The antidote to ideologies

BREAKING….the real reason why Cameron spoke about pensions on Marr

REMAIN CAMPAIGN HAEMORRHAGING OVER 60’s

A solid UK market research source confided to The Slog last night that the biggest single black hole for Remaindeers is women aged 55-75. It is possible that this trend is being driven by Waspi women….although not, I hasten to add, by their Executive. Meanwhile, as the Brexit lead first revealed and then censored last week is confirmed by every study since, the Left is turning increasingly feral on social media.

It must have been tricky even for a bare-faced liar like David Cameron to go on Marr yesterday and say that Brexit might endanger UK State pension promises. But a phone call from England last night (a result of seeing yesterday’s Slogpost) quickly provided an answer.

I spent over 30 years working as a communications research specialist. The call from a former colleague (then young, now very senior) asserted that older voters – especially women – have a very high voting intention and some 5/6ths of them will vote Leave:

“Our view for some time has been that we must measure how solid the voting intention is, and what things chiefly concern those on either side. The two latest studies show a trend among older females to firm up their intention, and vote Brexit, and the two things of most interest to them are immigration and pensions. Qualitative pullout from the latest study also shows very high levels of distrust towards David Cameron”

We mustn’t get carried away here: some of the sub-samples are small, and the jargon at the end is essentially saying they did a couple of focus groups. But this leak confirms every other reliable study done in the last month.

Now the logical thing for the Waspi Campaign to do would be to press this point home to the Odd Neighbours at Numbers 10 & 11. The Executive won’t, of course – they’d see that as “rather bad form” and altogether offside.

But my advice to Waspi Brexiteers is to bombard your MPs with the intention to vote Brexit – Labour or Tory, as usual it makes no difference: nothing terrifies Westminster élites more than whining backbenchers worried about reelection.

I would repeat my observation of last week that some stunt or outburst of dirty tricks remains very much on the cards. But equally apparent this morning is the British Left reverting to its default position of spitting bile at all those who might have a problem with staying with the European Bunion. Yesterday I got two corking tweets from Tom Pride, one of which told me I was ‘disgusting’, and the other that I was ‘not as intelligent as he thought’. Tom now blames ‘the relentless campaign of media demonisation of migrant workers’ for Remain having stalled. This reversion to ideological knee-jerk would be bad enough, but becomes hilarious when you go to his Twitter space and see this:

As a quite disgraceful (and somewhat desperate) smear against Brexiteers, this strikes me as both unintelligent and disgusting too. It also turned out to be wrong (England supporters were targeted by Russian ultras, not the other way round). Anyway, my crime was to point this out to Tom. Hence the spitting.

Such are the ways of liberal ideologists: they run out of arguments, and then start throwing mud. I’m not keen on yobs, racists, opportunists and other assorted loons who have latched on to Leave. But in a democracy, you can’t stop the unpleasant voting the same way as you.

Would I trust any major UK Party with citizens rights and liberty? No, of course I wouldn’t – probably because my eyes are still functioning alongside my brain – even at my tender age of 68 years.

I return once more to the single most wise thing said about the Referendum: “This isn’t about in or out, it’s about the People versus the Establishment”. And you know what Mister Mann’rin’? They don’t like it up ’em, do they?

“Such are the ways of liberal ideologists: they run out of arguments,…”

First, John, real ‘liberals’ don’t go around calling people who disagree with them ‘disgusting’. So let’s get that straight. These people are NOT liberal…they’ve simply hijacked the English language. They are, by their actions, fascists of the worst kind. But, as per the hijacking of the language, WE are the fascists.

Second, They have very few arguments. People like Mr Birrell, whoever he is, have been trained the Saul Alinsky method of discussion. MAKE IT PERSONAL!!

I also see all over Facebook an article from The Express which believe was written in January of this year but, seems to be relevant now, that Hollande is declaring an ‘economic emergency’, and that Germany has financial worries all of its own.
You see, it really doesn’t need any help from us Brexiteers, it’s managing to screw it up all on its own.

But, more seriously, and I know not how much truth there is in this, although given the circumstances in Europe it would seem to make sense.

A leak from the Bilderbergers agenda seems to revolve around a difference of opinion between two distinct groups within the Bilderbergers, one side wants a slow painful descent into utter depression and misery, and the other wants a short, sharp decline into utter depression and misery, and caught in between the bankers are beside themselves with worry, saying this is a high wire act that is not substainable.

When you consider that even Swervin’ Mervin broke ranks to state how Europe’s economic policies were designed to make things worse economically it sort of adds up….

Oh don’t be to hard on Tom Pride, he is a jolly decent fellow, as prone to kneejerk reactions as anyone else, but often quite funny. I know it can be hard to interact with some people but let’s keep trying, Tom is on the right side.

But on to more pressing matters, and indeed to keep on topic, The People vs The Establishment. Democracy is in a bad place, The People should be The Establishment but we’re not, this is an increasingly worldwide phenomenon all over the world.

We The People are going to make some truly terrible decisions in the vain hope of sticking it up The Establishment but I’m afraid their plans roll on regardless of Brexit or nay. Cameron’s hubris in calling this referendum is beyond belief.

there is the terrible feeling of them and us and its the difference between political ‘spin’ and reality… the fact is we are all up to our neck in it whether we stay or go… if we go maybe we can get ourselves some prosperity instead of austerity.. if we stay then we are handcuffed to 27 other countries and their politicians.. if we go we have only got our leaders to deal with.

So far after a few days of Euro footy, it makes me glad I switched watching rugby many years ago. The litter left behind after a game is the same but winner or loser, everyone goes home without the desire to kick hell out of the opposition supporters. I think this comes from the human failing to realise that be it one or a thousand , drunks are only funny to themselves, to everyone else they are a pathetic , threatening embarrassment, same as dog owners who let their huge mutts jump on your child claiming O! he really is just being playful he does not want to rip your child to pieces. Most of the normal fans could be controlled by stopping all drink sales and stopping drunk fans entering the stadia, however the same could not be said for the Russian black shirt’s, so called supporters, they are ultra sinister and look to have no interest in drink or football just fighting.

I fully expect a “terrorist attack/s” here in Britain within the next week where the whole Western media will spin it to suggest that only staying in the EU will keep us safe (even though we are currently in the EU and no it didn’t).

These Bastards will do anything to game the referendum their way and if 200+ innocent Brits need to die to cause the “Remain Panic” on the day, they’ll probably murder 600+ just to make sure.

it would appear that the British football hooligans became powder puffs and met their match when they came up against the Russian hooligans.
2 year Army conscription is compulsory in Russia and those hooligans are fit and brutal. On the ground reports is that the French Police were happy to sit back and watch after their bruising encounter with British fans the night before.in Marseille.
A sobering experience for some drunken fans.

If the polls are correct, Cameldung has already done a grand job of alienating a large proportion of the British voting public over Brexit. By trying to threaten the over 60’s he is likely to make his situation worse as age and worldly experience tend to reduce suggestibility, so making such people far more likely to dig their heels in; he is a venal, shallow man who thoroughly deserves a monumental defeat. As for those lotus eaters who see staying in the EU as a way to protect us from our own dysfunctional political system and self-interested politicians, the reality will come as a very nasty shock indeed when Remain turns to Regret.

The over 60’s by virtue of life experience and life in Uk before membership of the EU, can smell a sack of horse manure being sold as rose petals by a snake oil salesman such as Cameron.
He is Brexits best promoter, each time he appears on TV selling his tales of fear and doom.
He has lost all credibility in the eyes of young and old.
Whatever the result of the referendum he is a spent force and will go gently into political oblivion, leaving behind a split Tory party.

Yes, but Johnson, Gove, IDS, John Mann and the rest are also part of the establishment. But more sinister than that, their strings seem to be being pulled by characters such as Rupert Murdoch and the Barclay Brothers who are not even British. I have no doubt there is an honest case for leaving the EU but nothing in this campaign has made me want to vote Brexit.

Tom,
The older generation were deceived when they were told by the governments of the day they were voting on joining / remaining in a “Common Market”, whilst all the while those in power were working to produce an undemocratic super state that some call (with some justification the EUSSR). I think the younger generation, who have not experienced life outside the EU, are today being conned that the EU is the Solution. (But to what problem God alone knows). Our present bunch of weak politicians favouring Remain are busy acting almost as Sonderkommandos herding us into the EU prison – I sincerely hope that on June 23rd the doors won’t snap shut on us because the Brussels Elite will have a field day in imposing their direction of travel on Britain and all that that entails. Not that I’m advocating it, but history shows that Britain can do very very well as an independent nation devoid of “British EU Commissioners”…..

kfc, Thanks for that link, I gave up reading any on-line Telegraph when they changed the format and stopped comments, so a useful read!
The bit about the NI debate and the Ulster Catholics was good, and like the SNP and Corbyn, there seems to be a general agreement that not having the EU keep parliament in check will be BAD……I must have been asleep for the past 50 years, as I was always under the impression that the Gubmint did or didn’t do stuff according to how we the public vote and also on how good the Opposition are?! If Corbyn ‘Needs’ the EU, he is effectively saying he and the opposition have zero clout against the reigning lot. Or have I missed summat? If that IS the case then the sooner out the better, as then we can all hold our MP’s to account, and kick out the lot of them if they don’t represent us….I also wish to see the end of Whips, as that flies in the face of democracy!
I also note with interest that ALL the Remain folk trotted out for publicity keep hold of the mantra staying in ‘a reformed EU’ is the best option. As we all know there is not a cat-in-hell’s-chance of meaningful reform, could it just possibly be that they are playing us all, and are ‘Leavers’ keeping their options open in the new Britain that will be formed?
It’s what they will do, not what they say…innit!?

Brilliant read as ever JW, thanks. Just need to expose the 5th columnists of Common Purpose and jobs done. I predict a landslide for OUT followed by the demise of Cameron and Jacob Rees-Mogg the next Tory leader. (Get the 130/1 odds on Betfair soonest)
Tickety

Euro-court outlaws criticism of EU: THE European Court of Justice ruled yesterday that the European Union can lawfully suppress political criticism of its institutions and of leading figures, sweeping aside English Common Law and 50 years of European precedents on civil liberties.

@ Tom
Yesterday you said “The whole way this country is run desperately needs the kind of check that European institutions provide, and I suspect a large part of the reason people kick up a fuss about it, is that they don’t want their cosy, self-serving worlds being subject to scrutiny.”

I think you have got it exactly backwards – it is precisely the lack of scrutiny in the EU that is so attractive to those politicians whose basic tendencies are undemocratic. Presumably you’re aware that the sole source of EU laws, which take precedence over our own, is the European Commission who meet behind closed doors and do not publish minutes of their meetings? Are you in favour of opaque government? Those Commissioners represent 28 different countries and are appointed for 5 years, NOT elected. In theory, each one is supposed to forget about their own country and act in European interests, though that’s a bit hard to believe. Whichever portfolio they are subsequently assigned is completely up to the President, i.e. Juncker. Once again, I’d be surprised if the majority in Britain has the faintest idea how the system works or the name of even one member of the European Commission.

You say “the Barclay brothers are not even British”, when they were born in Hammersmith and do have British citizenship. Surely it’s the quality of their newspaper that is questionable rather than their residence on one of the British Channel Islands?

Wish these BREMAIN’s would start questioning what they are voting for because in my mind to accept without question is the ultimate dumb act. I only had 2 points yesterday on why BREXIT and now I have 3 … it’s called a style of justice I was not reared to accept so in order of importance.

1.) No democracy at the highest level, appointee system, in the US you can have a president impeached but not in the EU.
2.) Being unable to produce a set of financial books is not on, it only suggests hidden corruption in everything.
3.) If I commit a crime I expect the justice system I was raised in and where my peers on a jury decide.

What is becoming more apparent is for 40 years the elites changed the whole concept of europe but they made one mistake and that at no point was the population called upon to impart some democracy into this growing institution. Because of this error the amount of democracy in the system is negligible. Then apply the same concept to corruption and you can see how not ever being forced to “ever” produce a set of books you end up with rife corruption. No? Then produce the books … can’t or won’t? Then to the next nail in the coffin a justice system that best supports the no questions dictatorship or your jailed.

The 3.) points I raised should not even exist if the EU was created democratically … that it is so different is because there was no democracy involved was there.

Now I know they will take us in but as I believe we have a deteriorating economic condition like Japan the only mantra should be .. “The LIBLABCON and all their politicians joined us to this”. After that hang the lot, the price they should pay. The left are right on one point at the moment the fear being used to motivate people to vote and they are just as guilty as the other side.

But if things were so good we would all join … that should be the truth. Now from where I am sitting no BREMAIN or BREXIT are debating the points I raised instead both sides are resorting to scaremongering and mud slinging.

Here’s Douglas Murray highlighting the lack of reason one so often finds on the other side these days, in this case Eddie Izzard on Thursday’s Question Time. Murray wonders if he’s not “a mole placed at the heart of the Remain camp by Leave”.

” In their struggle to convince wavering voters that ‘Leave’ is risky, who better to put the case for ‘Remain’ than a man in lipstick and nail-varnish, wearing a bright pink beret with a religious adoration of the EU and a fevered compulsion to talk over everyone else. One of his claims was that since Nigel Farage is descended from foreigners he has a cheek to voice any concerns on immigration. How interesting it always is to watch people who pretend that someone landing in Britain yesterday from Eritrea or Somalia is immediately ‘as British as the next person’, while someone with the ‘wrong’ opinions on immigration (i.e. ‘thinks it should be managed’) is deemed ‘an immigrant’ even after centuries.””

It really is “where is the democracy coming from”, “who do we elect and “can” represent us at the highest level in the EU”.

Need to make the top of the EU selectable only through MEP’s. If you are not an MEP you can’t have the top job but by the same token the other MEP’s may choose somebody else. It is where the democracy breaks down and why so MEP’s appear worthless because you might elect them but you elect them as real puppets.

Watch this though, change that one point you can be ousted if the population starts to demand a set of books, immigration fine but if it gets to be mass immigration … again ousted and so on. TTIP, not a problem you are ousted for a group that will make any necessary and just modification to that … it all works if the top is a proper democracy and currently it is not.

They will not do it … the EU was brought into being for this purpose and that’s the problem.

Hence BREXIT and if someone want to sign up for whats on offer I should not suffer in the future for any penalities because of anothers choice. Even worse they fraudulently drag me into a poor position to suffer at that point just kill everything okay because it may be preferable. In that undemocratic act lies the next civil war, maybe even another european war and ominously the EU is moving towards this.

Whilst I agree with you on most things, I must disagree with you on the Referendum and willi be voting Remain.

However, I agree with you that Cameron is a complete arsehole and the ludicrous scare tactics he is employing could cost him the vote and his job. Having said that, the Exit camp are employing exactly the same tactics.

Meanwhile the Telegraph employs the best polictians money can stipend.

If, as kfc suggests, it’s going to get much dirtier with personal attacks then it could make for interesting viewing.

I trust voters will take a step back and consider the effect of an Exit vote will have on the GBP/USD and EUR/GBP exchange rates and how this will reflect in the price of filling up their petrol tank and the cost of their Europeam Holidays.

The June 23rd vote is inching ever closer and whilst media coverage of the EU referendum has been wall to wall for the last few months, we thought we’d take a poll of our clients to see where they stand on the biggest political question asked of the British public this generation: should we stay in or leave the EU?

We asked our clients that exact question, and perhaps not surprisingly, the results mirrored the current polls reflecting the UK’s thinking overall, with a slight lead for the leave camp.

Where’s the democracy going to come from, Glory Days? We don’t have a functioning democracy at the moment, with rigged skewed electoral system designed to keep getting the Tories elected (with the occasional stooge Tory in the Labour Party to keep up appearances), an unelected second chamber, and a biased press that is actively working against the British people.
Many nations in Europe are more democratic than we are. Leaving the EU will only result in a power grab by the leeches already trying to suck the blood out of the country, as well as completely shooting us in the foot economically.
They are pretending the EU is our enemy when in fact they are a friend. Our real enemies are the fifth column presently wrapping themselves in the Union flag to dupe decent British people. Don’t fall for their lies.

I have my coffee to read on newspaper that you British Englanders not to listen my advisorys here.
My advisory friendly for you to stop the bad things coming in the future time for yous.
We Germans writing some rules make Greece our example for the Englanders when the disobeydience the referendum advisorys.

@ Anon: “I trust voters will take a step back and consider the effect of an Exit vote will have on the GBP/USD and EUR/GBP exchange rates and how this will reflect in the price of filling up their petrol tank and the cost of their European Holidays…”

The overvalued £ needs to fall for the greater good of our exports and to rebalance our lopsided economy.

Tom, your points about the UK can be equally applied for reasons to leave the EU. The EU has proven over the years not to be our friend. At least once we are out we only have our elected filth to kick in to line and start answering to the people of the UK.

“The overvalued £ needs to fall for the greater good of our exports and to rebalance our lopsided economy”

And of course, there is a sting in this tail. Imports – on which the British economy has made itself dependent – will become more expensive. Britain’s trading deficit means that a weak pound will do more harm than good.

That will lead to inflation and the possibility that the pound will be forced even lower by the markets.

After all, today, the markets make money by having a strong pound; when the time comes that they can make more money through a weak pound, they will. The interests of those in the marketplace is only to make money: the consequences of their actions will affect those living in Britain.

I couldn’t agree more with your first paragraph. The FPTP system and an MSM that shills for the oligarchs does indeed mean that Britain is a democracy in name only at present. Without an educated, informed electorate and an independent judiciary, the sham of elections every five years is indeed very far from rule for and by the people. As long as the dark arts of Bernays and his ilk are applied to an unaware population and secrecy is used by default to hide the machinations of the Deep State, democracy in the UK will remain the Norwegian Blue – nailed to the perch when it should really be pushing up the daisies.

It does not follow however that rather than attempt to bring reform to the deeply flawed system created by the elites in the U.K. we should sign up to the behemoth banker/corporate-controlled bureaucracy the EU has become. I maintain that it will be easier to bring pressure to bear on those that have to live amongst us when things become critical than it will be to change the course of the EU super-tanker heading for the inevitable Neoliberal-piloted shipwreck.

It has been sobering for me to realise that I share common cause with some of the most objectionable, venal enemies of democracy such as those that appeared in the Brexit video posted on these threads several times and I am extremely suspicious of their motives. The fact that these duplicitous individuals are advocating for Brexit does not mean that I endorse their views on any other matter. I just would rather be on board a tender heading for the rocks rather than on a super-tanker. I at least have some chance of wresting the helm from the idiots in charge and effecting a change of course in the case of the tender.

Thank you for your responses. I don’t pretend that Remain is a perfect or even a very good option. Indeed, I commented here at the start of the campaign that I believed the referendum is a trap to blame the British people whatever the outcome. However, I have come to the conclusion that Remain is enough of the lesser evil to be worthy of the vote – and I feel that more strongly having seen Rupert Murdoch’s latest attempt to poison our democracy this morning.

This canadian (me) has been reading UK media and blogposts for the past five years. Also various european sites. And I have come to the conclusion that just like Greece, Britain’s Brexit vote will be either declared void or ignored or some other cockmammy excuse. And like Greece the people will just take it up the hoop.
Makes me sad.

First stop brexit. Second stop impeachment of all those who illegally sold the country out to foreign powers. 3rd reinstate capital punishment for treason and backdate it for 40 years.
Vote in new MPs to replace the danglers… to fix the democratic deficiency.

Of course you Englanders will find the coquesenses if you not listening to my advisorys.
My naming was Heinz and my wealthiness was very big and my papa calling me Heinrich when I was always giving good advisorys towards my friends for making very good job with the factory businesses. You always trusting your Heinrich with the best advisorys.

The fearmongering becomes apocalyptic, as in Donald Tusk yesterday, President of the EU Council:-
“As a historian I fear Brexit could be the beginning of the destruction of not only the EU but also Western political civilisation in its entirety.”

As the odds improve to the current 4/7 (1.57) BREXIT – beware- they will turn down early next week when it becomes apparent that the 12/15% move to the REMAIN camp. This is my last shout for people who want to make a fast profit.

I was young and foolish when I voted to remain in The Common Market. Now my salad days are long behind me, but I have an opportunity to put right the mistake of my youth. I WILL be voting out, notwithstanding the garbled piffle of Heinrich, McBroon and the swivel-eyed loon Cameron.

My recent experience of this referendum debate finds the head and the heart at odds. The heart loves the anti establishment scribbling , as exhibited by our host John Ward Esq . The head sees this discussion as an establishment sideshow, which might be a chance to make some money. We all love that do we not?
My recent experience , which I would like to share with you today is this. The pound has weakened a little….OK. So no big deal yet.
The London stock market is down, yes…..but look closely….there are STILL no bargains. Investors have just opened their eyes and decided to dump a few of their least interesting equities. Some are down a fair bit, but they were way over priced before. There are still no great buying opportunities. Maybe there will be after the result is known – but I doubt it….because the professional investors have supported any oversold shares already.
So my question is – are we being duped again? Shares are down, the pound is down, taxes will have to go up, benefits will have to be cut, govt spending will have to be cut.
Yes, we are being duped. BIG TIME. The elites KNOW the answers.
THIS IS A DONE DEAL. REMAIN WILL WIN.

I drnking my coffee and nothing much changing on my newspaper this morning. Where is the going forward on this for you Britishers? Of course some footballs and other sex stories like the habit everyday. Maybe some thinking on Heinrich special advisorys huh?

Jo
You hit the nail on the head. Sense at last.
FTSE mostly green this morning after ‘bloodbath’.(joke) – just adjusting for low growth in contrived economy.
Odds back to 4/7 again this morning on Remain.
Johns notes are very fine but ”they don’t butter my parsnips”.