100 Greatest Phillies: 54 – Pete Rose

By now the story is well known: Pete Rose was ripped from Cincinnati after 16 seasons, signing as a free agent with the Phillies to be the final piece in a championship puzzle. And he delivered. After a trying 1979 season that underwhelmed everyone, the Phillies rebounded in ’80, led by Rose, Mike Schmidt, Steve Carlton and Co. to take the pennant and World Series trophy. Rose’s contribution can’t go overlooked — he hit .331 in 1979, .282 in 1980 and .325 in the strike-shortened 1981. That season he broke the National League all time hit record. Aside from his Philadelphia accomplishments, Rose remains baseball’s all time hit king. He’s first in games and at bats, sixth in runs, seventh in total bases, a 17-time all star (four times with the Phils) and one-time MVP. Plus he had the most wicked head-first slide in the game’s history. Maybe the most incredible stat? In his five seasons as a Phillie, he struck out 151 times.

Comment: If Philadelphia can appreciate anyone, it’s Pete Rose. All-out hustle. Never-say-die attitude. Gambler. Drinker. Pariah. Crazy guy. Heck, if only he was a Phillie his entire career. As it stands, Rose had a heck of a Phillies career, and he can never be forgotten for his role in bringing the Phils their first championship.

Hall of Famer without question!!! When will he be forgiven? If Roger Clemens makes the hall before Rose does, it will expose a truth we all have known for years. Hypocrisy rules our beloved sport. Also, those uniforms…. WOW. Friggin Awesome.

Tim, it always ticks me off when people question your picks and their positions, so now I guess I’ll have to be ticked off at myself. I would def put him higher, not my favorite player, by far, I like the more laid back type myself, but he was such a sparkplug for that championship team, very clutch, ALWAYS hustled. But it really depends on who is on the remainder of the list though, maybe he does belong here.

BTW, just the fact that you put this list together is amazing, I wouldn’t know where to start. Can’t wait for the top ten, plus that means it’s almost time for baseball-yeaaaa!!!!

Hey Mike, get over yourself. I’m not the most astute Phils fan, but I can rattle off at least 25-30 former Phils that I believe meant more to THIS organization, not the game of baseball as a whole. Now if someone made a list of All Time Reds and had him listed at #54 then I would tell them to put the crack pipe down. As far as Rose being in HOF, he deserves to be, but didn’t he agree to the ban???

On the field, he kicked ass. Especially for Philadelphia. His hustle, his leadership. I will always see him in Phillies pinstripes diving head first into third. Or spiking the ball after the third out of an inning running to the dugout.

Off the field is a different story…

Pete Rose the player was AWESOME! Charlie Hustle. Today’s players DO NOT hustle like Rose. AT ALL.

Charlie Hustle should be much higher on this list. I know his best years were in Cincy, but without him the Phillies don’t even sniff the playoffs in 1980. And without him Lefty and Schmidt and Bull and Maddox etc… would just be more guys who were good players but couldn’t get it done.

My All Time favourite Phillie. i remember when i was in 2nd grade and the Phillies snatched him from the Reds, and i donned my Super Pete t-shirt. Nobody played as hard as Pete. it’s insane that he’s not in the HOF. The fact that a player could have 200 hits a year for 20 years and still not reach Pete is a testament to the player he was.

Pete Rose at 54. Now i’m convinced this guy is just posting this to get attention… Just posting names he’s heard of, in random order, which explains the Jay Johnstone #76. I for one, am morbidly curious to see the 53 players who are considered greater Phillies than Rose. There might be 25 at the most.

This is way off…hes in the top 20 at the very least. This is one of the very best players ever to play the game, and his seasons in Philadelphia were no different. That he was black-balled from the hall of fame is a disgrace…gambling aside. To put him at 54 is a disgrace. Sorry, Tim. I cant be on board with you this time. Even if he was top 30 I wouldnt be that irked. This is THE guy that get this team over the hump. They had Carlton and Schmidt and others, but they couldnt come through with clutch hits in the postseason until this guy showed up in town…

In defense of Tim, I think a lot of us see the name Pete Rose and think of his whole career. This is only as a phillie for this countdown though. If you look at his numbers as a phillie, they are not amazing because he didnt play here that long. Take away the name Pete Rose and only look at his numbers and you’ll see where Tim is coming from. For instance, someone like Bobby Abreu isnt anywhere close to Rose as a player but had better numbers as a phillie so will be higher on this list. That being said, I was at some of the 1980 playoff games and will always love Pete Rose. He made life right after coming close so many times.

IRONPIGPEN Says:
“Pete Rose the player was AWESOME! Charlie Hustle. Today’s players DO NOT hustle like Rose. AT ALL.”

Seriously? Chase Utley?

Pete was one of my favorites as a kid. i am curious to see who is ranked above him. Tim, you may be right, but prepare yourself for second guessing with pick 53. Some people are way off base here with their criticisms.

Joe O’Phillie, that is what I was just about to say, Chase Utley is a similar player to Pete PH**KING Rose, but also Shane Victorino, has the same intensity as Pete did for the Game, Pete was the motor for the 80 Phillies Shane was the motor for 08 Phillies.

AS far as his Phillies resume… Pete Rose is in the appropriate spot I think. He played 4 years for the Phils. He only had a 290 average. Sure, Pete was what got us over the top to win a championship, but it was not his offense that made the difference. It was his ATTITUDE. He brought a winning attitude to the team. I understand why people think he should be ranked higher, but looking at his number AS A PHILLIE, #54 sounds about right.

Pete was the player you loved to hate, until he was on your team. What about the Bob Boone, Pete Rose play at the dugout against the Royals? It is a crime that he is not in the Hall of Fame. When this list started, I stated that it’s tough to rank players without criteria. Pete is the all-time ML hits leader and he played for the Phillies. He should be in the top 10 greatest Phillies.

Per Bob Boone, the Boone-Rose play should never have happened. Rose was late getting there. It was his play. Boone kept looking for Rose…which let to the drop. Thankfully, Pete did get there in time to make one of the greatest plays in Phillies history.
Regardless, lets see who will be named #53 thru #1 before hurling insults.

As a few pointed out, there is a need for clarification on a criteria for determining “greatest Phillies” in franchise’ history. Statistics alone? Ignore the intangibles? And what of honors and awards for on field achievements? Perhaps I missed Tim’s stated criteria at the beginning of his selections. I think at least a few of us here would like to see his explanation for greatness once again. To see Pete Rose listed as 54th greatest is mind boggling especially when there were so many, many lean years of mediocrity with the team. FIFTYFOURTH?! And to Jason B… yes..ATTITUDE and INSPIRATIONAL LEADERSHIP are great attributes to go along with his clutch hitting and fielding. And as Tim pointed out, “… 17-time all star (four times with the Phils) and one-time MVP”. That’s FOUR times he was named an “ALL STAR” with the Phillies in honoring his achievements.

I too will be curious to see Tim’s selection of 53 players he considers having achieved more for the team than Pete Rose.

Remember Tim, it’s QUALITY not quantity that matters when considering statistics and number of years.

while pete wasn’t the star he was on the reds, he was the big missing piece of the puzzle that set the phillies in motion to win the world series. i’m glad tim is doing this countdown, i’ve found it to be very interesting, but i’ve disagreed with a lot of picks/placements and maybe none as strongly as this one. rose should be top 20 easily.

I always thought Rose was nothing more then a hired gun. Yeah he was a great player but the majority of those years happened somewhere else, he did play a key role in the Phillies winning in 80, but that doesn’t change the fact that he had most of his best years some where else.

Hmmm. I don’t post much here, but I have been waiting for this Pete rose controversy. Certainly he is a HOF caliber player for his career, but his gambling clearly threatened the integrity of the game far beyond other kinds of bad behavior. For me, his intensity is unquestioned but I always thought it was more often about Pete Rose than the team. His gambling as a player and manager, his off field attitude, his padding of his own stats as a player-manager all indicate this. Although a terrific hitter and hustler, he was an evn better self promoter. Lets not forget that he never hit for power, had very little speed, and was an average defensive player.

As for his time on the Phillies: he certainly made a contribution and belongs on this list, but he had just a good year in 1980 and I question the idea that they would not have won without him. I know Schmidt has promoted his role on that team for years, but I would point to Schmidt himself, Trillo, Carlton, McGraw before I would even begin to consider Rose as a key element. I agree with Bob B. re the World Series play and if we are talking about intensity on this team—what about Dallas Greene (someone I’d probably dislike personally about as much as Pete)?

if you want to see pete rose higher, you should make your own blog, write your own list and put him up there. tim could rank pete rose #101, it’s his list. although i don’t necessarily agree, there’s no need to attack anyone here. debating is cool but saying things like “this guy knows nothing about the phillies” (really?) come on.

Way too low – I would have had him in the top 10 at least. Phillies don’t win 1980 World Series without him. It was his leadership that took a bunch of guys who couldn’t reach the ultimate goal before he arrived and had them reach the pinacle of baseball.

I was at the closing ceremonies at the Vet, his absence was very dissapointing to me.

As for the HOF for Pete – unquestionably. Baseball is so hypocritical, no gambling, yet look at the outfield walls of many ballparks and you’ll see ads for casinos and state lotteries. Makes no sense to me.

Nationals #1: “if you want to see pete rose higher, you should make your own blog, write your own list and put him up there. tim could rank pete rose #101, it’s his list. although i don’t necessarily agree, there’s no need to attack anyone here. debating is cool but saying things like “this guy knows nothing about the phillies” (really?) come on.”

Amen. When someone with a complaint posts their well-thought out top 100, then I’ll listen.

The truth is that Pete was going to be ranked higher, but his maroon pajamas in that picture dropped him down to 54.

Pete Rose was an exciting ballplayer. He should be in the Hall of Fame for all that he accomplished and gave to the game, his hustle, determination and hard work. Pete, when he started out, did not have the great natural ability and skills to play baseball in the Major Leagues but he made himself into a great ballplayer thru determination and hard work. He was a leader. I see alot of Charlie Hustle in Chase Utley when I watch Chase play.

I find myself somewhere in the middle of the two sides of this debate. While I do think that Rose should be rated higher I do not think he is in the top ten based on the fact that he only played a small part of his career here. Just the fact that he participated in getting us a world championship alone puts him above most who will follow in this list.

I also tend to think a lot of Pete Rose when I see Chase Utley play which is strange. They seem to be opposites off the field but attack the game with the same intensity.

Well, let the “this player is better than Pete Rose!?” debates begin from this point on.

Phil is right. Rose was a great player and we are all clouded by the fact that Rose is the all time hit leader. While that is true he was only with the phillies for 4 years and in that time he was good but not great and didnt stay long enough to be a real legend of this franchise

MLBTR says the phillies are “still in negotiations” to re-sign Ryan Howard before arb…Translation: The Phillies are still in negotiations to trade Ryan Howard to the Yankees for a package headed by either Chien Ming Wang or Xavier Nady or possibly even Hideki Matsui if the Yankees pay some of this 13M salary…good bye Ryan Howard, its been nice watching you play in Philadelphia. Hope you enjoyed it while you had it becuase youre going to hate playing for the Yankees…

obviously matsui would require better prospects in return with him. but still..one of nady or wang plus good prospects isnt a bad haul for Howard. Nice job Amaro, hopefully he can finish off that deal…

John Kruk mentioned on ESPN radio on two different shows that he had heard rumblings of a package headed by Chien Ming Wang & that there has been some talk… other than that..nothing. it has not been on MLBTR at all because he doesnt count rumors unless its printed. If an analyst mentions it on the radio he ignores it unless its the overly worshipped red sox/yankees mouthpiece peter gammons. even rosenthal has to put it in writing first and hes usually right. as you recall, rosenthal predicted during august that ryan howard would be traded before the beginning of this coming season…

Side note: Joba would be a wicked setup man too, but the Yankees seem to insist on using him as a starter and Madson is our RH setup man for the foreseeable future…

thats the issue…thats the one reason why id doubt it happening before the arb hearing..they clearly are counting on michael taylor to be their cleanup man in 2/3 years. they seem really fed up with howard. they get a little irked in every interview about him now…be it montogmery or amaro they really get annoyed at the mere mention of his name. im pretty sure there is some VERY bad blood there. rosenthal is right like 90 percent of the time, so if he thinks theyll move him THIS offseason i still will go with that until it happens otherwise..

this is also the type of trade that will happen with little or no warning. it wont be like peavy where it drags on for months and months. itll just happen out of virtually nowhere…

Agree with Griffin 100%… Rosenthal is trying to create a self-fullfilling prophecy. He posts something that might make sense to get us talking and hopes that we can figure out how it could work. CM Wang is a fine pitcher and might fit well. Xavier Nady is a decent bat but certainly not Ryan Howard. Not enough… regardless, it’s not gonna happen. If we had not won a WS title, I might take this more seriously. Do you really think that Amaro wants to be known as the guy that came in and dismantled the championship team?

See I think its a thousand times more likely to happen now that they won a WS…they dont need him to “get over the hump” anymore, theyve already done that, with his help in september and for two games in the WS. So now the pressure is off of their shoulders in that regard.

Pete is being judge by something that is not easily defined. I think in terms on numerical impact, 54 is fine. However, the matter of his impact on the 1980 Phillies is immeasurable.
Schmitty et al, have spoken often on his (ROSE’s) leadership and mentoriship to the Phillies team…
I would have ranked him higher only b/c without him, this year would have been our first!

Pete brought so much from the intangible side, it is not possible to measure his impact on Bowa, Schmidt, Greg, Gary, Steve, et al…

If we trade Ryan Howard for Xavier Nady or Hideki Matsui.. i’ll boycott the Phillies this season… Since the only place this trade would actually happen is in Geoff’s mind.. I have nothing to worry about

In the 1980 NLCS, the Phillies were down 5-2 in the deciding game. Before Bowa went to the plate to lead off against none other than Nolan Ryan, Rose told him “Get on and we’ll win this thing”. Bowa singled, Rose eventually drew a walk later in the inning to score Bowa, and the comeback was on.

You’ll need to rename this the 100 Greatest Phillies Statistically speaking if you are going to bury Rose at 54 and use his .290 average as some sort of excuse.

Rose was the difference between playoff misery in the late 70s and a World Series win in 1980. How is that not worth a far higher ranking? They’d never won the WS before he came, and the next year, they did.

I am not trying to knock Tim, here, but there is something to be said for having been there. This list is unmitigated poop if Pete Rose is 54.

guys…ryan howard wont be tradeduntil they have used up all of his arb years…ud be crazy to let this guy go during his prime years…its one thing if you cant sign him and arb runs out and you want to at least get something for him but to trade him when u still own the rights to him is bordering terrorism…it took 100 years and 10k losses to find a guy that can hit 50hrs and drive in 150 runs for this team every year and a guy like this wont ever appear again…in this teams system anyways…sure, im rubbed the wrong way a bit by his high salary demands but you cant argue with the production…best slugger in baseball and remember we let this guy treat the minors like it was little league for a year and a half longer than we should have. had he been up at the start of the 04 season instead of mid 05 we may have already inked this moose to an 8yr 60m deal ala chase and rollins…i ahte to see him go but it looks like it will eventually happen but get every possible at bat and game as you possibnly can from this guy

If Philadelphia can appreciate anyone, it’s Pete Rose. All-out hustle. Never-say-die attitude. Gambler. Drinker. Pariah. Crazy guy. Heck, if only he was a Phillie his entire career. As it stands, Rose had a heck of a Phillies career, and he can never be forgotten for his role in bringing the Phils their first championship.

Why does everyone keep saying 4 years, when he was on this team for 5 years?

Why no mention of 1983? When it is the 93 team, winning a National League Championship is a pinnacle of a career, when it is the 1983 team it is an afterthought. Rose won two National League Championships for the Phillies, a team that has only won 4 in the last 58 years. Rose did more in 5 years than most guys can do in 10. I’d put him in the top 20 if I gave a crap about this stupid list.