Love them hate them or indifferent , they are a clothing company , I understand that there are passionate people as this is a very passionate sport .... but at the end of the day ... it is only clothing guys Vote with your wallet is always the best policy

Rapha has really found a niche for themselves on the market. Chapeau!That said the wool stuff and the everyday city riding stuff which can be used as casualwear is their force.You cant compare them to Assos or Castelli. Were talking fashion garments and old school wool garments as opposed to highly technical garments. Each to his own and Rapha has wisely decided to top off their image with stellar customer service.

I think you're being a little unfair. Rapha may produce will based jerseys but there is nothing untechnical about their kit. The team don't have stuff that is not available to the public, nor is it made by another company. Their Softshell jacket is one of the best rated on the market, before you take into account their customer service. I have both that jacket and the Assos 851. If anything the Rapha jacket is better than the Assos and is no more expensive than the 851 and way cheaper than its replacement.

I have both too and the Assos is way way warmer. The Rapha looks better...

Would I be right in thinking that the cold in your neck of the woods is dry continental cold as opposed to the cloying damp cold we get in the UK? That may be the leveller in terms of warmth.

They dont go to China for the cost savings (as virtually every other manufacturer that's being honest with themselves and their customers), They go to China for better quality than can be found elsewhere... It's the new Italy.

"KTC, manufacturers of several key Rapha products, see the Made in China label standing as a mark of quality in performance wear, just as Made in Italy might indicate quality in the fashion world."

Rapha make a good product.

But the compliments earned are a lot more about how they fabricated an image through photography and exeptionally high prices than they are about China as the pinnacle of quality manufacturing.

What they've created is the perfect three headed profit monster -cheaper labor and materials, Very High prices, a substantial focus on selling customers direct.

I'm all for new companies making better products and growing the sport and advancing tech. I'm also a big fan of companies that have a strong history and earned a long standing reputation the hard way by surviving from the old school to the new.

What I really dont like is Rapha putting an old school, hard scrabble, well earned euro-premium facade and price tag on an upper mid level Chinese knock off of genuine old school, Hard scrabble, well earned Euro Premium Rapha...

Clubagreenie wrote:

Love them hate them or indifferent , they are a clothing company , I understand that there are passionate people as this is a very passionate sport .... but at the end of the day ... it is only clothing guys Vote with your wallet is always the best policy

peaceout

That's damn well put.

My vote goes to companies making flat out better products than Rapha. Gore Bikewear, Assos, Giordana, Mavic (yes Mavic...), a host of products from TexMarket heck, even Bellwether have products I prefer to Rapha and it's sure as hell not because I wont pay a premium for high quality...

4 pages on "Rapha, love or hate". Really? Regardless if you think its overpriced posing nonsense, a carbunkled deformity on the face of our otherwise beautiful sport, or you love their products so much its probably illegal but cmon, do you really think youre gonna convince anyone else to change their view? Silly season in Northern hemisphere, I think.

btw Im in Nairobi right now and saw a guy riding here on a bike probably from 1950, no helmet, but he had a Rapha top.

4 pages on "Rapha, love or hate". Really? Regardless if you think its overpriced posing nonsense, a carbunkled deformity on the face of our otherwise beautiful sport, or you love their products so much its probably illegal but cmon, do you really think youre gonna convince anyone else to change their view? Silly season in Northern hemisphere, I think.

btw Im in Nairobi right now and saw a guy riding here on a bike probably from 1950, no helmet, but he had a Rapha top.

Actually I think at the high end of the sport we all occupy the prevailing views on forums like this are indeed influential.

Re the chap in Nairobi, trust you offered some brotherly advice on priorities. Head injury prevention is even better than Rapha.

They dont go to China for the cost savings (as virtually every other manufacturer that's being honest with themselves and their customers), They go to China for better quality than can be found elsewhere... It's the new Italy.

"KTC, manufacturers of several key Rapha products, see the Made in China label standing as a mark of quality in performance wear, just as Made in Italy might indicate quality in the fashion world."

Rapha make a good product.

But the compliments earned are a lot more about how they fabricated an image through photography and exeptionally high prices than they are about China as the pinnacle of quality manufacturing.

What they've created is the perfect three headed profit monster -cheaper labor and materials, Very High prices, a substantial focus on selling customers direct.

I'm all for new companies making better products and growing the sport and advancing tech. I'm also a big fan of companies that have a strong history and earned a long standing reputation the hard way by surviving from the old school to the new.

What I really dont like is Rapha putting an old school, hard scrabble, well earned euro-premium facade and price tag on an upper mid level Chinese knock off of genuine old school, Hard scrabble, well earned Euro Premium Rapha...

Clubagreenie wrote:

Love them hate them or indifferent , they are a clothing company , I understand that there are passionate people as this is a very passionate sport .... but at the end of the day ... it is only clothing guys Vote with your wallet is always the best policy

peaceout

That's damn well put.

My vote goes to companies making flat out better products than Rapha. Gore Bikewear, Assos, Giordana, Mavic (yes Mavic...), a host of products from TexMarket heck, even Bellwether have products I prefer to Rapha and it's sure as hell not because I wont pay a premium for high quality...

wow, i didn't know i would ever agree with you, but i do on this one. i would like to put sugoi up there, as a company that makes better clothing than rapha.

Rapha: I just don't get it. I am happy that they are happy and have happy customers. But I just don't get it.

Update: With reference to the thread about the made in China Rapha stuff: I think I do get it. I am a bit repulsed by Rapha's feeling that they need to publicise and create so much "drama" associated with their brand. It all started with those ridiculous videos. And now the excuses for having products made in China. Aside from the fact that their stuff seems just obscenely overpriced (which is just an opinion), can't they just make and sell cycling gear without so much appeal to snobbery ?

i roll my eyes at their videos too, but it's understandable.any luxury brand is selling a lifestyle just as much as they are a product.

look at car commercials - open roads, empty cities, smug drivers blowing past slower cars, etc.look at liquor ads - is it a shuck getting drunk at a bar? no, they show friends in tuxedos surrounded by sexy women.

so this is how rapha markets their stuff. the pure suffering of cycling up and down mountains, getting dirty but looking great, blah blah.

Rapha videos are shot in HD and then color-saturated in post-production, which gives them a contrived and extremely insincere feel.

The whole "monumental suffering on a bike equaling pure joy" message comes across as obtuse, inauthentic, and sanctimonious, especially given their business model.

The overriding trend in the cycling industry has been to sell exclusivity and caché to yuppies. Ten years ago a top of the line frame was within reasonable cost and consumers had more choices of manufacturers and materials. Now, we have less choice and prices have gone through the roof, not just for frames but for clothing apparel as well.

And most of the stuff is being made in China. So the cost savings are...where, exactly? The consumer certainly isn't seeing any benefit from Asian manufacturing. Quite the contrary. And I'm sure it's not trickling down to the workers, either.

And most of the stuff is being made in China. So the cost savings are...where, exactly?

It is not meant to save you money, it is not passed on to the customer. the cost savings in manufacturing in China is meant to yield higher profit margins. we live in a world where companies must beat last quarters profit margin and in order to do that we must find cheaper labor, thus China.

in the future we will synthesize any product we want eliminating manual labor all together. oh but you cant get a discount, we need to increase profit margin to 99%... if companies like rapha are making their "high end" stuff in china, what will happen to everything else? is china going to make everything? high or low end and everything in between?

to be honest i wish their were more american products made in USA. A friend said: "we have become a country of pure consumers and repair men, who can no longer sustain growth." while at the moment, i think he is right. i think we can turn this around and more companies can make products like rapha here in USA and sell for the same price and still make a decent profit.

just think about this, if iphones are made in USA and sold for the same price, they would still make a VERY Good profit, but they are made in china, where profit margins are bigger. make an iphone here in USA charge a little more and i would pay the premium to support american manufacturing.

im not against china, but i have to support are dying USA economy. At a time when the UK is almost bankrupt, to make a product that is marketed as a UK elite brand and now sent off to china, plainly SUCKS!!! profit over moral pride.

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