Is Harvey Updyke’s sentence too harsh? The answer is in your Sunday Cup of Coffee: 3/24/13

What a difference a week makes. This time last week we couldn’t rest worrying about what would happen to the murderer of Auburn’s beloved Toomer’s Corner trees. Now, 7 days later, we know his fate. The two year long saga with Harvey Updyke is finally over over. Updyke was sentenced to six-months jail time, and 5-years of supervised probation which includes a 7:00pm curfew and prohibited entry into any collegiate athletic event.

But is this too harsh? The politically correct answer if you wear crimson is to say “No. Harvey Updyke committed an atrocity that will never fully be vindicated.” But I say bull crap.

The man who did what every Alabama fan wanted to do.

The man is guilty of poisoning trees. He didn’t kill anybody. He didn’t injure a person or even an animal. Harvey Updyke simply took the collegiate frenzy that so many have profited from in this state too far. Paul Finebaum didn’t become Paul Finebaum without this kind of fanatacism. Daniel Moore didn’t become a household name without it. Stores selling apparel for both schools didn’t lock themselves into ledgers that live in the black without it. Media outlets don’t have ratings that shoot through the roof without it.

So, the flipside of that success is a nutcase who took that same fanatacism, but took it to the other extreme. As they say, you can’t have it both ways. Feed the beast, and eventually you’re going to get a Harvey Updyke.

Updyke took from the Auburn Fambly one of their most prized traditions: Throwing butt paper in trees following an Auburn win, or a meaningful Alabama loss. And I for one am glad he did it.

Hurl the insults at me if you will, but you are lying if you’re an Alabama fan and you say you’re saddened by what he did. You may say so in public, or in earshot of your Auburn friends, but privately you’re elated. If you love Alabama you hate Auburn. It’s that simple. They are a classless bunch of never-have-beens who live for our demise. Historically the Auburn fanbase has demonstrated that there isn’t a classles antic so low that they won’t subscribe to it if it means taking a shot at the foundation and rich tradition of the University of Alabama.

The only thing funnier than Updyke killing their trees is hearing Auburn fans lamenting about it. Hearing how it brings them to tears that they won’t be able to share with their children this meaningful tradition. The tradition, mind you, of throwing toilet paper up in some trees.

Harvey Updyke did those future generations a favor. He forced dignity upon these future members of society. Maybe now they’ll focus on things that really matter. Like learning how to exist outside the competitive hatred for the big brother they’ll never catch.

Or, maybe, finally realizing that we’ve all taken this rivalry too far. He who is without sin in this area, cast the first stone. But chances are, if you’re an Auburn fan on an Alabama blog, you need to drop your rocks right about now.

Now, for a few more snippets of note to cover this week…

The Bill Battle hire seems to be a slam dunk. The expediency of the hire following Mal Moore’s resignation spoke to this being an arranged marriage. This didn’t just happen. Everyone in the know in Tuscaloosa apparently knew it was coming.

Bill Battle

Battle didn’t take the job because he needs the money. He will reportedly earn $620,000 a year as Bama’s head athletic czar. But the billionaire didn’t need the cash. The author of collegiate sports licensing likely has $620K in the ash trays of each car in his fleet of personal vehicles.

Bill Battle was hired to succeed Mal Moore, keep the fund raising going, and provide a smooth transition from one of Alabama’s most beloved figures stepping aside due to health reasons. He wasn’t hired to recreate the Crimson wheel. Unless someone on board pulls a Mike Price with a woman of “Destiny,” it isn’t likely the ax will swing in any department any time soon.

One thing is for sure; Alabama could have done much worse. It appears Battle will be exactly what the doctor ordered.

I’m one person who is doing an about face about the Tide Basketball program. Sure I’m disappointed that Alabama, again, failed to make the field of 68 in the NCAA Tournament. But the NIT has shone a light in an area that needed illumination.

The crowds at the past two NIT games haven’t been the largest this season, but they have by far been the best. It isn’t a secret that Alabama blue bloods snatch up season tickets to Tide sporting events to earn Tide Pride points. These points help boost their standing on the football ticket priority list.

Bama defeated the Stanford Cardinal 66-54 to advance to the 3rd round of the NIT Tournament.

But the result is, Coleman Colesium sounding like a morgue most of the time. I don’t know what the answer is, but I do know tickets to the NIT games have been purchased by people who want to be there, and the immediate result is a more boistrous, involved crowd. That crowd played a large hand in Bama’s victory over Stanford Saturday morning/afternoon.

As Aaron Suttles and Cecil Hurt of the Tuscaloosa News tweeted following the game:

Change moves slow in Tuscaloosa, but for the good of our basketball program, here’s hoping it moves faster than normal. Expect more of the same this Tuesday night when Maryland comes to town. The winner of that game heads to New York for the NIT Final Four.

The Alabama baseball team picked up their second conference series win in a row with a 6-3 win over the Georgia Bulldogs on Saturday. Bama goes for the sweep today as their season continues to take a turn for the better.

107 Comments

i’ve said for years the coleman seating situation is a albatross on the program’s neck. that NIT game was evidence of it.

i’ve also said the athletic dept.’s attitude about basketball is evidenced by their decisions.

this is an athletic dept. that has, in actuality, sent out a letter to the ticket holders in the past basically telling them to sit down and shut up.

getting students involved in those games needs to be a priority.

getting folks who love alabama basketball there needs to be a priority.

giving football season ticket holders dibs to the prime seating needs to stop.

coleman IS NOT A BASKETBALL ARENA. we could blast that dump and build a new one without batting an eye. (and i’ve advocated that, in actuality argued with bob bockrath about it on the finebaum show, for years) but it wouldn’t change a thing if seating is not addressed.

for some illiterate, ignorant reason, there are many around this athletic dept. who believe winning in basketball equates to losing in football. i’ve said for many years a championship attitude about basketball would only help football.

look, i’m not sure anthony grant is the guy that was sold to us. as a matter of fact i KNOW he’s not. but i don’t know that anyone can with the present situation handed to them.

bill battle was chosen for the AD position by the same person who influences all the other major calls around the athletic dept., paul bryant jr. all this hoowauh about mal “hand picking” him is exactly that.

and i know pbj doesn’t give a rat’s ass about basketball.

it will be interesting to see in the coming weeks, months and years to see if battle has any interest in changing the culture around ‘bama basketball.

as to your take on updyke, truly unfortunate.

i’m one of the unwashed, pick up truck fans the bluebloods around the program look down on. i recall, ironically, being in the concession line at a basketball game a few years back, an auburn game where the football team was being honored. while standing there one of the britt boys from cullman was on screen and, frankly, looked like he hadn’t bathed before the ceremony.

i made mention of this casually to a gentleman in the line next to me who was obviously an alum.

he responded to me as if i were common trash.

i responded back by saying were i standing before 15,000 representing my university, there would be no question i was spit-shined.

these are the people around alabama athletics who (a.) hold basketball back and (b.) i despise with every fiber of my being.

the harvey updyke’s of the world validate that asshole’s thoughts about me and folks like me.

take the common fans out of the equation on a football saturday in tuscaloosa. (and considering the recent decision making around there, it seems like that’s exactly what they’re trying to do) let’s see what a stadium of alumni-only looks like.

harvey updyke didn’t just kill two trees. he killed part of their tradition.

an equivalent action in tuscaloosa would be for a couple of aubies to break into the Bryant museum and trash the place, destroying some of the precious artifacts in there.

i can guarantee your attitude would be different and you wouldn’t be an alabama fan if it weren’t.

There is absolutely no comparison between breaking into the Bryant Museum and thrashing the valuables inside and killing a plant. A plant can be replaced. It’s an overreaction to an event that deserves no more than some community service and a public apology. You far overplay the “tradition” part and you far underplay the reality that somebody just poisoned a tree.

No comparison? this is why everyone in the sports world thinks Alabama fans are dumb, classless idiots. One of your own intentionally attacks another teams tradition out of spite and hatred and you guys flock to him like he’s cured AIDS. The few Alabama fans with any sense cant save your image due to the complete idiocy of band-wagon fans like you. There are Alabama fans, and then there are people like you, who wish they were Alabama fans but really just want to live off of someone elses accomplishments because your own amount to nothing.

The sinister side of it is scary, no doubt. But you’re kidding yourself if you think the Auburn Fambly would put on the show we have of showing remorse for what Updyke did ( in your scenario). They would roll the trees in celebration.

I’m not saying it’s okay what he did. I’m just not going to put on sack cloth and mourn as so many have felt compelled to do.

Great column ITK!! I agree I’m not saddened about those trees either, and I think the penalty given Updyke was a little bit overboard but the circus was held in Lee County , so I didn’t expect nothing different. As I’ve said before, maybe now those folks that have been sending their toilet paper up into those trees will find a more ‘practical’ use for it now and , if they must do something to celebrate a rare win over somebody, maybe they could should put a statue of ‘Pay’ Dye up and they could use that…. RTR

When your greatest tradition is throwing toilet paper in tree’s, you lost the war a long time ago. I admit, I once found entertainment and humor in it. When I was 16. When you become a man, you put away childish things. That’s a lesson most Barner Fife’s failed to learn.

It’s too bad Southeners can’t just have collegiate sports without having to prop up these fake colleges. Just look at the reasoning displayed in this piece…is this the height of Alabamian erudition? Can’t you all just agree that you love sports but hate learning? A bunch of tree killing rubes arguing over whose tradition of toothless idiocy is superior, this really typifies the southern focus on academics, doesn’t it?

And good for LSU. It is a great school. Who cares if Bama is 1st or 2nd in that category? Being in the top 7 nationally in graduation rates is nothing to be ashamed of.

What is unfortunate is having an idiot defensive coordinator in Jon Chavis play prevent the last 2 minutes of a tight game, opening the door for Bama to waltz down the field, then blitzing at exactly the most obvious time to set up the screen perfectly.

Interesting comment coming from an Alabama fan, considering the fact that if, as you say, the “idiot defensive coordinator in Jon Chavis ” doesn’t “play prevent the last 2 minutes of a tight game, opening the door for Bama to waltz down the field, then blitzing at exactly the most obvious time to set up the screen perfectly” then Bama probably isn’t the SEC West champion, nor the SEC champion nor the National champion.

But hey if you want to discredit your own team and coach by saying the only reason you won that game was because of the defensive play calling of LSU, who am I to stop you.

But here is a question for you, what idiot defensive coordinator/coach put in or called a defensive game plan that allowed a freshman quaterback from Texas A&M to move up and down the field all game long against Alabama in Tuscaloosa by passing for over 250 yards and averaging over 8 yards per completion yards and rushing for 92 yards and over 8 yards per carry himself? Especially considering just a couple of weeks earlier that idiot Chavis’ defense held that same player to less than 5 yrds per completion and less than 2 yards per carry!

What Updyke did was ugly and vulgar. He deserved far more time but i would have made him clean toilets in Jordan Hare for the next 5 years. Seriously, you don’t care that he killed oaks that were around when the Civil War was fought and destroyed a schools beloved icon and tradition. If not, you’re no better than Updyke, and no I’m not an Auburn fan. Was a Bama fan before you were a twinkle and his sickened me. What next? Burn down the stadium?

Pity for a barner losing a tradition is like pity for a member of the Taliban. Turn your back on them and they’ll gladly destroy you. So cry your eyes out if you want. But those same folks you cry for would’ve rolled those same trees had the April 27 tornado destroyed the Bryant Museum, Bryant Denny, or anything else of import to us.

Yeah, like how terrible the response was from Auburn and Auburn fans when those tornados destroyed Tuscaloosa….oh, wait, Auburn fans showed more class than you can ever dream.

Face it, real Alabama fans know what type of person Updyke is and are disgusted by what he did. Only someone with no morals, no class and no dignity could write the drivel you posted on here and continue to stand by it.

One day the bandwagon will hit a rock and your dumb ass will bounce right off.

What the Auburn team did was nothing more than a photo opp, and it wasn’t in Tuscaloosa.

I know what kind of person Updyke is, and I wouldn’t want him as my neighbor. But I’m not going to sit here and manufacture remorse for a fan base that delighted in holding up fingers when we were at our lowest. I hope those stupid trees keep you up at night, when you’re not thinking about how bad this year’s beat down is going to be.

It wasn’t just the team that helped out Tuscaloosa when the tornadoes hit. A large portion of the Auburn fan base reached out and sent needed items through Toomer’s for Tuscaloosa. And they still would if it happened again, despite fans like you trying to bring the entire fanbase down by idiotic columns like this and by comparing fellow Americans to terrorists. You really have gone off the deep end if you think sports equates to murder and religious oppression. And this column just gives credence to what the Barners have been saying that Updyke was not just one crazy, but had the backing of a large portion of the fanbase.

“You really have gone off the deep end if you think sports equates to murder and religious oppression.”

Yeah, because that’s exactly what I said. If you didn’t respond to April 27 in some way, either in Tuscaloosa or the dozen other locations affected around the state, you don’t have a soul. Please don’t look for an engraved trophy on behalf of your beloved fanbase for doing what any human in their right mind should do.

What auburn fans did after the tornados was demonstrate the spirit of Christ. They ignored petty rivalries and gave generously of their time and money for their fellow human beings who were hurting — just like Christ described in the parable of the Good Samaritan. We would all do well to remember Christ’s example, and if it needs to be explained to you that rivalries can go too far, you are just too stupid to matter anyway.

ITK first of all its not fuzzy math that is the problem, it is your reading and/or comprehension skills that are obviously the problem.

My statement doesn’t say your a teabagger, it says your morals and mentality are the same as the teabagger’s, which are the same as Updyke’s.

As additonal proof as to your lack of reading skills or your hate filled obsession with Auburn fans, you have assumed I am an Auburn fan. I can promise you I am not. And no where in any of my previous post have I ever indicated in the slightest that I am an Auburn fan.

Look LSU fan, you hate Alabama, fear Nick Saban, and covet the success he’s created for the Crimson Tide with everything in your being. Therefore, all you need is a cause, and Updyke, today, is your cause.

You want to loosely tie together what you call “facts” to assign to me and any other Alabama fan the easy, lazy association with a nutjob because you’re mad that we’ve partied like it’s 1999 after the last two huge victories over your beloved Bengal Tigers. And don’t bother trying to argue that fact…please give me credit for being smart enough to pin this on you.

Oh yea that right ITK your last victory was a “huge” one against LSU. Is that the same victory you earlier posted that the only reason bama won was because of LSU’s “idiot defensive coordinator, and therefore nothing to do with the coach you “claim” I “fear”?

And yes you are “smart” enough to figure out I am an LSU tiger fan after you first assume I am an Auburn tiger fan and then I correct you to tell you I am not an Auburn tiger fan.

Yeah I’d say you fear it continuing. And with over half your team gone from last year, I’d say it will.

So yes, fear is a safe assumption when it comes to the Alabama game with you. Because you know I’m gonna gloat. Why this bothers you, and why you keep coming here to put yourself through this torture, not sure. But yeah, you’re scared alright, and for good reason.

ITK I have not used a single “hate-filled” superlative in any of my post to you here.

I know it is a waste of time, but since you asked, even if not so nicely, I will try and explain it to you.

Unbridled fanaticism is what caused an ex-officer of the law to ignore what he otherwise should have known was wrong and caused him to destroy public proberty by poisoning the trees at Toomers corner. And unbridled bfnaticism is what caused a 32 year old husband and father to think it was ok to pull out his genitals in a public place so that he could rub them on the head of a passed out 18 year old fan of an opposing fan base.

And unbridled fanaticism is what is causing you to think, believe and write that Udyke “did what every Alabama fan wanted to do” as you state under his picture in your “article”. And it is unbridled fanaticism causing you to make the statement “Harvey Updyke “simply” took the collegiate frenzy… too far” or to call what Updyke did funny, as you did in your “article”.

I say you are more blind than a man that can’t see because, you have refused to see and accept the comments of every Alabama fan who has come on here and rebuked what Updyke has done. And if you believe in your mind, as you state in your “article”, that “If you love Alabama you hate Auburn. It’s that simple” and that Auburn fans “are a classless bunch of never-have-beens who live for our demise”. Then you are as blinded by fanaticism to reality every bit as much as Updyke and the teabagger were.

You say in one of your post “I’m not saying it’s okay what he did” but you also never say it was wrong what he did! In fact what you say is you “for one am glad he did it”. Making you equally mentally and morally corrupt as he is. But you will never see that you are on the same path that Updyke was two years ago before his actions made him the poster boy for the Alabama fan base around the nation.

Whatever is causing this desperate hunger to connect dots between a singular, deranged tree poisoner and an entire fanbase, let me help you in understanding, there are anti-depressants that can help you. For instance, there’s:

Ask your doctor which is right for you. But getting back to the matter at hand, you’re eventually going to have to get over the pain caused by Nick Saban and Alabama dominating your Bengal Tigers (go on now, tell me you’re not an LSU fan now Mr. Baton Rouge).

But just know, I am your friend. I want to get you the help you need, and deserve. Your delusion has to stop with assigning tree poisoning and teabagging to people you don’t like. Help me help you.

I have never claimed not to be an LSU fan, so why would I tell you I’m not? It was your ignorance that made you assume I was an Auburn fan. So you have a friend who can help you look up an IP address because you make bad assumptions and need to correct it.

What you need to really need to work on is your reading comprehension skills. In none of my post did I ever tried to ” connect dots between a singular, deranged tree poisoner and an entire fanbase”, only to you! And that was easy based on your comments. See unlike you, obviously, I’ve read the comments of other Alabama fans both here on this site and others that don’t agree with you ITK. And the comments of those bama fans are on sites like this one where their identities are unknow so there is no reason for them to have to give a “politically correct” comment, which you claim is the only reason a bama fan would say anything against what Updyke did.

You my friend are inflicted with the same diesease that consumed Updyke and the Alabama Teabagger. Your symptoms just aren’t as bad as theirs, yet. But then neither were theirs two years ago.

Hey dimwit, where’s the outrage for Bobby Lowder fleecing all you stupid barniacs, stealing millions from the barniverse? How ’bout Tubs’ “business associate” who embezzled millions from you freaking morons? You’re a moron – that’s what I know in my “heart of hearts”.

My grandfather played for Auburn in 1926 and 1927. In 1969 I was 14 years old and my grandfather took me to Auburn to reminisce and show me the sights. We stood under those trees drinking a lemonade and he explained how he would meet friends at those trees on the corner. Those trees meant something to him and he’s been dead since 1981.

I was a Bammer when growing up, but attended Auburn when I got out of the military. Those trees have certainly meant something to me.

So ..continue your redneck, arrogant attitude about it. Seems that some Bama fans on here do realize this was important. It’s really no surprise that most of you don’t realize such ..it would be totally out of your redneck character if you did.

No trees are not more important than grace, but grace and second chances don’t just come because of Easter and the event it represents. They only come after confession and repentance. But according to you ITK as documented by you here, Updyke did nothing to “vilify” or rebuke him for. So in your mind what does Easter have to do with this, since you brought that into the discussion?

LMAO, you know as well as I if they had given Harvey Updyke 10 years in prison without parole you and your brethren would have celebrated that sentence whole-heartedly.

The man is clearly deranged. “But he’s one of them Bammers.” My Bible says to take pity on people who can’t care for themselves. What he did was a crime, but what he did in effect was mess with your god: Auburn football. There is more worship that takes place in Jordan-Hare Stadium on a Saturday afternoon than in 100 churches around the state the next day.

And no, Bryant-Denny is no different.

But when someone like Updyke comes along and upsets the apple cart, messing with the traditions that you’re likely more devoted to than your church, it simply reveals where men’s hearts are.

He killed some trees. That’s it. Trees. Where Easter comes into play, there was One who died on a tree over 2,000 years ago so that when people make mistakes, they can be forgiven and restored in the eyes of God. But Pharisees like yourself failed to see this, and were the ones putting the nails in His hands.

Regardless of the colors you wear in this state, sometimes it’s time to back away and take into account the importance we all place on this silly game called college football. And with that in mind, a real response to him would be grace and forgiveness rather in than scorn. But then again, he killed your trees. So crucify him! Right?

The only thing I struggle with is understanding why this is all so important to you? Are scores like 21-0 and 21-17 so painful that you need discourse like this in a search for significance? And does your mom know you’re on her computer?

ITK its not important to me but wasn’t it your article that asked the question?

If you only want responses from like minded gumps like yourself who will agree with every comment you make, then next time you post an “article” here with a headline that ask a question, follow that question up with a comment that says “If you don’t agree with my less than intelligent comments here please don’t respond”.

But I’m sure now you will try to claim it was just a rhetorical question, like you gumps do when you are caught in a lie or bending the truth, you later like to claim you were just using hyperbole.

Analogy as a Bama Fan: Suppose someone blew up the statue of Bear Bryant, in the dead of night, leaving a nice crater in the ground, and fans are irate. Not the Bear Bryant statue!

No one is hurt in the process — no deaths, injuries and only the only damage is to clean up the mess and put in a new statue.

But it’s illegal. You can’t terrorize a public landmrk for the same reason you can’t poison a public landmark with illegal chemicals. What type of sentence would we want the guy to serve? Probably the same as Harvey. Villified by the public, have a trial, and a small amount of jail time for sheer stupidity.

Let’s stop getting worked up about it (and no, we don’t all “feel the same way in our heart as Harvey does”), be happy the circus is over now, and move on.

Harvey Jr…I didn’t pass 3rd grade either, much less attend a university, I assume? Wow. figures, idiot. You can’t be this much of a tool bag, can you? Go fuck yourself you ignorant band wagon turd. I hope you don’t reproduce, redneck, we got enough mindless assholes in this world. Roll16 you too. How old are you, 12? Look at what your proud of. I can assure you it’s not your success in life and/or your IQ. What a shame. Start blogging when your balls drop, someone aught to slap your mama for raising this. You shameful pieces of shit.

Wow, what a hateful string of words from a lady. And you want to slap my mother?

If you’re done with your adolescent rant and potty mouthed anger, let me just say, you’ve proven my point about fanatacism and how destructive it can be. And if you get to walk around freely, Harvey Updyke should be able to as well.

And if Harvey had only ranted and cursed the trees in anger, like Nydia just did to you, Harvey would be able to walk around freely like Nydia does, but you ITK are obviously not smart enough to know the difference between what Nydia did here and what Harvey did, as evidenced by your comment to her.

You are a piece of shit loser. Don’t ever try to speak for all Bama fans, as I can assure you you are WAY off base. Updyke is a stain on Alabama fandom, and now you are right alongside him. Can’t believe I gave your POS blog a click.

And again you prove my earlier comments ITK. If someone doesn’t agree with you, rather than open your eyes and your mind, you automatically assume they can’t possibly be a Bama Alum or must be a fan for another team with a hate filled ulterior motive for disagreeing with you.

I guess opening your mind and listening to others point of view is hard for you to do, right Captain Kangaroo?

Could you provide some newspaper article or picture that proves otherwise? If so, I would be glad to acquiesce. Surely something so heinous as a public celebration of a rival coach’s death, would have ONE picture or article confirming it.

Updyke is one weired SOB. Who knows what he was thinking. I almost fell in the street laughing when I saw him dressed in his Hari Krishn type outfit on Bourbon St at the 2011 Natty game. Got a foto of him. But really how can you associate him to the Bama fan base. He is from Louisiana and was a Texas State Trooper. Geez, can you imagine this asshole stopping you for a speeding ticket or responding to a domestic violence call or an armed robbery, etc. The trees were going to die anyway from decades of shock at the hands of ultra high pressure washdowns to get the shit paper off of them. Now that’s really disgusting. Anyway, all that being said, I really love my Bulldog who weighes exactly 80 pounds and is named Spike. Bwaa Haww Haww! RTR!

Absolutely I’m upset with what Updyke did. Not really because it matters to Auburn, though.

Toilet-papering those trees was the most laughable “tradition” in the SEC, maybe in the nation. It helped put a stamp on how silly and little-brother the Auburn culture is, in particular for the reasons why they would toilet paper the trees in the first place. Can you imagine a “tradition” where Alabama’s culture would celebrate an Auburn loss?

It’s called raising a beer, if anything else, but that’s about as far as it goes.

But now they don’t have the tradition, and we don’t have the tradition to laugh at. Harvey Updyke should have filmed the tradition, not killed it. I know it’s not like we need another example of the goofiness of little brother’s culture, but that was one you just couldn’t make up.

Alabama is a great school, with a great winning tradition. They have several years where I think they probably should claim a champonship, and they don’t. That makes the fact that your university retroactively claims a championship, given by a system that was invented a decade AFTER the season was over, for a team that was ranked #20 in the AP poll, and 3rd in the SEC, completely mind boggling. It’s so beyond absurd, that it borders on fantasy. My point is, those who live in glass houses, shouldn’t throw stones. The gentleman above stated that it was hilarious that a small contingent of the Auburn fanbase thinks that their 1983, 1993, and 2004 teams should be called champions, while simultaneously claiming a championship that nobody outside the greater Tuscaloosa area gives any credence. I think that’s darn funny. Please feel free to disregard all of these facts, and just call me a jealous barner or something. Your grasp of the English language is simply breathtaking.

Brent, you raise good points, and I understand the difficulty anyone has with 1941. However, if you will indulge me:

“The NCAA recognizes consensus national champions as the teams that have captured a championship by way of one of the major polls since the 1950 college football season. Prior to 1950, national championships were chosen by a variety of selectors, and in the 1980s, Alabama claimed the 1941 championship as one of its 11 (at the time) claimed/recognized national championships. As such, Alabama claims a share of the 1941 national championship, with Minnesota, due to each school being selected national champion by various major selectors. Specifically, Alabama was selected national champion in 1941 by the Houlgate System. The Houlgate System was a mathematical ranking system devised by Dale Houlgate that was syndicated in newspapers between 1927 and 1958 to determine the national champion. His mathmatical system was, if you will, the BCS before there was a BCS, figuring in determining factors to crown a champion.”

I agree with you, 1941 is one of the weakest claims Alabama has. However, just because systems in place today are superior to past systems of determining a champion doesn’t mean we should adopt a revisionist attitude toward things we don’t like. For instance, no one disputes basketball results prior to the 3-point shot, though many games would’ve had different outcomes had it existed. The rules simply were what they were at the time.

We’ll never have a perfect system because we don’t play a round robin tournament to determine a champion. But it can’t be disputed that Alabama’s place as one of the elite and premiere college football schools in all the land is secure and intact.

I actually didn’t even bring up anything about Alabama’s NC’s. Not sure whom it was referred in this statement…

“while simultaneously claiming a championship that nobody outside the greater Tuscaloosa area gives any credence”

However, I can rest well counting only AP,UPI/Coaches, and the Rose Bowl years. No sweat off of me. I just wish Auburn fans would tell us how many NC’s we’ve won, instead of 1941! 1941! Then maybe they can actually sleep at night.