Post by jquist47 on Nov 20, 2018 22:00:47 GMT

I grew up playing the elder scrolls series, which ended up being my absolute favorite series when I was younger. After playing through Skyrim I became quite busy with real life stuff and more or less took a break from gaming until 2017. As the medieval fantasy RPG-genre was very close to my heart, I naturally decided to search for more types of games with the same style, and I found Dragon Age Origins. I was quite sceptical, it was a relatively old game with old graphics and old school gameplay which I had never really played before. After a steam sale and some convincing comments and critique I finally purchased it and played through it in the summer.

Adapting to the old graphics and having some troubles with the new and seemingly very complex mechanics in the game made the start somewhat slow to me. The more I played it and became familiar with the gameplay, characters, story and dialouge system the game just kept growing on me. And after finishing the game I had no doubts in my mind that it was my favorite game I have ever played, and the most epic journey/adventure I have ever experienced in a game. It almost felt like the entire game was tailored for me. The combat, the party system, the characters, the incredible voice acting, the gritty, dark and atmospheric art style, the moral dilemmas and hard decisions, just everything was so good. It really felt like this game had a soul, unlike any other game I have played before. I have no idea how I could possibly good back to the elder scrolls games after playing through this, despite being great games.

It turned out to be a double edged sword. Since then, every other game I have tried felt so... lackluster, uninspiring and soulless. I haven't been able to enjoy any other game since then tbh. I tried the test version of DA:I and it really failed to hook me, and I personally despised the changed combat system, the plastic and shiny looking graphics, I honestly never really liked the frostbite engines look, it really didn't capture the atmosphere as well as the Origins art style did. Overall it was obvious it was designed for consoles primarily, even though I commend Bioware for at least trying to satisfy the Origins fans with the tactical camera, it ultimately ended up being completely fruitless. I uninstalled the test version and never bought the game. I know how Bioware have changed since EA took over, is there somehow any chance that they may return to their roots with DA:4?

Post by Nightscrawl on Nov 21, 2018 2:25:09 GMT

The majority of DAO (as a playable game) was developed while under EA ownership. EA has little to do with it. Or conversely, you could credit EA with allowing the project to continue, or seeing promise in the franchise, but that doesn't usually fall under the "EA is an evil corporate overlord" narrative.

In November 2005, it was announced that BioWare and Pandemic Studios... would be joining forces, with private equity fund Elevation Partners investing in the partnership. On October 11, 2007, however, it was announced that this new partnership... had been bought by Electronic Arts. BioWare therefore became a unit of EA, but retained its own branding.

It's getting quite old continually seeing people blame EA for everything about Bioware games that they dislike.

However, I will say that EA does bear some responsibility for DA2 and that game's issues. DAO was successful, so they wanted another one, made in less time, with less budget. Those lack of resources hampered the game significantly; we will never know what DA2 could have been without those constraints.

According to the devs, EA does not overly influence content or direction. Whatever choices pertaining to that are on the devs themselves.

"The best analogy I use, in a positive way, is EA gives you enough rope to hang yourself. It was really interesting because we really made all the choices we wanted to make ourselves; these are all things we wanted to try ... That was the biggest revelation, that rope that EA gives you; they don't second-guess you, they don't say you shouldn't do that. We had complete creative control over a lot of it; some fans didn't like some of it and some of it was experimental, quite frankly."

For the most part (outside of DA2's issues), the devs have gotten to make the game they wanted to make, which included various changes across the games. Moreover, most of the leadership on DA remained the same through DAI, with Mark Darrah, Mike Laidlaw, and David Gaider being more of the prominent members. (Brent Knowles was creative director on DAO, but he eventually left, leaving the position to Mike Laidlaw, who was there for DAO. Even so, he was only one of a team who still answered to a higher authority, Mark Darrah, who again, has been around since the beginning.)

We saw that, despite DA2's troubles, EA permitted a higher budget for DAI and even gave an additional year.

... is there somehow any chance that they may return to their roots with DA:4?

This is highly subjective. I don't feel that they have strayed from their "roots" for the things I value in the games: story, roleplay opportunity, and compelling characters. With my metric, the answer would be "yes," as I have faith they will continue to do that. With your metric, particularly as concerns art style, the answer is "probably not."

Post by jquist47 on Nov 21, 2018 19:41:52 GMT

Interesting, my intention was never to blame everything on EA, it was a mistake if it seemed so. It was more to highlight the change in the company over the years, although I thought more of the leadership had been replaced and EA's influence was stronger than what you described. However with my experiences in the modern world, I have sadly learned to be extremely sceptical and cynical to everything, the devs comments about their freedom are no exception to that.

You mentioned the majority of the development time went into creating an IP from scratch and that the majority of the time actually developing the game was done under EA, which is also interesting to me. I'm not 100% familiar with how the different phases in game development functions, and when decisions are made for example, but to me it really felt like DA:O was create for PC primarily whereas DA:2 and DA:I was for console. As Dragon Age Origins is considered to be the spiritual successor to the Baldurs Gate series, it seems like a strange shift in priority and very much feels like they tried to appeal to a larger crowd at the expense of more old school fans. To be fair, the old gameplay style is definitely not for everyone and the console market is massive, it is understandable considering this, but seems strange that the Bioware devs really wanted this.

As I said before, I played the test version of DA:I, and the differences in gameplay style compared to Origins is night and day to me. No auto-attacking is a massive change for the worse imo, voiced protagonist and dialogue wheel system, as well as the changed art style. The soundtrack didn't feel as epic either, however DA:I felt like a really ambitious game though. So I can't really complain about EA or Bioware trying to rush it, in fact it seems like a good game overall, but the gameplay change and feel made it unbearable for me and as a result of this, I never even had the chance to experience the story and the characters. The game didn't feel nearly as captivating and inspiring though, and for the lack of a better word, didn't have the soul of Origins.

Post by talyn82 on Nov 22, 2018 6:43:37 GMT

I've played a lot of rpg's in my time. And Dragon Age Origins ranks second behind Morrowind as my top 5 rpg's of all time.

Here is the list if you never played them but are interested.

1) Morrowind: My first Bethesda rpg and consider it the best in the series imo. Skyrim was great too. But Morrowind fully fleshed out the Dunmer culture.

2) Dragon Age Origins: Probably the best BioWare rpg of all time imo.

3) Fallout New Vegas: Probably the best Fallout game ever made besides the original imo. Made by my second favorite rpg company Obsidian.

4) Knights of the Old Republic: The Sith Lords: Obsidian's first ever game and the best in the KOTOR series imo. Though it was released half finished due to LucasArts impossible deadline. The game was still great. Fast forward to 2018 and you can download "The Sith Lords Restoration Mod" or "TSLRCM" as it's more known as. It fixes many bugs that were still in the game as well as restores most to all of the cut content. The game now feels complete. Also the game stars my favorite Star Wars character Kreia.

5) Planescape: Torment: Classic crpg made by now defunct Black Isle Studios, luckily most of the team made it to Obsidian in its prime. The game is a classic dnd game set in Sigil a mysterious city that leads to other realms. The main character is an immortal who lost their memories. I will not say no more because I don't want to spoil the game. But trust me it's great. The only problem you may have is that it is isometric.

Post by Ieldra on Jan 11, 2019 16:59:43 GMT

It turned out to be a double edged sword. Since then, every other game I have tried felt so... lackluster, uninspiring and soulless.

I wouldn't put it that strongly, but I know what you mean. Dragon Age Origins is, for me, one of the best storytelling games ever made for the PC. Nothing Bioware made after it can compare, and I can count the games of its kind that were in the same league on one hand.

"A man can be himself only so long as he is alone; and if he does not love solitude, he will not love freedom; for it is only when he is alone that he is really free." -- Arthur SchopenhauerIgnorance is bold, and knowledge is reserved -- ThucydidesI'd rather have questions that can't be answered, than answers that can't be questioned -- Richard Feynman

Post by Quickpaw on Jul 5, 2019 23:35:09 GMT

Let's be honest, EA didn't interfere with Origins or ME2 dev-wise because Bioware was a new acquisition that they didn't know how to drive into the ground yet. But what DID happen the instant EA bought the company? Origins fell down the DLC tree and it fell HARD.

And not two years later did we get DA2, the end for Bioware's golden age. Every release since has been hit with lack-luster reception in some way, even Inquisition.

Post by talyn82 on Jul 6, 2019 2:12:37 GMT

Let's be honest, EA didn't interfere with Origins or ME2 dev-wise because Bioware was a new acquisition that they didn't know how to drive into the ground yet. But what DID happen the instant EA bought the company? Origins fell down the DLC tree and it fell HARD.

And not two years later did we get DA2, the end for Bioware's golden age. Every release since has been hit with lack-luster reception in some way, even Inquisition.

The last great BioWare game imo is SWTOR. I am not an MMO fan, but I am a huge fan of the KOTOR games. Love them both. What attracted me to SWTOR was that each class had their own storyline my favorite being the Jedi Knight story, various planets, my favorite being Korriban, and introducing various species to play as, my favorite being the Sith Pureblood. Although I wished that there was a proper KOTOR III, SWTOR has filled the gap, though I wish it would have continued from where K2 left off, instead of 300 years later. There are some things I do not like, like the canonizing of Revan and the Exile and their fates. I would have preferred it like in K2 where you answer a series of questions setting up Revan's gender and K1's outcome. But since it's an MMO I guess it would have proven to be too troublesome. Lastly like I said before I hate MMO's and prefer single player games. But SWTOR plays like a single player game. I think of the other players as intelligent npc's running around.

I also love the cinmatics especially the one with the two brothers. Vitiate's sons.

Post by operationathena on Jul 7, 2019 20:34:51 GMT

Origins was definitely the height of the Dragon Age series, and I'm glad we got a semi-direct sequel to it in the Awakening Expansion. I don't see Bioware ever returning to that style though. The good news is that other CRPG games have cropped up and a lot of them are really good

I'm a published author, get my new short story "Forsaken Earth" COMPLETELY FREE by signing up for my mailing list here: www.daltoncortner.com