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Mental Misstep Discussion

16 hours ago

"i dont really have any idea on what the competitive/pro tour scene would look like as far as what people would play with no modern ban"

Then why are you even having this discussion? Before making this kind of argument, you should have analyzed the metagame that the cards were banned in. Then, look at the win rates of said decks/usage level of said cards. Only then would you have enough knowledge to fully understand why there is a Modern Banlist. Most of the cards that were banned had a really high usage rate, or were key points of decks that were neigh unbeatable during their time, in much the same metagame that exists today (depending on the deck/card). If something like
Mental Misstep
was legal in modern, 9/10 most played cards in modern would be shut off (based on MTGGoldfish), and 19/50 of the most played cards. If
Chrome Mox
were legal, imagine t1
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
. It would be unbeatable, it's really that simple.

So before making an argument that is not even close to being based in fact, do the research. Then you can/will understand why there is a banlist in modern.

While some cards are probably deserving to come off the banlist, many of the spells have their place there, and will stay for many years to come.

1 day ago

"One thing that I found extremely interesting is that if you take the overbearing power of Eldrazi out of the equation, No Ban List Modern was actually less degenerate than regular Modern. Yes, decks were more powerful, but a lot of the powerful cards cancelled each other out. Games were actually fun, interesting and rich with decision points. I didn't get killed earlier than turn four a single time in the entire event, and most games I played lasted until turn 8-10 at the very least." - Brian Braun-Duin

as far as hyper aggro/combo are concerned that is just inherent risk of running/abusing such a low mana curve...you will be kept honest with
Chalice of the Void
,
Mindbreak Trap
or potentially
Mental Misstep
.... greedy mana bases will be kept in line with
Blood Moon
and company.... and if a deck demands having a perfect opening hand...thats a bit ridiculous/probably not a great deck to run but we do have
Serum Powder
...maybe that can help affinnity out?

SynergyBuild Truthfully I am not asking anything. This thread was honestly just started just for fun/speculation challenging the idea that modern would die without the banlist. I am making the case that there are plenty of answers that have been printed post 8th edition to prevent any one deck from being an apex predator/have someone to answer to... but certainly some will command more respect than others as is the case in any environment.... btw i dig that your playtesting this!

1 day ago

so i guess to clean it up.... in a no ban modern format... the guy who just bought into there paper
Through the Breach
combo would be understandibly furious considering what else would be made available like
Hypergenesis
... and if eveyone feels that there deck will require a full playset of
Mental Misstep
then i can only assum that the price would go up due to the demand and lack of reprints..so the guy who has a shoe box of new phyrexia cards in a shoe box from when he/she was in shool then i guess they'd be pumped for it.

1 day ago

when it comes to the economics... its a whole different animal... my angle aims more at proving or disproving the Modern format would thrive/die with a no ban/restriction list.....legacy/vintage still exist but have a completely different price tag depending on the player base.... same goes for standard....depending how serious of a player you are you can spend a lot of money playing in a standard format....i dont exactly control the price of
Force of Will
/
Mental Misstep
/
Teferi, Hero of Dominaria
... but those cards serve the same purpose in there perspective arenas.

1 day ago

Initially the speculation was that Miracles/Storm would be the only decks that would be played....in the NBLM event it turned into Eldrazi being the primary deck... the reality is that there is a much bigger scope here than just those... while squadron hawk is a great way to consistently have a creature, it might not be good enough for a format bereft with removal.. like a lot of removal... to be able
Fulminator Mage
/Fulminate a land,
Bloodbraid Elf
/Cascade into
Kolaghan's Command
/K-Command, get Fulminator back.... im just not convinced that decks types cant be hated out... unfair decks can be put in check with
Mental Misstep
/
Chalice of the Void
/
Abrupt Decay
... greedy mana bases have to deal with a slew of land hate in the same way graveyard strategies have a slew of hate coming their way.

was
Necropotence
ever Modern Legal/Printed post 8th edition sets?... and as far as standard caw-blade is concerned i cant comment on that hardly...sure i went and played LGS standard drafts back in zendikar days but i was a completely different player back then convinced i was gonna make something happen whith
Living Tsunami
and landfall shenanigans but to no avail lol.

2 days ago

Nice analysis but you are actually wrong mt friend. Those very strong 1 drop cards were not kept incheck by
Mental Misstep
because they werent legal together. Misstep was banned specifically because of the bad player experience it gave making turn 1 luck based.

The others such as skullclamp was banned because of sheer power as even in its original time of printing (pre modern) it was extremelty busted beyond its years

Your point on no banlist modern vs no banlist modern is very true! Busted beats busted. But i believe even throughout the svg tour it was noted eldrazi was a step above the other no banlist decks due to consitency of being busted even with mull to 4 on the draw plays. I believe the grand finals of the no banlist modern of scg on youtube highlited this.

"in many ways Misstep was the card that allowed No Ban List Modern to function as a format. Much like how
Force of Will
in Legacy holds a lot of broken strategies in check. "

"One thing that I found extremely interesting is that if you take the overbearing power of Eldrazi out of the equation, No Ban List Modern was actually less degenerate than regular Modern. Yes, decks were more powerful, but a lot of the powerful cards cancelled each other out. Games were actually fun, interesting and rich with decision points. I didn't get killed earlier than turn four a single time in the entire event, and most games I played lasted until turn 8-10 at the very least. Games actually felt a lot like playing Legacy, and there weren't any games in the event where I felt completely helpless to do anything against what my opponent was throwing out there."

"artifact lands like
Ancient Den
, did not seem to really matter at all in the games we played. I would say an artifact-land based Affinity deck could probably end up being a decent strategy in the format, but then again, maybe not. Affinity is not a great strategy in Legacy, and decks like Eldrazi, Dark Depths, and White-Blue Counter-Top were strategies that played at a near-Legacy power level. Affinity was just outclassed."

with some of those points in mind i dont think a single tournement like this is enough data to conclusively say what decks would be out of control in the modern format. If Eldrazi was higher on the radar many people could have drastically increased their win percentage against the deck by doing something as simple as splashing for
Blood Moon
or adding
Ensnaring Bridge
to their sideboard....there is a lot of power here no doubt about it; but the answers exist.

2 days ago

Well idk if you were around but i remember exactly why
Mental Misstep
was banned.

Everybody would jam 4x of it intheir decks for the turn 1 misstep war- and it would be zero skill. Whoever drew more wins the war. And thats not very fun is it?

Birthing Pod
made me quit magic. I went to an fnm with 25 people 20 of which played meleria pod. I remember it was very caw-blade esque of where the creativity was sapped out of modern and its wither you play pod or a direct counter. No in betweens.

Mental Misstep occurrence in decks from the last year

Commander / EDH:

All decks: 0.17%

Blue: 0.68%

G/U (Simic): 0.08%

U/R (Izzet): 0.07%

W/U/B (Esper): 0.14%

U/B/R (Grixis): 0.13%

BUG (Sultai): 0.12%

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