Its as close as I think we're ever going to get to an SMU Death Penalty ever again. It's the NCAA atomic bomb - After they used it on SMU, the results were so horrifying that it hasn't been used on a D1 program since.

Although, if Penn State had balked at what the NCAA had offered them penalty-wise, I think they may very well have received the SMU hammer.

"Pay the $60 million dollar fine, or sit for three years!"

07-25-2012, 03:49 PM

Trader Joe

Re: Penn State accusations

The 60 million dollar fine is nothing to them, it is pocket change. Why would Penn State have balked at it at all?

07-25-2012, 04:24 PM

Blackhawk4

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trader Joe

It took place on University grounds, heck in Penn State locker rooms. We have allegations that some of these boys were taken to Penn State bowl games and other events using school money. How does this not apply to the NCAA?

It's simple. The ncaa is in no way qualified to handle a situation like this. This is about a federal crime being committed and people hiding it. Why they hid it doesn't matter. The fact they hid it is what matters. The ncaa does not mess with crimes of rape sexual abuse and the hiding of sexual abuse. This is a matter for the feds to handle. The feds are qualified to handle this situation not the ncaa. The ncaa, and big Ten and Penn State helped turn this into a football issues with these sanctions. They went to punishing the football program because they belive it became bigger than it should have. You think the judge cared about that when Sandusky was on trial for 40+ counts? This is about putting those people behind bars where they belong but the ncaa helped turn it into a football issue. Do you think the victims and their families care about the sanctions or those who committed the else horrible federal crimes behind bars?

07-25-2012, 08:02 PM

Kstat

Re: Penn State accusations

Actually, Joe Paterno made this a football issue when he and the people above him chose to cover this up to spare the reputation of their football program.

This was a crime that used the Penn State football program as a shield. The football program itself is an accomplice in these matters.

Actually, Joe Paterno made this a football issue when he and the people above him chose to cover this up to spare the reputation of their football program.

This was a crime that used the Penn State football program as a shield. The football program itself is an accomplice in these matters.

The problem is that's on Joe Paterno and those individuals. It was their decision and their decision alone to cover it up by using he football program. The entire program did not know, not every single person knew during the time Sandusky was a part of the staff, so why try and make this seem like everyone in the program must be punished. This is a cover up of sexual abuse issue. It doesn't matter what was used to cover up that is not the point and not what should be focused on. The fact that it was covered up is what matters. You don't punish the entire football program for something that only a select few chose to do. With that logic, Nixon and the entire executive branch should have been punished for trying to cover up watergate. This is about Sandusky, Paterno and the individuals who helped cover it up. This is not about the student athletes and others not involved with these federal crimes even though they are part of the same football program as Sandusky and Paterno are, but the NCAA helped turn it into that.

What gets me out of all is this is how Penn State somehow made the NCAA look like the good guys out of all of this. That might be the greatest feat ever in the history of the NCAA's existence.

07-26-2012, 12:35 AM

travmil

Re: Penn State accusations

There is no gray area here. When you find out a pervert is anally raping 10 year old boys in your football facilities, you are faced with a black and white choice. You either call the police, or you are a *******. It's that simple. Any other course of action is the wrong choice. When a university, or any other organization for that matter, hires an individual for any position, they are giving that individual a certain amount of power to act on behalf and as an extension of the university. The higher profile the position, the more power is given. After 40 years, Joe Paterno WAS Penn State. Not just Penn State Football, he was Penn State. Are we saying that every person associated with Penn State knew? No, that's not what is being said. What IS being said is that the university is at the very least guilty of hiring a piece of garbage and then making him the face of their entire university. Is it fair to those people who didn't know? No, I don't think it is. But that doesn't change the fact that the university chose poorly, both in hiring and in their negligent reaction to this situation and deserves to be punished. As in many cases, the punishment here is far reaching and of course is going to affect people who had nothing to do with what happened. It's unfortunate, but the university doesn't get a pass just to keep the "innocent" from being affected by the punishment that was earned.

Sorry, kind of rambled there...

07-26-2012, 01:46 AM

Kstat

People get indirectly punished in every walk of life for the actions of those they work for/under/with. It sucks but it's also a fact of life, and the Penn state players all got golden parachutes, far better options than most of us. I don't want to hear that the players/fans are a reason not to punish the football program. That's simply not how it works.

07-26-2012, 11:11 AM

Slick Pinkham

Re: Penn State accusations

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackhawk4

The problem is that's on Joe Paterno and those individuals. It was their decision and their decision alone to cover it up by using he football program.

Whatever Paterno's motivation was, to protect his buddy, ignorance, or to avoid shame, why on Earth would any football coach be taken seriously when he offers the opinion that a serious crime should not be reported to the police? That is what is totally out of whack.

He had dictator-like power. He didn't just get that overnight, either. Lots of people helped build that screwy situation, and it would never be fixed by focusing a punishment on a few select most-culpable people.

07-26-2012, 11:19 AM

Blackhawk4

Re: Penn State accusations

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trader Joe

The 60 million dollar fine is nothing to them, it is pocket change. Why would Penn State have balked at it at all?

They couldn't balk at it. They pretty much cosigned it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kstat

People get indirectly punished in every walk of life for the actions of those they work for/under/with. It sucks but it's also a fact of life, and the Penn state players all got golden parachutes, far better options than most of us. I don't want to hear that the players/fans are a reason not to punish the football program. That's simply not how it works.

They're not the only reason either. They changed this from targeting the select group of people who deserved to be targeted because they committed federal crimes to just targeting the entire program. What good does it do to the victims that Penn State can't go to a bowl game for four years. You really think they care about that? What's likely to be more important to them, the people who covered it up going to jail or some student athletes we won't remember in two years to not be able to play in a bowl game? This is a smack in the face to the victims and their families by changing the focus to the football program. You punish the program and what does that do to help put those who covered this horrible crime up be charged and tried for their crimes? The NCAA listened to the mob calling for someone's head and went through on it. I can't say it was a bad PR move on the NCAA's part because it obviously wasn't. If anything it was the best PR move they've pulled in a while.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham

Whatever Paterno's motivation was, to protect his buddy, ignorance, or to avoid shame, why on Earth would any football coach be taken seriously when he offers the opinion that a serious crime should not be reported to the police? That is what is totally out of whack.

He had dictator-like power. He didn't just get that overnight, either. Lots of people helped build that screwy situation, and it would never be fixed by focusing a punishment on a few select most-culpable people.

And it won't be fixed by punishing the program. You really think this will stop people from covering up things they know to be wrong? They will try to cover up things because they believe they won't get caught. This is what it comes down to ultimately. Paterno, the president etc. believed they wouldn't get caught. SMU thought they wouldn't get caught, Miami thought they wouldn't get caught, Alabama thought they wouldn't get caught and yet they all did and until they were caught they all thought they could get away with it.

This sadly has turned into a focus on the program and the victims and their families have become an after thought.