From: hekunze@jeeves.uwaterloo.ca (Herb Kunze)
Subject: Wrestling TidBits - 05/25
Date: 1995/05/26
Message-ID:
X-Deja-AN: 103220183
sender: news@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca (USENET News System)
organization: University of Waterloo
newsgroups: rec.sport.pro-wrestling
- Presumably in an attempt to make house shows seem important again,
the WWF did a quickie IC Title change, passing the belt to Razor
Ramon last Friday and then back to Jeff Jarrett on Sunday. Jarrett
is now saying that he's given Ramon enough title matches and that
he's out of luck for now. I guess they'll stay on the tag team
program (JJ & Roadie vs. Ramon & Savio Vega) for a while.
- Meltzer reports that Steve Austin was talked into doing the quickie
job for the Renegade at the Center Stage tapings, followed by another
quickie job for Randy Savage. In return for going along with those
booking plans, there is a chance that the Hollywood Blonds tag team
may be reformed.
- After his loss at Slamboree on Sunday, Ed "Butcher" Leslie has parted
ways with WCW. It had been rumoured that Hulk Hogan was trying hard
to convince the company to keep Ed around, but in the end it wasn't
possible to justify his $2000-a-week salary.
- The Ric Flair vs. Alex Wright US Title tourney match that airs this
weekend ends with Randy Savage running in to beat up Flair while
Alex has the upper hand, leading to Alex's DQ. While I think a lot
of Flair the wrestler, I just gotta wonder about Flair the booker
sometimes.
- As already reported, the Steiners will not work WCW PPVs after all.
They will spend some time in SMW between New Japan dates.
- WCW has the Great American Bash on 06/18/95. Tentative line-up
includes:
- No Hulk Hogan
- Randy Savage vs. Ric Flair
*- Blue Bloods vs. Nasty Boys for the WCW Tag Titles
- Sting vs. Meng for the US Title (tourney final ?)
- Diamond Dallas Page vs. Dave Sullivan
- Jim Duggan vs. Kamala
- Arn Anderson vs. Renegade for the TV Title
- Brian Pillman vs. Alex Wright
- The WWF has King of the Ring on 06/25/95. So far, Mabel, Razor Ramon,
Shawn Michaels, Kama, UT, and Bob Holly are in the tournament.
- The next UFC is slated for 07/14/95. This show will feature a Dan Severn
vs. Ken Shamrock "superfight." Tournament entrants will include the
returning Oleg Taktarov, David Beneteau, and Patrick Smith.
- WCW has another PPV on 07/16/95. This is the show that will take place
on a beach with free admission. Tentative line-up includes:
- Hulk Hogan vs. Vader for the WCW Title in a cage match
*- Paul Orndorff vs. Arn Anderson or Renegade for the TV Title
- The WWF has SummerSlam on 08/28/95.
- Interview: Here's the fourth installment of an interview with Jim
Cornette from Wrestling Perspective (P.O. Box 401, Camillus, NY,
12031-0401, USA; possibly still $1.50 per monthly issue). The
interview was conducted on 07/20/93 and will give you an idea of
the quality of the newsletter.
WP: Do you think you learned how not to promote by working Global?
JC: No (laughs). I knew that shit already (laughs). We went down just
four, five times to tape at the Sportatorium. I tried to tell Joe, "I
don't know if they're going to buy this." "This is going to be great."
Whatever. I like Joe Pedicino, but he tended to have too grand ideas
for what people would believe, I think. That's the thing there. If
we'd have started up Smoky Mountain Wrestling and said, "Smoky
Mountain Wrestling is affiliated with Goddamn 14 different promotions
around the world. We're going to be doing a pay-per-view in six months
and we've got these champions coming in from all across America and
dadada." Well, people would have gone, "Aww fuck." But we say, "Hey,
Smoky Mountain Wrestling is bringing wrestling back to you, the fans,
on a local level and we appreciate your support and you're going to
see some hot action in the months to come. We're going to do our best
to bring it to you at affordable, family prices." People said, "Well,
they can do that." Everybody has to be world, galaxy, global,
international, universal, fuckin' astronomical, milky way, galaxy.
Fuck, it's ridiculous. Global, where are you running? Dallas. People
see that stuff and they know when it's bullshit. But they can't say
we're not Smoky Mountain Wrestling because we're all over these
fuckin' mountains.
WP: Why don't we get a little into a new topic: the Stan Lane
situation?
JC: I wasn't going to say anything except with his "Torch Talk" a few
things had to be answered. You read the letter (that Comette wrote to
Pro Wrestling Torch ) and you know what they were. I don't want to say
anything now to be honest with you. Just because Stan's a friend of
mine. I've liked Stan and I've been with Stan for so long. Stan just
changed his outlook on things and the whole thing stemmed from the
fact that he just really didn't want to be in the business anymore.
That just caused problems with me, who eats, sleeps and dreams it. I
just didn't feel like, aww jeez, it's hard to say this without
sounding like I'm trying to bury him and I'm not. But then by the same
token, I was upset when I read the Torch thing. Not only did he try to
babyface and say the reason was purely money, but he also in a
backhanded way downgraded all the other guys in the territory who were
working hard and, in some cases, outworking him. Stan's capable of a
lot, but we weren't getting what he was capable of and that was just a
whole bunch of other things. We were going to have to make a change so
we might as well make a change.
WP: You get the feeling from reading what he said and you said that
there was a good friendship there and it doesn't seem that's the case
now. It seems very strained
JC: You know, disappointment is more the thing. I'm trying to say this
without having anybody look like a total jerk or without coming out
and knocking anybody.
WP: He has his viewpoints and you have your viewpoints.
JC: Stan has been in the business long enough to know that shit goes
up and shit goes down. Stan felt like he should make more money each
year that he is in the business than the proceeding year or that he
was going backwards. That just ain't going to happen in any
profession. If you're running a plumbing company, the year of the
flood, you're going to make a fortune fixing all the shit. The next
year, you ain't going to make jack. But that don't mean you give up
and start a daggum carpeting company. I was disappointed in Stan that
if... Let's put it this way: If he'd have been running the thing and
I'd have been working for him, because I love the business and he's a
friend of mine, I'd have busted my butt and done whatever. I wouldn't
have given him problems when I knew he already had problems. I just
didn't get the same thing that I thought I would have given him when
it was the other way around.
WP: Have you spoken with him since he left?
JC: Truthfully, I haven't. I'm not saying we never will. Probably we
will later on at some point. It was just a disappointment to me
because I could see what we could do and what was possible and if he
had another job or something or another career that he was going
directly into I could understand him saying, "I'm just not going to
wrestle anymore." But as far as I know, he didn't. He's got things he
wants to do, but he ain't doing them yet. Stan's an only child and so
am I.
WP: Did you find it disappointing because it's pretty hard to find a
worker with Stan's charisma? Did you feel you were losing an asset in
that respect?
JC: He was a Heavenly Body. It's hard to find Heavenly Bodies. Stan
definitely has a lot of charisma. He had name value. But you've got to
look at it from okay, here's what I'm paying and here's what I'm
getting. In a territory, you've got to have good matches. You have to
have a guy willing to work. If Stan's girlfriend's plane was late, so
was he. That's not the way to run a daggum business.
WP: Was there pressure on him to move to Tennessee?
JC: There wasn't any pressure on him, but I told him, and I still
think this is a fair assessment, "Stan, you're renting a house in
Charlotte. You don't own one." I offered to take the ring truck down
and move his stuff to Knoxville. He would spend $200 a month minimum
less on rent. He would save a hotel every night he was working so that
was $40 minimum every night he worked. He would save food on the road
and a ton of gas. So making the same amount of money, he would come
out, what do you think, $1,000 a month ahead. I said, "Stan, Jesus
Christ, we can't afford to pay you more than you're making now. You're
already making more than anybody else. But you would come out further
ahead if you would move." I mean it's not like we were asking him to
move for six or eight shots a month. He knew he was figured in. He
knew he would continue to be and would be on all thes hows. But he
just didn't want to move. The reason he didn't want to move was cause
he knew that he didn't want to wrestle much longer and why move up
here. This wasn't where he wanted to live forever. He's looking at it
like that and it's a valid reason. But I'm also looking at a guy that
wants more money to stay. I always worked the same whether I was in
the Superdome or in Fort Polk, Louisiana. You've got to like doing it
for one thing and if you're sick, yeah, or if you've got an injury or
something, that's one thing. All things being equal, you work the same
way cause you take pride in what you do. If the guy won't work that
way for $200, but he will work that way for $400, I'd rather get the
guy that will work. The whole thing was I didn't mind paying Stan more
for what he was capable of doing, but I did mind paying him more for
what he seemed like he was willing to do.
WP: How did Tommy Young play into this, if at all?
JC: (laughs) Not at all other than Tommy and Stan were Felix and
Oscar, the Odd Couple, driving together. The thing is we had Tommy as
a road agent. Tommy Young, I felt with all the years he's been in the
business and what he knew about the business, was a valuable asset.
But unfortunately, he couldn' t referee anymore. We had him coming in
as a road agent, a glorified term that WCW uses, which mainly meant
that he handled the music, he carried finishes, he made sure that the
show ran smooth, he did things that needed to be done to keep our live
events running smoothly. But when you sit there and look at the
payroll and I mean cold-hearted business once again, if Tommy Young
wasn't there, it didn't harm the house. The referee and the people
that are already there really could handle his job. Now on big shows,
if he had lived in town, I would have used him. But it was hard on
some of the spot shows to have an extra guy on the payroll. So I told
him, "Tommy, for the time being, we really can't have you on all the
shows . It's not worth your while to just drive up for Knoxville. I
realize that." I would like to get him back in some capacity with us
in some point just because of his experience. But until I can offer
him enough to make it worth his while, I'm not going to insult him and
say, "Hey, I'll give you $150 a week, go hang posters." But that left
Stan having to make the trip by himself. Stan don't like to drive. Me,
I don't like to fly. I'll drive 400 miles to avoid getting in a plane
. Instantly, don't think a thing about it. But Stan don't like to
drive. So that's one of the things that hastened him either wanting
more money or to not work or whatever because he would have to make
the trip by himself. When you think about it, like I said, I can leave
here and be where I lived in Charlotte in three and a half hours. It's
not like we were asking him to come from Key West. That's the way
Tommy played into it indirectly.
WP: Have there been pay cuts due to attendance problems?
JC: Everybody is still making the same amount of money as their
original deal when they came in. We don't go back on our word. If a
guy started with us and we said, "Okay, we'll pay you $100." I'm just
using that figure. Then he's still making $100 a night. But if a guy
started two months ago and we said, "Look, we're adding guys to the
card, trying to have more variety and we can't pay you anymore than x
dollars," then he's on that deal. Nobody has had their money cut since
their original arrangement whenever that may have been.
WP: Have they seen peaks at one point? Let's say the house did real
well, did they get a boost in pay for that show or are they getting a
flat rate per show?
JC: We have given guys bonuses on real big shows that they were
instrumental in. A couple of times, I've given extra for TV matches
that I thought were just tremendous. I've given guys extra money. Not
a lot, to be honest with you because when you think about it, we've
got the best guarantees of any small promotion in the country today.
The money is there whether the house is $500 or $5,000. The guys don't
complain because you can say, "Hey, when it averages out, you're still
ahead." A lot of the babyfaces make a lot of gimmick money. You don't
feel the pressure to bonus them for a big house when Jesus Christ, in
addition to their payoff, they have made $600, $700, $800 because of
that big house on gimmicks. Now the heels, then you would, but then
also some of the babyfaces do give a percentage of their gimmick money
to the heels that they're working with since they're part of the
reason. It's not like this everything's all for myself mentality that
the big promotions have because one of the reasons these guys were
picked to be here is because they understand how the real wrestlmg
business works. They understand they're not TV stars, not movie stars.
They're wrestlers and I feel the same way about myself. They don't
have contracts and I don't have a contract. They understand that the
wrestling business is up and down. That's why a lot of them are here
because they're smart to the business . It's not a deal like, "Well,
I've made all this souvenir money and I'm not going to give anybody
anything" or "I drew this house." If that's not the case with a guy
then he's not going to fit in here. As you can see by Ric Flair not
drawing any money, here's the greatest wrestler in the world, he ain't
drawing a dime because the people don't care about who they're
sticking him in with. It takes two to hip toss (laughs).
- Booking Prediction Tourney: I won't have the Slamboree results posted
until next week, I guess. I didn't order the show and didn't see a
posting with the precise results I need to score ballots. The next
tourney card is King of the Ring, which will cause some problems
since we won't know the matches past the first round of the KotR.
The best answer is to only have the first round matches plus any
other announced matches on the ballot.
- WWW: This post is presented weekly, presumably with some short delay,
on Mark Long's r.s.p-w home page on the Web. That page contains a lot
of interesting wrestling info, so give it a try at:
http://www.luc.edu/~mlong/wrestling.html
- Videos: I have posted something about the availability of videos.
If you missed it, I'll send it to you in e-mail upon request. It
appears that the istrain.health.ufl.edu ftp site has been wiped
clean up r.s.p-w stuff and nobody knows what's going on.
Herb...