What you don't seem to understand or differentiate is between what islam teaches and who or what someone is.

You can't differentiate between an afghan, a pakistani, a sunni, or a shia, or this group or that group, or this race or that race. All you think is "hey his name is muhammad, her name is fatima, his name is jameel, her name is aisha" and you think MOZZLEMZZZ.

It seems whenever some single act of something happens no matter how construed the information is, Islam goes on trial

Now whether you realize if it was one person or another person claiming of this group or that race, you can't differentiate between islam and a 'person'.

If a bunch of rabbis traffic palestinian organs. Does that mean it's judaism and all jews that go on trial in public media? Yes more than 50 rabbis have been caught across europe and america trafficking palestinian organs. Killing them palestinians in palestine, taking their dead body's organs.

Muhammad (pbuh) said knowledge is mandatory upon every muslim. It is fard. It is mandatory/prescribed in the absolute that we seek knowledge. Knowledge of our religion then knowledge of the world.

Quote

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "The seeking of knowledge is obligatory for every Muslim." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 74

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: “One who treads a path in search of knowledge has his path to Paradise made easy by God…” - Riyadh us-Saleheen, 245

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "A servant of God will remain standing on the Day of Judgment until he is questioned about his (time on earth) and how he used it; about his knowledge and how he utilized it; about his wealth and from where he acquired it and in what (activities) he spent it; and about his body and how he used it." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 148

The Prophet also said: "Knowledge from which no benefit is derived is like a treasure out of which nothing is spent in the cause of God." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 108

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "God, His angels and all those in Heavens and on Earth, even ants in their hills and fish in the water, call down blessings on those who instruct others in beneficial knowledge." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 422

The Prophet also said: "Acquire knowledge and impart it to the people." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 107

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "If anyone travels on a road in search of knowledge, God will cause him to travel on one of the roads of Paradise. The angels will lower their wings in their great pleasure with one who seeks knowledge. The inhabitants of the heavens and the Earth and (even) the fish in the deep waters will ask forgiveness for the learned man. The superiority of the learned over the devout is like that of the moon, on the night when it is full, over the rest of the stars. The learned are the heirs of the Prophets, and the Prophets leave (no monetary inheritance), they leave only knowledge, and he who takes it takes an abundant portion. - Sunan of Abu-Dawood, Hadith 1631

It's no different than when some ramadan indian hindu or pakistani 'muslim' or nigerian christian throws acid on a woman's face.

ignorant people that follow tribal cultural beliefs and practices.

Islam forbids hitting of the face even. Imagine what kind of thing these people are doing.

Muhammad (pbuh) said anyone who tortures someone in this world. God will torture them in the next.

So of course you do not want to ascertain the truth about Islam. You jus twant to spread misinformation and hatred. You are only making yourselves look like fools.

Even when you people use the world 'taliban' do you even know who the taliban are. Based on what you've said thus far no. Except what you've been spoon fed in ignorance by the politically driven media.

I bet you wouldn't differentiate in afghanistan between the northern alliance and taliban if you had them standing in front of you. Yet it is the former not the later that is involved in homosexuality, opium drug trade, abuse of women etc...

The word taliban is thrown around like a ho, just like the words 'terrorist', and 'extremist'. Politically charged and motivated words not reality.

You are just a droid responding like a droid to televised propaganda, not knowing what Islam is, what any group is, what any race is, what any culture is, what anything about anything is.

You already demonstrated what your intentions are. Look at your avatar/display pic. I bet you're one of those tools that can't differentiate between an arab or a desi, much less between ethnic groups within Afghans and Pakistanis. Nor what culture is and what Islam is. These pakistani, indian, afghan, even some arab people follow pre-islamic cultures, tribal practices and norms which are contrary to Islam. You want to 'trial Islam'. You're an ignorant.

You created this thread to "show what them mozzlems are about" in sarcasm. You're a tool. I responded to you intelligently, showcasing what Islam actually says about knowledge, but what do you do?

Lets try this one more time:

Quote

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "The seeking of knowledge is obligatory for every Muslim." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 74

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: “One who treads a path in search of knowledge has his path to Paradise made easy by God…” - Riyadh us-Saleheen, 245

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "A servant of God will remain standing on the Day of Judgment until he is questioned about his (time on earth) and how he used it; about his knowledge and how he utilized it; about his wealth and from where he acquired it and in what (activities) he spent it; and about his body and how he used it." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 148

The Prophet also said: "Knowledge from which no benefit is derived is like a treasure out of which nothing is spent in the cause of God." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 108

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "God, His angels and all those in Heavens and on Earth, even ants in their hills and fish in the water, call down blessings on those who instruct others in beneficial knowledge." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 422

The Prophet also said: "Acquire knowledge and impart it to the people." - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 107

The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "If anyone travels on a road in search of knowledge, God will cause him to travel on one of the roads of Paradise. The angels will lower their wings in their great pleasure with one who seeks knowledge. The inhabitants of the heavens and the Earth and (even) the fish in the deep waters will ask forgiveness for the learned man. The superiority of the learned over the devout is like that of the moon, on the night when it is full, over the rest of the stars. The learned are the heirs of the Prophets, and the Prophets leave (no monetary inheritance), they leave only knowledge, and he who takes it takes an abundant portion. - Sunan of Abu-Dawood, Hadith 1631

Aaaah - so now I'm making generalisations about muslims - a bit like you are about me.

I live in a Muslim community and I get my wake-up calls from the Mosque 200 metres from my house. I also spend a fair amount of my time in Muslim countries. Just 2 particular countries, not many of them.

Still - that doesn't fit your "Islamophobe" stereotype. The whole "Islamophobe" thing is a sympathy generating creation of Muslims who think it's fine to riot in the streets over a cartoon but remain deathly silent over the attempted murder of a Schoolgirl.

As for being a 'tool' because I can't distinguish between Afghan and Pakistani - you really are a funny guy. You are right of course, I have not spent much time in Afghanistan. It's not really a popular holiday destination to be honest. I understand people like you go there and get 'training' but seriously - is that your best shot? That I am somehow unable to comment on the hypocrisy of people like you because I may not be well versed in telling 2 different ethnic groups apart?Fact is – Muslims remain deathly quiet about the murder of that girl. You yourself are unable to condemn it. You can quote passages, come up with other bad things other people have done but you just can’t bring yourself to disagree with the act.

On the other hand, if someone had burnt a book – well, then you might just go riot and break a few shop windows. Killing a schoolgirl? No problem, she was asking for it right?

You are way too smart to be creating a rather idiotic thread. I highly doubt you live in a muslim community considering your statement that muslims are okay with the attempted murder of the girl? Are you being serious right now?

You are way too smart to be creating a rather idiotic thread. I highly doubt you live in a muslim community considering your statement that muslims are okay with the attempted murder of the girl? Are you being serious right now?

I live in Thailand, in the suburbs outside of Bangkok. The community I live in is in the Saphan Sung area. A predominantly Muslim community. All of the mosques here have loudspeakers and so we get an earful each morning but with 2 kids, I'm generally awake by then anyway.

When we moved here from another part of Bangkok, it was quite a shift. Being predominantly muslim, the food at the market is very different from the fare we are used to. The local restaurants too - all Halal but it's not just that, it's more like Southern Thailand where the food is heavier and not as spicy. Saying that - there's a muslim woman at the local market & her chicken is heavenly. I get a whole cooked chicken for $3.

It's not such a bad thing, I just have to bite my tongue every time I see an idiot wearing an Osama Bin Laden shirt.

The Thai Muslims tend towards keeping to themselves in Bangkok and they are somewhat integrated. At the end of the day, Thailand isn't UK/US. The sort of stuff that goes on in my home country of the UK - where Muslims take over areas completely and it's not safe to walk the streets - well, that shit would NOT be tolerated in Bangkok. There's no raving liberals here, no powerful human rights lobby. What you do have is a powerful and vindictive police force that regularly applies rough justice.

In the South of Thailand - well it's your typical Muslim story there - murders, burning down schools, shooting farmers/monks/teachers, roadside bombs. Happens on a daily basis down there - all the usual reasons - the Muslims want a Muslim state down there. Ahmed will be along in a minute to make victims out of them.

They never bring the fight to Bangkok because they know that would be the end of them.

In terms of the Muslim countries I regularly visit - Malaysia and Indonesia.

I live in Thailand, in the suburbs outside of Bangkok. The community I live in is in the Saphan Sung area. A predominantly Muslim community. All of the mosques here have loudspeakers and so we get an earful each morning but with 2 kids, I'm generally awake by then anyway.

When we moved here from another part of Bangkok, it was quite a shift. Being predominantly muslim, the food at the market is very different from the fare we are used to. The local restaurants too - all Halal but it's not just that, it's more like Southern Thailand where the food is heavier and not as spicy. Saying that - there's a muslim woman at the local market & her chicken is heavenly. I get a whole cooked chicken for $3.

It's not such a bad thing, I just have to bite my tongue every time I see an idiot wearing an Osama Bin Laden shirt.

The Thai Muslims tend towards keeping to themselves in Bangkok and they are somewhat integrated. At the end of the day, Thailand isn't UK/US. The sort of stuff that goes on in my home country of the UK - where Muslims take over areas completely and it's not safe to walk the streets - well, that shit would NOT be tolerated in Bangkok. There's no raving liberals here, no powerful human rights lobby. What you do have is a powerful and vindictive police force that regularly applies rough justice.

In the South of Thailand - well it's your typical Muslim story there - murders, burning down schools, shooting farmers/monks/teachers, roadside bombs. Happens on a daily basis down there - all the usual reasons - the Muslims want a Muslim state down there. Ahmed will be along in a minute to make victims out of them.

They never bring the fight to Bangkok because they know that would be the end of them.

In terms of the Muslim countries I regularly visit - Malaysia and Indonesia.

rather informative post, I'm not very familiar with what goes on in thailand at all. I actually didn't know thailand had a muslim population, just assumed they were buddhists.

I actually do understand the disdain people have for muslims from a western perspective; some of it is fair as there is much progress to be made in the muslim world in human rights. But the demagoguery about muslims being inherently evil and attacking Islam is not fair and does not help the discussion whatsoever. I don't think muslims should become blind to their own problems, but people in the west should also understand the issues that concern muslims and cause much hatred toward the west- take the invasion of iraq for example.

Honestly, I think what makes relations worse between peoples is the human mental system which limits our circle of empathy to people of our own tribe, and makes it easy to pool 'other' people into stereotypical categories (no liberal). It is a very unconscious process (so we never question why we perceive things a certain way) and affects our perceptions more than we think. Anyway, I think its critical we understand each other better (no homo). It may seem like pie in the sky liberal talk but I think the need for that is very real.

I appreciate you intellectualising the issue and you are right that the issue is tribal. Muslim behaviour globally is an extreme example of tribalism.

There is a pattern of behaviour in the Muslim world. On the one hand they make themselves out to be victims, they are loud and vocal about this. They are NOT loud and vocal about the atrocities committed on their behalf.

In Nazi Germany. It wasn't just the guy at the top that wanted to commit atrocities, there was a huge support for what went on, as there is in the Mulsim communities around the world. It is a cancer that needs to be wiped out.

You can of course say "not all Muslims are bad" but the truth is that 99% of terrorist attacks worldwide are committed by Muslims. It is undeniable that they are murdering people on a daily basis and that their religious leaders are mostly silent on the issue.

Some people will prefer to pander to them, look at them as victims, say they aren't all bad. The way I see it, there is an omlette to be made. A few eggs will be broken. Until the greater Muslim community and their leaders come out to condemn the atrocities, then they are complicit.

There is no reason for these people to be shooting school teachers in the South of Thailand. No reason for them to be burning schools. Just the past few weeks, the terrorists here announced that they would kill any shop owners that opened on Fridays as this was their "Holy Day". Some towns closed down completely through fear. What was the suggestion of a Muslim Cleric here? "Make every Friday a holiday". No condemnation.

Islam is a net negative to mankind. There is overwhelmingly more bad than good coming out of the Muslim world. It needs stamping out.

I appreciate you intellectualising the issue and you are right that the issue is tribal. Muslim behaviour globally is an extreme example of tribalism.

There is a pattern of behaviour in the Muslim world. On the one hand they make themselves out to be victims, they are loud and vocal about this. They are NOT loud and vocal about the atrocities committed on their behalf.

In Nazi Germany. It wasn't just the guy at the top that wanted to commit atrocities, there was a huge support for what went on, as there is in the Mulsim communities around the world. It is a cancer that needs to be wiped out.

You can of course say "not all Muslims are bad" but the truth is that 99% of terrorist attacks worldwide are committed by Muslims. It is undeniable that they are murdering people on a daily basis and that their religious leaders are mostly silent on the issue.

Some people will prefer to pander to them, look at them as victims, say they aren't all bad. The way I see it, there is an omlette to be made. A few eggs will be broken. Until the greater Muslim community and their leaders come out to condemn the atrocities, then they are complicit.

There is no reason for these people to be shooting school teachers in the South of Thailand. No reason for them to be burning schools. Just the past few weeks, the terrorists here announced that they would kill any shop owners that opened on Fridays as this was their "Holy Day". Some towns closed down completely through fear. What was the suggestion of a Muslim Cleric here? "Make every Friday a holiday". No condemnation.

Islam is a net negative to mankind. There is overwhelmingly more bad than good coming out of the Muslim world. It needs stamping out.

I think you are quite wrong in how you understand the issue. What you see as 'Islam' is nothing more than the militant form of it that has taken hold in politicallly astable areas, and these sons of dogs tend to bark the loudest so they get all the attention from the west. The increasing numbers of these people is fed mostly by the military and political conflict that exists between the west and Islam, you simply cannot view this in a vacuum and come to any reasonable conclusion. You are basing your conclusions based on half the story.

I think you are quite wrong in how you understand the issue. What you see as 'Islam' is nothing more than the militant form of it that has taken hold in politicallly astable areas, and these sons of dogs tend to bark the loudest so they get all the attention from the west. The increasing numbers of these people is fed mostly by the military and political conflict that exists between the west and Islam, you simply cannot view this in a vacuum and come to any reasonable conclusion. You are basing your conclusions based on half the story.

Thing is Haider - your line is exactly what the greater Muslim community wants people to think; that the terrorism comes from a tiny minority of Muslims.

I disagree entirely.

I think the root cause of the terrorism is the religion itself. I think that the majority of muslims would like the whole world to be Muslim and as this is the reason for the silence on the behalf of the common Muslim and their leaders.

This is my opinion but it is backed up by people like Ahmed who simply can't bring themselves to condemn a single atrocity committed on the behalf of their religion.

Now - imagine if you will that a bunch of New York Jets fans killed a bunch of young girls for the sin of going to school. Their method - approaching school buses and blowing themselves up next to them. Prior to them becoming martyrs, they all made videos declaring their love for the New York Jets, their hatred for other teams and their belief that young girls should not go to school because cheerleading is a sin and school breeds cheerleaders.

If that happened today in 2012, what do you think would be the reaction of New York Jets fans and the teams leaders? Would they stay silent? Or would they be out in the streets & on the media condemning those acts and distancing themselves from them?

We both know the answer. We both know the uproar that just one attack would cause. The silence from the Muslim world is deafening.

Those who controls the images we see in the media have the ability to shape perception.

There could be 800 protests taking place, on a given day, but if the powers that control the images we see want to showcase 1 rally in support, we will see that 1 support rally over & over & over 6 different ways from Sunday until in our minds only the 1 rally exists, and the other 800 protests... what protests?

lol it's like when the western media was trying to force a 'revolution in iran' few years back. They showed the few days of hundreds of thousands protesting against ahmedinajad, pro-western elements of society but they completely ignorant the pro-iran/pro-ahmedinajad protests that were in the tens of millions+ across the nation.

For example PressTV, an Iranian run English speaking channel was banned in the UK. Why? As it was becoming very popular in the Uk and was showcasing what the western media is not.

So it's like me making a thread about your mother and saying why is your mother in jail. And you saying your mother is not in jail. Then me replying to you, why are you denying that she is in jail? why is she in jail? and then endlessly 'arguing'.

Then someone else jumping in backing me up saying "you're such a liar, your mother is in jail you are lying".

Then along the way other people join in and hate on you and your mother who they never met or know. Start talking about why your mother is in jail.

That's what you are doing. It's retarded.

Furthermore the media is focusing on Muslims and Islam daily. Mixing whatever someone with a muslim name does in some village which you can't even pinpoint on the map and blaring the television 247 about it. So that every ignorant like yourself will believe it and start hating Islam.

On top of that, they can exaggerate, falsify or skew information or details and no one would know the difference as they are ignorant of the people and ignorant of the religion and as a result succeed in instigating fear and hate in people's minds of Muslims and Islam.

Fact is, no matter how much effort is put into this slander machine, billions and billions. People are still learning about Islam and embracing Islam. You are doing us Muslims a favor. The more you demonize us, the more people are willing to learn about us and Islam and are actually becoming Muslim. 1/4 of the 4 million american muslims are converts to islam.

You are so 'fearful' of islam from your own stupid shadows and you are making others fear your own shadows.And say: "The truth has now come [to light], and falsehood has withered away: for, behold, all falsehood is bound to wither away!" 17:81

No matter how you lie even if you say the same lie 10000 times and people believe it as truth, ultimately that lie will not live forever when confronted with the truth it's bound to ultimately perish.

lol it's like when the western media was trying to force a 'revolution in iran' few years back. They showed the few days of hundreds of thousands protesting against ahmedinajad, pro-western elements of society but they completely ignorant the pro-iran/pro-ahmedinajad protests that were in the tens of millions+ across the nation.

For example PressTV, an Iranian run English speaking channel was banned in the UK. Why? As it was becoming very popular in the Uk and was showcasing what the western media is not.

For me it is especially frustrating watching what for me are such blatant manipulative media deceptions. Having previously worked in the film industry, I am able to decipher so much from the footage and the way it is edited in ways the average viewer would not. I find it especially frustrating when it is sooooo obvious.

I've worked on TV Series where they have taken a handful of 30 - 40 extras and through cutting edge splicing techniques created an auditorium of thousands. It has gotten to the point where the viewer is so fooled, that they aren't even careful with their editing anymore.

All I can say is Heaven Help the USA when her people come out of the trance.That kind of anger, + a nation full of guns = a recipe for chaos the likes of which we have never seen.