So if I understand this article, whilst Apple and Microsoft (more so than Apple) are trying to move away from the "PC" paradigm, Google seems to be trying to mimic it as closely as possible.

But then Google seems not to be trying to compete against the PC concept but rather appears to be trying to become a thin-PC client.

So I am confused.

Google appears to me to be trying to get the benefits of web+pc but offers a sub-PC experience while also giving a slightly confused web offering. It also seems to be trying to compete against tablets (especially as a lightweight internet device) but again offering little benefit other than a more mouse+keyboard friendly interface.

So in summary ... it seems to me to be little more than a cloud-concept device that happens to be looking for a purpose.

So it kind of looks like Win 7/8 desktop, has snapping like Aero Snap in Win 7/8, has a dock thats like the Windows taskbar including the near exact same position of things, and has window boxes with transparency like Windows Aero.

Are you sure Google didn't really call the UI "Aero" and not "Aura"?

All Google do is ripoff others and it's getting old. Even the Google Play store has a -slight- Microsoft Metro feel, and the same with Android 4.0. All of Googles stuff often feels like some cheap B-grade version of the competition.

So it kind of looks like Win 7/8 desktop, has snapping like Aero Snap in Win 7/8, has a dock thats like the Windows taskbar including the near exact same position of things, and has window boxes with transparency like Windows Aero.

This is like parody. I take it you only use Windows?

Ryan: did you try out the offline modes for Gmail or Google Docs? (I think using them as Chrome apps does this automatically, but I'm not sure). I'm curious if they make the ChromeOS experience better or if they aren't fully supported enough yet.

I saw that dropbox app in there. Can you upload things to dropbox from the Chrome OS? Is there local storage/file-system that you can use to do so? If not, are there other ways to get a document attachment from gmail, for example, into your dropbox? Or get a picture/pdf from a URL that you want to save to your dropbox?

Also I agree with crosslink, I love seeing articles like this because they embody the opinions of technical users and probably have a much bigger impact on the system's future development than any number of comments from non-published users.

Personally I would like to see this platform go even further towards a traditional desktop environment, but not all the way. Perhaps this is a bad example, but I feel that the "app drawer" approach is unnecessary. The standard Chrome in-tab extension list is far superior to the app drawer in that A) it can be kept open in a tab, B) it gives far more information about installed apps (in a "details list" form, similar to the "details" sorting option of Windows file systems), and C) you don't have to fudge around with context menus to do what you want. Context menus as exhibited in this article (in the app drawer image) are more geared towards a tablet experience, but unless I'm mistaken, Chromebooks are not generally designed to be tablets.

A better example would be the system-properties-type of stuff, such as the (currently) context menus for the clock/wifi/sound/user-login tray icons. While quick context-menu/bubble access to the most common settings is appreciable, there should definitely be a solid settings window you can open that would contain all of this plus the more advanced settings (like wifi profiles, advanced sound and user-login settings, etc). Although maybe that does exist (judging by the language used in the article), and Ryan just didn't post a screenshot of it. The bottom line is that convenient usability is detrimented (IMO) by the overuse of temporal UI elements, such as context-menus, bubbles, and other elements such as configuration windows and app-lists being presented in otherwise impermanent views.

If you take my meaning Ryan, could you possibly post some more screenshots or at least give us some more insight on any more advanced stuff like this? To be clear, some of your statements begged the question of what some UI elements actually look like, and how they are used: "The bubble displays sliders that can be used to adjust screen bightness [sic, BTW] and volume. It also has menus that the user can descend into to select a wireless network (or configure the 3G radio) and choose a different keyboard layout."

Site-specific browser tools have grappled with similar problems for a long time. Fluid, a popular tool for Mac OS X that lets users display a Web site in a stand-alone floating window, has a preference panel that lets the user specify whether links should be handled internally or in a regular browser window. Google might need to consider taking similar steps in order to make the stand-alone window mode more useful in Chrome OS.

They should just have an option, or default to, where and link to the same domain open in a new full window, but clicking on a link that leaves the domain opens up in a browser tab.

So it kind of looks like Win 7/8 desktop, has snapping like Aero Snap in Win 7/8, has a dock thats like the Windows taskbar including the near exact same position of things, and has window boxes with transparency like Windows Aero.

This is like parody. I take it you only use Windows?

He goes off the deep end to be sure, but the basis for his post is pretty spot-on... IMO

So it kind of looks like Win 7/8 desktop, has snapping like Aero Snap in Win 7/8, has a dock thats like the Windows taskbar including the near exact same position of things, and has window boxes with transparency like Windows Aero.

This is like parody. I take it you only use Windows?

He goes off the deep end to be sure, but the basis for his post is pretty spot-on... IMO

It is reminiscent of Windows 7...if you've only used Windows 7. All those features predate Aero as part of Linux window managers (which is all this is), and even if you don't count the stupid tricks you used to have to pull to get yourself a translucent terminal back in 2001, XGL/Compiz/whatever was making shiny transparent boxes before Aero looked like anything fancier than XP with smoother gradients.

In any case, this is what UIs do, they evolve by borrowing the look and feel of existing UIs and then building on them. This is how we innovate but how we also maintain usability. I say parody because you'll see the exact same comments coming from OS X users if you go back and look at the comments on the old Ars articles giving previews of the Vista betas. It's non-useful noise from people that have mistaken their choice of operating system for loyalty to their home tribe or their football club.

Google should just admit is is going to have to turn Chrome OS into what it really is: a simplified version of Linux.

It seems to be getting closer and closer and closer to to where current Linux distros already are.

Of course, Linux was never particularly popular for the desktop anyway.

I enjoy that they are pushing it with hardware vendors, but their plan is failing for several huge reasons... the biggest of which is that I have never seen a chromebook in person. Why can't I go play with one at Best Buy or Walmart?

and I would love to be able to download this as a fully supported distro.

I saw that dropbox app in there. Can you upload things to dropbox from the Chrome OS? Is there local storage/file-system that you can use to do so? If not, are there other ways to get a document attachment from gmail, for example, into your dropbox? Or get a picture/pdf from a URL that you want to save to your dropbox?

The operating system has its own native file manager that is implemented in HTML with a "downloads" folder that is user-read/writable. You can save anything you want in there and then upload items from it to any website that uses a standard file upload form. I believe that feature has already been available for quite some time in the stable channel, which is why it's not really addressed in the article.

The Dropbox application is the regular Dropbox website in a window. One of the nice features that Dropbox got in its latest website redesign is support for drag-and-drop file uploading. I tested this with Chrome OS when I was writing the article and was pleased to find that it actually does work. When I took screenshots on the Chromebook, I was able to drag them from the platform's file manager into the Dropbox website, which caused them to upload.

I enjoy that they are pushing it with hardware vendors, but their plan is failing for several huge reasons... the biggest of which is that I have never seen a chromebook in person. Why can't I go play with one at Best Buy or Walmart?

Here in the UK, "PC World" (probably the closest thing to "Best Buy") has dedicated Chromebook areas and staff in their stores.

It doesn't change the fact that you can buy the same hardware, with a Windows licence for the same amount of money (or less) about 5 metres away.

If the platform is limited (even intentionally) then the price needs to reflect that.

coder543 wrote:

and I would love to be able to download this as a fully supported distro.

A better example would be the system-properties-type of stuff, such as the (currently) context menus for the clock/wifi/sound/user-login tray icons. While quick context-menu/bubble access to the most common settings is appreciable, there should definitely be a solid settings window you can open that would contain all of this plus the more advanced settings (like wifi profiles, advanced sound and user-login settings, etc). Although maybe that does exist (judging by the language used in the article), and Ryan just didn't post a screenshot of it. The bottom line is that convenient usability is detrimented (IMO) by the overuse of temporal UI elements, such as context-menus, bubbles, and other elements such as configuration windows and app-lists being presented in otherwise impermanent views.

You can see the tray bubble interface in a screenshot on page 2. It looks a lot like the notification area popup on Android tablets. In the screenshot, you can see that the bottom item in the popup is a "Settings and Help" button. Clicking that will bring up the full Chrome OS settings panel, which I think comes pretty close to the kind of advanced settings interface that you want.

Ryan: did you try out the offline modes for Gmail or Google Docs? (I think using them as Chrome apps does this automatically, but I'm not sure). I'm curious if they make the ChromeOS experience better or if they aren't fully supported enough yet.

I wanted to try the Google Docs offline mode, but I couldn't get it working. Google's instructions refer to a menu item that wasn't available to me. I use Google Docs on a Google Apps account, so I'm assumed that's why the feature wasn't visible (Apps users are always the last people to get the new hotness).

Ryan: did you try out the offline modes for Gmail or Google Docs? (I think using them as Chrome apps does this automatically, but I'm not sure). I'm curious if they make the ChromeOS experience better or if they aren't fully supported enough yet.

I wanted to try the Google Docs offline mode, but I couldn't get it working. Google's instructions refer to a menu item that wasn't available to me. I use Google Docs on a Google Apps account, so I'm assumed that's why the feature wasn't visible (Apps users are always the last people to get the new hotness).

So it kind of looks like Win 7/8 desktop, has snapping like Aero Snap in Win 7/8, has a dock thats like the Windows taskbar including the near exact same position of things, and has window boxes with transparency like Windows Aero.

This is like parody. I take it you only use Windows?

He goes off the deep end to be sure, but the basis for his post is pretty spot-on... IMO

It is reminiscent of Windows 7...if you've only used Windows 7. All those features predate Aero as part of Linux window managers (which is all this is), and even if you don't count the stupid tricks you used to have to pull to get yourself a translucent terminal back in 2001, XGL/Compiz/whatever was making shiny transparent boxes before Aero looked like anything fancier than XP with smoother gradients.

In any case, this is what UIs do, they evolve by borrowing the look and feel of existing UIs and then building on them. This is how we innovate but how we also maintain usability. I say parody because you'll see the exact same comments coming from OS X users if you go back and look at the comments on the old Ars articles giving previews of the Vista betas. It's non-useful noise from people that have mistaken their choice of operating system for loyalty to their home tribe or their football club.

I've used and worked on just about everything. This has a Win7/8 look. Thats not necessarily a bad thing, but it is an objective observation. Yes, lots of individual features/technologies of Aero existed prior to Vista and Win7, but Aero still as a package had its own unique look/feel.

Here is the thing though: As similiar as this looks, in practice it may not 'feel' the same. Difficult to tell from the screen shots. But basic navigation looks pretty identical to me, the "app drawer" is basically the Win8 start screen, and the pinned task bar icons are the Win8 task bar in desktop mode. But again, it might feel different in practice.

The operating system has its own native file manager that is implemented in HTML with a "downloads" folder that is user-read/writable. You can save anything you want in there and then upload items from it to any website that uses a standard file upload form. I believe that feature has already been available for quite some time in the stable channel, which is why it's not really addressed in the article.

The Dropbox application is the regular Dropbox website in a window. One of the nice features that Dropbox got in its latest website redesign is support for drag-and-drop file uploading. I tested this with Chrome OS when I was writing the article and was pleased to find that it actually does work. When I took screenshots on the Chromebook, I was able to drag them from the platform's file manager into the Dropbox website, which caused them to upload.

That's pretty awesome. Thank you very much for the info, and apologies for not realizing this was available earlier.

The Chromebook...a "solution" to a problem that doesn't exist. I honestly can't think of a single type of person I would recommend this too...

Then I guess you don't know many people.

There are a tremendous number of people who could certainly use a very secure computer specifically for financial transactions. What's the price a chromebook versus the potential cost of a major account hack? It depends on the amount in the accounts. For many people, the price of a chromebook would be a negligible expense. Lock it in a safe, use it exclusively for such transactions.

That's just one use case. There are many others. Any business with valid security concerns could probably find use of this sort of machine for a subset of their employees. Just because it doesn't have the flexibility of a Windows 7 or OS10 machine doesn't mean it wouldn't be adequate for a large proportion of an enterprise.

Many would say that cheaper Windows and Mac OS notebooks offer better value, but value depends on requirements. Neither Windows now Mac come anywhere close to the security offered by Chrome OS. Chrome OS is designed to keep idiot users from compromising their own security. Windows and Mac do neither.

If you don't give a really damn about security or require a machine that can play games and run photoshop, no, this is definitely not the product for you. That doesn't mean it's not an excellent product that could be very valuable to someone else, someone with very different requirements than yours.

If the platform is limited (even intentionally) then the price needs to reflect that.

Very sensible, but there isn't very far for them to go to the bottom. There's a train of thought that persists on the Internet that shedding the OEM Windows license would result in much cheaper PCs. While on a strict dollar-for-dollar basis it might result in a savings of $35 or $40, even on low-end PCs that results in only a 10% cost savings over the total price...and it ignores the costs to the OEM that they would have to absorb or pay out for the replacement OS. After all, the costs to most OEMs for the software they distribute isn't free...they either have to staff for it, or it's provided by the vendor (like Red Hat and Microsoft)

Basically, the idea that the economics of ChromeOS on real hardware could showhow be vastly superior to Windows is something I'd have to see laid out with numbers, otherwise it's just an idea.

There are a tremendous number of people who could certainly use a very secure computer specifically for financial transactions. What's the price a chromebook versus the potential cost of a major account hack? It depends on the amount in the accounts. For many people, the price of a chromebook would be a negligible expense. Lock it in a safe, use it exclusively for such transactions.

That's just one use case. There are many others. Any business with valid security concerns could probably find use of this sort of machine for a subset of their employees. Just because it doesn't have the flexibility of a Windows 7 or OS10 machine doesn't mean it wouldn't be adequate for a large proportion of an enterprise.

The thing is, there is a big difference in finding a use for a product that exists and designing a product for a specific use. If Google has designed Chrome OS for that type of use because they think that's a big enough market, then it makes sense. But if they're just making it as more of an experiment, with no clearly defined use case that is substantially different enough from Android, Windows, iOS, OS X, or Linux then I can't see it being very successful. Is security the main point of Chrome OS?

Not only is it the main point, I've never seen another point to the product.

That said, I believe there is a tremendous market for a relatively inexpensive - very secure online computing platform. A platform that protects users from exploits and protects them from themselves. There are a huge number of businesses and end users that need something like the security of Chrome OS, unfortunately, most have no idea how insecure their current solutions are.

Most small business people I know manage their online accounts on Windows machines. It's lunacy. For a few hundred dollars they could almost completely insure themselves against banking exploits. I know of businesses that could be ruined if their secret sauce were hacked by their (often foreign) competition. That secret sauce sits on Mac's and Windows boxes. They may be encrypted, they may be managed and locked down by enterprise solutions, but zero days do happen and silly users go places they shouldn't and install things they shouldn't.

Yes, security is one of the main selling points. Readers who aren't familiar with the security characteristics of the platform might want to have a look at the third page of the original Cr-48 review, where that issues is discussed at length: http://arstechnica.com/open-source/revi ... ptop.ars/3 That will provide some context for the points that Lemmi is making.

In the screenshot, you can see that the bottom item in the popup is a "Settings and Help" button. Clicking that will bring up the full Chrome OS settings panel, which I think comes pretty close to the kind of advanced settings interface that you want.