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Re: ObamaCare: A false Promise

Hard to see Obamacare causing the 2008 recession since the program didn't become law until 2010 or so.

No, the subprime mortgage program caused the 2008 recession. I was just equating obummercare to that guvmint-pushed program as another example of how "good intentions" go awry when the federal guvmint is involved.

As for the connection between the recent opioid crisis and obummercare, via Medicaid doctors were(are) reimbursed for prescribing dangerous, habit-forming drugs (opioids) that has caused a HUGE increase in addiction cases and has created a ready supply for those selling it illegally. Just Google it. There are a bunch of articles on this crisis.

Re: ObamaCare: A false Promise

Another example of federal guvmint over-reach is being addressed in the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals, re: obummer's Fiduciary Rule. Designed to protect people from themselves, i.e. making "stupid" investment decisions, instead the rule punished those it was supposed to protect. You can Google it if you care to learn more details.

Re: ObamaCare: A false Promise

Originally Posted by dawg80

No, the subprime mortgage program caused the 2008 recession. I was just equating obummercare to that guvmint-pushed program as another example of how "good intentions" go awry when the federal guvmint is involved.

As for the connection between the recent opioid crisis and obummercare, via Medicaid doctors were(are) reimbursed for prescribing dangerous, habit-forming drugs (opioids) that has caused a HUGE increase in addiction cases and has created a ready supply for those selling it illegally. Just Google it. There are a bunch of articles on this crisis.

And all the folks now having free healthcare no matter which or what the doctors, $$ spent/cost and drugs used.

Former MIT economist Jonathan Gruber, described by many as the chief architect of Obamacare
who famously explained how the health-care law was adopted because of the “stupidity” of American voters, has been “fired for fraud.”

It was the Wall Street Journal that earlier reported there were 20,000 pages of emails sent by Gruber between January 2009 and March 2010 regarding his consultation for the White House and the Department of Health and Human Services.
He later was found to have said, “Lack of transparency is a huge political advantage. And basically, call it the stupidity of the American voters or whatever, but basically that was really, really critical for the thing to pass.”
He described how the Obamacare manipulators decided to call a tax a tax on insurance plans “rather than a tax on people, when we know it’s a tax on people who hold these insurance plans.”
That, he said, the American people were too “stupid to understand” and it exploited “the lack of the economic understanding of the American voter.”
Now the American Center for Law and Justice, is pointing out the newest developments for Gruber in Vermont.
“As Mr. Gruber’s architectural debacle continues to collapse on the American people, you would think that an epic fail like his would make it challenging for him to attain gainful employment, yet ‘[o]fficials in Vermont had hired Gruber as an economic consultant to assess, examine and provide economic models for a now-abandoned plan to roll out a single-payer health care system across the tiny state,'” the ACLJ reported.
“For years, we’ve not only exposed his lies, but have detailed his ongoing self-dealing relationships with Obamacare and state government programs to implement it. He created the program’s problems and then has been richly rewarded for trying to ‘fix’ it.”
The report continued, “Gruber … finds himself no longer employed at his latest job ‘as a taxpayer-funded economic consultant for [Vermont’s] health care system.’ Vermont Attorney General T.J. Donovan – who concluded that Gruber’s conduct violated the Vermont Civil False Claims Act – ‘reached an agreement to settle the state’s potential legal claim that Gruber submitted false [personal services contract] claims to the state.'”
The report quoted the Rutland Herald newspaper’s comments:

Donovan said Gruber’s personal services contract with the state was a standard “time and materials” contract that specified Gruber would be paid only for services actually performed. The contract required Gruber to submit monthly invoices describing the work performed and the amounts billed for such work.
Donovan’s office found that Gruber submitted at least two invoices that were false with respect to the amount of work performed by a research assistant working for Gruber. The supporting documentation provided by Gruber did not reflect the actual hours worked by the research assistant, nor did the assistant keep records accurately reflecting the hours he devoted to the state project, Donovan said.

The ACLJ reported, however, noted that Gruber’s problems go much deeper.“Gruber has also written extensively on his view that the abortion of ‘marginal children’ is a ‘social good.’ In a ‘scholarly’ paper he co-authored titled, ‘Abortion Legalization and Child Living Circumstances: Who is the ‘Marginal Child?”, he concluded that ‘the legalization of abortion saved the government over $14 billion in welfare payments through 1994,’ referring to abortion of poor children as ‘positive selection.’
“That’s sick,” the ACLJ report said in a report under the headline “Chief architect of Obama deceit and pro-abortion deception fired for fraud.”[/COLOR]WND revealed the White House paid Gruber $400,000 to help develop and promote Obamacare.
Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2017/08/obamacare...Lehhb6HGSSB.99

Five Senate Democrats are now publicly endorsing a government-run, single-payer health-care system in a sign the party is quickly rallying to that goal, however the idea promises to be a financial and regulatory nightmare that should compel Republicans to revisit the issue and get it right before the 2018 elections.On Tuesday, Sen. Jeff Merkley, D-Ore., announced he would support the “Medicare for All” legislation sponsored by Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt.“It’s time to simplify health care and lower patients’ costs, and embrace Medicare for all,” said Merkley, who is now the fifth Senate Democrat to join the cause publicly. In addition to Sanders, Sens. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass.; Kamala Harris, D-Calif.; and Cory Booker, D-N.J., are all co-sponsoring the bill.In addition, roughly half the House Democrats are on board with the idea.Heritage Foundation senior fellow Robert Moffit said Democrats are making their moves now because Republicans failed to get their health-care reforms passed in the Senate.“The immediate reason is the abject failure of Senate Republicans – and it’s the Senate’s fault here – to enact a health-care reform bill to repeal and at least partially replace Obamacare,” Moffit told WND and Radio America.

“It has created a major health policy vacuum, so the liberals in Congress and elsewhere are ready to fill it, and they’re preparing now for a total government takeover of health care, which is a single-payer system,” he said.But while touting “Medicare for all” and health care as a right, Moffit said Americans should not miss what is really at stake here.“What they are proposing is nothing short of a government monopoly over the financing and the delivery of health care,” Moffit explained. “Ultimately, what this means is that politicians will be in direct charge of health policy.”

He said Democrats in 2017 are making the exact opposite promise that President Obama made in 2009 and 2010, only this time they would actually keep it.“When Obama promised he would not take away your plan, that turned out to be false, especially if you were in the individual market. Here, the Democrats in the Senate – [Elizabeth] Warren, [Bernie] Sanders, Sen. [Jeff] Merkley, John Conyers in the House – they are telling you they are going to take away your health plan,” Moffit said.With Medicare already in deep debt and staring at $33-44 trillion in unfunded liabilities, Moffit said adding the rest of the nation to the program would require a major wallop to the wallets of taxpayers.Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2017/09/yikes-dem...lGfZLg4FH2b.99

Re: ObamaCare: A false Promise

Clears way for health-care 'alternatives,' goes around stalled Congress

Published: 4 hours ago

WASHINGTON – Thwarted over and over in his effort to repeal and replace Obamacare by a unified Democratic Party and a handful of Republicans, President Trump Thursday used his executive power to at least partially fulfill his major campaign promise

The president dismantled part of his predecessor’s signature health-care legislation — the Affordable Care Act — with the “power of the pen,” providing “millions of Americans with Obamacare relief.”The president’s plan will let small businesses and individuals band together, creating so-called “health-care associations,” and purchase insurance across state lines.The move, he said, will increase competition and bring down costs, making it easier for people to buy cheaper, bare-bones health insurance.

“We aim to allow more small businesses to form associations to buy affordable and more competitive health insurance. This will open up additional options for more [employers] to buy health care plans their workers want,” Trump explained at a White House event marking the action.“This will create tremendous competition — the competition will be staggering,” he said.

Re: ObamaCare: A false Promise

You and I agree about this. The only hope of avoiding single payer was the GOP putting forth an actual solution.

So, whether it's now, or whether it's one or two election cycles from now, we'll have single payer because the GOP has no ideas and no leadership...especially at 1600 Pennsylvania.

Over the next 3 months it will implode. Trump is putting it out of its' misery.

Blame Trump for the lack of leadership all you want, but when you have establishment cowards like McCain along with many other RINOs who favor socialism it was never going to be repealed and replaced. There really was no way to fix it. It was broken from day one.

Re: ObamaCare: A false Promise

Originally Posted by PawDawg

Over the next 3 months it will implode. Trump is putting it out of its' misery.

Blame Trump for the lack of leadership all you want, but when you have establishment cowards like McCain along with many other RINOs who favor socialism it was never going to be repealed and replaced. There really was no way to fix it. It was broken from day one.

As you said, it was designed to implode. After it does, the populace will demand something that covers pre-existing conditions and you know as well as I do that a single payer will ultimately be the result.

Trump isn't extraordinary in his inability to lead, he just touted himself as a savvy deal maker who could break gridlock and affect change.

Re: ObamaCare: A false Promise

Originally Posted by johnnylightnin

As you said, it was designed to implode. After it does, the populace will demand something that covers pre-existing conditions and you know as well as I do that a single payer will ultimately be the result.

Trump isn't extraordinary in his inability to lead, he just touted himself as a savvy deal maker who could break gridlock and affect change.

Actually he is leading by killing this crappy socialist plan.

No, single pay will not be the end result if it is scrapped and they start over from scratch. As it should have been from the start, a special pool will be set up to cover pre-existing. The government can fund it for much less than they are paying now. We must have a free market health care system that is funded by true insurance premiums. Otherwise our quality of care will go down to the level of other socialist countries.

Re: ObamaCare: A false Promise

Originally Posted by PawDawg

Actually he is leading by killing this crappy socialist plan.

No, single pay will not be the end result if it is scrapped and they start over from scratch. As it should have been from the start, a special pool will be set up to cover pre-existing. The government can fund it for much less than they are paying now. We must have a free market health care system that is funded by true insurance premiums. Otherwise our quality of care will go down to the level of other socialist countries.

Nooe. The ACA implosion has been baked in from the start...that has nothing to do with Trump.

He is culpable in having no feasible replacement and THAT is the reason the ACA is still in place today.

I'll bet you that by the time my kids are out of HS, we'll be single payer and we'll have Trump and the GOP to thank for it.