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1st 6 hour opener: 1,018 fish. 3 more to go. There are a lot of streams closed to sport fishing due to poor returns that could really have used those fish...

The Northern District caught just under 500 fish total for their first opener. They caught 367 Kings. As usual, your numbers are completely fabricated, and this fishery caught less than half of what you claim it did.

Willphish,

Not only are you using the timely and accurate harvest data that this fishery produces against it, you are posting bogus numbers to make it look bad.

No answer Willphish? I'm not surprised. When confronted with facts run away.

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm...salmon_harvest If there is a fabrication, it is not mine. This direct from the ADF&G website, where I and the rest of the general public can go for accurate information. Are you really saying that fish and game can't get their numbers straight? Shame, shame.

There may just be a little reading comprehension issue going on... There are a couple little words at the top of the column that are relevant; "Deliveries", and "chinook." In the "deliveries" column, the Northern District total is 360. In the "chinook" column it is 1050. So to sum it up; according to the fish and game official website, the northern district made 360 deliveries for a total of 1,050 salmon.

That's correct, although the real estimate if you call ADFG is probably slightly higher. Yesterday's harvest was not quite available this morning at 9am yet, when I pointed out that your numbers were completely bogus.

But you have to admit - the fact that yesterday's harvest is available today is pretty darned cool.

Yes, there is a reading comprehension issue going on. You are reading last year's season totals, ace. Switch to the daily tab to get info for this years openers. Best of luck.

Just reading what was on the page, listed as "Inseason Harvest Summary". I didn't think I'd have to dig any deeper; besides, you're always saying we can trust Fish and Game's numbers, and that they never make mistakes in management. You just won't give it up, will you?

Yes, i was mistaken, the first opener picked up over 350 fish, the second at current count is 488, so they are nearing last year's numbers already.

So now with 2 openers under their belt, Northern District has harvested about 75% of last year's harvest. I have huge issues with Fish and Game allowing this fishery to continue. The forecasts were all for a lower return than last year's. They have no inseason salt water data to manage by; they have to manage by the forecasts. Weir data on the Deshka may effect the last of 4 openers, but the damage will have already been done in the first three. Last year, only 3 of 17 monitored systems in the massive Yentna, Susitna and Matanuska River drainages made the bare threshold for escapement. Sport fish restrictions were all that allowed that to happen; Deshka had 1,088 fish over its minimum, and the other two had about 500 combined. If the next 2 openers do as well as the first two, a couple dozen setnetters will have harvested more fish than were surplus to the entire Matanuska-Susitna drainages minimum spawning needs last year. This includes three rivers that are already stocks of concern for chinook, and 2 more that qualify after last year's failure to meet escapement.

Nearly every river in the Valley needs every King possible to spawn this year; yet for this handful of fishermen who will have a bigger impact on Valley runs than all the sport fishermen combined, its business as usual. Incredible.

I pointed out that your numbers were total crap, AGAIN, and you blamed someone else, then spewed a bunch more numbers. I don't have time to double check them, but someone should cause accurate numbers aren't your strong suit.

Forecasts have a large margin of error. The fact that the ND king gillnet harvest is stronger than last year could be an indicator of a stronger run. Time will tell.

Yes, it is the law. An important law for responsible fisheries management. Kinda like the one that requires guide logbook data to be available within 12 hours.... Oh, wait, that's not a law. Currently we have to wait over a year before that data is publicly available. That's NOT cool.

Huh? I am not bashing the law or grinding axe just made a simple comment analogy with click it or ticket people buckle up because it is law, pay taxes, register your vehicle and many more examples out there of things we do not necessarily because everyone think it cool. Take care there and may God bless you

Smithb, are you really gunning against willphish cuz he has concerns for the king runs? If so it is YOU who should be ashamed. I've commercial fished, I've witnessed the carnage of kings caught in commercial fisheries. I quit. I hope all set netting and drift netting get shut the **** down. I want my kids to be able to catch a king out of my favorite stream someday. Not gonna happen with this bull. Numbers or not, shut it down and save the fishery. Stop being an ass trying to prove yourself right. That's what *******s do.

Smithb, are you really gunning against willphish cuz he has concerns for the king runs? If so it is YOU who should be ashamed. I've commercial fished, I've witnessed the carnage of kings caught in commercial fisheries. I quit. I hope all set netting and drift netting get shut the **** down. I want my kids to be able to catch a king out of my favorite stream someday. Not gonna happen with this bull. Numbers or not, shut it down and save the fishery. Stop being an ass trying to prove yourself right. That's what *******s do.

AK,

I don't have to prove myself right - you can just go ahead and check the ADFG website and find out for yourself if you actually care about the truth. I was being an "ass" to Willphish because, like yours, his posts were full of garbage. I'm glad that he is concerned for the King runs. That is step one. Step two would be to educate oneself about the issues. Posting inflated, false harvest statistics regarding the commercial fisheries in an attempt to smear them and making ignorant claims that natural flooding is the most serious inriver threat that our Kings face is not exactly the most effective way to show one's concern for the resource or help the resource recover. It's about as counterproductive as calling people names and insisting on the closure of a complete fishery that you obviously know nothing about.

Some perspective - maybe. Managing fisheries on forecast is always suspect. First, they are usually wrong or at least have large error. So what happens with a fishery that cannot recover lost fishing time (Northern District set nets) is that is the forecast is wrong they lose money and cannot recover it later in the season. This is unlike the sockeye fishery where extra time can be given to catch up. The ND set net fishery does not get extra time (if it did late in the season then willphis4food has a point. However, that is not the case. So then what?

ADF&G did close the first fishery and closed large areas of the fishery on the other periods if I am reading the e.o correctly. They also reduced fishing time to 6 hours from 12 hours. Those are pretty significant actions and the sport fishery in the Sustina is still harvesting fish so there is no closure in total there. The Deshka is fishing along with some other areas. So both fisheries are still harvesting fish but not at the historical effort.

Next, ADF&G held a period and the catches for 6 hours did not look bad. So the question becomes what is the real size of the return. ADF&G decided to keep both fisheries going and fished a second period. Total harvest from an email I got from Pat Shields on the 11th was 814 total chinook. So the next period is 17 June and I assume that ADF&G will look at weir counts and other indexes and decide on whether to close the fisheries in total or not. Some of the streams willphish4food mentioned as not meeting goals have large areas around them closed to commercial fishing.

So at this point I really cannot find fault with ADF&G. They are taking a reasoned approach to this with the multiple stocks involved. Will they be on the mark in every stream - probably not as there are lots of streams but they have taken significant actions.

So both fisheries are still harvesting fish but not at the historical effort.

j

Always glad to see your perspective, Nerka. How "historical" is 4 six hour openers? How many times in the last 20 years has the Northern District setnet had 4 6 hour fishing periods?

Here's some "historical effort" on the part of the Northern District; The Northern District has been closed in the past; because one monitored stream was not making its escapement. That was in the mid 90's, when sport fishing on the Deshka was closed. Though salmon were very abundant in other streams, the setnets were kept out for conservation reasons, to help rebuild that one failing stock. Now of the 17 stocks we monitor, we have one struggling but still making it river, 2 barely making it rivers, and 14 below thresholds, several listed as stocks of concern, and several more qualifying for stock of concern, due to repeated years of missing goal, and the setnets are allowed to fish on. They are not being held back to allow the other streams to rebuild, because the one bellweather stream still is scraping over the bottom end of the run.

Losing fishing time sucks. We can all agree on that. What I will never agree on is that not losing fishing time in one season is important enough to jeopardize future runs by continuing to fish.

So far the Deshka weir is at 861 fish, as of the 13th. This is the quarter percentile of the run.