Manchester City 18/19 discussion

I know they're our rivals and I'm never exactly going to watch them with joy but anyone else find they've made it all kind of boring now? Every game they're usually like 3 - 0 up within the first 30 minutes, often courtesy of 3 well-worked tap-ins. Don't get me wrong they're an incredibly well oiled machine and some of their goals are great but so many of them are pass, pass, pass, cut-back, tap-in. I swear Sterling and Jesus are absolute stat padders benefiting from players like Sane and Silva. It's like when someone gives themselves infinite money on FM and figures out an exploit to score the same goal every game.

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Incredibly clear you don't watch Sterling if that's what you think. Completely ran the show against Bournemouth last week and has saved City countless times through his own doing.

I know they're our rivals and I'm never exactly going to watch them with joy but anyone else find they've made it all kind of boring now? Every game they're usually like 3 - 0 up within the first 30 minutes, often courtesy of 3 well-worked tap-ins. Don't get me wrong they're an incredibly well oiled machine and some of their goals are great but so many of them are pass, pass, pass, cut-back, tap-in. I swear Sterling and Jesus are absolute stat padders benefiting from players like Sane and Silva. It's like when someone gives themselves infinite money on FM and figures out an exploit to score the same goal every game.

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That is the effect of a well coached side. Almost every game City scores the same style of goal.
Play a vertical ball behind the Full back, Wingers run behind square the ball, someone taps in

They have done the move so many times its like muscle memory. When they see a teammate in that position, they instinctively know how to play and opponents cant figure them out

I know they're our rivals and I'm never exactly going to watch them with joy but anyone else find they've made it all kind of boring now? Every game they're usually like 3 - 0 up within the first 30 minutes, often courtesy of 3 well-worked tap-ins. Don't get me wrong they're an incredibly well oiled machine and some of their goals are great but so many of them are pass, pass, pass, cut-back, tap-in. I swear Sterling and Jesus are absolute stat padders benefiting from players like Sane and Silva. It's like when someone gives themselves infinite money on FM and figures out an exploit to score the same goal every game.

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They score that type of goal because they are being coached by probably the greatest attacking coach to have lived. He’s drilled that move into their muscle memory so that penetrative ball inbetween cb and lb/rb always has a willing runner latch onto it to square for an easy goal.

Sterling doesn’t need to benefit from any player as he’s one of the best in the world and has been for a while now. He’s so, so intelligent off the ball, rarely picks the wrong option on the ball and has also become one of the most efficient players going when it comes to end product. Scary that he’s 23 and a shame he’s so under appreciated by many fans in this country and the world press, although I doubt he cares.

It’s impressive that even though we’re just two points behind (provided we win tomorrow) I have next to no hope of us catching up with them.

As good as they are, they are making the PL boring as hell.

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You would have won the league in any other season if Pep wasn't around. This is how it feels to go up against Pep's team. We would have won at least two more CLs we didn't face Pep's Barca. Even if SAF is still around, I doubt he can beat this City team.

You would have won the league in any other season if Pep wasn't around. This is how it feels to go up against Pep's team. We would have won at least two more CLs we didn't face Pep's Barca. Even if SAF is still around, I doubt he can beat this City team.

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It's not totally impossible. Jose's Real side beat them to the league in 11/12, so really, all we need is prime Ronaldo, with perfectly coached Di Maria, Alonso, & Ozil etc in behind Easy, right?

Certainly our weakest performance in awhile at the back. No Laporte seems to be an issue and we give up too many chances without him. He's out VVD. But easily our poorest showing, we deserved to win but made it really hard work.

Not really.
Aguero, de Bruyne, Laporte, Sterling, Mendy all missing from our best XI and still ran the show for 80 minutes away at a gutsy team on a sticky pitch. Great performance by Ben Foster, a stonewall penalty denied (don’t think we’ve had any in the PL so far this season other than the one at Anfield) and some poor finishing made the scoreline flatter Watford.
We will drop points here and there but you’ll have to play near perfectly to profit from them.

That's why true United fans never flinch when somebody says "all your fans are from London" or whatever because it simply means they've met lots of United fans in London which is a badge of honour for United supporters before the 90's when it started to become a stick to beat us with. I always argue with fellow Manchester based United fans why they question our "out of town" support as being somewhat inferior, that views goes against Manchester United and its history.

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Out of curiosity how do the Manchester based supporters on this forum view out of town supporters? Or even supporters outwith England? More specifically Scotland, Ireland, and Wales, curious more as to what they think about supporters from those countries because of age-old rivalries that go further back than football.

Manchester United has always had a connection with Scotland, and I suppose Glasgow specifically (being similar cities). There has always been something about Manchester United that despite being English and in a totally different City they in ways feel like a local team, and I know the boys in Ireland and Wales can make the exact same claim.

The best thing that happened to city apart from pep is United being run by clowns. It may sound arrogant but the only club who can stop this city reign is Manchester United.

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I don't think so, even with Sir Alex Ferguson around. His sides looked clueless during the 2011 Champions League Final which I watched fully. There were never any point in the game where it felt like Man United would have won the game. I missed the 2008 final, and probably it was more close, but he still could not beat Guardiola's team.

Sir Alex's United team would have given Pep's city team a tough fight during the end season, but as someone previously mentioned that United generally started slow and the point gap would be so much by December that it would have been futile even with the new year assault, inwhich United were best of any teams from any era.

So, No. Winning it against Guardiola is a different ball-game altogether compared to winning against Mancini or Pellegrini.

How many players do you think are truly world class in this Man City squad?

(not trying to start an argument, just out of honest curiosity)

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Aguero, KDB, David Silva, and maybe Sterling.

What is remarkable about the team is that they don't really have that many world class players and, of the ones they do have, they don't have anybody who you would truly consider among the top five or so players in the world. What they have is a few world class players and then another 12-13 guys that are just below world class, so that they can rotate at all positions (except the fullbacks) without really dropping much quality, and then the manager that provides a system to get the most out of that talent and make the whole thing work.

Its a devastating machine for a league campaign because they can deal with injuries, fixture congestion, or whatever else without missing a beat. I'm not sure whether its a great formula for winning the Champions League, where the quality of your first XI is supremely important and where other managers will have more sophisticated tactical plans to disrupt City's system. If clubs like Juventus and Barca were playing in the Premier League, I would still favor City to prevail over the grind of 38 matches. In a knockout tie with those kinds of clubs, I think City is a coin flip at best.

I don't think so, even with Sir Alex Ferguson around. His sides looked clueless during the 2011 Champions League Final which I watched fully. There were never any point in the game where it felt like Man United would have won the game. I missed the 2008 final, and probably it was more close, but he still could not beat Guardiola's team.

Sir Alex's United team would have given Pep's city team a tough fight during the end season, but as someone previously mentioned that United generally started slow and the point gap would be so much by December that it would have been futile even with the new year assault, inwhich United were best of any teams from any era.

So, No. Winning it against Guardiola is a different ball-game altogether compared to winning against Mancini or Pellegrini.

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And Sir Alex Ferguson always adapted to and excelled at every ball-game he played. Look, while its fair to say that this City team is more ruthless and consistent in the league than SAFs teams were (in the tiny sample we have of 1.5 years rather than decades), Sir Alex slow operated in a particular environment where he had certain competition and consistently beat it. Had he been up against this City team spending obsene amounts every summer, he most likely wouldn't have looked to win the league with what he has. Or at least that's not how a fair comparison can be carried out. You'd have to assume he's also spend on two squads full of 50 million players, or look to raise the level/consistency of the squad to meet it.

I don't think so, even with Sir Alex Ferguson around. His sides looked clueless during the 2011 Champions League Final which I watched fully. There were never any point in the game where it felt like Man United would have won the game. I missed the 2008 final, and probably it was more close, but he still could not beat Guardiola's team.

Sir Alex's United team would have given Pep's city team a tough fight during the end season, but as someone previously mentioned that United generally started slow and the point gap would be so much by December that it would have been futile even with the new year assault, inwhich United were best of any teams from any era.

So, No. Winning it against Guardiola is a different ball-game altogether compared to winning against Mancini or Pellegrini.

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This city side is no Barca side. That was something else, to compare that with city side is a joke. Conte was able to beat this so called pep the great so why wouldn't sir alex have done the same. The fact remains sir alex was a genius who always had a knack of stopping big teams. I still think with sir alex in charge we could have beaten pep at old Trafford last season which would have been a huge result. That loss in December killed everything. Anyways point remains United downfall has contributed to city being the dominant force.

This city side is no Barca side. That was something else, to compare that with city side is a joke. Conte was able to beat this so called pep the great so why wouldn't sir alex have done the same. The fact remains sir alex was a genius who always had a knack of stopping big teams. I still think with sir alex in charge we could have beaten pep at old Trafford last season which would have been a huge result. That loss in December killed everything. Anyways point remains United downfall has contributed to city being the dominant force.

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If Sir Alex's big game nous was as good as you say, he might have won more than 2 Champions league titles in his 27 years. He is no doubt amongst top 5 managers of all time, but every manager has his limitations.

And Sir Alex Ferguson always adapted to and excelled at every ball-game he played. Look, while its fair to say that this City team is more ruthless and consistent in the league than SAFs teams were (in the tiny sample we have of 1.5 years rather than decades), Sir Alex slow operated in a particular environment where he had certain competition and consistently beat it. Had he been up against this City team spending obsene amounts every summer, he most likely wouldn't have looked to win the league with what he has. Or at least that's not how a fair comparison can be carried out. You'd have to assume he's also spend on two squads full of 50 million players, or look to raise the level/consistency of the squad to meet it.

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I think we will not get a big sample space anyway to judge properly, as I think Guardiola leaves in next three years, but there is no doubt that Guardiola is the best manager in the world in last 10 years. The obscene spending does help a lot, but a coach also matters too. Anyone other than Guardiola managing this City team would not be so dominant.

My post was in no way a dig at Sir Alex, as I consider him in the top 5 list of managers of all time, the best I have seen in my lifetime. But even he has his limitations. My reply was against the original comment,as City's rise has only been due to United's decline. That's only partially true. Anyways it is very difficult to judge objectively between different eras of football as the game evolved so much, so my viewpoint may lack in lot of ways.

I don't think so, even with Sir Alex Ferguson around. His sides looked clueless during the 2011 Champions League Final which I watched fully. There were never any point in the game where it felt like Man United would have won the game. I missed the 2008 final, and probably it was more close, but he still could not beat Guardiola's team.

Sir Alex's United team would have given Pep's city team a tough fight during the end season, but as someone previously mentioned that United generally started slow and the point gap would be so much by December that it would have been futile even with the new year assault, inwhich United were best of any teams from any era.

So, No. Winning it against Guardiola is a different ball-game altogether compared to winning against Mancini or Pellegrini.

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The key words here are run by clowns. If there was a proper structure in place since SAF retired we wouldn't be so far from city. The gulf in class is embarrassing. Sadly it doesnt look like it will change soon.

They score that type of goal because they are being coached by probably the greatest attacking coach to have lived. He’s drilled that move into their muscle memory so that penetrative ball inbetween cb and lb/rb always has a willing runner latch onto it to square for an easy goal.

Sterling doesn’t need to benefit from any player as he’s one of the best in the world and has been for a while now. He’s so, so intelligent off the ball, rarely picks the wrong option on the ball and has also become one of the most efficient players going when it comes to end product. Scary that he’s 23 and a shame he’s so under appreciated by many fans in this country and the world press, although I doubt he cares.

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Thing is, City were already masters of that pass long before Pep came, What he has dribbled into them is consistency of performance.

Yeah but we were fined for missing out by "x amount" while its looking like the reality is we missed out by vastly more and covered it up. As I said instead of complying and accepting that fine we should have fought FFP for the sham it is. We chose to play by there rules when we accepted that.

The whole decision from then irritates me, Uefa moving the goalposts, us getting screwed by it. But for our part we took the deal, we pretty much accepted FFP there and then. We have to be honest, we never should have, should have fought tooth and nail to end FFP but we didn't.

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Your second paragraph I agree with

But the first I'm not so sure. If you actually cut through the nonsense in the leaks and deal with the facts, there is no apparent strong case for UEFA to follow up. You have an image rights situation (Fordham) which UEFA were fully aware of at the time (to the point that they actually refused to allow the £25M image rights payment as part of our FFP income which City were really unhappy about). You have the Etihad payment which crucially, was declared by UEFA (again despite city's protestations) as being a connected party, which in turn meant that UEFA would decide what fair market value was for the deal. So UEFA shot themselves in the foot and can't take action against CIty. The only one of relevance is Mancini's payment and in particular, if it is demonstrated some players are paid that way where it's far more transparent that it's a dodge. The leaks are damaging but there is a serious scarcity of facts (if one accepts the leaks are indeed factually accurate) that UEFA could come back to bash us with

If Sir Alex's big game nous was as good as you say, he might have won more than 2 Champions league titles in his 27 years. He is no doubt amongst top 5 managers of all time, but every manager has his limitations.

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Hate how people make out SAF has a poor European record. We were hampered by the foreigners rule early on. We were then robbed by poor officiating against Porto & Real. We would have gone on to win the competition in those years.

This city side is no Barca side. That was something else, to compare that with city side is a joke. Conte was able to beat this so called pep the great so why wouldn't sir alex have done the same.

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By last season Conte was approaching games vs City just with the intention of not getting embarrassed. Down 1-0 Conte didnt even bother to attack and will gladly take the loss.

Conte hit back by insisting it would be reckless to play openly against City and cited Arsenal’s back-to-back 3-0 hammerings to the runaway Premier League leaders only days before as examples of why he approached the game cautiously.

“I think in this moment you have to accept every criticism but I am not so stupid to play against Manchester City open and to lose 3-0 or 4-0,” the Chelsea manager said
Conte said. “When you play against City you have to use your brain, otherwise you risk to finish the game in a bad way and to lose 3-0 or 4-0. I think we tried to not concede the space for a long part of the match and that was good"

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There is no greater compliment than your opponent coming to play you hoping not to get humiliated.
At no point will Pep view his side as inferior to Conte's in that manner

Any team can win one random smash and grab game vs these type of dominant sides, Rubin Kazan once beat the dominant Barca Beating them consistently is what really counts

But the first I'm not so sure. If you actually cut through the nonsense in the leaks and deal with the facts, there is no apparent strong case for UEFA to follow up. You have an image rights situation (Fordham) which UEFA were fully aware of at the time (to the point that they actually refused to allow the £25M image rights payment as part of our FFP income which City were really unhappy about). You have the Etihad payment which crucially, was declared by UEFA (again despite city's protestations) as being a connected party, which in turn meant that UEFA would decide what fair market value was for the deal. So UEFA shot themselves in the foot and can't take action against CIty. The only one of relevance is Mancini's payment and in particular, if it is demonstrated some players are paid that way where it's far more transparent that it's a dodge. The leaks are damaging but there is a serious scarcity of facts (if one accepts the leaks are indeed factually accurate) that UEFA could come back to bash us with

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I agree with all that. I should clarify, my posts are on a "if we are found guilty,," I expect us to deal with the consequences, and there is very little for them to actually punish us for.

The aabar one is the one I think could be most damaging but imho uefa have no way to prove it even if we are cooking the books. They certainly can't make a case off an illegally stolen email.

I just wish we'd taken them on in court instead of taking a deal which might bite us in the arse.

It will be hilarious if the investigation shows nothing was wrong (or can be proven if it was) and we go after Der Spiegel for compensation.

Yeah but we were fined for missing out by "x amount" while its looking like the reality is we missed out by vastly more and covered it up. As I said instead of complying and accepting that fine we should have fought FFP for the sham it is. We chose to play by there rules when we accepted that.

The whole decision from then irritates me, Uefa moving the goalposts, us getting screwed by it. But for our part we took the deal, we pretty much accepted FFP there and then. We have to be honest, we never should have, should have fought tooth and nail to end FFP but we didn't.

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From what we read, City wanted to fight this and UEFA didn't, so they offered City a fine and reduced squad for the CL. Doesn't really matter how much was involved x or y, the fact is we failed, UEFA knew it, but didn't want to fight it. That lad who is now in charge of FIFA, oversaw the whole thing. He is making noises that he is a peacekeeper and thinks City's owners are a good thing for football. I would also assume, that any club who we've bought players from thinks we are a good thing, as the additional transfer monies we pay, help their club and situation. It is just the elite few who are making the noise. The whole FFP thing needs banning, and let anyone have a go if they've got the cahonas

From what we read, City wanted to fight this and UEFA didn't, so they offered City a fine and reduced squad for the CL. Doesn't really matter how much was involved x or y, the fact is we failed, UEFA knew it, but didn't want to fight it. That lad who is now in charge of FIFA, oversaw the whole thing. He is making noises that he is a peacekeeper and thinks City's owners are a good thing for football. I would also assume, that any club who we've bought players from thinks we are a good thing, as the additional transfer monies we pay, help their club and situation. It is just the elite few who are making the noise. The whole FFP thing needs banning, and let anyone have a go if they've got the cahonas