint of the, you know, the
public service like this, no cigarette ads type of thing. Thanks.
Ron: We’ll find out for you. Thank you.
Steve: Okay. Our logs are open to the public, as far as that goes. Anyone that wants to
find out how many times a commercial run, all they have to do is come in and ask to see
a log for a particular day. And that’s something in the broadcast industry that makes me,
that really makes me mad, you know. We cannot run cigarette advertising; we cannot run
alcoholic beverage advertising. And now they’re after us on this Montana Power thing. I
don’t know. Maybe it shows the power of broadcasting, I don’t know. Now you can see
cigarette ads in news, in newspapers, on billboards, in magazines. You can see whiskey
ads pretty much anywhere, but you can’t hear them on radio or television. And that’s
part of the problem. If this thing keeps going we’re going to have federal control of radio
stations.
Rosetta: Well, I think you might want to clear that up. It doesn’t make us mad because
we are advocating this way of life or these things in Montana, it’s because it’s a source of
revenue other areas are entitled to and broadcasters are not.
Steve: The American Broadcast System is the only system in the world that’s free, it’s
free in that area. American Broadcast Service is provided by and supported by
advertising monies.
Ron: What about her question in answering these advertisements? If they have an
adverse idea on them?
Steve: I, I, did she, I didn’t understand, Ron, did she, does she just want to know how
many times a commercial ran, or?
Ron: No, she wonders if they have a different view than the ad that’s running, for
instance on reclamation, can they come up and air their view on the radio or something.
Rosetta: People want equal time.
8
Steve: They want equal time to a paid commercial advertisement? No, they cannot. The
people at Montana Power Company, for instance, that are airing their views, are paying
for that commercial time on radio or television, or wherever, newspapers, billboards,
wherever. They are paying for that space.
Rosetta: But if someone wishes to pay and buy as much time they can.
Steve: Certainly they can.
Ron: Okay, we have another caller. (Commercial has been edited out.)
Ron: We have another caller, go ahead please.
Caller: This is a little bit off the subject, but in regard to what that woman just said I
understand people living around that area in Colstrip a square mile of it would hardly
support even a jack rabbit and any reclamation would be better than it is now.
Ron: Okay. Thank you.
Rosetta: Ron, we’re getting, there’s some things that remain to be said as far a
broadcasting and licensing that the public should know about so right now let’s hold the
calls for a little while so we can get through with this and then we’ll entitle you to call
again.
Steve: Okay I’ll go into this, yeah we are getting away from what I came in here to say.
And the reason that I’m here is that we all have a lot to lose if this free broadcast system
of ours goes down the drain. Now overseas it’s governmental controlled and people
don’t believe the news reports because they know whatever comes over the air is what
the government wants this to hear and that’s what we don’t want. And here’s the
background on this license renewal thing. Since 1951 the Federal Communications
Commission had a policy that the past performance of a broadcaster was the best
indicator of his future performance. And each three years the FCC renewed the license of
good performers. In 1969 however, the FCC took away a TV station’s license in Boston
and give them to a competitive, competing applicant. Okay. They tried to get legislation
in at that time and it failed. And then in 1969 they reverted back to the proven
performance procedure instead of anyone coming in wanting to promise anything he
thought he could do better they reverted back to the original thing of proven performance.
But we have to have some kind of legislation in there that assure us in the broadcast
business we’re going to be able to stay in business. We either need longer license periods
or we have to know our, the things that we’ve done in the past will weigh heavily on
license renewal proceedings.
Rosetta: So what does the average person do? I mean if they’re concerned now, what
can they do to assist?
9
Steve: The only thing that you can do to keep our free advertise, or free broadcast system
in effect the way that it is now is to write letters to your senator or congressman
requesting that they do this. See what happens is that special interest groups have been,
have been filing against broadcast licenses. Special interest groups and other people that
know nothing about the business and that’s bad because…
Rosetta: Why are they doing this, I mean what’s their intent in doing this?
Steve: I think their intent basically is good. They believe that what they are doing is for
the public good. However, they are a small group and the way that they’re going about it
is wrong. They’re telling the FCC or they’re telling the United States, really the United
States broadcasting system, that they’re going to revamp the whole broadcast
programming because they believe this is what should be aired, this is the type of
programming they believe should be aired, not what the public believes. So the only way
we can keep our present broadcast system is for the public to get in back of it and support
it and the only way you can do that is with letters to your legis…, your congressman and
representatives from the state of Montana. Let them know how you feel about this.
Ron: This is KBLL Radio, Helena, Montana.
Rosetta: Tell them why you do that all the time, Ron.
Ron: Because of the FCC.
Rosetta: (Laughter.) Now you know why he’s done that every single morning.
Steve: The FCC, I believe that the FCC has to control broadcast stations. They, there is
a certain amount of control that has to be initiated. There has to be some kind of
legislation on, and there is, on who can broadcast over what frequency. Back in the ‘20s
it was chaos. People came and went on the air whenever they felt like it, broadcasting on
similar channels and it was really bad there. And I don’t believe that the Federal
Communications Commissions, what, control, should be lessened at all, that’s not the
whole point. The whole point here is that a broadcaster’s performance, if he has done a
good job for the community in the past, should weigh heavily in his favor at license
renewal time, because if it doesn’t, we’re going to have a Big Brother situation in the
United States. We’ll either have radio stations in the broadcast industry controlled by
special interest groups or the government, and that’s what we don’t want and I’m sure the
people out there don’t want it either.
Rosetta: And it does exist in other countries.
Steve: It does exist in other countries. Most foreign countries are government, even
Britain, BBC, that’s the British Broadcasting Corporation, is government controlled and
those stations are under the government’s thumb, they have to say what the government
wants them to say or they get their license revoked. That’s as simple as it is.
10
Rosetta: We have a call, Ron. Let’s take it.
Ron: Scooter, go ahead please.
Caller: Yes, sir. Am I on the air?
Ron: Yes.
Caller: I would like to ask the gentlemen a question that he baited in the first place how
many stations had been, had lost their licenses and he came back with a nice political
evasion, he said 200 had been filed against. I did a little arithmetic, that 200 only figures
out well less than three percent and he didn’t say over how many years either. Please
clarify on that just a bit.
Ron: Okay. Thank you.
Steve: Okay. That was during one license renewal period. Now depending on when a
station went on the air, let’s say a station goes on the air now, today, their license will
come up for renewal in three years. Okay, we don’t, there’s applications made every day
and this was just during one test period and I don’t know when it was. This stuff came to
us from the National Association of Broadcasters. It was just a statistic for like a six or
eight month period. Those 200 stations during that period were filed against, that was
back in 1971.
Ron: And did you tell him how many actually lost their licenses?
Steve: As far as I know, three did.
Ron: Okay, we have another caller, go ahead please.
Caller: Yes, I’ve been listening to your program this morning and my husband happens
to be the President of the Western Montana Mining Association.
Ron: Yes.
Caller: And it sounds to me like our problems are very similar regardless of if it’s in
broadcasting or mining or what it is.
(Laughter)
Ron: Yeah, that’s right, you have your controls.
Caller: And what I think all of us as human beings are going to have to start standing up
for our rights. Thank you.
Ron: Thank you.
11
Steve: Okay, that’s a very good comment. But we do, we do need your support out
there. We operate for your benefit. Without you we couldn’t operate and we need your
letters. And I would appreciate your writing to your Congressman or your Senators and
asking them to go ahead and pass legislation that will grant broadcasters’ past record at
least a little merit in license renewal time. If you don’t, if the people of the United States
don’t get behind it, we’re going to lose it, simple as that.
Rosetta: Ron, we have another call.
Ron: Before we take that, listen to this.
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Ron: School lunch menu for tomorrow: apple juice, macaroni and cheese, luncheon
meat slice, tomato wedge, hot muffin with butter, fresh fruit and milk, and we have a
caller. Go ahead please.
Caller: Yes. I for one support your program, this program especially, but also your radio
program, your station, your broadcasting and I like the way you do it. What I’m
wondering is are you making any plans to have any FM because you know we only have
two FM stations now, one of them a part-time basis at Vo-Tech and one of them being
retransmitted from the airport.
Ron: Right.
Caller: And those are beamed direct toward Helena so we in East Helena can’t hear
them. There’s no FM reception out there whatsoever. And I was just wondering if you
do have any plans in the near future of perhaps going to FM?
Ron: Okay. Thank you for calling.
Caller: Thank you.
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Steve: I guess we’re on. KBLL Radio at this time does not have any plans for FM, a
station here, but there are two applications in for this area that we know of for FM
transmitters. Answer the man’s question.
Rosetta: Steve, I have a question that I am faced with daily because this program is
considered a public service program and I carry announcements for service groups all the
time and these announcements are free. I think we should get into the area of public
service time. What is expected and demanded of a broadcast industry versus another
media? How much public service time do we have to give, which also will lead us into,
how do we get our money, I mean how do we operate? Where is our, okay, you take it
from there, I’ll just sit back.
Steve: Okay, public service time has to be granted, that’s according to the FCC, too.
That’s one of their little rules, and we have to. However, it’s a small percentage of our
commercial time, about, oh, we usually have about two to three PSAs an hour. Okay
over an 18 hour broadcast day that’s quite a bit. However, we don’t, two or three really
isn’t much advertising and we have a lot of public service announcements that we’re
putting on the air. So if a group wants a PSA, we have no control over how many times
that’s going to be aired. The only way that you can make sure that your message is heard
by the public is to go commercial, buy commercial advertising for it. Just like you do in
a newspaper, and say, going to run so many commercials a day on it. That way you
know your message is going to be heard.
Rosetta: Well and we’re a little more generous. Usually they buy “X” number of spots
for public service time we give an equal amount, we give matching spots.
Steve: That is the station’s policy.
Rosetta: Oh, that’s the station.
Steve: That’s not required by the Federal Communications Commission. Matter of fact,
if we wanted to we could demand that they pay for the commercial announcements that
they bought at the full commercial rate. We don’t. We usually agree because they are
non-profit in nature and they don’t have much money to spend for advertising and we
want their message heard, we will give them a matching package. But that’s up to us, not
the FCC.
Rosetta: I think, too, that sometimes people become swallowed up with large businesses,
and aren’t aware how a small business, like a broadcast business, like ours, makes its
money. We make it off of advertising commercials. This is our only source of revenue.
Steve: That is our only source of revenue, and I, people will get sick of commercials,
let’s face it. We all do (laughter). But that’s what pays the freight.
Rosetta: And they are effective for the business people, though.
13
Steve: They’re very effective. Now I am not a programming individual as, I’ve always
been involved in advertising sales myself and it is a very effective way of advertising.
Yes it is.
Rosetta: But it is the only way we make money.
Steve: Right.
Rosetta: Okay, we’ve got a call.
Ron: Scooter, go ahead please.
Caller: Talking about commercials, that’s all well and good, but why are they so much
louder than the rest of the programming?
(Laughter)
Ron: I may be able to answer that one.
Rosetta: Why don’t you answer that one, Ron, since you do so many of the commercials.
Ron: Okay. Now, they really aren’t. We have a meter in front of us, in fact I see it right
now bouncing around, and when this meter bounces to the same spot all the time. Now
voices sometimes will carry, will sound like they’re not as loud. Some voices are soft
and deep and don’t sound too loud. Some commercials may sound louder because of the
music or something. But the meter is the first control and then we have an automatic
control on everything that before it leaves the station, it’s an automatic control system
that will dampen the sound, or raise the sound if it’s too soft. So there’s no way that
anything can leave this room here and be much louder than any other thing.
Rosetta: Because they are produced separately. They’re not done live generally, they are
produced in a room by themselves with music behind them. You may get a different
sound effect which leads one to believe that they are louder.
Steve: That’s due to the equipment and it’s also an individual thing. Like Ron, for
instance, if he opened the microphone it would drown me out because his voice is a lot
more powerful than one.
Rosetta: He does it to me all the time.
Ron: I shut yours off.
(Laughter)
14
Ron: The way that automatic control level, that I was talking about, is also something
that is required by the FCC, so all stations this.
Steve: You know, a gentleman called awhile ago with the statistics on the people who
were filed against, and I was kind of caught up against it there. I wasn’t trying to evade
that man, that wasn’t my purpose. I just didn’t have the information in front of me.
Okay, then I immediately followed that by saying that this, these 200 applications were
filed against within about eight months or a year and that was erroneous, too. It took a
two year period and that was where the 200 applications were filed against. In the state
of Massachusetts, every single station that came up for renewal was filed against. In
New York, nearly every one. In Rochester, New York, 14 out of 18 stations were filed
against, so I think that might clear it up a little bit.
Rosetta: Oh, I think that’s shocking. I’m glad you found that.
Steve: Thank you.
Rosetta: Yeah.
Ron: Okay, we have a caller, go ahead please.
Caller: I was glad to hear that gentlemen say about the louder voice for the
advertisement. And it’s kind of the louder voice, if you live in an apartment house with
mostly tissue paper walls, you can’t go far from your radio because if an advertisement
comes on it’ll shake the building and they’ll hear upstairs and downstairs.
Ron: Um-hm.
Caller: So I wish, I often wanted to call in and say why couldn’t they be so we could
leave our radio on at the same volume so that it wouldn’t disturb the neighbors. And then
I’d like to know a second thing. When you have terrible advertisements, and half a dozen
of them spread in other things, you can’t shut them off, you don’t know when they’re
coming. Like there’s terrible advertisements for perfectly good products, but I don’t
know why they think we’re idiots that have to know that. And what can we do about
getting a, I’ve telephoned to the people and asked whether they make up those
advertisements or whether they get it from headquarters and it usually comes from
headquarters.
Ron: Um-hm.
Caller: It, it makes your high blood pressure it’s so screaming and crazy people talking
about perfectly good materials. I’ve got some Campbell soup, but I can’t bear to look at
it, but I like it, but after that advertisement.
Ron: Okay, thank you.
15
Steve: That particular advertisement came in over the ABC Network, that one on
Campbell soup. We have no control. We don’t know when a network commercial is
coming up here, and we can’t control that part of it. However, that commercial
nationwide is one of the most effective commercials that’s ever been written. While it
might grate on this lady’s nerves, it turns someone else on, and makes them a Campbell
soup lover.
Rosetta: Well said.
Ron: Okay, we have another caller, go ahead please.
Caller: Yeah. What they say, what’s good for the goose is good for the gander. I was
just thinking all this control they’re putting on us people and all businesses and I’m in
business, too, and my gosh, I think we all ought to get together and pool our wisdom and
make some complaints against these parasites that are trying to control everything, if
there’s anybody to make a complaint to.
(Laughter)
Ron: If we can find someone. Thank you.
Steve: That’s my whole purpose for being here this morning is that these people are
trying to get control of the broadcast industry and I know there’s more and more control
every day in every facet of our lives. You can’t, you’re going to have to pay to go to the
bathroom any more. And it’s getting worse, it’s getting worse. It’s getting terrible. And
that’s why I’m here this morning to try to get you out there to support the free
broadcasting system.
Rosetta: Another call. Let’s take that.
Ron: Scooter, go ahead please.
Caller: There’s one that comes on, is that the Cloverleaf one? It sounds just like we were
in the hen house catching chickens to kill them.
Ron: Um-hm.
Caller: The chickens are cackling, the howling.
Ron: I’m not familiar with that one.
Caller: Oh, it comes in awful loud and we sometimes turn off the radio it sounds so
confused.
Steve: Maybe that’s Ron.
16
Ron: Okay, thank you.
Rosetta: I think that’s Sam.
Steve: That’s Sam the Rooster don’t you think?
Ron: Oh, maybe that’s ‘ol Sam.
Rosetta: Trying to lay an egg.
Ron: Maybe I should play that just to test it.
Rosetta: You ought to get it out there.
Ron: Should I get it out.
Rosetta: Get it out and see if that’s it. While you’re doing that, let’s do one of those
commercials that keeps that man in business for a long time.
Commercial: (Music) Grimes Buick...(cut out)
End of Rooster crowing.
Rosetta and Steve: That’s it, that’s it.
Steve: I have one thing to say then I’ll get out of Rosetta’s hair here.
Rosetta: Oh, you’re not in my hair.
Steve: If I can help any of you out there as far as letters to write to your Congressman or
Senators, just send me your name and address and I’ll send you the information that we
think should be in. And you can discard it if you want, that’s up to you. And as far as
programming on KBLL Radio, if you have any preferences that you like, please let us
know by letter.
Rosetta: I might add, too, those of you, when you write in for your recipes, Gleason’s is
the one who gets them mailed to me. I do appreciate the little remarks you make.
Sometimes they aren’t always favorable like the one, but one lady yesterday, I
appreciated her remarks. My recipes aren’t always, one time they were really bad, the
stencil didn’t cut through and the recipe was really bad, it was for the pasty recipes, and I
received lots of complaints, but it was so refreshing to receive this letter yesterday from
the woman who said, and honey, your copy was so clear I could read every word, and I
thought when you start getting comments like that what could be better. We have a call.
This will have to be our last call this morning.
Ron: Scooter, go ahead please.
17
Caller: I have a question and it’s somewhat of a complaint at the same time. Many times
we have been listening to the radio and one station will be doing a special promo for
business and you turn on another station hoping to get some music and a little relaxation
and they are likewise doing a special promo. Or perhaps you turn on the radio and you
hear a basketball game and you turn on another station and there’s another ballgame of
some kind. Do the stations ever cooperate somehow so that one station is open for the
pleasure of the listener rather than perhaps a promotional deal? This is my question.
Ron: Okay, thank you.
Steve: Okay. I think that is a matter of coincidence. The two stations here in Helena
work very closely together and they try not to let that happen. Case in point is a Class C
Tournament. KCAP Radio is going to be carrying the Class C Tournament, we are not
because we think the listeners should have more than one program to listen to. I hope
that answers her question.
Rosetta: Thank you, Steve, now if they have calls, we have the shy ones who prefer not
to call on the air, they can call 442-6620 right now and talk to Steve Rawls, who’s the
manager of KBLL Radio, or to Lawrence Reel who is our sales manager if you want to
talk about advertising.
Steve: He’s in a big sweat out there.
Rosetta: I know, he’s out there tearing his hair and saying, why are they saying my
name?
Steve: Thank you. Thank you, Rosetta, and thank you out there for listening.
(End of Interview)
Blank space
Interview with Dick Shackelford, Conductor, Helena Symphony Society
Rosetta: Now, tell us about the symphony, Helena Symphony Society. Dick you want to
start and tell us when the first concert is?
Dick: When was that date again, Ron?
Ron: Oh, November 6th.
Dick: Oh. Happy Birthday to you, happy birthday to you, happy birthday Rosetta, happy
birthday to you.
18
Rosetta: You’re a little early, Dick, but you said you’d sing, because you didn’t bring a
tape to play the music.
Dick: It was a pretty bad rendition, but you know.
Rosetta: Well, I appreciate that.
Dick: But it’s heartfelt.
Rosetta: It’s early. I don’t want to be any older so soon, but it’s okay. Thanks a lot for
singing.
Dick: Two weeks, is it two weeks?
Rosetta: You sang, you sang to me. I hope that the music you present at the symphony is
going to be…
Dick: Better than that?
(Laughter)
Dick: You didn’t want to say it, did you?
Rosetta: No I didn’t, but you said it.
Dick: Oh.
Rosetta: Dee, while he recuperates from his soul, would you tell us about the symphony?
Dee: Well, our membership drive is on and it will be now through November 2. And the
first concert date will be, our fall concert , will be Saturday, November 17, at the junior
high school. And then the Christmas concert will be Saturday, December 15, at the
Cathedral. Now that will be the Messiah. And our winter concert will be Saturday,
March 23, at the junior high school, and the spring concert will be Saturday, May 4, at
the cathedral.
Rosetta: All right. Now. I have attended these concerts in the past, and Dick is kind of a
ham, too, he’s part of the KBLL family or what, many years ago, and I remember those
years. However, when you attend these concerts or the symphonies, I am always amazed
that these are local people. I have to keep picking out people in the group to be sure that
I’m listening to local musicians.
Dee: It really is amazing that Helena has all of this talent, and of course they bring a few
outside performers in, but most of them are Helena people, and I think that’s the thing
that is so amazing about our symphony is that we have our people performing for Helena
and our Helena community.
19
Rosetta: Right. And we do have someplace to go in the winter time and in fall and the
spring. People who sit around and say we don’t have anything to do in Helena. We do
have something to listen to. You have Paul Ritter with you again.
Dick: Yes. Yes, definitely. Paul is, well there’s some rather spectacular news
concerning Paul. He went to Great Falls last year, he’s beginning his second year there
now at Great Falls High School. And this year out of five choirs that have been selected
to go to the National Music Educators Conference in Anaheim, California, Paul Ritter’s
delphinium choir from Great Falls High School has been selected, one of five. And it
really speaks well of his ambition, his talent, his ability to work for the overall thing
which we’re all working for, which is, well a musical communication, a way of, you
know music is another language, it’s a way of saying from the heart what you want to
say. And even though you have composers that you, you work off of their piece of
music, but it allows you to say something in your own way. And it’s a tribute to his
effort and his dedication to the profession of music as a professional musician.
Rosetta: Paul lives in Great Falls, but he comes over for your practices, your rehearsals.
Dick: Every Monday night he comes down.
Rosetta: What a devotion to Helena, really.
Dick: Yes, you know, it’s very interesting. Paul came, of course three years ago, to
Helena to fill a one year vacancy, and when he filled that vacancy he also filled a place in
the hearts of a lot of people, mine also. Anyway, he does a great job and we’ve got a
great season planned. I was asked the other day to describe this season and I’m not
exactly sure I can. Hopefully a conductor is able to, well, an orchestra is able to grow
and to build at a steady rate. Very often you end a season at a high point and you have to
start all over in the fall. This year, we aren’t doing that. We’re starting where we left off.
Rosetta: How fantastic.
Dick: It is fantastic.
Rosetta: It’s going to get better and better.
Dick: It’s beautiful. The first concert for example, the three works that we have
planned, the Egmont Overture, in fact was the first number that I ever conducted the
Helena Symphony on, five years ago as a guest conductor, and it brings back very
exciting memories. The second number is the Brahms Symphony No. 1, which is quite a
work, it’s got to be heavy and have a heft and yet at the same time it speaks so much of
the composer’s heart and his entire sole is all wrapped up within the pages of the work.
And then of course, Shahrazad is, you know, is kind of an unbelievable piece of music,
the effects and the colorations and the sound, it just makes one’s mind just completely
wander, Shahr, um, Rimsky-Korsikoff himself said, well, I’m not going to tell a story
20
with this. I don’t want to put a story in and call it program music. I want the listener’s
mind to simply wander and his imagination completely run wild rampant, giving the, just
simply the setting of a local or an area, Shahrazad’s being Tales of 1,001 Nights, the
Arabian Nights, and of course the story itself is really fascinating, so.
Rosetta: We have to quickly wrap up. You always amaze me, Richard Shackelford,
because you can come on and be so utterly, an utter clown, and sing Happy Birthday to
me (laughter) and then get wrapped up in your music like you do and just be so informed
and such a tremendous conductor. Really I just, when somebody like you would sing
Happy Birthday to me, it just gives me the willies. I’m not kidding.
Ron: Rudolph Valentino.
Dick: I’ll try not to sing it again.
Rosetta: Well, it’s just too much, I’m overwhelmed. Dee, will you take over and tell
where all these tickets are on sale.
Dee: Well, as I said, our drive will be on now through the second, or if anyone needs
tickets or a ticket they can purchase them anywhere if they call me. My number’s 442-
2686 or Mary Pitch at 443-3452 and we’ll see to it that they get tickets and also several of
the stores and places of business will be selling tickets. And that’s at Hennessy’s, the
First Security Bank, the Bank of Montana, the Northwestern Bank, the First National
Bank, Floreish, Niece Music, Clark Brothers and Stella Shop.
Rosetta: And the concerts are held again where?
Dick: Junior High School Auditorium for the fall concert and the winter concert. The
Christmas concert and the spring concert are both in the cathedral. The type of music we
are doing calls for a real dedication to the glory of the master and that’s why it’s going to
be in the cathedral.
Rosetta: I’ll keep pushing away and hope you can attend these concerts because they are
terrific. Tomorrow is our history lesson again with Dr. Michael Malone and Dr. Richard
Rader and it’s the Copper Kings tomorrow, and I know many of you will be very
interested in that. I certainly am and I’ haven’t met these two gentlemen; you’ve met
them and I haven’t, and tomorrow’s our history lesson so do be with us tomorrow and
call in your comments and whatever you know about the Copper Kings or that era of
time. It’s been sort of different today. Tomorrow it will be even more different and we’ll
see you then. Bye-bye.
(End of Interview)
Beginning of Interview
21
Well today, we’re going to have music. We’re going to have our Helena Symphony with
us today. Well, not the entire, yes we are, Dick. Dick Shackelford is down to bring us
the symphony. We are going to have the symphony with us today.
Dick: Oh, the whole bunch. We’ve got them all in your little tiny studio.
Rosetta: Yep.
Dick: All 50 of us.
Rosetta: All 50 are right here and you’re going to hear, with their instruments, and
you’re going to hear music if you can’t envision this, listen, and we do have them on
tape. We have excerpts. And that’s what our program is today, music, and I think you’ll
like it. It will be kind of relaxing. We’ve been having some rather fast paced programs
so this will be relaxing and I hope you enjoy today’s program. We’re going to have
Scooter Scoop, you see we were just sitting here chatting away about something. I was
making my Scooter Scoop announcements and I, we’re going to talk about the symphony
today and I had a call this morning from Irene Reynolds telling me about the Symphony
Guild and Saturday night is the concert and there will be a display, an art display in the
hall, or foyer…
Dick: Foyer.
Rosetta: And they will be original prints, watercolors and paintings by Mrs. Glen Drake
and her daughter, Leslie.
Dick: Leslie.
Rosetta: And then Shirley Bentley will have some things on display, so take time out
while you’re visiting there to see those things. Now what are you going to tell us about
the symphony today, Dick?
Dick: Oh, let’s see. My goodness. We’ve had many, many rehearsals. We had a
rehearsal last evening, in fact, and we’re getting to the point where it’s starting to feel
very comfortable, you know. The music is, still a few rough spots yet, we have one more
rehearsal before the concert. In a community orchestra what we attempt to do, or what I
attempt to do, is reach the peak at the concert. And sometimes I miss and…
Rosetta: Well then is that true when they say a bad dress rehearsal for a, does this hold
true for musicians, the bad dress rehearsal for a play that means a good performance?
(Laughter)
Dick: I think that’s a superstition. I don’t go along with that.
Rosetta: It has to be a superstition.
22
Dick: Yeah. I would prefer to think that if you do have a good rehearsal, sometimes you
can have a bad concert because you can become over confident. But what is happening,
and this is only the state of the mind, that you can, well, you can get yourself all messed
up by becoming over confident. If you think, well, gee, I know this backwards and
forwards, I don’t need to concentrate here at this point, and this is really never true. If
you were going to do something, you know this could apply to just about anything, like
the potter who’s spinning his wheel and he thinks well, by golly, I’ve got this really
sacked, I can spin this old pot out just any old time, and that’s when he finds that his
work is somehow lost some very special quality. And it’s the same in any art form, in
fact, even in reading or something, if you think you know something really well and you
sit down to read it, that’s when the mistakes are made when we stop concentrating. And
this is the deal about the good dress rehearsal/bad performance, bad dress rehearsal/good
performance. If you have a bad dress rehearsal everybody is so frightened they have to
concentrate and (Laughter) you know, they’re just waiting for something to happen. And
we’ve been having good rehearsals and attendance at rehearsals has been quite good. As
I mentioned before the last time, I have many new musicians in town and the ones who
have been the regulars for several years, so the orchestra has been becoming a unit, a
lovely unit. It’s not just 40 some odd people sitting down on the stage all playing the
same thing. It’s becoming an expressive vehicle and, well, this first concert is extremely
ambitious and I always wonder after I’ve picked the music and we start to work on it, I
wonder, golly, whiz, fella, you know, what are you doing? This is pretty tough. It’s
tough music. It’s very effective, it’s very emotional, it’s got ups, downs, middles,
sweeping sections that, you know, people are just going to get goose bumps if they can
really immerse themselves in what’s going on on the stage and watch what’s happening
and it can be very, very exciting, it really can.
Rosetta: Well, we’re going to hear things. We’re not going to hear this concert. These
are, the tapes that you brought down for today are not from the music that we’ll hear
Saturday night.
Dick: No, no. I had hoped maybe I could do that but I didn’t have time to set up some
equipment.
Rosetta: Well, I don’t know that you should do that. I think that they should come and
hear it at the concert.
Dick: Well, I think it will be a surprise for many. You get a community of 27,000 or
30,000, or whatever the Helena area population is, and you wonder, gee how can they
have a symphony at all? And there is a symphony and they are playing and there are
some great things happening. And they’re doing the work, you know, they’re having to
go home and practice their music and this type of thing. So it’s not just a one or two
night deal, they have to have their music ready. What I brought is some selections from
last year’s program. The first one on the tape is the finale from the Beethoven Emperor
Concerto, the one in E flat major, which we had a guest here for a whole week, Stephen
Bartas, from Texas, did a beautiful job for us and I learned a great deal from him in
23
conducting concertos and he was such a lovely man. He would stop the piano, you know,
and kind of pull on my shirt tail and “could I say something to the orchestra?” and I
would say, oh, yes, please, please do. And he would explain, you know, a little more
about Beethoven, a little more about concertos, a little more about the piano.
Rosetta: I met him.
Dick: Yes, you did.
Rosetta: He was on, in fact, he was on this program, wasn’t he?
Dick: He certainly was.
Rosetta: I remember him.
Dick: He was a lovely man and boy does he play piano, my goodness. And he put in a
fantastic week, a whole week.
Rosetta: He wore black paten shoes, I remember, and then I stepped on his foot. And he
had on those beautiful black paten leather shoes. Isn’t that funny, the things you
remember about people. I remember that he was gifted and talented, but I remember
those black paten leather shoes and I said, oh, you have such beautiful shoes, I stepped on
his foot.
Dick: He didn’t mind a bit.
Rosetta: No, he was very nice.
Dick: He said, that’s the nicest lady who’s ever stepped on my foot. (Laughter) No, he
didn’t tell me that really. But anyway.
Rosetta: Oh, I remember him well.
Dick: But, let’s see, anyway. Emperor, we could probably just roll it if you want to.
Rosetta: Okay. Let’s do it.
(Music)
Rosetta: I feel like there should be applause. Like I should clap. I want to clap.
Tremendous. Oh, we could clap, sure. I know people, when they turn this in, or tune this
in, I wonder if they wonder if they’re really listening to Helena musicians.
Dick: It really is. I heard some of the mistakes that we made. (Laughter)
Rosetta: And that, the guest artist was Stephan Bartas, a former Helena man, isn’t he?
24
Dick: Right. He taught at Carroll College for two or three years or four, I think it was
four. In the late ‘40s he came over from Hungary, just barely got out of, I think it was
either Austria or Hungary, or somewhere in there, before Hitler got in, and came over
here.
Rosetta: Heavy accent still, doesn’t he? When I hear him play it makes me want to go
home and beat Ann, you know we have hundreds of dollars in this girl for her music, and
I guess for her age and her background and as much practice time as she puts in, you
know, she’s doing okay, but something like that is fantastic. Al, we have to take a break
and do something that … (tape is cut).
Al: She said is that Helena Symphony Orchestra, I said yes, she said, wow, they’re
terrific.
Rosetta: That’s exactly what, see?
Dick: Thank you. Thank you for that. That’s lovely.
Rosetta: Isn’t that lovely? I said that. I’ve said that in the past. You can’t believe it
until you sit down or go to one of these concerts and listen to it, you don’t believe they’re
Helena people. I find myself thinking, I’m not really in Helena, Montana, you know,
they’re not putting out that kind of music. You’re great. It’s an absolutely great
orchestra and you’re a great conductor, Dick.
Dick: Oh, well, thank you.
Rosetta: You’re welcome. Let’s have some more music.
(Music)
Rosetta: We didn’t say, we didn’t say what it was or who was involved.
Dick: Oh my, but it sure was goose pimply. That was from the Poulenc Gloria that we
did last Christmas. The soloist was Joanna Lester Severs. A beautiful, beautiful vocal
voice. The instrument that she was given is really something. She’ll be coming for our
Christmas concert to do our soprano solos, the Messiah.
Rosetta: And she’s so entertaining to watch, she’s so beautiful. She’s beautiful to look at
and sings, and then when she opens her mouth.
Dick: Lovely to work with, very, very cooperative, and you know, it becomes a team
effort. And this is the way Mr. Bartas was, too. He was just, well, he was a member of
the team, “cause you know, a concerto is not just a man playing a solo, it’s everything all
together, doing everything together as an orchestra, as a group,” and it’s the same with
Joanna, you know, she feels the same way, it has to go that way.
25
Rosetta: We’re going to hurry along, Dick, because we have quite a few things we want
to listen to this morning, and we want to give, we want them all, because our friend and
your friend, everyone, Les Liedle from Valtron Recording Studios, did these cuts for us,
especially for this program, and I want them all to be on, and (Laughter).
Dick: Did you hear that, Les? Yes, I know you did.
Rosetta: You, bless his heart, for doing this. Al, we better take…
Dick: He listens every morning, right.
Rosetta: He’s a doll. I just adore Les. Let’s get the next one, Dick.
Dick: Oh, from our Pops concert last year we have a little Mancini number, about a
minute and 50 seconds of Charade.
(Music)
Dick: Well, that was Charade. (clears throat) Excuse me. We were just chatting in here
as the music was going on. Many, many people assume that a Pops is an easy thing to
put together. And the problem involved is that Pop music is as hard or harder than much
of your, well, what I’ll call your serious literature. And so you have to go into it with a
little bit different frame of mind. You can’t slough it off, you have to approach it with
the same weight or the same brevity that you would approach a Beethoven concerto or a
Poulenc gloria, this type of a thing, you just can’t be tossed off. The next one to listen to
is from the Electrum I concert that we played last year in October on October 6, and this
is the finale from The King and I.
(Music)
Rosetta: That’s one of my favorites, the finale in The King and I, one of my very
favorites. I still see Yul Brenner when I…
Dick: (singing) Shall we dance, ba ba ba.
Rosetta: Yes. I still see that. We are listening to Mr. Richard Shackelford who is the
Helena Symphony Orchestra conductor, and we’re listening to excerpts from last year’s
performances, and on Saturday night is the concert coming up at the junior high and
everyone can attend because you can buy family memberships, which is really the most
economical way to go, or you can buy tickets at the door for each of the concerts.
(question is not on tape)
Dick: We may record and preserve for posterity, I suppose, the recording and a member
of the chorale or the orchestra, by individual requests can purchase it, but we cannot, as I
26
understand it, sell them for profit. In other words, whatever the cost of Mr. Liedle’s time
and so on, I think he can do it, but I’m not sure, and so they would need to call Les Liedle
at Valtron to assure themselves of the recording. I think they could probably get one.
Like I say, I’m not sure. One would have to call Mr. Liedle at Valtron Recording Studios
to find out, I think the legal ramifications more than anything else because the music is
not in public domain and this has to do with copyright laws and this type of a thing. I
wish I knew the answer to that one. That’s a little tricky.
Rosetta: Are we ready for the biggee?
Dick: Well, I thought maybe we could talk about what we’re going to do this weekend.
Rosetta: I can’t stand it. I want to hear it. (Laughter) My favorite.
Dick: Rhapsody in Blue is the next one up.
Rosetta: Rhapsody in Blue.
Dick: She’s champing at the bit to hear it. So am I. Bud Brown, whom we have in, well,
we’ll talk about him in just a minute, because what I have to say about Bud takes a long
time. He’s such a great musician and a great individual to work with. Today I brought
down a baton. Sometimes I call it a stick because if I stick somebody with it I call it a
stick and if I’m conducting with it I call it a baton. But in any case it’s a …
Rosetta: You conduct, Dick, like I expect a conductor to conduct. You get excited in the
spots that are excitable and then you just kind of move a little bit in the stuff (Laughter).
You know people watch the conductor from the back, you’re aware of all these eyes on
your back. Does that bother you?
Dick: No. If I became aware of that I think I’d probably quit because I probably look
terrible from behind, I don’t know (Laughter).
Rosetta: No, you look….No, your behind is just fine (Laughter). Up there conducting,
well, conductors are watched, you know that.
Dick: That’s true. I don’t know, I probably have some habits that many other conductors
would say, you know maybe you shouldn’t do that. But music to me is very exciting and
being involved, and the attempt that we make is to include the listener somehow, not just
by sight, but somehow if they can immerse themselves in the sound, the colorations, the
various things. For example, in the concert this weekend, we open the concert with the
Egmont overture, which is one of Beethoven’s, not lesser works, but it’s one of his works
that he did for a play based on the Duke of Egmont, or the Duke of something, I can’t
remember now for sure, and it is kind of program music and there are fantastic horn calls
in it. And the horn section we have now is probably one of the most brilliant sections
(clears throat), excuse me, that we’ve ever had, plus trombones, we have a brass section
that is just gorgeous, and then we go on to the Shahrazad, and, or no, the Brahms
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Symphony No. 1. And then we finish out the program with the Shahrazad, which is just
gorgeous, absolutely gorgeous. But this baton that I brought down and wanted to say
something about was the first baton that I ever conducted with at a (clears throat) excuse
me, summer camp back in 1962 when I had just graduated from high school, and it was
given to me by a Mr. Gene Andre, who as many of you may not know, was the founder
of the Helena Symphony Orchestra. He was the first conductor, he got it organized, and
brought people over from Missoula to kind of fill the gaps in the section here. Got the
whole thing begun and he autographed this stick for me and I have, it just holds a very
special place in my heart. I think he would be proud of what he began here, and the man
himself holds a very special place in my heart. I will be using this stick for the concert
and have been using it for rehearsal, not that the stick has any magic, except in my heart.
Rosetta: Yeah. You always say things so eloquently.
Dick: (Laughter.)
Rosetta: You do. Now, you want to announce it?
Dick: I would love to. As I look at the clock here. Okay. The first thing I would like to
do, I really publicly want to thank several people. One is our symphony board members
for all of the effort and the work that they have put in, Les Liedle, especially for putting
this thing together so that we could bring the music to you, and also for recording our
concerts, otherwise it would be possible that we could bring the Helena Symphony music
to you over the air. And Bud Brown did a beautiful job on Rhapsody in Blue. He was
excellent. He’s really what you call a team member of an orchestra. He really, he works,
the man is just a marvelous musician and this last section is the conclusion of the
Gershwin Rhapsody in Blue.
(Music)
Rosetta: I just love it.
Dick: He did a beautiful job, didn’t he?
Rosetta: I just love it. I’m going to say it, Dick, all throughout the program today Al has
been taking calls from listeners who have been complimenting the orchestra, are
somewhat aghast that this really is, these really are our Helena people and complimenting
you. And even one of your members of the symphony called to say how great you were
to work with. And I’m going to say that because too often we hear things that aren’t
right. What?
Al: One minute left and 30 seconds for Crane’s out of that.
Rosetta: Oh, I see.
Al: Fifteen seconds, say good-bye Rosie.
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Rosetta: Well, I’m going to say thank you to Dick Shackelford for coming down and
we’ll just simply say good-bye. Be at the concert on Saturday night, right Dick?
Dick: Right. Hope you can be there.
Rosetta: Helena Junior High School.
Dick: Helena Junior High School, 8 p.m.
Rosetta: 8 p.m. Be there.
Dick: Three year olds can come, you bet.
Rosetta: We’ve had calls if they can bring children. Yes, bring your children, that’s how
they learn about music is to attend these. They don’t bother you.
Dick: No, they don’t bother me. In fact if they get exposed to music at that age then
they’re going to like music as they get older.
Rosetta: This morning has been Mr. Richard Shackelford, conductor of our Helena
Symphony Orchestra, and it has been our Helena Symphony people playing for your
pleasure this morning and again I want to thank Les Liedle from Valtron Recording
Studios for putting this program together for us today and all those involved and
tomorrow we’re going to have our two professors with us, Dr. Mike Malone and Dr.
Richard Rader and we’ll see you then. Bye-bye.

Click tabs to swap between content that is broken into logical sections.

Interviewed by Rosetta Kamlowsky on March 8, 1973 for the Scooter radio show on KBLL radio. Steve Rawls was the Manager of KBLL radio. The topic discussed is FCC regulations on radio broadcasting; Interviewed by Rosetta Kamlowsky on October 25, 1973 for the Scooter radio show on KBLL radio. Dick Shackelford was the Conductor of the Helena Symphony; Includes rehearsal excerpts of the Symphony from November 15, 1973

Rosetta: Before we get going with our interview this morning, this is Steve Rawls, the
marmalade recipes, for goodness sakes, I’m surprised we don’t have more of a response
because usually I can’t run off enough copies. I guess no one likes to make jelly; they
don’t like that sticky business. Personally, the little ol’ jelly maker here thinks it’s neat,
but a woman called in the other day to tell us how marmalade came about. Do you know
how marmalade originated, Steve?
Steve: Yeah, from an orange peel, right?
Rosetta: Well, that’s how orange marmalade, but no the original marmalade. Do you
know where real marmalade, why we have marmalade today?
Steve: I’m afraid not.
Rosetta: I thought you’d never say no because you knew I was going to fall on the floor!
Well, it came from Mary Queen of Scots, and the problem was she was really, really sick
and in olden days they called being sick “malody.”
Ron: Malady.
Rosetta: Malady. It was a malady when you were sick?
Ron: Right.
Rosetta: Okay. Well, she was very sick and she couldn’t eat anything. And they finally,
this woman in the kingdom, cooked up something.
Ron: A subject.
Rosetta: No. She cooked up a sticky substance. And she served it to Mary Queen of
Scots and she ate it and it was the only thing that she had eaten for a long time. So they
named it, they took the “mar” from Mary and the “malady” and they called it, it’s a
contraction, and they called it marmalade.
Ron: Hm.
Rosetta: Now that’s a true story, that’s how we have marmalade, and if you want the
recipe, the orange marmalade with the Gleason style, send me a self-addressed envelope.
By the way I have extra recipes from the meat pasty, the Cousin Jack meat pasties, and
cheesecake.
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Ron: May I just pick one up without sending an envelope?
Rosetta: You may, Ron, because…well I don’t know if I’ll let you do that or not. I guess
so.
Steve: Make him pay for it.
Rosetta: I should make him pay.
Ron: I’ll pay eight cents anyway.
Rosetta: If any of you would like to come out to the station and pick up the recipes rather
than mailing them in, please feel free because they’re in my desk drawer if I’m not here.
There’s a whole staff out here that does nothing but give out Gleason recipes. (Laughter)
No if you want to come up and get them you can.
Rosetta: Now Steve, we’ve told them that we’re going to discuss legislation and
broadcasting that affects everyone and what does that mean?
Steve: That, well, let me start with the background of the whole thing. I don’t know if
the people out there know that broadcasters have to have a license. Now a lot of business
men have to have a license. You can’t be a doctor without a license; you can’t run a
business without a license. You can’t drive a taxi, for instance, without a license. So
most of us have to have a license for another reason; to drive a car. You have to have a
license in your pocket, a license on the car. You have to have two licenses and you have
to have a license to almost live anymore, or so it seems like. And so we broadcasters
have to have a license to operate. Without it we are forbidden to operate and, of course,
now we have a problem in the broadcast industry. I think I can best illustrate it in the
following manner. Most of us have another kind of a license. It’s called a marriage
license, but let’s just suppose that this license was only good for three years and at the
end of that time you had to go before a seven member marriage commission and prove to
their satisfaction that you had been a superior husband and wife. But this is the kicker.
Anybody that wanted to could come in and file an application against that, against your
wife or your husband.
Rosetta: Oh, so if somebody had designs on my husband then they could come in and …
Steve: Sure, they could just come in and file an application on him and if he could
convince the marriage commission that he could do a better job than your husband in the
next three years, then he’d get her. That might be all right in some cases, but it’d sure
throw a monkey wrench in the social system here. And that’s what we’re up against in
broadcasting. Every three years, every broadcaster in the United States has to go before
the Federal Communications Commission and as the law is now interpreted is if someone
can out-promise us, they may get our license. Now that’s rough if you think about it for
awhile. If you’ve been in the business for 15 or 20 years, you’ve got a building to pay for
and you have equipment to pay for, it can be rough. It can be rough on your employees.
3
They may lose their jobs, if somebody can come in and grab your license. Now they
have a job, now they don’t. In fact, with that kind of a threat hanging over you every
three years, it’s difficult to get financing for radio station equipment, it’s difficult to hire
employees and give them any assurance of a stable future, or anything else. And so for
those of you out there who are operating a business, say that three years, or two years, or
even a year from now, the government came in and said, that’s it, you’re out, get out of
business. Okay, now the reason I’m worrying you out there with my problem is that I
believe it’s your problem, too. Both the radio and television are an important part of our
lives. They’re a community resource in this town, as such, and if they’re changed for the
worse everybody out there will suffer. Broadcasting means a lot to us. It means college
and pro football, basketball and baseball, Super Bowl, World Series, the Olympics. You
have a wake up service courtesy of your clock radio, weather reports, snow warnings,
driving conditions, even the school lunch menu that Ron gives every morning.
Ron: He sometimes gets us in trouble with that.
Steve: Yeah, well still, still, it’s a service. And you get music, of course. You get news.
As a matter of fact broadcasting is a principle source of news for most people, especially
in this town when you have a late afternoon newspaper. People have to depend on radio
for news until the paper comes out. And you get documentaries. Of course you have
interview shows like Scooter, editorials, you get coverage on political conventions,
election returns and inauguration, trips to the moon, and of course, entertainment. And
through broadcasting we get to know not only the President but the mayor and Chief of
Police and school board. As a matter of fact it’s a vehicle that affects our daily lives
every time we turn around. Well, I’ll stop there. I’m just trying to remind us all of the
importance of broadcasting in our daily lives. And just like electricity or water, you
don’t miss it until you don’t have it. Every time that you plug that little button, service is
always there with the exception of a mechanical breakdown, it’s there 365 days a year
without a break. Okay, let’s broadcast programming. It has a lot in common with
another great free enterprise here in the United States and that’s the department store.
Take Sears and Roebuck, for instance. They carry a tremendous variety of merchandise.
They carry school clothes for the kids, they carry fur coats for Mom, they carry hunting
clothes for Dad, tricycles, bicycles, appliances, and every other kind of a thing. And they
regularly bring in new ideas like the new trash compactor and they advertise these things
and phase out old products. Broadcast programming is a lot like that. We put all kinds of
programs for all kinds of people. We have programs for kids, teenagers, dad, mom,
farmers, matter of fact, the whole family. We try out new things and it’s aggravating to
the public sometimes.
Rosetta: They get upset with some of our commercials.
Steve: Well, it’s not the commercials but the programming that we air.
Rosetta: Oh, yeah. They get upset with that.
4
Steve: You know, we try new things and phase out old things. And that’s what the
people’s preferences determine what we put on the air.
Rosetta: I think that’s one point we should probably establish, Steve. Do we pay
attention to people when they complain or compliment us?
Steve: That’s the only way that we have of recog…, of adjusting our broadcast
programming is from letters, phone calls. I’ve been trying, I’ve been scratching my head
for months trying to figure out a simple things like the proper music format in a two
station market. And there’s so many people out there that, say for instance, they like
country mus.., country western music. You hear from them, but you never hear from the
majority of the people it seems.
Rosetta: Is this, you mean, when we’re talking about programming though, music,
you’re hearing the majority of people in this area are letting you know they like country
western music?
Steve: No, no. I didn’t say that.
Rosetta: Oh, you didn’t.
Steve: No. I said the only ones that you hear from are a few that like, I’m going to have
to find out someway what the majority of the people here in Helena area like. Okay.
There are 7,000 commercial radio stations in the United States and they have a
tremendous variety of everything from music, comedy, drama, news, national news. For
instance, we carry NBC for NBC emphasis, public programming, public information.
We have something for everyone. You get more program choices in the United States
than in any other country in the world and that’s why our system is everyone’s system.
There are 350 million radios. Did you know there are more radios in the United States
than there are bathrooms? Did you know that?
Rosetta: Well, jeepers, that’s a very important statement.
Steve: How can you answer that one?
Rosetta: I don’t know. We have a call.
Ron: Yes, we have a call with a question for you. Go ahead please.
Caller: Yeah. I’ve got two questions actually. I wondered what the percentage of
stations that had actually lost their licenses because of this licensing regulation and then
the other question I wanted to know is whether he thought TV or radio programming was
better or worse because of FCC regulations or whether he thought it really made any
difference?
Ron: Hm. Thank you.
5
Steve: Okay, in answer to the first question, there have been approximately 200 radio
and television stations that have been filed against by different groups. And in answer to
the other question, the FCC does not determine our program content as such. They tell us
what we cannot do. We cannot go into broadcast programming that has to do with off
color things. That’s the only guideline that they set.
Rosetta: Uh, someone didn’t want to come on the air with that.
Ron: They just wanted to say they like the Scooter program.
Steve: Thank you.
Rosetta: Yeah. Thank you. We like to hear that. Now, please, as long as the boss is here
all 5,000 of you call right now and say…
Ron: You think programming is better or worse because of the FCC control?
Rosetta: Well, that’s just what the lady asked.
Ron: Right.
Steve: Yeah, that just what…. I don’t know, Ron, whether it’s better or worse. They
don’t really control us that much as to our programming.
Ron: TV they do since they came in with that ruling on prime time.
Steve: Oh, in television, I know that in television news casting that the local stations are
responsible for what the network newscasters say, that’s true. And their licenses are held
in jeopardy that way.
Rosetta: I will remind everyone that our guest this morning is Steve Rawls who is
manager of KBLL Radio.
Steve: I don’t really know anything about TV except how to turn it on.
Rosetta: All right.
Steve: Or off.
Rosetta: This is another call.
Ron: Go ahead please.
Caller: Ron, as long as we’re talking about the program, on Sunday morning, really from
7 to 8, the music is horrible. It’s a continuation of the Shindig and all that sort of thing,
6
the type of music. I was wondering if we couldn’t have either if not completely sacred
music, semi-classical or something to set the mood for the day. Some of the songs are
terrible, some of the music is just awful. It’s rock and roll and it’s banging away and it’s
just awful. I have called two or three times but the people who are on at that time don’t
seem to know, it’s already set up.
Ron: Uh-huh. Okay. Thank you.
Steve: Okay. In response to that lady’s question, the only way we can clear up anything
out there that you don’t like as far as music or programming of any kind, calls really
don’t accomplish that much. What we need is letters. We need letters from everyone and
if you’ll just address them to the manager of KBLL radio we’ll do something about it if
there’s … of course, that’s what we’re trying to get into here. We’re trying to serve
everyone, not just a few. So we need your letters.
Rosetta: We have another call coming, but I would like to tell you about what’s
happening at the Needle Nook. Classes are being offered in crochet, knitting and crewel.
The Needle Nook is located at the corner of 16th and Ewing. You can call 443-3837 for
information. Lisa has some good buys on stitchery, she’s making room for new things
that are coming in. The Lowe’s Homes knit and crochet patterns are being discontinued
and their, she does have some things on special this week, so stop in at the Needle Nook.
Remember where it’s located and that’s 16th and Ewing at Crane’s Fabric Specialty,
where stitchery is an art.
Ron: We have another call, go ahead please.
Caller: Yes, I have one comment which wasn’t really what I called about, but because I
heard him make a statement about TV and I guess he’s right, he doesn’t know about TV,
I think he’s mistaken on this thing about local stations being responsible for what’s on the
national news. That was what this I think fellow called Whitehead came up with the idea
of doing it this way with the idea of trying to get a bill through Congress and everybody
raised a big fuss about it.
Ron: Right.
Caller: And nothing’s been done about it yet, but it’s got everybody in kind of a tizzy
you know. What was really going to happen to it? But this thing I called about was on
these types of things where you have announcements that could be, that are controversial,
say advertisements like the old cigarette type of advertising type of thing, you know?
Ron: Right.
Caller: Does the station wait until you go through, people go through a whole formal
procedure to try to present another side or is the station willing to cooperate? Now I’ll be
specific. There have been ads by the utility company in regard to the need for more
energy and how much more energy, and there have been ads in regard to the amount of
7
reclamation they have done in Eastern Montana and I have seen pictures of the
reclamation other than that being shown on TV and talked about on radio.
Ron: Right.
Caller: And I have read various studies on energy that refutes their advertisements. Now
I’ve been told, I don’t know much about it, I’ve been told that there’s some sort of whole
long process that we have to sit down and listen to the radio station, to monitor the TV
station for at least a full day or maybe a full week, you know, for the whole time that
their on the air and get a record of how many times this is on before we can do anything
legally. Will the station require this of us, or would they be willing listen if some of us
came in and said we’ve heard enough of these things to know what’s going on and we
think it’s controversial and we’d like to present the other viewpoint of the, you know, the
public service like this, no cigarette ads type of thing. Thanks.
Ron: We’ll find out for you. Thank you.
Steve: Okay. Our logs are open to the public, as far as that goes. Anyone that wants to
find out how many times a commercial run, all they have to do is come in and ask to see
a log for a particular day. And that’s something in the broadcast industry that makes me,
that really makes me mad, you know. We cannot run cigarette advertising; we cannot run
alcoholic beverage advertising. And now they’re after us on this Montana Power thing. I
don’t know. Maybe it shows the power of broadcasting, I don’t know. Now you can see
cigarette ads in news, in newspapers, on billboards, in magazines. You can see whiskey
ads pretty much anywhere, but you can’t hear them on radio or television. And that’s
part of the problem. If this thing keeps going we’re going to have federal control of radio
stations.
Rosetta: Well, I think you might want to clear that up. It doesn’t make us mad because
we are advocating this way of life or these things in Montana, it’s because it’s a source of
revenue other areas are entitled to and broadcasters are not.
Steve: The American Broadcast System is the only system in the world that’s free, it’s
free in that area. American Broadcast Service is provided by and supported by
advertising monies.
Ron: What about her question in answering these advertisements? If they have an
adverse idea on them?
Steve: I, I, did she, I didn’t understand, Ron, did she, does she just want to know how
many times a commercial ran, or?
Ron: No, she wonders if they have a different view than the ad that’s running, for
instance on reclamation, can they come up and air their view on the radio or something.
Rosetta: People want equal time.
8
Steve: They want equal time to a paid commercial advertisement? No, they cannot. The
people at Montana Power Company, for instance, that are airing their views, are paying
for that commercial time on radio or television, or wherever, newspapers, billboards,
wherever. They are paying for that space.
Rosetta: But if someone wishes to pay and buy as much time they can.
Steve: Certainly they can.
Ron: Okay, we have another caller. (Commercial has been edited out.)
Ron: We have another caller, go ahead please.
Caller: This is a little bit off the subject, but in regard to what that woman just said I
understand people living around that area in Colstrip a square mile of it would hardly
support even a jack rabbit and any reclamation would be better than it is now.
Ron: Okay. Thank you.
Rosetta: Ron, we’re getting, there’s some things that remain to be said as far a
broadcasting and licensing that the public should know about so right now let’s hold the
calls for a little while so we can get through with this and then we’ll entitle you to call
again.
Steve: Okay I’ll go into this, yeah we are getting away from what I came in here to say.
And the reason that I’m here is that we all have a lot to lose if this free broadcast system
of ours goes down the drain. Now overseas it’s governmental controlled and people
don’t believe the news reports because they know whatever comes over the air is what
the government wants this to hear and that’s what we don’t want. And here’s the
background on this license renewal thing. Since 1951 the Federal Communications
Commission had a policy that the past performance of a broadcaster was the best
indicator of his future performance. And each three years the FCC renewed the license of
good performers. In 1969 however, the FCC took away a TV station’s license in Boston
and give them to a competitive, competing applicant. Okay. They tried to get legislation
in at that time and it failed. And then in 1969 they reverted back to the proven
performance procedure instead of anyone coming in wanting to promise anything he
thought he could do better they reverted back to the original thing of proven performance.
But we have to have some kind of legislation in there that assure us in the broadcast
business we’re going to be able to stay in business. We either need longer license periods
or we have to know our, the things that we’ve done in the past will weigh heavily on
license renewal proceedings.
Rosetta: So what does the average person do? I mean if they’re concerned now, what
can they do to assist?
9
Steve: The only thing that you can do to keep our free advertise, or free broadcast system
in effect the way that it is now is to write letters to your senator or congressman
requesting that they do this. See what happens is that special interest groups have been,
have been filing against broadcast licenses. Special interest groups and other people that
know nothing about the business and that’s bad because…
Rosetta: Why are they doing this, I mean what’s their intent in doing this?
Steve: I think their intent basically is good. They believe that what they are doing is for
the public good. However, they are a small group and the way that they’re going about it
is wrong. They’re telling the FCC or they’re telling the United States, really the United
States broadcasting system, that they’re going to revamp the whole broadcast
programming because they believe this is what should be aired, this is the type of
programming they believe should be aired, not what the public believes. So the only way
we can keep our present broadcast system is for the public to get in back of it and support
it and the only way you can do that is with letters to your legis…, your congressman and
representatives from the state of Montana. Let them know how you feel about this.
Ron: This is KBLL Radio, Helena, Montana.
Rosetta: Tell them why you do that all the time, Ron.
Ron: Because of the FCC.
Rosetta: (Laughter.) Now you know why he’s done that every single morning.
Steve: The FCC, I believe that the FCC has to control broadcast stations. They, there is
a certain amount of control that has to be initiated. There has to be some kind of
legislation on, and there is, on who can broadcast over what frequency. Back in the ‘20s
it was chaos. People came and went on the air whenever they felt like it, broadcasting on
similar channels and it was really bad there. And I don’t believe that the Federal
Communications Commissions, what, control, should be lessened at all, that’s not the
whole point. The whole point here is that a broadcaster’s performance, if he has done a
good job for the community in the past, should weigh heavily in his favor at license
renewal time, because if it doesn’t, we’re going to have a Big Brother situation in the
United States. We’ll either have radio stations in the broadcast industry controlled by
special interest groups or the government, and that’s what we don’t want and I’m sure the
people out there don’t want it either.
Rosetta: And it does exist in other countries.
Steve: It does exist in other countries. Most foreign countries are government, even
Britain, BBC, that’s the British Broadcasting Corporation, is government controlled and
those stations are under the government’s thumb, they have to say what the government
wants them to say or they get their license revoked. That’s as simple as it is.
10
Rosetta: We have a call, Ron. Let’s take it.
Ron: Scooter, go ahead please.
Caller: Yes, sir. Am I on the air?
Ron: Yes.
Caller: I would like to ask the gentlemen a question that he baited in the first place how
many stations had been, had lost their licenses and he came back with a nice political
evasion, he said 200 had been filed against. I did a little arithmetic, that 200 only figures
out well less than three percent and he didn’t say over how many years either. Please
clarify on that just a bit.
Ron: Okay. Thank you.
Steve: Okay. That was during one license renewal period. Now depending on when a
station went on the air, let’s say a station goes on the air now, today, their license will
come up for renewal in three years. Okay, we don’t, there’s applications made every day
and this was just during one test period and I don’t know when it was. This stuff came to
us from the National Association of Broadcasters. It was just a statistic for like a six or
eight month period. Those 200 stations during that period were filed against, that was
back in 1971.
Ron: And did you tell him how many actually lost their licenses?
Steve: As far as I know, three did.
Ron: Okay, we have another caller, go ahead please.
Caller: Yes, I’ve been listening to your program this morning and my husband happens
to be the President of the Western Montana Mining Association.
Ron: Yes.
Caller: And it sounds to me like our problems are very similar regardless of if it’s in
broadcasting or mining or what it is.
(Laughter)
Ron: Yeah, that’s right, you have your controls.
Caller: And what I think all of us as human beings are going to have to start standing up
for our rights. Thank you.
Ron: Thank you.
11
Steve: Okay, that’s a very good comment. But we do, we do need your support out
there. We operate for your benefit. Without you we couldn’t operate and we need your
letters. And I would appreciate your writing to your Congressman or your Senators and
asking them to go ahead and pass legislation that will grant broadcasters’ past record at
least a little merit in license renewal time. If you don’t, if the people of the United States
don’t get behind it, we’re going to lose it, simple as that.
Rosetta: Ron, we have another call.
Ron: Before we take that, listen to this.
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materials, notions and patterns, and even accessories to top off that creation. Be
individual, sew your own clothes. Fabrics from Temple. Temple in the Lundy Center.
Ron: School lunch menu for tomorrow: apple juice, macaroni and cheese, luncheon
meat slice, tomato wedge, hot muffin with butter, fresh fruit and milk, and we have a
caller. Go ahead please.
Caller: Yes. I for one support your program, this program especially, but also your radio
program, your station, your broadcasting and I like the way you do it. What I’m
wondering is are you making any plans to have any FM because you know we only have
two FM stations now, one of them a part-time basis at Vo-Tech and one of them being
retransmitted from the airport.
Ron: Right.
Caller: And those are beamed direct toward Helena so we in East Helena can’t hear
them. There’s no FM reception out there whatsoever. And I was just wondering if you
do have any plans in the near future of perhaps going to FM?
Ron: Okay. Thank you for calling.
Caller: Thank you.
12
Steve: I guess we’re on. KBLL Radio at this time does not have any plans for FM, a
station here, but there are two applications in for this area that we know of for FM
transmitters. Answer the man’s question.
Rosetta: Steve, I have a question that I am faced with daily because this program is
considered a public service program and I carry announcements for service groups all the
time and these announcements are free. I think we should get into the area of public
service time. What is expected and demanded of a broadcast industry versus another
media? How much public service time do we have to give, which also will lead us into,
how do we get our money, I mean how do we operate? Where is our, okay, you take it
from there, I’ll just sit back.
Steve: Okay, public service time has to be granted, that’s according to the FCC, too.
That’s one of their little rules, and we have to. However, it’s a small percentage of our
commercial time, about, oh, we usually have about two to three PSAs an hour. Okay
over an 18 hour broadcast day that’s quite a bit. However, we don’t, two or three really
isn’t much advertising and we have a lot of public service announcements that we’re
putting on the air. So if a group wants a PSA, we have no control over how many times
that’s going to be aired. The only way that you can make sure that your message is heard
by the public is to go commercial, buy commercial advertising for it. Just like you do in
a newspaper, and say, going to run so many commercials a day on it. That way you
know your message is going to be heard.
Rosetta: Well and we’re a little more generous. Usually they buy “X” number of spots
for public service time we give an equal amount, we give matching spots.
Steve: That is the station’s policy.
Rosetta: Oh, that’s the station.
Steve: That’s not required by the Federal Communications Commission. Matter of fact,
if we wanted to we could demand that they pay for the commercial announcements that
they bought at the full commercial rate. We don’t. We usually agree because they are
non-profit in nature and they don’t have much money to spend for advertising and we
want their message heard, we will give them a matching package. But that’s up to us, not
the FCC.
Rosetta: I think, too, that sometimes people become swallowed up with large businesses,
and aren’t aware how a small business, like a broadcast business, like ours, makes its
money. We make it off of advertising commercials. This is our only source of revenue.
Steve: That is our only source of revenue, and I, people will get sick of commercials,
let’s face it. We all do (laughter). But that’s what pays the freight.
Rosetta: And they are effective for the business people, though.
13
Steve: They’re very effective. Now I am not a programming individual as, I’ve always
been involved in advertising sales myself and it is a very effective way of advertising.
Yes it is.
Rosetta: But it is the only way we make money.
Steve: Right.
Rosetta: Okay, we’ve got a call.
Ron: Scooter, go ahead please.
Caller: Talking about commercials, that’s all well and good, but why are they so much
louder than the rest of the programming?
(Laughter)
Ron: I may be able to answer that one.
Rosetta: Why don’t you answer that one, Ron, since you do so many of the commercials.
Ron: Okay. Now, they really aren’t. We have a meter in front of us, in fact I see it right
now bouncing around, and when this meter bounces to the same spot all the time. Now
voices sometimes will carry, will sound like they’re not as loud. Some voices are soft
and deep and don’t sound too loud. Some commercials may sound louder because of the
music or something. But the meter is the first control and then we have an automatic
control on everything that before it leaves the station, it’s an automatic control system
that will dampen the sound, or raise the sound if it’s too soft. So there’s no way that
anything can leave this room here and be much louder than any other thing.
Rosetta: Because they are produced separately. They’re not done live generally, they are
produced in a room by themselves with music behind them. You may get a different
sound effect which leads one to believe that they are louder.
Steve: That’s due to the equipment and it’s also an individual thing. Like Ron, for
instance, if he opened the microphone it would drown me out because his voice is a lot
more powerful than one.
Rosetta: He does it to me all the time.
Ron: I shut yours off.
(Laughter)
14
Ron: The way that automatic control level, that I was talking about, is also something
that is required by the FCC, so all stations this.
Steve: You know, a gentleman called awhile ago with the statistics on the people who
were filed against, and I was kind of caught up against it there. I wasn’t trying to evade
that man, that wasn’t my purpose. I just didn’t have the information in front of me.
Okay, then I immediately followed that by saying that this, these 200 applications were
filed against within about eight months or a year and that was erroneous, too. It took a
two year period and that was where the 200 applications were filed against. In the state
of Massachusetts, every single station that came up for renewal was filed against. In
New York, nearly every one. In Rochester, New York, 14 out of 18 stations were filed
against, so I think that might clear it up a little bit.
Rosetta: Oh, I think that’s shocking. I’m glad you found that.
Steve: Thank you.
Rosetta: Yeah.
Ron: Okay, we have a caller, go ahead please.
Caller: I was glad to hear that gentlemen say about the louder voice for the
advertisement. And it’s kind of the louder voice, if you live in an apartment house with
mostly tissue paper walls, you can’t go far from your radio because if an advertisement
comes on it’ll shake the building and they’ll hear upstairs and downstairs.
Ron: Um-hm.
Caller: So I wish, I often wanted to call in and say why couldn’t they be so we could
leave our radio on at the same volume so that it wouldn’t disturb the neighbors. And then
I’d like to know a second thing. When you have terrible advertisements, and half a dozen
of them spread in other things, you can’t shut them off, you don’t know when they’re
coming. Like there’s terrible advertisements for perfectly good products, but I don’t
know why they think we’re idiots that have to know that. And what can we do about
getting a, I’ve telephoned to the people and asked whether they make up those
advertisements or whether they get it from headquarters and it usually comes from
headquarters.
Ron: Um-hm.
Caller: It, it makes your high blood pressure it’s so screaming and crazy people talking
about perfectly good materials. I’ve got some Campbell soup, but I can’t bear to look at
it, but I like it, but after that advertisement.
Ron: Okay, thank you.
15
Steve: That particular advertisement came in over the ABC Network, that one on
Campbell soup. We have no control. We don’t know when a network commercial is
coming up here, and we can’t control that part of it. However, that commercial
nationwide is one of the most effective commercials that’s ever been written. While it
might grate on this lady’s nerves, it turns someone else on, and makes them a Campbell
soup lover.
Rosetta: Well said.
Ron: Okay, we have another caller, go ahead please.
Caller: Yeah. What they say, what’s good for the goose is good for the gander. I was
just thinking all this control they’re putting on us people and all businesses and I’m in
business, too, and my gosh, I think we all ought to get together and pool our wisdom and
make some complaints against these parasites that are trying to control everything, if
there’s anybody to make a complaint to.
(Laughter)
Ron: If we can find someone. Thank you.
Steve: That’s my whole purpose for being here this morning is that these people are
trying to get control of the broadcast industry and I know there’s more and more control
every day in every facet of our lives. You can’t, you’re going to have to pay to go to the
bathroom any more. And it’s getting worse, it’s getting worse. It’s getting terrible. And
that’s why I’m here this morning to try to get you out there to support the free
broadcasting system.
Rosetta: Another call. Let’s take that.
Ron: Scooter, go ahead please.
Caller: There’s one that comes on, is that the Cloverleaf one? It sounds just like we were
in the hen house catching chickens to kill them.
Ron: Um-hm.
Caller: The chickens are cackling, the howling.
Ron: I’m not familiar with that one.
Caller: Oh, it comes in awful loud and we sometimes turn off the radio it sounds so
confused.
Steve: Maybe that’s Ron.
16
Ron: Okay, thank you.
Rosetta: I think that’s Sam.
Steve: That’s Sam the Rooster don’t you think?
Ron: Oh, maybe that’s ‘ol Sam.
Rosetta: Trying to lay an egg.
Ron: Maybe I should play that just to test it.
Rosetta: You ought to get it out there.
Ron: Should I get it out.
Rosetta: Get it out and see if that’s it. While you’re doing that, let’s do one of those
commercials that keeps that man in business for a long time.
Commercial: (Music) Grimes Buick...(cut out)
End of Rooster crowing.
Rosetta and Steve: That’s it, that’s it.
Steve: I have one thing to say then I’ll get out of Rosetta’s hair here.
Rosetta: Oh, you’re not in my hair.
Steve: If I can help any of you out there as far as letters to write to your Congressman or
Senators, just send me your name and address and I’ll send you the information that we
think should be in. And you can discard it if you want, that’s up to you. And as far as
programming on KBLL Radio, if you have any preferences that you like, please let us
know by letter.
Rosetta: I might add, too, those of you, when you write in for your recipes, Gleason’s is
the one who gets them mailed to me. I do appreciate the little remarks you make.
Sometimes they aren’t always favorable like the one, but one lady yesterday, I
appreciated her remarks. My recipes aren’t always, one time they were really bad, the
stencil didn’t cut through and the recipe was really bad, it was for the pasty recipes, and I
received lots of complaints, but it was so refreshing to receive this letter yesterday from
the woman who said, and honey, your copy was so clear I could read every word, and I
thought when you start getting comments like that what could be better. We have a call.
This will have to be our last call this morning.
Ron: Scooter, go ahead please.
17
Caller: I have a question and it’s somewhat of a complaint at the same time. Many times
we have been listening to the radio and one station will be doing a special promo for
business and you turn on another station hoping to get some music and a little relaxation
and they are likewise doing a special promo. Or perhaps you turn on the radio and you
hear a basketball game and you turn on another station and there’s another ballgame of
some kind. Do the stations ever cooperate somehow so that one station is open for the
pleasure of the listener rather than perhaps a promotional deal? This is my question.
Ron: Okay, thank you.
Steve: Okay. I think that is a matter of coincidence. The two stations here in Helena
work very closely together and they try not to let that happen. Case in point is a Class C
Tournament. KCAP Radio is going to be carrying the Class C Tournament, we are not
because we think the listeners should have more than one program to listen to. I hope
that answers her question.
Rosetta: Thank you, Steve, now if they have calls, we have the shy ones who prefer not
to call on the air, they can call 442-6620 right now and talk to Steve Rawls, who’s the
manager of KBLL Radio, or to Lawrence Reel who is our sales manager if you want to
talk about advertising.
Steve: He’s in a big sweat out there.
Rosetta: I know, he’s out there tearing his hair and saying, why are they saying my
name?
Steve: Thank you. Thank you, Rosetta, and thank you out there for listening.
(End of Interview)
Blank space
Interview with Dick Shackelford, Conductor, Helena Symphony Society
Rosetta: Now, tell us about the symphony, Helena Symphony Society. Dick you want to
start and tell us when the first concert is?
Dick: When was that date again, Ron?
Ron: Oh, November 6th.
Dick: Oh. Happy Birthday to you, happy birthday to you, happy birthday Rosetta, happy
birthday to you.
18
Rosetta: You’re a little early, Dick, but you said you’d sing, because you didn’t bring a
tape to play the music.
Dick: It was a pretty bad rendition, but you know.
Rosetta: Well, I appreciate that.
Dick: But it’s heartfelt.
Rosetta: It’s early. I don’t want to be any older so soon, but it’s okay. Thanks a lot for
singing.
Dick: Two weeks, is it two weeks?
Rosetta: You sang, you sang to me. I hope that the music you present at the symphony is
going to be…
Dick: Better than that?
(Laughter)
Dick: You didn’t want to say it, did you?
Rosetta: No I didn’t, but you said it.
Dick: Oh.
Rosetta: Dee, while he recuperates from his soul, would you tell us about the symphony?
Dee: Well, our membership drive is on and it will be now through November 2. And the
first concert date will be, our fall concert , will be Saturday, November 17, at the junior
high school. And then the Christmas concert will be Saturday, December 15, at the
Cathedral. Now that will be the Messiah. And our winter concert will be Saturday,
March 23, at the junior high school, and the spring concert will be Saturday, May 4, at
the cathedral.
Rosetta: All right. Now. I have attended these concerts in the past, and Dick is kind of a
ham, too, he’s part of the KBLL family or what, many years ago, and I remember those
years. However, when you attend these concerts or the symphonies, I am always amazed
that these are local people. I have to keep picking out people in the group to be sure that
I’m listening to local musicians.
Dee: It really is amazing that Helena has all of this talent, and of course they bring a few
outside performers in, but most of them are Helena people, and I think that’s the thing
that is so amazing about our symphony is that we have our people performing for Helena
and our Helena community.
19
Rosetta: Right. And we do have someplace to go in the winter time and in fall and the
spring. People who sit around and say we don’t have anything to do in Helena. We do
have something to listen to. You have Paul Ritter with you again.
Dick: Yes. Yes, definitely. Paul is, well there’s some rather spectacular news
concerning Paul. He went to Great Falls last year, he’s beginning his second year there
now at Great Falls High School. And this year out of five choirs that have been selected
to go to the National Music Educators Conference in Anaheim, California, Paul Ritter’s
delphinium choir from Great Falls High School has been selected, one of five. And it
really speaks well of his ambition, his talent, his ability to work for the overall thing
which we’re all working for, which is, well a musical communication, a way of, you
know music is another language, it’s a way of saying from the heart what you want to
say. And even though you have composers that you, you work off of their piece of
music, but it allows you to say something in your own way. And it’s a tribute to his
effort and his dedication to the profession of music as a professional musician.
Rosetta: Paul lives in Great Falls, but he comes over for your practices, your rehearsals.
Dick: Every Monday night he comes down.
Rosetta: What a devotion to Helena, really.
Dick: Yes, you know, it’s very interesting. Paul came, of course three years ago, to
Helena to fill a one year vacancy, and when he filled that vacancy he also filled a place in
the hearts of a lot of people, mine also. Anyway, he does a great job and we’ve got a
great season planned. I was asked the other day to describe this season and I’m not
exactly sure I can. Hopefully a conductor is able to, well, an orchestra is able to grow
and to build at a steady rate. Very often you end a season at a high point and you have to
start all over in the fall. This year, we aren’t doing that. We’re starting where we left off.
Rosetta: How fantastic.
Dick: It is fantastic.
Rosetta: It’s going to get better and better.
Dick: It’s beautiful. The first concert for example, the three works that we have
planned, the Egmont Overture, in fact was the first number that I ever conducted the
Helena Symphony on, five years ago as a guest conductor, and it brings back very
exciting memories. The second number is the Brahms Symphony No. 1, which is quite a
work, it’s got to be heavy and have a heft and yet at the same time it speaks so much of
the composer’s heart and his entire sole is all wrapped up within the pages of the work.
And then of course, Shahrazad is, you know, is kind of an unbelievable piece of music,
the effects and the colorations and the sound, it just makes one’s mind just completely
wander, Shahr, um, Rimsky-Korsikoff himself said, well, I’m not going to tell a story
20
with this. I don’t want to put a story in and call it program music. I want the listener’s
mind to simply wander and his imagination completely run wild rampant, giving the, just
simply the setting of a local or an area, Shahrazad’s being Tales of 1,001 Nights, the
Arabian Nights, and of course the story itself is really fascinating, so.
Rosetta: We have to quickly wrap up. You always amaze me, Richard Shackelford,
because you can come on and be so utterly, an utter clown, and sing Happy Birthday to
me (laughter) and then get wrapped up in your music like you do and just be so informed
and such a tremendous conductor. Really I just, when somebody like you would sing
Happy Birthday to me, it just gives me the willies. I’m not kidding.
Ron: Rudolph Valentino.
Dick: I’ll try not to sing it again.
Rosetta: Well, it’s just too much, I’m overwhelmed. Dee, will you take over and tell
where all these tickets are on sale.
Dee: Well, as I said, our drive will be on now through the second, or if anyone needs
tickets or a ticket they can purchase them anywhere if they call me. My number’s 442-
2686 or Mary Pitch at 443-3452 and we’ll see to it that they get tickets and also several of
the stores and places of business will be selling tickets. And that’s at Hennessy’s, the
First Security Bank, the Bank of Montana, the Northwestern Bank, the First National
Bank, Floreish, Niece Music, Clark Brothers and Stella Shop.
Rosetta: And the concerts are held again where?
Dick: Junior High School Auditorium for the fall concert and the winter concert. The
Christmas concert and the spring concert are both in the cathedral. The type of music we
are doing calls for a real dedication to the glory of the master and that’s why it’s going to
be in the cathedral.
Rosetta: I’ll keep pushing away and hope you can attend these concerts because they are
terrific. Tomorrow is our history lesson again with Dr. Michael Malone and Dr. Richard
Rader and it’s the Copper Kings tomorrow, and I know many of you will be very
interested in that. I certainly am and I’ haven’t met these two gentlemen; you’ve met
them and I haven’t, and tomorrow’s our history lesson so do be with us tomorrow and
call in your comments and whatever you know about the Copper Kings or that era of
time. It’s been sort of different today. Tomorrow it will be even more different and we’ll
see you then. Bye-bye.
(End of Interview)
Beginning of Interview
21
Well today, we’re going to have music. We’re going to have our Helena Symphony with
us today. Well, not the entire, yes we are, Dick. Dick Shackelford is down to bring us
the symphony. We are going to have the symphony with us today.
Dick: Oh, the whole bunch. We’ve got them all in your little tiny studio.
Rosetta: Yep.
Dick: All 50 of us.
Rosetta: All 50 are right here and you’re going to hear, with their instruments, and
you’re going to hear music if you can’t envision this, listen, and we do have them on
tape. We have excerpts. And that’s what our program is today, music, and I think you’ll
like it. It will be kind of relaxing. We’ve been having some rather fast paced programs
so this will be relaxing and I hope you enjoy today’s program. We’re going to have
Scooter Scoop, you see we were just sitting here chatting away about something. I was
making my Scooter Scoop announcements and I, we’re going to talk about the symphony
today and I had a call this morning from Irene Reynolds telling me about the Symphony
Guild and Saturday night is the concert and there will be a display, an art display in the
hall, or foyer…
Dick: Foyer.
Rosetta: And they will be original prints, watercolors and paintings by Mrs. Glen Drake
and her daughter, Leslie.
Dick: Leslie.
Rosetta: And then Shirley Bentley will have some things on display, so take time out
while you’re visiting there to see those things. Now what are you going to tell us about
the symphony today, Dick?
Dick: Oh, let’s see. My goodness. We’ve had many, many rehearsals. We had a
rehearsal last evening, in fact, and we’re getting to the point where it’s starting to feel
very comfortable, you know. The music is, still a few rough spots yet, we have one more
rehearsal before the concert. In a community orchestra what we attempt to do, or what I
attempt to do, is reach the peak at the concert. And sometimes I miss and…
Rosetta: Well then is that true when they say a bad dress rehearsal for a, does this hold
true for musicians, the bad dress rehearsal for a play that means a good performance?
(Laughter)
Dick: I think that’s a superstition. I don’t go along with that.
Rosetta: It has to be a superstition.
22
Dick: Yeah. I would prefer to think that if you do have a good rehearsal, sometimes you
can have a bad concert because you can become over confident. But what is happening,
and this is only the state of the mind, that you can, well, you can get yourself all messed
up by becoming over confident. If you think, well, gee, I know this backwards and
forwards, I don’t need to concentrate here at this point, and this is really never true. If
you were going to do something, you know this could apply to just about anything, like
the potter who’s spinning his wheel and he thinks well, by golly, I’ve got this really
sacked, I can spin this old pot out just any old time, and that’s when he finds that his
work is somehow lost some very special quality. And it’s the same in any art form, in
fact, even in reading or something, if you think you know something really well and you
sit down to read it, that’s when the mistakes are made when we stop concentrating. And
this is the deal about the good dress rehearsal/bad performance, bad dress rehearsal/good
performance. If you have a bad dress rehearsal everybody is so frightened they have to
concentrate and (Laughter) you know, they’re just waiting for something to happen. And
we’ve been having good rehearsals and attendance at rehearsals has been quite good. As
I mentioned before the last time, I have many new musicians in town and the ones who
have been the regulars for several years, so the orchestra has been becoming a unit, a
lovely unit. It’s not just 40 some odd people sitting down on the stage all playing the
same thing. It’s becoming an expressive vehicle and, well, this first concert is extremely
ambitious and I always wonder after I’ve picked the music and we start to work on it, I
wonder, golly, whiz, fella, you know, what are you doing? This is pretty tough. It’s
tough music. It’s very effective, it’s very emotional, it’s got ups, downs, middles,
sweeping sections that, you know, people are just going to get goose bumps if they can
really immerse themselves in what’s going on on the stage and watch what’s happening
and it can be very, very exciting, it really can.
Rosetta: Well, we’re going to hear things. We’re not going to hear this concert. These
are, the tapes that you brought down for today are not from the music that we’ll hear
Saturday night.
Dick: No, no. I had hoped maybe I could do that but I didn’t have time to set up some
equipment.
Rosetta: Well, I don’t know that you should do that. I think that they should come and
hear it at the concert.
Dick: Well, I think it will be a surprise for many. You get a community of 27,000 or
30,000, or whatever the Helena area population is, and you wonder, gee how can they
have a symphony at all? And there is a symphony and they are playing and there are
some great things happening. And they’re doing the work, you know, they’re having to
go home and practice their music and this type of thing. So it’s not just a one or two
night deal, they have to have their music ready. What I brought is some selections from
last year’s program. The first one on the tape is the finale from the Beethoven Emperor
Concerto, the one in E flat major, which we had a guest here for a whole week, Stephen
Bartas, from Texas, did a beautiful job for us and I learned a great deal from him in
23
conducting concertos and he was such a lovely man. He would stop the piano, you know,
and kind of pull on my shirt tail and “could I say something to the orchestra?” and I
would say, oh, yes, please, please do. And he would explain, you know, a little more
about Beethoven, a little more about concertos, a little more about the piano.
Rosetta: I met him.
Dick: Yes, you did.
Rosetta: He was on, in fact, he was on this program, wasn’t he?
Dick: He certainly was.
Rosetta: I remember him.
Dick: He was a lovely man and boy does he play piano, my goodness. And he put in a
fantastic week, a whole week.
Rosetta: He wore black paten shoes, I remember, and then I stepped on his foot. And he
had on those beautiful black paten leather shoes. Isn’t that funny, the things you
remember about people. I remember that he was gifted and talented, but I remember
those black paten leather shoes and I said, oh, you have such beautiful shoes, I stepped on
his foot.
Dick: He didn’t mind a bit.
Rosetta: No, he was very nice.
Dick: He said, that’s the nicest lady who’s ever stepped on my foot. (Laughter) No, he
didn’t tell me that really. But anyway.
Rosetta: Oh, I remember him well.
Dick: But, let’s see, anyway. Emperor, we could probably just roll it if you want to.
Rosetta: Okay. Let’s do it.
(Music)
Rosetta: I feel like there should be applause. Like I should clap. I want to clap.
Tremendous. Oh, we could clap, sure. I know people, when they turn this in, or tune this
in, I wonder if they wonder if they’re really listening to Helena musicians.
Dick: It really is. I heard some of the mistakes that we made. (Laughter)
Rosetta: And that, the guest artist was Stephan Bartas, a former Helena man, isn’t he?
24
Dick: Right. He taught at Carroll College for two or three years or four, I think it was
four. In the late ‘40s he came over from Hungary, just barely got out of, I think it was
either Austria or Hungary, or somewhere in there, before Hitler got in, and came over
here.
Rosetta: Heavy accent still, doesn’t he? When I hear him play it makes me want to go
home and beat Ann, you know we have hundreds of dollars in this girl for her music, and
I guess for her age and her background and as much practice time as she puts in, you
know, she’s doing okay, but something like that is fantastic. Al, we have to take a break
and do something that … (tape is cut).
Al: She said is that Helena Symphony Orchestra, I said yes, she said, wow, they’re
terrific.
Rosetta: That’s exactly what, see?
Dick: Thank you. Thank you for that. That’s lovely.
Rosetta: Isn’t that lovely? I said that. I’ve said that in the past. You can’t believe it
until you sit down or go to one of these concerts and listen to it, you don’t believe they’re
Helena people. I find myself thinking, I’m not really in Helena, Montana, you know,
they’re not putting out that kind of music. You’re great. It’s an absolutely great
orchestra and you’re a great conductor, Dick.
Dick: Oh, well, thank you.
Rosetta: You’re welcome. Let’s have some more music.
(Music)
Rosetta: We didn’t say, we didn’t say what it was or who was involved.
Dick: Oh my, but it sure was goose pimply. That was from the Poulenc Gloria that we
did last Christmas. The soloist was Joanna Lester Severs. A beautiful, beautiful vocal
voice. The instrument that she was given is really something. She’ll be coming for our
Christmas concert to do our soprano solos, the Messiah.
Rosetta: And she’s so entertaining to watch, she’s so beautiful. She’s beautiful to look at
and sings, and then when she opens her mouth.
Dick: Lovely to work with, very, very cooperative, and you know, it becomes a team
effort. And this is the way Mr. Bartas was, too. He was just, well, he was a member of
the team, “cause you know, a concerto is not just a man playing a solo, it’s everything all
together, doing everything together as an orchestra, as a group,” and it’s the same with
Joanna, you know, she feels the same way, it has to go that way.
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Rosetta: We’re going to hurry along, Dick, because we have quite a few things we want
to listen to this morning, and we want to give, we want them all, because our friend and
your friend, everyone, Les Liedle from Valtron Recording Studios, did these cuts for us,
especially for this program, and I want them all to be on, and (Laughter).
Dick: Did you hear that, Les? Yes, I know you did.
Rosetta: You, bless his heart, for doing this. Al, we better take…
Dick: He listens every morning, right.
Rosetta: He’s a doll. I just adore Les. Let’s get the next one, Dick.
Dick: Oh, from our Pops concert last year we have a little Mancini number, about a
minute and 50 seconds of Charade.
(Music)
Dick: Well, that was Charade. (clears throat) Excuse me. We were just chatting in here
as the music was going on. Many, many people assume that a Pops is an easy thing to
put together. And the problem involved is that Pop music is as hard or harder than much
of your, well, what I’ll call your serious literature. And so you have to go into it with a
little bit different frame of mind. You can’t slough it off, you have to approach it with
the same weight or the same brevity that you would approach a Beethoven concerto or a
Poulenc gloria, this type of a thing, you just can’t be tossed off. The next one to listen to
is from the Electrum I concert that we played last year in October on October 6, and this
is the finale from The King and I.
(Music)
Rosetta: That’s one of my favorites, the finale in The King and I, one of my very
favorites. I still see Yul Brenner when I…
Dick: (singing) Shall we dance, ba ba ba.
Rosetta: Yes. I still see that. We are listening to Mr. Richard Shackelford who is the
Helena Symphony Orchestra conductor, and we’re listening to excerpts from last year’s
performances, and on Saturday night is the concert coming up at the junior high and
everyone can attend because you can buy family memberships, which is really the most
economical way to go, or you can buy tickets at the door for each of the concerts.
(question is not on tape)
Dick: We may record and preserve for posterity, I suppose, the recording and a member
of the chorale or the orchestra, by individual requests can purchase it, but we cannot, as I
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understand it, sell them for profit. In other words, whatever the cost of Mr. Liedle’s time
and so on, I think he can do it, but I’m not sure, and so they would need to call Les Liedle
at Valtron to assure themselves of the recording. I think they could probably get one.
Like I say, I’m not sure. One would have to call Mr. Liedle at Valtron Recording Studios
to find out, I think the legal ramifications more than anything else because the music is
not in public domain and this has to do with copyright laws and this type of a thing. I
wish I knew the answer to that one. That’s a little tricky.
Rosetta: Are we ready for the biggee?
Dick: Well, I thought maybe we could talk about what we’re going to do this weekend.
Rosetta: I can’t stand it. I want to hear it. (Laughter) My favorite.
Dick: Rhapsody in Blue is the next one up.
Rosetta: Rhapsody in Blue.
Dick: She’s champing at the bit to hear it. So am I. Bud Brown, whom we have in, well,
we’ll talk about him in just a minute, because what I have to say about Bud takes a long
time. He’s such a great musician and a great individual to work with. Today I brought
down a baton. Sometimes I call it a stick because if I stick somebody with it I call it a
stick and if I’m conducting with it I call it a baton. But in any case it’s a …
Rosetta: You conduct, Dick, like I expect a conductor to conduct. You get excited in the
spots that are excitable and then you just kind of move a little bit in the stuff (Laughter).
You know people watch the conductor from the back, you’re aware of all these eyes on
your back. Does that bother you?
Dick: No. If I became aware of that I think I’d probably quit because I probably look
terrible from behind, I don’t know (Laughter).
Rosetta: No, you look….No, your behind is just fine (Laughter). Up there conducting,
well, conductors are watched, you know that.
Dick: That’s true. I don’t know, I probably have some habits that many other conductors
would say, you know maybe you shouldn’t do that. But music to me is very exciting and
being involved, and the attempt that we make is to include the listener somehow, not just
by sight, but somehow if they can immerse themselves in the sound, the colorations, the
various things. For example, in the concert this weekend, we open the concert with the
Egmont overture, which is one of Beethoven’s, not lesser works, but it’s one of his works
that he did for a play based on the Duke of Egmont, or the Duke of something, I can’t
remember now for sure, and it is kind of program music and there are fantastic horn calls
in it. And the horn section we have now is probably one of the most brilliant sections
(clears throat), excuse me, that we’ve ever had, plus trombones, we have a brass section
that is just gorgeous, and then we go on to the Shahrazad, and, or no, the Brahms
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Symphony No. 1. And then we finish out the program with the Shahrazad, which is just
gorgeous, absolutely gorgeous. But this baton that I brought down and wanted to say
something about was the first baton that I ever conducted with at a (clears throat) excuse
me, summer camp back in 1962 when I had just graduated from high school, and it was
given to me by a Mr. Gene Andre, who as many of you may not know, was the founder
of the Helena Symphony Orchestra. He was the first conductor, he got it organized, and
brought people over from Missoula to kind of fill the gaps in the section here. Got the
whole thing begun and he autographed this stick for me and I have, it just holds a very
special place in my heart. I think he would be proud of what he began here, and the man
himself holds a very special place in my heart. I will be using this stick for the concert
and have been using it for rehearsal, not that the stick has any magic, except in my heart.
Rosetta: Yeah. You always say things so eloquently.
Dick: (Laughter.)
Rosetta: You do. Now, you want to announce it?
Dick: I would love to. As I look at the clock here. Okay. The first thing I would like to
do, I really publicly want to thank several people. One is our symphony board members
for all of the effort and the work that they have put in, Les Liedle, especially for putting
this thing together so that we could bring the music to you, and also for recording our
concerts, otherwise it would be possible that we could bring the Helena Symphony music
to you over the air. And Bud Brown did a beautiful job on Rhapsody in Blue. He was
excellent. He’s really what you call a team member of an orchestra. He really, he works,
the man is just a marvelous musician and this last section is the conclusion of the
Gershwin Rhapsody in Blue.
(Music)
Rosetta: I just love it.
Dick: He did a beautiful job, didn’t he?
Rosetta: I just love it. I’m going to say it, Dick, all throughout the program today Al has
been taking calls from listeners who have been complimenting the orchestra, are
somewhat aghast that this really is, these really are our Helena people and complimenting
you. And even one of your members of the symphony called to say how great you were
to work with. And I’m going to say that because too often we hear things that aren’t
right. What?
Al: One minute left and 30 seconds for Crane’s out of that.
Rosetta: Oh, I see.
Al: Fifteen seconds, say good-bye Rosie.
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Rosetta: Well, I’m going to say thank you to Dick Shackelford for coming down and
we’ll just simply say good-bye. Be at the concert on Saturday night, right Dick?
Dick: Right. Hope you can be there.
Rosetta: Helena Junior High School.
Dick: Helena Junior High School, 8 p.m.
Rosetta: 8 p.m. Be there.
Dick: Three year olds can come, you bet.
Rosetta: We’ve had calls if they can bring children. Yes, bring your children, that’s how
they learn about music is to attend these. They don’t bother you.
Dick: No, they don’t bother me. In fact if they get exposed to music at that age then
they’re going to like music as they get older.
Rosetta: This morning has been Mr. Richard Shackelford, conductor of our Helena
Symphony Orchestra, and it has been our Helena Symphony people playing for your
pleasure this morning and again I want to thank Les Liedle from Valtron Recording
Studios for putting this program together for us today and all those involved and
tomorrow we’re going to have our two professors with us, Dr. Mike Malone and Dr.
Richard Rader and we’ll see you then. Bye-bye.