Bachmann: Gardasil causes “mental retardation”

posted at 10:45 am on September 13, 2011 by Ed Morrissey

Earlier today, I noted that Michele Bachmann finally scored points on Rick Perry by hitting him on his ties to Merck and linking that to the Gardasil mandate Perry imposed through executive order in Texas. This is a fair point on Perry’s record, even given his apology for pursuing the mandate through EO instead of through the legislature, and it’s not surprising that Bachmann was the candidate to first take advantage of the opening. (Mitt Romney passed a mandate on health insurance for all citizens of Massachusetts, which pretty much puts this issue out of reach for him.) However, Bachmann took a winning argument about the method and the wisdom of mandating a vaccination for a limited-spread virus and turned it into an anti-vaccination argument, especially in this post-debate argument on Fox with Greta van Susteren (via The Right Scoop):

There’s a woman who came up crying to me tonight after the debate. She said her daughter was given that vaccine. She told me her daughter suffered mental retardation as a result of that vaccine.

Huh? “Mental retardation” typically takes place in a pre- or neo-natal event. Autism becomes apparent in the first couple of years of life — and primarily affects boys. Gardasil vaccinations take place among girls between 9-12 years of age. Even assuming that this anecdote is arguably true, it wouldn’t be either “mental retardation” or autism, but brain damage.

The FDA has received no reports of brain damage as a result of HPV vaccines Gardasil and Cervarix. Among the reports that correlate seriously adverse reactions to either, the FDA lists blood clots, Guillain-Barre Syndrome, and 68 deaths during the entire run of the drugs. The FDA found no causal connection to any of these serious adverse events and found plenty of contributing factors to all — and all of the events are exceedingly rare.

The “mental retardation” argument is a rehash of the thoroughly discredited notion that vaccines containing thimerasol caused a rapid increase in diagnosed autism cases. That started with a badly-botched report in Lancet that allowed one researcher to manipulate a ridiculously small sample of twelve cases in order to reach far-sweeping conclusions about thimerasol. That preservative hasn’t been included in vaccines for years, at least not in the US, and the rate of autism diagnoses remain unchanged.

The most charitable analysis that can be offered in this case for Bachmann is that she got duped into repeating a vaccine-scare urban legend on national television. It looks more like Bachmann sensed that she had won a point and wanted to go in for the kill, didn’t bother to check the facts, and didn’t care that she was stoking an anti-vaccination paranoid conspiracy theory, either. Neither shines a particularly favorable light on Bachmann.

Rick Santorum took the correct position on the Gardasil issue. We mandate certain vaccines in children because we mandate children be gathered for educational purposes for many years (in private or public schools), and certain diseases are easily communicable in those settings. By mandating vaccinations against whooping cough, measles, and mumps, we are protecting children who would otherwise get exposed without any action on their part except compliance with the law. That’s not true with HPV, and parents should decide for themselves whether to inoculate their sons and daughters with Gardasil or Cervarix. If Perry wanted to make those inoculations more accessible, he could have crafted an opt-in system rather than forcing parents to opt out.

Update: Politico’s Ben Smith notes that Bachmann’s statement is getting some pushback in the health sector:

The alleged link between vaccination and mental disabilities — autism is the one frequently cited — has been repeatedly debunked, with the key research on the issue in a British journal withdrawn years ago. But the theory has lived on, and contributed to declining vaccine rates and — advocates for autistic children say — scientific distraction.

“Congresswoman Bachmann’s decision to spread fear of vaccines is dangerous and irresponsible,” said Evan Siegfried, a spokesman for the Global and Regional Asperger Syndrome Partnership. “There is zero credible scientific evidence that vaccines cause mental retardation or autism. She should cease trying to foment fear in order to advance her political agenda.”

“Irresponsible” is correct, and a bad tactical error, too. Instead of highlighting Perry’s faulty actions in Texas, she made herself and (at best) her ignorance on the matter the story.

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Nope you are taking his complete statement about the $5,000 out of context. Go back and read the transcripts from last night’s debate. He never said that the $ 5,000 was the only donation he ever received from Merck.

Dr Evil on September 13, 2011 at 6:02 PM

Actual words:

Bachmann: The drug company gave thousands of dollars in political donations to the governor, and this is just flat-out wrong. The question is, is it about life, or was it about millions of dollars, and potentially billions, for a drug company?

Perry: Yes, sir. Um…the company was Merck…and it was a $5,000 contribution that I had received from them. I raised about $30 million. And if you’re saying I can be bought for five thousand, I am offended.

The Gardasil mandate executive order was issued in 2007.

Texas Governor Rick Perry received at least $23,500 in campaign contributions from drug-maker Merck & Co., including $5,000 in 2006, the year before he ordered girls throughout the state to take a new Merck vaccine.

Wouldn’t contributions prior to 2007 be relevant information? The sum of all donations in the 2006 year was only $15,775,168.37. However, in the 2002 year he raised $14,345,102.42. The $30 million figure Perry cites then includes more than just 2006 contributions. Why then only mention the one $5,000 contribution from Merck and not others?

He said the EO was a mistake, to mandate the HPV vaccine. I take him at his word. He’s speaking in English, he didn’t stutter. People don’t want to accept- he agrees with them, it was a mistake to use the EO to mandate the HPV vaccine. They are arguing with themselves, because Perry isn’t arguing with them.

Dr Evil on September 13, 2011 at 4:25 PM

That is the issue in a nutshell and should be the end of it. Yes they are arguing with themselves, LOL

I’m done with it myself, other than pointing out what you’ve said here. Making mountains out of molehills by those that don’t like Gov. Perry. It really says more about them than Gov. Perry.

I’m done with it myself, other than pointing out what you’ve said here. Making mountains out of molehills by those that don’t like Gov. Perry. It really says more about them than Gov. Perry.

bluefox on September 13, 2011 at 7:02 PM

I agree with you. i wish one of the 4 Governors or Cain had said something to the effect that ‘when you are actually in charge of something, you make a lot of decisions everyday, and sometimes you make the wrong decision.’
Last night I felt that the Legislators had it easy. They have never had to govern so their worst paper trail will be something they voted for or against.

Actually when I heard the answer, I was thinking the opposite. He knew the thing would come up so he had a number ready to deliver.

powerpro on September 13, 2011 at 7:06 PM

That’s a good point. All in all, the Vaccination brouhaha isn’t a deal breaker for me. He says he screwed up, and I leave it at that. I was disappointed that Bachmann went as heavy as she did on him last night. It made her look desperate and reinforced the idea that she is running for Romney’s VP slot to improve his standing with Tea Party COnservatives.

My comment was made because the issue has been explained and repeatedly. It is done. To continue to do what the MSM is doing, exactly like in the debate last night and last week is pointless. The left and the MSM love to keep the debates and conversation on this until dooms day. So why is it going on here?

Yes, each Candidate should be vetted. But let me ask you this. Why is Perry the only one being vetted and then on this same issue?
Is he the only Candidate? It appears so. He gets 80% of the questions from the monitors and then each other Candidate get to ask him variations. Nice, huh?

That leaves one with the impression that all other Candidates are perfect and don’t need vetted since I don’t hear it.

That’s a good point. All in all, the Vaccination brouhaha isn’t a deal breaker for me. He says he screwed up, and I leave it at that. I was disappointed that Bachmann went as heavy as she did on him last night. It made her look desperate and reinforced the idea that she is running for Romney’s VP slot to improve his standing with Tea Party COnservatives.

Red State State of Mind on September 13, 2011 at 7:13 PM

It really isn’t to me either, generally speaking.

If there is a true tie in with some pay to play, then I’d have an issue with that.

I think Bachmann went too far though and by broadening her attack as to her ideas as to whether or not the drug is dangerous. It diluted her argument and was a serious misstep.

Steebo is a proud tool for Palin. Take every word it says with a bucket full of salt. The Nistas are as dirty and dishonest as they come.

CW on September 13, 2011 at 7:20 PM

That’s your response to the facts? I take the time to transcribe the relevant portion of the debate and to research the campaign contribution figures, and all you can say is that I am a “dirty and dishonest” “tool.”

You don’t seriously believe that he was paid for his support of this vaccine? Really? Even $23K is a drop in the bucket of $30M . . . like .075%.

Voter from WA State on September 13, 2011 at 7:43 PM

I don’t know. It’s not beyond the realm of possibility and the case for something not totally above-board is mounting. But that’s not the issue in my particular post. The issue is whether or not Perry’s statement about receiving $5,000 from Merck was honest. It was not.

Well, is currently on Hannity’s radio show preaching the same thing: these “little girls” etc, etc.

bluefox on September 13, 2011 at 4:10 PM
Is Hannity letting her get away with it or is he asking follow up questions?

Dr Evil on September 13, 2011 at 4:15 PM

He would ask her a question, but she would either repeat or state a variation. He really didn’t challenge her in my opinion. He played one or two of the audios of her from the debate. To me it was just another venue for her to repeat her talking points.

Getting tired of Fox too, with Coulter/Ingraham/Luntz/Morris/Rove etal. Oh, if you missed Greta & Bachmann you can find it here:

Here’s the first comment on this article — go check it out before it’s taken down (but if you miss it, Insty has a screenshot):

The only good Republican is a dead one. I’m rooting for a civil war so I can put a bullet in their heads. I’ll probably find it more satisfying then killing Iraqis.
BY Lloyd C. on 09/13/2011 at 11:46

This is what we’re up against. Not mere political disagreement — actual dehumanizing. Maybe this guy isn’t serious — maybe he’s just trying to provoke a reaction — but what does it say that he felt perfectly fine typing such a statement on a public Web site? Nothing good…

So I’d like to ask the HA commentariat if we could please at least think twice before insulting and dehumanizing fellow conservatives who have a different preference for a primary candidate? Thanks — please don’t flame me if you disagree, just ignore my comment.

Backing Bachmann’s charges against Perry that Bachmann had/has no proof of is what I think Palin should not have done.

bluefox on September 13, 2011 at 3:15 PM
Who says there is no proof? What is not true? Did Perry receive donations from Merck? Did his COS lobby for Merck? Did Perry issue an E.O. to mandate Gardasil? Is it not cronyism if the amount is only $28,500.00?

The Merck disclosure is but a scratch on the surface.

NoNails on September 13, 2011 at 4:01 PM

It is up to the one making the charge here, which is Bachmann. Don’t posters here ask for a link when a comment it made? It should be more so from a Presidential Candidate in my opinion.
If I said Bachmann lied in an interview, wouldn’t you expect me to provide proof? Or would I expect you to prove me wrong?

I too believe Bachmann jumped the shark. Mental retardation? I’ve looked into the vaccine because I have kids and I never saw a claim like that! To me, that statement was puzzling. Watching the debate, I thought it was disgusting how all of the candidated spent the entire debate attacking Perry. He was the only one anwering questions. I wanted to know more about each of their priorities and solutions. Only got to see a few revelations. So do we have to get the polls to lower Perry so we can learn more about the other candidates?

Bachmann jumped the shark . . . and the elephant . . . and the battleship.

Voter from WA State on September 13, 2011 at 7:43 PM

I agree. Greed for a position does strange things to some people.

Why do people think that they can jump from being a Representative, skip the Senate, a Governorship and jump into the Presidency? No experience running anything, talking at a Tea Party rally here and there, voting or not voting in the House.

I heard of a car dealer that had held no elective office and ran for a U.S. Senate seat, LOL Changed his mind a little later.

We need someone Qualified, not a President in training. We’ve had that:-)

Sigh.* Where does one begin? The incessant equating of parents wanting to be fully informed and given a choice of single vaccine shots as Troofers is shameful, lazy reporting, and reminiscent of “Bush lied, people died” WMD chants. Lancet and all other scientific journals are not within my control and in light of AGW peer-reviewed scandals, who can trust any scientist or government agency with drug maker rent-seeking crony capitalism without their own due diligence? But the Lancet report in question stated further study was required based on findings in the gut, not that the science was settled. Alas, there appears to be a strong male/female divide regardless of political isle in principled recognition of parental rights.

Regardless of any sex divide, the drug maker doesn’t see boys and young men as a client base too far for a cervical cancer vaccine. On October 21, 2009, the CDC took the first steps to forcing federal funds to pay for Gardasil vaccines to prevent sexually transmitted genital warts in boys with a “permissive recommendation.” Yep, one product fits all now; female and male. Good business for China’s one child (female genocide) policy.

As far as Mrs. Bachmann relaying a statement of “mental retardation” from the vaccine as told to her by a parent, who are we to question the parent’s motives or imply irrationality? I’m quite certain you don’t possess a medical degree or a dinosaur doctorate but in the climate change scam like others. But do you have a political science degree? What was your thesis? Have you released your college transcripts, yet? Enough. Aside from your proven or implied aptitude (of which I care not), how would you otherwise conversationally relate “sudden regression into neurological disorder”?

1 in 3,000 children had polio back in the day and that was considered an epidemic. It was ultimately the private sector that Salk worked in that came up with the vaccine. Now that we have the nanny state, how well have they done? The CDC does not even consider 1 in 110 autistic children an epidemic. It’s time to stop merely continuing to focus on and politicize scientific diagnosis ahead of an epidemic disabling a generation of children, and a lack of preparedness in our schools and communities.

Speaking of the CDC, did you know the head of the CDC from 2002-2009, Dr. Julie Gerberding (Masters of Public Health at the University of California, Berkeley), was announced as head of MERCK’s $5 billion global vaccine division December 21, 2009 to take over January 25, 2010? She has “50 awards and honors” that are no less impressive than those assembled by (as noted by Mark Steyn) the head of disgraced cheating Atlanta Public Schools Super:

“…Beverly Hall, garlanded with the National Superintendent of the Year Award, the Administrator of the Year Award, the Distinguished Public Service Award, the Keystone Award for Leadership in Education, the Concerned Black Clergy Education Award, the American Association of School Administrators Effie H. Jones Humanitarian Award, and a zillion other phony-baloney baubles with which the American edu-fraud cartel scratches its own back.”

Furthermore, per the Merck press release for government revolving door employment:

“As president of the vaccines business, [Dr Gerberding] will be responsible for the sale of the company’s current portfolio of vaccines, the introduction of vaccines from the company’s pipeline and the acceleration of Merck’s efforts to broaden vaccinations in developing countries”

However, according to the CDC in 2009, seasonal flu sees on average 36,000 deaths in America. The CDC also states:

“Every year, about 12,000 women are diagnosed with cervical cancer and almost 4,000 die from this disease in the United States. Worldwide, cervical cancer is the second most common cancer in women, causing an estimated 470,000 new cases and 233,000 deaths per year.”

You see, this is not what is beneficial for individual Americans but monopolized, global medicine dollars. Just as Ron Paul was lamenting in the debate America’s far flung and numerous “bases” around the globe, Merck preens it operates “in more than 140 countries”. Crony capitalism, much?

Ethics and corruptible industries of tobacco and broadcast journalism (60 Minutes) come to mind. Shades of big tobacco and academic Dr Jeffrey Wigan as loosely portrayed by Russell Crowe in the movie “The Insider” (1999). It took a scientist to violate contractual agreements to expose addictive ingredients in cigarettes, and crony capitalism corporations unleashed a legal quicksand. Not to be outdone though, per the WSJ on December 16, 2009, “Today, Merck said it is naming Michael Rosenblatt to the new position of chief medical officer. Rosenblatt, 62, a Harvard-trained endocrinologist, has been dean of Tufts University School of Medicine since 2003.”

Of course, Dr Gerberding and Rosenblatt could just be more along the lines of those insider realignments when federal administration’s change political party hands, I guess. However, for my money, there is nothing more honorable than a layman parent over a politician, rent-seeking scientist, or lobbyist any day.

FDA approved Gardasil on June 8, 2006, for females 9-26 years of age. Per the CDC, it “was tested in [only] over 11,000 women in the United States and around the world.” Per the FDA, the first published review of “select adverse events” during “product licensure in June 2006 through December 31, 2008″ was on August 19, 2009. “The article describes 12,424 reports of adverse events following Gardasil vaccination,” you will note, a number on par with the total diagnosed with cervial cancer above. Are you prepared to mitigate one disease for another? What of the conservative cry of “unintended consequences” from meddlesome, burdensome, intrusive government?

Again, let this conservative blog focus on the fiscal issue of Perry’s EO, February 2, 1997, affecting 165,000 11-year-old girls rather than web traffic driving headlines. Who do you think pays for most of the third-world’s vaccines today? Have you reported on PEPFAR.gov and/as the Global Health Initiative (GHI) lately? American taxpayers continue to be sold the healthcare lie of buy one; $70 billion since 2003 of medical aid to the world for goodwill and moral standing — and get one free, Obamacare. Perry’s motive was to force insurance companies to pay for the expensive $300+ vaccine, and therefore, the state would be equally compelled to pay for non-insured, non-citizen, and low-income resident vaccines with taxpayer largess too. Per the Statesman.com, Texas was expected to spend about $13 million per year to provide the vaccine to females only. Think of the cost when males eventually get fully approved. As they say, other people’s money soon runs out.

More likely – Perry got suckered by his empathy for almost epidemic trend of women developing cancer as a result of HPV. He saw a way to protect Texans by a mandatory vaccination program. Better damned well believe my daughter will get this vaccine – I’m thinking father – and I care for my daughter. No, I don’t want her to have sex – idiots. But I’m smart enough to know that “accidents” happen and there’s no reason she should get a death sentence from something as trivial as pre-marital sex. Especially when it can be prevented so easily.

No – he didn’t do it the right way. Yes – he’s admitted that. Move on. For the Love of Christ folks – you have a candidate up there who conspired with Socialists to pass a Socialist health care system that has destroyed the Mass economy – and that guy still thinks his Socialist program was a good idea.

While everyone gets all hyper about Rick Perry’s attempt to get little girls protected from cervical cancer – which resulted in ..

I expected this kind of trash from Bachmann. Only a gutter snipe would have hired that pig Ed Rollins. I was more disappointed with that little shit Rick Santorum. He doesn’t have a snowball’s chance in hell of becoming President yet he went beyond a philosophical debate and assaulted the intent of another committed Christian. For his own vanity he’s working his hardest to trash perhaps the most pro-life top tier candidate in the race.

He’d rather hand the nomination to the ethically empty Mitt Romney. What a hypocritical ass the Bible thumper turns out to be.

The biggest argument against Gardasil is that it’s possible that it is only effective for 5 years without further boosters. So why are we giving all 12 year olds an STD vaccine that’s effective for 5 years? Why should this be required for school? Do 12 year olds have sex on school grounds?

I really can’t believe that so many people are defending a person that ORDERED children to take a “Vaccine” that doesn’t cover all causes of cervical cancer that they claim it prevents…that they aren’t sure how long before a booster is needed…that had been linked to neurological disorders. To call trying to FORCE that onto a population just a “bad decision” as some have said it putting you head in the sand because the bad guy is a player on the team you root for.

I don’t know about the rest of you but I would prefer to cast a vote for the candidate that isn’t going to force chemicals into my children without my consent.

Gardisil is the rare drug that has almost no known side effects beyond modest local reactions, and is 100% effective against the targeted viruses. It is true that there are at least 20 different viruses which can cause cervical cancer, and Gardisil immunizes against only four of them – but those four are by far the most common and account for 70% of all cervical cancers.

The idea that it has not been tested is completely false, and the allegation it contributes to autism or retardation in any way is just a flat out LIE.

There is no serious scientific case against the drug, but that does not mean it should be required, and certainly doesn’t mean it should be required by state executive order instead of legislative action in response to medical consensus.

It is completely appropriate to criticize Perry for the right reasons on this issue. Perhaps the biggest question he hasn’t been asked is what effect his wife had on his decision – the vaccine campaign had been one of her signature causes.

Gardasil is not 100% effective. There are 10 types of HPV that in rare cases lead to cancer. Gardasil only claims to stop 4 of those. So this “vaccine” by the admission of its creators doesn’t stop 50% of the HPV types that may cause cancer.

How do you feel about the instances of paralysis or how about these effects…
pain, swelling, itching, bruising, and redness at the injection site
headache
fever
nausea
dizziness
vomiting
fainting

Fainting can happen after getting GARDASIL.

Tell your health care professional if any of the following problems occur because these may be signs of an allergic reaction:

So because there are sadly a wide range of dangerous drugs otu there being peddled to us its ok to have a ridiculously long list of horrific potential side effects??? That thinking scare the hell out of me.

As for fluoride in the water…Fluoride in the water is troubling since a waste product of explosives and fertilizers in the water supply just do not sound like a good idea to me. But I guess that makes me crazy… you know.. worried about chemicals in the drinking water. But I guess if I am crazy them the majority of the world is crazy as well. Fluoride in the water supply is not a world wide practice and has been stopped in many countries that did at one time fluoridate the water supply because there are concerns that the long term effects are harmful to human body.

I can just bet what’s been written on this thread. I think I’ll save myself the headache.
Probably stuff like, vaccines cause autism bcs I know somebody’s who kids are autistic now, I got the flu vaccine once & got the flu so vaccines cause disease, vaccines don’t work, herd immunity is a myth blah blah blah.

Course if I’m wrong, then I would be delighted.
But I’m not holding my breath for that.
I really really really wish we could take the anti-vaccine crowd & send them back to a time when there weren’t any so that they could see the widespread death & suffering that comes from NOT being vaccinated against common diseases.

I see herd immunity every day. Bcs I raise livestock.
I vaccinate them.
They do not get sick.
The people I know who do not vaccinate, guess what? Their calves get sick. Many die.
Then when they go to the feed lots to mingle with other strange cattle, the ones that didn’t get sick at 1st, do get sick. And have to be treated with medicine to save their lives. And sometimes they die anyway.
THAT’s your model of proof for a world without vaccines.
Thank God we have vaccines.
Those who die from vaccinations, which are RARE, are people who would have died from either that disease, or some other disease, more than likely.
Life is risky.
Why would you walk into a disease-ridden room without protecting yourself if you could?
You don’t walk outside in subzero weather without proper clothing do you?
Jeebus.
If Bachmann said this, then she is now an idiot/moron in my book.

And before some Libertines go nuts here, I do think citizens should have the choice of getting vaccinated or not.
Which we do.
But then there are restrictions to what you can do.
States & local communities have a right to, for instance, refuse people entry to nursing homes bcs they are not vaccinated.
Or refuse letting a kid go to public school bcs they are not vaccinated etc.
Don’t like it? Stay home & live in a bubble.
But this is one of those things that state & local governments (not the Feds) have every right to make decisions on.

I think Michele’s great, but I just KNEW they were going to jump her for the mental retardation comment. She needs to round up the woman who told her that, I think.

Other than that, since Perry apparently thinks that if you sneak into the US and avoid detection for three years, it’s just peachy to get all the benefits that Texas citizens get, including in-state tuition rates, if I were Bachmann I’d continue to nail Perry on that. There were a whole bunch of people who treated Perry’s entering the race as if it were greater than the Second Coming, but I bet they did no research on his beliefs about illegal aliens deserving American benefits.

You should stay off of those weird websites…most of your post is pure garbage…either you don’t understand his immigration policies or you just are too lazy to report the truth.
Either way, it’s just wrong…

I suspect the woman making the initial claim to Bachman was being dishonest in the first place. There is a contingent of people who fear these vaccines because the disease they protect against is sexually transmitted. Rather than rationally fearing the disease itself, they fear that which inoculates against it. Why? Because even more than cancer and death, they fear that their daughters will have sex. Something that protects against cancer and death transmitted through sex, is irrationally seen as something that promotes sex, which is anathema to them.

But they cannot make that argument because normal people are not persuaded by it. No normal person sees something that protects a 12 year old girl from contagious cervical cancer as an incitement for her to go party like a co-ed on girls gone wild.

So instead they latch on to anything they can come up with, no matter how ridiculous. They freak out and get emotional, at which point they get stupid. Those who listen to them end up looking stupid as well.

Wouldn’t contributions prior to 2007 be relevant information? The sum of all donations in the 2006 year was only $15,775,168.37. However, in the 2002 year he raised $14,345,102.42. The $30 million figure Perry cites then includes more than just 2006 contributions. Why then only mention the one $5,000 contribution from Merck and not others?

Perry was being deliberately dishonest.

steebo77 on September 13, 2011 at 6:55 PM

In February 2007, “the Associated Press reported that Texas Governor Rick Perry, who had just required HPV vaccinations for all girls entering sixth grade, had accepted $5,000 from Merck’s political action committee the same day that Perry’s chief of staff met with key aides about the vaccine.”

The AP reported this back in 2007, and Rick Perry stated the same thing at the CNN TEA party debates. That’s not being dishonest – that’s being specific. Considering it was a debate with time allotment’s for answers, I would say Perry did pretty well responding if people bothered to take his response in context.

I suspect the woman making the initial claim to Bachman was being dishonest in the first place.
leereyno on September 14, 2011 at 12:09 PM

Or had said it out of sheer ignorance &/or stupidity.
Whatever the case, I would hope Bachmann would understand such things a little better. Bcs I personally try & not blurt out things like that concerning topics I am ignorant on.
She should have looked that one up before rambling on about it.
Vaccines are a contentious issue.
She’s not helping support the facts concerning vaccines.
She’s supporting the looney anti-vaccine crowd.

Any person who want’s to be President fights it out tooth and nail..
and then there is the person who JUST KNOWS they will be the President without having to jump through a bunch of hoops and attacking others.. they just become it naturally.. kind of like Kings.

Any person who want’s to be President fights it out tooth and nail..
and then there is the person who JUST KNOWS they will be the President without having to jump through a bunch of hoops and attacking others.. they just become it naturally.. kind of like Kings.

amend2 on September 14, 2011 at 10:29 PM

I think that’s true. Not only for President but for other goals in life. If you knock on a door and it opens, then fine. But if you knock on a door and it doesn’t open, don’t knock it down. That means no one is home:-)