okay having a really bad day so my head is muddled so hope i can say what i want to say....

you know how in MC or even IC, there's all this damm non-judgemental stuff going on. Like looking at relationship dynamics, communication, his needs/her needs. For ONCE, i'd like like one of these professionals to just Lay Blame!

I almost need it for validation. Sure, I'm not perfect, but I am a good human being, and he's not.

I wish someone else besides me who knows him would say that!!!

Dammit.

Me BS 49, ExWS: narcissist! Jekyll Hyde. Left in secret early July, moved states. Left home, job, whole life behind and difficult** adjusting. Dog injured and too much to handle. Supremely bummed out.

Posts: 557 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: theagonyofit

SummerStorm21♀ 41320Member # 41320

Posted: 5:42 PM, December 13th (Friday), 2013

Do you belong to a church? Ours told it like it is. Helped me a lot at the beginning. Not so much anymore.

BW

Posts: 112 | Registered: Nov 2013

TheAgonyOfIt♀ 39114Member # 39114

Posted: 5:47 PM, December 13th (Friday), 2013

That's the thing with religion. Pretty clear on right and wrong. Psychology, not so much. It's maddening!

Because while I understand dynamics, and accept my part in them, some things are, well, just wrong.

Me BS 49, ExWS: narcissist! Jekyll Hyde. Left in secret early July, moved states. Left home, job, whole life behind and difficult** adjusting. Dog injured and too much to handle. Supremely bummed out.

Posts: 557 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: theagonyofit

Fireflies♀ 40210Member # 40210

Posted: 5:58 PM, December 13th (Friday), 2013

I've ranted about this a few times on here I'm right there with you.

Me: BS
Him: WS
Go your way,
I'll take the long way 'round,
I'll find my own way down,
As I should.

Posts: 83 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: Grr Argh

Dreamland♀ 40488Member # 40488

Posted: 6:07 PM, December 13th (Friday), 2013

Yes my MC started telling me that I need to let go of it. That he cheated and he is sorry so to accept it and move on.. How can I move on if I am the one who told that bitch to leave my h alone. And because of legal issue when he had the opportunity to send the NC letter he didn't. Then afterwards he could not because of legal issues. He has not done one thing to make things better yet she tells me I need to decide if I want my marriage or not. Well now I can't decide until he does his work which was laid out to him.
Ugh I hate those MC

I liked our MC/IC... I still "like" her... and she helped. I guess she was not an infidelity specialist, 'cause she kept advising me "not to ask questions for which the answers would hurt me" --- ummmm, so that would be like, ANY of them. Is there a question I could ask that wouldn't hurt? I digress...

She was very "compassionate" and "kind". That was "nice" for a while, but yes, my waffling WH needed a few 2x4s (and I couldn't get him on this site!). So I provided some tough love from Linda MacDonald -- "How to Help Your Spouse" and "Who Will You Become". That worked much more effectively.

Just started with a new MC/IC last week. My kids all go to see him next week. I am really hoping that we're finally with someone who will be a little tougher.

Blame isn't an issue for us, but it's crystal clear that my W had to take responsibility for her actions. The few times I started to blame myself for W's A, our MC stopped me - the A was my W's responsibility.

Even now, I bet 90% of MC's confrontations are aimed at my W.

Look for a new MC - or do you really need a lawyer?

fBH (me) - 70 (22 in my head), fWW (plainsong) - 70 (22 in my head), Married 45+, together since 1965, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
I'm not an exemplar. I share my own experience because it's all I know.

Posts: 11875 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: Chicago area

Skan♀ 35812Member # 35812

Posted: 4:41 PM, December 14th (Saturday), 2013

Interesting insight, SummerStorm21. Our MC was also a pastor and FWHs IC is as well (two different faiths). And our MC was VERY upfront that the A had to be dealt with and acknowledged before any of the other issues had a chance of being heard.

Imagine a ship trying to set sail while towing an anchor. Cutting free is not a gift to the anchor. You must release that burden, not because the anchor is worthy, but because the ship is.

D-Day, June 10, 2012

Posts: 6086 | Registered: Jun 2012 | From: So California

Ascendant♂ 38303Member # 38303

Posted: 5:12 PM, December 14th (Saturday), 2013

I was sort of in the same boat as well. I felt like our MC would have done a really, really good job as an MC in a non-infidelity situation where the problems were just one of non-communication or poor communication. She was really nice, and affirming, to both of us at a time when I really wanted her to 2 x 4 my wife. It took a while for me to kind of 'get' the idea that MC are *generally* going to be nice to both people. I definitely charged in with my thoughts and ideas all revved up by this site and expected much the same. I mean, overall I found MC to be helpful, but after we reached a certain point our MC decided that we had progressed as far as we could until my wife had some serious IC on her own.

Me: 31 Her: 30

"Now I know that's contradiction, wants and needs in competition/But it's hard to stay on point with such extremes in opposition."

Still married.

Posts: 3911 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: North of Chicago, Illinois

katmandude5435992Member # 35992

Posted: 5:43 PM, December 14th (Saturday), 2013

My IC told me that if I wanted to stay in the marriage that I needed to be Ok with what she did and tell her it was OK to go out with other guys while still married to me.
Needless to say, I'm with a different counselor now.

If at first you don't succeed, you're probably screwed.

Posts: 39 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: FLORIDA

Blobette♀ 36519Member # 36519

Posted: 8:39 PM, December 14th (Saturday), 2013

We've seen three different MCs. The first was a crisis intervention, 3 days post DD, saw him once. I'll never forget him saying to WH, "99% of cheaters want to 'move on' and 99% of the betrayed want to talk about the A. I'm telling you you can't move on unless you deal with the A.". (I'm sure he didn't use those words, but that was the gist of it.). the next one we saw was great, and really raked WH over the coals re empathy and his selfishness. The one we're seeing now pretty much tells WH that he did a terrible thing and we need to figure out how to go from there. It's kind of a given that WH did a shitty thing -- which, at this stage, WH totally admits. And these are all secular types...

Can't address the MC issue, but remember, an IC is a health professional, and she has a patient.

Her job is to help that patient. Diagnosis him if necessary, but not to save the marriage, find justice, cure your relationship problems... Only to make the patient "better", for some definition of better. And not perfect, just better.

I suppose, for an MC, it's the marriage that is the patient, and some of them think that means everyone has to compromise, even if the compromise (like rugsweeping) is unhealthy.

If you find one of those, run. You're just postponing the inevitable, and making it worse in the long run. You don't fix a marriage by patching over it. You have to mend the broken parts first.

But what do I know? I never got the chance to R. I do read a lot on SI though...

Take care of yourself. There's a great future out there. It won't come to you; you have to go to it.

Posts: 5315 | Registered: Mar 2009 | From: DeepInTheHeartOf, TX

seenow♀ 40720Member # 40720

Posted: 9:19 PM, December 14th (Saturday), 2013

I had one of those Agony. They just focus on communication. How to make the other person feel OK with what you say and how you say it. It's their bubble of expertise. IMHO they do not deal with trauma. Find one who does.

I am tired of it too. We worked on communications skills to death. Too bad I was the only one trying to communicate. In order for communication to work you both have to talk. I quit MC because we NEVER talked about the affair unless I got fed up and started the conversation about it. H still goes if he feels like it. I guess they just stare at each other for 50 minutes Maybe he is trying to convince the counselor that he is a good guy, who cares. It was a waste of time for me. Maybe I will try later with a different counselor.

Posts: 77 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: CA

momoffive♀ 27352Member # 27352

Posted: 7:15 AM, December 15th (Sunday), 2013

I'm so tired of the "let's be gentle with SAWH" approach as well. Wondered if all IC/MC are like that. Read "When He Says I Don't Love You Anymore" by David Clarke. Now that's a MC I'd like to see. Read his web page. Too bad we're in PA and he's in Florida.

We see a Christian counselor. He was very upfront with my husband that he had to do the work, that the affair was on him, that he needed to change, that we needed to deal with the affair, and that all of that had to occur
BEFORE we addressed problems in the marriage.

I went to MC with my DDís dad, and he refused to even admit that he cheated. After multiple full sessions (that we paid for) where I presented evidence over and over again and he just sat there like an idiot denying, our MC looked at me and said, ďLook, does it really matter if he cheated or not? At the end of the day, whether or not he admits to cheating, you need to accept what happened in your relationship and decide if what he did is forgivable or not.Ē

I was so mad. I looked at her and said, ďAre the two of you listening to yourselves? I donít know why I would spend one more minute in here listening to this. If he canít tell me what all he did, I canít forgive him. First of all, I need to know exactly WHAT I am forgiving, and second of all, I canít forgive someone who is not changing his behavior. If he is continuing to lie, sneak around, cover his tracks, and deny, that tells me that he is not sorry, not remorseful, and not willing to improve his behavior and respect me.

After that, and some other things that happened in that MC session, I walked out and refused to go back. Never, ever have I participated in such a waste of time and money. Even with current H now- I say I want to go to MC, but we never go. He doesn't want to go, but deep down, I have a lot of hesitations and anxiety about ever doing that again.

Sometimes, I wish the MC would stand on a chair and point to the WS and yell, "THIS IS YOUR FAULT! YOU'RE AN IDIOT!"

I have been cheated on by 3 different men, and I have more DDays than anyone ever should. I am here, just trying to pickup the pieces.