A reply to Mandy Sayer

Last week a reader sent me a link to a review in The Australian of "the kind of books that, once you put them down, you can't pick them up again".

Written by Aussie novelist Mandy Sayer, it was one of those sarky, entitled pieces you'd expect from an author who's more widely regarded than read.

And, sure, Sayer is entitled to her opinion, although I consider the practice of authors acting as book reviewers akin to burns victims judging beauty contests.

Anyway, Sayer had a go at a number of soft-target self-help books that are probably not so great, including Why Zebras Don't Get Ulcers, The Fine Art of Small Talk and The End of Overeating: Taking Control of the Insatiable American Appetite.

Then she ripped into another tome titled For Women Only: What Women Need to Know About the Inner Lives of Men saying "at 200 pages, this book must have big print, or lots of illustrations" ...

She continues: "We all know that any publication about the inner lives of men wouldn't fill much more than a leaflet.

"When women ask men what they're thinking, and they reply, 'Nothing', they're not making it up. There's really not much going on behind those unblinking eyes except the latest cricket scores and last week's episode of Rake," she wrote.

As the female reader, Carol, who sent me this link said in her email: "I do get tired of this kind of sexism. It's been around forever, of course, but it used to be different when women weren't on an equal footing with men.

"Now that the sexes are supposedly equal, I don't see why women should get away with this kind of 'humour' when men can't," she wrote.

Well, Mandy's actually not getting away with any kind of humour, because what she wrote ain't funny; she's just swatting low-hanging fruit.

It's the female equivalent of a mouth-breathing male shouting "have a look at this dog" at a woman who's walking her Labrador, then turning to his mates for laughs.

It's the lowest common denominator sister of the pan-fried snot you see in men's magazines, where some boofhead chuckles about how chicks can't drive, read maps or deal with pressure without crying.

The whole "men just think about tits and sport" riff is a way for people such as Sayer to simplify a complex world, but in the process it dehumanises a gender.

God knows, I've made enough sweeping generalisations about women on this blog over the past four years, but it's interactive, you get your clock cleaned every now and then and it forces you to rethink your sometimes stunted world view.

Every day of the week, the thoughtful responses from men on this blog have shown that there are many guys who think deeply and widely about everything from art to anal sex, feminism to footy, philosophy to beer bongs.

As I have said constantly on this blog, one of the most consistently demeaning things about the media portrayals of men is they fail to acknowledge the spectrum of masculinity that exists across the population, and within individual guys.

I love cricket and I love Rake, Mandy. I also dig books, surfing, boxing, the French language, Eric Hoffer, porn, country music, rugby league, beer, scotch, red wine, action movies and hanging long turds into cool porcelain after a good coffee.

I also guarantee that I, and many, many of my readers have read more widely about feminism and gender, philosophy and psychology, art, literature and pig hunting than you or the cabal of snobs and misandrists you're hoping to get a chuckle from with the sort of horseshit comment reprinted above.

I'd also wager we have more empathy for the opposite sex than you do, because to be part of the community we've built here on this blog, you have to, or you wouldn't come back to read and comment like so many do.

Maybe I'm overreacting to a tiny, obscure piece of commentary by an equally tiny and obscure commentator, but it's my belief Mandy, that the sentiments you've expressed in your review are as damaging to gender relations as strip clubs and the now thankfully defunct Ralph magazine.

It's also why I'd never put down one of your books - because I wouldn't even bother picking one up.

If it's come from a mind so shuttered, it's unlikely to bring any light or enlightenment to my world.

AND THE WINNER IS
The winner of the RedBalloon skydiving competition is Oscar Black who wrote: "IF I JUMPED OUT OF A PLANE, MY LAST THOUGHT WOULD BE ... please don't let me land teeth first on a bubbler."

Because?

It's just weird, and it made me laugh. So Oscar, I have your email address, but if you wanna send me an email, I'll get your details and the good people at RedBalloon will post you out your gift voucher.

TWITTER
My mate El Guapo has been saying for about a year I HAVE TO give Twitter a go, so I am, mainly to see if it'll give me ideas for blogs. If you're interested in seeing me embarrass myself in more than one medium, you can follow me here.

If you'd like to email me with a topic suggestion or just vent, try here. I now have too many unanswered emails to catch up on, so I'm instituting a no-reply policy. In advance, I thank you for your email.

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Recent comments

Now, now, perhaps Mandy was just feeling a bit lazy and didn't have it in her to create something insightful and worth reading?

Maybe Mandy feels like that every day. You don't know her.

We should start a charity - one set up to support those less talented than they wish they were, a charity for people like Mandy. Just like all the tone-deaf singers, painters who could stuff up a stick-figure drawing and dancers with two left feet, "writers" who don't know the difference between "lots of words" and "something worthwhile reading" need our support.

I will be taking donations on the corner of George and Market St for the rest of the day.

randomguy

December 13, 2010

02:52 PM

this illustrates that there are some bitter shrews and shrieking demons out there trumpeting that women are still an oppressed minority

you aren't, ladies

you are valued and respected, and it is demeaning to the vast majority of you that these goobers get any air time

I am impressed that this destructive diatribe was brought to your attention by a female reader

well done Carol

AdamV

December 13, 2010

03:05 PM

I think you might be overreacting a little. The article is obviously meant to be snarky and barbed, but as you've reminded us on here before, it's a mistake to confuse a written persona with the writer.

I know I don't want to become a humourless gender warrior howling with fury at every anti-man or anti-woman joke I see. In fact, I'd say the opposite to your reader who drew the piece to your attention: as the sexes are (at least theoretically) equal, who cares if we rib each other a little?

I was not hurt or upset by the (admittedly boring and lightweight) Sayers piece, and I have no interest in defending any man so thin-skinned and spineless to have been so injured. The world is far more intricate than "men vs women", and I'd suggest that anybody who does view the world along those lines can only be a lightweight thinker.

Making a lame joke about it in some pointless book review, however, is really no skin off anybody's nose. Of course, by the same token, neither is this response. Have at it, says I. God love freedom of expression!

Nobody

December 13, 2010

03:11 PM

Hey Sam. Thanks for ripping in to Mandy.

I also wish to thank Carol for being open to the idea that many men are very similar to Sam's widely accepting, diverse thinking personality. And that we have good relationships with women. I mean, my Mum's a woman. And my wife. My daughter's female. And our Prime Minister. Sh&% ... They're everywhere.

Cheers,

Thea

December 13, 2010

03:25 PM

Bloody right - Sayer's comments are out of line and lazy as hell as far as a serious book review should go, whether or not she was serious or just thought she was being funny. (Note to Mandy: Comedy Fail.)

But I have a nasty feeling that this discussion could degenerate along the usual lines, with the usual suspects grabbing any opportunity to start banging on about evil women making victims of men, and how them darn feminazis have ruined the world and stolen everybody's testicles and now everyone has to live in fear of the scary wimmin.

But we're bigger than that, right? God I hope so.

S&M

December 13, 2010

03:36 PM

For some reason I am reminded of the other day when a facebook status from a female friend said, "does anyone know of a good place to stay in Longbeach, CA?" and I replied, "the Dogg pound" which was promptly deleted. You see, my idea was that Snoop Dogg's house would be a really good place to stay in Longbeach, CA and I did not think any further than that.

I am definitely unthinkingly insensitive even when I am trying to be helpful, but I am never consciously malicious. This cannot be said about this Mandy chick, who probably hates being called a chick. So I am being mischievous, not malicious, in that statement.

Stormy

December 13, 2010

03:36 PM

"everything from art to anal sex, feminism to footy, philosophy to beer bongs"

Like, Like, Generally agree with, Like, Mostly over my head, Like.

There's a book called "Why Zebras Don't Get Ulcers" ? Dear Lord, my three year old has "Can a Zebra Fly?", perhaps it's the sequel.

It would be fair to say that I know plenty of blokes who profess to mostly liking sport and tits, but for all I know they could be at home on a lonely Saturday night deconstructing Camus while listening to Phillip Adams. During half-time in Lingerie Football, anyway.

If a bloke wrote something like this:

"We all know that a publication on the inner life of women is called a shoe catalogue"

he'd probably have a fatwah on him by now.

According to my exhaustive 60 seconds' research on Google, Mandy Sayer is one of Australia's "best known authors". I'll be honest, I think her name rang a distant bell but I wouldn't know her work if I tripped over it in an inner west bookstore. So let's hear from the Mandy Sayer fans, what's she all about then?

EvilBob

December 13, 2010

03:39 PM

Sorry, Mandy who? I'm a librarian, and I've never heard of her. Heard of her husband (Louis Nowra), though. Don't know if that says anything. Anyway, any opinion expressed in The Australian can be fairly safely ignored.
Some women think this way, just as some men really do have little on their minds other than the cricket and norgs. Most don't.
I wonder how Mandy's male friends feel if she views them this way?

jimmy

December 13, 2010

03:43 PM

It's like the passage in the book "Slap", which received an award for the worst sex scene... "they f**ked for ages" it read.

The judge said it was just lazy writing.

Similarly, I'd say Mandy took the path with the least amount of thought required.

HIM

December 13, 2010

03:55 PM

Don't worry about Mandy she probably had the painters in at the time.

Bagatelle

December 13, 2010

03:56 PM

What an adorable overreaction!

Not that she's right, of course, she sounds like an idiot. It's just...well, who cares? After centuries of sanctioned misogyny, such indignation at what you rightfully refer to as a tiny and obscure piece of commentary is..well..come on. Only imagine how you'd feel if you were a woman, dealing with those kinds of insults so often that its kind of commonplace!

So...what would the appropriate response be I wonder..."man up", perhaps? "Grow a pair?"

Tee hee!

M

December 13, 2010

04:16 PM

Well I don't understand why it is necessary to give such comments more air time than necessary. If she wrote what she did to get her name out in the open then it was mission accomplished. If it was to take a feminist stance on the writings of men then she failed in my mind.

In order for our society to function both men and women need to be accepting of the fact that the world is made up of all sorts of people. The differences make our world a rich and diverse place and slinging turds at each other doesn't make it very pleasant for anyone.

Stormy December 13, 2010 03:36 PM

Nothing wrong with a shoe collection as a story of the life of my feet. As long as I have the hats and handbags to match.

tom

December 13, 2010

04:34 PM

I'm surprised you spent the time to put that into words Sam.

Kneejerking my way out of this post.

Lulu

December 13, 2010

04:47 PM

"I also guarantee that I, and many, many of my readers have read more widely about"

Otherwise known as the 'mine's bigger than yours' tactic.

kaindia

December 13, 2010

04:56 PM

I'm going to depart from the current consensus... her article is not THAT bad.

I'm suprised it invoked a bit of a hissy fit from you Sam. Obviously she was trying to be witty and funny and didn't really achieve either.

'The difference between literature and journalism is that journalism is unreadable and literature is not read.'

Direct

December 13, 2010

05:10 PM

I am definitely unthinkingly insensitive even when I am trying to be helpful, but I am never consciously malicious.

Posted by S&M @ December 13, 2010 03:36 PM

Inconsiderate perhaps?

Bender

December 13, 2010

05:11 PM

Ha! I initially thought that she'd written a review of one of your books and you were responding to it - but I knew you'd be bigger than that.

As for women thinking men don't think - meh, I don't care. Better to be underestimated from day one and get on with it rather than trying to prove something to someone that doesn't matter to you.

It's not like men have never thought of anything - philosophy, art, engineering, religion, law etc

It was funny reading a review on The Frisky about Samantha Brett's new book which also tells people how men think.

SmartMonkey

December 13, 2010

05:28 PM

Wow......zinger. Probably is a little bit of an over-reaction to go all scorched earth on her like that, but hey, if she is prepared to write scathing critiques of the creative endeavours of others and demean a gender as a sidebar gag in the process all in the name of a paycheck...then she had it coming.

It is a shame that a woman who has probably fought for gender respect for most of her life finds it so easy to look down her nose at men once she has reaped the benefits of equality in education, career and standing. It's not the kind of equality my mum spoke to me about growing up.

I think you should be justifiably proud of the community you have built here Sam. I enjoy reading the thoughtful (and sometimes not so thoughtful) perspectives of others on this blog as much as your own. I have felt an evolution in my own perspective on a wide range of issues from being part of it (some sudden and some that seep through the cracks of consciousness over time) and may have observed similar changes in some others here.

I am glad there are so many female contributors to this blog who hold such a different perspective on gender issue to Mandy and who view men's issues as a domain they want to be part of. I think they are much better role models for modern feminism that the graceless sniping of the Mandy Sayers of the world.

The irony is Mandy and her friends are probably the same people who complain that "there are no decent men anymore". Well my question to you Mandy would be, what are you doing to help fix that?

Albers

December 13, 2010

05:41 PM

May be Mandy should change her first name to Sooth!

SLR

December 13, 2010

06:14 PM

She's a hoot, maybe not so much in that piece, but as a writer you must have written articles or opinion pieces that don't sit too comfortable after the fact (or the sub)?

I used to see her having a beer at the Darlo most evenings and the men she was with (including Louis) would argue the misandry tag.

I reckon you'd enjoy a beer with Mandy as much or more than you did with your mate Abbott.

Dadevilish1

December 13, 2010

06:18 PM

Maybe it is the quality of "men" Mandy hangs around with?
A) She hangs around men that have "NOTHING" on their mind,
B) She doesn't know how to start a decent conversation with men, so asks them outright "What are you thinking about?", or
C) Men know her well enough that they avoid having a decent conversation with her by saying "NOTHING"

You get what you expect, if you expect the worst...

Sonja

December 13, 2010

06:35 PM

Just goes to show she never read a single page of those books.

I've enjoyed "Never have your dog stuffed" by Alan Alda, started on (but have yet to finish) "How to amputate a leg and other ways to stay out of trouble" by Nathan Mullen, "All guts and no glory" by Bob Buick (his account of the Battle of Long Tan, a bloody good read!), and plenty of others.

Carol (aka The Schoolmarm)

December 13, 2010

06:47 PM

Well, I feel like I went to light a match and let off a rocket.

@Bagatelle
“Only imagine how you'd feel if you were a woman, dealing with those kinds of insults so often that its kind of commonplace!”

So if you know how it feels, why on earth would you tell Sam to ‘man up’?

@Stormy
“If a bloke wrote something like this:"We all know that a publication on the inner life of women is called a shoe catalogue" he'd probably have a fatwah on him by now.”

Funnier line than anything Ms Sayers came up with!

Chris

December 13, 2010

06:54 PM

I think you've totally missed the point Sam.

The article is mocking a certain type of book with glib advice and pop-psychology, that relies on a catchy title to sell. I think Mandy was suggesting the only way "For Women Only" could offer any insights was if you were silly enough to believe the stereotype she has trotted out.

hired goon

December 13, 2010

06:55 PM

"If a bloke wrote something like this:

"We all know that a publication on the inner life of women is called a shoe catalogue"

he'd probably have a fatwah on him by now. "

Stormy, I don't think so. Remember the blog where SdB wrote off women obsessed with shopping? Yeeeeeeeah

davo

December 13, 2010

06:58 PM

"When women ask men what they're thinking, and they reply 'nothing' ,they're really not making it up .There's really not much going on behind those unblinking eyes except the latest cricket scores and last week's episode of Rake "

Firstly,she obviously doesn't follow cricket .....
Secondly ,i disagree . While most men will readily give up what they're thinking ,it's their feelings relative to those thoughts is what lets us know where they stand . And sadly, many a bloke has made an honest observation based on his immediate thoughts - only to have them misunderstood and thrown back at him as some kind of insult because it didn't tie-in with the feelings of the woman conversing with him .Smart guys shut the ... up,smile, censor what they say and play the game letting women believe they're inwardly empty and incapable of honest and critical reflection .Whatever keeps the peace and gets you what you want.....

And let's be honest for a moment .......there's a whole demographic of men who don't read the Herald or AMAL, and whose lives ARE mostly about beer,footy,big tits and hot bods,fast cars and rock'n'roll.And they certainly don't lie in bed at night reading books; it's only soft porn mags featuring pneumatic nymphomaniacs with tattz for these dudes.Some blokes are shallow- and they seem to have no trouble finding women with a similar outlook to breed with ...

tba

December 13, 2010

06:59 PM

The gist of the article in The Australian offends me. I think of all the beautiful, deep thinking men I know and it makes me sad for them.

One of the things I hate the most about my sex is our seemingly overwhelming desire to control our men. That really is all put-down's are. Poor blokes would probably thrive if they were just allowed to be, and if we women could just love who our men be.

Im afraid all this author has done is revealed her own failings.

The evil twin

December 13, 2010

07:06 PM

My first thought was, Oh don't give her more oxygen, Sam....I didn't know about her until I read this.

Bagatelle

December 13, 2010

07:08 PM

@Carol (aka The Schoolmarm)
December 13, 2010 06:47 PM "So if you know how it feels, why on earth would you tell Sam to ‘man up’?"

Am guessing irony is not your strong suit.

The evil twin

December 13, 2010

08:01 PM

Wait.

She does have a point about some (most) of the self-help literature published these days. Just because you're offended, doesn't mean she's wrong.

Yeah_Nah!

December 13, 2010

08:08 PM

Priorities people!

There's no time for all this Ashes nonsense.

Not while the big "O" is in town, and with Miley Cyrus smoking drugs, and Suri Cruise getting her own credit card.

We really should stay focused on the important issues.

skitzmixv9

December 13, 2010

09:23 PM

Sam, I've read every one of your posts. I like this one. I agree with you. What I hate hearing most is a jilted female saying "when men get laid they are called a stud, when a woman does she is a slut". We simply don't live in that paradigm anymore, and most of us never have.

Props for calling this woman out.

Strawbs

December 13, 2010

10:02 PM

...and for the record I enjoyed, as well as studied, the concepts written in 'Why Zebras Don't Get Ulcers'. It may not be your cup of tea Mandy but it's more than likely someone elses!

Peter S

December 13, 2010

10:28 PM

It's OK Sam, Mandy's article is no threat - just a chance to remember that many of us would rather create and live in a kinder, more respectful world, and also one where people's creative efforts are supported.

LittleJohn

December 13, 2010

10:58 PM

Magazine publishing...probably one of the most cut-throat industries there is. If there is an interest, they will supply a mag about it.
Walk into any newsagent and have a look at the range of subject matter bought by men..politics, the arts, photography, home theatre, computing, sport, cooking, boating, flying, scuba diving, gardening, computer games, pornography, science fiction, computing....and on and on.
What kind of magazines do women mainly buy? Gossip, fashion, celebrity, home making and not much else really...
obviously this a huge generalisation and a bit sexist but I believe there is some truth in this observation.
Next time you read the usual tripe degrading men from idiots like Mandy Sayer (which seem to get a free pass for some reason) walk into a newsagent and see what really interests men.
And then compare that to women.......

KiyoK

December 13, 2010

11:22 PM

"Burns victims judging beauty pageants" - ouch - maybe you meant it differently but I don't think that line was well thought through. Cheers, KK.

Alby

December 14, 2010

12:14 AM

What the!! Ralph is no longer???

(Been o/s for a few years)

Does this mean my collection dating back to the late 90's is now worth something??

Michael J. Dundee

December 14, 2010

01:56 AM

"Sarky"? What on earth! I'd drop that from the repertoire quick smart. Way too girly.

Now, I clicked on that link expecting some fireworks but all I got was disappointment. Has it been edited? is atht all she said?

Fair dinkum, Sam, you've produced the over reaction of our young century. Take a chill pill bro*. Girls can laugh well but are never funny**, sadly. And Mandy probably doesn't believe a word of it anyway. I mean, how could she possibly?

No no no, you should have saved some ire for SHARI-LEA HITCHCOCK. Blog title suggestion: Horrible Gold Diggin' Floozies

(I've never watched a second of Rake. Roxburgh is a dud. CAS school, Richard? Can spot em a mile away.)

*I'd never of course use such a ridiculous phrase in public. **Natalie Portman did something pretty funny once in an interview when she was bagging herself. I nearly cried.

Perplexio

December 14, 2010

02:23 AM

Stereotypes exist and perpetuate because there is generally some truth to them.

Mandy's comments are snarky, can't deny that but maybe she's the wrong target... Maybe we shouldn't be targeting the people who still stereotype on gender lines but we should target those within our own genders who perpetuate the negative stereotypes about the rest of us that people like Mandy use for lowbrow article fodder.

bad advice

December 14, 2010

03:04 AM

I like boobs!

I comment on this blog sometimes frequently and sometimes not so frequently, I don't ever use another handle except bad advice but, the only time Sam responded to a comment of mine was when I suggested in the pursuit of romance and love that love and romance was "finding someone who doesn't sh!t you too much" – is this an anti-mandy comment?

So what does attract a blokes attention?

In the last few weeks I have had a real realization in life. One of my inner circle of mates was diagnosed with a BIG mofo of a brain tumor. He has had the top of his head opened like a soft boiled egg, had someone he doesn't know mess around in his brains with an ice-cream scoop and now faces weeks/months of cancer treatment. Made me realize that all the effort to chase coin and prestige, make mum proud and not act like too much of wanker doesn’t add up to anything if the decision to live or die is taken out of your hands when your kids are under 7.

I have also decided I am not going to sweat the small stuff. So what if you think differently to me, you are entitled to your opinion as I am and you know what, maybe I am wrong. (Maybe you are?) In fact, if you want to carry on like a wombat, go for it; just don't get fired up if I don't join in.

In regards to this bird Mandy, if thinking all blokes are morons floats her boat and she can make a living out of spouting it, good on her.

At the end of the day, the one thing I am comfortable with is - I LIKE BOOBS - fark, maybe Mandy is right.

lostinaustin

December 14, 2010

03:17 AM

well-thought, fair and honest ...as usual, sam. well said!

CityChick

December 14, 2010

06:13 AM

Meh ... Ms Sayer, never read her stuff before this post and after googling some of her work .. happy for her to stay that way - the beauty of literary choice.

fawtah? (classic)

giddy-up ...

Al

December 14, 2010

06:28 AM

What he said

Richard

December 14, 2010

06:42 AM

For goodness' sake, get a life! The article was clearly not intended as a treatise on gender relationships; it was intended to be a dig at the 'self-help' genre and as a little bit of humour in the day's reading.

tltsu

December 14, 2010

07:58 AM

Sam, what do you tihnk about your colleague Samantha Brett on AskSam! ?

I know this is a lazy comment but it is early so it is all I am capable of.

This blog reminded me of that Seinfeld episode where Elaine and Puddy are flying back from Europe and Elaine is enraged by the fact that Puddy is content to sit and blankly stare at the back of the seat in front of him rather than read or sleep.

I agree with M December 13, 2010 04:16 PM, why even dignify Sayer's drivel with a response, ignore her and she will go away.

I personally have never heard of her but then I had never heard of you either Sam until I happened to pick up the lost boys one rainy day when I was mooching about in a book store; I actually spend a lot of time in book stores. Not sure what my point is, possibly it is that I don't read Ralph or what have you, I prefer to read books n'that.

Did I mention it is quite early in the morning?

Tim

December 14, 2010

09:06 AM

For some reason I am really looking forward to the movie "Black Swan" even though I know it is about ballet and have even ordered "The Red Shoes" on DVD to watch first. I normally mainly watch action or martial arts movies. I cannot explain the Betty Hutton jag I went on a few years back either.

slim jim

December 14, 2010

09:08 AM

It’s just shitty humour – lowest common denominator stuff from someone who lacks the wit to come up with something better.

Evs

December 14, 2010

09:26 AM

I'vwe never read any of her books but she's got a good face for radio, I'll keep an ear out for her.

Fruitcake

December 14, 2010

09:37 AM

I was given one of Mandy Sayer's books as a gift once. I only finished it 'cos I thought it would get better. It didn't.
Anyway, I have to say I think I've learned more about the inner workings of the male mind in the last 2 years than in my previous 30 something years. Ultimately, most guys just don't feel the need to express every thought they have the moment they have them. Also, if men were to express how they were feeling, there is the gender imbalance that would label them as "girls". Just because they don't express it, doesn't mean they are less emotional creatures. At the end of the day, it just makes no sense to generalise about gender, race or religion - although like many, I have been guilty of doing just that in the past. I try to think through more carefully what I say these days, because you just don't know what lies beneath the surface and judging a book by it's cover is the dumbest thing you can ever do! I have learned that the hard way!

Niente but a pin cushion

December 14, 2010

09:44 AM

I've never heard of Mandy Sayer until now. What's her problem with Rake? I watch Rake and I'm a woman.

I don't agree with the generalizations she's made but I'm sure there's some guy somewhere making equivalent comments about women. I'd rather not give them any attention.

irony bypass

December 14, 2010

09:48 AM

Mr. De Brito, do you think maybe, just maybe... Mandy was exaggerating for effect. Look up 'irony' and even 'satire' in the dictionary; you know, it's one of those big books you're forever telling us you read and write. But a Bryce Courtenay is probably your idea of a deep, weighty tome. From the little of your drivel I've read here, you strike me as a boorish, narcissistic, pseudo-enlightened 'bloke.' I mean, you even had to tell your poor readers, once again, about all your wonderful enlightened qualities in a piece that wasn't supposed to be about you. Oh, I forgot, all your pieces are about you. By the way, I'm a guy (so no reverse sexism here). And change the title of your blog - it reeks - your stab at chivalrous irony didn't come off. As usual.

Thanks for dropping by, Mandy. - Sam

mrpc

December 14, 2010

10:07 AM

Another great piece Sam.

You continue to hit the social nerve that I live my life by, acknowledge the inner (and outer) demons that I too possess and provide a balanced and measured expression of all that is unsaid by the majority. Kudos !

e1

December 14, 2010

10:09 AM

IF I JUMPED OUT OF A PLANE, MY LAST THOUGHT WOULD BE ...

I'm glad I didn't put my parachute on and I hope I land on Sam DeBrito.

Stormy

December 14, 2010

10:12 AM

irony bypass
December 14, 201009:48 AM
"Mr. De Brito, do you think maybe, just maybe... Mandy was exaggerating for effect"

Well, it had an effect...

When you've finished with Roget's, can I borrow it please? "boorish, narcissistic and pseudo-enlightened". Wow, what a lot of syllables.

Argentmount Black, Esq.

December 14, 2010

10:16 AM

Sir,

As a gentleman, I must take issue with the fulminations of the suffragette and bluestocking infesting the hallowed pages of The Australian.

Mr Sam de Brito has the right of it when he condemns the scribblings of hysterical women in a newspaper which is intended as a reputable journal of opinion, and which should therefore be the exclusive province of the gentlemanly classes.

Works of literature are intended to inform gentlemen in a world of responsibility, be it those with a career in the Church, Foreign Office, or the Army. Literature of any sort must therefore resemble a gentlemen's club of the better sort, where an atmosphere of bonhomie among men may prevail without the need to constantly pander to the sensibilities of the fairer sex.

It is the responsibility of any good paterfamilias to ensure that his daughter has been suitably instructed by her governess in the gentle arts of needlework and household management. I have previously observed that the peculiar constitution of the weaker sex renders its members incapable of any cerebral activity beyond the perusal of a genteel novel, with the possible inclusion of those chapters of Scripture which have been approved by their male guardians.

I must therefore protest the presence of women in the realm of social or academic discussion. Exposure to knowledge hitherto reserved for gentlemen will cause them to become shrewish and querulous, and will render them unmarriageable to any but the most fevered Socialist or Frenchman.

Luke

December 14, 2010

10:16 AM

Surely you could of found a better person/example to have a massive dig at?

Going through your back catalogues you've written some amazing stuff, and your mostly spot on in explaining mens thoughts and actions.

But this post just feels like your clutching at straws. As a man im not really too offended, it was bad humour, but so what? She had an off day. With all the talk about metro-sexuals and SNAGS being open to there feelings. Its a silly lighthearted character assesment to make.
Compared to what Fry and another Age columist made about womens relation to sex, her post is not worthy of any rebuttal.
Save up your anger for someone that deserves it.

The 'dopey' bloke concept is being counter attacked by all the 'Man' ads now in the media. I.e Old Spice, the canned soup, even Macca's is getting onto it.

Johnny

December 14, 2010

10:26 AM

"When women ask men what they're thinking, and they reply 'nothing' ,they're really not making it up .There's really not much going on behind those unblinking eyes except the latest cricket scores and last week's episode of Rake."

I dunno if it is the same for everyone else but for me when i answer "nothing", it is an abridged answer.

The unabridged answer is something like "...Nothing you'd be interested in. Why do you care if i'm puzzling over scales and modes in my head? What does it matter to you if i'm trying to come up with ideas for my presentation at work next week? Why would you care if i gotta help my mate install a server at his house or fix his car? I don't discuss these things with you because I don't want to bore or frustrate you any further than you obviously are".

So to Mandy Sayer: There are things going on in the male brain. That's where we keep the things you aren't interested in. And there's more of it than you obviously think.

To people saying Sam over reacted: I tend to disagree. Tell me though, where do you draw the line between over-reacting and expressing an opposing opinion? Besides, he's a blog writer! He needs to be able to write things that may cause controvesy, because that is what makes people read, post and return here!!

Bek

December 14, 2010

10:29 AM

I don't think it's fair to judge either gender based on a few nutters from each tribe. The genders are different with a few general strengths and weaknesses, so I don't think we'll ever have equality as such. But at least women aren't being burned as witches these days. Apparently with my green eyes, red hair and big mouth, I would have been a prime target... Men are not all neanderthals though and it's unfair to generalise as such.

Lulu

December 14, 2010

10:29 AM

"Thanks for dropping by, Mandy. - Sam"

Because of course there's only one person who could possibly disagree with you, or notice your missing of irony (in other people's writing).

M

December 14, 2010

10:38 AM

Lulu December 14, 2010 10:29 AM

Isn't irony all about pressing a hem or a shirt?

Come come now.

MattMan

December 14, 2010

10:40 AM

I'm beginning to doubt if Mandy would even appreciate the value of a good forward defensive shot through cover.

Huh? Isn't she merely a charicature invented for the purposes of jumping on the blog bandwagon, and therefore not to be taken too seriously?

If I was to take her that seriously, wow, she doesn't give women much credibility either.

On Sam's topic, I'm not sure why he'd give oxygen to a writer he obviously doesn't rate very highly.

razrea

December 14, 2010

10:48 AM

On topic - I can understand the annoyance with the double standard but mostly I just think she was being lazy and trying to score cheap points.

Off topic -
Argentmount Black, Esq.
December 14, 2010 10:16 AM
Awesome. I wish more people wrote like that. Damn Georgette Heyer!

irony bypass

December 14, 2010

11:00 AM

Sorry Mr. de Britto, I really am a guy.
Just a quiet guy who retreats to a dark corner of the bar when someone like you walks in. It's all I can do to keep from kicking the chair out from under you. Don't you get it? You're too loud. Your proclamations a little too self-serving. I guess I just have to accept that most people won't see through your reactionary, intelligent knockabout-bloke routine.

"Because of course there's only one person who could possibly disagree with you, or notice your missing of irony (in other people's writing)."

Well said.

Mark Harrison

December 14, 2010

11:01 AM

You know, I was going to respond to La Mayer's vapid little piece in The Australian but I figured that would be what she wanted. Because:

1. I'd never heard of Mandy Sayer.
2. I read some extracts of the book she was putting down on Amazon and thought that it had some merit, leaving aside the references to God every other para. But that is the writer's shtick, it didn't detract from her thesis and I'm a live and let live kind of guy.
3. Nope, I'd still never heard of Mandy Sayer.

Now that EvilBob has clued me into her marital arrangement, I'm guessing she got the gig at a dinner party somewhere in the eastern suburbs of Sydney. It certainly wasn't by talent, if this example is anything to go by.

Andrew

December 14, 2010

11:07 AM

I regret my alligience to feminism when I was a philosophy student and that I didn't see its supporters as the resentful, penis envying man haters they are. I note the distiction between feminism and its supporters.

My interest in feminism actually devalued my sense of self worth.

shevek

December 14, 2010

11:08 AM

Hey DB did you edit this post? I do think its a lot better read than it was last night....

On another note did anyone see that article last week about the supposed glut of Christmas functions taking place in strip clubs? That could have been written by a friend of Mandy's....lazy, misandrist and completely speculative 'journalism'. Dislike.

So you like porn but you don't like Ralph magazine? I don't understand where you're coming from. What's wrong with Ralph - is it simply too intellectual or highbrow for you?

Hobsonz Choice

December 14, 2010

11:54 AM

I totally agree with you, but I'm not sure that attacking Mandy Sayer makes up for all the man hating that goes on out there.
I love men. In fact, most of my friends are male partly because far too many of the women of my generation (the gen X/Y overlap) seem to think that female empowerment is about hating men. Men are awesome and you don't resolve any remaining gender inequality by vilifying them. You only promote the beleifs of misogynists that women are, in fact, inferior.

Troglodyte

December 14, 2010

11:59 AM

Yeah, right on! You know it really pisses me off when people like Mandy trash me off as one-dimensional, neanderth.....ooh, hang on, I can see right down that girl's top from up here.

Woooahh, illicit glimpse of boob. I like boobs. A lot. Hers are fantastic, I mean I've seen a lot of boobs, but hers really take the prize.

Um, now, where was I?

As a blog lurker, if I read ONE MORE reductionist paragraph starting with 'We're simple creatures', I'm gonna....well, keep looking at those boobs, really.

The point that I'm trying to make is; I don't really care about unimaginative opinion pieces like Mandy's. She's going for a bargain basement laugh and probably had a deadline to meet for her column that prevented her from writing anything creative and original.

Underestimating me only lends me advantages.

It's the metronomic, cyclopean vitriol from some of the posters on this blog that slowly winds me up. A little bit like that mosquito that starts buzzing around your head as soon as you switch the light off. You put up with it for a while but eventually you have to take a swat at it.

James M

December 14, 2010

12:14 PM

@ Argentmount, Dec 14 2010 10:16 AM

Nice work

tugdraker

December 14, 2010

12:16 PM

irony bypass December 14, 2010 11:00 AM

Are you suggesting that those of us who read Sam's blog are too ignorant to make a proper assessment of his motives, that we are incapable of forming our own opinions without his guidance, that we are a bunch of sycophantic, fawning, half smart automatons dutifully toeing the Debrito line?

If so you are wrong. Go back and read some of Sam’s previous blogs (there is hundreds to choose from) and then read some of the comments that have been posted. You will very quickly realize that most people who regularly comment have, at one time or another leveled their guns at Sam and let him have it. Some of the criticism is savage; most of it is very insightful, methodical and well thought through.

As a starting point I recommend you read the comments that were posted in relation to Sam’s article entitled “Basic bloody competency redux” he got spanked by pretty much everybody over that article. It is quite amusing actually, not the article, the comments. It was in June of this year.

Don’t get me wrong here I am not defending Sam, he can do that himself, I just don’t think this is the right company in which to mount your intellectual high horse, there are some very smart people lurking about this site. I could give you the names of some regular commentators who have very impressive intellects indeed, but I think you should have a look for yourself.

Helen G

December 14, 2010

12:19 PM

Seems like another excuse for Sam to have a swipe at women. One week he's all pro-women and the next he's using his partner to complain about things that wimmin do (don't wake the baby, don't wear that, excessive building-up of feminine hygiene products in bathroom...). Your blog may attract the 'think widely and deeply' bloke, agreed, but if you read some of the comments you will find some pretty sexist attitudes still exist out there. Buried nice and deep.

I pick up reverse-sexism in the media fairly well and it frustrates me as I don't find anything 'empowering' about trying to make someone else look like an idiot. The media portrays men and women in a particularly poor light and looking at the ads on tv I'm surprised that some of these companies are still in business with the ridiculous caricatures that they use to try and get us to buy something. And we do.

Comments from the likes of Mandy are unoriginal but I do think she was having a go at self-help books in general. Unfortunately, you can't use smiley faces in the newspaper.

As for Samantha Brett. She's just a bimbo who uses her blog to project her nonsense onto us and some how make her feel better for having a lousy love-life. She's looking for the 'there, there, you're perfect love it's just that men are too stupid to notice' kinda thing. She does more of a disservice to women than she does to men. She's more likely to receive heavy criticism from the female bloggers than the men.

Ask a man what he's thinking? Can't be bothered to ask.

Blah

December 14, 2010

12:34 PM

* irony bypass
* December 14, 2010
* 11:00 AM

"Sorry Mr. de Britto, I really am a guy.
Just a quiet guy who retreats to a dark corner of the bar when someone like you walks in. It's all I can do to keep from kicking the chair out from under you."

Wow - that is some seriously creepy s***. May I suggest working on your sense of proportion? When somebody merely writes a blog taking a position on topics that you do not agree with, holds views or displays traits that you find offensive, a more measured response might be to simply get on with enjoying your own life rather than brooding in the corner of a bar about violently assaulting them? I'd suggest a better night out would involve drinks with friends and attempting to get laid.

Anyway, on topic, the reason that guys say 'Nothing' when a woman asks them what they are thinking, especially if they do it every ten seconds, is because it is the polite way of saying 'It was a private thought and I can't be bothered going through it with you now'. Either that or you were thinking about what it would be like to shag her sister, or the various complexities of the Duckworth-Lewis system, and all such conversation with women is generally considered inappropriate.

Evan

December 14, 2010

12:42 PM

Things have switched. It used to be that women's hormones made them flighty and irresponsible. No males are made irretrievably stupid and violent by their hormones.

How I wish this rubbish would disappear.

TonTon

December 14, 2010

01:06 PM

Its interesting what society deems as acceptable sexism these days. I started a new job a few months back - naturally I knew almost no one when I started. There is an internal group designed for women to extend their networks across the organisation - they have a monthly drinks function, paid for by the org. Frankly, something like this that wasnt just for one gender would be perfect for me to get connected internally. Even stranger is that the majority of employees at the organisation are women, so it is discrimination against a minority. Worse, the team I am in is 90% women, so off they go to their functions leaving just 4 of us behind. But, apparently this is OK.

Some Old Guy

December 14, 2010

01:07 PM

Irony Bypass; nice name, but you seem very highly strung.

If you were in a bar when de Brito walked in, why would you retreat to a dark corner? Kinda boring, don't you think? And your other option of chair kicking's about as useful as tyre kicking. Why not talk to him?

theapostrophe

December 14, 2010

01:27 PM

I've recently returned as a 'lurker' in your blog community and this type of post (and the one about Steve Tucker) is one of the reasons why. I'm a big believer in women's issues and equality, just as I am a big believer in men's issues, particularly health.

Thanks for highlighting the 'other side' of equality time and again. It is nice to come back and read that in fact us males are actually human.

M

December 14, 2010

01:34 PM

Helen G December 14, 2010 12:19 PM

I bet you are a real laugh riot to be around.

If you would like to reread what Sam has written you may find that he is commenting on the sexism displayed by someone who happens to be female and the sexism in her writing is directed towards me. Believe it or not women can be sexist towards men.

If you are so good at picking up "reverse-sexism" I reckon you need to tune your senses. You missed out big time.

I dare you to read it again.

Sarah

December 14, 2010

02:11 PM

Although I think Bernard Keane is a tool, you're a bigger one for that stupid and lazy gag about burns victims. If you can't think of a better funny than that, you're being paid way too much.

cass

December 14, 2010

02:14 PM

I've read a few of Mandy Sayer's books.
She writes - indulgently and wistfully - about her father in Dreamtime Alice. And despite your umbrage, I would have picked her books as having some appeal to you - you both write about a similar Australia. - but that's based solely on my impression of your writing and her writing and I guess we will never know now!

Louis Nowra, her husband - upset a lot of people with his essay on Germaine Greer in the monthly..especially the comment - "Snapped on the set, she looks like a befuddled and exhausted old woman. She reminded me of my demented grandmother who, towards the end of her life, was often in a similarly unruly state.". I believe Mandy Sayer wrote an article in defence of this essay. http://www.themonthly.com.au/louis-nowra

I have no time for soft target self help books, either, and I would feel pretty scathing about a book called 'what women need to know about the inner lives of Men.' who are they pitching that to, anyway? Readers of No Idea?
I might make the same kind of remark as Mandy, but to a friend- as a way of sending up the book - because quite bluntly, I consider it self evident that the inner lives of men are as varied as the the men who experience them. As to facile? anyone who reads knows that a vast amount of excellent books are written by men with rich and complex inner lives.
But then I haven't read the article concerned.

DP

December 14, 2010

02:14 PM

Dude,

What the hell - you just gave her a wider audience than she deserved. Her Google count just peaked!

waysideblue

December 14, 2010

02:26 PM

cringe. yep... women should not get away with this kind of 'humour' when men can't... agreed. portia de generes, I'm narrowing my eyes at you.

writers like mandy are never sufficiently alert to the extent that men are victims of patriarchy too... I bet she had a hens party with penis straws... and is slavishly following Oprah's tourism tour

virginia woolf wrote once, after being denied access to a public library because of her gender, how unpleasant it was to be locked out, but reflected that it is worse, perhaps, to be locked in...

and she said "I read the book of Job last night, I don't think God comes out well in it"

classic

always asking why

December 14, 2010

03:06 PM

i was compelled to respond to this blog, not because i agree either way, moreover, because of the 'state of play' between men and women in the world today.

i firmly believe that for far too long, the accepted status quo of women being viewed as inferior or 'needing to stay in the kitchen' was a bad thing for all.

now, trying to correct the imbalance, the pendulum of acceptance and tolerance has swung back too far the other way and the current lay of the land is no better!

men seem to have become the 'second class citizens' in the world. women now behave like men and, more distressingly, misbehave like men used to.

for years women were requesting that we men "understand their thoughts and feelings", and try to 'get' into their worlds. yet now, its seems that women are happy to brush men off as unthinking, unimaginative, second cousins to neanderthal man!! where is the same understanding and compassion that women sought from us? why aren't they try to 'get' into our world, instead of simply discounting us as useless??

maybe mandy was just trying to be funny, but the social subtext contained in her comments was, is and will continue to be distressing to me, and other like minded men i know.

as always sam, your blogs are well written and i enjoy the way you treat men's issues with the respect they are due. cheers.

Baron Love

December 14, 2010

03:16 PM

Big up from the massif

ab

December 14, 2010

03:16 PM

"I love hanging long turds into cool porcelain after a good coffee.."

You started out well with a good premise. Then you destroyed your credibility. At this point I thought...yes, nothing between the ears.

What is it about Australian men? They compete to be the most ugly, stupid and insensitive and then complain when people don't take them seriously.

I once heard it said that in Australia the worse thing a man can be is a woman. So men surrender all this experience in being alive in a constant competition to not act like a woman/girl. This version of maleness leaves very little. It is no surprise that this guy who was asked what he was thinking about said "nothing." This is often the only safe answer.

Shelby

December 14, 2010

03:26 PM

Me smells cross promotion amongst aussie novelists. Good show old chap. Steve Biddulph can stay in his box. Thanks for introducing me to Mandy.

Helen G

December 14, 2010

03:47 PM

MDecember 14, 2010
01:34 PM
Helen G December 14, 2010 12:19 PM

I bet you are a real laugh riot to be around.

***

Oh, what a surprise! Can't comment without insulting. Not typical for this blog is it?

I'm actually a friggin' ball thanks very much.

I write an acorn and you act like you've been hit on the head with the sky.

My comments were around not finding reverse-sexism empowering for women. I don't think much of women who make sexist comments towards men particularly clever. Comments like hers really p*ss me off as it does nothing for women and just sets us up for more ridicule. Of course, you may pick up that I'm looking at it from a female point of view but that's because I am female. I know what it's like to be on the receiving end of sexist attitudes so I don't see any benefit in returning the favour.

Oh, please excuse me if I'm not here to worship Sam. I expect that the next time some tool on this site makes a generalist claim about all women you'll be the first to go on the attack? I'll stick up for you but it's a good thing I've learnt how to defend myself.

M

December 14, 2010

04:13 PM

Helen G December 14, 2010 03:47 PM

Over-react much?

Matt

December 14, 2010

04:33 PM

Mandy is just a self absorbed latte sipping constipated psuedo-intellectual twat who is trying to carve a career for herself as a social commentator and columnist becuase no one takes her seriously as an author!

I like your fiery spirit Sam, but I am surprised that this one little sentence, albeit insulting and misguided, sparks such fury in you, and not once have you made any comment what so ever on the ‘other Sam’s’ bubble gum blog on this site that does nothing but diminish women and men to one dimensional 1950’s stereotypes. Talk about damaging gender relations!

Thea

December 14, 2010

05:30 PM

@ Little John

Your argument is bogus as about 90% of magazines aimed at men are porn. Come to think of it, your argument is bogus anyway.

Hey Sam, were you working at 111 Pacific Highway, North Sydney during the early 90s.

Some bloke regularly left one of these in the men's toilet, and being so LONG as well as wide girthed, meant that it stayed there the whole day, as no one dared use that cubicle until cleared!

Well done!

cass

December 14, 2010

06:42 PM

erk.. glad I'm not a writer.
JUst read my post back, and wanted to clarify what I wrote.
Mandy Sayer has written quite a lot about her father, especially in her book, dreamtime alice. When I said it was indulgent, I didnt mean self indulgent. I meant that she indulged him, by trying to understand him, and appreciate the good in him, rather (as is far more common in a lot of autobiographical writing)than presenting herself as 'a victim' and laying the blame at his door.
It was a genuinely affectionate and sad description of a man who she obviously cares for very much, but who leaves much to be desired as a Dad.
It was a good read.
Still havent read yours, I'm afraid. It isnt in the library, and it hasn't appeared in the local secondhand shops.

The Schoolmarm

December 14, 2010

07:05 PM

@first time blogger

I've always hated 'the other Sam's' site too, but I assumed this Sam probably wasn't free to comment.

benoit

December 14, 2010

07:33 PM

Helen G .. you are an angry and very boring person .. go away .. accept the blog for what it is and the spirit in which Sams' missives and the responses are offered .. no time in my world for vitriolic people like you .. get over it

hired goon

December 14, 2010

07:42 PM

bad advice - boobs are pretty awesome. I likes em.

Argentmount Black, Esq. - everything this guy said, I agree with.

Helen G - it seems that you use a lot of words to get a very small point across. Having a large vocabulary doesn't mean it must be used all the time. Four paragraphs is hardly an acorn, love.

Matt - someone should send what he said to Mandy as an example of how a lazy, throwaway line can contain wit.

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 14, 2010

08:01 PM

Can you imagine the outrage if the genders where reversed.

"When men ask women what they're thinking, and they reply 'nothing' ,they're really not making it up .There's really not much going on behind those unblinking eyes except the latest gossip magazine rubbish and last week's episode of OPERA."

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 14, 2010

08:58 PM

Gender Pay Gap Reversed for Young in UK

A new report from Britain’s Office for National Statistics has revealed that women in their 20s who work full time now earn more than men of the same age, and for those in their 30s the gap has decreased to less than 3%. For those who work part time, women make more across the board.

Although women’s overrepresentation in universities is one factor, most important has been the decline of private sector wages in comparison to the public sector, which has enjoyed pay increases even during the recession. More than twice as many women as men work in the public sector, and 40% of British working women (and only 15% of men) have public sector jobs. Because public sector jobs are funded by those who earn money in the private sector, this should raise the question of whether men’s private sector wages are artificially low due to the high business taxes needed for all those public jobs for women.

It is starting to become clear that the price of gender equality falls overwhelmingly on men, and that’s not really very equal when you think about it. Essentially, men are being held back and impoverished in order to create an illusion of equality, which is turning out to be very expensive to maintain. This is really what’s wrong with the concept of “equity feminism;” it mandates an unequal burden to achieve some subjectively equal outcome.

Although feminists may cheer the news, it will not be enough for them. They will not stop until women have it better than men in every possible measure of wealth, quality of life and power.

Sam, if we had more burns victims judging beauty contests, that would be a good thing.

Perhaps they could enlighten the audience and participants about the ridiculous nature of focusing on insignificant differences and making a competition about it. Perhaps they could remind us to just be happy to have functioning skin!

cass

December 14, 2010

10:08 PM

actually on the back of her last book is a promotional blurb written by thomas keneally. He's impressed by her.
He's not one of the cabal of snobs etc..?

nickname

December 14, 2010

11:13 PM

this is my second time reading this column. the last time left me drained wondering who reads this and thinks anyone is remotely interested in reading the column or the comments? now here i am doing it.

just wanted to echo the very few comments regarding the phrase "authors acting as book reviewers akin to burns victims judging beauty contests."

who the hell cares what Mandy whatshername said about "men". could you have been any more insensitive to burns victims? like they are a minority so it's ok to use them for tasteless humour but don't dare insult "men". any other minorities you'd like to insult, just because you can? how about Aboriginals? gays? the disabled? the demented?

utterly lazy and hypocritical.

Kel

December 14, 2010

11:57 PM

This is cool. A bit of not much all round turns into a very funny read. Especially love the people who miss irony telling everyone how bad we are at missing irony. I just let my socks and undies get away with that.

major

December 15, 2010

09:03 AM

@First time blogger

Indeed! The other Sam's a bit touchy though. Twice I've tried to comment on the vapidity of her blog posts - constructively but negatively. Both times the comment never appeared.

e1

December 15, 2010

09:04 AM

nickname December 14, 2010 11:13 PM

Hear, hear.

Jack Sprat

December 15, 2010

09:48 AM

nickname

Could I just harness a little of your outrage in defence of the nostril-impaired?

I'm going to sigh myself to sleep tonight. Oh, hang on, I do that every night.

Dan

December 15, 2010

10:36 AM

This is your best line ever Sam.

'hanging long turds into cool porcelain after a good coffee'

Cant beat it.

Shelby

December 15, 2010

10:39 AM

@KARMA MRA MGTOW

"Because public sector jobs are funded by those who earn money in the private sector..."

What? Jeez you're a tool mate. They should change the name of spearhead to dickhead cause that's the type of fellows who frequent that place. I suspect most of you have inadequate and/or impotent spears anyway and that's why you hate the evil wimminz. Ugly black heart.

enno

December 15, 2010

11:06 AM

"Heard of her husband (Louis Nowra), though."

That explains it !

Mandy's experience with the empty minds of men obviously starts pretty close to home.

I have seen almost all of its work and its about 25 hours of my life I could have spent doing better things.

joncitizen

December 15, 2010

11:43 AM

I wondered if Sam was over-reacting when I read this too. I read the original and it is offensive and deserved a bollocking.

“It's satirical irony, stupid" just doesn't fly with me. Mandy’s bitterness isn't leavened with any real humour; it's only funny to those as bitter as her. And the whole point of the article is to criticise a collection of books. If her lines re the dopey male gender are "satirical," then just what is she saying? Feldhan's book is great? Nothing? Nah, don’t think so.

But I wonder if the better angle would have been to just mock the utter absurdity of any kind of attack - or characterisation of any kind - of a gender as a whole. I understand Sam's irritation at the misandrism. I shared it; started comparing "men's" contribution to human ideas compared to "women's" before I caught myself... Once you buy into that silly discourse, 1, you've let the likes of Mandy unload some of her loathing onto you, and 2, you sink to the ridiculously irrational activity of comparing "men" and "women". Better just to laugh it off.

Lulu December 14, 2010
10:29 AM

“Because of course there's only one person who could possibly disagree with you”

Actually there’s quite a collection of people who hate Sam, disagree with everything he says, and yet read and comment every. Single. Day. It’s usually an attack on Sam, sometimes an attack on someone else. They never have anything positive to say. Strange. My guess it’s an attempt to buy some self worth at the expense of others.

MJ

December 15, 2010

11:44 AM

Not an over reaction at all, Sam. You're on the money.

What a person says reveals everything about how the person must feel about himself / herself.

sneakers32

December 15, 2010

12:07 PM

Do you think that she had a word-limit on the article? In any case, it's a bit of a throw-away piece that has somehow tickled your not-very-f#$&%!-funny bone.

Reminds me of Christopher Hitchens claim that women are not funny...I'm getting ulcers just thinking the Sayer article might well have proved it to be true...

Days

December 15, 2010

12:55 PM

(Waaaay off topic)
My man-child gene has not worn off yet, at 45.

I stacked my mountain bike and split my knee open. Fortunately no structural damage was done (medical term du-jour: The Knee Capsule was not penetrated), but it was gashed to the bone. Off to see the surgeon for some scrubbage under general anaesthetic.

Back at home after a day of being on the endone, which like most medical opiates has the side-effect of binding up the digestive system.

The first, erm, offload since then was awesome.

I'm just sayin.

JP

December 15, 2010

01:23 PM

Thats the way.

The next thing for equality in the media is... (drum role)... advertising household products without making men look like morons - or dependent on there spouses for mothering because 'they're just children really'.

Surely that one's passed its use by date?

enno

December 15, 2010

01:25 PM

Todays crazy news.

Video of US Navy testing new electromagnetic cannon. This device uses enough electricity to power a small town for a year.

The video is preceded by an NSW Government paid advertisement asking people to turn off electrical devices to save power and minimise "carbon pollution".

Why bother ?

S&M

December 15, 2010

01:46 PM

Shelby
December 15, 2010 10:39 AM

So the research that he sourced is wrong? Evidence please. Provide your source material so we can make up our own minds.

Shelby, be careful, you are very close to out and out stating you hate men, especially those who stand up for themselves.

Yobsta

December 15, 2010

01:54 PM

Men may be closer to neanderthal than women,but it is women who pressure others to wear tight skirts that restrict movement, high heel shoes that creates back and feet/ankle problems for years to come, to spend massive amounts of $$$ on hair and cosmetics. Most men don't care about all of that, they just look for people who they can relate to. The beuty industry relies on pressure from other women, not men. We men are so stupid

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 15, 2010

01:56 PM

* Shelby
* December 15, 2010
* 10:39 AM

Honey go and live in North Korea for a while and get back in a year or two.

Let's see how that works out for you.

JP

December 15, 2010

01:59 PM

irony bypass
December 14, 201009:48 AM

" But a Bryce Courtenay is probably your idea of a deep, weighty tome."

Pfft!
So what if it is - who made you a benchmark?
Live your life and get over yourself.
Theres plenty of room for everyone - no need to attack. What are you gaining?

So much effort into putting someone down - with your ego.

Ego defending Ego defending Ego.

You're arguing with yourself.

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 15, 2010

02:07 PM

* Shelby
* December 15, 2010
* 10:39 AM

That projection says more about you than anyone else.

Keep up the good work Shelby, teenage like temper tantrums show the young guys what they are against with many, if not most western females.

Guys if a women you are dating or contemplating dating goes on with this crap dump her - no if's no but's just do it.

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 15, 2010

02:14 PM

Shelby December 15, 2010 10:39 AM

Tool or not Karma and the link he posted are correct.

Wian

December 15, 2010

02:25 PM

Is *every* published item these days premised around product placement ? The other Sam is regurgitating WarneGate product. Here we have MandyGate product (though infinitly better written). Seeing as this may get published, I'd better baseline here and now: NikeCokeIntelOprahMyFace.

Chris Kerr

December 15, 2010

02:57 PM

Exactly Sam.

Its hard to convince a women that you want to listen to them, that you want to support them and you will be there for them because the typical stereotype is that we are simply incapable of that kind of behaviour. I'll profess like yourself, I like the destroy a bowl and enjoy more than a few snorts, but then as much as some women can be quite unfeminine in some respects, that doesn't apply to them as a whole. I can never profess to solve a womens problems but I will certain try help were I can. Sometimes listening is all I can do. In the quite moments, I would wonder what kind of husband Mandy has, however I wont be having a quiet moment anytime soon.

Oh for heaven's sake! There are a lot of lost boys out there. (Just bought the book as a Christmas gift Sam, for me... a woman way past hotness but always interested in the human animal from a sociological perspective.)Firstly I couldn't believe that the article M Sayer wrote was even published as it went absolutely nowhere and she had no conclusion. Secondly it's a weird thing for 'Carol'to be up in arms about. So what? Mildly amusing comment about the inner lives of men, not hugely offensive. Not many women have inner lives that they examine either but people get by, so she was just making up for years of blonde jokes (which can be funny). And finally, why would sam de brito react??? And all your acolytes have come out of the cupboard, including good ol boy Troglodyte. (I hasten to add, I guess he is actually young but it's just a figure of speech.)

mags

December 15, 2010

07:45 PM

@ Chris Kerr

This is the kind of husband Mandy has. He wrote a very good play called Cosi which was a great little film. But he wrote a nasty piece on Germaine Greer whose contribution to the creation of a more interesting world I will defend till the day I die.

Bit surprised by your caustic appraisal of Mandy Sayer. First of all I'm a loyal follower of your blog; I admire your honesty and tend to agree with your well-formed opinion on most things. The reason why I feel I should say something about this piece Sam is I’m not a big fan of how you ‘lost the plot’ at the end.

Your argument, I understand and agree with, I just don’t see why you took the time to deliver such a cutting personal rebuttal to an individual who yes should know better, but probably just couldn’t be assed using her brain for a few hours to review a book she hasn’t even read.

She went for the lowest common denominator, a knee jerk generalization that would get a chuckle from women and a ‘I don’t give a sh!t’ from any man that knows what he’s about, and that his world involves more than just ‘cricket scores and Rake’. The thing is Sam you are obviously one of those men, but you have taken the time not only to piss on her ridiculous appraisal of a book, but also on her. Address the argument, not the individual making it, and you’ll stay on the high road that you normally travel. This is what leaves people thinking about what you’ve written long after they have read one of your articles.

Mandy Sayer hasn’t done anything to gender relations. She was lazy at best, and if she believes her words, a fool at worst. Point, this post left me thinking you have just pissed on her rather than her argument. And ‘I don’t give a sh!t' about MandySayer.

Tiny

December 16, 2010

11:11 AM

@ShelbyDecember 15, 2010
10:39 AM
Shelby,
THe difference between you and Karma? Karma attacked what he see's an an unjust system. You just attacked HIM.

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 16, 2010

02:14 PM

* Tiny
* December 16, 2010
* 11:11 AM

Shelby really told me!

HA!! :):):)

.................................

* NG
* December 16, 2010
* 03:37 AM

All men are liars v Mandy Sayer… and no winner.

All men are liars v the way men are treated in the media. would be more accurate

You knew that all along NG....to say otherwise would be very disingenuous.

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 16, 2010

03:34 PM

AVfM Release

A federal class-action lawsuit filed on December 13th accuses the U.S. Department of Education and N.Y. State Regents of violating the Establishment Clause of the Constitution. The Regents require that Columbia University and other colleges in New York operate in accordance with the modern-day religion “Feminism,” and both the Regents and U.S. Department of Education partially finance Columbia’s Institute for Research on Women and Gender Studies, which proselytizes the belief-system Feminism.

The U.S. Supreme Court and five federal courts of appeals do not require a god-centered belief-system in order to forbid the aiding of religion by federal or state governments. Legally, religion exists when moral and ethical precepts are held with the strength of traditional religious convictions.

N.Y. City attorney Roy Den Hollander brought the action after the U.S. Second Circuit Court of Appeals threw out his prior lawsuit alleging thatColumbia discriminated against men by only having a Women’s Studies program. In that case, the Second Circuit ruled that any harm caused men by the lack of a Men’s Studies program was “speculative.” Strange that the federal courts don’t say the same about the lack of a girls’ sports team when a college only has a guys’ team. Apparently the law is adjudicated one way under Title IX for girls and another way for guys.

The Second Circuit also dismissed the prior case claim that N.Y. and the U.S. aided the religion Feminism because the plaintiff did not show the obvious—that he has taxpayer status under the law.

In this second suit, Den Hollander states the obvious—four times—and provides an abundance of plausible allegations that Feminism is a religion and is promoted and financed by the State....

Tinto rio

December 16, 2010

04:35 PM

' * Shelby
* December 15, 2010
* 10:39 AM

@KARMA MRA MGTOW

"Because public sector jobs are funded by those who earn money in the private sector..."

What? Jeez you're a tool mate. They should change the name of spearhead to dickhead cause that's the type of fellows who frequent that place. I suspect most of you have inadequate and/or impotent spears anyway and that's why you hate the evil wimminz. Ugly black heart.'

Mining tax anyone?

Shink for men

December 16, 2010

09:12 PM

post 1/2

The first Shrink4Men was published by Dr Tara J. Palmatier, PsyD on January 12, 2009. Dr Palmatier began Shrink4Men because she recognized that men who are in abusive relationships in which the perpetrator is a woman do not have the same support resources as their female counterparts. Much of society and support organizations refuse to recognize that men compromise approximately 50% of relational abuse targets or, worse yet, ridicule men who seek help for this reason.

Many men in relationships with abusive women don’t even recognize that what they’re experiencing from their nearest and dearest is abuse. There are many double standards in our society when it come to what is acceptable behavior for men and what is acceptable behavior for women.

The philosophy of Shrink4Men is as follows:

* Abuse is unacceptable from either sex.
* Abuse is unacceptable even when the perpetrator has a personality disorder or other mental illness.
* Tolerating abuse from your wife or girlfriend doesn’t make you a good guy; it makes you a victim. If you remain in the relationship or don’t take steps to stop the abuse once you recognize you’re being abused, manipulated, controlled or terrorized you are enabling your own mistreatment.
* Ending a relationship or a marriage in which you’re actively being emotionally and/or physically abused doesn’t make you a “bad guy”—even if you have children.
* Double standards and inequities in relationships are unhealthy and unacceptable. You shouldn’t have to “take it” or shoulder the entire financial burden because you’re a man.
* Both partners’ needs and feelings are equally important. Both partners come first in a relationship. Both partners need to compromise.

Shrink for men

December 16, 2010

09:13 PM

post 2/2

* Allowing yourself to be devalued in a relationship is not okay. Relationships should ultimately be a source of comfort and support not a series of endless hostilities, psychological castration, no-win situations, hoop jumping, emotional withdrawal, transactions and resignation.

When a man is abusive, he’s designated a jerk and we encourage his wife or girlfriend to end the relationship. Abusive men are publicly humiliated, vilified and often imprisoned for their violent behavior. When a woman is abusive, we advise her male target that she’s just emotional, she was abused as child, so he needs to be patient and sensitive to her feelings and stick with her no matter the personal cost. When a woman is violent toward a man in the context of an intimate relationship, it’s still the man who usually gets carted off to jail even when he’s the one with the cuts and bruises.

Dr Tara J. Palmatier is in no way minimizing the legitimate abuse many women suffer in their intimate relationships from men. She is, however, trying to shine the spotlight on the abuse suffered by men who are targets of their female intimate partners and exes, which is just as real and just as painful, if not worse, due to the lack of ready social and personal support.

My son, years ago, was “jacked” for his sports jacket by five guys, all under the age of sixteen One of them had a handgun. I tracked them down within 30 minutes of the incident. [I] took the gun from them and took everyone of them home to their parents.

Not one of them had a father.

Not one of the mothers wanted to hear what had happened. Everyone of those guys became instantly polite to me whenever I saw them and they always said hello.

Every one of them were starving for male attention.

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 17, 2010

12:00 PM

NG @ December 16, 2010 03:37 AM

Sam is just drawing attention to the man/boy bashing going on in todays society.

NG your puerile attempt at diminishing his post only proves what Sam is saying.

Jessica Valenti: America should model rape laws after Sweden's -- where some legal experts want to make sex a presumptive crime whenever a woman cries rape.

Jessica Valenti's take on the Assange sex case in last Sunday'sWashington Post was more of the same old same old, a mish-mash of the usual feminist victim blather about America's supposed tolerance of rape.

But then, just as we are nodding off, Valenti tosses a bucket of ice water on us by -- it seemed to me (you read it and decide for yourself) -- at least tacitly endorsing what would be the most unjust, inhumane, morally grotesque law in our entire jurisprudence. Read carefully what she says:

". . . we should look to [Swedish rape laws] as a potential model for our own legislation.

"In fact, some activists and legal experts in Sweden want to change the law there so that the burden of proof is on the accused; the alleged rapist would have to show that he got consent, instead of the victim having to prove that she didn't give it."

Valenti, who, by the way, is not above resorting to the cheap feminist trick of calling a rape accuser "the victim" (which means, of course, that the accused must be a "rapist"), seems to at least tacitly endorse turning the most fundamental act of intimacy, an act that has been performed countless times every minute of every day of every year since the beginning of time the world over, into a presumed felony.

Read that again. It's not hyperbole. Under the plan proposed by some Swedish legal experts once a woman cries "rape,"

Read my response KARMA and you'll note 'I understand and agree with your argument' is mentioned, meaning the 'man/boy bashing' that you refer to. If you understand what I have said then you'd realize it's not a 'puerile attempt to diminish his post', just a call for Sam to stay on the high road of pulling apart arguments rather than stupid individuals. Unfortunately you appear to be one of these individuals.

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 18, 2010

03:14 PM

* NG
* December 18, 2010
* 03:25 AM

Maybe I am stupid, maybe not.

Your response to my post by hypocritically using the tactics you admonish says it all.

KARMA MRA MGTOW

December 18, 2010

03:28 PM

' * NG
* December 18, 2010
* 03:25 AM

' just a call for Sam to stay on the high road of pulling apart arguments rather than stupid individuals.

then

Unfortunately you appear to be one of these individuals.'

.....like to anyone top that exercise in impeccable logic....

HA!

NG,I hope you are not male.

Stormy

December 18, 2010

09:30 PM

KARMA MRA MGTOW
December 18, 201003:28 PM
"NG,I hope you are not male"

I had a look at your "Spearhead" nonsense. What a pack of whingy whiny so-called blokes must there be in the world. Oh those horrible women. Fair dinkum, why don't you all just find a desert island somewhere and go and rub lotion on each other?

I don't agree with everything that Shelby says on this blog (hiya Shelbs!) but if I had the choice of being stuck on a desert island with her, you, or the bubonic plague, you're number 3.

tommy tom

January 06, 2011

10:27 PM

Maybe some guys do fit Mandy's stereotype. But there not the types that read this blog, that I would care to hang out with, or that a smart woman would want to find. If she believes the stereotype it is her loss.

NG

January 17, 2011

11:09 AM

KARMA,

Read again what I have said, and you will notice that I call for Sam to stay on the high road. As I don't have one of the most popular blogs in the country I can stay on whatever road I see fit. And that road leads me to believe that you're a massive wanker. Most of your previous contributions to this blog stand as references to this claim.

KARMA MRA MGTOW

January 23, 2011

05:08 PM

'* NG
* January 17, 2011
* 11:09 AM

As I don't have one of the most popular blogs in the country I can stay on whatever road I see fit.'

A rather interesting take on personal responsibly, and a little more then hypocritical.

When you grow up you might understand leading by example might just be the go, not name calling or claiming you can - are entitled - to have lower personnel standards than Sam because his blog is well read.

Anna

January 27, 2011

10:11 PM

How can you complain about misandry because of a few wry, poorly chosen words and then proudly boast that you use porn, one of the most pervasive and virulently sexist, mysoginist, racist, and dehumanising materials on the planet?

It's another irony that Sayer's biographies are filled with stories of her warmth, care and compassion for often selfish, indulgent and sometimes violent men who probably didn't deserve it. It's your loss that you will never read them. Her writing is stunning, and filled with an honesty and humanity that is sadly lacking in your preferred 'reading materials'.

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