That has nothing to do with handouts Peeker, it has far more to do with a modern two party shit-hole where the politicians are focused on getting reelected instead of running an actual gov't.

They all line the pockets of whoever will make that happen. If that money wasn't going into one pocket (maybe via handout) it would simply be shoved into another person's pocket.

There is already talk that the SuperPac's literally bought the house this time around because it was deemed the best bang for their buck in terms of spending....

Bitching about social handouts completely ignores the true problem and that is a broken ass political system where votes and elections are bought and reelection governs choices instead of accomplishment (and spare the second term president shit, because with a Republican House and a Senate that is victim to what will be endless fillibustering nothing is changing in the next four years and it would have been the same had Romney won).

As too all empires falling, the disaster that has unfolder int he EU and China over the last two years has given us hope. The Olympics were the worst thing to ever happen to the Chinese, because labor wage increases and westernization are now very real desires. They have their own set of fucks to be fucked by.

BTW: IT is the new US manufactoring sector. If that transition finalizes the economy will stabilize. Also important: all the fucking baby boomers dying so we can have a managable and creative populace again.

I agree with that. What I'm saying is we've reached (or maybe did some time ago) what appears to be critical mass. Inefficient businesses go under or are forced to adapt/merge/sell/etc. Inefficient governments and societies will too. Regardless of their size. Maybe not now or in a decade or even a century, but they do. At some point it has to be addressed (if that's still possible) and you have to take as hard a look at the inefficiencies in social/government programs/spending as businesses do on their expenditures, etc.

All empires fall, dude.

Amen. We in that stage or is it fixable? And if it's fixable are we set up to fix it or perpetuate the fall? I guess that's my question.

I don't think we're in that stage yet. Fixing it is the tough question because we rely on these fucksticks in DC to fix it. So yeah, we're fucked.

It's not bitching about social handouts. I'm fine with those when needed. It's implementing, administering and modifying them when necessary that pisses me off. It's not chasing bad programs with worse programs and and it's being responsible about giving more blood when you yourself have a sucking chest wound and need blood.

And yes, you're definitely right about the PACs and two party systems. Kill them all. $6billion + spent on the 2012 elections. Mandel spent $15m vs Sherrod Brown, almost all of it private interest bullshit.

Kill it.

Just tell me who and how it happens.

Start somewhere. Anywhere.

e0y2e3 wrote:That has nothing to do with handouts Peeker, it has far more to do with a modern two party shit-hole where the politicians are focused on getting reelected instead of running an actual gov't.

They all line the pockets of whoever will make that happen. If that money wasn't going into one pocket (maybe via handout) it would simply be shoved into another person's pocket.

There is already talk that the SuperPac's literally bought the house this time around because it was deemed the best bang for their buck in terms of spending....

Bitching about social handouts completely ignores the true problem and that is a broken ass political system where votes and elections are bought and reelection governs choices instead of accomplishment (and spare the second term president shit, because with a Republican House and a Senate that is victim to what will be endless fillibustering nothing is changing in the next four years and it would have been the same had Romney won).

As too all empires falling, the disaster that has unfolder int he EU and China over the last two years has given us hope. The Olympics were the worst thing to ever happen to the Chinese, because labor wage increases and westernization are now very real desires. They have their own set of fucks to be fucked by.

The empire will stand, but not for reasons that any of you seem to be able to discern.

"Fairy tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten." G K Chesterton

Because of something much more sublime.

"Give me your tired, your poor. . ."

It will stand precisely because of why Romney didn't win this election.

"Your huddled masses yearning to be free"

And it has nothing to do with the economy, or entitlements, or the market.

"The wretched refuse of your teeming shores. . ."

Nothing that you can graph or plot.

"Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me"

Andrew Cohen, writing in "The Atlantic" has a theory:

"If there is one thing this election has proven, if there is one thing I have come to know, it is that Americans don't like it when their right to vote is threatened. The very people whose votes the Republicans sought to suppress came out to vote. In places like Akron and Orlando and Denver and Milwaukee, they came. They waited in long lines and endured the indignities of poll workers. Yet they were not cowed. Today is their day. A day when they can look at one another and appreciate that they are truly a part of the history of civil rights in this country."

"Jacqueline Kane is a winner today. She is an elderly woman in an assisted-living facility in Pennsylvania, a beloved mother who voted first in 1952 and still remembers the day. GOP lawmakers in her state tried to take away her right to vote this year with a photo identification law that would have required her, at age 82, to take a bus and wait in a line. Her daughter stood up for her. So did thousands of other Pennsylvanians."

"You know who else is a winner today? Vietnam veteran Craig Debose, a longtime resident of South Carolina. Debose traveled 11 hours by train this summer to testify in Washington in the federal civil rights lawsuit brought against South Carolina for its restrictive photo identification law. A friendly lawyer asked him, "And why did you come all this way to tell the Court your story?" And Debose said: "So I can vote." This is a statement and a sentiment as American as any you can conceive. The Republicans cannot suppress this. Why would they even try?"

"I couldn't call Debose Tuesday night. He doesn't have a phone. Or a computer. Or a car, which is why he didn't have a driver's license, which is why South Carolina was trying to take away his right to vote. I'd like to think that Debose voted this year. And that he voted for the man who will appoint federal judges who will in turn vote to preserve our right to vote against the whims of the majority. But whether he did or he didn't, Debose's story has a happy ending. Fifty years after the war, his country had called him to serve once again. And, again, he had answered the call."

"I lift my lamp beside the golden door"

The empire will survive because of Craig Debose.

There's a statue in New York's harbor, perhaps Mitt Romney should go take a look at it sometime.

Yeah. Inspiring. Plenty of people were also "inspired" by a bus ride to the polls that promised a free sandwich on each leg of the trip.

Sorry- I'm a bit pessimistic these days.

But do let me know when we start to Craig DeBose the PACs and are ready for reform and y'all can pick me up. I'll bring the ammo and enough weapons for our truck-ful of patriots. Then I'll know enough people give enough of a fuck to actually DO something.

I also love the folks who complain about having to show something proving who you are too. You can't buy a drink in the bar or pick up fucking Browns tickets at will call without an ID but suddenly it's tyranny to require someone show one to vote.

IT is the new manufacturing base but apparently pebbles in a coffee can is how we need to vote so as not to infringe upon the rights of those who aren't wanting an ID.

I wonder if the population of Rhodesia was flown in to vote on charter flight after charter flight by the GOP if ID would be seen as a solid idea?

How about we just do retinal scans at birth, you show up when you're 18 to vote and they just read your irises? Of course, if Zeke is born on the dirt floor in rural GA and one side or other wants his vote, someone's gonna be bitching about the fairness of retinal scans and how poor Zeke gets fucked because of his circumstances. Who does the bitching will depend on who needs the vote. No sense putting Zeke on that bus and wasting a couple free sandwiches if he can't be of use.

e0y2e3 wrote:Also important: all the fucking baby boomers dying so we can have a managable and creative populace again.

Never happen. We baby boomers are gonna be around forever—and we're only praying that in 40 or 50 years all you young'uns will have accumulated enough wisdom NOT to vote for dickwads who spend more time campaigning and visiting with Leno and Whoopie than legislating.

To review history: those tired, poor huddled masses came to the U.S. in the 19th and early 20th centuries seeking nothing more than a chance to make a life with little government intervention. They weren't seeking hand-outs. Hell, they weren't even seeking hand-UPs. They built their own homes, supplied their own food. If they needed help, they depended on their churches, their extended families, and their neighbors. They became laborers and craftsmen. Some even became captains of industry. All they yearned for was "to be free" without a massive, intrusive government looking over their shoulder at every turn. And the U.S. welcomed them, just as we do today. THAT is what those words on the Statue of Liberty stand for.

e0y2e3 wrote:You do understand the unemployment is paid by companies. The more people you lay-off the more you pay, etc. This happens to try and dilute the cost because you have shit companies like Sale Jobs that have insane turnover and then you have stable companies that shouldn't be eating the cost.

I have no problem with shitty ass sales companies paying out their asses for laying people off.

That is true in normal times, the last four years have had crazy state overruns and the feds bailing out the states. 'course that money had strings which is why Ohio declined further EUC money from the feds.

Essentially its a fed/state mandated benefit you earn. Cuz otherwise you'd be paid more or the comapny would make more profit.

"When a man with money meets a man with experience, the man with experience leaves with money and the man with money leaves with experience."

You get five weeks to vote and are enticed with free stuff. Many of those enticed have never voted. People getting bussed to polling places. Once elected those people continue to give you free stuff. The whole while your life really sucks and you have no hope until they entice you with free stuff, and scare the shit outta you that other guy going to take yer rights and stuff. Freaking Obama never dismantled his machine in Ohio. Since Bush the Dem's have outsmarted the Rep's on every tactical maneuver. Had to rely on a dismal debate to even have a chance.

However, if the Republicans would drop the social issue shit, and not be afraid to communicate the common sense middle ground on them, well, I think there are still enough earners out there to win an election.

"When a man with money meets a man with experience, the man with experience leaves with money and the man with money leaves with experience."

olecowboy wrote:The empire will stand, but not for reasons that any of you seem to be able to discern.

"Fairy tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten." G K Chesterton

Because of something much more sublime.

"Give me your tired, your poor. . ."

It will stand precisely because of why Romney didn't win this election.

"Your huddled masses yearning to be free"

And it has nothing to do with the economy, or entitlements, or the market.

"The wretched refuse of your teeming shores. . ."

Nothing that you can graph or plot.

"Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me"

Andrew Cohen, writing in "The Atlantic" has a theory:

"If there is one thing this election has proven, if there is one thing I have come to know, it is that Americans don't like it when their right to vote is threatened. The very people whose votes the Republicans sought to suppress came out to vote. In places like Akron and Orlando and Denver and Milwaukee, they came. They waited in long lines and endured the indignities of poll workers. Yet they were not cowed. Today is their day. A day when they can look at one another and appreciate that they are truly a part of the history of civil rights in this country."

"Jacqueline Kane is a winner today. She is an elderly woman in an assisted-living facility in Pennsylvania, a beloved mother who voted first in 1952 and still remembers the day. GOP lawmakers in her state tried to take away her right to vote this year with a photo identification law that would have required her, at age 82, to take a bus and wait in a line. Her daughter stood up for her. So did thousands of other Pennsylvanians."

"You know who else is a winner today? Vietnam veteran Craig Debose, a longtime resident of South Carolina. Debose traveled 11 hours by train this summer to testify in Washington in the federal civil rights lawsuit brought against South Carolina for its restrictive photo identification law. A friendly lawyer asked him, "And why did you come all this way to tell the Court your story?" And Debose said: "So I can vote." This is a statement and a sentiment as American as any you can conceive. The Republicans cannot suppress this. Why would they even try?"

"I couldn't call Debose Tuesday night. He doesn't have a phone. Or a computer. Or a car, which is why he didn't have a driver's license, which is why South Carolina was trying to take away his right to vote. I'd like to think that Debose voted this year. And that he voted for the man who will appoint federal judges who will in turn vote to preserve our right to vote against the whims of the majority. But whether he did or he didn't, Debose's story has a happy ending. Fifty years after the war, his country had called him to serve once again. And, again, he had answered the call."

"I lift my lamp beside the golden door"

The empire will survive because of Craig Debose.

There's a statue in New York's harbor, perhaps Mitt Romney should go take a look at it sometime.

Well for the love of sweet baby Jesus.

Where the hell did you get kicked out of to end up here?

...and I've been calling the number on the back of my cinder block receipt for months, nobody answers.

Criminals in this town used to believe in things...honor, respect."I heard your dog is sick, so bought you this shovel"

The point isn't the masses running for change right now, nor is it claim the details regarding the former soldier and his ID (something I assume you don't know yourself, but OC probably does).

The point is that as long as somewhere in this country there still exists that fight and desire to preserve this country by the means that were fought for all those ages ago the spirit cannot be entirely killed. If all of that dies, America dies, but until then someone, somewhere is trying to keep the spirit alive.

The point isn't the masses running for change right now, nor is it claim the details regarding the former soldier and his ID (something I assume you don't know yourself, but OC probably does).

The point is that as long as somewhere in this country there still exists that fight and desire to preserve this country by the means that were fought for all those ages ago the spirit cannot be entirely killed. If all of that dies, America dies, but until then someone, somewhere is trying to keep the spirit alive.

Hence my point about calling when that truck full of patriots is ready to roll. And my ammo waiting for you guys whenever you need it. Don't tell me I missed the point when you missed that I didn't. Or maybe the overdone symbolism and metaphors weren't clear?

And yeah, the whole ID thing is about a forgotten soldier not having his. It's not about anything more than that.

As you're one of the smartest guys in the room, I can't tell if your synapses just shut down occasionally or you're being obtuse because you think you can slip by everyone else.

Or maybe 'smartest guy in the room' is extremely relative to this room. Either way, offensive and insulting.

I also love the folks who complain about having to show something proving who you are too. You can't buy a drink in the bar or pick up fucking Browns tickets at will call without an ID but suddenly it's tyranny to require someone show one to vote.

IT is the new manufacturing base but apparently pebbles in a coffee can is how we need to vote so as not to infringe upon the rights of those who aren't wanting an ID.

I wonder if the population of Rhodesia was flown in to vote on charter flight after charter flight by the GOP if ID would be seen as a solid idea?

How about we just do retinal scans at birth, you show up when you're 18 to vote and they just read your irises? Of course, if Zeke is born on the dirt floor in rural GA and one side or other wants his vote, someone's gonna be bitching about the fairness of retinal scans and how poor Zeke gets fucked because of his circumstances. Who does the bitching will depend on who needs the vote. No sense putting Zeke on that bus and wasting a couple free sandwiches if he can't be of use.

Jesus Christ.

If you really think they used sandwiches to "inspire" people to vote, you're insane.

Most of those people got a sack lunch because they were going to polling places with 4-5 hour waits.

The voter ID stuff is basic GOP bullshit to keep the elderly and poor from voting. They tried to pass that shit in PA, the problem is the GOP scumbags couldn't fine ONE SINGLE incident of voter fraud.

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:Wow, someone's in a bad mood...... go light up and relax, fucko.

I never mentioned race.

The point the voter ID laws is to solve a problem that doesn't exist.

The penalty for voter impersonation is up to 5 years in prison and a $10,000 fine. How many people are going to risk that?

Voter ID is the snuggie of political reform initiatives.

What's to stop me from going and voting as you next election? Except everyone would wonder why you were no longer a stark, raving asshole.

Fine by me. And if anyone wonders where I am, I'll be at home on the couch, watching hoarders wrapped in my snuggie. And unlike you I'll be having no trouble grabbing the TV clicker or answering the phone due to a restrictive blanket without sleeves.

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:Wow, someone's in a bad mood...... go light up and relax, fucko.

I never mentioned race.

The point the voter ID laws is to solve a problem that doesn't exist.

The penalty for voter impersonation is up to 5 years in prison and a $10,000 fine. How many people are going to risk that?

Voter ID is the snuggie of political reform initiatives.

What's to stop me from going and voting as you next election? Except everyone would wonder why you were no longer a stark, raving asshole.

Fine by me. And if anyone wonders where I am, I'll be at home on the couch, watching hoarders wrapped in my snuggie. And unlike you I'll be having no trouble grabbing the TV clicker or answering the phone due to a restrictive blanket without sleeves.

I bet you do have a Snuggie.

Honestly.... I believe it. I bet it's blue and has Joe Biden on it.

I hate you (I don't, really, because you amuse me to no end...but don't tell anyone)

This thread make me chuckle. No different than the Fox and MSNBC shows with Peeker as Hannity, OJ as Chris Wallace, and the syndicated FMB as Michael Savage.

But I only drive by to empty this banana clip on you retards who never understood in your tard-bubble what is really going on out there. This poll held :

(CNN) - The final polls are out and behind the national horserace is a fascinating dynamic – Mitt Romney is narrowly winning independent voters while President Obama is winning centrist voters by a nearly 20-point margin.For example, here in the must-win battleground state of Ohio, the final CNN/ORC poll showed Romney edging Obama among independent voters by two points, 48% to 46%. But among moderate voters, Obama is crushing Romney by 21 points – 57% to 36%.

This is significant because in past elections independents and centrist voters have been largely synonymous–overlapping cohorts, reflecting the belief of many independents that the two parties are too polarized and disproportionately dominated by their respective special interests. But what I think we're seeing this year is the extended impact of the tea party – a growth in the number of independent conservatives that has moved the overall independent voting block slightly to the right. In turn, centrist voters are more likely to vote for Obama precisely because of the polarizing impact of the tea party and the intransigence of many conservative congressmen when it came to working in a good faith spirit of principled compromise with the Obama administration.

National polls also bear this dynamic out. In the final Pew poll of this election, Romney is winning independent voters by a three point margin, 44% to 41%. But Obama is winning centrist voters by a 21-point margin – 56% to 25%.