Though this is completely unrelated t' Smash 4, Lucario bein' a new 'mon did actually play a humongous role in him gettin' into Brawl. He starred in one'a them yearly Pokemovies which was released a vclose enough). Lucario was, in a way, the face of Generation 4 Pokemon games 'cause of this movie. That, and the fact he was one'a the first Generation 4 Pokemon revealed. Regardless of his popularity, the fact he was a new 'mon was very important for him gettin' that roster slot.

Well if being new was such an important merit (I do believe being new has something to do with his inclusion) why didn't Sakurai just go with Darkrai, or one of the other 4th Gen Pokemon that had a movie? I think Lucario's unooficial status as te 4th Gen mascot and band of incredibly autistic followers really are what helped him. And, if he is to return, I would thank tem.

... We'll soon see if Sakurai will change his mind in regards t' whether or not he wants to remove characters. ;_;

Sakurai's been quoted saying "I love all my characters! :laughs:". So I think if he can avoid cutting, he will.

I disagree. Sakurai has implicitly stated he strived t' erase clones from Brawl. I can only imagine he'll try even harder to keep clones outta Smash 4. Doc won't return before a new character will both because of his history as a clone and the fact he's literally still Mario, even if he has a completely different moveset.

I've actually never heard that statement, but I suppose being cut from Brawl is a double edged sword. But, remember if Sakurai had it his way we would have four more clones in Brawl. Toon Zelda, Toon Shiek, Roy, and Doctor Mario.

Who would Jr. be a clone of, Bowser... ? Definitely not. Jr. obviously wouldn't be a heavy hitter, nor is he large and can breath fire. Ya definitely couldn't just paste Bowser's moveset onto his son and call that adequate. Sakurai definitely wouldn't do that.

You can, it would just be stupid. I'm not expecting that though, heck, I'm not expecting Junior to begin with. I think ultimately, him and Doc are the most likely choices, but I don't know how likely a Mario character is. I agree with you that on merits alone, Junior could get in Smash, but I also think Toad has enough merits as well.

Don't believe Sakurai ever stated there can only be one villain per series. Don't think he ever would neither considerin' the hero-villain ratio we currently have

Plus that's just such a random little rule to make for Sakurai to make for himself.
Anyways, here's my vote:
Mario
Luigi
Peach
Bowser

And the King of Second Bananas is overshadowed by Mario. And DK overshadows Diddy. If the character ain't bein' overshadowed by someone not yet a part of the roster, I don't think bein' overshadowed is a problem on it's own. Perhaps if another character from the series who would moreso appreciate the slot, but otherwise I would say that only slightly hampers their chances.

Luigi got his own game and it happens to be the "year of Rurigi" and Diddy Kong is not overshadowed by DK. I don't think he ever was. That's like saying Ratchet overshadows Clank. I don't think Bowser J has been Bowser's partner in crime. More like he does what he wants and Bowser just sleeps on the couch like a normal father.

Originally Posted by Splash_King

Don't believe Sakurai ever stated there can only be one villain per series. Don't think he ever would neither considerin' the hero-villain ratio we currently have.

I only observe patterns.

Originally Posted by HeyLolita

Sakurai's been quoted saying "I love all my characters! :laughs:". So I think if he can avoid cutting, he will.

Interpretation, Kirby, Meta Knight, DeDeDe, and Pit are not going to get cut EVER.

Originally Posted by HeyLolita

I've actually never heard that statement, but I suppose being cut from Brawl is a double edged sword. But, remember if Sakurai had it his way we would have four more clones in Brawl. Toon Zelda, Toon Shiek, Roy, and Doctor Mario.

There is a reason why they were cut.

Now about Rosalia
3 points

1. She is THE representative of Super Mario Galaxy, a masterpiece series that will no doubt get huge rep in this Smash game.

2. She is female. Jigglypuff got in over Meowth for a reason and has stayed in the games for a long time.

3. She is a new character that has a backstory. Her character is the most fleshed out of any new Mario character or that of any main series Mario game. If any new Mario character got in it would be her.

Against Bowser Jr.
3 points

1. He did not get into Brawl, and he was not even considered (judging by the missing 8). He is not old enough to be acknowledged as a staple and not young enough to be fresh.

2. His role is not that big in the Mario franchise. He is an annoyance which does not constitute true villain material. He is not even Bowser's partner.

Waluigi
is not getting in:
Reason one: His existence was solely for Doulbes in Tennis and Double Dash as Wario's Partner. He has no purpose other than that.
Reason two: Too many Mario characters already. If we are going to get another one I hope it's not wasted on Waluigi.
Reason three: No Rep. He has no games. Wario has his own games but Waluigi does not.

Waluigi is dangerously close IMO. Him, Junior and Toad are the three "real" choices I could see Sakurai using IMO. Besides Doctor Mario.

Anyways since none of us can agree on what the Mario roster will look like, feel free to vote for the characters you think the mario franchise will have. This is a prediction roster, not an ideal roster, so it's what you think will happen, not what you want. Can't stress this enough. Include veterans in your vote as well. I would like a vote from all of you if possible. (Neo, Mr, Wii, and Splash)

And Neo, I was going to guess girl or gay. :P

1. She is THE representative of Super Mario Galaxy, a masterpiece series that will no doubt get huge rep in this Smash game.

That's fine, I'll give you this. Junior and Toad have so many more appearences than her, it's not even funny. Both even showed up in "her" games. I think you place too much on this series. It's just two installments of the Mario series.

2. She is female. Jigglypuff got in over Meowth for a reason and has stayed in the games for a long time.

Being female has such little weight when Sakurai is creating a roster. Every female in Smash is extremely deserving right now, and if Sakurai was going to add a female just because of her genitals, then, why not someone like Dixie, Palutena, or Krystal?

3. She is a new character that has a backstory. Her character is the most fleshed out of any new Mario character or that of any main series Mario game. If any new Mario character got in it would be her.

Can't comment much on this, but I don't think it's really relevent considering Game and Watch has literally no back story. It doesn't matter much in terms of inclusion.

To refute one, I gotta point out that not being in the "Missing 8" doesn't mean he wasn't considered. And for two, how is Rosalina more important than Bowser Jr.? Jr.'s appeared in far more games then she has. 3 doesn't mean much either, I could say that "the Mario roster doesn't need another blonde woman in a dress".

And how is Jr. not Bowser's partner? I'm pretty sure he counts as Bowser's partner in multiple games.

People only want him in because he completes an already complete circle.
Waluigi's existence is solely for sports games so Wario can have a partner.

Originally Posted by Neosquid

To refute one, I gotta point out that not being in the "Missing 8" doesn't mean he wasn't considered. And for two, how is Rosalina more important than Bowser Jr.? Jr.'s appeared in far more games then she has. 3 doesn't mean much either, I could say that "the Mario roster doesn't need another blonde woman in a dress"

Right, it just means that at least 8 other character were higher on the list then him.
Why is Rosalina better than BJ... SMG>SMS
She represents a whole series and is a new character.
BJ is not old enough and young enough to give him any leverage.

Originally Posted by Neosquid

And how is Jr. not Bowser's partner? I'm pretty sure he counts as Bowser's partner in multiple games.

I don't think Bowser J has been Bowser's partner in crime. More like he does what he wants and Bowser just sleeps on the couch like a normal father.