NOTE: This thread is NOT for asking about whether a certain band is acceptable or not. Initial assessment of bands is what the band queue is for. This thread is for appeals to/questions about rejections/deletions/blacklistings only. Don't try to cut in line. We don't do "pre-checks", so don't bother asking. If you feel you have to ask here, perhaps it's better not to submit at all.

This is the thread to appeal your submitted band being rejected or deleted (or for inquiring about blacklisted/deleted bands in general). Please read this post before posting, it will save you a lot of headache.

[ Thread renewed due to the "No posts exist for this topic" bug. Here's the old one for future references: viewtopic.php?t=39064 ]

- Before asking why a band was deleted, >>>use the search function<<< to see if the reasons of the deletion can be found.

Search for keywords: Band nameSearch for all termsSearch in forums:: Suggestions and complaintsDisplay results as: Posts

If the search yielded no results, you may ask. POLITELY. Rudeness and insults will not be tolerated.

Before posting, ask yourself these questions:

1) Did you read all the Site Rules?2) Does your submitted band have a valid album out? (See here for what we define as a valid release.)3) Is your submitted band's release already out/available as of the date of your posting? 4) Did you provide evidence of the above under the "submission rules" field of the band form?

If you answer NO to any of the above questions, then you can stop right there, as there are no ways to appeal this. Please only resubmit your band when you have an available physical album, or a valid digital album, and evidence for it.

1. Releases

The MA only accepts bands that have a physical release or a valid digital release. For physical releases, that means that the band must either have a CD, a tape, a vinyl, or a release in some other physical format out. Since January 1st, 2013, the site also allows certain digital-only bands. Please be aware that despite all guidelines listed in the rules, the judging of an acceptable digital-only release is fundamentally case-by-case and as such can still depend on the staff's discretion, as these releases are generally more complicated to judge. You can post in this thread and state your case with the necessary evidence and arguments if you disagree with a rejection based on an unacceptable digital release, but if you are again given a "no", don't continue to argue about the details. An initial rejection most often already means that the release was thoroughly reviewed and judged unacceptable. We try to be realistic about what digital release we consider serious and "proper", but are also very careful about adding such bands lest the site becomes flooded with crappy bedroom demo bands.

Also, whatever the valid release, it must have been released by the time of the band's submission. Even if the release comes out tomorrow, the band will not be accepted until then.

2. "Metalness"

The second requirement is more difficult to assess as accurately as the existence of a physical release, but the staff here mostly knows what is metal and what isn't. Mistakes do happen, and if you are absolutely certain a mistake has been done, show us the band's music and we'll listen. Do not argue the decisions. This thread is a court of appeals, not a shouting match. If you act rudely and/or refuse to accept the decision, you might get banned. And provide samples, otherwise it will not lead to anything.

3. Evidence

If you submit a band, it's your task to provide the mods with evidence. A band's MySpace page or MP3s uploaded somewhere will work well as evidence on the metalness, but the problems usually encountered concern the existence of a physical release. A good quality digital photograph of a CD and a case is a good way to provide evidence (here is an example), as is a distro list distributing it or a mention on a label website. If you opt for the photograph, upload it on an image hosting website (Imgur, TinyPic...) and include the link to the photo in the "Submission notes" of your band form. Reviews on respectable and well-known websites are acceptable, too. However, a crude band website mentioning a demo casually, with no information on the format, no links or email addresses for ordering it, no cover art, or cover art that does not seem convincing (bad photoshops, MS Paint, etc.) are not enough. The required amount of evidence is decided by the moderator, and the evidence must be supplied by the submitter.

4. Side-projects

EDIT: As of September 2015, regular users are no longer allowed to submit side-projects or other non-metal.

A side-project is a band started in parallel to another band. It is not the same thing as a band member leaving a band and forming a new one, or to join another band. The MA accepts some side-projects of metal band members, the metal band in question must be on MA. The side-project must be on a label with worldwide distribution. It means that the label must have professional distributors who will supply real-life shops with albums, in other words be a big enough label. It is not the same as worldwide shipping, method used by small online labels.Finally, the side-project rule is not absolute. Not all bands that fulfil its material requirements will be added, particularly if they are adjudged to have minimal connection to the metal culture. Precedent-setting side-projects, such as Mortiis, were originally decided on this basis alone, before the rule was further codified as a matter of necessity. These further codifications are intended as a band-aid/block to reduce queue clutter (i.e. scads of social-networking-based "ambient" projects with no significant output)--not as a new loophole or primary admission criterion.

5. Comparing bands (don't)

This may seem like the obvious course of action in some cases, but be advised that we generally frown upon arguments like "you have band A listed and band B is similar, hence you must also accept band B". Please avoid this, as it comes with the following problems:1) We simply do not work that way. Each band is assessed and judged on its own merit and trying to compare two distinct bands is treacherous business, even if they may sound similar. And if the two are indeed sonic carbon copies, perhaps the listed one should be deleted instead.2) Since the site lists a (very) small number of non-metal exceptions, one might be tempted to use them as a reference point. However, these are exactly that, exceptions, and not subject to our guidelines on music.3) Slippery slope. We do not want to base further inclusions solely on one or more listed band(s) that might be questionable or were wrongly approved to begin with. We would rather (re-)assess the proposed inclusion and the compared listed band(s) on their own instead of expanding a part of the database based around repeated instances of a resigned "we'll, we have this, why not this as well?". See item 1). To be clear, nobody thinks that we'd otherwise be doomed to ride into fallacy territory and in danger of including BB King or whatever, but we are quite strict about keeping the database focussed. 4) Most importantly, the Archives can in some ways be seen as a database of metal releases rather than bands. What that means is that in order to gain entry, a band only needs one predominantly metal release (ideally a full-length), regardless of the rest of their discography. This can result in bands starting out as metal, but changing to non-metal later or the reverse. More subtle cases exist, with bandsbeinglistedbased ona (possiblylesser-known) fractionof theirdiscography. So how does this connect to comparing bands? Well, it's simple: Since we judge releases, comparing band A as a whole to band B as a whole is a fallacious argument when one is actually comparing non-metal output of band A (accepted based on their metal output) to non-metal output of band B (unacceptable because they have no metal output). Consider it one level above arguing that band B should be included because they have a few songs as metal as band A's releases.

So again, each band is judged individually and we don't do the blind approach "A, hence also B".

6. Be patient

The staff consists entirely of unpaid volunteers investing their own free time in this site. We aren't a streamlined there-for-you-24/7 service. Response time to your inquiries may vary, depending on who's online and who checks this subforum. Mods may answer within minutes, but a few days aren't unusual either. That means that you SHOULD NOT repost your inquiry unless both of the following conditions are fulfilled: 1) it's been unusually long (over 1 week at least) since your post, 2) your post is no longer on the last page of this thread. Note that sometimes mods may choose to respond to inquiries preceeding or suceeding yours, but seemingly "ignore" yours. Again, DO NOT repost, unless the two aforementioned conditions apply. Read the second paragraph here as to why responses can be selective.

Before posting, please think through every point on this list, and try to figure out with your common sense what might be wrong. Also, check the email feedback box under your profile on the database, and you'll get the reasons for rejections via email. The moderator will include a description of the problem. If all this does not help, ask about the band ON THIS THREAD. Do NOT start a new one asking "why didn't you accept Vomit Sodomy?!? they are metal and have The Undead Muessin out next month!! Assholes!". We won't bite, unless you start barking.

[Edited by Azmodes on January 4th, 2013; reflecting the rule change regarding valid releases][Edited by Azmodes on June 16th, 2014; added the bit about pre-checks][Edited by Azmodes on June 25th, 2015; some minor tweaking][Edited by Azmodes on November 27th, 2015; added the bit about comparing bands][Edited by Azmodes on January 4th, 2017; added the bit about patience]

Last edited by Fanfarigoule on Tue May 11, 2010 3:57 pm, edited 6 times in total.

I' am sorry for all the inconvenience.
I must be giving u a hard time.

When I started "spamming" this forum earlier to day I had no idea my release where out for sale. I now draw back my statment that it was "not yet distributed".
Clearly from the new evidence I just found in my quest for getting Kraaker into the archives it IS.

I'll wait a couple of days and see if more proof comes up and try to resubmit.

I tryied to upload a band with a link of a pishical release photography; the bans is called That, a side-proyect of ØØpart, my one-man proyect; before reject the proyect again, remember this rule in the metal archives page:

5) Must be a heavy metal band...

We accept the following non-metal bands in certain cases:

* Side-projects of metal band members

And the reason you reject the band is:

Either there is a lack of information, or this band has no apparent discography. Please see rule #7. If this band has indeed released anything and you can show us proof, you can resubmit it again.

The band will not be accepted for reasons above. If you are not able to comprehend the written rules, your problem.

Side-projects are a big debate. When does a band stop being one and starts being a full-time band? What's the difference between a solo career and a side-project, etc. Now, a side-project is a band started in parallel to another band. This is not the same thing as a band member leaving a band and forming a new one, or to join another band! For example, Soulfly is no more a side-project of Max Cavalera as Voivod is a side-project of Jason Newsted.
One might argue that a band can start as such but can stop being one if the main band splits-up. Or that while it's reasonable to have Wongraven or Chaostar, that a country band started by a Flotsam & Jetsam member would simply look out of place on a metal site. Our answer is that we have no choice but to go with a case by case approach. It might be a little arbitrary, but it's hard to define a rule that will apply for every case of a non-metal side-project. Yes, that might mean you'll have to ask us before submitting this guy's side-project. Usually there shouldn't be any problem, but if the side-project really has nothing to do with the heavy metal scene and/or would really look out of place here, chances are, it won't be accepted.

That is not the whole rule, it also says that it must be on a label with worldwide distribution.

We accept the following non-metal bands in certain cases (these exceptions can be ambiguous and debatable - scroll down for details):

* Side-projects of metal band members (ex: Pain, Wongraven, Die Verbannten Kinder Eva's)
Note that side-projects will only be eligible if they have at least one release on a label with worldwide distribution (to avoid a flood of bedroom/MySpace bands).

Last edited by Witcher on Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.

That is not the whole rule, it also says that it must be on a label with worldwide distribution.

We accept the following non-metal bands in certain cases (these exceptions can be ambiguous and debatable - scroll down for details):

* Side-projects of metal band members (ex: Pain, Wongraven, Die Verbannten Kinder Eva's) Note that side-projects will only be eligible if they have at least one release on a label with worldwide distribution (to avoid a flood of bedroom/MySpace bands). * Bands that are no longer metal, but are/were still generally recognized as metal bands (ex: Burzum, Metallica) * Grindcore if it's close enough to death metal (ex: Carcass, Napalm Death)

That is not the whole rule, it also says that it must be on a label with worldwide distribution.

Show me where says it in the page

I read it ALL the page

Here:
Side-projects of metal band members (ex: Pain, Wongraven, Die Verbannten Kinder Eva's)
Note that side-projects will only be eligible if they have at least one release on a label with worldwide distribution (to avoid a flood of bedroom/MySpace bands).

That is not the whole rule, it also says that it must be on a label with worldwide distribution.

We accept the following non-metal bands in certain cases (these exceptions can be ambiguous and debatable - scroll down for details):

* Side-projects of metal band members (ex: Pain, Wongraven, Die Verbannten Kinder Eva's) Note that side-projects will only be eligible if they have at least one release on a label with worldwide distribution (to avoid a flood of bedroom/MySpace bands).

And what about the LLN bands, and there are lots of side proyects of them, and they were ALL independient, and there are here

That is not the whole rule, it also says that it must be on a label with worldwide distribution.

We accept the following non-metal bands in certain cases (these exceptions can be ambiguous and debatable - scroll down for details):

* Side-projects of metal band members (ex: Pain, Wongraven, Die Verbannten Kinder Eva's) Note that side-projects will only be eligible if they have at least one release on a label with worldwide distribution (to avoid a flood of bedroom/MySpace bands).

And what about the LLN bands, and there are lots of side proyects of them, and they were ALL independient, and there are here

They are selected exceptions. Now, you have been told the decision, so please stop.

That is not the whole rule, it also says that it must be on a label with worldwide distribution.

Show me where says it in the page

I read it ALL the page

Here: Side-projects of metal band members (ex: Pain, Wongraven, Die Verbannten Kinder Eva's)Note that side-projects will only be eligible if they have at least one release on a label with worldwide distribution (to avoid a flood of bedroom/MySpace bands).

That is not the whole rule, it also says that it must be on a label with worldwide distribution.

We accept the following non-metal bands in certain cases (these exceptions can be ambiguous and debatable - scroll down for details):

* Side-projects of metal band members (ex: Pain, Wongraven, Die Verbannten Kinder Eva's) Note that side-projects will only be eligible if they have at least one release on a label with worldwide distribution (to avoid a flood of bedroom/MySpace bands).

And what about the LLN bands, and there are lots of side proyects of them, and they were ALL independient, and there are here

They are selected exceptions. Now, you have been told the decision, so please stop.

"They are selected exceptions. Now, you have been told the decision, so please stop"

That is not the whole rule, it also says that it must be on a label with worldwide distribution.

Show me where says it in the page

I read it ALL the page

Here: Side-projects of metal band members (ex: Pain, Wongraven, Die Verbannten Kinder Eva's)Note that side-projects will only be eligible if they have at least one release on a label with worldwide distribution (to avoid a flood of bedroom/MySpace bands).

"They are selected exceptions. Now, you have been told the decision, so please stop"

BASED ON WHAT? and please don't be agresive Im not fighting, like you

Quote:

Additionally, there will be some non-metal bands featured on the site that we feel are still part of the metal scene despite not being metal themselves (usually darkwave, ambient, neo-classical and/or folk bands, examples being Mortiis, Elend, Autumn Tears, Stille Volk, etc). These bands are selected by the moderators in an admittedly arbitrary fashion, and their submission by normal users is discouraged. Please bear with us on this.

Now, don't tell us you read ALL the page or, else, you have comprehension problems.

Last edited by Fanfarigoule on Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

They influenced MOST of the metal bands of our days, and they are not part of this site? This is unacceptable!!!I would like to know why is that???Because they are not considered metal? This is not fare!!!

grauw from the netherlands have been rejected, since there is no proof of a release, but i have got the released cd-r here at home. is that not a real release then ?
and if you need a picture of it for proof, where can i send it ?