If you've seen a sig that may be overpowered, rule-breaking, or otherwise merits attention for the wrong reasons, report or challenge it here.

NOTE: The following procedure must be adhered to at all times.

- Upon finding a sig worth reporting, the user posts the sig in full; Pokemon, bio and all, and the post approving it in the sig approval thread. Ideally the user should explain in reasonable terms why the sig breaks the rules. The user must also notify the user in ownership of the sig by linking to the post challenging the sig in a message.

- The challenged user is permitted to make a single post in defence of the sig, explaining why the sig should be permitted and/or otherwise not changed or retroactively rejected.

- The League Official shall make the final decision in a single post summing up the rationale of the decision.

- Under no circumstances should other non-LO members post and clog up the thread.

- All of the above is to be conducted in a civil, non-confrontational manner.

Thank you for your kind attention.

Only coming in here to make this post because its blatantly obvious no one else is. Seriously guys? You're all more mature and respectful than this and you know it. We closed the last thread because of this crap, let's not ruin this one when its been perfectly fine for a while now.

Okay so I'm going to close this thread for a little bit because I need some time to think on it before I adjudicate. I obviously set a precedence on this and it's kind of a bad one so I'm going to need a little time to reconsider.

On a related note, Emi is pretty much right. Please be respectful.

I'd also like to take this opportunity to note that this thread should not be used for witch hunting. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt for the time being but it is a little suspicious that there are two sigs brought up for the same member not too long after they returned.

I really don't think a Chatot with an above average moveset is going to be shaking up the meta, but I also don't really love build a 'mon sigs either. I think limiting it to 15 moves and getting rid of the extra sound move boost is fine.

TiVo: Female Smeargle
Biography: A change that defined 21st century television was the creation of TiVo. The ability to program shows into its memory was outstanding. Every line, sound, and movement, TiVo records with ease and never forgets. As an early model, you can say it works too well. Once it records something, it does not have the function to delete or erase. Technology comes with a price, but the benefits out weight the cost.
Special Training: TiVo Programming [Various]
TiVo has upgraded her capabilities of using Sketch, accessing two additional slots per new trainer level, capping off at 12 additional move slots by the time her trainer reaches TL7. TiVo’s upgrade allows her to tune into any finished match the she was previously present as a squad member as if she had DVRed the moves. TiVo can submit which moves with appropriate round links that she learned from her studies via the Miscellaneous Squad Submissions thread and naturally the moves must be recorded into TiVo’s biography. This function only works for the DVR sketch slots gained via this signature. After the available DVR slots are recorded, TiVo cannot DVR new moves with those slots until six months have passed for the owner. She cannot sketch any Legend Moves with any of her DRV sketch slots.

Just pointing out that still doesn't require Smeargle having actually been used in the match, let alone having seen the move.

Yes, that was the intention. Whatever moves I change via the DVR slots are the same moves I could change in a quick 2v2 doubles. Your argument for abuse does not really hold up in this instance. I implore you that you next time send me a VM so I can properly address my rationale behind the signature, as it was meant to be a constructive dialogue between the member who placed it here and the member defending their signature. I did not notice you had placed it here until Jeri made mention that two of my sigs were placed in the sig court back to back. Cheers.

Honestly, I was looking for something rather unique within the Smeargle circle that was picking up before I left. I think this is pretty tamed as is because I only plan to swap out moves if the current descriptions change, or new event moves are added for example. The current moves are not improved in their ability on how to perform them, and it is certainly not the Smeargle with the most sketch slots available. Mercutio, what do you suggest would be a proper fix for this signature? Scrapping it all together is within the realms of possibility if you still feel it is overdone.

The intent of the sig was, at a basic level, to get around how cumbersome sketch matches are.

The concern with this sig was, at a basic level, that it allowed CAP (more than Smeargle already does), and moreso, CAP with a movepool that can be changed at the owner's whim. These are not illegitimate.

The edits help this by substantially cutting down on the moves available to DVR (things Smeargle was in a squad for is a huge improvement from any match ever), and lengthening the time required to swap a move (making it harder to customize Smeargle for a specific match).

If it turns out that the sig is being abused, we could revisit this, but I think that the current form of the sig is safe enough. Plus Jeri already ruled on this, so it's a fairly moot matter.

Cloud: Level 1 Male Mantyke
Hidden Power: Fire
Biography: Cloud spent a lot of his time floating in the sky, and bringing rain to places that needed it, being of both the seas and the skies. But unlike a real cloud, instead of having the ability to create lightening and thunder, he ironically feared them. Zeus, the god of clouds and lightening, seeing his disciple's predicament, gave him the ability to better deal with electrical attacks.
Signature: Special Training- Thunder Cloud
Cloud takes half the usual damage from the first two Electric-type attacks used against him. After he has taken these first two Electric type attacks, he starts to rain down, i.e., the weather changes to Rain, as if Cloud had just used rain dance. This rain part would of course not happen in a arena where a Rain Dance would fail. Cloud has also learned how to use Discharge and Volt Switch. Due to immense practice, he is capable of holding position indefinitely when flying, just like a real cloud.
He no longer resists Steel, Fighting and Bug type attacks due to never dealing with these. He can no longer use Acrobatics, Air Cutter, Attract, Bubble, Captivate, Endure, Facade, Frustration, Mud-Slap, Natural Gift, Return, Rock Slide, Secret Power, Slam, Tackle, Water Sport, Wing Attack. His baby pokemon techniques are no longer effective due to his maturity.

Was perusing the newbie matches on SPPf when this caught my eye.

Really, the problem I have with this sig is that it's basically 4 sigs in one. It grants new (and useful) offtype, a switching move, a rain dance that doesn't cost a move, better flight, and the first two attacks that hit it x3 effective are severely weakened, to the point that the weakness is almost neutralized entirely. This is made worse by the fact that by and large non-electrics only have two uses of their electric offtype, unless they have HP Electric on top of say, ThunderPunch or Discharge.

It doesn't really give up too much in the way of drawback either- Sure, it loses 3 resistances, but who honestly gives a damn about resistances? Fighting and Bug are still fucked over by Air Slash and Twister having infinite type energy, while Steels hardly like dealing with the Earthquake, Bulldoze, and HP Fire that Mantyke retains- with a 3 this Mantyke can wipe out half of a pure steel type's health bar in one go. The only truly relevant moves it loses are Rock Slide and Secret Power, and even then, Rock Slide is difficult for Mantine to really utilize since it has to be in a rock arena or something to use it now that Magic!Rock Slide is Rock Exclusive.

It just doesn't sit right with me that we're giving a Pokemon as objectively solid as Mantine 4 sigs, one of which allows it to neutralize a double weakness in the vast majority of matchups, for the effective price of Secret Power and a neutral matchup against Steels that it still by and large does excellently in. Mantine is not a Carbink.

Let us assume, that it is 4 sigs in one. I have found something that I would like to show you.

TKF's Gourgeist:
Visaljos the Shiny Super Sized Gourgeist (lvl 3 female)
Bio
Visaljos was born with a slight defect, the natural mechanism responsible for her lantern lights was undeveloped and unable to create light like others of her species. When I found her, she had lost all of her confidence and had put herself into exile. Eager to help her work out her issues I decided to help her fix her lantern lights. I used my tiny joltik, Borulus to search inside the Pumpkaboo, looking for some way to get her lights up and running. It seemed her internal battery had not developed, meaning that there was nothing to fuel the lights! I got Borulus to give her a bit of a jump start in the form of a quick discharge. The idea worked as Visaljos’s lights came flashing on with a blinding intensity. Borulus hopped out of her, and we all celebrated the achievement. She needs to restart her internal battery regular however, so she had to work on learning some electric moves of her own!
Special Training: Internal Battery
Due to needing to jumpstart her internal battery regularly, Visaljos has spent a lot of time working with the electric type. She is now familiar with the electric type, learning discharge, thunder wave and volt switch. She also has electricity constantly coursing through her body, making her take neutral damage from flying and ground type moves. She also never learnt how to use fire blast or gyro ball.

Slash's Trapinch
Aurora: Trapinch Lv 1 (F)
Aurora has always been preoccupied with the wind. It's such a graceful force of nature, but seeing wind-swept deserts and eroded mountains, there can be no doubt whatsoever that it is indeed a force to be reckoned with. Something with such beauty and yet such power must be respected. And in her mind, this also means it must be trained, honed, developed. Her largest subject of study was of course the desert where she grew up. She saw many rock formations wear away, slowly but steadily, the desert claiming more and more land for its own with its sandy winds. It seemed like such a simple mix, sand and wind, but those two combined, it seemed almost like they could do anything. And she knew that if she harnessed this power, she, too, could do anything.
Sig: Special Training: Do The Windy Thing
Aurora has focused much on her wind techniques and on honing new ones, giving her access to Icy Wind, Blizzard, Leaf Tornado, Leaf Storm, and Hurricane. She has the off-type to use the most powerful move granted per type twice per battle. With no extra energy investment, she can charge Ground energy into any wind or breath move to make it take on the Ground typing instead of their native typing, although retaining all other effects. Her wind and breath-based moves are all saturated with sand, giving them an irritation effect and making panes break easily under their power. This also creates a somewhat weak pseudo-Sandstorm effect within a few meters of her for the round's duration. However, this comes at a cost. She can no longer use Superpower, Crunch, Hyper Beam, Fury Cutter, Solar Beam, or Fissure. Upon evolution, her flight will be slightly less fast and free than others of her species.

So how many sigs is this?
1. Three new offtypes
2. Gains familiarity level type energy for each of these new offtypes.
3. For literally no drawback, she can use these moves moves as ground typed, so you can use moves that have great secondary effect as many times as she likes as long as they are ground typed.
4. Every time one of these moves is used, a weak Sandstorm is created.

Regina: Level 5 Genderless Electrode
HP Grass
Biography: Regina is a very special Electrode. She was born from a Love Ball- and because of that she can feel love, unlike most Electrode, which are entirely inorganic. While she's still genderless, she fully identifies as a female and desperately wishes she really was one. She's very affectionate, and loves watching romantic movies and following couples on dates. While observing this way, she discovered that most women are given beautiful, sparkly jewelry by their partners, and she became incredibly fond of sparkly things because of this. Disappointed that she would never have a male Electrode give her something sparkly due to genderlessness, Regina decided that she had to take it upon herself to get her own sparkly things. She took to stealing from jewelry shops to get what she wanted, and became something of an outlaw Pokemon. One day, I was shopping in a jewelry store for my girlfriend when she tried to rob it. I stopped her and caught her. When we were out of the store, I let her out of her ball and convinced her to let me help her train to create sparkly things herself. She agreed, though we had a problem- I had no clue how to teach an electrode how to use fancy attacks like that! Luckily, thanks to her status as a special Electrode and her being naturally different than most Electrode, she had an easier time with this task than most would, and it produced results perhaps even more astonishing than the effects of her birth defects.

Sig: Type Change: Ball of Love
Regina has adopted a secondary Fairy type, now being an Electric/Fairy type Pokemon. She has the normal weaknesses and resistances associated with the typing, with a few exceptions. For one, she is only resistant to Dragon-type moves rather than immune. For another, she takes neutral damage from Dark moves, as the absence of love in these two types upsets her greatly. She has gained access to Dazzling Gleam and Play Rough. In addition, her Hyper Beam and Secret Power attacks may now be ordered as Fairy-Type moves, ordered as Fairy!Hyper Beam and Fairy!Secret Power. She may not change the type of a move more than once per round, however. Because of her sweet, loving nature, she can also use Draining Kiss, Lovely Kiss, and Sweet Kiss. Due to her love of beautiful, sparkly things, she gains access to Power Gem, Aurora Beam and Mirror Shot, having the energy to use each thrice per battle. However, she loses Foul Play, Sucker Punch, and Thief, as these ways are too dark for her loving nature, and loses Gyro Ball for being ungraceful. She has also lost Self-Destruct, Confide, and Substitute. As she identifies with the female gender, Attract and other such attacks with work on her if used by a Male Pokemon despite her being genderless.

So how many sigs is this?
1. Type change to one of the best type combination.
2. Fairy type moves added.
3 Ability to convert her secret power and hyper beam into fairy typed.
4. Three completely new offtypes.
5. Gaining familiarity level offtype for these moves.

Enough with the obvious scapegoating
and pointing finger at others, specially when you have a pokemon much more ridiculous than mine.
There are like at least 20-30 more sigs out there similar to these, and I am not even going to defend myself, until you have courted all of the other sigs that according to your logic are "multi sig sigs".

Also, almost forgot, Miror's mantine sig.

Irwin
[ Level 4 Male Mantine ]
[Biography ] - Despite his name clearly indicating that he is similar to the manta ray in our world, Irwin was born with a genetic mutation that made him more similar to the stingrays that we see. Have a nearly footlong barb at the end of his tail(?), Irwin was proud of this feature. Discovering his crippling weakness to electric attacks pretty early on, using a combination of the move he already knew (that being Mud Sport), as well as the barb which he learned could function in the way he wanted it to, and after much practice with a Rhydon, the Mantine achieved what he sought out to do with his strange deformity combined with other strange tactics.
[ Hidden Power: Ground]
Signature Move:
Special Training - Lightningrod
Whenever an Electric move that travels in a beam or something similar (Thunder, Thunderbolt, Shock Wave, Discharge, Thunder Wave, etc.) is used around Irwin, it instead redirects to his mud laden tail, becoming neutralized and having no effect. Electric moves that make physical contact (Nuzzle, Thunder Fang, Volt Tackle, etc.) or ones that travel through the air but aren't that mold (Zap Cannon, Volt Switch, Electro Ball, etc.) will still strike for their usual amounts of damage. Irwin has lost the ability to use Hydro Pump, Blizzard, Mud Sport, Wide Guard, and Aqua Tail.

Turning a x3 weakness to neutral. At least my sig was doing it only first two times, and instead of neutrality, x1.5. Also look at drawbacks, majority of them are physical direct contact ones, for a pokemon that either swims or is usually flying.

( Just clarifyin, I haven't reported any of the four sigs stated above. I was just using them as examples, to show that a lot of "x sigs in 1"'sig are around us.)

My main issue with Austo's sig is that it could use a bit more drawback, but I'm not that fussed about it. Not sig courtable. At least it has some cohesion from a "gain electric moves, and shift the type chart to more resemble an electric". Pumpkaboo is pretty mediocre and can get away with it as far as I'm concerned. This is one sig by current standards.

My main issue with Slash's Trapinch sig is that it is stupid broken and he should feel ashamed of himself for it. I read through that thing expecting it to end in a "cannot evolve" but nope. The sheer amount of effects is also an issue but this is waaaay too broken which is the greater concern.

My main issue with Slash's Electrode sig is less that it's two in one, because Electrode is a terrible terrible Pokemon, and more.... Uh... Yeah struggling on this one. Adding new offtypes on top of the type change is a bit much, sure, but it's an Electrode and he gives up two of his three old ones. It does break the two in one rule, but for Electrode we can let it slide provided there is proper drawback. Also that's not Familiarity on any of those new off types. Rock is a bit boosted over normal but that's about it. And it's fairly customary to give moves of the type you're type changing into, particularly if you don't have moves of that type already.

Miror's Mantine sig is imbalanced and he should nerf it. He can fly to dodge the physical moves and the most common ranged moves he is safe from. Not really okay. Maybe if he added another weakness to balance the typechart but eh. Needs to be reworked.

TalkSick's Mantyke is 4 sigs in one to a ludicrous extent. Maybe 3 if we want to link the electric bits, but still ridiculous. It's not as broken as Slash's Trapinch, but it's on a whole other level in the multiple effects category. Obviously the drawback can be reduced accordingly, but he needs to pare down the effects. He also needs to not act like he's being overly persecuted because he has a broken sig.

Normally I'd tell Stealthy he shouldn't break the rules but honestly he said what I was going to say more eloquently. I'll still say it, though.

@TKF's Gourgeist
I would probably only call that 2 sigs in one (Electric familiarity will obviously have Electric moves to go with it on a non-electric type). It needs a little more drawback, but it's not stupidly overpowered.

@Slash's Trapinch
Yes, this is an absolutely insane Sig. It's also one I have never seen before. Holding any given person who walks into sig court accountable for every single sig ever approved is more than a little insane, TalkSick.

@My Electrode
Again, if you think 3 uses of Aurora Beam is familiarity, you bluntly are reffing familiarity wrong. Furthermore, Mirror Shot isn't even a new offtype. And even then, of course a type change is going to include moves of the new type if the 'mon doesn't get them naturally. While this is easily the strongest multi-sig you brought up, it still is only 2 sigs in one compared to your 4 (1. New electric attacks 2. Neutrality on first two moves 3. Better Flight 4. Free Rain Dance). Not to mention this sig is on one of the objectively worst Pokemon in the game. Compare to Mantine, which is an excellent pokemon in its own right.

Oh yeah, all of these sigs have far more relevant drawback, too.

By the by, the notion that I'm supposed to be held accountable for every sig in the ASB any time I go I see something I think is potentially broken is absolutely ridiculous, like I said earlier. The only one of these sigs I've ever laid eyes upon is my own (which I would argue is far less offensive than yours.)

Now Miror's sig really should be reworked since it's very silly, but again, I've never seen that sig and it's completely idiotic to force me to read every sig in the ASB before courting one of them. Even if all of these were as broken as yours (they aren't) that's not a good reason to allow yours, that's just a good reason to retroject them all.

The fact that you claim I'm targeting you specifically after having posted one incredibly broken sig in here is frankly an insult to my integrity as a person, the fact that it's completely baseless and false aside. If I was targeting you as a person, I would have posted your Inkay sig that somebody showed me, telling me that it was also similarly broken. But I didn't do that, I explained to them that while your Inkay does have a powerful sig, I saw it as nowhere near as broken as this Mantyke and didn't think it needed to be dragged to court.

Slash's Trapinch
Aurora: Trapinch Lv 1 (F)
Aurora has always been preoccupied with the wind. It's such a graceful force of nature, but seeing wind-swept deserts and eroded mountains, there can be no doubt whatsoever that it is indeed a force to be reckoned with. Something with such beauty and yet such power must be respected. And in her mind, this also means it must be trained, honed, developed. Her largest subject of study was of course the desert where she grew up. She saw many rock formations wear away, slowly but steadily, the desert claiming more and more land for its own with its sandy winds. It seemed like such a simple mix, sand and wind, but those two combined, it seemed almost like they could do anything. And she knew that if she harnessed this power, she, too, could do anything.
Sig: Special Training: Do The Windy Thing
Aurora has focused much on her wind techniques and on honing new ones, giving her access to Icy Wind, Blizzard, Leaf Tornado, Leaf Storm, and Hurricane. She has the off-type to use the most powerful move granted per type twice per battle. With no extra energy investment, she can charge Ground energy into any wind or breath move to make it take on the Ground typing instead of their native typing, although retaining all other effects. Her wind and breath-based moves are all saturated with sand, giving them an irritation effect and making panes break easily under their power. This also creates a somewhat weak pseudo-Sandstorm effect within a few meters of her for the round's duration. However, this comes at a cost. She can no longer use Superpower, Crunch, Hyper Beam, Fury Cutter, Solar Beam, or Fissure. Upon evolution, her flight will be slightly less fast and free than others of her species.

So how many sigs is this?
1. Three new offtypes
2. Gains familiarity level type energy for each of these new offtypes.
3. For literally no drawback, she can use these moves moves as ground typed, so you can use moves that have great secondary effect as many times as she likes as long as they are ground typed.
4. Every time one of these moves is used, a weak Sandstorm is created.

Okay, pointing out a few things.

For one, it's only one new offtype. I already have Grass and Flying access, so Ice is the only new type gained here.
I'm also not getting levels of 2 HB (2 Blizzard familiarity is bad and you should feel bad, when the difference between being familiar and unfamiliar is an almighty Shock Wave). And regardless of whether people are being horrible and reffing familiarity too low, familiarity also comes with other benefits, having STAB benefits for those moves (aside from having more limited energy, that is), which this doesn't get.

Now I am going to point out a couple more things.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadowshocker

- Upon finding a sig worth reporting, the user posts the sig in full; Pokemon, bio and all, and the post approving it in the sig approval thread. Ideally the user should explain in reasonable terms why the sig breaks the rules. The user must also notify the user in ownership of the sig by linking to the post challenging the sig in a message.

You posted one of my sigs in court and did not notify me, did not link to the approving post. Perhaps your intention was less to court it, and more to try to use it as a way to defend your own (though, I've gotta say, mine's probably not as bad as yours), you still threw one of my sigs into this thread without following the rules of engagement, and I'm sure you probably didn't notify anyone else for whom you did so as well. That is just plain rude, and that's the kind of behaviour that can start problems. If you're going to throw a punch, at least look a guy in the eye first.

Now, back to my sig. I'll admit, I forgot to pore back over it after writing it and, yeah, I do realise I made it overall too much.

So, I'm fine with cutting out a fair chunk. If SS likes this one better, I'd be fine with it. If he retrojects it, I'll just see what I can come up with otherwise for the next round of approvals instead.

You can say it's still two sigs, but it's honestly a blurry line. It's all cohesive on wind moves and being able to insert a level of earthiness into them.

Sig: Special Training: Do The Windy Thing
With no extra energy investment, Aurora can charge Ground energy into any wind or breath move to make it take on the Ground typing instead of their native typing, although retaining all other effects. Her wind and breath-based moves are all saturated with sand, giving them an irritation effect and making panes break easily under their power. This also creates a somewhat weak pseudo-Sandstorm effect within a few meters of her for the round's duration. However, this comes at a cost. She can no longer use Superpower, Crunch, Hyper Beam, Fury Cutter, Solar Beam, or Fissure. Upon evolution, her flight will be slightly less fast and free than others of her species.

As for the others, I guess I may as well say some small bits

Austo's is fine. As has been stated, probably should have a mite more drawback, but it's really not that major. I'd hardly call it over the sig court threshold.

Snorby's Electrode (not mine, Stealthy, although I can see how you might make that mistake, since he didn't state whose that one was for whatever reason, and it has a distinctly me flavour to it. Gee, wonder why)? I see no problem with it. It's a freaking Electrode.

Haha Miror's is named Irwin. Yeah, his is a bit much, just needs a little work.

My Mantyke sig is literally inspired from clouds. I mean it is a Water/Flying type that doesn't look like birds. The thing that would scare a Water/Flying the most is electric type attacks.
1. So I added that part about the initial two electric type attacks would do half the usual damage, and gave it a couple of electric type attacks, cause "lol clouds and lightening".
2. Also added that after he has been attacked by two electric type attacks, weather changes to rain (cause clouds bring rain).
3. Finally better and more graceful flight, as clouds float in the sky.

I mean it is all cloud theme, so I never thought of it as 3 or 4 sigs in one. But yeah I will have to reduce the number of sig effects.

> Slash

I would have done the notify thingy if I was reporting. But I didn't report.

Just clarifyin, I haven't reported any of the four sigs stated above. I was just using them as examples, to show that a lot of "x sigs in 1" sig are around us.

Yeah your sig is kinda a lot, but I have seen much more broken sigs.

>Stealthy

He also needs to not act like he's being overly persecuted because he has a broken sig.

My sig wasn't even reported for being broken, It was reported for being 4in1 sig. I felt I was being targeted because Snorby himself has that multi in one sig. If instead I told my sig was reported for being broken, this shitstorm would have never happened.

> Snorby

First of all, I never said nor implied that these sigs are broken. If I thought so, I would have reported those sigs.

Also, your main reason for sig courting my mantyke is because it has 4 sigs in one. In my time here, I have seen shitload of sigs with having for than one effects. So the natural course of action was to find a few sigs that are multi-sigs and use those sigs to prove my point that lynching a single person when there are a lot more culprits, is not a very nice thing to do. I found TKF's and slash's quite easily. Then after this I found Miror's and your sigs that are mentioned in my previous post. Yeah when I saw your sig, I definitely got mad that you reported me for having a 4in1 sig when yours appeared to be 5in1, hence my reaction in the initial defense post:

"Enough with the obvious scapegoating
and pointing finger at others, specially when you have a pokemon much more ridiculous than mine."

I mean how would have Zelphon reacted if someone was to report his as heavy as a snorlax slugma sig, but the person who reported it himself has a slugma which weighs more than a mega metagross.

By the by, the notion that I'm supposed to be held accountable for every sig in the ASB any time I go I see something I think is potentially broken is absolutely ridiculous, like I said earlier.

Now calm down. If you had reported my sig for being broken, instead of "4in1" excuse, it would have spared us a lot of pointless chit-chat.

Now Miror's sig really should be reworked since it's very silly, but again, I've never seen that sig and it's completely idiotic to force me to read every sig in the ASB before courting one of them. Even if all of these were as broken as yours (they aren't) that's not a good reason to allow yours, that's just a good reason to retroject them all.
The fact that you claim I'm targeting you specifically after having posted one incredibly broken sig in here is frankly an insult to my integrity as a person, the fact that it's completely baseless and false aside. If I was targeting you as a person, I would have posted your Inkay sig that somebody showed me, telling me that it was also similarly broken. But I didn't do that, I explained to them that while your Inkay does have a powerful sig, I saw it as nowhere near as broken as this Mantyke and didn't think it needed to be dragged to court.

For the last time, I was not told my sig is broken. If you had mentioned from the start that you were reporting my sig for being broken, instead of the 4 sigs in 1, things wouldn't have escalated.

...We literally just went over why my sig is both not broken and less offensive in terms of "X sigs in one". At best, it's 2 (Fairy typechange + moves to accommodate combined with 2 new offtypes). Yours is four. This isn't someone with a Mega Metagross sized Slugma calling out Zelphy's Snorlax-sized Slugma, this is someone with a Hariyama sized Hoppip calling out said Slugma- the pokemon is worse and the sig is less offensive.

Please note that whether it's being pointed out for being a 4-in-1 sig or being a broken sig isn't actually relevant- when you get down to it, it's both, and neither is acceptable on a Pokemon like Mantine.

Oh, and please, do tell me more about how Rock Slide (difficult for Mantine to make use of), Secret Power (the only real drawback), and Acrobatics (which doesn't matter at all because Twister and Air Slash are both retained. They're better in pretty much every way.) are more useful than dropping 3 of Electrode's 4-5 worthwhile non-stab non-normal typed attacks.

________________________________________

On a very related note, can we please get a new system instead of sig court? People get offended way too easily by it- it's basically a show trial. Besides, it leads to nothing but unproductive bad blood. I won't pretend I have an idea on how to fix it, but it really should probably be fixed (and perhaps even closed while we figure out how to fix it)

Let's go ahead and move to a periodic, PM based sig review thing. Thread opens people can PM sigs for looking at, then Shadow or whoever has to respond with a look at what is ok. This would also allow themes to be identified i.e. if half a dozen people are doing the above and literally having four sigs in one (don't deny it, you know damn well you're doing it) which would enable mass retrorejetions.

Because the combination of maliciousness and, frankly, fundamental misunderstanding about what makes a balanced sig is actually quite concerning. People straight up do not know how to analyse sigs which totally defeats the purpose of this thread.

Igneel-Level 5 Male Shelgon
Igneel never gives up and always tries to get stronger in order to protect what is dear to him. After losing his family, Igneel trained daily in order to become more powerful. Due to having the natural destructive force of a dragon, his physical capabilities have grown to be off the charts.

Power is all that matters:
All of Igneels physical attacks do an extra mild worth of damage, for 5% extra energy. He has also lost access to Iron defense, Hyper voice, Hydro pump, and Dragon breath.

First of all this is nothing personal. My problem with this sig is the amount of energy being used for such a boost. A milds worth of extra damage is equivalent to a 30% boost on a heavy energy move, for only a 5% energy increase. Apply this to something with a lower energy cost, fire fang for example, the boost in power climbs to around 45% for a 5% increase in energy usage. Any other time you see a sig like this the power increase to energy increase ratio is almost the exact same, like a 10% boost for 10% energy increase.

I feel like either the energy needs to be increased or the power needs to be lowered, possibly both. This sig is just totally broken and out of balance.

Shadow I realise that I PMed you yesterday offering to constructively assist you on an issue but can you pull your finger out and do your job now? This sig is still broken months down the line and now I have to deal with it because you are ineffective. Come on.

I'm not going to bother making excuses for my life outside ASB at this point, outside of how slippery sloping has now basically turned things into a train wreck.

That said, Kush's point is a valid reminder to me that translating description terms to mathematical percentages is a bad thing, and if you're doing it, you should be feeling very ashamed of yourself. Shelgon's sig is retroactively rejected.

The rest of you can bother me when I'm less likely to desire strangling you lot.