Religious Discussions

I perfectly understand this. I don't visit this thread as often I must admit. In fact, I was on this thread a few weeks ago but then WTF came along and I never visited this again until I saw Zarfeen's name on the thread a couple of days ago and wondered what she was doing here. I still haven't read those few pages in between so have no idea what was said after I left. Not even remotely curious.

I don't believe that, Zarfeen. I adore my two students (I call them "my boys") who are devout Muslims and came to our home straight from Jeddah to learn English and study Engineering. They are kind, pure, intelligent and humorous. I must say though that it's certainly been an education for me to find out that their beliefs are set in stone with no room for empathy with others' beliefs.

It's like they've been living in a leaded box.Their basic knowledge was astounding. Here is a small, random sample of stuff they had never heard of:

- Anything to do with space. (Space missions, the Space Station.)- Had never written a paragraph in their lives. Only a basic sentence or two. (They tell me there are special schools in Jeddah for writing.)- Germs and their influence.- The Beatles, Lady Gaga, Madonna. (But they'd heard of Michael Jackson & Shakira.. other than that..)

Things I've learned:- Google is censored in their country (they didn't know that until they used Google here in our country.)- They believe in witchcraft and are frightened of it. And it is an offence punishable by death in their country.- They love their King.- They believe The Quoran is the absolute truth.- They believe anything other than their religion is not the truth.

They are wonderful human beings who have lived in our home and have been part of our family for 2 years, but boy-o'-boy, have we learned from each other.And continue to do so..

Linda, I said almost all people, to be more precise, almost all people I have met..

It is nice to hear about those two boys and their story. They seem to be so simple and religious.

I am not the kind of girl who goes around wearing a hijab or a burqa and conservative and blah blah blah. There are soooo many things a muslims isn't supposed to do which I do for example, wearing nail varnish, watchin movies, celebrating other festivals etc etc.People are surprised when they find out that I actually am a muslim!

And it is nice to know that you respect muslims. I have met many people I just feel like slapping because of their stupid thoughts.

How does it respond in subtle ways if its responses appear to be entirely predictable?

If the responses are entirely predictable why do you see this as a sign of consciousness?

If I put my hand on a hot stove and involuntarily withdraw it (which will happen with 100% predictability) is that a conscious decision? It seems to be of a different character to a conscious decision to me. In fact, in a reflex reaction the Central Nervous System bypasses the brain except to send a pain signal.

Subtlety and predictability are not exclusive. Nor is it 100% predictable that you will withdraw your hand from a hot stove. For all I know you might be a lunatic, or you might have some nervous impairment. I see no need for consciousness/awareness to lead inevitably to decision-making

Not true. For example, there are fishes who have evolved to live in dark caves who have lost the use of their eyes.

The environment does not necessarily get more complex.

Wrong, my friend. One single example does not obviate a trend. The geological record demonstrates increasing complexity. More species, more niches. Trolls, however, are fictional as far as I know. No doubt you'll want to make an issue of that too.

I do stuff which I feel is not harmful.By wearing nail varnish or celebrating other festivals, no one is gonna take an AK-47 and shoot me...at least in the place I live.There are also many things which I do follow strictly and have no plans of crossing my limits.We aren't supposed to eat pork, drink, smoke etc which I feel is for our own good. Those are more serious stuff which I obviously follow...