So, your argument is that companies like Apple and Dell rip you off. Well, depends how you look at it, but of course you are going to get a cheaper computer if you build it yourself.

Firstly, you think Apple is shit because of the 10% market share? Funny, they are making ground on windows every year, and the rate of increase is increasing. How many computers run design CAD? Less than 1%. So obviously by your logic, design/CAD is crap. Know we all know how stupid that is for an argument, but keep it up if you like.

Market share is important, it CAN be a good judge of market acceptance. It can also just be a good example of Apple vs Microsoft's history. Which lets face it, in sales figures, has favoured Microsoft.

Ultimately, though, you argument is flawed. You dismiss Dell, while at the same time failing to recognise that most of the 90% windows machines you talk about, are actually Dell or similar beige boxes, and neither 'maximum power computing' machines, or anything worth trumpeting about.

Skulltrail, by market share, isn't exactly anything to be proud of. You seem to extrapolating the PC elite, over the entire market share. A simple look at Valve's surveys, and the fact that that represents the 'high end' of PC computing, shows you where the real 'strength' of that 90% market share resides:

Integrated Graphics. Single Core Celerons.

By your market-share argument, THAT is what atomic would be reviewing.

Checking in from South East Asia (Central Malaysia, currently). I've just looked at this thread and had a good think about it all.

Looks like the community consensus is that we'll have a pretty cool Apple/Mac article to look forward to. I've taken a lot of ideas onboard from all of you that have suggested what you'd like to see. Thanks for the input!

Not so easy I'm afraid, skulltrail = 4x dimm slots that means you'll need 4x 8gb dimms to reach 32gb. Which is impossible for $2.5k at this point in time, your looking at a considerable expense for 8gb dimms. The maximum you could get out of skull trail is 16gb, but even then your looking at 4gb dimms to get the job done, which is more expensive than 2gb dimms. Cheapest i can find 16gb [4x4gb] of ddr2 800 fb-dimm ecc = $3500.

1. I hardly think the handfull of antagonisers that have responded to this thread make up the community consensus. 2. For anyone with a stable mind that has gone through the links and posts carefully, the only conclusion is to NOT buy a crapple, therefore making the proposed article even less relevant than 8%. 3. Publishing a significant mac article would be as crazy as this thread, with every claim thoughtfully and logically reputed, therefore demising the reputation of it's contributers even fruther. 4. I think your bluffing and don't for a moment believe David would waste the ink or the thinking time.

5. If something totally profound and ridiculous happens and the said article does slip by David's good senses can you please make it into a slip out flyer type format and call it "Sorbent" so I can simply shake it over a garbage bin and be done with it. 6. It better not be published in the overclocking issue, or you'll be wearing more than this trivial battle, I will be announcing full scale atomic war on your bitch asses!!!

Quote by jennyb I will be announcing full scale atomic war on your bitch asses!!!

Now there's something to look forward too, what have you got planned? Start your own magazine, get 200 of your mates to blast the mac section with useless spam? Hunger strike, i think should go on a hunger strike if they print the article.

Quote by jennyb6. It better not be published in the overclocking issue, or you'll be wearing more than this trivial battle, I will be announcing full scale atomic war on your bitch asses!!! And what if I decided to retract my overclocking article in preference of the Mac one? ;)

Mozes I did make a note of the mobo. Other boards using the cheaper x5400 series cpus (same as the crapple config) come in less than $700 and you save a couple of hundred on the cpu's. Re: -dual socket mobo=~$700 (D5400XS has max 16GB RAM)

Either which way, yes you do save $12,000. Oh and remember that's for a top of the line workstation, remember PC components also release a can of viscious WHOOPASS on everything in between.

Tinbane.....umm have you been reading this thread at all or do you just pop in occasionally for a digg? I suggest you start from the start with a pen and notepad and follow the posts and links.very.slowly.and.thoroughly.if.you.want.to.understand.it.

Oh Tinbrane, I knew long ago you wern’t the sharpest pencil in the case and that’s why I asked you to use my template. You want a response sure no problem:

“So, your argument is that companies like Apple and Dell rip you off. Well, depends how you look at it, but of course you are going to get a cheaper computer if you build it yourself.”

There’s only one way to look at it tinbrane, are you getting value or not. If you look at mozes’ example you save over $10,000.00 by NOT buying a crapple. Even at the $3,000 level you can save over $1000 and if you dump the ECC almost $2000. Bwahahahaha and we’re only talking about something at the 3K level.

“Firstly, you think Apple is shit because of the 10% market share? Funny, they are making ground on windows every year, and the rate of increase is increasing. How many computers run design CAD? Less than 1%. So obviously by your logic, design/CAD is crap. Know we all know how stupid that is for an argument, but keep it up if you like.”

From wiki:

“The company was established in Cupertino, California on April 1, 1976, and incorporated January 3, 1977,[4] was known as "Apple Computer, Inc." for its first 30 years.”

Wow Tinbrane thats one hell of a compelling arguement you have there, making ground on windows every year, so you think LESS than 10% in 32 years is making ground? Even though I have said more than once I’m not interested in the OS debate, you seem too demented to remember but just so you know Microsoft have been around for the same amount of time and have captured over 90% of the market. Not only that they have had the task of trying to make thousands of various components work together from thousands of different vendors, unlike lameass crapple which only ever had limited hardware options in its assembly and even then struggled to put out a reliable machine.

To sum it up:

Microsoft 32 years-90% of users adopt and stick with the PC Platform. That’s over 9 times more customers than crapple. Crapple 32 years –Less than 10% even after the move to Intel and PC component suppliers. Only a hardcore tardbucket would be impressed with crapples performance.

READ THIS TINBRANE AND UNDERSTAND WHY I DON’T RESPOND TO YOU:

You are in fact so stupid tinbrane that you can’t even remember we had this same argument on page 5 of this debate when you said:

“The reason that Apple is selling so well, in industry and the public, is that the price has come down to near-parity with equivalent competition.” And i replied with: “They are NOT selling so well, like I said before they have less than 10% market share in around 30 years of business. Maybe that's your standard for success.....bwahahahahaahhahahahahahahahahaha”

So tinbrane why keep bringing up the same dribble? Why can’t you even remember what you were arguing about only 2 pages ago? Hmm, one could speculate....... CAD is simply an example for god’s sake. Stop putting words into people’s mouths you pinhead.

“Market share is important, it CAN be a good judge of market acceptance. It can also just be a good example of Apple vs Microsoft's history. Which let’s face it, in sales figures, has favoured Microsoft”

Wow tinbrane you actually admitted something rather than simply arguing a point like a dumbass.

“Ultimately, though, you argument is flawed. You dismiss Dell, while at the same time failing to recognise that most of the 90% windows machines you talk about, are actually Dell or similar beige boxes, and neither 'maximum power computing' machines, or anything worth trumpeting about”

Well I’d say that the majority of computers are bought from the local computer vendors mixing and array of components or online with no badge other than maybe the shops, but I can’t believe DELL or similar have 90% of the PC market.

Also why is my argument flawed? What do I care about market share? I want good value components to run the programs I want to run, PC components give me that. Who cares what components the majority of computers have in them, I pick the stuff I need for my applications. Once again your making shit up.

“Skulltrail, by market share, isn't exactly anything to be proud of. You seem to extrapolating the PC elite, over the entire market share.”

Tinbrane that was a sample board I used when mozes brought up the mac pro. See thats why I said you should use my template, your too stupid to even follow the sequence of the conversation that’s been happening in this thread. At no other time have I mentioned the skulltrail board.

“If you can't address the issues other people raise, there is no shame in admitting it.”

Your really are super stupid. I have addressed the links posted by others in this thread heavily flawed as they all were. I cannot address something as subjective as “I like macs” or “macs are reliable” because in the opinions of 90% of computer users, people like PC’s and in my personal opinion my PC computer is more than reliable, it’s rock solid under full load for hours.

“So far, I've asked you to show me a single equivalent to the midrange imac. You've failed to do that. I'll just assume you don't really want to address any of the other issues, shall I?”

I am one person tinbrane debating against an army of drones dumbest of all which is you. I don’t have time to spec out shit for tards, even though I cant imagine a crapple beating a PC in anything.

“Following your logic nobody should buy a house, they should build it themselves and save a packet.”

Man you really are a vegetable. You think that’s an analogy relevant to this debate do you? Centrecom’s standard build price is $75. You pick your components, pay an extra $75 and you get a working computer. Can you follow that tinbrane?

The funniest and most amazing thing you have said to me tinbrane is this:

“I work for a company that supports IT for windows, unix and macintosh computers, although we are more specialised in the macintosh area.”

I can’t believe you actually have a job and in IT for god’s sake!!!! No wonder we’re suffering a skills shortage and getting people in on 457 visa’s. You remind me of a cartoon I saw once where the IT guy sees smoke coming out of a PSU and changes the mouse, problem is he gets tangled up in the mouse cord and hangs himself from a table that's 2 feet off the ground. That guy was you wasn't it tinbrane? Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahaha

I can’t deal with you tinbrane, your a simpleton and you do my head in with your baseless bullshit. From now on you will referred to my easy to use template.

Quote by jennybOh Tinbrane, I knew long ago you wern’t the sharpest pencil in the case.

You are in fact so stupid tinbrane that you can’t even remember we had this same argument on page 5 of this debate

Your really are super stupid.

I am one person tinbrane debating against an army of drones dumbest of all which is you. I don’t have time to spec out shit for tards, even though I cant imagine a crapple beating a PC in anything.

Man you really are a vegetable.

Can you follow that tinbrane?

I can’t deal with you tinbrane, your a simpleton and you do my head in with your baseless bullshit. From now on you will referred to my easy to use template. From the FAQ:

1. Personal attacks. Criticise the idea, not the person. "You are wrong" is not a personal attack. "You are wrong because you are an idiot" is. We certainly encourage healthy and robust debate, but let’s not go overboard, folks.

3. Trolling. Deliberately posting inflammatory comments just to upset someone or attract an aggressive response is lame and uncool. It’s pretty obvious to all concerned when someone is baiting traps just so they can score points – again, this is very much a judgement call, but trust that you will be dealt with eventually. If not by a mod in an official capacity, then surely by the community as they ignore your sorry arse.

4. Spamming. Please do not flood the site with useless content, or empty, repetitive posts. Or empty, repetitive posts. Or empty, repetitive posts. Or empty, repetitive posts.

Can you follow that jenny? There IS a difference between attacking the person's idea, and the person themselves. In the end it boils down to just how much you need to learn about forum etiquette.

Poor showing, people might have actually listened to you, had you not resorted to name-calling.

----- Minister of Technology

Quote by ShikimaruTheFrunj doesn't guess, when he forms words with his lips, the world will Warp and change to do his bidding.

Quote by jennyb1. I hardly think the handfull of antagonisers that have responded to this thread make up the community consensus. 2. For anyone with a stable mind that has gone through the links and posts carefully, the only conclusion is to NOT buy a crapple, therefore making the proposed article even less relevant than 8%. 3. Publishing a significant mac article would be as crazy as this thread, with every claim thoughtfully and logically reputed, therefore demising the reputation of it's contributers even fruther. 4. I think your bluffing and don't for a moment believe David would waste the ink or the thinking time.

5. If something totally profound and ridiculous happens and the said article does slip by David's good senses can you please make it into a slip out flyer type format and call it "Sorbent" so I can simply shake it over a garbage bin and be done with it. 6. It better not be published in the overclocking issue, or you'll be wearing more than this trivial battle, I will be announcing full scale atomic war on your bitch asses!!!

Jenny.

I don't usually get too involved in this kind of thing with users and I like to stay emotionally detached from such discussion, but I have this to say to you.

1. Way over the line. Really over the line. You didn't just cross it. You threw up all over it. You've made threats, attempted to ridicule the magazine, the contriubutors and the over all value. If it were in a respectful, constructive way, I'd be ok with that. But it isn't. Not cool.

2. I don't want you to be banned for something like this and I'd like to think you could reconsider your viewpoint, or at very least, be more open to the opinions of the community. If you cannot be, maybe this isn't the right place for you.

Please, I am asking you nicely if you can just cool it, take a look at it from a different perspective and maybe just chill a bit on your Apple war.

We are fond of ALL things computing at Atomic, not just one aspect of the computing world. We live, inhale and eat computing, in every way, even if it is Apple infused.

Again, I don't want to see you thrown overboard for this, or left with a bitter taste in your mouth, simply because you couldn't agree that others see the world a bit differently.

I won't ask you again. Feel free to respond if you wish, but I won't entertain any rude, inflamatory or inappropriate remarks against myself, the mag or the community. If you can simply say you don't like Mac's, leave it at that...and so be it, cool. All cool. Nobody will have a problem with this in the slightest. You are after all, entitled to your opinions!

The mods have been informed of your actions. It is ultimately up to them how to handle this. I want to see you happy here. Not thrown out.

CAD was an example. You were the one who extrapolated that example over all computing.

What do you care about market share? You were the one who brought it up. I never said Apple's market share was growing over the past 32 years. It's been growing since about 2002. In 1997 they hit rock bottom, and were nearly bankrupted.

The $75 centrecom build gives you a global warranty does it? That's funny, every time I've gone to centrecom, I've found them totally devoid of computer knowledge. Mind you, that's only based on two victorian stores.

You are amazed I work in IT? I'm amazed that you are apparently an adult. The difference is, I know that is just based on how you come across in this thread.

I don't get it, i really don't get it, why someone puts so much passion into hating something so much, imagine what could be achieved if that passions was put into more constructive pursuits. With that all i can say is I'm glad i will not be anywhere close by when jennyb opens up atomic to see your article zebra.