Beret Shape Enforcement Officer

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Swinger

I've heard on the grapevine that there is to be a new duty on Blandford Camp. It will be a WO/Officer, they will locate themselves in the RONCO Bunk with the suicide watch boys, from there they will carry out random patrols of the Camp to ensure that the Pastie Beret crew of the Airborn Fraternity aren't stepping out of line with there 'wierd and wonderful berets' as the CO calls them,

MIA

Crow

I can't really understand why this is such a big deal for anyone. An item of uniform or dress which is outside the "norm" should be picked up in barracks (and that includes Barbour jackets, extreme moustaches, sideburns and silly looking berets). And before anyone starts on about the lack of definition about what a beret should look like, that is why I deliberately used "norm".

It's all about creeping and erosion of standards and once a droopy moustache is acceptable, next will be handlebars and in a flash we'll all be like the Crabs! Similarly, after the "flat cap" comes the badge over the ear etc etc.

I have to say that all those who would criticise time being spent on this petty subject should maybe just wear their berets correctly in the first place and let those trying to enforce the issue get on with other, possibly more important, things.

But then again, maybe maintenance of standards is old hat (and please excuse the rather weak pun).

MIA

I can't really understand why this is such a big deal for anyone. An item of uniform or dress which is outside the "norm" should be picked up in barracks (and that includes Barbour jackets, extreme moustaches, sideburns and silly looking berets).

Maybe because these people are very proud of what they have achieved. A lot is expected from the 264/216 lads in Blandford, let em keep their flat caps, plus it means we always have someone to look after the whippets.

War Hero

I can't really understand why this is such a big deal for anyone. An item of uniform or dress which is outside the "norm" should be picked up in barracks (and that includes Barbour jackets, extreme moustaches, sideburns and silly looking berets).

Maybe because these people are very proud of what they have achieved. A lot is expected from the 264/216 lads in Blandford, let em keep their flat caps, plus it means we always have someone to look after the whippets.

Old-Salt

I can't really understand why this is such a big deal for anyone. An item of uniform or dress which is outside the "norm" should be picked up in barracks (and that includes Barbour jackets, extreme moustaches, sideburns and silly looking berets).

Maybe because these people are very proud of what they have achieved. A lot is expected from the 264/216 lads in Blandford, let em keep their flat caps, plus it means we always have someone to look after the whippets.

Well let me see....maybe it is because the 264/216 lads highlight the varied and interesting lives you can have away from a normal signals unit...or is it to show how far you can motivate yourself to become an achiever instead of yet another mincer....or is it becasue they have achieved summat which not may people can do and should be admired for doing so. That kind of negativity towards these members of the corps just shows ignorance and plain stupidity. These lads are something for the phase 2 trainees to look up to, more than can be said for the remainder of blandford camp!

Point 3. I wouldn't say they rush to the front, although they do volunteer, so do I, a humbe harry.

Point 4. This was mainly because their course was spammed to be section commanders. And their course happens to have a number of 264/216 types on it. And they weren't section commanders. Just like on exercise they were more section holdy hands person to ensure the kids didn't wander off and end up in glasgow or somewhere.

As for shapes of berets etc. I've always considered it a bit of a game to see what you can get away with. Flat caps aside. Who hasn't ironed his lightweights till they were two tone? You could have white inners and dark outers, dark inners and white outer or, my favourite, the battenburg!!!

We'll all be wearing twisters too. The CO likes them, and thinks they're good. So will the designers of the 95 issue trousers take note. Strings at ankles are no longer required so please stop wasting the money. We might be able to save for a swimming pool.

Someone check the twins berets and twisters. If they're not wearing the correct normal beret kindly reshape with a blow torch!!!

MIA

Elastics/twisters......... fookin hate them! They are a BAD practice and will lead to foot rot and other bad foot things in the field (teach the kids - sorry trainees that its a 'good' thing and they will carry that practice into the field) - Got this from a Medic - straight up! (hmmm will post this thought on the Medic site see what they say.......)

War Hero

I think the WO in charge of berets should go and spend some quality time with 216/264 so he can explain in person why this is so important. If he gets back to Blandford alive the flat cap brigade will have to reshape their lids. It is a kind of sporting way of resolving this, what?

Does this mean that Field Marshall Montgomery's many statues will have to be altered to take into account this very important new rule?

Swinger

Evening all, it's my first post so be gentle.....
Am presently at Blandford fm 264, and the "shape of berets" argument has continued to be an issue that draws fire from all kinds of places, including Lt Col rank.....

1. Some people simply don't like the shape [flat cap], find it irritating, un-uniformal, and unprofessional.
2. Some folks think that the airborne and SF blokes large it outrageously.

My responses to these (fairly reasonable thoughts) are as follows:

1. I don't like the dead budgie thing the Fusiliers wear, but realise that they (rightly) wear it as a unit badge of honour that distinguishes them from their infantry brethren, from whom they would otherwise be no different. All infantry units have their individual traditions, and their esprit-de-corps is all the better for it. My opinion on their headgear is irrelevant - I don't work there, nor do I command them. If the fusiliers is a better place for having a flock of dead budgies, then great. All power to them. Time spent contemplating the shape of the airborne beret might be better spent getting other signals personnel to the same standards as the 264/216 lads who are usually around the top at phys, trade, and military knowledge.

Because rest of the Corps simply doesn't have the calibre of men to pass the two courses in anything like sufficient numbers, both units have a large percentage of similarly dressed signallers who are not qualified to be there. Thus the (maybe un-liked) beret shape is the only way to tell a 264 Special Forces Communicator from some bloke who's just been posted in to answer the phone at Hereford. No one's knocking the posted lads - I'm glad they're there, it means we can get on with our primary task. But I trained for a year and a bit, followed by a 6 month course and a 6 month probationary period, to work with a sabre sqd. Therefore I wear the relevant beret shape. Even if it looks daft. I've earned the right to.

2. We are fairly guilty of the larging it to a point. Some senior Corps individuals have probably identified that wearing the alley beret and smocks / Lowa boots acts as a kind of mobile middle-finger-up at the rest of the corps. There is without a doubt an element of truth about this. It should be remembered that this serves two vital purposes :
It UNDOUBTABLY aids 264 and 216 recruitment. Not everyone wants to parachute or tab, but EVERYBODY who serves in the army has at some point or other thought "I fu@::{g hate this place. I'd love to go someplace I can do something else where the place/people I work for/with don't get me down...." At which point a group of airborne lads, smiling and not letting life get to them, go past. The poor sod from 3 Div thinks, "Right, screw this, I'm gonna do that."

Everyone can relate to giving the middle finger to the corps, because we've all wanted to do it at some point really, really badly. I'm aware this isn't a popular fact, understandably, but as an aid to getting people motivated to prepare hard enough to pass the courses it serves a purpose, and as long as the guys don't over-do the larging it this should probably be left alone.

3. It aids 216 and 264 esprit-de-corps. Having worked hard to get people there, we also want to keep people there. Part of being a team involves (unfortunately) having people outside the group as well as inside. That's part of the definition of a team - there are people who don't get to join in because they aren't good enough. Sad, elitist maybe, but necessary to form strong bonds. Who's going to work hard to join a team any fool can get into ? The only sign of being on the team at those units is the alley beret. It is a visible "badge" of being part of a group that others can aspire to. I have yet to met anyone who said "I really want to wear a small plane on my arm/ charging rhino/number one". Certainly never met anyone who was so proud to be there that they tatooed the damn thing on their body! Wings, on the other hand....
Daft maybe. But it works.

Thus in conclusion I would say this. If the Corps Command element, clearly based at Blandford, left the Beret shape alone, it would quickly find the lads from Hereford towing the line on other issues such as sideburns and boots. If it allowed 264 / 216 blokes posted to Blandford as instructors to retain their beret's (as is done at all other trg establishments) they would find a higher quality of instructor applying to work there, which would have positive knock-on effects at Blandford.

Whilst Blandford continues to give the beret (which whilst as daft as a dead budgie clearly has a decent reason behind it) a hard time whilst simultaneously having fat unprofessional instructors and RP staff who clearly don't want to work there, then the fit, motivated, and knowledgeable lads from 216 and Hereford will continue to think the place hypocritical - and act accordingly. Which is a shame, since Blandford could actually be a great place to work.

Sorry it was long, as the bishop said to the actress. Thanks for reading.

Crow

It helps to put a after a posting that is so obviously of the "Bah Humbug " variety less someone actually believes that you are, in fact, posting via a wormhole that has transported you back to 1958.

Barbour jackets are not G1098, unlike berets.

What will the next Komic Kaper be? Ensuring that trousers are bloused the correct height above the ankle? That only issue drawers, mens are used? rationing loo roll? "

Bravo_Bravo, Sorry for taking so long to reply. Unfortunately (for me?) I was being serious. The point I was trying to make and obviously not succeeding was that in any walk of life and (in my opinion) especially the military, there needs to be standards. I don't believe, although I may be wrong, there would be many who would advocate blokes with long hair tied up in buns, males with ear-rings, anyone with nose studs and the like IN UNIFORM. If you agree with this, then you are acepting that there has to be a dress standard and all we are disagreeing on is who sets that standard. Some would say that long sideburns, strangely shaped berets and the like are acceptable. Others (those who happen to be in a position of authority at the moment) say not. Three choices really, as unpalateable as they may be:

1. Accept that dress standards are an order and what do we all do with orders in the Army? (all the time waiting for the new bloke - you maybe?? - to arrive in that command position who has different dress standards and imposes them - although he might want everyone in CS95 to wear stable belts or something else which others take a dislike to.....)

2. Decide you can't live with the fact someone is telling you how to wear your hair/clothes/beret/nose stud and leave.

3. Appeal to the European Court of Human Rights! (Is this when I should have used the smiley face?)

Old-Salt

They've worked hard to get that beret. It's a status symbol, who, when going through training (whether it be Blandford, or like some of us crusties - Harrogate) didn't look at these blokes 'larging it' (or is that just excreting confidence?) and think - 'I want a piece of that'.

I'm now older, fatter and nowhere near fit/aggresive/ambitious enough to go for it, so will never wear a beret of any colour other than blue. However my inferioty complex does not compell me to whine about the (un)important shape of peoples berets. I'm more concerned with the smaller aspects of life - like is Blandford turning out the right people with the correct training, or is everybody disappearing up their own arrse?

Oh yeah - certainly on my Sgts course I was helped out on several occasions by some bloke in a strangely shaped beret, when other people, who were big of mouth but small of deed jacked on each other left right and centre.