You know if these bidders would communicate a lil bit and get on the same page instead of trying to undercut and f u c k the other guy, many of the issues with FDNY's bidding process could be fixed very quickly.

Go 2 or 3 RFP's or RFB's or whatever NYC calls their bid process and have every company refuse to bid and they might start singing a new tune.

Expecting a quality product for what your paying is one thing. To have unrealistic expectations and be willing to cause and watch companies go out of business is another altogether.

You know if these bidders would communicate a lil bit and get on the same page instead of trying to undercut and f u c k the other guy, many of the issues with FDNY's bidding process could be fixed very quickly.

One friend noted yesterday that a fire officer only carries a flashlight, sometimes prompting grumbling from firefighters who have to lug tools and hoses.
"The old saying is you never know how heavy that flashlight can become," the friend said.
-from a tragic story posted on firefighterclosecalls.com

Seems that the temptation to land an FDNY order large or small is TOO GREAT for some firms to resist. Thus is is doubtful that a refusal to bid by any and all vendors is a likely scenario anytime soon.

Little Birdy is never wrong about FDNY. He is also pretty DOBA (dead on balls accurate) about 98% of other apparatus matters. Sometimes it takes time to confirm what he and magic 8-ball predict, but it always pans out in the end.

How very nice. I sincerely hope that new vendors on FDNY orders are able to do what is required of them. Where does that leave Seagrave? I don't see very much evidence that they are surviving. Anybody able to fill us in?

Seagrave has the FDNY Aerialscope order that they are working on and there are other big cities with large apparatus orders that they can still bid on. They will survive ,but there prices have to match other builders or it's good by!

Seagrave has the FDNY Aerialscope order that they are working on and there are other big cities with large apparatus orders that they can still bid on. They will survive ,but there prices have to match other builders or it's good by!

They also have the tillers. But they better be careful, because KME just built a so-called "severe service" tiller for Camden NJ. I say "so-called" because it has been out of service more than it has been in service since delivered.

A 90 pumper order is a good thing for any builder, it will keep workers on the payroll for three years, much better than getting laid off. It would have been nice if the city of New York could have split the order between Kme, Ferrara, & Seagrave. That would have sent work to all three plants!

A 90 pumper order is a good thing for any builder, it will keep workers on the payroll for three years, much better than getting laid off. It would have been nice if the city of New York could have split the order between Kme, Ferrara, & Seagrave. That would have sent work to all three plants!

Wrong. I didn't suggest driving the price up, I said refuse to bid based on unrealistic expectations from the purchaser.

It a manufacturer decides on their own not to be stupid and low-bid themselves out of business, good for them.

But the second they "communicate a lil bit" and "get on the same page" like you stated, especially regarding contract bidding, it is called collusion which is highly illegal.

By the way, collusion and price fixing doesn't necessarily denote driving up prices above what could be considered normal. It could mean that another company just refuses to low-ball another due to some kind-of agreement.

One friend noted yesterday that a fire officer only carries a flashlight, sometimes prompting grumbling from firefighters who have to lug tools and hoses.
"The old saying is you never know how heavy that flashlight can become," the friend said.
-from a tragic story posted on firefighterclosecalls.com

One friend noted yesterday that a fire officer only carries a flashlight, sometimes prompting grumbling from firefighters who have to lug tools and hoses.
"The old saying is you never know how heavy that flashlight can become," the friend said.
-from a tragic story posted on firefighterclosecalls.com

Now that Kme Fire Apparatus has a signed contract from the City of New York,to build 90 engines over a three year span, will this be the first " split tilt cab " built by Kme ?

KME Receives FDNY Pumper Order
January 11, 2013

Nesquehoning, PA –KME is pleased to announce that it has received a purchase order from the City of New York for 2000gpm pumper trucks. The engines are an award from a 2012 bid which provides the opportunity for FDNY to purchase units through November of 2015.

According to John J. Kovatch III, KME President and CEO, “I’m excited about this new relationship. We’ve studied FDNY’s needs and waited for the right time. Our team has met with City personnel several times and I’m confident that we’re a natural fit for them. I believe that our location, high level of product customization and dedication to quality, service and support will make us a valued, long term supplier of apparatus.”

The engines will be built for FDNY on a KME Severe Service chassis with a stainless steel split tilt cab. More information will be released in the near future.

Hey FWD, You hit the nail on the head, I think that KME, under bid the warranty cost over a 5 year period. If the pumpers cost the about $ 500k to build with a small profit,and you only have $ 50k left for the repairs over the next 5 years they may brake even or lose money on the contract!