Nor will the liberals, anti-trumpers or whatever you like to call yourselves of jazzfanz.com...

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I seriously doubt either side of the Great American Divide has altered the fundamental position of the opposite side, here on jazzfanz. Certainly, I can hear the contempt in your "whatever you like to call yourselves", and it has often been reciprocal of course. Basically, much of the conversation in these many Trump threads has been in the form of people simply talking past each other. I also believe there are very fundamental psychological differences in how liberals and conservatives see and interpret the world. And there are so many ways in which those differences, and our divisions, can be described and examined. For instance, much of our history can be seen as a struggle between the values of urban dwellers vs. the values of rural folks. The stark divisions we see today have been present throughout our history.

I would never presume anything I could or would say, would alter how you feel and think. Of course, if we are to survive, and even once more thrive, beyond our present Great Divide, we will someday have to find a way to recognize some commonality in our all being citizens of this country. We will have to give up trolling and aiming for pounding the other side into submission. Someday.

I also believe there are very fundamental psychological differences in how liberals and conservatives see and interpret the world.

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I disagree.
They see the world the way their party wants them to see it.

If trump/the Republican party decided tomorrow that open borders are the way to go and that women should have the right to choose and that guns should have more restrictions then heathme would agree with those thoughts/policies.

Fine vote for him. It’s your right. But I’ll openly wonder about your dedication to American principles, courage and morality.

If you want to pretend it’s a left/right thing go ahead.

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@Stoked I would say the same thing to you. "I’ll openly wonder about your dedication to American principles, courage and morality" if you vote for someone who would like to implement socialism in the United States of America.

I seriously doubt either side of the Great American Divide has altered the fundamental position of the opposite side, here on jazzfanz. Certainly, I can hear the contempt in your "whatever you like to call yourselves", and it has often been reciprocal of course. Basically, much of the conversation in these many Trump threads has been in the form of people simply talking past each other. I also believe there are very fundamental psychological differences in how liberals and conservatives see and interpret the world. And there are so many ways in which those differences, and our divisions, can be described and examined. For instance, much of our history can be seen as a struggle between the values of urban dwellers vs. the values of rural folks. The stark divisions we see today have been present throughout our history.

I would never presume anything I could or would say, would alter how you feel and think. Of course, if we are to survive, and even once more thrive, beyond our present Great Divide, we will someday have to find a way to recognize some commonality in our all being citizens of this country. We will have to give up trolling and aiming for pounding the other side into submission. Someday.

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I say "whatever you like to call yourselves" because every time I post "liberals" someone throws a fit and says "I'm not a liberal. How dare you call me that".

Coming to a common ground would be wonderful. The two sides just disagree too profoundly in what is best for the country.

@Stoked I would say the same thing to you. "I’ll openly wonder about your dedication to American principles, courage and morality" if you vote for someone who would like to implement socialism in the United States of America.

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This guy stands by his principles. He will refuse socialized social security. Does not travel on socialist roads. Refuses socialist firefighters.

@Stoked I would say the same thing to you. "I’ll openly wonder about your dedication to American principles, courage and morality" if you vote for someone who would like to implement socialism in the United States of America.

I disagree.
They see the world the way their party wants them to see it.

If trump/the Republican party decided tomorrow that open borders are the way to go and that women should have the right to choose and that guns should have more restrictions then heathme would agree with those thoughts/policies.

Well, I'm not going to dig for sources now, but a couple of years ago, @joebagadonuts and I initiated a thread on the differences between liberals and conservatives, and I was able to find sources describing differences in the physical brain structure. Now, that's poorly worded, I need to find sources to better describe what I am getting at, but be it psychology, or physiological differences in brain structure, when I said "psychological differences between how liberals and conservatives see the world", that is what I was thinking of. Just as a simplistic "for example", conservatives tend to be more aware and conscious of threats, liberals tend to be more open to change, etc., etc. etc. This is over and apart from the particulars separating liberals and conservatives on issues in 2019 America.

Edit: @fishonjazz, this is but one example of where I was coming from. I could find sources like this all day, and I'm sure it's relevancy/accuracy could be debated all day:

A pure socialist system across everything would be a disaster. Using socialism as just another arrow in the quiver for targeted, specific problems isn’t.

For example, Healthcare. Make everyone eligible for Medicare. Those that want to keep their insurance can. Medicare has everyone else. All medical facilities and doctors must take Medicare.

I think that’s a very solid foundation to work from on healthcare. And it has a socialist base.

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Socialist based healthcare scares me. Look no further than some European countries that implement it now. They decide if you're worthy enough to live or die and give the patient and families no say in the matter.

Socialist based healthcare scares me. Look no further than some European countries that implement it now. They decide if you're worthy enough to live or die and give the patient and families no say in the matter.

That is not a good road to travel down.

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It’s better than millions uninsured. Also those already insured can keep their insurance under what I proposed. So it’s not truly “universal” in the sense of single payer. Unless everyone chooses it to be.

It’s better than millions uninsured. Also those already insured can keep their insurance under what I proposed. So it’s not truly “universal” in the sense of single payer. Unless everyone chooses it to be.

Canada says hi.

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I don't think I would have any issues with that depending on the fine print. My main concern being what I previously wrote. Also, Canada taxes the crap out of their people to pay for that, Germany does as well under a similar system.