The Gnome Project released version 2.12 yesterday. We had a quick look at it by using the latest Gnome Live CD (1.12-pre) and Foresight 0.9.0 (2.12 final) and here are our thoughts over 2.12 and Gnome's status in general.

Not really, anyone not in denial and trying to defend a error would not need it, but for some it may have helped. It would have shown the real use for an menu editor would primarily be adding new entries and changing(editing) existing ones. Changing location or moving entries around would be the least used used functionality.

>if the app isn't broken, the user wouldn't need to add menu items.
For user in the real world this is not the case so handle it.

>Such as adding a launcher on the panel or desktop
The user wants it in the menu, deal with it.

>writing the app.desktop file and dropping it in to the correct directory
The user don't want to learn the correct syntax for .desktop files or bother with their location. Compare the usability to something like 2 minutes with a GUI menu editor.

Doing things like adding a selfmade xdialog/normal script, small app or adding/changing a application start-up parameter are some typical task. And the user are not interested in mucking about with .desktop files, that's why you have menu editors. A simple study of actual users would have told you so.

It would have shown the real use for an menu editor would primarily be adding new entries and changing(editing) existing ones

I sure would never asks you for a study, given that you know/are biased to the answer before ever starting anything.

>if the app isn't broken, the user wouldn't need to add menu items.
For user in the real world this is not the case so handle it.

No, users in the real world use distros, so the distro has to handle it, and that's what they do. Your point is moot.

>Such as adding a launcher on the panel or desktop
The user wants it in the menu, deal with it.

No he doesn't. I am a user and I don't, so who are you to tell me I want ? The fact is you don't know what the user want, a gnome app exists to overcome this problem, but you want to modify the base platform because that suits you better. But clearly, you are not an ordinary user. Every ordinary user I saw avoid the menu as much as they can, and use icons on their desktop or on the panel. Power users know how to install smeg.

>writing the app.desktop file and dropping it in to the correct directory
The user don't want to learn the correct syntax for .desktop files or bother with their location. Compare the usability to something like 2 minutes with a GUI menu editor.

The user doesn't have to !! The .desktop file is actually simpler to edit with gedit than any GUI. The GUI just puts a GUI around the content of the file, adding complexity, but reassuring people like you. It's actually more tedious and longer to use a GUI for editing these than do it with a text editor.
Anyway, this is the distro's duty.

For normal users, the default correct directory and standard one is <gnome prefix>/share/applications.
What you described is for user only prefs. You talk like you are alone to use the machine. We are several people on mine, and sure as hell, when an app is installed, creating a menu entry just for one user is NOT the way to go. There's a reason for the standard.

Doing things like adding a selfmade xdialog/normal script, small app or adding/changing a application start-up parameter are some typical task

There are Gnome ways to create your own menu or icons to do that, but you refuse the Gnome way, you want to have the (broken) MS Windows way absolutely. You have the tools to do that, but still, the problem is you want this *in the platform*. For now, Gnome devs said no, can't you accept that ? If the Gnome devs then realize they were wrong, you can be sure Smeg, once up to Gnome standards (HIG, ...) will be integrated.

And the user are not interested in mucking about with .desktop files, that's why you have menu editors

No he doesn't. I am a user and I don't, so who are you to tell me I want ? The fact is you don't know what the user want, a gnome app exists to overcome this problem, but you want to modify the base platform because that suits you better. But clearly, you are not an ordinary user. Every ordinary user I saw avoid the menu as much as they can, and use icons on their desktop or on the panel. Power users know how to install smeg.

Sure, power users know how to install smeg, and ordinary users know how to use it. So clearly there is no problem making smeg the default application or adding the missing functionality to the existing lame version. Just saying that the functionality of SMEG wouldn't be needed if all applications followed the standard isn't good enough.

What about legacy applications, that was written before any menu standards was written. Users and sysadmins will need to add such applications to the gnome menu and a menu editor program should cater for that. A sysadmin may also want to change the order of the menu item is such that the most frequently used applications in the organization requires the least mouse movement to start.