Orthodox church also allow the Christians to offer intercession prayers to the dead Orthodox members who are not recognised as saints, like their friends,parents and grandparents,etc.Is it better not to do ?

Because.we do not know whether they are really in heaven or not . We may have a risk of asking the help or intercession from an unsaved one which cannot really pray for us.Or We may have risk which simply chat with the air...

That wouldn't be too terrible, now would it be?

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"Who wants to be consistent? The dullard and the doctrinaire, the tedious people who carry out their principles to the bitter end of action, to the reductio ad absurdum of practice. Not I."-Oscar Wilde, The Decay of Lying

Orthodox church also allow the Christians to offer intercession prayers to the dead Orthodox members who are not recognised as saints, like their friends,parents and grandparents,etc.Is it better not to do ?

Because.we do not know whether they are really in heaven or not . We may have a risk of asking the help or intercession from an unsaved one which cannot really pray for us.Or We may have risk which simply chat with the air...

Walter, you sound as if you're afraid God won't hear your prayers if you don't have someone else interceding for you. If you make a mistake and ask the wrong person to pray for you, you think God won't hear you?

"Who wants to be consistent? The dullard and the doctrinaire, the tedious people who carry out their principles to the bitter end of action, to the reductio ad absurdum of practice. Not I."-Oscar Wilde, The Decay of Lying

Only an Ecumenical Council can represent the whole Church, and one hasn't been called for some 1200 years now. Besides, canonisations in the early Church were also done by the local synods.

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"Who wants to be consistent? The dullard and the doctrinaire, the tedious people who carry out their principles to the bitter end of action, to the reductio ad absurdum of practice. Not I."-Oscar Wilde, The Decay of Lying

i only prayed once to a saint before i became orthodox. it is not something you always have to do before you are orthodox.after you become orthodox, it all slowly makes sense.so don't rush it, i was an inquirer for 2 years before i asked the intercession of the saints for something personal.i was singing along with the prayers in the liturgy in this time, but without fully understanding this aspect.i didn't realise how protestant i was until i became orthodox, and then gradually left the prejudices (intercession of saints etc.) behind.

it is more important at this stage for you to pray to God, study the Bible and read about orthodoxy.if one area confuses you a lot, move onto the next area. it will all make sense later, as God leads you.

Can any former Protestant Christian share their experience which they get closer to God after they offer intercession prayers and pray with the saints?

Hope this can encourage me.

I wasn't something that I could control voluntary, but after praticing it, as humble as possibly, more and more, after some months I felt that it indeed helps to come closer to God in the way of struggling more succesfully against passions.. Especially when I read an akathist to a saint I feel that this saint is living and that he's a friend, who prays for me as well. But it was also important to me not to forget that Christ is the centre of our life and that when I feel grace during a prayer to a saint, that this grace is coming from Christ through the saint, and not directly from the saint. I've prayers which I say daily to my favourite saints, and I you just feel and know that they're praying for me. That gives me also encouragement.

I have just realized that St. Isaac of Syria was from Assyrian church of East.Why would Orthodox Church venerate a christian who is outside the church and come from heretic group?

Quote from: Wikipedia

Isaac is remembered for his spiritual homilies on the inner life, which have a human breadth and theological depth that transcends the Nestorian Christianity of the Church to which he belonged. They survive in Syriac manuscripts and in Greek and Arabic translations. From Greek they were translated into Russian.

Isaac consciously avoided writing on topics that were disputed or discussed in the contemporary theological debates. This gives Isaac a certain ecumenical potential, and is probably the reason that he has come to be venerated and appreciated among many different Christian traditions.

I have just realized that St. Isaac of Syria was from Assyrian church of East.Why would Orthodox Church venerate a christian who is outside the church and come from heretic group?

Quote from: Wikipedia

Isaac is remembered for his spiritual homilies on the inner life, which have a human breadth and theological depth that transcends the Nestorian Christianity of the Church to which he belonged. They survive in Syriac manuscripts and in Greek and Arabic translations. From Greek they were translated into Russian.

Isaac consciously avoided writing on topics that were disputed or discussed in the contemporary theological debates. This gives Isaac a certain ecumenical potential, and is probably the reason that he has come to be venerated and appreciated among many different Christian traditions.

Although st Isaac have many wondwrful written works, could understand and show great love and mercy of God, he was still a member of Assyrian Church of East in his life.Is it not good to recognise a Christian who is outside the true Church as the saint?

I have just realized that St. Isaac of Syria was from Assyrian church of East.Why would Orthodox Church venerate a christian who is outside the church and come from heretic group?

Quote from: Wikipedia

Isaac is remembered for his spiritual homilies on the inner life, which have a human breadth and theological depth that transcends the Nestorian Christianity of the Church to which he belonged. They survive in Syriac manuscripts and in Greek and Arabic translations. From Greek they were translated into Russian.

Isaac consciously avoided writing on topics that were disputed or discussed in the contemporary theological debates. This gives Isaac a certain ecumenical potential, and is probably the reason that he has come to be venerated and appreciated among many different Christian traditions.

Although st Isaac have many wondwrful written works, could understand and show great love and mercy of God, he was still a member of Assyrian Church of East in his life.Is it not good to recognise a Christian who is outside the true Church as the saint?

But he was Orthodox, not Nestorian. So there you go.

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Quote from: GabrieltheCelt

If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.

Quote from: orthonorm

I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.

It is quite natural for me to ask for the intercession of the uncanonized righteous in my personal prayers.

I would not expect that to occur duing Church services, however there are certainly exceptions there. I wouldn't be suprised if I were visiting a monastery and we asked the intercession of a righteous departed Geronda, but I would be suprised if my parish priest petitioned his YiaYia!

"Who wants to be consistent? The dullard and the doctrinaire, the tedious people who carry out their principles to the bitter end of action, to the reductio ad absurdum of practice. Not I."-Oscar Wilde, The Decay of Lying

It is quite natural for me to ask for the intercession of the uncanonized righteous in my personal prayers.

I would not expect that to occur duing Church services, however there are certainly exceptions there. I wouldn't be suprised if I were visiting a monastery and we asked the intercession of a righteous departed Geronda, but I would be suprised if my parish priest petitioned his YiaYia!

Agree with elephant. Sometimes how a Saint becomes recognised is the local population venerating them and reporting the answered prayers.

Thanks for clarifying. That's what I thought/assumed before (because that's also how it is with us Catholics) but I was wondering now after reading the conversation with walter1234 about knowing that the saint you're praying to really is a saint.

It is quite natural for me to ask for the intercession of the uncanonized righteous in my personal prayers.

I would not expect that to occur duing Church services, however there are certainly exceptions there. I wouldn't be suprised if I were visiting a monastery and we asked the intercession of a righteous departed Geronda, but I would be suprised if my parish priest petitioned his YiaYia!

Agree with elephant. Sometimes how a Saint becomes recognised is the local population venerating them and reporting the answered prayers.

Thanks for clarifying. That's what I thought/assumed before (because that's also how it is with us Catholics) but I was wondering now after reading the conversation with walter1234 about knowing that the saint you're praying to really is a saint.

The same thing happens in the Catholic Church. How does, for example, Pope John Paul II become beatified or canonized if there is no one praying for his intercession and then having that prayer granted? Of course liturgically he won't be commemorated until at least beatified, but after his death I've already have priests during Mass say "Pope John Paul the Great, Pray for Us." Right or wrong, that is part of the process and it is the same both in the Orthodox Church and the Roman Catholic Church.

It is quite natural for me to ask for the intercession of the uncanonized righteous in my personal prayers.

I would not expect that to occur duing Church services, however there are certainly exceptions there. I wouldn't be suprised if I were visiting a monastery and we asked the intercession of a righteous departed Geronda, but I would be suprised if my parish priest petitioned his YiaYia!

Agree with elephant. Sometimes how a Saint becomes recognised is the local population venerating them and reporting the answered prayers.

Thanks for clarifying. That's what I thought/assumed before (because that's also how it is with us Catholics) but I was wondering now after reading the conversation with walter1234 about knowing that the saint you're praying to really is a saint.

The same thing happens in the Catholic Church. How does, for example, Pope John Paul II become beatified or canonized if there is no one praying for his intercession and then having that prayer granted? Of course liturgically he won't be commemorated until at least beatified, but after his death I've already have priests during Mass say "Pope John Paul the Great, Pray for Us." Right or wrong, that is part of the process and it is the same both in the Orthodox Church and the Roman Catholic Church.

Thanks, although that wasn't so much what I was asking. I already know that's how it is in the Catholic Church; I was asking whether it is different in the Orthodox Church.

And remember not to pray to the Saints directly and ask them to give or provide us anything, just ask them to pray and intercede for me.Am I correct?l

Good question. I've never been completely sure about that one way or the other.

One can do both, though perhaps intercession is requested more often, don't know. This was one of my most difficult struggles coming to Orthodoxy from Protestantism, but after a long struggle someone finally put it in a way that I got. Just remember anything done by a Saint is done by the power of God.

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Psalm 37:23 The Lord guides a man safely in the way he should go.

Prov. 3: 5-6 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways acknowledge Him, and He will direct your paths.