with several teams at 0-3 and looking worse than ever before just wanted to see ya'lls opinion on this one

my vote however goes to mike martz...i hate this guy...i think he's the worst head coach in the nfl followed by eric dickerson of the niners...what are ya'lls pick for the worst head coach in the nfl

texasguy346

09-28-2004, 08:59 PM

with several teams at 0-3 and looking worse than ever before just wanted to see ya'lls opinion on this one

my vote however goes to mike martz...i hate this guy...i think he's the worst head coach in the nfl followed by eric dickerson of the niners...what are ya'lls pick for the worst head coach in the nfl

Do you mean Dennis Errickson? Never noticed how similar those two names were before, but I didn't catch it till reading it a second time.

I think the worst coach is Dave Wanstedt. I know he's got the toughest situation in the NFL right now, but I think he'll be gone at the end of the season.

cuppacoffee

09-29-2004, 09:09 AM

with several teams at 0-3 and looking worse than ever before just wanted to see ya'lls opinion on this one

my vote however goes to mike martz...i hate this guy...i think he's the worst head coach in the nfl followed by eric dickerson of the niners...what are ya'lls pick for the worst head coach in the nfl

Dont know if he's the worst, but Dick Vermiel made the worse mistake a coach can make last Sunday. He underestimated his opponent. :twocents:

JustBonee

09-29-2004, 09:30 AM

I think that Dick Vermiel is past his days of effectiveness.
It seems to me that some new blood is needed in the NFL coaching ranks.
Like the players going beyond their prime, too many coaches don't know when to call it quits... both pro and college (Joe Paterno) Man, that guy is hurting things!

If you haven't seen this ... a recent poll taken by NFL players, present and past of their choices of best and worst coaches:

http://www.cnnsi.com/2004/players/09/14/players.poll/

WWJD

09-29-2004, 09:40 AM

Even though the team is playing ok my vote would be for Tom Coughlin of the Giants.

All the rules and I just bet his players are counting the days till he's gone.

longhornjag

09-29-2004, 03:48 PM

Coughlin isn't a bad coach or at least he wasn't. When he was winning back in 96-99 no one said he was a bad coach. It's only after he started to lose the good players that the teams got bad. I do agree that if the teams winning players can put up with him, but when they're losing they don't want to deal with it.

Panther5407

09-29-2004, 09:09 PM

Worst coach would have to be the niners coach. But the guy I can't stand is John Gruden. The guy won the super bowl with someone else's team and now that its actually his, he lost valuable players.

HowBoutThemCowboys!

09-30-2004, 12:21 AM

Dom Capers of yes, the Texans

No, I'm just messing with you guys, I knew that would get you mad. lol. I would go with Butch Davis

TheOgre

09-30-2004, 10:57 AM

I think that Dick Vermiel is past his days of effectiveness.

His team went 13-3 last year. Is that SO far in the past now?

TheOgre

09-30-2004, 11:00 AM

Even though the team is playing ok my vote would be for Tom Coughlin of the Giants.

All the rules and I just bet his players are counting the days till he's gone.

The guy is a proven winner. He never got them to the promised land but he definitely has a winning recipe.

My personal vote goes to Jim Haslett of the Saints. He has a very talented team that constantly underachieves. His AFC counterpart is Dave Wannstedt. Wannstedt will be gone before the start of next season.

J-Man

09-30-2004, 11:14 AM

I think the "worst coach" slot is tough to call...you can probably lump several guys into that tier...

1. Wannestedt- obivously has some skills as a defensive coordinator, horrible as a GM...which helps set him up for failure on the offense.

2. Erickson- the only thing that looks to stop the 49er freefall is the ground.

3. Davis- well he wanted to be the guy that pulls all the strings, looks like he's fashioning a nice noose for himself with them.

4. Schottenheimer- wow... :crazy:

5. Tice- players dig him, I think he is a little over his head. He probably could have used another year or two as a coordinator and that would have helped him quite a bit.

6. Coughlin- this may be counter-intuitive, but wins aren't the only thing that determine the quality of the coach. Players hate this guy, players hate Parcell's but they want to play for him and appreciate what he does for them...players just hate Coughlin. One other note, several of the old Jag's players noted that they didn't believe they could trust Coughlin with their safety (ie refusing to believe a guy is injured and forcing him to play or get benched).

WWJD

09-30-2004, 11:23 AM

The only reason I said Coughlin was because of his rules, dress codes, etc. I know the guy has been a winner and I know his team is playing better this year. I just think his style might work in high school, even in college but it must wear very thin with pro players and professionals. I think he wears his welcome out very, very fast.

J-Man

09-30-2004, 11:29 AM

The only reason I said Coughlin was because of his rules, dress codes, etc. I know the guy has been a winner and I know his team is playing better this year. I just think his style might work in high school, even in college but it must wear very thin with pro players and professionals. I think he wears his welcome out very, very fast.

WWJD...I think you've hit the nail on the head. I agree that Coughlin is probably an excellent X and Os guy and I think he is pretty good at game management as well. That's wonderful, but when your personality or manner runs players off your team, that's bad. I think this is particularly key in todays free agent structure...top guys don't always go with the best money or they make you pay extra for playing for a guy like Coughlin. The problem also rears up when you are trying to keep your own FAs who don't care for the coach.

TheOgre

09-30-2004, 11:41 AM

The only reason I said Coughlin was because of his rules, dress codes, etc. I know the guy has been a winner and I know his team is playing better this year. I just think his style might work in high school, even in college but it must wear very thin with pro players and professionals. I think he wears his welcome out very, very fast.

The main difference between him and Parcells are the rings IMO. Players know Parcells wins so they put up with his bull. Parcells also has more charisma than Coughlin. Jimmy Johnson also worked his players hard but got the rings. Basically if you have that mentality, then you better win a ring. Otherwise guys resent the extra work.

I still think Coughlin is a good coach. I'd rather play for him then a Bill Tobin, Dave Campo, Mike Merriweather or any of the other former coaches that were losers.

WWJD

09-30-2004, 11:46 AM

It's a well known fact that for some years that was major friction between Jimmy Johnson and Troy Aikman. I've heard them both talk about it.

They buried the hacket with a visit by Troy to Jimmy's home to show off his expensive fish tanks (!) and they cleared the air and become good friends.

I don't know that players have to be "friends" with their coaches; I don't even think most of them would care to be but there has to be respect, mutual desire for the same goals, etc.

I think most players like Parcells. He's abrasive but he's smart and he knows how to get the most out of players. I think that means alot because he's not exactly known for being easy to get along with!

And some coaches are meant to be assistants and that's all....and they excell at that. Dave Campo is a very good example. Maybe Wannstedt too.

I never thought about Martz as being a bad coach...good name to throw out there. He definitely has issues.

V Man

09-30-2004, 12:11 PM

Dom Capers of yes, the Texans

Before last weeks win, I think he would have had more votes. I would say Butch Davis, or Denny Green ( I never really like him as a coach, players always seem to under achive) :twocents:

TheOgre

09-30-2004, 05:26 PM

Denny Green ( I never really like him as a coach, players always seem to under achive) :twocents:

You have GOT to be kidding me. Anyone that get a Jeff George led team to the playoffs deserves credit. Didn't he also lead an over-the-hill Randall Cunningham to the NFC Championship Game?

His teams didn't have defensive talent. That is what killed him. He learned from that and promised to put more emphasis on defense in Arizona.

Huge

09-30-2004, 07:41 PM

Worst coach would have to be the niners coach. But the guy I can't stand is John Gruden. The guy won the super bowl with someone else's team and now that its actually his, he lost valuable players.
That's (Gruden was coaching someone else's team) true. But he helped assemble the team he was playing against in that Super Bowl.

TheOgre

10-04-2004, 10:40 AM

"Just a few weeks ago, everyone was harping incessantly on how Coughlin had these "rules" for his players to follow, and that he was a disciplinarian more than a head coach. Now everyone sees that the Giants are 3-1 after beating the Packers, and all of a sudden Coughlin is a whiz. Well, he's always been that way; his style is unique and most good coaches are unique. But all good coaches win football games, and as long as Coughlin keeps winning, his players (and the media) cannot complain.

I remember running into former Packers defensive end and Hall of Famer Willie Davis a few years ago. We started recanting old football stories, and he mentioned that if the Packers hadn't won within a year or two with Vince Lombardi coaching there, they would have had the greatest revolution anyone had ever seen. The lesson here is, if you win, then it's okay. But if you lose, it's bad news, and that's probably true regardless of your coaching persona. I do think that players bail out on their coaches quicker if there isn't any success. "

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/7760781

WWJD

10-04-2004, 11:13 AM

I do not remember where I read it but some sportswriter somewhere said he thinks it will take Green 5 years to turn the Cardinals into a playoff contender.

I think he's a good coach...with some good drafts...and they played well yesterday, maybe 2 years.

And I obviously misspoke about Coach Coughlin. His rules are dumb, dumb, dumb but he seems to have the Giants playing well again.

V Man

10-04-2004, 11:21 AM

You have GOT to be kidding me. Anyone that get a Jeff George led team to the playoffs deserves credit. Didn't he also lead an over-the-hill Randall Cunningham to the NFC Championship Game?

His teams didn't have defensive talent. That is what killed him. He learned from that and promised to put more emphasis on defense in Arizona.

No I am not kidding you. His team always played less than the talent they had. How can you call Randall over the hill, when there are so many older Qbs leading teams now days (Vinny, Warren Moon, Gannon, all older QBs).

Also John Randle was a all pro d-line for Green for several years, so he had talent.

As for Arizona, I hope he does turn it around, and make me change me mind. But til now I just haven't been impressed with him.

DavidCarr_Fan8

10-04-2004, 02:14 PM

Mike Martz, he is tupid not to use Marshall Faulk, and our first pick in the draft was Steven Jackson, a good young RB, and he says we aren't going to run??? :blah: . He is insane. The worst coach in the NFL.

TheOgre

10-04-2004, 02:35 PM

His rules are dumb, dumb, dumb

Now we are seeing eye-to-eye. I totally agree with that.

WWJD

10-04-2004, 02:42 PM

Thanks..those rules are dumb but maybe I'm the dumber one for thinking he's not a good coach! :yap

He has them playing pretty well where they basically quit last year. Green Bay is no pushover team although I'm reading Favre was knocked out for a series or something with a concussion.

I still think though that he could lighten up on some rules.

TheOgre

10-04-2004, 02:56 PM

How can you call Randall over the hill, when there are so many older Qbs leading teams now days (Vinny, Warren Moon, Gannon, all older QBs).

Randall was the MVP in 1990. After that he suffered some injuries and he was very unproductive for a number of years (1994-1997). He was even out of the league in 1996. The Vikes brought him back into the league as the backup in '97 and Green resurrected his career in 1998 (15-1 record). I would argue that his 1998 stats were comparable, and perhaps better, than his MVP 1990 season. I considered Randall over-the-hill because he played like a shadow of his former self until Green resurrected his career.

Oh BTW, John Randle was a great player (I actually only own one football jersey and it is a Randle Vikings one), but he didn't have much of a supporting cast. That is why the defense wasn't good. Green even admit that he learned from that mistake and plans on winning with more defensive playmakers. So far the Cardinals have looked pretty good on defense.