Monday, July 20, 2009

On my question the other day ref the birth certificate question,

I maybe should have phrased it differently:If it turned out to be true that he's not legally qualified to be President, do we do what the law and right demands, or go with the "It would cause too much disruption!" argument and let him stay in?

Messy as hell either way. If we hold to the law, it meansHe's out of office, immediately.EVERY law, act, executive order, ANYTHING signed into effect by him is void.Every appointee to any position is out.And, of course, we'd wind up with Biden in the Oval Office(there's a nightmare for you).

If we don't do the above?EVERYthing he's done or would do in the future is tainted. This is not something Congress could throw a quick law through to get over(and who would sign it?); we're talking having to actually amend the Constitution to change that. And God, wouldn't there be a mess while you were trying to do it? And lawsuits on everything in sight. Because "He was not a valid President when he signed/appointed/whatever.", and rightly so.

So the question, better put, is "Would you favor follow the law and let the chips fall, or somehow letting him stay in the office(IF a legal way could be found) so as to minimize disruption?(it wouldn't, the disruption might actually be worse, but that would be the argument)

I disagree that we'd end up with Biden in office. But that's because, as I stated before, the entire electoral process would be null and void. I don't know that SCOTUS would hold such an opinion, and I think that that's where the question would wind up.

However, here's an interesting thought. We elected electors, not a president. I wonder about the possibility of reconvening the electoral college. I'm not sure how a slate of candidates would be presented to them.

But yes, we do what the law demands, no matter how messy. The main problem with this is that there are things which simply cannot be undone. Or perhaps I'm wrong about that, but how, e.g., do you return GM to it's pre-breakup state? Also, the solution proposed in comments to your prior post about Congress simply re-authorizing past bills raises ex-post-facto problems.

Tangental to this is the observation that if the damn feddies didn't have their fingers in every damn pie under the sun, and instead restricted their activities to those enumerated, this wouldn't be such a large problem to fix.

Obama/Biden are out of office, and there is no line of succession to deal with. It would be as if we had voted for "None of the Above" and they won.

While we cannot undo what has already been done, we can immediately stop doing anything else under the laws, regulations and fiats issued. Congress effectively has its hands tied as there is nobody to sign legislation into law. If there is a budget issue that really needs to be funded, give out IOUs till the next time we have a genuine POTUS - if Cali can do it surely the USA can do it too.

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at elmtreeforge at att point net

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their consciences. - C.S. Lewis

Y'all got on this boat for different reasons, but y'all come to the same place. So now I'm asking more of you than I have before. Maybe all. Sure as I know anything, I know this - they will try again. Maybe on another world, maybe on this very ground swept clean. A year from now, ten? They'll swing back to the belief that they can make people... better. And I do not hold to that. So no more runnin'. I aim to misbehave. - Capt. Mal

A Rifleman’s Prayer:Oh Lord, I would live my life in freedom, peace and happiness, enjoying the simple pleasures of hearth and home. I would die an old, old man in my own bed, preferably of sexual overexertion.

But if that is not to be, Lord, if monsters such as this should find their way to my little corner of the world on my watch, then help me to sweep those bastards from the ramparts, because doing that is good, and right, and just.

And if in this I should fall, let me be found atop a pile of brass, behind the wall I made of their corpses. Geek with a .45

"He's Black Council,", I said.

"Or maybe stupid," Ebenezar countered.

I thought about it. "Not sure which is scarier."

Ebenezar blinked at me, then snorted. "Stupid, Hoss. Every time. Only so many blackhearted villains in the world, and they only get uppity on occasion. Stupid's everywhere, every day." Ebenezar McCoy

“A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition” ― Rudyard Kipling

This deprecation of individual freedom was objectionable to me. I am convinced now, as I was then, that man is an end because he is a child of God. Man is not made for the state; the state is made for man. To deprive man of freedom is to relegate him to the status of a thing, rather than elevate him to the status of a person. Man must never be treated as means to the end of the state; but always as an end within himself." Dr. M.L. King Jr.