So I finally sat down and got caught up with this... I don't know if I've just lost the thread or not, but I don't see the apocalyptic horror in any of it. Yes, Trump's obviously crazy and generally horrible. But he is what we are. Or, at least, an alarming number of us. For years and years, on these forums and at bars and on living room couches, we've gone on and on about the very particular American Sickness that's been brewing since roughly 1949 or so. We're dumbing ourselves down with every generation, we're taught to embrace the distractions, we've been fed the Outrage Loop and fall for it every time.

Of course Trump's in there. Of course he's crazy. And, of course, he'll get away with it. Because everyone who ever wants to do something about it is distracted 45 seconds later.

If the FBI is neutered and Congress is neutered and we let it happen, then what stops Trump from becoming Dictator Comanche for life? It's a completely disregard for the illusion of a system. And maybe it's time for it to fall, but then you've got 4 billion people who are supposed to do what? This is already a clusterfuck for the long term, and if we decide that one man is above the system then it's just game over.

I can't speak for the rest of America, but he's fucked the local economy. My current financial woes are directly related to the fact that he's destroyed my niche industry in the DMV. Frankly, I want somebody who actually gives a shit about the stupid illusion of a system which actually seemed to try to work before all this.

If the FBI is neutered and Congress is neutered and we let it happen, then what stops Trump from becoming Dictator Comanche for life? It's a completely disregard for the illusion of a system. And maybe it's time for it to fall, but then you've got 4 billion people who are supposed to do what? This is already a clusterfuck for the long term, and if we decide that one man is above the system then it's just game over.

I can't speak for the rest of America, but he's fucked the local economy. My current financial woes are directly related to the fact that he's destroyed my niche industry in the DMV. Frankly, I want somebody who actually gives a shit about the stupid illusion of a system which actually seemed to try to work before all this.

The FBI neutered themselves thanks to Hoover making it his private fiefdom for 30 years. Your FBI history, since the 1940s, has been:

1) The sole domain of a paranoid lunatic who did nothing but obliterate all of the freedoms in our society and was never kept in check by Congress or the President

2) A period of guilty reform that led to a shattered, broken leadership that completely backfired (Ruby Ridge, Waco, etc)

3) A period of pulling back and trying to win public opinion that resulted in a neutering so complete that they were incapable of stopping domestic threats (see 9/11, Boston, etc).

The FBI neutering is evident in the need for so many different divisions. ATF, Homeland Security, etc. The FBI has been incapable of keeping their house clean since Hoover died and his madness was exposed. What we have going on now, with the firings and the investigation, is akin to a show trial. We're back to Adam Curtis with this Russia probe.

Congress has also been neutered long before Trump. I've been talking to you about the parallels to the downfall of the Roman Republic -- with the evenly split and totally ineffectual senate -- for about 20 years now.

And the economy has been on the downswing long before Trump as well. The only alarming factor is that Trump is the first person to bring the problem inside the Beltway. We used to be immune and not think about it while everyone else wallowed. Now the walls are coming down because the people out there finally got their "outside the Beltway" president. This little DMV island we've been on is starting to reflect what's been happening out there in all the other states.

None of this to defend Trump. Just saying that he's not the problem, he's just an advanced symptom.

Your point about DC always being recession proof and that now not being the case is interesting, and spot on.

And I agree Trump is an advanced symptom, but even he isn't the boogeyman behind the curtain. That's Putin and Russia and The U.S. having done to us what we've done to all the banana republics over the decades. I guess my problem is that if the system breaks down then it's going to be even easier for some populist strongman who actually knows what he's doing to come in an wreck real havoc. Trump is an incompetent narcissist and look at all the damage he's done.

I don't know what I'm supposed to do. Congress is the entity that can save us, and I'm not sure they have the political will to do so. Besides, where in history have you read, "And then the legislature did the righting and saved them?"

Besides, where in history have you read, "And then the legislature did the righting and saved them?"

In the last 80 years, and just speaking about the US legislature -

The civil rights acts, of course.

The polio vaccine assistance act. We wiped out a disease and nobody made any real money from it because the legislature said enough is enough. Three years before the vaccine, polio was at epidemic proportions. We never talk about this in our history classes, but thousands of people (mainly children) were dying per year from polio. Legislation made sure everyone got the vaccine, regardless of their ability to pay for it. Within 5 years, polio was all but wiped out of the US. Further legislation -- on our part -- to make the vaccine readily available to the world has eradicated polio. There are only a handful of outbreaks a year, originating from the usual suspect countries.

The Marshall Plan and other efforts to spend an enormous amount of money rebuilding Europe instead of punishing Europe. We emerged as the champion and could have been cruel, instead we legislated some of the greatest humanitarian acts into being to rebuild infrastructure, entire cities, historical monuments, and deal with the greatest refugee crisis in modern history. All paid for by the citizens who dropped the bombs in the first place. Ditto Japan and the south Pacific, which benefited from similar plans.

Clean water acts. It is now safe to drink water from the tap (theoretically) everywhere in the US whereas prior to the 1950s you had to treat going from Iowa to Kansas like going from the US to a Central American shantytown.

Various workplace safety acts so now your employer isn't allowed to seal you into the mine on purpose because you talked back to him, or force your 10 year old son into employment, or force you to spend 115% of your paycheck buying your own supplies for the job.

FDIC so that we can actually use our banks without fear of repeating 1929.

The GI Bill -- the most effective demobilization of a large army in history which was also designed to create a renewable brain trust that we're still benefiting from. Truly the only successful historical incidence of "turning swords into plowshares."

The FHA -- call them projects, but they were four walls and a roof.

Consumer Protection. So, now, when Ford builds a car that murders you and gets caught, they're forced to recall it as opposed to saying, "Buyer beware!"

The military -- this is controversial, and outdated, but we have a clean and functional armed forces program that's really miles above everyone else. We're also very focused on separating the military from the state. That's due to legislation, not just popular opinion.

The FDA -- someone is regulating your food and drugs (nominally, at the moment, but this entity doesn't have many opposite numbers in other countries).

Ongoing funding of basic science/NIH/NASA: Also something not too many other countries can claim.

So... these are all laws and regulations passed and they're wonderful, yes. But I'm thinking more about the history of kings, despots, Star Wars villains, and executives harnessing power for their own selfish needs, while the legislature lets it happen thinking they'll benefit before said legislature is disbanded.

(The Marshall Plan is your one example that sort of false under what I'm saying.)

Past legislatures aside, do you think *this* one is going to do the right thing? And by "right thing," I mean stand up to trump and support the Russia investigation?

So... these are all laws and regulations passed and they're wonderful, yes. But I'm thinking more about the history of kings, despots, Star Wars villains, and executives harnessing power for their own selfish needs, while the legislature lets it happen thinking they'll benefit before said legislature is disbanded.

(The Marshall Plan is your one example that sort of false under what I'm saying.)

Past legislatures aside, do you think *this* one is going to do the right thing? And by "right thing," I mean stand up to trump and support the Russia investigation?

Well, many of those kings, despots, etc. were also the legislature! Between about 44 BC and about 1650 AD, the human race did not have a government that had a (empowered) separate legislative body.

Our current legislature is suffering from what happened to the one in the 50's-40's BC, thus back round we go to the Roman Republic conversation.

I guess my disconnect here is that the Russian influence seems so, so obvious. Yet everyone is burying their head in the sand... or doesn't care. Trump is o utterly incompetent and corrupt. I'm just shocked that we're letting the system break down for him.

During the Bush II years, it all seemed more sinister and under the cover of night. We were fed plausible lies to keep the sheep in line while the dirty deeds were done. This just seems so preventable.

I guess my disconnect here is that the Russian influence seems so, so obvious. Yet everyone is burying their head in the sand... or doesn't care. Trump is o utterly incompetent and corrupt. I'm just shocked that we're letting the system break down for him.

During the Bush II years, it all seemed more sinister and under the cover of night. We were fed plausible lies to keep the sheep in line while the dirty deeds were done. This just seems so preventable.

Here's something no one seems to be thinking about, even though it's headline news: What if "Russian influence on the election" is actually the hypernormalization and there's something else going on? Because...is it really "so obvious," RC? Lester Holt would like you to think so, but where's the hard evidence? It remains suspected. A now year long investigation points to some people in Trumplandia having corporate ties with Russia, but the same could be said for about 90% of the 1% during every administration since Putin took power because Russia is a cash cow on the oligarch level. Hell, Obama stood idly by while Russia literally attacked eastern Europe and Russian paramilitary troops attacked US bases in Syria.

Now... Let's look at the evidence we actually have regarding election tampering. Namely, Facebook and Cambridge Analytica. CA is ON CAMERA admitting that they won the election and claiming they can account for tens of millions of votes. And the LEGION of similar corporations are all cheerfully talking to the media about how, yes, that's exactly what they do: Win elections by hijacking our social media. And, yes, every social media outlet has stood by and let this happen because they're getting a boatload of money. On the block is Twitter, Snapchat, and Facebook. And it looks like it's going to snowball into congressional hearings. In fact, it's so bad, and so perverse, that stock market wonks are worried this will shatter the tech bubble and spiral us into a downturn.

If we actually sit down and rationally process the news, here's what I suggest is happening: A billionaire showman who is a member of an oligarchical billionaire showman club spread lots of money around to the places he knew it would count: The people who deliver instant content to the devices we walk around all day staring at. That content is unregulated and unmonitored and exists solely at the whim of for-profit corporations run by members of that same billionaire showman club. Social media is designed to control us and inform on us. We do it willingly! In the last election, techniques to manipulate, control, and outright hijack our identities were finally perfected. And that's who stole the election. Zuckerberg et. al.

We don't blame them because we've perversely been convinced that these corporations -- Google, Apple, Facebook, etc. -- are working for the public good. This is the fundamental backbone of their image. Your Google Life is generally free. Look at all the great things they did and are doing. A great place to work. How exciting to get Amazon HQ2 in our town. And on and on and on. They've painted themselves as the benefactors of Humanity much like the Church did in the middle ages.

Meanwhile, they're harvesting everything and have now become powerful enough to shape politics and the world.

Russia? Putin? Come on, RC. That's the old way. They're relics from more than a decade ago. There are no borders now. There are no countries and there are no rivals. On the news every night, we see the CA admission, we hear from companies like CA that do exactly what they did and outline it for us step by step. Yet we still scream Russia! Why? Because it's easy. Because Russia was a bogeyman (and nothing more) for two generations. Because Putin likes to stoke that image because it IS GOOD FOR BUSINESS for Russia and the US to be at odds. It always has been a business decision. You can't call Google, Facebook, Amazon, and all of them out. Why? Well, simple. Because they actually own and control the news outlets.

The system is breaking down for Trump, the system just doesn't work anymore because it hasn't changed since 1865.

Because...is it really "so obvious," RC? Lester Holt would like you to think so, but where's the hard evidence? It remains suspected. A now year long investigation points to some people in Trumplandia having corporate ties with Russia, but the same could be said for about 90% of the 1% during every administration since Putin took power because Russia is a cash cow on the oligarch level.

...

Russia? Putin? Come on, RC. That's the old way. They're relics from more than a decade ago. There are no borders now. There are no countries and there are no rivals. On the news every night, we see the CA admission, we hear from companies like CA that do exactly what they did and outline it for us step by step. Yet we still scream Russia! Why? Because it's easy. Because Russia was a bogeyman (and nothing more) for two generations. Because Putin likes to stoke that image because it IS GOOD FOR BUSINESS for Russia and the US to be at odds. It always has been a business decision. You can't call Google, Facebook, Amazon, and all of them out. Why? Well, simple. Because they actually own and control the news outlets.

1.) Evidence that Trump was in bed financially (and prostitutionally, if I can coin a word) with the Russians. Putin's old KGB buddies have all sorts of nasty sex shit to blackmail Trump with. (Including trips on Jeffery Epstein's "Lolita Express." Our girl Stormy Daniels is only the tip of the iceberg on Trump as far as deviant perversity goes. Personally, I give two shits if he likes to be fucked with a strap-on while sucking milk out of a whore's ass, and the rest of America probably doesn't care either. To me, the sex shit is the distraction. Trump wants Stormy Daniels all over the news because that's far sexier and less damning than Russia.)

Trump's Russia involvement is deep and well-documeted, but basically boils down to the fact that he's bankrupted himself so many times that the Russian mob were the only ones willing to loan him any money. The problem became when he decided to run for public office for a "cold" enemy of that particular state. He was deep in the Russian oligarch's pocket long before he considered running for office.

2.) Evidence of election tampering by Russians. This is a large part of what Mueller is collecting evidence on. The tech/bot part of it aside for a second, Russia's original plan was to neuter a Clinton administration by having all this uncertainty shadow her presidency (which it would have). That Trump actually won was a back-handed win because the trail of breadcrumbs of their involvement was purposely left so wide. But their guy won.

*Their guy who they probably blackmailed into running because of all the shit they have on him won the election.*

The U.S. presidency is operating under Putin's influence. Indirectly probably, but the Russians control the executive branch because Trump lives in fear of them. Think of the shit they could leak to Mueller that proves without a doubt that Trump has committed treason. Fucking treason. Per hypernormalizaion, Putin's goal is destabilization. It's to weaken U.S. power and influence, particularly in Europe. He's succeeding wildly.

Now... Let's look at the evidence we actually have regarding election tampering. Namely, Facebook and Cambridge Analytica. CA is ON CAMERA admitting that they won the election and claiming they can account for tens of millions of votes. And the LEGION of similar corporations are all cheerfully talking to the media about how, yes, that's exactly what they do: Win elections by hijacking our social media. And, yes, every social media outlet has stood by and let this happen because they're getting a boatload of money. On the block is Twitter, Snapchat, and Facebook. And it looks like it's going to snowball into congressional hearings. In fact, it's so bad, and so perverse, that stock market wonks are worried this will shatter the tech bubble and spiral us into a downturn.

If we actually sit down and rationally process the news, here's what I suggest is happening: A billionaire showman who is a member of an oligarchical billionaire showman club spread lots of money around to the places he knew it would count: The people who deliver instant content to the devices we walk around all day staring at. That content is unregulated and unmonitored and exists solely at the whim of for-profit corporations run by members of that same billionaire showman club. Social media is designed to control us and inform on us. We do it willingly! In the last election, techniques to manipulate, control, and outright hijack our identities were finally perfected. And that's who stole the election. Zuckerberg et. al.

We don't blame them because we've perversely been convinced that these corporations -- Google, Apple, Facebook, etc. -- are working for the public good. This is the fundamental backbone of their image. Your Google Life is generally free. Look at all the great things they did and are doing. A great place to work. How exciting to get Amazon HQ2 in our town. And on and on and on. They've painted themselves as the benefactors of Humanity much like the Church did in the middle ages.

Meanwhile, they're harvesting everything and have now become powerful enough to shape politics and the world.

I don't doubt this is occurring and the Cambridge Analytica shit is fascinating beyond belief. Yet I also think that big business always has more to gain by maintaining the status quo. The technology shifts, but the goal is the same, consolidate political power as a means to consolidate financial control. Why make us doubt these systems (Google, Facebook, etc.) that we've had no reason to doubt until now? Why even let the Russians do this even as a scapegoat to hide the sinister shit they're doing? Why not keep the illusion of a socially responsible system?