You Knew This Was Coming

British and German tabloids are claiming that the Germanwings pilot was “tormented” about being gay. From Britain’s Daily Star, which has more than twice the circulation of the Guardian:

Lubitz’ relationship with his girlfriend is said to have broken down and it has been claimed that he was secretly homosexual. He was even taunted by pilot pals for previously being a “trolley dolly” airline steward and dubbed Tomato Andy – a derogatory gay slur. It also emerged the David Guetta fan enjoyed partying at a German nightclub which holds boozy, circus-themed events involving drag queens and dwarves. The lively Agostea club in Koblenz lies 20 minutes from the home he shared with his parents in the German town of Montabaur. The revelations came as German airline Lufthansa, which owns Germanwings, announced it would pay up to e50,000 “immediate financial assistance” to relatives of every victim of the horror crash.

Former colleagues told how Lubitz was mercilessly taunted over his cabin crew past. He was nicknamed “Tomato Andy” because they believed he didn’t know if he was a “fruit or veg” – a reference to his sexuality. One ex-workmate said it was slang term for a “straight who was really gay”. Another added: “Everyone thought it strange that he kept on going back home to his mum and dad at weekends. “He had a nice car, a good job, and good prospects, but he seemed to spend all his time by himself.” Lubitz bought two top-of-the-range Audi cars earlier this month. One was said to be a present for himself and the other for his girlfriend. Habibalah Hassani, 53, who runs a pizza restaurant near the killer pilot’s Dusseldorf home, said he had often seen him with his lover. But neighbours in Montabaur claimed she had not been seen there recently.

Rumors about the pilot’s sexuality have even been picked up by the reputable Independent:

Mass-murdering Germanwings co-pilot Andreas Lubitz had had a “serious relationship crisis” with his girlfriend, investigators told Germany’s Bild newspaper yesterday, and according to one report last night he split with her the day before the crash. An ex-girlfriend told Bild that Lubitz had once told her he wanted his name remembered and that he planned to go down in history by doing something to “change the whole system”. “People all over the world will know my name.” Other theories concerned his sexuality. There was speculation yesterday that he may have been gay and felt forced to keep it secret, after it emerged that a male friend had sent a message to Lubitz’s personal website after the crash. It read: “We were only talking yesterday about what we would do together when you came back. You always made me smile.” It was suggested to The Independent that “Tomato Andi” was a joke gay term used to describe someone who repressed their homosexuality, a tomato being commonly referred to as a vegetable despite being a fruit. In any case, it now seems certain that Lubitz had serious psychological problems which he kept secret.

Meanwhile American crackpots like Pam Geller and Jim Hoft are predictably claiming that the pilot was a recent convert to Islam.

And if the xn assholes didn’t hate us so much, IF the co-pilot was gay, he wouldn’t feel so tormented.

guest

I know a few German gay men and trust me, the culture they talk about is rather intense sexually and very supportive of others, while their society is more supportive than many other countries. (I have seen more than a few American males shrink just from hearing the intense sexual stories spoken. Ha! LOL)

I know a person can have issues, especially when religion has infested them as a youth, and I will not discount a personal demon, but he was at least in a society that would have been better to come out in than many others. That is, if this story is even true, and I doubt that.

Chucktech

That’s exactly the point I was going to make. I had always thought that other societies, especially in Europe, Germany in particular, had a healthy attitude about everything sexual, and gay people would be far less likely to be exposed to homophobia, certainly light years from what can and does happen here.

And if there is a scintilla of truth to any of this, it’s really quite the indictment of society’s fixation on sexual proclivities, not him.

TommyTune

I have no idea whether this is true or not, but it would be nice if the right-wing trolls seized on the word “torment” in that headline rather than the word “gay.” Perhaps then they would recognize that they are the ones responsible for driving some gay people to commit desperate acts of various sorts. I won’t be holding my breath waiting for that to happen, however.

Richard Rush

Exactly. The only reason anyone would be tormented by being gay is due to society’s denigration and persecution.

Gindy51

Sounds to me like he was bullied by his fellow pilots, a lot like the kids who shot up Columbine and many other of our schools were bullied by their peers.

Regan DuCasse

Yep, there is a big difference in being tormented BY being gay. And being tormented FOR being gay…or suspected of it.
Either one, has NEVER been healthy. Using anti gay sentiment AS a means of bullying, assault and mental and physical torment, whether the person is gay or not, again: what GOOD has ever come from it?

As mentioned, this has been the impetus behind school mass shootings, suicides and many broken marriages, families and abandoned children.
And yet, the religious still like to insist, this is the ‘will of God’, or there is success to be had for treating gay people this way.
I don’t think there could be any mass delusion more dangerous and destructive than anti gay and transgender bigotry.
And hiding behind God for doing it, any more morally cowardly and dishonest.

Assuming any of this is true, of course his constant harassment, degradation, & torment would have nothing to do with this.

John30013

And if these “theories” turn out to be the case, then wasn’t it the company’s responsibility to provide a safe and open work environment?

Anyone know Germanwings’ policy regarding sexual harassment in the workplace? I poked around on their website a bit but I couldn’t find anything about their employment policies or workplace protections.

GayOldLady

If he was truly teased in the way that’s been described in the press, that would have an impact on any person, regardless of sexual orientation. Still, being teased and tormented does not normally drive a person to mass murder. He could have jumped off the Golden Gate bridge and just killed himself, but he didn’t so the question becomes, why? This was an act in the same vein as Columbine and Newtown. This guy wanted to go out in a blaze of homicidal glory and that’s exactly what he did.

Dale

If it’s true what he supposedly said about his name being known worldwide then simply jumping off the GGB wouldn’t do it.

Todd20036

Using that logic, it wasn’t the passengers he wanted to hurt… it was the airline company

GayOldLady

By hurting the passengers he did hurt the airline company. It’s hard to understand the logic in such a twisted act, possibly because there is nothing logical about it.

Mark

And, for all we know – the pilot may have been one of the bullies.

shellback

“tormented about being gay”
Brought to you by religion – the fastest spreading mental illness on earth.

teeveedub

I’ve never thought of mental illness as a communicable disease, but you’ve made me rethink that.

David L. Caster

Mental instability and other psychological challenges can make an individual more susceptible to control. As they search for a steadying or comforting influence in their lives, religion is often a haven for them along with others that are weak of spirit.

vorpal

I can already see the right-wingers wringing their vile little talons together and adding his name on their list of Big Bad Mos right under Jeffrey Dahmer and Floyd Lee Corkins, completely oblivious that the problem in this case can be entirely placed squarely on them and their “morality”, and not on us.

guest

By the way, on your comments about gaming the other day, on that thread, how is gaming possible since cats do not have opposable thumbs? Ha!

The best they can do is to swat at the control.

vorpal

Oh, we make dew. (Get it? Dew claws? Har har!)

guest

Yes, I understood. Terrible pun.

Go to your corner or I will spray cold water in your face, even if you like it, as you wrote you did!

grada3784

Take them to the beach so you can celebrate Christmas early.

joseliafcfs

Did you actually read their “evidence” for him being gay? He was not tormented for being gay – over religion or otherwise – because he was not gay. Being held in high esteem by one’s male friends has nothing to do with gayness.

Ray Taylor

He was tormented by being called “Tomato Andy” by his co-workers. which may have come from straight and gay alike.

Gay Fordham Prep Grad

If true, Germanwings must be one fukced up airline. In what business would you have “professional” adults teasing other adults about things like that?

joseliafcfs

That sounds naive of you. I don’t buy that he was called that, let alone that it has the meaning ascribed to it by British tabloids and that Lubitz was disturbed by it.

Sashineb

And you can imagine how much the fuckwit fundies are loving this, as they carry on about more proof of how sick gays are. I’m sure Bryan Fischer and Pat Robertson are busy making videos about it.

Ore Carmi

Got it. He was a gay Muslim Nazi. And Obama asked him to crash the plane.

geoffalnutt

No, ORDERED him to.

Dagoril

No no, Obama crashed the plane himself from afar with his Orbital Mind-Control Lasers. Or perhaps with his Insidious Mind-Control Powers.

In any case, we should do more fracking for oil, and we should bomb Iran!

Eebadee-eebadee-thatsallfolks

Starts with a B. Ends with an i. Eight letters. Come on, we got this boys and girls….

This isn’t much better than what CNN has descended too lately. I forgot how indecently cable news treats tragedy, but I have now gone almost a year without cable and then last week saw a half hour of coverage if this event on CNN and I was disgusted. The wording, the discussions and the images are obviously intended to be as lurid and grisly as possible. No thanks. And of course the endless speculation by people who know nothing at all about what happened, and how they as the investigation is still ongoing. Of course that impression is colored by my viewing of Nightcrawler the week before, but it just made me aware of how depraved our culture has become that this is our “entertainment.” Shame on everyone watching the disaster-porn.

Larry Ft Pierce

remember CNN in the Nineties?

Octavio

You mean before Ted Turner merged it with Time Warner, whereupon he was kicked to the sidewalk? Yes. At one time CNN was a respectable news outlet. Those days are long gone.

Ragnar Lothbrok

Free speech TV is a great alternative.

canoebum

Ironically, Al Jazeera has filled that space. Their format, which focuses on actual reporting, investigative documentaries, and restrains speculation and crass titilation, is the closest thing to an actual straight news channel on cable.

Larry Ft Pierce

yes, I have noticed.

TommyTune

Get Jon Stewart started on what HE thinks about CNN. It’s pretty much what you just described.

NeverEclipsed81

yeah i did know it was coming, although I believe he was straight and people claim he had a girlfriend.. I also knew the “depressed” stuff was coming.. as someone who has been depressed nearly my whole life, it bothers me that people don’t make a clear distinction between depressed, and mass murderer. There is a huge difference. He was psychotic, that takes more than depression. I feel bad for pilots who suffer from depression, because now it just got a lot harder for them.

goofy_joe

So a comment by a male friend, saying he always smiled around him…and a sad past of being adult-bullied by colleagues and all of the sudden he’s gay?

There has been too much quick information coming out about this guy. Let’s let the investigation run it’s course before jumping to so many conclusions. The attention span of people is shockingly shorter and shorter.

Chucktech

What about that picture of him at the Golden Gate bridge, eh?? There’s your proof he’s a ‘mo!!

Absolutely! Never been a breeder within photo shooting distance of that bridge. Ever.

Hue-Man

Only gays drive on the bridge because straights can’t afford to drive. What did that bogus survey say about gays in San Francisco? Something less than 5%? Sometimes the stupidity is overwhelming.

goofy_joe

Touche, good sir!

Ragnar Lothbrok

I heard he had a pet cat too. You know what that means…

Bad Tom

He liked cats?

Polterguest

he was a closeted lesbian?

CanuckDon

He had a couch with torn arms?
He was constantly stepping on cat toys?
He was some animal’s bitch?

Eebadee-eebadee-thatsallfolks

The last one fer shur

SJWinCMH

He was into pussy?

Cuberly

And guess what. On WND and FR they’re already linking/posting photoshopped dreck of that pic. And yep, it’s all screamingly homophobic.

Chucktech

Huh?? I’d rather not sully my browser by going there, but what did they photoshop into it?

Cuberly

I’d have to retrace my browsing steps yesterday to link to the images but one was the SF image of the co-pilot with “fag murderer” in big letters on it. Another one was “murderer” with a rainbow colored font.

The FR comments linked to an article on Gateway Pundit, claiming the co-pilot had recently converted to Islam. The rainbow font “murderer” was in a link in the comments.

The Islamophobia over at GWP is jaw dropping.

Ragnar Lothbrok

Tomato Andy ?

oikos

Yeah , I was wondering about that too. Never heard that one.

oikos

From urban dictionary:

tomato

A term used to describe someone who is denial of his
homosexuality…because even though you think a tomato is a vegetable,
it’s really a “fruit”

What a tomato, he definitely likes guys

Ragnar Lothbrok

Must be a European thing…

oikos

My thoughts as well. Murricans aren’t bright enough to know if a tomato is veggie or fruit.

Ragnar Lothbrok

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit.
Wisdom is knowing not to put it in a fruit salad.

oikos

Well said!

BobSF_94117

If you really wanna mess with people. put ripe plums in a tossed salad.

Octavio

Sounds like a Sunset Magazine fusion thing — plums with greens. Don’t forget the orange sections and a raspberry vinaigrette dressing with a side of balsmic and herbs for dipping the crusty artesnel bread 🙂

Thanks, Daily star. Now the irrational hateful “christians” will be blaming every plane crash on the evil homosexual agenda.

Schlukitz

“Now”?

Haven’t they been blaming us for just about everything else under the sun?

Why should plane crashes be excluded?

GayOldLady

What this guy did has no more to do with his sexual orientation than the color of his skin. Let’s face it, this guy’s mental issues, like most mass murderers, and we’ve seen many of them in this country, is what drove him to this. If it turns out this guy is a straight Christian, that will never be considered as the reason by those who want to blame this atrocity on gays. I’m so sick of this blame the gays I could scream. !!!!!!!!!!

Ragnar Lothbrok

Go ahead and scream. You will feel much better, but you might scare the cat.

GayOldLady

I might scare both cats, and the dog! 🙂

vorpal

=yowl=

Alex in Idaho

Mrowr!

KCMC

Indeed. depression can be complicated and very personal.
More than one antidepressant clearly warns side effects can include increased risk of suicidal tendencies.

MythicalBeast

Exactly. Mental illness knows no boundaries of “orientation.” For the sleazy tabloids to hype this up is pure homophobia whether they intend it consciously or not.

Steverino

Yeah, one can see the gay / muslim guilt-by-association blame game coming from a mile away. Expect the usual rogue’s gallery of christianist grifters to capitalize on this tragedy.

Mark

If he was already struggling with “mental illness” – then the folks who doled out the ridicule have a bloody hand in this senseless tragedy.

Americanish

Says the child psychologist.

BTW what are the chances that you are fat?

GayOldLady

“BTW what are the chances that you are fat?”
Says the gay hater. And now you’re interested in my body type? Hmmmm!!! The chance that my body type is fat is zero. Why are you such a pervert, Pete? What’s your last name, Pete? Does it begin with an L?

Americanish

Just looking into causation why you are a lesbian. Just something I saw in college and that government studies confirm.

but hey what would you care if someone used conditional probabilities?

GayOldLady

Pete, you’re one angry man. Do you want to believe that I’m a lesbian because I’m overweight and ugly? What’s next? Will you want a photo to prove that I’m not? Pete, you are a seriously sick and obsessed homophobe, otherwise you wouldn’t continue to comment here. And what’s your last name Pete? Does it begin with an “L”?

Americanish

Obsessed? No, I just know human psychology.

GayOldLady

No, you’re just obsessed to the point where you can’t stay away from the gay. OCBD?

GayOldLady

Does your last name begin with an “L”, Pete?

Americanish

I don’t get the reference. I don;t live in your world and there is really no point to do so.

Obama is doing such a bang up job. He stokes the flames a little more and he can get a regional war to go global

You did vote for Obozo did you not?

GayOldLady

You’re choosing to live in my world right now, Pete. I know you have the hots for Joe and probably men in general, otherwise you wouldn’t keep cruising this blog.

Pete, does you’re last name begin with “L”?

Americanish

Really?

For one joe is a user as proven by his worst sex ever series.

GayOldLady

I don’t know anything about Joe’s sex life, but your use of the word “user” could describe most straight men at some point in their life. So, what’s your point? You’re just here cruising, Pete. Don’t deny it.
And, please, stop trying to pretend that you’re some moral superior specimen, when you are nothing of the sort. You slither in here and you slither out. Snake!!!!!
So, why don’t you come over to an active thread and comment? Don’t want the “gay” to jump on you?
And Pete, does your last name begin with “L”.

Americanish

“I don’t know anything about Joe’s sex life” – GayOldLady

He posts is sex life on his blog. It used to be on the left side of the blog posts. It was tiled “Worst Sex Ever”. He actually went on tour using it as material for a stage show.

Just google “Worst Sex Ever” and you might find it (But I think a challenged person such as yourself will have problems finding it). Joe might have been embarrassed but he never seemed to pass it up.

Americanish

You did not reply to my question if you voted for Obozo.

I guess you want to take massive drugs of your choice before you answer that one honestly.

GayOldLady

Of course I voted for Obama. And I will vote for Hillary if she gets the nomination.
Who did you vote for RMoney/LyinRyan, McCan’t/Palin.
And so, Pete, does your last name start with an “L”?

Americanish

Hillary? Mrs Transparency? The one who wiped every email off her private server used for government work?

You want someone in the mold of FDR? He tried his hand at monetary policy and failed. He was trying to manipulate the price of gold and money (Read “The Forgotten Man”). He sent 3 different people at different times to a conference on trade and monetary policy and gave them each contradictory instructions. The other nations were appalled. the conference broke up without action. FDR did not know what to do. He just stirred the pot hoping for a good outcome.

When SCOTUs slapped down his NRA, he hit upon the idea of identity politics and we have been in that shathole ever since.

FDR’s NRA defeat at SCOTUS actually boosted the stock market. It had been hitting potholes ever since he was elected. FDR was saved not be his dabbling at monetary policy but by Hitler scaring people. Wealth fled (gold) Europe and ended up in NYC. The money drought (literally a drought; people used scrip money) ended when the money supply doubled. But it did not end though FDR’s efforts. It ended in spite of him.

Democrat politicians since FDR have been using the same playbook.

And they mostly get law degrees ans eschew economics degrees. A good leader should have both plus a knowledge of military science. Economics is just applied psychology.

Liberals generally like the humanities like psychology. I guess it is the “applied” part that has them ignoring economics. All that math. that is too hard when you can play whack a mole and blame others.

How could Romney and McCain do worse than Obama in the Middle East? Obama is literally trying to give away the store in his negotiations with Iran.

And you obviously don’t know many gay people or you’d know that Lesbians and gay men, like straight men and women, are both beautiful and homely, thin and fat, muscular and frail, tall, short and everything in between. Get over it, Pete!

Americanish

“It is now well-established that women of minority sexual orientation are disproportionately affected by the obesity epidemic, with nearly three-quarters of adult lesbians overweight or obese, compared to half of heterosexual women”

I did see a good looking lesbian. I would have asked her out but she was too b_tt hurt about being cornholed by every gay guy she had slept with.

GayOldLady

“did see a good looking lesbian. I would have asked her out but she was too b_tt hurt about being cornholed by every gay guy she had slept with.”
Hmmmm! Oh, Pete, how do you know, were you watching? Awww, you’re just jealous because a “good looking lesbian” picked a “gay guy” over you. Who wouldn’t?

And who cares, other than the haters, whether or even if obesity is higher among lesbians? Is your wife an obese lesbian, Pete? Is that why you’re all stressed out over it? And in case you didn’t know obesity among gay men is lower than the general population. What does that mean? In my opinion, nothing. Or are you a “fat”, “plain” straight man who’s jealous of the muscular, handsome gay man? You’re getting too easy to read, Pete.
And what’s your last name Pete? Does it begin with an “L”.?

Americanish

Cuz the lesbian shouted it out in the student union.

I can shut my eyes but I cannot shut my ears.

Muscular gays are like a lot of people that are freaks, geeks and 90 lb weaklings in high school. If they survive that, they get some backbone get into overdrive and become fit or otherwise excel.

GayOldLady

“Cuz the lesbian shouted it out in the student union.”
All of your references to college proves one thing, you’re not as old as you have attempted to make yourself out to be. College is not a point of reference for middle aged adults. And most mature adults did not go to college at a time when a lesbian would have “shouted it out” anywhere, much less shouted it out “in the student union”. Keep talking, Pete.
So, Pete, does your last name begin with “L”?

Americanish

“College is not a point of reference for middle aged adult”

It is a point of reference, if it is the 1st time I met people who were gay and I knew they were gay, because they were upfront about it.

GayOldLady

So, when did you graduate, Pete? Not many people were out of the closet in College even 20 years ago. And those who were wouldn’t have “shouted it out” at “student union”. You’re conversing with an Old Lesbian here, Pete. I’ve been out of the closet since the early 70’s. So, how old are you? 30? 35?

Americanish

“Not many people were out of the closet in College even 20 years ago. And those who were wouldn’t have “shouted it out” at “student union””

Actually about 20 or 30 were. they had an office in the student union.

And you are fishing.

The story is true.

GayOldLady

Of course it’s true, Pete! And I don’t have to fish, Pete, you can’t resist talking about yourself. Why don’t you come on over to an active thread and troll? You don’t want the gays and lesbians to know you’re cruising gay blogs again?

And Pete, does your last name begin with an “L”?

Americanish

I found the story I was interested in. The one that discussed Tomato Andy. I found the most recent blogpost on that story and it was a day old or less. So it was current.

The way I feel about that story is the same way I feel about Adam Lanza. Society is wondering “Woe is me , why did this happen?”, when they caused it.

Now 2 wrongs do not make a right, but you are as dumb as the rest of them. You refuse to see the truth.

So here is a summary. The story upset me. I assumed that the blog and blog followers would be just as stupid as so many straights. I was not disappointed. So no I was not cruising. I chose to respond to you because of post ‘geography’, plus responding to you is the same difference as responding to many of the others. You are just blind.

GayOldLady

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You are rambling, Pete. You are blaming “society” for a sick man who killed himself and 150 innocent people? You’re warped, Pete, not to mention your comments are incoherent. And when you comment on a thread that’s 24-72 hours old th you do it because you are afraid to jump into a thread where you have to really mix it up!

Now if you want to talk to me, come on into a current thread, or take your stupid comments to mama! I’m not commenting to you on old threads any longer.

Goodbye Pete L

Americanish

The story was posted Saturday. I replied to it on Monday after I read the DM article.

Sorry but reading JMG is not my favorite thing to do on a weekend.

I read the DM article and wondered what will JMG’s take be on it. You guys did not disappoint.

it could be world news that the world would end tomorrow and the headline at JMG would be “World to End Tomorrow: Gays affected Most!”

There is a current thread talking about Andy Lubitz? Nah, the current threads will more likely be about Gov Pence. Funny thing is that the Indiana law is the same or watered down form of the same law 20 other states have. It is modeled after the law the Bubba Clinton (and Al Gore supported) signed into law in 1993.

GayOldLady

And by the way pete, the co-pilot, was he a heterosexual? It appears he was, but I don’t believe that heterosexuality had anything to do with his horrible actions and neither does anyone else. It’s also likely he was Christian, but Christianity isn’t to blame either. But, if he had been a homosexual man you and the other haters would have been blaming it on “the gays”, because that’s what you do! The man had serious emotional problems. You don’t have to be a psychologist or a psychiatrist to know that his actions were not that of a sane person. His actions had nothing to do with his sexual orientation or his religion, it had to do with his twisted perception of reality. That sounds a lot like you, pete.

Blake Jordan

At most, all this does is shift the blame to those who tormented him, assuming this is not complete bullshit.

IN A WORLD….where it’s better to be a dead mass-murderer than be compared to a tomato….

Dean

I’m surprised they didn’t come up with this story 5 minutes after the crash.

Lawerence Collins

Reliigious bigots are none to quick

Lawerence Collins

Fuck! Fuck! Fuck! I knew this was going to happen. When they first said it was intentional.
Organized religion strikes again. If this is true. You know scapegoats are in fashion.
Dolce & Gabbanna. Are devoting an entire collection of them.

Hip Byroads

What I want to know is what kind of drugs he was on. It was reported early on that he had been receiving medication for depression, but this angle seems to have been dropped. It is, however, the angle I would explore. What kind of drugs was he on? What kind of adverse reactions?

Bj Lincoln

You make a very good point. If he were just starting an anti-depressant or suddenly stopped taking them, he could have been a suicidal. Many phyic drugs have opposite effects or will send a person farther down than they were if stopped.

Eebadee-eebadee-thatsallfolks

This is an ever-so-touchy subject. I know people who seemed very normal to me, alert and functioning, who became suicidal or became unemployable zombies after taking prescribed supposed “anti-depressants”. But if you point that out, some people tend to get very angry.

Just some of what is known:
–Elliott Rodgers, who went on the murder spree in Santa Barbara, was on anti-depressants.
–Specialist Ivan Lopez, who committed one of the mass shootings at Fort Hood, was on anti-depressants.
–Aaron Alexis, who shot 16 at the Washington Navy yard, was on antidepressants.
–Scott DeKraai, who shot up the whole hair salon in Seal Beach, CA where his wife worked, was on antidepressants.
–Doug Williams, who killed 5 and wounded 9 of his Lockheed-Martin co-workers in Meridian, FL was on antidepressants.

And this list goes on and on and on and on….. It’s way past time that there was an open discussion about this. But the manufacturers of of Prozac, Xanax, Ambien, Valium, Zoloft, Celexa, etc. will probably not allow that.

i have very strong, negative feelings about many antidepressants and downers given to people these days. it seems like so many people are on them, and i don’t perceive a huge increase in the national happiness level as a result.

but i will say that in my experience with people who are on them, when they come off them is a very delicate time. a patient of mine went off them and it was horrifying to watch the ups and downs before he finally settled into ‘normal.’

the brain damage side effects of some of these drugs is also rarely discussed.

Eebadee-eebadee-thatsallfolks

Wow. I was looking around the internet about this after I replied to Bj’s comment, and it is way worse than I even suspected. At least 35 school shootings alone, that killed 79 and wounded 169 are known to have involved the antidepressants and/or anti-anxiety meds. It’s “at least” because in some cases the shooters’ medical files are sealed.

If that story is accurate, there are people in the anti-gay industry who have the blood of 150 people on their hands. Definitely including, though not limited to, those of the pious variety who urge fellow bigots to discriminate and abuse “with love.”

JalapeñoBusiness

If this is true, then anti gay animus, hatred, bullying and bigotry just killed 150 people.

So, his flight training was “interrupted” for six months due to a medical/psychological reason. He had a rocky relationship with his girlfriend who was an older woman and might have just split with her. May have developed some vision problems that might be going to affect his career. He had been to local hospitals/doctors repeatedly in the past few months for some unknown medical or psychological condition. He was upset that he wasn’t being assigned to long haul routes by his employer. But the reason he did this has to be because he was reported, by some sources, to be gay. Yep, relationship issues, medical and psychological problems, career dissatisfaction and who knows what else had NO role to play. That’s good to know.

LovesIrony

From the Michigan brief:

43 Michigan’s longstanding marriage definition is not based in animus toward same-sex couples or individuals who experience same-sex attraction. Every human life has inherent dignity and is of immense worth. Michigan, through its laws, encourages all people to treat each other with respect
Sounds just like the child raping Catholic Church. Which should not be a reason for denying equal protection.

When innocent women, men, children and babies are murdered, more often than not there’s one common characteristic among the psychopaths who commit such acts and it certainly isn’t sexual orientation. I’d still prefer to take my chances on a flight with a “tormented” gay pilot than a deeply religious (all religions) pilot any time.

Well, since his Mom was the organist in the local Protestant church near the town center, I think we can dismiss the Muslim connection.

joseliafcfs

In the comments section of the so-called reputable Independent, a reader, “Sabimalu”, makes clear that what is in the article is not the German press is reporting.

Ragnar Lothbrok

Rhonda, I’m not going to flag you for your spam, but for being a very inefficient whore. Practice baby practice !

Steven Leahy

Well you could look at this another way: assuming any of this is true, and there is no concrete evidence that it is, just another reason to encourage LGBT people to be 100% true to themselves by eliminating shame and extending full legal and social equality. Then you wouldn’t have people who hate themselves doing crazy things out of hopelessness.

BearEyes

that makes too much sense.

Claude Jacques Bonhomme

Bingo! The closet, discrimination and bullying are sources of torment, not being gay.

Bj Lincoln

The guy had a ton of issues and was more then likely on meds. If he messed with his meds or they were new with bad side effects, he could have been in a very bad depression. The list of issues may include being gay but it is NOT the main reason the man did this.

s2dbaker

Dwarfs are totally gay!

JalapeñoBusiness

SMH

MBear

Sorry, no gays allowed on international flights.

“How do you tell if someone is gay”
TSA: “We pull out our dicks – yeah, we haven’t found a gay yet”
…cuz everyone goes “EWWW” to TSA dick

Eebadee-eebadee-thatsallfolks

Generally true, but I did once see a total hottie working for TSA. Once. I think he was in the Las Vegas McCarran airport, but I can’t remember for sure.

I had a very early morning flight a few years ago and I think the TSA agents must have been bored with only a couple of people going through security because they gave me the full treatment, body scan, chemical test and then a pat down by a very hot guy. As his hands moved down my back I had to bite my tongue to keep from saying “keep going, lower lower” I think I did inadvertently kind of moan “mmmmm” quietly when he first put his hands on me…
If I had seen his dick the last thing I would have said would be “ewww”

Ninja0980

The only torment I’ve ever felt about being gay was from people telling me I was going to burn in hell solely because of who I am.

When I read that a plane full of 150 people goes down and that over 150 men, women and children are killed, the first thing I think of is the horror those people must have felt. Then I think of the poor families. Strange how I never consider in what ways I can manipulate a tragedy to demonize gay people.
Religion does not equal morality, as they’ve proved yet again.

JalapeñoBusiness

My takeaway from the news reports is that many of them didn’t know death was imminent, and the ones screaming were the ones near the front who were alarmed by the pilot trying to bash the cockpit door in with an ax.

Joseph Miceli

Well, we can only hope. Thanks for that. I think that if death was immanent and unavoidable, I’d like to not know it.

JalapeñoBusiness

me too

Ireyon

It’s moments like these that make me glad I’m able to speak german.

“Fruit” as an insult for gay men is an english expression. No german would ever use the term “Frucht” (fruit) as an insult. The closest one gets would be “Fruechtchen” but that is used to denote a particularily mischievous child. There are also no insults involving vegetables for sexual orientation. The only context in which vegetables are employed are height jokes “Bohnenstange” (beanstalk) and “Spargeltarzan” (Asparagus tarzan).

German insults would be “Schwuler” (basically calling someone gay), “Homo” (…), “Schwuchtel” (even more derogatory term for Schwuler), “Schwanzlutscher” (cocksucker) and very rarely “Warmer Bruder” (warm brother, the german version of the archaic “Mary-Ann”). Also, german gays prefer the more medical term of “Homosexueller” (homosexual) instead of any equivalent to “gay”, though they’ve started to co-opt than term as a loanword. (Maybe germans don’t equate “sounds scientific” with “sounds dangerous” ?)

The man was german, as were his collegues and his company. I doubt that they would use english to insult him, even if they were all fluent in the language. The reason why he was called “Tomaten-Andi” was because Germanwings serves tomato juice during the flight and he started out as a flight attendant. It’s likely a teasing nickname because he started out as a glorified stewardess.

*Play “the more you know” theme here*

WNY

..

Bad Tom

Thank you very much for the illumination.

StevenMN

As sidebar trivia, English is the standard and required language for international flights. Air traffic controllers on the ground as well as airline pilots are mandated to speak it worldwide.

That aside, thanks for your analysis.

Schlukitz

Ja ja. Das ist so.

“The International Civil Aviation Organisation has decreed that from 1 January 2008 all Air Traffic Controllers and Flight Crew Members engaged in or in contact with international flights must be proficient in the English language as a general spoken medium and not simply have a proficiency in standard ICAO Radio Telephony Phraseology.”

True, though I think they would’ve insulted him in german regardless. There’s a difference being able to speak a language and actually grasp it. Jokes, sarcasm and insults are infamously difficult to translate across languages and culture lines.

German grammar alone is a complete nightmare. The have many more definite and indefinite articles than english. English only has “the” as definite article. Germans have “der, die, das” for male, female and genderless. “Die” also doubles as the plural. Germans also assign genders to objects, so rain is male (the rain —> der Regen) while a car is genderless (the car —-> das Auto).

There have been whole books about the ridiculous confusions of the german language. Their neighbours, the french do something similar in their grammar.

Schlukitz

My father and his entire side of the family were born in Germany. I was born in America.

As someone who has been trying to learn to speak German for most of my life and my ability to do so is still sehr schlecht, I can certainly relate to the incongruities of the German language.

The German language is no picknicken, das ist sicher. 🙂

Baltimatt

But if you call a car a Wagen, it’s masculine. “Der” also serves as the feminine singular and plural genitive pronoun and feminine singular dative pronoun.

All that inflection allows you to do interesting things with word order. Den Mann beißt der Hund has the opposite meaning of Der Mann beißt den Hund.

(Dog bites man vs. man bites dog)

Had to change back to the US English keyboard to get the angle brackets for the italics, as my American keyboard is missing the key to make .

Robert W. Pierce

Then there is also the declension of definite articles, nouns, prepositions governing the nominative, accusative, dative, genitive to contend with, similar to Latin except there is no ablative. It’s a fascinating language and the mother of English, Dutch, Norwegian, Swedish, Danish….

Robincho

You’ve got “zu dem Haus” meaning the same thing as “zum Hause.” But if you have more than one house, it’s “zu den Häusern.” It’s entirely as senseless as English, and it’s a wonder any of us can speak to each other in any language…

Larry Ft Pierce

I couldn’t read all of that, but I think I should say “thank you.”

William

Every time I fly my German friend tells me to ‘enjoy the tomato juice’. I figured it was a DDR thing. I have flown on Germanwings, but usually buy a beer.

KaBoomBOX

This would normally be true, but as a pilot, his co-workers and fellow pilots would all speak English on the job.

Ireyon

Being able to speak english doesn’t mean that they also understand that “fruit” can be insulting to a gay person, even less to come up with the tomato => fruit joke. If for some arbitrary reason they felt the need to insult him in english instead of their native language, they’d take a german expression and try to translate it into english, likely mangling it in the process.

sach2

Thank you so much for this detailed analysis. It puts things in perspective. I appreciate it. 🙂

Yalma Cuder-Zicci

He “may have been gay” because a male friend had been looking forward to seeing him, and he made that friend smile? I thought they might have speculated because of the Golden Gate Bridge, but smiling?

Bad Tom

Pretty thin.

grada3784

The torment this guy faced was not secret; it was quite blatant: the continual harassment by his co-workers.

We shouldn’t be shocked by this should we?
9/11, and the Boston bombing are just two acts of terrorism and murder that have been blamed on the growing acceptance of LGBT people and rights.
It was only a matter of time before it happened here.

Dead Men Don’t Rebut

Well, everybody knows the older Tsarnov brother was gay. (Especially since he’s dead and can’t contradict that. And pay no attention to his wife and daughter.)

C: I’m just saying that it if people think critically about it then it would be a smear of the anti-gay ideology

Ginger Snap

It always amazes me that people buy and read crap rags like this. Think of the scum of the earth employees that work there and all rag reporters. They must just laugh it up about tragedies like this.

Gregory In Seattle

So… his relationship with a woman was on the rocks, therefore he was gay? I have some divorced friends — and their current wives, girlfriends and mistresses — who will be very surprised to learn that’s how it works.

Ore Carmi

So that’s why I can’t find a boyfriend: First I have to fail with a woman.

TKW

A gay muslim abortionist. Got it. Probably a democrat too..even though he isn’t a U.S. citizen.

Doctor Who What Where

I figured that angle might be used as well. Mental illness, not sexual orientation, is the issue. Case closed.

The RWNJ better sit up and take notice. Keep up your tormenting, denigrating rhetoric – and you too could find yourself splattered down a mountain valley. We are everywhere.

We’re not machines and we’re not immune to the hurt brought about by your beliefs in a centuries old story book. You can live by it if you want. But when you shove that shit down our throats day and day after day, call us sick and perverted and disgusting and abominations – well, did you NOT think that sooner or later somebody was gonna flip out?? Are you really THAT fucking ignorant and oblivious to the feelings of others???

Think about it.

noni

So True.
I use to have a live and let live attitude toward Christians.
Absolutely not anymore. They are all evil until proven otherwise.
Look at those hideous nuns standing with Pence in the signing picture to make it legal to harass and discriminate toward gay people.
These are the Christians we are told are loving and all that. Really?
We’re not stupid. They are evil.

Yup. IN A WORLD…..where being a dead mass-murderer is far preferable to being called a tomato…

Baby_Raptor

Of course. He’s the Evil Other so we have to project all the things we hate on them.

If having a relationship problem turned everyone homosexual humanity would have died out LONG ago.

Ore Carmi

Or let’s just say, we wouldn’t be in the cauldron we’re in today.

MSW

Homophobes and the ‘religious’ create the atmosphere where someone who may be dealing with being gay would rather be dead however taking 149 innocents with you is something else.

Baltimatt

According to a Pew Study, Germany is the second most gay-friendly country based on moral attitudes of people, only behind Spain. 8% of Germans consider homosexuality morally unacceptable, 51% morally acceptable, and 38% not a moral issue. Ghana is the worst.

This just means that you better watch what you call your pilot, driver, nurse, physician, etc. You never know…those ‘blood thirsty’ gays may just decide to take you out!

SJWinCMH

I have a friend who is African-American will say when watching the local news about some crime being reported ‘Please don’t be black, please don’t be black’. We laugh about it, almost with a sense of relief, when the suspect is white or something other than black.
I felt the exact same way when this when suicidal-homicidal co-pilot thing started. ‘Please don’t be gay, please don’t be gay’…

stanhope

Doll here them tell it everybody that has ever done anything horrid is a homosexual. I’d be up for helping to reform that Boston bomber boy. 🙂 Can I put his angle bracelet tracking on my iPad?

danolgb

I don’t buy the gay rumors at all. From LA Times:

The German newspaper Bild spoke to the young woman, identified only as Maria W, 26, and said she dated Lubitz for five months in 2014 during which time he said: “One day I will do something that will change the whole system and then everyone will know my name and remember it.

“I never knew what he meant, but now it makes sense,” the woman was quoted as saying.

She revealed that the pilot had suffered nightmares and that their relationship ended because his behavior scared her.

“At night, he would wake up and scream: ‘We’re going down!’”

She said if Lubitz did indeed deliberately bring down the plane, “it is because he understood that because of his health problems, his big dream of a job at Lufthansa as captain and as a long-haul pilot was practically impossible.”

I don’t mean to make light of the subject, but I’m going to start working “dolly trolly” into any conversation that I can.

JCF

Totes knew it was coming (what took so long?)

westcoast88

Obviously this happened to show God’s wrath against gays and Muslims.

Yeek

Gay, straight, or other the guy is clearly a loser. His self-pity outweighed any decent human feeling for any living thing. He betrayed his parents, the friends and teachers who supported his dream, the instructors who trained him, the doctors and co-workers who tried so hard to help him, and most of all the people he massacred and their loved ones. Sure, anguish over conflicted sexuality may be one of his ‘reasons,’ but in the end he just wanted an excuse to hurt people.

was once

The moment I heard “tomato Andy”, I thought that the pilot locked out might have part of the name calling. If he was sensitive/closeted and still on the line because pilots in general are very hetero/ macho gang, and german country culture is very anti-gay not allowing him to be ok..it all plays on the mind. But we know will never know, and it will be another name to be called when you don’t fit in.