I think the real story here is that in England you will find a pub open for 80+ years, unlike here in the US where a pub old than 10 years either moves to a brand new building, goes out of business, or gets sold off and changes names...

CeroX:I think the real story here is that in England you will find a pub open for 80+ years, unlike here in the US where a pub old than 10 years either moves to a brand new building, goes out of business, or gets sold off and changes names...

Did you read the story? This pub has been open for 700 years. People have been drinking there longer than we've been a country.

CeroX:I think the real story here is that in England you will find a pub open for 80+ years, unlike here in the US where a pub old than 10 years either moves to a brand new building, goes out of business, or gets sold off and changes names...

digitalrain:CeroX: I think the real story here is that in England you will find a pub open for 80+ years, unlike here in the US where a pub old than 10 years either moves to a brand new building, goes out of business, or gets sold off and changes names...

We have a few old timers here in the US.

Bell in Hand Tavern - Boston, MA - est. 1795

McSorley's Alehouse - NYC - est. 1854

Old Ebbitt Grill - DC - est. 1856

White Horse Tavern - Newport, RI - est. 1673

Jessop's Tavern - New Castle, DE - est. 1724

There are more, but you get the idea.

Well here in Knoxville all the Antique bars that had been open since like the 1800s except for prohibition(or been speakeasies during prohibition) have closed since the economy tanked in '08.

Oldiron_79:digitalrain: CeroX: I think the real story here is that in England you will find a pub open for 80+ years, unlike here in the US where a pub old than 10 years either moves to a brand new building, goes out of business, or gets sold off and changes names...

We have a few old timers here in the US.

Bell in Hand Tavern - Boston, MA - est. 1795

McSorley's Alehouse - NYC - est. 1854

Old Ebbitt Grill - DC - est. 1856

White Horse Tavern - Newport, RI - est. 1673

Jessop's Tavern - New Castle, DE - est. 1724

There are more, but you get the idea.

Well here in Knoxville all the Antique bars that had been open since like the 1800s except for prohibition(or been speakeasies during prohibition) have closed since the economy tanked in '08.

Oldiron_79:Well here in Knoxville all the Antique bars that had been open since like the 1800s except for prohibition(or been speakeasies during prohibition) have closed since the economy tanked in '08.

LonMead:Oldiron_79:Well here in Knoxville all the Antique bars that had been open since like the 1800s except for prohibition(or been speakeasies during prohibition) have closed since the economy tanked in '08.

Oldiron_79:LonMead: Oldiron_79:Well here in Knoxville all the Antique bars that had been open since like the 1800s except for prohibition(or been speakeasies during prohibition) have closed since the economy tanked in '08.

No, not Patrick Sullivan's!

Many a fond memory of falling off the barstools there...

Yes, as well as some of the other ye olde bars.

I mean there are some bars in ye olde buildings but not ones that have been there like as long as the building like Patrick Sullivan's

digitalrain:Oldiron_79: digitalrain: CeroX: I think the real story here is that in England you will find a pub open for 80+ years, unlike here in the US where a pub old than 10 years either moves to a brand new building, goes out of business, or gets sold off and changes names...

We have a few old timers here in the US.

Bell in Hand Tavern - Boston, MA - est. 1795

McSorley's Alehouse - NYC - est. 1854

Old Ebbitt Grill - DC - est. 1856

White Horse Tavern - Newport, RI - est. 1673

Jessop's Tavern - New Castle, DE - est. 1724

There are more, but you get the idea.

Well here in Knoxville all the Antique bars that had been open since like the 1800s except for prohibition(or been speakeasies during prohibition) have closed since the economy tanked in '08.

digitalrain:CeroX: I think the real story here is that in England you will find a pub open for 80+ years, unlike here in the US where a pub old than 10 years either moves to a brand new building, goes out of business, or gets sold off and changes names...

When I was a kid there was this old woman called Weird Annie who lived alone in a big, tumble-down house built by her parents in more prosperous times. She was 95 and still hitch-hiking to the Canadian Legion to drink and party.

CeroX:I think the real story here is that in England you will find a pub open for 80+ years, unlike here in the US where a pub old than 10 years either moves to a brand new building, goes out of business, or gets sold off and changes names...

Plenty of real old ones here in New Orleans. But, yeah, in more modernized cities- I get what you're saying.

Average age at death in my family tree (now 36,000 strong) is about 57 but that is because 1) there was high infant and juvenile mortality in the past; and 2) I have pushed back most branches into the early 1600s when adult mortality was considerably higher due to war and plague.

Most of the adults who made it through the various dangers of youth lived into their 70s, 80s or 90s. I have a smattering of centenarians, but many of them are the result of mistaken identity--their life spans include parents, uncles, aunts, or others of the same name from the same locality who are accidentally confused.

In some cases census records show the same families with different ages, some varying by as much as three years. People were vain enough to add or subtract a few years according to their personal occasions and errors were no doubt made, and other errors were made.

Quite a few people have multiple birth or death dates in various other sources, making the possibility of further confusion and error likely. But all in all, 57 is probably a very good estimate and given the number of people in my "survey", I would be confident of this result within a couple of percent.

The accuracy of polls depends more on the number of people polled than on the number of people in the total population (within reason). Taking a poll of 1,500 Americans (out of 310 million, say) is more likely to produce accurate results than polling 100 people out of a thousand. Odd, but that's the way it works.

In principle, you could have equally accurate results from polling 3 people in a group of 10 as from polling 3 people in the whole population of America. Imagine, for example, that the people in both cases are divided 50-50. Well, you are just as likely or unlikely to get two out of three for either side in a population of 10 people as in a population of 300 million. There is one chance of three yeas, one chance of three nays, and the other six results will be 1:2 or 2:1. See how that works?

Well, my 36,000 ancestors (and a some non-relations added on speculation) are as good a poll as you could wish for, and much better than most of the surveys you read about in the news.

They aren't exactly a scientific poll because the data has some bias in time, space, social standing, etc., but 57 is a very good guess. In fact, when social security was first implemented, the life expectancy of Americans at the time of application (and Canadians and so forth) was well under 65. Most of the recipients died very shortly after receiving their first social security cheque. This is fair enough, however, since those early recipients didn't pay anything into the program. Those who did live long lives were carried by their children and grandchildren and often were better off in retirement than they were when they worked.