Wait, now you're talking about affirmative actions on the part of the subordinates - for their own self-interested purposes of career advancement - rather than the coercive assertion of authority requiring action contrary to the subordinates' beliefs by those up the chain of command?

I don't mean to be snarky here, but I'm not following your line of thought at all.

tifosi77 wrote:Wait, now you're talking about affirmative actions on the part of the subordinates - for their own self-interested purposes of career advancement - rather than the coercive assertion of authority requiring action contrary to the subordinates' beliefs by those up the chain of command?

I don't mean to be snarky here, but I'm not following your line of thought at all.

Coerced.

If my OIC has a new Obama Bumper sticker and is reading "Dreams of my Father", it certainly encourages advancement minded individuals to express complimentary opinions and values.

Look, all I'm saying is that if you're going to prohibit political expression, you have to do it agnostically.

ExPatriatePen wrote:Look, all I'm saying is that if you're going to prohibit political expression, you have to do it agnostically.

Okay, um....... that's no different to what we've been saying all along.

If a member is displaying material and expressing positions similar to what Sommers was doing - but in support of the current administration instead of in opposition - they'd be just as guilty of breaking the rules and should be reprimanded accordingly. The rule breaking has nothing to do with the position itself but rather the expression of an opinion in a public way that contravenes rules of conduct for the uniformed military (and I think to a certain extent all federal employees, for that matter).

ExPatriatePen wrote:Look, all I'm saying is that if you're going to prohibit political expression, you have to do it agnostically.

Okay, um....... that's no different to what we've been saying all along.

Not everyone.

shafnutz05 wrote:Back in 2004, I had a Bush Cheney sticker on my truck. If it would have been Kerry Edwards no biggie. But in the military there is a certain line you cannot cross.

Also

tifosi77 wrote:If a member is displaying material and expressing positions similar to what Sommers was doing - but in support of the current administration instead of in opposition - they'd be just as guilty of breaking the rules and should be reprimanded accordingly. The rule breaking has nothing to do with the position itself but rather the expression of an opinion in a public way that contravenes rules of conduct for the uniformed military (and I think to a certain extent all federal employees, for that matter).

Do you honestly believe that the policy is being enforced in that fashion?

My personal experience, having been on a number of US military installations in the course of my business over the last few years, is that it most definitely is not.

All I know is that if I were in the military and looking to advance my career, I would be as pro-current president and his policy as I could because I would know there could be problems otherwise. Reading more on the story right now, I think that point is pretty valid.

What I understand from looking at your discussion is that the question is whether the soldier would have gotten into this much trouble if he instead had an Obama sticker on his car and I would say likely 'no'.

I'm trying to learn more on this story only now because I really don't like the military. There are some in Congress trying to pass an amendment to help the soldier.

Still stuck with a broken car radio. I can listen to the liberal morning radio show for a while, cos I think they're genuinely funny. But I tune them out when they actually start talking politics in any detail; substantive they are not. I can only handle Limbaugh, Hannity and Levin (who is, imo, the worst of the three) for about 4-5 minutes tops before I feel like punching my car.

Sarcastic wrote:All I know is that if I were in the military and looking to advance my career, I would be as pro-current president and his policy as I could because I would know there could be problems otherwise. Reading more on the story right now, I think that point is pretty valid.

What I understand from looking at your discussion is that the question is whether the soldier would have gotten into this much trouble if he instead had an Obama sticker on his car and I would say likely 'no'.

I'm trying to learn more on this story only now because I really don't like the military. There are some in Congress trying to pass an amendment to help the soldier.

Sarcastic wrote:All I know is that if I were in the military and looking to advance my career, I would be as pro-current president and his policy as I could because I would know there could be problems otherwise. Reading more on the story right now, I think that point is pretty valid.

What I understand from looking at your discussion is that the question is whether the soldier would have gotten into this much trouble if he instead had an Obama sticker on his car and I would say likely 'no'.

I'm trying to learn more on this story only now because I really don't like the military. There are some in Congress trying to pass an amendment to help the soldier.

Sarcastic wrote:All I know is that if I were in the military and looking to advance my career, I would be as pro-current president and his policy as I could because I would know there could be problems otherwise. Reading more on the story right now, I think that point is pretty valid. :scared:

What I understand from looking at your discussion is that the question is whether the soldier would have gotten into this much trouble if he instead had an Obama sticker on his car and I would say likely 'no'.

I'm trying to learn more on this story only now because I really don't like the military. There are some in Congress trying to pass an amendment to help the soldier.

being "pro" the current president wouldnt advance you one iota unless you were a General Officer in line for an appointment to something that can only come from the white house.

you're right. a grunt is a grunt. shut up and do your pushups. but i'm sure it would make things a lot more comfortable.

Not many people bother to ask in my experience, much less give a ****. Never have I seen it affect morale. If it did with this guy, its because he was likely the senior enlisted soldier in his unit, used to speaking his mind about whatever he wanted, and the gay junior troops would surely be put off by that.