Poles to the right of Jarosław Kaczyński

WARSAW — Poland’s youthful ultra-nationalists helped Law and Justice (PiS) take power last year. Their growing self-assurance and belligerence now threatens to turn them from useful allies to rivals.

PiS has turned a blind eye to the activities of the likes of the All-Polish Youth and the National Radical Camp (ONR) — which were banned for decades before the fall of communism in 1989 — to the dismay of mainstream parties like the Centrist opposition Civic Platform, which this week asked Poland’s prosecutor general to outlaw the ONR for propagating fascism.

The complaint from opposition MPs came in response to incidents at the reburial on August 28 of two resistance fighters murdered by the communists after the war. At the funeral, attended by the president and prime minister, hundreds of young nationalists held up smoking flares — the traditional gesture of the soccer hooligans who form a key part of the nationalist base.

Green ONR flags rippled in the background as PiS-affiliated President Andrzej Duda made his way to a Gdańsk church for the reburial mass. Nationalists booed and harassed a handful of activists from the Committee for the Defense of Democracy (KOD), a Centrist grouping that has staged anti-government street protests in recent months.

In practical terms, too, the PiS government has made it easier for the ultra-nationalists to operate, like removing ONR’s symbol from a guide to hate crimes.

Lech Wałęsa, the historic leader of the Solidarity labor union and a Nobel Peace Prize laureate, was greeted with cries of “traitor” and “death to the country’s enemies.”

Paweł Olszewski, one of the opposition MPs who filed the complaint, said such incidents were not entirely new, but previously “the response of the authorities was much more severe.”

“That changed after the [2015] parliamentary elections,” he told Onet, a news portal. “Now the actions of the ONR are treated with a wink.”

In response, Elżbieta Witek, chief of staff to Prime Minister Beata Szydło, told reporters, “Above all, I value those who are patriots.”

In last October’s parliamentary election, PiS had the support of a quarter of voters aged 18-29, much better than its past performance with that age bracket. Not all of those voters were nationalists or right-wingers, but those groupings have become part of PiS’s support base.

At the funeral, Duda praised the ultras for honoring Poland’s past, saying: “In order to be strong, in order to nurture a new generation, a country has to have heroes.” Interior Minister Mariusz Błaszczak said the presence of activists from the KOD was a “provocation.”

Polish nationalists, right wing supporters and ultra-catholic activists demonstrate to support the government | Wojtek Radwanski/AFP via Getty Images

In practical terms, too, the PiS government has made it easier for the ultra-nationalists to operate. In a review of police training materials conducted by the interior ministry in June, the ONR’s symbol — a hand gripping a sword — was removed from a guide to hate crimes.

When the ONR announced its intention to patrol the streets of the city of Łódź to “protect the Polish people against migrants,” regional governor Zbigniew Rau from the PiS defended them, saying, “If young people want to do something for the common good and they are concerned that [public] safety could be in danger, then it is the kind of capital on which we can build.”

White Catholics

Nationalist sentiment in Poland has surged thanks to a perceived lack of economic opportunity at home, resentment at often menial and unfulfilling work abroad, and widespread rejection of European Union demands for Poland to take in asylum seekers during the refugee crisis.

In response, the PiS has cultivated new national heroes — in this case, the “cursed soldiers” who resisted the Soviet-backed communist regime after the war and who have been traditionally celebrated by the far-right as embodying a bloodier tradition of national resistance.

That helps PiS discredit the traditional historic narrative that Poland regained its independence in 1989 thanks to the Solidarity labor union and tedious talks with the communist government.

Now the “cursed soldiers” have gone mainstream. The PiS government has staged commemorations, granted state funerals to fighters whose remains have been identified, organized cursed soldier “fun runs” for young patriots, and used actors to re-stage the wedding of the executed army officer Witold Pilecki.

Protesters against the right-wing government in Warsaw, in May | Wojtek Radwanski/Getty Images

But that’s created an opening for militant groups far to the right of PiS. It “allows the radical nationalists to present themselves as the representatives of all genuine Polish patriots,” said Rafał Wnuk, a historian at the Polish Academy of Humanities.

The problem for Jarosław Kaczyński, the 67-year-old leader of PiS, is that his party’s core electorate is older, pious Catholics from the poorer reaches of eastern Poland, who may have been thankful for nationalist support in last year’s parliamentary and presidential elections, but now struggle to keep up with them.

Radical young Poles embrace what Rafał Pankowski, a scholar and anti-racism campaigner based at Warsaw’s Collegium Civitas, calls “the far-right’s ethno-religious understanding of what it means to be Polish” — in other words, that true Poles are white Catholics.

OK to be different

“If you look at the football stadiums, if you look online, if you look at the streets, if you look at fashion, this kind of ‘new nationalism’ has been growing for some time,” said Pankowski.

He pointed out a sharp rise in attendance at the annual March for Independence organized by the ONR and All-Polish Youth, where marchers carried fascist symbols and demanded a “White, Catholic Europe.”

Roman Giertych, who rebuilt the All-Polish Youth in the 1990s and was an ally of PiS before breaking with the party’s leader, said that “when it comes to the politics of the street, Kaczyński recognizes them, not the liberal opposition, as the most important danger.”

For the youthful nationalists, the question of whether the ruling party is encouraging them or trying to co-opt them is less important than their ability to take control of the national narrative.

That appears to chime with the nationalists’ own view of their increasing importance. All-Polish Youth’s leader Bartosz Berk called his movement “the only group in Poland that can be active both on the streets of Polish cities and in the parliament; at universities and in the stadiums.”

Tomasz Kalinowski, a spokesman for the ONR, said “any insinuation that there is cooperation between the ONR and the government can only be treated ironically.”

“Our actions and slogans also criticize PiS. For example, we don’t like that party’s approach to Catholicism,” Kalinowski told the news portal WP.

For the youthful nationalists, the question of whether the ruling party is encouraging them or trying to co-opt them is less important than their ability to take control of the national narrative. That’s represented by honoring the “cursed soldiers” of the 1940s, who were “fighting for a Catholic Poland, not a liberal democracy,” said Krzysztof Bosak, vice president of the National Movement, a new nationalist coalition.

“We had a situation in Poland where for 20 years we were pushed to change the national culture to reach so-called ‘European standards,’” said Bosak. “But this point of view has completely collapsed — people understand that we can be different, and that’s OK.”

sewa

Sajra

Simon

Mr Bosak is certainly different. Just like all dumb nationalists, he’s further away from a homo sapiens than a baboon.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 10:37 AM CET

US Observer

Poland is reverting to its authoritarian and xenohobic roots. It is also becoming an increasingly anti-Semitic country.

Let’s not forget that the Second Polish Republic (1919-39) was all of that and worse (after the 1926 coup d’état, it essentially became a fascist regime, as Mussolini’s Italy earlier (1922) and Franco’s Spain afterwards (1936-39).

For anybody not ethnically Polish, this is a good time to avoid Poland. Take it from someone who’s lived there. I’ll go back once those right-wing punks are out of power again.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 12:15 PM CET

Beerkules

Which won’t happen soon, since they have forgotten how to think.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 1:01 PM CET

YY

Without demand no supply. If the main parties don’t deliver the need of the people, they’ll shift to parties that (partly) delivers. Even when they know the collateral damage.

This disaster is all on the hands of moderate politicians and parties who turn a blind eye to the real problems the people encounter. The Political Correct, the refugee policy, the lack of integration from enemies living amongst us, those with double passports and double standards. NOTHING they’ll truly do against those problems. Hence, the growth of National Socialism.

It is as if they are living in a bubble, wearing pink glasses, not noticing the beginning of civil war. Don’t think the attacks and rapes and discrimination against the Europeans will stop. This still can be resolved in a civil way but time is running out.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 1:07 PM CET

G

@US Observer – looks like you know nothing about Polish history. I’ve never seen such amount of lies. Shame on you.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 1:50 PM CET

US Observer

@ G

I know Polish history very well, and I have lived in the country.

Unfortunately, most Poles take a completely uncritical view of their own history, esp. with regard to Poland’s own record of anti-Semitism and xenophobia.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 2:37 PM CET

aaaaaa

US Observer: you are just a plain propaganda-parrot. Poland was so anti-semitist and xenopohobical during its history that most of Jews and other groups that were heavily discrimnated in western and northern Europe moved to Poland or neighbouring Slavic countries. Poland was so oppresive to Jews that before 2nd war about 35 % of Warsaw inhabitants had Jewish roots. The problem with Jews in Poland was that some of them started creating parallel society, like muslims currently in France, Germany and other EU countries. It was a source of conflicts between them and other (not only of Polish roots) citizens.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 3:45 PM CET

Kubanek

I am a nationalist and I consider “ONR” as a laughable organization. It has nothing to do with National-Radical Camp from 1930’s. It is National Rebirth of Poland which continues the tradition of 1930’s ONR. Secondly, there’s a lot of other small organizations, like Niklot, Zadruga, Autonomous Nationalists, Narodowcy RP and many more. Yet, nationalism is very weak in Poland, especially in comparison to Hungary (Jobbik, HVIM), Greece(Golden Dawn)or France (National Front). Even in Germany, nationalists from NPD are better organized than Polish ones.
These “nationalists” from ONR are ordinary National-Conservative-Catholic patriots, nothing more. I do not consider myself a Catholic and I see no need for Polish Nationalism to have links with Catholic Church.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 3:55 PM CET

Kubanek

US Observer, I do not understand what this “antisemitism” is about. I know Jews, whom I could consider antisemites. I distinguish between ordinary Jewish people, living in Israel or USA and International Jews, like George Soros and naturally between Jewish Communists, who are responsible for dozens of millions od death, not only in Russia or Ukraine.
Are you aware, what is the source of “Polish antisemitism”? National struggle of Polish people, under Russian, Austrian occupation. But also plenty of Communist crimes, commited by Jewish Communists, like Bauman. Bauman was a Stalinist criminal, who has never been persecuted, just like Stefan Michnik, who lives now in Sweden.
What about Communism, the most criminal ideology, ever created. Why Jews were so keen on joining this ideology of evil? Why should we stay quiet if we hear or read about Jewish Communists, who were mass murderers in 1917-1956 period?

Posted on 9/7/16 | 4:01 PM CET

Kubanek

When it comes to Second Polish Republic. We have saved Europe from Communism, in 1920. We have saved, dozens of millions of people, who would have been perished from the hands of bolshevik horde.
Only an ignorant or a communist/Marxist bastard may critisize Poland for this. Communism/Marxism is the worst, the most barbaric ideology, ever created. Responsible for more than 100 000 000 victims. At least times more than Hitler.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 4:05 PM CET

US Observer

@ Kubanek

You are repeating all the boilerplate anti-Semitic clichés that have been used not only by the Polish far-right for nearly a century, but also by the likes of Adolf Hitler. No need to say more.

The reason why a substantial number of Jews at first welcomed the Soviet Union’s takeover of Eastern Poland was that they had not been treated as equal citizens in interwar Poland (1919-39).

Posted on 9/7/16 | 4:23 PM CET

US Observer

@ Kubanek

“When it comes to Second Polish Republic. We have saved Europe from Communism, in 1920.”

No, you didn’t.

The Soviet Union’s Red Army of 1920 was the much diminuished force of the new-born Soviet state, a country in great disarray, and it had barely escaped defeat in a domestic war. It possessed nowhere near the strength of the Russian Imperial Army that had been beaten by the Central Powers (Germany and Austria-Hungary) in 1918. It would never have been able to advance into Germany (even after that country’s defeat in WWI), left alone France.

The myth of the “Miracle at the Vistula”, Poland’s narrow victory over the Red Army in 1920 in the vicinity of Warsaw, did much to make Poles believe their army was a lot stronger than it actually was and led to the miscalculations of 1939.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 4:30 PM CET

wwww

US Observer: hello propaganda parrot. Why are you so anti-Polish? Why are you racist? Why are you blaming Poles for everything like Hitler and Stalin?

Posted on 9/7/16 | 4:31 PM CET

Leszek

Since we are going to hear about ONR in the future, one minor, technical point: “camp” in ONR’s (Obóz Natodowo-Radykalny) translation to English not work in English very well. National Radical Caucus conveys the sense of Polish “obóz” as both a social environment and a gathering of like-minded people.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 4:54 PM CET

wwww

US Observer: yes, that bolshevik army was not extra-powerful, but it wasn’t have to be extra-powerful to win with Germany or France, because communist movements were very strong in those countries. For example in Germany there was strong communist party: Kommunistische Partei Deutschlands (leader of that party was a Polish-Jew, Rosa Luxemburg that moved to Germany with her parents when she was child), that party was pro-Leninist and later pro-Stalinist. Members of that party would join bolshevik army in war against Germany.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 4:55 PM CET

wwww

Sorry, she moved later, when she was teenager.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 5:01 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

The longer PiS rules, the more Poles looks like a clerical-fascist version of Putin’s Russia.

I hate to say it, but Poland was not ready for EU membership in 2004, and isn’t now. The EU was a better place without all these countries that aren’t part of western European civilisation and have difficulty accepting the common standards.

I’m not sure how anyone can dismiss this as being untrue. The Polish identity is based on being ethnically Polish and religiously Catholic.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 5:11 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

About Polish xenophobia: I have my own first hand experiences, and they are not the best ones. I never understood why there is so much hartred for foreigners in eastern Europe today, when there are virtually no foreigners at all. As a person with darker complexion, I felt very unsafe and was not treated well during my recent visit to the region.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 5:12 PM CET

Danny

I’m happy we’ll be out of this EU mess soon and shut the doors to Poles and the likes of them. Enough is enough. Let them build their own country, ours is fine the way it use to be.

Lest I forget: Thanks to Politico for reporting this. Your coverage of Poland is very informative.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 5:16 PM CET

Tom

US Observer

Interesting, but maybe we should talk about the criminal history of the United States. The violation of human rights, racism in the US and destabilizing world peace , etc .
American has no moral right to teach poles on a critical look at the history . Especially if you babbling such nonsense .

Posted on 9/7/16 | 5:29 PM CET

Tom

Jean-Philippe

“I hate to say it, but Poland was not ready for EU membership in 2004, and isn’t now.”
Agree :). And I hope we can leave EU as soon as possible like England :). Thanks to such statements as the one, in Poland anti-EU moods are growing.
Thanks 🙂

Posted on 9/7/16 | 5:37 PM CET

akul

@Jean-Philippe
Yes, we would love to say to the EU “farewell and thanks for all the fish” !

Polesky

Politicians all over the world are keen to release the Genie from the bottle – or open Pandora’s Box – for their particular and immediate gains. There is a Polish saying ‘Po nas choćby Potop’ which means ‘After us, it may be the Flood’. Jarosław Kaczyński and PiS have their political interest in ‘treating with a wink’ the present nationalist actions. But this Genie is not likely to come back to the bottle of his own will. Sooner or later the price will have to be paid.
The same applies to all of Europe, and the World, in fact.
If I may allude to ‘Lord of the Rings’ – the Dwarves had dig to deep and they have woken up Balrog …

Posted on 9/7/16 | 7:25 PM CET

marie

“…in other words, that true Poles are white Catholics”. There is so little truths in what you are insinuating. Little Davies, his father son! So you take turns with Cienski to write anti-polish assignments. Your daddy found a refuge in Poland, you were born here, obviously access to gravy train is denied “koryto” and you do not like it. Same as your esteemed daddy.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 7:29 PM CET

dfsdfds

Jean-Philippe: and how many billions French companies are making every year thanks to access to Polish market? Because for example in case of Germany, for every Euro transfered from Germany to Poland in EU founds, German companies are taking back almost that Euro back.

But, yes you could spent it better, for example you could do something to prevent you citizens from killing foreign citizens in terrorist attacks. You could also do something with your dirty cities and aggresive marchers. France with every year looks more and more like 3rd world country.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 9:19 PM CET

Tom

@Jean-Philippe

“We can spend this money better at home.”

I have no doubt about that . You have to pay for collapsing UE. You have to pay loafers immigrants from Africa who will kill you and beat you. You have to pay for protection against terrorist attacks. And most importantly you have to once again find themselves a new country to teach and guard its democracy. Your money is transmitted to that kind of “problems”.
I don’t want my country pay for the stupid policy of the EU. That is not the same Eu as that we entered.

ssss

Jebby: yes true Pole is a Pole, that’s normal, isn’it? But – except very small minority – it is not based on religion. In my company atheist are majority.

Posted on 9/7/16 | 11:28 PM CET

Patrick

“ultra nationalists” – for euro-communists everyone who love God and his Nation is ultra-mega-hiper-nationalist 😀

Posted on 9/7/16 | 11:46 PM CET

Patrick

Anyway, let’s face it – multi culti ideology and atheistic Europe is dying :/ This experiment failed and left ruins. The future is in countries like Poland or Hungary because soon French, Great Britain or Germany will become muslim kalifates with europeans as minority. Oppressed minority….

Posted on 9/7/16 | 11:54 PM CET

Roland

You read a lot about how these right wing nationalists are a threat. But lets be honest when was the last time you read about misbehaving white nationalists?

Posted on 9/8/16 | 12:03 AM CET

Joel

Shame on Poland for letting this happen.

Posted on 9/8/16 | 1:48 AM CET

bogdan

Very one sided and divisive article by Mr Davies junior. Poles need to brought together and not divided by the present political cold war. The mainstream opposition parties have lost support because they are either perceived to be implicated in corruption (Platforma/PSL) or sponsored by Soros (Nowoczesna). The PiS government is socialist not right wing as some western media would lead us to believe. Also being pro-Catholic and patriotic does not mean that others are discriminated against. The mainstream opposition and KOD appear to have nothing to offer and that is very sad as a strong opposition is fundamental to a country’s politics. ONR is a marginal grouping with minimal popular support but ironically it was a recent KOD demonstration at a patriotic funeral that made the ONR front page news. The result is (but surely not the intention) that this unconstructive anti-PiS article seems to bring the Pole haters out of the woodwork and also strengthens anti EU sentiment amongst many Poles.

Posted on 9/8/16 | 7:52 AM CET

aaaa

Jean-Philippe: have you checked how many billions your companies made thanks to those founds and open market in Poland for them? It could be much more that what your country send in EU founds.

I’m curious when civil war in France will start, or maybe French will behave like French in houellebecq books? So … like blind sheeps that are taken to the butcher.

But, yes, I agree that you could spent it much better. You could, for example, not let your citizens to kill foreigners in terrorist attacks, you could clean your dirty cities, you could do something with your violent marchers, you could defend truck drivers in Calais, and you could just defend citizens of Calais. France with every year is looking more and more like 3rd world country.

Posted on 9/8/16 | 9:07 AM CET

aaaa

Shame on politico for cenzura!

Posted on 9/8/16 | 9:57 AM CET

aaaa

Shame on politico for censorship!

Posted on 9/8/16 | 9:58 AM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ dfsdfds

“But, yes you could spent it better, for example you could do something to prevent you citizens from killing foreign citizens in terrorist attacks. You could also do something with your dirty cities and aggresive marchers. France with every year looks more and more like 3rd world country.”

´This coming from a country that is not even fully 1st world … .

Without EU funds, Poland would still be the underdeveloped dirthole that it was in 2004 and still is outside the big cities.

It wil take you a long time to look like France, and you will never be like it.

By the way, Poland picked the cherry for the worst food ever on my recent trip to the region. No comparison to Czechia or Slovakia, which have decent culinary traditions thanks to the Austrians, and to Hungary. When your food is so bad, how can you expect people to respect your culture?

Posted on 9/8/16 | 1:08 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

P.S. Two versions posted. 😉

Posted on 9/8/16 | 1:22 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ dfsdfds

“Jean-Philippe: …. You could also do something with your dirty cities and aggresive marchers. France with every year looks more and more like 3rd world country.”

You are writng this insult from Poland, right? The country which receives the most EU transfers (paid for by the French, among others) to built a first-world infrastructure? A country which was never really considered “first world” to begin with?

Well, allow me to laugh.

Posted on 9/8/16 | 3:32 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ Tom

“I don’t want my country pay for the stupid policy of the EU. That is not the same Eu as that we entered.”

Don’t worry, Poland is not paying for anything in the EU. You are the biggest net recipient of EU transfers by far, which means that we pay for your membership.

Therefore, don’t expect us to shed a tear when you leave. We’ll make good use of this money at home.

Posted on 9/8/16 | 3:36 PM CET

wi

A good and a right change is finally happening in Poland.

Posted on 9/8/16 | 4:06 PM CET

Kubanek

Jean-Philippe, I have always been against Polish entry or membership in the EU, since I’ve always considered EU as a communist organization. There is no bigger difference between EU and COMECON or Warsaw Pact. There is no freedom in EU, everything is based on Marxist-Liberal “equality” insanity. EEC from 1950’s was a pretty intelligent and decent idea. Yet, since EU was created, this organization, just like USSR does everything to kill and destroy, everything, related to Europe as a civilization, a White Man’s Civlization. USSR exterminated 50-60 millions of its own population, EU is extermination its own population, every day(through abortion for example or massive immigration).
EU will end, just like USSR, I can guarantee it.
F.. EU, f.. Marxism,

Posted on 9/8/16 | 6:10 PM CET

Josef

This text is simple manipulation – an incentive for hate speech between fascists and communists. It omits facts and real situation that happens in Poland. This text present a extreme left activist’s (or communists) point of view. It is sad that Politico is taking part in such provocation…

Posted on 9/8/16 | 7:22 PM CET

ddh

So it seems in Belgium, France, Germany, Sweden, etc. people are massacred in the streets, women sexually harassed but it doesn’t compare with “dire” situation in Poland.
What kind of joke is this ? Notwithstanding large doze of nonsense and manipulation.

Posted on 9/9/16 | 12:17 AM CET

xyz

Jean-Philippe: Then you must have been simply unlucky in your trip.

Posted on 9/9/16 | 4:08 AM CET

xyz

US-Observer: I’ve never seen anyone writing such historically ignorant posts or simply writing in bad faith. The Battle of Warsaw (1920) was of paramount importance to the future of Europe – it is considered the eighteenth decisive battle in the history, which changed the course of events. In this case Polish Army protected the entire Europe from the wave of communism coming from the Bolshevik Russia. These are undeniable facts.

Posted on 9/9/16 | 4:17 AM CET

Tom

@Jean-Philippe

oo it’s so sad :). I don’t care if you will be cry or not for us :). Believe me we will not be cry after EU also :D. Rather, it would be good tidings. But I do not believe that this Polish government will be smart enough to do it. Maybe next government will do it :).

We pay contribution like any other countries. And there is higher in every year. In this year like i read we pay more than we get. Like one person wrote here before “many billions your companies made thanks to those founds and open market in Poland for them”. You buy our national companies for practically nothing. You enforce us how many money we can charge for our own goods in trade with countries outside the EU and at the same time you act against our country with such projects as Nord Stream. EU interfere in our internal affairs , foist us who we can take and whom not (refugees). Interferes with the democratic election of our society. And many other negative things.

This is not a union this is slavery. Membership in the union is extremely disadvantageous for us. Not every benefit must be financial. Money is not everything.

Regards

once more:
“We’ll make good use of this money at home.”
if the EU makes good use of the money that is already debatable .

Posted on 9/9/16 | 10:13 AM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ Tom

“We pay contribution like any other countries. And there is higher in every year. In this year like i read we pay more than we get.”

You reveice massively more than you pay, and you always have since you were accepted as a member in 2004.

EU transfers are the difference between the second-world Poland of 2004 and the first-world Poland of today. But if you want to leave the EU, that’s fine.

It’s about time we started investing our money at home again. You ungrateful Eastern Europeans can return to where you came from. There is nothing you do for the union, anyhow.

Posted on 9/9/16 | 11:18 AM CET

Tom

@Jean-Philippe

You repeat like a broken record and I don’t think you understand what I wrote . But its none of my business . Hide to the pocket your mind orientated only for money and try to think overall. You want to make us slaves, and for that you do not due to any gratitude. You think that as soon as you send us some money you have the moral right to rule in Poland. Do you think that just becouse you send us money we should all silly ideas EU to accept uncritically? Freedom and independence is more valuable than any money. So don’t talk nonsense to me about some gratitude because it was your business activities not charity.

“There is nothing you do for the union, anyhow”
and we don’t want to 🙂 . Maybe just help her to collapse :).

bye bye 🙂

Posted on 9/9/16 | 12:12 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ Tom

EU transfers are “charity”, absolutely. Or more precisely, “development aid”. We can stop them with every new budget.

We pay them because we believe in making Europe more unified and stronger, and are willing to help underdeveloped countries – such as Poland was in 2004. If those countries do nothing to help the union in return, we should either cut them loose or stop subsidising them.

Right now, Poland is a selfish and useless member. Unfortunately. We expected more from you.

Posted on 9/9/16 | 12:30 PM CET

US Observer

Poland is becoming a fascist country fast.

It is no news that foreigners are regularly beaten up in public spaces, such as the South American guy in a train a few weeks ago (the attackers thought he looked “Arab”, and felt that was reason enough to attack him).

Now, people speaking foreign languages in public can no longer feel safe, either: A few days ago, a university professor (!) was beaten up in a Warsaw tram because he spoke German to a German colleague. Nobody stepped in to help the victim, nobody reported the incident to the police, and the attacker vanished from sight. The professor was hospitalized and had to be stitched up.

Tom

“EU transfers are “charity”, absolutely.”
You made my day – thank you :D.

“we believe in making Europe more unified and stronger”
And i also believed in this in 2004. EU sucessfully dissuade me from that kind of thinkin.

“willing to help underdeveloped countries – such as Poland was in 2004”
If you didn’t turn your back to us after war that would be no need to pay now for our progress. We would did it by ourselves until today.

“We expected more from you.”
We are also dissapointed by you… we thought we’d partner for negotiations and you gets us the subject of negotiations. For something like this can not be our permission.
So you got right we also “expected more from you.”

Tom

US Observer

btw. For your knowledge. Facist country is that country whose legal system is fascism. In Poland is a still democracy as it is written in the Constitution. Or maybe something has changed and I don’t know about it :).

btw2 nice censorship is here :). Thank you for deleting my comment 🙂

Posted on 9/9/16 | 2:11 PM CET

jb

@Tom
@ Jean Philippe
As long as your discussion is based on official EU propaganda (solidarity, structural funds to help underdeveloped regions, etc.) it won’t make much sense.
So let’s look at the facts. To understand whole issue two factors are critical:
1. For Germans EU funds are equivalent of war reparations that they have not paid for destroying other countries including Poland
2. Main beneficiaries of EU funds are German companies.

Ad 1.
Human and material losses inflicted by Germany to Poland during WWII can probably be estimated in trillions of euros. Yes – trillions, it is not a mistake. Just take into account a fee that EU Commission wants to impose on countries that don’t want to take so called “refugees” – 250.000 EUR/person/year and apply that fee to human losses in Poland during WWII, even without taking into account time factor: 6 million x 250.000 EUR gives EUR 1,5 trillion for human losses alone.
Germany has never covered such damages.

Now what is German position concerning EU funds vs war reparations ?
From interview with Frank Schorkopf – a professor for international law at the Universtiy of Göttingen
“(… )SPIEGEL: That sounds like a deal: Eschewing reparations in exchange for acceptance into the currency union?
Schorkopf: Perhaps not so direct. But in unspoken terms, these associated transfers of wealth were the implicit way in which Germany sought to do justice to its responsibility for World War II. The so-called Economic Miracle (in Germany) was also made possible by the fact that the question of reparations was put aside in the London Debt Agreement, explicitly so that Germany could prosper. As a part of European integration, other countries rightly profited from that — especially the Greeks. It was a smart and modern form of addressing the issue of reparations. With that, in my opinion, demands for reparations should not only be rejected for formal legal reasons, they should also be viewed as having been fulfilled economically, politically and morally.”

Jean Philippe is right in that sense that I also don’t understand why British, Dutch, French, etc. accept to participate in funding Germany’s reparations for war damages in the form of EU funds ?!?
They should be funded solely by Germany !
Moreover EU Funds amount to just small percentage of war damages inflicted by Germany, so for Germany it is a very good deal. They pay much less than they should and some other countries participate in funding those transfers – very clever !

Ad. 2
Where those EU Funds go ?
Well, according to estimates German companies get 85 eurocents from each euro of EU Funds funded by Germany.

So in summary thanks to EU Funds Germany avoids paying much more costly war damages and moreover EU tax payers fund well being of German companies.
I think EU Funds should be scrapped and Germany should simply pay due war reparations.
It would be beneficial for EU taxpayers from other countries that unjustly fund such transfers as well as for the countries that have not received any compensation for war damages.

Posted on 9/9/16 | 2:56 PM CET

US Observer

@ Tom

“btw. For your knowledge. Facist country is that country whose legal system is fascism. In Poland is a still democracy as it is written in the Constitution. Or maybe something has changed and I don’t know about it :). ”

Oh, dear. Whether Poland is still a democracy in more but name is subject to debate.

After all, we are talking about the country which is the first EU member state to have come under close scrutiny by the EU Commission for the government’s systematic violation of the rule of law and its attack on the country’s highest court.

Remember, the communist regimes of old were nominally “democratic”, as well, but never lived up to that promise. We might be saying the same about the new-old Poland of Mr Kaczynski soon.

Posted on 9/9/16 | 3:39 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

Voilà, the mindset of the welfare recipient: Who can is pressure into sponsoring my life-style instead of working for it?
If that’s the pervasive thinking in Poland, you will never be among the winners.

Posted on 9/9/16 | 3:43 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe
As far as living on welfare benefits is concerned I agree – the French are clearly the winners.
Highest government spending to GPD ratio in Europe, least hours worked per employee per year, 35 hour workweek, almost constant strikes, 25% of youth literally doing nothing.
Top it with inefficient large corporations on the verge of collapse and you have another Greece – but a bit bigger. And this time there are no colonies that could be robbed, in fact it is the opposite – better learn quickly how to please your Muslim masters. You already know what happens when they get angry.
Au revoir au savoir vivre a la francaise !

Posted on 9/9/16 | 7:42 PM CET

-

–

Posted on 9/9/16 | 7:54 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe
As far as living on welfare benefits is concerned I agree – the French are clearly the winners.
Highest government spending to GDP ratio in Europe, least hours worked per employee per year, 35 hour work week, 25% of youth literally doing nothing.
Top it with large inefficient corporations on the verge of collapse and you have another Greece – but a bit bigger. And this time there are no colonies to be robbed.
Au revoir au savoir vivre a la francaise !

Posted on 9/9/16 | 8:03 PM CET

kaszub

US Observer you are so stupid that only an idiot would read your nonsense and take them seriously. You are sick with hatred. Typical American ignorant fed propaganda Fox News

Posted on 9/10/16 | 9:30 AM CET

US Observer

@ kaszub

Tell me again what your argument was… . You Polish far-righters excel in the personal attack department, but have difficulty making an intelligent argument. (On second though, that’s true for all of the haters anywhere, I guess … .)

Posted on 9/10/16 | 1:50 PM CET

Another Frenchman

Jacques Chirac once aid about the English: “How can you trust a country where the food is so bad?”

The same is true for Poland: Polish food is so terribly bland and greasy that you really have to wonder what’s wrong with those people to like it. 😉

I’m joking, of course. But only a little bit. 😀

Posted on 9/10/16 | 1:54 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb

You can belittle the French economy until the cows come home, but there is not one Polish company that can compete with the French “champions”, and there probably never will be.

Also, French culture is held in high esteem all around the world, whether you like it or not, while Poland’s contribution to world culture is negligeable. As opposed to France, Poland has always been a country that imports culture, but doesn’t export it. (Even your national dish is Russian, not Polish!)

Posted on 9/10/16 | 2:05 PM CET

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—

Posted on 9/10/16 | 8:34 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe 1/3
Well, due also to the French traitors that didn’t fulfill treaties they signed in 1939 Central European countries fell under German and Russian occupation and after that became unwillingly part of Soviet block for years which prevented development of sane economy and companies.
But after that experience I think everyone is aware what trust can be put in France and what is French attitude summarized the best by a great representative of “internationally highly esteemed” French culture – Arletty when she was prostituting with German soldiers: “My heart is French but my ass is international.”. It seems French attitude towards current wave of invaders is similar and consequences are described in Houellebecq’s “Soumission”.

Posted on 9/10/16 | 10:05 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe 2.1/3
As far as culture is concerned calling negligeable contribution to world culture of a country that has for example 8th place on a list of countries with largest number of Nobel laureates in literature is quite extravagant or simply put stupid. By saying that you imply that also all other over 180 countries in the world have no input into world culture – complete nonsense. Moreover interestingly when for example French and Polish culture clashed in Chopin’s family it was Polish culture that prevailed. Almost all his music is based on Polish folk music not French one.

Posted on 9/10/16 | 10:08 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe 2.2/3
And finally you should be more respectful towards a country thanks to which French don’t eat any more with hands but with a fork – brought to France from Poland by Henryk Walezy (which interestingly raised protests of French clergy and doctors at the beginning). By the way he saw also WC’s for the first time in his life in Poland and when he came back to France he ordered to implement them in French castles and palaces so that the French wouldn’t defecate any more under stairs and into fireplaces. But it took them longer to adapt to WC’s than to forks.

Posted on 9/10/16 | 10:11 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe 3/3
I’m curious also what Polish national dish you mean that you think comes from Russia ? Borsht, pierogi (dumplings) or may be sauerkraut that Poles share with Russians ? But these were not invented by Poles or Russians but by their common Slavic ancestors many centuries ago. Learn something outside of French backwoods before making silly statements.

Posted on 9/10/16 | 10:13 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

You should educate yourself on European culture.

You cannot even begin to compare Poland with France. In all of European history, there is not one cultural trend that has its origin in Poland and spread all over Europe. As for France, too many to mention.

Posted on 9/11/16 | 12:22 AM CET

Miss Toronto

Hey, this is disgusting. Maybe the Europeans should suspend Polish EU membership?!? Something needs to be done about this!

Posted on 9/11/16 | 1:05 AM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe
Dreaming about past glory is pleasant but wake up ! When was the last time that anything meaningful originated in France ? France about which you are still dreaming doesn’t exist any more for a long time.
It is like schoolgirls who after reading all those 19th century French novels go to Paris and are shocked because instead of city from the novels they see something more like Middle Eastern or African city, dirty, full of beggars, thieves and armed policemen and soldiers.

Posted on 9/11/16 | 1:14 AM CET

Miss Toronto

Also, sanctions might be a good idea!

Posted on 9/11/16 | 1:16 AM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

Paris is the most beautiful city on earth. Warsaw? Dirty, unsafe and full of ridiculous architecture.

Posted on 9/11/16 | 1:39 AM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe
Ha, ha, – tell that Paris is the most beautiful city to inhabitants of Rome, Vancouver, Prague, Venice, Florence, Jaipur, Antwerp, Budapest and many more and see their reaction.
But those cities have not been destroyed so heavily like Warsaw during WWII which happened thanks also to French traitors that didn’t fulfill treaties they signed in 1939.
If you call Warsaw “dirty and unsafe” than Paris compared to it should be called probably “mad homeless scum burrow”. No only dirty but dangerous with madmen running around, shooting people and trying to blow themselves up in public. How is the touristic season this year in Paris by the way ?
In Warsaw as usually since 1989 – every year much more visitors. And also a new trend – more and more people from Scandinavia, Germany buying apartments thinking about moving to Poland because they started to feel unsafe in their countries. French are also welcome – despite your sins from the past, you can please people with serving some decent food.

Posted on 9/11/16 | 11:15 AM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb

You seem to live in a fantasy world.

Hundreds of thousands of Poles are leaving Poland for Western Europe every year, and hardly any Western European moves to Poland. And you want to tell me the opposite is happening? Silly.

As far as tidiness and safety are concerned, Warsaw ranks very low on the list of big cities I have visited. In Warsaw train station, dirty pidgeons were sitting on the coffee tables, and there were rats to be seen in the lower floors (between the main hall and the platforms). And this was after the station was “renovated”. This has nothing to do with WWII but about Polish everyday culture.

In or at some of Paris’ main stations, you have some excellent, michelin-starred restaurants.

Vive la différence!

Posted on 9/11/16 | 12:30 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe
It seems that you are living in a fantasy world or you drank too much vodka when you were in Warsaw.
Based on the opinions of six million guests (and not just one Jean Philippe) Warsaw’s hotels for example rank as second cleanest in the world just after Tokyo hotels.
In the same ranking Paris hotels are 6th – but not among the cleanest ones but 6th among the dirtiest in the world.
blogs.wsj.com/japanrealtime/2014/08/29/hotels-which-countrys-are-cleanest/
And Polish people that left Poland to work in Western Europe didn’t do that because of safety reasons or dirty cities but for economic reasons – they can simply earn more for the same job there.
But exactly because of safety reasons already many of them plan to come back. I wonder where the French will be escaping when more and more of them will have their throats cut ?

Posted on 9/11/16 | 2:06 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

I’ve travelled most of Eastern Europe, and Poland is definitely a less clean country than most of its neighbours. And I’m not talking about Germany here, but other Eastern European countries such as the Czech Republic or Slovakia. It’s also not particularly safe. I’ve never seen so many drunk people lying at bus stops etc. as in your country, adn so many hooligans (not even in the UK). So please, don’t lecture me on safety and security, you are more like Ukraine or Russia in that regard from our point of view.

And don’t think the French will consider moving to Poland en masse. Who wants to eat meat dumplings at a Polish Baltic Sea town on a rainy day when he can enjoy seafood at the French Riviera in the autumn sun, after all?

Posted on 9/11/16 | 2:40 PM CET

TAK

Dear Jean-Philippe and US-Observer

Read again your own comments, please.
You regularly humiliate other nation, you exalt your own, you use national stereotypes.
Your opinions and arguments very often are racist, nationalistic, xenophobic.
So I don’t think that you are prefect teachers of humanity and good “European” manners.

And – to be honest – I don’t think that you know the history and present of Poland too well.

Best regards from sunny Warsaw

Posted on 9/11/16 | 4:29 PM CET

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Posted on 9/11/16 | 5:31 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe 1/2
“I’ve travelled most of Western Europe, and France is definitely a less clean country than most of its neighbours. And I’m not talking about Switzerland here, but other Western European countries such as Belgium or Germany. It’s also not particularly safe.” – we can go for long like this, but I’m really curious what is the reason for your ignorance and disdain for objective facts I provide, while you present mainly your fantasies and impressions. May be the reason is deplorable state of education in France which results in badly educated students (about 10 places behind Poland in OECD ranking) ? oecd.org/pisa/keyfindings/pisa-2012-results-overview.pdf
Moreover have I written anywhere that France is not popular among tourists (or less popular than Poland) ?!? It is and there are many reasons it should but in recent years something happened which makes situation in France worse every year – in terms of safety, terrorist attacks, cleanliness, more violent riots on the streets, quickly deteriorating economy and standing of French companies.

Posted on 9/11/16 | 5:32 PM CET

jb

@Jean Philippe 2/2
I wonder how long tourists will be able to enjoy seafood on French Riviera fearing that they might be rolled over by a truck like in Nice or killed with a machine gun like in Paris. It seems less and less of them are willing to come – in Paris alone there are 56% less Japanese, 35% less Russians and 14% less Chinese this year.
Additionally I’m personally really very surprised that just 27 years after fall of communism Poland is already ahead of France in terms of various factors (from unemployment, through education to cleanliness of hotels) and what is important the situation is still improving, unlike in France where it is deteriorating.
As far as Baltic Sea is concerned you would be surprised how packed it was this year also with tourists from all over Europe – probably they can stand variable weather and cold sea as long as they know that they and their families are safe and there are no madmen around with machine guns or explosives ready to blow themselves up. By the way most of people that come to Poland rave about Polish food – check tripadvisor entries for good restaurants.

Posted on 9/11/16 | 5:34 PM CET

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Posted on 9/11/16 | 6:58 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

France is the most visited country, and Paris is the most visited city on earth. By comparison, the numbers of tourists to Warsaw and Poland are tiny.

Also, French cuisine is one of the leading cuisines of the world. Polish food is, in my experience, one of the less refined Eastern European kitchens. I’ve eaten very well in the Czech Republic and Hungary, in Austria and the South of Germany, but Polish cuisine is really a peasant kitchen by comparison, lacking originality and variety.

Most dishes you can find on the menues in Poland are actually local adaptations of Austrian dishes, but a lot less well done than they do them in Vienna, one of the most cultured cities on earth. Russia seems to have been a great influence, also, but again, I prefer the original (the same goes for Vodka!).

Posted on 9/11/16 | 8:04 PM CET

jb

@Jean Philippe
With every post you only confirm your utter ignorance about Central Europe.
Polish cuisine “lacking originality and variety” ?!? Good joke.
With influences from various cultures that lived in Poland for centuries and its neighbours – Jewish, Lithuanian, Armenian, Italian (not current but since XVI century), German, Hungarian, Tatar, Turkish – to name some this is probably one of the most varied if not the most varied cuisine in Europe. When I’m in France or Italy after some time I start craving for some typically Polish or more broadly Slavic flavors that don’t even exist in those cuisines. Not even talking about probably the largest variety of soups among any of European cuisines – at least in France you have little idea about what a proper, rich soup with a full original flavor is.
If you tasted just peasant food I feel sorry for you. It is like judging French cuisine without ever tasting “haute cuisine”.

Posted on 9/11/16 | 8:56 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

Polish cuisine “is probably … the most varied cuisine in Europe. ”

Monsieur, my apologies, but that statement simply reveals that you have no experience with the great cuisines of the world.

I’ve worked in the wine trade for nearly 30 years, and know a thing or two about food.

There are only two Michelin starred-restaurants in Poland, less than in any larger city in France, Belgium, Switzerland, Italy, Spain, Germany, Austria. I hope Polish cuisine will continue to develop, to grow in refinement and variety, but for the moment, it lacks in all of that.

Of course, that doesn’t mean all is bad. There are individual dishes which are decent. Use them as a platform to build upon, and you might eventually leave your mark on European cuisine one day. The potatoe and meat heapings offered with a side dish of cabbage in most of your restaurants may be good enough to feed the hungry masses during communism, but don’t constitute a “cuisine” deserving the name.

I grant you that Eastern Europe is at a natural disadvantage to the south and west of Europe also in this field (as in all others). Food is better wherever wine is grown, and sharply less good wherever it is not. So east of a line of Germany-Austria-Hungary, in the wheat-and-rye plains of the European east, conditions weren’t great for a rich culinary culture, and the result is there for all to see.

Posted on 9/11/16 | 10:59 PM CET

Tom

@Jean-Philippe

“It’s also not particularly safe. I’ve never seen so many drunk people lying at bus stops etc. as in your country, adn so many hooligans (not even in the UK). So please, don’t lecture me on safety and security, you are more like Ukraine or Russia in that regard from our point of view.

“Paris-The city ranked 71st after a series of terrorist attacks. In November, suicide bombers and gunmen attacked multiple locations in France’s capital, including cafés, restaurants, and a music venue, killing 130 people and injuring hundreds of others.”
I have never seen terrorist attack in Warsaw…never. What is more dangerous politycal protests or terrorist attacks? :). So don’t tell me about safety…

aaa by the way You want to convince me that these photos come from a safe city?

Posted on 9/11/16 | 11:59 PM CET

jb

@Jean Philippe
Dear Jean Philippe your narrow-mindedness gives me a lot of joy. But if Jean Philippe doesn’t know about something it doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist. You made my day especially with “Food is better wherever wine is grown, and sharply less good wherever it is not. “. One of the best meals in my life I had in India, Japan, Malaysia, Singapore and Thailand where you can hardly find any wine. So your theory is worth nothing. Moreover in my opinion those cuisines are much more interesting then French cuisine and if I had a choice to choose just one restaurant now I would without hesitation choose any of restaurants with personnel from those countries over French one (or frankly speaking probably over any European one).
I don’t even take into consideration Michelin stars when I’m choosing a non-French restaurant. It is a French system invented by the French and proper for the French restaurants. How many Michelin stars you have in the countries I mentioned ? Check – you will understand it doesn’t make sense at all to take it into consideration outside of France for non-French restaurants (good example is Singapore – with fantastic food almost on every corner and I think only one Michelin star restaurant – French one of course !).
I don’t want to convince that you should like Polish cuisine – it’s a question of personal taste. But learn something about Polish history, of all ethnicities that lived throughout centuries in Poland and contributed to Polish cuisine, have a trip around Poland, have a look in Polish cookbooks – Polish cuisine is very diverse compared to other European cuisines.
If you personally have not experienced that, well you can spend also a lot of time in France, taste just the most popular dishes (steak frites, poulet roti, blanquette de veau, boeuf bourguignon, quiche lorraine, cassoulet) and come to conclusion that French cuisine is bland, with very limited range of flavors, rather heavy and not very healthy.

Posted on 9/12/16 | 10:01 AM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

Monsieur, I don’t have all day debating cuisine with you, as I have still my own business to look after.

But you should read my comment in full. I was comparing EUROPEAN cuisines when I wrote:

“I grant you that Eastern Europe is at a natural disadvantage to the south and west of Europe also in this field (as in all others). Food is better wherever wine is grown, and sharply less good wherever it is not. So east of a line of Germany-Austria-Hungary, in the wheat-and-rye plains of the European east, conditions weren’t great for a rich culinary culture, and the result is there for all to see.”

You obviously cannot compare European and Asian cuisines, as the traditions, techniques and ingredients differ so greatly. (As a matter of personal taste, I consider the Japanase cuisine one of the richest of all.)

Among European cuisines, there is a clear gap between those of the wine- and those of the non-wine-growing countries, and among the former, the Mediterranean countries are again at a natural advantage over e.g. Germany, Austria and Hungary, because of their climate and “terroir” which allows for more diverse ingredients to grow.

The cuisines of Eastern Europe cannot compete with those of the south and west of Europe.

Poland’s cuisine in particular lacks originality and variation and, constricting itself to often to the same one or two dozens of staple foods which are served with little adaptation even in grand restaurants.

Except for the mountain region in the south with its smoked cheeses, regional culinary traditions are almost completely absent in Poland, certainly by comparison to the countries of southern and western Europe, and even beverages are rather primitive, with very few local brewerie. In wine growing countries from Germany and Austria down to Spain and Greece, every vineyard has its own flavour … .

I’ve been a semi-professional eater for most of my professional life (I’ve worked in the food and beverages industry), and I welcome culinary diversity. It would be wonderful if Poland’s cuisine develop in that direction, but so far it disappoints.

Posted on 9/12/16 | 11:12 AM CET

Jean-Philippe

My apologies for the typing errors in my comment above. I was writing in a hurry.

Posted on 9/12/16 | 11:15 AM CET

US Observer

@ Jean-Philippe

I agree it’s hard to find decent restaurants in Poland. But the quality of Polish food or lack therof is not an issue here.

Posted on 9/12/16 | 5:57 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe
Dear Jean Philippe,
As I demonstrated with example of Asian cuisines your theory about wine/cuisine relationship is as good as theory that a restaurant is good only if it is visible from top of Eiffel tower which is a sheer nonsense.
Of course because of differences in climate some agricultural products are better in Mediterranean countries but exactly for the same reason some agricultural products are better in Central Europe (for example soft fruits, some vegetables, some kinds of meats or fish).
Apart from that what ingredients lacked in one region used to be imported from another region since centuries and used in local cuisine (like for example much more extensive use of spices in Polish traditional cuisine compared to other European cuisines thanks to much lower prices of spices due to close trade relations with Middle Eastern countries) .
I suppose also that you don’t cultivate black pepper or nutmeg in France but still use it in your cuisine ?!?
Or may be I’ll learn from you in a moment that even black pepper, nutmeg and oranges are better in France than anywhere else because of this wine-black pepper-nutmeg-oranges miraculous relationship in Mediterranean 😉
No one has to like a particular cuisine – obviously it is a question of personal taste, although most of foreigners that I met that were open to experience real Polish cuisine outside of the most popular dishes like “schabowy” (equivalent – in popularity terms, of equally “refined” steak-frites in France) were delighted. But it is obvious that in terms of variety of flavors for example we have wider range than any of Mediterranean cuisines (be it French, Spanish, Italian or Greek) for one simple reason. Polish cuisine incorporates most of the flavors that exist in those cuisines (including for example dishes with wine as ingredient which used to be imported for centuries) plus some flavors particular for Slavic nations that simply have not existed in Mediterranean cuisines. And I repeat again – if you don’t know about something it doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist.

Posted on 9/12/16 | 6:24 PM CET

jb

@US Observer
I agree about the restaurants. Partly it is a legacy of communism during which Polish traditional cuisine didn’t flourish to say the least (as any other tradition that communists tried to destroy) and partly it is due to lower purchasing power than in the West and people can’t afford to go often to good restaurants.
But if something is rarer or harder to find it doesn’t imply that it doesn’t exist at all as Jean Philippe tries to prove.

Posted on 9/12/16 | 7:20 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

“But it is obvious that in terms of variety of flavors for example we (the Poles) have wider range than any of Mediterranean cuisines”

A single serving of Bouillabaisse served with a glass of Pouilly-Fumé would cure you of such delusions.

In terms of flavour, intensity of taste and refinement, there is nothing in the Polish cuisine that comes even close to such simple delights (and there is nothing that matches the more artistic creations to be found here).

France has been immensily enriched by the culinary exchanges with the Arab world for a millenium, and more recently with Asia.

Polish cuisine lacks those intense influences, except for the Austrian and Russian ones. You Poles cannot match the artistry of the Austrians, however, and the Russian cuisine has never managed to rival the great cuisines of Europe in the first place.

Posted on 9/12/16 | 7:27 PM CET

jb

Of course about dogs and cats should have been: “you don’t in France either”.
I don’t suspect you of eating them 😉

Posted on 9/13/16 | 12:15 AM CET

jb

@Jean Philippe 1/2
“Polish cuisine lacks those intense influences, except for the Austrian and Russian ones.”
It seems you have no idea about Polish history and as a consequence also about Polish cuisine which has influences from ethnicities that lived in Poland for centuries (or from our neighbours) – Jewish, Lithuanian, Italian, Hungarian, Tatar, Turkish, etc. While in Western Europe everyone was killing each other because of different religion or race for centuries Poland was welcoming different minorities which were persecuted in the West and granted them rights they couldn’t enjoy elsewhere. Such barbaric acts as religion related 30 Year War or massacre of Huguenots in France were completely alien to Polish citizens. So Poland was a unique country where catholics, protestants, jews, muslims, Italians, Scotts, Germans, Dutch, Armenians, Tatars lived side by side and contributed to enrich Polish culture as well as Polish cuisine. As a consequence there is a big variety of different flavors in Polish traditional cuisine from “regular European” ones (close to what you have in France) – salty, mild, various sauces (based on cream,butter, eggs, wine, etc.), to spicy (Hungarian and Oriental influences) and really sweet (Jewish and Oriental influences) mainly for poultry, wild game and freshwater fish dishes (for geographical reasons traditionally more popular than salt water fish).

Posted on 9/13/16 | 12:36 AM CET

jb

@Jean Philippe 2/2
On top of that there are uniquely Slavic sour-fermented flavors (soured rye soup, soured cabbage – basis for several dishes like soups including extremely sour one and stew of which French choucroute is like a sad poor man’s version passed by Germans from Central Europe, soured cucumbers – great soup from them, soured milk), which usually fall into acquired taste category because of pungency (like Japanese natto or Malaysian sambal belacan). I pointed already to probably the biggest variety of soups in Europe so I will mention here only one curiosity that I think you don’t have in France – duck blood soup (with very special sweet & sour taste). And then there are desserts – I see you like Austria, so apart may be from some exceptions you will find most of similar desserts in Poland plus many more including the ones with big amount of poppy seeds (makowiec cake, kutia, noodles with poppy seed) which usually raise eyebrows of the French as for them poppy is equivalent to heroin 😉
So if this is not a diverse cuisine I really don’t know which European cuisine you can call diverse (may be Swiss one then – where dogs and cats are eaten which we don’t do and I think you don’t in France either 😉 ).
As far as Bouillabaisse is concerned I like it (for the first time I had it in Vieux Port in Marseille by the way) but frankly I had quite similar dishes also in Portugal and Italy which I also liked.

Posted on 9/13/16 | 12:38 AM CET

xyz

@US Observer: You seem very biased in how you judge different countries and most of the time your comments turn out to be anti-Polish.

Posted on 9/13/16 | 3:26 AM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

Monsieur, if I gave you a list of all the French specialities and their foreign origins or influences, I would have to write a book, not a short paragraph as you do for the Polish cuisine’s highlights!

By the way, your “makowiec” is the Viennioise “mohnstriezel”, and if I were you I wouldn’t bet a fortune on it that you do it better than the Viennoise confectioners, the kings of their trade.

And that really is my impression of Polish food: mostly local variations of dishes available elsewhere (mainly in Austria and Russia), but done less well than in their country of origin. If you’d improved the original version, bon, that’d be something else! But my experience was the opposite.

For me, Polish food lacks variety and richness of flavour. It’s also not very artistically done, but rather plain.

I like a good restaurant meal to not only feed me, but to add a new experience to my culinary memory, and I never had that in Poland with the exception of your sour rye soup (which, on the other hand, is something I wouldn’t want to eat regularly over here, it’s not made for our climate).

Posted on 9/13/16 | 11:40 AM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe
Dear Jean Philippe. Your ignorance is astounding. That’s why I provided very short background of various influences in Polish cuisine as even this brief description increases your knowledge infinitely as it hovers somewhere close to null.
I’m not surprised that you constantly refer to Austrian or Russian cuisine as even for this handful of examples of Polish dishes and flavors I mentioned you can not find any counterparts in French cuisine. Although French cuisine is quite diverse in general it is quite funny that it offers so limited choice as far as breakfests are concerned. We start our day with extremely varied menu in Poland from which to choose vs a croissant soaked in a cafe in France. By the way I’ve always wondered who invented something equally disgusting in terms of taste as well as visual effect of wet pastry stuffed into a mouth and chewed like a toothless old person. May be you know the answer.
And be a brave French – don’t hesitate and go ahead with “French specialities and their foreign origins or influences”. You can start with numerous “a la polonaise” dishes from French cuisine !

Posted on 9/13/16 | 5:19 PM CET

Tom

US Observer

This is solidarity action with beaten professor you mentioned earlier. People reading books in english, german etc in trams. There is also interview with German who live in Poland from 10 years and he had NEVER any problem with violence. Polish people are also very criticise this criminal behavior.
So please dont show this as an example of Polish untollerance or something like that. This was just criminal behavior with is criticized by common people.

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

We started this debate on Polish cuisine when you claimed that the French would soon bein to move to Poland because they felt unsafe at home. To which I responded that that would not happen because the French do not find Poland and its culture attractive enough to consider moving, and I used its cuisine as an example.

For me personally, Polish cuisine is totally unappealing. It is simplistic, uses too much fat instead of herbs to add flavour and lacks originality. In short, it’s like most peasant kitchens around the globe: Hearty meals that feed you well, but nothing for more elaborate tastes.

It is therefore a cuisine that matches the national culture well. If you think Polish food is the “most diverse” food in Europe, I suppose you have never actually left the country … .

I will close on that note. Dinner beckons.

Posted on 9/13/16 | 9:40 PM CET

Tom

US Observer

“After all, we are talking about the country which is the first EU member state to have come under close scrutiny by the EU Commission for the government’s systematic violation of the rule of law and its attack on the country’s highest court.”
This is just ridiculous how the EU can keep an eye on their interests even at the expense of democracy and violation of other free nations. I don’t know how good you know this theme. I think you don’t know it well becouse crisis concern Constitutional Court not Highest Court. In Poland there are two different courts. The Constitutional Court decides on the compatibilty of laws with the Constitution. Highest Court is the final court of appeal in Poland. And this is the dispute about the Constitutional Court. You can read in Polish? You said that you lived in Poland (As i remember well). If you want I can give you some valuable links, becouse I feel too weak from the English language to try to explain it. And it would be a loooot of writing. But some articles can show you broader context of the dispute and show you that the fault does not lie only on the side of the ruling party. Maybe also you will see that in Poland there is no breaking the law at all. And democracy and freedom of speech are even higher than at rule of previous PO party.

Just look at this comparison between the previous government and the present and tell me please and please tell me which actions are more democratic. You got the date on the movie PIS (Law and Justice) rule from Oct. 25 2015. PO rule from 2007 to 2015.

Posted on 9/13/16 | 9:55 PM CET

US Observer

@ Tom:

The Constitutional Court (in Polish: Trybunał konstytucyjny) IS Poland’s highest court. And it is currently being emasculated by the government, in clear violation of the separation of powers and the rule of law.

With these recent developments, Poland is no longer a democracy in the western sense.

I thought becoming part of the west was Poland’s long-term aspiration? And now it is turning it’s back on western values after little more than a decade of being part of the EU and NATO. What a shame.

Posted on 9/14/16 | 1:54 AM CET

Katarzyna

this article is a pure manipulation, honestly idiotic left-wing politis sucks everywhere and everybody knows it, so please stop attack Poland, our government is not ultra nationalist. It is center right and politico should stop sell shoddy lies to people, politico is attacking polish government just becouse we do not want muslims here in Poland !!! Did You know that polish governmet is offering help to christians in Syria?

Posted on 9/14/16 | 4:00 PM CET

ddh

@ US Observer
1. “The Constitutional Court (in Polish: Trybunał konstytucyjny) IS Poland’s highest court. ”
Wrong. As Tom writes Polish highest court is “Sad Najwyzszy”
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supreme_Court_of_Poland
Constitutional Tribunal is for verifying if particular regulation passed by the parliament is consistent with constitution. But it is not the key issue here.
2. The current issue with Constitutional Tribunal started when previous coalition (PO-Civic Platform and PSL – Farmer’s party) realized that they would lose power in next parliamentary elections (they already lost presidential elections then) and taking into account scale of corruption and criminal acts they were involved in (read for example about so called “reprivatisation” in Warsaw where even Civic Platform mayor’s family is involved in taking possession of an apartment house of a deceased Jewish family) they tried to protect their interests in various institutions. In case of Constitutional Tribunal they passed a law co-written by head of Constitutional Tribunal (sic !) that would allow them to retain 14 out of 15 seats in the Tribunal for a long time. This law turned out to be unconstitutional – even Constitutional Tribunal under presidency of the judge who has co-written that law had to admit that ! You have to admit that it is gross – as head of Constitutional Tribunal that should be “independent” takes part in dirty political tricks and secondly that he is not even able to advise politicians in such way that this law is compliant with constitution ! Untangling this mess is not easy and created some legal disputes. Add to that involvement of some judges in collaboration with communist secret services in the past or in political trials when people fighting for democracy were sentenced for years in prison and lack of “love” of current ruling party (PiS – Law and justice) towards members of former communist regime and you have pretty good picture of what is going on.

Posted on 9/14/16 | 4:10 PM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe
Dear Jean Philippe,
I wrote about some Germans and Scandinavians buying apartments in Poland as they feel already too unsafe in their countries and plan to move permanently (actual case I know). I didn’t write about the French moving to Poland because of safety reasons as I am not aware of such cases.
I just wondered where the French would be escaping when safety situation becomes unbearable in France but then came to a conclusion that taking into account 20th century history and France’s welcoming approach to invaders (e.g. collaboration and prostitution with Germans) it is more probable that it will end like in Houellebecq’s “Soumission”. Just looked in the news in the morning and it’s the same story almost every day – this time about some women suspected of plotting to blow up a car packed with gas canisters last week near Notre Dame in Paris..
As far as cuisine is concerned with every post you are even further way off the mark and make me laugh even more. “too much fat instead of herbs” you say ? Check then what kind of herbs and spices go into some examples of very traditional basic Polish dishes present I think almost on every Polish table: bigos (sour cabbage stew), flaki (tripes – the ones I had in France were completely bland in comparison by the way) or gingerbread cake (piernik). Just google following 3 entries and open first links: “Czym-doprawic-bigos”, „Flaki_na_sposob_tradycyjny-5744p”, „domowa-przyprawa-korzenna-do-piernika”
PS Won’t you enlighten me about a reason to soak viennoiseries in a coffee by the French ? Wet pastry becomes “artistic creation” or coffee with pieces of jam and breadcrumbs turns “refined” then ?

Posted on 9/14/16 | 4:41 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

I give you full marks for obnoxiousness, but otherwise, your comment disappoints:

1) Individual Germans and Scandinavians might be buying property in Poland, but there is no signs of a significant number of either of them to Poland for whatever reasons. Meanwhile, the exodus of Poles to those countries continues.

2) On Polish cuisine, I’m afraid we will continue to disagree. I find it bland and uninspiring. As in so many other cultural areas, half a century of being shut off from the world certainly hasn’t helped, so blame it on communism, if you want to. I believe the roots are deeper than that, though … . Also, this is one of the areas where your anti-immigration stance really hurts. Eating well in Warsaw is tricky, while you are spolit for choice in any Western European capital.

3) If you absolutely want to make a fool of yourself, you should continue to call French women of various epochs (WWI, WWII) “prostitutes”. That is particularly silly considering the fact that for two decades, Polish women have been one of the largest groups among prostitutes all over Western Europe, together with their colleagues from Ukraine, Moldova, Romania and Bulgaria. (The sadly interesting fact is that of these countries, Poland was the only one which wasn’t dirt poor, so the incentive for prostitution should in theory have been lower … .)

Posted on 9/14/16 | 6:26 PM CET

jb

Dear Jean Philippe,
1. It only shows how reckless politicians destroy one of the best places to live on earth – Western Europe. Who could have thought about it just several years ago ? The same goes for Hungary – “Growing number of Germans moving to Hungary out of fear of migrants” (dailynewshungary.com/growing-number-of-germans-moving-to-hungary-out-of-fear-of-migrants-german-public-tv/). Of course the numbers are not big (yet ?) but trend started to be visible.

2. You don’t have to like Polish cuisine – that’s obvious. But for each of your reproach I demonstrated evidence which shows that it is not exactly as you think. Of course the number of good restaurants is lower here than in Western Europe capitals – as I stated for two main reasons: communist legacy and lower purchasing power of society. But by going just to restaurants in Poland, especially restaurants in bigger cities you still miss more than you are able to discover. The situation is constantly improving but there is multitude of dishes, cooking styles, ingredients that you can taste only if you are invited by a family or you come by chance across some restaurant (or sometimes rather auberge) deep in a country specialising in a particular region’s cuisine. So in Poland it is a bit more complicated than just opening Michelin Guide and making a choice like in France but on the other hand sometimes it is more fun.

3. I was not analysing market for prostitution services but I referred to attitude of the French during WWII towards those that occupied your country and killed your soldiers. Let me cite French Wikipedia to make it clear: “les historiens parlent de « collaboration au quotidien » pour désigner un certain nombre de comportements significatifs, mais ne relevant pas de l’engagement politique actif : rapports personnels cordiaux entretenus avec des Allemands, envoi de lettres de dénonciation à la police ou à la Gestapo (trois à cinq millions de lettres anonymes en France, soit une moyenne de 2 700 lettres par jour), chefs d’entreprises sollicitant d’eux-mêmes des commandes de l’ennemi, relations amoureuses affichées avec des soldats de l’armée d’Occupation, voire des membres de la Gestapo, etc.”
As far as current prostitution market is concerned I am not an expert as I don’t have to use such services. So I tried to find some statistics to verify your statements. According to a recent report by OCRTEH prostitutes in France come mainly from (apart from France itself): Bulgaria, Romania, Nigeria, Cameroun, Brazil, China. No Polish prostitutes mentioned – it seems their number is below radar. What a pity – another area in which we are not champion !

Posted on 9/14/16 | 9:52 PM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

1) Western Europe isn’t being destroyed, and France will persist, as it always has for over a thousand years. (That can’t be said about Poland … .)

2) Your words simply didn’t convince me of the qualities of Polish food. I have travelled to Poland, and believe me, the food is a strong reason not to move there. The same goes for any other Eastern European country, except maybe the Czech Republic and Hungary. I’d rather relocate to Morocco, where French is spoken and the food is varied, tasty and healthy. Yes, the people are Arab (and Berber) muslims, but so what? We’ve accommodated with them for a long time.

3) I spoke of prostitution in Western Europe in general, a “business” in which Polish service providers are greatly over-represented, as are their neighbours from Ukraine, but not e.g. the Czechs. Now, this is interesting, isn’t it? The vast majority of Poles are Catholics, the vast majority of Czechs are atheists, and still, the latter are apparently better at teaching their daughters a sense of right and wrong. So, please, Monsieur, stop moralising, it makes me embarrassed for you!

Posted on 9/15/16 | 12:17 AM CET

Tom

@US Observer

Just as I thought. I’m sorry but the only shame is that, you don’t know what you are talking about. If you think that Sąd Najwyższy (Supreme Court) is the same as Trybunał Konstytucyjny (Constitutional Court) that means you know nothing about the judicial system in Poland. This is the basic knowledge. If you don’t know this it must be difficult to you to understand what is happening in this dispute. That is so irritating when foreigners talk about things in our country and they don’t have an idea what are they talking about. And if you think that the controversy started by the current government it means that you don’t know what is happening in Polish politics. As ddh wrote The current issue with Constitutional Tribunal started when previous coalition PO-Civic Platform and PSL – Farmer’s party broke a law. Funny thing is that no one was protesting then. The whole hypocrisy of Europe lies in the fact that when PIS (Law and Justice) protested that constitution is broken EU didn’t care. That’s why I think it’s a simply help to buddies / servants of the PO not care for our democration. PiS also protested in EU (when PO broke a law) – where were you then? Now it is too late to interfere. Society wants change and it would be good if you do not interfere in our affairs .
BTW in my opinion our democracy grow under the rule of PiS :).

Greetings 🙂

Posted on 9/16/16 | 1:00 AM CET

US Observer

@ Tom:

“I’m sorry but the only shame is that, you don’t know what you are talking about. If you think that Sąd Najwyższy (Supreme Court) is the same as Trybunał Konstytucyjny (Constitutional Court) that means you know nothing about the judicial system in Poland.”

I didn’t say that. But the Constitutional Court is the highest cort in the land in any rule of law state. The Supreme Court is only the highest civil and penal court. I’m a lawyer, btw, and you probably are not.

“BTW in my opinion our democracy grow under the rule of PiS.”

Of course you do. May you enjoy your delusions while they last.

Posted on 9/16/16 | 2:17 AM CET

Tom

@US Observer

“I’m a lawyer, btw, and you probably are not.”
Now I start to worry about your finance with this kind of knowledge :D. Mate this is no some mystical knowledge. Children in school learn this on such a subject as WOS. But i learnt about it on studies also :). Ok but let’s look to the Polish encyclopedia:

“Supreme Court chief court supervising the work of all other courts in the field of jurisprudence.”

“Constitutional Court independent judicial authority , the decisive basic constitutional disputes in the country, in particular the ruling on the conformity of laws with the Constitution.”

“The Supreme Court is only the highest civil and penal court”
ehm, Only? Didn’t you forget about the other very important competence SN ?:

Competences of SN:
• supervising the activities of all other courts to rule
• ensuring the accuracy and uniformity of law lecture
• consideration of a cassation appeal against the judgment or order made by the court of second instance
• adopting resolutions explaining the provisions raising doubts in practice
• adopting resolutions on resolving legal issues raise doubts in a particular case
• reviewing election protests
• validating the presidential elections and to the Sejm and the Senate
• validating referendums nationwide
• approving changes to Chapters I , II and XII of the Constitution

Ok mr. lawyer, I do not change my opinion about your knowledge on this topic . In Poland, the judicial system is not so simple as you are trying to draw here . That was been such situations that the Supreme Court interpretation of the law and TK was different. Whose interpretation in this case they are guided by other courts?

---

—–

Posted on 9/18/16 | 3:43 AM CET

jb

@Jean-Philippe
1. It seems that I simply misunderstood mysterious Western European soul and wrongly assumed that such voices as below are about some problems in the West.
– Laurent Bouvet : l’islamisme, la gauche et le complexe colonial
– Guillaume Bigot : Bruxelles, laboratoire de l’Europe de demain ?
– Hugues Moutouh: Pourquoi la France est plus touchée que ses voisins par le djihadisme ?
While as I now understand from you that they simply reflect joyful, happy population heading towards even brighter future which in France is confirmed additionally by works like Houellebecq’s “Soumission” and last but not least rising support for Front National financed with Putin’s money.

2. Clear. Personal taste is above anything. I can even understand that you feel better in filth there and that’s the reason why hotels in Paris are one of the dirtiest in the world on purpose (while Warsaw’s ones are the cleanest just after Tokyo).
I don’t understand on the other hand what’s your problem with Arabs ? I visited several Arabic countries (sadly some of them would be difficult to visit today – like Syria for example) and enjoyed their relaxed, “lazy” attitude and also food (for some time at least as flavors start to repeat after not so long time). As everywhere in the world – as long as you respect local customs and traditions (don’t go wearing shorts to a mosque, don’t drink alcohol on a street, don’t kiss girls, etc.) it is ok.

3. While Polish women would probably be champions in that sector if they wanted, unfortunately you have not provided evidence that their number is significant in that sector. In fact the evidence I came across and provided to you demonstrates the opposite.
As far as Catholics are concerned there are some statistics that they enjoy better sex life than other demographics. And do you remember Monthy Python’s sketch about Catholics vs protestants ?
So may be this catholic upbringing is the reason that when a French guy has some Polish women around it happens quite often that he dumps his French wife or girlfriend to go for a Polish one ? Who knows.

Posted on 9/18/16 | 3:53 AM CET

Pawel Grajnert

Extremism nurtures more virulent extremism. And nationalism is extremism. Kaczynski is a Putinist pure and simple: Like Orban, Farage, Drumpf, Cameron… These people have succumbed to a dangerous anti-democratic ideology that has as its goal the undermining of all the civil, political and economic institutions that maintain our freedoms and prosperity. Deplorable.

When Donald Tusk (king of Europe :P) was prime minister in Poland to destroy the opposition, breaking the law and the Constitution!! Then no one protested because it supported the left-liberal politics that prevails in rotten Europe.

Posted on 9/18/16 | 11:28 PM CET

Man from Poland

What a disgusting article full of lies! And the manipulative photo of Radosław Siedlecki holding crosses, this guy is retarded, he has severe mental illness. Please don`t belive in this anti-polish propaganda. Poles want to rebuild their industrial potential which is agaist germany and france interest, because Poland its a huge market of export of thoose two, soo they use media to lie about Poland and Kaczyński. We the Poles started the democratic changes in the east block, and we know what a freedom is, so better you should be worried about what is happening in the western europe.

Posted on 9/19/16 | 6:14 AM CET

Man from Poland

@Jean-Philippe @US Observer
What an racist and ignorat guys you are. That`s just sad. Dividing world to the 1st, 2nd, 3rd it`s very open and tolerant. Contgarulations. Every day I see Poland growing, and every day I see western Europe dying, which for me it`s very sad, and feel very sorry for problems that ordinary people from germany, france etc are facing. I was living in your`s “so-called” first world in germany, UK, Netherlands and besides great developed countries I saw drugs on the streets, gangs, youngsters with knifes, young mothers without husbands, aggresion. When I was living in Rotterdam some blacks and marocans break into my house terrorize my mate and steal my stuff, when I go to police and we directly pointed the attackers, because we know them, they do nothing. That`s the dark side of the western europe. Belive me or not it never happened to me in my second world Poland, as you enlighted, open and tolerant westerners tend to call it.

Posted on 9/19/16 | 7:14 AM CET

frost

The western leftist-islam alliance forced almost all Jews out of Europe. The left on the west is more antysemite than Hitler himself. Some of the UE officials has already converted to islam which is ideal system for the bad to dominate the weak. Other thing is legalizing pedophilia which is for the left the most important thing in the whole world. They tried every posible way to do it and they failed so they made an alliance withe islam in order to achive their cammon goal.

Posted on 9/19/16 | 10:30 PM CET

US Observer

@ Tom:

What you write on the position of the Polish High(est) Court (SN) and the Constitutional Court (TK) is not wrong, yet you overlook one aspect:

In their application of the law, all courts including the SN are bound by the TK’s ruling on certain aspects of the consitution such as individual liberties and human rights. The exact competences in this matter vary from state to state (and I don’t claim to be an expert in Polish law), but that generally makes any constitutional court (and the TK in Poland) take preeminence.

Also, the constitutional courts are usually charged with tranching conflicts of competence among the top courts of each branch, such as civil and criminal (in Poland, the SN) and administrative.

Posted on 9/21/16 | 7:53 AM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ Man from Poland

“What an racist and ignorat guys you are. That`s just sad. Dividing world to the 1st, 2nd, 3rd it`s very open and tolerant.”

Poland prior to becoming an EU member was not part of the 1st world. Sorry if that hurts your feelings. For your interest, it still ranks as a “developing country” in economic parlance used by the large international organisations and investors. Guess what would happen if you dropped out of the EU again?

“Every day I see Poland growing, and every day I see western Europe dying”

Great, so we can stop sending you 15 billon Euros per year as a gift? That’d be wonderful. But before you agree in a haste, remember that without these EU transfers (worth roughly 3 % of Polish GDP) Poland wouldn’t be growing.

Posted on 9/21/16 | 7:59 AM CET

Jean-Philippe

@ jb:

1. I know, according to you, the djihadists and Vladimir Poutine, France is dying. Et bien? France has existed for over a millenium without interruption, wile Poland has been wiped off the map more often than anybody cares to remember.

2. You told us already that Polish food is the “most diverse in Europe”, and now, that Polish hotels are among the best. Is it possible that you never ever went abroad?

3. Polish women. It’s funny that you ask for a source when you don’t provide a source for your counter-claim yourself. Speaking from personal experience, none of my friends who dated a Polish girl ended up marrying her, while quite a few married foreigners. Maybe they couldn’t stand the prospect of Polish cooking every day? The French stomach simply isn’t accustomed to daily heapings of meat accompanied by mashed potatoes and gravy. 😉 Our food is the reason why French women usually stay slim into old age, while Polish women double in size after 40 compared to what they looked like at marriage. 😀

Posted on 9/21/16 | 8:12 AM CET

Krzysztof Prabucki

I don’t belive what I just saw. I’m a citizen of Poland, student on university and I don’t see those green-facist flags and so on. You really don’t know how our politics look like. Law and Justice hates ONR, Ruch Narodowy, Wolność and all this type of parties, because LaJ is social-democratic party with PPS (it’s Polish Socialists). The idea of Law and Justice is deeply connected with Józef Piłsudski and Jarosław Kaczyński trying to be like Piłsudski. ONR (like you said) nacionalists and Law and Justice hate each other. By the way ONR has 0.2% endorsment in polls, so what the hell are you talking about? Poland is not some facist country. Platforma Obywatelska (the previous leading party) was made of corrupted politicians (they led our country to bankrupcy). After 8 years of their governing all people wanted to get rid of them and Law and Justice just won the election. Now the corrupted politicians making manifestations and want to get back on stool.