I think a robin introduction is fine, given how it mirrors Bruce's origin.

This way we don't have to have Batman begins.

The only problem I have is that that's pretty much Batman Forever.

Though there's justification for going over the same stuff again, is rather that it was completely different, ala a Tim Drake or Damien Wayne intro, with an established Nightwing (and Dick's origin told through brief dialogue and/or flashback)

I say Tim drake, have it be long into batmans career, he's already gone through his falling out with dick Grayson, Jason Todd has already been murdered by the joker and bat girl is already paralyzed and operating as oracle, and an embittered batman whos getting increasingly violent with criminals has pretty much sworn off the concept of having a partner in the field, until Tim drake changes his mind. Basically having batman start out as the frank millar batman, and actually having a reason for being so, and being pushed more towards current comics batman by drake... Or Damian to add a more personal element to batman allowing himself a new protege. And treat it more like a master/apprentice samurai type relationship, with a little more warmth rather than the sidekick dynamic.

I think a robin introduction is fine, given how it mirrors Bruce's origin.

This way we don't have to have Batman begins.

The only problem I have is that that's pretty much Batman Forever.

Though there's justification for going over the same stuff again, is rather that it was completely different, ala a Tim Drake or Damien Wayne intro, with an established Nightwing (and Dick's origin told through brief dialogue and/or flashback)

I agree. I'd go with Drake and have Grayson already established as Nightwing.

For all the faults of Batman Forever, it actually was a pretty decent Dick Grayons/Robin origin story. I'd prefer the films explore new characters where they can to keep things fresh. It's such a vast universe in the comics that you have options and don't necessarily have to just keep repeating the same thing over and over.

I think regardless of what happens with the next iteration of Batman, it's only a matter of time before Nightwing shows up in a film. They'd be crazy not to.

I used to be pretty adamant that I only wanted to see a solo Batman in movies. But Blake in TDKR, Carrie Kelly in, erm, TDKR(eturns), and Robin in the Arkham City videogame made me think maybe it could work. Here's how I'd do it:

- Robin does a Carrie Kelly by repeatedly disobeying Bruce but proves himself capable (maybe saves Bruce after a severe beating or similar??)

- Keep Robin piloting the plane/batmobile and doing 'side objectives' - no Robin taking down thugs. Batman gives him his 'orders' for each mission and he carries them out - no Batman & Robin swinging around town together looking for criminals.

- Have Robin trying to gain Bruce's approval throughout the movie, by the end of it Bruce has grudgingly accepted that Robin is useful, but tries to keep him out of direct danger where possible.

- Robin wears a darker version of his BTAS costume, but with bigger domino mask and hood (ala Arkham City) - this makes his ID being secret slightly more believable.

- Have Robin go from obedient/slightly intimidated by Batman's authority to begin with, and gradually have him make the odd sly, sarcastic remark here and there (a mildly comedic foil to Bruce's seriousness, ala BTAS) as Bruce comes to accept him as a valuable ally.

I think if it's done like this it could work...personally I feel this would work best with a Batman in his mid-30s/40s as Robin would then be like his 'student' rather than his 'sidekick'.

I used to be pretty adamant that I only wanted to see a solo Batman in movies. But Blake in TDKR, Carrie Kelly in, erm, TDKR(eturns), and Robin in the Arkham City videogame made me think maybe it could work. Here's how I'd do it:

- Robin does a Carrie Kelly by repeatedly disobeying Bruce but proves himself capable (maybe saves Bruce after a severe beating or similar??)

- Keep Robin piloting the plane/batmobile and doing 'side objectives' - no Robin taking down thugs. Batman gives him his 'orders' for each mission and he carries them out - no Batman & Robin swinging around town together looking for criminals.

- Have Robin trying to gain Bruce's approval throughout the movie, by the end of it Bruce has grudgingly accepted that Robin is useful, but tries to keep him out of direct danger where possible.

- Robin wears a darker version of his BTAS costume, but with bigger domino mask and hood (ala Arkham City) - this makes his ID being secret slightly more believable.

- Have Robin go from obedient/slightly intimidated by Batman's authority to begin with, and gradually have him make the odd sly, sarcastic remark here and there (a mildly comedic foil to Bruce's seriousness, ala BTAS) as Bruce comes to accept him as a valuable ally.

I think if it's done like this it could work...personally I feel this would work best with a Batman in his mid-30s/40s as Robin would then be like his 'student' rather than his 'sidekick'.

This is what I've been saying for years, the only change is that I would have Bruce take him in at 12-14, and he be in training until he was 16, because I can't imagine any 16 year old off the street being that useful.

Yeah, Robin needs to be around 12 / 13ish. I was listening to a Batman podcast which suggested that where Bruce was hugely affected in a negative way by the Zorro movie, Dick Grayson should be affected in a positve way through the old swashbuckling Robin Hood movies (hence the Robin name and his cavalier and innocent approach to crimefighting).

This is what I've been saying for years, the only change is that I would have Bruce take him in at 12-14, and he be in training until he was 16, because I can't imagine any 16 year old off the street being that useful.

Fair comment. I guess it would make more sense if he's been trained from a younger age. I definitely wouldn't have Robin out 'in the field' until at least 16/17 though, and a balance would definitely need to be found with regard to Bruce kind of grooming a 12 year old kid to be a vigilante. They need to make it plausible without making Batman seem insane for putting the kid in danger. Maybe Bruce trains him physically and mentally with the aim of helping him focus on something other than his parent's deaths..but with no intention of him ever being a 'sidekick'. Robin then decides for himself that he wants to help Batman

Use Robin. If you were to use a 13 year old actor, the movie will live or die on that actor. It's a huge risk. Is it worth taking? Personally, I prefer an older Dick.

I would have it where Jason has just been murdered and Bruce is in a fractured state of mind. Regretting the decision to have a partner so young. In the meantime, Dick has come back to Gotham to help Bruce, who is caught in the plot of the film but could be a danger to himself and as Batman. Basically, the film would show why Batman needs Robin and at the same time, address to the audience why he is needed, and break the stigma Robin has these days. The job of the writer and director is to show people Robin is important.

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Originally Posted by socool

If this was directed at me, I don't come here just to bad mouth the movie, I come here to discuss any new and relevant news. The new and relevant news just so happened to be ****.

The most important thing that I feel needs to be addressed is the mask and its inability to properly conceal the wearer's identity. Of course, concessions are made within the comic book genre where we as the audience can ignore certain aspects which might not work in reality (fighting an opponent while suffering from Bat-neck, fighting multiple opponents while wearing a cape etc.), but with Robin's mask this is harder to let pass. Various comic book movies have alluded to this point (Green Lantern, TDKR). Even in the first Schumacher movie, the mask covered more of Robin's face, somewhat acknowledging that the first mask he wore didn't provide enough concealment.

Although the mask is one of the most familiar and constant features of Robin's look, I would be very open to the idea of doing away with completely in favour of something more believable. Perhaps a ninja-like mask that covers the mouth area, but leaves the eye area and possibly the top of the head uncovered, allowing room for the actor to emote. Something akin to Arkham City's League of Assassins.

Or, perhaps give him a full face mask of some kind, where the old mask motif can be affixed or hinted at. The mask could even be made from a mesh-like material, similar to the that of a fencer's mask, which would allow the actor to emote, but the appearance of the wearer would never reach the point where Robin's true identity can be deduced or his features clearly recognized. I wouldn't mind a full ninja mask with only the eyes visible.

As for other parts of his costume, I would like to see more ninja influences, less rubber and less use of mass-produced body armour - if Robin were to wear body armour, it would be custom-made. The suit would be specifically created for Robin, and not be a mere variation of a Bat-Suit. Colours should be subtle and desaturated, especially on the body, but a combination of black/green would be the main colours, with perhaps some small red highlights.

I actually think that Batman Forever and Batman and Robin did the Robin character a lot of justice. We get his proper origin (although his family wasn't killed by Two-Face but just some random mobster) and see him become Batman's sidekick. We then get his almost transformation into Nightwing in the next movie. I think that's the best we'll ever get of Robin. You can argue about the bad acting or whatever, but visually and thematically it's all there. So what's the point of doing it again?