If you don't know the Thigles but always meditate and keep in equanimity, it still can't be successful because if a crane flies in the sky, it cannot find the edge of space.

In a similar way, no matter how far you keep in the meditation of Shamatha- we call it Nyamzhag -you can't meet with success because normal Shamatha doesn't lead you beyond Samsara. There are several qualities of Samsara, some have very heavy suffering, some have medium suffering, some are a little better, but anyhow they are all in Samsara.

Thigle is a Tibetan word, but there is:

- The Thigle of Absolute Truth
- The Thigle of Relative Truth
- The visible Thigle
- The invisible Thigles

So many Thigles! Here there is the general explanation of the Thigles:

( I deleted the "special" added explanations because this would disturb the Mind of some super advisors here aboard and hope so that this plain enumeration without going into details would be non-disturbing)

1. In the brain, on the head there is the Thigle of Body, Speech and Mind.
2. In the palace of the heart level there is the Thigle of Space,Empty Nature and Bliss.
3. At the navel level there is the Palace of the Thigle of Samsara and Nirvana.
4. At the secret place there is the Thigle of Unchangeable Nature.
5. And in the heart level the Thigle is Clarity Nature - it is called a Thigle but it is naturally Clear Nature.
6. The Thigle which is at the navel level is the Thigle of unstoppable clarity which is integrated with Nature.
7. The Thigle of the secret chakra is beyond inherent existence;
8. This Thigle of the body, speech and mind is introduced by means of signs and symbols.
9. The Thigle of Space, Clarity and Unification
10. Your own Nature of Mind is the Thigle beyond Nirvana or Samsara.

If you realize all these Thigles with the Natural State, it is like a crane which doesn't search for the edge of space; the crane knows that space is endless. So in a similar way, Nature, Clarity and SelfAwareness don't search for the edge, meaning or center at all.

The particular time for this practice is to practice with the sunlight during daytime (nyin snang) and during the nighttime (mtshan snang) one practices with the darkness (mun mtshams).

It is also important that you find a place for practice where it is convenient for you.
When you have found such a suitable place for practice then you have to have only one or 2 faithful friends for practical reasons, not any more - that would bring diluting circumstances.

After your meditation is completely stable, or stable enough, it would be better to stop all normal activities; not to do any more things, thereby stopping delusions and normal popular activities.

Once you are stable and familiar enough you can try to integrate with any kind of activity of body, speech and mind.
Until this point you should try to keep in meditation and stop delusions.
Until then you will have to work hard.
Until this point in time you must not stop and find excuses to be tired.
Until that time it is best to stay in very strict retreat (mtshams bsdam).

Do not talk to anybody or at least do not too much! Food, clothes and living - everything should not be too luxury nor too poor - just medium class and suitable for you.

Stop completely any activities of body, speech and mind and any connection which you might have with worldly living conditions.

When all these things are perfect and the practice is going well there are many texts and teachings and many methods you can use.

Although there are many methods to use, many practices for developing the visions (snang ba), and many methods for the direct introduction (ngo sprod pa), the most important thing is that whatever you are practicing is to be as stable in the natural state and as clear (in the luminous visions of the clear light) as possible.

That Is the main thing you should focus on, whatever you may meditate and practice.
That is very, very Important!

Whatever you meditate on and where you meditate and how you meditate should be always covered with this awareness (rang rig pa) and the Great Clear Light ('od gsal chen po).
That is the real point of trying to be stable and clear."

Question:
Is it possible to practise Thögal vision while dreaming and what is the practise?

Lopon La:
Yes, that is a good way. It depends how far you practise.

It depends what the purpose is. If you use Tantra, then sometimes you do Dzogrim or if you are a Dzogchenpa, you
don't need to do anything special. Try to keep in the Natural State before sleeping and keep in meditation as you fall
asleep.

There are methods to visualize in the throat chakra, maybe a Syllable A or a Lotus, but the main thing is to integrate in the Natural State.

You could offer a Mandala of the universe - not only one globe, but imagine many, many numberless things inside,
good and bad, and offer them to the Buddha.

You can offer your own belongings, but you can visualize more. Visualize the Buddha in front of you and visualize
offerings. You don't need to check if He takes or not.

Same way, Chöd. Offer to the 4 Guests- Buddha, the highest Guardians, powerful worldly beings and, fourthly,
all 6 Realms. Make offerings to the Buddha and give to the Guardians and make ransoms so they will not bother
you any more.

Visualize all the needs of all the beings like - heat to the cold hells, cold to the hot hells etc. - and it can work.

We cannot see spirits because we are deeply integrated with the body. Spirits have lost it, but they can see our mind
activities, so it really works to help them. Same way with dead people.

Think to help them, don't forget them. Burning leftover food or incense acts as a support for visualization and benefit. Also water in bowls helps visualization - you fill them in the morning and are reminded in the afternoon.

The intention is important. Also, there is the Ganapuja. It is not only for party! It is for the 4 Guests in the same way.

All the time, whatever you offer, the gifts should be clean.

If you give only some small money or buy cheap flowers etc, then that is not really open, it is mixed with
desire and not really a clean offering.

A real offering, that is if you go to a flower garden and see and visualize Buddha and all the deities and offer to them what you see; that is a clean offering. You are not in that way desiring or jealous, you have nothing to lose, there is no attachment. But don't worry, the Buddha won't come and take them away!

Question:
How many Dzogchen cycles of teachings are there in Bön Dzogchen contained?

Lopon La:

Generally, we have 4 cycles of Dzogchen but they all have the same view; the View comes together, but sometimes the lineage is different or sometimes the version of the text is different.

But as for the View, there is no difference at all. I will explain in a moment why we have these 4 cycles of Dzogchen.

The source of the 1st cycle of Dzogchen is called Gabpa Gukor, It forms a part of he Semme Degu; it belongs to that cycle.
This is taught in a practice manual which comes through the Atri. Atri goes back to the source of Gabpa Gukor. That is one source.

The 2nd source is Yetri Thasel, and the Namkha Trul dzo is a kind of commentary on this There are also 25 sub-commentaries or chapters. These have all been added to the Yetri Thase/. This is the second of our major Dzogchen cycles.

The 3rd is Dragpa Korsum which is the source, and then the chapters which explain or comment on this are the Yangtse Longchen, That is the third major Dzogchen cycle.

Then the 4th is the Zhang Zhung Nyengyud Korzhi, and Nyamgyud. These all belong to the Zhang Zhung Nyengyud cycle.

Lopon La:
Kalpa Zangmo is the embodiment of all the Buddhas.
It is explained in the Precious Golden Lamp from the Golden Instructions of Drenpa Namkha.

Kalpa Zangmo represents all the lineage maters from the Dharmakaya down to now. Their knowledge is complete in her.
She is the embodiment of all the lineage holders from Dharmakaya up until now.

The material bodies cannot be put together into one thing, but their knowledge is not different from Dharmakaya until now - everything is perfected in Kalpa Zangmo.

Whoever is devoted to her and prays with devotion will receive whatever they wish for, such as protection, for instance.

Devotion is very, very important, it is the key. If your devotion is strong, clear and durable, then your wishes and prayers will be successful, no doubt; that is their promise - the promise of all the Buddhas in general.

You can also think that Kalpa Zangmo is a completely perfect Buddha. 'Buddha' doesn't just mean one thing - whoever has complete knowledge, whoever is all-wise, that is Buddha.

Most people think that 'Buddha' means someone wearing a monk's clothes or dressed that way, but, actually, Buddha means anyone who has completely purified [their obscurations]. [In the West] you say 'enlightenment' but I am not sure what that means.
That is just what the dictionary says. In our tradition, when we take refuge, first of all we say: "I take refuge in the Buddha." That does not mean one Buddha, but to all the Buddhas of the ten directions and the three times - past, present and future - and however many there are - there are one thousand, millions, billions - we take refuge in them all equally. That is our tradition and our prayer.

We don't talk about 'my Buddha' or 'his Buddha;' there is no sectarianism at all.

Depending on the help a being needs - long-life or richness or protection - the Buddhas manifest as guardians etc. and we can ask the Buddhas for whatever we want to ask them for, we can pray to them. 'Prayer' means asking for what you need, that is prayer.

Maybe according to the dictionary it is something else, but I think that praying means asking them for whatever you wish, and they willingly do it. They promised, that is their promise. It doesn't depend on whether someone is good or bad; they don't look at this, but devotion is very, very important. If your devotion is stable, durable, clear and trusting, then you will certainly receive what you wish. If your devotion is something-something, then the result is something similar, too! That is normal. It is quite popular for people to think that Buddha means someone dressed in monk's clothes, in yellow or something. People always think this, but it is not always like that.

Buddha emanated peaceful, wrathful and subduing emanations, all according to whoever has devotion and needs something and prays to him. According to this, he shows different forms, different yidams and so on. But don't think these are all separate - I have already mentioned this before. Dharmakaya, Sambhogakaya, Nirmanakaya - these all have the same source but show different features for different purposes.

You always have to remember this and keep it.

Buddha does not only mean one kind of appearance. Depending on what you wish - not only male, not only female, they can emanate anything. ' You have to remember. 'Buddha' means completely perfected and purified. All substances, defilements and obscurations, including deep ignorance, have been purified. That is what 'buddha' means.

You may think that guardians or Yidams are different and special, there are so many, but not all of them are for one person. We have so many - hundreds, thousands - but they are not all for one person. Whatever you need, individually, you can take only one, not everything.
We have 9 Ways and each of them is according to the followers' capacity .

Not all people are the same, not everyone has the same attitude, capacity and knowledge, so the Buddha taught according to the person, and you can receive whatever is suitable for you. He doesn't force you saying: 'you do this or that.' He cannot force you. If he did, something would be too heavy, something would be too light, and many things would not be suitable, so [what you practise] is only according to the follower, to what is suitable for you personally.

That is why there can be so many different teachings, and from there, you see what you need, what you wish to do, that is your share; not everything is for one person.

For example: the self. I already said searching the external and internal for the self, the ME is never found, but when you have a headache, you can say: “I have a problem.” The doctor will ask you and you will answer you have a headache. “I” you made as your head, your head is ME.
The doctor will never say: “You are not sick, your head is sick.”
The reality is your head, not you, but you create it temporarily. All is projected like this, only a name. We trust this, and that is ignorance, and that makes every suffering and miseries – death, birth, everything.

Now if you are fed up with this situation, try to see everything as a name, but if you try to find it in the object’s side, you will find nothing. Only temporarily found as a name, and that is called an illusion.

Everything is an illusion. Try to realize illusion. If you found illusion in every existence, then there is no need for emotions or fighting, desire: nothing needed because there is nothing real, only a name."

Question:
My question is about accumulating karmic traces. We often go to the cinema and see many crimes etc., and in the cinema we participate, so do we get a share of the negative karma?

Lopon la:

Whatever we see, think, smell, hear etc. is all saved as karmic causes. No doubt.

It doesn't matter whether the object exists as such or not.

If we look back at Ignorance, in fact nothing is real, yet we can still save big negative things.
So in the same way, whether it is real we think it is real - or whether it is something in the cinema - the cinema is the relative truth of relative truth! - we still see things and so we still collect karmic causes in the Alaya.

You can see this from your dreams.
If you watch a film, you can see it in your dream afterwards. So there is no doubt (that karmic causes are collected).
It doesn't matter whether the object exists or not, everything is saved in the Alaya. The Alaya is going to be very rich!

Question:
If I have understood correctly, you say once we have understood the Natural State we don't need to read so much about Dharma, so could you explain this a bit more?

Lopon La:
For days and days now I have been teaching and the main point of these Teachings is to try to introduce you to your Natural State, to make sure that you have found and realized this Nature.

Once you have found it and understood it clearly, then you don't need to do something in addition for that.
If you advance in practice and can remain in the Natural State without distraction, then you can do everything - you can integrate with living conditions without being bound by desire.

But before you are stable in your own Natural State, and if you try to do something, that will disturb your meditation with the Natural State, then if you just try to integrate that with meditation, then it will disturb your activities.
So, you are not at all ready to integrate these two, so it is better not to try it; you should just practice one of these, one side, and learn and try to make your practice of Nature more stable until you are really ready to integrate this meditation with activities.

Question:
When I look at my thoughts arising, I have the feeling that they do have a source, the Alaya Vijnana, the Ground of Consciousness. I feel that they come from there and that they leave a trace there, stored in the store of the Alaya.

Although I understand that, as you said, this Alaya is like a big piece of ice and ice can melt into water, I don't understand how I can melt that ice into water. Maybe I look at the object-side too much and follow things; maybe I don't go far enough in the direction of the source. I don't know.

Lopon La:
This is something different. Normally our consciousness comes and goes into the Alaya or Basic Storing Consciousness. That is always the case for a normal person with no understanding of Nature.

We have Sutra, Tantra and Dzogchen, and according to this Teaching, Dzogchen is the highest teaching.

But whether it is indeed the highest or not depends on the follower's capacity to understand.

If you don't understand clearly how Nature can appear spontaneously but always follow the object side, then it is absolutely true that our living conditions and everything comes from Alaya or Basic Consciousness. Traces are kept there.

Normally, we think of lunch and then immediately act and follow our thoughts - we try to go and get something to eat. In a similar way, we are always
following the objects and not looking back towards the source. That is our life, you see.

If you do this, it has nothing to do with Nature or Dzogchen, it is normal life, you see.

But if you try to look back to the source, to where things come from, how they arise, then you will start to search for Nature in a different
way. This not just some story; we can clearly see that it is true.

For instance, if you are sleeping very deeply then wake up suddenly, then for a little while you don't see anything clearly. Your eyes are open, you can see things and hear things, but you don't recognize what you see or hear.

While you were asleep you were deeply integrated with the Alaya or Kunzhi or Basic Consciousness, but then you wake up suddenly and the rest of your consciousness is not acting, not reacting to the object. That has nothing to do with Dzogchen at all, but it gives you evidence of how deeply we are integrated with the Kunzhi Namshe.

When you wake up suddenly, consciousness then begins to act, to grasp, and that is nothing to do with Nature. I have already said several times that Nature looks like this state, but is in fact different.

When you look back towards a thought, that thought disappears yet there is a very clear presence.
What is clear? You cannot explain it, yet it is not the same as your state when you suddenly wake up.
So you need to compare these 2 experiences and that will allow you to correct your understanding.

You can see the difference through your own experience; words do not make much sense.

Question:
What will happen if a person at the highest level of Shamatha starts to do Thögal practice?

Lopon La:
He can't practise Thögal because he has no basic Trekcho.

What happens is that before he dies, as he has clairvoyance, he realizes what will be after his death, he sees all the suffering and miseries, he sees what his condition will be.

He thought he had completely achieved Buddhahood, the Final Goal, but now he realizes that he was completely deluded, that whatever he has done was wrong, that there was no truth, [he thinks that] Buddha's speech is not truth and that it is impossible for there to be absolute truth. He trusted and practised, [he may have practised] any kinds of Buddhism or any religion which has a kind of Shamatha practice, the practice of meditation, but finally, no matter what kind of teachings he followed - not only Buddha's Teachings - he got something in terms of how to concentrate and meditate, but everything was absolutely deluded, not true.

So then through thinking like that he falls into nihilism. This leads him down to the Hell realms or to the Preta realm or somewhere. There is no hope any more. Now you can find out how to discover Nature.

Even in Hinayana practice you always have to have an object; they always need to have something there to perceive, whether you follow and check your breathing or activities, no matter what you do you are always focussing on something without any disturbances, you keep on focussing on one point. This leads you to checking.

We have already said how to check whether, for instance, one Atman or man exists inherently. I explained that if you check, everything is mine, not me. So then you realize that the real me is only a name, that it doesn't exist inherently or concretely.

The Hinayana followers know this. They focus on that, but they are still focusing; they always need an object. That is one point.
Even in Mahayana, Madhyamaka or Mahamudra some object is always needed, there is always a point of focus.
(NOT MEANT IS HERE ESSENCE MAHAMUDRA etc.Lopon La moves only in the conventional way of approaching Mahamudra which would be the same as Trekchöd))

Therefore you can't compare these with Dzogchen. If you follow these paths, your contemplation can be very deep and so these paths can lead you very high, but there is still some involvement with some object. Nature cannot be compared with this.

Lopon La:
When you have experience, there is no consciousness, no object, no subject, yet it is clear, Clarity.

How can you know this Clarity?

As I said several times, when you have been working hard and then stop, at that time you can find a kind of unthinkable state, a state without thoughts. But there is no clarity in that state.

Another example is when you wake up from a deep sleep, there is no clarity at that moment, either, just a state you cannot describe.
Clarity, then, arises just after you look towards a thought when the thought, the watcher and what is watched all disappear all together.

Just after everything has disappeared, if you don't change anything but simply leave it as it is, then there is Clarity.

Nature is there, everything is there. That is called Non-duality or Unification.( gnyis med ).

Question:
Can you explain a little more about the relation between Mirror-like Wisdom and the Natural State?
Lopon La:
We know that anything can be reflected in a mirror.

The mirror doesn't make any distinctions between good or bad or anything else.
The mirror just shows a picture. That is an imitation.

Nature itself is like a mirror, you see. It doesn't distinguish between whether some good things appear as visions or bad things appear as visions. 'Good things' means Bodhichitta, compassion and so on. Whatever comes into the visions, Nature itself is the same! If anger, desire or emotions appear as visions in Nature, Nature itself doesn't change; it is the same.

Therefore, it looks similar to a mirror, so we say 'mirror-like wisdom.'
Nature is like a mirror, and visions are like reflections.
The visions don't disturb the mirror, the mirror doesn't recognize anything, yet they are shining there clearly.

Secondly, whatever reflections come into the mirror, they are not far from the mirror at all. Whatever comes, everything is 'inside' the mirror.
In the same way, no matter what visions arise, they are all totally integrated with Nature.
Nothing at all can go away from Nature. Anything - good, bad, pure, impure everything is a reflection, everything is in Nature, the Natural State.

A question about the state of unconsciousness immediately after death:

Question:
How long,from the point of view of human time, does the state of unconsciousness immediately after death last?

Lopon La:
How long this lasts depends completely on the individual person. It is not limited.

Question:
What can we do to help during that period?

Lopon La:

1.) The advanced practitioner

An advanced practitioner keeps in the Natural state, in meditation, continuously.

The best thing for him is to keep this, so we leave him without touch from before dying until quite some time after the sign comes.
Without anything, you must not disturb, leave as it is. The purpose of this is very important: if you touch or do something, it disturbs him, keeps him from staying in meditation continuously.
He is still in meditation, even after the sign comes. That means: when an advanced practitioner is dead, you can see he is dead, but he does not change colour, he does not change his posture, he is still straight, or in the position he has been in, it looks like controlled, like controlled body-posture, and still his consciousness, everything looks like dead. But then the special sign comes, mucus, white mucus comes, that is one sign. And also after he has stopped to meditate continuously, his head will hang down

2.) In the case of the normal being

In the case of the normal being, there is no reason for not touching or whatever else you may do. The text says, that if you dispose of the body or do something like cremating it, the diseased person will not completely feel it, but it will be like during unconsciousness.

How long this lasts depends very much on the individual person, there is no limit at all. What happens to the person next looks like waking up, and then this spirit is no more connected to the material body.

And the text says, "His feeling is like he immediately wanted to get up and to do something, wanting to do things, wanting to say something, all the feelings are very clear and alive."

So then when he looks and wants to get up with his/her body, and tries to do so, his body cannot be connected to his spirit any more.

Then he realises he has passed away, and that it is not possible any more for him to connect, which causes a lot of suffering, and he changes his mind and tries to figure out what to do now.

Then he goes round to see and talk to the alive persons he/she was connected to, but nobody answers, and nobody sees him/her. That again causes even more suffering.

There are feelings, and the spirit cannot be stopped, even if you close the door, like in a dream, you see. He can also not stop anything, but he can see many visible things. At that time the only thing you can do to help, according to our believe, is to recite the Thödol, as you call it: Bardo Thödol

Traditionally this is recited continuously for 3 days and 3 nights. Our tradition says that when they hear it, they will listen and try to realize that they are passed away.
We hope that by listening and following the text he hears something gets through to him. That is one thing.

Traditionally one asks someone who has the knowledge, a Lama for instance, to do this. The Lama will be called and asked to do prayers and Pho-wa. All this is done to show the diseased person what he should do, and to guide him.

We hope that with this help also a normal being, who is not a practitioner, can go the direct way. And then after this we do Sur practice with the help of burning.

And that is for the family, relatives, and whoever is close to the dead persons, to think of them and giving them by visualization what they need. This ritual of burning of food supports the mind (of the dying person)

So one can use all these methods. The traditional period of time for this, according to the text, is 49 days. If one does it later, it can still bring some change to the situation.
Prayers can be sometimes helpful. (depends upon the constitution of the person.)

A question about the state of unconsciousness immediately after death:

Question:
How long,from the point of view of human time, does the state of unconsciousness immediately after death last?

Lopon La:
How long this lasts depends completely on the individual person. It is not limited.

Question:
What can we do to help during that period?

Lopon La:

1.) The advanced practitioner

An advanced practitioner keeps in the Natural state, in meditation, continuously.

The best thing for him is to keep this, so we leave him without touch from before dying until quite some time after the sign comes.

Without anything, you must not disturb, leave as it is. The purpose of this is very important: if you touch or do something, it disturbs him, keeps him from staying in meditation continuously.

He is still in meditation, even after the sign comes. That means: when an advanced practitioner is dead, you can see he is dead, but he does not change colour, he does not change his posture, he is still straight, or in the position he has been in, it looks like controlled, like controlled body-posture, and still his consciousness, everything looks like dead. But then the special sign comes, mucus, white mucus comes, that is one sign. And also after he has stopped to meditate continuously, his head will hang down

2.) In the case of the normal being

In case of the normal being, there is no reason for not touching or whatever else you may do. The text says, that if you dispose of the body or do something like cremating it, the diseased person will not feel it, it will be like during a state of unconsciousness.

How long this lasts, depends very much on the individual person, there is no limit at all. What happens to the person next looks like waking up, then this spirit is no more connected to the physical body.

And the text says, "His feeling is like he immediately wanted to get up and to do something, wanting to do things, wanting to say something, all the feelings are very clear and alive."

So then when he looks and wants to get up with his/her body, and tries to do so, his body cannot be connected to his spirit any more.

Then he realises he has passed away, and that it is not possible any more for him to connect, which causes a lot of suffering, and he changes his mind and tries to figure out what to do now.

Then he goes round to see and talk to the alive persons he/she was connected to, but nobody answers, and nobody sees him/her. That again causes even more suffering.

There are feelings, and the spirit cannot be stopped, even if you close the door, like in a dream, you see. He can also not stop anything, but he can see many visible things. At that time the only thing you can do to help, according to our believe, is to recite the Thödol, as you call it: Bardo Thödol

Traditionally this is recited continuously for 3 days and 3 nights. Our tradition says that when they hear it, they will listen and try to realize that they are passed away.

We hope that by listening and following the text he hears something gets through to him. That is one thing.

Traditionally one asks someone who has the knowledge, a Lama for instance, to do this. The Lama will be called and asked to do prayers and Pho-wa. All this is done to show the diseased person what he should do, and to guide him.

We hope that with this help also a normal being, who is not a practitioner, can go the direct way. And then after this we do Sur practice with the help of burning.

And that is for the family, relatives, and whoever is close to the dead persons, to think of them and giving them by visualization what they need. This ritual of burning of food supports the mind (of the dying person)

So one can use all these methods. The traditional period of time for this, according to the text, is 49 days. If one does it later, it can still bring some change to the situation.

Prayers can be sometimes helpful. (depends upon the constitution of the person.)
[/quote]

Relative Nature:
This means that nothing is created, it is just as it is. For instance, the nature of water is that it is wet, the nature of fire is that it is hot. This is relative nature.

Absolute Nature:
Every being, from Dharmakaya down to hell, is integrated with Nature.
It encompasses all beings equally without any changes. But we don't trust our own Nature, our own property. We don't realize it, we don't recognize it, we don't try to know it.

We are always just [looking] outside, we are not facing it. This is our main mistake. It seems too easy, too close, too clear. But the problem is that we don't trust it, we don't think it is important.
Or sometimes people think it is too difficult to know it or something. Don't say you don't know it. It is your Nature! If you rest [in awareness], it is clear to you. That is the first point.

How to make your Nature clear to yourself:
Secondly, if you look towards your own thought, it disappears and just after it disappears, the State has to be the same [as described by the master and the text]. There are many ways to correct this [if your understanding is mistaken].