It appears that Anagamis and some Jhana meditators also can attain Nirodha-samapatti. My understanding is that, only Arahant can experience this state.

This question is based on:==================================Nirodha-samāpatti: 'attainment of ceasing' S. XIV, 11, also called saññā-vedayita-nirodha, ceasing of feeling and perception', is the temporary suspension of all consciousness and mental activity, following immediately upon the semi-conscious state called 'sphere of neither-perception-nor-non-perception' see: jhāna. The absolutely necessary pre-conditions to its attainment are said to be perfect mastery of all the 8 absorptions jhāna as well as the previous attainment of Anāgāmi or Arahatship see: ariya-puggala According to Vis.M XXIII, the entering into this state takes place in the following way: by means of mental tranquillity samatha and insight vipassanā one has to pass through all the 8 absorptions one after the other up to the sphere of neither-perception-nor-non-perception and then one has to bring this state to an end. If, namely, according to the Vis.M, the disciple Anāgāmi or Arahat passes through the absorption merely by means of tranquillity, i.e. concentration, he will only attain the sphere of neither-perception-nor-non-perception, and then come to a standstill; if, on the other hand, he proceeds only with insight, he will reach the fruition phala of Anāgāmi or Arahatship. He, however, who by means of both abilities has risen from absorption to absorption and, having made the necessary preparations, brings the sphere of neither-perception-nor-non-perception to an end, such a one reaches the state of ceasing. Whilst the disciple is passing through the 8 absorptions, he each time emerges from the absorption attained, and regards with his insight all the mental phenomena constituting that special absorption, as impermanent, miserable and impersonal. Then he again enters the next higher absorption, and thus, after each absorption practising insight, he at last reaches the state of neither-perception-nor-non-perception, and thereafter the full ceasing. This state, according to the Com., may last for 7 days or even longer. Immediately at the rising from this state, however, there arises in the Anāgāmi the fruition of Anāgāmiship anāgāmi-phala in the Arahat the fruition of Arahatship arahatta-phala.With regard to the difference existing between the Bhikkhu abiding in this state of ceasing on the one hand, and a dead person on the other hand, M 43 says:;In him who is dead, and whose life has come to an end, the bodily in-and-outbreathing, verbal thought-conception and discursive thinking, and mental functions see: sankhāra 2 have become suspended and come to a standstill, life is exhausted, the vital heat extinguished, the abilities are destroyed. Also in the Bhikkhu who has reached 'ceasing of perception and feeling' saññā-vedayita-nirodha the bodily, verbal and mental functions have been suspended and come to a standstill, but life is not exhausted, the vital heat not extinguished, and the abilities are not destroyedFor details, see Vis.M XXIII; for texts see: path 206.http://what-buddha-said.net/library/Bud ... dic3_n.htm

I think you have misread the first paragraph. It is saying that you must be anagami or arahant and the jannasalone are not enough. I really don't see the point for a description of a process or attainment which is only available to people who don't need a description of the process in that it is guaranteed that anagrami will become arahants and that arahants will gain fruition as there is no other options for them.......so really what is the point?, unless the point is just being curious about this subject which is of course a good reason to pursue it.

Also, this is commentarial stuff so do be advised that it may be difficult (some people say impossible) to reconcile it with the Suttas.chownah

The point is that if it is accessible to non aryas, it could mean that there is yet another route to nibbana.

He turns his mind away from those phenomena, and having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.' (Jhana Sutta - Thanissaro Bhikkhu translation)

SarathW wrote:Thanks ChownahCan you give me the Sutta reference which says that both Anagami and Arahant can attain Nirodha Samapatti state.

That's the problem. I've seen it argued that it can be accessib le to non aryas, based on the suttas. But I'm not knowledgeable enough to say either way. I hope people who know well the suttas say something.

He turns his mind away from those phenomena, and having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.' (Jhana Sutta - Thanissaro Bhikkhu translation)

..Spk explains that Citta used to abide in cessation [Spk-pt: as a nonreturner] and thus he raised the question to ask about the formations that are the basis for cessation..The attainment of cessation, a meditative state in which mind and all mental functions stop. It is said to be accessible only to arahants and nonreturners who have mastered the eight attainments of samadhi. For a detailed treatment according to the commentarial method, see Vism 702–9 (Ppn 23:16–52). Spk says Citta had asked this question to find out if the monk was familiar with the attainment.

Nirodhasamàpatti—Lit., ‘attainment to cessation’.It is so called because during this period the streamof consciousness temporarily ceases to flow. Mind issuspended, but vitality persists.It is only an Anàgàmi or an Arahant who hasdeveloped the Råpa and Aråpa Jhànas who canattain to this supreme state of ecstasy.When such a person wishes to attain to Nirodhasamàpatti,he first attains to the first jhàna and,emerging from which, he meditates on the transiency,sorrowfulness, and soullessness of conditionedstates found in that particular jhàna. Likewise,

he attains, in order, to the remaining jhànas andmeditates in the same way until the Aråpa-Jhàna of‘Nothingness’.Emerging from this jhàna, he makes the followingfour resolutions:—(i) that his fourfold requisites be not destroyed,(ii) that he should arise in time when his servicesare needed by the Sangha, (iii) that he shouldarise in time when he is summoned by theBuddha, (iv) whether he would live for morethan seven days from that moment.He has to think of his age-limit as this ecstaticstate normally extends to seven days.After making these resolutions, he attains to thelast Aråpajhàna of ‘Neither Perception nor Non-Perception’ and remains in that state for two javanathought-moments. Immediately after he attains toNirodha-samàpatti when his stream of consciousnessis temporarily suspended. After seven days heemerges from this state and experiences for a singlemoment an Anàgàmi Phala consciousness in thecase of an Anàgàmi, or an Arahant Phala consciousnessin the case of an Arahant. Thereafter arises theBhavaïga citta.For details see Visuddhimagga.†‡†

I just wonder when Anagami emerge from Nirodha-Samapatti, he is already an Arahant. This idea is contrary to my previous post.According to it, Anagami will emerge as Anagami.How do you understand the following Sutta.============Furthermore, with the complete transcending of the dimension of neither perception nor non-perception, Sariputta entered & remained in the cessation of feeling & perception. Seeing with discernment, his fermentations were totally ended. He emerged mindfully from that attainment. On emerging mindfully from that attainment, he regarded the past qualities that had ceased & changed: 'So this is how these qualities, not having been, come into play. Having been, they vanish.' He remained unattracted & unrepelled with regard to those qualities, independent, detached, released, dissociated, with an awareness rid of barriers. He discerned that 'There is no further escape,' and pursuing it there really wasn't for him.