Both expect the informal hearings to bring change. Dunn expects the PSC staff to propose reducing Alabama Power’s allowed return on equity. Cavanaugh was not as specific, but said she expects “real changes.” She expects the three-member commission to vote on a proposal no later than at its September meeting.

Stephen Hill, a rate expert hired by AARP, told the commission at Wednesday’s hearing that Alabama Power’s allowed return on equity, 13 percent to 14.5 percent, is higher than the national average of 10 percent. He said lowering it to 10 percent would save customers $287 million a year.

Alabama Power urged the commission not to change the rate structure. The company argued that overall return on investment capital is a better measure than return on equity and that Alabama Power’s overall return is in line with similar companies.

PSC Commissioner Terry Dunn

Dunn said he thought Alabama Power had no effective rebuttal for Hill’s argument for 10 percent.

“It’s going to come down,” Dunn said. “I don’t know what the number will be, but I think ROE will come down.”

“To me it was an insult to the intelligence of the people of Alabama, the first two meetings,” Dunn said. “We never did get into the rates. It was basically getting up and praising Alabama Power.”

“Alabama Power is a great company and a well-run company,” Dunn said. “But that was not the issue. The issue was rates and the ROE.”

Many of the groups that spoke at Wednesday’s hearing did not talk about rates. They praised Alabama Power’s reliability, disaster response, support of economic development and overall record as a corporate citizen. Some praised the coal industry. Some groups criticized others.

“They were like fighting a battle, some of these people were, that I couldn’t see existed,” Dunn said. “It was about rates. But everybody that got up was talking about coal and if we go any further what we were about to do was going to raise rates. It was just laughable.”

“I said all along we need to use the cheapest mix available to us in the state of Alabama so that consumers and businesses have a lower price,” Cavanaugh said.

Cavanaugh stressed what she said was strong public access for the hearings.

“We allowed anybody that wanted to participate to participate,” Cavanaugh said. “Everyone got a seat at the table that wanted to be seated at the table to ask questions. If an individual wanted to make comments during or at the end of each public hearing, they were allowed to do so. My point was to make sure that these were transparent.”

The Public Service Commission will hold the first of four public meetings on Alabama Gas Corporation’s rate structure on Sept. 5. Those will be held at the RSA Union building in Montgomery beginning at 8:30 a.m.

Cavanaugh and Dunn expect a similar format to the Alabama Power meetings.

“I think it was a huge success and I think it’s going to be a template that other states take away from Alabama,” Cavanaugh said. “I think we’ll be a role model.”

Dunn said the PSC probably has to use a similar format for Alabama Gas because he said treating the companies differently could lead to a lawsuit. But he said he was embarrassed by the hearings.

"The first two meetings, it was just a dog and pony show," Dunn said. "It was all staged. The people that you saw get up, they were reading off the same script."

Dunn said he expected to hear plenty about “how great Alabama Gas is.”

“We’ll just kinda go through the motions and make the public believe that we’ve done something,” Dunn said.