Readers’ Matzav: A Crying Bas Yisroel in Shidduchim

I write these words with a broken heart. I am sure they are echoed by thousands of girls out there, and each one of us is living through our own nisayon. The parsha of shidduchim has been a nightmare for me. I have all but given up – at the tender age of 23. I hope you allow me to say this, but I am cute, I am put together, and I am nice. I am pretty and geshikt. But that, it appears, is where it ends. My parents don’t have money and we don’t have yichus. We don’t have “pull” and we don’t have connections. So with all my maalos, I am told that I am just like thousands of other girls. And so the phone does not ring.

My mother pursues shidduchim, only to get flat-out nos. I have been out with a handful of boys in four years of being in shidduchim. Think that’s nuts? Ask around. It’s not. That’s the lot that we’ve been given. We, girls, try so hard, doing everything we are supposed to in life, only to have to sit around, never knowing if our shidduch will ever come.

I am not actually “sitting around.” Not by any stretch. I have two great jobs which keep me busy, I spend time with my family, I help my parents (and I read Matzav in my spare time!). I have no complaints about the lot I’ve been given in life. I have never felt deprived and I love my parents for everything they’ve given me, even with their financial difficulties. But I had never imagined that shidduchim would be the living gehennom that it has been.

I don’t know what to say anymore. I go to weddings looking my best, I am conscious 24/7 to make the best impression, but that won’t make my parents rich and it doesn’t appear to be enough to get shidduchim redd.

Hakadosh Boruch Hu, I am Your daughter. I know You are listening. I know You hear my cries! I know You feel my pillow soaked with the tears of frustration!

Ad mosai? How long does a Yiddishe maidel have to wait for a redd? How many months have to go by with not a phone call? Ad mosai?

the proposal of AZ is retarded, who do you want to demand from??
Its a challenge, and people are trying to help, its not poshut and there is no one culprit, who if you DEMAND from him has it in his hands to solve….
unless you mean Hashem!!

While even one Jewsish single who wants to be married but isn’t is a tragedy what are we demanding and from who? This is not a communist plot. What change should be demanded – and don’t give me the age gap shpiel – I agree its a good idea – but it can’t be DEMANDED!

We can suggest that people deal with their son’s shidduchim the way they want to be dealt with when they have daughters in the parsha. We can also work to with parents to help them set reasonable standards for what they are looking for for their children.

AZ – you can’t be serious. What girl or family will do that in public and make demands. Talk about a sure fire why to make people not want to date you.

This girl does not mention what sort of boy she is looking for. Say, like many others, she wants a learning boy for a “few” of years. The boy asks, how will we be supported. The girl works, but is it enough to support a family? What happens when within a year she has a child, will she be able to still work 2 jobs?
Most guys and their parents (due to simple economic theory of supply and demand) want the easy way out and want to have that comfort of a fahter-in-law being able to pay their bills.
Good luck in changing that mentality.

I am a father and I am crying for you. I daven everyday for my girls and I will daven for you.

I have wonderful girls (and boys). I am worried sick about what will be since like so many others out there, even with my wife working and as a 2 income family we do not make enough to cover our bills. Will my girls suffer because I cannot cover what it will cost to support a son in law? Will my girls loose out on getting a husband who will learn (at least a couple of years)so that the foundation of their home is built on Torah? I want my grandchildren to be raised in a home where Torah is the Ikkur, where they will know that (at least)the first few years of their parents married life was spent the way their Rabbeim and Teachers (and us) taught them and raised them to do.

But, I have no money. I cannot support. I cannot provide a specific amount per month. I CAN promise that my sons in law will be my children and they will get the unconditional love from me, they will get all the help I can give them, they will be my responsibility because he is my child. I CAN provide a wonderful girl for him as a wife. I CAN provide a girl who excells in Middos, who loves to do Chesed, who can cook and bake, who will be a great mother, a great friend and a great wife. I CAN provide a family that is well liked, is there for each other and a family with strong Torahdigga values.

I hate to say it but #4 is right. The system is broken and it has to be fixed by extreme measures. I think not just the girls, but their parents as well should show up. Make a massive rally. Its only when you shake people up that they wake up. Writing letters to Matzav, Yated, Hamodia and other papers only gets the sympathy from a few readers, not the people who have the power to change the situation.

I feel your pain and something needs to be done. i would suggest some forum where girls in groups of similar age get together and hook up with a partner and befriend that partner. From then on u begin to daven for that partner and call shadchanim to find match for that partner (alot easier than asking for yourself). Chazal assure us that hamispallel b’ad chaveiro v’hu tzurich oso dovor hu ne’ene techilah. Let us follow Chazal’s method of being answered. In this zechus all boys and girls in the parsha of shiduchim should find their zivug sheolu yufeh b’korov.

What changes?
Having boys learn in Eretz Yisrael for an arbitrary time NOT based on their learning growth?

Abolishing the freezer so the boys will have NO time to acclimate? (I guess one CAN always so no to shidduchim for a few months, but my guess is that an “ideal” might not be just for boys to meet a shadchan as an entrance requirement to BMG but to actually go out twice the first zman.)

have the boys start dating younger? So they’ll be even less resourceful and prepared to establish their bayis neeman b’Yisrael?

If we’re going to go solely by numbers to solve this crisis, hey, let’s apply to tuition too. Love to see where THAT gets us.

I think that the Roshei Yeshiva should be approached & asked to urge their talmidim not to look for money, but to look at the girl & family.
My husband was told not to look for $ as then the girl would have a higher lifestyle, & take him out of learning quicker. The boys shouldn’t be told that more $ will keep them learning longer. That is what is causing this shidduch crises. To the letter writer, keep on davening, & know that Hashem has the perfect shidduch waiting for you. My heart is with you.

I am so sorry that the Shidduch world has not treated you well. I hope that you find your bashert soon. No one deserves to be treated as you have been.

That being said, I think you need to take three important steps.

1. Drop the notion that 23 is old. It’s not. There are plenty of women who got married later than 23 and went on tho have successful and loving marriages. 23 is not old — despite the fact that some people may try to convince you otherwise.

2. Consider yourself lucky. I know it may not seem that way, but you are. You have just managed to avoid a bunch of jerks who are interested only in money or yichus. Tell me — do you want a spouse who appreciates you for who you are, or for who your ancestors were and how much money your parents have? Based on your letter, you sound like the former. That being the case, congratuations — you managed to avoid a bunch of people looking for the latter. I know it may be a small comfort to you, but it is an important fact to consider.

3. You have to stop being reactive and begin being proactive. Stop waiting for the phone to ring — take matters into your own hands. This may mean stepping out of your comfort zone. It may mean actively networking with friends and their husbands/relatives. It may mean using an online dating site, as another poster here recommended. It may mean going to singles events. In short, you have to maximize your opportunity to meet people — both men and people who can introduce you to them.

Good luck on your journey and may you soon find yourself building a bayis ne’eman b’yisroel.

When I saw the headline here I was thinking that perhaps it was written by a never-married single woman in perhaps her thirties, forties, or even beyond. Such frum women exist, believe me.

While your situation is frustrating you, and you have my sympathy for your tzaar, you should have hatzlocho bikarov, I think you are still very young and there is no need to panic. Examine your options, perhaps you should look at a broader range of bochurim, maybe that will do the trick. FYI, sometimes bochurim that seemingly learn less, are oseik in derech eretz as well as Torah, etc., are on a higher madreiga be’emes than those who appear more frum on the outside.

I am the father of a boy who married a wonderful girl 2 years older than himself. She has a good job but nobody pledged to support – none was asked or given even though my son is learning in kollel. There was no discussion at all in the house about wealth, the only questions related to haskofos and middos.

Your husband is waiting for you Mamelle, don’t worry or give up. Your marriage will be all the more beautiful for the smaller focus on gashmius.

I wish you great happiness in your future and am confident you will find it.

the answer is simple
stop this handout/entitlement mentality!
being moiser nefesh for toirah means waking up at 5 am learning morning kollel, davening, running to work, listening to shiur or learning on commute to work, running home and learning at night
thats mesiras nefesh!!!! and wonderful people do it

entitlement mentality is not mesiras nefesh, it’s destroying entire communities, and it will change when:
a) the money runs out
b) public assistance requirements will be tightened
c) those in authority positions start to recognize what has to be done

I didn’t read the other comments but let me say this. Keep davening and don’t give up. The right one is out there and will come at the right time. Relax. Don’t pressure yourself. If your motives are leshaim shomayim, hashem will help you. As with everything, we need siyata dishmaya. Keep davening. Don’t dispair. Our 23 year old daughter just became a kallah to a wonderful boy from a great family. We don’t have money or yichus either but b”h our daughter has gone from frustrated to elated. It will happen to you too.

Plenty of shtark bochurim at Yeshiva University sitting and learning and going to college to make a parnassa. Without even discussing the ones sitting in RIETS and learning full time for semicha!

By your wording of the message it seems like you are in a major bubble in brooklyn. Wherever you find yourself… open your eyes to different possibilities! Think about the system you find yourself in… what its doing to you… and if you feel happy or fulfilled.

DONT BE AFRAID… dont let your parents run your shidduchim if they do… go out and be PROACTIVE… dont wait for phone calls!

How long have you been dating?? 5 yrs? 4 yrs?

How long do you expect US to feel bad for you when your waiting by the phone for phone calls?

Will you date a boy that broke a shidduch, or dare I say, got divorced?
Most boys would date a girl with all of the great qualities that you allegedly possess. As other comments point out, you’re not to specific as far as what YOU are looking for.

It seems that some people here have limited bitachon in Hashem. It’s like those of us who are unemployed. All we can do is our hishtadlus with the clear knowledge that Hashem is in control…but we have to BELIEVE IT! Don’t just give it lip service.

here is a quote from Rav Avigdor Miller ZT”L. It is on one of the Rav’s taped Shiurim to hear it live. Here is the written quote.
Enjoy. From the mouth of a Gadol as only Rav Miller can say it!

QUESTION:
Should someone of marriageable age delay getting married because they are immature?

ANSWER:
And the answer is, the only way you can become mature is, you get married while you are already in the funeral parlor. Then he should call in a Reverend and make a chupa and get married. As long as you are alive, nobody is mature. No marriage is perfect. The same is, no car is perfect, still people buy cars and even 18 year olds get cars. As soon as they can get a license legally, they do it. Because it’s a very big convenience, you can travel places with cars. Marriage makes you travel places, you could accomplish, you could accomplish a family if you are married. If you wait until you are mature, which will never be, so you marry when you are past the child bearing age and you will never be a granddaddy. Never will you have grand children. A tragedy to wait too long. Nobody is mature. Another thing, when a girl becomes mature, she matures not only in her abilities to manage marriage, she matures also in selfishness. She matures in stubbornness. She matures in having her own ideas, she becomes a feminist. She becomes more difficult to live with. But when she is young, and pliable, and she is able to change yet, that’s the best time, and therefore, when you marry young, although there will be some strapping, it’s adjusting, but eventually they will adjust , doesn’t mean that everybody lives the most ideal life. I don’t know if there is an ideal marriage, but all marriage is ideal.
A man and a women are made for each other, and that’s a great happiness. Therefore, people who try to postpone marriage because they want to become more mature, first of all they will never become more mature, and second, they are maturing in the wrong direction. It’s like the Lulov leaves. At the beginning the Lulov leaves are soft, and pliable, so you can push them back against the Lulov. If you wait longer it grows out and the leaves become hard and you can’t push them back on the Lulov anymore. And so people when they become older they won’t adjust anymore, the older they are, it’s harder to adjust to anybody else. And therefore the most mature time to get married is when you are very young.

It is a himmel geshrei that so many girls are crying. It is up to the Roshei Yeshivah to set the tune and tell the boys that money is not everything, and midos is of utmost importance. If one really wants to sit and learn they will do so in poverty as well.

(Let me come clean, I was “to AZ”).
This is to Wolf.
No, 23 is not old at all, but 3-4 years in shidduchim under such circumstances is enough to demoralize anyone. These are girls (like Oy vey’s, #9) who SHOULD have boys lining up, they’re so good, whose parents are spending hours a week on shidduchim, with shadchanim, other networking, checking out.

So with all due respect to older singles, I have a profound amount of sympathy for our letter writer.

Can someone please explain how a home with “Torahdigge values” is dependent on staying in the learning cocoon for an extended period of time as opposed to taking one’s Torah learning and actually applying it while functioning in the world?

I feel terrible for the girl. But I don’t feel terrible for the people who created such problems.
The fact is that money, looks, age and figure sizes are very high on the list for the mothers of these boys and if they have girls…well, what goes around comes around.
Take some tips from the Chassidishe circles. With some exceptions, the MAJORITY give only a little thought about the looks, money is usually fifty-fifty for wedding expenses and no long term support from the parents and shidduchim are redt in most cases with the boy and girl being approximately the same age.
In addition (and I’m not saying the letter writer is guilty of this) the girls in these circles are just as picky. The boy has to be handsome and learn in yeshiva for who knows how many years and the family has to be just the right baal habatish.

The Chassidishe are not so picky and not stuck on the chitzonius so much.I’m not saying all of us Chassidishe breeze through the shidduch scene with carefree ease. Some of us with “baggage (I don’t consider it as such- but people do)from dysfunctional homes (like me) do have it harder, but I bet you, people like me would go through hell in the Yeshivish/Litvish circles.

You don’t need freezers. You don’t need girls and boys and their mothers so focused on looks. You don’t need a spoiled generation with long lists of wants, likes and dislikes.
We need people with yiras shomayim, we need people with love to Hakodesh Baruch Hu and His Torah, we need enthusiastic youth who will perpetuate the true purpose of a bayis neeman b’Yisroel.

We need loads and loads of siyatta dishmaya when it comes to shidduchim. We cannot do it without the ultimate Matchmaker. But the problems that are created by humans need to solved by them. Hashem will not do the work for us.

Dear Good and Lofty Bas Yisroel,
There is a basherte there for you. He was created 40 days before you were. I am sure you know that.
A big tzadekes once told us “say yes to the next boy who says yes to you. If he is frum, ehrlich just say yes. Hashem will help you make the rest work. Don’t look for faults.

After the war, Litvishe married chasidishe, and vice versa. And yes, they made it work. Easy? No. But they worked on it. Marriage is something that has to be worked on.

May HKBH help you and send your zivug very soon. Then, when that happens, make sure you help others find their zivug.

BTW, if all the young newlyweds, would only remember their single friends and continuously try to red them shidduchim friends, a good portion of this problem could get alleviated.

Look around you. Poor girls get married, rich girls get married, short girls get married, so do tall ones. Skinny girls get married, overweight ones get married. Remember. There is a Ribono Shel Olam who runs this world. You too, will find your zivug, very soon. Hashem will IYH send him. Yeshuas Hashem Keheref ayin.

One more thing: Stay away from certain professional shadchanim that are known to concentrate on size and on money. Go to shadchanim that others have recommended that work with the person, not the pocketbook or the figure.

Teach the boys a parnasah so they can make a living for themselves and their families. Nobody supported me when I got married, my spouse and I both worked. B’H we married off our daughter to a great boy from a great family, with a JOB. So he davens with a minyan 3x a day and goes to a shiur.

Hello. I got married when I was 25 (turning 26) years old. My brother-in-law just got engaged to a wonderful 27-year-old girl. My brother is IY”H getting married soon to a 28-year-old girl. THERE IS HOPE.

Some advice:
1) It’s NOT worth the tears. Really, it isn’t. Everyone told me that when I get married, all my tears will have been worth it. B”H I got married, but I have yet to see the correlation. I truly wish I had spent less time crying and more time enjoying. Even though I cried to Hashem, it was too much, and I regret it.

3) Realize that money IS important. Stop trying to marry a boy that only wants a girl for money, and marry a man who wants to take care of a girl financially. You will thank me in ten years from now when all your friends are burned out from the kids and work while theirs husbands wake up at 8 and take coffee breaks and naps. TRUST ME.

Realize that YOU are the most important thing you have in the world. Treat yourself well, b/c no one else will if you don’t.

Though changing the defrost days for boys based on the ages of the girls might improve the situation somewhat, many boys are engaged before they ever get into the freezer to very young girls.

Also, many mothers and boys who actually prefer girls who can legally buy their own kiddush wine, have their sons rejected once or twice by older girls who complain that they don’t drive well or aren’t sophisticated enough and guess what – it’s back to the list of 19 year olds.

This is a self inflicted problem in the frum communities for which the young women (and by extension their parents) bear the utmost burden.

What I am referring to is the shidduch system as currently practiced – is fatally flawed.

Any system that is supposed to help people where the bottom line becomes all about $$$ – is by its very nature a biased system, and is ultimately an unfair system that won’t work for but a select few people who can afford it.

Young women (post-high school they should not be considered “girls” anymore) such as the letter write are in a tough spot, playing a game where the deck is stacked against her. How can she pull out a royal flush then?

My advice to her is not to play this silly shidduch game anymore. She should proactively go out and find someone. She will iy”h be succesful – and probably happier with the end result.

Question for the girl who wrote the letter, her parents, and her sympathizers:What about your brothers and sons?Are they not getting or asking for money?I did get any money from in laws partly because I didn’t want to be supported and partly because they cried about how they have no money to give.Today thirteen years later, it is still difficult for me to over come my resentment over the fact that with all my in laws talk about not being able to give, don’t look demand money etc., they would never let their son marry someone without money.And in general I’ve found that it is more the boys mother then the boy himself who demands money.

I agree, which I forgot to mention in my earlier comment, that the system is broken. There is something very wrong. But our whole world is messed up, with broken aspects. That doesn;t mean we give up. We keep trying.
The yeshuas Hashem comes when things look most bleak.

1) Men not earning a parnassah for years
2) Large families
3) Girls getting married as young as possible without the ability to get professional training
4) Many seminaries and bais yakovs preaching that going to college is treif

Has to have some survival mechanism. Many families are not looking for “real money” and money is on the bottom of their priority list. They do want to make sure the new couple will have food clothing and shelter for the forseeable future. The fact that there is no real shidduch crisis in Eretz Yisroel underscores that money is not the root cause of our ills as in Eretz Yisroel they all have less and need apartments to do shidduchim.

The fact that they split the cost is often not true and also immaterial since on average families have equal amounts of boys and girls.

So it must be something else. In Israel the girls get married older as a rule and I think they are less – yes I will say it PICKY!

Any shadchan will tell you that it is much easier to get a date for a boy than a girl but the party that does most of the early rejection is TADA! The GIRL

I can tell you for sure that not all Roshei Yeshiva are telling boys to ask for money. But, if the boy wants to learn, he needs ‘a matzav’ – meaning, a combination of the girl’s employment potential (whether work experience, degrees, marketable skills) and her savings, parents chipping in what they can (which can be a small amount or a large one), the boy doing shemiras hasedorim, a night kollel, or being willing to go out of town. If none of the above apply, then the girl will really have to be realistic and look for a boy who is not trying to stay in learning. That’s the only way it can work!

And, by the way, often professionals with a presumably decent income are not willing to commit to help support, while klei kodesh who are living very frugally somehow manage to eke out something to help their children. It depends on the parents’ priorities more than their income bracket.

I just want you to know that I was a girl like you. No money, no yichus, and an out of towner. I didn’t have a date till I was 20. Hashem helps when it gets to be too much. I remember that on my first date with my husband, I felt like this parsha was going to go on forever. But it didn’t. This is your chance to improve yourself. When you get married, you will be too busy to really improve yourself. Take advantage now, and when you have gotten to where you need to be, hashem will introduce you to your bashert.

I dont think all the Kol Korehs in the world are going to change this behavior. However I do think that if we went back to the Hashkafa of a generation ago that allowed people such as yourself to earn Ph.D.s and earn a living while still being valued as bnei Torah, that we could deemphasize the role played by money in shidduchim.

I am truly amazed that no boy, has complained here of having the same problem. I am a 24 year old hard working boy, I learn sometimes. And I am facing the exact problems as her. Their is definately a serious issue here! Stop blaming her, she is not looking for a YU boy. She is looking for a boy that is following her circles. To whom ever you are I feel your pain, pain hurts. Just keep davening to Hashem he will help, I promise. May we hear of only simchas! AMEN

Ok, just wanna let you all know, THE SHIDDUCH CRISES IS NOT ONLY FOR GIRLS, I know plenty of very good boys that are broken, and yes, crying into their pillows at night, and yes, waiting by the telephone for shidduchim to be redd as well.

There seems to be missing information. first of all, your “only” 23. BE”H you will still get your shidduch. I married my wife when she was 23. I was 25. Everything is fine. There is nothing wrong with you as far as age is concerned.
I’m not sure which shadchanim you are using? Are you not being redd at all? Are you being redd and the boy’s are refusing to go out with you? Are YOU turning boy’s away? Are YOU being picky? Has the fact that you are “pretty” (whatever that means) getting to your head? Are you looking for a learning guy? Working guy?
Are YOU looking for money? There are plenty of eirlacha boy’s out there that don’t have money and would certainly be willing to go out with you. Are you giving them a chance?
It seems that you are holding a grudge against your parents for not having money (for whatever the reason). You have to stop blaming them and move foward.
May HK”BH grant you your Shidduch bekarov!

start learning eglah aroofa so you no what YODENU LOI SHOFCHO HADAM HAZEH there was torah and klal yisroel before kollel and people went to work before they were 30 years old and there was no less ignorance. maybe the hierarchy fears educated masses b/c they’ll have no control over them

With all due respect, girls and their parents should be proactive! You should not be “waiting” for phone calls. Make your own phone calls, do your own networking! Why are so many single girls sitting around waiting for lightning to strike? Money or no money, there are lots and lots of boys out there. Dont cry–do something useful. Get your resume out to all shadchanim. Treat it like you would treat a job hunt; you dont wait around for someone to contact you with a job offer, you really make a lot of effort to find that job! And of course, dont forget to daven as you work hard on finding your bashert.

First of all, everyone stop telling her she’s “only” 23. Her point is that if she hardly had dates until now, she doesn’t expect it to get better. And the fewer dates = fewer chances of finding a shidduch. Also even though 23 sounds young, 4 years of being in the parsha can very long for the person going through it.
Secondly for all of you telling her to look at YU boys etc. why would a YU boy want a yeshivish girl? Be realistic.
I wish you much hatzlacha. I was once in your shoes. My heart goes out to you.

Is the demographic imbalance motivating boys to be extra selective or is the emergence of more exaggerated selection criteria further enlarging the age gap. I think it is in fact a vicious cycle of both, but I remain convinced that the emergence of money-centracism by our current generation of boys and their parents who are looking for substantial financial support is the main culprit.

I’ve seen so many like you in my own community. Both boys and girls who for some fershtunkena reason are “unmarryable” according to the local shadchanim.

For that reason I’m currently designing a free shadchan site. Sawyouatsinai etc. can be great, but the fees are prohibitive to many and I’ve already got a parnasah so I figure why not make it free 🙂 Be on the lookout for http://www.thefreeshadchan.com Although I can’t promise anything, feel free to e-mail me at thefreeshachan at gmail.com

There are many young girls out there going through this – girls from fine families, where the brothers in shidduchim get literally hundreds of calls, and the sisters get none. I was also a “good girl” who at 23, had very few calls. (I was pretty but looked very young, so at weddings, people thought I was 17 and didn’t try to set me up). Part of the answer is to work hard – make friends, try to get them to set you up – and set up other people. Surely you know a single guy – someone you dated, a cousin, a neighbor etc. If you won’t work to get other people dates, why do you expect them to get you dates? Part of the problem is that women want to get married very much, so they want to say no to one shidduch and rush to date the next – guys don’t care if they take off a week here or a month there – so it feels like there are these endless dating breaks for women. Any guy who wants money or yichus – well, a normal guy should be happy to find someone nice he can love. So who would want those dodos anyway?

i am 23 and i just got married, i totally know where she’s coming from…. if you dont know when your lucky one will come, then 23 feels really old… the not knowing when makes it so hard… i feel for you…

May The Holy Mezaveg Zivugim Open The Gates for You and for All the Holy Daughters of Yisrael to find a Zivug Hagun. Amen Keyn Yehi Ratzon Amen!!!!!!!
We all know it that its in YOUR (Woman of Klal Yisrael)Merit We have survived.

i would like to set up comment 53 or comment 63 with the person who wrote the letter
if you want any help – please email merayimahuvim@gmail.com—
but yes everyone has to be willing to be open to slightly out of his own box
i thought number 53 was going to ask her out in his letter – i guess he was too shy !

First of all I do feel your pain and is pretty sad case. I hope you and the rest of klal yisroel looking for their bashert find them very soon to the right person at the right time. I read your article and is missing some information.
1. Where do you live? in-town or out of town?
2. Who is running/incharge of your shiduchim? you or your parents?
3. What are you looking for?
4. What type of a job do you have?
5. What about the rest of your family (eg. siblings)are they married or in shiduchim?
6. Do shadchanim/neighbors or… bad mouth you or your family?
7. You write your mother pursues your shiduchim do you know what she asks or finds out?
8. Have you ever spoke to anybody (eg rebitzen) about your situation?
9. Are you and your parents on the same page about shiduchim,support ….?
10. Why do you think that money and yichus is the reson why you havent got any shiduchim?
11. Are you ready to fly in or drive in to meet a boy?
Also you should know there are good amount of married people sitting in kollel learning which don’t get supported. Support also doesn’t have to mean $2000.00 a month from each side. It could be something small even if it is $100-$200 a month. A parent could subtract this from their maaser (most rabonim say it is ok and actually it is better to give to your kid than rather some one else). Baruch Hashem most people advices are pretty good, so talk to someone (eg Rebitzen) about your situation and see what suits you. a lot of hatzlocho and bracha to you and all the people in your situation.

I am sorry, but I don’t understand why the Ribbon Shel Olom’s plan that you should get married when you are 23 or more is cause for a broken heart. Is the waiting fun? No. But how do you know what cheshbonos have led to you still being single at this age? It is not when you get married that matters, but whom you marry. Maybe the right boy for you is not ready yet, or maybe you, with your emphasis on how pretty you are, are not ready. Daven and have bitachon. (By the way, I was about your age when I got married.)

I am also a working boy 24 I can not get dates, because I don’t pretend to be learning all day. Its really sad it hurts I’m in College getting a degree and every girl that is read to me says no because I don’t learn enough (or I don’t pretend to).

I am not a professional shadchen but I am always trying to help others find their bashert. Please feel free to email me and send me your profile with a picture and I will be in touch with you and try my best to find someone for you. This goes for anyone out there looking (including the guys).morahrivki@msn.com

The shidduch crisis is due to one factor and one factor alone: the corruption of the minds of our youth.

1. The unrealistic expectations among the goyim have seeped into our communities via television, internet and even billboards and music and polluted the minds of our children.

2. Until we realize that to remain apart is to survive, this will only get worse R”LS. There is no shidduch crisis in Williamsburg.

3. We must first learn to guard our own eyes, hearts and mouths before we can expect our children to have enough sensitivity to be able to marry their zivug, and not treat their first shidduch date as a preparation for a career of coffee and dinners well into their 30’s G-d forbid.

4. Keep your children in Boro Park, and stop letting them move to the Upper West Side. Teach them a trade locally.

While I feel this girl’s pain and don’t personally blame her b/c I don’t know enough details of her situation. However, I can tell you as the mother of a boy in shidduchim, it’s been our experience that yes there is a shidduch crisis. This crisis though, is the result of the girls and their families being too picky. They are the ones creating this crisis. We have gotten “no’s” for the dumbest of reasons. When in times of “crisis” people don’t behave the way these girls and their families do with so many “no’s” and yes my son is a normal wonderful boy from a functional intact yeshivish family. I know I am not the only one with this opinion. When these girls are young they are picky and then when they reach 23 or so,,, the good boys are gone. I think someone needs to speak up about this self inflicted crisis we are all experiencing.

I am sorry your school did not teach you the reality of life. The simple fact is if your family dose not have yicus and money, if you want a learning boy get yourself a job which will have you making a 6 figure salary. Otherwise go ahead and go out with men who have jobs and have a seder at night.

I agree with those who say something DRASTIC has to be done. Those of you who think that making some kind of protest or rally is a crazy idea, let me tell you that the shidduch crisis is FAR MORE CRAZY! We’re obviously in a stiuation that Hashem doesn’t like. Yes, Hashem probably is proud of His Jewish nation in some areas. Yes there is lots of Harbotzas Torah going around – but at what expense? There is one word which I feel describes our generation the best and that is SUPERFICIAL.
And almost no one is exempt from this adjective being applied to them.
For a girl, why is it that she’s only a “top girl” if she has money,looks and middos? Why is it that when a girl has ‘just’ the middos she’s not considered tops?! Why by having money does that add onto her maalos? Can someone please explain this to me? Is it that she’s a top girl because money is the most precious thing out there and she has it? Is it because she’s a great girl despite the fact that she has money?!
This is to each and every one of you reading this post: Think about two girls who you know who have similar middos or ‘are equally nice and sweet’. Try to narrow it to two girls who come from completely opposite economic lifestyles aka poor and rich. NOW, think in your head how you would describe them for shidduchim. Most people would describe the wealthy girl as tops, alla maalos… bla bla bla… The girl from the more modest background may be described as amazing, really big baalas middos … but ‘top’? Hhmmm? Does her father’s bank account qualify as top? I don’t think so. No, forget it she’s not tops- but she’s amazing!
No, we don’t do this whole mental calculation every time a top boy comes around and we want to redd him a shidduch. We don’t have to do this calculation any more because it has been fed to our brains for so many years already that our brains don’t have to think about it anymore.
How about all those shadchanim out there try something new. The next time you want to redd a ‘top boy’ a shidduch, sift out money as a criteria for to date him. No, we can’t do that. After all he’s a top boy. How can I suggest him to a girl who has little or no money? He’s a top boy, he needs a top/wealthy/baalas midos girl. An amazing/baalos middos girl won’t do. Only tops. ‘Top’, in other words has become synonomous with wealthy.
I humbly suggestk, that one of the ways to solving the crisis (in addition to solving the age gap of course) is to work on ourselves to become less superficial people. We should learn to value people for there ruchniyus worth not there gashmiyus or monetary value.

I think the reason people have difficulty understanding the math behind the Shidduch crisis is because it is so simple. People expect something more complex.

Leave all your preconceptions behind.

You have 10 boys and ten girls born in 1980
In 1983 you have 13 boys and thirteen girls
The 10 boys born in 1980 marry the girls born in 1983. There are 13
girls. Therefore 3 girls are left and they become older singles. They can’t marry the boys born in 1982 because the boys born in 1982 want girls born in 1979. This goes on and on unless we stop it and have boys and girls marry each other close in age.

For those who say that we only started having a Shidduch crisis in the last 15 years. This is not true. After WW2 there was a shidduch crisis but the frum community was much smaller and therefore the amount of single women was much smaller and they did not stand out. As the community got larger, the amount of single women got larger till we reached the point that there is a crisis. If we don’t do something now the crisis will get much bigger.

By the way there must have been a Shidduch crisis in the Jewish community before WW2. Between 1850 and 1939 the Jewish community grew a lot. I have heard stories from Holocaust survivors who said how terrible it was in Europe that there were so many older girls who could not get married. They attributed it to the fact that the girls did not have a dowry. The real truth was that there was a large age gap in Europe (men married women even 7 years younger than they) and therefore there were many single girls left over. Of course the girls with the dowries were the first to marry and those who did not have one were left over. The lack of dowry did not cause the problem. The age gap caused the problem and because there was such a large pool of women for men to choose from, they could afford to ask for large dowries.

By the way the reason the Chassidim go 50/50 as far as money is concerned is because there is no age gap and therefore hardly any Shidduch crisis (except for a small surplus of boys, but that’s because the marriage age has to be fine tuned). If there is no surplus of girls then the girl’s families don’t have to pay off the boy’s families in order to to get their daughters married and so they go 50/50.

Today most girls don’t want to hear of a boy with a plan or who went to college no matter how fine a boy he is. we are raising a doir of kids that want to live on easy street and girls whose parents can’t provide sit home waiting for those phone calls.
The only ones who can stop this is parents of girls. If a shadchen calls and demands full support or makes other outrageous
demands just hang up the phone and tell them you are not interested. If enough of us stop giving in to these demands the lunacy will stop. If mothers will have to split the cost of support you will see how quick these guys will have to go to work.
I have a son that can outlearn, outspeak and outdarrshen all the others.
but he has trouble getting decent girls redd to him because he finished college. It is strange that he is being redd to every doctor, dentist, and lawyer from the Five Towns and also many girls whose fathers are in chinuch. Its the people in the middle who are embarresed from their friends that their son in laws might one day go to work who are perpetuating this lunacy.
we are a doir yossom that has no one to give us direction in this matter

My heart goes out to this girl as well as all the other boys and girls struggling with shidduchim.
All the responders are assuming that this girl wants a yeshivishe learning boy. Didn’t see that anywhere in her letter. May she already is looking for a YU boy.
From my experience as an unprofessional (and mostly unsuccessful) shadchan, the girls looking for college/professional/working boys are having the same problem. There are also many girls from wealthy homes out there still looking. They may get more dates, but many are still single well into their 20’s. Many of the people I try setting up are like brick walls. Either the boy, or his parents, have their mind made up on a girl of a very specific height, size, hair color, profession, home, background, etc. They will not budge, even if the boy is over 30. I get the same answers to each suggestion: Too short, too tall, a redhead(!), too American, too Hungarian, too this or too that. They simply will not budge. Many of the girls’ parents, who are wringing their hands and calling shadchanim all the time to please PLEASE help them find a shidduch for their daughter, are turning down boys who are too short, too tall, families are not the same, etc. No amount of age-gap closing, etc., can help these people since they will not help themselves.
Another trend I see is girls who dress very trendy carrying on about how they need a really really frum boy who is a very serious learning boy. And then there are the girls who are looking for YU/professional types, don’t need a black hat, etc., but get all concerned about which yeshivos the boy attended 10 years ago. Get real!!!!
One possible solution is to have the boys’ Roshei Yeshiva get involved in every boy’s situation, but not when the boy is in his late 20’s, rather when the boy starts going out and inquiring who he is being redt to, why he is turning down this or that shidduch, etc. Maybe some hadrachsh will help. Not an easy solution, as the Roshei Yeshiva have full plates as it is……..

instead of raising boys and girls in worlds so separate they may as well be from separate planets, and then forcing them to go through the degrading shidduch process, with lying and ignorant “expert” shadchanim attempting to match them up one by one by one, let them interact with many people and allow relationships to develop over time as is natural.

I wish you hatzlocha and you should find your zivug bekarov,as the frum community has increased exponentially the increase in size has created a serious demographic issue that must be addressed. If boys born in 1989 are going out with girls born in 1991 or 1992 There will be an imbalance between the pool of boys and girls that is only going to get larger every year. The eitzah I see is that boys have to be willing to go out with girls older than them and girls need to go out with boys younger than them. We are playing a terrible game of musical chairs and for even one Jewish girl to be “out” is not an option.

Look around next time you are at a chupuah. (I speak of Litvishe, I don’t know many Chasidishe). The women are almost all either crying, davening, or saying Tehillim mechulak. The men are spacing out, shmuzing (in learning?), texting or even TALKING on their cell phones. Of course, this may be because the women are gullible enough to believe it’s an Ais Rotzon, the Shechinah is present, etc, while the men can be cynical & quote plenty of mekoros why women are too gullible…and maybe it’s only an Ais Rotzon for the chosson & kallah (& for sure why do you start davening before the chosson & kallah are both under the chupah?)…

So, who is doing a better job, the Bais Yankevs or the Yeshivos? The girls are often more mature, responsible and have more Yiras Shomayim due to more emphasis on hashkafa in school and additional voluntary shiurim (because they girls have no yetzer hara to be mevatel Torah).

This may explain why there are more girls looking for shtarke learners than there are shtarke learners…

Simple eitzah – let the girls do their hishtadlus to earn a parnasah, whether schooling or work experience and savings, and only go out after a full year or two after seminary. This will help enable them to be a normal mother who can work part-time and be a mother.

This in no way is meant to endorse the age-gap theory. I think it does a disservice by making the girls & their parents panicky, which is why they are frantically looking for a boy right after sem or sooner.

In fact, my suggestions might not work because many of the girls at 19 are already way more mature than boys of 23….that’s why many of the boys won’t buy the proposal either…

I married young and wish now I had waited. I was pressured into “saying yes to the next boy who says yes to me” and now I regret it but there is not much to do. There are actually worse things than being single.

First of all, noone has a right to judge older singles or singles in general, unless they themselves went through the same issues in getting married; its a mishna in avos “al todin es chaveyroh, ad shetageeyah limikomo”. Noone that hasnt gone through the pain can understand it.

I am a single man of 28 so you are not alone.
You need to do a few things and start to think outside the box. I apologize if my suggestions where already mentioned, but I did not have time to read all the comments.
You need to get an education so you can support yourself. Also you need to give up on the idea of learning in Israel for shana rishona.
Also if all you do is wait by the phone you are your own worst enemy. Go meet shadchanim. Go to singles events/weekends, and check out frumster and syas.
If no one sets you up do it yourself. If you are at shul and you see a nice guy at kiddush go up to him. By the way, go to shul every shabbos be friendly talk to people.
A lot of poor girls get married. Don’t sell yourself short.

to #74
Being Chassidish does not mean sacrificing the human hair shaitel. Not only do I wear a human hair wig, but I also wear a European hair shaitel (I don’t spend 2,000$ though-I buy them on sale for $600.)Though I am considering not buying wigs with a natural looking part anymore as per Rabbi Falk’s handbook guide on shaitlech.
Chassidim are pretty diverse and have different minhugim and shittas depending on which Rebbe or Chassidus you follow. But with the shidduch scene we basically follow the same script. The only difference I can think of is that some have more beshows- meetings between the boy and girl – and some less. In fact a lot of Chassidim only have one beshow before getting engaged. I have dealt with Litvish/Yeshivish and Chassidish couples in business and have not found the couples that went out for a few months to be happier than the ones that had beshow once. I’m not saying that davka one beshow is better, but I am saying there are a lot of other factors involved in the couples’ happiness.
Anyway, headgear is not the reason to bring change to the shidduch scene. But #74 AA, I definitely agree with you that there is no need to go modern. The grass is NOT greener on the other side. But neither is there a need to become more frum for the sake of a shidduch. There ARE a lot of reasons though to reevaluate what is real and important and to realize that looks, money, baal habatishkeit and other trivialities have taken front and center stage (all with very understandable excuses and reasoning) when they belong backstage.
When there are so many lists and reqirements, when there is a need as well for that “spark”, when there is this longing for “prince charming” that is learning and shteiging for an unlimited amount of years or that “Barbie” with the pocketbook full of money, then there is indeed a long wait.
I’m not say this is the only cause for the “shidduch crisis” but I am saying it definitly is a major cause of the shidduch crisis.

the problem is that 18 year old girls come home from seminary and were told they need to get married. they have no idea what type of family they want to raise, they have no idea what they want to do with their life.
then they spend four years of agony. and they think they are old which they are not.
the reason there are older girls that are single is because the parents are so superficial and care more about what will benefit themselves and how their name will be perceived. you have the boys who will only date girls whose parents have money. why?
90% of girl will NOT date a guy who is younger because they are embarrassed and feel it is beneath them.

The key here is that the frum community has a growing population. Suppose that the population increases by 10% every five years (I just made that up). That means, in theory, that for every ten 5-year-olds, there are 11 newborn babies. That means that for every ten 23-year-olds, there are eleven 18-year-olds. If suppose the typical frum marriage involves a boy who is five years older than the girl, then there will only be 10 boys for every 11 girls. This would leave nearly 10% of the frum girls without mates.

I don’t think this entirely explains the shidduch crisis – I think that such a statement would require some real research and hard statistics – but it’s probably true to some degree.

Williamsburg has some sort of Shidduch crisis but on the opposite gender. There are more available boys than girls. But I wouldn’t call it a Shidduch crisis and certainly not on the level that the non-Chassidish world is experiencing.

It is naive to think that the only quality girls are those WITHOUT yichus or money. Of course, a girl with yichus / money needs to be checked out carefully to make sure she is not stuck up etc, but they DO exist. If so, why shouldn’t a boy who learns well try to get himself a wife who 1)has the middos etc that may be more prevalent in a less comfortable / less pedigreed family 2) has yichus as well plus, pardon my being so blunt, but has money as well ???

I’m not sure if anyone suggested this yet, but did you ever try davening for your friends in the same boat as you? Don’t forget, when you daven for someone else and you need the same thing, you are answered first (I don’t recall the Chazal in Hebrew). There is also an organization called Daven for Me and I’ll Daven for You, I think it’s called. They advertise here and there. Call them. And don’t forget to cry your heart out during Shema Koleinu in Shemona Esray. Also, keep a list of your friends in the same boat as you in your tehillim and mention their names when you say a kapittel. You will soon be a kallah!

to mein taihyra bas yisrael: my heart cries out for your pain. the only peice of advice i can give you is that aside from all the segulos, demonstrations, petitions, blame games,etc., in the area of shidduchim more so than in any other area in life, ein lanu al mi lehishaen ela avinu shebashamayim. the sweetness of tehillim from the heart is priceless in Hashem’s eyes. keep your emuna strong, and may you be zocheh to find your bashert, quickly, and at the right time.

I’m not saying by us Chaddishe it’s perfect. As I stated in my first post not all of us have it easy. But you can’t compare it to the Yeshivish/Litvish crowd. Please don’t cite numbers as facts were you are just assuming them to be.

First of all I understand your pain, I didn’t get married until I was 31 and there were times I was 100% convinced that I never would.

A few ideas to consider
1) Take a 4-6 month “break” from dating. Just get away from the whole thing for a little while and let the frustration with the system get out of your system.
2) Make Aliyah, thats what did it for me. I came to Israel and met my wife 3 weeks after I got here.
3) Find ways to meet people, the more people you know the sooner someone will say “Oh you should meet my friend/brother etc”. My Step Daughter just started dating a guy, and he is the older brother of a girl she has known for 10+ years.

being 23 is not over the hill.yes it is not easy waiting for the phone to ring but where is your bitochon.Hashem has made a wonderful world and maybe Hashem in his infinite wisdom is giving you time to enjoy and appreciate all the good things he has bestowed on you so that when in the right time you find your bashert and your busy with raising a wonderful family you will have the understanding of appreciating all the good HASHEM HAS GIVEN YOU EVEN THOUGH IT TOOK LONGER THEN YOU WOULD HAVE LIKED

I blame the shadduchanim.1-They’d rather deal with the rich people even though many people who are not rich will cough up all the money it would take to get their children married.2-they will redd any shidduch even though it is not what the boy or girl is looking for.One does have a right to look for the qualities important to them in a spouse.if someone doesn’t want someone from a divorced family that is their peragative, if someone wants looks they have a right to ask for that after all hopefully a spouse is not something like a dress if you get tired of it throw it away,and nobody should have to settle .

I am a 25 y/o young man – working type but frum. You would think I have the flu. No one redds for me either.Even at weddings of my friends I can’t meet because of separate seating. Anyway, its not just girls who suffer.

My husband and I come from a family of no ‘fancy’ yichus and we are definitely far from rich, yet we married our daughter off before more yichusdik and wealthy classmates and seminary friends of hers. I can’t answer any other reason other than my mechutanim were also down to earth people not looking for a fancy title, my son in law is a wonderful ben Torah, with no airs about him and neither us of were looking to impress anyone with our shidduch.
My husband wasted years of worrying about how we’d marry off our daughter.
Davening helps tremendously and just the idea that Hashem could make anything happen is really what made it work.

I had chased shadchanim but when I took a break and did nothing, but relied on Hashem, that is when the shidduch came about.
I do not say it to brag since there is nothing I can take credit for.
Rather, I say it that the same Totty in Heaven who took care of my daughter has you as His daughter too. You’ve just got to believe in it, and stop blaming everyone for it.
Do you think Hashem is scared of statistics? Does He love the daughters or roshei yeshivos or philanthropists more than He loves you?
You’ve got to say, “No, NO, NO!!” He can make a yeshua happen any time, but first believe in it. I listened on chazak line to a woman who got married older (I think she was in her mid 20s) and she said that each day she’d get up with the idea, “Today is the day I’m getting engaged!” And if it didn’t happen that day, she woke up the next day with the same thought, until eventually it happened.
I know it’s not easy, but being bitter will get you nowhere. Believe me all of us have had things in life that were difficult. No one sails through life, and even getting married doesn’t solve the problems(I tell people that’s when the nisyonos first begin- with tzaar gidul bonim, sholom bayis…) so it’s always going to have to be about relying on Hashem, for now and forever until moshiach comes.
Also go and get a brocha from a gadol, if that will ease your pain.
Hatzlocha and may we all read your name on Only Simchos in the near future!!

I am a very educated computer programmer, but when the job offers arent pouring in, I have no problem doing hasgacha jobs or selling stuff in the street.

If you arent going to singles events or atleast discreetly meeting ppl from frum dating-websites, all I can say is ‘col mi sh-aina bas deah osur lrachem alov’ (whoever has sense and normalcy, we are forbidden to have mercy on them) .

#114:
Do you really plan on dating someone based on their post? I hope both of you would at least spend some time checking each other out.
Yes, she wrote a very compelling letter, but both of you should provide information to each other (some hate the term shidduch resume but it’s a good thing to have) and both of you should provide contacts to check each other out well, just as I did for my daughter.
Shidduchim is playing with fire and it’s not a time to be nice at the expense of your future. Do some research and be honest, and maybe with all that it will work out.
Does Matzav have the capacity to contact each of you offline?

To the social engineers: it might be a good idea to encourage thinking outside of rigid age parameters but short of a universally mandated takana on the level of the Shoftim era, how do you propose this happening?

Another thing: everyone’s encouraging the girls to get a parnasa and indeed, in this era a second income is basically a necessity. But
a) that’s the SECOND income. First income shouldn’t come from the parents.
b) what’s happened to the ultimate goal of being an akeres habayis? Are girls being given permission to aspire to being home, if not full-time then part-time? Yeah, yeah, the Chofetz Chaim’s rebbetzin ran the store but she didn’t have a two hour commute and the same pressures. The Chofetz Chaim was still intimately involved in the day to day business.

We have done a great job on encouraging our girls to be machshiv Torah (see quote 91 among others). I just hope that the family isn’t being sacrificed. (Check out the article, Chemotherapy as Metaphor. There are a few themes that seem to be recurrent. At this point we’re probably talking in circles.)

to #119 Socialize in a bataampte way? You sound like a Modern Orthodox person. Well in the MO circles it might be easier to find a shidduch, but it is also easier to trespass gedarim and indeed there is a lot going on there that is unmentionable on this site.
What was fine for our parents/grandparents is not ok for the bacharim and girls in this generation. It IS a different generation.

You say you have no complaints and yet that’s all this letter is. Man up. And work on your bitachon. You sound confused; you work hard to look good and do what’s right, and yet you’re barely redt shidduchim. Effort doesn’t breed results.

The time has come to put the responsibity of supporting a Kollel guy on the boys parents. You want your son to sit and learn then you support him. You think your son has the potential to be the next Gadol Hador you put your money where your mouth is. Lets face we know our sons and we know if they should be sitting and learning or they should be working.

I feel for you young lady, May you dance at your wedding before the year is up.

Looks and money – materialism gone wild. Chitzonius in its most extreme. The consumer mindset even in regard to people. Demands for “the best” product.

We have gotten really, really Americanized in the worst sense of the word. We are’t a “nation that dwells apart” – we’ve become a nation that reads the ads and wants more.

our attitudes are based on sources which do not come from the Torah or from the “alter heim,” but from the radio and the ads our “free” weeklies and “Torahdik” magazines serve up to us. Take a look at the slogans in the advertisements in your favorite frum publication. What are they teaching us and our children?

“Americanization” doesn’t mean just following the World Series, it means adopting the values that have brought the US to its present situation – greed, short-sightedness and egoism.

hey, I didn’t read through all the comments ( some were too long) but I will tell you this…im also in shidduchim. im 22, and i may say im also pretty, put together, well dressed, and have good personality. i may also say that while we don’t have it financially well, but my parents saved up for support. you think i have it easier because i can offer that? No. you know why? because it has NOTHING TO DO with $ and NOTHING TO DO WITH yichus…they are all SIFTERS! yes, when u sift flour, all the dirt and impurities stay behind until you got the finest and whitest flour.
the “having money” and coming from “this” background with “that” kind of grandparents and “this” kind of home, is a sifter and it helps sift our any guy that was not meant for you!!!! its not that BECAUSE your father has no money, that you can’t find a shidduch….its just thats the way you can sift out all the other guys that arn’t best for you so that instead of dating 1000 boys before you meet the right one, you only have to date a few who would embrace your background, personality, situation etc with eagerness!

yes, its frustrating! yes, its annoying! yes, at times its all that consumes the mind by day and night! but…know that Hashem doesn’t only make shidduchim for the rich and the “well connected”….
if anything, my family is well connect and i can’t say im at a better place in shidduchim then you are….
we’r both eager to build a true bais ne’eman b’yisrole. its just our paths will be different because Hashem made you be born to that family, go to that school, be in that situation etc…and me in a diff family with its own conditions and situations.

I have a friend who just got married at 25, she married boy she truly liked. she cud have married by age of 23, yes…a boy she did not truly feel comfortalbe with, a boy she may have been pressured to marry. but she didn’t. she chose to have faith in Hashem that He will send her the right one at the right time.
yes, she had to go to many shadchanim. yes, she had to go to every wedding well dressed and put on a smile….
but Hashem did not forget her and her tefillos.
she’s happily married today B”H.

This is how it is proposed and we don’t need shoftim we just need leaders and individuals who care….

The follwing suggestions WILL solve the crisis

Part A). A Staggered Lakewood freezer- tu bshvat/ pesach or even better tubshvat/shavuos. meaning at tubshvat they can only date girls above 21 (or 20 whatever) to date younger girls they must wait till pesach or shavous.

This will automatically yield the following:

1. 800+ boys a year with a selfish incentive to date close in age

2. If these boys want close in age, inevitably far fewer 19 yrs olds will be dating and the shaddchanim will be focusing on the slightly older girls in order to cater to these boys.

Part B) slowly lower the entrance age to post EY yeshivos.

If in 2 yrs from now the top entering age is 22.5 as opposed to that being the average age, we will have boys dating slightly younger. If boys are coming in around 22 and dating girls 20/21 we have basically solved the lions share of the problem.

Part C). Shortening time in EY. Boys should learn in EY for as long as it is in their individual best intereset not a day longer not a day shorter. Inevitable the vast majority of them will be coming home considerably earlier. this would yield Same result as B)

The girls and their families need to join forces and DEMAND that these and similar suggestions be implemented.

I read your letter and I can totally empathize- it takes one to know one. It takes one single girl’s pain to truly understand another single girl’s pain. I often feel like there is no one who know the depths of despair I go through every night. “y’gaaty banachasy escheh bchol lilah mitasy,b’dmaasy…” every night I drench my pillow with my tears. Shidduchim is a nightmare. I feel like my married friends cannot begin to understand what I go through. Of the numerous emotional stabs I feel every single day- whether its a younger neighbor getting engaged straight out of seminary, or a few months with no date, or a looming birthday approaching… The pain is a constant dull ache, but the numerous occurences of the day add a knife in my heart. I too wonder when will Hashem hear me, when will He finally answer all of my heartwrenching tefillos. I look aroound at all of my married classmates and even those much younger than me. I want it too… Oh, I want it so badly…. And then I whisper to Hashem in my darkest moments- please Hashem, am I so unworthy? Please, help me, because to You I turn.” And then I am confident that this is the tefillah that will surely break open the door, this is the tefillah that will make me a kallah in a few weeks. And then… nothing. Quiet. And then I feel down and depressed until the cycle begi-ns again.

CBY- I just want you to know that there are so many of us like you. But know that in a few weeks Hashem can change everything. And iy”h it will change, very very soon. And when it does the whole past few years will be but a fleeting nightmare. There will be good to take out of this very hard situation- more appreciation to your spouse, sensitivity to those who are lonely and in pain, and a stronger character. Until then.. just try to get yourself through day by day and remember that every single day that passes and every painful, lonely yom tov that passes, you are one closer to your yeshuah. I like the comment about the sifter- every no is another loser that you do not want. Hashem is sparing you the pain of having to go out. When I first came out of seminary and did not date, I used to think- if only I dated, I would manage to be single and happy. Well, a few years and dates later I no longer think that someone who dates is any better off than someone who does not date. A date that is not bashert for you will leave you in the same exact state as someone who never went out- lonely and desperate to get married. In fact, it may even make you feel worse because you have the added dimension of being hurt or hurting someone else. It is all hard.

So, be strong and don’t worry about the lack of dates. You want someone who will love you for the amazing person you are, not for your family status and money. And Hashem knows just who that someone is and will soon give it to you. Until then, daven and daven and just try to distract yourself day by day. “If Gd bought you to it, He will surely get you through it.”
I feel your pain, along with all of those older singles who feel so lonely and abandoned. I will keep you in my tefillos… Soon he will come, dont worry!

AZ, I thought your plan davka DIDN’T involve the BMG freezer AND didn’t effect the learning time in E”Y.
It does, apparently, mean creating a social climate in which we put the girls in the freezer for a bit.

P.S. Please don’t think I didn’t read what you wrote re E”Y. The current system may not be perfect but
– if boys are going to go YOUNGER there needs to be much better supervision. Or supervision at all.
– who’s to say that all boys WANT to start dating the second they come back from E”Y? Especially if they’ll be younger.

I think that it is very offensive to those who are venting their pain and frustration to be told–23 is not old. It is not a matter of age, it is a matter of stage. Obviously in a secular culture that is not old, but in our circles when around 85% of that age group is married with kids it can feel very old. Don’t minimize people’s pain and suffering.

Why are so many people blaming the girl. You don’t know that she’s picky. You don’t know that she wants a learning boy. You don’t know that she isn’t networking and being proactive. But you just assume it must be something that she’s doing wrong. I was in the exact same situation at that age. It’s true that 23 is not old, but if you have no dates when you’re 23, it feels like it certainly won’t get better when you’re older.

When I was 23 I had no dates. By the time I was 25 I was told that at my age I couldn’t be so “picky.” How can you be picky if you have nothing to pick from?

I am now 31 and still not married, but I have changed my attitude. Hashem runs the world. If it was purely up to statistics I would have no chance. Hashem can send me a Yeshua the same way he can give a 19 year old girl straight out of seminary a Yeshua. It’s the same Krias Yam Suf. I’ve accepted that Hashem gave me a different tafkid than my friends. It’s true that girls 12 years younger than me are getting married. It’s true it’s painful. I don’t try to solve the Shidduch crises anymore. I don’t blame anyone. There are definitely things that need to change. There are many problems with the system, but for myself I’m leaving it in Hashem’s hands.

I also commiserate with the writer, but to all the commenters I can only say that if you have daughters, you have to meet your responsiblities to them starting the day they are born. Living the good life and then throwing your daughter into the world without what you owe her can only have this result.

I am a BT, age 29 (close to 30) have a good income and love Torah and Hashem. I have been frum for 12 years. I don’t come from a distinguished family. I didn’t go to yeshiva growing up (tho I did go to Ohr Somayach for 2 years). Want to know something? No frum girl will date me. The Shadchan always comes back and says, “Sorry, but you need to have learned more and come from a better family.”

So as much as I feel for this girl I have to ask- what about me? Am I doomed to be single forever?

What is one to do when he reads a cry of pain like this? anyone who can go about their daily lives is missing something. We are rachmonim. We can’t sit by when fellow Jews are in such pain. I don’t know if the suggestions offered in the comments would help. Prahaps AZ’s suggestions are worth thinking about, though, his demand that girl go to protest themselves I find somewhat foolish and unfair to them. As a community we need to think about what is to be done. We need to appoint a group of people (and pay them for this) who figure out what should be done. If the solutions offered are reasonable we should implement all of them. If we need new suggestions, there should be a forum for people to send ideas in. Maybe we need some frum or even secular sociologist to analyze the situation. I have read many opinions about community growth and greater difficulty getting married when there should be hard data to work with. In short we need to be willing to spend money and create a task force to deal with the problem. There should be funding to research any possible ways. This effort should be supported by the community and endorsed by the Gedolim (who must be in as great pain as these girls at the suffering in our nation)
On a more personal note. In regards to the solution about changing the norm of the age diffrence between girls and guys dating. I am a 24 year old single boy. So I can talk with some knowledge about what guys can be expected to do. While we may be willing to do almost anything to help a girl in such pain. The one thing we can’t be asked to do is marry her if she is not someone who we feel we can have a really good marriage with and are also somewhat attracted to. I have dated quite a few girls most of them younger than me but also a good number of whom were older than me. I can speak from personal experiance when I say that no matter what is done trying to change this alone will never fix the entire problem. Girls who are older just don’t seem as attractive. I wish this weren’t the case but we seem to be just built this way. Guys around the age of dating find girls who are somewhat younger than them more attractive both physically and emotionally (in the sense that their somewhat undeveloped personality is one we perfer. I am sure many people would disagree with me. And I don’t say this applies to everybody however I think most to nearly all guys feel this way. My point is just that there needs to be a focus on alternative methods as well.
I will daven every day that Klal Yisroel, our wonderful and merciful nation, with Hashem’s help, will find a workable solution to our problem and implement it soon.

i TOTALY UNDERSTAND YOUR SITUATION, BEEZRAT HASHEM YOU WILL MEET YOUR BASHERT VERY SOON.I AM 32 HAVE A PHISICAL DISABILITY AND AM LOOKING FOR A YOUNG WOMAN WITH A MINOR PHISICAL DESABILTY. IT HAS NOT BEEN EAZY.
I HAVE A HOME IN ISRAEL AND WOULD LIKE TO SHARE IT WITH MY BASHERT ONE DAY EM YERTZE HASHEM.I CURENTLY LIVE IN AMERICA AND WOULD LIKE AT LEAST TO FIND A SHADCHAN WHO MATCHES PEOPLE WITH A DESABILITY. I WORK EVERY DAY AND LEARN OFTEN. BEEZRAT HASHEM ETBARCAH I TRULY NEED A SHALEACH WHO CAN HELP ME TO FIND MY BASHERT.

I don’t usually have the time to read matzav w all writers but maybe the reason I read your letter, precious Bas yisroel is simply so that I can…invest Tfilos for you, here, in EY. At the right places. When I go.
I’m surprized no one above asked for your name, but I am.
You can e mail your name to me at yosefb@neto.net.il
But please: When you become a Kallah I’d like to know, so that I don’t go on davening for you-aafter all, Tefilos take strength.

If I have your/your Parents e mail, it’s fine as well.

I hope you read this, because I’m serious.

I live in Yerushalayim, not far from the Kosel, and Bechlal, have reason to visit certain places at certain timesI tend to invest alot of effort/heart in Tfilos for those in distress, Baruch H.

Please forgive me for not signing my last name here….I’m sure you understand.

As a Baal Teshuva who got married at 30 (I am now 50, and the next generation of the shidduch scene is not far off for me…) I can relate to your post, and fee your pain. I can offer and reiterate suggestions that have already been offered.
1) Think outside the box. Nothing wrong with a boy who works for a living and is very serious about a Torah lifestyle. The economic realities of learning for an indefinite period of time (or even a definite but extended period of time) but expecting support is simply not realistic, and I predict will change in time.
2) Think more out of the box. The ashkenaz / sepharad marriages that I know of work very well (you may have to learn how to change your cooking habits, but that’s about it). Going into the ‘chassidic lite’ or into the ‘serious centrist orthodox’ — i.e. a bit to the right or to the left of where you may feel yourself, should be on your agenda. If you are an FFB, there should be nothing wrong with marrying a BT (my wife, an FFB, did so…)
3) Make a name for yourself. volunteer for organizations, chessed committees, bikur cholim, etc. Get to know people. Get to know local rabbonim (not just by asking them to make a shidduch). Get yourself talked about in a good way.
4) Going back 20 years I can tell you that my workings with formal shadchanim did not help much. It was my network, friends, friends parents, others that I had dated but it did not work out but then had other suggestions, that produced the best prospects, and ultimately the shidduch that worked. Herein may lie one of the solutions (other than changing the entitlement mentality). If every observant family would keep in mind those singles that they know, those that are struggling, and make suggestions, things would ease up significantly.
Wishing all frum singles of all ages the very best in their difficult struggle.

It seems like you got quite a lot of feed back so I don’t know if this will give you chizuk but I will try. I feel for you I am a Buchur who’s parents also have very little money and I don’t know what you mean by pull if you have good references who will speak highly of you just walk with you’re head high and keep trying and trust me I know you probably heard this so many times and you keep trying and nothing works but what I mean and this is hard to do is not be depressed in shidduchim the yetzer hara makes it so hard and makes you so depressed because the yetzer hara knows the beautiful children that will grow up to be big talmedai chachamim bezras Hashem that I hope and pray you will have but in order to receive bracha you need to make a container to except the bracha and that is emuna and I know you probably have and you just get torn down because every time you try time just passes and nothing happens you get courage and then when you see things are not working out the way you wanted you get even more depressed and you ask yourself how can this be Hashem wants us to get married why isn’t it working out? I suggest that you read everyday for 13 days peek 13 in tehilim and complete the tehilim every 3 days. When you daven ask Hashem to give you courage ask Hashem for complete emuna tell him that your flesh and blood it’s so hard to fight the yetzer hara and only hashem who is not flesh and blood can help overcome the yetzer hara thank him for this situation and as many things you can thank him for if I can suggest every night before you go to sleep write a list of things to be thankful to Hashem for. When we thank hashem he will always give more to thank him for. After you thank him tell him in your own words to the T how exactly you feel and cry tears go right to shamayim with out any interference tell Hashem that you know he is here and listening to you he listens to every heart beat. Tell Hashem no human being can help you thru this and so you turn to him with all your faith and ask him to help you have that faith remember hashem can also help you daven! And beg him for a yeshua it’s nothing to do with pull hashem is your father trust me he is the biggest pull anyone can get and guess what? You think the ones that have it easy that Hashem cares and watches after them more? Nope that ain’t the way it works. The ones that are more richouse get a lot of yissurim look at our gedolim look how much they suffer Hashem do doesn’t give anyone a challenge they can’t handle so if he is giving you this challenge I can only imagine what a big tzadekes you are. So internalize this you got the pull trust me and the biggest! Never give up Hashem loves you so much! I’m sure you will find a wonderful chussan with Hashem’s help but don’t turn to flesh and blood for help turn to Hashem he longs to hear your beautiful voice! From the bottom of my heart it is my hope that it should be the will of Hashem that you should find the best Chussan possible that will take care of you and be at your side and Love and care for you someone that you will be number one in their lives someone that will aprecciate you for everything and that everyday he should thank more and more Hashem for you as a wife and he should be patient and be good with kids and raising them bderech hashem along with you you should have shalom bayis all your days and you should have a large abundance of nachas from your children may you find him bekarov mamish with out anymore snags. Don’t worry I don’t know who you are but in your zchus I’m gonna try to learn more intense and be more makpid on lashon hara and I’ll daven for you hashem knows who you are I hope with all my heart that you find your true zivug really quickly! Amen!

Simple solution?
Yeshivish girls should be willing to marry Chasidishe boys, it would level the playing field.
The Yeshivishe girls are the underdog and the Chasidishe boys are too. rather than waiting, just marry the other “victim” of the shiduch game and those who are in control will have to give in if they want to get married.
Yeshivishe girl! You think a chasidishe life is SOOooo different than a yeshivishe one?
its not really so, true yoru boys may grow up speaking yiddish and with curly payos,
but im sure you can handle that in return for a mench

The authoress’ complaint is utter nonsense. Typically, women, not men, look for money in a marriage. And there are just as many men who are unable to find a shidduch through traditional channels. The problem today, whether you are a man or woman, is that people expect to much. Despite their own faults, they want a faultless spouse. Newsflash! There is no such thing. Find someone with whom you are compatible, and grow up.

I am a guy just like you in the same situation at the age of 23, I to give up.
That’s how I found this page by asking google

Even if I don’t find a Shidduch in my life god forbid. I have so much faith that is the best for me that I don’t find a Shidduch god forbid, what I’m upset and scared about is knowing the pain to go through in order to that is what’s the best thing for me and I will thank hashem for it but I just hate the suffering part of it.

The hard part is that I want to grow stronger with my connection to hashem but I can’t because by being single I haven’t got a partner in fighting the yetzer hara and when you don’t have a partner the yetzer hara will take me with friends and places I shouldn’t be or do, if theres a wife you don’t have time to go out with friends and be influence.

The main reason why I can’t find a Shidduch and not all guys have this problem but I have had it all my life and I know it’s very shallow but me as a person I’m not at all shallow but when it comes to this I am 🙁

Looks!!!!
I am a artist and understand the beautie in things I see. I feel curesed and blessed for it. I never feel satisfied if things don’t look nice in all aspects of life includeing ones middes