McCain was right about Putin

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The original post/thread was not started by me; but by Stratego12. He posted it, originally, in the SR part of the forums, but i felt that it was a great thread, and should be put out there for more people to read. I will give you his original post, then a link to the topic thread in SR section. Enjoy!!!

Stratego12's Thread Starter:It was March of 1939, and British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain was shocked that a man he trusted had gone back on his word.

Chamberlain, German dictator Adolf Hitler and French Prime Minister Edouard Daladier had met in Munich the previous September. There the British and French leaders assented to the dismemberment of Czechoslovakia in exchange for Hitler's promise his territorial ambitions would be satisfied with the acquisition of the Sudetenland.

Chamberlain had told his Cabinet Hitler "would not deliberately deceive a man whom he respected and with whom he had been in negotiation." But now Hitler had marched his troops into the rest of Czechoslovakia.

Chamberlain was as mistaken about Hitler's opinion of him as he was of Hitler's geopolitical intentions. "Our enemies are little worms," the German dictator told his aides. "I saw them at Munich."

Turning points in history usually are hard to detect when they are occurring. Most Americans were too absorbed with the Olympics and the John Edwards sex scandal to pay much attention to the Russian invasion of Georgia over the weekend.

"Historians will come to view August 8, 2008 as a turning point no less significant than Nov. 9, 1989, when the Berlin Wall fell," wrote the military historian Robert Kagan in the Washington Post Monday.

Russia (pop 140.7 million) has immediate, intermediate and long term goals for invading its democratic neighbor (pop 4.6 million), all invidious to our interests.

The immediate goal is to prop up high oil prices, without which Russia's faltering economy might implode. A major oil pipeline (featured in a 1999 James Bond film) runs from the oilfields around the Caspian sea through Georgia to the Turkish port of Ceyhan. A major interruption of supplies (about one percent of the world's oil flows through the BTC pipeline) could reverse the recent decline in oil prices. Russia tried to bomb the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan pipeline, and an adjacent natural gas pipeline, but missed.

The intermediate goal is to force from office Georgia's democratically elected, pro-Western president, Mikheil Saakashvili, and replace him with a Soviet stooge. This would put the kibosh on the efforts of Georgia and other former Soviet republics to join NATO.

The long term goal of Russian strong man Vladimir Putin, who described the collapse of the Soviet Union as "the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the (20th) century," is to force Georgia and the other former Soviet satellites back into the Russian orbit, and thus to give Russia powerful leverage over the economies of Western Europe. The BTC oil pipeline and the BTE natural gas pipeline are the only pipelines to Western Europe not under Russian control.

Whether Mr. Putin achieves these goals depends, in large part, on the extent to which Western leaders imitate Chamberlain and Daladier.

History never repeats itself exactly, but there are frequent echoes, because greed, stupidity, and cowardice are universal human traits, and our capacity for self delusion seems infinite.

Mr. Putin is using the same excuse for invading Georgia (protecting Russian ethnic minorities) that Hitler used for invading Czechoslovakia and Poland (protecting German minorities). French President Nicolas Sarkozy, who has flown to Moscow to head peace negotiations, seems as eager to accept that excuse as Daladier was in 1938.

When Russian tanks rolled into Georgia, President Bush remained in Beijing, swatting the fannies of U.S. Olympic volleyball players, perhaps because, like Neville Chamberlain, he trusted too much in the word of a dictator.

When he met Vladimir Putin in 2001, President Bush said: "I looked the man in the eye. I was able to get a sense of his soul." But in his press statement Monday, Mr. Bush said Moscow's attacks are "inconsistent with assurances we have received from Russia that its objectives were limited to restoring the status quo in South Ossetia that existed before the fighting began on August the 6th."

"Mr. President, did you hold off speaking out and acting because of these assurances?" asked Gordon Chang on Commentary magazine's blog. "Your reliance on Russian promises would explain your inadequate response to a clear act of aggression."

When John McCain looked into Vladimir Putin's eyes, he saw "a K, a G, and a B." He is our Winston Churchill. We will need him soon.

THIS WAS NOT WRITTEN BY ME
By Jack Kelly (author)

This is an opinion documentary, you do not have to believe it if you do not want to.
THIS IS FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY.

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I don't exactly agree with what McCain has to bring the United States, but if ths is of major consequence to the United States in the future, we can only see if we need him then. How I see it is McCain can't do enough now, but Barack can't do enough in his later years of presidency.

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Very nicely said, and thanks for posting this. Unfortunately, most of the people who will be reading this are too ignorant to see and understand this point, or, they will still be hardheaded and too shallow to admit that this country needs someone like McCain in the White House. Someone who, like your article states, knows and understand history, and has been around in politics long enough to have gotten a feel for other world leaders and understands how they operate.

Again, thanks for posting this brilliantly written article!

*Raises an eyebrow*

Personally, I hope Russia grows back into its former glory, and becomes a world superpower again. Only when the USSR and the USA both existed, was there true equality in the political spectrum. The world needs two large super-powers to balance things out. While the US is the only one, they can do things that they wouldn't normally be able to do if there was another major super-power. Iraq, more than likely, would never happened if the USSR had still be in existence. Not to mention, the quality of living, in almost all of the former Soviet satellite states has fallen dramatically since the fall of the USSR. A war of any kind with Russia would be incredibly foolish on the part of the US, and could easily lead to global conflict, and possibly a nuclear exchange between countries.

That said, I firmly hope the Motherland regains its former glory, and the world becomes a more balanced place again, where one country cannot do almost anything that they want.

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There will be policies put into place before Russia can become the giant it once was, all of its land was taken by force and the UN won't take kindly if they try to take it by force again. If you are looking for another superpower, look to China before Russia. China already has the USA in its pocket due to the debt and the growing middle class, compaired to the USA's shrinking middle class. Before long China will become the worlds strongest economic power, and a super power.

I still have USA pride, we will have to radicaly change our policies to adapt to the future.

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Personally, I hope Russia grows back into its former glory, and becomes a world superpower again. Only when the USSR and the USA both existed, was there true equality in the political spectrum. The world needs two large super-powers to balance things out. While the US is the only one, they can do things that they wouldn't normally be able to do if there was another major super-power. Iraq, more than likely, would never happened if the USSR had still be in existence. Not to mention, the quality of living, in almost all of the former Soviet satellite states has fallen dramatically since the fall of the USSR. A war of any kind with Russia would be incredibly foolish on the part of the US, and could easily lead to global conflict, and possibly a nuclear exchange between countries.

That said, I firmly hope the Motherland regains its former glory, and the world becomes a more balanced place again, where one country cannot do almost anything that they want.

So you would see an oppressive, Totalitarian government be reformed? When the USSR was around, there was most definitely not a balanced political spectrum. People feared for their lives, living everyday with the thought of Nuclear warfare. Have you forgotten that it was during this time that we lost John F. Kennedy? you call that balanced? What about the Cuban missile crisis? was that all a part of a balanced political spectrum? And let us not forget Vietnam and Korea. Both of these wars were fought during that time period. The way you see things only leads to more bloodshed in the long run. Little side fights that have nothing to do with the main problem at hand. The article is right, Neville Chamberlain was a fool to trust Hitler, much like Bush trusts Putin. Churchill, now, he never believed that any good would come out of adopting that policy of Appeasement. Was he right? Of course he was! It lead us right in to WWII. Look at the time line for both. The United States is now in a recession. Back then we were in the Great Depression. Right now isnt as bad as then but it is still a similarity. I feel that if we dont do something to stop Russia, then we will be plunged into World War III. And may only God help us when the time comes.

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Well, even though there were some issues, it still kept things balanced, and ensured that no one country gained too much power. And as I have said, call the USSR what you will, but, the people in those former USSR states today have a lower standard of living than back when they were a part of the USSR, so that should at least count for something. The US is the only country that has ever used Nuclear Weapons in anger, so I think I am more worried about the US hitting the nuclear button than anyone else.

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Some issues? There was alot more than some issues dude. There were threats of nuclear warfare for 44 years (1947-1991). We had nukes near their borders in Turkey, they had nukes right next to us in Cuba. If starts taking over all of the old countries that it took over, Armenia, Belarus, Ukraine, Lavtia, and the other 11 countries that can now be indepenent. Russia caused Afghanistan in the 80s that was a great victory for the Americans, they made China comunist which had a chain effect in other Asian countries which could have saved many American rights. Also why would another superpower be good? No one can tell us what to do, also this would be very bad if Obama became president becausehe is weak in foreing policy and would get pushed around.

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>.O You're all talking about the complicated, and varying systems of Government around the world. Whether it be Dictatorship, a Unicameral or Bicameral Congress, or even a frikkin Communistic, Hierarchical Dictatorship, ALL humans on this planet are ignorant, arrogant, and greedy. No matter to what extent, every single person has these three traits. Whoever's reading this at the time, myself, and the person who posted above me; WE'RE ALL ARROGANT. And don't think saying you aren't makes it any better; It only proves that you're more arrogant than most.

No matter who's a superpower, or who has the big guns in the worst conflicts, nothing is going to change unless we can give up the monetary values our market is based on. The only reason inflation happens, is greed. Think about it; all the money we spend on gas every month. About 3/4 ( I'm estimating ) goes to a tiny, once barren country in the Middle-East. 20 years ago, this place wasn't even on the map with a city. Now, there's an indoor snow park - IN A DESERT - and two water parks; Not to mention the man-made island paradise built into the sea that cost billions to build, let alone set homes, hotels, stores and restaurants on. These people are jacking up the oil prices because they want MORE of this... ignorant "bliss" they've found from being greedy.

Think about it... SERIOUSLY. We aren't going to get anywhere as a race until we can get over this... B.S. These events will continue to repeat themselves, no matter who gets to push the big red button that makes the pretty explosions happen on other people's houses.

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>.O You're all talking about the complicated, and varying systems of Government around the world. Whether it be Dictatorship, a Unicameral or Bicameral Congress, or even a frikkin Communistic, Hierarchical Dictatorship, ALL humans on this planet are ignorant, arrogant, and greedy. No matter to what extent, every single person has these three traits. Whoever's reading this at the time, myself, and the person who posted above me; WE'RE ALL ARROGANT. And don't think saying you aren't makes it any better; It only proves that you're more arrogant than most.

No matter who's a superpower, or who has the big guns in the worst conflicts, nothing is going to change unless we can give up the monetary values our market is based on. The only reason inflation happens, is greed. Think about it; all the money we spend on gas every month. About 3/4 ( I'm estimating ) goes to a tiny, once barren country in the Middle-East. 20 years ago, this place wasn't even on the map with a city. Now, there's an indoor snow park - IN A DESERT - and two water parks; Not to mention the man-made island paradise built into the sea that cost billions to build, let alone set homes, hotels, stores and restaurants on. These people are jacking up the oil prices because they want MORE of this... ignorant "bliss" they've found from being greedy.

Think about it... SERIOUSLY. We aren't going to get anywhere as a race until we can get over this... B.S. These events will continue to repeat themselves, no matter who gets to push the big red button that makes the pretty explosions happen on other people's houses.

Well said.

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I just don't see any reason for political debate when it's not doing any good. Besides, the President is just a figure head for this nation... The same goes for all others that have a Diplomacy-based Government. Bush has prolly 100 people who write his speeches; tell him what to say, what not to say, etc. And the most true of all the underlying facts as to why a president is pointless, is that he doesn't really even control the country's actions anyway. Congress has the ability to pass laws without the President's approval via 2/3 vote. Do you think that these Congressmen give a d*mn about you and I? No way. All they want is more money and to control every aspect of our lives to that they can sleep at night.

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I just don't see any reason for political debate when it's not doing any good. Besides, the President is just a figure head for this nation... The same goes for all others that have a Diplomacy-based Government. Bush has prolly 100 people who write his speeches; tell him what to say, what not to say, etc. And the most true of all the underlying facts as to why a president is pointless, is that he doesn't really even control the country's actions anyway. Congress has the ability to pass laws without the President's approval via 2/3 vote. Do you think that these Congressmen give a d*mn about you and I? No way. All they want is more money and to control every aspect of our lives to that they can sleep at night.

I think debate can be used for the enrichment of others, but usually, forum debate doesn't come to this. Seeing as you don't see other members as actual human beings, most people just go around with this "I am right, you are ignorant" attitude. I like debates personally, because it makes me research further into what I believe. This leaves me smarter in the end. Plus, debate is fun

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I think debate can be used for the enrichment of others, but usually, forum debate doesn't come to this. Seeing as you don't see other members as actual human beings, most people just go around with this "I am right, you are ignorant" attitude. I like debates personally, because it makes me research further into what I believe. This leaves me smarter in the end. Plus, debate is fun

Yea, but you want to know the funny thing? For the most, I am right. I don't sit in on political debate. I sit on the outside, and observe how a person will lie, and try to make themselves look better for every single human being's needs in this country.