Russia trying to 'dismember' Ukraine through protests, Kiev says

Pro-Russian protesters have seized state buildings in several east Ukrainian cities, prompting accusations from Kiev that Moscow is trying to
"dismember" the country.

The protesters broke into a regional administrative building in the mining city of Donetsk on Sunday as well as security services offices in nearby
Luhansk, where police said they had seized weapons.

A self-proclaimed legislature, representing what it called the Donetsk People's Republic, then announced that it would hold a referendum by May 11
on whether the area should join Russia, Russian state-run news agency ITAR-Tass reported Monday. CNN has not confirmed the report.

The Russian news agency also said the Donetsk group asked Russian President Vladimir Putin to send a "temporary peacekeeping
contingent."

Hey look, another region wanting to join Russia...

While the report has not been confirmed by any media organisation outside of Russia, it honestly wouldn't surprise me if this news is correct. Russia
is playing a damn fine game of acquiring territory through alternative means...i expect this to be very similar to the Crimean situation...these guys
are even requesting 'peacekeepers'...

There is a thread already posted on this subject although it may be in a different forum ....just saying ...peace

Thanks.

Yeah, i searched...i just noticed a similar thread down the 'new' page. It is indeed in a different forum, which should mean that this thread is
alright. With that said, this thread also covers further information on the matter.

khimbar
So, a government which took power by force in a coup, is trying to stop the other side taking power by referendum?

Yes that is about the top and tail of it.

I see it like this !

Mr UK has a poor credit rating and he will do anything you tell him and agrees to an APR of 50%

Mr X has a good credit rating, won't sell his sole to to borrow money at an APR of 4%

Now you tell me who the banks are going to fight to control ?

Russia lent the Ukraine $15bn with little to no strings attached (4 % APR) but now the bankers from the west have upset the apple cart so they can now
come in and offer an APR of 50% and the dickheads who seized power are falling over themselves to take it.

Open elections as soon as possible is the only way that the Ukraine won't get torn apart by a pack of wolf that came from the west.

Actually Russia pushed the idea of a "Federation" style government for Ukraine and its "regions". They are essentially pushing for a association
style government, which in turn would make it easier for Russia to continue absorbing sections of Ukraine. In their idea its a round about method of
invasion without actually firing shots.

The reaction from Ukraine tells me the Russian idea is not going to happen. There have been reports of people being arrested coming into Ukraine with
weapons / bombs / explosives etc. With the amount of propaganda flowing from both sides its difficult to figure out what info is valid and what info
is not.

Russia essentially has Ukraine surrounded now with military assets so and the theory is they are going to strike just prior to the Presidential
elections.

I am assuming you 2 are referring to Crimea? Where masked gunmen entered their parliament building and arrested the Prime minister, replacing him
with a pro Russian who was not elected.

Since the former President of Ukraine was lawfully removed under the 2004 Constitution that he signed back into effect surely you cant be referring to
Ukraine.

Current acting President is the current Chairman of the Ukrainian Parliament Oleksandr Turchynov after the Ukrainian Parliament ousted Viktor
Yanukovych from this office on 21 February 2014.[1] It is unclear if the removal of Yanukovych was legal because Yanukovych had not signed the bills
that would restore the Constitution as it was between 2004 and 2010.[2] The constitutional guidelines provide for a review of the case by Ukraine's
Constitutional Court and a three-fourths majority vote by parliament (338 MPs).[2] The decisions to remove Yanukovych was supported by 328 MPs.[3]
Yanukovych still claims to be "the legitimate head of the Ukrainian state elected in a free vote by Ukrainian citizens".

Actually Russia pushed the idea of a "Federation" style government for Ukraine and its "regions". They are essentially pushing for a association
style government, which in turn would make it easier for Russia to continue absorbing sections of Ukraine. In their idea its a round about method of
invasion without actually firing shots.

The reaction from Ukraine tells me the Russian idea is not going to happen. There have been reports of people being arrested coming into Ukraine with
weapons / bombs / explosives etc. With the amount of propaganda flowing from both sides its difficult to figure out what info is valid and what info
is not.

Russia essentially has Ukraine surrounded now with military assets so and the theory is they are going to strike just prior to the Presidential
elections.

Police officers sealed off access to the buildings but said that they had no idea who was behind the assault...

...But it was unclear how much authority Mr. Avakov has over the police and other state services in Crimea, where a heavily ethnic Russian and
Russian-speaking population mostly views the Ukrainian government installed after the ouster last weekend of Mr. Yanukovych as the illegitimate result
of a fascist coup.

“Provocateurs are on the march,” Mr. Avakov added. “It’s a time for cool heads, the healthy consolidation of forces, and careful action.”

Outside the occupied legislature building, columns of several hundred pro-Russia protesters forced their way through police lines chanting “Rossiya,
Rossiya” — “Russia, Russia” — and waving Russian flags. The leader of a group called the Russian Movement for Crimea read out Mr.
Yanukovych’s reported statement declaring himself to be the legitimate president. “We agree, we agree,” the crowd shouted. One man shouted
through a bullhorn: “We are not separatists. Russia, Ukraine and Belarus are one
country.”

Russia needs to take back Ukraine .. that's the only way they can stay head to head with the West trying to put up a missiles defense shield and such
in Poland, etc .. once they have Ukraine, they can use that is a buffer zone to beef up their own defenses ..
The West is playing a dangerous game .. poking and surrounding the bear in his own neighborhood ..
Sooner or later, Ukraine will be part of Russia ..and that will be that ..Russia will not stop, because it's a matter of top national security for
them..

I wonder what the US would do if Russia was trying to place a missile defense shield anywhere next door ..
Nobody has done it yet, but they should, just to drive the point home ..that it's not so funny when it's your own back yard ..
There will probably be a new Cuban missile crisis ..since the US has again, had a direct destabilizing role in Cuba ..

There is a sense of extreme arrogance that makes the Western governments think they can get away with anything ..all it takes is one reality check
..reading the news every day, it's clear the situation is so grave right now, Russia will be allowed to simply take Ukraine, because the West knows
they went too far with this one .. their desperation stinks to high heaven with playground tactics ..crying to everyone around how they are at risk
..same rhetoric ..

You seem to be confused and it was the Crimea that had a vote and Ukraine that saw 86 people killed by the very same people these people were
protesting in support of. Yes it sounded silly when western TV kept it out the news but not quite so daft when the neo-nazi party turned on the other
groups they were fight next too just a few weeks before.

There have been reports of people being arrested coming into Ukraine with weapons / bombs / explosives etc

That's odd because I heard that Russia had captured two dozen extremist inside Russia from Kiev that were trying to start trouble about a week ago.

You see what I know is that if everyone in Syria hated Assad like they kept telling us like 2 years ago 24/7 on our TV's then how come he has stayed
in power or could it just be that the media in the west was giving me a bag of lies just like they are doing today when they talk about the
Ukraine.

Should we now bomb the Ukraine in order to stop them from having a vote so they can taste our democracy because we know that Russia only got sanctions
(An act of war) for allowing a vote to go ahead in the Crimea

junglimogli

Yes I could not had said it better myself and do keep bringing up Cuba and the sanctions because that hurts Americans when they try to make out they
are peace keeping all over the world

junglimogli
Russia needs to take back Ukraine .. that's the only way they can stay head to head with the West trying to put up a missiles defense shield and such
in Poland, etc .. once they have Ukraine, they can use that is a buffer zone to beef up their own defenses ..

O I love people with this mindset.

By all means, how about you actually research the missile shield before making claims that are in the realm of make believe?

Poland and Romania are set to receive shore based operations in 2015 and 2018 with spy Radar.

Russian reaction -

During the late 1990s, the U.S. Navy was tasked to provide a weapon system for exploratory testing of LEAP. This phase was designated the Aegis
LEAP Intercept (ALI) program. The program was for two successful intercepts in five attempts. On June 13, 2002, the second successful ALI intercept
occurred during the FM-3 flight test mission. Initial Aegis BMD success may have contributed to President George W. Bush's decision to deploy an
emergency ballistic missile capability by late 2004.

Upon the completion of the ALI program, Aegis BMD was transitioned to the production phase. The first Block I production SM-3 was delivered in October
2004, and the Aegis 3.0 update was delivered in 2005.

This system was given major new importance by President Obama in September 2009, when he announced plans to scrap the plans for a missile defense site
in Poland, in favor of missile defense systems located on U.S. Navy warships.[4][5] On 18 September 2009, Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin
welcomed Obama's plans for missile defense which may include stationing American Aegis armed warships in the Black Sea, as these would be less
effective against Russia's missile attacks.[6][7] In 2009, several U.S. Navy ships were fitted with SM-3 missiles to serve this function, which
complements the Patriot systems already deployed by American units. Also, warships of Japan and Australia have been given weapons and technology to
enable them to participate as well.[8][9]

Current Aegis BMD hardware includes the SM-3 Block-1a missile and other improvements to the Aegis Weapons System. Future development of the Aegis BMD
system includes Launch on Remote capability, upgraded SM-3 avionics and hardware, and an upgraded Aegis Weapon System. In 2012 Aegis Ballistic Missile
Defense will merge with Aegis Open Architecture and deliver the benefits of both platforms.[10] The Launch on Remote capability involves the use of
off-board sensors, such as the Space Tracking and Surveillance System to provide a targeting solution for a SM-3 launch.[11]

Russia supported it...

If Russia has an issue with a system that is defensive in purpose then maybe they should not invade and annex their neighbors.

AEGIS Ashore

Aegis Ashore[edit]

A land-based component, Aegis Ashore, is also planned (pictured). This would consist of equipment which is commonly used by the Navy being deployed in
land-based facilities. This would include SPY-1 radars and a battery of Standard Missile-3s. The Obama administration’s plans call for two sites:
the first in Romania at Deveselu in 2015 and the second in Poland in 2018. In 2020, both will get the latest versions of the Aegis BMD software and
the latest version of the SM-3.[12] Some radar facilities will be placed in Turkey at a future date.[13][14][15][16]

CURRENT STATUS -

As of January, 2014, the U.S. and Japan are the only countries to have deployed the Aegis BMD.[17]

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