I have just purchased a colnago CLX 3.0 with Di2, the reviews suggest the wheels are not equivalent to the level of frame and an upgrade will change the feel of the bike altogether.

The bike comes with Shimano RS30 wheels.

For a recreational rider and for group rides will an upgrade make much of a difference?

I'm considering the following upgraded wheel sets

1. Shimano RS 802. Mavic kysrium elite3. Zipp 404 firecrest clinchers

I haven't taken delivery of the bike yet but the LBS suggested that if I upgrade the wheels he will do a swap and I only pay the difference. So I don't wan to make the mistake of buying with the current wheels and upgrade 2 weeks later!

You have not even test ridden the bike to acertain how the hoops ride and perform on the CLX 3.0 frame and on the other hand if you act now you will save yourself the trouble of offloading an 'as new' pair of Shimano RS30 hoops if you actually do decide to change your mind after sucking and seeing..........

I've ridden on the Ksyrium Elites, they are uber reliable on lumpy roads but a tad heavy for my liking and also a tad bland if you are wanting to tart up your Colnago says my 20 cent opinion........

I tested a freind's set of 2010 404 dimpled clinchers which were def. aero when you put the effort in to hold speed well above 30km/hr, looked the goods and were well made but very expensive.

If you care about the bike's cosmetic appearance (and I admit I am one who shamlessly does) then the Zipps will match that gorgeous sloping frame of the CLX 3.0 IMHO.

If you are moving at above 30km/hr + a lot then the aero benefits of the 404's will kick in but if you are mostly rolling about in the sub 30km/hr area then I say the aero benefit of deep dish wheels like the 404's is wasted.

I can't comment on the Shimano RS 80's as I have no idea what they are.......

In all honesty, the difference is almost negligible for a recreational rider. BUT the look of the Zipps is hard to get past. If you can afford them, go for it.

I changed the standard wheels on my Cervelo RS and now ride on Ksyrium Elites and noticed the difference immediately but then I rode on a friend's Zipp 404 Firecrest and couldn't substantiate the difference (except when the wind almost blew me over).

I have now done about 1200klm on the RS80 and am very happy with them for recreational riding. Where I ride the wind is always blowing so deep aero rims are not ideal.The RS80 is an alloy rim with carbonfibre overlay and Ultegra hubs.They look like this:

Im fully aware it's a Taiwan produced frame.. But for the riding I do which like I said is recreational and fitness group rides it's already overkill. But in saying that I do appreciate aesthetics and gadgets and that's why I went for an Italian designed Di2 ... And I figure if I'm going all this way may as well complete the bike with good looking and functioning wheelset !

Are the zipp 404 long lasting on good as well as average roads? What should I try and negotiate the difference between RS 30 and Zipp 404s?

Depends what you weigh... 50mm rims are a must for me in any wind... They don't budge apart from when I put them on the tt bike for training and I am in full tuck and a truck blasts past in the opposite direction .I train on kysriums and race on deep dish... I notice the difference instantly. As often said... Aero trumps weight nearly everywhere. But would I ride everyday on $2000 dollar wheels?.... No.

Dr.Nate wrote:Where I ride can also sometimes get windy so maybe the zipp 404 aren't suitable... Mmm

I rode for 18 months on a pair of 50mm carbon wheels. I also live in an area where 7/10 days have a wind over 30km/hr and often faster. It was only ever when the wind gusts rose over 45km/hr and upwards that I felt the taller rims were really dragging in a cross wind and at those speeds with a gusting wind just about every rider is going to feel like they are being buffeted irrespective of which wheelset they are on.

Unless you really ride a lot of your miles in faster winds like the ones described above I'd not rule out any deep dish wheels like the Zipp 404's because of any cross wind drag effect IMHO I rode on $1600 50mm carbon rims as my regular trainer wheelset and never lived to regret it but that was my perogative at the time.

Below is some excel fun - comparison of price and weight. Wheelsets are ordered from lightest to heaviest. What you are looking for in the $/gram plot is a wheelset that is below the black trendline. Wheelsets for a comparison like this should have their quality validated by many users. The analysis reveals nothing of quality, only where a wheelset is relative to the price trendline.Keep in mind the rs80 50mm are alloy/carbon deep dish. all the others are not.

Last edited by PawPaw on Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

- wheels don't last forever. a guy on our group ride this morning had the rim of his carbon wheel shatter and cause a loud tube flat. scared the bejesus out of us, and he was lucky it didn't happen on a dangerous part of the route. end of his ride, 5 minutes after it started. arguably an alloy wheel may have been easier to predict failure. the carbon wheel didn't have wear indicator holes or anything to judge use by date.

- just because you pay 4x the price for a wheel, doesn't mean it will last any longer.

i prefer alloy wheels because I think they are easier to true, and you can replace the rims if generic enough.most of my riding when over 35kph is in a pack sharing the lead, so deep dish aero ain't the ducks nuts. plus there's always wind after 7am on most of my rides.and full alloy wheels don't have issues with delamination. plus I don't know if carbon/alloy composites are inferior with heat dissipation during braking.

Rather than buy 404s, I'd rather have 2x sub $800 wheelsets, the second set on a backup bike, for when (not if) I have a mechanical.There's nothing worse than trashing a component on Good Friday , and being rideless for the rest of the hols.

PawPaw wrote:most of my riding when over 35kph is in a pack sharing the lead, so deep dish aero ain't the ducks nuts. plus there's always wind after 7am on most of my rides.

most of my ride today was at over 35kmph in a pack with large amounts of time on the front in a strong wind... Funnily felt exactly the opposite about my wheels

I feel the same way. It's the higher speed rides is exactly the time you want the deep dish wheels. The wind thing is a furphy. I've only ever felt a gust strong enough to feel something through the bars and it really isn't that dramatic and certainly manageable unless you're intending on practising your "no handed bike moves".

It's amusing to see guys riding deep dish too stiff or sore to get in the drops for any length of time.I've seen the line of some deep dishies in a cross wind on the Ted Smout bridge and Flinders Pde. No furphy ime.

I often wonder if the subjective benefits one feels on deep dish is primarily more stable steering (when there's not a cross wind).

Rode a mate's bike with 404s a few times, at NundahDome and Scarborough. I did actually seriously consider firecrests last year, but realized the money could be better spent elsewhere...and my average rides don't justify them.

In the meantime, I'll focus on the aero advantages of - getting the bars down another spacer- trialing a longer 110 and 120mm stem. - 10% bodyfat.

Without joining the deep carbon vs alu bunfight, that's a pretty slim list you have put up, considering how many options there are out there. If you want some more bling wheels, look at a Campag Shamals. Good aero, not too heavy, not too expensive and have cultural synergy with your nice Italian frame.

I'm about 100kg. I've had a set of RS80s that came on my CAAD9 for 18 months now. They have done a heap of km's and are still great. I've raced and trained on them with zero problems.

9 months ago I bought a set of Chinese 60mm carbon tubulars. They were o.k. but not great. They were not very stiff so I sold them.

In the last 6 months I've bought a set of 2008 404's tubulars and found them to be very good. Light, stiffish and responsive. They only get used for racing and I noticed the difference straight away, but I will use the RS80s in racing with strong crosswinds.

I've just purchased a old mismatched set of Zipp 440s tubulars which I plan on using as training wheels on my new Six13. It will be interesting to see how they go.

I've also owned a set of RS30s which I planned on using as training wheels, but they just didn't do it for me and I couldn't even bring myself to train on them. Too heavy, didn't roll too well and left me feeling very slow. I know you should train heavy and race light, but the extreme was too great for me.

I also have a pair of 20 year old Shimano 600 hubs on Mavic Open 4CD training wheels that are great and bullet proof, but I'm looking for a 10 speed free hub for the 6402 rear hub, which I'm struggling to find, to keep them going. I really want to get it right because you can never have enough wheels.

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