If you can't file a bug report simply because you use Gentoo, that makes GAIM harder to use; if you can't submit bug reports simply because you've used BMG ebuilds in the past, that makes Gentoo harder to use.

You can file a bug report no problem. The problem is when the bug reports contain something totally useless to the gaim devs like

Average Schmuck wrote:

Uh yea I was using gaim version 0.75-r3 and my emerge bailed out saying something about an error

Gaim devs got so many usless reports like that or bug reports that were specific to gentoo only that they asked the devs if they would point users towards the gentoo bugzilla before the gaim bug tracking system. If the bug is a real gaim bug and not related to gentoo in anyway..it will get reported upstream. If anything that would better the gaim development process, allowing them to work on things other then removing bogus bug reports

You can file a bug report no problem. The problem is when the bug reports contain something totally useless to the gaim devs like

Average Schmuck wrote:

Uh yea I was using gaim version 0.75-r3 and my emerge bailed out saying something about an error

I know -- I have posted a bug report without telling them I'm on Gentoo

I don't like being lumped in with the "Average Schmucks"; nevertheless, I can understand a gainful, rational management policy provided its enforced with a modicum of civility.

This is my objection to Foser's behavior. His work seems top notch, but his rude behavior is totally unacceptable. Also, his BMG policy borders on irrational._________________Personal overlay | Simple backup scheme

This is my objection to Foser's behavior. His work seems top notch, but his rude behavior is totally unacceptable. Also, his BMG policy borders on irrational.

Being lead of the gnome project gives him more work then most can handle. Foser has a policy of not being responsible for anything that he hasn't done(or that isn't in the official portage tree) It just so happens that bmg ebuilds are what he comes across most. I don't blame him for being rude when he has been asking people for the last year or so to not report bugs on ebuilds that he didn't write and that gentoo doesn't support. I also find it annoying when no matter how many times I tell people not to report bugs to him, they do it anyways.
I have a working relationship with foser and he has never randomly tried to hunt me down for what I do..he just doesn't want to be bothered with stuff that isn't his responsibility.

Being lead of the gnome project gives him more work then most can handle. Foser has a policy of not being responsible for anything that he hasn't done(or that isn't in the official portage tree) It just so happens that bmg ebuilds are what he comes across most. I don't blame him for being rude when he has been asking people for the last year or so to not report bugs on ebuilds that he didn't write and that gentoo doesn't support. I also find it annoying when no matter how many times I tell people not to report bugs to him, they do it anyways.

I do blame him for being rude -- it's never called for. I can understand him only wanting to support his own product, but

Quote:

I suppose i wasn't clear enough in my initial comment, using BMG ebuilds results in losing our support. It doesn't matter to me if you don't actually use them at this point, they were on your system : No more support. That's why i'm closing this as INVALID now.

I think you simply have some text that is slightly too long for the window to display. So technically, it does serve a purpose, otherwise it would not show.

Nope. Longest string there was Hello. I tried changing the size of the initial window in the preferences and the scroll bar is always there. I can make it 1000 pixels wide and its still there. Very annoying.

I think you simply have some text that is slightly too long for the window to display. So technically, it does serve a purpose, otherwise it would not show.

Nope. Longest string there was Hello. I tried changing the size of the initial window in the preferences and the scroll bar is always there. I can make it 1000 pixels wide and its still there. Very annoying.

I don't have a problem being asked not to report useless bugs to the gaim guys. It's just that that message is worded.. Well, it seemed a little bit rude.

Quote:

I agree..shutup. Until you produce something that people can use, nobody wants to hear your complaining. Even if you did produce something useful,I still don't want to hear your complaining.

That is the number one attitude that prevents linux from making it to the desktop mainstream.

I may not be able to "produce" C or C++ code, but I can give useful feedback to developers who don't have time to test every aspect of their application on every platform.

Hell, if you don't want it, I'll go back to Windows.

I thought the ideal behind Free Software was to make the software that underlies computers - which are becoming an increasingly large part of out lives - Free to everyone. I don't remember their being a stipulation that you had to be a Linux God. Some people are more knowledgable then others, and I thought the idea was that those individuals were willing to help along others toward the goal, in a respectful mannder.

Me too! This pissed me off big time - I turned off the history plugin just so I didn't have to see this scroll bar.

Two other pisser-offers. You now have to get through a sub menu to get to your custom away messages. Also, a certain friend of mine uses a small font. Before, it was fine, but the new Gaim makes it unreadably small!

I don't have a problem being asked not to report useless bugs to the gaim guys. It's just that that message is worded.. Well, it seemed a little bit rude.

Quote:

I agree..shutup. Until you produce something that people can use, nobody wants to hear your complaining. Even if you did produce something useful,I still don't want to hear your complaining.

That is the number one attitude that prevents linux from making it to the desktop mainstream.

I may not be able to "produce" C or C++ code, but I can give useful feedback to developers who don't have time to test every aspect of their application on every platform.

Hell, if you don't want it, I'll go back to Windows.

I thought the ideal behind Free Software was to make the software that underlies computers - which are becoming an increasingly large part of out lives - Free to everyone. I don't remember their being a stipulation that you had to be a Linux God. Some people are more knowledgable then others, and I thought the idea was that those individuals were willing to help along others toward the goal, in a respectful mannder.

I guess I thought wrong.

Something useful doesn't have to be c/c++ code. It can be anything..it could even be feedback...but useless feedback isn't worth a thing. It doesn't take a linux god to not piss and moan about something after reading 3 einfo lines.

Alright there's enough FUD going around that I thought I'd better make an appearance and set things straight.

First, foser doesn't maintain gaim, I do. foser hates it when gaim bugs get assigned to him, as do I.

Second, regarding my note to file bugs with gentoo instead of gaim. This is because the distro should always be the first line of defense, since the distro often modifies the distribution, as we did heavily with gaim-0.75. The gaim developers don't know or care how we modified the source for building, and don't want to support any of those changes. Filing bugs with them that turn out to be due to changes we in the distro made wastes both their time and yours.

Others have a germ of truth to them. Robbins acknowledged twice in his talk that Gentoo users have a reputation for pestering upstream open source developers with bug reports. Some have been legitimate -- the idiosyncratic configurations permitted by Gentoo often shook out obscure problems in the most stable packages. There's a general feeling among some developers that Gentoo users are identifying problems caused not by upstream bugs, but by aggressive optimization or other poor configuration choices that the users themselves have made.

Robbins wants to stop this, and emphasizes that if Gentoo users have a problem, reporting bugs upstream to the software's original author is the wrong place to start, and that they should let the Gentoo development team know first.

So if you want to stop using gaim because I'm trying to make us better netizens, go nuts. It honestly doesn't affect how I'm going to do things and especially won't affect the gaim developers.

No. At least one is using a mac (iChat) and one is using AIM on windows i think. I meant that their fonts are small on gaim on my computer when I am talking to them, not that they are small on their screens.

No. At least one is using a mac (iChat) and one is using AIM on windows i think. I meant that their fonts are small on gaim on my computer when I am talking to them, not that they are small on their screens.