never tried the TD2, but it's the same inside rim depth, 1.1 cm. Same as TD, Predator, JLS, leopard, CE Teebird etc...

I realize the PDGA specs are neither that precise nor the only relevant factor, but I admit to being pretty surprised when I discovered the Pred and the TD were the same rim depth (had to double check my own), I was so sure the Pred was much higher. However, when actually comparing the discs I can feel them hitting my fingers in just the same spots (except for the concave/convex wing of course), the Pred is just sharper and more defined.

What I'm getting at here, is I'm pretty skeptical of these "sooo shallow" comments, as I just pointed out the feel is different, but needing another grip??? That's all in your head IMO (in fact, I'm about as skeptical as I am to Mike's general defense of anything MVP - I've stopped thinking about it as reviews, sorry... you would be a better ambassador if you turned the praise a bit down from eleven, just sayin'...)

Expecting a pair of Volts to land here soon, Amps will be ordered as soon as they're out as well,'cause I've really liked all of MVP's offerings so far (except too clear Proton plastic) and consistency is better than anything I've seen. And I like challengers

I know I'm biased towards MVP...I know the guys, etc, etc, and I don't think I could deny a deeply rooted affection. I will try and keep my reviews void of value statements and focus on how the disc flies as to avoid annoying those concerned.

The part where flight plate and rim connect is slightly rounded which might add to the shallower feel. Not nearly as rounded as MVP putters but it might make it feel 1mm shallower or so. I think it actually does feel good, my fingers are rounded as well.What I'm more worried is that mine got a bit damaged while throwing it at a grass field. Since flight plate and most of the rim are in premium plastic I'd think it will need a lot more to actually change how it flies but I still wonder if softer outside rim on such a sharp disc is a good idea.

I'm also with the crowd that thinks Volt isn't anything special. My 170 flat pink certainly isn't understable tho. At least MVP has proven that they can achieve a lot of variation in one mold as well.

Edit// Just realized I'm in completely wrong thread for this post. My whole post is about Volt after all.

discspeed speaks of dome height and there's been talk of PLH. All the Volts at the store i got mine from had an equal PLH to each other and i did not detect much dome height variation at all. Is there a lot of HSS and LSS difference between a 168 red to a 175?

Could we get a side profile of a straight Volt and if possible side by side with a flippy one?

I'm not gonna bag mine unless i can change it back to factory spec. I just don't know about the target PLH and dome height my disc needs to be changed into. My 167 GL Saint is one step more flippier and harder fading high speed high glide EX than the Volt i have is. I want to get a disc that flies like the one MikeC has. Mine is way different.

I have no grip issues with the Volt but i don't have large hands and long fingers.

I guess i already have an Amp now flight wise. Although mine is not Valk fast and long. Almost though.

Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.

I just got back from playing a round to find a package at my door...Eclosed was a red 172 Amp and a white 172 Amp. Here are some initial impressions...

In the hand it has a unique feel. It is fairly shallow, but for some reason it feels deeper than the Volt. The way the nose feels in the hand is also very different. I like it, feels like a PD with a little duller nose.

I just took them to the field alongside two Volts. It was a little windy and I threw all sorts of shots/distances, but mostly I was throwing them with power (I'll have to take it to the course to finesse it). They flew understable...Most shots were slowly turning for 90% of the flight. As ZJ said, they don't fly like Volts at all...Much more of a Leopard/XL/ASS type of line where the turn is slow and constant and there isn't much fade to pull it out. It has a speed closer to a SW/RR, but it does not behave like those discs. It has slower action.

Distance wise they were not going quite as far as my Volts (which I'm quite comfortable with now) except with a direct or left to right tailwind. Then there were pretty equivalent.

That's about all I should say until I take them to the course for more testing. Also I should note again that the Volts I'm throwing/comparing the Amp to are stable.

I got to throw my Amps at the course today...It was a bit gusty, but nothing I'd switch out any of my normal discs for. I put them through quite a workout on a range of shots from approaches to tailwind distance drives. I threw them FH and BH as well.

First off, at least I'll understand from a firsthand perspective the variation in this mold (unlike the Volt) because the two I have are different discs stability wise. My stormtrooper flies a lot like ZJ's description...It likes to get some initial high speed turn, settle on it's line, and then fade late. It's a really straight hyzer flipper, and very controllable in it's action. For a high speed turning disc it flies decent in the wind and is pretty predictable all around. This disc likes to hold pretty straight in it's flight with just enough HSS on the hyzer flip to keep the shot from getting away.

My red Amp is one of the most understable discs out of the box I've ever thrown. I could keep it straight from a deep hyzer on 300ish shots, but farther than that and my shot always finished right. This disc has almost no LSS, almost coming to a stop in the air before falling left. Despite it's understability it was still useable to me, which was a bit surprising as I've never carried a fwy driver this understable. It's turn was slow and methodical and it is very insensitive to nose angle...I would just throw it with deep hyzer and watch it slowly work up and over and to the ground. It has good glide, but not as much as a RR. It really holds in the air on it's anny turn as well. I don't roll a whole lot, but this disc was easy for me to stand up and get good rollers out of right away. Overall in was responding similarly to the same release angles as my Mamba.

So I've got two new discs in my bag, both with their own merits and virtues. They go really well with my stable Volt as well. So now I'm really hoping that MVP completes this trilogy of drivers with a true "0" HSS disc that has a decent fade before they move on to faster stuff.