Quote:does any one have an idea about this style of tae kwon do i think its habkieo or Hapkido or hapkido

Hapkido is not Tae Kwon Do, it is not a sport and it is effective in live combat, no flying kicks. After ten years of hapkido it upsets me when people say it is like TKD!!! I hope razor foot shuts you down!!

Quote:does any one have an idea about this style of tae kwon do i think its habkieo or Hapkido or hapkido

Hapkido is not Tae Kwon Do, it is not a sport and it is effective in live combat, no flying kicks. After ten years of hapkido it upsets me when people say it is like TKD!!! I hope razor foot shuts you down!!

*storms off angrily*

First of all to yaze, I am sorry for being so abrupt, I am not usually like this, I am just dealing with a few things right now. I have tried to find out what you are talking about, but I cant, maybe if you told me a bit more about it, like the proper name I will try my hardest to help you out! I owe you that much at least. Once again I am sorry brother!!

I never insulted TKD!!!!! I have merly pointed out the larger holes TKD has because it doesnt deal with all contingencies "just kick him in the head"...well what if you cant....then what? I have often wondered why you all take such offense!!

Quote: Hate to tell you this but anything thing with punches, kicks, strikes, or any form of defense is combat effective.

You kick in soccer.....what type of art is that? you can punch/slap a volleyball, what art is that? No a sport is a sport, a combat art is a combat art! TKD WAS a combat art! But the sport aspect is killing it! Tell me how many militaries teach their armies TKD, or kicking in hand to hand combat? then tell me how mwny militaries teach a style that is more like HKD. That should be the final answer for this! Because that is a way to tell combat effectivness, how many militaries back it!That sounds pretty fair to me!

Quote: It depends on the individual and how you apply it. I have been trying to explain that to you since day one but for some reason you fail to see it.

Yes the individual is the most important part of the art, however if two individuals of equal skill should meet up, the one with the stronger art will win! Can you disagree? UFC statistics will prove me right. I use UFC because TKD doesnt cater for grapplers as assailants, TKD is only useful against another TKDer! But again this is only what I have found, therefore my opinion!

Quote: Boxing has no kicks, no take downs, no grappling, and no chokes but it is very combat effective. A skilled boxer can take you apart. And guess what, last I checked boxing was a sport.

Yes boxing is a hell of a defense style as well as sport, could a boxer beat a MT fighter? I doubt it. MT is a more efficient strike art than TKD, it has a greater arsenal, it doesnt have take downs. It kicks low, pnches elbow and knees, it does however have grappling, I would back MT against TKD anytime.

I myself box and it was my first art, in a street fight I would back a boxer against a TKD artist!

Also in regard to boxing being a sport, the rules of excecution outside and inside the ring are the same! In the ring TKD cant punch the face, outside they can, but they dont train for it...... I hope you understand!

Quote: But I am sure with your skills, you could have easily defeated someone like a Roy Jones Jr or an Oscar De La Hoya in their prime. No Problem with a young Mike Tyson either I am sure. With your skills, you would have easily gotten through their defenses and choke them out. Sure, no problem.

If I trained everyday for as long as they did, to fight professionally, then yes! Would it be easy....NO! It is never easy to fight, maybe that is another TKD myth! I also believe that I would have a easier time against TKD than boxing.

Also I am upset that you think I am a ground fighter, or a UFC groupie, I am as much a striker as you, I would start by taking out there legs. It is just that I am prepared for more than A TKD artist, because my art HKD is more complete than TKD and I suppliment it as well.

Would you say that HKD as an art, forget all that its the individual, I am talking techniques they teach, less effective for SD than TKD. SD is what all MA should be about!

Tell me Mr Foot could you beat those boxers in your prime and find it easy to get them with a spinning back flying kick!! That was a childish statenent!!

Before you attempt to delete this post, as you have done with all my other posts that disagree with you, or lock the thread, I am not being personally disrespectful but merely raising my opinions, which is what forums are about! you will be glad to know I will then PM it to everybody already on this thread. Then I will make a complaint to ADMIN!

Quote:Before you attempt to delete this post, as you have done with all my other posts that disagree with you, or lock the thread, I am not being personally disrespectful but merely raising my opinions, which is what forums are about! you will be glad to know I will then PM it to everybody already on this thread. Then I will make a complaint to ADMIN!

I have been quite toleant up to this point, but this sort of comment goes over the boundries of civil behavior.

Trust that the Admin and all the Moderators are aware.

I am disapointed that time and time again you violate your own code of ethics with reagard to pacifism. Pacifism is not only avoiding violence in actions, but also in your words.

You give the impression that anyone who does not agree with you is stupid or uninformed. If this is not the case, you are choosing your words poorly.

The individuals who are moderators on this site are so because of their dedication and knowledge of a particular MA or multiple MA's. They are not appointed at a mere whim of the Admin.

You continue to confront others in a hostile manner with little regard for their feelings or experience. I would not expect this will be permitted to continue unabated.

In short, you dishonor yourself.

Take a step back, reflect on your verbal behavior, and modify your attitude.

It takes quite a bit to push my buttons Sir, and you have mashed it quite hard.

_________________________"If you're gonna be stupid, you better be tough."

H2whoa I am saddened that you think all TKD practitioners are the same. In my limited years in martial arts I have met some outstanding individuals that were simply put ... amazing. They didn't compete in sporting events but trained for SD ... as I do. I have even seen some that would more then be a match for a boxer just with their TKD skills and no other. Again like many, TKD is being painted with the same brush!

As with "every" martial art there are holes that some will fill and others won't. In our system we do with Hapkido, JJJ and BJJ. We don't even mind stealing things like the clinch or elbows or anything that is useful. Obviously you must have seen holes in your martial arts to have cross trained in so many. If one such as Hapkido ... and I respect this art (as well as the others) ... were so effective for SD then why would there be any need to train further?

Not all TKD people kick to the head and infact we learn the opposite, BUT you had better believe if I have a chance to ring your bell then consider it rung. Another misconception you have about TKD is there is no grappling which is the furtherest from the truth. In the higher belt levels this is taught as well as higher SD training. What I think you are doing is talking sport TKD which has diluted much of the art but didn't really get to the meat of it to see what it actual is and has to offer.

TKD is only good against another TKD person ... wrong again. I know of individuals with TKD training that have competed in both Kickboxing and Muay Thai tournaments and dominated. Again this boils down to the person with the art and can be the only "true measurement".

Perhaps if you don't have much regard for TKD you may wish to stay off of the Taekwondo forum and hang around the BJJ/MMA forum or any other that more fits your profile.

I don't say this as a bad thing I just wish you would look at things with an open mind. TKD may have not worked for you but it does for others. And for a fact, TKD has been trained to the military ... both the Korean and US Marines.

Quote:does any one have an idea about this style of tae kwon do i think its habkieo or Hapkido or hapkido

Hapkido is not Tae Kwon Do, it is not a sport and it is effective in live combat, no flying kicks. After ten years of hapkido it upsets me when people say it is like TKD!!! I hope razor foot shuts you down!!

*storms off angrily*

First of all to yaze, I am sorry for being so abrupt, I am not usually like this, I am just dealing with a few things right now. I have tried to find out what you are talking about, but I cant, maybe if you told me a bit more about it, like the proper name I will try my hardest to help you out! I owe you that much at least. Once again I am sorry brother!!

I never insulted TKD!!!!! I have merly pointed out the larger holes TKD has because it doesnt deal with all contingencies "just kick him in the head"...well what if you cant....then what? I have often wondered why you all take such offense!!

Quote: Hate to tell you this but anything thing with punches, kicks, strikes, or any form of defense is combat effective.

You kick in soccer.....what type of art is that? you can punch/slap a volleyball, what art is that? No a sport is a sport, a combat art is a combat art! TKD WAS a combat art! But the sport aspect is killing it! Tell me how many militaries teach their armies TKD, or kicking in hand to hand combat? then tell me how mwny militaries teach a style that is more like HKD. That should be the final answer for this! Because that is a way to tell combat effectivness, how many militaries back it!That sounds pretty fair to me!

Quote: It depends on the individual and how you apply it. I have been trying to explain that to you since day one but for some reason you fail to see it.

Yes the individual is the most important part of the art, however if two individuals of equal skill should meet up, the one with the stronger art will win! Can you disagree? UFC statistics will prove me right. I use UFC because TKD doesnt cater for grapplers as assailants, TKD is only useful against another TKDer! But again this is only what I have found, therefore my opinion!

Quote: Boxing has no kicks, no take downs, no grappling, and no chokes but it is very combat effective. A skilled boxer can take you apart. And guess what, last I checked boxing was a sport.

Yes boxing is a hell of a defense style as well as sport, could a boxer beat a MT fighter? I doubt it. MT is a more efficient strike art than TKD, it has a greater arsenal, it doesnt have take downs. It kicks low, pnches elbow and knees, it does however have grappling, I would back MT against TKD anytime.

I myself box and it was my first art, in a street fight I would back a boxer against a TKD artist!

Also in regard to boxing being a sport, the rules of excecution outside and inside the ring are the same! In the ring TKD cant punch the face, outside they can, but they dont train for it...... I hope you understand!

Quote: But I am sure with your skills, you could have easily defeated someone like a Roy Jones Jr or an Oscar De La Hoya in their prime. No Problem with a young Mike Tyson either I am sure. With your skills, you would have easily gotten through their defenses and choke them out. Sure, no problem.

If I trained everyday for as long as they did, to fight professionally, then yes! Would it be easy....NO! It is never easy to fight, maybe that is another TKD myth! I also believe that I would have a easier time against TKD than boxing.

Also I am upset that you think I am a ground fighter, or a UFC groupie, I am as much a striker as you, I would start by taking out there legs. It is just that I am prepared for more than A TKD artist, because my art HKD is more complete than TKD and I suppliment it as well.

Would you say that HKD as an art, forget all that its the individual, I am talking techniques they teach, less effective for SD than TKD. SD is what all MA should be about!

Tell me Mr Foot could you beat those boxers in your prime and find it easy to get them with a spinning back flying kick!! That was a childish statenent!!

Before you attempt to delete this post, as you have done with all my other posts that disagree with you, or lock the thread, I am not being personally disrespectful but merely raising my opinions, which is what forums are about! you will be glad to know I will then PM it to everybody already on this thread. Then I will make a complaint to ADMIN!

Quote:Before you attempt to delete this post, as you have done with all my other posts that disagree with you, or lock the thread, I am not being personally disrespectful but merely raising my opinions, which is what forums are about! you will be glad to know I will then PM it to everybody already on this thread. Then I will make a complaint to ADMIN!

Quote: I have been quite toleant up to this point, but this sort of comment goes over the boundries of civil behavior.

Thank you for you tolerance, but how is my behaviour uncivil?

Quote: Trust that the Admin and all the Moderators are aware.

One would hope so

Quote: I am disapointed that time and time again you violate your own code of ethics with reagard to pacifism. Pacifism is not only avoiding violence in actions, but also in your words.

You have no Idea of my code regarding pacifism, I will walk away from conflict, however in a debate such as forums, conflict is inevitable, I just wish people would not start with the sarcasm and what have you. Like this:

Quote: But I am sure with your skills, you could have easily defeated someone like a Roy Jones Jr or an Oscar De La Hoya in their prime. No Problem with a young Mike Tyson either I am sure. With your skills, you would have easily gotten through their defenses and choke them out. Sure, no problem.

or

Quote:Clearly, you have no clue what you are talking about and will use what ever twisted argument you choose, unsupported by any other thinking individual here, to "prove" what you believe to be a point.

or

Quote: Bye bye h2ho

I mean honestly, I think this is a little childish for someone your age wadowoman!

or

Quote:Quite honeslty.... you have no idea what you are talking about.*Bows respectfully*? What's up with that? It doesn't seem to be working because I am taking great offense because you're blabbering on about something you have no knowlege about.

Quite honeslty.... you have no idea what you are talking about.*Bows respectfully*? What's up with that? It doesn't seem to be working because I am taking great offense because you're blabbering on about something you have no knowlege about.

Although I am highly displeased with how sport is starting to dilute our art, it is nonetheless a useful art. People jump on the bash-TKD bandwagon with no prior knowledge or experience and do so only to go with the crowd.

I do have experience, I do repect TKD, I am not trying to jump on any kind of wagon, I am stating what I have found in my journey. As for sports diluting the art, I think that is a sad but true fact, it is also happening to Judo and Karate.

I have no doubt that you are a formidable warrior, one who feels so passionately about his art. However passion and confidence do not win battles, it was passion that led to the destruction of Troy!! If you read my post you will see that if I may break it down, is that against other arts TKD is a superior kicking art, in the ring, against other arts (though it is yet to be proven), TKD is quite deadly. As a mechanism for self defense against other arts it is not a whole system!! I study arts that strike and ground fight, have joint locks and throws....this is what I mean by a complete system. TKD doesnt teach some of these things, you yourself would know this.

*bows respectfully*

Quote: You give the impression that anyone who does not agree with you is stupid or uninformed. If this is not the case, you are choosing your words poorly.

No that is not my intent, I respect everyones opinion, I think people should start reading whats on the line, not what they think is between the line!

Quote: The individuals who are moderators on this site are so because of their dedication and knowledge of a particular MA or multiple MA's. They are not appointed at a mere whim of the Admin.

There is no dispute from me here, I agree. I just think that a mod should be more open to different trains of thought and not go around being sarcastic or calling people fools.

I would also hope that my humble 18 years of experience, and 10 year of challenging black belts of other styles, would give me enough knowledge to venture an opinion!

Quote:You continue to confront others in a hostile manner with little regard for their feelings or experience.

Hostile?!?!?!?!?!?! I respect their opinions, this all started with the thread "high kicks effective for SD", I said no, people jumped up and said well what about this? what about that? All I do is continue to answer there questions, till they get frustrated that I havent said yes, "you are correct", then Razorfoot locks the threads or deletes my posts!

I have always stated that, all my posts are based on my personal journey, from having challenged the best martial artists that I could, from being a bouncer in a nightclub, to just life in general! I even had to start a thread to this effect:

Quote: It takes quite a bit to push my buttons Sir, and you have mashed it quite hard.

I apologise!

*bows respectfully*

Derek

Quote: H2whoa I am saddened that you think all TKD practitioners are the same. In my limited years in martial arts I have met some outstanding individuals that were simply put ... amazing. They didn't compete in sporting events but trained for SD ... as I do. I have even seen some that would more then be a match for a boxer just with their TKD skills and no other. Again like many, TKD is being painted with the same brush!

I do not nor have ever said practitioners, I am talking soley of the art, and I believe TKD has more holes than any I have ever seen! Even that only as SD, it is very effective in the ring, but without rules.......

Quote: As with "every" martial art there are holes that some will fill and others won't. In our system we do with Hapkido, JJJ and BJJ. We don't even mind stealing things like the clinch or elbows or anything that is useful.

I believe in evolving arts!

Quote: Obviously you must have seen holes in your martial arts to have cross trained in so many. If one such as Hapkido ... and I respect this art (as well as the others) ... were so effective for SD then why would there be any need to train further?

Not holes, so much as defecits, in HKD (my primary art), I was taught to grapple, throw lock, punch, kick, groundfighting I just wanted to take a few into more detail than that art taught. I even went to TKD to teach me how to torque to get more power in my kick, and it did help. Like I said TKD is a good art.

Quote:What I think you are doing is talking sport TKD which has diluted much of the art but didn't really get to the meat of it to see what it actual is and has to offer.

Yes I have and that is how I formed my opinion, and having beaten many TKD seniors, in challenge matches. At first I used to get my ass kicked, not often, but enough times before i adjusted so but now I can deal with it!

Quote: TKD is only good against another TKD person ... wrong again. I know of individuals with TKD training that have competed in both Kickboxing and Muay Thai tournaments and dominated.

Muay Thai and kickboxing are the same thing, they are both kicking/striking arts, so there really isnt much variety. I feel your argument would be more convincing if they won at UFC, which to my knowledge neither hapkido,TKD, or muay thai, has won. if a TKD, muay thai artist was on the ground they would be toast, this is one of the holes no ground fighting, no technique to get out of a shimewazza, like a rear naked choke. It is one thing to say, not to get taken down, it is another thing to avoid it!

Quote: Perhaps if you don't have much regard for TKD you may wish to stay off of the Taekwondo forum and hang around the BJJ/MMA forum or any other that more fits your profile.

Once more I have high regard for TKD, as a teaching tool for excecuting kicks, the values it instill, and the way that the sport teaches you anticipation, timng and peripheral vision, i just dont think it is effective as a SD art. I admire anyone who can stick it out in any art, being a MArtist is hard work, whatever art you do!

And I am first and foremost a striker!!

Quote: I don't say this as a bad thing I just wish you would look at things with an open mind. TKD may have not worked for you but it does for others. And for a fact, TKD has been trained to the military ... both the Korean and US Marines.

My mind is open, I believe it is good for alot of reasone, but an open mind should never cloud judgement or perception!

I think you will find that the US marines have changed art since then, it is more like krav magna, which is alot like hapkido or Jujitsu!

*bows respectfully*

Edited by h2whoa (11/02/0507:50 PM)

_________________________
No matter how fashionable it is on Krypton, I will not wear my underwear on the outside of my Gi!!