Reminds me of one time a girl I was dating slapped me. Her family was "non-denominational Christian." The church they went to was in a store front that used to be a used car dealership. When she explained this, I asked her, "So the guy who owned the dealership realized he could make more if he just opened a church?"

I don't find the car salesman morally wrong of anything. The brother is the sleaze who is taking advantage of dying old people and the banks are morons for approving loans their customers can't logically pay off before death. The salesman has to feed his family, too -- and if some young guy comes in and says he wants a $42k SUV and that his parents are gonna sign for him -- that deal is getting done. Is it the salesman responsibility to be a family councilor and look for red flags other than legal ones? Fark off, everyone wants to blame salespeople for their horrible judgement. Like they extort people.

irgunner:I don't find the car salesman morally wrong of anything. The brother is the sleaze who is taking advantage of dying old people and the banks are morons for approving loans their customers can't logically pay off before death. The salesman has to feed his family, too -- and if some young guy comes in and says he wants a $42k SUV and that his parents are gonna sign for him -- that deal is getting done. Is it the salesman responsibility to be a family councilor and look for red flags other than legal ones? Fark off, everyone wants to blame salespeople for their horrible judgement. Like they extort people.

/former salesman//current government employee

I agree the salesman was blameless. If he refused, you would hear shouts about freedom and such things. He doesn't know the family history, he isn't a councillor, he sells cars.

I seem to recall an incident where a salesman sold the same car 4 or 5 times to an old man with dementia. The old guy got it in his head that he wanted a car, and the sales guy sold it to him. Next day he drives the new car to the dealership forgetting that he just bought it. So the salesman sold him the same car over and over.

The family found out about this and took it to the news, and the dealership offered to refund the money like the nice people they were.

irgunner:I don't find the car salesman morally wrong of anything. The brother is the sleaze who is taking advantage of dying old people and the banks are morons for approving loans their customers can't logically pay off before death. The salesman has to feed his family, too -- and if some young guy comes in and says he wants a $42k SUV and that his parents are gonna sign for him -- that deal is getting done. Is it the salesman responsibility to be a family councilor and look for red flags other than legal ones? Fark off, everyone wants to blame salespeople for their horrible judgement. Like they extort people.

/former salesman//current government employee

there is a grey area here as it states the man was "in hospice", as we don't know if he was actually under hospice care in a Hospital. but many States have clear laws against signing contracts in a Hospital by a person under sedation or in other circumstances. bells and whistles should have gone off for the salesman, but of course there is a probability that he did not know he was participating in a morally reprehensible act from which he would profit.

Ok that's unscrupulous but that's nothing new, the question is WHY? Why "scam" a financed car onto someone who OBVIOUSLY had no capabilities or intention of ever making a payment on it? Seems like a business model doomed to failure.

FTFA:He died three weeks after the family says a Palmen Motors employee went to the couple's home to get the dying man's signature on a contract.

See, here is the problem with saying the salesman was 'unaware' of anything wrong with the deal. He went to their house. And saw nothing? Nothing at all that might make him say, "Hmmm".? Sorry, I am not buying it. Having been around many friends and family who were dying at home with Hospice there as well, the house looks like a mini hospital.

Yes, the brother/son is a scumbag, but so was the salesman for drooling over a sale more than being a human being and saying "Something is fishy here.

/Yes, the dealershiop made things right.... after an investigative news crew was standing at their door...// this may be why I am still unemployed... I just can't lower myself to the 'lack of humanity' level it takes to be a salesman in our current economy./// which is why I find it funny when I see all the ads for retail stores and the like where they crow about 'customer satisfaction' being their number one priority. That is a lie and they know it. Profit is their number one priority... why not just be honest about it?

Because of our investigation, an attorney for Palmen Motors called CBS 2 tonight to say they regret the way this transaction turned out. They are now going to buy the car back, pay off the loan and make the family whole for all they lost in the transaction.

payattention:// this may be why I am still unemployed... I just can't lower myself to the 'lack of humanity' level it takes to be a salesman in our current economy./// which is why I find it funny when I see all the ads for retail stores and the like where they crow about 'customer satisfaction' being their number one priority. That is a lie and they know it. Profit is their number one priority... why not just be honest about it?

I was fired from Palmen after working there for a month because I was "not aggressive enough" and "not greedy enough." I told them "Thank you" and walked out.

/Nevermind that they hired me to only sell new cars a month after Cash for Clunkers ended and I went days without even seeing a potential customer walk on the lot.

"It's morally wrong what they did and how they did it," said Barb Tinker. "They exploited the elderly people."

At the Kenosha, Wisconsin, dealership, Savini spoke with a man who identified himself as the manager and said, "Everything was done legally."

See, only a sociopath doesn't understand there is a difference between morality and legality.

Except it wasn't done legally.

What's important is that they thought it was done legally. I mean, they said so right there. It makes everything all better when you think you're doing stuff legally. (I feel comfortable using legal jargon in everyday life.)

Salesman said she did not seem to be suffering from dementia but daughter says she is yet article cites a quote from the 90 year old who apparently wasn't demented at the interview time?

Yes the brother is the culprit but if the son took his mom to the dealer and she agreed to buy a car and there did not seem to be an issue... meh. Seems the daughter thought she was OK enough for an interview

Spouses can sign for spouses with the right information. My mother did that to my dad... A BUNCH of times :-/

This is on the brother for exploiting his own mother and the bank for allowing the loan to go through.I strongly dislike car dealerships and their salesforce, but this is not their fault and certainly not morally wrong of them.

sloshed_again:I've dealt with Palmen many times. They are not out to rip you off.

Dude was a sleaze trying for a truck for free

Nailed it right there. When I sold cars this happened all the time. Son/daughter/grandchild wants car, doesn't have the income/credit to get it, gets grammy to cosign. Half the time the old folks knew full well what was going to happen and just didn't care. From what I read, the dealership did the right thing. The son is a sleazeball and deserves whatever he gets.

Like someone else said, don't blame the salesman. He's just trying to make a living, and if the deal isn't breaking any laws, it's all good. I know that just because something's legal doesn't make it ethical, but you still have to pay the rent somehow.