Civ 4 the List: List of Threadmasters

The List for Civ IV was a project that could not have been accomplished without the hard work and dedication of the many Threadmasters and ideas-finders on the forums. While idea-suggestors are likewise important, I have compiled here a list of the volunteers who went above and beyond the call of duty to take on the task of threadmastering a thread for the List.
And here they are, alphabetically:
Asmodean- Former Administrator of the List
Azazel- Government and Social Engineering
DarkCloud- Administrator; Civilizations, General, Scenario/Map Editor; List Formatter
Fosse- The Polls
Ixnay- Space
Lajzar- Units
MattH- Cheats
Nikolai- AI, Resources, Terrain
Octavian X- Wonders
Platypus Rex- Regional and City Menus
TechWins- Diplomacy
Trifna- Movement/Supply, User Friendliness
...

Civ 4 the List: Closing Remarks

And so now the list has drawn to a close. Thousands of ideas have been culled from the Civ III community at Apolyton. Hopefully the list that we propose here has been easy enough to search through and hopefully it will lead to a great parnership between the players and the corporation.Good luck with your struggles and please, keep civving!
-DarkCloudList Administrator
PS: Here's a link to the Civ III-Ideas List compiled by Apolyton Fans on July 14, 1999 - Civ III List in case you wish to compare it to the current creation...

Civ 4 the List: The Polls

Introduction
Realizing that some polls about hot topics have already left the top page, and that newcomers to the discussion seldom dig through the back pages in order to find out what's been discussed before, I've decided to compile a list of the Civ 4 List related polls.
I've abandoned keeping a running talley of votes, as it's a great deal of work that is immediatley outdated, and if you really were interested in the results you would visit the poll and read the comments.
Now... the polls:
Stacked vs. Single Unit Combat: The Battle ContinuesShould units be stacked into "armies" that fight and operate as a single unit, or does moving them one at a time provide a boost to strategic considerations?
Resources: How to HandleIs a system with stores and limits on resources a better simulation and more fun, or tedious micromangement?
From Civ 3 to Civ 4More of the same, or a bold new direction for Civ 4?
Squares, Hexes, Octagons... Pick your poison, the traditional Civ Map, traditional War Games map, or something else entirely.
Eras in Civ 4?Is the new era system a great addition, or a stifling hindrance?
Espionage & Assymetrical WarfareDoes Bond get his own unit?
To 2000 AD or Beyond?Civ, From the Ancients to the Stars; or Civ, The Whole of Human History.
{The List} United NationsA resolution for change... do you Veto?
{The List} What Should Happen to Civ Traits?Should Civ 4 have homogenous Civs or even more differences?
Terrain Improvements"Give me Workers, or Give me Death" vs "Micromagement Gives me Death."
Nomads and ChiefdomsShould Civ 4 let us wander the great wide open?
Civ 4 ideas - straights and canalsDo you want straigts? Or canals?
Civ 4 idea: Armies instead of unitsOnce again, armies or single units?
Health in Civ 4?Should we have sick Civs?
Emphasis on AgeWhich historical era, if any, should get a boost in Civ 4?
Civ 4 resistanceDo you want partisans from Civ 2? Resistors from Civ 3? Or something new for Civ 4?
Fire and MovementHow should firepower and movement rates affect combat in Civ 4?
Stacking Limits Y/NAssuming we have stacks, what sorts of stack limits should there be?
Improved Poll: When should Civilization IV end?What is a good time for the game to end?
Future Techs in Civ 4Which future era techs would you like in Civ 4?
What ARE wonders, anyway?Well? What are they?
Pollution Managers:Would you like Pollution Managment added to city screen?
Tech Transmission
Here is some food for thought from Civfanatics.
-Respectfully Compiled by Fosse...

Civ 4 the List: Wonders

Introduction
The concept of the great Wonders of the World in Civ is as old as the series itself. For years, civvers around the world have built Pyramids, Great Libraries, Magellanic Voyages, and trips to the Moon.
And, as Civ has gone from I to II to III, wonders have been added, removed, or have changed in some way. With Civ3 came the idea of Small Wonders that each nation had the oppertunity to build individually, further widening the effect of these great projects.
As Civ4 looms over the horizon, how will the concept of Wonders of the World evolve further?
Summary
As you can see, I'm still coming up with ideas already proposed and boiling them down into a list. The links I have found to all threads in this forum pertaining to wonders has been included. If you have some more links, or brand new ideas, please feel free to post them in this thread.
Related Threads
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=75460
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=106609
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=107349
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=117222
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=107895
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=111317
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=114759
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=115569
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=117740
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=117222
Table of Contents
New Wonder Ideas
Changes to Existing Wonders
New Wonder Concepts
Conclusion
The Ideas
I. New Wonder Ideas
This section goes on the idea that the concept of the ‘wonder’ in Civ will not change from Civ3 to Civ4, that players will still accumulate production in a race with other civs in their attempt to build a wonder. Listed at those specific ideas for a brand new wonder.
Statue of Liberty
No so much a new wonder, but bringing back a great one from Civ2. A civ with this wonder, in Civ2, could switch to any government type, irregardless of possession of the prerequisite tech, with no anarchy time. In Civ2, it was rendered mostly useless by the fact that one could switch governments without penalty every four turns (the classic Odeo years).Arrian
Banaue Rice Terraces
>Ancient - allows irrigation on hills (weak, needs more benefit, maybe cut irrigation time or allow hills/forests/mountains to act as irrigated square for the purposes of irrigating next to it).Solomwi
Channel Tunnel
Modern/Late Industrial - allows ground units to move across single tile straits without ships.Solomwi
Machu Picchu
Late Ancient - allows settlement on mountains.Solomwi
Attitude/Reputation Wonders
Bring back some of the old ones from Civ2 that could modify relations with neighbors. (Eiffel, Marco Polo, etc.)Solomi
Apian Way (Small Wonder)
Originally Roman Empire, huge boon to trade (25-50% for every city connected by it) and unit movement along its length (4 tiles instead of three like other roads).
For those who love micromanaging, the Wonder could cost a city less to "produce," but workers would return to existing roads for an additional one or two turns per tile, resulting in a straighter road graphic or a different color. Building the AW from scr...

Civ 4 the List: User Friendliness/ The Manual / Help Files

Introduction
User Friendliness- what makes the game easy to play. The Manual- the guides to Civ I and II provided historical information and pull-out charts that gave the game character- will Civ IV have such things? Or will the manual merely be a cheap on-line PDF? Help Files- how easily can the owners of the game find their way around it once accessing the game itself?
Summary
While this wasnt the most glamours of sections, it is in some ways the most important because without easy accessibility, Civilization would be both unfun and impossible to play. Many ideas which could fall in this area were included in other sections, thus its sparseness can be explained by the universality in where these help information can be put in.
Table of Contents
The Ideas
Conclusion
The Ideas
Historical Garbage: Forget the historical stuff about units. Most people never read it and it doesn't enhance gameplay.-Kuciwalker
(It should be noted, however that a significant group of civvers actually appreciates these historical things and the fact that they are in the game makes it more educational and acceptable to teachers and parents trying to teach their children through learning. It also makes the game more 'intellectual' and provides a good reference.)-DarkCloud
Generating Civlopedia Entries IN THE EDITOR:: Make it easy to generate Civpedia entries IN THE EDITOR.-Kuciwalker
A "?" to click on and point at elements: I propose that somewhere at the top of the screen there would be a litte interrogation mark to click on. If you click on it, there will be a bunch of very visible interrogation marks each place on the present screen you can get a little text explaining how it works, what it is and ev...

Civ 4 the List: Units

Introduction
This is meant as a discussion of two principal aspects of the game: what units should appear in the game, and the effects of the various unit attribute flags.
Of secondary importance is finding a way to integrate unit statistics with whatever combat method is chosen; it is generally agreed that balancing stats will depend a lot on how combat (stacked vs 1:1 vs other) is implemented.
Summary
One recurring theme across the various lists for each generation of civ was for a unit workshop, similar to smac. I believe this would be bad for civ. While it could reflect the historical range of units if constrained with a uitably detailed complex ruleset, this rulset would be unreasonably complex for a game, forcing an extra level of management. In addition, it would make it extremely hard to mod the graphics, and all but impossible to create mods with fantasy units.
Most people agree that civ3 had far too few units in the game. The big jumps in the capabilities at each critical tech gave an overwhelming advantage to teh tech leader, as well as giving a somewhat disjointed view of history.
With assymetric units, there is clearly a strong desire for these functions to be implemented. The main debate is on whether or not units are the best means of implementing these functions. This a decision that should be made on a group by group basis. There is very little desire for religious units or lawyers, but worker functions are evenly split on whether units are the best method to put them in the game.
Related Threads
Civ4 Idea: Armies instead of Units
Stacked vs. Single Unit Combat - The Battle Continues
Some sort of unit design allowed?
Civ4 Units
Table of Contents
2.0 Miscellaneous Thoughts
5.0 Units
Conclusion
The Ideas
Organized by: Lajzar...

Civ 4 the List: Terrain & Terrain Improvements 2

Table of Contents
1 - The Terrain
2 - Terrain improvements
3 - Worker and PW ideas
4 - Transportation over the map
5 - Cities
6 - Pollution
7 - Mini-map
8 - Climate and weather
Conclusion
The Ideas
3 - Worker and PW ideas
3.1 - More worker jobs
I like both the CtP and CivIII version of terrain improvements, but just for the sake of arguement, I will be going from the perspective of CivIII. I want to either be able to add worker jobs or already have them in. Examples: Loved the ability to Irragate a second time in CivII. Give this back.
(Posted by donegeal)
3.2 - A hybrid system
Fort tile improvements, I'd like to see a hybrid system. In this system, tile improvements such as irrigation and mining done within your borders would be handled by a public works type system. I don't want exactly what was had in CtP, though. I'd rather a system where you would start an irrigation project for an entire city, and it would take a lot of money/shields to produce, and once completed, would require a good deal of maintainence.
However, once you get outside the land that is technically yours, and you want to build roads, rails, colonies, and forts and such, it would require the use of workers.
This way in the early game you can still have fun building up your civilization, and in the late game you don't have to worry about the swarms of workers going around to cleanup this polution or irrigate that tile.
(Posted by Lorizael)
I like that... I'd actually like to see a combination use of workers/PW if you build Tile improvements outside of your city radius (not national borders), and PW used inside those radius.
(Posted by hexagonian)
3.3 - PW ideas
3.3.1 - Public Works, not workers
PUBLIC WORKS : exactly like in CTP.
(Posted by J-S)
3.3.2 - Public works director
How about a Public Works Director that works by automating workers? You could paint down roads like in Sim City, and workers would automatically start building them... or you could give a worker a direct order, and she would finish that project before going back to the Public Works Director for new instructions.
Each city could have a Public Works Submenu which would show three graphs of the maximum possible Food/Shields/Commerce if you optimized for each of those. So at a glance you can see - "The most Food I could possibly get out of this city is X, and the most shields is Y", etc. Then there would be a slider where you set the percentage priority of each of those.
When workers have no specific tasks given them directly nor any specific improvements from the Public Works Director (like roads or colonies, etc.) a worker will start upgrading the city radius based on the percentages you've chosen. If you go 50% Food 25% Shields 25% Commerce, the worker will build 2 food improvements, then one shield improvement, then 1 commerce.
This system would be flexible enough to allow you to micromanage in the early stages of the game when its most important, then forget about them later on, yet still have the ability to direct them if you want to. It would also be a lot more precise than the current automation of workers. And it preserves the ability to take slave workers to improve your civ's production.
(Posted by wrylachlan)
3.3.3 - PW costs something
Have public works cost something. Gold, food, shields, whatever floats your boat (I prefer gold though, because there is no clutter like a "public works reserve" à la CtP). Such a system can be implemented either in a CTP-ish system or in a Civish system (featuring workers): the key is that each individual public work costs something when performed.(Posted by Spiffor)
3.3.4 - A possible PW system idea
You can build anywhere in your territory, and anywhere that you have a military presence. Improvements outside your territory cost more, and there is a third price tier for improvements inside hostile nations. The price difference is reflected both in construction time and in resource points needed.
If an improvement is pillaged while under construction, the pillaging player gains half the base construction cost of that improvement. This reflects the "capturing workers" aspect of civ3.
The interface is a basic click on the palette item, then click on the tile where you want it to go. An option to paint an area (think simcity zoning) with an improvement could be done, but I don't expect it to be necessary.
PW are paid for out of a pool, similar to CTP. I'm not overly fussy about whether this pool comes from gold or shields, but I suspect shields gives the more interesting opportunity cost.
Once you place the order for an improvement to be build, an "under construction" icon appears on the screen. This icon could either be a half-finished image of the improvement, or an animated worker. The improvement appears a few turns later, depending on the improvemnt/terrain (rails take longer than roads, mountain mines take longer than hill mines, undersea tunnels take ages and ages).
To prevent the idea of building a ridiculous stockpile of PW resources then splurging, I'd suggest one or both of the following:
- A negative interest on stockpiled PW resources. Say, it depreciates at 1% each turn. The first N points of stockpile shouldn't have this interest charge (N is the cost of your single most expensive PW project).- You can only start a maximum of 1 PW action per city you control each turn.(Posted by lajzar)
3.3.5 - Another Public Work System Idea
As one might imagine, the above system lends it very well to public works. Excess Shields in your national inventory will be used for this. Naturally either everything else in the game will be a bit cheaper or shields will be easier to come by (relative to cIIIv or cIIV).
Each public works project requires a certain number of shields to start. This number depends on the terrain and the tile improvement. Every item would have a base cost that is some multiple of 2. Roads, for instance, would cost 2 shields. This number divided by 2 is how many turns it would take to finish it if left to its own devices; each turn 2 shields are used to further the project along. If you want to rush a PW, then you can right-click or double-click on it to bring up an option window. This would allow you to cancel it (getting back all the shields that haven't been spent), or rush it. Rushing would cost gold, not shields however, as you already have the necessary materials to finish the project. 3 Gold or so per shield left should work well for this. Rushed PWs are done immediately, and you don't have to wait a turn to make use of them.
Forests, hills, and tundra would impose a 50% expense increase on PW, and mountains and glaciers would impose a 100% increase. This means they require more shields *and* take longer to finish (for only 2 shields of work are done each turn).
IMHO, there should be small and large rivers. Small Rivers should exist between squares and work as they did in cIIIv. Large rivers should be lik cIIv rivers and be on squares. Roads on Large Rivers are 200% more expensive to build and require construction.
Civilizations at war with you automatically raid PW squares of yours they enter. This destroys the project and gives the ...

Civ 4 the List: Terrain & Terrain Improvements

Introduction
Terrain; the environment of our civ. Terrain improvements; the ways civ alters its environment. Here; the place to find ideas on how this should be done in Civ4!-List Threadmaster Nikolai
Summary
In the start of the discussion, the "terrain" and the "terrain improvements" parts of the list was most debated. People are mostly agreeing on the need of a new and vastly improved terrain/map, but when it comes to the actual kind of new terrains, the ideas are splitting.
Later in the discussion process, the old public works vs. workers discussion arose. Pages after pages of this discussion filled the threads, and many ideas was proposed and debated.
The third large discussion point, was railroads and transportation. Most people think that it have to be changed. Infinite movement for example, is not particularly popular everywhere, one might say.
Related Threads
Radical Ideas
Spherical World
Things to Borrow from Other Games
Squares, Hexes, Octagons...
Terrain Improvements?
The design decision that can have a huge impact
Growth - should it be related to food?
Customizable Auto Workers
What's in Civ4. Just the facts, ma'am
Civ IV will have a 3D map! Discussion of possibilities
Railroads?
A vision of cIV
Terrain:Public Works System - Ideas
Terrain:Workers System - Ideas
Table of Contents
1 - The Terrain
2 - Terrain improvements
3 - Worker and PW ideas
4 - Transportation over the map
5 - Cities
6 - Pollution
7 - Mini-map
8 - Climate and weather
Conclusion
The Ideas
1 - The terrain
1.1 - Harsher environment
It should never be possible to irrigate desert or tundra EVER. Most military units that cross them should die, as should be the case with mountains and jungles. Forests and jungles should create plains when cut down. Irrigation should be curtailed.
(Posted By Sandman)
Agreementos with the 'harsher environment' idea, but if it's implemented, better make sure that the player is guaranteed at least a stretch of 'nice' environment, with room for 4-5 cities - otherwise it'll easily get really friggin' annoying.
(Posted by Stefu)
1.2 - Terrain technology
1.2.1 - Back to SMAC
Go back toward SMAC. have certain characteristics like elevation, ruggedness, trees, grass, rocks, sand, moisture, temparature. Treat north and south poles as in Civ2. Include fungus terrain characteristic in editor.
(Posted By Brent)
1.2.2 - Spherical world
Spheric world!!If it would be done well and nice, it could really bring some immersion, hype and a bit more sense (not including the graphics ).
(Posted by trifna)
I am strongly in favour of a civilization game with a spherical map. The reasons why a spherical map would be an improvement include:
1. A spherical map would be more realistic. The polar areas could be fully implemented, withn the possibility of nuclear exchanges over the poles, for example.2. A spherical map would reinvigorate the game, presenting a new challenge to long-time civ players, who've grown accustomed to playing on a flat map. No other grand-strategy game has used a spherical map to my knowledge, and if civ doesn't get it, some other game will.3. A spherical map would be aesthetically pleasing, particularly if it was combined with a renewed investment in the terrain graphics.
(Posted by Sandman)
1.2.3 - Triangular/octagonal pixels
Triangular Pixels!
Or octagonal to increase the accuracy of the modeling and to maximize strategic assault patterns.
(Posted by DarkCloud
1.2.4 - Hexgrid
I would support a hexgrid.With a hexgrid, some adjustments would need to be made as there would only be 18 tiles in a city radius. Here are some suggestions (these suggestions generally have to deal with the population explosion of the late 19th/20th centuries that is so poorly represented in Civ I, II and III):
Either when a certian tech is gained or when a city reaches a predetermined population (ie: 1-6 = town, 7-12 = city, 13+ = Metropololis) the city expands to a third ring of tiles (anything more than 3, like in CTPII, I think would be too much). The increase in available tiles will reflect in a larger population and thus more accurately represent the modern age.
(Posted by donegeal)
We can also look at the possibility of hexagons with four-sided figures.
(Posted by Trifna)
1.2.5 - Multiple level map
How about a multiple level map, like ToT, so there is a level for land, a level for undersea, a level for orbit, and so on.
1.3 - Suburbs
1.3.1 - Suburbs in a hexgrid
[On the discussion about using a hexgrid]However, since most Civ players aren't going to space their cities 6 hexs apart to take advantage of the additonal hex ring, I would also like to see the worker job of "Build Suburb" added. As I stated in another thread, the action would consume the worker and place a "town" graphic on the grid. Now if the "Build Suburb" action was limited to the inner ring of hexs surrounding the actual city, we would get a fine graphical representation of "Urban Sprawl". Now to fix the actual population explosion problem I mentioned at the on set of this post, I would have the "Build Suburb" action add two food to the tile it is built on (now I know that building a suburb on farm land does NOT increase the food gained from that farm, but the added food will reflect a higher population in the city it is attached to to better represent the population explosion).(Posted by donegeal)
1.3.2 - Worker builds suburbs
I have also be wanting a good way to deal with Urban Sprawl/Suburbs. Currently, for astetic reasons, I use the Urban Sprawl graphic for rail roads. Looks good, but then you get the Urban Sprawl everywhere. I have been wanting a "Suburb" tile improvement. The graphic would be similar to a "town". Suburbs would only be allowed to be built in the inner eight squares surrounding the actual city (maybe even giving cities the ability to build naval/costal things even if they are one tile back of the coast) and only on flat terrain (Grassland, Plains, Desert). Have a suburb add one or two of each food/shield/commerce (added food to show that the city is now larger population wise, added shield to show that there is infact more than one city working to complete something, and added commerce for all the extra trade that goes on). Building a Suburb comsumes the worker.(Posted By donegeal)
1.3.3 - City growth builds suburbs
When a city gets to a certain size, any additional growth has a chance of happening not in the city center, but in a suburb. This turns a surrounding tile into a "suburb" tile. These tiles do not produce food, or shields, but can hold up to 5 citizens which can be made into tax collectors, or workers, or whatever.
The upside is that it gives you a lot of flexibility in terms of whether you want the city to be commercial or producing or science, etc. The down side is that you have to double irrigate, or farm other tiles to feed them. And you have to defend them from enemy attack.(Posted by wrylachlan)
1.3.4 - Suburbs must not increase food output
I like the "build suburb" idea, but INCREASE FOOD?! WTF?! What we really need to increase is Production and trade. In civ3 those specialists were goddamn worthless.(Posted by Azazel)
1.4 - Terrain-specific Civs
Let some Civs be more suited to specific terrain types, such as mountains, arctic, desert, forest, and islands.(Posted By Brent)
1.5 - Text and names on terrain
1.5.1 - Naming of the terrain
However, past units it would be fun to have the option of giving names to terrain features. No default random ones to clutter the map, but (deleteable) ones you make like 'Monte Cassino', 'the Little Big Horn', the Mississippi, the Rhine, the Urals, etc. Names for map places that you can put anywhere and turn off if you don't want to see them.(Posted by Seeker)
Place names. It would be good to have the option to put the place names in game (and obviously when editing an scenario).(Posted by Kramsib)
1.5.2 - Ability to add text on the terrain
The ability to right click on terrain and add text (from SMAC). This adds a great deal to the experience.(jimmytrick)
1.6 - Landmarks
Landmarks: like in SMAC.(Posted by J-S)
1.7 - Terrain affects units
1.7.1 - Damage from some terrain types
Terrain afects units: some units should not be able to cross certain terrains without damage. That is afterall why both Napoleon and Hitler failed in Russia.(Posted by J-S)
1.7.2 - Chance to damage units in certain terrains
Certain terrains have a percentage chance each turn you move through them of taking away hitpoints. It could be as though the terrain itself were a unit and it "attacks" you as you go by. Certain units or civs would be more immune than others to these effects ie. Mayans have no jungle penalty or a late game Special Forces unit that is imune to all terrain penalties...(Posted by wrylachlan)
1.8 - No tile overlay
As for radical... I'd love to see a sphere witout any sort of tile overlay. You would tell units to go to coordinates instead.(Posted by Fosse)
1.9 - Terrain types
1.9.1 - Volcanoes
1.9.1.1 - Active and dormant volcano
Dormant is very fertile, but has a risk of becoming active...(Posted by Seeker)
Volcano terrain - great benefits while dormant: tourism, fertile af...

Civ 4 the List: Space

Introduction
Space - the final frontier. While the development of space exploration is incredibly recent looking at the span of human history, it is also become profoundly important.
How should Civilization 4 handle space?
Summary
One of mankind's great achievements in the modern era, space flight has played an important role in shaping the world - from satellites to space stations. Space has always played a role in Civilization, ranging from constructing the Apollo Program to building a spaceship to Alpha Centauri. What directions should Civ 4 take space in?
Related Threads
The Moon
Table of Contents
1. The Space Race
2. Satellites
3. Diplomacy in Space
4. Military in Space
5. Space Colonization
Conclusion
The Ideas
1. The Space Race
1.1 Multi-tiered space race
In all the other civ games, the space portion of the game happens when you research "space flight" and build the apollo program. Then you immediately jump into building a large spaceship.
I was thinking that the atmosphere could be improved by adding details and such - How about while you are building the Apollo wonder, by making progress it pops up notifications for you and your opponents?
For example at 20% completion you might get the message "Your civilization has launched a manmade object into space", at 40% "You have put a man into space", at 60% "You have put a man in orbit", and eventually "You have put a man on the moon".
Something like this would, I think, make the space race actually seem a bit more like a realistic space race without necissarily making things more complicated. (ixnay)
1.2 Happiness and the space race
The space race should have an influence on happiness and vice versa (if another, enemy nation is winning the space race) (Herzog)
2. Satellites
2.1 Types of Satellites
Research Satellites: Whether it's inward (weather & habitat monitoring), or outward (Hubble and Chandra space telescopes), satellites are important for research. They could give a set amount or a small percentage boost to research. (Laszlo)
Commercial Satellites: Bonuses to commerce through better communications, GPS technology, etc. Prospecting can reveal new supplies of resources like oil and better managing of resources like fisheries and farms (bonuses limited ...

Civ 4 the List: Scenario / Map Editor

Introduction
Here's the Scenario/Map Editor section of the list; dealing with all modability and customizability and rules editing for the Map Editor as well as all possible Game Modifications and Scenarios and additions that might be added to Civ IV.
Thanks! List Threadmaster DarkCloud
Summary
Basically, the major desire of the scenario creating community is for Civilization IV to be more Scenario-building friendly than Civ III.
One of the major desires was for the limitations on population limits and map size to be raised or destroyed altogether since in these days of 3 GHZ+ computers and computers with 512MB+ RAM, most computers can handle that sort of power.Therefore, most people desired "more" customizability and "more" power.
Related Threads
{The List} Scenario/Map Editor, DarkCloud
Civ2 Editor style or Civ3?, Nuclear Master
Table of Contents
1.0.0 The Scenario Editor
2.0.0 Scripting Language
3.0.0 Map Editor
4.0.0 Maps
5.0.0 Scenarios
6.0.0 Resources
7.0.0 Unit/Wonder/Improvement Modability
8.0.0 Editor Support
9.0.0 Civlopedia
Conclusion
The Ideas
1.0.0 The Scenario Editor
1.1.0 Basic Design Philosophy
*I think the civ2 editor works better for creating scenarios, because you could basically make any concievable starting position, but it's not as good for editing rules and stuff.
They should be hybridized somehow. Perhaps there should be a rules editor, and then you can load a rules file and make the scenario in a civ2 style editor.-Jaguar Warrior
1.2.0 The Cheat Mode
*The Game needs a Cheat-Mode option for easy modification either "in game" (a la Civ II) or in a special scenario-editor image screen.*The Cheat Mode should also be included in the regular game as a 'sandbox mode' for newbies or people who enjoy to cheat.-Jaguar Warrior
1.3.0 No Limits
*It would be very nice indeed if the various limits (maximum city population, maximum number of units, maximum map size, maximum number of civilization, maximum number of unit types, maximum number of terrain types, etc.) were set very, very high indeed. (ed- Especially since computers nowadays are much more powerful than computers in the past.)These limits can hamper the creation of scenarios, partucularly large scenarios - I certainly had that problem in Civilization 2 - The Gold Edition.-Roman
1.4.0 In-Game Editor
*In Civilization 3, I never even bothered creating scenarios. The out of game editor was actually a major turn-off, since it is frequently much easier to create scenarios through a combination of playing and editing/modification than through an editor alone. Hence, I would strongly recommend an in-game scenario editor for Civ IV.-Roman
1.5.0 Flags
*I want to be able to make national flags for nations in scenarios-POTUS
1.6.0 Tierd Maps
*I'd really like if they put back the ability to play on multi-tiered maps, like in Civ2ToT, although it might not be realistic to have them permanently fixed together (teleporting from one hex brings you automatically to the same numbered hex on any map you can go to); but perhaps there can be designated 'link-points' between the maps like in Sim City 2004 or in Heroes of Might and Magic III?-Jawn Henry
1.7.0 Altering Maps Slightly Still Allows Players to get in Hall of Fame
*Be able to alter city lists but still be in the hall of fame.-Brent
1.8.0 Turn Off Features in the Game
*Be able to turn off major features of the game, like military leaders, continental congress, religion, combat, cities, technological advancement, wonders, etc. Turning off military leaders would be good for civs with limited available names.-Brent
1.9.0 Minieditor use allows the Hall of Fame
*Have a separate minieditor where you can only change things that will not affect the fairness of the game, like giving one civ a combination of characteristics that a different one has anyway; city lists; barbarian tribe lists, graphics for rulers, cities, and the palace, etc. Things that would not disallow the Hall of Fame. Have it as a minieditor so you can set things to use more than once, but also be able to set these options in an optional extended startup.
*altering graphics, unit names, and improvement names. Also be able to re...

Latest Articles

The List for Civ IV was a project that could not have been accomplished without the hard work and dedication of the many Threadmasters and ideas-finders on the forums. While idea-suggestors are likewise important, I have compiled here a list of the volunteers who went above and beyond the call of duty to take on the task of threadmastering a thread for the List.
And here they are, alphabetically:
Asmodean- Former Administrator of the List
Azazel- Government and Social Engineering
DarkCloud- Administrator; Civilizations, General, Scenario/Map Editor; List Formatter
Fosse- The Polls
Ixnay- Space
Lajzar- Units
MattH- Cheats
Nikolai- AI, Resources, Terrain
Octavian X- Wonders
Platypus Rex- Regional and City Menus
TechWins- Diplomacy
Trifna- Movement/Supply, User Friendliness
...

And so now the list has drawn to a close. Thousands of ideas have been culled from the Civ III community at Apolyton. Hopefully the list that we propose here has been easy enough to search through and hopefully it will lead to a great parnership between the players and the corporation.Good luck with your struggles and please, keep civving!
-DarkCloudList Administrator
PS: Here's a link to the Civ III-Ideas List compiled by Apolyton Fans on July 14, 1999 - Civ III List in case you wish to compare it to the current creation...

Introduction
Realizing that some polls about hot topics have already left the top page, and that newcomers to the discussion seldom dig through the back pages in order to find out what's been discussed before, I've decided to compile a list of the Civ 4 List related polls.
I've abandoned keeping a running talley of votes, as it's a great deal of work that is immediatley outdated, and if you really were interested in the results you would visit the poll and read the comments.
Now... the polls:
Stacked vs. Single Unit Combat: The Battle ContinuesShould units be stacked into "armies" that fight and operate as a single unit, or does moving them one at a time provide a boost to strategic considerations?
Resources: How to HandleIs a system with stores and limits on resources a better simulation and more fun, or tedious micromangement?
From Civ 3 to Civ 4More of the same, or a bold new direction for Civ 4?
Squares, Hexes, Octagons... Pick your poison, the traditional Civ Map, traditional War Games map, or something else entirely.
Eras in Civ 4?Is the new era system a great addition, or a stifling hindrance?
Espionage & Assymetrical WarfareDoes Bond get his own unit?
To 2000 AD or Beyond?Civ, From the Ancients to the Stars; or Civ, The Whole of Human History.
{The List} United NationsA resolution for change... do you Veto?
{The List} What Should Happen to Civ Traits?Should Civ 4 have homogenous Civs or even more differences?
Terrain Improvements"Give me Workers, or Give me Death" vs "Micromagement Gives me Death."
Nomads and ChiefdomsShould Civ 4 let us wander the great wide open?
Civ 4 ideas - straights and canalsDo you want straigts? Or canals?
Civ 4 idea: Armies instead of unitsOnce again, armies or single units?
Health in Civ 4?Should we have sick Civs?
Emphasis on AgeWhich historical era, if any, should get a boost in Civ 4?
Civ 4 resistanceDo you want partisans from Civ 2? Resistors from Civ 3? Or something new for Civ 4?
Fire and MovementHow should firepower and movement rates affect combat in Civ 4?
Stacking Limits Y/NAssuming we have stacks, what sorts of stack limits should there be?
Improved Poll: When should Civilization IV end?What is a good time for the game to end?
Future Techs in Civ 4Which future era techs would you like in Civ 4?
What ARE wonders, anyway?Well? What are they?
Pollution Managers:Would you like Pollution Managment added to city screen?
Tech Transmission
Here is some food for thought from Civfanatics.
-Respectfully Compiled by Fosse...

Introduction
The concept of the great Wonders of the World in Civ is as old as the series itself. For years, civvers around the world have built Pyramids, Great Libraries, Magellanic Voyages, and trips to the Moon.
And, as Civ has gone from I to II to III, wonders have been added, removed, or have changed in some way. With Civ3 came the idea of Small Wonders that each nation had the oppertunity to build individually, further widening the effect of these great projects.
As Civ4 looms over the horizon, how will the concept of Wonders of the World evolve further?
Summary
As you can see, I'm still coming up with ideas already proposed and boiling them down into a list. The links I have found to all threads in this forum pertaining to wonders has been included. If you have some more links, or brand new ideas, please feel free to post them in this thread.
Related Threads
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=75460
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=106609
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=107349
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=117222
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=107895
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=111317
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=114759
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=115569
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=117740
http://apolyton.net/showthread.php?threadid=117222
Table of Contents
New Wonder Ideas
Changes to Existing Wonders
New Wonder Concepts
Conclusion
The Ideas
I. New Wonder Ideas
This section goes on the idea that the concept of the ‘wonder’ in Civ will not change from Civ3 to Civ4, that players will still accumulate production in a race with other civs in their attempt to build a wonder. Listed at those specific ideas for a brand new wonder.
Statue of Liberty
No so much a new wonder, but bringing back a great one from Civ2. A civ with this wonder, in Civ2, could switch to any government type, irregardless of possession of the prerequisite tech, with no anarchy time. In Civ2, it was rendered mostly useless by the fact that one could switch governments without penalty every four turns (the classic Odeo years).Arrian
Banaue Rice Terraces
>Ancient - allows irrigation on hills (weak, needs more benefit, maybe cut irrigation time or allow hills/forests/mountains to act as irrigated square for the purposes of irrigating next to it).Solomwi
Channel Tunnel
Modern/Late Industrial - allows ground units to move across single tile straits without ships.Solomwi
Machu Picchu
Late Ancient - allows settlement on mountains.Solomwi
Attitude/Reputation Wonders
Bring back some of the old ones from Civ2 that could modify relations with neighbors. (Eiffel, Marco Polo, etc.)Solomi
Apian Way (Small Wonder)
Originally Roman Empire, huge boon to trade (25-50% for every city connected by it) and unit movement along its length (4 tiles instead of three like other roads).
For those who love micromanaging, the Wonder could cost a city less to "produce," but workers would return to existing roads for an additional one or two turns per tile, resulting in a straighter road graphic or a different color. Building the AW from scr...

Introduction
User Friendliness- what makes the game easy to play. The Manual- the guides to Civ I and II provided historical information and pull-out charts that gave the game character- will Civ IV have such things? Or will the manual merely be a cheap on-line PDF? Help Files- how easily can the owners of the game find their way around it once accessing the game itself?
Summary
While this wasnt the most glamours of sections, it is in some ways the most important because without easy accessibility, Civilization would be both unfun and impossible to play. Many ideas which could fall in this area were included in other sections, thus its sparseness can be explained by the universality in where these help information can be put in.
Table of Contents
The Ideas
Conclusion
The Ideas
Historical Garbage: Forget the historical stuff about units. Most people never read it and it doesn't enhance gameplay.-Kuciwalker
(It should be noted, however that a significant group of civvers actually appreciates these historical things and the fact that they are in the game makes it more educational and acceptable to teachers and parents trying to teach their children through learning. It also makes the game more 'intellectual' and provides a good reference.)-DarkCloud
Generating Civlopedia Entries IN THE EDITOR:: Make it easy to generate Civpedia entries IN THE EDITOR.-Kuciwalker
A "?" to click on and point at elements: I propose that somewhere at the top of the screen there would be a litte interrogation mark to click on. If you click on it, there will be a bunch of very visible interrogation marks each place on the present screen you can get a little text explaining how it works, what it is and ev...

Introduction
This is meant as a discussion of two principal aspects of the game: what units should appear in the game, and the effects of the various unit attribute flags.
Of secondary importance is finding a way to integrate unit statistics with whatever combat method is chosen; it is generally agreed that balancing stats will depend a lot on how combat (stacked vs 1:1 vs other) is implemented.
Summary
One recurring theme across the various lists for each generation of civ was for a unit workshop, similar to smac. I believe this would be bad for civ. While it could reflect the historical range of units if constrained with a uitably detailed complex ruleset, this rulset would be unreasonably complex for a game, forcing an extra level of management. In addition, it would make it extremely hard to mod the graphics, and all but impossible to create mods with fantasy units.
Most people agree that civ3 had far too few units in the game. The big jumps in the capabilities at each critical tech gave an overwhelming advantage to teh tech leader, as well as giving a somewhat disjointed view of history.
With assymetric units, there is clearly a strong desire for these functions to be implemented. The main debate is on whether or not units are the best means of implementing these functions. This a decision that should be made on a group by group basis. There is very little desire for religious units or lawyers, but worker functions are evenly split on whether units are the best method to put them in the game.
Related Threads
Civ4 Idea: Armies instead of Units
Stacked vs. Single Unit Combat - The Battle Continues
Some sort of unit design allowed?
Civ4 Units
Table of Contents
2.0 Miscellaneous Thoughts
5.0 Units
Conclusion
The Ideas
Organized by: Lajzar...