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Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

Rick is still my fav Nba coach. If I ever get into coaching his style is a lot like I see me being. He isn't narrow minded and takes win now vs build for future better than most. Main reason I like him and POP so much. Monty Williams is my 3rd fav he gets the best out of his young guys.

Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

Slick. Three championships; 'nuff said.

But honorable mention goes to Larry Brown. Other than his wandering eye looking for the next job, he's still everything you want in a coach. And while he's the illustration of why Bird's three-year rule for coaches has validity, you get so much from him during those three years.

Bird gets credit because of his success. Not a tactician, probably terrible with x's and o's or working with players individually, but he could lead them and motivate them.

That's the Golden Three of Pacers coaches.

Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
And life itself, rushing over me
Life itself, the wind in black elms,
Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

This thread is going to produce some knife fights....I gotta go with Slick for a lot of reasons, but mainly even when you listen to him now you can just tell he gets the game, and he seems like he would be good at handling players.

Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

Two best from when I started following the NBA would be Bird and Carlisle.

Bird had the experience and the players listened. Not sure he was the best "coach" ever, but he know what he knew and more importantly he knew when to delegate. He could also still play which I think helped the players relate a lot.

Rick was a great coach, though his interpersonal skills held him back a bit IMO. I think we saw him grow a lot from Detroit to Indiana, and his work after the brawl was nothing short of spectacular.

Never saw Slick coach, but like another posters said above just listening to him you know he "gets it". Basically the polar opposite of Isiah Thomas. Oops, sorry, wrong thread

Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

About coach Brown not a fan of his at all. I'm sure he was great with us a team that is ready to win. But what he did with the Kittes really soured me with him. When you have a young rebuilding type roster like he did with the Cats you don't play over priced vets who aren't part of the future instead of the kids and try to win 8th every year I doubt many top notch coaches would do that. You don't tank per say but you do what Monty did last year you play the kids see what you have and let the kids learn and play hard. Coaches like Larry Brown and JOB can't do that.

Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

Unfortunately, too young to have caught Slick, so I gotta go with Larry Legend.

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Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

I love Slick, but I don't really remember much about his coaching, so I can't pick him. He had to be good no doubt and I love his comments during games and how he believes basketball should be played. He bleeds Blue and Gold, how can you not love that.

Larry Brown was great, helped turn this franchise around. I can't over look Larry's constant unhappiness with his players no mater were he's coaching. He is a great coach, just don't let him make personnel decisions, he falls in and out of love with players to often. I still was not happy with him his last season here he gave up on the team and he has even said that himself. Some of the greatest times at MSA were with Larry Brown though, I'll never forget those times.

Larry Bird, I'm still not completely sure about as a coach. He obviously did a great job when he was our coach, seems to really know the game and how players think and what makes them respond (aka Jalen). He commands respect that few coaches will ever have, simply because of what he was as a player. I think he hired two great assistants and let them do their job, so does that make him a great coach, maybe, or a great leader yes, I really still don't know. Seems Bird has excelled at everything there is to do with Basketball, very impressive resume. Maybe we are still under estimating him?

I'llpick Rick
I just think Rick is a awesome coach, He was great at Detroit, still believe he is as responsible for their Championship as Larry Brown was. He set the stage, established a stye of play, they were doing worse under Larry the next season, till the Sheed give away. Billups always had nice things to say about Rick and he's the one guy from those Detroit teams I really respect.

Rick was even better here, he took some questionable rosters and preformed well over expectations IMO. The brawl season was about the best coaching job I've ever seen. He was not without flaws, he was supposedly distant and not very personable, but I think he worked on his weaknesses and improved, ultimately getting a much deserved Championship in Dallas.

I certainly would not be upset if he was ever brought back here, several years down the road.

Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

I can only vote on what I saw and witnessed, so while Slick is probably the pick here, my vote goes to Larry Brown. I think he is the guy who helped change the culture, took a slightly above average team and made them a contender, while setting them up for the success Bird enjoyed. Larry Brown is a fickle, fickle man, but he can coach.

Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

I can only vote on what I saw and witnessed, so while Slick is probably the pick here, my vote goes to Larry Brown. I think he is the guy who helped change the culture, took a slightly above average team and made them a contender, while setting them up for the success Bird enjoyed. Larry Brown is a fickle, fickle man, but he can coach.

Close race between Brown and Carlisle for me but I'll go with that reasoning. I think Carlisle is brilliant with tactics though - on pure X&O's I think he'd be my top choice.

Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

Come on, man. Find me a post where UB even came close to doing anything but defending JOB as an adequate coach for the Pacers who actually might have been good in certain areas. You need to stop equating defense with adoration, you really do.

To the topic at hand, it would be a toss-up between Slick's ABA days and Brown or Carlisle in the NBA days. Slick's NBA days are tainted by the lack of talent (and changing conditions) he was saddled with. Brown's behind-the-scenes problems grated on players but there is no question he took the team to another level, which is what you want a coach to do. Rick was skilled at the game but not so skilled with player interaction - remember that many of the locker room issues started when his player interaction assistant coaches moved on.

If I had to pick one, it would be Slick with Larry Brown a very close second.

BillS

"Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
- Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

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Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

I voted for Slick for the same reason that I'd vote for Wilt at the greatest center of all time. I'm old enough to remember the aba but never went to a game and they were seldom televised where I lived so I can't vote for him from personal memory but his record speaks for itself.
For the NBA era I'd give it to Larry Bird. I realize that he had Carlisle but for that I just credit him to for being smart enough to surround himself with good people.

I'm too young to remember the ABA, the Coliseum, or the telethon, and my only memories of him involve listening to the radio, but I think Slick deserves this distinction. I don't understand the total dismissal of anything that happened in the ABA - a tendency on the part of casual fans and media to immediately discredit a very real and storied history.

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Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

I was too young to remember Slick all that well. Larry Brown was the best coach I have ever seen in Indy. His coaching actually made a positive difference. I would put Rick behind him and Larry third. Not sure where Slick would rank, but he's sure getting a lot of votes.

Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

Larry Brown set the stage for most of a decade of great Pacer basketball. Without Larry Brown I'm not sure what the team would've looked like in the 90's or how much Brown's impact seasoned Reggie's game. Just as Jonathon Bender should thank Donnie Walsh every day for his bank account, Donnie Walsh should thank Larry Brown for his prolonged career and reputation.

Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

------

"A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

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Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

I think Larry Brown is widely regarded as the best in-game coach ever to coach in the NBA. That is what I hear all the time from many experts. Brown has some negatives - the biggest is that he wears out his welcome by the way he drives his players - they eventually tune him out. I contend he didn't leave all of his coaching jobs because he got restless, but because he could tell the players were starting to tune him out. So he had a short self-life. Maybe his personality is a little different - people who know him well, including Donnie Walsh, always said Larry is only happy when he is miserable.

Another negative is he runs hot and cold on players - he wants to trade players on a whim. Walsh also mentioned this (in a nicer way) several times. So you never want him being in control of personel. Also, Brown is by nature a negative guy, he never thinks his teams are good enough, never satisfied and he wants each player to b play perfectly. He'll stop practice over and over again if a player makes a mistake.

Another thing about Larry is he wasn't much of a film watcher himself. Supposedly he could watch a play live and remember every single thing that happened down to every detail.

He coached his team to be the best it could be. He didn't coach his team to "beat the other team" In many ways he is almost exact oppsite to Carlisle.

Granted these are generalities:

1) Carlisle sees his players as they are, puts them in positions to succeed, plays to each players strengths and coaches his team to beat the other team
2) Larry Brown teaches his players to be what they can become, teaches them to play the game, teaches them to be better at things they aren't good at.

Example - Carlisle and Brown both coached Ben Wallace. Carlisle asked Ben to rebound and defend - he never worried about getting him to be part of the offense. Brown asked Ben to expand his game, get better offensively, forced him to be part of the scoring offense.

Which approach is correct? Carlisle approach is more typical for NBA coaches.

I think the different approaches is why Brown's teams generally started seasons very slow, because he spent training camp trying to get the players better. Carlisle was trying to get the team ready to beat the opponents.

Another thing about Brown, supposedly he put in new offensive plays all the time as the season went along - not to suggest other coaches don't, but Brown much more often.

Back in Brown's first season here, if you watch how the Pacers developed from the first month to the last - it was remarkable how the team didn't look anything like it did earlier. That single season was the best single season coaching job I have ever seen.

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Re: Who is the best coach in Pacers history?

I have to go with Bird because I'm too young for Slick and the Bird coaching years are my most fond as a Pacer fan.

Jackson, Rose, Miller, Davis, Mckey, Mullin, Smits. That was a nice team and the first time I got really familier with a Pacer team, so that team definitely sits in an important spot in my heart! It also helps that they made it to the Finals!