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17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #27

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Hasn't FB been around long enough where people know not to do any sort of ranting on FB, especially if you have an upper position of say, a fire captain?

Apparently not. I recently fired an employee for posting about a political argument she got into with a patron in my place of business (which never should have happened to begin with). She was ranting about what a jerk this customer was on FB. Nope! Not happening in my place of business!

Brought over from other thread, got caught in the door.
suzihawk
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 3,013

I'm so sorry.
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Thanks Suzihawk! I never post personal information but couldn't let this one go, based on personal experience.

I knew from the moment I saw the sheriff video, GZ was not a victim of a beating. He wouldn't have been able to walk in the manner in which he did, both physically and emotionally. He was as calm as a cucumber. One that is beaten does not act like he did on that evening. Furthermore, he would struggle to walk due to injuries all over his body, he would feel like a truck just ran him over, especially over the next few days. He would have bruises all over his body, in the areas I mentioned, as well as others. He would have bruises on bruises. He certainly wouldn't be able to move his belongings. If he had any type of cut on the head or a nose injury, there would be blood all over, and it would not have stopped bleeding in a 1/2 hour. No way.

Brought over from other thread, got caught in the door.
suzihawk
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 3,013

I'm so sorry.
-------------------------------------------------
Thanks Suzihawk! I never post personal information but couldn't let this one go, based on personal experience.

I knew from the moment I saw the sheriff video, GZ was not a victim of a beating. He wouldn't have been able to walk in the manner in which he did, both physically and emotionally. He was as calm as a cucumber. One that is beaten does not act like he did on that evening. Furthermore, he would struggle to walk due to injuries all over his body, he would feel like a truck just ran him over, especially over the next few days. He would have bruises all over his body, in the areas I mentioned, as well as others. He would have bruises on bruises. He certainly wouldn't be able to move his belongings. If he had any type of cut on the head or a nose injury, there would be blood all over, and it would not have stopped bleeding in a 1/2 hour. No way.

JMO and thank you again.

I think the point of the SYG law (which GZ will be trying to claim) is you don't have to actually get hurt to claim self defense, just be in fear of getting hurt.

I think the point of the SYG law (which GZ will be trying to claim) is you don't have to actually get hurt to claim self defense, just be in fear of getting hurt.

I understand that, but his family is claiming his head was beaten on the concrete , and some people are claiming GZ was straddled and beaten. I wasn't talking about the SYG law. Since you mentioned it though, if he did not have injuries, I doubt this will go his way. JMO

I think the point of the SYG law (which GZ will be trying to claim) is you don't have to actually get hurt to claim self defense, just be in fear of getting hurt.

But, if you have already claimed to have been beaten and suffered severe injuries, but have been discredited, do you then get to claim that you were oops, uninjured but in mortal fear?
I feel that is what is happening here, the statute may state that you only have to be in fear for your life, but if you choose to go whole hog and claim a terrible beating was administered, then, when that beating doesn't seem to be supported by the evidence available, I am not going to find your claims of mortal fear credible either. Moo

With every new piece of evidence that has cast doubt about Zimmerman's terrible injuries, his family has come forward with a slightly tweaked version of the story to account (as best they can) for it. I don't believe any of it now. Moo

But, if you have already claimed to have been beaten and suffered severe injuries, but have been discredited, do you then get to claim that you were oops, uninjured but in mortal fear?
I feel that is what is happening here, the statute may state that you only have to be in fear for your life, but if you choose to go whole hog and claim a terrible beating was administered, then, when that beating doesn't seem to be supported by the evidence available, I am not going to find your claims of mortal fear credible either. Moo

With every new piece of evidence that has cast doubt about Zimmerman's terrible injuries, his family has come forward with a slightly tweaked version of the story to account (as best they can) for it. I don't believe any of it now. Moo

I think the point of the SYG law (which GZ will be trying to claim) is you don't have to actually get hurt to claim self defense, just be in fear of getting hurt.

As I understand it, you are correct. However, the problem for his defense is possibly going to center around documented evidence as to the body's location. Remember, only 18 seconds lapsed during the 911 call between GZ getting out of his vehicle and the 911 dispatcher's admonition not to follow TM. That doesn't allow for much more than 100 feet of travel on GZ's part.

Any altercation that happened beyound that point would, to me, seem to be as a result of "Pursuing Your Ground" as opposed to "Standing Your Ground".

I'm aware of several different locations having been given for the body, but if the SPD report and the SFD's dispatch recordings are correct, TM's body was 200 feet +/- from where GZ got out of his truck.

IMO, if that's the case, he's got a huge problem in proving a SYG defense against an unarmed 17 year old kid who was breaking no laws.

But there is nothing covered up that will not be revealed, and hidden that will not be known. Accordingly, whatever you have said in the dark will be heard in the light, and what you have whispered in the inner rooms will be proclaimed upon the housetops. Luke 12, 2-3

As I understand it, you are correct. However, the problem for his defense is possibly going to center around documented evidence as to the body's location. Remember, only 18 seconds lapsed during the 911 call between GZ getting out of his vehicle and the 911 dispatcher's admonition not to follow TM. That doesn't allow for much more than 100 feet of travel on GZ's part.

Any altercation that happened beyound that point would, to me, seem to be as a result of "Pursuing Your Ground" as opposed to "Standing Your Ground".

I'm aware of several different locations having been given for the body, but if the SPD report and the SFD's dispatch recordings are correct, TM's body was 200 feet +/- from where GZ got out of his truck.

IMO, if that's the case, he's got a huge problem in proving a SYG defense against an unarmed 17 year old kid who was breaking no laws.

Is the SPD report the same report that said GZ was wearing a 'red' jacket? (I know there were conversations on the accuracy of that).

I guess what I'm asking is, how much accuracy are we putting in the SPD report?

Is the SPD report the same report that said GZ was wearing a 'red' jacket? (I know there were conversations on the accuracy of that).

I guess what I'm asking is, how much accuracy are we putting in the SPD report?

I really don't know. Until the SPD report came out and was largely confirmed by SFD Fire and Rescue, I was going on what Tracy Martin said. With this info, it seems to me to be the safest bet.

I just know it would be a pretty sorry state of affairs if the police department AND the fire department were both telling us wrong.

But there is nothing covered up that will not be revealed, and hidden that will not be known. Accordingly, whatever you have said in the dark will be heard in the light, and what you have whispered in the inner rooms will be proclaimed upon the housetops. Luke 12, 2-3

I think the point of the SYG law (which GZ will be trying to claim) is you don't have to actually get hurt to claim self defense, just be in fear of getting hurt.

If I were on GZ's jury, I would be incredibly skeptical of this SYG claim, given GZ's apparent lack of serious injuries. I don't think someone can reasonably fear great bodily harm or death from an unarmed teenager unless it could be proven that that teen was beating him mercilessly (head on concrete seems about the right breaking point to reach for the gun - though I don't believe for one minute that TM was beating GZ's head on the concrete). Anything less severe than that wouldn't fly with me for SYG.

That said, I believe GZ initiated the confrontation, so I think SYG is a moot point.