What we call the 'Stroller Wars' have been going on in our neighborhood for years.

There are lots and lots of children here.

Most of the businesses are in 19th and early 20th century buildings. Retail spaces and restaurants are not large.

Many families favor the style of stroller that can be described as 'Baby's First Hummer'. There simply isn't room for them in many places.

If you live in the suburbs, you can drive your car to a restaurant and carry baby in.If you live in the city, you use your stroller and walk/subway/bus to where you are going. Then what do you do with the stroller once you get there? I would hope you could fold it up and stow it out of the way.

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And that is the reason I always had one of those umbrella style strollers that can be folded up really small in addition to a larger more roomy one. I do think it is SS to assume that every place you go to can accomodate your desire to have a massive sized stroller.

This reminds me of something that happened a couple years ago, in a store in my hometown. Details are fuzzy, but a customer had gone in, with her double-wide stroller, and was asked to leave, as the store (independently owned, not a chain) had a policy that didn't allow strollers. THe store sells arts and crafts, and other things of that nature, many of which are fragile. Customer then wrote in to the local paper, essentially crying discrimination and so on, simply because the stroller wasn't allowed an she was asked to leave. It turned into a huge bruhaha, I thought the owner was reasonable in his explanation, and stroller mom a bit of an SS.

... This reminds me of something that happened a couple years ago, in a store in my hometown. Details are fuzzy, but a customer had gone in, with her double-wide stroller, and was asked to leave, as the store (independently owned, not a chain) had a policy that didn't allow strollers. THe store sells arts and crafts, and other things of that nature, many of which are fragile. Customer then wrote in to the local paper, essentially crying discrimination and so on, simply because the stroller wasn't allowed an she was asked to leave. It turned into a huge bruhaha, I thought the owner was reasonable in his explanation, and stroller mom a bit of an SS.

She obviously told her story in the newspaper to solicit community support for her position (and probably to "punish" the store owner as well). I'm interested to know whether people did sympathize with her as she was expecting to happen, or did they tend to take the owner's side?

We visited the Georgia aquarium a few times, and there are certain exhibits that can't have strollers in them because of the way the floors and exhibits are. I have witnessed more than a few SS parents throwing tantrums when they try to bring large strollers in anyway.

... This reminds me of something that happened a couple years ago, in a store in my hometown. Details are fuzzy, but a customer had gone in, with her double-wide stroller, and was asked to leave, as the store (independently owned, not a chain) had a policy that didn't allow strollers. THe store sells arts and crafts, and other things of that nature, many of which are fragile. Customer then wrote in to the local paper, essentially crying discrimination and so on, simply because the stroller wasn't allowed an she was asked to leave. It turned into a huge bruhaha, I thought the owner was reasonable in his explanation, and stroller mom a bit of an SS.

She obviously told her story in the newspaper to solicit community support for her position (and probably to "punish" the store owner as well). I'm interested to know whether people did sympathize with her as she was expecting to happen, or did they tend to take the owner's side?

A little of both, actually. Predictably, most of those on her side were parents with small kids who also felt they should be allowed to go whereever they wanted, with their giant strollers Not saying all parents are like that, as they aren't but those who commented gave that impression.

Many others, however, were on the side of the store owners. Who by the way, also received some rather nasty phone calls, threatening him, and saying horrible things about his s*xual orientation, because he is gay.

What got me, and lost any sympathy i might have had for her, was her comparison to wheelchairs, in that the store allows wheelchairs in, and her double wide stroller was no larger than a wheelchair. To me, they are not the same, and if the owner chooses to forbid strollers in his store, then that's his right an dchoice.

But the other issue was the child apparently was grabbing for things as she wheeled him/them around, and the owner was afraid that some of his merchandise might get broken.

We visited the Georgia aquarium a few times, and there are certain exhibits that can't have strollers in them because of the way the floors and exhibits are. I have witnessed more than a few SS parents throwing tantrums when they try to bring large strollers in anyway.

Sigh. Our local aquarium doesn't allow strollers inside at all, and while I understand their reasoning to some extent (crowds, moving sidewalks, etc) it does make the whole experience much less friendly for a family with small kids. It's huge, there's a lot of walking, and even my three year old is in some danger of being stepped on essentially all the time. We still go, but we can't go without at least two adults, only in very early hours, and are constantly juggling both the 25-pound turkey that masquerades as our son, plus the bag o' prepared-ness. I wish there were a more balanced solution.

We visited the Georgia aquarium a few times, and there are certain exhibits that can't have strollers in them because of the way the floors and exhibits are. I have witnessed more than a few SS parents throwing tantrums when they try to bring large strollers in anyway.

Sigh. Our local aquarium doesn't allow strollers inside at all, and while I understand their reasoning to some extent (crowds, moving sidewalks, etc) it does make the whole experience much less friendly for a family with small kids. It's huge, there's a lot of walking, and even my three year old is in some danger of being stepped on essentially all the time. We still go, but we can't go without at least two adults, only in very early hours, and are constantly juggling both the 25-pound turkey that masquerades as our son, plus the bag o' prepared-ness. I wish there were a more balanced solution.

There is. Cultural Institutions like that should be providing sturdy Umbrella type strollers that never see out doors and/or having times that are billed as stroller friendly, so that folks who need them know that they can have access and folks who don't want to risk it can stay away...they can balance it by having adult only times that are not fundraisers. But under no circumstances should a cultural institution be making it significantly less ( or more) accessible for one particular demographic.

We visited the Georgia aquarium a few times, and there are certain exhibits that can't have strollers in them because of the way the floors and exhibits are. I have witnessed more than a few SS parents throwing tantrums when they try to bring large strollers in anyway.

The National Aquarium in Baltimore doesn't allow them either but they will loan out carriers that you can wear on the front or back. I saw people using them when I was there. I had brought my moby wrap and well, while there I discovered it was no longer really all that useful. It was great when he was little but like Snowdragon's child, he's about 25lbs and by the end of the day my shoulders were killing me and he was tired but either overstimulated or uncomfortable (or both) to fall asleep in the wrap.

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Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself. You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars. You have a right to be here. Be cheerful, strive to be happy. -Desiderata

My ex-mother in law was a slightly nervous flyer. When my ex graduated college she took him on a tour of the far East, and the visited Hong Kong, flying into the old airport, the one in the centre of the city that you had to dodge tower blocks to fly into. She said as they were on final approach, she looked out of the window, into an apartment block window, and saw someone doing their ironing. This was not made any easier by the news that the best pilots got to choose their routes, and never chose Hong Kong as it was so tricky. So the trickiest landing was being done by the worst pilots!

It's too late to matter, but it's not true that the trickiest landing was done by the worst pilots. The airlines were pretty careful to make sure that only skilled pilots flew in and out of Kai-tak (the old Hong Kong airport); the most senior on some airlines might get to go elsewhere, but the airlines don't want crashes either. Even if they had no humanitarian or publicity concerns, airplanes are expensive.

I am glad I got to fly in and out of Kai-tak once (a year before it closed), but that was definitely a "you will love it or hate it" approach.

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Any advice that requires the use of a time machine may safely be ignored.

I was riding with a coworker who opened the car window and tossed out his fast food wrappers. Stunned, I said, "You just threw a bunch of trash on the highway ". He replied, "What was I supposed to do -- leave it in my car?"

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It takes two people to play tug of war. If you don't want to play, don't pick up the rope.

I often want to snarl at drivers whom I see tapping their cigarette ash out of their cars' windows. I feel like saying "You don't want it in your car? I don't want it on my road." And don't get me started about people who just toss their cigarette butts onto the ground.

My ex-mother in law was a slightly nervous flyer. When my ex graduated college she took him on a tour of the far East, and the visited Hong Kong, flying into the old airport, the one in the centre of the city that you had to dodge tower blocks to fly into. She said as they were on final approach, she looked out of the window, into an apartment block window, and saw someone doing their ironing. This was not made any easier by the news that the best pilots got to choose their routes, and never chose Hong Kong as it was so tricky. So the trickiest landing was being done by the worst pilots!

It's too late to matter, but it's not true that the trickiest landing was done by the worst pilots. The airlines were pretty careful to make sure that only skilled pilots flew in and out of Kai-tak (the old Hong Kong airport); the most senior on some airlines might get to go elsewhere, but the airlines don't want crashes either. Even if they had no humanitarian or publicity concerns, airplanes are expensive.

I am glad I got to fly in and out of Kai-tak once (a year before it closed), but that was definitely a "you will love it or hate it" approach.

I'd heard (strictly second-hand) that the old Hong Kong airport in fact had an excellent safety record. It was notorious as a horror to fly into and out of, so pilots doing so, were extremely careful and attentive...

What we call the 'Stroller Wars' have been going on in our neighborhood for years.

There are lots and lots of children here.

Most of the businesses are in 19th and early 20th century buildings. Retail spaces and restaurants are not large.

Many families favor the style of stroller that can be described as 'Baby's First Hummer'. There simply isn't room for them in many places.

If you live in the suburbs, you can drive your car to a restaurant and carry baby in.If you live in the city, you use your stroller and walk/subway/bus to where you are going. Then what do you do with the stroller once you get there? I would hope you could fold it up and stow it out of the way.

[/b]

And that is the reason I always had one of those umbrella style strollers that can be folded up really small in addition to a larger more roomy one. I do think it is SS to assume that every place you go to can accomodate your desire to have a massive sized stroller.

I had two strollers, the big one with the large wheels which was great for outdoor events (we do renaissance faires) that could handle gravel, tree roots, uneven terrain. Then I had the umbrella one for things like the mall.

We visited the Georgia aquarium a few times, and there are certain exhibits that can't have strollers in them because of the way the floors and exhibits are. I have witnessed more than a few SS parents throwing tantrums when they try to bring large strollers in anyway.

Sigh. Our local aquarium doesn't allow strollers inside at all, and while I understand their reasoning to some extent (crowds, moving sidewalks, etc) it does make the whole experience much less friendly for a family with small kids. It's huge, there's a lot of walking, and even my three year old is in some danger of being stepped on essentially all the time. We still go, but we can't go without at least two adults, only in very early hours, and are constantly juggling both the 25-pound turkey that masquerades as our son, plus the bag o' prepared-ness. I wish there were a more balanced solution.

There is. Cultural Institutions like that should be providing sturdy Umbrella type strollers that never see out doors and/or having times that are billed as stroller friendly, so that folks who need them know that they can have access and folks who don't want to risk it can stay away...they can balance it by having adult only times that are not fundraisers. But under no circumstances should a cultural institution be making it significantly less ( or more) accessible for one particular demographic.

Thanks Snowdragon, I hadn't thought of some of those but I really think something like "stroller-friendly" hours is a reasonable compromise. Your post prompted me to send feedback to the aquarium (it's actually the National Aquarium in Baltimore that Piratelvr1121 mentioned). The most annoying thing is that they have a whole thing on their FAQs about how they "understand" strollers are important to families but, well, it's just such as SAFETY issue because of the building's layout.

And then right underneath that a paragraph about how the Washington location (the two are affiliated) does allow strollers!

Um. The Baltimore venue was renovated much more recently than the Washington location, so if layout was SUCH an issue why wasn't it rectified then, plus if it's a safety concern then it's a safety concern in DC, too, right?

I'd heard (strictly second-hand) that the old Hong Kong airport in fact had an excellent safety record. It was notorious as a horror to fly into and out of, so pilots doing so, were extremely careful and attentive...