So I'm upgrading my Dad's PC and have got him a i5-4670k and Asus Z97-A for £265 (with £30 cashback to come). I went a bit OTT with the PSU and got him a Corsair CX750M, when he'll probably only be pulling 400W max and that's if he gets a very powerful GPU which is probably unlikely but I figured it would at least future-proof him and leave him the option to run two GPUs if he ever wants to and it was quite cheap at £66.

Whilst the 200R looks a bit more classy and the SPEC-01 a bit more garish, I'm concerned about the limited air vents on the front of the 200R and think perhaps the open mesh front of the SPEC-01 would be more sensible for providing enough airflow to keep the overclocked 4670k and whatever GPU ends up going in there, nice and cool. It has the bonus of being a bit cheaper as well

Apart from the front panel, both cases seem pretty much identical, with generous amounts of space for long GPUs. I don't really like top fan vents as I just see them as places were food and drink can spill in and damage the components but my Dad keeps his intray on top of his PC, so they'll be pretty much blocked anyway.

Then you should not have pick the Corsair CX-750M, and you should pick a better fan for the Hyper 212...

I should have phrased that better. I mean I want to keep it reasonably quiet without spending a lot to get the quietest components. I only really got the CX-750M as it was on offer and if I hadn't ordered it with the rest of the stuff, I would have had to pay another £8.95 P&P to get it later but maybe I can still return/exchange it. I've got a few Nexus 120mm fans lying around I think (maybe a couple of 140mm as well), so I can try them with the Hyper 212, although I need to be careful to ensure the airflow and thus cooling stays sufficient for the OC'd 4670k.

The Corsair 230T is much the same as the 200R except with a mesh front and dust filters for the front and PSU. It's £58 though and I'm not sure it's worth £20 more than the SPEC-01 or £14 more than the 200R. Looking at these photos (which show the removable PSU dust filter at the bottom of the page), the SPEC-01 doesn't look so bad without the red fans, which I could obviously replace with something unlighted or at least more tasteful http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cases/ ... 1-review/1 so if it only had more than 150mm space for CPU coolers, I'd probably go with that.

NZXT Source 210/220. Good: USB/Audio ports at top of the case. Bad: HDD cage would block long GPUs. Restricted front panel airflow (Source 220 is better in that respect, having a mesh front), no dust filtering.

Cooler Master N200: Good: CPU cooler up to 160mm, HDD cage not blocking long GPUs, open mesh front, bulging sides to accomodate cables, dust filter on PSU. Bad: No dust filtering on front. Only one 5.25" bay, front panel ports not at top.

Zalman Z9: Good: Generous with USB ports on front panel. Front and PSU dust filters Bad: Front panel ports only USB 2, Mesh/Windows side panel (I always block off any side panel fan mounts to improve front to back airflow and this would be hard to block off without looking messy), detail on front panel blocking airflow, only 290mm for GPU (330mm on Z5), only 150mm for CPU cooler (with Z5, maybe slightly more with Z9)

The Cooler Master N200 would have been the best choice but the single 5.25" bay is a deal breaker and no front panel dust filtering and the front ports positioning isn't ideal either (the last point I could compromise on if I have to but it causes difficulties keeping cables tidy and out of the way and accessing the USB ports). This review identified that whilst the bulging sides allow it accomodate even a 171mm CPU cooler, there isn't much space at the top for the CPU HSF which might be a problem http://www.hitechlegion.com/reviews/cas ... l=&start=4

So, any suggestions for something with room for at least 160mm CPU HSF and long GPUs, at least two 5.25" bays, front and PSU dust filtering (preferably removable), open mesh front panel, front panel ports at top-front (and including at least one USB 3)?

I've heard decent things about the Bitfenix Merc Alpha, if you don't want to splurge on a case. The Fractal Core series, as well - but...not as cheap.

Thanks but that has the HDD cage blocking long GPUs, only has USB 2 ports on the front and doesn't seem to mention what size CPU HSF it will take.

I looked at the Fractal Core and the minimum that looks suitable is the Core 2500 as the 1x000 series have the HDD cage blocking long GPUs but I can't find anywhere selling it at present. It has the same restricted front panel airflow as the Corsair 200R anyway and this thread suggests they're not great quality either http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showth ... t=18601288

Anyway, the 260mm limit for GPUs counts against it, as does the lack of front filtering (although I'd probably be willing to compromise on that and accept having to open up the case regularly to clean out the dust, if a case met the rest of my requirements).

Quote:

Z9 is a series: the Z9 U3 should have USB3, and it should accomodate any CPU cooler as high as 170mm (I did it).

OK but it still has the annoying plastic detail on the front partly blocking the intake fan and only 290mm for the GPU (it seems like the side panel comes in a window only version, so I wouldn't have to worry about blocking any fan mounts with that).

With an SSD, I only ever need two HDD max, so it's a shame they don't just put rubber mounts on the bottom side by side (i.e. one over the extra fan mount in front of the PSU), which would clear the front intake even more to allow better airflow and ensure the HDD cage doesn't interfere with either GPU in a Crossfire/SLI setup. A two HDD cage seems about the max that would still allow the bottom GPU to be unhindered.

Even if the HDD cage is easily removable from the Z9 (i.e. without drilling out rivets), it would mean lying the HDDs on the bottom unsecured and I've done that enough to know that without proper mounts to hold them in place, they rotate and it's difficult to keep cables in place, etc, so I'm not interested in doing that and don't have time (or the tools) to make myself some clever mods. Plus it would still have that annoying front detail

The CM N200 seems to be the only case with a small HDD cage that wouldn't block dual GPUs but I realised it's a micro-ATX case and I need full ATX. I had a look at their mid-tower range, like the N400 and N500 but they've put larger HDD cages in those, which seems a bit daft as surely someone running a powerful dual-GPU system is much more likely to want a full ATX case than a micro-ATX one. I was reconsidering whether my Dad could manage with only a single 5.25" bay, which might be possible as we can get USB DVD drives now, so if he needed the bay for something else that could be an option but it being micro-ATX rules it out.

Bitfenix Neos: ATX, just slightly bigger than Silencio 352/N200, 160mm cooler, 300mm graphics, mesh front with dust filter and USB 3.0, around 30Gbp or less, can be ordered on Caseking.de with noise absorption (dampening) kit (a 25Gbp option I guess), in lots of colours and optional window too (if you wanna show off). Give it a look.

Thanks. It seems like a good case but I think only 300mm for the GPU could be an issue, with cards already at 305-317mm. I don't think a second GPU would have even 300mm space in that case, as looking at the motherboard I bought, which is probably pretty standard, Slot 1 is the PCI-E 2x1 slot, so the first GPU would go in slots 2-3 and the second in slots 5-6 and slot 6 would certainly conflict with the HDD cage, possibly 5 as well.

If they'd just have a two HDD cage and then put a two SSD cage next to it instead of above it (and maybe some other SSD mounts, like behind the right side panel as some other cases do, then there'd be no problem. Heck, I'd be happy leaving SSDs loose or sticking them own with a bit of blutak, as there's no moving parts to worry about!

As you mentioned it, what would you suggest as an alternative to the CX750M? Not that I've read anything bad about the CX750M, although the only review I could find was in Danish and not very detailed.

Looking at Aria's selection (I might have to swap it rather than get a refund but I'm not sure), apart from a couple of Bequiets and a XFX Pro, the only modular PSU about the same price as the CX750M is the EVGA SuperNova NEX 650W for £69 http://www.aria.co.uk/Products/Componen ... ctId=60492

I've never heard of them but saw someone recommended SuperNova somewhere else, so maybe they're good. I don't think I'd want to go any lower than 650W, as although the system's only likely to be pulling about 350W for now (GPU-200W, CPU OC'd-100W, Misc. 50W), if another GPU is added in future, it will need about 550W. I went for the CX750M as it was on sale and because it would cope with 2*250W GPU but those are probably the extreme top-end and it's unlikely my Dad's ever going to have two (or even one) of those.

No good for my Dad's build, as he only has space for a tower but the Cooler Master HAF XB EVO http://www.coolermaster.com/case/lan-bo ... af-xb-evo/ looks pretty amazing. I've actually been planning to build a case like that for myself for over a year (currently have my rig in plastic crates) but it wouldn't have turned out half as nice and would have cost me more, so I'm glad I found this now, before I got started

I've never heard of them but saw someone recommended SuperNova somewhere else, so maybe they're good. I don't think I'd want to go any lower than 650W, as although the system's only likely to be pulling about 350W for now (GPU-200W, CPU OC'd-100W, Misc. 50W), if another GPU is added in future, it will need about 550W. I went for the CX750M as it was on sale and because it would cope with 2*250W GPU but those are probably the extreme top-end and it's unlikely my Dad's ever going to have two (or even one) of those.

The NEX-series is NOT the recommended (by me) Supernova G2/P2 series: the first is based on FSP Aurum, the latter is based upon the Super Flower Leadex (updated platform of the Kingwin/Rosewill PSUs reviewed by SPCR). Noise wise the NEX is not that good and, being a not high-performance, group-regulated, multi-rail platform, it is NOT indicated for a running a pair of 200/250W cards (while the CX750M is a more modern and reliable DC-DC platform, so more indicated to such a task). I guess it could be considered roughly comparable to the old Seasonic S12-II series. The quieter unit at Aria's catalogue should be the BeQuiet L8, even if it's still a low-end HEC platform, so probably not the best one to run a pair of hot cards.

So I'm upgrading my Dad's PC and have got him a i5-4670k and Asus Z97-A for £265 (with £30 cashback to come). I went a bit OTT with the PSU and got him a Corsair CX750M, when he'll probably only be pulling 400W max and that's if he gets a very powerful GPU which is probably unlikely but I figured it would at least future-proof him and leave him the option to run two GPUs if he ever wants to and it was quite cheap at £66.

Are there any other similar cases around the same price range that might be better alternatives to the 200R?

What's your dad going to do with the machine that he would go from not-sure-he-gets-a-powerful GPU to two? Also, why did you overclock the CPU?

I built my machine about 8 years ago and I'm a bit annoyed that I went into overly-thrifty mode on the case (and jumped through hoops to get it quiet). Should have splurged those extra 50 quid for a Antec Solo and be happy for the years to come. A good case will stay with you for many years.

What's your dad going to do with the machine that he would go from not-sure-he-gets-a-powerful GPU to two? Also, why did you overclock the CPU?

I built my machine about 8 years ago and I'm a bit annoyed that I went into overly-thrifty mode on the case (and jumped through hoops to get it quiet). Should have splurged those extra 50 quid for a Antec Solo and be happy for the years to come. A good case will stay with you for many years.

How much are you currently saving? 20-30 pounds?

I'm mainly building it for him to be able to fly X-Plane 10, which needs as fast a CPU as possible, hence the overclocked 4670k. I'll probably end up buying him the first GPU and I don't think X-Plane can use SLI/Crossfire yet but it's planned and then it might be quite desirable to get another matching card (which will be a lot cheaper by then) to give it a boost. By then we might be on X-Plane 11 or 12 and it might have additional effects/requirements that make the second card even more useful.

Like you say, I'm trying to avoid building a system that will be a pain to upgrade, hence making sure the motherboard and PSU will support two cards and the case has room for them, as it's a lot more likely he'll add another GPU if he doesn't have to change the PSU or case.

Not sure what you mean by 'how much are you currently saving?' I haven't found or chosen a suitable case yet.

The NEX-series is NOT the recommended (by me) Supernova G2/P2 series: the first is based on FSP Aurum, the latter is based upon the Super Flower Leadex (updated platform of the Kingwin/Rosewill PSUs reviewed by SPCR). Noise wise the NEX is not that good and, being a not high-performance, group-regulated, multi-rail platform, it is NOT indicated for a running a pair of 200/250W cards (while the CX750M is a more modern and reliable DC-DC platform, so more indicated to such a task). I guess it could be considered roughly comparable to the old Seasonic S12-II series. The quieter unit at Aria's catalogue should be the BeQuiet L8, even if it's still a low-end HEC platform, so probably not the best one to run a pair of hot cards.

Thanks Luca. I guess I'll stick with the CX750M then. It seems a reasonable quality unit and my Dad's probably won't be bothered if it's a bit noisy anyway.

Thanks. It's a nice case and might be suitable with the upper drive cage removed (290mm clearance with the cage, 430mm without) but it looks like the lower cage would definitely block slot 7 and possibly slot 6, which is likely to be an issue with the 2nd GPU in slot 5 with a large cooler like my Arctic Cooling Accelero Xtreme, as that covers two slots and overhangs a third.

You can see this better from these pictures http://www.fractal-design.com/media/21b ... e5dd845034 The lower cage is removable as well, so if someone was happy lying the drives loose on the floor of the cage (on some foam to stop vibrations) or mounting them elsewhere (or externally) then this could be a suitable case.

I think I've found something suitable though. The NZXT Source 530 http://www.nzxt.com/product/detail/137- ... -case.html has space for 310mm GPU with the cage, 444mm without it and has the cage in three modules of 3, 1 and 2 drive bays, so I can remove the top two (the 3 and 1 bay), leaving just the two bay at the bottom sitting under the motherboard and not blocking any slots and it has a mount for the SSD behind the motherboard With 310mm space with the cage, I probably won't even need to remove it but it's nice to have the option in case cards get bigger. Front and PSU removable dust filters, mesh front, no holes that I need to block on the side (window) panel, ports at the top on the front panel.

A bit above my target of £50 at £70 but I don't think I'm going to find anything cheaper that's suitable, so I can live with that.

which is likely to be an issue with the 2nd GPU in slot 5 with a large cooler like my Arctic Cooling Accelero Xtreme

A pair of Accelero Extreme for a build where a Corsair CX is more than enough quiet? Wouldn't it be somehow unreasonable, dude?

Anyway, I know that Source 530, and IMO it is an overall good case: it has not so quiet 120mm fans, but I don't think they are much worse than the Corsair PSU one, so eventually have a good time with your parents build.

A pair of Accelero Extreme for a build where a Corsair CX is more than enough quiet? Wouldn't it be somehow unreasonable, dude?

Anyway, I know that Source 530, and IMO it is an overall good case: it has not so quiet 120mm fans, but I don't think they are much worse than the Corsair PSU one, so eventually have a good time with your parents build.

Thanks. Yeah, I guess I probably wouldn't fit Accelero Extremes to cards going in this build with the Corsair CX but nonetheless, even a less 'extreme' cooling solution, maybe even a pre-fitted one, might use up 2-3 slots, so best to allow for that possibility I think. I can always replace the case fans if they're noisier than the Corsair PSU.

It looks like it would probably have enough width (17.53cm) and depth (20.07mm), although the cables would probably not fit in without removing the X-docks but it just doesn't have enough height (11.94cm) and there's nothing that can be done about that.

So I guess I'll have to spend another £60+ on a new PSU and hope I can get a decent price selling my CP-850, which might be tricky considering it doesn't fit in most cases. It seemed like a good idea when I bought it, considering the benefits the non-standard design confers in terms of better cooling, reliability and lower noise and I was planning to build a custom case anyway. Now I've found the HAF XB EVO though, I'm not going to build a case just because the CP-850 doesn't fit!

I could use the Corsair CX750M I bought for my Dad's build and order something else for him but as the Corsair isn't particularly quiet and I'm much more bothered by noise than my Dad is, I really need to get something quieter for myself. Do you think that a 650W will be enough to allow for 2*250W GPUs (possibly, although I'll probably only have one GPU I want to allow for the possibility), an OC'd 4670k, 16GB DDR3, 2*3.5" HDD and 2*SSD, one ODD and 4 120mm fans? Or should I get a 700-750W to be safe? Any suggestions for suitable PSUs that are quiet and not too expensive?

EDIT: Oh and it does need to be modular, as it'll get rather cramped in this case otherwise.

I really need to get something quieter for myself. Do you think that a 650W will be enough to allow for 2*250W GPUs (possibly, although I'll probably only have one GPU I want to allow for the possibility), an OC'd 4670k, 16GB DDR3, 2*3.5" HDD and 2*SSD, one ODD and 4 120mm fans? Or should I get a 700-750W to be safe? Any suggestions for suitable PSUs that are quiet and not too expensive?

If you're going to have a "quiet" PSU at >600W power draw, IMO you should need to look at 1000W+ class PSUs.

I really need to get something quieter for myself. Do you think that a 650W will be enough to allow for 2*250W GPUs (possibly, although I'll probably only have one GPU I want to allow for the possibility), an OC'd 4670k, 16GB DDR3, 2*3.5" HDD and 2*SSD, one ODD and 4 120mm fans? Or should I get a 700-750W to be safe? Any suggestions for suitable PSUs that are quiet and not too expensive?

If you're going to have a "quiet" PSU at >600W power draw, IMO you should need to look at 1000W+ class PSUs.

Thanks. I'll check the length. I don't necessarily need a PSU that's quiet at 600W+ though. If I had two cards and was gaming and drawing that much, if it's a bit noisy it won't really matter as I'll either have my headphones on or the sound coming out the speakers will mostly drown it out. I guess potentially I could have two Radeon cards and be mining with both and not want it to be noisy but then the CPU wouldn't be doing much, so that would only be drawing about 500W, so if there's something that is reasonably quiet at that draw, that would be fine I think.

To be honest, I'm not wealthy and may not ever SLI/Crossfire and any single card I get is unlikely to be one of the very high power ones, as they tend to be ridiculously expensive, so I'll probably only be running a single card that draws 150-200W but I might want to add another of those sometime, so totalling maybe 400W for the GPUs, so even something quiet at that draw (assuming I'm mining with them) would likely be fine for me.

It doesn't change that much: either a 400W or a 500W power draw require an expensive PSU. My following advices are based just upon the Skinflint SERPS about what's actually available in UK (so if there is any alternative to that price comparator, point me that out), and they are just the the least expensive options I'm aware of.

doveman wrote:

so that would only be drawing about 500W, so if there's something that is reasonably quiet at that draw, that would be fine I think.

Money-wise, you may also consider either this one, or that one (there are chances that both could be even quieter than the two SPCR reviewed units: particularly the second one should be similar to that SPCR reviewed PSU).

Last but not least, you may also give a look to TechPowerUp! reviews, as they usually publish the PSU fan rotational speed, which may help you to assess the expected sound pressure level (obviously, they can't help you about the relevant noise signature, which is very important).

Thanks for finding all those for me but ouch! They're all more expensive than the EVGA SuperNOVA 750W you posted, even those that are lower wattage.

The closest in price is the Corsair RM750. If the RM series are good, maybe the 650W would be an option? It's not much cheaper than the RM750 or the EVGA though, so probably better to spend an extra few quid to have 750W rather than 650W http://skinflint.co.uk/corsair-rm-serie ... 00826.html Which would you say is the better choice out of the SuperNOVA 750W and the RM750?

The only review of the SuperNOVA on Amazon reckons it's 'about on par' with his previous Be Quiet L8 530 as far as noise is concerned but obviously it's a subjective opinion and he might just not be sensitive enough or have sharp enough hearing to tell the difference, or maybe the L8 is actually so quiet that no-one could notice the difference, if there even is one.

I don't actually know how much the i5 4670k will draw when overclocked. If it's only 100W, then assuming 2*250W GPUs + 50W for misc. stuff, then 650W might be a bit low. With 2*200W GPUs, it would leave 50-100W (depending on whether the 4670k needs 100W or 150W). Of course, it's only likely that the GPUs would draw the max when mining, when the CPU isn't doing much and in gaming, the GPUs and CPU won't draw the same as they do when stress-testing so the max. draw when gaming, mining or anything else 'normal' is likely to be even lower than 550-600W.

One nice thing about this CX750M I'm using as a temporary measure is that the SATA cable is very long with the headers spaced far about, so I might be able to just use one to power both HDDs and the X-Docks (which only use one power connector for both), keeping cable clutter down, so if any of the SuperNOVA or the L8's have the same, that would be useful to know when choosing between them.

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