PirateBay's plans threatened as Sealand's sovereignty is called into question

Earlier this month, the people who run PirateBay.org announced
plans to purchase the man-made island
called Sealand. Michael Bates, Prince and heir to Sealand, said in a CBC interview that he has no intention of selling his
micronation to any cause that violates international treaties. Oddly enough,
Sealand was once home to nation founder Paddy Roy Bates’ pirate radio
broadcasting operation.

When the interviewer asked Prince Michael about his
awareness of PirateBay.org’s intentions, he spoke quite clearly on how he was
against file sharing. “It’s theft of proprietary rights, it doesn’t suit us at all,”
he said. “In fact, I’ve written a book and Hollywood is making a movie out of
it, so it would go right against the grain to go into the file sharing thing.”

The estate agent hired to handle the sale of Sealand has
also gone on record to say that PirateBay.org would not be a suitable buyer.
“We might not be able to sell to them, since one of the conditions imposed by
the actual occupants of Sealand is that none of the activities to be carried
out on Sealand should be an action against the UK, and potentially this group
does not comply with this condition,” Sealand said a statement issued to InmoNaranja. “The
final decision lies with the current representatives of Sealand at the time of
seeing the purchaser's proposal.”

Legal online publication Out-Law consulted a Dundee
University lecturer in constitutional and international law, who thinks that
Sealand isn’t its own sovereign nation after all. “It is within 12 miles of the
coast of Britain and in 1987 the UK extended its territorial waters to 12
miles. That means that UK law applies, including the law of copyright, which
could be extended to Sealand without any legal problems whatsoever,” said
Professor Robin Churchill.

The final nail in the coffin for independent operations such
as PirateBay is the asking price for rights to Sealand. According to Prince Michael, his micronation is valued at €750 million ($971 million),
putting it out of reach to all small time buyers. At the time of writing, a total
of $19,941 has been raised at PirateBay.org’s BuySealand.com.

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quote: According to what Prince Michael said, his micronation is valued at €750 million ($971 million), putting it out of reach to all small time buyers. At time of writing, a total of $19,941 has been raised at PirateBay.org’s BuySealand.com.

quote: According to what Prince Michael said, his micronation is valued at €750 million ($971 million), putting it out of reach to all small time buyers. At time of writing, a total of $19,941 has been raised at PirateBay.org’s BuySealand.com.

When I first read that, I misread it thinking it said that the asking price of sealand had gone up, lol upon further inspection of this paragraph, i laughed my ass off :D

Its value is set by the marketplace. If $20K is the biggest offer they've gotten, then perhaps that is its value. I can say the asking price for my house is twelve trillion US dollars, but that doesn't make that its valuation. Only upon sale is that value determined. So we'll see. :-)

You can't. International agreements prohibit recognition of "constructed" land as actual territories, either for the purpose of extending one's territory or building new territories. It has to happen naturally, which is almost always through volcanic means.

> "International agreements prohibit recognition of "constructed" land as actual territories, either for the purpose of extending one's territory or building new territories..."

Almost. Look at the huge complex of artificial islands Dubai is building. Legally, they're part of Dubai and under their jurisdiction. They are, however, not eligible for independent status and they cannot be used to extend the 200nm EEZ of the parent nation.

quote: Its value is set by the marketplace. If $20K is the biggest offer they've gotten, then perhaps that is its value. I can say the asking price for my house is twelve trillion US dollars, but that doesn't make that its valuation. Only upon sale is that value determined. So we'll see. :-)

While I think the price is outrageous, you are confusing Fair Market Value vs. Inherent Value. As anyone who has done any valuation studies or practice knows, there are several definitions of valuation.

If I overbid on someting, does that raise it's value? No it just raises the price I paid on it.

"Intrinsic Value" is the commonly used term in economic theory. Most items, according to any reasonable economist, have no intrinsic value whatsoever. " The value of an item is what it will bring", as the saying goes.

How was Sealand going to be suitable for the Pirate Bay anyway? Where were they going to get their high bandwidth data connections from? Run their own fibre to Sealand maybe at a cost of only a few million?

Also half the idea of running a pirate network is the secrecy of your whereabouts so the authorities can't find out where your base is. With it being in Sealand, -everyone- is going to know where they are. What's to stop the U.S. from firing a cruise missile at it, or sending a single jet to bomb it back to the stone ages? Even a small Navy Seals team would do the job fine. No-ones going to cry over the loss of a few pirates. Lawyers and the U.N. won't help you, you'll need some serious military hardware to defend your little pirate nation.

Ha ha, I can see it now, Bush urges the world to unite against the greatest threat to civilization since the Soviet Union, Sealand. Finally, a country small enough for the US to win a war without resorting to nukes or genocide. One retired Navy Seal with could conquer the whole place probably with just his hands.

It was an awfully dumb idea for PirateBay. Usenext.com charges for bandwidth on downloading pirated stuff from their server farms in the US and NL, and they've been in business for over a year without being shut down. Why bother creating a new country?

Only the fact that every single nation on earth would be opposed to such actions. Now, they can call for sanctions against a nation that is doing illegal activities but you can't just blow them into the stone age.

While the U.K did extend their territorial waters to 12 miles off the coast in 1987, under international treaties extending your off coast territorial waters does NOT give you the claim to land of other countries.

By 1987 a U.K court had already decided that Sealand was not bound by British law and the U.K government refused to deal with foreign diplomats over Sealand, directing them to negotiate treaties directly with Sealand.

quote: In fact, I’ve written a book and Hollywood is making a movie out of it

As numerous people have commented, the $1 billion MSRP is ludicrous and probably indicates that there's no real intention to sell. I would like to suggest that the "For Sale" sign was just hung out to get free media attention so that people will go out and buy his book and/or watch his movie.

havenco also had some pretty tight defenses, nitrogen flooded server rooms, you have to bring your own air or else the atmosphere will KILL you, AA guns, and heavily armed guards; definately would require a military operation (aka, an act of war) to get in and with the same defense that kept england safe from nazi germany (its called being a dinky island) means you need a vehicle (those AA guns would tear a helocopter or boat apart) or a few cruise missiles (a blatant and overt act of aggression)

england must defend sealand if it wishes to claim the mirconation legally (which means if sealand is attack, england MUST counter-attack), something they aint going do for the RIAA; so either it must enforce british law on sealand which it cannot do without sealand's permission (sealand was claimed before england expanded her borders to 12km, and I believe the UK has ex post facto prohibitions as well) or it must attack sealand (which will be seen as an outrage by many, since it's the UK bullying another nation) and an act of war would force the crown to recognize sealand as a seperate entity

Lost in all this discussion of territorial waters and sale prices is the real tragedy: if PirateBay.Org is unable to become a sovereign nation, then there will continue to be no country in the world in which Talk Like a Pirate Day (http://www.talklikeapirate.com/) is an official state holiday.

quote: “It’s theft of proprietary rights, it doesn’t suit us at all,” he said. “In fact, I’ve written a book and Hollywood is making a movie out of it, so it would go right against the grain to go into the file sharing thing.”

Ahhh yes... a bet ya they'll make those file sharers into terrorists and some hero cop will fight them for the good of the planet thus saving the good people of hollywood who are just trying to make ends meat.