Comments on: Tibetans, second-class citizens?http://www.pekingduck.org/2013/02/tibetans-second-class-citizens/
A peculiar hybrid of personal journal, dilettantish punditry, pseudo-philosophy and much more, from an Accidental Expat who has made his way from Hong Kong to Beijing to Taipei and finally back to Beijing for reasons that are still not entirely clear to him...Sun, 15 Mar 2015 12:14:28 +0000hourly1http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1By: Richardhttp://www.pekingduck.org/2013/02/tibetans-second-class-citizens/comment-page-5/#comment-198457
RichardMon, 25 Feb 2013 16:20:20 +0000http://www.pekingduck.org/?p=11356#comment-198457This thread has generated a huge spam attack and I'm closing it. If anyone wants to add a comment please email me. Thanks.This thread has generated a huge spam attack and I’m closing it. If anyone wants to add a comment please email me. Thanks.
]]>By: Otto Kernerhttp://www.pekingduck.org/2013/02/tibetans-second-class-citizens/comment-page-5/#comment-198005
Otto KernerFri, 22 Feb 2013 16:38:09 +0000http://www.pekingduck.org/?p=11356#comment-198005@ t_co #204,
"<i>Would you rather we pacify the region through brute force instead?</i>"
Bring it on, son. We will resist you by any means necessary, even if it requires us to develop morals, ethics, a more just and decent system of international legal norms, or visions and dreams for a better world in the future. Non serviemus.@ t_co #204,

“Would you rather we pacify the region through brute force instead?”

Bring it on, son. We will resist you by any means necessary, even if it requires us to develop morals, ethics, a more just and decent system of international legal norms, or visions and dreams for a better world in the future. Non serviemus.

]]>By: Otto Kernerhttp://www.pekingduck.org/2013/02/tibetans-second-class-citizens/comment-page-5/#comment-198001
Otto KernerFri, 22 Feb 2013 16:11:58 +0000http://www.pekingduck.org/?p=11356#comment-198001@t_co #201 and #202
You really think that will work? I expect it would have no effect, or maybe be counterproductive. I suppose Beijing has been planning on parachuting in a reliable Tibetan leadership since 1951. How's that going so far?
@FOARP #200,
You're right. It's hypothetically possible to have a long-term equilibrium in which Tibet is an autonomous part of a liberalized China. The more anger and resentment build up from the current policies, the harder it will be to effect this.
I'm not sure what you mean about co-opting the élite. Most of them are in exile. Tsering Shakya noted in 2008 that the government was having a hard time finding influential lamas to lean on to support their policies, having lost so many to exile, prison, and gradual attrition to old age (for instance, Bomi Rinpoche, the widely-respected Acting Gandän Thripa, who presided at the selection of the Chinese Panchen Lama, got sick not much later and died after a couple years. There doesn't seem to be a new Acting Gandän Thripa). Almost no reincarnated lamas were identified in China prior to the Karmapa in 1992, so the younger generation of Rinpoches (e.g. Pawo, Trungpa, Ghungthang, Reting) is still young and their ability to influence the public untested. As far as secular leaders, it's notable that, in the last few years, two of the most prominent Tibetan businessmen, who were seemingly non-political, have gotten lengthy prison terms for putative subversion.@t_co #201 and #202

You really think that will work? I expect it would have no effect, or maybe be counterproductive. I suppose Beijing has been planning on parachuting in a reliable Tibetan leadership since 1951. How’s that going so far?

@FOARP #200,

You’re right. It’s hypothetically possible to have a long-term equilibrium in which Tibet is an autonomous part of a liberalized China. The more anger and resentment build up from the current policies, the harder it will be to effect this.
I’m not sure what you mean about co-opting the élite. Most of them are in exile. Tsering Shakya noted in 2008 that the government was having a hard time finding influential lamas to lean on to support their policies, having lost so many to exile, prison, and gradual attrition to old age (for instance, Bomi Rinpoche, the widely-respected Acting Gandän Thripa, who presided at the selection of the Chinese Panchen Lama, got sick not much later and died after a couple years. There doesn’t seem to be a new Acting Gandän Thripa). Almost no reincarnated lamas were identified in China prior to the Karmapa in 1992, so the younger generation of Rinpoches (e.g. Pawo, Trungpa, Ghungthang, Reting) is still young and their ability to influence the public untested. As far as secular leaders, it’s notable that, in the last few years, two of the most prominent Tibetan businessmen, who were seemingly non-political, have gotten lengthy prison terms for putative subversion.

]]>By: Calvinhttp://www.pekingduck.org/2013/02/tibetans-second-class-citizens/comment-page-5/#comment-197942
CalvinFri, 22 Feb 2013 05:13:39 +0000http://www.pekingduck.org/?p=11356#comment-197942Wow, much ado about nothing going on here. Tibet will remain part of China for the foreseeable future.
The geopolitics of the modern era demands this whether China democratizes or not. The Himalayas is a natural boundary between the two regional powers of India and China. Offensive force projection is basically nullified by this natural fortification. No sane Chinese leadership will just give it up. Too bad, so sad...
To the guy above ranting about a liberal revolution with Han marching side by side with Tibetans, LOL. This is reality not a Les Miserables musical, buddy.Wow, much ado about nothing going on here. Tibet will remain part of China for the foreseeable future.

The geopolitics of the modern era demands this whether China democratizes or not. The Himalayas is a natural boundary between the two regional powers of India and China. Offensive force projection is basically nullified by this natural fortification. No sane Chinese leadership will just give it up. Too bad, so sad…

To the guy above ranting about a liberal revolution with Han marching side by side with Tibetans, LOL. This is reality not a Les Miserables musical, buddy.

]]>By: Xilinhttp://www.pekingduck.org/2013/02/tibetans-second-class-citizens/comment-page-5/#comment-197902
XilinThu, 21 Feb 2013 23:16:08 +0000http://www.pekingduck.org/?p=11356#comment-197902@t_co
'Does that matter?'
Yes. I doubt that you could play much of an active role in either the cultural carpet bombing of Tibet or the pacification of Asia while sitting at your laptop in Starbucks, Chicago. So perhaps you shouldn't use 'we'.@t_co

‘Does that matter?’

Yes. I doubt that you could play much of an active role in either the cultural carpet bombing of Tibet or the pacification of Asia while sitting at your laptop in Starbucks, Chicago. So perhaps you shouldn’t use ‘we’.

]]>By: t_cohttp://www.pekingduck.org/2013/02/tibetans-second-class-citizens/comment-page-5/#comment-197840
t_coThu, 21 Feb 2013 12:11:28 +0000http://www.pekingduck.org/?p=11356#comment-197840<blockquote>You’re proposing the sinification of Tibet through casinos? Do you write for the China daily show or something?</blockquote>
Would you rather we pacify the region through brute force instead?

You’re proposing the sinification of Tibet through casinos? Do you write for the China daily show or something?

Would you rather we pacify the region through brute force instead?

]]>By: Xilinhttp://www.pekingduck.org/2013/02/tibetans-second-class-citizens/comment-page-5/#comment-197833
XilinThu, 21 Feb 2013 11:25:27 +0000http://www.pekingduck.org/?p=11356#comment-197833@t_co
You're proposing the sinification of Tibet through casinos? Do you write for the China daily show or something?@t_co

You’re proposing the sinification of Tibet through casinos? Do you write for the China daily show or something?

]]>By: t_cohttp://www.pekingduck.org/2013/02/tibetans-second-class-citizens/comment-page-5/#comment-197802
t_coThu, 21 Feb 2013 06:42:40 +0000http://www.pekingduck.org/?p=11356#comment-197802And yes--a liberal China would be able to control, Sinify, and secularize the youth of Tibet through these mechanisms (gambling, education, economic opportunity, a strict emphasis on the separation of church and state) just as effectively as an authoritarian government--perhaps even more effectively, as they use less Torquemada and more Cass Sunstein, less axe, and more scalpel.
It is toward that liberal goal--a free, prosperous, and confident China--that reformers work towards every day. They are the heroes of China, and, ergo, they deserve the support of every true Sinophile.And yes–a liberal China would be able to control, Sinify, and secularize the youth of Tibet through these mechanisms (gambling, education, economic opportunity, a strict emphasis on the separation of church and state) just as effectively as an authoritarian government–perhaps even more effectively, as they use less Torquemada and more Cass Sunstein, less axe, and more scalpel.

It is toward that liberal goal–a free, prosperous, and confident China–that reformers work towards every day. They are the heroes of China, and, ergo, they deserve the support of every true Sinophile.