2) If the answer to number 1) is yes, (and I realize this is driver dependent), do you see any problem passing the helmet clearance chech when the broomstick is laid from windshield to rollbar?

Tommy V

10-07-2002 06:33 AM

Is it a bolt in? And if it is, what are the negative issues pertaining to risk of injury versus a weld in unit?

Thanks Randy.

Tommy

The Roadstergal

10-07-2002 07:56 PM

Very nice. I think the HMS (and hard dog) rollbars look very sharp on the Z. Let us know how it feels... :thumbup:

Randy Forbes

10-07-2002 08:09 PM

Quote:

Will the top still go up over it?

>>> Yes.

Quote:

do you see any problem passing the helmet clearance chech when the broomstick is laid from windshield to rollbar?

>>>As I sit in the car, my unhelmeted head is about 3" below a straightedge laid across the windshield header and the rollbar.

Quote:

Is it a bolt in?

>>> Yes.

Quote:

what are the negative issues pertaining to risk of injury versus a weld in unit?

>>> I'm not certain that I understand your question. Are you concerned the rollbar will come unfastened and strike an occupant?

Quote:

Very nice. I think the HMS (and hard dog) rollbars look very sharp on the Z. Let us know how it feels...

>>> Thank you! I'll give you my impression after the autocross on 10/20/02. I am most interested in the stiffening benefits of the rollbar, I have no intention of testing its rollover protection:)

Tommy V

10-08-2002 06:30 AM

My question regards risk in a rollover. Welds are stronger than bolts. What is the risk of shear? Does the rollbar come with an injury disclaimer?

Thanks Randy

Randy Forbes

10-08-2002 06:24 PM

Quote:

Does the rollbar come with an injury disclaimer?

Good luck getting a manufacturer to stand behind components used in racing!

Taken from Simpson catalog: (as an example)

"WARNING/DISCLAIMER
Motorsports are dangerous. No warranty or representation is made as to the products ability to protect the user from any injury or death. The user assumes that risk...."

Check out anybody's catalog, and chances are you'll see the same wording.

If you want a welded in rollcage, you'll have to contact TC Kline (assuming that he has re-established a relation with a suitable fabricator).

JoeZ

10-09-2002 10:11 AM

Any more pics to show? At first I didn't really like the look of the HMS but now it's growing on me and I'm seriously considering it. I've got an early Z3 without hoops and I think that a retrofit would cost just as much if not more than the HMS, and the HMS would be safer (I'm a little crazy sometimes).

Randy Forbes

10-09-2002 08:00 PM

Joe,
I'll get some pictures up in a few days.
I just put the car back together tonight (also had the center console out...must be Stygar/Maddux influence:)).

I need to get the car cleaned up a bit, then I'll get some finished shots of it.

You'll be buck$ ahead with your swap, I still have to order the NON-rollhoop cover that goes across the rear console area.

If you want any detail-specific pictures, let me know and I will get them for you.

JoeZ

10-09-2002 08:51 PM

1 more question-

Is raising the top more difficult with the HMS rollbar? I don't have a power top so I'm used to reaching around for it but does the bar get in the way and give any problems?

Randy Forbes

10-09-2002 09:01 PM

I haven't yet got the hang of it, after all, I'm used to stepping on the brake and pushing a button:)

Depending on the length/strength of your arm, you may still be able to lift it from the driver's seat.

One thing that you may be able to answer for me:
Does the top bounce up & down when in the lowered position?
I used to be able to count on the hydraulic cylinder to keep it tensioned when lowered.
Now I am concerned that it may have a tendency to float when going down a bumpy (95% of Toledo) road.

JoeZ

10-09-2002 09:11 PM

My arms aren't that long so it could be a slight problem for me, but I'm sure I'd get around it. As far as bouncing goes I've never noticed any bouncing at all. However I should state that I use the boot more often than not and that would hide the bounce if it was there, but I haven't ever noticed any.

Randy Forbes

10-10-2002 04:52 PM

Installation complete

1 Attachment(s)

The rollbar is secured and all the debris has been cleaned up.
No driving impressions yet, but I'll probably put a hundred or so miles on it tomorrow.
Season's last autocross is October 20th and I'm hoping to notice a difference!
Only thing left to do is fit a new cover over the sub woofer, doing away with the three individual pieces in favor of one intended for vehicles without factory rollhoops fitted.
It was ordered today from Paul Mclaughlin @ BMW South Motors.

Compare the two:

The Roadstergal

10-10-2002 04:54 PM

I love it. Be sure to give us commentary after the autoX.

My friends with rollbars - and long enough arms to reach - reach one arm under the bar, pull it up and feed it to the other arm over the top of the bar. It's quite a sight.

JoeZ

10-10-2002 07:56 PM

Looks great!! How about another pic from the rear a little closer up?

Randy Forbes

10-10-2002 08:04 PM

On Cue!

1 Attachment(s)

I was holding off because I don't have the rear cover for a non rollhoop car yet (but it is ordered).

JoeZ

10-10-2002 08:11 PM

I have to admit the HMS bar is really starting to grow on me. I like the aggressive look and you can't knock the increased safety. How long was the install? Can it be done with an everyday set of tools?

Randy Forbes

10-10-2002 08:26 PM

If this link works, you can get the complete instructions from their website:

But to answer your question, it could've been done on Saturday...
I just elected to start on Sunday afternoon (I know, crazy).

Simple hand tools should get you through.

Christian

10-13-2002 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JoeZ 1 more question-

Is raising the top more difficult with the HMS rollbar? I don't have a power top so I'm used to reaching around for it but does the bar get in the way and give any problems?

I have a Hard Dog roll bar, but the design is similar to the HMS. It's still possible to raise the top while seated, but it becomes a two handed affair. Not too bad though.

JoeZ

10-13-2002 03:04 PM

Now I'm really wanting a rollbar! However I'm falling quite a bit short as far as the HMS goes. Why does it cost $895 when the hard dog only costs $500? I like the look of the HMS better but it's gonna take me a while.

D///Mill

10-14-2002 12:48 PM

Padding needed? ...

In drag racing, cars quicker than 12-flat need at least a 6-point roll-cage. Another requirement is that it be padded using the wrap-around foam. Is this NOT a requirement for auto-X? Just curious. TIA

The Roadstergal

10-14-2002 12:52 PM

Depends on who's running the AutoX, but at the WWSCC ones I go to in Seattle, they don't even require a rollbar. The speeds just don't get very high...

Sven Odin

10-14-2002 06:34 PM

Maybe a stupid question on my part.........For the Z3's equipped with roll hoops, do they have to be removed in order to install the HMS rollbar?:dunno:

Randy Forbes

10-14-2002 06:42 PM

Quote:

Is this NOT a requirement for auto-X? Just curious.

The rollbar is NOT required.
I wanted it primarily to stiffen up the rear of the car.
Next Sunday I'll find out if it makes much difference.

Quote:

For the Z3's equipped with roll hoops, do they have to be removed in order to install the HMS rollbar?

Yes.
Take a look back at some of the pictures that are in this thread and you can see where the original hoops were, and where the new bar now is.