do the two he's have different "things"?Not in the way you're suggesting, but yesis one of the things a life? plan? money? food? stolen from the other? time? NoneAre both of the things a life? plan? money? food? stolen from the other? time?None

Are both 'things' conceptual things?YesIs (at least) one of the things living? No

Are these things that they've always had? NopeAcquired at some specific time in their life? at an arbitrary time? gradually/ over time? FA (:

"and that is why He1 did" = "and that is why He1 had his thing"? "and that is why He1 did" = "and that is why He1 subsequently obtained/acquired his thing"? Sorry! Really bad phrasing on my part... That is why He1 pretended he didn't have it

He1 had his before He2 did? He2 had his before He1 did? IrrelevantHe1 obtained his (through choice) after seeing/experiencing/learning of He2 having his?

Did either obtain their thing through choice?YopeDid either have their thing thrust upon them? by another person(s)? by nature/physics/biochemistry?None

So he1 had his and pretended that he didn't. he2 had his, and that is why he1 had his. his what? his thing?I am a little confused by the statement you made to crazypalpig on July 21 about 'bad phrasing'. Can you clear it up for me?

So he1 had his and pretended that he didn't. he2 had his, and that is why he1 had his. his what? his thing? I am a little confused by the statement you made to crazypalpig on July 21 about 'bad phrasing'. Can you clear it up for me?Actually, I made the statement... to clear up, that's why He1(Let's call him... Mark) pretended to not have his

Mark gave a speech first? his own? Dave's? Dave gave a speech first? his own? Mark's?

Was Mark asked to write his speech? Dave's? by Dave? Was Dave asked to write his speech? Mark's? by Mark?

Both of them read a speech? were to read a speech? Each read their own speech? Did Mark not want to give his speech first? want to give his speech second? want to give his speech immediately after Dave? want to give his speech any time after Dave? want to give his speech last? but would have probably (or possibly) have not been able to give his speech at the time/position-in-the-order-of-speeches that he wanted if he admitted to having one/it? Where there any other relevant speakers? silent individuals?

Did Mark at any point reveal he had a speech? iff so: was it apparent to his audience why he concealed this information? was anyone upset by the deception?

Mark gave a speech first?No his own? Dave's? Dave gave a speech first?Yes his own?Yes Mark's? No, but explore.

Was Mark asked to write his speech?Yes Dave's? by Dave? Was Dave asked to write his speech?Yes Mark's? by Mark?

Both of them read a speech? were to read a speech? Each read their own speech? Yes, but Mark didn't...Did Mark not want to give his speech first?No want to give his speech second?Yes (I think, rephrase) want to give his speech immediately after Dave?Yes want to give his speech any time after Dave?No want to give his speech last? but would have probably (or possibly) have not been able to give his speech at the time/position-in-the-order-of-speeches that he wanted if he admitted to having one/it? Confused heavily nowWhere there any other relevant speakers?Yope silent individuals? No

Did Mark at any point reveal he had a speech?No iff so: was it apparent to his audience why he concealed this information? was anyone upset by the deception? Possibly Dave

Did Mark write his own speech? did he ever deliver it (even partially)? Did Dave write his own speech?

Someone else spoke but it wasn't a speech? Someone else gave a speech? (Someone else = not Mark or Dave)

Did Mark give his speech from memory? apposed to reading it? Did Mark alter/add to his speech? in light of Dave's speech? Did Mark want to give his speech second/after Dave? because he intended to alter/add to it?

Mark never revealed he had a speech? (confused me... I'd expected this to be answered yes as surely it would become apparent that he did have one if he gave it...) but Dave was upset by the deception? So Dave found out accidently/by himself that Mark did have a speech?

Did Mark write his own speech?Yes did he ever deliver it (even partially)? For the purposes of this puzzle, no.Did Dave write his own speech? Yes

Someone else spoke but it wasn't a speech?YesSomeone else gave a speech? No(Someone else = not Mark or Dave)

Did Mark give his speech from memory?No apposed to reading it? Did Mark alter/add to his speech?Changed what he said outright in light of Dave's speech? Yes-ishDid Mark want to give his speech second/after Dave? because he intended to alter/add to it? Neither

Mark never revealed he had a speech? (confused me... I'd expected this to be answered yes as surely it would become apparent that he did have one if he gave it...) He never gave the one he preparedbut Dave was upset by the deception? For purposes of puzzle, yes, but I don't really knowSo Dave found out accidently/by himself that Mark did have a speech?He knew immediately

I recall reading a scientist (maybe Asimov?) who had a speech he gave regularly, by heart, for a particular type of event and organization. At a function, the emcee introduced him by describing how he had witnessed the scientist's fantastic speech somewhere else. In his enthusiasm, he gave away the point, the stories, and the punchlines of that "previous" speech, and the scientist was forced to improvise a new speech on the spot to avoid giving away the fact that he always used the same one.

I recall reading a scientist (maybe Asimov?) who had a speech he gave regularly, by heart, for a particular type of event and organization. At a function, the emcee introduced him by describing how he had witnessed the scientist's fantastic speech somewhere else. In his enthusiasm, he gave away the point, the stories, and the punchlines of that "previous" speech, and the scientist was forced to improvise a new speech on the spot to avoid giving away the fact that he always used the same one.

Relevant?Not like this at all, although there was enthusiasm at some point

I'm imagining a scenario where the speech is a proposal. He1 and He2 are in love with the same woman and both have a proposal. He2 gives his first, the other speaker who did not give a speech is the woman who says yes and that is why He1 did not give his proposal. Anything like that?

I'm imagining a scenario where the speech is a proposal. He1 and He2 are in love with the same woman and both have a proposal. He2 gives his first, the other speaker who did not give a speech is the woman who says yes and that is why He1 did not give his proposal. Anything like that?No

for clarity: The order of speaking is He2, unnamed non-speech-giver who has an utterance, He1 is silently pretending he did not have a speechFA because of He2's speech.Not silentlyIs this correct?More or less. Kinda.

I am trying to figure out what kind of speech this is...I know that someone asked him to give it, that it is not formal, and that it is not fully scripted, but that some thought must have gone in to it ahead of time. I'm getting nowhere in asking about the types of emotions that could prompt this speech or that could be associated with it, nor with asking the type of speech, so lets try this...

Is the audience of this speech 1? 2? 5? 10? 50? 100+?

Would the audience of this speech know that the speech was going to be given before it was delivered? Would the audience have come to the place of delivery for the reason of hearing this speech? Would the speaker have gone to the audience with the sole intention of giving this speech (and witnessing subsequent effects of it)?

Was the person who asked him to write it a member of the audience? A person in power over him? A person asking for the speech for reasons of charity?

Now, the outcome of the speech...

Does the audience feel happy to have heard the speech? saddened by it? driven to action? inspired? informed? challenged to make decisions? refreshed?

Ok...hopefully I can get a better idea of what kind of speech this is! Thanks for your post btw =)

I am trying to figure out what kind of speech this is...I know that someone asked him to give it, that it is not formal, and that it is not fully scripted, but that some thought must have gone in to it ahead of time. I'm getting nowhere in asking about the types of emotions that could prompt this speech or that could be associated with it, nor with asking the type of speech, so lets try this... OK

Is the audience of this speech 1? 2? 5? 10? 50? 100+?Irr, say 50

Would the audience of this speech know that the speech was going to be given before it was delivered?No, but irrelevant Would the audience have come to the place of delivery for the reason of hearing this speech?Not sure what you mean Would the speaker have gone to the audience with the sole intention of giving this speech (and witnessing subsequent effects of it)? Yes

Was the person who asked him to write it a member of the audience? A person in power over him? A person asking for the speech for reasons of charity?Completely irrelevant

Now, the outcome of the speech... That's the next step now

Does the audience feel happy to have heard the speech? Dave's or Mark's? Dave's, yes, Mark's, FA saddened by it? driven to action? inspired? informed? challenged to make decisions? refreshed?

Ok...hopefully I can get a better idea of what kind of speech this is! Thanks for your post btw =)

Dave is He1 and Mark is He2, right? Operating under that assumption...Mark actually gave his speech? I thought he pretended he didn't have one...

As for the other questions, most of with are marked irr, I'm more trying to get a feel for what type of speech this is, because as it stands this could be ranging from laying out a chores schedule amongst roommates to an inaugural (not really that drastic, but I'm trying to narrow the window). So, that said, is knowing the type of speech or the subject of the speech not going to help solve this puzzle at all?

Dave is He1 and Mark is He2, right?Yes Operating under that assumption...Mark actually gave his speech?No, he pretended I thought he pretended he didn't have one...

As for the other questions, most of with are marked irr, I'm more trying to get a feel for what type of speech this is, because as it stands this could be ranging from laying out a chores schedule amongst roommates to an inaugural (not really that drastic, but I'm trying to narrow the window). So, that said, is knowing the type of speech or the subject of the speech not going to help solve this puzzle at all?No, just a dinner speech. What was said in the speech is irrelevant except for the reaction

He had his, but pretended he didn't. He2 had his, and that is why He1 did.

He1= first He's

In a July 21 posting, you write:

"Sorry! Really bad phrasing on my part... That is why He1 pretended he didn't have it"

So, if we amend the first posting with your new wording we would have:

He1 had his, but pretended he didn't. He2 had his, and that's why He1 pretended he didn't.

In your last post, you say He1 is Dave and He2 is Mark, so, re-expressed again:

Dave had his, but pretended he didn't. Mark had his, and that's why Dave pretended he didn't.

But, in your last post, you also say that Mark pretended. Does this mean that no speech was actually delivered and that both men pretended not to have one? Or, pretended to give it? (I don't really know how someone pretends to give a speech...but who knows! lol)

Ok, that's the extent of my confusion. Thanks for putting up with me and my long post!

He had his, but pretended he didn't. He2 had his, and that is why He1 did.

He1= first He's

In a July 21 posting, you write:

"Sorry! Really bad phrasing on my part... That is why He1 pretended he didn't have it"

So, if we amend the first posting with your new wording we would have:

He1 had his, but pretended he didn't. He2 had his, and that's why He1 pretended he didn't.

In your last post, you say He1 is Dave and He2 is Mark, so, re-expressed again:

Dave had his, but pretended he didn't. Mark had his, and that's why Dave pretended he didn't.

But, in your last post, you also say that Mark pretended. Does this mean that no speech was actually delivered and that both men pretended not to have one? Or, pretended to give it? (I don't really know how someone pretends to give a speech...but who knows! lol) Arg! really sorry! Mark gave his, Dave pretended to not have a speech with him

Ok, that's the extent of my confusion. Thanks for putting up with me and my long post!

Did the audience no like the speech that mark gave? did the like it a lot so he was hard to follow?Yes... I think it's close enough for a... ************ SPOILER ****************** "Republican senator from New York Chauncey M. Depew was chosen to speak after Mark Twain at a banquet. As Depew watched, Twain delivered an uproarious talk. Depew walked to the dais, waited until the laughter and applause had died down, and then cannily feigned forgetfulness. 'Mr. Toastmaster and Ladies and Gentlemen,' he announced, 'before this dinner Mark Twain and myself agreed to trade speeches. He has just delivered my speech, and I am gratified for the pleasant way you received it. I regret to say that I have lost the notes of his speech and cannot remember anything he was to say. Thank you.'"

So I even gave you a correct first name =) Sorry for the vague statement, and the quote was taken from 1,000 Unforgettable Senior Moments (of which we could only remember 246) by Tom Friedman