I don't doubt it, M9. I'm just glad that there are a few manufacturers making bikes that are good for riding fast in the real world. There are a lot of bikes out there that are designed to look good in magazines and on track days, but very little else.

It was a good race.
Casey Stoner result is a creditable achievement given the fact that it is likely he has glandular fever.
Interesting to see Valentino Rossi come second, even though he had poll position due consistant very fast times.
Jorge Lorenzo was on pain killers for a dislocated shoulder resulting from a highside on the right hander in the 'corkscrew' yesterday afternoon. A gutsy effort indeed considering he left it till his warmup lap immediately before the race to make up his mind if he would compete.
Dani Pedrosa only just held off a late lunge by Valentino Rossi on the second-last corner of the last lap for the lead, which is pretty amazing considering he held a significant lead earlier (over a second ahead of the pack), and it seems his bike mapped to a leaner fuel mix to make the distance, hence was underpowered in the dying stage of the race.

The corkscrew on that circuit would be mind blowing to negotiate at the speeds those fellows do. Hard to imagine topping a blind crest where the bike wants to fly, and having to brake hard into a steep downhill and turn all at the same time ...

No. Did not see the IOMTT. My TV watching is opportunistic and I only tripped over the Leguna MotoGP being advertised by accident!

From other threads.>I'm gutted.>The motorbike I rode to work yesterday and had security cabled to a post at the base of the building in a public open place, was stolen.>They left the cut plastic-sheathed security flex-cable, allegedly designed to stop such acts...

What are peoples thoughts on the wide variety of chains and cables on the market designed for motor cycle security and any real life testimony as to their effectiveness?

I have seen security chains/locks ranging from $80 to $600, and noticed within one brand that they sell identical items but in differing chain gauges...
Obviously you get what you pay for to a certain extent, and 'heavier' is probably better, but it seems to me that hardened steel is only so hard, and after a certain price the benefit is only psychological?
I have come to the conclusion from first hand experience that the flexible steel cable style of thing in 10 mm diameter is insufficient to stop a thief.
I have also heard of determined thieves getting through chain by freezing it in liquid nitrogen (or similar?), so it becomes brittle then breaking it... ~> if thief is that prepared, then not much would stop them ... ~> so I am more interested in preventing the opportunistic low-lifes.

My bike is insured so the question is possibly academic, but can do without the inconvenience, so I am interested in what others find effective.

On 9/07/2009 IdratherbeclimbingM9 wrote:>I have also heard of determined thieves getting through chain by freezing>it in liquid nitrogen (or similar?), so it becomes brittle then breaking>it... ~> if thief is that prepared, then not much would stop them ... ~>>so I am more interested in preventing the opportunistic low-lifes.

We had this happen to several (push) bikes outside our house in Abottsford in Melbourne (just near lactic Factory). They even did it when we were on the house! The remains of the locks were sort of scorched / melted / shattered. Locks only keep the honest from taking it!

With the advent of cordless angle grinders, the reality is that no lock is more than 30 seconds away from being cut. Whilst it's no doubt possible to freeze a lock and shatter it, the practicality of doing it would be beyond most bike thieves. Industrial cable cutters, big bolt cutters and long crowbars would be the most common tools.

I reckon the only sure-fire way to make sure your bike isn't stolen is to park it next to a better bike that has a worse lock.

On 9/07/2009 tmarsh wrote:>I reckon the only sure-fire way to make sure your bike isn't stolen is to park it next to a better bike that has a worse lock.

I have checked some motorcycle forums and also done some more homework on 'security'.
~> Have come to the conclusion that you are probably right.

The plentiful YouTube footage etc, that is out there, shows just how easily the alleged 'guaranteed to take five minutes to cut through' stuff can be done in (often) about 30 seconds, or the locks picked in similar time. Quite sobering to see/learn this actually …

The best solution it seems to me is to have a combination of time consuming deterrents.
A chain to resist hacksaws, a flex-steel cable to resist bolt cutters, a disc lock (or two! ie one front and rear wheel), a guard dog, a hand gun & nasty attitude, alarms etc. As the opportunistic thief is unlikely to be carrying all the necessary items to address the variety, and will move on to an easier target.
The professionals will still take a bike within 30 seconds if they want it, but they are likely to come in numbers (four or more to simply pick it up!), with a van to transport it etc.

My preferred option is to just go bush on it and not have to worry about urban lowlife, but that does not get around the commute to work situation.

~> Been a week now, I shall phone the Police and see how they are getting on…

I'm looking for some suggestions on a good commuter bike. I've taken some contract work that means a 120km ride into the city for a while. Want something reliable and don't want to spend more than $11K, but would be happier with something cheaper as well. I've looked at BMW F800S, Ducati STs, Triumph 1050. Prefer to have a comfortable ride position with a reasonable screen as I get a sore neck otherwise.

I note from your profile that Blackheath is mentioned, so assume the commute is down the hill into the city. The conditions you will encounter, qualify my response re the bikes (limited, or no experience on the models you mention!).

I reckon riding position is everything. The more upright it is, the more comfortable for longer commutes, but also the more need for a decent fairing if foul weather is anticipated.

The BMW F800S or ST? (quite different machines).
The relaxed sport-touring riding position (higher bars), of the ST (sport/tourer) is more conducive to logging high kilometre trips and spending long days in the saddle. The S (sport) ride position is a lot more forward which equals weight on wrists in slower going traffic conditions, and it's fairing is less 'keep the weather off', due more minimalistic. The S also does not have saddlebag mounts ~> could be an issue depending what you need to take with you.

Ducati ST3S from reviews appears to be a much more nimble machine and a truer 50/50 sports/tourer bike compared to the BMW, which aligns more to the tourer side of the equation.
Duke is taller than BMW, an issue if you are short? I have heard that some Dukes have had electrical issues in the past, though I also gather that they can be sorted fairly easily.

Triumph Tiger 1050, or speed triple 1050? (quite different machines).
Tiger is comfortable and predictable. Have ridden one and they sound a bit tinnie in my opinion, but that is a matter of personal preference. They are fairly agile for touring and have a low enough centre of gravity to handle commute. The newer ones are reliable, and are also more road oriented than older models.
The speed triple has bugger all pillion comfort and I have heard can be a bit jumpy in low gear.

In my opinion it would largely come down to emotion (looks, ie naked vs faired, and colour?) Vs what is available in reasonable price/condition? … ~> as well as what you want to do on the bike that is additional to basic commute.

Other possible things to consider would be; Pillioning friendliness of the bike, luggage carrying capacity, slow speed manouvering (weight) eg parking, cooling system efficiency eg additional electric fan to force air through engine while in standstill(?) traffic, the proximity and conscientiousness of the ongoing servicing/dealer, standard gearing/torque ratios of your final choices (more important if considering the beamer due smaller engine?) as a good low gear helps considerably in slow traffic.

If it was me; I'd go for the Duke for more road oriented riding pleasure; but would go for the Triumph Tiger if the more hybrid (includes dirt backroads) touring style of usage is anticipated as part of the equation.

yeah, the ride is down the hill from the mtns, which is part of the attraction of the BMW, as I think they have heated grips! Have also looked at the FJ900 which comes in a bnit cheaper than the others. Was thinking of the Sprint 1050, but will have to check the ride position for comfort.

Agree that a decent fairing will help in foul weather, but on those days will try to catch the train. Although at 2.5 hours, the bike option is looking good.

Agree about heated grips. Had them fitted to mine as it did not come with them. If you choose this option look around a bit, as they vary in price (when I looked - a fair while ago), from $60 to $130. If you are half mechanically minded then many of them can be fitted by yourself. The difference in prices of the items largely came down to the type of switch that operates them and whether they are multi-stage heating or simply a 'one setting' and either on, or off.
If you fit them, then wire them in through your key ignition, so that when the motor is turned off they are also turned off. Would be a bummer to come out next morning and find a flat battery due an independent switch accidently remained on all night without having power cut to it by the key route.

Some mornings in my part of the world; even with heat on high setting, double gloves (good mcycle leather ones with a 2nd set of wool liners), & barkbusters (handgrip protectors) that also are good at deflecting wind; ... it is a queer mix of simultaneous feelings of cold fingertips, cool but sometimes slightly sweaty palms and back of hands still cold enough to wonder if the grip heaters are actually on, ... till you remove your hand off the grip for a bit, and realise that yes, ... they are indeed on! On other occasions (particularly in wet weather), one can have hot palms and freezing back of hand simultaneously.

Different topics.
No good news on recovering the stolen bike yet, and have since learnt of another one being stolen in the area.

I went to five of the six local motorcycle stores and noticed they seem affected by 'global recession' and are not carrying much stock / variety, especially for security devices. I also went to the local locksmith place to eyeball similar.
Interestingly the best thing I have found in the way of security chain is actually not from any of them. I found that the local 'heavy lifting' industrial mob who supply slings/cables etc to cranes etc, have super-duper high tensile steel chain that is harder to cut than the supposed 'security type' chains, and at half the price per metre, with whatever length you want available, instead of being limited to the 'fashion' of a pre-packaged item from supplier to a bikestore. I saw first hand how hard it is to cut*, and compared to the educational (for me) YouTube stuff I saw of cutting similar, reckon it to be a good deal.

*4 ft bolt croppers get through one side of a 10 mm link but the force to do so 'wonks' (distort spreads), the jaws of the bolt cropper so they are ineffective on the other side of the link. The half cut link cannot be twisted open as it is still too strong. A hacksaw loses its teeth by about half way through cutting one side of a link.

I have a Triumph Street Triple but it is not really built for carrying a son and a pile of climbing gear! I should get some hard-shelled panniers or something for it, but it is not really built for touring and luggage. I would love to go riding/climbing. What a great combination! (Your lovely orange machine is certainly better suited to this sort of use than mine Striple...) Cheers,

>Interestingly the best thing I have found in the way of security chain>is actually not from any of them. I found that the local 'heavy lifting'>industrial mob who supply slings/cables etc to cranes etc, have super-duper>high tensile steel chain that is harder to cut than the supposed 'security>type' chains, and at half the price per metre, with whatever length you>want available, instead of being limited to the 'fashion' of a pre-packaged>item from supplier to a bikestore. I saw first hand how hard it is to cut*,>and compared to the educational (for me) YouTube stuff I saw of cutting>similar, reckon it to be a good deal.

cant remember exactly how much it was, i think around $100 from Peter Stevens. I think its great, the
website does a good enuff job explaining how fantastic it is, so i wont go into too much detail, but i'm
pretty confident no-one is getting thru it in a hurry! This in combination with the steering lock seems to
make a pretty foolproof combination. And if they do want it that badly then they can have it, and i'll
have the insurance money.

I think once you go beyond anything like this, it is probably easier for said thief to just cut the signpost
off (or even just pull it out of the ground - I can remember many nights as a drunken teenager pulling
out signposts on the walk home :-), it actually pretty easy) Plus if you go too crazy, it just becomes a
pain to carry around. They can get quite heavy.

I'm lucky enough to work in the city, so most of the day its pretty safe. On those nights when a late
night in the office carries on into the early morning, i do get pretty concerned about it. If anyone has
any better ideas than a simple chain and lock, i'd be keen to know!

On 21/07/2009 atreyudelacy wrote:>pretty confident no-one is getting thru it in a hurry! This in combination>with the steering lock seems to make a pretty foolproof combination. And if they do want it that badly then they can have it, and i'll have the insurance money.>
After my recent experience, I definitely agree.

>If anyone has any better ideas than a simple chain and lock, i'd be keen to know!>
More than one lock/security-variety style!

Jacq. wrote;>I have a Triumph Street Triple but it is not really built for carrying a son and a pile of climbing gear! >I should get some hard-shelled panniers or something for it, but it is not really built for touring and luggage.

... but it is built for twisty mountain roads! (imo) ~> which often lead to climbing areas!!

Welcome to Chockstone Jacq.

Regarding gear carrying; the riding/climbing combo I have found is dictated by the style of climbing involved somewhat. Sport climbing doesn't require much gear compared to trad, and trad is less than aid etc.
It also depends on the gear taken by those that you may link up with. If my climbing partners are going in a cage, then I only take personal gear and a light supplementary rack to compliment theirs.
If a group of riders were meeting to climb, then it could be sorted beforehand who takes what, so that those without panniers etc can get by with less.

On the flip side, I have not found being a minimalist rider carries over into my climbing.
~> where did I pack that kitchen sink again?
Heh, heh, heh.

If I have to stick Blake on the back I am in trouble - he is not a minimalist climber! The more shiny stuff the better! I did offer to ride up to Mt Pilot on Sunday - he did not seem impressed with the idea at all! He's not a big fan of going pillion. At least I dont have to cart around his bouldering mat anymore - that'd be fun on the bike!

Back on 14/07/09 I wrote;>~> Been a week now, I shall phone the Police and see how they are getting on…

The bike still has not been recovered.

I have viewed the CCT footage and the main suspect they identified in it has been interviewed by police. He has a verified alibi and so that turns out to be a mis-identification.
Police recovered the licence plate off it along with another stolen motorcycle, and other stolen goods, in a common area under a block of flats. These are being finger-printed.

Our Saturday turned out to be one of those days. Initial plan - forecast 25C - plan lets go for a ride. That got delayed, when husband said I need to go into work for a while. That "while" got longer and longer" ride abandoned. He eventually arrived home at 5.15pm. He had promised to take me out to dinner to make up for his absence. I looked at him and he was so tired so we "planned" Thai takeaway and a movie. He said to me "I don't have any money on me". So we walked to the ATM and on the way back I suggested a cleansing ale outside our favourite restaurant just around the corner from home.

We sat enjoying the balmy conditions, the cold beer and just watching the people in the park opposite and relaxing. Then a bike went past and husband sat upright "bloody idiot
he has lost his girlie"! "What" I said. I turned to see a little figure scrabbling around on the road. I ran and got to her just as she made it to the median strip.

She looked up at me through the visor with hurt, surprised eyes. She took off her helmet and I gasped, it was one of our neighbours. Her husband arrived and I just looked at him
and said "What did you do?"

In a very short amount of time she went into shock and was gasping with pain, her jeans were shredded and her knees were a bloody mess and her hip badly grazed where her jacket
and ridden up. The ambulance was called and I got some ice for her to suck on as she was so thirsty. I sat holding her hand for what seemed like forever, her husband stood sweating, he had hurt his wife and the mother of his children - it was all a bit much and from what they both said and what my husband had seen he was not being irresponsible - she just fell of the back! After she was assessed they took her to hospital.

We pushed his bike home to our place and took their gear with us. They took her to hospital and last I heard she was going to have an operation to clean up her knees.

I guess if there are morals to this story - it would be always expected the unexpected, never relax because you are near home and please ATGATT her knees just looked awful!
They were only doing 40km/hr.

Thank you all for your wishes, I will certainly pass them on. She had a hot date with a plastic surgeon this morning - skin grafts. I knew she was cut up pretty badly (cos I was
in the ambulance with her when they were pouring saline over her jeans to cut them away and when asked by the ambo's rate your pain on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the worst she said 8 and this was from a young women who has had 2 children!

Thank heaven she had gloves on, her hands were unmarked and her Dainese jacket certainly kept her top half to her hips from being grazed.

Take care out there.

Funny you should say that whilst all this was going on, two other friends turned up for a drink at the same place, saw my husband emerge from behind the ambulance carrying two
helmets and thought it was me! My husband swiftly allayed their fears.

Our neighbour just turned up to take his bike home, the surgery apparently included shaving off some of her knee cap - which makes me feel slightly unwell just thinking about
it. He said she admits, it was most probably her fault, she was only hanging on with one hand and not tightly enough. She will be in hospital for several days on antibiotics to
stop infection. He admits that in future it will be ATGATT they have learnt their lesson the hard way. But it was just out for a ride on our first warm day (incidentall it was
our hottest September day on record it was still 29.5C at 8.30pm), just a quick coffee, home and out to dinner for her birthday. What was the harm in wearing jeans.