RE: Do you think that aliens would bother to come to a highly superstitious planet?

I do like the idea of aliens being insect-like.
Insects seem well defined and purposeful, especially Bees.
It's horrible how they're currently having survival issues. Ok... so I like Bees.

I think in the end, I just feel like I'm a secular person who has a skeptical eye toward any extraordinary claim, carefully examining any extraordinary evidence before jumping to conclusions. ~ Eric ~ My friend ... who figured it out.

RE: Do you think that aliens would bother to come to a highly superstitious planet?

(30-06-2012 05:09 PM)kim Wrote:

(29-06-2012 10:13 PM)LabMonster13 Wrote: Well at least I thought it was an interesting idea.

Ha - it is an interesting idea. It's possible some of us may be excited rather than hostile, although I actually speak for no one but me.
I also think LabMonster, some of us may have gathered from your writing, that you already have a preconceived notion of sorts... of Atheist, humanoid-like aliens, who come to Earth to interact with Atheist humans, and whew -aren't we lucky that we've given up superstition or we'd be fucked. Maybe to some it seems as if you've come for some blind confirmation. Possibly some don't see consideration given or see enough of a brainstorm evident to arrive at an original idea. Hmm.

Humanity is humanity for a reason... it took a long time to get this way, and evolution does not take "the best of the best"... because that may not provide the best possibilities to adapt and survive. We're quite fragile in many ways, but often and quite profoundly, this vulnerability reminds us of our strength as humans, continually overcoming adversity both genetically and psychologically. Logically, everything builds on itself... development is key.

A famous marine biologist recently acknowledged that the term "fish" is the most completely absurd and incorrect classification we have, because so very many things we call fish are so completely not fish. Oh, we pretend we know what fish are like; we make them talk and give them recognizable personalities in movies -we make them mommy and daddy fish... "fish are not food, fish are friends". But we really have no idea how fish feel or if they feel at all. Do fish have emotion? Do they desire, fear, care, excite, hate? How, and very importantly why? Fish are right here in our oceans, yet we haven't much of a clue as to what they must be like.

If we don't know what fish are like, how would we - how could we possibly know what aliens might be like?
Maybe some feel that starting with humans could be kind of ass backward when considering what an alien might be like. Notions too narrow show us nothing of where we've been or where we might be headed... to say nothing of how we might perceive an alien at any given moment.

Don't know. Just brainstorming here. Any new thoughts?

I am glad that you think it makes an
interesting idea. I do tend to lean toward atheistic aliens, only
because it seems the most logical to me. I do come to this point of
view from a lot of experience and knowledge. From my point of view
the more that you develop a world view from facts and truth, the more
you begin to see the possibilities expand. I think that it is far
more likely that an alien civilization would develop a world view
closer to Carl Sagon, then it would of someone like, lets say, Dick
Cheney. Our rise to the top of the animal food chain is a product of
our unity and ability to work together towards a common goal. People
have it stuck in their heads of this notion of survival of the
fittest. This notion coming more from eugenics, than from evolution.
The point is that we didn't become the dominate species on this
planet by going off on our own, we got there thru working together.

The problem with being superstitious,
is that it can effect things in very subtle ways. Take for instance
the problem with drivers not paying attention to the road. There are
a lot of factors that come into play but, on average the more
experienced driver would be a more cautious driver then a less
experienced one. But you have new developments with new technology.
People that think their imaginary friend is looking out for them are
going to be more likely to be texting while driving then someone who
does not have that point of view. Unfortunately there are a lot of
people out there that just pay a little less attention to what they
are doing because they feel that they are being guided or looked
after by their imaginary friend. The scariest part is that it is very
common.

I think that there are similar notions
but just as an example: Humans need each other to survive and grow. A
human on its own is relatively weak and has no real natural weapons
anymore it needs to rely on other humans to make it. Cheetahs on the
other hand do not need other cheetahs to survive. I think you get the
idea. Unfortunately we are seeing the effects of these erroneous
ideas with the 1% compared to the 99%. It is foolish to think that if
you have ridiculous amounts of money that you can survive without
other people or just with a small amount of people you think are
worthy. The most frustrating aspect is that many people have bought
into this idea that it just has to be this way because it is. If you
take the money figures from the 60s to today, the minimum wage should
be at around $25.00 an hour. Also we are guarantied a lawyer but not
a doctor? And what are some of the arguments people come up with?
“If everybody was rich no body would do anything.”. Wrong. That
is simply not true. Would there be some? Yes of coarse there would
be but so what? I think that would be wonderful world to live in. The
point is that there are many better things for the whole world to be
doing then the nonsense that is happening now.

Oh yes. We know very little about the
creatures of the sea. (Sharks remind me of big dogs when I see them
interact with things.) And the possibilities are vast. Basically I
have to start somewhere so right now I am looking at the behavior and
our own notions. Yes the whole idea of this thread is to brainstorm.
To entertain the possibilities. Just because I happen to be an
atheist does not mean that I do not like fantasies or fairy tales. I
do see much room for improvement though. For instance: Take the movie
ALIEN and Prometheus. The two stories are vastly different in terms
of logic and believability. ALIEN = Awesome. Prometheus = poop. If
you take these movies just in terms of education you can see a
reflection of the world we live in today. Okay, I know this is a bit
on the long side. Sorry about that. D: But I do thank you for your
interest and your brainstorming. Lots to ponder and I thank you for
it.

"No matter how old or young everyone is worth it, everyone can learn and no one is beneath you unless they claim to be above you." -Myself

RE: Do you think that aliens would bother to come to a highly superstitious planet?

(30-06-2012 06:52 PM)kim Wrote: I do like the idea of aliens being insect-like.
Insects seem well defined and purposeful, especially Bees.
It's horrible how they're currently having survival issues. Ok... so I like Bees.

I understand obsessions with bees. My
dad farms some as a hobby, so believe me I understand it. Yes the
issues are unfortunate and it turns out that the most likely cause of
their problem is pesticides. Shocking :|

"No matter how old or young everyone is worth it, everyone can learn and no one is beneath you unless they claim to be above you." -Myself

RE: Do you think that aliens would bother to come to a highly superstitious planet?

(30-06-2012 05:25 PM)Chas Wrote:

(30-06-2012 05:09 PM)kim Wrote: If we don't know what fish are like, how would we - how could we possibly know what aliens might be like?

Maybe some feel that starting with humans could be kind of ass backward
when considering what an alien might be like. Notions too narrow show
us nothing of where we've been or where we might be headed... to say
nothing of how we might perceive an alien at any given moment.

Interesting. One reason to start with humans is that humans are intelligent, conscious, while fish are not. An interesting model is to think about how we might communicate with dolphins, elephants, dogs, etc. - species that appear to have some level of intelligence, but not the same as human intelligence.

Aliens that can master science and technology to cross interstellar distances are likely more comparable to humans than to fish; but they may be more comparable to bees or termites.

I'd like humanity to have contact with aliens before I die.

Yes exactly. Though I think it is an
interesting problem to try portray realistically intelligent alien
creatures trying to communicate with us much the same way we try to
communicate with dogs. I worry that they would not want to make
contact with a planet that still can't seem to get over its
superstitions. Who knows though maybe the ones that have would be the
ones that will?

"No matter how old or young everyone is worth it, everyone can learn and no one is beneath you unless they claim to be above you." -Myself

RE: Do you think that aliens would bother to come to a highly superstitious planet?

Alien: Oh hey guys look, a planet with life!
Another Alien: Shit man, those guys are blowing each other up and think some sky daddy is in charge of all their decisions.
Alien: Nah it can't be that bad. Surely they're reasonable.
Another Alien: But what if they think we're demons or something?
Alien: Fuck. You know what, we'll leave some crop circles and give them some stuff for TV and come back in a few hundred years and see how it goes.

I think in the end, I just feel like I'm a secular person who has a skeptical eye toward any extraordinary claim, carefully examining any extraordinary evidence before jumping to conclusions. ~ Eric ~ My friend ... who figured it out.

RE: Do you think that aliens would bother to come to a highly superstitious planet?

We could also be a bad joke. I am pretty sure that if I came across a planet like this where most of the population believed something verifiably crazy, I would go back to my home planet and say "You have to see this!" You're never going to believe it." Then I would tell everyone about the civilization that is not too far behind our own that believes these crazy ideas, so that my people could prepare an invasion force to wipe humans out or prepare my own planet for the violence about to head our way when humans learn to travel at FTL speeds or become capable of detecting my civilization. We humans do bring death and destruction to those outside our group. Being a different species or our own species, but different culture.

RE: Do you think that aliens would bother to come to a highly superstitious planet?

My thinking is that to know we were superstitious they would have to have observed us for a length of time that allowed them to understand us from the point of a completely alien culture to clarity (not to mention the linguistic variables). They would have then been exposed to our past to really understand what a bunch of raving loonies most people are and how easy they dehumanize each other, let alone truly alien creatures. Yeah, they'd put a big space buoy on the outer edge of the solar system that says "Do not enter" and move on.