THIS IS THE CHARACTER ARC THAT PETER SHOULD HAVE HAD LAST SEASON AFTER LIV DUMPED HIM. IT IS TOTALLY OUT OF PLACE HERE BUT IM GLAD THAT HE’S AT LEAST HAVING IT. this was totally excellent and i am back on board now BUT there’s still not really a valid reason for them to be in an alt timeline and this episode does not excuse all of the pissing around that they have been doing all season. this episode should have come like four episodes into the season or something. also OLIVIA DUNHAM IS A FREAKING BOSS IN ALL POSSIBLE TIMELINES FOREVER!!!

4 weeks is going to feel like forever! That last scene was heartbreaking, which hopefully means when they are united it will be marvelous. And hey, September seems to be the biggest shipper of them all! He wants Olivia to be with Peter so bad!! Love it! Love Fringe! Love is the answer!! That and a 5th season.

Yes, indeed, and if Peter is very important, it would seem that he is part of the evolutionary sequence that resulted in the Observer-like future humans. That means to me at least, that he and Olivia must procreate. I almost forgot what an entire mythology episode felt like–it felt great. Help me!–when Jones was fake torturing bad Olivia, didn’t he torture the bionic hand? Later, she clearlly had two natural hands (no prosthetic). Another 10.

I was expecting a little more than what we got this episode… The cliff-hanger was non-existent and now we get to watch more soap opera crap when Fringe returns in 4 weeks. The only good scene was between Peter and “Mr.X”. So basically were left with nothing changed. We still don’t know what September is doing being shot and whether he died or stayed alive. Peter knows about Henry, but from what September said, it sounded like he was also “important” like Peter. Maybe if i watch it again i will like this episode more.

watch it again and pay closer attention, bud.
Also, (this is not necessarily in response to 4 weeks. just workin’ out my thoughts) the context of having peter and olivia’s offspring somehow be relevant to the future of humanity makes the whole “destined lovers” thing seem alot less b.s. at least from where im standing. sounds like some john connor type stuff goin’ on. also, the fact that we have confirmation that this is NOT our olivia makes her gushy behavior towards peter less b.s. as well. it’s like peter said, HIS feelings and memories of olivia are rubbing off on this liv and are conflicting with her own experiences, hence she comes across as more desperate and needy. He wants her to want him, and its projecting on to her. So for her sake, he needs to GTFO back to his timeline before it completely destroys her.
furthermore, there’s still no purpose to the alt timeline. if they wanted to bring jones back so bad, they could have just brought in another one from a different universe or something. And, regardless of the new context offered by september, liv and peter’s relationship has still been poorly handled from 3×10 onward, so im not giving up my stance there.
That said, this episode has made me feel a lot better.

Here’s my confusion. If Peter was suppose to live in the Alt Universe, then wouldn’t it make sense that Bolivia was infact the correct Olivia? I’m just totally confused. Also, I believe this Olivia is ‘his’ Olivia. I still believe that this is Peter’s timeline minus his existence.

It will be really interesting to see how they make sense of the TL mess. As a Polivia fan, I am interested in seeing how they bring them together–my money remains on this Olivia as being Peter’s. I guess this Olivia has grown on me, plus, I can’t stand to think of any Olivia being with Lincoln!

we have to assume that at some point walter and bell or walternate had to have naturally and safely broken the universe barrier so that liv and peter could eventually meet. the mistake seems to be that september’s actions led to an unsafe breach in the fabric of the universes.

Maybe is destiny, it doesn’t matter if Walternate discovered the cure or not, I believe that eventually they would meet, making both of them important … Like, don’t matter the begining, in some point of the history they were suposed to meet.

I loved the explanation!! The observers are scientist from one of the possible timelines of the future!!!! Amazing!!!
But Poor Olivia!! If this one has her memories and electrocuted a guy the other one should rock harder!!! Awesome Episode!! But We have to wait too long…

Well, I wouldn’t be that cheerful about the Observers being us…imagine that future world full of Tabasco, with no feelings, no human contact?, and I don’t even want to think about what they’re wearing…how do they procreate?…are there woman and children?…uff! I deviate a little, but nevertheless it’s kinda freaky if you know what I mean.

Great episode! Loved all the Observer info!! I had a feeling the Nina at MD was the real one….she just seemed to shocked at the accusations. Though her double was a good actress too….that Nina played her part well:) But I love that we finally got to meet her doppleganger.

My question is: Why did the doppelganger Nina, that is in league with DRJ, also have a bio-mechanical arm? Do you think DRJ gave her that arm just for the ole switcheroo? Maybe it ties in with why the original timeline DRJ stole the arm…? Or is it possible that fate gave Alter-Nina a missing arm as well? What if somehow Alter-Nina is really the original timeline Nina somehow brought here by DRJ? I have so many damn questions that it’s not even funny.

I honestly see it as; Nina at the Fringe headquarters, the one being interrogated, is the real Nina, she was not the Nina communicating with DRJ, that was Alter-Nina we just didn’t know it at the time. I really don’t think Alter-Nina is a shape-shifter. I believe Alter-Nina is this timeline’s Red Version, or even perhaps the original Blue version considering the bionic arm (or hell even the original Red we’ve always wondered about if in fact this timeline isn’t one and the same as the original). I mean I guess it is possible that DRJ had the Bionic arm put on a perfectly fine fully armed Nina just to convince Liv that it is her, but that seems extreme unless we’ve been seeing the Alter-Nina for much longer than even we have now believed. I believe the Ninas are the Key to the relationship between the timelines. I also am beginning to believe that DRJ is really the same DRJ from season 1, or maybe his Red counterpart. We just have a piece of the puzzle missing at this moment so there is still uncertainty.

I imagine that we’ll see more of September. Being that time has no hold on him, I expect we’ll see his past played out in the show’s future. In other words; This may have very well been his death, but before he was even shot he may have visited the future we have yet to have seen. Yesterday for him may be days, weeks, or/and even months away for us.

Good episode…loved the return to mythology. Even the Observer ( our Observer) hates alter-Olivia. But still…are the Observers from one timeline, or is each Observer from a different possible future? Wasn’t really clear to me.

So…the tortured Nina…an alternate? I really want to know her story. And how Jones influenced her story.

What irritates me is Peter’s reasoning for not believing this Olivia is his Olivia. I mean why, instead of an alternate timeline, can no one suggest that everyone was pretty much mind-wiped and had replacement memories introduced?

I mean at first I thought he was talking about him hurting her as evidenced by the seizures and thought, silly Peter don’t you remember that Olivia ALWAYS has seizures after extensively using her powers as an adult?

Ya, but Peter is too afraid he will make the same mistake. September let Peter know that he procreated with the wrong Olivia! LOL. On that note, I just can’t blame Peter for putting a stop to it. I feel bad for Olivia getting her heart broken, but I can see and understand why Peter is doubting himself. Great episode. I thought we had to wait 3 weeks, now its FOUR WEEKS!?!?!?!?

Cheyanne, I agree with you completely. He has no irrefutable proof that this is his Olivia, he only wants to believe it. Just because you want to believe in something doesn’t make it true. He’s done that already, wanted to believe a different Olivia was his, so he made excuses for the differences. He doesn’t want to make that same mistake, again, and quite frankly, I’m proud of him. I expected this type of reaction in an episode following ABHB. It’s very realistic , I think, to assume that because he’s no certainity that this is his ‘home’, he’s going to keep looking for something until he can no for sure why everything is happening.

I think now that Peter knows he had a son he is feeling even more guilty for what happened with Alt-Olivia. can you imagine how Olive is gonna feel when/if she finds out that Peter had a child with Alt-Liv when it should have been her & Peter making babies, she will be shattered and then she found out that he again went with another Olivia ( assuming that this isnt OUR Olivia) i dont think there is a word to describe. she just fried someone with her mind in this epiosde she may repeat that on Peters private parts lol. so i think he is being very very cautious

Yes, actually, I think Walter alluded to that in this episode, when he said of a recording device that if you scratch underneath the surface, you will find what was originally written. That, for me, indicated that this was in fact Peter’s timeline, but everyone has a new set of memories recorded over the original. Perhaps they’ll figure out a way to “uncover” the original recording/memory.

Also, the babies in the APPLE glyph are now apparent to me as Peter and Olivia being the “Adam and Eve” to their descendants- the observers. Plus to reference the fact that they are “soul mates”- which perhaps is the entire underlying message of this show…that one should keep searching until they find/reunite with their soulmate.

I like it also, and agree with it. This is the original timeline, i dont care what people say, they would not have produced 15 episodes + to just say were in the wrong place, i refuse to believe that, if it is the case i will always remember fringe as having the worst season 4 in any history of any tv show ever, because it was literally 15 episodes of empty space.

Oh please. It’d be a bigger waste of 14 episodes if we WERE in the same place because then you’re asking, “what’s the point?” They’ll have wasted an entire season of Peter running around asking where he is and he’ll have been home the entire time. THAT is a waste.

Exploring a new universe/timeline is better than any “what-if” scenario or a dream sequence unless it teaches Peter and Olivia how to save the universes once and for all.

The point is progress. That’s been the point from the very beginning – it’s about the characters overcoming their flaws and growing. All three central characters have had a major flaw since the beginning of the show.

Walter had a God complex. He knew no boundaries. He made a selfish choice that resulted in the death of millions of people. He has since overcome that, or is at least on his way to overcoming that.

Olivia was consumed by fear, and by extension, pushed others away. She also has overcome that.

Peter was very self-centered, knew no home, and was true to nobody but himself. He is on the journey to remedying that – first he sacrificed himself in the machine. Now he is going to have to see beyond his own selfishness in wanting to get home. There is universe falling apart right in front of his face – Olivia is falling apart right in front of his face, but he doesn’t want to be part of it because he is uncomfortable that nobody knows/remembers him here. He will have to reconcile that to progress on and truly get back “home” with Olivia, which is in the present timeline.

I just wanted to add to this that we’ve seen Peter repeating the same mistake this season that he made at the end of season 2. He felt betrayed so he went “home” to the other universe where his “true” family was – only to be brought back to where he truly belongs by Olivia. I think this plot point is key to what is happening now – Peter just needs to realize where he really belongs.

Dan S — great theory! AND, along the lines of the Observers being descendents of Peter and Olivia, maybe September is dying (i.e, his existence is being erased) the longer Peter is away from home. Which is why September asked Peter to do him a favor and go home. If he goes home to Olivia, there’s a chance that September will eventually be born.

Another thought: the observers are highly intelligent scientists with the ability to “jump” space and time — doesn’t that sound like a combination of our 3 main Fringe characters???? Peter (the genius) + Walter (scientist) + Olivia (who can jump between universes without the machine) = Observers. I don’t mean literally those 3 procreating (eeeeww!), but just Olivia and Peter, who shares Walter’s DNA (Walternate’s really).

Dan S. Excellent catch on the Walter quote. As I watched him explain the word to Astrid, I suspected that it will playout later. It’s the same with the mice in “Wall Flower” — Yoko was there all the time . . .

Although I wasn’t floored by the episode, the more I read these comments and give more thought to what I watched, I’m feeling pretty good about the final batch of episodes (for the season — not the series.).

Well, the promos definately hyped this one up to be a “massive” episode… but, I don’t think it was. The only real “development” were a few minutes with September, not that I didn’t enjoy those few minutes at all. We figured out, to a certain extent, who the Observers are, but that’s about all we figured out. I found the Nina twist, being that the tortured one is actually working with Jones, and the one in the FBI to be “our” Nina, to be completely predictable, and called it very early on. I also thought the showrunners assured us we’d learn more about Jones and his plan… but we didn’t. At all… And, Peter’s decision at the end also felt a bit forced, and again, predictable.

One of the biggest problems I’ve had with the anticipating a “huge Fringe episode” is that it’s never a “huge Fringe episode”. The first thirty minutes followed a pretty basic structure — albeit with a bit more “edge”, just because Olivia was in danger. The structure being as follows: Lincoln, a few shocks, a twist, some science dialogue, and then the Observer showed up. The few moments with the Observer were great — Josh Jackson and Michael Cerveris had some real good interplay, and I loved the spatial effects going on around them. The entire setting felt very Fringey — grand, out of the box, mysterious, and “big budget”. Something we’ve been missing this season. Josh did a great job reacting to the Henry news, and he did an incredible job in those last few moments with Olivia, even if it felt slightly rushed and forced.

I was surprised that this episode didn’t end on a real cliffhanger. It obviously wrapped up leaving the audience craving more, but not in the sense that, say, Jones had a gun to Peter’s head and Olivia couldn’t get a hang of the cortexiphan abilities. Instead, it closed in a way that felt like some kind of a conclusion — like the penultimate chapter of a book, just before a final epilogue to tie up the loose ends. I guess the final episodes will be about reconciling everything, and maybe finally “getting home”. I’ve still gotta say, even if this episode didn’t blow me away, this middle block of episodes has been much better than the first block. I only hope that I can enjoy the final block just as much.

I think it was an awesome episode. But i do agree it was very over hyped, and i dont know about you guys but especially when they were torturing nina, i did not know anna torv could act that badly, it just felt completely wrong they way she was playing it, she was back to her normal excellent self after that but still……

Josh jackson was amazing and subtle in this episode especially at the end.

It’s true J.P, I was expecting Olivia to seem alot more ‘bothered’ and angry and desperate towards Nina. But I suppose, given this Olivia is no longer the one that feels like a daughter to Nina, the reactions toward her torture wouldn’t have been as ‘grandiose’ as they would have been before.

JM, As I mentioned in the review, I think it was bad directed…I think as many here are saying, that Olivia could’ve shown more desperation even if she wasn’t connected to this Nina or if she already knew it could be a trap. Same with Nina’s ridiculous bending after knowing Peter was the key…Anna and Blair played well, I just think they were directed to play it that way.

Really? My reasoning for her acting was because at that moment, she is more of “our” Olivia than the Olivia in the new timeline. So given that our Olivia isn’t that close or that sympathetic to Nina, her “bland” reaction was pretty understandable. But, that’s just me.

Ok, so basically, we got something to start to understand the Observer…Which is very good, and I think that we still going to see September!
The Nina plot… I applaud standing! Really love that, and I really wish that the both Ninas are on the ” bad” side!!! Nina is just a puzzle and I like when she is in the bad side…
Lincoln…Lincoln… JUST SHUT UP!!!! REALLY!!!!!!!
Peter and Olivia.. I know the ” all the good “love stories are tragic, but …really, my heart just break with that last scene… Even my neighbors were able to hear it!!!!!!
Love this episode, and 4 weeks IS TO MUCH FOR A HUMAN BEING!!!!!!!!
*crying my lungs out*

I think that this IS our timeline, with some adjust, because make Olivia fall in love with Peter and that not be her is so, soooooooooooooooo wrong and cruel!!!
And definitely I need to watch again, and again, and again….

I also believe it is our timeline. Before Peeter came back, the characters were a product of a universe in which Peter died crossing over. After Peter returned, the characters moved toward their selves with Peter in the universe.

I rewatched the scene I referenced in my last post, and it’s pretty ambiguous – could go either way I guess.

Although it just doesn’t make sense that the showrunners would spend an entire season in an alternate timeline that doesn’t affect our prime universe/timeline – plus they’ve come right out many times and said that this IS our timeline.

Peter is just freaking out for not committed the same mistake (Henry) that he did with the , Observer’s word, ” wrong Olivia” , so probably if I was in Peters place, I was just freaking out too!Too much pressure for one man, that can’t commit another mistake!

The fact that Walter and Olivia were both having dreams and visions of Peter before he reappeared has to mean something. Peter thinks he’s just affecting them by being around, but they were affected before he rematerialized…so I think that does lean support to your theory.

Also, DRJ said about Olivia’s feelings toward’s Peter were ‘profound’ . . . I’ve said it a dozen times, this is his timeline and his Olivia, now we just have to see how the writers bring it together. I trust they will.

Agreed. I think this is sort of like Lost, where in the end what we’re meant to take away is what the characters meant to each other and how they grew, not necessarily how they solved the big mystery and tied everything up in a nice bow in the way of understanding everything.

I’m sure there will be some resolution to the overarching story with DRJ, the observers, ect. but I think what we’re really after here is the characters making some progress. Olivia is progressing in terms of opening up and being more honest and authentic with her feelings. Walter seems to be questioning things with Peter, but he’s also grown in that he sees his mistakes and how he tried to play God by interfering. Now we are seeing Peter really find himself – like he said in WtW, Olivia gave him a sense of home he has been sorely missing. I think we will see these characters continue to progress, especially Peter, and that will be the resolution of the season.

One word-EPIC! I loved this episode. So Olivia shoots Jones right in the freaking neck and he’s like all— hey there are certain ‘fringe’ benefits to being assembled atomically, or something like that. So I think this is the OT Jones somehow: heck I don’t know. Liked how they talked of the video constantly being recorded over. It is like this new timeline was recorded over the last (OT) one. Great episode.

After watching it again, yes I already re-watched the episode, the final scene kinda felt like the bookend to marionette. That scene was a gut wrencher as well, this was like the opposite version. Both scenes were beautifully acted, and heartbreaking. Anna Torv & Joshua Jackson are pure gold that have been overlooked for far too long.

Very True. Olivia was great as always but hey, in this episode we see more of Joshua’s acting capabilities. That scene with Observer was flawless. There is really more power in subtleties. And I noticed Peter is starting to look like Peter from season 1 as well- looks younger, more handsome, great hair and blue polo. I like it! Then I digress, sorry

I enjoyed the episode. I don’t think it was as epic as was hyped, but I must admit I fell into a couple spoiler traps, so that’s my own fault. I, too, was glad to see the return of the beacon from Season 1.

I’m enjoying this last round of episodes. My only complaint with this episode, and with the entire timeline in general, is the inconsistency of some of the main characters. Walter going back and forth concerning his feelings for Peter, Olivia rejecting and then embracing Peter. The biggest flaw for me, though, is Peter himself. I can rationalize the odd behavior of the other characters because they aren’t our characters from the original timeline (or are they?), but Peter is still himself, and he seems too wishy-washy for me.

We have him fall for the wrong Olivia in Season 3. He redeems himself in LSD by recognizing the “real” Olivia in her mind. Then in this new timeline he is determined to get home. Then he falls back into the old trap with Olivia. Now he rejects her again. This is just a little too much. I hope they explain it soon.

* As Walternate said, not everything is as it seems. Nina in the cell was a fake. And it became obvious when Broyles and Lincoln were interrogating the real Nina.

* Olivia blowing out the lights all over the joint was absolute MONEY. If it had been our Olivia, she would have engaged in pyrotechnics. Which leads me to…

* So last week I asked a Fellow Fringe Fan if Peter kissing Olivia (amidst all the green) was a case of the Amber moving toward the Blue or the Blue moving toward the Amber, and that this was the right Olivia. Now we know. I felt bad for this Olivia because her heart was broken in this episode. We will see if Peter chose wisely. Maybe this Olivia will end up with Lincoln after all, although I think the door is still open for Lincoln to end up with this timeline’s Fauxlivia. And speaking of Lincoln…

* Could the guy’s lines paint him as being any more of a jerk (“Our Olivia, your Olivia, I thought they were one in the same,” sneeringly)? Lincoln adds brains to the team, but the character comes across a bit petty and a bit preachy. The hurdle is already high enough with so many fans of Peter, they need to paint him in a sympathetic light. Shippers resented the triangle, and because of that, many resent Lincoln. The writers need to do something to present him more favorably. I am not a Lincoln lover, but if you’re gonna make him one of the good guys, make him more sympathetic. But Lincoln is not Peter, especially when it comes to…

* The Fringe Mind Meld. Wow. We are the ancestors to the Observers. That is COOL. That whole scene was perfect. And it really did revisit all that has happened. September admitted that he had erred going into the lab when Walternate was finding a cure for Peter. Obviously, Peter’s life was meant to go on. Pointing out to Peter that he was meant to be with his Olivia sort of implies that at some point he and Olivia would have met after crossing dimensions. September telling Peter that he fathered Henry with the wrong Olivia takes on two items…

* Henry is important somewhere in the timeline. The Observer said that by erasing Peter, they erased Henry.

* Henry was meant to live with Peter as his dad.

Overall, an excellent episode. I had read some spoilers earlier today which left me thinking that this installment was going to be a bit more complicated.

It’s like I said before, I think we are in our timeline, and that this is our Olivia, and that Henry thing, he was not suposed to be with the other Olivia, so maybe we going to see him with the right Olivia, our Olivia!

I just thought for a second that Olivia was going to shoot one of the machines that helped open up the portal so it would close on him, thus slicing him like bread again… but that would have been too easy.

How can it be (1) a mistake that Walternate didn’t discover the cure and that Peter ended up in “our” Universe instead of his; and also (2) a mistake that Peter had sex with Fauxlivia (from his Universe) instead of Olivia (from our Universe)? Did I miss something?

I’m guessing if things had played out correctly and September wouldn’t have been seen, Walternate would have saved Peter and either Peter or Olivia would have somehow crossed over to unite. Also, Peter was supposed to father a son with blue ‘verse Olivia. This son is apparently important, maybe an ancestor to the observers, or maybe he just contributed something vital to the unfolding of human, and by extension, observer, existence. Henry has to exist in the timeline as originally intended, as the product of Peter and blue ‘verse Olivia.

That was my take on what September said as well. But if a baby born to Peter and blue Olivia is so important to the Observers’ existence, why did they erase Peter from the timeline? Wouldn’t that be counter productive?

I swear, whenever I think I have figured something out about this show, something throws a spanner in the works.

I think the consequence of September’s mistake was the war between the universes. They were trying to prevent the war believing it to be a better solution to the huge problem created by September’s mistake. But now September realizes/believes that it is not a better solution. We just don’t know why. Yet.

This is what i understood from this episode regarding the observers:
– In the far future mankind evolves into them.
– This group of observers are a scientific team who wanted to watch their creation, but they accidentally interfered and actually caused the first fringe event, starting the story arc of the entire fringe show
– In the first original timeline (which we have never seen) walternate saves peternate, but he still ends up with the olivia from the blueverse and they have a son named henry.

Well he already knew how to view the other universe. Maybe he didn’t have as strong of a reason to breach it to go over and get Peter, but maybe he would have gone for some other reason. We know from other episodes that he and Bell experimented with exchanging objects between the universes – the man knows no boundaries, so what would have stopped him from doing it just because he could?

Hmm that’s interesting….so you’re suggesting that if the future had played out correctly, instead of Walter and Belly opening a portal to the other side that Olivia, maybe in a moment of fear and because of the Cortexiphan, flashed to the other side and met Peter? A la Subject 13?

Why does no one else seem completely floored by the implications of this episode? THINK for a minute guys. We just learned a sh*t-ton of stuff!

-this liv is NOT our olivia and peter FINALLY had the emotional epiphany that he should have had last season before ourliv took him back.
-the observers are an advanced form of us
-the whole “destined lovers” thing that seemed like crap actually makes sense now BECAUSE
-olivia and peter are supposed to have a son who is going to do something really important which affects the future of the universe
-it is seriously implied that jones knows way more about liv’s powers than he is letting on.
-also THE ENTIRE SHOW HAS ESSENTIALLY JUST BEEN A BIG GLITCH IN THE PROGRESSION OF TIME (thanks to september). THERE IS A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT SET OF EVENTS WHICH IS SUPPOSED TO HAVE HAPPENED WHICH DID NOT.

how are people not blown away by this? it almost makes up for the last thirteen episodes of nothing. also, LINCOLN’S BERATING OF PETER IN THAT PROMO WAS TOTALLY JUSTIFIED BECAUSE PETER WAS WRONG ABOUT OLIVIA AGAIN. I have SO MUCH satisfaction right now! BAM! also, i love september but he’s not really good at his job.
Oh! and if observers are an advanced stage of us then are there female observers? do observers have sex? …. geez, now i’m thinking about it… ew.. good night, y’all!

I don’t mean this to be rude, but when did they say that this is not our Olivia? Unless I missed something, they didn’t say anything either way. Peter just assumed; just as he assumed when he showed up at the beginning of the season. There really hasn’t been evidence either way.

Hehe, so great to see you going to bat for this episode after your dissatisfaction with much of the season..

I may be stretching things here a bit BUT…I think the specific pairing of Ourlivia with Peter makes a whole lot of sense because
1) Altivia wasn’t subjected to Cortexiphan (I could be entirely wrong, there’s so much damn stuff to keep track of! Feel free to put me in my place if I’ve flubbed it).
2) I feel like the specific combination of our Olivia’s abilities (which are far more than other Cortexitots) and Peter’s being from the redverse are what gives rise to the observers (the observer powers seem to point to this i.e: teleportation). If P & O are the “missing link” between humanity as we know it and the Observers, it’s not such a stretch to think that she could have passed on some innate abilities to the child, via the Cortexiphan possibly mutating some of her genetic code. Slap that together with the fact that Peter was never ever ever supposed to have anything to do with the Blueverse and voila: people who can exist outside of space and time.

That actually makes a lot of sense, especially paired with cal’s post above about Peter, Olivia, and Walter being combined genetically to give rise to beings with the kinds of powers the Observers have.

the whole “this wasn’t supposed to have happened” revelation wasn’t revealed in this episode, it was revealed in ‘Peter’ when we first saw September distract Walternate, and then consult with the others about his mistake.

right but now we know it’s because liv/peter’s baby is supposed to be essential to the natural progression of time. the added perspective of the observers being from the future just makes the whole thing seem much bigger and more legit, at least for me. i’m not gonna argue semantics, this is just how i feel.

Wait, I may have missed something. I remember September highlighting that Henry wasn’t supposed to have been, but I don’t necessarily remember anything about the child being essential – only that he shouldn’t have existed in order to permit the machine to be activated on the other side first.

Reed, I know there’s most likely inconsequential dialogue in this show, but personally, I take nothing as non-essential. I’m sure there’s something to it that we’ll most likely realize in later episodes.

September says “the beginning of all things” when Peter first enters his mind. I didn’t really see the episode as the end of all things, unless you want to interpret it as the beginning of the end of the universes as they unite into a merger? Maybe?

When Peter entered September’s mind, it was “the beginning of all things”….it looked like the Big Bang/universe creation. But it sounded like September also noted that Peter was observing his (September’s) end. Which, if this really is the end of September, then the Fringe mythology has lost a major player.

But this is Fringe. Is anything ever really the end? If Peter gets back home, and it is NOT where he is right now, then maybe once the timeline resets, September comes back?

Because it’s the end of all things alt timeline? and the next episode will be the start of Peter’s return home to the original? Oh well, i’m still thinking which reality to except – this is the original timeline, only re-written and is original bleeding through because of Peter, or it’s really a new or alt timeline. Either way, the end of all things could also mean end of all beliefs. Nothing is as it seems. Whew!

I’m with the majority that believe this is, in fact, our timeline. And the definition about the video tape, I think, clues us in on this.

This is definitely are timeline. And I think another main element of this show, is that sometimes things that are meant to happen, fate, itself can be undone by the choices we make. And Peter chose to get into the machine and in effect, created this timeline, even though he never should have got into the machine in the first place because Henry was never meant to exist. And because of an underlying connection to Olivia, Peter bled through into a timeline that is his, but isn’t because he’s not supposed to exist after the BBM swallowed him up.

There’s still more answers we need, but a think a big, overarching aspect of this show is whether or not we can dictate and define our fate. Peter’s said a countless number of times that he doesn’t believe in it, Olivia mentioned it this season too. Maybe there’s something about their shared belief system, and upcoming events.

Even before I read any comments, I wanted to write this first.
I was somewhat underwhelmed by the episode and left very confused. Don’t get me wrong I enjoyed the episode and I am devastated that September is no longer; that was one of my favorite parts of the episode.

I believe my disconnect came at the end with the Peter Olivia scene. I think Peter is wrong; he doesn’t have a timeline to return to . . . everything September and the other Observes said was “he is back”. However, that’s not my biggest problem. My biggest and probably the first time I’ve really had any complaints (other than Lincoln :)) with the show is, I didn’t like the way Peter was so dismissive of Olivia. Whether or not she’s ‘his’ Olivia to simply say ‘maybe Walter can help you/fix you . . . I don’t know, I just need to get back to my Olivia.” So harsh . . . I think that was out of character for Peter.

Okay, I’ll probably have more to say and in a more coherent fashion, but I had to get this off of my chest.

I think the consequence of Peter changing the timeline is he changed Olivia. He can’t get her back unless he resets things to the way they were–which would cause the future we saw in The Day We Died. Maybe that’s the future he belongs in.

I think Peter is so wore out emotionally and physically from all of this he just wanted to get away from Olivia at that moment because he is still so confused and tired. I cant imagine the toll this would take on person.

Although it was great to catch a glimpse into the future in the observer’s mind and see the moment when Peter and our Olivia reunite with a huge hug and happiness, while September says “THIS must be, and everything will be as it was intended. You MUST find a way”.

Peter very much gave Olivia the brush-off, and left her in the rain, saying he was going home. This left this Olivia heartbroken. I think there may have been a clue/foreshadowing for this in last week’s episode, when Karen Elson’s “The Ghost Who Walks” was playing in the background in the lab.

But September did say Peter had to get back to the right Olivia. We’ll
see if the two Olivias are really different.

Well, we got at least some of our answers, but still many question were raised. I suppose that’s just how fringe works. What I do love particularly about the show now is it’s really diving into it’s own mythology. It’s really starting to develop the overall story on a regular basis, which is great, considering this season may sadly be their last. I feel whatever happens, the show will wrap up nicely. And as for dealing with the break, I’ll just have to find other things to keep my mind off of Fringe. *sigh*

Ok i know i usually have a lot of lincoln hate, but i think all the hate i had for him prior was justified with his performance in this episode, possibly the worst character performance i have ever seen on fringe, completely and utterly ****!

So based on this episode and the episode named August from season two they are telling us that humans will lost their emotions in future! in that episode from season 2 August told September “I think it’s what they call feelings” or something like that.

I don’t care what they do with the Lincoln character to redeem him, they could make him the funniest, most saintly, most professional and useful character ever, but, at this point, the only thing that could redeem this season is his sudden death. I’ve always found his little ugly voice beyond annoying and using it to preach and being judgmental is not helping his awful existence. I’m not counting on a satisfying death for him, I’m thinking flamethrowers, because the producers are so in love with the character (something I find astonishing), but I swear that if he was killed off (and somehow managed to take his counterpart with him), my happiness would last for a month at least.

I knew Meana was the one with Olivia! She looked somewhat hesitant, when talking about her past with Rachel and Olivia, but when she started screaming in pain, it was absolutely clear it wasn’t real Nina. How bad an actress is she? I mean Meana, not Blair Brown, who is perfect. I think Blair did an amazing job at making Meana do such a terrible performance. I agree with the posts above that the scenes with DRJ, Meana and Olivia were bland, but Meana! She was fun!

The scene with Peter in September’s mind was amazing! Easily my favorite in this episode. It was hard to see him gain and lose a son in less than a minute, that was heartbreaking… On the other hand, he got to witness the Big Bang! How cool is that?

I also think this episode was kind of overhyped. How was it a game changer?

So agree about Lincoln, i just.cannot.stand.him and hes doing his best “jealous look” in the promo for the next episode, and lol number six, if he had been killed in this episode you would have been very happy over the hiatus then!

The cast interviews that were released by fox hyped this episode SO much i wouldnt call it a “game changer” id call it a “eye opener” but it seems we took 2 steps forward and a millions steps back in terms of moving past the P/O stuff and looking to the universes being healed etc. once they are together this season, which i reckon will happen in 4.15 i hope they just keep it, and move on with the narrative, if they split once more it will split focus, if they stay apart it will split focus, if they stay together it can be nicely in the background while the driving force of the narrative stays focus.

If by jealous look you mean open his eyes wide (ease up on the eyeliner, dude!) and press his mouth, that’s exactly how he does his menacing look. And his serious look. And his concentrated look. And his infatuated look…

We have learned a lot about the Observers and Peter has learned about his son. That is some progress, but I can hardly call that an “eye opener”, because the main characters still don’t know where they stand and they are the ones, who drive the action. We are 14 episodes in, what are the writers waiting for? And what about DRJ (who I’m finding rather disappointing)? We haven’t learned anything about his intentions, either.

I don’t think Lincoln is going anywhere. I am not a fan of his character, at least Amber Lincoln. Red Lincoln is sort of a fun guy, or at least he was prior to the timeline being wiped. But the producers have said that Lincoln is part of the team. And his character produces a bright-line difference with Peter. (imo, Amber Lincoln is “Fredo” to Peter’s “Michael.”)

As far as Peter and Olivia being resolved next episode, Jeff Pinkner and J.H. Wyman have always talked about the long-and-bended path for “wuv…twue wuv…” and so I would guess that that will not happen in 4.15. But at some point it will.

Lol when Lincoln was lecturing Peter in the first scene i was like JUST SHUT UP! i find his character so annoying. and i swear if Olivia ends up falling for Linc because Peter is pushing her away man i am gonna be pissed.

OK one other thing about this episode. After September disappeared, Walter seemed relieved that Peter was able to exit his consciousness prior to his dying. Almost like a father happy to see his son come out of a dangerous situation.

I wasn’t big fan of baby Henry, or at least the way he was introduced, but seeing in this episode the way Peter looked at him, with fatherly, tender look, and the same way he whisper his name, and following the realization that he had him, was so sad (that that my heart broke in piece) and NOW I want Henry back in game, in any form. Joshua Jackson is pure gold in this scene. Love for son he just found out, and sadness for his non existence, was so sad to watch! After all, theme of Fringe IS love, father-son love and what will one do to have other in his life.
I’m also in majority who thinks that this IS our Olivia, and I look forward to see how writers will resolve that. Peter made wise decision and frankly I love him more for that. I would be just wrong play along without real explanation why she suddenly have new memory. So that last scene was inevitable and feel right.

I don’t understand why some people keep telling that this characters are not the characters from the original time line. there are a lot of indications that shows this is the rewritten original time without the presence of Peter and the big prove to this for me is the conversation Peter had with September about baby Henry. Peter : I HAVE a son. September : HAD when you made that sacrifice with stepping into that machine you were not the only one that cease to exist.

The Observer revelation was a little dull, and really didn’t answer anything at all (ok, so they’re scientists from the future who can fight, catch bullets, travel through time, magically open car doors, have awesome guns, and a strange cylinder that shoots through from…somewhere). Disappointing aspect of the episode, and a little bit of cheat considering that, for all the advertising, The Observers were hardly in this story.

Other than that gripe though, the rest of the episode was fine. A few quibbles here and there but it was otherwise fun, I enjoyed it.

Season 4 has me interested now. I don’t love it, I still don’t consider it ‘Fringe’, but it has finally becoming entertaining.

btw are we to expect that both Ninas are in on it? After all, it’s the one being interrogated that was seen in previous episodes speaking with Jones and dosing Olivia with cortexiphan, but the other was revealed to be in on it, so…doppelgangers from either universe? Or an alt universe doppelganger and a shape-shifter of our Nina? Kudos to Blair Brown btw for putting on a great performance. See, this is why we need more of her.

Totally agree about Blair Brown. She is a legend.
I think the episode was overhyped, and we maybe didn’t get as many answers as we wanted. But, with everything else going on in the episode, there wasn’t really a lot of time for it, in my opinion. Although, as for the hype, I’d rather every episode be overhyped and overpromoted by Fox and the showrunners so we have some ratings chances.

That said, I’m happy with what we got. The Peter/September scene was good, but they did reveal quite a bit there with just the conversation between the two. That’s kind of giving up a lot of mythology really easily. You know – the show don’t tell idea of storytelling. I think we need to be “shown” the big mythology stuff and not “told” so much, so I think we’ll get more down the road in a way that is a more natural playing out of events.

Enjoyed watching this epsiode but like many I think I need to rewatch. So we finally get answers on the observers and im glad they are not aliens from another planet lol!

I have to say I got emotional when September told Peter about Henry, he seemed so happy to know he had a son. Not ashamed to say this but I did have some tears forming. Even though I didn’t like the addition of Henry the lil bub will be missed after all he is innocent in all this.

The last scene between Peter & Olivia was heartbreaking. What if this is HIS OLIVIA then he jerpodising their chance at happiness.

Now we have to wait 4 weeks until the next episode and let me say it’s sure gonna be painful to do so.

I REALLY enjoyed this episode. I was on a cruise all week, so going into ‘The End of All Things’ I had no promo hypes are anything; I was going in not knowing what was going to happen already. I loved the scene with Peter and September (I think they were seeing the Big Bang?) and the pacing of the episode felt perfect (except, Walter could have maybe mentioned a bit how he was connecting Peter in September’s brain…I know we’ve seen it before but that part felt a bit rushed).

All in all, fantastic episode with some really interesting revelation. I’m also going with the theory that Peter and Olivia are September’s ancestors and he needs them to be together for the Observer future to survive. Really looking forward to the next episode and seeing the Beacon again!!!

HOW STUPID IS SEPTEMBER?
Yay for the Peter/Olivia-Shipping, but man… didn’t he learn anything by watching both Walters sacrifice everything for the life of their son? So telling Peter he had a son (who he killed by stepping into the machine) he’ll NOT GIVE HIM UP and be with his Olivia and make a new baby with her but DO EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE and go home ONLY BECAUSE OF HIS SON WITH BOLIVIA???? And eventually leave and lose his Olivia???? So whatever “must be” according to the observers WON’T COME TO PASS as intended. The only thing that’s gonna happen for sure is: Olivia will get her heart broken yet another time.

And probably that’s resulting in why she has to die and September/Mr. X will probably need to kill her to rectify whatever new unintended consequences. Also I think he’ll get shot by Peter who of course wants to protect his true love… blah.

And as for ALL THE ANSWERS that weren’t coming…. not to quote another tv-series that let us down before…. every answer only leads to another question….

WHY THE HELL IS PETER SO DAMN IMPORTANT? Because he could prevent the future of mankind where the observers live in?
And just to clear that up: The observers can’t just travel in time but also across universes, right?

And superbaby Henry (if he would have been born to the right Olivia) will be the first of a new species? Cross-Universe-Cortexifan-timetraveller? Maybe he’s the first observer? Maybe he’s the one the machine was really meant for. Gawd…

WHAT IS TO COME? WHAT WHAT WHAT? And if Walter and Peter really built the Big Bad Machine in the future… WHY DID THEY DO IT? And why did they take it back in time and burry the scattered pieces. Probably not because they wanted their younger selfs to find them but probably because they wanted to destroy it for good since noone is to temper with timelines and fates.

Maybe it’s just like “startrek – first contact”. Maybe Peter is like the guy who invented warp-speed and that resulted in the first contact with another alien species. If the machine is the first time travel thing (the observers use) and peter and walter are the ones to invent it, they’ll probably know the evil that lies in it (with all the oppenheimer quoting on this show walter definitly has learnt his lesson). so peter hopefully will go to the future and tell the observers to back the hell off trying to alter past events to their advantage.

AND ANOTHER PROBLEM I HAVE WITH SEPTEMBER’S CRYPTIC LIKE-IT-WAS-INTENDED-SPEECH:

If Peter originally was to be cured by Walternate (which September messed up) – then he would never have met OUR Olivia because the war between the universes would never have happened because Walter would never have had a reason to cross over??? But according to September they would have met anyway to make their superbaby… aaaaah… I’m going crazy.

I think in the observer’s time there are also two sides – like always. one that wants to do whatever they do and one that wants to change their fate for the better (September) maybe?

And another thing… did I missunderstand something? If Peter goes “home” to his timeline baby Henry will still be alive, won’t he? He did only not exist in this new timeline, right? And of course the beacon will bring Peter home… that’s probably why in season one september needed walter’s help to hide it. Probably because he stole it from the other observer’s in order to send Peter home in season 4 and couldn’t have season 1 Peter interfere in his own rescue

THE OBSERVER: You have managed to return in physical form. I suspect… This will provide an opportunity for you to put things right. She is the one… The Olivia Dunham from whom your shared future was meant to spring. This must be, and everything will be as it was intended. You must find a way… they are coming.
PETER: Who?
THE OBSERVER: You need to go.
PETER: What’s happening?
THE OBSERVER: There is no time. I’m going to need you to do something for me.
PETER: I’m not doing anything till you tell me where to find Olivia–
THE OBSERVER: For that, you have only to go home.

See, I got the impression that by saying “You have returned in physical form. I suspect this will provide an opportunity to put things right”, the Observer was saying that he is now with the true Olivia and that he can make things right by being with her. How else would he put things right by returning physically unless he was in the correct timeline? He then tells Peter that all he needs to do is go home to find Olivia- the Observer is telling Peter to just go back to where he was and there she is- he is telling him that he is already with her.

Things changed without Peter to make the timeline look different, sure, but now he is back and making Olivia remember her past as it happened with Peter. This doesn’t mean that she is a different Olivia, I believe that everyone is the correct version of themselves. How can you look at what September says above and not see he is saying that Peter has been given another chance to be with his Olivia and that he is already with her?

Also, the producers wouldn’t make a show where the timeline is full of people we don’t know and the first three seasons were for nothing. Look at what September says, it’s quite obvious that this is our Olivia, just with her memories and past changes by the intervention of the other Observers. They tried to remove Peter from the timeline and make everything okay because he messed up by having a boy with the other Olivia, but September was the “rogue Observer” in this sense, going against them and giving him another chance to do it the right way. For this, I suspect he got shot.

Pretty fulfilling episode for me, considering how awful Season 3 and the first half of this season was . I was gonna stop watching Fringe after Wallflower, but they really picked up the show and it seems almost like Season 1 or 2 again. I’ll say I’m glad I didn’t stop watching, and I hope it redeems itself and answers even more (I’m looking at you, storage discs in people’s hands, kid observer, etc. from season 1 that were just dropped). Beacon in the next episode, so that’s a start.

Even the Observer use the “was” when he was talking about Henry, “was” past, a past that no longer existed.
In my pont of view, that timeline that was ours, no longer existe, it was erased and replaced for this new timeline. Like the exemple of the VHS that Peter and Walter talked about.
I believe thar even if Peter enter in the machine again, he would not be able to chance for that old timeline, because is the past and the past can’t be changed, you just can change the future…
But I can be wrong,

Yeeeh. Isn’t it annoying that a guy with IQ of 190 wouldn’t get what normal people like us can see? I guess he is too much in love for that kind of discovery. Or, writers want to make things interesting for us by giving us a chance to see Olivia’s chase after Peter. I hope they won’t loose us in that pursue. There aren’t that many good shows on TV these days to make the lost less painful.

Cliff after reading your comments I would say that your logic makes alot of sense. When I watched the Peter /September scene I felt as if this Olivia was not really his, but you have given very compelling arguments to suggest that he is in the right timeline and this in fact is his Olivia.

It will be interesting to see how the rest of the season pans out in regards to this.

So many comments that I cannot read them all, but those I read are great. Something is bothering me. I am not so sure that “timelines” are litterally universes in different times. I think we are watching the age old time travel problem. If you go to another time, you may inadvertently change the future with dire results. Everything points to the amberverse being the blue verse without Peter in the beginning of the season Were not the episodes before Peter returned introducing us to what the world looked like without Peter? The recent episodes have to be a blend of the “timelines.” Olivia is having problems with two sets of meories, and the memories before Peter returned are getting hazy. But, if I amm correct, why did not the other observers not understand as September did that Peter needed to be in this universe so that humans could evolve into the humans in the future?

Truth to be told, these people really aren’t Peter’s Olvia and Walter… the same way Bolivia wasn’t his Olivia. Or Walternate isn’t Walter… they are simply different because Peter never existed in their lives. And we have seen that their lives got altered in many umpredictable ways… like Rachel and Olivia living with Nina. Did this also happen because of the lack of Peter? It could be… but it doesn’t really matter. The possibilites are infinite like the universes.

The problem is… and I don’t see why Peter hasn’t at least considerd this yet, that there is no point in space or time where he can go back to. Because the envents we saw at the end of season 3 never happened. He can’t go back to the moment when he vanished (the only “place” where he can meet *his* people again) because that moment doesn’t exist and never existed. Plus it would probably cause a huge paradox. Now, is the machine able to rebuild an entire universe just to let him go home, back to that moment? I actually don’t see how. And wouldn’t that probably erease the Amber Universe? Would he find that fair? But this is Fringe, so everything is possible.

But if the people of the Amber Universe remember him (I don’t know how… traces of him lingering around?) then they simply become his people. Things exist when we remember them. If he can make everyone remember his existence then he really is home. Is that ethical? Does he “kill” the people in this universe by doing that? I don’t know. But the question loses much of its importance if we consider that this is just a single, random universe… and there are inifinite universes out there coming to life with every single second. To be true this consideration also kills pretty much all the mithology of the show… so let’s ignore it.

I think you are right mostly. I don’t think moving from one timeline to the other is as simple as between parallel universes, otherwise, why observers tried so hard to get Peter into the BBM and erase him from the timeline. Also September said “You had a son.” meaning that you don’t have one now. If there were another timeline to jump into, he would have said “You have a son.”.

Also September said that he had offspring with wrong Olivia. Again, it means that he didn’t erase Peter, so he can have a baby with right Olivia. Sorry guys but it really doesn’t make sense that he simply go back to his timeline and get busy on Olivia. We have seen the future in that timeline; no baby.

The other part that I’d like to point out is that Peter was the driver of BBM and he returned the time to Reiden lake moment while the correct action was to return to finding the cure moment. That would explain why September was showing that event to Peter. In that Senario, Peter (who is important) would exist and be raised by his own father. He still could make a baby with our Olivia, cause Jones would still making wholes in two universes. And that can also explain why September didn’t erased Peter. He wanted Peter to try again and reset the events one more time.

One last thing, Jones was referring to Olivia possessing much more power than she can imagine. Maybe, just maybe, her power is not only passing freely between universes but alo to passing her memories through different timelines.

Hey guys, I just realized that maybe this Amber Olivia is NOT our Olivia. She only has the memories of Blue-verse Olivia maybe given to her by “fake” Nina without it being made aware of it. Remember a couple of seasons ago when Walternate captured and gave our Blue-verse Olivia memories of the Red-verse Olivia (sharp-shooting skills, memories with Red Lincoln and Red Charlie). But after awhile, those memories were overtaken by her real memories and visions of Peter telling her not to forget about him. Somehow, this Amber Olivia has been given the memories of our Blue-verse Olivia. Maybe they got transferred through the chortexiphan being given her by “fake” Nina.

I thought the same thing. In fact, the first time I heard Olivia say “You want me to turn on the lights,” I thought it was rather irritating. But then I thought about it and I figured it really doesn’t matter if she’s turning the lights on or turning the lights off, right? I mean, it’s the same general concept of turning them on/turning them off. I guess it’s not a big deal.

No, the box that reappeared in this episode she originally had to turn the lights on and failed. Remember Peter and Walter rigged it so the lights turn on without Olivia? The bomb in the building was different and she had to turn those lights off… I thought it was interesting that she actually realized its Peter that turns on her abilities.

Just like with the tape analogy, I think that part of the old timeline is bleading through (ie: Olivia because she is being dosed). The rest of the timeline will stay the same, but Peter’s influence will be noticed (ie: Walter going out in the field etc).

I wonder how long it will take Peter (or Walter…I think he knows more than he is letting on, he just doesn’t want to believe it to be true) to figure it out?

September tells Peter that he has an opportunity to put things right if he ends up with the Olivia he is supposed to be with, and once he is with her everything will be as it supposed to and then tells him he must find a way. To me that line makes it seem like amberliv is not his Olivia afterall and why he won’t give up finding the right one.

We don’t know yet whatever September was trying to tell Peter. Based on the promo of the next episode it seems that maybe we are going to find out that on March 23. Maybe September was trying to tell Peter that he must to find a way to prevent Olivia’s death before they interrupted by mysterious People that were coming. After watching that scene for several times I’m now convinced that September didn’t mean that this is not the same OT and it seems that Peter misunderstood him. I think the writers take this road just to make Peter’s acceptance of AmberOlivia as his Olivia more believable and make their reunion more epic(After all we know that the next episode is “A short story about love” and if I’m not mistaken JW has confirmed in an interview that it actually is a romantic episode). But now based on the look on Lincoln’s face (I hate his character. He is barely a character, How could he be a Fringe character? HE DOES NOT BELONG TO FRINGE) from the next episode’s promo I’m concerned that their going to hookup AmberOlivia with him (Because she is desperately want to go back to who she was! right! and what is the best solution : Fall into Lincoln’s arms… OOUGH!) and then announce that she is Peter’s Olivia and so here we go again the focus of the show will remains on Peter and Olivia’s relationship and we’ll have a lot of wasted time in new coming episodes.

I don’t know why so many people are so (relatively) unhappy with this episode. I guess that’s the risk you run with a show like this: some people will never be satisfied no matter what answers you give. Personally, I thought it was everything the promos made it out to be. The acting and production was right up there with the best Fringe has to offer. I don’t understand the criticism of Anna Torv/Blair Brown during the torture scenes. I saw nothing wrong with it. The episode was abounding in developments surrounding the observers, Peter trying to find his home, David Robert Jones, Olivia and cortexiphan, Nina — everything this season has been building towards. And yes, there are still questions, but there should be. The story isn’t over yet. This was a key episode in the course of the season and the story that’s being told, and it did exactly what it was supposed to do in progressing the story, answering some questions, and asking some new ones. This is the same pattern Fringe has followed since Season 1 and I don’t understand why people find it frustrating and complain that it’s not the same Fringe.

I loved the story with the Observers. I thought they did a fantastic job of showing what it was like for Peter when he went in September’s mind. I loved seeing the story play out in pieces behind them and I felt that it really helped to emphasize and highlight what was being said to make it that much more profound. It was a great way to deliver those answers — very much in line with what you would expect from anything involving the observers. I felt satisfied with the explanation of who the observers are. I liked seeing December and the others and following up with what they needed to do with September. And I felt like they really left the door open. We don’t know what happened when September disappeared. You would assume he died, but that’s not necessarily true. For all we know, the other observers took him back to their time where they were able to save him. From August, it seems like a very rare thing when an observer dies, so it’s possible September didn’t actually die. Then you have to wonder what their next move is going to be. Will they try to interfere again, in order to set things right? What will happen now that September isn’t here to “protect” the team?

David Robert Jones was delightfully evil as always. Though his plan is not clear, I love how they are picking up with his plan from season 1. That was always one of the “unanswered questions” and we never understood what exactly he was trying to do. I like how they are continuing that here and I look forward to getting a better look for what exactly he’s trying to accomplish. Certainly that’s a story we will see play out over the course of the rest of the season. As was mentioned in earlier comments, I was one of those who was fully expecting Olivia to shoot the machine to close the door as Jones was stepping through to the other side. The stage was definitely set and it would make perfect sense for him to go the same way he did the first time. I’m glad that he’s still around to be a presence throughout the rest of the season, but I expect if they do kill him again, they will do something similar to being split in half. It’s just such a fitting death for Jones.

Many have said that it was completely predictable and obvious that the Nina with Olivia was a fake, so I guess I was one of the few that was completely fooled by it. Of course I was aware of the possibility that she could be working with Jones, but she seemed rather convincing. But I think what really did it for me was that I so wanted to believe that the Nina they captured at Massive Dynamic was the evil Nina. I was convinced that she was doing an excellent job at deflecting their questions and appearing to be all surprised about the cortexiphan and worried about Olivia and that it was all part of her master act. Because face it, Nina is an expert at making her appearance seem genuine when in reality her motives are completely opposite. So I was completely willing to go along with the idea that the Nina with Olivia was really on her side right up to the very end where it was revealed that she was working with Jones after all. So that twist worked very well for me and I was quite proud of the fact that Olivia had caught Nina in her deception and managed to be the one who fooled Nina in the end. And, I suppose there’s still a chance that both Nina’s are working with Jones… but I’m guessing the one they caught is genuine in her concern for Olivia and being uninvolved in Jones’ plans.

So finally we have Olivia and Peter. This was my one frustration of the episode. The most prevalent question/issue I’ve seen in the comments here is whether or not this is the original timeline. Personally, I can’t figure out if we’re supposed to believe this is our timeline or not. It could go either way and I think there would be things that make sense and there would be things that don’t fit with that explanation. But I am tired of the constant back and forth “This isn’t my timeline” “It is my timeline” “This isn’t my Olivia” “This is my Olivia” “This isn’t my Olivia.” I was willing to go along with the explanation that this is in fact the original timeline and to have them explore that after A Better Human Being. But after The End of All Things and Peter’s sudden reversal that this isn’t his home and it isn’t his Olivia, I’m done. I don’t want them to go back and reveal that it is his home after all. I find the whole back and forth of it all to be pointless and irritating.

So however they resolve it, I do not want them to settle things with “Sorry, I was wrong, but this is my home and you have been my Olivia all along.” I know that’s in the minority of opinions here, but I would be extremely frustrated if they went back on that yet again. Unlike many fans, I don’t mind if Peter needs to get back to a different timeline/universe/period of time to be at home. They’ve done a lot to establish that this timeline is different, from the little things like cases that they worked on in the original timeline that they didn’t work on in this timeline, to the big things, like how Nina raised Olivia and Rachel in this timeline or David Robert Jones is still alive. I don’t see how they can establish all that but still claim this is the original timeline. And I don’t think it would be considered a waste of a season to have spent in a new timeline. A huge purpose behind this “reset” was to explore how things change if one person no longer exists. How does it affect those who knew that person? How do events unfold if that person wasn’t there to influence the outcome? That’s what we’ve seen, and I’ve found it to be fascinating, not a waste. And if this is Peter’s season, then it fits that this is Peter’s journey. Even if this is not the original timeline and these are not the characters we know from earlier seasons, it is still Peter and the events of this season are in fact influencing him and they will leave an impact on him when he returns to wherever he’s supposed to be. It’s the same thing with the Wizard of Oz. Dorothy ends up in some strange place and she sees people who represent people she knows from her real life, but that doesn’t mean they’re the same people she knew. She couldn’t just stay there and be at home just because they resembled the people she knew. It wasn’t really her life. And just because she made it back home, doesn’t make the journey she had any less significant.

But, all things considered, I thought this episode delivered in several key areas and came out to be an exceptional story. Very rewarding.

okay… I’m getting really scared right now. Because you’ve almost convinced me that Peter is never gonna get home because he actually is “home”…

the observer using past tense with henry and the metaphor of the vcr-tape with older recordings bleeding through. OH MY GOD. Are the writers really going for this??? I’m not ready to accept this… and there’s no way I’m going to like it…

I know you probably had this ranting when this season started, but I really didn’t let myself believe it till now. Honestly, I was so annoyed that I started skipping through the episodes of MY FAVOURITE SHOW impatiently waiting for this “detour” to finally be over so that the real story could continue… but boy… it might really be the end of all things!!!!

Which brings me to an important distinction what I’ve been confusing from the start: The amber “universe” is actually not a different universe like the red from the blue but it’s the same two universes where something was altered in time which resulted in certain changes. In the beginning I thought it was a new combined universe because Peter created the bridge and sort of “unified” the blue and the red, but that was a huge misunderstanding. The actual change was that he now never existed. And unless Peter cannot go back in time the characters I invested three years of my life in are gone forever. And no… Olivia remembering Peter’s echo and the life she had before IS NOT THE SAME…

Imho, the brilliant multiverse idea would have been enough for this show, why meddle with time as well? I hated (as intended) all the red doubles from the start, why make our loved characters disappear, too? To keep the show fresh?… Comeon guys, it just breaks my heart! You could have done countless seasons with other universes and it wouldn’t have been old. WHY ON EARTH KILL OFF THE “ORIGINALS”????

And if you think it’s epic and romantic that true love can be so strong that it creates an echo even if one is erased from time and they’ll find each other no matter what. Yeah, no… it’s just not satisfying for me.

COMEON since you had to put timelines in, I BEG OF YOU GUYS, please let Peter go back in time and prevent the amber timeline.

“The amber “universe” is actually not a different universe like the red from the blue but it’s the same two universes where something was altered in time which resulted in certain changes.”

Well actually, from the beginning, most of the speculation here is that this is our blue-verse with altered timeline. The writers/producers have said it before that they are not going to go beyond 2 universes (too complicated).

The problem with that is that if Peter goes back to the blue timeline and prevents the amber timeline from happening, the two universes will still be at war and will eventually be destroyed, as we saw in the Season 3 finale.

I’m thinking that Peter will either have to let Henry die or kill him outright, and this is where the “Be a better man than your father” mantra will come into play. (This of course is assuming that Henry has somehow bled through into the amber timeline as well, and is all grown up, madder than hell, and not gonna take it any more.)

We most certainly DO NOT know that this is not our Olivia. In fact, I am more convinced than ever that Peter is already home. The Observers ‘meeting’ said Peter RETURNED to this timeline – that he REAPPEARED, suggesting highly that he *came back* and did not go elsewhere. As well, September telling Peter to go home? He meant it literally. He knew if Peter went back to the house, he would be abducted and brought to Olivia. I’ve said it before and I stick by it – we the audience have been watching the entire season and know full well that Peter disappeared from these very people from the bridge room. Peter’s confusion is valid and understandable but WE THE AUDIENCE should know better. I guess we are not evolved enough to be good observers…

I totally agree with you! I also believe that Peter is already HOME! We audience has NO evidience that the Ambertimeline is not our Blue/Red timeline only altered because of Peters actions, Peters choice while in the BBM! On the contrary All that what The Observers said also September indicates that Peter returned home to HIS but altered (life without him) versions of his beloved people – All what he has to do is to accept them so as they are now to find his home! But I understand also his confusion – he saw in September mind this version of his Olivia, who we learnd to love with him over the last 3 years and September said she is meant to be with him so I must admit it is also very difficult for me to believe and accept The Amberlivia as Our original Olivia….(still missing the original chracters Olivia and Walter:() It seems I must also acctept The Amberverse characters because I have the feeling they are the onces staying with us – I think there will NOT be the reunion scene in the Bridge room where we last time saw our beloved original characters, what I was so hoping for…….But it was Peters sacrifice……..So I think we audience and Peter have to learn how to cope with the new circumstances and as Peters original blueverse mom said once: sometimes the world we live in is not the world we want but we have our hearts and imagination so we can try and change it………ehh…… So the last scene of ep.4.14 was so heartbreaking for me because I realised that Amberlivia is really Ourlivia and I decided to accept her and I must say Our beloved Peter is really dumb SMART man although he had some good reasons to reject
AmberOurlivia or at least not to acctep her immediately he totally overheard September who said literally in order to find Olivia he has ONLY to go home actually twice as Peter asked about Ambelivia September insisted GO HOME!!!!! Peter even didn´t take it into concideration at least for now at the end of ep.4.14………It was so SAD I had the feeling he rejected His Olivia in fact!!!!! I´m so curious to find out if my theory is right Unfortunately we have to wait 4 weeks for that to play out:( And a very interesting question is actually. What was that September wanted Peter to do for him?

Right on. I think from September little power demo, he wants Peter to get into BBM and reset the events to the time when he interrupted Walternate’s discovery. That would set the events right.

September: “I suspect this will provide an opportunity to set things right. She is the one. The Olivia Dunham from whom your shared future was meant to spring. This must be, and everything will be as it was intended. You must find a way.”

I think it just depends on what you are looking for. I personally don’t think the show is confusing, but if you look for extra things in it and try to predict or make some extra sense of what is going on instead of just taking it at face value, it can become very confusing.

That said, your semantic interpretation of what is going on is absolutely correct. If we look at what the Observers have SAID then it does seem that Peter is in the correct timeline. I personally am in that camp that thinks Peter is home and he just needs to realize it, things will start to bleed back through, etc.

But, the showrunners also do a lot of things to keep us on our toes, so some things we can never take a face value. This is Fringe, after all, where nobody really dies, nobody is ever really erased from existence, people say cryptic things that are impossible to interpret, etc.

Soooo….I think the confusion is just more speculation for most of us, but we enjoy confusing ourselves and it’s all worth it in the end anyway.

As remarked above, I think the key is in the “palimpsest” that Walter commented.
I think we are in the timeline amber, in which Peter died as a child and that is different from the original.
But I also believe that there is no “home” for Peter to return to. I mean there is no other reality (with different physical entity) in which the old Walter, Olivia, etc … have followed their lives and are waiting for Peter to return.
I mean, a timeline has rewritten the previous one which has been deleted. And my theory (the theory of palimpsest of Walter) is that the deleted original timeline can be recovered. As the deleted data from a hard disk.
Olivia, thanks to Cortexiphan and the influence of Peter, is now recovering her own data (memories).
Now, for me, the question is how much data can be recovered?, all or only some?. And above all, who and how do it?.

The producers have said repeatedly they have no intention of doing useless or meaningless the characters and events of the first three seasons.
And while at first I was absolutely convinced we were going to fully recover the original timeline, I now recognize that I have none security at all with me. And that worries me.
For example, by the words of September, it seems to be intuited that Baby Nugget can not exist. Is it then a partial recovery? Will they turn Walter, Olivia, Astrid ….. their former beings but not the rest of the universe / universes?
I am very confused. Excited, but confused.

I liked this episode – I would have preferred to know more about DRJ. Him saying that he’s made of atomic structure (or something like that) reminds me of what Bell said in the opera house – that his atoms have separated and put together so many times that he may dissipate into energy….hmm?
1. Could there be a connection between Bell and DRJ?
2. Now that Olivia is heartbroken and it is about Peter, we know that she is “activated” when she is emotionally strained and it has to be about Peter – so with her achy breaky heart – will she realize her full powers? and if she does, how does DRJ benefit?
3. I believe that the longer Peter stays in this re-written timeline (which is our timeline without Peter), the longer the two timelines are merging (i.e. Peter’s and the rewritten one – one is bleeding into the other). What does that mean for BBM?
4. Olivia has never really been very emotional, and if she is one of the ancestors of the Observer race, could their unemotional trait come from Olivia?
5. Could it be possible to not have any more episodes with Lincoln? Thank you.

Did anyone else notice that in the last scene, when Peter and Olivia are talking outside, there are two windows in the building in the background where a light is flashing from inside? It appears to be Morse Code to me. It happens right after Peter says “or maybe it was me.” I tried to decode it. It looks like 3 characters, and I came up with “8ST” but I’m no expert. Are there any experts out there? If it is “8ST”, what could that mean?

Today after rewatching the preview of the next episode now I’m pretty sure that I know if AmberOlivia is the real Olivia or not. Well if anybody knows some spoilers that revealed in January(I believe it was intentional and show runners somehow wanted it to happen) then he/she will find out the answer only by watching the first five seconds of next episode’s preview.

So, I went back and watched the episode from the point that Peter entered the Observer’s mind. A couple of interesting points:

* When the Observer told Peter about the “right” Olivia Dunham, you could see that Peter was greatly disappointed that the Olivia he was with was not the right one, but also the realization that he would have to tell her. Telling the person that you think is the right one that she is not the right one is cataclysmic on an emotional level, more so for the receiver than for the sender. But difficult for the sender if that person believes that this is the love of [his] life.

* As Peter was jettisoning the relationship, saying he had promised he would never make that mistake again, Olivia said something along the lines of, “That’s not important,” as though she knew what he was saying and referencing. Which would make sense, since she has Olivia’s (or Peter’s) memories.

* September believed that Peter was important enough to save 12 zillion times. What if it was more about Olivia than Peter?

* The Walter from the old timeline is slowly coming through, and Astrid is reverting back to her empathetic, understated self.

* Lincoln…Lincoln, Lincoln, Lincoln…is it really possible that one of the good guys is less accepted by fans than any bad guy Fringe could come up with, even Walternate in the old timeline? Folks in these parts know that I am not a Lincoln fan, but…